# Oil Sands Boom Dries Up in Alberta, Taking Thousands of Jobs With it



## Synthaholic

*Oil Sands Boom Dries Up in Alberta,*
*Taking Thousands of Jobs With it*
.

After an extraordinary boom that attracted many of the world’s largest energy companies and about $200 billion worth of investments to oil sands development over the last 15 years, the industry is in a state of financial stasis, and navigating the decline has proved challenging. Pipeline plans that would create new export markets, includingKeystone XL, have been hampered by environmental concerns and political opposition. The hazy outlook is creating turmoil in a province and a country that has become dependent on the energy business.

Canada is now dealing with the economic fallout, having slipped into a mild recession earlier this year. And Alberta, which relies most heavily on oil royalties, now expects to post a deficit of 6 billion Canadian dollars, or about $4.5 billion. The political landscape has also shifted.

Last spring, a left-of-center government ended four decades of rule by the Conservative Party of Canada in Alberta. Federally, polls suggest that the Conservative Party — which championed Keystone XL and repeatedly resisted calls for stricter greenhouse gas emission controls in the oil sands — is struggling to get re-elected in October.


“The pendulum has swung,” said Stephen Ross, the president of Devonian Properties, an Alberta development company that has built several residential and commercial properties in Fort McMurray.


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## Mr. H.

Why in the fuck would you find this amusing?


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## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Why in the fuck would you find this amusing?


Because it is helping to save what little environment we have left.

I could give a fuck about Canadian oil jobs, just like BP Oil jobs in the Gulf after that royal fuck-up.

Why would I give a shit about people who have no emergency plans for something so monumentally important to American livelihoods, like fisherman, restaurants, etc.?

FUCK THEM.

Let the fucking Arabs pump the oil from their wasteland.  Who gives a flying fuck if there is an oil spill in the Saudi desert?


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## Toro

Where's the humor in that?

50,000 people have been laid off in the Alberta energy industry.  And many tens of thousands more in secondary and tertiary industries are also going to lose their jobs.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that in most businesses, when the price of something falls by two-thirds, people are going to lose their jobs.  It's ironic that leftists would cheer this because even more Americans are going to get canned.

The economics of the oil sands are such that oil sands production will NOT go down.  That's because the upfront costs are massive but the operating costs are small.  Thus, once the capital is in the ground, the oil gets pulled out at low cost.  The operating costs of oil sands giant Suncor is about $28, lower than 95% of all production in the US.  And the production profiles of oil sands fields are decades, perhaps even a century.

American rigs will lay down before production in the oil sands will fall.  New American oil production is primarily via fracking.  Fracked fields have a high decline curve, meaning that a hole runs dry in a few years.  Thus, the upfront capex costs are low but the operating costs are high.  American companies will stop production sooner.

Low prices hurt new oil sands capex but it doesn't hurt current production, unless oil will fall into the lows $20s for a prolonged period of time.  All that oil sands product is still coming, whether Keystone is built or not.


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## Synthaholic

Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.


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## Toro

Synthaholic said:


> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.



Who, exactly, is "we?"

If you wish to send American dollars to Canadian workers, feel free.  I doubt many other Americans would agree.

Otherwise, Canadian producers pay high taxes, and Canada has generous social programs.

Almost all of those receiving UI would rather be working though.


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## Synthaholic

Toro said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Who, exactly, is "we?"
> 
> If you wish to send American dollars to Canadian workers, feel free.  I doubt many other Americans would agree.
> 
> Otherwise, Canadian producers pay high taxes, and Canada has generous social programs.
> 
> Almost all of those receiving UI would rather be working though.
Click to expand...

I'm talking about whatever U.S. jobs are lost due to Green energy, and lower foreign oil prices.


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why in the fuck would you find this amusing?
> 
> 
> 
> Because it is helping to save what little environment we have left.
> 
> I could give a fuck about Canadian oil jobs, just like BP Oil jobs in the Gulf after that royal fuck-up.
> 
> Why would I give a shit about people who have no emergency plans for something so monumentally important to American livelihoods, like fisherman, restaurants, etc.?
> 
> FUCK THEM.
> 
> Let the fucking Arabs pump the oil from their wasteland.  Who gives a flying fuck if there is an oil spill in the Saudi desert?
Click to expand...

