# Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?



## RollingThunder (Jun 22, 2014)

I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.

*Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
AlterNet
By Amanda Marcotte  
June 11, 2014
(excerpts)
*Spouting off about stuff you know nothing about is traditionally considered unwise. But as the Republican war on science intensifies, ignorance has started to become not only less of a handicap, but a point of pride. In the face of expertise and facts, being belligerently ignorantand offended that anyone dare suggest ignorance is less desirable than knowledgehas become the go-to position for many conservative politicians and pundits. Sadly, its a strategy thats working, making it harder every day for liberals to argue the value of evidence and reason over wishful thinking and unblinking prejudice. ... But for modern Republicans, being downright proud of their ignorance has become a badge of honor, a way to demonstrate loyalty to the right-wing cause while also sticking it to those liberal pinheads who think theres some kind of value in knowing what they're talking about before offering an opinion.

The thing is, shameless lying and ignorance work surprisingly well as debate tactics. Its hard to argue with someone who not only has signaled that he doesnt care what the truth is but is downright proud of how little he actually knows. Such a person is not amenable to being educated. Once the pretense of really caring one way or another about what is right and what is wrong has been abandoned, all avenue of discourse is shut down. The problem here is that someone who is not only so catastrophically wrong but downright proud of being an ignoramus is not going to actually bother to listen to an explanation like that. Thats why the wall of ignorance is such a powerful rhetorical tool. When you have nothing but contempt for the facts, attempts to educate you will only make your pride in your own ignorance grow stronger. The more you try to educate the proudly ignorant, the dumber they get. At the end of the day, the problem is one of identity. The conservative identity is one of being opposed to everything liberal, to the point of despising anything even associated with liberalism. As liberalism has increasingly been aligned with the values of empiricism and reason, the incentives for conservatives to reject empiricism and reason multiply. To be a conservative increasingly means taking a contemptuous view of reality. And so the proudly ignorant grow more belligerent, day after day.*


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## norwegen (Jun 22, 2014)

I don't get it.  Will you include pictures, please?


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## Dad2three (Jun 22, 2014)

norwegen said:


> I don't get it.  Will you include pictures, please?



The Republican Party hasn't had a single idea that benefited the majority of Americans since before Reagan.


They've embraced anti intellectualism as a virtue for 40+ years, why do you think less than 10% of scientists self ID as Conservative/GOPers?


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## norwegen (Jun 22, 2014)

dad2three said:


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*Pictures!!!!!*


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## westwall (Jun 22, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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Obama and the Democrats have been in power for six years now.  The wealthy have got wealthier, the percentage of people who qualify as poor has grown to the highest level in 40 years, energy costs have been the highest in over a decade for six continuous years, more people need public assistance than ever before and you think the Repubs are to blame?


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## S.J. (Jun 22, 2014)

Rolling Thunder, why didn't you post this thread in the Flame Zone, where it belongs?


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## Dad2three (Jun 22, 2014)

westwall said:


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Oh, the width and depth of the hole the Bush/GOP recession put US into doesn't matter, just that we aren't completely back on track where Clinton had US before the GOP took over?

BTW, Less than 6 years, Obama came into office Jan 20th 2009 AS THE ECONOMY HAD TUMBLED 9%+ THE PREVIOUS QUARTER AND LOSING 700,0000+ JOBS A MONTH  


In 8 years Bush lost 673,000+ PRIVATE sector jobs, took US from Clinton surpluses to crushing debt, AS the GOP has worked against EVERYTHING that might help US? I know, more UNFUNDED tax cuts while we go to war? Perhaps give US UNFUNDED Medicare expansion (Part D) that costs as much this decade as Obamacares does (CBO), which is 100%+ funded?


BTW, 5+ million private sector jobs under Obama, gas prices are where they were in July 2008, SLOWLY digging out of the Bush hole, WHILE the GOP refuses to get out and push


Bureau of Labor Statistics Data


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## Dad2three (Jun 22, 2014)

norwegen said:


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## Dad2three (Jun 22, 2014)

norwegen said:


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## Mr. H. (Jun 22, 2014)

R.T., let's talk hydraulic fracturing. Just to see where the ignorance falls.


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## Dont Taz Me Bro (Jun 22, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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That's a very elementary analysis from a very elementary mind.


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## HUGGY (Jun 23, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



The rich and the clever have been working on gaining whatever advantage they can over the years.

Not surprizingly.... As it turns out it has been demonstrated that winning is everything.  It is an added bonus to find candidates to back that are also ignorant and take pride in being so.

Business contributes much of the expense of running a campaign.  These contributions come at a price.  These contributors expect advantage in congress for their money.  It is much easier to get ignorant candidates to do the bidding of their contributors than intelligent curious candidates that might balk on performing "favors" without scrutiny.

Karl Rove and Dick Army are especially adept at discovering new candidates that are especially willing to trade votes with no conscience of the consequences.


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## Kosh (Jun 23, 2014)

Well the far left had to post something to show that what is in the OP is really about them.

Then again programmed talking points from the far left is nothing new,

See one far left post seen them all.


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

Dont Taz Me Bro said:


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Good rebuttal *shaking head*

Conservatives are mostly dumb, simple minded and with zero honesty today


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## Moonglow (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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Don't you love Mittens as the Doubting Thomas??


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## Dont Taz Me Bro (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Good rebuttal *shaking head*
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> Conservatives are mostly dumb, simple minded and with zero honesty today



Interesting response.  Based on your elementary rantings above I had the impression you were a so-called "liberal."


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## Steven_R (Jun 23, 2014)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7Q8UvJ1wvk]Who's More Pro-Science, Republicans or Democrats? - Neil deGrasse Tyson - YouTube[/ame]

41% of Democrats are Young Earth Creationists. 41% of Democrats are young-Earth creationists


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## Moonglow (Jun 23, 2014)

> Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?



How else to explain Duck Dynasty???


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## S.J. (Jun 23, 2014)

HELLO.....MODS.....How about putting this thread where it belongs?????


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## I.P.Freely (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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## I.P.Freely (Jun 23, 2014)

S.J. said:


> HELLO.....MODS.....How about putting this thread where it belongs?????


morning SJ, perhaps you can explain why a dimwit like you is attracted by right wing mumblings?


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## S.J. (Jun 23, 2014)

I.P.Freely said:


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Perhaps you can kiss my ass.


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## I.P.Freely (Jun 23, 2014)

S.J. said:


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how quaint.


ps your gay?


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## S.J. (Jun 23, 2014)

I.P.Freely said:


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That would be "you're" gay, not "your gay".  Maybe I should reconsider you for the number 2 spot (or 3) on my "dumbest liberal" thread.


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## ScienceRocks (Jun 23, 2014)

The left does some of this too.
1. GMO's. We know damn well we couldn't feed 7 billion humans without messing with things.
2. Bell curve. They'll scream bloody murder about this.


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## Stephanie (Jun 23, 2014)

Can you feel all the love lately from your fellow lefties?

what haven't they call you yet should be the question

love, peace and tolerance is their motto, they crow about it constantly

threads such as this is proof of it..of course it's from the left wing hate site, alteredworldnet

man who can stand being around these types of people?


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## Stephanie (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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well bow to him every day, please
you are one in the very small minority of 30 something % who will...the other 60-70% of the people disagrees with you, damn that must hurt


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## I.P.Freely (Jun 23, 2014)

S.J. said:


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that's what I'm striving for, it would be an honour.

Ps you're gay?


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## bripat9643 (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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Stopping the libturd agenda benefits all Americans.




Dad2three said:


> They've embraced anti intellectualism as a virtue for 40+ years, why do you think less than 10% of scientists self ID as Conservative/GOPers?



Opposing hucksterism and abracadabra is not "anti-intellectualism."

Most "scientists" are liberal because most are sucking on the government tit.


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

Dont Taz Me Bro said:


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You mean like the Founding fathers, the most radical liberals of the day, not the conservatives (Torries) who stood with King George in 1776? Yes, I am a huge liberal, unlike a conservative who can''t/doesn't use reason, logic or honesty....


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

bripat9643 said:


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Sure, and conservatives have such a good record of being on the correct side of history in the US with the major policies since our Founding right? lol. Care to point to the last one the conservatives were on the correct side of history on?




"The Republican Brain: The Science of Why They Deny Science--and Reality"

He has written quite a few articles on the web about his research.

Why Republicans Deny Science: The Quest for a Scientific Explanation
Chris Mooney: Why Republicans Deny Science: The Quest for a Scientific Explanation

Want to Understand Republicans? First Understand Evolution
Chris Mooney: Want to Understand Republicans? First Understand Evolution

The Science of Truthiness: Why Conservatives Deny Global Warming
Chris Mooney: The Science of Truthiness: Why Conservatives Deny Global Warming


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## rdean (Jun 23, 2014)

norwegen said:


> I don't get it.  Will you include pictures, please?



They won't help.  Not with "determined ignorance".


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

Stephanie said:


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Got it, You are part of the low info hate talk radio listeners who believe in false premisses, distortions and lies over facts and reality...


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

Steven_R said:


> Who's More Pro-Science, Republicans or Democrats? - Neil deGrasse Tyson - YouTube
> 
> 41% of Democrats are Young Earth Creationists. 41% of Democrats are young-Earth creationists





Republican Acceptance of Evolution Plummets



A poll released today by the Pew Research Center reveals that acceptance of evolution among Republicans has plummeted in recent years, from 54 percent in 2009 to a jarring 43 percent today. The poll also found that a startling 48 percent of Republicans believe that all living things today have existed in their present form since the start of time. 

Democrats and independents fared much better: 67 percent of Democrats accept evolution today (up from 64 percent in 2009), while 65 percent of independents accept it (down from 67 percent in 2013). Overall, 60 percent of Americans accept the basic fact that humans and other living things have evolved over time, meaning 40 percent support, to varying degrees, creationism. 


Republicans Reject Evolution: Acceptance has plummeted among the GOP.


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## HereWeGoAgain (Jun 23, 2014)

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  The HuffingPaint post? 
I gotta say,you bring less to the table then most of the liberals here. And thats saying something...........


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


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You say that like it's a bad thing...However, it might just be that they're right and you're a victim of brain washing.  

"In June 1936 Max Hahn and his wife Emma were on a walk beside a waterfall near to London, Texas, when they noticed a rock with wood protruding from its core. They decided to take the oddity home and later cracked it open with a hammer and a chisel. What they found within shocked the archaeological and scientific community. Embedded in the rock was what appeared to be some type of ancient man made hammer.

A team of archaeologists analyzed and dated it. The rock encasing the hammer was dated to more than 400 million years old. The hammer itself turned out to be more than 500 million years old. Additionally, a section of the wooden handle had begun the metamorphosis into coal.  The hammers head, made of more than 96% iron, is far more pure than anything nature could have achieved without assistance from relatively modern smelting methods."

Everything We Have Been Taught About Our Origins Is A Lie - Malta Now


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

HereWeGoAgain said:


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Ad homs huh? lol


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## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

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The fact remains that Obamas energy policies hurt the middle class.  Energy costs RAISE all other costs.  Higher food costs?  Extra fuel costs.  Extra electricity costs?  EPA regs.  EVERYTHING costs more now, than six years ago.  That has a direct and immediate impact on the middle class and that is PURELY OBAMA's responsibility.  

