# Taliban Declares Victory



## High_Gravity (Jan 18, 2012)

Taliban Declares Victory, as Fighting Goes On









> KABUL, Afghanistan  Mullah Muhammad Omar, the Talibans one-eyed leader, seems to have taken a page from George W. Bushs playbook.
> 
> Just as the former president declared mission accomplished in Iraq years before the war there ended, the Taliban made their own victory declaration this weekend, even though roughly 130,000 coalition troops were still fighting in Afghanistan  and keeping the Afghan government firmly in power.
> 
> ...



Taliban Declares Victory, as Fighting Goes On - NYTimes.com


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## Katzndogz (Jan 18, 2012)

Did they not demand that our soldiers be punished for pissing on Taliban bodies?  And Hillary profusely apologized and promised swift and  severe punishment.  Is not obama engaging in peace talks and negotiations with them?

From their point of view, they have surely won.


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## High_Gravity (Jan 18, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Did they not demand that our soldiers be punished for pissing on Taliban bodies?  And Hillary profusely apologized and promised swift and  severe punishment.  Is not obama engaging in peace talks and negotiations with them?
> 
> From their point of view, they have surely won.



Their organization is in tact and they didn't have to change any of their radical backwards policies or give up anything, yes they did win.


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## SillyWabbit (Jan 18, 2012)

Did anyone _not_ see this coming? 
News flash: everyone who's tried to control Afghanistan--and who's not from there--gets their ass kicked. 
"Thanks for coming fellas. Thanks for the weapons. We can use them on the next bunch of assholes who try to fuck with us. Thanks again. Peace "


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## Katzndogz (Jan 18, 2012)

The last civilization imposed on Afghanistan was Alexander the Great.  He did it by killing everyone until they shaped up.


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## High_Gravity (Jan 18, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> The last civilization imposed on Afghanistan was Alexander the Great.  He did it by killing everyone until they shaped up.



Staying there to rebuild their fucking country was a mistake, they are not interested in the advancements we could have given them, they are perfectly fine living in mud huts, fucking goats and beating the living shit out of their women.


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## Katzndogz (Jan 19, 2012)

They could have stayed there just like that forever, had they just stayed in Afghanistan and not become a training ground for terrorist distribution.

The mistake was in assuming that the people wanted to use the democratic process for electing leadership for the same bests interests that we think are best interests.


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## Sunni Man (Jan 19, 2012)

The Afghans have been fighting invaders for millinia.

Long before they embraced Islam as their religion.

It is in their DNA

We are just the most recent in a long line of invaders who found out the hard way that Afghans will always refuse to be subdued or occupied.

They should be admired for their courage and adherence to their cultural past.


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## Katzndogz (Jan 19, 2012)

There isn't a whole lot to be proud of as far as cultural past goes.  They have no art, music, inventions, philosophies or anything else that would speak to "culture".  They have some creative ways of bloodletting.

This doesn't mean that someone has the right to march in there and impose an alien and unwanted civilization on them.   Because whatever they practice as a culture is so barbaric it is incumbent on other countries to protect themselves from the spread of cultural murder.  Afghanistan needs more than non-interference, it needs or perhaps a better statement would be that others need Afghanistan to be in quarantine.


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## Sunni Man (Jan 19, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> There isn't a whole lot to be proud of as far as cultural past goes.  They have no art, music, inventions, philosophies or anything else that would speak to "culture".


You just made on of the all time dumest posts at USMB    

Afghanistan has a long history of arts and culture.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRpIFIYix9g]Afghani Music Melody of Rubab instrument (Attan Traditional Dance Melody) - YouTube[/ame]


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## Katzndogz (Jan 19, 2012)

You are not aware that the Taliban prohibited both music and art.

Okay, but no Afghanistan has never had noteworthy art or music although the people were at one time capable of making sounds and rudimentary pictures.  They certainly aren't noted for that any longer.  

Don't feel bad.  The same circumstance existed among the Natives of America.  The Hopi and Navajo have always been noted for their magnificent works of art.  The Mohawk and the Blackfoot not so much, even though the Mohawk and Blackfoot made pots and wove blankets, they were in no way "art".  

Afghanistan is toxic, its people are infectious.  They need to be left alone in quarantine.


