# NVIDIA Graphics Card Updates



## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

Here's my dilemma. I have an NVIDIA Geforce GTX 660 video card with 2 Gigs of Video RAM. I have installed the graphics driver from the CD which accompanied the card. The driver is Version 306.38. After installing all the software, which came with the card, I was notified of an update: Version 320.18. I downloaded the driver, but while trying to install it, I was met with the error stating that the driver could not be installed. I uninstalled the original 306.38 driver and tried again. I still could not install the update. I then tried to install Version 314.22. I again received the same error that the driver could not be installed.

I have Windows 8 professional. My motherboard is an ASUS P5Q with an Intel P45 chipset. I have an Intel Core 2 Quad Core Q9400 CPU at 2.66 Ghz. I have 8 gigs of DDR2 RAM. Hard drive is a Seagate 1 TB.

At this point in time, I am at a loss to discover why I am unable to update this graphics card. My games play well with no hiccups. I am just going to have to continue without updating the graphics card.

I have updated my BIOS to Windows 7. There are no BIOS updates for my motherboard that address Windows 8, since Windows 8 is so new at this time. More than likely ASUS will not create any more updates for this motherboard.

Does anyone have any ideas as to what I may be doing wrong, or whether perhaps my motherboard is too outdated to interface well with the new graphics update for my video card?


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## Mr. H. (May 30, 2013)

If it's a new purchase, try calling tech support at NVIDIA.


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## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> If it's a new purchase, try calling tech support at NVIDIA.



It's a new purchase. I have noticed from other geek sites that others are having similar problems, but in theirs, the install won't even start. My install starts but then fails.

Now, when I upgraded to Windows 8, I did a clean install, but it took me 2 weeks of on again off again headaches. It was only after I updated the BIOS on my motherboard, that I was able to install Windows 8 without any problems. With all the problems I have had with Windows 8, I wouldn't be surprised that it is indeed Windows 8's incompatibility with mostly every bit of hardware that is out there.


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## Uncensored2008 (May 30, 2013)

While the Nvidia site generally does a pretty good job of detecting your OS, be aware that there are separate 64 and 32 bit variants of the drivers. The 320.18 drivers are the latest WHQL certified. Make sure that if you use Window 8, 64 bit, that you install the 64 bit Nvidia driver.

You might also try a driver cleaner to clear out old drivers;

Download Driver Cleaner Professional For Free - MajorGeeks


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## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> While the Nvidia site generally does a pretty good job of detecting your OS, be aware that there are separate 64 and 32 bit variants of the drivers. The 320.18 drivers are the latest WHQL certified. Make sure that if you use Window 8, 64 bit, that you install the 64 bit Nvidia driver.
> 
> You might also try a driver cleaner to clear out old drivers;
> 
> Download Driver Cleaner Professional For Free - MajorGeeks



I'm running Windows 8 64 bit, and the NVIDIA update app should have been programmed to tell the difference between 64 and 32 bit, but you know how that goes. I have downloaded the same graphics driver several times from different sites, which did allow me to specify whether 32 or 64 bit. Initially, I thought I just got a bad download, but I have had to rule that out.


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## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

I installed the Driver Cleaner. Thanks for the heads up on that one, but I'm not going to run that just yet. I will wait maybe tomorrow and uninstall the 306 driver and see if there is any residue left. I uninstalled everything this morning. I even went into the registry and removed any references to NVIDIA, but I still had the same problem. 

I guess I could call NVIDIA, but I don't hold out much hope. I will probably get some character from New Delhi, who is practicing his English on me. That's how my luck runs with help desk techs. I often end up teaching them about what they are supposed to be helping me on.


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## Ropey (May 30, 2013)

Did you clean install using the Nvidia clean install option after the sweep?


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## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Did you clean install using the Nvidia clean install option after the sweep?



I did the Express Install. Then I did the Custom Install where it asks you to click on the clean install box. The only one I haven't done is to uninstall my driver and run the app I just downloaded here, and then go back and do the install for 320 again. Somehow, I get the stinking suspicion that I will be wasting my time, again. 

Several weeks ago, I ran a troubleshooting app, and it said I had the wrong graphics adapter. Well, if that's the case, then this is on NVIDIA's end because they have released a driver that is incompatible with the GTS 660 graphics adapter. One size doesn't fit all. So, i will just sit back and see what NVIDIA can come up with in the future.


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## Ropey (May 30, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > Did you clean install using the Nvidia clean install option after the sweep?
> ...



You might want to do a safe mode prune of your enumerated previous graphics drivers. You may be experiencing a stack corruption of the re-enumeration with so many install/removals.