Can't blame Bush for that one.  That is all Obama.  As far as your claim about the hole Bush put us into, that is more the fault of the media than anyone else.  They went out of their way to report every negative thing they could to drive the economy down, just like now they are lying through their teeth trying to pump up Obama's "successes".

The facts are there are more people who are living in poverty AFTER Obama than before.  That too is on him.  There are fewer jobs in the US because of policies that HE implemented.  That too is a fact.


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## Katzndogz (Jun 23, 2014)

Moonglow said:


> > Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
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You mean those multimillionaires?


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

hunarcy said:


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The London Hammer: An Alleged Out-of-Place Artifact 



However, the hammer was not documented in situ, and has not been reliably associated with any specific host formation. Other relatively recent implements have been found encased in by similar nodules, and can form within centuries or even decades under proper conditions (Stromberg, 2004). The hammer in question was probably dropped or discarded by a local miner or craftsman within the last few hundred years, after which dissolved limy sediment hardened into a nodule around it. Although a brief rebuttal to Baugh's hammer claims was made by Cole (1985), Baugh and a few other creationists continue to promote it. This review provides further analysis of the hammer and creationist claims about it. 



The London Hammer: An Alleged Out of Place Artifact


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


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Got it, the most energy production under Obama's 5+ years in the last 25 years, but EVERYTHING is Obama's fault? lol



NOTHING right wingers posit as 'facts' actually are, you need causation to prove it, and sorry, Bush/GOP great recession was deep AND wide...


Corp media did that huh? lol


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

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LOL!  As predicted:

"The usual methods of the conformist scientific community, when faced with such anomalies is to attempt to debunk their reported age, or perhaps endeavor to discredit the source of the report or even the reporter. If this approach fails then usually the artefacts themselves are banished to the shadowy vaults of museums and warehouses, never to be seen again. If these unusual artefacts were one offs then perhaps one could be forgiven for accepting the view espoused by the mainstream scientific and archaeological community that they are hoaxes or misreported stories. However, when one realizes that thousands upon thousands of these anomalous artefacts have been discovered and reported over the years, then one may need to re-evaluate ones acceptance of the integrity of mainstream archaeology and science. 

Everything We Have Been Taught About Our Origins Is A Lie - Malta Now


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

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Did Obama's Administration issue the drilling permits that led to that production?  In fact, how much production has occurred based on permits issued by Obama's Administration?


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## Anathema (Jun 23, 2014)

Those of us on the Right place a far greater emphasis on Tradition, Values, and the concept of what one Should do rather than what one Can do. That places us quite often at odds with the Left which seems to emphasize unproven/unprovable science, and the ideal of doing what we Can without any regard for whether we Should or not. That's really where the difference is.


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## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

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Fuel costs were nearly HALF under Bush.  Half.  Calculate the effect of doubling the fuel costs for everything that is produced and transported in the US.  Yes, that is all Obama's fault.

You're a drone.  You have no mind of your own, that is clear to see.  The facts are the facts, and the facts say that Obama has been one of the worst POTUS's we've ever had and I voted for him the first time around.....but not the second.


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## hadit (Jun 23, 2014)

Why are liberals so insecure that they have to bolster their self-esteem by calling everyone else stupid?


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

hadit said:


> Why are liberals so insecure that they have to bolster their self-esteem by calling everyone else stupid?



They certainly don't seem to be able tolerate ideas that are different from their own.


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

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Is there 25+ year RECORD energy production or not? Everything else is irrelevant, unless you don't think energy prices aren't a result of not enough supply but market manipulation conservatives cheer-lead for?


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

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I see...you see the answer isn't advantageous to your political beliefs, so you can't force yourself to answer.

But, before you're excused, let's see if you can answer this...with the 25+ year RECORD energy production, did refinery capacity increase?  Because that also figures into it


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

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Anecdotal stories with no established truths in them, spun by misinformation, lies and strawmen. 

I know, the bible is 'the way' and truth right?


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

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So energy prices are high because oil corps don't want to build more refinery's , NOT the manipulation in the market Goldman Sachs admitted was 40% of the costs? 


Why would you need the question answered again? Is there or is there not record energy production under Obama?


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

hadit said:


> Why are liberals so insecure that they have to bolster their self-esteem by calling everyone else stupid?



Perhaps because conservatives so proudly invoke their anti intellectualism as a virtue?


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## Quantum Windbag (Jun 23, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



Why do idiots make blanket statements that are demonstrably wrong? Could it be the same reason they think large, bold fonts make them look intelligent?


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

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Isn't it odd that this guy can't address the issue raised, then wants to imply that I get my ideas from the Bible, while the information I posted is not supporting bible content?

BTW, if the hammer was modern and merely encased in silica, how is it that the rock encasing the hammer was dated to more than 400 million years old. The hammer itself turned out to be more than 500 million years old?  

How is it that a section of the wooden handle had begun the metamorphosis into coal if it were a modern hammer?  

And, how is it that hammers head, made of more than 96% iron, is far more pure than anything nature could have achieved without assistance?

You won't be able to answer that.  So, you'll just dismiss it out of hand as "anecdotal"   In fact, you're dismissive of anything that doesn't support your theory, just as the topologists you try to condemn as "ignorant".  That's funny!


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## emilynghiem (Jun 23, 2014)

[MENTION=22971]RollingThunder[/MENTION]
As many "secular scientists" and "religious advocates"
have falsely rejected and refused to support Medical Research on Spiritual Healing
despite many long years of testimonies that Forgiveness therapy can even
cure mental and physical illness that medicine alone cannot by itself.

the FAULT is the "false division between science and religion"
which is a MUTUAL FAULT on BOTH SIDES of the divide

Sources: Dr. Francis MacNutt "Healing" Home - Christian Healing Ministries
Dr. Scott Peck "Glimpses of the Devil"
both these authors have cited BOTH SIDES for dividing science from religious teachings and therapeutic practices.
see also
Healing Is Yours

RollingThunder: if you show reluctance in "not being open minded" or "remaining ignorant"
that science can prove spiritual healing is natural, effective and in keeping with medicine,
then THAT FEAR is the problem - and clearly both the religious and the secular science
crowd have followers equally CLOSE MINDED and AFRAID of changing their perceptions!
They both become falsely secure in blaming "the other group" as the problem ("not them!")
when in fact, both are leaving out information the other has, and remain "willfully ignorant."

==============================


RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



Your complaints are VALID in applying to BOTH SIDES of any debate
that could be resolved using science to prove the religious teachings are equally true!


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## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

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There's more than 25 years.  So you tell us.  Why were the fuel costs under Bush almost HALF of what they are today?  I'll grant you that there is market manipulation.  There's no doubt of that. 

However Mr. I don't seem to be able to put two and two together....that means that OBAMA is ALLOWING the oil companies to fuck you over.......  Bush DIDN'T allow it....and Obama is.....


Do you finally begin to understand what sort of person you have thrown your support behind?


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

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Sorry, but if you want to argue with the scientific community that has pretty much debunked YOUR hammer theory,. have at it

Let's go through YOUR link

"A team of archaeologists analysed and dated it. The rock encasing the hammer was dated to more than 400 million years old. The hammer itself turned out to be more than 500 million years old. Additionally, a section of the wooden handle had begun the metamorphosis into coal.  The hammers head, made of more than 96% iron, is far more pure than anything nature could have achieved without assistance from relatively modern smelting methods."

Everything We Have Been Taught About Our Origins Is A Lie | thisishowitisnow




A response to YOUR link


Really, a team of archaeologists? Not a labaratory equipped with carbondating equipment? Wait, not even carbondating - if it is 500 million years old, it follows that radiocarbon dating won't work - it allows for some 70 thousand years, but that's the limit. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. This paragraph simply doesn't live up to that - it leaves open some questions:


Daimonie: Response to [Everything We Have Been Taught About Our Origins Is A Lie]


HAVE AT IT THOUGH


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

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I want the answer posted because I laugh every time one of you obamabots try to claim anything positive done by Bush becomes credited to Obama.

Second, yes, limited refinery capacity contributes to the cost of energy.

Finally, let's see a link to "the manipulation in the market Goldman Sachs admitted was 40% of the costs".


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

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Under Bush fuel costs were half of what it is today? lol, Oh right leave out the costs of gas that hit records July 2008, pre his great recession...

July 2, 2008

Gas prices post 3rd straight record
National average gas price sets all-time high of $4.092 a gallon.

Gas prices post third straight record - Jul. 2, 2008


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

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I'm supposed to get excited by a blog post by some person claiming the name Daimonie?  Thanks, but you'll have to do better.  Perhaps something by an actual scientist? 

But, I thank you for dropping your specious implication that I was talking about the Bible and trying to associate me with people who believe the Earth is only 5,000 years old.

Sorry I'm not fitting your preexisting expectations.


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## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

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WHAT did Bush do that created the fracking that has produced record energy again? 


So  what aren';t the oil comps asking for more refinery's again? lol


Goldman Sachs Admits Its Software Can Manipulate Markets in Unfair Ways


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/07/business/07goldman.html?_r=3&ref=business&



Goldman Sachs says speculation behind much of recent oil price rise, tells clients to sell

Goldman Sachs says speculation behind much of recent oil price rise, tells clients to "sell" | ThinkProgress


GOP admits speculation is helping boost oil prices, moves to gut speculation watchdog anyway


GOP admits speculation is helping boost oil prices, moves to gut speculation watchdog anyway | ThinkProgress


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## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> hunarcy said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



New refineries are being proposed all the time, but are being blocked by the EPA.  But, that won't matter to you.  Because  you gave yourself away on the Goldman Sachs manipulation thing...you're going back to 2009 to explain today's gas prices.  No one who is serious would do that.

I thought you were truly being serious.  Go back to posting your propaganda, I didn't mean to interrupt  you.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

hunarcy said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > hunarcy said:
> ...



Got it, Your hammer theory is crap. Thanks for admitting it

The London hammer (Texas)
The ?London hammer? (Texas) | Bad Archaeology


The London Hammer:
An Alleged Out-of-Place Artifact 

The London Hammer: An Alleged Out of Place Artifact


Carl Edward Baugh is an American young earth creationist. Along with others, Baugh claims to have discovered human footprints alongside dinosaur footprints near the Paluxy River in Texas, but never provided evidence for his alleged findings



His claims have been debunked by the scientific community and other creationists as pseudoscience

 His educational credentials have also been called into question.

Carl Baugh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

hunarcy said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > hunarcy said:
> ...



CARE TO GIVE ME THESES REFINERY'S THE EPA IS BLOCKING? lol

2009 gas prices? Oh right, when Bush hit record US oi prices summer 2008



No new oil refinery has been built in the U.S. in more than 35 years. Now there are two in the works. A 20,000-barrel a day refinery in North Dakota is already under construction and on Monday a second was announced.


New U.S. Oil Refinery Proposed - 24/7 Wall St.
'

YOU wing nuts are terrible at history and facts you know?


----------



## peach174 (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> norwegen said:
> 
> 
> > I don't get it.  Will you include pictures, please?
> ...





Because the rest of them are too afraid to speak, out of fear of losing their job.
Just like in the Universities and Hollywood.
I'm glad to see Conservatives speaking out about their rights in the Universities and in Hollywood.
Scientists should do the same.
It seems that people have had enough of 45 years of liberal threats and intimidation.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

peach174 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > norwegen said:
> ...



