# I Don't Think Many Of You Know What "Confronted" Means



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.

When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.

What we have here is a case of standing your ground, and a criminal then gunning down the lawful citizen who was rightfully standing their ground.

Zimmerman is toast...TOAST I said!


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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Sure you can.

con·front/k&#601;n&#712;fr&#601;nt/
Verb:	

    1.  Meet (someone) face to face with hostile or argumentative intent.
    2.  Face up to and deal with (a problem or difficult situation).


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
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Sadly, it wont bring back the poor kid.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
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You would convict someone without seeing any of the evidence. I am sure of that.
When the alleged victim is black.
I prefer to see all of the evidence and any witnesses  before I reach a conclusion that a defendant is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
Something about The United States Constitution that clearly states Zimmerman is PRESUMED innocent. 
I know the presumption of innocence is a difficult standard to comprehend when one's judgment is clearly grounded with prejudices and bias be they black or white.
I saw this in the 60s with whites and now I see it with blacks.


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## Intense (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


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I support Due Process here, and a full account of both their past histories. I bet the Kid comes out allot cleaner than the shooter. Lets see how many people come out as witnesses against Zimmerman from past altercations?


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Intense said:


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I think the guy is guilty of murder. It also sounded like the kid was whipping the shit out of a wannabe super cop. Zimmerman was told to stop by a 911 operator, he did not. He instigated this and he should be held accountable for his part. Then you have the cowards and scum who go straight to race. They dont make it any better. Wonder how much money they are making on this poor kids death.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> You would convict someone without seeing any of the evidence. I am sure of that.
> When the alleged victim is black.
> I prefer to see all of the evidence and any witnesses  before I reach a conclusion that a defendant is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
> Something about The United States Constitution that clearly states Zimmerman is PRESUMED innocent.
> ...



Presumption of innocence means that an accused must be granted a trial before he can be judicially punished.  It doesn't mean that you need to have a trial to prove their guilt before you can arrest and charge them.

What evidence would you like to see?  Have you seen enough evidence to be convinced that Zimmerman shot the kid?  Have you seen enough evidence to be convinced that the kid died from the shooting?  Have you seen enough evidence to be convinced that Zimmerman pursued the kid?  What more do you need?


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


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I love how you HAVE to play semantics just to get a smidgeon of leeway on this.

Keep it up.


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## Douger (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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Pumpernickel


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


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He needs to see video evidence of Zimmerman assassinating the kid in cold blood, then a jury saying "guilty", until that happens, we should not say anything or do anything about the case.


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


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Who's making money out of this and how?

Thanks.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


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Semantics is not a bad word, nor are actual meanings of words a bad thing.


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


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No one.


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## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


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Right and that's what judges and juries are for.  The Sanford Police Department is not judge/jury/executioner yet they are essentially wielding judicial authority by refusing to arrest Zimmerman.  If Zimmerman wants to assert an affirmative defense via Florida's Stand Your Ground law, the burden of proof is on him to present his case at a legal hearing before a judge.  But there is no judge right now and there is no case because the SPD has refused to arrest/charge him; they've essentially made their own judicial ruling and unilaterally dismissed all potential charges without having proper authority to do so.  Sanford Florida isn't Nazi Germany so its police department shouldn't be operating like the Gestapo.


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## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


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How about you stop putting words into the mouths of others and let them speak for themselves? Just an idea.


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## WillowTree (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
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yep one less hispanic voter for obama


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Intense said:


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With all due respect to you that is not evidence and will not be included as evidence in the case.
That is prejudicial to the jury unless he is recitivist under Florida statute. 
I doubt this guy has shot and killed anyone else anyway as that is the only way that would be allowed in as similar cases. 
This case is being presented to the grand jury for possible indictment. That is a good thing.
Of course there are many that would rather try him in the media and the court of public opinion as evidenced here.
There are no shortage of arm chair jurists here for sure. However, an understanding of THE LAW would help.
Let the grand jury decide and if they choose to indict him let  a jury decide his guilt or not. 
You can now untie the noose in the rope. I know that tree looked good and high but that is not how we do things these days.
I trust the jury system more than the rank hearsay here or anywhere else.


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

imbalance said:


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My guess is he has not been arrrested yet becuase a charge has not been determined. Will it be murder, voluntary manslaughter, involuntary manslaughter, etc.

Furthermore, they are also probably trying to determine if they have a case of a racially motivated crime....did race play a role in his decision to scout the poor kid out.

Once they charge him, they have to prove the charge....so to charge hiim too early may result in a botched prosecution.

The guy is innocent until proven guilty....but based on what I have heard...again, third hand information.....this attack was unwarranted.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


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Well in order to see all the evidence, in the United States we first arrest and charge someone.

Except in this case, of course, we didn't arrest or charge someone.  We did, however, drug test the dead body.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Amazing that folks believe "witnesses from past altercations" would be allowed in this case as evidence.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


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You better have probable cause!  There's this thing called the Constitution, here.  It's pretty important.


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## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
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Who used the word 'confront' with regard to this case?


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## Douger (Mar 21, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz4DfzsqR6o]In Yo Face - DJ Unk - YouTube[/ame]


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


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Leave it to you. You just proved Marc's point. When you are trying to get away from someone you do not do either of those things!!!


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


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you do not know what the DA is doing.
Dont be so quick to judge.
Drug testing the victim was important. Not to make the kid the issue, but to clear the kid of being the issue....I am sure it was done to put the onus on the attacker.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


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I DO know what the police department did - they didn't make an arrest, took the word of a guy who had just shot someone in cold blood, failed to contact the parents of the kid for 48 hours and failed to review phone records.



> Drug testing the victim was important. Not to make the kid the issue, but to clear the kid of being the issue....I am sure it was done to put the onus on the attacker.


Except the police department never used it in that manner.  This kid was killed almost a month ago.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
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The reports say Zimmerman was attacked and had a bad bruise on his face from being hit in the face with a soda can. A witness said the young man was on top of him beating the older man. That tells you the kid wasn't innocent in this either and there was a confrontation.

Did he deserve to be killed? Hell no. Zimmerman was playing cop and started the whole thing. He should get charged with manslaughter at the very least as well as with any other charges they can get him on.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


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Probable cause to make an arrest?  I'm pretty sure a man admitting he shot someone is probable cause for arrest and questioning.


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## BlindBoo (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


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Race?  Almost certainly!  He (Zimmerman) calls the Kid a fucking Coon on the 911 tape.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNI5CA5jijw]Trayvon Martin 911 Call - Did George Zimmerman Say &#39;F*ng Coons&#39;? - YouTube[/ame]


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


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No, presumption of innocence means that The Judge charges the jury AFTER THE TRIAL before jury proceedings that the defendant is PRESUMED INNOCENT and the prosecution must prove the defendant guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

Nothing close to what you just posted.
With all due respect to you also, you do not have a clue what you are talking about either. 

The presumption of innocence is tied with the due process clause.  The due process clause is a fundamental tenet of the criminal law and is contained in Florida statutes. 

A jury charge by The Judge, a presumption of innocence instruction to the jury after the evidence and closjng arguments before the case goes to the jury, is mandated because jurors may be in danger of convicting the defendant on the basis of EXTRANEOUS CIRCUMSTANCES, as this case is full of it as evidenced here, RATHER THAN THE FACTS OF THE CASE. 

Thank God we have The Constitution. You folks have no clue about criminal proceedings.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


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....And, *a GUN* surely would _enhance_ the concept*!!*​


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


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EXACTLY, as this young man that was killed ALSO should receive fairness.
Even more so as he is dead. 
Watch the system work and watch an arrest if this kid was unarmed and not doing anything such as attacking the shooter. There has to be physical attack on the shooter for a self defense defense to work on most juries. "In fear of my life" is the standard in Florida and most states but that does not hold any water here because the shooter was armed and the victim was apparently not. 
Amazing that folks here go by media reports to base their judgment on guilt or innocence at this stage.
To date NO ONE knows the evidence. Just because someone is dead is no evidence of murder. This could be self defense or it could 1st degree murder.
Unbelievable.


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


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So why did that poster say people are making money then?


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

you know....funny thing.

Now that I have Shaman on my ignore list, the threads seem so much shorter.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


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Someone's gotta *pay*.

No one....*in their right-mind*....is gonna blow-away some kid....just for walking. 

And, I can't believe there aren't *others* who've been leery o' this *John-Wayne-wannabe*....who wouldn't mind seeing him *relocated* from the neighborhood.








Hell....he's already *paid* his _entrance-fee_.​


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


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I am not that poster, so why would you ask me?

I simply answered your question. There is absolutely no one that can make money off of this tragedy...with the exception of an attorney


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


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Pay attention ditz...a lot of your fellow righties have been using the word "confront" in regards to the victim being the one who confronted the killer then ended up being shot to death.

Pay, a damn, tention.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

The girlfriend of the deceased has lawyered up.
Wonder why.


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

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No tolerance for a simple question asked?

It was a valid question......and you felt the need to ridicule her for asking it


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## Jarhead (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The girlfriend of the deceased has lawyered up.
> Wonder why.



my guess...pure guess.....some ambulance chasing attorney told her it would be for her own good.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Intense said:


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*Bingo!!!*

At *some* point, a clown (like this dude) feels he's _untouchable_....that *he* represents the community's "standards".​


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## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

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You can arrest someone without setting in stone the charges against them.  If you charge him with manslaughter or negligent homicide you are not prohibited from then upping the charge to murder later on down the line and double jeopardy doesn't hold until the case has been adjudicated.  They don't need to stall an arrest so that they can obtain evidence or make a case because Zimmerman shooting and killing Martin is already an established fact.  Zimmerman doesn't deny that because really he can't.  So at this point, Zimmerman must use an affirmative defense (Stand Your Ground self defense) to mitigate a murder charge.  But the key here is that when a defendant uses an affirmative defense, the burden shifts to the defendant to prove he was acting in self-defense so it's a bit of a role reversal here in that Zimmerman is essentially established guilty until he proves he was justified in killing Martin.  It is because of this that delaying arresting him makes troubling little sense and doesn't seem to accomplish much of anything other than encouraging Zimmerman to flee the state.


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

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WoW!! Even I thought that part was exagerrated, but it's crystal clear to the ear what he said, "These f--ckin' C@@NS!" 

Folks, it's clear as day from 2:40.

WoW!!! That MFer is TOAST!!!


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


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Relax Jar, I never see you share such sentiments with her when she's one of the most belligerent posters on this board with every single post.

Take it easy...huh?


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## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


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Why should I pay attention to people who have no valid opinions? All any of us know is what we have heard through the media. Anyone with an IQ into double digits knows that the media rarely get their facts right.... and they do not know ALL the facts. Until we have ALL the facts, none of us has a valid opinion. This is more about whipping up racial tension than any real interest in justice. I find that disgusting.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Florida passed in 2005 "Stand your Ground" legislation self defense law.
Now keep in mind all of you arm chair jurists that I do not like this law and do not believe this law is a good idea but this is CURRENT law in Florida.

The statute clearly states that if someone is attacked they can stand their ground and use whatever force they deem necessary to keep their ground. 

Again, I do know if this is the case and it does appear there is good evidence that Zimmerman followed this kid so that is a question of material fact and makes that a jury question.

But that could be a reason why he has not been charged yet.

This statute clearly states that a citizen has NO duty to retreat and eliminates any duty to retreat before using deadly force to confront any attacker. 

Rightly so police and prosecutors OPPOSED THIS LEGISLATION but it passed anyway.
These kind of laws always foster a shoot first, ask questions later mentality and accordingly I also oppose them. 

The kicker in these statutes, as I have worked a few of these cases, is that the law includes a provision that grants immunity from prosecution or civil lawsuits if a person is deemed to have acted in self defense though these dumb ass lawmakers never clearly specified who grants this immunity and bestows it.


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The girlfriend of the deceased has lawyered up.
> Wonder why.





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You guys seem to be painting a certain narrative.

And I don't think I like the tone of it.

What are you people suggesting here? Really.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


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I guess *Zimmerman* hadn't *HEARD*-about.....



> ....*that little-detail**.*


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Florida passed in 2005 "Stand your Ground" legislation self defense law.
> Now keep in mind all of you arm chair jurists that I do not like this law and do not believe this law is a good idea but this is CURRENT law in Florida.
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> The statute clearly states that if someone is attacked they can stand their ground and use whatever force they deem necessary to keep their ground.
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Where does that law apply svengali?

In the park, the streets, or in your own home/castle?

Hmmmm.....!?!!??


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## Wiseacre (Mar 21, 2012)

Was the kid shot in the back or in the front?   Does he have marks on his hands to show he might've hit Zimmerman?   Or does he have defensive wounds to show Zimmerman might've hit him?   How far away from Zimmerman was he when he was shot?   They're gonna know that stuff, and pretty much tell what went down.

I've always been big on waiting for the facts before rushing to judgement on anybody.   But I heard the shooter said the victim was moving away, and he (Zimmerman) was told not to follow but he did anyway.   So if there was a confrontation, it appears that Zimmerman initiated it.   And that makes this murder to some degree IMHO, rather than self defense.


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## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Zimmerman is toast...TOAST I said!



This is why black countries are such sh!tholes, they have no concept of justice.

Justice was done with a gun.  And, now we roaches (sharpton, jackson, etc.) who are trying to damage civilization to punish the just outcome.

The black attacked Zimmerman, not the other way around.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 21, 2012)

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Yeah, he said it under his breath. What a POS.


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


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Save your BS anti-media propaganda for someone who's stupid enough to buy it.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

imbalance said:


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Very good and I agree except the defendant never has any burden. The burden is always on the prosecution.
But I believe you meant that if a defendant is going to use that Stand Your Ground defense he has to inform the prosecution of it in Jackson discovery process and have some form of evidence to get past motions hearings where the prosecution is trying to bar that defense being made.
The system works folks. Al Sharpton is down there staying at The Ritz Carlton holding news conferences. 
Which side is the best way to go?


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

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Ya think there's any probable cause for this being a racially motivated murder now?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

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What have you offered other than your opinion based on media reports?
Were you there? 
You may believe Al Sharpton and his version or the police version but I do not believe either version.
You, I, Al Sharpton and the police WERE NOT THERE AND ARE NOT WITNESSES. 
Why else would Sharpton go there except to whip up racial tension.
I believe you agree as I know you as a reasonable man.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 21, 2012)

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Most definitely. It's clear as day on the tape.


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

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All the civil rights activist who collect "donations" in the name of the victim.  The ones who desperately need things like this to be about race so they dont have to go out and get a job. Ill give you credit for not going right to race in your thread here, ill even agree this dude committed murder, but there are others here and out there who want it to be about race. A whit guy shooting a black kid.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


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So basically what you are telling us is you are a racist piece of trash and you support the shooter no matter what, ok got it.


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## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

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WTF has quoted Al Sharpton on anything dawg?

You're acting as if we have no evidence. We have written reports. We have 911 calls, we hear live recording of the incident.

Why are you acting this way?

WTF is up dude?!?!?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


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Strong possibility. Probably, maybe, could be, leaning that way, has to be.

None of that means a damn thing in criminal court. And I thank the Constitution for that. 

Now we would not ever want a "rush to judgment" would we?


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> No, presumption of innocence means that The Judge charges the jury AFTER THE TRIAL before jury proceedings that the defendant is PRESUMED INNOCENT and the prosecution must prove the defendant guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.



Shut the fuck up!  If you're not going to address anything I've said, don't quote me or even bother saying anything.  I never said anything about what the judge is supposed to tell the jury, or when.  I said that presumption of innocence means that the accused has to be granted a trial before he can be punished.  The problem is that you seem to want it to mean that there must first be a trial before someone can be arrested and charged with a crime.



> With all due respect to you also, you do not have a clue what you are talking about either.



That's rich coming from someone who is babbling on, using SAT words, and not knowing what the fuck they actually mean.  Listen, we're not talking about a trial over whether someone broke your window and interrupted you while watching "Kick My Balls."  We're talking about real deal, grown up stuff, mkay?



> The presumption of innocence is tied with the due process clause.  The due process clause is a fundamental tenet of the criminal law and is contained in Florida statutes.



Who has said anything about denying due process?  Stop tearing down the straw man, Dorothy, he didn't do anything to you.  Nobody said that Zimmerman should be thrown in prison on a whim and that should be the end of it.  The issue that people have is that the police are not interested in arresting and charging Zimmerman for his crime.  He should be arrested, charged, tried, and convicted.  But your entire position seems to be that charging him would be a violation of due process, which is an absurdity because it would be ADMINISTERING DUE PROCESS.


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

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Zimmerman pushed the issue and was getting a well deserved ass whipping. He was looking for trouble. This was not a justified shooting.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

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This girl is being taken advantage of and used for publicity.
ONLY.
Don't you see that also?


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## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
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I'd say your clairvoyance is impressive, if I didn't know you were simply filling in the gaps with assumptions that fit your confirmation bias.

There are a lot of anonymous internet dipshits in the cloud, but you're the worst kind.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



With no evidence, you have Zimmerman convicted.

Might it be the color of his skin?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


What is so wrong with saying it's about race and racism...when it's about race and racism?

Did you hear the tape of him calling him an effing coon, and of him saying "they always get away?"

Did you hear that?


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


*Bullshit!!*

If it's proven (if neighbors feel *safe* about testifying) that Zimmerman has a *HABIT* of confronting/intimidating people, it's gonna weigh *heavily*, against him!!

I'd say there's a damned-good-*chance* that (*too* many) neighbors have been (merely) *tolerating* his routine.....'cause they're convinced he's a _little_ *off-balance*, *any*how. Ya' can't very-well banish someone from your neighborhood, if he hasn't *done* anything. *Pre*emptive-_striking_ is (more) a *Bush*-_entitlement_.

Time will tell.​


----------



## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



The whole family is.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...


Post where I've stated that I've convicted him.

I think the opposite is true, you and others, including the corrupt cops have declared him innocent by not even arresting him.

Funny how you managed to twist things around so viciously.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> You better have probable cause!  There's this thing called the Constitution, here.  It's pretty important.



Actually, I think Obama revoked that.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


....But, ya' *GOTTA* (also) agree he *should* have (at least) been taken-in for *questioning*.

If he *had* been, I haven't heard-about-it.​


----------



## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Yup. I sure did. And the man committed murder to. But there is an insinuation that this man got away with this because he shot a black kid and not a white one. Its about morons with guns, not race.


----------



## Wiseacre (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...




That's BS Marc, what a ridiculous thing to say.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > No, presumption of innocence means that The Judge charges the jury AFTER THE TRIAL before jury proceedings that the defendant is PRESUMED INNOCENT and the prosecution must prove the defendant guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
> ...



How many criminal cases have you investigated and gone to trial?
Where did you get your POST training and studied criminal procedure?
Where did you take criminal justice at the university?
Where did I state anywhere I had a problem charging this guy with anything?

If you would educate yourself on the law the police have no duty to arrest anyone if THE LAW AND STATUTES of their state do not warrant them to do so.

I stated clearly that I do not like Florida law and it stinks but that is THE LAW.

I have worked similar cases here where the law was bad and know the process. I have investigated over 200 murder cases and many were self defense under the law.\

I do not like it anymore than you do these gun toting cowboys out there. PROBABLY, the evidence is that this guy chased this kid down, a fight ensued and we do not know who started it.
WE DO KNOW FLORIDA LAW and Florida law is that it is LEGAL to shoot to kill if the otherguy started the fight.

So tell us Clarence, WHO STARTED THE FIGHT AND WHO HIT WHO FIRST?


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Jarhead said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...



It's true that we don't know. And that is why so many are upset. The police were willing to drop the matter without an investigation. The death of an unarmed person by an armed person should be investigated. More so if the unarmed person was a minor.


----------



## kwc57 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



Are we supposed to know what you are talking about without a link?  Who is Zimmerman?


----------



## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



In another thread, you did say something about punching him in the face, did you not? 
And have made a few threats against him as an individual, have you not? 
You have said 'he's toast', have you not? 

Generally speaking, those statements could be seen as convicting him without due process.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Amazing that folks believe "witnesses from past altercations" would be allowed in this case as evidence.


You're saying.....if this had happened in *YOUR* neighborhood....and, you were *convinced* the dude had a *few screws loose* (due to *past* incidents)....and, you have children....*YOU* wouldn't want to have some input*????*

I don't buy that.​


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Post where I've stated that I've convicted him.



This entire thread is a lynching.

You know it.



> I think the opposite is true, you and others, including the corrupt cops have declared him innocent by not even arresting him.
> 
> Funny how you managed to twist things around so viciously.



I haven't declared him anything, fool.

I said let the courts and evidence decide,

You decided based on race.


----------



## frazzledgear (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



I think Si Modo was just using the definition in the way some laws have even tried to make it where if someone tries to attack you and you can get away, you are obligated to do so and run away.  A stupid interpretation that only tries to make a victim out of the aggressor.   Which is exactly what  this guy is trying to claim -that even though  he was actually the aggressor, he is really the victim.  No he isn't.  That poor kid he followed And stalked and whose body shows he was struck several times and then finally shot -is the victim.  This kid's crime as far as Zimmerman's defense?  Being black while buying snacks at a 7-11 without incident and then walking in the rain and looking like he was up to no good.  He followed him and undoubtedly scared the heck out of the kid, hit him-he fought back.  But he was fighting for his life and lost.  The entire incident was instigated by Zimmerman as a power trip who already decided he was up to "no good" based on race -and now lying about it, claiming he couldn't tell.  Although he sure knew his race during his 911 call.  Stalking a black kid walking in the rain after buying snacks where it is YOUR actions are actually the only ones that are suspicious and crossing the line, scaring a kid by stalking him and obviously following him before getting out of your car to beat and shoot him is not what is meant by "neighborhood watch".  The man belongs in prison.  And I personally would not take his word about what happened given he stalked his victim, ignored the 911 operator to leave him alone -and it is the kid who actually did nothing wrong who ends up dead.  With the killer trying to STILL blame the victim he chose and he stalked.and he killed.


----------



## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



My, my, Marc... you are very emotional about this. I am not 'anti-media', I am pro accurate, unbiased journalism.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...


What does me saying he should get punched in the face mean?
What does me saying "He's TOAST!" mean?

I say that EXACT thing about RepubliCON$ almost every day here.

What does "He's TOAST" mean?

You, nor anyone for that matter, can produce a single, solitary shred of evidence of me threatening Zimmerman. As if that would mean anything in the context of an anonymous poster on a public board anyway.

Your BS would not stand up in Court...and that much is a fact. You're whole case is one big flop...as usual.

*FAIL!!!*


----------



## BlindBoo (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



Federal civil rights violation standards are pretty tough to prove.  The tape helps proves race was a motivating factor.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Douger said:


> In Yo Face - DJ Unk - YouTube


I was *WONDERING* where the *Reps* (for the *WHITE-TRASH BIGOTS*), here, were.​


----------



## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Jarhead said:
> ...



And that is one issue that I would like to see addressed. I'd like to hear from the police about what investigation was undertaken and what the results of that were... from the police themselves, not from the media.


----------



## GHook93 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



In this case the White man appears to be in the wrong. However, you're a Black Supremacist you are always going to Whitey as wrong. The MAN as the ills for all of African American community. Europe as the reason African warlords rape and slaughter innocent people. I guarantee you still think the Duke LaCrosse players got away with rape and you were screaming on the frontlines that they are rapist, even in light of all the evidence. 

You will ALWAYS ALWAYS blame the white man. I bet you blame the white kid who got light on fire by two older black kids! I bet you will ignore the fact that black and latino kids can easily go to a school that is predominately white. Yet a White kid cannot got to a school that is predominately black or latino!


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....so, if he was "high"....it was his time to *"go"*, huh??​


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

frazzledgear said:


> I think Si Modo was just using the definition in the way some laws have even tried to make it where if someone tries to attack you and you can get away, you are obligated to do so and run away.  A stupid interpretation that only tries to make a victim out of the aggressor.   Which is exactly what  this guy is trying to claim -that even though  he was actually the aggressor, he is really the victim.  No he isn't.  That poor kid he followed And stalked and whose body shows he was struck several times and then finally shot -is the victim.  This kid's crime as far as Zimmerman's defense?  Being black while buying snacks at a 7-11 without incident and then walking in the rain and looking like he was up to no good.  He followed him and undoubtedly scared the heck out of the kid, hit him-he fought back.  But he was fighting for his life and lost.  The entire incident was instigated by Zimmerman as a power trip who already decided he was up to "no good" based on race -and now lying about it, claiming he couldn't tell.  Although he sure knew his race during his 911 call.  Stalking a black kid walking in the rain after buying snacks where it is YOUR actions are actually the only ones that are suspicious and crossing the line, scaring a kid by stalking him and obviously following him before getting out of your car to beat and shoot him is not what is meant by "neighborhood watch".  The man belongs in prison.  And I personally would not take his word about what happened given he stalked his victim, ignored the 911 operator to leave him alone -and it is the kid who actually did nothing wrong who ends up dead.  With the killer trying to STILL blame the victim he chose and he stalked.and he killed.


Mark who's supporting the murderer and who's  bashing the victim. You'll notice certain similarities among them.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...


...But, you _forget_ where you read that.....right?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...


Point out the "emotion" in my post(s).

Considering you're one of the most ranting, cussing, raving and belligerent so-and-soes on this board your statement is nothing but a big ole joke.

*ROTFLMBAO!!!!!*


----------



## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> So basically what you are telling us is you are a racist piece of trash and you support the shooter no matter what, ok got it.



I support the shooter because he was attacked.  

If you want to see a racist piece of trash, check a mirror.  It should be a good clue when you're on the same side of the fence with Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, while accusing Zimmerman (hispanic), the police (who may be black), etc. of racism.

Justice served with a gun is why every law-abiding citizen should own a gun.


----------



## OldUSAFSniper (Mar 21, 2012)

Who's making money on this?  Well, I hear that the Reverend Sharpton is on his way to Florida.  I can tell you right now that Big Al doesn't do this crap for free.  So if you're asking me who is making money on this, I'd say that Reverand Al is one of them.  The man is a race pimp.  Tawana Browley was such a great cause!

We have a child who is dead and a man who may have maliciously shot him.  I'd say that we have enough chaos without the race pimps and the other trash that seem to float to the surface.  The wheels of justice can move very slowly, but they do turn.  Let them...


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The girlfriend of the deceased has lawyered up.
> Wonder why.


*ANYONE*, directly related to this, would be *WISE* to-do-so*!!!!!*

If you're gonna be dragged-into-Court, you'd *damned*-well better have a paper-trail of *anything & EVERYTHING* you've said/done*!!!*

An adult would know such things.​


----------



## Wiseacre (Mar 21, 2012)

Anybody heard anything about how far away the kid was when he was shot?   Or whether it was in the back or front?   I heard the shooter say on a call to 911 that the kid was moving away from him;  he was told in so many words not to pursue but did anyway, so if a confrontation or fight broke out it seems the shooter initiated it.   I'm not big on jumping to conclusions, and would like to know more details, but it doesn't sound like self defense to me.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

kwc57 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...


Are you kiddin' me!?!? 

Surely you jest...right?

Maybe a snapshot of his mugshot will joggle and toggle your memory...


----------



## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > So basically what you are telling us is you are a racist piece of trash and you support the shooter no matter what, ok got it.
> ...



The shooter instigated the confrontation. He could have followed the kid and directed the police to the kid. Instead he confronted the kid, started a fight, and shot him when the kid started to beat his ass. He committed murder, he should be arrested and charged.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > The girlfriend of the deceased has lawyered up.
> ...


Yeah....right....._roll-the-dice_ on showing-up, in Court, for a (possible) *homicide*-trial.....*without* representation.

How _exciting_ that'd be, huh??


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 21, 2012)

OldUSAFSniper said:


> Who's making money on this?  Well, I hear that the Reverend Sharpton is on his way to Florida.  I can tell you right now that Big Al doesn't do this crap for free.  So if you're asking me who is making money on this, I'd say that Reverand Al is one of them.  The man is a race pimp.  Tawana Browley was such a great cause!
> 
> We have a child who is dead and a man who may have maliciously shot him.  I'd say that we have enough chaos without the race pimps and the other trash that seem to float to the surface.  The wheels of justice can move very slowly, but they do turn.  Let them...


Any links supporting your claims that he gets paid for such things?

I'd like to see them now please.

Thank you very much in advance.


----------



## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

OldUSAFSniper said:


> Who's making money on this?  Well, I hear that the Reverend Sharpton is on his way to Florida.  I can tell you right now that Big Al doesn't do this crap for free.  So if you're asking me who is making money on this, I'd say that Reverand Al is one of them.  The man is a race pimp.  Tawana Browley was such a great cause!
> 
> We have a child who is dead and a man who may have maliciously shot him.  I'd say that we have enough chaos without the race pimps and the other trash that seem to float to the surface.  The wheels of justice can move very slowly, but they do turn.  Let them...



Yup.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

Wiseacre said:


> Anybody heard anything about how far away the kid was when he was shot?   Or whether it was in the back or front?   I heard the shooter say on a call to 911 that the kid was moving away from him;  he was told in so many words not to pursue but did anyway, so if a confrontation or fight broke out it seems the shooter initiated it.   I'm not big on jumping to conclusions, and would like to know more details, but it doesn't sound like self defense to me.



The confrontation took place sometime after the police told Zimmerman not to follow the black. It makes no sense that Zimmerman would have confronted the black he was following, given that the police were on their way.  Zimmerman was physically attacked, and had the wounds to prove it.  Zimmerman was calling for help, during the attack.  

Most likely, the black saw Zimmerman following him, and so decided to jump Zimmerman.  Zimmerman shot in self-defense, which should settle it for anyone who isn't a real racist piece of trash.


----------



## BlindBoo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > Anybody heard anything about how far away the kid was when he was shot?   Or whether it was in the back or front?   I heard the shooter say on a call to 911 that the kid was moving away from him;  he was told in so many words not to pursue but did anyway, so if a confrontation or fight broke out it seems the shooter initiated it.   I'm not big on jumping to conclusions, and would like to know more details, but it doesn't sound like self defense to me.
> ...



I think it would be more suited to your style if you used the same term Zimmerman used when talking about Trayvon Martin.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNI5CA5jijw]Trayvon Martin 911 Call - Did George Zimmerman Say &#39;F*ng Coons&#39;? - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Florida passed in 2005 "Stand your Ground" legislation self defense law.
> Now keep in mind all of you arm chair jurists that I do not like this law and do not believe this law is a good idea but this is CURRENT law in Florida.
> 
> The statute clearly states that if someone is attacked they can stand their ground and use whatever force they deem necessary to keep their ground.


So....if Martin had a gun....and, Zimmerman jumped outta his vehicle, and went after Martin....Martin could have done the shooting.

Yeah....I'm _sure_ *THAT* would have gone _well_.


----------



## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Mark who's supporting the murderer and who's  bashing the victim. You'll notice certain similarities among them.



And also note who is automatically calling Zimmerman a murderer and assuming that Martin is completely innocent.

The facts may prove you right, but they may prove you wrong.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

*"Stand Your Ground" Author; 
Zimmerman Should Probably Be Arrested*​


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> I support the shooter because he was attacked.



I've seen no evidence that supports that claim. 



> If you want to see a racist piece of trash, check a mirror.  It should be a good clue when you're on the same side of the fence with Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, while accusing Zimmerman (hispanic), the police (who may be black), etc. of racism.
> 
> Justice served with a gun is why every law-abiding citizen should own a gun.



Unless there is evidence that Zimmerman had a reasonable fear for his life, the shooting was not justified.

Since I don't know the facts, I'm waiting for the investigation. I oppose BOTH SIDES jumping to unwarranted conclusions.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Mark who's supporting the murderer and who's  bashing the victim. You'll notice certain similarities among them.
> ...



Police are the authorities to make first judgement of the facts, that is how they determine whether to make an arrest .  They judged that Zimmerman is innocent.  And, looking at thew facts myself, Zimmerman is innocent.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > The girlfriend of the deceased has lawyered up.
> ...


....Besides them *not-knowing-SHIT*, about legal-proceedings?

​


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Are you kiddin' me!?!?
> 
> Surely you jest...right?
> 
> Maybe a snapshot of his mugshot will joggle and toggle your memory...



If he wasn't arrested, how is there a mugshot?


----------



## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Sometimes even the police make mistakes.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Zimmerman is toast...TOAST I said!
> ...


Yeah.....you _really_ sound like someone who's been to "black countries".






You *Dead-O-Heads* are toooooooooooooooo obvious.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


----------



## Old Rocks (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



So you are a smallish 17 year old kid. You are followed then confronted by a very large angry man you don't know. Does it matter who hit first? The kid had reason, given the many cases like this we have seen, to take whatever action he thought neccessary.

Were this my son, on the what I have heard of the tapes, Zimmermann would already be dead, and artistically so. The Scotch-Irish runs deep. 

Given prior actions, the police department of Sanford merely followed their normal routine in failling to arrest Zimmermann. This is why we have the hate crime laws.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gee.....the cops _forgot_ to test Zimmerman for alcohol!

*

*Florida Police-Chief*​


----------



## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...





Si modo said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



* standing your ground *


I haven't been paying much attention to most news stories...off to google zimmmerman


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Holy Shit!

*How old ARE you??!!!*


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> So you are a smallish 17 year old kid. You are followed then confronted by a very large angry man you don't know. Does it matter who hit first? The kid had reason, given the many cases like this we have seen, to take whatever action he thought neccessary.
> 
> Were this my son, on the what I have heard of the tapes, Zimmermann would already be dead, and artistically so. The Scotch-Irish runs deep.
> 
> Given prior actions, the police department of Sanford merely followed their normal routine in failling to arrest Zimmermann. This is why we have the hate crime laws.



No doubt that you're deep into a bottle of Scotch.

Do you think Zimmerman should face more severe charges if he is found guilty of being white?


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...


I think the gun had a _little_-more to do with it.​


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > You better have probable cause!  There's this thing called the Constitution, here.  It's pretty important.
> ...



Well, you're wrong....as usual.​


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


You're (actually) givin' the *cops* a "pass"?????


----------



## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 21, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > You better have probable cause!  There's this thing called the Constitution, here.  It's pretty important.
> ...



Circumvented, get it right!


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



I stand corrected...


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



That's enough.

*You're full o' shit!!*

How do you manage to spin so much bullshit....while you (also) suggest the girlfriend (*who was ON THE PHONE WITH HIM*) is being _taken-advantage-of_, by those who insist she get *legal-representation??!!!!!*







 . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Yeah.....you're some *young-punk BULLSHITTER*, alright.

​


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

GHook93 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > So basically what you are telling us is you are a racist piece of trash and you support the shooter no matter what, ok got it.
> ...


----------



## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Based on all the evidence and the "coon" comment, it's _beginning to look likely_ that this 17 year old kid was guilty of a heinous crime.

He was guilty of first degree being black.


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

OldUSAFSniper said:


> Who's making money on this?  Well, I hear that the Reverend Sharpton is on his way to Florida.  I can tell you right now that Big Al doesn't do this crap for free.  So if you're asking me who is making money on this, I'd say that Reverand Al is one of them.  The man is a race pimp.  Tawana Browley was such a great cause!
> 
> We have a child who is dead and a man who may have maliciously shot him.  I'd say that we have enough chaos without the race pimps and the other trash that seem to float to the surface.  *The wheels of justice can move very slowly, but they do turn.*


Yeah.....I've heard that.......​


> "Through the constant attention it received, Till's case became emblematic of the disparity of justice for blacks in the South."
> 
> *Emmett Till*​


----------



## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Zimmerman is toast...TOAST I said!
> ...



Are you kidding??? I don't believe that Gerorge Zimmerman was attacked for one minute by, "the black". For your information, he has a name. It is Trayvon Martin. Zimmerman outweighs Martin by 100 pounds, for God's sake. Oh yeah, Martin really messed him up!!! Get real.

And you have the nerve to say that justice was done with a gun?? That's pitiful.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Really.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



You are either being obtuse or you are an absolute idiot. I hope you figure it out.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 21, 2012)

Rinata said:


> Ariux said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Ariux is a racist piece of trash who hates Black people, he is basically on the side of the shooter no matter what, he just doesn't have the balls to come out and say it.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Based on all the evidence and the "coon" comment, it's _beginning to look likely_ that this 17 year old kid was guilty of a heinous crime.
> 
> *He was guilty of first degree being black.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> To quite a few people on this board, yes, he was.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

> *Zimmerman; BOGUS*​
> "When 28-year-old George Zimmerman was discovered by Sanford, Florida police standing over the body of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they accepted Zimmerman's claim that he killed in self-defense as a neighborhood watch captain. Now, *through a statement released by the National Sheriffs' Association (NSA)* -- the parent organization of USAonWatch-Neighborhood Watch -- it has been revealed that *Zimmerman was not a member of any group recognized by the organization.* Zimmerman violated the central tenants of Neighborhood Watch by following Martin, confronting him, carrying a concealed weapon -- and certainly by killing.
> 
> "In no program that I have ever heard of does someone patrol with a gun in their pocket," Carmen Caldwell, the Executive Director of Citizens' Crime Watch of Miami-Dade, told theGrio. "Every city and municipality has their own policies. Here in Miami-Dade we train people only to be the eyes and ears of their communities. Not to follow and most definitely not to carry a weapon."



​


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## High_Gravity (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > So basically what you are telling us is you are a racist piece of trash and you support the shooter no matter what, ok got it.
> ...



You are so full of shit it is coming out of your ears, you support the shooter because you are a racist faggot piece of trash who hates Black people, at least have the balls to admit it.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



One of my teachers told me once that there are 2 types of people in this world. Those that get it and those that do not get it. This site has a lot of people that don't get it. Talking to a wall would be more productive than talking to them.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > Anybody heard anything about how far away the kid was when he was shot?   Or whether it was in the back or front?   I heard the shooter say on a call to 911 that the kid was moving away from him;  he was told in so many words not to pursue but did anyway, so if a confrontation or fight broke out it seems the shooter initiated it.   I'm not big on jumping to conclusions, and would like to know more details, but it doesn't sound like self defense to me.
> ...


Aw, gee......a *Donald Trump fan!!*


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Mark who's supporting the murderer and who's  bashing the victim. You'll notice certain similarities among them.
> ...


.....And, maybe there really *IS* a *Santa Claus*.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



You don't even live here, fool. Are they covering this story in great depth in England?? Oh wait, I forgot. You never watch the news or read a paper. They all lie. You get your news by magic. How could I forget that.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



And how would you hear what the police have to say if not thru the media??


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## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

Rinata said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



I've never claimed that I 'don't watch the news', idiot. I said I don't watch many talking head shows.... the pundits.... commentators... until very recently I didn't even have access to Fox News, yet alone actually watch it. I do watch a variety of intelligent, well presented, news organisations, including the BBC, Sky News, and some EU stations. I also do read newspapers... usually from both perspectives... that gives me balance - both sides of the same story. 

The difference between us, perhaps, is that I do not take everything I read at face value. I question what I read.... I don't assume the media are presenting the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I find that generally to be the case... they have their own agenda... and I don't like other people's agendas.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

GHook93 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



That is just plain ignorant. I am as white as snow and I want justice for Trayvon Martin because he was a young boy that did not deserve to die. 

Where in the hell do you you people come from?? Everything is about race with you. Thank God I was born and raised in Hollyweird. We can be a little strange but we don't hate like you do.


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## Mr. Shaman (Mar 21, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Are you kiddin' me!?!?
> ...


He'd had an earlier arrest for attacking *a COP!!*​


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## asaratis (Mar 21, 2012)

Jarhead said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


Wrong!  Lawyers will be making money from this.

...and the presumption of innocence applies only to the government.  I know and you know that Zimmerman is guilty of murder.  Now we need for the government to prove it!

Being a vigilante night watchman does not give ANYONE the right to shoot an unarmed person that did not approach you.  The kid was running from the shooter.  The shooter wanted to shoot the victim, so he caught up with him, confronted him and shot him to death.

I don't know that race was an issue, but I suspect it was.  Zimmerman is a German name and Germans tend to hate blacks because of guys like Jesse Owens and Joe Louis.

I hope Zimmerman is convicted of murder.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > Anybody heard anything about how far away the kid was when he was shot?   Or whether it was in the back or front?   I heard the shooter say on a call to 911 that the kid was moving away from him;  he was told in so many words not to pursue but did anyway, so if a confrontation or fight broke out it seems the shooter initiated it.   I'm not big on jumping to conclusions, and would like to know more details, but it doesn't sound like self defense to me.
> ...



The fact that you keep saying, "the black" tells me all I need to know about you. You're a typical racist idiot that I cannot tolerate.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Rinata said:


> Ariux said:
> 
> 
> > Wiseacre said:
> ...


Yeah, what is up with "the Black"?  Sounds creepy.  And racist.


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## amrchaos (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



The concept stems from the fact that Zimmerman is using the "Stand your ground" argument for his defense.

The problem is that much of the recordings, including one by Zimmerman to a dispatcher, tends to suggest that Zimmerman initiated contact with Trevon.  Thus the idea that Zimmerman was standing his ground appears flimsy.  The recordings suggest that Zimmerman confronted Trevon when he was not to.

Add in the fact that Zimmerman is a neighborhood watch patrol instead of actual police, one would have to wonder about what were Zimmerman intentions after he caught up to Trevon.  What training did he recieved to apprehend a suspect, and if none, what actual rights does Zimmerman have to hold a suspect?

ASIDE

The case does contain racial profiling but is it racially motivated?  There have been reports of "Black youths" robbing neihbors in the past thus the part of profiling does have a logical basis to it.  But was it racially motivated.  Most of the media is claiming that the tapes contain racial epithets. Upon closer inspection of these tapes, it seems that Zimmerman is saying "Fucking punks" instead of a racial slur.

In all likelyhood, the media is sensationalizing the case for profit.  Of course, the fact that you have aggressizely minded nieghborhood watch packing heat is enough to sensationalize the story even if Trevon was not shot.

Even so, I do find it strange that Zimmerman, even though he has used the stand your ground defense, was not arrested and further investigated.  Maybe Zimmerman has friends on the police force.  Cronyism maybe the reason Zimmerman was not handled like an average citizen.  I can't see how someone can kill another person without a standard arrest on the grounds of murder being the charge plus a follow up investigation for witnesses.  Apparently the police missed Trevon's girlfriend, although her testimony maybe biased due to who was the victim.


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## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

asaratis said:


> Jarhead said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Actually, all those commentators and 'experts' that get called in to give their 'opinions' about the incident... they're all making money from it too. 

I hope Zimmerman gets justice. I hope the same for Martin. That's because I lean towards the whole 'trial by jury' instead of 'trail by media' thing.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Rinata said:


> GHook93 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


----------



## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Ain't that the truth.  Blasphemed it at every opportunity.


----------



## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

I'm going to pass on the jump to conclusions frenzy that seems to have taken over here.  Once all the facts are in it could very well go either way.  The only dog I have in this fight is that justice be served.  But the idea that Zimmerman has no right to patrol his own neighborhood and ask strangers about what they're up to is preposterous.  We all have that right folks.  Just because many or most are too timid to exercise it doesn't change the fact that it's well within our rights to do so.  It's also the right of the stranger to tell you to fuck off and it's none of your business.  Of course if he was up to no good he knows somebody is watching, and that's a very powerful deterrent.  It's essentially the same principle that Home Depot and Best Buy employ by having a greeter get in your face and say hi every time you walk through the door.  Because studies show that you're much less likely to shoplift if someone acknowledges your presence.  And likewise, a burglar casing the neighborhood is more likely to go find a new neighborhood if someone asks him what he's doing.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Rinata said:
> 
> 
> > Ariux said:
> ...


It's a dehumanizing tool used by racist fucktards.


----------



## LockeJaw (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Rinata said:
> ...



Sometimes yes, it is possible the poster forgot the kids name, you know?


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> I'm going to pass on the jump to conclusions frenzy that seems to have taken over here.  Once all the facts are in it could very well go either way.  The only dog I have in this fight is that justice be served.  But the idea that Zimmerman has no right to patrol his own neighborhood and ask strangers about what they're up to is preposterous.  We all have that right folks.  Just because many or most are too timid to exercise it doesn't change the fact that it's well within our rights to do so.  It's also the right of the stranger to tell you to fuck off and it's none of your business.  Of course if he was up to no good he knows somebody is watching, and that's a very powerful deterrent.  It's essentially the same principle that Home Depot and Best Buy employ by having a greeter get in your face and say hi every time you walk through the door.  Because studies show that you're much less likely to shoplift if someone acknowledges your presence.  And likewise, a burglar casing the neighborhood is more likely to go find a new neighborhood if someone asks him what he's doing.


Home Depot doesn't shoot suspicious persons. Though I guess in Florida, they could justify killing shoplifters with this law.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Rinata said:
> ...


Not that I have anything against using dehumanizing rhetoric for an individual I find to be below human in nature (), but that's not based on race, rather it's based on the fact that the individual is subhuman.

Well, I learn something new every day about what racist fucktards do.

Thanks.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > I'm going to pass on the jump to conclusions frenzy that seems to have taken over here.  Once all the facts are in it could very well go either way.  The only dog I have in this fight is that justice be served.  But the idea that Zimmerman has no right to patrol his own neighborhood and ask strangers about what they're up to is preposterous.  We all have that right folks.  Just because many or most are too timid to exercise it doesn't change the fact that it's well within our rights to do so.  It's also the right of the stranger to tell you to fuck off and it's none of your business.  Of course if he was up to no good he knows somebody is watching, and that's a very powerful deterrent.  It's essentially the same principle that Home Depot and Best Buy employ by having a greeter get in your face and say hi every time you walk through the door.  Because studies show that you're much less likely to shoplift if someone acknowledges your presence.  And likewise, a burglar casing the neighborhood is more likely to go find a new neighborhood if someone asks him what he's doing.
> ...


Mani brings up a good point.

One thing we can all agree on is what Zimmerman did before he and Martin actually came into contact:  Zimmerman followed and confronted Martin because he believed Martin to be suspicious, and there is nothing illegal about that.  And, there is nothing illegal about being a creepy copper wannabe.

What happened after that, I hope the courts do a good job on fact-finding.  The press is no longer equipped to do that.


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## California Girl (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > manifold said:
> ...



Yep. That's all very logical.


----------



## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > manifold said:
> ...



Ravi never heard a good point she wasn't willing to ignore if it conflicted with her agenda driven bias.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> It's a dehumanizing tool used by racist fucktards.



The term "black" is dehumanizing?


----------



## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

Rinata said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



That's what I just asked you, you big babone!!! You're making me call you names in Italian because you're so annoying!!!


----------



## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > It's a dehumanizing tool used by racist fucktards.
> ...


"*The* black", fucktard.


----------



## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Rinata said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I doubt this case is being covered by the BBC.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > manifold said:
> ...



Regardless, there should have been an investigation since the kid was unarmed. And because he was a kid.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


I think  there is one going on.


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## Rinata (Mar 21, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Yes, and it's possible that, if I find the right doctor, I can be 25 again!!!


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > It's a dehumanizing tool used by racist fucktards.
> ...


No, constantly referring to someone as _the skin color_ is....that would also include _the white, the brown, the yellow_, etc.


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## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Regardless, there should have been an investigation since the kid was unarmed. And because he was a kid.



And the next person that says the police shouldn't investigate the shooting of an unarmed teenager will be the first.

Ravi, the always intrepid slayer of strawmen!


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Yes, _now_ there is due to the public outcry.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Regardless, there should have been an investigation since the kid was unarmed. And because he was a kid.
> ...


And yet they didn't.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


Hmmm.  I'm not aware that the don't investigate fatal shootings in Florida.

Very strange.  Everywhere else they do.


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## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



Says you.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


sigh....THAT is what this law is about.  You can't be prosecuted if you acted in self-defense. If the police believe you when you say you acted in self defense, they don't bring charges and there is no investigation. If the DA starts an investigation and find themselves backed up against this law, they drop the case.

I read today since this law was put into place, justifiable homicides have tripled. And the vast majority were against unarmed victims.


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## Amelia (Mar 21, 2012)

I'm still waiting for the answer to why they drug tested the dead boy but not the man who shot him.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


So odd.  It seems to me that ANY fatal shooting should be investigated regardless of what the shooter claims.

The Florida legislature really needs to revisit this law, and soon, IMO.


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## Mr.Nick (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



Only wanna-b "authority figures" confront individuals on suspicion..

The idiot was tying to play "neighborhood hero."

The guy obviously has some authoritarian psychological complex.....

I'll call it right now - I bet the guy's life dream was to be a police officer but was rejected...


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Yes, I agree. But the authors contend it doesn't cover what Zimmerman did.

btw, here is the link to the tripling of justifiable homicides in Florida.

Deaths Nearly Triple Since &#8220;Stand Your Ground&#8221; Enacted « CBS Miami


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> "*The* black", fucktard.



The guy is Belgian, give him a break.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Rinata said:


> Yes, and it's possible that, if I find the right doctor, I can be 25 again!!!



Your IQ?

Did it drop?


----------



## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> sigh....THAT is what this law is about.  You can't be prosecuted if you acted in self-defense. If the police believe you when you say you acted in self defense, they don't bring charges and there is no investigation. If the DA starts an investigation and find themselves backed up against this law, they drop the case.



Especially if the forensic and eyewitness evidence corroborate your self-defense.


----------



## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

Mr.Nick said:


> Only wanna-b "authority figures" confront individuals on suspicion.



Bullshit.

Anyone who cares about his family and neighborhood, *and has a spine*, confronts suspicious individuals.

Last summer I saw a guy in a pickup driving really slowly down the street.  I didn't think too much of it at first.  Then I saw him swinging by a second time and I payed closer attention.  On his third pass I flagged him down and asked him if he was lost.  He gave me some story about looking for scrap metal in people's yards.  I didn't particularly believe him, but all I said was ok, just keeping an eye out, you have a nice day.  He left and never came back.  If that makes me a 'wanna-b' authority figure then so be it.


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> Mr.Nick said:
> 
> 
> > Only wanna-b "authority figures" confront individuals on suspicion.
> ...



Certainly if on their private property as w/ Zimmerman.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > "*The* black", fucktard.
> ...


Ahhhhh.

My apologies to him, then.

Now, I understand.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > sigh....THAT is what this law is about.  You can't be prosecuted if you acted in self-defense. If the police believe you when you say you acted in self defense, they don't bring charges and there is no investigation. If the DA starts an investigation and find themselves backed up against this law, they drop the case.
> ...


Iin this case, I don't believe it did. No one knows who started the fight, if there was a fight to begin with.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > Mr.Nick said:
> ...


It wasn't on his private property, dumbass.


----------



## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

Mr.Nick said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



Apparently Zimmerman was adopted.  

Shooting of Trayvon Martin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm thinking this guy's obviously been carrying around a lot of baggage long before the shooting ever happened.  A sad story all the way around.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...





You should read some of his comments in the other thread. He might be a Belgian, but he's still a racist fucktard.


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> OODA_Loop said:
> 
> 
> > manifold said:
> ...



Sure it was.

Privately dedicated street and common area in a private community to which Zimmerman held an undivided interest in, tax liability and maintenace responsibity for.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

imbalance said:


> Mr.Nick said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


I'm not sure how being adopted is carrying around a lot of baggage, but didn't Zimmerman's father say Zimmerman spoke Spanish? He sure doesn't have an accent.....but that is a weird thing for him to say, in hindsight, that he's an hispanic minority. Looking for sympathy?


----------



## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > OODA_Loop said:
> ...


As did the boy's father. The kid had every right to be there.


----------



## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> OODA_Loop said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



He did as an invitee, but is father is not on the deed nor have a leasehold interest in the condo.  As invitees they are subject to verification of their purpose or visitation in the private community at will by bona fide residents.


----------



## BlindBoo (Mar 21, 2012)

amrchaos said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Not even close.  Unless the tape was modified.  Coons is not phonetically close to punks.  I mean Ricky might get away with Blah-people but coons to punks.....nah.  

Maybe Zimmerman was ticked off about a recent Racoon infestation?

Perhaps he was pretending to be Eric Cartman?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNI5CA5jijw]Trayvon Martin 911 Call - Did George Zimmerman Say &#39;F*ng Coons&#39;? - YouTube[/ame]


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Fucking Goons

Coon is a 1950's era perjorative that is unkown in the modern lexicon.

Certainly to 26 y/o kids.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

imbalance said:


> I'm thinking this guy's obviously been carrying around a lot of baggage long before the shooting ever happened.  A sad story all the way around.



An hispanic JEW shoots a black attacker, whites blamed.  

Zimmerman might have had a lot of baggage, but he still shot an animal in self-defense.


----------



## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > Mr.Nick said:
> ...


It's common for adopted children to feel a constant unhealthy need to prove their worth and it often carries over into adulthood.  It does make me think his crime may not have been completely race and hate motivated but rather more "neighborhood hero" motivated.  Not that it matters really, but I'm just trying to understand for myself this horrible situation.

Zimmerman is of Hispanic ethnicity and his adoptive parents are Jewish.  It could be that Zimmerman himself doesn't know who he is.  And I agree that the father slipping that in there is awkward.  It could be that he's looking for sympathy as you said or maybe he's trying to preempt the kind of white vs black race tension we saw during the Rodney King police brutality trial by suggesting that George Zimmerman can't be racist as he himself is a minority.  Who knows, people will do whatever they think they can to keep their family out of jail.


----------



## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > I'm thinking this guy's obviously been carrying around a lot of baggage long before the shooting ever happened.  A sad story all the way around.
> ...



I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here, but if your intent is to piss people off I don't think it's working.  You aren't the first racist shock-jock internet troll and you certainly won't be the last.  So whatevs.


----------



## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

imbalance said:


> It does make me think* his crime* may not have been...



^Another guy with all the facts he needs to send Zimmerman to the gallows.


----------



## Dr.Traveler (Mar 21, 2012)

Intense said:


> I support Due Process here, and a full account of both their past histories. I bet the Kid comes out allot cleaner than the shooter. Lets see how many people come out as witnesses against Zimmerman from past altercations?



Ditto.  I'm betting after a full investigation that you'll see justice done here. But I do want to know all of the facts here.  Just from what I do know, I'd bet that the Neighborhood Watch guy was in the wrong and will face charges.  But it kinda bothers me that when they show the victim and the shooter on the news now they use such blatantly biased photo choices.  There's a lot of stuff happening now that will make it that much harder to get to the truth.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Dr.Traveler said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > I support Due Process here, and a full account of both their past histories. I bet the Kid comes out allot cleaner than the shooter. Lets see how many people come out as witnesses against Zimmerman from past altercations?
> ...


Yup.  That's what our once great newsmen have become.  Very sad.


----------



## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > It does make me think* his crime* may not have been...
> ...



Oh my bad bro I didn't mean cause you any butthurt over your boy Zimmerman.  Florida doesn't even use gallows btw.  And yes, when you acknowledge shooting and killing an unarmed child you have by default committed a crime unless you can produce a legal defense that mitigates the degree of criminality.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > OODA_Loop said:
> ...


Link?

I also wonder if the father of the boy can sue the homeowner's association for allowing an unregistered "crime watch" captain to roam around with a gun.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > I'm thinking this guy's obviously been carrying around a lot of baggage long before the shooting ever happened.  A sad story all the way around.
> ...


Gawdammit.  I retract my apology for calling you a racist fucktard.  Someone said you were Belgian and didn't know the language too well and that's why your rhetoric was what it was.

But, now it is obvious you are a racist fucktard.

Time for Belgian jokes!  Let them flow!

Les Belges....boff.

Retard.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> OODA_Loop said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


I hope not.  I've called the cops on suspicious activity in my neighborhood.


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> OODA_Loop said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



No link required....pull the plat in the Orange County Public Records its a private community with private rights-of-way.  Fl Statutes speaks to owners / leaseholders  undivded interests in common areas.  Just like a private common pool or recreation area is "my" pool and I would not have to retreat from it.

No registration of watch groups required by law.

Irregardless he was patroling private property.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > OODA_Loop said:
> ...


It's Seminole County, not Orange. And communities have been sued successfully for not making residents aware of crimes committed within the community. So it doesn't really matter if it is considered private property or not....


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> And communities have been sued successfully for not making residents aware of crimes committed within the communitySo it doesn't really matter if it is considered private property or not....




Got it. Brilliant counselor.


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## Too Tall (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



Al Sharpton the race pimp will be in Florida tomorrow.  He will make some money.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > And communities have been sued successfully for not making residents aware of crimes committed within the communitySo it doesn't really matter if it is considered private property or not....
> ...



Government and communities have sovereign immunity in most instances.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > OODA_Loop said:
> ...



One of the co-sponsors of the legislation was on CNN earlier and he disagrees with your assessment - he says his law (the one he sponsored and pushed) does not apply in this case.

Maybe you know better than him.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Amelia said:


> I'm still waiting for the answer to why they drug tested the dead boy but not the man who shot him.



They do not conduct autopsies on folk that are still vertical with a heartbeat.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> An hispanic JEW shoots a black attacker, whites blamed.
> 
> Zimmerman might have had a lot of baggage, but he still shot an animal in self-defense.



Damn, I defended you.

But you really are a racist pile of shit.....

On behalf of the people of the United States, I invite you to fuck off and go back to Belgium.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Florida passed in 2005 "Stand your Ground" legislation self defense law.
> ...



Anywhere Marc. Go look it up. As I stated I do not like it either.
If the fact that both Democrats and Republicans both pass bad law is news to you then that is your problem.
Been going on for a long time. 
The Stand your Ground applies to anywhere in Florida.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still waiting for the answer to why they drug tested the dead boy but not the man who shot him.
> ...



When those vertical people with heartbeats kill someone else, they usually perform arrests.


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## Amelia (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still waiting for the answer to why they drug tested the dead boy but not the man who shot him.
> ...




You have to be dead to have a drug test?  They didn't even check to see if Zimmerman had been drinking.


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## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Irregardless he was patroling private property.



Irregardless isn't a word.  The suffix _less_ and prefix _ir_ both mean "not" so the two negatives cancel each other out leaving irregardless as the equivalent of regard.  It would be like saying irrationaless or irregularless.  Just sayin.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Amelia said:
> ...


See, that's the problem.  The LAW in Florida allows for his killing that kid (with what we know).  We PRESUME INNOCENCE in the USA, especially when the law allows for the event.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



No, I stated what WE THINK of any evidence now is moot.
Don't you know that the evidence has to be tendered and offererd before the case goes to trial?
I love the old Perry Mason shows where a witness all of a sudden appears and offers testimony that no one knew about.
Never happens because the defense is given ALL the evidence in discovery proceedings long before the trial and they can argue the admissability of all of that evidence piece by piece.
So to date we HAVE NO EVIDENCE. 
Nothing, nada, zero. What we have is POTENTIAL evidence. 
I do not make the laws of criminal procedure.
But after 34 years as a street 'gator in Atlanta I do know the criminal law and very well. I have investigated over 5500 cases, 3000 of them criminal. I have worked for the top criminal defense lawyers in Atlanta and Georgia for most of those 34 years. Not do drop names dude but I am very sure you have heard of all of them.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Objection your honor. The prosecution is offering opinion only.
"Sustained".


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Amelia said:
> ...


You DO know they can only do that if they have probable cause to do so, right?

It's that pesky Fourth Amendment.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Jarhead said:
> ...



The police did not drop the matter. They sent it directly to the grand jury.
Are you folks really this ignorant calling the police "corrupt" and other BS?
Damn, one would think some of you have taken some courses in the law or something along the way.
"Racism, racism, racism, the cops are corrupt, he said coon."
If this would have been a gay guy in Atlanta shot by a black kid Marc would have not mentioned a word about it if the black kid was not charged.
It IS all about race.


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The police did not drop the matter. They sent it directly to the grand jury.



And after departmental and state attorney counsel.... they did not have cause to arrest him.

Such compelling evidence to cut someone loose.....typically in jurisdictions around the country is:

-_ eye witness testimony
- gun shot residue
- testing of weapons for biological determiners_


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## Amelia (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...




Directly?

Please read up on the timeline following the shooting.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Good argument at trial but the law is the law. 
It always who hits first in civil and criminal law. He could have kept on walking.
You have to show material fact that the person was actively trying to AVOID confrontation for The Stand Your Ground Statute not to apply.
But as I have stated time and time again, your or my suppositions do not mean a thing.
And all you have provided are maybes and supposititons.
Respectfully, which is nothing.


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Directly?
> 
> Please read up on the timeline following the shooting.



Ergo .......it is just another case of law enforcement acting _"stupidly"_ for racial reasons.


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> You have to show material fact that the person was actively trying to AVOID confrontation for The Stand Your Ground Statute not to apply.



Not on private property or conveyances.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



The district attorneys office controls the grand jury calendar, NOT THE POLICE.
Damn, does anyone anywhere take civics class at any time. Hell, we took it in grade school.


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## Amelia (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Directly?
> ...





Ergo you are talking out of your hat and deflecting when that is pointed out.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

So if a black man that has been robbing Tech students recently, both black and white students, and he calls one of his white victims "honky" that is a hate crime?

LOL, this is getting so funny my side is aching!


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Apparently not.  Some have no idea what the 4th Amendment is about, either.

(And, like most American kids, I bet you took civics in 8th grade...but it may seem like grade school.  Time has a way of blending the past.  )


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Amelia said:


> OODA_Loop said:
> 
> 
> > Amelia said:
> ...



I don't deflect.

What specific deficiency in the time line and the responsible party are you referring ?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Mr. Shaman said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Please go back to 3rd grade and learn how to form a complete sentence and get back to us.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Nothing wrong with getting emotional about a young kid getting gunned down and having sympathy for the family and his friends.
But calling police corrupt and making claims about the guilt and innocence based on media reports only is not sound reason.


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## Mr.Nick (Mar 21, 2012)

Why does his race matter???

Zimmerman has a history of calling the cops on "suspicious people" I highly doubt they were all black.

I read an article where it said he called the cops 22 or 24 different times on "suspicious suspects."

This time he took it too far on a kid eating candy talking to his girl...

How rational is following someone then shooting them because they kicked your ass..

Zimmerman is delusional at best...

He's probably a paranoid schizophrenic....


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## manifold (Mar 21, 2012)

imbalance said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > imbalance said:
> ...





Need a tissue?


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## OODA_Loop (Mar 21, 2012)

Private property where one encounters an unknown and asks what he is doing there but the unknown proceeds to run further into the private property wherein one takes chase to protect the safety of the residents ....only to be ambushed in the dark and bashed in the head with Az Ice Tea Can....which are giant..... and pounced on and punched until after screaming for help forced to pull a lawful weapon an cease the attack with lethal force is reasonable.

Cops thought so


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 21, 2012)

Mr.Nick said:


> Why does his race matter???
> 
> Zimmerman has a history of calling the cops on "suspicious people" I highly doubt they were all black.
> 
> ...



If he is, that brings up the question of why he was issued a C&C license.

I'm all in favor of concealed and carry, but crazy people are excluded.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Mr. Shaman said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



How about we lay out 50K each and let someone of your choice here look into my qualifications and career.
And find out who the punk is and who isn't?
Comprende?


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## frazzledgear (Mar 21, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Out today the phone records of the kid proving he was on the phone right up to when Zimmerman accosted him.  On the phone with his girlfriend, backed up by both of their phone records-who for some reason didn't come forward until now -but said he told her he was being followed.  She told him to run and he said was just going to walk fast and try to lose him.  He told her the guy was still following and heard him ask "why are you following me?" -and then she heard him screaming for help and the phone disconnected so she didn't hear the gunshot. That is now four people who confirm it was the kid screaming for help.  In spite of Zimmerman claiming he was the one screaming - which is not believable given it is no doubt the sight of he gun that made the kid start screaming and throw his candy at him.  The kid's phone records prove he was on the phone with his girlfriend right up until right before he was shot. And he was the one screaming for help.  Zimmerman supposedly had a bloody nose and bump on his head-I wouldn't put it past him to have done it to himself after realizing he shot and killed a scared unarmed kid.  But given the tight timeline, if the teenager did it, he was already screaming for help-which tells me if he laid a hand on the guy it was out of terror after seeing the gun drawn on him by a white stranger who had been following him and was NOT a fight he started.  

And by the way I am sick of hearing news media supposedly correcting  previous "false" reports that Zimmerman is white and that he is actually Hispanic.  I hate to break the bad news to morons who don't realize it, but Hispanics are WHITE.   Being Hispanic is merely an ethnic difference, not a racial one.  Apparently we still have people who do not realize there are only three races of human beings.  Other differences within a race are just ethnic differences that have nothing to do with race.  So Hispanic or not, Zimmerman is a white guy who stalked, attacked and killed an innocent black kid who was walking down the street while talking to his girlfriend on the phone which is backed up by both phone records.  The kid threw his Skittles at Zimmerman while screaming for his life-and Zimmerman shot him.  Just thinking of the fear and desperation of throwing his candy to defend himself against a hot-headed arrogant asshole packing a gun, an attitude and a massive power trip makes me weep.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > And communities have been sued successfully for not making residents aware of crimes committed within the communitySo it doesn't really matter if it is considered private property or not....
> ...


Any time you want to produce evidence that the kid didn't have a right to walk through the community, let's have a look at it.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


That is false.

As to whether the police are corrupt or not, I do not know. But in their judgement they couldn't arrest the guy. Their hands were tied by the law from their understanding of it.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

OODA_Loop said:


> Private property where one encounters an unknown and asks what he is doing there but the unknown proceeds to run further into the private property wherein one takes chase to protect the safety of the residents ....only to be ambushed in the dark and bashed in the head with Az Ice Tea Can....which are giant..... and pounced on and punched until after screaming for help forced to pull a lawful weapon an cease the attack with lethal force is reasonable.
> 
> Cops thought so


It was reported that the can of ice tea was in his pocket. I guess he thoughtfully put it there after he bashed the perp.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

A small bit of good news:

Fla. "Stand Your Ground" author may seek changes - CBS News


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## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

frazzledgear said:


> Out today the phone records of the kid proving he was on the phone right up to when Zimmerman accosted him.  On the phone with his girlfriend, backed up by both of their phone records-who for some reason didn't come forward until now -but said he told her...."



Hearsay.



> and then she heard him screaming for help and the phone disconnected so she didn't hear the gunshot. That is now four people who confirm it was the kid screaming for help.



Wrong.  She didn't say she heard him screaming for help.  And, none of the witnesses who talked to police that night contradicted Zimmerman's claim that he was screaming.



> In spite of Zimmerman claiming he was the one screaming - which is not believable given it is no doubt the sight of he gun that made the kid start screaming



I wish you would put down the crack pipe and explain to me how you think Zimmerman suffered physical injuries.  Did the sight of a gun make the black attack Zimmerman, forcing Zimmerman to pull the trigger? 



> Zimmerman supposedly had a bloody nose and bump on his head-I wouldn't put it past him to have done it to himself after realizing he shot and killed a scared unarmed kid.



Oh good, you did answer my question from above!  The police showed up almost immediately after the shooting (say, within a minute).   Do you think the mentally-slow and shaken Zimmerman had the presence of mind to inflict damage upon himself in such a short time?  Why is it you think Zimmerman fabricated evidence, but that the black's girlfiend (who had a lot of time to invent something) didn't fabricate a story?



> And by the way I am sick of hearing news media supposedly correcting  previous "false" reports that Zimmerman is white and that he is actually Hispanic.  I hate to break the bad news to morons who don't realize it, but Hispanics are WHITE.



Aside from the fact that Hispanics are typically mixed-race with Indian blood (with Asian ancestry), "white" is more than just genes.  It's also culture. 



> Just thinking of the fear and desperation of throwing his candy to defend himself against a hot-headed arrogant asshole packing a gun, an attitude and a massive power trip makes me weep.



That is all in your head.


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> frazzledgear said:
> 
> 
> > Out today the phone records of the kid proving he was on the phone right up to when Zimmerman accosted him.  On the phone with his girlfriend, backed up by both of their phone records-who for some reason didn't come forward until now -but said he told her...."
> ...



Zimmerman pushed the confrontation, and initiated the contact. Had he done as he was instructed by the 911 operator this would have ended differently. This kid did not need to be shot. It was murder.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


The law allows a judge and/or grand jury to make such determinations.  If someone murders another person with a gun, the law does not take them at their word without arrest or extensive questioning.


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## imbalance (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > manifold said:
> ...



I can't hear you over the Radiohead I'm listening to COME AT ME BRO


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...


To arrest, you need probable cause.  It's a constitutional thing.  Under the LAW in Florida, the cops saw none.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



A person shot a 17 year old kid and killed him.  I don't care what the cops claim they "saw", if a person shoots another person in cold blood and kills them there's probable cause to detain and question them - if for no other reason than the fact that the police can only get one side of the story.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...


I agree there is probable cause to detain and question him.

Do you have evidence they did not do that?


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## Old Rocks (Mar 21, 2012)

You have to understand Si, she thinks Attila the Hun is the left wing of her political ideology.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> You have to understand Si, she thinks Attila the Hun is the left wing of her political ideology.


Actually, I don't but don't let that keep you from looking like the fool that you are.

Negged for attempting to represent my views for me - dishonestly, as usual.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



yes!  They did not detain and question him.  He was briefly questioned at the scene.

Tell me, how many people who shoot and kill an unarmed 17 year old walk away without arrest?


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## Gareyt17 (Mar 21, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



Convict is one thing...but we do have evidence!

We know for a FACT the poor kid that was shot was unarmed..we know for a FACT the poor kid that was shot had no ill intent, we know for a FACT he was simply an American going to the store, something we all do every day.  We know for a FACT he was illegally confronted by a vigilante (yes, I use that word intentionally) citizen who decided this kid didn't "belong" in his neighborhood...that vigilante, ARMED with a gun went AGAINST the police dispatchers advice and both followed AND CONFRONTED this American citizen who's only crime was walking to the store!

and finally, we know for a FACT this unarmed American was gunned down on our streets by a vigilante taking the law into his own hands!

These FACTS are not up for debate!  The sad thing about all of this, while you are all concerned about not "convicting" the shooter, he not only convicted this AMERICAN citizen LAWFULLY living his life...he EXECUTED HIM!


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...


A hell of a lot in Florida, because of the LAW.

And, do you have a link to the information that says he was briefly questioned at the scene?

Thanks.


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

Gareyt17 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Well, we don't really no for a fact that the kid had no ill intent, but it sure looks that way.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Can you show me a case where an armed person shot and killed an unarmed minor and walked away without arrest or questioning?



> And, do you have a link to the information that says he was briefly questioned at the scene?



sure:



> Zimmerman tells police he killed Martin in self defense. Taking him at his word, police do not arrest him, nor administer a drug or alcohol test. They also did not run a background check.



Trayvon Martin Case: Timeline of Events - ABC News


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## Gareyt17 (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gareyt17 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Oh yeah...I forgot...those Skittles he bought at the store for his little brother...maybe he was gonna assault the guy who shot him...silly me....


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## Gareyt17 (Mar 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



I actually heard one of Zimmermans neighbors telling a newsman and I have to paraphrase, *"if the kid had just answered the questions asked him properly none of this wouldn't have happened"*

I just shook my head thinking how I remember back to the days when America existed...ah, the good ol days


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## Ravi (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...


There was a kid that got shot in the back by security guards for doing nothing more than sitting in his car....when he tried to drive away when they challenged him they shot him. And got off because they claimed he was trying to run them over.

No investigation.

This is a bad law.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-57401955/fla--stand-your-ground-author-may-seek-changes/


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## Salt Jones (Mar 21, 2012)

Ariux said:


> frazzledgear said:
> 
> 
> > Out today the phone records of the kid proving he was on the phone right up to when Zimmerman accosted him.  On the phone with his girlfriend, backed up by both of their phone records-who for some reason didn't come forward until now -but said he told her...."
> ...



Witness did contradict Zimmerman concerning the screaming.

Zimmerman's father is white, mother is hispanic. 

You seem to be factless.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...


Thanks for the link.  The chief listened to what Zimmerman said, there are reports that Zimmerman had wounds on him, and there is an eyewitness who saw him on the ground before he shot the kid.

