# Backpack trip into wilderness



## yiostheoy

Just got back from a week long backpack trip with an old friend into the wilderness.

It was somewhat of a Walden Pond experience for us both to reconnect and compare views and also to get away from it all.

On a backpack trip into the wilderness, your main concerns are with making hot coffee and dehydrated egg breakfast in the early morning, spending a rest day relaxing from yesterday's long all day hike, or packing your gear and heading up to the next campsite.  You normally stop along the trail either to rest in place or to break for a lunch of trail mix, jerky, and Gatorade.  Late in the afternoon you set up camp, replenish your water, have a dehydrated foil pack dinner, discuss how the day went, and then turn-in for the night inside your tent, with an air mattress, sleeping bag, and pillow made out your rolled up jacket stuffed into a pillow case.  Very fundamental human needs.  To travel is better than to arrive -- it is all in the hiking experience.

We passed one hiker who was coming down the trail who had thrown out his back and was walking at a right angle like an "L" while his buddies carried his pack for him.  Either his pack was too heavy or his back was too weak.  He did not look all that old -- maybe mid 50's
We also passed a few groups comprised of several females and one token male.  I guess he was the bodyguard.

Here are some photos.
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## gipper

I would love to do that.


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## Treeshepherd

Which wilderness area?


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> Which wilderness area?


Well I was speaking generically about any wilderness.

We were backpacking along the east face of the Sierra near Lone Pine CA.


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## yiostheoy

koshergrl said:


> Maybe you'll run into treeshepherd. He's squatting out in the wilderness somewhere.


We were not up on the John Muir trail though.


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## koshergrl

The pics are beautiful. My everest is a local trail nearby. It's short enough that I can do it after work during the summer, and remote enough that not everybody knows about it.


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## yiostheoy

Speaking of squatting, on this backpack trip we brought poo jugs to pack out our poopoo with.

It was an innovation I made from kitty kibbles jugs.

These are then clipped to the outside of our backpacks.

One jug easily holds an entire week's worth of poo.

Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."

.


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## koshergrl




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## Treeshepherd

Whitney Portal? I was just curious. That would be the detail I would be interested in because I'll be hiking down there next year.

Generally, I don't use a tent or an air mattress, eat dehydrated eggs or foil pack dinners, or drink gatorade while I'm backpacking. Those would be specifics.


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## westwall

yiostheoy said:


> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Which wilderness area?
> 
> 
> 
> Well I was speaking generically about any wilderness.
> 
> We were backpacking along the east face of the Sierra near Lone Pine CA.
Click to expand...






Did you head up to Kearsarge Pass?  That's a beautiful area.


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## Treeshepherd

yiostheoy said:


> Speaking of squatting, on this backpack trip we brought poo jugs to pack out our poopoo with.
> 
> It was an innovation I made from kitty kibbles jugs.
> 
> These are then clipped to the outside of our backpacks.
> 
> One jug easily holds an entire week's worth of poo.
> 
> Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."
> 
> .View attachment 87169



Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one


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## cnm

I've never been able to get my pack under 45 lbs plus rifle for a weekend hunt. That's carrying no water.


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## westwall

cnm said:


> I've never been able to get my pack under 45 lbs plus rifle for a weekend hunt. That's carrying no water.







What the heck!  You carrying the kitchen sink too?


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## cnm

I even drilled holes in the magazine well of my rifle to save a bit of weight.


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## westwall

cnm said:


> I even drilled holes in the magazine well of my rifle to save a bit of weight.






You clearly never learned how to edit....


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## cnm

westwall said:


> What the heck! You carrying the kitchen sink too?


A lightweight mountain style stove, maybe half a litre of kerosene, a cup, a billy.


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## cnm

westwall said:


> You clearly never learned how to edit....


Certainly not as well as you've learnt to jump to conclusions.


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## cnm

Treeshepherd said:


> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one


What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> Whitney Portal? I was just curious. That would be the detail I would be interested in because I'll be hiking down there next year.
> 
> Generally, I don't use a tent or an air mattress, eat dehydrated eggs or foil pack dinners, or drink gatorade while I'm backpacking. Those would be specifics.



Yes, Whitney Portal.  Very good guess.  It was my 5th trip up there.  Storms for 3 days in a row held us off the summit until we finally had to turn around because our trail pass was expiring.  Lots of other groups were forced to do the same.

Here is my complete gear list:

BACKPACKING
LIST

Pack attached to frame.
Yoga seat attached to pack as a backrest.
Water bottle pouches attached to frame with carabiner clip locks.