How to Delete Hardware on Windows 7

This works with Windows 8 as well. 

Then a reboot into normal mode and a new installation using a right-click on the Nvidia executable and choosing "Run as Administrator". (just in case there's permission issues)

That's what I'd try. First I would make sure my on cpu graphics unit was disabled in BIOS.  That's a just in case there's a gpu 'sniffing' failure.  It's a bit doubtful, but possible.

If that doesn't work, you may want to try the Microsoft fix it center.

Microsoft Fix it Center Online


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## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

Thanks, Ropey for those options.

I just did an uninstall of my drivers. Then I ran the driver cleaner software I downloaded today. That software merely cleans out any reference to NVIDIA in the registry. I tried to install 320.18, but still got the install failure. I have also sent a tech failure message to NVIDIA. More than likely, they are going to cop out and tell me the culprit is my motherboard, since it is "so old." Well, it is still usable because if I can play Crysis 3 on that computer, it is not yet that old. 

Since I have a satellite internet system, I'm going to have to wait until 2:00 AM to download an old legacy driver, version 310.90 WHQL. I will see if that one will work because I too think that my motherboard may be the problem so I'm going to have to search for a driver that will work, until I upgrade my motherboard in 3 or 4 years. I tend to like to tweak things to make them last.

I also don't have a built-in graphics adapter on my motherboard so I don't have to worry about any conflicts there.


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## Ropey (May 30, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Thanks, Ropey for those options.
> 
> I just did an uninstall of my drivers. Then I ran the driver cleaner software I downloaded today. That software merely cleans out any reference to NVIDIA in the registry. I tried to install 320.18, but still got the install failure. I have also sent a tech failure message to NVIDIA. More than likely, they are going to cop out and tell me the culprit is my motherboard, since it is "so old." Well, it is still usable because if I can play Crysis 3 on that computer, it is not yet that old.
> 
> Since I have a satellite internet system, I'm going to have to wait until 2:00 AM to download an old legacy driver, version 310.90 WHQL. I will see if that one will work because I too think that my motherboard may be the problem so I'm going to have to search for a driver that will work, until I upgrade my motherboard in 3 or 4 years. I tend to like to tweak things to make them last.



I love tweaking but it's more to make them run faster.  I had the P5Q with an e8400 @ 4.0Ghz.   They're great boards and I agree that it should last years yet.  Did you try running an install in compatibility mode?

Right clicking on the executable and selecting properties will bring up the properties splash. If you choose the "compatibility tab" and then choose to run the executable in compatibility mode for windows 7, you may be able to tweak a way through.

Maybe entering Windows in Driver Compatibility mode before the compatibility install is another possibility.


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## Ropey (May 30, 2013)

XPostFacto said:
			
		

> Gskill memory, 4 sticks of 2 Gigs.
> 
> The Bios seems to recognize it on boot up, and I have had no other issues with it. Then again, I am open for any suggestion I can get.



4 sticks means both banks of memory are filled.

You might have a memory bank population issue. What's the speed of the memory?  The 2.66Ghz CPU is running on a 266 x 2 = 533Mhz Dimms of DDR @ 1066Mhz. 

But when you fill all four slots of that board then you're taxing a memory controller that was already a bit suspect. 

The general rule of thumb in such a case is to drop one speed bin when you populate all four banks. You also need to be sure that you set the memory command rate to 2T (2N).

Now the BIOS update likely smoothed the memory timing up so that you're not getting memory corruption errors anymore, but there might be issues at the higher levels of the memory if the command rate is unsteady.


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## XPostFacto (May 30, 2013)

Ropey said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wow! I thought I was pretty good with computers, my weak point being when you start talking about assembly language, timing and all those CAS and RAS latency speeds. 

I will definitely pop the covers and remove 4 gigs of RAM.

Also, thanks for jarring my memory. The speed of my memory is 1066. I had a feeling I should have upgraded to 2 sticks of 4 gigs vs. 4 sticks of 2. The only problem is that DDR2 RAM is more expensive up there in the 4 gig range. That is all to convince folks to swap out their motherboards so they can go to DDR3 RAM.


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## XPostFacto (May 31, 2013)

Well, I downloaded Version 310.90, and that driver successfully installed on my PC. I also know that Version 311.06 will also install because I found that on my computer several weeks ago. More than likely, I got that driver through the Windows 8 installation system. I will continue my research and see how things work out. Thanks for all the suggestions from everyone.


