# Australia is killing millions of feral cats with poisoned sausages



## The Purge

The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019 

Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported

------------

We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........ 

1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.

2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.

3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.

I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!


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## gtopa1

The Purge said:


> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!



Shot dozens out of a tree once; the tree was once home to hundreds of native birds. 1080 is good stuff. Usually kills them pretty fast. Good job!!

CSIRO PUBLISHING | Wildlife Research

Main symptoms are disorientation and lethargy.

Yes; some birds may eat them but the risk isn't high.


> Based on this finding and others, in 2008, the Australian Pesticides and Veterinary Medicines Authority Final Review Report and Regulatory Decision of Sodium Fluoroacetate concluded that although individual poisoning of non-target animals can occur, this does not adversely affect the overall population of the non-target wildlife – while still highly regulated, they allowed 1080 to continue to be used as a management tool for invasive species (and predator) control.



The science behind the claim - 1080 is no threat to native wildlife populations - PestSmart Connect


Greg


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## Likkmee

Can they rainbow tint them ans send them to San Fran ?


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## Moonglow

The Purge said:


> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!


I bet the Asians are bummed out.


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## Kittymom1026

The Purge said:


> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!


That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.


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## Vastator

Kittymom1026 said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
Click to expand...

Release where?


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## The Purge

Vastator said:


> Kittymom1026 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Release where?
Click to expand...

Why, one of a dozen or so cat islands


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## gtopa1

Kittymom1026 said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
Click to expand...


Release where? 

Greg


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## gtopa1

Kittymom1026 said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
Click to expand...

The cats go drowsy and then die. No suffering unless I hit them with a shovel though it does make it quicker. 

Greg


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## beautress

Poor little kitties.


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## The Purge

gtopa1 said:


> Kittymom1026 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The cats go drowsy and then die. No suffering unless I hit them with a shovel though it does make it quicker.
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...

Come on Greg....a little pussy never hurt anyone!


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## beautress

Maybe they were eating all the platypus ducks' eggs or something. Or carrying diseases that were stressing extinction-brink animals. A common complaint of farmers in America is that people will drive 60 miles from the nearest metropolis to drop off unwanted litters of their household cats and even dogs. Often these small ones are not inoculated from disease and can suffer heinous deaths without regular shots to prevent animal diseases. They can also spread these diseases among the wild animals and decimate a breed of animals already on the extinct watch list. Someone dumped the animals out back where no one could see. Some likely adapted and produced another generation or more.


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## HereWeGoAgain

Meh......
I killed dozens of the little bastards when we bought our weekend place.
   The lovely lady who lived there when we bought the place left em there to fend for themselves. 
   Let two of em live to control snakes and rats in the out buildings.


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## toobfreak

The Purge said:


> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!




I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.


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## HereWeGoAgain

toobfreak said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
Click to expand...


   I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
  They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
Had I been close to an SPCA of some sort I would have trapped them and dropped em off.
    As it was it was a hundred mile round trip to the nearest shelter/SPCA.
  Just not going to take a few dozen 100 mile trips just to be nice.


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## toobfreak

HereWeGoAgain said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
Click to expand...


They were surviving.

Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.


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## HereWeGoAgain

toobfreak said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
Click to expand...


    Stray dogs dont do well in the wild,they aren't the natural hunters that cats are.
   I got ringworm from all the strays on my property,and that was after I eliminated 3/4s of them. The cat lady dumped her inside cats litter box off the side of the porch and I got infected removing the mess.
    Once I thinned out the feral cats rabbits,road runners,turkey,tarantulas,horntoads,fox kits and all manner of wildlife returned.

   I'd kill em again if it was necessary.


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## toobfreak

HereWeGoAgain said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stray dogs dont do well in the wild,they aren't the natural hunters that cats are.
Click to expand...

That's for sure.


> I got ringworm from all the strays on my property,and that was after I eliminated 3/4s of them. The cat lady dumped her inside cats litter box off the side of the porch and I got infected removing the mess.


Sounds like a big part of the problem was really that lady, artificially inflating the neighborhood population and improperly disposing of waste.  I hate people who get this unhealthy relationship with animals and take it to some crazy level.  There is something wrong with those people.  I've never had more than two pets at a time.  That ringworm issue never would have happened had she been giving proper care to her animals.


> Once I thinned out the feral cats rabbits,road runners,turkey,tarantulas,horntoads,fox kits and all manner of wildlife returned.


I bet.  Like I said, its not that cats are bad, they are just trying to survive in a situation mostly created by bad people.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

toobfreak said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stray dogs dont do well in the wild,they aren't the natural hunters that cats are.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's for sure.
> 
> 
> 
> I got ringworm from all the strays on my property,and that was after I eliminated 3/4s of them. The cat lady dumped her inside cats litter box off the side of the porch and I got infected removing the mess.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Sounds like a big part of the problem was really that lady, artificially inflating the neighborhood population and improperly disposing of waste.  I hate people who get this unhealthy relationship with animals and take it to some crazy level.  There is something wrong with those people.  I've never had more than two pets at a time.  That ringworm issue never would have happened had she been giving proper care to her animals.
> 
> 
> 
> Once I thinned out the feral cats rabbits,road runners,turkey,tarantulas,horntoads,fox kits and all manner of wildlife returned.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I bet.  Like I said, its not that cats are bad, they are just trying to survive in a situation mostly created by bad people.
Click to expand...


  This wasn't in anything like a neighborhood.
We're talking about the major boonies a hundred miles from the mexican border in west Texas.
 The whole county consisted of 8k people.

