# Colin Powell has endorsed Obama for President



## Silence (Oct 19, 2008)

According to MSNBC, this morning on Meet the Press Gen Colin Powell will endorse Barack Obama for President of the United States!

That is incredible and will certainly silence (no pun) a lot of the "he's too risky" bullshit coming from McCain & Co.  

I was hoping for this since Colin Powell is probably the ONLY Republican I'd ever vote for!


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## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

Nice. 

But how could a decorated vietnam vet, respected Republican, and former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs support a secret radical muslim socialist, who pals around with terrorists?


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

Powell should be led before a firing squad and shot to death for his role in getting tens of thousands of US soldiers killed, maimed, and critically wounded with false "evidence" he KNEW was false.

SO, the Powell fraud endorses the Obama fraud .. big deal .. America still loses


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## Annie (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> According to MSNBC, this morning on Meet the Press Gen Colin Powell will endorse Barack Obama for President of the United States!
> 
> That is incredible and will certainly silence (no pun) a lot of the "he's too risky" bullshit coming from McCain & Co.
> 
> I was hoping for this since Colin Powell is probably the ONLY Republican I'd ever vote for!



How much 'courage' does it take to endorse the person most likely to win? Do you think Powell would have done this if McCain was ahead? Pretty hard sell, since it may have mattered much more to Powell/Obama supporters back when he was taking a pounding from Hillary.


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## rayboyusmc (Oct 19, 2008)

No, America loses the most if McCain wins.  There is a difference between the too.  That is why I can't understand ever not voting.  

But that is just my opinion.


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## rayboyusmc (Oct 19, 2008)

So we have heard our first disparaging word?



> How much 'courage' does it take to endorse the person most likely to win? Do you think Powell would have done this if McCain was ahead? Pretty hard sell, since it may have mattered much more to Powell/Obama supporters back when he was taking a pounding from Hillary.



Maybe, now that he sees to what extent the Palin/McCain ticket will stoop, he felt he needed to stand up and redeem himself for having been with the Asses of Evil.


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## Silence (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> Powell should be led before a firing squad and shot to death for his role in getting tens of thousands of US soldiers killed, maimed, and critically wounded with false "evidence" he KNEW was false.
> 
> SO, the Powell fraud endorses the Obama fraud .. big deal .. America still loses



wow.  you're insane



> How much 'courage' does it take to endorse the person most likely to win? Do you think Powell would have done this if McCain was ahead? Pretty hard sell, since it may have mattered much more to Powell/Obama supporters back when he was taking a pounding from Hillary.



perhaps instead of just throwing his endorsement out there without much reflection, he waited and actually weighed the candidates carefully.  Novel concept I know, someone who actually THINKS before he acts.  Something Obama and Powell seem to have in common.

and yes, I do think Powell would've endorsed Obama if McCain were ahead, especially if he were ahead having used the nasty, negative tactics he's employed recently.  

I'm quite sure this will cause no small amount of distress to the conversative republicans.  Although I'm sure there will be those who will now summarily dismiss this American Hero as a traitor and anti-american.


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> wow.  you're insane



When you can figure out how to counter an argument without smelling like a right-winger and using their brain-dead tactics .. come see me

Let me guess .. you claimed you were against the Iraq invasion.


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## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

rayboyusmc said:


> No, America loses the most if McCain wins.  There is a difference between the too.  That is why I can't understand ever not voting.
> 
> But that is just my opinion.



I suspect because he's black, this endorsement won't matter much, except with some military votes and some repubs that respect/like powell.

Ps.  I went to a wedding last night.  2 repubs tried to argue for mccain.  We totally made them look wrong.

They tried to say it doesn't matter, so we listed a bunch of diference.  Tax breaks to companies going overseas, $10 bill a month spending in iraq, spending.

I love when they say they worry obama won't be able to do everything he says he'll do.  So we pointed out mccains plan  makes even less sense.

And they tried to distance themselves from bush, but then that would assume mccain is any different on major policies.

Ok, now after listening to cnn, this endorsement may be huge.  

All you republicans out there that said you would vote for powell or condy, I guess that means you respect his opinion?


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> I suspect because he's black, this endorsement won't matter much, except with some military votes and some repubs that respect/like powell.
> 
> Ps.  I went to a wedding last night.  2 repubs tried to argue for mccain.  We totally made them look wrong.
> 
> ...



Surely you didn't actually believe them when they said they'd vote for Powell or Rice.


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## rayboyusmc (Oct 19, 2008)

There will some honest Republicans (not those who worship at the altar of the Bush NeoCon Idol) who will now vote for Obama.  The real republican party has been hi-jacked by the extreme right and doesn't reflect what their party once stood for.

This is a big endorsement no matter what the right says.

When the real conservative pundits and now Powell won't back up McCain and his Sarah Doll, that is telling evidence.

Now if we can sweep this election in the Whitehouse, Congress and Senate and then have Dems who don't act like Repubs, we might be able to get back on America's real course.

No spying on all of US, No condoning torture for convenience. No tax cuts for the rich and screw the middle class.  No wars for the sake of making a lot of fucking money and killing our troops in the process.  No socializing of banks. (That ones is for you, Ali. Bush already started that.)etc. etc. etc.


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## MichaelCollins (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> ]wow.  you're insane[/B]
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Is that better or worse than being a gullible fool like yourself?

Of course Powell was part of the BUSHTEAM liars...and should always be shamed as such.


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

MichaelCollins said:


> Is that better or worse than being a gullible fool like yourself?
> 
> Of course Powell was part of the BUSHTEAM liars...and should always be shamed as such.



What forever amazes me is the number of people who call themselves "antiwar" and shout and scream at Bush .. but absolve Powell of his complicity in the worst military and political disaster in American history.

They call that bullshit .. progressive.

go figure


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## editec (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Nice.
> 
> But how could a decorated vietnam vet, respected Republican, and former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs support a secret radical muslim socialist, who pals around with terrorists?


 
You need to be careful when you post things like that.

If you push that technique too hard, your tongue acually can explode right through your cheek.


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## editec (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> What forever amazes me is the number of people who call themselves "antiwar" and shout and scream at Bush .. but absolve Powell of his complicity in the worst military and political disaster in American history.
> 
> They call that bullshit .. progressive.
> 
> go figure


 
You know normally I'd agree with you on this point, BAC.

But Collin Powell was so contrite and so candid about how betrayed he'd been; his condemnations of the current administration and his role in it, too, were so damning, when he could have simply kept quiet, that I'm inclined to think him a man driven by an high ethical code.

When I tally up all the anti-war Dems who voted to go to war, I find few of them who didn't try to absolve themsevles completely of their responsibility for it.

Collins calls his moment when he testified before the UN on behalf of going to war, the lowpoint of his career, and one for which he can never excuse himself.

Please show me ANY DEMOCRAP who voted for the war, who has accepted that level of personal guilt for their part in the war.

There are none that I know of.

They ALL absolve themselves of their part by saying they were lied to.

Collin Powell strikes me as a true man of honor.

There are damned few people in the public arena that I can say that about.

Collin Powell is one of those Republicans that I often allude to as being truly patriotic and thoughly decent people.

Sadly, few such Republicans (or Dems for that matter)  ever seem to attain any power in this painfully corrupted society we live in.


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## PeterS (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Nice.
> 
> But how could a decorated vietnam vet, respected Republican, and former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs support a secret radical muslim socialist, who pals around with terrorists?



Maybe because he thinks he will make the best president. Scary, huh!


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## Silence (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> When you can figure out how to counter an argument without smelling like a right-winger and using their brain-dead tactics .. come see me



are you actually claiming I'm a right winger?  seriously?  you might want to look around here before you assume you know someone's political views.  I'm for abortion, for gun control, and various other "left wing" ideas.  

I've never voted for a Republican president so please explain to me how I'm a right winger Black?  



> Let me guess .. you claimed you were against the Iraq invasion.



and yes, I was against the Iraq war.  I'm generally speaking, against ALL war since I'd consider myself to be a pacifist.  