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## Uncensored2008 (May 31, 2013)

Ropey said:


> You might want to do a safe mode prune of your enumerated previous graphics drivers. You may be experiencing a stack corruption of the re-enumeration with so many install/removals.
> 
> How to Delete Hardware on Windows 7



Honestly Ropey, it's safer and cleaner for him to just run Drive Cleaner, the results are the same.



> This works with Windows 8 as well.
> 
> Then a reboot into normal mode and a new installation using a right-click on the Nvidia executable and choosing "Run as Administrator". (just in case there's permission issues)
> 
> ...



That's an important point.

On most newer motherboards, onboard is disabled if a card is in the PCI-E16 slot. But if it is an SLI board, the Nvidia card could be in a secondary slot, keeping the BIOS from seeing it - thus keeping the onboard activated.

I agree that manually turning it off is a good idea.


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## Ropey (May 31, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > You might want to do a safe mode prune of your enumerated previous graphics drivers. You may be experiencing a stack corruption of the re-enumeration with so many install/removals.
> ...



To each their own. I just use the M$ included tools when available.  I've had issues in the past with cleaning programs.

I've never had issues with using the M$ method to delete unused devices. 

So, I'll stick with it and I'll likely continue to advise the M$ method. You can advise the Drive Cleaner and then both avenues are crossed. 

More options are better imo.


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## XPostFacto (May 31, 2013)

There is also a great cleaner called CCleaner or Crap Cleaner. You can get it here:

CCleaner - PC Optimization and Cleaning - Free Download

It's a free download, or you can buy the advanced version. I used to use it for awhile until I got a virus from an old copy I had installed. I didn't carry it over when I upgraded to Windows 8, but I will tell you that it is a good program, but be careful when you use it to clean the registry. Make sure you back up your registry. I didn't and ended up with some strange problems, afterwards, involving some strange errors about missing files.


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## XPostFacto (May 31, 2013)

Well, this graphics card is designed to work with SLI, but I don't have a SLI motherboard.  I researched that  some years back when I put my present PC together and concluded that one card was the best way to go. Besides, I have a Hauppauge HD TV tuner in one of the spare regular PCI slots. That was the only reason I bought an ASUS motherboard because they do have extra expansion slots. When you employ these heavy duty graphics cards, the graphics processor will extend over and block one or two expansion slots. Since the ASUS had 5 expansion slots, and all I needed was at least 2 free slots, then the ASUS was the right choice.

Also, Ropey, I checked the BIOS for that 2T or 2N setting, but the BIOS on my motherboard is set for auto or manual, so I decided to leave everything in auto and let it find its way.

Incidentally, I have still not heard from NVIDIA regarding my  problem with that driver. It may have been either a dead link, or they know something was wrong with the driver and may be hiding out.


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## Ropey (May 31, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Well, this graphics card is designed to work with SLI, but I don't have a SLI motherboard.  I researched that  some years back when I put my present PC together and concluded that one card was the best way to go. Besides, I have a Hauppauge HD TV tuner in one of the spare regular PCI slots. That was the only reason I bought an ASUS motherboard because they do have extra expansion slots. When you employ these heavy duty graphics cards, the graphics processor will extend over and block one or two expansion slots. Since the ASUS had 5 expansion slots, and all I needed was at least 2 free slots, then the ASUS was the right choice.
> 
> Also, Ropey, I checked the BIOS for that 2T or 2N setting, but the BIOS on my motherboard is set for auto or manual, so I decided to leave everything in auto and let it find its way.
> 
> Incidentally, I have still not heard from NVIDIA regarding my  problem with that driver. It may have been either a dead link, or they know something was wrong with the driver and may be hiding out.



I would think the BIOS update auto configured the command rate with all four slots.  It likely loosened the timings.

If you can use an earlier driver without issue and if there's no special fix in the newer driver then it's all just some tinkering fun anyway and with system imaging, it's all fun for system tweakers. 

Maybe a bios fix for the card?

What's the actual company OEM?  EVGA or...?


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## XPostFacto (Jun 1, 2013)

The graphics card company is EVGA. BIOS upgrade for the graphics card sounds like the way to go. Rather than remove the Hauppauge TV tuner or memory, I will go with the BIOS upgrade and then try to reload the 320 driver. Whatever the outcome, I will have learned a lot, made the day go faster, and possibly improve my old PC so it can keep ticking along for the next several years.


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## Ropey (Jun 1, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> The graphics card company is EVGA. BIOS upgrade for the graphics card sounds like the way to go. Rather than remove the Hauppauge TV tuner or memory, I will go with the BIOS upgrade and then try to reload the 320 driver. Whatever the outcome, I will have learned a lot, made the day go faster, and possibly improve my old PC so it can keep ticking along for the next several years.