    You did what you had to do.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

gtopa1 said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Shot dozens out of a tree once; the tree was once home to hundreds of native birds. 1080 is good stuff. Usually kills them pretty fast. Good job!!
> 
> CSIRO PUBLISHING | Wildlife Research
> 
> Main symptoms are disorientation and lethargy.
> 
> Yes; some birds may eat them but the risk isn't high.
> 
> 
> 
> Based on this finding and others, in 2008, the Australian Pesticides and Veterinary Medicines Authority Final Review Report and Regulatory Decision of Sodium Fluoroacetate concluded that although individual poisoning of non-target animals can occur, this does not adversely affect the overall population of the non-target wildlife – while still highly regulated, they allowed 1080 to continue to be used as a management tool for invasive species (and predator) control.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The science behind the claim - 1080 is no threat to native wildlife populations - PestSmart Connect
> 
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...



Actually, it takes a long time and is an agonizing death. 

The cats need to be eradicated but, for a lot of reasons, 1080 is not the way to do it. 

Time Taken to Die | 1080 Science


----------



## Luddly Neddite

People seem to think poison just goes a way but that's not the case at all. Humans are the only animal that routinely fouls their own nest and their own food, water and air.

Hunters Reject DOC Plan for More 1080 Poison | Scoop News

What is 1080, and why do people oppose it?

Hunters oppose 1080 consent

Exclusive: 1080 dumpsite uncovered in Stewart Island national park

1080 Poison


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!




About the damage cats do or don't do --

From what I've read, islands are different. Be that as it may, I'm pissed at having to deal with ferals dumped on us. We've altered all but two but one of those is lactating and the other in a tom. That equals a lot of kittens. 

I love cats but firmly believe that I have no right to force them on others. These cats mean we cannot feed birds and it means other wildlife will suffer. 

Cats should be under the same controls as dogs. If they're not, the jackass owners should face same kind of fines as for dogs.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About the damage cats do or don't do --
> 
> From what I've read, islands are different. Be that as it may, I'm pissed at having to deal with ferals dumped on us. We've altered all but two but one of those is lactating and the other in a tom. That equals a lot of kittens.
> 
> I love cats but firmly believe that I have no right to force them on others. These cats mean we cannot feed birds and it means other wildlife will suffer.
> 
> Cats should be under the same controls as dogs. If they're not, the jackass owners should face same kind of fines as for dogs.
Click to expand...

So what are you going to do...KILL the kittens when born?


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About the damage cats do or don't do --
> 
> From what I've read, islands are different. Be that as it may, I'm pissed at having to deal with ferals dumped on us. We've altered all but two but one of those is lactating and the other in a tom. That equals a lot of kittens.
> 
> I love cats but firmly believe that I have no right to force them on others. These cats mean we cannot feed birds and it means other wildlife will suffer.
> 
> Cats should be under the same controls as dogs. If they're not, the jackass owners should face same kind of fines as for dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So what are you going to do...KILL the kittens when born?
Click to expand...



What would YOU do with animals who can not be placed?

Yes, unwanted un-placeable animals should be put down. Period. 

If you disagree you must not have seen starving, sickly animals dying long slow deaths. Or maybe you're one of those heartless, cruel assholes who believe the suffering of human animals and non-human animals is just fine.

If you don't want unwanted animals to be put down, then work to spay/neuter every single animal you can find. If you're not part of the solution to this very fixable problem, then just STFU.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About the damage cats do or don't do --
> 
> From what I've read, islands are different. Be that as it may, I'm pissed at having to deal with ferals dumped on us. We've altered all but two but one of those is lactating and the other in a tom. That equals a lot of kittens.
> 
> I love cats but firmly believe that I have no right to force them on others. These cats mean we cannot feed birds and it means other wildlife will suffer.
> 
> Cats should be under the same controls as dogs. If they're not, the jackass owners should face same kind of fines as for dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So what are you going to do...KILL the kittens when born?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> What would YOU do with animals who can not be placed?
> 
> Yes, unwanted un-placeable animals should be put down. Period.
> 
> If you disagree you must not have seen starving, sickly animals dying long slow deaths. Or maybe you're one of those heartless, cruel assholes who believe the suffering of human animals and non-human animals is just fine.
> 
> If you don't want unwanted animals to be put down, then work to spay/neuter every single animal you can find. If you're not part of the solution to this very fixable problem, then just STFU.
Click to expand...

I rescue cats....and you?


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About the damage cats do or don't do --
> 
> From what I've read, islands are different. Be that as it may, I'm pissed at having to deal with ferals dumped on us. We've altered all but two but one of those is lactating and the other in a tom. That equals a lot of kittens.
> 
> I love cats but firmly believe that I have no right to force them on others. These cats mean we cannot feed birds and it means other wildlife will suffer.
> 
> Cats should be under the same controls as dogs. If they're not, the jackass owners should face same kind of fines as for dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So what are you going to do...KILL the kittens when born?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> What would YOU do with animals who can not be placed?
> 
> Yes, unwanted un-placeable animals should be put down. Period.
> 
> If you disagree you must not have seen starving, sickly animals dying long slow deaths. Or maybe you're one of those heartless, cruel assholes who believe the suffering of human animals and non-human animals is just fine.
> 
> If you don't want unwanted animals to be put down, then work to spay/neuter every single animal you can find. If you're not part of the solution to this very fixable problem, then just STFU.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I rescue cats....and you?
Click to expand...



I rescue cats.
I've rescued cats for 60+ years.
I refuse to stand by while any animal suffers and I believe there are things much worse than death.

You?