Quick-easy access outer compartments:

1 – Top/center document compartment:
Trail topo map
Glass magnifier
Magnetic topo compass with mirror reflector
Star charts
Red lens compact flashlight
Campfire permit
Trail pass
Ball point pen
Other documents as needed

2 – Top/middle compartment:
Poncho with 2 plastic carabiner clips

3 – Top/right compartment:
Trail snacks – raisins, nuts, jerky, snack bars

4 – Top/left compartment:
First aid kit
Small TP roll in storage bag with 2 plastic poop bags
Extra lighter
Bug net
Bug repellant

5 – Bottom/left compartment:
Gatorade jug w/ measuring scoop inside

6 – Bottom/right compartment:
Two small gas canisters for backpacking stove

Bottom inner compartment:

Pot/lid combo with coffee cup & spoon (this becomes the bear noise repellant at night too)
One large water reserve bottle
Dirty laundry mesh bag

Top inner compartment:

Bear canister w/ camp stove & base & lighter
Dehydrated egg breakfasts
Dehydrated dinners
Instant coffee premixed
Cleanup gear & dishwash gear

Clean up gear in gallon bag – comb, washrag, soap in dish, powder, tweezers, antihistamine, ibuprofen, tooth brush, paste, razor, deodorant

Dishwash gear in plastic storage bag – flask of dish soap, sponge and dish towel

Skivis & sox & sock liners for the trail
Swimming or P/T shorts
Full roll TP in tuppeware
Long paracord & 8 clothespins for clothesline
Boy scout knife with fire stick & G/I can opener
Poo plastic bags in gallon storage bag
Water filter and expanding water jug on top with folded tote daypack to protect it all in last on top

Tent duffel:

Ground tarp for tent
Tent
Tent fly sheet
Tent & fly poles
Air mattress
Pillow case to stuff with jacket as a pillow
Long pack straps for tent duffel

Sleeping bag stuff sack:

Lite sleeping bag for summers
Poncho liner rolled up separately
Big black stuff sack
Long pack straps for sleeping bag

Other items:

Poo jug, assembled & attached last externally
Hiking poles & hiking gloves & machete on belt of its own
Orange/camo hunting jacket to wear & convert to pillow at night or rolled up into tent duffel
Heavy fingerless gloves in pocket of jacket
Orange knit cap in other pocket of jacket
Tie-off cord in pocket

Wear:

Keys on necklace – strip down before leaving (Jeep, gas, steering lock, apt 1 key)
Tennis shoes for car trip
Hiking boots (into jeep)
Wear levis, skivvies, suspenders and belt, white T shirt and white over-shirt
Hiking sox and liners
Utility jack knife into pocket with lanyard
Bike flashlight into other pocket
Cell phone into pocket then into pack at trailhead
Wallet stripped with medical cards and credit card
Cash for food on trip.

Trailhead Gear:

Single-burner gasoline camp-stove
Camp-stove fuel for each additional meal
Ice chest
Ice
Frozen steak
Eggs & onion on top
Salt & pepper
Sharp paring knife & tiny cutting board
Canned fruit
Canned drinks
Trash bags for big tent
Coffee, sugar, canned evap milk.
Coffee pot
Coffee jugs
Knife/fork/spoon camping combo’s
Camp plates
Frying pan & flipper.
Small cooking oil bottle
Camp chairs & table
Tall garbage bags
Water jugs with drinking water
Small duffel or tote to leave in vehicle
Change of clothes for trip home into doffel or tote
Cell phone charger into car.

Data:

Dry pack weight loaded with all gear and food = 20 lbs
3 bottles (5 pts) water = 7.5 lbs
Tent duffel loaded = 11 lbs
Sleeping bag & poncho liner = 5 lbs
Total weight for Whitney was 45 lbs max


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## westwall

cnm said:


> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
Click to expand...





21 pounds full up.  That's with water.


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## yiostheoy

westwall said:


> cnm said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21 pounds full up.  That's with water.
Click to expand...

That's incredibly lite.


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## yiostheoy

westwall said:


> cnm said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've never been able to get my pack under 45 lbs plus rifle for a weekend hunt. That's carrying no water.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What the heck!  You carrying the kitchen sink too?
Click to expand...

The bear-proof canister makes a great kitchen sink!

I bring an REI tote with me to dump all the food and stuff from the bear canister into during the day, and then I use the canister as a sink.  Add hot and cold water to clean up with, face, hair, armpits, crotch, bunghole.  Then let the washrag soak in the soapy water for a while before wringing it out and pouring out the water.  Keeps the washrag clean that way.

The canister also works well as a camp chair.

And if you take the lid off it and line it with a plastic bag, it works just like a toilet too.

A very versatile piece of gear.

For the evenings, the food goes back into the canister and under a tree to keep the bears away from your tent.