Now, before anyone gets their knickers in a knot about MY views on this, read this:





Si modo said:


> I think what might get him off is an independent witness already claiming that he saw Zimmerman on the ground.
> 
> Personally, I think this is a tragedy.  I think the 17 yo was doing nothing but walking back to his father's fiancee's house - the kid probably had to get out.  My fiancee's 17 yo can't stand me simply because I am his father's fiancee.  So, the kid got out of the house for a break.
> 
> ...



Additionally, to do an alcohol or drug test, they have to have probable cause that he is under the influence.

So, taking into consideration the stand your ground laws, the witness, the wounds, etc., the cops didn't abuse their authority, IMO.

It's a shit law.  The cops know the law and they had enough information to release him.

Personally, I don't think they did the right thing, butI don't like the laws there, and  that's what happened.  

And, most importantly, we presume innocence in this country.  We don't arrest, THEN investigate, without probable cause.  At the time after the accident, what was the probable cause other than the kid being dead, wounds on the shooter, a witness seeing the shooter on the ground before the shooting, and in consideration of the LAW?


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Ravi said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


I agree.  Now, I like the Castle Doctrine, but this Florida law goes way too far.


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

manifold said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Mark who's supporting the murderer and who's  bashing the victim. You'll notice certain similarities among them.
> ...



Zimmerman had no authority to do anything other then call the police. He had no authority to follow the kid either. It was a 1000% avoidable situation. Those are facts. In this day and age, if I am walking down the street and I am being followed by some fat slob, then the fat slob has an ass whipping coming. The kid had no way of knowing why he was being followed and was under no obligation to stop and answer any question Zimmerman may have had. Zimmerman acted foolishly. Was it an act of racizem ? no, it was an act of bad judgment that got a kid shot.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Bullshit.  Nowhere in the USA is it against the law for a citizen to follow someone, except in very limited circumstances (orders of protection, for example).



> It was a 1000% avoidable situation. Those are facts. In this day and age, if I am walking down the street and I am being followed by some fat slob, then the fat slob has an ass whipping coming. ....


And, if that fat slob has a gun and shoots you because he is afraid for his life - and he can legally do that in all states if you are "whooping his ass" and being a fat slob, he can't get away - I hope you survive.



> ....  The kid had now of knowing why he was being followed and was under no obligation to stop and answer any question Zimmerman may have had. Zimmerman acted foolishly. Was it an act of racizem ? no, it was an act of bad judgment that got a kid shot.


Very true.


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## 8537 (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> At the time after the accident, what was the probable cause other than the kid being dead, wounds on the shooter, a witness seeing the shooter on the ground before the shooting, and in consideration of the LAW?



A gunshot that killed this kid was not an "accident," nor has anyone claimed as much .


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

8537 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > At the time after the accident, what was the probable cause other than the kid being dead, wounds on the shooter, a witness seeing the shooter on the ground before the shooting, and in consideration of the LAW?
> ...


Nor have I.

Your point?


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > manifold said:
> ...



And if I am being followed by some one at night who has not identified him self when you hear five stories a night on the news about some sicko doing horrible things to kids and has 100 pounds on my I am well within my rights to defend my self. That is a fact. Zimmerman was a block Capetian for his neighborhood watch. He knew he was pushing it. Sure, he can follow whom ever he likes, but he has no authority to detain any one. And zero authority to follow anyone with the intent of detaining them for any reason. As a matter of fact, he was ordered to stop by the 911 operator. Zimmerman was wrong. He needs to be prosecuted.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


Still bullshit.  Anyone can follow anyone for any reason they want, except when ordered by a COURT not to.  We are still - barely still - a free country.

No one is obligated to do what a 9/11 operator tells them to do.  You know that, right?  And, the 9/11 operator did not make any "order", rather the operator said, "We don't need you to do that".

I agree that Zimmerman was wrong.  If Zimmerman broke the current law in Florida, yes he needs to be prosecuted.  Given the information in the press - certainly by no means at any evidentiary standard - and given the LAW, I'm not so sure he should be prosecuted.


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## Amelia (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > 8537 said:
> ...


Well, thanks.  I meant to write incident.


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Maybe so, but if he were a cop here, he would be facing charges, and we have the same law. He went out of his way to confront the boy, he had no right to do that. For all the kid knew, he was about to be robbed and acted to defend him self against a man considerably larger then him. Zimmerman went out of his way to escalate the situation. He wanted the confrontation, and when the kid got the better of him, Zimmerman shot him down. We are arguing semantics here not much more. The law is not bad, the fact this retard got a CCW is. The fact he is a neighborhood watch captain is bad. He will catch charges in this. Maybe nothing to heavy, but he will get some.


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## Ariux (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> if I am walking down the street and I am being followed by some fat slob, then the fat slob has an ass whipping coming.



And, that's why Zimmerman acted in self-defense.  The black thought he's whip the fat slob's ass, but he got his own butt capped instead.


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## Si modo (Mar 21, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


Well, unless the 'here' you refer to is Florida, the laws where you are are pretty irrelevant to what happened in Florida.

The reports I have read say Zimmerman wasn't even a part of the neighborhood's watch program; he was doing his own thing.  Reeks of vigilante, but he can do his own thing.

I agree with all you say, but I am not so sure that Zimmerman will get convicted of anything.  We'll see.  Other states' have stand your ground laws, but they are not as all-emcompassing as those in Florida, and that's what this nerd has going for him, sadly.


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## earlycuyler (Mar 21, 2012)

Si modo said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Its Texas, and they may be more liberal here. There was one case when this drunk guy from Scotland went to the wrong door. He could not get it open and began to pound on it, so the home owner shot him dead through it. We also had that guy who shot those dudes who were robbing his neighbor a while back.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Zimmerman's wrong...period.

He's going to get what's coming to him...eventually.


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## Barb (Mar 22, 2012)

8537 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



of course.


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## Ariux (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> He's going to get what's coming to him...eventually.



So, you think people get what's coming to them.  A bullet or a big book deal?


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## Barb (Mar 22, 2012)

Gareyt17 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...





it really IS that simple


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## Barb (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> 8537 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...





> Zimmerman tells police he killed Martin in self defense. Taking him at his word, police do not arrest him, nor administer a drug or alcohol test. They also did not run a background check.


 .


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## Clementine (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



Are you saying you witnessed the whole ordeal?   Perhaps you should call the police and give a statement since you claim to know who was doing what and why.


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## konradv (Mar 22, 2012)

Clementine said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



Well, he wasn't really standing his ground, he was in pursuit.  That's evident from the 911 call.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

konradv said:


> Clementine said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Yes we do know that and that was before they were face to face.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...



and sometimes just flat out ignores it........

I did what I said I was going to and checked out this zimmerman thing as I hadn't really known much about it yesterday when  I posted.

After hearing the 911 call and getting all the information about the case I do not think the law will or should protect Zimmerman.  This law people are talking about really doesn't protect what he did.  In fact it looks like what he did was murder the kid.

He approached the kid after the 911 operator told him not to, that in itself removes any protection Zimmerman may think he is entitled to under the language of the law.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


Why is that?  Are we obliged by law to do what a 9/11 operator suggests?

9/11 operator:  "We don't need you to do that."

If we are, this is information I should know.  And, it will give me pause to be the caller to 9/11 in the future.  I'll let someone else do it.


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## manifold (Mar 22, 2012)

imbalance said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > imbalance said:
> ...



Radiohead?? 

Speaking of guys who need a tissue!


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



The man suspected but could not verify there was any real threat.  In hindsight it is plainly obvious that skittles and iced tea are not dangerous weapons or markers of ill intent, neither is wearing a hoodie or being black (you can hear a racial slur under his breath at one point, I assume that means that race figured into it for zimmerman but I could be wrong).

He did the wrong thing, the law does not protect people who actually approach someone who isn't threatening anyone or doing anything wrong and then shoot them.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


There is NO law that prohibits ANYone from following someone for ANY reason they want, unless they are ordered by a court not to do so.

Based on what the media reports, neither I know nor does anyone else know at this point what happened when they were face to face.  A lot could have happened, a lot may not have happened.

As far as the racist term is concerned, when I listened to the tape, I would have transcribed that muttering as 'unintelligible'.  Then someone suggested that Zimmerman muttered "fucking coon" and that's what I heard, too.  But, only after it was suggested to me, did I hear that.  Based on that, it is prudent to have an audio analysis of the tape to determine what he said.

I also think Zimmerman is wrong based on what the media is reporting, but I don't know all the facts that are available.  The media does not meet any evidentiary standard, either, for sure.  And, based on the law in Florida, irrespective of my belief that Zimmerman was wrong, I am not so sure that he acted outside what the Florida laws allow.

I don't believe anyone listening to the media is in a position to know that, either.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 22, 2012)

Spin it how you want he was still wrong.  From hearing the 911 call and finding out what i've read come out since the shooting the guy was just wrong.

I think the law is good and I don't think the law protects him.

Your arguments haven't convinced me otherwise....YET.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Spin it how you want he was still wrong.  From hearing the 911 call and finding out what i've read come out since the shooting the guy was just wrong.
> 
> I think the law is good and I don't think the law protects him.
> 
> Your arguments haven't convinced me otherwise....YET.


What "spin"?  

So, show me the law that prohibits one from following another.  Thanks.

And give me the reports on what happened when they were face to face.  Thanks.

And, give me the audio analysis of the tape showing that he said "fucking coon", then give me the law that prohibits that, too.  Thanks.

And, while you are at it, show me where I said he WASN'T wrong, in my opinion.  Thanks.

But, I'm not prone to try and convict anyone based on what the media says.  I've never been too keen on picking up a torch and joining other villagers.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Ariux said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > He's going to get what's coming to him...eventually.
> ...


Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of the electric chair. You won't see me shedding a tear for that scum of the earth.



Clementine said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...


Are you saying you are unaware of the facts that have come out thus far? Are you pretending not to know the events of the case as reported? Why is this? Are you a fool or are you a FOOL...which one?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Having read the Florida statute in question Zimmerman has no standing on immunity under it if he pursued this kid in any manner.
Also saw 2nd Amendment groups, NRA advocates from Florida and gun enthusiasts from Florida on TV last night calling for a swift investigation as they also stated that under their interpretation of the statutue that defense is not valid if Zimmerman pursued the kid.
Most importantly, it is the Florida crime lab, slowed drasticallyby the massive amount of narcotics case backlog testing, that slowed this investigation FROM THE START. Also, the autopsy report has to be tendered before the grand jury can convene and hear testimony on this case.
NONE of that the police have ANY control over as the crime lab is state level and grand jury is district attorney's office. Very troubling that the attorney representing the family KNOWS ALL OF THIS yet still came out with his publicity circus with claims that nothing was being done.
And that is for one reason only, HIS interests only.
Sad but this goes on too much these days and race and color has nothing to do with it.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Afterall...why believe your lying ears....right?


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Having read the Florida statute in question Zimmerman has no standing on immunity under it if he pursued this kid in any manner.
> Also saw 2nd Amendment groups, NRA advocates from Florida and gun enthusiasts from Florida on TV last night calling for a swift investigation as they also stated that under their interpretation of the statutue that defense is not valid if Zimmerman pursued the kid.
> Most importantly, it is the Florida crime lab, slowed drasticallyby the massive amount of narcotics case backlog testing, that slowed this investigation FROM THE START. Also, the autopsy report has to be tendered before the grand jury can convene and hear testimony on this case.
> NONE of that the police have ANY control over as the crime lab is state level and grand jury is district attorney's office. Very troubling that the attorney representing the family KNOWS ALL OF THIS yet still came out with his publicity circus with claims that nothing was being done.
> ...


Except for that pesky little racial epitaph he used and also the "they always get away" phrase he uttered. Quite obvious and quite damning at the same time. His time is coming.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Having read the Florida statute in question Zimmerman has no standing on immunity under it if he pursued this kid in any manner.
> Also saw 2nd Amendment groups, NRA advocates from Florida and gun enthusiasts from Florida on TV last night calling for a swift investigation as they also stated that under their interpretation of the statutue that defense is not valid if Zimmerman pursued the kid.
> Most importantly, it is the Florida crime lab, slowed drasticallyby the massive amount of narcotics case backlog testing, that slowed this investigation FROM THE START. Also, the autopsy report has to be tendered before the grand jury can convene and hear testimony on this case.
> NONE of that the police have ANY control over as the crime lab is state level and grand jury is district attorney's office. Very troubling that the attorney representing the family KNOWS ALL OF THIS yet still came out with his publicity circus with claims that nothing was being done.
> ...



They just had a clip of the author of said bill on the news, even he says this guy isn't protected by the law he wrote.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...




My "ears" heard "unintelligible", and my MIND is wise enough to know the power of suggestion.

Yours is not.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...





			
				Si modo said:
			
		

> Hi, you have received -895 reputation points from Si modo.
> Reputation was given for *this* post.
> 
> Comment:
> ...



*RUH ROHHH!!!!*


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Lying about me ALWAYS gets a neg.  So do whines about it.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Having read the Florida statute in question Zimmerman has no standing on immunity under it if he pursued this kid in any manner.
> ...



If it would have been another black that shot this kid then the racial epitaph could not be used as evidence.
But if someone else of another race uses it it can.
Equal protection under the law gets thrown under the bus again all the in the name of PC.
And I vividly remember a case here in Atlanta where a gay guy was killed and was called a faggot. Where was the NAACP and you screaming for justice for that poor soul and where were you asking for a hate crime charge against that shooter?
Okey dokey.
Another fact that was released through leaks, and I am admitting this is not evidence yet as it is hearsay, the kid was shot once in the chest.
But I do not care where the kid was shot as the statute clearly states there is not an immunity charge defense if someone follows someone.
Additionally, I have been told that Zimmerman had wanted to be a police officer and had taken some community college courses and may have applied for POST training.
I hate to sound like I am stereotyping Zimmerman but it has always been my experience with dealing with guys like him that want to be cops and somehow got washed out they make the worst security guards and should not be carrying a damn gun. They get a real thrill and rush playing copper and get all giddy when out on the "job". 
They get all fired up over nothing in most cases and should be locked in a rubber room with a decoder ring, a fake detective badge and a box of cracker jacks. 
This case will be indicted first presentation to the grand jury felony murder and I bet there will be a jury charge of volunatary and involuntary manslaughter to the jury if it goes to trial.
Who knows but if it shakes out like I think it will Zimmerman takes a 2nd degree or involuntary manslaughter charge plea. A lot depends on the statement he gave.
NOTE TO EVERYONE: *NEVER * GIVE A STATEMENT TO POLICE. CALL YOUR FAMILY LAWYER.
I guarantee the statement Zimmerman gave to police is what will sink his ass. 
Off to work. Boring day as I am working an employee theft ring case this week. 
Yes Marc, white folk steal as much as any folk. 
Who says crime do not pay!?


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 22, 2012)

Clementine said:


> Are you saying you witnessed the whole ordeal?   Perhaps you should call the police and give a statement since you claim to know who was doing what and why.



Nah, Marc didn't witness anything.

Marc is just a racist. Zimmerman is guilty of being white - no more investigation or due process needed.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Why is that?  Are we obliged by law to do what a 9/11 operator suggests?



No, but it shows that Zimmerman was not in immanent danger when he placed the call. Zimmerman had to opportunity to stand down, but instead created an altercation. This will work against him in court.



> 9/11 operator:  "We don't need you to do that."
> 
> If we are, this is information I should know.  And, it will give me pause to be the caller to 9/11 in the future.  I'll let someone else do it.



I don't know Florida law and will wait for the courts to sort this out. That said, Zimmerman did act in such a way that he provoked the situation.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 22, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> They just had a clip of the author of said bill on the news, even he says this guy isn't protected by the law he wrote.



I heard that too. Basically, if Zimmerman would have stood his ground, this wouldn't have happened.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



Any believe most teenagers do NO more than stand their ground when confronting others? What most likely happened is the young man started a fight that went terribly wrong. A tragedy, not a racial confrontation. 

So far, what we know isTrayvon Martin initiated a verbal confrontation. That most likely led to the tragedy. 

The Lynch Mob Mentality is playing out all over America.  



> *So far, what we know isTrayvon Martin initiated a verbal confrontation. *
> 
> it seems like the young man might have started a physical confrontation after he started a verbal confrontation, all before he knew the guy had an equalizer ... poor kid, but he acted stupidly. a tragedy for all involved.
> 
> ...


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



"If..."

One can almost stop reading after that word. However, I knew about the potential-cop and wanna-be cop status of Zimmerman. On the gay guy story and NAACP's lack of involvement, I'd have to take your word. With that said, NAACP did not come into existence to fight for gays. Doesn't mean they disagree with them or won't support them. There are organizations out there for every minority group that brings attention to their issues...let them do that. I'm not saying the various organizations have to disagree or not work together.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> And I vividly remember a case here in Atlanta where a gay guy was killed and was called a faggot. Where was the NAACP and you screaming for justice for that poor soul and where were you asking for a hate crime charge against that shooter?



Uh, you do realize that it's call the N-A-A-*C*-P, right?  Not the N-A-A-_F_-P.  You really are coming unhinged over this.


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## frazzledgear (Mar 22, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



I think he was racially motivated to follow this kid but I do not believe he followed him with the intention to kill him.  I think he was likely on a power trip.  Bu it happened so quickly after Zimmerman got out of the car I suspect Zimmerman likely pulled out his gun intending to hold the kid at gunpoint until cops arrived and the sight of it threw the kid into an understandable panic and he started screaming for help, threw his Skittles at him, maybe tried hitting or shoving and fighting to get away.  The fact the teenager had time to scream for help for half a minute or so says Zimmerman didn't get out and immediately kill him.  The girlfriend who was on the phone with the kid heard him ask Zimmerman why he was following him and heard Zimmerman demand to know what the kid was doing -and then he screamed for help and the phone was disconnected.  On 911 calls you can hear him screaming for help for several seconds more before the gunshot.

This kid had no idea who Zimmerman was but knew he wasn't a cop.  As far as he was concerned he was a big white guy up to no good who had been following him for no reason who pulled a gun on him and intended to kill him.  Once he started fighting and screaming for his life -Zimmerman made the wrong decision about how to control the situation and fired.  Now he belongs in prison for the senseless killing during a stupid situation he needlessly created.  I think the fitting crime would be voluntary manslaughter, not premeditated murder.  I don't know if the racial motivation for the shooting itself exists or not -up to a jury, but I think it exists for following him. Maybe the law says if a racial motive exists at one part it does for the entire time -I don't know.  I really do think he probably intended to hold him for cops but he was a kid already scared of this white guy following him for no reason and undoubtedly thought Zimmerman was going to kill him when he pulled the gun.  Zimmerman was not prepared for the reaction and is now pretending he is the victim with the right to stand his ground under FL law and shoot him.  But THIS kind of situation where he is actually the aggressor does not apply.  But if the teen had had a gun, HE is the one who would have been justified to shoot after Zimmerman pulled the gun under that law.  Because he is the one who was going about his business when accosted by Zimmerman -NOT the other way around. At every point, it is the teen who is the victim and Zimmerman the aggressor.  Zimmerman needlessly created the entire situation and NEEDLESSLY used the threat of lethal violence against the kid -and then did use it.  Stand your ground law does not apply to his actions-but i think definitely would have if the teen had killed him.


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## BlindBoo (Mar 22, 2012)

Ariux said:


> imbalance said:
> 
> 
> > I'm thinking this guy's obviously been carrying around a lot of baggage long before the shooting ever happened.  A sad story all the way around.
> ...



Nope.  Zimmerman blamed.  No evidence so far that Zimmerman life was in danger.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> Ariux said:
> 
> 
> > imbalance said:
> ...



Nor any evidence the killing was deemed important in Seminole county, UNTIL there was public outcry.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > And I vividly remember a case here in Atlanta where a gay guy was killed and was called a faggot. Where was the NAACP and you screaming for justice for that poor soul and where were you asking for a hate crime charge against that shooter?
> ...



Not what Dr. King stated. 
But I do know that you are right and that many in the current NAACP care nothing about the rights of anyone but themselves.
To them civil rights are for colored folk only and you are to be commended for pointing out that fact.
Of course you are too young and naive to even know that NAACP has championed and fought for equal rights for all for many years.
Julian Bond, ever heard of him?; at the LAST NAACP CONVENTION held a public forum on equal rights for gays and lesbians. Bond "gay rights are another component of civil rights."
But we will not take him seriously and believe you instead.
All I ever do is post the facts. You are the one coming unglued telling me to "shut the fuck up.'
Grow up and learn some history.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...




Bond is correct, in my opinion.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Why does MarcATL want a lynch mob before all evidence is in? Is his mind affected by some kind of mental illness? This is a serious question. MarcATL and a few other people have become completely unhinged over a tragedy that is not theirs. 

What is it about lonely shut-ins with internet service that makes them so angry and irrational?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Julian Bond was a Georgia politician for many years and when Reginald Eaves was Atlanta public safety commissioner I met him a few times. I remember seeing him campaigning outside the Fox theatre when he ran against John Lewis for Congress. "Dawg, how about some $$ to help with my campaign". I told him I wasn't even in his district. "I need your contribution more than your vote."  He had a great sense of humor! He lost to Lewis in a scorched earth campaign as Lewis made accusations against Julian for drug use and other indiscretions. Bond was known to label Lewis "Buckwheat" many times as the inside war in Atlanta black politics, like any politics, was fierce. However, Bond walked the walk when it came to civil rights. Did not agree with a lot of his other liberal politics but I liked the guy.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> Why does MarcATL want a lynch mob before all evidence is in? Is his mind affected by some kind of mental illness? This is a serious question. MarcATL and a few other people have become completely unhinged over a tragedy that is not theirs.
> 
> What is it about lonely shut-ins with internet service that makes them so angry and irrational?



Now I am not defending MarcATL and tend to agree with you on the main points but the LAST TIME there was any form of a lynch mob forming and delivering it would be the black folk on the wrong end of the rope.
Coming from my background and 34 years on the streets in the real world I can understand why he may be getting uptight and wants action.
Disagree with MarcATL but understand fully his concerns.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Why does MarcATL want a lynch mob before all evidence is in? Is his mind affected by some kind of mental illness? This is a serious question. MarcATL and a few other people have become completely unhinged over a tragedy that is not theirs.
> ...



I understood white racists as well as MarcATL, but understanding is just that. 

Two wrongs don't...


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## MikeK (Mar 22, 2012)

earlycuyler said:


> I think the guy is guilty of murder.


Whether or not he is tried for and convicted of murder depends on several factors, mainly the applicable law and the available evidence.   



> It also sounded like the kid was whipping the shit out of a wannabe super cop.


And therein could lie the tale.  If Zimmerman can convincingly assert that Martin assaulted him, then according to the Florida law Zimmerman had a right to use deadly force to defend himself.  The fact that Zimmerman's conduct up to that point was excessive and probably unlawful does not override the _Stand Your Ground_ ruling.   



> Zimmerman was told to stop by a 911 operator, he did not.


Actually he was not "told to stop."  He was _advised_ that the Sanford PD "did not need him to do that" (follow Martin). That is not an instruction.  It is information -- a request at most, leaving a wide open option.



> Zimmerman instigated this and he should be held accountable for his part.


I agree.  Zimmerman did indeed instigate the incident.  But if he can make the case that his part was limited to exceeding his authority as a civilian the most he could be charged with is disorderly conduct and maybe harassment.  

The police know these things which is why Zimmerman hasn't been arrested.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

MikeK said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > I think the guy is guilty of murder.
> ...



Very good and this is most likely the case.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Why does MarcATL want a lynch mob before all evidence is in? Is his mind affected by some kind of mental illness? This is a serious question. MarcATL and a few other people have become completely unhinged over a tragedy that is not theirs.
> ...


Isn't it funny to note who's ALWAYS screaming and going on about "the new lynch mobs" or just "lynch mobs" nowadays? Hint: It ain't black folks.

Up is down, down is up, Good is bad in radical RW Bizarro Wurld.


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## Shogun (Mar 22, 2012)

This commercial break brought to you by George Lynch brand Lynch Mobs.  "When you got that wicked sensation...." 


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxMtn75BrO0]Lynch Mob - Wicked Sensation - YouTube[/ame]


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

MikeK said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > I think the guy is guilty of murder.
> ...




Exceeding his authority as a civilian? He shot & killed a another person.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> MikeK said:
> 
> 
> > earlycuyler said:
> ...


Civilians can do that in certain circumstances, you know.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > MikeK said:
> ...




Well yes, but killing another human being is usually not described as "exceeding the authority of a civilian".


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## uscitizen (Mar 22, 2012)

This person is truly con fronted.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...


I'm not seeing where he said that the *killing* was exceeding his authority as a civilian.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Isn't it funny to note who's ALWAYS screaming and going on about "the new lynch mobs" or just "lynch mobs" nowadays? Hint: It ain't black folks.



That's because it ain't them being lynched.

We also note that you have no problem with lynching, as long as the victim is white.

Yeah, that does make you a racist.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Isn't it funny to note who's ALWAYS screaming and going on about "the new lynch mobs" or just "lynch mobs" nowadays? Hint: It ain't black folks.
> ...


No you stupid MORAN...the point is that those in this society who were actually most recently lynched, blacks, aren't the ones harping on and on and on about that term,  using it indiscriminately and with no thought, rhyme or reason.

The only folks going on and on and on about "being lynched" actually have it cooshy nice and cozy, and are not members of any minority group. Yet they someone feel the need to be a victim and used such a historically charged word to show-case their victim-hood. Well, perceived and faux victim-hood rather.

No one is being lynched, no one has been lynched for decades. No one.

Talk about whiners.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



" Zimmerman did indeed instigate the incident. But if he can make the case that his part was limited to exceeding his authority as a civilian the most he could be charged with is disorderly conduct and maybe harassment. "

The MOST he could be charged with? HE killed the victim.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...


  And, you DO know that civilians can kill someone in certain circumstances, right?


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> No you stupid MORAN...the point is that those in this society who were actually most recently lynched, blacks, aren't the ones harping on and on and on about that term,  using it indiscriminately and with no thought, rhyme or reason.



My calender says 2012 in more recent than 1921.

Well, you of the left mold reality to fit your bullshit.



> The only folks going on and on and on about "being lynched" actually have it cooshy nice and cozy, and are not members of any minority group. Yet they someone feel the need to be a victim and used such a historically charged word to show-case their victim-hood. Well, perceived and faux victim-hood rather.



I suspect Zimmerman will face charges - but you convicted him the second you heard he was white. (Yes, I acknowledge that "hispanic" is white.)

You are part of the lynch mob.



> No one is being lynched, no one has been lynched for decades. No one.
> 
> Talk about whiners.



You're doing your best to lynch Zimmerman.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Marc, let me appeal to your reason and commnon sense.
The district attorney released their information Tuesday that they are convening a grand jury and the evidence will be given to the grand jury. If the grand jury comes back with a bill of indictment then there will surely be an arrest.
The police turned this case over to the district attorney's office as there is an investigative division of the district attorney's office. Now take into the consideration of this crazy rewritten Stand Your Ground Statute in 2005. Wouldn't you want someone with the DA's office investigating this as that would stand better ground in the presentation of the evidence to the grand jury than a police division investigative agency that is good at gathering the evidence at the scene and then turning it over? 
Now if you were in charge of these rallies being held by the NAACP and Al Sharpton wouldn't you have believed it to be a good idea to tell all of those in attendance at these rallies and protests the truth: "The grand jury is meeting and we will wait and see if they indict Zimmerman and see when the trial date is"?
Marc, what else can anyone do other than gather the evidence, present it to the grand jury and arrest someone when the bill of indictment comes in?
Isn't it obvious to you that the reason that these good folks that want justice for this young man if he was gunned down and not in self defense need to be told the truth about the process from their own leaders and others leading these protests and gatherings?
They are not being told the truth. They are being told nothing has been done and that is a lie. The case was set for a grand jury and these good folks are also being taken advantage of for publicity reasons only.
And no one is speaking out against that and advising them of the facts of the process at any of these rallies.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > No you stupid MORAN...the point is that those in this society who were actually most recently lynched, blacks, aren't the ones harping on and on and on about that term,  using it indiscriminately and with no thought, rhyme or reason.
> ...


Somewhere on the Interwebs, there's a tiny, tiny, tiny violin playing songs for you and the rest of the "victims." 

Keep it up!!


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



But the MOST they can be charged with is NOT "disorderly conduct".


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...


So is that why Zimmerman was allowed to go free after killing an unarmed black teenage boy?

Is that why the dead black teenage boy had a drug test done on his body, but not so much as a question to the free-roaming Zimmerman?

The outrage is over the blatant lack of justice.

I think it's fair to expect AT LEAST an arrest for Zimmerman while the authorities proceed with all you've stated above.

At the very least. That is fair afterall....isn't it?


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Well, tox analyses are SOP in autopsies, for one.  Secondly, the police cannot do a BAC test on anyone without probable cause or their consent; it is illegal.  Third, the law allows for someone to shoot another in these circumstances given the current evidence.

If he broke the law, then he should be tried.  It's not clear that he DID break the law.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

The fact that it's not clear that he DID break the law is the reason for the outrage.

Ghedditt!?!?


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Secondly, the police cannot do a BAC test on anyone without probable cause or their consent; it is illegal. 

Discharging a firearm which resulted in a death should be enough "cause".


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Ummm, probable cause is specific to the actual investigation to be done - a test for alcohol.  Discharging a firearm or even killing someone is not a standard indication of intoxication.


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## MikeK (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

*Martin - Zimmerman | Arrests | Florida Statute | Criminal Investigations*

A tragey has visited the city of Sanford, Florida, and espeially the families involved in this very public circus. A young man is dead, and a mob is hounding and hunting an innocent man accused of no crime. The mob is bent on exacting a pound of flesh be owed (  Pound of flesh ), regardless of facts or solid evidence.

Sanford, Fla., explains why George Zimmerman was not arrested

Sanford, Fla., explains why George Zimmerman was not arrested - BlogPost - The Washington Post

_"...the letter, signed by Sanford City Manager Norton Bonaparte Jr., says. By Florida Statute, law enforcement was PROHIBITED from making an arrest based on the facts and circumstances they had at the time. (Caps are theirs.)"_


We are a nation of laws and NOT mob rule. The Founding Fathers and the Framers would be horrified, and maybe hypocritical, over the current display of a majority demanding law be put aside. The people who founded our nation were often mob-ish in action, but believed the system they set up would keep their not so better natures from running rough shod over the rights of individuals, and over the rule of law: Principles over personalities and emotions. 

People are clamoring for an arrest of a man who is not a suspect in a crime. The US Justice Dept is said to be assisting in an investigation of a death. This means they are NOT there to assist building a case. That would be a criminal charge looking for a justification/scenario/cause. Evidence is what our system of justice demands during investigations. Investigations are NOT initiated solely in order to charge and convict people. They are initiated as searches for evidence and truth, truth being very subjective. Lack of evidence equals no charges brought.

Maybe a federal statute can be looked into, if state statutes cannot be brought to bear. But there needs to be evidence a crime was committed. This display of the mob using emotion to demand justice is nothing more than a modern day lynch mob.

Even if this man Zimmerman is eventually found to be accused in a court of law, this story is turning into a sad period in the history of Criminal and Civil Justice in American democracy.


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## rdean (Mar 22, 2012)

He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.

"Black" makes it not a crime?  That your point?


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## Sunshine (Mar 22, 2012)

Yeah, whatcha gonna do with all those southern white racists!


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

rdean said:


> He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> 
> "Black" makes it not a crime?  That your point?



None of this is a legal argument. This is a thread about law and the justice system. Please respect that, or go away. there are other threads you can scream and emote in.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> Yeah, whatcha gonna do with all those southern white racists!



Southern white racisst are not involved in the tragedy. Like others, they may insert themselves into a public debate over it, but this is about law and the justice system.

People need to recognize this or our system is in more trouble than before.


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## Sunshine (Mar 22, 2012)

You open a thread.   People are going to post.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> ...



Does the City Manager double as City Attorney?


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> You open a thread.   People are going to post.



Of course.  But asking people to stay somewhat close to on topic. Going off topic can be grounds for...

but that isn't what I desire. What about the law, and legal/justice system debate about this very public exercise in democracy?


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

None of this is a legal argument. This is a thread about law and the justice system. Please respect that, or go away. there are other threads you can scream and emote in.[/QUOTE]


The Office of the State Attorney gave a statement, no conclusions, unlike the City Manager: 


A Seminole County grand jury will hear evidence in the case of slain 17-year-old Martin on April 10, according to State Attorney Norm Wolfinger.
ATTORNEY NEWS CONFERENCE: Part 1 | Part 2
Wolfinger released a statement on Tuesday saying, "I share in the desire of the family and the community to accurately collect and evaluate all the facts surrounding the tragic death of Trayvon Martin.  That is why I directed the expeditious review of the investigation which was delivered by the Sanford Police Department one week ago today; areas for further investigation have been identified; and, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement has agreed to assist and has been working hard with my office since Friday, March 16.  I will also be utilizing the investigative resources of the Seminole County Grand Jury which will be called to session on Tuesday, April 10, 2012.
I respectfully request that the public remain patient as this process continues forward.  We are a country based upon law, and as the State Attorney for the Eighteenth Judicial Circuit I am sworn to uphold those laws.  As I have previously stated, the public is entitled to no less than a thorough, deliberate, and just review of the facts.  We intend to honor that commitment."
The panel includes 21 Seminole County citizens. Officials said 54 percent of the cases that go through the State Attorney's Office with no arrests still go to trial.

Crowds at rally call for gunman George Zimmerman&#39;s arrest in... | www.wftv.com

LEAVE DECISIONS TO THE GRAND JURY.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

rdean said:


> He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> 
> "Black" makes it not a crime?  That your point?



Conclusions are up to the Grand Jury.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



Interesting question. I was going to investigate the city structure myself. Does anyone here know? I doubt it. Legal arguments over the actions of the police are being presented. But to whom? A public with no authority? Federal officials are said to be assisting in an investigation of the incident.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> ...


rdean generally takes a dump on random threads.  You'll have to forgive his weak sauce.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> ...



Yes, if and when a grand jury is called to hear this. The Police Dept showed up and upon preliminary investigation concluded no crime was committed. In the OP: _"...the letter, signed by Sanford City Manager Norton Bonaparte Jr., says. &#8220;By Florida Statute, law enforcement was PROHIBITED from making an arrest based on the facts and circumstances they had at the time.&#8221; (Caps are theirs.)"_

Do you know for a fact where things stand with the city, state, and the feds - if at all?  I'm looking to discuss facts and legal issues raised by credible authorities and figures.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> ...


True, if by "grand jury" you mean "petit jury."


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

The Office of the State Attorney gave a statement, no conclusions, unlike the City Manager: 


"A Seminole County grand jury will hear evidence in the case of slain 17-year-old Martin on April 10, according to State Attorney Norm Wolfinger.
ATTORNEY NEWS CONFERENCE: Part 1 | Part 2
Wolfinger released a statement on Tuesday saying, "I share in the desire of the family and the community to accurately collect and evaluate all the facts surrounding the tragic death of Trayvon Martin.  That is why I directed the expeditious review of the investigation which was delivered by the Sanford Police Department one week ago today; areas for further investigation have been identified; and, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement has agreed to assist and has been working hard with my office since Friday, March 16.  I will also be utilizing the investigative resources of the Seminole County Grand Jury which will be called to session on Tuesday, April 10, 2012.
I respectfully request that the public remain patient as this process continues forward.  We are a country based upon law, and as the State Attorney for the Eighteenth Judicial Circuit I am sworn to uphold those laws.  As I have previously stated, the public is entitled to no less than a thorough, deliberate, and just review of the facts.  We intend to honor that commitment."
The panel includes 21 Seminole County citizens. Officials said 54 percent of the cases that go through the State Attorney's Office with no arrests still go to trial."

Crowds at rally call for gunman George Zimmerman's arrest in... | www.wftv.com

LEAVE DECISIONS TO THE GRAND JURY.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 22, 2012)

The Federal investigation will center on a possible civil rights violation/hate crime, likely under the Matthew Shepard/James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2009. 

The alleged racial epithet would be key to such an investigation. 



> The people who founded our nation were often mob-ish in action, but believed the system they set up would keep their not so better natures from running rough shod over the rights of individuals, and over the rule of law: Principles over personalities and emotions.


Correct. 

The rule of law and due process  with regard to both civil and criminal cases  ensures no civil liberties are violated in the heat of the moment.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

*LEAVE FURTHER DECISIONS TO THE GRAND JURY*


Peach said:


> The Office of the State Attorney gave a statement, no conclusions, unlike the City Manager:
> 
> 
> "A Seminole County grand jury will hear evidence in the case of slain 17-year-old Martin on April 10, according to State Attorney Norm Wolfinger.
> ...



thank you


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...




The Grand Jury may conclude an indictment is warranted.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> The Federal investigation will center on a possible civil rights violation/hate crime, likely under the Matthew Shepard/James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2009.
> 
> The alleged racial epithet would be key to such an investigation.
> 
> ...


Yes. It is alleged a racial epithet was used, but how and why, and when will be important.

Just using an epithet during the commission of a crime is not of itself a crime.


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## Ravi (Mar 22, 2012)

*The Founding Fathers and the Framers would be horrified, and maybe hypocritical, over the current display of a majority demanding law be put aside.*

You must be joking. Or really, really stupid.


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## Quantum Windbag (Mar 22, 2012)

rdean said:


> He chased down an unarmed black teen who, while being taped begging for his life was shot dead.
> 
> "Black" makes it not a crime?  That your point?



He chased him down? The taped conversation has him pleading for his life? Why hasn't this made the national news? 

Better yet, what planet do you live on?


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> *LEAVE FURTHER DECISIONS TO THE GRAND JURY*
> 
> 
> Peach said:
> ...



You are welcome Dante.


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## Ravi (Mar 22, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> The Federal investigation will center on a possible civil rights violation/hate crime, likely under the Matthew Shepard/James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2009.
> 
> The alleged racial epithet would be key to such an investigation.
> 
> ...


I don't think he committed a hate crime, though I don't know what's in his heart.

I think he is guilty of thinking black teens are criminals. Not a hate crime, just giving into stereotypical behavior.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Ravi said:


> *The Founding Fathers and the Framers would be horrified, and maybe hypocritical, over the current display of a majority demanding law be put aside.*
> 
> You must be joking. Or really, really stupid.



why? If you can explain what you mean, I would be delighted to lecture you.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Ravi said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > The Federal investigation will center on a possible civil rights violation/hate crime, likely under the Matthew Shepard/James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2009.
> ...



maybe, but like you say, that is not the legal issue. The police and the courts have no jurisdiction with this issue.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Ravi said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > The Federal investigation will center on a possible civil rights violation/hate crime, likely under the Matthew Shepard/James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2009.
> ...



The DEATH of the minor will be the subject of the STATE Grand Jury proceedings, I HOPE & PRAY.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



I hate the idea that it is to be initiated not because of the system, but because of the public. This is a dispute between citizens, not between a citizen and the police or the system. 

I may be wrong, but I think this man is innocent and the push to find something, anything, will end up becoming a miscarriage of justice. I hope I am wrong.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

from the OP link (post #1) Sanford, Fla., explains why George Zimmerman was not arrested - BlogPost - The Washington Post

*The city is now being assisted by the U.S. Department of Justice and FBI, which have opened a criminal investigation into Martin&#8217;s death.*

I stand corrected here.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...




I darn sure hope the Grand Jury does their job based on the law & facts, and are not swayed by outside considerations.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



I have more faith in a grand jury than the Justice Dept when it comes to issues where the public is demanding a pound of flesh. Grand juries will often indict easily, but they can resist easily when they want to. 

The Justice Dept has been political in many cases.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 22, 2012)

> Yes. It is alleged a racial epithet was used, but how and why, and when will be important.
> 
> Just using an epithet during the commission of a crime is not of itself a crime.



True.

And among the other things to be investigated is what was the length of time between the alleged racial remark and the actual shooting. 

Someone may say with impunity he hates black people and would like to see them all dead, thats protected speech. One may not say to an angry crowd, however, to meet at a nearby street corner in five minutes and kill the first black person seen, thats not protected speech and would likely constitute a hate crime.   



> I don't think he committed a hate crime, though I don't know what's in his heart.
> 
> I think he is guilty of thinking black teens are criminals. Not a hate crime, just giving into stereotypical behavior.



And this is a serious issue in need of remedy in the context of social and public policy, not the judicial system.


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



Nothing but opinions are available till the Grand Jury hands down an indictment or NO indictment. (My guess is scared shirtless for the city, county, ans state however.)


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> The fact that it's not clear that he DID break the law is the reason for the outrage.
> 
> Ghedditt!?!?



outrage? do you know how many black teenagers are purposefully gunned down in the streets in American cities? Where the fuck is the outrage there?

People are making this out like it is an injustice perpetrated by the system. It isn't. It was a dispute between two citizens that ended in tragedy.

---

Why does MarcATL want a lynch mob before all evidence is in? Is his mind affected by some kind of mental illness? This is a serious question. MarcATL and a few other people have become completely unhinged over a tragedy that is not theirs.

What is it about lonely shut-ins with internet service that makes them so angry and irrational?


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## Peach (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Refusing a breathalyzer can cost you your DL in Florida.  As no attempt was made to get a BAC or drug test, too late now.


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



Opinions based on facts. Knowing what is true and not true in news reports is difficult. Even an investigation by the city or state is better than news reports


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## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > Yes. It is alleged a racial epithet was used, but how and why, and when will be important.
> >
> > Just using an epithet during the commission of a crime is not of itself a crime.
> 
> ...



Yes. We can't make every instance of disrespect among citizens a crime. We have laws to cover most instances where we mostly all agree lines of behavior and action are crossed.


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## Amelia (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > The fact that it's not clear that he DID break the law is the reason for the outrage.
> ...






A dispute?

Chasing down a teenager because you have issues with black men is a dispute?

One person tracking and one person fleeing is not a dispute.  

Try again.


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## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...


Was Zimmerman driving?

No.

And, as it is ILLEGAL TO TAKE A BAC without consent or probable cause, there was none done on Zimmerman.

You are a dishonest person.  You keep asking about a BAC on Zimmerman, and you know damn well why one wasn't done because I keep telling you why and so do others.

Stop your dishonesty.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Wouldn't it be better to gather all of the evidence, indict him and that way if the totality of the evidence that has been gathered after a lengthy investigation is so strong the bail will be set very high.
I guarantee you that IF he had been arrested he would have made bail within a few days after his arrest PRE INDICTMENT.
That is the way it always works Marc. If he is not indicted and there is a question of LAW as there is with The Stand My Ground statute the bail has to be reasonable.
We may not like that but don't you want the applicable law to apply to the bail.
Justice comes at the conclusion of due process. I believe you know that so enough steam blown off and let us get to the realities of the common law.
Fair? Our system of justice in America is the best in the world. What seems fair to one side NEVER seems fair to another.
Lady Justice with the scales always tips one way or another. Get used to it and embrace it.
You win some and you lose some but NONE are ever rained out.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



He had issues with his community being hit by burglaries and robberies in epidemic proportions. As hard as you want to try this has not been proven to be a race issue.
The transcripts of the 911 call can not make out and confirm any racial names called.
To date that is a myth spread by the vast legal team for the girl friend.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Peach said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Wrong and
Wrong.
We may not like the law but you are wrong on both counts under Florida law.
We are a nation of LAW, not men and their various religous and legal beliefs.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 22, 2012)

Oh, there are many innocent victims in this incident all over the place.
No matter what happens the families of both of these young men are all victims.
And I fault none of them for seeking the best remedy possible and best outcome for any, and/or all involved.
Been there, done that, seen it and did not care about getting the T shirt.
No matter what happens in this THERE ARE NO WINNERS.


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## MarcATL (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



so u say.


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Chasing down?  hmmmmm....

because the man was black? double hmmmmmmmmmmm, hmmmmmmm....

fleeing? who? the kid who confronted the man and started a verbal dispute - according to his girlfriend?


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


the gated community was racially mixed 20% Black, 20% Hispanic, 40% Anglo/White, and Asians and others the rest... according to Public Radio reporter. 

and you said Zimmerman was arrested and questioned. hmmmm, sounds like  a tragedy as teh story will never suffice for some people.


----------



## Rinata (Mar 22, 2012)

I really don't see what is so hard to understand about this case. The guy with the weapon, that outweighs the weaponless victim by 100 pounds, shot him in self defense. So he says. What exactly was he defending himself against?? What is so damn hard??? Arrest him!!!


----------



## Amelia (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...





Yes, fleeing.  According to the girlfriend, Trayvon was trying to get away and thought he had but then that *expletive deleted* found him again.  


Yes, because Trayvon was black.


----------



## Amelia (Mar 22, 2012)

Zimmerman's issues with blacks were illustrated in his past 911 calls and in his profiling activities which made black people in his community afraid to walk around in their own neighborhood.   


And then there was the tape on the night of the killing.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Rinata said:


> I really don't see what is so hard to understand about this case. The guy with the weapon, that outweighs the weaponless victim by 100 pounds, shot him in self defense. So he says. What exactly was he defending himself against?? What is so damn hard??? Arrest him!!!


There are laws, so unless he broke them, they don't arrest anyone.


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

SANFORD, Fla. &#8212; Zimmerman was handcuffed after police arrived and taken into custody for questioning, but was released by police without being charged. Police have interviewed Zimmerman twice since then.

Crump called the treatment patently unfair and asked if Martin would have received the same treatment if he had been the shooter.

Feds, Fla. probe teen's shooting by watch captain


----------



## Rinata (Mar 22, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Rinata said:
> 
> 
> > I really don't see what is so hard to understand about this case. The guy with the weapon, that outweighs the weaponless victim by 100 pounds, shot him in self defense. So he says. What exactly was he defending himself against?? What is so damn hard??? Arrest him!!!
> ...



He did break a law. He killed someone.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Rinata said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Rinata said:
> ...


He killed someone, but he did NOT break the law in Florida.


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

In Florida, once self-defense is invoked, *the burden is on the prosecution to disprove the claim.*

(The police report on the shooting refers to it as an unnecessary killing to prevent unlawful act.)

Still, in not arresting Zimmerman, local officials have pointed to Floridas wide definition of self-defense. 

The 23 States That Have Sweeping Self-Defense Laws Just Like Floridas - ProPublica


Earlier Tuesday, an attorney for Martin's family revealed the teenager told his girlfriend just moments before he was killed that he was being followed.

"'Oh he's right behind me, he's right behind me again,'" 17-year-old Trayvon Martin told his girlfriend on his cellphone, attorney Benjamin Crump said. The girl later heard Martin say, "Why are you following me?" Another man asked, "What are you doing around here?'" Crump said. Crump told reporters Tuesday Martin cried out when a man bearing a 9mm handgun came at him. Police said Zimmerman, who was found bleeding from his nose and the back of his head, told authorities he yelled out for help before shooting Martin.

"She says: 'Run.' He says, 'I'm not going to run, I'm just going to walk fast,'" Crump said, quoting the girl. After Martin encountered Zimmerman, the girl thought she heard a scuffle "because his voice changes like something interrupted his speech," Crump said. The phone call ended before the girl heard gunshots.

The last call was at 7:12 p.m. Police arrived at 7:17 p.m. to find Martin lying face down on the ground. Zimmerman was handcuffed after police arrived and taken into custody for questioning, but was released by police without being charged. Police have interviewed Zimmerman twice since then. Crump called the treatment patently unfair...

Rights leaders to keep up pressure in Florida shooting : News : miNBCnews.com


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Rinata said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Rinata said:
> ...



not a crime


----------



## Si modo (Mar 22, 2012)

Fellow Citizens:

There has been a lot of media attention to the recent incident where George Zimmerman shot and
killed Trayvon Martin. This is indeed a tragic situation and has caused a flood of questions and
strong emotions from within our community, the region and nation. On behalf of the employees
of the City of Sanford, Our deepest sympathy and prayers go out to the family and friends of
Trayvon Martin. As a father, I can only image the pain Trayvon&#8217;s family must be going though.
In an effort to continue to be as responsive as possible to the public seeking information on the
incident, I have asked Chief Lee to provide answers to some of the most frequently asked
questions regarding this matter. Below are his responses. Please understand that since this is
still an ongoing investigation, the Police Department is limited in what information it can
publicly release.

The City of Sanford is committed to insuring that justice is served and, therefore, the City of
Sanford has contacted the United States Attorney General&#8217;s Office for assistance in this matter.
The men and women of the Sanford Police Department extend our heartfelt sympathies to the
Martin family. This is indeed a tragic situation. The death of anyone due to violence, especially a
17 year old young man, is morally appalling. As this incident has generated a lot of media
attention, we wanted to provide answers to some of the most frequently asked questions.

*Why was George Zimmerman not arrested the night of the shooting?

When the Sanford Police Department arrived at the scene of the incident, Mr. Zimmerman
provided a statement claiming he acted in self defense which at the time was supported by
physical evidence and testimony. By Florida Statute, law enforcement was PROHIBITED from
making an arrest based on the facts and circumstances they had at the time. Additionally, when
any police officer makes an arrest for any reason, the officer MUST swear and affirm that he/she
is making the arrest in good faith and with probable cause. If the arrest is done maliciously and
in bad faith, the officer and the City may be held liable.*

According to Florida Statute 776.032 :

776.032 Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of
force.&#8212;

(1) A person who uses force as permitted in s. 776.012, s. 776.013, or s. 776.031 is
justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for
the use of such force, unless the person against whom force was used is a law
enforcement officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who was acting in the performance of
his or her official duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with
any applicable law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that
the person was a law enforcement officer. As used in this subsection, the term &#8220;criminal
prosecution&#8221; includes arresting, detaining in custody, and charging or prosecuting the
defendant.

(2) A law enforcement agency may use standard procedures for investigating the use of
force as described in subsection (1), *but the agency may not arrest the person for using
force unless it determines that there is probable cause that the force that was used was
unlawful.*

....

Thank you,

Norton N. Bonaparte, Jr., ICMA-CM
City Manager
March 19, 2012​
http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/Zimmerman_Martin_shooting.pdf


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

http://cnninsession.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/martinpolicreport.pdf

thanks to the eye-team @USMB

from the police report:

*"I asked the subject in the red jacket, later identified as George Zimmerman (who was original caller for the suspicious person complaint), if he had seen the subject. Zimmerman stated that he had shot the subject and was still armed. Zimmerman complied with all of my verbal commands and was secured in handcuffs. Located on the inside of Zimmerman's waist band, I removed a black Kel Tek 9mm PF9 semi auto handgun and holster. While I was in such close contact with Zimmerman, I could observe that his back appeared to be wet and was covered in grass, as if he had been laying on his back on the ground. Zimmerman was also bleeding from the nose aand back of his head."

"Zimmerman was placed in the rear of my police vehicle and was given first aid by the SFD. While the SFD was attending to Zimmerman, I over heard[sic] him state 'I was yelling for someone to help me, but no one would help me.' At no point did I question Zimmerman about the incident that had taken place. Once Zimmerman was cleared by the SFD, he was transported to the Sanford Police Department."*


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

Police chief steps aside over Trayvon Martin case

There have been "assumptions and conclusions" made by the public regarding the Martin case that are based on limited information, Lee said in an email to USA TODAY this week. "There is much information that at this time is not public record to ensure the integrity of the investigation," he said.

The initial police report of the incident says that an officer noticed that Zimmerman showed apparent signs of being in a struggle. "I could observe that his back appeared to be wet and was covered in grass, as if he had been laying on his back on the ground. Zimmerman was also bleeding from the nose and back of his head," the officer said in the report.

The report also said that while Zimmerman was getting first aid from the fire department, he said, "I was yelling for someone to help me, but no one would help me."


----------



## Dante (Mar 22, 2012)

more sanity 




> Former F.B.I. agent Michael Tabman, says while _*he wants to make it clear George Zimmerman deserves to be innocent until proven guilty*_, he thinks police in Florida should have handled the case differently.
> 
> You have an armed person shooting an unarmed person.  The person who was armed certainly appears to have been the aggressor.  I dont know why the case seemed to be dropped as quickly as it was dropped, Tabman said.
> 
> ...


----------



## rdean (Mar 22, 2012)

Dante said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, whatcha gonna do with all those southern white racists!
> ...



And yet, quoting Mr. Zimmerman, "They ALWAYS get away".  What does that mean exactly?


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

rdean said:


> And yet, quoting Mr. Zimmerman, "They ALWAYS get away".  What does that mean exactly?


  please, this thread is about the law and the justice system. we can play with our dicks in another thread?  next time, please link to anything you post or in this thread I will report you for being an illegal alien fuck face


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

"they always get away" - meaning the perps


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

Mother Jones has a good aticle on this, as well as clear audio for all of the 911 calls and links to transcripts. 

The Trayvon Martin Killing, Explained | Mother Jones 

A good question was asked here:



> UPDATE 3, 9:30 p.m. EDT, Monday, March 19: Where is Trayvon Martin's cellphone?
> 
> When Trayvon Martin was killed, all he had were Skittles, iced tea...and a cellphone, authorities told the L.A. Times. The phone has been mentioned in multiple reports in recent days, and journalists and concerned citizens are starting to ask: Where is Trayvon's phone? Why did the police on the scene of the shooting not use it to identify Martin, or contact his next of kin?* "Trayvon's body was bagged and taken to the morgue, where he was tagged as a John Doe," writes African American affairs blogger Sandra Rose. "No one contacted Trayvon's family even though police had Trayvon's cell phone in their possession."*
> The lack of information about Martin's phone is feeding further skepticism about the police's conduct, and it's led New York Times columnist Charles Blow to start a new meme on Twitter:
> ...



and



> Why is the history of the Sanford Police Department in question?
> 
> Sanford PD's officers have suffered a series of public missteps in recent years, according to local reporters. In 2006 two private security guardsthe son of a Sanford police officer, and a volunteer for the departmentkilled a black teen with a single gunshot in his back. Even though they admitted to never identifying themselves, the guards were released without charges. In 2009, after an assailant allegedly attempted to rape a child in her home, the department was called to task for sitting on the suspect's fingerprints, delaying identification and pursuit of the attacker.
> 
> ...



and another thing:



> UPDATE 14, 12:45 EDT, Wednesday, March 21: Is a Koch brothers group behind the "stand your ground" laws?
> 
> Media Matters reports that a notorious Koch brothers-funded lobby group may have played a leading role in writing and passing the 2005 Florida self-defense law that's reportedly hindering prosecution against George Zimmerman.
> 
> As Mother Jones has reported before, the American Legislative Exchange Council often writes conservative legislation that finds its way onto the lawbooksit's shaped energy laws, as well as labor fights in Wisconsin and Michigan. (It's also recently been caught red-handed passing its legislation onto lawmakers in Florida.) But Media Matters says ALEC has also teamed up with the National Rifle Association to pass "stand your ground" legislation to protect shooters:



and, OF COURSE:



> PDATE 15, 3:30 p.m. EDT, Wednesday, March 21: Glenn Beck website calls Trayvon Martin "aggressor," implies he's a criminal
> 
> In a separate post here at Mother Jones, my colleague Adam Serwer has flagged two articles from the Blaze, Glenn Beck's news site, that 1) call Trayvon Martin the "aggressor," 2) intimate the furor over Martin's death is cooked up by minority racial activists, and 3) speculate that Martin was suspended from school for, possibly, maybe, "'armed robbery,' 'arson,' 'kidnapping' or 'sexual battery.'" Adam's piece is a must-read.
> 
> The Blaze pieces are written not by a random anonymous commenter but by Mytheos Holt, a Wesleyan graduate and former speechwriter for Sen. John Barrasso (R-Wyo.). Holt claims to hail from the mean streets of Big Sur, California, where 0.3 percent of the population is African-American.


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Fellow Citizens:
> 
> There has been a lot of media attention to the recent incident where George Zimmerman shot and
> killed Trayvon Martin. This is indeed a tragic situation and has caused a flood of questions and
> ...



thank you


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Mother Jones
> 
> ...



conspiracy thread


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Fellow Citizens:

There has been a lot of media attention to the recent incident where George Zimmerman shot and
killed Trayvon Martin. This is indeed a tragic situation and has caused a flood of questions and
strong emotions from within our community, the region and nation. On behalf of the employees
of the City of Sanford, Our deepest sympathy and prayers go out to the family and friends of
Trayvon Martin. As a father, I can only image the pain Trayvon&#8217;s family must be going though.
In an effort to continue to be as responsive as possible to the public seeking information on the
incident, I have asked Chief Lee to provide answers to some of the most frequently asked
questions regarding this matter. Below are his responses. Please understand that since this is
still an ongoing investigation, the Police Department is limited in what information it can
publicly release.

The City of Sanford is committed to insuring that justice is served and, therefore, the City of
Sanford has contacted the United States Attorney General&#8217;s Office for assistance in this matter.
The men and women of the Sanford Police Department extend our heartfelt sympathies to the
Martin family. This is indeed a tragic situation. The death of anyone due to violence, especially a
17 year old young man, is morally appalling. As this incident has generated a lot of media
attention, we wanted to provide answers to some of the most frequently asked questions.

*Why was George Zimmerman not arrested the night of the shooting?

When the Sanford Police Department arrived at the scene of the incident, Mr. Zimmerman
provided a statement claiming he acted in self defense which at the time was supported by
physical evidence and testimony. By Florida Statute, law enforcement was PROHIBITED from
making an arrest based on the facts and circumstances they had at the time. Additionally, when
any police officer makes an arrest for any reason, the officer MUST swear and affirm that he/she
is making the arrest in good faith and with probable cause. If the arrest is done maliciously and
in bad faith, the officer and the City may be held liable.*

According to Florida Statute 776.032 :

776.032 Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of
force.&#8212;

(1) A person who uses force as permitted in s. 776.012, s. 776.013, or s. 776.031 is
justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for
the use of such force, unless the person against whom force was used is a law
enforcement officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who was acting in the performance of
his or her official duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with
any applicable law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that
the person was a law enforcement officer. As used in this subsection, the term &#8220;criminal
prosecution&#8221; includes arresting, detaining in custody, and charging or prosecuting the
defendant.

(2) A law enforcement agency may use standard procedures for investigating the use of
force as described in subsection (1), *but the agency may not arrest the person for using
force unless it determines that there is probable cause that the force that was used was
unlawful.*

....

Thank you,

Norton N. Bonaparte, Jr., ICMA-CM
City Manager
March 19, 2012​
http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/Zimmerman_Martin_shooting.pdf


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


I also have more faith in the grand jury.  The DOJ has a long history of being a political tool.

This is exactly the situation you alluded to.  The public (mob) is outraged over this tragedy, while ignoring, either willfully or unwittingly, the law in the jurisdiction.  They want their pound of flesh.

Our country was not founded on mob rule, in fact our entire justice system is designed to prevent that - to be blind.

We are not villagers-with-torches who CAN exact a pound of flesh at our whim.  And we should all be thankful that we can't, because it could just as easily be us, depending on how effective the instigators' rhetoric is.

THAT is the bigger picture - protect and defend the PROCESS, irrespective of our feelings about the persons involved - lest the next one the villagers want is us.


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Mother Jones has a good aticle on this, as well as clear audio for all of the 911 calls and links to transcripts.
> 
> The Trayvon Martin Killing, Explained | Mother Jones
> 
> ...




Koch brothers and Glenn Beck?  seals the deal. guilty by association. let's hang the innocent prick!!!


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

frazzledgear said:


> BlindBoo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



excellent post.
Ten dollars to a dime, that law would NOT be applied by that police department if Trayvon was the one who shot Zimmerman. Never.


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Of course Martin was tested for alcohol and drugs....it's standard in an autopsy and autopsies are standard in fatal shootings. - see moh doh


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



I could not 'thank' you in my own thread. WTF is going here?


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

You refuse to get it, Dante. It isn't just Zimmerman being criticized in all this. It is selective law enfrcement, the way the stand your ground law was applied in this case, that the same law encourages events like these, that there has been an increase in killings since it has been adopted in Fla and elsewhere, and, of course, all of it supported with the blame the victim rhetoric from like-minded assholes like you.

 Go ahead, neg me again, it tickles.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> You refuse to get it, Dante. It isn't just Zimmerman being criticized in all this. It is selective law enfrcement, the way the stand your ground law was applied in this case, that the same law encourages events like these, that there has been an increase in killings since it has been adopted in Fla and elsewhere, and, of course, all of it supported with the blame the victim rhetoric from like-minded assholes like you.
> 
> Go ahead, neg me again, it tickles.


But he isn't blaming the victim.

Most probably agree that the law sucks, but it IS the law.  As you can see above, the cops could not legally arrest Zimmerman.

Everyone is equal under the law, no matter how much we don't like the person or the law.  And, we apply the CURRENT law to everyone.

We change the law as fast as we can, and that is not done in the courts.


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

frazzledgear said:


> BlindBoo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Duke Power!!!


[youtube]0bw55sR4ec8[/youtube]

and I have an account at a racist site Am I a racist? Is this post racist? think about IT


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...


I may start a web site for this guy's defense. This is getting crazy.

wtf is wrong with people? a lynch mob?


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Jesus (hey zeus) Christ! This guy could be me or you. wtf is wrong with people? has the mob mentality taken over the nation?

46 Calls - The Daily Beast

http://motherjones.com/politics/2012/03/what-happened-trayvon-martin-explained


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Jesus (hey zeus) Christ! This guy could be me or you. wtf is wrong with people? has the mob mentality taken over the nation?
> 
> 46 Calls - The Daily Beast


Apparently so.  More should notice.

More should value the process.


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > You refuse to get it, Dante. It isn't just Zimmerman being criticized in all this. It is selective law enfrcement, the way the stand your ground law was applied in this case, that the same law encourages events like these, that there has been an increase in killings since it has been adopted in Fla and elsewhere, and, of course, all of it supported with the blame the victim rhetoric from like-minded assholes like you.
> ...



Si, please. I don't see you blaming the kid, but it is completely unreasonable to expect me to believe that the law tied the officers hands as was contended within PR statement you posted. The Sanford City Council issued a no confidence statement towards the police department, their conduct in this incident is being investigated by higher authorities,  and they've been in trouble for similar non-action before. The law does suck, but even that law does NOT protect Zimmerman, as it should have protected Trayvon if he were lucky, or fast, or strong enough to wrest the gun away and shoot Zimmerman. And you're too smart to believe that would have happened if the roles were reversed. 

For god's sake, si, the police run a check on people at a TRAFFIC stop. They wouldn't have checked Zimmerman standing over a dead boy? This is reasonable?


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...


Before the PR statement and upon inspection of the statute, I came to the same conclusion - there was no probable cause to detain him further (in that jurisdiction).  Detention without probable cause is illegal.


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> You refuse to get it, Dante. It isn't just Zimmerman being criticized in all this. It is selective law enfrcement, the way the stand your ground law was applied in this case, that the same law encourages events like these, that there has been an increase in killings since it has been adopted in Fla and elsewhere, and, of course, all of it supported with the blame the victim rhetoric from like-minded assholes like you.
> 
> Go ahead, neg me again, it tickles.



you people are making me nervous. I am NOT a racist. I follow Morris Dees, but I don't agree with everything he says. I have my own mind.

you people are getting mind fucked. group think. assholes like me? I've worked with vets, gays, homeless, minorities... I have a difficult time understanding the mob mentality of people I respect. 

selective enforcement? that has nothing to do with MArtin and Zimmerman and what went down. Fuck! I fought with a black mother fucker who tried to kill me with a gun, and walked away...with no racism. I was targeted because I was white. Fuck, wake up. 

I don't believe what is being portrayed as justice in America, it's sick lynch mob justice


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Jesus (hey zeus) Christ! This guy could be me or you. wtf is wrong with people? has the mob mentality taken over the nation?
> ...



This shit is scary. Cons, libs, progressives, all get nutso where race is concerned. People forget process.

I want to start a fund for George even if he is a racist fuck. Which I don't believe. 

I'm ashamed to be a member of the human race today.


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante, I did not call you a racist. I called you an asshole and a douchebag (pretty sure I limited it to this subject), but never a racist.


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

Si, we'll have to agree to disagree.


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Dante, I did not call you a racist. I called you an asshole and a douchebag (pretty sure I limited it to this subject), but never a racist.



the slippery slope. the fact that I feel you are being irrational about an incident that is far removed from our pathetic little lives...but an incident that goes to how we view each other as human beings... 

jesus christ, don't you see what is happening...how people are transforming themselves into warriors for right vs wrong? shit, what is happening here is the American version of what we criticize in the extremist Muslim world


some of us have become ideological purists who would hang another human being because we perceive him as representing evil



George Zimmerman is NOT evil. He is a poor sucker caught up in a whirlwind of societal retribution


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Dante, I did not call you a racist. I called you an asshole and a douchebag (pretty sure I limited it to this subject), but never a racist.


Hi again, Barb.

Here is the statute itself (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.013.html):

(1)&#8195;A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

....

(3)&#8195;A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

....​
Now, try to put yourself in the cops' shoes and imagine you know nothing about the parties - both the victim and the shooter have no faces and you only know what you see and hear that night.

And, look at the law within which you MUST operate.

Now, this is what we know:  

One of the parties is dead from a gunshot wound.

One of the parties is not and admits to shooting the other party.

An eye witness told the cops they had seen the shooter on the ground and on his back just before the shooting.

The shooter had grass stains on his back.

The shooter had head wounds and those were attended to by the EMTs.

The shooter told the cops he called for help and no one came.  And, a witness told cops that they had heard someone calling for help before the shooting.




Remember, no faces to the parties.  No emotions.  The law is written in plain English.  And, no one can detain anyone without probable cause that a law was broken.

I know what I would do.  How about you?


----------



## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Dante, I did not call you a racist. I called you an asshole and a douchebag (pretty sure I limited it to this subject), but never a racist.



the slippery slope. the fact that I feel you are being irrational about an incident that is far removed from our pathetic little lives...but an incident that goes to how we view each other as human beings... 

jesus christ, don't you see what is happening...how people are transforming themselves into warriors for right vs wrong? shit, what is happening here is the American version of what we criticize in the extremist Muslim world


some of us have become ideological purists who would hang another human being because we perceive him as representing evil



George Zimmerman is NOT evil. He is a poor sucker caught up in a whirlwind of societal retribution

----


you people scare me. I want to rethink why you are worth not destroying


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Dante, I did not call you a racist. I called you an asshole and a douchebag (pretty sure I limited it to this subject), but never a racist.
> ...



Si, that is not all we know, though. 
The dead kid had just as much right to stand his ground, and he was armed only with an iced tea, a cell phone, and skittles. He wasn't doing anything wrong. He had every right to be there. The cops might have known that sooner if they had done any investigation into his cell phone, instead of ignoring his contact list and tagging him as a John Doe. 
Like I said, we'll have to disagree.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...


The kid did have just as much right to do that.  Unfortunately he did not have a gun, too.

The cop report from that night shows the kid's full name, which contradicts the John Doe story.

So, have you looked at the law and the evidence we do know (from the actual cop report)?  Can you see why he was not further detained/arrested?


----------



## Barb (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Si, I'm looking at the cop report. Everything identifying anyone is blacked out. In the report they list Zimmerman, but blacked his name out, and repeatedly refer to the dead as "the subject." So no, thaqt report doesn't contradict anything. 

from the Mother Jones link I posted before:



> UPDATE 3, 9:30 p.m. EDT, Monday, March 19: Where is Trayvon Martin's cellphone?
> 
> When Trayvon Martin was killed, all he had were Skittles, iced tea...and a cellphone, authorities told the L.A. Times. The phone has been mentioned in multiple reports in recent days, and journalists and concerned citizens are starting to ask: Where is Trayvon's phone? Why did the police on the scene of the shooting not use it to identify Martin, or contact his next of kin? "Trayvon's body was bagged and taken to the morgue, where he was tagged as a John Doe," writes African American affairs blogger Sandra Rose. "No one contacted Trayvon's family even though police had Trayvon's cell phone in their possession."
> The lack of information about Martin's phone is feeding further skepticism about the police's conduct, and it's led New York Times columnist Charles Blow to start a new meme on Twitter:
> ...


----------



## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Dante, I did not call you a racist. I called you an asshole and a douchebag (pretty sure I limited it to this subject), but never a racist.
> ...


It may be far removed from your pathetic little life, but many in florida would like the ability to walk around with out being followed and killed with impunity because of a bad law.


----------



## konradv (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> (3) A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and *who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be *has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.



Don't really see where this applies when from the 911 call we already know he was not "in a place he had a right to be".  He was told to quit following the kid and should have been arrested on that basis alone.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

konradv said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > (3) A person who is not  engaged in an unlawful activity and *who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be *has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
> ...


No one is under any legal obligation to follow the suggestions of a 9/11 operator.  The operator told him, "We don't need you to do that".


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...


On the top of 'page 2 of 4' is the boy's full name.


----------



## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...




Ravi the law does not protect what this zimmerman guy did, how is it a bad law?

People claiming the law protects this do not understand the law itself.  Or they are intentionally misrepresenting it to use this tragedy as a vehicle to attack the law, which had nothing to do with zimmerman murdering the kid and doesn't protect zimmerman.

In fact there is language in this law that specifically says what zimmerman did isn't protected.


----------



## BlindBoo (Mar 23, 2012)

Peach said:


> BlindBoo said:
> 
> 
> > Ariux said:
> ...



I think it was the Young Turks that finally brought some attention to the situation.


----------



## BlindBoo (Mar 23, 2012)

MikeK said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> > I think the guy is guilty of murder.
> ...



Under te Stand your Gound law Zimmerman still needs to prove that he felt threaten enough by this kid to use deadly force.  Since he was the one following the kid.....Hopefully it will be up to a jury to decide.


----------



## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.

I feel for the family and believe that they are right in demanding he be charged and tried, I wouldn't blame them for wanting Zimmerman put to death. But these marching idiots making it a racial issue are nothing more than agitators. I can understand Trayvon's family, friends, neighbors protesting. But alot these people making speeches and marching and commenting on the news who don't know him are just out to promote their causes, they didn't know this young man, nor do they genuinely care about his death in general, and it shows when they turn it into a race issue.

I don't believe in hate crime legislation. Murder is murder, the reasoning for the murder should only count if it proves intent. As far as sentencing it should have no bearing. No life is worth more than another. So let's knock off the bullshit and just let what happens happen. If Zimmerman faces trial, as I believe he should, it shouldnt be because of marches, tv comments, and peoples feelings.

It should be because of the evidence.

Alright.... Done ranting. I had to get that off my chest. Spent a good hour arguing with my father over this this morning.


----------



## Liberty (Mar 23, 2012)

i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.


----------



## Chris (Mar 23, 2012)

Liberty said:


> i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.



Yes, unarmed teenagers are gunned down all the time with the police looking the other way.

Happens all the time.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


Could you quote the part of the statute that you believe specifically says what Zimmerman did is not protected, please?

I've looked at the statute many times looking for something, and I don't find it.

Thanks.


----------



## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

Chris said:


> Liberty said:
> 
> 
> > i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.
> ...



By all the time, what do you mean exactly? I'm not trying to argue with you. Just want some clarity.


----------



## bobcollum (Mar 23, 2012)

It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.

To politicize it is just par for the course in today's political discourse, but as you say, it's sickening.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Mar 23, 2012)

Liberals are the ones playing politics and race baiting, with Obama now the official ring leader. And Al Sharpton is a disgrace. MSNBC must be proud.


----------



## bobcollum (Mar 23, 2012)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Liberals are the ones playing politics and race baiting, with Obama now the official ring leader. And Al Sharpton is a disgrace. MSNBC must be proud.





Of course it's the liberals.


----------



## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Liberals are the ones playing politics and race baiting, with Obama now the official ring leader. And Al Sharpton is a disgrace. MSNBC must be proud.


Both sides have people using this incident as a soapbox for something.


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 23, 2012)

bobcollum said:


> It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.
> 
> To politicize it is just par for the course in today's political discourse, but as you say, it's sickening.