=======

What would you call my trapping, altering, vetting all these cats? I call it rescue.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About the damage cats do or don't do --
> 
> From what I've read, islands are different. Be that as it may, I'm pissed at having to deal with ferals dumped on us. We've altered all but two but one of those is lactating and the other in a tom. That equals a lot of kittens.
> 
> I love cats but firmly believe that I have no right to force them on others. These cats mean we cannot feed birds and it means other wildlife will suffer.
> 
> Cats should be under the same controls as dogs. If they're not, the jackass owners should face same kind of fines as for dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So what are you going to do...KILL the kittens when born?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> What would YOU do with animals who can not be placed?
> 
> Yes, unwanted un-placeable animals should be put down. Period.
> 
> If you disagree you must not have seen starving, sickly animals dying long slow deaths. Or maybe you're one of those heartless, cruel assholes who believe the suffering of human animals and non-human animals is just fine.
> 
> If you don't want unwanted animals to be put down, then work to spay/neuter every single animal you can find. If you're not part of the solution to this very fixable problem, then just STFU.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I rescue cats....and you?
Click to expand...



I've run across idiots like you who believe starving, sick, internal and external parasites, short tortured lives is a good thing,

Make no mistake - I will always support killing homeless animals BECAUSE IRRESPONSIBLE PEOPLE DON'T SPAY/NEUTER.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands. 

No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were. 

Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals. 

No-kill is part of the problem.

And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.


----------



## Slyhunter

Back to the poison Sausage. Cats aren't the only creatures that eat Sausage. And birds eat the poisoned cats.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands.
> 
> No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were.
> 
> Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals.
> 
> No-kill is part of the problem.
> 
> And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.


You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands.
> 
> No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were.
> 
> Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals.
> 
> No-kill is part of the problem.
> 
> And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.
> 
> 
> 
> You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.
Click to expand...



*(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*

Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?  

Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.

The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that. 

Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.

We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.

We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one. 

I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom. 

As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them. 

Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..

How would you have handled this situation?


----------



## OldLady

The Purge said:


> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!


Introducing new species into Australia has been a disaster before.  Wasn't it rabbits last time that pretty much turned parts of Australia into dessert?

If any folks out there have a dog, that has to be really tough on them.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Slyhunter said:


> Back to the poison Sausage. Cats aren't the only creatures that eat Sausage. And birds eat the poisoned cats.



I've had predators come into rehab poisoned by eating poisoned prey. Especially owls. If I get them soon enough, its possible to save them with Vit K but its heartbreaking to see animals go through the suffering caused by poison.


----------



## gtopa1

toobfreak said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
Click to expand...

That's the point. The bloody things eat NATIVE ANIMALS!! The best strategy is to get rid of ALL feral animals.

Greg


----------



## OldLady

The *introduction* of *cats* into the wild in the 1800's *was* to control the rabbit, rat, and mice populations.

The rabbits,rats and mice were either accidentally or intentionally introduced into Australia by European traders and settlers.

This is very much reminding me of the nursery rhyme The House That Jack Built
This is the house that Jack built.
This is the malt that lay in the house that Jack built.
This is the rat that ate the malt
That lay in the house that Jack built.
This is the cat
That killed the rat that ate the malt
That lay in the house that Jack built.
This is the dog that worried the cat
That killed the rat that ate the malt
That lay in the house that Jack built.
This is the cow with the crumpled horn
That tossed the dog that worried the cat
That killed the rat that ate the malt
That lay in the house that Jack built.....


----------



## toobfreak

gtopa1 said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's the point. The bloody things eat NATIVE ANIMALS!! The best strategy is to get rid of ALL feral animals.
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...


So do just about every predator.  So your idea is to kill all predators on Earth?


----------



## OldLady

toobfreak said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's the point. The bloody things eat NATIVE ANIMALS!! The best strategy is to get rid of ALL feral animals.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So do just about every predator.  So your idea is to kill all predators on Earth?
Click to expand...

It sounds to me as if Australia needs more predators, not less.  But it didn't help when they introduced the cats, so I don't know what would work.  You can't introduce a species without introducing another that will eat it, though, it seems.


----------



## Darkwind

Vastator said:


> Kittymom1026 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Release where?
Click to expand...

Back into the stray population.  We have a program like that here.  We capture the feral cats, spade or neuter them, and then release them back into the population.  It's working too.  The feral population in this place has been dropping significantly.  

When they can't breed, their numbers decline and none of them have to suffer a horrible death by poisoning.


----------



## Darkwind

toobfreak said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
Click to expand...

The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.

However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.


----------



## toobfreak

Darkwind said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.
> 
> However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.
Click to expand...


That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.


----------



## Darkwind

toobfreak said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.
> 
> However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.
> 
> View attachment 258680
Click to expand...

It isn't bullshit, but whatever.  

Okay, it seems that there is a technique for taming feral cats if your willing to put in the time.


----------



## toobfreak

Darkwind said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> I like cats.  Cats are very good in the hands of good people.  People who don't like them don't like them mainly because they aren't as dependent on people as dogs.  But a large population of feral cats doesn't exist without a food source.  If the cats are there, it is because something is feeding them.  It would have been better to go after that and let the cats adjust numbers accordingly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.
> 
> However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.
> 
> View attachment 258680
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It isn't bullshit, but whatever.
> 
> Okay, it seems that there is a technique for taming feral cats if your willing to put in the time.
Click to expand...



You said it.  It takes time and patience to build up their desire and trust.  But sooner or later, all living things respond to love.


----------



## Darkwind

Feral and Stray Cats—An Important Difference


----------



## Darkwind

toobfreak said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll admit I'm not a cat person,but that didnt come into play when I wanted em gone.
> They shit and pissed everywhere and killed all the local wildlife.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.
> 
> However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.
> 
> View attachment 258680
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It isn't bullshit, but whatever.
> 
> Okay, it seems that there is a technique for taming feral cats if your willing to put in the time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You said it.  It takes time and patience to build up their desire and trust.  But sooner or later, all living things respond to love.
Click to expand...