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## Treeshepherd

cnm said:


> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
Click to expand...


I just did 180 miles from Tuolumne Meadows to Tahoe on the Pacific Crest Trail. I started with 45 pounds including 64 ounces of water. Resupplied food on day 12 (total of 14 days). Pack got as light as 35 pounds.

Pack included:
ENO backpacking hammock and straps
9x8 tarp
Jacket
Shorts
4 pairs of socks
1 extra shirt
1 extra underwear
Food (inside bear canister)
Knife
Journal
Platypus water filter
Klean Kanteen
Toilet paper
Maps
Tweezers
Mosquito hood


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of squatting, on this backpack trip we brought poo jugs to pack out our poopoo with.
> 
> It was an innovation I made from kitty kibbles jugs.
> 
> These are then clipped to the outside of our backpacks.
> 
> One jug easily holds an entire week's worth of poo.
> 
> Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."
> 
> .View attachment 87169
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
Click to expand...

I am sure that someday everyone everywhere on Federal lands will be required to pack out their poo just like at Whitney.

I should patent a poo jug like the one I designed for this hike.


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> cnm said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just did 180 miles from Tuolumne Meadows to Tahoe on the Pacific Crest Trail. I started with 45 pounds including 64 ounces of water. Resupplied food on day 12 (total of 14 days). Pack got as light as 35 pounds.
> 
> Pack included:
> ENO backpacking hammock and straps
> 9x8 tarp
> Jacket
> Shorts
> 4 pairs of socks
> 1 extra shirt
> 1 extra underwear
> Food (inside bear canister)
> Knife
> Journal
> Platypus water filter
> Klean Kanteen
> Toilet paper
> Maps
> Tweezers
> Mosquito hood
Click to expand...

With some paracord and 8 clothespins, I have found that washing one's clothing every other day during the rest days therefore only requires 1 extra set of skivis and sox.

Normally I hike all day with the pack, set up camp in the evening, replenish my water, then sack out without dinner.  Usually too exhausted on a hiking day to eat.

The next day is always a rest day on which I will do laundry using the bear canister as a washing machine for the skivis and sox.  I can even wash a shirt in a separate load.

Then wring and rise them out and hang them on the paracord clothesline to dry overnight.


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## cnm

Treeshepherd said:


> I started with 45 pounds including 64 ounces of water. Resupplied food on day 12 (total of 14 days).


No stove, no cooking gear, no spare ammunition, no torch, no rifle cleaning gear, no binos, no this, no that?


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## Treeshepherd

yiostheoy said:


> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of squatting, on this backpack trip we brought poo jugs to pack out our poopoo with.
> 
> It was an innovation I made from kitty kibbles jugs.
> 
> These are then clipped to the outside of our backpacks.
> 
> One jug easily holds an entire week's worth of poo.
> 
> Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."
> 
> .View attachment 87169
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am sure that someday everyone everywhere on Federal lands will be required to pack out their poo just like at Whitney.
> 
> I should patent a poo jug like the one I designed for this hike.
Click to expand...


Nobody packs out their poop. Well, one person. 

You have to crap away from lakes and streams. You are required to carry out used paper, which I noticed that lots of people didnt do (animals dig it up). I just put mine in a zip lock and burn it at the next fire pit.


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## westwall

yiostheoy said:


> westwall said:
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> cnm said:
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> 
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> 
> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21 pounds full up.  That's with water.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's incredibly lite.
Click to expand...






I have always traveled light.  I wear the same pants, and shirt, but change underwear daily, and socks every three to four days depending on wear and tear.   I fish along the way, and forage for a little bit depending on where I'm hiking.   I carry a bowie knife as a camp tool because I can do everything with it.  Don't have a tent, or a camp chair.  I have a small esbit cooker that I carry and use a small pot to cook everything in.


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## yiostheoy

westwall said:


> yiostheoy said:
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> westwall said:
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> cnm said:
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> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21 pounds full up.  That's with water.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's incredibly lite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have always traveled light.  I wear the same pants, and shirt, but change underwear daily, and socks every three to four days depending on wear and tear.   I fish along the way, and forage for a little bit depending on where I'm hiking.   I carry a bowie knife as a camp tool because I can do everything with it.  Don't have a tent, or a camp chair.  I have a small esbit cooker that I carry and use a small pot to cook everything in.
Click to expand...

For 3 days we got rained on, with sleet too.

For times like that a ground tarp, tent, and rain fly are very nice to have.  This of course costs you about 10 lbs.


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## Treeshepherd

cnm said:


> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> I started with 45 pounds including 64 ounces of water. Resupplied food on day 12 (total of 14 days).
> 
> 
> 
> No stove, no cooking gear, no spare ammunition, no torch, no rifle cleaning gear, no binos, no this no that?
Click to expand...


