# Pitbulls...



## mal

Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post

A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...

What gives?...



peace...


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## strollingbones

what a horrible story.....i own dobermans....i cannot imagine my dog attacking me....i could wrap my arm in bacon and he might nibble a bit....but to do this....


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## mal

"Still, pit bulls, although they have legions of admirers, have killed and maimed countless times before. The most recent pit bull death occurred last week in Kernersville, N.C., when 25-year-old Katherine Atkins was set upon by her two dogs while she was attempting to feed them. She had owned the dogs since they were puppies, Kernersville police said. 

And last month, 5-year-old Jason Ryan, of Baker City, Ore., was set upon by a neighbor's pit bull. He died in the ambulance. In September, two toddlers were mauled to death by pit bulls, one in Colton, Calif., the other in Gilbert, Ariz."

^That's what's troubling to me... And it's not just Pitbulls that I don't Trust around my kids, I don't Trust any Dogs around my Kids.

I have Personally known (2) Girls who have been Permanently Scared in the Face by Family Dogs and one of my Wife's Teammates a few years back had their German Shepherd attack their Baby...

Sick thing in that Case, the Police allowed the Dog to stay and the "Man" of the House won out of the Wife about the Dog staying... The dog remains in the Home.

I just don't Trust Animals... I understand the Appeal, but the Attacks I have seen in my Life leave me with little want or need to Expose Defenseless Children to them.

Hell, look what these Dogs have done to their Adult Owners?

To each their own, I just don't Trust Animals.



peace...


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## strollingbones

o hush i already got my dob on lock down due to problems with the neighboring kids....he went over and amused himself by barking at the kids at the damn bus stop till they ran home crying....i got a phone call immediately and i was glad to get that over a gunshot.....and then a phone call...i never leave any of my dogs with small kids.....never....i just dont like the chances or the odds...the kid aint gonna win 

plus thor does this typical doberman thing where he can whip his body back and forth....in the air....its like a bowling ball when he hits a small group of kids....they just fly this way and that....so its best for him to not be around kids....

my dogs are on lock down from 7 am to 7:30 am and then 3 pm to 3:30 pm and any other time the neighbors are having parties etc...we all have dogs.....just about everyone on the creek has dogs...so we work hard to keep the peace


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## mal

strollingbones said:


> o hush i already got my dob on lock down due to problems with the neighboring kids....he went over and amused himself by barking at the kids at the damn bus stop till they ran home crying....i got a phone call immediately and i was glad to get that over a gunshot.....and then a phone call...i never leave any of my dogs with small kids.....never....i just dont like the chances or the odds...the kid aint gonna win
> 
> plus thor does this typical doberman thing where he can whip his body back and forth....in the air....its like a bowling ball when he hits a small group of kids....they just fly this way and that....so its best for him to not be around kids....
> 
> my dogs are on lock down from 7 am to 7:30 am and then 3 pm to 3:30 pm and any other time the neighbors are having parties etc...we all have dogs.....just about everyone on the creek has dogs...so we work hard to keep the peace



I grew up with dogs... Had a Shar Pei last... I was about 16... She was Family.  Her name was Mink.  I don't Hate animals, quite the contrary... Wish I was so deathly allergic to cats... But when it comes to kids and animals, I am hard line on that.

I'll send you something PM...



peace...


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## strollingbones

no parent should put a child at risk...leaving kids alone with any sized dog is a risk..but with a large dog...that can do damage in seconds its just foolish...


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## WinterBorn

My daughter has a pit bull.   Biggest baby ever.  Very sweet dog.

That said, he is also strong has hell, has a super high pain tolerance, and is very protective of his owner.  All typical pit attributes.

It takes a better owner for a pit than for a lab or basset hound.  Pity so many owners are not up to the task.


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## BullKurtz

The statistics don't lie....Pits kill on the average of 66 humans a year, over double the number Rottweillers kill....Rotties are notorious for years of being docile and then suddenly exploding into a murderous attack on whoever is handy.  Dobermans are way down on the list at 17.  I'd link my numbers but I can't find the article....it was written by a veternarian with no agenda, just a heads-up on dangerous breeds.  I consider being menaced by an aggressive dog the same as pointing a pistol at me....I make it vividly clear to the owner I will cut their dog's throat....and then beat the living shit out of them for instigating the attack.


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## NLT

My wife and I was was attacked at a car lot by a rottwiler, both of us were bit multible times, mine required stitches, luckily the owner of the dog was there to pull him off me. Off course he said he was surpised that the dog attacked . the dog never barked once. Then we found out that the dog did not have its rabie shots up to date and had attacked two other people. We had to sue the owner for the emergency room bills. The dog was finally put down by the owner, he could not afford any more law suits.

I have absolutley no use for Rottwilers, Pit bulls, chows and other agreesive breeds. If they come onto to my prperty or threaten me or mine in anyway, I will shoot them down. Take that to the bank.


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## mal

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> The statistics don't lie....Pits kill on the average of 66 humans a year, over double the number Rottweillers kill....Rotties are notorious for years of being docile and then suddenly exploding into a murderous attack on whoever is handy.  Dobermans are way down on the list at 17.  I'd link my numbers but I can't find the article....it was written by a veternarian with no agenda, just a heads-up on dangerous breeds.  I consider being menaced by an aggressive dog the same as pointing a pistol at me....I make it vividly clear to the owner I will cut their dog's throat....and then beat the living shit out of them for instigating the attack.



I can tell you this, if a dog attacked any of my Children it would not Live and the Owners would have VERY Serious Issues with me.

You take the Responsibility of the Animal when you Decide to make it your Pet.

ALL of it's Actions.

Reminds me of the dbags to the South of me with the Yappy little dogs... Real Fuckstains...

Westminster Animal Control paid them a visit a few years ago and found they were not tagged or had shots...

Guy has the balls to ask me if I called them because "it cost me a lot money to get that shit done, man"... Yeah?... Fuck you. 

He's a former Sureño and I had a DPD GU Officer in my Garage the time.

Stupid Motherfucker.

Still my Neighbors though... Although I believe he has Abandoned his 6 or 7 kids once a again for the Jail Cell.

He's AWESOME! 

/end rant.



peace...


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## mal

And people wonder why I have a CCP... 



peace...


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## Luddly Neddite

> But when it comes to kids and animals, I am hard line on that.



I agree completely. 

After most of these vicious attacks, someone says, 'I don't know. He was always fine before'. And, people line up to say how wonderful their own dog are how they wouldn't hurt a fly and how they love the kids. 

I live on a lake in a very rural area. Most of the homes are vacant much of the year and its not uncommon for me not to see anyone for days at a time. Other year round people let their dogs run loose including three pits that I sometimes see when I walk to the mailbox. This is a very backward red state and there is no leash law in the county. The last time it came up for a vote, idiots carried signs about the "nanny state". 

It will take an attack like this, probably resulting in lawsuits, before we'll get a leash law. 

People are just plain stupid.


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## Connery

I have Chihuahuas and Shelties I found both thought to be great with kids and that is where I draw the line myself. While I love animals there are limits to what I would have based on the probability that the dog would attack another. Don't need them for protection as I have been told there was no meaner dog than I.


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com


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## Sallow

Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.

I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.

Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.


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## Luddly Neddite

Linked from the OP -

Nick Santino Commits Suicide After Euthanizing Dog



> Last week, soap opera actor Nick Santino euthanized his beloved five-year-old Pit Bull, Rocco &#8212; a decision that he said was forced on him by his New York condo board, which has a policy that bans residents from owning the breed.
> 
> Just hours later, Santino took his own life, writing that he had &#8220;betrayed his best friend,&#8221; reported the NY Post. &#8220;Rocco trusted me, and I failed him. He didn&#8217;t deserve this.&#8221;
> 
> A board member told the newspaper that Santino&#8217;s death had &#8220;nothing to do with the pet policy.&#8221; Apparently, the dog had been grandfathered in and wasn't subject to the policy, but Santino claimed that he'd been harassed about the dog by members of the board.
> Punishing a Much Maligned Breed
> 
> Santino&#8217;s actions of euthanizing a healthy dog and then committing suicide may be hard for many people to understand, but bans of so-called "dangerous breeds" often leave owners of healthy and nonaggressive Pit Bull&#8211;type dogs in heartbreaking situations.


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## BullKurtz

NLT said:


> My wife and I was was attacked at a car lot by a rottwiler, both of us were bit multible times, mine required stitches, luckily the owner of the dog was there to pull him off me. Off course he said he was surpised that the dog attacked . the dog never barked once. Then we found out that the dog did not have its rabie shots up to date and had attacked two other people. We had to sue the owner for the emergency room bills. The dog was finally put down by the owner, he could not afford any more law suits.
> 
> I have absolutley no use for Rottwilers, Pit bulls, chows and other agreesive breeds. If they come onto to my prperty or threaten me or mine in anyway, I will shoot them down. Take that to the bank.



I got a pal who was a mailman for 20 years....got attacked by two dobermans....they were literally ripping him apart....he shit himself it was so bad...luckily he kept his feet under him and his chin on his chest to take the bites in the face instead of his throat.  Once again, the owner claimed they were "sweet babies who'd never done anything like that before"....he got a settlement of over $200K and the scars to prove it....they bit his junk so many times he can't perform for his wife anymore.  The owner was cited, paid a small fine and agreed to have the beasts put down...that's it.  The insurance paid the settlement and the owner later had two new doberman pups in his yard.


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## G.T.

There are so many levels of trust with a dog, that it is kind of scary to keep them unattended around small kids no matter WHAT their history or temperament. 

A dog cant tell your kid if he's playing along still or getting aggravated / pissed off. 

I saw one of the best/nicest dogs ever scar a little kids jaw-skin (the kid is fine) for life because the kid was really young/doesn't know better, and grabbed on of the dog's eyes. The dog snapped @ him.

You also don't know their mental health status as they get older. You don't know necessarily if they have early onset dementia and can just lose their way. Lots of trust there. 


But I love dogs. : /


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## NLT

> healthy and nonaggressive Pit Bull&#8211;type dogs



No such thing as non-agressive pit bulls.


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## G.T.

wrong thread...


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## BullKurtz

Sallow said:


> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.



No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.


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## G.T.

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
Click to expand...


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## Sallow

NLT said:


> healthy and nonaggressive Pit Bulltype dogs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No such thing as non-agressive pit bulls.
Click to expand...


Bullshit.


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## Sallow

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
Click to expand...


Don't tell me what I know and I don't know.

I have a friend with 2 HUGE pits. Neither one of them is aggressive. And his intention in owning them? They were discarded by a guy who didn't think they would eat so much.

Both are sweet dogs.


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## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight*....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
Click to expand...


So you know everyone who owns a pit?   This is just bullshit based on hysteria.

Are there plenty of owners who fit your statement?   Sure.    Is it every pit owner?  No even close.  My daughter's pit is a sweet, loving dog.  My lab/basset hound mix is the alpha when they play.  Her dog is a 75lb wannabe lap dog.

Also, I am not sure why you think lifting a dog over your head shows him you are the alpha, but it is a strange idea.   Every dog I have owned gets the same treatment to show who is in charge.  I roll them on their back, put my face on their neck and growl.  I do it when they are puppies and every few years as they grow up.  I have never owned a dog that would not do what I told it to do.  The most difficult dog (as far as listening) I have owned was a Walker Coonhound.  She, like all my dogs, was a rescue.  Hunting hounds tend to be way more independent.


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## Katzndogz

No one knows why a dog would go haywire and start attacking.  It could be something as common as something they ate.  Particularly today when the use of illicit drugs is common, a dog could get into a stash, or someone  might give the dog something as  a joke.   Sometimes the dog just goes off on its own.   If you have ever been at a shelter where dogs that have attacked people are, you would not believe they could do it.  They are as peaceful and calm as they always were.

Some dogs are just unpredictable.  Pit bulls, Chows and Shar Peis are among the most likely do be unpredictable.  For outright viciousness, it is the Chihuahua.  They bite first.  I would never allow a child to be around a Chihuahua.


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## NLT

Sallow said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> healthy and nonaggressive Pit Bull&#8211;type dogs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No such thing as non-agressive pit bulls.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit.
Click to expand...


I hope you remember that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.


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## G.T.

NLT said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> No such thing as non-agressive pit bulls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I hope you remeber that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.
Click to expand...


What percentage of pits have attacked a human being?


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## WinterBorn

NLT said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> No such thing as non-agressive pit bulls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I hope you remember that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.
Click to expand...


I laugh that you say "when" and not "if".    Tell us, oh great and wise seer, how did you come by such insights?


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## Katzndogz

Sallow said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't tell me what I know and I don't know.
> 
> I have a friend with 2 HUGE pits. Neither one of them is aggressive. And his intention in owning them? They were discarded by a guy who didn't think they would eat so much.
> 
> Both are sweet dogs.
Click to expand...


They are ALL sweet dogs.  Most of the time the dogs who maul or kill someone is, and was, at all times, a very sweet gentle dog.  Until they aren't any more.  After the attack, they go back to being sweet and gentle dogs.

Pit Bulls used to be called Nanny Dogs and cared for children.   What is it that would drive a normally sweet and gentle dog to a single act of mindless violence?    We don't know.  I am not one to condemn an entire breed to extinction because some have an anomaly.   Find out what caused it would be a far better method of dealing with canine violence.


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## BullKurtz

So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.


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## Connery

Katzndogz said:


> No one knows why a dog would go haywire and start attacking.  It could be something as common as something they ate.  Particularly today when the use of illicit drugs is common, a dog could get into a stash, or someone  might give the dog something as  a joke.   Sometimes the dog just goes off on its own.   If you have ever been at a shelter where dogs that have attacked people are, you would not believe they could do it.  They are as peaceful and calm as they always were.
> 
> Some dogs are just unpredictable.  Pit bulls, Chows and Shar Peis are among the most likely do be unpredictable.  *For outright viciousness, it is the Chihuahua.  They bite first.  I would never allow a child to be around a Chihuahua*.



Not always true. I have had Chis for years including when  my son was born. I have found them to be loyal and protective. If this were the pic thread I would share, a lot of love and gentle caring from these dogs to my boy. These were rescues to boot! Depends on how a person raises and treats the dogs  and how I taught my son to respect and treat them as well.


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## WinterBorn

Katzndogz said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't tell me what I know and I don't know.
> 
> I have a friend with 2 HUGE pits. Neither one of them is aggressive. And his intention in owning them? They were discarded by a guy who didn't think they would eat so much.
> 
> Both are sweet dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They are ALL sweet dogs.  Most of the time the dogs who maul or kill someone is, and was, at all times, a very sweet gentle dog.  Until they aren't any more.  After the attack, they go back to being sweet and gentle dogs.
> 
> Pit Bulls used to be called Nanny Dogs and cared for children.   What is it that would drive a normally sweet and gentle dog to a single act of mindless violence?    We don't know.  I am not one to condemn an entire breed to extinction because some have an anomaly.   Find out what caused it would be a far better method of dealing with canine violence.
Click to expand...


I think most of the problem is that people get a dog and don't give it the attention and training it needs.  They like having a dog for a few hours a week, and the rest of the time they are too busy to be bothered.  They should have gotten a goldfish.


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## NLT

My next door neighbor had a albino pit bull named igloo. He brought it home as a puppy. We played with that dog all the time, until he started getting too agressive, one day I was cooking on the grill and brought igloo a couple of hot dogs to give him over the fence, the dog just went insane and tried to get at me through the fence. I had known this dog since he was a pup. he was never abused or treated badly. My nieghbor had to take him to the pound because the dog started to scare him and his pregnant wife. I have absolutley no use for pit bulls.


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## BullKurtz

NLT said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> No such thing as non-agressive pit bulls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I hope you remember that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.
Click to expand...


I hope he does...fuckin moron needs a lesson taught...pain is a great teacher.


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## manifold

Why does everyone keep bringing up kids? The woman in the OP story is 56 years old.

And if she was stupid enough to own a pit bull then IMO there are plenty of other 'victims' I don't know in the news that are far more worthy of my sympathies.


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## NLT

WinterBorn said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope you remember that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I laugh that you say "when" and not "if".    Tell us, oh great and wise seer, how did you come by such insights?
Click to expand...


Fuck you. You can have all the pit bulls you want, and if they get near me, I will shoot them dead. No BS.


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## WinterBorn

Connery said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> No one knows why a dog would go haywire and start attacking.  It could be something as common as something they ate.  Particularly today when the use of illicit drugs is common, a dog could get into a stash, or someone  might give the dog something as  a joke.   Sometimes the dog just goes off on its own.   If you have ever been at a shelter where dogs that have attacked people are, you would not believe they could do it.  They are as peaceful and calm as they always were.
> 
> Some dogs are just unpredictable.  Pit bulls, Chows and Shar Peis are among the most likely do be unpredictable.  *For outright viciousness, it is the Chihuahua.  They bite first.  I would never allow a child to be around a Chihuahua*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not always true. I have had Chis for years including when  my son was born. I have found them to be loyal and protective. If this were the pic thread I would share, a lot of love and gentle caring from these dogs to my boy. These were rescues to boot! *Depends on how a person raises and treats the dogs  and how I taught my son to respect and treat them as well*.
Click to expand...


All breeds have different attributes and characteristics.  Chihuahuas tend to be far more high strung than many breeds.  That is a characteristic that you have to take into account when you own them.  Pits have a very high pain tolerance and very, very strong jaw muscles.  THIS means if the do attack, the results tend to me more horrific.  That tends to make the news.

I like what you said about it depending on how a person raises the dogs and treats the dogs.

I have been bitten by a dog only once.  It was a golden retriever.


----------



## G.T.

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.



You sound like an untamed pit bull.


----------



## G.T.

NLT said:


> My next door neighbor had a albino pit bull named igloo. He brought it home as a puppy. We played with that dog all the time, until he started getting too agressive, one day I was cooking on the grill and brought igloo a couple of hot dogs to give him over the fence, the dog just went insane and tried to get at me through the fence. I had known this dog since he was a pup. he was never abused or treated badly. My nieghbor had to take him to the pound because the dog started to scare him and his pregnant wife. I have absolutley no use for pit bulls.



Because of one experience?

Do you believe in math?

What percentage of pit bulls attack humans?


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight*....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you know everyone who owns a pit?   This is just bullshit based on hysteria.
> 
> Are there plenty of owners who fit your statement?   Sure.    Is it every pit owner?  No even close.  My daughter's pit is a sweet, loving dog.  My lab/basset hound mix is the alpha when they play.  Her dog is a 75lb wannabe lap dog.
> 
> Also, I am not sure why you think lifting a dog over your head shows him you are the alpha, but it is a strange idea.   Every dog I have owned gets the same treatment to show who is in charge.  I roll them on their back, put my face on their neck and growl.  I do it when they are puppies and every few years as they grow up.  I have never owned a dog that would not do what I told it to do.  The most difficult dog (as far as listening) I have owned was a Walker Coonhound.  She, like all my dogs, was a rescue.  Hunting hounds tend to be way more independent.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I know every single Pitbull owner...you idiot.  As a man becomes an adult, he forms opinions based on experience...in my experience your wonderful loving Pits are capable of MAYHEM for no reason....no other dog (with few exceptions) have that kind of short-circuit potential.  Why lift the Shepherds over my head?  From being on a LRRP team in Vietnam and having months of experience with K-9 handlers.....don't shit on what you don't know, fool....it'll bite your ass every single time.


----------



## WinterBorn

NLT said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope you remember that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I laugh that you say "when" and not "if".    Tell us, oh great and wise seer, how did you come by such insights?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fuck you. You can have all the pit bulls you want, and if they get near me, I will shoot them dead. No BS.
Click to expand...


Good enough.  My daughter's dog does not run loose.  When I walk him he is on a leash.  If you happen to be on the sidewalk or in the park where we are, it would be best if you contain your irrational fear and not pull a weapon on the dog.  Trust me when I tell you that he is not the one you should fear if you attack us.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> *No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight*....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you know everyone who owns a pit?   This is just bullshit based on hysteria.
> 
> Are there plenty of owners who fit your statement?   Sure.    Is it every pit owner?  No even close.  My daughter's pit is a sweet, loving dog.  My lab/basset hound mix is the alpha when they play.  Her dog is a 75lb wannabe lap dog.
> 
> Also, I am not sure why you think lifting a dog over your head shows him you are the alpha, but it is a strange idea.   Every dog I have owned gets the same treatment to show who is in charge.  I roll them on their back, put my face on their neck and growl.  I do it when they are puppies and every few years as they grow up.  I have never owned a dog that would not do what I told it to do.  The most difficult dog (as far as listening) I have owned was a Walker Coonhound.  She, like all my dogs, was a rescue.  Hunting hounds tend to be way more independent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, I know every single Pitbull owner...you idiot.  As a man becomes an adult, he forms opinions based on experience...in my experience your wonderful loving Pits are capable of MAYHEM for no reason....no other dog (with few exceptions) have that kind of short-circuit potential.  Why lift the Shepherds over my head?  From being on a LRRP team in Vietnam and having months of experience with K-9 handlers.....don't shit on what you don't know, fool....it'll bite your ass every single time.
Click to expand...


I don't shit on what I don't know.  5 years of working with one of the best canine training facilities in the US taught me plenty.

But don't get pissy when your bullshit is called out.  There are millions of pit bulls in the US and the overwhelming majority never cause any "mayhem".   Using sensationalistic press releases as evidence of an entire breed shows your "knowledge".


----------



## Esmeralda

mal said:


> Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post
> 
> A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...
> 
> *What gives?...*
> 
> 
> peace...



~Exactly. What is wrong with people. I cannot understand why anyone would want to have such a dog and why people defend them. I've read quite a few threads in other forums discussing this, and some people go on endlessly defending these aniamls, despite the constant reports of their vicious, usually deadly attacks.  The people even try to say that such dogs as labradors and golden retrievers are just as dangerous, though they have always been known to be docile and gentle, totally unlike pitbulls. I think only sick, paranoid people own dogs that are bred to be attack dogs, guard dogs and the like. What does a normal, average family need an attack dog for?


----------



## BullKurtz

G.T. said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You sound like an untamed pit bull.
Click to expand...


I notice the kid in the pic has the footprint of the American chicken on his shirt....


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You sound like an untamed pit bull.
Click to expand...


His flair for dramatics aside he's not wrong.

I came quickly around a corner once and met face to face with a german shepherd out for a jog with it's owner. The dog lunged at me and I kicked it as hard as I could right under the jaw and sent it yelping ass over tea kettle. I understand that it viewed me as a threat to it's owner and acted on instinct, but then again so did I. That didn't stop the owner from reading me the riot act. I told her I was sorry but I'd do it every time.


----------



## Connery

manifold said:


> Why does everyone keep bringing up kids? The woman in the OP story is 56 years old.
> 
> And if she was stupid enough to own a pit bull then IMO there are plenty of other 'victims' I don't know in the news that are far more worthy of my sympathies.



Because that is an aspect of having a dog and living in area that has kids.  Kids are my focus on this issue as well as others.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> What percentage of pit bulls attack humans?



It's not just about the likelihood of an attack, it's also about how much damage is inflicted when they do.

Case in point: The story in the OP.


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you know everyone who owns a pit?   This is just bullshit based on hysteria.
> 
> Are there plenty of owners who fit your statement?   Sure.    Is it every pit owner?  No even close.  My daughter's pit is a sweet, loving dog.  My lab/basset hound mix is the alpha when they play.  Her dog is a 75lb wannabe lap dog.
> 
> Also, I am not sure why you think lifting a dog over your head shows him you are the alpha, but it is a strange idea.   Every dog I have owned gets the same treatment to show who is in charge.  I roll them on their back, put my face on their neck and growl.  I do it when they are puppies and every few years as they grow up.  I have never owned a dog that would not do what I told it to do.  The most difficult dog (as far as listening) I have owned was a Walker Coonhound.  She, like all my dogs, was a rescue.  Hunting hounds tend to be way more independent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I know every single Pitbull owner...you idiot.  As a man becomes an adult, he forms opinions based on experience...in my experience your wonderful loving Pits are capable of MAYHEM for no reason....no other dog (with few exceptions) have that kind of short-circuit potential.  Why lift the Shepherds over my head?  From being on a LRRP team in Vietnam and having months of experience with K-9 handlers.....don't shit on what you don't know, fool....it'll bite your ass every single time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't shit on what I don't know.  5 years of working with one of the best canine training facilities in the US taught me plenty.
> 
> But don't get pissy when your bullshit is called out.  There are millions of pit bulls in the US and the overwhelming majority never cause any "mayhem".   Using sensationalistic press releases as evidence of an entire breed shows your "knowledge".
Click to expand...


"pissy"?  Listen Alice....you have no idea what a LRRP dog is trained to do, loves doing, and is quite adept at doing.  You're a civilian...you think this is all one big AKA discussion about "tendencies"....fuck that.  You got manhood problems....that's for sure, and no dog can solve that for you....I suggest you stick with cats...more your speed, Alice.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.



One of the best places to go foro n a dog that is attacking you is their feet.  Granted, this assumes you will be  bitten, but when you are being attacked a few bites are going to happen.

Stay on your feet.  Keep facing the dog. Make noise and try to look as big as possible.  Any weapon is a plus.


----------



## Connery

WinterBorn said:


> Connery said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> No one knows why a dog would go haywire and start attacking.  It could be something as common as something they ate.  Particularly today when the use of illicit drugs is common, a dog could get into a stash, or someone  might give the dog something as  a joke.   Sometimes the dog just goes off on its own.   If you have ever been at a shelter where dogs that have attacked people are, you would not believe they could do it.  They are as peaceful and calm as they always were.
> 
> Some dogs are just unpredictable.  Pit bulls, Chows and Shar Peis are among the most likely do be unpredictable.  *For outright viciousness, it is the Chihuahua.  They bite first.  I would never allow a child to be around a Chihuahua*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not always true. I have had Chis for years including when  my son was born. I have found them to be loyal and protective. If this were the pic thread I would share, a lot of love and gentle caring from these dogs to my boy. These were rescues to boot! *Depends on how a person raises and treats the dogs  and how I taught my son to respect and treat them as well*.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> All breeds have different attributes and characteristics.  *Chihuahuas tend to be far more high strung than many breeds*.  That is a characteristic that you have to take into account when you own them.  Pits have a very high pain tolerance and very, very strong jaw muscles.  THIS means if the do attack, the results tend to me more horrific.  That tends to make the news.
> 
> I like what you said about it depending on how a person raises the dogs and treats the dogs.
> 
> I have been bitten by a dog only once.  It was a golden retriever.
Click to expand...


They are high strung and rescues need more care and attention then non-rescues . All these factors must be weighed when considering a pet. There is no one set formula when deciding.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I know every single Pitbull owner...you idiot.  As a man becomes an adult, he forms opinions based on experience...in my experience your wonderful loving Pits are capable of MAYHEM for no reason....no other dog (with few exceptions) have that kind of short-circuit potential.  Why lift the Shepherds over my head?  From being on a LRRP team in Vietnam and having months of experience with K-9 handlers.....don't shit on what you don't know, fool....it'll bite your ass every single time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't shit on what I don't know.  5 years of working with one of the best canine training facilities in the US taught me plenty.
> 
> But don't get pissy when your bullshit is called out.  There are millions of pit bulls in the US and the overwhelming majority never cause any "mayhem".   Using sensationalistic press releases as evidence of an entire breed shows your "knowledge".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "pissy"?  Listen Alice....you have no idea what a LRRP dog is trained to do, loves doing, and is quite adapt at doing.  You're a civilian...you think this is all one big AKA discussion about "tendencies"....fuck that.  You got manhood problems....that's for sure, and no dog can solve that for you....I suggest you stick with cats...more your speed, Alice.
Click to expand...


You assume a lot, don't you Sally?  It is not about proving my manhood. If you need to prove it you ain't got it. And I know full well what a LRRP dog is trained to do.  I also know what all canines respond to, and that is just what I stated.  

I'll stick with my dogs.  But I will also always be in control of them and I will have them as pets not as protection.  I am better protection for my home than a dog ever could be.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> What percentage of pit bulls attack humans?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not just about the likelihood of an attack, it's also about how much damage is inflicted when they do.
> 
> Case in point: The story in the OP.
Click to expand...


I think it's about the likelihood of an attack. 

You can say the same with anything that causes great damage, like a gun for instance. The amount of harm it can cause shouldn't be the sole reason when deciding if it is or is not ok to have around. 

I could change my mind about pit bulls though, if anyone knows that percentage. 

I'm of the school at any dogs are cool with me, except around my daughter or young children. That's where the level of trust ends.


----------



## manifold

Connery said:


> They are high strung and rescues need more care and attention then non-rescues . All these factors must be weighed when considering a pet. *There is no one set formula when deciding.*



Agreed.

But every variation of the formula for me says Pit bull = non-starter.


----------



## WinterBorn

manifold said:


> Connery said:
> 
> 
> 
> They are high strung and rescues need more care and attention then non-rescues . All these factors must be weighed when considering a pet. *There is no one set formula when deciding.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agreed.
> 
> But every variation of the formula for me says Pit bull = non-starter.
Click to expand...


While I do not agree with condemning the entire breed for the actions of the few, I do (As I stated near the beginning of this thread) think a pit requires more from the owner.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> What percentage of pit bulls attack humans?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not just about the likelihood of an attack, it's also about how much damage is inflicted when they do.
> 
> Case in point: The story in the OP.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think it's about the likelihood of an attack.
> 
> You can say the same with anything that causes great damage, like a gun for instance. The amount of harm it can cause shouldn't be the sole reason when deciding if it is or is not ok to have around.
> 
> I could change my mind about pit bulls though, if anyone knows that percentage.
> 
> I'm of the school at any dogs are cool with me, except around my daughter or young children. That's where the level of trust ends.
Click to expand...


This is about dogs, not guns. And to dismiss the amount of damage inflicted when a dog snaps is foolish.  <<- Massive understatement

If this woman owned a collie that snapped, she'd still have both arms.


----------



## Katzndogz

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.



If you are attacked by a normally sweet and gentle dog, you are in the fight of your life and you will probably lose.

There is no difference between a sweet and gentle dog who, for some reason, just goes off and that helpful and caring father who shoots up an office building.   

I always carry a knife too, that I can open with one hand.  I have a Boker Kalishnakov automatic.  One button.    

One thing to keep in mind about dog attacks is, they aren't like what you think they are like.  A dog in attack mode is incredibly fast, like lightening.  A dog attack is measured in seconds.   As far as grabbing the collar of a pit bull and pulling them off, it won't work, not with pit bulls.   They have incredibly strong neck muscles and won't even notice.  Since they don't let go, a tractor pulling the dog off you, will probably drag you along for the ride.  You might imagine that you could lift a pit bull with one hand and leave its paws dangling in the air, but your imagination is as far as that will go.   You best chance is the knife, if you can get to it.

In this case, the dog was already observed to be acting aggressively.   Normally sweet and gentle dogs do not act aggressively without any cause.   If I were there, I'd be looking at the son to see if he left any of his personal drugs lying around.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's not just about the likelihood of an attack, it's also about how much damage is inflicted when they do.
> 
> Case in point: The story in the OP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it's about the likelihood of an attack.
> 
> You can say the same with anything that causes great damage, like a gun for instance. The amount of harm it can cause shouldn't be the sole reason when deciding if it is or is not ok to have around.
> 
> I could change my mind about pit bulls though, if anyone knows that percentage.
> 
> I'm of the school at any dogs are cool with me, except around my daughter or young children. That's where the level of trust ends.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is about dogs, not guns. And to dismiss the amount of damage inflicted when a dog snaps is foolish.  <<- Massive understatement
> 
> If this woman owned a collie that snapped, she'd still have both arms.
Click to expand...


It's foolish to dismiss the dogs as being great pets based on anecdotes. That's why numbers matter.


----------



## Esmeralda

Luddly Neddite said:


> Linked from the OP -
> 
> Nick Santino Commits Suicide After Euthanizing Dog
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Last week, soap opera actor Nick Santino euthanized his beloved five-year-old Pit Bull, Rocco  a decision that he said was forced on him by his New York condo board, which has a policy that bans residents from owning the breed.
> 
> Just hours later, Santino took his own life, writing that he had betrayed his best friend, reported the NY Post. Rocco trusted me, and I failed him. He didnt deserve this.
> 
> A board member told the newspaper that Santinos death had nothing to do with the pet policy. Apparently, the dog had been grandfathered in and wasn't subject to the policy, but Santino claimed that he'd been harassed about the dog by members of the board.
> Punishing a Much Maligned Breed
> 
> Santinos actions of euthanizing a healthy dog and then committing suicide may be hard for many people to understand, but bans of so-called "dangerous breeds" often leave owners of healthy and nonaggressive Pit Bulltype dogs in heartbreaking situations.
Click to expand...


What this suggests is that Santino was someone with issues of his own. First, just because the condo board doesn't allow pets, it doesn't mean he has to kill it. He could have found a good home for it.  Committing suicide because he euthanized a dog that didn't even need to be euthanized?  Really an unstable guy.  Dangerous breeds should be kept away from the general public. Average people do not need those kinds of dogs: Rottweilers, pit bulls, Dobermans...they are meant for something other than being a family pet and living among people in town and city conditions, in areas where there are vulnerable people and children.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think it's about the likelihood of an attack.
> 
> You can say the same with anything that causes great damage, like a gun for instance. The amount of harm it can cause shouldn't be the sole reason when deciding if it is or is not ok to have around.
> 
> I could change my mind about pit bulls though, if anyone knows that percentage.
> 
> I'm of the school at any dogs are cool with me, except around my daughter or young children. That's where the level of trust ends.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is about dogs, not guns. And to dismiss the amount of damage inflicted when a dog snaps is foolish.  <<- Massive understatement
> 
> If this woman owned a collie that snapped, she'd still have both arms.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's foolish to dismiss the dogs as being great pets based on anecdotes. That's why numbers matter.
Click to expand...


Fine. But you still need to find a way to quantify the damage, otherwise your analysis is woefully incomplete.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is about dogs, not guns. And to dismiss the amount of damage inflicted when a dog snaps is foolish.  <<- Massive understatement
> 
> If this woman owned a collie that snapped, she'd still have both arms.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's foolish to dismiss the dogs as being great pets based on anecdotes. That's why numbers matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fine. But you still need to find a way to quantify the damage, otherwise your analysis is woefully incomplete.
Click to expand...


We can call it death. 

And it's still worth it if the number of attacking pit bulls versus the number of domesticated pit bulls warrants it. It still wouldn't be irrational to own one, depending on those numbers which I wish were around somewhere. 

Like - I like roller coasters. There's a teeny percent chance I could die every time I ride one. But the risk vs. reward based on the numbers is simple math. The odds are juuuUUUuuUUUst about zero. 

It could be the same with owning a pit bull.


----------



## Esmeralda

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> My wife and I was was attacked at a car lot by a rottwiler, both of us were bit multible times, mine required stitches, luckily the owner of the dog was there to pull him off me. Off course he said he was surpised that the dog attacked . the dog never barked once. Then we found out that the dog did not have its rabie shots up to date and had attacked two other people. We had to sue the owner for the emergency room bills. The dog was finally put down by the owner, he could not afford any more law suits.
> 
> I have absolutley no use for Rottwilers, Pit bulls, chows and other agreesive breeds. If they come onto to my prperty or threaten me or mine in anyway, I will shoot them down. Take that to the bank.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got a pal who was a mailman for 20 years....got attacked by two dobermans....they were literally ripping him apart....he shit himself it was so bad...luckily he kept his feet under him and his chin on his chest to take the bites in the face instead of his throat.  Once again, the owner claimed they were "sweet babies who'd never done anything like that before"....he got a settlement of over $200K and the scars to prove it....they bit his junk so many times he can't perform for his wife anymore.  The owner was cited, paid a small fine and agreed to have the beasts put down...that's it.  The insurance paid the settlement and the owner later had two new doberman pups in his yard.
Click to expand...


Yep, that's what you hear all the time, they are so sweet and good natured, and then they do things like this.  Such dog breeds should not be allowed to live witin average communities.  I would not live near anyone who had a pit-bull, Doberman or Rottweiler.  First, I think people who own these kinds of animals have serious personal issues, and second, I would know I, my family, and my pets would all be at risk because of these animals.


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't shit on what I don't know.  5 years of working with one of the best canine training facilities in the US taught me plenty.
> 
> But don't get pissy when your bullshit is called out.  There are millions of pit bulls in the US and the overwhelming majority never cause any "mayhem".   Using sensationalistic press releases as evidence of an entire breed shows your "knowledge".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "pissy"?  Listen Alice....you have no idea what a LRRP dog is trained to do, loves doing, and is quite adapt at doing.  You're a civilian...you think this is all one big AKA discussion about "tendencies"....fuck that.  You got manhood problems....that's for sure, and no dog can solve that for you....I suggest you stick with cats...more your speed, Alice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You assume a lot, don't you Sally?  It is not about proving my manhood. If you need to prove it you ain't got it. And I know full well what a LRRP dog is trained to do.  I also know what all canines respond to, and that is just what I stated.
> 
> I'll stick with my dogs.  But I will also always be in control of them and I will have them as pets not as protection.  I am better protection for my home than a dog ever could be.
Click to expand...


You came out of a bag at me, Alice....you want to get rough, here I am...but understand you don't know shit about how to keep control of a dog who's trained to kill...not restrain, not incapacitate....kill.  Military K-9 teams don't operate like your local police SWAT units do...these are dogs you must constantly physically dominate...picking them up over your head is SOP....now you know and don't have to sound stupid next time.  Damn.....stick your face on the pup's neck and growl?    Run along, Alice...this thread might just save somebody's ass if you'd stop butting in.


----------



## WinterBorn

Here is some excellent info concerning pits:

from:Pit Bulls by the Numbers : StubbyDog

According to the CDC, pits are not the terror people think.   I trust the CDC over the anecdotal evidence and sensationalistic news media.

From the linked website:
"What&#8217;s the take home message of all this? It&#8217;s important to question statistics related to how many pit bulls there are in the United States and how often they bite for all the reasons listed above. And, if you&#8217;re in need of some positive statistics, consider this: Temperament evaluations by the American Temperament Test Society give American Pit Bull Terriers an extremely high passing rate of 82.6 percent. The average passing rate for the other 121 breeds of dogs tested was 77 percent. Pit bulls share their homes with all types of people &#8211; from celebrities to senators to everyday families like you and me. They work as search and rescue dogs, therapy dogs and service dogs, and they are our faithful companions and best friends."


----------



## G.T.

Just thumbing through some stats - pit bulls are by far the most dangerous dogs and account for the most attacks. 

I still cant find the % of pit bulls who actually end up attacking though.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> "pissy"?  Listen Alice....you have no idea what a LRRP dog is trained to do, loves doing, and is quite adapt at doing.  You're a civilian...you think this is all one big AKA discussion about "tendencies"....fuck that.  You got manhood problems....that's for sure, and no dog can solve that for you....I suggest you stick with cats...more your speed, Alice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You assume a lot, don't you Sally?  It is not about proving my manhood. If you need to prove it you ain't got it. And I know full well what a LRRP dog is trained to do.  I also know what all canines respond to, and that is just what I stated.
> 
> I'll stick with my dogs.  But I will also always be in control of them and I will have them as pets not as protection.  I am better protection for my home than a dog ever could be.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You came out of a bag at me, Alice....you want to get rough, here I am...but understand you don't know shit about how to keep control of a dog who's trained to kill...not restrain, not incapacitate....kill.  Military K-9 teams don't operate like your local police SWAT units do...these are dogs you must constantly physically dominate...picking them up over your head is SOP....now you know and don't have to sound stupid next time.  Damn.....stick your face on the pup's neck and growl?    Run along, Alice...this thread might just save somebody's ass if you'd stop butting in.
Click to expand...


I came out of a bag at you because of your statement condemning all pit bulls.  That is pure bullshit.  Generalizations like that typically are.

As for the face in the neck and growling, that is what canines do to establish dominance. Every dog on the planet understands that.  It is based on their instincts. How an attack dog is handled is completely different.  If we had been discussing how you handle a dog that is trained to kill and is always aggressive, you are the expert.  But we weren't.  We were discussing pets in average homes.


