# Fantastic Four



## Sgt_Gath (Aug 22, 2015)

*Fantastic Four*

_Holy Hell..._This was bad. *Really* bad.


I'd read some negative reviews beforehand, but decided to go ahead and brave a watch anyway. While I wouldn't call the film "unwatchable" per se, describing it as being a misguided, convoluted, insulting, and ultimately _pointless_ mess would be something of an understatement.

Among the film's the more obvious problems....

1. The whole "edgy Millennial superheroes" angle is awkward and unnecessary. Any serious exploration of the concept is dropped almost as soon as it is brought up for that exact reason. Just about the only thing it contributes to the film (besides a weird and rather laughable introduction to Reed Richards - a.k.a. Mr Fantastic - as a 10 or 12 year old boy genius capable of building a prototype matter teleporter in his garage out of spare parts) is a heavy handed speech about the power of the new generation to "save the world" given by a token mentor figure early in the film that comes completely out of nowhere. It also provides a convenient - though largely only implied - excuse for Doom's brooding nihilism and violent anti-authoritarian tendencies.

2. This film's script _desperately_ needed to be streamlined, if not rewritten entirely. There are elements that work here and there, but the plot spends way, waaaay too much time and energy on some subjects, while skimping on others. This results in character motivations - and even personalities, to a certain extent - which tend to be vaguely defined at best, and outright nonsensical at worst. Awkwardly inserted conflicts which are left largely unresolved, in addition to numerous time wasting plot cul de sacs (along with accompanying plot holes), abound throughout the film as well.

3. As a result of #2, the climax feels so rushed, awkward, and underdeveloped as to be simply cringeworthy. It literally lasts all of about 15 to 20 minutes, and arrives almost out of no where on the heels of more than an hour of tediously meandering origin story. "Dr Doom" is really given no time whatsoever to be built up as a menacing villain. He just pops up after being absent for more than 45 minutes (mind you, his last appearance before this point having him be nothing more than a slightly dickish twenty-something scientist, rather than a monster, with no transition in between), kills a few people with his new powers, fights the heroes for a bit, and is dispatched. That's it.

4. Oh! And the special effects weren't even good. The "Invisible Woman's" force fields in particular just looked like complete ass. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





*Overall: 3.5 out of 10*

I could have forgiven a lot of the problems in this film if it were at least building up to a worthwhile villain or climax. However, this cinematic abortion couldn't even deliver that much.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

I skimmed over your review..I was wondering how they reconciled that the negro and the white chick were supposed to be brother and sister? If I remember right...it's been a long time since I read any comic books...but they were originally brother/sister...
On another note..there's going to be a new james bond soon...and he's going to be a negro this time

the social marxists are in hyperdrive....


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## Sgt_Gath (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> I skimmed over your review..I was wondering how they reconciled that the negro and the white chick were supposed to be brother and sister? If I remember right...it's been a long time since I read any comic books...but they were originally brother/sister...
> On another note..there's going to be a new james bond soon...and he's going to be a negro this time
> 
> the social marxists are in hyperdrive....



The blonde girl's adopted, from Slovakia (or Bosnia, I forget which), apparently.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

LMAO...negroes adopted a blonde white girl.....Like THAT'S plausible...lucky she survived to adulthood...
the social marxists are hard at work cramming that sheit down people's throats....


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> LMAO...negroes adopted a blonde white girl.....Like THAT'S plausible...lucky she survived to adulthood...
> the social marxists are hard at work cramming that sheit down people's throats....



why do you feel the need to inject race into this conversation.  

Anyway, I've heard this movie was really bad because apparenlty the director had one vision and the studio - Fox - had another.  There were a lot of reshoots, involving the lead actress to get a wig to make her look consistant with the earlier footage.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Rotagilla said:
> 
> 
> > LMAO...negroes adopted a blonde white girl.....Like THAT'S plausible...lucky she survived to adulthood...
> ...



why did the producers of the movie have change the characters to inject race into the story..and in such an implausible way...negroes adopted a white girl...LMAO..

I wonder who the producer was...I wonder what his last name is...


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## Harry Dresden (Aug 22, 2015)

this is what happens when Marvel does not have control and the people that do have control have to make it politically correct.....


