# "Gotham" (Fox TV)



## Abishai100

This fall, the Batman (DC Comics) adapted TV series "Gotham" (Fox TV) will premiere.

"Gotham" (Fox TV) will present origin storylines of the famous caped crusader Batman as the young boy Bruce Wayne scarred by the murder of his parents and attempting to mature into his role as an aristocrat in Gotham City and finding his way towards republic-minded vigilantism while various nihilistic super-villains such as Penguin (a crime-master with a taste for blood) and Poison Ivy (an eco-terrorist who is anything but democratic) rise to power.

This TV series reflects a modern demand for entertainment that represents society fascination with lifestyle thrills.

When the controversial American white supremacist David Duke went on national TV in the 1990s and voiced his incendiary opinions about racial profiling, people took notice of the power that modern media has in creating discussion about the merging of politics and street talk.

Well, "Gotham" (Fox TV) reveals today's social interest in politics-oriented comic book stylized art talk avatars such as the 'heretical' eco-activist Poison Ivy.


Watching "Gotham" (Fox TV) just might make you think about Poison Ivy and recycling those pesky  plastic water bottles in your consumerism skeleton closet.

I can seriously see this show becoming an American achievement.

"Gotham" (Fox TV) could be as spellbinding as the popular Green Arrow (the incredible super-archer) comic book adapted TV series "Arrow" (CW TV).





Gotham on FOX


----------



## JoeB131

Is this going to be "Smallville" for Batman?  

Ugh.


----------



## Montrovant

JoeB131 said:


> Is this going to be "Smallville" for Batman?
> 
> Ugh.



I don't think it is.  From what I've read this focuses more on Jim Gordon, with Wayne and the villains playing secondary roles.

Plus, it's not on the WB/UPN/CW.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Abishai100 said:


> This fall, the Batman (DC Comics) adapted TV series "Gotham" (Fox TV) will premiere.
> 
> "Gotham" (Fox TV) will present origin storylines of the famous caped crusader Batman as the young boy Bruce Wayne scarred by the murder of his parents and attempting to mature into his role as an aristocrat in Gotham City and finding his way towards republic-minded vigilantism while various nihilistic super-villains such as Penguin (a crime-master with a taste for blood) and Poison Ivy (an eco-terrorist who is anything but democratic) rise to power.
> 
> This TV series reflects a modern demand for entertainment that represents society fascination with lifestyle thrills.
> 
> When the controversial American white supremacist David Duke went on national TV in the 1990s and voiced his incendiary opinions about racial profiling, people took notice of the power that modern media has in creating discussion about the merging of politics and street talk.
> 
> Well, "Gotham" (Fox TV) reveals today's social interest in politics-oriented comic book stylized art talk avatars such as the 'heretical' eco-activist Poison Ivy.
> 
> 
> Watching "Gotham" (Fox TV) just might make you think about Poison Ivy and recycling those pesky  plastic water bottles in your consumerism skeleton closet.
> 
> I can seriously see this show becoming an American achievement.
> 
> "Gotham" (Fox TV) could be as spellbinding as the popular Green Arrow (the incredible super-archer) comic book adapted TV series "Arrow" (CW TV).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham on FOX


----------



## shart_attack

Looks dumb as hell to me.

Most shows based on comic book heroes/ heroines are.


----------



## Harry Dresden

shart_attack said:


> Looks dumb as hell to me.
> 
> Most shows based on comic book heroes/ heroines are.


depends on how well they are done.....


----------



## JoeB131

Montrovant said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this going to be "Smallville" for Batman?
> 
> Ugh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think it is.  From what I've read this focuses more on Jim Gordon, with Wayne and the villains playing secondary roles.
> 
> Plus, it's not on the WB/UPN/CW.
Click to expand...


Well, I just watched the premiere. 

They managed to shoehorn in "prequel" versions of not only Batman, but the Penguin, Poison Ivy, Catwoman, The Riddler and the Joker.  I'm surprised they didn't have Two-Face in a pre-law class.  They also included minor normal characters like Rene Montoya and Harvey Bullock. 

So this is like a "prequel" to the Nolan Batman who exists in a universe where no one has super powers.

Hey, bonus round.  Alfred Pennysworth is played by Sean Pertwee, who is the son of Jon Pertwee, or as we better know him, the Third Doctor.


----------



## Montrovant

JoeB131 said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this going to be "Smallville" for Batman?
> 
> Ugh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think it is.  From what I've read this focuses more on Jim Gordon, with Wayne and the villains playing secondary roles.
> 
> Plus, it's not on the WB/UPN/CW.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, I just watched the premiere.
> 
> They managed to shoehorn in "prequel" versions of not only Batman, but the Penguin, Poison Ivy, Catwoman, The Riddler and the Joker.  I'm surprised they didn't have Two-Face in a pre-law class.  They also included minor normal characters like Rene Montoya and Harvey Bullock.
> 
> So this is like a "prequel" to the Nolan Batman who exists in a universe where no one has super powers.
> 
> Hey, bonus round.  Alfred Pennysworth is played by Sean Pertwee, who is the son of Jon Pertwee, or as we better know him, the Third Doctor.
Click to expand...


Holy crap did they shoehorn in characters.  I'm hoping that is not going to be a regular thing in the show, too many Batman characters forced into unnecessary scenes.

Not a great premier, but I'll give it some more episodes, it wasn't horrible.

It did focus on Gordon, at least.


----------



## theDoctorisIn

Damn, I missed it. I'm sure they'll replay it, though.

I meant to watch it, the concept reminds me of the Batman: Year One graphic novel, which also focused on a young Gordon.


----------



## Abishai100

*Street Lights*


After watching the first two episodes of "Gotham" (Fox TV), I find that it is comparable to "Arrow" (The CW) and arguably has the potential to be as good as "Smallville" (WB, CW).

In fact, I think with the colorful introductions of ominous henchmen, "Gotham" (Fox TV) is offering audiences Batman's own stamp and perhaps separating it from Superman lore (perhaps prepping America nicely for the upcoming Superman vs. Batman film).  I really liked Lili Taylor and Frank Whaley's insidious characters from Episode 2, "Selina Kyle" (09/29/2014).

What really sets apart Batman from Superman and other comic book heroes such as Green Arrow is its conscious focus on the psychological aspects of vigilantism.  Modern age populism politics gave rise to street justice talk and the cultural popularity of the Hell's Angels and Hollywood (USA) films such as "Maniac Cop" (1988) added fuel to the fire.

Batman is in many ways the comic book world's most intriguing vigilante.

One of Batman's challenging nemeses, Ra's al Ghul, is a psyche mastermind who devises elaborate schemes designed to promote 'fascist vigilantism.'  Ra's is to Batman what Fortinbras was to Hamlet.  I'd love to see David Duchovny play the antagonistic Ra's al Ghul on "Gotham" (Fox TV).


With positive reviews of "Gotham" (Fox TV) in so far, I'm going to start researching real-life cops/detectives who became 'famous' for taking down multiple crime-masters.

Chang Apana, for example, the legendary Honolulu detective, took down multiple nefarious gambling and narcotics-smuggling rings and was the inspiration for the fictional media detective character Charlie Chan, portrayed in various films, radio, and television programs from the 1920s to the 1940s.





Street Justice - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


----------



## longknife

I agree with the above poster. I've watched the episodes and like the theme. It shows Wayne's dedication to finding the killer of his parents. It also shows the corruption what was - and may still be - a major part of city life. As one character said, "You can have cops without crime."


----------



## Circle_Breaker

They should have changed the story completely.

Have the mugger shoot Bruce instead of the father.

The father goes vigilante and becomes batman.

Mother goes crazy and becomes the Joker.

Would have have been a great alternate history that would have made Gotham Unique.

There a great comic miniseries that was based around the idea. flashpoint maybe?


----------



## Montrovant

Circle_Breaker said:


> They should have changed the story completely.
> 
> Have the mugger shoot Bruce instead of the father.
> 
> The father goes vigilante and becomes batman.
> 
> Mother goes crazy and becomes the Joker.
> 
> Would have have been a great alternate history that would have made Gotham Unique.
> 
> There a great comic miniseries that was based around the idea. flashpoint maybe?



Didn't the villain Owl Man, from an alternate DC universe and recently transported to the main DC universe, have something like that happen?  Bruce was killed, the father became an evil vigilante?


----------



## Abishai100

*Revenge of the Nerds*

This show is doing very handsomely, and I think it will fit nicely in today's mural of comic book adapted entertainment programs and likely also establish itself as the domain's 'go-to flashlight' for those getting into Batman for the first time.

I'd like to see "Gotham" (Fox TV) succeeding in hyping street-justice labor appreciation and doing for the NYPD (etc.) what Sherlock Holmes films did for Scotland Yard (UK).

The development of Edward Nygma (the future Riddler) continues to satisfy.







en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulp_magazine


----------



## Delta4Embassy

Think the networks are wasting their money making new series for commercial tv. Commercials are too frequent, too many, and totally disrupt any storytelling in the show. Wanna make something major like this do it for the premium channels like Starz or something. Putting it on reg tv is a waste of effort.


----------



## JoeB131

Montrovant said:


> Didn't the villain Owl Man, from an alternate DC universe and recently transported to the main DC universe, have something like that happen? Bruce was killed, the father became an evil vigilante?



Well, two different things. 

One was that on Earth-3, Bruce Wayne's brother Thomas became the evil criminal Owl-Man. 

In the comic "Flashpoint", Thomas Wayne Senior survives the attack and becomes an evil Batman in an alternative reality caused by the Flash trying to reset the timeline. 

AAAAAHHHHHH COMIC NERD ALERT!!!!!


----------



## Harry Dresden

Delta4Embassy said:


> Think the networks are wasting their money making new series for commercial tv. Commercials are too frequent, too many, and totally disrupt any storytelling in the show. Wanna make something major like this do it for the premium channels like Starz or something. Putting it on reg tv is a waste of effort.


for Gotham?.....


----------



## 2aguy

Spoilers....


Tonights episode shows real promise...they did not p.c. Bruce Wayne fighting the bully by making him sob and whine about not enjoying defeating the kid....and Alfred....finally....when he explains to the beaten bully the consequences and how he stands by them....great....there is a lot of promise in this show....I hope they don't screw it up like the guys did to Blacklist....


----------



## 2aguy

> Wanna make something major like this do it for the premium channels like Starz or something.



It would be good to see a superhero show on a cable network...the only problem would be adding sex every 5 seconds....not that I am against it...it's just kind of silly when you know they are just throwing it in where it isn't called for or necessary...

Did you know Netflix is doing superhero shows....they are doing Daredevil, and a couple of others...that will be interesting and may be what you are looking for....


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> Spoilers....
> 
> 
> Tonights episode shows real promise...they did not p.c. Bruce Wayne fighting the bully by making him sob and whine about not enjoying defeating the kid....and Alfred....finally....when he explains to the beaten bully the consequences and how he stands by them....great....there is a lot of promise in this show....I hope they don't screw it up like the guys did to Blacklist....



Wow, so essentially, Alfred is training Bruce to grow up to be sociopath, and you think this is great character development. 

Don't worry, next week they are shoe-horning Two-Face into the story.  So in this universe, all of Batman's villains are going to be like Old People when he finally becomes Batman.


----------



## 2aguy

> Wow, so essentially, Alfred is training Bruce to grow up to be sociopath



Do you think the Navy Seal who double tapped bin laden should go through life weeping over killing bin laden....?   Is that Navy Seal a sociopath?

Does the character Batman indiscriminately kill people....?  Does the Character Batman choose victims who are innocent, weak, or not guilty of a crime?

Joe, I know violence is unsettling to you...sadly, for the actual sociopaths, violence is a tool they use to get their way, and no amount of hugs, and good feelings is ever going to change that....


----------



## longknife

I love how the liberals hate this show.

Me? I find it quite interesting and enjoyable.


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> Wow, so essentially, Alfred is training Bruce to grow up to be sociopath
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think the Navy Seal who double tapped bin laden should go through life weeping over killing bin laden....?   Is that Navy Seal a sociopath?
> 
> Does the character Batman indiscriminately kill people....?  Does the Character Batman choose victims who are innocent, weak, or not guilty of a crime?
> 
> Joe, I know violence is unsettling to you...sadly, for the actual sociopaths, violence is a tool they use to get their way, and no amount of hugs, and good feelings is ever going to change that....
Click to expand...


I think a bully in Middle School is nowhere near "bin Laden".  

Sadly, a lot of school shooters like Kelbold, Harris, Lanza all kind of have your values and "avenged" themselves, just like you think is cool.


----------



## JoeB131

longknife said:


> I love how the liberals hate this show.
> 
> Me? I find it quite interesting and enjoyable.



I'm a Batman fan and I hate this show.  