----------



## BullKurtz

Katzndogz said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are attacked by a normally sweet and gentle dog, you are in the fight of your life and you will probably lose.
> 
> There is no difference between a sweet and gentle dog who, for some reason, just goes off and that helpful and caring father who shoots up an office building.
> 
> I always carry a knife too, that I can open with one hand.  I have a Boker Kalishnakov automatic.  One button.
> 
> One thing to keep in mind about dog attacks is, they aren't like what you think they are like.  A dog in attack mode is incredibly fast, like lightening.  A dog attack is measured in seconds.   As far as grabbing the collar of a pit bull and pulling them off, it won't work, not with pit bulls.   They have incredibly strong neck muscles and won't even notice.  Since they don't let go, a tractor pulling the dog off you, will probably drag you along for the ride.  You might imagine that you could lift a pit bull with one hand and leave its paws dangling in the air, but your imagination is as far as that will go.   You best chance is the knife, if you can get to it.
> 
> In this case, the dog was already observed to be acting aggressively.   Normally sweet and gentle dogs do not act aggressively without any cause.   If I were there, I'd be looking at the son to see if he left any of his personal drugs lying around.
Click to expand...


Good grief....everybody is an expert eh?   Suffice to say, I've been trained how to fight a dog, have fought a dog, have done exactly as I wrote, and won the fight.  Let's get real here....I don't need any amateur advice and neither do the readers.  What I've said so far is far from the only advice I have should you encounter a menacing dog.  Suffice to say, fighting a dog requires ONE technique that almost always works...if you have 3 or 4, you'll probably freeze doing nothing....I told you mine.  I don't try to kick a dog.  I don't try to yell, stand tall, wave my arms, or do the Bugaloo.....And if one reader here is paying attention, they won't have to feel completely helpless should they be attacked...that's what I'm about in this thread.


----------



## Esmeralda

Katzndogz said:


> No one knows why a dog would go haywire and start attacking.  It could be something as common as something they ate.  Particularly today when the use of illicit drugs is common, a dog could get into a stash, or someone  might give the dog something as  a joke.   Sometimes the dog just goes off on its own.   If you have ever been at a shelter where dogs that have attacked people are, you would not believe they could do it.  They are as peaceful and calm as they always were.
> 
> Some dogs are just unpredictable.  Pit bulls, Chows and Shar Peis are among the most likely do be unpredictable.  For outright viciousness, it is the Chihuahua.  They bite first.  I would never allow a child to be around a Chihuahua.



Chihuahuas may bite, but they don't kill.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are attacked by a normally sweet and gentle dog, you are in the fight of your life and you will probably lose.
> 
> There is no difference between a sweet and gentle dog who, for some reason, just goes off and that helpful and caring father who shoots up an office building.
> 
> I always carry a knife too, that I can open with one hand.  I have a Boker Kalishnakov automatic.  One button.
> 
> One thing to keep in mind about dog attacks is, they aren't like what you think they are like.  A dog in attack mode is incredibly fast, like lightening.  A dog attack is measured in seconds.   As far as grabbing the collar of a pit bull and pulling them off, it won't work, not with pit bulls.   They have incredibly strong neck muscles and won't even notice.  Since they don't let go, a tractor pulling the dog off you, will probably drag you along for the ride.  You might imagine that you could lift a pit bull with one hand and leave its paws dangling in the air, but your imagination is as far as that will go.   You best chance is the knife, if you can get to it.
> 
> In this case, the dog was already observed to be acting aggressively.   Normally sweet and gentle dogs do not act aggressively without any cause.   If I were there, I'd be looking at the son to see if he left any of his personal drugs lying around.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Good grief....everybody is an expert eh?   Suffice to say, I've been trained how to fight a dog, have fought a dog, have done exactly as I wrote, and won the fight.  Let's get real here....I don't need any amateur advice and neither do the readers.  What I've said so far is far from the only advice I have should you encounter a menacing dog.  Suffice to say, fighting a dog requires ONE technique that almost always works...if you have 3 or 4, you'll probably freeze doing nothing....I told you mine.  I don't try to kick a dog.  I don't try to yell, stand tall, wave my arms, or do the Bugaloo.....And if one reader here is paying attention, they won't have to feel completely helpless should they be attacked...that's what I'm about in this thread.
Click to expand...


Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?

Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?


----------



## BullKurtz

G.T. said:


> Just thumbing through some stats - pit bulls are by far the most dangerous dogs and account for the most attacks.
> 
> I still cant find the % of pit bulls who actually end up attacking though.



Doh!


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you are attacked by a normally sweet and gentle dog, you are in the fight of your life and you will probably lose.
> 
> There is no difference between a sweet and gentle dog who, for some reason, just goes off and that helpful and caring father who shoots up an office building.
> 
> I always carry a knife too, that I can open with one hand.  I have a Boker Kalishnakov automatic.  One button.
> 
> One thing to keep in mind about dog attacks is, they aren't like what you think they are like.  A dog in attack mode is incredibly fast, like lightening.  A dog attack is measured in seconds.   As far as grabbing the collar of a pit bull and pulling them off, it won't work, not with pit bulls.   They have incredibly strong neck muscles and won't even notice.  Since they don't let go, a tractor pulling the dog off you, will probably drag you along for the ride.  You might imagine that you could lift a pit bull with one hand and leave its paws dangling in the air, but your imagination is as far as that will go.   You best chance is the knife, if you can get to it.
> 
> In this case, the dog was already observed to be acting aggressively.   Normally sweet and gentle dogs do not act aggressively without any cause.   If I were there, I'd be looking at the son to see if he left any of his personal drugs lying around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good grief....everybody is an expert eh?   Suffice to say, I've been trained how to fight a dog, have fought a dog, have done exactly as I wrote, and won the fight.  Let's get real here....I don't need any amateur advice and neither do the readers.  What I've said so far is far from the only advice I have should you encounter a menacing dog.  Suffice to say, fighting a dog requires ONE technique that almost always works...if you have 3 or 4, you'll probably freeze doing nothing....I told you mine.  I don't try to kick a dog.  I don't try to yell, stand tall, wave my arms, or do the Bugaloo.....And if one reader here is paying attention, they won't have to feel completely helpless should they be attacked...that's what I'm about in this thread.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
Click to expand...


How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.

Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip....even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.


----------



## G.T.

You're a complete tool, dude.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.



You are one sicko pup yourself. I suspect you're lying but if you really are going around stabbing dogs to death, I hope you get caught and go to jail for a long time because you're just not wrapped too tight. 

Having said that, people know there are nutters like you running loose. There are nutters who kill cats just to be killing cats. Sickos like you. 

The responsibility lies with the owner to keep their dogs behind a fence or in a yard and their cats inside their home.


----------



## Katzndogz

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are attacked by a normally sweet and gentle dog, you are in the fight of your life and you will probably lose.
> 
> There is no difference between a sweet and gentle dog who, for some reason, just goes off and that helpful and caring father who shoots up an office building.
> 
> I always carry a knife too, that I can open with one hand.  I have a Boker Kalishnakov automatic.  One button.
> 
> One thing to keep in mind about dog attacks is, they aren't like what you think they are like.  A dog in attack mode is incredibly fast, like lightening.  A dog attack is measured in seconds.   As far as grabbing the collar of a pit bull and pulling them off, it won't work, not with pit bulls.   They have incredibly strong neck muscles and won't even notice.  Since they don't let go, a tractor pulling the dog off you, will probably drag you along for the ride.  You might imagine that you could lift a pit bull with one hand and leave its paws dangling in the air, but your imagination is as far as that will go.   You best chance is the knife, if you can get to it.
> 
> In this case, the dog was already observed to be acting aggressively.   Normally sweet and gentle dogs do not act aggressively without any cause.   If I were there, I'd be looking at the son to see if he left any of his personal drugs lying around.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Good grief....everybody is an expert eh?   Suffice to say, I've been trained how to fight a dog, have fought a dog, have done exactly as I wrote, and won the fight.  Let's get real here....I don't need any amateur advice and neither do the readers.  What I've said so far is far from the only advice I have should you encounter a menacing dog.  Suffice to say, fighting a dog requires ONE technique that almost always works...if you have 3 or 4, you'll probably freeze doing nothing....I told you mine.  I don't try to kick a dog.  I don't try to yell, stand tall, wave my arms, or do the Bugaloo.....And if one reader here is paying attention, they won't have to feel completely helpless should they be attacked...that's what I'm about in this thread.
Click to expand...


I'm not an amateur.  I am a pet care professional who has received training in pet care.  A pet dog, a family dog is NOT TRAINED to fight anyone.   For whatever reason, they simply go off.  They do it suddenly, most of the time not even acting in a menacing manner.    They are very fast, since a random attack is not part of a training exercise, the victim is caught totally unaware and as easily taken as the victims of the "trained" Ft. Hood victims were when attacked by Nidal Hassan.   If you want to only use trained combat fighters, a dog attack is as sudden  and unknown as an insider attack in Fallujah.  

If you are confronted by a menacing dog, you can act.  You can act only because the dog has not yet made up its mind.  It is menacing, thinking about it, wondering what you will do.  A dog in sudden attack is not contemplating what you will do.  It merely attacks, and very very quickly.

Waving your arms and standing tall is used for bears, it doesn't work on dogs.   In Los Angeles, we hear that every day, since we have both bears and coyotes.   People have to be continually reminded that standing tall and waving arms doesn't work on coyotes.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Esmeralda said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> No one knows why a dog would go haywire and start attacking.  It could be something as common as something they ate.  Particularly today when the use of illicit drugs is common, a dog could get into a stash, or someone  might give the dog something as  a joke.   Sometimes the dog just goes off on its own.   If you have ever been at a shelter where dogs that have attacked people are, you would not believe they could do it.  They are as peaceful and calm as they always were.
> 
> Some dogs are just unpredictable.  Pit bulls, Chows and Shar Peis are among the most likely do be unpredictable.  For outright viciousness, it is the Chihuahua.  They bite first.  I would never allow a child to be around a Chihuahua.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Chihuahuas may bite, but they don't kill.
Click to expand...


They're usually on the other end of attacks.

Two pit bulls euthanized after killing Chihuahua in attack in Harrisburg, police say | PennLive.com



> Two pit bulls were euthanized Thursday after they attacked and killed a 10-year-old Chihuahua in Harrisburg, according to city police.
> 
> A police officer also fired two gunshots at the pit bulls and injured one after the dogs were seen acting aggressively, according to police. The dogs were eventually seized in the 1600 block of North 4th Street.
> 
> The incident started around 4:11 a.m. The dogs freed themselves from their yard and entered a neighbor's yard in the 300 block of Hamilton Street.



Its humans who have ruined the pit breed. The worst thing that can happen to a dog breed is to become popular. Back yard breeders think they'll make easy money off the back of the latest fad breed and end up wrecking the breed. So called "reputable" breeders are just as bad. They breed to a "standard" that has nothing to do with what's best for the breed or the people they sell their puppies to.


----------



## Sallow

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope you remember that when your face is chewed off by your sweet loving puppy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I hope he does...fuckin moron needs a lesson taught...pain is a great teacher.
Click to expand...




You haven't walked in my shoes..and I haven't walked in yours.

I ain't making any assumptions about you.

You are showing your stupidity by telling me how to walk in my shoes, or making guesses about where I've traveled, ace.


----------



## Katzndogz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> So what do you do if you're about to set upon by a dog intent on fucking you up?  Depends on the circumstances, surroundings, and dog of course.  Nobody should have to take the bites waiting for the owner (if they're present) to stop it.   You have every right to do grievous harm to a dog intent on doing grievous harm to you regardless of the circustances.  It's best to keep your self-interest in mind when you're most vulnerable...like out for a run or riding a bicycle.  I always carry a knife I can open with one hand...should I need it, I will and have used it.  Most dogs are stupid....wag your cap at them and when they clamp down on it, you attack....you only have one shot because the cap ain't the taste they're after.  Most dogs have a collar on....grab em by the collar and lift them off the ground....now the fucker is at your mercy....you can take it to water and drown it, throw it over a fence, or punch the shit out it with it's paws dangling in the air.....I'll run my blade through one of it's eyes and scramble it's brains....if the owner is watching, more the better.  My friends tend to put Rover away when Kurtz comes around.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One of the best places to go foro n a dog that is attacking you is their feet.  Granted, this assumes you will be  bitten, but when you are being attacked a few bites are going to happen.
> 
> Stay on your feet.  Keep facing the dog. Make noise and try to look as big as possible.  Any weapon is a plus.
Click to expand...


Trying to look as big as possible doesn't work on dogs.   Dogs are not intimidated by size, they just adjust their attack.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

But, chihuahua's do get shot -

Chihuahua fatally shot, cops say neighbor felt dog was attacking - Fox 2 News Headlines



> DETROIT (WJBK) -
> 
> A 14-year-old says her Chihuahua, named JoJo, was shot and killed by a neighbor Tuesday afternoon on Asbury Park on Detroit's west side.
> 
> The teen said she let her one-year-old dog out, then went inside.  When she came back out, her neighbor told her to put her dog in the house.
> 
> "When he saw my dog running out of the bushes, [he said], 'I'm going to handle him myself,' and then I guess my dog had run back up on him again, and he just shot him," the owner explained.
> 
> However, the neighbor has a license to carry, and police say he told them he felt he was being attacked by the dog that wasn't on a leash.
> 
> "[He] couldn't have [felt] threatened at all by this little Chihuahua," said the dog's owner.  "[The] dog is not big at all."
> 
> Read more: Chihuahua fatally shot, cops say neighbor felt dog was attacking - Fox 2 News Headlines



The teenage owner should be glad this dunderhead didn't shoot her as well. But, the dog should have been leashed.


----------



## BullKurtz

Luddly Neddite said:


> . I suspect you're lying but if you really are going around stabbing dogs to death, I hope you get caught and go to jail for a long time because you're just not wrapped too tight.
> 
> Having said that, people know there are nutters like you running loose. There are nutters who kill cats just to be killing cats. Sickos like you.
> 
> The responsibility lies with the owner to keep their dogs behind a fence or in a yard and their cats inside their home.



  Never killed a cat although I once faced down a mountain lion up in the Superstitions....I could have just shot it but that would have put the DNR bleeding hearts on my trail so I just moved out of the path he was on and he boogied on.....you never want to bend over if it's a cougar....even if you've dropped your weapon...that's a prey-trigger....they'll jump you in a heartbeat....but back to dogs, especially the German breeds....avoid eye-contact with a menacing dog.....same as fighting a human....keep your focus on the chest...that moves, REACT but not until that moves.....some dogs, like goldies and collies like to growl and fake-charge but really have no idea what to do next.....I won't harm a moron dog.....don't turn your back on a German Shepherd...they're known to let you pass and grab you from behind.


----------



## Sallow

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good grief....everybody is an expert eh?   Suffice to say, I've been trained how to fight a dog, have fought a dog, have done exactly as I wrote, and won the fight.  Let's get real here....I don't need any amateur advice and neither do the readers.  What I've said so far is far from the only advice I have should you encounter a menacing dog.  Suffice to say, fighting a dog requires ONE technique that almost always works...if you have 3 or 4, you'll probably freeze doing nothing....I told you mine.  I don't try to kick a dog.  I don't try to yell, stand tall, wave my arms, or do the Bugaloo.....And if one reader here is paying attention, they won't have to feel completely helpless should they be attacked...that's what I'm about in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip...*.even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move*.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
Click to expand...


Dude.

"Plot your next move"?

Have you ever been in a real fight?

Seriously?


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Sallow said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip...*.even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move*.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude.
> 
> "Plot your next move"?
> 
> Have you ever been in a real fight?
> 
> Seriously?
Click to expand...


"a minute or two"? 

He's just another blowhard who mixed a few facts in with his tall tales (facing down a mountain lion). I're read other things he's written and thought he was lying.

I wouldn't want to leave him alone with children.


----------



## BullKurtz

Sallow said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip...*.even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move*.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude.
> 
> "Plot your next move"?
> 
> Have you ever been in a real fight?
> 
> Seriously?
Click to expand...


Dood?  seriously?  I first named you "swallow" long ago....it's a pity you've forgotten how tangling with me and Kurtz ends up for you.  I couldn't care less what you believe or don't believe...this ain't a who's got a bigger dick contest....If this were a matter of notches on my gun barrel, I'd have needed a new barrel many times over....ya get me?


----------



## BullKurtz

Luddly Neddite said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip...*.even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move*.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude.
> 
> "Plot your next move"?
> 
> Have you ever been in a real fight?
> 
> Seriously?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "a minute or two"?
> 
> He's just another blowhard who mixed a few facts in with his tall tales (facing down a mountain lion). I're read other things he's written and thought he was lying.
> 
> I wouldn't want to leave him alone with children.
Click to expand...


Now now Cuddly....don't PMS all over yourself....I know I frighten you...not my intention but I can't be somebody I ain't now can I?  

BTW...the "minute or two" reference is relating to a large struggling dog you'll holding in the air by one arm....planting the elbow on the hip increases your mechanical advantage....look it up, try not to appear braindead.....wait, you're a leftist.....nevermind.


----------



## Katzndogz

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good grief....everybody is an expert eh?   Suffice to say, I've been trained how to fight a dog, have fought a dog, have done exactly as I wrote, and won the fight.  Let's get real here....I don't need any amateur advice and neither do the readers.  What I've said so far is far from the only advice I have should you encounter a menacing dog.  Suffice to say, fighting a dog requires ONE technique that almost always works...if you have 3 or 4, you'll probably freeze doing nothing....I told you mine.  I don't try to kick a dog.  I don't try to yell, stand tall, wave my arms, or do the Bugaloo.....And if one reader here is paying attention, they won't have to feel completely helpless should they be attacked...that's what I'm about in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip....even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
Click to expand...


If you are fighting a 40 pound pit bull, you are dealing with a puppy.  At 4 months, a healthy pit bull will weight about 55 pounds.  A full grown Pit will weigh 110 to 120 pounds.   The American Staffordshire Terrier is somewhat smaller and will weigh 75 to 80 pounds full grown.   Now it might be attractive to imagine that you could lift that weight of fighting dog with one hand, it might happen in the movies, but in real life, not so much.   As far as flinging it out in traffic, there's no real dealing with that idea.  

Pits are incredibly strong.   Pit bulls have been known to pull 5,000 pounds of dead weight.  

Here's a video of Rebel, a young, small pit at only 56 pounds pulling 6,613 pounds.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6LDopZZVzg]Rebel (56lbs) Pulling 6613lbs, 118x's his body weight - YouTube[/ame]

Pit bulls are terriers.   Calling them pit bulls is just a nick name.  They got this nick name because this breed was put into pits to fight and kill bulls or bears.  Yeah, I'm gonna grab that sucker by the collar and just throw him into traffic.  He's not gonna touch ME.   It's the training.


----------



## BullKurtz

Katzndogz said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip....even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you are fighting a 40 pound pit bull, you are dealing with a puppy.  At 4 months, a healthy pit bull will weight about 55 pounds.  A full grown Pit will weigh 110 to 120 pounds.   The American Staffordshire Terrier is somewhat smaller and will weigh 75 to 80 pounds full grown.   Now it might be attractive to imagine that you could lift that weight of fighting dog with one hand, it might happen in the movies, but in real life, not so much.   As far as flinging it out in traffic, there's no real dealing with that idea.
> 
> Pits are incredibly strong.   Pit bulls have been known to pull 5,000 pounds of dead weight.
> 
> Here's a video of Rebel, a young, small pit at only 56 pounds pulling 6,613 pounds.
> 
> [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6LDopZZVzg]Rebel (56lbs) Pulling 6613lbs, 118x's his body weight - YouTube[/ame]
> 
> Pit bulls are terriers.   Calling them pit bulls is just a nick name.  They got this nick name because this breed was put into pits to fight and kill bulls or bears.  Yeah, I'm gonna grab that sucker by the collar and just throw him into traffic.  He's not gonna touch ME.   It's the training.
Click to expand...


Okay, I tried to play nice....you've admitted you're a woman in your 70's.....go get your dentures out of the jar and eat some applesauce or prunes or something....most men can easily lift a Pit off the ground with one arm...few weigh over 40-50 pounds....the larger ones are dealt with no differently....this is getting tiresome.   buh bye!


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip....even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are fighting a 40 pound pit bull, you are dealing with a puppy.  At 4 months, a healthy pit bull will weight about 55 pounds.  A full grown Pit will weigh 110 to 120 pounds.   The American Staffordshire Terrier is somewhat smaller and will weigh 75 to 80 pounds full grown.   Now it might be attractive to imagine that you could lift that weight of fighting dog with one hand, it might happen in the movies, but in real life, not so much.   As far as flinging it out in traffic, there's no real dealing with that idea.
> 
> Pits are incredibly strong.   Pit bulls have been known to pull 5,000 pounds of dead weight.
> 
> Here's a video of Rebel, a young, small pit at only 56 pounds pulling 6,613 pounds.
> 
> [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6LDopZZVzg]Rebel (56lbs) Pulling 6613lbs, 118x's his body weight - YouTube[/ame]
> 
> Pit bulls are terriers.   Calling them pit bulls is just a nick name.  They got this nick name because this breed was put into pits to fight and kill bulls or bears.  Yeah, I'm gonna grab that sucker by the collar and just throw him into traffic.  He's not gonna touch ME.   It's the training.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Okay, I tried to play nice....you've admitted you're a woman in your 70's.....go get your dentures out of the jar and eat some applesauce or prunes or something....most men can easily lift a Pit off the ground with one arm...few weigh over 40-50 pounds....the larger ones are dealt with no differently....this is getting tiresome.   buh bye!
Click to expand...


40 to 50 lbs?  You are an idiot.   Most pits will top 75 or 80 lbs with many going over 100 lbs.

Now lets look at a scenario where you want them to grab the collar.  This dog is charging you, and you reach down to grab the collar.  First of all, the dog is going to react to anything coming towards it.  It will most likely get at least one of your hands or forearms.  A grown pit bull will crush the bones like they were pretzels.  Now you have one hand left to fight and probably arterial bleeding from the other.  And even if you manage to grab the collar and avoid the jaws, you want to claim you can lift a wiggling 100lb dog?  

You are a pretender and a wannabe.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip....even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are fighting a 40 pound pit bull, you are dealing with a puppy.  At 4 months, a healthy pit bull will weight about 55 pounds.  A full grown Pit will weigh 110 to 120 pounds.   The American Staffordshire Terrier is somewhat smaller and will weigh 75 to 80 pounds full grown.   Now it might be attractive to imagine that you could lift that weight of fighting dog with one hand, it might happen in the movies, but in real life, not so much.   As far as flinging it out in traffic, there's no real dealing with that idea.
> 
> Pits are incredibly strong.   Pit bulls have been known to pull 5,000 pounds of dead weight.
> 
> Here's a video of Rebel, a young, small pit at only 56 pounds pulling 6,613 pounds.
> 
> [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6LDopZZVzg]Rebel (56lbs) Pulling 6613lbs, 118x's his body weight - YouTube[/ame]
> 
> Pit bulls are terriers.   Calling them pit bulls is just a nick name.  They got this nick name because this breed was put into pits to fight and kill bulls or bears.  Yeah, I'm gonna grab that sucker by the collar and just throw him into traffic.  He's not gonna touch ME.   It's the training.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Okay, I tried to play nice....you've admitted you're a woman in your 70's.....go get your dentures out of the jar and eat some applesauce or prunes or something....most men can easily lift a Pit off the ground with one arm...few weigh over 40-50 pounds....the larger ones are dealt with no differently....this is getting tiresome.   buh bye!
Click to expand...


Tried to play nice?   When?  You came into this thread spouting generalizations, and went down from there.


----------



## Sallow

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip...*.even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move*.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude.
> 
> "Plot your next move"?
> 
> Have you ever been in a real fight?
> 
> Seriously?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dood?  seriously?  I first named you "swallow" long ago....it's a pity you've forgotten how tangling with me and Kurtz ends up for you.  I couldn't care less what you believe or don't believe...this ain't a who's got a bigger dick contest....If this were a matter of notches on my gun barrel, I'd have needed a new barrel many times over....ya get me?
Click to expand...


Swallow is what you do with your boyfriend, faggot.

Couple of minutes is generally how long an actual fight takes.

You don't know your ass from your elbow.

As I thought. You haven't changed much. Even with this new name.

Boy.


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you are fighting a 40 pound pit bull, you are dealing with a puppy.  At 4 months, a healthy pit bull will weight about 55 pounds.  A full grown Pit will weigh 110 to 120 pounds.   The American Staffordshire Terrier is somewhat smaller and will weigh 75 to 80 pounds full grown.   Now it might be attractive to imagine that you could lift that weight of fighting dog with one hand, it might happen in the movies, but in real life, not so much.   As far as flinging it out in traffic, there's no real dealing with that idea.
> 
> Pits are incredibly strong.   Pit bulls have been known to pull 5,000 pounds of dead weight.
> 
> Here's a video of Rebel, a young, small pit at only 56 pounds pulling 6,613 pounds.
> 
> Rebel (56lbs) Pulling 6613lbs, 118x's his body weight - YouTube
> 
> Pit bulls are terriers.   Calling them pit bulls is just a nick name.  They got this nick name because this breed was put into pits to fight and kill bulls or bears.  Yeah, I'm gonna grab that sucker by the collar and just throw him into traffic.  He's not gonna touch ME.   It's the training.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, I tried to play nice....you've admitted you're a woman in your 70's.....go get your dentures out of the jar and eat some applesauce or prunes or something....most men can easily lift a Pit off the ground with one arm...few weigh over 40-50 pounds....the larger ones are dealt with no differently....this is getting tiresome.   buh bye!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 40 to 50 lbs?  You are an idiot.   Most pits will top 75 or 80 lbs with many going over 100 lbs.
> 
> Now lets look at a scenario where you want them to grab the collar.  This dog is charging you, and you reach down to grab the collar.  First of all, the dog is going to react to anything coming towards it.  It will most likely get at least one of your hands or forearms.  A grown pit bull will crush the bones like they were pretzels.  Now you have one hand left to fight and probably arterial bleeding from the other.  And even if you manage to grab the collar and avoid the jaws, you want to claim you can lift a wiggling 100lb dog?
> 
> You are a pretender and a wannabe.
Click to expand...


Got a little reading comprehension there, Alice?  Seems you're even dumber than your picture....backtrack and read about how you get ahold of the dog's collar in the first place ya racist punk.


----------



## BullKurtz

Sallow said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dude.
> 
> "Plot your next move"?
> 
> Have you ever been in a real fight?
> 
> Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dood?  seriously?  I first named you "swallow" long ago....it's a pity you've forgotten how tangling with me and Kurtz ends up for you.  I couldn't care less what you believe or don't believe...this ain't a who's got a bigger dick contest....If this were a matter of notches on my gun barrel, I'd have needed a new barrel many times over....ya get me?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Swallow is what you do with your boyfriend, faggot.
> 
> Couple of minutes is generally how long an actual fight takes.
> 
> You don't know your ass from your elbow.
> 
> As I thought. You haven't changed much. Even with this new name.
> 
> Boy.
Click to expand...


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, I tried to play nice....you've admitted you're a woman in your 70's.....go get your dentures out of the jar and eat some applesauce or prunes or something....most men can easily lift a Pit off the ground with one arm...few weigh over 40-50 pounds....the larger ones are dealt with no differently....this is getting tiresome.   buh bye!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 40 to 50 lbs?  You are an idiot.   Most pits will top 75 or 80 lbs with many going over 100 lbs.
> 
> Now lets look at a scenario where you want them to grab the collar.  This dog is charging you, and you reach down to grab the collar.  First of all, the dog is going to react to anything coming towards it.  It will most likely get at least one of your hands or forearms.  A grown pit bull will crush the bones like they were pretzels.  Now you have one hand left to fight and probably arterial bleeding from the other.  And even if you manage to grab the collar and avoid the jaws, you want to claim you can lift a wiggling 100lb dog?
> 
> You are a pretender and a wannabe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Got a little reading comprehension there, Alice?  Seems you're even dumber than your picture....backtrack and read about how you get ahold of the dog's collar in the first place ya racist punk.
Click to expand...


Oh, now I am a racist?   I'd love to hear the reasons behind that bit of invented nonsense.


----------



## Sallow

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 40 to 50 lbs?  You are an idiot.   Most pits will top 75 or 80 lbs with many going over 100 lbs.
> 
> Now lets look at a scenario where you want them to grab the collar.  This dog is charging you, and you reach down to grab the collar.  First of all, the dog is going to react to anything coming towards it.  It will most likely get at least one of your hands or forearms.  A grown pit bull will crush the bones like they were pretzels.  Now you have one hand left to fight and probably arterial bleeding from the other.  And even if you manage to grab the collar and avoid the jaws, you want to claim you can lift a wiggling 100lb dog?
> 
> You are a pretender and a wannabe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a little reading comprehension there, Alice?  Seems you're even dumber than your picture....backtrack and read about how you get ahold of the dog's collar in the first place ya racist punk.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, now I am a racist?   I'd love to hear the reasons behind that bit of invented nonsense.
Click to expand...

Probably against white people.

Which is a neat trick..given you are probably a white guy.


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 40 to 50 lbs?  You are an idiot.   Most pits will top 75 or 80 lbs with many going over 100 lbs.
> 
> Now lets look at a scenario where you want them to grab the collar.  This dog is charging you, and you reach down to grab the collar.  First of all, the dog is going to react to anything coming towards it.  It will most likely get at least one of your hands or forearms.  A grown pit bull will crush the bones like they were pretzels.  Now you have one hand left to fight and probably arterial bleeding from the other.  And even if you manage to grab the collar and avoid the jaws, you want to claim you can lift a wiggling 100lb dog?
> 
> You are a pretender and a wannabe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a little reading comprehension there, Alice?  Seems you're even dumber than your picture....backtrack and read about how you get ahold of the dog's collar in the first place ya racist punk.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, now I am a racist?   I'd love to hear the reasons behind that bit of invented nonsense.
Click to expand...


Why not?  You're a cracker from Alabama....dumbest humps in the country...you don't know shit from shinola about dogs.....too dumb to remember what you read five minutes ago, I'd be surprised if you could light that ceegar you're sucking on without assistance.   Face it boy, you were reduced to calling a man who's clearly your superior in all ways a "pretender"...you and Swallow should move someplace where they let gay racists wed...you two are a matched set.


----------



## BullKurtz

Sallow said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Got a little reading comprehension there, Alice?  Seems you're even dumber than your picture....backtrack and read about how you get ahold of the dog's collar in the first place ya racist punk.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, now I am a racist?   I'd love to hear the reasons behind that bit of invented nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Probably against white people.
> 
> Which is a neat trick..given you are probably a white guy.
Click to expand...


Don't talk with your mouth full, Swallow.


----------



## Unkotare

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> ....same as fighting a human.....





Oh, you mean it's something you've never done? Thanks for sharing.


----------



## koshergrl

Pit bulls are no more dangerous than any other powerful dog. The press routinely reoprts "pit bull" attacks based on nothing more than whether the dog *looks* a certain way to them. And currently the lower criminal class is fixated on pits because they have a bad reputation...which they feed into.

Pit bulls aren't hard wired to snap...they are loving, devoted. They're terriers, it's true, so people need to know how to deal with terriers. But of my three dogs..a pit, a saint, and a parson russell terrier, the pit is the one I trust the most. He's the one that will come when called, even when he's actually fighting with another dog (I know because he has gotten into fights with my other dogs before) and he is the one who is the gentlest with the kids.


----------



## Unkotare

WinterBorn said:


> You are a pretender and a wannabe.





That he most surely is. He is enjoying a rich fantasy life in his dotage.


----------



## koshergrl

Gads, who was the idiot who maintained he could stop a pit with a well aimed kick?

HAHAHAHAHA...that was a funny one.


----------



## koshergrl

Snoop weighs in at 75 lbs or so, I think. He might be 80....he's gotten kinda hefty since he came to live with us.


----------



## koshergrl

And I've pulled him out of a couple of fights, no problem. And he never bit me or anyone else. He's 7 years old now. My granddaughter can take food out of his mouth, and does.


----------



## koshergrl

darnit, stupid photofucket, I would love to post some snoop and baby pics now, but I can't get into stupid photobucket.


----------



## koshergrl




----------



## koshergrl

That pic is a few years old...he can't wear that collar anymore, lol.


----------



## earlycuyler

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> The statistics don't lie....Pits kill on the average of 66 humans a year, over double the number Rottweillers kill....Rotties are notorious for years of being docile and then suddenly exploding into a murderous attack on whoever is handy.  Dobermans are way down on the list at 17.  I'd link my numbers but I can't find the article....it was written by a veternarian with no agenda, just a heads-up on dangerous breeds.  I consider being menaced by an aggressive dog the same as pointing a pistol at me....I make it vividly clear to the owner I will cut their dog's throat....and then beat the living shit out of them for instigating the attack.



That statistic is a lie. Pleas show pictures of the animals that exicuted the attacks.


----------



## Unkotare

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> The statistics don't lie....Pits kill on the average of 66 humans a year, over double the number Rottweillers kill....Rotties are notorious for years of being docile and then suddenly exploding into a murderous attack on whoever is handy.  Dobermans are way down on the list at 17.  I'd link my numbers but I can't find the article....it was written by a veternarian with no agenda, just a heads-up on dangerous breeds.  I consider being menaced by an aggressive dog the same as pointing a pistol at me....I make it vividly clear to the owner I will cut their dog's throat....and then beat the living shit out of them for instigating the attack.




Yes, yes, of course you do, hero. Everyone really, REALLY believes you.......really.


----------



## BullKurtz

earlycuyler said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> The statistics don't lie....Pits kill on the average of 66 humans a year, over double the number Rottweillers kill....Rotties are notorious for years of being docile and then suddenly exploding into a murderous attack on whoever is handy.  Dobermans are way down on the list at 17.  I'd link my numbers but I can't find the article....it was written by a veternarian with no agenda, just a heads-up on dangerous breeds.  I consider being menaced by an aggressive dog the same as pointing a pistol at me....I make it vividly clear to the owner I will cut their dog's throat....and then beat the living shit out of them for instigating the attack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That statistic is a lie. *Peals* show pictures of the animals that *eicutedx* the attacks.
Click to expand...


Kiss my ass ya freak.....and don't post drunk....you're dimished enough without the box wine.


----------



## koshergrl

It is a lie.


----------



## koshergrl

Wait till the criminal element gets their hands on these bad boys:






They won't just be attacking people walking down the streets, they'll be eating them, and taking on buses!


----------



## earlycuyler

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> The statistics don't lie....Pits kill on the average of 66 humans a year, over double the number Rottweillers kill....Rotties are notorious for years of being docile and then suddenly exploding into a murderous attack on whoever is handy.  Dobermans are way down on the list at 17.  I'd link my numbers but I can't find the article....it was written by a veternarian with no agenda, just a heads-up on dangerous breeds.  I consider being menaced by an aggressive dog the same as pointing a pistol at me....I make it vividly clear to the owner I will cut their dog's throat....and then beat the living shit out of them for instigating the attack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That statistic is a lie. *Peals* show pictures of the animals that *eicutedx* the attacks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Kiss my ass ya freak.....and don't post drunk....you're dimished enough without the box wine.
Click to expand...


That's what I figgred. Another interweb tufftard. By the way, what's dimished ?


----------



## earlycuyler

Sallow said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Funny, the experts seem to agree with me.   Leerburg | What Would I Do if Attacked by a Dog?
> 
> Also, do you really think everyone reading his is capable of lifting an attacking dog off the ground by its collar?  Do you think they are quick enough to reach and grab the collar without ending up losing their hands?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many of your "experts" have fought a dog, and trained others to fight a dog, Alice?  I have...you got an expert you're trying to dominate for whatever petty reasons.... who cares?  If you can't lift a 40 lb Pit off the ground with one arm you best get to a gym.
> 
> Incidentally, to readers without this fool's problem, once the dog is off the ground, brace the elbow on your hip...*.even if the dog weighs a hundred pounds this gives you a minute or two to plot your next move*.....I'm ending it's life....you might want to do one of the alternatives I mentioned....around city streets you can always fling it out into traffic...no mercy, that's how you deal with Fido.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude.
> 
> "Plot your next move"?
> 
> Have you ever been in a real fight?
> 
> Seriously?
Click to expand...


No this one has not. Just another tufftard stealing valor. Mega homo.


----------



## earlycuyler

koshergrl said:


> Wait till the criminal element gets their hands on these bad boys:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They won't just be attacking people walking down the streets, they'll be eating them, and taking on buses!



Ya. Big dogs. You should watch them on youtube. Just freaking huge.


----------



## BullKurtz

I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect.  But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:

https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks


----------



## Noomi

mal said:


> Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post
> 
> A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...
> 
> What gives?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...



Pit Bulls are no more dangerous than any other dog.


----------



## koshergrl

And eventually, they will be the nasty dogs that are eating kids, attacking people in their hallways, and running in packs.

The criminal element always have one breed or another that they fixate on, and it's always based on how tough and mean they are. They flood their neighborhoods with them, mistreat them, abandon them....then everybody freaks out and starts screeching to ban the BREED of DOG, instead of addressing the problem, which is criminal, ignorant dog owners.

Cesar Milan has it right...go into those neighborhoods and educate those people, and give them tools and skills. It's not the breed, it's the people.


----------



## BullKurtz

earlycuyler said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> That statistic is a lie. *Peals* show pictures of the animals that *eicutedx* the attacks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kiss my ass ya freak.....and don't post drunk....you're dimished enough without the box wine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what I figgred. Another interweb tufftard. By the way, what's dimished ?
Click to expand...


Triying tu comdunicate in a waye uwe mite unnerstan, Early. 

Ya fuckin lush.


----------



## BullKurtz

Noomi said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post
> 
> A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...
> 
> What gives?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are no more dangerous than any other dog.
Click to expand...


Sure thing mooni....any other little rays of light you'd like to shine on us?


----------



## BullKurtz

koshergrl said:


> And eventually, they will be the nasty dogs that are eating kids, attacking people in their hallways, and running in packs.
> 
> The criminal element always have one breed or another that they fixate on, and it's always based on how tough and mean they are. They flood their neighborhoods with them, mistreat them, abandon them....then everybody freaks out and starts screeching to ban the BREED of DOG, instead of addressing the problem, which is criminal, ignorant dog owners.
> 
> Cesar Milan has it right...go into those neighborhoods and educate those people, and give them tools and skills. It's not the breed, it's the people.



Ran out of gas back in the day, one winter afternoon up Lefthand Canyon outside Boulder in Colorado...so I set out with my Shepherd to walk up to my brothers place.  I saw the first two dogs come off the ridge to the left first....then two more runnng down a creek bed to the right.....luckily we were only about 40-45 meters from the Buick and we both got back inside before they swarmed the car.  Feral abandoned hippie dogs....well over a dozen of them...my Shepherd, a fierce presence but the worst fighter I ever saw, was going from the front seat to the back seat smashing his face into the windows the marauders were jumping at....I'm here to tell the tale because we got back to the car in time....not a Pit amongst them by the way...just large dogs packed up to jump deer, and a human caught in the open...like me.


----------



## earlycuyler

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Kiss my ass ya freak.....and don't post drunk....you're dimished enough without the box wine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's what I figgred. Another interweb tufftard. By the way, what's dimished ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Triying tu comdunicate in a waye uwe mite unnerstan, Early.
> 
> Ya fuckin lush.
Click to expand...


Better a lush then a fake marine.


----------



## koshergrl

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks


 
That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.

If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.

All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.

But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.


----------



## earlycuyler

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> And eventually, they will be the nasty dogs that are eating kids, attacking people in their hallways, and running in packs.
> 
> The criminal element always have one breed or another that they fixate on, and it's always based on how tough and mean they are. They flood their neighborhoods with them, mistreat them, abandon them....then everybody freaks out and starts screeching to ban the BREED of DOG, instead of addressing the problem, which is criminal, ignorant dog owners.
> 
> Cesar Milan has it right...go into those neighborhoods and educate those people, and give them tools and skills. It's not the breed, it's the people.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ran out of gas back in the day, one winter afternoon up Lefthand Canyon outside Boulder in Colorado...so I set out with my Shepherd to walk up to my brothers place.  I saw the first two dogs come off the ridge to the left first....then two more runnng down a creek bed to the right.....luckily we were only about 40-45 meters from the Buick and we both got back inside before they swarmed the car.  Feral abandoned hippie dogs....well over a dozen of them...my Shepherd, a fierce presence but the worst fighter I ever saw, was going from the front seat to the back seat smashing his face into the windows the marauders were jumping at....I'm here to tell the tale because we got back to the car in time....not a Pit amongst them by the way...just large dogs packed up to jump deer, and a human caught in the open...like me.
Click to expand...