I've done that as well. Usually the fixes come.


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## XPostFacto (Jun 1, 2013)

Ropey said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > The graphics card company is EVGA. BIOS upgrade for the graphics card sounds like the way to go. Rather than remove the Hauppauge TV tuner or memory, I will go with the BIOS upgrade and then try to reload the 320 driver. Whatever the outcome, I will have learned a lot, made the day go faster, and possibly improve my old PC so it can keep ticking along for the next several years.
> ...



I checked the EVGA site. Even though you click on the BIOS tab, it just points me in the direction of the 320 update. I discovered that there is a BIOS update for the MSI GTX 660 TI, but with a warning that if you have only the 660 card, don't bother with it, because it is not the same. From what I can gather, there is no BIOS update out yet for my board. NVIDIA advises everyone not to update the BIOS because all the problems are fixed through their driver updates. Yeah, right. Usually more unforeseen problems are caused by each driver update.


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## Ropey (Jun 1, 2013)

Ropey said:


> I've done that as well. Usually the fixes come.





XPostFacto said:


> Yeah, right. Usually _more _unforeseen problems are caused by each driver update.



Oh yeah. It's a damnable dance.


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## XPostFacto (Jun 1, 2013)

Looks like other users are having trouble with driver 320.18, at least the users who get it to actually install. Maybe, I'm lucky that it never would install.

ATTENTION: BANS OF INNOCENT USERS - PLEASE READ AND REPORT - Project Reality Forums

This site above is some kind of gaming site. I don't play on line because of my satellite system.

Here are some more unhappy users:

NVIDIA 320.18 WHQL Update is a complete wreck.

That's all I'm going to post, but lots of gamers are having trouble with this new driver.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic - New nvidia drivers (320.18 WHQL) broke the client


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## Ropey (Jun 1, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Looks like other users are having trouble with driver 320.18, at least the users who get it to actually install. Maybe, I'm lucky that it never would install.
> 
> ATTENTION: BANS OF INNOCENT USERS - PLEASE READ AND REPORT - Project Reality Forums
> 
> ...



Well, at least this time it's not ATi drivers messing everything up.


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## Bleipriester (Jun 1, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Well, at least this time it's not ATi drivers messing everything up.


I´ve been using ATI cards for many years now and only had minor issues and easy solutions for them


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## Bleipriester (Jun 1, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Looks like other users are having trouble with driver 320.18, at least the users who get it to actually install. Maybe, I'm lucky that it never would install.
> 
> ATTENTION: BANS OF INNOCENT USERS - PLEASE READ AND REPORT - Project Reality Forums
> 
> ...


New drivers always are being released in very short periods. Why do you need the current driver version now by all means?


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## Ropey (Jun 1, 2013)

Bleipriester said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > Well, at least this time it's not ATi drivers messing everything up.
> ...



I've had my issues with both but more with Ati. Still, this ASUS HD7850 has given 0 problems.


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## Bleipriester (Jun 1, 2013)

Ropey said:


> I've had my issues with both but more with Ati. Still, this ASUS HD7850 has given 0 problems.


I have the same card. I have problems when using HDMI ( I prefer DVI but my Monitor offers VGA and HDMI only) in so far that -  as soon as I install the Catalyst Engine Control Center - there is a big black frame around the picture and the picture itself was blurred. And with Win 8 I have it natively. Its the scaling option in the Control Center that solves that problem and you can adjust it for every refresh rate.


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## Ropey (Jun 1, 2013)

Bleipriester said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > I've had my issues with both but more with Ati. Still, this ASUS HD7850 has given 0 problems.
> ...



It's been a perfect card for me. My (ASUS) version has two dvi, one hdmi and one display port. It's a dual display from on CPU Intel and the discreet video card  (Monitor/TV).  Considering the days of the Diamond Stealth 3d "Decellerator", I'm happy.


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## XPostFacto (Jun 13, 2013)

I was finally able to install Driver 320.18 today. I searched for the error, "NVIDIA Intaller Failed", and I found a site where someone said that if you could rename the folder "UpdatusUser" you could install any driver that was refusing to install. 

The folder UpdatusUser is located in the Users folder: c:\Users\UpdatusUser. I found the folder but was unable to rename it, since Windows 8 kept telling me that I needed administrator rights. I thought I was the administrator since I set up the operating system. Well, in the process of constantly trying to rename the folder, the folder disappeared. Try as I might I could no longer find the folder, "UpdatusUser." Undaunted, I went ahead one more time and tried to install Driver 320.18. This time it worked, mainly because at the time of today's installation UpdatusUser was not there to prevent the installation. I did discover that when the NVIDIA driver is installed, it automatically creates this folder. 

