# "I Had an Abortion"



## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion". 


My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says. 

Gloria Steinem is so irresponsible that she had unprotected sex,and they used a barbaric and obsolete practice to mercilessly hack to death an unborn child because she couldn't face the consequences of her actions. That's pro choice for you. 

I want you to notice that pro choice advocates only give you one choice, abortion. A real feminist knows she has many choices and that abortion isn't one of them. A real feminist respects her body enough to not have it used as a "c*m dumptser". She chooses her man carefully and demands he uses a condom if they are not exclusive as extra protection against pregnancy and disease. She uses birthcontrol to ensure she doesn't have an unwanted pregnancy. She isn't Pro choice, she is pro choices,has a brain and uses it. Should she find herself pregnant she excepts the consequences of her actions. She knows from the start that if she isn't ready to except the consequences of her actions then maybe she isn't ready to have sex in the first place.

Gloria Steinem should hang her head in shame. She's a poor example for women to follow and too stupid to realize it. 


gloria steinem i had an abortion - Bing Images


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## Katzndogz (Oct 17, 2013)

It is very common today for women to authenticate themselves by claiming they had an abortion even if they never had one.


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## bodecea (Oct 17, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> It is very common today for women to authenticate themselves by claiming they had an abortion even if they never had one.



Very Common, eh?   Link to that commonality, please.


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## JakeStarkey (Oct 17, 2013)

bodecea said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > It is very common today for women to authenticate themselves by claiming they had an abortion even if they never had one.
> ...



This just weirdo person for you.  No commonality at all.


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## Pennywise (Oct 17, 2013)

Gloria, like any good Jewish business person, has made a mint off selling the degradation of womanhood and furthering the destruction of society.

Sell the Holocaust&#8482; or sell Feminism&#8482; and line your pockets with the shekels of the goyim. It's a win win.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Oct 17, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> It is very common today for women to authenticate themselves by claiming they had an abortion even if they never had one.



I have never met such a person, Katz.  I find this statement to be quite "out there"...  I highly doubt that any woman is "proud" of having had an abortion, Katz.  

The women I have spoken to feel enough shame for you and me both and do not need to be shamed further over it.  What they need is healing, mercy, love, comfort, they need to hear Jesus asking them, where are your accusers, woman?  Go and sin no more.  That is what they need to hear.  Not condemnation and wrath.  That is not helping anyone and as for Gloria Steinham - I did not look at the photograph nor will I.  Pray for the woman and stop judging her.  If you are a Christian you should know that in 1 Corinthinians 5: 12 Paul makes it very clear we are not to "judge the World" but rather those inside the church who are destroying it by their own sin.  Paul makes it clear that we are NOT to judge the world because that is not our place.  God will judge the world.  The bible says so.


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## novasteve (Oct 17, 2013)

Only a twisted liberal could take pride in killing their own child


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## Book of Jeremiah (Oct 17, 2013)

Pennywise said:


> Gloria, like any good Jewish business person, has made a mint off selling the degradation of womanhood and furthering the destruction of society.
> 
> Sell the Holocaust or sell Feminism and line your pockets with the shekels of the goyim. It's a win win.



God has not called you to judge the Jews, Penny.   Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.   That is what the the Lord requires of each of us.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

Pennywise said:


> Gloria, like any good Jewish business person, has made a mint off selling the degradation of womanhood and furthering the destruction of society.
> 
> Sell the Holocaust or sell Feminism and line your pockets with the shekels of the goyim. It's a win win.



it's unfortunate that people believe this is feminism cause it's not.  I guess that's what you get when you have a culture that accepts everything the liberal media says without question. Libbers are so busy trying to keep Roe v Wade alive that they never stop to think about the implications of what abortion on demand says about their skewed thinking. Abortion shouldn't even be an issue because it's obsolete.  It's like taking away an I phone 5 and handing that person a rotary dial phone attached to a wall. There are better ways not to get pregnant and they have been around longer than abortion has so why Abortion was ever considered necessary IDK. Laziness?

Lifers if you want to get rid of abortion it's simple. Drop the religious aspect(see Mathew 7:6) you can't force someone whose eyes are not open to see.   We need to approach it from a secular point ot view. This way the message reaches all women at whatever level of life they are at. Point out to the girls the multiple ways of not getting pregnant including the pill whether you agree with personally it or not. Show the girls that they run the show and have a right not ot have sex if they are uncomfortable or to demand the man be responisble too and use a condom. Teach the girls that abortion is not good for their body and they should at all times respect thier body and that abortion = major fail. 

One more thing, for heaven sakes ladies dress a little better. If you don't want a man to treat you like a sex object, don't dress like one. Seriously, the guy is going to follow your lead,if you look like "a ho" than he will treat you like one. If you look like a well put together lady he will treat you like one. If he doesn't, dump him, the choice is yours. Demand the respect you deserve, that's real feminism.


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## koshergrl (Oct 17, 2013)

It's never been about helping women. It's all about making it legal to kill certain populations.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



Karen Santorum should hang her head in shame. She's a poor example for women to follow and too stupid to realize it. 

The reason why either woman chose an abortion is none of your business.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/...iel-michael-santorum-late-term-karen-santorum


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hk_-XWpUFmU]Cricket sound effect (1) - YouTube[/ame]


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## mamooth (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> One more thing, for heaven sakes ladies dress a little better.



Do you understand that you come across as a creepy obsessive control freak? Spending your days obsessing about women who dare have sex in a manner you disapprove of is just weird and pervy. Find some other hobby.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

mamooth said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > One more thing, for heaven sakes ladies dress a little better.
> ...



Did you read the whole post? And the other things he has written. He really is creepy.


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## JakeStarkey (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinreaper and koshergrl are made for each other: creepy and creepier.


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## Vox (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



You have to realize, that those brainless vaginas with vocal cords are not human.
they do not have empathy, kindness or responsibility toward the weak and dependent.
all they care is "me, me, me" and at the end it is coming the full circle and hits them with double force( karma law)

Abortion Contributes to Increased Suicide Rates Among Young Women
Abortion Contributes to Increased Suicide Rates Among Young Women | LifeNews.com
Suicide Rate Higher After Abortion, Study Shows | After Abortion

 Elliot Institute Presents New Findings at International Women&#8217;s Health Conference

A new Elliot Institute study has found that women who have had abortions are more likely to commit suicide than those who have given birth.

The study examined Medi-Cal records for more than 173,000 low-income California women who had abortions or gave birth in 1989. Linking these records to death certificates, the researchers found that women who had state-funded abortions were 2.6 times more likely to die of suicide compared to women who delivered their babies.

The average annual suicide rate per 100,000 women was 3.0 for delivering women, compared to 7.8 for aborting women. The national average suicide rate for women between the ages of 15 and 44 is 5.2 per 100,000 women. This shows that aborted women have a higher suicide rate than women in general, while giving birth actually reduces women&#8217;s suicide risk.

Abortion and mental health: quantitative synthesis and analysis of research published 1995?2009
*
Results Women who had undergone an abortion experienced an 81% increased risk of mental health problems, and nearly 10% of the incidence of mental health problems was shown to be attributable to abortion. The strongest subgroup estimates of increased risk occurred when abortion was compared with term pregnancy and when the outcomes pertained to substance use and suicidal behaviour.*

Conclusions This review offers the largest quantitative estimate of mental health risks associated with abortion available in the world literature. Calling into question the conclusions from traditional reviews, the results revealed a moderate to highly increased risk of mental health problems after abortion. Consistent with the tenets of evidence-based medicine, this information should inform the delivery of abortion services.


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## Vox (Oct 17, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> It's never been about helping women. It's all about making it legal to kill certain populations.



yep. Eugenics in full bloom.

pus it is total freedom and off the hook for men


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## JakeStarkey (Oct 17, 2013)

Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



it becomes my business when she makes a public statement that she parades around on a T shirt no less, like it's a trivia matter when it's not. It becomes my business when people call her a feminist and she parades around in that shirt because it sends the wrong message. Gloria Steinem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 I'm here to say she wears clown shoes and doesn't represent real feminists. I don't give a flying fuck about Karen Santorum. If she starts wearing a I had an abortion T shirt like it's something females should be proud of, then I'll ride her ass too.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

mamooth said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > One more thing, for heaven sakes ladies dress a little better.
> ...



Really? what did I say that you disagree with?  Oh I see, your offended because I asked women demand something better not to be sex objects and c*m dumpsters for womanizing men? Well I guess that explains what YOUR hobby is.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Hello, I see you didn't get the memo, I'm a woman,and mother of three daughters. I want a better world for them other then the low bar the liberal agenda sets for them and others females. I guess in your book wanting women to be self sufficient,educated, demand men treat them with respect and properly plan their families with the least possible physical and mental trauma to themselves as possible is creepy.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



So, you agree that women are the owners of their own bodies and that government should not be in control of women's reproduction. 

Its that Steinem wore a shirt that says she agrees with you that women are the owners of their own bodies and that government should not be in control of women's reproduction that bothers you. 

Are there any other rights that you believe should not appear on a t-shirt?

(You're a *maroon*.)


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



I've never seen you post anything in favor of women so no, I had no idea that you believe any of those things. 

And, I still don't believe it because what you write is very ugly and toxic and hateful towards women.


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## Steven_R (Oct 17, 2013)

JakeStarkey said:


> Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.



Why not? So long as the decision as to whether or not the child will even be born is unilaterally with the mother, why shouldn't the father have a say in the process? If the woman gets pregnant and doesn't want a baby, vacuum the womb. If the woman gets pregnant and the man doesn't want a baby, tough shit, just pay up for the next 18 years. The reverse is true, if the woman doesn't want a kid and the man does, he just gets to stand by and watch his offspring be vacuumed out. And we haven't even gotten into custody of children.

It's hardly an equitable system.


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## emilynghiem (Oct 17, 2013)

Hi LR: Where abortion/Roe v Wade is a women's issue
is the reason the law was struck down as unconstitutional
is that it violated due process of women whose privacy would have to be violated
to defend her of charges based on "mitigating factors"

I have YET to see any law proposed by either side of this debate
that held MEN accountable for the consequences of pregnancy/abortion as the WOMEN

THAT'S why it's a women's issue
and the fighting over it has prevented work to reach any kind of agreement
on solutions that would PREVENT abuse leading to abortion or PREVENT
from penalizing/imposing on women more than men, especially in case of rape/incest

it always ends up being a women's issue because of who is affected by legislation

If laws focused on equally holding men accountable for relationship abuse and rape
that leads to unwanted pregnancy/children/abortion, then maybe we could get around it being primarily a women's issue. we'd have to police the abuse at the point of having sex where it involves both the men and women equally accountable to make it gender neutral!



laughinReaper said:


> Pennywise said:
> 
> 
> > Gloria, like any good Jewish business person, has made a mint off selling the degradation of womanhood and furthering the destruction of society.
> ...


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support. 

Even so -  government has no place in controlling women's reproduction. Period. 

Get government out of our private lives.


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## emilynghiem (Oct 17, 2013)

Steven_R said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.
> ...



Both partners should be held accountable for relationship abuse,
where any actions or decisions affecting people should ideally reflect consent of both.

if we required counseling and conflict resolution training and assistance
to prevent, reduce, or correct relationship abuse, we'd not only cut down
on bullying and abuse but crime and violence that results when these escalate.


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## emilynghiem (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> 
> Even so -  government has no place in controlling women's reproduction. Period.
> 
> Get government out of our private lives.



I love your statement Luddly.
But this is where a huge question mark hangs over my head.

how can you say to get govt out of our private lives
but then have health care mandated by federal govt,
precluding and penalizing other choices of health care.

Luddly after working with prochoice and prolife activists over the years
nothing is going to change their minds, but the most we can agree on
is to separate funding so people are not imposing on each other through govt.

can we agree to separate and respect equal free choice to get govt out of the equation?

this ACA allows prolife people to understand why prochoice people demand choice.
we have a chance to reach a greater understanding here, about
solving problems at the root, not charging or costing or penalizing people after the fact.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

emilynghiem said:


> Hi LR: Where abortion/Roe v Wade is a women's issue
> is the reason the law was struck down as unconstitutional
> is that it violated due process of women whose privacy would have to be violated
> to defend her of charges based on "mitigating factors"
> ...



Emily, your posts are so hard to translate that I don't usually even try to read them. 

For example, I've tried to imagine punctuation and caps in this first paragraph and I just can't make any sense of it. 

But, because of context, there are a few points that are understandable so - I think I agree with you.


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## TNHarley (Oct 17, 2013)

JakeStarkey said:


> laughinreaper and koshergrl are made for each other: creepy and creepier.



theya are conservatives, not gay


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

emilynghiem said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> ...



I agree. I don't think govt has any place in our medical care. 

OTOH, how else to make people take responsibility for their own costs? Like auto insurance, ObamaCare forces people to take responsibility. 

As you well know, our current "system" is a bust and, even though the rw's won't admit it,  it IS socialist. 

I appreciate that you used a couple of commas but I still can't make heads or tails out of your last lines. Is that the same subject and therefore the same paragraph? How does ACA help or not help "solve problems at the root"? WHAT is the "root"?


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## TNHarley (Oct 17, 2013)

I am very pro-choice, but this is disgusting. 
it is nothing to fuckin brag about.


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## whitehall (Oct 17, 2013)

Steinem is old enough to have had an abortion during WW2.


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## TNHarley (Oct 17, 2013)

JakeStarkey said:


> Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.



sperm donation?
the woman gets off the hook as well with abortion you know..
I had a buddy that wanted to kill his gf because she aborted behind his back. like I seriously.thought he was going.to hurt her.. aint been the same with chicks.since


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## jknowgood (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> 
> Even so -  government has no place in controlling women's reproduction. Period.
> 
> Get government out of our private lives.



Well i'm a single father, have been for 12 years and don't get child support. Thd real kicker is she claimed my son last year on her taxes costed me over two grand.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

TNHarley said:


> I am very pro-choice, but this is disgusting.
> it is nothing to fuckin brag about.



Where did anyone "brag"?

You must have seen a different shirt than I did because all I saw was the simple. declarative statement - "I had an abortion". 

Please post a link to the "bragging".

Thanks.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

whitehall said:


> Steinem is old enough to have had an abortion during WW2.



When you're old enough to have sex and wear long pants, you'll understand that pregnancies have been unwanted as well as wanted since the beginning of time.


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## TNHarley (Oct 17, 2013)

she shouldnt be showing the world she is irresponsible. I know your ass condones that, but responsible people dont
if I wore a shirt that said "I am rich" pretty sure that would be bragging, numbnuts


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## jknowgood (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



C%m catchers is more political correct. Lol


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

TNHarley said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.
> ...



Lucky chicks. 



> Well i'm a single father, have been for 12 years and don't get child support. Thd real kicker is she claimed my son last year on her taxes costed me over two grand.



Like I said, I agree that its not an equitable system but your situation is rare compared to women being deserted by dead beat "fathers". 

Men who don't support their children are so revered by the tee potties, they even elected one. Luckily, saner voters prevailed and threw his useless butt out. Which is what his wife should have done before her first pregnancy.


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## Rebelitarian (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



She is  a Globalist puppet funded by the CIA to con women into disrupting the family unit.

That's all feminism is.

In 50 years of feminism women are still doing women's jobs and men are doing men's jobs.

It is all part of the Culture of Death Pope John Paul warned us about !!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> 
> Even so -  government has no place in controlling women's reproduction. Period.
> 
> *Get government out of our private lives*.




ACA is law of the land, gov't _mandates _we purchase insurance, forces people to pay for maternity, newborn, pediatric care (including vision and dental) whether they need it or not ... and you post this?    tff


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## R.C. Christian (Oct 17, 2013)

Why are virtually all Jewish women liberal dogs who advocate immoral behavior?


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> ...



Yep.

Too bad you make asssumptions without knowing facts.

I've already addressed this in this thread. If you're interested, you could read it. or you could just keep on making asssumptions without knowing facts.  



TNHarley said:


> she shouldnt be showing the world she is irresponsible. I know your ass condones that, but responsible people dont
> if I wore a shirt that said "I am rich" pretty sure that would be bragging, numbnuts



You've never gotten the news that you're carrying a baby that will never be well, never be without pain, never see adulthood. 

Abortion is not irresponsible. 

By its very definition, it is responsibility at its most difficult and most painful.

The reasons why any woman has an abortion is none of your business. 

Oh and you wearing a shirt that reads "I an rich" would be a lie. There's a difference but its one that rw's have no firsthand knowledge of.


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## R.C. Christian (Oct 17, 2013)

OMG another abortion thread.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 17, 2013)

R.C. Christian said:


> Why are virtually all Jewish women liberal dogs who advocate immoral behavior?



That's an incredibly stupid thing to write but I think this has even you beat for stupdity -



Rebelitarian said:


> She is  a Globalist puppet funded by the CIA to con women into disrupting the family unit.
> 
> That's all feminism is.
> 
> ...


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## R.C. Christian (Oct 17, 2013)

Actually, no it wasn't an "incredibly stupid thing to write". I was simply asking a question.


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



You don't believe the gov't s/be in the medical care business ... followed by "on the other hand ...".  Translation:  you're fine with it.

Abortion ends the life of another human being.  Period.


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## TNHarley (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



no fuckin shit lud
I am pro-choice you dumb son of a bitch
I don't give a shit why they do it, I support the freedom to do it. 
and you are  an idiot


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 17, 2013)

> The student had heard the pro-choice movements slogans. He took them at face value, believing that the unborn baby was a mass of cells and not an individual human being. He felt that a woman had the right to control her body and did not sympathize with the tiny baby inside her. He did not believe in the childs humanity or right to life.
> 
> Then he took the opportunity to see an abortion performed. Because of his pro-choice beliefs, he did not expect to be disturbed by anything he would see:
> 
> ...




"Pro-Choice" Medical Student Witnesses Abortion, Becomes Pro-Life | LifeNews.com


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## Jackson (Oct 17, 2013)

My first sexual experience was when I was 21.  I was amazed to find I was pregnant but I welcomed the event for I thought it must be God's will.  (My parents were not so excited, lol, but I never seemed to notice)  I continued with my marriage plans and had a wonderful little boy.

I learned later on due to medical reasons I could not have more children but relished the time I had with my son.  He grew up to be a strapping young man, brilliant, handsome and a success at everything he tried.  Now a father of three delightful boys and a successful businessman, I often think what would my life be like  and the four people that came from that one night and decision be?  

One night...one decision....four people and a lifetime of love.   Don't make the wrong choice.


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## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Abortion is one reason we are in this mess.


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



Saying that you had an abortion means you are not ashamed, like the lifers want you to be.

Your offensive language here, referring to women as 'cum dumpsters' just shows how pathetically immature you really are, and goes to show that you know nothing at all about women.
Pro choicers do NOT think that the only option for an unintended pregnancy is abortion, we believe in 3 choices - adoption, raising the child yourself, or abortion.
Lifers believe there is only ONE choice - have the baby no matter what.

It is your lot that should be ashamed, assuming women are sluts, and wishing to dictate what a woman can and cannot do with her own reproductive system.


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

novasteve said:


> Only a twisted liberal could take pride in killing their own child



Only conservatives take pride in a white man shooting dead an unarmed teenager.


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

TNHarley said:


> I am very pro-choice, but this is disgusting.
> it is nothing to fuckin brag about.



She is NOT bragging. All it is saying is that there is NOTHING to be ashamed of, in having an abortion!
Sheesh!


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> > The student had heard the pro-choice movements slogans. He took them at face value, believing that the unborn baby was a mass of cells and not an individual human being. He felt that a woman had the right to control her body and did not sympathize with the tiny baby inside her. He did not believe in the childs humanity or right to life.
> >
> > Then he took the opportunity to see an abortion performed. Because of his pro-choice beliefs, he did not expect to be disturbed by anything he would see:
> >
> ...



This abortion would have taken place well before 12 weeks, and the sex of the fetus cannot be determined.
The tissue removed has to be examined to ensure the abortion is complete, because if it isn't, the woman may suffer an infection.
As a med student, this brat should have known that, and been prepared.


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## Jackson (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



When a woman finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!


----------



## Sunshine (Oct 17, 2013)

Gloria Steinem is so old, I don't see how she got laid, let alone pregnant.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

Jackson said:


> When a woman finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!



The woman shouldn't have to use her body to sustain the life of something else for nine months. Do you know what childbirth is like? Why should a woman be forced to endure the agony of childbirth simply because she had sex?


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > When a wom louzy monthsan finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!
> ...




My Mother did, I did, all of us had a woman sustain our lives, for  it was THE most awesome thing I have ever done. It morphs all else, all other successes in life, is nothing compared to being a Mom. 

17 hours of labor for a lifetime of love


----------



## whitehall (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> whitehall said:
> 
> 
> > Steinem is old enough to have had an abortion during WW2.
> ...



Lucky for you your parents decided to give birth to a liberal. Some day there might be a DNA test for the propensity toward liberalism. In that case I might change my pro-life status.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



The difference is that you CHOSE to give birth. Not every woman wants to give birth, and no woman should ever be forced to.


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Don't get pregnant . No use in taking it out on your kid.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 17, 2013)




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## Luissa (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



Childbirth was the worst thing that has ever happened to me. It was worth it, but I am glad the next time if that happens I will be having a c section. I can handle the pain from the c section.


----------



## Kooshdakhaa (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Pennywise said:
> 
> 
> > Gloria, like any good Jewish business person, has made a mint off selling the degradation of womanhood and furthering the destruction of society.
> ...



Wow.  I can tell you've never felt really hot, sexual passion.  Because if you ever had you might understand how a woman could lose control of herself in the throes of passion and make a mistake and have unprotected sex.  I'm sorry for you that you can't grasp that.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I want you to notice that pro choice advocates only give you one choice, abortion. A real feminist knows she has many choices and that abortion isn't one of them.



Obviously youre unaware of how idiotic this is. 

Those who respect the Constitutional right to privacy respect a womans decision, whatever that decision might be. 

As opposed to most on the right who fear individual liberty and seek to empower the state to interfere with a womans right to privacy.


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## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Luissa said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...




I am sorry you had such a hard labor Luissa. My pregnancy was awful. I was just glad it was over. And I got to finally talk to my baby. Best day of my life


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



In other words, don't have sex - which basically means that you wish to punish women for having sex by forcing them to give birth.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Exactly. 

Ultimately the decision belongs to the woman alone, the Liberty Clause of the 5th Amendment clearly prohibits the state from interfering with that decision.


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...




Give me a break, that is asinine. 

In other words, don't get pregnant. Did I studder?


----------



## Kooshdakhaa (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



And then you get old and die and leave your offspring to fend for themselves in a hard, cruel world.  Who knows what the future holds in terms of wars and tragedies and the rages of Mother Nature.  Even as an adult woman I sometimes want to cry out for my mother.  But she is long gone and I must face the world without her.

This is why I chose not to have children.  I couldn't justify creating life just for my own  pleasure, and then not being able to be with and care for my children...forever.  Or worse, live long enough to watch them die.


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## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Kooshdakhaa said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Oh, so now becoming a Mom is a selfish thing to do? 

Apparently you haven't a clue. I feel sorry for you


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



Don't get pregnant means don't have sex, idiot. You are saying not to have sex if you don't want to get pregnant. Admit it.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 17, 2013)

Jackson said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



In your subjective opinion, which youre entitled to. 

You may not seek to codify that subjective opinion, however. 

And a person is not required to justify the exercising of a fundamental right such as the right to privacy as a prerequisite to indeed exercise that right.


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



OMG, I did not know that God madE people this stupid

Have sex all day long for all I care. Take responsibility for what you help to create. Without killing


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## Steven_R (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > When a woman finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!
> ...



Why should a man be forced to endure 18 years of child support payments simply because he had sex?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



If a woman intends to have an abortion if she became pregnant, what should she do?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

Steven_R said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



He shouldn't, and that is one thing that I believe is unfair. The man should not have to pay for a choice the woman made. She chose to give birth knowing he didn't want to be a father, he shouldn't be expected to pay for her decision.


----------



## birddog (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Hey SFBs, what makes you think you are dealing with a "he?"


----------



## Esmeralda (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...


Exactly.


----------



## Esmeralda (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



 Holy shit Superman your ex-ray eyes see stuff that's not there. Her shirt said " I had an abortion" not  "laughinreaper agrees with me that I own my body and the government should not be involved in a womans reproductive rights."  

Seriously dude, stop spewing the Liberal mantra and get back to the thread. She had an abortion, she's obviously proud of her abortion as she went to all the trouble of having a t-shirt and a professional looking pic of her in said t-shirt advertising she had an abortion. How do you or anybody support a person who is so irresponsible and/or stupid, that she didn't take birthcontrol and had a unborn baby hacked out of her body because she didn't want to deal with the consequences of her actions? How does anyone find her as a good example of a feminist woman? She's a POS. Then she and other ignorant libers advertise to the young women of this country that this is the smart way to go? A surgical proceedure that should be considered obsolete? A abortion is essentiallly a forced miscarriage and carries medical risks. This is a no-brainer, non-invasive prevention or surgical proceedure which is better? 

The fact that these morons push abortion on demand instead of birthcontrol on demand should show everyone what dumbasses they are. This is 2013 dude, birthcontrol has come along way and is very effective. I should know I've been on it myself and my daughters are on it also. Guess what Einstein, it works. Is it 100%, no, but damn close.  This is why women need to put their foot down with their men and tell them to wear a condom.  

Oh BTW If Steinem and others "agree" that the government shouldn't be involved in reproductive issues than I'm guessing they should be fighting for Planned Parenthood to stop taking government funding. After all Isn't that what Planned Parenthood does?


"The report also indicates Planned Parenthood had a record year when it comes to funding from the government. An analysis done by the pro-life group, Susan B. Anthony List, shows the abortion provider received a record $542 million in taxpayer dollars by way of government grants, contracts, and Medicaid reimbursements. That amounts to almost half of all Planned Parenthood's budget."


 - See more at: Planned Parenthood: Record year for abortions, taxpayer funding

Planned Parenthood: Record year for abortions, taxpayer funding


----------



## Jackson (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > When a woman finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!
> ...



Wow.  Why should a woman sustain a life for nine months when she could go and have someone rip a baby apart bit by bit?   Why her mother could have done that after she had sex too. But she had this child that grew up to be an insensitive clod.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



OMG this is the problem! could you be anymore fucking brainwashed. No it doesn't mean don't have sex. It means be responsible and use birthcontrol. Not just the woman but the man too! It's being secure enough in who you are as a woman to say,I don't want to get pregnant so put on a condom or no sex. If the guy isn't a complete tool, he will accomodate you. If he says no, what are you doing with such a jerk anyway? What are the odds that both male and female contraception used at the same time are both  going to fail?  Highly unlikely. It's time for women to put on their big girl panties, be responsible, demand the man also be responsible, and stop using abortion as a way to get out of their bad behavior and poor decision making.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

Jackson said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



No idea what you are talking about, but I will say it again: No woman should ever be forced to endure a pregnancy if she doesn't want to.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> OMG this is the problem! could you be anymore fucking brainwashed. No it doesn't mean don't have sex. It means be responsible and use birthcontrol. Not just the woman but the man too! It's being secure enough in who you are as a woman to say,I don't want to get pregnant so put on a condom or no sex. If the guy isn't a complete tool, he will accomodate you. If he says no, what are you doing with such a jerk anyway? What are the odds that both male and female contraception used at the same time are both  going to fail?  Highly unlikely. It's time for women to put on their big girl panties, be responsible, demand the man also be responsible, and stop using abortion as a way to get out of their bad behavior and poor decision making.



If the woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, what do you suggest she does to prevent a pregnancy?


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > OMG this is the problem! could you be anymore fucking brainwashed. No it doesn't mean don't have sex. It means be responsible and use birthcontrol. Not just the woman but the man too! It's being secure enough in who you are as a woman to say,I don't want to get pregnant so put on a condom or no sex. If the guy isn't a complete tool, he will accomodate you. If he says no, what are you doing with such a jerk anyway? What are the odds that both male and female contraception used at the same time are both  going to fail?  Highly unlikely. It's time for women to put on their big girl panties, be responsible, demand the man also be responsible, and stop using abortion as a way to get out of their bad behavior and poor decision making.
> ...



You are kidding....right?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 17, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



How do you know she didn't ask the man to use a condom, and how do you know she didn't pick a mate carefully ?


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Nope. Just answer the question.


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Become a nun. 

There, how's that?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



Become a nun and not have sex - is that your answer?