This happened over three weeks ago. If not for the family "politicizing" it, the case would have been swept under the rug


----------



## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> 
> I feel for the family and believe that they are right in demanding he be charged and tried, I wouldn't blame them for wanting Zimmerman put to death. But these marching idiots making it a racial issue are nothing more than agitators. I can understand Trayvon's family, friends, neighbors protesting. But alot these people making speeches and marching and commenting on the news who don't know him are just out to promote their causes, they didn't know this young man, nor do they genuinely care about his death in general, and it shows when they turn it into a race issue.
> 
> ...



I agree with pretty much everything you say. I think, if I were a local resident, I would want an investigation into the actions of the local police. Most certainly, an investigation into the circumstances surrounding the death of Martin is warranted. If there is evidence of wrong doing, Zimmerman should face the consequences of those actions. 

Like you, I think that the likes of Sharpton are - yet again - using this tragedy for political mileage and deliberately causing unrest and tensions between racial groups. That is truly disgusting.


----------



## bobcollum (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bobcollum said:
> 
> 
> > It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.
> ...



Absolutely, but once it stuck to the wall it gathered national attention which brought on the unneeded external inputs as noted in the op.


----------



## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bobcollum said:
> 
> 
> > It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.
> ...



For the family to fight to raise awareness and put pressure on the local LEOs is one thing. To have Sharpton and his gang of race baiters jumping on this kid's death for political mileage is something else altogether.


----------



## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



I AGREE with Cali Girl on BOTH points. Though I see unrest because of an incomplete investigation, why FAN THE FLAMES of hate?


----------



## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

Liberty said:


> i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.



My my look at this happy go lucky motherfucker right here.


----------



## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...


I'm telling you, stuff like this makes me want to pack up the family and just live in solitude. This world gets more and more rotten by the day and it doesn't look like its going to change, maybe it can't.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 23, 2012)

I saw the Republican that wrote the law on TV last night.
He says the law does not and was not intended to protect anyone that PURSUES someone unless that someone is law enforcement.
May or may not but I guarantee you the prosecution will CHALLENGE the law if the facts warrant it.
Just another example of the hysteria nonsense "they are not doing anything" mob mentality of a circus these preachers and out of town shake down artists do not want their followers to know about.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Liberals are the ones playing politics and race baiting, with Obama now the official ring leader. And Al Sharpton is a disgrace. MSNBC must be proud.
> ...



Politically this was a non story prior to sharpton and the usual cast of characters injected politics into it. And now Obama has stirred up a political firestorm with his comments. Naturally the right isn't going to sit by while their integrity is being besmerched on national tv hourly. 

This is 100% instigated by the left.


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial.



I'm a reasonable person, as opposed to those who are reacting out of emotion only. What evidence do you see out there that contradicts his story that it was self-defense?



LockeJaw said:


> You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns.



You mean Al "Race Pimp and Media Whore" Sharpton? I agree.



LockeJaw said:


> The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.



Yes he did go after the guy, but that isn't a crime.



LockeJaw said:


> I feel for the family and believe that they are right in demanding he be charged and tried, I wouldn't blame them for wanting Zimmerman put to death.



I don't know about you butI don't live in a country where one can be put in jail before and until the authorities can determine if a crime has been committed.



LockeJaw said:


> But these marching idiots making it a racial issue are nothing more than agitators. I can understand Trayvon's family, friends, neighbors protesting. But alot these people making speeches and marching and commenting on the news who don't know him are just out to promote their causes, they didn't know this young man, nor do they genuinely care about his death in general, and it shows when they turn it into a race issue.



Agreed.



LockeJaw said:


> I don't believe in hate crime legislation. Murder is murder, the reasoning for the murder should only count if it proves intent. As far as sentencing it should have no bearing. No life is worth more than another. So let's knock off the bullshit and just let what happens happen. If Zimmerman faces trial, as I believe he should, it shouldnt be because of marches, tv comments, and peoples feelings.
> 
> It should be because of the evidence.



Agreed, and he should not ecven be arrested until there is evidence.


----------



## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

Liberty said:


> i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.



Shit happens? A kid is dead and it appears - certainly on the face of it - that little, if any, investigation took place as to why he is dead... you don't have to be a parent to understand why this is not 'shit happens'. Your comment was pathetic.


----------



## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bobcollum said:
> 
> 
> > It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.
> ...



And you know this HOW?? You know whether the investigators are sweeping it under the rug or doing their due diligence to make sure that if charges are brought against anyone, that they stick because there are not holes in the case because they rushed things??

And it is not the family politicizing and using this as a stage... it is everyone from politicians, extremist groups, vigilante groups, talk show hosts, media networks, etc that are politicizing this....

It is a shame that this grandstanding is taking away from a tragic death of someone young.... condolences should be going to the family so that they can get beyond this and heal in whatever way they can.... and that will not happen when you have grandstanding by talking heads and agenda driven assholes


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

Chris said:


> Liberty said:
> 
> 
> > i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.
> ...



The police are not looking the other way dumbass, they already looked into it and determined that there was no evidence to discount the shooter's story. It is only being re-looked at because of the outcry.


----------



## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



Don't give up on it, Locke. There will come a day when Americans see the content of one's character instead of the color of one's skin. We're close - we just ain't there yet. So we can't cut and run from the fight.... we just have to fight harder.


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



I am a local resident. I live 5 miles from Sanford. I have been hearing about this story for almost all of the time since it happened. We do not know the whole story, we do not know what happened. The way the law works is that the shooter has claimed that it was self-defense and gave his story to prove it. It doesn't matter if the police believe his story or not, if they have no proof that it happened any other way than the way he said it did, then they cannot arrest him. It shouldn't matter if Al Sharpton comes down here and rants his racist rhetoric all day long. The law is the law, due process is due process, and this is still America and we still have a 5th Amendment.


----------



## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



First I'll quote the authors of the law itself  Stand Your Ground authors: Trayvon Martin&#x2019;s shooter should likely be charged, avoid immunity - Trayvon Martin - MiamiHerald.com



> They got the goods on him. They need to prosecute whoever shot the kid, said Peaden, a Crestview Republican who sponsored the deadly force law in 2005. He has no protection under my law.
> 
> Peaden and Baxley, R-Ocala, say their law is a self-defense act. It says law-abiding people have no duty to retreat from an attacker and can meet force with force. Nowhere does it say that a person has a right to confront another.
> 
> ...




The place I read the statute two days ago is now no longer online  http://election.dos.state.fl.us/laws/05laws/ch_2005-027.pdf  i will find it elsewhere for you asap


----------



## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > Liberty said:
> ...



It deserves to be re-looked, this is NOT an open and shut case.


----------



## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bobcollum said:
> ...



From my perspective, if the family need a re-investigation in order to assure them that no one murdered their son, fine... re-investigate it. If the police investigated properly, then they have nothing to fear. If Zimmerman did nothing wrong, he shouldn't have anything to fear either.... what concerns me are:

1. No one should get away with killing someone without justification.

2. No one should be railroaded into prosecuting an innocent man by the media, or race baiting bastards like Sharpton et al.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> I saw the Republican that wrote the law on TV last night.
> He says the law does not and was not intended to protect anyone that PURSUES someone unless that someone is law enforcement.
> May or may not but I guarantee you the prosecution will CHALLENGE the law if the facts warrant it.
> Just another example of the hysteria nonsense "they are not doing anything" mob mentality of a circus these preachers and out of town shake down artists do not want their followers to know about.


The politician who championed this bill - the one who said that - is simply trying to cover his ass for WRITING a bad law.  If that was the intent of the law, then dammit, he had the responsibility to make sure that was what the law said!

Florida needs to send him packing.


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

Grampa Murked U said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



What did Obama say?


----------



## BlindBoo (Mar 23, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Isn't it funny to note who's ALWAYS screaming and going on about "the new lynch mobs" or just "lynch mobs" nowadays? Hint: It ain't black folks.
> ...



Lawrence and two of his friends offered James a ride while he was walking down a deserted country road. James was not only beaten unconscious, but was urinated upon and then tied to their car by his ankles. The men drove three miles with him chained to the vehicle, and its speculated that James was alive for most of the ordeal. It wasnt until his arm and head were ripped from his body that forensic evidence shows he died. The three killers then dumped James remains in a cemetery and went to a barbeque.

Never Forget James Byrd Jr.: White Supremacist Executed Last Night for 1998 Murder | Necole Bitchie.com


----------



## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Liberty said:
> 
> 
> > i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.
> ...




I agree again with Cali Girl; the talking heads USING the death are disgusting. But would there have been a Grand Jury without an angry segment of the population?


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


Here is the statute:  Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

That is what is currently on the books.

So, if you could, I would also like to find something in that law that disallows what happened, but I can't.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



If he had w son he would look like the victim in this case. Tying his sympathy to race. Disgusting


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> And you know this HOW?? You know whether the investigators are sweeping it under the rug or doing their due diligence to make sure that if charges are brought against anyone, that they stick because there are not holes in the case because they rushed things??



 We have a winner folks!



DiamondDave said:


> And it is not the family politicizing and using this as a stage... it is everyone from politicians, extremist groups, vigilante groups, talk show hosts, media networks, etc that are politicizing this....



Yuppers.




DiamondDave said:


> It is a shame that this grandstanding is taking away from a tragic death of someone young.... condolences should be going to the family so that they can get beyond this and heal in whatever way they can.... and that will not happen when you have grandstanding by talking heads and agenda driven assholes


----------



## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



I don't disagree. I have not formed an opinion of guilt or innocence - and I have, in the main, avoided any media coverage... the media are notorious for filling in missing facts by making up their own theories. Never a good way to form an opinion.

I've supported due process from the beginning of this... and I will continue to do so. I don't want the police to be railroaded to charge Zimmerman unless there is evidence of wrong doing. Justice is not served by sending an innocent person to jail to calm the race baiters.... nor is it served if a guilty man goes free because the police did not do their job right. 

This is not a cut and dried case, it is not a done deal.... but a kid is dead and his family have the right to expect - and demand - that it is investigated thoroughly.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > I saw the Republican that wrote the law on TV last night.
> ...



When you have law enforcement and prosecutors opposing the laws offered you know then it was a bad law.
But the right wing fringe kooks loved it and it passed. 
Same with anything anti environment, abortion anything, the gay boogeyman, anti drinking, pro Nascar and Jesus they offer it as legislation and it passes.


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...



And you know this how?


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bobcollum said:
> ...



I know this how the police took his story at face value
I know this how and armed civilian who just killed a kid was never brought in for questioning
I know this how Zimmerman was allowed to leave the scene with the murder weapon
I know this how the guy was never clearly established as part of a neighborhood watch or involved in a formal patrol at the time

If not for the family raising a stink......nothing would have been done. Given the delay, nothing will probably get done


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 23, 2012)

Chris said:


> Liberty said:
> 
> 
> > i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.
> ...



ya know 49 people were shot in Chicago in one day last week don't ya? This kids death is a terrible tradgedy, I'm sure if you are patient you will get justice. Judge jury and trial..


----------



## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



http://laws.flrules.org/files/Ch_2005-027.pdf   there it is.

776.013 Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of
death or great bodily harm.
(1) A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril
of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using
defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm
to another if:
(a) The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the
process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly
entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had
removed or was attempting to remove another against that persons will
from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and
(b) The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe
that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring
or had occurred.

*Under part 1, zimmerman has no protection *

(2) The presumption set forth in subsection (1) does not apply if:

(a) The person against whom the defensive force is used has the right to
be in or is a lawful resident of the dwelling, residence, or vehicle, such as
an owner, lessee, or titleholder, and there is not an injunction for protection
from domestic violence or a written pretrial supervision order of no contact
against that person; or

(b) The person or persons sought to be removed is a child or grandchild,
or is otherwise in the lawful custody or under the lawful guardianship of,
the person against whom the defensive force is used; or

(c) The person who uses defensive force is engaged in an unlawful activity
or is using the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle to further an
unlawful activity; or

(d) The person against whom the defensive force is used is a law enforcement
officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who enters or attempts to enter a
dwelling, residence, or vehicle in the performance of his or her official duties
and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with any applicable
law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that
the person entering or attempting to enter was a law enforcement officer.

*Section 2 does not allow for defensive force to have been used in this situation*

(3) A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is
attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty
to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with
force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary
to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another
or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

Section 3 does not apply to zimmerman either.

The law does not protect what he did at all.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 23, 2012)

Barb said:


> Mother Jones has a good aticle on this, as well as clear audio for all of the 911 calls and links to transcripts.



Mother Jones has never had a "good" article.

MJ is a leftist rag.


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Personally, I don't care on which end of the political spectrum he is.  He wrote a bad law.  Writing law is his job, and he is incompetent at it, regardless of the letter after his name.

This is EXACTLY why local elections are so important.  Lives depend on what the dumbfucks do.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial.
> ...


People are arrested all the time without concrete evidence, even denied bail while awaiting trial. What evidence do I see Zimmerman may not(note the may not) have a case for claiming self defense? The fact he started the confrontation and pulled a gun, if Trayvon did fight with him it was most likely because he was trying to defend himself from a big guy with a gun. Zimmerman had over 100 lbs on the kid. Now unless the kids a damn ninja, I see no way he could be seen as a physical threat to him. The 9-11 tape where it's clear it's a young kids voice screaming for help. That wasn't Zimmerman. We've heard his chat with the 9-11 operator, and it's also clear as day, regardless what the news is saying, that Zimmerman called him a "fucking coon". Thats enough evidence for most prosecutors.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Its not a bad law, people's interpretations are wrong.

The authors of said law say so and, once this goes through court, the judges explaination of their decision will show how people have misinterpreted it when they find zimmerman guilty of a crime


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



No... YOU ASSUME this because it fits your agenda...


The FACT is that you do not have inside information into the status or progress of the investigation... for if you did, the investigators would be leaking to to you and any subsequent possible charges would be thrown out in a mistrial'

You are one pompous ignorant motherfucker


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

Grampa Murked U said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...


 
Yep. The FEDS need to stay the Hell out of it and let the State handle it.

More grandstanding by the usual suspects.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> But he isn't blaming the victim.
> 
> Most probably agree that the law sucks, but it IS the law.  As you can see above, the cops could not legally arrest Zimmerman.
> 
> ...



Barb doesn't care about the law.

She want's to lynch Zimmerman.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Understood and I agree with the exception of whether it's cut and dried or not. I could very well be a cut and dried case. We just don't know. As of this very minute, Zimmerman has not been arrested and charged. I would think that if they actually had any kind of case against him, he would be in custody. The Sanford Police are no longer in charge but the FBI, and a new prosecutor have still not had him arrested. The only thing we can rule out at this point is that it is a cut and dried case of murder.


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## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Again, I agree with Murked. Stale evidence, too many talking heads.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



Because I am God.


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


here is section 3:

(3)&#8195;A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.​
Please explain how that does not apply to Zimmerman.

Here is my analysis:

- Zimmerman was not engaged in an unlawful activity.

- The evidence at the scene indicates that Zimmerman was physically attacked, and witness statements corroborate that.

- Zimmerman had a right to be there.

- And, Zimmerman told the cops that he called for help and no one came (witness statement corroborates that someone called for help).

- And, only Zimmerman knows what he feared or not.  I can guess what he says, too.

So, if I'm missing something, please explain to me what it is.


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



Yes... since when are their federal murder laws?? This is the fed's jurisdiction how?? Now... the persons rightfully in charge of the investigation can call for assistance... but the fed cannot just step in all over this...

Again... for ones like wrongwinger.. the sensationalizing and posing opinion as fact are more important than the actual incident and result... for it is a vehicle to their political agenda... and it has nothing to do with a real investigation or what may or may not stem from the results of that investigation


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## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

Peach said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > DiamondDave said:
> ...



CORRECTION: I agree with RW.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> I know this how the police took his story at face value



Wrong.



rightwinger said:


> I know this how and armed civilian who just killed a kid was never brought in for questioning



He was questioned at the scene, and at the hospital, and i believe he was brought to the station but I'm not 100% sure on that.



rightwinger said:


> I know this how Zimmerman was allowed to leave the scene with the murder weapon



It isn't a murder weapon if it's self-defense.



rightwinger said:


> I know this how the guy was never clearly established as part of a neighborhood watch or involved in a formal patrol at the time



Irrelevant. Anyone can watch their neighborhood.



rightwinger said:


> If not for the family raising a stink......nothing would have been done. Given the delay, nothing will probably get done



What needed to be done?

So yeah, you don't really know all that much about it.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...


 
The Florida Governor and his Attorney General are looking into the matter as they should. Had the perp fled over State lines THEN it might become a matter for the FBI...whatever...

Looks like the left is gonna beat another issue to death like anything they touch. It's sickening as Hell.

*Angela Corey to take over investigation into Sanford shooting death of Trayvon Martin*


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## GuyPinestra (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Because his story matched the physical evidence.


> I know this how and armed civilian who just killed a kid was never brought in for questioning


Because his story matched the physical evidence.


> I know this how Zimmerman was allowed to leave the scene with the murder weapon


Wrong, read the police report.


> I know this how the guy was never clearly established as part of a neighborhood watch or involved in a formal patrol at the time


The guy has been doing Neighborhood Watch for years. No, the homeowner's association didn't have an 'official' program, but then again they aren't REQUIRED to.


> If not for the family raising a stink......nothing would have been done. Given the delay, nothing will probably get done


Unless there is something they're not telling us, there is probably nothing to BE done.


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## emilynghiem (Mar 23, 2012)

Liberty said:


> i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.



I agree people are killing and dying daily. But instead of growing insensitive to it, we should be more aware it is not acceptable and needs to change. Look how Rosa Parks did not consider herself special, just a tired woman who wanted to sit down on the bus. And that sparked a national movement that was waiting to happen anyway.

Same here. It's because these things happen all the time, whether it's race related or not. It finally happened to two people that the media and public took notice of.

We've been needing to address this whole issue anyway.

How are the local neighbors and residents supposed to promote self-policing our own districts? What are the policies and procedures we need to follow, and what is to prevent criminal or sick people from getting a hold of guns and using them out of the context of regulated policing or defense of the law?

How do we make sure everyone in a district knows who is supposed to be there and who is a suspicious person out of place? And what is the correct procedure for confrontation and arrest so there is no violence between citizens, police or even people with criminal intent? How do we train everyone, and get all residents to agree to a common policy?

How do we prevent conflict from escalating into crime or violence in any form?


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> I know this how Zimmerman was allowed to leave the scene with the murder weapon


According to the police report, the firearm used in the incident was confiscated by the police at the scene and entered into evidence.  Please see the last page.


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## BlindBoo (Mar 23, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



That is as much a myth as "I think he said punks not coons".

One of the strongest indications comes from CNN, which asked an audio expert to closely examine a crucial 1.6 seconds of the recording.

On Zimmerman&#8217;s 911 Call, What Sounds Like a Racial Slur | Florida Center for Investigative Reporting

What stood out, on first listen, was Zimmerman describing a real suspicious guy who looks like hes up to no good, and adding, These assholes, they always get away. Also commanding attention was the dispatchers telling Zimmerman not to follow the man.

But after The Young Turks played tapes on the Internet video show on Monday, listeners contacted them to say, You missed something. Host Cent Uygur credited his viewers for the catch: You put up anything on YouTube, they will dissect it, second by second.

On Tuesday, the show followed up with a segment strongly suggesting the mumbled sounds were the words fucking coons.  The angle gained traction when blogger ZappoDave on the Daily Kos also began writing about it on Tuesday, and cable TV talk shows soon began broaching the subject.

Last night on MSNBC, Jasmine Rand, an attorney for the Martin family, said that the words were not audible on the version of the tapes that Sanford police provided to the family. So at this time, until the family can verify that that was an official version from the Sanford Police Department, the family cannot stand by those terms, Rand said.

But the words do appear to be present on the tapes released over the weekend and published Monday by the Florida Center for Investigative Reporting. They can be heard, however indistinctly, at the 2:21 mark of Zimmermans 911 call:

If Zimmerman indeed made the racist remark, the legal consequences could be severe. As legal writer Jeffrey Toobin pointed out, homicide is not a federal crime. But a homicide motivated by racial animus  that is a federal hate crime, and it could result in very serious charges


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



I agree with you on most points, but the fact they haven't arrested him yet means nothing. They've got procedures to go through, evidence to analyze, etc. that this happened only 3 weeks ago and they just treated it like an open and shut case of self defense is appalling. It shows a lazy police department at best, a biased at worst. I'm not going to say just because he said what he said on the 9-11 tape he should be convicted, that doesn't prove he wasn't defending himself but it does provide a motive for his overreaction. The Martin family is right to pressure the cops to be thorough. But like you, all I want is to see justice be done. And justice in my opinion from what I know, is at least bringing the man up for trial. Ultimately it's up to the cops and courts.


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > I know this how Zimmerman was allowed to leave the scene with the murder weapon
> ...


Wrongwinger posing fantasy and opinion as fact?? Say it isn't so!!!!


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



There is no concrete evidence in this case. Starting the confrontation? You mean by following him. That is not evidence that he was attacked by the victim. You do realize that this "kid" was substantially bigger and stronger than what you see in the photos. He was a football player. Weight, however means little. If Zimmerman who looks like he eats at McDonalds way too often, was following the guy, he might have been totally breathless when the attack happened.

Again, you were not there, you are totally speculating.

You do not know that that wasn't Zimmerman. You do not know that at all.

If he called him a coon, it is not evidence for a charge of murder, nor is it proof in any way that Martin did not attack him.

You have absolutely zero proof that it didn't happen the way Zimmerman said it did. None at all.


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Amelia said:
> ...


But, there has to be a crime first, before there is a hate crime.

We don't convict on thoughts or feelings, alone.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



Yeah, that's what I thought.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Wrongwinger is just a jackass looking for attention he can't get otherwise.


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## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Yea, I was shocked at that! 

Shocked!

S H O C K E D!

So shocked, in truth, that I may shortly have to use several exclamation marks to make my point more valid!!!!!!!


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...


I agree with you up until that last part I bolded.  The purpose of a trial is not to discover facts, it is to determine guilt.  The investigation is over once the trial begins.

I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I think you would more correctly articulate your opinion by desiring to see his case brought before a grand jury, as that is the instrument for determining whether all the available evidence against the proposed defendant is enough to justify a trial.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > I know this how Zimmerman was allowed to leave the scene with the murder weapon
> ...



Yup, most of these people know very very little about the case, they only know what the media tells them.

I live in Orlando, 5 miles from Sanford. I've known about this for more than two weeks. I don't know if he's guilty or not, but I do know that demands for an arrest are being done by a lynch mob. They are wrong and they need to let the police handle it.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Fair enough.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



The 9-11 call from the neighbor clearly contains the voice of a younger boy screaming for help. The fact you claim that something I've heard with my own 2 ears is "speculation" is hilarious, I've listened to the uncut call from Zimmerman saying"they always get away" and "fucking coons". That was said prior to the shooting, sir. There doesn't have to be concrete evidence, circumstantial evidence is admissable in court, you know that right?

You don't seem to understand the justice system very well.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> I don't believe in hate crime legislation. Murder is murder, the reasoning for the murder should only count if it proves intent.



So you don't believe there should be a difference between 1st and 2nd degree murder, either, I take it. Its still murder, right?

Shouldn't all illegal homicides be treated the same by your logic?

If I catch my wife red handed cheating on me and kill her in the heat of the moment - that's just as bad as plotting and successfully killing my wife to cash in on her insurance money, right? She's dead in both cases. And the only difference is the thoughts going on in my head. So why should't I be punished exactly the same in both cases?

In fact - why don't we toss out the element of the mind set of the criminal entirely and make all criminal laws strict liability laws.


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## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Amelia said:
> ...



MURDER is a very serious charge; Zimmerman could face that on the STATE level.


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## Rozman (Mar 23, 2012)

The sad thing is maybe there is something to be gained here by all this attention.
Some good may come to the parents of the child but there is mileage to be gained by those around this
killing.The Rev Al has made a very nice career for himself off tragedy's like this.
He has gotten a radio and TV show and a Presidential run as well.
To be fair Curtis Sliwa of the guardian angels got a career from what he was doing.
TV and the rest of the media will gain ratings from the coverage.

Everybody has gotten into this for their own self interests.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


I really don't get why people believe that an arrest will somehow break the case open.  Other than getting a mug shot and fingerprints, there is nothing else that will happen.  He'll take the Fifth if they attempt to question him and, unless the DA charges him with something, he'll be let go within 48 hours.

Some people watch too much _Law & Order_, I guess.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > I don't believe in hate crime legislation. Murder is murder, the reasoning for the murder should only count if it proves intent.
> ...



Actually isn't that a crime of passion?


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

Rozman said:


> The sad thing is maybe there is something to be gained here by all this attention.
> Some good may come to the parents of the child but there is mileage to be gained by those around this
> killing.The Rev Al has made a very nice career for himself off tragedy's like this.
> He has gotten a radio and TV show and a Presidential run as well.
> ...


 
Say _Twanna Brawley_ around the attention-Whore the not-so-reverend _*Sharpton*_ and watch his stupid ass come unglued.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...


Voluntary manslaughter at common law.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...





I can't for the life of me figure out why this POS has not been arrested and charged yet. Whether or not he shot and killed the victim is not in dispute by anyone. Given that, and given the fact that all the evidence available other than Zimmerman's claims suggest Zimmerman was not in danger of being harmed, its pretty clear what should be done.

BUT IN FLORIDA ITS LEGAL FOR WHITE PEOPLE TO KILL BLACK PEOPLE.

And that is quite clearly a FACT


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > OohPooPahDoo said:
> ...



Hmm does that vary by state?


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > I don't believe in hate crime legislation. Murder is murder, the reasoning for the murder should only count if it proves intent.
> ...



You make no sense. How did you get the silly notion I don't believe there are more heinous forms and degrees of murder? You assume too much.


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## jillian (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> 
> I feel for the family and believe that they are right in demanding he be charged and tried, I wouldn't blame them for wanting Zimmerman put to death. But these marching idiots making it a racial issue are nothing more than agitators. I can understand Trayvon's family, friends, neighbors protesting. But alot these people making speeches and marching and commenting on the news who don't know him are just out to promote their causes, they didn't know this young man, nor do they genuinely care about his death in general, and it shows when they turn it into a race issue.
> 
> ...



except that it IS about race. if a black man killed a white kid after pursuing them for no reason, we'd be talking about whether the guy should do life or get the death penalty.

so you can complain, but a lot of people marched for civil rights, too.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



Yeah. And if I kill her because she's black, the law defines it as a hate crime. According to LockeJaw, those things shouldn't matter.


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## emilynghiem (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



Either way, you are gambling with your rights and security
if you depend on courts or cops or government to determine truth and justice.
Good luck with that!

The deeper message this whole incident carries
is that none of us can afford to gamble with our lives.

We can't have crime unchecked in our neighborhoods.
We can't afford NOT to know who are neighbors are,
and which people have which problem to watch out for.

We can't afford to run around policing or walking around alone by ourselves,
but need to work together in groups and need to know each other.

I think people respond to this case, depending on which person they can relate to.
If you can put yourself in the shoes of the shooter, and ask what would you do if
you were reacting to break-ins and having to police things yourself because the
legal sytem and law enforcement only responds after the fact, if there is enough
evidence to intervene.
Or if you identify and sympathize with the young man, and wonder what would happen
if you were by yourself and got into a confrontation with no other witnesses.
Both scenarios are equally disturbing to me, if I were in either person's position.

I just know that if I KNEW these men personally in advance, then I would be better able to interact with them to diffuse any hostile situation.  That is the only way I see to avoid tragedies like this from happening, we have to know one another and not leave things to chance and guessing what someone might do.

All neighborhoods, communities, families and groups should make a commitment to get to know everyone around them, break down the walls and barriers, quit hiding our problems and get help for people with serious issues that could become a danger or hazard,
and not leave things to chance confrontation, especially not with guns involved.

If we are serious about law enforcement, preventing either crime or accidents, and any political, religious or racial conflict from becoming a physical or legal confrontation, we need to resolve issues far in advance instead of waiting for them to blow up in our faces.

After 9/11 I saw a lot more people being compassionate and appreciative of other people, even strangers passing on the street. May this incident have that same effect on people.  May all the negativity being drawn out now be released as part of a healing process, so this moves toward a better place than where we were before as a society. Peace to all.


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



Well.. there we have it folks... the STUPID POST OF THE MONTH


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...


 

Agreed. Racists always bear themselves out don't they?


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



From your words: . "Murder is murder"

You seem to arbitrarily decide whether or not the mind of the criminal should have anything to do with the severity of their penalty. It should if its a question of whether or not the murder was planned before hand, but should not if its a question of whether or not the murder was intended to harm only the victim or was it intended to both harm the victim and terrorize an entire class of people?

That makes no sense.

A) I kill you because you look at me wrong in a bar and I was drunk and stupid.

B) I kill you because I know you have $10,000 in cash on you and I want it, so I lay in waiting and sneak up on you and stab you in the back and take the money.

You say B is worse than A and B should be punished more



I agree

B) I kill you because I know you have $10,000 in cash on you and I want it.

C) I kill you because I hate people of your race and I want to not only kill you, but inspire fear of death and general terror in everyone else in your race (I may, for instance, want them to be afraid to go to the polls and vote - or afraid to live in my nice white gated neighborhood)

Yet C is not worse than B.

Seems you draw the line arbitrarily.


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## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



Not according to the standard definition of the word 'fact'.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...


They call it different things in different states, but most all of them consider a crime of passion murder to be a lesser crime than a premeditated murder.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...


Or the word _'LEGAL'_.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

emilynghiem said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...


That's the system under which we live, so we kinda don't have a choice ...


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

jillian said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



No... this is about the incident, evidence, and what really happened.... not about whether one was black the other white.. or one yellow and one Aleutian... or one albino and one mixed race.... or anything else... NOR SHOULD IT BE


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## BlindBoo (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BlindBoo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Personally I don't think Zimmerman had a reasonable belief that he was in mortal danger from an unarmed teenager.  I don't think a jury will either.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > OohPooPahDoo said:
> ...


I said in terms of SENTENCING. If it involves things like dismemberment, for example, that is where the heavier sentencing should come in. I'm saying race should only be relevant as far as evidence of intent.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...


 
I thought Jillian was a _lawyer _and should KNOW these things?


----------



## jillian (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



poor tommy. drinking again, hon?


----------



## jillian (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



no. they didn't even take the guy in.

it's about race.

you can pretend otherwise.if it weren't the feds wouldn't have had to get involved.

and you really thanked drunk tommy? really??


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > BlindBoo said:
> ...


First of all, I know plenty of 17 yo boys, and they can and sometimes do inflict bodily injury.

So, his age is irrelevant in that respect.

Zimmerman is fat and short, so likely not in any physical condition near that of Martin.

So, not an issue.

The evidence at the scene indicates Zimmerman was injured - head wounds, not serious because they were treated at the scene by EMTs - and witness testimony corroborates that Zimmerman was on his back on the ground and that there was someone who called for help.

As far as what Zimmerman feared, that is nothing anyone can know except Zimmerman.

If I were on the jury and based on the law and the information in the cop report (not in the press), I would have to let him go.

But, that's just me.  And, I do not know all the evidence.


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Why does MarcATL want a lynch mob before all evidence is in? Is his mind affected by some kind of mental illness? This is a serious question. MarcATL and a few other people have become completely unhinged over a tragedy that is not theirs.
> 
> What is it about lonely shut-ins with internet service that makes them so angry and irrational?



I got a neg rep over this one?    I forgot it was here.

thanks for reminding me
sincerely and with undying luv (you know who you are)

dD


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



It's only circumstantial evidence if the charge is racism. The charge is murder, or it would be if they prosecutor thinks he has any evidence, and "fucking coon" is not proof of murder.

I also heard the cries on tape. If you claim to know it was Martin and not Zimmerman, you are arguing just to argue.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



Yeah, I get it. A white man who kills a black man because the black man slept with his wife should get the same sentence as a white man who kills a black man because he hates all blacks and wants to terrorize every single one of them.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



Idiot.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...




SORRY - its OK for a NON-BLACK to kill a BLACK.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

jillian said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



Zimmerman apparently has no white blood in him. He's hispanic with an amalgum of other races most notably black.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Zimmerman was not attacked, he persued and initiated the contact.  If Zimmermen had not left to persue the situation would not have arose.  This is why part 3 does not protect him.


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## paperview (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...


His mother is Peruvian and his father is white.

The police report notes him as "white."

To most observers, he is white.

Where you get your "amalgam of other races most notably black" one can only guess.


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## whitehall (Mar 23, 2012)

Do you civil rights caring libs want to wait for the justice system to work or do you want to lynch Zimmerman this afternoon?


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> BUT IN FLORIDA ITS LEGAL FOR WHITE PEOPLE TO KILL BLACK PEOPLE.
> 
> And that is quite clearly a FACT


Hyperbole much?


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## paulitician (Mar 23, 2012)

For many, it's only about Politics. Justice never enters the equation for the usual suspects. And we all know who they are.


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## WillowTree (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



well dangnation.. obama's mama was from Kansas and daddykins was from Kenya, to most observers he must be white too..


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

whitehall said:


> Do you civil rights caring libs want to wait for the justice system to work or do you want to lynch Zimmerman this afternoon?


Right, because civil rights just aren't all that important.

Typical cop.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

whitehall said:


> Do you civil rights caring libs want to wait for the justice system to work or do you want to lynch Zimmerman this afternoon?




"Governor, if Kitty Dukakis were raped and murdered, would you favor an irrevocable death penalty for the killer?"


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 23, 2012)

whitehall said:


> Do you civil rights caring libs want to wait for the justice system to work or do you want to lynch Zimmerman this afternoon?



I like how you mock the very idea of civil rights. Do you even know what a civil right is?


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...


 
And note that another twerp form the left has to focus on the race of the alledged perp?


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## paulitician (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bobcollum said:
> 
> 
> > It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.
> ...



A whole three weeks ago? Really? And clarify what you mean when you say 'swept under the rug.'


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



I heard they gave the Victim a drug and alcohol test and not the shooter.    Yeah, it's Sharptons fault for bringing light to this issue.  How is this a bad thing?  I dunno...People say Sharpton and turn on the auto-hate feature in their brains


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## WillowTree (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...








I'm just trying to get to their logic,, lesseee white plus hispanic (brown)  gets white..

white plus black gets you black..


now when white kills black for no reason the whole nation is in an uproar. but when black sets white on fire they shrug it off and says "what's race got to do with it."


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> whitehall said:
> 
> 
> > Do you civil rights caring libs want to wait for the justice system to work or do you want to lynch Zimmerman this afternoon?
> ...



He takes civil rights for granted.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

paulitician said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bobcollum said:
> ...


 
Seems to me the rug has been yanked and the mess is here for all to see.

Shame there are so many politicizing a tragedy that can be handled by the State without massive morons like Sharpton and Obama/FED getting involved.


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## Ariux (Mar 23, 2012)

BlindBoo said:


> That is as much a myth as "I think he said punks not coons".



Just like Catholics can see the image of Jesus in a slice of toast, liberals can hear "coons" in an inaudible sound on a tape.

Even if he said "coons", so what?  People who use Politically Incorrect language don't have a right of self-defense?   

Some coon attacked a man with a gun, and the coon got shot.  And, because liberals hate white people, they want the man to go to prison.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

jillian said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



That story would be the wet dream of every fox news host.  24-7


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Almost anything can be handled without Al Sharpton getting involved.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



In a minute, I'll get the link.


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## paperview (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...


I never thought of Pred Fan as a liberal twerp, but have it your way, Tommy.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



As long as you dont use your eyes I guess you would be confused wiwwow.


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Zimmerman was not attacked, he persued and initiated the contact.  If Zimmermen had not left to persue the situation would not have arose.  This is why part 3 does not protect him.



initiated contact? you don't know that. we do know Martin initiated a verbal confrontation. his own girlfriend verified this


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > DiamondDave said:
> ...



You heard 

Well.. that's all the proof I need


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Here's the first link where his family describes him as "Multi-racial Hispanic". There is another article that I read just today that stated that he has very close family members that were black. I'm still trying to find that article.

Zimmerman was on the ground being punched when he shot Trayvon Martin - Charleston Charleston Conservative | Examiner.com


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...


 

Agreed. YOU demonstrated the absurdity by being such yourself.

Good job! You nailed it.


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## sealybobo (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



George is a murderer.  I can't believe this is how you see things.  He was a right wing extremist with guns and racism.

Now, on the other hand, I also agree with Geraldo and Fox that black people need to stop dressing like criminals.  If the kid was dressed in dockers and a polo shirt, he would not have gotten shot.  Kids, and that goes for you Wiggers too, stop dressing like gangstas.  If George would have shot a kid wearing polo and pants that don't show his underwear, he'd be in jail.  Dress appropriately.  You aren't impressing any of us.  But you are scaring the shit out of some of us.  

Again, George should go to jail for stalking and chasing that kid and murdering him in cold blood.


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## Rocko (Mar 23, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bobcollum said:
> 
> 
> > It's an easily sensationalized story for the 24-hour news networks to pull in the usual crowd of people that can't get enough of other people's misery and get ratings. In short, it sells.
> ...



Had the victim and perp been of the same race no one would be "politicizing" this story.

I'm not upset about a crusade for justice, but for most of the people advocating justice, it's not about justice, it's about getting ahead with their point of view in racial politics.


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


Zimmerman had wounds on his head and grass stains on his back, according to the report by the cops first on the scene.  Are you saying there is evidence that he got them some other way other than Martin?  By someone else who may have been there?  Self-inflicted?

Zimmerman can legally pursue anyone he wants for any reason, unless there is a court ordering him not to do so.  So, he was legally in that area for legal reasons, unless you have some law to indicate otherwise.

Finally, you can SAY that the statute does not apply to him, but I am not seeing the part of the statute that says that.  Where in the statute does it say this cannot apply to someone who follows another?  And, where in the statute does it say that this cannot apply to someone who 'starts it'?

I may agree with your words as it pertains to my personal beleifs, but the law is what matters here, not my personal opinion of what the law _should_ mean.

So, if you could, that would be great.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

sealybobo said:


> He was a right wing extremist with guns and racism.


I sure would love to know how you became aware of his political ideology.


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## DiamondDave (Mar 23, 2012)

jillian said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



No.. it is not all about race... but you have some trying to make it all about race....

The Feds DON'T have to get involved... it is not their jurisdiction... as stated, if the local, county, or state authorities ask for help, I am sure the Fed would... but an alleged murder case is not the Fed's jurisdiction

And yes... I thank the comments... I have even thanked wrongwinger on the rare occasion for a comment


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

Barry44sucks said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bobcollum said:
> ...


And the usual suspects show up time and time again.


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## paperview (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...


One thing you need to know - the Examiner is rubbish, and you basically just posted a blog opinion piece by someone, but he thanks you for the hits.  Ca-ching for him.

We know his father said he was multi-racial.  That's old news. We also know his father lies. Not about that-we know he _does_ have Peruvian blood. I  Already stated that.  It was *you *that had him swimming in black blood.


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## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > He was a right wing extremist with guns and racism.
> ...



He is subject to indictment by the Grand Jury, scheduled to convene April 10, 2012.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > DiamondDave said:
> ...


 
These idiots just can't help themselves.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

Peach said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > sealybobo said:
> ...


I love lamp.  Do you like pie?


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



I said I was looking for the article that I read. I still am. I've been reading a lot about this case for weeks. If it's wrong, I'll admit it but it doesn't matter if the examiner is right leaning or not, that fact is that he is not white.


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## WillowTree (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> Barry44sucks said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



tough shit for ewe innit?


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Crackerjack said:
> ...


  (I am glad someone sees the same thing I do.)


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Si what does that even mean? I can grab my 9 MM and start chasing people down in the street I deem suspicious? I thought the only people allowed to "pursue" others were police or other law enforcement types.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Zimmerman was not attacked, he persued and initiated the contact.  If Zimmermen had not left to persue the situation would not have arose.  This is why part 3 does not protect him.
> ...



I do know that from the 911 call where the operator told him to not initiate contact...and he did anyway.


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > Barry44sucks said:
> ...


For me? Really?


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



And the law, as i have already shown, does not protect him at all.  The 911 call backs up what I am saying perfectly.

He was instructed to not intiate a confontation and did anyway, by intiating a confrontation with the other person he lost all protection under the law according to the language of the law.  This law is worded to protect those defending themselves, not to protect those initiating a situation.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...


Yeah, I had that half-second debate with myself as to whether I was the crazy one in this equation or not.

The voices in my head assured me that I'm sane, so we're good.


----------



## Rocko (Mar 23, 2012)

The T said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > The T said:
> ...


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



Ok, it isn't exactly what I read but it's CNN who says he has black family members. Unless you think CNN is a right wing blog?

I'm still trying to find the article that said he had direct blood relatives that were black. You can bet your ass that when I do, you will find it in your face right quick.

Neighbors describe watch leader at center of Florida investigation - CNN.com


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


I'm pretty sure I can legally follow anyone I want to follow.  I've done it as a matter of fact.  I've even hired a PI to do it.

Whether I have a gun on me or not when I do it doesn't matter, unless I don't have a permit.

And, IF the law - that's an IF, because I haven't seen any law quoted that says so - says that I can only defend myself with deadly force if I don't instigate something, then that law is bad as well.  For example, if I simply shove someone for some reason - accidentally or just because I think the person is ugly -  and then they attack me and attack me hard, that would mean I cannot use deadly force to defend myself.  I would be a goner.

The law is bad.  It needs to go.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



But I thought stalking laws were made to prevent that? what If I lose my mind and start following a woman home from the bar because she won't talk to me? I thought there were laws agains that?


----------



## paperview (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...


Weird how the police officer who made the description noted him as such, huh?  

Surprise!  Hispanics  are an ethnic group - not a color.


----------



## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Crackerjack said:
> ...




And I STILL believe a Grand Jury presentment is the correct course of action. VARIOUS "witnesses", various conclusions.


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


Where have you shown where the law doesn't apply?  That's what I am asking.

The 9/11 call doesn't back that up at all, either.  What the 9/11 operator says is not legally binding.  Show me the law that says it is, please.

Show me where in the law that it says someone who initiates this is no longer covered.

Show me the law, please.


----------



## paperview (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...


I'll be looking forward to it.  Yew betcha!


----------



## SAJason (Mar 23, 2012)

I believe this might be it.

George Zimmerman's father on Trayvon Martin: My son is not racist, did not confront Trayvon Martin - Orlando Sentinel


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## WillowTree (Mar 23, 2012)

Barry44sucks said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



ditto that


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



Then there is this one from the Orlando sentinel where Zimmerman's father describes him as hispanic with black family members:

George Zimmerman's father on Trayvon Martin: My son is not racist, did not confront Trayvon Martin - Orlando Sentinel

Still looking....


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## Ariux (Mar 23, 2012)

The favorite chant of blacks:

"No justice, no peace."

They don't want justice here, and if they don't get injustice, they're promising violence.


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

EVERYONE should read THIS article right here:

George Zimmerman's father on Trayvon Martin: My son is not racist, did not confront Trayvon Martin - Orlando Sentinel


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...


Sure, stalking laws prevent that.  But stalking is a long pattern, not a single action.

And, charges have to be pressed for a stalking law to apply.

You can follow a woman home from a bar.  No law prevents you from doing that.  She can call the cops and report you as suspicious and I'm sure they will talk to you and ask you to move on.  If you don't, then you have a problem.

If you follow her as a habit, then she can probably seek remedy under stalking laws.


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## WillowTree (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



really then why did the left paint the influx of illegal hispanics as the "browning of America." ?????


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> whitehall said:
> 
> 
> > Do you civil rights caring libs want to wait for the justice system to work or do you want to lynch Zimmerman this afternoon?
> ...



Yup. One of them is "due process" dumbass.


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## Amelia (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...





Basically it appears that you are allowed to do that.  That's why this pig will have to move from Florida if he is let off.   A few million people who will deem him suspicious.


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## Crackerjack (Mar 23, 2012)

Ariux said:


> The favorite chant of blacks:
> 
> "No justice, no peace."
> 
> They don't want justice here, and if they don't get injustice, they're promising violence.


You and ducks102 should be locked in a room together.  The last one to drown in his own saliva wins.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paperview said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



Irrelevant. His family should know what he is. You are wrong, admit it and move on.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Hmm so you are only allowed to follow someone until they call the cops and report you?


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

Barry44sucks said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...


  Indeed. Am I missing something here?


----------



## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

SAJason said:


> I believe this might be it.
> 
> George Zimmerman's father on Trayvon Martin: My son is not racist, did not confront Trayvon Martin - Orlando Sentinel



Thanks but that wasn't quite it. The article I read said he had very close family members who were black. I took it at the time I read it to mean "related by blood", that article doesn't say that.

Still, it pretty much points to Zimmerman as not being white at all.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> SAJason said:
> 
> 
> > I believe this might be it.
> ...



He's not white, he doesn't look white in his pics at least.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...


Pretty much.  That's my understanding.

I have been involved in a nasty legal situation (not criminal and only because of an association of mine) where I WAS followed and followed regularly.  I finally noticed it when my fiancee pointed it out.  He and I have close association with the local cops (on the citizen advisory council) and we asked about it.  The dop said that there is no law to prevent them from following me, BUT, they said that IF I were creeped out about it, I can call 9/11 and tell them that some suspicious person (or vehicle) is following me.  They will come and have a talk with the person and likely ask them to move along.  This was all presented in a hypothetical, of course.

And, once the person refuses to follow the order of a LEO, then they are violating the law.

And, that's just what I did.  It took one time, then the following stopped, until they hired a PI.  Same thing.  But, the PI has more rights to refuse to cease following, if they are licensed.  That sucked.


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## paulitician (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > SAJason said:
> ...



What will CNN & NBC do if it turns out he's not White. Their shameful Race-Baiting is now 24/7 programming for them. It's their Rodney King Redux. If he does turn out not to be White, they're screwed. Their regular programming is an abomination. They desperately need this farce to last longer. And that's just very sad.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

paulitician said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



I guarantee you that they will shift the racism prism that they view the world through to the police department instead. In fact you don't hear the family calling him white anymore. It's now about the supposed racism of the Sanford Police Department. Even the black officers apparently.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 23, 2012)

paulitician said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



I don't really care about Zimmermans race to be honest.


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## Too Tall (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Liberty said:
> 
> 
> > i dont understand why this "story" is so goddamn important. people die all the time...shit happens. this is not special.
> ...



The police report stated that the back of Zimmerman's shirt was wet and had grass stains.  He (Zimmerman) was treated by the EMT's at the scene for a bloody nose and a laceration on the back of his head.  He was also cuffed and relieved of his gun.  Then taken downtown for further questioning.

My take is Zimmerman was attacked by Martin, knocked on his ass by this football playing 17 year old, and retaliated by shooting him.


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## paulitician (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



Yeah, sadly that is very predictable. CNN & NBC are shameful Race-Baiting assholes. They need this farce to continue. Shame on them.


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## paulitician (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



I hear ya. I feel the same way.


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Ariux said:


> The favorite chant of blacks:
> 
> "No justice, no peace."
> 
> They don't want justice here, and if they don't get injustice, they're promising violence.



I agree with you. Whenever the left (I was part of an original group of OCCUPY before it went berzerk - one month ) calls for social or any other justice, my eyes glaze over. Even when I agree with them.


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Peach said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



no harm in a grand jury, except when an investigator is on a witch hunt. Grand juries are notorious for delivering indictments that later pan out to be horrible, but that's our system. It's open to abuse like everything else is.

that said, I fear the Justice Department here more than my peers (I distrust my peers) on a grand jury, even one being manipulated by an overzealous inestigator


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## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Crackerjack said:
> ...




The SA will be from the 4th Circuit (Duval, Clay and Nassau counties); the actual SA for the 18th Circuit removed himself from the case Wednesday.

Trayvon Martin Case: State Attorney Quits Investigation As State Studies 'Stand Your Ground' Law


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## The T (Mar 23, 2012)

paulitician said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > paulitician said:
> ...


All WE need care about is another HUMAN lost his life. Let the State figure it out sans this Racial yaksqueeze.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > OohPooPahDoo said:
> ...



Yeah pretty much. Im black by the way.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 23, 2012)

They might have a hard time finding a judge.   If he doesn't find Zimmerman guilty, he could be responsible for nationwide riots.   No matter what the evidence is.  

So far, it doesn't look the best for Trayvon Martin.


 That jibes with what Cheryl Brown's teenage son witnessed while walking his dog that night. Thirteen-year-old Austin stepped out his front door and heard people fighting, he told the Orlando Sentinel on Thursday.

 "I heard screaming and crying for help," he said. "I heard, 'Help me.' "

 It was dark, and the boy did not see how the fight started, in fact, he only saw one person, a man in a red shirt &#8212; Zimmerman &#8212; who was on the ground.

 The boy said he is not sure who called for help. After a moment, his dog escaped, and he turned to catch it and a few seconds later heard a gunshot, he said.

 "When I heard the shot, the screaming stopped," he said.

 He then rushed inside and told his sister to call police.

 In his letter, Robert Zimmerman wrote that what happened that night was "tragic &#8230; and very sad for all concerned. The Martin family, our family and the entire community have been forever changed."

 George Zimmerman has not talked publicly about what happened, his father said, because that's the advice police gave him. Both Zimmerman families have moved out of their homes, at least temporarily, Robert Zimmerman said, because they've received death threats.

 Police on Tuesday turned the case over to the State Attorney's Office, saying they did not have evidence to justify George Zimmerman's arrest on a charge of manslaughter.

Cut on the back of the head, bloody broken nose, it sure looks like it's building towards self-defense.


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## Too Tall (Mar 23, 2012)

sealybobo said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Read the police report and then apologize for being a racist prick.


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## theHawk (Mar 23, 2012)

Pretty sickening that the President of the United States has latched onto this in order to try to gain public support and to stir up public outrage.

I'm not taking sides on Zimmerman being guilty or not guilty, but at this point I don't see how he can get a fair trial when the President has obviously taken sides and the Feds are working as his personal lynchmob with badges.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

DiamondDave said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



What are you mad about?

zimmerman never drug tested - Google Search

Pick a link and you'll see the they did drug test Trevons dead body but not Zimmerman.  You guys seem mad for no reason


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

Oh yeah, I dont see what the problem is with Sharpton bringing light to this.  If he didnt it most likely would have not gone anywhere even tho everyone agrees this was handled badly.

But say Sharpton and some people black out and starts being against whatever it is.  Just because Sharpton said or did something.


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## PredFan (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Oh yeah, I dont see what the problem is with Sharpton bringing light to this.  If he didnt it most likely would have not gone anywhere even tho everyone agrees this was handled badly.
> 
> But say Sharpton and some people black out and starts being against whatever it is.  Just because Sharpton said or did something.



Complete garbage. I live in Orlando, which is 5 miles south of Sanford. This has been boiling over down here since it happened. Sharpton only got involved when it broke national news.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

PredFan said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Oh yeah, I dont see what the problem is with Sharpton bringing light to this.  If he didnt it most likely would have not gone anywhere even tho everyone agrees this was handled badly.
> ...



Ok...and...?

BTW...how does that dispute anything I said?    (Garbage?!)


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Oh yeah, I dont see what the problem is with Sharpton bringing light to this.  If he didnt it most likely would have not gone anywhere even tho everyone agrees this was handled badly.
> 
> But say Sharpton and some people black out and starts being against whatever it is.  Just because Sharpton said or did something.



Sharpton soils anything he touches. You're right. He's an opportunist and everyone knows it. It didn't take him to do squat man.

If I remember correctly the story was reported and then Sharpton slicked his hair, put on a suit, and took off down there as soon as he heard it was a white guy involved. The guy lives to agitate. The best way to get people turned off is to have a huckster like him speak on behalf of your cause.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Oh yeah, I dont see what the problem is with Sharpton bringing light to this.  If he didnt it most likely would have not gone anywhere even tho everyone agrees this was handled badly.
> ...



Actually he took off when he heard how the police handled the situation but dont let that stop you from making up shit.



> The guy lives to agitate. The best way to get people turned off is to have a huckster like him speak on behalf of your cause.



Uh, no...you believe he soils anything he touches but if it were not for him and others the story would have stayed local.

Ahh, so the old I dont care because...line.  Either you care or you dont.  Many people who dont care are holding Sharpton up as the reason for their feelings.  Sharpton doesnt control your feelings, you do.

Sharpton has gotten this attention that wouldnt have been there if he didnt.  What is wrong with spotlighting something that is wrong?  

Sharpton does that and people are mad that he does it.  How about no one put it on the national stage?  Would that make it better?  

No...only for you.  Not the family


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## Sallow (Mar 23, 2012)

The problem was the police work. They didn't take a statement at the scene. They didn't take evidence. They let Zimmerman go. And this despite the fact a child was shot in the chest and killed.

Really, really bad police work.


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## Sallow (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Oh yeah, I dont see what the problem is with Sharpton bringing light to this.  If he didnt it most likely would have not gone anywhere even tho everyone agrees this was handled badly.
> ...



The family asked him to get involved.


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## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

Sallow said:


> The problem was the police work. They didn't take a statement at the scene. They didn't take evidence. They let Zimmerman go. And this despite the fact a child was shot in the chest and killed.
> 
> Really, really bad police work.



They let Zimmerman go? That is the general process if there is no evidence of a crime. You're making far too many assumptions - including the assumption of guilt. That is not our process. Trial by media is a very dangerous precedent to set... and yet you seem determined to support it.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



 Al Sharpton had nothing to do with this going on national news, CC.

He had and has nothing to do with anything more than fanning the flames.
You're just blind to reality with your race-colored glasses on. Your worship of Sharpton is disappointing.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



Fanning what flames...The flames of a dead kid?  Your trolling use of the word worship is disappointing.  Cant you have a serious discussion without making accusations?


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

Sallow said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



That was a mistake then. All Sharpton does is turn people off. 

It's a shame the family didn't think of that before calling the Huckster. Here comes a poorly written book about this tragedy from the people's champion, Al Sharpton. $19.95 at your local bookstore, coming soon.

Fuck.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > The problem was the police work. They didn't take a statement at the scene. They didn't take evidence. They let Zimmerman go. And this despite the fact a child was shot in the chest and killed.
> ...



Uh, why did they drug test the dead kid and not the shooter?  Ever watched CSI?  Can you at least say that that is a strange thing to do?  Or are you rendered speechless until after a judge has banged his gavel?


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## California Girl (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



You are aware that CSI is fiction, right? 

It is SOP to drug test - that's police procedure. Nothing to do with anything other than process.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...


Would "praise" be a better word for you? The guy is a damn clown out to make a buck and get some tv face time off of someone else's misery.

You'll see.


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## Againsheila (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> 
> I feel for the family and believe that they are right in demanding he be charged and tried, I wouldn't blame them for wanting Zimmerman put to death. But these marching idiots making it a racial issue are nothing more than agitators. I can understand Trayvon's family, friends, neighbors protesting. But alot these people making speeches and marching and commenting on the news who don't know him are just out to promote their causes, they didn't know this young man, nor do they genuinely care about his death in general, and it shows when they turn it into a race issue.
> 
> ...



As far as I'm concerned, if Sharpton is involved, Zimmerman should get off just on principle.  Sharpton never did apologize for what he did to the Duke Lacross players.

Seriously, I haven't followed this case very closely so I don't know if Zimmerman is guilty or not, but with Sharpton defending Travon Martin, and me not knowing all the facts, I have to side with Zimmerman.

The blacks should get rid of that guy if they want to be taken seriously.


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## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


Because it's subjective. A reasonable fear is different for different people. If for instance, Mitt Romney walked into JoeB's airspace, JoeB would feel a reasonable fear of Romney as he is terrified of mormons. That's a joke, but close enough to the truth of the matter.


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## MaryL (Mar 23, 2012)

I add this to the list of terrible things that we humans do to each other...This poor kid should be alive. But, all the hollering and childish tantrums being thrown on this issue by blacks are counter productive. I think most whites and certainly the media are overly sensitive to events like this... If this had this been a white kid murdered by blacks,  it would be ignored and downplayed.  Any one here doubt that for a second?  Whites get victimized by blacks all the time. I can speak from personal experience. What about  that high black crime rate? What about  black crime against whites? They can  construed as racial /hate crimes.  But that  rarely happens.  If we are going to be realistic here, everyone everywhere should be  an activist to stop  any hate   crimes, not just  blacks. But there is only concern when  it happens to a black person, but blacks should be just as pissed off when innocent whites are killed by a black person. Then we might a have solidarity  on  this issue.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

Againsheila said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



Sharpton does this to people as I said. However Sharpton being involved shouldn't have any bearing on this case. There is enough evidence to bring Zimmerman up on charges. Since I wasn't there I don't know any more than the next guy, but what I know is damning of Zimmerman. 

Read up on the case, you won't be on his side with all the circumstantial evidence along with the fact he isn't denying he shot him. Unless of course you just hate black folks, which I'm not claiming or trying to insinuate, don't get me wrong.

Reading up on Trayvon, he had never been arrested(ofcourse he is a minor so the courts can't confirm, but I'll take his fathers word for it), devoted a lot of time to community service alongside his father. Things just don't add up.


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## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


It isn't binding, but it does show that he wasn't acting from a fear of Martin, but rather for some other reason, notably, not letting the assholes get away (based on what he said on tape during the 911 call). That is perhaps what PP is trying to say.


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

MaryL said:


> I add this to the list of terrible things that we humans do to each other...This poor kid should be alive. But, all the hollering and childish tantrums being thrown on this issue by blacks are counter productive. I think most whites and certainly the media are overly sensitive to events like this... If this had this been a white kid murdered by blacks,  it would be ignored and downplayed.  Any one here doubt that for a second?  Whites get victimized by blacks all the time. I can speak from personal experience. What about  that high black crime rate? What about  black crime against whites. They can  construed as racial /hate crimes.  But that  rarely happens.  If we are going to be realistic here, everyone everywhere should be  an activist to stop  any hate   crimes, not just  blacks. But there is only concern when  it happens to a black person., but blacks should be just as pissed off when innocent whites are killed by a black person. Then we might a have solidarity  on  this issue.


Family Of Tulsa Couple Victimized In Home Invasion Speak Out - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |
An 85 year old woman was raped and killed and her husband severely beaten by a young black man in Tulsa around the time this happened. No Al Sharpton for the elderly white victims, I wonder why that is? No rally, no national news coverage, nothing. Just as horrible of a tragedy.  65 years of marriage, this old man is going to have to deal with losing his soulmate and he'll probably die from it. 

You're right. Until the media stops with the hypocrisy we'll never get past this stuff.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 23, 2012)

The law is that no one has an expectation of privacy in public and you can follow anyone.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 23, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



Stalking is different than following someone. Stalking is more than one time. Stalking involves harrasment and events that put someone in fear. JUst following someone is not stalking. There has to be documented unwarranted contact directly threatening to someone for it to fit the legal definition of stalking. The legal definition involves motive where there is an inventiveness, a persistence of many times, an obsessive nature that was pre-planned and thought about before the event.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 23, 2012)

Zimmerman never knew this kid before he saw him so this is not stalking.
Not condoning what he did in any way if there was no attack from the kid.


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## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

theHawk said:


> Pretty sickening that the President of the United States has latched onto this in order to try to gain public support and to stir up public outrage.
> 
> I'm not taking sides on Zimmerman being guilty or not guilty, but at this point I don't see how he can get a fair trial when the President has obviously taken sides and the Feds are working as his personal lynchmob with badges.


He answered a question posed to him by reporters. As did Santorum and Mittens, with basically the same answer.

I guess you won't support them either.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

California Girl said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I notice you didnt touch my question...Why didnt they test the shooter?  Isnt that SOP? or is this where you start up with the "I dont knows"?


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



I'll repeat...Fanning the flames of what?  Dead Kids?  Trying to insult me is not addressing the topic.   Sharpton was asked to be there.  Problem with the families wishes?  Why?


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## rightwinger (Mar 23, 2012)

MaryL said:


> I add this to the list of terrible things that we humans do to each other...This poor kid should be alive. But, all the hollering and childish tantrums being thrown on this issue by blacks are counter productive. I think most whites and certainly the media are overly sensitive to events like this... If this had this been a white kid murdered by blacks,  it would be ignored and downplayed.  Any one here doubt that for a second?  Whites get victimized by blacks all the time. I can speak from personal experience. What about  that high black crime rate? What about  black crime against whites? They can  construed as racial /hate crimes.  But that  rarely happens.  If we are going to be realistic here, everyone everywhere should be  an activist to stop  any hate   crimes, not just  blacks. But there is only concern when  it happens to a black person, but blacks should be just as pissed off when innocent whites are killed by a black person. Then we might a have solidarity  on  this issue.



Whites do get murdered by blacks all the time, but blacks are filling our prisons. They do not get sent home after a murder with a pat on the back

I think the whole thing was a tragic mistake. But one person was innocent and the other was overstepping his bounds. Carrying a gun is a constitutional right   But that right comes with certain responsibilities. Zimmerman pushed the confrontation, his responsibility was to follow the kid and then report him. Because of his mishandling of the situation, a kid ended up dead. 

Was it murder?  I don't think so
Manslaughter?  based on the investigation, it very well may be


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## Peach (Mar 23, 2012)

Againsheila said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > The way people are politicizing this tragedy that never shouldve happened is sickening. With the evidence we as those on the outside looking in should, to any reasonable person, show you Zimmerman should at the very least be charged and put on trial. You've got Al Sharptongue out there leeching off the situation and a bunch of assholes trying to link this to the Stand Your Ground law in FL and bringing up the banning of guns. The guy obviously went after the kid and started the whole thing. I don't have any respect for these people trying to promote their pet causes piggy backing off the unnecessary death of a young man.
> ...



How does Sharpton's appearance negate a POSSIBLE murder? And do all African Americans in the US have the authority to "get rid of" Al Sharpton?  Can ALL Caucasion Americans GET RID of David Duke?


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## Againsheila (Mar 23, 2012)

Peach said:


> Againsheila said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



I apologize for the way I phrased it.  What blacks should do is disown Sharpton and not let him in any way represent them.  And yes, whites should do the same for Duke.  I sure don't want him representing me...of course, I've never seen Duke parade and cry racism against whites when a white is killed by a black, and I've certainly never seen him defending a false cry of rape from a white woman against a team of black players, have you?


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


Yes, that seems to be the case - that Zimmerman had no fear at the time he left his vehicle.  I beleive that any reasonable person would think that.

However, at the time he came into contact with Martin, that may have changed.


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## Too Tall (Mar 23, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



According to the police report the back of Zimmerman's shirt was wet and had a lot of grass on it, and he had blood on his face as well as on the back of his head and was given first aid at the scene by an EMT.  SOMEONE, perhaps a 17 year old that played football, knocked Zimmerman on his ass and started to punch him out after he stopped running away.  

That is clearly "confrontation."


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



CC I'm not insulting you, you were praising him, holding him up as a hero. Take issue with yourself if you take issue with my description of your posts about Sharpton.

I've explained as much as I need to. The fact you are acting oblivious to the point doesn't negate the point made, bro.

I'm sure we both want justice in this case. Let's not argue about this, fair?


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 23, 2012)

LockeJaw said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > LockeJaw said:
> ...



I applaud Sharpton for getting involved at the request of the Family.  Saying so isnt worship or making him a hero.  

I notice that a lot of you guys say things and when pressed further cannot explain the words you type.  If Sharpton is fanning the flames as you said, what Flames is he fanning?

You said it then when asked what do you mean...you dont want to talk about it.  Thats what happens when you make accusations that you cant back.


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## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Zimmerman never knew this kid before he saw him so this is not stalking.
> Not condoning what he did in any way if there was no attack from the kid.


No, it isn't stalking. Regardless, he was following Martin so that pretty much kills his defense that he was in fear of his life.


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## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


True enough, but that doesn't really change the fact that Zimmerman was the aggressor, if it happened that Zimmerman was following Martin, then Martin had every right to go on the offensive.


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## Si modo (Mar 23, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


Oh, in my book, too.  I see nothing wrong with confronting someone who you believe is following you.  And, it appears that Martin did, according to the statement from his girlfriend.

I just really wish this law had never been on the books.


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

*So far, what we know for a fact is Trayvon Martin initiated a verbal confrontation.*


Too Tall said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



So far, what we know for a fact is Trayvon Martin initiated a verbal confrontation.


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



So far, what we know for a fact is Trayvon Martin initiated a verbal confrontation.


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## Ravi (Mar 23, 2012)

Dante said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Yes, dear, and I know that makes it a-okay that he was shot in cold blood...asking, why are you following me, and all.

Shall I give you the address to the street I live on so I can do the same?


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## LockeJaw (Mar 23, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> LockeJaw said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...


*face palm*


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## Dante (Mar 23, 2012)

I apologize for Hawk and Ravi taking this thread off topic.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 24, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Most probably agree that the law sucks, but it IS the law.  As you can see above, the cops could not legally arrest Zimmerman.



This is utter bullshit.  In order to believe this, we would have to believe that the intent of the legislature was to grant Zimmerman special privileges that nobody else would possess.  Zimmerman would have to have to have a special prioritization of his personal right to "self defense" that allowed him to chase down and corner other people, without that person having a right to self defense or to feel threatened by circumstances that a reasonable person would find threatening.  It would have to grant Zimmerman special privileges that apparently would not apply to others, to *create* tense situations, and then respond with deadly force.

Stand your ground doctrine has NEVER meant that person has the right to pursue an allegedly dangerous situation, and then respond with deadly force.  Your theory would require us to believe that the intent of the legislature was to not create a stand your ground law, but to create something entirely different and new, something that would be more appropriately be called a "walking into the fire" law.



> Everyone is equal under the law, no matter how much we don't like the person or the law.  And, we apply the CURRENT law to everyone.



Except Trayvon Martin, apparently.  Zimmerman admitted that he was following Martin.  He chased him down, don't you think a 17 year old kid would be feel threatened?  Even if we assume that Martin threw the first proverbial punch, the idea that Zimmerman's actions were justified as self defense would require that we condemn Martin's actions as wrong and legally unjustified.  Which, then, means that we are not applying stand your ground rights to Martin, only to Zimmerman.

It is absolutely insane to believe that the intent of the legislature was to create a law that allows a person, like Zimmerman, to create a situation that provokes a person like Martin to evoke his own self defense rights, and then use that as a basis to justify killing Martin in Zimmerman's own "self defense."


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## Si modo (Mar 24, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Most probably agree that the law sucks, but it IS the law.  As you can see above, the cops could not legally arrest Zimmerman.
> ...


What chase?

What cornering?

What personal law?

Read the actual law and the actual police report (both linked to numerous times in this thread by me and others).  Believing what others tell you without thinking for yourself is making you look like a fool.


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



There are quite a few more facts than that.  Like Zimmerman being asked not to follow the kid and him lying saying he won't.  So now it is a fact that Zimmerman is a liar.


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## editec (Mar 24, 2012)

Gun queer accidently_ on purpose_ shoots a little boy.

There's your whole story in a nutshell.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 24, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Zimmerman would have to have to have a special prioritization of his personal right to "self defense" that allowed him to chase down and corner other people,



Shit-for-brains lynch mob thinks Zimmerman chased down and cornered the black?  How could a fat slob chase down a 6' black buck in his prime?  Cornered where, in the wide open?  Regardless of how stupid your speculation is, it's still only your speculation.

The victim, Mr. Zimmerman, says he was attacked from behind.  All the physical evidence and statements from the witnesses support that.  In this country, unlike black shit-hole countries, we've got something called Innocent Until Proven Guilty.  Now, if you want to find someone to lynch, find someone casing your neighborhood.



> Zimmerman admitted that he was following Martin.  He chased him down, don't you think a 17 year old kid would be feel threatened?



And, what would that black animal do, after feeling threatened?  He didn't run, obviously.  What does that leave?  Attacking the person he thinks is following him.  



> Even if we assume that Martin threw the first proverbial punch, the idea that Zimmerman's actions were justified as self defense would require that we condemn Martin's actions as wrong and legally unjustified.  Which, then, means that we are not applying stand your ground rights to Martin, only to Zimmerman.



Attacking someone for following you is far from shooting someone who is physically assaulting you.  The black always had the option of running, if not ignoring Zimmerman.  You can't ignore someone physically assaulting you and Zimmerman didn't have the option to run.


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## Si modo (Mar 24, 2012)

Sarah G said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


I just listened to recordings of Zimmerman on the phone with 911.  I do not hear him telling the operator that he will not pursue Martin.

I hear this:

911 Operator:  Are you following him?

Zimmerman:  Yeah.

911 Operator:  OK.  We don't need you to do that.

Zimmerman (delayed):  OK.

I don't see that as Zimmerman telling the 911 operator that he will not pursue Martin.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

What I find amazing is the ignorance people here have on the law.
Arresting someone does not mean a damn thing. An arrest is nothing as they can make bail without an indictment fairly easily especially when the investigation is not complete where the crime lab reports are not back. 
The grand jury indictment is what matters sports. Time for all of you to go back to 8th grade and learn just a little bit about civics, the law and The Constitution.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

He was never told NOT to persue him and he NEVER told the 911 operator he wasn't going to.
Those were media reports and statements from the lawyers.
And guess what, they were lies.
Imagine that, people getting their information from media and it is incorrect.
Best to leave these things to the professionals.


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## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Amelia said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



First of all, during the 9-11 call, Zimmerman only made note of the person's identity, be it his clothes worn and etc. (including his color) to the 9-11 operator, when the supspicious person began walking toward Zimmerman (coming closer and closer to him), and I guess this was in order to check Zimmerman out as well when he (Trayvon) had noticed Zimmerman watching him and his actions in the area, whom Zimmerman was observing this individual whom looked suspicious while walking in the area. Infact Zimmerman made the call to 9-11 before knowing the color of the individual, because when the 9-11 operator asked Zimmerman the description of the individual, Zimmerman had to wait until the person began to come toward him to give it to the operator..

Can you help me understand your statement above, about Zimmerman having "issues with black men" ?  Do we know for sure that the results wouldnot have been the same, if it would had been a white kid walking in a hoodie, and looking suspicious to Zimmerman by his actions as well (i.e. Zimmerman operating in the area, because there had been known break in's recently) so he was there on watch to look for supsicious individuals, that may fit a profile in his mind that meets the standards of a suspicious looking individual, and then here comes Trayvon sadly looking suspect and fitting the profile in his mind. 

Sadly a large majority of citizens whom number many, do have also in their minds in America, the same thinking, but why ???? I will try and answer as best I can next.. 

Could it be that it's because when crimes are committed, there seems to be a dress code for criminals in which they adopt in large part of, and because MTV and other shows glorify a culture of thugs, drugs and unethical behaviours being found within our youth these days, in which is drilled deep into the mind (skewing the ability for average citizens to just trust anyone anymore)??? It all makes for a traggic situation in America, that then leads in so many instances, to mis-perceptions and mis-interpretations, and then on to cases just like this one sadly enough.... Once teens take on that rebellion or rebellious look, in which a majority of criminals love to sport about when committing crime in America, then the mis-trust created in it all can have traggic and dire consequences sadly enough if not careful. 

The devil is the author of confusion, and he is doing a splended job in confusing and skewing the lines so badly these days, that it is inevitable that these kinds of situations will be on the rise in America, insteaded of on the decline in America, that's if America doesn't get a handle on what is making America a ticking time bomb anymore, thus leaning backwards and not leaning foward.

America, just look at yourself, and then just ask yourself, what have you done that has created this situation and many others we are now dealing with ???

I think that glorifying thug wear in America is a major fail, and notice how we see the pic of the kid wearing the football jersy, instead of a hoodie ? Now why do you think they had to put that apple pie pic up after the traggic event? It's because it is something that all in America can relate to, and then see as a positive, thus pulling on America's heart string for the boy in the case instantly, in which is good and very smart thinking on the families part, but what if they would have put a pic up of the boy wearing thug wear, would the results and sympothy's upon first learning of the case be the same you reckon ? Just think about that for a second or two. 

This is why so many cases in America go wrong, and sometimes for some get buried, because all depending on how these cases are presented, it defintley can determin the outcomes and sympothy's of the public in each case, especially if it is done just right.... 