Now, why this folder never interfered with my installation of the 310 driver doesn't make sense. I'm still somewhat confused as to what happened, but at least I now have the driver installed. It just appears to be the folder *UpdatusUser* that stops the advanced drivers, anything above 310 from being installed.


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## Ropey (Jun 13, 2013)

Have you tried taking ownership of the folder?

Take Ownership of a File or Folder


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## XPostFacto (Jun 13, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Have you tried taking ownership of the folder?
> 
> Take Ownership of a File or Folder



The explanation you supplied only applies to Windows 7, not Windows 8. I looked at that as far as I could go and compare it with Windows 8, and it appears that I already have ownership and control of this folder. 

I hope that is not a permanent ban and you can come back and reply to this post.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > Have you tried taking ownership of the folder?
> ...



There is virtually no difference between Window 7 and 8 beyond the interface. The file system and administrative tools of 8 are identical to 7. From Vista on, this is all Longhorn, and behaves as Longhorn. Permissions, taking ownership, etc. all work the same.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.



An IDE drive on a Windows 8 machine? How old is the box?

For the last 7 or 8 years, most motherboards have had a single IDE port, to support older optical devices, but in the last year, I've seen few that support even the single port. The the 600 MBPS transfer rates of SATA-3, it makes no sense to use the outdated interface. Hard drives are cheap these days, $60 will get you a terabyte. The average home user should upgrade their drives every 3 to 5 years. Newer drives have what is called "SMART" that will alert you to drive issues.

S.M.A.R.T. - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.


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## Ropey (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.



Whenever there is data/stack corruption I test memory and then drives.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.
> ...



I'm one of those people who tends to hang on to the old technology. My motherboard is an ASUS P5Q with DDR2 RAM. I built the PC in 2009. Yeah, I've thought about building a new one. It was a real pain to install Windows 8. I'd get to where I was almost there, and it would hang up. I then had to flash the BIOS for Windows 7, since Windows 8 wasn't around 4 years ago. After I did that, then the software loaded up quite nicely. I have noticed that if you ignore the useless metro squares, there is not much difference between Windows 7 and 8.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Ropey said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.
> ...



From what I could glean off the geek sites, a lot of folks are having the same problems I was having and are all blaming NVIDIA. It's not NVIDIA's fault. It's all the rest of us geeks refusing to admit our hard drives are corrupted.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.
> ...



Oh, you'll also enjoy the fact that I am running an IOMEGA 100 megabyte zip drive on my PC. I use it as a backup for the small stuff. It sure turned out to be more reliable than my MAXTOR, alias Seagate external backup drive.

I definitely would like to upgrade, but my requirements are stringent. I have to have at least 3 PCI slots, IDE ports, and at least a Firewire slot. That's why I got the ASUS 4 years ago. I suppose I will stay with ASUS when I upgrade and probably get an I-5 processor. What do you think? I know, I'm going to cringe at your answer.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> I'm one of those people who tends to hang on to the old technology. My motherboard is an ASUS P5Q with DDR2 RAM. I built the PC in 2009. Yeah, I've thought about building a new one. It was a real pain to install Windows 8. I'd get to where I was almost there, and it would hang up. I then had to flash the BIOS for Windows 7, since Windows 8 wasn't around 4 years ago. After I did that, then the software loaded up quite nicely. I have noticed that if you ignore the useless metro squares, there is not much difference between Windows 7 and 8.




Your mobo has 8 SATA-2 connectors. Easy enough to through a new drive on without doing a new build.

I initially hated Windows 8, only using the desktop and command line. But I bought a Surface Pro and have grown to like the interface a bit better. I still won't put it on a desktop, but for a touch screen, it does a good job. And you're right, except for Metro/Modern - there is very little difference between 7 and 8. That's Microsoft. The real operating system is Longhorn, the Vista/7/8/8.1 are just changes in the presentation layer. Longhorn is the best operating system on the market - by a long way. Windows 8 is a good system, even if you hate the UI - it has a stable and mature core, multi-threading that puts Ubuntu and other Linux distros to shame, and can do grown up work, unlike the Cat named systems.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Oh, you'll also enjoy the fact that I am running an IOMEGA 100 megabyte zip drive on my PC. I use it as a backup for the small stuff. It sure turned out to be more reliable than my MAXTOR, alias Seagate external backup drive.
> 
> I definitely would like to upgrade, but my requirements are stringent. I have to have at least 3 PCI slots, IDE ports, and at least a Firewire slot. That's why I got the ASUS 4 years ago. I suppose I will stay with ASUS when I upgrade and probably get an I-5 processor. What do you think? I know, I'm going to cringe at your answer.



