# But....a handgun ban that doesn't work?   Just ask the Canadians...



## 2aguy (Oct 25, 2022)

Canada doesn't have a 2nd amendment, so their politicians can do stupid gun bans that don't work......

*Toronto Police reported a shooting in Scarborough that happened just after 3 p.m., hours after Trudeau’s announcement. There would be another shooting in Scarborough that sent a man to hospital with non-life-threatening injuries just after 6 p.m.*
*


A third shooting happened overnight and left a 38-year-old man dead, Toronto’s 57th homicide of the year.


*
*That’s just Toronto. Across the country, communities are dealing with an increase in gun violence and Trudeau’s latest move won’t fix anything. The handgun freeze has actually been in place since May 30 and in every month since, there have been more than 30 shootings in Toronto, putting the city on track to match or exceed last year’s total of 409.
----
That’s because the people doing the shooting aren’t following any laws, never mind a tightening of them.*
*
The three men arrested Friday in connection with a shooting in Vancouver, not far from where Trudeau made his announcement, weren’t licensed gun owners, they were gang members. They weren’t using a gun purchased at a local gun shop, they were using an illegal gun, likely smuggled into the country from the United States.*













						EDITORIAL: Handgun ban won’t work
					

It should be no surprise that, within hours of Justin Trudeau announcing his handgun freeze had become permanent, there were shootings.




					torontosun.com


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## sealybobo (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Canada doesn't have a 2nd amendment, so their politicians can do stupid gun bans that don't work......
> 
> *Toronto Police reported a shooting in Scarborough that happened just after 3 p.m., hours after Trudeau’s announcement. There would be another shooting in Scarborough that sent a man to hospital with non-life-threatening injuries just after 6 p.m.*
> 
> ...


Recent estimates indicate that 26 percent of Canadian households own at least one firearm. Ninety-five percent of firearm-owning households in Canada possess long guns and less than 12 percent own handguns.

They like hunting guns.  Assault rifles not so much.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2022)

Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249

Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384


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## 2aguy (Oct 25, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384




Yeah, our criminals like to kill each other...their criminals not as much.


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## 2aguy (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> Recent estimates indicate that 26 percent of Canadian households own at least one firearm. Ninety-five percent of firearm-owning households in Canada possess long guns and less than 12 percent own handguns.
> 
> They like hunting guns.  Assault rifles not so much.




You mean except for Alberta....right?
*
The Alberta government is taking steps to oppose federal firearms prohibition legislation and the potential seizure of thousands of assault-style weapons.*







__





						Loading…
					





					www.cbc.ca


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## Calypso Jones (Oct 25, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384


well leftist bureaus rather manipuate those numbers.  And Leftists DO own firearms.


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384



Population of Canada - 36 million.

Population of USA - 340 million.

Ratio of JoeBstalin's IQ to that of a dung beetle 1/1...


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## 2aguy (Oct 25, 2022)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Population of Canada - 36 million.
> 
> Population of USA - 340 million.
> 
> Ratio of JoeBstalin's IQ to that of a dung beetle 1/1...




The biggest factor is American criminals like to kill each other.  Canadian criminals do not.  That, however, is also changing as foreign immigrants in Canada take over their drug crime......


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## sealybobo (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> You mean except for Alberta....right?
> 
> *The Alberta government is taking steps to oppose federal firearms prohibition legislation and the potential seizure of thousands of assault-style weapons.*
> 
> ...


I wonder if they'd consider my Ruger 450 Bushmaster an assault rifle?  They shouldn't.  It can only hold 4 bullets at a time.  It's meant for hunting.

I get guns meant for hunting it's the other guns.  The icky guns I don't like.  LOL.  

Actually, I see why we need them.  Wolverines!!!


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> The biggest factor is American criminals like to kill each other.  Canadian criminals do not.  That, however, is also changing as foreign immigrants in Canada take over their drug crime......



Great point. Canada has enjoyed two homogenous cultures, the French and the British. The two cultures largely keep to themselves. This has resulted in a fairly peaceful country as there is a common language, common religion, and common culture. 

That is starting to change as the globalists seek to adulterate Canada with third world immigrants. Just as with the USA, as the percent of third world residents goes up, violent crime goes up.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> Recent estimates indicate that 26 percent of Canadian households own at least one firearm. Ninety-five percent of firearm-owning households in Canada possess long guns and less than 12 percent own handguns.


So...  why do they have so many fewer mass shootings than we do?


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## sealybobo (Oct 25, 2022)

M14 Shooter said:


> So...  why do they have so many fewer mass shootings than we do?


Recently various analysts have called attention to the apparent success of the Canadian social assistance system in reducing poverty among the elderly and have suggested that there may be lessons to be drawn from the Canadian experience that are relevant to the evolution of the U.S. Supplemental Security Income (SSI) program. 






						The Canadian Safety Net for the Elderly
					

Social Security Administration Research, Statistics, and Policy Analysis



					www.ssa.gov


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> Recently various analysts have called attention to the apparent success of the Canadian social assistance system in reducing poverty among the elderly and have suggested that there may be lessons to be drawn from the Canadian experience that are relevant to the evolution of the U.S. Supplemental Security Income (SSI) program.


So, it's -not- the guns in the US driving the mass shootings in the US.
Well done.


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

Americans discussing the problem of too many guns and too many deaths by guns is progress!


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Americans discussing the problem of too many guns and too many deaths by guns is progress!



"Too many guns" is an impossible condition.


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## sealybobo (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Americans discussing the problem of too many guns and too many deaths by guns is progress!


But the gun manufacturers want to sell more guns next year than they did this year.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> But the gun manufacturers want to sell more guns next year than they did this year.


GM and Ford want to sell more cars than they did last year.
So?


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## Concerned American (Oct 25, 2022)

Uncensored2008 said:


> This has resulted in a fairly peaceful country as there is a common language,


This isn't exactly true.  While most of the country speaks and understands English, all federal signs and communications have to be printed in French (or a facsimile thereof, as French nationals claim that French Canadians don't speak French) as well.


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

Concerned American said:


> This isn't exactly true.  While most of the country speaks and understands English, all federal signs and communications have to be printed in French (or a facsimile thereof, as French nationals claim that French Canadians don't speak French) as well.



Right, as I said, two homogenous cultures, the French and the British. The two cultures largely keep to themselves. There were clashes with the French in the 1960's that drove Canada close to civil war, but since that time the French and the Brits have mostly learned to get along. Leave the French Montreal and Quebec and the Brits the rest.


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> But the gun manufacturers want to sell more guns next year than they did this year.


Too many guns primarily but that along with the American culture of violence, death, and continuous wars.

This then is a problem that can possibly be addressed by various different approaches that include more solutions other than the obvious overabundance of guns.

American attitudes and the culture of killing, death, violence, and wars may be a more direct approach, considering that Americans only want more weapons that are designed for shooting each other.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Too many guns....



Impossible..


Donald H said:


> This then is a problem that can possibly be addressed by various different approaches that include more solutions other than the obvious overabundance of guns.



No such thing.


Donald H said:


> American attitudes and the culture of killing, death, violence, and wars may be a more direct approach, considering that Americans only want more weapons that are designed for shooting each other.



All weapons are designed for people to use against other people.


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Right, as I said, two homogenous cultures, the French and the British. The two cultures largely keep to themselves. There were clashes with the French in the 1960's that drove Canada close to civil war, but since that time the French and the Brits have mostly learned to get along. Leave the French Montreal and Quebec and the Brits the rest.


No, the FLQ crisis didn't bring Canada close to civil war. It was more similar to the truckers demonstrating, which was a small group of Canadians, infiltrated with Americans. 

Although it's true that the FLQ had their cause, while the truckers had no cause that could be identified.

Coincidentally, both P.E. Trudeau and Justin Trudeau defused both situations sufficiently without any imposition on the rights and freedoms of Canadians!

As opposed to America's failed coup attempt by Trump, which cost the lives of many Americans.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> As opposed to America's failed coup attempt by Trump, which cost the lives of many Americans.


Good of you to no longer hide your bigotry and dishonesty behind implication and innuendo.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Canada doesn't have a 2nd amendment, so their politicians can do stupid gun bans that don't work......
> 
> *Toronto Police reported a shooting in Scarborough that happened just after 3 p.m., hours after Trudeau’s announcement. There would be another shooting in Scarborough that sent a man to hospital with non-life-threatening injuries just after 6 p.m.*
> 
> ...


This is a lie.

Handguns are not banned in Canada.


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Too many guns primarily but that along with the American culture of violence, death, and continuous wars.
> 
> This then is a problem that can possibly be addressed by various different approaches that include more solutions other than the obvious overabundance of guns.
> 
> American attitudes and the culture of killing, death, violence, and wars may be a more direct approach, considering that Americans only want more weapons that are designed for shooting each other.



I have a .38 revolver that I've had since the 1970's. I've kept it loaded in a drawer for all these years, and it's never gone out and shot anyone?

It must be defective...


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

Many of those loaded guns kept in drawers have ended up shooting the owner's children in the face.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Many of those loaded guns kept in drawers have ended up shooting the owner's children in the face.


You and I both know you know you cannot demonstrate this to be true.


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## Blues Man (Oct 25, 2022)

Uncensored2008 said:


> I have a .38 revolver that I've had since the 1970's. I've kept it loaded in a drawer for all these years, and it's never gone out and shot anyone?
> 
> It must be defective...


I know my Glock 19 is extremely well behaved too I'm starting to wonder if I should see if it's defective


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## Blues Man (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Many of those loaded guns kept in drawers have ended up shooting the owner's children in the face.


Less than 500 accidental shooting deaths annually out of literally tens of millions of legal gun uses annually 

in any other activity this would be seen as a stellar safety record


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

Blues Man said:


> Less than 500 accidental shooting deaths annually out of literally tens of millions of legal gun uses annually
> 
> in any other activity this would be seen as a stellar safety record


Tens of thousands of injured gun owners and their children being either killed or injured by loaded guns left in drawers, under pillows, in the hall, behind the toilet, under the bed, in yard, in the dog's kennel, in the pumpkin patch, in the car, behind their ears, etc.
Ask NRA members if leaving loaded guns lying around is a good idea?
I'm a Canadian so don't ask me. I've been conditioned to not give a fk.



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2022/08/24/mom-dad-infant-gun-unsecured/


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Tens of thousands of injured gun owners and their children being either killed or injured by loaded guns left in drawers, under pillows, in the hall,...


^^^^^
An outright lie.