Colin Powell is a man of deep integrity IMO and high intelligence.  He, I think, believed in the intelligence he presented for the case for war.  I don't think he was in on the lies and manipulations, but rather was lied to and manipulated by the Bush administration and used to make the case BECAUSE of the respect the American people had for him. 

He took the hit for the Bush administration and I think that was their plan all along.   



> I suspect because he's black, this endorsement won't matter much, except with some military votes and some repubs that respect/like powell.



Powell has an 80% favorable rating with Americans according to Gallup.  To insinuate that his endorsement is somehow lessened because he's black is just idiotic but not unexpected from you sealy.  You make some of the most outlandish remarks and you actually, at times, make me ashamed that we are on the same side.  



> but absolve Powell of his complicity in the worst military and political disaster in American history.



I don't absolve Powell of anything.  He fucked up.  But like I said I believe he was used by the Bush Administration.


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## PeterS (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> According to MSNBC, this morning on Meet the Press Gen Colin Powell will endorse Barack Obama for President of the United States!
> 
> That is incredible and will certainly silence (no pun) a lot of the "he's too risky" bullshit coming from McCain & Co.
> 
> I was hoping for this since Colin Powell is probably the ONLY Republican I'd ever vote for!



Powell is solid center right. This is the last nail in McCains coffin...


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## PeterS (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> are you actually claiming I'm a right winger?  seriously?  you might want to look around here before you assume you know someone's political views.  I'm for abortion, for gun control, and various other "left wing" ideas.



That kind of ideological confusion certainly explains all the problems in the republican party. But that's ok Silence. I'm a liberal and I accept you anyway...


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## rayboyusmc (Oct 19, 2008)

> "And I come to the conclusion that because of his ability to inspire, because of the inclusive nature of his campaign, because he is reaching out all across America, because of who he is and his rhetorical abilities  and you have to take that into account  as well as his substance  he has both style and substance, he has met the standard of being a successful president, being an exceptional president."
> 
> Powell said that he is "troubled" by the direction of the Republican Party, and said he began to doubt Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) when he chose Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as his running mate.
> 
> ...



He was too kind in her description of Sister Sarah.

Powell endorses Obama as &#39;transformational&#39; - Yahoo! News


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## Silence (Oct 19, 2008)

PeterS said:


> That kind of ideological confusion certainly explains all the problems in the republican party. But that's ok Silence. I'm a liberal and I accept you anyway...



Thanks Peter... I appreciate it


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## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

rayboyusmc said:


> There will some honest Republicans (not those who worship at the altar of the Bush NeoCon Idol) who will now vote for Obama.  The real republican party has been hi-jacked by the extreme right and doesn't reflect what their party once stood for.
> 
> This is a big endorsement no matter what the right says.
> 
> ...



Are you saying america needs real republicans for democrats to sweep the government, but that once in control they should not act like republicans? <scratch head>


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> are you actually claiming I'm a right winger?  seriously?  you might want to look around here before you assume you know someone's political views.  I'm for abortion, for gun control, and various other "left wing" ideas.
> 
> I've never voted for a Republican president so please explain to me how I'm a right winger Black?



I never claimed you were a right-winger my brother. I've read your posts.

What I said was that you used the tactics of a right-winger in just screaming "I'm insane" rather than debating your point .. which I know you are fully capable of.



> and yes, I was against the Iraq war.  I'm generally speaking, against ALL war since I'd consider myself to be a pacifist.



My point exactly .. how do you reconcile being against the war .. even being a pacifist .. yet being so in love with the very asshole who went before the UN with false evidence HE KNEW WAS FALSE .. and would result in terrible death and destruction? 



> Colin Powell is a man of deep integrity IMO and high intelligence.  He, I think, believed in the intelligence he presented for the case for war.  I don't think he was in on the lies and manipulations, but rather was lied to and manipulated by the Bush administration and used to make the case BECAUSE of the respect the American people had for him.
> 
> He took the hit for the Bush administration and I think that was their plan all along.



Then you neither know Colon Powell or are you aware of his involvement in the deception.

*Now He Tells Us*
Now Powell Tells Us

A man of integrity????

*Colin Powell: don't ask about my lai, don't tell about iran-contra*
disinformation | colin powell: don't ask about my lai, don't tell about iran-contra

Powell's rapid rise up the ranks came because he proved that he has no integrity, backbone, or principles, and he would do anything he's told to do.



> Powell has an 80% favorable rating with Americans according to Gallup.  To insinuate that his endorsement is somehow lessened because he's black is just idiotic but not unexpected from you sealy.  You make some of the most outlandish remarks and you actually, at times, make me ashamed that we are on the same side.



You should be ashamed that you once again, appear to be a closet right-winger because you love their tactics ..

*POST WHERE I SUPPOSEDLY SAID THAT POWELL'S ENDORSEMENT IS LESSENED BECAUSE HE'S BLACK*

If you can't post it, then you're a liar .. and make no mistake about it .. you and I ARE NOT on the same side.



> I don't absolve Powell of anything.  He fucked up.  But like I said I believe he was used by the Bush Administration.



YES, the fuck you did absolve Powell of everything .. even though his putrid ass was front and center to the invasion of Iraq.


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## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> What forever amazes me is the number of people who call themselves "antiwar" and shout and scream at Bush .. but absolve Powell of his complicity in the worst military and political disaster in American history.
> 
> They call that bullshit .. progressive.
> 
> go figure



Its the Nuremburg Principle.   

Powell wasn't an architect of this war, there's no evidence that he was involved in cooking up bogus intelligence, and behind the scenes all evidence points to the fact that Powell was trying to talk bush out of invading. 

Yes, he's guilty of complicity and weakness.  He's an asshole on a whole front of issues. 

But the people that should be rotting in prison in the Hague are the architects,  Cheney, Bush, Wolfowitz, Hadley, and the NeoCons who proactively engaged in deception and lies. 


Silence is a Liberal by the way.


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## Silence (Oct 19, 2008)

black as coal, first I'd be a sister not a brother since I'm female 

I said you were insane for saying that Powell should be taken before a firing squad.  Talk about militant and dangerous.  

I believe Powell should be held accountable for his actions IF he knew that the intelligence was faulty, however, I don't believe he knew.  I believe he was manipulated by the Bush Administration to push their agenda for war.  He was their fall guy so to speak.  



> You should be ashamed that you once again, appear to be a closet right-winger because you love their tactics ..
> 
> POST WHERE I SUPPOSEDLY SAID THAT POWELL'S ENDORSEMENT IS LESSENED BECAUSE HE'S BLACK



learn to read you dumbfuck.  I was talking to sealybobo not YOU.  you are a reactionary fucktard who wants to argue and you'll argue with anyone, regardless of whether it's warranted or not.  

Good luck with that.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Nice.
> 
> But how could a decorated vietnam vet, respected Republican, and former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs support a secret radical muslim socialist, who pals around with terrorists?



His wife made him do it.


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## The Paperboy (Oct 19, 2008)

Poor, poor Colin, being misled once again:

[youtube]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/IYBA9JD5oW4&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/IYBA9JD5oW4&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/youtube]


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## Silence (Oct 19, 2008)

it's just my opinion Black... you don't have to agree with it.

Powell had shown himself, prior to the Iraq war, to be a man of deep integrity.  He resigned from the Bush Administration when it was revealed that the intelligence was faulty.  I believe he did that because he felt they had used him.  

I'm not privy to inside information so I am not stating this as fact, just speculation based on years of following this man and his actions.


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> According to MSNBC, this morning on Meet the Press Gen Colin Powell will endorse Barack Obama for President of the United States!
> 
> That is incredible and will certainly silence (no pun) a lot of the "he's too risky" bullshit coming from McCain & Co.
> 
> I was hoping for this since Colin Powell is probably the ONLY Republican I'd ever vote for!



I saw this morning myself and was very glad to hear so.

Another huge endorsement for Obama.