Note how Zimmerman looks so shifty and suspect in his pic's, and the boy looks the part of such an innocent kid in that jersy (even had Obama saying that the kid looked like he could be his son) ? Does not Zimmerman have any family who would be representing him, and for whom would be wanting to create a profile of their boy in a positive light, just as the family has done for the victim here ? Undoubtedly not..

I am not siding with Zimmerman at all (trust me), because I am one who looks at the evidence and not the wear in which the two have been presented in for specific reasoning.. I am just one who has a problem with blanket statements, that throw racist accusations into the mix, when they might not apply according to the evidence... Do you have evidence that Zimmerman had problems with blackmen in general as you have stated ?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



You are speaking reason and common sense.
But since you do not side with Al Sharpton, the train wreck media and mob promoters you are a racist.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

Latest is Zimmerman has a broken nose and lacerations on his head.
I am sure he did those to himself later to make it appear Martin did it.


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## paperview (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Latest is Zimmerman has a broken nose and lacerations on his head.
> I am sure he did those to himself later to make it appear Martin did it.


All the police report stated was he had a bloody nose and blood on the back of his head,  and it was treated immediately and quickly by the Fire Dept. on the scene.

If you have further information than that, please show it.

We know is there was blood.  Hell, it could have even been the victims.  Gun shot wounds draw blood.  So does a punch that a 250 pound man might have whopped on Trayvon.   

We don't know though cause the stupid assed cops here didn't bother to get a blood sample or do most  of the basics you do when a homicide happens.

No. They let him go.


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## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


Did the (((Ok))) mean that Zimmerman stopped following at that point ? If he did (inwhich we don't know that), then did Trayvon turn and walk towards Zimmerman again, thus the physical struggle part of it began? You see, we don't know these things until the indictment and then the trial right ?


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## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Amelia said:
> ...


I had to do some spell checking and a few corrections, and adds to the original...Hmmmm I may want to re-post if read again my original posting...Thanks, and yes I do agree with there being a mob mentaility now, that is being found in this case, and it is a problem, where as people don't allow the case to be reviewed properly when have this mentality, and the accusations are just all over the place by so many now, that how will a fair trial ever ensue as a result of ??


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## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Amelia said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


 This was directed at the person who made the statement about Zimmerman having problems with blackmen in general...
I had to re-post due to spelling and some add on's...Thanks


----------



## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > You open a thread.   People are going to post.
> ...



Ah Dante starts threatening.  How clever!  How cute!    It is clear your objective here is nothing more than to paint blacks as victims of the white man's law.


----------



## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> The Federal investigation will center on a possible civil rights violation/hate crime, likely under the Matthew Shepard/James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2009.
> 
> The alleged racial epithet would be key to such an investigation.
> 
> ...



So tell me, when a bunch of blacks in Nashville brutally raped a white teacher when they broke in her house to rob her, did it _become_ a 'hate crime' when one of them said 'I'm not leaving until I get me some of that white pussy?'  I guess that was a LUV crime!


----------



## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> I apologize for Hawk and Ravi taking this thread off topic.



Make some more threats.  Maybe it will work this time.


----------



## theHawk (Mar 24, 2012)

Ravi said:


> theHawk said:
> 
> 
> > Pretty sickening that the President of the United States has latched onto this in order to try to gain public support and to stir up public outrage.
> ...



The difference is they aren't trying to benefit off a black kid's death.

Remember the motto of the Hussein administration is: "You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before." - Rahm Emanuel.

All Obama sees is an opportunity, to stir up the black voters and get them to think he is on their side, even though he has done nothing for them as they still have the highest unemployment rate in decades.

Its right out of the community agitator playbook.  Its the only thing Obama has since he cannot run on his own record of absolute failure.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 24, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Shit-for-brains lynch mob



If you are going to talk to a shit-for-brains lynch mob, don't quote me.  My posts are well too thorough and well thought out to deal with such intellectual ineptitude.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 24, 2012)

Ariux said:


> The black always had the option of running, if not ignoring Zimmerman.



1.  He did run away, and Zimmerman caught up to him again.

2.  You just proved my point.  How can the same FL law allow Zimmerman to chase after Martin and then use deadly force, but then require Martin to run away?  You're completely ignoring Martin's rights.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 24, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



Do you see now that Zimmerman did indeed chase after Martin, and that according to Zimmerman's own words Martin was trying to evade Zimmerman?


----------



## Si modo (Mar 24, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Sarah G said:
> ...


Ummmm, yeah.  I've known that for days.

Your point?


----------



## Rinata (Mar 24, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Rinata said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



He had nothing to fear from Martin. The police found a man, with a gun, that outweighed the dead man on the ground by 100 pounds. The dead man had candy, tea, and a cell phone. It was murder, plain and simple. That's against the law. Trying to use that ridiculous law on the books in Florida is a joke and you know it. Zimmerman was the one that broke the law and should have been arrested.

Even Zimmerman's lawyer has said said Florida's "stand your ground" law doesn't apply to the shooting that killed the unarmed teen.

"In my legal opinion, that's not really applicable to this case. The statute on 'stand your ground' is primarily when you're in your house," said Craig Sonner, attorney for George Zimmerman.

Zimmerman's lawyer: 'Stand your ground' doesn't apply in Trayvon Martin case - CNN.com


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## Rinata (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Rinata said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



What is your friggin' point???


----------



## Rinata (Mar 24, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Fellow Citizens:
> 
> There has been a lot of media attention to the recent incident where George Zimmerman shot and
> killed Trayvon Martin. This is indeed a tragic situation and has caused a flood of questions and
> ...



I don't like that little twit Bonaparte. I give no credence to anything he says.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

paperview said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Latest is Zimmerman has a broken nose and lacerations on his head.
> ...



"didn't bother to get a blood sample or do most of the basics you do when a homicide happens"
Where did you get your POST training?
How many homicide investigations have you conducted.
I have over 200 and counting. 
You do not know what they did or didn't do and have no training in any of this.
Your opinion is noted and you have a right to one but all you have is opinion only.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

The Stand Your Ground statute will not apply in this case is my opinion but I have read and reviewed the statute and the applicable standing with other rulings and case law and I believe Zimmerman has NO standing of immunity under that statute. PERIOD.
He will not need to.
Zimmerman's statement to police has also been leaked. He stated that as he was returning to his truck after giving up his following of Martin as Martin had evaded him he was all of a sudden attacked out of no where and hit in the back of the head with an object and also the nose.
Not claiming any of this is true but this tells me the defense WILL NOT be the stand your ground defense.
The case will be defended SOLEY on self defense, period.
Watch and see. 
Not claiming that it was self defense or that anything he claims is true but wait and see.
That will be the defense and if the physical evidence at the scene matches this and there is no other evidence to dispute it then this is a jury material fact issue of reasonable doubt.
I still see this as a plea to voluntary manslaughter-some form of a lesser homicide. 
Those that claim this is a Murder 1 gunslinging do not have much experience in these matters and are shooting from the hip because of emotion, no pun intended.
Of course this is ALL speculation no matter what all you amateur jurists and junior detectives claim here.


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## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Ariux said:
> 
> 
> > The black always had the option of running, if not ignoring Zimmerman.
> ...


Martin either ran away or walked away ? Big difference in the two, and this all depending on what is trying to be implied... Setting the scene without witnesses to coaberate these little introduced points, can lead the audience astray, and feed the mob mentality if that is what the results are due to speaking in these ways.

Did Martin run away or walk away, and did Zimmerman run after him or walk to keep up with him, in order to keep survielance on him until the cops got there ??? Did Martin Run, and did Zimmerman give chase (i.e. as in run also) ?


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## PredFan (Mar 24, 2012)

It is my belief, based solely on a hunch, that the State Attourney will announce that after extensive investigation, Zimmerman's story isthe only one that fits the facts and the witness testimony, and there for the state will not be pressing charges.

I think that that is the reason Zimmerman has still not been arrested, and right now they are trying to figure out how to tell Al Sharpton and his lynch mob this without causeing rioting in the streets.


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> It is my belief, based solely on a hunch, that the State Attourney will announce that after extensive investigation, Zimmerman's story isthe only one that fits the facts and the witness testimony, and there for the state will not be pressing charges.
> 
> I think that that is the reason Zimmerman has still not been arrested, and right now they are trying to figure out how to tell Al Sharpton and his lynch mob this without causeing rioting in the streets.



The VICTIM'S friends statements about the VICTIM:

Slain teen

Yes, I am off topic but the life of Trayvon Martin seems to matter less than the "history" of the KILLER.


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



About the Prosecutor who will present the case to the Grand Jury:

Prosecutor in Trayvon Martin case vows 'blank slate' - CNN.com


----------



## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The Stand Your Ground statute will not apply in this case is my opinion but I have read and reviewed the statute and the applicable standing with other rulings and case law and I believe Zimmerman has NO standing of immunity under that statute. PERIOD.
> He will not need to.
> Zimmerman's statement to police has also been leaked. He stated that as he was returning to his truck after giving up his following of Martin as Martin had evaded him he was all of a sudden attacked out of no where and hit in the back of the head with an object and also the nose.
> Not claiming any of this is true but this tells me the defense WILL NOT be the stand your ground defense.
> ...


Yep, when it all enters the justice system and the court room, all points will be investigated thoroughly and entirely hopefully... What will be interesting, is when the facts of the case are found to be different from the mob mentality's ideas or thinking on the case to some degree right now, what will be said then?,  The mob may have a broader purpose and agenda involved here (or) is just as confused as anyone, but if their ideas and accusations were to somehow stick, in which they have prior to a courtroom showdown, and it were all to go it's way somehow, then where will justice on that day be for America ? 

What is the bigger picture here I wonder, when accusations fly according to a possible bigger and broader agenda to be involved, where as a case may have enough fotter to fan the flames of an overall agenda, so it is now looked at to be used as such by those who are looking for more than actually exist within the evidence of the case, and all for their agenda ? Becareful America, and stick to the evidence and facts found within the case only, and not let yourself be led into a confused period, where a bigger agenda could be involved by some whom have an agenda related to a bigger picture. I do hope that justice is served always, and that Martins death will be settled properly and righteously in the case, or even that Zimmermans innocence due to his claim of self defense will be found in the case as well also maybe. The main thing is that justice be served for the situation, and not for an agenda if so be the case as is orchastrated by some, whom do hope to sway the mob or fan the flames of a mob mentality.


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

> But one man's testimony could be key for the police.
> 
> "The guy on the bottom who had a red sweater on was yelling to me: 'help, help&#8230;and I told him to stop and I was calling 911," he said.
> Trayvon Martin was in a hoodie; Zimmerman was in red.
> ...





> Sanford police on Thursday also challenged a WFTV-Channel 9 report, in which *Mary Cutcher said police largely ignored her even though she told them, "I know this was not self-defense. There was no punching, no hitting going on at the time, no wrestling.*"
> 
> *Police said they twice tried to interview her without success*, and the third time, she wrote a very short sworn statement for her roommate that was consistent with Zimmerman's account.
> 
> George Zimmerman's father on Trayvon Martin: My son is not racist, did not confront Trayvon Martin - South Florida Sun-Sentinel.com





> "I asked the subject in the red jacket, later identified as George Zimmerman (who was original caller for the suspicious person complaint), if he had seen the subject. Zimmerman stated that he had shot the subject and was still armed. Zimmerman complied with all of my verbal commands and was secured in handcuffs. Located on the inside of Zimmerman's waist band, I removed a black Kel Tek 9mm PF9 semi auto handgun and holster. While I was in such close contact with Zimmerman, I could observe that his back appeared to be wet and was covered in grass, as if he had been laying on his back on the ground. Zimmerman was also bleeding from the nose and back of his head."
> 
> "Zimmerman was placed in the rear of my police vehicle and was given first aid by the SFD. While the SFD was attending to Zimmerman, I over heard[sic] him state "I was yelling for someone to help me, but no one would help me." At no point did I question Zimmerman about the incident that had taken place. Once Zimmerman was cleared by the SFD, he was transported to the Sanford Police Department."



we have three sources from media that show Zimmerman's version on things to be credible versus the version of distraught parents and busybodies like Ravi and other whack-a-doodles @ USMB


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

"At no point did I question Zimmerman about the incident that had taken place." 

How is this a credible version?


----------



## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > It is my belief, based solely on a hunch, that the State Attourney will announce that after extensive investigation, Zimmerman's story isthe only one that fits the facts and the witness testimony, and there for the state will not be pressing charges.
> ...



Every thug I have ever seen on TV has 'friends' and 'family' who will go on camera and vouch for 'what a good boy' he was!  You are too simple minded to be on a discussion forum, and you have no command of the English language.


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> It is my belief, based solely on a hunch, that the State Attourney will announce that after extensive investigation, Zimmerman's story isthe only one that fits the facts and the witness testimony, and there for the state will not be pressing charges.
> 
> I think that that is the reason Zimmerman has still not been arrested, and right now they are trying to figure out how to tell Al Sharpton and his lynch mob this without causeing rioting in the streets.


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > It is my belief, based solely on a hunch, that the State Attourney will announce that after extensive investigation, Zimmerman's story isthe only one that fits the facts and the witness testimony, and there for the state will not be pressing charges.
> ...




This office handled the autopsy which will also be evidence:

Medical Examiner


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



Thank you for this critique. My typing skills are as bad as my spelling.


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > It is my belief, based solely on a hunch, that the State Attourney will announce that after extensive investigation, Zimmerman's story isthe only one that fits the facts and the witness testimony, and there for the state will not be pressing charges.
> ...



friends?   every time somebody gets in trouble their friends are revealed to be clueless


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



The fact that victim had no criminal record is also irrelevant? The killer's record is deemed "clean" because he had no convictions?


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



State Attorney Angela B. Corey's team was scheduled to arrive Friday and begin seeking facts in a case that has garnered national attention, drawing comments from President Barack Obama.

"We don't worry about backlash from cases," Corey said Thursday after Gov. Rick Scott announced that she would lead the state investigation. "What we worry about is seeking the truth. That is our mission."

Zimmerman better hope this SA is not out to get a resume enhancer - conviction, regardless of truth. Justice is blind...


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> The fact that victim had no criminal record is also irrelevant? The killer's record is deemed "clean" because he had no convictions?



you do know you are acting like the 911 conspiracists? every answer leads to another question. 

Occam's razor: Occam's razor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Zimmerman knows the police are on the way. He knows he has a weapon on his person. The young man does not. Both know assaulting the other is a crime. Who is most likely to start a fight thinking hey can then run away free?  an older guy hitting a young man or a young man?


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...




The 4th Circuit is a conservative area of Florida; Corey, the SA, is Republican.  I hope that has no impact on her investigation. She is considered "tough" on crime.


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Zimmerman's statement to police has also been leaked.



link?


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Ariux said:
> ...



you: 

Inthemiddle:


----------



## DiamondDave (Mar 24, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



All blogs and winger links and editorials.. I will wait for the real findings and releases from the investigation.... 

And no.. I do not take what you 'heard' or what wingers post on their whims and feelings as fact


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## DiamondDave (Mar 24, 2012)

Sallow said:


> The problem was the police work. They didn't take a statement at the scene. They didn't take evidence. They let Zimmerman go. And this despite the fact a child was shot in the chest and killed.
> 
> Really, really bad police work.




 Ahhh... you have inside information from the investigation I see...


----------



## Crackerjack (Mar 24, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Uh, why did they drug test the dead kid and not the shooter?  *Ever watched CSI?*  Can you at least say that that is a strange thing to do?  Or are you rendered speechless until after a judge has banged his gavel?


  This is where I knew you were full of it.

This is about ninety percent of the problem with this whole debate.  _CSI_ &#8800; real life.

Just gotta shake my head at that.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Zimmerman's statement to police has also been leaked.
> ...



Sources that take decades to develop are never linked.

I believe that you will hear this tonight or by tomorrow. CNN out of Atlanta will have it up soon.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

http://www.cnninsession.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/martinpolicreport.pdf

this is the police report
"Zimmerman bleeding from the nose and the back of the head"
I am sure the police did not make this up at the scene.
this is the redacted version. The entire version non redacted has been requested and probably will be out Monday.
However, this has everything in it.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

Three witnesses at the scene and interviewed by the police.
Probably why there was no arrest. 
See sports fans, you will not get any of this from the Shake down King Sharpton and the mob mentality.


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

*Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin*

What happened with this, and what does the progressive left say about this particular Militia group?

Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin - Crimesider - CBS News


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



I'm wondering what happened with the Militia group that attempted a citizen's arrest of Zimmerman. What do the nitwits here have to say about this?


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

> A person who makes a citizen's arrest could risk exposing him or herself to possible lawsuits or criminal charges (such as charges of impersonating police, false imprisonment, kidnapping, or wrongful arrest) if the wrong person is apprehended or a suspect's civil rights are violated.[citation needed] This is especially so when police forces are attempting to determine who an aggressor is.



Citizen's arrest - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I say go ahead!  I hope he's waiting for them with an uzi.


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> > A person who makes a citizen's arrest could risk exposing him or herself to possible lawsuits or criminal charges (such as charges of impersonating police, false imprisonment, kidnapping, or wrongful arrest) if the wrong person is apprehended or a suspect's civil rights are violated.[citation needed] This is especially so when police forces are attempting to determine who an aggressor is.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Zimmerman might wish to do so. The March 16th story appears to be a loudmouth yapping however. Zimmerman remains free, alive, and able to purchase any firearms allowed by law, as of today.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > > A person who makes a citizen's arrest could risk exposing him or herself to possible lawsuits or criminal charges (such as charges of impersonating police, false imprisonment, kidnapping, or wrongful arrest) if the wrong person is apprehended or a suspect's civil rights are violated.[citation needed] This is especially so when police forces are attempting to determine who an aggressor is.
> ...



Why not?  He hasn't been convicted of any crime.   The black militia group really should read up on Florida's Stand Your Ground Law because there's no authority for a citizen's arrest and Zimmerman could blow each and every one of them away.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Why would they need to drug test Zimmerman?   Did he deny he shot the kid?


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> > A person who makes a citizen's arrest could risk exposing him or herself to possible lawsuits or criminal charges (such as charges of impersonating police, false imprisonment, kidnapping, or wrongful arrest) if the wrong person is apprehended or a suspect's civil rights are violated.[citation needed] This is especially so when police forces are attempting to determine who an aggressor is.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



really? I would hope the authorities are doing their jobs. Zimmerman should be under surveillance for his own protection and that of the community. 
*
Zimmerman under surveillance?*


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## PredFan (Mar 24, 2012)

It's rediculous to even mention testing Zimmerman for drugs or achohol.


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > > A person who makes a citizen's arrest could risk exposing him or herself to possible lawsuits or criminal charges (such as charges of impersonating police, false imprisonment, kidnapping, or wrongful arrest) if the wrong person is apprehended or a suspect's civil rights are violated.[citation needed] This is especially so when police forces are attempting to determine who an aggressor is.
> ...



LOL.  Yeah right.  The police chief quit a couple of days ago.  Anyone who attempts to 'protect' Zimmerman will be hauled out and lynched.  No one with any balls is going to stand up in this case.  And if it ever does get to a jury, no one who wants to live to be old will vote not guilty.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> *Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin*
> 
> What happened with this, and what does the progressive left say about this particular Militia group?
> 
> Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin - Crimesider - CBS News



Nothing to say about that group.

Don't know Florida law. In some states citizen's arrests are legal - and in some states the citizens may even form a grand jury and indict on their own.

If it happened in my state and it was legal to do so, I'd be all for it. Only a lunatic would suggest that a grand jury should not be presented the evidence to decide if he should be charged.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 24, 2012)

Guess lynch-mobs aren't passe.


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Guess lynch-mobs aren't passe.
> ..........snip



Bu...bu...bu... lynch mobs are white!


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Guess lynch-mobs aren't passe.
> ...



Nice race baiting.


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > > A person who makes a citizen's arrest could risk exposing him or herself to possible lawsuits or criminal charges (such as charges of impersonating police, false imprisonment, kidnapping, or wrongful arrest) if the wrong person is apprehended or a suspect's civil rights are violated.[citation needed] This is especially so when police forces are attempting to determine who an aggressor is.
> ...



No arrest; and  Zimmerman has the opportunity to have any firearm he can get his paws on.  The killing of Martin was with any automatic firearm; it appears Zimmerman is well versed in this area.


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> The police chief quit a couple of days ago.  Anyone who attempts to 'protect' Zimmerman will be hauled out and lynched.  No one with any balls is going to stand up in this case.  And if it ever does get to a jury, no one who wants to live to be old will vote not guilty.









the leftists aren't the only kooks posting on this subject


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Sunshine said:
> ...



The "militia" should disband; Zimmerman can do as he pleases. He "Sure got that right". 

LYNYRD SKYNYRD LYRICS - You Got That Right


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## PredFan (Mar 24, 2012)

I believe that the group in question is the New Black Panthers. They are asking for a group of 5000 volunteers to find and capture Zimmerman, and a reward of $10k to the person who does.

Biggest racist group in history. Makes the Klan look like saints.


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> I believe that the group in question is the New Black Panthers. They are asking for a group of 5000 volunteers to find and capture Zimmerman, and a reward of $10k to the person who does.
> 
> Biggest racist group in history. Makes the Klan look like saints.



Najee Muhammad, a member of the *New Black Liberation Militia*, announced Thursday that members of the group plan to take the 28-year-old Zimmerman to federal authorities since local police haven't acted. - from link in OP  - There is no mention of citizen's arrests in Florida's criminal statutes but state courts have cited common law in establishing when such an arrest can be made. The crime has to be a felony. It has to be witnessed by the citizen making the arrest or the citizen has to have probable cause that the person being arrested is guilty of a felony.

are some militias created more than equal?


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > The police chief quit a couple of days ago.  Anyone who attempts to 'protect' Zimmerman will be hauled out and lynched.  No one with any balls is going to stand up in this case.  And if it ever does get to a jury, no one who wants to live to be old will vote not guilty.
> ...



I don't see _your_ face out there protecting him.


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> I believe that the group in question is the New Black Panthers. They are asking for a group of 5000 volunteers to find and capture Zimmerman, and a reward of $10k to the person who does.
> 
> Biggest racist group in history. Makes the Klan look like saints.



I hope there are 5000 uzis waiting for them.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> Makes the Klan look like saints.



You're right, there were numerous Saints which had people executed - often in cruel and inhumane ways - for not being the right religion. It is very similar.


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> I believe that the group in question is the New Black Panthers. They are asking for a group of 5000 volunteers to find and capture Zimmerman, and a reward of $10k to the person who does.
> 
> Little community support for the NBP; the Southern Poverty Law Center, among others, have denounced the group:
> ________________________________________________
> ...


----------



## PredFan (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > I believe that the group in question is the New Black Panthers. They are asking for a group of 5000 volunteers to find and capture Zimmerman, and a reward of $10k to the person who does.
> ...


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > Makes the Klan look like saints.
> ...



It was the saints that were executed in some cruel, inhumane and innovative ways.  

10 Excruciating Martyrdoms of Early Christianity - Oddee.com (saint hippolytus)

This doesn't include the Christians murdered today for their faith.


----------



## PredFan (Mar 24, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



ZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz................................

Wake me up when you have something relevant to say.


----------



## Salt Jones (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> *Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin*
> 
> What happened with this, and what does the progressive left say about this particular Militia group?
> 
> Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin - Crimesider - CBS News



Must be a group of sovereign citizens.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Some NBP followers will get drugged up, drunked up, and go on the hunt.  Completely forgetting that Florida still has a stand your ground law, Zimmerman still has his gun(s) and with this kind of publicity he can rack up quite a body count and STILL not be charged with a crime.

That leaves the general riot.  Burn homes and businesses, this is an election year.   We really need a good riot.


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

PredFan said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 24, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...




Thomas Moore had about a half dozen people burned alive for their religious beliefs, so its only fitting he was himself executed.

Robert Bellarmine sat in judgment of Giordano Bruno and concurred with the decision to put him to death for his religion.

Sorry but there are numerous examples of "Saints" who had no problem with putting people to death merely for professing a different faith. That's about the moral equivalent of a KKK lynching if you ask me.


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > *Militia group to attempt citizen's arrest in Fla. shooting of Trayvon Martin*
> ...



A rather small group of haters. they denounce violence then offer rewards for kidnapping......


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



They are also pretty gutless.  Otherwise, they would have done it by now.  Notice how the self-styled leaders ask for someone else to do something they are unwilling to do themselves.


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Also notice Dante started this thread with an article from March 16th. No reports of recruitment in Jacksonville yet.


----------



## Salt Jones (Mar 24, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Must be white supremacists.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 24, 2012)

> Najee Muhammad, a member of the New Black Liberation Militia, announced Thursday that members of the group plan to take the 28-year-old Zimmerman to federal authorities since local police haven't acted


Uh-huh  on what charge? 

Where will he be booked and arraigned? Who will set bond and a court date? 

Idiots.


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## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > Najee Muhammad, a member of the New Black Liberation Militia, announced Thursday that members of the group plan to take the 28-year-old Zimmerman to federal authorities since local police haven't acted
> 
> 
> Uh-huh  on what charge?
> ...



IF they can come up with the $10,000, they will try to "arrest". Media wh*res.


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## FuelRod (Mar 24, 2012)

Just wondering where these "New" Black Panthers are offering rewards and attempting citizens arrests when there is a bystander shot in a gang related (read as black on black) crime?
They're a hate group.  Simple as that.


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## California Girl (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> > I believe that the group in question is the New Black Panthers. They are asking for a group of 5000 volunteers to find and capture Zimmerman, and a reward of $10k to the person who does.
> ...



I'm quietly confident that citing a newspaper article misstating facts does not amount to 'probable cause'. Anyone who attempts a 'citizens arrest' is likely to end up charged with unlawful detainment, and possibly kidnapping charges. That is assuming they hand him over alive.... if not, well, that would be first degree murder, I suspect. 

Overall, not a very smart move by the NBP.


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## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

FuelRod said:


> Just wondering where these "New" Black Panthers are offering rewards and attempting citizens arrests when there is a bystander shot in a gang related (read as black on black) crime?
> They're a hate group.  Simple as that.



New Black Liberation Militia,


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > PredFan said:
> ...



This sounds like some small group of idiots


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## mudwhistle (Mar 24, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > Najee Muhammad, a member of the New Black Liberation Militia, announced Thursday that members of the group plan to take the 28-year-old Zimmerman to federal authorities since local police haven't acted
> 
> 
> Uh-huh  on what charge?
> ...



Now you're seeing what I've been talking about all week.......this garbage brings out the idiots. 

My nephew lives there and he's in the middle of all of this shit.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 24, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Uh, why did they drug test the dead kid and not the shooter?  *Ever watched CSI?*  Can you at least say that that is a strange thing to do?  Or are you rendered speechless until after a judge has banged his gavel?
> ...



Since I never said CSI equals real life that IS the problem with this debate.  You keep changing what I'm saying to score points.

I notice that you keep ignoring that they drug tested a dead kid and not the shooter.  Go head tell everyone how the CSI thing made you forget about all those other sentences around it.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 24, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Why would they need to drug test Zimmerman?   Did he deny he shot the kid?




Did Martin deny he was dead?


----------



## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > > Najee Muhammad, a member of the New Black Liberation Militia, announced Thursday that members of the group plan to take the 28-year-old Zimmerman to federal authorities since local police haven't acted
> ...



Sorry to hear that, mud.


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## Toddsterpatriot (Mar 24, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



Both groups are filled with low IQ losers.


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

According to the just now news report, the black panthers is trying to get up a mob of 5,000 to go house to house to search for Zimmerman.  Oh wow, in a state like Florida, with a mostly armed citizenry and protective laws, you know that if they are successful, this won't end well.


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



What kind of country would America be if blacks were officially running it?


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## California Girl (Mar 24, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Why would they need to drug test Zimmerman?   Did he deny he shot the kid?
> ...



What an overly emotional, and completely meaningless, response.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 24, 2012)

> Now you're seeing what I've been talking about all week.......this garbage brings out the idiots.
> 
> My nephew lives there and he's in the middle of all of this shit.


Ive been witnessing this idiocy for over 40 years  idiocy from both left and right. 

Thats the true garbage.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 24, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISN1RCxko2Q&feature=related]Extermination of white people? - YouTube[/ame]


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## Ariux (Mar 24, 2012)

It makes you wonder why we don't bring back public hangings to deal with such people as the Black Panthers.


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## Ropey (Mar 24, 2012)

Ariux said:


> It makes you wonder why we don't bring back public hangings to deal with such people as the Black Panthers.



No, it makes you wonder and seems to make others neg you for wondering such things.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Mar 24, 2012)

Let me remind everyone about the topic of this thread. 

Sharpton and the usual race baiters made this about politics. Media attention is good to keep authorities on their toes. Political attention serves no purpose other than to promote ones self. 

That is all


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



There is a black seperatist group down there that has put a 10K bounty on his head.

Hypothetical: let us say all of the witnesses state that Martin jumped Zimmerman from behind hitting him with something. Zimmerman hits and rolls over on his back and Martin breaks his nose and then Zimmerman shoots him.
Will that change the minds of the decoder ring detectives here?


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 24, 2012)

California Girl said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



Right back at cha


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 24, 2012)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Let me remind everyone about the topic of this thread.
> 
> Sharpton and the usual race baiters made this about politics. Media attention is good to keep authorities on their toes. Political attention serves no purpose other than to promote ones self.
> 
> That is all



It's not about politics no matter how much you want it to be


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## Sunshine (Mar 24, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Extermination of white people? - YouTube



'the British tried to _sterminate_.........'

'Hitler tried to _sterminate.........._'


OMG.  That's funny!


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Mar 24, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Let me remind everyone about the topic of this thread.
> ...



My perception is mine not yours, no matter how much you want it to be.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 24, 2012)

Grampa Murked U said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



Cool, but you blamed others of making it about politics...If thats your opinion cool.  If you are saying it as a statement of fact, not cool, not true.


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


basic psychology says nope

God Bless America!  I am only along for the ride.


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Extermination of white people? - YouTube
> ...



It's the thought that counts.


----------



## uscitizen (Mar 24, 2012)

All militia groups are wacko.


----------



## mudwhistle (Mar 24, 2012)

Sunshine said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Extermination of white people? - YouTube
> ...



All that's missing is gaps in his teeth and a pair of wife-beaters.


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> "At no point did I question Zimmerman about the incident that had taken place."
> 
> How is this a credible version?



The police took independent witness statements without questioning Zimmerman who was then handcuffed in the police car!   Well, that makes sense.  Before Zimmerman was questioned he'd have to be given his rights.  If the police don't want to give someone their rights at a particular point, they won't question them.


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

The witness is absolutely devastating to any dreams of prosecution.


----------



## Katzndogz (Mar 24, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



The witness said that Zimmerman was getting into his car after telling Martin that he was meeting up with the police (Zimmerman knew they were on the way) and Martin jumped him from behind hitting him in the head with the can.  

It was pretty much as you said it might have been.

If that can has a dent or blood on it, this case is o-v-e-r.


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> "At no point did I question Zimmerman about the incident that had taken place."
> 
> How is this a credible version?



it's not a _version_, it's the police report.


----------



## Old Rocks (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



Given what you have posted thus far, I am ashamed that you are a member of the human race.


----------



## Old Rocks (Mar 24, 2012)

*So a can of iced tea is more deadly than a garden hose.*

Lawful Self-Defense - Weapons - Division of Licensing, FDACS

Q. When can I use my handgun to protect myself? 

A. Florida law justifies use of deadly force when you are: 

Trying to protect yourself or another person from death or serious bodily harm; 
Trying to prevent a forcible felony, such as rape, robbery, burglary or kidnapping. 
Using or displaying a handgun in any other circumstances could result in your conviction for crimes such as improper exhibition of a firearm, manslaughter, or worse. 

Example of the kind of attack that will not justify defending yourself with deadly force: Two neighbors got into a fight, and one of them tried to hit the other by swinging a garden hose. The neighbor who was being attacked with the hose shot the other in the chest. The court upheld his conviction for aggravated battery with a firearm, because an attack with a garden hose is not the kind of violent assault that justifies responding with deadly force.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 24, 2012)

The media is using Trayvon Martin as a distraction to keep from having to report about the failed obama economy. 
It's sad the kid died
My God how many times has someone shot someone else? Some thing like this or closely similar happen at least once or twice when Bush was president

Here's one why no long term national media attention because a mother shoots and kills her children?

Authorities: Mom shot 3 children, boyfriend before killing herself - Chicago Tribune


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



get a life


----------



## Peach (Mar 24, 2012)

Dante said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > The fact that victim had no criminal record is also irrelevant? The killer's record is deemed "clean" because he had no convictions?
> ...



I am familiar with Occam's Razor; with human behavior, the simplest explanation is not always the correct one. As the victim was killed, and unarmed, one could conclude he was murdered. I do not so conclude; that is why I desire a Grand Jury presentation. Zimmerman "knowing the police" are their way is speculation as to his intent, and behavior. Zimmerman's failure to heed the advice from the individual he called at 911  might indicate his lust for violence against the "suspicious" victim was greater than any belief in police "power".  After the killing, he stayed on the spot to greet law enforcement. He appears to have felt he "did the job" for law enforcement.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 24, 2012)

> This shit is scary. Cons, libs, progressives, all get nutso where race is concerned. People forget process.
> 
> I want to start a fund for George even if he is a racist fuck. Which I don't believe.



True. 

Zimmerman may or may not be a racist, but hes likely in a world of trouble; all the more reason to provide him the most aggressive of defenses.


----------



## Crackerjack (Mar 24, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Crackerjack said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...


Yeah, you just randomly mentioned _CSI_ because you're such a big fan, right?  Must be.

Now if you'll excuse me, a repeat of _House_ is on, and I'm working on my medical degree.


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

Peach said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



lust for violence?  whooeeeeeeeeee   fruit loops


----------



## Dante (Mar 24, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > This shit is scary. Cons, libs, progressives, all get nutso where race is concerned. People forget process.
> >
> > I want to start a fund for George even if he is a racist fuck. Which I don't believe.
> 
> ...




John Adams defended British Troops ,.. and won


----------



## beagle9 (Mar 24, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> *So a can of iced tea is more deadly than a garden hose.*
> 
> Lawful Self-Defense - Weapons - Division of Licensing, FDACS
> 
> ...




Yet it all depends on how the garden hose were to be used, if it was being used to choke a person out, then I would say that doing that, could easily warrant actions that could lead to what is deemed to be self defense, and for which would easily be taken by the person being attacked in such a situation to be deadly, and all due to a fear of ones life being taken by that hose, then (yes) deadly force just may be the option in such a case, yet all depending right? 

A can (yes) can also be used as a weapon, in which if used in a certain way (hitting a person from behind in the head), causing the one who was hit to fall to the ground, where as the one who did the hit, could easily have made the person feel that their life was in mortal danger as the fight then continued, in which next resulted in deadly force being taken by the one who was struck down in such a way (especially not knowing what was used to take him down in this way).

Sadly the person hit from behind (Zimmerman), undoubtedly feared for his life as a result of such actions taken by (Trayvon), thus leaving him with no other choice as the man (Trayvon) was on top of him continuing the attack, until the gun went off, removing the threat in which turned out sadly enough, to be a case of profiling and/or mistaken identity gone wrong by Zimmerman at the start of it all, or could be found now in the entire incident maybe.

What needs to be stressed now by many parents across this nation (IMHO), and this mainly to their children in result of, is to quit helping hollywood to endorse thug wear and lifiting up a violent drug culture that loves to sport thug wear, where as these kids are associating themselves with this "wear", because they think that it is making a cool statement for themselves, and that it is soooo cool to their friends also, when sadly it is marking/stereo typing them into a situation, where people are "thinking" that they are a part of or either they are wanting to be a part of this criminal culture, when infact they (the youth) may just think that they are being cool by associating themselves to those whom think they are soooo cool and sooo bad in our society. 

They (the youth) feel that it gives them strength when they wear these clothes, just like the weekend warrior Harley riders do also, whom really don't want to be a hardcore rider for example like "The Hell's Angles" are, but rather they just love to be associated with that look, in order that people - ummmm will what maybe - "respect them more" or fear them maybe even more, and this even if they are not truly this way in life ?? Sadly for these folks, the test will come as to whether they are tuff and bad as they look, and this is where it all goes wrong in life for them sometimes, and this in a stereo typical way.

The problem is that when people take on a certain style and look, in which associates them with bad things in our soceity, then people donot know how or what to trust them with anymore, and so they can easily find themselves being mis-understood or profiled in a way in which (Trayvon) may have been mis-understood & then profiled badly in this case as well, thus leading to a traggedy in the end found between the two of them..

Why not teach our kids that the clothes in which they choose to wear, could easily paint them into a bad picture if not careful (whore has been the most problematic word used, and this when the dress code is used in this way as I remember growing up, for the girls who wanted to sport this wear) , where as we should begin to investigate what is going on at school or in the neighborhood quickly, in which may have your kid by peer pressure "wearing" clothes that you don't aprove of, and all because you have seen the thugs and druggies wearing these same clothes in which you donot aprove of, so you investigate and try and stop your kid from doing this... You don't want your kid associated with that kind of crowd or thing in their lives, and this is in order that something like this does not happen to your kid.

No, but people would rather that society change for them (sacrifice so much, even to sacrifice if one has to - their child maybe ?), and yet instead of these smaller numbers to somehow follow along better in what is deemed good in society, and to not associate or follow along with that which is deemed by many to be bad & un-trustworthy in society, their are those who would rather buck the system always, even if it means placing their own children in harms way in order to get the point across, and that is sad ya know...

Hey, you cannot change what the perceptions are, when there are so many instances that are associated with many factors during crimes, and yes the clothes are one of them that stick out when you see these video's of thugs and others in society committing crimes in our society and/or dealing drugs etc. So hey - if don't want to get profiled or stereo typed in to bad things, then it best not to be wearing thug wear, especially if you know that while in some areas in the nation, people are very afraid now of people wearing this kind of wear, because they have either had bad experiences with people wearing these types of clothes, or they have learned from TV or other stuff in their lives, that people wearing these types of clothes are usually up to no good in society, just like a person like Zimmerman thought sadly enough when tried to profile Trayvon due to his hoodie worn and crimes in the area. 

Never will peoples perceptions change on these issues, unless somehow a generation is willing to change in their hearts and minds these things in which they can change if they really want to, but the key words are "if they really want to".


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## MikeK (Mar 24, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> [...]
> 
> I think that glorifying *thug wear* in America is a major fail, and notice how we see the pic of the kid wearing the football jersey, instead of a hoodie ? Now why do you think they had to put that apple pie pic up after the tragic event? It's because it is something that all America can relate to and see as positive, thus pulling on America's heart string for the boy in the case instantly, in which is good and very smart thinking on the families part, but what if they would have put a pic up of the boy wearing thug wear, would the results and sympathy's upon first learning of the case be the same you reckon ? Just think about that for a second or two.
> 
> [...]


You've raised an important and relevant point.  So relevant in fact that Geraldo Rivera made an issue of it on his program yesterday (Friday, 3/23).  He didn't use the term _thug wear_ but he did denounce the hoodie as projecting a subtly sinister impression.    

I agree with Rivera and with you.  While I'm certain not everyone who wears a hoodie (when the weather doesn't call for it) is a gangsta or an anti-social type, that item of clothing does seem to have acquired exactly that stigma.  In support of that impression; on its popular tv program, _Caught On Camera,_ MSNBC frequently runs actual surveillance videos of armed robberies, burglaries and other criminal acts and it seems that the "perps" almost invariably are wearing hoodies -- which absolutely does make it difficult to identify them.  

When I was a teen-ager (back in the late 40s - early 50s) "pegged pants" (i.e., trousers narrowed at the cuffs) was a style that originated with street-corner "tough guy" types but quickly caught on and became a fad.  Our mother strictly forbade my brother or me to wear them.  My brother bought a pair and she raised hell.  She made him take them off and threw them in the trash.  She said they made him look like a "hoodlum."


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## Ariux (Mar 25, 2012)

MikeK said:


> While I'm certain not everyone who wears a hoodie (when the weather doesn't call for it) is a gangsta or an anti-social type, that item of clothing does seem to have acquired exactly that stigma.



If guy is not a fag, he shouldn't be flopping his wrist around.
If a girl is not a prostitute, she shouldn't be wearing platform sandal and a short skirt.
If a black is not a hoodlum, he should't be wearing hoodie.  

Fags flop their wrists to advertise that they're queer.
Prostitutes wear platforms to advertise they're for sale.
Blacks wear hoodies to advertise that they're gangsters.

If you don't want be seen as this, don't appear as this.


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## Dante (Mar 25, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



if true, Ravi will have a melt down.


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## Sallow (Mar 25, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



Link?


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## Sallow (Mar 25, 2012)

Second version of this story. The first being that Zimmerman got out of his SUV to look for street signs when he was jumped from behind.

Gotta love it.


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## beagle9 (Mar 25, 2012)

MikeK said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > [...]
> ...


Yes, it is sad that reality is this way for so many these days, so why do people want their kids to live within a fantasy/fad world, in which lies to them constantly or decieves them constantly, where as in such a fantasy/fad world, they all become subjected to bad things in their lives in association with, but the parents can't seem to deal with it, and this is especially so once the kid makes it to the "public middle school", which is sadly where it all begins for most of them -(i.e. these things in which we speak of in their lives).

I say we should allow freedom of choice to enter back into the public school systems, where as if a teen wants to disrupt and force others into a bad situation while at school, then that teen should be allowed to leave school on his or her own choice, thus the school would next notify the parents that the teen is not compatible to learning in said public school system, and this by his or her own makings or actions being dealt with, and so sadly he or she will not be allowed to attend and disrupt the public school system anylonger at this point.  The parents are free as well to seek out an alternative for them if can...

Ok, so now we will have a slew of young adults who need to enter the workforce early, in which is A-OK also be it all depending, because this is how it was for many years gone by, in which seperated the bad teens from the good teens, where as the bad ones went out and got a job doing whatever they could do at some point in their lives (once they ditched school), and they just became either a young man or woman a little bit earlier than the rest would in life, and all by their choices made... The main thing is that everyone is seperated by their own choices made, and not forced. Next the school system is saved by this new freedom allowed to take place again in that system. Bad teens donot need to be in school "influencing good teens" to then turn them bad as well within the public system, and that is that (IMHO). This nation must take the fight to the public school system, in which has gotten totally out of control over the years, and it needs to be reformed and cleaned up finally, where as education is a privileage and not a right for young people to somehow then exploit so badly, and in a bad way. Why? It is all because they are forced to do something that they don't want to do at a certain age in their life, so they rebel and freely take it out on the school system, and also they take it out upon the ones who want to learn in that system sadly enough, and with an almost 100% impunity they have done it until enough is enough already, but by then it is to late, where lives were sadly destroyed as well as an entire system rocked by it all. 

What they have been doing, is they have been doing this with almost no accountability in many cases over the years, but the majority of it has been hidden and covered up...Why has all this taken place ?  It's because the nation has been drug down, and has been leveled out to a large extent at certain levels, in order to assist others to catch up, and the sacrifices have been great in this situation all because of this, but now what really is bad, is when these sacrifices have been found in vane. 

I think that schools should desperately band thug wear or anything that even looks like this type of wear, it would be a step in the right direction I think, and I also think that the majority of Americans would agree with me on that note.

Remember "Pants on the Gorund" a song sung by an American patriot on the American Idle that year, who was batteling this gang stuff and thug wear in the neighborhood in which he lived, trying to help the young people stay on message in that neighborhood? He was for real, and there are many more like him in America, who want to see the kids by pass all this stuff, but when opportunity arrives to make a point, the race baiters win the day, and the message gets lost, and sadly it could be that another death ends up in vane. 

We don't need millions of illegals in America working, we just need to clean out the schools of young adults who don't want to be there, and thus if they are forced to be, then they just use the schools as a recruiting grounds for what ever they want to recruit for, destroying the hopes and dreams of good young adults who were distracted by them in some form or fashion, for whom are valuable lives also, that cannot be restored for years gone by afterwards.

Wake up America !!


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 25, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Second version of this story. The first being that Zimmerman got out of his SUV to look for street signs when he was jumped from behind.
> 
> Gotta love it.



You are right, it is the second version.
The first version was the media fabricated story that you bought because it fit your agenda.
I do not go by any version of the story. 
Doesn't it bother you that the police report was ignored in the media reports?
What story do you believe anyway?
I believe none to date. 
I would believe THE WITNESSES.
Don't you believe the 3 witnesses that saw this entire incident are the best indicators of what happened?
Or do you just love the anti police anti whitey story that is not based on any credible evidence in this specific matter?
If you do not see that this entire tragic event that left a young man dead HAS BEEN BLOWN OUT OF PROPORTION by the anti police anti whitey crowd and the knee jerk train wreck reporting media then you are as biased as they all are.
Fact is Zimmerman WAS INJURED and attacked in some way by Martin.
Maybe Zimmerman ATTACKED HIM FIRST.
But how do YOU know? 
Were YOU THERE?
Try having an open mind for a change.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 25, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Zimmerman's statement to police has also been leaked. He stated that as he was returning to his truck after giving up his following of Martin as Martin had evaded him he was all of a sudden attacked out of no where and hit in the back of the head with an object and also the nose.



If this is Zimmerman's claim, then we can stop listening to anything he says, because his claim has been disproven completely.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 25, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Did Martin run away or walk away, and did Zimmerman run after him or walk to keep up with him, in order to keep survielance on him until the cops got there ??? Did Martin Run, and did Zimmerman give chase (i.e. as in run also) ?



Are you kidding me?  There's no difference between the two in any relevant manner to this case.  Zimmerman pursued Martin, and Martin was trying to evade Zimmerman.  Walked, ran, skipped, did the hokie-pokie, it's still a matter of pursuit and attempted evasion.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 25, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> The witness said that Zimmerman was getting into his car after telling Martin that he was meeting up with the police (Zimmerman knew they were on the way) and Martin jumped him from behind hitting him in the head with the can.
> 
> It was pretty much as you said it might have been.
> 
> If that can has a dent or blood on it, this case is o-v-e-r.



Too bad that's all completely disproven from the tape of Martin's final phone conversation.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 25, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Zimmerman's statement to police has also been leaked. He stated that as he was returning to his truck after giving up his following of Martin as Martin had evaded him he was all of a sudden attacked out of no where and hit in the back of the head with an object and also the nose.
> ...



You claim to be "in the middle".
I am. 
Where iare Zimmerman's "claims" anywhere? 
Where is his written statement or statements under oath?
Don't you value being an American where you are PRESUMED INNOCENT?
Do you have any clue what this country was founded on?
Do you understand what the doctrine of innocent until proven guilty is?
I suggest you do some research and studying some constitutional law and get back to us.
Otherwise, hang up your claim that you are "in the middle".


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 25, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > The witness said that Zimmerman was getting into his car after telling Martin that he was meeting up with the police (Zimmerman knew they were on the way) and Martin jumped him from behind hitting him in the head with the can.
> ...



Where is there any tape of Martin's phone call?
Why do you have to make things up that are false?
There is NO recording of any call from Martin.
Are you that foolish and naive that you have to just make up BS as you go?

Fact is you are just full of it with no facts. A tape of a phone call. BS.
How could anyone have a tape of his call to the girlfriend?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 25, 2012)

One of the eyewitnesses came forward yesterday.
"The guy in the red shirt was being attacked and was on the ground yelling for help."

End of story, done deal. Martin attacked him and now we have an eye witness to it.
Of course this does not matter as a black kid was killed and even if he was the attacker it does not matter.
Blacks side with blacks no matter what most of the time.


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## Ravi (Mar 25, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> One of the eyewitnesses came forward yesterday.
> "The guy in the red shirt was being attacked and was on the ground yelling for help."
> 
> End of story, done deal. Martin attacked him and now we have an eye witness to it.
> ...


There are two witnesses that disagree with him. And he did not come forward yesterday.....he came forward last month.

Even if they were fighting and Martin was on top at one time or another, that isn't evidence that Martin attacked first.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world. 

Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???

If I was Zimmerman I'd have my lawyer suing the SOB right now. 

Spike Lee Retweets George Zimmermans Home Address | TheBlaze.com


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Isn't issuing posters to kill him advertising for a contract to murder? I don't see the Justice Department doing anything about either the Rush Limbaugh you tube shit or the Black panthers issuing such material for Zimmerman.

But then Holder is a racist dumb ass.


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## percysunshine (Mar 25, 2012)

That was stupid.

Of course, so are all of his movies.


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## Publius1787 (Mar 25, 2012)

In Spike Lees world, a crime only counts as a crime when any other ethnicity attacks a black man. If it happens the other way around, however, special consideration should be given. Black people storming a parking lot or a convenience store should be described as youths and killing a man because he is white/Hispanic cannot possibly be a hate crime but an act of social justice. The courts and the law do not apply to black people. See Obama and critical race theory.


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## hjmick (Mar 25, 2012)

What a douche.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Kind of reminds you of America pre-civil rights movement doesn't it?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Kind of reminds you of America pre-civil rights movement doesn't it?



Considering the media attention, and groups hating Zimmerman already, it was a rotten thing to do.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Kind of reminds you of America pre-civil rights movement doesn't it?
> ...



It is incitement to murder, which as far as I know IS a chargeable offense. It is also a violation of Zimmerman"s CIVIL RIGHTS. Also a chargeable offense.

The youtube adds about Rush Limbaugh fit that bill as well, as do the flyers for Zimmerman to be killed by the New Black Panthers.

But there will be no charges and no attempt to stop them by this administration.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Nope, because Obama and Holder are radical black racists with a deep seated hatred of white people. Just wait until the second term, we've been instructed to wait until then.


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## Toro (Mar 25, 2012)

If this is true, Lee is a real douchebag.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...




The president aside, the media attention to the NBP calling for a "citizen's arrest" AND the groups protesting Zimmerman, make this act by Lee deplorable. Incitement to murder, who knows, but a low life act by one person does not excuse another disgusting action. His mailing address is a different story; his attorney has said Zimmerman is not AT his home address, though who can be sure?


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...



Was this conspiracy to commit murder?

"Long-time immigrant rights activist Jorge-Mario Cabrera is used to being called to task for his views. But when radio hosts John Kobylt and Ken Chiampou recently gave out his cellphone number on the air in a campaign against the California Dream Act, he found himself unprepared for the barrage of hate-filled phone calls that followed."

Groups want 'John and Ken' show pulled after phone-number stunt - Los Angeles Times


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.



Just as Martin's parents will sue the Sanford Police, Zimmerman, the HOA and the state of Florida.

P.S. What Spike Lee did is not a crime.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.
> ...



There is no evidence against Zimmerman. There is evidence of incitement to commit murder from a variety of groups and individuals... including Spike Lee. That, my little racist, is a crime.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...



Don't know about "murder", it is odd Spike Lee is termed a "vigilante" by those who think Zimmerman is a "victim"...............................


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



Currently, those tweeting Zimmerman's address... and those producing 'wanted' posters are targeting someone who has not been charged with any crime. How would you like the NBP, and Hollywood A listers to tweet your address to people who thought you murdered a black kid? Hmmm? 

If Zimmerman comes to any harm, each and every one of them - including Lee - should be charged as an accessory.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



He will come to harm, it's just a matter of time. Maybe he can meet up with Casey Anthony.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...




Zimmerman is still reported to be at "an undisclosed" location; I think Zimmerman's home address has already been disclosed, his father speaks for him. His neighbors may have cause to worry though, why keep stirring the sh*t?


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

Toro said:


> If this is true, Lee is a real douchebag.



Agreed. That being said, it's also perfectly legal.


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## Sherry (Mar 25, 2012)

Do those on the left who seem to be begging for race riots to evolve from this incident realize that it will be detrimental to Obama...it only magnifies how he's failed at bringing people together, which is why some people were willing to give him a chance in the first place.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



Why kill an unarmed black kid?

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



I'm not ok with people being forced out of their lawful place of residence because of a witch hunt.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Sherry said:


> Do those on the left who seem to be begging for race riots to evolve from this incident realize that it will be detrimental to Obama...it only magnifies how he's failed at bringing people together, which is why some people were willing to give him a chance in the first place.



Fuck bringing people together. This is America, a country born of racism and following it's due course.


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## Toro (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Sure.  If that's, you know, what we are talking about.


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## Sherry (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Sherry said:
> 
> 
> > Do those on the left who seem to be begging for race riots to evolve from this incident realize that it will be detrimental to Obama...it only magnifies how he's failed at bringing people together, which is why some people were willing to give him a chance in the first place.
> ...



I'm sure Obama appreciates your "support".


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I'm not ok with a black kid walking to a residence and being shot and killed. I wish someone would tweet out the addresses of all the blacks who kill fellow blacks and their fear was as palpable as Zimmerman's. Until that day, he'll do.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Sherry said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Sherry said:
> ...



He's black, I'll vote for him again.


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## Sherry (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Sherry said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Well he was never concerned about your gimme vote...it's those thinking folks he needs to worry about.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...




Zimmerman is reported to have left his home DAYS ago:
Sanford, Fla. police chief Bill Lee steps down "temporarily" amid Trayvon Martin controversy - Crimesider - CBS News


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...


You can't drive to a cell phone number to kill the owner.

You stupid racist dumbass.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.
> ...


Post your address.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Polk said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > If this is true, Lee is a real douchebag.
> ...



My, my, the "right to privacy" sure seems to evaporate whenever it's convenient, doesn't it?


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



I'm aware.... at the risk of repeating myself.... I am against people who have not been charged with any crime being railroaded out of their lawful residence because a bunch of assholes are whipping up hatred against that person. Which part of that do I need to explain?


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



A Vigilante is someone who takes the law into his own hands. 

It doesn't matter if the target is guilty or not.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Not even close to being an incitement to murder...but was a silly thing to do...


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## Papageorgio (Mar 25, 2012)

If any thing happens to Zimmerman and it happens at his home, he or his family would have a strong civil suit against a Spike Lee or anyone found to do the same thing.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...


Oh, you mean like going vigilante on a guy?

You probably have a "Free Mumia" t-shirt, don't you, you racist retard?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Zimmerman REMAINS at "an undisclosed" location; worry about his neighbors. His home address was already known, Lee didn't need to add fuel to the fire. I notice only very right wing internet cites are carrying THIS "news",  some with racial slurs included.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Sherry said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...


Exactly as programmed.  Good robot.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Sure.
*XXXXX-Meister*


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## Toro (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.
> ...



It's not a crime but it is grossly irresponsible.  And if true, Spike Lee is a shitty human being.

Throughout history, the media has been used to incite hate and violence.  Radio was the primary tool of the Hutus to incite and kill nearly a million Tutsis in the Rwanda genocide for example.  The media is powerful, and those who use it to incite strife are derelict in their responsibility.  People of power and stature should be calming the population, not inciting them because their actions could lead to more innocent people getting hurt.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...


Probably because the left doesn't see anything wrong with this.  

If some asshole kills Zimmerman or any of his family, the left will claim the murderer is a "political prisoner".


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



post your cell phone number and I'll have your billing address within 24 hours.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



If something happens to Zimmerman, whatever offense it is, Spike Lee can be prosecuted for incitement to commit that crime. 

As it is now, he's subject to a civil suit already.


This is a cat that you can't get back in the bag.


And to think everyone thought Rush Limbaugh was a putz.


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## Sherry (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



I've never reported a post, but I almost think I should...incredibly foolish move on your part. I hope an admin sees it and removes it, even if it's not really your actual address.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.



Why would you be suing everybody. Spike Lee maybe, but the rest? It's not their fault this wannabe Rambo KILLED somebody. Let's not forget that aspect of this. Maybe if this douche (and he is a douche no matter what way you look at it) hadn't wanted to be a wannabe cop, none of this would have come down.

I thought you conservatives liked to hold people accountable for their actions. This is the fallout of his stupid act. While this doesn't make Lee look any good, I'm having problems feeling sympathy for the guy....


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Sherry said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
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> > daveman said:
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I live in that building.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Show me that statute that says posting somebody's address on Twitter, or anywhere for that matter, is an incitement to anything....


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

Sherry said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



It's none of your business what he posts and is well within the rules. A dumb thing to do, but don't you think you're being a Nanny Stater right on this board...


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > Salt Jones said:
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1.  That's not a residential address, so you're a liar.

2.  Since it's not your real address, you're unwilling to do what you think is no big deal in Zimmerman's case, so you're a hypocrite.

3.  Since it's not you're real address, you're a coward.

In summary, you're a lying, hypocritical, cowardly, racist, retard robot.

And that truly pathetic thing is you're not even ashamed of it.


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## Sherry (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Sherry said:
> 
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> > Salt Jones said:
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Apparently the word "almost" was lost on you.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Dr Grump said:
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> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Zimmerman has been hiding since 3/15:

George Zimmerman's father on Trayvon Martin: My son is not racist, did not confront Trayvon Martin - Orlando Sentinel


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## Big Fitz (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...



What a cozy little Fatwah the left has going on, isn't it?

Nothing like a Reckless Endangerment charge to snap people's heads around.  Spike better pray nothing happens to Zimmerman because black on hispanic hate crime ain't gonna do him or P-BO any good.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > Salt Jones said:
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And then you can send somebody to kick my ass, because you're too cowardly to do it yourself?


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.
> ...



So, once somebody is accused of a crime their rights are gone???

It doesn't matter what side you're on, you can't decide if you're gonna follow the law in this case and not in that case.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

Sherry said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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> > Sherry said:
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Yeah, but why make the post in the first place...


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Sherry said:
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I seem to remember you saying you lived in a house.

A condo is not a house.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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You are truly a fat blob of a failure.

*XXXXX-Meister*

Summit at Copper Square was the first modern high rise condominium built in downtown Phoenix (It's the 22 story yellow, blue and burnt orange high rise at 4th Street and Jackson, you can't miss it!).

Summit at Copper Square, Phoenix, AZ


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
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> > daveman said:
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Thus, the person to FEAR is Daveman? He searched for Salt's ADDRESS..........


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## Sherry (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Sherry said:
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> > Dr Grump said:
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To point out what a foolish, and as you said, "dumb thing to do".


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## Papageorgio (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
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Apartment or suite number?


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

I guess race relations just took a step back about 30 years.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
> ...



What rights have been violated? 
I don't know of any law Lee has broken. He's a douche for doing what he did, and he may have broken some law (but I don't know what it is).

It's interesting how people are frothing at the mouth about this (especially the right). It's a nice diversion to the real story here - a vigilante kills a kid walking down the street because he 'looked suspicious'. Whatever Lee is, this Zimmerman is a complete fucking loon and deserves to go to prison for a long time...


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
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> > Sherry said:
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I thought you just posted that it wasn't a "residential building"?


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> daveman said:
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I knew he would.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Papageorgio said:


> Salt Jones said:
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> > daveman said:
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Nope.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> mudwhistle said:
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I see no difference here with what we used to see around the turn of the 20th century. Roaming bands of whites looking to bring justice upon a black man that hasn't been convicted. Watch "To Kill A Mockingbird".


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
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> > daveman said:
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Were you planning to drive to Phoenix when you asked for my address?


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## Big Fitz (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> If I were Zimmerman, my lawyer would be contacting Spikey and suing his ass, as well as every single person involved with the 'wanted' poster, and  every other fucker who put my life at risk. Then I'd be suing Holder, the DoJ, the police, the city, and everyone else I could think of.


In other words, Zimmerman just hit the winning ticket in the favorite game of the litigious left: "Jackpot Justice"!


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## Meister (Mar 25, 2012)

*DO NOT, and I repeat DO NOT be giving out addresses or phone numbers on the open board.  Nuff said?*


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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> > mudwhistle said:
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I have the book, somewhere. TODAY, the "roaming bands" are featured on TV; the "MSM" isn't disclosing Zimmerman's home address, only far right internet sites by the way.


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## Big Fitz (Mar 25, 2012)

FIRE IN THE HOLE!

::: Dives for the foxhole:::


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
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They know they would be liable for a massive lawsuit. 

It's too late.....once Lee tweeted it, the address became public domain.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> mudwhistle said:
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> > Dr Grump said:
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So, trial by media is something you support. Interesting.... and seriously disappointing... given that you are quite a rational human being. So far, there is not one shred of actual evidence of Zimmerman having committed a crime.... I'm curious why he should go to prison.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Oops, it seems that Spike Lee didn't tweet any address. Two tweets containing the address were sent to Lee. From the OP's Link:

Two messages were posted *to* Lee&#8217;s official Twitter account, one Friday and one Saturday, with a street address and the words &#8220;EVERYBODY REPOST THIS.&#8221; Both messages were still visible on Lee&#8217;s account Sunday morning. Lee has tweeted numerous times about Martin&#8217;s death.

Damn, right-wingers are dumb.


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## PoliticalChic (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...



Should anything happen to Zimmerman, and if the Department of Injustice suddenly discovers rectitude, then I would hope they pursue the same path taken  against the Metzgers....

"Metzger, Son Are Sued Over Killing by Skinheads
October 21, 1989|RICHARD E. MEYER | TIMES STAFF WRITER
Tom Metzger of Fallbrook, head of the White Aryan Resistance, was sued Friday in Portland, Ore., federal court by the uncle of an Ethiopian who was beaten to death last year by skinheads, young neo-Nazis who favor shaved heads, steel-toed boots and military-style clothing.

Also named as a defendant is Metzger's White Aryan Resistance, a white power organization reported to have a following of more than 2,000. The suit seeks unspecified "compensatory and punitive damages."

It is similar to a lawsuit pressed by the law center three years ago against the Ku Klux Klan, in which a jury returned a $7-million verdict that crushed an entire arm of the Klan financially.

The lawsuit charges that agents of Tom and John Metzger, who heads the Aryan Youth Movement, moved into a skinhead apartment in Portland and encouraged the skinheads to commit violent acts against blacks and others to promote white supremacy."
Metzger, Son Are Sued Over Killing by Skinheads - Los Angeles Times


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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> > mudwhistle said:
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We will know after the Grand Jury convenes...............Zimmerman does admit killing Trayvon Martin, this isn't a case of jay walking.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
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> > Dr Grump said:
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Every single outlet, and every single individual that passes that address on to others, is putting his life at risk. If I were him, I'd be suing the living fucking daylights out of each and every one... including going after Twitter itself. They are responsible for their content, much like USMB is responsible for this board's content. 

You publish that guy's address here.... and see what happens.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

PoliticalChic said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
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Key words:

"moved into a skinhead apartment"

Sheriff Joe Arpiao tried to claim giving out his address was a crime. Study how that turned out for Sheriff Joe.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
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> > Dr Grump said:
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He's already been cleared by a police investigation... you do realize that one requires evidence to present to a Grand Jury, right? We all know that Zimmerman killed Trayvon - and I am not defending him... I am defending the process. I do not support trial by media. It is dangerous... and it can get people killed.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Oops, it seems that Spike Lee didn't tweet any address. Two tweets containing the address were sent to Lee. From the OP's Link:
> 
> Two messages were posted *to* Lee&#8217;s official Twitter account, one Friday and one Saturday, with a street address and the words &#8220;EVERYBODY REPOST THIS.&#8221; Both messages were still visible on Lee&#8217;s account Sunday morning. Lee has tweeted numerous times about Martin&#8217;s death.
> 
> Damn, right-wingers are dumb.



As you will notice at the bottom of the msg it shows "Retweeted by Spike Lee".







That means he got it and sent it out to everyone that follows his account.

He did it twice.

Now, he could always hide the conversation, but instead he chose to retweet it.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> [
> 
> 
> So, trial by media is something you support. Interesting.... and seriously disappointing... given that you are quite a rational human being. So far, there is not one shred of actual evidence of Zimmerman having committed a crime.... I'm curious why he should go to prison.



No, I do not support trial by media....
There is not one shred of evidence? I disagree...there is plenty of circumstantial evidence to go on so far - and yes, the law you can convict somebody on circumstantial evidence - happens all the time. The 9-11 call, the call the victim made to his girlfriend, his past behaviour....

So, you saying there is not a shred of evidence is untrue...

He will get charged with something...eventually...


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Oops, it seems that Spike Lee didn't tweet any address. Two tweets containing the address were sent to Lee. From the OP's Link:
> 
> Two messages were posted *to* Lees official Twitter account, one Friday and one Saturday, with a street address and the words EVERYBODY REPOST THIS. Both messages were still visible on Lees account Sunday morning. Lee has tweeted numerous times about Martins death.
> 
> Damn, right-wingers are dumb.



Thank you Salt. I note the name & location of Zimmerman's FORMER employer was released days ago.


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## Big Fitz (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
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Trial by Media!

Screwing up Justice in America Since OJ!


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



The police undertaking the original investigation didn't find evidence to counter his account. All you have is what the media tell you.... and that is trial by media. If you don't support trial by media... why do you want him to go to prison?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Big Fitz said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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"The Blaze" started this; GODLIKE productions is calling for Lee's head now............


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Oops, it seems that Spike Lee didn't tweet any address. Two tweets containing the address were sent to Lee. From the OP's Link:
> ...



Why are you thanking him for lying? Look at the twitter feed that Mud posted.... it clearly says 'retweeted by Spike Lee'.... therefore, Spike Lee retweeted it. You do know how twitter works, right?


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
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> > Salt Jones said:
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Salt Jones wanted so bad for it to be untrue that he skimmed over that simple fact.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Oops, it seems that Spike Lee didn't tweet any address. Two tweets containing the address were sent to Lee. From the OP's Link:
> 
> Two messages were posted *to* Lees official Twitter account, one Friday and one Saturday, with a street address and the words EVERYBODY REPOST THIS. Both messages were still visible on Lees account Sunday morning. Lee has tweeted numerous times about Martins death.
> 
> Damn, right-wingers are dumb.



Oops! It seems I was wrong and Mud pointed out my wrongness. MudWhistle is correct and I didn't read close enough.

In this instance, I was the dumb one.


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## Big Fitz (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Big Fitz said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
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Never heard of em.  I've been learning about all this actually through mainstream media it seems.  Quite surprising for me, but I can't seem to avoid it lately.  the bastards.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Then again, maybe the police did a shitty job...they only have his account of what happened...took it for granted and carried on. Now they will get a proper investigation.

I want him to go to prison because all indications so far are is that he is a douche. He has cost a young man his life because he wanted to be big man on Campus. If they release the emergency call tape, and the despatcher did indeed tell him to back off, then he should go inside for a long time. Looks like he instigated, then accelerated, and concluded the whole incident.

If it didn't turn out that way, then we'll see what happens. I only want him to go inside IF that did happen.

All the rest if supposition, and I'm allowed to suppose, just like you do....


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Spike Lee has 246,200 followers.

That's a lot of possibilities.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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> > Peach said:
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Hey, when you're a hammer everything looks like a nail.


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## Dante (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Spike-Lee.jpg/IMG]
> 
> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> ...


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Big Fitz said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Big Fitz said:
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Spike Lee directed:

Jungle Fever
Get On The Bus
Malcolm X
Do The Right Thing
Crooklyn
Summer Of Sam


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> mudwhistle said:
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> > California Girl said:
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## Dante (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
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> > mudwhistle said:
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a cell phone number can lead to a home address, unless it is a throw away phone without a contract, and even then, if that number ever entered a data base


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> California Girl said:
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I tend not to find people guilty on a 'maybe'. I like solid evidence. You claim you do not support trial by media... and yet you are the one who wants the man in prison. So far, there is no evidence to find him guilty.... so, again, why have you found him guilty? Because the media tells you so. 

In this country (and, granted, it may be different in Australia)... but here, we are innocent until proven guilty. That is our due process. 

He doesn't have to prove he's innocent.... the police have to find evidence that counters his account. Again, where is that evidence? 

I don't 'suppose'.... nor do I find him guilty.... I will reserve judgment until I know ALL the relevant facts. That, my friend, is logic.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Dante said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Spike-Lee.jpg/IMG]
> ...


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

This is a hammer I'd love to nail.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dante said:
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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
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Oh, I agree with most of what you say, which is why I said "if" in my last post. 

Just out of interest, IF it is found that he was told to back off and didn't, would your view change.

Innocent until proven guilty down here...

Then again, you guys do have the perp walk, which is an insidious institution. Down here, people get suppression orders all the time against their name...


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## Dante (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dante said:
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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
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The Grand Jury will review what is presented; that is the proper course for the investigation into the killing. (I think DOJ should keep out of it until the Grand Jury is done; IF Zimmerman is indicted, where in Florida he can be tried is a mystery, there is so much pre trial publicity. I THINK Bundy went to trial in Miami for  the FSU murders, and Orlando for the Lake City murder.)


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> This is a hammer I'd love to nail.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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Before that 'if' in your last post, you clearly stated that you wanted him to go to prison, you are clearly of the opinion that he is guilty. And yet, the original police investigation did not find enough evidence to charge him. 

What Spike Lee et al are doing is the internet equivalent of a perp walk - and the man hasn't even been arrested, yet alone tried or convicted. Y'all seem very keen to hang this guy.... regardless of the evidence. 

Face it, you have been influenced by the media to find him guilty. Recognize it and deal with it. I don't claim he is guilty or innocent... only that he is, in law, innocent until proven guilty... and, so far - leaving aside the 'maybes', 'ifs', 'likelys' or hysteria... he remains innocent... and people like Lee have put his life at risk. I, personally, find that appalling.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

I am all for Zimmerman being thrown under the jail for killing this unarmed kid.  What spike lee did was wrong and it will make the Zimmerman supporters (the people on the right) spout all people who want justice here are just like Spike lee or the new black panther party (all 10 of those guys).

Spike Lee, dumb move.  Zimmerman, if there is justice in this world, you will experience OZ.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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The oringinal police "investigation" had the cops telling him what to say to make it a good shoot.  You do know the captain stepped down because of this dont you?

This is obviously  the local "investigation" was a sham.  Period.  That is why it has gone beyond that.  You go get this dont you?


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## Toro (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
> ...



Right.  We need due process, not mob rule.

It's tragic that one person has lost his life.  It would be tragic if another did also.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> I am all for Zimmerman being thrown under the jail for killing this unarmed kid.  What spike lee did was wrong and it will make the Zimmerman supporters (the people on the right) spout all people who want justice here are just like Spike lee or the new black panther party (all 10 of those guys).
> 
> Spike Lee, dumb move.  Zimmerman, if there is justice in this world, you will experience OZ.



The Dorthy OZ or the Schillinger/Adebisi OZ?


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Big Fitz said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



Jungle Fever.  Great movie
Get on the Bus.  Eh
Malcolm X.  Great movie
Do the Right Thing.  Excellent Movie
Crookln.  Eh
Summer of Sam.  Great Movie.  (Leguizamo is a great actor as well.)


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Polk said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...



Last I checked, Spike Lee isn't the government.


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

Papageorgio said:


> If any thing happens to Zimmerman and it happens at his home, he or his family would have a strong civil suit against a Spike Lee or anyone found to do the same thing.



No, they really wouldn't.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > I am all for Zimmerman being thrown under the jail for killing this unarmed kid.  What spike lee did was wrong and it will make the Zimmerman supporters (the people on the right) spout all people who want justice here are just like Spike lee or the new black panther party (all 10 of those guys).
> ...



Thats Schillin ger.    (If you watched, you get it.)


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I'm only 'influenced' by the media if what they say is correct, after all they are the only ones reporting on it. It's not like you and I can go down there and interview the police captain or zimmerman, right? Sometimes they are right sometimes not. I do not like what Lee did either...the guy is an idiot...

Wanting a guy to go to jail IF he is responsible is not mob rule, nor do I endorse such actions...


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



I get that everyone - black, white, hispanic.... or sky blue and fucking shocked pink... has the right to a fair trial... IF there is evidence for such. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law... not in the court of Judge Fucking Judy. No one has the right to decide someone else's guilt on a bunch of hysterical, over emotional bullshit in the media.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
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> > Salt Jones said:
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I don't got to "Twitter" unless I have to. Still, someone else may have RE tweeted, and internet sites are filled with the "tweet" now. Luckily, Zimmerman moved almost two weeks ago.  Stupid, rotten move; IF Zimmerman is indicted, those who desire justice may be thwarted by all the PRE TRIAL media coverage. Zimmerman's right to fair & impartial proceedings comes FIRST. I looked up Lee's "Twitter" account; one must sign up to see the contents. It should be taken down, or the relevant portions REMOVED.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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> > Peach said:
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I followed the link provided at the article in the op. 