I-5 is a good choice for a home user, particularly one that does mostly gaming. Even today, most games can effectively use no more than three threads, so a massive hyperthreading I-7 4770 doesn't do much for you. Now if you're using Photoshop CS-5, Solidworks, or other computationally heavy applications, you might want the I-7. These days, you put together a decent system for under $400, with an SSD and Blueray. I have had a LOT of trouble with Asus Sabertooth motherboards, so I don't recommend them. Are you planning to overclock?


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, you'll also enjoy the fact that I am running an IOMEGA 100 megabyte zip drive on my PC. I use it as a backup for the small stuff. It sure turned out to be more reliable than my MAXTOR, alias Seagate external backup drive.
> ...



Well, the ASUS P5Q was advertised as a good overclocking board, but I don't care about that. My system runs pretty fast now, but I'm faced with the dilemma that I'm always tweaking for more performance, and I am limited to the fact that my RAM is only DDR2.

Now, if I did upgrade, all I would need is the motherboard, processor, and memory. i would keep my power supply, hard drive and graphics card. I might even go with a Pelletier refrigeration system, but maybe not, since I am somewhat leery of having a system with liquid coolant running around near my electronics.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Ropey said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > I thought I would bring back this discussion concerning my NVIDIA graphics card. I discovered that the reason certain drivers wouldn't load was because my hard drive was corrupted. I was recently watching a newly bought DVD on my PC and then the sound would all of a sudden cut out and the movie would drop frame rates. I should have taken a hint right there and started backing up everything, but I instead uninstalled and reinstalled my DVD Ultra 13. That didn't help. Two days ago as I booted up my Windows 8 PC, it went into diagnostic mode and then eventually a repair loop. Of course the repair loop didn't work, forcing me to completely reformat my hard drive. I am now busy replacing my software that will take awhile. I lost some very important files, and to make matters worse, my external hard drive would no longer work in its case. Last night, I removed the external hard drive from its casing. It turned to be IDE vs. SATA. Fortunately, my motherboard does have an IDE port, which is being used by my old Zip drive. I hooked up the external drive and was able to retrieve a lot of my pictures and really old files that I didn't want to lose. All is not lost, but to make a long story short, when any graphics card whether it's NVIDIA or ATI, refuses to accept new drivers, figure on the fact that your hard drive is corrupted, start backing up, and then reformat the hard drive and start over. According to Zone Alarm, I didn't have any viruses, but I sure had one corrupted hard drive.
> ...



How do you test your memory? Are you using some kind of bit tester that hooks up inside the system?


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Well, the ASUS P5Q was advertised as a good overclocking board, but I don't care about that. My system runs pretty fast now, but I'm faced with the dilemma that I'm always tweaking for more performance, and I am limited to the fact that my RAM is only DDR2.
> 
> Now, if I did upgrade, all I would need is the motherboard, processor, and memory. i would keep my power supply, hard drive and graphics card. I might even go with a Pelletier refrigeration system, but maybe not, since I am somewhat leery of having a system with liquid coolant running around near my electronics.



You would keep the hard drive that just corrupted on you? An SSD can be the most significant performance boost to a system

Oh, and for liquid cooling, this is a solid performer for a low price.

Corsair CW-9060002-WW Hydro H70 CORE High Performance Liquid CPU Cooler - Socket LGA 1155, LGA 1366, LGA 2011,AM2, AM3, FM1 at TigerDirect.com.

I'm running the H90, but can get my I7 3770K to 5.6 gHz on it.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Well, this smart technology is intriguing, but  whenever I install my hard drive, I repartition it, which usually wipes the drive. Is this technology contained in some hidden area of the drive, making it impossible to erase? My present hard drive was bought before Christmas and is a terrabyte in size. I must have destroyed this smart stuff, just from my partitioning the drive because I never received any kind of warning, unless it was mixed in there with all the rest of Windows nuisance messages telling me that since the software I am installing is not blessed by the Pope, I need to steer clear of it.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 4, 2013)

XPostFacto said:


> Well, this smart technology is intriguing, but  whenever I install my hard drive, I repartition it, which usually wipes the drive. Is this technology contained in some hidden area of the drive, making it impossible to erase? My present hard drive was bought before Christmas and is a terrabyte in size. I must have destroyed this smart stuff, just from my partitioning the drive because I never received any kind of warning, unless it was mixed in there with all the rest of Windows nuisance messages telling me that since the software I am installing is not blessed by the Pope, I need to steer clear of it.