I don't know why I tolerate your Left-wing enviro-Nazi bullshit. "What little environment we have left". 

It's not only the Canadian oil sands project that is in the shitter, it's tens of thousands of U.S. workers with families who are now unemployed. It's Caterpillar who is laying off thousands. It's U.S. steel mills that are cutting production and laying off... workers with families. 

You want to help the environment, go plant a fucking tree. 

People in my industry eat in restaurants, and they eat fish. 

God you are more insane than I ever thought.


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.


Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.


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## Dad2three

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
Click to expand...



* Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *



*President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:

Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''



*Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices." 


http://mediamatters.org/research/2011/04/28/right-wing-media-falsely-claim-that-cutting-tax/179178

*Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*

Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.

Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices

*Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*

http://mediamatters.org/research/2012/03/06/energy-experts-debunk-right-wing-defense-of-oil/184371


Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
— Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference







*The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.

"The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."


...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.



*...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*

Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist


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## Mr. H.

Dad2three said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
Click to expand...

Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.


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## Dad2three

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why in the fuck would you find this amusing?
> 
> 
> 
> Because it is helping to save what little environment we have left.
> 
> I could give a fuck about Canadian oil jobs, just like BP Oil jobs in the Gulf after that royal fuck-up.
> 
> Why would I give a shit about people who have no emergency plans for something so monumentally important to American livelihoods, like fisherman, restaurants, etc.?
> 
> FUCK THEM.
> 
> Let the fucking Arabs pump the oil from their wasteland.  Who gives a flying fuck if there is an oil spill in the Saudi desert?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't know why I tolerate your Left-wing enviro-Nazi bullshit. "What little environment we have left".
> 
> It's not only the Canadian oil sands project that is in the shitter, it's tens of thousands of U.S. workers with families who are now unemployed. It's Caterpillar who is laying off thousands. It's U.S. steel mills that are cutting production and laying off... workers with families.
> 
> You want to help the environment, go plant a fucking tree.
> 
> People in my industry eat in restaurants, and they eat fish.
> 
> God you are more insane than I ever thought.
Click to expand...



*Jobs — Fossil Fuels Vs. Renewables Laser Talk*

*
In 2012, there were a total of 137,650 permanent coal-related jobs nationwide [1], and 806,831 oil and gas jobs as of 2011* [2]. By contrast, there were *3,401,279 green jobs in 2011* [3].  The Department of Energy predicts using conservative estimates that by 2030 there will be over half a million wind jobs alone [4].

*Renewable energy provides more jobs than fossil fuels *

The overall job story is that renewable energy will provide more and higher paying jobs, with more diverse opportunities [5].

*This is because $1 million dollars worth of oil and natural gas output directly creates 0.8 jobs, and $1 million of coal produces 1.9 jobs. Compare that to building retrofits for energy efficiency (7 jobs per million), mass transit services (11 jobs), building the smart grid (4.3), wind (4.6), solar (5.4), and biomass power generation (7.4) [6].*


*The green economy already supports more jobs than the fossil fuel economy, and has for years, even though renewable energy accounts for only 11.98% of our domestically produced energy [7].*

The writing is on the wall: the key to creating American jobs now and in the future is not investment in fossil fuels, it is investment in the green economy.

*Skeptic Claims and One-Liners*


Carbon Fee Skeptic Claim: Putting a price on carbon will cost jobs.
One-Liner: *Wind, solar, and biomass generate 2.5 – 9.25 times as many jobs as coal, oil, and gas for every $1 million contribution to GDP.*

Jobs - Fossil Fuels Vs. Renewables - Citizens' Climate Lobby


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## Dad2three

Mr. H. said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
Click to expand...


Got it lil bitch, you HATE FACTS.


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## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
Click to expand...


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Take the easy route, and cut and paste that bullshit. Then I'll address it.


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?


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## Mr. H.

I thought not. And that's why I've taken a liking to you. 


Against my better judgement.


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## Dad2three

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
Click to expand...




*The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*








*



*


*The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*


*Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*


*Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*


----------



## Mr. H.

Dad2three said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
Click to expand...

Thank you, not Synthoholic. 

Double shut the fuck up.


----------



## Dad2three

Mr. H. said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thank you, not Synthoholic.
> 
> Double shut the fuck up.
Click to expand...


LMAOROG


----------



## Toro

Dad2three said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
Click to expand...