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

Blues Man said:


> I know my Glock 19 is extremely well behaved too I'm starting to wonder if I should see if it's defective


Load it and give it to a 3 year old to find out.


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## Donald H (Oct 25, 2022)

Gun Violence in America
					

Gun violence in America is at a crisis point. Every day, more than 110 people are killed from guns and more than 200 are shot and wounded.




					everytownresearch.org
				




What is 200 multiplied by 365 days in a year?

About 73,000?
Or more than 7 times 10,000?


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Load it and give it to a 3 year old to find out.


If your knew anything about firearms, you'd know a 3-yr old can't rack the slide.
Good of yor to continue to put your ignorance on display for us all to see.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Gun Violence in America
> 
> 
> Gun violence in America is at a crisis point. Every day, more than 110 people are killed from guns and more than 200 are shot and wounded.
> ...



What's 73,000 divided by 423,000,000?


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## Foxfyre (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Canada doesn't have a 2nd amendment, so their politicians can do stupid gun bans that don't work......
> 
> *Toronto Police reported a shooting in Scarborough that happened just after 3 p.m., hours after Trudeau’s announcement. There would be another shooting in Scarborough that sent a man to hospital with non-life-threatening injuries just after 6 p.m.*
> 
> ...


Can't find it now, but I recently saved a meme in which the armed robbers stopped outside and said, "Wait, we better check the gun laws here first."


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## surada (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Canada doesn't have a 2nd amendment, so their politicians can do stupid gun bans that don't work......
> 
> *Toronto Police reported a shooting in Scarborough that happened just after 3 p.m., hours after Trudeau’s announcement. There would be another shooting in Scarborough that sent a man to hospital with non-life-threatening injuries just after 6 p.m.*
> *
> ...




Canada doesn't have as many gun crimes as the US.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

surada said:


> Canada doesn't have as many gun crimes as the US.


Yeah?
Why?


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## surada (Oct 25, 2022)

M14 Shooter said:


> Yeah?
> Why?



Maybe Canadian men don't need guns to feel manly.


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

surada said:


> Maybe Canadian men don't need guns to feel manly.


Best you can do?


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Many of those loaded guns kept in drawers have ended up shooting the owner's children in the face.



I didn't send mind to obedience school or anything? I wonder why it just sat there, completely inanimate?

Unless, you anti-liberty types are actually insane by trying to amorphize inanimate objects..


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## M14 Shooter (Oct 25, 2022)

Uncensored2008 said:


> I didn't send mind to obedience school or anything? I wonder why it just sat there, completely inanimate?
> Unless, you anti-liberty types are actually insane by trying to amorphize inanimate objects..


I can't tell you know long my carry gun has been loaded.
Zero discharges.
Huh.


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

M14 Shooter said:


> I can't tell you know long my carry gun has been loaded.
> Zero discharges.
> Huh.



Yes Donald H  says my revolver is going to jump up, and go shoot some random kid in the face. My kids are all grown, so I assume the old Taurus will steal a car when it goes out to shoot a kid in the face. I mean, it's a little snub nose and if it just hops along on it's handle, it could take it a LONG time to hunt down some kid.  I don't know how far a revolver can hop, but if it's the body length, it's only 6 inches. Could take it all day just to get to the front door.


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## sealybobo (Oct 25, 2022)

Uncensored2008 said:


> "because since Reagan, the middle class has become the working poor."
> 
> Ah the lies you Nazis tell.
> 
> ...


I think you are giving Reagan credit for things he doesn't deserve credit for









						Opinion | Roll Back the Reagan Tax Cuts
					






					www.commondreams.org
				




Reagan's bad policies hurt us in the future, not at the time.  For example, breaking unions, inventing nafta and cuts to social security.  

HE sucked bad.  And today he'd be a Democrat.  Look how much he grew government and spent.


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## Blues Man (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Tens of thousands of injured gun owners and their children being either killed or injured by loaded guns left in drawers, under pillows, in the hall, behind the toilet, under the bed, in yard, in the dog's kennel, in the pumpkin patch, in the car, behind their ears, etc.
> Ask NRA members if leaving loaded guns lying around is a good idea?
> I'm a Canadian so don't ask me. I've been conditioned to not give a fk.
> 
> ...


If you don't give a fuck why are you whining about the laws in a foreign country?


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## Concerned American (Oct 25, 2022)

Donald H said:


> Many of those loaded guns kept in drawers have ended up shooting the owner's children in the face.


Too bad your parents didn't leave one lying around when you were young, duck.


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## Concerned American (Oct 25, 2022)

M14 Shooter said:


> Yeah?
> Why?


Maybe because they have 1/10th of the population of the US.


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## 2aguy (Oct 25, 2022)

surada said:


> Canada doesn't have as many gun crimes as the US.




Because their people don't choose to commit as many gun crimes.


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## 2aguy (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> I think you are giving Reagan credit for things he doesn't deserve credit for
> 
> 
> 
> ...




No....they didn't....they led to the longest sustained economic growth in the modern period...everyone benefited, including minorities....and you can try to lie about it as much as you want, but the numbers speak for themselves...


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## Uncensored2008 (Oct 25, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> I think you are giving Reagan credit for things he doesn't deserve credit for



I think you're a leftist troll.




sealybobo said:


> Opinion | Roll Back the Reagan Tax Cuts
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Common Dreams is a radical leftist hate site.

Yes, they hate that the middle class got tax cuts. Of course the steaming pile you posted is utterly irrelevant after the 2018 tax revision.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Yeah, our criminals like to kill each other...their criminals not as much.



Wow... there's always an excuse.  It's not that our criminals can get guns easily, it's that they are somehow more murderous, even though most gun homicides are domestic violence. 



Uncensored2008 said:


> Population of Canada - 36 million.
> 
> Population of USA - 340 million.



Even if you account for the differences in population, we still have a gun murder rate 9 times what Canada has.


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## whitehall (Oct 25, 2022)

Can't carry a handgun and get attacked by a predator in rural Canada? Who ya' gonna call?


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## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Wow... there's always an excuse.  It's not that our criminals can get guns easily, it's that they are somehow more murderous, even though most gun homicides are domestic violence.
> 
> 
> 
> Even if you account for the differences in population, we still have a gun murder rate 9 times what Canada has.



Canadian criminals also have guns….they just don’t murder each other with them as often…….,,

Our criminals are more violent……the culture of crime in this country is more violent……that is changing in Canada as the increased gun murder there shows…


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## Cellblock2429 (Oct 26, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384


/——-/ Mostly democrat criminals shooting other democrat criminals. No loss, in fact it helps reduce the prison population.


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## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——-/ Mostly democrat criminals shooting other democrat criminals. No loss, in fact it helps reduce the prison population.




this is where joe will say that most murders are husbands killing their wives........he is such a hack.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Canadian criminals also have guns….they just don’t murder each other with them as often…….,,
> 
> Our criminals are more violent……the culture of crime in this country is more violent……that is changing in Canada as the increased gun murder there shows…



Again- 249 gun murders in Canada compared to 19,348 in the US.  



2aguy said:


> this is where joe will say that most murders are husbands killing their wives........he is such a hack.



And you will claim the husband was a hardened criminal because he had a juvenile record.


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## Cellblock2429 (Oct 26, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Again- 249 gun murders in Canada compared to 19,348 in the US.
> 
> 
> 
> And you will claim the husband was a hardened criminal because he had a juvenile record.


/-----/ I guess math is racist to you gun grabbers. 

The population of the US is about 9 times that of Canada. If you multiply 249 times 9, you get 2,241 in proportion. Still lower, yes, but, Canada does not have the inner city gang violence democRAT mayors seem to support. 

*Canada* *Population*: *37,943,231* (July 2021 est.) 334,998,398 (July 2021 est.) note: the US Census Bureau's 2020 census results show the *US population* as *331,449,281* as of 1 April 2020 






						number of gang related homicides at DuckDuckGo
					

DuckDuckGo. Privacy, Simplified.




					duckduckgo.com
				




For various reasons the total number of *gang related homicides appears to be about 11,500;* while *the total for the rest of us is about 3,000. *Essentially, then; the percentage of gang related homicides in the United States is about 74 percent –* and rising as the number of murders among the general population declines.*

BOTTOM LINE Pro rated. The rates are pretty much the same for both countries. Still more in the US, but not to the wild eyed exageration you claim.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> The population of the US is about 9 times that of Canada. If you multiply 249 times 9, you get 2,241 in proportion. Still lower, yes, but, Canada does not have the inner city gang violence democRAT mayors seem to support.



I already made this point, that even adjusting for population, Canada's murder rate is a lot lower than ours... 

Because they don't let every idiot who wants a gun have a gun, and if you don't want little Timmy shot at school, you'd better hope your school has a good plan.


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## Cellblock2429 (Oct 26, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> I already made this point, that even adjusting for population, Canada's murder rate is a lot lower than ours...
> 
> Because they don't let every idiot who wants a gun have a gun, and if you don't want little Timmy shot at school, you'd better hope your school has a good plan.


/----/ What part of gang-related homicides do you not understand?
For various reasons the total number of *gang-related homicides appears to be about 11,500;* while *the total for the rest of us is about 3,000. *Essentially, then; the percentage of gang-related homicides in the United States is about 74 percent –* and rising as the number of murders among the general population declines.*


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## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Again- 249 gun murders in Canada compared to 19,348 in the US.
> 
> 
> 
> And you will claim the husband was a hardened criminal because he had a juvenile record.




Yes.....as you were told, American criminals, in democrat party controlled cities, choose to murder each other at huge numbers in this country.

If you guys would stop voting for democrats, a lot of black lives would be saved, but that isn't what you care about.


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## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> /----/ What part of gang-related homicides do you not understand?
> For various reasons the total number of *gang-related homicides appears to be about 11,500;* while *the total for the rest of us is about 3,000. *Essentially, then; the percentage of gang-related homicides in the United States is about 74 percent –* and rising as the number of murders among the general population declines.*




And this is where he will cite a bogus stat that most murder is not gang related....but that is a fail because in crime reporting, 

Gangs and Violence​*Armstrong:* Let’s turn to questions of where crime is coming from in our country. How much violent crime takes place in the subset of the population we would typically associate with the gang culture?

*Kleck:* In places like Chicago or Los Angeles, it’s a huge fraction of it. It varies enormously from place to place. It may well be that half or more of the gun homicides in those cities are gang related. But in most places in America, it’s a somewhat more modest fraction.

We don’t have national figures that are of any use. For what it’s worth, in the FBI uniform crime reports data, they do have a category for the circumstance in which the crime was committed. 