This show is doing for Batman what "_The Phantom Menace_" did for Darth Vader.


----------



## 2aguy

> Sadly, a lot of school shooters like Kelbold, Harris, Lanza all kind of have your values and "avenged" themselves,



Joe...Joe....klebold and harris were not bullied...that was not true...the one was a follower of the other and the main guy wanted to kill a bunch of people because he hated inferior people in general...neither was actually bullied, and lanza was a nut...


----------



## 2aguy

> I think a bully in Middle School is nowhere near "bin Laden".



Joe, I wrote, the character Batman....this boy defended himself in the show...against a bully....


----------



## 2aguy

Joe....here is an article that looks at the truth about kel old and Harris....one was a depressed guy, the other a psycho path...no bullying happened...

At last we know why the Columbine killers did it.



> He is _disgusted_ with the morons around him. These are not the rantings of an angry young man, picked on by jocks until he's not going to take it anymore. These are the rantings of someone with a messianic-grade _superiority_ complex, out to punish the entire human race for its appalling inferiority. It may look like hate, but "It's more about demeaning other people," says Hare.





> The first steps to understanding Columbine, they say, are to forget the popular narrative about the jocks, Goths, and Trenchcoat Mafia—click here to read more about Columbine's myths—and to abandon the core idea that Columbine was simply a _school shooting. _We can't understand _why_ they did it until we understand _what_ they were doing.





> School shooters tend to act impulsively and attack the targets of their rage: students and faculty. But Harris and Klebold planned for a year and dreamed much bigger. The school served as means to a grander end, to terrorize the entire nation by attacking a symbol of American life. Their slaughter was aimed at students and teachers, but it was not motivated by resentment of them in particular. Students and teachers were just convenient quarry, what Timothy McVeigh described as "collateral damage."




]





> The killers, in fact, laughed at petty school shooters. They bragged about dwarfing the carnage of the Oklahoma City bombing and originally scheduled their bloody performance for its anniversary. Klebold boasted on video about inflicting "the most deaths in U.S. history." *Columbine was intended not primarily as a shooting at all, but as a bombing on a massive scale.*





> Fuselier and Ochberg say that if you want to understand "the killers," quit asking what drove _them_. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were radically different individuals, with vastly different motives and opposite mental conditions. Klebold is easier to comprehend, a more familiar type. He was hotheaded, but depressive and suicidal. He blamed himself for his problems.





> Harris is the challenge. He was sweet-faced and well-spoken. Adults, and even some other kids, described him as "nice." But Harris was cold, calculating, and homicidal. "Klebold was hurting inside while Harris wanted to hurt people," Fuselier says. Harris was not merely a troubled kid, the psychiatrists say, he was a psychopath.


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> Joe...Joe....klebold and harris were not bullied...that was not true...the one was a follower of the other and the main guy wanted to kill a bunch of people because he hated inferior people in general...neither was actually bullied, and lanza was a nut...



Yes, they were all gun nuts with revenge fantasies.  Thank you for pointing that out.


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> I think a bully in Middle School is nowhere near "bin Laden".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Joe, I wrote, the character Batman....this boy defended himself in the show...against a bully....
Click to expand...


No, he beat another child in an act of revenge.  That bully was not an immediate threat to him.  

And the adult in his life, instead of confronting the adult in that child's life, instead indulged his act of revenge. 

Now, besides this being totally sociopathic, it really undermines the characters as written in the comics.  Alfred in the comics is Batman/Bruce's "voice of reason".  This version of Alfred is just an enabler of bad behavior.


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> Joe....here is an article that looks at the truth about kel old and Harris....one was a depressed guy, the other a psycho path...no bullying happened...



Guy, you gun nuts need to start owning your heroes.  When you spend all day fantasizing about all the people you can't wait to shoot, you really shouldn't go "ummm, not us" when one of them actually does it.


----------



## 2aguy

> Yes, they were all gun nuts with revenge fantasies. Thank you for pointing that out.



Joe, I know you went to a government school controlled by the education wing of the democrat party...but as an adult you should have worked on your reading comprehension....the main nut at Columbine simply hated people...he had no score to settle....and they had bombs as well....


----------



## 2aguy

> No, he beat another child in an act of revenge. That bully was not an immediate threat to him.
> 
> And the adult in his life, instead of confronting the adult in that child's life, instead indulged his act of revenge.



No....he dealt with a much larger violent bully...and in doing what he did he ensured it wouldn't happen again...rather than spending his entire educational time at that school in constant fear of intimidation and assault...and the adult....taught him a lesson too few learn today....you can't run from bullies....they don't stop when you submit to them...it simply encourages more aggression...


----------



## 2aguy

Joe....look at this, and tell me the school system is equipped to deal with this psychopathic behavior...tell me the school social worker or psychologist is going to be able to protect weaker children from this monster....



> Harris married his deceitfulness with a total lack of remorse or empathy—another distinctive quality of the psychopath. Fuselier was finally convinced of his diagnosis when he read Harris' response to being punished after being caught breaking into a van. Klebold and Harris had avoided prosecution for the robbery by participating in a "diversion program" that involved counseling and community service. Both killers feigned regret to obtain an early release, *but Harris had relished the opportunity to perform. He wrote an ingratiating letter to his victim offering empathy, rather than just apologies. Fuselier remembers that it was packed with statements like Jeez, I understand now how you feel and I understand what this did to you. *





> "But he wrote that strictly for effect," Fuselier said. "That was complete manipulation. At almost the exact same time, he wrote down his real feelings in his journal: _'Isn't America supposed to be the land of the free? How come, if I'm free, I can't deprive a stupid f---ing dumbshit from his possessions if he leaves them sitting in the front seat of his f---ing van out in plain sight and in the middle of f---ing nowhere on a Frif---ingday night. NATURAL SELECTION. F---er should be shot.' _"





> None of his victims means anything to the psychopath. He recognizes other people only as means to obtain what he desires. Not only does he feel no guilt for destroying their lives, he doesn't grasp what they feel. The truly hard-core psychopath doesn't quite comprehend emotions like love or hate or fear, because he has never experienced them directly.





> "Because of their inability to appreciate the feelings of others, some psychopaths are capable of behavior that normal people find not only horrific but baffling," Hare writes. "For example, they can torture and mutilate their victims with about the same sense of concern that we feel when we carve a turkey for Thanksgiving dinner."


----------



## 2aguy

> Guy, you gun nuts need to start owning your heroes. When you spend all day fantasizing about all the people you can't wait to shoot, you really shouldn't go "ummm, not us" when one of them actually does it.





Psychological projection - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia



> *Psychological projection* is a theory in psychology in which humans defend themselves against unpleasant impulses by denying their existence in themselves, while attributing them to others.[1] For example, a person who is rude may constantly accuse other people of being rude.



Joe...get help...before you hurt someone


----------



## longknife

Why oh why can't the Leftists get into a thread without screwing it up?


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> Joe, I know you went to a government school controlled by the education wing of the democrat party...but as an adult you should have worked on your reading comprehension....the main nut at Columbine simply hated people...he had no score to settle....and they had bombs as well....



Actually, I went to Catholic School, which is why I have an abiding hate of religious nuts. 

Kleibold and Harris were gun nuts seeking revenge.  They were living your dream, baby, the one that you don't have the balls to do.


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> No....he dealt with a much larger violent bully...and in doing what he did he ensured it wouldn't happen again...rather than spending his entire educational time at that school in constant fear of intimidation and assault...and the adult....taught him a lesson too few learn today....you can't run from bullies....they don't stop when you submit to them...it simply encourages more aggression...



Nobody suggested he should submit. 

Frankly, it should have worked like this. Alfred talks to the parents of the bully. The Bully's parents, although well off, have nowhere near the wealth of the Waynes.  In short, this is not a family you want your little bastard to fuck with. 

Instead, he teaches Bruce to assault this kid with a WEAPON, which normally would get him some time in a juvy detention center.  Or it should.


----------



## 2aguy

> Kleibold and Harris were gun nuts seeking revenge.



I guess you still didn't comprehend the article....you should really read it....it wasn't revenge, harris and klebold were never bullie....they were just cold killers....


----------



## 2aguy

What the truth was about columbine....



> Their view of Harris is more reassuring, in a certain way. Harris was not a wayward boy who could have been rescued. Harris, they believe, was irretrievable. He was a brilliant killer without a conscience, searching for the most diabolical scheme imaginable. If he had lived to adulthood and developed his murderous skills for many more years, there is no telling what he could have done. His death at Columbine may have stopped him from doing something even worse.



So, if any bullying had been done...it would have been harris and klebold doing it....


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> I guess you still didn't comprehend the article....you should really read it....it wasn't revenge, harris and klebold were never bullie....they were just cold killers....



Yup, just like a lot of gun nuts.


----------



## Harry Dresden

JoeB131 said:


> Billc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think a bully in Middle School is nowhere near "bin Laden".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Joe, I wrote, the character Batman....this boy defended himself in the show...against a bully....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, he beat another child in an act of revenge.  That bully was not an immediate threat to him.
> 
> And the adult in his life, instead of confronting the adult in that child's life, instead indulged his act of revenge.
> 
> Now, besides this being totally sociopathic, it really undermines the characters as written in the comics.  Alfred in the comics is Batman/Bruce's "voice of reason".  This version of Alfred is just an enabler of bad behavior.
Click to expand...

the Alfred in the comics was when Bruce was an adult......i dont ever remember a Batman comic that dealt with a 12 year old Bruce.....so do we know what went on back then?....and i read these things in the 50's....religiously.....


----------



## Montrovant

JoeB131 said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I love how the liberals hate this show.
> 
> Me? I find it quite interesting and enjoyable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a Batman fan and I hate this show.
> 
> This show is doing for Batman what "_The Phantom Menace_" did for Darth Vader.
Click to expand...


Absolutely terrible comparison.  The Phantom Menace was simply a bad movie.  Even had it followed along with the story of the original movies, it was poorly made and acted.  Gotham, while you may not like the story, is at least put together fairly well.

As to this show dramatically changing the Bruce Wayne character, I don't agree.  Yes, it is obviously taking liberties, but there have been plenty of different takes on Bruce Wayne/Batman over the years, I don't think Gotham is ruining some sort of sacred canon about his youth.  And Alfred, while he is often the 'voice of reason', is also a former soldier who has on multiple occasions shown off his physical and strategic skills and, depending on who's doing the writing, gone for his own revenge as well.

If you don't like what they have done with this show, that's entirely understandable, but Batman has been a changeable enough character that I don't think what they have done is so far from the comics as to ruin it.

I would have preferred a little bit less of shoving various characters from the comics in our faces, though.


----------



## JoeB131

Harry Dresden said:


> the Alfred in the comics was when Bruce was an adult......i dont ever remember a Batman comic that dealt with a 12 year old Bruce.....so do we know what went on back then?....and i read these things in the 50's....religiously.....



I guess, if you want to stretch, maybe Alfred made some really poor parenting choices when Bruce was growing up.  

Here's the better question. Did we NEED a whole TV series dedicated to Bruce Wayne as a middle-schooler?


----------



## JoeB131

Montrovant said:


> I would have preferred a little bit less of shoving various characters from the comics in our faces, though.



But that's all they really have, isn't it? Don't worry, Harvey Dent is going to show up next week.


----------



## Harry Dresden

JoeB131 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> the Alfred in the comics was when Bruce was an adult......i dont ever remember a Batman comic that dealt with a 12 year old Bruce.....so do we know what went on back then?....and i read these things in the 50's....religiously.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess, if you want to stretch, maybe Alfred made some really poor parenting choices when Bruce was growing up.
> 
> Here's the better question. Did we NEED a whole TV series dedicated to Bruce Wayne as a middle-schooler?
Click to expand...

hey ill take this anyday over those shitty reality shows.....shit Joe if you dont like it.....change the channel,there are enough to go check out.........


----------



## JoeB131

Harry Dresden said:


> hey ill take this anyday over those shitty reality shows.....shit Joe if you dont like it.....change the channel,there are enough to go check out.........



I'm kind of expressing my disappointment with it. 

I think when they take something like this - material that already has fans - and flips a big bird to the Audience by changing things, we maybe ought to point it out. 

This was my big problem with Star Trek Enterprise.  "Hey, let's make a prequel Star Trek series where the Vulcans are the bad guys!"  

I also doubt it will last one season.  I think it would be a shame if Fox kept this on the air after cancelling _Firefly_.


----------



## 2aguy

I don't understand the fascination with the show Firefly...it was okay, but nothing special....


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> I don't understand the fascination with the show Firefly...it was okay, but nothing special....



You mean other than having sharply written dialog and great characters,  yeah, it was just like all the other TV shows that don't.