They will rarely become the kind of housepet that we normally associate with housecats.  It's actually better, according to most sources, to neuter and releases feral cats because they don't really become affectionate.

Either way, doing that is a much more humane way to control their population.  Wild cats ARE a problem and they breed fast, like rabbits.  Meaning they have larger litters and expand exponentially.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands.
> 
> No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were.
> 
> Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals.
> 
> No-kill is part of the problem.
> 
> And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.
> 
> 
> 
> You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> *(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*
> 
> Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?
> 
> Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.
> 
> The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that.
> 
> Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.
> 
> We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.
> 
> We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one.
> 
> I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom.
> 
> As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them.
> 
> Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..
> 
> How would you have handled this situation?
> 
> View attachment 258626 View attachment 258627 View attachment 258628 View attachment 258629
Click to expand...


How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio. 






There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.

Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands.
> 
> No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were.
> 
> Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals.
> 
> No-kill is part of the problem.
> 
> And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.
> 
> 
> 
> You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> *(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*
> 
> Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?
> 
> Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.
> 
> The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that.
> 
> Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.
> 
> We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.
> 
> We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one.
> 
> I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom.
> 
> As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them.
> 
> Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..
> 
> How would you have handled this situation?
> 
> View attachment 258626 View attachment 258627 View attachment 258628 View attachment 258629
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
Click to expand...



I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.

I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve. 

Yeah, I'm being sarcastic. 

I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live. 

No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Darkwind said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> They were surviving.
> 
> Had they been most dogs, they would have been wandering the streets, tail between legs, dejected, looking for someone to adopt them.  Cats are tough little creatures.  But given half the chance, they make amazing gentle, loving pets.
> 
> 
> 
> The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.
> 
> However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.
> 
> View attachment 258680
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It isn't bullshit, but whatever.
> 
> Okay, it seems that there is a technique for taming feral cats if your willing to put in the time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You said it.  It takes time and patience to build up their desire and trust.  But sooner or later, all living things respond to love.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They will rarely become the kind of housepet that we normally associate with housecats.  It's actually better, according to most sources, to neuter and releases feral cats because they don't really become affectionate.
> 
> Either way, doing that is a much more humane way to control their population.  Wild cats ARE a problem and they breed fast, like rabbits.  Meaning they have larger litters and expand exponentially.
Click to expand...



Both of you make good points. I've tamed a lot of ferals and its sadly true that few are able to get back the kind of life they would have had if they had been raised differently. I've had cats who I never saw. I knew they were in the house, eating, drinking, going outside to the cat run. I knew they were safe, healthy, vetted but they had their own way of living in the same space as humans. 

The ferals I've been working with - I've been able to tame and place more than half but I'm certain that when all the alters are done, there will be 2-3 who will never never be approachable. I hate that. 

I wish, SO much, that we could find the litter. My bet is that I could nab the kittens and lure her back into the porch. We would be able to tame and place the kittens. And there's still the huge tabby I call The Ghost.

As I said above, this past winter, I had trapped them all and kept them warm and fed but by next winter, its likely I won't be able to catch them. We have outdoor shelter for them and heated pads so they'll probably survive.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands.
> 
> No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were.
> 
> Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals.
> 
> No-kill is part of the problem.
> 
> And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.
> 
> 
> 
> You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> *(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*
> 
> Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?
> 
> Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.
> 
> The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that.
> 
> Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.
> 
> We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.
> 
> We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one.
> 
> I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom.
> 
> As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them.
> 
> Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..
> 
> How would you have handled this situation?
> 
> View attachment 258626 View attachment 258627 View attachment 258628 View attachment 258629
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
Click to expand...

Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.

I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@

As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...

Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia


----------



## toobfreak

Luddly Neddite said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> The problem with cats is that you have  very tiny window for them to bond with humans.  About eight weeks.  After that, they remain feral for life and cannot be tamed.
> 
> However, if you can catch enough of either gender in a location and sterilize them, the population quickly begins to fall off.  Feral cats don't live as long as housecats, maybe 7 or 8 years.  While they are alive, they are hardy animals, but living outdoors shortens their lifespans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.
> 
> View attachment 258680
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It isn't bullshit, but whatever.
> 
> Okay, it seems that there is a technique for taming feral cats if your willing to put in the time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You said it.  It takes time and patience to build up their desire and trust.  But sooner or later, all living things respond to love.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They will rarely become the kind of housepet that we normally associate with housecats.  It's actually better, according to most sources, to neuter and releases feral cats because they don't really become affectionate.
> 
> Either way, doing that is a much more humane way to control their population.  Wild cats ARE a problem and they breed fast, like rabbits.  Meaning they have larger litters and expand exponentially.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The ferals I've been working with - I've been able to tame and place more than half but I'm certain that when all the alters are done, there will be 2-3 who will never never be approachable. I hate that..
Click to expand...