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## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



You poor thing. Wow


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

Is it your answer that if a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, in order to avoid a pregnancy, she should not have sex?

Yes or no?


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## PixieStix (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi, Please read a book dear


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## Esmeralda (Oct 17, 2013)

Abortion is accepted and legal the world over. The only places it isn't legal is in theocracies or in extremely, highly religious countries that are pretty darn near theocracies, such as Ireland. The US is a secular country. If you want to live in a Christian theocracy, move to one, and live in a country that does not allow abortion. Otherwise, abortion is LEGAL in the US and it is not up to you to impose your religious or moral beliefs on the majority the US population. No one is forcing you to get an abortion, so don't get one, but do not speak as if you have a right to censure or control what others do.


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## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi, Please read a book dear



laughinReaper did say this: 'No it doesn't mean don't have sex. It means be responsible and use birthcontrol'

I asked what a woman should do if she would have an abortion if she became pregnant- how would she prevent a pregnancy?

You said that it didn't mean she shouldn't have sex so I asked you the same question, and you refuse to answer.

You DO believe that if a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, she should not have sex, which is exactly what you insisted she didn't have to do.

Now. Come clean and admit how wrong you were.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 17, 2013)

Noomi said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



But you should be ashamed because you failed in the simple task of using birthcontrol.

Can't help but notice in your three Pro choice options not one is contraception. You go straight to abortion. Why is abortion the "birthcontrol" of choice with the Pro Choice crowd? Is contraception even in your vocabulary? 

Non-invasive prevention or surgical procedure. which is better choice? Geez Noomi, there is the pill, the ring, the patch, the shot,IUD, diaphram/spemicide and probably more. Ladies need to get with the program and pick the one that best works for them and don't forget to make the man use a condom.


BTW Noomi C*m Dumpster isn't my word, I first heard it when a couple of guys on this board said it and it's also in the urban dictionary.  It goes to show what men think of women or a certain type of woman. The type of woman that is coming up in the world today. When I was a young woman 30 years ago, being called a bitch and a whore were fighting words. The kids today use those words(especially men) with just about every woman. Now it seems to me that if the pro choice liberated woman lifestyle was doing what it was supposed to be doing women woudn't find it perfectly OK to be constantly disrespected. Actually it's just the opposite, we have declined and become OK with being sex objects. We went from being referred to as "the little woman" to every mans twerking, half dressed,"it's getting hot in here I want to take my clothes off" whore.  It's the truth and It's womens fault for letting it happen. So who's immature, the woman who, takes responsiblity for her actions, uses contraception and demands respect or the woman who is irresponsible, allows herself to be objectified and relies on abortion as contraception. Don't shoot the messenger.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fUjcPCUWD0]Nelly - Hot in Herre - Lyrics - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Noomi (Oct 17, 2013)

And if the woman does use birth control but falls pregnant anyway?


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## koshergrl (Oct 17, 2013)

Then she needs to take care of herself for 9 months.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



How do you know what happened during her abortion?


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Thank you. I am sick unto death of all these little old ladies and men who probably haven't been laid since the turn of the century anyway, prescribing that women just keep their legs crossed when REALLY?! It is NONE of their literally fucking business what any other person does in their sex  life. None. It's like they've all given themselves permission to be Peeping Toms with full gossip rights.

And further, they know none of these women. None. Know nothing about them. But they somehow ... god. I don't even know how they live with all those judging, hypocritical, ranting voices in their head.


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## Noomi (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Then she needs to take care of herself for 9 months.



And she can do that by having an abortion.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > > The student had heard the pro-choice movements slogans. He took them at face value, believing that the unborn baby was a mass of cells and not an individual human being. He felt that a woman had the right to control her body and did not sympathize with the tiny baby inside her. He did not believe in the childs humanity or right to life.
> ...



The entire post went right over your head.  Typical.

Genitalia start forming around 8 weeks.  The abortion took place prior to the 14 week (as stated in the article) and the sex of the aborted fetus would have be known.

It isn't "tissue".  But I do understand that you need to repeat that meme over and over and over in order to dehumanize the unborn so you can justify ending their life.


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## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.


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## Esmeralda (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> I am sick unto death of all these little old ladies and men who probably haven't been laid since the turn of the century anyway, prescribing that women just keep their legs crossed when REALLY?! It is NONE of their literally fucking business what any other person does in their sex  life. None. It's like they've all given themselves permission to be Peeping Toms with full gossip rights.
> 
> And further, they know none of these women. None. Know nothing about them. But they somehow ... god. I don't even know how they live with all those judging, hypocritical, ranting voices in their head.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

The vaginas with vocal cords of this site can not tolerate the truth and resort to angry negging - what else is new 

Sore losers realizing they are being used but can not be told that, because it is offensive


----------



## jknowgood (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Is it your answer that if a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, in order to avoid a pregnancy, she should not have sex?
> 
> Yes or no?



Your kidding right? A woman choses to have sex without birth control or protection, because she can get an abortion. Making that decision before having sex. She should be commited and is another reason abortion should be illegal. One she could get an std and second she could die while having an abortion.


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.



No, it is a human being in the early stages of its development.  It may not look like a human being but it is.  I know, that fact throws the whole 'my body, my choice, it's just tissue' meme out the window.  Fact:  abortion ends the life of a pre-born human being.  But abortion supporters are too chicken shit to admit this so they have to dehumanize the unborn to justify their actions.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.



You realize tha you are not more than a tissue yourself, do you?

A brainless tissue, but with a reflex to neg when you can not tolerate the truth 

Guess what - you will have to wait couple of hours to relieve yourself again 
You might want to use that time to help that vaginal itch of yours which clearly is clouding your limited reasoning


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.
> ...


You are trying to reason with a tissue. It's pointless.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.
> ...



My favorite thing about all this is that you can talk, preach, moan, groan, bitch, and complain until the cows come home. 



You accomplish nothing.

None of these women even know you exist.

You are the epitome of powerlessness.

This makes me very happy.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Steven_R said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



BTW this is the exact reason why so many men are supporting this idiocy of "it is my body, i can do whatever i want" -because it lets the off the hook entirely. Our stupid vaginas with vocal cords are too brainwashed to realize that this mantra has denigrated them more than anything ever in history, making them all sluts and equating a woman to a whore whom a man does not even have to pay for using them


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



A defense of the vagina with vocal cords which deeply inside realizes she is being used as a conveyer


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



well now had she used female birthcontrol and he used male birthcontrol she shouldn't have needed an abortion. what are the odds of both failing at the same time? Considering Ms Steinem's intellect, perhaps she did carefully pick a man as ridiculous as she is.


----------



## Sunshine (Oct 18, 2013)

Kooshdakhaa said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



LMAO.  Such melodrama~!


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...




Didn't your liberated mother tell you how to keep from getting pregnant? No of course not, she just told you to have an abortion. Silly me.

This one is 99.9% effecitve.Birth Control Pills - Types, Effectiveness, and Side Effects of Birth Control Pills

NuvaRing

Depo Provera &#8211; What is Depo Provera

The Ortho Evra Birth Control Patch

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diaphragm_(contraceptive)

Condom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Moonglow (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> It's never been about helping women. It's all about making it legal to kill certain populations.



Abortions will occur whether legal or not.


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## Sunshine (Oct 18, 2013)

Did anyone notice how much Sarah Palin looks like Steinem did in her younger days?  That's just freaky!


----------



## Caroljo (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> novasteve said:
> 
> 
> > Only a twisted liberal could take pride in killing their own child
> ...



That was really a stupid comparison!  Lol!


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



I call bullshit on the whole letter either way. 
Crude medical instrument? They use a speculum, which is what they use in any Pap smear. The moment that was stated I knew it wasn't from a medical student and was completely made up. 
And why was the woman asleep when he stated she had the MVA procedure? 
"Manual Vacuum Aspiration (MVA): a procedure used as early as 3 -12 weeks since the last period. Considered less invasive with only a local anesthesia being used on the cervix."
http://americanpregnancy.org/unplannedpregnancy/abortionprocedures.html


Like I said, I call bullshit on the whole story.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.
> ...



Why do you hate women?


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

I have had two friends who  worked at Planned Parenthood. I just asked one if you could tell what sex the baby was. This is what she responded with.
"When I worked there, we only went to 14 Weeks & you couldn't tell the sex that early"

You can believe me or not, but I sure as hell don't believe that letter is legit.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Pennywise said:
> 
> 
> > Gloria, like any good Jewish business person, has made a mint off selling the degradation of womanhood and furthering the destruction of society.
> ...


A christian never condones the murder of innocent babies....


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

JakeStarkey said:


> laughinreaper and koshergrl are made for each other: creepy and creepier.



Why would they care what a liar like you thinks of them?


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

JakeStarkey said:


> Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.



All homosexuals say so.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

emilynghiem said:


> Hi LR: Where abortion/Roe v Wade is a women's issue
> is the reason the law was struck down as unconstitutional
> is that it violated due process of women whose privacy would have to be violated
> to defend her of charges based on "mitigating factors"
> ...


Really? Men are financially responsible ALL THE TIME and yet they have no say on whether the woman can kill his child.... You my friend are full of shit.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

TNHarley said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...


You support the freedom to end innocent life?


----------



## mamooth (Oct 18, 2013)

birddog said:


> Hey SFBs, what makes you think you are dealing with a "he?"



Because laughinReaper was referring to women as "cum dumpsters". While pro-life women can be nasty, I've never seen them stoop down to that level. Derangement against women to that degree always comes from a man.

For similar reasons, you can tell Vox is male. No woman would call a woman "vagina with vocal cords."


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > When a woman finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!
> ...



Then she should have made the decision not to fuck.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

whitehall said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > whitehall said:
> ...



That wont upset Lud. Progressive already think it is okay to kill a baby based on sex Ideology is a simple step for them.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Kooshdakhaa said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Pennywise said:
> ...


Bullshit cop out. I can use my brain to have sex responsibly if you cant you are not mature enough to be having sex.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



I don't hate women.

But I hate vaginas with vocal cords like yourself and some others, because they cause all the women to be viewed as brainless sex objects only.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Sunshine said:


> Did anyone notice how much Sarah Palin looks like Steinem did in her younger days?  That's just freaky!



Except Palin is a real feminist where as Steinem is a communist tool.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Caroljo said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > novasteve said:
> ...



thats all they ever have


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...


Why do you want dead babies?


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Sure! 
Or you just hate women. 
You know how I know this? You have judged me on numerous occasions without knowing anything about me. You hate women, admit it.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I am a single mom with a five year old. It's called being pro choice. I may or may not like it, but it isn't my decision what you or anyone else does with their body. 
You morons are too dumb to realize that. And you claim to be for freedom and less government involvement. Ha!


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...




You post this as if you think I care.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



The only person I see supporting hate  here is you. He isn't calling for the deaths of innocent babies. Tell me are you like Sanger and hoping the babies killed are black? It is what planned parenthood was made for by the way. Democrats always show their true racist roots


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Men should never be let off the hook for fathering a child.
> ...



You are a lovely one.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> I have had two friends works at Planned Parenthood. I just asked one if you could tell what sex the baby was. This is what she responded with.
> "When I worked there, we only went to 14 Weeks & you couldn't tell the sex that early"
> 
> You can believe me or not, but I sure as hell don't believe that letter is legit.



that's a lie.

a baby's sex can be told at the end of the first trimester ( sometimes earlier -11 week) - even on US.

and it is definite upon abortion if the body is not distorted too much at the end of first trimester.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...



Why thank you but I am married and I dont date women who want babies killed because of their race or for inconvenience.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I am calling for the deaths of babies? Show me where I stated this, loser.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Show me where I said that, loser? 
Oh! That's right I didn't. Why do losers like you like lying and to dramatize everything? 
Boring life? No sex life? Right hand hurt?


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Yes, I'm sure abortion isn't anything like this.  It's much more sanitary and routine.  And the unborn comes out in one piece and isn't really a human being at all, just a bunch of 'tissue'.

"On the table in front of me, I saw a woman, legs up as if delivering a child although she was asleep. Next to her was a tray of instruments for the abortion and a vacuum machine for suctioning the fetal tissues from the uterus. The doctors put on their gowns and masks and the procedure began. The cervix was held open with a crude metal instrument and* a large transparent tube was stuck inside of the woman. Within a matter of seconds, the machines motor was engaged and blood, tissue, and tiny organs were pulled out of their environment into a filter. A minute later, the vacuum choked to a halt. The tube was removed, and stuck to the end was a small body and a head attached haphazardly to it, what was formed of the neck snapped. The ribs had formed with a thin skin covering them, the eyes had formed, and the inner organs had begun to function. The tiny heart of the fetus, obviously a little boy, had just stopped  forever. The vacuum filter was opened, and the tiny arms and legs that had been torn off of the fetus were accounted for. The fingers and toes had the beginnings of their nails on them. The doctors, proud of their work, reassembled the body to show me. *Tears welled up in my eyes as they removed the baby boy from the table and shoved his body into a container for disposal."


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...


You are defending abortion thus you are calling for babies to die. Is the truth that alien to you?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



no, I just hate the brainless vaginas with vocal cords who have such a potent vaginal itch ( and being brainless do not see any other option or so they state) that they will MURDER to satisfy it.
I admit - I hate those. 

But they are NOT women. They are XX brainless selfish sluts which are too stupid and too lazy to consider a birth control to be a method of "taking care of my body" instead of the murder of the innocent babies.

and I do not have to have numerous occasions to recognize you to be a brainless vagina with vocal cords - this thread is enough.
plus you are a typical leftard liar and I have caught you on lying several times


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > I have had two friends works at Planned Parenthood. I just asked one if you could tell what sex the baby was. This is what she responded with.
> ...



No it isn't.


----------



## j-mac (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Kooshdakhaa said:
> 
> 
> > Wow.  I can tell you've never felt really hot, sexual passion.  Because if you ever had you might understand how a woman could lose control of herself in the throes of passion and make a mistake and have unprotected sex.  I'm sorry for you that you can't grasp that.
> ...


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Why do repeat the same insults over and over? 
You hate women. It's cool. Most hate you too, I am guessing. 
And you have no clue why a woman has an abortion, and you should stop pretending you do. You should also stop judging women you have never met.


----------



## Stephanie (Oct 18, 2013)

I hope she aborted all her children

she's a useless person


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

j-mac said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Kooshdakhaa said:
> ...


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> sunshine said:
> 
> 
> > did anyone notice how much sarah palin looks like steinem did in her younger days?  That's just freaky!
> ...



exactly!


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 18, 2013)

ANYTIME a liberal tells you how sensitive they are to human suffering and injustice just needs to remember they SUPPORT killing of innocent babies for sex,race and convenience.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



It isn't your body that we're concerned with, it's the body of the unborn human.  If the woman has an abortion it's obvious she doesn't care about them.  It's obvious those who whole heartedly support abortion don't care about them. But the people who do care the abortion supporters berate.  How heartless to care so little about another human being that you (general) don't want to hear what pro-lifers say.

The government is suppose to protect it's citizens.  Yeah, yeah I know.  'pre-borns' are citizens, aren't humans, aren't people.  Like I said, de-humanize them, diminish what abortion does, make it all about the woman with nary a thought about the unborn.

Whatever.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> The only person I see supporting hate  here is you. He isn't calling for the deaths of innocent babies. Tell me are you like Sanger and hoping the babies killed are black? It is what planned parenthood was made for by the way. Democrats always show their true racist roots



they are too ignorant to know that.
and if you shovel it in front of them, they will accuse you of hate


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> I hope she aborted all her children
> 
> she's a useless person



That's an awful thing to say.  Why would you even say that?  Why would you want those children dead?? ... just because you don't approve of the mother?

Wow.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Truth hurts?

I know.

But it does not mean it is not truth - brainless vaginas with vocal cords which proudly parade around their murdering the babies - are brainless sluts no matter how you view it. They are NOT women - they are XX vaginas with vocal cords, like that POS gloria steinem is.

*There is NO NEED to murder a baby in 2013 USA - where is no stigma and all the government support of the mother and the baby.*
You know it is a uterine job for some, don't you?
Plus you can give the baby for adoption or to the father of the baby if you choose to.
You don't have to use murder as a birth control.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> I hope she aborted all her children
> 
> she's a useless person



she is.

but the children have had the right to life.

Don't become like the leftard side. I know it is easy, given all the hate and spite and bile the left is demonstrating.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



If a women doesn't care about the baby should she be having a baby?


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > The only person I see supporting hate  here is you. He isn't calling for the deaths of innocent babies. Tell me are you like Sanger and hoping the babies killed are black? It is what planned parenthood was made for by the way. Democrats always show their true racist roots
> ...



You are calling people ignorant while quoting a ignorant bigots post? 
Is that irony?


----------



## Stephanie (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > I hope she aborted all her children
> ...



I know, I was meaning I wouldn't want the children to have a mother like her

parading around with a shirt on, crowing she is proud she aborted her child


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



yes it is. as all the leftard lies are.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> I hope she aborted all her children
> 
> she's a useless person


Such compassion from the pro life crowd.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



You mean angry vaginas with vocal cords?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



I have you and other vaginas with vocal cords to support the claim - you guys are as ignorant as it can get - as all the leftard shills are.

Otherwise you won't be LEFTARD.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...




She can give the child up for adoption.  

Dodged the rest.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



Sure


----------



## j-mac (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> j-mac said:
> 
> 
> > Only one problem to your defense of abortion here, and that is that the overwhelming reason, and use of legalized abortion today, is not for health, not for a mistake caused by passion overriding common sense, not anything other than convenience....
> ...



Why yes, yes I do....



>  The reasons women give for having an abortion underscore their understanding of the responsibilities of parenthood and family life. *Three-fourths of women cite concern for or responsibility to other individuals; three-fourths say they cannot afford a child; three-fourths say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or the ability to care for dependents; and half say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner.*[7]
> 
> Facts on Induced Abortion in the United States



Anything else I can help you with?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



yep. like yours.

an easy google search would show you that your claim is a lie, but being an ignorant vagina with vocal cords you are unable to analyze and check the information yourself 

angry vagina with vocal cords is even better that simple one - because they are angry  Thanks


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



But what if she doesn't?


----------



## j-mac (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Then she must raise it. It really isn't that complicated.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Then she will do what you are doing and despite animosity between us I have to command you for your CHOICE.
I remember you work nights.
And that is a sacrifice for your kid.
But that is a right sacrifice.
Why do you chose to support all those murderers while yourself not being one - is unexplainable.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Then back up your claim if it is that easy. 

And I did look it up, it is very rare to be able to tell the sex of the baby before 12-14 weeks. 
The letter was fake. It's okay. 

And my vagina isn't angry, it's actually very happy.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



The difference is, I wanted my child. No matter how bad my situation was and the fact he wasn't planned. The moment I found out I was pregnant, I wanted him. Therefore I don't give him a guilt trip when I have to work hard to support him. 
I support a woman's choice because I have seen what it is like when a girl has a child she doesn't want, or realize there is other circumstances that factor into a woman's decision.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Fetal development: The first trimester - MayoClinic.com

do I also need to explain the terminology to you? 

Prenatal gender determination and the diagnosis of genital anomalies - Pajkrt - 2004 - BJU International - Wiley Online Library
 Determination of gender - 10 and 14 weeks by Z Efrat et al which appeared in the Journal: Ultrasound in Obstetrics and Gynecology 1999; 13:305&#8211;30, reported:

The 172 women were all scanned transabdominally. Using a midline sagittal scan with the fetus supine and the spine parallel to the transducer face (sound lines perpendicular) &#8216;without extension of the spine or limbs&#8217;, angles were drawn on an image of the genital area with a line through the genital tubercle and another through the lumbosacral skin line. Male fetuses were characterised by an angle >300 (angle increases with age) and a females by parallel or convergent lines (angle <300). In other words, the phallus was vertical/cranially directed in males and caudally directed in females. *At 12 weeks the accuracy of gender assignment was 98.7% and at 13 weeks the accuracy was 100%.* There was incorrect assignment of males as females in 3% at 12 weeks and no females assigned as males after 12 weeks. The authors therefore conclude that &#8216;a final decision on invasive testing for sex-linked conditions should be undertaken only after 12 weeks of gestation&#8217;
*
Just to remind you, angry vagina,  -- that is by ULTRASOUND, not by direct visualization upon abortion, when it can be done with 100% accuracy by the end of first trimester ( 12 weeks) if the baby's body is not too destroyed.*

*The letter was the ultimate truth - the abortion in question was in second trimester - the description of some details proved that it was absolutely truthful.*


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



it is still NOT a reason to MURDER the baby.
You can give your baby for adoption even after some time passed - and you realize you can't handle the motherhood.
If you WANT to.

there are no other circumstances except the convenience in murdering one's baby.


----------



## Stephanie (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > I hope she aborted all her children
> ...



too bad, I don't have compassion for people like her...just disgust and pity

she doesn't show us compassion in this country

prancing around shoving her abortion in people and children's face


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



you idiot, the cervix IS closed  and in order to get into the uterus one needs to dilate it - that is why the woman needs sedation or anesthesia as dilation is painful.
and the instrument is crude.
as is speculum.
but you, angry vaginas, consider a vaginal US probe to be "invasive" and a speculum and a cervix dilator - to be not 
talking about stupid 

and the student in question is PRE-medical student, not a medical one 
does the difference have to be explained to you as well?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Kooshdakhaa said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Pennywise said:
> ...



Well see there's where you're wrong. I was just smart enough to take care of that BEFORE I found myself in that situation, it's called the birthcontrol pill. It's 99.9 percent effective. With a condom it's very effective. I'm just sorry you're mental capacity is so small you can't think that far ahead.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Rebelitarian said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



well the feminist movement certainly hasn't succeeded. Woman are still underpaid,women certainly had more respect for themselves and had more respect from others before the movement than they do now. We still wear bras,so even burning them didn't work out  I hate bras.lol Men see us and are more vocal about using us as sex objects and unlike pre movement, women are more than happy to oblige.  All you have to do is listen to one of the kids songs to figure that out. Sure more women go to college, but the school curriculum has been dumbed down so much, is she really getting a better education? The only thing that has come from the movement is better contraception but it would appear  from this thread that today's women are woefully uninformed about it. Then of course there are the so called feminists themselves. Steinem and her ilk are dinosaurs still stuck in 1973 and hell bent on making sure women don't progress. Yup pretty much a major fail. We need another and better womans movement cause the last one missed the mark.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



While you do?


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



Oh, now I get it. Women are fucking, and you and Vox aren't getting any.

Maybe if you weren't so disgustingly blatant with the misogyny, you could get the occasional pity fuck.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Rebelitarian said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



AMERICAN feminists.

Not feminists.

American variety are the angry vaginas with vocal cords paid by evil corporations so by their constant shrieking about abortion they divert the attention from the REAL feminist issues - like a guaranteed maternity leave and pregnancy protection at the workplace.

Which is a standard practice in the countries where feminism IS about protecting women and making their natural role as a mother easier.
Contrary to American "feminstas" whose goal is to make women an underpaid workforce for the benefit of the big pockets.
Which they have succeeded with the help of brainless vaginas with vocal cords


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



angry vagina, I am a woman 

everybody smart enough on this board have figured that long time ago.

but brainless vaginas with vocal cords could not guess it even when I told them that I had maternity leave for 3 years


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Via ultra sound.  When they're dead on the table is a different story.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > > The student had heard the pro-choice movements slogans. He took them at face value, believing that the unborn baby was a mass of cells and not an individual human being. He felt that a woman had the right to control her body and did not sympathize with the tiny baby inside her. He did not believe in the childs humanity or right to life.
> ...



Well now we've hit on another fine point against abortion, the physical toll on the woman herself. You will note that Noomi said "the woman may suffer an infection". This is very true. Matter of fact I knew someone who had three abortions and got infected after every one. The infections were so bad she landed in the hospital. Now this is one of the dirty little secrets Steinem and friends don't want you to hear, that things can go very wrong after an abortion. My friends doctor warned her that she would not be able to have children if she got another infection and advised her she should not have another abortion. She got married,had one child and was forced to have a hysterectomy at the age of *24* due to the complications of her abortion. All of her abortions were performed by reputable clinics. The fact is Abortion is not good for a womans body. It's a surgical proceedure and like any other surgery, carries risks. While I'm sure waviers are signed that tell a woman that, all the pro choice BS makes it sound like no big deal. It is a big deal and women need to be told that.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



the concept is too difficult to grasp for the leftards.
they consider vaginal US probe to be "invasive" and speculum and cervical dilator - to be not


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Kooshdakhaa said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Your choices were smart for you and that's where it ends.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



you expect the other brainless angry vagina with vocal cords to understand what she is reading? It is stated in the article, that the student was PRE-medical and that abortion was a second-trimester one - by the description of the details of the body it is clear it was 12-13 weeks gestation.
abortion is DETRIMENTAL both to the body and to mental health of the woman.
The very reason I was negged by BDBoop was I posted the links to SCIENTIFIC articles confirming that suicide and depression rate among women undergoing abortion is sky-high. It is a karmic boomerang getting back to those who proudly parade "I had an abortion".

It IS a murder of innocent life and they know it - therefore the psychiatric complications and the spiteful hateful attacks of all the vaginas on the pro-lifers.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Misogyny /m&#618;&#712;s&#594;d&#658;&#618;ni/ is the hatred or dislike of women or girls.

You can be female and still be a misogynist.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > When a woman finds she is pregnant, no one is saying she is a slut.  That is how you perceive it.  But by going for an abortion rather than having the child and giving it up for adoption is definitely selfish.  You are subjecting yourself to probably 5 months of pregnancy where you are showing and labor and birth.  That is not bad with the drugs they give you now.  You would be seen as an upstanding woman to go through the pregnancy and for a family and everyone wins. Giving a family a child...what a gift!
> ...



Children aren't a disease, they are a blessing even if you give them up for adoption. 

Have you ever been pregnant Noomi? It's not this god awful thing, actually it's pretty wonderful and I was sick during 90% of mine with pre-eclampsia. The pain of childbirth or in my case,c-sections were well worth it. The love you feel for your child is eye opening. I never knew I could love someone like that until I had kids. My husband and I became closer in our love for eachother because of the children. BTW I have one adopted daughter and yes she is a blessing.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



no, I hate the angry vaginas with vocal cords like yourself because it denigrates all the women to the role of sex object as you and other steinem-like are.

and BDBoop had no idea I am a woman - which is clear from BDBoop previous post 
But I am a woman, not an angry vagina with vocal cords and that is a humongous difference.

Try to be one and you will find out what I mean


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Um I think you are replying to someone else?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



yeah, I mixed you with BDBoop, sorry for that - I changed the post.


----------



## NLT (Oct 18, 2013)

bodecea said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > It is very common today for women to authenticate themselves by claiming they had an abortion even if they never had one.
> ...



Not common for bull dyke carpet munchers


----------



## NLT (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Luddly dullard, LR is a Woman, you fucking tardicus


----------



## NLT (Oct 18, 2013)

If I wore a shirt that read *"I fathered 5 aborted babies and now its Miller time", *do you think the feminazis would get upset?


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

Hell no, they'd follow you around like you were a god. You're their kinda man! The kind that abuses women, coerces them into abortion...and never gets caught because they protect your ass!


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## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Esmeralda said:


> Abortion is accepted and legal the world over. The only places it isn't legal is in theocracies or in extremely, highly religious countries that are pretty darn near theocracies, such as Ireland. The US is a secular country. If you want to live in a Christian theocracy, move to one, and live in a country that does not allow abortion. Otherwise, abortion is LEGAL in the US and it is not up to you to impose your religious or moral beliefs on the majority the US population. No one is forcing you to get an abortion, so don't get one, but do not speak as if you have a right to censure or control what others do.



I didn't drag religion into this ladies so why are you? I'm trying to point out that any woman proud of having an abortion should have her head examined.  If you are still using abortion as birthcontrol, 1973 called and they want the mentality they gave you back. There are much better ways through contraception that abortion is an outdated practice. It's the difference between a rotary dial wall phone and a Iphone s. why would you want to continue using outdated abortion when you can use 2013 methods of  birthcontrol?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Hell no, they'd follow you around like you were a god. You're their kinda man! The kind that abuses women, coerces them into abortion...and never gets caught because they protect your ass!



those stupid vaginas with vocal cords don't realize why such a big number of men are supporting their idiotic notion of "it is my body" - because it lets them totally off the hook and lets them treat those sluts not with respect, but like unpaid prostitutes


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

So Vox hates herself for being female?