Got it, MORE right wing nonsense from the like of rush/Hannity. Weird how SELF DESCRIBED  political leanings of scientists are less than 10% conservative or GOP?


I guess 30+ years of embracing anti intellectualism as a virtue has paid dividends?


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



Factual evidence often runs counter to so called conservative values.  More often than not so called conservatives seem to feign ignorance as a way of disguising dishonesty.


----------



## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

peach174 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > norwegen said:
> ...



They probably get tired of being trolled by people like that propagandist who I just put on ignore.  It's just easier to ignore the unreasonable because they don't have an open mind, and  can't really carry on a conversation.


----------



## hunarcy (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> RollingThunder said:
> 
> 
> > I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> ...



While it's obvious that you have decided on what is "correct" and everything else is "ignorance".  There is nothing so closed as the mind of a young person who "knows" something.  Carry on.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

hunarcy said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > RollingThunder said:
> ...



I've apparently just been admonished by a pompous sounding geriatric.


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## Katzndogz (Jun 23, 2014)

With obama running around saving the honey bees and predicting hurricanes liberals even mentioning ignorance is laughable.


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## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

Katzndogz said:


> With obama running around saving the honey bees and predicting hurricanes liberals even mentioning ignorance is laughable.



This ill considered remark provides a good example of the kind of ignorance the OP seeks to address.


----------



## Stephanie (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > With obama running around saving the honey bees and predicting hurricanes liberals even mentioning ignorance is laughable.
> ...




tough
the op is the ignorant one to lump everyone into the right as if they ALL embrace ignorance FROM some left wing hate site calle, ALTEREDWORLDNET
go bitch at them, I dare ya


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## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



I see, so then your solution is to compound ignorance with more ignorance.  It's always good to hear from a voice of reason.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Good rebuttal *shaking head*
> 
> Conservatives are mostly dumb, simple minded and with zero honesty today



From your perspective as one who is severely retarded, can you explain how the fact that stupidest people on the forum, you included, are all leftists?

You see, I have a thesis that leftism is built on a foundation of stupidity - so that it will attract people like you.

Oh BTW - which banned leftist troll are you? I could guess, but we cannot speak the name of the pink....


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 23, 2014)

Moonglow said:


> > Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> 
> 
> 
> How else to explain Duck Dynasty???



Phil Robertson has a Masters - you failed to get a GED.

Yeah, it DOES explain everything...


----------



## Stephanie (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



oh stuff it,...we're not impressed with the oh so high and the mighty....... go kick your dog or something you feel you need to scold something


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 23, 2014)

I.P.Freely said:


> how quaint.
> 
> 
> ps your gay?



You're illiterate.

Leftism is built on the foundation of utter stupidity - you are sufficient evidence of this thesis.


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## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



Thank you for taking the time to elevate the conversation.


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## Stephanie (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



reading your 300 word spew's is boring
just trying to help... get a clue
see ya zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


>



You really believe the caption, don't you?

Retard.


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## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.


It turns out that there is about as strong a correlation between scores on the science comprehension scale and identifying with the Tea Party as there is between scores on the science comprehension scale and Conservrepub.  

Except that it has the opposite sign: that is, identifying with the Tea Party correlates positively (r = 0.05, p = 0.05) with scores on the science comprehension measure:



www.culturalcognition.net - Cultural Cognition Blog - Some data on education, religiosity, ideology, and science*comprehension


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## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Dont Taz Me Bro said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


 

You're a Big Daddy Government supporter.  The FF valued freedom and personal liberty -- things progressives hate.

You'd have informed on the FF to King George.  Guaranteed.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

rdean said:


> norwegen said:
> 
> 
> > I don't get it.  Will you include pictures, please?
> ...


Here's a picture that illustrates the stupidity and dishonesty of conservatives:



rdean said:


> Big D little a  double L  ----> AS!  And that spells Dallas.


The file name says that's the Fen River.  The Fen river is in China.

Oh, but wait...that was RDEAN that dishonestly and stupidly tried to claim a Chinese river is in Dallas, Texas.

Sorry.  Kerry on with your proglodyte circle jerk.


----------



## boedicca (Jun 23, 2014)

Why do the Progs continuously project their own pathologies and inadequacies upon everyone else?


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## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


When was the last time you read an article from Fox News or the National Review, or any other conservative media?

Bonus points for reading it with an open mind and considering the content.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.
> 
> 
> It turns out that there is about as strong a correlation between scores on the science comprehension scale and identifying with the Tea Party as there is between scores on the science comprehension scale and Conservrepub.
> ...


Proof of the old Reagan quote:

How do you tell a Communist? Well, it's someone who reads Marx and Lenin. And how do you tell an anti-Communist? It's someone who _understands_ Marx and Lenin.​


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



Thank you for the helpful advise, you can be sure that I will give your suggestions all the consideration they deserve.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

boedicca said:


> Why do the Progs continuously project their own pathologies and inadequacies upon everyone else?



 [MENTION=39072]mamooth[/MENTION] is the absolute _worst_ at that.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


Have you ever done anything to merit the level of arrogance you're displaying?  Or do you just think you're _entitled_ to it?

Lots of participation medals will do that do a guy.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



I often watch FOX News when I want my mind opened in one direction.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



My apologies, I had no idea you were chairman of the awards committee.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


Yeah, progs watching Fox just to get angry doesn't count.  No points for you.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



I'm just a guy who notices that progressives seem to believe "being a progressive" is an actual accomplishment worthy of respect that gives their opinions the weight of fact.

In reality, they seem to be a rather stupid and hateful lot.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Had I known you were clairvoyant I could have saved myself the trouble of responding to your posts.  See if you can guess what I'm thinking now.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


Okay.


"................................................."

How'd I do?


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



About as well as expected.


----------



## mamooth (Jun 23, 2014)

Dave, what made you so extra bitchy today? Normally you're more of a little bitch, but lately, you've been ramping it up to major bitch.

Would you like me to lay off, to stop pointing out your bad behavior? You could just try asking nicely. I can be a real sweetie if approached the right way. And I care. I'd hate to see you end up self-destructing like some of my other fan club members.


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## Luddly Neddite (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > norwegen said:
> ...



No they haven't. The Repubs said they would bring the govt down and that's what they've done. Nothing but obstructing, lying, gerrymandering. 

In spite of that, Obama has made huge progress. Just think what he could have done if the damn R had gotten out of the way and if they actually worked for the United States.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> norwegen said:
> 
> 
> > dad2three said:
> ...


----------



## sealybobo (Jun 23, 2014)

If you vote GOP, either you are rich or you are ignorant.  So the right uses wedge issues to win over ignorant poor and middle class Americans.  

This fact alone proves my point.  There is no proof of a god, but the GOP uses an imaginary man in the sky to win over votes.  

Why do they do it?  Because Americans are stupid.  Just look at the survey that came out that Americans would rather vote for a pot smoking phylanderer than they would an atheist. 

So the fact is, the average American is ignorant so that is why they embrace it.  When the public wises up so will the politicians.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

mamooth said:


> Dave, what made you so extra bitchy today? Normally you're more of a little bitch, but lately, you've been ramping it up to major bitch.
> 
> Would you like me to lay off, to stop pointing out your bad behavior? You could just try asking nicely. I can be a real sweetie if approached the right way. And I care. I'd hate to see you end up self-destructing like some of my other fan club members.



Open mindedness apparently works best if you don't disagree.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


Well, sheesh.  You're not giving me much to work with here, Slappy.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

mamooth said:


> Dave, what made you so extra bitchy today? Normally you're more of a little bitch, but lately, you've been ramping it up to major bitch.
> 
> Would you like me to lay off, to stop pointing out your bad behavior? You could just try asking nicely. I can be a real sweetie if approached the right way. And I care. I'd hate to see you end up self-destructing like some of my other fan club members.




There is something growing in your head.  Get a CAT scan.  Tomorro -- no, toNIGHT.  Right away.


----------



## OohPooPahDoo (Jun 23, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?



Its easier than thinking, that's why.


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > norwegen said:
> ...









Once again because it refutes this BS so very well....

Yale university researcher studies conservatives and progressives and finds that conservatives understand science BETTER than the progressives.  It shocks him, but doesn't surprise us in the slightest.


"I've got to confess, though, I found this result surprising. As I pushed the button to run the analysis on my computer, I fully expected I'd be shown a modest negative correlation between identifying with the Tea Party and science comprehension.

But then again, I don't know a single person who identifies with the Tea Party.  All my impressions come from watching cable tv -- & I don't watch Fox News very often -- and reading the "paper" (New York Times daily, plus a variety of politics-focused internet sites like Huffington Post & Politico).  

I'm a little embarrassed, but mainly I'm just glad that I no longer hold this particular mistaken view."




www.culturalcognition.net - Cultural Cognition Blog - Some data on education, religiosity, ideology, and science*comprehension


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## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Surprising......considering your powers of perception.


----------



## Unkotare (Jun 23, 2014)

Wow, another lefty troll thread. Haven't seen one of these in a few seconds...


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## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Luddly Neddite said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


The GOP is under no obligation to rubber-stamp Obama's agenda.  They don't work for him.  They work for their constituents.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



I read your link, it looks like a somewhat less than scientific study of anecdotes and opinions about science......he should be embarrassed.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Dave, what made you so extra bitchy today? Normally you're more of a little bitch, but lately, you've been ramping it up to major bitch.
> ...


Yes, that's how tolerance works for progressives.  If you mindlessly repeat what they say, they'll tolerate you.

If you dare think for yourself, they'll attack.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


Perhaps you're overestimating your intellect.  That seems far more likely.


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...








  Sure thing troll.  He actually did a decent study and was shocked that it refuted his pre-conceived idea.  Fortunately he had the intellectual honesty to publish the results.  Something you clearly aren't, and would not have done.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

I wonder what percentage of so called conservatives actually believe the earth is six thousand years old?  That would make an interesting study.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



That might be true, but I certainly haven't overestimated yours.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



If the same guy had done a similar study under the same conditions about global climate change, and came to a conclusion you didn't agree with, you would have said he was full of shit.   You seem to have a tendency to pick and choose your science based on personal opinions.


----------



## mamooth (Jun 23, 2014)

The researcher:
"The sign of the correlation indicates that science comprehension decreases as political outlooks move in the rightward direction--i.e., the more "liberal" and "Democrat," the more science comprehending."

Westwall:
"Yale university researcher studies conservatives and progressives and finds that conservatives understand science BETTER than the progressives".

Very interesting, the way Westwall claims the researcher says the precise opposite of what the researcher actually said.

Conclusion: If Westwall wants people to stop thinking conservatives are dopes, he should post less often.


----------



## daveman (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


I'm sure it comforts you to believe that.

Say, kid, ever going to _do_ anything to merit that arrogance?


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> I wonder what percentage of so called conservatives actually believe the earth is six thousand years old?  That would make an interesting study.







Very, very small.  It is a very small group of evangelicals who hold to that belief.  Not even
Catholics believe that.  You are grasping at straws because your preconceived notion of superiority has been shot all to hell by a liberal professor.

What a pathetic ass you are....