----------



## 2aguy

Joe, as much as you say you hate "Red Neck gun nuts" it would seem the characters on that show are the very type of people you can't stand....since the are pretty much red neck gun nuts....who use guns in a definitely illegal manner, and the only non red neck gun nuts were the Doctor, his sister and possibly the priest and the...sex worker....


----------



## Montrovant

Billc said:


> I don't understand the fascination with the show Firefly...it was okay, but nothing special....



Firefly was perhaps the greatest single season of television I've ever seen.  I'm a big fan of Whedon's dialogue and the actors had great chemistry in the show.


----------



## Montrovant

JoeB131 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> hey ill take this anyday over those shitty reality shows.....shit Joe if you dont like it.....change the channel,there are enough to go check out.........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm kind of expressing my disappointment with it.
> 
> I think when they take something like this - material that already has fans - and flips a big bird to the Audience by changing things, we maybe ought to point it out.
> 
> This was my big problem with Star Trek Enterprise.  "Hey, let's make a prequel Star Trek series where the Vulcans are the bad guys!"
> 
> I also doubt it will last one season.  I think it would be a shame if Fox kept this on the air after cancelling _Firefly_.
Click to expand...


According to this, if you take all kinds of viewership into account, Gotham is by far FOX's best rated show.

 8216 Gotham 8217 Tops FOX 30-Day Multi-Platform Ratings for the Week of October 6 - Ratings TVbytheNumbers.Zap2it.com

Firefly, while a great show, had issues that Gotham does not.  Poor advertisement, a more niche type of basic audience, no wave of comic book movies and shows to be part of.

Plenty of good sci-fi shows have been cancelled prematurely.  

Gotham is pretty well put together show, even if you do not enjoy it.


----------



## JoeB131

Billc said:


> Joe, as much as you say you hate "Red Neck gun nuts" it would seem the characters on that show are the very type of people you can't stand....since the are pretty much red neck gun nuts....who use guns in a definitely illegal manner, and the only non red neck gun nuts were the Doctor, his sister and possibly the priest and the...sex worker....



Okay, except this is a work of fiction... 

IN the real world, rednecks are usually using hteir famous last words, 'Hold my beer".


----------



## Montrovant

I find it funny, in a pathetic kind of way, how easily a thread about a show based on Batman characters can turn political.


----------



## 2aguy

> IN the real world, rednecks are usually using hteir famous last words, 'Hold my beer".



Joe, I think we found an area of agreement...when you are anywhere where alcohol is being imbibed, and you hear the words..."Hold my bear," you should either run for cover....or get out your cell phone camera...hilarity or tragedy is about to happen....


----------



## longknife

The bottom line is simple --- *If you don't like the show, don't watch it!!!!!*


----------



## JoeB131

longknife said:


> The bottom line is simple --- *If you don't like the show, don't watch it!!!!!*



I probably won't for much longer.  However, I do try to give certain SF and Fantasy shows a little more leeway than I give other shows.  

The _Doctor Who_ Reboot and _Babylon 5_ had very weak first seasons. Then the writing got better, they tweaked a few things - mostly getting rid of lead actors who didn't work. (Not an option I see for Gotham.)


----------



## Harry Dresden

JoeB131 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> hey ill take this anyday over those shitty reality shows.....shit Joe if you dont like it.....change the channel,there are enough to go check out.........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm kind of expressing my disappointment with it.
> 
> I think when they take something like this - material that already has fans - and flips a big bird to the Audience by changing things, we maybe ought to point it out.
> 
> This was my big problem with Star Trek Enterprise.  "Hey, let's make a prequel Star Trek series where the Vulcans are the bad guys!"
> 
> I also doubt it will last one season.  I think it would be a shame if Fox kept this on the air after cancelling _Firefly_.
Click to expand...

i heard it is one of Foxes highest rated shows.....its been averaging 6.7 million viewers thru the first 8 episodes and has been oked for a full season.....Firefly by the way was pulling in an avg of 4.7 million viewers during its 11 episode run..........


----------



## Montrovant

JoeB131 said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> The bottom line is simple --- *If you don't like the show, don't watch it!!!!!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I probably won't for much longer.  However, I do try to give certain SF and Fantasy shows a little more leeway than I give other shows.
> 
> The _Doctor Who_ Reboot and _Babylon 5_ had very weak first seasons. Then the writing got better, they tweaked a few things - mostly getting rid of lead actors who didn't work. (Not an option I see for Gotham.)
Click to expand...


One day I really should watch Babylon 5!


----------



## JoeB131

Montrovant said:


> One day I really should watch Babylon 5!



YOu really should.  It was a great show in that it had a five year story arc that pays off in the end.


----------



## JoeB131

Oh, even better as an example of a show that sucked in season 1 and got Better-  Star Trek the Next Generation.


----------



## Montrovant

JoeB131 said:


> Oh, even better as an example of a show that sucked in season 1 and got Better-  Star Trek the Next Generation.



It's been a long time, but I remember enjoying TNG right from the start.

Buffy had a fairly weak first season but improved every year, at least for the first 5 years.


----------



## JoeB131

After the last scene in tonight's episode... I totally take it all back.

Wooo-hooo!!!!


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> The bottom line is simple --- *If you don't like the show, don't watch it!!!!!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I probably won't for much longer.  However, I do try to give certain SF and Fantasy shows a little more leeway than I give other shows.
> 
> The _Doctor Who_ Reboot and _Babylon 5_ had very weak first seasons. Then the writing got better, they tweaked a few things - mostly getting rid of lead actors who didn't work. (Not an option I see for Gotham.)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> One day I really should watch Babylon 5!
Click to expand...

yes you should Montro.....arguably the best sci-fy show ever on TV....definitely top 5....


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Billc said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't understand the fascination with the show Firefly...it was okay, but nothing special....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Firefly was perhaps the greatest single season of television I've ever seen.  I'm a big fan of Whedon's dialogue and the actors had great chemistry in the show.
Click to expand...

not to me.....Firefly was good but not that good....but thats me.....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Billc said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't understand the fascination with the show Firefly...it was okay, but nothing special....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Firefly was perhaps the greatest single season of television I've ever seen.  I'm a big fan of Whedon's dialogue and the actors had great chemistry in the show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> not to me.....Firefly was good but not that good....but thats me.....
Click to expand...


I actually didn't watch the show when it was on TV.  I think that, after Buffy and Angel, it wasn't what I was looking for.  When I did finally give it a chance, though, I loved it.

But, as I said, I'm a fan of Whedon and his dialogue.


----------



## longknife

From Wired, an analysis of Bruce Wayne's emotional problems @ We Asked Psychiatrists to Decode Bruce Wayne s Emotional Problems in Gotham WIRED


----------



## Abishai100

*Red Hood: Halloween Hairspray*


Well, tonight's episode will introduce Batman (DC Comics) fans to the eccentric Red Hood gang.

I'm still hoping a popular cult favorite actor such as David Duchovny will show up on "Gotham" (Fox TV) to portray the nefarious Ra's al Ghul.

I'd be interested in a study that asks how these vigilantism-themed comic book adapted programs (TV shows, movies) affect the sales of water-guns.  Have sales risen since the proliferation of comic book adaptations, which arguably began soaring not during the classic Adam West Batman television series but with the release of Tim Burton's odd but cinematic "Batman" (1989)?

Let's admit it, America makes the best playhouses, so maybe tonight's Red Hood presentation on "Gotham" (Fox TV) will offer up some costuming capital for Halloween 2015.


----------



## Abishai100

*Red Hood America
*

A series of episodes for this first year of "Gotham" (Fox TV) begins in April, and the recent ones since January 2015 entertained us with eerie and intriguing images foreshadowing the rise of the likes of the Joker, Scarecrow, the Red Hood Gang, and the Dollmaker.

Meanwhile, the meanderings of the Penguin continue to create adequate atmosphere, and the quirky presence of Edward Nygma (the future Riddler) continues to stir ideas about Jim Gordon's perspective on friendship and police department bureaucracy.

Overall, the show seems to be capturing our modern age fascination with capital sentimentality (i.e., Facebook) and the various 'governance' behemoths it catapults (i.e., World Bank), so I'd like to see more seasons/years of "Gotham" (Fox TV) provide ratings and good solid brain candy.

I was very impressed by the storyboard managers' introduction, presentation, and treatment of the nefarious Red Hood Gang and their scheming bank robberies.  Remember that in the comics, we see the Joker get an origin thread as a leader of the Red Hood Gang, so how "Gotham" (Fox TV) continues to address themes of theft-related pure mania and mayhem will ice this show as a comic book celebratory era version of "Hill Street Blues" (1981-1987) or "Remington Steele" (1982-1987).










World Bank (Wikipedia)


----------



## longknife

I too enjoy the show and am looking forward to its return.


----------



## JoeB131

I'm warming up to it.


----------



## Desperado

It is one and done for Jada Pinkett Smith as Fish Mooney on Gotham
Overall it is a good show and her character will be missed.
http://variety.com/2015/tv/news/jada-pinkett-smith-leaving-gotham-season-2-1201447900/


----------



## Abishai100

*Oswald's Oligarchy*

I'll keep following what's going on with the Penguin on "Gotham" (Fox TV).

It's nice to think we have a 'picture' of a creepy crime-maniac like Oswald Cobblepot roaming around prophetic and gloomy Gotham City and reminding us of the general strangeness of planet Earth.






Gotham City (Batman Wikia)


----------



## Abishai100

*Hats Off: Pesky Polaroids*


The reason I think that the Mad Hatter should make an appearance on "Gotham" (Fox TV) is because he would give the show the right tone it needs to paint Gotham City as an urbanization-paranoia symbol of _intentionality hellfire_.

Maybe an under-used but hard-working American actor such as Jason Priestly could portray a young Dr. Jervis Tetch (the future Mad Hatter).







Batman: City of Crime (Wikipedia)


----------



## JoeB131

Abishai100 said:


> The reason I think that the Mad Hatter should make an appearance on "Gotham" (Fox TV) is because he would give the show the right tone it needs to paint Gotham City as an urbanization-paranoia symbol of _intentionality hellfire_.
> 
> Maybe an under-used but hard-working American actor such as Jason Priestly could portray a young Dr. Jervis Tetch (the future Mad Hatter).



Or maybe they can stop trying to shoehorn in every minor villian...


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Abishai100 said:


> *Hats Off: Pesky Polaroids*
> 
> 
> The reason I think that the Mad Hatter should make an appearance on "Gotham" (Fox TV) is because he would give the show the right tone it needs to paint Gotham City as an urbanization-paranoia symbol of _intentionality hellfire_.
> 
> Maybe an under-used but hard-working American actor such as Jason Priestly could portray a young Dr. Jervis Tetch (the future Mad Hatter).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Batman: City of Crime (Wikipedia)
> 
> View attachment 39329



yeah since it looks like we probably wont see him this year,he for sure needs to make one next year.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

cant believe nobody has replied to last nights episode.and to the OP how come i did not get a tag from you recently like i have before?


----------



## longknife

9/11 inside job said:


> cant believe nobody has replied to last nights episode.and to the OP how come i did not get a tag from you recently like i have before?


Not quite sure what you want us to post.

A lot of stuff went on.


----------



## Aktas

For the first it produces interest..


----------



## LA RAM FAN

longknife said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> cant believe nobody has replied to last nights episode.and to the OP how come i did not get a tag from you recently like i have before?
> 
> 
> 
> Not quite sure what you want us to post.
> 
> A lot of stuff went on.
Click to expand...

Its a NEW episode.there should be a lot of talk about it.


----------



## Harry Dresden

9/11 inside job said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> cant believe nobody has replied to last nights episode.and to the OP how come i did not get a tag from you recently like i have before?
> 
> 
> 
> Not quite sure what you want us to post.
> 
> A lot of stuff went on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its a NEW episode.there should be a lot of talk about it.
Click to expand...

it was a new episode last week too.....


----------



## LA RAM FAN

thats what Im saying.Looks like nobody around here wants to talk about the show anymore.


----------



## Harry Dresden

9/11 inside job said:


> thats what Im saying.Looks like nobody around here wants to talk about the show anymore.


start talking....i think it was a pleasant surprise,i initially thought this show would suck....im glad i was wrong,i like it.....the guy who plays Cobblepot is great....


----------



## longknife

I think all of the characters are interesting.

The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
Cobblepot.
All of them.
I like the way the plot is moving along.


----------



## Harry Dresden

longknife said:


> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.


its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
Click to expand...


Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :

The Walking Dead
Daredevil
Constantine/Gotham (tie)
Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
Arrow
The Flash
Agent Carter
The Strain

I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
Click to expand...

what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....


----------



## longknife

I watch but really don't like S.H.I.E.L.D. that much.


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
Click to expand...


Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.