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> Powell should be led before a firing squad and shot to death for his role in getting tens of thousands of US soldiers killed, maimed, and critically wounded with false "evidence" he KNEW was false.
> 
> SO, the Powell fraud endorses the Obama fraud .. big deal .. America still loses



Uh, tens of thousands of US soldiers have been killed in Iraq?

This is news to me.

Wounded and maimed perhaps but killed?


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## The Paperboy (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> it's just my opinion Black... you don't have to agree with it.
> 
> Powell had shown himself, prior to the Iraq war, to be a man of deep integrity.  He resigned from the Bush Administration when it was revealed that the intelligence was faulty.  I believe he did that because he felt they had used him.
> 
> I'm not privy to inside information so I am not stating this as fact, just speculation based on years of following this man and his actions.



I agree with you.

Let's point out the CIA Director, George Tenet, was a Clinton appointee and said the WMD intelligence  was a "slam dunk".

So how come Powell gets a  pass for being duped by Tenet but Bush does not?


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

The Paperboy said:


> I agree with you.
> 
> Let's point out the CIA Director, George Tenet, was a Clinton appointee and said the WMD intelligence  was a "slam dunk".
> 
> So how come Powell gets a  pass for being duped by Tenet but Bush does not?



Republican Tactics 101: Someone makes a endorsement towards the opponent, even if they are the same side as you; destroy their character.


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## Paulie (Oct 19, 2008)

PeterS said:


> That kind of ideological confusion certainly explains all the problems in the republican party. But that's ok Silence. I'm a liberal and I accept you anyway...



You aren't getting it.  She is a liberal democrat.  That's what she's trying to tell you idiots.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Republican Tactics 101: Someone makes a endorsement towards the opponent, even if they are the same side as you; destroy their character.



Well DOH-----if someone is gonig to use their characture as a reason to vote for someone I think they have pretty much opened the door for valid criticism.


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Its the Nuremburg Principle.
> 
> Powell wasn't an architect of this war, there's no evidence that he was involved in cooking up bogus intelligence, and behind the scenes all evidence points to the fact that Powell was trying to talk bush out of invading.
> 
> ...



Powell didn't invent the war, but he knew it was based on lies and deceptions .. AND, *he was silent* .. and he's not a liberal .. which kinda' blows your theory.

Liberals are however, weak as mud.


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## The Paperboy (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Republican Tactics 101: Someone makes a endorsement towards the opponent, even if they are the same side as you; destroy their character.



Are you impaired in some way?  I agreed with the poster regarding Powell's integrity, etc. I simply pointed out that Powell is given a pass on accepting faulty intelligence from Clinton appointee Tenet but Bush is not.


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Well DOH-----if someone is gonig to use their characture as a reason to vote for someone I think they have pretty much opened the door for valid criticism.



Do you notice the amount of hypocrisy in that post?

If he endorsed John McCain, you'd be talking about how great Colin Powell is and what a great decision he made.


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

The Paperboy said:


> Are you impaired in some way?  I agreed with the poster regarding Powell's integrity, etc. I simply pointed out that Powell is given a pass on accepting faulty intelligence from Clinton appointee Tenet but Bush is not.



Didn't mean to quote you, that was in response to some of Dillo's comments in a locked thread.


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## rayboyusmc (Oct 19, 2008)

> Liberals are however, weak as mud.



Don't bet on that based on what you see from some of our "elected" officials.  You might be suprised.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Do you notice the amount of hypocrisy in that post?
> 
> If he endorsed John McCain, you'd be talking about how great Colin Powell is and what a great decision he made.



I hate McCain you idiot. and no--- I would be saying the exact same thing.
Anyone who endorses someone else opens themself up to valid criticism.


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

editec said:


> You know normally I'd agree with you on this point, BAC.
> 
> But Collin Powell was so contrite and so candid about how betrayed he'd been; his condemnations of the current administration and his role in it, too, were so damning, when he could have simply kept quiet, that I'm inclined to think him a man driven by an high ethical code.
> 
> ...



Please read the links on Powell I've already posted .. then come back and explain your "man of honor" .. who sat back and watched innocent people die when HE KNEW they were dying for a lie. Please explain how you get "honor" out of that my brother?


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## PeterS (Oct 19, 2008)

Paulitics said:


> You aren't getting it.  She is a liberal democrat.  That's what she's trying to tell you idiots.



You're kidding me! Jesus, I am so embarrassed in not recognizing a fellow liberal. Silly me...


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> I hate McCain you idiot. and no--- I would be saying the exact same thing.
> Anyone who endorses someone else opens themself up to valid criticism.



So who would you be voting for this election season Dillo? You could hate McCain but still be voting for him. Hell, until Sawwah came along that's how half his supporters felt.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Well DOH-----if someone is gonig to use their characture as a reason to vote for someone I think they have pretty much opened the door for valid criticism.


I guess so but Powell made his decision not based on party and he is good friends with McCain, he went with the better candidates in his mind. The guys has made mistakes but maybe he learned what it is like to endorse the wrong person!


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

rayboyusmc said:


> Don't bet on that based on what you see from some of our "elected" officials.  You might be suprised.



I base it on my life experience and history my brother

It's the very reason I do not call myself a liberal .. many of whom were so terrified of republican attacks on "liberals" they started calling themselves "progressives"

This very issue is indicative of liberal weakness


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> So who would you be voting for this election season Dillo? You could hate McCain but still be voting for him. Hell, until Sawwah came along that's how half his supporters felt.



Wrong--again. I'm going to be honest this election. I will vote for who I think will be the best president--not who the democrats and republicans say will be the best president. Why does the concept of non-partisan confuse the hell out of you ?


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## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> I hate McCain you idiot. and no--- I would be saying the exact same thing.
> Anyone who endorses someone else opens themself up to valid criticism.



And invalid criticism too.  The fact you assume he's doing it because of race is insane!

He's a true conservative.  What does that tell me?  That says he woke up and realizes that the gop aren't  conservative.  They are corrupt to the core.  

And, this endorsement totally says the lie about obama being an extreme left liberal is BULLSHIT!  Do you honestly think a conservative like powell would endorse a far left liberal?  Just because he's half black?  Is that true about condy too?  What happened to you guys who said you would vote for powell?  If you changed your mind over this endorsement then maybe your judgement is in question?  Or maybe powell is right and you are wrong.


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## The Paperboy (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Didn't mean to quote you, that was in response to some of Dillo's comments in a locked thread.



Fair enough. No worries.


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## jschuck12001 (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> I base it on my life experience and history my brother
> 
> It's the very reason I do not call myself a liberal .. many of whom were so terrified of republican attacks on "liberals" they started calling themselves "progressives"
> 
> This very issue is indicative of liberal weakness



What is it that makes you call liberals "weak", whats your basis for that opinion?


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> And invalid criticism too.  The fact you assume he's doing it because of race is insane!
> 
> He's a true conservative.  What does that tell me?  That says he woke up and realizes that the gop aren't  conservative.  They are corrupt to the core.
> 
> And, this endorsement totally says the lie about obama being an extreme left liberal is BULLSHIT!  Do you honestly think a conservative like powell would endorse a far left liberal?  Just because he's half black?  Is that true about condy too?  What happened to you guys who said you would vote for powell?  If you changed your mind over this endorsement then maybe your judgement is in question?  Or maybe powell is right and you are wrong.



I never said he endorsed Obama because of his race. Please learn to read Bobo.


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

Silence said:


> black as coal, first I'd be a sister not a brother since I'm female



A thousand pardons my sister.



> I said you were insane for saying that Powell should be taken before a firing squad.  Talk about militant and dangerous.



Militant is not dangerous my sister .. rights are ONLY determined by what you can demand.

And I know for fact there are families of dead US soldiers killed in Iraq who feel the exact same way I do about Powell .. fortunately for me, my daughter is still alive



> I believe Powell should be held accountable for his actions IF he knew that the intelligence was faulty, however, I don't believe he knew.  I believe he was manipulated by the Bush Administration to push their agenda for war.  He was their fall guy so to speak.