*One possible box that local police can check in filling out the homicide reports for the FBI could indeed be for gang-related. But the problem is that the FBI forms require police to check just one circumstance. So if a guy belongs to a gang, and he was selling drugs, and he has a dispute with his customer over the price, and then they get into an argument and one shoots the other, that could go into any of three or four different categories, only one of which is gang-related.*


So those data are useless.


What we’re stuck with are local estimates, and, as I say, it varies enormously from one locality to another. It’s a huge percentage in a couple of cities. Chicago and Los Angeles have really bad street-gang problems. On the other hand, in Peoria it’s probably a relatively small fraction, certainly well under half.

Criminologist Gary Kleck on Guns, Crime, and Their Study - Ari Armstrong

Youtu


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## sealybobo (Oct 26, 2022)

2aguy said:


> No....they didn't....they led to the longest sustained economic growth in the modern period...everyone benefited, including minorities....and you can try to lie about it as much as you want, but the numbers speak for themselves...


1981-1990: The Fed fights the “Great Inflation”​The fed funds rate has never been as high as it was in the 1980s.

Most of the reason why is because the Fed wanted to combat inflation, which soared in 1980 to its highest level on record: 14.6 percent.

As a result, the U.S. central bank did something that might seem counterintuitive for an institution that strives to maintain the most productive economy possible: It manufactured a recession to bring prices back down.

The “effective” fed funds rate averaged at 9.97 percent during this 10-year period.

So we need to raise interest rates more.  Right?









						Fed's Interest Rate History: The Fed Funds Rate Since 1981 | Bankrate
					

The federal funds rate, a key borrowing benchmark set by the Federal Reserve, is now back to levels not seen since 2008.



					www.bankrate.com


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## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> 1981-1990: The Fed fights the “Great Inflation”​The fed funds rate has never been as high as it was in the 1980s.
> 
> Most of the reason why is because the Fed wanted to combat inflation, which soared in 1980 to its highest level on record: 14.6 percent.
> 
> ...




Yes.....after jimmy carter and his mess, Reagan fixed the country, you doofus.....

You moron....

*Real GDP per working-age adult, which had increased at only a 0.8 annual rate during the Carter administration, increased at a 1.8 percent rate during the Reagan administration. The increase in productivity growth was even higher: output per hour in the business sector, which had been roughly constant in the Carter years, increased at a 1.4 percent rate in the Reagan years. Productivityin the manufacturing sector increased at a 3.8 percent annual rate, a record for peacetime.

Most other economic conditions also improved. The unemployment rate declined from 7.0 percent in 1980 to 5.4 percent in 1988. 

The inflation rate declined from 10.4 percent in 1980 to 4.2 percent in 1988. 

The combination of conditions proved that there is no long-run trade-off between the unemployment rate and the inflation rate (see Phillips Curve). Other conditions were more mixed. The rate of new business formation increased sharply, but the rate of bank failures was the highest since the thirties. Real interest rates increased sharply, but inflation-adjusted prices of common stocks more than doubled.
------

At the end of the Reagan administration, the U.S. economy had experienced the longest peacetime expansion ever. The “stagflation” and “malaise” that plagued the U.S. economy from 1973 through 1980 were transformed by the Reagan economic program into a sustained period of higher growth and lower inflation.
----
 Moreover, these changes were achieved at a much lower cost than was previously expected. Despite the large decline in marginal tax rates, for example, the federal revenue share of GDP declined only slightly. Similarly, the large reduction in the inflation rate was achieved without any long-term effect on the unemployment rate.*









						Reaganomics - Econlib
					

Reagan’s 1981 Program for Economic Recovery had four major policy objectives: (1) reduce the growth of government spending, (2) reduce the marginal tax rates on income from both labor and capital, (3) reduce regulation, and (4) reduce inflation by controlling the growth of the money supply.



					www.econlib.org


----------



## Cellblock2429 (Oct 26, 2022)

2aguy said:


> And this is where he will cite a bogus stat that most murder is not gang related....but that is a fail because in crime reporting,
> 
> Gangs and Violence​*Armstrong:* Let’s turn to questions of where crime is coming from in our country. How much violent crime takes place in the subset of the population we would typically associate with the gang culture?
> 
> ...


/——-/ So everyone is lying about gang related murders. Even these guys who track it by neighborhood. Chicago Murder Map And Neighborhood Totals - 2022 Update


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——-/ So everyone is lying about gang related murders. Even these guys who track it by neighborhood. Chicago Murder Map And Neighborhood Totals - 2022 Update




No.....the ones lying are joe and his buddies......trying to hide the fact that gang crime makes up the majority of murder in democrat party controlled cities.....and if you look into it, you will see the close connection between Chicago gangs and the democrat party.

Hey Jack Ass is another great site for Chicago murder rates.....they collect all of the information.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 26, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——-/ So everyone is lying about gang related murders. Even these guys who track it by neighborhood. Chicago Murder Map And Neighborhood Totals - 2022 Update




According to joe, those are all husbands murdering their wives because dinner was late.


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 26, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Yes.....after jimmy carter and his mess, Reagan fixed the country, you doofus.....
> 
> You moron....
> 
> ...


How did he fix it?  First of all, Jimmy didn't break it and Reagan didn't fix it.  The Feds raised interest rates.  When they did that it caused a lot of pain for a lot of people for a long time.  And I'm sure you hope that pain puts Trump back in just like it helped Reagan.

Doesn't mean Trump or Republicans are going to do anything better.  In fact Biden just had a report of 2.9% gdp?  Before the Christmas bump?  Biden is doing amazing....considering.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> /----/ What part of gang-related homicides do you not understand?
> For various reasons the total number of *gang-related homicides appears to be about 11,500;* while *the total for the rest of us is about 3,000. *Essentially, then; the percentage of gang-related homicides in the United States is about 74 percent –* and rising as the number of murders among the general population declines.*





2aguy said:


> And this is where he will cite a bogus stat that most murder is not gang related....but that is a fail because in crime reporting,



According to the Federal government, only 1700 - 2400 homicides a year are considered "Gang Related".   And that's usually means, if someone had a brother in a gang, it was considered "Gang related".  









						National Youth Gang Survey Analysis: Measuring the Extent of Gang Problems
					

The NGC conducted an annual survey of law enforcement agencies to assess the extent of gang problems. This page shows data measuring the extent of gang problems.




					nationalgangcenter.ojp.gov
				




Most of the rest are domestic violence and acquaintance violence. 

The homicide rate shot up in 2020.  Why?  Because most of us spent 24-7 locked up with family members we can barely stand a few hours a day.  Of course, you had more homicides.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2022)

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——-/ So everyone is lying about gang related murders. Even these guys who track it by neighborhood. Chicago Murder Map And Neighborhood Totals - 2022 Update



Nope, the National Gang Center says that gang violence is only about 10% of all homicides.  



2aguy said:


> According to joe, those are all husbands murdering their wives because dinner was late.



Or wives shooting husbands because they were cheating
Or neighbors shooting each other because the dog was shitting on their lawn. 
Or idiots fighting over parking spaces after you dug your car out and put some chairs on the street. (A fine Chicago tradition)

Most gun violence is domestic... not gang related.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 27, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> According to the Federal government, only 1700 - 2400 homicides a year are considered "Gang Related".   And that's usually means, if someone had a brother in a gang, it was considered "Gang related".
> 
> 
> 
> ...




And I gave you the reason for that low number....

Gangs and Violence​*Armstrong:* Let’s turn to questions of where crime is coming from in our country. How much violent crime takes place in the subset of the population we would typically associate with the gang culture?


*Kleck:* In places like Chicago or Los Angeles, it’s a huge fraction of it. It varies enormously from place to place. It may well be that half or more of the gun homicides in those cities are gang related. But in most places in America, it’s a somewhat more modest fraction.


We don’t have national figures that are of any use. For what it’s worth, in the FBI uniform crime reports data, they do have a category for the circumstance in which the crime was committed. One possible box that local police can check in filling out the homicide reports for the FBI could indeed be for gang-related. 

*But the problem is that the FBI forms require police to check just one circumstance. So if a guy belongs to a gang, and he was selling drugs, and he has a dispute with his customer over the price, and then they get into an argument and one shoots the other, that could go into any of three or four different categories, only one of which is gang-related. So those data are useless.*


What we’re stuck with are local estimates, and, as I say, it varies enormously from one locality to another. It’s a huge percentage in a couple of cities. Chicago and Los Angeles have really bad street-gang problems. On the other hand, in Peoria it’s probably a relatively small fraction, certainly well under half.

Criminologist Gary Kleck on Guns, Crime, and Their Study - Ari Armstrong


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 27, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Nope, the National Gang Center says that gang violence is only about 10% of all homicides.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Yeah....organized drug gangs shoot fewer people than husbands and wives do...

You are such a fucking moron....


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 27, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> According to the Federal government, only 1700 - 2400 homicides a year are considered "Gang Related".   And that's usually means, if someone had a brother in a gang, it was considered "Gang related".
> 
> 
> 
> ...




The murder rate went up in 2020 because of the democrat party policies going back to 2015....

1) They began an all out war on the police, causing the police to stop pro-active police work, retire and quit in massive numbers.

2) They began "Decarceration," where democrat party judges, prosecutors and politicians began pushing no cash bail, and releasing the most dangerous and violent criminals over and over again....

And that was after the 7 months of blm and antifa brownshirts of the democrat party burned, looted, and murdered in black neighborhoods for 7 months.....and democrat party mayors telling their police to stand down.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2022)

Dick Tiny strikes again.



2aguy said:


> And I gave you the reason for that low number....



And I proved it was bullshit.  



2aguy said:


> Yeah....organized drug gangs shoot fewer people than husbands and wives do...
> 
> You are such a fucking moron....



Uh, yeah, simply because there are more of them... 

There are only 770,000 gang members in the US. 

There are millions of miserable husbands and wives...  It's why marriage should be avoided. 



2aguy said:


> The murder rate went up in 2020 because of the democrat party policies going back to 2015....
> 
> 1) They began an all out war on the police, causing the police to stop pro-active police work, retire and quit in massive numbers.



What all out war? We've actually INCREASED Police funding since 2015 








2aguy said:


> 2) They began "Decarceration," where democrat party judges, prosecutors and politicians began pushing no cash bail, and releasing the most dangerous and violent criminals over and over again....



Um.. okay.  So why are we holding people in jail who haven't been convicted of anything? The problem with Cash bail is that it's not punishing crime, it's punishing poverty.  The only reason why someone should be locked up before conviction is if they are an immediate danger.  If the judge is setting bail, then they don't see that person as a danger. 