No stove, no pots or pans, no cups or plates.

I did forget to mention Ziploc baggies, I brought those. I should have brought a contractor bag to put all my stuff in inside my pack. Next time. 

I'll be setting out again on September 4th or 5th for a longer trek. I'll be blogging it if u want to follow along. My details are on my profile page.


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## yiostheoy

I don't particularly enjoy foul body odor, so I wash my skivis and sox every day on my alternate rest days.

I can wash the shirt too every few days when it starts to stink as well.

I typically do not wash the Levi's though -- they can usually go indefinitely without washing as long as you are changing skivi's every day.


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## westwall

yiostheoy said:


> westwall said:
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> yiostheoy said:
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> westwall said:
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> cnm said:
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> Treeshepherd said:
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> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> 
> 
> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21 pounds full up.  That's with water.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's incredibly lite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have always traveled light.  I wear the same pants, and shirt, but change underwear daily, and socks every three to four days depending on wear and tear.   I fish along the way, and forage for a little bit depending on where I'm hiking.   I carry a bowie knife as a camp tool because I can do everything with it.  Don't have a tent, or a camp chair.  I have a small esbit cooker that I carry and use a small pot to cook everything in.
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> Click to expand...
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> For 3 days we got rained on, with sleet too.
> 
> For times like that a ground tarp, tent, and rain fly are very nice to have.  This of course costs you about 10 lbs.
Click to expand...







Nope.  No tent, though when I hiked the PCT I did add a tube tent to the load.  My pack for that trip was 65 pounds as I had to be prepared for many other eventualities.


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> cnm said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> I started with 45 pounds including 64 ounces of water. Resupplied food on day 12 (total of 14 days).
> 
> 
> 
> No stove, no cooking gear, no spare ammunition, no torch, no rifle cleaning gear, no binos, no this no that?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No stove, no pots or pans, no cups or plates.
> 
> I did forget to mention Ziploc baggies, I brought those. I should have brought a contractor bag to put all my stuff in inside my pack. Next time.
> 
> I'll be setting out again on September 4th or 5th for a longer trek. I'll be blogging it if u want to follow along. My details are on my profile page.
Click to expand...

Even when I had my Colt Woodsman 22LR pistol with me, to shoot small game and birds in the Rockies, I would still bring along several dehydrated meals as a backup in case I could not shoot anything.  But on a good trip I would not use any of them except maybe the egg breakfasts.  That and hot coffee are always good in the mornings.

And of course to heat the water for the coffee and the dehydrated eggs you need a stove and pot/pan.  The pan I have is also a lid for the pot.


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## Treeshepherd

I forgot also I carry a Goal Zero solar charger and a Black Diamond headlamp.


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## yiostheoy

westwall said:


> yiostheoy said:
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> westwall said:
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> yiostheoy said:
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> westwall said:
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> cnm said:
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> What does your pack weigh for a weekend hunt away from every facility?
> 
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> 
> 21 pounds full up.  That's with water.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's incredibly lite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have always traveled light.  I wear the same pants, and shirt, but change underwear daily, and socks every three to four days depending on wear and tear.   I fish along the way, and forage for a little bit depending on where I'm hiking.   I carry a bowie knife as a camp tool because I can do everything with it.  Don't have a tent, or a camp chair.  I have a small esbit cooker that I carry and use a small pot to cook everything in.
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> Click to expand...
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> 
> Nope.  No tent, though when I hiked the PCT I did add a tube tent to the load.  My pack for that trip was 65 pounds as I had to be prepared for many other eventualities.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For 3 days we got rained on, with sleet too.
> 
> For times like that a ground tarp, tent, and rain fly are very nice to have.  This of course costs you about 10 lbs.
Click to expand...


My hiking buddy used a bivy the last time and almost froze to death.

This year he graduated to a small 2 person tent and it was perfect for him, he said.

I also use a 2 person tent.  My backpack is the other person.  I like to keep it inside my tent with me.

That way it stays dry in the rain and sleet.


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## westwall

Treeshepherd said:


> I forgot also I carry a Goal Zero solar charger and a Black Diamond headlamp.







I carry a small flashlight but that's it.  No recharger or anything like that.   Like I said, I travel light.  If I'm doing an overnighter I won't even carry a pack on most occasions.  I have a good coat with pockets and just use that.