I'm looking at his account right now.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> California Girl said:
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> > Dr Grump said:
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The whole point of due process is to examine ALL the evidence, presented from BOTH sides... in order to establish guilt - beyond a reasonable doubt. I have no interest in interviewing anyone.... nor do I have any interest in reading half assed media reports that present some of the facts, with whatever agenda suits them. 

What you support is mob rule... you just said so when you said he should be in prison. He hasn't been charged, tried or found guilty... and you are happy to condemn him to prison anyway. What is that if not trial by media? It's nothing more than mob rule. I find that ridiculous... and, honestly, I expected better from you.


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## whitehall (Mar 25, 2012)

What do you think? Does the caring ACLU loving left want to lynch Zimmerman?


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I know you have said how educated you are and this post makes your point. 

If it were up to the local idiot cops there, he WOULD NEVER HAVE STOOD TRIAL.  This is why others had to come in and make sure justice is served.  He will stand trial for murder now because that police force, from the captain down to the keystone idiots at the scene are under a microscope for being horrible investigators.  

God bless America and God bless any agency that is above those idiot cops in Florida who allowed this shooter to not only not be arrested, but he still has his gun. 

Yes, California Girl.  The educated one.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Toro said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



I agree Cali & Grump. FAIR & IMPARTIAL proceedings are the first concern at this point.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



You don't need to go to his twitter account. You just need to look at the screen grab that Mudwhilstle provided. It quite clearly says 'retweeted by Spike Lee'... given his following.... you don't think it is a tad irresponsible for him to forward out to all his 'followers' the private address of Zimmerman?


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

whitehall said:


> What do you think? Does the caring ACLU loving left want to lynch Zimmerman?



Lynching sounds more like something Zimmerman would apporve of.  Dont you think?  Remember what he said before he killed that boy.  He called him a "fucking coon".  Remember?  But we are the race baitors.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
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And? If there is no evidence, why should he stand trial? You are assuming that the local LEOs fucked the investigation. I do not make that assumption. I wait for evidence before I convict someone. You don't. That's fine... just have the courage to say so... say 'I support trial by media'. 

What is this 'justice' that you desire? Justice is putting people on trial when there is some fucking evidence against them. I've seen no evidence against him. I've seen a bunch of biased and badly reported half truths, partially accurate, and outright lies... that is not evidence. 

And.... yea... compared to you... I am most defintely the educated one. I understand due process... I don't make assumptions of guilt... You do. Trial by media... an interesting... and incredibly dangerous way to run a justice system.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
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I used the term DISGUSTING. He is well known; he knew, or should have known, this would reach many people.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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> > Peach said:
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AND people like Mudwhistle would further display the information.


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## Big Fitz (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
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Never seen a one.... never going to now.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Zoom said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
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Jeb Bush himself said Zimmerman was wrong and did not have  grounds to stand behind the "stand your ground" Law.  If this is true, (and he fucking wrote that crap), what is holding this guy back from being prosecuted?

Oh and educated one, WHY DID THE CAPTAIN STEP DOWN? Because his investigators fucked up royally and he knows it.  If that is not the reason, please give your opinion as to why he stepped down so quickly?

Interesting spelling there.  ... "defintely"...  Oh my God, the irony of you spelling "defintely" that way while saying how educated you are is probably lost on you.  

(Sometimes you just have to take your lumps and say, yup...I just got pwned.)  Just saying.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
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Well yea. That's kind of my point.... he has a lot of followers.... by his actions, he has contributed to putting Zimmerman's life at further risk. As he has not been charged with anything... they are inciting people to hunt this guy down. To me... that is fundamentally wrong. Even if he's guilty... it's not right to incite whackjobs to hunt the man down.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

Big Fitz said:


> Zoom said:
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> > mudwhistle said:
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I thank the poster for that list.  It reminded me of how great a director Spike Lee really is.  I almost forgot.

He screwed the pooch on what he did here though.  Dumb move Spike.  Dumb move.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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> > Zoom said:
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I don't give a rat's fucking ass what Jeb Bush said. I care only about the due process that this man is entitled to. 

No, the irony isn't lost.... my bad. But... because I prefer due process to trial by media... I'm still smarter than you.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Zoom said:
> 
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Not sure, but shouldn't it be...I'm still smarter than you are?  Not really sure, I am still rattled by your spelling of "defintely" and you saying how smart you are in the same sentence.  That is just hilarious to me.  But I am not educated, (like you are.  LOL) so maybe I should not laugh at you?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
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I agree again. As in Afghanistan & Iraq, Americans stand for justice, trial by one, or by groups, doesn't meet the standard(.)


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
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He could have deleted it....or hid it. 

Instead he retweeted. 

Seemed harmless at the moment.

I wonder if he doesn't have anything better to do than act as a overseer to everyone's racism.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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Thing for me...I don't know whether Zimmerman is guilty or innocent. I just don't want trial by media.... and I won't find someone guilty in the court of public opinion.... only in a court of law. Simple concept.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
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I see there are lots of city offices nearby.  Maybe you should talk to the white employees there the way you talk to whites here.  

Especially the cops.  

No?

Looks like you're a coward then, huh?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
> 
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In the age of mass over communication, not that simple anymore. I hope the prosecutor finds good jurors who have heard & read nothing about this case.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> daveman said:
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Did Zimmerman give out his own address?

No.  A hateful racist bastard publicized it.

Similarly, a hateful racist bastard publicized Salt's address.  Of course, he did leave out the condo number.    He's a "tough guy", remember.  

But he has nothing to fear from me.  I'm not even going to send some of "my homies" there, like he "threatened" me with.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Zoom said:
> 
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By the way, way to represent educated people.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
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I said "neighborhood".  Do try to keep up, dumbfuck racist.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> Papageorgio said:
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Why not?  Spike gave everyone Zimmerman's full address, and you said it was no big deal.

Looks like you're a coward and hypocrite after all, huh?


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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That is not an acceptable excuse. We don't let people get away with incitement to commit murder in this country... even if it's 'not that simple anymore'. What Lee and others did, what the NBPs did with the 'wanted dead or alive' poster.... that is incitement. And, if I was Zimmerman.... I'd get myself a fucking good lawyer and go after each and every one of them. It is absolutely not acceptable for people to behave like this. We are a nation of laws, not opinions.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
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Your dumbfuck coward hypocrite racist ass isn't worth driving across the county line for, dumbfuck.


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## California Girl (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> California Girl said:
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I represent no one but myself.... cuz I'm not a liberal. You do 'group think'... I don't. Idiot.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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And that justifies telling the world his address? Or putting up posters of wanted dead or alive? Funny how you are not to upset ABOUT THAT. But then you are a lefty aren't you?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 25, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > One of the eyewitnesses came forward yesterday.
> ...



It was released yesterday.
The other 2 witnesses showed up AFTER the fact. NO they did not state that Martin was attacked first. They said "we showed up and the big guy was not offering any help to the guy laying on the ground. He should have done CPR or something."
They saw nothing and stated that.
Fact is they offered NO CPR either.
The main witness stated he saw Martin cold cock Zimmerman from behind.
Still may not warrant deadly force but that IS A MATERIAL FACT ISSUE FOR A JURY.
Definitely not murder of any shape, as I have been trying to educate you folks: this is a manslaughter case of some kind. Most likely aggravated involuntary manslaughter.
10 year sentence with 2 to do max, plea to 10 year sentence and 1 year county jail.

News flash to the dumbmasses here: There was no motive to kill in this and no premeditated evidence.
Still may not warrant deadly force though. I am still impartial and open to all evidence.


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## gallantwarrior (Mar 25, 2012)

I'm wondering, since Zimmerman is as Hispanic as obama is black, how is obama's condemnation of a Hispanic man without benefit of facts or due process, going to affect his standing with the all-important Hispanic voters?


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## Toro (Mar 25, 2012)

Big Fitz said:


> Zoom said:
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> > mudwhistle said:
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Malcolm X was good. 
Do the Right Thing was boring until the end.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Peach said:
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I bet the NBP gets lots of law enforcement attention; Lee needs to remedy his error or face the music. Zimmerman made a statement today, still hiding & speaking through his father.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
> 
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> > Peach said:
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If you created and posted a poster that said "wanted dead or alive" for Obama or any Federal State or local official, what do yo think would happen? Liberals haven't a clue about right and wrong, any excuse will do when one of theirs crosses the line. Putting a contract out to kill someone is not only a State crime but when committed over State lines it is a Federal offense. The New Black Panthers did JUST that.

Tweeting a man's address in such a situation is incitement to murder. Also a State and Federal Crime. Not to mention a violation of the person's CIVIL RIGHTS. But you don't care cause lefties did it, so it is excusable. You are a piece of work.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Dante said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...


Unless I'm wrong, you can't get a cell's home address legally without a search warrant.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


Too bad nobody gives a shit what racist dumbfucks want.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
> ...



I darn sure DO care; read my posts. ZIMMERMAN'S right to fair & IMPARTIAL proceedings is the NUMBER 1 CONCERN now.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> California Girl said:
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I am betting they get no attention. Holder does not care what black groups do, his Civil Rights division is ON RECORD for saying they don't care. Obama is supporting the vilification of a Hispanic and no one on the left gives a rats ass.

And hate to break it to you but there still is ZERO evidence a crime was committed.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Zoom said:
> 
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Ah, so thats how YOU spell represent.    Remember, because you said you represent smart people, yet now you are saying you are only representing "no one but myself".  I am confused, but that makes sense since I am not the educated one here.  You are.  Right?  

(Just stop, you look like a fool here.  Again.)


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## beagle9 (Mar 25, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Did Martin run away or walk away, and did Zimmerman run after him or walk to keep up with him, in order to keep survielance on him until the cops got there ??? Did Martin Run, and did Zimmerman give chase (i.e. as in run also) ?
> ...


No, it's more like are you kidding me? The inference in whether or not they were running and/or walking is very important in the case, and I see you chose running as in "chased" in your words when speaking on the subject, but are you certain about that ? If not, then was your speak in order to give an implication to the scene that you wanted to give, yet you can't truly prove walking or running maybe ?

What evidence do you have that Zimmerman was giving chase ? Please give me a link so I can review it, because you may be right, but I must listen to the evidence you have, in which I have not had as of yet..

If I were walking as a watchmen of a neighborhood, in slow pursuit of a suspicious person, and all in order to keep an eye on that person until the cops got there, well that is a big difference when that is stated, instead of when running or chasing is stated (i.e. as in chased), thus suggesting that Trayvon had been implicated by Zimmerman already to have committed a crime as to be found in Zimmerman's mind, and because of this, Trayvon is then found scared and running away, while Zimmerman is chasing him all because of ?? So the watchmen (Zimmerman) would be giving chase if that were the case, but was that actually what took place (or) is this the senario or case in which you are hoping for is what I am asking you ? 

If he (Zimmerman) was "chasing" Trayvon against the 9-11 operators command to stop pursuing Trayvon, and he didnot, then yes Zimmerman has some more explaining to do big time.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

Toro said:


> Big Fitz said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



I agree with Malcolm X

I disagree with Do the Right Thing...liked it up until the end....


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



The only fools here are all you pieces of shit defending incite to murder.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

California Girl said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
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I do not even come close to supporting mob rule. Where have I said that....


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
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pssst.  The dead, unarmed kid who was stalked and attacked is kind of evidence, no?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
> ...



The 4th Circuit prosecutor has the option of not going forward I believe. She just got the case recently however.


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Polk said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
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Meaningless.  Zimmerman's right to privacy was abrogated.

He certainly has grounds to sue Lee for a violation of his civil rights.

Or is that different?  Somehow?


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## Si modo (Mar 25, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > beagle9 said:
> ...


First of all, the 911 operator didn't command Zimmerman to do anything.  When 911 asked Zimmerman if he was following the suspect, Zimmerman answered, "Yeah".  Then, 911 said, "OK.  We don't need you to do that."

Secondly, there is no legal obligation to follow the suggestions or even orders of 911 operators as to what to do at a scene or in a situation.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
> 
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> > California Girl said:
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If you want, I can go back and show you where I said Spike Lee was wrong and him doing this would make* idiots *on the right think we agree with what he did and we are of the same mindset.

I hope you are picking up what I am putting down. ?


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## The Infidel (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
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Does not justify what Spike Lee is doing


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Polk said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



You are correct.  Zimmerman's right to privacy was abrogated.  He should be in jail in my opinion, but you are correct.  

 Its funny how you seem to be  upset about Zimmerman's civil rights being violated, but are fine with him stalking, attacking and shooting an unarmed kid.  

The right are funny people.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

The Infidel said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
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Agreed.  Spike Lee was wrong.  I said that.  WRONG WRONG WRONG. 


This does not take away from the fact that Zimmerman shot an unarmed kid and killed him.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
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There is evidence the "kid" attacked Zimmerman, there is evidence that Zimmerman acted in self defense. There is NO evidence otherwise, at least none even the Fed has released.

But back to the point. You support mob violence, you support incitement to murder. And you have the balls to call someone pointing it out stupid.


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## Ariux (Mar 25, 2012)

Ravi said:


> There are two witnesses that disagree with him. And he did not come forward yesterday.....he came forward last month.



You're an idiot.  All the witnesses police talked to supported Zimmerman's account.



> Even if they were fighting and Martin was on top at one time or another, that isn't evidence that Martin attacked first.



Getting hit on the back of the head is evidence of who started the fight.  The fact that the fucking African hadn't continued directly on his way is also evidence.


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## The Infidel (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> The right are funny people.



I for one hate vigilantes.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I think I understand what you are trying to say here, but Zimmerman is not the president of the United states.  You do know this dont you?

Oh and Spike Lee was wrong doing this.  The New Black Panthers (all 10 of them) are fucking idiots.  They did this to make you say their name so they win, I guess.  Rational people know this and wont get upset by such a small insignificant few morons.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
> ...



There is no evidence of stalking or of attacking. In fact there is ample evidence Zimmerman was attacked. And I have seen at least one thread on this board with a link to a story where an eye witness SAW the attack.

Even without a witness, Zimmerman was bloody on his face and back of his head and had been on his back on the ground. All actual evidence HE was attacked. Further he stated he was attacked and called out for help.

But lets ignore reality and keep making shit up.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Really? What is the evidence? You mean that same 911 call that told Zimmerman not to follow the young man, but he did anyway? That evidence? The evidence that the kid was getting some skittles and ice tea and then was followed by a self-appointed vigilante? That evidence...


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

The Infidel said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > The right are funny people.
> ...



Like Zimmerman?


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
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I've given no opinion on the shooting because I don't have all the facts.

That doesn't stop some people, apparently.


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## The Infidel (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> The Infidel said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
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Sorry.. didnt see that.

I do hope justice is served... I dont like what Zimmerman did either. I think he should have stopped following him when he was told to.

I may have confronted Zimmerman if he was following me as well.

Sad case, but I want to wait to see the results of investigation.


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## The Infidel (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> The Infidel said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
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Reserving judgement


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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You mean like the "investigator" who let him just go home with his gun?  (Oh and because of that move, the captain had to step down by the way).

If it were up to those cops, we would NEVER even be thinking about getting facts, since they told him what to say to make this a good shoot. 

Again, Jeb Bush..the fucking idiot who wrote that piece of crap "stand your ground" said Zimmerman cant use that as a defense.  The guy who wrote it says so.  That has to mean something to Zimmerman supporters.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...




LOOK THEY BROKE the law. A very serious crime. They are inciting murder, they are putting a contract openly, publicly on a private citizen. What part of that do you fail to UNDERSTAND? If some white group put out a "wanted dead or alive" poster on someone the Feds would be ALL over it. The Justice department would be making charges and demanding arrests. And so the fuck would you. BUT it is just some black group so we can ignore them.... right?

We now have 2 incidents of Liberals advocating in the public square for murder. One on Zimmerman and one on Rush Limbaugh. And not a single peep from the Justice Department and OPEN support from the left. As well as supporting comments from the President.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

The Infidel said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



Smooth move.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...



He is an obama supporter


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> The Infidel said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



Liberals are now advocating murder; a conservative has all the evidence & has rendered findings. The 4th Circuit SA can go home I gather...........................


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Please see the highlighted area above.  I am fucking agreeing with you.  Damn.  

They are fucking idiots.  They are wrong and IF they are found guilty of a crime, I hope they are prosecuted.  Didnt the right say the same thing about Zimmerman?  

I guess the difference between me and you is represented right here.  I am very comfortable with this.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
> ...



Alleged stalking, attacking, and shooting of an unarmed defenseless kid. 

There's a description for everyone that's jumping to conclusions on this.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



I thank God that kid had a chance to defend himself against an armed attack.  Zimmerman got into a fight with a kid 100 pounds lighter than himself and lost it looks like.  Then he pulled the ultimate pussy move and shot and killed him.

Pussy.


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## The Infidel (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



Take a bow Zoom.... I am




BTW Peach, I have not passed judgement, but whatever....


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 25, 2012)

Si modo said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



911 operator in response to Zimmerman stated he was in pursuit:
"You do not have to do that"
That is in NO way a command to stop.
In fact, 911 operators have no authority to make such commands anyway.
Can you believe how uninformed these folks are and how they do not even read the transcript before they post innuendo?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



Except there is ZERO investigation on the new Black Panthers. NONE, zippo , nadda. Getting the drift yet? You are demanding someone be prosecuted when there is not even any evidence yet a crime WAS committed but giving a pass to an open public crime. Go figure. Just like you claim Spike Lee committed no crime.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
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I think it was described as losing....fearing for his life. He didn't know if this unknown assailant was trying to kill him. 

The unknown is really scary numb-nuts.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



In Zimmerman's defense you say, let him stand trial.

I say, if those (10) idiot new black panthers did something illegal, let them stand trial for it.

Agree?

Fuck those morons.  They do this shit to stir up crap but they are hurting the left.  The right uses them to scare the weak minded of the right and make them think we all think this way.

Remember the "voter intimidation" thing in Philly?  They were in front of black people.  Who did they intimidate anyway?  

Small minds are easily manipulated.  Seriously.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Who approached who?  (Remember the actual phone call the kid was on when it all physically started)?  Who continued to stalk who?  Who was armed?  Who called who a "coon"?  Who is dead?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



So Liberals did not support and create and post videos demanding the death of Rush Limbaugh? Liberals did not create a "wanted dead or alive " poster of Zimmerman, followed by a liberal ensuring everyone knew his address? None of that happened? All with absolutely no action by the Government and no call for action by the Government?

You all demanded the Federal Government over rule the local authority and mount a criminal and civil rights investigation with absolutely no evidence a crime was committed and the statement from the local authorities that IN FACT no crime did occur.

But you make excuses and defend the absolute silence and failure to take action on open, obvious criminal activity. Claiming things like "golly it was just 10 guys that advocated murdering him. And it was only one guy that gave everyone his address. You Peach have made excuse after excuse to defend them.


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## Rozman (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...



This and the Black Panthers putting out a bounty for the capture for the guy is very serious.
I wonder if Nancy Pelosi will endorse this like she did the OWS movement....

But getting back on point....
This is sending out a call for a lynch mob....

I wonder how our Lib friends here will feel about this.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
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So let me get this right..... If I approach someone and ask them what they are doing out late at night they have every right to attack me, beat me to the ground and I have no right to self defense? That is in fact what you are saying, if that is what happened.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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There is ZERO investigation on Zimmerman either.  And if those Florida Keystone idiots had it their way, there never would have been one.

Fuck the New Black Panthers.  If they end up in jail, good.  Maybe they will stop this shit.
Fuck Zimmerman for killing that unarmed child.  Maybe Florida will stop this shit.

As far as the highlighted part.  I fucking called this.  I said what spike lee did was wrong and it would make fucking idiots on the right think we all think the way he does on this.

Show me where I said spike lee committed no crime.   I said he was wrong wrong wrong.  

I am fucking calling you out dude. Man up. 

JHC, this is so predictable.  It really is.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Rozman said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...



These events were within the last few DAYS; Trayvon Martin was killed in February......................


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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If you approach me with a gun, I will defend myself.  If you approach me with a fist, I will defend myself. 

You are turning this into self defense for Zimmerman?  Oh dear God.  He was armed trying to fight a kid 100 pounds lighter than he was.  Zimmerman should have been scared?  If so, why did he get out of the fucking truck?  Why did he not wait for the cops like he was instructed to do.

I will put you in his mindset.  He called him a coon, then approached him armed.  Did he want to talk about recipes at that point?  Common sense has to set in here.  IT HAS TO.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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You said he was wrong but then go on page after page defending him. Claiming he broke no laws. As for Zimmerman there are several investigations occurring, one a criminal Federal and State investigation and the other a Federal Civil Rights investigation. All ANNOUNCED to the PUBLIC.

What there is none of is any announcement or any evidence that anyone is going to investigate anything on the New Black Panthers or Spike Lee.

SO you man up, did Spike Lee incite to murder by knowingly sending to the world the address of a man that the public is clamoring for his blood?


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
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Liberals did not create a wanted dead or alive poster.  10 idiots who call themselves the New black panther party did.  I am a liberal and I nave NOTHING to do with them.  Nothing. 

You saying this is like me saying republicans shot that kid.  it wasn't, it was Zimmerman.  He has a lot of defenders on the right (see your post above) but he also has a few from the right saying he was wrong.  (Although, I dont see too many in here on the right saying this).  I am sure there are a few level headed actual non hack right wingers in here.


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## Si modo (Mar 25, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
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> > beagle9 said:
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It is amazing.

And disgusting.  Our press is being beyond their usual bias, they are being irresponsible.

And, when the riots start, the reporters on scene will be telling the audience how tragic it all is and asking, 'how could this happen????????'


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
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Approaching someone shouldn't be an excuse for a whipping. 

Zimmerman belonged there and he wanted to know who the kid was.

If you think he deserves to get beat up for that then your principles are in the toilet.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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And here you are making assumptions with out any evidence to back it up. IF Zimmerman had drawn his weapon there would have been no fight most likely. What most likely occurred as evidenced by eye witness testimony and statements from Zimmerman is he approached the kid, ask him what he was doing and the kid attacked him, beating him to the ground and then probably did not stop. You see Zimmerman did not resort to his gun first he first called out for help.

I weigh 280 pounds and a 140 pound kid could easily beat me to the ground. I am out of shape, fat and in poor physical condition. Size is nearly irrelevant.

I can tell you that the fact the federal Government is taking no action against the new Black Panthers, the fact that they are taking no civil rights action against Spike Lee sends a clear racist message.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
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Mudwhistle also posted his address; Lee skipped the Million Hoodie March for a pro basketball game. I am NOT defending Lee, I still do not know if he is responsible for the invasion of privacy. *I will condemn the release as it could make FAIR & IMPARTIAL proceedings more difficult. *GOT THAT: CONDEMNED by all who share the information.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


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Provide evidence that he called the Kid a coon. Provide evidence he approached the kid weapon drawn, provide evidence he instigated the fight. It is neither illegal nor inappropriate to approach someone that does not seem to fit where they are and ask them why they are there.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

By Zoom's standards anyone who asks me who I am on post (Ft Campbell) deserves to be beat senseless.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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Please see the highlighted area.  Please link me to where I said Spike lee broke no laws.  If you cant, will you plesae come back here and apologize.  

(People, I called this.  I said he was wrong and it would make the weak minded of the right actually believe we think like he does here).


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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I repeat man up did Spike Lee incite to murder? Or as you have claimed did nothing more then be an idiot? Should the Justice Department investigate him for violating Zimmerman's Civil Rights? Yes or No.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> By Zoom's standards anyone who asks me who I am on post (Ft Campbell) deserves to be beat senseless.



What?

Are you really trying to say, Zimmerman went up to that kid and calmly asked him for credentials?  (you know, like you would be at Ft. Campbell).

He called him a coon, then approached him after hunting him and chasing him down.  Tell me that is the same as asking you for identification on base.  he was instructed to wait for the proper authorities but he didnt.  Is that ok with you?  He approached an unarmed kid, called him a racial epithet and shot and killed him.  In what world is this ok?  Oh yeah, in Florida and in here it seems.

Wow.  I thought you were a little better than this.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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Unfortunately nothing can be done until he gets killed or beating by somebody, and if they do an investigation and discover he has a twitter account and got his address from Spike Lee then charges could be brought against him. As it is now it's a civil case, not a criminal case.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> By Zoom's standards anyone who asks me who I am on post (Ft Campbell) deserves to be beat senseless.



Zimmerman had the ability to draw, if he had not already done so, and shoot Trayvon Martin, square in the chest. He recovered quickly from being "beaten senseless."


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > By Zoom's standards anyone who asks me who I am on post (Ft Campbell) deserves to be beat senseless.
> ...



Provide evidence your claim is factual.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > By Zoom's standards anyone who asks me who I am on post (Ft Campbell) deserves to be beat senseless.
> ...



Yup you are impartial alright.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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I dont know the law well enough to say yes or no or have an opinion actually. My gut says he was wrong.  Illegal, I dont know.   If they go after him and find him guilty, fuck him.  If they go after those morons, the New black panther party, and prosecute them, GOOD.  

I know the law well enough to to have an opinion on Zimmerman though.  I think he killed that unarmed boy and should be thrown under the jail.  

Agreed?


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## daveman (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > Zoom said:
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And yet, oddly, you know almost nothing about the case, Your Honor.

So put down the hangin' rope and let the wheels of justice turn.  

Or you're nothing better than a vigilante yourself.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > By Zoom's standards anyone who asks me who I am on post (Ft Campbell) deserves to be beat senseless.
> ...



I've heard nothing to support that assertion.

Seemed to me that Zimmerman was told he didn't need to follow the kid. He was not ordered. Zimmerman still took it upon himself to follow the kid and he got beat up for it. 

There is no evidence that says Zimmerman called him a coon. That is a rumor. Zimmerman has black family members. Why would he call the kid a coon?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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No. I do not agree. Currently there is ZERO evidence Zimmerman did anything more then defend himself.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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You honestly dont know he called him a "coon"?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


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Link.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Zoom said:
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It would appear he did not "approve" of those he did not know in "his jurisdiction". A wannabe cop it also appears.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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Then why did the captain...the boss of the guy who did the intitial "investigation" quit?
I admit, at this point, Zimmerman is a free man who is still carrying a gun around and that sacres the shit out of me.  

He will be prosecuted and found guilty (imho) but even then some on the right will never admit he did wrong.  


When its all said and done, will you come back and say you were wrong?  I would.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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Then the SA will proceed as advised; the SA in question is known for being TOUGH on crime, not a "bleeding heart".


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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Waiting for that link to Zimmerman calling him a coon.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F1mT3zOmSI]GEORGE ZIMMERMAN UN-EDITED 911 TAPE - SAYS "FUCKING COONS" *Graphic Language - YouTube[/ame]

My bad, he said "fucking" coons. I dont want to misrepresent this fine gentleman.  

Does this make any difference in your mind? 

He also said "they always get away".  Who are they and what exactly was that kid doing wrong?

Again, any differnce?


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## Rat in the Hat (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


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He is not still carrying the gun around...



> SANFORD, Fla.  There is a great deal of misinformation surrounding the Trayvon Martin shooting. Here are some of the most prominent misunderstandings:
> 
> Cops returned the gun to shooter George Zimmerman.
> 
> Untrue, according to police. Sanford Officer Tim Smith handcuffed Zimmerman, and then pulled from a holster in Zimmermans waistband the black Kel Tec 9 mm PF9, a semiautomatic. *The gun is now in the possession of authorities, officially part of the evidence in the case*.



Trayvon Martin case&rsquo;s myths, half truths - BostonHerald.com


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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See above.  Will it change your mind in any way?  Lets see.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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The coon thing came from the audio used by the young turks. You can barely hear someone say CO something.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Zoom said:
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Cool..Thank you.  I did not know this. 

Is there anything stopping him from legally buying another one?


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


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What?  It came from the police tapes.

Damn, will some people ever just admit it.  

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F1mT3zOmSI]GEORGE ZIMMERMAN UN-EDITED 911 TAPE - SAYS "FUCKING COONS" *Graphic Language - YouTube[/ame]


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
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I've read he may have said "goons"; he did say "these a**holes always get away". Not necessarily racist. 

The American Conservative » Murder, Incorporated


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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He could have said coons and he could have also said Goons. when you become excited maybe out of breath you speech doesn't always sound like what you really said.


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## Rat in the Hat (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
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I don't know FL law, but I assume he could until he is convicted of a felony in a court of law.


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## GHook93 (Mar 25, 2012)

The Panthers put a $10K contract the guy! Why aren't they getting arrested for that? 



RetiredGySgt said:


> Isn't issuing posters to kill him advertising for a contract to murder? I don't see the Justice Department doing anything about either the Rush Limbaugh you tube shit or the Black panthers issuing such material for Zimmerman.
> 
> But then Holder is a racist dumb ass.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
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NO, he has not been charged, let alone convicted, of any crime.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Zoom said:
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> > RetiredGySgt said:
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Regardless......sticks and stones.

Words are not legit reasons to try to kill someone or beat them senseless.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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Or kill them with a clean shot in the chest.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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I'm just saying that if they are trying to make it a racial thing they need something better because that audio is not clear enough to say one way or another.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Zoom said:
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Dammit, now I am afraid for the people in Florida again.  This sucks.  IMHO he killed that kid.  Technically there is nothing stopping him from doing it again down there.  IMHO.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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That's your supposed evidence? I don't hear it and in fact they way they played it sounds like garbage to me. Further the source states for the record some claim to hear it and some claim not to hear it. I don't hear it.

As for the other part? he thought he was following a crook, he meant crooks when he said "they". There is nothing racial about it.

In Zimmerman's mind the kid was a crook. And I doubt it had to do with skin color. Or rather there is no evidence it had anything to do with skin color.


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Dragging hate crime into this can obscure the KILLING. Sad to see.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


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At this point, you are actually saying he DID NOT go after that kid because he was black?  There was a witness to all this and he was a white kid with a dog.  Why didnt  Zimmerman think that kid belonged there?  

Seriously, it is racial.  Sometimes you just have to say yup, it was.  

He said "they always get away".  Right before he approached that kid (after stalking and chasing him) he called him a coon.  

Are you serious?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Peach said:


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I see you are being "impartial" again.


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## Zoom (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


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Of course you dont hear it.  Of course.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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and of course you do.. Would you have heard it, if it wasn't pointed out to you?


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## Peach (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
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RGS; there WAS a killing; I believe the focus should be: self defense or a crime; even involuntary manslaughter is a possibility. I don't see 1st degree but the SA and Grand Jury might.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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You have a garbled unintelligible tape that no one can agree on the word used. You have a man who has blacks in his immediate family from what I understand. Someone that has never committed a crime, never been accused of racism. Someone that mistakenly thought he was following a crook.

All he did as far as the evidence shows is approach the person and then get assaulted, and hit in the face and back of the head as well as knocked off his feet. he called for help BEFORE he resorted to his weapon. He shot the person in the front, which indicates the person was NOT running away. This all bolsters Zimmerman's claims it does not support the claim he stalked him, that he drew his weapon before a fight or that He initiated the fight.

You want it to be racial and so hear what you WANT to hear. That part of the tape is useless in a court of law.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> Why didnt  Zimmerman think that kid belonged there?


It was reported that Martin had jumped the fence. However you are saying Zimmerman went after Martin because he was black without any proof. As for me do not put words in my post that I never said. I don't know one way or the other.


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## yidnar (Mar 25, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...


Spike Lee is a racist ...


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

> Should anything happen to Zimmerman, and if the Department of Injustice suddenly discovers rectitude, then I would hope they pursue the same path taken against the Metzgers....


Assuming theres evidence Lee encouraged a person or persons to commit a violent act against Zimmerman. Tweeting the address alone wouldnt constitute such an act, particularly if the address is already known to the public prior to the tweet. 

There would need to be evidence Zimmermans would-be attacker got the address from Lee only and that Lee knew the would-be attacker intended to harm Zimmerman. 

A wrongful death civil suit would require similar evidence.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > Should anything happen to Zimmerman, and if the Department of Injustice suddenly discovers rectitude, then I would hope they pursue the same path taken against the Metzgers....
> 
> 
> Assuming theres evidence Lee encouraged a person or persons to commit a violent act against Zimmerman. Tweeting the address alone wouldnt constitute such an act, particularly if the address is already known to the public prior to the tweet.
> ...



In the court of liberal opinion Sarah Palin was found guilty.


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## Salt Jones (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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You exact words:

1. That's not a residential address, so you're a liar.

2. Since it's not your real address, you're unwilling to do what you think is no big deal in Zimmerman's case, so you're a hypocrite.

3. Since it's not you're real address, you're a coward.

In summary, you're a lying, hypocritical, cowardly, racist, retard robot.

And that truly pathetic thing is you're not even ashamed of it.

You lie.


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

daveman said:


> Polk said:
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What right was violated? Spike Lee is not the government and addresses are publicly available information.


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

Zoom said:


> daveman said:
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I would note I don't agree with what Spike Lee did. I think it creates an environment where violence is more likely to occur. It's just that he didn't do anything illegal.


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
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> > daveman said:
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No evidence of stalking? We have the 911 tapes where Zimmerman is following the kid and being told to by the dispatcher to stay back. We've also got the reports of the girl was on the phone with Trayvon saying he was being followed.


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


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Without any proof? He used a racial slur to describe the kid on the 911 tape.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

Polk said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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I heard that audio, it would never be used in any court of law. The only way you would know what you were looking for is because it was pointed out. You can make anything sound like you want it too sound.


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## Polk (Mar 25, 2012)

There is a difference between saying it would be admissible in court and claiming there is no proof at all.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 25, 2012)

Polk said:


> There is a difference between saying it would be admissible in court and claiming there is no proof at all.



There isn't any proof that Zimmerman stopped Martin because he was black.


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## Papageorgio (Mar 25, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> California Girl said:
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> 
> > [
> ...



Why is he getting charged? If it is because the race baiters want revenge, I not for it. If it is for justice then let's proceed.


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## Papageorgio (Mar 25, 2012)

Polk said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > Polk said:
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Intent could be applied, if Lee posted the tweet knowing that people would go find and harm Mr. Zimmerman it could be considered depraved indifference, it would be tough to prove however... 

Besides, Lee would hire attorneys that none of us could afford. So he'd probably get off, like Simpson did.


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## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

Papageorgio said:


> Polk said:
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> > daveman said:
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I wouldn't focus on Lee. I'd focus on Zimmerman....


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Polk said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
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You might want to look up the legal definition of stalking, a neighborhood watch person following a suspicious individual for a few minutes is NOT stalking. Nor does it allow the person followed to attack that person when they ask them a question. Isn't it telling that the left will defend the physical attack of someone simply because the press and mob mentality has taken hold. By the way the shooter is NOT white, he is Hispanic. Last I checked no one has EVER referred to Hispanics as white when they are the victims.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Polk said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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You can not prove that. I listened to the supposed slur, I can't even tell what the word was. It is garbled even after being "enhanced" further there is no consensus that it was coon, and last I checked goon sounds pretty much like coon as well. Your 911 tape is worthless and is not evidence of anything. Any reasonable person listing to it will tell you it is unintelligible.


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## daveman (Mar 26, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> daveman said:
> 
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Yes, I said address, not neighborhood.

I was wrong.

And you're still a hypocritical, cowardly, racist, retard robot.


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## daveman (Mar 26, 2012)

Polk said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
> ...


Like I said:  the "right to privacy" sure seems to evaporate whenever it's convenient, doesn't it?


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Polk said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
> ...



A gun doesn't become a danger till you put bullets in it.

Neither does an address till you add malice and bad intentions. 

Giving out the address to somebody that is hated by thousands, if not millions of people, is instigating a crime. 

Making a threat against anyone other than the President doesn't become a crime until you have the will and the opportunity to go through with that threat. Idle threats are meaningless, but knowing that there are folks out there looking for Zimmerman who want to kill him Spike Lee became an accomplice. If his twitter account becomes "Get Zimmerman Central", which it appears it has, he's in deep shit.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
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Where are you getting that from? This witness said no such thing.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > Should anything happen to Zimmerman, and if the Department of Injustice suddenly discovers rectitude, then I would hope they pursue the same path taken against the Metzgers....
> 
> 
> Assuming there&#8217;s evidence Lee encouraged a person or persons to commit a violent act against Zimmerman. Tweeting the address alone wouldn&#8217;t constitute such an act, particularly if the address is already known to the public prior to the tweet.
> ...



Lee wouldn't have to know the attacker. 

Publishing someones address with the intent to do harm is grounds for reckless endangerment charges. 

_*Reckless endangerment: A person commits the crime of reckless endangerment if the person recklessly engages in conduct which creates a substantial risk of serious physical injury to another person. &#8220;Reckless&#8221; conduct is conduct that exhibits a culpable disregard of foreseeable consequences to others from the act or omission involved. The accused need not intentionally cause a resulting harm. The ultimate question is whether, under all the circumstances, the accused&#8217;s conduct was of that heedless nature that made it actually or imminently dangerous to the rights or safety of others.*_​
Since Spike Lee's Twitter account is highly visible he may be charged with this crime right now. It depends if anyone wants to swear out a warrant on him.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...



Naw.

Operation Rescue and Sarah Palin targets people all the time.

No arrests.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...



Sarah Palin wasn't trying to kill anyone. Now, the assholes that accused her of targeting people for violence are more liable to cause physical harm to someone than Sarah Palin simply putting a bullseye on a place on the map.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > > Should anything happen to Zimmerman, and if the Department of Injustice suddenly discovers rectitude, then I would hope they pursue the same path taken against the Metzgers....
> ...



Funny you mention that..

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tTDiZZYCAs]Gabrielle Giffords warns Sarah Palin there will be consequences. - YouTube[/ame]


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
> 
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> > mudwhistle said:
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Giffords had a different opinion.

I sure you think she was wrong.

Just as your thread here is wrong.

Unless of course..you are being inconsistent.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

daveman said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
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> > daveman said:
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Actually Dave the address lee gave was to a house. google it.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
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You're trying to distract from the issue.

And what you think is irrelevant. 

Did Sarah Palin give out Gabby Gifford's address knowing 5000 racist blacks were looking to kill her????


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
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> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



So Sarah Palin had nukes she could have dropped on Gabby Gifford's district?

Keep going dip-shit.

It gets funnier by the minute.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
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Not distracting from it at all. Actually..trying to help you here ace.

Palin's and Operation Rescue's shennigans resulted in death. Mr. Lee should take that to heart.

But of course..you only see Lee as wrong.

Which makes you a hypocrite.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
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> > mudwhistle said:
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You mad bro?


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## Papageorgio (Mar 26, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> > Polk said:
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I'd focus on both, Lee for possibly inciting violence and Zimmerman for his actions in killing Martin.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
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You're grasping at straws. If you think you could prove this nonsense in any court, feel free. It may work in the warped minds of those on the left but not in reality. 

Course folks like you don't need reality to think you have a valid point.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

Papageorgio said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > Papageorgio said:
> ...



I'm with ya. And we can finally bring Palin and Operation Rescue to justice as well.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
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No.....simply amused.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
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> > mudwhistle said:
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Of course I am not "grasping at straws". At almost every turn your hypocrisy is like a beacon. Spot lighting it..is fun...however.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Papageorgio said:
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> > Dr Grump said:
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Well, good luck doing that......


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
> 
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> > Papageorgio said:
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So, was Giffords wrong?


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
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RLMAO

You have this habit of not thinking things out completely.

I guess that's why you support Obama.

*If Gabby Gifford made the rally she was shot at a public event she would be more at blame for what happened to her than anyone. Good luck trying to prove Sarah Palin had anything to do with it. *


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

Seems you can't answer the question, eh? Muddy.

Typical.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Seems you can't answer the question, eh? Muddy.
> 
> Typical.



I answered it numb-nuts.

Go back and read.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Seems you can't answer the question, eh? Muddy.
> 
> Typical.



I hope you're not a lawyer......you'll need to start looking for another job.

Try politics......perfect for bullshitters like you.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...



And how is what you've just done any different?


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Seems you can't answer the question, eh? Muddy.
> ...



Ah..okay. You sorta disguised the answer.

So..what we learn here..is either your thread is total bullshit..because you point as one action being wrong and another not..

Or you are just racist.

Both are okay by the way.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
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> > Sallow said:
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Good come-back.

Excellent.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
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> > Ravi said:
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He is identified as "John" and did  not want to appear on camera. He has received death threats for telling the truth.
He saw Martin attack Zimmerman and then went upstairs to his apartment. He also says the screams on the 911 tape are Zimmerman.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

btw, that address isn't in the community where Zimmerman claims he lived and where Martin was shot.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
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He didn't say what you claimed above in bold.

Why did you lie about that?


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
> 
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> > mudwhistle said:
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Hey thanks!

Here's something else for ya to chew on..

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZYbAhCdmZs]Calling Murdered Dr Tiller "Baby Killer" Was Wrong? - YouTube[/ame]


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
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> > Gadawg73 said:
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In what media report is this?  If you've linked before, I apologize.  I try to hit every link, though, and I don't recall this one.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> btw, that address isn't in the community where Zimmerman claims he lived and where Martin was shot.



He moved.

Lee shouldn't have done this..no matter how he feels. It's a dangerous thing to do.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > btw, that address isn't in the community where Zimmerman claims he lived and where Martin was shot.
> ...


Absolutely. And the Blaze shouldn't have published it either. Nor should Muddie have plastered it all over USMB.


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > btw, that address isn't in the community where Zimmerman claims he lived and where Martin was shot.
> ...


We agree.

And, Zimmerman's parents had to move.

Now, they'll all have to move again.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
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> 
> > Ravi said:
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Fox station in Tampa. Google Zimmerman witness and it comes up.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



Coulda shoulda woulda.....


Big problem.....the address was already public.....

I got it from the Blaze......so nice try.


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Ah.  I got this in the NY Post:  "....

The guy on the bottom, who I believe had a red sweater on, was yelling to me, Help, help. I told him to stop, I was calling 911, John told the TV station. Zimmerman was wearing red.

When I got upstairs and looked down, the person that was on top beating up the other guy was laying in the grass. And I believe he was dead at that point, the eyewitness claimed.

...."

Read more: Alleged eyewitness backs George Zimmerman in killing of Trayvon Martin - NYPOST.com


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Oh, and the Blaze got it from Spike Lee....who got it from somebody else.....then he sent it out to about a quarter of a million followers.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

I'm sure who ever is at that address will appreciate it.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



He told the police that.
How does someone get a laceration that has to be treated with first aid in the back of the head if they were not hit from behind?
Why are you so dense to the facts?
As someone that is different than you and not prejudiced and biased I remain willing to listen to all evidence before I would make a decision as to guilt or innocence in this matter.
You however, have your closed mind made up having NOT heard any grand jury presentation of anything other THAN RANK HEARSAY AND MEDIA BIAS.
No wonder politicians run 30 second ads on TV. The dumbmasses fall for that shit hook line and sinker as evidenced here.
Have an open mind and govern yourself accordingly. Something about THE CONSTITUTION.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



There's no record anywhere that he told the police that. And he certainly doesn't say that in the FOX interview.

You're the one that is making up "facts" dude.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Now get ready for everyone here to claim he is an Aryan Nation racist and a liar and anti hoodie or some crazy shit.
Word down there is the New Black Panthers have death bounties on ANYONE that dares testify to anything other than the pre-arranged script that media has already parrotted. 
Facts do not mean anything to these folks. Media says Zimmerman is guilty, Al Sharpton has the evidence and everyone that disagrees is a racist.
Pure and simple.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



Ever heard of a statement?
Again, how does someone get a laceration that requires stitches IN THE BACK OF THE HEAD without getting hit from behind?
This ought to be rich.

Go read the police report and read the narrative. Hint to the dumbmasses: police narratives are based ON WITNESS STATEMENTS.
well DUH!
Stick to your day job Moe. I have been investigating criminal cases for over 30 years.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



You can't be a cop, unless you're a dirty cop. You made up what the witness said. Shame on you.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Damn......nobody wants to play anymore?

Guess common-sense and effective reasoning tends to do that. 


Funny, all of that BS last year on Sarah Palin being the cause of the Gabby Gifford attack and I was able to totally debunk it in one sentence.


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


One can get a laceration on the back of the head if they are pushed or fall on their back.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Damn......nobody wants to play anymore?
> 
> Guess common-sense and effective reasoning tends to do that.
> 
> ...



You didn't "debunk" shit.

What you did was spotlight either your hypocrisy or racism.

Your choice.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



Tell you what as I have repeated this 100 times here:
We both put in 10K as to my qualifications and we pick an independent person to validate I have a licensed private detective agency owner since 1982. I started in 1979 and then in '82 the law required a license. Guess what kind of background and training that requires.
Of course anyone that disagrees with your bias and prejudice has to be "dirty".
In? 10K.
Thought so.

Have you read the incident report?
It clearly states "Zimmerman with lacerations on the back of the head"
And Zimmerman told them he was attacked from behind.
And the witness was asked if he saw Martin attack Zimmerman from behind.
And the incident report also states "Zimmerman treated with first aid at scene"\

Now let me appeal to your reason and common sense Ravi: If the police note that there were bad lacerations in the back of someone's head after a scuffle and they NOTE that along with other relevant information ABOUT THE LACERATION and then NOTE THREE WITNESSES in the incident report, what does that indicate to you?
In short, if after a fight someone has a laceration in the back of their head, can it get there from someone attacking from the front?
READ THE INCIDENT REPORT and get back to us.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



The incident report says nothing of the sort.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



And one can get shot if the gun goes off accidentally?

HAHAHAHAHA. Works every time. 
Amazing how it does take a while some time to get folks to this point but this proves it.

You are willing to look at every possible scenario out there that makes Martin look good but ARE UNWILLING to give Zimmerman the SAME standard.
And Zimmerman is the accused! The accused under our law is ALWAYS given the presumption of innocence.
You are a hypocrit.


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Wut?

I know the accused are given the presumption of innocence.

I also KNOW when I DON'T know everything.  You asked how someone could get a laceration to the back of their head and I gave you an answer in addition to yours.

And, I dare you to evaluate my posts on this matter and tell me I'm assuming anything (that I don't already acknowledge as an assumption).

Sheesh.  I have a leftie whackjob incessantly PMing me this morning telling me I am convinced that Zimmerman is without fault, and now you seem convinced that I think he IS at fault.

As I have said so many times, I AM INTERESTED IN THE INTEGRITY OF THE PROCESS.

And, those who aren't can pound sand while they watch another thing that makes this country great be tossed aside.


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## beagle9 (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Well Zimmerman said (((OK))) when the operator said "We don't need you to do that", in which means to me that Zimmerman was willing to stop survielence on Trayvon at that point, and yes you two are right, that "We don't need you to do that" is not a command, but more of a suggestion by them to Zimmerman, that it is dangerous to follow someone in such a situation, and Zimmerman understood that when he said (((OK))).


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Damn......nobody wants to play anymore?
> ...



Waaaaaaaaaaaaa

You got owned.


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## Papageorgio (Mar 26, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



Goon or coon? I can't tell and neither could many experts, but you seem to be able to, interesting, and who could they be? Criminals, kids, but you go again directly to the race card. Interesting.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

Papageorgio said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Yeah..it was coons. In any case..it follows the narrative that 911 tapes show. And Zimmerman's previous calls..all which were made on black people.


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



Naw..your bullshit got owned.

But your a legend in your own mind.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...




Anyone can make something indiscernible sound the way they want it to sound. I doubt that you would have said that sounds like he said coon unless it was pointed out to you.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

This illustrates what's wrong with the left. 

They have an agenda, and they have a schedule. They spend all of their time faking events and twisting real ones beyond recognition. 

What is real doesn't matter. They try to shape perceptions into the direction needed to prove whatever their ideology requires. 

It doesn't matter that Zimmerman is Hispanic. They try to convince their ignorant followers he's Caucasian. It doesn't matter the facts of the incident. Paybacks are in order. So hateful fuck wads like Spike Lee get to act like Do Gooders when in fact they're instigating more and more hatred.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



Maybe you should start a poll and see if anyone's buying your BS or just seeing it for what it is......a face-saving attempt.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 26, 2012)

Last election California democrats published the addresses and posted pictures of the homes of registered republicans or those homes with "McCain" posters so that outraged criminals could target them.

That's why Ann Coulter's book "Demonic" was so perceptive.  Liberals and their street thugs have the mob when they don't have the law.


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## driveby (Mar 26, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



You ain't gonna do shit except troll this message board......


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Papageorgio said:
> ...


Some are more susceptible to the power of suggestion than others.  They are also the ones who can be hypnotized.

(I have tried, and I can't be.)


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## Sallow (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



Not face "saving" at all. We are dealing with reality here. I posted several actions that were quite similar to the one Lee engaged in. By the way..I think what Lee, Palin, Operation Rescue and O'Reilly did was wrong.

Out of those choices..you believe only one person did something wrong.

That person was black. Spike Lee.

So..either you are using a racial exception or a political one.

You look bad either way.

Poll? On a mostly conservative board? Are you mad? Next you'll wanna bet me $10,000 dollars.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



True enough tried the new fad hypnosis years ago to quite smoking,  didn't  work, The only thing that did was  tell my mind enough is enough and I quite.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



The only reality you'll admit to is that what Lee did was wrong. 

Using moral relativism to attack Palin is weak. 

The reasons I gave were valid. 

So, you threw out the race-card because your argument is lame.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Ok, I see where you are coming from. Thought devil's advocate would bring it out and did not mean to offend you.
Point is that there are always 2 sides to the argument and that is where I am coming.
I see that you are interested in looking at both sides.
My bad. Took it the wrong way. I was wrong about what you meant.
Allergy medications early in the morning with coffee. 
Totally saw what you posted different and now see it as what you meant. Sorry.


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## Si modo (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


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## gallantwarrior (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



He doesn't need any more "evidence" than that which has been publicized by the racist media.  So far, actual facts of the investigation have been pretty tightly controlled.  I am willing to wait for the professionals to finish their job.  I'm betting that Zoom doesn't even live in the same county where this occurred.


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## gallantwarrior (Mar 26, 2012)

Zoom said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



How do you know he did?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Police investigation and reports and evidence to the crime lab.
Good thing.
Interviews with all witnesses, evidence gathered and secured and statements taken at scene.
Good thing.
District attorneys notified within 48 hours with file, notes and statements sent.
Good thing.
Evidence sent to Florida crime lab for examination.
Good thing.
District attorney sets date for grand jury hearing based on time frame of when Florida crime lab may complete initial examinations.
Good thing.
Federal DOJ sends team to investigate.
Maybe an over reaction but the law is the law.
Good thing.
State of Florida enters the investigation.
Good thing.

So where is this "police corruption" and "nothing is getting done"?
Where is it? 
From the start this case was handled exactly by the book from start to finish.


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## gallantwarrior (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



That is absolutely correct and appears to be one of the unintended consequences.  What might otherwise have been a far simpler case has now become extremely complicated because now the prosecution should have to prove what a man was thinking at a specific point in time.  There is no such thing as a "hate" crime.  People don't commit crimes because they care deeply for their victims.


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## Big Fitz (Mar 26, 2012)

George Zimmerman's Attorney and Friend Speak About Trayvon Martin Incident - ABC News

Ain't looking good for the race baiters and those who want to kill Zimmerman.


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## Polk (Mar 26, 2012)

Papageorgio said:


> Polk said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



He'd "get off" because he didn't do anything illegal.


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## Polk (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Polk said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



If that were true, there would be a lot of leading evangelicals sitting in prison right now for the abortion provider lists they put out.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Trayvon Martin Shooter Told Cops Teenager Went For His Gun - Yahoo!

The 6" 3" "kid went for Zimmerman's gun after knocking him down and breaking his nose. So much for an open and shut case of murder. Sure sounds like self defense to me.

Besides the fact he had no reason to attack Zimmerman.


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## theHawk (Mar 26, 2012)

I guessed that this is probably what happened.

When I pointed that out our resident libtards stated that someone going for your gun doesn't constitute using lethal force.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/race-...shoots-innocent-black-teen-4.html#post4985143


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## uscitizen (Mar 26, 2012)

Broken nose?


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Trayvon Martin Shooter Told Cops Teenager Went For His Gun - Yahoo!
> 
> The 6" 3" "kid went for Zimmerman's gun after knocking him down and breaking his nose. So much for an open and shut case of murder. Sure sounds like self defense to me.
> 
> Besides the fact he had no reason to attack Zimmerman.



In all fairness, someone follows me through an apartment complex in the dark, I'm going to cold cock them.


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## theHawk (Mar 26, 2012)

Its also coming out that the "innocent kid" was once suspended from school from being caught with an empty bag of weed.

I know it doesn't have anything to do with the case, but it sure doesn't fit the narrative the liberal media has been painting for us about this kid.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

uscitizen said:


> Broken nose?



Not up to date? Been reported in several sources that he had a broken nose. As well as wounds to the back of his head.


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## theHawk (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> uscitizen said:
> 
> 
> > Broken nose?
> ...



Rachel Madcow probably didn't clue him in on all the facts.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 26, 2012)

theHawk said:


> Its also coming out that the "innocent kid" was once suspended from school from being caught with an empty bag of weed.
> 
> I know it doesn't have anything to do with the case, but it sure doesn't fit the narrative the liberal media has been painting for us about this kid.



It does fit with Zimmerman's report that the kid looked like he was on drugs and explains why Martin was tested for drugs.

Treyvon Martin was a drug user, this just became justifiable homicide no matter what else happens.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Trayvon Martin Shooter Told Cops Teenager Went For His Gun - Yahoo!
> ...



And try to get his gun before he shoots me.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 26, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> theHawk said:
> 
> 
> > Its also coming out that the "innocent kid" was once suspended from school from being caught with an empty bag of weed.
> ...



The deceased was tested for drugs and alcohol, did the results come back positive? or are you just making this up?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Police just released a stamtement:
"the evidence indicates the teen attacked before the community watch officer shot him"
Well I will be damned.
Now the grand jury will have this evidence.
If the evidence indicates that Martin was the attacker then how many here now claim this is murder?
Still may be manslaughter and maybe the police are wrong.
But is the evidence wrong?
Evidence is never wrong. Evidence is impartial.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Police just released a stamtement:
> *"the evidence indicates the teen attacked before the community watch officer shot him"*
> Well I will be damned.
> Now the grand jury will have this evidence.
> ...


Link?


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## Katzndogz (Mar 26, 2012)

Spike Lee publishes Zimmerman's address with the intention that someone collect the reward for bringing him to street justice.   Someone takes uses that information to take up the reward offer.   Florida still has a stand your ground law.   The bounty hunter smashes in Zimmerman's door and goes down in a hail of gunfire.

Spike Lee gets arrested for murder along with the person who published the reward.


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## daveman (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...


Really?  Palin has published the address of people with whom she disagrees?

Doubtful.


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## daveman (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...


I know.  I was discussing racist asshole Salt's address.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...




I cannot be hypontized either Si. I tried to find something valuable belonging to my mother, WHICH I LOST. Neither of two hypnotists did much of anything but bore me...........................


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## California Girl (Mar 26, 2012)

driveby said:


> Salt Jones said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



When Saltie the Racist says 'we' he means himself and the voices in his head. The voices tell him to wait. No doubt white people across the country are trembling.... with laughter at his punk ass 'threats'.


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## Katzndogz (Mar 26, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > theHawk said:
> ...



That's why he was suspended from school.   He was a pot user.  I posted that awhile ago.

He called himself the "No Limit Nigga".   He was a member of a hash group called Team4dat.  

Was Trayvon Martin a Drug Dealer?

My personal opinion is that the faster druggies get taken out the better off we all are.  Let them use, but the public needs to be protected.  It seems like Zimmerman was doing just that.


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## mudwhistle (Mar 26, 2012)

California Girl said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Salt basically said that Zimmerman deserved an ass-whipping for using a racial slur.

That's essentially the problem with blacks in America. Pride is one of those deadly sins that is killing more and more of them every day.

Learning to turn the other cheek is not taught. They teach their kids to carry a chip on their shoulders. Anyone disrespects you and you are supposed to react. Well I say that is what is wrong with black America. 

Sometimes you have to take shit to keep an incident from happening. Sometimes you have to take shit from your boss or you have to take shit to keep the peace. If you fly off the handle at the slightest affront guess where you end up???

In prison......or dead.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Police just released a stamtement:
> ...



Front and center msn.comI sure feel bad for the Martin family in all of this. They have been conned by the media, Al Sharpton and the rush to judgment 30 second sound bite worshipers.
Prayers and thoughts to the Martin family. They were taken advantage of by the publicity whores.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

daveman said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



I realize that after I posted it, and felt if I deleted it, it would look dishonest or I was trying to hide something.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Jesus could come back and state he was an eye witness to this and that would not be good enough for those that need to believe that Martin was not at fault in any way.
So why link anything?
Your mind is made up no matter what anyone says or testifies to.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


There's nothing at your link that says what you claim. I suppose you are talking about the article stating that Zimmerman told the police that Martin attacked him. That isn't _evidence_, it is his statement. There's a lot more to _evidence_ than someone's words.


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## daveman (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



No worries.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



You are a dumb ass for sure "Police sources told the Sentinel that their evidence indicated it was Zimmerman" that were the cries of distress, not Martin.
"One witness said he saw Martin pounding Zimmerman on the ground"
Can't you read you fool?:
"Zimmerman told police that Martin knocked him down with a single punch and slammed his head into the sidewalk several times before the shooting, *AN ACCOUNT THAT POLICE SAID WITNESSES HAVE CORROBARATED"*

Like I said nothing will change your biased and prejudiced mind.
Witnesses corroborate, I doubt you even know what that means, Zimmerman's account.

But go ahead and hide like a 5 year old, whine, bitch and moan and keep sending me rude neg reps.
I like them, keep them coming.
Tells me you know you are beat.

Wham it zero on set, EP team on the ready for 1, 2nd KO team on the pads and 4th string D to coordinator group.


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## theHawk (Mar 26, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > theHawk said:
> ...



I thought I heard he was tested but came back negative.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


You still don't have a link. Big fucking surprise.

And your whine over a neg is noticed.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.

Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community. 

Called 911 the EVENING he killed an armed teenager, Trayvon Martin. Ignored the advice given, and continued following the teenager.

Suffered minor wounds at some point in the encounter. Zimmerman was found standing over the young man he killed when police arrived minutes later. He went to a doctor the next day. Never entered a hospital, the police describe his injuries as NOT SERIOUS.

He remains free, in hiding, allegedly remorseful; why he might be remorseful after he killed in "self defense" is also unknown.

The evidence in the case is stale, no toxicology tests were done on the killer. Little evidence collected by the Sanford PD, no further investigation until the killing was publicized. 

Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Today the mother of this poor deceased kid filed trademark rights with the US Patent office so she can sell T shirts and hats and start a clothing line and cash in.
And the law firm that is "representing" the family signed the documents filed today.
No wonder Al and Jesse and professional "racism" thieves are there.
You folks are dumber than a box of rocks.
All about the $$$ first and foremost.
DUMBASSES.
Mother Seeks Trayvon Martin Trademarks | The Smoking Gun


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## percysunshine (Mar 26, 2012)

Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Today the mother of this poor deceased kid filed trademark rights with the US Patent office so she can sell T shirts and hats and start a clothing line and cash in.
> And the law firm that is "representing" the family signed the documents filed today.
> No wonder Al and Jesse and professional "racism" thieves are there.
> You folks are dumber than a box of rocks.
> ...


Right, because his mother's actions make him guilty.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

percysunshine said:


> Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.



The death of a unarmed 17 year old, going to a store during half time of a basketball game,  walking with Skittles & iced tea to his father's home,  is a joke to some I gather. I pray it does not happen to any of your loved ones.


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## percysunshine (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.
> ...



Like you were there? Watched the whole thing. Sure.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 26, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Today the mother of this poor deceased kid filed trademark rights with the US Patent office so she can sell T shirts and hats and start a clothing line and cash in.
> ...



Didn't say that. 
But you bought hook line and sinker their con from the start.
The entire thing is a fraud.
Admit it and move on. They conned you and you bought it hook line and sinker.
Leave these things to us professionals. 
I still say the indictment will be lower homicide charges and probably manslaughter.
Involuntary with a max of 1 year to serve on a 10 year sentence, the rest to be probated.
But Ravi, the sad part of this they had a GOOD civil case no matter what the criminal outcome is. Do you know why? I will once again teach you some law.
The burden in civil court is the preponderance of the evidence, NOT beyond a reasonable doubt. Of course any lawyer worth a nickel looks for the deep pocket in a civil case and so that would mean the association of the community where Zimmerman lived and the liability policy associated with that.
This patent filing RUINS that case from day one.
But hey! Trayvon T shirts, hats, CDs and flip flops rule and count more. 
What size T shirt do you wear Ravi? How about a hat to go along with it.
Only in America where the dumbmasses rule the day. 
Unbelievable. 
I am sure you would admit the family is CORRUPT!?
S..........L..................A...................M    D.................U...................N.....................K


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> 
> Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community.
> 
> ...



I SEE YOU ARE BEING IMPARTIAL AGAIN.

Lets try this.  Trayvon Martin shooting: New details emerge from Facebook and Twitter accounts, witness testimony | The Cutline - Yahoo! News 

Seems the kid also swung on a bus driver and was slamming Zimmerman's head into the pavement. The kid attacked Zimmerman. As evidenced by EYEWITNESS testimony. That is a fact. It is also a fact he broke his nose and put a wound on the back of his head. All corroborated by EYEWITNESS testimony.

I think I will believe Zimmerman when he says he called for help and did not fire until he feared for his life. The fact his the girl friend confirms all he did is ask him a question. An eye witness confirms Martin ASSAULTED Zimmerman, knocked him to the ground with one blow and pounded his head into the pavement. His online activity shows he had at least one violent encounter with a bus driver as well.

Zimmerman claims he tried to take his gun, which would appear, based on EYEWITNESS testimony to appear to be what happened. Knocked to the ground with the assailant pounding his head on the ground he then grabs for the gun.  Zimmerman defended himself.

But thanks for staying impartial and all.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 26, 2012)

> Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.



A question clearly rhetorical.


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## Ravi (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


You're no professional, you've been making up "facts" all along. Please post your real name so anyone and their brother knows to steer clear of you.


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## Old Rocks (Mar 26, 2012)

A 17 year old boy goes out to get a snack and a can of tea. No prior record, no prior problems with fighting or aggressiveness. A man that has had prior problems on both accounts is out with a gun. He follows the boy, and, in spite of being told not to, confronts him. The boy asks "Why are you following me?", the man asks, "What are you doing here". That is the last we know of the exchange, what we do know, is that a fight ensued, and the man with the gun killed the boy.

From this alone, I would say a murder took place. The man had no right to confront the boy. At that point, the boy had the right to do whatever he could, not knowing what the fellow was up to.

Yet, once again, the wingnuts have come down on the side of the criminal.


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## TruthSeeker56 (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> 
> Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community.
> 
> ...



I guess you missed the part about Martin knocking Zimmerman to the ground and slamming Zimmerman's head to the pavement over and over again?  

I guess you missed the part about Martin attacking Zimmerman being corroborated by SEVERAL witnesses?

Maybe you also missed the part about Zimmerman NOT being a "Jew".

Zimmerman is HISPANIC.

Does Zimmerman's race make ANY difference to you, or is this strictly another "poor and innocent and misunderstood black kid getting killed" story that has been blown way out of proportion by race warlords and people like you?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> A 17 year old boy goes out to get a snack and a can of tea. No prior record, no prior problems with fighting or aggressiveness. A man that has had prior problems on both accounts is out with a gun. He follows the boy, and, in spite of being told not to, confronts him. The boy asks "Why are you following me?", the man asks, "What are you doing here". That is the last we know of the exchange, what we do know, is that a fight ensued, and the man with the gun killed the boy.
> 
> From this alone, I would say a murder took place. The man had no right to confront the boy. At that point, the boy had the right to do whatever he could, not knowing what the fellow was up to.
> 
> Yet, once again, the wingnuts have come down on the side of the criminal.



Except for that pesky eye witness account of the Kid attacking Zimmerman. Except for the fact we have prior knowledge now that the "kid" has been violent with at least one bus driver. Except for the fact an eye witness saw Martin knock Zimmerman to the ground, pound his head on the ground. Yup lets ignore all those facts shall we?


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> ...



The head bashing is untrue, even the Sanford police reported NO SERIOUS INJURIES. I had a wound to his head which a DOCTOR treated, perhaps with pain medication. NO hospital visit.  *My bias is in favor of a complete investigation in in ANY killing; that did not happen here *& it may do not know if Zimmerman did commit a crime; I DO know the shooting death should have a been priority with law enforcement in February, not late March.


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## Care4all (Mar 26, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Today the mother of this poor deceased kid filed trademark rights with the US Patent office so she can sell T shirts and hats and start a clothing line and cash in.
> And the law firm that is "representing" the family signed the documents filed today.
> No wonder Al and Jesse and professional "racism" thieves are there.
> You folks are dumber than a box of rocks.
> ...


fyi, it DOES NOT SAY in the ad that she bought the trademarks to sell the stuff....it's possible but that's NOT what was said in your link....

MANY times, people trademark phrases and terms so to protect themselves and family, so that OTHERS do not abuse or take advantage of their family....or of them.

as example, keith obermann trademarked ''countdown''  years before he was let go....he never used the trademark outside of msnbc's show with him as the host....

but years later, when he quit or was pushed out, his trademark of ''countdown'' prevented msnbc to continue with the countdown show.....


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.
> 
> 
> 
> A question clearly rhetorical.



No, I wonder why THIS victim received so little attention from law enforcement until DEMONSTRATIONS took place, and why there is a firm defense of the killer by so many who decry street crimes.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Old Rocks said:
> 
> 
> > A 17 year old boy goes out to get a snack and a can of tea. No prior record, no prior problems with fighting or aggressiveness. A man that has had prior problems on both accounts is out with a gun. He follows the boy, and, in spite of being told not to, confronts him. The boy asks "Why are you following me?", the man asks, "What are you doing here". That is the last we know of the exchange, what we do know, is that a fight ensued, and the man with the gun killed the boy.
> ...




Zimmerman's injuries, as reported by the police, and evidenced by his actions, are not consistent with that account. The killer has a defense attorney who makes public statements many are taking at face value, thus far.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Old Rocks said:
> ...



What part of EYE Witness do you fail to grasp? You brought Zimmerman's past into, guess what? Martin has a past too and it is starting to come out. And it isn't looking so good. But you ignore all that. By the way? Zimmerman's nose was broken and he had an injury to the back of his head consistent with that eye witness account.


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## percysunshine (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Old Rocks said:
> ...



We should all take everything posted on USMB as fact. Wait...I didn't say that....


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## Luddly Neddite (Mar 26, 2012)

percysunshine said:


> Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.



Elsewhere, some vacuous rw demands to know who would cheer a heart attack and yet, read this forum - you'll find a lot rw's making excuses for the wanton murder of a 17 year old kid and worse, making excuses for the killer. 

Oh, but that's different, right?

You're right. It IS different. 

Cheney isn't black.


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## percysunshine (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.
> ...



Rdean is white. How did you go racist on an rdean joke? You libs are a hoot.


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## Trajan (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > > Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.
> ...



yes, well I wonder why this received so little attention, where are HiJackson and Sharkskin? 

 

Shooting death of 6&#8211;year-old girl punctuates lethal Chicago weekend
'She didn't deserve this,' mother says; 49 people are shot citywide, 10 fatally




March 20, 2012
_Diana Aguilar was distraught with grief Monday as she sat in the purple-and-pink bedroom of her 6-year-old daughter, gripping photos of her "baby."

Two days earlier, on a sunny afternoon more like a June day, Aliyah Shell was sitting between her mother's legs on the family's Little Village front porch as Aguilar untangled her hair. The family had a friend's birthday party to attend.

Suddenly, shots rang out from a pickup truck. Aguilar said she knocked her 2-year-old daughter on her back and hugged Aliyah tightly. But Aliyah was shot several times and died that afternoon at a hospital.

"She didn't deserve this," the mother repeated over and over again Monday as she sat on her daughter's bed, which was covered with bright balloons, stuffed animals and family photos. "They're not people. They're animals for doing this to my baby. A person with a heart would never do this, so they're not people."

Aliyah's shooting was the most shocking of a particularly violent weekend in Chicago. According to an analysis by the Tribune, *49 people were shot &#8212; 10 of them fatally *&#8212; from late Friday afternoon through early Monday, mostly on the South and Southwest sides. Chicago police, excluding Monday morning from the calculation, said nine homicides took place over the weekend.

The deadly weekend continues a violent start to 2012. From Jan. 1 through Sunday, homicides soared 42 percent, to 94 from 66 a year earlier, according to a police spokeswoman. So far in 2012, nonfatal shootings rose to 408, up from 296 a year earlier, a 38 percent jump, she said. That continues a troubling trend that started in the last quarter of 2011. Police say gangs are to blame for much of the violence, including Aliyah's killing._


more at-

Murder of 6-year-old girl caps violent weekend in Chicago - chicagotribune.com



We all know why, becasue the media and those 2 'persons' didn't have a race card to play,  BUT and you can see it now, they are slowly very slowly but incrementally walking back the race angle...why?

Zimmerman despite his name, he is Hispanic, looks Hispanic  and the last thing the Democratic party hence their media sympathizers wants is a Hispanics and blacks to come to blows over this.....


oh and the NY Times referred to Zimmerman as a ....wait for it-......."White Hispanic"... 


 I bet if he saved kids form a burning building or was running for office as a democrat or HE was shot by a 'real' white man in exactly the same situation,  they would _never ever _refer to him as a "white" Hispanic.....simply shameless.


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## TruthSeeker56 (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.
> ...



OK, so you're a RACIST, a race-baiter, and a HATER.  

Nobody is "making excuses" for the "wanton murder of a 17 year old kid".  But somebody (namely, YOU and your ilk), is jumping to conclusions.

Thus far, the KILLING is not a "murder", and the HISPANIC man acted in self-defense.  That's the TRUE story, based on eye witness accounts.

Lastly, when race warlords like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton get involved, that's the signal that the CIRCUS is in town, and the whole situation has turned into an "event" chock full of clowns, magicians, carnival barkers, and other LOSERS.

I see you've already purchased your tickets, and you have front row seats.  Enjoy the funnel cakes.


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## Luddly Neddite (Mar 26, 2012)

> No, I wonder why THIS victim received so little attention from law enforcement until DEMONSTRATIONS took place, and why there is a firm defense of the killer by so many who decry street crimes.



Its been a month since he was shot by Zimmerman. Unlike the non-existent comparison that Trajan tries and fails to make, the police knew who the killer was and still let him go. They probably also knew his long and very violent history but they still let him go.

Since when do the parents of murdered children have to demonstrate in order to get theie child's killer arrested? 

And, to my knowledge, this jerk STILL has not been arrested.

Why not?


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## Vel (Mar 26, 2012)

Trajan said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Probably the same reason this... Women May Have Texted Killers&#39; IDs From Trunk, As Authorities Confirm Bodies Found In Shallow Grave | Fox News  is getting so little attention. Although the article doesn't say, I'm willing to bet that the shooters in this case aren't white.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Trajan said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Were the Chicago murders investigated promptly? No claims of self defense in these heinous crimes I gather. And Zimmerman's mother is Peruvian, HISPANIC is an ethnic term, not a RACE. If the police in Chicago didn't investigate ASAP, they need to be out of their jobs, same thing if the shooters walked free after police questioning.  

Demographics Peru: The Peruvian census does not contain information about ethnicity so only rough estimates are available. Its population can be composed of Mestizos: 47%,[1] Amerindians: 31%,[2] European: 18.5%,[1] Afro-Peruvians: 2%,[3] Asians and others: 1%.[4] 

Largely native tribal ancestry, Europeans, Native Americans. (HINT: Spain is part of Europe.)