The solar industry created more jobs than the oil industry in 2014 because oil fell from $110 to $40.  

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand this.  

Of course, more jobs were created in the oil industry from 2005 to 2014 than almost all industries in the country.  I don't see the liberals pointing this out.

Having said that, I think solar is coming in a big way.  And that's ultimately good for America.


----------



## Dad2three

Toro said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The solar industry created more jobs than the oil industry in 2014 because oil fell from $110 to $40.
> 
> It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand this.
> 
> Of course, more jobs were created in the oil industry from 2005 to 2014 than almost all industries in the country.  I don't see the liberals pointing this out.
> 
> Having said that, I think solar is coming in a big way.  And that's ultimately good for America.
Click to expand...


2005-2015? You mean 2005-2010 when we had a NET ZERO private sector jobs growth? Wow. Hard to top that right?


Got a source for your numbers Bubs?



*Oil and gas extraction*
*NAICS Code: *211
*Data Type: *ALL EMPLOYEES, THOUSANDS

JAN 2005  124,100
Dec 2014 (peak) 201,200


75,000 jobs in 9 years huh?


Bureau of Labor Statistics Data









*"in 2012 alone the clean energy sector created 110,413 jobs"*


http://www.nacubo.org/Documents/BusinessPolicyAreas/FactSheetGreenJobs061113.pdf



*Power sector employment declines, except for renewable electricity generators*







*Source: *Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) Quarterly Census of Employment and Wages
*Note: *2014 data are preliminary.
The electric p*ower generation sector lost more than 5,800 jobs from January 2011 through June 2014 despite a gain of nearly 1,800 non-hydro renewable electricity generation jobs*, according to the latest data available from the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS). 

Power sector employment declines, except for renewable electricity generators - Today in Energy - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)


----------



## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take the $4B in subsidies that we lavish on mega-successful oil companies and use it to ease the suffering of laid-off oil employees until they can find respectable employment.
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
Click to expand...

Huh?  I just logged in.  Been watching our next president on the CNN debate.


----------



## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Huh?  I just logged in.  Been watching our next president on the CNN debate.
Click to expand...

Ahhh... shaddap.


----------



## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Huh?  I just logged in.  Been watching our next president on the CNN debate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ahhh... shaddap.
Click to expand...

You didn't even ask me which one!


----------



## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
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> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> Synthaholic said:
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> 
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> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Huh?  I just logged in.  Been watching our next president on the CNN debate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ahhh... shaddap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You didn't even ask me which one!
Click to expand...

And you are... ?

You bailed on this thread way back when your mouthpiece minions piped up.


----------



## Synthaholic

I laughed in the OP because it means that KeystoneXL is even less likely to get built.  And that is good for America, since we would have to suffer any leaks, not the Canadians.


----------



## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
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> Synthaholic said:
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> Mr. H. said:
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> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Huh?  I just logged in.  Been watching our next president on the CNN debate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ahhh... shaddap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You didn't even ask me which one!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And you are... ?
> 
> You bailed on this thread way back when your mouthpiece minions piped up.
Click to expand...

No, I think I went to bed.  Although, I'm not too proud to get a little help from my friends, Ringo.


----------



## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> I laughed in the OP because it means that KeystoneXL is even less likely to get built.  And that is good for America, since we would have to suffer any leaks, not the Canadians.


You insufferable mental delinquent.


----------



## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> I laughed in the OP because it means that KeystoneXL is even less likely to get built.  And that is good for America, since we would have to suffer any leaks, not the Canadians.
> 
> 
> 
> You insufferable mental delinquent.
Click to expand...

Well, we've seen that the oil industry doesn't place any importance, and certainly not any money, into workable plans in case of an accident.  They just don't give a shit about a) any Americans who may live there, b) the environment that they have fouled, and c) the American taxpayer who ends up footing the bill in so many ways.

So why would I want to enable them even more for the sake of a few jobs?  Let those workers  learn how to install solar panels instead.


----------



## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> I laughed in the OP because it means that KeystoneXL is even less likely to get built.  And that is good for America, since we would have to suffer any leaks, not the Canadians.
> 
> 
> 
> You insufferable mental delinquent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well, we've seen that the oil industry doesn't place any importance, and certainly not any money, into workable plans in case of an accident.  They just don't give a shit about a) any Americans who may live there, b) the environment that they have fouled, and c) the American taxpayer who ends up footing the bill in so many ways.
> 
> So why would I want to enable them even more for the sake of a few jobs?  Let those workers  learn how to install solar panels instead.
Click to expand...