What you realy mean is that you were smokeing dick at one of the rest areas along I-25, and you offered to let the Johns dog mount you for another 5 bucks and some smokes ?


----------



## BullKurtz

earlycuyler said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's what I figgred. Another interweb tufftard. By the way, what's dimished ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Triying tu comdunicate in a waye uwe mite unnerstan, Early.
> 
> Ya fuckin lush.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Better a lush then a fake marine.
Click to expand...


I'm a "fake marine" because you're a drunken queer?   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Don't try any of your ballet spins in the condition you're in, Becky.


----------



## Gracie

There is so much inbreding now, no telling what is goin on in those doggy heads. I love all animals...but pit bulls scare the bejesus out of me.
With that said...Dobermans and German Shepherds had the same bad rap years ago. Now it is Pits. What's next?


----------



## Sunshine

mal said:


> Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post
> 
> A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...
> 
> What gives?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...



And that owner was probably one of the gazillions of people who say, 'punish the deed not the breed, my pit is a honey he wouldn't hurt a fly.'  Pits and Dobermans have been bred to attack.  And that's what they do.  If you defend a pit, you deserve what you get.


----------



## BullKurtz

koshergrl said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
Click to expand...


Ample evidence says they do....plus they have very strong jaws, are oblivious to pain when in the attack mode (they wag their tails while they fight), and can jump like Michael Jordan if you try to climb a tree or a fence to get away from them.  They were never intended to be a family dog nor were Rottweilers...trying to adapt them to a life around kids or the elderly is asking for a nightmare.  I don't blame Pitbull owners for defending their pets....it's understood you would differ with what's becoming accepted fact.....the proof of that is communities banning them and insurance companies dropping homeowners coverage if a Pit or Rottie is the family pet.  Like I said earlier, these dogs can live a sedate and friendly life for YEARS and then that moment comes when you have a killer in your midst.


----------



## Sunshine

koshergrl said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
Click to expand...


It has been said that nice people don't need a mean dog.  This day and age, I'm not sure I totally agree.  But certainly people need a dog that is not going to turn on them and/or the children.


----------



## G.T.

Still waiting on that percentage of pit bulls who attack


----------



## Gracie

I would say that 75% of killer dogs are from bad owners wanting a bad ass dog (in short, bad role models training them to be vicious). 25% is from bad breeding. Dogs are like people. Some are just born with a few screws loose....that has very sharp teeth.


----------



## Sunshine

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post
> 
> A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...
> 
> What gives?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are no more dangerous than any other dog.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure thing mooni....any other little rays of light you'd like to shine on us?
Click to expand...


She thinks people should be euthanized.  I wonder when it will be her turn.


----------



## Gracie

Hell, a chihuahua can turn on ya. And those little nippers can take a pretty good chunk out of an ankle...or arm.
The scarey thing about pits is..once those jaws lock on....not even a crow bar will get them unlatched.

And packs of dogs abandoned...they form packs. Anyone is free game. Even other dogs.


----------



## BullKurtz

Gracie said:


> There is so much inbreding now, no telling what is goin on in those doggy heads. I love all animals...but pit bulls scare the bejesus out of me.
> With that said...Dobermans and German Shepherds had the same bad rap years ago. Now it is Pits. What's next?



We grew up believing Dobermans had too small a cranium for their brain when full-grown so they lived with a constant headache.  I suppose that could be true...don't know.  My contribution here is how to fight one, not to condemn one breed or another.  The thing about Dobermans is they usually turn their heads sideways and slash at the throat on a human, while a German Shepherd is a crush-biter....they can snap your femur like a stick.  Military K-9 units have never used Pits to my knowledge....too unpredictable to encourage attack.  Beleive it or not, the Weimereiner (sp?) is every bit as dangerous as a Doberman...something about the German breeds from a country that likes to jump France every generation or two.


----------



## Sunshine

I was attacked by a dog when I was a girl.  Dog shoved me down on the road after I got off the school bus and bit the hell out of my ass.  Dog's owner saw what happened and didn't do anything but watch. My dad who was on vacation that day saw it as well.  My dad went in the house and got the rifle.  Dog, knowing what was coming, ran under neighbor's porch.  My dad got down on his belly and shot the dog.  Neighbor never said a word about it. Life went on as though it never happened.  Last year I told that story to friends.  One of them raised a toast to my dad, because what he did 'conveyed that I was worth something.'

Once you have been attacked by a dog,  you are never really comfortable around dogs of any breed again.  They sense that, just like horses do.  I got on a horse one time in my life when I was a girl.  I promised myself if I lived through that I would never get on another horse.  And I haven't.   I wouldn't mind having a Yorkie.  If I have a dog, though, I would have to grossly out distance it in both weight and teeth.  And those little MFs can be all over you and bite the hell out of you like a Tasmanian devil.


----------



## BullKurtz

Sunshine said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are no more dangerous than any other dog.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure thing mooni....any other little rays of light you'd like to shine on us?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> She thinks people should be euthanized.  I wonder when it will be her turn.
Click to expand...


----------



## Sunshine

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is so much inbreding now, no telling what is goin on in those doggy heads. I love all animals...but pit bulls scare the bejesus out of me.
> With that said...Dobermans and German Shepherds had the same bad rap years ago. Now it is Pits. What's next?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We grew up believing Dobermans had too small a cranium for their brain when full-grown so they lived with a constant headache.  I suppose that could be true...don't know.  My contribution here is how to fight one, not to condemn one breed or another.  The thing about Dobermans is they usually turn their heads sideways and slash at the throat on a human, while a German Shepherd is a crush-biter....they can snap your femur like a stick.  Military K-9 units have never used Pits to my knowledge....too unpredictable to encourage attack.  Beleive it or not, the Weimereiner (sp?) is every bit as dangerous as a Doberman...*something about the German breeds from a country that likes to jump France every generation or two.*
Click to expand...


  Good one!


----------



## Gracie

I think people should be euthanized too. Criminals, and those with uncurable diseases if that is their wish.

Ok. Carry on. This is about pit bull attacks, so sorry. Just had to say something for my friend Noomi.
Anywho...I think there is more to this story none of us know yet. I clicked the link. The woman was 65. Her two twin sons, aged 26 lived there. The house was falling apart. Nothing was being repaired. Maybe that dog was abused. Maybe it wandered the streets many times trying to find food. Maybe, if, possibly. Nobody knows. But now that woman has no arms or hands and a dog is dead. Where the fuck are the twins? Out partying?


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
Click to expand...


I agree. The vast majority of pits I know are awesome, I love the breed.  But you have idiots breeding dogs to sell to people that have no business owning a dog.  Or any living thing.  I wish the Pit Bull community would take their breed's image more seriously and stop trying to promote them as a cool tough breed - have you ever looked at some of the breeder websites?  They do their breed no favors


----------



## Gracie

I was bit by a chow dog when I was a kid. Didn't stop me from loving dogs. All dogs. But Pits...I avoid. I still donate blankets, love their faces, would cuddle one in a heartbeat while a puppy, but once it got older and it became "in the know" with it's own instincts, I know it would smell the fear on me. So no...no pits for me. Dobies? Oh man. I love dobies. Even karma bites a bit hard when in play mode. She no longer has Gracie to chase and play with so now she wants to do it with me. Poor Karma has no clue my skin is thin, I bleed easily and my joints don't let me roll around like Gracie did. And when I holler OUCH...she is always right there to lick the owie. Karma is the one that pulled me up when I fell. Gracie took off running in fear. Hubby didn't see or hear me fall due to the weed eater he was using. But karma? She came bounding over, stood over me with her big paws on each side of my chest and started down at me. I didn't know what she wanted but finally figured it out. She was waiting for me to wrap my arms around her neck. So I did. And she slowly started backing up. She got me to my feet, then ran off to get a stuffed animal for playtime. She knew she did good.
Karma ia a yellow lab. 80 lbs of yellow lab.


----------



## BullKurtz

Sunshine said:


> I was attacked by a dog when I was a girl.  Dog shoved me down on the road after I got off the school bus and bit the hell out of my ass.  Dog's owner saw what happened and didn't do anything but watch. My dad who was on vacation that day saw it as well.  My dad went in the house and got the rifle.  Dog, knowing what was coming, ran under neighbor's porch.  My dad got down on his belly and shot the dog.  Neighbor never said a word about it. Life went on as though it never happened.  Last year I told that story to friends.  One of them raised a toast to my dad, because what he did 'conveyed that I was worth something.'
> 
> Once you have been attacked by a dog,  you are never really comfortable around dogs of any breed again.  They sense that, just like horses do.  I got on a horse one time in my life when I was a girl.  I promised myself if I lived through that I would never get on another horse.  And I haven't.   I wouldn't mind having a Yorkie.  If I have a dog, though, I would have to grossly out distance it in both weight and teeth.  And those little MFs can be all over you and bite the hell out of you like a Tasmanian devil.



Maybe the dog's owner was afraid of his own dog while it was attacking you.  I agree about horses....one ran away with me on it's back when I was a squirt.....too high to jump off, reins dragging on the ground....I was hanging onto it's mane for dear life.   It ran across TWO highways with me on it's back....finally I decided to bail and picked a likely looking ditch with some water in it once we were out of the city.....I leaped, a perfect splashdown and the horse never seemed to notice.  I had to walk over 4 miles back home. 

Then a girl's father who didn't approve of my kind sent me into a stall with his arabian stud to bring him out....of course the damn thing pinned me on the stall rail until I could barely breathe....when it tried to bite me I caught it between the eyes with a solid right hand....I boxed at Kronk.....I can hit....buckled the things knees and gave me enough space to crawl out between the rails....he just stared at me like the prick he was....Naval Commander....all of them hate Marines...and the feeling is mutual.


----------



## Wry Catcher

I have a Border Collie / Australian Cattle Dog mix.  Very smart dog but one with lots of energy.  We take her to the dog park nearly every day and she plays with all breeds of dogs.  Most seem to be rescues and of mixed breed.  

Two days ago an American Pit bull ran into me as he was playing.  I'm 6'2" and 230 pounds and he was maybe 50 pounds.  He nearly knocked me over, they are one very powerful breed.  That said, he and other Pits play well with others; only one time did we experience an aggressive pit.  It was obvious the owner was the problem and in short order every other owner picked up their dog and left.  

Fortunately he and his dog never returned (at least when we were present).  Fights break out rarely but responsible owners gain fast control of their pets and respond before blood is spilled.  Once the people move in the battle is over quickly and the offending dog(s)  seem to forgive and forget.  Too bad people can't be as civilized as most dogs.


----------



## BullKurtz

Wry Catcher said:


> I have a Border Collie / Australian Cattle Dog mix.  Very smart dog but one with lots of energy.  We take her to the dog park nearly every day and she plays with all breeds of dogs.  Most seem to be rescues and of mixed breed.
> 
> Two days ago an American Pit bull ran into me as he was playing.  I'm 6'2" and 230 pounds and he was maybe 50 pounds.  He nearly knocked me over, they are one very powerful breed.  That said, he and other Pits play well with others; only one time did we experience an aggressive pit.  It was obvious the owner was the problem and in short order every other owner picked up their dog and left.
> 
> Fortunately he and his dog never returned (at least when we were present).  Fights break out rarely but responsible owners gain fast control of their pets and respond before blood is spilled.  Once the people move in the battle is over quickly and the offending dog(s)  seem to forgive and forget.  Too bad people can't be as civilized as most dogs.



Just keep them on a leash out in public...it's not that difficult.  I sometimes encounter a woman with two Chows on my run....she likes the way they intimidate guys I guess...the rust colored one hates the sight of me......paws at the ground as I approach and then comes full-steam at me....drags her a couple feet until she yanks it back....usually within a couple feet of me....finally I displayed the blade I referred to earlier and it wiped the smile off her face....I kept it to my side....didn't menace her, but she got the point...(unintended pun or maybe a metaphor?)....damn thing looks like a small lion.  So I decided maybe the blade wasn't putting my mind at ease so now I carry a little .32 revolver when I run...had to show IT last week to a kid with a Pit pulling him toward me....he didn't seem to notice and neither did the Pit....I will not be torn apart as I approach my geezerdom...I'd rather do time with the County then have myself stitched back together.


----------



## Coyote

The worst dogs I generally encounter have been Labs attached to clueless owners who think everyone loves their dogs.  Several of my dogs are not keen on exhuberant puppies in adult bodies who get into their faces because "they're just being friendly".  They aren't.  They are rude.  The owners don't get it.


----------



## BullKurtz

Coyote said:


> The worst dogs I generally encounter have been Labs attached to clueless owners who think everyone loves their dogs.  Several of my dogs are not keen on exhuberant puppies in adult bodies who get into their faces because "they're just being friendly".  They aren't.  They are rude.  The owners don't get it.



Labs and Goldies are "soft mouth" breeds.....seldom leave a tooth mark on a duck they swim back with and drop.  But they can bite hard alright....my Golden got tired of a Doberman growling at her when she was at an adjoining food bowl.  Finally she grabbed the thing by the neck and slammed in on the kitchen floor.  We were all standing there with our mouths hanging open...She'd never displayed any kind of behavior like that before....I must say I was real proud of her and made sure she knew it.


----------



## Gracie

I took Karma to the dog park about a week after Gracie died. There was a hefty woman with two pits and boy did she have attitude. So did her dogs. I immediately got up and dragged Karma out of the fence area and into my car. As I was driving away, I saw the other people taking their dogs out as well. She had this smug look on her face all the while.  I laugh about it now because there would have been no smug sarcastic look on her face without her back up. Chickenshit coward that she is.


----------



## Wry Catcher

Coyote said:


> The worst dogs I generally encounter have been Labs attached to clueless owners who think everyone loves their dogs.  Several of my dogs are not keen on exhuberant puppies in adult bodies who get into their faces because "they're just being friendly".  They aren't.  They are rude.  The owners don't get it.



We have four dog parks close to us and each has a different population (dogs and owners).  Since we are retired we go in the morning, usually around 0930 and stay 'til about 1100.  The owners during those hours are responsible, however some of the owners and some of the dogs in the late afternoon can be problematic.


----------



## Gracie

Oh, Gracie was SOOO pissed off at Karma when I got her as an 8 week old. Gracie was about 6 months old at the time and karma latched on to her like a mama. Karma would want to play and pounce on Gracie and she would wake me up growling and biting Karma and nudging her to SLEEPY TIME LEAVE MOMMY ALONE KID! But were they close? Oh yes. We are short one in the pack now. I still miss Gracie very much. This coming weekend, it will be 18 weeks since she has been gone. Seems like 18 years. 

btw..Gracie was australian shepherd.


----------



## Gracie

There is a stretch of beach near us. About a 10 minute drive. I took Karma about a month ago so she could run free in the waves. That section of the beach is owned by Standard Oil company. They have signs all over the fencing but one section has been cut away..just wide enough for a dog or two, and an owner or two, to slide thru. On those signs it says "this is our beach. We are letting you use it. Pick up your dog poop. Keep the beach clean. Control your kids. Have your leash handy. Otherwise..enjoy".

There were dogs all over the place happily playing in the water, none with each other. The sea was keeping them occupied..and the waves. Karma wanted none of it and she LOVES water. She stayed right with me, off the leash. We stayed about 15 minutes and she wouldn't budge. Gracie was not there. She didn't want to be either. She wanted her yard where all Gracies balls are still where she last left them.


----------



## Coyote

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The worst dogs I generally encounter have been Labs attached to clueless owners who think everyone loves their dogs.  Several of my dogs are not keen on exhuberant puppies in adult bodies who get into their faces because "they're just being friendly".  They aren't.  They are rude.  The owners don't get it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Labs and Goldies are "soft mouth" breeds.....seldom leave a tooth mark on a duck they swim back with and drop.  But they can bite hard alright....my Golden got tired of a Doberman growling at her when she was at an adjoining food bowl.  Finally she grabbed the thing by the neck and slammed in on the kitchen floor.  We were all standing there with our mouths hanging open...She'd never displayed any kind of behavior like that before....I must say I was real proud of her and made sure she knew it.
Click to expand...


Most dogs when they are allowed to interact with each other naturally - will inhibit their bites.  It's the insecure or fearful ones that frequently need to posture or bite inappropriately.

My good friend had a wonderful Rottie, Jake, that she rescued.  Jake had a wonderfull temperment - a very appropriate alpha.  She had multiple dogs.  He never went beyond what was necessary to make a point and almost never left a mark on the other dog.  Some dogs - he knew were just kind of..."that boy ain't right" - and he cut them a break.  Other dogs he knew that despite their attitude - were no threat (a certain chihuahua) and he let ignored them.  When I was visiting her one time, when my dog Cowboy was younger - he really pissed off Jake by nipping him on the butt during a pack hike.  I'll be the first to admit that aussies can be assholes (like may herding dogs) - Jake took him down and, her Pitt, Elwood also joined in (another dog with a steller temperment).  When we seperated everyone (in this situation the biggest concern is other dog's joining in) - the only damage Cowboy had was basically from us pulling dogs off - a rip on his ear, and swellling on his cheek from the pressure of Elwood's bite.  Not a single puncture or major wound.  And that's a pitt and a rottie.  Both are gone now sadly - but could have been poster children for their breeds.


----------



## Coyote

Gracie said:


> There is a stretch of beach near us. About a 10 minute drive. I took Karma about a month ago so she could run free in the waves. That section of the beach is owned by Standard Oil company. They have signs all over the fencing but one section has been cut away..just wide enough for a dog or two, and an owner or two, to slide thru. On those signs it says "this is our beach. We are letting you use it. Pick up your dog poop. Keep the beach clean. Control your kids. Have your leash handy. Otherwise..enjoy".
> 
> There were dogs all over the place happily playing in the water, none with each other. The sea was keeping them occupied..and the waves. Karma wanted none of it and she LOVES water. She stayed right with me, off the leash. We stayed about 15 minutes and she wouldn't budge. Gracie was not there. She didn't want to be either. She wanted her yard where all Gracies balls are still where she last left them.



That's wonderful that you have a beach nearby!  What kind of dog is Karma?


----------



## Gracie

Moki is a rat terrier...he is an ornery cuss. Gracie was very gentle. She loved to herd but instead of doing that, she fixated on her tennis balls and would "herd" them all over the yard. One day, Moki decided to pick a fight with Gracie. They were elbows and assholes and drawing blood..moki hanging on to Gracies ear, gracie swinging moki around like he was a tether ball. I turned the hose on them. They both hate baths and water. Afterwards.....moki tentatively went up to Gracie, who gave him the stink eye but didn't move. Moki began to lick Gracies ear..then he washed her face and her eyes with his tongue. She in turn licked him back. From then on....when they got to where it wasn't play time any more and they began to get pissed off...or one yelped at a nip that hurt...they both would stop and lick the air then bellies down go to each other to lick each other. It was amazing to see. They made up in the only way they knew how. Kisses.


----------



## Gracie

Karma is yellow lab. Moki rat terrier. Gracie was Australian sheperd. Pretties..well...she is a cat but thinks she is a dog.

I think I still have pics in the pet forum of them all. The one called Gracie is Seizing Again. Maybe it is in general. Not sure. I have not gone back for a long time to that thread. It makes me cry.


----------



## Gracie

It is the ONLY beach that is leash free along the california coastline. At least, the only one I can find in google.

Actually, there are a few. I went to look again. This one I went to is closest to me.


----------



## Katzndogz

koshergrl said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
Click to expand...


I would not trust a collie.  Particularly a purebred one.   They, like St. Bernards, have become too inbred.  In some cases, breeding for the long muzzle has resulted in the dog's eyes being too far apart making them almost blind.

However, if you thought there was more to this story than a housepet going off, you were right.

Pit bull likely ate owner's hands - SFGate

WILTON, Conn. -- Two days after a dog bit off a woman's hand and her other arm, sources said her hands were likely eaten. A*nd police said they had been to her home in the past for problems with the same dog.*

Police have also come to Murray's home several times to arrest her 26-year-old son, Ian, according to state court records. Ian Murray was given a five-year suspended sentence after he was found guilty of a 2005 robbery and conspiracy to commit first-degree robbery. He was also found guilty of violating his probation in 2010 in connection with that case.

Bet the son was taking some kind of drugs and the dog got into the stash.  Or, was generally mistreated by the criminal son and had enough.


----------



## BullKurtz

Gracie said:


> There is a stretch of beach near us. About a 10 minute drive. I took Karma about a month ago so she could run free in the waves. That section of the beach is owned by Standard Oil company. They have signs all over the fencing but one section has been cut away..just wide enough for a dog or two, and an owner or two, to slide thru. On those signs it says "this is our beach. We are letting you use it. Pick up your dog poop. Keep the beach clean. Control your kids. Have your leash handy. Otherwise..enjoy".
> 
> There were dogs all over the place happily playing in the water, none with each other. The sea was keeping them occupied..and the waves. Karma wanted none of it and she LOVES water. She stayed right with me, off the leash. We stayed about 15 minutes and she wouldn't budge. Gracie was not there. She didn't want to be either. She wanted her yard where all Gracies balls are still where she last left them.



I'm a Christian and believe our souls are delivered one place or the other when we pass over.  But I also believe dogs are reincarnated....I bet Gracie is a wiggling puppy somewhere this evening...full of piss and vinegar and then sleeping like a rock.  I bet you run into her again someday in her new body.....you'll know her and she'll know you if only for a moment.


----------



## Katzndogz

I don't let my dog around other dogs.  She does tend to bite dogs.  She's blind and willing to be tail wagging friendly, she draws the line at sniffing.  She will not permit another dog to sniff her that's when she's ready to fight.  

When she was about six months old and still able to see, a rottweiler growled at her cat.  Arwen was a white frenzy at that rottie.  Every time he turned she was gone bite an ear, tail, foot, quick as could be until he stopped paying attention to the cat and got on his belly.  She was nothing but a white blur.


----------



## Katzndogz

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is a stretch of beach near us. About a 10 minute drive. I took Karma about a month ago so she could run free in the waves. That section of the beach is owned by Standard Oil company. They have signs all over the fencing but one section has been cut away..just wide enough for a dog or two, and an owner or two, to slide thru. On those signs it says "this is our beach. We are letting you use it. Pick up your dog poop. Keep the beach clean. Control your kids. Have your leash handy. Otherwise..enjoy".
> 
> There were dogs all over the place happily playing in the water, none with each other. The sea was keeping them occupied..and the waves. Karma wanted none of it and she LOVES water. She stayed right with me, off the leash. We stayed about 15 minutes and she wouldn't budge. Gracie was not there. She didn't want to be either. She wanted her yard where all Gracies balls are still where she last left them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a Christian and believe our souls are delivered one place or the other when we pass over.  But I also believe dogs are reincarnated....I bet Gracie is a wiggling puppy somewhere this evening...full of piss and vinegar and then sleeping like a rock.  I bet you run into her again someday in her new body.....you'll know her and she'll know you if only for a moment.
Click to expand...


I believe that my loved ones will be waiting for me so we can all be together again.


----------



## koshergrl

Sunshine said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit bull chews off owner's arm, hand - Connecticut Post
> 
> A number of recent deadly attacks in that link...
> 
> What gives?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And that owner was probably one of the gazillions of people who say, 'punish the deed not the breed, my pit is a honey he wouldn't hurt a fly.'  Pits and Dobermans have been bred to attack.  And that's what they do.  If you defend a pit, you deserve what you get.
Click to expand...


They're terriers for sure...but no more likely to *go off* than any other terrier..and a lot less likely to go off than my PRT.

Anyone who says any dog would never hurt a fly is delusional...but that's not to say that pits are any worse.

And answer this...how many pit bosses have been killed by fighting pits? None that I've ever heard of. Because for all that pits fight ferociously, they fight ferociously FOR their owners. They overcome their fear of fighting (and they are afraid) for the sake of their owners. They are endlessly loyal. 

But they are animals. Don't leave your baby closed up in a room with them, and don't expect them to act like pussy cats if they are running loose with other dogs, or chained in your yard, or in sniffing vicinity of bitches in heat. 

Dogs are just dogs, ultimately, and if they aren't properly supervised, there are whole dozens of scenarios where they can put a serious hurt on someone. 

That doesn't mean you eliminate all the scary breeds. A dachsund chewed off the legs of a baby and killed the baby...I mean, it's not just pits.


----------



## gallantwarrior

mal said:


> "Still, pit bulls, although they have legions of admirers, have killed and maimed countless times before. The most recent pit bull death occurred last week in Kernersville, N.C., when 25-year-old Katherine Atkins was set upon by her two dogs while she was attempting to feed them. She had owned the dogs since they were puppies, Kernersville police said.
> 
> And last month, 5-year-old Jason Ryan, of Baker City, Ore., was set upon by a neighbor's pit bull. He died in the ambulance. In September, two toddlers were mauled to death by pit bulls, one in Colton, Calif., the other in Gilbert, Ariz."
> 
> ^That's what's troubling to me... And it's not just Pitbulls that I don't Trust around my kids, I don't Trust any Dogs around my Kids.
> 
> I have Personally known (2) Girls who have been Permanently Scared in the Face by Family Dogs and one of my Wife's Teammates a few years back had their German Shepherd attack their Baby...
> 
> Sick thing in that Case, the Police allowed the Dog to stay and the "Man" of the House won out of the Wife about the Dog staying... The dog remains in the Home.
> 
> I just don't Trust Animals... I understand the Appeal, but the Attacks I have seen in my Life leave me with little want or need to Expose Defenseless Children to them.
> 
> Hell, look what these Dogs have done to their Adult Owners?
> 
> To each their own, I just don't Trust Animals.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...



I came across pitbull attack videos while surfing the net one night.  I cannot believe that anybody would want one of these beasts.  Funny thing, almost every owner interviewed after their animal maimed or destroyed another animal or even a human...they just cannot believe how nice, kind Fifi could _ever_ have done such a thing.  
Dogs of different breeds have been selectively bred for generations (in some cases) to do a specific job.  Pits were bred to be killers.  You want to have one in the same house with your kids, good luck.  You want to have one that comes and kills any of my animals, get your shovel.


----------



## Coyote

gallantwarrior said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Still, pit bulls, although they have legions of admirers, have killed and maimed countless times before. The most recent pit bull death occurred last week in Kernersville, N.C., when 25-year-old Katherine Atkins was set upon by her two dogs while she was attempting to feed them. She had owned the dogs since they were puppies, Kernersville police said.
> 
> And last month, 5-year-old Jason Ryan, of Baker City, Ore., was set upon by a neighbor's pit bull. He died in the ambulance. In September, two toddlers were mauled to death by pit bulls, one in Colton, Calif., the other in Gilbert, Ariz."
> 
> ^That's what's troubling to me... And it's not just Pitbulls that I don't Trust around my kids, I don't Trust any Dogs around my Kids.
> 
> I have Personally known (2) Girls who have been Permanently Scared in the Face by Family Dogs and one of my Wife's Teammates a few years back had their German Shepherd attack their Baby...
> 
> Sick thing in that Case, the Police allowed the Dog to stay and the "Man" of the House won out of the Wife about the Dog staying... The dog remains in the Home.
> 
> I just don't Trust Animals... I understand the Appeal, but the Attacks I have seen in my Life leave me with little want or need to Expose Defenseless Children to them.
> 
> Hell, look what these Dogs have done to their Adult Owners?
> 
> To each their own, I just don't Trust Animals.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I came across pitbull attack videos while surfing the net one night.  I cannot believe that anybody would want one of these beasts.  Funny thing, almost every owner interviewed after their animal maimed or destroyed another animal or even a human...they just cannot believe how nice, kind Fifi could _ever_ have done such a thing.
> Dogs of different breeds have been selectively bred for generations (in some cases) to do a specific job.  Pits were bred to be killers.  You want to have one in the same house with your kids, good luck.  You want to have one that comes and kills any of my animals, get your shovel.
Click to expand...



Pit's weren't bred to be "killers" - they were bred to fight other dogs.


----------



## Esmeralda

Katzndogz said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would not trust a collie.  Particularly a purebred one.   They, like St. Bernards, have become too inbred.  In some cases, breeding for the long muzzle has resulted in the dog's eyes being too far apart making them almost blind.
> 
> However, if you thought there was more to this story than a housepet going off, you were right.
> 
> Pit bull likely ate owner's hands - SFGate
> 
> WILTON, Conn. -- Two days after a dog bit off a woman's hand and her other arm, sources said her hands were likely eaten. A*nd police said they had been to her home in the past for problems with the same dog.*
> 
> Police have also come to Murray's home several times to arrest her 26-year-old son, Ian, according to state court records. Ian Murray was given a five-year suspended sentence after he was found guilty of a 2005 robbery and conspiracy to commit first-degree robbery. He was also found guilty of violating his probation in 2010 in connection with that case.
> 
> Bet the son was taking some kind of drugs and the dog got into the stash.  Or, was generally mistreated by the criminal son and had enough.
Click to expand...


This is absolutely disgusting.  I get the point that many pitbull owners are low class people who don't train their dogs properly and don't manage them intelligently, but you just don't hear these kinds of stories about other dogs, and plenty of low class, unintelligent people have plenty of other breeds of dogs that don't do things like this.  

From the link: 





> pit bull owners, swiftly defended the breed, saying that any breed of dog can become aggressive and that incidents involving pit bulls tend to be unfairly sensationalized


  These pitbull owners are always defending these dogs and making excuses for them, but there have also always been many stories of pitbulls from normal, average homes who go off like this too: it isn't because they aren't raised in caring homes with responsible owners. They are just dogs that 'go off' and when they do, are deadly.  IMO the whole breed should be put down and ended. Such animals are not something we need.  It's like keeping sharks for pets.


----------



## gallantwarrior

Coyote said:


> gallantwarrior said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Still, pit bulls, although they have legions of admirers, have killed and maimed countless times before. The most recent pit bull death occurred last week in Kernersville, N.C., when 25-year-old Katherine Atkins was set upon by her two dogs while she was attempting to feed them. She had owned the dogs since they were puppies, Kernersville police said.
> 
> And last month, 5-year-old Jason Ryan, of Baker City, Ore., was set upon by a neighbor's pit bull. He died in the ambulance. In September, two toddlers were mauled to death by pit bulls, one in Colton, Calif., the other in Gilbert, Ariz."
> 
> ^That's what's troubling to me... And it's not just Pitbulls that I don't Trust around my kids, I don't Trust any Dogs around my Kids.
> 
> I have Personally known (2) Girls who have been Permanently Scared in the Face by Family Dogs and one of my Wife's Teammates a few years back had their German Shepherd attack their Baby...
> 
> Sick thing in that Case, the Police allowed the Dog to stay and the "Man" of the House won out of the Wife about the Dog staying... The dog remains in the Home.
> 
> I just don't Trust Animals... I understand the Appeal, but the Attacks I have seen in my Life leave me with little want or need to Expose Defenseless Children to them.
> 
> Hell, look what these Dogs have done to their Adult Owners?
> 
> To each their own, I just don't Trust Animals.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I came across pitbull attack videos while surfing the net one night.  I cannot believe that anybody would want one of these beasts.  Funny thing, almost every owner interviewed after their animal maimed or destroyed another animal or even a human...they just cannot believe how nice, kind Fifi could _ever_ have done such a thing.
> Dogs of different breeds have been selectively bred for generations (in some cases) to do a specific job.  Pits were bred to be killers.  You want to have one in the same house with your kids, good luck.  You want to have one that comes and kills any of my animals, get your shovel.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Pit's weren't bred to be "killers" - they were bred to fight other dogs.
Click to expand...


And that aggressiveness carries over to other animals, as well.  They were bred to kill or be killed.


----------



## Gracie

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is a stretch of beach near us. About a 10 minute drive. I took Karma about a month ago so she could run free in the waves. That section of the beach is owned by Standard Oil company. They have signs all over the fencing but one section has been cut away..just wide enough for a dog or two, and an owner or two, to slide thru. On those signs it says "this is our beach. We are letting you use it. Pick up your dog poop. Keep the beach clean. Control your kids. Have your leash handy. Otherwise..enjoy".
> 
> There were dogs all over the place happily playing in the water, none with each other. The sea was keeping them occupied..and the waves. Karma wanted none of it and she LOVES water. She stayed right with me, off the leash. We stayed about 15 minutes and she wouldn't budge. Gracie was not there. She didn't want to be either. She wanted her yard where all Gracies balls are still where she last left them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a Christian and believe our souls are delivered one place or the other when we pass over.  But I also believe dogs are reincarnated....I bet Gracie is a wiggling puppy somewhere this evening...full of piss and vinegar and then sleeping like a rock.  I bet you run into her again someday in her new body.....you'll know her and she'll know you if only for a moment.
Click to expand...


Oh, I believe that myself. Which is why I waited before looking for new pack members when Charlie, Chooch and Fatty died. I was dogless. I hated it. Hated coming home. Hated waking up. Hated being in that cold empty apartment. No wet noses or wagging tails to greet me, no kitty to pat my face with claws sheathed and those claws as big as my palm. Nothing. just emptiness. So..I waited. I got LOTS of dogs out of the pound but none worked out so I found good homes for all of them. I had friends in rescue groups who helped too. I paid for neutering and spaying and adoption fees so much, I got in major trouble with my CC company. I was a walking zombie without my pack. And one gal I never met...she took a malnourished, bone rack of a dog I found at the pound and bottle fed it, took it to the vet (where I helped pay for whatever that dog needed), and turns out she was psychic. She didn't know about Chooch. She didn't know he was a black lab. She didn't know anything about him or me. I was visiting her and the rescued dog one day and out of the blue she said "I have a message for you. From...ChooChoo? Choochy? Black dog. Looked like a lab. He said to tell you he didn't want to leave...but someone else needed him more and he had to die". (He was hit by a truck when the idiot Sister In Law let him out one night without my knowledge, so he could run. He died on the way to the ER). I got goosebumps when she said that. Then I got angry. I yelled at her and said "well, you tell CHOOCH that I needed him MORE. I NEED HIM" and I burst into tears. She just hugged me and said to wait. He will return. And he did. Karma is Chooch. I tease Karma all the time. "Choochy. You came back yellow, and a girl". She just looks at me and smiles the way dogs do. Charlie came back too. He was Gracie. Moki....I don't know who he was or is. He is just Moki. FattyCat sent Pretties just to be ornery, lol.

So yes. I wait. She is not meant to be found yet. Gracie will come back. And if I am meant to find her, then we will be in the right place at the right time. But for now..she is safe, pain free, and in the care of someone I trust explicitly. She is with Jesus.


----------



## Coyote

gallantwarrior said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gallantwarrior said:
> 
> 
> 
> I came across pitbull attack videos while surfing the net one night.  I cannot believe that anybody would want one of these beasts.  Funny thing, almost every owner interviewed after their animal maimed or destroyed another animal or even a human...they just cannot believe how nice, kind Fifi could _ever_ have done such a thing.
> Dogs of different breeds have been selectively bred for generations (in some cases) to do a specific job.  Pits were bred to be killers.  You want to have one in the same house with your kids, good luck.  You want to have one that comes and kills any of my animals, get your shovel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pit's weren't bred to be "killers" - they were bred to fight other dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And that aggressiveness carries over to other animals, as well.  They were bred to kill or be killed.
Click to expand...


Not necessarily Gallant Warrier.  Dog to dog aggression is very specific.

Now, I'll add that it is in the best interest of Pitbull lovers and breeders to breed away from dog aggression - dog fighting is illegal.

Most of the pits I know are in my friend's all-breed rescue and live in a large multi-dog and cat pack.  The dogs range from a Rottie mix to Chihuahua and they get along just fine.


----------



## Esmeralda

Gracie said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is a stretch of beach near us. About a 10 minute drive. I took Karma about a month ago so she could run free in the waves. That section of the beach is owned by Standard Oil company. They have signs all over the fencing but one section has been cut away..just wide enough for a dog or two, and an owner or two, to slide thru. On those signs it says "this is our beach. We are letting you use it. Pick up your dog poop. Keep the beach clean. Control your kids. Have your leash handy. Otherwise..enjoy".
> 
> There were dogs all over the place happily playing in the water, none with each other. The sea was keeping them occupied..and the waves. Karma wanted none of it and she LOVES water. She stayed right with me, off the leash. We stayed about 15 minutes and she wouldn't budge. Gracie was not there. She didn't want to be either. She wanted her yard where all Gracies balls are still where she last left them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a Christian and believe our souls are delivered one place or the other when we pass over.  But I also believe dogs are reincarnated....I bet Gracie is a wiggling puppy somewhere this evening...full of piss and vinegar and then sleeping like a rock.  I bet you run into her again someday in her new body.....you'll know her and she'll know you if only for a moment.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, I believe that myself. Which is why I waited before looking for new pack members when Charlie, Chooch and Fatty died. I was dogless. I hated it. Hated coming home. Hated waking up. Hated being in that cold empty apartment. No wet noses or wagging tails to greet me, no kitty to pat my face with claws sheathed and those claws as big as my palm. Nothing. just emptiness. So..I waited. I got LOTS of dogs out of the pound but none worked out so I found good homes for all of them. I had friends in rescue groups who helped too. I paid for neutering and spaying and adoption fees so much, I got in major trouble with my CC company. I was a walking zombie without my pack. And one gal I never met...she took a malnourished, bone rack of a dog I found at the pound and bottle fed it, took it to the vet (where I helped pay for whatever that dog needed), and turns out she was psychic. She didn't know about Chooch. She didn't know he was a black lab. She didn't know anything about him or me. I was visiting her and the rescued dog one day and out of the blue she said "I have a message for you. From...ChooChoo? Choochy? Black dog. Looked like a lab. He said to tell you he didn't want to leave...but someone else needed him more and he had to die". (He was hit by a truck when the idiot Sister In Law let him out one night without my knowledge, so he could run. He died on the way to the ER). I got goosebumps when she said that. Then I got angry. I yelled at her and said "well, you tell CHOOCH that I needed him MORE. I NEED HIM" and I burst into tears. She just hugged me and said to wait. He will return. And he did. Karma is Chooch. I tease Karma all the time. "Choochy. You came back yellow, and a girl". She just looks at me and smiles the way dogs do. Charlie came back too. He was Gracie. Moki....I don't know who he was or is. He is just Moki. FattyCat sent Pretties just to be ornery, lol.
> 
> So yes. I wait. She is not meant to be found yet. Gracie will come back. And if I am meant to find her, then we will be in the right place at the right time. But for now..she is safe, pain free, and in the care of someone I trust explicitly. She is with Jesus.
Click to expand...


I kind of feel like that.  I wish it was true, that she is waiting for me to find her again.  I can't have another dog now for a few more years, but when I'm ready, and out there looking for her, I feel like she will send her soul to a new pup that is born, one I'll come across in my search, and I'll just recognize it. It's like a fairly tale, and probably wishful thinking, but that's kind of how I imagine it.


----------



## gallantwarrior

Coyote said:


> gallantwarrior said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit's weren't bred to be "killers" - they were bred to fight other dogs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And that aggressiveness carries over to other animals, as well.  They were bred to kill or be killed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not necessarily Gallant Warrier.  Dog to dog aggression is very specific.
> 
> Now, I'll add that it is in the best interest of Pitbull lovers and breeders to breed away from dog aggression - dog fighting is illegal.
> 
> Most of the pits I know are in my friend's all-breed rescue and live in a large multi-dog and cat pack.  The dogs range from a Rottie mix to Chihuahua and they get along just fine.
Click to expand...


I'm familiar enough with dog breeds to recognize that some breeds have "jobs".  Right now, I own a Great Pyrenees.  She lives with the goats, she lives _for_ the goats.  That's her job.  I admit, I am not the "dog person" my be friend is, but I have had working dogs for years.  I am not convinced that a pitbull is the best choice for a family with small children and other animals.  If you have a place that needs a protector, sure...that's a good fit for a Pit.


----------



## Esmeralda

Coyote said:


> gallantwarrior said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit's weren't bred to be "killers" - they were bred to fight other dogs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And that aggressiveness carries over to other animals, as well.  They were bred to kill or be killed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not necessarily Gallant Warrier.  Dog to dog aggression is very specific.
> 
> Now, I'll add that *it is in the best interest of Pitbull lovers and breeders to breed away from dog aggression - d*og fighting is illegal.
> 
> Most of the pits I know are in my friend's all-breed rescue and live in a large multi-dog and cat pack.  The dogs range from a Rottie mix to Chihuahua and they get along just fine.
Click to expand...