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## percysunshine (Mar 26, 2012)

Never thought I would say it, but rdean has been usurped as the most accomplished USMB moron.

Luddly holds the crown now.

Maybe they are the same person.....?


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## Luddly Neddite (Mar 26, 2012)

I can't find anything in the links in common with the Zimmerman killing. 

What is known is that Zimmerman stalked this kid for no reason. Apparently the kid fought back, which, according to rw's makes him guilty of some crime. If Zimmerman had not chased the kid, had not been carrying a gun and been so damned willing to use it against what he called a "fucking coon", we wouldn't be discussing it.

And, sorry, but anyone who says "ilk" or "minion" should be ignored for the same reason those who bring Hitler into a thread should be. Its stupid and lame and lazy.


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## Quantum Windbag (Mar 26, 2012)

Not that I am going to let facts sway my opinion, Zimmerman is obviously guilty and needs to be hinted down and killed. 





> Zimmerman told them he lost sight of Trayvon and was walking back to  his SUV when Trayvon approached him from the left rear, and they  exchanged words.
> Trayvon asked Zimmerman if he had a problem.  Zimmerman said no and reached for his cell phone, he told police.  Trayvon then said, "Well, you do now" or something similar and punched  Zimmerman in the nose, according to the account he gave police.
> Zimmerman fell to the ground and Trayvon got on top of him and began slamming his head into the sidewalk, he told police.
> Zimmerman began yelling for help.
> ...


Trayvon Martin: George Zimmerman's account to police of the Trayvon Martin shooting. - Orlando Sentinel


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Vel said:


> Trajan said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



Black, white, red, green, purple, arrest, investigate, file any appropriate charges, and put 'em on trial. Don't wait weeks to try to find scattered evidence. (I am a VICTIM sympathizer in almost all matters.)


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> 
> Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community.
> 
> ...



Dont forget he called 911 over 40 times in about a month.  Cool guy...


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## Jackson (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



If I was on a jury, Zimmerman's past would be more important to me than Trayvon's.  Trayvon wasn't bothering anyone but walking alone with skittles an iced tea while Zimmerman was following him with a gun.  What's wrong with that picture?


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Mar 26, 2012)

> My bias is in favor of a complete investigation in in ANY killing; that did not happen here



My bias is in favor of the law, which doesnt allow an investigation in the first place. 



Peach said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > > Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.
> ...



Asked and answered. 

But again, if we must: an investigation wasnt conducted because no crime occurred, in the context of the SYG statute. The police cant investigate where there is no crime. 

When the demonstrations took place, the incident moved from the legal realm to the political, where the rules of engagement are radically different. 

In the political court of public opinion, facts of law are ruled inadmissible.


----------



## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

ClosedCaption said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> ...



I've read 50 times in about a year; open garage doors, windows etc. I've also read some praise him for his help. It could be anything from self defense to 2nd degree murder. I don't see 1st degree, but no one has all the evidence.


----------



## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > My bias is in favor of a complete investigation in in ANY killing; that did not happen here
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Uh, CCJ, it isn't for law enforcement to INTERPRET statutes, remember?


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## Quantum Windbag (Mar 26, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> > There have been no reports that a witness saw the initial punch Zimmerman told police about
> 
> 
> so its all heresay..



Umm, no.

Hearsay is I say you said something, not me saying you did something.


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## Luddly Neddite (Mar 26, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > My bias is in favor of a complete investigation in in ANY killing; that did not happen here
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Now it looks like it could go federal and be investigated/tried as a hate crime. That's Zimmerman's doing but it will send the rw's into apoplectic fits!

Somehow, they'll nake it President Obama's "fault".


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## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Trajan said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



I hope Chicago law enforcement puts every resources they can into these murders.


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## Jackson (Mar 26, 2012)

Now that it is in the State's hands, let's wait for all of the facts without the MSM.  And certainly without Sharpton and Jackson.  Hard for me to wrap my common sense around the fact that Zimmerman had the right to follow anyone with a gun.  

Quite honestly, it was time for someone to break that nose for putting it where it didn't belong.


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## Jackson (Mar 26, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.



Zimmerman would have never been on his back if he would have backed off as the police told him to do.  If I had followed a kid with skittles in his hand a gun in mine I would expect to be pummeled while laying on my back, too.


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## Quantum Windbag (Mar 26, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



Still not hearsay. And, like it or not, there is evidence that supports Zimmerman's story, and witnesses that saw him on the ground under Martin. 

But, like I said in my OP, I am not going to let facts change my opinion, Zimmermen should be hunted down and killed. It is good to see I am not the only one to think that way.


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## theDoctorisIn (Mar 26, 2012)

Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...


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## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > > There have been no reports that a witness saw the initial punch Zimmerman told police about
> ...



Hearsay covers both doing and saying.....


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## Jackson (Mar 26, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...



Shockingly enough, the guy with the gun who started it, stands over the dead guy and claims he hurt my nose.


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## Quantum Windbag (Mar 26, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



No it does not.


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## Quantum Windbag (Mar 26, 2012)

Jackson said:


> theDoctorisIn said:
> 
> 
> > Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...
> ...



Sounds like what most cops say after they kill someone, doesn't it?


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...




That is UNUSUAL!


----------



## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

Jackson said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.
> ...



There is no proof that Zimmerman was after Martin with gun in hand. Zimmerman claims Martin attacked him from behind as he was heading back to his truck. No evidence to refute that story. Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings all back Zimmerman's account of events minutes before the shooting. There is no evidence to the contrary.


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## Luddly Neddite (Mar 26, 2012)

> I don't see 1st degree, but no one has all the evidence.



I've thought the same thing but I wonder - I'm not an attorney or an expert on the law but wonder if his history of calling 911 about blacks, his saying "they always get away with it" ... "fucking coons" could be construed as "... both willful and premeditated, meaning that it was committed after planning or "lying in wait" for the victim..." 

First Degree Murder Definition - FindLaw

("fucking coon" - I've also read that some relative has said he's not "racist". I wonder what he would call the kid if he were a racist ... )


----------



## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Absolutely it does. It covers unverified information - ie "So and so DID something" or "so-and-so SAID something"....


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

How can the guy who expressed his concern about a guy following him suddenly become the aggressor? How does a young man walking home with tea and skittles become the agitator in this?


----------



## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Jackson said:


> theDoctorisIn said:
> 
> 
> > Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...
> ...



And is not taken to a hospital after his head was "bashed in". Instead he goes in for questioning, and visits a doctor's office the next day. What a TOUGH guy with those NOT SERIOUS injuries the police reported.


----------



## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> > I don't see 1st degree, but no one has all the evidence.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Zimmerman said "fucking punks" NOT "fucking coons". He called 911 several times because he was on neighborhood watch. Nothing out of the ordinary about that or racist about that.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 26, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



Hearsay is not unverified information, it is indirect information. Hearsay involves you getting talking to someone else and repeating what they said, period. You might talk about what they say they did, but you are still talking about what they said.

Feel free to provide any kind of link to prove me wrong, even a really bad crime novel.


----------



## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.



The Grand Jury already met and released the findings? The victim is reported to have been on the phone until a couple minutes before the killing, police do not report taking twenty+ minutes to get there after the killer called and was cautioned. I see the pro KILLER groups are consistent in siding with the killer. Contribute to his defense fund, offer your home as a safe refuge, PLEASE.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Jackson said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.
> ...




There are a LOT of bleeding hearts for the killer here.


----------



## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



How about the dictionary?

hear·say
&#8194; &#8194;/&#712;h&#618;&#601;r&#716;se&#618;/ Show Spelled[heer-sey] Show IPA
noun
1.
unverified, unofficial information gained or acquired from another and not part of one's direct knowledge: I pay no attention to hearsay.
2.
an item of idle or unverified information or gossip; rumor: a malicious hearsay.


----------



## Full-Auto (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



We dont have all the facts. But you have cast judgement.

Nuff said.


----------



## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Seawytch said:


> How can the guy who expressed his concern about a guy following him suddenly become the aggressor? How does a young man walking home with tea and skittles become the agitator in this?



Bleeding hearts are about to hemorrhage with sympathy for the killer here.


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.
> ...



What on Earth are you talking about?  Cheney?  Excuses?

Good Lord....


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

Why can't all the stories and hypothesis regarding Zimmerman's alleged innocence be consistent?  In order for Zimmerman's innocence to be accepted we have to embrace a series of contradictory claims.  Zimmerman did not run after Martin, except where Zimmerman told police that he was running after him.  Zimmerman was attacked from behind, except where Zimmerman had his head bashed into the ground and not his face.  Zimmerman was knocked down and had a wet back full of grass, except that he was attacked on the pavement.  Zimmerman was brutally assaulted by an aggressor Martin and was virtually helpless and screamed the bloody murder that was heard on the 911 tapes, except that Zimmerman did not actually incur any serious injury and didn't even go to the hospital.  Zimmerman was knocked flat on his back by Martin, who was sitting on top of him throwing punches and only then did he take out his gun, except that Zimmerman would have been laying on top of his gun.  Zimmerman feared for his life because Martin tried to take his gun away, except that Zimmerman did not pull out his gun until he feared for his life.  Martin used a soda can as a weapon to hit Zimmerman in the head, except that Martin caused the injuries to Zimmerman by beating his head into the pavement.


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## Luddly Neddite (Mar 26, 2012)

No, he was not on "neighborhood watch" because that neighborhood did not have a watch group. He self-appointed himself to the position of captain of a non-existent watch group.

I've heard the tape. He very clearly says "coon".


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Jackson said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.
> ...



Lying I see, he did not have a gun in his hand and as a Neighborhood watch Captain he had a duty to investigate suspicious behavior.

And for all to see now the left is claiming if you ask someone what they are doing they can break your nose knock you to the ground pound your head in the ground and attempt to murder you with your own gun. And the assailant is the "victim".


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 26, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



We don't hunt people down and kill them based on one's belief that they are guilty.


----------



## Crackerjack (Mar 26, 2012)

Let's see, we have the word of the lawyers hired by Trayvon's parents, who think that hanging out with Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton is okay and trademarking their not-yet-cold son's name so they can turn a quick buck, versus the word of the police, who can barely investigate their way out of a wet paper bag.

Yeah, the odds of the truth ever coming out in this situation are approximately zero.


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## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Old Rocks said:
> 
> 
> > A 17 year old boy goes out to get a snack and a can of tea. No prior record, no prior problems with fighting or aggressiveness. A man that has had prior problems on both accounts is out with a gun. He follows the boy, and, in spite of being told not to, confronts him. The boy asks "Why are you following me?", the man asks, "What are you doing here". That is the last we know of the exchange, what we do know, is that a fight ensued, and the man with the gun killed the boy.
> ...



not to mention Zimmerman bleeding. I can't fault the police for accepting the self defense claim.


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## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.
> ...



I did not say 20 minutes. The 911 tape has Zimmerman screaming "HELP" 20+ times in about 3 second intervals before the shot was fired. Martin would not stop beating Zimmerman during this time as Zimmerman was subdued & screaming "HELP". That makes the shooting legal. Martin was being unreasonable by continuing to beat someone who was down & begging for help. Why would Zimmerman believe Martin would ever stop before killing him? Zimmerman had a valid reason to fear for his life.


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## Trajan (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> > No, I wonder why THIS victim received so little attention from law enforcement until DEMONSTRATIONS took place, and why there is a firm defense of the killer by so many who decry street crimes.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



that wasn't the point I making  nimrod.


here;


Reading Comprehension Connection: Home

get busy....


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> No, he was not on "neighborhood watch" because that neighborhood did not have a watch group. He self-appointed himself to the position of captain of a non-existent watch group.
> 
> I've heard the tape. He very clearly says "coon".



You are a bald faced LIAR. I listened to the tape as well and the word is unrecognizable. Of course having an agenda like Peach and the rest of you left wing loons explains how you can hear a word most people can not.


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## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

Full-Auto said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



No, it could be self defense, involuntary manslaughter, voluntary manslaughter, 2nd degree murder. I don't see 1st degree murder, but the first presentation of the evidence will be to the Grand Jury, such as it is. I do not see the purpose of bringing the Feds in either at this point, it could just cloud the proceedings.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.



So Zimmerman was taking a major ass kicking from the kid.  That's hard enough to believe in and of itself.  If some kid half my size were on top of me kicking my ass like that, it would be pretty easy to just push him off.  But that's okay, let's just go with that for a moment.....

How did Zimmerman manage to pull out his gun in all of that?  Was he not at least using his arms and hands to try to fend off the blows?  If Zimmerman stopped blocking shots long enough to pull out his gun, how was he not more seriously injured?  How was he not injured enough that he would have needed to go to the hospital?  Why wasn't his face beaten to a pulp?  How did he end up having nothing more than a bloody nose?  Where's the bloody mouth, the facial swelling, the black eyes?  For that matter, where are the interruptions in the screaming heard in the 911 tapes?  Are we supposed to believe that Martin was giving Zimmerman titty-twisters?


----------



## LockeJaw (Mar 26, 2012)

Seawytch said:


> How can the guy who expressed his concern about a guy following him suddenly become the aggressor? How does a young man walking home with tea and skittles become the agitator in this?



Captain Emotional Appeal to the RESCUUUUUUUUE!


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> Full-Auto said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



Ohh now after 4 pages of yu saying he is guilty suddenly it might be self defense? YOU started this thread with a claim he murdered him. NOW it might be self defense?


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> You are a bald faced LIAR. I listened to the tape as well and the word is unrecognizable. Of course having an agenda like Peach and the rest of you left wing loons explains how you can hear a word most people can not.



I listened to the tape as well, and the word is perfectly intelligible.  But then again, I have pretty good hearing.  Maybe your ears aren't the end all and be all....


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > > Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.
> ...



And what evidence do you have that the case recieved little attention from law enforcement? None.

As for remorse, how can you not feel remorse for taking another human life, even if you were justified in doing it? I know if I was ever put in a position where I had to take someone elses life to defend myself, my family, or my neighbor, I would feel remorse over it. I don't _want_ to kill someone. 

I highly doubt Zimmerman went out looking to kill someone. There is no evidence for that at all. I mean, holy crap, a 17 year old boy is dead. Even if it was self defense, that's a tragedy that could have been avoided if other choices were made. How can you not feel remorseful about that?


----------



## snakedoc (Mar 26, 2012)

Maybe everyone should try getting all the facts and hearing the whole story before making decision just a thought.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > You are a bald faced LIAR. I listened to the tape as well and the word is unrecognizable. Of course having an agenda like Peach and the rest of you left wing loons explains how you can hear a word most people can not.
> ...



Bullshit, he has family members that are black, has close personal friends that are black, you are hearing what you want to hear, as well as ignoring eye witness testimony.


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## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

About a month ago, 17-year-old Trayvon Martin is stalked and murdered by self-elected neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman. Trayvon Martin is found face down (implying he had been shot from behind). 911 calls reveal Trayvon Martin had been running away from his murderer and crying for help when he was shot dead by George Zimmerman. Friends of George Zimmerman and now Zimmerman allege Trayvon Martin had been shot in self-defense, citing Florida&#8217;s Stand Your Ground Law. George Zimmerman has not been arrested or charged with any crime yet.

*Florida&#8217;s Stand Your Ground Law gives a person the right to use deadly force, if attacked where a person has legal right to be*. There is thus far no evidence showing Trayvon Martin had in any way attacked George Zimmerman. Interestingly, George Zimmerman is said to be a criminal justice scholar. Recorded conversation between 911 agent and George Zimmerman also reveal an amicable relationship between 911 agent and Zimmerman who is known to report to 911 frequently. 

How does any average or sane criminal justice scholar fail to understand that stalking is an offense, and that shooting someone who has neither attacked you nor has your possession is not self-defense?

I am also aware that there exists a very tense relationship between Blacks and Hispanics (especially in the South) and some people intentionally take advantage of the mounting tension and set these groups against each other. 

I am of the opinion that George Zimmer is either a simpleton, is very stupid, or is just plain hate-driven. In any case, I think George Zimmerman is more likely a simpleton and was directly or indirectly coached to harass people by those around him who know of his mental state. *Thus, the coaches of George Zimmerman - State of Florida, Stanford police department, Gun Licensing Department (who all deputized mentally disabled Zimmerman) and his parents who failed to restrain a mentally disabled child &#8211; should be held liable for the murder of Trayvon Martin.* No one should be deserving of death for merely walking down the streets of the US, or streets of any nation in Planet Earth. 

Brief History on George Zimmerman - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/12/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin_n_1340358.html


Author&#8217;s Note: *Versions of this discussion (and one the very first to address the Trayvon Martin case on USMessageBoard) were deleted. Why? Making too much sense and pointing to all villains involved in this case.  
*


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, but rdean dated him from 1997-2002. So there is that to consider.
> ...



Yeah, there is a difference. You're completely lying because there was no wanton murder. We have a Constitutional Right to self defense. There is absolutely no evidence that anyone _wanted_ to kill someone.

That's a huge difference with wanting someone to die because you disagree with your politics. If you don't see that, then you have some serious freakin issues.


----------



## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.
> ...



Here is one 911 recording

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj4RHJ0taoc&feature=related"]Zimmerman Martin 911 Tape Screaming "Help"[/ame]


----------



## bodecea (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



That means what exactly?


----------



## Trajan (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> Trajan said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



is that a distinction with little difference you want to grab onto, and what are you defending? so hes NOT white...thank you...hes latino...? So,  I beg your pardon, shes  a 'latina' is that better? and you may want to correct the NY Times while you are at it...and, and NPR and its dear dear nina totenberg too, my gosh..

Obama Picks Hispanic Woman For Supreme Court

by Nina Totenberg
Obama Picks Hispanic Woman For Supreme Court : NPR

get it now? 

and the rest of my post? I see the point went right over your head, HINT- wheres the outrage for black on black crime?


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> theDoctorisIn said:
> 
> 
> > Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...
> ...



Being Impartial again I see.


----------



## Trajan (Mar 26, 2012)

bodecea said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



it means alot when you're obama apparently, this guy is more 'latino' than obama is black....ohhhhhhh the irony.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



When the PERSON that saw it says it, it is NOT hearsay. But then don't let pesky things like facts cloud the issue.


----------



## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



That is correct. I'm not saying otherwise...
When the person who saw it says it, then it comes down to a credibility test...


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> Seawytch said:
> 
> 
> > How can the guy who expressed his concern about a guy following him suddenly become the aggressor? How does a young man walking home with tea and skittles become the agitator in this?
> ...



There is that impartial streak again. Remind us how you think it might be self defense again.


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## hjmick (Mar 26, 2012)

Please explain Zimmerman's injuries.


Oh, and large, bold text doesn't make your opinion any more important.


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## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

*Florida&#8217;s Stand Your Ground Law gives no license to kill people unprovoked. And while such self-defense laws are permissible, all actors invoking such laws bear the burden of proof. *


----------



## Crackerjack (Mar 26, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...


Try this definition out.

hearsay rule | LII / Legal Information Institute


----------



## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

Days ago, prominent TV host Geraldo Rivera said Trayvon Martin had caused his own death by wearing a hoodie: If you look like a gangster, then you asked for it, Geraldo Rivera said. I guess by Geraldo&#8217;s reasoning, a woman wearing a miniskirt deserves to be rape, and non-conformists with minds of their own should all be annihilated.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> > My bias is in favor of a complete investigation in in ANY killing; that did not happen here
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Actually, they can investigate if their is no crime, assuming there is a possibility of one. Of course, once they determine no crime has been committed, that usually ends the investigation.

Man bleeding, says he was attacked. Eye witnesses confirming the story. Sure as heck sounds like self-defense to me. That's a lawful killing. Sad that anyone died, but not a crime.


----------



## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

Crackerjack said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Yeah, that covers it....


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 26, 2012)

No matter what happens at this point in this case. the rabid left have made sure of the impossibility of Mr. Zimmerman getting a fair and impartial jury..  should it come to that..Way to go libturds..


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Bullshit, he has family members that are black, has close personal friends that are black



My boss at work has is engaged to a black man.  Actually, he works for our company too, in a different department.  Real nice guy, one of my favorite people to work with (I used to work in the department he is in now).  Of course, that doesn't stop her from complaining about the, shall we say "trends," regarding how black customers behave.  The head accountant at our company was just married two weeks ago, to a black man.  They've been together for a decade, and have two children together.  Cute boys, then then again mixed ethnicities tend to have an edge when it comes to attractiveness.  She does the same thing.  Then there's the manager of another department who used to work in my department, and occasionally comes over to do a day shift with us when we're short handed.  She's half black and her husband is black.  Yet wouldn't you know that she does the same thing.

Now, I could be crazy.  But racially based prejudice tends to be alot more complex than "I have black friends and family."  



> you are hearing what you want to hear, as well as ignoring eye witness testimony.



No, you're distorting the witness accounts.  Nobody saw Martin attack Zimmerman.  The only account given has claimed that they observed a confrontation and claim that Martin has the upper hand at the particular moment.  Even if we accept the account, it's just as possible that Zimmerman started the altercation and Martin managed to gain the upper hand.

That being said, YOU are ignoring the fact that there is also witness accounts that contradict your theory.  There's the witnesses who said that it was Martin screaming, and the witnesses that have said that the police altered the statements they verbal provided, and insisted that those people were wrong.  You're providing a textbook example of confirmation bias.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



Explain slowly for those of us without an agenda how YOU or the people putting out the tape know it was Martin?


----------



## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

hjmick said:


> Please explain Zimmerman's injuries.
> 
> 
> Oh, and large, bold text doesn't make your opinion any more important.




*Doesnt it strike you as strange that we suddenly hear of George Zimmermans bruises more than a month after the murder of Trayvon Martin? *


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> No, he was not on "neighborhood watch" because that neighborhood did not have a watch group. He self-appointed himself to the position of captain of a non-existent watch group.
> 
> I've heard the tape. He very clearly says "coon".



Most watch groups are self appointed.... That's kind of obvious...


----------



## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

The Stand Your Ground Law does not give license to kill people unprovoked. Nothing thus far indicates Trayvon Martin had attacked George Zimmerman. I know. Today 3/26, attorney for George Zimmerman is suddenly alleging young Black Trayvon Martin had attacked gun-toting George Zimmerman, resulting in the stalking death of Trayvon Martin. *One has to be a total imbecile to come up with the allegation that a young Black male had in fact walked up to a White male with a gun and attacked the white male unprovoked.  *


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 26, 2012)

Ya know,, they have forensic specialists that can slow that tape down and know precisely if he used the word "coon" or "loon" or "goon" it will all come out in the wash. pass the Tide...


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Credible, unimpeachable, un-bias eyewitness & 911 recordings puts Zimmerman on his back on the ground screaming for help more than 20 times while Martin continued to beat him. Zimmerman was justified in shooting Martin.
> ...



Half his size? You realize that pictures of Trayvon floating around online are from several years ago right?


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## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

*I believe in defending myself, my family and my property, but have no right to harass and/or unjustly take the life of anyone merely using a public easement. *


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Bullshit, he has family members that are black, has close personal friends that are black
> ...



But of course you AREN'T right? You know what happened, who to believe and what story is right? I got that part right?


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Explain slowly for those of us without an agenda how YOU or the people putting out the tape know it was Martin?



You first.  Explain how you "know" it was Zimmerman?


----------



## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

*The State of Florida and Stanford police force did not need public outrage to act on a matter so clearly challenging an issue of law. Unless, of course, wannabe cop George Zimmerman had in fact been deputized and coached to harass and murder people his society deems a nuisance.  *


----------



## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

While all good humans are enraged at the murder of anyone just walking down a US street, I here plead with the Black Panthers to refrain from inciting more atrocity.* If there ought to be a bounty for the Trayvon Martin case, then the bounty should be on the State of Florida, AG of Florida, Stanford police department, Florida DA office and Gun Licensing department.   *


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Avatar4321 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



Martin was 6 foot 3 inches tall. A football player with what appears to be a past of violence towards others. But lets not let facts like Zimmerman's broken nose and wound to the back of his head get in the way now.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Explain slowly for those of us without an agenda how YOU or the people putting out the tape know it was Martin?
> ...



I didn't claim to know it was anyone. The poster and the people putting it out there made the claim. So explain again how YOU know it was Martin?


----------



## LAfrique (Mar 26, 2012)

*&#8220;You can fool some people sometimes, but you can&#8217;t fool all the people all of the time.&#8221;*


----------



## hjmick (Mar 26, 2012)

LAfrique said:


> hjmick said:
> 
> 
> > Please explain Zimmerman's injuries.
> ...



I found it strange that we heard about it at all. That being said, I also find it strange that, now that we have heard about it, it took damn near a month for any of the story to hit the naational news.

I also find it strange that there is no outrage over the three Black men who murdered a white college student in his dorm in Mississippi. Just sayin'...


----------



## Clementine (Mar 26, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> > There have been no reports that a witness saw the initial punch Zimmerman told police about
> 
> 
> 
> so its all heresay..



So is everything else that many are basing their opinions on.   Some don't take it well when new information contradicts the version they bought into, but we'll never get to the truth until people calm down and take a critical look at the whole picture.    I wish the media coverage was more honest.   I hate having media try to give me an opinion and wish they'd stick with facts.


----------



## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Eye witness "John" said it was Zimmerman who was on his back screaming "HELP" as he was being beaten by Martin. This eye witness "John" ran inside, had his wife call 911 & I believe that call is the one in the recording in my post.


----------



## Clementine (Mar 26, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> No matter what happens at this point in this case. the rabid left have made sure of the impossibility of Mr. Zimmerman getting a fair and impartial jury..  should it come to that..Way to go libturds..



The unbalanced coverage of this is my biggest complaint.    I have followed several cases that were wrongful convictions, which were overturned, and one thing many of those cases have in common is a bias media willing to convict them before they set foot in a court room. 

We all have the right to a fair trial and I don't see how that is possible when the media taints the jury pool.    How many people hate Zimmerman and are hoping like hell they get a chance to be on the jury?    They will lie about being bias and say what they need to in order to get chosen even though they have already made up their minds and could care less about what is presented in court.


----------



## Salt Jones (Mar 26, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> No matter what happens at this point in this case. the rabid left have made sure of the impossibility of Mr. Zimmerman getting a fair and impartial jury..  should it come to that..Way to go libturds..



Thank you. Now how long before someone stands their ground on Zimmerman?


----------



## Crackerjack (Mar 26, 2012)

Salt Jones said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > No matter what happens at this point in this case. the rabid left have made sure of the impossibility of Mr. Zimmerman getting a fair and impartial jury..  should it come to that..Way to go libturds..
> ...


I'm sure one of your Black Panther friends would be more than happy to make himself a political prisoner.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> But of course you AREN'T right? You know what happened, who to believe and what story is right? I got that part right?



I'm processing all the available information and running it through the filter of logic, and extrapolating those portions of information that are consistent with others, and those that are inconsistent with others, and weighing the veracity of all the various claims accordingly based on various factors of how and why a person's account might be inaccurate, etc.

What I see is that the idea of Zimmerman's innocence cannot be logically reached, because all the attempted rationales for various issues are contradictory to each other and make it impossible to achieve a singular, consistent explanation of the events and the evidence.  Even if we limit the scope to Zimmerman's claims specifically, his claims produce irreconcilable inconsistencies.  He claims that he was attacked from behind, yet he claims that when he was attacked Martin smashed the back of his head against the pavement.  This, alone, shows Zimmerman's claims just don't make sense.  He claims that he was brutally attacked and being punched repeatedly to such a degree that it invoked him to scream such bloody murder as is heard on the 911 tape.  Yet Zimmerman lacked injuries that would be consistent with such a brutal beating.  Zimmerman claims he didn't pull out his gun until he "feared for his life" but claims he feared for his life because Martin tried to grab his gun.  These claims are inconsistent with each other.  Zimmerman admits that Martin was running away from him, yet he claims that he was walking away from Martin.  This claim is a rather extraordinary claim.  It's a much more reasonable to expect that Martin would have taken the opportunity to once again get away from Zimmerman.


----------



## Peach (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...




A history of violence? The only hint of violence is the allegation he may have "swung at a bus driver"; the killer had a real history of violence, an arrest for assaulting a police officer, injunction against domestic violence. It still may have been self defense on the part of the killer, but it is a bit early to canonize him. The young man is DEAD; Zimmerman is very good at violence. Zimmerman's injuries were not serious, he went to the police station, not a hospital, and visited his doctor the next day.


----------



## Vel (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Bullshit, he has family members that are black, has close personal friends that are black
> ...



I think the precedent was set back during the Newsom/Christian murders that if you have friends or date people of the race of people you victimized, then it can't be called a hate crime.
***************************************************
"There is absolutely no proof of a hate crime," said John Gill, special counsel to Knox County District Atty. Randy Nichols. "It was a terrible crime, a horrendous crime, but race was not a motive. *We know from our investigation that the people charged in this case were friends with white people, socialized with white people, dated white people.* So not only is there no evidence of any racial animus, there's evidence to the contrary."

What is a hate crime? - chicagotribune.com


----------



## theDoctorisIn (Mar 26, 2012)

Clementine said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > No matter what happens at this point in this case. the rabid left have made sure of the impossibility of Mr. Zimmerman getting a fair and impartial jury..  should it come to that..Way to go libturds..
> ...



Umm..

If there was no media circus about this, there would be NO trial at all - the police were content to let Zimmerman go home, and ignore the dead kid.

He still hasn't been arrested yet, but it's nice to see how worried you are about whether he gets a "fair trial".

Would no trial at all been "fair"?


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 26, 2012)

snakedoc said:


> Maybe everyone should try getting all the facts and hearing the whole story before making decision just a thought.



Because most were ready to let this slide into the files forever.  The police allowed this to become what it is.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> Clementine said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



How do you try someone that did not break any laws?


----------



## bornright (Mar 26, 2012)

It is unfortunate but you can not believe anything said at this time from the media.  If there is no story they make a story.  They place some information in front of us and keep other evidence away from us that might calm the story.  This community watchman actually may be the victim but that would not be much of a story.  Quite frankly any of us that have been involved in law enforcement feel the media would like nothing better than a full scale riot.

Characters such as Al Sharpton benefit so much from these type stories.  He has become a very rich man from such news events.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> They might have a hard time finding a judge.   If he doesn't find Zimmerman guilty, he could be responsible for nationwide riots.   No matter what the evidence is.
> 
> So far, it doesn't look the best for Trayvon Martin.
> 
> ...


Where is the evidence of such injuries?
Has he gone to the hospital?
Where are the records?
A black eye or black eyes are typical of a broken nose.
Does Zimmerman have at least A black eye?
All here say.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Martin was 6 foot 3 inches tall. A football player with what appears to be a past of violence towards others. But lets not let facts like Zimmerman's broken nose and wound to the back of his head get in the way now.



Zimmerman has an extensive history of violence towards others.  But we should ignore that, and only talk about Martin's past, right?


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > But of course you AREN'T right? You know what happened, who to believe and what story is right? I got that part right?
> ...



Well except the 911 tape is evidence that not martin but Zimmerman was yelling for help as reported by the Husband of the woman that made the call. Which supports another part of Zimmerman's claim. The girlfriend of Martin corroborates that all Zimmerman did is ask a question. Eye witnesses corroborate that Zimmerman was on the ground having his head pounded. Another Eye Witness stated that Martin threw the punch that started the fight. Again evidenced by Zimmerman having a broken nose.

Your supposed impartial claims aside YOU have created quite the falsehood in your statements based on what we seem to actually know about the case. Further evidenced by your absolute claim that you can hear a word most people can not.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> Zimmerman's injuries were not serious



Of course they were serious.  He was brutally attacked.  Did you hear his blood curdling cries for help on the 911 tape?  You think all that was because he bumped his head?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...


Is Zimmerman in the local phone book?

If so, this is a non-story.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Well except the 911 tape is evidence that not martin but Zimmerman was yelling for help





RetiredGySgt said:


> I didn't claim to know it was anyone.



Just stop.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Martin was 6 foot 3 inches tall. A football player with what appears to be a past of violence towards others. But lets not let facts like Zimmerman's broken nose and wound to the back of his head get in the way now.
> ...



And that should be a warning to people to not attack people, because they might have a history of violence and might shoot you in self defense.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Well except the 911 tape is evidence that not martin but Zimmerman was yelling for help
> ...



Do you bother to read threads you post in? After I said that the original poster clarified what the tape was, and who said what. I guess keeping up with all that fact finding requires you to not pay attention to inconvenient posts right?


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

KissMy said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



I guess in all your fact finding you just MISSED this post right?


----------



## Zoom (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> ...


I never thought about that.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

Avatar4321 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Perhaps idiot sissies like Zimmerman should not go chasing down people who are running away from them, or corner them in other people's back yards.  They might fear for their lives and defend themselves.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Being that unbiased fact finder again?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> 
> Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community.
> 
> ...





> Called 911 the EVENING he killed an armed teenager, Trayvon Martin. Ignored the advice given, and continued following the teenager.



Actually that's a lie

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aVwPqXc-bk]George Zimmerman Trayvon Martin 911 Call - YouTube[/ame]

Zimmerman when told to not follow he stopped  it was Trayvon when approach Zimmerman.


----------



## American Horse (Mar 26, 2012)

I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.

When the first call was made by Zimmerman, the time was 7:00 pm.  In Orlando the sun had set at 6:23 (37 minutes earler) and civil dusk had come at 6:50.  Civil dusk is a state of light such that you can still see outlines but not details.  

I say that last about the light because Juan Williams on FNC repeatedly says that a white kid carrying skittles and a can of ice tea would not be shot, and that explains why this was a racist act.  With the light available it might have easily been possible to see that the person did not have a white face, but what he was carrying (including a cellphone) would not have been easily discerned.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



And what kind of blathering bullshit excuse is that for the fact that you're contradicting yourself?  Back to my previous question, how do you "know" that it was Zimmerman who was screaming?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...


Wrong Trayvon approached Zimmerman


----------



## Zoom (Mar 26, 2012)

There are 30 people named George Zimmerman in the white pages in Florida.  If he is one of these people, then this is all for naught really.  

I still say, what spike lee did was wrong.  It hurts us who really want justice served.

(Oh and they are going to do everything they can to discredit the victim.  I already see it.)
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CDgQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnames.whitepages.com%2Fflorida%2Fgeorge%2Fzimmerman&ei=ZzRxT6nkCufUsgLBj8TjDg&usg=AFQjCNGXPhydIBrH-p8Xfl2nemQr5VMg7g&sig2=NX5cxpHaS23Ebq9LE_T5yQ


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> Clementine said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



If Zimmerman had been arrested from the get-go, there would be no media at all. This would be like hundreds of other manslaughter cases across the country...ignored.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Avatar4321 said:
> ...



When is he ever unbiased? Doesn't matter.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...


Are you stupid? The original poster of the tape clarified it IN THIS THREAD, I quoted it for you. The Husband of the woman that made the call stated it was Zimmerman calling for help. Do try to keep up with all that fact finding of yours.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Well, according to Trayvon's father, it wasn't Trayvon.


----------



## Dr Grump (Mar 26, 2012)

American Horse said:


> I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.
> 
> When the first call was made by Zimmerman, the time was 7:00 pm.  In Orlando the sun had set at 6:23 (37 minutes earler) and civil dusk had come at 6:50.  Civil dusk is a state of light such that you can still see outlines but not details.
> 
> I say that last about the light because Juan Williams on FNC repeatedly says that a white kid carrying skittles and a can of ice tea would not be shot, and that explains why this was a racist act.  With the light available it might have easily been possible to see that the person did not have a white face, but what he was carrying (including a cellphone) would not have been easily discerned.



It was easy to see because Zimmerman said the kid was black to the dispatcher...


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> American Horse said:
> 
> 
> > I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.
> ...



Link?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

Avatar4321 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...


actually it does not sound like a young black male screaming

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okGY4EHwHsY]Black Teen Death Caught On Tape ( Trayvon Martin ) - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

American Horse said:


> I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.
> 
> When the first call was made by Zimmerman, the time was 7:00 pm.  In Orlando the sun had set at 6:23 (37 minutes earler) and civil dusk had come at 6:50.  Civil dusk is a state of light such that you can still see outlines but not details.
> 
> I say that last about the light because Juan Williams on FNC repeatedly says that a white kid carrying skittles and a can of ice tea would not be shot, and that explains why this was a racist act.  With the light available it might have easily been possible to see that the person did not have a white face, but what he was carrying (including a cellphone) would not have been easily discerned.



Nice try but Zimmerman had already identified him as a black youth on the phone...and not just by calling him a fucking c word for black person. 

6' 3" and 140 pounds? Kid would fall down a drain he was so skinny. 

Are you forgetting that Zimmerman pursued this young man who was doing nothing more than walking home after getting a snack?


----------



## Political Junky (Mar 26, 2012)

Trayvon Martin: Jeb Bush says "stand your ground" law doesn't apply to George Zimmerman's reported actions - Orlando Sentinel


The death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin has put Florida's "stand your ground" law under scrutiny after police cited it as one reason they did not arrest George Zimmerman, the 28-year-old Neighborhood Watch volunteer who said he shot Trayvon in self-defense.

But the man who signed "stand your ground" into law says officials have it wrong. Speaking Friday in Texas, former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said "stand your ground" doesn't apply to this case."Stand your ground means stand your ground. It doesn't mean chase after somebody who's turned their back," Bush told The Dallas Morning News.


----------



## Zoom (Mar 26, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



They were not black, they were "goons" apparently.


----------



## Vidi (Mar 26, 2012)

Yes, Zimmerman clearly was not in accordance with the Stand Your Ground law. All the argument of how its a bad law because of the Martin murder, is completely moot.


----------



## jillian (Mar 26, 2012)

American Horse said:


> I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.
> 
> When the first call was made by Zimmerman, the time was 7:00 pm.  In Orlando the sun had set at 6:23 (37 minutes earler) and civil dusk had come at 6:50.  Civil dusk is a state of light such that you can still see outlines but not details.
> 
> I say that last about the light because Juan Williams on FNC repeatedly says that a white kid carrying skittles and a can of ice tea would not be shot, and that explains why this was a racist act.  With the light available it might have easily been possible to see that the person did not have a white face, but what he was carrying (including a cellphone) would not have been easily discerned.



he was told not to follow. so it almost doesn't matter what was in the kid's hand.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Are you stupid? The original poster of the tape clarified it IN THIS THREAD, I quoted it for you. The Husband of the woman that made the call stated it was Zimmerman calling for help. Do try to keep up with all that fact finding of yours.



Wait, are you basing it off of the witness or the 911 tape?  Which one?  What about the witness who said it was Martin screaming?  Yet again, you are being a textbook example of confirmation bias.  You are ignoring the evidence that conflicts with your conclusion, and trumpeting only those things that would support your conclusion.  And you seem completely unable to give any good reason why to reject and affirm those particular pieces of evidence that you've chosen to reject and confirm.  And you have the audacity to say that I'm being biased?  I'm the only one looking for a CONSISTENT explanation in all of this.


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > American Horse said:
> ...



*Zimmerman:
*
Yeah, now hes coming toward me. Hes got his hands in his waist band.

And hes a black male.[1:03]

*911 dispatcher:
*
How old would you say he is?

George Zimmerman's 911 call transcribed


----------



## Zoom (Mar 26, 2012)

gallantwarrior said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



Neither does 99% of this board.  What the hell difference does that make?  If I said Zimmerman is not guilty, would it matter if I didnt live in Florida then? 

Damn.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Are you stupid? The original poster of the tape clarified it IN THIS THREAD, I quoted it for you. The Husband of the woman that made the call stated it was Zimmerman calling for help. Do try to keep up with all that fact finding of yours.
> ...



You are a RETARD. An eye witness stated that he saw Zimmerman calling for help and that he asked his wife to call 911. The original poster provided that information with a LINK to back it up. The only one being dishonest or stupid is you.


----------



## Zoom (Mar 26, 2012)

If this is true, what is holding them back from arresting this murderer?  (Damn "goons".  There are actual morons in here who say he called him a goon.  JHC).


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > theDoctorisIn said:
> ...



When one shots someone in self defense, there is no trial dumb ass.


----------



## Vidi (Mar 26, 2012)

Zoom said:


> If this is true, what is holding them back from arresting this murderer?  (Damn "goons".  There are actual morons in here who say he called him a goon.  JHC).



A misinterpretation of the law by local police led to no collection of real evidence, toxicology, gun powder residue, etc.

There may be no way to fairly try Zimmerman at this point.


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



It wasn't self defense, it was vigilantism.


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

It might not apply to Zimmerman, but it should to Martin.


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## jillian (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



you decided it was self defense before an investigation?

i guess hunting season on young black men is ok to you. 

*shrug*


----------



## Charles_Main (Mar 26, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > > There have been no reports that a witness saw the initial punch Zimmerman told police about
> ...



Hearsay is any Unsubstantiated statement by an individual. If there is no way to independently corroborate what they say, it's Hearsay and it's worthless.


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Seawytch said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



You don't know that and the evidence is mounting it was in fact self defense. But you all keep ignoring facts.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 26, 2012)

Jackson said:


> Quite honestly, it was time for someone to break that nose for putting it where it didn't belong.



*Edited * and wiggers insist that Zimmerman deserved to be attacked, but then insist that Zimmerman started the fight without motive.  Shit-for-brains liberals.
*
Please do not use that word outside the flame zone*


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

jillian said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...


You are a lawyer and know full well there WAS an investigation, and that the DA and cops all decided it was a clear case of self defense.  MORON.


----------



## Seawytch (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Seawytch said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Which evidence? The evidence of the 911 operator telling Zimmerman not to pursue Martin...who was doing nothing wrong? The self defense was on Martin's part, not the racist vigilante Zimmerman.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> You are a RETARD.



No, I'm actually exceedingly more intelligent than you, apparently.



> An eye witness stated that he saw Zimmerman calling for help and that he asked his wife to call 911. The original poster provided that information with a LINK to back it up. The only one being dishonest or stupid is you.



  And yet you continue to ignore the witness account that says it was Martin calling for help.  You're subscribing to one, ignoring the other, for no reason other than one supports your preordained conclusion and the other does not.    You are a RETARD.


----------



## BreezeWood (Mar 26, 2012)

> Jeb Bush says ....



did the police at the crime scene forget to ask Jeb first ???  oh shucks.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Mar 26, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Not that I am going to let facts sway my opinion, Zimmerman is obviously guilty and needs to be hinted down and killed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Gee, if Zimmerman said it, it must be true!


----------



## jillian (Mar 26, 2012)

BreezeWood said:


> > Jeb Bush says ....
> 
> 
> 
> did the police at the crime scene forget to ask Jeb first ???  oh shucks.



you know jeb was the person who signed the bill into law, right?

don't you think he knows what the legislative intent was?

or does that not jive with what passes for reality in rightwingnutworld?


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > You are a RETARD.
> ...



But of course you ascribing to the one you support is somehow different right? Care to LINK to an eye witness account that it was martin yelling?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > You are a RETARD.
> ...



Dishonesty detracts from your self proclaimed intelligence. I posted a link to the call it does not sound like a young black male hollering.


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## sobi (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.



Zimmerman has gone into hiding.  He may never see the light of day again either.  The difference is Zimmerman doesn't deserve to see it.


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## RetiredGySgt (Mar 26, 2012)

jillian said:


> BreezeWood said:
> 
> 
> > > Jeb Bush says ....
> ...



Actually you would need to ask the Legislature not the Governor what the intent was. But then as a Lawyer you would know that, RIGHT?


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## jillian (Mar 26, 2012)

Charles_Main said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



ummm... no. 

hearsay is a statement made by someone *without firsthand knowledge* and used to prove the truth or falsity of a fact at issue.

e.g., i say "he told me that...."

hearsay is not a statement like "i said..." or "i saw..."


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

Zoom said:


> There are 30 people named George Zimmerman in the white pages in Florida.  If he is one of these people, then this is all for naught really.
> 
> I still say, what spike lee did was wrong.  It hurts us who really want justice served.
> 
> ...


Zimmerman's legal defense team has initiated a full-on media-smear campaign against the dead victim Trayvon Martin.

Only the choir's biting though.

Zimmmerman's TOAST!


----------



## KissMy (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



First eye witness (adult male) saw Martin on top of & beating Zimmerman as Zimmerman yelled "HELP". That is recorded on 911 tape & news crew interviewed this witness on tape within hours.

Second eye witness (boy walking dog) saw Martin on top of Zimmerman as Zimmermann yelled "HELP". This was moments prior to shooting. That is also recorded on 911 tape.


----------



## BreezeWood (Mar 26, 2012)

jillian said:


> BreezeWood said:
> 
> 
> > > Jeb Bush says ....
> ...




you doubt the police did not have the correct interpretation implied by the legislation (by their actions) - knowing the intent of those who sponsored the bill ??? - been to Florida any time recently ...

- with Marten out of the way, Jeb has his carrier to think of.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > There are 30 people named George Zimmerman in the white pages in Florida.  If he is one of these people, then this is all for naught really.
> ...



Smear like his ten day suspension from school? What could he have done to get a ten day out of school suspension?
Smear like his past tweets from his tweeter account
or smear like those from his myspace page?


----------



## Synthaholic (Mar 26, 2012)

Zoom said:


> If this is true, what is holding them back from arresting this murderer?  (Damn "goons".  There are actual morons in here who say he called him a goon.  JHC).


And Zimmerman's "Black Friend&#8482;" today claimed that "goon" is a term of endearment! 

Bwahahahahaha!!!!!!


----------



## uscitizen (Mar 26, 2012)

While I lived in FL a man and his guide dog was thrown out of a restaruant by a cop who backed up the restaruant owner who said no dogs allowed.

A clear violation of law.
Cops mess up.


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## Synthaholic (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > BreezeWood said:
> ...


Ahh, so you are claiming that Governor Bush signed into law legislation that he didn't understand?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...


If you want to play this game...

The picture that's been posted of Zimmerman, is a jail picture.
Also, Zimmerman has a record of assaulting police officers.
He also has been arrested for domestic abuse.
The hits keep on coming.
Pun intended.

Let's play this game son. You. will. lose.


----------



## uscitizen (Mar 26, 2012)

Synthaholic said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



sounds like several on here are, but I will bet they would vote for him for president


----------



## Ariux (Mar 26, 2012)

Political Junky said:


> Speaking Friday in Texas, former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said "stand your ground" doesn't apply to this case."Stand your ground means stand your ground. It doesn't mean chase after some body who's turned their back," Bush told The Dallas Morning News.



No politician is going to defend Zimmerman because of the racial heat.  But, only a bad politician is going to defend the African criminal.

Stand Your Ground was made for people like Zimmerman.  It was made to give the self-defender the victory in controversial self-defense cases.  Otherwise, pre-existing law would have been enough.


----------



## candycorn (Mar 26, 2012)

A child is dead.  He was a teenager.  The "stand your ground" law is to blame clearly.


----------



## candycorn (Mar 26, 2012)

uscitizen said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



In a heartbeat.  No doubt.  

What an absolute tragedy.  It was predictable though.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



What game? I just wanted to know what smear you were talking about.
Was trayvon in a gang was he a drug dealer why was he suspended from school, was Trayvon a violent person?


----------



## uscitizen (Mar 26, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Political Junky said:
> 
> 
> > Speaking Friday in Texas, former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said "stand your ground" doesn't apply to this case."Stand your ground means stand your ground. It doesn't mean chase after some body who's turned their back," Bush told The Dallas Morning News.
> ...




so says someone who knows the intent of the law better than the governor that signed it into law?


----------



## Clementine (Mar 26, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> Clementine said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



The media is repeating lies, which does not help bring about justice.   So far, they've managed to rile people up and embolden groups like the Black Panthers to make death threats against Zimmerman.   The press has vilified Zimmerman and carefully hidden anything negative about Martin.   

We can handle the truth and the public deserves it.     

The police did investigate and since then, we've heard from more witnesses who are backing up Zimmerman's account.   It's quite possible that the police did the right thing.  They were there and saw the evidence and talked to witnesses.   I know it hasn't occurred to some people, but maybe the police got it right.   I know that doesn't go over well with the lynch mobs, but must be considered.    Of course, now they are under pressure and with threats of violence looming, they have to go over things again.   Whether it will change the outcome of the initial investigation isn't known, but when people out there can't control their tempers, we end up with a volatile situation, so it's necessary to double check and be thorough.   It would help if people could have an open mind till they have all the facts, but that'll never happen.

No matter who gets arrested in this country, they have rights.   Like it or not.   Some of the same people who would happily deny Zimmerman his right to a fair trial would not tolerate their own rights trampled if they found themselves accused of a crime.   Remember, we all have rights or none of us do.    I think our rights, like our constitution, are sacred.   

Too many people have taken a little information and rushed to judgement and now won't budge regardless of what comes to light.    Breaking through that mob mentality is a difficult task at best.   

And many have noted that the press is selective as to when/if they mentioned the color of either the victim or perp.     Color is the detemining factor in how any incident will be covered, but will only be mentioned in certain circumstances.        

There are so many rules and exceptions to the rules in how liberals insist people should be labeled. 

If a Latino is an illegal alien, they are simply referred to as Latino or Hispanic undocumented immigrants.

If a Latino is accused of attacking a white person, they are simply called male or female suspect.

If a Latino is accused of attacking another Hispanic, they are simply called male or female suspect.

If a Latino is accused of attacking a black, they are referred to as white or the brand new, just revealed "white Hispanic", but the latter is only used if people notice the obvious Latino ethnicity. 

If a white person says anything at all that any liberal disagrees with, they are referred to as racists. 

If people like the Black Panthers make death threats to whites and encourage violence, no one says a damn thing.   

When people in Florida sell out all their t-shirts with racist remarks towards whites, no one says a damn thing.

I've seen so many posts about how Zimmerman is guilty.   Zimmerman would deserve it if the Black Panthers took an eye for an eye, a life for a life.    Zimmerman has been called names and many assumptions have been made about him.  

Then the same people who make inflammatory and hateful remarks about Zimmerman have the nerve to say they want truth and justice.    Really?    If they are interested in the truth, then why do they resist any new information if it doesn't compliment their foregone conclusions? 

Thankfully, even considering the worst case scenario here, this is a rare incident.    We have murders daily by gangs and other criminals and the media and politicians yawn, yet they have chosen to treat this one tragedy as if it's an epidemic.   They are creating a crisis in order to advance an agenda.   The result of the bias reporting is deepening racial tensions and calls from some politicians to take away more of our rights.

I feel bad for Trayvon's family.   No matter what the circumstances, they have suffered a great deal.    

Maybe Zimmerman will end up in jail.   Maybe not.    While the media has been bias in how they presented the two guys to the public and have pushed only one possible version of events, the truth may not be so cut and dried.


----------



## Synthaholic (Mar 26, 2012)

uscitizen said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...


I love when their own words make their politicians look like idiots.


----------



## Political Junky (Mar 26, 2012)

Synthaholic said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > If this is true, what is holding them back from arresting this murderer?  (Damn "goons".  There are actual morons in here who say he called him a goon.  JHC).
> ...


I saw that ... unbelievable spin.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Spike Lee wants to become a vigilante. He retweeted George Zimmerman's home address to the world.
> 
> Somebody correct me, but isn't this conspiracy to commit murder if somebody kills him as a result of everyone in the world knowing where he lives???
> 
> ...





He is black. So yeah, its definitely attempted murder.

Sue him for what exactly?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


Is Zimmerman a racist? A vigilante? Did he have a chip on his shoulder? A vendetta against black people? A cop wanna-be? I want answers.


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## uscitizen (Mar 26, 2012)

I use the term Tea Bagger to refer to Tea Party members as a term of endearment.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

Publius1787 said:


> In Spike Lee&#8217;s world, a crime only counts as a crime when any other ethnicity attacks a black man. If it happens the other way around, however, special consideration should be given. Black people storming a parking lot or a convenience store should be described as &#8220;youths&#8221; and killing a man because he is white/Hispanic cannot possibly be a hate crime but an act of social justice. The courts and the law do not apply to black people. See Obama and critical race theory.



What crime did Lee commit exactly?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Not according to his black friend Zimmerman is not racist.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Salt Jones said:
> ...



Please show me the statue which defines posting someone's address that is already public knowledge is "incitement to murder" ?





> It is also a violation of Zimmerman"s CIVIL RIGHTS. Also a chargeable offense.




Please show us that statute as well, thanks.



Also - please explain why you think only Spike Lee should be charged - and not the person who originated the tweet or the thousands of others who did the same. Do you have something against richers?


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## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

Internet Site Offers to SELL YOU George Zimmerman's address, phone number, and more information on him!

They should be charged with INCITING MURDER!!!

People Search & Directory Services Powered By Intelius


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## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


You mean the paid actor hired by the defense team to soften Zimmerman's public image?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



source or it's a lie.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



All racists have a black friend. Its pretty much a pre-requisite to being racist. I've never met a racist who didn't have a black friend.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


Sure. Right after you present the PROOF that that actor is actually a friend of Zimmerman.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



What? you are a really stupid piece of shit you make a claim but did not provide proof LIAR.


----------



## beagle9 (Mar 26, 2012)

MSNBC is pure poison onto this nation, just like NPR is also.... I just heard Rachael Maddow make up stuff about the so called "SHOOTER" in which she calls Zimmerman, claiming that he profiled Trayvon Martin because of his race in which began it all she implied, and that my friends is is a lie......I listen to the 9-11 call, and when Zimmerman was asked by the operator about the person who was being observed as suspicious, about his identity -Zimmerman then told the operator to wait for the identity report, as Trayvon walked closer to him, otherwise when Trayvon walked towards Zimmerman while being observed and while the 9-11 operator was on the phone, it allowed Zimmerman to then once Trayvon was close enough, to give information about Trayvon's identity at that point (color included), in which was all (AFTER ZIMMERMAN HAD CALLED 9-11 TO REPORT A SUSPICIOUS PERSON IN THE AREA), so where does Rachael Maddow get off saying that the "SHOOTER" she calls Zimmerman, racial profiled Trayvon to begin with, in which caused the whole incident ? How is it that these people can get away with their vile lies in which they tell on national TV, in which could lead people astray (this happend on her show around 12:20 AM on 3/27/12).. Does this woman hate so badly, that she will say or try anything to cause a situation maybe ?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuUk5xJX-8s]Zimmerman&#39;s friend, Joe Oliver, speaks out - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

Vidi said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > If this is true, what is holding them back from arresting this murderer?  (Damn "goons".  There are actual morons in here who say he called him a goon.  JHC).
> ...



Yeah - right - what a convenient explanation.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

uscitizen said:


> While I lived in FL a man and his guide dog was thrown out of a restaruant by a cop who backed up the restaruant owner who said no dogs allowed.
> 
> A clear violation of law.
> Cops mess up.



What a poorly trained pig.

Did you speak up and inform the officer he was violating federal law?

Let's say you did - and the officer really believed you were right, he was violating federal law - do you think he'd give a shit? Or do you think he would have tazed you and hauled you off to prison for assaulting an officer and resisting arrest?


----------



## oreo (Mar 26, 2012)

Political Junky said:


> Trayvon Martin: Jeb Bush says "stand your ground" law doesn't apply to George Zimmerman's reported actions - Orlando Sentinel
> 
> 
> The death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin has put Florida's "stand your ground" law under scrutiny after police cited it as one reason they did not arrest George Zimmerman, the 28-year-old Neighborhood Watch volunteer who said he shot Trayvon in self-defense.
> ...




Yeah--pursuit was not included in this bill.  It is a horrible tragedy that didn't need to happen.  We had a self-appointed neighborhood watch guy that had called police 47 times in the last several months--which tells me this Zimmerman was looking for a confrontation.

The police should have arrested him immediately for violating their statement to not pursue--and he did it anyway.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

Oh yeah...Zimmerman's "friend" has spoken....he's innocent.


----------



## oreo (Mar 26, 2012)

Peach said:


> A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> 
> Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community.
> 
> ...




Do you have a link to all of this?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

Zimmerman isn't the "shooter" he's the shooter, the killer.

Trayvon Martin is dead. Do you understand that. D.E.A.D.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Oh yeah...Zimmerman's "friend" has spoken....he's innocent.



Listen - Martin was black - and Zimmerman has a friend who is black and says he's innocent - what more evidence do you need?

Duh!


----------



## oreo (Mar 26, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> ...



How do you know that Travon didn't think he was going to be assaulted by Zimmerman?  If I had someone following me through a neighborhood--and I hadn't done anything wrong--I would assume that this Hispanic was out to get me.  Zimmerman had made 47 calls to the police in the last several months--which tells me--he was the one that was the aggressor.  Police tapes--telling him NOT to follow this kid--he didn't listen too.  _If the kid jumped him thinking he was defending himself_--and then got killed over it--who's fault is it?


----------



## candycorn (Mar 26, 2012)

oreo said:


> Political Junky said:
> 
> 
> > Trayvon Martin: Jeb Bush says "stand your ground" law doesn't apply to George Zimmerman's reported actions - Orlando Sentinel
> ...



I don't see how it's not going to be found that it was pre-meditated manslaughter; if not pre-meditated murder.


----------



## beagle9 (Mar 26, 2012)

Zoom said:


> There are 30 people named George Zimmerman in the white pages in Florida.  If he is one of these people, then this is all for naught really.
> 
> *I still say, what spike lee did was wrong.  It hurts us who really want justice served.*
> (Oh and they are going to do everything they can to discredit the victim.  I already see it.)
> http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CDgQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnames.whitepages.com%2Fflorida%2Fgeorge%2Fzimmerman&ei=ZzRxT6nkCufUsgLBj8TjDg&usg=AFQjCNGXPhydIBrH-p8Xfl2nemQr5VMg7g&sig2=NX5cxpHaS23Ebq9LE_T5yQ



Hopefully they will do everything they can, in order to get to the bottom of this mess...It is my wishes that neither of the individuals involved, get falsely discredited.....


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Oh yeah...Zimmerman's "friend" has spoken....he's innocent.



Thats not what zimmermans friend said, but you wouldn't tell the truth any way.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Oh yeah...Zimmerman's "friend" has spoken....he's innocent.
> ...



So what's your point? What do you want?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 26, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


That you are a liar


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 26, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


That's what I thought...bupkiss.


----------



## oreo (Mar 26, 2012)

sobi said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > Why do many anti crime, usual victims' advocates, turn this 28 year old man into a sympathetic figure? The 17 year old victim will never see the light of day again. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman.
> ...



Agreed---he over-reacted to the situation--and I think he was the aggressor in this.


----------



## Dante (Mar 26, 2012)

[youtube]skZQv4HVA-o[/youtube]


----------



## candycorn (Mar 27, 2012)

Peach said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Peach said:
> ...



You said the magic words there.

A person died from a gunshot wound.  There was no investigation.
I've had my house burglarized and the cops showed up 4 hours after.
I've had my IPOD stolen out of my car and the cops didn't even show up.
I would like to think that when someone is gunned down--regardless of the reasoning--the cops would make a complete investigation.

I would think that the parents would have strong case, if they choose to pursue it, in the arena of civil rights.  I'd hate to think that the reason it wasn't even investigated was because he was black.  Sadly, thats the way it looks.

I mean, is crime THAT bad in Sanford that the cops don't have the manpower to investigate someone being gunned down?


----------



## oreo (Mar 27, 2012)

candycorn said:


> oreo said:
> 
> 
> > Political Junky said:
> ...



It's at least manslaughter--if not 2nd degree murder.  The stand your ground law does not include pursuit.  Nor would it include inciting a fight--and then killing someone--and I think that's what happened.  Travon--not knowing the neighborhood--did not know who Zimmerman was.  Zimmerman--starts to follow him in his car--the police tell him to back off--for some reason Zimmerman gets out of his car--then a witness sees them both on the ground--and then a shot is fired--and we have a dead 16 year old kid who was carrying ice tea and a bag of chips.

Zimmerman should have been arrested on the spot.


----------



## IndependntLogic (Mar 27, 2012)

Si modo said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



Self-Defense: 
1. To defend one's self against a confrontation or attack.
2. (Conservative Definition) To chase someone and then, after being told to stop chasing them, chase them some more and shoot them.


----------



## beagle9 (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Zimmerman isn't the "shooter" he's the shooter, the killer.
> 
> Trayvon Martin is dead. Do you understand that. D.E.A.D.


Until it is proven that Zimmerman murdered Trayvon Martin in cold blood, he is George Zimmerman, the neighborhood watchman, who ended up defending himself against an attack by another, in which resulted in the discharge of a handgun, thus killing the attacker he was earlier conducting survielence on in the area. The full details of the case are not completely known, but an investigation is being conducted in order to get to the bottom of the incident that took a young man's life, and left another mans life hanging in the balance..

Now this is what responsible media should be doing, and not what was seen on the Rachael Maddow show tonight..


----------



## Si modo (Mar 27, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> A 17 year old boy goes out to get a snack and a can of tea. No prior record, no prior problems with fighting or aggressiveness. A man that has had prior problems on both accounts is out with a gun. He follows the boy, and, in spite of being told not to, confronts him. The boy asks "Why are you following me?", the man asks, "What are you doing here". That is the last we know of the exchange, what we do know, is that a fight ensued, and the man with the gun killed the boy.
> 
> From this alone, I would say a murder took place. The man had no right to confront the boy. At that point, the boy had the right to do whatever he could, not knowing what the fellow was up to.
> 
> Yet, once again, the wingnuts have come down on the side of the criminal.


When did citizens lose their right to confront another in public?

What date was that?  I really should know this so I can operate within the law when in public.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> ...




What's the name of the eyewitness that saw Zimmerman get attacked?


----------



## oreo (Mar 27, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



There's all kinds of testimony right now.  Another states that it was Travon that was yelling for help.  Furthermore--this didn't happen in Zimmerman's yard--he was pursuing Travon with his car.  The police told him not to do that--he didn't listen--instead he got out of his car--and that's when the altercation took place.  Zimmerman has made 47 CALLS to police within the last several months.  Zimmerman was looking for trouble, and he found it.

Zimmerman should have been arrested for violating the stand your ground law--by pursuing this kid--and I believe it was Zimmerman who incited this incident.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...




What, a LINK to back it up? Is there a NAME to back it up?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Where is the evidence of such injuries?
> Has he gone to the hospital?



In the police report. It mentioned a cut on his head, and grass stains on his shirt. I don't know about the broken nose, but the paramedics actually wanted to take Zimmerman in. 

Maybe they were part of the conspiracy.



MarcATL said:


> Where are the records?



Of the doctor visit? Pretty sure they are private, which would make it illegal to release them.



MarcATL said:


> A black eye or black eyes are typical of a broken nose.



Are they? Even if that is true, it never happens instantaneously.



MarcATL said:


> Does Zimmerman have at least A black eye?
> All here say.



No one has seen him recently. He did, however, have enough damage to make the police believe he was in a fight.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Page 2: Trayvon Martin Shooter Says Teenager Went for His Gun - ABC News

Page 2 of 2
SANFORD, Fla., March 26

The law affords people enormous leeway to use deadly force if they feel their life is seriously endangered. Sonner said Zimmerman felt "one of them was going to die that night," when he pulled the trigger.

Corey, a veteran prosecutor known for her zealous defense of victims rights was hand-picked by Florida Gov. Rick Scott for the job. But she faces other challenges in the case.

While in life Trayvon Martin was barely 17, when it comes to justifiable homicide his size -- about 6-foot-3 and 150 pounds -- makes him an adult in death.

Zimmerman, 28, is 5-foot-9 and weighs well over 200 pounds.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Was Trayvon Martin a Drug Dealer?

To learn more about Trayvon&#8217;s character, we have to look to his friends and family to offer clues.
Unfortunately, it seems as if most people who knew him are intent on cleaning up his image rather than discussing what Trayvon was really like.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

liberal media: The Trayvon Martin Tweets


----------



## Si modo (Mar 27, 2012)

IndependntLogic said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...




Typical leftie.  Can't stand real definitions, so you make one up.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Page 2: Trayvon Martin Shooter Says Teenager Went for His Gun - ABC News

Page 2 of 2
SANFORD, Fla., March 26

The law affords people enormous leeway to use deadly force if they feel their life is seriously endangered. Sonner said Zimmerman felt "one of them was going to die that night," when he pulled the trigger.

Corey, a veteran prosecutor known for her zealous defense of victims rights was hand-picked by Florida Gov. Rick Scott for the job. But she faces other challenges in the case.

While in life Trayvon Martin was barely 17, when it comes to justifiable homicide his size -- about 6-foot-3 and 150 pounds -- makes him an adult in death.

Zimmerman, 28, is 5-foot-9 and weighs well over 200 pounds. 

========

Was Trayvon Martin a Drug Dealer?

To learn more about Trayvon&#8217;s character, we have to look to his friends and family to offer clues.
Unfortunately, it seems as if most people who knew him are intent on cleaning up his image,
rather than discussing what Trayvon was really like.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Page 2: Trayvon Martin Shooter Says Teenager Went for His Gun - ABC News

Page 2 of 2
SANFORD, Fla., March 26

The law affords people enormous leeway to use deadly force if they feel their life is seriously endangered. Sonner said Zimmerman felt "one of them was going to die that night," when he pulled the trigger.

Corey, a veteran prosecutor known for her zealous defense of victims rights was hand-picked by Florida Gov. Rick Scott for the job. But she faces other challenges in the case.

While in life Trayvon Martin was barely 17, when it comes to justifiable homicide his size -- about 6-foot-3 and 150 pounds -- makes him an adult in death.

Zimmerman, 28, is 5-foot-9 and weighs well over 200 pounds. 

========

Was Trayvon Martin a Drug Dealer?

To learn more about Trayvon&#8217;s character, we have to look to his friends and family to offer clues.
Unfortunately, it seems as if most people who knew him are intent on cleaning up his image,
rather than discussing what Trayvon was really like.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



How about the dictionary.

Do you get that information, or gossip, by watching or by listening? Hint, if you watch, it is your knowledge, and, by definition, not hearsay.

Instead of always trying to prove me wrong you might want to admit you are wrong occasionally.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Soggy in NOLA said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



Ah, c'mon. Why the hell not? Lynchings are so much fun.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



If,Zimmerman is telling the truth it might explain why the witnesses are verifying what he said. As for the punch, somebody should have had a cell phone out filming it. Since they didn't, it proves it didn't happen, which proves Zimmerman is lying.

Hunt him down and kill him.


----------



## auditor0007 (Mar 27, 2012)

Jackson said:


> theDoctorisIn said:
> 
> 
> > Shockingly enough, the guy still living claims the dead guy started it...
> ...



Is that the guy that is 100 pounds heavier than the victim?  I know I always try to start fights with guys that have a hundred pounds on me.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



Never said I did know. My point is rather simple, Zimmerman saying he was attacked is not hearsay.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Dr Grump said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



Then why are you trying to prove me wrong when I said Zimmerman saying he was attacked is not hearsay?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> Clementine said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



The media jumping to conclusions justifies a trial?


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Not that I am going to let facts sway my opinion, Zimmerman is obviously guilty and needs to be hinted down and killed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wow, only took him 1 month to get his story straight.

We should definitely just believe whatever Zimmerman says. No need to put it to a Grand Jury. If the shooter says his shooting was justified - then obviously it is.

Come on guys, this is like law enforcement 101 - if someone commits a homicide and they tell you they did it in self defense - then they couldn't possibly be lying to protect themselves.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Seawytch said:


> theDoctorisIn said:
> 
> 
> > Clementine said:
> ...



Why arrest him? Do you want everyone who gets attacked arrested?


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Seawytch said:
> 
> 
> > theDoctorisIn said:
> ...




People who commit homicides should generally be arrested, yes.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Seawytch said:


> American Horse said:
> 
> 
> > I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.
> ...



He did? You have an interesting imagination, don't you?


----------



## auditor0007 (Mar 27, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> theDoctorisIn said:
> 
> 
> > Clementine said:
> ...



I'm just curious as to where it is legal to shoot and kill someone for punching you in the nose, regardless of who started it?  If this kid did attack Zimmerman unprovoked, which is debatable, how is it that Zimmerman, weighing 100 pounds more than the kid, gets beat up to the point that he needs to use a gun to defend himself?  What a fucking pussy, if that is the case.  If he's that much of a pussy, he should never have been following the kid in the first place.  But then, I don't buy that story.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> > There have been no reports that a witness saw the initial punch Zimmerman told police about
> 
> 
> 
> so its all heresay..



better than nothing

U.S. News - Trayvon Martin was suspended three times from school

In October, Martin was suspended with friends for writing W.T.F. on a hallway locker,
according to a school report obtained by the Herald.
A security guard looking through his backpack for the graffiti marker and instead found womens rings
and earrings and a screwdriver, described by the staffer as a burglary tool.

Ben Crump, an attorney for Martins parents, told the Herald they had never heard about the bag of jewelry.

And anyway, its completely irrelevant to what happened Feb. 26, Crump told the Miami Herald.
They never heard this and dont believe its true.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > theDoctorisIn said:
> ...



Umm, not necessarily.

In Florida the law actually requires police to prove you did something wrong before they arrest you. Wouldn't it be wonderful if every state required that?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Seawytch said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



It it was, the police will arrest him.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



They have to prove you did something wrong to WHO?


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Seawytch said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



So basically he shouldn't be arrested until AFTER and if a jury finds him guilty.

That's brilliant. I'm sure he won't try to flee jurisdiction if it looks like the case is going against him.


You gotta love it. Poor black folks spend months behind bars under suspicion of all sorts of minor crimes because they can't afford bail - but if you KILL a black guy, you shouldn't even be arrested until AFTER (and if) you are found guilty!!

Maybe we should let him stay free pending appeal. If he's got a good lawyer, he could probably drag it out for decades.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Charles_Main said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



Wrong again, unsubstantiated statements by an individual is eyewitness testimony.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Not that I am going to let facts sway my opinion, Zimmerman is obviously guilty and needs to be hinted down and killed.
> ...



I said to hunt him down and kill him.


----------



## ginscpy (Mar 27, 2012)

2 smucks with raging hormones looking for a fight


----------



## oreo (Mar 27, 2012)

Dante said:


> *Martin - Zimmerman | Arrests | Florida Statute | Criminal Investigations*
> 
> A tragey has visited the city of Sanford, Florida, and espeially the families involved in this very public circus. A young man is dead, and a mob is hounding and hunting an innocent man accused of no crime. The mob is bent on exacting a pound of flesh be owed (  Pound of flesh ), regardless of facts or solid evidence.
> 
> ...





That would be the same as me picking a fight with you---you respond--and I shoot you dead--and I get to walk away a free person. _And you think that's O.K.--then God help this society._  The Stand your ground law--did not include pursuit.  The police dispatcher told Zimmerman not to pursue this kid--he ignored that by getting out of his car--and confronting this kid.  Through Zimmerman's actions he killed an innocent kid--who had no criminal record what-so-ever.  This could have been anyone's kid--including yours.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

candycorn said:


> A child is dead.  He was a teenager.  The "stand your ground" law is to blame clearly.



No it is not, but thanks for playing.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Clearly there are only two options a) kill him with a vigilante mob b) shut the fuck up and pretend like nothing ever happened and let him off


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Not that I am going to let facts sway my opinion, Zimmerman is obviously guilty and needs to be hinted down and killed.
> ...



Umm, genius, the report is from the night of the shooting.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Seawytch said:
> ...



You think someone who kills a person who is breaking into their house should be arrested? You are aware that is homicide, aren't you? 

Should police who kill people be arrested? More homicide.

Idiot.


----------



## Mr.Nick (Mar 27, 2012)

Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton (especially) have a long history of paying people to lie....

Tawana Brawley, Duke Lacrosse, Jenna 6 etc...

No one should believe a word that comes out of their black activist mouths...


----------



## auditor0007 (Mar 27, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



It was a clear case of self-defense from what?  A 140 pound skinny kid?  Really?  The kid was that much of a threat that Zimmerman was justified in shooting him after he was told not to follow him?  I don't know what happened and it doesn't really seem anyone else does either.  Bottom line is that you don't kill someone for punching you in the face.  If you do, you are likely going to prison.  I really do hope they can determine what exactly happened so everyone can get some real answers.  I'm just having a real hard time buying into this young kid going after Zimmerman and beating him up after he supposedly told his girlfriend he was scared that this guy was following him and had him cornered.  Zimmerman's story doesn't add up.  If Trayvon attacked Zimmerman it was out of pure fear which was brought on by Zimmerman stalking him.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

auditor0007 said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > theDoctorisIn said:
> ...