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## Unkotare (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> I skimmed over your review..I was wondering how they reconciled that the negro and the white chick were supposed to be brother and sister? If I remember right...it's been a long time since I read any comic books...but they were originally brother/sister...
> On another note..there's going to be a new james bond soon...and he's going to be a negro this time
> ....




Do you get a tingle every time you type the word "negro," asswipe? Grow the fuck up already.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

one of the guys who wrote the screenplay's last name is "Kinberg"
interesting..a member of the tribe pushing his anti white ideology...


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## aaronleland (Aug 22, 2015)

Without Rotagilla's blatant racism... making the Human Torch black was retarded.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> [
> 
> why did the producers of the movie have change the characters to inject race into the story..and in such an implausible way...negroes adopted a white girl...LMAO..
> 
> I wonder who the producer was...I wonder what his last name is...



Why would that be implausible?  I mean, I know it would make you nuts. 

Heck, htey re-imagined Nick Fury as a black guy, and that was fine.  



Harry Dresden said:


> this is what happens when Marvel does not have control and the people that do have control have to make it politically correct.....



I agree Fox didn't know what they were doing with this movie, but it had little to do with Political Correctness.  

I think overall, you have people involved who don't really know the source material, which is why they end up making crap. 

I think the other problem is the Source Material itself isn't all that.  the FF just aren't that compelling. They hold a certain affection with Comic Nerds as they were the beginning of the Marvel Universe.  (Where Reed Richards original plan was to beat the Russians into space.) 

They've made three attempts with this franchise, the Roger Corman 1990 movie, the Jessica Alba disaster, and now this.  All of them kind of suck.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

aaronleland said:


> Without Rotagilla's blatant racism... making the Human Torch black was retarded.



I think on a list of this films sins, that is still pretty far down on the list.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

joeb131 said:
			
		

> Heck, htey re-imagined Nick Fury as a black guy, and that was fine.


I disagree.
Who said so?.... and what is the purpose of displacing whites in those roles? "Diversity"?.."empowerment"? "inclusiveness"?
more social marxism.





JoeB131 said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> > Without Rotagilla's blatant racism... making the Human Torch black was retarded.
> ...



so if I said it was wrong to replace a white actor in a role that was historically a white person, I'm a "racist"...but if you say it was wrong it's because you have such refined tastes and are a film connoisseur..

How about a movie about the u.s. where all major roles are played by negroes? washington, jefferson, adams, hancock, etc..That would be believeable, right?
comical.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> I disagree.
> Who said so?.... and what is the purpose of displacing whites in those roles? "Diversity"?.."empowerment"? "inclusiveness"?
> more social marxism.



Mostly, it's more to do with putting asses into seats.  And frankly, some people will only put their ass in a seat if the person on the screen is someone they can identify with.  

Case in point. the actor playing the Torch in this film has been in a lot of very popular movies. He's a big box office draw and the calculation was that a certain percentage of the audience would come just to see him, even if they didn't give a flip about the Fantastic Four.  



Rotagilla said:


> so if I said it was wrong to replace a white actor in a role that was historically a white person, I'm a "racist"...but if you say it was wrong it's because you have such refined tastes and are a film connoisseur..
> 
> How about a movie about the u.s. where all major roles are played by negroes? washington, jefferson, adams, hancock, etc..That would be believeable, right?
> comical.



We aren't talking about a historical character, we are talking about fictional character who can light himself on fire.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Rotagilla said:
> 
> 
> > I disagree.
> ...


re read it.
I didn't say a "historic figure"..I said a role that was 'historically" played by a white actor.


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## Harry Dresden (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Rotagilla said:
> 
> 
> > I disagree.
> ...


and who had been a blonde white guy for 50 years....there are now plenty of black super heroes Joe,there was no need to make the torch black,just to try and appease a segment of the population,which is what they were trying to do....on this new Supergirl TV show Jimmy Olson is now a black guy,whats the point if not trying to be PC?.......


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> re read it.
> I didn't say a "historic figure"..I said a role that was 'historically" played by a white actor.



Only one other actor has played this character (the Human Torch)  in an officially released movie.  So it's not like "historical" means "that other guy". 