----------



## itfitzme (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > norwegen said:
> ...



You actually don't know what power is.


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

mamooth said:


> The researcher:
> "The sign of the correlation indicates that science comprehension decreases as political outlooks move in the rightward direction--i.e., the more "liberal" and "Democrat," the more science comprehending."
> 
> Westwall:
> ...









"Except that it has the opposite sign: that is, identifying with the Tea Party correlates positively (r = 0.05, p = 0.05) with scores on the science comprehension measure:"

In other words...for the learning impaired like our dear old admiral here....THE MOST conservative of the Repubs are more scientifically literate than the Democrats.


----------



## itfitzme (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder what percentage of so called conservatives actually believe the earth is six thousand years old?  That would make an interesting study.
> ...



And that very small group actually has real power over the Republican party and conservatives in terms of how you are perceived. That's power.


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

itfitzme said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...







No, it doesn't.  The amount of power those extremists is far less than the power progressives have over the Democrat party and they are truly the most religious nutters of them all.  Their belief systems boggle the mind.  No other political system has killed more people than progressivism worldwide.

At least the people who think the world is 6,00 years old don't want to kill me because I don't agree with them.  That's the purview of the Progressives.


----------



## itfitzme (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > The researcher:
> ...



Dude, an r of .05 makes the statistics useless, regardless of the p value.  That is an r^2 of .0025. It says that the independent variable doesn't predict any thing.  The p value of .05 says the r value is absolutly correct in that being a conservative has no bearing on scientific knowlwdge. It's just completely random whether they do or don't

But your posting it as demonstating something sure is appropriate.  Kinda proves the point.


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

itfitzme said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...







  It's a higher value than that which the climatologists found in the oceans where they claim that is solid evidence that oceans ate the warming!

So which is it!


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder what percentage of so called conservatives actually believe the earth is six thousand years old?  That would make an interesting study.
> ...



Your anecdotal interpretations seem to be at odds with a 2011 Gallup poll which indicates that 30% of American adults believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible.  Maybe you conducted your own study on that to produce the desired results.


----------



## itfitzme (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> itfitzme said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



Dude, you've already proven that you don't know what you're reading.  What you believe you know is irrelevant.  

Here's what we can do.  You find an article or study, read it and post it. Then I'll go over it with you and explain it.

Short of that, you're just a goof.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Good rebuttal *shaking head*
> ...




Got it, projection is the best you have? Seriously?


From a Klown who believes in myths and fairy tales Ayn Rand try's to sell? lol

Keynes wrote "The End of Laissez Faire" in 1926. He was correct then, and his insight remains more valid than any economics that conservative Libertarians propound ad infinitum and ad nauseum. Laissez Faire is nothing more than a childish Christmas wish of no substance; just hope and myth, and smoke and mirrors. Fails every time we try even the tiniest bit.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

Apparently name calling is one of the finer attributes of open mindedness.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> itfitzme said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



You need to get off Beck, Rush, Levine,m etc, it's killing the few brain cells you might have left....


----------



## itfitzme (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> itfitzme said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



Why are you still yammering about this. I already told you that you don't know what power is.

How difficult is it for you to learn?  How many times did you have to repeat kindergarten before you finally learned to use the potty?


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > itfitzme said:
> ...







I don't listen to any of them.  I mainly listen to NPR and classic rock stations.


----------



## westwall (Jun 23, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Apparently name calling is one of the finer attributes of open mindedness.







Says the name caller!


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Apparently name calling is one of the finer attributes of open mindedness.
> ...



Perhaps you'd like to point out the operative phrase.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 23, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > itfitzme said:
> ...



They'd be lost without them, ill defined anger needs a focus.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



HUNDREDS of millions conservatives have spent to create the MYTH of Ronnie, nothing would surprise me Bubba


----------



## SmedlyButler (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.
> 
> 
> It turns out that there is about as strong a correlation between scores on the science comprehension scale and identifying with the Tea Party as there is between scores on the science comprehension scale and Conservrepub.
> ...



I'm not sure even you know what you're trying to say but as long as your quoting from this blog, let's add this quote from same post.



> In this dataset, I found that there is a small correlation (r = -0.05, p = 0.03) between the science comprehension measure and a left-right political outlook measure, Conservrepub, which aggregates liberal-conservative ideology and party self-identification. The sign of the correlation indicates that science comprehension decreases as political outlooks move in the rightward direction--i.e., the more "liberal" and "Democrat," the more science comprehending.



Thanks for pointing this out.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.
> 
> 
> It turns out that there is about as strong a correlation between scores on the science comprehension scale and identifying with the Tea Party as there is between scores on the science comprehension scale and Conservrepub.
> ...



Go back to school (along with our law professor who did the 'study') and take Statistics 101. 


All you have here is the fact that they took a "minority slice" of a group on the right and held it up against the average. Unless you take a corresponding "slice" from the left, such as people who identify as humanists, evolutionists, or environmentalists, then this is really meaningless other than to show that tea-baggers aren't the dumbest part of the right. 

They only used 430 tea party members and 1886 non tea party members. That is not a good study design, that correlation coefficient is terrible. 0 is no correlation and 1 or -1 represents strong correlation. An r value of .05 means nothing. 


There's a WHOLE lot missing. The Professor should stick to law and send his statistical analyses over to the Math Department.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 23, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Dont Taz Me Bro said:
> ...




You mean like those big Gov't Founders who chose a federal big Gov't over a small states rights? YES


conservatives choose to ignore facts and reality and live in a right wing world of delusion and disconnect created by the right wing echo chamber of spin, lies and misinformation.


----------



## SmedlyButler (Jun 23, 2014)

westwall said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



I just want to be sure you read this quote from your link in the post above where you were babbling about science comprehension teaparty vs repubs. So from your link, again;



> In this dataset, I found that there is a small correlation (r = -0.05, p = 0.03) between the science comprehension measure and a left-right political outlook measure, Conservrepub, which aggregates liberal-conservative ideology and party self-identification. The sign of the correlation indicates that science comprehension decreases as political outlooks move in the rightward direction--i.e., the more "liberal" and "Democrat," the more science comprehending.



I'll say "thanks again" for pointing this out. God you're dumb.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

I wonder how many Americans believe that President Obama is a Muslim?  And what would be the average intelligence of those people?  Another interesting subject for statistical study.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



I'm only guilty of picking easy targets.


----------



## Stephanie (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> I wonder how many Americans believe that President Obama is a Muslim?  And what would be the average intelligence of those people?  Another interesting subject for statistical study.



who care's,  but someone like you because you do think you are better than everyone and evidently don't have a life either
what a typical liberal SNOB


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder how many Americans believe that President Obama is a Muslim?  And what would be the average intelligence of those people?  Another interesting subject for statistical study.
> ...



Evidently 17% of Americans say they believe the President is a Muslim.  Therefore 17% of Americans are either very stupid or completely dishonest.


----------



## Toro (Jun 24, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



It's a good question. 

One reason is because apocalyptical leftist environmentalists have been spectacularly wrong in the past.

That doesn't mean they're wrong now. But go back and read about the predictions of the new ice age in the 70s, and how acid rain had killed lakes for 10,000 years, and you can see why some people might be skeptical of global warming.


----------



## Toro (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> I wonder how many Americans believe that President Obama is a Muslim?  And what would be the average intelligence of those people?  Another interesting subject for statistical study.



Or how many people thought Bush was either behind 9/11 or knew about it and let it happen. 

I'm betting many more Democrats believe that one than Republicans.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Toro said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder how many Americans believe that President Obama is a Muslim?  And what would be the average intelligence of those people?  Another interesting subject for statistical study.
> ...



I'll bet you would bet that.   Maybe you should conduct a study to confirm your hypothesis.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...




why dont you conduct if for him or her?
 i mean some morons seem to have nothing to do but use other people's money to give to people to find a "conclusion" they wanted in the first place


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...



Indeed!  I see many people on this forum going to great lengths to confirm what they were already predisposed to believe.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...




yes it's a message board

wow!


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



Which of course precludes any rational discussion.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...




in your opinion it does.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...




then stay in the classroom


----------



## Toro (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



A survey of New Jersey Democrats demonstrated exactly that. Fully a third believed Bush was behind 9/11 or had foreknowledge of the attacks.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Toro said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...



No doubt this little New Jersey factoid has great significance for you.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



Maybe if you answer twice it will make more sense.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



this board is also filled with losers that; when confronted with inconveniant facts that fall outside of the narrative they have for others; ones that are closer to home; are simply ignored or dismissed


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...



My thoughts exactly.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...




your thoughts exactly or your practice exactly?
 be honest


----------



## Toro (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



If you understand statistics, yes.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



Be honest?  You go first.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...




ok; i'm convinced my views are correct. who isnt?
doesnt mean i dimiss all opposing views outright

why dont you just say what you're thinking; or go cry somewhere?


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



I thought you were going to be honest.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...





YAWN
 oh the denial; another item more rampant on the side that loves accusing the other side of the same thing


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



How did that birth certificate thing work out?  Did so called conservatives ever unravel the conspiracy?


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

itfitzme said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...


It also disproves the left's claim that conservatives are scientifically ignorant.

You should perhaps go ahead and admit that.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



I wonder which banned leftist troll he is?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

westwall said:


> What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.
> 
> 
> It turns out that there is about as strong a correlation between scores on the science comprehension scale and identifying with the Tea Party as there is between scores on the science comprehension scale and Conservrepub.
> ...



This makes perfect sense.

If USMB is a microcosm of the nation at large, the clearly the conservatives are far better educated than the leftists.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



Like I said...you really believe it.  Because it was posted on Democratic Underground, so you immediately and unquestioningly accepted it.  And because you wanted to believe it's true, it really IS true.

Magical thinking is a hallmark of progressives.  That's how they can see the many historic failures of progressivism and claim it can work.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

boedicca said:


> Why do the Progs continuously project their own pathologies and inadequacies upon everyone else?



They do as they are instructed, they lack the capacity of thought.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


The FF WANTED a big Federal Government?  

Wow.  You can make yourself believe _anything_, no matter how stupid, can't you?

Perhaps you've never noticed that the Constitituion places LIMITS on the power of the Federal government.  NOT on the people, and NOT on the states.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> I often watch FOX News when I want my mind opened in one direction.



You turn on MSNBC when you want your mind closed, then?


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



So, you've got "believes in progressivism" as an accomplishment on your resume.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


What percentage of Americans voted for Obama a second time?

There's your stupid people.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


"Rational discussion" being, of course, anything that agrees with you.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


You just make sure you don't condemn the stupid Jersey Democrats.  You'll burst into flame or something.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Toro said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...


Suddenly, statistics isn't important to Bob.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> You need to get off Beck, Rush, Levine,m etc, it's killing the few brain cells you might have left....



Why is this thread not in badlands?

This is a troll thread by a mentally retarded leftist - it has NOTHING to do with science and technology. Megatroll Dad2three clearly failed to complete primary education, and wouldn't know "science" if it bit him on the ass and made his scalp bleed...


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> itfitzme said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



You provide a perfect example of the kind of ignorance the OP is addressing.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > You need to get off Beck, Rush, Levine,m etc, it's killing the few brain cells you might have left....
> ...



Your right, the OP has very little to do with science, but it has everything to do with people who don't except or understand science.