If pitbulls were purposely bred away from aggression, and only those bred to be non-aggressive could be sold, I'd go for the breed to be kept around, but then, most of the people who want pitbulls would no longer want them because the main reason people have them is the status and image of having such an aggressive, dangerous dog.  Also, there would probably be a black market of pits who were not legally bred away from aggression, and they'd be mixed with those who are, and we'd have an even worse problem. No, the best solution is get rid of the breed altogether.  Wipe them from the face of the Earth. There is absolutely no need for such animals.


----------



## Unkotare

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Then a girl's father who didn't approve of my kind sent me into a stall with his arabian stud to bring him out....of course the damn thing pinned me on the stall rail until I could barely breathe....when it tried to bite me I caught it between the eyes with a solid right hand....I boxed at Kronk.....I can hit....buckled the things knees and gave me enough space to crawl out between the rails....





Oh, of course.  


Just how much shit can one idiot be full of?


----------



## Gracie

Katzndogz said:


> I don't let my dog around other dogs.  She does tend to bite dogs.  She's blind and willing to be tail wagging friendly, she draws the line at sniffing.  She will not permit another dog to sniff her that's when she's ready to fight.
> 
> When she was about six months old and still able to see, a rottweiler growled at her cat.  Arwen was a white frenzy at that rottie.  Every time he turned she was gone bite an ear, tail, foot, quick as could be until he stopped paying attention to the cat and got on his belly.  She was nothing but a white blur.




Moki is cranky. He doesn't do well with other dogs cuz he wants to be alpha. Um. Sorry bubba...but Mommy is Alpha. Still, he tries to sneak and be da boss.
Anyway...Oliver is a blind weiner dog and he gets out once in awhile from the house about 4 doors down. Actually, they are blind dog rescuers (they have 5 blind dogs). Poor Oliver got out more than once and I happened to find him more than once. The first time I got him out of the street with blood all over his nose from running in to stuff, I brought him in the house. I was afraid moki would start crap with Oliver...but he didn't. He went straight up to Oliver and sniffed both eyes. Then he walked away. He knew. Oliver just sat in the doggy bed I made for him and shivered. Karma went and laid next to him and let him sniff her all over. Gracie joined them and it was a regular sniff fest. The cat tried, but Oliver wouldn't allow a cat in the doggy bonding thing. Pretties was quite indignant since she thinks she is a dog too. 
The owner came and fetched him after I left a note on their door.


----------



## Gracie

Exterminate all pits? That I don't agree with. That was suggested with dobies many moons ago. If they had done that, I would never have found Blue. He was a gunmetal blue doberman, full blood. He was about 5 years old, scars all over his head. His owners moved in next door when I lived in the valley, and they asked if I wanted their guard dog. I said let me meet him. So they took me to the abode they were vacating and there he was..locked in a cage full of dog shit, empty water bowl. The top of his head had scars all over it from being pistol whipped, his job was as a rental for junkyards. He was chained...and IN the cage as well. I immediately had tears slip down my face as I approached him, growling and snapping and tugging at his chain to get to me. I put my hands on the bars of the cage and spoke softly to him. I told him he was beautiful. I would never ever hit or hurt him. I would feed him, give him fresh water, let him sleep in my house. One rule. The cat is MINE. I said Cat/MINE quite a few times. During my convo with him, he sat in his own excrement, pointed ears cocked to my voice. He never growled again. Never snapped. He just sat there and listened. So I told the guy yes..I wanted him. I asked Blue if he wanted me, too. He stood up and the guy entered teh cage and unchained him, leashed him, handed me the leash. I stood there and said "I am yours. You are mine. Cat is mine. Don't hurt what is ours" and I took him home. He sat politely in the front seat with me. Soon as I got him home, he saw the cat. But he just looked. Then looked at me and I said MINE. He walked in the house, met Candy, my white sheperd mix, sniffed her, fell in love. They had puppies about a year later. Blue was my lap dog. He licked the bags off the puppies as they came out. He cleaned them. He was a proud papa. I left him with a friend because I had to travel with hubby for a week and when I got back..she sold him to bikers to protect their bikes. I looked everywhere for him. I gave out flyers with a reward. I never found him. I hope he met Gracie and is happy there with her. And I WILL see him again.

Dogs are smart. They can sense things. Dobies are awesome. I am so glad they were not exterminated.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Not to long ago a you tuber that I subscribe was attacked by his pitbull at home, if he had not been armed the dog would have killed him. He said something just snapped in his dog. He's has since gotten two more Pits, WHICH I CAN'T FAULT HIM FOR THAT.


----------



## Gracie

Like I said before...dogs are like people. Some just have a few screws loose....or worse, some kind of anyurism (spelling?), or a brain tumor. They don't just turn bad because they have an agenda. They just have a problem and unfortunately...they have teeth. And jaws. I pity the person they hurt or attack...but I pity the dog too.


----------



## Gracie

See....it took awhile for me to actually talk to the vet the day gracie was put down. THEY thought it was epilepsy. It was a brain tumor after all. She could not be saved. When she was a puppy and I brought her home from the swap meet where she was being sold for 50 bucks, once we got her home, she was afraid of brooms. She was afraid to come in the house. She didn't like being touched on the head at all. You could pet her back, her butt, her chest, her belly. But not her head. It took about 4 years before she would let me kiss her right between the eyes, my hands gently on each side of her head as I kissed her. She was no longer so afraid. But I think those people bonked her with a broom, or hit her on the head, or did some other damage to her brain. It didn't manifest into a tumor until she was 8 years old. So no telling what ANY dog experiences in their lifetime that will turn into something else. Like alzheimers in people. One minute, they are smart business people. The next? Vegetables. Ya just never know.


----------



## Esmeralda

Gracie said:


> Exterminate all pits? That I don't agree with. That was suggested with dobies many moons ago. If they had done that, I would never have found Blue. He was a gunmetal blue doberman, full blood. He was about 5 years old, scars all over his head. His owners moved in next door when I lived in the valley, and they asked if I wanted their guard dog. I said let me meet him. So they took me to the abode they were vacating and there he was..locked in a cage full of dog shit, empty water bowl. The top of his head had scars all over it from being pistol whipped, his job was as a rental for junkyards. He was chained...and IN the cage as well. I immediately had tears slip down my face as I approached him, growling and snapping and tugging at his chain to get to me. I put my hands on the bars of the cage and spoke softly to him. I told him he was beautiful. I would never ever hit or hurt him. I would feed him, give him fresh water, let him sleep in my house. One rule. The cat is MINE. I said Cat/MINE quite a few times. During my convo with him, he sat in his own excrement, pointed ears cocked to my voice. He never growled again. Never snapped. He just sat there and listened. So I told the guy yes..I wanted him. I asked Blue if he wanted me, too. He stood up and the guy entered teh cage and unchained him, leashed him, handed me the leash. I stood there and said "I am yours. You are mine. Cat is mine. Don't hurt what is ours" and I took him home. He sat politely in the front seat with me. Soon as I got him home, he saw the cat. But he just looked. Then looked at me and I said MINE. He walked in the house, met Candy, my white sheperd mix, sniffed her, fell in love. They had puppies about a year later. Blue was my lap dog. He licked the bags off the puppies as they came out. He cleaned them. He was a proud papa. I left him with a friend because I had to travel with hubby for a week and when I got back..she sold him to bikers to protect their bikes. I looked everywhere for him. I gave out flyers with a reward. I never found him. I hope he met Gracie and is happy there with her. And I WILL see him again.
> 
> Dogs are smart. They can sense things. Dobies are awesome. I am so glad they were not exterminated.



That's an amazing story, but very, very sad your 'friend' sold him to bikers. I'd want to kill her.  I don't suggest doberman's be exterminated, but they have a role in the human community: pitbulls don't.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Esmeralda said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Exterminate all pits? That I don't agree with. That was suggested with dobies many moons ago. If they had done that, I would never have found Blue. He was a gunmetal blue doberman, full blood. He was about 5 years old, scars all over his head. His owners moved in next door when I lived in the valley, and they asked if I wanted their guard dog. I said let me meet him. So they took me to the abode they were vacating and there he was..locked in a cage full of dog shit, empty water bowl. The top of his head had scars all over it from being pistol whipped, his job was as a rental for junkyards. He was chained...and IN the cage as well. I immediately had tears slip down my face as I approached him, growling and snapping and tugging at his chain to get to me. I put my hands on the bars of the cage and spoke softly to him. I told him he was beautiful. I would never ever hit or hurt him. I would feed him, give him fresh water, let him sleep in my house. One rule. The cat is MINE. I said Cat/MINE quite a few times. During my convo with him, he sat in his own excrement, pointed ears cocked to my voice. He never growled again. Never snapped. He just sat there and listened. So I told the guy yes..I wanted him. I asked Blue if he wanted me, too. He stood up and the guy entered teh cage and unchained him, leashed him, handed me the leash. I stood there and said "I am yours. You are mine. Cat is mine. Don't hurt what is ours" and I took him home. He sat politely in the front seat with me. Soon as I got him home, he saw the cat. But he just looked. Then looked at me and I said MINE. He walked in the house, met Candy, my white sheperd mix, sniffed her, fell in love. They had puppies about a year later. Blue was my lap dog. He licked the bags off the puppies as they came out. He cleaned them. He was a proud papa. I left him with a friend because I had to travel with hubby for a week and when I got back..she sold him to bikers to protect their bikes. I looked everywhere for him. I gave out flyers with a reward. I never found him. I hope he met Gracie and is happy there with her. And I WILL see him again.
> 
> Dogs are smart. They can sense things. Dobies are awesome. I am so glad they were not exterminated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's an amazing story, but very, very sad your 'friend' sold him to bikers. I'd want to kill her.  *I don't suggest doberman's be exterminated, but they have a role in the human community: pitbulls don't.*
Click to expand...


Horse shit. I'd rather have pitbulls on earth than mother fucking liberals.


----------



## Gracie

Esmeralda said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Exterminate all pits? That I don't agree with. That was suggested with dobies many moons ago. If they had done that, I would never have found Blue. He was a gunmetal blue doberman, full blood. He was about 5 years old, scars all over his head. His owners moved in next door when I lived in the valley, and they asked if I wanted their guard dog. I said let me meet him. So they took me to the abode they were vacating and there he was..locked in a cage full of dog shit, empty water bowl. The top of his head had scars all over it from being pistol whipped, his job was as a rental for junkyards. He was chained...and IN the cage as well. I immediately had tears slip down my face as I approached him, growling and snapping and tugging at his chain to get to me. I put my hands on the bars of the cage and spoke softly to him. I told him he was beautiful. I would never ever hit or hurt him. I would feed him, give him fresh water, let him sleep in my house. One rule. The cat is MINE. I said Cat/MINE quite a few times. During my convo with him, he sat in his own excrement, pointed ears cocked to my voice. He never growled again. Never snapped. He just sat there and listened. So I told the guy yes..I wanted him. I asked Blue if he wanted me, too. He stood up and the guy entered teh cage and unchained him, leashed him, handed me the leash. I stood there and said "I am yours. You are mine. Cat is mine. Don't hurt what is ours" and I took him home. He sat politely in the front seat with me. Soon as I got him home, he saw the cat. But he just looked. Then looked at me and I said MINE. He walked in the house, met Candy, my white sheperd mix, sniffed her, fell in love. They had puppies about a year later. Blue was my lap dog. He licked the bags off the puppies as they came out. He cleaned them. He was a proud papa. I left him with a friend because I had to travel with hubby for a week and when I got back..she sold him to bikers to protect their bikes. I looked everywhere for him. I gave out flyers with a reward. I never found him. I hope he met Gracie and is happy there with her. And I WILL see him again.
> 
> Dogs are smart. They can sense things. Dobies are awesome. I am so glad they were not exterminated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's an amazing story, but very, very sad your 'friend' sold him to bikers. I'd want to kill her.  I don't suggest doberman's be exterminated, but they have a role in the human community: pitbulls don't.
Click to expand...


Actually, I did want to kill her. I am ferocious when it comes to my furkids. But I never found HER either. Lucky her.


----------



## Gracie

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Exterminate all pits? That I don't agree with. That was suggested with dobies many moons ago. If they had done that, I would never have found Blue. He was a gunmetal blue doberman, full blood. He was about 5 years old, scars all over his head. His owners moved in next door when I lived in the valley, and they asked if I wanted their guard dog. I said let me meet him. So they took me to the abode they were vacating and there he was..locked in a cage full of dog shit, empty water bowl. The top of his head had scars all over it from being pistol whipped, his job was as a rental for junkyards. He was chained...and IN the cage as well. I immediately had tears slip down my face as I approached him, growling and snapping and tugging at his chain to get to me. I put my hands on the bars of the cage and spoke softly to him. I told him he was beautiful. I would never ever hit or hurt him. I would feed him, give him fresh water, let him sleep in my house. One rule. The cat is MINE. I said Cat/MINE quite a few times. During my convo with him, he sat in his own excrement, pointed ears cocked to my voice. He never growled again. Never snapped. He just sat there and listened. So I told the guy yes..I wanted him. I asked Blue if he wanted me, too. He stood up and the guy entered teh cage and unchained him, leashed him, handed me the leash. I stood there and said "I am yours. You are mine. Cat is mine. Don't hurt what is ours" and I took him home. He sat politely in the front seat with me. Soon as I got him home, he saw the cat. But he just looked. Then looked at me and I said MINE. He walked in the house, met Candy, my white sheperd mix, sniffed her, fell in love. They had puppies about a year later. Blue was my lap dog. He licked the bags off the puppies as they came out. He cleaned them. He was a proud papa. I left him with a friend because I had to travel with hubby for a week and when I got back..she sold him to bikers to protect their bikes. I looked everywhere for him. I gave out flyers with a reward. I never found him. I hope he met Gracie and is happy there with her. And I WILL see him again.
> 
> Dogs are smart. They can sense things. Dobies are awesome. I am so glad they were not exterminated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's an amazing story, but very, very sad your 'friend' sold him to bikers. I'd want to kill her.  *I don't suggest doberman's be exterminated, but they have a role in the human community: pitbulls don't.*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Horse shit. I'd rather have pitbulls on earth than mother fucking liberals.
Click to expand...


Oh please. Not politics AGAIN!!!


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Gracie said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's an amazing story, but very, very sad your 'friend' sold him to bikers. I'd want to kill her.  *I don't suggest doberman's be exterminated, but they have a role in the human community: pitbulls don't.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Horse shit. I'd rather have pitbulls on earth than mother fucking liberals.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh please. Not politics AGAIN!!!
Click to expand...


What's so political about it? that person thinks pitbulls have no value, and I think liberals have even less value to humans.


----------



## Esmeralda

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Horse shit. I'd rather have pitbulls on earth than mother fucking liberals.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh please. Not politics AGAIN!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What's so political about it? that person thinks pitbulls have no value, and I think liberals have even less value to humans.
Click to expand...


What would you do if one of your kids was a liberal? Stop loving him? Be abusive?  Say  he is worthless and has no place on this Earth?  Tell him he has no value as a human being?


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Esmeralda said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh please. Not politics AGAIN!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's so political about it? that person thinks pitbulls have no value, and I think liberals have even less value to humans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What would you do if one of your kids was a liberal? Stop loving him? Be abusive?  Say  he is worthless and has no place on this Earth?  Tell him he has no value as a human being?
Click to expand...

That ain't never going to happen. but yes he would be dead to me.


----------



## Esmeralda

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's so political about it? that person thinks pitbulls have no value, and I think liberals have even less value to humans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What would you do if one of your kids was a liberal? Stop loving him? Be abusive?  Say  he is worthless and has no place on this Earth?  Tell him he has no value as a human being?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That ain't never going to happen. but yes he would be dead to me.
Click to expand...


That's just pathetic.


----------



## Sallow

G.T. said:


> Still waiting on that percentage of pit bulls who attack



You can wait till the cows come home.

People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.

If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.


----------



## G.T.

Sallow said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on that percentage of pit bulls who attack
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
Click to expand...


Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person. 

They're not anywhere.


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on that percentage of pit bulls who attack
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
Click to expand...

http://www.dogsbite.org/dogsbite-recent-dog-bite-statistics.php

% Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012

*60% (151) Pit bull*
13% (32) Rottweiler
4% (10) Husky
4% (10) Mixed breed
3.6% (9) American bulldog
3.6% (9) German shepherd
3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
2% (5) Boxer
1.6% (4) Malamute
1.6% (4) Labrador
3.6% (3 and less) Combination*

60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.



Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
to December 2008
A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.

Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13

http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics.php


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on that percentage of pit bulls who attack
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
Click to expand...


So, basically, your stance is that pitbulls are 'terribly abused,' far, far more than any other dog and that is why 60% of all deadly dog attacks are done by pitbulls? Right.  You betcha.


----------



## WinterBorn

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Got a little reading comprehension there, Alice?  Seems you're even dumber than your picture....backtrack and read about how you get ahold of the dog's collar in the first place ya racist punk.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, now I am a racist?   I'd love to hear the reasons behind that bit of invented nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why not?  You're a cracker from Alabama....dumbest humps in the country...you don't know shit from shinola about dogs.....too dumb to remember what you read five minutes ago, I'd be surprised if you could light that ceegar you're sucking on without assistance.   Face it boy, you were reduced to calling a man who's clearly your superior in all ways a "pretender"...you and Swallow should move someplace where they let gay racists wed...you two are a matched set.
Click to expand...


My superior?   LMAO!   That is rich.  Yeah, thanks for the laugh with my morning coffee.

You'd be hard pressed to show me as either a cracker or dumb.  I'd be happy to match intellects with you any day.  But I doubt you have the balls for that.

But feel free to keep trying to prove your "superiority".   Those with an inferiority complex typically need to prove themselves.  I see you do so by trying to be an internet badass and a troll.   I find it amusing.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, basically, your stance is that pitbulls are 'terribly abused,' far, far more than any other dog and that is why 60% of all deadly dog attacks are done by pitbulls? Right.  You betcha.
Click to expand...


Thats really what you got from what I said?

Pretty weird.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Chart Key
> % Deaths Dog Breed
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
Click to expand...


This doesn't show the percent of pit bulls who attack.

It shows the percent of total attacks done by pit bulls.


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Chart Key
> % Deaths Dog Breed
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This doesn't show the percent of pit bulls who attack.
> 
> It shows the percent of total attacks done by pit bulls.
Click to expand...


If you want some kind of specific information, do the research yourself. It's just pitiful to expect others to do it for you.


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Chart Key
> % Deaths Dog Breed
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This doesn't show the percent of pit bulls who attack.
> 
> It shows the percent of total attacks done by pit bulls.
Click to expand...


Asshat... The only way that Statistic is looking good for Pitbulls is if they are 60% of the Dog Population... 

Holy Shit, you are really in Rare form lately with your Ability to Excuse some Fucked-up Shit...

Sucker Punching Faggot. 



peace...


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, basically, your stance is that pitbulls are 'terribly abused,' far, far more than any other dog and that is why 60% of all deadly dog attacks are done by pitbulls? Right.  You betcha.
Click to expand...


The research done by the CDC shows pits are not the terrors they are claimed to be in this thread.  I trust them more than sensationalistic media.

Try this little game and see if you can identify the actual pit bull terrier:   findpitbull_v4

The American Temperament Testing Society lists pits as in the  80% range, which is higher than the average breed for temperament.

I have seen figures as high as 75% concerning misidentification of pit bulls.

Pits are even used as Therapy dogs in hospitals and nursing homes.  Pit Bulls Are Therapy Dogs

The fact that a tiny percentage of any breed attacks is not even close to a reason to malign an entire breed.  And when the breed is misidentified as often as pits, it becomes even more ridiculous.


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
Click to expand...


And who identified the dogs as pit bulls?

Difficulty of Breed Identification | Stop BSL


----------



## Esmeralda

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Chart Key
> % Deaths Dog Breed
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This doesn't show the percent of pit bulls who attack.
> 
> It shows the percent of total attacks done by pit bulls.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Asshat... The only way that Statistic is looking good for Pitbulls is if they are 60% of the Dog Population...
> 
> Holy Shit, you are really in Rare form lately with your Ability to Excuse some Fucked-up Shit...
> 
> Sucker Punching Faggot.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...




> In 198687 there were about 12 million pit bulls in the U.S., approximately 2% of the dogs in the country, and in 2004 there were at least 2 million pit bulls in the U.S



In 2004, approximately 2% of the dogs in the US were pitbulls. These 2% were the cause of 60% of the dog attacks resulting in death.  Again, how much more does anyone need to know???


----------



## Esmeralda

WinterBorn said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And who identified the dogs as pit bulls?
> 
> Difficulty of Breed Identification | Stop BSL
Click to expand...


This is just another pathetic excuse made by shameless people who don't care how many innocent people, especially children, are torn apart by these vicious dogs.


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And who identified the dogs as pit bulls?
> 
> Difficulty of Breed Identification | Stop BSL
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is just another pathetic excuse made by shameless people who don't care how many innocent people, especially children, are torn apart by these vicious dogs.
Click to expand...


LMAO!!    My post is shameless?

Your link is to a website created by a woman who was mauled by a pit.  And her stats claim that 96% of all dog bites are by pure breed dogs?   You really think that is valid?

I go with the experts.  The CDC disagrees with your info.

Did you take the challenge of the link I posted to identify the pit bull?


----------



## Sunshine

Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think there's ample evidence that Pits are a dangerous breed of dog.....all dogs can be made menacing with abuse or neglect. But I doubt you'll find hundreds of accounts of a collie or golden retriever ripping innocent bystanders or even family members apart for no apparent reason other than they were around when the thing went off.....to wit:
> 
> https://www.google.com/#q=pit+bull+attacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree. The vast majority of pits I know are awesome, I love the breed.  But you have idiots breeding dogs to sell to people that have no business owning a dog.  Or any living thing.  I wish the Pit Bull community would take their breed's image more seriously and stop trying to promote them as a cool tough breed - have you ever looked at some of the breeder websites?  They do their breed no favors
Click to expand...


That occurs with every breed, not just pits.


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> This doesn't show the percent of pit bulls who attack.
> 
> It shows the percent of total attacks done by pit bulls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asshat... The only way that Statistic is looking good for Pitbulls is if they are 60% of the Dog Population...
> 
> Holy Shit, you are really in Rare form lately with your Ability to Excuse some Fucked-up Shit...
> 
> Sucker Punching Faggot.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In 198687 there were about 12 million pit bulls in the U.S., approximately 2% of the dogs in the country, and in 2004 there were at least 2 million pit bulls in the U.S
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In 2004, approximately 2% of the dogs in the US were pitbulls. These 2% were the cause of 60% of the dog attacks resulting in death.  Again, how much more does anyone need to know???
Click to expand...


In addition to questioning how the dogs were identified as pit bulls, I would question who counted the actual pit bull terriers in the US.

But if we use your highly suspect numbers, 2 million dogs and 151 attacks, that means 0.008% of the pit bulls in this country have reportedly attacked someone

So 99.992% of pit bulls have never attacked.   And you want the breed banned for that?

Wow.   Just wow.


----------



## Esmeralda

WinterBorn said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> And who identified the dogs as pit bulls?
> 
> Difficulty of Breed Identification | Stop BSL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is just another pathetic excuse made by shameless people who don't care how many innocent people, especially children, are torn apart by these vicious dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LMAO!!    My post is shameless?
> 
> Your link is to a website created by a woman who was mauled by a pit.  And her stats claim that 96% of all dog bites are by pure breed dogs?   You really think that is valid?
> 
> I go with the experts.  The CDC disagrees with your info.
> 
> Did you take the challenge of the link I posted to identify the pit bull?
Click to expand...


When the dogs are killed and taken to the vet, they are identified as pits.  If they are not purebred but 90 or 80 or 70 percent pit, it makes no difference, they are mostly pit.  Why would anyone defend them? Wait unitl your daughter's pit attacks her or one of children, or even you, then you'll change your tune.


----------



## mal

I don't want any Breed Banned... But I know 3 People Close to me that have been Mauled by "Family" Dogs including a Baby...

That's 3 too many. 



peace...


----------



## Sallow

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can wait till the cows come home.
> 
> People are cherry picking dog bite stories. And seriously? If you dig into most of them, you find that the dog was terribly abused first.
> 
> If dogs could talk you'd probably hear some pretty horrific shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
Click to expand...


So 151 fatalities over a period of 7 years and some folks want to decimate a breed of dog?

How many fatalities over the same period from guns? How about cars? How about bad food from restaurants?

Man..the things people obsess over really makes you think.


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And who identified the dogs as pit bulls?
> 
> Difficulty of Breed Identification | Stop BSL
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is just another pathetic excuse made by shameless people who don't care how many innocent people, especially children, are torn apart by these vicious dogs.
Click to expand...


50 children a year are killed by their cribs.  A child is 25 times more likely to die because of a crib than because of a pit bull.


----------



## mal

I think dog attacks are WAY Higher than Reported... I know of many in my Life that were never Reported... And so does everyone else on this Thread.

Or how about the Attacks that were Stopped short of a 3 Year Old being Mauled?...



peace...


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Chart Key
> % Deaths Dog Breed
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This doesn't show the percent of pit bulls who attack.
> 
> It shows the percent of total attacks done by pit bulls.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Asshat... The only way that Statistic is looking good for Pitbulls is if they are 60% of the Dog Population...
> 
> Holy Shit, you are really in Rare form lately with your Ability to Excuse some Fucked-up Shit...
> 
> Sucker Punching Faggot.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


You're a fucking moron, nobody questions that. 

& it does matter. It matters quite a bit. 

Say, for example, there are 50million dogs in America. 

Of those, 2% are pitbulls. So, there are a million pit bulls. 

So using her numbers, 251 total deaths (her numbers add to 245, but her site says 251). 

This is over a 7 year period. 

6% of 251 = 150.6, or 151 rounded up. 

So if there ARE 1 million pit bulls, the chances of one killing are 151 into one million, or 0.0151%.





That's why the numbers matter, but having an adult conversation with YOU is like pulling teeth, 1. because you're retarded. 2. because you're flat out fucking dumb. 3. you're just a dishonest troll. 


Now, I was asking about the numbers because they do, indeed - matter. 

WHY? Because if you have less of a chance of getting bit by a pit bull than getting struck by lightning, then this is reactionary bullshit due to media hype. Numbers, math, facts, data. They all matter.


----------



## G.T.

Sallow said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yea the stories don't mean much unless there's some numbers behind them. I just want to know if anyone has the percent chance that if you have a pit bull, he will attack a person.
> 
> They're not anywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So 151 fatalities over a period of 7 years and some folks want to decimate a breed of dog?
> 
> How many fatalities over the same period from guns? How about cars? How about bad food from restaurants?
> 
> Man..the things people obsess over really makes you think.
Click to expand...


Numbers are hard for some people.


----------



## WinterBorn

If you want to see a tragedy, look at the numbers of pit bulls abused and killed by their owners.


----------



## G.T.

And I haven't even made my decision. 

My choice is : more information is necessary to form an honest opinion. 

To morons, that is "dismissing it."

To intelligent people, this is being pragmatic.


----------



## Sallow

WinterBorn said:


> If you want to see a tragedy, look at the numbers of pit bulls abused and killed by their owners.



It's a travesty a guy like Michael Vick is allowed to have dogs.

At the very least..he should have gotten a lifetime ban from dog ownership.


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most Recent U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - Fatal and Serious Injury Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> % Deaths Dog Breed - 2005-2012
> 
> *60% (151) Pit bull*
> 13% (32) Rottweiler
> 4% (10) Husky
> 4% (10) Mixed breed
> 3.6% (9) American bulldog
> 3.6% (9) German shepherd
> 3% (8) Mastiff/bullmastiff
> 2% (5) Boxer
> 1.6% (4) Malamute
> 1.6% (4) Labrador
> 3.6% (3 and less) Combination*
> 
> 60% of all dog attacks that result in DEATH are by pitbulls. What more does anyone need to know?  These dogs are not fit to be living within the human community. They put everyone at risk.  All other deadly dog attacks combined are not as much as deadly pitbull attacks combined.
> 
> 
> 
> Report: U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities January 2006
> to December 2008
> A 2009 report issued by DogsBite.org shows that 19 dog breeds contributed to 88 deaths in a recent 3-year period. Pit bulls accounted for 59% followed by rottweilers with 14%.
> 
> Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
> The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13
> 
> U.S. Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So 151 fatalities over a period of 7 years and some folks want to decimate a breed of dog?
> 
> How many fatalities over the same period from guns? How about cars? How about bad food from restaurants?
> 
> Man..the things people obsess over really makes you think.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Numbers are hard for some people.
Click to expand...


I'd like to get rid of all the guns too. These are 151 unnecessary deaths, usually children or the most vulnerable adults, elderly people.  It is completely unnecessary.  People do not need to own pitbulls.  Pathetic to support this breed.

Numbers are hard for some people?  Clear thinking is hard for many. These stats are just about 'deadly' attacks. They don't include where the dog rips off half your face or takes off an arm or two, like in the OP. Funny. You forgot about that, eh?  At least the poor woman isn't dead. She just lost one of her arms and half of another, and has dog bites all over her body.  Lucky her.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Deleted accidental double post.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

2-year-old special needs boy killed by trio of pit bulls*after dogs start to fight in babysitter?s Arizona home* - NY Daily News



> The toddler was with his siblings at the babysitter's Gilbert home when the dogs began to fight. The boy somehow got trapped in the middle when they attacked, and the frantic babysitter was seriously injured trying in vain to pull him free.



Pack of stray dogs brutally attacks Houston woman, causing heart attack - NY Daily News


> A pack of wild dogs mauled a Houston woman on her way to work Monday morning, leaving her in critical condition.
> 
> Maria Arcos, 52, was walking under an overpass when the pack of at least 15 strays ramped up their bloodcurdling barks into bitter bites.



VIDEO: Dog dumped down Houston sewer, set on fire and left to burn to death* - NY Daily News



> Grainy security footage captured the horrific killing of the pit bull Saturday morning. Cops were speaking Monday morning to &#8216;persons of interest&#8217; in the case, including the dog owner's son.


Boy, 6, carrying Burger King bag mauled by pit bull in Queens* - NY Daily News



> The pit bull tore into the boy's leg and didn't let go until a bystander attacked the dog with a metal pipe.



Florida mom mauled while shielding 6-year-old daughter from pack of pit bulls* - NY Daily News



> Police said the woman shielded her young daughter and told her to run after the pack of dogs pounced.



http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...survives-brutal-ear-cutting-article-1.1490462


> The Pennsylvania pit bull was reportedly being trained to be a fighting dog. He was abandoned in Upper Darby and taken to Stoney Creek Veterinarian Hospital, bleeding profusely from both ears ... An 8-week-old puppy was found nearly bleeding to death on Wednesday after its ears were cut off.









http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...d-recover-tossed-moving-car-article-1.1462890


> A yellow lab puppy tossed from a moving car suffered broken bones and bruises, but &#8216;Frankie&#8217; expected to heal and needs new home, Pa. animal volunteers say



IMO, most dogs are better than some of their human owners and most of the problems with dogs are caused by humans. 

And, of course, its not just dogs.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/kitten-survives-toss-floor-window-article-1.1312470



> The five-week-old feline Precious landed on her feet after being flung out of a window following a dispute between the owner and her ex-boyfriend.








And, its not just domesticated animals. Watch the "reality" shows about animals attacking people and every single time, its the human's fault for being really really stupid.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> So 151 fatalities over a period of 7 years and some folks want to decimate a breed of dog?
> 
> How many fatalities over the same period from guns? How about cars? How about bad food from restaurants?
> 
> Man..the things people obsess over really makes you think.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Numbers are hard for some people.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'd like to get rid of all the guns too. These are 151 unnecessary deaths, usually children or the most vulnerable adults, elderly people.  It is completely unnecessary.  People do not need to own pitbulls.  Pathetic to support this breed.
Click to expand...


I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear. 

It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"

No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers. 

And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either. 

Reality doesn't matter to you?


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> And I haven't even made my decision.
> 
> My choice is : more information is necessary to form an honest opinion.
> 
> To morons, that is "dismissing it."
> 
> To intelligent people, this is being pragmatic.



You Dismissed it you Sucker Punching Faggot... 

60% of Fatalities by Dog Attacks come from Pitbulls...

You either look up the Stats on what Percentage of the Dog Pop Pitbulls are yourself and then still Realize that 60% is a LOT, or you do your best look like you are on the Pitbull Side of this Debate with your Dismissive post.

The Fact that you have to Announce yourself as "Intelligent" Speaks Volumes to just how Stupid your Pre-Op ass is there, Boob. 



peace...


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Numbers are hard for some people.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to get rid of all the guns too. These are 151 unnecessary deaths, usually children or the most vulnerable adults, elderly people.  It is completely unnecessary.  People do not need to own pitbulls.  Pathetic to support this breed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear.
> 
> It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"
> 
> No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers.
> 
> And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either.
> 
> Reality doesn't matter to you?
Click to expand...


Liberals who Attempt to be Neutral on an Issue they so Clearly are NOT Neutral on are Beyond Pathetic...



peace...


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to get rid of all the guns too. These are 151 unnecessary deaths, usually children or the most vulnerable adults, elderly people.  It is completely unnecessary.  People do not need to own pitbulls.  Pathetic to support this breed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear.
> 
> It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"
> 
> No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers.
> 
> And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either.
> 
> Reality doesn't matter to you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Liberals who Attempt to be Neutral on an Issue they so Clearly are NOT Neutral on are Beyond Pathetic...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


Let the adults talk. You cant even keep an intelligent discussion in your own damn thread you pathetic louse. 

Numbers matter. You're just d-u-m-b, we know dude. We know.


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Numbers are hard for some people.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to get rid of all the guns too. These are 151 unnecessary deaths, usually children or the most vulnerable adults, elderly people.  It is completely unnecessary.  People do not need to own pitbulls.  Pathetic to support this breed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear.
> 
> It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"
> 
> No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers.
> 
> And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either.
> 
> Reality doesn't matter to you?
Click to expand...


This is the perfect picture of poor logic.  There is no correlation between human beings and dogs. We are not talking about getting rid of human beings. We are talking, I am talking, about getting rid of an unncessary element that is causing  harm to human beings in civilized society.  To try to make a logical connection betwen pitbulls and humans is ludicrous and as logic, completely failure.  Are you going to start comparing the pest control problem of rats, cockroaches, etc. to human beings too? Essentially, pitbulls are a pest control problem. They cause harm to civilized people and need to be eliminated as much as possible, just like rats, just like cockroaches. They have no value to society, none whatsoever.


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> And I haven't even made my decision.
> 
> My choice is : more information is necessary to form an honest opinion.
> 
> To morons, that is "dismissing it."
> 
> To intelligent people, this is being pragmatic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You Dismissed it you Sucker Punching Faggot...
> 
> 60% of Fatalities by Dog Attacks come from Pitbulls...
> 
> You either look up the Stats on what Percentage of the Dog Pop Pitbulls are yourself and then still Realize that 60% is a LOT, or you do your best look like you are on the Pitbull Side of this Debate with your Dismissive post.
> 
> The Fact that you have to Announce yourself as "Intelligent" Speaks Volumes to just how Stupid your Pre-Op ass is there, Boob.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


So stupid it hurts. 

The 60% number is quite insignificant without other data - dumb fuck. 

It only tells you: pit bulls' temperament vs. other breeds. 

It doesn't  tell you: pit bulls' temperament. 

I know already that you don't know the difference between those two. Because you're an idiot.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> To intelligent people, this is being pragmatic.



I find absolutely nothing intelligent nor pragmatic about your take on the subject.

But that's just one man's opinion.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to get rid of all the guns too. These are 151 unnecessary deaths, usually children or the most vulnerable adults, elderly people.  It is completely unnecessary.  People do not need to own pitbulls.  Pathetic to support this breed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear.
> 
> It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"
> 
> No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers.
> 
> And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either.
> 
> Reality doesn't matter to you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is the perfect picture of poor logic.  There is no correlation between human beings and dogs. We are not talking about getting rid of human beings. We are talking, I am talking, about getting rid of an unncessary element that is causing  harm to human beings in civilized society.  To try to make a logical connection betwen pitbulls and humans is ludicrous and as logic, completely failure.  Are you going to start comparing the pest control problem of rats, cockroaches, etc. to human beings too? Essentially, pitbulls are a pest control problem. They cause harm to civilized people and need to be eliminated as much as possible, just like rats, just like cockroaches. They have no value to society, none whatsoever.
Click to expand...


I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction

To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction



It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> To intelligent people, this is being pragmatic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I find absolutely nothing intelligent nor pragmatic about your take on the subject.
> 
> But that's just one man's opinion.
Click to expand...


If you're not going to explain, this post is worthless trolling.


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear.
> 
> It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"
> 
> No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers.
> 
> And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either.
> 
> Reality doesn't matter to you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the perfect picture of poor logic.  There is no correlation between human beings and dogs. We are not talking about getting rid of human beings. We are talking, I am talking, about getting rid of an unncessary element that is causing  harm to human beings in civilized society.  To try to make a logical connection betwen pitbulls and humans is ludicrous and as logic, completely failure.  Are you going to start comparing the pest control problem of rats, cockroaches, etc. to human beings too? Essentially, pitbulls are a pest control problem. They cause harm to civilized people and need to be eliminated as much as possible, just like rats, just like cockroaches. They have no value to society, none whatsoever.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> 
> 
> It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.
Click to expand...


^Look... The Wigger could have done the Math earlier on... But he wants to Appear like's Educated... Thoughtful... Objective... Like he wants to Appear like he's Urban when he's got his Rapper Costume on...

Sucker Punching Faggot. 



peace...


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> To intelligent people, this is being pragmatic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I find absolutely nothing intelligent nor pragmatic about your take on the subject.
> 
> But that's just one man's opinion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you're not going to explain, this post is worthless trolling.
Click to expand...


I tried to explain already and failed. Apparently the mountain of ignorance was too steep even for me.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find absolutely nothing intelligent nor pragmatic about your take on the subject.
> 
> But that's just one man's opinion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you're not going to explain, this post is worthless trolling.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I tried to explain already and failed. Apparently the mountain of ignorance was too steep even for me.
Click to expand...


That's a concession mani, thanks boss. 

The ignorance is yours. You're apparently in favor of jumping to conclusions like the rest of the idiots without any factual data to make a reasonable conclusion. 

That is, indeed, ignorance.


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the perfect picture of poor logic.  There is no correlation between human beings and dogs. We are not talking about getting rid of human beings. We are talking, I am talking, about getting rid of an unncessary element that is causing  harm to human beings in civilized society.  To try to make a logical connection betwen pitbulls and humans is ludicrous and as logic, completely failure.  Are you going to start comparing the pest control problem of rats, cockroaches, etc. to human beings too? Essentially, pitbulls are a pest control problem. They cause harm to civilized people and need to be eliminated as much as possible, just like rats, just like cockroaches. They have no value to society, none whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> 
> 
> It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ^Look... The Wigger could have done the Math earlier on... But he wants to Appear like's Educated... Thoughtful... Objective... Like he wants to Appear like he's Urban when he's got his Rapper Costume on...
> 
> Sucker Punching Faggot.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


Toddler shit ^


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you're not going to explain, this post is worthless trolling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried to explain already and failed. Apparently the mountain of ignorance was too steep even for me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's a concession mani, thanks boss.
> 
> The ignorance is yours. You're apparently in favor of jumping to conclusions like the rest of the idiots without any factual data to make a reasonable conclusion.
> 
> That is, indeed, ignorance.
Click to expand...


Hey Slappy... What Conlcusion did I jump to?... 



peace...


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> 
> 
> It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^Look... The Wigger could have done the Math earlier on... But he wants to Appear like's Educated... Thoughtful... Objective... Like he wants to Appear like he's Urban when he's got his Rapper Costume on...
> 
> Sucker Punching Faggot.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Toddler shit ^
Click to expand...


Sucker Punching, Pre-Op, ******-wanna-be Faggot ^ 



peace...


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> I tried to explain already and failed. Apparently the mountain of ignorance was too steep even for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's a concession mani, thanks boss.
> 
> The ignorance is yours. You're apparently in favor of jumping to conclusions like the rest of the idiots without any factual data to make a reasonable conclusion.
> 
> That is, indeed, ignorance.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey Slappy... What Conlcusion did I jump to?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


^ coward


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> ^Look... The Wigger could have done the Math earlier on... But he wants to Appear like's Educated... Thoughtful... Objective... Like he wants to Appear like he's Urban when he's got his Rapper Costume on...
> 
> Sucker Punching Faggot.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Toddler shit ^
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sucker Punching, Pre-Op, ******-wanna-be Faggot ^
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


toddler ^


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you're not going to explain, this post is worthless trolling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried to explain already and failed. Apparently the mountain of ignorance was too steep even for me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's a concession mani, thanks boss.
> 
> The ignorance is yours. You're apparently in favor of jumping to conclusions like the rest of the idiots without any factual data to make a reasonable conclusion.
> 
> That is, indeed, ignorance.
Click to expand...