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## Treeshepherd

yiostheoy said:


> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
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> cnm said:
> 
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> 
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> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> I started with 45 pounds including 64 ounces of water. Resupplied food on day 12 (total of 14 days).
> 
> 
> 
> No stove, no cooking gear, no spare ammunition, no torch, no rifle cleaning gear, no binos, no this no that?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No stove, no pots or pans, no cups or plates.
> 
> I did forget to mention Ziploc baggies, I brought those. I should have brought a contractor bag to put all my stuff in inside my pack. Next time.
> 
> I'll be setting out again on September 4th or 5th for a longer trek. I'll be blogging it if u want to follow along. My details are on my profile page.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Even when I had my Colt Woodsman 22LR pistol with me, to shoot small game and birds in the Rockies, I would still bring along several dehydrated meals as a backup in case I could not shoot anything.  But on a good trip I would not use any of them except maybe the egg breakfasts.  That and hot coffee are always good in the mornings.
> 
> And of course to heat the water for the coffee and the dehydrated eggs you need a stove and pot/pan.  The pan I have is also a lid for the pot.
Click to expand...


I don't hunt or bring any weapon. Just the folding knife.

I didn't bring coffee last time. That was a mistake. This time I'll bring instant and just mix some in my water bottle with some powdered milk and drink it cold.


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## cnm

westwall said:


> My pack for that trip was 65 pounds as I had to be prepared for many other eventualities.


More realistic.


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## westwall

yiostheoy said:


> westwall said:
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> yiostheoy said:
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> westwall said:
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> yiostheoy said:
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> westwall said:
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> 
> 21 pounds full up.  That's with water.
> 
> 
> 
> That's incredibly lite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have always traveled light.  I wear the same pants, and shirt, but change underwear daily, and socks every three to four days depending on wear and tear.   I fish along the way, and forage for a little bit depending on where I'm hiking.   I carry a bowie knife as a camp tool because I can do everything with it.  Don't have a tent, or a camp chair.  I have a small esbit cooker that I carry and use a small pot to cook everything in.
> 
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> Click to expand...
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> 
> Nope.  No tent, though when I hiked the PCT I did add a tube tent to the load.  My pack for that trip was 65 pounds as I had to be prepared for many other eventualities.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For 3 days we got rained on, with sleet too.
> 
> For times like that a ground tarp, tent, and rain fly are very nice to have.  This of course costs you about 10 lbs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> My hiking buddy used a bivy the last time and almost froze to death.
> 
> This year he graduated to a small 2 person tent and it was perfect for him, he said.
> 
> I also use a 2 person tent.  My backpack is the other person.  I like to keep it inside my tent with me.
> 
> That way it stays dry in the rain and sleet.
Click to expand...







If I'm going up to high altitude I will bring the tube tent as I will find a protected spot and lay the tent down and use it as a ground sheet and cover.  I too bring everything in under cover (it acts like a dead air space insulator that way) and many times I have awakened to find myself covered with ice (on top of the tube tent) but I'm snug in my sleeping bag.


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## westwall

cnm said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> My pack for that trip was 65 pounds as I had to be prepared for many other eventualities.
> 
> 
> 
> More realistic.
Click to expand...





2600 miles.  More climate zones, thus more prep needed.


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> I don't hunt or bring any weapon. Just the folding knife.
> 
> I didn't bring coffee last time. That was a mistake. This time I'll bring instant and just mix some in my water bottle with some powdered milk and drink it cold.


Our coffee at the trailhead in the campsite near the vehicles is always freshly brewed in an old fashioned percolator.

Our coffee on the trail is a premixed concoction of instant coffee, coffeemate, and sugar.

I have found that under any strenuous circumstances, coffee is always the first thing that the body craves.

And scrambled eggs with ham or bacon bits in it is always the second thing.

So those are the fist 2 things I make on any given morning out on the trail.


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## yiostheoy

westwall said:


> If I'm going up to high altitude I will bring the tube tent as I will find a protected spot and lay the tent down and use it as a ground sheet and cover.  I too bring everything in under cover (it acts like a dead air space insulator that way) and many times I have awakened to find myself covered with ice (on top of the tube tent) but I'm snug in my sleeping bag.


The only dangerous thing about setting up your tent directly under a tree is the lightning.

I prefer to be away from the trees a bit.

We saw lots and lots of old dead trees that had been struck by lightning previously.


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## cnm

But then I'm hunting off the tracks in this sort of stuff...


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Treeshepherd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of squatting, on this backpack trip we brought poo jugs to pack out our poopoo with.
> 
> It was an innovation I made from kitty kibbles jugs.
> 
> These are then clipped to the outside of our backpacks.
> 
> One jug easily holds an entire week's worth of poo.
> 
> Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."
> 
> .View attachment 87169
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is beyond specific. Singular is the adjective for that one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am sure that someday everyone everywhere on Federal lands will be required to pack out their poo just like at Whitney.
> 
> I should patent a poo jug like the one I designed for this hike.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Nobody packs out their poop. Well, one person.
> 
> You have to crap away from lakes and streams. You are required to carry out used paper, which I noticed that lots of people didnt do (animals dig it up). I just put mine in a zip lock and burn it at the next fire pit.
Click to expand...