You're a fucking mental midget. A stooge for the Left. And an enviro-Nazi who has no fucking clue of the real world.


----------



## Toro

Synthaholic said:


> I laughed in the OP because it means that KeystoneXL is even less likely to get built.  And that is good for America, since we would have to suffer any leaks, not the Canadians.



No it doesn't. 

What makes it less likely is American politics.  

The product that is coming out of the ground already contracted to XL will be moved by pipeline across Canada, then shipped down the eastern seaboard, around the straight of Florida, and up into the Gulf and refined in Louisiana if XL fails.

Therefore, your state is now at risk whereas it wasn't before with XL.


----------



## Toro

Dad2three said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
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> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The solar industry created more jobs than the oil industry in 2014 because oil fell from $110 to $40.
> 
> It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand this.
> 
> Of course, more jobs were created in the oil industry from 2005 to 2014 than almost all industries in the country.  I don't see the liberals pointing this out.
> 
> Having said that, I think solar is coming in a big way.  And that's ultimately good for America.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 2005-2015? You mean 2005-2010 when we had a NET ZERO private sector jobs growth? Wow. Hard to top that right?
> 
> 
> Got a source for your numbers Bubs?
> 
> 
> 
> *Oil and gas extraction*
> *NAICS Code: *211
> *Data Type: *ALL EMPLOYEES, THOUSANDS
> 
> JAN 2005  124,100
> Dec 2014 (peak) 201,200
> 
> 
> 75,000 jobs in 9 years huh?
> 
> 
> Bureau of Labor Statistics Data
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"in 2012 alone the clean energy sector created 110,413 jobs"*
> 
> 
> http://www.nacubo.org/Documents/BusinessPolicyAreas/FactSheetGreenJobs061113.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> *Power sector employment declines, except for renewable electricity generators*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Source: *Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) Quarterly Census of Employment and Wages
> *Note: *2014 data are preliminary.
> The electric p*ower generation sector lost more than 5,800 jobs from January 2011 through June 2014 despite a gain of nearly 1,800 non-hydro renewable electricity generation jobs*, according to the latest data available from the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS).
> 
> Power sector employment declines, except for renewable electricity generators - Today in Energy - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)
Click to expand...


Sure thing, derp2three. 

Since you have demonstrated zero understanding of economics in the past, it's no surprise you are doing so now.  You only included extraction. 



> About half of the workers employed in crude oil and natural gas production are in the support category of oil and natural gas industry employment, and employment in this category accounted for the bulk of the increases seen in oil and gas industry employment. Combined, the three industry categories equal just one-half of one percent of total U.S. private sector employment.



Oil and gas industry employment growing much faster than total private sector employment - Today in Energy - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

Extraction is only one part of the energy complex. Not surprising you don't know this. 

C&P will only get you so far, poseur.


----------



## Synthaholic

Toro said:


> The product that is coming out of the ground already contracted to XL will be moved by pipeline across Canada, then shipped down the eastern seaboard, around the straight of Florida, and up into the Gulf and refined in Louisiana if XL fails.


That sounds expensive.  Maybe too expensive to compete.


----------



## Searcher44

Toro said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> I laughed in the OP because it means that KeystoneXL is even less likely to get built.  And that is good for America, since we would have to suffer any leaks, not the Canadians.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it doesn't.
> 
> What makes it less likely is American politics.
> 
> The product that is coming out of the ground already contracted to XL will be moved by pipeline across Canada, then shipped down the eastern seaboard, around the straight of Florida, and up into the Gulf and refined in Louisiana if XL fails.
> 
> Therefore, your state is now at risk whereas it wasn't before with XL.
Click to expand...

 

What do you think about Notley's talk about wanting to see oil refined in Alberta? The Conservatives who just got booted out sold themselves and Albertans to the oil companies for decades. Maybe they should have invested some of the harvest in that industry. I lived in Alberta for ten years. They were all drunk on oil, thought they could ride that gravy train at least as long as *they *needed it. My saying was "When the oil runs out there won't be anybody left to turn out the lights" (I hated the place and most of the red-necked cowboy wanna-bes who lived there.) Oil will come back and the industry will do just fine in Alberta. They'll hold the NDP at ransom for low royalties just like they did the Conservatives. I hope the NDP will at least be a little smarter and try harder to diversify Alberta's economy and move it into the 21st century.