----------



## Harry Dresden

longknife said:


> I watch but really don't like S.H.I.E.L.D. that much.


Shield needs more super beings making appearances.....like Iron Man or Capt America....


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.
Click to expand...

i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....
Click to expand...


Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!  

Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!
> 
> Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.
Click to expand...

i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> 
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!
> 
> Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....
Click to expand...


Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.

I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.


----------



## peach174

I think that many got turned off when they started showing old reruns and said it was new shows for the 2nd season.

I liked the 1st season but stopped watching the 2nd season because of that.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!
> 
> Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.
> 
> I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.
Click to expand...

how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> thats what Im saying.Looks like nobody around here wants to talk about the show anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> start talking....i think it was a pleasant surprise,i initially thought this show would suck....im glad i was wrong,i like it.....the guy who plays Cobblepot is great....
Click to expand...

I knew from seeing the very first episode it was going to be awesome.I love the skyviews of Gotham.that so much makes the show.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
Click to expand...


Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.

What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.

I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.

It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?

 He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.

I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.

I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.

I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.

They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.

The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.

same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
Click to expand...


There's a Daredevil show on? seriously? when,what channel? 

Also I been hearing about The Flash being a tv show and all but when is that on,I never heard about that airing or anything?


----------



## Harry Dresden

9/11 inside job said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
Click to expand...

Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....


----------



## Harry Dresden

9/11 inside job said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a Daredevil show on? seriously? when,what channel?
> 
> Also I been hearing about The Flash being a tv show and all but when is that on,I never heard about that airing or anything?
Click to expand...

Daredevil just started on Netflix.....and the Flash is finishing up his 1st season on the CW....and Arrow is finishing up season 2 also on the CW.....and Agents of Shield are on ABC....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lots of things annoy me about those shows.  Primarily it's the poor writing.  That is worse with The Flash, but occurs commonly in both shows.  With The Flash, in almost every dangerous situation, he could easily escape or prevent whatever is happening simply by using his speed, but the writers continuously have him stop using that speed for dramatic effect, despite how ridiculous it is.  With Arrow, there's the people learning to be martial arts masters in almost no time, people using guns always being incredibly terrible shots, etc.  Both shows also go too heavily on the CW-style drama.
> 
> 
> 
> i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!
> 
> Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.
> 
> I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......
Click to expand...


I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.  

So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> i blame that on writers who are not comic fans....Greg Berlanti the show runner of both shows is not as comic book savvy as he thinks he is....just by the way he has fucked up the Atom shows that.....and why not the Green Arrow,instead of just Arrow?.... i mean thats who the guy is supposed to be....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!
> 
> Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.
> 
> I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.
> 
> So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.
Click to expand...

*The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, I'm fine with that part of it.  I don't like Green Arrow all that much.  Just getting rid of the hat is a huge improvement!
> 
> Not being comic fans might have something to do with it, but really, I think it's more to do with being on the CW.  That network looks for a certain feel to their shows which doesn't seem to lend itself to exceptional writing.  They are more concerned with pretty young actors and angst.
> 
> 
> 
> i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.
> 
> I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.
> 
> So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
> matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....
Click to expand...


The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.

As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> i agree with what you said about the CW,but right now they are the no.1 network doing comics....maybe Netflix will change how the CW looks at things....and if the guy is supposed to be the Green Arrow....thats what he should be called...i agree about that dumbass hat ....never understood how it stayed on his head.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.
> 
> I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.
> 
> So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
> matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.
> 
> As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.
Click to expand...

like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, I think that CW keeps shows on the air with far lower ratings than the major networks.  I don't think Arrow or Flash would have gotten extensions if they were on NBC, CBS, ABC or Fox.  CW has a lower viewership so is willing to accept fewer viewers.
> 
> I think The Walking Dead is far, far better than anything that's ever been on CW.  If I had to choose between watching Walking Dead or watching Arrow, Flash, and whatever the spinoff from those shows is going to be, I'd go with TWD.  So for me, AMC is currently the best network doing comics.  Netflix did a great job with Daredevil and have more Marvel shows in the works, so I'd put them at 2.
> 
> 
> 
> how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.
> 
> So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
> matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.
> 
> As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....
Click to expand...


I don't think young girls are a big demographic of The Walking Dead.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> how can AMC be the no 1 network with only 1 show?....CW has 2 with i believe 2 more on the way....Netflix has one with a couple more on the way....AMC? 1 with how many coming up?....none that i can see.......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.
> 
> So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
> matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.
> 
> As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think young girls are a big demographic of The Walking Dead.
Click to expand...

well older women are, the younger ones are into the Vampires....either way the great majority of the viewers of that show could not tell you who the Flash is....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> I would say AMC is #1 in two ways.  First, in quality.  The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash, the one show is worth more than the two on CW.  The second way is ratings.  I don't know the numbers, but The Walking Dead is one of the highest rated shows on cable in terms of viewership.  Arrow and Flash, from what I've read, are not nearly so widely watched.  I think that TWD has gotten as many as 20 million viewers for an episode, while Arrow's best is something like 4 million.  I don't know if Flash has exceeded Arrow or not, but I doubt it would be by much if it has.
> 
> So more people watch The Walking Dead and it is a far, far better show than Arrow or Flash.  AMC may only have 1 comic book based show, but it is the best and most popular such show.
> 
> 
> 
> *The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
> matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.
> 
> As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think young girls are a big demographic of The Walking Dead.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well older women are, the younger ones are into the Vampires....either way the great majority of the viewers of that show could not tell you who the Flash is....
Click to expand...


Comic book movies have been popular enough that, if the show is good enough, I'd think they would get a decent amount of non-comic reading audience.  Maybe DC needs to put out some more good movies first.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> *The Walking Dead is so much better than Arrow and Flash*
> matter of opinion....people seem to have a fascination with zombies and vampires...when that fascination starts to fade watch the ratings fade... .the super hero shows are watched mostly by the comic book crowd and their ratings have been pretty consistent with that viewership for years....many who watch TWD can care less about shows dealing with super heros.......a different crowd.....and AMC has a new show coming up..."Fear of the Walking Dead".... yet another zombie show.....what i found funny is i was reading comments about the popularity of TWD....this one lady who is a major fan was asked if she watches the Vampire Diaries....she said that show is silly.....but a bunch of mindless dead people running amok is not i guess....its all what you like.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.
> 
> As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think young girls are a big demographic of The Walking Dead.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well older women are, the younger ones are into the Vampires....either way the great majority of the viewers of that show could not tell you who the Flash is....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Comic book movies have been popular enough that, if the show is good enough, I'd think they would get a decent amount of non-comic reading audience.  Maybe DC needs to put out some more good movies first.
Click to expand...

going to a movie is a lot different than watching TV......the only people that will watch a super hero show on TV week after week are the people into super hero type of stuff.....the comic book readers or those who did at one time in their lives.....if WD gets 18 million viewers,14 million of them can care less about the Flash,no matter how good it may be....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Walking Dead has better production, writing, and acting than Arrow or The Flash.    Of course most of this is subjective, but just as a matter of internal consistency I'll take TWD over either of the CW shows.
> 
> As to watching the ratings fade, TWD has had at least 5 times as many viewers for an episode as Arrow ever has.  Even if the viewership wanes, I'm confident that Arrow will never reach the kind of popularity that TWD has.  The show simply isn't well made enough.  Another comic book show might do as well (Daredevil showed me that comic book hero shows can be done very well) but the CW just has not, to this point, made the kinds of shows that appeal to large audiences.
> 
> 
> 
> like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think young girls are a big demographic of The Walking Dead.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well older women are, the younger ones are into the Vampires....either way the great majority of the viewers of that show could not tell you who the Flash is....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Comic book movies have been popular enough that, if the show is good enough, I'd think they would get a decent amount of non-comic reading audience.  Maybe DC needs to put out some more good movies first.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> going to a movie is a lot different than watching TV......the only people that will watch a super hero show on TV week after week are the people into super hero type of stuff.....the comic book readers or those who did at one time in their lives.....if WD gets 18 million viewers,14 million of them can care less about the Flash,no matter how good it may be....
Click to expand...


TV and movies certainly are different.  My point, though, is that the popularity of comic book movies should lead to more people at least giving comic book TV shows a chance.  It wasn't just comic book readers who got the first Avengers movie to $1.5 billion.  I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the first episode viewers of Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. were non-comic readers.  Of course, the show wasn't good enough to hook most of them.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

I hope that someday in the future that since we have now had the story of Supermans adventures when he was growing up learning his powers in Smallville-"like I said,the first couple seasons were good,got way too stupid after that though and should have never gone past 5 seasons."

With Smallville and now Gotham,I would like them to someday make a spiderman  show with him as a kid growing up as well like they are with Gothem,spiderman being my favorite marvel character and all.

Show the time he spent with his parents and the events that led them to have his uncle and aunt adopt him.they could talk about his scientific genius and we could see the future villains origins before they went bad as well like they are doing with Gothem.

they could do the same thing with captain stacy they are with Jim Gordon,have him investigating the crimes of the future villains as well before he became someone with high rank..dont you think that would be interesting?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
Click to expand...



did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?

Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> like i said.....the majority of viewers of super hero shows are fans of super hero comics.....the Walking Dead is watched by many people who have never picked up a Flash or Batman comic in their life and probably never will...many young girls have been swept up in the craze,especially the Vampire thing......i will take a super hero show over fucking zombies any day of the week....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think young girls are a big demographic of The Walking Dead.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well older women are, the younger ones are into the Vampires....either way the great majority of the viewers of that show could not tell you who the Flash is....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Comic book movies have been popular enough that, if the show is good enough, I'd think they would get a decent amount of non-comic reading audience.  Maybe DC needs to put out some more good movies first.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> going to a movie is a lot different than watching TV......the only people that will watch a super hero show on TV week after week are the people into super hero type of stuff.....the comic book readers or those who did at one time in their lives.....if WD gets 18 million viewers,14 million of them can care less about the Flash,no matter how good it may be....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> TV and movies certainly are different.  My point, though, is that the popularity of comic book movies should lead to more people at least giving comic book TV shows a chance.  It wasn't just comic book readers who got the first Avengers movie to $1.5 billion.  I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the first episode viewers of Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. were non-comic readers.  Of course, the show wasn't good enough to hook most of them.
Click to expand...

it took more than just Americans to get that 1.5 billion.....and i know fans of Scify/fantasy who cant get into superhero stuff.....so i repeat,there is generally only one type of person who will watch something like the Flash on TV,week after week......those who read the comics and those who are very receptive to super hero type stuff....otherwise most people can give a shit....but i understand what your saying,you would think super hero TV would be bigger than what it is....i watch all of them,i am mysteriously drawn towards them....


----------



## Harry Dresden

9/11 inside job said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?
> 
> Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.
Click to expand...


*did you stop watching it after the first five years as well *
nope...kept going till the end,thats the way i am with Comic stuff....it has to be really bad for me not to watch....

and the last episode he flew costume and all in the last minute of the series.....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?
> 
> Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *did you stop watching it after the first five years as well *
> nope...kept going till the end,thats the way i am with Comic stuff....it has to be really bad for me not to watch....
> 
> and the last episode he flew costume and all in the last minute of the series.....
Click to expand...


I watched till the end as well, but damn, I shouldn't have.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?
> 
> Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *did you stop watching it after the first five years as well *
> nope...kept going till the end,thats the way i am with Comic stuff....it has to be really bad for me not to watch....
> 
> and the last episode he flew costume and all in the last minute of the series.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched till the end as well, but damn, I shouldn't have.
Click to expand...


----------



## longknife

Back to Gotham -

I thought last night's episode was most interesting.

Bruce learning what he did. What is that going to do for his future?

Saving Barbara and telling his girlfriend he loves her.

Penguin being a read sneaky bird.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?
> 
> Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *did you stop watching it after the first five years as well *
> nope...kept going till the end,thats the way i am with Comic stuff....it has to be really bad for me not to watch....
> 
> and the last episode he flew costume and all in the last minute of the series.....
Click to expand...



not a true statement at all from you since smallville DID get really bad after  five years and ran out of juice.

 well glad you were able to sit through all that crap for all those years since you knew the answer.

its almost as if that show copied off 90210.I really do believe they did,too many coincidences. within 5 years as in 90210,the parents leave the home only difference being the father did not die in 90210,one of the characters left after the first season,and most importantly,it ALSO stayed on for ten years. far too many similaritys.


----------



## Aktas

Gotham cityy


----------



## LA RAM FAN

longknife said:


> Back to Gotham -
> 
> I thought last night's episode was most interesting.
> 
> Bruce learning what he did. What is that going to do for his future?
> 
> Saving Barbara and telling his girlfriend he loves her.
> 
> Penguin being a read sneaky bird.


last nights episode just proves the world is more violent than it ever has.Its disturbing to me that this show isnt even on a cable network and yet we saw rated R material in that show last night with slasher killings and practically nude people walking around and advertising how sleazy and sick minded they are with sex toys in the like.