2aguy said:


> And that was after the 7 months of blm and antifa brownshirts of the democrat party burned, looted, and murdered in black neighborhoods for 7 months.....and democrat party mayors telling their police to stand down.



Blah, blah, blah... there were only 50 homicides linked to BLM demonstrations, guy.  Most of those cops shooting demonstrators. 93% of the demonstrations were peaceful, and the times they weren't was when some right wing goons like Rittenhouse stirred up trouble.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 27, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Dick Tiny strikes again.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




You are an idiot....

*there were only 50 homicides linked to BLM demonstrations,


The democrat party brown shirts murdered 50 people.........you really are stupid....*


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2022)

2aguy said:


> You are an idiot....
> 
> *there were only 50 homicides linked to BLM demonstrations,
> 
> ...



Actually, I was being generous.   Most sources I've found put the death toll at 16-36.   And that includes demonstrators killed by police. 

MEANWHILE, the number of civilians killed by police - you know, the thing they were protesting - remained at over 1000 a year.  1143 in 2020,  1100 in 2021, 945 so far in 2022. 









						Mapping Police Violence
					

Official home of America's most comprehensive database of police violence. Get the facts about police brutality and how to address it.




					mappingpoliceviolence.us
				








__





						Violence and controversies during the George Floyd protests - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				












						93% of Black Lives Matter Protests Have Been Peaceful, New Report Finds
					

The Armed Conflict Location & Event Data Project analyzed more than 7,750 BLM demonstrations in all 50 states and D.C.




					time.com
				












						Fact check: More Black people died in 2019 police shootings than in George Floyd protests
					

Not all of the reported deaths happened at or during protests. Some occurred later and some happened apart from the protests.



					www.usatoday.com


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Actually, I was being generous.   Most sources I've found put the death toll at 16-36.   And that includes demonstrators killed by police.
> 
> MEANWHILE, the number of civilians killed by police - you know, the thing they were protesting - remained at over 1000 a year.  1143 in 2020,  1100 in 2021, 945 so far in 2022.
> 
> ...




Yes.....think about that....the brown shirts of the democrat party, blm and antifa urdered upwards of 50 people......during political violence to influence an election........you are an idiot.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Yes.....think about that....the brown shirts of the democrat party, blm and antifa urdered upwards of 50 people......during political violence to influence an election........you are an idiot.



The Trump thugs murdered 5 people during the 1-6 riots, and you didn't have a problem with that. 

If anything, the BLM riots probably helped Trump, as it scared white people into ignoring his failure on Covid and the Economy.  But they were probably inevitable as long as we kept ignoring the issue of police misconduct.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> The Trump thugs murdered 5 people during the 1-6 riots, and you didn't have a problem with that.
> 
> If anything, the BLM riots probably helped Trump, as it scared white people into ignoring his failure on Covid and the Economy.  But they were probably inevitable as long as we kept ignoring the issue of police misconduct.


''Trump thugs'' didn't murder anyone. 









						Cause of death released for 4 of 5 people at Capitol riot – but not Officer Brian Sicknick
					

The causes of death for four people who died at the Capitol riot have been released, but results are still pending for Capitol officer Brian Sicknick.



					www.usatoday.com
				





Dr. Francisco Diaz, the district's chief medical examiner, announced the causes of deaths as:

• Ashli Babbitt, 35, died by homicide from a gunshot to the left shoulder. She was shot by a Capitol police officer while trying to climb through a door near the House chamber.

• Kevin Greeson, 55, died of natural causes from cardiovascular disease. Greeson, of Athens, Alabama, had a Twitter account in which he supported former President Donald Trump and profanely denounced his opponents.

• Benjamin Phillips, 50, died of natural causes from cardiovascular disease. According to the Philadelphia Inquirer, Phillips of Ringtown, Pennsylvania, was a computer programmer who founded a social media website for Trump supporters. He had organized a trip of several dozen people to the district.

• Roseanne Boyland, 34, died by accident from acute amphetamine intoxication. Boyland, of Georgia, wanted to be a sobriety counselor and followed QAnon conspiracies, her family said.




I'm afraid this is just another instance of your lies and falsehoods. 

The most difficult aspect of dealing with leftists is this pathology that afflicts them. They have no sense of integrity that would cause them to deal honestly with others.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2022)

Hollie said:


> I'm afraid this is just another instance of your lies and falsehoods.
> 
> The most difficult aspect of dealing with leftists is this pathology that afflicts them. They have no sense of integrity that would cause them to deal honestly with others.



You left out the cop they killed. 

All those people would still be alive if Trump hadn't instigated a riot.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> You left out the cop they killed.
> 
> All those people would still be alive if Trump hadn't instigated a riot.


You left out the part about your dishonest, hysterical rant being completely clueless and devoid of fact. Just another of your dishonest diatribes. 

You left out the part about officer Sicknick dying of a stroke two days after the peaceful protest.

You left out the part about having no facts that Trump instigated any riot.

Literally everything in your posts in false, invented and / or just the hysterical ranting of a compulsive liar.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> The Trump thugs murdered 5 people during the 1-6 riots, and you didn't have a problem with that.
> 
> If anything, the BLM riots probably helped Trump, as it scared white people into ignoring his failure on Covid and the Economy.  But they were probably inevitable as long as we kept ignoring the issue of police misconduct.




Wow....you truly are a lazy fuck..........the only one killed on Jan. 6 was an unarmed, female Trump supporter, shot without warning by a cowardly democrat party goon in uniform.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> You left out the cop they killed.
> 
> All those people would still be alive if Trump hadn't instigated a riot.




No cop was killed by Trump supporters...you lying piece of crap.


----------



## Flash (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384


If we ship them all the Negroes that commit most of the gun crimes in the US the numbers would go up astronomically.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2022)

Hollie said:


> You left out the part about your dishonest, hysterical rant being completely clueless and devoid of fact. Just another of your dishonest diatribes.
> 
> You left out the part about officer Sicknick dying of a stroke two days after the peaceful protest.



Which he wouldn't have had he not been beaten silly by Nazis at that riot. 



Hollie said:


> You left out the part about having no facts that Trump instigated any riot.



Okay, you mean other than the volumes of evidence uncovered by the Jan 6 committee? 



2aguy said:


> Wow....you truly are a lazy fuck..........the only one killed on Jan. 6 was an unarmed, female Trump supporter, shot without warning by a cowardly democrat party goon in uniform.



Were her last words... "But, but, but I'm a white person?"   Because you guys have no problem with cops gunning down unarmed black people


----------



## Hollie (Oct 28, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Which he wouldn't have had he not been beaten silly by Nazis at that riot.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sicknick was not beaten silly by any rioters. You're a silly conspiracy theorist who spends way too much time pouring over supermarket tabloids. 


Okay, you mean the silly Jan. 6 circus? I'm sure you and the other three people who care about that farce are in a TDS stupor as you flail your Pom Poms for a complete waste of time.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Sicknick was not beaten silly by any rioters. You're a silly conspiracy theorist who spends way too much time pouring over supermarket tabloids.
> 
> 
> Okay, you mean the silly Jan. 6 circus? I'm sure you and the other three people who care about that farce are in a TDS stupor as you flail your Pom Poms for a complete waste of time.



So when BLM storms Congress in 2024 after Desantis squeaks by in the Electoral College, you are going to be cool with that, right?


----------



## Hollie (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> So when BLM storms Congress in 2024 after Desantis squeaks by in the Electoral College, you are going to be cool with that, right?


I find it not surprising at all that you posted lies and falsehoods throughout this thread yet you blithely proceed on because ethics and integrity mean nothing to leftist hacks,


----------



## OKTexas (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384




Their homicide rate would be higher than ours if that's the case, we have almost 10 times their population.

.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2022)

OKTexas said:


> Their homicide rate would be higher than ours if that's the case, we have almost 10 times their population.



Even if you counted proportinal population, they would only have 2490 gun homicides compared to our nearly 20,000.  

And here's the thing. Canada has actually pretty moderate gun laws.  You can own a gun if you are vetted, but it isn't considered a "right".


----------



## Hollie (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Even if you counted proportinal population, they would only have 2490 gun homicides compared to our nearly 20,000.
> 
> And here's the thing. Canada has actually pretty moderate gun laws.  You can own a gun if you are vetted, but it isn't considered a "right".


And here's the thing, the little Emperor decides you have no ''rights'' because that's what Totalitarian little Emperors do.










						Justin Trudeau announces Canada is banning assault-style weapons
					

"Canadians deserve more than thoughts and prayers,” Trudeau said.




					www.nbcnews.com
				














						Canada's Trudeau announces ban on handgun sales, transfers, saying 'fewer guns means safer communities'
					

Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's administration has frozen all handgun sales, purchases and transfers in the country in order to "protect Canadians."




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## OKTexas (Oct 29, 2022)

sealybobo said:


> I wonder if they'd consider my Ruger 450 Bushmaster an assault rifle?  They shouldn't.  It can only hold 4 bullets at a time.  It's meant for hunting.
> 
> I get guns meant for hunting it's the other guns.  The icky guns I don't like.  LOL.
> 
> Actually, I see why we need them.  Wolverines!!!




The icky ones, as you put it, are great for wild hogs. Also I'm assuming you have the bolt action model of the Bushmaster.

.


----------



## OKTexas (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Even if you counted proportinal population, they would only have 2490 gun homicides compared to our nearly 20,000.
> 
> And here's the thing. Canada has actually pretty moderate gun laws.  You can own a gun if you are vetted, but it isn't considered a "right".




You can own approved guns in Canada, where I can own any gun I can afford. Canadians are not free and are becoming less free all the time. Hopefully we can reverse that trend here, starting with this election.

.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2022)

Hollie said:


> And here's the thing, the little Emperor decides you have no ''rights'' because that's what Totalitarian little Emperors do.



Gun ownership isn't a right, it's a privilege. 

If Canadians are unhappy with Trudeau, they can vote him out.  



OKTexas said:


> You can own approved guns in Canada, where I can own any gun I can afford. Canadians are not free and are becoming less free all the time. Hopefully we can reverse that trend here, starting with this election.



Uh, guy, I don't feel "Free" is I have to walk through metal detectors and security doors, participate in active shooter drills, deal with trigger happy cops who might shoot me if I make a panicked move because he's terrified I might have a gun.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> So when BLM storms Congress in 2024 after Desantis squeaks by in the Electoral College, you are going to be cool with that, right?