----------



## Toro

Synthaholic said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> 
> The product that is coming out of the ground already contracted to XL will be moved by pipeline across Canada, then shipped down the eastern seaboard, around the straight of Florida, and up into the Gulf and refined in Louisiana if XL fails.
> 
> 
> 
> That sounds expensive.  Maybe too expensive to compete.
Click to expand...


My friends in Calgary tell me the difference between the XL pipeline and shipping it across Canada, down the eastern seaboard and into the Gulf is $2-$3 a barrel.


----------



## Toro

Searcher44 said:


> What do you think about Notley's talk about wanting to see oil refined in Alberta?



The problem is primarily economics.  People have talked about it for decades.  The reason why it hasn't happened is because it costs too much.  Saskatchewan tried to subsidize refining with the Husky Oil Upgrader and it cost the province something like a billion dollars.


----------



## Searcher44

Toro said:


> Searcher44 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What do you think about Notley's talk about wanting to see oil refined in Alberta?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The problem is primarily economics.  People have talked about it for decades.  The reason why it hasn't happened is because it costs too much.  Saskatchewan tried to subsidize refining with the Husky Oil Upgrader and it cost the province something like a billion dollars.
Click to expand...

 


Toro said:


> Searcher44 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What do you think about Notley's talk about wanting to see oil refined in Alberta?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The problem is primarily economics.  People have talked about it for decades.  The reason why it hasn't happened is because it costs too much.  Saskatchewan tried to subsidize refining with the Husky Oil Upgrader and it cost the province something like a billion dollars.
Click to expand...



Since my post I've done a little googling and filled in a bit of my ignorance on the subject. Turns out we do upgrade and refine a much larger amount of our crude than I thought, here's a map of Canadian refineries and upgraders;






The capacity of these sites is comparatively low compared to what we produce but it still surprised me. A few facts;

Canada's proven reserves of 175 billion barrels of oil -- the vast majority of it trapped in the oil sands -- is the second-largest oil stash in the world, after Saudi Arabia's 267 billion.
One-third of Canada's oil sands bitumen stays in the country, and is refined into gasoline, heating oil and diesel.
Canada refined 300,000 cubic metres daily in 1980; in 2010, that number was slightly down, to 291,000, even though exports of oil had grown tenfold in that time. 

And of course the environmental impact has to be factored in to any cost-benefit analysis. Most people want to get the most money in their pocket in the shortest amount of time. Especially Big Oil. They can tell us they are "Green" over and over but we know what green really motivates them. It's too bad we couldn't take the long view, even some kind of moratorium until the best way forward for everyone, especially our grandkids, could be figured out. But the lure of money...I was making good money when I worked in Calgary but a few years I still got that cheque in the mail, my "share" of Alberta's oil profits. Basically the Conservatives buy-off of any potential questioning of their oil strategy - you'd be surprised by how many people were bought off, or maybe you wouldn't. Anyway with the amount of reserves still in the ground it's going to be a long term problem, damn I wish we would take a while and find the right long term solutions. I don't think it's a simple dollars and cents equation. Here's a clip from a CBC article;

_"A broader cost-benefit analysis, they argue, that includes measures such as job creation, engineering know-how, and other valuable economic spinoffs to industry shows that a refinery project has the potential to be a big win for the province in the long term. "I wouldn't for an instant say, 'Damn the torpedoes, build a new refinery, no matter what,'" says Jim Stanford, an economist with Unifor, the country's largest private sector union. "But I do think the assumption that the private market can make an accurate decision on this unfettered by government is fantasy. What's in Canadians' public interest, he says, isn't always the same as what's in the best interest of a company such as Exxon. For a company, wanting to put spare refining capacity in to good use is sensible. Whether it's in Canada's best economic interests to see oil sands bitumen refined on the Gulf Coast is another question."_

My province (B.C.) is also talking about building refineries. In the north Kitimat might make sense, it could have the Port facilities and would require much shorter pipelines. The XL pipeline could be made obsolete. Lots of things to look at. Of course the prime mover of Governments and most of the people - instant gratification - means we won't take the time to do the best thing for the long term.