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

westwall said:


> What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.
> 
> 
> It turns out that there is about as strong a correlation between scores on the science comprehension scale and identifying with the Tea Party as there is between scores on the science comprehension scale and Conservrepub.
> ...



Did you read what it said right at the top?




> *Cultural Cognition Blog
> 
> No, this blog post is not a federally funded study. It's neither "federally funded" nor a "study"!​*


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > What's truly funny is in a Yale research paper it was found conservatives have a much better grasp of science than the libs who think they do.
> ...



Nope, not even close! USMB political forums are largely comprised of "likely voters" from all parts of the political spectrum. 

Given the apathy of registered voters USMB political forums are atypical of the nation at large. What is scary is that this is a reflection of the "better educated" of the conservatives.


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> boedicca said:
> 
> 
> > Why do the Progs continuously project their own pathologies and inadequacies upon everyone else?
> ...



Ironic!


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

people who call the record welfare and food stamps on their watch "forward progress" should avoid commenting on the lack of capacity of thought of others

libs are losers who lie to themselves


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Actually the Constitution does place limits on the states and the people. The states cannot deprive the people of rights enumerated in the Constitution and the people cannot violate the constitutional rights of others.


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

Toro said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> people who call the record welfare and food stamps on their watch "forward progress" *should avoid commenting on the lack of capacity of thought of others
> 
> libs are losers who lie to themselves*



 at the irony!


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

irony

 Black and Hispanic Americans; women too; had it better when Republicans were running things



libs are losers who lie to themselves


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> irony
> 
> Black and Hispanic Americans; women too; had it better when Republicans were running things
> 
> ...



That must be why blacks, hispanics and women have been voting for Republicans in record numbers.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > irony
> ...



good point dimwit; there is much work to be done undoing decades of pandering and lies told to minorities

but obama; the nominal head of the Democrat Party; lost ground among even his strongest supporters from the first election to the second


----------



## S.J. (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > irony
> ...


With all the election fraud, who would know?


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Racism doesn't explain why Obama's approval rating is falling



Latest news, world news, sport and comment from the Guardian | theguardian.com | The Guardian &#8250; Opinion &#8250; Barack Obama





The Guardian





Aug 11, 2013 - Does being black cost President Obama support among white voters? ... Obama lost the white vote in 2012, according to the final pre-election Pew ... Moreover, Obama is also seeing his numbers drop among minorities.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

even the NAACP  has said Black Americans have it WORSE  under obama

enjoy your moments being a smug idiot left-wing nutjob

 you cant fool all the people all the time


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



There sure is a lot of name calling around here.  No doubt the low standards of behavior on this forum suit you well.


----------



## sealybobo (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> even the NAACP  has said Black Americans have it WORSE  under obama
> 
> enjoy your moments being a smug idiot left-wing nutjob
> 
> you cant fool all the people all the time



Yea but they don't blame Obama jackass.  

"Are you better off now than you were 4 years ago" ignores the fact that it was GOP policies from 2000-2006 that put us in the poor house and GOP Obstruction from 2007-present that is slowing down the recovery.


----------



## sealybobo (Jun 24, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Racism doesn't explain why Obama's approval rating is falling
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No but bullshit polls do. 

Do you even know what they are doing to you?  They are playing you like a fool.  They'll show you bogus polls that show Obama's approval is low, just like they did in 2010, KNOWING that not a lot of people vote during midterms.  So the right is going to pretend that they have a mandate and that the people are behind them but the fact is, the people are stupid for not voting every 2 years.  

And in 2016 we will win the White House and probably win back whatever numbers we lose this year.  Just like in 2010, the GOP will win the 2014 midterms.  Happens every midterm.  But make no mistake about it that doesn't mean the masses like or want the GOP running this country.  

The people who only vote every 4 years or the people who don't vote at all do not deserve to live in this country.  The only thing I hate more than republican voters are people who don't vote.


----------



## Stephanie (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



do you post just to see yourself post? 
you've become a TROLL already by overtaking this thread and you just joined
oh well, the more you talk the more people see you as a pompous ass
are you this boring in real life?


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

sealybobo said:


> bedowin62 said:
> 
> 
> > Racism doesn't explain why Obama's approval rating is falling
> ...



in 2012 Dems won back a whole 10 of the 70 seats they lost in 2010



libs are idiots

Republicans will keep the House and take the Senate back this year

it's hard for repbulicans to win the White House because of the way the electoral college works; libs have the ignorant vote sewn up in the large population centers

libs are losers who lie to themselves


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 24, 2014)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> RollingThunder said:
> 
> 
> > Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> ...





daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Mind reader AND a person who sets up false premises and argues from there, I hit the jackpot 


Next we just need the distortions and lies, and you use up ALL the rights wings ammo, as they have nothing else but failed policy to fall back on


----------



## kwc57 (Jun 24, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut.....



Let me know when they publish the second installment about the insane behavior of the left.  I bet it will be equally riveting.

What a sheeple.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...





Weird, perhaps you didn't notice the F/F chose a STRONG federal Gov't over the weaker Articles of Confederation?

And James Madison favored a STRONGER stronger federal Gov't and role while the Anti Federalists wanted stronger states rights, which side won? lol


----------



## bripat9643 (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> bripat9643 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



The meaning of the terms "liberal" and "conservative" have changed dramatically over the last two centuries, so your question is a non sequitur.  




Dad2three said:


> "The Republican Brain: The Science of Why They Deny Science--and Reality"
> 
> He has written quite a few articles on the web about his research.
> 
> ...



You're obviously a colossal sucker for psuedo-science.  The above abracadabra is not science.  It's hucksterism.

No one is surprised that you fell for it, however.


----------



## bedowin62 (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > RollingThunder said:
> ...




failed policy:

record welfare and food stamps in the eighth-straight year of Democrat-majority rule

libs are losers who lie to themselves


----------



## bripat9643 (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



The Federalists wanted a slightly stronger federal government, not a "strong" federal government.  They would be appalled at the leviathan the federal government has become.

The fact that the Federalists won only shows that even smart men can make dumb mistakes.


----------



## KissMy (Jun 24, 2014)

Mr. H. said:


> R.T., let's talk hydraulic fracturing. Just to see where the ignorance falls.


    [MENTION=20545]Mr. H.[/MENTION]

What is the EROEI of Oil fracked & Canadian Tar Sands?

What is your production cost to extract per barrel?

What price effect will Keystone pipeline have on gas prices here in the USA?

How many years worth of recoverable oil do we have here in the USA?

Have you been covered in oil? Is it toxic? How old are you? Had any health problems?

Did oil + corexit kill shrimp in the Gulf?

Is oil subsidized?

Are tax payers paying for highways?

Were we in Iraq to lower oil prices?

Do we protect Persian Gulf Oil Shipments?

From the time you purchase an oil drilling lease how long does it take to turn that into a market supplying oil producing well?

What is your fastest time at turning a lease into a oil producing well?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Your right, the OP has very little to do with science, but it has everything to do with people who don't except or understand science.



Yes, people like you and the MegaTroll. Partisan hacks who think that Rachel Maddow is an expert on science.

I'm sure that if we took every last one of you leftists in this thread. you would scarcely break a 2 digit IQ..

Say sploogy, the most critical element of the scientific method is;

A.) Consensus
B.) Falsification
C.) Faith
D.) Government Grants

Standard Disclaimer: If you answered "A," you voted for Obama and have an IQ less than 10... IOW, you're a typical democrat.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > bedowin62 said:
> ...



Fortunately your fine example sets a high standard for reasonable discussion.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > Your right, the OP has very little to do with science, but it has everything to do with people who don't except or understand science.
> ...



No doubt we can rely on your knowledge and scientific expertise to verify your conclusions.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> Nope, not even close! USMB political forums are largely comprised of "likely voters" from all parts of the political spectrum.
> 
> Given the apathy of registered voters USMB political forums are atypical of the nation at large. What is scary is that this is a reflection of the "better educated" of the conservatives.



Nonsense, those who post here are interested in discussions of politics, but I would not say that makes them "likely voters."

Still, among the most politically astute, those with conservative views are significantly better educated, and demonstrably smarter than those who lean left.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > boedicca said:
> ...



You misspelled "irrefutable."


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> Actually the Constitution does place limits on the states and the people. The states cannot deprive the people of rights enumerated in the Constitution and the people cannot violate the constitutional rights of others.



And you can tell this by the repeated use of the phrase "Congress shall make no.."


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> No doubt we can rely on your knowledge and scientific expertise to verify your conclusions.



You answered "A," dinja?


----------



## IlarMeilyr (Jun 24, 2014)

RollingBlunder said:
			
		

> Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?



It doesn't.

Why do you left wing propagandist assholes embrace your ceaseless dishonesty as a virtue?


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > No doubt we can rely on your knowledge and scientific expertise to verify your conclusions.
> ...



E) Uniformed anecdotes and opinions of science are completely meaningless.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> E) Uniformed anecdotes and opinions of science are completely meaningless.



Come now, you think "consensus" is the foundation of legitimate scientific study, don't you?

Okay Mr. Scientist, tell the class why you hate GMO's and how that fits with your vast understanding of science, would you? Or perhaps you can offer some really valid scientific insight on fracking?

ROFL

We both know you are nothing but a mindless partisan hack, spewing idiotic shit from MSDNC and thinking that is actual science...


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > E) Uniformed anecdotes and opinions of science are completely meaningless.
> ...



No, I think we can rely on scholars like you to provide all the really valid scientific insight this forum will ever need.


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > Nope, not even close! USMB political forums are largely comprised of "likely voters" from all parts of the political spectrum.
> ...



Given your demonstrated bias that allegation has zero credibility. Both sides have astute and educated posters.


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...



Your ego exceeds your intelligence by a considerable margin!


----------



## Derideo_Te (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > Actually the Constitution does place limits on the states and the people. The states cannot deprive the people of rights enumerated in the Constitution and the people cannot violate the constitutional rights of others.
> ...



Your ego also exceeds your education by a considerable margin! The Constitution is the law that governs Congress.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> No, I think we can rely on scholars like you to provide all the really valid scientific insight this forum will ever need.



Well of course, you turn to Rachel Maddow and Jon Stewart for all the science you need.

I mean, you're a leftist, ergo you have the intellect of a stalk of broccoli..


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> Given your demonstrated bias that allegation has zero credibility. Both sides have astute and educated posters.



The ration bodes poorly for the left, though...


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Derideo_Te said:
> ...



Yet you made the absurd claim that the Constitution places limits on the people.


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > No, I think we can rely on scholars like you to provide all the really valid scientific insight this forum will ever need.
> ...



When I want completely unbiased opinions about science I turn to Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh.   I'll bet they know almost as much as you do.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > itfitzme said:
> ...


Why?  Because I don't immediately and unquestioningly accept and endorse AGW dogma?  Because I think you're a self-important dumbass?

These are the questions which plague men's minds.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



"Accept".

Dumbass.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...


It would be scary, if you believed what progressives say about conservatives.

We've talked via PM.  Would you think me uneducated or stupid?


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



No, because you're not a real scientist......you just play one on this forum.


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## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


True.  But most of the limitations are on the fedgov.  

Why would the FF place limits on the fedgov if they wanted a huge powerful central government?