I bow to your mad internet debate skillz and iron clad logic.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> I tried to explain already and failed. Apparently the mountain of ignorance was too steep even for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's a concession mani, thanks boss.
> 
> The ignorance is yours. You're apparently in favor of jumping to conclusions like the rest of the idiots without any factual data to make a reasonable conclusion.
> 
> That is, indeed, ignorance.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I bow to your mad internet debate skillz and iron clad logic.
Click to expand...


yea, deude


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's a concession mani, thanks boss.
> 
> The ignorance is yours. You're apparently in favor of jumping to conclusions like the rest of the idiots without any factual data to make a reasonable conclusion.
> 
> That is, indeed, ignorance.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I bow to your mad internet debate skillz and iron clad logic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yea, deude
Click to expand...


In fact, I recommend you get yourself three pitbulls, Pythagoras.


----------



## G.T.

No dogs at all, for me. I have a 2 year old. I don't recommend any dogs for young children. I think I said that like my 3 or so post in this thread.


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not supporting the breed. I'm not being against the breed. I believe the data at this point is unclear.
> 
> It's pathetic to be reactionary instead of visionary. Numbers matter. If there are 17, 000 murders in the US a year, should we say that "it's pathetic to support human beings in the United States?"
> 
> No, because the vast majority of human beings aren't murderers.
> 
> And similarly, so far, it looks like the vast majority of pit bulls aren't either.
> 
> Reality doesn't matter to you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the perfect picture of poor logic.  There is no correlation between human beings and dogs. We are not talking about getting rid of human beings. We are talking, I am talking, about getting rid of an unncessary element that is causing  harm to human beings in civilized society.  To try to make a logical connection betwen pitbulls and humans is ludicrous and as logic, completely failure.  Are you going to start comparing the pest control problem of rats, cockroaches, etc. to human beings too? Essentially, pitbulls are a pest control problem. They cause harm to civilized people and need to be eliminated as much as possible, just like rats, just like cockroaches. They have no value to society, none whatsoever.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> 
> 
> It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.
Click to expand...


You are willing to gamble with human life, and ready to accept there will be casualities.  I am not. We are talking about 151 completely unnecessary deaths, generally of the  most vulnerable in our society, children and the elderly.  There is no need for people to own pitbulls. There are probably nearly a hundred other breeds to choose a pet dog from.  If pitbulls never existed, no one would miss them.  If they disappeared, they would be soon forgotten. They are a toxic element in civilized society. The statistics I gave are of deaths only; they do not include all the maiming these dogs do. They also do not include all the other pet dogs and cats that pitbulls kill, which is substantial.  

You want to gamble based on percentages and accept a kill and maim rate: I don't.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the perfect picture of poor logic.  There is no correlation between human beings and dogs. We are not talking about getting rid of human beings. We are talking, I am talking, about getting rid of an unncessary element that is causing  harm to human beings in civilized society.  To try to make a logical connection betwen pitbulls and humans is ludicrous and as logic, completely failure.  Are you going to start comparing the pest control problem of rats, cockroaches, etc. to human beings too? Essentially, pitbulls are a pest control problem. They cause harm to civilized people and need to be eliminated as much as possible, just like rats, just like cockroaches. They have no value to society, none whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> 
> 
> It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are willing to gamble with human life, and ready to accept there will be casualities.  I am not. We are talking about 151 completely unnecessary deaths, generally of the  most vulnerable in our society, children and the elderly.  There is no need for people to own pitbulls. There are probably nearly a hundred other breeds to choose a pet dog from.  If pitbulls never existed, no one would miss them.  If they disappeared, they would be soon forgotten. They are a toxic element in civilized society. The statistics I gave are of deaths only; they do not include all the maiming these dogs do. They also do not include all the other pet dogs and cats that pitbulls kill, which is substantial.
> 
> You want to gamble based on percentages and accept a kill and maim rate: I don't.
Click to expand...


Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.  

Risks are worth it sometimes.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.



Then why does having a two year old prevent you from owning a pit bull? Do you not drive with your child in the car?

I mean, if everything is just a gamble afterall, why distinguish between various levels of risk?


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why does having a two year old prevent you from owning a pit bull? Do you not drive with your child in the car?
> 
> I mean, if everything is just a gamble afterall, why distinguish between various levels of risk?
Click to expand...


Because the age of the young child substantially increases the risk of a dog bite because they don't have a modicum of a clue how to treat a dog. I don't even think a dog has to be vicious in order to defend itself from what it perceives to be an attack. 

Driving with a kid in the car doesn't impair my driving. She's strapped in and noise doesn't effect me. I've been driving to loud music all of my life. 

Why distinguish between various levels of risk? Really? 

You chances of getting hit by a car while playing on your lawn versus playing on a busy street don't warrant a distinction? Really?


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I compared a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> To a % chance of something happening - and the subsequent reaction
> 
> 
> 
> It is piss poor logic to not look into whether not a breed is vicious before getting rid of it. If only 0.008% of the breed kill in a seven year period, it would be a pretty retarded thing to do. Especially since it's a living thing, the deaths are avoidable in many cases, and soo00o0oo0oo0o many other, NON LIVING things are WAY more dangerous. Like, driving.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are willing to gamble with human life, and ready to accept there will be casualities.  I am not. We are talking about 151 completely unnecessary deaths, generally of the  most vulnerable in our society, children and the elderly.  There is no need for people to own pitbulls. There are probably nearly a hundred other breeds to choose a pet dog from.  If pitbulls never existed, no one would miss them.  If they disappeared, they would be soon forgotten. They are a toxic element in civilized society. The statistics I gave are of deaths only; they do not include all the maiming these dogs do. They also do not include all the other pet dogs and cats that pitbulls kill, which is substantial.
> 
> You want to gamble based on percentages and accept a kill and maim rate: I don't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.
Click to expand...


Again, your logic is failing.  We need cars, we need airplanes. We do not need pitbulls.  They add nothing to society.  They are nothing but a problem, a pest, a deadly pest. It makes more sense to compare them to sharks or alligators, but sharks and alligators are part of the web of life.  Pitbulls are not comparable to cars or airplanes. They are not comparable to sharks or alligators because they have nothing to do with sustaining the web of life. There are completely unnecessary and disposable.


----------



## Coyote

gallantwarrior said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gallantwarrior said:
> 
> 
> 
> And that aggressiveness carries over to other animals, as well.  They were bred to kill or be killed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily Gallant Warrier.  Dog to dog aggression is very specific.
> 
> Now, I'll add that it is in the best interest of Pitbull lovers and breeders to breed away from dog aggression - dog fighting is illegal.
> 
> Most of the pits I know are in my friend's all-breed rescue and live in a large multi-dog and cat pack.  The dogs range from a Rottie mix to Chihuahua and they get along just fine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm familiar enough with dog breeds to recognize that some breeds have "jobs".  Right now, I own a Great Pyrenees.  She lives with the goats, she lives _for_ the goats.  That's her job.  I admit, I am not the "dog person" my be friend is, but I have had working dogs for years.  I am not convinced that a pitbull is the best choice for a family with small children and other animals.  If you have a place that needs a protector, sure...that's a good fit for a Pit.
Click to expand...


Great Pyrenees are a whole 'nother breed - that's for sure.  But Pit's don't - if they're bred right, make good "guards" .  My friends pits are very friendly and sociable to strangers.  It's the chihuahua's and the Cattle Dog that really guard the place.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are willing to gamble with human life, and ready to accept there will be casualities.  I am not. We are talking about 151 completely unnecessary deaths, generally of the  most vulnerable in our society, children and the elderly.  There is no need for people to own pitbulls. There are probably nearly a hundred other breeds to choose a pet dog from.  If pitbulls never existed, no one would miss them.  If they disappeared, they would be soon forgotten. They are a toxic element in civilized society. The statistics I gave are of deaths only; they do not include all the maiming these dogs do. They also do not include all the other pet dogs and cats that pitbulls kill, which is substantial.
> 
> You want to gamble based on percentages and accept a kill and maim rate: I don't.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again, your logic is failing.  We need cars, we need airplanes. We do not need pitbulls.  They add nothing to society.  They are nothing but a problem, a pest, a deadly pest. It makes more sense to compare them to sharks or alligators, but sharks and alligators are part of the web of life.  Pitbulls are not comparable to cars or airplanes. They are not comparable to sharks or alligators because they have nothing to do with sustaining the web of life. There are completely unnecessary and disposable.
Click to expand...


My logic isn't failing at all. We don't NEED cars, or airplanes. They are merely a convenience. They make life easier. Humans lived before cars and airplanes, remember?>


And you're wrong - pit bulls add something to society if their owner loves them. You don't get to personally decide who gets what out of what. Even if you really really want to, really really bad.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why does having a two year old prevent you from owning a pit bull? Do you not drive with your child in the car?
> 
> I mean, if everything is just a gamble afterall, why distinguish between various levels of risk?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because the age of the young child substantially increases the risk of a dog bite because they don't have a modicum of a clue how to treat a dog. I don't even think a dog has to be vicious in order to defend itself from what it perceives to be an attack.
> 
> Driving with a kid in the car doesn't impair my driving. She's strapped in and noise doesn't effect me. I've been driving to loud music all of my life.
> 
> Why distinguish between various levels of risk? Really?
> 
> You chances of getting hit by a car while playing on your lawn versus playing on a busy street don't warrant a distinction? Really?
Click to expand...


Of course distinctions are warranted, the question was facetious. That's the whole point.

Arguing that because driving poses inherent risks somehow supports ANY position one wants to take on the subject of pit bulls, is no argument at all. It's a red herring fallacy.


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> No dogs at all, for me. I have a 2 year old. I don't recommend any dogs for young children. I think I said that like my 3 or so post in this thread.



Why do you take even riskier chances by putting her in a car?... 



peace...


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why does having a two year old prevent you from owning a pit bull? Do you not drive with your child in the car?
> 
> I mean, if everything is just a gamble afterall, why distinguish between various levels of risk?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the age of the young child substantially increases the risk of a dog bite because they don't have a modicum of a clue how to treat a dog. I don't even think a dog has to be vicious in order to defend itself from what it perceives to be an attack.
> 
> Driving with a kid in the car doesn't impair my driving. She's strapped in and noise doesn't effect me. I've been driving to loud music all of my life.
> 
> Why distinguish between various levels of risk? Really?
> 
> You chances of getting hit by a car while playing on your lawn versus playing on a busy street don't warrant a distinction? Really?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course distinctions are warranted, the question was facetious. That's the whole point.
> 
> Arguing that because driving poses inherent risks somehow supports ANY position one wants to take on the subject of pit bulls, is no argument at all. It's a red herring fallacy.
Click to expand...


Except it's not. It's comparing risk of death vs. risk of death. It's completely analogous. Both activities are non essential risk. The comparison is valid.


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> No dogs at all, for me. I have a 2 year old. I don't recommend any dogs for young children. I think I said that like my 3 or so post in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you take even riskier chances by putting her in a car?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


Because riskier does not equal risky, genius.

Also your premise is faulty, I believe its safer to drive than to leave a 2 year old with ANY dog.


----------



## Esmeralda

G.T. said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Again, your logic is failing.  We need cars, we need airplanes. We do not need pitbulls.  They add nothing to society.  They are nothing but a problem, a pest, a deadly pest. It makes more sense to compare them to sharks or alligators, but sharks and alligators are part of the web of life.  Pitbulls are not comparable to cars or airplanes. They are not comparable to sharks or alligators because they have nothing to do with sustaining the web of life. There are completely unnecessary and disposable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> My logic isn't failing at all. We don't NEED cars, or airplanes. They are merely a convenience. They make life easier. Humans lived before cars and airplanes, remember?>
> 
> 
> And you're wrong - pit bulls add something to society if their owner loves them. You don't get to personally decide who gets what out of what. Even if you really really want to, really really bad.
Click to expand...


OMG you really think this? Are you that dense? There is no comparison between pitbulls and automobiles or airplanes. We don't 'need' doctors or hospitals either. We could go back to herbs, leeches and medicine men dancing around a fire.  Why are you so desperate to defend this pathetic animal?  No  one needs a pitbull. They do not have one iota of benefit to human beings.  None. They are completely useless and disposable.  End of.  I'm done. You all can go on  putting forth your idotic debate points.  I am no longer interested in wasting my time here.


----------



## G.T.

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Again, your logic is failing.  We need cars, we need airplanes. We do not need pitbulls.  They add nothing to society.  They are nothing but a problem, a pest, a deadly pest. It makes more sense to compare them to sharks or alligators, but sharks and alligators are part of the web of life.  Pitbulls are not comparable to cars or airplanes. They are not comparable to sharks or alligators because they have nothing to do with sustaining the web of life. There are completely unnecessary and disposable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My logic isn't failing at all. We don't NEED cars, or airplanes. They are merely a convenience. They make life easier. Humans lived before cars and airplanes, remember?>
> 
> 
> And you're wrong - pit bulls add something to society if their owner loves them. You don't get to personally decide who gets what out of what. Even if you really really want to, really really bad.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OMG you really think this? Are you that dense? There is no comparison between pitbulls and automobiles or airplanes. We don't 'need' doctors or hospitals either. We could go back to herbs, leeches and medicine men dancing around a fire.  Why are you so desparate to defend this pathetic animal?  No  one needs a pitbull. They do not have one iota of benefit to human beings.  None. They are completely useless and disposable.  End of.  I'm done. You all can go on  putting forth your idotic debate points.  I am no longer interested in wasting my time here.
Click to expand...


I'm not defending pit bulls.

I'm defending common sense. 

If something is dangerous 0.008% of the time and people get joy and satisfaction out of doing it, then banning it is fucking dumb in my opinion.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because the age of the young child substantially increases the risk of a dog bite because they don't have a modicum of a clue how to treat a dog. I don't even think a dog has to be vicious in order to defend itself from what it perceives to be an attack.
> 
> Driving with a kid in the car doesn't impair my driving. She's strapped in and noise doesn't effect me. I've been driving to loud music all of my life.
> 
> Why distinguish between various levels of risk? Really?
> 
> You chances of getting hit by a car while playing on your lawn versus playing on a busy street don't warrant a distinction? Really?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course distinctions are warranted, the question was facetious. That's the whole point.
> 
> Arguing that because driving poses inherent risks somehow supports ANY position one wants to take on the subject of pit bulls, is no argument at all. It's a red herring fallacy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Except it's not. It's comparing risk of death vs. risk of death. It's completely analogous. Both activities are non essential risk. The comparison is valid.
Click to expand...


I'm just glad you understand intuitively what you refuse to acknowledge intellectually, and you know better than to own a pit bull yourself.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> No dogs at all, for me. I have a 2 year old. I don't recommend any dogs for young children. I think I said that like my 3 or so post in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you take even riskier chances by putting her in a car?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because riskier does not equal risky, genius.
> 
> Also your premise is faulty, I believe its safer to drive than to leave a 2 year old with ANY dog.
Click to expand...


Based on what, exactly?

Weren't you jumping up and down on your soap box talking about numbers a while back?

So where are the numbers that support your conclusion that cars are safer than dogs?


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Of course distinctions are warranted, the question was facetious. That's the whole point.
> 
> Arguing that because driving poses inherent risks somehow supports ANY position one wants to take on the subject of pit bulls, is no argument at all. It's a red herring fallacy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except it's not. It's comparing risk of death vs. risk of death. It's completely analogous. Both activities are non essential risk. The comparison is valid.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm just glad you understand intuitively what you refuse to acknowledge intellectually, and you know better than to own a pit bull yourself.
Click to expand...


I'd own a pit bull if the stats are as we've found on those non-substantiated sources, and my daughter was 10. 

And I haven't refused anything intellectually - you have. My foundation is one of numbers, yours is one of emotive responses to horrific attacks.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you take even riskier chances by putting her in a car?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because riskier does not equal risky, genius.
> 
> Also your premise is faulty, I believe its safer to drive than to leave a 2 year old with ANY dog.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Based on what, exactly?
> 
> Weren't you jumping up and down on your soap box talking about numbers a while back?
> 
> So where are the numbers that support your conclusion that cars are safer than dogs?
Click to expand...


First of all, I didn't say cars were safer than dogs pork-chop. 

I said cars were safer than leaving a 2 year old with a dog. Some things you can surmise with common sense, but I guess not huh?

If it was even possible to grab data on 2 year olds alone with dogs versus 2 year olds in a car, I'd be glad to go over the numbers. Unfortunately, we don't have them and have to use our brains. 

With pit bulls, apparently we have the numbers.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

I used to be completely opposed to BSL and banning of pit bulls. And, I blame humans for every single attack by a pit bull because its human's over breeding and inbreeding that has created a completely different dog than the pit bull of the 19th century. 

Esmeralda makes some very good points as does GT. Its true that its a minority of pits who attack, kill, maim.

But, google "pit bull attacks" and then "images". Imagine those people are your child or other family member. 

Is this dog breed really more important, worth more, more valuable than the safety of human beings?


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> I'd own a pit bull if the stats are as we've found on those non-substantiated sources, and my daughter was 10.



Yeah, her being 10 would certainly mitigate the risk of a pit bull attack. 



G.T. said:


> And I haven't refused anything intellectually - you have. My foundation is one of numbers, yours is one of emotive responses to horrific attacks.



So where are those numbers about driving being safer for 2 year olds than dogs?


----------



## mal

G.T. said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> No dogs at all, for me. I have a 2 year old. I don't recommend any dogs for young children. I think I said that like my 3 or so post in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you take even riskier chances by putting her in a car?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because riskier does not equal risky, genius.
> 
> Also your premise is faulty, I believe its safer to drive than to leave a 2 year old with ANY dog.
Click to expand...


Statistics don't agree with you... 2 year olds are left with dogs ALL the time in America... For hours on end in Homes from Coast to Coast.

I would Suggest that the Comparibly more Limited time they spend in a Car is more Dangerous to them than being at Home with the Family Dog.

The Point is you pretty much need to Commute to Survive and in that you Weight the Risks towards Survival in the Modern Age.

I don't own a Dog because I Disagree with keeping Animals in general and I don't like picking up dog shit, buying dog food or having Vet Bills. 

That and (3) People I know Personally have been Disfugured by Dogs.

(1) would've been all it took.

Ask Strollingbones, she's seen one of my Family Members who was Attacked by the "Family" Dog... It's always, "they never acted Aggressively before".

And I am Damned Certain that Attacks by Dogs are Overwhelmingly Unreported to the Authorities.

After Witnessing Friends of ours Decide to keep their Dog that Attacked their Baby, I am Certain that MANY Dog Owners/Lovers will do some REALLY Stupid shit not to Lose their Animal Slave. 



peace...


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> I said cars were safer than leaving a 2 year old with a dog. Some things you can surmise with common sense, but I guess not huh?



So it's all about the numbers out one side of your mouth and all about common sense out the other side.

I see how you roll.


----------



## G.T.

Luddly Neddite said:


> I used to be completely opposed to BSL and banning of pit bulls. And, I blame humans for every single attack by a pit bull because its human's over breeding and inbreeding that has created a completely different dog than the pit bull of the 19th century.
> 
> Esmeralda makes some very good points as does GT. Its true that its a minority of pits who attack, kill, maim.
> 
> But, google "pit bull attacks" and then "images". Imagine those people are your child or other family member.
> 
> Is this dog breed really more important, worth more, more valuable than the safety of human beings?



A converse question, is: is a situation where you would be completely unharmed 99.992% of the time considered an "unsafe" situation?

And aside from that, we don't even know what percentage of that 0.008% of pit who kill were raised by seething, abusive retards. Your risk might even be far less.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I said cars were safer than leaving a 2 year old with a dog. Some things you can surmise with common sense, but I guess not huh?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So it's all about the numbers out one side of your mouth and all about common sense out the other side.
> 
> I see how you roll.
Click to expand...


Umm, no. 

It's about evaluating data. Nice try to obfuscate to get some sort of faux moral victory dude, but it's retarded.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I said cars were safer than leaving a 2 year old with a dog. Some things you can surmise with common sense, but I guess not huh?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So it's all about the numbers out one side of your mouth and all about common sense out the other side.
> 
> I see how you roll.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Umm, no.
> 
> It's about evaluating data. Nice try to obfuscate to get some sort of faux moral victory dude, but it's retarded.
Click to expand...



So where is the data that 2yr olds are safer in cars than in the company of dogs?


----------



## G.T.

mal said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you take even riskier chances by putting her in a car?...
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because riskier does not equal risky, genius.
> 
> Also your premise is faulty, I believe its safer to drive than to leave a 2 year old with ANY dog.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Statistics don't agree with you... 2 year olds are left with dogs ALL the time in America... For hours on end in Homes from Coast to Coast.
> 
> I would Suggest that the Comparibly more Limited time they spend in a Car is more Dangerous to them than being at Home with the Family Dog.
> 
> The Point is you pretty much need to Commute to Survive and in that you Weight the Risks towards Survival in the Modern Age.
> 
> I don't own a Dog because I Disagree with keeping Animals in general and I don't like picking up dog shit, buying dog food or having Vet Bills.
> 
> That and (3) People I know Personally have been Disfugured by Dogs.
> 
> (1) would've been all it took.
> 
> Ask Strollingbones, she's seen one of my Family Members who was Attacked by the "Family" Dog... It's always, "they never acted Aggressively before".
> 
> And I am Damned Certain that Attacks by Dogs are Overwhelmingly Unreported to the Authorities.
> 
> After Witnessing Friends of ours Decide to keep their Dog that Attacked their Baby, I am Certain that MANY Dog Owners/Lovers will do some REALLY Stupid shit not to Lose their Animal Slave.
> 
> 
> 
> peace...
Click to expand...


It is probably underreported. 

And you're right about risk versus reward. That's what this is ALL about. _THATS WHY _I wouldn't leave my 2 year old alone with any dog. There's not much by way of reward in that, with the risk involved. 

But some people get enough love out of having the breed of dog that they will own a pit bull. I don't believe a 2 year old can experience that reward in the same way,. I'm not sure anyone believes that.


----------



## manifold

Here's a stat for you G.T.

Motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death for children of every age from 2 to 14 years old

Go ahead and tell me again how 'common sense' allows you to dismiss it.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

G.T. said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I used to be completely opposed to BSL and banning of pit bulls. And, I blame humans for every single attack by a pit bull because its human's over breeding and inbreeding that has created a completely different dog than the pit bull of the 19th century.
> 
> Esmeralda makes some very good points as does GT. Its true that its a minority of pits who attack, kill, maim.
> 
> But, google "pit bull attacks" and then "images". Imagine those people are your child or other family member.
> 
> Is this dog breed really more important, worth more, more valuable than the safety of human beings?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A converse question, is: is a situation where you would be completely unharmed 99.992% of the time considered an "unsafe" situation?
> 
> And aside from that, we don't even know what percentage of that 0.008% of pit who kill were raised by seething, abusive retards. Your risk might even be far less.
Click to expand...


You're right. If we could ban the damn owners, I'd be in favor of banning the idiots who have used and abused these dogs and then bred more. And I appreciate the points you've made about degree of risk.

But still -

What would be lost if pits were - POOF! - gone?

It won't happen though. Nor will we ever really punish dog fighters and others who are responsible for the dogs who attack.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> So it's all about the numbers out one side of your mouth and all about common sense out the other side.
> 
> I see how you roll.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Umm, no.
> 
> It's about evaluating data. Nice try to obfuscate to get some sort of faux moral victory dude, but it's retarded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So where is the data that 2yr olds are safer in cars than in the company of dogs?
Click to expand...


There isn't - that was my point: with NO DATA, we have to USE OUR BRAINS. 

You're saying that because I stand up for the DATA in the case of pit bulls, that it's intellectually inconsistent to surmise something WITHOUT DATA for something else. That is not intellectual inconsistency, it's working with what you've got.


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are willing to gamble with human life, and ready to accept there will be casualities.  I am not. We are talking about 151 completely unnecessary deaths, generally of the  most vulnerable in our society, children and the elderly.  There is no need for people to own pitbulls. There are probably nearly a hundred other breeds to choose a pet dog from.  If pitbulls never existed, no one would miss them.  If they disappeared, they would be soon forgotten. They are a toxic element in civilized society. The statistics I gave are of deaths only; they do not include all the maiming these dogs do. They also do not include all the other pet dogs and cats that pitbulls kill, which is substantial.
> 
> You want to gamble based on percentages and accept a kill and maim rate: I don't.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone is gambling with human life - if you _*DRIVE*_, you _included_. Driving isn't the only example, either. Should planes NOT fly? It's gambling with human life.
> 
> Risks are worth it sometimes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again, your logic is failing.  We need cars, we need airplanes. We do not need pitbulls.  They add nothing to society.  They are nothing but a problem, a pest, a deadly pest. It makes more sense to compare them to sharks or alligators, but sharks and alligators are part of the web of life.  Pitbulls are not comparable to cars or airplanes. They are not comparable to sharks or alligators because they have nothing to do with sustaining the web of life. There are completely unnecessary and disposable.
Click to expand...


99.992% of pit bulls never attacked anyone, and yet you call them disposable?   Such logic is laughable.

Pit bulls work as therapy dogs in hospitals and nursing homes.  They work as rescue dogs and assist the handicapped.  But they are disposable?

The overwhelming majority of pit bull terriers are beloved family pets.  You cannot quantify what they bring to the hundreds of thousands of families.  Yet because of the actions of 0.008% of them, and without knowing the full circumstances of how they were treated, you call them disposable?  

And if you had taken the time to look at all the info, instead of cherrypicking facts that support your own hysteria, you would have seen that the numbers you quoted are not even close to accurate.

from: Pit Bulls by the Numbers : StubbyDog
"Sites like Dogsbite.org like to claim that pit bulls only make up 5 percent of the total dog population in the United States and are therefore attacking at a much higher rate than other dogs, but the truth is that there are no accurate statistics kept on the total number of dogs in this country, let alone dogs by type. *The CDC clearly states this on its website: There is currently no accurate way to identify the number of dogs of a particular breed, and consequently no measure to determine which breeds are more likely to bite or kill.* And while its anyones guess exactly how many pit bull type dogs there are in this country, its clear from looking around most cities, neighborhoods and shelters that dogs labeled as pit bulls are far more common than 5 percent."

The link I posted earlier offered quite a few pictures of various dogs, with the challenge to find the pit bull.  Did you find it?  I would be willing to bet that most people would have called every dog pictured a pit bull.  The misidentification involved is huge and renders your claims ridiculous.  When the CDC does not trust the numbers put out there, I certainly don't think we should consider any breed of dog as disposable.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> Here's a stat for you G.T.
> 
> Motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death for children of every age from 2 to 14 years old
> 
> Go ahead and tell me again how 'common sense' allows you to dismiss it.



Go ahead and tell me how this makes any sense to what I've been saying. 

All children 2 to 14 years old have dogs? As many children from 2 to 14 years old have dogs, that get into cars? 

There's no correlation. 

All 2 year olds are _LEFT ALONE _with their dogs, when they have one? 

Not seeing the connection, genius.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> There isn't - that was my point: with NO DATA...



No data on moving vehicle fatalities?

Are you serious?


----------



## G.T.

Luddly Neddite said:


> What would be lost if pits were - POOF! - gone?
> .



Ask a pit owner, that's a subjective question.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> There isn't - that was my point: with NO DATA...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No data on moving vehicle fatalities?
> 
> Are you serious?
Click to expand...


^ wrong. 

No data on leaving a 2 year old alone with a dog, and them being attacked. 

Are YOU serious?


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a stat for you G.T.
> 
> Motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death for children of every age from 2 to 14 years old
> 
> Go ahead and tell me again how 'common sense' allows you to dismiss it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go ahead and tell me how this makes any sense to what I've been saying.
> 
> All children 2 to 14 years old have dogs? As many children from 2 to 14 years old have dogs, that get into cars?
> 
> *There's no correlation. *
> 
> All 2 year olds are _LEFT ALONE _with their dogs, when they have one?
> 
> Not seeing the connection, genius.
Click to expand...


You're eviscerating your own point better than anyone else possibly could.

I've been saying there is no correlation between driving risk and pit bull risk all along. Duh!


Keep arguing with yourself dude, it's teh funneh!


----------



## WinterBorn

Esmeralda said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> Again, your logic is failing.  We need cars, we need airplanes. We do not need pitbulls.  They add nothing to society.  They are nothing but a problem, a pest, a deadly pest. It makes more sense to compare them to sharks or alligators, but sharks and alligators are part of the web of life.  Pitbulls are not comparable to cars or airplanes. They are not comparable to sharks or alligators because they have nothing to do with sustaining the web of life. There are completely unnecessary and disposable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My logic isn't failing at all. We don't NEED cars, or airplanes. They are merely a convenience. They make life easier. Humans lived before cars and airplanes, remember?>
> 
> 
> And you're wrong - pit bulls add something to society if their owner loves them. You don't get to personally decide who gets what out of what. Even if you really really want to, really really bad.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OMG you really think this? Are you that dense? There is no comparison between pitbulls and automobiles or airplanes. We don't 'need' doctors or hospitals either. We could go back to herbs, leeches and medicine men dancing around a fire.  Why are you so desperate to defend this pathetic animal?  No  one needs a pitbull. They do not have one iota of benefit to human beings.  None. They are completely useless and disposable.  End of.  I'm done. You all can go on  putting forth your idotic debate points.  I am no longer interested in wasting my time here.
Click to expand...


You can call them a waste all you want.  But the fact that, at worst, 99.998% of pits never attack means your logic is ridiculous.

And how dare you sit and presume to judge what a loving pet bring to a family or to a person living alone.  How dare you presume to call a service dog or therapy dog "disposable" simply because you refuse to look at the facts.

Luckily the blind prejudice you display is not in charge.  The laws against pits are being challenged and taken down.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a stat for you G.T.
> 
> Motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death for children of every age from 2 to 14 years old
> 
> Go ahead and tell me again how 'common sense' allows you to dismiss it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go ahead and tell me how this makes any sense to what I've been saying.
> 
> All children 2 to 14 years old have dogs? As many children from 2 to 14 years old have dogs, that get into cars?
> 
> *There's no correlation. *
> 
> All 2 year olds are _LEFT ALONE _with their dogs, when they have one?
> 
> Not seeing the connection, genius.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're eviscerating your own point better than anyone else possibly could.
> 
> I've been saying there is no correlation between driving risk and pit bull risk all along. Duh!
> 
> 
> Keep arguing with yourself dude, it's teh funneh!
Click to expand...


No, you're just inept apparently. 

There IS a correlation between driving as an activity and dying, and owning a dog as an activity, and dying. 

There is not correlation between the leading cause of death between ALL 2 to 14 year olds. and the %risk of a 2-14 year old DOG OWNER from being attacked when left alone with a dog. 

You keep giggling in the face of being a moron with comprehension troubles. It's soothing.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> There isn't - that was my point: with NO DATA...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No data on moving vehicle fatalities?
> 
> Are you serious?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ^ wrong.
> 
> No data on leaving a 2 year old alone with a dog, and them being attacked.
> 
> Are YOU serious?
Click to expand...


There's plenty of data on what happens when they are attacked. You know, the other part of the analysis I mentioned in my first one or two posts in this discussion.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> No data on moving vehicle fatalities?
> 
> Are you serious?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^ wrong.
> 
> No data on leaving a 2 year old alone with a dog, and them being attacked.
> 
> Are YOU serious?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's plenty of data on what happens when they are attacked. You know, the other part of the analysis I mentioned in my first one or two posts in this discussion.
Click to expand...


Nice obfuscation. 

I said: No data on leaving a 2 year old alone with a dog, and them being attacked.

Your unrelated response was: There's plenty of data on what happens *when they are attacked*



So apparently you're just a giant troll and not trying to have a conversation, but just to reach for SSOOOmthing, AAAAnything, ypou can swing from for your smilies. Grow up, dumbass.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> There IS a correlation between driving as an activity and dying



Yup



G.T. said:


> There IS a correlation between... owning a dog as an activity, and dying.



Yup


Thank you once again for pointing out that the only thing the two have in common is they both carry a risk of death.

The evaluation of risk for each is completely independent of the other.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> There IS a correlation between driving as an activity and dying
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> There IS a correlation between... owning a dog as an activity, and dying.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup
> 
> 
> Thank you once again for pointing out that the only thing the two have in common is they both carry a risk of death.
> 
> The evaluation of risk for each is completely independent of the other.
Click to expand...


The evaluation of risk is a number.

Numbers are comparable. 

% chance of death is what we're comparing. 




When you bring up highest % chance of death of ALL 2-14 year olds as being motor vehicle death - and then say a bigger percent die from car deaths than dog deaths as your point, it's a non-point because not all 2-14 year olds own and are left alone with dogs which is what we were discussing (my 2 year old alone with a dog vs. my driving with her in the car).


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> There IS a correlation between driving as an activity and dying
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> There IS a correlation between... owning a dog as an activity, and dying.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup
> 
> 
> Thank you once again for pointing out that the only thing the two have in common is they both carry a risk of death.
> 
> The evaluation of risk for each is completely independent of the other.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The evaluation of risk is a number.
> 
> Numbers are comparable.
> 
> % chance of death is what we're comparing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you bring up % chance of death of ALL 2-14 year olds as being motor vehicle death - and then say a bigger percent die from car deaths than dog deaths as your point, it's a non-point because not all 2-14 year olds own and are left alone with dogs which is what we were discussing (my 2 year old alone with a dog vs. my driving with her in the car).
Click to expand...


Make up your mind would you.

So are we comparing percentages or using common sense?


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yup
> 
> 
> 
> Yup
> 
> 
> Thank you once again for pointing out that the only thing the two have in common is they both carry a risk of death.
> 
> The evaluation of risk for each is completely independent of the other.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The evaluation of risk is a number.
> 
> Numbers are comparable.
> 
> % chance of death is what we're comparing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you bring up % chance of death of ALL 2-14 year olds as being motor vehicle death - and then say a bigger percent die from car deaths than dog deaths as your point, it's a non-point because not all 2-14 year olds own and are left alone with dogs which is what we were discussing (my 2 year old alone with a dog vs. my driving with her in the car).
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Make up your mind would you.
> 
> So are we comparing percentages or using common sense?
Click to expand...


See, you're just a hack. 

You can compare % chance of death while performing an activity (driving) versus % chance of death while performing an activity (dog ownership). 

This way, you can evaluate which is riskier. 

My point was - do we still drive, even though it's riskier? I do. 


Then, I said I wouldn't leave my 2 year old alone with a dog. But - I would let her drive with me. 

Then you asked, why?

I responded: There's not really data on 2 year olds left with dogs, and risk - so it's a judgment call. 


your response was to say that the leading cause of deaths is 2-14 year olds is by car. 

that doesn't mean that a car is riskier than leaving a 2 year old alone with a dog. therefore, it was a stupid fucking analogy. 

You're dumb.

I win. 

smilies x infinity, all that dorkiness.


I also don't understand your giggles. 

Are you saying that because I use percentage data that's available to me, that I should NOT use my brain when there's no data available? I'm missing your retarded logic, here.


----------



## manifold

[MENTION=19867]G.T.[/MENTION]

So is it data or common sense that brings you to conclude that owning a pit bull with a 2yr old kid is too risky, but once the kids reaches age 10, the risk is no longer sufficient to rule out owning a pit bull?


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> [MENTION=19867]G.T.[/MENTION]
> 
> So is it data or common sense that brings you to conclude that owning a pit bull with a 2yr old kid is too risky, but once the kids reaches age 10, the risk is no longer sufficient to rule out owning a pit bull?



When we have statistical facts, we use them.

When we don't, we're forced to make judgment calls. 

2 years olds grab dogs' eyeballs and stick their arms down dogs' throats. 

Hope that clears your confusion.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> [MENTION=19867]G.T.[/MENTION]
> 
> So is it data or common sense that brings you to conclude that owning a pit bull with a 2yr old kid is too risky, but once the kids reaches age 10, the risk is no longer sufficient to rule out owning a pit bull?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When we have statistical facts, we use them.
> 
> When we don't, we're forced to make judgment calls.
> 
> 2 years olds grab dogs' eyeballs and stick their arms down dogs' throats.
> 
> Hope that clears your confusion.
Click to expand...



And sometimes pit bulls snap and attack unprovoked, such as the story in the OP. Is a ten year old materially less defenseless against a deranged pit bull than a two year old? Or are you only concerned about the relative risk posed by the curiosity of a 2yr old?


----------



## G.T.

Speaking on those statistics:


If 0.008% of pit bulls are attackers, I would assume:

-Of the 0.008% who attack, there's likely many caused by the emotional immaturity of the owner or of the attacked. Meaning - the data is skewed higher because of abusive owners or kids who grab eyeballs. Most likely. I think it's safe to assume that in a caring home with none of the aforementioned behavior, pit bulls are even SAFER than 99.992%, but LESS SAFE for the emotionally immature.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> [MENTION=19867]G.T.[/MENTION]
> 
> So is it data or common sense that brings you to conclude that owning a pit bull with a 2yr old kid is too risky, but once the kids reaches age 10, the risk is no longer sufficient to rule out owning a pit bull?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When we have statistical facts, we use them.
> 
> When we don't, we're forced to make judgment calls.
> 
> 2 years olds grab dogs' eyeballs and stick their arms down dogs' throats.
> 
> Hope that clears your confusion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> And sometimes pit bulls snap and attack unprovoked, such as the story in the OP. Is a ten year old materially less defenseless against a deranged pit bull than a two year old? Or are you only concerned about the relative risk posed by the curiosity of a 2yr old?
Click to expand...


Relative risk, yepp.

I'd be wondering the % of pit bulls that attack unprovoked before I could answer this question, because in the case of the 2 year old I'm assuming ALL 2 year olds don't know how to handle a dog. I'd call that a "fair assumption."

 In the case of a ten year old being attacked unprovoked, I'd wonder how many pit bulls attack unprovoked on average.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> Speaking on those statistics:
> 
> 
> If 0.008% of pit bulls are attackers, I would assume:
> 
> -Of the 0.008% who attack, there's likely many caused by the emotional immaturity of the owner or of the attacked. Meaning - the data is skewed higher because of abusive owners or kids who grab eyeballs. Most likely. I think it's safe to assume that in a caring home with none of the aforementioned behavior, pit bulls are even SAFER than 99.992%, but LESS SAFE for the emotionally immature.



I'm not debating the fact that a 2yr old is more likely to be "asking for it" than a 10 year old.

I'm saying I'd be no more accepting of the potential consequences of a pit bull attack for a 10 year old than I am for a 2yr old, regardless of the probability of an attack occurring.

But if you're comfortable owning a pit bull once your kid reaches age 10, have at it Wild Bill, just beware of aces and eights.


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking on those statistics:
> 
> 
> If 0.008% of pit bulls are attackers, I would assume:
> 
> -Of the 0.008% who attack, there's likely many caused by the emotional immaturity of the owner or of the attacked. Meaning - the data is skewed higher because of abusive owners or kids who grab eyeballs. Most likely. I think it's safe to assume that in a caring home with none of the aforementioned behavior, pit bulls are even SAFER than 99.992%, but LESS SAFE for the emotionally immature.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not debating the fact that a 2yr old is more likely to be "asking for it" than a 10 year old.
> 
> I'm saying I'd be no more accepting of the potential consequences of a pit bull attack for a 10 year old than I am for a 2yr old, regardless of the probability of an attack occurring.
> 
> But if you're comfortable owning a pit bull once your kid reaches age 10, have at it Wild Bill, just beware of aces and eights.
Click to expand...


The potential is close to 0.

There are so many more voluntary things people subject themselves and their kids to that are more dangerous, that it's disingenuous to characterize a relatively low risk behavior (pit bull ownership) as "dangerous" because of the sensationalized stories of those fallen to said tiny risk  -  ESPECIALLY when it's likely that a lot of those attacks have a lot more going on with them then just an unprovoked innocent dog turned wild.


----------



## BullKurtz

G.T. said:


> A converse question, is: is a situation where you would be completely unharmed 99.992% of the time considered an "unsafe" situation?
> 
> And aside from that, we don't even know what percentage of that 0.008% of pit who kill were raised by seething, abusive retards. Your risk might even be far less.