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

The *feminists* think that Larry Flynt & Hugh Hefner are the epitome of feminine empowerment...

Because they believe a woman's snatch is her sole claim to fame. She has no other identity, except via her vagina. Women are only useful when they are using their vaginas vigorously, often, and preferrably with a wide assortment of non-traditional characters.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> > Abortion is accepted and legal the world over. The only places it isn't legal is in theocracies or in extremely, highly religious countries that are pretty darn near theocracies, such as Ireland. The US is a secular country. If you want to live in a Christian theocracy, move to one, and live in a country that does not allow abortion. Otherwise, abortion is LEGAL in the US and it is not up to you to impose your religious or moral beliefs on the majority the US population. No one is forcing you to get an abortion, so don't get one, but do not speak as if you have a right to censure or control what others do.
> ...


No, you did not.
Religion has absolutely NOTHING to do with simple science that LIFE begins at conception. To be exactly precise - when zygote begins to divide.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> So Vox hates herself for being female?



no I hate the ones like you or steinem because you are an abomination - you, angry vaginas with vocal cords are NOT women, just sex objects for irresponsible men.

This makes it look ALL the women are like you - because you are angry, spiteful and very vocal.

Not that you are not being distinguished quickly but constant shrieking of yours is damaging to the young generation - both men and women - the first are finding it hard to respect the shrieking vaginas, the latter are finding it confusing and hard to learn how not to be a shrieking vagina.


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

And they despise the one thing that is the essence of all that is female...the ability to bear children.

They see it as a hindrance, a stigma, which is also the way they view children.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

NLT said:


> If I wore a shirt that read *"I fathered 5 aborted babies and now its Miller time", *do you think the feminazis would get upset?



you should also have a one "I am dumping babes whenever I find they got pregnant, they can do with their body whatever they want" - you will be a magnet for ones like BDBoop


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> And they despise the one thing that is the essence of all that is female...the ability to bear children.
> 
> They see it as a hindrance, a stigma, which is also the way they view children.



maybe not all of them, but a huge amount - it is a form of psychological defense, however twisted it may be.

their goddess hated ALL children, though as a eugenic she was focused on minority ones mostly.


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## mamooth (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Because they believe a woman's snatch is her sole claim to fame. She has no other identity, except via her vagina. Women are only useful when they are using their vaginas vigorously, often, and preferrably with a wide assortment of non-traditional characters.



You understand that stupid crazy talk such as that is why everyone classifies you as mentally ill, right?

It's no biggie if you don't get it, because everyone else does. When you pro-lifers put your insanity front and center, it just drives people away from the pro-life cause. So by all means, keep it up.


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

Lol...thinking you speak for the collective is actually a symptom of mental illness.

Look at my rep, then look at yours, then tell me again what *everyone* thinks of me.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Because they believe a woman's snatch is her sole claim to fame. She has no other identity, except via her vagina. Women are only useful when they are using their vaginas vigorously, often, and preferrably with a wide assortment of non-traditional characters.
> ...



by everyone else you mean angry vaginas with vocal cords and their sex partners?

Your microbrain is too small to comprehend the idea that "everyone else" is not those groups of people. It is just your environment, nothing else


----------



## mamooth (Oct 18, 2013)

> Lol...thinking you speak for the collective is actually a symptom of mental illness.
> 
> Look at my rep, then look at yours, then tell me again what *everyone* thinks of me.



You should know by now that your neg-bully routine doesn't work with decent honest people. And yes, I know how much that pisses off the rep-obsessed clique, when they can't bully someone into a retreat. After all, it's not like they can win by debating.

But congrats, you have proven that you can suck the ass of the conservative rep-clique effectively and consistently. That absolutely makes you not a stupid crazy person. Really it does.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Because they believe a woman's snatch is her sole claim to fame. She has no other identity, except via her vagina. Women are only useful when they are using their vaginas vigorously, often, and preferrably with a wide assortment of non-traditional characters.
> ...





Too funny.


----------



## mamooth (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> by everyone else you mean angry vaginas with vocal cords and their sex partners?



And mentally disturbed person #2 steps up to provide some input. 

Yes, good strategy. Calling women "vaginas with vocal cords" will just bring 'em running to your cause.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> You should know by now that your neg-bully 'tard routine doesn't work with decent honest people. And yes, I know how much that pisses off the rep-obsessed clique, wehn they can't bully someone into a retreat. After all, it's not like they can win by debating.
> 
> But congrats, you have proven that you can suck the ass of the conservative rep-clique effectively and consistently. That absolutely makes you not a stupid crazy person. Really it does.



Thanks for the head's up!

/pos repped


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> You should know by now that your neg-bully 'tard routine doesn't work with decent honest people. And yes, I know how much that pisses off the rep-obsessed clique, wehn they can't bully someone into a retreat. After all, it's not like they can win by debating.
> 
> But congrats, you have proven that you can suck the ass of the conservative rep-clique effectively and consistently. That absolutely makes you not a stupid crazy person. Really it does.



the only stupid crazy people around are the angry vaginas with vocal cords.

Their male supporters are not crazy, though. They are abusive jerks, and quite clever to brainwash the sex object they are using to be a vocal vagina without a brain.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > by everyone else you mean angry vaginas with vocal cords and their sex partners?
> ...



not all women ARE angry vaginas with vocal cords. But steinem and some here on the board are the most perfect examples of exactly that - brainless angry vaginas with vocal cords.

and listen, retard.

I am a woman and there are PLENTY of women who do not want to be EVER considered anything like the angry vagina with vocal cords. EVER.
It is denigrating to be considered a sex object used without any commitments - which all those steinems, flukes and others vaginal shrieks are promoting( but they are not the ones which are puppeteers, though they are too stupid to know that)
But it takes a brain to grow to realize that.
Which you lack.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Hunter's Moon tonight, as expressed by the USMB loons.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > You should know by now that your neg-bully 'tard routine doesn't work with decent honest people. And yes, I know how much that pisses off the rep-obsessed clique, wehn they can't bully someone into a retreat. After all, it's not like they can win by debating.
> ...



Keep going. This way more people will know what a loon you are.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> So Vox hates herself for being female?



I thought Vox was a man?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> So Vox hates herself for being female?



There are some females that are female misogynists.

Slut-shaming is an old school way of trying to socially control others for expressing seuxality, it typically happens more often to females but males can be put into that category once in a  while as well.

Some problems with early feminism is that it made presumptions that problems white privileged women perceived as a universal women's problems which was not really true.

One example : White women wanted the right to work, and women of color couldn't relate to the idea of working outside the home as liberating, because they had always worked outside the home and were tired.

In order to address an issue like abortion I think it is just as important to  hold men accountable for pregnancies as women, and hold them equally responsible in making the decision for abortion or not.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

NLT said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



She is still creepy.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > by everyone else you mean angry vaginas with vocal cords and their sex partners?
> ...



And you're just an asshole with vocal cords. Shut the fuck up mamooth.

Only liberals like you would revel the prospect of murdering unborn children.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Take your own advice. Vox is a loon, so of course you defend him.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Revel? 
Like he said. Your crazy comments do not  help people come to your side.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



What is the purpose of using that language to refer to women, it's disrespectful in my opinion.

Can't you just disagree with some females opinions without attempting to reduce them or demean them?


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



He hates women. It is proven by his comments. 

Because I am pro choice, to him that translates to angry vagina.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > So Vox hates herself for being female?
> ...



He's claiming to be a she. Guess that makes me Blake Lively, Ryan Reynolds' wife.

We are so very happy! We're thinking about starting a family.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Really? Was it the breast feeding thread that it was proven he could in no way be a woman? 
I can't remember. 
Either way, Vox isn't a woman.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Well, YOU know that. And I know that.

But Vox is gender-confused.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



I am sure he knows... But it doesn't fit in with his character here.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > So Vox hates herself for being female?
> ...



a brainless stupid angry vagina with vocal cords like you are could not figure it out when I even told YOU that I have had 3 year maternity leave 

talking about stupid


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.



only against retarded angry vaginas with vocal cords.

they do not deserve any respect, though, just contempt.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

angry brainless vaginas with vocal cords a.k.a. BDBoop and Luissa can't comprehend that somebody does not have to be a shrieking vagina with leftards leanings to be a woman?

well, if they never have encountered a woman but only angry shrieking bitches a.k.a. vaginas with vocal cords - that would explain it.
Plus being a leftard does not contribute to one's intelligence, so they resort to the most primitive defense - denial 

And LIES


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



I really don't think anyone cares about your sex like BD, but it's knuckle draggers like you who keep women hooked on barbaric practices like abortion. Keep their legs crossed?   I guess you didn't read the part about birthcontrol and how it's 99.9% effective that pregnancy shouldn't even be an issue especially if a male uses a condom along with it. Nah you'd rather keep women in the dark and protect the dismemberment unborn children.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.
> ...



All people in this discussion deserve respect, including you.


While the topic can become emotional, it can still be a discussion when people are respectful.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



I name it as I see it.

If a so-called female is supporting the bitch who is parading around her murder of the unborn child - she can not be a WOMAN by default - because she lacks basic female characteristics - empathy, responsibility, need to care for the weak and defenseless ( a baby) and can be only crazy vagina with vocal cords which is obsessed by unprotected sex. Those types of female crazies were called nymphomaniacs in the past centuries, and I could name our angry vaginas that as well, but I suspect their small brains won't know what is it and inability to find out would make them think it's a compliment 

So it is not me demeaning them and reducing them to the level of sex object - they do it THEMSELVES with their maniac drive to murder, in order to bypass the responsibility to make reasonable choice which are plenty available.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



In reading the article behind the photo, it looks like the purpose was to :



> Supporters of the shirts told WWAY that they are simply trying to de-stigmatize the word abortion. Critics said the abortion shirts are out of line and embarrassing to the UNCW student body.



?I Had an Abortion? Shirt Sales Stir Controversy at University of North Carolina Wilmington | TheBlaze.com

[ame=http://youtu.be/mf74l9Oc38g]"I had an Abortion" T-Shirt Sparks Controversy - YouTube[/ame]



> "I had an abortion" isn't what we expect to see on a t-shirt, but author Jennifer Baumgardner (speaking at the University of North Carolina Wilmington) felt like it would be a wise move as a promotion for her book, and as a way to fight anti-abortion stigma. Critics of the shirts fought back with protests and a counter t-shirt that read "I haven't killed a baby." Ana Kasparian and John Iadarola respond to this t-shirt back and forth.
> 
> Was it wise to wear the "I had an abortion" t-shirts? Or could Baumgardner have gotten her message across in a wiser way? And what about the "I haven't killed a baby" shirts? Is that any better? What would you say if you came across someone wearing one of these shirts?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

While I think people should have the right to make their own choices, I think the t-shirt almost glorifies abortion.

I don't really think whatever the intention was that it comes off the way they intended, it almost seems like there is pride in it.

A case of lost in translation.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Of course a moron like you can't understand I didn't believe you. 
But there ya go with the angry vagina. Are you projecting your issues on me? Too many angry vaginas?


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.
> ...



And you think someone like you deserves respect? Are you the same person who judges me and others over breast feeding? 
Do you get a dollar from some Pro Life group every time you say angry vagina with vocal cords? I sure hope so, otherwise the fact you keep repeating it is a little strange.


----------



## Rozman (Oct 18, 2013)

Sounds to me like they are proud of what they did.
They had an abortion and are proud of it and they are rubbing everyone's nose in it.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

> Was it wise to wear the "I had an abortion" t-shirts? Or could Baumgardner have gotten her message across in a wiser way? And what about the "I haven't killed a baby" shirts? Is that any better? What would you say if you came across someone wearing one of these shirts?



If someone can trot around with a t-shirt stating "I haven't killed a baby" then I see nothing wrong with a t-shirt that says "I had an abortion".

Political correctness is going wayyyyyy overboard. Goose, gander.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Gender is a social construction.

You have an idea of how a female should behave, present herself and what kind of choices she should make and that's how you feel.

That doesn't mean it's how everyone feels and shaming people for feeling differently does not make you right, it only makes you unable to look at someone else's situation or perspective.

There is no way anyone can be an "object" unless they have an audience willing to perpetuate it.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> angry brainless vaginas with vocal cords a.k.a. BDBoop and Luissa can't comprehend that somebody does not have to be a shrieking vagina with leftards leanings to be a woman?
> 
> well, if they never have encountered a woman but only angry shrieking bitches a.k.a. vaginas with vocal cords - that would explain it.
> Plus being a leftard does not contribute to one's intelligence, so they resort to the most primitive defense - denial
> ...



Says the person who keeps repeating "angry vagina with vocal cords". 
I know quite a bit of right wing women, good thing they are nothing like you.
Tell me again your views on breast feeding?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Gracie said:


> > Was it wise to wear the "I had an abortion" t-shirts? Or could Baumgardner have gotten her message across in a wiser way? And what about the "I haven't killed a baby" shirts? Is that any better? What would you say if you came across someone wearing one of these shirts?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I don't like either t-shirt but that's just me.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



You don't deserve to be called names .


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



pardon me, I don't have respect to shrieking vaginas.

whose only argument in defense of the murder is - it is my body ( a LIE) and I can do whatever I want ( a selfish irresponsibility of a bitch).

We are talking XXI century extremely affluent country here - there is no NEED for abortion as it might have been decades ago in a poor or repressive community ( still a murder, but at least can be explained by the reality of real difficulties existence, which is not the case NOW.
Plus what was known about fetal development in 1921 is not the same as in 2013.
If one can do fetal surgeries as early as 14-15 week gestation and consider that baby to be a baby and at the same time advocate the murder of the totally the same baby but unwanted - for convenience - I can not consider such a "woman" anything more than a brainless vagina with vocal cords.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Maybe it's just Vox, but when a guy says something I don't agree with, I don't resort to using filthy language about his sexual parts. That is assinine. And childish.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> It is tissue. Not only that, but it's not YOUR tissue. Now, I realize you've given yourself permission to pass judgment on everybody who disagrees with you on this subject - I just hope you're not a Christian, because your sin is on a par with hers.



 Good point so lets see what the tissue looks like shall we? Most abortions happen in the first trimester of pregnancy. After all women need to be well informed if they are going to have an abortion right?




Month One of Pregnancy

The amniotic sac is a water-tight sac that forms around the fertilized egg.  It helps cushion the growing embryo throughout pregnancy.

The placenta also develops at this point in the first trimester. The placenta is a round, flat organ that transfers nutrients from the mother to the baby, and transfers waste from the baby.

A primitive face takes form with large dark circles for eyes. The mouth, lower jaw, and throat are developing. Blood cells are taking shape, and circulation will begin.

By the end of the first month of pregnancy, your baby is around 6-7mm (1/4 inch) long - about the size of a grain of rice!




Month Two of Pregnancy

Your baby's facial features continue to develop. Each ear begins as a little fold of skin at the side of the head. Tiny buds that eventually grow into arms and legs are forming. Fingers, toes, and eyes are also forming in the second month of pregnancy.

The neural tube (brain, spinal cord, and other neural tissue of the central nervous system) is well formed. The digestive tract and sensory organs begin to develop. Bone starts to replace cartilage. The embryo begins to move, although the mother cannot yet feel it.

By the end of the second month, your baby, now a fetus, is about 2.54cm (1 inch) long, weighs about 9.45g (1/3 ounce), and a third of baby is now made up of its head.

I'd like you all to note that by the end of the second month the brain,spinal cord and neural tissue of the nervous system is "well formed"  and the baby can move. This means that the baby can feel the pain of being pulled apart by an abortion


Month Three of Pregnancy

By the end of the third month of pregnancy, your baby is fully formed. Your baby has arms, hands, fingers, feet, and toes and can open and close its fists and mouth. Fingernails and toenails are beginning to develop and the external ears are formed. The beginnings of teeth are forming. Your baby's reproductive organs also develop, but the baby's gender is difficult to distinguish on ultrasound. The circulatory and urinary systems are working and the liver produces bile.

At the end of the third month, your baby is about 7.6 -10 cm (3-4 inches) long and weighs about 28g (1 ounce).
1 to 3 Months Pregnant - 1st Trimester Baby Growth & Development


 Oh look By the end of the third month of pregnancy, your baby is fully formed. Imagine hacking to death a tiny fully formed baby because you were careless and it's inconvienient for you. Good job abortionists, for your next act of compassion why don't you go knock over an 80 year old lady because she moves to slow


----------



## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Negged, because I grow weary of his idiotic tantrums.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > angry brainless vaginas with vocal cords a.k.a. BDBoop and Luissa can't comprehend that somebody does not have to be a shrieking vagina with leftards leanings to be a woman?
> ...



Because you ARE angry vagina with vocal cords.

A *woman* won't advertise and support a murder of a baby just because she is inconvenient.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Gracie said:


> Maybe it's just Vox, but when a guy says something I don't agree with, I don't resort to using filthy language about his sexual parts. That is assinine. And childish.



I think he is getting paid to say "angry vagina with vocal cords".


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

one more loser addition to the vaginas with vocal cords - which is too scared to discuss, just resort to neg 
what else is new except loser gracie


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Gracie said:


> Negged, because I grow weary of his idiotic tantrums.



because you are a sore brainless loser


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Because she is inconvenient? 
I already explained I don't have an angry vagina, but hey you just earned another dollar. How much is that now? Twenty, thirty dollars? 

And what does a woman do? Trash other women? 
You never answered my question on breast feeding either???


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> one more loser addition to the vaginas with vocal cords - which is too scared to discuss, just resort to neg
> what else is new except loser gracie



I guess repeating vagina with vocal cords over and over to earn money makes you a winner.


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.


 
Er..the gender of "females" is ..female...isn't it?

Why show respect to people who degrade women? How have they earned respect?


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Sure, well why can't you make your points about abortion without all that other vulgar name calling?

It just distracts from the points you want to make about the topic.

You don't have to do anything but your argument would be taken more seriously and discussed if you left all that other stuff out.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > Negged, because I grow weary of his idiotic tantrums.
> ...



Sore? Is her vagina's vocal cords sore? 
Will I earn money if I keep repeating it?


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.
> ...



Of course Vox and you never degrade women, not even once.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox's tone towards females has been disrespectful in my opinion, regardless of gender.
> ...



Vox deserves a voice to air his/her opinion on the topic the "t-shirt"  even if the majority of females disagree with his/her opinion.

I don't mean respecting the name-calling.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...




If you are so irresponsible that you got pregnant with million choices available - in the XXI century you can deliver a baby and give it for adoption ( you can find willing adoptive parents during early pregnancy - plenty of willing) or you can have a baby and all the taxpayers are going to support you because it's the law.
Or you can have a baby and be a responsible woman, not a slut who is a murder for convenience.

it is a murder, not just a choice of a car or studies in the university.

And since you don't see anything problematic with not only support of the murder, but support of disgusting parading of that murder - you clearly lack some moral compass here.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Why are you only making females responsible, males who impregnate have a responsibility to.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



And you have moral compass? I didn't know being judgmental and full of hate was an example of having morals.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



the majority of females agreed with my opinion. only shrieking vaginas with vocal cords a.k.a. luissa and BDBoop and cowardly old gracie ( which had a feud with me previously) approve that parading.
Koshergirl, LR, myself, and couple of other ladies totally abhorred that steinem


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Ding ding, one more dollar.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...


unlike you, I have a moral compass.
but I do not expect for you to have one - you neither have a brain nor a heart.


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## Immanuel (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> 
> Even so -  government has no place in controlling women's reproduction. Period.
> 
> Get government out of our private lives.



You say that and yet you support the ACA.  Some of us call that hypocritical.

Immie


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Why are you only making females responsible, males who impregnate have a responsibility to.



of course they are. but what those shrieking vaginas with vocal cords but without a brain cause is a total male irresponsibility - all of those happily jumping in support of the "woman's choice of her body" - are the exact beneficiaries of this idiocy - because it not only lets them off the hook but also makes those vaginas easily accessible - like whores without necessity to pay - it's a dream for irresponsible male


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



You have a heart? As you sit in judgement of people you don't know? 
What was your opinion on breast feeding again? Since you are such a caring moral person. I bet you take care of the elderly, and provide homes for pregnant poor teenage moms too. 
And I am sure you never judge moms living off of Tanf because they chose to keep their child.


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## Immanuel (Oct 18, 2013)

Immanuel said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> ...



I have read a little further and seen your reply...  and I still say some of us call you a hypocrite... Hypocrite. 

Immie


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...


 
Women like you and boop degrade yourselves, Luissa. The sad thing is you think you're doing women a favor by telling them they should be slutty, like you, and kill their babies if they happen to get knocked up..that is the epitome of a *strong, smart, empowered* female, in your view.

It's pathetic, and gross.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Long story short, you have never once shown compassion in your posts. As for morals, you have to answer to yourself on that one.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Pennywise said:
> ...



I know, you're preaching to the choir, but the argument is much easier from a secular point of view. As long as we infuse religion into it we will never overturn that abomination of Roe V Wade because they will continue to point and say we are trying to force our religion on them. The argument is winnable with science and secular debate because it becomes a civil and human rights issue. IMHO even that course of action would take to long. The fastest course of action is to present the facts themselves to abortionists and make them look at what they probably have never investigated. The women have been told that the unborn child is nothing but a bunch of cells,but we are all nothing more than a bunch of cells so the question then becomes how developed are those cells. By the end of 8 weeks the baby has a brain,spinal collum and a developing nervous system which means it can register pain of an abortion.  By the end of the first trimester the baby is fully developed. So now just because a person can't speak for themselves doesn't mean it doesn't have rights. Certainly from a human rights standard it could be considered  genocide/infanticide or at the very least child abuse.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> While I think people should have the right to make their own choices, I think the t-shirt almost glorifies abortion.
> 
> I don't really think whatever the intention was that it comes off the way they intended, it almost seems like there is pride in it.
> 
> A case of lost in translation.



well, but our brainless shrieking vaginas here all are in support of this - and that is why they are NOT women, just shrieking itching vaginas.

A *woman* even in support of abortion at some instances - can not support *this* glorification.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Show me where I said a woman should be slutty or kill their baby. I will be waiting. 
While you are at it, tell me your opinion on women who quit breast feeding. 

And how do you know I am slutty? Have I discussed my sex life with you? 
Like I said, you have no compassion and it shows.


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> > Lol...thinking you speak for the collective is actually a symptom of mental illness.
> >
> > Look at my rep, then look at yours, then tell me again what *everyone* thinks of me.
> 
> ...


 
Wow, you combined mentally ill ranting with a neg rep whine!

You rock!


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Gross, is hating women as much as you do. Why is that?


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > While I think people should have the right to make their own choices, I think the t-shirt almost glorifies abortion.
> ...



No it's itching? Is that an extra dollar? 
How much we up to now?


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

I don't hate women at all Luissa. I think they should be protected from slutty ghouls like you, who think their only worth is as a tool to satisfy a man, at the cost of their own health, and the lives of their children.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Long story short, you have never once shown compassion in your posts. As for morals, you have to answer to yourself on that one.



compassion for whom? glorificators of the murder? or the bitches who will murder an innocent baby for her convenience?

you are not only brainless you are


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

And you're posting like you're under the influence again, Luissa. Having a little relapse, are we?


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> And you're posting like you're under the influence again, Luissa. Having a little relapse, are we?



There we go. That's the degrading comment I was looking for.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Long story short, you have never once shown compassion in your posts. As for morals, you have to answer to yourself on that one.
> ...



It's cool, you looked bat shit crazy a few pages back.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > While I think people should have the right to make their own choices, I think the t-shirt almost glorifies abortion.
> ...



I would say that some men and some women would equally be turned off by abortion as well as view the t-shirt as more a glory symbol rather than the intention to de-stigmatize those who have had abortions.

In the same way that some men and some women will wear the t-shirts in support of abortion.

Both men and women have opinions about abortion, some men view abortion as a woman's choice and some men feel powerless because they have no say in what happens once they have impregnated a female.

It's an issue that everyone has a voice in.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> I don't hate women at all Luissa. I think they should be protected from slutty ghouls like you, who think their only worth is as a tool to satisfy a man, at the cost of their own health, and the lives of their children.



What am I doing to women now? 
Fuck! I am sure busy.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



I could not care less about your respect.
I do not consider you to be not only a woman but a human.
You are a scum.

one can grudgingly _understand_ some cases of abortion, but to put it as a flag and wave it high as a virtue - you can not fall lower than that - and that is all you and your ilk are doing.

you are nothing more than shrieking used vagina.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



whoever used you, angry used vagina


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I put something on a flag now? 
I think the scum is the person who stated I am slutty, have an angry vagina, and was some how used. 
Do you get money for changing it up to shrieking used vagina? Five bucks a shot?


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

I think Vox needs a nap. Your anger is getting the best of you.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Why are you only making females responsible, males who impregnate have a responsibility to.
> ...



Part of that problem is because men don't care.

The irresponsibility of men (as you put it), has a part in causing abortion and is rarely called out and instead women hold the burden of accountability. 

There are men who instead of being stuck with a decision about abortion would rather support it give money to pay for it and move on to the next woman.

If you really feel passionate about the topic why isn't there any peer pressure toward men to be more mindful and responsible for who they have sex with?

It seems to me that if you really wanted to end such a practice you would hold both parties accountable.


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## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



Witch hazel does wonders.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



abortion is legal almost everywhere in the world. But almost NOWHERE in the world is it legal to have abortion ON DEMAND up until 24 weeks - like in this country - certainly not ANYWHERE in Europe.

it is disgusting that one can save the baby and murder the baby of the same gestational age - for convenience.

And only in this country abortion is glorified and made a pride issue as a flag waving.
Even more disgusting are those rabid "women" who are foaming in defense of this atrocity, like the ones here - it's unheard of anywhere else.
Abortion is viewed like a shameful thing - as it should be, because it is a murder, not a liberation thing, like it is considered by American vaginas and is avoided as much as it is possible - which is almost 100% in nowadays world.
one can not feel nothing except contempt to those creatures advocating and defending murder for convenience and spitting bile on anybody who dares to name them as they are - scum.

Plus those "women" make all women look like sluts - because they are extremely noisy and think they are representing all women, whereas they are a minority of disgusting shrieking vaginas.


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## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

I wonder how many babies he has adopted that were going to be aborted but instead the woman decided to have it and just give it up. So Vox....how many kids ya got that you are supporting?


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > I don't hate women at all Luissa. I think they should be protected from slutty ghouls like you, who think their only worth is as a tool to satisfy a man, at the cost of their own health, and the lives of their children.
> ...



You really don't deserve the personal attacks.

What do you think about the topic of the t-shirt?

Do you think the intention of the shirts was lost or do you think it made the point exactly as it meant to?


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## j-mac (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Part of that problem is because men don't care.
> 
> The irresponsibility of men (as you put it), has a part in causing abortion and is rarely called out and instead women hold the burden of accountability.
> 
> ...



You know what? You're right! It is a double standard on our society for sure. I have both, and boy, and a girl, both grown now, but as they were being brought up I was instrumental in instilling both children with virtue. That means for my son to respect women, and be ultra careful to not get in a position to be in that circumstance, and that obviously went for the girl as well.

So many in the argument today don't take into account that our young men need to know that just hopping bed to bed is supremely disrespectful to women in general, and at that point they to me anyway are not much of a man.

But, let's not stray from the fact that abortion is being used as contraceptive as I already in this thread pointed out, and backed up.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



What is your opinion about it when the mother's life is in danger?

Do you feel both men and women have a responsibility in whether abortion happens?


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Why won't you tell me who is using me? Because I can't think of anyone right now? Maybe you can clear it up for me. 
FYI, I am not the one who sounds angry right now.


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

> Supporters of the shirts told WWAY that they are simply trying to* de-stigmatize the word abortio*n. Critics said the abortion shirts are out of line and embarrassing to the UNCW student body.



?I Had an Abortion? Shirt Sales Stir Controversy at University of North Carolina Wilmington | TheBlaze.com





> "I had an abortion" isn't what we expect to see on a t-shirt, but author Jennifer Baumgardner (speaking at the University of North Carolina Wilmington) felt like it would be a wise move as a promotion for her book, and as a way *to fight anti-abortion stigma.* Critics of the shirts fought back with protests and a counter t-shirt that read "I haven't killed a baby." Ana Kasparian and John Iadarola respond to this t-shirt back and forth.