----------



## martybegan

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why in the fuck would you find this amusing?
> 
> 
> 
> Because it is helping to save what little environment we have left.
> 
> I could give a fuck about Canadian oil jobs, just like BP Oil jobs in the Gulf after that royal fuck-up.
> 
> Why would I give a shit about people who have no emergency plans for something so monumentally important to American livelihoods, like fisherman, restaurants, etc.?
> 
> FUCK THEM.
> 
> Let the fucking Arabs pump the oil from their wasteland.  Who gives a flying fuck if there is an oil spill in the Saudi desert?
Click to expand...


Well ain't we just a miserable excuse for a human being.

The people who work in the oil industry are used to rises and falls (and the people new to it will learn about it soon enough). Sooner or later prices will go back up, and these trained people will be back to work. In the meantime I'm sure they can find other work, maybe not as well paying, but their skills remain, and when the boom comes back, they can get back to making $$


----------



## martybegan

Dad2three said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Name them. Be specific and quote the IRS tax code.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
Click to expand...


Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?


----------



## Synthaholic

martybegan said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies *
> 
> 
> 
> *President Obama Proposed Repealing $4 Billion In Annual Tax Subsidies For Oil And Gas Companies.* From an Associated Press summary of President Obama's proposed budget for fiscal year 2013:
> 
> Obama would repeal *more than $4 billion per year in tax subsidies to oil, gas and other fossil fuel producers*. The budget proposal says the plan "eliminates inefficient fossil fuel subsidies that impede investment in clean energy sources and undermine efforts to address the threat of climate change.''
> 
> 
> 
> *Energy Expert: "The Incremental Change In Production That Might Result From Changing Oil Subsidies Will Have No Impact On World Oil Prices."* According to Severin Borenstein, co-director of U.C. Berkeley's Center for the Study of Energy Markets, cutting subsidies for oil companies "would not affect gasoline prices."
> 
> 
> Right-Wing Media Falsely Claim That Cutting Tax Breaks For Oil Companies Will Boost Gas Prices
> 
> *Oil Industry Analyst: Impact Would Be Negligible*
> 
> Tom Kloza, an oil industry analyst and founder of the Oil Price Information Service, agreed that the impact would be negligible. "It is a small amount of money considering the huge sums flowing in and out of oil futures," he said, referring to the commodity markets.
> 
> Playing Politics with Gasoline Prices
> 
> *Former API Economist: Ending Oil Subsidies Would Have "Very Little" Effect On Gasoline Prices*
> 
> Energy Experts Debunk Right-Wing Defense Of Oil Subsidies
> 
> 
> Says the oil industry subsidies that President Barack Obama is attacking don’t exist
> — Bill Johnson on Tuesday, April 17th, 2012 in a news conference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The nonpartisan taxpayer watchdog group Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates the U.S. tax code currently contains about $5 billion in yearly tax breaks that are exclusive to the oil and gas industry*, and says the industry also benefits from an extra $5.5 billion worth of general business tax provisions that companies in other industries also claim.
> 
> "The oil and gas industry often argues the tax breaks they take advantage of are available to every industry," the group’s vice president, Steve Ellis, said in an email. "*But obviously other industries can’t realistically claim the Intangible Drilling Costs tax credit (created in 1918) *or the Expensing of Tertiary Injectants tax credit or the Volumetric Ethanol Excise Tax Credit for blending ethanol into fuel."
> 
> 
> ...While use of the word "subsidy" to describe tax credits for the energy industry seems most popular among Democrats, plenty of Republicans have used that phrasing, too.
> 
> 
> 
> *...A March 2012 Congressional Budget Office report on federal financial support for energy development and production also refers to energy tax preferences as "subsidies."*
> 
> Bill Johnson says subsidies for the oil companies that Barack Obama has attacked don't exist
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?
Click to expand...

Have you ever asked that question of USMB's cut-n-paste queen, PoliticalChic?

Of course not, you hack.


----------



## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> martybegan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is your name Synthaholic? Fuck off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
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> *
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> *
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> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
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> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you ever asked that question of USMB's cut-n-paste queen, PoliticalChic?
> 
> Of course not, you hack.
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter to you if one cuts and pastes, or speaks from decades of experience. You'll believe what you want to.