Note that within the Whitney Zone you are REQUIRED to pack out your poop.

This will be a new experience for you.


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## westwall

yiostheoy said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I'm going up to high altitude I will bring the tube tent as I will find a protected spot and lay the tent down and use it as a ground sheet and cover.  I too bring everything in under cover (it acts like a dead air space insulator that way) and many times I have awakened to find myself covered with ice (on top of the tube tent) but I'm snug in my sleeping bag.
> 
> 
> 
> The only dangerous thing about setting up your tent directly under a tree is the lightning.
> 
> I prefer to be away from the trees a bit.
> 
> We saw lots and lots of old dead trees that had been struck by lightning previously.
Click to expand...






Not under a standing tree, usually a fallen one, or a cleft in the rocks.  The hardest spot I ever slept in was a dry lake bed in the desert.  That sucked.  I camped on Tableland Meadows one year, which is above the treeline, and other than the fucking mosquito's that tried to suck me dry, I had a good time.  I killed 935 of them in an hour!


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> I don't hunt or bring any weapon. Just the folding knife.
> ...


My ideal is to bring 2 firearms -- one 22LR pistol for small game and one 12 gauge shotgun loaded with alternating slugs and double aught buck for self defense.

But obviously in the Whitney Zone there are way too many people to forage for game.

Elsewhere, I have always seen plenty of grouse, quail, rabbits, squirrel, and an occasional snake for dinner.

I have never tried rats but they must be similar to squirrel.  A Chinese babe I used to date said that rat meat tastes pretty good.


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## westwall

cnm said:


> But then I'm hunting off the tracks in this sort of stuff...









You're a Kiwi?  That's North Island near Gisborne.  We hunted Sika near there one year.


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## yiostheoy

westwall said:


> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I'm going up to high altitude I will bring the tube tent as I will find a protected spot and lay the tent down and use it as a ground sheet and cover.  I too bring everything in under cover (it acts like a dead air space insulator that way) and many times I have awakened to find myself covered with ice (on top of the tube tent) but I'm snug in my sleeping bag.
> 
> 
> 
> The only dangerous thing about setting up your tent directly under a tree is the lightning.
> 
> I prefer to be away from the trees a bit.
> 
> We saw lots and lots of old dead trees that had been struck by lightning previously.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not under a standing tree, usually a fallen one, or a cleft in the rocks.  The hardest spot I ever slept in was a dry lake bed in the desert.  That sucked.  I camped on Tableland Meadows one year, which is above the treeline, and other than the fucking mosquito's that tried to suck me dry, I had a good time.  I killed 935 of them in an hour!
Click to expand...

I have camped on Emerson Lake in the Mojave Desert (on Federal restricted land).

Worse than the mosquitoes are the biting flies called kissing bugs.

I am really spoiled now and won't go anywhere without my 2 person tent, air mattress, sleeping bag, and poncho liner.  I like being toasty warm and dry at night, and not getting bitten by bugs of any kind.


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## Treeshepherd

yiostheoy said:


> Note that within the Whitney Zone you are REQUIRED to pack out your poop.
> 
> This will be a new experience for you.



That's just on one mountain, not the PCT in general.

Actually, Whitney doesn't sound all that appealing to me with all the waiting list/permitting, regulations and crowds. I'm sure it's awesome but all that red tape is a buzz kill.


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Note that within the Whitney Zone you are REQUIRED to pack out your poop.
> 
> This will be a new experience for you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's just on one mountain, not the PCT in general.
> 
> Actually, Whitney doesn't sound all that appealing to me with all the waiting list/permitting, regulations and crowds. I'm sure it's awesome but all that red tape is a buzz kill.
Click to expand...

You are correct.

However my buddy really wanted to try and summit it.

But summiting Whitney is always if-fy even on a good day.

This trip we got rained out, with sleet.

Last trip, we got snowed out and could not ascend to the top.

The 3 times I did it prior everything went ok and I made it all the way to the top.  But I did not bring a camera.  But cameras back in those days were not digital yet.


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## cnm

westwall said:


> We hunted Sika near there one year.


Sika and fallow are the best eating deer I've experienced, much better than red.