The stigma should never be removed from abortion.  It is a horrific ordeal (for both woman and the unborn) and those who are contemplating an abortion should be given full information on what it does and how it may affect the woman.  It is nothing at all to be proud of ... quite the contrary.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



In my opinion, and I could be wrong the T shirt was to put a face to whom many judge. They throw hateful words and accusations out against women they don't know and have never met. 
I don't think it was a good idea, unless they wanted more outrage over the topic. 
Plus most women who have abortions don't announce it to the world.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

j-mac said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Part of that problem is because men don't care.
> ...



Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

Holding men equally accountable makes sense if you are arguing for human rights. Because it takes both men and women to procreate.

I always wonder why people who are against abortion never hold men accountable for being so irresponsible and only slut shame women.

If men had more care they would be rallying for their rights but the laws in effect seem to give evidence that men are fine with pushing that decision onto women.

In my opinion it is such a personal and private situation but I firmly believe both men and women should have that choice together and be equally responsible.

If a woman has the child the man has to pay child support period, why doesn't he get  a choice ? 

Do men who support abortion want out of the financial responsibility or don't want to bother with having to deal with kids and the female he impregnated for the rest of his life?

It's kind of selfish if that is the reason.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



if the mother's life is in danger - she should decide whom she wants to save, if that is a family - the family should decide.
It is a difficult situation but it is so extremely rare that it can be in a category of grudgingly understandable.

both are responsible if he is informed. In a lot of cases the man is just informed post-factum or is just informed to get the money.
I know few cases where the man was begging not to have an abortion that he can take the baby, that he will marry the woman - but "it was her body" and he could not do anything ( btw those case in some countries go to court - you do not have automatic "choice" if the husband or the partner is willing to raise the baby).

there is a little dirty secret to all this abortion business - yes, it's a business. And it is generating billions of dollars - so there is a necessity for some to keep it going - plus the USA have quite positive demographic outlook ( for now) - so there is no need in restrictions. But you would be surprised how the issue will disappear by itself, should the business become unprofitable or the demographic changes ( the latter is already, but it will take another 30-40 years)


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## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

I did not read the article, but I can't imagine any woman being PROUD. Making a statement about those who bomb birth control clinics? Yes. Being PROUD to kill a baby? Um, no. Well, unless they are as Vox states....vaginas with vocal cords. There. I said. Do I get paid now too?

Eye roll.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Agreed, I think they were trying to put a face to it so others who have had abortions wouldn't feel alone isolated or shame based.

I don't think it conveyed that to the general public though, it failed and came off as almost showing pride for it.


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## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Still waiting for the answer on HOW MANY CHILDREN NOT ABORTED that Vox has adopted or is supporting financially.


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



In instances where the man wants to keep the baby I think it's tragic that he has no choice.

What do you think about the men who gladly give money for the abortion and move on.

Do you think they should equally be shamed in the way you shame women?


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## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Gracie said:


> I did not read the article, but I can't imagine any woman being PROUD. Making a statement about those who bomb birth control clinics? Yes. Being PROUD to kill a baby? Um, no. Well, unless they are as Vox states....vaginas with vocal cords. There. I said. Do I get paid now too?
> 
> Eye roll.



Absolutely ! Good point.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



the one who impregnated you and then dumped you 
if you weren't used, you won't be  a single mother


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## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...


 
Where has vox *shamed* women? 

I find it fascinating that the most female aspect of a woman, her ability to bear a child, is considered *shameful* by the death cultists....and yet they can say with a straight face that they are about *empowering* women. How is it *empowering* to tell women that the one thing that makes them uniquely female is a hindrance, something to be *ashamed* of?

Empowering women isn't to make them into victims and tell them they should kill their babies as if they're parasites. If you want to empower women, stop talking of pregnancy in death vault tones; don't refer to babies as "mistakes" and treat them like a prison sentence. Support and encourage women in pregnancy and motherhood. THAT'S how you empower women. You actually empower them to be WOMEN. You don't try to hide the fact.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Part of that problem is because men don't care.



No. They were driven to not care - if it is all "my body" and "my choice" why should he care?


drifter said:


> The irresponsibility of men (as you put it), has a part in causing abortion and is rarely called out and instead women hold the burden of accountability.



why should it? it is not their body and their choice, or IS IT?


drifter said:


> There are men who instead of being stuck with a decision about abortion would rather support it give money to pay for it and move on to the next woman.


those have been around forever. But they did not have WOMEN on their side - and now they do - because all those abortion-crazy sluts with idiotic claims - "it's MY body and you have no right to it and to what I do with MY body" made this exactly possible and morally acceptable.


drifter said:


> If you really feel passionate about the topic why isn't there any peer pressure toward men to be more mindful and responsible for who they have sex with?



because it is the RESULT of the 40 years of shrieking vaginas claiming it is nothing more than "their body" and "their choice".
they let a lot of men drift into this comfort zone - "I could not care less - you do what you want - here are 300$"



drifter said:


> It seems to me that if you really wanted to end such a practice you would hold both parties accountable.



and how would you do that? if the stupid shrieking sluts are not even informing men? 
if you want to do both parties accountable - then BOTH parties have a decision to make, not just a woman - if HE does not agree for abortion - then there is NO ABORTION.
Then you can make both parties accountable


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

j-mac said:


> So many in the argument today don't take into account that our young men need to know that just hopping bed to bed is supremely disrespectful to women in general, and at that point they to me anyway are not much of a man.



But disrespect for the woman is the exact result of the hysteria of so-called women over murder of a baby if it is conceived - because it is "her body and her choice".
It is NOT her body and it is not her "choice".

and would it be discussed in a serious manner, not with hysteria of the vaginal crazies "men want to enslave me!", "why should I have a parasite in my body for 9 months"? "it is impeding my freedom!" and all other well-known "arguments" of a slut in defense of a murder - there won't be so much disrespect for the women from young men today.

And BTW, I have pointed exactly to that - that those shrieking vaginas are causing this disrespect and therefore they deserve nothing more but contempt.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> j-mac said:
> 
> 
> > So many in the argument today don't take into account that our young men need to know that just hopping bed to bed is supremely disrespectful to women in general, and at that point they to me anyway are not much of a man.
> ...



You should never speak about respecting women.


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## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> In instances where the man wants to keep the baby I think it's tragic that he has no choice.
> 
> What do you think about the men who gladly give money for the abortion and move on.
> 
> Do you think they should equally be shamed in the way you shame women?



the tragic situation results SOLELY form the idiocy of the situation "it is my body and my choice".
And you have to deal with all the consequences of such legally carved situation.
You want a man to not just give money and hop into another bed - you have to give him the possibility of CHOICE in DECISION making.

they do not have it NOW.

And therefore they are nothing to be ashamed for.
Shrieking vaginas with vocal cords are solely responsible for this situation.

BTW, there are plenty of young couples which do not follow this pattern - but is the woman who makes it happen - she is not shutting all the doors for the man by "her body and her choice" and they are making the choice - together. In the vast majority of cases to have a baby. Which should be the way it goes - there is no reason in the most affluent country under the sun with the most generous social network help and without any stigma attached to out-of the -wedlock birth  not to have a baby.


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Really? So because I am single that translates to me being dumped by child's father? 
Tell me again how moral it is to pass judgement on someone you don't know? 
If you had asked. I would have explained I was never dumped by my child's father and I am not angry he impregnated me. That would imply that I regret having my son, which I don't, I am thankful for every day I have with him. So on top of everything else you are implying I did not want my son. You are such an awesome person. 
As for the single part, that implies so much more. If a woman is single does that always mean she was used to you? Or slutty? 
Or... It could mean she has no time for a relationship and also doesn't want men coming in and out of her son's life. 

Vox you are an angry person, very judgmental. Plus your hatred for women is very apparent. You should really worry about your own life.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > j-mac said:
> ...



oh, piss off. you are not a woman. you are a shrieking used vagina with vocal cords.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



you can confabulate all you want, but your attitude towards men, relationships, abortion and shrieking vaginas tells it all.

and, btw, why do you hate men?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> I find it fascinating that the most female aspect of a woman, her ability to bear a child, is considered *shameful* by the death cultists....and yet they can say with a straight face that they are about *empowering* women. How is it *empowering* to tell women that the one thing that makes them uniquely female is a hindrance, something to be *ashamed* of?
> 
> Empowering women isn't to make them into victims and tell them they should kill their babies as if they're parasites. If you want to empower women, stop talking of pregnancy in death vault tones; don't refer to babies as "mistakes" and treat them like a prison sentence. Support and encourage women in pregnancy and motherhood. THAT'S how you empower women. You actually empower them to be WOMEN. You don't try to hide the fact.





you know where this myth of "empowering" woman comes form, don't you?

from the big pockets, which, on one hand want to make all women just a workforce, and on the other not to bear any financial losses when the workforce gets pregnant and has children.
Nowhere else in the developed world has this idiotic "empowerment" centered on murdering the very biological nature of a woman - everywhere else it was exactly the opposite - help with motherhood in form of maternity leaves and pregnancy protection, plus other benefits for the working women with children.

THIS is empowerment, and this is what feminists fought for. In everywhere else except the USA.

Plus it is multibillion business - in murdering the babies.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



What do you know about my views about men or relationships? Please inform me.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Ding ding, two more dollars.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



in your very post I am quoting 

you are _incredible_ 

so why do you hate men?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



don't be jealous 

so why do you hate men, Luissa?


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Where did i put down men other than you, or relationships? 
You are incredible with your projections. 
Why do you hate women? Now that is apparent with every single one of your posts. 

Oh! And you can add two more dollars. I bet your are almost up to a hundred now.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Why do you hate women?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



I hate vaginas with vocal cords, but those are not women.

so why do you hate men?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



why do you hate men, Luissa?
it's apparent you hate them from every shriek you produce


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Really? Show me an example.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Did I call you a dick with a size problem anywhere in this thread?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Luissa, why do you hate men?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



every single  post of yours  in this thread is an example.

so why do you hate men so strongly, Luissa?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> birddog said:
> 
> 
> > Hey SFBs, what makes you think you are dealing with a "he?"
> ...



 So you want women to treat you different from men? Sorry if I hurt your delicate sensibilities, hope you didn't swoon.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2TynbO3eWko]I Feel Faint - YouTube[/ame]


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## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



or maybe he likes women and just doesn't like you.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



That hurts...so bad.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



An example of hating men? How so? 
Link please.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



If I was slutty, like you claim, how could I hate men? Wouldn't that mean I love men? Do you always contradict yourself?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > I hope she aborted all her children
> ...



If abortion is ok than you should have a problem with her comment.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



Huh?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > birddog said:
> ...



you are talking to ignorant leftards 
which are so narrow minded that in their small brains they think we are all united by our boobs and since they are used to crazy vagina rhetoric with spiteful hatred towards men they think that all women hate men.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



that is exactly when you hate men - when you are slutty aggressive vagina 

so why do you hate men, Luissa?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



every single post of yours in this thread.

why do you hate men so much?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Personally attacking any woman with name calling and accusing them of why they are single mothers is shameful in my opinion.

It's not even part of the topic which is the "t-shirt" and also has turned into abortion.

People should be willing to discuss reason why they are for or against an issue without being personally attacked or called vulgar names using female anatomy.

I don't see vox calling other women names only those who disagree with Vox's opinion.

If you disagree with someones argument attack the argument not the person.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Kooshdakhaa said:
> ...



How does it not trasfer to other women as well? My daughters were on birthcontrol as teens because it's better to be prepared. They wanted to date. While I would prefer they wait until marriage, I recognize that didn't work for me and probably won't work for them either, hence we had a frank discussion,made an appointment and got birthcontrol. It's not rocket science.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Part of that problem is because men don't care.
> ...



Of course men should care. 

Just because the law does not favor them currently is no excuse.

In fact if more men cared the law might possibly be different since the majority of congress and house of representatives are men who have the power to pass laws.

If you believe in pro-life you wouldn't argue it is women's bodies and men would argue for their rights to decision making about a pregnancy they helped create.

If men had any interest they would lobby for rights to know about a pregnancy rights to decide etc etc.

They don't because they don't care, they enjoy having sex and don't mind if women have abortions.

The men who do care have no rights.

I would think those who are against abortion would care to educate where the power lies but instead I just read name calling and personal attacks on women, this is not just a woman problem it belongs to everyone.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Vox hasn't personally attacked women in the thread who agreed with vox's opinion.

I just don't understand why people can't attack the issue instead of a person.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



See now I hadn't even addressed the mental state of the women after an abortion. I can tell you several personal stories as well of how abortions have weighed on the mind of women for over a 30 year period. It's not pretty. I'm sure BD didn't like actual links cause that's to much like the truth that she can't handle.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Link please


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



If I hate men, why would I sleep with them? Wouldn't I become a lesbian?


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 18, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...



No. 

Actually, without sperm, there would be no fetus. 

HE should have taken responsibility for his own sperm. 

FACT is, women can have all kinds of really great sex without getting pregnant. Its the male who brings pregnancy into the equation.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

NLT said:


> If I wore a shirt that read *"I fathered 5 aborted babies and now its Miller time", *do you think the feminazis would get upset?



you should photoshop that and find out,i'm sure it would promp some memorable responses.


----------



## R.C. Christian (Oct 18, 2013)

Feminist dogs. This thread makes meh sad.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



If men sleep around, they're sowing their wild oats and boys will be boys.

If women sleep around, they hate men, they're sluts and ...............

For men like the ones in this discussion, they're scared to death of real women and usually scared they're really gay cuz they can't get it up with a real woman - so they call them nasty names to hide their fear.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> ...


 
WTH? 

Don't you claim him? If you claim him, then she's breaking the law.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > In instances where the man wants to keep the baby I think it's tragic that he has no choice.
> ...



Men should have a choice in decision making once a pregnancy occurs imo.

Men also have an equal choice in not hopping into bed with women.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

Once the baby is made, choice time is over. The only choice at that point is 1. Are you going to get married, and 2. are you going to put the baby up for adoption.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



Members are not supposed to bring other members family into debates.

Attack the issue not the person please.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

Aborted children are *family*?


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

How does that work within the construct of the "it's not a baby" argument?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Aborted children are *family*?



Stephanie called them children not a zygote and she said she hoped they were all aborted.

Do you think personally attacking people instead of attacking the issue is better then giving concrete reasons for why you agree or disagree with the "t-shirt"  which is the original topic.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Both men and women have the choice not to have sex.

Both men and women have the responsibility to make sure protection is used.

Currently women are the only ones granted the right to keep the pregnancy or have an abortion.

I do think men should have a choice in that, as they are held responsible financially when a woman keeps the baby.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

So if stephanie calls my coffee cup my child, and then mentions my coffee cup, is that *mentioning family*?

Moron. You loons maintain that aborted babies aren't even human. So spare us with the hard stretch to get Stephanie in *trouble* for referencing family if she dares to mention aborted children of a poster...you are the ones who maintain they aren't children. If they aren't children, then they can't be family now, can they?

If they are, then you have a problem. 

You can't have it both ways, death cultist.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> So if stephanie calls my coffee cup my child, and then mentions my coffee cup, is that *mentioning family*?
> 
> Moron. You loons maintain that aborted babies aren't even human. So spare us with the hard stretch to get Stephanie in *trouble* for referencing family if she dares to mention aborted children of a poster...you are the ones who maintain they aren't children. If they aren't children, then they can't be family now, can they?
> 
> ...



If she is making things personal and attacking you or insinuating things about your family I would have a problem with it.

Do you think it's better to attack a person posting or attack the issue being discussed?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

mamooth said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Because they believe a woman's snatch is her sole claim to fame. She has no other identity, except via her vagina. Women are only useful when they are using their vaginas vigorously, often, and preferrably with a wide assortment of non-traditional characters.
> ...



Well actually mamooth, I've seen a lot of name calling from the pro choice crowd but very little evidence or intelligent points made, so either you don't have a leg to stand on or her point that pro choice advocates are little more than angry irresponsible c*m dumpsters for irresponsible men is accurate? Maybe both.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > So if stephanie calls my coffee cup my child, and then mentions my coffee cup, is that *mentioning family*?
> ...


 
She wasn't attacking me, or insinuating things about my family. Try to stick to the subject.

Which is...how can you claim that saying "you should abort all your children" is referencing FAMILY when you maintain that aborted babies aren't human beings?

How can they be *family*?

You keep dodging that.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 18, 2013)

R.C. Christian said:


> Feminist dogs. This thread makes meh sad.


Why?

You can father babies you don't want and then walk away but you want to force women to give birth to babies they can't support and don't want. 



> If I wore a shirt that read "I fathered 5 aborted babies and now its Miller time", do you think the feminazis would get upset?



For many men, that would just be a simple fact. We call them dead beat dads and rw's love men who don't support their own kids so much, they even elected one to congress.

You "men" are scared of women so you denigrate them. Rush the fat Lush coined the term "feminazi" because he can't get it up without a drug he had his maid smuggle in for him because he doesn't have the balls to do it himself. 

Feminism is nothing more than the belief that women are equal to men, that women should be paid the same as men for the same job and that women should have the same control over their own bodies that men take for granted. 

Men can "donate" sperm. They're paid for it but they lie and call it "donations". Women cannot sell their eggs. 

You lily-livered little squirts need to figure out why you're so afraid of women who control their own bodies. Or, just shut up and go on screwing over women and walking away.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Because she posted it directly to a poster making it subjective, instead of just posting it random without direction towards a particular person.

Also in the context of opposing opinions because the poster she directed it at supports abortion so she made it personal.

Do you think it is better to make things personal and attack a poster or is it better to attack the issue in an impersonal way?


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



It would be a much better world if that were true.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



Legally they are responsible. If men evade that responsibility the burden falls on women.

In terms of whether they have a legal right to decide no they don't, women have gender privilege in decision making about the pregnancy and most men are fine with that.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

You maintain they aren't children. So the point is moot.

The rules aren't based upon our "perception" of what constitutes family. If you believe aborted babies are *family* then your argument is fundamentally flawed. They can't be *family* sometimes, and *medical waste* at other times. You sort of have to stick with one or the other.

PS...my views on what is "better" is completely irrelevant. That would in fact be a personal discussion now, wouldn't it? Why are you trying to make this personal?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



http://www.usmessageboard.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=8013566


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> You maintain they aren't children. So the point is moot.
> 
> The rules aren't based upon our "perception" of what constitutes family. If you believe aborted babies are *family* then your argument is fundamentally flawed. They can't be *family* sometimes, and *medical waste* at other times. You sort of have to stick with one or the other.
> 
> PS...my views on what is "better" is completely irrelevant. That would in fact be a personal discussion now, wouldn't it? Why are you trying to make this personal?



who maintains they aren't children?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

[MENTION=31640]koshergrl[/MENTION] 

Do you think it is better to attack a poster personally or attack the issue being discussed?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



sexual drive and mental hate has nothing to do with each other. at least not in such a linear way
your hate towards men is obvious from every word on this thread
why? i don't know - that is why I asked you several time why do you hate men?
so why do you hate men, Luissa?


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> You maintain they aren't children. So the point is moot.
> 
> The rules aren't based upon our "perception" of what constitutes family. If you believe aborted babies are *family* then your argument is fundamentally flawed. *They can't be *family* sometimes, and *medical waste* at other times.* You sort of have to stick with one or the other.
> 
> PS...my views on what is "better" is completely irrelevant. That would in fact be a personal discussion now, wouldn't it? Why are you trying to make this personal?



They maintain that the pre-born are human if they are wanted but are 'tissue' if they are unwanted.  So ... yeah, they don't do that "stick with one or the other" thing very well.  Fundamental flaw?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



Ah shucks, coming from you that means absolutely nothing to me.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > You maintain they aren't children. So the point is moot.
> ...



True so if you refer to them as "aborted children" you see them as human beings. 

That said to tell anyone you hope they aborted all their children if you are pro-life is personal.

I am not sure why Stephanie said that.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



women can sleep around. that does not mean they should have abortions.

men do not murder their babies. at least not usually.
women, on the other hand, especially the vaginas with vocal cords - do, and proudly parade their murders - and *that* makes them sluts, not the fact of having sex around - who cares how much STD they encounter, really


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



agree on both with an addition for the latter - don't hop into a bed with angry vagina with vocal cords


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > So if stephanie calls my coffee cup my child, and then mentions my coffee cup, is that *mentioning family*?
> ...



I think she was talking about steinem or somebody from the article.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...


 
"Personal" and "family reference" are not one and the same. You said she was referencing family. 

Whoops.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> R.C. Christian said:
> 
> 
> > Feminist dogs. This thread makes meh sad.
> ...



I know you are an idiot, but I did not know that you are an idiot to such an extent
women sell their eggs left and right and are bragging about it in the leftard media

Jasmine Stein: I Donated My Eggs For The Money -- And I Don't Regret It


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



yeah cause advocating having your child ripped from your uterus because they are an inconvience to the mother just screams " respect me".


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

Oh, seriously, luddly currently reigns as the site's most retarded poster. 

He had to work hard to gain that position, but now he has it, he seems to be hell bent on keeping it, and proving to us every single day exactly why he deserves it.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Oh, seriously, luddly currently reigns as the site's most retarded poster.
> 
> He had to work hard to gain that position, but now he has it, he seems to be hell bent on keeping it, and proving to us every single day exactly why he deserves it.



looks like it.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...


 
Particularly when it's in response to rape..."Let's kill the baby..it's half mine but I don't count anyway, and the important thing is that nobody SEES that I've been raped. Cuz that will make it easier for everybody to forget, and will increase the chance of the rapist getting away with it. Cuz that's what we do when we *value* women."


----------



## Wake (Oct 18, 2013)

Taking pleasure in the snuffing out of life is perverse.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



You can't de-stigmatize abortion because everybody with a working brain knows it's infanticide. Using the death of countless aborted babies as promo to sell more books just makes it even more disgusting. Unfortunately I'm not surprised that selfish people who advocate the killing innocent children would try to cash in on it. It does show how sick the minds of these people are.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Gracie said:


> > Was it wise to wear the "I had an abortion" t-shirts? Or could Baumgardner have gotten her message across in a wiser way? And what about the "I haven't killed a baby" shirts? Is that any better? What would you say if you came across someone wearing one of these shirts?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It was the other way around. The I haven't killed a baby was a sarcastic response to the 
  "I had an abortion t-shirt." 

"Critics of the shirts fought back with protests and a counter t-shirt that read "I haven't killed a baby."


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



great points - BOTH


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



fair enough, I'd like to see some evidence that justifies abortion from the pro choicers. So far they haven't produced much of anything to back their arguments. At least Vox and I have posted information.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> I don't hate women at all Luissa. I think they should be protected from *slutty ghouls *like you, who think their only worth is as a tool to satisfy a man, at the cost of their own health, and the lives of their children.



And she says I'm the "creepy" one.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



Just as a little social experiment, I am putting everybody who insults women, as a group or personally in this thread, on ignore.

Man, it's quiet.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Well in my opinion men should be more involved in this topic.

I think both men & women have the choice whether or not to have sex with each other

and they both are responsible to wear protection.

Then female gender privilege takes over, in that once a pregnancy occurs only the woman gets to choose about keeping the baby ( which legally makes men responsible whether they want to or not) or to have an abortion ( which men have no choice in) on adoption I am not sure currently whether men get choice or not but in the past men did not.

Mainly if both parties create the pregnancy shouldn't both parties be responsible in that choice of what to do?

If not then explain why?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



I will probably just leave the thread if people can't keep it impersonal.

I understand how it's emotional for both sides, but attack the issue not the person.


----------



## Wake (Oct 18, 2013)

Multiple wrongs make no right.

I don't like seeing people take joy in the ceasing in life, and it's wrong to make negative assumptions about whole groups of women. It's OK to qualify statements, though, in my opinion.

Currently what I hold to is this:

1) Innocent life should be protected.
2) Misogyny is disgusting.
3) Not all statements are misogynistic.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



If she made  the post at luissa about her children , it is family, just like if anyone says something about someones wife or mother in a post. 

"your children" directed at a particular person is personal and is talking about that person children /family.

At any rate, you never did answer whether which is better attacking a person or attacking the issue in a thread.

We will just have to disagree on how we see what Stephanie said.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Wake said:


> Multiple wrongs make no right.
> 
> I don't like seeing people take joy in the ceasing in life, and it's wrong to make negative assumptions about whole groups of women. It's OK to qualify statements, though, in my opinion.
> 
> ...



Do you think men should have equal responsibility in the choices faced with a pregnancy?


----------



## Wake (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> > Multiple wrongs make no right.
> ...



Yes. Though the life develops in the woman's body, it takes two to make it. also, it is sickening to see deadbeat men who can't be real men and take responsibility for their actions.


----------



## Stephanie (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Aborted children are *family*?
> ...



 my are you a whiney one.. are you the board police now?
worry about what you do, I'll worry about me

she wants to flaunt her having an abortion I'll say any damn I want

she's no hero as she believes she is


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> I hope she aborted all her children
> 
> she's a useless person



That is the exact quote of Stephanie's post.

It is referred to the OP article.
*
Drifter, why do you keep confabulating and dragging more and more imaginable addressees where it is clearly not addressed to anybody of the board posters?*


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Wake said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Wake said:
> ...



Yeah.

I do not understand why men aren't fighting more for the right to decide.

It doesn't make sense to me that both can choose whether or not to have sex, both can use protection, but once pregnancy occurs only females have the decision but it affects both men and women no matter what decision is made.

I would think with men being the majority in the congress there would be more men active about that but there isn't. 

It makes me think men care even less than women but I don't know maybe there is another reason.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > I hope she aborted all her children
> ...



Oh Thank you Vox, what page was it? or link would be even better.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Wake said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Wake said:
> ...



is it equally sickening to you to see the aggressive vaginas with vocal cords ( they are NOT women) deny anybody, including the father of the baby have ANY say in what the fate of the baby is going to be? even if the men are begging to not abort the baby and that they will take care of the baby?


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...


*

page 4 
http://www.usmessageboard.com/current-events/319198-i-had-an-abortion-4.html*


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



IDK about Vox but I actually found myself in that situation. I chose not to abort,put my life on the line, and had my daughter in my 7th month by emergency c-section; we both almost died. She was 2lbs,7oz at birth, had complications but pulled through. She is a healthy 21 year old today.  When it's a life against a life I could never put down a woman for choosing her own over the child,especially if she has other children who need her. It's a tough call I hope not to many people have to make.


----------



## Dot Com (Oct 18, 2013)

JakeStarkey said:


> laughinreaper and koshergrl are made for each other: creepy and creepier.



^ that


----------



## Wake (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



I think you mean certain aggressive women who deny others, including fathers of those babies, the right to any say in its life even should the father beg for it to live.

It stirs up a lot of anger and indignation that those certain women do that, even when the father says he'll do what it takes to raise it himself. That, man, that just gets me hot under the collar.

*Walks away to cool head*


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



Just click on the little blue arrow next to Stephanie's name in the post in question, and that will take you to the post in question.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Stephanie said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Stephanie I apologize I did think you directed it at a person posting here named Luissa.


I do not like personal attacks when discussing issues, and so I voice it when it bothers me.

If anyone attacks a person and feels ok with it they should feel ok with others not liking it.

But if you were not saying it towards her then I sincerely apologize to you.

I would like to find out what each side thinks about men being more involved in this issue and it is frustrating when everyone just goes down to name calling back n forth because then nobody will talk about the issue with me.

I hope you forgive what I misread but I can't make you I can only say I am sorry.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Yeah that would be a tough call, you don't have to answer if you don't want to but did you also ask the male what they wanted to as in a joint decision?

I am glad it worked out good for you and your baby.


----------



## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

So Gloria had an abortion?
How did it taste? Like chicken?
Was it sautéed, steamed oven baked or subjected to one of those new weird French slow poaching thingies in a sealed plastic bag?

What is the best wine to serve with an abortion?
Is abortion best for lunch or dinner?

Can abortion be served as brunch?
How many does one serve?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > I find it fascinating that the most female aspect of a woman, her ability to bear a child, is considered *shameful* by the death cultists....and yet they can say with a straight face that they are about *empowering* women. How is it *empowering* to tell women that the one thing that makes them uniquely female is a hindrance, something to be *ashamed* of?
> ...



You know why the big pockets wanted the women in the workforce? Because we work for less cash than men. Women have tried to change that but it still is the case.


----------



## Wake (Oct 18, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> So Gloria had an abortion?
> How did it taste? Like chicken?
> Was it sautéed, steamed oven baked or subjected to one of those new weird French slow poaching thingies in a sealed plastic bag?
> 
> ...



Posts like this only inflame the disagreement, Paul.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



I think there are several reasons for men not fighting for the decision making.