The trick with the tough cases is to feed them.  Make YOU the source of food.  Make them come to you.  Get them used to trusting you a little bit more at a time.  A little closer each time.  It has to be their choice though.  Never trap or force them before they are ready.  If they want to eat, they'll eventually come, you have to have a good energy.  But once they get accustomed to taking food from you, the battle is won.  Sooner or later, they'll realize where the food is, and you are not hurting them.  Then you have a friend.  That's not to say you'll ever make them a cuddly baby.  But its a start.  You have to teach them TRUST.  Trust is the difference between a wild animal and a tame one.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

toobfreak said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's BULLSHIT.  I've had feral cats totally wild that we have tamed as adults.  Here's one.  It takes the right person.  But you are right.  If you want to be HUMANE about it, catching feral cats and sterilizing them is the way to control their population.
> 
> View attachment 258680
> 
> 
> 
> It isn't bullshit, but whatever.
> 
> Okay, it seems that there is a technique for taming feral cats if your willing to put in the time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You said it.  It takes time and patience to build up their desire and trust.  But sooner or later, all living things respond to love.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They will rarely become the kind of housepet that we normally associate with housecats.  It's actually better, according to most sources, to neuter and releases feral cats because they don't really become affectionate.
> 
> Either way, doing that is a much more humane way to control their population.  Wild cats ARE a problem and they breed fast, like rabbits.  Meaning they have larger litters and expand exponentially.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The ferals I've been working with - I've been able to tame and place more than half but I'm certain that when all the alters are done, there will be 2-3 who will never never be approachable. I hate that..
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The trick with the tough cases is to feed them.  Make YOU the source of food.  Make them come to you.  Get them used to trusting you a little bit more at a time.  A little closer each time.  It has to be their choice though.  Never trap or force them before they are ready.  If they want to eat, they'll eventually come, you have to have a good energy.  But once they get accustomed to taking food from you, the battle is won.  Sooner or later, they'll realize where the food is, and you are not hurting them.  Then you have a friend.  That's not to say you'll ever make them a cuddly baby.  But its a start.  You have to teach them TRUST.  Trust is the difference between a wild animal and a tame one.
Click to expand...



Yep.

Exactly as I have done with both domestic and wild animals for many many years.

*I posted the links to some of the wild animals I work with but here it is again.
*
I rehab, condition and train raptors and mammals to be ambassador animals, education animals. As required by federal law, if they cannot be placed, they must be put down. Also required by law is that I give at least two education program per month. I believe strongly that wild animals belong in the wild but if that's not possible, I look for the next best thing.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very red very backward state. We have very little in the way of resources for pets. The two shelters are both "no-kill", which is another way of saying they kill thousands and thousands.
> 
> No-kill shelters are warehouses for very small numbers of animals. They sit in their cages, some literally going crazy. The money used on warehousing could be used to subsidize low-cost spay and neuter but oh no, its better that unwanted animals be dumped out in the country - like these cats were.
> 
> Another resucer and I were talking recently - about the act that even after all the years and thousands of rescues, we still have not put a dent in numbers of unwanted animals.
> 
> No-kill is part of the problem.
> 
> And yes, I do feel strongly about how we treat our companion animals.
> 
> 
> 
> You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> *(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*
> 
> Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?
> 
> Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.
> 
> The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that.
> 
> Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.
> 
> We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.
> 
> We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one.
> 
> I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom.
> 
> As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them.
> 
> Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..
> 
> How would you have handled this situation?
> 
> View attachment 258626 View attachment 258627 View attachment 258628 View attachment 258629
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
Click to expand...



So I'm stupid? Okay. 
In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ........................... 
Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right? 

Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about? 

Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.

Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.


The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?

You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering. 

You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> You doing it for 60 years.....just how old are you since I started doing it in 1967....and NO you don't kill anything because they have a harsh life....one thing if they are fatally ill but even the govt setting up a preserve especially like a wide open country like Australia with volunteers and paid workers to take care of the problem is more than doable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*
> 
> Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?
> 
> Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.
> 
> The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that.
> 
> Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.
> 
> We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.
> 
> We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one.
> 
> I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom.
> 
> As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them.
> 
> Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..
> 
> How would you have handled this situation?
> 
> View attachment 258626 View attachment 258627 View attachment 258628 View attachment 258629
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
Click to expand...


Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> *(I'm also a wildlife rehabber. Three or four posts with photos.)*
> 
> Your original question was 'would I kill kittens after birth'. What do you believe should be done with unwanted animals?
> 
> Years ago, I did an on-air interview/debate in which I said the county I lived in was killing more than 1000 every month. Nationally, fully 25% are so-called "pure breeds" and more than 87% are younger than 3 years. I asked the froot loop on the other side of this question and he very seriously said that if I truly loved animals, I would take them home. IOW, he had no frikken clue what he was talking about.
> 
> The reason I was doing this interview was to push a county-wide bill that would add a 1% tax on all pet food that would subsidize spay/neuter. The bill did not pass. Even though many despise and blame "the pound" for piles of dead animals, they don't want to pay to change that.
> 
> Below are a few photos of the ferals I'm dealing with. Little by little, I was able to lure them into our screened in porch. It was not their fault but its hard to describe just how much damage they did.
> 
> We had patio furniture covered with heavy canvas covers. Both were covered with diarrhea. The porch is carpeted with indoor-outdoor carpet. When the last cat is gone, we will get new carpeting but its wood underneath the carpet. That means urine would have soaked through. W may have to replace the entire floor and probably would not carpet in the case.
> 
> We had a very cold winter so we covered the screens with specially made canvas shades. We set up a shelter, heated towels for them to sleep on, ran a heater 18 hours a day, 24/7. When that heater died, we bought a new one.
> 
> I was able to tame some down enough to place 2 in forever homes, 6 in foster homes. This left 3 wild and outside (altered and vacc'd), one intact tom and one lactating mom. I've trapped a lot of dogs and cats but sometimes they get trap-savvy like this tom.
> 
> As to the kittens - If we could find them, I would take them to raise. That way, they would be place-able. Ideally I would hope to get them at 4-5 weeks or so but we haven't been able to find them.
> 
> Final count is 11 spayed/neutered and vaccinated, two intact and an unknown number of kittens..
> 
> How would you have handled this situation?
> 
> View attachment 258626 View attachment 258627 View attachment 258628 View attachment 258629
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
Click to expand...



All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!" 
(Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)

Hypocrite.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
Click to expand...




Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> How do I handle this situation....I refuse to kill them. I take care of them. As to them hunting, if they have a constant supply of food as I have in our yard they rarely hunt. They are like people if you give them most everything they need to survive they don't  go out looking for anything else, they are LAZY. I have a constant supply of dry food available and have a few dozen of these under bushes, low trees and on a covered but open on 3 sides back patio.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is NO SUCH THING as a perpetual feral cat....it may take months and sometimes many months with the older cats to get them to a point that they accept your touch. You simply have to WORK ON EACH ONE. The ones that are HARD CORE wild and have trouble accepting me, I have several Have a Heart traps, have LEARNED what cat like what food the best and use that for bait. Once caught they are taken inside and placed in a room that has a few shelter boxes in it so they have a safe place to hide. When in that room I WORK on each one with food and slowly get each one used to me and human touch.....yes it is sometimes a longer process but have never had one completely reject my touch and come around to respond positively  to it. All are neutered and checked for disease. Ones that are AIDS or Leuk positive go into 2 separate rooms and live out their lives until I see them start to succumb to their disease and are put down.
> 
> Now to Australia. As I said there are thousands of square miles to form preserves for them. Yes it will cost money and manpower to take care of them but it is ETHICAL and MORAL to do so, besides all the bullshit the governments spend money on that are frivolous. You set up a central station or how many you actually need and the cats will congregate there. I don't  think I need to go any further into this but if you want to I can elaborate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
Click to expand...

What!!?..

You are nuts!!!!.

But you sure do like to lie!


----------



## fncceo

The Purge said:


> Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage



I don't hate cats ... it depends on the sauce...


----------



## BasicHumanUnit

fncceo said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't hate cats ... it depends on the sauce...
Click to expand...


Interesting.....a lot of Americans today feel all cops deserve to be "sauced"...and put down.   How nice.
Either way, it takes  a perverted mind to think like you do.

Homosapiens are animals with a sight advantage in mental skills....who patronize themselves and convince themselves they're "better'.     hardly.
Animals are a *LOT* smarter truth told.....they're not irradiating the oceans with nuclear waste and dumping billions of tons of plastic into the oceans.
They don't build nuclear weapons to destroy the planet and everything on it.

Yeah, humans are the ones who need to be put down if the planet is to survive.   The Cat haters have it backwards.  Which puts their mental capacity a few notches below an ectoparasite.


----------



## fncceo

BasicHumanUnit said:


> Yeah, humans are the ones who need to be put down if the planet is to survive.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot tell you how grateful I am that you take in every single one of the millions of sick, old, homeless cats that otherwise be put down. What a guy.
> 
> I'm sure you will also fund this Aussie preserve.
> 
> Yeah, I'm being sarcastic.
> 
> I notice you forgot to say EXACTLY where the millions of cats and dogs would live as well as how they will live.
> 
> No one goes into rescue to kill kittens and cats and puppies and dogs but only idiots believe it is "ethical and moral" or possible to keep every single animal alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
Click to expand...



@Purge 

Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?

You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive". 

Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?


----------



## Luddly Neddite

BasicHumanUnit said:


> fncceo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't hate cats ... it depends on the sauce...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting.....a lot of Americans today feel all cops deserve to be "sauced"...and put down.   How nice.
> Either way, it takes  a perverted mind to think like you do.
> 
> Homosapiens are animals with a sight advantage in mental skills....who patronize themselves and convince themselves they're "better'.     hardly.
> Animals are a *LOT* smarter truth told.....they're not irradiating the oceans with nuclear waste and dumping billions of tons of plastic into the oceans.
> They don't build nuclear weapons to destroy the planet and everything on it.
> 
> Yeah, humans are the ones who need to be put down if the planet is to survive.   The Cat haters have it backwards.  Which puts their mental capacity a few notches below an ectoparasite.
Click to expand...


Agree that we don't give non-human animals credit for their intelligence and emotional capabilities. 

Because I work with wild animals, I often hear people say that animals are dumb. As in, stupid that they run into the road. 

Animals have evolved to be smart in the ways they need to be and there is no way for them to learn to avoid dangerous behavior. Its not like an animal can go home and tell others not to go on the highway because you'll be killed. 

Humans - No other species poisons their own nest but big money rules. That's why trump is removing regs that keep our air,  water and food safe.


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't  be stupid Luddley stop and think for a change.
> 
> I take on all that come to my door and yard....a hell of a lot of work and cost....but it certainly makes my HEARY SMILE with saving one at a time and sometimes a family@
> 
> As to where do you put them in Australia....look at this...
> 
> Previously Undocumented Forest has been Discovered Across Australia
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> @Purge
> 
> Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?
> 
> You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive".
> 
> Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?
Click to expand...

Baby's born alive is HUMAN ABORTION Which is abhorrent


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stupid? Okay.
> In that case, tell me where you are putting the other MILLIONS of unwanted companions animals ...........................
> Surely you have already begun to trap, alter, vacc, vet these MILLIONS of cats and have now put them in some fairy tale place. Right?
> 
> Oh. No? You mean you're all big talk and you really have no fucking clue what you're blathering on about?
> 
> Okie dokey. Thanks. And please do let me know when you can deliver more than sanctimonious hot air.
> 
> Good for you for choosing to take care of those VERY FEW CATS. I would never expect you to do more. BUT, you are demanding that others take on MILLIONS of unwanted animals and you have no idea how that could be done.
> 
> 
> The whole point behind killing invasive cats in Australia is to save native species. What do you plan to do with native species located at your link? How long before the cats wipe them out? Who will paying to feed your invasive species? Who is out there altering them? Vaccinating them? Vetting them?
> 
> You want to play god. You want to decide that native species should be destroyed, driven extinct and replaced with invasive species that cannot survive with your benevolent god actions. Which YOU won't be paying for or actually delivering.
> 
> You remind me of a neighbor I had. Holy roller, far right dingbat who said "we" should take gallons of bleach out to the desert after heavy rains to disinfect the _charcos_. I have no doubt she meant well but that's just flat out dumb.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> @Purge
> 
> Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?
> 
> You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive".
> 
> Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Baby's born alive is HUMAN ABORTION Which is abhorrent
Click to expand...