Looks like we have two more episodes actually.they did not say next weeks was the season finale.


----------



## Harry Dresden

9/11 inside job said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?
> 
> Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *did you stop watching it after the first five years as well *
> nope...kept going till the end,thats the way i am with Comic stuff....it has to be really bad for me not to watch....
> 
> and the last episode he flew costume and all in the last minute of the series.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> not a true statement at all from you since smallville DID get really bad after  five years and ran out of juice.
> 
> well glad you were able to sit through all that crap for all those years since you knew the answer.
> 
> its almost as if that show copied off 90210.I really do believe they did,too many coincidences. within 5 years as in 90210,the parents leave the home only difference being the father did not die in 90210,one of the characters left after the first season,and most importantly,it ALSO stayed on for ten years. far too many similaritys.
Click to expand...

you are telling me i watched crap and you are bringing up fucking 90210?....


----------



## Montrovant

9/11 inside job said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back to Gotham -
> 
> I thought last night's episode was most interesting.
> 
> Bruce learning what he did. What is that going to do for his future?
> 
> Saving Barbara and telling his girlfriend he loves her.
> 
> Penguin being a read sneaky bird.
> 
> 
> 
> last nights episode just proves the world is more violent than it ever has.Its disturbing to me that this show isnt even on a cable network and yet we saw rated R material in that show last night with slasher killings and practically nude people walking around and advertising how sleazy and sick minded they are with sex toys in the like.
> 
> Looks like we have two more episodes actually.they did not say next weeks was the season finale.
Click to expand...


Watch The Following, or better yet, Hannibal.  Those are both on network TV and closer to R rated than Gotham.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Montrovant said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back to Gotham -
> 
> I thought last night's episode was most interesting.
> 
> Bruce learning what he did. What is that going to do for his future?
> 
> Saving Barbara and telling his girlfriend he loves her.
> 
> Penguin being a read sneaky bird.
> 
> 
> 
> last nights episode just proves the world is more violent than it ever has.Its disturbing to me that this show isnt even on a cable network and yet we saw rated R material in that show last night with slasher killings and practically nude people walking around and advertising how sleazy and sick minded they are with sex toys in the like.
> 
> Looks like we have two more episodes actually.they did not say next weeks was the season finale.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Watch The Following, or better yet, Hannibal.  Those are both on network TV and closer to R rated than Gotham.
Click to expand...


Oh I know.I am a HUGE kevin bacon fan with Footloose being my favorite move of all time-hollywood is clearly running out of ideas the fact they are making so many remakes with that new crappy remake they made CRAPLOOSE.

 Since Bacon is in it I tried watching it a couple times and I have not brought myself back to watch a third episode since then nor will I in the future  even with Bacon in the starring role.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed.I think the reason we havent seen Mad Hatter yet and some of the others is because they dont want to rush things.You dont want to introduce ALL the bay guys in the same season.
> 
> What I dont understand is why Cobblepot-the future Penguin is getting all the attention.Why he is the one that gets all the special paid attention over the other featured villians.
> 
> I assume you used to watch Smallville? I feel good that this show wont get  ruined like that show was eventually.
> 
> It was good the first couple years but after that,it lost its juice.That show got stupid after the first couple of seasons when they brought in Lois Lane. WTF?
> 
> He never met Lois in Smallville for god sakes!!!!!!  I tolerated it when they brought her in and kept watching it but the final nail in the coffin where i could not tolerate it anymore was after they killed off Jonathan Kent.
> 
> I had no problem with them killing him off.That wasnt the issue with me.What was the issue for me was they killed him off too soon.
> 
> I stopped watching it after the fourth season when they killed him off that year.He was a big part of the reason why that show was so great.
> 
> I was glad when that show FINALLY went off the air.It stayed on far too long.They should never have kept it on after the fifth season and certainly not for 10 seasons.
> 
> They did the same thing with that show that the did with beverly hills 90210. They had the parents leave the show way too early.that was part of the downfall of the show.same with smallville.
> 
> The other thing i hated about smallviile was so many people finding out his identity.Pete should have been the ONLY one to have found out.nobody else after that.When they had Chloe find out,it got beyond stupid.you just knew at that point eventually Lana was going to find out also.
> 
> same as 90210,a show that stayed on far too long than it should have.
> 
> 
> 
> Smallville painted themselves into a corner....once again Greg Berlanti showing how little he knows about comics....they made Clark look like a kryptonian retard ....every other Kryptonian could immediately fly except Clark....that show had a lot of holes in it....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> did you stop watching it after the first five years as well when it got too stupid or did you stay till the end? I would like to find out if he ever ended up flying in the last season like in the last couple episodes or so,have any idea on that?
> 
> Back to Gothem now.another new episode tonight.I think this is the second to last new one for the year I believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *did you stop watching it after the first five years as well *
> nope...kept going till the end,thats the way i am with Comic stuff....it has to be really bad for me not to watch....
> 
> and the last episode he flew costume and all in the last minute of the series.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> not a true statement at all from you since smallville DID get really bad after  five years and ran out of juice.
> 
> well glad you were able to sit through all that crap for all those years since you knew the answer.
> 
> its almost as if that show copied off 90210.I really do believe they did,too many coincidences. within 5 years as in 90210,the parents leave the home only difference being the father did not die in 90210,one of the characters left after the first season,and most importantly,it ALSO stayed on for ten years. far too many similaritys.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you are telling me i watched crap and you are bringing up fucking 90210?....
Click to expand...


the show only became crap after season two dude.first two seasons were awesome.

as I said,two shows that stayed on wayyyyyyy  far too long than they ever should have been allowed to.

the facts are BOTH shows eventually became crap.smallville was fun longer than 90210 no doubit.It did not become crap till the middle of season four.90210 became crap after season two but what difference does it make since they BOTH became a couple of crapfest shows within five years.

the writers of both shows  should be hung up by their balls for the crap they came up with  eventually.

I just hope Gothem doesnt suffer the same fate they did in the future down the road.With hollywood though,I would not hold my breath.they always run out of creative ideas these days it seems which is why they are making so many remakes of tv shows and movies now that they have run out of ideas for new material.


----------



## Harry Dresden

*the show only became crap after season two dude.first two seasons were awesome.*
if you say so "dude".....


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Okay now that it has been established that both shows 90210 and Smallville became UTTER CRAP within five years,back to the topic of the thread here. Gothem.

I actually am optimistic that Gothem wont suffer the same fate that Smallville did and become utter crap within five years and feel good that it could actually remain a good quality show for at least ten years because of my previous reasons for why Smallville turned into a joke.

This is what doomed smallville.

1.Everybody was finding out his identity.Nobody other than Pete should have discovered that.

Well all these events in Gothem take place while he is a kid and growing up so that wont be an issue here.

2.Lex Luther was the only real villian you got to see the origin of.You just had ONE future villain you got to see transform,there is only so much you can do with one future villain.

Gothem doesnt have that problem,it holds your attention the fact we are getting to see so many of them in their younger days before they became known for their namesake.they can bulid that up for many years.that will be fun to watch,with so many of them to work with,this show can last a long time i believe.

3.bringing Lois Lane into smallville was what did in this show.I remember countless number of fans back then saying the same thing ,that they also thought that was so stupid when they brought her to smallville since he is not suppose to see her till he goes to metropolis,let alone meet her in high school no less.freaking idiots. they could not overcome that goof.

That wont happen with Gothem.

4.then the ultimate monstrocity was killing jonathan kent off as soon as they did and have the parents leave the house so early.as i said before,i had nothing against them killing him off,just that it happened way wayyyyy too god damn early.

I tolerated it when Lois came into town and lived with them and had to hear the annoying -hey smallville crap from her,but the COMBINATION of those two was far too much for the show to overcome and became beyond stupid.

as i said before,it looks like they were clearly following the stupid path 90210 went down which was one of the things that ruined that show.

This also wont happen with Gothem because his parents have already been killed and alfred wont die until he at least becomes batman.

so none of the stuff that plauged smallville will happen in Gothem which makes this show look promising the fact they can do so many stuff with the multiple characters over the years and introduce the new villains along the way each year as well.


----------



## peach174

When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.


----------



## Uncensored2008

Montrovant said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back to Gotham -
> 
> I thought last night's episode was most interesting.
> 
> Bruce learning what he did. What is that going to do for his future?
> 
> Saving Barbara and telling his girlfriend he loves her.
> 
> Penguin being a read sneaky bird.
> 
> 
> 
> last nights episode just proves the world is more violent than it ever has.Its disturbing to me that this show isnt even on a cable network and yet we saw rated R material in that show last night with slasher killings and practically nude people walking around and advertising how sleazy and sick minded they are with sex toys in the like.
> 
> Looks like we have two more episodes actually.they did not say next weeks was the season finale.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Watch The Following, or better yet, Hannibal.  Those are both on network TV and closer to R rated than Gotham.
Click to expand...


The Following is the DUMBEST show on TV. 

Did Joe escape AGAIN?


----------



## Montrovant

Uncensored2008 said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back to Gotham -
> 
> I thought last night's episode was most interesting.
> 
> Bruce learning what he did. What is that going to do for his future?
> 
> Saving Barbara and telling his girlfriend he loves her.
> 
> Penguin being a read sneaky bird.
> 
> 
> 
> last nights episode just proves the world is more violent than it ever has.Its disturbing to me that this show isnt even on a cable network and yet we saw rated R material in that show last night with slasher killings and practically nude people walking around and advertising how sleazy and sick minded they are with sex toys in the like.
> 
> Looks like we have two more episodes actually.they did not say next weeks was the season finale.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Watch The Following, or better yet, Hannibal.  Those are both on network TV and closer to R rated than Gotham.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Following is the DUMBEST show on TV.
> 
> Did Joe escape AGAIN?
Click to expand...


I've only seen the first 2 seasons, so I have no idea lol.  I thought the first season was very good, then it tapered off in the second.  It's a premise that has a shelf life, at least if you use the same characters.


----------



## Harry Dresden

peach174 said:


> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.


Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....


----------



## Politico

Harry Dresden said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
Click to expand...

The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
Click to expand...

the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....


----------



## LA RAM FAN

peach174 said:


> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.


i thought this WAS the first season?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
Click to expand...


yeah she must have been getting Gothem mixed up with Sleep Hollow i guess since that show comes on afterward and this is THEIR second season.


----------



## peach174

9/11 inside job said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
Click to expand...


It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?


----------



## peach174

9/11 inside job said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yeah she must have been getting Gothem mixed up with Sleep Hollow i guess since that show comes on afterward and this is THEIR second season.
Click to expand...


I am not getting them mixed up.


----------



## Montrovant

peach174 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
> I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
> I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?
Click to expand...


Lots of shows do mid-season breaks.


----------



## peach174

Montrovant said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
> I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
> I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lots of shows do mid-season breaks.
Click to expand...


Yes
Gotham went off the air for their mid-season break, after the March 2nd- episode18th showing.
Then they showed reruns that started on March 23rd, 30th and the 6th.
If they had just stayed off the air like most shows do and then started the19th episode on April 13th I think that more people would have stayed with the show.
When they kept doing the reruns I stopped watching like many did and I had no idea when the new episodes started.
I found out later that it was new on April 13th.


----------



## Harry Dresden

peach174 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
> I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
> I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?
Click to expand...

Gotham,according to their episode guide,and at least where i live, showed their first 10 episodes without a break from Sept 22nd to Nov 24th,then was off too Jan.5th....then ran without a break until March 2nd.....


----------



## peach174

Harry Dresden said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
> I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
> I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Gotham,according to their episode guide,and at least where i live, showed their first 10 episodes without a break from Sept 22nd to Nov 24th,then was off too Jan.5th....then ran without a break until March 2nd.....
Click to expand...


Yes that is why I am saying that many viewers got turned off by doing the shows that way.
I really like the show but I'm not going to keep checking when they come on again and continue to watch reruns till there are new shows.


----------



## Harry Dresden

peach174 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
> I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
> I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Gotham,according to their episode guide,and at least where i live, showed their first 10 episodes without a break from Sept 22nd to Nov 24th,then was off too Jan.5th....then ran without a break until March 2nd.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes that is why I am saying that many viewers got turned off by doing the shows that way.
> I really like the show but I'm not going to keep checking when they come on again and continue to watch reruns till there are new shows.
Click to expand...

i agree.....the constant breaks,especially the longer ones are turning people off.....one of the reasons companies like Netflix are getting so popular,you create your own breaks....