First and foremost - they are AFRAID. Especially the ones in the elected or other public positions. You have seen what the smearing media can do to anybody, plus the proverbial vaginas with vocal cords ( which happened numerous times, but just to remind one - the akin account - medically speaking his statement that pregnancy after violent rape is very rare is correct, though his choice of words and twisting terminology is weird, but fact is the fact - he was correct, and he was crucified for that).
Now imagine anybody making a move to equal decision making. Can you imagine the shrieking and amount of mud and spite and hate and bile from the likes of steinem and flukes and their worshipers on this board?!?
 and even if such a law would be passed - it would be immediately defeated by courts, since in the US abortion legality is based on the most idiotic premise imaginable - "privacy" - one can not make this up - what the heck can a murder have to do with "privacy"?!? what privacy, of her appendix being removed?
The idiocy of initial court ruling makes it almost impossible to change anything - unless somebody finally makes a challenge that a totally separate human being with a separate DNA is not a part of woman's body and therefore can not be her "privacy".

I am not a lawyer and it is difficult for me to add together this absolute idiocy of the court ruling fundamentals and parallel existence of numerous laws of criminal responsibility of murdering 2 human beings if somebody kills a pregnant woman who did not consider and abortion, or if somebody beats a woman and she miscarries, that somebody is going to be charged with murder - no matter what gestational age if the baby was!


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



I think there is some truth to your statement.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Wake said:
> ...



When it comes to life, as in being pro-life I can't imagine being to afraid to defend it.

I think what laughin reaper said may have some truth to it about the workforce.

I also don't think enough men care about the issue.

The men who do care are in a minority and so they are oppressed in their rights to decide.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> R.C. Christian said:
> 
> 
> > Feminist dogs. This thread makes meh sad.
> ...



well now if she can control her own body than she should have opted for birthcontrol. Once the baby is in the womb it becomes an issue Not her body but of why does one human have the right to destroy another humans body just because they don't have a voice yet.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > What is your opinion about it when the mother's life is in danger?
> ...



oh, you reminded me something I forgot to answer about life choice.

actually there are almost non-existent "threats to the life of mother" nowadays almost until the end of pregnancy, certainly way after the baby is viable by today's standards( 22-24 weeks). yes at that gestational age it is extremely high possibilities the baby won't survive - but if the dilemma arrives - I do not understand why should it be an ABORTION?
at that gestational age performing an abortion is an extremely dangerous and lengthy operation, whereas the c-section is much shorter, much more safe and much more beneficial - because it saves BOTH.
That is how it is being done in Europe - an emergency CS, and later whatever happens - happens.

Only in this country is a late-term abortion considered instead of the C-section.
And nobody ever can answer - WHY?

So - why, anybody knows? There are NO MEDICAL ADVANTAGES in performing a late-term abortion vs c-section if mother's life is in danger.
NONE, zilch, nada.
But is is still pushed at least as a talking point.
actually the same question is valid to any post-22 weeks "decisions" by the women - as it is in US ONLY that abortion on demand can be done that late - everywhere else it is either denied or the woman is offered to have emergency c-section at 30 weeks and giving the child for adoption.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



What&#8217;s disgusting is your ignorance, hate, demagoguery, and contempt for individual liberty.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Wake said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Wake said:
> ...




sir, you are awesomely level-headed


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



Vox has added nothing but ugliness and lies to this conversation.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



I do. But the ones who should be vocal on that issue are instead shrieking about having ability to murder the unborn babies anytime, anywhere at any gestation age for anybody without parental consent, and, of course, on a taxpayers dime.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I *chose* not to abort



Precisely. 

You had a *choice*; there was a time not long ago when that wasnt the case.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> When it comes to life, as in being pro-life I can't imagine being to afraid to defend it.
> 
> I think what laughin reaper said may have some truth to it about the workforce.
> 
> ...



I agree, but you know how the elected and appointed politicians are.
all they care is mostly their personal benefits of the positions. With the few exceptions, which only prove the rule.

I think the only way is to challenge the RvW exactly on it's premise of privacy - given all the facts of the medical advancement of the last 40 years ( although the baby having a separate DNA and not being a part of the mother's body was known at the time as well, but maybe those justices were just ignorant).


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



what is even more disgusting is your ignorance and blood thirst to murder innocent babies for your convenience.
and yes, I have contempt for the angry vaginas with vocal cords and their male supporters.
Because they are not worthy absolutely anything else.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> well now if she can control her own body than she should have opted for birthcontrol. Once the baby is in the womb it becomes an issue Not her body but of *why does one human have the right to destroy another humans body just because they don't have a voice yet.*



well that is all what that angry bloodthirsty murderous death-cult worshipers care about - how to destroy another human being for their personal convenience.

and then they demand respect and_ love _


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > When it comes to life, as in being pro-life I can't imagine being to afraid to defend it.
> ...



Politicians only care about money and power it seems like.

Still if  congress which is majority men believed that abortion was murder you would think they would do something about it, so I can only conclude they don't think it or if they do then they don't care.

Until men change their own views about it being just a woman issue then not much will change because it's everyone's issue.


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## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Why is it everyone's issue.

Why should anybody be thinking they have a say in anybody else's personal medical decisions.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



true, but you have a Genie out of the bottle now - men have tasted the freedom of irresponsibility and it is going to be hard to change the trend without first changing the idiocy of concept that "it is my body and my choice".
until that is defeated - nothing will change


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



So you called me a slut and said I hated men because you think I had an abortion? 
A. When did I tell you I had an abortion? 
B. when did I parade said abortion?


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



If that was law then the woman who didn't want to be bothered with letting the father have a voice might tell people she doesn't know who the father is, it might hard to enforce. Personally I don't think either should have a choice. Thier choice was on the night the child was concieved. They said yes that night and now a third party has been created. That third party has the right to keep it's life. That fact that the woman has that life inside her is irrelevant. If she doesn't want the life inside her than she can give it up for adoption.

Everyone knows that sex produces babies, it's not a surprise. Take responsibility for your actions and let the child live.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Link please. 
Link me one post where I showed my hatred towards men, other than you... Just one. 
I will be waiting.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



 Yes I asked for his imput. My husband told me he'd support what I felt was the right thing to do. But even if he did want me to have an abortion, I couldn't do it and live with myself. He knew that so I didn't expect any other answer from him.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Dot Com said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > laughinreaper and koshergrl are made for each other: creepy and creepier.
> ...



Coming from you and Jake, it still means nothing.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



you are too stupid to be involved in conversation. the thread in not about YOU 
but for the last time I'll repeat - you are a slut because you support abortion and you even supported this disgusting POS steinem with her t-shirts.
supporting abortion makes you a slut and an angry vagina with vocal cords, not sleeping around - i could not care less what you do with your body when it is ONLY your body. Unborn baby is NOT YOUR BODY.

and here I will end this explanation to the retarded VWVC - enough for tonight, because your small brain is too inflamed and your process of "thinking" is getting too incoherent.


----------



## Vox (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



I already did. read the thread.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Did you provide a link?


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## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

I think the only thing I said about men was you hate women, and my child's father didn't dump me. 
Please provide a link proving otherwise.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



You obviously did not see my post about the actual topic, moron.


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

So you are only calling me a slut because I am pro choice? 
I figured I would give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it was because you thought I had an abortion. I just couldn't fathom calling someone a slut for being pro choice. 
You are real winner.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Luissa said:


> I think the only thing I said about men was you hate women, and my child's father didn't dump me.
> Please provide a link proving otherwise.



Before I slapped his moronic ass on ignore, I saw where he said that to you. Did you report him for bringing in such filth about FAMILY and your chiild? Do it. He's a nasty troll. Which is why he is on ignore but I still get blessed (barf) to see the spewing when someone quotes him.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Guess I am a slut too cuz I AM pro choice.

Fellow like minded folks...Hiya, sluts!
Love
Slut


----------



## Luissa (Oct 18, 2013)

Gracie said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > I think the only thing I said about men was you hate women, and my child's father didn't dump me.
> ...



Nah! I don't think it's a direct hit to family. Plus this way the comment won't be deleted and everyone can see what an asshole he is.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Me neither and I questioned her about it. She ignored it. Odd.


----------



## tinydancer (Oct 18, 2013)

I am not pro abortion. What a horrid phrase. I am not this choice of ending life. 

Some how we must tend to these words.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Vox said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



I decided from the start to take the pregnancy as far as I could. At month 7 to the day, I noticed the baby had stopped kicking. I went to the hospital and they discovered the placenta had seperated and her heart rate was dropping. My blood pressure went through the roof. They tried to stabilize me but couldn't so they said my daughter had a chance if I gave birth and no chance if she was left in the uterus, so out she came. Same thing happened to my first daughter, but I went 8 months before that happened so there was no question she could make it. My first daughter was 4 lbs 2 oz. Both girls had apnea and my second daughter had a serious intestinal infection, but aside from that they did OK.  I don't understand why any woman would have a late term abortion as opposed to giving birth, makes no sense and is clearly murder no matter what side of the abortion fence you are on.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I decided from the start to take the pregnancy as far as I could. At month 7 to the day, I noticed the baby had stopped kicking. I went to the hospital and they discovered the placenta had seperated and her heart rate was dropping. My blood pressure went through the roof. They tried to stabilize me but couldn't so they said my daughter had a chance if I gave birth and no chance if she was left in the uterus, so out she came. Same thing happened to my first daughter, but I went 8 months before that happened so there was no question she could make it. My first daughter was 4 lbs 2 oz. Both girls had apnea and my second daughter had a serious intestinal infection, but aside from that they did OK.  I don't understand why any woman would have a late term abortion as opposed to giving birth, makes no sense and is clearly murder no matter what side of the abortion fence you are on.



Women don't choose to have a late term abortion unless they need to. If they are in the third trimester, one must assume (logically) that they want that baby, so they wouldn't just up and decide to have an abortion.
Women who have late abortions should be given compassion, as it cannot be an easy choice to make.


----------



## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I *chose* not to abort
> ...



 I'm not advocating to take away choice when a womans life is in danger. I want to get rid of abortion of healthy women by way of birthcontrol. There is no reason why any healthy woman should have an abortion with so many effective methods of birthcontrol available. There is also no reason men shouldn't use a condom or even help a woman who they are in a long term relationship with with the cost of her birthcontrol. As Drifter has been saying all night, the men need to be included in the process, they have rights too.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Why is it everyone's issue.
> 
> Why should anybody be thinking they have a say in anybody else's personal medical decisions.



Because both parties created the pregnancy both parties have a responsibility and should have the right to decide what they want to do.


----------



## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

Wake said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > So Gloria had an abortion?
> ...



I thought they offered a bit of a break from the monotony of fanaticism.
Laughter is the best Medcine!!
Read the The ACA!!!!
Best Joke Ever!!


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



It turns out that she was saying it toward the person the article was about Gloria Steinem


----------



## Noomi (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Why is it everyone's issue.
> ...



A bit hard when both want to do something different, eh?


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



It most definitely is, and so women have a gender privilege over men in that they are able to abort, put up for adoption or sue the man for child support.

Now prior to pregnancy a man and a woman have the choice whether or not to have sex with each other.

They also both have equal responsibility in taking measures to use protection.

But once the pregnancy occurs all power is given to women, it matters not how the man feels about her choice.

That seems unfair.


----------



## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



If she had let him do " something different" there would be no problem!!

Guys, if they don't do anal, they don't get done!!
Save yourselves the bother with nutters!!


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Why is it everyone's issue.
> ...



I am not talking about couples. I am referring to people on the interweb, ffs, thinking they have a say in what said couples decide.

Or just the woman.

Because if you want tire marks on your chest and forehead, just tell a man "I think I'm pregnant."


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



And that's why men should never have sex if they're not ready to be a father.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



I don't agree with they way some people in this thread have made things personal.

I really despise the words that have been used toward you and Luissa.

I probably should just exit this thread because it is very upsetting to watch that kind of treatment.

You don't deserve it.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



Thank you. And while you have been an absolute breath of fresh air, I'd hate to adversely affect your weekend.  You should go think happy thoughts.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



But people say that toward women to, that is not really fair to say to either person.


----------



## Michelle420 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Thanks, I think I will. 

Maybe you & Luissa should as well and have nice weekend back.


----------



## tinydancer (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...




You dont know who gloria is? Get real.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



Of course it's not. It isn't even rational. I figure the only people who say that are ones who have never had good sex - but I digress.

You know what reduces abortion rates? Free birth control. So if people are against that, then they really don't want to stop abortion - they just want to control women.

By the way, I read an awesome article some weeks back.

How I Lost Faith in the Pro-Life Movement



> Both the lowest and highest subregional abortion rates are in Europe, where abortion is generally legal under broad grounds. In Western Europe, the rate is 12 per 1,000 women, while in Eastern Europe it is 43. The discrepancy in rates between the two regions reflects relatively low contraceptive use in Eastern Europe, as well as a high degree of reliance on methods with relatively high user failure rates, such as the condom, withdrawal and the rhythm method.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Further, from the same article;



> As I mulled this over, I realized how very obvious it was. The cause of abortions is unwanted pregnancies. If you get rid of unwanted pregnancies the number of people who seek abortions will drop like a rock. Simply banning abortion leaves women stuck with unwanted pregnancies. Banning abortion doesn&#8217;t make those pregnancies wanted. Many women in a situation like that will be willing to do anything to end that pregnancy, even if it means trying to induce their own abortions (say, with a coat hanger or by drinking chemicals) or seeking out illegal abortions. I realized that the real way to reduce abortion rates, then, was to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies. And the way to do that is with birth control, which reduces the number of unwanted pregnancies by allowing women to control when and if they become pregnant.
> 
> I realized that the only world in which opposing birth control made any sense was one in which the goal was to control women&#8217;s sex lives. After all, birth control allows women to have sex without having to face the &#8220;consequences&#8221; of sex. But I had never opposed abortion in an effort to make women face the &#8220;consequences&#8221; of having sex. I had always opposed abortion out of a desire to save the lives of unborn babies. As a child, I had been moved to tears by the image of millions of babies murdered by abortion each year. If making it easier for women to have sex I personally believed was sinful was the price I had to pay to save the lives of unborn babies, it was a price I was more than willing to pay.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 18, 2013)

Noomi said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I decided from the start to take the pregnancy as far as I could. At month 7 to the day, I noticed the baby had stopped kicking. I went to the hospital and they discovered the placenta had seperated and her heart rate was dropping. My blood pressure went through the roof. They tried to stabilize me but couldn't so they said my daughter had a chance if I gave birth and no chance if she was left in the uterus, so out she came. Same thing happened to my first daughter, but I went 8 months before that happened so there was no question she could make it. My first daughter was 4 lbs 2 oz. Both girls had apnea and my second daughter had a serious intestinal infection, but aside from that they did OK.  I don't understand why any woman would have a late term abortion as opposed to giving birth, makes no sense and is clearly murder no matter what side of the abortion fence you are on.
> ...



 If the womans life is at risk and the baby can't live outside of the womb fine, I agree. But why have a late term abortion at all if the baby can live outside the womb just deliver the baby.


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## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...




I agree Drifter. You are a breath of fresh air. But...I disagree Luissa or anyone else should leave the discussion due to one troll disrupting the convo with personal attacks. Why give him the satisfaction? I know I damn sure won't. The ignore button sure helps, too.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



All for birth control .
Don't give a shit about abortion.
Not my place.
Not my responsibility .

So I shouldn't pay for it.
That is all.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 18, 2013)

drifter said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



You might perceive it as unfair but its actually not, as the law wisely and appropriately acknowledges the fact that prior to birth the woman is alone effected, her personal liberty and physical person safeguarded by the Constitution from unwarranted government interference.  

The notion that the father should be authorized by the state to overrule a womans decisions concerning her personal liberty and physical person is repugnant to the fundamental tenets of our Constitutional Republic and the rule of law.


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## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...





> Tay&#8211;Sachs disease (also known as GM2 gangliosidosis or hexosaminidase A deficiency) is a rare autosomal recessive genetic disorder. In its most common variant (known as infantile Tay&#8211;Sachs disease), it causes a progressive deterioration of nerve cells and of mental and physical abilities that commences around six months of age and usually results in death by the age of four. The disease occurs when harmful quantities of cell membrane components known as gangliosides accumulate in the brain's nerve cells, eventually leading to the premature death of the cells. A ganglioside is a form of sphingolipid, which makes Tay&#8211;Sachs disease a member of the sphingolipidoses. There is no known cure or treatment.
> 
> The child becomes blind, deaf, unable to swallow, atrophied, and paralytic.



You were saying?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...


No no no !!!!!!
It's a woman's RIGHT to have a fourth trimester abortion on demand!!!!
And YOU should pay for it.
It is YOUR responsibility.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Up to delivery .
But in the Forth trimester , what then ?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...


I think rugby is a far more entertaining sport than soccer.

Kids who are deaf, dumb. Etc etc etc , can rest assured that they are still better looking than Chelsea Clinton!!
Damn, even Chelsea MA is better looking than Chelsea Clinton!!


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 18, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



No idea what youre referring to. 

But again, fathers cant overrule a womans decision to have an abortion in accordance with her states laws.


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## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

Oh, yeah. The fourth trimester. That's when we cut off WIC and SNAP. Because fuck you, that's why.


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## tinydancer (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Further, from the same article;
> 
> 
> 
> ...



What the hell?

Pathetic. Horridly written.


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## BDBoop (Oct 18, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Further, from the same article;
> ...





Honey, sometimes I can't tell if you are still speaking English - and you're going to point fingers at the author?


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## tinydancer (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Oh, yeah. The fourth trimester. That's when we cut off WIC and SNAP. Because fuck you, that's why.



BD you have to get a grip on some. I don;t even know where to go from this crap.


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## tinydancer (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Oh bite me. I'm not bad when it comes to the queen's own. canuck world bank on the money. americano geeze louize your grammar sucks the big one. Thats just fun to say. 

When it comes though to truly speaking other languages, I excel. I'm having a blast right now because my eldest daughter is about to move Stolkholm.  I get to learn another language. This is so exciting.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 18, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Oh, yeah. The fourth trimester. That's when we cut off WIC and SNAP. Because fuck you, that's why.



Recent poll of liberal students showed support for abortions into the FOUTH trimester.
That's later than the few days after a child is born supported by Barbera Boxer.


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## Gracie (Oct 18, 2013)

Stockhom!!! That is exciting, TD!!! Tell her to take LOTS of cool pics of beautiful scenery...then you share with us, ok?


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



Forth trimester? We are not elephants.


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, yeah. The fourth trimester. That's when we cut off WIC and SNAP. Because fuck you, that's why.
> ...



I do? Really? Because I can provide article after article whereby the GOP has either attempted to or successfully cut WIC and SNAP. So where does me 'getting a grip' play a part in this exchange.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...


That's code for "after birth abortion", genius.


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

That 17 year old girl carrying around a dead fetus in her shopping bag at Victoria's Secret? Read about that? Turns out, the baby was born alive. Then asphyxiated. And they went shopping. She gave birth at the friends house. So yeah. She didn't abort it. She just flat out smothered it or choked it after it came out.

Just sayin'.


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

Baby Found Dead In Teen's Shopping Bag Was Born Alive, According To Police


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Yeah, that's what they do at abortion clinics, too. And college kids think it should be legal.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Yeah, that's what they do at abortion clinics, too. And college kids think it should be legal.



Well, no, at most abortion clinics, they don't abort viable fetuses...  

but let's go ahead and scream about the few cases where they do because people just won't get worked up about a fetus the size of a kidney bean...


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Go away, ghoul. Trust you to show up once the conversation turns to outright infant murder.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Go away, ghoul. Trust you to show up once the conversation turns to outright infant murder.



They are only infants in your tiny mind... 

And when you act like you care about REAL children, I will take your concern about fetuses a little more seriously.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



or have an emergency CS


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



That would be murdering a 12 week old baby!

(There is no "4" in a TRImester)


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> I am not pro abortion. What a horrid phrase. I am not this choice of ending life.
> 
> Some how we must tend to these words.



any normal WOMAN and any normal man, being human, can not be pro-murder.

and everybody knows in 2013 that it IS murder.

Women, whose natural instincts are all wired for the protection of the children even with the price of their own sacrifice to save them, simply can not  be proponents of the baby murders - it is against their own nature and physiology.
One can agree that there could be exceptional situations where the woman will have to make a choice between her own life and the life of her baby and one can sympathize with such particular tragic situation.
But the ones who actively support and advertise murdering the unborn children can not be women in their sane mind - and this disconnect of the natural predisposition to be a saver and a caretaker and a leftard brainwash many of so-called  "women" are  indoctrinated with, is obviously causing this angry hateful, spiteful lash at anybody who is opposing murder and naming that as it is. The arguments  of "it is my body and my choice", "it is my freedom", "why should I be_ tortured _to carry a _parasite _for 9 months", "men can not enslave ME to carry their children", "it is not a baby, it is a cluster of cells" and all other standard moronic phrases used by rabid pro-aborts, are a clear evidence of psychotic paranoia those creatures are experiencing.
And if one uses the most moronic "defense" possible - "you  just want me not to have sex" - it is a clear sign what is wrong with this particular "woman".
Those obsessed rabid creatures can not be called women - they do not deserve it and they are not women, they are angry vaginas with vocal cords.
With public figures as steinem and fluke being the most exemplary.
But that cognitive dissonance is not limited to those only.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Its a screwy world we live in when the men who CAUSE pregnancy are not held responsible while they want the government to force women to carry the resulting fetus to term and deliver it. 

State-controlled reproduction - Not at all surprising that its the "small government, personal responsibility, let them eat cake" rw's who want big government, more laws, no personal responsibility, let them starve in the street.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Sometimes, I'm tempted to turn on my rep so can positive rep a post and poster. Your posts are always succinct, factual and intelligent. Thank you for saying this so well.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

In truth, it is men like joe & luddly who completely support the abortion industry. Because they always want to have the option of coercing women to dump their babies.

Most abortions are coerced.


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## Misty (Oct 19, 2013)

Gloria Steinem had an abortion. When 50 years ago?  She is an idiot.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> That 17 year old girl carrying around a dead fetus in her shopping bag at Victoria's Secret? Read about that? Turns out, the baby was born alive. Then asphyxiated. And they went shopping. She gave birth at the friends house. So yeah. She didn't abort it. She just flat out smothered it or choked it after it came out.
> 
> Just sayin'.



How crazy is this one? Then you have the other young girl who birthed in the bathtub and threw the baby out the window.

17 stories I think it fell. Not sure if the baby lived.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



It was just a quick review.

It is horridly written. Would you prefer written horridly?

Both are acceptable.

ETA: are you thinking I misspelled horribly? I wasn't using that word at all. I meant horrid. Truly I did.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> Stockhom!!! That is exciting, TD!!! Tell her to take LOTS of cool pics of beautiful scenery...then you share with us, ok?



I still have to get the pics up of the puppy who is now huge and the garden. I am a horrible person at this stuff. 

I promise I'll figure out photobucket. Honest.

Yes Stockholm. Aye carumba! I finally have one of my kids moving somewhere interesting where I'd love to visit them.

Her stock just went up on the "mommy loves you best" richter scale!


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > tinydancer said:
> ...



No, hon. I know you did. I meant other places and tines.


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## laughinReaper (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Six months of age means the baby is already here unless your suggesting that the child be killed at the sixth month diagnosis age. What unborn babies isn't enough blood for you, now lets kill born defective children too. Sounds alot like the final solution,Kill all those we find undesirable or those we feel are worthless, heil Hitler!

 And I'm the creepy one? At least i'm not a ghoul. Your mind is sick beyond repair.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



6 month old preemie is absolutely viable nowadays and there is no reason that child should not be delivered if any threat to mom exists or even she suddenly decides she does not want a baby anymore.
No abortion at that gestational age.
Tay-Sachs is a genetic disorder which is usually known to the parents as it is ethnically connected. Prognosis for the babies is poor - they do not survive more than 4 years.
Still no reason to abort those babies.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



In your opinion. 

Plus, are you a doctor?


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



Are you?


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Premature baby born three months early and weighing under 2lb is back at home before his due date | Mail Online


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

Some abortions can be stymied if interested family/friends are given the option to adopt and raise the developing life. Before an abortion can happen, first allow others to come in and save it from death. If there must some financial incentive for the biological mother, so be it.


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.

Make birth control affordable, free to those who just don't have the money, and watch the abortion rate drop.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> In truth, it is men like joe & luddly who completely support the abortion industry. Because they always want to have the option of coercing women to dump their babies.
> 
> Most abortions are coerced.



Such ignorance absent evidence. 

And insulting to women perceived to be too weak-minded to decide for themselves.


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > In truth, it is men like joe & luddly who completely support the abortion industry. Because they always want to have the option of coercing women to dump their babies.
> ...



Exactly.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



And he who references Hitler has lost the argument.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > In truth, it is men like joe & luddly who completely support the abortion industry. Because they always want to have the option of coercing women to dump their babies.
> ...



Oh look, another man proclaiming that abortion is for the strong minded, and denying the reality of coercion.

Meanwhile, my grandson...5 months:


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Oh, so somebody couldn't be bothered to read the article to find out when the disease can be detected in utero?

Shock -n- Awe, y'all!


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Don't hate, appreciate, baby killers.

Lol..that's a word of advice from my granddaughter.


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.
> 
> Make birth control affordable, free to those who just don't have the money, and watch the abortion rate drop.



There's a lot of questions around that. It's true that life begins when the egg and sperm combine to create the zygote, which is the exacting point that a developing life begins. IF birth controls prevents sperm and egg from forming, I would be 100% for cheap and effective birth control.

However, there's also the issue of younger and younger promiscuity. If birth control can be bought OTC, young girls and boys could have rampant sex. And even younger. That, and any young runt of a girl could buy birth control and go out and have sex with an over-age male. I just wish kids and teens could be innocent, and stay out of trouble, but that's more than likely a pipe-dream. 

My sensitivity on this issue is that I plan on being a father of at least two little girls in the distant future (someday). I'm scared as hell of having to protect my boys and girls from bad influences, so I reason the best I can do is to keep them occupied and shower them with as much love and attention as I can. Go picking in the orchard, work as a family team in the garden, have icecream night every Saturday and watch a wholesome movie. I don't know.

What I do know is that I don't want my little girls going out at night God-knows-where and having sex with whoever. Girls barely know those young boys, and there's only one thing on the minds of those boys. Sex. Just using them for sex. Young teens (male and female) who don't have proper upbringing whore around and get into trouble. Those bad influence invite alcohol, smoking, drugs, law-breaking, etc. I'd rather have my little girls safe and sound at home, warm, well-fed, safe, and content.

I'm only 25 but thinking about the future and its dangers is enough to give one an ulcer or ten.


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

I'm sorry. It's a lovely, well thought-out post. It just doesn't really have a hill of beans to do with preventing abortions by preventing pregnancy the easiest way imaginable.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I don't pretend to know what the best option is for a baby who will probably die or the child's mother.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Death is never the best option. Particularly when someone else is making the decision for you.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Not aborted:


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...


And the state shouldnt pretend to know, either.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

The purpose of the state is to protect life.

It's pretty much the only valid purpose of the state. For as long as there has been human society, the states that take an interest in removing the rights of individuals are ultimately recognized as tyrannical, fascist states.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Death is never the best option. Particularly when someone else is making the decision for you.



And yet as the hypocrite you are you seek to have the state do just that.


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## freedombecki (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Not aborted:


 She's beautiful!


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Killing the innocent, putting vulnerable lives in jeopardy (pregnant women), and protecting abusers are not acceptable roles for the state. Sorry. States that do that are fascist.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

freedombecki said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Not aborted:
> ...



I was just chatting with her via her mom and she sends the following message to the baby killers:

Don't hate, appreciate!


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## freedombecki (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Death is never the best option. Particularly when someone else is making the decision for you.
> ...


You are mistaken. If America had the good sense to listen to koshergrl, we'd have 1,300,000 fewer abortions every year in America alone.

That's a workforce in about 21 years of over a million people. Do the math. They're contributors. You want them continually to have their lives ended before they get a good start? They're not breathing, you say? lol! Their mothers breathe for them! It's a mother's job! If that's not a job she would like, she should not agree to have sex to get that way! Problem solved! No cost to the gummint, plus 1,300,000 new citizens who will likely not be involved in government takeover that results in the killing off of 100,000,000 people who are disinterested in being apparatchiks in a communist or terrorist society that eats its own and enslaves women based on gender.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> The purpose of the state is to protect life.
> 
> It's pretty much the only valid purpose of the state. For as long as there has been human society, the states that take an interest in removing the rights of individuals are ultimately recognized as tyrannical, fascist states.