SMART is in the firmware of the drive, part of the electronics. Your BIOS has to support it, but it provides information to the the system on the health of the drive and will warn you if there is an issue. And you won't miss a SMART message, since it's usually accompanied by loud beeping and such.


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## Ropey (Sep 4, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> XPostFacto said:
> 
> 
> > Well, this smart technology is intriguing, but  whenever I install my hard drive, I repartition it, which usually wipes the drive. Is this technology contained in some hidden area of the drive, making it impossible to erase? My present hard drive was bought before Christmas and is a terrabyte in size. I must have destroyed this smart stuff, just from my partitioning the drive because I never received any kind of warning, unless it was mixed in there with all the rest of Windows nuisance messages telling me that since the software I am installing is not blessed by the Pope, I need to steer clear of it.
> ...



Many bios's support the disabling of SMART technology. Some used to have it disabled by default although I'm not sure if that's the case anymore.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 4, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > XPostFacto said:
> ...



Thanks for the info on that. I'll check my BIOS, but more than likely, since I had to search high and low for a BIOS flash that would keep the motherboard from having a coronary over Windows 8, I probably don't have that function. ASUS won't be sending out any updates,  recognizing Windows 8, since they expect me to invest in another one of their boards. I'm thinking with all the extra slots I got, maybe I still didn't get that good of a deal. Of course, everything would have stayed cool, had I left everything in XP, but Crysis 3 wouldn't play without at least Vista. After 4 years, my LAN  interface already quit, forcing me to buy an extra LAN card. That hasn't sat well with me. I never lost any part of my old Tyan motherboards, but now Tyan is out of sight in price and only makes server boards.


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## iamwhatiseem (Sep 5, 2013)

Just curious, and I might have missed something - why were you wanting to update it anyway?
If everything is working fine - why in the world update a video card unless there is a problem?


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 5, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > XPostFacto said:
> ...



Every BIOS I know of has SMART parameters, but haven't seen it disabled by default.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 5, 2013)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Just curious, and I might have missed something - why were you wanting to update it anyway?
> If everything is working fine - why in the world update a video card unless there is a problem?



Updating video cards is obvious, more frames per second.


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## XPostFacto (Sep 5, 2013)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Just curious, and I might have missed something - why were you wanting to update it anyway?
> If everything is working fine - why in the world update a video card unless there is a problem?



That is an excellent point, because new patches can create problems elsewhere. NVIDIA has a software program which searches for any available updates. Just for the heck of it, I decided to install update 320.18 because the update program kept nagging me to update. As a result, I discovered that it wouldn't install. I then went on a campaign to see just what would install. Everyone of the updates I tried failed to install except the 310.90, which floored me. Hence, I never looked at my hard drive being the problem. I blamed NVIDIA, even contacted them, but they ignored me as they did others. Posting my problems here did give me some useful information, one of which is the Smart technology that I had previously not heard of. I hope my experiences will be helpful to anyone else, who happens to surf in here, who is having similar problems.


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## iamwhatiseem (Sep 5, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> iamwhatiseem said:
> 
> 
> > Just curious, and I might have missed something - why were you wanting to update it anyway?
> ...



Ah...I don't play games on a PC so I wouldn't have thought about that aspect on the ever increasing demand from games.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 5, 2013)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Ah...I don't play games on a PC so I wouldn't have thought about that aspect on the ever increasing demand from games.



It's funny, the super cards are venturing out into other areas now - don't get me wrong, I bought a Radeon 7990 for games - but when trying to crack a password the other day, the software employed the GPU, since it dwarfs the I7 in floating point processing.


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## Bleipriester (Sep 8, 2013)

Few days ago, I wanted to install a NVidia Driver on a neighbor´s computer. Though the package is 218 Megs big, the installation required an internet connection. AHH. I installed the driver out of the unzipped content via the device manager. Is that normal?


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## Ropey (Sep 8, 2013)

Bleipriester said:


> Few days ago, I wanted to install a NVidia Driver on a neighbor´s computer. Though the package is 218 Megs big, the installation required an internet connection. AHH. I installed the driver out of the unzipped content via the device manager. Is that normal?



That's how I install my video drivers as well. It's not as common as using the install/setup executable. 

Some other forms of drivers won't install manually but I've never had a problem installing both ATi and Nvidia drivers manually.


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## Bleipriester (Sep 9, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> > Few days ago, I wanted to install a NVidia Driver on a neighbor´s computer. Though the package is 218 Megs big, the installation required an internet connection. AHH. I installed the driver out of the unzipped content via the device manager. Is that normal?
> ...