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## Sunni Man (Jan 19, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> You are not aware that the Taliban prohibited both music and art.


The Taliban are against Western art and music.

Not traditional Afghan art and music.

They do not want trash like Lady Gaga and pornography polluting their country.

And I don't blame them one bit for not wanting it poisoning peoples minds.


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## PoliticalChic (Jan 19, 2012)

Sunni Man said:


> The Afghans have been fighting invaders for millinia.
> 
> Long before they embraced Islam as their religion.
> 
> ...



If your officer's dead and the sergeants look white, 
Remember it's ruin to run from a fight: 
So take open order, lie down, and sit tight, 
         And wait for supports like a soldier. 
         Wait, wait, wait like a soldier . . . 

When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains, 
And the women come out to cut up what remains, 
Jest roll to your rifle and blow out your brains 
         An' go to your Gawd like a soldier. 
         Go, go, go like a soldier, 
         Go, go, go like a soldier, 
         Go, go, go like a soldier, 
         So-oldier of the Queen! 
Rudyard Kipling


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## Katzndogz (Jan 19, 2012)

Inside the Taliban

The Taliban banned music and dancing, shut down movie theaters and television stations, destroyed public works of art that depicted living beings, and forbade the consumption of alcoholic beverages. Men were ordered to grow full, untrimmed beards (in accordance with orthodox Islam) and were rounded up and beaten with sticks in an effort to force prayer in the mosques. The Taliban strongly enforced the ancient custom of purdah, the veiling and seclusion of women from men. Women were ordered to cover themselves from head to toe in burkas (long, tentlike veils). Girls&#146; schools were closed, and women were forbidden to work outside their homes. As a result, hospitals lost almost all their staffs and children in orphanages were abandoned. In a country where hundreds of thousands of men had been killed in warfare, widows found themselves unable to work to provide basic necessities for their families. 

The Taliban religious police enforced the new rules and punished anyone found disobeying. They inflicted many of the punishments on the spot, usually ruthlessly, without offering the offender any sort of judicial hearing. The Taliban allowed public beatings and stonings, sometimes fatal, of women who violated the dress code or were escorted by men not related to them. Any person found not praying at the required times was imprisoned. The Taliban leaders also mandated specific punishments for other types of crimes. They made murder, adultery, and drug dealing punishable by death, and theft punishable by amputation of the hand. Many of the Taliban laws and punishments alarmed human-rights groups and provoked worldwide condemnation.


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## High_Gravity (Jan 20, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> There isn't a whole lot to be proud of as far as cultural past goes.  They have no art, music, inventions, philosophies or anything else that would speak to "culture".  They have some creative ways of bloodletting.
> 
> This doesn't mean that someone has the right to march in there and impose an alien and unwanted civilization on them.   Because whatever they practice as a culture is so barbaric it is incumbent on other countries to protect themselves from the spread of cultural murder.  Afghanistan needs more than non-interference, it needs or perhaps a better statement would be that others need Afghanistan to be in quarantine.



Actually Afghanistan wasn't always like this, before the Soviets invaded they had a pretty nice culture there. Women were not required to cover from head to toe and they were allowed to work and go to school alongside men.
















Once the Soviets invaded and Afghanistan was flooded with Islamic Militants from around the globe, the culture in the country completely changed. They have been at war for almost 30 years straight.


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## High_Gravity (Jan 20, 2012)

Sunni Man said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > You are not aware that the Taliban prohibited both music and art.
> ...



Actually the Taliban don't allow ANY art or music, they consider it haram and a distraction from Islam.


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## Sunni Man (Jan 20, 2012)

High_Gravity said:


> Sunni Man said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


Islam allows music played on certain instruments and art that does not display people or animals.

If the Taliban disallows these then they do not know their religion.


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## High_Gravity (Jan 20, 2012)

Sunni Man said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Sunni Man said:
> ...



Thats the thing, the Taliban are not following Islam the right way, if anything they make it look bad and people think all Muslims are like this. Most Muslim countries have no problem with art or music.