And the purpose of Constitutional case law is to protect us from the state. 

As long as there has been human society there has been tyranny, by either the few or the many, the Constitution protects us from both but mostly the latter. 

Those who take an interest in removing the rights of the individual, such as the right to privacy, are ultimately recognized as tyrants and hostile to individual liberty.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> freedombecki said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Maybe you should listen to her.


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## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

No reason to abort a Tay-Sachs baby? Really. 

I'm guessing you've never seen their excruciating, short life and death as it unfolded.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

freedombecki said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Actually not. 

Private citizens advocating against abortion is perfectly appropriate, provided they dont seek to codify that advocacy. 

One would love nothing more than to see the practice ended by citizens own volition, not as dictated by the state. 

And the right to privacy concerns much more than just abortion, it concerns the fundamental principle of limiting the power and authority of the state and safeguarding individual liberty. And in order for that principle to have any force or meaning, it must be applied consistently.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Who decided that it was the governments job to subsidise laziness?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.
> 
> Make birth control affordable, free to those who just don't have the money, and watch the abortion rate drop.



Teach responsibility, don't force decent folk to cough up their hard earned to subsidize stupidity.
Teach the dopes that they are not entitled to others hard earned gains.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> No reason to abort a Tay-Sachs baby? Really.
> 
> I'm guessing you've never seen their excruciating, short life and death as it unfolded.



Citizens cannot be compelled to justify the exercising of a fundamental right as a prerequisite to indeed exercise that fundamental right.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> I'm sorry. It's a lovely, well thought-out post. It just doesn't really have a hill of beans to do with preventing abortions by preventing pregnancy the easiest way imaginable.



By being responsible?


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > laughinReaper said:
> ...



yes, I am


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



she is a tech


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Wake said:


> Some abortions can be stymied if interested family/friends are given the option to adopt and raise the developing life. Before an abortion can happen, first allow others to come in and save it from death. If there must some financial incentive for the biological mother, so be it.



the waiting line for adoption in the US is YEARS - for any baby, any race, any ethnic origin, any health condition.
I am surprised there is no business flourishing on this type of adoption ( it happens but it is rare)
probably, because it is in confrontation with well-established and leftard- protected murder mills, which abortion is all about - making money on slaughtering babies.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Death is never the best option. Particularly when someone else is making the decision for you.



well, the ones which advocate murder for OTHERS, have been already born - and that is all about THEM - "me, me, me" - is the only goal vaginas with vocal cords pursue in life.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> The purpose of the state is to protect life.
> 
> It's pretty much the only valid purpose of the state. For as long as there has been human society, the states that take an interest in removing the rights of individuals are ultimately recognized as tyrannical, fascist states.



the purpose of the left is to control an individual - and this what this all wailing about "women's rights" is all about. Control.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

freedombecki said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Not aborted:
> ...



she is. God bless her and her Mom and Dad.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

The grandson is already named


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



And I am the Queen of England.


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## j-mac (Oct 19, 2013)

drifter said:


> j-mac said:
> 
> 
> > drifter said:
> ...



Agreed, but in more cases than not, the decision is a selfish one for both men and women.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Death is never the best option. Particularly when someone else is making the decision for you.



And yet, all you write is that you want the state to make decisions for women. 

MYOB


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> No reason to abort a Tay-Sachs baby? Really.
> 
> I'm guessing you've never seen their excruciating, short life and death as it unfolded.



What is ignored is the fact that most abortions are medically necessary. The haters want to paint women as having abortions so they go back out and pregnant again but that is very rarely the truth. 

And, as usual, those who cause the pregnancy - men - are given a free "ride", as it were, to just keep doing it again and again. 

Bottom line to this round and round argument is always the same though -

A woman's body is her own and she has the right to have babies or not. No one, certainly not the state, has the right to interfere with her wishes. Why a woman aborts is no one's business but hers.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Death is never the best option. Particularly when someone else is making the decision for you.
> ...



No, what you see me writing about is protestation against state-sponsored homicide. Determining that someone else should die for your pleasure is the ultimate rejection of choice, and the ultimate in decision making...for someone else. Nobody has the right to make that decision for another. Did you know that you can be prosecuted for leaving a child, one that isn't your own, alone when you see that there is nobody watching that child, if harm comes to it and you were the last person to see it? We are obligated to protect those in our care. Even if they are in our care by way of pregnancy. Your obligation ends the minute you can safely hand it off to someone else...but not before. You do not have the right to kill beings that come under your care, just because you don't feel like protecting them.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> freedombecki said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



I will always be amazed at how people are so willing and cavalier about endangering innocent children.

Especially if they're using them to push a fascist agenda. 

Please, people THINK.

There are always a lot more people viewing a board than posting. There is no way to know anything about those people. 

I hope koshergirl has the good sense to delete this photo and uses her head in the future.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



This thread is about abortion.

Not the death penalty.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

I put pics up of my kids all the time. So has luser and a lot of other posters.

And if you're trying to intimidate me, then your tenure on this board is about to come to a crashing end, and your IP will be reported. 

So...what's your point?

PS...pro-death cultists always object to photos of babies. They always complain if someone dares to post pics of babies in their baby-killing threads. They don't like people to be reminded of exactly what they want to kill.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



I know what it's about. It's about babies, and when they should be killed.

You think they should be killed whenever they are a nuisance, and the state should support that *choice*.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Crickets while the baby killers frantically attempt to find a way to get pictures of children deleted from their baby killing thread....


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



"... state-sponsored homicide ..."

Idiocy.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Speaking of crickets. 

kg - you're crazy. 

Abortion is none of your business unless you want to have one.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > No reason to abort a Tay-Sachs baby? Really.
> ...



What a lie. What a lie that abortions are just a medical necessity. OMG,


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

I think he meant abortions CAN be a medical necessity.

Anywho..I hate these kinds of threads. Two sides, bickering, and nobody changing their minds on their stance in the subject. Just a helluvalot of arguing, name calling, spittle flying.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Speaking of crickets.
> 
> kg - you're crazy.
> 
> Abortion is none of your business unless you want to have one.



They are when you pay for one. Like we do up here. 

A woman can get her 50th taxpayer abortion all on my dime and my husbands dime.

Hey.

Pay for someone to kill your unborn. Oh and by the way you have to pay for your own asthma pumps.

Nice healthcare system eh? Kill a baby in the womb = free

Puffers so you can breathe if you have asthma = pay you son of a bitch.


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## Smilodonfatalis (Oct 19, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



The world would be a better place if there were more abortions.

They don't "hack" a fetus to death.

They remove a microscopic zygote.  If the abortion is early enough, it's not even visible to the human eye.

So take your hysterics and shove it.


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

There are many "reasons" for abortion.
Rape
incest
medical necessity for either the mother or the child.

I just can't imagine ANY woman having an abortion (late term) for funzies.
Meanwhile, I stand with my pro choice beliefs. UNLESS it is late term and no medical emergency for the child or mother. Most rape victims abort when they are told they are pregnant. Same goes for those who are victims of incest.

Anyone have any statistics on abortions that are LATE term...of women who had one done legally or illegally vs 4 weeks or 6 weeks pregnant?


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> I think he meant abortions CAN be a medical necessity.
> 
> Anywho..I hate these kinds of threads. Two sides, bickering, and nobody changing their minds on their stance in the subject. Just a helluvalot of arguing, name calling, spittle flying.



I've read that 2/3rds of all abortions are medically necessary.

What people forget is that many are done in hospitals by the woman's OB. They used to be called 'theraputic d&c's'. The family is often shattered by the loss and they have every right to the medical procedure and to their privacy. 

Still -  the reason for an abortion is no one's business.


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## Smilodonfatalis (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Some abortions are a medical necessity.  Try doing some research before spouting your ignorance.


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## YoungRepublican (Oct 19, 2013)

I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power. 

The bottom line is simple, either we can force these people into having children they don't want, so the children can grow up in a home that is'nt ready to have them, and doesn't want them, so they can get into their teens and go out an d commit crimes and be just as poor as their parents are. Or, we can allow parents to have children when they are ready and those children can have a shot at a real life. A successful life. But, no, this is still an issue for some reason. Some people want children to grow up unwanted in poor homes so they can go out and be part of the problem. Duh, why wouldnt we want that


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> I think he meant abortions CAN be a medical necessity.
> 
> Anywho..I hate these kinds of threads. Two sides, bickering, and nobody changing their minds on their stance in the subject. Just a helluvalot of arguing, name calling, spittle flying.



He put in "most" that's why I took it that way.

Gracie for years I have even as a real anti abortion conservative tried to find middle ground. The left won't give up an inch. 

I believe that a child is raped and might need this horrible procedure if she chooses. I believe that a woman who is in the worst domestic abuse situation finds herself pregnant with her 5th child and cannot run because of this.

I know all the case scenarios and they are heartbreaking. Abortion has to be the last option we can give anyone, but we must allow that horrid option. 

I would like to see and have been advocating for years absolutely free birth control before and after.

Just don't let that baby grow inside a womb to hit 5 months and have it dragged out by such vile means like we are doing today.

Know what? Every one calls "it" a fetus. I have spawned three.  Only time I ever thought of killing them was some where around 14 or 15. 

When Rubystarr my foundation bitch of my catahoula kennel was pregnant, I never thought for one minute that my dog had "fetus" x 12 inside her.

I felt from the get go all those puppies were alive. Inside her. Moving inside her. 

What is inside a woman isn't a fetus no more than what's inside a bitch. These are living souls.

They are real. And no matter the word changing, they are babies.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Smilodonfatalis said:


> laughinReaper said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> ...



And, the same people who are hysterically screeching about "hacking" - those would be the same people who demand that a teenage girl face a pregnancy alone, no help, let her starve in the street, don't hold the father responsible and all the rest of the xtian garbage. 

Make birth control available -period. 

If you don't believe in birth control, don't use it but get out of the way of the sane and responsible people. 

Invest in education - about sex, about life, about ways of making living. Teach our young people instead of punishing them. 

If a child decides to carry her zygote to term and give birth to a baby, don't spit on her and deny her basic help. That only costs us more in the long run. Leave your preaching at home and give her a hand up - trade school, day care, help her become a contributing member of society. 

And, the father, the sperm, the one who made the pregnancy equally responsible.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Smilodonfatalis said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



Some are.

Did I argue that? I didn't. I was responding to this lie. 

* What is ignored is the fact that most abortions are medically necessary.*


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> I don't understand how abortion is still an issue.



Then you are truly naïve. 

Its the ultimate litmus test for the social right, red meat for the rightwing base, and the most important criterion when determining who is a RINO.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> 
> The bottom line is simple, either we can force these people into having children they don't want, so the children can grow up in a home that is'nt ready to have them, and doesn't want them, so they can get into their teens and go out an d commit crimes and be just as poor as their parents are. Or, we can allow parents to have children when they are ready and those children can have a shot at a real life. A successful life. But, no, this is still an issue for some reason. Some people want children to grow up unwanted in poor homes so they can go out and be part of the problem. Duh, why wouldnt we want that



Get back to me when you can prove that 40 years ago we would have a Planned Parenthood rep arguing with Florida lawmakers that we need to kill a "fetus outside the womb" and that it should only be between a doctor and the woman to commit fetacide.

You get back to me on that one.


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## YoungRepublican (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue.
> ...



No, it determines who is left in the past, and who has an intelligence level that progressed past 1970. We have had Conservative SC's, Presidents, AG's, and why has this ruling not been overturned? Because they only let people with intelligence into these positions, and it is obvious that "Pro-lifers" don't have those reasoning skills. They would rather three three lives ruined before something that isn't even a person is terminated.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue.
> ...



No it's a test to show that no way, no how are we going to allow you left wing whackos get your way to be able to kill a "fetus outside the womb".



And you are trying. And it's on record.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> 
> The bottom line is simple, either we can force these people into having children they don't want, so the children can grow up in a home that is'nt ready to have them, and doesn't want them, so they can get into their teens and go out an d commit crimes and be just as poor as their parents are. Or, we can allow parents to have children when they are ready and those children can have a shot at a real life. A successful life. But, no, this is still an issue for some reason. Some people want children to grow up unwanted in poor homes so they can go out and be part of the problem. Duh, why wouldnt we want that



Yes, exactly. 

And, its not just that your lives are changed forever, the child will never have the attention, the education and the future he could have had if his parents had been prepared for him. 

In another thread, the very same anti-basic rights posters are screeching about a young girl who had her baby and then killed it. 

Not one of them has wondered what would drive her to that act. How desperate would one have to be to do what she did?

I'd bet her own parents were not prepared to have her and same with the parents before them. 

Its all well and good to be all holier than thou when you're facing a lifetime of poverty ad no way out. But, until you walk in others' shoes, you really have no idea what you're talking about. 

And all of that means absolutely nothing because its no one's business but hers.


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

I don't think being on one end or another of the Abortion debate denotes your intelligence.

Intelligence is the acquisition and application of knowledge and skills. How you get and use info. 

Saying one political side or another is inherently smarter is extremely dishonest and fantastical.


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## YoungRepublican (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> ...



Abortion is abortion.. It isnt like they throw the woman down the steps or scrape her uterus with a metal hanger. They giver her pills, she takes the pills, the pregnancy is terminated. Why ruin her life, the fathers life and the childs life by forcing the three parties into an unwanted situation where the child is born unwanted to lead a statistically poorer, more crime centered life?


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



Tell that to Gosnell's victims douchebag. You just tell that to one of his screaming coming out and needed their heads snipped off person. 

Hold that baby errrrr fetus in your hands and snip off its head. Tell me it's not a person decapitated.

Wait a minute. It might not be a democrat or a liberal. Ah yes. Snip away.


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## YoungRepublican (Oct 19, 2013)

I couldn't care less about abortion. If you don't want to be pregnant within the first tri mester than get rid of it. It isnt like its a person. Want me to watch the abortion take place on a screen? OK, sure. The world is already too overpopulated with unwanted children committing crimes and being detriments to society, why wouldn't I be for less of that?


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



They give her pills and the pregnancy is terminated?

Aye carumba.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



Yeah, how many have you had?

The procedure is not that easy, or that safe.

And explain to me how it is that child abuse and other crime have increased exponentially since abortion was legalized, if it's a cure-all for those things?

Baby killers. You guys never change. Hitler's abortionists maintained that abortions were necessary to *protect* life as well. They were also liars, and scum.


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## YoungRepublican (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > tinydancer said:
> ...



Easy, it is a statistical fact that abortion and crime rate is in direct correlation. When Row v. Wade was passed, the American crime rate was on a steep rise, and continued to rise over the 80's and early 90's, then what happened? The crime rate drops drastically. Why? Because when all of the crime all of these unwanted children would have committing when they were 18 (prime crime rate) they were never around to commit the crime. Want to know how they found this out? Five states legalized or allowed easier processes for abortion three years earlier than the rest of the nation. Was it a coincidence that their crime rate fell 30 percent more than the way the rest of the country did in fifteen years after it was legalized? Then you look at the states that not only made it easier for abortions to be had, versus the states that just made it "legal", crime rate is shown to be 30% lower in the states that made it easier to get abortions.

Here is the crazziest stat. All of the data points to people under the age of 25 (people young enough to be exposed to legalized abortion) where the crime rate drops. There is no statistical data showing a lower crime rate for people over 25 (people not exposed to abortions) These are numbers, and I know they scare a lot of you, but they don't lie. Abortion has done a greater job at lowering the crime rate than any DARE program, police force, crime legislation etc. period. Funny thing is the precise opposite thing happened in Romania. Romania made abortion illegal, and guess what happened to them? Crime rate shoots up drastically. Why? Because thousands of unwanted, poor, children were being born committing crime like they were going to.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

"
*Coercion facts:*


 64 percent of abortions involve some sort of coercion.
 45 percent of men interviewed at abortion clinics recalled urging abortion, including 37 percent of married men.
 Teens are at higher risk for becoming victims of coerced abortion.
 According to researcher David Reardon, women give these reasons, among others, for undergoing abortion:


 Forced by their mother, father, husband or boyfriend
 Lack of support from social network
 Persuaded / pressured by abortion center."
Forced Abortions


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> I couldn't care less about abortion. If you don't want to be pregnant within the first tri mester than get rid of it. It isnt like its a person. Want me to watch the abortion take place on a screen? OK, sure. The world is already too overpopulated with unwanted children committing crimes and being detriments to society, why wouldn't I be for less of that?



It's not an adult human like you and I, but it's a developing human life. It's the promise of a person. Left unharmed, it will be a person some day.

Your last sentence troubles me. While there is a threat of overpopulation to our world, it's not solely "unwanted" children committing crimes and being detriments to society. As there are children out there who were/are wanted who commit crimes, so too are there unwanted children who grow up to be loving and decent human beings. 

I'm not for preventative death.


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## YoungRepublican (Oct 19, 2013)

Wake said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I couldn't care less about abortion. If you don't want to be pregnant within the first tri mester than get rid of it. It isnt like its a person. Want me to watch the abortion take place on a screen? OK, sure. The world is already too overpopulated with unwanted children committing crimes and being detriments to society, why wouldn't I be for less of that?
> ...



But, it is statistically prevalent when talking about abortion.. Unwanted and kids who grow up in homes that weren't ready for them are at an increased potential for being criminals. Not to mention if my GF got pregnant, I would have to drop out of school, get some work a day 22 dollar an hour job, just to provide for this kid I never wanted. Now my life is ruined too. Who wants that?


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

That's a complete and total fabrication. If children aren't wanted these days, they are killed. There is absolutely no evidence that legalized abortion results in FEWER unwanted children, and in fact the evidence, gathered over MILLENNIA, shows us that societies that practice and encourage abortion actually are more likely to kill and harm children.


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



Perhaps there is a solution other than death. Influence is everything in life. Loving, principled people (usually) pass on their values to their children. As a society, we should highlight and revere certain principles, like responsibility and respect, and encourage it for everyone. The question would be "how."

Affordable, easily-accessed birth control would be better than rampant abortion. Maturity and responsibility would be better than birth control. There are many risks out there that people take, and when people take risks they should take responsibility if they don't pay off. Having sex without birth control, like playing Russian Roulette, is a great risk. By doing so you take the risk of impregnating the female you are with. If the consequence is too great, please don't take the risk, or do something to lower it (like birth control).


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## Intense (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > I think he meant abortions CAN be a medical necessity.
> ...





> *Still -  the reason for an abortion is no one's business.*


Really? Outside of civilized society, you may have a valid argument. 

You are big on eugenics, huh. Sad.

There are no winners in abortion, only loss, in one form or another, for all involved. To claim that one knows with finality the possibilities of what another may achieve, in life, is utter bullshit. Are you that vain? Never mind. Don't answer, it's a trick question. 

Granted, there are certain rights a pregnant female has among choices, but, there is nothing to celebrate about the termination of the life of an unborn fetus. Be the pregnancy unplanned, or by force, or high risk for the mother, it is still her choice to make. Let's learn to distinguish between hardship, be it trauma, or whatever the cause, and the termination of a pregnancy because the sex of the fetus isn't what was hoped for, or a hare lip,  or a risk of some sickness. 

For the record, my position is pro life, through persuasion, not law, though, like all things, abortion needs to be regulated. There are always do's and dont's. Adoption should be the best supported alternative. Why anyone would have a problem with that, is beyond me. That said, dealing with women that have chose to have an abortion, I try to separate the act from the person. For those that advise others to do it, it's on you, you are not without guilt.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

The ones who are in favor of the state forcing women to give birth to unwanted babies are also dead set against helping the poor out of poverty.

In other treads, they want the worst to happen to the children of the poor. They don't want to get decent food at school, they don't want Head Start funded, they don't want the poor to have a bed to sleep in and food to eat. 

They want to hurt people. If you can't pay for health care, "let them die". You're a gay man, protecting your country, you're boo'd. 

The rw's are not known as "haters" for nuthin'.


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## Smilodonfatalis (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Smilodonfatalis said:
> 
> 
> > tinydancer said:
> ...



Sorry.

I'd take back the neg I gave you, if I could.  It's too late.

I'm drunk and I judged your statement too quickly without reading through your response to her response.

I thought you were saying no abortions were medically necessary.

I'm just really pissed off that my favorite football team lost today.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Intense said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



*You are big on eugenics*

Didn't read the rest of your post because that is bullshit and you know it. 

Gawd. Are you another one of those fools who refuses to see any of the good that Margaret Sanger did?

How do you feel about Charles Lindbergh flying the Atlantic in the Spirit of St Louis? Or Ayn Rand being pro-nazi and pro-abortion?

jeeezus


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> That's a complete and total fabrication. *If children aren't wanted these days, they are killed. *There is absolutely no evidence that legalized abortion results in FEWER unwanted children, and in fact the evidence, gathered over MILLENNIA, shows us that societies that practice and encourage abortion actually are more likely to kill and harm children.



You just get nuttier and nuttier. 

People are not killing unwanted children. 

Yes, there are people like Casey Anthony or the religious freak in Texasss who drowned her 5 kids but no - there is not reason to think that people are killing unwanted children. 

And, children have always been abused and harmed. There was a thread here on this board not long ago where usual haters said they routinely hit their kids. Some said they think its fine to hit children as young as still in diapers.


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## tinydancer (Oct 19, 2013)

Smilodonfatalis said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Smilodonfatalis said:
> ...



Not a worry

I'm no angel preaching to a choir here. I understand why there needs to be birth control. I understand really truly sadly why abortions need to be, why the morning after pill.

I understand. 

Its trying to find a way a way for a medium stance. I am no angel. I can't make things better. But I sure as heck wish we could stop hurtling on. 

I wish I could stop that much.


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

Guys, guys, let's go have a drink or take a break from this thread. 

Please? I don't like seeing people I like fighting each other.


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## Wake (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa, Koshergrl, I'm certain both of you are good people.

Hey, I know! Maybe you two can share with me your points on this issue? Yeah, bounce'em off me and maybe we can land on a new middleground? That sounds fun! What'd you say guys?


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## Intense (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.
> 
> Make birth control affordable, free to those who just don't have the money, and watch the abortion rate drop.



It already is. You are wrong here. Want abortions to slow down, stop throwing Federal money at abortion clinics.


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## Intense (Oct 19, 2013)

*Thread reopened. Please try to keep it civil and on topic.*


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## Intense (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...







I'm so sorry if the language is to complicated for you to digest. Let me try to simplify for you...... 



> the reason for an abortion is no one's business.



Your words. Do you really need a translation??? That's bullshit.
For arguments sake.... Translation..... 

Anything goes, and there is nothing to do about it. No room for guidelines, regulation, that's what you are implying. You want to tailor or amend that? fine with me. 



> Gawd. Are you another one of those fools who refuses to see any of the good that Margaret Sanger did?


Would you want to credit her for the mass murders involved with her legacy? Where or when  have so many lost lives been associated with a single event or person? Noah's Flood? I don't hate her. I don't hate anyone for that matter. I may pray for her salvation. Someone should.




> How do you feel about Charles Lindbergh flying the Atlantic in the Spirit of St Louis? Or Ayn Rand being pro-nazi and pro-abortion?



I grew up near Roosevelt Field. I thought it was a brave and coreagous flight. I don't see a point here, Sparky. 

Ayn Rand was Human, translation, not perfect. I admire most of her work, I don't idolize her, or walk in lock step with her or anyone else. I thought you knew that.



> jeeezus


Why waste his time? When you are ready, call on him. 



> Didn't read the rest of your post because that is bullshit and you know it.


My favorite part of your post. I saved it for last, I doubt you will get this far, considering your self proclaimed disorder, commenting about things you have not yet read, so I just thought I would share this futile attempt to say hi to your following.


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## Intense (Oct 19, 2013)

NEW YORK CITY ABORTION RATIO DECLINED SLIGHTLY IN 2011

Thursday, 07 March 2013 10:44

Group Warns that Cuomo Abortion Expansion Would Reverse Progress


New York, NY, March 6...Discernible progress is being made in New York City on the ratio of abortions to live births just released 2011 City data shows, but that progress could easily be reversed if Governor Cuomo forces through an abortion expansion measure in Albany that could drive abortion rates higher, the Chiaroscuro Foundation today said.

While the city remained the abortion capital of America in 2011, with abortion ratios almost twice the national average (the national average was 22% in 2008), the ratio of live births to abortions citywide in 2011 fell below 40% (39.55%) for the first time since 1970, when abortion was legalized in New York. The Bronx continues to lead the city in percentage of abortions to live births at 47.97%, and Staten Island women terminated pregnancies the least often at 29.89%. The ratio of abortions for African-American women remained demographically highest in the city in 2011 at 57.7% Asian and Pacific Island women had the lowest ratio at 18.2%. City abortion data from 1994-2011, broken down by borough and ethnicity, is available here.

&#8220;New York City has one of the highest abortion rates in America, but progress is slowly being made,&#8221; said Greg Pfundstein, president of the Chiaroscuro Foundation. &#8220;It is all the more alarming then that Governor Cuomo is talking about measures in Albany, like allowing non-physicians to perform abortions, that would dramatically increase the number of abortions in the state. Polling clearly shows that New Yorkers think there are too many abortions as it is, and we hope Governor Cuomo is beginning to hear that message.&#8221;

Recent statewide polling on the issue is available here, and a comprehensive 2010 citywide survey on abortion attitudes is available here.

In the midst of the overall progress, the number of late term abortions after 21 weeks reached a reached a ten year high as a percentage of the total number of pregnancies.

Of the 203, 514 viable pregnancies in New York City in 2011, 80,485 were terminated by abortion. 2,085, or 2.59%, of the abortions performed in the City in 2011 were performed at gestational ages of 21 weeks or later. &#8220;Gov. Cuomo&#8217;s effort to expand late term abortions will certainly drive this number higher in the coming years if he forces through his abortion expansion effort,&#8221; Pfundstein said. &#8220; At a time when medical advances have enabled doctors to save younger and younger preterm babies, the Governor&#8217;s effort to increase the number of late term abortions in unconscionable.&#8221;

NYC 41 Percent - NYC 41 Percent


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## PixieStix (Oct 19, 2013)

Intense said:


> *Thread reopened. Please try to keep it civil and on topic.*




Ok. Abortion is murder. The willful killing of an innocent life.

The devil is in the details


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly





> How do you feel about Charles Lindbergh flying the Atlantic in the Spirit of St Louis? Or Ayn Rand being pro-nazi and pro-abortion?



Intense





> I grew up near Roosevelt Field. I thought it was a brave and coreagous flight. I don't see a point here, Sparky.
> 
> Ayn Rand was Human, translation, not perfect. _I admire most of her work, I don't idolize her, or walk in lock step with her or anyone else._ I thought you knew that.



You don't see the point but that doesn't stop you from insulting me?

The point is simple. 

Those who want to take rights away from women often name Margaret Sanger because of her stand on eugenics. They willfully CHOOSE to hold on to their ignorance about the incredible good she did for the poor in the cold water tenement flats of NYC. Women begged her for help in stopping the repeated pregnancies that were killing them and starving entire families. Sanger brought "French letters" from France and got deported as a result. She did came back to the US and continued to teach women how to prevent pregnancy. And, she believed in eugenics. 

Charles Lindbergh is still considered an American hero in spite of the fact that he was a nazi and funnel US money to them. His wife left him for his work against the US. 

About Margaret Sanger,  _I admire most of her work, I don't idolize her, or walk in lock step with her or anyone else._

About Chas Lindbergh, I have nothing but contempt. Ayn Rand - heh. She was an interesting read in high school but I outgrew her and she means nothing to me now. 

Do you get the point now? Or are you just going to go on insulting me for no reason?


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > *Thread reopened. Please try to keep it civil and on topic.*
> ...



That's an opinion. 

Not one shared by most women who have them, medical science or the law. 

But let's all agree that it would be nice if there were less abortions.  

How do you get there?  By banning them?  Hasn't worked with drugs, didn't work with alcohol and most gun bans don't work, either.  

You get there by 1) Preventing pregnancy from happening to start with and 2) giving women options if they are on the fence about abortion.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



Only you delude yourself into thinking your opinion is the only one that holds weight.

Quite ironic you would push gun bans, but say most of them don't work. Thank you for debunking a key premise of your very own progressive worldview. Freudian slip, perhaps?


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## Noomi (Oct 19, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > *Thread reopened. Please try to keep it civil and on topic.*
> ...