Now for Nick Fury... the only other actor to play him was David Hasselhoff. Somehow I think Samuel L. Jackson is a much cooler Nick Fury than the Hoff!


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## Iceweasel (Aug 22, 2015)

Hollywood spends its' money on special effects, not writers. A sad commentary of today's culture.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Harry Dresden said:


> and who had been a blonde white guy for 50 years....there are now plenty of black super heroes Joe,there was no need to make the torch black,just to try and appease a segment of the population,which is what they were trying to do....on this new Supergirl TV show Jimmy Olson is now a black guy,whats the point if not trying to be PC?.......



by that logic, we should write the characters EXACTLY the same way they were written 50 years ago, then? 

I don't think they were trying to appease anyone except maybe the terms ofa contract they had with this actor to put him in so many major movies.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Iceweasel said:


> Hollywood spends its' money on special effects, not writers. A sad commentary of today's culture.



Did you hear the one about the Polish Starlet?  She was so dumb she slept with the writer!


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Rotagilla said:
> 
> 
> > re read it.
> ...


fantastic four "existed" for decades before anyone thought of making a movie....and none of them were "black".

How about this; a movie about MLK but he's played by a white man?

Maybe a movie about obama with a white man and woman playing him and michelle?


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## Harry Dresden (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Rotagilla said:
> ...


and that has a dam history.....as far as i am concerned if they cant take a subject matter,in this case a comic book, that has a history and do it the way it was then dont do it at all......if they tell you before hand that they are doing a what if? or a comedy version....that may be different story.....


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > and who had been a blonde white guy for 50 years....there are now plenty of black super heroes Joe,there was no need to make the torch black,just to try and appease a segment of the population,which is what they were trying to do....on this new Supergirl TV show Jimmy Olson is now a black guy,whats the point if not trying to be PC?.......
> ...



not one white actor in hollywood was good enough or available so they were just forced to use a black person?
c'mon, man...don't pretend you don't see the cultural marxism in recasting tradtional white roles with black actors...it isn't by chance...

again I point out one of the writers name is "Kinberg"....maybe he has an agenda?...


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Iceweasel said:
> 
> 
> > Hollywood spends its' money on special effects, not writers. A sad commentary of today's culture.
> ...



what? are you a misogynist?...you hate polish people? Are you saying polish people are dumb?..or women are dumb?...or polish females are dumb?

I'm kidding but you see the point, I'm sure...


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## Harry Dresden (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > and who had been a blonde white guy for 50 years....there are now plenty of black super heroes Joe,there was no need to make the torch black,just to try and appease a segment of the population,which is what they were trying to do....on this new Supergirl TV show Jimmy Olson is now a black guy,whats the point if not trying to be PC?.......
> ...


*by that logic, we should write the characters EXACTLY the same way they were written 50 years ago, then? *
the comic has a history Joe,like i said there are plenty of black super heroes now,no need to change the race of one to try and look like they are trying to be inclusive,if there were no black ones i can understand the why of it,but you cant say that anymore....but im a comic purest,if you dont do it right,then dont do it.....
*I don't think they were trying to appease anyone except maybe the terms ofa contract they had with this actor to put him in so many major movies*
come on Joe, so they dont have other vehicles to put the guy in?....


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## mudwhistle (Aug 22, 2015)

Al Sharpton must have writ this motherfucker.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> fantastic four "existed" for decades before anyone thought of making a movie....and none of them were "black".
> 
> How about this; a movie about MLK but he's played by a white man?
> 
> Maybe a movie about obama with a white man and woman playing him and michelle?



Actually, they've already had a white actor playing Obama on SNL.  



Rotagilla said:


> not one white actor in hollywood was good enough or available so they were just forced to use a black person?
> c'mon, man...don't pretend you don't see the cultural marxism in recasting tradtional white roles with black actors...it isn't by chance...
> 
> again I point out one of the writers name is "Kinberg"....maybe he has an agenda?...



I'm sure they were forced by the studio for ECONOMIC reasons of wanting to attract a wider audience.   

This movie was made for all the wrong reasons.  It was made not because there was a clamoring for this film, but so Fox could hold on to the rights.   The same reason why Sony is going to reboot Spider-Man again.  (Stop Killing Uncle Ben, Dammit!  Just stop!) 