WTF is the matter with you?  Your useless replies are making this thread unreadable....you're nowhere near the topic in question nagging about probabilities...if you want risk analysis check out what insurance companies have to say about Pits instead of nagging others to do it for you.....fuck off.


----------



## G.T.

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> A converse question, is: is a situation where you would be completely unharmed 99.992% of the time considered an "unsafe" situation?
> 
> And aside from that, we don't even know what percentage of that 0.008% of pit who kill were raised by seething, abusive retards. Your risk might even be far less.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WTF is the matter with you?  Your useless replies are making this thread unreadable....you're nowhere near the topic in question nagging about probabilities...if you want risk analysis check out what insurance companies have to say about Pits instead of nagging others to do it for you.....fuck off.
Click to expand...


^ what does this say? I can't read it.


----------



## koshergrl

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> When we have statistical facts, we use them.
> 
> When we don't, we're forced to make judgment calls.
> 
> 2 years olds grab dogs' eyeballs and stick their arms down dogs' throats.
> 
> Hope that clears your confusion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And sometimes pit bulls snap and attack unprovoked, such as the story in the OP. Is a ten year old materially less defenseless against a deranged pit bull than a two year old? Or are you only concerned about the relative risk posed by the curiosity of a 2yr old?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Relative risk, yepp.
> 
> I'd be wondering the % of pit bulls that attack unprovoked before I could answer this question, because in the case of the 2 year old I'm assuming ALL 2 year olds don't know how to handle a dog. I'd call that a "fair assumption."
> 
> In the case of a ten year old being attacked unprovoked, I'd wonder how many pit bulls attack unprovoked on average.
Click to expand...

 
Any dog has the potential to "attack, unprovoked". The thing is, just because a human doesn't see the potential there doesn't mean there haven't been warning signs. 

A person might consider the family husky who pulls a toddler out of it's crib and drags it down the hall to kill it as "unprovoked" but in fact, the dog is just acting like a dog.


----------



## BullKurtz

koshergrl said:


> Any dog has the potential to "attack, unprovoked". The thing is, just because a human doesn't see the potential there doesn't mean there haven't been warning signs.
> 
> A person might consider the family husky who pulls a toddler out of it's crib and drags it down the hall to kill it as "unprovoked" but in fact, the dog is just acting like a dog.



When I was almost a year old my mom was outside hanging laundry on the clothes line when the phone rang and she went inside to answer it.  We had a collie named Mack who rarely came inside and was a tough customer who had never laid eyes on me before.  Mack could leap up into the apple tree with my sister, once dragged a guy off a passing motorcycle, and is thought to have fought off a bear during a stay with a family friend in northern Michigan.

So I'm sitting on a blanket in the yard and guess what....here comes Mack back from some adventure out in the field behind the house.  My mom looks out the window and sees Mack standing over me looking part curious, part menacing.  He could have snapped my neck with a single grab and my mom panicked, ran out on the porch and screamed: "MACK NO!"

Mack leaped straight up in the air as the story goes and ran away for almost a week.  Lucky for me I had the family scent on me or Mom woulda have been too late to save me.  Whether it's from hearing the story told or my brain being able to recall an event at such a young age, I believe I recall the image of the massive beast staring down at me... and  giving me a little lick on the nose before my Mom scared the beejeebers out of him.


----------



## manifold

G.T. said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking on those statistics:
> 
> 
> If 0.008% of pit bulls are attackers, I would assume:
> 
> -Of the 0.008% who attack, there's likely many caused by the emotional immaturity of the owner or of the attacked. Meaning - the data is skewed higher because of abusive owners or kids who grab eyeballs. Most likely. I think it's safe to assume that in a caring home with none of the aforementioned behavior, pit bulls are even SAFER than 99.992%, but LESS SAFE for the emotionally immature.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not debating the fact that a 2yr old is more likely to be "asking for it" than a 10 year old.
> 
> I'm saying I'd be no more accepting of the potential consequences of a pit bull attack for a 10 year old than I am for a 2yr old, regardless of the probability of an attack occurring.
> 
> But if you're comfortable owning a pit bull once your kid reaches age 10, have at it Wild Bill, just beware of aces and eights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The potential is close to 0.
> 
> There are so many more voluntary things people subject themselves and their kids to that are more dangerous, that it's disingenuous to characterize a relatively low risk behavior (pit bull ownership) as "dangerous" because of the sensationalized stories of those fallen to said tiny risk  -  ESPECIALLY when it's likely that a lot of those attacks have a lot more going on with them then just an unprovoked innocent dog turned wild.
Click to expand...


----------



## G.T.

manifold said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not debating the fact that a 2yr old is more likely to be "asking for it" than a 10 year old.
> 
> I'm saying I'd be no more accepting of the potential consequences of a pit bull attack for a 10 year old than I am for a 2yr old, regardless of the probability of an attack occurring.
> 
> But if you're comfortable owning a pit bull once your kid reaches age 10, have at it Wild Bill, just beware of aces and eights.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The potential is close to 0.
> 
> There are so many more voluntary things people subject themselves and their kids to that are more dangerous, that it's disingenuous to characterize a relatively low risk behavior (pit bull ownership) as "dangerous" because of the sensationalized stories of those fallen to said tiny risk  -  ESPECIALLY when it's likely that a lot of those attacks have a lot more going on with them then just an unprovoked innocent dog turned wild.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


yea deude


----------



## koshergrl

Dogs are wired to eat small and/or helpless things. 

Even my saint..I had to teach him not to hold my daughter down by the back of her head...if the kids were running and he was loose, that's what he would do! He'd run over her, knock her down, then grab the back of her noggin and not let her up. He did it 2x and he doesn't do it anymore, but how quickly that could go bad! 

I STILL don't leave my children home alone with all three of my dogs...I have the pit, the saint, and a terrier....and they are not physcially capable of restraining them, so I NEVER leave them alone with the big boys. They're fine with one, or the other...but never both. The dogs act differently when they are together, and my 11 and 10 year olds are not capable of commanding respect or physically restraining the dogs. So I never leave them alone. At night, I sleep with my door open, so I can exert control over the dogs. The pit usually sleeps with my daughter, adn the saint in my room or the living room..if he gets up and walks into the girl's bedroom, I make him get out. Because dogs interact with other dogs in a way that is different from the way we interact with them. One dog with my daughter views her as something to protect...two dogs might just view her as a toy.


----------



## Coyote

Sunshine said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's because typically, ignorant, criminal people don't gravitate towards collies and golden retrievers.
> 
> If they did, then collies and golden retrievers would be the ones *going off*.
> 
> All animals are potentially dangerous, and the more powerful they are the more potential they have to be deadly.
> 
> But pits don't just explode for no reason. If a pit isn't safe, it's because it was raised wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The vast majority of pits I know are awesome, I love the breed.  But you have idiots breeding dogs to sell to people that have no business owning a dog.  Or any living thing.  I wish the Pit Bull community would take their breed's image more seriously and stop trying to promote them as a cool tough breed - have you ever looked at some of the breeder websites?  They do their breed no favors
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That occurs with every breed, not just pits.
Click to expand...


Yes, it does and every decade we have new Tough-Dog Breed de jour at the end of a logging chain.  It used to be German Shepherds and Dobermans, then Pits and Rotties, and now more exotic breeds and crosses.  But I do think the breeder community can do something to help and that is choose how they market their dogs (actually - be more selective in who they sell to as well).  The Doberman community faced a similar problem with their breed's reputation and a flakey temperment and they went all out to counter it.  It was successful.


----------



## koshergrl

Plus there's the media hysteria over PITBULLS that has them labeling every mut as a "pit bull mix" or "pit bull terrier"....


----------



## BullKurtz

koshergrl said:


> Dogs are wired to eat small and/or helpless things.
> 
> Even my saint..I had to teach him not to hold my daughter down by the back of her head...if the kids were running and he was loose, that's what he would do! He'd run over her, knock her down, then grab the back of her noggin and not let her up. He did it 2x and he doesn't do it anymore, but how quickly that could go bad!
> 
> I STILL don't leave my children home alone with all three of my dogs...I have the pit, the saint, and a terrier....and they are not physcially capable of restraining them, so I NEVER leave them alone with the big boys. They're fine with one, or the other...but never both. The dogs act differently when they are together, and my 11 and 10 year olds are not capable of commanding respect or physically restraining the dogs. So I never leave them alone. At night, I sleep with my door open, so I can exert control over the dogs. The pit usually sleeps with my daughter, adn the saint in my room or the living room..if he gets up and walks into the girl's bedroom, I make him get out. Because dogs interact with other dogs in a way that is different from the way we interact with them. One dog with my daughter views her as something to protect...two dogs might just view her as a toy.



You got that right...my last two Shepherds were brother and sister.   Each on their own were mild-manned, quick to obey a command, and generally pleasant around strangers.  But together out in public?  LUNATICS!   Once my gal and I came out of a store I'd parked in front of and the two of them had their heads out the car windows (rolled down half way) snarling and growling at passersby to the point small groups had formed in each direction afraid to pass by them.  

Since I rarely miss an opportunity to grandstand, I pretended we didn't know the dogs.  I asked aloud how so many could be afraid of a couple dogs cooped up inside a car....most of them looked down at their shoes.  So I had to walk over to the car, tell them to "LAY DOWN" in a forceful voice, which of course they did, and we walked away to finish the stunt.  I heard one guy say "that guy's got some balls on him alright"....


----------



## Unkotare

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dogs are wired to eat small and/or helpless things.
> 
> Even my saint..I had to teach him not to hold my daughter down by the back of her head...if the kids were running and he was loose, that's what he would do! He'd run over her, knock her down, then grab the back of her noggin and not let her up. He did it 2x and he doesn't do it anymore, but how quickly that could go bad!
> 
> I STILL don't leave my children home alone with all three of my dogs...I have the pit, the saint, and a terrier....and they are not physcially capable of restraining them, so I NEVER leave them alone with the big boys. They're fine with one, or the other...but never both. The dogs act differently when they are together, and my 11 and 10 year olds are not capable of commanding respect or physically restraining the dogs. So I never leave them alone. At night, I sleep with my door open, so I can exert control over the dogs. The pit usually sleeps with my daughter, adn the saint in my room or the living room..if he gets up and walks into the girl's bedroom, I make him get out. Because dogs interact with other dogs in a way that is different from the way we interact with them. One dog with my daughter views her as something to protect...two dogs might just view her as a toy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You got that right...my last two Shepherds were brother and sister.   Each on their own were mild-manned, quick to obey a command, and generally pleasant around strangers.  But together out in public?  LUNATICS!   Once my gal and I came out of a store I'd parked in front of and the two of them had their heads out the car windows (rolled down half way) snarling and growling at passersby to the point small groups had formed in each direction afraid to pass by them.
> 
> Since I rarely miss an opportunity to grandstand, I pretended we didn't know the dogs.  I asked aloud how so many could be afraid of a couple dogs cooped up inside a car....most of them looked down at their shoes.  So I had to walk over to the car, tell them to "LAY DOWN" in a forceful voice, which of course they did, and we walked away to finish the stunt.  I heard one guy say "that guy's got some balls on him alright"....
Click to expand...




Your fiction writing really sucks.


----------



## BullKurtz

Coyote said:


> Yes, it does and every decade we have new Tough-Dog Breed de jour at the end of a logging chain.  It used to be German Shepherds and Dobermans, then Pits and Rotties, and now more exotic breeds and crosses.  But I do think the breeder community can do something to help and that is choose how they market their dogs (actually - be more selective in who they sell to as well).  The Doberman community faced a similar problem with their breed's reputation and a flakey temperment and they went all out to counter it.  It was successful.



Same thing happened with Golden Retrievers in the 1980s....the breeders couldn't keep up with demand so they went ahead and in-bred them, tricking the AKA with false paperwork.   In the early 90's the hip-displacia and epilepsy started showing up.  These days you'll be lucky to find a Golden who doesn't develop real health problems before they're 2 or 3 years old....same thing with German Shepherds in the 70's....bad hips.


----------



## koshergrl

For a while I had a group of old nosey men congregating on the street across from my house. There were up to 5 of them, often with dogs. They'd hang out across from my driveway, and the dogs in my house would go NUTS. I found out this was happening by coming home at odd times during the day, incidentally. Anyway, they'd all hang out there with their little dogs and their idling vehicles, and glare up at my house when the dogs would bark.

I took to coming home, bringing the pit out very lightly restrained on his leash, putting him into the car, then backing out. He of course went ballistic in the car when I did this...slavering and snarling and barking at them (I left the window open about 2 inches to allow them the full impact). What assholes! They can go congregate in front of their own houses, why of ALL the places to hang out, they felt compelled to hang out THERE, I'm sure I don't know.

But after doing that a few times, they finally broke it up. Mylo got out once and ran over the dachsund..she didn't even bite the little shit (who would walk back and forth in front of the house with its owner yap-yap-yapping) but I still got to pay for a vet visit and..get this...ANTI-ANXIETY meds for the little fucker.


----------



## Coyote

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, it does and every decade we have new Tough-Dog Breed de jour at the end of a logging chain.  It used to be German Shepherds and Dobermans, then Pits and Rotties, and now more exotic breeds and crosses.  But I do think the breeder community can do something to help and that is choose how they market their dogs (actually - be more selective in who they sell to as well).  The Doberman community faced a similar problem with their breed's reputation and a flakey temperment and they went all out to counter it.  It was successful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same thing happened with Golden Retrievers in the 1980s....the breeders couldn't keep up with demand so they went ahead and in-bred them, tricking the AKA with false paperwork.   In the early 90's the hip-displacia and epilepsy started showing up.  These days you'll be lucky to find a Golden who doesn't develop real health problems before they're 2 or 3 years old....same thing with German Shepherds in the 70's....bad hips.
Click to expand...


I know, German Shepherds are one of my favorite breeds, but the health problems


----------



## Luddly Neddite

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dogs are wired to eat small and/or helpless things.
> 
> Even my saint..I had to teach him not to hold my daughter down by the back of her head...if the kids were running and he was loose, that's what he would do! He'd run over her, knock her down, then grab the back of her noggin and not let her up. He did it 2x and he doesn't do it anymore, but how quickly that could go bad!
> 
> I STILL don't leave my children home alone with all three of my dogs...I have the pit, the saint, and a terrier....and they are not physcially capable of restraining them, so I NEVER leave them alone with the big boys. They're fine with one, or the other...but never both. The dogs act differently when they are together, and my 11 and 10 year olds are not capable of commanding respect or physically restraining the dogs. So I never leave them alone. At night, I sleep with my door open, so I can exert control over the dogs. The pit usually sleeps with my daughter, adn the saint in my room or the living room..if he gets up and walks into the girl's bedroom, I make him get out. Because dogs interact with other dogs in a way that is different from the way we interact with them. One dog with my daughter views her as something to protect...two dogs might just view her as a toy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You got that right...my last two Shepherds were brother and sister.   Each on their own were mild-manned, quick to obey a command, and generally pleasant around strangers.  But together out in public?  LUNATICS!   Once my gal and I came out of a store I'd parked in front of and the two of them had their heads out the car windows (rolled down half way) snarling and growling at passersby to the point small groups had formed in each direction afraid to pass by them.
> 
> Since I rarely miss an opportunity to grandstand, I pretended we didn't know the dogs.  I asked aloud how so many could be afraid of a couple dogs cooped up inside a car....most of them looked down at their shoes.  So I had to walk over to the car, tell them to "LAY DOWN" in a forceful voice, which of course they did, and we walked away to finish the stunt.  I heard one guy say "that guy's got some balls on him alright"....
Click to expand...


Can't be your balls you're talking about.

Have your dog neutered.


----------



## Sunshine

WinterBorn said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> And who identified the dogs as pit bulls?
> 
> Difficulty of Breed Identification | Stop BSL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is just another pathetic excuse made by shameless people who don't care how many innocent people, especially children, are torn apart by these vicious dogs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 50 children a year are killed by their cribs.  A child is 25 times more likely to die because of a crib than because of a pit bull.
Click to expand...


Well then put a muzzle on the crib.    That is a stupid comparison.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Esmeralda said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> What would you do if one of your kids was a liberal? Stop loving him? Be abusive?  Say  he is worthless and has no place on this Earth?  Tell him he has no value as a human being?
> 
> 
> 
> That ain't never going to happen. but yes he would be dead to me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's just pathetic.
Click to expand...


That's just the facts of life. If any of my sons ever turn liberal I would disinherit them


----------



## koshergrl

My sons aren't liberal.

They were undecided for a while, but they've come around.

My daughter in law voted for Obama...but I think she learned a valuable lesson in doing so. And I love her anyway.


----------



## gallantwarrior

Gracie said:


> See....it took awhile for me to actually talk to the vet the day gracie was put down. THEY thought it was epilepsy. It was a brain tumor after all. She could not be saved. When she was a puppy and I brought her home from the swap meet where she was being sold for 50 bucks, once we got her home, she was afraid of brooms. She was afraid to come in the house. She didn't like being touched on the head at all. You could pet her back, her butt, her chest, her belly. But not her head. It took about 4 years before she would let me kiss her right between the eyes, my hands gently on each side of her head as I kissed her. She was no longer so afraid. But I think those people bonked her with a broom, or hit her on the head, or did some other damage to her brain. It didn't manifest into a tumor until she was 8 years old. So no telling what ANY dog experiences in their lifetime that will turn into something else. Like alzheimers in people. One minute, they are smart business people. The next? Vegetables. Ya just never know.



I've never heard of someone with Alzheimer's brutally shredding another person, animal, or small child when the "lose it".


----------



## koshergrl

Well they don't have the teeth that a pit does.

Look, there are lots of things that are dangerous for kids..that doesn't mean you ban everything that poses a threat to children. 

Dogs are dogs. They have always posed a potential threat to children. That's the way it is.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> That ain't never going to happen. but yes he would be dead to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's just pathetic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's just the facts of life. If any of my sons ever turn liberal I would disinherit them
Click to expand...


No matter how often I read this kind of rw shit, I'm still shocked at how utterly inhuman some of you are.

If you're really that callous and uncaring of your own child why did you have him? Does he know how little you care about him? 

I suppose if he were gay or transgender, you'd just kill him. 

Don't answer. I really don't want to know.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

The 10 Most Dangerous Dog Breeds

No surprises but - there it is.


----------



## Coyote

Luddly Neddite said:


> The 10 Most Dangerous Dog Breeds
> 
> No surprises but - there it is.



Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.


> Pit Bull  To anyone who knows dogs, the American Pit Bull Terrier is no surprise at #1 on a list of deadliest dogs. In this study the Pit Bull stood far ahead of all the other breeds with *66 fatalities *attributed to it. Known for their extremely aggressive nature, many states have legislation banning the breeding of pit bulls



66 fatalities.

Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.

That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.

"Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?

You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.

But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.


----------



## Noomi

koshergrl said:


> For a while I had a group of old nosey men congregating on the street across from my house. There were up to 5 of them, often with dogs. They'd hang out across from my driveway, and the dogs in my house would go NUTS. I found out this was happening by coming home at odd times during the day, incidentally. Anyway, they'd all hang out there with their little dogs and their idling vehicles, and glare up at my house when the dogs would bark.
> 
> I took to coming home, bringing the pit out very lightly restrained on his leash, putting him into the car, then backing out. He of course went ballistic in the car when I did this...slavering and snarling and barking at them (I left the window open about 2 inches to allow them the full impact). What assholes! They can go congregate in front of their own houses, why of ALL the places to hang out, they felt compelled to hang out THERE, I'm sure I don't know.
> 
> But after doing that a few times, they finally broke it up. Mylo got out once and ran over the dachsund..she didn't even bite the little shit (who would walk back and forth in front of the house with its owner yap-yap-yapping) but I still got to pay for a vet visit and..get this...ANTI-ANXIETY meds for the little fucker.



Little fuckin' yappy dogs are the worst. And pits get a bad rap (mainly media bias) for some reason, yet the little mongrel dogs who nip at your heels and are basically vicious fuckers, get a free pass.

If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.


----------



## Noomi

Coyote said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> The 10 Most Dangerous Dog Breeds
> 
> No surprises but - there it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bull  To anyone who knows dogs, the American Pit Bull Terrier is no surprise at #1 on a list of deadliest dogs. In this study the Pit Bull stood far ahead of all the other breeds with *66 fatalities *attributed to it. Known for their extremely aggressive nature, many states have legislation banning the breeding of pit bulls
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 66 fatalities.
> 
> Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.
> 
> That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.
> 
> "Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?
> 
> You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.
> 
> But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.
Click to expand...


Exactly. Some pits attack, but the vast majority of them are harmless and wouldn't hurt a fly.


----------



## Coyote

Noomi said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> The 10 Most Dangerous Dog Breeds
> 
> No surprises but - there it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bull  To anyone who knows dogs, the American Pit Bull Terrier is no surprise at #1 on a list of deadliest dogs. In this study the Pit Bull stood far ahead of all the other breeds with *66 fatalities *attributed to it. Known for their extremely aggressive nature, many states have legislation banning the breeding of pit bulls
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 66 fatalities.
> 
> Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.
> 
> That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.
> 
> "Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?
> 
> You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.
> 
> But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly. Some pits attack, but the vast majority of them are harmless and wouldn't hurt a fly.
Click to expand...


The thing with events like dog fatalities is they are very rare period, but they get blown way out of proportion.  I believe you are more likely to die by car than by dog.


----------



## Noomi

Coyote said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.
> 
> 
> 66 fatalities.
> 
> Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.
> 
> That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.
> 
> "Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?
> 
> You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.
> 
> But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. Some pits attack, but the vast majority of them are harmless and wouldn't hurt a fly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The thing with events like dog fatalities is they are very rare period, but they get blown way out of proportion.  I believe you are more likely to die by car than by dog.
Click to expand...


Someone gets hit and killed a car, its lucky to get a byline on page 5. Someone gets bitten by a pitbull, its front page news and everyone demands pits be banned.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Coyote said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> The 10 Most Dangerous Dog Breeds
> 
> No surprises but - there it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bull  To anyone who knows dogs, the American Pit Bull Terrier is no surprise at #1 on a list of deadliest dogs. In this study the Pit Bull stood far ahead of all the other breeds with *66 fatalities *attributed to it. Known for their extremely aggressive nature, many states have legislation banning the breeding of pit bulls
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 66 fatalities.
> 
> Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.
> 
> That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.
> 
> "Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?
> 
> You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.
> 
> But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.
Click to expand...


Actually, the site stated very clearly what they were basing their numbers on so the bites of small dogs would have no place in that article.

If you have read my posts in this thread, you know that I am mostly in agreement with your very shallow assessment. Further, you already know that I have said I would ban the owners before I would ban the breed. 

However, if you're the one whose arms are torn off, I doubt any of that would matter much.


----------



## WinterBorn

Noomi said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> The 10 Most Dangerous Dog Breeds
> 
> No surprises but - there it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bull  To anyone who knows dogs, the American Pit Bull Terrier is no surprise at #1 on a list of deadliest dogs. In this study the Pit Bull stood far ahead of all the other breeds with *66 fatalities *attributed to it. Known for their extremely aggressive nature, many states have legislation banning the breeding of pit bulls
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 66 fatalities.
> 
> Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.
> 
> That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.
> 
> "Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?
> 
> You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.
> 
> But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly. Some pits attack, but the vast majority of them are harmless and wouldn't hurt a fly.
Click to expand...


And the witnesses identifying the dog as a pit bull are suspect as well.  Plenty of the attacks are committed by other breeds and are misidentified.


----------



## Noomi

WinterBorn said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Actually...the surprise is in the lack of critical thinking.
> 
> 
> 66 fatalities.
> 
> Out of an estimated 55 million dogs in the US, Pits  makes up maybe 9% of the total canine population and as much as 30 to 40% in some regions.
> 
> That's a shitload of Pits and only 66 fatalities?  This is a VERY RARE event.
> 
> "Known for their aggressive nature"?  WTF?  If the fatality rate is so low, how aggressive is their nature?
> 
> You could go further and extrapolate dog attacks and bites as a whole in which case the numbers would be marginally larger.  However - there would still be a caveat.  Most dog bites by small dogs go unreported (so those aggressive buggers get a free pass in statistics) - bites by large dogs do more damage so get reported more.
> 
> But in the end you are looking at a lot of pits who do nothing more than munch dog chow, sleep on the couch and go out to poop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. Some pits attack, but the vast majority of them are harmless and wouldn't hurt a fly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And the witnesses identifying the dog as a pit bull are suspect as well.  Plenty of the attacks are committed by other breeds and are misidentified.
Click to expand...


Most people couldn't even pick out a pitbull from a lineup.


----------



## Noomi

Pick the Pit - Can you find the Pitbull?

Spot the pit bull.

I got it right first try. Most people take 9 tries to get it right.


----------



## Noomi

findpitbull_v4

Spot the pit bull. I got it right first try. Most people won't.


----------



## Gracie

I know pits. I thought gracie had pit in her when she was a pup but as she grew, her face lengthened, jaws not so prominent. I got it on the second try.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.





If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.


----------



## Sallow

Pit bull hailed as hero after protecting owner from home invasion | CTV News

More likely than not..this is what Pits..and most dogs actually do.



> A pit bull is being hailed as a hero by police after the dog saved its owner&#8217;s life during an attack at an Edmonton home on Tuesday.
> 
> Four-year-old pit bull Mercy jumped into action after a group of three men and a teenaged boy pushed their way into the apartment of a 30-year-old female victim.
> 
> Mercy jumped to protect her owner after the men allegedly became violent.
> 
> A pitbull is being credited with saving her owner's life during a violent home invasion.
> 
> The dog suffered from life-threatening injuries after she was attacked with what police describe as a machete
> 
> 
> Read more: Pit bull hailed as hero after protecting owner from home invasion | CTV News


----------



## Noomi

Unkotare said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
Click to expand...


He takes two people to walk, usually.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> For a while I had a group of old nosey men congregating on the street across from my house. There were up to 5 of them, often with dogs. They'd hang out across from my driveway, and the dogs in my house would go NUTS. I found out this was happening by coming home at odd times during the day, incidentally. Anyway, they'd all hang out there with their little dogs and their idling vehicles, and glare up at my house when the dogs would bark.
> 
> I took to coming home, bringing the pit out very lightly restrained on his leash, putting him into the car, then backing out. He of course went ballistic in the car when I did this...slavering and snarling and barking at them (I left the window open about 2 inches to allow them the full impact). What assholes! They can go congregate in front of their own houses, why of ALL the places to hang out, they felt compelled to hang out THERE, I'm sure I don't know.
> 
> But after doing that a few times, they finally broke it up. Mylo got out once and ran over the dachsund..she didn't even bite the little shit (who would walk back and forth in front of the house with its owner yap-yap-yapping) but I still got to pay for a vet visit and..get this...ANTI-ANXIETY meds for the little fucker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Little fuckin' yappy dogs are the worst. And pits get a bad rap (mainly media bias) for some reason, yet the little mongrel dogs who nip at your heels and are basically vicious fuckers, get a free pass.
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
Click to expand...


You should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Luddly Neddite said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's just pathetic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's just the facts of life. If any of my sons ever turn liberal I would disinherit them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No matter how often I read this kind of rw shit, I'm still shocked at how utterly inhuman some of you are.
> 
> If you're really that callous and uncaring of your own child why did you have him? Does he know how little you care about him?
> 
> I suppose if he were gay or transgender, you'd just kill him.
> 
> Don't answer. I really don't want to know.
Click to expand...


FUCK YOU GOD DAMN LIBERALS.


----------



## Noomi

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> For a while I had a group of old nosey men congregating on the street across from my house. There were up to 5 of them, often with dogs. They'd hang out across from my driveway, and the dogs in my house would go NUTS. I found out this was happening by coming home at odd times during the day, incidentally. Anyway, they'd all hang out there with their little dogs and their idling vehicles, and glare up at my house when the dogs would bark.
> 
> I took to coming home, bringing the pit out very lightly restrained on his leash, putting him into the car, then backing out. He of course went ballistic in the car when I did this...slavering and snarling and barking at them (I left the window open about 2 inches to allow them the full impact). What assholes! They can go congregate in front of their own houses, why of ALL the places to hang out, they felt compelled to hang out THERE, I'm sure I don't know.
> 
> But after doing that a few times, they finally broke it up. Mylo got out once and ran over the dachsund..she didn't even bite the little shit (who would walk back and forth in front of the house with its owner yap-yap-yapping) but I still got to pay for a vet visit and..get this...ANTI-ANXIETY meds for the little fucker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Little fuckin' yappy dogs are the worst. And pits get a bad rap (mainly media bias) for some reason, yet the little mongrel dogs who nip at your heels and are basically vicious fuckers, get a free pass.
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.
Click to expand...


If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> Little fuckin' yappy dogs are the worst. And pits get a bad rap (mainly media bias) for some reason, yet the little mongrel dogs who nip at your heels and are basically vicious fuckers, get a free pass.
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
Click to expand...

If you can't handle your dog it could kill a human, I'm not concerned with the yappy dog.


----------



## HUGGY

My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches.  He just made a pass a few seconds ago.  I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes.  Dre can be VERY persistant.  

Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears.  She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction.  Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head.  THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed.  He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs.  I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed.  Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead.  Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.  

In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed.  They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.

Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door.  I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor.  I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.  

Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.

True story.


----------



## Noomi

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you can't handle your dog it could kill a human, I'm not concerned with the yappy dog.
Click to expand...


He is harmless.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't handle your dog it could kill a human, I'm not concerned with the yappy dog.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He is harmless.
Click to expand...


If YOU can't control your dog and it's takes two people to restrain it YOU need to be banned from the dog.


----------



## HUGGY

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you can't handle your dog it could kill a human, I'm not concerned with the yappy dog.
Click to expand...


There is no point having gaurd dogs that are not capable of taking on a human being intent on doing you harm.  

My dogs are outside right this second fending off the property I watch yelling at some prostitutes and drug dealers.  This goes on almost every night from around 10 PM till 4 in the morning.  Happens probably a dozen times on average.  

OK gotta go out and see what the comotion is all about again...  I'll catch up on my Z's in the afternoon as usual.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

HUGGY said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't handle your dog it could kill a human, I'm not concerned with the yappy dog.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is no point having gaurd dogs that are not capable of taking on a human being intent on doing you harm.
> 
> My dogs are outside right this second fending off the property I watch yelling at some prostitutes and drug dealers.  This goes on almost every night from around 10 PM till 4 in the morning.  Happens probably a dozen times on average.
> 
> OK gotta go out and see what the comotion is all about again...  I'll catch up on my Z's in the afternoon as usual.
Click to expand...


Do you have control over your dog? Trained guard dogs are controllable.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
Click to expand...




Then you shouldn't have him.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Unkotare said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then you shouldn't have him.
Click to expand...


Go figure shes anti gun but has a dog that takes two people to control
Gun is an  inanimate object can't move or doing anything on it's own
BIG POWERFUL DOG can move freely on it's own which is more of a danger


----------



## WinterBorn

HUGGY said:


> My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches.  He just made a pass a few seconds ago.  I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes.  Dre can be VERY persistant.
> 
> Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears.  She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction.  Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head.  THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed.  He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs.  I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed.  Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead.  Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.
> 
> In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed.  They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.
> 
> Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door.  I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor.  I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.
> 
> Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.
> 
> True story.



Haven't you heard?  Your dogs will eventually turn on you and kill you or kill some small child.  Oh, and your dogs serve no purpose and are disposable. 


Actually, it sounds like my nights a few years ago.  No pits, but a Walker Coonhound and a Weimeraner can hog a lotta bed.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

WinterBorn said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches.  He just made a pass a few seconds ago.  I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes.  Dre can be VERY persistant.
> 
> Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears.  She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction.  Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head.  THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed.  He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs.  I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed.  Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead.  Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.
> 
> In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed.  They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.
> 
> Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door.  I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor.  I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.
> 
> Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.
> 
> True story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't you heard?  Your dogs will eventually turn on you and kill you or kill some small child.  Oh, and your dogs serve no purpose and are disposable.
> 
> 
> Actually, it sounds like my nights a few years ago.  No pits, but a Walker Coonhound and a Weimeraner can hog a lotta bed.
Click to expand...


huggy sounds like his dog is trained and controlled.


----------



## HUGGY

bigrebnc1775 said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't handle your dog it could kill a human, I'm not concerned with the yappy dog.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is no point having gaurd dogs that are not capable of taking on a human being intent on doing you harm.
> 
> My dogs are outside right this second fending off the property I watch yelling at some prostitutes and drug dealers.  This goes on almost every night from around 10 PM till 4 in the morning.  Happens probably a dozen times on average.
> 
> OK gotta go out and see what the comotion is all about again...  I'll catch up on my Z's in the afternoon as usual.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you have control over your dog? Trained guard dogs are controllable.
Click to expand...


With verbal commands and hand signals.  I rarely leash them.  I only use the physical restraints when I use them in areas of the property where I might come into contact with innocent people.  

I can direct my dogs from my third story perch and outlook to anywhere on the property.  They are highly trained and fully responsive to my direction.. both individually and as a pair in various action or non action commands.

My favorite and most used command is "Shut the fuck up and go back to sleep".    Seriously... I have absolute control over my dogs from a distance of up to several hundred feet.  All dogs are individuals and have varied ability to think and respond to the "alpha's" direction.  The more potentially dangerous an animal is obviously the more important that it has an absolute understanding of who the boss is and what it's role is "in the pack".


----------



## BullKurtz

Noomi said:


> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.



And here you have it ladies and gents.....an angry woman with a dangerous dog on a leash.....perfect really.  She can intimidate anybody she pleases with it, which she obviously enjoys.  And should she decide to unleash it, she probably won't be charged with assault with a deadly weapon like she could if she used a machete.   The perfect crime, eh Noomi?


----------



## BullKurtz

WinterBorn said:


> Haven't you heard?  Your dogs will eventually turn on you and kill you or kill some small child.  Oh, and your dogs serve no purpose and are disposable. .



Just remember this cracker's technique to fight off a lunging pitbull....throw it on it's back and make growling sounds on it's throat.  

What's becoming clear with the growing ownership of dangerous dogs is the growing number of criminal charges stemming from an attack.  Civil liability is also making inroads into a choice of breeds.....if your dog messes up a meter reader, he will own your house for it.  Since my morning run now involves passing several yards with aggressive dogs, I'm thinking about finding an ambulance-chaser and filing nuisance-suits for intimidation.  I see no difference between a wolf-hybrid croutching in attack-mode behind a fence it can easily jump, and the homeowner pointing a rifle at me. 

 I'm gonna be RICH I tell ya, RICH!


----------



## HUGGY

WinterBorn said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches.  He just made a pass a few seconds ago.  I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes.  Dre can be VERY persistant.
> 
> Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears.  She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction.  Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head.  THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed.  He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs.  I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed.  Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead.  Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.
> 
> In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed.  They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.
> 
> Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door.  I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor.  I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.
> 
> Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.
> 
> True story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't you heard?  Your dogs will eventually turn on you and kill you or kill some small child.  Oh, and your dogs serve no purpose and are disposable.
> 
> 
> Actually, it sounds like my nights a few years ago.  No pits, but a Walker Coonhound and a Weimeraner can hog a lotta bed.
Click to expand...


Dogs turn on owners that exhibit weakness.  The secret to better dog control is repetition and consistant behavior from the handler.  I never "bribe" my dogs.  Treats are one of the dumbest motivators used by ignorant dog owners.  Your better guard dog needs to *want* to follow your commands under any conditions or situation.


----------



## Unkotare

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> WinterBorn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't you heard?  Your dogs will eventually turn on you and kill you or kill some small child.  Oh, and your dogs serve no purpose and are disposable. .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just remember this cracker's technique to fight off a lunging pitbull....throw it on it's back and make growling sounds on it's throat.
> 
> What's becoming clear with the growing ownership of dangerous dogs is the growing number of criminal charges stemming from an attack.  Civil liability is also making inroads into a choice of breeds.....if your dog messes up a meter reader, he will own your house for it.  Since my morning run now involves passing several yards with aggressive dogs, I'm thinking about finding an ambulance-chaser and filing nuisance-suits for intimidation.  I see no difference between a wolf-hybrid croutching in attack-mode behind a fence it can easily jump, and the homeowner pointing a rifle at me.
> 
> I'm gonna be RICH I tell ya, RICH!
Click to expand...



Ok, we get it. You're scared of dogs.


----------



## koshergrl

Noomi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> Little fuckin' yappy dogs are the worst. And pits get a bad rap (mainly media bias) for some reason, yet the little mongrel dogs who nip at your heels and are basically vicious fuckers, get a free pass.
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
Click to expand...

 
In what alternate reality? NO, your dog does NOT have the right to kill little dogs that *annoy* it. You prove once again that you believe might = right, and survival of the fittest trumps common sense.

Your dog doesn't, in fact, have any *rights* aside from the right to be treated with a modicom of care. 

I'll never forget your retarded thread where you were resentful of the dogs in your household because they were not sufficiently *grateful* to you for keeping them. You're a fucking piece of work.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

koshergrl said:


> noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> you should be banned from owning anything that you cannot control that can do harm/ or kill others.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if a little yappy dog starts annoying my dog, my dog has the right to attack it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in what alternate reality? No, your dog does not have the right to kill little dogs that *annoy* it. You prove once again that you believe might = right, and survival of the fittest trumps common sense.
> 
> Your dog doesn't, in fact, have any *rights* aside from the right to be treated with a modicom of care.
> 
> I'll never forget your retarded thread where you were resentful of the dogs in your household because they were not sufficiently *grateful* to you for keeping them. You're a fucking piece of work.
Click to expand...


and then some.


----------



## koshergrl

Luddly Neddite said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> I used to be completely opposed to BSL and banning of pit bulls. And, I blame humans for every single attack by a pit bull because its human's over breeding and inbreeding that has created a completely different dog than the pit bull of the 19th century.
> 
> Esmeralda makes some very good points as does GT. Its true that its a minority of pits who attack, kill, maim.
> 
> But, google "pit bull attacks" and then "images". Imagine those people are your child or other family member.
> 
> Is this dog breed really more important, worth more, more valuable than the safety of human beings?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A converse question, is: is a situation where you would be completely unharmed 99.992% of the time considered an "unsafe" situation?
> 
> And aside from that, we don't even know what percentage of that 0.008% of pit who kill were raised by seething, abusive retards. Your risk might even be far less.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're right. If we could ban the damn owners, I'd be in favor of banning the idiots who have used and abused these dogs and then bred more. And I appreciate the points you've made about degree of risk.
> 
> But still -
> 
> What would be lost if pits were - POOF! - gone?
> 
> It won't happen though. Nor will we ever really punish dog fighters and others who are responsible for the dogs who attack.
Click to expand...

 
If pits were gone, some other dog would fill the niche.

Because it's not the dogs, it's the owners.

Also, all these *numbers* and *stats* that we're talking about in re: pit bull attacks...the PRESS is who is determining what dogs are pits and what dogs aren't. And when you look at it objectively, and you start reading the articles, you realize that most of the "pits" and "pit crosses" are just mutts of uncertain background, and nobody has actually identified their breed, except the writer of the article.


----------



## koshergrl

HUGGY said:


> My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches. He just made a pass a few seconds ago. I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes. Dre can be VERY persistant.
> 
> Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears. She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction. Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head. THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed. He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs. I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed. Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead. Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.
> 
> In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed. They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.
> 
> Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door. I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor. I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.
> 
> Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.
> 
> True story.


 
Snoop Dog is a huge bed hog as well. He pushes my son out of the bed fairly regularly. My daughter is more tenacious...but she has a larger bed, and even so, I am frequently called in to make him move. It's not an easy task. He's around 70-75 lbs, but when he snugs down on the bed, it's like he's made of lead.


----------



## koshergrl

In fact, I think the bed hogging must be a terrier trait...Mylo only weighs in at about 15 lbs...I have a queen size bed, and still I spend most of every night hanging over the side of the bed where she has pushed me.

That's when she isn't actually laying on top of my legs, which is even worse.


----------



## Coyote

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If a yappy dog came up to me when Cooper was out for his walk, and I couldn't restrain him (likely because he's extremely strong) he'd devour that little dog in seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
Click to expand...


You might consider using different equipment to walk him....just a thought.  

It's not a good idea to walk a dog you can't control if a situation gets out of hand.


----------



## koshergrl

Good lord.

My impression is that she has no inclination to control her dog, if she thinks he has the right to kill dogs that *annoy* him.


----------



## koshergrl

I also get the impression that the dog doesn't get out much, and she's proud of the fact that it takes two people to walk him.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

koshergrl said:


> I also get the impression that the dog doesn't get out much, and she's proud of the fact that it takes two people to walk him.