Dad2three can't answer that question.  Maybe you could give it a shot.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > RollingThunder said:
> ...


It doesn't matter what I say -- you'll call it distortions and lies anyway.

That is YOUR ammo.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


Yup, no question...you'd have had King George on speed-dial.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> "The Republican Brain: The Science of Why They Deny Science--and Reality"
> 
> He has written quite a few articles on the web about his research.
> 
> ...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Mooney_(journalist)

He's a writer.  He's not a scientist.

Confirmation Bias
Confirmation bias refers to a type of selective thinking whereby one tends to notice and to look for what confirms one's beliefs, and to ignore, not look for, or undervalue the relevance of what contradicts one's beliefs. 

--

This tendency to give more attention and weight to data that support our beliefs than we do to contrary data is especially pernicious when our beliefs are little more than prejudices.​
Well, that nailed you to the wall.


----------



## daveman (Jun 24, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...


Oh, then I can dismiss your views on science, because you're not a scientist.

Or is it different...somehow...it just is, dammit!...with you?


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 24, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



That goes without saying.  Why would you seek opinions on science from people who aren't scientists?  Do you talk to a plumber when you want medical opinions?


----------



## ScienceRocks (Jun 24, 2014)

The tea party wants to cut science by 10%. Hell, they want to end all grants and privatize the entire nws.

These people need to be defeated.


----------



## ScienceRocks (Jun 24, 2014)

I'll fight like hell to defend our edge in science and our institutions that make us the best in the world!


----------



## daveman (Jun 25, 2014)

Discombobulated said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Discombobulated said:
> ...



Nope.  And when I want something from a scientist, I make sure I find one who doesn't alter, distort, and cherry-pick data to arrive at his preselected conclusion.


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## daveman (Jun 25, 2014)

Matthew said:


> The tea party wants to cut science by 10%. Hell, they want to end all grants and privatize the entire nws.
> 
> These people need to be defeated.



The problem is, idiots like you consider flushing a half a billion dollars down the Solyndra toilet to be a good investment in science.  

Government can't choose between ideas and MAKE some of them work.  That's best left to private enterprise.


----------



## IlarMeilyr (Jun 25, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> * * * * The Constitution is the law that governs Congress. * * * *



^ that is a correct theoretical assertion.

Sadly, given the realities of American iife for a couple of generations now, it is not a correct assertion about how things really are.

The Constitution is the instrument that is DESIGNED to govern Congress and limit it.

Of course, it is also the instrument that is DESIGNED to govern and limit the power of the Executive Branch.

That's not working out too well either.


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## Discombobulated (Jun 25, 2014)

daveman said:


> Matthew said:
> 
> 
> > The tea party wants to cut science by 10%. Hell, they want to end all grants and privatize the entire nws.
> ...



Private enterprise should establish all this country's priorities because they always have our best interest at heart.


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## Discombobulated (Jun 25, 2014)

daveman said:


> Discombobulated said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Your vast wealth of scientific knowledge no doubt enables you to know the difference.


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## Derideo_Te (Jun 25, 2014)

daveman said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...



Quite the opposite. You are as astute as anyone on the left and I have never had any reason to believe you to be uneducated. 

My comment was largely tongue in cheek and directed primarily at Uncensored. He isn't stupid or uneducated either but he does make some really stupid allegations about those on the left. That kind of baiting doesn't add anything of value to the debate in my opinion. Quite the opposite since it is merely intended to flame rather than enlighten.


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## Derideo_Te (Jun 25, 2014)

daveman said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



The purpose envisioned by the FF was appropriate for the times. But they clearly understood that things would change in the future in a way that they could not foresee. 

At the time of signing the Constitution the total population was 4 million. Today the military has 2.3 million (including reserves). Overall the government of today (federal, state and local) employs about 22 million people out of a population of 315 million. This averages to 7.3% of the population over the last 5 presidents. For the record under Obama it is only 6.9%.

The Growth Of Government: 1980 To 2012 - Forbes

Big government" is actually not that big in real terms when you consider that the FF never envisioned a standing army capable of striking anywhere in the world at a moment's notice. They never foresaw a network of space satellites making it possible to know exactly where you are to within a couple of yards. They never anticipated a global internet that allows you and I to have this debate even though we have never met in person.

But if we look closer at the things that the FF's actually did we discover that they passed a law to register all guns. They implemented mandatory health insurance for sailors (including a payroll tax) with government run hospitals. They built libraries and encouraged education. 

So to answer your question the FF's did sow the seeds for the government we have today and in real terms it isn't all that big. If you want to reduce it then you have to come up with a realistic alternative to the military, police, customs, parks, roads, etc, etc that we have today.

Can you do that?


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## Dad2three (Jun 25, 2014)

bripat9643 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > bripat9643 said:
> ...




Sure it has. The US Founders were BY FARRRR the most educated AND radical of their times. Know who stood with King George in 1776? The conservatives, Torrie's


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## Dad2three (Jun 25, 2014)

bedowin62 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > OohPooPahDoo said:
> ...





Weird? Care to point to Dems laws passed 2007-2009 that caused Dubya/GOP great recession? PLEASE?


Right-wingers Want To Erase How George Bush's "Homeowner Society" Helped Cause The Economic Collapse


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 25, 2014)

bripat9643 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...





Oh MORE opinion


The Rights Dubious Claim to Madison


James Madison, a chief architect of the U.S. Constitution when he was essentially a protégé of George Washington in the 1780s. But Madison was also a practical politician who drifted  in the 1790s and later  into the orbit of his central Virginia neighbor, Thomas Jefferson, who led bitter fights against Washingtons Federalists and especially Alexander Hamilton.


....Madison was of a similar mind. In 1781, as a member of the Congress under the Articles of Confederation, he introduced a radical amendment that would have required states that ignored their federal responsibilities or refused to be bound by decisions of Congress to be compelled to do so by use of the army or navy or by the seizure of exported goods, noted Chris DeRose in Founding Rivals. However, Madisons plan  opposed by the powerful states  went nowhere.


...Madison told Washington that the states had to be made subordinately useful, a sentiment that Washington shared after seeing how states had failed to meet their financial obligations to his troops during the Revolution.


The Right?s Dubious Claim to Madison | Consortiumnews


One of the more novel provisions of the Virginia Plan, formulated by James Madison, who discussed the proposal in a number of letters prior to the Convention (Hobson 1979, 219), was a provision for a congressional negative on state laws. Section 6 of the Virginia Plan accordingly provided that Congress would have the power "to negative all laws passed by the several States, contravening in the opinion of the National Legislature the articles of Union" (Farrand 1937, I, 21). This was in addition to the negative that the proposed Council of Revision, consisting of the president and key members of the judiciary, would exercise over both congressional and state legislation, subject to congressional override


ABC-CLIO SCHOOLS


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 25, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > Actually the Constitution does place limits on the states and the people. The states cannot deprive the people of rights enumerated in the Constitution and the people cannot violate the constitutional rights of others.
> ...



Article I of the Constitution sets forth most of the powers of Congress, which include numerous explicit powers enumerated in Section 8. Constitutional amendments have granted Congress additional powers. Congress also has implied powers derived from the Necessary and Proper Clause of the Constitution.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 25, 2014)

daveman said:


> Matthew said:
> 
> 
> > The tea party wants to cut science by 10%. Hell, they want to end all grants and privatize the entire nws.
> ...



(Re-)Introducing: The American School of Economics


When the United States became independent from Britain it also rebelled against the British System of economics, characterized by Adam Smith, in favor of the American School based on protectionism and infrastructure and prospered under this system for almost 200 years to become the wealthiest nation in the world.   Unrestrained free trade resurfaced in the early 1900s culminating in the Great Depression and again in the 1970s culminating in the current Economic Meltdown.


Closely related to mercantilism, it can be seen as contrary to classical economics. It consisted of these three core policies:

    protecting industry through selective high tariffs (especially 18611932) and through subsidies (especially 193270)

    government investments in infrastructure creating targeted internal improvements (especially in transportation)

    a national bank with policies that promote the growth of productive enterprises rather than speculation


Frank Bourgin's 1989 study of the Constitutional Convention shows that direct government involvement in the economy was intended by the Founders

American School of Economics


American School (economics) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Solyndra accounts for less than 2% of the DOE's successful Loan Program

Despite what critics say, the DoEs guaranteed loan program is a successful program. The default rate for the loan portfolio is less than 4%. By comparison, the loan default rate for the Small Business Administration is nearly 12%, three times as high as the DoEs loan program.  

Secretary Chu also clarified that the actual cost to the taxpayer of DoE's loan program will be roughly $2.5 billion, which is the actual amount appropriated to the program, and not the $38.6 billion that is often cited. Considering the program has created over 60,000 jobs, it cost taxpayers roughly $42,000 per job created


Solyndra accounts for less than 2% of the DOE's successful Loan Program


Reuters: Venture Capitalists Point To Solyndra As One Of The Top 10 Companies "Ripest" To Go Public. Reuters reported in August 2009:
Investors eye top startups as IPO market awakens - Aug. 19, 2009


Market Conditions Shifted Significantly from 2009 to 2011


"advantages that were more important in 2009 when it received a $535 million U.S. loan guarantee to build a factory" than they are now, noting that the price of the silicon-based panels with which Solyndra was competing "has fallen 46 percent since then."
Obama?s Solar Bets May Avoid Solyndra?s Fate With Low Costs - Bloomberg


----------



## daveman (Jun 26, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Derideo_Te said:
> ...


All Constitutionally-mandated government functions could stand to be trimmed -- some more than others.

All the non-Constitutionally-mandated government functions could stand to be eliminated.


----------



## daveman (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> bripat9643 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


Tell me something bad liberals have done.


----------



## daveman (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Weird? Care to point to Dems laws passed 2007-2009 that caused Dubya/GOP great recession? PLEASE?
> 
> 
> Right-wingers Want To Erase How George Bush's "Homeowner Society" Helped Cause The Economic Collapse



That's true...well, it would be, if it wasn't completely false.


----------



## daveman (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Matthew said:
> ...



Up to 50 Obama-backed energy companies financially troubled | The Daily Caller

Obama picked companies not for their potential success, but by how much the owners contributed to his campaign.

Democrats believe the Treasury's purpose is to let them give money to cronies.


----------



## theliq (Jun 26, 2014)

Dont Taz Me Bro said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



Not at all......your elementary analysis of economics has a lot to be desired


----------



## theliq (Jun 26, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Boring Republican Currs comment..ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzBORING


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## daveman (Jun 26, 2014)

theliq said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


That's nice.  Run along now.


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## Derideo_Te (Jun 26, 2014)

daveman said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



So are you willing to trim the military by 50%?

Let's turn to these "non-Constitutionally-mandated government functions" that you want to eliminate. 

Are you willing to eliminate social security, medicare and medicaid since they none of those are "Constitutionally-mandated government functions"?


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

daveman said:


> Derideo_Te said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Weird, You'd think conservatives would have SCOTUS throw out those 'non constitutional' programs?


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > bripat9643 said:
> ...



You PLEASE tell me what policy conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history since the US Founding? Just one, PLEASE?


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Weird? Care to point to Dems laws passed 2007-2009 that caused Dubya/GOP great recession? PLEASE?
> ...



BARNEY FRANK? Minority member of the GOP House 1995-2007? What super powers did he have again?