SO .. let me get this right .. his own words weren't convincing enough for you?

He was the fucking SOS and HE KNEW the evidence he was presenting to the UN was doctored and his own State Department didn't agree with it. 



> learn to read you dumbfuck.  I was talking to sealybobo not YOU.  you are a reactionary fucktard who wants to argue and you'll argue with anyone, regardless of whether it's warranted or not.
> 
> Good luck with that.



Dumbfuck?

Pardon me ma'am, but you posted what you were supposedly posting to someone else right in the middle of what you posted to me without ever mentioning someone else's name.

If I post to you I make so it's clear that it is you I am talking to and don't stick comments to someone else in that post.

However, I apologize


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Wrong--again. I'm going to be honest this election. I will vote for who I think will be the best president--not who the democrats and republicans say will be the best president. Why does the concept of non-partisan confuse the hell out of you ?



Because I haven't nearly seen you go after McCain as you have Obama?

So therefore if your voting "non-partisan" then you sure aren't acting it here.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> I base it on my life experience and history my brother
> 
> It's the very reason I do not call myself a liberal .. many of whom were so terrified of republican attacks on "liberals" they started calling themselves "progressives"
> 
> This very issue is indicative of liberal weakness



Trump just gave bush a B and Paulson an A grade.  lol.

Anyways, the gop were successful in making liberal a dirty word.  I still call myself a liberal, but a lot of good people I know who don't follow politics enough to know they've been brainwashed tend to call themselves conservatives.

Even though on every issue they tend to agree with the democrats.  It drives me crazy!  Pro choice?  Yes, but because they wouldn't get an abortion they think they are pro life.  But they admit they don't want to reverse roe v wade, but can't understand that makes them pro choice.

Just one example of ppl not knowing the issues enough to make an educated vote.

And ppl will actually vote against their own tax bracket because they dream one day they will all make $250k and they don't want to pay more taxes IF they ever make it there.  And the vast majority of them never will.  And that's a fact.  If they do, then $250k won't be that much money, and that's where we are headed with gop inflation.


----------



## jschuck12001 (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Because I haven't nearly seen you go after McCain as you have Obama?
> 
> So therefore if your voting "non-partisan" then you sure aren't acting it here.



I have to agree, Dillo you love Sarah palin and you will vote for Mccain, its obvious, I have never heard you post one decent thing about Obama.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Because I haven't nearly seen you go after McCain as you have Obama?
> 
> So therefore if your voting "non-partisan" then you sure aren't acting it here.



You're so partisan you wouldn't have a clue what I think. I've made several postings for over a year now where I have consistently criticized McCain. Missed em all did ya ? Bobo just falsely accused me of claiming Powell endorsed Obama because of his race. This is exactly what happens when you put on partisan blinders. You miss the truth. You only see what you want to see.


----------



## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

jschuck12001 said:


> What is it that makes you call liberals "weak", whats your basis for that opinion?



You mean besides the issue we're talking about?

.. or besides the fact that republicans AND democrats run all over them 

.. or the fact that the Democratic Party uses them, takes them for granted, then discards them whenever they choose

.. or could it be because they don't have the courage of their convictions? .. How is it that "liberals" come to support illegal wiretapping and war without a peep in defiance?

Liberals like Pelosi and Reid .. are too timid to pursue impeachment of Bush or a REAL investigation of 9/11

Please demonstrate any liberal outrage in the last 40 years.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Wrong--again. I'm going to be honest this election. I will vote for who I think will be the best president--not who the democrats and republicans say will be the best president. Why does the concept of non-partisan confuse the hell out of you ?



Who's the last Democrat you voted for president?


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Who's the last Democrat you voted for president?



I'd be glad to answer as soon as you can tell me what difference that makes.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Because I haven't nearly seen you go after McCain as you have Obama?
> 
> So therefore if your voting "non-partisan" then you sure aren't acting it here.



I've had this argument with other republicans who can't admit what they are.  Fuck em.  Its a smart tactic.  Makes some people think they are unbias.  

They aren't  any smarter or less racist/greedy than the ppl voting for mccain.

Dillidick just doesn't get it.  He just can't defend his party so he bashes the democrats instead.

Hey dillidick, maybe since you never had an all democratic government in your lifetime, maybe you should give it a try.  The 80's were a long time ago.  I hope you hold just as long of a grudge against the gop, however I believe you will vote for romney in 2012.  Al will be forgiven with you and your party by then i'm sure.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> I'd be glad to answer as soon as you can tell me what difference that makes.



Its a simple question.  Who's the last democratic candidate for president you voted for.  Its not a trick question.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> I've had this argument with other republicans who can't admit what they are.  Fuck em.  Its a smart tactic.  Makes some people think they are unbias.
> 
> They aren't  any smarter or less racist/greedy than the ppl voting for mccain.
> 
> ...



Well you just stick with you mission, Bobo and if you can't use what they actually say to refute them, just make up lies. Hyper-partisans always have a hard time believing that there is someone who isn't one.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> You're so partisan you wouldn't have a clue what I think. I've made several postings for over a year now where I have consistently criticized McCain. Missed em all did ya ? Bobo just falsely accused me of claiming Powell endorsed Obama because of his race. This is exactly what happens when you put on partisan blinders. You miss the truth. You only see what you want to see.



I may be a Liberal but I guess I missed you my post last night about how I would vote for a republican locally if I could.

You've made several postings over a entire year criticizing McCain? Several over a whole year? Whoa nelly, slow down there. And how many for Palin?

Whenever Joe Biden makes a gaffe, you're right there. Whenever Obama makes one, you're right there.

Where have you specifically "criticized McCain"? I'm willing to bet if we lined up the number of times you attacked Obama to McCain it'd look ugly.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Who's the last Democrat you voted for president?



Did you catch what he said?  He's going to be honest THIS election.  As opposed to?

Mccain only up 1 percent in missouri!  

ps.  Does anyone think powell would endorse a guy who's "palin" around with terrorists?  Seriously?


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Its a simple question.  Who's the last democratic candidate for president you voted for.  Its not a trick question.



It might be for some.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> I may be a Liberal but I guess I missed you my post last night about how I would vote for a republican locally if I could.
> 
> You've made several postings over a entire year criticizing McCain? Several over a whole year? Whoa nelly, slow down there. And how many for Palin?
> 
> ...



How many times is McCain praised here as the answer to everything ? Rarely.
There's no need to confront partisans for McCain. There're aren't any. I think actually I have urged more people to vote for Joe the plumber than anyone.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Well you just stick with you mission, Bobo and if you can't use what they actually say to refute them, just make up lies. Hyper-partisans always have a hard time believing that there is someone who isn't one.



Who are you voting for and why don't you sell us on him?  Doesn't sound like your mistery man has a chance.  Nor does it sound like you are proud of him.  I guess I should take off my blinders and cut out my tongue like you.  You realize you haven't talked about your candidate once, as far as I remember.

And why do you think Powell endorsed Obama, if not race.  Sorry I assumed.  Please correct me.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

bump



Red Dawn said:


> Dillo, Who's the last Democrat you voted for president?


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Do you notice the amount of hypocrisy in that post?
> 
> If he endorsed John McCain, you'd be talking about how great Colin Powell is and what a great decision he made.



no, dilloduck wouldn't.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Because I haven't nearly seen you go after McCain as you have Obama?
> 
> So therefore if your voting "non-partisan" then you sure aren't acting it here.



Yes he is.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> no, dilloduck wouldn't.



We're past that now Caligirl.

Though Dillo has avoided answering the question when's the last time a vote for Democrat for President was cast by Dillo.

From what I've seen since September, I figured Dillo was a Republican since I rarely saw a bad word for McCain and the rest for Obama.

Not my fault if one acts partsian, somewhat new people will think so.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

jschuck12001 said:


> I have to agree, Dillo you love Sarah palin and you will vote for Mccain, its obvious, I have never heard you post one decent thing about Obama.