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## High_Gravity (Feb 2, 2012)

Taliban Will Control Afghanistan With Support From Pakistan, Says Leaked Report 








> KABUL, Feb 1 (Reuters) - The U.S. military said in a secret report the Taliban, backed by Pakistan, are set to retake control of Afghanistan after NATO-led forces withdraw from the country, raising the prospect of a major failure of western policy after a costly war.
> 
> Lieutenant Colonel Jimmie Cummings, a spokesman for the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force, confirmed the existence of the document, reported by Britain's Times newspaper and the BBC. But he said it was not a strategic study.
> 
> ...



Taliban Will Control Afghanistan With Support From Pakistan, Says Leaked Report


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## High_Gravity (Feb 2, 2012)

Afghanistan War: NATO Ministers Mull Drawdown








> BRUSSELS  NATO's top official joined the U.S. and France on Thursday in calling for Afghan forces to take the lead in all combat operations by mid-2013, while continuing to assist them in fighting the Taliban.
> 
> Both U.S. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta and French President Nicolas Sarkozy have suggested in recent days that the coalition should gradually transition out of combat in 2013. Government forces are supposed to assume responsibility for the war at the end of 2014, when the coalition is expected to end its participation in the war.
> 
> ...



Afghanistan War: NATO Ministers Mull Drawdown


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## Peter Dow (Feb 3, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXMHnu-7ZZk]Peter Dow's "no" to Taliban's surrender terms. Afpak strategy for victory in war on terror. - YouTube[/ame]

*Peter Dow's "no" to Taliban's surrender terms. Afpak strategy for victory in war on terror.* (YouTube)



			
				CBS News said:
			
		

> _CBS News:_ *Divisions within Taliban make peace elusive*
> 
> Defense Secretary Leon Panetta made news Wednesday when he said the combat role for U.S. troops in Afghanistan could end next year instead of 2014. On Thursday, he took a step back -- insisting U.S. forces will remain combat ready -- even as they transition into their new role of training Afghan troops.
> 
> ...



So the Deans of Jihad have dictated terms to the West, the terms they propose of the West's surrender to the Jihadis in the war on terror.

So what should the response of the West be? Should we surrender to the Jihadis, or should we fight to win?

This guy Sami ul Haq should be a prisoner at Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp along with his University of Jihad colleagues, his controllers from the Pakistani ISI and his financial backers from Saudi Arabia.

The US and Western allies ought to name Pakistan and Saudi Arabia as "state sponsors of terrorism".

There ought to be drone strikes on the University of Jihad. (Darul Uloom Haqqania, Akora Khattak, Pakistan)

We ought to seize control of Pakistani and Saudi TV satellites and use them to broadcast propaganda calling for the arrest of all involved in waging terrorist war against the West. 

It just seems very poor tactics for our military to be risking life and limb in the minefields of Afghanistan yet at the strategic level our governments and businesses are still "trading with the enemy".   

As the Star Trek character Commander Scott might have said -

_"It's war, Captain but not as we know it."_


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## Urbanguerrilla (Feb 5, 2012)

Peter Dow said:


> Peter Dow's "no" to Taliban's surrender terms. Afpak strategy for victory in war on terror. - YouTube
> 
> *Peter Dow's "no" to Taliban's surrender terms. Afpak strategy for victory in war on terror.* (YouTube)
> 
> ...





Why should they come to terms, they believe they are winning


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## Peter Dow (Feb 5, 2012)

Urbanguerrilla said:


> Peter Dow said:
> 
> 
> > Peter Dow's "no" to Taliban's surrender terms. Afpak strategy for victory in war on terror. - YouTube
> ...


I offer no reason because I do not seek to agree terms with the Taliban. I am disinterested in peace talks with the Taliban.

I am simply rejecting the Taliban's 3 demands and offering a strategy for victory over the Taliban.

When a spider is crawling along, thinking it is winning, I am not really concerned whether or not it believes it has no need to come to terms. It matters not what the spider believes because I am not about to offer any terms to the spider anyway.

The Taliban spider ought to be crushed and I have explained how we do that.

Terms can be offered to the part of Pakistani state under responsible democratic control and which is not in any way concerned with sponsoring or sheltering the Taliban.


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## SillyWabbit (Feb 5, 2012)

There is a world full of "ought."

As far I can tell "is" usually trumps "ought."







Get big guns











These help for psych comfort:






The End is Near.


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## violet (Feb 6, 2012)

SillyWabbit said:


> There is a world full of "ought."
> 
> As far I can tell "is" usually trumps "ought."
> 
> ...