You're wrong of course. Babies born alive is not human abortion. In fact, most want their babies born alive. In any event, stop trying to change the subject. 

You said the feral cats should be kept alive and suggested dumping them on an island. That means indigenous species must die, including babies. It also means the cats must be fed, altered, vaccinated. If you don't do that, you will soon have a lot of very sick cats.

How do you propose to do this? Do you want to just kill the indigenous species all at once? How would you do that? The thread concerns the use of a very cruel poison. Is that what you want to use on the wild animals? 

Or, do you want to just let the feral cats kill them a little at the time? 

Do you agree that if you're going to play god, you should take responsibility for your actions?

You will sidestep these questions again and that's fine. I'm saying that while it feels good to say you're going to save them all, its simply not possible.


----------



## Likkmee

I expect tRump to ask the Aussies for the chorizo version for the border.


----------



## OldLady

Darkwind said:


> Vastator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kittymom1026 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Release where?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Back into the stray population.  We have a program like that here.  We capture the feral cats, spade or neuter them, and then release them back into the population.  It's working too.  The feral population in this place has been dropping significantly.
> 
> When they can't breed, their numbers decline and none of them have to suffer a horrible death by poisoning.
Click to expand...

I heard about a program where they were keeping down a (deer?) population by putting "The Pill" into tasty feed they dropped near the herd, and that, too, worked well.  I don't think that would cause as much collateral damage as poison.


----------



## Likkmee

OldLady said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vastator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kittymom1026 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Release where?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Back into the stray population.  We have a program like that here.  We capture the feral cats, spade or neuter them, and then release them back into the population.  It's working too.  The feral population in this place has been dropping significantly.
> 
> When they can't breed, their numbers decline and none of them have to suffer a horrible death by poisoning.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I heard about a program where they were keeping down a (deer?) population by putting "The Pill" into tasty feed they dropped near the herd, and that, too, worked well.  I don't think that would cause as much collateral damage as poison.
Click to expand...

Good plan! Pilled empanadas !


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> Again you are making a fool of yourself....perhaps if zi had the MONEY that is available in Australia what I purpose would come about but I take care of my small area...you just want TO KILL THEM even when they are viable....you suck!...Bet you are PRO DEATH FOR BABIES ALSO...EVEN WHEN BORN ALIVE!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> @Purge
> 
> Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?
> 
> You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive".
> 
> Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Baby's born alive is HUMAN ABORTION Which is abhorrent
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You're wrong of course. Babies born alive is not human abortion. In fact, most want their babies born alive. In any event, stop trying to change the subject.
> 
> You said the feral cats should be kept alive and suggested dumping them on an island. That means indigenous species must die, including babies. It also means the cats must be fed, altered, vaccinated. If you don't do that, you will soon have a lot of very sick cats.
> 
> How do you propose to do this? Do you want to just kill the indigenous species all at once? How would you do that? The thread concerns the use of a very cruel poison. Is that what you want to use on the wild animals?
> 
> Or, do you want to just let the feral cats kill them a little at the time?
> 
> Do you agree that if you're going to play god, you should take responsibility for your actions?
> 
> You will sidestep these questions again and that's fine. I'm saying that while it feels good to say you're going to save them all, its simply not possible.
Click to expand...

The Japanese have done it and there are plenty of uninhabited island in Australia.....Do as the Japanese have make them tourist spots!


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> @Purge
> 
> Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?
> 
> You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive".
> 
> Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Baby's born alive is HUMAN ABORTION Which is abhorrent
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You're wrong of course. Babies born alive is not human abortion. In fact, most want their babies born alive. In any event, stop trying to change the subject.
> 
> You said the feral cats should be kept alive and suggested dumping them on an island. That means indigenous species must die, including babies. It also means the cats must be fed, altered, vaccinated. If you don't do that, you will soon have a lot of very sick cats.
> 
> How do you propose to do this? Do you want to just kill the indigenous species all at once? How would you do that? The thread concerns the use of a very cruel poison. Is that what you want to use on the wild animals?
> 
> Or, do you want to just let the feral cats kill them a little at the time?
> 
> Do you agree that if you're going to play god, you should take responsibility for your actions?
> 
> You will sidestep these questions again and that's fine. I'm saying that while it feels good to say you're going to save them all, its simply not possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Japanese have done it and there are plenty of uninhabited island in Australia.....Do as the Japanese have make them tourist spots!
Click to expand...


Actually, there are several 'cat islands' off Japan. What happened to the indigenous life? 

IF there are islands with no life, there's a reason for it. Such as, fresh water.

Not to mention, sea level is rising. It might be okay with you but I'm against starving and drowning of cats. 

But hey, that's just me. 

You're very pie in the sky with no practical consideration of the needs of the animals or the logistics of getting gazillions of them trapped and transported there. No matter how you accomplish this, a lot of animals will die. 

10 Uninhabited Islands around the World
10 Uninhabited Islands and Why Nobody Lives on Them


----------



## Luddly Neddite

OldLady said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vastator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kittymom1026 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Release where?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Back into the stray population.  We have a program like that here.  We capture the feral cats, spade or neuter them, and then release them back into the population.  It's working too.  The feral population in this place has been dropping significantly.
> 
> When they can't breed, their numbers decline and none of them have to suffer a horrible death by poisoning.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I heard about a program where they were keeping down a (deer?) population by putting "The Pill" into tasty feed they dropped near the herd, and that, too, worked well.  I don't think that would cause as much collateral damage as poison.
Click to expand...