----------



## Montrovant

Harry Dresden said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> i thought this WAS the first season?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It was the 1st season- then it was off the air for 2 or 3 weeks (I don't know why) then came back on with repeat episodes saying that it was new episodes.
> I thought that it was the 2nd season when it came back on after being off the air for about  2 or 3 weeks.
> I guess is was still the 1st season, but why did it go off for 2 or 3 weeks and then showed old episodes when it came back on again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Gotham,according to their episode guide,and at least where i live, showed their first 10 episodes without a break from Sept 22nd to Nov 24th,then was off too Jan.5th....then ran without a break until March 2nd.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes that is why I am saying that many viewers got turned off by doing the shows that way.
> I really like the show but I'm not going to keep checking when they come on again and continue to watch reruns till there are new shows.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i agree.....the constant breaks,especially the longer ones are turning people off.....one of the reasons companies like Netflix are getting so popular,you create your own breaks....
Click to expand...


The new David Duchovny show is actually going to be available in full for a month or so after release.  It's on one of the old networks, they are going to have the entire season on their website for a while as an experiment.


----------



## Politico

Harry Dresden said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think all of the characters are interesting.
> 
> The young girl who will become Cat Woman.
> Cobblepot.
> All of them.
> I like the way the plot is moving along.
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....
Click to expand...

Yeah no shit. The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941. And I said the Flash was a man not a Millennial man boy. And he was more than a few years older. And he designed his own suit. And the Cosmic Treadmill which is how he actually traveled through time not by running. And he was married to Iris who he did not grow up with. And he became the Flash through a lightning induced chemical spill. Fact is other than the mother/father storyline the whole series is made up. So yeah what a difference. If you want some more schooling from a guy who actually read the comics let me know.


----------



## Uncensored2008

Harry Dresden said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
Click to expand...


Fox does repeat a lot, but just set your DVR to record only new shows and it isn't a problem. Gotham is phenomenally well written. I'm not usually a comic book show fan, but this is a top notch show.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> its one of the best done Comic related shows that has been on....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah no shit. The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941. And I said the Flash was a man not a Millennial man boy. And he was more than a few years older. And he designed his own suit. And the Cosmic Treadmill which is how he actually traveled through time not by running. And he was married to Iris who he did not grow up with. And he became the Flash through a lightning induced chemical spill. Fact is other than the mother/father storyline the whole series is made up. So yeah what a difference. If you want some more schooling from a guy who actually read the comics let me know.
Click to expand...

*The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941*
who was based on the Green Archer with obvious Batman influences....
you are talking to someone who was raised in the 50's and 60's reading these things....and if you,mr comic book fan,dont realize by now that these guys change things to suite their own agendas,or to "up date" them, than you havent been paying attention..... i had this comic when it came out...i know all about the treadmill....and Cisco has developed a treadmill that they use to test Barry's speed and will no doubt turn into the time traveling one as the series goes on.....


----------



## Harry Dresden

Uncensored2008 said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fox does repeat a lot, but just set your DVR to record only new shows and it isn't a problem. Gotham is phenomenally well written. I'm not usually a comic book show fan, but this is a top notch show.
Click to expand...

looks like at the end of this weeks episode they find the "Bat-Cave"....


----------



## Politico

Harry Dresden said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fox does repeat a lot, but just set your DVR to record only new shows and it isn't a problem. Gotham is phenomenally well written. I'm not usually a comic book show fan, but this is a top notch show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> looks like at the end of this weeks episode they find the "Bat-Cave"....
Click to expand...

Which didn't exist yet lol.



Harry Dresden said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Of the shows on now based on comics, I'd rank them like this :
> 
> The Walking Dead
> Daredevil
> Constantine/Gotham (tie)
> Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
> Arrow
> The Flash
> Agent Carter
> The Strain
> 
> I gave up on The Strain and Agent Carter after a few episodes.  Arrow and Flash annoy me too often, I find myself thinking I might be better off not watching them.   Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has gotten better, although it's still not great.  Gotham and Constantine are both quality network shows.  Daredevil was quite good.  The Walking Dead is probably the best show on TV right now.
> 
> 
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah no shit. The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941. And I said the Flash was a man not a Millennial man boy. And he was more than a few years older. And he designed his own suit. And the Cosmic Treadmill which is how he actually traveled through time not by running. And he was married to Iris who he did not grow up with. And he became the Flash through a lightning induced chemical spill. Fact is other than the mother/father storyline the whole series is made up. So yeah what a difference. If you want some more schooling from a guy who actually read the comics let me know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941*
> who was based on the Green Archer with obvious Batman influences....
> you are talking to someone who was raised in the 50's and 60's reading these things....and if you,mr comic book fan,dont realize by now that these guys change things to suite their own agendas,or to "up date" them, than you havent been paying attention..... i had this comic when it came out...i know all about the treadmill....and Cisco has developed a treadmill that they use to test Barry's speed and will no doubt turn into the time traveling one as the series goes on.....
> View attachment 40669
Click to expand...

Your whole rebuttal is based on an argument I never made. I know they make changes. The whole current Marvel train wreck is proof of that. I simply said the Flash was miscast. Gustin is one of the androgenous manboys with 12 year old haircuts and the verbal affect of a wet mop that are pervasive in Hollywood.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fox does repeat a lot, but just set your DVR to record only new shows and it isn't a problem. Gotham is phenomenally well written. I'm not usually a comic book show fan, but this is a top notch show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> looks like at the end of this weeks episode they find the "Bat-Cave"....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Which didn't exist yet lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah no shit. The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941. And I said the Flash was a man not a Millennial man boy. And he was more than a few years older. And he designed his own suit. And the Cosmic Treadmill which is how he actually traveled through time not by running. And he was married to Iris who he did not grow up with. And he became the Flash through a lightning induced chemical spill. Fact is other than the mother/father storyline the whole series is made up. So yeah what a difference. If you want some more schooling from a guy who actually read the comics let me know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941*
> who was based on the Green Archer with obvious Batman influences....
> you are talking to someone who was raised in the 50's and 60's reading these things....and if you,mr comic book fan,dont realize by now that these guys change things to suite their own agendas,or to "up date" them, than you havent been paying attention..... i had this comic when it came out...i know all about the treadmill....and Cisco has developed a treadmill that they use to test Barry's speed and will no doubt turn into the time traveling one as the series goes on.....
> View attachment 40669
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your whole rebuttal is based on an argument I never made. I know they make changes. The whole current Marvel train wreck is proof of that. I simply said the Flash was miscast. Gustin is one of the androgenous manboys with 12 year old haircuts and the verbal affect of a wet mop that are pervasive in Hollywood.
Click to expand...

*Which didn't exist yet lol.*
not the bat cave as we know it.....but those caves were in existence and used as a storehouse by his dad,so he knew about the caves and no doubt built the secret entrance for easy access to it.....and young Bruce has already fell into it from the outside but does not realize that the caves are under the house and what they are used for......a comic fan should know this.....now depending on what he and Alfred see when they get into it, we will see how distorted they will make it,they should only find a warehouse of sorts....and i would think Alfred would know of the entrance and the "storeroom".....


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fox does repeat a lot, but just set your DVR to record only new shows and it isn't a problem. Gotham is phenomenally well written. I'm not usually a comic book show fan, but this is a top notch show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> looks like at the end of this weeks episode they find the "Bat-Cave"....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Which didn't exist yet lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> what annoys you about arrow and the flash?.....what i dont like right now is how they are portraying the atom.....if they dont have him shrinking soon and getting rid of that pathetic costume i may not watch either.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah no shit. The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941. And I said the Flash was a man not a Millennial man boy. And he was more than a few years older. And he designed his own suit. And the Cosmic Treadmill which is how he actually traveled through time not by running. And he was married to Iris who he did not grow up with. And he became the Flash through a lightning induced chemical spill. Fact is other than the mother/father storyline the whole series is made up. So yeah what a difference. If you want some more schooling from a guy who actually read the comics let me know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941*
> who was based on the Green Archer with obvious Batman influences....
> you are talking to someone who was raised in the 50's and 60's reading these things....and if you,mr comic book fan,dont realize by now that these guys change things to suite their own agendas,or to "up date" them, than you havent been paying attention..... i had this comic when it came out...i know all about the treadmill....and Cisco has developed a treadmill that they use to test Barry's speed and will no doubt turn into the time traveling one as the series goes on.....
> View attachment 40669
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your whole rebuttal is based on an argument I never made. I know they make changes. The whole current Marvel train wreck is proof of that. I simply said the Flash was miscast. Gustin is one of the androgenous manboys with 12 year old haircuts and the verbal affect of a wet mop that are pervasive in Hollywood.
Click to expand...

yea lots of people think many of the heros have been miscast.....but if you want to show them what you can do.....make your own movie,but i am sure you will get the same shit from others like you out there....


----------



## Politico

I doubt it. But feel free to put up the money.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> I doubt it. But feel free to put up the money.


so are you saying if you cast the movie,it would be so well cast, no one will say you picked the wrong people?....


----------



## Politico

Harry Dresden said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I doubt it. But feel free to put up the money.
> 
> 
> 
> so are you saying if you cast the movie,it would be so well cast, no one will say you picked the wrong people?....
Click to expand...

I laugh when people ask stupid loaded questions. You know there is no thing in life every person agrees with.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Harry Dresden said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> When did they actually start showing new shows for the 2nd season for Gotham?
> I watched about 4 shows that said they were new, when they were reruns, so I stopped watching.
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is about to end their 1st season of 22 episodes....you got messed up somewhere in the beginning....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fox does repeat a lot, but just set your DVR to record only new shows and it isn't a problem. Gotham is phenomenally well written. I'm not usually a comic book show fan, but this is a top notch show.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> looks like at the end of this weeks episode they find the "Bat-Cave"....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Which didn't exist yet lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Arrow is made up and the Flash was miscast. The Flash in the conics was not a Milennial. He was a real man who could actually carry someone over 100 pounds a half block.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the Arrow is made up?....no shit.....and so in the comics the Barry there was a few years older?.....wow what a difference....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah no shit. The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941. And I said the Flash was a man not a Millennial man boy. And he was more than a few years older. And he designed his own suit. And the Cosmic Treadmill which is how he actually traveled through time not by running. And he was married to Iris who he did not grow up with. And he became the Flash through a lightning induced chemical spill. Fact is other than the mother/father storyline the whole series is made up. So yeah what a difference. If you want some more schooling from a guy who actually read the comics let me know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Arrow is a made up take on the Green Arrow who appeared in 1941*
> who was based on the Green Archer with obvious Batman influences....
> you are talking to someone who was raised in the 50's and 60's reading these things....and if you,mr comic book fan,dont realize by now that these guys change things to suite their own agendas,or to "up date" them, than you havent been paying attention..... i had this comic when it came out...i know all about the treadmill....and Cisco has developed a treadmill that they use to test Barry's speed and will no doubt turn into the time traveling one as the series goes on.....
> View attachment 40669
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your whole rebuttal is based on an argument I never made. I know they make changes. The whole current Marvel train wreck is proof of that. I simply said the Flash was miscast. Gustin is one of the androgenous manboys with 12 year old haircuts and the verbal affect of a wet mop that are pervasive in Hollywood.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Which didn't exist yet lol.*
> not the bat cave as we know it.....but those caves were in existence and used as a storehouse by his dad,so he knew about the caves and no doubt built the secret entrance for easy access to it.....and young Bruce has already fell into it from the outside but does not realize that the caves are under the house and what they are used for......a comic fan should know this.....now depending on what he and Alfred see when they get into it, we will see how distorted they will make it,they should only find a warehouse of sorts....and i would think Alfred would know of the entrance and the "storeroom".....
Click to expand...



will be interesting to see if they go into a lot of detail on that tonight.I sure hope so.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I doubt it. But feel free to put up the money.
> 
> 
> 
> so are you saying if you cast the movie,it would be so well cast, no one will say you picked the wrong people?....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I laugh when people ask stupid loaded questions. You know there is no thing in life every person agrees with.
Click to expand...

after i said....".make your own movie,*but i am sure you will get the same shit from others like you out there*"....you then said...."*I doubt i*t".....so what then do you doubt?....i took it to mean the casting.....


----------



## Politico

I doubt nothing.


----------



## longknife

*#Gotham Season One: The Long Game*


Can't figure out whether this is for or against the show. I sorta agree with some things but it's worth reading for fans (and critics) of the show @  Gotham Season One The Long Game RedState


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> I doubt nothing.


of course you dont.....in other words you said something that you cant back up,again,.....


----------



## Politico

I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.


----------



## longknife

Tsk. Tsk children. Play nice.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

okay last mondays episode made no sense at all.If Jim Gordons girlfriend was such a psycho nutcase killer this whole time,then why was she acting like an innocent nice girl victem crying about him getting ready to  to kill someone of her choosing to avoid him killing her when that dude was saying to her-who do you want me to kill? and she then replied something like-No I cant do that.