He said as recently as Friday that he hopes Obama wins.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> Yes he is.



Again, I haven't seen it and I spar with Dillo constantly.


----------



## editec (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> Please read the links on Powell I've already posted .. then come back and explain your "man of honor" .. who sat back and watched innocent people die when HE KNEW they were dying for a lie. Please explain how you get "honor" out of that my brother?


 
I know even honorable men can have terrible judgement. Power makes equivicating pragmatists of us all.

And the more powerful those men are granted, the more horrible those equivicating crimes will be, too

As it regards Iraq, Powell acknowledged his mistakes and assumed responsibility for them. 

I don't think this man shits marble, BAC, I am just not convinced his feet are cloven hooves, either.

In this corrupted society, that makes him almost saintly in comparison to the insiders we typically talk about.

He removed himself from that powerful insider position (I think) when it became evident for him that to continue as an insider in that Bush Administration that would have required of him that he sink even lower than he'd already done.

Perhaps it has never happened to you that you are seduced into becoming part of something evil.

I have.

Perhaps that is why I am inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. One of my flaws is forgiving people for their sins, perhaps too easily.

But I know that when you recognize where your associations are leading you into something that is evil, the only honorable thing you can do is remove yourself from it, and acknowlege your role in whatever evil it has done.

Powell seems to have done that. 

How many others of the Bush cabal can say the same?

As to Mai Lia? He was a Major. He found what he was ordered to find.

I wasn't aware of his role in Iran Contra, though. I actually once spend a fair amount of time studying that emboglio, but don't recall him as a central player in it. 

So You'll excuse me if I reserve the right to hold off on accepting as gospel the charges found in a website entitled *DISINFORMATION*, won't you?

Guilt is all about DETAILS so I'd need to read _a lot more about that_ before I fault the man in uniform _for following orders._

As to Powell's son and the obvious nepotism that put Collin's his son in the FCC to grant corporate media power *still more monopoly over our media?*

Yes, truly evil, I quite agree. 

No evil he's ever acknowledged, either. I am still waiting for that confession, to be honest, but don't expect it...._ever._

Our government, and our corporations (public, private profit and non profit alike) are so rife with nepotism like that it bearly even registers as something fundamentally wrong with this society.

Most people don't think nepotism is wrong. We talk about this society being a meritocracy but only fools think it really is.

So people like you and I are SO in the minority on _that _point, that it's not a battle even worth fighting, Bro.

Save you ammunition for those battles where, if you can out the truth, the _average person can understand your point._


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> I've had this argument with other republicans who can't admit what they are.  Fuck em.  Its a smart tactic.  Makes some people think they are unbias.
> 
> They aren't  any smarter or less racist/greedy than the ppl voting for mccain.
> 
> ...



This is so blatantly stupid.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> He said as recently as Friday that he hopes Obama wins.




Dillo, is this true?  Are you voting for Obama?

And who was the last democrat for prez you voted for?


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> Who are you voting for and why don't you sell us on him?



Because it is your job to decide for yourself who you think the best president is. 

This is not a used car lot.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> Who are you voting for and why don't you sell us on him?  Doesn't sound like your mistery man has a chance.  Nor does it sound like you are proud of him.  I guess I should take off my blinders and cut out my tongue like you.  You realize you haven't talked about your candidate once, as far as I remember.
> 
> And why do you think Powell endorsed Obama, if not race.  Sorry I assumed.  Please correct me.



Are you kidding ? I dont come here to campaign because it's futile. No one here is going to change their mind one iota. I prefer to discuss our political system is general and how it currently works against us. 
I made a joke that Powell endorsed Obama because his wife told him to. In all seriousnes I have no clue why he really did it. I would have to ask him.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Dillo, is this true?  Are you voting for Obama?
> 
> And who was the last democrat for prez you voted for?



He did not say he was voting Obama, he said he hopes Obama wins.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> You mean besides the issue we're talking about?
> 
> .. or besides the fact that republicans AND democrats run all over them
> 
> ...



Hey black, you are right about dems being weak, but why?  Ever listen to bill maher?  He said its a shame democrats only win when the country is going through a catastrophy.  I blame the voters.  They are so easily fooled into thinking the dems are weak on terror or tax and spenders.  Just look how bush and the all gop got hit on 9 11 and bin ladin is still free and plotting against us.  Look at how the gop doubled the debt.  If taxes are raised, who is to blame?

Maher said obama is the jackie robinson of politics.  He has had to be perfect!  And still the race is close?  He said, imagine if obama was ever late to a debate.  They'd accuse him of being on colored people time.  lol.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Though Dillo has avoided answering the question when's the last time a vote for Democrat for President was cast by Dillo.



I sure as hell don't discuss my voting record either, and I don't support FISA - and both for the same reason - it is none of your business.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> Because it is your job to decide for yourself who you think the best president is.
> 
> This is not a used car lot.



Really? I've been in the wrong place all this time then.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> He did not say he was voting Obama, he said he hopes Obama wins.




Weird.  He hopes Obama wins, but he's voting for McCain?


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> I sure as hell don't discuss my voting record either, and I don't support FISA - and both for the same reason - it is none of your business.



Testy, no?

No need to compare a simple question to someone listening in on your convo.


----------



## DavidS (Oct 19, 2008)

PeterS said:


> Powell is solid center right. This is the last nail in McCains coffin...



I hope you're right, Peter.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Weird.  He hopes Obama wins, but he's voting for McCain?



I have no idea who he is voting for. He may be writing in his wife's name.

I am not particularly testy, but I do wish the left would stop being as blindly partisan as the right.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> He did not say he was voting Obama, he said he hopes Obama wins.



That's great? Not saying it applies to Dillo but:

I know plenty of Republicans on this board and outside of this board who want Obama to win. That way the Republican party will "learn" supposedly and nominate somebody who is actually more Republican come 2012. Plus, the American people will supposedly see the Democrats for who they are and get voted out of Congress too.

Crazy idea I know, but I'm not the one believing in it.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Are you kidding ? I dont come here to campaign because it's futile. No one here is going to change their mind one iota. I prefer to discuss our political system is general and how it currently works against us.
> I made a joke that Powell endorsed Obama because his wife told him to. In all seriousnes I have no clue why he really did it. I would have to ask him.



Or you could have listened to his interview like the rest of us.

Another under informed voter who wants to talk about the issues. 

Please inform yourself first.

Or go to a discusion you know more about.


----------



## DavidS (Oct 19, 2008)

Well, I just watched the interview from my DVR and WOW. What a GREAT interview overall.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

DavidS said:


> I hope you're right, Peter.



Endorsements are a sign that people think you are too stupid to chose the 'right" person.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Really? I've been in the wrong place all this time then.





Yeah, the used car lot is across town.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> I have no idea who he is voting for. He may be writing in his wife's name.
> 
> I am not particularly testy, but I do wish the left would stop being as blindly partisan as the right.



Its a political message board.  We discuss the candidates we like and who we're voting for.   

Dillo said he'd be happy to say which Democrats for prez he's voted for.  But, so far he hasn't responded.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

he said he'd be happy to as soon as you explain why it's relevant.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> Yeah, the used car lot is across town.



Really? Damn

I could of swore all these people trying to sell me this car that is older, outdated, flawed with many problems and a horrible backup engine in case you need the old one replaced. 

I guess they were just talking about McCain/Palin.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> he said he'd be happy to as soon as you explain why it's relevant.



Dillo, if somebody has spent the last 30 years only voting for Republican candidates for pres, its kinda hard for them to claim they're non partisan. 

So which Dem candidates did you vote for prez Dillo?


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Really? Damn
> 
> I could of swore all these people trying to sell me this car that is older, outdated, flawed with many problems and a horrible backup engine in case you need the old one replaced.
> 
> I guess they were just talking about McCain/Palin.



And see? You figured it out for yourself without needing help from anyone.