It is your opinion that abortion is murder. Murder is the deliberate killing of a human person. A fetus is not considered a person by law, thus, abortion is not murder.

Try again.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



I think we need to push SMARTER gun laws...  

Such as holding gun makers liable for the damage t heir products cause.  

But let's keep on topic.  

My opinion is frankly irrelevent. And so is yours.  

The only RELEVENT opinion is the one of the woman that the fetus/embryo/pre-born person whatever you want to call it resides in.  

If her opinion is that it's not a baby and she is going to get rid of it, she's going to get rid of it.  

On another thread, someone pointed out that in 1967, Romania banned not only abortion but contraception.  And they had a baby boom that lasted exactly one year.  

AFter that, women figured out how to beat the system- _in a Communist Dicatorship_, no less.  

Oh, yeah, and Communist dictatorships actually had no problem making gun control work.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Then shut your trap and stop giving it.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Abortion is homicide. Laws do not dictate humanity, and people who commit murder when it's legal can still be held accountable, and are still murderers. Regardless of whether or not the murder is legal under the current regime. 

People are prosecuted and given the death penalty all the time for committing murder that was deemed "legal" at the time.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Intense said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.
> ...



Can someone tell me why it is completely ignored that its been something like 30 years since the passage of the Hyde Amendment, which forbids federal funding for abortion?

Why is this even brought up since it is completely untrue?


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## PixieStix (Oct 19, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



There you go with details again. Long winded and excuse making as to why it is NOT murder.

Like I said the devil is indeed in the details.

Tearing a human fetus to pieces is murder. NOT an opinion.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > That's a complete and total fabrication. *If children aren't wanted these days, they are killed. *There is absolutely no evidence that legalized abortion results in FEWER unwanted children, and in fact the evidence, gathered over MILLENNIA, shows us that societies that practice and encourage abortion actually are more likely to kill and harm children.
> ...



And none of that has anything to do with abortion. 

Abortion is not murder, it is not killing children, its ignorant idiocy and demagoguery to maintain otherwise.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

You know, selectively editting posts to make your point is against the rules, right?


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## PixieStix (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.
> 
> Make birth control affordable, free to those who just don't have the money, and watch the abortion rate drop.



Birth control pills are cheap and many times free. Condoms are cheap too.

Personal responsibility.........priceless


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Shut up, joe. You already told us your opinion is irrelevant, and we all agree.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Abortion is homicide. Laws do not dictate humanity, and people who commit murder when it's legal can still be held accountable, and are still murderers. Regardless of whether or not the murder is legal under the current regime.
> 
> People are prosecuted and given the death penalty all the time for committing murder that was deemed "legal" at the time.



Here we go again. 

SSDD about fetuses but I'd love to hear about all these murders that weren't murders when the murder was committed?

Are you going to make it into another George Zimmerman murdered Trayvon thread? Fergit it cuz neither of them were fetuses at the time of the murder so it doesn't count.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



Except society doesn't consider fetuses to be the same as babies.  

I've known women who've had babies die, and women who've had miscarriages. (the latter in my own very Catholic family.)  Sorry, they are just not considered the same thing, even when they are wanted.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Abortion is homicide. Laws do not dictate humanity, and people who commit murder when it's legal can still be held accountable, and are still murderers. Regardless of whether or not the murder is legal under the current regime.
> 
> People are prosecuted and given the death penalty all the time for committing murder that was deemed "legal" at the time.



Really?  When?  

I mean, other than another nation defeating them in a war or something.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



As already correctly noted: in your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law.  

If you believe abortion is murder, then dont have an abortion.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> You know, selectively editting posts to make your point is against the rules, right?



Nope. Those were your own words, Joe. If I changed the wording to make it appear you said something different, then yes. Oh, too bad. I know the site rules better than you do, so spare me the lecture.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



That is exactly the point I was trying to make with koshergirl who said that unwanted children are killed.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Wait, you want a woman to have an abortion, but are telling another one not to have one...

Forgive me if I struggle with that logic...


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## Sarah G (Oct 19, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



The anti choicers are out in full force tonight.  Full moon?  It is not murder, I was however watching a program early this morning about the murder of a doctor who performed abortions in Kansas.  George Tiller.  He was shot in both arms first off then someone came and finished the job.

Now that is murder.  

I think the uptick in abortion discussions have to do with the new law in California:



> Nurses, other non-physicians can perform abortions in California
> 
> As more states pass measures tightening abortion laws, California is making abortions more accessible.
> 
> ...


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...



You posted a photo of yourself that appear male-ish. 

If you are a male, do you believe there should be laws giving the state control over your reproduction?

Should the state decide when you will produce offspring and when you will not?

Same question for the other males - 

Who should control your reproduction?


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



He actually said neither. 

He said there is a choice to be made.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> The grandson is already named



all the best and all the health to the beautiful family


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Sarah G said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



Certainly proves the anti-rights people are in favor of murder. 

All that whining about fetuses being "murdered" because they are actually children and yet, they have no problem with murdering other people.

That is beyond the usual hypocrisy we see from the crackpot rw's.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



no, you are a typical stupid leftard screeching angry vagina


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Abortion is homicide. Laws do not dictate humanity, and people who commit murder when it's legal can still be held accountable, and are still murderers. Regardless of whether or not the murder is legal under the current regime.
> 
> People are prosecuted and given the death penalty all the time for committing murder that was deemed "legal" at the time.



Ignorant nonsense. 



> _No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed._
> 
> US Constitution, Article I, Section 9





> Ex post facto
> 
> Latin for "from a thing done afterward." Ex post facto is most typically used to refer to a criminal law that applies retroactively, thereby criminalizing conduct that was legal when originally performed.
> 
> Ex post facto | LII / Legal Information Institute



Its as if the Framers anticipated the insanity that is the social right.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > No reason to abort a Tay-Sachs baby? Really.
> ...



absolute LIE.
most abortions are a convenience and there is almost never a necessity to murder a baby because of medical problems ( of the mother).
medical problems with a baby are not a medical necessity to murder the baby. EVER.
a baby in a woman's body is not a woman's body.

ans a murder of the baby is ALWAYS a murder. In the majority of cases - for pure convenience only.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Abortion is homicide. Laws do not dictate humanity, and people who commit murder when it's legal can still be held accountable, and are still murderers. Regardless of whether or not the murder is legal under the current regime.
> ...



So guess what, punishing someone for not having healthcare insurance is an act of attainder. Since beforehand not having healthcare insurance carried with it no punishment. 

ohh lookie what I found!


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



You're welcome to whatever opinion suits your agenda. 

Abortion is legal and its none of your business unless you're the one that's pregnant.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> I put pics up of my kids all the time. So has luser and a lot of other posters.
> 
> And if you're trying to intimidate me, then your tenure on this board is about to come to a crashing end, and your IP will be reported.
> 
> ...



I think he is not trying to intimidate. and I understand where he is coming from.

Despite all our ideological differences this particular remark was done of real concern. IMHO.


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## Luissa (Oct 19, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



My friend used to work for a collection agency that collected on medical bills. Many would never pay their bills. If a doctor or hospital doesn't get paid for their services, how do you think they make up that money lost?


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



for NOW 

you know, women and children were viewed as subhuman and their murder was not counted as murder of a human by a lot of magnificent civilizations.

Not to even mention slavery and racial misconstructions of the laws 

so the key element here is a time issue.
Murder of an innocent human being can not be legal too long.

In a civilized society.


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

So, just for curiosities sake....has anyone had a change of heart about abortion? Step right up and state if you have been swayed the opposite of your original thoughts about it. I'll wait.


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## Sarah G (Oct 19, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



I knew that .


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > I put pics up of my kids all the time. So has luser and a lot of other posters.
> ...



People have no idea how much information can be gleaned from what appears to be an anonymous photo.


I just think its stupid to post photos of children on an open and very public message board.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > I think he meant abortions CAN be a medical necessity.
> ...



Bullshit.

abortions are NOT done in the hospitals and extremely rarely done by the patient's OB/GYN( the majority of which do not perform those as a choice) as neither the hospital stuff nor the doctors who are taking care of the patient are willing to be a part of the MURDER. 
that is why it is done in abortion clinics only. 
complications of abortions go to the hospitals and miscarriages usually as well. The latter ones ARE the tragedy for the whole family often, true.
But miscarriage is not a planned murder as abortion is.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



In a "civilized" society, in a FREE society, both men AND women have full ownership and control over their own bodies.

Has anyone noticed that not one anti-freedom male has stepped up to answer my earier question?

The question again is simply this -

Do you believe government should have control over your reproduction? 

Should the state have the power to force you to reproduce?

If you answer yes, should the state have the power to force you to support a child you did not want to have?

Its so easy for you anti-freedom nutters to say you want the government to control every woman's reproduction but, if it were turned around, you'd be singing a different tune. And, you would be quite right to do so.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



I would rep you if I could 
For being considerate.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



Wow. You have no clue.

This is also why we have no accurate numbers about abortion. Most are done as I said  - by the OB, in a hospital as part of medical treatment. 

If Roe v Wade were overturned, the number of therapeutic d & c's would skyrocket.


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## PixieStix (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



Weak, a very weak excuse

And the hypocrisy is sickening


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



I have a perfect clue.
Professional one 
it is not 1975 anymore, you know

 I'll add - there are OB/GYN residencies which do not teach to perform abortions, because nobody is willing to do them.
The California law is based on this - there is an acute shortage of providers being an MD ( not even OB/GYN).

During the last 40 years medical science has advanced dramatically and nowadays every medical porfessional KNOWS that life begins at conception.
And less and less of them are willing to participate in murder.
Luckily, for now laws of this country permit an option of choice for a medical professional as well  and you do not have to perform a procedure or assist in any other way in a murder.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



The reason we have no accurate numbers is because the abortion abbatoirs are not required to provide records to any oversight agency. That's right, they don't have to report anything...and the reason they don't want ultrasounds is because they know that if they used the ultrasounds, they would be forced to adhere to the laws that limit abortions to a certain time line. Those ultrasounds pinpoint the stage of pregnancy to the very day...and they could not legally perform the abortions they do now if it could be proven they knew, without a shadow of a doubt, how far along the women they hack at actually are in their pregnancies.


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## Sarah G (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Shut up, joe. You already told us your opinion is irrelevant, and we all agree.



Wow, speak for yourself, Allie.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



So now having basic rights over one's own body is "sickening hypocrisy".

if you mean Rick and Karen Santorum, I agree completely. 

There are plenty of countries where it is legal to force women to reproduce. Why don't you move to one of them? I'm sure you could find a burka in your size.

But, for now, IF you live in the US, you're stuck with equal rights and freedom under our Constitution.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Right over your body does not extend to the right to terminate the life within another.

Try again.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Did you know your sig violates the usmb 10-line sig rule?

Just thought you'd like to know. I'm sure you wouldn't intentionally violate the rule, luddly.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Also, bold red is restricted to mod use.


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## mamooth (Oct 19, 2013)

Intense said:


> Would you want to credit her for the mass murders involved with her legacy?



Margaret Sanger was one of the most heroic women in American history.

And no, no one sensible says she was a eugenicist. That crazy story is only put forth by pro-lifers. It's just kooky. Sanger was praised by MLK, Bethune, DuBois and all the black leaders of the time. If she was engaged in genocide against blacks, how do you explain that? Maybe MLK was a partner in black genocide, maybe he was a stupid dupe of the evil Sanger, or maybe ... gasp ... maybe you've been fed a lot of outright lies about Sanger.

Why the rage against Sanger? Because she was the first to publicly say it was okay for women to enjoy sex just for the sake of sex. That enraged the religious conservatives back then, and that's the origin of the ongoing hatred.

And yes, I'm very aware of the standard pro-life list of supposed quotes by Sanger. Half are outright fabrications, and the other half are ripped screaming out of context. Post them if you'd like.


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

MY body. I ALONE decide what to do with it.  No some people on a message board. Not the government. Not anyone. Period.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

"
*The Eugenic Value of Birth Control             Propaganda*

*By Margaret Sanger*

         Seemingly every new approach to the great problem of the human race             must manifest its vitality by running the gauntlet of prejudice,             ridicule and misinterpretation. Eugenists may remember that not many             years ago this program for race regeneration was subjected to the             cruel ridicule of stupidity and ignorance. Today Eugenics is             suggested by the most diverse minds as the most adequate and             thorough avenue to the solution of racial, political and social             problems. The most intransigent and daring teachers and scientists             have lent their support to this great biological interpretation of             the human race. The war has emphasized its necessity."


The Public Papers of Margaret Sanger: Web Edition


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Right over your body does not extend to the right to terminate the life within another.
> 
> Try again.



Alaine, that is your opinion and you're welcome to it. 

However, its not the law.

Live your life as you wish, make up all the little lies you want, hiss and spit and preach and whine --  but you cannot force others to bend to your will. 

And, that's just the way it is.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> MY body. I ALONE decide what to do with it.  No some people on a message board. Not the government. Not anyone. Period.



Too bad. You are not allowed to use your body to kill children, or by withdrawal of the oversight and protection of your body to allow harm to come to them.

Pretty simple.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

This is where Luddly posts "I'm a fucking idiot who has no concept of what the hell I'm talking about at any time, but even less than usual regarding the subject of abortion. I swear never to open my stupid mouth on the topic again, except to proclaim my undying support of the pro-life agenda and all things kosher."


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > Would you want to credit her for the mass murders involved with her legacy?
> ...



I believe she was pro-nazi but as I pointed out earlier, so was Charles Lindbergh and Ayn Rand and the rw's just UH-DOOR them. 

Sanger did enormous good. And, yes, she did say women should be able to enjoy sex while being able to avoid pregnancy. 

She introduced "French letters" to the US and when she was deported for it, she brought more back. 

I highly recommend her books. Its been years since I read them but her desire to help poor women and children is just as timely now as it was then.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Yes, nazis loved Sanger and she loved them.

She was staunchly anti-abortion however. She correctly identified abortion as an abuse of women, and murder besides.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > MY body. I ALONE decide what to do with it.  No some people on a message board. Not the government. Not anyone. Period.
> ...



Yes, I am allowed to do with my body whatever I want done. If not legally, then ilegally. MY BODY. Not anyone elses. And when the day comes that government or others have a right to a body other than their own, we may as well allow slavery...which ain't gonna happen.

So everyone can gripe and moan and groan all they want but it comes to naught. Our bodies are our own. And there isn't a damn thing anyone can do about it.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > MY body. I ALONE decide what to do with it.  No some people on a message board. Not the government. Not anyone. Period.
> ...



On that, we agree. 

But, this thread is about abortion, not about killing children.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

That would make you a murderer.

Murderers and narcissists always maintain that they exist separate from the law..a law unto themselves, as it were. 
They are universally despised, too.


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



Yup, abortion, a.k.a., baby killing.


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Right over your body does not extend to the right to terminate the life within another.
> ...



For NOW 

Black people were not considered equal by the law as well.

It has changed.
This also will.

And that is what we are going to continue to do  - name the murder what it is.
and name supporters of the murder what they are as well.
Especially those with a XX pair of 46th chromosomes.

And you, proponents of the murder and active murderers can hiss ans spit, and whine and screech all you want - won't change the fact that abortions IS a murder of an innocent baby.

And as a murder it haunts ( as it should) - women who have had abortions have much higher suicide rates and depression rates.
Not to name gynecological problems, which are a legion.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Hey pudly... you did catch that your heroine, the eugenecist Sanger, was staunchly ANTI-abortion, right?

Cuz you haven't commented on it.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

To you, I am a murderer. Ok. Like, ouch. I don't think I will live knowing that. (cough).

I had an abortion long ago. I'd do it again if the same circumstances happened. I don't regret it one iota. So think of me what you will. Women's bodies are theirs to chose what is allowed to grow in it. Nobody else can choose, especially the one that planted it there to begin with without the agreement of the recipient that has to carry it. All the screeching in the world won't stop women from doing what THEY choose to do with their bodies. Period.


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



Luckily enough you are too old to murder innocent babies


----------



## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

Oh, and it WAS done in a hospital. By doctors.


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> To you, I am a murderer. Ok. Like, ouch. I don't think I will live knowing that. (cough).
> 
> I had an abortion long ago. I'd do it again if the same circumstances happened. I don't regret it one iota. So think of me what you will. Women's bodies are theirs to chose what is allowed to grow in it. Nobody else can choose, especially the one that planted it there to begin with without the agreement of the recipient that has to carry it. All the screeching in the world won't stop women from doing what THEY choose to do with their bodies. Period.



one more vagina with vocal cords proud to be a murderer


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## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

She can certainly influence others to do so, though.

Meanwhile, Luddly, from your hero Sanger:

"Possibly             drastic and Spartan methods may be forced upon society if it             continues complacently to encourage the chance and chaotic breeding             that has resulted from our stupidly cruel sentimentalism."

You know what she's referring to, right?

Abortion and infanticide...the spartans threw imperfect or poorly born babies out for the wolves to eat.

The Public Papers of Margaret Sanger: Web Edition


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> Oh, and it WAS done in a hospital. By doctors.



30 years ago 

you ability to murder is gone. GOOD.


----------



## mamooth (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> I believe she was pro-nazi



Nah. That claim stems from an article by Nazi Ernst Rudin in a 1933 issue of Birth Control Review, an issue that featured pro and con articles on forced sterilization. However, Sanger had resigned as editor in 1929, and had no affiliation with the magazine at all in 1933. She never had any affiliation or communication with any Nazis. 

That won't stop koshr from claiming it, of course. God is on her side, which means any lie she tells is justified in the eyes of God.


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## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> She can certainly influence others to do so, though.
> 
> Meanwhile, Luddly, from your hero Sanger:
> 
> ...



We do not have to go that far.
There have been the whole classes of people being dehumanized based on their appearance not that long time ago - much less than all the way to ancient Sparta.

The defenders of racism based it also on the laws and were also extremely proud.

Where are they NOW?

But honestly, I can fathom how can anybody be proud of a murder of the innocent baby.
Plus be so stupid to parade around that she is a murderer


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Hey pudly... you did catch that your heroine, the eugenecist Sanger, was staunchly ANTI-abortion, right?
> 
> Cuz you haven't commented on it.



Actually, she was more concerned with the welfare of women and children. She was not "staunchly anti-abortion". She was against back alley butchers and believe contraception should be the answer. She said there were times when "abortion is justifiable" but called contraception the "cure for abortions". 

Are you aware that she's dead?

Are you aware that abortion is legal in the US and that Margaret Sanger has no say over anything in this age?

Your constant lying does nothing to help your cause. Anyone who read what I wrote knows that Sanger is not "my heroine".


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > To you, I am a murderer. Ok. Like, ouch. I don't think I will live knowing that. (cough).
> ...



Obviously, you have never had to make that decision. You have never been forced to do the one thing you did not want to do. 

Attacking someone you know nothing about is nothing more than cyber-bullying. If you met her in real life, you would not say this to her face. 

Shut up until you have some frikken clue what you're preaching about.


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## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

How many here have offered to pay a woman to carry a baby she does not want...her medical, the delivery, recompensate for loss of a job if she had one, etc...then adopted that baby to raise?

Anyone?

I thought not.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > I believe she was pro-nazi
> ...



Thanks. I read her books many years ago. 

I've never been trapped and dirt poor, one room, cold water walk up tenement in NYC but I felt for the women who begged her for help. 

At that time, Lysol was used as a douche/contraceptive. There is little doubt that the anti-rights preachers would have poor women right back to that backward, barbaric method of contraception.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



The moron is on ignore but I can see when someone quotes said moron. I don't give a rats ass what he thinks because like you said Luddy...he has no knowlege of who I am.

Meanwhile...I wonder if those acting like screeching harpies would insist their daughters have a child when the daughter does not want to carry it and wants it aborted asap after finding out they were preggers after being raped. Let's say...a 14 year old girl for example. Would those with daughters FORCE them to carry that fetus? Even knowing the daughter is distraught at the thought of the rapists child growing within her?

Do tell.


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## mamooth (Oct 19, 2013)

There's never a word about any specific race in anything Sanger writes. When she mentions "eugenics", she's referring to improving the human race.

Now, Sanger was not keen on poor people. She's very much like modern conservatives, in that she didn't want poor people to breed. But she was always completely color-blind in that regard.



> Seemingly every new approach to the great problem of the human race  must manifest its vitality by running the gauntlet of prejudice, ridicule and misinterpretation. Eugenists may remember that not many years ago this program for race regeneration was subjected to the cruel ridicule of stupidity and ignorance. Today Eugenics is suggested by the most diverse minds as the most adequate and thorough avenue to the solution of racial, political and social problems. The most intransigent and daring teachers and scientists have lent their support to this great biological interpretation of the human race. The war has emphasized its necessity.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

Gracie said:


> How many here have offered to pay a woman to carry a baby she does not want...her medical, the delivery, recompensate for loss of a job if she had one, etc...then adopted that baby to raise?
> 
> Anyone?
> 
> I thought not.



Nope. They just want to control women. They really don't give a flip about the baby and wouldn't lift a finger to actually help a real child.

People Who Call Themselves "Pro-Life" Are Lying, Here Are 10 More Accurate Descriptions -


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...


*
Nobody is forced to make that decision.*
It is not occupied Italy during world war II.
In a nowadays US and even 30 years ago it is done for CONVENIENCE only.
And it is a murder.
I can understand that a woman might have been stupid enough or forced by a boyfriend or whatever - then.
But to be even more stupid to parade it around years after means only one thing - that woman is a screeching vagina with vocal cords, nothing more - there is neither a brain, nor a heart in that creature.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > How many here have offered to pay a woman to carry a baby she does not want...her medical, the delivery, recompensate for loss of a job if she had one, etc...then adopted that baby to raise?
> ...



Kinda like some churches I've heard about. It's all "love thy neighbor, be kind, do unto others" on sunday but Monday thru saturday it's "fuck you".


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > How many here have offered to pay a woman to carry a baby she does not want...her medical, the delivery, recompensate for loss of a job if she had one, etc...then adopted that baby to raise?
> ...



you idiot, if a woman only voices her desire to give the child for adoption she is being pampered and cared and paid because there is a waiting list for adoption of an infant for YEARS in the US - no matter what race and health condition of the infant.

You murderous leftards are blatantly ignorant in your preaching of a slaughter.


----------



## mamooth (Oct 19, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> "Possibly drastic and Spartan methods may be forced upon society if it continues complacently to encourage the chance and chaotic breeding that has resulted from our stupidly cruel sentimentalism."
> 
> You know what she's referring to, right?



She's warning of what bad things could happen without contraception and family planning. If you're a crazy and dishonest person, you could claim she's advocating those bad things. Hey, look who's talking.



> Abortion and infanticide...the spartans threw imperfect or poorly born babies out for the wolves to eat.



That's your crazy person interpretation, but it only reveals how diseased your mind is.

Anyways, didn't you just tell us Sanger was anti-abortion? Now you claim she's advocating abortion. Could you please settle on a single kook conspiracy theory?


----------



## mamooth (Oct 19, 2013)

Vox said:


> you idiot, if a woman only voices her desire to give the child for adoption she is being pampered and cared and paid because there is a waiting list for adoption of an infant for YEARS in the US - no matter what race and health condition of the infant.



And if abortion was illegal, that adoption backlog would be completely filled within a couple years.

And after that, we'd be like Romania, with the overflowing orphanages.

In any case, no woman is obligated to be a broodmare just because someone else wants a child.


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > you idiot, if a woman only voices her desire to give the child for adoption she is being pampered and cared and paid because there is a waiting list for adoption of an infant for YEARS in the US - no matter what race and health condition of the infant.
> ...



no it would not.
and you do not  know anything about Romania obviously - orphanages there as orphanages anywhere in a socialist heaven were full not because of the abortion bans.
not to even remind you that all your preaching points are at least 24 years too old 

If a woman gets pregnant( with availability of birth control methods like anywhere one looks) - yes, she is obligated to deliver that child and take care of herself during pregnancy. If she is a woman, not vagina with vocal cords without a brain and a heart.
It is a murder and a normal woman would never murder her baby.
It is against the very nature of woman's body and psyche.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > you idiot, if a woman only voices her desire to give the child for adoption she is being pampered and cared and paid because there is a waiting list for adoption of an infant for YEARS in the US - no matter what race and health condition of the infant.
> ...



I worked my way through college (which would have been damn near impossible if I were also supporting kids). I had a job as a night watchman at a home for unwed mothers. Called Florence Crittendon Home for Unwed Mothers. Those are mostly or all gone now because we have come to accept pregnant teens. 

There used to be orphanages in the US as well. Those are gone too. 

Fact is, this society just does not care about children. They care about fetuses but not about kids. 

Your last line is really the final word on all of this. A woman's body belongs to her and the state should have the power to force her to reproduce. 

And, still, not one male has said they would be fine with the state controlling their reproduction. Nor are the fathers of fetuses held responsible.


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



until she gets pregnant.
than it is not her body only anymore.
It belongs to the baby as well.

And it is the state requirement to protect the vulnerable and the weak and the ones who can not protect themselves, even if it poses some temporary discomfort to the woman.
And that will happen as the society which allows murder of the innocents is doomed.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 19, 2013)

For the last time vox - you are welcome to your opinion but that's all it is. It is not the law. 

Abortions have been done since the first woman got pregnant. Keep a stiff upper lip, child and try to be brave. We are not "doomed".

But, hey, if you feel so strongly, how about you adopt a baby and let us know about that "temporary discomfort" that takes over your life and lasts until you shuffle off this mortal coil.


----------



## Vox (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> For the last time vox - you are welcome to your opinion but that's all it is.* It is not the law.
> *
> Abortions have been done since the first woman got pregnant. Keep a stiff upper lip, child and try to be brave. We are not "doomed".
> 
> But, hey, if you feel so strongly, how about you adopt a baby and let us know about that "temporary discomfort" that takes over your life and lasts until you shuffle off this mortal coil.



for one more time - FOR NOW 

it will be.
Times change and so do the laws.

Abortion will be outlawed as murder should as racial discrimination was.

A civilized society can not murder it's vulnerable and unable to defend themselves members.
As unborn children are.
Or this society will cease to exist - as happened with those who considered killing children and women not to be a crime. Rightfully so 

It is just a question of time.
Still does not make screechy selfish vaginas with vocal cords who murder innocent babies to become women.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



You aren't holding your breath are you?


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

Oh look, more dishonest claptrap meant to hide the fact that you guys are all about killing babies, exploiting women, and putting them in danger.

Meh.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Speaking of crickets.
> ...



Yup!! And I don't want to pay for war.

Sucks to be us, huh?

You still get no say.

It's not your uterus, not your business, not your problem, nada.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> 
> The bottom line is simple, either we can force these people into having children they don't want, so the children can grow up in a home that is'nt ready to have them, and doesn't want them, so they can get into their teens and go out an d commit crimes and be just as poor as their parents are. Or, we can allow parents to have children when they are ready and those children can have a shot at a real life. A successful life. But, no, this is still an issue for some reason. Some people want children to grow up unwanted in poor homes so they can go out and be part of the problem. Duh, why wouldnt we want that



Excellent post. Bravo!


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

*gag*


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> > I think he meant abortions CAN be a medical necessity.
> ...



We CAN'T give an inch because it is not our inch to give. The woman's rights have been addressed by the SCotUS. 

Have you done any research. Real research? Because if you had, you would know that the vast majority of abortions are done in the first trimester, and the ones happening fifth month and later are due to health concerns of either the mother or child, or both.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue.
> ...



No, he is not naive. He hit the nail on the head. Your statement pretty much said exactly what his did, which is that it's not a real issue. It's a beat the drums issue.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> ...



WTF? Seriously. What the fuck did you just try to say.

He's a college kid. You're going to drag up ancient history to make your point, then you don't have a point worth making.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> ...



Exactly. Protect until birth, but then fuck you and yours, you slut. Good luck with that 'survival' shit you were hoping for.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



I'm sorry. But if you're going to keep making sense, we're going to have to declare you a Democrat.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Hey, by the way; once you overturn Roe v Wade, all y'all are going to be responsible for every death and maiming that happens after that.

Sucks to be you.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > tinydancer said:
> ...



Yes. They do. DO try to get up to speed.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Gracie said:
> ...



^^Complete fabrication (i.e., LIE)

There are no comprehensive numbers on abortion, so we don't know who is getting them, in what trimester.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



Ah, the compound lie that is all the baby killers have...