Hey that doesn't comfort me! I demand comfort for women!


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## uscitizen (Feb 6, 2012)

Taliban Declares Victory, as Fighting Goes On

Kinda reminds me of Mr. Mission Accompolished.


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## Peter Dow (Jul 15, 2012)

*Bomb Taliban Jihadi indoctrination bases in Pakistan.*

I want to tell you all how to beat the Taliban in Afghanistan and Pakistan. 

So this is about "AfPak" military strategy and as well as direct advice for US, British & NATO generals, it is to inform the public so our political leaders know what can be done and what to ask of our military.

I am suggesting that our forces bomb the Taliban Headquarters known as "the University of Jihad" or Darul Uloom Haqqania, Akora Khattak, 50 kilometres (31 miles) east of the provincial capital, Peshawar. 

More about the place in this BBC webpage

BBC NEWS | South Asia | The 'university of holy war'

The significance of this place is that it is the main recruitment and command centre for the Taliban which must be known to our military intelligence officers and so it is a mystery why they have not advised our generals to bomb this place before now or if they did advise our generals to bomb it why they didn't actually bomb it?

It makes no sense in a war to give the enemy headquarters a free pass and immunity from being targeted. It just makes their commanders feel untouchable which is not how we want them to feel. We want them arrested or dead or in great fear that soon they will be arrested or dead and bombing their HQ gives them that idea. 

Our forces do not have ground forces close enough to use artillery to destroy this target so that leaves NATO to use its aerial power - drones and bomber planes, to bomb the target from the air.

So apart from not wanting to use nuclear weapons on such a weak target which would be over-kill, I think bombing using the very heaviest conventional bombs, MOABs or heavy bombing from B52s or C130s is appropriate. 

Heavy bombing could be used to totally level such targets, or turn the target site into one huge crater field - obliterate it. Give the Jihadis a demonstration that they won't ever forget!

Then if the Taliban and Jihadi leaders relocate to a new recruitment, indoctrination and command base, blast that to pieces as well.

Our forces will have to establish air superiority over the target areas to allow not only unmanned drones but piloted heavy bombers with a much heavier bomb load to over-fly the area reasonably safely.

If and when Pakistan objects to our plans to aerial bomb these enemy indoctrination bases we should tell them that because our view is that Pakistan does not control the ground there to our satisfaction - because Pakistani police or military have not arrested and handed over the likes of the Darul Uloom Haqqania and other Taliban leaders operating on the ground for removal to Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp and not closed down the University of Jihad and other Taliban bases then the Pakistan military don't deserve control of the air space over that ground which they don't satisfactorily control.

So we can say "Sorry" if the Pakistanis don't like this violation of their sovereignty but the needs of war mean this is something we must do. We wouldn't intend to permanently deprive Pakistan of control over its air space; this would be a temporary measure until the war on terror is won.

Pakistan had their chance to arrest or kill the Taliban leaders in their Pakistan bases but now it is too late so we are going to flatten the Taliban bases in that part of Pakistan from the air and we need total air superiority over the target area in order to protect our pilots.

The Pakistan government and military has complained about drone strikes in parts of Pakistan but Pakistan has not gone to war with us about it, thankfully. 

Hopefully, the Pakistanis will not want to contest air superiority with their military but if they do decide to fight to resist our air-superiority where we need it to bomb the Taliban then we must be prepared to take out all nearby Pakistani ground to air missile batteries and any air fighters they send against us to contest air superiority.

If the Pakistanis decide to fight us over control of Pakistan's air space then of course there is a risk this could escalate to all-out war if the Pakistanis really want to make a casus belli out of the sovereignty issue and the matter of us requiring to destroy the Taliban so possibly we should make it clear to the Pakistanis that the US President or the NATO supreme commander have the option to use nuclear weapons against Pakistani military bases anywhere in Pakistan if that was necessary to win an all-out war with Pakistan. 

That's not our aim to escalate to an all-out war with Pakistan here but Pakistan should be careful not to escalate the situation from one where we need to go after the Taliban only into one where the official Pakistan military gets dragged into a war with us unnecessarily. 