----------



## del (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Again, I haven't seen it and I spar with Dillo constantly.



open your eyes, then.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> That's great? Not saying it applies to Dillo but:
> 
> I know plenty of Republicans on this board and outside of this board who want Obama to win. That way the Republican party will "learn" supposedly and nominate somebody who is actually more Republican come 2012. Plus, the American people will supposedly see the Democrats for who they are and get voted out of Congress too.
> 
> Crazy idea I know, but I'm not the one believing in it.



The democrats won't have the luxury of tanking the economy and not winning 2 wars and still getting re elected.

The fact is, we need all 3 branches of government to fix the mess the gop put us in.

They won't have the money to be irresponsible either.

Ps.  Obama raised ashit load of money!  600 milion?  Wow!  And the gop can't raise the same amount of money they did in 04 because even rich ppl are hurting.  So their not spending on mccain.  But millions of ppl like me are sending in $25 or $15 or $50.  So obama is going to work for us.  Mccain will only work for the rich who have contributed to him.  That's the way it works.  Who would you work for?  You'd work for the ppl who helped you win.  Did corporations help obama too?  Sure, so they can be assured he won't fuck them over, but the era of fucking we the people is over.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

del said:


> open your eyes, then.



My eyes are opened. Though tonight they will be distracted by the Red Sox game.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Don't listen to del, he's voting for Bob. Bob is a prick. 

Vote for Joe.


----------



## del (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> Don't listen to del, he's voting for Bob. Bob is a prick.
> 
> Vote for Joe.



hey!
Bob's a uniter, not a divider, like that half assed plumber dillo shills for


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

The only thing Bob unites is two by fours.

Joe knows how to get shit done.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Dillo, if somebody has spent the last 30 years only voting for Republican candidates for pres, its kinda hard for them to claim they're non partisan.
> 
> So which Dem candidates did you vote for prez Dillo?



ahhh I get it-----you assume that since a person consistently voted for a party that they are a member of that party and actually thinks that whoever that party nominates is the best person for the job. Every time I have voted I voted for what I thought was the lesser of two evils. I voted for McGovern and I voted for Carter.


----------



## Mad Scientist (Oct 19, 2008)

BlackAsCoal said:


> Powell should be led before a firing squad and shot to death for his role in getting tens of thousands of US soldiers killed, maimed, and critically wounded with false "evidence" he KNEW was false.
> SO, the Powell fraud endorses the Obama fraud .. big deal .. America still loses


Colin Powell endorsing Obama really comes as no surprise to me. Gen Powell has stated previously that companies in the US need to pay more of their fair share (taxes). I'm sure his choice had nothing to do with race at all. I mean that seriously.
But what I don't understand is this: What does the Liberal mind think of A "Warmonger" like Powell, who was Chairman of the Joint Chiefs and then Sec of Defense when the Iraq war was launched, endorsing it's supposedly anti-war candidate? Or does that matter? Is Colin Powell that big a fish in their eyes that they would overlook his involvement in the war.

I think only poster BlackAsCoal sees this as a problem as I do.


----------



## del (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> The only thing Bob unites is two by fours.
> 
> Joe knows how to get shit done.



eventually the truth about Joe will be flushedout into the open for all the world to see, and it ain't gonna be pretty.

Bob- he's on the level.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> I voted for McGovern and I voted for Carter.



To Robert and etc:

Nyah, nyah nyanya, nyah.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> The only thing Bob unites is two by fours.
> 
> Joe knows how to get shit done.



You mean Sam 

Bob the Builder is the man but sorry; my vote can only go to one person.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> ahhh I get it-----you assume that since a person consistently voted for a party that they are a member of that party and actually thinks that whoever that party nominates is the best person for the job. Every time I have voted I voted for what I thought was the lesser of two evils. I voted for McGovern and I voted for Carter.




Wow, you're old.  

So you haven't voted for a Democratic prez candidate in 32 years or more. 

I voted for Poppy Bush in 1988.  Does that make me non-partisan?


----------



## xsited1 (Oct 19, 2008)

I'm guessing Colin endorsed Obama for at least two reasons:

1. The Republican Party has lost its way and left people like Colin Powell behind.  (This is true for a great many 'former' Republicans.)
2. Obama is African American.


----------



## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Wow, you're old.
> 
> So you haven't voted for a Democratic prez candidate in 32 years or more.
> 
> I voted for Poppy Bush in 1988.  Does that make me non-partisan?



Almost 57.  Hell if I know--it's your theory. Are you ?


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> To Robert and etc:
> 
> Nyah, nyah nyanya, nyah.



 Alright, thirty years ago. I give Dillo credit for voting Carter.

But McGovern? 

That was so bad that delegates put in votes for people like Archie Bunker and Ralph Nader.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> I have no idea who he is voting for. He may be writing in his wife's name.
> 
> I am not particularly testy, but I do wish the left would stop being as blindly partisan as the right.



Who lied us into a war for oil and now isn't  sharing the wealth with us?  We're paying for iraq and oil companies are profiting.  How do you defend that?

The Gao determined that 2/3 us companies don't pay any taxes.

The gop house ways and means gave corporations a tax break to move their operations overseas.  How do you defend that?

It was just discovered that the gop created a loophole that allowed offshore companies to dodge 100 billion in taxes.  How do you defend that?  

Anyone that is middle class and voting gop is underinformed and voting against their own self interests.

Now why aren't  you voting democratic?  Are you rich, brainwashed and believe what the gop says about democrats, racist or so hung up on abortion and gays that it trumps common sense?


----------



## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

xsited1 said:


> I'm guessing Colin endorsed Obama for at least two reasons:
> 
> 1. The Republican Party has lost its way and left people like Colin Powell behind.  (This is true for a great many 'former' Republicans.)
> 2. Obama is African American.



Why do you feel the need to mention #2?

Colin Powell doesn't endorse every African American candidate you know if any in the past.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> Who lied us into a war for oil and now isn't  sharing the wealth with us?  We're paying for iraq and oil companies are profiting.  How do you defend that?
> 
> The Gao determined that 2/3 us companies don't pay any taxes.
> 
> ...



Ah, so now I am republican eh?


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Wow, you're old.
> 
> So you haven't voted for a Democratic prez candidate in 32 years or more.
> 
> I voted for Poppy Bush in 1988.  Does that make me non-partisan?



Hunh, it might mean that who you voted for has little bearing on whether you are repub, dem, or non partisan.


----------



## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Alright, thirty years ago. I give Dillo credit for voting Carter.
> 
> But McGovern?



 so he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.


----------



## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Almost 57.  Hell if I know--it's your theory. Are you ?




I've voted for repubublicans for president in the past. 

I've started threads mocking Democratic congressmen, and saying they should be defeated. 

But, I would never claim I'm non-partisan.  

Neither are you.  We're all partisan.   Don't you spend most of your time on the board using republican talking points, and criticizing democrats?

Have you started any threads, like I have for democrats, that are highly critical of a republican?


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

xsited1 said:


> I'm guessing Colin endorsed Obama for at least two reasons:
> 
> 1. The Republican Party has lost its way and left people like Colin Powell behind.  (This is true for a great many 'former' Republicans.)
> 2. Obama is African American.



How did the gop leave powell behind?  Is he not rich?


----------



## jillian (Oct 19, 2008)

Kathianne said:


> How much 'courage' does it take to endorse the person most likely to win? Do you think Powell would have done this if McCain was ahead? Pretty hard sell, since it may have mattered much more to Powell/Obama supporters back when he was taking a pounding from Hillary.



That sounds like sour grapes. Obama has not won yet and McCain is still trying to make inroads into the "middle" with his rovian swiftboating smears. Colin Powell goes a long way to giving him "street cred" with those independents since I don't know a single person who's in the middle who wouldn't vote for Powell for pres notwithstanding his role in helping Bush perpetuate his little fraud.

If he endorsed McCain, every person on the right would have been saying "well, of course he did, he's a republican".

More to the point, Powell said that  Palin was not equipped to be CinC in the event she was required to.