WHAT were the Dems saying (CONTEXT) and WHEN?

The "turmoil in financial markets clearly was triggered by a dramatic weakening of underwriting standards for U.S. subprime mortgages, beginning in late 2004 and extending into 2007," the President's Working Group on Financial Markets OCT 2008


DUBYA FOUGHT ALL 50 STATE AG'S IN 2003, INVOKING A CIVIL WAR ERA RULE SAYING FEDS RULE ON "PREDATORY" LENDERS!

Dubya was warned by the FBI of an "epidemic" of mortgage fraud in 2004. He gave them less resources. Later in 2004 Dubya allowed the leverage rules to go from 12-1 to 33-1 which flooded the market with cheap money!

Bush drive for home ownership fueled housing bubble


He insisted that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac meet ambitious new goals for low-income lending.

Concerned that down payments were a barrier, Bush persuaded Congress to spend as much as $200 million a year to help first-time buyers with down payments and closing costs.

And he pushed to allow first-time buyers to qualify for government insured mortgages with no money down



Thanks again to the Bush administrations allowing the greedy & unethical brokers to operate at their will.


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## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

daveman said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



TROUBLED? LOL

LESS THAN 4% OF DOE BUDGET DEFAULTED, MUCH BETTER THAN PRIVATE MARKETS



Bush Admin. Advanced16 Projects, Including Solyndra, Out Of 143 Submissions
Hearings and Votes | Energy & Commerce Committee

DOE Under Bush Admin. Set Out Timeline For Completing Solyndra Review
http://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/Solar Background Document 1.pdf

In March, The Same Credit Committee Of Career Civil Servants recommended Approval
Exclusive Timeline: Bush Administration Advanced Solyndra Loan Guarantee for Two Years, Media Blow the Story | ThinkProgress

DOE Official: "It's The Same Group Of Career Professionals That Were On The First Committee."
Hearings and Votes | Energy & Commerce Committee



NEXT


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Article I of the Constitution sets forth most of the powers of Congress, which include numerous explicit powers enumerated in Section 8. Constitutional amendments have granted Congress additional powers. Congress also has implied powers derived from the Necessary and Proper Clause of the Constitution.



Yes it does, drooling little sycophant. 

Of course none of this has a damned thing to do with your ignorant claim that the Constitution places limits on the people. 

Hatred and stupidity are the twin pillars of leftism, which you exemplify so well, Cletus.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Article I of the Constitution sets forth most of the powers of Congress, which include numerous explicit powers enumerated in Section 8. Constitutional amendments have granted Congress additional powers. Congress also has implied powers derived from the Necessary and Proper Clause of the Constitution.
> ...



Care to give that quote? PLEASE? 



I never meant to say that the conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative. I believe that is so obviously and universally admitted a principle that I hardly think any gentleman will deny it.

John Stuart Mill, in a letter to the Conservative MP, John Pakington


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> You PLEASE tell me what policy conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history since the US Founding? Just one, PLEASE?



In another thread, one of your fellow Khmer Rouge democrats was advocating for your little tin god, Obama, to "ignore the do nothing congress and rule through executive order."

So we see that you of the Khmer Rouge advocate for one man rule, AKA dictatorship. Ergo, there is nothing even remotely "liberal" about you. You are totalitarian leftists - seeking to establish dictatorship where all assets, including people, are the property of rulers in Washington DC.


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## sealybobo (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



In a conservative/libertarian/tea bagger America even freedom wouldn't be free.  In fact it's not anymore.  If you want to even run for a house seat you better have millions of dollars or forget it.  Politicians spend 2 hours of their day working for constituents and the rest of the day dealing with lobbyists and begging for donations so they can run again in 4 more years.  Funny you have to have millions of dollars to get a job that only pays $200K.  Citizens United is another perfect example.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Care to give that quote? PLEASE?



Which quote Cletus, specifically?



> I never meant to say that the conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative. I believe that is so obviously and universally admitted a principle that I hardly think any gentleman will deny it.
> 
> John Stuart Mill, in a letter to the Conservative MP, John Pakington



Hatred and stupidity are the twin pillars of leftism. - The Uncensored One on USMB.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain (Jun 26, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



   Why do lefties suck dick in back alleys for fun and profit?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 26, 2014)

sealybobo said:


> In a conservative/libertarian/tea bagger America even freedom wouldn't be free.  In fact it's not anymore.  If you want to even run for a house seat you better have millions of dollars or forget it.  Politicians spend 2 hours of their day working for constituents and the rest of the day dealing with lobbyists and begging for donations so they can run again in 4 more years.  Funny you have to have millions of dollars to get a job that only pays $200K.  Citizens United is another perfect example.



You believe that freedom is a far too precious to be entrusted to the peasants, right Silly Bonobo?

Freedom must be kept safe by rulers appointed by the party, who can keep infidels from abusing it by uttering words and thoughts that might damage the party or disparage our Dear Leader.

You Khmer Rouge democrats advocate freedom through unquestioning obedience....


----------



## Discombobulated (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > In a conservative/libertarian/tea bagger America even freedom wouldn't be free.  In fact it's not anymore.  If you want to even run for a house seat you better have millions of dollars or forget it.  Politicians spend 2 hours of their day working for constituents and the rest of the day dealing with lobbyists and begging for donations so they can run again in 4 more years.  Funny you have to have millions of dollars to get a job that only pays $200K.  Citizens United is another perfect example.
> ...



[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUZgPfdkWis"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUZgPfdkWis[/ame]


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > You PLEASE tell me what policy conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history since the US Founding? Just one, PLEASE?
> ...



Got it, you CAN'T give me one policy that conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on


False premises, distortions and lies, the ONLY thing conservatives have in their playbook...


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Care to give that quote? PLEASE?
> ...



The one YOU gave that said I was wrong to reply how ignorant conservatives are too the REAL meaning of the US Constitution!


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Got it, you CAN'T give me one policy that conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on



What the fuck?

ROFL

Are you tripped out on LSD at this very moment? BWAHAHAHA, that shit was right out of your ass with zero connection to the discussion.

I mean, I knew you were a fucktard - you're a leftest, but I didn't realize that you have no grasp of reality.



> False premises, distortions and lies, the ONLY thing conservatives have in their playbook...



ROFL

You mean shit like;
_
you CAN'T give me one policy that conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on_ 


Stupid is as leftist does...


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 26, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> The one YOU gave that said I was wrong to reply how ignorant conservatives are too the REAL meaning of the US Constitution!



Now see, this one sounds more like you're sloppy drunk, rather than tripped out on LSD.

Hey, you dropped acid AND downed a fifth of gin, is that it?

Like nearly all Khmer Rouge democrats, you've never read the Constitution and depend on the leftist hate sites for misinterpretations.

The "real" meaning of the Constitution is precisely what it says, you ignorant baboon. 

THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION - We the People


----------



## Mr. H. (Jun 26, 2014)

KissMy said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> > R.T., let's talk hydraulic fracturing. Just to see where the ignorance falls.
> ...



Thank you, R.T.


----------



## sealybobo (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Got it, you CAN'T give me one policy that conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on
> ...



Well give him one asshole or shut the fuck up.


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Got it, you CAN'T give me one policy that conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on
> ...




So you STILL can't give me ONE policy conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on. Got it


----------



## Dad2three (Jun 26, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > The one YOU gave that said I was wrong to reply how ignorant conservatives are too the REAL meaning of the US Constitution!
> ...



Good, glad you know how to link, now about the meaning of that STRONG FEDERAL CONSTITUTION?

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, PROMOTE THE GENERAL WELFARE , and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."


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## hunarcy (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



Conservatives have supported conservation efforts, from the protection of the Yosemite Valley, to the creation of the Environmental Protection Agency.  Happy now?


----------



## Stephanie (Jun 27, 2014)

the question should be why does the left think they have a right to push off their hate and ignorance on everyone in this country? 

and I really think they believe it's one of their better virtues...because they damn sure have no honor, civility, tolerance and for sure NO shame 


and you can take this thread as the perfect example


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 27, 2014)

sealybobo said:


> Well give him one asshole or shut the fuck up.



Silly Bonobo, you mindless chimp you, the recovery in the 80's springs to mind.


----------



## hunarcy (Jun 27, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Well give him one asshole or shut the fuck up.
> ...



He's just trolling you.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> So you STILL can't give me ONE policy conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on. Got it



You are on drugs, clearly. You post wild non-sequitur and wonder why normals look at you like you are a babbling fool. It's because you ARE a babbling fool.

You are filled with hate, rage, and stupidity. If I point to the warning the conservatives gave regarding Castro, as you leftists embraced him, you'll just scream and post idiocy from the hate sites. I believe America's own Goebbels - Ed Murrow - claimed Castro was the "new George Washington."

You are a mindless automaton, incapable of thought - much less reason.


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Good, glad you know how to link, now about the meaning of that STRONG FEDERAL CONSTITUTION?



ROFL

You are an ignorant feral baboon.

The ratification of the Constitution involved serious debate, and compromise between the Federalist and Anti-Federalists, played out in the press, you mindless monkey.



> "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, PROMOTE THE GENERAL WELFARE , and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."



Yes, you are an ignorant and uneducated monkey that thinks "general welfare" indicates the redistribution of assets. Part of the reason that neither I, nor anyone with a developed intellect, gives you any credibility or pays heed to your shit flinging.

Have a banana, you shit flinging feral baboon.


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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

hunarcy said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
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Nonsense, Conservatives haven't done that. That's like saying liberals supported cutting taxes for  the rich because 2 guys voted with GOP and Dubya from the Dem party

Conservatives are ALWAYS on the wrong side of history, they ALWAYS claim a tax increase, a regulation or safety net will kill the economy, and they are ALWAYS wrong!


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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> the question should be why does the left think they have a right to push off their hate and ignorance on everyone in this country?
> 
> and I really think they believe it's one of their better virtues...because they damn sure have no honor, civility, tolerance and for sure NO shame
> 
> ...



Stop projecting rightie


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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Got it, you CAN'T give me one policy that conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on
> ...



Conservatives, since they were loyalists standing with King George in 1776, have a LONG history of being on the wrong side of history


They were the slavers, the confederates, isolationists during both WW's, fought union rights, labor laws, woman's and civil rights, environmental laws, SS, Medicare,  etc


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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > Good, glad you know how to link, now about the meaning of that STRONG FEDERAL CONSTITUTION?
> ...






Weird, Madison wanted a STRONG federtal Gov't right? The federalist won right?


Why Thomas Jefferson Favored Profit Sharing
By David Cay Johnston

The founders, despite decades of rancorous disagreements about almost every other aspect of their grand experiment, agreed that America would survive and thrive only if there was widespread ownership of land and businesses.

George Washington, nine months before his inauguration as the first president, predicted that America "will be the most favorable country of any kind in the world for persons of industry and frugality, possessed of moderate capital, to inhabit." And, he continued, "it will not be less advantageous to the happiness of the lowest class of people, because of the equal distribution of property."

The second president, John Adams, feared "monopolies of land" would destroy the nation and that a business aristocracy born of inequality would manipulate voters, creating "a system of subordination to all... The capricious will of one or a very few" dominating the rest. Unless constrained, Adams wrote, "the rich and the proud" would wield economic and political power that "will destroy all the equality and liberty, with the consent and acclamations of the people themselves."