If she was so much against having someone killed,then why act all upset about him killing anybody when SHE killed her parents?


----------



## Montrovant

9/11 inside job said:


> okay last mondays episode made no sense at all.If Jim Gordons girlfriend was such a psycho nutcase killer this whole time,then why was she acting like an innocent nice girl victem crying about him getting ready to  to kill someone of her choosing to avoid him killing her when that dude was saying to her-who do you want me to kill? and she then replied something like-No I cant do that.
> 
> If she was so much against having someone killed,then why act all upset about him killing anybody when SHE killed her parents?



It's not that she's always been a killer, it's that her experience with the serial killer who kidnapped and mentally tortured her pushed her into becoming one.  At least, that seemed like the clear point to me.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.


right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........


----------



## longknife

9/11 inside job said:


> okay last mondays episode made no sense at all.If Jim Gordons girlfriend was such a psycho nutcase killer this whole time,then why was she acting like an innocent nice girl victem crying about him getting ready to  to kill someone of her choosing to avoid him killing her when that dude was saying to her-who do you want me to kill? and she then replied something like-No I cant do that.
> 
> If she was so much against having someone killed,then why act all upset about him killing anybody when SHE killed her parents?


Did you not see the episodes where she was having a fling with another female? There was lots in there to show her instability.


----------



## Politico

Harry Dresden said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
Click to expand...

Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.


----------



## Montrovant

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
Click to expand...


That's a huge success on the CW.


----------



## Montrovant

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
Click to expand...


That might be a success on the Playstation Network, too.  I don't know what kind of numbers they get, but Powers was renewed for a second season.


----------



## Montrovant

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
Click to expand...


Oh, and while Gotham's rating fell in the last few weeks of the season, the lowest viewership for an episode was 4.3 million and the show averaged 6.1 million viewers for the season.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
Click to expand...

i can see you look into things first........Gotham averages 6.1 million viewers.....and has been renewed....


----------



## Kosh

This show is ok, I like Arrow better. At least if we compare season 1 Arrow to Season 1 Gotham.

We will see what season 2 holds for Gotham..


----------



## LA RAM FAN

longknife said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> okay last mondays episode made no sense at all.If Jim Gordons girlfriend was such a psycho nutcase killer this whole time,then why was she acting like an innocent nice girl victem crying about him getting ready to  to kill someone of her choosing to avoid him killing her when that dude was saying to her-who do you want me to kill? and she then replied something like-No I cant do that.
> 
> If she was so much against having someone killed,then why act all upset about him killing anybody when SHE killed her parents?
> 
> 
> 
> Did you not see the episodes where she was having a fling with another female? There was lots in there to show her instability.
Click to expand...


yeah but its one thing to have a fling with another female but something else entirely different to kill someone.there are bi sexual women out there in the world who are good people you know?


It's not that she's always been a killer, it's that her experience with the serial killer who kidnapped and mentally tortured her pushed her into becoming one. At least, that seemed like the clear point to me.

I'll buy that.she was bitter towards her parents after all and having gone through that experience with him,that would push you over the edge no doubt.


----------



## Montrovant

Kosh said:


> This show is ok, I like Arrow better. At least if we compare season 1 Arrow to Season 1 Gotham.
> 
> We will see what season 2 holds for Gotham..



Arrow suffers from being a CW show.  They are all a bit too 'pretty' and overly dramatic.


----------



## Politico

Harry Dresden said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i can see you look into things first........Gotham averages 6.1 million viewers.....and has been renewed....
Click to expand...

No they barely pull in 4 million.


----------



## Montrovant

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i can see you look into things first........Gotham averages 6.1 million viewers.....and has been renewed....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No they barely pull in 4 million.
Click to expand...


Gotham did in fact average 6.1 million viewers for the season.  Only in the last 4 episodes did it fail to get over 5.5 million.

Gotham TV show on FOX latest ratings cancel or renew canceled renewed TV shows TV Series Finale


----------



## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i can see you look into things first........Gotham averages 6.1 million viewers.....and has been renewed....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No they barely pull in 4 million.
Click to expand...




Politico said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i can see you look into things first........Gotham averages 6.1 million viewers.....and has been renewed....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No they barely pull in 4 million.
Click to expand...

if they avg 6.1 mill for the season,how can they barely be doing 4?....the last 4 shows it dropped to 4,but otherwise it has never gone below 6 mill....but it has been renewed,so its up to the writers to get it back on track....


----------



## Harry Dresden

Montrovant said:


> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Politico said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have to back up anything. I did not make the stupid claim that you could make everyone happy.
> 
> 
> 
> right you did not....you implied that if you made the movie the great majority of film goers would have no problems with whom you cast....i said you would get the same complaints as the people now,you said.....i...doubt.....it..........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Split hairs all you want. Gotham barely pulls in 4 milllion viewers. Anywhere other than Fox that is a fail.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i can see you look into things first........Gotham averages 6.1 million viewers.....and has been renewed....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No they barely pull in 4 million.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotham did in fact average 6.1 million viewers for the season.  Only in the last 4 episodes did it fail to get over 5.5 million.
> 
> Gotham TV show on FOX latest ratings cancel or renew canceled renewed TV shows TV Series Finale
Click to expand...

it averages 8-9 with DVR recordings added in....


----------



## Abishai100

*Traffic Toolbag*


One reason that this show seems to grab our attention is that Gotham City represents a rather eerily realistic paranoia about loss of jurisprudence control in our age of high-traffic urbanization. In many ways, Batman (DC Comics) is America's rendition of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's diligent fictional super-detective Sherlock Holmes.

Lots of stories arise in the world of Batman (DC Comics) regarding 'nemeses gauntlets.'

"Joker, Penguin, the Red Hood Gang, the Riddler, and Two-Face (and his new treacherous girlfriend Harley Quinn) plan to take Gotham City's library hostage on Saturday afternoon. Bruce Wayne gets wind of this plan from Jim Gordon and decides to wear the cape and mask of the Dark Knight (Batman) and secure the city library by placing trumpets all along the roof of the library to detract any kind of terrorism."

Many Hollywood (USA) movies such as "Mean Streets" (1973) and "Dark City" (1998) deal with traffic-related crime paranoia, but perhaps "Gotham" (Fox TV) symbolizes psychological polka.

The Batman (DC Comics) adapted Hollywood (USA) movie "The Dark Knight Rises" (2012) which featured the Gotham City super-nemesis Bane presented a traffic-related city super-riot.

In many ways, "Gotham" (Fox TV) seems to resemble the imagery presented in the crime-experimentation film "Killing Zoe" (1994).





Killing Zoe (Wikipedia)


----------



## LA RAM FAN

hey your back,where you been? I thought you died or something the fact for a while you were sending me attachments on upcoming episodes then all of a sudden i never heard from you anymore as well as the fact you stopped posting about current episodes.


----------



## Abishai100

*Gotham's Ra's: Machination Moderator*

I've been watching "Gotham" (Fox TV) more or less the same way I read comic books --- with a laissez-faire spiritualism.

I'm satisfied with the atmospherics and casting on the show and the way they make me interested in the labors of the young Jim Gordon trying to manage a developing city criminality (with various henchmen and super-goons rising to prominence).

If there's something I'm still upset with it's the lack of appearance of Ra's al Ghul who is already on "Arrow" (The CW).

I think that "Gotham" (Fox TV) has enough character development to explore how a Gotham City villain such as Ra's could make everyone a bit pensive about _machinating overlords_.

David Duchovny was my early pick from 2014 to appear on the show as Ra's.

However, David Duchovny is now snatched by "Aquarius" (NBC), so maybe we'll see a comparably entertaining (and appropriate) American actor such as Jeremy Piven make an appearance somewhere if not on "Gotham" (Fox TV) as the irreplaceable Ra's al Ghul.

Machinations are, after all, what make Batman (DC Comics) stories about the multiplicity of villains so profitable.






Almost Got 'Im (Batman: The Animated Series)


----------



## Abishai100

*Notes & Nachos*

Well, I have a lot to say about the first season of "Gotham" (Fox TV), but I'll try to summarize.

1. I liked the development of Edward Nygma
2. I liked the introduction of the Red Hood Gang
3. I liked the overall work of Gordon and Bullock
4. satisfying acting and atmospherics
5. I liked how they created the aura of the Joker
6. I liked how Alfred was raising young Bruce
7. I liked Bruce and Selina's friendship
8. I wanted to see more focused criminal development of Penguin

Hopefully, the overall praises for "Gotham" (Fox TV) will generate enough audience appeal to warrant more seasons (a second, third, and fourth).

Maybe next season will focus on why exactly Gotham City is catering to the criminality sentiments that give rise to creeps such as the Dollmaker (a sort of comic book version of Leatherface).

I'd also not be surprised if I hear that "Gotham" (Fox TV) is generating enough fan interest in the Batman (DC Comics) franchise to warrant more Hollywood (USA) films:

++++
"Batman: Year One" (dir: Darren Aronofsky) --- starring Guy Pearce as Batman, Orlando Bloom as Black Mask, and Emily Blunt as Harley Quinn

"Gotham Knight" (dir: Paul Verhoeven) --- starring Jude Law as Batman, Macaulay Culkin as the Joker, and Stana Katic (James Bond girl) as Harley Quinn
++++


Thanks to those who read and followed.  I'm always on the lookout for high-quality Batman stickers.


----------



## Abishai100

*Hatter Hip*

I wasn't going to post anymore on this thread and simply read and follow what others were viewing, but after seeing the teaser trailers for Gotham Season 2, I have to say, I have a lot of thoughts going through my head that I felt were worth sharing.

The trailer featuring the host of villain armies and Arkham maniac teams and of course the rise of the Joker suggest that the "Gotham" (Fox TV) writers will be focusing on criminality atmospherics more, so maybe we'll see more of Nygma unraveling and Penguin rising to some sort of odd level of power.  I also hope they continue to develop the Bruce-Selina friendship.

I'd love to see an interesting actor such as Adrian Grenier showing up on Season 2 (or Season 3?) to portray a young Jervis Tetch (the future Mad Hatter).

The Comic Con Gotham Press Conference for Season 2 from YouTube is below.





Jervis Tetch


----------



## Abishai100

*Arkham Association*


"Where the world sees criminal lunatics, Theo Galavan (James Frain) sees potential. It's a new day for the Gotham City Police Department, but the new day could end up being a dark one as villains straight out of Arkham Asylum are running loose in "Gotham" Season 2, episode 2" (ibtimes.com).

The camera-work is more in-your-face in Season 2, and the characters are more representative of the symbolism of Arkham Asylum.  Maybe they are focusing in on Arkham to address fan criticism about not enough attention going to the development of Bruce Wayne.  Maybe they're focusing in on Arkham, since the stories seem to gel together there nicely.

Gotham City is, after all, the Mecca of criminal insanity --- that's what Bob Kane envisioned when he created the Dark Knight.

If we want to sell "Gotham" (Fox TV) as a new age media confetti about Halloween in America, then we should talk about the _psychology of disfigurement_.




Samhain


----------



## 2aguy

I hope the young Bruce Wayne actor starts working out.....Wayne was focused like a laser into becoming what he needed to be to fight the bad guys....


----------



## LA RAM FAN

2aguy said:


> I hope the young Bruce Wayne actor starts working out.....Wayne was focused like a laser into becoming what he needed to be to fight the bad guys....


Im sure eventually you will get your wish.remember alfred was parring with him once in boxing.Its just the second season and he is young.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Montrovant said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this going to be "Smallville" for Batman?
> 
> Ugh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think it is.  From what I've read this focuses more on Jim Gordon, with Wayne and the villains playing secondary roles.
> 
> Plus, it's not on the WB/UPN/CW.
Click to expand...

yeah the other difference in it as well is its not made for a family viewing audience.some of the shows for smallville were not either but that was only once in a while,this show is indeed very gothic.


----------



## longknife

Well, I watched last night's episode and, as usual, the ending left me hanging.

Is Penguin going to do a job on Galavan? He's sure going to try?

At what point will Jim and the new captain catch on to how dangerous Galavan is?

And I'm betting Future Cat Woman is going to somehow save Bruce from being taken.


----------



## Abishai100

*Harley Quinn Overtones*

Maybe this season is professedly focusing on '_Rise of the Villains_' storylines, since right now in America, there seems to be a cultural tone of general mischief-related traffic intrigue (i.e., Internet hackers, celebrity gossip, illegal immigration politics jokes, etc.).

Mischief is really interesting, from an ethics standpoint, since you can't directly prosecute it, since of course, it's not necessarily tied to malice or murder.  That's what the Batman (DC Comics) character Harley Quinn is all about, a trickster sidekick of the nefarious Joker who represents mischief pizazz.