We weren't cool with them when they burned, looted and murdered black Americans in democrat party controlled cities for 7 months to impact the electioni.......you were


----------



## OKTexas (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Gun ownership isn't a right, it's a privilege.
> 
> If Canadians are unhappy with Trudeau, they can vote him out.
> 
> ...




You must live in a real shit hole. I don't have to deal with any of that and I carry a gun everyday.

.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Gun ownership isn't a right, it's a privilege.
> 
> If Canadians are unhappy with Trudeau, they can vote him out.
> 
> ...


In Canada, run by Emperor Trudeau, gun ownership is not even a privilege. There will be no new owners of Firearms. 

Here in what you would define as the evil Great Satan, firearm ownership is a right. That may hurt your tender sensibilities but it seems everything hurts your tender sensibilities.


----------



## Flash (Oct 29, 2022)




----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2022)

2aguy said:


> We weren't cool with them when they burned, looted and murdered black Americans in democrat party controlled cities for 7 months to impact the electioni.......you were



Our side BEGGED you for 10 years to clean up the thug cops, but you refused to do so.  When you ignore the guy who politely takes the knee, don't get upset when you have a riot. 



Hollie said:


> In Canada, run by Emperor Trudeau, gun ownership is not even a privilege. There will be no new owners of Firearms.



Not really what he did, but never mind. 



Hollie said:


> Here in what you would define as the evil Great Satan, firearm ownership is a right. That may hurt your tender sensibilities but it seems everything hurts your tender sensibilities.



No, what hurts my sensibilities is watching kids being taken out of schools in body bags... Humanity, you should try is some time.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Our side BEGGED you for 10 years to clean up the thug cops, but you refused to do so.  When you ignore the guy who politely takes the knee, don't get upset when you have a riot.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh. You're humanities savior. I never got the email. 

It seems you're rather ambivalent toward the weekly shoot'em ups in so many leftist run cities. Your tender sensibilities aren't affected much by shootings unless those shootings can be used to further the leftisexual, ''we need more gun laws we won't enforce because that would offend the tender sensibilities of the criminals we enable''.


----------



## M14 Shooter (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Gun ownership isn't a right, it's a privilege.


^^^^
An outright lie.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Oh. You're humanities savior. I never got the email.
> 
> It seems you're rather ambivalent toward the weekly shoot'em ups in so many leftist run cities. Your tender sensibilities aren't affected much by shootings unless those shootings can be used to further the leftisexual, ''we need more gun laws we won't enforce because that would offend the tender sensibilities of the criminals we enable''.



Let's have some common sense gun laws, and start there.  

No, I don't think that Awake the Rapper or Joker Holmes should be arrested for buying a gun, they just shouldn't be allowed to buy a gun.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 29, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Let's have some common sense gun laws, and start there.
> 
> No, I don't think that Awake the Rapper or Joker Holmes should be arrested for buying a gun, they just shouldn't be allowed to buy a gun.


Everytime a leftist cuts and pastes the ''Let's have some common sense gun laws'' slogan, I know we're headed for leftists demanding there be no guns.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Let's have some common sense gun laws, and start there.
> 
> No, I don't think that Awake the Rapper or Joker Holmes should be arrested for buying a gun, they just shouldn't be allowed to buy a gun.



We already have all the common sense gun laws we need.  What we need is for the democrat party judges, prosecutors and politicians to stop releasing violent criminals, and to stop attacking and destroying our police.

It is already a crime to use a gun to commit a crime.  It is already against the law for a convicted criminal to buy, own or carry a gun.....so when we catch a criminal who has a gun, we can already arrest them.

See....we already have all the laws we need....so stop voting for the democrat party and our crime problem goes down 95%.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Let's have some common sense gun laws, and start there.
> 
> No, I don't think that Awake the Rapper or Joker Holmes should be arrested for buying a gun, they just shouldn't be allowed to buy a gun.




Mass public shootings in 2021.....

6

Total killed.....

43

Deer kill 200 people a year
Bathtubs kill 350 people a year
Ladders kill 300 people a year
Cars kill over 39,000 people a year.

The movie theater shooter and other mass public shooters are 6 people out of over 350 million people......they slip through the system because before the mass public shooting they have no criminal record which would prevent them from buying a gun.

The other thousands of shootings?   We have already arrested almost all of those killers, but you and your democrat party prosecutors, judges and politicians keep releasing them over and over again until they finally use their illegally acquired guns to murder someone......

You are the major problem, not the normal gun owners who buy, own and carry legal guns and never use them for crime........

Stop the democrats, and save lives.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

2aguy said:


> We already have all the common sense gun laws we need. What we need is for the democrat party judges, prosecutors and politicians to stop releasing violent criminals, and to stop attacking and destroying our police.



Except Awake the Rapper and Joker Holmes weren't violent criminals when they got guns, they did have histories that should have prohibited them from getting guns.  They live in communities (Aurora, CO and Highland Park, IL) where the police were well-funded and got everything they wanted.    Try to stay on the subject, Dick Tiny.   When you make guns that easy to get, of course the cops aren't going to be preventing crime.  They are going to be blowing away some poor fool who reaches for a cell phone because it might be a gun.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Mass public shootings in 2021.....
> 
> 6








						List of mass shootings in the United States in 2021 - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				




As of December 2021, 693 (of which 303 resulted in zero deaths) fit the Mass Shooting Tracker project criterion, leaving 703 people dead and 2,842 injured, for a total of 3,545 total victims, some including the shooter(s).


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Everytime a leftist cuts and pastes the ''Let's have some common sense gun laws'' slogan, I know we're headed for leftists demanding there be no guns.



I'm pragmatic enough to realize that isn't feasible. 

Let's start with SENSIBLE stuff.  Getting the guns out of the hands of people who shouldn't have them.  

Holding the gun industry accountable for putting those guns in the wrong hands. 

The first thing I would do is allow the victims of gun violence to sue gun sellers and gun makers for selling to people who shouldn't have guns.  That would get them to clean up their act pretty quickly.   

It's pretty much how we make every other industry in this country responsible.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> I'm pragmatic enough to realize that isn't feasible.
> 
> Let's start with SENSIBLE stuff.  Getting the guns out of the hands of people who shouldn't have them.
> 
> ...


Leftists are not pragmatic. Everything leftism cones into contact with becomes a disaster of mismanagement and incompetent decision-making. 

Leftist gun control 'solutions' are simply finding ways to take guns away from people. The gun industry does not put guns into the wrong hands. State and federal law regulate who owns a firearm.

There are laws on the books that make it illegal to sell firearms to people who, for a variety of reasons, are not allowed to own them. 

As usual, you just Parrott leftist screeds about ways leftists want to remove constitutional rights.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Leftists are not pragmatic. Everything leftism cones into contact with becomes a disaster of mismanagement and incompetent decision-making.
> 
> Leftist gun control 'solutions' are simply finding ways to take guns away from people. The gun industry does not put guns into the wrong hands. State and federal law regulate who owns a firearm.



That's kind of like saying drug dealers don't put drugs in the wrong hands, because government failed to stop them.  
It's an obscene argument.. you guys hobble the government at every turn in trying to control gun violence, the gun industry OPENLY sells to criminals, and you blame the government for not stopping them. 



Hollie said:


> There are laws on the books that make it illegal to sell firearms to people who, for a variety of reasons, are not allowed to own them.



And as pointed out, are never enforced.  



Hollie said:


> As usual, you just Parrott leftist screeds about ways leftists want to remove constitutional rights.



I'm all for well-regulated militias.. I was a member of one for years


----------



## Hollie (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> That's kind of like saying drug dealers don't put drugs in the wrong hands, because government failed to stop them.
> It's an obscene argument.. you guys hobble the government at every turn in trying to control gun violence, the gun industry OPENLY sells to criminals, and you blame the government for not stopping them.
> 
> 
> ...


That's kind of like saying your attempt at argument was a total fail so it's time to retreat to conspiracy theories.

Leftisexuals enact policies that enable criminals and then you deflect to childish excuses when those policies are shown to be total disasters.










						Crime Rampant In Democrat Cities With Beheadings, Shootings
					

While 2021 was the deadliest year the city has seen, Philadelphia is set to surpass last year's record this year.




					thefederalist.com
				





It's just a party.


----------



## Blues Man (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Let's have some common sense gun laws, and start there.
> 
> No, I don't think that Awake the Rapper or Joker Holmes should be arrested for buying a gun, they just shouldn't be allowed to buy a gun.


We have literally thousands of state and federal gun laws.

the problem is no one is enforcing them.

If you are against enforcing gun laws you don't give a single flying fuck about the victims of gun crimes.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

Hollie said:


> That's kind of like saying your attempt at argument was a total fail so it's time to retreat to conspiracy theories.
> 
> Leftisexuals enact policies that enable criminals and then you deflect to childish excuses when those policies are shown to be total disasters.



Uh, I was able to find cases of beheadings in Red rural counties, so I am not sure what your point is. 









						‘Worst thing they’ve ever seen’: Woman stabbed, beheaded for refusing to have sex, sheriff says
					

The suspect told deputies that he had “done something really bad” and that they could find “the evidence inside.”




					www.whio.com
				




According to WBMA, Justin Fields, 38, confessed to investigators that he stabbed and later dismembered the body of Tammy Bailey, 52, after she rejected him when he asked her for sex.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

Blues Man said:


> We have literally thousands of state and federal gun laws.
> 
> the problem is no one is enforcing them.
> 
> If you are against enforcing gun laws you don't give a single flying fuck about the victims of gun crimes.



I'm all for taking guns away from people who shouldn't have them. 

Anything more than that is just abusing the system. 

We don't have room to lock people up for that.   Our prisons are past capacity now.


----------



## Blues Man (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> I'm all for taking guns away from people who shouldn't have them.
> 
> Anything more than that is just abusing the system.
> 
> We don't have room to lock people up for that.   Our prisons are past capacity now.


No you're not.  You have said as much more than once

And once again for at least the 100th time I'll tell you that we lock up the wrong people.  You should be for be all for locking up the right people but you aren't


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Except Awake the Rapper and Joker Holmes weren't violent criminals when they got guns, they did have histories that should have prohibited them from getting guns.  They live in communities (Aurora, CO and Highland Park, IL) where the police were well-funded and got everything they wanted.    Try to stay on the subject, Dick Tiny.   When you make guns that easy to get, of course the cops aren't going to be preventing crime.  They are going to be blowing away some poor fool who reaches for a cell phone because it might be a gun.



600 million guns in private hands……

Over 21.5 million Americans can legally carry guns for self defense.