A person who can't control their dog is criminal and should be treated as such.


----------



## koshergrl

This is noomi. She thinks mothers who torture their children to death should not get jail time, but be *treated*. Don't expect her to have much sympathy for little dogs that get in her way.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

koshergrl said:


> This is noomi. She thinks mothers who torture their children to death should not get jail time, but be *treated*. Don't expect her to have much sympathy for little dogs that get in her way.



I remember that discussion.


----------



## BullKurtz

koshergrl said:


> I also get the impression that the dog doesn't get out much, and she's proud of the fact that it takes two people to walk him.



I get the impression the dog is for intimidation which she enjoys immensely....same as my tormentor with her two chows.   She just called the guy in Detroit who shot the woman on his porch a "racist" who shouldn't have a gun.  Imagine a world where folks like Noomi are in control....wait....they already are in the blue states.


----------



## koshergrl

Well noom isn't even American, so we can breathe a sigh of relief. 

She just thinks she has the authority to tell us how we should do things.


----------



## HUGGY

koshergrl said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches. He just made a pass a few seconds ago. I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes. Dre can be VERY persistant.
> 
> Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears. She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction. Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head. THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed. He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs. I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed. Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead. Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.
> 
> In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed. They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.
> 
> Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door. I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor. I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.
> 
> Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.
> 
> True story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Snoop Dog is a huge bed hog as well. He pushes my son out of the bed fairly regularly. My daughter is more tenacious...but she has a larger bed, and even so, I am frequently called in to make him move. It's not an easy task. He's around 70-75 lbs, but when he snugs down on the bed, it's like he's made of lead.
Click to expand...


I've got a fool proof "trick" to get my dogs to make space.  Strangely they both like a well made bed.  So I tell em to get off the bed cuz I gotta "fix" it.  They jump right off and I straighten everything and tuck in the corners and toss the blankets at the headboard and then the two big comforters.... THEN I lie down on the far right edge and make myself "comfortable" and give the all clear and having waited patiently they spring up on the bed and take up all the remaining space on my queen size.  Angel stands up next to my head and I take one of the comforters and toss it up so it covers her completely ...then and only then she settles down in a ball near my head.

*I *have no pillows though because the big male has a strange fetish.  He has commandered both of them as chew/comfort toys... He doesn't damage them but he slobbers his dog slime on them and renders them unuseable as anything you might want to lay your head on.  So he grabs one out of the dog toy enclosure and takes it up on the bed with him and "sucks/chews" on it till he falls asleep.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

HUGGY said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> My big male "Dre" preasures me for butt scratches. He just made a pass a few seconds ago. I find it annoying when I'm on the puter and he goes head first under the puter table and positions his big butt right up against my legs and just waits there until I scratch his butt for a few minutes. Dre can be VERY persistant.
> 
> Sometimes "Angel, the female, will get up on the bed and lick me on the face and in my ears. She is very forceful and won't stop until she is sure that my face and ears are clean enough for her satisfaction. Then ... she will nose around in the comforters until I cover her up and only then will she curl up and go to sleep next to my head. THEN Dre will jump up on the bed and lie down next to me sometimes pushing me right to the very edge of the bed. He doesn't want any blankets on him so he lies down on mine making it difficult to adjust the bedding to suit my own needs. I tell ya...200 pounds of pitbulls can be very intimidating on one bed. Ya try to scoot em over so ya can have more room and it is like they are dead. Ya might get a groan out of em but they seem to have this extra ability to hold thier ground when sleeping or "pretending" to sleep when a guy just wants a little space to stretch out sometimes.
> 
> In my experience pitbulls can be extremely selfish in taking up space on my bed. They do allow you SOME room but just barely enough so you don't fall off of the bed.
> 
> Sometimes though they will hear something outside in the middle of the night and both jump up out of thier dead sleep and when they do I go flying off of the bed from them pushing off to get off the bed and to the door. I get little warning...just a woof and a growl and I land on my ass on the floor. I'm not little either...6' 225 lbs.
> 
> Pitbulls are not only capable of vicious attacks... they are capable of carelessness and being bed hogs.
> 
> True story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Snoop Dog is a huge bed hog as well. He pushes my son out of the bed fairly regularly. My daughter is more tenacious...but she has a larger bed, and even so, I am frequently called in to make him move. It's not an easy task. He's around 70-75 lbs, but when he snugs down on the bed, it's like he's made of lead.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've got a fool proof "trick" to get my dogs to make space.  Strangely they both like a well made bed.  So I tell em to get off the bed cuz I gotta "fix" it.  They jump right off and I straighten everything and tuck in the corners and toss the blankets at the headboard and then the two big comforters.... THEN I lie down on the far right edge and make myself "comfortable" and give the all clear and having waited patiently they spring up on the bed and take up all the remaining space on my queen size.  Angel stands up next to my head and I take one of the comforters and toss it up so it covers her completely ...then and only then she settles down in a ball near my head.
> 
> *I *have no pillows though because the big male has a strange fetish.  He has commandered both of them as chew/comfort toys... He doesn't damage them but he slobbers his dog slime on them and renders them unuseable as anything you might want to lay your head on.  So he grabs one out of the dog toy enclosure and takes it up on the bed with him and "sucks/chews" on it till he falls asleep.
Click to expand...


He sounds like a big ass baby 
I wished mine was still here


----------



## koshergrl

I have a Parson Russell Terrier who would gladly move in with you, bigreb! I will foot the $$ to send her your way, just give the word! She needs a single man with no other dogs.


----------



## longknife

Pitbulls, like ANY dog, reacts to their Alpha male and female - usually their owners. If you treat them tenderly, with love, they will respond a hundred times more giving unlimited love.

As someone pointed out, most dogs of ANY breed will react badly if they have been mistreated by their owners.

Pits have such a bad rep because of their amazingly strong jaw and grip.


----------



## Unkotare

longknife said:


> Pitbulls, like ANY dog, reacts to their Alpha male and female - usually their owners. If you treat them tenderly, with love, they will respond a hundred times more giving unlimited love.
> 
> As someone pointed out, most dogs of ANY breed will react badly if they have been mistreated by their owners.
> 
> Pits have such a bad rep because of their amazingly strong jaw and grip.





They have thumbs?!


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Strange thing just happen. A guy knocked on my door had the biggest pitbull I have ever seen sweet guy had a few scratches around the nose. Anyway this strange er asked me if it was my dog. I told him no while we we're talking my cat comes to the front door my cat freaks the hell out the dog moved closer to the front door. (luckily I have a solid tempered treated glass door) anyway he starts braking it was everything I could do to pull him back. I gave him a command to stop, he sat down and looked at me and was ok after that.


----------



## koshergrl

Wow that is sort of weird, given the recent convo.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

koshergrl said:


> Wow that is sort of weird, given the recent convo.



True. not sure if I want to see the dog reunited with his owner. I have a funny feeling about this especially with the scratches on the nose. Anyway I hope it finds a good home or if his owner is a good person finds it's way back home.


----------



## koshergrl

Snoop's got dinks on his face, too, and he's never fought as far as I know. They just lead with their mouths...the scars might be from a fence.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

koshergrl said:


> Snoop's got dinks on his face, too, and he's never fought as far as I know. They just lead with their mouths...the scars might be from a fence.



I hope so. That was a beautiful dog.


----------



## koshergrl

He probably just got loose...hopefully they find his people.

Snoop got out of my car once here...cops picked him up pronto and I had to pick him up at the dog pound. 

He now holds the title of "unrepentant jailbird". He wasn't even glad to see me when I picked him up. He walked out like he owned the place, and was a little miffed at me.


----------



## Sallow

Coyote said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You might consider using different equipment to walk him....just a thought.
> 
> It's not a good idea to walk a dog you can't control if a situation gets out of hand.
Click to expand...


gotta agree with this.

you should be able to completely control your dog in most circumstances.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

koshergrl said:


> He probably just got loose...hopefully they find his people.
> 
> Snoop got out of my car once here...cops picked him up pronto and I had to pick him up at the dog pound.
> 
> He now holds the title of "unrepentant jailbird". He wasn't even glad to see me when I picked him up. He walked out like he owned the place, and was a little miffed at me.


----------



## Coyote

bigrebnc1775 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> I also get the impression that the dog doesn't get out much, and she's proud of the fact that it takes two people to walk him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A person who can't control their dog is criminal and should be treated as such.
Click to expand...


Up to a point I agree, however - if my dog is on leash, and an off leash dog runs up to my dog, there is only so much I can do to control it, I can not control the loose dog's actions and the responsibility for what happens lies with the owner of the loose dog.  That said - I don't want my dogs fighting or put in a position of having to fight and if it means getting the dog behind me, or kicking the other dog, I'll do it.


----------



## koshergrl

Yeah but that's not what Noomi was talking about.

She said if a little dog ANNOYED her dog, her dog had the right to kill it.


----------



## Noomi

Unkotare said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then you shouldn't have him.
Click to expand...


You don't have the right to tell me what dog I should and shouldn't own. He is harmless, but if a smaller dog starts giving him the shits, I don't care if he tears it to shreds - if he gets to it before I kick it.


----------



## Noomi

koshergrl said:


> Yeah but that's not what Noomi was talking about.
> 
> She said if a little dog ANNOYED her dog, her dog had the right to kill it.



If a yappy dog starts growling and snapping at Cooper, he has the right to defend his space and his owner.


----------



## Noomi

Coyote said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you can't control your dog you shouldn't have it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You might consider using different equipment to walk him....just a thought.
> 
> It's not a good idea to walk a dog you can't control if a situation gets out of hand.
Click to expand...


I rarely walk him as it is. He is content playing ball in the backyard, usually.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah but that's not what Noomi was talking about.
> 
> She said if a little dog ANNOYED her dog, her dog had the right to kill it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If a yappy dog starts growling and snapping at Cooper, he has the right to defend his space and his owner.
Click to expand...


So dogs have rights but baby's don't? GOT IT.


----------



## Noomi

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah but that's not what Noomi was talking about.
> 
> She said if a little dog ANNOYED her dog, her dog had the right to kill it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If a yappy dog starts growling and snapping at Cooper, he has the right to defend his space and his owner.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So dogs have rights but baby's don't? GOT IT.
Click to expand...


No idea what a thread about pit bulls has to do with babies.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If a yappy dog starts growling and snapping at Cooper, he has the right to defend his space and his owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So dogs have rights but baby's don't? GOT IT.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No idea what a thread about pit bulls has to do with babies.
Click to expand...


You can't leave one thread attacking baby's and come to another thread saying a dog has rights. It just doesn't work that way.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then you shouldn't have him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't have the right to tell me what dog I should and shouldn't own.
Click to expand...





Of course I do, and from your other comments I can tell you that not only should you not own any kind of dog - EVER - but that you shouldn't be allowed near humans either.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> He takes two people to walk, usually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You might consider using different equipment to walk him....just a thought.
> 
> It's not a good idea to walk a dog you can't control if a situation gets out of hand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I rarely walk him as it is. He is content playing ball in the backyard, usually.
Click to expand...



You're a morally bankrupt, irresponsible fucking mess.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> if a smaller dog starts giving him the shits, I don't care if he tears it to shreds - if he gets to it before I kick it.





You realize that YOU deserve the same treatment - at least, right?


----------



## Noomi

Unkotare said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> if a smaller dog starts giving him the shits, I don't care if he tears it to shreds - if he gets to it before I kick it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that YOU deserve the same treatment - at least, right?
Click to expand...


I guess you are okay with little yappy dogs being let off the leash and allowed to snap at the heels of dog walkers?


----------



## Noomi

Unkotare said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then you shouldn't have him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have the right to tell me what dog I should and shouldn't own.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course I do, and from your other comments I can tell you that not only should you not own any kind of dog - EVER - but that you shouldn't be allowed near humans either.
Click to expand...


What a wonderful person you are.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> if a smaller dog starts giving him the shits, I don't care if he tears it to shreds - if he gets to it before I kick it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that YOU deserve the same treatment - at least, right?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I guess you are okay with little yappy dogs being let off the leash and allowed to snap at the heels of dog walkers?
Click to expand...




And there  is nothing between that and letting some irresponsible, immoral fool like you cause its death because you are too stupid and weak to control an animal you have no business being near let alone owning? You're a disgrace of an animal yourself.


----------



## Noomi

You didn't answer the question.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have the right to tell me what dog I should and shouldn't own.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course I do, and from your other comments I can tell you that not only should you not own any kind of dog - EVER - but that you shouldn't be allowed near humans either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What a wonderful person you are.
Click to expand...



This coming from the likes of _you_?


----------



## Noomi

I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.



Prove it say something decent instead of thew bull shit that you have been saying.


----------



## Noomi

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prove it say something decent instead of thew bull shit that you have been saying.
Click to expand...


I will say something decent when you show me respect.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Noomi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prove it say something decent instead of thew bull shit that you have been saying.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I will say something decent when you show me respect.
Click to expand...


Bitch you have to earn it. Respect isn't given and being an arrogant foreigner talking about a subject that you don't have a clue on (the U.S.) IS ONE STRIKE AGAINST YOU. And being a liberal makes it two. so shut the fuck up.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.





Not according to how you've presented yourself here. Not even close.


----------



## Noomi

Unkotare said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to how you've presented yourself here. Not even close.
Click to expand...


In your opinion.


----------



## Bfgrn

Sallow said:


> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.



False.


----------



## tinydancer

Every one keeps forgetting the full name.

Pit Bull Terriers. 

A Yorkie is just a smaller version of the same.

Terriers. 

My parents Boston was hell on four legs.  I used to beg my parents not to make me walk him. Our neighbor had a german shepherd. 

No Benny no Benny not Wilhelm (our neighbors german shepherd) I'd scream this every walk. 

It was a freaking nightmare, but this little son of a bitch kept challenging  our neighbors dog. Why?
Because he was a terrier. A Boston Terrier. 

Just like the pit bull terrier. Are we getting better now to understanding what I am talking about?

It's the nature of the beast.


----------



## tinydancer

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to how you've presented yourself here. Not even close.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In your opinion.
Click to expand...


You have some blessedly funky dogs down your way.

When I first got on the net..............whoa geeze way back when and in the catahoula world I rarely stepped outside it except for this great place for dog chat.

I met a guy who had the most amazing and wonderous shepherd aussie shep guys not to be mistaken for a german who all she ever wanted to do was herd something. 



I kept telling him Sally had to have something to herd. At this point she was trying to herd the planes coming in and out of his space. I was losing my ridgeback Ripley at the time so I guess Sally was my girl dreaming to herd planes.

Sally kept me going all thru those darkest days. The pilots never knew it but that dog kept herding them. 

And she kept me alive in spirit. 

You are an interesting lot. Pity you have such a quarantine on beasties. Or I would have been down lickety split decades ago. 

I just can't give up my babies to a 6 month wait time. And it's most insulting that the government would do that to a sanctioned pet versus...................well you can fill in the blank.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

tinydancer said:


> Pit Bull Terriers.
> 
> A Yorkie is just a smaller version of the same.
> 
> Terriers.



You're truly certifiable.


----------



## earlycuyler

Pit Bulls are fine dogs. You just have to know how to be around them. It is a fact, that many out there now Close to all of them have suffred some form of abuse from haveing to fight, to just plane old neglect. Even most of thees dogs come back to be fine family dogs. Some, are just psycho crazy dogs that need.to be put to sleep for their own good. In reality, pits are no more dangerous then any other dog. What I find shocking, is that so many will get sucked into such deep fear by a media that on any other topic would be considred biased and dishonest. Kind of shows how much of our critical this king has been hamded over to the powers that be.


----------



## Unkotare

Noomi said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> 
> I happen to be a decent person, thank you very much.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to how you've presented yourself here. Not even close.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In your opinion.
Click to expand...




By any reasonable assessment.


----------



## Bfgrn

earlycuyler said:


> Pit Bulls are fine dogs. You just have to know how to be around them. It is a fact, that many out there now Close to all of them have suffred some form of abuse from haveing to fight, to just plane old neglect. Even most of thees dogs come back to be fine family dogs. Some, are just psycho crazy dogs that need.to be put to sleep for their own good. In reality, pits are no more dangerous then any other dog. What I find shocking, is that so many will get sucked into such deep fear by a media that on any other topic would be considred biased and dishonest. Kind of shows how much of our critical this king has been hamded over to the powers that be.



You don't know shit. Ignorant people like you need to educate yourself before you open your pie hole. When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.

By 1993 pit bulls kept as pets, exclusive of dogs trained to fight, already accounted for more than half of all life-threatening dog attacks. Rottweilers accounted for 20%. Over the past decade the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks was up 789%; attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%. The percentage of total life-threatening dog attacks committed by pit bulls did not go up only because the number of life-threatening Rottweiler attacks leaped 2000%; attacks on children were up 1000%; attacks on adults were up 1700%; fatalies were up 2500%; and maimings were up 2500%. Rottweilers now account for 25% of all life-threateningdog attacks.

No other common breeds present an even remotely comparable actuarial risk factor. Yet among all the major U.S. animal advocacy groups, only PETA has favored a breed-specific approach to dog regulation.

The list for why pitbulls are dangerous, in numbers:

*$92.7 million*  Dog bite claims totaled $92.7 million for 2,400 claims in California (Insurance Information Institute, 2011). Source.
$500,000  The typical cost of settlements in attacks  by pit bulls and Rottweilers causing death or serious injury is an average of a half million dollars. The amount of $29,396 was the average cost of a dog bite case in 2011. Source.

*3000 %* -  Pit bulls and Rottweilers do three times more killing and maiming than all other dogs combined, meaning that their actuarial risk is approximately 3000% higher than that of the average dog. Source.

*2,500*  More than 2,500 times higher risk of killing than Labradors. Source.

*789%*  Over the past decade, there was an increase of 789% in the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks (attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%.). Source.

*66%  80%*   Over 2/3 (66%  80%) of the pit bulls who end up at the shelter are surrendered by their owners. Source.

*65%*  Pit bulls are responsible for 65 percent of all fatal dog attacks nationally. Source.

*58%*  Fifty eight percent of dogs euthanized at shelters are pit bull types.

*44%*  Forty four percent of Seeing Eye teams have reported being attacked by other dogs.  Source.

*25%*  A fourth of all dog bite claims were by due to pit bull bites. Source.

*14*  Every fourteen days, someone in the U.S. is killed by a pit bull.

*14*  Pitbuls are fourteen times more likely to escape their confines.  Source.

*11th*  Eleventh in popularity  *American Pit Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers, ranked 11th in popularity among 16 AKC-registered breeds and had by far the highest risk of killing  more than 2,500 times higher than Labs. Source.

*9*  Owners of dangerous breeds are more than 9 times more likely to have been convicted for a crime involving children and more than Source.

*8*  Eight times more likely to have been charged with drug crimes than owners of low-risked licensed dogs.  Source.

*6*  Six times more likely to kill their owners. Source.

*5.4*  Every 5.4. days, a body part is severed and lost in a pit bull attack . Source.

*3*  Owners of dangerous dogs are more than three times more likely to have been convicted of domestic abuse. Source.

*1/3* of all home insurance claims are dog bites (25% of them, pit bull bites). Source.

*3*  It is estimated that pit bull type dogs represent 3% of the total population of dogs in the U.S.A.. Source.

*1* -  The Leading biters in 25 states. Source.

*1*  The Leading biters, nationally. Source.

*1* -  Leading in deaths and serious disfigurements and maimings.  Source.

 (U.S. statistics only)

So, is there any way a decent person would deny that Pitbulls ARE dangerous dogs? No, there isnt.


----------



## BullKurtz

I once kept Shepherds more for their intimidation potential than any protection I needed from them.  That changed one night when a black guy at a gas station was handing me a pack of cigarettes through the car window and the male shepherd grabbed his wrist from the back seat.  I had to scram because I was carrying a significant amount of contraband at the time and could not be interviewed by police.  Suffice to say the dog in question was no longer a threat...he was a dangerous dog I could no longer trust.  I kept him but he was given regular attitude adjustments about who would choose any future targets...him or me.  I called the guy at the gas station, apologize for what had happened, assured him the beast had it's rabies shots, and mailed him a cashiers check for $500 which he thanks me profusely for.  When owning a dog who can do serious damage to a human, I would strongly advise losing the buzz of having mayhem at the end of your leash and be very careful about being out and around with it.  When the dog does what you have not wanted the dog to do, you'll have some real consequences to deal with.


----------



## koshergrl

Bfgrn said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are fine dogs. You just have to know how to be around them. It is a fact, that many out there now Close to all of them have suffred some form of abuse from haveing to fight, to just plane old neglect. Even most of thees dogs come back to be fine family dogs. Some, are just psycho crazy dogs that need.to be put to sleep for their own good. In reality, pits are no more dangerous then any other dog. What I find shocking, is that so many will get sucked into such deep fear by a media that on any other topic would be considred biased and dishonest. Kind of shows how much of our critical this king has been hamded over to the powers that be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know shit. Ignorant people like you need to educate yourself before you open your pie hole. When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.
> 
> By 1993 pit bulls kept as pets, exclusive of dogs trained to fight, already accounted for more than half of all life-threatening dog attacks. Rottweilers accounted for 20%. Over the past decade the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks was up 789%; attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%. The percentage of total life-threatening dog attacks committed by pit bulls did not go up only because the number of life-threatening Rottweiler attacks leaped 2000%; attacks on children were up 1000%; attacks on adults were up 1700%; fatalies were up 2500%; and maimings were up 2500%. Rottweilers now account for 25% of all life-threateningdog attacks.
> 
> No other common breeds present an even remotely comparable actuarial risk factor. Yet among all the major U.S. animal advocacy groups, only PETA has favored a breed-specific approach to dog regulation.
> 
> The list for why pitbulls are dangerous, in numbers:
> 
> *$92.7 million*  Dog bite claims totaled $92.7 million for 2,400 claims in California (Insurance Information Institute, 2011). Source.
> $500,000  The typical cost of settlements in attacks  by pit bulls and Rottweilers causing death or serious injury is an average of a half million dollars. The amount of $29,396 was the average cost of a dog bite case in 2011. Source.
> 
> *3000 %* -  Pit bulls and Rottweilers do three times more killing and maiming than all other dogs combined, meaning that their actuarial risk is approximately 3000% higher than that of the average dog. Source.
> 
> *2,500*  More than 2,500 times higher risk of killing than Labradors. Source.
> 
> *789%*  Over the past decade, there was an increase of 789% in the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks (attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%.). Source.
> 
> *66%  80%*   Over 2/3 (66%  80%) of the pit bulls who end up at the shelter are surrendered by their owners. Source.
> 
> *65%*  Pit bulls are responsible for 65 percent of all fatal dog attacks nationally. Source.
> 
> *58%*  Fifty eight percent of dogs euthanized at shelters are pit bull types.
> 
> *44%*  Forty four percent of Seeing Eye teams have reported being attacked by other dogs.  Source.
> 
> *25%*  A fourth of all dog bite claims were by due to pit bull bites. Source.
> 
> *14*  Every fourteen days, someone in the U.S. is killed by a pit bull.
> 
> *14*  Pitbuls are fourteen times more likely to escape their confines.  Source.
> 
> *11th*  Eleventh in popularity  *American Pit Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers, ranked 11th in popularity among 16 AKC-registered breeds and had by far the highest risk of killing  more than 2,500 times higher than Labs. Source.
> 
> *9*  Owners of dangerous breeds are more than 9 times more likely to have been convicted for a crime involving children and more than Source.
> 
> *8*  Eight times more likely to have been charged with drug crimes than owners of low-risked licensed dogs.  Source.
> 
> *6*  Six times more likely to kill their owners. Source.
> 
> *5.4*  Every 5.4. days, a body part is severed and lost in a pit bull attack . Source.
> 
> *3*  Owners of dangerous dogs are more than three times more likely to have been convicted of domestic abuse. Source.
> 
> *1/3* of all home insurance claims are dog bites (25% of them, pit bull bites). Source.
> 
> *3*  It is estimated that pit bull type dogs represent 3% of the total population of dogs in the U.S.A.. Source.
> 
> *1* -  The Leading biters in 25 states. Source.
> 
> *1*  The Leading biters, nationally. Source.
> 
> *1* -  Leading in deaths and serious disfigurements and maimings.  Source.
> 
> (U.S. statistics only)
> 
> So, is there any way a decent person would deny that Pitbulls ARE dangerous dogs? No, there isnt.
Click to expand...



All dogs are dangerous according to their size and power.

However, keep in mind the stats are gathered via newspaper articles...and the press doesn't know a pit from a hole in the wall.

Snoop goes everywhere with me, and gas station attendants regularly reach into the car to receive $$ from me. We exchange it over his head. The local gas station attendants, McDonald's drive through workers and the ladies who take money at the dump all know him and give him treats. 

It's all about preparation, exposure, and controlling the situation at all times, so that in those situations where you don't necessarily have control, the dog still knows what is expected. 

I deliberately reach over the dog to pay people, so that on those occasions when one reaches in without thinking, he doesn't jump them.

And he doesn't, because of course that has happened.


----------



## koshergrl

The time that snoop got out of my car, he didn't cause any problems, and I didn't have to pay any fines. I had forgotten the back window was open and parked my car, and when I came out of the building he was gone. 

The police picked him up right away, he went willingly and docilely with them. He didn't attack any people or animals, he didn't cause any problems. Because he's a good dog.


----------



## BullKurtz

I work in the home-security industry and have found that most dogs will protect their owners but few are much at protecting the property.  Keep in mind I usually get there the morning after....sometimes to find a house trashed, sometimes finding blood splatter, sometimes finding the dog missing along with the guns and jewelry.  For the most part, a smart burglar can befriend most dogs by not showing any fear and having a pocket full of treats.  The dog is alone, bored, and actually welcomes a new companion....especially that gives him treats.  Again, the german breeds seem to be the most reliable at defending property when properly trained...ie being told to "watch the house, boy".  Our bane is the doggy-door....more burglars come in through those damn things than you'd ever imagine and we to this day do not have a reliable way to defend it.  Sliders are #2....I could teach you how to go through a locked patio door in under ten seconds....ask your security provider how to prevent it.


----------



## earlycuyler

Bfgrn said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are fine dogs. You just have to know how to be around them. It is a fact, that many out there now Close to all of them have suffred some form of abuse from haveing to fight, to just plane old neglect. Even most of thees dogs come back to be fine family dogs. Some, are just psycho crazy dogs that need.to be put to sleep for their own good. In reality, pits are no more dangerous then any other dog. What I find shocking, is that so many will get sucked into such deep fear by a media that on any other topic would be considred biased and dishonest. Kind of shows how much of our critical this king has been hamded over to the powers that be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know shit. Ignorant people like you need to educate yourself before you open your pie hole. When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.
> 
> By 1993 pit bulls kept as pets, exclusive of dogs trained to fight, already accounted for more than half of all life-threatening dog attacks. Rottweilers accounted for 20%. Over the past decade the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks was up 789%; attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%. The percentage of total life-threatening dog attacks committed by pit bulls did not go up only because the number of life-threatening Rottweiler attacks leaped 2000%; attacks on children were up 1000%; attacks on adults were up 1700%; fatalies were up 2500%; and maimings were up 2500%. Rottweilers now account for 25% of all life-threateningdog attacks.
> 
> No other common breeds present an even remotely comparable actuarial risk factor. Yet among all the major U.S. animal advocacy groups, only PETA has favored a breed-specific approach to dog regulation.
> 
> The list for why pitbulls are dangerous, in numbers:
> 
> *$92.7 million*  Dog bite claims totaled $92.7 million for 2,400 claims in California (Insurance Information Institute, 2011). Source.
> $500,000  The typical cost of settlements in attacks  by pit bulls and Rottweilers causing death or serious injury is an average of a half million dollars. The amount of $29,396 was the average cost of a dog bite case in 2011. Source.
> 
> *3000 %* -  Pit bulls and Rottweilers do three times more killing and maiming than all other dogs combined, meaning that their actuarial risk is approximately 3000% higher than that of the average dog. Source.
> 
> *2,500*  More than 2,500 times higher risk of killing than Labradors. Source.
> 
> *789%*  Over the past decade, there was an increase of 789% in the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks (attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%.). Source.
> 
> *66%  80%*   Over 2/3 (66%  80%) of the pit bulls who end up at the shelter are surrendered by their owners. Source.
> 
> *65%*  Pit bulls are responsible for 65 percent of all fatal dog attacks nationally. Source.
> 
> *58%*  Fifty eight percent of dogs euthanized at shelters are pit bull types.
> 
> *44%*  Forty four percent of Seeing Eye teams have reported being attacked by other dogs.  Source.
> 
> *25%*  A fourth of all dog bite claims were by due to pit bull bites. Source.
> 
> *14*  Every fourteen days, someone in the U.S. is killed by a pit bull.
> 
> *14*  Pitbuls are fourteen times more likely to escape their confines.  Source.
> 
> *11th*  Eleventh in popularity  *American Pit Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers, ranked 11th in popularity among 16 AKC-registered breeds and had by far the highest risk of killing  more than 2,500 times higher than Labs. Source.
> 
> *9*  Owners of dangerous breeds are more than 9 times more likely to have been convicted for a crime involving children and more than Source.
> 
> *8*  Eight times more likely to have been charged with drug crimes than owners of low-risked licensed dogs.  Source.
> 
> *6*  Six times more likely to kill their owners. Source.
> 
> *5.4*  Every 5.4. days, a body part is severed and lost in a pit bull attack . Source.
> 
> *3*  Owners of dangerous dogs are more than three times more likely to have been convicted of domestic abuse. Source.
> 
> *1/3* of all home insurance claims are dog bites (25% of them, pit bull bites). Source.
> 
> *3*  It is estimated that pit bull type dogs represent 3% of the total population of dogs in the U.S.A.. Source.
> 
> *1* -  The Leading biters in 25 states. Source.
> 
> *1*  The Leading biters, nationally. Source.
> 
> *1* -  Leading in deaths and serious disfigurements and maimings.  Source.
> 
> (U.S. statistics only)
> 
> So, is there any way a decent person would deny that Pitbulls ARE dangerous dogs? No, there isnt.
Click to expand...


First, fo fuck your self retard, and lap up your main stream media bullshit all you want. It only proves my point that indepemdent thought is dead. Thank you. So, is there any way a decent person can deny you aren't a dangerois person ?


----------



## earlycuyler

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> I work in the home-security industry and have found that most dogs will protect their owners but few are much at protecting the property.  Keep in mind I usually get there the morning after....sometimes to find a house trashed, sometimes finding blood splatter, sometimes finding the dog missing along with the guns and jewelry.  For the most part, a smart burglar can befriend most dogs by not showing any fear and having a pocket full of treats.  The dog is alone, bored, and actually welcomes a new companion....especially that gives him treats.  Again, the german breeds seem to be the most reliable at defending property when properly trained...ie being told to "watch the house, boy".  Our bane is the doggy-door....more burglars come in through those damn things than you'd ever imagine and we to this day do not have a reliable way to defend it.  Sliders are #2....I could teach you how to go through a locked patio door in under ten seconds....ask your security provider how to prevent it.



Fake security expert to. Soumd like Dougher sock to me.


----------



## Unkotare

earlycuyler said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I work in the home-security industry and have found that most dogs will protect their owners but few are much at protecting the property.  Keep in mind I usually get there the morning after....sometimes to find a house trashed, sometimes finding blood splatter, sometimes finding the dog missing along with the guns and jewelry.  For the most part, a smart burglar can befriend most dogs by not showing any fear and having a pocket full of treats.  The dog is alone, bored, and actually welcomes a new companion....especially that gives him treats.  Again, the german breeds seem to be the most reliable at defending property when properly trained...ie being told to "watch the house, boy".  Our bane is the doggy-door....more burglars come in through those damn things than you'd ever imagine and we to this day do not have a reliable way to defend it.  Sliders are #2....I could teach you how to go through a locked patio door in under ten seconds....ask your security provider how to prevent it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fake security expert to. Soumd like Dougher sock to me.
Click to expand...


A ratty, smelly sock at that.

You can't take anything that poseur says as true. About the only thing we know about him that's true is that he's scared of dogs.


----------



## BullKurtz

Incidentally....I have Unkotare (UnKotex) on iggy since he/she proved they are nothing more than a pissant e-stalking coward who was given an invite to call me names face to face and declined over and over again.  Any insults spewing out that smelly ass remain unknown to me.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> I work in the home-security industry and have found that most dogs will protect their owners but few are much at protecting the property.  Keep in mind I usually get there the morning after....sometimes to find a house trashed, sometimes finding blood splatter, sometimes finding the dog missing along with the guns and jewelry.  For the most part, a smart burglar can befriend most dogs by not showing any fear and having a pocket full of treats.  The dog is alone, bored, and actually welcomes a new companion....especially that gives him treats.  Again, the german breeds seem to be the most reliable at defending property when properly trained...ie being told to "watch the house, boy".  Our bane is the doggy-door....more burglars come in through those damn things than you'd ever imagine and we to this day do not have a reliable way to defend it.  Sliders are #2....I could teach you how to go through a locked patio door in under ten seconds....ask your security provider how to prevent it.



I'd have to agree with most of this. Dogs can be bribed even well trained dogs Hell I can bust through a patio sliding door in less than 5 seconds. it will be noisy as hell but a 4 pound hammer can do a lot of damage to glass


----------



## BullKurtz

bigrebnc1775 said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I work in the home-security industry and have found that most dogs will protect their owners but few are much at protecting the property.  Keep in mind I usually get there the morning after....sometimes to find a house trashed, sometimes finding blood splatter, sometimes finding the dog missing along with the guns and jewelry.  For the most part, a smart burglar can befriend most dogs by not showing any fear and having a pocket full of treats.  The dog is alone, bored, and actually welcomes a new companion....especially that gives him treats.  Again, the german breeds seem to be the most reliable at defending property when properly trained...ie being told to "watch the house, boy".  Our bane is the doggy-door....more burglars come in through those damn things than you'd ever imagine and we to this day do not have a reliable way to defend it.  Sliders are #2....I could teach you how to go through a locked patio door in under ten seconds....ask your security provider how to prevent it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd have to agree with most of this. Dogs can be bribed even well trained dogs Hell I can bust through a patio sliding door in less than 5 seconds. it will be noisy as hell but a 4 pound hammer can do a lot of damage to glass
Click to expand...


  My way involves much less damage (none) and is quiet.  I've had a few potential customers ask "how does the system keep YOU out".....believe it or not, I'm glad they ask instead of declining our services because they think I look a little sketchy despite the shirt and tie, picture ID, and mulitple FBI background checks required...gets it out in the open.  Buyer beware but don't be stupid....even the tech who installs your security system can't beat it.


----------



## Unkotare

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Incidentally....I have Unkotare (UnKotex) on iggy since he/she proved they are nothing more than a pissant e-stalking coward who was given an invite to call me names face to face and declined over and over again.  Any insults spewing out that smelly ass remain unknown to me.





Since this internet tough-guy wannabe does nothing but post lies and poor fiction, I reckon he probably has me on "ignore" in the Poet fashion of not actually ignoring. He's a ridiculous clown who seems to get off on posting his stupid little stories here.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I work in the home-security industry and have found that most dogs will protect their owners but few are much at protecting the property.  Keep in mind I usually get there the morning after....sometimes to find a house trashed, sometimes finding blood splatter, sometimes finding the dog missing along with the guns and jewelry.  For the most part, a smart burglar can befriend most dogs by not showing any fear and having a pocket full of treats.  The dog is alone, bored, and actually welcomes a new companion....especially that gives him treats.  Again, the german breeds seem to be the most reliable at defending property when properly trained...ie being told to "watch the house, boy".  Our bane is the doggy-door....more burglars come in through those damn things than you'd ever imagine and we to this day do not have a reliable way to defend it.  Sliders are #2....I could teach you how to go through a locked patio door in under ten seconds....ask your security provider how to prevent it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd have to agree with most of this. Dogs can be bribed even well trained dogs Hell I can bust through a patio sliding door in less than 5 seconds. it will be noisy as hell but a 4 pound hammer can do a lot of damage to glass
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> My way involves much less damage (none) and is quiet.  I've had a few potential customers ask "how does the system keep YOU out".....believe it or not, I'm glad they ask instead of declining our services because they think I look a little sketchy despite the shirt and tie, picture ID, and mulitple FBI background checks required...gets it out in the open.  Buyer beware but don't be stupid....even the tech who installs your security system can't beat it.
Click to expand...


If I'm going in someones home I am not going to care what damage is done. On second thought I may use some dutch tape or painter tape to make the braking glass a little more quite.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Unkotare said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally....I have Unkotare (UnKotex) on iggy since he/she proved they are nothing more than a pissant e-stalking coward who was given an invite to call me names face to face and declined over and over again.  Any insults spewing out that smelly ass remain unknown to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since this internet tough-guy wannabe does nothing but post lies and poor fiction, I reckon he probably has me on "ignore" in the Poet fashion of not actually ignoring. He's a ridiculous clown who seems to get off on posting his stupid little stories here.
Click to expand...


Whether he is or is not what he says that he is, for this one post in this thread what he said was some what correct.


----------



## BullKurtz

bigrebnc1775 said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd have to agree with most of this. Dogs can be bribed even well trained dogs Hell I can bust through a patio sliding door in less than 5 seconds. it will be noisy as hell but a 4 pound hammer can do a lot of damage to glass
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My way involves much less damage (none) and is quiet.  I've had a few potential customers ask "how does the system keep YOU out".....believe it or not, I'm glad they ask instead of declining our services because they think I look a little sketchy despite the shirt and tie, picture ID, and mulitple FBI background checks required...gets it out in the open.  Buyer beware but don't be stupid....even the tech who installs your security system can't beat it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If I'm going in someones home I am not going to care what damage is done. On second thought I may use some dutch tape or painter tape to make the braking glass a little more quite.
Click to expand...


Burglars who don't get caught leave little to chance.....they watch and learn behavior patterns, they know how an alarm system works and if there is power and land-line telephone service.  They can tell by the pet food bowls out on the patio what type of beast lives within.  If there's a cat, the motion-detector will be disabled.  If there's a dog they'll do a meet and greet over the fence to take it's temperature (apt to defend or not).  They'll leave the house undisturbed....in fact the better ones leave it so undisturbed, the owners may not know they've been robbed for hours, even days.  They may operate in the open with a phony  company name on a panel truck.  They may have scored local utility uniforms from a pal at a dry cleaning business.....and once inside they will usually walk the floors with a pistol in their hand...so keep that in mind if you're prone to go John Wayne over unexpected guests.

p.s.  I'm not "somewhat right"....I am exactly right....I been in this game a long time.