I suspect this would take longer than they're willing to allow but yes - I've always dreamed of some way to accomplished mass sterilization. There are now injections for both male dogs and cat. Obviously not applicable in this situation but interesting. 

Of course, the first thing one thinks of is that the first testicle would be easy. Its that second one that just might prove difficult ...


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The Purge said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> All through this thread, you have said you want to kill animals, including "BABIES ... BORN ALIVE!"
> (Dumb thing to say since you can't kill an animal that is NOT alive.)
> 
> Hypocrite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> @Purge
> 
> Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?
> 
> You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive".
> 
> Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Baby's born alive is HUMAN ABORTION Which is abhorrent
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You're wrong of course. Babies born alive is not human abortion. In fact, most want their babies born alive. In any event, stop trying to change the subject.
> 
> You said the feral cats should be kept alive and suggested dumping them on an island. That means indigenous species must die, including babies. It also means the cats must be fed, altered, vaccinated. If you don't do that, you will soon have a lot of very sick cats.
> 
> How do you propose to do this? Do you want to just kill the indigenous species all at once? How would you do that? The thread concerns the use of a very cruel poison. Is that what you want to use on the wild animals?
> 
> Or, do you want to just let the feral cats kill them a little at the time?
> 
> Do you agree that if you're going to play god, you should take responsibility for your actions?
> 
> You will sidestep these questions again and that's fine. I'm saying that while it feels good to say you're going to save them all, its simply not possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Japanese have done it and there are plenty of uninhabited island in Australia.....Do as the Japanese have make them tourist spots!
Click to expand...


Surely, by now, you realize that you want to create the same mess that Australia has. You want to kill millions of indigenous animals so you can park unwanted cats in their space.

My bet is that you believe in a god. Doesn't matter which god. Any one of them will do. Point is that if you do believe in a god, then you must also believe your particular god created the creatures you ware wanting to kill off in order to make room for the millions of cats. You think your god would agree with that?


----------



## The Purge

Luddly Neddite said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> What!!?..
> 
> You are nuts!!!!.
> 
> But you sure do like to lie!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Purge
> 
> Do you really believe the constant, childish name calling is helpful?
> 
> You said you want indigenous species to be killed so that an invasive species can take their home.  That will include "babies ... born alive".
> 
> Or did you plan keep either or both in cages for the rest of their lives?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Baby's born alive is HUMAN ABORTION Which is abhorrent
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You're wrong of course. Babies born alive is not human abortion. In fact, most want their babies born alive. In any event, stop trying to change the subject.
> 
> You said the feral cats should be kept alive and suggested dumping them on an island. That means indigenous species must die, including babies. It also means the cats must be fed, altered, vaccinated. If you don't do that, you will soon have a lot of very sick cats.
> 
> How do you propose to do this? Do you want to just kill the indigenous species all at once? How would you do that? The thread concerns the use of a very cruel poison. Is that what you want to use on the wild animals?
> 
> Or, do you want to just let the feral cats kill them a little at the time?
> 
> Do you agree that if you're going to play god, you should take responsibility for your actions?
> 
> You will sidestep these questions again and that's fine. I'm saying that while it feels good to say you're going to save them all, its simply not possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Japanese have done it and there are plenty of uninhabited island in Australia.....Do as the Japanese have make them tourist spots!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Surely, by now, you realize that you want to create the same mess that Australia has. You want to kill millions of indigenous animals so you can park unwanted cats in their space.
> 
> My bet is that you believe in a god. Doesn't matter which god. Any one of them will do. Point is that if you do believe in a god, then you must also believe your particular god created the creatures you ware wanting to kill off in order to make room for the millions of cats. You think your god would agree with that?
Click to expand...

I'm an agnostic....blowing your rant all to bits.


----------



## Death Angel

Kittymom1026 said:


> The Purge said:
> 
> 
> 
> The New York Post/The Sun/AP ^ | April 26, 2019
> 
> Australian officials are killing millions of feral cats by airdropping frozen sausages laced with poison across the Outback. The felines die within 15 minutes of ingesting the toxic treats, which are produced at a factory close to Perth. But in a bid to kill as many as possible, officials also trap and shoot the creatures. The sausages are made with kangaroo meat, chicken fat, herbs, spices and the poison, 1080, the New York Times reported
> 
> ------------
> 
> We have all heard the song "Who let the dogs out" well who let all the cats out?.... Cats are an invasive species in Australia but can you imagine the RAT infestation without them........
> 
> 1. Poison is extremely cruel. Depending on the type, it causes seizures, hemorrhaging, or burns.
> 
> 2. Poisons are not selective. This bait will kill non-target species, as well.
> 
> 3. Cat haters love to go on about the supposed environmental damage that cats cause. However, the damage caused by allowing rodents and other small animals to breed without any checks on their population is worse. Despite what cat-haters who hide behind environmental concerns claim, cats *are* an integral part of ecosystems that humans inhabit.
> 
> I wonder, now that this cruel program has been publicized, how much longer it will last?.....and since the government has taken all the guns... Well you get my drift......The Japanese have a cat island, I'm  sure there are many uninhabited Islands just scattered all around Australia....it could become a huge tourist attraction as those industrious Japanese have done!
> 
> 
> 
> That is horrible! Those poor cats. It's not their fault they were born. They'd do better to trap and release. That would stop the breeding.
Click to expand...

It's a crime, and it should be, if us peasants do it


----------