This risk of having to fight and win an all-out war with Pakistan is a lesser risk than failing to defeat the Taliban, withdrawing from Pakistan having achieved little to secure Afghanistan and thereby giving encouragement to Jihadis the world over to commit more acts of terrorism and war elsewhere in the world including in our homelands. So Pakistan should not force us to make that choice of two risky options because their defeat is preferable to our own defeat in our opinion. 

Pakistan should avoid war with the West by stepping back and allowing us to destroy the Taliban in Pakistan because it is the Taliban and the Jihahis who are the true enemies of the Pakistani and Afghan people. We are the friends of the people of Pakistan and we will prove that by defeating their and our enemy, the Taliban and associated Jihadis.

Hopefully the Pakistanis will back off and let us bomb the Taliban without threat from Pakistan's air defences. We should tell Pakistan that we are doing them a favour which they will thank us for in the long run though we appreciate the embarrassment for them in the short term.


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## ima (Jul 19, 2012)

The Taliban are winning, who can dispute that?


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## Peter Dow (Jul 19, 2012)

ima said:


> The Taliban are winning, who can dispute that?


Anyone who can drop one of these on a Taliban HQ.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX5h2fjhKyQ]Ultimate Weapons- Mother of all Bombs (YouTube)[/ame]

That's a MOAB and it has a blast radius of 450 feet or 137 metres.

(Or anyone who can drop many smaller bombs to get the same effect).

Who? That would be the US military.


*Targeting the University of Jihad, Akora Khattak*

Here are the co-ordinates for Akora Khattak.

Geohack - Akora Khattak

34° 0&#8242; 2.17&#8243; N, 72° 7&#8242; 18.06&#8243; E
34.000603,72.121683

and if you look on Google Maps the co-ordinates for Akora Khattak seems to be centred right on the Darul Uloom Haqqania / University of Jihad.

That location is in a built-up area (of course the cowards would use civilian human shields) so using the MOAB is bound to do a fair amount of collateral damage to surrounding buidings and people. So the word should go out now - evacuate Akora Khattak and don't live within 5 miles of any such jihadi university otherwise you could be seriously inconvenienced.

The target area of the campus of University of Jihad looks to be about 100 metres x 100 metres. Hard to guess from the satellite photo.

Here is the Jihadis' own website for the base International Islamic University: Darul Uloom Haqqania which has a number of photographs and is helpfully in English.

Anyway a MOAB on that lot is certainly going to spoil their day and their terror-war plans.

If anyone doubts whether that enemy base deserves targeting please read this -
BBC NEWS | South Asia | The 'university of holy war'


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## ima (Jul 19, 2012)

The Taliban are still winning, and heroin production is up.


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## Hollie (Jul 19, 2012)

Sunni Man said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > You are not aware that the Taliban prohibited both music and art.
> ...



I think your heroes, the Taliban, are afraid that young boys might be attracted to women.

The Dancing Boys Of Afghanistan | FRONTLINE | PBS




> Its an ancient practice, secretly revived--young boys sold by families to entertain wealthy merchants and warlords. An undercover investigation into this illicit sex trade...


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## Peach (Jul 19, 2012)

The day we invaded Iraq, the Taliban WON.


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## RoccoR (Jul 21, 2012)

Peach,  _et al,_

Why do you think this?



Peach said:


> The day we invaded Iraq, the Taliban WON.


*(COMMENT)*

What is the connection?

Most Respectfully,
R


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## ima (Jul 22, 2012)

RoccoR said:


> Peach,  _et al,_
> 
> Why do you think this?
> 
> ...



The Taliban weren't responsible for 9/11. Neither was Iraq. We would have been better invading Saudi Arabia, their oil is better and easier to get at, plus they have no army.


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## Moonglow (Jul 22, 2012)

We did not invade the country of Afghanistan, we helped a coalition defeat the Taliban. Evidently they have not won, they are not in control.


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## Moonglow (Jul 22, 2012)

nuke Pakistan and end it sooner.


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## ima (Jul 22, 2012)

Moonglow said:


> We did not invade the country of Afghanistan, we helped a coalition defeat the Taliban. Evidently they have not won, they are not in control.



We didn't invade? So how did we get there? On an invitation?
The Taliban have stalemated the biggest and best armies of the world. If they just weren't so nasty to their women...


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