----------



## Bfgrn

earlycuyler said:


> Bfgrn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are fine dogs. You just have to know how to be around them. It is a fact, that many out there now Close to all of them have suffred some form of abuse from haveing to fight, to just plane old neglect. Even most of thees dogs come back to be fine family dogs. Some, are just psycho crazy dogs that need.to be put to sleep for their own good. In reality, pits are no more dangerous then any other dog. What I find shocking, is that so many will get sucked into such deep fear by a media that on any other topic would be considred biased and dishonest. Kind of shows how much of our critical this king has been hamded over to the powers that be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know shit. Ignorant people like you need to educate yourself before you open your pie hole. When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.
> 
> By 1993 pit bulls kept as pets, exclusive of dogs trained to fight, already accounted for more than half of all life-threatening dog attacks. Rottweilers accounted for 20%. Over the past decade the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks was up 789%; attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%. The percentage of total life-threatening dog attacks committed by pit bulls did not go up only because the number of life-threatening Rottweiler attacks leaped 2000%; attacks on children were up 1000%; attacks on adults were up 1700%; fatalies were up 2500%; and maimings were up 2500%. Rottweilers now account for 25% of all life-threateningdog attacks.
> 
> No other common breeds present an even remotely comparable actuarial risk factor. Yet among all the major U.S. animal advocacy groups, only PETA has favored a breed-specific approach to dog regulation.
> 
> The list for why pitbulls are dangerous, in numbers:
> 
> *$92.7 million* &#8211; Dog bite claims totaled $92.7 million for 2,400 claims in California (Insurance Information Institute, 2011). Source.
> $500,000 &#8211; The typical cost of settlements in attacks  by pit bulls and Rottweilers causing death or serious injury is an average of a half million dollars. The amount of $29,396 was the average cost of a dog bite case in 2011. Source.
> 
> *3000 %* -  Pit bulls and Rottweilers do three times more killing and maiming than all other dogs combined, meaning that their actuarial risk is approximately 3000% higher than that of the average dog. Source.
> 
> *2,500* &#8211; More than 2,500 times higher risk of killing than Labradors. Source.
> 
> *789%* &#8211; Over the past decade, there was an increase of 789% in the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks (attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%.). Source.
> 
> *66% &#8211; 80%*  &#8211; Over 2/3 (66% &#8211; 80%) of the pit bulls who end up at the shelter are surrendered by their owners. Source.
> 
> *65%* &#8211; Pit bulls are responsible for 65 percent of all fatal dog attacks nationally. Source.
> 
> *58%* &#8211; Fifty eight percent of dogs euthanized at shelters are pit bull types.
> 
> *44%* &#8211; Forty four percent of Seeing Eye teams have reported being attacked by other dogs.  Source.
> 
> *25%* &#8211; A fourth of all dog bite claims were by due to pit bull bites. Source.
> 
> *14* &#8211; Every fourteen days, someone in the U.S. is killed by a pit bull.
> 
> *14* &#8211; Pitbuls are fourteen times more likely to escape their confines.  Source.
> 
> *11th* &#8211; Eleventh in popularity &#8211; *American Pit Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers, ranked 11th in popularity among 16 AKC-registered breeds and had by far the highest risk of killing &#8212; more than 2,500 times higher than Labs. Source.
> 
> *9* &#8211; Owners of dangerous breeds are more than 9 times more likely to have been convicted for a crime involving children and more than Source.
> 
> *8* &#8211; Eight times more likely to have been charged with drug crimes than owners of low-risked licensed dogs.  Source.
> 
> *6* &#8211; Six times more likely to kill their owners. Source.
> 
> *5.4* &#8211; Every 5.4. days, a body part is severed and lost in a pit bull attack . Source.
> 
> *3* &#8211; Owners of dangerous dogs are more than three times more likely to have been convicted of domestic abuse. Source.
> 
> *1/3* of all home insurance claims are dog bites (25% of them, pit bull bites). Source.
> 
> *3* &#8211; It is estimated that pit bull type dogs represent 3% of the total population of dogs in the U.S.A.. Source.
> 
> *1* -  The Leading biters in 25 states. Source.
> 
> *1* &#8211; The Leading biters, nationally. Source.
> 
> *1* -  Leading in deaths and serious disfigurements and maimings.  Source.
> 
> (U.S. statistics only)
> 
> So, is there any way a decent person would deny that Pitbulls ARE dangerous dogs? No, there isn&#8217;t.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> First, fo fuck your self retard, and lap up your main stream media bullshit all you want. It only proves my point that indepemdent thought is dead. Thank you. So, is there any way a decent person can deny you aren't a dangerois person ?
Click to expand...


Listen you little pea brain. I grew up always having at least one dog and have owned dogs for over 60 years. I was personally attacked by my own pit bull in my living room. What did I do to trigger the attack? My wife dusted the cabinet in the dining room and left Buddy's leash on the carpet. When I went to pick it up, Buddy rushed over and started to growl. I gave him a sit command, he sat. I put up a 'halt' sign and told Buddy it was ok. When I walked away he charged me, leaping through the air he latched on to my left arm. I swung him off of me, and he charged and got my right arm. Blood was spurting out of my arm. Then he latched on to my hand. I yelled for help. My son tried to get Buddy off me. He couldn't stop him. Then Buddy ripped into my right leg (I had shorts on) When he was through my femur was exposed. I finally grabbed him around the neck and fell on top of him and held on for dear life. My son was then able to grab Buddy and I got away, my wife called 911.

There is no doubt in mind that if I had been home alone my family would have found a corpse. 

So don't go spouting off on things you know nothing about. The number don't lie you ignorant asshole. Did I suddenly become a 'bad' dog owner? Or maybe I just wanted the femur in my right leg exposed, and blood gushing from my leg and both arms?

Maybe you can ask Darla Napora who is a huge pit bull advocate...oh that's right, you can't...



 When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.


Pregnant woman mauled to death by family pit bull was in campaign group arguing that the animals are safe


Victim was member of 'Dog Lovers Responsible About Pit Bulls'
 

Husband: 'She will be buried with killer dog'
 

Two-year-old pitbull terrier shot after charging at police
 

Husband finds Darla Napora's body drenched in blood
 

Victim suffered dozens of bites to her body and face






A pregnant woman who was mauled to death by one of her pet pit bull terriers belonged to group campaigning to convince people that the animals aren't dangerous, it has emerged.

Darla Napora, 32, was bitten dozens of times and found by her husband Greg covered in blood outstretched on their living room floor in Pacifica, California.

Police say the two-year-old unneutered pit bull believed to be responsible was hovering around the woman, who had major injuries to her upper body and face.

It has since emerged Napora was a member of Bay Area Dog Lovers Responsible About Pit Bulls, a group that does its best to convince people that pit bulls aren't really that dangerous.

'When they arrived, they found the victim laying in her own front living room; she was not breathing, unresponsive and had major trauma to her upper body,' said Pacifica Police Captain Dave Bretini.

'The husband stated that when he got home, at about noon, he found his wife with their pit bull hovering over her.'


Police shot the pit bull terrier, similar to the one pictured, dead as it tried to escape from the Napora's back garden

Police shot the blood covered animal dead as it tried to escape from the back garden whilst officers conducted their investigation.

'The last thing we wanted to happen was for the dog to get out and start attacking bystanders or be loose in the neighbourhood,' Bertini said.

Read more: Darla Napora: Pregnant woman dies after being mauled by pet dog in living room | Mail Online


----------



## ekrem

There are countries which have banned the posession, import and even advertisement for Pitbulls.


----------



## tinydancer

When I decided on my new breed apres Ridgeback I went and died and loved every minute watching what this breed could do.

A Louisiana Catahoula Leopard dog.

I adored every minute of this wildness. I love this crazy. But iI also knew that Jimdandy had to rock daily with me and interact with kids 0 to 80

Its called being responsible.


----------



## tinydancer

Bfgrn said:


> earlycuyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bfgrn said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know shit. Ignorant people like you need to educate yourself before you open your pie hole. When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.
> 
> By 1993 pit bulls kept as pets, exclusive of dogs trained to fight, already accounted for more than half of all life-threatening dog attacks. Rottweilers accounted for 20%. Over the past decade the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks was up 789%; attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%. The percentage of total life-threatening dog attacks committed by pit bulls did not go up only because the number of life-threatening Rottweiler attacks leaped 2000%; attacks on children were up 1000%; attacks on adults were up 1700%; fatalies were up 2500%; and maimings were up 2500%. Rottweilers now account for 25% of all life-threateningdog attacks.
> 
> No other common breeds present an even remotely comparable actuarial risk factor. Yet among all the major U.S. animal advocacy groups, only PETA has favored a breed-specific approach to dog regulation.
> 
> The list for why pitbulls are dangerous, in numbers:
> 
> *$92.7 million* &#8211; Dog bite claims totaled $92.7 million for 2,400 claims in California (Insurance Information Institute, 2011). Source.
> $500,000 &#8211; The typical cost of settlements in attacks  by pit bulls and Rottweilers causing death or serious injury is an average of a half million dollars. The amount of $29,396 was the average cost of a dog bite case in 2011. Source.
> 
> *3000 %* -  Pit bulls and Rottweilers do three times more killing and maiming than all other dogs combined, meaning that their actuarial risk is approximately 3000% higher than that of the average dog. Source.
> 
> *2,500* &#8211; More than 2,500 times higher risk of killing than Labradors. Source.
> 
> *789%* &#8211; Over the past decade, there was an increase of 789% in the number of life-threatening pit bull attacks (attacks on children were up 876%; attacks on adults were up 490%; fatalities were up 388%; and maimings were up 1269%.). Source.
> 
> *66% &#8211; 80%*  &#8211; Over 2/3 (66% &#8211; 80%) of the pit bulls who end up at the shelter are surrendered by their owners. Source.
> 
> *65%* &#8211; Pit bulls are responsible for 65 percent of all fatal dog attacks nationally. Source.
> 
> *58%* &#8211; Fifty eight percent of dogs euthanized at shelters are pit bull types.
> 
> *44%* &#8211; Forty four percent of Seeing Eye teams have reported being attacked by other dogs.  Source.
> 
> *25%* &#8211; A fourth of all dog bite claims were by due to pit bull bites. Source.
> 
> *14* &#8211; Every fourteen days, someone in the U.S. is killed by a pit bull.
> 
> *14* &#8211; Pitbuls are fourteen times more likely to escape their confines.  Source.
> 
> *11th* &#8211; Eleventh in popularity &#8211; *American Pit Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers, ranked 11th in popularity among 16 AKC-registered breeds and had by far the highest risk of killing &#8212; more than 2,500 times higher than Labs. Source.
> 
> *9* &#8211; Owners of dangerous breeds are more than 9 times more likely to have been convicted for a crime involving children and more than Source.
> 
> *8* &#8211; Eight times more likely to have been charged with drug crimes than owners of low-risked licensed dogs.  Source.
> 
> *6* &#8211; Six times more likely to kill their owners. Source.
> 
> *5.4* &#8211; Every 5.4. days, a body part is severed and lost in a pit bull attack . Source.
> 
> *3* &#8211; Owners of dangerous dogs are more than three times more likely to have been convicted of domestic abuse. Source.
> 
> *1/3* of all home insurance claims are dog bites (25% of them, pit bull bites). Source.
> 
> *3* &#8211; It is estimated that pit bull type dogs represent 3% of the total population of dogs in the U.S.A.. Source.
> 
> *1* -  The Leading biters in 25 states. Source.
> 
> *1* &#8211; The Leading biters, nationally. Source.
> 
> *1* -  Leading in deaths and serious disfigurements and maimings.  Source.
> 
> (U.S. statistics only)
> 
> So, is there any way a decent person would deny that Pitbulls ARE dangerous dogs? No, there isn&#8217;t.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> /QUOTE]
> 
> Listen you little pea brain. I grew up always having at least one dog and have owned dogs for over 60 years. I was personally attacked by my own pit bull in my living room. What did I do to trigger the attack? My wife dusted the cabinet in the dining room and left Buddy's leash on the carpet. When I went to pick it up, Buddy rushed over and started to growl. I gave him a sit command, he sat. I put up a 'halt' sign and told Buddy it was ok. When I walked away he charged me, leaping through the air he latched on to my left arm. I swung him off of me, and he charged and got my right arm. Blood was spurting out of my arm. Then he latched on to my hand. I yelled for help. My son tried to get Buddy off me. He couldn't stop him. Then Buddy ripped into my right leg (I had shorts on) When he was through my femur was exposed. I finally grabbed him around the neck and fell on top of him and held on for dear life. My son was then able to grab Buddy and I got away, my wife called 911.
> 
> There is no doubt in mind that if I had been home alone my family would have found a corpse.
> 
> So don't go spouting off on things you know nothing about. The number don't lie you ignorant asshole. Did I suddenly become a 'bad' dog owner? Or maybe I just wanted the femur in my right leg exposed, and blood gushing from my leg and both arms?
> 
> Maybe you can ask Darla Napora who is a huge pit bull advocate...oh that's right, you can't...
> 
> 
> 
> When any other dog has a bad day, somebody can get hurt; when a pit bull has a bad day, somebody can get killed or maimed. Pit bulls don't 'bite', they attack.
> 
> 
> Pregnant woman mauled to death by family pit bull was in campaign group arguing that the animals are safe
> 
> 
> Victim was member of 'Dog Lovers Responsible About Pit Bulls'
> 
> 
> Husband: 'She will be buried with killer dog'
> 
> 
> Two-year-old pitbull terrier shot after charging at police
> 
> 
> Husband finds Darla Napora's body drenched in blood
> 
> 
> Victim suffered dozens of bites to her body and face
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A pregnant woman who was mauled to death by one of her pet pit bull terriers belonged to group campaigning to convince people that the animals aren't dangerous, it has emerged.
> 
> Darla Napora, 32, was bitten dozens of times and found by her husband Greg covered in blood outstretched on their living room floor in Pacifica, California.
> 
> Police say the two-year-old unneutered pit bull believed to be responsible was hovering around the woman, who had major injuries to her upper body and face.
> 
> It has since emerged Napora was a member of Bay Area Dog Lovers Responsible About Pit Bulls, a group that does its best to convince people that pit bulls aren't really that dangerous.
> 
> 'When they arrived, they found the victim laying in her own front living room; she was not breathing, unresponsive and had major trauma to her upper body,' said Pacifica Police Captain Dave Bretini.
> 
> 'The husband stated that when he got home, at about noon, he found his wife with their pit bull hovering over her.'
> 
> 
> Police shot the pit bull terrier, similar to the one pictured, dead as it tried to escape from the Napora's back garden
> 
> Police shot the blood covered animal dead as it tried to escape from the back garden whilst officers conducted their investigation.
> 
> 'The last thing we wanted to happen was for the dog to get out and start attacking bystanders or be loose in the neighbourhood,' Bertini said.
> 
> Read more: Darla Napora: Pregnant woman dies after being mauled by pet dog in living room | Mail Online
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whoa not agian.
Click to expand...


----------



## tinydancer

Not meNow to the douche bags comments..............

Its not the pit in the pit bull it is the terrier


----------



## tinydancer

what do we do here?

I'm tired of this bullshit.


----------



## ekrem

Man charged with having 'sexual contact' with a pit bull terrier during tour of Chicago city pound
Mail Online


----------



## tinydancer

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> My way involves much less damage (none) and is quiet.  I've had a few potential customers ask "how does the system keep YOU out".....believe it or not, I'm glad they ask instead of declining our services because they think I look a little sketchy despite the shirt and tie, picture ID, and mulitple FBI background checks required...gets it out in the open.  Buyer beware but don't be stupid....even the tech who installs your security system can't beat it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I'm going in someones home I am not going to care what damage is done. On second thought I may use some dutch tape or painter tape to make the braking glass a little more quite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Burglars who don't get caught leave little to chance.....they watch and learn behavior patterns, they know how an alarm system works and if there is power and land-line telephone service.  They can tell by the pet food bowls out on the patio what type of beast lives within.  If there's a cat, the motion-detector will be disabled.  If there's a dog they'll do a meet and greet over the fence to take it's temperature (apt to defend or not).  They'll leave the house undisturbed....in fact the better ones leave it so undisturbed, the owners may not know they've been robbed for hours, even days.  They may operate in the open with a phony  company name on a panel truck.  They may have scored local utility uniforms from a pal at a dry cleaning business.....and once inside they will usually walk the floors with a pistol in their hand...so keep that in mind if you're prone to go John Wayne over unexpected guests.
> 
> p.s.  I'm not "somewhat right"....I am exactly right....I been in this game a long time.
Click to expand...


Now I have you. Was waiting till you surfaced.

You are going to have such a different tomorrow.


----------



## tinydancer

ekrem said:


> Man charged with having 'sexual contact' with a pit bull terrier during tour of Chicago city pound
> Mail Online



How can I put it nicely. You try to fuck a pit bull up the ass in Chicago, something big and large aint leaving with you



Aye carumba!


----------



## Bfgrn

tinydancer said:


> what do we do here?
> 
> I'm tired of this bullshit.



Then leave. It is not all about you...


----------



## bigrebnc1775

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Strange thing just happen. A guy knocked on my door had the biggest pitbull I have ever seen sweet guy had a few scratches around the nose. Anyway this strange er asked me if it was my dog. I told him no while we we're talking my cat comes to the front door my cat freaks the hell out the dog moved closer to the front door. (luckily I have a solid tempered treated glass door) anyway he starts braking it was everything I could do to pull him back. I gave him a command to stop, he sat down and looked at me and was ok after that.



I have a confession to make, I feel bad about it and then I don't
While I was out working in my garage the dog came back laid down beside my work space. My cat inside freaking out growling like a dog. Anyway I ended up calling animal control. I asked her what will happen to the dog, she said it will be allotted three working days, but the state does allowed good healthy dogs to remain in their control for two weeks. She said dogs like this do not have a problem finding a home.
She also said their were a lot of dogs being abandon sick or healthy it didn't matter she had not seen this many ever.

I may give it a week and see if the dog is still there and adopt it my damn self.


----------



## Sallow

bigrebnc1775 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Strange thing just happen. A guy knocked on my door had the biggest pitbull I have ever seen sweet guy had a few scratches around the nose. Anyway this strange er asked me if it was my dog. I told him no while we we're talking my cat comes to the front door my cat freaks the hell out the dog moved closer to the front door. (luckily I have a solid tempered treated glass door) anyway he starts braking it was everything I could do to pull him back. I gave him a command to stop, he sat down and looked at me and was ok after that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a confession to make, I feel bad about it and then I don't
> While I was out working in my garage the dog came back laid down beside my work space. My cat inside freaking out growling like a dog. Anyway I ended up calling animal control. I asked her what will happen to the dog, she said it will be allotted three working days, but the state does allowed good healthy dogs to remain in their control for two weeks. She said dogs like this do not have a problem finding a home.
> She also said their were a lot of dogs being abandon sick or healthy it didn't matter she had not seen this many ever.
> 
> I may give it a week and see if the dog is still there and adopt it my damn self.
Click to expand...


Why wait.

Seems like a good match.

Go get your doggie.


----------



## bigrebnc1775

Sallow said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Strange thing just happen. A guy knocked on my door had the biggest pitbull I have ever seen sweet guy had a few scratches around the nose. Anyway this strange er asked me if it was my dog. I told him no while we we're talking my cat comes to the front door my cat freaks the hell out the dog moved closer to the front door. (luckily I have a solid tempered treated glass door) anyway he starts braking it was everything I could do to pull him back. I gave him a command to stop, he sat down and looked at me and was ok after that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a confession to make, I feel bad about it and then I don't
> While I was out working in my garage the dog came back laid down beside my work space. My cat inside freaking out growling like a dog. Anyway I ended up calling animal control. I asked her what will happen to the dog, she said it will be allotted three working days, but the state does allowed good healthy dogs to remain in their control for two weeks. She said dogs like this do not have a problem finding a home.
> She also said their were a lot of dogs being abandon sick or healthy it didn't matter she had not seen this many ever.
> 
> I may give it a week and see if the dog is still there and adopt it my damn self.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why wait.
> 
> Seems like a good match.
> 
> Go get your doggie.
Click to expand...


I have a cat that doesn't like this dog,.


----------



## BullKurtz

tinydancer said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I'm going in someones home I am not going to care what damage is done. On second thought I may use some dutch tape or painter tape to make the braking glass a little more quite.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Burglars who don't get caught leave little to chance.....they watch and learn behavior patterns, they know how an alarm system works and if there is power and land-line telephone service.  They can tell by the pet food bowls out on the patio what type of beast lives within.  If there's a cat, the motion-detector will be disabled.  If there's a dog they'll do a meet and greet over the fence to take it's temperature (apt to defend or not).  They'll leave the house undisturbed....in fact the better ones leave it so undisturbed, the owners may not know they've been robbed for hours, even days.  They may operate in the open with a phony  company name on a panel truck.  They may have scored local utility uniforms from a pal at a dry cleaning business.....and once inside they will usually walk the floors with a pistol in their hand...so keep that in mind if you're prone to go John Wayne over unexpected guests.
> 
> p.s.  I'm not "somewhat right"....I am exactly right....I been in this game a long time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now I have you. Was waiting till you surfaced.
> 
> You are going to have such a different tomorrow.
Click to expand...


Huh?


----------



## Unkotare

mal said:


> "Still, pit bulls, although they have legions of admirers, have killed and maimed countless times before. The most recent pit bull death occurred last week in Kernersville, N.C., when 25-year-old Katherine Atkins was set upon by her two dogs while she was attempting to feed them. She had owned the dogs since they were puppies, Kernersville police said.
> 
> And last month, 5-year-old Jason Ryan, of Baker City, Ore., was set upon by a neighbor's pit bull. He died in the ambulance. In September, two toddlers were mauled to death by pit bulls, one in Colton, Calif., the other in Gilbert, Ariz."
> 
> ^That's what's troubling to me... And it's not just Pitbulls that I don't Trust around my kids, I don't Trust any Dogs around my Kids.
> 
> I have Personally known (2) Girls who have been Permanently Scared in the Face by Family Dogs and one of my Wife's Teammates a few years back had their German Shepherd attack their Baby...
> 
> Sick thing in that Case, the Police allowed the Dog to stay and the "Man" of the House won out of the Wife about the Dog staying... The dog remains in the Home.
> 
> I just don't Trust Animals... I understand the Appeal, but the Attacks I have seen in my Life leave me with little want or need to Expose Defenseless Children to them.
> 
> Hell, look what these Dogs have done to their Adult Owners?
> 
> To each their own, I just don't Trust Animals....




Do you trust humans? They are a hell of a lot more dangerous than any animal.


----------



## Coyote

I trust animals...it's the people attached to them I'm not so sure of....


----------



## bayoubill

I've just now dropped into this thread...

no matter the breed, dogs 'n gonna be dogs...

and stupid owners of large powerful dogs are gonna be stupid... occasionally with bad consequences...


eta: stupid owners of small yappy nippy nose-biting dogs can also easily find themselves in trouble with lawsuits...


----------



## Politico

strollingbones said:


> no parent should put a child at risk...leaving kids alone with any sized dog is a risk..but with a large dog...that can do damage in seconds its just foolish...



I was left with a St Bernard on a regular basis who sat guard in front of me like a statue. It fully intended to do damage to anyone who came near me. That was the whole point.


----------



## mal

Unkotare said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Still, pit bulls, although they have legions of admirers, have killed and maimed countless times before. The most recent pit bull death occurred last week in Kernersville, N.C., when 25-year-old Katherine Atkins was set upon by her two dogs while she was attempting to feed them. She had owned the dogs since they were puppies, Kernersville police said.
> 
> And last month, 5-year-old Jason Ryan, of Baker City, Ore., was set upon by a neighbor's pit bull. He died in the ambulance. In September, two toddlers were mauled to death by pit bulls, one in Colton, Calif., the other in Gilbert, Ariz."
> 
> ^That's what's troubling to me... And it's not just Pitbulls that I don't Trust around my kids, I don't Trust any Dogs around my Kids.
> 
> I have Personally known (2) Girls who have been Permanently Scared in the Face by Family Dogs and one of my Wife's Teammates a few years back had their German Shepherd attack their Baby...
> 
> Sick thing in that Case, the Police allowed the Dog to stay and the "Man" of the House won out of the Wife about the Dog staying... The dog remains in the Home.
> 
> I just don't Trust Animals... I understand the Appeal, but the Attacks I have seen in my Life leave me with little want or need to Expose Defenseless Children to them.
> 
> Hell, look what these Dogs have done to their Adult Owners?
> 
> To each their own, I just don't Trust Animals....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you trust humans? They are a hell of a lot more dangerous than any animal.
Click to expand...


You got link to the last Human Mauling a Child or a Baby?...



peace...


----------



## mal

bayoubill said:


> I've just now dropped into this thread...
> 
> no matter the breed, dogs 'n gonna be dogs...
> 
> and stupid owners of large powerful dogs are gonna be stupid... occasionally with bad consequences...
> 
> 
> eta: stupid owners of small yappy nippy nose-biting dogs can also easily find themselves in trouble with lawsuits...



My Asshole Neighbors to the South of me have those Yappy Dogs... They leave them out all Fucking Day Long and those Dogs NEVER Stop Yapping...

I Hate those People... A LOT. 



peace...


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> I trust animals...it's the people attached to them I'm not so sure of....


 
Well, you can trust animals to act like animals...

Don't trust them to act like humans, though. They're not.


----------



## koshergrl

bigrebnc1775 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Strange thing just happen. A guy knocked on my door had the biggest pitbull I have ever seen sweet guy had a few scratches around the nose. Anyway this strange er asked me if it was my dog. I told him no while we we're talking my cat comes to the front door my cat freaks the hell out the dog moved closer to the front door. (luckily I have a solid tempered treated glass door) anyway he starts braking it was everything I could do to pull him back. I gave him a command to stop, he sat down and looked at me and was ok after that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a confession to make, I feel bad about it and then I don't
> While I was out working in my garage the dog came back laid down beside my work space. My cat inside freaking out growling like a dog. Anyway I ended up calling animal control. I asked her what will happen to the dog, she said it will be allotted three working days, but the state does allowed good healthy dogs to remain in their control for two weeks. She said dogs like this do not have a problem finding a home.
> She also said their were a lot of dogs being abandon sick or healthy it didn't matter she had not seen this many ever.
> 
> I may give it a week and see if the dog is still there and adopt it my damn self.
Click to expand...

 

Lol....just be aware, adopted dogs may have issues you don't know about.

Most dogs are going to act accordingly to their handler at the time..but some dogs are innately aggressive/predatory...as I'm sure you know.


----------



## BullKurtz

Used dog is same as a used car....caveat emptor.


----------



## koshergrl

I support the right of people to own whatever dog they own, provided they can care for them and maintain the safety of everybody...

At the same time, when these two terriers are gone, I'm done forever with terriers. They completely wear me out. I'm too languid to really get into terriers.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

A Dog?s Devotion: Pit Bull Puppy Is His Blind Brother?s Seeing Eye Dog | The Wet Nose Press



> One blind little dog already has his seeing-eye pal for life &#8212; his brother. Eight month old Pit Bull-Lab puppies, Jeffrey and Jermaine, were rescued on October 5th by Operation Ava in Philadelphia, and their special bond is touching everyone they meet.










> &#8220;Jeffrey really does try to maintain contact with Jermaine, especially when he&#8217;s in an unfamiliar environment,&#8221; Little told NBC. &#8221;As soon as he gets familiar with a new place, then he becomes a little bit more independent. But it&#8217;s amazing how they try to maintain contact with each other.&#8221;



They even hold on to each other in their sleep. 






The link says they're still waiting for their forever home.


----------



## koshergrl

Awwww...both Mylo and Snoop like to sleep very, very, VERY close to whomever they're sleeping with.

My uncle said that his terrier in Korea saved his life many times, sleeping with him and alerting him to danger.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

koshergrl said:


> Awwww...both Mylo and Snoop like to sleep very, very, VERY close to whomever they're sleeping with.
> 
> My uncle said that his terrier in Korea saved his life many times, sleeping with him and alerting him to danger.



The puppies are brothers and the sighted one is his brother's seeing eye dog.


----------



## Kooshdakhaa

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
Click to expand...


Don't have ANY dog if you only have an hour a day to spend with him.

My two Dobermans are with me all the time when I'm home.  They sleep in my bed.  I sleep like a baby because I know they're looking after me.  They're not a threat to me, but they're definitely a threat to anyone who would try to hurt me.

Oh, and I've never had to lift them over my head or pin them down or any other such shit to show them who's alpha.  I simply AM the alpha around here and that is obvious to them by the way I carry myself.  I don't have to manhandle them to get that point across.  I give them lots of affection.  We have a very strong bond.

And as for being around children, I trust my Dobermans around children much more than I trust my miniature pinscher and my miniature pinscher mix.  The odds are pretty high that one of those little shits will bite a kid. The Dobermans, not so much.  Nonetheless, I am very protective of the dobes when kids are around.  Don't want some creepy little brat getting one of my dogs in trouble.


----------



## BullKurtz

Kooshdakhaa said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't have ANY dog if you only have an hour a day to spend with him.
> 
> My two Dobermans are with me all the time when I'm home.  They sleep in my bed.  I sleep like a baby because I know they're looking after me.  They're not a threat to me, but they're definitely a threat to anyone who would try to hurt me.
> 
> Oh, and I've never had to lift them over my head or pin them down or any other such shit to show them who's alpha.  I simply AM the alpha around here and that is obvious to them by the way I carry myself.  I don't have to manhandle them to get that point across.  I give them lots of affection.  We have a very strong bond.
> 
> And as for being around children, I trust my Dobermans around children much more than I trust my miniature pinscher and my miniature pinscher mix.  The odds are pretty high that one of those little shits will bite a kid. The Dobermans, not so much.  Nonetheless, I am very protective of the dobes when kids are around.  Don't want some creepy little brat getting one of my dogs in trouble.
Click to expand...


What I meant about an hour a day is an hour devoted solely to the dog....a walk, a game of fetch, teaching a new command, or in my world, a reminder who's the dog and who's the bear (Bull).  Your dogs being with you isn't enough if you're doing other things.....a large dog aggressively bred must be interacted with to notice if something is bothering it.  

In Colorado my male Shepherd started acting cranky....when we took our hour I discovered he had a couple dozen ticks on him from an adventure up around Gold Hill.  The ticks were making his life miserable and a miserable 100 pound German Shepherd can accomplish the unexpected in a blur.  The female had the beginnings of hip problems at one point and her disposition turned nasty from it.   The vet solved both issues because I discovered them before they escalated.  And BTW, lay down with dogs, get up with fleas.  No dog has ever slept in my bed and no dog ever will.


----------



## koshergrl

Lift them over your head?

Lol..that's a new one, I've never heard that before hahaha.

PS..you're making a mistake to "protect" your dogs from children. You should make it quite clear to your dogs that the children are alpha, and they are subject to them. Dogs thinking they have dominance over children is what leads them to hurt them...and if your dogs see you "protecting" them from kids, they are going to internalize that.

My dogs are NEVER allowed to look askance at kids. It doesn't matter what the kids do to them. 

Now I also tell the kids not to do certain things, but the dogs have to know the kids are higher up on the chain. Dogs will kill over food and sex, and kids can easily get caught in the middle of that if you haven't made it very clear to your dogs that the kids are boss. 

I support the commands the kids give, spoken or implied, and the dogs get in a lot of trouble for crowding, jumping on, stealing food from the kids.


----------



## koshergrl

My terrier sleeps in my bed. I'm not crazy about it, but it's the best place for her, it keeps her out of trouble and it makes her happy. She's the only dog I've ever slept with regularly.


----------



## boedicca

Pitbbulls are to gang bangers what French Bulldogs are to Urban Hipster Yuppies.


----------



## BullKurtz

Luddly Neddite said:


> A Dog?s Devotion: Pit Bull Puppy Is His Blind Brother?s Seeing Eye Dog | The Wet Nose Press
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One blind little dog already has his seeing-eye pal for life  his brother. Eight month old Pit Bull-Lab puppies, Jeffrey and Jermaine, were rescued on October 5th by Operation Ava in Philadelphia, and their special bond is touching everyone they meet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jeffrey really does try to maintain contact with Jermaine, especially when hes in an unfamiliar environment, Little told NBC. As soon as he gets familiar with a new place, then he becomes a little bit more independent. But its amazing how they try to maintain contact with each other.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They even hold on to each other in their sleep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The link says they're still waiting for their forever home.
Click to expand...


Or they may have already killed each other.  

What choice do they have on a bed that small?


----------



## BullKurtz

koshergrl said:


> Lift them over your head?
> 
> Lol..that's a new one, I've never heard that before hahaha.



I was a LRRP in Vietnam....you can google what that means.  We on occasion took highly trained German Shepherds on certain types of insertions, to accomplish various tasks.  For instance, those dogs could cover a 30 meter area of open ground before a sentry could see them coming, much less react.  In a matter of seconds, that sentry was KIA.  The guys who trained these dogs had methods I won't disclose here; one of them being to lift a dog showing the smallest sign of rebellion over their head.  K-9 got the message with their paws dangling in the air...."I am stronger and smarter than you....I am your master".


----------



## koshergrl

Sadly, most average women are unable to do that with the larger dogs. I know I'm certainly incapable of lifting Klaus over my head...he's 130 lbs. And I doubt I have the strength in my arms and shoulders to lift snoop, either.

I could lift Mylo who is probably the one who would benefit the most from it...but I suspect she would just jump out of my hands. She can bounce as high as my face from a standing position at my feet.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Kooshdakhaa said:


> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pit Bulls are the "Breed du Jour" to beat up on.
> 
> I know plenty of pit bull owners that never had trouble with their dogs.
> 
> Generally if you dig a bit into the stories? You find that the dog was abused at some point. Not necessarily by the present owner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't have ANY dog if you only have an hour a day to spend with him.
> 
> My two Dobermans are with me all the time when I'm home.  They sleep in my bed.  I sleep like a baby because I know they're looking after me.  They're not a threat to me, but they're definitely a threat to anyone who would try to hurt me.
> 
> Oh, and I've never had to lift them over my head or pin them down or any other such shit to show them who's alpha.  I simply AM the alpha around here and that is obvious to them by the way I carry myself.  I don't have to manhandle them to get that point across.  I give them lots of affection.  We have a very strong bond.
> 
> And as for being around children, I trust my Dobermans around children much more than I trust my miniature pinscher and my miniature pinscher mix.  The odds are pretty high that one of those little shits will bite a kid. The Dobermans, not so much.  Nonetheless, I am very protective of the dobes when kids are around.  Don't want some creepy little brat getting one of my dogs in trouble.
Click to expand...


Agree. When we domesticated dogs, we became their pack. We're alpha to them. If you need to put a dog in his place, lifting them over your head is just silly macho posturing. Maybe he needs a bigger gun. 



> And BTW, lay down with dogs, get up with fleas.



Why don't you do something to get rid of the fleas?

Its not that hard. 

Do a search of a previous thread here. I posted extensively on a cheap and easy method that wiped fleas out of our two homes.


----------



## Luddly Neddite

Fleas thread for "bull".

http://www.usmessageboard.com/pets/301700-my-dogs-have-fleas.html


----------



## BullKurtz

Luddly Neddite said:


> Kooshdakhaa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have ANY dog if you only have an hour a day to spend with him.
> 
> My two Dobermans are with me all the time when I'm home.  They sleep in my bed.  I sleep like a baby because I know they're looking after me.  They're not a threat to me, but they're definitely a threat to anyone who would try to hurt me.
> 
> Oh, and I've never had to lift them over my head or pin them down or any other such shit to show them who's alpha.  I simply AM the alpha around here and that is obvious to them by the way I carry myself.  I don't have to manhandle them to get that point across.  I give them lots of affection.  We have a very strong bond.
> 
> And as for being around children, I trust my Dobermans around children much more than I trust my miniature pinscher and my miniature pinscher mix.  The odds are pretty high that one of those little shits will bite a kid. The Dobermans, not so much.  Nonetheless, I am very protective of the dobes when kids are around.  Don't want some creepy little brat getting one of my dogs in trouble.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Agree. When we domesticated dogs, we became their pack. We're alpha to them. If you need to put a dog in his place, lifting them over your head is just silly macho posturing. Maybe he needs a bigger gun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And BTW, lay down with dogs, get up with fleas.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why don't you do something to get rid of the fleas?
> 
> Its not that hard.
> 
> Do a search of a previous thread here. I posted extensively on a cheap and easy method that wiped fleas out of our two homes.
Click to expand...


Cuddly proves once again she's the dumbest rock in the box around here.  Nothing about being a human makes a dog owner the "alpha" dog.   You must prove to the dog you are it's master....I can imagine this weakling around a dog.....I bet she'd lick it's ass for it if it growled at her.   

You just landed on my iggy list...you and unKotex are a matched set of gerbils.


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## Coyote

I have never had to pick up my dogs and hold them over my head.  That's not a dog thing.  That's a primate thing.

I've never had any problems with my dog's either that weren't resolvable using less confrontational means.


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## earlycuyler

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kooshdakhaa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have ANY dog if you only have an hour a day to spend with him.
> 
> My two Dobermans are with me all the time when I'm home.  They sleep in my bed.  I sleep like a baby because I know they're looking after me.  They're not a threat to me, but they're definitely a threat to anyone who would try to hurt me.
> 
> Oh, and I've never had to lift them over my head or pin them down or any other such shit to show them who's alpha.  I simply AM the alpha around here and that is obvious to them by the way I carry myself.  I don't have to manhandle them to get that point across.  I give them lots of affection.  We have a very strong bond.
> 
> And as for being around children, I trust my Dobermans around children much more than I trust my miniature pinscher and my miniature pinscher mix.  The odds are pretty high that one of those little shits will bite a kid. The Dobermans, not so much.  Nonetheless, I am very protective of the dobes when kids are around.  Don't want some creepy little brat getting one of my dogs in trouble.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agree. When we domesticated dogs, we became their pack. We're alpha to them. If you need to put a dog in his place, lifting them over your head is just silly macho posturing. Maybe he needs a bigger gun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And BTW, lay down with dogs, get up with fleas.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why don't you do something to get rid of the fleas?
> 
> Its not that hard.
> 
> Do a search of a previous thread here. I posted extensively on a cheap and easy method that wiped fleas out of our two homes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cuddly proves once again she's the dumbest rock in the box around here.  Nothing about being a human makes a dog owner the "alpha" dog.   You must prove to the dog you are it's master....I can imagine this weakling around a dog.....I bet she'd lick it's ass for it if it growled at her.
> 
> You just landed on my iggy list...you and unKotex are a matched set of gerbils.
Click to expand...


Beats an interweb fagtough anyway.


----------



## Kooshdakhaa

BullKurtzUSMC said:


> Kooshdakhaa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BullKurtzUSMC said:
> 
> 
> 
> No you don't...because nobody has a Pit with innocent intentions....they like it that their dog makes others uptight....they like it that their Pit is their security blanket, and they know if the fucker messes somebody up they can claim "Killer was only defending us"...Uh huh.  Cowards every one of them....what kind of man would leave their family at the mercy of a dog who might go haywire on them out of the clear blue?  I got rid of my German Shepherds when I started a family....while they were growing up, I continuously picked them up over my head to remind them who was Alapha Dog and who wasn't.  Still, they were very aggressive to strangers as much as I tried to dissuade them from acting like that.  I couldn't trust them so they went to a farm to live....but only on the condition they never be put on a chain....put a German Shepherd on a chain for two weeks and you have a problem dog in two weeks.  Bottom line?  Don't get involved in a breed big enough to kill you and yours unless you can spend an hour a day with him to notice if his behavior is changing....you can have a real tragedy on your hands in a matter of seconds with these breeds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have ANY dog if you only have an hour a day to spend with him.
> 
> My two Dobermans are with me all the time when I'm home.  They sleep in my bed.  I sleep like a baby because I know they're looking after me.  They're not a threat to me, but they're definitely a threat to anyone who would try to hurt me.
> 
> Oh, and I've never had to lift them over my head or pin them down or any other such shit to show them who's alpha.  I simply AM the alpha around here and that is obvious to them by the way I carry myself.  I don't have to manhandle them to get that point across.  I give them lots of affection.  We have a very strong bond.
> 
> And as for being around children, I trust my Dobermans around children much more than I trust my miniature pinscher and my miniature pinscher mix.  The odds are pretty high that one of those little shits will bite a kid. The Dobermans, not so much.  Nonetheless, I am very protective of the dobes when kids are around.  Don't want some creepy little brat getting one of my dogs in trouble.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What I meant about an hour a day is an hour devoted solely to the dog....a walk, a game of fetch, teaching a new command, or in my world, a reminder who's the dog and who's the bear (Bull).  Your dogs being with you isn't enough if you're doing other things.....a large dog aggressively bred must be interacted with to notice if something is bothering it.
> 
> In Colorado my male Shepherd started acting cranky....when we took our hour I discovered he had a couple dozen ticks on him from an adventure up around Gold Hill.  The ticks were making his life miserable and a miserable 100 pound German Shepherd can accomplish the unexpected in a blur.  The female had the beginnings of hip problems at one point and her disposition turned nasty from it.   The vet solved both issues because I discovered them before they escalated.  And BTW, lay down with dogs, get up with fleas.  No dog has ever slept in my bed and no dog ever will.
Click to expand...


I agree with you about spending time devoted solely to the dog, allowing yourself to be aware of any concerns.

Now, as far as sleeping with the dogs, it's my choice.  I LIKE them on the bed with me.  They're warm.  I have 2-3 layers of "dog" blankets over "my" bedding to keep the dogs off it, and the dogs also aren't allowed on the sheets, where I sleep.  And I wash ALL the bedding every week.

But I'm also in Alaska.  We don't have much problem with fleas up here.  I did bring in a stray min pin a few years ago who turned out to be crawling with fleas!  My two dobermans and the four cats I had all got fleas.  But I was able to obliterate them entirely with Frontline and getting rid of them in the bedding, cat beds, etc. was no problem.  For example, I just threw the cat beds outside and let them freeze for a few nights.  No more fleas. 

People bring animals up who already have fleas, so there is the possibility of catching them, but it's pretty rare for a dog to have fleas up here.

So my point is...none of my dogs have fleas, so your line about "lay down with the dogs, get up with the fleas" simply doesn't apply.


----------