1.1 million times a year Americans use their legal guns to stop rapes, robberies, murders, beatings and stabbings.  1.5 million times a year according to the Department of Justice.

Over 350 million Americans in the U.S.

Mass public shootings in 2021?

6

Total killed….

43

deer kill 200 people a year
bathtubs 350 people a year
ladders 300 people a year…….

Your solution for 6 nuts is to take guns away from millions of Americans for fewer people killed by the governments failure to enforce current gun laws than are killed by deer…..

you really are dumb


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 30, 2022)

Blues Man said:


> No you're not.  You have said as much more than once
> 
> And once again for at least the 100th time I'll tell you that we lock up the wrong people.  You should be for be all for locking up the right people but you aren't



Yep….I don’t know what sort of mental illness the democrats have, but they just will not keep violent monsters locked up….


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

Blues Man said:


> No you're not. You have said as much more than once
> 
> And once again for at least the 100th time I'll tell you that we lock up the wrong people. You should be for be all for locking up the right people but you aren't



No, we lock up too many people.  

I'd rather lock up a guy who was selling drugs on the schoolyard than some guy who had a gun in his pocket for protection in a bad neighborhood.  

The idea of 'let's let all the pushers go so we can lock up any black kids we catch with guns" (because you know damned well they aren't going to lock up any white people for this.) 



2aguy said:


> Yep….I don’t know what sort of mental illness the democrats have, but they just will not keep violent monsters locked up….



You mean the one that says people are innocent until proven guilty. 
The problem with a "locking people up for gun possession" will be like every other petty crime we have on the books. Poor people and people of color will get locked up, affluent white people will get probation and a slap on the wrist.


----------



## Blues Man (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> No, we lock up too many people.
> 
> I'd rather lock up a guy who was selling drugs on the schoolyard than some guy who had a gun in his pocket for protection in a bad neighborhood.
> 
> ...


There you go you do not want to lock up people who break gun laws.  

And I don't care what color skin a criminal has but you obviously do.

So you should be working to reform the justice system instead of blaming legal gun owners for all the ills of society.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> No, we lock up too many people.
> 
> I'd rather lock up a guy who was selling drugs on the schoolyard than some guy who had a gun in his pocket for protection in a bad neighborhood.
> 
> ...



Why not declare that Trump is responsible for causing people to commit crimes, therefore, criminals are no longer responsible for their crimes.

You insist Trump was responsible for covid so go all in.


----------



## miketx (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Number of gun homicides in Canada- 249
> 
> Number of gun homicides in the US - 19384


Did they catch any of those guns?


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2022)

Blues Man said:


> There you go you do not want to lock up people who break gun laws.
> 
> And I don't care what color skin a criminal has but you obviously do.
> 
> So you should be working to reform the justice system instead of blaming legal gun owners for all the ills of society.



Because you are one of the major ills.  

Half of all gun murders are "Legal gun owners" shooting each other in domestic violence incidents.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Because you are one of the major ills.
> 
> Half of all gun murders are "Legal gun owners" shooting each other in domestic violence incidents.


Put your efforts toward an _assault ladder_, ban. 









						500,000 falls from ladders annually; 97 percent occur at home or on farms
					

According the American Academy of Orthopedic Surgeons, every year 500,000 people are treated for ladder-related injuries and approximately 300 of these incidents prove to be fatal. In 2007 alone, more than 400 people died as a result of falls on or from ladders or scaffolding. -Liberty Mutual -...




					www.ishn.com
				




According the American Academy of Orthopedic Surgeons, every year 500,000 people are treated for ladder-related injuries and approximately 300 of these incidents prove to be fatal. In 2007 alone, more than 400 people died as a result of falls on or from ladders or scaffolding. -Liberty Mutual - Research Institute for Safety


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 30, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Because you are one of the major ills.
> 
> Half of all gun murders are "Legal gun owners" shooting each other in domestic violence incidents.



Wrong you liar.  The vast majority of gun murder is criminals murdering other criminals or accidentally hitting friends and family of the criminals….. you liar


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 30, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Put your efforts toward an _assault ladder_, ban.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yep…:far more than any year of mass public shootimgs……which is hard to use when you are trying to scare people into giving you the power to ban guns


----------



## sealybobo (Oct 30, 2022)

OKTexas said:


> The icky ones, as you put it, are great for wild hogs. Also I'm assuming you have the bolt action model of the Bushmaster.
> 
> .


Yes


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 31, 2022)

Hollie said:


> According the American Academy of Orthopedic Surgeons, every year 500,000 people are treated for ladder-related injuries and approximately 300 of these incidents prove to be fatal. In 2007 alone, more than 400 people died as a result of falls on or from ladders or scaffolding. -Liberty Mutual - Research Institute for Safety



Hmmm...

300 fatalities due to ladders vs. 43,000 fatalities due to guns...    Hmmmm....  I think guns are the bigger problem.  

Not to mention the 450,000 gun crimes we have every year.  Now, if bad guys starts threatening people with ladders, I'll get back to you.  

Sweet Evil Jesus, I thought 2TinyGuy was bad with the "Whataboutisms"  



2aguy said:


> Yep…:far more than any year of mass public shootimgs……which is hard to use when you are trying to scare people into giving you the power to ban guns



Only if you try to define "mass shooting" down to a very narrow criteria... which means only when more than three white people die.  

Otherwise, we have 600+ mass shootings a year.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 31, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Wrong you liar. The vast majority of gun murder is criminals murdering other criminals or accidentally hitting friends and family of the criminals….. you liar



Nope, it's domestic violence...  people killing their friends, families, and coworkers because we let any idiot who wants a gun have one.


----------



## Blues Man (Oct 31, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Because you are one of the major ills.
> 
> Half of all gun murders are "Legal gun owners" shooting each other in domestic violence incidents.


All rapists have a dick so I guess we should just assume you are a rapist


----------



## Hollie (Oct 31, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Nope, it's domestic violence...  people killing their friends, families, and coworkers because we let any idiot who wants a gun have one.


These juvenile, emotional outbursts of yours would be embarrassing to most people.

Obviously, we don't let anyone who wants a gun have one. These kinds of behaviors you repeat time after time just reinforce a lot of negative stereotypes about your posting.


----------



## Hollie (Oct 31, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Hmmm...
> 
> 300 fatalities due to ladders vs. 43,000 fatalities due to guns...    Hmmmm....  I think guns are the bigger problem.
> 
> ...


Oh, dear. Your tender sensibilities are offended. Strange how you're quick to cut and paste the ''43,000 fatalities a year'', slogan but you don't address the dem / leftist policies that literally encourage and enable gun crime.


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 31, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Hmmm...
> 
> 300 fatalities due to ladders vs. 43,000 fatalities due to guns...    Hmmmm....  I think guns are the bigger problem.
> 
> ...




Nope....not 43,000 due to guns.



Americans use their legal guns 1.1 million times a year to save lives, from rape, robbery, murder, beatings, stabbings, mass public shootings and serve to keep the government from mass murdering Americans....unlike Europe where their governments murdered 15 million innocent men, women and children in just 6 years...more people than all of our gun murder combined for the entire 246 years of our history....


----------



## 2aguy (Oct 31, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Hmmm...
> 
> 300 fatalities due to ladders vs. 43,000 fatalities due to guns...    Hmmmm....  I think guns are the bigger problem.
> 
> ...



No, we didn't have 600 mass public shootings, yo lying asshat....

US mass shootings, 1982–2022: Data from Mother Jones’ investigation

Dating back to at least 2005, the FBI and leading criminologists essentially defined a mass shooting as a single attack in a public place in which four or more victims were killed. We adopted that baseline for fatalities when we gathered data in 2012 on three decades worth of cases. 
-------


Here is a description of the criteria we use:


The perpetrator took the lives of at least four people. A 2008 FBI report identifies an individual as a mass murderer—versus a spree killer or a serial killer—if he kills four or more people in a single incident (not including himself), typically in a single location. (*In 2013, the US government’s fatality baseline was revised down to three; our database reflects this change beginning from Jan. 2013, as detailed above.)
The killings were carried out by a lone shooter. (Except in the case of the Columbine massacre and the Westside Middle School killings, which involved two shooters.)
The shootings occurred in a public place. (Except in the case of a party on private property in Crandon, Wisconsin, and another in Seattle, where crowds of strangers had gathered, essentially constituting a public crowd.)* Crimes primarily related to gang activity or armed robbery are not included, nor are mass killings that took place in private homes (often stemming from domestic violence).*
Perpetrators who died or were wounded during the attack are not included in the victim tallies.
We included a handful of cases also known as “spree killings“—cases in which the killings occurred in more than one location, but still over a short period of time, that otherwise fit the above criteria.
----------------------
Our research focused on indiscriminate rampages in public places resulting in four or more victims killed by the attacker. We exclude shootings stemming from more conventionally motivated crimes such as armed robbery or gang violence. (Or in which the perpetrators have not been identified.) Other news outlets and researchers have since published larger tallies that include a wide range of gun crimes in which four or more people have been either wounded or killed. While those larger datasets of multiple-victim shootings are useful for studying the broader problem of gun violence, our investigation provides an in-depth look at a distinct phenomenon—from the firearms used and mental health factors to the growing copycat problem. Tracking mass shootings is complex; we believe ours is the most useful approach for studying this specific phenomenon.



---------
The actual number of mass shootings from Mother Jones......

Here you go...the number of mass public shootings according to Mother Jones...rabid, anti gun, left wing news source.....not the NRA...

The list below comes from the old definition of 4 killed to make a shooting a mass shooting...if you now go to the link there are more than listed below...but that is because Mother Jones changed the list from the time I first posted it...and changed to obama's new standard of only 3 dead to make a mass shooting...



US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

2021...6
2020....2

2019....10

2018... 12

2017:  11 ( 5 according to the old standard)

2016....6

2015....4 ( obama's new standard....7)

2014....2 (4)

2013....5

2012....7

2011....3

2010....1

2009....4

2008....3

2007....4

2006....3

2005...2

2004....1

2003...1

2002 not listed so more than likely 0

2001....1

2000....1

1999....5

1998...3

1997....2

1996....1

1995...1

1994...1

1993...4

1992...2

1991...3

1990...1

1989...2

1988....1

1987...1

1986...1

1985... not listed so probably 0

1984...2

1983...not listed so probably 0

1982...1
US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 1, 2022)

Hollie said:


> These juvenile, emotional outbursts of yours would be embarrassing to most people.
> 
> Obviously, we don't let anyone who wants a gun have one. These kinds of behaviors you repeat time after time just reinforce a lot of negative stereotypes about your posting.