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## westwall

Treeshepherd said:


> yiostheoy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Note that within the Whitney Zone you are REQUIRED to pack out your poop.
> 
> This will be a new experience for you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's just on one mountain, not the PCT in general.
> 
> Actually, Whitney doesn't sound all that appealing to me with all the waiting list/permitting, regulations and crowds. I'm sure it's awesome but all that red tape is a buzz kill.
Click to expand...








To be honest with you the climb is easy, and the crowds annoying.  Far better, at least IMHO, was the hike up Waucoba Mountain on the opposite side of Owens Valley.  It's only a bit more than 11K to the top, but there's NO ONE there.


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## yiostheoy

I normally prefer rolling mountain country with abundant water from mountain springs and streams.

Summits are generally not preferable because there is never any water up there so you need to bring your own.

I hate dry camps.

I usually plan excursions from one water source to the next one.

Water is great for drinking, for cooking, for cleaning up, and for washing your clothes out.


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## Treeshepherd

65 pound packs, canned drinks, percolators, multiple fire arms, daily laundry, two person tents, poop bags...
I'm definitely not interested in carrying all that over 2 passes per day. The people I met on the PCT this month don't travel like that. They typically resupply food once a week and keep the pack around 40 pounds or less.


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> 65 pound packs, canned drinks, percolators, multiple fire arms, daily laundry, two person tents, poop bags...
> I'm definitely not interested in carrying all that over 2 passes per day. The people I met on the PCT this month don't travel like that. They typically resupply food once a week and keep the pack around 40 pounds or less.


I can do 55 lbs max.  But only on flat lands.

40 lbs is my ideal including 5 pints of water.


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## westwall

Treeshepherd said:


> 65 pound packs, canned drinks, percolators, multiple fire arms, daily laundry, two person tents, poop bags...
> I'm definitely not interested in carrying all that over 2 passes per day. The people I met on the PCT this month don't travel like that. They typically resupply food once a week and keep the pack around 40 pounds or less.









Yeah 65 was a bit much but it was a long time ago, before the technology lightened everything up.


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## Treeshepherd

My sleeping bag (2lbs.), obviously, I forgot to list that. And ENO makes an insulating blanket that fits inside the hammock and wraps around the bag. That's mere ounces. 

I would take a tent if I did Oregon and Washington. In California you can eek by without one in August. Weather comes in in the afternoon, typically, but clears out at dusk (in my experience). Tents are mostly a type of psychological security. They also provide privacy for intimate couples. But I like to look at the stars and I was plenty warm in my 22 degree bag above 10,000 feet earlier this month.

My next leg of the PCT from Donner heading north won't be as high. Maybe 8,000 feet max. Not sure if it'll be blazing hot or rainy and cool. Looking forward to hot springs around Lassen. 

Anyway, happy trails all. My trail name is Squirrel. See you out there.


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## yiostheoy

Treeshepherd said:


> 65 pound packs, canned drinks, percolators, multiple fire arms, daily laundry, two person tents, poop bags...
> I'm definitely not interested in carrying all that over 2 passes per day. The people I met on the PCT this month don't travel like that. They typically resupply food once a week and keep the pack around 40 pounds or less.


The national parks and state parks do not allow firearms.  Thus if you hike through one of them you may not have any.  Whenever I cannot carry a firearm I always have my machete with me, shoulder mounted on its own belt across my shoulder.

The national forests and BLM land permit guns, but you need to have a valid hunting license for hunting.  Best to have a bear tag also in case you need to shoot one.  And a pig tag as well.  Deer season is carefully controlled and regulated, besides which you are unlikely to see a hunt-able buck anyway because the mountain lions are killing most of them.

If you get dropped off early enough in the day so that you can start hiking-in right away, then you don't need to set up a trailhead camp with a percolating coffee maker, canned drinks, pots and pans for a real breakfast.  But for us each to get to Whitney Portal campground we each had to drive 8 or more hours by car.  So we set up a camp and had a nice breakfast in the morning of the first day.

Since bear canisters are mandatory as well as make sense, just a tiny backpacking detergent vial lets you wash your skivis, sox, sock liners, and shirt when needed.  This way you are always wearing clean dry clothing next to your skin.  And then you don't need to carry as much extra clothing -- just one day's worth.  You already have the bear canister so it might as well get full usage.

I like the idea of packing out poop.  Squatting all over the wilderness seems nasty now to me.

In the rain and sleet (tiny hail), a ground tarp and tent and rain fly are indispensable.  Otherwise you could suffer hypothermia.  Our tents each worked well in the 3 days of rain that we encountered.

Each trip is different.  Desert is different than mountains.  Bear country is different than coyote country.  Mountain lions are almost everywhere in California.  So a tent is a good thing in most cases anywhere.  Tents protect you from parasite insects like ticks, fleas, mosquitoes, and biting flies (kissing bugs) as well.  Fleas carry plague bacillus.  Mice and rats carry fleas.  There are plague warnings all over the Sierra.