James Madison, the Constitution's main author, described inequality as an evil, saying government should prevent "an immoderate, and especially unmerited, accumulation of riches." He favored "the silent operation of laws which, without violating the rights of property, reduce extreme wealth towards a state of mediocrity, and raise extreme indigents towards a state of comfort."




Alexander Hamilton, who championed manufacturing and banking as the first Treasury secretary, also argued for widespread ownership of assets, warning in 1782 that, "whenever a discretionary power is lodged in any set of men over the property of their neighbors, they will abuse it."

Late in life, Adams, pessimistic about whether the republic would endure, wrote that the goal of the democratic government was not to help the wealthy and powerful but to achieve "the greatest happiness for the greatest number."



http://www.newsweek.com/2014/02/07/why-thomas-jefferson-favored-profit-sharing-245454.html


SOUNDS LIKE THEY HATED THAT REDISTRIBUTION RIGHT?


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## itfitzme (Jun 27, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



Which is why ther is no obligation to give a shit about them.  All they are good for is target practice.


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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Dad2three said:
> 
> 
> > So you STILL can't give me ONE policy conservatives have EVER been on the correct side of history on. Got it
> ...




Leftist did that?
Weird



That Time Ronald Reagan Hosted Those 'Freedom Fighters' At The Oval Office








Those 'freedom fighters' (Mujahideen) turned into the Taliban...HMM


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## Stephanie (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > the question should be why does the left think they have a right to push off their hate and ignorance on everyone in this country?
> ...



stop puking all over us, commie


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## S.J. (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
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Shame on Reagan for not being able to foresee the future.


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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> Dad2three said:
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> > Stephanie said:
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## Dad2three (Jun 27, 2014)

S.J. said:


> Dad2three said:
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Foresee the future? How about recognizing the past and what WOULD happen? Not like we didn't have decade and decades and decades of 'enemies of my enemies' crap to look at. But heck, he was probably to far gone with his Alzheimer anyways...


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## westwall (Jun 27, 2014)

itfitzme said:


> RollingThunder said:
> 
> 
> > I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> ...









Oh goody.  Yet another internet tough guy.  Real bullets flying at you are considerably different from playing Call of Duty silly person.

Best not tempt fate, you may get what you hoped for and really, not like the outcome.

And how unsurprising that a progressive is advocating for the murder of people who disagree with him.   How Stalinist of you....


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## Stephanie (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Stephanie said:
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well aren't you cute
got any cartoons with Muslims?


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## S.J. (Jun 27, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> S.J. said:
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I know, your solution (like Jimmy Carter) would have been to let the Soviet Union kill everyone in the country.


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## itfitzme (Jun 28, 2014)

westwall said:


> itfitzme said:
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> > RollingThunder said:
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Now we know what a moron you are cuz liberal progressives want to ban guns.

Your making no sense.

Not to mention the psychotic fantacies about stalin.  Whatever youb gotta to convince yourself thayt your not the obnoxious, whiney moron that you really are.


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## Dad2three (Jun 28, 2014)

S.J. said:


> Dad2three said:
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Is communism bad or not? If it 'fails' would it have failed in Afghanistan too? lol


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## mamooth (Jun 28, 2014)

Dan Kahan, the researcher Westwall helpfully quoted before to show liberals had a better grasp of science than conservatives, went further with his studies. He found that the smarter a liberal gets, the more likely he/she is to be correct about global warming science. But the smarter a conservative gets, the more likely he/she is to get global warming science completely wrong.

Conservatives Don't Deny Climate Science Because They're Ignorant. They Deny It Because of Who They Are. | Mother Jones

Look at the conservatives here to confirm how it works. The duller ones can only rage mindlessly and parrot, so they only manage to be a little wrong, and are kind of boring. But the smarter ones, like Westwall, will obsessively devote all of their intelligence into being wrong on behalf of their party. Thus, they are far more successful at being spectacularly wrong concerning all types of science across the board.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> daveman said:
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> > Derideo_Te said:
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I've given my ideas before, but I'm not sure why you're asking me to totally redesign the government.


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## hunarcy (Jun 28, 2014)

daveman said:


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> > daveman said:
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Many of the things he mentions (police, parks, roads, etc, etc that we have today) can and are better managed by the States.  The Federal government could give up it's role in those areas with no consequence for us.


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## Dad2three (Jun 28, 2014)

daveman said:


> Derideo_Te said:
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> > daveman said:
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The poster isn't, just pointing out right wingers OPINIONS on what the Founder wanted or not, are generally based on what right wingers base their opinions on, IDEOLOGY over history or facts!


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## whitehall (Jun 28, 2014)

You almost gotta laugh. A couple of decades ago the ignorant left considered it a virtue to question authority and now they post large print junk to reinforce their new belief that it is a sin against nature to question authority.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Derideo_Te said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > Derideo_Te said:
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Not by that much.  Certainly the procurement system needs to be overhauled.  Assets the Pentagon says they don't need are rammed through by Congress anyway, giving huge money to defense contractors.  More base closures could probably be done.  Scale back our overseas presence in places.  



Derideo_Te said:


> Let's turn to these "non-Constitutionally-mandated government functions" that you want to eliminate.
> Are you willing to eliminate social security, medicare and medicaid since they none of those are "Constitutionally-mandated government functions"?


Eliminate them?  No.  That toothpaste has been squeezed; no way to get it back in the tube.  The bureaucracy running them could definitely be reworked into something more efficient.  But the very second anyone suggests making better use of our tax dollars, some idiots start claiming that we want to push Grandma over a cliff.

The purpose of government is not to employ middle managers.  A lot of people just don't grasp that.

Here's a list of government waste, totaling $36,986,404,949.

Can you defend any of that as necessary?

Oh, and one thing I'd cut immediately:  End ALL foreign aid to nations that hate us.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Derideo_Te said:
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You wouldn't think at all.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
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Civil Rights.  Leave your bullshit historical revision at the door, please.  Not interested.

Now tell me something bad liberals have done.

I don't think you'll have an answer.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
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Yes, you've proven several times you're unable to think for yourself.  No need to keep telling us.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...



Bush Admin. Voted AGAINST Solyndra Loan - Fox Nation
The results of the Congressional probe shared Tuesday with ABC News show that less than two weeks before President Bush left office, on January 9, 2009, the Energy Department's credit committee had voted against offering a loan commitment to Solyndra.

Even after Obama took office on Jan. 20, 2009, analysts in the Energy Department and in the Office of Management and Budget were repeatedly questioning the wisdom of the loan. In one exchange, an Energy official wrote of "a major outstanding issue" -- namely, that Solyndra's numbers showed it would run out of cash in September 2011.

There was also concern about the high-risk nature of the project. Internally, the Office of Management and Budget wrote that "the risk rating for the project sponsor [Solyndra]  seems high." Outside analysts had warned for months that the company might not be a sound investment.

Peter Lynch, a New York-based solar energy analyst, told ABC News it took only a cursory glance through Solyndra's prospectus to see there was a problem with their numbers.

"It's very difficult to perceive a company with a model that says, well, I can build something for six dollars and sell it for three dollars," Lynch said. "Those numbers don't generally work. You don't want to lose three dollars for every unit you make."​Obama made the loan...or more accurate, gift...not because he thought it was a good investment.

No, it was purely political payback.

As TheDC previously reported, Solyndra officials, including Kaiser himself, donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to Barack Obama.

Kaiser personally donated $53,500 to Obamas presidential campaign in 2008. Ben Bierman, executive vice president of operations donated $5,500 to Obama, and Karen Alter, senior vice president of marketing gave $23,000, just to name a few.

In 2009, Solyndra secured a $535 million loan guarantee from the U.S. Treasury to produce solar panels. But on August 31, 2011, the company shut its doors and announced its intent to file for bankruptcy.​
Naturally, you will refuse to accept this reality.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
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You have no business calling anyone else stupid.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Dad2three said:
> ...


And there it is.  Liberals hear the word "welfare", and get in line to get money taken from people who earned it.

Dumbass.


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Stephanie said:


> the question should be why does the left think they have a right to push off their hate and ignorance on everyone in this country?
> 
> and I really think they believe it's one of their better virtues...because they damn sure have no honor, civility, tolerance and for sure NO shame
> 
> ...


Right?  Hell, they think they have an obligation!


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## daveman (Jun 28, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Derideo_Te said:
> ...


That's nice.  Run along now.


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## itfitzme (Jun 28, 2014)

RollingThunder said:


> I found a great article that casts some light on the puzzling, reality-denying, seemingly insane behavior of so many of the rightwingnut AGW denier cultists who post on this forum. It could have been written with them in mind. It perfectly describes their rejection of science and evidence, as well as logic and rationality, in the service of their political/economic ideologies.
> 
> *Why Does the Right Embrace Ignorance as a Virtue?
> Dxismissing facts and science has become a staple of conservative ideology.*
> ...



Because it feels so good.  You know, that look that you see in a toddlers eyes as they shit in their diaper, forgetting that they had a painful rash just yesterday.


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## S.J. (Jun 28, 2014)

whitehall said:


> You almost gotta laugh. A couple of decades ago the ignorant left considered it a virtue to question authority and now they post large print junk to reinforce their new belief that it is a *sin against nature* to question authority.


Or a federal offense.


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## Delta4Embassy (Jun 30, 2014)

By rejecting reality and science you can stir people up convincing themselves their petty issues and concerns have merit. If you conceed God isn't going to prevent a big huge rock from hitting the planet wiping us ALL out because we're "special" then issues like whether gays can marry or not become rather trivial.


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 30, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Conservatives, since they were loyalists standing with King George in 1776, have a LONG history of being on the wrong side of history



BWAHAHAHAHA

What a drooling fucktard you are.




> They were the slavers, the confederates, isolationists during both WW's, fought union rights, labor laws, woman's and civil rights, environmental laws, SS, Medicare,  etc



Of course they were, stupid fuck. Those democrats like you...


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 30, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Weird, Madison wanted a STRONG federtal Gov't right? The federalist won right?



No stupid, the Federalists and anti-Federalists compromised; which is much of the reason we have a Bill of Rights - that you democrats work so hard to end.


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 30, 2014)

Dad2three said:


> Leftist did that?
> Weird
> 
> 
> ...



No, they didn't - you mindless monkey.

Look, you're stupid - you have the intellect of a lamppost. You fling shit from the hate sites with no grasp of what it means.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=kjpnfDwWd7Y]Fidel Castro Interview on Ed Sullivan - 1959 - YouTube[/ame]


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## Uncensored2008 (Jun 30, 2014)

S.J. said:


> Shame on Reagan for not being able to foresee the future.



Leftists lie.

I cut the feral baboon some slack because he is not evolved enough to have thoughts. He's just a monkey flinging shit on behalf of his masters.

The Mujahideen were mostly the mountain people from Northern Afghanistan, who were the "Northern Alliance" that worked with America during the invasion.

The Taliban, which arose under Clinton's administration, is made up mostly of Pashtuns, from the Southern portion of the country and from Pakistan. The Taliban has always been controlled by Pakistan.

The monkey doesn't know this, nor does it care. It is trained by it's masters to fling shit, as a feral baboon is apt to do...


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