Then how do all these mass shooters and crooks keep getting guns.   Getting guns is too easy.  It should be hard.  At least as hard as getting a mortgage. 



Hollie said:


> Oh, dear. Your tender sensibilities are offended. Strange how you're quick to cut and paste the ''43,000 fatalities a year'', slogan but you don't address the dem / leftist policies that literally encourage and enable gun crime.



because we have just as much crime in the Red areas.   The top ten states for murder, six of them are red states.  



2aguy said:


> Americans use their legal guns 1.1 million times a year to save lives,


Nope.  No evidence to support that.   When you can NAME 1.1 million people who did that, get back to me.   Otherwise, I'll go with the FBI's numbers of about 30K.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 1, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Then how do all these mass shooters and crooks keep getting guns.   Getting guns is too easy.  It should be hard.  At least as hard as getting a mortgage.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



2021

MassPublic shootings….

6

2020?

2

Over 350 million people in the U.S……..8 mass public shooters in 2 years………..

You have no case for the gun banning that you dream about.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 1, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Then how do all these mass shooters and crooks keep getting guns.   Getting guns is too easy.  It should be hard.  At least as hard as getting a mortgage.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yes…the lie….

you say “state,” knowing it is the blue, democrat party cities in those red states that create the violent crime.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 1, 2022)

2aguy said:


> 2021
> 
> MassPublic shootings….



Well over 600 a year.  I'm not sure why you think by limiting it to "Mass Public Shootings" you can define it down enough to not count anything... 

But we have 600 incidents a year where more than one person is shot or killed.  



2aguy said:


> Yes…the lie….
> 
> you say “state,” knowing it is the blue, democrat party cities in those red states that create the violent crime.



Most of those red states don't really have big blue cities... but they still have high murder rates.


----------



## Hollie (Nov 1, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Then how do all these mass shooters and crooks keep getting guns.   Getting guns is too easy.  It should be hard.  At least as hard as getting a mortgage.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Crooks keep getting guns because in so many leftist run cities, there's little risk of arrest and conviction for their crimes.

Top crime cities have a common theme as to political leadership. Can you determine what that theme is?









						15 Cities with Highest Crime Rate in the US [Report 2022]
					

So, today, I'm going to talk about the top cities with highest crime rate, which will help you take careful measures for yourself and your loved ones.




					usabynumbers.com


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 1, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Crooks keep getting guns because in so many leftist run cities, there's little risk of arrest and conviction for their crimes.
> 
> Top crime cities have a common theme as to political leadership. Can you determine what that theme is?



They aren't populated by inbreds?


----------



## Hollie (Nov 1, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> They aren't populated by inbreds?


With the leftist clowns and misfits running dem controlled cities, the leadership certainly is.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 1, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Well over 600 a year.  I'm not sure why you think by limiting it to "Mass Public Shootings" you can define it down enough to not count anything...
> 
> But we have 600 incidents a year where more than one person is shot or killed.
> 
> ...




Nope.....you can't lie about that...Mother Jones tracks all of them, and uses the actual definition of mass public shootings by the FBI...you lying asshat.

6 mass public shootings in 2021, 2 in 2020......

Red states have lots of blue cities.......


From poster, Toobfreak.

 I chose 58 cities as that was the largest number I could fit on a page. I then went through each city one by one to look up the major of every city. Aside from the fact that you can forget finding any pattern of cities in "red" states being the most with the highest crime as the idiot Marc tries to claim, but I went down the list marking all the mayors of the highest crimes cities in America in *BRIGHT RED* who were DEMOCRATS.


Look at what I found:








*Every city above in red is RUN BY A DEMOCRAT!* 

Murder map: Deadliest U.S. cities


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 1, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Nope.....you can't lie about that...Mother Jones



That's one source with a very narrow definition. 

My definition is, any incident where more than one person is wounded or killed. 

600+ a year.  Every year.  

So often they don't even make the news unless you get a big bodycount, and you show up here like they just lit the Bat Signal splattering the page with spam.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 1, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> That's one source with a very narrow definition.
> 
> My definition is, any incident where more than one person is wounded or killed.
> 
> ...




No...not a "narrow" definition, the actual definition.....you want to lie about mass public shootings because their low number each year doesn't give you the emotional black mail against uninformed people.....


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2022)

2aguy said:


> No...not a "narrow" definition, the actual definition.....you want to lie about mass public shootings because their low number each year doesn't give you the emotional black mail against uninformed people.....



Not at all. 

Mass shooting - more than one person shot.
Single shooting - just one person shot. 

See. Simple definition.  

We have 600 Mass shootings a year. 
We have 85,000 single shootings a year (combined injuries and murders). 

See. That was simple.  

Now, because of the dystopia created by you ammosexuals, we don't even notice the single shootings anymore, and the mass shootings only register if a lot of people get killed.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> That's one source with a very narrow definition.
> 
> My definition is, any incident where more than one person is wounded or killed.
> 
> ...


Making shit up again


----------



## Hollie (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Not at all.
> 
> Mass shooting - more than one person shot.
> Single shooting - just one person shot.
> ...


You find it difficult to understand but the orders of magnitude increase in crime rates can be directly attributed to leftisexual policies that enable criminals.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2022)

Hollie said:


> You find it difficult to understand but the orders of magnitude increase in crime rates can be directly attributed to leftisexual policies that enable criminals.



Then why does crime spike when Republicans are in charge?  We hit a high under Bush the elder of 758.  It spiked again under Bush -43, and spiked again when Trump took office.  Could it be that when Republicans are in charge, that's also when we get recessions?


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Not at all.
> 
> Mass shooting - more than one person shot.
> Single shooting - just one person shot.
> ...




Nope......wrong again....

US mass shootings, 1982–2022: Data from Mother Jones’ investigation

Dating back to at least 2005, the FBI and leading criminologists essentially defined a mass shooting as a single attack in a public place in which four or more victims were killed. We adopted that baseline for fatalities when we gathered data in 2012 on three decades worth of cases. 
-------


Here is a description of the criteria we use:


The perpetrator took the lives of at least four people. A 2008 FBI report identifies an individual as a mass murderer—versus a spree killer or a serial killer—if he kills four or more people in a single incident (not including himself), typically in a single location. (*In 2013, the US government’s fatality baseline was revised down to three; our database reflects this change beginning from Jan. 2013, as detailed above.)
The killings were carried out by a lone shooter. (Except in the case of the Columbine massacre and the Westside Middle School killings, which involved two shooters.)
The shootings occurred in a public place. (Except in the case of a party on private property in Crandon, Wisconsin, and another in Seattle, where crowds of strangers had gathered, essentially constituting a public crowd.)
* Crimes primarily related to gang activity or armed robbery are not included, nor are mass killings that took place in private homes (often stemming from domestic violence).*



Perpetrators who died or were wounded during the attack are not included in the victim tallies.
We included a handful of cases also known as “spree killings“—cases in which the killings occurred in more than one location, but still over a short period of time, that otherwise fit the above criteria.
----------------------
Our research focused on indiscriminate rampages in public places resulting in four or more victims killed by the attacker. 

*We exclude shootings stemming from more conventionally motivated crimes such as armed robbery or gang violence. (Or in which the perpetrators have not been identified.) *


Other news outlets and researchers have since published larger tallies that include a wide range of gun crimes in which four or more people have been either wounded or killed. While those larger datasets of multiple-victim shootings are useful for studying the broader problem of gun violence, our investigation provides an in-depth look at a distinct phenomenon—from the firearms used and mental health factors to the growing copycat problem. Tracking mass shootings is complex; we believe ours is the most useful approach for studying this specific phenomenon.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Nope......wrong again....



Yawn, defining mass shootings down to high numbers.  

we have 600 mass shootings every year.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Yawn, defining mass shootings down to high numbers.
> 
> we have 600 mass shootings every year.


YEah according to your own made up definition


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Yawn, defining mass shootings down to high numbers.
> 
> we have 600 mass shootings every year.




Mother Jones, a left wing, anti-gun organization uses the actual definition.....you lie about shootings in order to manipulate uninformed people......


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Mother Jones, a left wing, anti-gun organization uses the actual definition...



No, they use a definition you like 

Instead of a common sense one of any incident that causes more than one death or injury.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> No, they use a definition you like
> 
> Instead of a common sense one of any incident that causes more than one death or injury.




No....they use the FBI definition....you idiot.

A lone nut walking into a public space to commit murder is a different crime with different solutions from gang members shooting at each other over drugs, girlfriends and social media insults......you doofus.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2022)

2aguy said:


> No....they use the FBI definition....you idiot.



The FBI that has a vested interest in defining crime down and under-reporting it? 



2aguy said:


> A lone nut walking into a public space to commit murder is a different crime with different solutions from gang members shooting at each other over drugs, girlfriends and social media insults......you doofus.



Right... the later scenario doesn't involve white people..   and we know it only counts when white people die.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> The FBI that has a vested interest in defining crime down and under-reporting it?
> 
> 
> 
> Right... the later scenario doesn't involve white people..   and we know it only counts when white people die.




* and we know it only counts when white people die.

You just stated the policy of the democrat party in the cities they control....*


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2022)

2aguy said:


> and we know it only counts when white people die.
> 
> You just stated the policy of the democrat party in the cities they control....



It's not democrats who flooded the streets of those cities with guns... that would be you guys.


----------



## Hollie (Nov 2, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Then why does crime spike when Republicans are in charge?  We hit a high under Bush the elder of 758.  It spiked again under Bush -43, and spiked again when Trump took office.  Could it be that when Republicans are in charge, that's also when we get recessions?
> 
> View attachment 719761



Why does crime spike under lawless leftist policies of defund the police, release career criminals from jail and turn your misfit heroes onto the public?


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 3, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Why does crime spike under lawless leftist policies of defund the police, release career criminals from jail and turn your misfit heroes onto the public?



No one defunded the police.  In fact, Chicago increased police spending.  

Crime spiked in 2020 because thanks to Trump Plague, you had a lot of people locked in their homes with people they could barely stand to live with when they were working most of the time.  Most murders are domestic violence, not gang crime.


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## Hollie (Nov 3, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> No one defunded the police.  In fact, Chicago increased police spending.
> 
> Crime spiked in 2020 because thanks to Trump Plague, you had a lot of people locked in their homes with people they could barely stand to live with when they were working most of the time.  Most murders are domestic violence, not gang crime.


This is a syndrome that afflicts the leftist mind. "No one defended the police" and the expected. "I blame Trump".