It is generally legal to shoot someone who is beating you down while you are on the ground. That actually applies in every single state and Washington DC because it is actually impossible to retreat when someone is holding you down.

I do appreciate you sticking to the spirit, and letter, of the OP, and not let actual facts sway your opinion, we should hunt Zimmerman down and kill him. It would teach him, and everyone else that thinks they have a right to self defense, a lesson.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



To the guy who was bashing your head off the sidewalk, who else?

Idiots will be idiots.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Seawytch said:
> ...



No, genius, he shouldn't be arrested unless the police have evidence he did something wrong. That, believe it or not, is the way the system is supposed to work. Just because you think everyone should be arrested and that they are guilty until proven innocent does not mean the justice system agrees with you.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



Clearly, there is a third, the one you have chosen.

I just prefer to actually accept the fact that Martin might actually have been wrong here.


----------



## auditor0007 (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> auditor0007 said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



So Trayvon's girlfriend's account of things is to be disregarded?  She stated that while she was on the phone with him, Trayvon told her that this guy was following him and then that he was cornered.  So after being stalked, Trayvon had no right to defend himself against a threat?  Honestly if some guy that is a lot bigger than me corners me and threatens me, I'm going to fight for my life, and I think you would too.  But doing so then gives your assailant the right to shoot and kill you.  See the problem?


----------



## Mr.Nick (Mar 27, 2012)

auditor0007 said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > theDoctorisIn said:
> ...



IMO Zimmerman is a wanna b cop with an itchy trigger finger....

Martin probably was the aggressor - he probably told Zimmerman to fuck off and when he didn't he beat Zimmermans ass, only then did Zimmerman pull the pistol.

Zimmerman was probably dreaming for the day he could shoot someone (anyone)...

Zimmerman would have shot anyone who laid a finger on him while believing he was justified in doing such....


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Mar 27, 2012)

auditor0007 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > auditor0007 said:
> ...



Trayvon's girlfriend? The one that said there was some sort of fight? The one that refused to talk to police until someone explained to her that making Zimmerman look bad might help her make some money? That girlfriend?

Question, if Zimmerman was a threat, why was he on the ground under Trayvon? Why was Zimmerman yelling for help? 

Don't let facts sway your opinion now, keep blaming the guy that was getting a beat down from a kid half his age.


----------



## Mr.Nick (Mar 27, 2012)

auditor0007 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > auditor0007 said:
> ...



What she says is hardly relevant considering all she heard was Zimmerman saying: "what are you doing here" and "where are you going?"

I have little doubt Martin started the altercation physically, however that didn't give Zimmerman the right to shoot and kill him.

IMO, Zimmerman was just out looking for trouble and a reason to shoot anyone.


----------



## Chris (Mar 27, 2012)

Zimmerman outweighed Martin by 60 lbs.

Zimmerman is lying.


----------



## Chris (Mar 27, 2012)

Peach said:


> A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> 
> Was rejected from a police academy, reasons unknown. Set himself up as the "Neighborhood Watch" in his community.
> 
> ...



He still has the gun he used to kill Trayvon.

It was never tested. His clothes were not tested. The Sanford police did nothing. They did not even question him at the scene.

Unbelievable.


----------



## Mr.Nick (Mar 27, 2012)

Chris said:


> Zimmerman outweighed Martin by 60 lbs.
> 
> Zimmerman is lying.



Who fucking cares???

I have kicked dudes asses that outweigh me by 100 pounds...

Size doesn't mean shit...


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Mar 27, 2012)

auditor0007 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > auditor0007 said:
> ...



Link to her saying he said he was cornered, cause damn I haven't herd that anywhere yet.


----------



## koshergrl (Mar 27, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


> > There have been no reports that a witness saw the initial punch Zimmerman told police about
> 
> 
> 
> so its all heresay..


 


Look up hearsay, genius.


----------



## Artevelde (Mar 27, 2012)

So many threads ... so little that is relevant.
How about letting the police and the judiciary do their work?


----------



## Godboy (Mar 27, 2012)

Artevelde said:


> So many threads ... so little that is relevant.
> How about letting the police and the judiciary do their work?



When have we ever seen these "race movements" wait for the facts? You watch, this is going to end up like the Tawana Brawley and Duke lacrosse team cases. Im going to laugh my ass off when the real facts come out and Zimmerman is exhonerated.


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Chris said:


> Zimmerman outweighed Martin by 60 lbs.
> 
> Zimmerman is lying.




Trayvon was a very tall guy

Page 2: Trayvon Martin Shooter Says Teenager Went for His Gun - ABC News

Page 2 of 2
SANFORD, Fla., March 26

The law affords people enormous leeway to use deadly force if they feel their life is seriously endangered. Sonner said Zimmerman felt "one of them was going to die that night," when he pulled the trigger.

Corey, a veteran prosecutor known for her zealous defense of victims rights was hand-picked by Florida Gov. Rick Scott for the job. But she faces other challenges in the case.

While in life Trayvon Martin was barely 17, when it comes to justifiable homicide his size -- about 6-foot-3 and 150 pounds -- makes him an adult in death.

Zimmerman, 28, is 5-foot-9 and weighs well over 200 pounds. 

========

http://www.wagist.com/2012/dan-linehan/was-trayvon-martin-a-drug-dealer

To learn more about Trayvons character, we have to look to his friends and family to offer clues.
Unfortunately, it seems as if most people who knew him are intent on cleaning up his image,
rather than discussing what Trayvon was really like.

=========================================



U.S. News - Trayvon Martin was suspended three times from school

In October, Martin was suspended with friends for writing W.T.F. on a hallway locker,
according to a school report obtained by the Herald.
A security guard looking through his backpack for the graffiti marker and instead found womens rings
and earrings and a screwdriver, described by the staffer as a burglary tool.

Ben Crump, an attorney for Martins parents, told the Herald they had never heard about the bag of jewelry.

And anyway, its completely irrelevant to what happened Feb. 26, Crump told the Miami Herald.
They never heard this and dont believe its true.


[youtube]ED6ckuxU924[/youtube]


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Zimmerman says Okay. he stops following Martin


----------



## Artevelde (Mar 27, 2012)

Godboy said:


> Artevelde said:
> 
> 
> > So many threads ... so little that is relevant.
> ...



Quite possible. I'll just wait and see how the process plays out. That is why we have police and prosecutors.


----------



## Ariux (Mar 27, 2012)

Mr.Nick said:


> Martin probably was the aggressor - he probably told Zimmerman to fuck off and when he didn't he beat Zimmermans ass, only then did Zimmerman pull the pistol.



You're probably right.  And, it was self-defense.  Stupid no-limit-nigga, brought fists to a gun fight.


----------



## Dick Tuck (Mar 27, 2012)




----------



## Ariux (Mar 27, 2012)

Chris said:


> He still has the gun he used to kill Trayvon.
> 
> It was never tested. His clothes were not tested. The Sanford police did nothing. They did not even question him at the scene.
> 
> Unbelievable.



Yeah, unbelievable how stupid some people are, that they think Zimmerman did something wrong.  Test the gun for what?  Hmmm?  What questions do you think they should have asked Zimmerman?  Test his clothes for what?


----------



## California Girl (Mar 27, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



All of which were made on black people? 

All?

Really?

And your proof of that is..... what exactly?


----------



## theDoctorisIn (Mar 27, 2012)

*A number of threads have been merged.


How many threads do we need about this?*


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

theDoctorisIn said:


> *A number of threads have been merged.
> 
> 
> How many threads do we need about this?*



2 or 3 instead of how many?


----------



## jillian (Mar 27, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > BreezeWood said:
> ...



I suppose I could go find the bill jacket and look for the legislative intent, but both the sponsor of the bill and the governor who signed it into law said the bill does not apply to someone who hunts another person down.

but if you had two IQ points to rub together, you'd know that, wouldn't you?

or you could just shut your yap and look at the statute 

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes...ng=&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.013.html


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 27, 2012)

Dick Tuck said:


>



That might mean something now if new information about Trayvon had not already come out.
Like drug involvement
His suspension from school because of drugs
Gangs
and violence.
It appears that he was a little thug want to be.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 27, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Nawh martin couldn't have been in the wrong he was an angel who want to fly planes or work on them, don't believe me just ask anyone from the left.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 27, 2012)

Chris said:


> Peach said:
> 
> 
> > A record of violence, he assaulted a police officer, got off through Pre Trial diversion. Had an Injunction against him for domestic violence, dismissed after he filed one also.
> ...


Really?  Then I wonder why the cop report said they disarmed Zimmerman and entered his gun into evidence and labeled it "TS-1".

They first responding officers did not question him at the scene because he was being treated by paramedics and they can't whenever that is happening.  They then cuffed him and took him to the cop station where he was interviewed in an interview room by Investigator D. Singleton for several hours.


It's in the cop report.  You should read it.

As to his clothes not being tested, what do you want them tested for?  Gunshot residue?  He admitted to shooting his gun at the kid, you know.  Right?


----------



## Si modo (Mar 27, 2012)

jillian said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


But, correct me if I'm wrong, legislative intent is only probative BEFORE the law is passed, not after.

What any lawmaker says about the intent after the law is passed has little to probably no relevance.

It seems if it did, we could just bypass one branch of government - the judicial branch.  The politicians/lawmakers could just apply the law where they saw fit.

Is that the case?


----------



## Trajan (Mar 27, 2012)

jillian said:


> American Horse said:
> 
> 
> > I think it's worth pointing out that the picture we keep seeing of Trayvon is him when he was 12 years old.  When he died he was 17 years old, 6'-3" tall, and weighed 140 pounds.  They should start showing a more recent photo of him, because this one of him as child is distorting who he actually was.  He was big enough to get Zimmerman on the ground, get on top of him,  break his nose, and smash his head into the pavement.
> ...



almost?


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## Trajan (Mar 27, 2012)

jillian said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



so he was "hunting him down"? ....iz dat der sum  of dat layer touk?


----------



## Trajan (Mar 27, 2012)

Trajan said:


> *
> 
> 
> Peach said:
> ...


*



uh huh...*


----------



## Vidi (Mar 27, 2012)

So, President Obama is White Black...?


----------



## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

Dante said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > The fact that it's not clear that he DID break the law is the reason for the outrage.
> ...



some things...


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 27, 2012)

Vidi said:


> So, President Obama is White Black...?



President Obama is incompetent.


Skin color is irrelevant.


----------



## Crackerjack (Mar 27, 2012)

sealybobo said:


> He was a right wing extremist with guns and racism.


Oops!


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...





			
				KissMy said:
			
		

> Hi, you have received -155 reputation points from KissMy.
> Reputation was given for *this* post.
> 
> Comment:
> ...


Another one!  LOL!!! LOL!!!


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



Marc, don't you believe now that the initial media reports were one sided and they should have waited until the evidence was collected before the rush to judgment?

I am not condoning what Zimmerman did or didn't do or making up my mind yet as I have not seen ALL the evidence or probably anywhere near all of the evidence but it is very clear Marc that the initial reports on this were not true. Initial reports had Zimmerman gunning this kid down in cold blood and we know now that part is not true. There was a fight and Zimmerman pulled the gun when he was on the ground and shot him.
And there is evidence that Martin saw the gun before the fight but maybe Zimmerman threatened him with it, who knows? Maybe Martin felt like HIS life was in danger if a gun was pulled on him. Could be that way also as NO one knows. Could be that he was acting in fear of his life after seeing the gun. In his mind seeing a gun pulled on him meant that the gun was pulled TO BE USED ON HIM.
We just do not know. As a result of all of this there is no question in my mind the initial claims of "police corruption" and "they are not doing anything" are bogus to the core.
Both parties deserve the presumption of innocence in this case and Zimmerman did not get that after the circus side show started.


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## MarcATL (Mar 27, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


No, I don't believe the media is hyping this up out of proportion.

We have an armed adult, killing an unarmed kid.

We have a man that was told not to pursue the kid.

We have a man that pursued the kid.

We have a kid that was now gunned down dead.

Had the adult man followed the instructions of the authorities and not pursue or discontinue his pursuit of the kid, who had EVERY RIGHT to be where he was, the kid would not be dead.

All of the above are facts.

How could such a man not be arrested with all the above?

How could such a man have a gun in the first place?

I believe these are the main points the media is talking about and questions being asked in the media.

Those are all fair.


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## beagle9 (Mar 27, 2012)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Seawytch said:
> ...




OJ Simpson alledgedly kills poor white woman (his wife) and her friend, then is chased for a long period of time by LA police, until the SUV finally stops (where he is crouched down in the back with a gun), and this ended at OJ's home or residence this chase, and then once captured, very quickly it is demanded by his lawyer who arrived on the scene, that the hand cuffs are to be removed immediately, *because he hadn't been charged with a crime or proven guilty of a crime at that point *(so why didn't the white people demand in the thousands, that OJ be arrested and the hand cuffs put back on immediately, because they *FELT* that OJ was guilty etc. ?.... What's with the hypocrsy in your statement, by using the poor black guy analogy in your statement, suggesting that Zimmerman be arrested and deemed guilty without a hearing, indictment or a trial to prove his guilt, and this beyond the shadow of a doubt  ? 

What if Latino's were yelling to the top of their voices right now, that their guy Zimmerman is the focus of a witch hunt, in which deems Zimmerman guilty before all the facts and the evidence is finally in ? We are a nation of laws and not of men, so we should make sure that the process is correct, and this by all our review, and if it isn't correct, then we should as *Americans *speak in unison against injustices, if it is to be found that justice is not served, and we must quit with the racial stereo typing and class warfare that is being used in these types of cases.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


You are a lying idiot most of what you said is untrue or based on racial emotions.


> We have an armed adult, killing an unarmed kid.


A person can kill while defending them self 



> We have a man that was told not to pursue the kid.


He stopped when told to do so.



> We have a man that pursued the kid.


Nothing wrong with observing a stranger who has enter your neighborhood, which had some recent break ins



> We have a man that pursued the kid.


We have a 17 year old who hit another person and went for his gun



> How could such a man not be arrested with all the above?



Not enough evidence to arrest



> How could such a man have a gun in the first place?


Since when is defending your self wrong?


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## MarcATL (Mar 27, 2012)

Your ENTIRE post was nothing but supposition and conjecture. Nothing supported by facts. You're also lying on top of that.

W.O.W.!!!


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Your ENTIRE post was nothing but supposition and conjecture. Nothing supported by facts. You're also lying on top of that.
> 
> W.O.W.!!!



You're an idiot you wouldn't know a fact if it hit you in the face.


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## beagle9 (Mar 27, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Your ENTIRE post was nothing but supposition and conjecture. Nothing supported by facts. You're also lying on top of that.
> 
> W.O.W.!!!


Um, hit the little check box to add quote when respond....Thanks


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 27, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Your ENTIRE post was nothing but supposition and conjecture. Nothing supported by facts. You're also lying on top of that.
> ...



This was the post he was talking about.


bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



He has a hard time using the quote feature when he can't make his argument stick.


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## Dante (Mar 27, 2012)

*O k M, any of this shit true?*

Its becoming more and more evident that 17-teen-year-old Trayvon Martin had fully embraced the anti white black thug culture that is so pervasive here in our country and that is, in fact, largely responsible for rotting the morals of our youth.

What could be even more alarming than this? Ive just learned that the youths no limit nigga lingo -lingo that was found on his Twitter account  is actually POPULAR slang used by the Florida Black Foot Soldiers when they are talking about what they call black on white (BOW) reparations protests.

Trayvon Martin &#8220;Florida Black Foot Soldier Link&#8221; ESTABLISHED! &#8220;No Limit Nigga&#8217; Lingo is Popular Florida Black Foot Soldier Slang for &#8220;Black On White (BOW) Crime:&#8221; Had Teen Embraced Anti White Black Thug Culture & D

For those of you who dont know, Black Foot Soldier BOW reparations protests are actully black on white robberies. They use lingo like this to mask their support of their support of crime and violence against whites for any reason.

Whats most important for us to all remember here? Its most important to remember that the anti white black thug culture that Trayvon embraced emphatically hates white people and has ZERO respect for whites in positions of authority.


nationalblackfootsoldiernetwork


MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 28, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> But of course you ascribing to the one you support is somehow different right? Care to LINK to an eye witness account that it was martin yelling?



And that is where you are lying.  I haven't been basing my arguments on the witness who said it was Trayvon heard yelling on the tape, and you know it.  I've pointed out all of the inconsistencies in Zimmerman's stories, in the stories that have been presented to defend him and fill in other blanks, and the physical evidence known.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 28, 2012)

Clementine said:


> The media is repeating lies



And you know this because you know the "truth," right?  You were there, or something, right?  No, you weren't.  So shut up with the bullshit.


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## Douger (Mar 28, 2012)

I do. I'll buy this bimbo a house !
Tree confrontation !
Drunk girl at Ultra 2012 - YouTube!


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 28, 2012)

jillian said:


> or you could just shut your yap and look at the statute
> 
> Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine



For all the babbling that people are doing, you would think that they had read the statute.  At least, they act like they've read the statute.  But anyone who _has_ read the statute clearly sees that no part of it applies to a person out in public who pursues another person on the false belief that said other person is about to commit a crime.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > or you could just shut your yap and look at the statute
> ...


I've read the statute several times.

Now, could you point out what part in that law disqualifies what Zimmerman did for protection under that law?

Thanks.


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## Dante (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> no part of it applies to a person out in public who pursues another person on the false belief that said other person is about to commit a crime.



and Zimmerman and the police never said Zimmerman shot Martin because Zimmerman thought Martin was about to commit a crime.

so reading and comprehension is not in your back of tricks?

I'll help you. Under the law- Zimmerman claimed self defense in fear for his life while being beaten down by Trayvon Martin, a 6'3" young man.


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 28, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Logical fallacy.  The burden of proof is on you.  The law covers Zimmerman if:

_(a)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that persons will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and

(b)&#8195;The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred._

The burden of proof is on you to how how Martin fit those criteria.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...


Not really.  He is PRESUMED innocent AND PRESUMED to have the law apply to him.

Your burden.  I just presume what the law says I have to.

And, you should read section 3.

Which you didn't quote.


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## Ravi (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...


Here's a case that was in today's paper for contrast. A man was ruled immune from prosecution for killing a burglar that he caught in the act. Notice that a judge made the determination. In Zimmerman's case, it never got to a judge to decide.

Bag of car radios ruled a deadly threat in Stand Your Ground decision - Miami-Dade - MiamiHerald.com


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## Dante (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



the law applies if a man is being beaten into submission on the ground while fearing for his life.

you and every other nitwit here have no evidence to the contrary. only speck-u-lation


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## Inthemiddle (Mar 28, 2012)

Dante said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > no part of it applies to a person out in public who pursues another person on the false belief that said other person is about to commit a crime.
> ...



Reading comprehension is well within my grasp, but not yours, apparently.  Zimmerman pursued Martin on the false believe that Martin was "up to no good."  Such a scenario does not invoke application of the stand your ground law.  Stand your ground applies to when a the person against whom force is used is actually engaged in an illegal entry.  Zimmerman's actions are not covered under the stand your ground law. 



> I'll help you. Under the law- Zimmerman claimed self defense



Zimmerman claims self defense.  But his actions are not covered under the law.



> in fear for his life while being beaten down by Trayvon Martin, a 6'3" young man.



Martin was 150 pounds.  At his height he was a fragile twig, easily broken.  I'm only 5'7" and I weigh 160.  At 5'9" Zimmerman is over 200 pounds.  It's ridiculous to think that Martin would have been able to take Zimmerman down with one punch, as Martin claims.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 28, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



He was NEVER told not to pursue the kid. If he was, 911 operators are not authorized to make those demands anyway. Why do you distort the truth. "You do not have to" is what he was told. Distortion #1 by Marc.
Media has misprepresented most of the facts and not reported many others.
Distortion #2.
There is no duty to arrest anyone until a grand jury meets in most jurisdictions in America.
Distortion #3.
He had A LICENSE to carry the guy.
Distortion #4 by Marc.
"gunned down" That is a lie Marc and you know it. The gun was fired with Martin on top of Zimmerman. Lie #1 by Marc.

Your mind is made up as you are bitter, biased and prejudiced. 
I thought you were different. I am open to the evidence as possibly Martin had the gun waved in his face before he took Zimmerman to the ground. To me that is self defense and Martin would be okay doing it. I have an open mind.
You do not and would be unfit to serve on any jury, especially this one.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



"He was fragile twig, easily broken"
You are a joke.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 28, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Dumbass, it has not even been indicted yet.
You are about as stupid as a box of rocks.
Civics class 101 for you, back to 6th grade.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> ....
> 
> Zimmerman claims self defense.  But his actions are not covered under the law.
> 
> ....


Section 3 of the law says his actions ARE covered.

You should read that section.


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## Ravi (Mar 28, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



You really don't know what you're talking about. In Zimmerman's case, the DA and/or the police department made the decision to not press charges. Under the stand your ground law, only a judge has the authority to make that decision.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...


He pulled 150 lbs out of some orifice, as well.


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## saveliberty (Mar 28, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



Depends how the 200 pounds is distributed.  I'm 5'9" and 195.  A 6'3" 150 pound person is going to get his ass kicked messing with me.  Difference might be, my waist is a 32; chest 44 and Mr. Zimmerman might be a 40 for both.  He probably felt tougher with that gun though.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 28, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...





> I am open to the evidence as possibly Martin had the gun waved in his face before he took Zimmerman to the ground. To me that is self defense and Martin would be okay doing it. I have an open mind.



With all the media attention and racially motivated actions I wonder why they haven't play with that angle?


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## saveliberty (Mar 28, 2012)

Hope the police are working on this case as hard as we all are.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...


Where are you getting that Martin was 6'3" and 150 lbs?

The cop report says he was 6' and 160 lbs.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 28, 2012)

This is what I would be focusing on as a prosecution investigator as I mentioned earlier.

If Zimmerman HAD THE GUN OUT in his pursuit then the proximate cause of the death is the gun being out. His life WAS IN NO DANGER in the pursuit.

And if it was not out then how can someone be arrested if they pull a gun after they have been attacked?

You folks need to understand THE LAW. Just because you do not like it does not make your opinion valid.
Ignorance of the law is NEVER A DEFENSE. Government never has a duty to report the law or inform the public of the law as that is the duty of the citizen.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 28, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Hope the police are working on this case as hard as we all are.



Yeah no shit.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 28, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



DA takes the case after the police make an arrest.
DA TAKES THE CASE TO THE GRAND JURY.
A DA can NOT take a case to the grand jury basing their decision ON THE LAW, and SYG is THE LAW.
I have been doing this for over 30 years. I own a detective agency and have investigated over 3000 criminal cases with over 1000 going to trial.
I do this for a living. 
Fool, the police CAN NEVER make the decision NOT to take a case to the grand jury.
They have no authority to do that.
Please, educate yourself as you are making yourself look very foolish here.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 28, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Your ENTIRE post was nothing but supposition and conjecture. Nothing supported by facts.



So kind of like every post of yours....



> You're also lying on top of that.
> 
> W.O.W.!!!



The problem here Marc, is that you're a racist. So instead of letting the evidence guide you, you determine guilt or innocence by skin color.


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## Ravi (Mar 28, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


You obviously didn't read my link about the case that was in the paper today. There was no grand jury involvement because the stabber invoked stand your ground.

Also, the police chief stated that Zimmerman wasn't arrested because there was no probable cause UNDER stand your ground.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 28, 2012)

Ravi the police cheif was wrong.

The police should have arrested him and let the court decide if stand your ground covers him or not, since its not the police's job to be judge or jury.   (The law shouldn't apply to zimmerman from the information that is available)


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Ravi the police cheif was wrong.
> 
> The police should have arrested him and let the court decide if stand your ground covers him or not, since its not the police's job to be judge or jury.   (The law shouldn't apply to zimmerman from the information that is available)


What about Zimmerman and/or his actions exclude him from that law?


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 28, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi the police cheif was wrong.
> ...



He followed and intiated a confrontation, this exempts him from protection according to the the way the language in the law reads and the 2 people who drafted it.

I could be wrong but one thing is for sure, that is a judge's and/or jury's job to decide and not a police chief's.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


And, if I were a cop in Florida, I wouldn't think I would be able to charge him, either, because of that law.

Ravi, you posted a few days ago something about a big increase in 'justifiable' homicides since the passage of that SYG law.  Can you repost that info if it's not too much trouble.  I looked for your earlier post, but failed in finding it.

Folks should know about that increase, IMO.


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


You keep saying that, but it simply is not true.

There is NO EXEMPTION for following and/or initiating in that statute.

See:

776.012&#8195;Use of force in defense of person.&#8212;A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other&#8217;s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:

    (1)&#8195;He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
    (2)&#8195;Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.

776.013&#8195;Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.&#8212;

(1)&#8195;A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

    (a)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that person&#8217;s will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and
    (b)&#8195;The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.

(2)&#8195;The presumption set forth in subsection (1) does not apply if:

    (a)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force is used has the right to be in or is a lawful resident of the dwelling, residence, or vehicle, such as an owner, lessee, or titleholder, and there is not an injunction for protection from domestic violence or a written pretrial supervision order of no contact against that person; or
    (b)&#8195;The person or persons sought to be removed is a child or grandchild, or is otherwise in the lawful custody or under the lawful guardianship of, the person against whom the defensive force is used; or
    (c)&#8195;The person who uses defensive force is engaged in an unlawful activity or is using the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle to further an unlawful activity; or
    (d)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force is used is a law enforcement officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who enters or attempts to enter a dwelling, residence, or vehicle in the performance of his or her official duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with any applicable law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that the person entering or attempting to enter was a law enforcement officer.

(3)&#8195;A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

(4)&#8195;A person who unlawfully and by force enters or attempts to enter a person&#8217;s dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle is presumed to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence.

(5)&#8195;As used in this section, the term:

    (a)&#8195;&#8220;Dwelling&#8221; means a building or conveyance of any kind, including any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is designed to be occupied by people lodging therein at night.
    (b)&#8195;&#8220;Residence&#8221; means a dwelling in which a person resides either temporarily or permanently or is visiting as an invited guest.
    (c)&#8195;&#8220;Vehicle&#8221; means a conveyance of any kind, whether or not motorized, which is designed to transport people or property.​




Think about it, too, Pilgrim; there can't be that exemption.  If I shove someone, I've initiated a fight.  They in turn, try to beat the ever-living-shit out of me and I can no longer use deadly force to save my life?

I don't think so.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 28, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Hope the police are working on this case as hard as we all are.



They have more facts than we do, so there is less guess work involve.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 28, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Zimmerman probably did not know the law existed.
No doubt that is why he was not arrested.
A judge makes that ruling when the defense is required to list their affirmative defense BEFORE TRIAL. If a judge rules that that defense can not be used a defendant STILL can use self defense statute which is a totally different statute.
As I have stated from the start I give Martin the benefit of the doubt if the gun had been pulled before the attack. That makes Martin defending himself.
Martin was breaking no laws apparantly and if a gun is pulled on him he has every right to attack Zimmerman in self defense. This could be the case. Makes for a minumum of voluntary manslaughter and possibly murder. 
BUT WAIT FOR THE GRAND JURY CASE.
Grand jury presentation AFTER AN ARREST is different than with NO arrest.


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## Ravi (Mar 28, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


I couldn't find the same link but here is an article discussing it:



> According to Florida state records, justifiable homicides by private citizens - not law enforcement officers - have risen steadily under the stand your ground law. In 2010, there were 40; in 2004, there were eight. FBI statistics on justifiable homicides nationwide show similar increases, from 196 in 2005 to 278 in 2010.



Florida killing raises questions about 'stand your ground' laws - KansasCity.com


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## Ravi (Mar 28, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> R*avi the police cheif was wrong.*
> 
> The police should have arrested him and let the court decide if stand your ground covers him or not, since its not the police's job to be judge or jury.   (The law shouldn't apply to zimmerman from the information that is available)


I agree that the police chief was wrong.

I also agree that the law shouldn't apply to him, simply because Martin's crime, according to Zimmerman, was wondering around the neighborhood. And Zimmerman did follow him.

It's possible that in the end he acted in self-defense, but that is a determination that can only be made in the course of a trial.


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## PLYMCO_PILGRIM (Mar 28, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Yes you would not get protected under the stand your ground law if you intiated the confrontation, nothing in the language you just posted provides for you to be protected if you initiated the situation.


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## saveliberty (Mar 28, 2012)

Ravi said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > R*avi the police cheif was wrong.*
> ...



This is why I think it ends up a negligent homicide plea.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 28, 2012)

Ravi said:


> I couldn't find the same link but here is an article discussing it:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Have the total number of firearm homicides increased or decreased?

They have decreased.

Gun crime statistics by US state: download the data. Visualised | World news | guardian.co.uk

Since the total has decreased, is your complaint that it's the bad guys instead of innocent victims, who are dying?


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## Si modo (Mar 28, 2012)

PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> ...


Ummmmmm, the law doesn't HAVE to explicitly state every condition under which the law applies.

No requirement or canon of interpretation says that.  Ever.


The law is presumed to apply to everyone, unless explicitly exempted, ESPECIALLY when exemptions are listed.  _Expressio unius est exclusio alterius_ (Expression of one [exemption] excludes the other [exemption]). We don't just make shit up as we go along in this country. 

Now, if the legislature addressed that specific instance in their discussions (which are on record) BEFORE the passage of the law, then you may have a point.

However, what politicians say they meant AFTER passage, means shit in a court.


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## The Infidel (Mar 28, 2012)

*This case is very disturbing... 

They have put a bounty out on that poor man, and not a word from DOJ or Obama...

Spike Lee posts the wrong address for Zimmerman, and not a word from DOJ or Obama...

Al Sharpton stirring up racist hatred, and not a word from DOJ or Obama...

I am shocked at where we are going as a nation.


WHERE ARE YOU OBAMA...????? WHERE ARE YOU ERIC HOLDER????? 


YOU FUCKING BASTATRDS!!!!!​*


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## beagle9 (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Clementine said:
> 
> 
> > The media is repeating lies
> ...


Funny how this type of answer, can easily be a two edged sword....Did you think of that when lost your cool in such a way ?


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## Vidi (Mar 28, 2012)

Si modo said:


> PLYMCO_PILGRIM said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Correct. Once the law is passed its up to the judiciary to inpret the law.


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## IndependntLogic (Mar 28, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> You are a lying idiot most of what you said is untrue or based on racial emotions.
> 
> A whackjob will retort without facts or even addressing positions. They simply insult the poster. So do you have anything to counter what Marc actually posted?
> 
> ...



You know he was defending himself how? Oh yeah. Forgot. Psychic Conservative Powers let you know that anything that will back up the Conservative position must be the facts. 
At least you're entertaining!


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## beagle9 (Mar 28, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > or you could just shut your yap and look at the statute
> ...


Is a gated community considered public or private property, and what about if the community had given Zimmerman the responsibility of being their watchman, and this all due to the breakins and burgurlaries that had been taken place in that gated community ? Who appointed Zimmerman ?

Was Trayvon a suspicous looking character, who needed to be checked out by the watchman, once he was seen walking in the area with a hoodie on, and looking or acting as a suspicious character to the watchman?

Did Trayvons association with BOW, cause him to be upset about being looked at as a suspect in the area, when Zimmerman began surveilence on him, and if so, did it make for a powder keg situation, where these two people came together with all their suspicions combined, where they next began the process of mis-interpretation, confusion, bad analysis, wrongful profiling and etc. in the situation, and this upon each other in the dance in which they began doing around each other, for which next led to a confrontation that ended in tragedy for both men involved in this situation ?


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 28, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Is a gated community considered public or private property, and what about if the community had given Zimmerman the responsibility of being their watchman, and this all due to the breakins and burgurlaries that had been taken place in that gated community ? Who appointed Zimmerman ?
> 
> Was Trayvon a suspicous looking character, who needed to be checked out by the watchman, once he was seen walking in the area with a hoodie on, and looking or acting as a suspicious character to the watchman?
> 
> Did Trayvons association with BOW, cause him to be upset about being looked at as a suspect in the area, when Zimmerman began surveilence on him, and if so, did it make for a powder keg situation, where these two people came together with all their suspicions combined, where they next began the process of mis-interpretation, confusion, bad analysis, wrongful profiling and etc. in the situation, and this upon each other in the dance in which they began doing around each other, for which next led to a confrontation that ended in tragedy for both men involved in this situation ?



There is no evidence - ZERO, that Trayvon Martin had any association with BOW.

None at all.


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## Peach (Mar 28, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...




Any stats on break ins; here is more on justifiable homicides since STAND YOUR GROUND:

Deaths Nearly Triple Since &#8220;Stand Your Ground&#8221; Enacted « CBS Miami


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## Peach (Mar 28, 2012)

IndependntLogic said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > You are a lying idiot most of what you said is untrue or based on racial emotions.
> ...




And how the victim threatened DEADLY FORCE:

However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:

(1)&#8195;He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to* prevent imminent death or great bodily harm *to himself or herself or another* or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or*


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 28, 2012)

Peach said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...



People have a basic right to defend them self. If deaths are on the rise so be it.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 28, 2012)

IndependntLogic said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > You are a lying idiot most of what you said is untrue or based on racial emotions.
> ...



What the fuck ? who are you posting too? everything you post is jibberish and about nothing dealing with the topic.
You are on ignore. You post nothing worth commenting about you arrogant son of a bitch. Do you understand this?


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 28, 2012)

Peach said:


> Any stats on break ins; here is more on justifiable homicides since STAND YOUR GROUND:
> 
> Deaths Nearly Triple Since Stand Your Ground Enacted « CBS Miami



Since I showed you earlier that the TOTAL NUMBER OF FIREARM DEATHS IS DOWN - then your complaint must be that the victims aren't cooperating and dying, the way you want them to.

People are defending themselves, and that upsets you....

You have the right to be a victim
You have the right to die
You have the right to submit
You have the right to be raped
You have the right to be robbed
You have the right to be assaulted

(The leftists bill of rights!)


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## beagle9 (Mar 28, 2012)

Peach said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Inthemiddle said:
> ...


Ok, so deaths nearly trippled since "stand your ground" came into being ?? Ok I will ask this then, why did "stand your ground" down in florida come into being in the first place ? Was Florida a place in certain areas, that had gotten totally out of control, where burgularies, murders and crime had exploded over the years ? Did Floridians think next that they needed a "stand your ground" law, because to many innocents were being abused, robbed, killed/murdered etc. down in Florida? Did this law benefit the state on whole, or has it been a curse on the state since it's inception?

Does anyone know the true stories and the stats to be found in the light in which they should be placed in, or are we going to get the biased version since this event made national headlines now ?


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## beagle9 (Mar 28, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Is a gated community considered public or private property, and what about if the community had given Zimmerman the responsibility of being their watchman, and this all due to the breakins and burgurlaries that had been taken place in that gated community ? Who appointed Zimmerman ?
> ...


Thanks on the BOW issue, because I saw that in these threads lately, and it didn't look good as far as a character analysis goes, and especially upon us trying to get an idea of these two guy's characters, in which we are all dealing with on the issue here...We can only hope that Trayvon wasn't involved in a blanket hatred of whites (or) Zimmerman also in the opposite for that matter, and especially in some sort of club type of thing, thinking or something to that affect. Justice must prevail for all in the situation, and then the nation can get on with the lessons learned from it all, and get on with the healing process for the family and the friends finally. I sure am sorry for what has happened in this situation, and it is my hopes that justice will be found soon in it all, but we must have impartial-non-biased justice to be what is used, and not biased lynch mob justice, that can involve the same types of confusion in which was found in the events of that day.


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## Dante (Mar 28, 2012)

pay attention to the video

a little over half way through the video (50 seconds in), a police officer takes a look at the back of Zimmerman's head  .. looking at something on Zimmerman's head. then he asks him to stand back against the wall

George Zimmerman on Police Surveillance | Video - ABC News


pay attention people. stop being so R-a-v-i   .....looks like a spot or two on back of head. fuzzy video


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## oreo (Mar 28, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...




Not very often do I agree with you--but I do here.  I think we had a wanna-be--cop assigned to neighborhood duty--that had called the police 47 times to make a variety of complaints that was looking for a problem that he could solve.

Zimmerman was told by the police dispatcher not to pursue--Zimmerman told the dispatcher that Martin was running----not running toward Zimmerman but away from him--Zimmerman pursued him in his car--got out of the car to confront Martin--a fight ensued--and then he shot and killed Martin.

It's like if I pick a fight with you--you respond with some punches--I pull my gun--shoot you-and I get to walk away free over the Stand your ground law.  UNBELIEVABLE.

*Now what I don't agree with is the accusation that Martin is dead because he was black.*  Zimmerman would have pursued anyone that looked suspicious and was wearing a hoodie--and I am certain that those 47 different complaints to the cops--were not only revolving around blacks--but whites and hispanics too--that he was suspicious of.  IOW--the elevator in Zimmerman's head didn't quite hit the top floor--47 calls to the police tells me there were some screws loose in Zimmerman's brain.


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## oreo (Mar 28, 2012)

Dante said:


> pay attention to the video
> 
> a little over half way through the video (50 seconds in), a police officer takes a look at the back of Zimmerman's head  .. looking at something on Zimmerman's head. then he asks him to stand back against the wall
> 
> ...




Zimmerman doesn't look like he was touched in this video--his nose certainly isn't broken--no blood there--and I sure didn't see any evidence of any trauma--scratch's or other to his head or anywhere on his body.   IOW--anyone who is a fist fight for their lives--would certainly have proof of it by bleeding--scratch's--and lots of bruising.  Zimmerman is clean as a whistle.


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## IndependntLogic (Mar 28, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> IndependntLogic said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



LOL!!!! owned...


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## oreo (Mar 28, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> 
> When and if they catch up with you after pursuing you, you aren't "confronting" them when you stand your ground.
> 
> ...



*BREAKING NEWS:* *The lead investigator at the scene wanted to arrest Zimmerman and charge him with homicide/manslaughter but was overruled by the state AG.*



> *The special prosecutor in the Trayvon Martin case said that the Sanford Police Department asked the state attorney's office for an arrest warrant to charge George Zimmerman early in the investigation, but the state's attorney's office decided to wait.
> *
> *The Miami Herald reported that the local police initially went to the Seminole State Attorney with a request to file charges and the police report labeled the case as "homicide/negligent manslaughter."*
> 
> ...



_In this is an instance--they should have investigated within a couple of hours and filed charges on Zimmerman.  Here is the lead investigator on the scene stating he didn't believe Zimmerman's account of this incident-and wanted him charged for homicide/manslaughter--and they wait for over a month--until it explodes in their faces is absolutely no excuse._

And who would believe Zimmerman with this video of the way he looked afterwards.  I don't see any blood--I don't see a broken nose--I don't see any bruises or scratch's.  Nothing that would indicate that he was attacked by anyone.

George Zimmerman on Police Surveillance | Video - ABC News


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## Care4all (Mar 28, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > I couldn't find the same link but here is an article discussing it:
> ...


I clicked on the link and they do not have Florida in their figures???


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

IndependntLogic said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > IndependntLogic said:
> ...



The only thing you own is maybe the shoes on your feet and that may be doubtful. Do you want to try that post one more time instead of editing what I wrote?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

oreo said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > You can't "confront" someone if you're actively trying to get away from them.
> ...



Thing about that video was when was it taken how many hours and was he cleaned up  before transported to the police station? His face looked like it has some abrasions on it with some swelling around the nose.


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## Sallow (Mar 29, 2012)

There was no fight.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Sallow said:


> There was no fight.



Were you there? The only justice you want is at the hands of a lynch mob. Only a guilty  verdict will be good enough, isn't that correct?


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## Sallow (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > There was no fight.
> ...



I didn't need to be.

Zimmerman lied.

He said he was getting beaten down so badly that he needed to kill the kid. Well the kid had one minute to accomplish that feat. One minute to beat a muscular 240 lb adult to within an inch of his life. Zimmerman said his nose was broken, he had a huge gash on the back of his head that should have been stitched and his clothes were a mess from the struggle. None of that is even remotely visible in the police video. And Zimmerman doesn't look sore at all.

The police lied too.

This is going to be huge.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Sallow said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



Zimmerman also said that Trayvon went for his gun when that happen deadly force was warranted.


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## Sallow (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Ah so no fight..

Zimmerman pulls his gun..Trayvon goes for it..and gets killed.

That's what you are going with?

Zimmerman is still a cold blooded murderer.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Sallow said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...


Thats possible but I don't think so according to witness statements.


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## Barb (Mar 29, 2012)

Dante said:


> pay attention to the video
> 
> a little over half way through the video (50 seconds in), a police officer takes a look at the back of Zimmerman's head  .. looking at something on Zimmerman's head. then he asks him to stand back against the wall
> 
> ...



You really are reaching. 

There's no marks on his jacket, no blood, not even Trayvon's (shot to the chest whilst atop Zimmerman, and not a drop?), his head is intact, so's his face. He hopped with no problems out of the back of the patrol car with no help from the police and with his hands cuffed behind his back (like a gazelle). He wasn't even stiff or sore form his "brush with death."

24 hours or so later, he shows up with a broken nose and gashes to his head that required stitches. Yeah, and the broken chain of custody to _that_ "evidence" doesn't raise any red flags at all. 

meanwhile, at about 1:19 in, the one cop circled around Zimmerman's left side, removed something from his back pocket, and placed it into his own. What was that? If there was anything to be removed from Zimmerman, it should have been logged into evidence.


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## Sallow (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > pay attention to the video
> ...



There's never been anything confirming he had a broken nose or a gash..or stitches. In any case..since the police report itself seems to have been tampered with..I don't think there's going to be much credibility in any documents surfacing from Sandford.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> Dante said:
> 
> 
> > pay attention to the video
> ...


and you're reaching. Justice be served but damn the lynch mob wants some attention.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Sallow said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



of course let's all go down to Florida and lynch the bastard.


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## Barb (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Dante said:
> ...



Reaching how? Every statement of mine is an observable fact.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...


What observed fact? Were you there? Your facts are based on your opinion


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## Barb (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...



I'm anti - death penalty. Period.  

All this pissing and moaning about lynching is an effort at misdirection. 

The discussion this case has generated on the law that's being used to defend Zimmerman, on the predisposition law enforcement has in their outlook towards black people (and its's black PEOPLE, people, and white PEOPLE, and Latino PEOPLE, not blacks, whites, messicans, Asians, etc, ad nauseum), and the unequal treatment under the law that black people experiences as suspects AND VICTIMS of crimes because of that predisposition needed to take place anyway. Well, now it is.

 Stop trying to make a victim out of a cold-blooded killer.


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## Barb (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



The fucking police video, in the link in the post I responded to. 

Why don't you practice looking both ways before playing in traffic, huh?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



It's not my fault that you fail to realize you are part of a lynch mob. It's time you owned it.


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## Barb (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



It doesn't matter how many times or by how many a lie is repeated, its still a lie. You own it.


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## Ravi (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Barb said:
> ...


No, you stay away, please. We have more than our fair share of idiots here.


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

Sallow said:


> There was no fight.


And two witnesses who were there say there was a fight.

Hmmmm.  I wonder who one should believe - you or witnesses to the event?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Within a stones' throw of the Traylon Martin rally at the Atlanta University campus yesterday a 3 year old black child was shot in the stomach and killed by a black man.
Where is the rally about this? Where is the public outrage in the black community about a 3 year old black child being killed?
They can not cry racism on that one. I am sure they are very upset about it but since whitey was not involved just another day.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > There was no fight.
> ...



Amazing isn't it the very folk that were persecuted for centuries, kicked to the back of the bus, paid less for the same work, denied equal oppurtunity, prejudged and had societies' biases thrown at them daily are now doing the exact same thing.
Their minds are made up, they make the evidence up as they go and nothing will change their mind.
Martin is black and Zimmerman is white and Martin is dead and Zimmerman shot him.
That is all that matters to them. Evidence? Who cares about stinkin evidence?


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## Old Rocks (Mar 29, 2012)

Was the black man charged? Incarcerated? 

I thought you were better than this, Gadawg. The problem is not that a nutter with a gun killed an innocent kid, the problem is that there was a coverup and no charges for the gunman. 

And given the video at the police station, Zimmerman's story, and any that corroberate it, are obvious lies. Also, we now know that the Sanford Police wanted to charge Zimmerman that night, and were told not to. For what reason? And why no charges brought since then? 

George Zimmerman on Police Surveillance | Video - ABC News


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> Was the black man charged? Incarcerated?
> 
> I thought you were better than this, Gadawg. The problem is not that a nutter with a gun killed an innocent kid, the problem is that there was a coverup and no charges for the gunman.
> 
> ...


Who suggested that the kid was charged?    Who suggested that he was incarcerated?  

What cover-up are you referring to?

Of course there were no charges - there has to be probable cause that a crime was committed in that jurisdiction.  Under Florida law, the DA made that call.  That's what we do in the USA.  We don't press charges THEN try to make the law apply.  We apply law to facts.


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## High_Gravity (Mar 29, 2012)

Sallow said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



I saw some pics of Zimmerman outside the cop car on Huffpost, didn't see any bruises or scratches on him, my god this whole thing is a huge lie and cover up.


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## Ariux (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> Reaching how? Every statement of mine is an observable fact.



The cops observed the fact that Zimmerman was bleeding from the nose and the back of the head.  

But, my belief that liberals have shit for brains isn't an observable fact, unless we crack their heads open.  Or, maybe we can just look through the lenses of their eyes.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Ariux said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Reaching how? Every statement of mine is an observable fact.
> ...



Your up early mofo cracker.  Pretty funny talk coming from someone who talks shit out of his mouth all day.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> Was the black man charged? Incarcerated?
> 
> I thought you were better than this, Gadawg. The problem is not that a nutter with a gun killed an innocent kid, the problem is that there was a coverup and no charges for the gunman.
> 
> ...



On the run and witnesses are scared to come forward Rocks.
Who told police not to charge Zimmerman?
What coverup? There was NO coverup. Where, when and who covered up any evidence.
The incident report was written that day and released as public record.
Please tell me that is a coverup when the report was issued to the public. 
Respectfully, charges do not mean a damn thing Rocks. INDICTMENT is what counts. And the grand jury is meeting.
And read my posts about what I believe is a possibility of what happened:
1. If Zimmerman had his gun pulled when Martin first saw him Martin has ever right to attack Zimmerman. Guns goes off or Zimmerman pulls the trigger we have strong case murder.
2. Zimmerman does not have his gun out and is attacked by Martin, pulls the gun and either shoots him or the gun goes off.
Now how the hell do you or I know what happened? Were either of us there?
I am OPEN TO all SCENARIOS.
You folks are hung up on "he was not charged" which means nothing as many times the crime lab results, as a factor of how back logged they are, may take 3 months to get to the DA to present to the grand jury.
Fact is this case was going to the grand jury from DAY ONE. Read the incident report.
Witnesses interviewd and statements taken THE DAY OF THE SHOOTING.
So how the HELL IS THAT A COVERUP? That is complete BULL SHIT. 
Incident report written and filed the same day.
How is that a cover up. The police file a public report and you claim they covered it up.
Outright fabrication by you and I believe you know it. 
Evidence gathered and some sent to the crime lab. CHAIN OF CUSTODY.
With a chain of custody of the evidence which is public record how is there a cover up?
As hard as you try the fact is the police did NOTHING wrong in this matter. They did their job. If it was as you say someone else told them not to charge him then how is that their fault? 
If this would have been a black shooting another black there is NO way in hell there would be this kind of circus going on all over the country.
Would they be carrying signs stating "Police are racist" if this was a black on black crime?
This had nothing to do with racism although there is a strong possibility that facts will prove that Zimmerman had profiled Martin.
See, I am objective and open to ALL THE EVIDENCE. Try it, makes it easier with an open mind.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence.  Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example.  This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum.  Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

I was the first here to point out the fact that if Zimmerman had his gun OUT then Martin has every right to attack him. Zimmerman had no authority to pull a gun on Martin. This is a possibility.
I have been hard and objective for and against BOTH SIDES in this.
That is what a seasoned investigator does. LOOKS AT ALL SIDES.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence.  Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example.  This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum.  Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.



"media stated"
What else does media say when they want ratings and to inflame a story to grow nationwide?
They lied. 
Respectfully, let me educate as to evidence gathering.
You have 2 people here, a dead boy and a man that admits shooting him.
So tell us Mr. Holmes for what reason would any police investigator want to hold Zimmerman's clothes?
For what? They have the shooter. What would the clothes prove?
Please, I have been doing this for 32 years and am trained professionally as a detective. 
Hint: do not listen to media for legal advice and do not take any wooden nickels.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence.  Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example.  This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum.  Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.
> ...



Not a damn thing. The police got everything they needed.


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## koshergrl (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence. Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example. This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum. Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.


 
The media stated.

You must have missed the link I posted that listed the rumors that are abounding, offset by the truth.

The clothing rumor is just that, a rumor. They did take the clothes. Fail.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

This case is Exhibit A why we need judicial reform in all states. Too many resources are allocated to the drug cases and not enough to the other criminal cases.
I guarantee you that is the hold up on all fronts in this matter. Crime lab and grand jury docket both.
We need drug courts where non violent crimes are handled with probation only and/or treatment and quit sending young folks, mostly black youth, to prison for non violent drug cases with mandatory sentences. 
I am in and out of the prison and jail systems here in Georgia weekly and it troubles me greatly to see the waste of resources and, most importantly, the unfairness and inequities of imprisoning a generation of young blacks for "crimes" that are in reality health problems. 
This fact has more to do with any lax time delay problems in this case and in most all criminal cases.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence. Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example. This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum. Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.
> ...



I would have probably taken them but since this is not a "who done it" then a sample of the clothing would suffice.
Sample of clothing where the blood was, if any.
But when you have the folks involved all identified with witnesses on scene and eye then the forensic evidence such as clothing is not as important except for samples or swabbing.


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## Toro (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Within a stones' throw of the Traylon Martin rally at the Atlanta University campus yesterday a 3 year old black child was shot in the stomach and killed by a black man.
> Where is the rally about this? Where is the public outrage in the black community about a 3 year old black child being killed?
> They can not cry racism on that one. I am sure they are very upset about it but since whitey was not involved just another day.



The black community in Sanford FL is not concerned about white on black violence because it is rare. They are concerned about black on black violence, which is much more common.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence. Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example. This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum. Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.
> ...



Thank you for the information koshergrl.  That will probably be important as this moves forward.


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## Toro (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence.  Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example.  This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum.  Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.
> ...



The Sanford police were at the scene from 8pm to 3am.


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


What is horrible is that witnesses who gave statements to the cops that night have to be in fear now.


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## koshergrl (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence. Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example. This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum. Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.


 
What on earth do you know about his personality? He hasn't made any statements, he's hiding.

And here, educate yourself:

Fact vs. Rumor:

"
Statement: Sanford police failed to collect key evidence in the case: the clothing of George Zimmerman, the gunman who killed Trayvon.
Not true, police said. They took his clothing as well as Trayvon's and packaged it for crime-lab analysis. A spokeswoman for Special Prosecutor Angela Corey would not disclose Tuesday where the clothing is now, but she wrote in an email that the Florida Department of Law Enforcement "is assisting with the processing of physical evidence."

Oh and

"
Statement: The Volusia County Medical Examiner refused to release Trayvon's body to his family for three days, an unusually long wait.
Not true, according to the medical examiner. It picked up the body at the scene just after 10 p.m. Feb. 26 and notified a Fort Lauderdale funeral home 39 hours later that the body was ready. The funeral home, Roy Mizell and Kurtz, did not pick up the body for an additional 24 hours, the medical examiner reported."

Facts are funny things, aren't they...they so often don't fit in with a lynch mob agenda.

Nation & World | Rumors in Trayvon Martin case abound, but here are facts | Seattle Times Newspaper


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Early on the media stated police did not properly document the evidence.  Zimmerman's clothes were not withheld for example.  This is a case of an inept police force at a minimum.  Just looking at Zimmerman's personality, he will kill again.
> ...



Well here's some helpful information for you then.  You need the clothing to help confirm the self defense story or determine it was murder.  Apparently you're not as good a detective as you report.


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


According to a statement by prosecutor spokesperson, they took his clothes.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Well kosher, I know he was carrying a gun when the organization he was part of doesn't allow guns.  I know he had charges of domestic assault at least once.  I know he had a restraining order against him at least once.  He assaulted a police officer at least once.  I know he killed at least one person in his life so far.  He has been characterized as a want-to-be cop.  Enjoy the facts.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



No kidding?  You mean when koshergrl corrected that point a few posts back, I didn't understand?  Try reading the post I was responding to and then comment okay?


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


  Touchy, eh?

But, that does nothing to change the fact that the prosecutor's office says his clothing was taken.


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Well kosher, I know he was carrying a gun when the organization he was part of doesn't allow guns.
> ....


They don't allow guns while on watch.  The cops say he was on his way to the grocery store when he called about Martin.



> ....  I know he had charges of domestic assault at least once.
> 
> ....


And, it looks like both he and the other were charged.



> ....  I know he had a restraining order against him at least once.
> 
> ....


Now, that I didn't know.  Link, please.



> ....  He assaulted a police officer at least once.
> 
> ....


And he was convicted?



> .... I know he killed at least one person in his life so far.  He has been characterized as a want-to-be cop.  Enjoy the facts.


Yes.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Does nothing to change the fact you can't handle the information I presented in the post. 

Sorry to hear about your broken nose.  Hope it is a distant memory and set nice and straight.


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


"Can't handle"?  I don't give a shit whether you think Gadawg is a detective or not, so there is not much to "handle" in that post.



> ... Sorry to hear about your broken nose.  Hope it is a distant memory and set nice and straight.


Thanks.  Yes, it did - can't even tell.  But, it hurt.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> I'm anti - death penalty. Period.
> 
> All this pissing and moaning about lynching is an effort at misdirection.



So those that want to wait for the evidence and go be the facts are engaged in "misdirection?" 

Not like you clear-headed leftists who demand conviction based on emotion and racial prejudice......


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 29, 2012)

Ravi said:


> No, you stay away, please. We have more than our fair share of idiots here.



You alone make more than a state's fair share of idiots, Rati.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Ravi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



I would be the best thing that happen to your state I would offset your stupidity with intelligence.


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## Barb (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Within a stones' throw of the Traylon Martin rally at the Atlanta University campus yesterday a 3 year old black child was shot in the stomach and killed by a black man.
> Where is the rally about this? Where is the public outrage in the black community about a 3 year old black child being killed?
> They can not cry racism on that one. I am sure they are very upset about it but since whitey was not involved just another day.



How do you know there isn't outrage? The media shows what is sensational, not what is commonplace. Man bites dog is a headline, dog bites man...not so much.

Additionally, there is a response in poor communities (not black anymore, as these are the one commons that HAS been fully integrated). There are candle lit vigils, marches against community violence, community funded (for generations, mind you) recreation, arts, boys and girls centers, churches, et cetera. 

What there isn't, is timely police response to the calls of VICTIMS, community resources in re police, fire, mass transit, hospitals, groceries, better roads, housing construction, schools, supplies, teachers,and ALL the infrastructure wealthier communities TAKE FOR GRANTED as their DUE. 

You live one day, with any form of grace, in a poverty ridden neighborhood and get back to us poor slobs on how we should react to the abject want all around us, the blatant disregard of those who consider themselves our betters (when they're no better than reptiles themselves), and the result of public policy that not one of us had a voice in crafting, and that not one ounce of research was conducted in the formation of with our neighborhoods in mind. 

In short, fuck you. Fuck you running.


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Sort of hurts just thinking about it happening to YOUR nose.  It is a good point that not all broken noses mean a blood bath.  Its even possible that there was no blood spatter from the gun shot.  All in all, the story looks and sounds like a homicide to me, so for now that's what I'm going with.  Hopefully I'm wrong and the community can start to heal and no one else suffers.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Barb said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Within a stones' throw of the Traylon Martin rally at the Atlanta University campus yesterday a 3 year old black child was shot in the stomach and killed by a black man.
> ...



You sure have a lot of free time, you poor slob you.
There is no "public policy" that makes you post here instead of working.
YOU make your neighborhoods, the public policy doesn't.
But that would be a good thing to march for, a better neighborhood.
Why don't you advocate a community that helps each other, rebuilds the community and neighborhood and stands for justice for one and all.
Instead of the few that you may believe it is politically correct to stand for.
On any given day whenever the wind is blowing your direction only.
So go and march and demonstrate for a better neighborhood and community where you live and see how many folk you get behind you versus those that have the time to march for this poor kid and his family that have been led by those that have THEIR best interests in mind and foremost and DO NOT live in their neighborhoods.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

What this will end up as and I believe it to be correct and valid is:
Zimmerman has NO authority to pursue Martin even though Zimmerman was breaking NO law doing so.
Martin WAS NOT doing anything illegal that day. 
A lot of gray area in between. I believe Zimmerman was a pain in the ass as he was known for making nusance calls to 911 all the time.
Having read the Florida statute 20 times I NOW have this take on it also: Martin ALSO HAS THE BENEFIT of this statute. Zimmerman pursues Martin and Martin STANDS HIS GROUND. He confronts his pursuer. He can LEGALLY do that under this statute sports fans is my take. Now how far can he do that is subject to interpretation and what the witnesses say.
The pursuit resulted in the death. Could have been in self defense BUT I see it as at most 2nd degree murder and most likely VOLUNTARY manslaughter.
Depends on the witnesses as to how far Martin went on top of Zimmerman.
If Zimmerman does not pursue this kid that was not doing anything criminal the kid is walking today. 
This is not a planned killing, this is most likely involuntary or voluntary manslaughter, if that. I believe the pursuit most likely, as this is my opinion based on the fact this kid HAD NO CRIMINAL intent that day because IF HE DID  we damn sure would have heard about it by now from the police, makes this a voluntary manslaughter case as voluntary manslaughter statute states "from a provacation of some kind" and I believe Martin was the one FIRST provoked..
Folks, a manslaughter conviction in Florida can carry 30 years under certain circumstance but the max is 15 years otherwise. I see this as voluntary manslaughter as Zimmerman PURSUED Martin, not illegal as there is no law against it BUT that pursuit caused the gun to be used and this kid is dead.
15 to do 5 minimum with the opening offer more like 15 to do 10.
As usual, I am the one in the middle and open to any and all facts and I call them as I see them.
For those that do not like it or can not take it, the hell with ya.


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## MarcATL (Mar 29, 2012)

I hope he gets at least the max 30 years based on that analysis.


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## koshergrl (Mar 29, 2012)

What makes you think we would have heard about criminal intent by now? What do you base that on?

The police are sitting tight and doing their investigation. I see no reason why they would tip their hand at this point...and I'm fairly certain they are very nervous about making any statements except the most vague until they know exactly where they're going with this, and can thoroughly defend their position.

Also there's nothing to prove anyone was pursuing anyone at the time of the altercation.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> What this will end up as and I believe it to be correct and valid is:
> Zimmerman has NO authority to pursue Martin even though Zimmerman was breaking NO law doing so.
> Martin WAS NOT doing anything illegal that day.
> A lot of gray area in between. I believe Zimmerman was a pain in the ass as he was known for making nusance calls to 911 all the time.
> ...



There's one thing that has been pointed numerous times. The dispatcher told Zimmerman that he did not need to follow Trayvon. Zimmerman said "OK" and headed back to his SUV to wait for the police. Now why would Zimmerman shoot somebody when he knew the police were in route unless Trayvon assaulted Zimmerman? What I just posted was submitted in the investigation.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> I hope he gets at least the max 30 years based on that analysis.



Based solely on emotion.


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## koshergrl (Mar 29, 2012)

And racism.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> I hope he gets at least the max 30 years based on that analysis.



Marc, what you or I "hope" is never the law and thank God for it.
When I was growing up the majority down here "hoped" blacks would stay in their place.
Thankfully I was raised to fight that and know that what others hoped for was not always right.
The 30 years is ONLY for habitual offenders with previous felony convictions of more than 3 times so that is out. Now there is a provision in Georgia law Marc and I believe it is also applicable under the Florida sentencing statute for manslaughter that if a child or an elderly person was killed where there were NO other circumstances such as a confrontation then this case is bumped up as a 1st degree felony with that maximum of 30 years.
But I oppose these mandatory sentencing guidelines anyway. They have sent more of your folk unfairly to prison on mandatory 10 years in the Federal system with NO parole or probation.
30 years for unpremedidated murder Marc. Since when have you been a hard core conservative right wing kook?


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > What this will end up as and I believe it to be correct and valid is:
> ...



First we heard from media and all the circus promoters: "He was ORDERED not to pursue"
Then we hear another made up version "Well, they meant to tell him not to do it"
At least you got it right.
You do not have to means you do not have to which means they were telling him he does not have to possibly put himself in danger.
And 911 operators have no authority to tell someone what they can do or can not do if what they are doing is legal.
But I agree that possibly Zimmerman was walking back to his vehicle but we DO NOT know if that was after the preliminary confrontation. 
Witnesses folks, witnesses. This case boils down to the witnesses and what happened after the first confrontation.
But he can not get away from HE pursued this kid and the kid HAD NO criminal intent that day. I believe that to be fact.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> What makes you think we would have heard about criminal intent by now? What do you base that on?
> 
> The police are sitting tight and doing their investigation. I see no reason why they would tip their hand at this point...and I'm fairly certain they are very nervous about making any statements except the most vague until they know exactly where they're going with this, and can thoroughly defend their position.
> 
> Also there's nothing to prove anyone was pursuing anyone at the time of the altercation.



Zimmerman admits he was pursuing Martin in the call but I do see your point that at the time of the altercation before the shooting we do not know.
But under Florida law and their criminal code is as hard core conservative as it gets manslaughter can be a "homocide committed while in the midst of a provacation"
Not very specific there and gives a lot of room for a prosecutor. 
And the fact that he was pursuing him earlier and the kid was apparently not doing anything criminal can be used as evidence to show the provacation later.
All under the Florida statute.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Yes the witness that what it boils down too. And what have the witnesses thus far stated?
I will add that we do know according to the 911 tapes Zimmerman was waiting on the police to arrive. Now why would he shoot Trayvon without due cause?


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 29, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> And racism.



Exactly.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



I believe Zimmerman is asking himself that question as we post.
"Why didn't I just let that kid go?"
I see this as a manslaughter case 100%. He was not breaking the law during the pursuit but the net result of it caused the death.
And when the crime lab is done with their work there will be an indictment.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 29, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> I hope he gets at least the max 30 years based on that analysis.



You're a pig.

I hope Trayvon's parents find some peace and joy in the rest of their lives, despite this tragedy.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

If Zimmerman is not willing to cop a plea and that is his right he goes to trial.
If he is acquitted at trial how many folks will burn their own neighborhoods down protesting that verdict?


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## saveliberty (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



No idea why someone murders another.  To think there is a valid reason is probably not realistic.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > I hope he gets at least the max 30 years based on that analysis.
> ...



I bet his parents do not want that much time.
I believe them to be reasonable people.
There is a victims rights statute in Florida and they will be asked their opinion.
I favor those laws in most instances.


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## CrusaderFrank (Mar 29, 2012)

I don't think many of you know what "turgid" means


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## Old Rocks (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > What this will end up as and I believe it to be correct and valid is:
> ...



That is Zimmerman's story. We will never know the kids side of the story.


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## Firehorse (Mar 29, 2012)

The 'pursuit' in my mind is not the point. The witness states that Zimmerman was on the ground being beaten. Both parties parents attest that the voice yelling for help on the 911 tape is Zimmerman 

Clearly Zimmerman was being attacked and was looking for help from anyone. He had a gun and did not shot when he confronted him. There was a scuffle, some rolling around on the ground ... And a gun shot happened even as he was yelling for help (meaning the scuffle was still going on) ... This is self defense

On the 911 tape you hear the yells for help as the gun goes off ... There was no 'help' ... Wait 5 seconds ... Then a gunshot ... which could indicate Zimmerman getting the upper hand and firing on a defenseless teen .... As it stands based on the 911 the fight was happening, Zimmerman was loosing, he felt his life in danger, he shoots


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## Firehorse (Mar 29, 2012)

Moral of the story:

Don't get in a fight with someone that may be armed. If you do, you take your chances.

It may sound cold, but it's real world stuff. I personally don't start fights in biker bars ... It's not that I couldn't win, it's that I don't carry a gun and I know that in a biker bar, winning a fight just means getting shot or stabbed.

It's a bad way to learn that lesson. A dead teenager is never good. But if he would have walked away after putting Zimmerman on the ground, he would likely still be walking around today


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



We have eye witnesses.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Firehorse said:


> Moral of the story:
> 
> Don't get in a fight with someone that may be armed. If you do, you take your chances.
> 
> ...



Don't carry a gun and pursue those that are not breaking the law playing wannabe cop.
You may accidentally kill someone that did not deserve to die.
I believe this is what happened.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Notice the part where I also said "OK" that was when Zimmerman acknowledged that he would stop. Why would he continue to look for the guy when he was going to a location to meet with cops that were in route?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Why didn't he let him go? why did Trayvon go after Zimmerman?
Man slaughter does not fit when it's self defense


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Firehorse said:


> The 'pursuit' in my mind is not the point. The witness states that Zimmerman was on the ground being beaten. Both parties parents attest that the voice yelling for help on the 911 tape is Zimmerman
> 
> Clearly Zimmerman was being attacked and was looking for help from anyone. He had a gun and did not shot when he confronted him. There was a scuffle, some rolling around on the ground ... And a gun shot happened even as he was yelling for help (meaning the scuffle was still going on) ... This is self defense
> 
> On the 911 tape you hear the yells for help as the gun goes off ... There was no 'help' ... Wait 5 seconds ... Then a gunshot ... which could indicate Zimmerman getting the upper hand and firing on a defenseless teen .... As it stands based on the 911 the fight was happening, Zimmerman was loosing, he felt his life in danger, he shoots



Well under the law it is a problem.
Zimmerman provoked the entire scenario with the first pursuit. He had no valid reason to do it. Not illegal but it is cause of the provacation, probably I think but the witnesses will tell us. Looks like it.
But that does not make this murder. However, that pursuit gives Martin every reason to stand his ground.
And if the kid was not breaking the law here we have a fight with one guy armed that should not have been pursuing the kid to begin with.
Not murder at all but manslaughter it is. Maybe involuntary but I believe there is acase for voluntary, maybe.
But this is not murder as Zimmerman could have killed the kid during the pursuit.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Self defense is not murder and thats what the evidence that has been release shows.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Firehorse said:
> 
> 
> > The 'pursuit' in my mind is not the point. The witness states that Zimmerman was on the ground being beaten. Both parties parents attest that the voice yelling for help on the 911 tape is Zimmerman
> ...



Zimmerman as far as we know and what the facts show stopped following Trayvon.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Firehorse said:
> 
> 
> > Moral of the story:
> ...



If I lived in an area such as a sub division with limited entry points and that area had a some break ins I would ask someone whom I have never seen before who they were and where they were going. But thats just me.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Firehorse said:
> ...



Prpbably but they may have had an altercation before that also.
We do not know.
But who had the gun and who didn't?
Depends on the witnesses.
I am open to all evidence.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> Was the black man charged? Incarcerated?
> 
> I thought you were better than this, Gadawg. The problem is not that a nutter with a gun killed an innocent kid, the problem is that there was a coverup and no charges for the gunman.
> 
> ...



I thought you were better also and could and see through chicken shit that is presented as chicken salad.
You give the race pimps a FREE PASS. 
They come out of the wood work in masses to exploit this tragedy where Traylon Martin is dead, rushing out of their dens to exploit it and then all of a sudden they find out Zimmerman is Hispanic. But wait, the race pimps all of a sudden see their exploitation value of this incident is reduced SIGNIFICANTLY if the killer can not be shown to be WHITE.
Zimmerman's friends and family say he IS HISPANIC and he LOOKS HISPANIC so what do the race pimps do? They LABEL HIM as WHITE Hispanic. 
Gotta get that "white" thing in there somehow, someway, anyplace, someplace, anywhere or the entire cause is LOST to the race whores.
And that flies 20 feet over your head as you completely ignore that from the start.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Fine they had an altercation in that scenario since Zimmerman was going to his vehicle would make Trayvon the aggressor  



> But who had the gun and who didn't?


That's not against the law and Zimmerman was lawfully carring


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Let me to appeal to your reason and common sense reb:
Under Florida statute and I would bet $$$ in NC also, in most all conservative states that have statutes that favor the prosecution heavily there is a provacation part in it on their manslaughter statutes. It is the law.
The pursuit to begin with of Martin who was NOT doing any criminal acts will be used by the prosecution under that statute to show that Martin, a law abiding citizen that had done NOTHING wrong was provoked simply by being followed for no good reason.
Now under that statute if NOTHING happens, then nothing was illegal.
But something happened and that procacation part of the manslaughter covers ALL the time each had some form of contact with each other. Fact is Martin was profiled by Zimmerman. Zimmerman never follows him and nothing happens, Martin goes home.
You can not have Zimmerman ASSUMING a crime has gone down for him to be armed and pursue someone if that scenario leads to a dead man. 
That is the law. Of course we will see what the witnesses say. IF Martin had a chance to just leave also after Zimmerman stopped pursuing him without any 1st altercation then a self defense stance will be his defense.
But the first pursuit is in evidence and will be used against him no matter what.
The NRA pushed this bill and watch it blow up in their face.


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## koshergrl (Mar 29, 2012)

Martin was observed to be behaving strangely in a gated neighborhood that has had a string of robberies. He came towards Zimmerman first, then ran when Zimmerman moved to meet him. Zimmerman ran initially, then stopped pursuit when the 911 operator told him to (and he probably thought "what the HELL am I doing?")

That isn't profiling. He didn't notice the kid because he was black. He noticed him because he was behaving strangely, and that's what he said in his call to 911...the kid acted like he was on drugs.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 29, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Martin was observed to be behaving strangely in a gated neighborhood that has had a string of robberies. He came towards Zimmerman first, then ran when Zimmerman moved to meet him. Zimmerman ran initially, then stopped pursuit when the 911 operator told him to (and he probably thought "what the HELL am I doing?")
> 
> That isn't profiling. He didn't notice the kid because he was black. He noticed him because he was behaving strangely, and that's what he said in his call to 911...the kid acted like he was on drugs.



What did he do that was "behaving strangely" and who observed it OTHER than Zimmerman?
Keep in mind that Zimmerman made over 90 nuisance calls to 911 about "behaving strangely" incidents that turned out to be nothing.
You have to have more than "behaving strangely" to play copper.
What was he specifically doing that was strange?
Where is there any evidence "the kid acted like he was on drugs"?
What exatly was he doing?


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## percysunshine (Mar 29, 2012)

MarcATL; * I Don't Think Many Of You Know What "Confronted" Means *

If you are going to confront USMB people with an accusation like that...ummmm...better be doing your home work....chuckle


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## Ravi (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Martin was observed to be behaving strangely in a gated neighborhood that has had a string of robberies. He came towards Zimmerman first, then ran when Zimmerman moved to meet him. Zimmerman ran initially, then stopped pursuit when the 911 operator told him to (and he probably thought "what the HELL am I doing?")
> ...



Walking while black.


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## percysunshine (Mar 29, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Maybe it was just sauntering.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



1. Zimmerman calls 911 says he lives in a community that has some recent break ins
2. He says he saw a suspicious guy maybe a black male walking around looking at homes.
2. while talking with the dispatcher he says the guy is acting strange, and starting looking his way. and started walking his way.
5. Zimmerman at this time leaves his vehicle
6. Trayvon runs away.
7. Dispatchers ask if Zimmerman is following the black male, Zimmerman says yes they say you don't have to do that He acknowledge's that with OK.
8. Zimmerman talks about meeting with the police at a certain location
9. It is at this time in my opinion while Zimmerman is heading back to his vehicle Trayvon walks up to Zimmerman and ask Zimmerman if he had a problem.
10. Zimmerman says no and at that time in my opinion Trayvon becomes the aggressor.
11. In the struggle Zimmerman said that Trayvon went for Zimmerman's gun.
Now why would Zimmerman shoot Trayvon if he knew the police were in route unless Trayvon did attack Zimmerman?