Rotagilla said:


> what? are you a misogynist?...you hate polish people? Are you saying polish people are dumb?..or women are dumb?...or polish females are dumb?
> 
> I'm kidding but you see the point, I'm sure...



That you don't have a sense of humor. 

Do you know how many Polish Jokes there are?  Just two. The rest are true stories.


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

Thanks for the polite conversation...enjoyed talking to you joe.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 22, 2015)

Harry Dresden said:


> *by that logic, we should write the characters EXACTLY the same way they were written 50 years ago, then? *
> the comic has a history Joe,like i said there are plenty of black super heroes now,no need to change the race of one to try and look like they are trying to be inclusive,if there were no black ones i can understand the why of it,but you cant say that anymore....but im a comic purest,if you dont do it right,then dont do it.....
> *I don't think they were trying to appease anyone except maybe the terms ofa contract they had with this actor to put him in so many major movies*
> come on Joe, so they dont have other vehicles to put the guy in?....



Here's what I think the problem is, and it doesn't apply to just Comic book movies but Star Trek and a lot of other Sci-Fi. 

There are alot of people who see comic book movies who aren't comic book nerds. they've never read an issueof the Fantastic Four comic.  If they know these characters at all, it's from movies or cartoons. (Remember that one from the 1970's that replaced the Human Torch with a robot named "Robbie". )  

Frankly, I have a lot more problems with the X-Men movies than this one.  I think they bastardized those characters and took really good stories and flubbed them. (Especially the Dark Phoenix Saga.)


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## Sgt_Gath (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> one of the guys who wrote the screenplay's last name is "Kinberg"
> interesting..a member of the tribe pushing his anti white ideology...





JoeB131 said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> > Without Rotagilla's blatant racism... making the Human Torch black was retarded.
> ...



I actually didn't have a problem with the actor they chose. They gave him some legitimately funny lines, and he had more personality than either Sue or Reed.

Honestly, I think the deeper problem with the entire film's entire concept was that it simply felt the need to mess with things that didn't need to be messed with. It wound up overcomplicating the story and straining its own believability in the process.

In that regard, I actually had a MUCH bigger problem with how they handled Reed Richard's character. The whole "boy genius" thing just felt like a bad, overly-cliche joke.

I came to watch the Fantastic Four, not freaking Dexter's Laboratory. Lol


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## Rotagilla (Aug 22, 2015)

fair enough. Thanks for the polite conversation. Appreciate it.


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## Unkotare (Aug 22, 2015)

Rotagilla said:


> one of the guys who wrote the screenplay's last name is "Kinberg"
> interesting..a member of the tribe pushing his anti white ideology...



What the hell is wrong with you?


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## Harry Dresden (Aug 22, 2015)

JoeB131 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > *by that logic, we should write the characters EXACTLY the same way they were written 50 years ago, then? *
> ...


. 
bottom line the movie is considered a box office bomb...


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## Montrovant (Aug 27, 2015)

Sgt_Gath said:


> Rotagilla said:
> 
> 
> > one of the guys who wrote the screenplay's last name is "Kinberg"
> ...



I mostly agree with you, but really, I think the problem wasn't over-complication but the opposite, over-simplification.  So much of the characters remained unexplored and the plot was so vague and ill-defined at times that it felt as though the movie should have been an hour longer.  It needed more background, more depth, more exploration of the personalities and motivations of the characters.  Dr. Doom was almost entirely unknown, as was the power behind the transformation of the heroes and Doom.  Richards running away and basically hiding for, what was it, a year?  Grimm's hatred of Richards suddenly disappearing?  Susan not even going on the trip yet also getting powers?  There were so many things left unexplained the movie felt incredibly empty.

Having Johnny Storm as a black guy might be jarring for a fan of the comics, but really, not that big a deal.  Having Susan be adopted doesn't hurt the overall story of the FF.  It's not a necessary thing either way.  Particularly in this movie, where the characters are so poorly developed, it was unimportant.  Had he been the white, biological brother of Susan it would not have helped at all.

I thought the movie was not as bad as the reviews it has gotten indicated.  This wasn't painful to watch so much as an amazing waste of time.  It wasn't bad, it was hollow.


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