Here are just two examples which contradict your loopy conspiracy theories. The most difficult aspect in doing with goofy leftists is their inability to reconcile a really based worldview.









						The Seattle Times | Local news, sports, business, politics, entertainment, travel, restaurants and opinion for Seattle and the Pacific Northwest.
					

Local news, sports, business, politics, entertainment, travel, restaurants and opinion for Seattle and the Pacific Northwest.




					www.seattletimes.com
				




Whether you think defund the police has some merit to it, or not, it’s becoming clear that no entity in the country has bungled the idea more than the city of Seattle.










						Mayor who pushed to defund police by $80M pleads with feds to help with rampant crime
					

Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot pleaded to the federal government for additional law enforcement resources on Monday to crack down on rampant crime, despite supporting measures to defund her city's police just last year. A rampant crime crisis in major U. S. cities is causing progressive mayors who...




					www.google.com
				




Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot pleaded to the federal government for additional law enforcement resources on Monday to crack down on rampant crime, despite supporting measures to defund her city's police just last year.




I'm afraid it's childish and disingenuous for leftists to continually screech out their "I blame Trump" mantra as they retreat into a safe-space but not taking responsibility for the results of your actions is pretty typical for the leftist addled.


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## sealybobo (Nov 3, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> No one defunded the police.  In fact, Chicago increased police spending.
> 
> Crime spiked in 2020 because thanks to Trump Plague, you had a lot of people locked in their homes with people they could barely stand to live with when they were working most of the time.  Most murders are domestic violence, not gang crime.


I went to high school with a girl who moved to Texas and from what we could see and what we knew, seemed she had a wonderful life and family.  The front door video camera caught it on tape.  Her son beat her to death.  I search to see what ended up happening but it's impossible to find anything.  But our entire class knows about it.  

I said back then it's because these families are all cooped up in the house together.  Mom's being a bitch.  Dad's being a dick.  Yelling all the time.  

A lot of divorce happened during covid too.

But also a lot of people got pregnant during covid too.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 4, 2022)

Hollie said:


> This is a syndrome that afflicts the leftist mind. "No one defended the police" and the expected. "I blame Trump".
> 
> 
> Here are just two examples which contradict your loopy conspiracy theories. The most difficult aspect in doing with goofy leftists is their inability to reconcile a really based worldview.



Except nationally, police spending increased...   

Defunded means exactly that, you stop funding police.   We didn't do that.  We increased funding to the police while social services (which do far more to prevent crime) are being slashed.  



Hollie said:


> Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot pleaded to the federal government for additional law enforcement resources on Monday to crack down on rampant crime, despite supporting measures to defund her city's police just last year.



Except Lightfoot increased funding to the police.  She did this despite massively decreased revenues due to TRUMP PLAGUE.  





__





						City of Chicago Public Safety Spending | The Civic Federation
					

The Chicago City Council approved the City’s annual budget for FY2022 (which aligns with the 2022 calendar year) on October 27. The Civic Federation supported the City’s FY2022 budget totaling $10.6 billion in an analysis of the budget proposal released earlier this fall.




					www.civicfed.org


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## Hollie (Nov 5, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Except nationally, police spending increased...
> 
> Defunded means exactly that, you stop funding police.   We didn't do that.  We increased funding to the police while social services (which do far more to prevent crime) are being slashed.
> 
> ...



Except you realize your silly, ''no one defunded the police'', lie was just the typical leftist tactic of changing definitions to suit their agenda.









						Democratic Mayors Defunded Their Police, While Spending Millions On Their Own Police Protection
					

Critics ask, "Why does protection for the people matter less?"




					www.forbes.com
				




In 25 major U.S. cities across the country, officials have already cut – or have proposed cutting — funds from police budgets.

However, in as many as 20 of those same cities, mayors and other city officials enjoy the personal protection of a dedicated police security detail. In many cities, this security costs taxpayers millions of dollars per year.

We found that the defunding of police – coupled with taxpayer dollars spent on police security details protecting public officials– only occurred in cities run by Democratic mayors




Except you realized your, 'I Blame Trump', nonsense is just another leftist excuse for your own incomptence and failure.

Except you understand none of the above.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 5, 2022)

Hollie said:


> In 25 major U.S. cities across the country, officials have already cut – or have proposed cutting — funds from police budgets.



Okay, let's look at that.  Some "proposed" it, but it didn't happen.   Most of them that did were forced to cut back on ALL city services, not just police, because thanks to Covid, they had taken a sharp hit to revenues.


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## Hollie (Nov 5, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Okay, let's look at that.  Some "proposed" it, but it didn't happen.   Most of them that did were forced to cut back on ALL city services, not just police, because thanks to Covid, they had taken a sharp hit to revenues.



Okay, yes, lets look at that. Many democrat Hellholes ''proposed'' and then followed through on their plans to defund police and law enforcement.










						Democratic mayors who called to defund the police spent millions on own security details
					

Democratic mayors in nearly two dozen major cities across the United States who have publicly called for defunding the police have received personal protection from a police detail at taxpayers' expense.




					news.yahoo.com
				




DC LEADERS STRUGGLE WITH RISING CRIME AFTER CUTTING POLICE

Calls to defund the police coupled with taxpayer dollars spent to protect public officials only occurred in cities run by Democratic mayors, according to the report.

Baltimore, for example, slashed $22 million from its police budget in 2020 but didn't have a problem spending $3.6 million for 14 officers to protect Mayor Brandon Scott, State's Attorney Marilyn Mosby, and Police Commissioner Michael Harrison.


Maryland's largest city saw widespread protests against police in 2015 following the death of Freddie Gray and again in 2020 over the death of George Floyd. Gray, a 25-year-old black man, was arrested in April 2015 for possession of a "switchblade," thrown into the back of a Baltimore Police Department van, and found unconscious 45 minutes later with his spinal cord nearly severed. He spent seven days in a coma.


The city of Chicago spent $17.3 million between 2015 and 2020 to guard "unnamed city officials," according to information gathered through a Freedom of Information Act request.

Even though Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot said she was against defunding the police, records show that 400 police officer positions were cut last year while the cost of the security detail hit an all-time high of $3.4 million for 22 officers. The city spent $2.8 million for 17 officers in 2019; $2.8 million for 16 officers in 2018; $2.7 million for 20 police officers in 2017; and $2.9 million for 16 officers in 2016.


In San Francisco, officials made headlines for promising to divest $120 million from police over two years and move the money into health programs. However, the city spent $12.4 million between 2015 and 2020 to protect Democratic Mayor London Breed.


San Diego city council members this year budgeted $2.6 million for 12 full-time officials to protect Mayor Todd Gloria, as well as city council members during meetings and for security at the city administration building. However, Gloria's budget proposed a $4.3 million cut from the police overtime budget while spending $1 million to set up the Commission on Police Practices, a new oversight body to review and evaluate complaints brought by the public against police officers.


As crime spiked in New York, the city slashed $1 billion from its $6 billion police budget in 2021, reallocating $354 million to help curb homelessness and promote educational services. However, Mayor Bill de Blasio, his wife, and his son have had no problems traveling the country with an NYPD security detail


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## JoeB131 (Nov 5, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Okay, yes, lets look at that. Many democrat Hellholes ''proposed'' and then followed through on their plans to defund police and law enforcement.



What you leave out is that those funds were restored in 2022 when revenues returned. 

Of course, security details for officials is a red herring.   The real problem with police spending is that it isn't done efficiently.  

Remember when Republicans used to be fiscally responsible and didn't want to throw money at every problem?


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## Hollie (Nov 5, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> What you leave out is that those funds were restored in 2022 when revenues returned.
> 
> Of course, security details for officials is a red herring.   The real problem with police spending is that it isn't done efficiently.
> 
> Remember when Republicans used to be fiscally responsible and didn't want to throw money at every problem?



Why did funds have to be restored?

You claimed earlier that , ''no one defunded the police''. If no defunding had taken place, there would be no requirement for restoration of funds. 

Your major malfunction is that you can't recall the nonsense you post in various threads so you tend to come across as a total buffoon when you completely contradict yourself.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 5, 2022)

Hollie said:


> Why did funds have to be restored?
> 
> You claimed earlier that , ''no one defunded the police''. If no defunding had taken place, there would be no requirement for restoration of funds.



Did I need to use smaller words?  Spending was cut because REVENUES declined.  You can't spend money you don't have.  You make it out to be "They disbanded the police force" instead of "Sorry, guys, you can't buy a new tank this year!"


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## Hollie (Nov 5, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Did I need to use smaller words?  Spending was cut because REVENUES declined.  You can't spend money you don't have.  You make it out to be "They disbanded the police force" instead of "Sorry, guys, you can't buy a new tank this year!"


Do you need to use single syllable words to compose coherent sentences? Why, yes, of course.









						Here's a List of the Many Times Democrats Supported Defunding Police
					

The Biden Administration has been attempting to shift crime wave blame onto Republicans by accusing them of "defunding the police."




					www.breitbart.com


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## 2aguy (Nov 5, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> Okay, let's look at that.  Some "proposed" it, but it didn't happen.   Most of them that did were forced to cut back on ALL city services, not just police, because thanks to Covid, they had taken a sharp hit to revenues.



Yes….they attacked the police openly and proudly …and the p9lice responded by refusing to engage criminals, they also quit or retired in massive numbers……….because of you and the democrats.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 5, 2022)

2aguy said:


> Yes….they attacked the police openly and proudly …and the p9lice responded by refusing to engage criminals, they also quit or retired in massive numbers……….because of you and the democrats.



You talk about racist cops quitting like that's a bad thing. 

If someone quits being a cop because they can't abuse and murder black people anymore, it's a win-win for everyone. 

I just imagine that if Jason Van Dyke or Derek Chauvin quit years ago because they were no longer feeling the love, how that would have worked out so much better for everyone.


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## 2aguy (Nov 5, 2022)

JoeB131 said:


> You talk about racist cops quitting like that's a bad thing.
> 
> If someone quits being a cop because they can't abuse and murder black people anymore, it's a win-win for everyone.
> 
> I just imagine that if Jason Van Dyke or Derek Chauvin quit years ago because they were no longer feeling the love, how that would have worked out so much better for everyone.




They weren't racists you asshole......

But we will see what morons like you have created on Tuesday.....see you at the polls.....


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## JoeB131 (Nov 5, 2022)

2aguy said:


> They weren't racists you asshole......
> 
> But we will see what morons like you have created on Tuesday.....see you at the polls.....



You are going to be so disappointed when you find out how little that means...

Like you guys just forgot about 1994 and 2010.


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