I could speculate and give you some opinions why Trayvon went to hit Zimmerman and tried to take his gun, But no doubt it would be my opinion.


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## Vidi (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Unfortunately for Zimmerman, once he left the car, he loses the protection of the Stand Your Ground Act. He absolutely should have been arrested because of that.

I spoke to my cousin yesterday about this case. He is an officer here in a small town in MN. He said it doesnt matter if it was self defense or not, you arrest the guy and hand the case over to the DA. Its up to them to decide if charges are to be filed. He specifically said," Its the officers job to colelct evidence. Not to decide guilt."

Like I said before, I think the officers did a disservice to both Martin and Zimmerman in this case. had they followed procedure and done their jobs, if Trayvon was the agressor, Zimmerman might have seen an involuntary manslaughter charge and even walked from that once he faced a jury. 

Now because they didnt do their damned jobs, Zimmerman, no matter what the truth is, will be a social pariah for the rest of his life.

basically, Im saying that IF Zimmermans story is true, the cops fucked him.


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## Si modo (Mar 29, 2012)

Vidi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Here's the statute.  Please show me where the law says what you claim:

776.013&#8195;Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.

(1)&#8195;A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

    (a)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that persons will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and
    (b)&#8195;The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.

(2)&#8195;The presumption set forth in subsection (1) does not apply if:

    (a)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force is used has the right to be in or is a lawful resident of the dwelling, residence, or vehicle, such as an owner, lessee, or titleholder, and there is not an injunction for protection from domestic violence or a written pretrial supervision order of no contact against that person; or
    (b)&#8195;The person or persons sought to be removed is a child or grandchild, or is otherwise in the lawful custody or under the lawful guardianship of, the person against whom the defensive force is used; or
    (c)&#8195;The person who uses defensive force is engaged in an unlawful activity or is using the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle to further an unlawful activity; or
    (d)&#8195;The person against whom the defensive force is used is a law enforcement officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who enters or attempts to enter a dwelling, residence, or vehicle in the performance of his or her official duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with any applicable law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that the person entering or attempting to enter was a law enforcement officer.

(3)&#8195;A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

(4)&#8195;A person who unlawfully and by force enters or attempts to enter a persons dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle is presumed to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence.

(5)&#8195;As used in this section, the term:

    (a)&#8195;Dwelling means a building or conveyance of any kind, including any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is designed to be occupied by people lodging therein at night.
    (b)&#8195;Residence means a dwelling in which a person resides either temporarily or permanently or is visiting as an invited guest.
    (c)&#8195;Vehicle means a conveyance of any kind, whether or not motorized, which is designed to transport people or property.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Vidi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Here is part of Florida's Stand your ground law

(3)&#8195;A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Yes Zimmerman had the right of self defense even though he left his vehicle.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 29, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Vidi said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Damn you with the truth about the law.


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## IndependntLogic (Mar 29, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> IndependntLogic said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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I thought you had me on ignore? LOL!! 
Um yeah. The shoes on my feet remark? LOL! Yeah, you own a successful business...


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## Barb (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Barb said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



And you continue to have enough time on you own to assume you know an awful lot about people you clearly have no contact with. 
First it was what is and is not protested and worked towards in poor communities.
Now it's what kind of time I have on my hands, and what I do or don't do with it.

I work full time nights, with some lag time between when my reports come in, take care of a full time family, and until very recently handled a full time college course load. I also belong and volunteer at a local chapter of a national fraternal organization that works to help the community we're based in, and the children that the national order supports, by cooking, cleaning, and soon by taking over some bookeeping duties. 

People don't "march" for better neighborhoods; that is the stuff of community involvement and policy. There isn't a whole lot of time for poor people to become involved when they're so busy working to keep the roof over their heads, food on their tables, and the heat on, but surprisingly, and as I noted in my original response to you, many make the time to do so in varied ways. I planned my degrees to be better able / situated to help give people who live in poor communities a greater voice in the policies that shape their surroundings. 

So now that we've dispatched any notion that you have a clue what your talking about regarding the concerns, desires, and activism of people in poor communities, as well as what a poor slob like me does in my own free time, maybe the discussion can get back to the dead seventeen year old boy.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

IndependntLogic said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > IndependntLogic said:
> ...



I took you off  if you missed that part.


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Vidi said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



That law would get Martin off if he'd have killed Zimmerman, or it should have done so. But I don't see it backing up Zimmerman.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Vidi said:
> ...



You would have to prove that martin had a right to be there
And that Martin felt threaten
and that Zimmerman had his weapon drawn.

It does fit for Zimmerman according to witness statements.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Vidi said:
> ...


Yes, it would get either one of them off.

What's missing, in your opinion, for it to apply to Zimmerman?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Where it stop applying to martin was when he ran from Zimmerman and then came back making Martin the aggressor


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


I'm not convinced (reports from press) that Martin did that.

Once the scuffle started, both are aggressors, so both are attacking.  I don't see the legal protection being exempt from either.


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


The fact that he was following Martin and Martin had done nothing wrong.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


I understand that, I do.

But, where in the law does following, or even initiating it, exempt someone from being legally protected in a killing?

That's what I'm wondering.  (The law totally sucks.)


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



sigh.....it doesn't say that but one does have to be in fear. You just don't get out of your truck and follow someone that you fear when that someone has done nothing wrong.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


True, I believe one can safely assume that Zimmerman had little fear of Martin when Zimmerman exited his vehicle.

However, when he later became face to face it is more than possible that Zimmerman became fearful of Martin.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Go to that other thread and listen to the video I posted you can hear what happen very clearly one of the better versions. Or do you want me to post it here.


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Yes, and that was part of his own following of Martin, if true. Martin seemingly had every right to fear an unknown man that was following him.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
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Martin ran in fear, however he came back when he should have kept going.


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


You have no proof of that. He could have run in fear, thought he'd gotten away from the guy, and then started walking back to his father's finace's home. From what I understand, he would have had to walk in the direction he did to get to her house.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

Where are the "CIVIL RIGHTS" folk condemning the massive amounts of death threats Zimmerman and his family are receiving?
Where has anyone come forward and stated that needs to stop and that is wrong?


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


 
I have a different take..I think he sounds spooked. He says "shit I don't know where this kid is". And he sounds alarmed when he says there's something wrong with him.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



The proof is in the video I posted you can hear Zimmerman  say he's running you can hear the ding ding of a key in the ignition as Zimmerman opens the door. You can hear Zimmerman heavy breathing and  foot steps has he's running and  and you can hear that his heavy breathing has stopped when he's asked if he's following Martin and they tell him he doesn't have to do that. That's should be proof enough to show Martin ran and the fact that Martin came back that lead to his death should tell you Martin then became the aggressor.


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## CrusaderFrank (Mar 30, 2012)

I Don't Think Many Of You Know What "Antidisestablishmentarianism" Means


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

Throw all these threads into the Conspiracy Theory section.


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## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

*Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim. 

Interesting.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> *Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim.
> 
> Interesting.



He must have come back since he ran.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> *Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim.
> 
> Interesting.


Oh, please, spare us.  You are the queen of hysterical predetermined views.



But, no one ever accused you of not being a hypocrite.


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## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > *Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim.
> ...





Si modo said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > *Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim.
> ...



Your Honor: 

I present to you Exhibit A...

Evidence that both of these hard RW radicals are admitting that they don't know that the murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, came back, as they are claiming as fact time and time again.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
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Your Honor I present exhibit B NO COMMON SENSE all emotional knee jerk reaction.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Your Honor:

This fool thinks I said something.  There is no evidence I did.  In fact, there is evidence that I doubt that is true.

Please save society from hysterical and hypocritical idiots who lie.  No need for mercy.

TIA


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 30, 2012)

CrusaderFrank said:


> I Don't Think Many Of You Know What "Antidisestablishmentarianism" Means



Perhaps, but I do know it's the longest word in the English language....


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

The law is bad because:

1.  A family lost their child and would like to see due process.  It may not happen, because a law is ambiguous.

2.  A man cannot live his life as he chooses because about half the country "thinks" he killed someone.  He deserves an opportunity to clear his name.

3.  Promoting the idea you can pursue someone because you think they could or may have committed a crime and kill them denies the suspect due process.

Framing this as left versus right only demonstrates the polarity of politics.

I grew up in a nearly all white community.  I was never stopped by the police and questioned.  Neighbors never chased after me.  This appears to be more of an experience shared by the poor or minority population.  Listening to them only seems appropriate in this situation.


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

You're an idiot.

I really don't know how else to put it. Essentially you are saying anyone who is ever accused of a crime should be brought to trial and forced to prove their innocence, regardless of whether or not there is any evidence.

I really doubt Zimmerman "wants" to be charged with murder.

And you don't know what the fuck *due process* means. 

Cripes.


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> The law is bad because:
> 
> 1.  A family lost their child and would like to see due process.  It may not happen, because a law is ambiguous.
> 
> ...


Great post, especially the part I bolded.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> The law is bad because:
> 
> 1.  A family lost their child and would like to see due process.  It may not happen, because a law is ambiguous.
> 
> ...


How the fuck is not taking a suspect, who is automatically presumed innocent, to trial a denial of his due process?


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

Please one of you geniuses...tell us what *due process* is.


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > The law is bad because:
> ...


I think you misinterpreted what he says. You two basically agree, why not stop getting so damn anal about everything, both of you.


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

"The constitutional guarantee of due process of law, found in the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the U.S. Constitution, prohibits all levels of *government* from arbitrarily or unfairly depriving individuals of their basic constitutional rights to life, liberty, and property."

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Due+Process+of+Law

Morons.

If you were to do what saveidiot has repeatedly called for, and just arrest Zimmerman based on the fact that he's been accused, with no evidence, and require anyone who is involved in a death where a gun is involved to *prove* their innocence based on a presumption of guilt, then you are denying them DUE PROCESS.

Trayvon wasn't denied *DUE PROCESS* because the government is not who deprived him of liberty or life.

He was perhaps MURDERED but that isn't the same thing, nitwit.

DUE PROCESS, like the separation of church and state, is meant to protect US from the GOVERNMENT depriving us of our right to life and liberty, and basic human rights (like the right to our property).

But naturally leftwing windbags are going to run with the notion that it means the exact opposite...saveliberty's continued squawk is that due process means we presume guilt in murder cases, and those accused must prove their innocence.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


  Maybe.  But, I'm not getting his claim there - denying the suspect due process.

The law IS anal and tedious (probably the exact reason I stopped my legal education before the first semester was finished and went back to science.)


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## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



The suspect in this case is the person that gets shot because someone decided he deserved to be shot because he or she was committing or about to commit a crime. In other words, the vigilante's suspect.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


Oh!  Thanks.  That makes some sense.

On the other hand, why should the law be used to prosecute someone  - waste his time, the court's, the prosecutor's, the witness', etc. and money - when it doesn't look like a conviction is even possible under that jurisdiction and with the evidence?

For example, I'm driving my car, hit a pedestrian, and kill him.  There are witnesses who make statements to the cops that I was not speeding or breaking any other driving laws.  There is no evidence that I was doing anything illegal at the time.  But, the parents are pretty outraged and so are their hundred thousand friends.  And, it is very sad that the guy is dead.  And, by the way, I don't have the greatest driving record, but I can still legally drive.  But the family and friends are convinced that I was doing something wrong.

Should I be tried for vehicular manslaughter just so the dead guy's friends and relatives get some satisfaction?


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

Absolutely! We must assume you are guilty of murder based upon the outrage of the family members and complete strangers who don't know the whole story!

Because we all know the witnesses must be lying....

After all, you denied the pedestrian his *due process*.

Whatever that means.


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## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> You're an idiot.
> 
> I really don't know how else to put it. Essentially you are saying anyone who is ever accused of a crime should be brought to trial and forced to prove their innocence, regardless of whether or not there is any evidence.
> 
> ...


Keep on letting your light shine Christian.


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

Peter was a brawler too.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Absolutely! We must assume you are guilty of murder based upon the outrage of the family members and complete strangers who don't know the whole story!
> 
> Because we all know the witnesses must be lying....
> 
> ...


Right.  I must be missing something.  So must the DA.


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > The law is bad because:
> ...



Martin was the suspect dumbass.


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## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Peter didn't STAY a "brawler" though.

In fact Christ admonished him to change those "brawler" ways.

There's a passage of text that goes something like this..."go and sin no more.."

But keep on promoting "brawler" ways...yuh heah!?


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


Thanks, asshole.


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Please one of you geniuses...tell us what *due process* is.



Its what Martin DIDN'T get.


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Your welcome.


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## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


What about it?  

(trying to be light here, let's see what you do with that)


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> You're an idiot.
> 
> I really don't know how else to put it. Essentially you are saying anyone who is ever accused of a crime should be brought to trial and forced to prove their innocence, regardless of whether or not there is any evidence.
> 
> ...



If placing myself in the shoes of someone I don't normally walk with makes me an idiot, so be it.  Far better than championing a blind position in my opinion, but then, I'm just an idiot.


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

No, you're an idiot for claiming that *due process* means denying *due process*.


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## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



We tend to agree much than disagree Si.  I think we agree that the investigation needs to run its course and what comes out of that should be the basis of what happens next.  Seems like you see some issues with the Florida law as it stands now.

The rest of it seems to be me emphasizing the death of a young man and you the right of a person to defend himself.  Is that about right?

I think both Martin and Zimmerman had a right to due process.


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Peter didn't STAY a "brawler" though.
> 
> In fact Christ admonished him to change those "brawler" ways.
> 
> ...



Marc, why does media release a 9th grade photo of Martin when they had a recent one that shows he looks like a 17 year old young man instead of the very young looking 9th grade photo?
Why do Sharpton and his team go with the made up term of "white" Hispanic?
Could it be to inflame the white versus black angle?
What good does that do Marc? 
Where has anyone stated that it is wrong to make death threats against the Zimmerman family?


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## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

I stated it, and some left wing loon, rather than decrying it, pointed out that there were only 139 subscriptions to the "kill zimmerman" page or something like that.


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## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Peter didn't STAY a "brawler" though.
> ...


Hispanics can't be white?
It's not a made up term. This is not the first time we've heard this term before.
The only thing that Al Sharpton and others, including myself, are bringing attention to is the seemingly corrupt, biased and racist leanings of the authorities in Sanford, FL.
Zimmerman is almost of no relevance...almost.


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## Uncensored2008 (Mar 30, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Its what Martin DIDN'T get.



So, "due process" is not worrying about evidence and facts, and just locking up the white guy?

Back in my day, we had a different name for that: "lynching."


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## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> *Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim.
> 
> Interesting.



You are the most hardened right wing radical posting here Marc.
You have convicted a man without trial and want the support of right wing radical laws to imprison him for 30 years without trial.
You love right wing radical laws when they support your agenda yet condemn them when they don't.
Your team plays both sides of the street.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



You have not proven there is any evidence that the authorities are corrupt, biased or racist in Sanford Florida. 
"seemingly" is a pitiful stance when you are accusing someone of corruption.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Will you hardcore, radical RWers please stop using the term "lynching?"

Clearly you haven't a CLUE as to what lynching means. 

Locking up does not equate to lynching.

This is lynching...
































THAT is lynching! Ghedditt!?!?

Not one hair on the killer George Zimmerman's coifed  head has been harm, not one hair.

Trayvon Martin Case: Exclusive Surveillance Video of George Zimmerman - ABC News

You people are so disgusting!!!

*spits*


----------



## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

That's exactly what it is, which is why you should stop advocating vigilantism.

Those guys were lynched by left wing mobs who didn't want to wait for the law to determine guilt.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

It's a desired lynching. It's not specific to race, jackass.

Lynch:

(of a mob) Kill (someone), esp. by hanging, for an alleged offense with or without a legal trial.





Get a grip.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > *Note:* The hard RW radicals are all spewing the claim that "Martin came back" when there's absolutely NO proof of that. That is strictly based on their speculation and their predetermined view of who murdered victim, Trayvon Martin, is/was. Exactly like they did with the "Zimmerman got beat up" bogus claim.
> ...


Please present one, single post where I've stated that I've convicted him.

Yes, I want him arrested. That's the LEAST in this matter, as has been set by precedent previously...
Cops routinely make arrests in 'stand your ground' cases
Clearly George Zimmerman is getting some special treatment, most likely due to the relationship his father has with the law, being a retired Magistrate and all. He's now virtually untouchable.
It's not uncommon, nor unlawful to have been arrested and detained, pending bail, or trial in a matter such as this, as cited above.
You're speaking out of your neck now...and you know it.
Cut it out!
*wagging finger sternly*


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...



Don't you think that Sharpton is "seemingly" corrupt Marc?
There is PLENTY of evidence of that but you will always ignore that because he looks like you. 
Seemingly.


----------



## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

It's not clear he's getting special treatment.

It's clear the prosecutor doesn't want to screw up her case by denying him due process, which is WHAT SHE SAID AT THE BEGINNING WHEN SHE TOLD THE COPS NOT TO ARREST HIM. She said that law made it extremely difficult to justify an arrest of somebody who claims self defense without clear cut evidence that a crime was committed.

Idiot.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Will you hardcore, radical RWers please stop using the term "lynching?"
> 
> Clearly you haven't a CLUE as to what lynching means.
> 
> ...


If anyone was lynched it appears more likely that it was Trayvon Martin.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> That's exactly what it is, which is why you should stop advocating vigilantism.
> 
> Those guys were lynched by left wing mobs who didn't want to wait for the law to determine guilt.


It's not about race you big dope. Where did I state it was?

Lynching is a specific ACT that involves death of the victim.

The killer George Zimmerman has had not so much as a single hair on his coifed hair harmed.

But yet and still you and your fellow radical RWers are squawking, squealing and yelping on and on about some made up "lynching."

What you are doing is diminishing the value of the word, rendering it useless.

A travesty and a great offense.

Cut it out!

*wagging finger more sternly*


----------



## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


You really should read your link.


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> That's exactly what it is, which is why you should stop advocating vigilantism.
> 
> Those guys were lynched by left wing mobs who didn't want to wait for the law to determine guilt.



Gee, you're right.  There's a guy in one of those pics with an ACLU Tshirt on.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Will you hardcore, radical RWers please stop using the term "lynching?"
> ...


Really?

What mob was after him?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Ravi said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Will you hardcore, radical RWers please stop using the term "lynching?"
> ...


EXACTLY!!!

I bet those proud white Good Ole Boys n Gals in those pics felt that they were the victims too.

Dollars to donuts they did.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Really?

What mob was after Martin?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Heck no I don't think Sharpton is corrupt.

Why are you besmirching and damaging a man's name?

What evidence to you have to support that BOGUS claim?

You really are showing your colors now.

My goodness!!

*SMH*


----------



## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > That's exactly what it is, which is why you should stop advocating vigilantism.
> ...


 
Lynch mobs typically take accused criminals out of the custody of the state to sentence them and carry out their sentence before the state has an opportunity to either carry out the sentence, or determine their guilt.

Which is exactly what the people who are claiming that there's "proof" pointing to Zimmerman's guilt are doing.

I know exactly what it is, and it always starts with groups of people who claim to be acting for the good of some victim somewhere.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Somehow, whenever I read your posts, I'm reminded of a hysterical woman at the scene of a disaster who is standing on the sidelines doing nothing but screaming hysterically, while everyone else is working to fix things and trying to ignore her screeches.

I suppose every disaster needs one, though.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

Sharpton pays himself hundreds of thousands of dollars and what does he do?
He withholds payroll deductions for state and federal taxes for all of his employees and what does he do with that $$$.
He pockets it and does not pay the taxes he withheld. He owes 2.6 million to the IRS and $900,000 in state taxes as a result of that.
Yet Marc holds him as not corrupt with evidence staring him in the face and alleges the white honkey Sanford authorities as "seemingly" corrupt with NO evidence.
This ain't rocket science folks.


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Somehow, whenever I read your posts, I'm reminded of a hysterical woman at the scene of a disaster who is standing on the sidelines doing nothing but screaming hysterically, while everyone else is working to fix things and trying to ignore her screeches.
> 
> I suppose every disaster needs one, though.



The whole neighborhood's full of them this time.  On both sides.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Sharpton pays himself hundreds of thousands of dollars and what does he do?
> He withholds payroll deductions for state and federal taxes for all of his employees and what does he do with that $$$.
> He pockets it and does not pay the taxes he withheld. He owes 2.6 million to the IRS and $900,000 in state taxes as a result of that.
> Yet Marc holds him as not corrupt with evidence staring him in the face and alleges the white honkey Sanford authorities as "seemingly" corrupt with NO evidence.
> This ain't rocket science folks.


Link...?


----------



## koshergrl (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Peter didn't STAY a "brawler" though.
> 
> In fact Christ admonished him to change those "brawler" ways.
> 
> ...


 
Yeah, that's why Christ had to tell him to stop attacking the arresting soldiers.

Anyway.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Sharpton pays himself hundreds of thousands of dollars and what does he do?
> ...



You go find it. It is on his National Alliance Network NAN tax filings and since they are a "non profit" it is all there Marc. Public record. 
Additionally Sharpton held one of his "conferences" in Memphis in 2008 and had 3 floors including the penthouse suite rented at the Peabody downtown. Of course his plan everywhere he goes is to shakedown a local business. His cronies go to the Federal courthouse everywhere they go and research the docket looking for who has filed any form of employment discrimination, racial or not, and contact that person. In this particular case it was an age discrimination case and Sharpton, et al entered the case with the objections of the plaintiff's attorney. And what was the opening bid? Sharpton wanted the corporation being sued to pay the Peabody tab for that week which was $110,000.00 and he would advise the lady suing that company to settle her lawysuit for what the company had offered previously. Or course after the investigation in this matter and the evidence provided to the company which included the facts listed in the last sentence the company told "Bo Spanky" to kiss their ass. The case went to trial and an almost all black jury gave the woman nothing and sided with the company.
So what does Sharpton do? He stiffs the Peabody out of the $106,900.00 bill. After many months and finally finding a willing victim another one of his "non profits" paid the tab after suit was filed.
His defense to not paying the tab? "The Peabody Hotel is owned by greedy racists".
Go look that one up also Marc.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

Tawana Brawley ring a bell anyone?


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 30, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Peter didn't STAY a "brawler" though.
> ...



Not what Mark says...

The Passion of Jesus Christ: Narratives and Commentary


----------



## Si modo (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Tawana Brawley ring a bell anyone?


I wouldn't bother.

Decent enough guy, but Marc has his own reality.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Will you hardcore, radical RWers please stop using the term "lynching?"
> 
> Clearly you haven't a CLUE as to what lynching means.
> 
> ...



Oh shit, now you've cum all over your keyboard, Marc.

Saunter back to Stormfront with your pictures.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Link...?



Without racism, how would you fill that gaping hole in your character, Marc?


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


That's really all I needed to read, but I read it anyway.

The answer is a resounding *NO!* *1.* I'm not the one making the claim, you are. The onus is on you to provide the link/proof/evidence of the claim. *2.* It's important to you, not to me, so I have no interest in finding out whether or not that claim is true or false. *3. *I typically posts links, videos, images, etc. when I'm making claims I suspect will get opposition. *4. *I typically seek the evidence, proof, etc, when my claims are questioned and/or challenged.

Carry on.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> That's really all I needed to read, but I read it anyway.
> 
> The answer is a resounding *NO!* *1.* I'm not the one making the claim, you are. The onus is on you to provide the link/proof/evidence of the claim. *2.* It's important to you, not to me, so I have no interest in finding out whether or not that claim is true or false. *3. *I typically posts links, videos, images, etc. when I'm making claims I suspect will get opposition. *4. *I typically seek the evidence, proof, etc, when my claims are questioned and/or challenged.
> 
> Carry on.



Get real.

{The television show HBO's Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel showed a 1983 FBI videotape in which Al Sharpton is seen talking about laundering drug money with former mobster Michael Franzese, a Mafioso-turned-undercover-FBI informant posing as a cocaine dealer. 

Skeleton Closet - Al Sharpton, The Dark Side


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Tawana Brawley ring a bell anyone?
> ...



Oh I agree. That is why I debate him.
Soon he will see the light!


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > That's really all I needed to read, but I read it anyway.
> ...



Marc knows it is all true.
Bo Spanky looks like Marc so Marc has to defend him.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Read it and weep but grow some stones and join us in reality:

MSNBC Star Host Al Sharpton Owes IRS $2.6 Million | The Gateway Pundit


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 30, 2012)

*"UNPAID FEDERAL PAYROLL TAXES" *Marc.

When the hell you going to wake up?

Bo Spanky lives a lavish lifestyle, witholds his employees' taxes and spends it at The Ritz.

Stiffing the government as he goes.

I am getting ready for your next bogus excuse.


----------



## MarcATL (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> *"UNPAID FEDERAL PAYROLL TAXES" *Marc.
> 
> When the hell you going to wake up?
> 
> ...



lol...good one.

I haven't read the link yet, busy working, but I will.

However, rich folks are often accused, and sometimes are victims of their own success by missing out on the details of each and every minute payment they may have had to make.

I'm certain that this is as isolated to Sharpton as you're making it out to be.


----------



## beagle9 (Mar 30, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Martin was observed to be behaving strangely in a gated neighborhood that has had a string of robberies. He came towards Zimmerman first, then ran when Zimmerman moved to meet him. Zimmerman ran initially, then stopped pursuit when the 911 operator told him to (and he probably thought "what the HELL am I doing?")
> ...


Ok, Trayvon was doing nothing but walking through a community that had had some problems in it (worst of all burgulary), in which Zimmerman was appointed as watchmen over ???....Ok, Next Zimmerman noticed Trayvon walking in the neighborhood, because Trayvon was wearing a hoodie (a favorite atire for druggies, hoodlums, gangsta's, criminals and so forth, who want to conceal their indentity by wearing these hoodies, in which is even more hightened in suspicions, when it is not the season for wearing clothes that are designed mainly to keep you warm in the heart of winter))?? Now very sadly our youth have taken on the look also in many cases (as what some sort of a statement maybe)? Ummmm where they think that it's so cool to look the part of a thug these days)? I guess this was the first flag for Zimmerman to begin checking Trayvon out (it was wrong in America's thinking these days to do this, but was right on in the mind of a person like Zimmerman, who I guess was on watch. OK, so Zimmermans profiling experience is based on what ? Does anyone know Zimmermans background in security work?? Does he even have a background in security work? 

Zimmerman said he (Trayvon) was acting strange according to Zimmerman when called 9-11 (what ever that means), then he gave a description of Trayvon as a blackman etc. when Trayvon began walking closer to him, I guess because his hood was up, and he couldnot tell until Trayvon came closer. 

Yes Trayvon was profiled by Zimmerman as a possible criminal element in the area, but why(?) Was it due to his atire worn, and this when Zimmerman first spotted him, and not because he was a blackman when Zimmerman first spotted him??... Zimmerman profiled Trayvon as a suspicious character, that later led to the two coming into a great and dire situation together, that next led to traggic consequences over what apears to be a possible mis-judgement by Zimmerman, who had profiled Trayvon wrongfully as based upon his atire worn (the hoodie), in which caused a person like Zimmerman to become initially suspicious of Trayvon, in which started the whole deadly dance between the two on that traggic (((night)))? I was under the impression it was day when this happened, but was it at night ?

Racial profiling would have only been the case, if Zimmerman would have called 9-11 and said to begin with " Hey their is a "blackman" walking and looking suspicious in the area, so I am going to place him under survielence as a suspicious person due to the crimes that have taken place in the area...


----------



## Ariux (Mar 30, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Racial profiling would have only been the case, if



At night, from some distance, it could be real hard to tell what a hooded-person's race is.  And, Zimmerman seemed unsure of the race until some point during the 911 call when, as you point out, _ Trayvon came closer_, and squarely faced Zimmerman.  But, even if Zimmerman knew it was a black guy from the start, that still wouldn't prove racial profiling (not that there's anything wrong with profiling).

No, it's not racial profiling.  But, the shit-for-brains racist lynch mob has to claim racial profiling or concede that Tyrone was acting suspiciously (Zimmerman's professed motivation).


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 31, 2012)

Big article today all over about the PR firm that put out the photo of Martin in the 6th grade and the mug shot of Zimmerman in '05.
Sources state Martin looks nothing like that photo and Zimmerman is now much slimmer than he was then.
Talk about biased and prejudiced.
And Al, et al run with it.
Stinks more by the minute.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 31, 2012)

Marc, Malcolm X opposed the likes of Sharpton in his day. 
I read the book on Malcolm X and also really enjoy the movie with Denzel Washington and Spike Lee in it.
Washington is one of my favorite actors and even though I do not agree with a lot of the politics of Lee he is a very talented writer and actor. His works are excellent. 
Sharpton with his straightened Prince Valiant hair do. Malcolm despised the likes of Al Sharpton.


----------



## Si modo (Mar 31, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Big article today all over about the PR firm that put out the photo of Martin in the 6th grade and the mug shot of Zimmerman in '05.
> Sources state Martin looks nothing like that photo and Zimmerman is now much slimmer than he was then.
> Talk about biased and prejudiced.
> And Al, et al run with it.
> Stinks more by the minute.


After this, ANYONE who trusts the press to report on ANYTHING accurately, is even more of a fool than before.


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 31, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Big article today all over about the PR firm that put out the photo of Martin in the 6th grade and the mug shot of Zimmerman in '05.
> ...



The press has been practicing with political reporting for so long, they think that's how you do everything now.


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 31, 2012)

I'm done with this until the report comes out.  Unsubscribe.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 31, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > *"UNPAID FEDERAL PAYROLL TAXES" *Marc.
> ...



"missing out on the details"
like stiffing a private business out of 100 grand.
"minute payment"
Earth to the simpleton Marc: 3 MILLION IS "MINUTE"?
You asked for a link and now make excuses.
Seriously Marc, is that all the game you have? Excuse after excuse after excuse.
When I crossed the lines in no matter what I do, I am held accountable.
Since when have you ever called rich folks "victims"?
When they look like you do when their ass is caught in the crack.


----------



## Ravi (Mar 31, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Big article today all over about the PR firm that put out the photo of Martin in the 6th grade and the mug shot of Zimmerman in '05.
> Sources state Martin looks nothing like that photo and Zimmerman is now much slimmer than he was then.
> Talk about biased and prejudiced.
> And Al, et al run with it.
> Stinks more by the minute.


You mean that Zimmerman wasn't really a waddling obese porker unable to defend himself from a buff black football linebacker?

Asswipe.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Mar 31, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Big article today all over about the PR firm that put out the photo of Martin in the 6th grade and the mug shot of Zimmerman in '05.
> ...



Are you really this dense?
The photo of Martin media put out to begin with was a 6th grade photo-6 YEARS AGO.
To make him appear childlike.
The media puts out the orange jumpsuited Zimmerman mug shot to make him as bad as they possibly can.
And in Ravi's world that is not biased and prejudiced at all.


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Marc, Malcolm X opposed the likes of Sharpton in his day.
> I read the book on Malcolm X and also really enjoy the movie with Denzel Washington and Spike Lee in it.
> Washington is one of my favorite actors and even though I do not agree with a lot of the politics of Lee he is a very talented writer and actor. His works are excellent.
> Sharpton with his straightened Prince Valiant hair do. Malcolm despised the likes of Al Sharpton.


Spike Lee is a stone cold racist pure and simple, and the whites who have followed him (supported him) over the years have been duped by this cat... Proven by his actions in this case.


----------



## Si modo (Apr 1, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Marc, Malcolm X opposed the likes of Sharpton in his day.
> ...


And a piece of shit for putting that innocent elderly couple in harms way by his RECKLESS acts.  

I mean, WTF?  That's plain egregious.


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


I was wondering about this aspect of it just as well in the beginning..........Things can begin to stink to the highest, when these things are orchastrated by any one side in a case, and this depending on all for whom are trying to save what it is that they want to save or cause (regardless of), especially in a case like this (or) upon anyother like it for that matter.

I just hope that justice prevails no matter what in the case..


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 1, 2012)

Agree with that on Lee as they had that couple on last night.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 1, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > Marc, Malcolm X opposed the likes of Sharpton in his day.
> ...



I agree but there are many whites that I also disagree with their politics that I enjoy their talents.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The media puts out the orange jumpsuited Zimmerman mug shot to make him as bad as they possibly can.



You're a god damned liar and you know it.  Zimmerman wasn't wearing an orange jump suit in that picture.  He was wearing a collared polo shirt.  The arrest in connection with that mug shot never resulted in Zimmerman being incarcerated to be wearing a jailhouse jump suit in the first place in which he could have ever been photographed.

And if you'd been paying attention, the media has also been circulating a very well dressed, clean cut, picture of Zimmerman.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 1, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > The media puts out the orange jumpsuited Zimmerman mug shot to make him as bad as they possibly can.
> ...



You are an idiot. You post ONE news source. AP has the photo of Zimmerman in the orange jump suit and STILL HAS the 6th grade photo of Martin. That matchup has covered the media in 99% of the markets.
You put up a "gumbumper.com" photo as your evidence. 
I am sure gumbumper.com has more than half of 1% of media exposure, if that.
You are beyond weak. Do you understand how foolish that makes you look?
Note to those that claim to be "in the middle": he left out the photo of Martin in the 6th grade.
Why do they put a photo of Martin in the 6th grade Moe?


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 1, 2012)

MSN.com

Still has the 6th grade photo of Martin.
Why is that under the middle?


----------



## Inthemiddle (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> You are an idiot.



No, you are, you dumb ass.  You're just making shit up out of thin air, but what's worse is that you seem to actually believe what you're saying makes sense.



> You post ONE news source.



No, I posted a picture.  If you'd bothered to be paying attention, it's been all over the news.



> AP has the photo of Zimmerman in the orange jump suit



It's not a jump suit, it's a polo shirt that belonged to Zimmerman.  It's what he just happened to be wearing at the time of his arrest several years ago.  It was the only picture available to the media when the story hit.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 1, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > You are an idiot.
> ...



So you are claiming that the first picture put out and the picture MOSTLY used by media IS NOT the one with him in the orange jump suit mug shot at the jail?
Is that what you are claiming? 
Admit that you are wrong once in your life you spoiled baby brat.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 1, 2012)

For the dumbmasses here:
THIS IS THE PICTURE USED IN 99% OF MEDIA ALONGSIDE THE 6TH GRADE PHOTO OF MARTIN:

And this is the source ALL MEDIA GOT IT FROM:

George Zimmerman Mugshot - Mugshots.com - Find Mugshots Online. Official Records, Criminal Records, Arrest Records


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> Marc, Malcolm X opposed the likes of Sharpton in his day.
> I read the book on Malcolm X and also really enjoy the movie with Denzel Washington and Spike Lee in it.
> Washington is one of my favorite actors and even though I do not agree with a lot of the politics of Lee he is a very talented writer and actor. His works are excellent.
> Sharpton with his straightened Prince Valiant hair do. Malcolm despised the likes of Al Sharpton.


1. You can't provide one evidence that Brother Minister Malcolm-X opposed Reverend Al Sharpton

2. I'm quite certain you're not the best one in a position to say whether or not Malcolm-X would approve or disapprove of another black leader. Certainly not more than myself or others.

3. What exactly do you mean by "the likes of Sharpton?" Tell me what does Al Sharpton represent to you.

Thanks.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Alls I'm saying is that Al Sharpton isn't the first "rich person" to have such issues going on, won't be the last.

In fact I believe Mint Raw-Money's had a lot of similar situations going on.

BTW, I still haven't read the link but I'm willing to admit that there MAY be some funny business going on.

However, certainly not as sinister as you're making it out to be.

You clearly are guided by your feelings about Al Sharpton. I wish you'd divert those feelings or focus them on others more deserving.

Just my $0.02


----------



## OODA_Loop (Apr 1, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> What exactly do you mean by "the likes of Sharpton?" Tell me what does Al Sharpton represent to you.



I have never heard a positive affirmation or reinforcement of the value of hard work and self-accountable living from the "Reverend".


----------



## Inthemiddle (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> So you are claiming that the first picture put out and the picture MOSTLY used by media IS NOT the one with him in the orange jump suit mug shot at the jail?



HE'S NOT WEARING AN ORANGE JUMP SUIT, IT'S A COLLARED POLO SHIRT!!



> Is that what you are claiming?



No, I'm telling the truth.  You're sitting here making claims, and stupid ones at that.  Zimmerman isn't wearing a jail clothes, he's wearing his own clothes.  People don't get changed into jail clothing just to pose for mug shots, when they're going to be released.



> Admit that you are wrong once in your life you spoiled baby brat.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> For the dumbmasses here:
> THIS IS THE PICTURE USED IN 99% OF MEDIA ALONGSIDE THE 6TH GRADE PHOTO OF MARTIN:
> 
> And this is the source ALL MEDIA GOT IT FROM:
> ...



That's a cropped image.  This is the picture....







He's wearing a god damned polo shirt, you idiot.


----------



## Ravi (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> For the dumbmasses here:
> THIS IS THE PICTURE USED IN 99% OF MEDIA ALONGSIDE THE 6TH GRADE PHOTO OF MARTIN:
> 
> And this is the source ALL MEDIA GOT IT FROM:
> ...


That's not an orange jump suit. He'd only have been wearing an orange jumpsuit if he had been jailed. Oh wait, are you claiming that he spent time in the slammer?

You really are an idiot.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Apr 1, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > For the dumbmasses here:
> ...



Is that an older picture of Zimmerman? Which picture makes Zimmerman look more menacing 

This one





Or this one 





Which picture is going to get the biggest Knee jerk reaction from idiots like you?


----------



## Rocko (Apr 1, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > For the dumbmasses here:
> ...



That was actually an arrest photo buddy. Doesn't look very flattering does it?


----------



## Ravi (Apr 1, 2012)

You just have to laugh. The loons have been claiming the pic of Zimmerman in the polo shirt proves he's an overweight midget doughboy that couldn't hurt a ten year old girl, let alone a 17 year old boy.

Now that we've seen the perp walk into the police station, we know different.

If you want honesty in the media, the most posted picture should be the most recent: Zimmerman doing the perp walk.


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 1, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > The media puts out the orange jumpsuited Zimmerman mug shot to make him as bad as they possibly can.
> ...


The first photo I saw of Zimmerman, was the mug looking shot, in which did have an affect on me in an assumptive negative kind of way. It made me think Zimmerman was a shady character himself when I saw that shot of him, then came the one you have presented here, in which I saw next or second in the ordeal.

Are you sure that someone is a liar in which you out right called them in the response post you submitted ??


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 1, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


I don't know, if someone messes up bad enough, I am done with them, and I don't care what kind of talent they have..


----------



## Inthemiddle (Apr 2, 2012)

Barry44sucks said:


> That was actually an arrest photo buddy. Doesn't look very flattering does it?



Well no shit it's an arrest photo.  That's what I said.  When the story hit, it was the only picture available to the media because such things are public record.  But if you noticed, the family has since release another photo that is now the main picture being utilized by the media.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 2, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > For the dumbmasses here:
> ...



Ok, he is wearing an orange polo shirt in his mug shot at the jail.
Go figure.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 2, 2012)

Inthemiddle said:


> Barry44sucks said:
> 
> 
> > That was actually an arrest photo buddy. Doesn't look very flattering does it?
> ...



Just as soon as they were called out on the 6th grade photo that their law firm released, not them.
I feel very bad for the family of this young man in this senseless killing.
Like you they are blind as a bat but they have an excuse.
What is yours?


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 8, 2012)

I finally read the link to the Al Sharpton tax issues.

So what.

Like I said, he's not the first rich person to have such issues and won't be the last.

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

Fact of the matter is, bringing us back to the OP, that in no way, shape or form did the, now deceased victim, Trayvon Martin, "confront" his killer George Zimmerman. It's not "confronting" when one stands one's ground to a person that is following you.

Zimmerman was out of bounds coming and going...six ways from Sunday. He will have to pay for what he has done.

Justice is coming.


----------



## PredFan (Apr 8, 2012)

I can't wait for the butt hurt when Zimmerman is found not-guilty. That will be sweeeeeeeet!


----------



## Ravi (Apr 8, 2012)

PredFan said:


> I can't wait for the butt hurt when Zimmerman is found not-guilty. That will be sweeeeeeeet!



Yeah, I'm sure to you, it will be.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 8, 2012)

This is the real Trayvon Martin.
Why the gold grill?

Where does a 17 year old "boy" get the $$$ to buy all that gold?

Autopsy report is 75 1/2 inches and 161 pounds.  
6'3" and 1/2 inches and 161 pounds.

Looks like a bouncing baby boy for sure in this photo.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 8, 2012)

The sad part is if the evidence supports Zimmerman's claims and a jury finds accordingly many of you short bus folk here will claim that the jury was paid off by white supremacists.

So obvious that the short bus folk here have no understanding of the law, the presumption of innocence and the right to self defense. 

Their simpleton minds were made up when that 6th grade photo came out and the media for the dumbmasses told them Zimmerman was a racist.


----------



## Ravi (Apr 8, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> View attachment 18222
> 
> This is the real Trayvon Martin.
> Why the gold grill?
> ...


Yeah, and he had a nine inch dick so he deserved to die.

What was Zimmerman's claim to fame? Cop wannabe, race baiter, martial arts master?

Why don't we know these things?


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 8, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> I finally read the link to the Al Sharpton tax issues.
> 
> So what.
> 
> ...



You denied everything I stated about it. Said I was a liar.
But now you have another tune.
The liberal short bus mind:
1st you deny
Then you change the subject.
Then you call folks liars. 

Martin was a punk thug Marc. You know it, the police knew it, the school knew it, his parents and family know it.
Doesn't give Zimmerman the right to kill him.
But if Martin attacked Zimmerman first and kept coming then so be it.
If that is the case then where do I contribute to the Zimmerman Bahama vacation fund and a medal for him after he is found not guilty?
But this is a manslaughter case I believe. Plea down to 10 years with 1 to serve.
Then watch the black communities burn their own houses over it.
No winners in this Marc. All losers. Wake the hell up, grow some stones and speak the truth.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 8, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > View attachment 18222
> ...



Already proven he was not a race baiter.
I called him a cop wannabe when you were drooling over the fabricated 911 call NBC used that was a fraud.

You make my point. You know he stole to get the $$$ for his teeth but will not admit it because you are drooling over his Johnson.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 8, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > View attachment 18222
> ...




What is most disturbing is you WANT the evidence to be that Zimmerman did it. You WANT Zimmerman to be guilty. You WILL DISPUTE any evidence that does not fit 
"Zimmerman is guilty".
And that is sick. Your mind is made up, biased and prejudiced.
You are not qualified to be a jurist. 
But you are not alone. Ignorance, bias and prejudice in America is rampant.


----------



## Ravi (Apr 9, 2012)

What's most disturbing is that you think you know what I think. Even more disturbing is that people hire you to conduct investigations?? bwahahaha you've constantly posted things here as fact that are merely speculation.


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 9, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > View attachment 18222
> ...


 
The question is...why do you know those things when there's zero evidence that they're true?

Oh I know, you're a racist and a liar.


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 9, 2012)

Ravi said:


> What's most disturbing is that you think you know what I think. Even more disturbing is that people hire you to conduct investigations?? bwahahaha you've constantly posted things here as fact that are merely speculation.


 
Uh, hello..you tell people what you think.

And what you say is racist, and lies.

Which makes you a lying racist.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot (Apr 9, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> I finally read the link to the Al Sharpton tax issues.
> 
> So what.
> 
> ...



*It's not "confronting" when one stands one's ground to a person that is following you.
*

Is it confronting to punch that person? 
To bang his head against the ground?


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 15, 2012)

I can easily understand about Zimmerman, once he had called 9-11, and had them on the phone regarding what he thought was a suspicious looking person in the area, that he would also try and keep an eye on that person until the cops got there, in order to have him checked out by the police when they arrived (i.e. to tell the cops where Trayvon went or is heading), so he left his truck to keep an eye on the person we all know now as being Trayvon Martin, who eventually walked towards Zimmerman, but then began leaving the area quickly after being surveyed by Zimmerman (as to being a possible criminal element lerking in the area), but to Martin (Zimmerman) was also an unidentified person that was profiling him for some reason, in which was un-beknownst to Martin at the time as to why, so Martin then began to leave the area quickly, and this is where Zimmerman began his pursuit of Trayvon on foot (to my understanding) so when the dispatcher asked Zimmerman " are you following him"? Zimmerman replied yes, then the dispatcher told Zimmerman " we don't need you to do that sir" (i.e. to follow Trayvon like Zimmerman was doing), because the dispatcher knew that the suspect was a person for whom Zimmerman didnot know anything about, and thus feared for Zimmermans safety in the situation, because after all he was the watchman of the gated community, who is calling the 9-11 operator to report a possible suspect in the area. 

So yes (I feel) the dispatcher told (Zimmerman) to stop following this person in the dark, but it was for his own safety in the situation. Then when Zimmerman realized that the dispatcher was right, and that he was actually chasing a person in the dark for whom he had no knowldge of what so ever, and for which the person being chased could easily turn around and harm him, Zimmerman stopped the pursuit at that point.. Then Zimmerman turned and began his journey back to his truck (to my understanding), where Trayvon (to my understanding) next re-apeared to surprise Zimmerman, causing Zimmerman to turn around to face Trayvon, who said next to Zimmerman "do you have a problem", in which Zimmerman said No, and then Trayvon (to my understanding), said "well you do now", and decked Zimmerman at that point, where the struggle between the two began, that ended sadly in a traggedy where Zimmermans gun was discharged, and sadly Trayvon lay dead because of that discharged weapon.

The perfect storm had arisen upon these two that night, where both of them became highly suspicious of the other that rainey evening, and a deadly dance began to form, that caused each man to do things that ended sadly in a traggic death of one of them, because both men were innocent in the ordeal, but didnot realize this untill it was to late.

The mistakes made:

1. Zimmerman profiled Martin as a potential criminal element in the area, and this because of various identifying or suspicious factors involved, and this all according to Zimmerman (the hoodie being one of them) as Zimmerman did mention the hoodie to the dispatcher, and to couple this with the break in's in the area, in which  led Zimmerman to believe the worst about Martin when spotted him, especially when saw him walking along acting (according to Zimmerman), like something was wrong with the now known innocent victim Trayvon Martin. These mis-understandings coupled with Zimmermans experience as a watchmen, will be heavily investigated in this trial coming up next possibly.

2. Zimmerman follows Martin, making Martin very nervous (for reasons unknown at this time) other than an un-identified man was following him, thus causing Martin to become curious as to who exactly was this man who was first checking him out, and then following him next, and worse for nothing in Martins mind, that he Zimmerman should have been following Trayvon Martin as an innocent person in the dark at all, so he Trayvon doubles back to get answers to these questions in bravery of, by actually confronting Zimmerman as he did, where as we only know what was told by the survivor Zimmerman, and a few witnesses as to what happened next.

3. No identifiable clothing worn, in order to identify Zimmerman as a security officer, in which would have stopped the deadly dance way before it began, otherwise if this would have been the case I do strongly feel in the situation that Trayvon would still be with us today.

4. Now Trayvon alledgedly decks Zimmerman, which is a huge mistake by Trayvon in the situation, thus leading to the struggle and ultimately to his death found within the struggle.

Am I close on this yall ?? My grandaddy was an investigator back in the 40's... I may be a chip off of the old block...


----------



## Ariux (Apr 15, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> I can easily understand about Zimmerman, once he had called 9-11, and had them on the phone regarding what he thought was a suspicious looking person in the area, that he would also try and keep an eye on that person until the cops got there,



Supporters of Trayvon deserve our utmost contempt.  Out of their racist hatred, they take innocent things and paint them as sinister.  It's completely normal and reasonable for someone to try to keep an eye on a suspicious person, after they've called 911. And, the only reason the 911 operator suggested that Zimmerman keep an eye on the suspect is for Zimmerman's own safety.  But, to the bigoted liberals, keeping an eye on becomes "chasing down".  The 911 operator's suggestion becomes a law that Zimmerman supposedly violated and continued to violate (even though he agreed with the operator to stop keeping an eye on Trayvon).

The Liberal bigoted illogic continues "f-cold"  becomes "f-coons" which becomes proof that Zimmerman attacked Trayvon.  Ditto for everything else Liberals argue.   



> The mistakes made:
> 
> 1. Zimmerman profiled Martin as a potential criminal element in the area, and this because of various identifying or suspicious factors involved, and this all according to Zimmerman (the hoodie being one of them)



Just when I thought you had at least a room-temperature IQ, you go off on this idiotic, bigoted left-wing trail.  There's zero evidence that Zimmerman profiled Trayvon by hoodie.  He saw somebody looking around, as if casing the neighborhood, looking for criminal opportunities.  It was night and rainy, not a time where a non-criminal is likely to do anything but head straight to where he's going.

Sure, any reasonable person would consider race, hoodie, sex, and youth... but those factors alone are not enough for even quick-dial Zimmerman to call 911.  And, these are not the reasons Zimmerman gave to the 911 operator for the call.



> 2. Zimmerman follows Martin, making Martin very nervous (for reasons unknown at this time) other than an un-identified man was following him,



And, you continue down the leftwing trail... How do you know Trayvon was "very nervous"?  A 6'3, 17y-old African is a trifecta for cockiness.  This is reflected in the fact he called himself a no-limit-nigga.  And, it's reflected in the fact that he moved toward Zimmerman (according to the 911 call) and attacked Zimmerman, a fat hispanic (according to all the evidence).  Someone very nervous would have been long gone before the shooting, and so there would have been no shooting. 



> 3. No identifiable clothing worn, in order to identify Zimmerman as a security officer, in which would have stopped the deadly dance way before it began, otherwise if this would have been the case I do strongly feel in the situation that Trayvon would still be with us today.



Don't be such a shithead coming up with excuses for the African.  Are citizens not suppose to protect their neighborhood.  Trayvon would still be with us today if he wasn't a piece of shit, such as someone who would brutally assault someone for eyeballing him.


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 15, 2012)

Ariux said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> > I can easily understand about Zimmerman, once he had called 9-11, and had them on the phone regarding what he thought was a suspicious looking person in the area, that he would also try and keep an eye on that person until the cops got there,
> ...




Look here troll, don't be commenting on my postings anylonger if you can't get the story right... You take words and change them around and try to make something out of them that they are not, just as you have done listed in red ink above, because the 9-11 operator never did suggest that Zimmerman keep an eye on anyone, so get your story straight if you are going to participate how about it.... I am also not for your bad attitude shown in your words as written here either, so how's about you go along some where else and confuse the message and/or truth never to be found in your words as they are written.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 15, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > I finally read the link to the Al Sharpton tax issues.
> ...


You have zero credibility.
Not one scratch was on Zimmerman who's claimed, via his proxies, that he was within inches of his life due to the blows and damage that Trayvon inflicted on him.
But, not that that matters to you, you've already made up your mind.


----------



## beagle9 (Apr 15, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Man the conspirital mind does get the best of some here sometimes, because marc, you know that none of us can make these kinds of claims about Zimmermans injuries yet, but you are doing it as if you already know without the shadow of a doubt, or is this just for argument purposes only ?


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 15, 2012)

Produce Zimmerman's injuries.

I dare you.


----------



## Dante (Apr 16, 2012)

Ravi and Marc and others need to stfu. Why?

An affidavit released by the prosecutor who has charged George Zimmerman with second-degree murder in the shooting of Trayvon Martin says he did not use a racial slur in a 911 call made to police shortly before killing the teen.

Read more: George Zimmerman Did Not Use Racial Slur, New Judge Needed in Case? | Fox News Latino

--------

The affidavit also states that facts set out in the three-page document "are not a complete recitation of all the pertinent facts and evidence in this case."

--------

Harvard law professor predicts George Zimmerman will be acquitted

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/04/...-predicts-george-zimmerman-will-be-acquitted/

Dershowitz said the affidavit was not just thin, it was also irresponsible and unethical because it excluded any evidence that favors the defendant.

&#8220;This case will not, if the evidence is no stronger than what appears in the probable cause affidavit, this case will result in an acquittal,&#8221; he said.

Jonathan Turley, a professor at George Washington University and a defense attorney, has also said it would be very difficult to convict Zimmerman.


----------



## Ariux (Apr 16, 2012)

beagle9 said:


> Look here troll, don't be commenting on my postings anylonger if you can't get the story right... You take words and change them around and try to make something out of them that they are not, just as you have done listed in red ink above, because the 9-11 operator never did suggest that Zimmerman keep an eye on anyone, so get your story straight if you are going to participate how about it....



You drooling idiot, it's obvious I inadvertently dropped the word "not".  My argument is about the 911 operator telling Zimmerman not to follow, so it would make no sense if I thought Zimmerman was told to keep an eye on Trayvon.  Also in the same paragraph, I correctly stated that the operator told Zimmerman to stop.  I'll put in red, moron, he agreed with the operator to stop, you even quoted this in your reply to me.



> I am also not for your bad attitude shown in your words as written here either, so how's about you go along some where else and confuse the message and/or truth never to be found in your words as they are written.



Your posts are moronic.  Instead of accusing me of having a bad attitude, you should see if you can get some more brain cells to fire up.

What really happened is that I ripped to shreds your idiotic post and now you're a sore loser, reduced to whining about an obvious typo.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

If a Judge validates The Stand Your Ground Defense and dismisses the case how many communities will burn the first night?


----------



## Old Rocks (Apr 16, 2012)

If this is what is considered a 'Stand your Ground Case', then murder is legal in the US. Just follow someone you dislike for whatever reason, instigate a fight, and kill them. Then claim 'Stand your Ground'.


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

You have no way of knowing that's what happened, loon.

But it sure makes a good story!


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> If this is what is considered a 'Stand your Ground Case', then murder is legal in the US. Just follow someone you dislike for whatever reason, instigate a fight, and kill them. Then claim 'Stand your Ground'.



How can you claim it was murder when you were not there?
Did you see who attacked who?
Did you see the gun pointed at Martin and the trigger pulled?
How do you know Zimmerman "instigated a fight".
Not saying I like the law there but WE WERE NOT THERE.

Your greatest call as a citizen in this country is as a jurist. How could you ever sit on any jury when you have your mind made up already and do not know the foundation of the jury system which is the presumption of innocence?

Following someone IS NOT instigating a fight. 
What evidence is there that Zimmerman "disliked" Martin?
Frankly, I am shocked by your bias and prejudice.
I have an open mind as I WAS NOT THERE.


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

I'm not shocked.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> If a Judge validates The Stand Your Ground Defense and dismisses the case how many communities will burn the first night?



Sounds like you're calling for anarchy. Wishing and praying for it actually.

Carry on.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Produce Zimmerman's injuries.
> 
> I dare you.


What does that have to do w/the price of tea in China?





			
				Dante said:
			
		

> Hi, you have received -139 reputation points from Dante.
> Reputation was given for *this* post.
> 
> Comment:
> ...


 LOL!!!


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

You're ridiculing your own post?


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > If a Judge validates The Stand Your Ground Defense and dismisses the case how many communities will burn the first night?
> ...


The truth shouldn't be an offense missy.





			
				koshergrl said:
			
		

> Hi, you have received -295 reputation points from koshergrl.
> Reputation was given for *this* post.
> 
> Comment:
> ...


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Truth about what? You're a gibbering idiot.


----------



## Dante (Apr 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Truth about what? You're a gibbering idiot.



and if he can get Ravi to follow him around the thread we'll have an idjit fest


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > If a Judge validates The Stand Your Ground Defense and dismisses the case how many communities will burn the first night?
> ...



No, unlike you I want a fair trial.
Not vigalante mob rule "justice" that you seek.
I understand we are a nation of LAWS, not wild tribal factions like the New Black Panther Party that would kill at the drop of a hat and be allowed to get away with it by those that look like them.
Civilized society is a great thing Marc. Come on over and leave the culture of violence and join us.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

The incident report clearly states "Zimmerman treated in the back of patrol car by SFD".
Hate to inform you legal mental midgets but that is ALL that is needed for a self defense claim.
You idiots do not know that the defense has to offer their affirmative defenses before trial and a Judge rules on them. 
Something about The United States Constitution, a document many here have no clue exists.


----------



## jillian (Apr 16, 2012)

Old Rocks said:


> If this is what is considered a 'Stand your Ground Case', then murder is legal in the US. Just follow someone you dislike for whatever reason, instigate a fight, and kill them. Then claim 'Stand your Ground'.



It does have kind of a 'wild west' feel to it, doesn't it?


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> The incident report clearly states "Zimmerman treated in the back of patrol car by SFD".
> Hate to inform you legal mental midgets but that is ALL that is needed for a self defense claim.
> You idiots do not know that the defense has to offer their affirmative defenses before trial and a Judge rules on them.
> Something about The United States Constitution, a document many here have no clue exists.


Produce the injuries please.

Thanks.


----------



## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > The incident report clearly states "Zimmerman treated in the back of patrol car by SFD".
> ...



How does one "produce the injuries"?
The trial has not started.
Do you know anything about our system of justice here or are you a new arrival?


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Here's how it works...

If peach, emma, marcatl, paper,  or any of the other idiots *imagine* it, then that's the way it is.

If you contest their imaginings, you must *produce* evidence to disprove whatever loony assertation they are making at that time.


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Oh, and if you state "innocent until proven guilty" then you are a racist who *loves* zimmerman.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


Ahhh...I see.

Well thank you for clarifying  that.

It seems then, based on your falling on the sword of "the trial hasn't started yet" everything that you've been stating as gospel fact to bolser YOUR OPINIONS on the case, has been pure SPECULATION, HERE-SAY and CONJECTURE.

Isn't that right?


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Has he proclaimed guilt or innocence?

So far all he's done is point out the idiocy of retards who have no access to the facts thinking they can determine guilt or innocence...


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Has he proclaimed guilt or innocence?
> 
> So far all he's done is point out the idiocy of retards who have no access to the facts thinking they can determine guilt or innocence...


Produce evidence of posters stating that he's guilty.

Thanks.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Former State Sen. Durell Peadon said:
			
		

> "If he has a gun, that's
> premeditated. There's nothing
> in the Florida law that allows
> him to follow someone with a
> damn gun."


- 
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...aw-george-zimmerman-arrestedarticle-1.1048164


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Has he proclaimed guilt or innocence?
> ...


 
"Open and shut second degree murder." - saveliberty
http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/218317-posters-for-the-jury-7.html?

Do you want more?


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

"He isn't innocent, he killed a kid in cold blood. He isn't innocent. " Sarahg
http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/217852-free-george-zimmerman.html?


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

"My guess he is guilty- of something.Of being a re-election ploy at least....... And killing Trayvon Martin. "
Luddlyneophyte
http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/217852-free-george-zimmerman.html? POST #32


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

This is fun.


----------



## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> "Open and shut second degree murder." - saveliberty
> http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/218317-posters-for-the-jury-7.html?
> 
> Do you want more?





koshergrl said:


> "He isn't innocent, he killed a kid in cold blood. He isn't innocent. " Sarahg
> http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/217852-free-george-zimmerman.html?





koshergrl said:


> "My guess he is guilty- of something.Of being a re-election ploy at least....... And killing Trayvon Martin. "
> Luddlyneophyte
> http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/217852-free-george-zimmerman.html?



Two of your quotes are fraudulent, Sarah didn't say it nor did SaveLiberty.

Why must you lie so?


----------



## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

And who could forget this gem:

"Zimmerman had a 100 lb weight advantage" - rightwinger
http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-a...ness-trayvon-was-beating-zimmerman-up-2.html?


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > "Open and shut second degree murder." - saveliberty
> ...


 
Bullshit.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

He isn't innocent, he killed a kid in cold blood. He isn't innocent. 
Sarahag...post #30
http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-a...ness-trayvon-was-beating-zimmerman-up-2.html?


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

What are you racists going to do when Zimmerman gets the book thrown at him?

You've already been setting up for it I see, claiming and moaning and wailing on and on and on about "Oh how he won't get a fair trial!" "Oh how Zimmerman has been demonized by the media!" "Oh if George Zimmerman could only get a fair trial!" "Oh woe is me!" 

You people are so transparent.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

"The man murdered a child. He needs to stand up in front of a jury and tell us why."
Joeb131 post #175
http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-a...63-this-just-in-on-the-zimmerman-case-5.html?


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Is that enough, Marcatl? Should I keep bringing up posts where your comrades have proclaimed Zimmerman's guilt? Should I keep showing you up as the liar you are?

Don't feel bad though...you aren't the only one. All of the lynch mob members, being hard core progressive racists, are liars.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

You feel very proud of yourself now Kosher...don't you?


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

I always feel good when a lying racist exposes himself. 

And if I can contribute in some small way to exposing them, then I feel that much better about it.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

In case you are ever in charge of questioning someone in a court of law, I have some advice for you...

NEVER ASK A QUESTION UNLESS YOU KNOW THE ANSWER.

Dumbass.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

You lie Kosher, I was being sarcastic with my question and you can't even recognize that for your head is so far up your BUTTOCKS!!







Again, 2 of the 3 you initially posted were fraudulent, those posters did NOT say what you claimed the said. In fact, Sarah G, wasn't even on that page in your link.

You are such a rude and crude liar...you have no shame.

*SMH*


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Yeah, you wish.

Even for someone as lame as you are, that's exceptionally lame. It's from the progressive racist liar script...

"When caught in a lie, just say you were being 'sarcastic'".


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Yeah, you wish.
> 
> Even for someone as lame as you are, that's exceptionally lame. It's from the progressive racist liar script...
> 
> "When caught in a lie, just say you were being 'sarcastic'".



Just like a stinkin RepubliCON...just make up the rules as you go along.

Keep it up.


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## jillian (Apr 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Oh, and if you state "innocent until proven guilty" then you are a racist who *loves* zimmerman.



i have no problem with a presumption of innocence. i have a problem with the improper investigation and people who don't think this guy should be tried.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

I think it wasn't so much that people didn't want him tried...they just didn't want him tried unless there was some sort of evidence that he had committed a crime.

If the cops and the prosecutor, who had the evidence, didn't think there was a reason to try him, then a mob shouldn't be able to come along and force him into court...or worse yet, straight to the tree.

They have the evidence, let them arrest and try him, that's fine. But just because it looks like a crime was committed to the yahoos on usmb doesn't mean this guy should HAVE to be accused of a crime, if law enforcement and prosecutors don't think a crime was committed.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, you wish.
> ...


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## beagle9 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Produce Zimmerman's injuries.
> 
> I dare you.


If you can't, then what makes you think that I can ?? Sheesh....Stawman


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## beagle9 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


Then why does Marc keep on speculating, I mean if it is the wrong thing to be doing as is found in your own opinion?


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> You lie Kosher, I was being sarcastic with my question and you can't even recognize that for your head is so far up your BUTTOCKS!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Again, you're the liar. I posted the post numbers and the links.

Loser.


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## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> What are you racists going to do when Zimmerman gets the book thrown at him?
> 
> You've already been setting up for it I see, claiming and moaning and wailing on and on and on about "Oh how he won't get a fair trial!" "Oh how Zimmerman has been demonized by the media!" "Oh if George Zimmerman could only get a fair trial!" "Oh woe is me!"
> 
> You people are so transparent.



How am I a racist Marc?
A racist is someone that believes that their race is superior to another.
Please show me how I believe that my race is superior to yours.
And please go back to 3rd grade English and learn your 3rd grade vocabulary words..
Amazing how you throw the r word around when you have no clue even what it means.
Sad that ignorance is so prevalent in American these days.
Marc, all you amount to is a pawn for the race pimps and mass media.
I pity you. Malcolm X would laugh at you. You are a pawn to the mass media.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > What are you racists going to do when Zimmerman gets the book thrown at him?
> ...


If I merely used the term racists...what makes you think it's referring to you?

Doth thou protest too much? hmmmmmmm.....!!!??!?


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## Si modo (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


"You racists" is what you used in the context of those who are concerned about a fair trial, which is the PROCESS.

It's both amazing and pathetic that you find those who defend the integrity of the PROCESS as racists.


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## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



You said "you racists" so who are you talking to Marc?
When confronted with your own words and asked to back it up you run from it like a scalded dog on fire.
Why is that Marc? Are your worn out platitudes so weak that you can never defend them?


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## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

'You are racist" is all they ever have.
And they don't even know the definition of the words they speak.
So old, so worn out, so judgmental and biased and so weak.

But that is all they know and have been taught by Sharpton/Jackson, et al. 
Divisiveness is what they thrive on. They call us racists if we dare challenge them to provide facts to back up their claims.


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## Toddsterpatriot (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> What are you racists going to do when Zimmerman gets the book thrown at him?
> 
> You've already been setting up for it I see, claiming and moaning and wailing on and on and on about "Oh how he won't get a fair trial!" "Oh how Zimmerman has been demonized by the media!" "Oh if George Zimmerman could only get a fair trial!" "Oh woe is me!"
> 
> You people are so transparent.



*What are you racists going to do when Zimmerman gets the book thrown at him?*

Isn't it sad when a registered Democrat shoots a poor black child?


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


We ALL are defending the PROCESS...so what you're saying is nothing but claptrap.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

You don't even know what the process is, you lunatic.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Toddsterpatriot said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > What are you racists going to do when Zimmerman gets the book thrown at him?
> ...


I don't care WHAT Zimmerman is or isn't...I just want to see JUSTICE served.

Whereas the radical RWers and the racists didn't even want him to get charged.

Yet, some are claiming that they're just "defending the process"

Funny that.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> 'You are racist" is all they ever have.
> And they don't even know the definition of the words they speak.
> So old, so worn out, so judgmental and biased and so weak.
> 
> ...



You're still squawking about "facts" when it's been already proven that NOBODY has ANY of the facts as of yet?

You're are quite a lost case.


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## Toddsterpatriot (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



*the racists didn't even want him to get charged.*

The racists are the ones putting a bounty on his head.

Imagine, if we could throw all the lawbreaking Democrats in jail, Dems would never win another national or statewide race again.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Any person that inserts the inconsequential 2-man group of the New Black Panthers to support some bogus claim or the other simply CANNOT be taken seriously in an adult discussion about anything.


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## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Gadawg73 said:
> 
> 
> > 'You are racist" is all they ever have.
> ...



OK, so you have changed your tune and now want to see the facts.
I respect that and figured you would come to that. 
But you have to admit I have always stated MY MIND IS OPEN, I WAS NOT THERE, I WANT TO SEE THE EVIDENCE AND FACTS, I WANT TO HEAR THE WITNESSES 
*BEFORE * I judge.
So is that where you are at now? You presume BOTH Martin and Zimmerman innocent of all accusations? 
You do not judge Martin whatsoever that he has history and same for Zimmerman?
Open mind and the presumption of innocence?
I am with you. Just because someone is charged with a crime means nothing.
Bring on the case and the burden of proof is always on the prosecution. And the past of both parties ARE NOT evidence of any kind.


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## koshergrl (Apr 16, 2012)

Yeah. Obviously it's just two people..that explains why zimmerman's parents, all the witnesses, zimmerman himself, and the unfortunate couple that Spike Lee set up, have all received death threats.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJONVUSbXr0]Mike Tyson on George Zimmerman: &#39;Disgrace He Hasn&#39;t Been Shot Yet&#39; - YouTube[/ame]

Is Mike Tyson a New Black Panther?


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## Gadawg73 (Apr 16, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Any person that inserts the inconsequential 2-man group of the New Black Panthers to support some bogus claim or the other simply CANNOT be taken seriously in an adult discussion about anything.



LOL, I have to agree the recording I heard of the Black Panther Party down there sounded like a drunken crack smoking get together full of BS and threats.
But who knows? If they were a 2 man KKK Aryan Nation group the FBI and local law enforcement would be on them quicker than green flies on shit and Morris Dees and The 
Southern Poverty Law Clinic would own everything they have after the civil suit.
Fair is fair and fair ain't happening as the NBBP gets a free pass no matter how stupid they obviously are as you correctly pointed out.


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Gadawg73 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Gadawg73 said:
> ...


No, no, no. We do differ.
I BELIEVE Zimmerman is guilty of murder. I RECOGNIZE that by LAW he IS innocent until proven GUIILY, but that doesn't stop ME from personally making a judgement based on the reports thus far.
I do, however, remain OPEN to what the OFFICIAL findings are.

Clear as mud?


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## Rocko (Apr 16, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, and if you state "innocent until proven guilty" then you are a racist who *loves* zimmerman.
> ...



how do you know it was an improper investigation?

Why do you have a problem with some people feeling there wasn't enough evidence for a trial?  Surely everyone is entitled to an opinion, right?


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## MarcATL (Apr 16, 2012)

Your two statements cancel each other out.

You ask someone else, how do they know, due to the fact that they don't know all the facts.
And your last statement talks about how you're entitled to your own opinion.

You see how you people like to mess things up just to swing them your way?


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## Rocko (Apr 17, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Your two statements cancel each other out.
> 
> You ask someone else, how do they know, due to the fact that they don't know all the facts.
> And your last statement talks about how you're entitled to your own opinion.
> ...



We don't know facts. We won't until the trial.

What we have are police statements and media reports.

I haven't heard anything that would, to me, indicate the police didn't handel the investigation correctly.

With all the information we've recieved on the incident, people we're free to form an oppion on wether or not the trial should happen. Having said that. The trial is now going to happen, and that decision could have been made based on information we don't know about, so it's important to trust the process.


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## koshergrl (Apr 17, 2012)

Barry44sucks said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...


 
The only people I've heard say there has been an improper investigation has been the lynch mob here.

The special prosecutor said they were right on track when she picked it up.


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## Rocko (Apr 17, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> barry44sucks said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


+1


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## beagle9 (Apr 21, 2012)

MarcATL said:


> Your two statements cancel each other out.
> 
> You ask someone else, how do they know, due to the fact that they don't know all the facts.
> And your last statement talks about how you're entitled to your own opinion.
> ...




You people eh ? Classic racist seperatist speak, as is accused of the white man by the black man everytime it is spoken by a white man in the same way, otherwise if and when (a white man) speaks in this way, and in the same context, then the black man says to him, whats this "you people" stuff, and then assumes instantly that (the white man) is a racist and seperatist by such speak as is used or is spoken by a white man in this way.. Ohhhh the double standards that just keep going on and on and on and on, and round and round and round and round and round.. B )


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## KissMy (Apr 21, 2012)

Did Trayvon Martin "Swing on a Bus Driver"?


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## Ariux (Apr 21, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Did Trayvon Martin "Swing on a Bus Driver"?



Trayvon was 17, it's an age where there's gong to be little evidence that a thug is a thug.  Police records are sealed.  School records are private.  At that age, a thug hasn't been a  thug for long.  And, at that age, and the years leading up to it, kids are often not arrested in the same situation that an adult would be arrested.

Yet, from the past school year alone, we know that Trayvon has been caught with stolen goods, a burglary tool, and possession of illegal drugs.  We know he committed vandalism at school.  There are stories related to him being involved with fighting, maybe even a swing at a buss driver.  Then there's the non-criminal evidence of his poor character, from his gangsta fetish to the lack of any white character witnesses.  He was chronically late to classes, enough to earn a suspension.  No one has praised him for being a good student, or having good grades.  

In short, even with Trayvon's short history, we know he was a thug who was already developing into a hardened criminal... the kind who would case a neighborhood and then brutally assault someone who caught him in that act of casing.


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## Gadawg73 (Apr 23, 2012)

If it goes to a jury as I doubt it will, we have a 150K bond for a murder charge, the jury will have to weigh the charge of murder with these undisputed facts:

1. Zimmerman did call police about seeing Martin. 
2. Zimmerman was going to meet with the police as advised in the call.

So my argument to the jury if Zimmerman was going to hunt down and murder Martin WHY DOES HE CALL POLICE AND TELL HIM HE IS THERE?

It makes no sense. Jury verdict on the 2nd degree murder is not guilty or possibly a hung jury.


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