The problem is, my neighbor hasn´t installed the Nvidia configuration software.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 9, 2013)

Ropey said:


> That's how I install my video drivers as well. It's not as common as using the install/setup executable.
> 
> Some other forms of drivers won't install manually but I've never had a problem installing both ATi and Nvidia drivers manually.



ATi does a full package install even if you install from the control panel - not sure about Nvidia.


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## Ropey (Sep 9, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > That's how I install my video drivers as well. It's not as common as using the install/setup executable.
> ...



I simply remove the old drivers and unzip and direct the seek to the drivers folder from device manager and not the control panel. I do it with both ATi and Nvidia. I didn't even know that there was an install path from the control panel.

All I have is the driver installed and no ccc, etc.


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## Bleipriester (Sep 9, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Ropey said:
> ...


I like and need the CCC. For example when you use HDMI or when you set graphics-profiles for .exe files of games.


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## Ropey (Sep 9, 2013)

Bleipriester said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...



Sure, that's why most people use it.  It extends your ability to customize.  

I don't use gaming profiles and hdmi is native to Win8.  I've got ccc installed in my win7 image though.


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## Bleipriester (Sep 9, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> > Ropey said:
> ...


The good thing is that profiles are only active, als long as the linked .exe files run. So you don´t have to do anything after the configuration.

And there are problems with HDMI on Win8. You must install CCC and set the scaling options to overscan 0 % or you have a big black frame around the picture and the picture is blurred. Same on Win7/Vista, but here it appears only when you have installed the package.


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## Ropey (Sep 9, 2013)

Bleipriester said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > Bleipriester said:
> ...



I've no issues with hdmi or I would have installed ccc. My tv scales perfectly.


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## Bleipriester (Sep 10, 2013)

Ropey said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> > Ropey said:
> ...


Then  you are a lucky guy. Just google:
https://www.google.de/search?q=hdmi...nnel=fflb&gws_rd=cr&ei=5fguUrrZM9C3hAfAioD4CA


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## Ropey (Sep 10, 2013)

Bleipriester said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > Bleipriester said:
> ...



I'm a guy without a problem with win8 and hdmi on my Ati card, but you said I must.

That's wrong.


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## Bleipriester (Sep 10, 2013)

Ropey said:


> I'm a guy without a problem with win8 and hdmi on my Ati card, but you said I must.
> 
> That's wrong.


This is why you are lucky with this.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 10, 2013)

Ropey said:


> I simply remove the old drivers and unzip and direct the seek to the drivers folder from device manager and not the control panel.



I view device manager as a control panel item.



> I do it with both ATi and Nvidia. I didn't even know that there was an install path from the control panel.
> 
> All I have is the driver installed and no ccc, etc.



Control panel -> computer management -> device manager. (Or as all of us actually do, right click computer - manage.)

ATI will still do a complete package install.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 10, 2013)

Ropey said:


> It's a component. A plug in module that fits in the control panel as a library database.



Technically, it's an MMC plug in. But no matter.


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## Ropey (Sep 10, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > It's a component. A plug in module that fits in the control panel as a library database.
> ...




That's what I originally agreed with before it became a disagreement. *


Technically it's an .msc that connects to the mmc library and plugs into the mmc console.


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## Uncensored2008 (Sep 10, 2013)

Ropey said:


> That's what I originally agreed with before it became a disagreement. *
> 
> 
> Technically it's an .msc that connects to the mmc library and plugs into the mmc console.



Ropey, you have a talent for finding a quarrel in most innocuous exchanges...


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## XPostFacto (Sep 10, 2013)

One thing I didn't bring out is that if you have an NVIDIA card and Windows 8, Windows will try to install their version of the NVIDIA driver. Whatever you do, don't let Windows install that driver because it will mess up the works. I have my updates set up where I choose when and if I want their updates, and I give the command to install. One time, I was allowing Windows to install an optional update, and I didn't notice that the 229 megabyte NVIDIA driver piggy backed in there. All of a sudden my screen started blanking, and I no longer had full screen coverage of my monitor. When I checked Device Manager, instead of NVIDIA GTX 660, it read "no display adapter." I immediately reinstalled the proper NVIDIA driver.


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## Ropey (Sep 10, 2013)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> > That's what I originally agreed with before it became a disagreement. *
> ...



Disagreement is not quarrel and I simply clarified the technical device call path with a bit more detail and didn't disagree.

I'm sorry that you find my information came as a quarrel.  I don't and I find you quite knowledgeable.


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