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## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

non-partisan means you don't belong to a party. It doesn't mean you don't have opinions. 

And thinking is another level entirely.


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## Razalas (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Why do you feel the need to mention #2?
> 
> *Colin Powell doesn't endorse every African American candidate you know if any in the past.*



No, but when has he ever endorsed a white liberal?


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> so he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.



No 

But McGovern? I guess since he was running against Nixon I would for him but McGovern? 

McGovern made a as bad VP pick as McCain did. (And no, I'm not comparing the two personally.)


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## jillian (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> How did the gop leave powell behind?  Is he not rich?



I think you're missing his point. The GOP DID leave Powell behind along with most of the real centrists and real conservatives. I'm not one to generally jump to X's defense, but he's dead right about that.  See, you should be glad for that type of attitude. It proves not everyone on the right is a wingnut. I find it comforting to be reminded of that in the midst of all the Sawwah Bawwacuda stuff about "real pro-America states".


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## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> non-partisan means you don't belong to a party. It doesn't mean you don't have opinions.
> 
> And thinking is another level entirely.



Party registration is only one measure of partisanship. 

Bill O'Reilly claims he's a registered independent.  But, 90% of the time he's either defending Bush, McCain, and Palin, or he's criticizing liberals.   

Bill O'Reilly is a partisan conservative.  It doesn't matter what his party registration is;.


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## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

Well, there's the problem. You are using one definition of partisan and other people may use a different definition.

We should chuck partisan out the window and talk issues. There's an idea, eh?


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> non-partisan means you don't belong to a party. It doesn't mean you don't have opinions.
> 
> And thinking is another level entirely.



Nobody is non-partisan on this board then because everyone has a opinion and voices it.


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## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

I said the opposite.... read it again.....


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

Mad Scientist said:


> Colin Powell endorsing Obama really comes as no surprise to me. Gen Powell has stated previously that companies in the US need to pay more of their fair share (taxes). I'm sure his choice had nothing to do with race at all. I mean that seriously.
> But what I don't understand is this: What does the Liberal mind think of A "Warmonger" like Powell, who was Chairman of the Joint Chiefs and then Sec of Defense when the Iraq war was launched, endorsing it's supposedly anti-war candidate? Or does that matter? Is Colin Powell that big a fish in their eyes that they would overlook his involvement in the war.
> 
> I think only poster BlackAsCoal sees this as a problem as I do.



Liberals have a good heart .. but unfortunately they don't usually come with the strength to fight.

They see Powell as just a good guy led badly .. and .. going out on the limb .. don't properly judge him because he's black. .. as if it's somehow doing black people a favor.

Wanna do us a favor .. take a firm stand against the war on drugs and the racist criminal system in America.

Then I'd be impressed.

But to those who aren't paying attention .. Powell isn't celebrated in the black community. Most of us recognize what he is. We saw what he was during Vietnam and recognize how he rose to "the top."

We also recognize who's image of a "hero" he fits.

Powell was instrumental in the deception that has led to the greatest military and political disaster in American history. He stood silent while US troops, young US troops were marched off to their deaths for profit. NOW he tells us he knew .. trying to wash the blood off his hands.

At anytime during the dying, he could have stood up and told the truth.

He backs Obama NOW ... but he knew the truth in 2004 and he could have spoken the truth before Bush was elected .. more importantly, before more US troops went to their deaths .. before we started melting babies

If that is someone's opinion of honor, integrity, courage, or a dedication to the troops .. that person would be a fool .. in my opinion of course.


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## jillian (Oct 19, 2008)

Why don't we try using the real definition of the word.

Partisan means being PARTIAL to a cause or group or concern. Everyone is PARTISAN. The question is ... whether one is partisan above all else. 

The answer, I would think, is that it depends on how devoted one is to a political issue.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> I've voted for repubublicans for president in the past.
> 
> I've started threads mocking Democratic congressmen, and saying they should be defeated.
> 
> ...



God forbid you be called a non-partisan huh?  I don't start many threads and am content for the most part to comment or respond to what happens to be posted. I criticize or praise behavior and ideas. I ask questions , sometimes for answers, sometimes to stimulate thought. Sometimes I just make fun of all of us trying to predict what will happen next or guess what someone REALLY is thinking.
Sometimes I just just feel like blowing off steam or throwing out things that cross my mind. You can take a look for yourself at what threads I have started. It's available for anyone to look at.


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> I said the opposite.... read it again.....



Sorry, under No Child Left Behind I wasn't taught to read.



Kidding, but do you like my avatar Cali?


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## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

LOL yes very much.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

jillian said:


> Why don't we try using the real definition of the word.
> 
> Partisan means being PARTIAL to a cause or group or concern. Everyone is PARTISAN. The question is ... whether one is partisan above all else.
> 
> The answer, I would think, is that it depends on how devoted one is to a political issue.



Which is why I began using the hyphenated  hyper-partisan. We all know who they are.


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## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> God forbid you be called a non-partisan huh?  I don't start many threads and am content for the most part to comment or respond to what happens to be posted. I criticize or praise behavior and ideas. I ask questions , sometimes for answers, sometimes to stimulate thought. Sometimes I just make fun of all of us trying to predict what will happen next or guess what someone REALLY is thinking.
> Sometimes I just just feel like blowing off steam or throwing out things that cross my mind. You can take a look for yourself at what threads I have started. It's available for anyone to look at.



I'm looking forward to you starting threads criticizing republicans and conservatives, and to your measured and equal defense of democrats and liberals, if you really are an independent-thinking non-partisan.


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## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

Caligirl said:


> Ah, so now I am republican eh?



Politics is very confusing for most people.  Maybe you just don't know whatto think/do.  Most voters are in that position.  

You don't like democratic partisans, right?  Do you remember republicans being non partisan when they got bush elected twice?

And I'm sorry if i'm voting for the better man and not the lesser of two evils.  I don't see obama as an evil.  Now bush, tom delay and mccain?  pure greed and evil.

Did you hear powell?  Mccan will continue to push the republican agenda.  If you like their agenda or think obama's agenda is worse, vote mccain.  Then you will lose your job to china or india.  Because that is their agenda.  Huge difference.  Why would you be for that unless you yourself have an offshore company?

Why are you ok with iraq having a surplus and we spend $10 bill a month in iraq?


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## Caligirl (Oct 19, 2008)

You haven't read my threads, son.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> I'm looking forward to you starting threads criticizing republicans and conservatives, and to your measured and equal defense of democrats and liberals, if you really are an independent-thinking non-partisan.



oh boy--well, you keep score for me and tell me how I'm doing ok ?


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## Red Dawn (Oct 19, 2008)

jillian said:


> Why don't we try using the real definition of the word.
> 
> Partisan means being PARTIAL to a cause or group or concern. Everyone is PARTISAN. The question is ... whether one is partisan above all else.
> 
> The answer, I would think, is that it depends on how devoted one is to a political issue.




Exactly.  

I'm a partisan liberal.  That means, I don't agree with every Democrat, and I even start threads criticizing some democrats. 

Dillo is a partisan conservative. Even if he doesn't like some republicans.    Everyone know it.  I don't know why its even debatable.


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## DavidS (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Endorsements are a sign that people think you are too stupid to chose the 'right" person.





An endorsment is a statement letting people know that you support this person and here's why. That's it. The people who think that we're too stupid to make up our minds on our own are the Republicans by placing those godforsaken robocalls.


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## BlackAsCoal (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> Politics is very confusing for most people.  Maybe you just don't know whatto think/do.  Most voters are in that position.
> 
> You don't like democratic partisans, right?  Do you remember republicans being non partisan when they got bush elected twice?
> 
> ...



Tell me you don't really believe Obama is going to do any better on corporate influence?

How much of that 10 million do you think Obama will be spending in Afghanistan and bombing innocent people in Pakistan?


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

DavidS said:


> An endorsment is a statement letting people know that you support this person and here's why. That's it. The people who think that we're too stupid to make up our minds on our own are the Republicans by placing those godforsaken robocalls.