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## yiostheoy

Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."

Unfortunately most people squat in the woods and don't pack it out.

We pick up after our dogs in town.

So there is no good reason not to pick up after ourselves as well.

Leave the forest as you found it -- pristine.


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## yiostheoy

Just finished cleaning up all my gear and doing the laundry and dishes from the trip.

After I took all my gear out of the backpack, I cleaned it and returned it to the back pack.  Except for replenishing the dehydrated meals, of which I need more Mountain House dehydrates for my 3 day supply, my pack is always packed and ready to go.  It is my 72 hour kit when I am not backpacking with it.

Now I need to run to the store for groceries.  Before I leave home for a week I tend to eat everything out of the fridge so that it is empty and nothing can spoil while I am away.  Net result, the fridge is completely empty now.

Grocery shopping tends to require getting one or two of everything at this point.

On the trail the dehydrated scrambled eggs and bacon were very good, so now I am hungry for fresh scrambled eggs with fresh bacon in the mornings -- so I'll buy some of that.

I missed bread and also tuna mayo sandwiches.  So I'll get more of that for lunches.  Tuna and mayo on toast tastes great for lunch.

I got plenty of dehydrated beef and vegies on the trail, so now I will get a corned beef brisket and cook that tonight, with cabbage and carrots.  You really miss fresh foods on a backpack trip, although the dehydrates tend to taste pretty good while you are out there since you are hungrier outdoors.

I missed milk.  I especially missed strawberry milkshakes, which I make by blending together frozen strawberries with milk in my blender.  So I'll get both.  These are my main cravings from civilization.  I did not miss alcoholic drinks, but I did miss strawberry milkshakes.

I have plenty of booze, so I don't need more of that.  My booze of choice is Everclear, which I mix with frozen fruit and make fruit smoothies with.  But I have plenty of booze, just need more strawberries, same as for the milk shakes.

I missed fresh vegetables so I will get more of those.  Stir fry vegies are my favorites, even though I don't always stir fry them.

For me, returning to civilization is an exercise in gratification of all the food lusts that I missed out on the backpack trail.  This is where Epicureanism (my primary philosophy) takes over from Stoicism (my secondary backup philosophy) again.

Epicureanism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Stoicism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## koshergrl

yiostheoy said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> "I like the idea of packing out poop."
> 
> I am absolutely 100 percent certain that is true.
> 
> 
> 
> Rule #1 for backpacking is "pack it in -- pack it out."
> 
> Unfortunately most people squat in the woods and don't pack it out.
> 
> We pick up after our dogs in town.
> 
> So there is no good reason not to pick up after ourselves as well.
> 
> Leave the forest as you found it -- pristine.
Click to expand...

Whatever lol. You want to live like you are in town, stay in town. Not tha I don't relish the idea of you being so fearful of your own presence that you are happy to handle and pack your own crap around.


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## yiostheoy

Whenever people poop in the wilderness it stinks up the area and you can tell for months they have done it.

There is also a cholera contamination risk.

It is better therefore to pack your poop out, same as when you pickup after your dog.


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## Camp

Most hikes in wilderness areas like those discussed in this thread are far from real wilderness and have designated trails. That means people use these trails day after day and the debris and waste accumulates if not hiked out. When "bushwacking", meaning going off the designated trails and making your own path, burying wasted usually accepted. The term wilderness is being used very loosely in this thread.


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## yiostheoy

To bury poop correctly you need to dig at least half a foot deep or more.  A whole foot would be ideal.

Most people barely scratch they surface when they dig their cat holes.

Most people do everything they do very superficially.  With cat holes this then stinks up the area.

The best and easiest thing is to pack your poop out with you.

That's when the poop jug comes in handy, and plastic bags.


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## yiostheoy

Bushwacking is discouraged in most regulated wilderness areas.  The USFS wants people to stay on the trails to minimize erosion along the trails.


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## whoisit

Partially grew up in the wilderness in North and South Georgia. Also the Okeefenoki Swamps. Was also part time city slicker, best of both worlds back then.

I'm female but was big time Tom boy. Love to run through the woods and jumped over many snakes. Also had a couple fights with a couple over tree houses. My mother lost a fight with a diamond back rattler almost killed her and was talk about leg aputation. Stone Mountain has lots of snakes we swam with them all our lives. Mother told me to get out of the water ,slowly, there were 2 large cottom mouths right behind me, I was arguring  with her, didn't know about the snakes behind my head. Also in a creek two attacked me. Mother shot them both. I know all about wildrness life.


----------