I'd be interested to see how much more _artistic_ Season 2 becomes.  You know, mischief is a social criticism theme in art that highlights 'high-brow vigilantism.'




Harley Quinn


----------



## Abishai100

*Wayne Enterprises: Gotham Gumball
*

Ya know, "Gotham" (Fox TV) has me thinking about social etiquette in our modern age of urban paranoia (i.e., Los Angeles race riots).

Bruce Wayne is the ideal American prince, an inheritor and an ambitious and prominent socialite-businessman.  Batman is the ideal vigilante, a masked ninja tackling the criminally insane.

We need unspoken speakeasy dream-trader clubs, a sort of virtual Wayne Enterprises.  That's what really gives Scarecrow and Joker a run for their money.  It's all about money, and the atmospherics on "Gotham" (Fox TV) speak to this.  I hope Robin Lord Taylor gets his due accolades for his work on this fun program.

So grab a cider, a beer, or a non-alcoholic pina colada, and suppose that Wayne Enterprises really is capitalism perfection.

I'll be following what young Bruce Wayne does to develop his fancy interests in Wayne Enterprises on "Gotham" (Fox TV).






*Wayne Enterprises*


----------



## DGS49

Pardon the interruption, but Camren Bicondova  (the future "CatWoman") is walking, talking, kiddie-porn.  Even with all her clothes on.

Sorry.


----------



## Abishai100

*Nygma-Kringle Jab*


What did everyone think about the developing Nygma-Kringle relationship?

I thought this was going to be the main script lever for Nygma's evolution into the Riddler.

This is the human-face of "Gotham" (Fox TV), so we'll have a more fun time skipping over (*DGS49*)...the Selina ballet.


----------



## longknife

Abishai100 said:


> *Nygma-Kringle Jab*
> 
> 
> What did everyone think about the developing Nygma-Kringle relationship?
> 
> I thought this was going to be the main script lever for Nygma's evolution into the Riddler.
> 
> This is the human-face of "Gotham" (Fox TV), so we'll have a more fun time skipping over (*DGS49*)...the Selina ballet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 60132




I don't know where you get this - he strangled her to death!!! That's his "transition" to being the psycho Riddler.


----------



## 2aguy

longknife said:


> Abishai100 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Nygma-Kringle Jab*
> 
> 
> What did everyone think about the developing Nygma-Kringle relationship?
> 
> I thought this was going to be the main script lever for Nygma's evolution into the Riddler.
> 
> This is the human-face of "Gotham" (Fox TV), so we'll have a more fun time skipping over (*DGS49*)...the Selina ballet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 60132
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know where you get this - he strangled her to death!!! That's his "transition" to being the psycho Riddler.
Click to expand...



Yeah...I didn't get his posts either.


----------



## Slyhunter

can watch both seasons here --> Watch Gotham Online - Stream TV Free
I've watched most of them. Who needs Batman.


----------



## Abishai100

*The Iceman Cometh!*


Yes, yes.  I simply referred to the Kringle-Nygma relationship for irony purposes.  It can be argued that the Riddler is Batman's strangest nemesis.

Enough with Nygma for now though, the first images of Mr. Freeze on "Gotham" (Fox TV) look pretty...cool.


----------



## 2aguy

Abishai100 said:


> *The Iceman Cometh!*
> 
> 
> Yes, yes.  I simply referred to the Kringle-Nygma relationship for irony purposes.  It can be argued that the Riddler is Batman's strangest nemesis.
> 
> Enough with Nygma for now though, the first images of Mr. Freeze on "Gotham" (Fox TV) look pretty...cool.
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 64724




It is interesting to see the similarities between that image and the Captain Cold character from the show The Flash.......


----------



## Abishai100

*Season 3: All Good Things*


Yes, 2aguy, the similarities are very conspicuous.  Maybe they're experimenting with Freeze's look on "Gotham" (Fox TV).  Why not?  They've certainly built up enough ratings/critical credibility.

Well, the reports are surfacing that "Gotham" (Fox TV) has been renewed by Fox for Season 3, which makes this thread rather well-justified.

We were all a bit apprehensive about a pre-Batman show featuring Bruce Wayne as a caddy little boy while Jim Gordon was dealing with super-villains such as Penguin and Riddler coming to prominence.  Isn't it funny that they made only Selina Kyle (Catwoman) and Ivy Pepper (Poison Ivy) part of Bruce Wayne's age group?  All the other characters are older, so we assume that the future Dark Knight will be tackling older and wiser super-villains donning the mantles of the Joker, etc.

Then again, Tim Burton's "Batman" [1989] also presented Michael Keaton's Dark Knight tackling Jack Nicholson's much older Joker.

Maybe criminal insanity is more intriguing when viewed through the lens of father-son patricide...hmmm...

Will Barbara Gordon become the proto-Harley Quinn?  Will Jerome and 2-3 other goons don the mantle of the Joker-aura?

I won't be posting much more, so stay tuned fans and have fun.  I'll most likely be perusing this thread as "Gotham" (Fox TV) continues its successes and watching for any Harley Quinn news.  I'm sure someone's guessed by now that she's my favourite Gotham City freak.





*Gotham Renewed for Season 3 (deadline.com)*


----------



## Harry Dresden

Slyhunter said:


> can watch both seasons here --> Watch Gotham Online - Stream TV Free
> I've watched most of them. Who needs Batman.


gotham will,10 years from the time the show is set in....


----------



## Abishai100

*Friends and Devils
*

The recent passing of the great iconic musicians David Bowie and Prince has me thinking about the honors afforded to their mourning surviving relatives and loved ones (i.e., spouses).

It was cool to see the developing gender nuances between Jerome and Barbara and Edward and Miss Kringle on "Gotham" (Fox TV), as odd as they were.

The Joker-Harley Quinn relationship is perhaps the most honoured in the halls of comic book super-villain duo archives.

Now that the show has been picked up for another season, let's see more of the Bruce-Selina friendship!

Ain't the soap opera grand?


----------



## 2aguy

Abishai100 said:


> *Season 3: All Good Things*
> 
> 
> Yes, 2aguy, the similarities are very conspicuous.  Maybe they're experimenting with Freeze's look on "Gotham" (Fox TV).  Why not?  They've certainly built up enough ratings/critical credibility.
> 
> Well, the reports are surfacing that "Gotham" (Fox TV) has been renewed by Fox for Season 3, which makes this thread rather well-justified.
> 
> We were all a bit apprehensive about a pre-Batman show featuring Bruce Wayne as a caddy little boy while Jim Gordon was dealing with super-villains such as Penguin and Riddler coming to prominence.  Isn't it funny that they made only Selina Kyle (Catwoman) and Ivy Pepper (Poison Ivy) part of Bruce Wayne's age group?  All the other characters are older, so we assume that the future Dark Knight will be tackling older and wiser super-villains donning the mantles of the Joker, etc.
> 
> Then again, Tim Burton's "Batman" [1989] also presented Michael Keaton's Dark Knight tackling Jack Nicholson's much older Joker.
> 
> Maybe criminal insanity is more intriguing when viewed through the lens of father-son patricide...hmmm...
> 
> Will Barbara Gordon become the proto-Harley Quinn?  Will Jerome and 2-3 other goons don the mantle of the Joker-aura?
> 
> I won't be posting much more, so stay tuned fans and have fun.  I'll most likely be perusing this thread as "Gotham" (Fox TV) continues its successes and watching for any Harley Quinn news.  I'm sure someone's guessed by now that she's my favourite Gotham City freak.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Gotham Renewed for Season 3 (deadline.com)*
> 
> 
> View attachment 68348




They have to make the future Catwoman near his age because they are romantically linked......he has to be younger than the villains because punching people is a young mans game.


I just hope they start him on his path more directly...he really needs to start working out...........punching people takes some training...


----------



## longknife

Abishai100 said:


> *Friends and Devils
> *
> 
> The recent passing of the great iconic musicians David Bowie and Prince has me thinking about the honors afforded to their mourning surviving relatives and loved ones (i.e., spouses).
> 
> It was cool to see the developing gender nuances between Jerome and Barbara and Edward and Miss Kringle on "Gotham" (Fox TV), as odd as they were.
> 
> The Joker-Harley Quinn relationship is perhaps the most honoured in the halls of comic book super-villain duo archives.
> 
> Now that the show has been picked up for another season, let's see more of the Bruce-Selina friendship!
> 
> Ain't the soap opera grand?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 72648 View attachment 72649
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 72650



Batman and Catwoman!


----------



## Bob Blaylock

Abishai100 said:


> Will Barbara Gordon become the proto-Harley Quinn?  Will Jerome and 2-3 other goons don the mantle of the Joker-aura?



  You must have missed the episode in which Galavan killed Jerome.  Some of the characters who have been “killed” have been handled in such a manner as to allow a possibility that they aren't really dead quite yet, and may return; but Jerome was left pretty solidly, unmistakable dead.  That seemed to me like a bit of a dirty trick on the show's part, building Jerome up and making it seem obvious that he was intended to become the Joker, and then killing him off.  That episode did end with a scene that seems intended to imply that Jerome's death inspired several other random criminals on the street to emulate him, and the Joker is probably meant to come of one of them.


----------



## Abishai100

*Black Mask: Urbanology Under-Writing*

The Joker should be a symbolic voice on _Gotham_ (Fox TV), but I also think the show could explore the classicist stylings of street-diplomacy comics (in the design of Bat-villains such as Black Mask).


----------



## Abishai100

*Djinn Dial*

The tid-bits about Season 3 are enticing, and I'm psyched for continued stories surrounding Azrael and the Mad Hatter; these bad guys aren't too too evil just yet, since Batman is still just a young boy.  As long as they keep focusing on Jim Gordon, _Gotham (Fox TV)_ should become as prestigious a fun Batman franchise achievement for Fox as was the thoughtful '90s cartoon _Batman: The Animated Series_.

Batman and Gotham City should always engage us about the 'hell-fangs' of criminal insanity.

Gotham


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Abishai100 said:


> *Djinn Dial*
> 
> The tid-bits about Season 3 are enticing, and I'm psyched for continued stories surrounding Azrael and the Mad Hatter; these bad guys aren't too too evil just yet, since Batman is still just a young boy.  As long as they keep focusing on Jim Gordon, _Gotham (Fox TV)_ should become as prestigious a fun Batman franchise achievement for Fox as was the thoughtful '90s cartoon _Batman: The Animated Series_.
> 
> Batman and Gotham City should always engage us about the 'hell-fangs' of criminal insanity.
> 
> Gotham
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 87874


when is the season premier set for?


----------



## Harry Dresden

LA RAM FAN said:


> Abishai100 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Djinn Dial*
> 
> The tid-bits about Season 3 are enticing, and I'm psyched for continued stories surrounding Azrael and the Mad Hatter; these bad guys aren't too too evil just yet, since Batman is still just a young boy.  As long as they keep focusing on Jim Gordon, _Gotham (Fox TV)_ should become as prestigious a fun Batman franchise achievement for Fox as was the thoughtful '90s cartoon _Batman: The Animated Series_.
> 
> Batman and Gotham City should always engage us about the 'hell-fangs' of criminal insanity.
> 
> Gotham
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 87874
> 
> 
> 
> when is the season premier set for?
Click to expand...

sept 19.....unless they decide different....


----------



## TheOldSchool

I love the new "Make Gotham Safe Again" plotline.  A little obvious, but excellent.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

wow NOBODY has posted on this thread in a year. I have to assume that is because everybody that posted in the beginning has lost interest in this show?  Only thing that makes any sense since NOBODY is talking about the upcoming season.

Gotham Season 4 Release Date, Trailer Cast, Villains, and More News


----------



## Montrovant

Gotham is just good enough to keep watching, not good enough to keep talking about.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Montrovant said:


> Gotham is just good enough to keep watching, not good enough to keep talking about.


hey since i am getting very few replies to this thread here,

Funny that THIS is my hero from this show agree? lol

got two questions here for you.
1,did you ever watch this show.
2.simple yes or no question to the title of my thread.. do you agree  thats funny the question i posed in my thread title? lol


----------



## Montrovant

LA RAM FAN said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gotham is just good enough to keep watching, not good enough to keep talking about.
> 
> 
> 
> hey since i am getting very few replies to this thread here,
> 
> Funny that THIS is my hero from this show agree? lol
> 
> got two questions here for you.
> 1,did you ever watch this show.
> 2.simple yes or no question to the title of my thread.. do you agree  thats funny the question i posed in my thread title? lol
Click to expand...


1. Yes, I watched Airwolf, but it's been many, many years.
2. I don't really remember anything about the show except for the helicopter.


----------



## longknife

I'm a dedicated Gotham viewer and already have it on my to-view list. Other shows in that time slot on record.


----------