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## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
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> martybegan said:
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> Dad2three said:
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> Mr. H. said:
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> Synthaholic said:
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> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you ever asked that question of USMB's cut-n-paste queen, PoliticalChic?
> 
> Of course not, you hack.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It doesn't matter to you if one cuts and pastes, or speaks from decades of experience. You'll believe what you want to.
Click to expand...

Decades of experience does not make one objective.  Quite the opposite, especially when your livelihood is entangled in that opinion.


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
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> Synthaholic said:
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> martybegan said:
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> Dad2three said:
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> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Really, is 20 seconds of your time worth more than my 38 years in this industry?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you ever asked that question of USMB's cut-n-paste queen, PoliticalChic?
> 
> Of course not, you hack.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It doesn't matter to you if one cuts and pastes, or speaks from decades of experience. You'll believe what you want to.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Decades of experience does not make one objective.  Quite the opposite, especially when your livelihood is entangled in that opinion.
Click to expand...

And I suppose when you need a tooth pulled you call the plumber?


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## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Synthaholic said:
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> Mr. H. said:
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> Synthaholic said:
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> martybegan said:
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> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
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> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *The Solar Industry Created More Jobs In 2014 Than Oil And Gas Extraction*
> 
> 
> *Canada’s green energy sector has grown so quickly and has become such an important part of the economy that it now employs more people than the oil sands.*
> 
> 
> *Green energy sector jobs surpass total oil sands employment - The Globe and Mail*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you ever asked that question of USMB's cut-n-paste queen, PoliticalChic?
> 
> Of course not, you hack.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It doesn't matter to you if one cuts and pastes, or speaks from decades of experience. You'll believe what you want to.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Decades of experience does not make one objective.  Quite the opposite, especially when your livelihood is entangled in that opinion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And I suppose when you need a tooth pulled you call the plumber?
Click to expand...

No, but I certainly don't ask the dentist if he believes dentists make too much money, or if he believes dental hygienists could pull that tooth just as capably.

The answers I would receive would be biased/slanted.

And stop hitting me!


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
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> Synthaholic said:
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> Mr. H. said:
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> Synthaholic said:
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> martybegan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you even have the ability to have your own opinion, or are you just a cut and paste twatwaddle?
> 
> 
> 
> Have you ever asked that question of USMB's cut-n-paste queen, PoliticalChic?
> 
> Of course not, you hack.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It doesn't matter to you if one cuts and pastes, or speaks from decades of experience. You'll believe what you want to.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Decades of experience does not make one objective.  Quite the opposite, especially when your livelihood is entangled in that opinion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And I suppose when you need a tooth pulled you call the plumber?
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, but I certainly don't ask the dentist if he believes dentists make too much money, or if he believes dental hygienists could pull that tooth just as capably.
> 
> The answers I would receive would be biased/slanted.
> 
> And stop hitting me!
Click to expand...

This is why folks such as yourself turn to Josh Fox for information on hydraulic fracturing as opposed to the myriad of available industry publications that are filled with... science, technology, engineering, and mathematics. 

Have a gander...

World Oil - Upstream News | Technology | Exploration | Drilling | Production | Statistics | Careers | Events

Oil & Gas Journal- Oil and Gas News, Prices, Oil Drilling, Exploration and Production

American Oil & Gas Reporter

Welcome to Exploration & Production | Exploration & Production

P.S. -


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## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Have a gander...


I will when I sober up.


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## Mr. H.

Synthaholic said:


> Mr. H. said:
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> 
> 
> Have a gander...
> 
> 
> 
> I will when I sober up.
Click to expand...



I've been perusing such publications since I graduated in the '70s. Absolutely fascinating stuff. A lot of the technical articles are over my head as they can get quite detailed and in-depth. The offshore industry just blows me away. 

I was at a national convention years ago (www.ipaa.org) and noticed Noble Drilling on some guy's name tag. I told him how I'd love to visit an offshore platform and that I'd help pay for gas if I could hitch a ride on a tender. He thought that was funny enough so he gave his card and told to call and ask for his secretary and they's arrange something. Like a doof, I didn't follow up. Self Brotch slap...


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## Synthaholic

Mr. H. said:


> Self Brotch slap...


Here, allow me...


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