Why do I need to even know who some famous person wants to be president and even moreso, why should I care ?


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## Annie (Oct 19, 2008)

Do I think politicians lie? Inevitably. Have I ever had a candidate I thought correct on all issues? Maybe in the 70's, Jim Thompson for Governor. I believed in him enough to be my college rep for him. Registered a lot of voters, not one Mickey Mouse. Since then? Pretty disillusioned. 

Now that I'm more than a grown up, I look at political philosophies of the candidates. For a long time it was impossible to find Obama's, but luckily for me, I'd read lots of coverage of him, because I'm in Chicago area. In the past few months, non MSM sources have fleshed his philosophies out in more detail, often explaining the difficulties they run into in Chicago, trying to dig for the information. Most of you here don't care about his company, though it certainly reflects his philosophy. I saw someone say that he'd endorsed Ayers' book on education; it wasn't on education and anyone who really was inquiring would have known that.

McCain, well he's a 'known' quality. Most conservatives have him on their lists of least likely to be conservative. Yet, he's way beyond the Obama school of socialism-not communism. He'll get my vote, from Illinois, which will most likely vote Obama over 20%.


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## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

jillian said:


> I think you're missing his point. The GOP DID leave Powell behind along with most of the real centrists and real conservatives. I'm not one to generally jump to X's defense, but he's dead right about that.  See, you should be glad for that type of attitude. It proves not everyone on the right is a wingnut. I find it comforting to be reminded of that in the midst of all the Sawwah Bawwacuda stuff about "real pro-America states".



Oh, got it.  That makes sense.


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## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Why do I need to even know who some famous person wants to be president and even moreso, why should I care ?



Powell is a foreign policy expert.  He's telling you the gop's agenda is radical, dangerous and insane.  War with iran and russia?  Get it?  You want to go there, vote for mccain.

And Bill maher is able to put into words what some people feel but can't virbalize.  When he says something I often say, EXACTLY.  He didn't change my mind, he just confirmed my feelings.

The same way you feel about rush.  You anti bush/pro mccain ppl need to realize bush does equal mccain.  same guy.  same agenda.  At least on the important stuff.


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## dilloduck (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> Powell is a foreign policy expert.  He's telling you the gop's agenda is radical, dangerous and insane.  War with iran and russia?  Get it?  You want to go there, vote for mccain.
> 
> And Bill maher is able to put into words what some people feel but can't virbalize.  When he says something I often say, EXACTLY.  He didn't change my mind, he just confirmed my feelings.
> 
> The same way you feel about rush.  You anti bush/pro mccain ppl need to realize bush does equal mccain.  same guy.  same agenda.  At least on the important stuff.



Bobo--you're an idiot and a liar.


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## CA95380 (Oct 19, 2008)

Red Dawn said:


> Nice.
> 
> But how could a decorated vietnam vet, respected Republican, and former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs support a secret radical muslim socialist, who pals around with terrorists?



They have you and every other "racist" Republican scared "shitless" don't they?

Three cheers for Obama and three cheers for *Powell*!  

  My prayer *now* is that Obama will select Powell to be a member of  his team when they move into the Whitehouse in January!!   Can you say Sec. of State 

The Obama ticket is getting better and better!  YAY!


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## Paulie (Oct 19, 2008)

PeterS said:


> You're kidding me! Jesus, I am so embarrassed in not recognizing a fellow liberal. Silly me...



Well, that's what you get for making assumptions.  All you had to do was search posts, or just ask.


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## sealybobo (Oct 19, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Bobo--you're an idiot and a liar.



Maybe an idiot but certainly not a liar.

Mccain will bomb iran to stop their nuclear ambitions.  That's idiotic.  Obama will achieve better results with diplomacy.  

Important to know that iran and n. korea made great nuclear gains under the gop and pakistan is a mess because we backed their anti democracy dictator. 

You are the idiot.


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## del (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> You mean Sam
> 
> Bob the Builder is the man but sorry; my vote can only go to one person.
> 
> View attachment 6118



you don't have a vote, sorry.


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## Chris (Oct 19, 2008)

CA95380 said:


> They have you and every other "racist" Republican scared "shitless" don't they?
> 
> Three cheers for Obama and three cheers for *Powell*!
> 
> ...



I was thinking Coin Powell for Secretary of Defense and Bill Clinton for Secretary of State.


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## CA95380 (Oct 19, 2008)

Chris said:


> I was thinking Coin Powell for Secretary of Defense and Bill Clinton for Secretary of State.



I'm still not a fan of Bill Clinton ... but Hillary would work just fine.   

Ok, I will go along with your suggestion, other than that.


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## Chris (Oct 19, 2008)

CA95380 said:


> I'm still not a fan of Bill Clinton ... but Hillary would work just fine.
> 
> Ok, I will go along with your suggestion, other than that.



I think Bill will work very closely with Sarkozy's wife....Carla Burni.


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## xsited1 (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Why do you feel the need to mention #2?
> 
> Colin Powell doesn't endorse every African American candidate you know if any in the past.



Because he's African American, because he's the first African American who has a chance to become President and because more than 90% of African Americans say they will vote for an African American President.  (The percentage could actually be higher.)


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## xsited1 (Oct 19, 2008)

sealybobo said:


> How did the gop leave powell behind?  Is he not rich?



Do a google search on 'Neoconservatives'.  That's your answer.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2008)

xsited1 said:


> Do a google search on 'Neoconservatives'.  That's your answer.


Are you saying Powell is a neocon?


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## xsited1 (Oct 19, 2008)

Luissa27 said:


> Are you saying Powell is a neocon?



No.  You'll have to look at the thread for more information.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2008)

xsited1 said:


> No.  You'll have to look at the thread for more information.


I was just making sure and I will!


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## Modbert (Oct 19, 2008)

xsited1 said:


> Because he's African American, because he's the first African American who has a chance to become President and because more than 90% of African Americans say they will vote for an African American President.  (The percentage could actually be higher.)



Okay? African Americans have always traditionally voted Democrat in the past few elections.

United States presidential election, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

2004 - Kerry received EIGHTY EIGHT (88%) of the African American Vote.

THE 2000 CAMPAIGN: THE VICE PRESIDENT; Gore Gets Wild Applause At Meeting of N.A.A.C.P. - New York Times



> David Bositis, chief pollster for the Joint Center for Political and Economic Studies, said: *''He'll get 90 to 95 percent* of the black vote. The larger question for Gore really is black turnout, as opposed to his share of the black vote



United States presidential election, 1996 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1996/1992 - Bill Clinton received 84% of the African American Vote in 96 and 83% in 1992.

So is that myth dispelled for you now? Or do you need more facts to go against "It's just because he is black."


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## xsited1 (Oct 19, 2008)

Modbert said:


> Okay? African Americans have always traditionally voted Democrat in the past few elections.
> 
> United States presidential election, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> ...




It's not a myth.  If you lived in an area with a large black population, you would know how closely they stick together.  The black candidate always gets the black vote.  We recently had a simple school board election.  A friend of mine who is a Democrat ran against an African-American.  It was like the 1960s all over again.  Black preachers basically ordered their congregations to vote for the black candidate, blacks were registered to vote in record numbers, blacks organized rides for anyone who couldn't get to the voting booth.  In the end, the black candidate won.  It's how it is in the black community.  If you don't live with blacks, you don't understand.


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## sealybobo (Oct 21, 2008)

dilloduck said:


> Well you just stick with you mission, Bobo and if you can't use what they actually say to refute them, just make up lies. Hyper-partisans always have a hard time believing that there is someone who isn't one.



I use deduction and reasoning to come  up with my conclusions about you folks.

Rush says Powell only endorsed Obama because he's black.  I assume you all agree with your leader Rush.  Or are you going to distance yourself from him?

Maybe the Democrats should pass a non binding resolution in congress to admonish Rush and his comments and see if the Republicans will sign it.  Oh, we don't play those faggoty games like Conservatives do.  I forgot.


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