Abortion prevents child abuse so people who don't support abortion must support child abuse.

What utter garbage. *F* for irrelevance, dishonesty, and crap logic.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

Remember, all these pro abortionists want non physician abortion legalized. They don't give a damn about the life of the child, nor for the woman's.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > YoungRepublican said:
> ...



Yup.

Facts on Induced Abortion Worldwide

Lots of information out there, MOST of which flies in the face of the pro-lifers lies and "statistics."


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

BTW, flooding is against the rules.

Looks like boop's on a bender. Batten down the hatches, she's gonna blow.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Funny, we pro-lifers don't justify murder with statistics.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> The ones who are in favor of the state forcing women to give birth to unwanted babies are also dead set against helping the poor out of poverty.
> 
> In other treads, they want the worst to happen to the children of the poor. They don't want to get decent food at school, they don't want Head Start funded, they don't want the poor to have a bed to sleep in and food to eat.
> 
> ...



Hallelujah, and amen.

And Intense, my point stands. You can hate it, you can disagree with it, you can believe I'm wrong until the cows come home. But you know not a single woman going through an unwanted pregnancy, and you don't get to decide for a complete random stranger how she should live her life.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

Smilodonfatalis said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Smilodonfatalis said:
> ...



I pos-repped her to make up for your neg.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 19, 2013)

Intense said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Birth control and education, people. That's all it takes.
> ...



Bullshit. PROVEN FACT: the only thing that slows down abortion is birth control and education.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



It's made up numbers:

"States are not required to submit abortion data to the CDC."

http://www.guttmacher.org/statecenter/spibs/spib_ARR.pdf


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Or self restraint.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



No, that has never been proven.

If it was true, there would have been a decline in abortion the minute free contraceptives and sex ed were available.

That didn't happen. Abortions skyrocketed.

They didn't start to decline until the 90s, on the heels of revised education that again stressed the value of abstinence, in the wake of the AIDS epidemic.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 19, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > The ones who are in favor of the state forcing women to give birth to unwanted babies are also dead set against helping the poor out of poverty.
> ...



You can prop your point up with sticks if you want to, doesn't make it right. My grandmother had to console women while working at UGA who were traumatized by having an abortion. She's heard horror stories that I don't think you'd care to hear. It's quite odd, you don't care for "complete strangers" dictating how a woman should live her life, yet you vote for a government who does just that... to everyone. And they happen to be complete strangers. You want government to make abortion legal, yet protest it's intrusion into your sex life. Funny how you folks always want it both ways.


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> Remember, all these pro abortionists want non physician abortion legalized. They don't give a damn about the life of the child, nor for the woman's.



Conservatives don't give a damn about the woman either, short of punishing her for having sex.


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



Having sex is natural, and people have the natural urge to have sex. Why deny something that is natural just because you might get pregnant?


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > Remember, all these pro abortionists want non physician abortion legalized. They don't give a damn about the life of the child, nor for the woman's.
> ...



Exactly. Do you know how many times it has been pointed out that birth control and education are the cheapest, easiest way to end abortion, and nobody will address that fact?

Because you are right. It's not about stopping abortion, it's about controlling women.


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



I've noticed it's the people who aren't getting laid who are the most bitter about those who are.


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > I don't understand how abortion is still an issue. It was decided forty years ago, people need to get with the times. Here is the deal with abortions though. Let's just say me and my girlfriend are fornicating and the condom breaks. My swimmers go on up and do what they are supposed to do. Now she is pregnant. So now, I need to leave school, ruining my career and passion for good. She needs to find a few jobs to be able to pay for diapers, medicine, cribs, etc. and now her life is ruined as well. Now, our child is born into two unprepared parents who can barely afford the bills, let alone all of the things that they need. This is a good example, imagine those in the community who are already poor? You are taking away their chance at life for some moral code that was reasoned silly in the 1970's. This isn't murder, or anything close to it. Do you really think that the Supreme Court would say, "ya know what, lets take the most awful law in the land at make it legal, as long as their only killing children", and then in the next forty years, with conservative SC, and Presidents, this law is never overturned. Well, that's because they only let people with actual educations and intelligence in these positions of power.
> ...



No it is our business and we failed this child. This young girl. 

We should have been there to have offered prevention. Made sure she had prevention.

Now the poor baby will carry this burden of killing her child forever.


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...




Being the hard core feminist that I am and yes a conservative I don't get the controlling women mantra.

Truly. I'm balls to the walls and I would never ever link up with any group that mocked, derided or put down women. 

It just not in my dna. And think of who would accept me?  Conservatives have. 

Not libs. They hate me over at DU.


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...



Note to self:

rep BD for this one when you get your rep back


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## JoeB131 (Oct 20, 2013)

Gracie said:


> So, just for curiosities sake....has anyone had a change of heart about abortion? Step right up and state if you have been swayed the opposite of your original thoughts about it. I'll wait.



As a matter of fact, I did.  I was brought up Catholic and got the full 12 years of anti-Abortion indoctrination where the nuns would show us pictures of fetuses and tell us how horrible it was.   Keep in mind, this was right around the time that the SCOTUS decided _Roe v. Wade _and the Church was just beside itself with anger.  

And even though I stopped being Catholic or believing in Sky Pixies in the 1980's, I still believed that Abortion was wrong for all the things that folks say about them feeling pain.  

So what changed my mind? 

The first was the realization that pro-Lifers are the ultimate useful idiots.  They've been ranting about this for, what, 40 years now, throwing their support behind Republicans, and what do they have to show for it?  I mean besides a busted middle class that the "Reagan Democrats" got for their trouble.   The rich got Right to work, Free trade, deregulation of industries, union busting.  And those working class christians still had to tolerate their womenfolk going down to the abortion clinic.  

The people who run the GOP have nothing but contempt for the "Christian Right".  Look how fast they torpedoed guys like Santorum and Huckabee.  Useful Idiots, that's what you are. 

The second was the realization laws banning abortion don't work.  They didn't work in this country before _Roe_ was decided. (Most abortions were quietly performed not in back alleys, but in doctor's offices because the doctors were ignoring the law.) They don't work in countries like the Philippines, where it's illegal, but they have more abortions per capita than we have. 

The final straw was the realization that most pro-lifers don't care about children or people in general.  Given their druthers, they'd cut medicaid, food stamps, welfare, or anything else to help those kids when they are NOT in Fetus form. 

The thing is, fixing the country's real problems won't happen until we get these idiots to stop voting against their own economic interests and ironically, causing a lot of the abortions they hate.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



I continue to be amazed that people don't know the Hyde Amendment has made it illegal to use federal money for abortion for something like 30 years.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 20, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



You're the one who wants it both ways.

First you say that woman don't care, that they use abortion indiscriminately, but here you say that woman are traumatized by abortion.

Abortion is devastating and no one is in favor of it. 

That does not mean women should not be in charge of their own bodies and that safe and legal abortion should be readily available.

You're WRONG when you right "... you want government to make abortion legal ...". 

Abortion IS legal and it should stay that way.


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## koshergrl (Oct 20, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



That doesn't stop them. PP continues to receive federal funding.


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Here is some education

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXZCOaRVrbg]Abortion Provider Speaks - YouTube[/ame]


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Intense said:
> ...



*No.*

My point stands.

Birth control and education.

Period.


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Watch it. I dare you. In fact, I double dare you


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop doesn't want education, she just wants rhetoric


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh, dear. A dare, and on the Internet of all places.


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Oh, dear. A dare, and on the Internet of all places.



Are you gonna take my challenge, or just stay on your full line of bullshit, that you have been fed and are now regurgitating on the forum?


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Birth control and education is rhetoric?

No. It's not.

But just out of curiosity - why are you so invested in me watching this video?


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

Let's make this real.

Here is the one I didn't abort/


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Let's make this real.
> 
> Here is the one my daughter didn't abort.



The anti lifers do not want "real" They want to stay in their fantasy world 

What a lovely girl TD


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

Now lets take it to real. My husband #2 at the time we didn't need another child. 

Danielle was not an option. I couldn't do it. I had everything at my disposal. Last thing I wanted was to be burdened down with a baby in my belly as a rocker.

I could have aborted  her. 

I decided not to. And look pray tell who I have? Is she gorgeous? Is she mine? Am I blessed?


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

Whoopsies that's Danielle. My daughter. 

Wait till you see Trinity.


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

I never thought about it before. 

That chin..............


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

I find it a sad irony. That BDBoop has a sigline supporting breast cancer awareness and yet ignore the facts on abortion and breast cancer.

The ABC Link


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Now lets take it to real. My husband #2 at the time we didn't need another child.
> 
> Danielle was not an option. I couldn't do it. I had everything at my disposal. Last thing I wanted was to be burdened down with a baby in my belly as a rocker.
> 
> ...



You are blessed and she IS gorgeous.

The vile unleashing of proaborts on the prolifers is usually because of their envy, IMHO - deep inside they know they are wrong, but they lack courage to admit it. and then there are those who hide their doubts and regret behind the anger and hate.
It is a typical reaction formation mechanism of defense.


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## Immanuel (Oct 20, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



The government finds its way around supporting abortion.  Funding of Planned Parenthood is only one example.  The government gives to other programs which opens up other donated funding for abortion.  If the government cut funding to PP, less money would be available for the destruction of human life.

Immie


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Birth control and education is rhetoric?
> 
> No. It's not.
> 
> But just out of curiosity - why are you so invested in me watching this video?



Because you are spewing the rhetoric of "more education". That is a cop out.  If you actually want to push your side and "educate", You need to look at the other side.

The video is about the abortion industry. It features a former owner of 4 abortion clinics.

I have volunteered my time to help those who are actually looking for answers, not band aids.
But I do know Carol Everette.Her story is amazing.

As a pro-lifer. I am invested in life.


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> I find it a sad irony. That BDBoop has a sigline supporting breast cancer awareness and yet ignore the facts on abortion and breast cancer.
> 
> The ABC Link



there is even more sad irony. check this thread:
http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-rubber-room/313496-jesus-real-face-pictorial.html

there are more quite thoughtful posts in the religion section of the forum.
That simply does not make any sense.
She knows a baby IS a gift from God. Yet is so rabidly pro-murder it is simply inconceivable.


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## tinydancer (Oct 20, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Let's make this real.
> ...



Hey thanks sweetie.

She's a doll.  I love her to death.


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## PixieStix (Oct 20, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> I look at her. Shes such an idiot. I love her to death.
> 
> I am so glad I didnt take the "option"/



Most women who have had abortions, may not even be "pro choice", but feel that they had no "choice". Sad irony.

The pro aborts, expects us to be intellectually dishonest and accept their "choice" mantra.


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> I look at her. Shes such an idiot. I love her to death.
> 
> I am so glad I didnt take the "option"/



I bet you are


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## thanatos144 (Oct 20, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > I look at her. Shes such an idiot. I love her to death.
> ...



Isn't that what they tell girls now?  Why get saddled with a baby because you had sex? Just kill it!  Just sick if you ask me. The only choice they support leads to killing a innocent baby


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > tinydancer said:
> ...



That is exactly what they promote.
therefore that insane defense - aaaaaa, you want me not to have sex!!!! - ridiculous and transparent give away of the mindset of those itchy vaginas.


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 20, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > tinydancer said:
> ...



The password is "punished".

Our dear leader.  

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpWOYWIWVcg]Obama would not want his daughter "punished with a baby" - YouTube[/ame]

Yes, it is literally how they think.  Warped.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 20, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



The real punishment is having to listen to them debase women as nothing more then a vagina to plunder


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

> The abortion&#8211;breast cancer hypothesis posits that induced abortion increases the risk of developing breast cancer.[1] In early pregnancy, levels of estrogen increase, leading to breast growth in preparation for lactation. The hypothesis proposes that if this process is interrupted by an abortion&#8212;before full maturity in the third trimester&#8212;then more relatively vulnerable immature cells could be left than there were prior to the pregnancy, resulting in a greater potential risk of breast cancer over time. This mechanism was first proposed and explored in rat studies conducted in the 1980s.[2][3][4]
> *The abortion&#8211;breast cancer hypothesis has been the subject of extensive scientific inquiry, and the scientific community has concluded that abortion does not cause breast cancer. This consensus is supported by major medical bodies,[5] including the World Health Organization,[6] the U.S. National Cancer Institute,[7][8] the American Cancer Society,[9] the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists,[10] and the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists.[11]*



Nothing ironic to see here, kids. No connection. I am perfectly free to be pro-choice AND a supporter of finding a cure.

Also, I'd post a lovely picture of my daughter and her three kids, but she'd be pissed if she thought she was being used to insinuate her beauty meant women should lose the right to choose.


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Let's make this real.
> 
> Here is the one I didn't abort/



Who gives a shit?


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

Can someone please answer my question that is yet to be answered?

If a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, should she refrain from ever having sex, even if it meant never having sex with her husband?


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Study: Free Birth Control Slashes Abortion Rates | TIME.com

Showing pictures of dead babies doesn't change anything.

Live ones, either.

All the vidoes you can muster won't stop a woman who is determined to terminate. 

As I have stated repeatedly, and will continue to state, no matter who melts in their Cheerios? Education and birth control will lower abortion rates.  That's all. That's it. 

Do you see anybody in these threads changing their minds? No? No. You don't. Why is that, do you think? Oh, maybe because we are all adults who have been fighting this issue for years, and there's nothing new under the sun.

Women have had abortions since the beginning of time. Always have. Always will. All Roe v Wade did was make it legal in all the states where it was not already legal.

So as much as nobody is impressed with Kermit - he would be the end result of you all managing an overturn.

Which, of course won't be happening, and you should be grateful it won't be happening, since all the attendant deaths and maimings would then be the blood on your hands.


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## koshergrl (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Let's make this real.
> ...



Exactly.

We give a shit.

You don't.

Thanks for illustrating the point so succinctly.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Can someone please answer my question that is yet to be answered?
> 
> If a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, should she refrain from ever having sex, even if it meant never having sex with her husband?



If she refused to be responsible before having sex and viewed abortion as a form of birth control she should take a step back and review.

We get it.
You love abortions and hate families.

In your own words, "who gives a shit"!
I don't care how many abortions you have.
I don't care who you fuck.
I don't care if you are responsible or not.

I do care when you start demanding that I pay for your shagging around, your johnnies, your pill, your abortions or your bastards.

Get it?
Live your life.
Let me live mine, keep your promiscuous behavior out of my personal finances.
That work for you?


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## koshergrl (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Can someone please answer my question that is yet to be answered?
> 
> If a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, should she refrain from ever having sex, even if it meant never having sex with her husband?



Nobody is going to address the question because it's a retarded question. It's irrelevant, and the *wtf are you talking about* factor is off the scale.

Stick to the fucking subject or take your toys and go home. If you can't make your point without asking completely senseless questions, then you don't have a point to make.


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Can someone please answer my question that is yet to be answered?
> 
> If a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, should she refrain from ever having sex, even if it meant never having sex with her husband?



Apparently, yes.

Sucks to be him.

Know what else? Republican women have abortions.

Christian women have abortions.

Common denominator there is pregnancy.

Common denominator here is a whole lot of people operating in a vacuum. Thinking more about the 'precious cargo' than the woman they would force to term - by what means, one wonders?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Study: Free Birth Control Slashes Abortion Rates | TIME.com
> 
> Showing pictures of dead babies doesn't change anything.
> 
> ...



Like I always said.
Keep your promiscuous behaviour( fucking around, birth control , condoms, abortion and bastards) out of my wallet!
It's your promiscuity, you pay for it.


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## koshergrl (Oct 20, 2013)

Also completely irrelevant. I see we've launched into drunken lalala land.

Next will come the lies that abortion prevents child abuse, and abortions are *healthy* for women.


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Like I always said.
> Keep your promiscuous behaviour( fucking around, birth control , condoms, abortion and bastards) out of my wallet!
> It's your promiscuity, you pay for it.



So women who have abortions are sluts?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Can someone please answer my question that is yet to be answered?
> ...



Why is it an irrelevant question? And why do you refuse to answer it?

Should a woman never have sex if she would have an abortion if she became pregnant? It requires a yes or a no answer.

I assume you refuse to answer because your answer would be no, she shouldn't have sex, which would mean that you want women punished for having sex.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Like I always said.
> ...



Did I say that, you dozy cow?

If you want to have your fat ugly ass tapped by multiple partners, why should I pick up the tab?
You can't answer that?
Your life, your choice, your responsibility.


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



You said: "Keep your promiscuous behavior out of my wallet' - a woman who has sex once in her life could get pregnant, so if she has an abortion, you obviously believe she's a slut.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...


No.
Should everyone else be punished because some fat, ugly douchebag likes to get fucked by multiple partners?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...


No, I believe it's nothing to do with me, unless I'm the dope who knocked her up.
Why should I pay?


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## BDBoop (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Surely I am not the only one here who knows there was a time women were told they need to make it clear to their husbands "No more sex. Another pregnancy will kill me."

Surely not.


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Just to ensure I have the right answer - a woman, who married, and would abort if she became pregnant, should not have sex with her husband?


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



Would you prefer to pay her welfare check, and the welfare for her children?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



That's between you and your violent abusive partner.
You chose him!!


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## Noomi (Oct 20, 2013)

Who said anything about an abusive partner?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



None.
Not my responsibility.
Hers and his.
Up to them.
They fuck, it's all them!!
They choose to be irresponsible? It's all them!!
If they choose abortion, great!
If they don't, great!
Where am I at fault in any of this?
Why should I pay?


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Who said anything about an abusive partner?



Ok, I bow to your superior knowledge!!
There is no such thing as an abusive partner!!


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Told ya.

Oh look, another completely  irrelevant question, meant to imply the lie that abortion somehow reduces welfare.

So we have fewer women on welfare now, and we're supporting fewer children on welfare now, than we were before legalized abortion, right?

Oh snap...guess not. Whoops. Just another dishonest diversion attempt.


----------



## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> > The abortionbreast cancer hypothesis posits that induced abortion increases the risk of developing breast cancer.[1] In early pregnancy, l[
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Except Wikipedia article is a LIE. There is a direct connection.

there IS a connection between cancer and induced abortion and numerous Chinese studies, where abortion is an everyday reality because of one-child policy and the sample of women can be much bigger ( and therefore the study - much reliable) than any American or European combined.

*Chinese Study: Women With a Previous Induced Abortion Had a Significant Increased Risk of Breast Cancer*

The Coalition on Abortion/Breast Cancer notes that a Chinese study consisting of *1,351 subjects published in the Asian Pacific Journal of Cancer Prevention in February, 2012 reported a very statistically significant increased risk of breast cancer for women with previous induced abortions (IAs) in comparison with women without previous IAs. *[1]Researchers led by Ai-Ren Jiang reported a statistically significant 1.52-fold elevation in risk for women with IAs and a significant dose-response relationship between (the risk) for breast cancer and number of (IAs), meaning that risk climbed with number of IAs.

For premenopausal women with IAs, the numbers were relatively small, and the observed 16% risk elevation was not statistically significant. However, for those with three or more IAs, the risk climbed to a statistically significant 1.55-fold elevation.

By contrast, postmenopausal women with IAs experienced a statistically significant 1.82-fold elevation in risk, compared to those with no IAs. Risk climbed with number of IAs from a statistically significant 1.79-fold increased risk for one IA and a statistically significant 1.85-fold elevation for two IAs, to a non-statistically significant 2.14-fold elevated risk for three or more IAs.

*A Chinese study in 1995 by L. Bu and colleagues, including Janet Daling of the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, reported a statistically significant 4.5-fold elevated risk among women with IAs who developed breast cancer at or before age 35, compared to older women (who experienced a statistically significant 2.5-fold elevated risk). 

Four of seven Chinese studies report statistically significant risk increases for women with IAs.Fifty-three of sixty-nineepidemiological studies dating from 1957 report risk elevations for women with previous IAs. Biological and experimental research supports an abortion-breast cancer link.* 

References:

    Jiang AR, Gao CM, Ding JH, Li SP, Liu YT, Cao HX, Wu JZ, Tang JH, Qian Y, Tajima K. Abortions and breast cancer risk in premenopausal and postmenopausal women in Jiangsu Province of China. Asian Pacific J Cancer Prev 2012;13:33-35. Available at: <http://www.apjcpcontrol.org/page/popup_paper_file_view.php?pno=MzMtMzUgMTIuMiZrY29kZT0yNzAxJmZubz0w&pgubun=i>.
    Bu L, Voigt L, Yu Z, Malone K, Daling J. Risk of breast cancer associated with induced abortion in a population at low risk of breast cancer. Am J Epidemiol 1995;141:S85. (abstract).
    Ye Z, Gao DL, Qin Q, Ray RM, Thomas DB. Breast cancer in relation to induced abortions in a cohort of Chinese women. Br J Cancer 2002;87:977-981.
    Sanderson M, Shu X-O, Jin F, Dai Q, Wen W, Hua Y, Gao Y-T, Zheng W. Abortion history and breast cancer risk: results from the Shanghai breast cancer study. Int J Cancer 2001;92:899-905.

For a list of 68 of those epidemiological studies, see: <http://bcpinstitute.org/epidemiology_studies_bcpi.htm>. One study excluded from this list was: Carroll, P. The breast cancer epidemic: modeling and forecasts based on abortion and other risk factors." J Am Phys Surg Vol. 12, No. 3 (Fall 2007) 72-78.  Available at: <http://www.jpands.org/vol12no3/carroll.pdf


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

So to paraphrase the liberals.
Some people are immoral and irresponsible.
They need to be rewarded.

The good, responsible people should be subjected to punitive taxation to raise funds to reward the immoral and irresponsible.

The good are bad and the bad are good!!
Liberal logic, brilliant!!


----------



## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Vox said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > > The abortionbreast cancer hypothesis posits that induced abortion increases the risk of developing breast cancer.[1] In early pregnancy, l[
> ...



A karmic quality so to speak.........


----------



## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...


*
a karmic quality is even bigger - women who have had abortions are on a very high risk for suicide and depression when compared to those who did not.*


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

and nobody to my knowledge has studied the connection between induced abortion and endometrial cancer or induced abortion and ovarian cancer. or maybe they did, let me check 

This is easily explained by pure physiology - pregnancy is a natural state of increased levels of different hormones and sudden interruption of the slowly built remake of the bodily function is an extreme stress to the whole endocrinological system of the body - and some aspects of the system never recover form that.


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

There is an increased risk of ovarian cancer after induced abortions:

Reproductive factors in relation to ovarian cancer: a case?control study in Northern Vietnam

The risk of ovarian cancer was significantly lower in parous women than nulliparous women. Use of an intrauterine contraceptive device was also associated with a reduced risk. *In contrast, induced abortion, late menopause and years of ovulation were significantly associated with an increased risk of cancer.*

oh, one more study proving a direct connection between abortions and breast cancer - a French one:
http://www.biomedcentral.com/content/pdf/bcr3218.pdf
plus this particular study shows that there is a significant risk increase of breast cancer connected to the age the woman had abortion - the younger the age - the higher the risk.


*and having children and breastfeeding them lowers the risk for all three GYN cancers - breast, endometrial and ovarian.*


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



It does not. But it is a perfect give away of all those followers of eugenics - they consider only the "low classes" will murder their babies and that this is their population control method for the poverty.
Eugenics of Sanger ( poor and disadvantaged have to be controlled)- their prophet though she, personally, objected to murder of the innocent and knew perfectly well how detrimental to the woman abortion is.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 20, 2013)

Vox said:


> and nobody to my knowledge has studied the connection between induced abortion and endometrial cancer or induced abortion and ovarian cancer. or maybe they did, let me check
> 
> This is easily explained by pure physiology - pregnancy is a natural state of increased levels of different hormones and sudden interruption of the slowly built remake of the bodily function is an extreme stress to the whole endocrinological system of the body - and some aspects of the system never recover form that.



Interesting.
Like how I was issued and ordered to ingest naiads to protect against nerve agents on some deployments.
Now I suffer all manner of tendon issues in one foot and both legs?

You fuck with the natural order of things, nature bites back.
I see it, it is logical!


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Like I always said.
> ...



For social conservatives, in essence, yes. 

They dont have the courage to admit it, of course, but most on the social right believe that a woman should have sex only in the context of marriage, and with the intent of having a child. 

A woman who engages in recreational sex with someone not her husband is immoral and irresponsible, with abortion the manifestation of that immorality. 

And as authoritarians conservatives fear individual liberty and dissent, they seek to codify their morality, to compel others to abide by their subjective religious beliefs. Hence the demagogic references to murder, infanticide, and baby killing.


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## Vox (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > and nobody to my knowledge has studied the connection between induced abortion and endometrial cancer or induced abortion and ovarian cancer. or maybe they did, let me check
> ...



yep. that exactly as it is.

and since the murder of the innocent babies is the worst crime against natural order of things - it is actually punished the most - in all possible directions. 
By mother nature - and that is GOOD.

Murder SHOULD be punished.


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## koshergrl (Oct 20, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



^^^^senseless drivel.


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## Esmeralda (Oct 20, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...


Of course there is an easy solution to all of this, one proposed nearly three hundred years ago and not taken seriously.  Now is the time to take it seriously. It will solve the problem of poor women having too many children they cannot support, of children not being cared for and turning to crime to survive, of poor fathers turning to crime to support their children (or simply running out on them),& of welfare for the poor (especially single mothers).  Jonathan Swift - A Modest Proposal  &#8221;I have been assured by a very knowing American of my acquaintance in London, that a young healthy child well nursed is at a year old a most delicious, nourishing, and wholesome food, whether stewed, roasted, baked, or boiled ...&#8221;

"Progress, far from consisting in change, depends on retentiveness. When change is absolute there remains no being to improve and no direction is set for possible improvement: and when experience is not retained, as among savages, infancy is perpetual. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."  George Santayana


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Oh look, more insane spouting.


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## Noomi (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Answer the question.


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## Noomi (Oct 21, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Who said anything about an abusive partner?
> ...



I never said that, did I?


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## BDBoop (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



She can't.

It's an actual character defect. 

S'tragic, really.

I would bet anybody $20 that she can't answer a simple, honest question with a simple honest answer, sans insults, cheap shots, and lies.


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## Noomi (Oct 21, 2013)

It was an easy question with an easy answer, and people like KG can't answer it because it exposes their true beliefs - that women who have sex and get pregnant should be punished for having sex.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> It's never been about helping women. It's all about making it legal to kill certain populations.



Sure does feel that way....








Of course Margaret Sanger was a believer in eugenics, so it is no surprise.


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## Noomi (Oct 21, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > It's never been about helping women. It's all about making it legal to kill certain populations.
> ...



Abortion doesn't kill people.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 21, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you that its not an "equitable system" but its almost always the woman who gets stuck with 100% of the responsibility for raising the child the man refused to support.
> ...



The radical left believes in the gov't regulating everything but this....

Yet Planned Parenthood and the reactionary left is on the minority side of
how the majority feel about abortion
-majority of Americans do not believe in abortion with no restrictions
-majority do not support late term abortions

The radical left did not even support California from charging Scott Peterson, who killed his
pregnant wife, with the murder of his child.

Sadly, for the Democrats, they allow only the politician with the most extreme views on this
subject, act as their spokesperson - pitting them against the majority of Americans

For example

Papa Obama, as a state senator, fought a law that would have protected live infants accidentally delivered during an abortion. 
Senator Barbara Boxer once said that constitutional rights begin when you bring the baby home from the hospital.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...




tell that to Kermit Gosnell


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## JoeB131 (Oct 21, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



No, what killed people there was Gosnell's incompetence.  

96,000 Americans die every year due to medical malpractice.  

Gosnell just had the bad luck to be incompetent in a medical practice religious loons hate.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Like I always said.
> ...



You are all women?


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



What a fucking lie


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Over 40 million people dead from abortion people not just cells people


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Plus there are the women and girls who die from abortions...that the left studiously ignores and pretends don't exist.

Because they're all about female *empowerment* and *health*.

Scum.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



there is no question. there is an idiotic assumption that the only birth control method is abortion, which you think is, but that is not the reality - after you learn the reality, you may start asking coherent questions, which might be answered.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



a question which pertains that abortion is the only birth control method and the only solution of pregnancy is an honest question?
in a leftard ignorant brainwashed mind, probably.
But not in the reality.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

But really it's easy.

If a woman believes she has no option to pregnancy but abortion, and she's married, then yeah, she can abstain. If you're in such dire straits that you feel compelled to kill any babies you might conceive, then you have more important things to think of than getting laid.

Lefties think the first and foremost duty of a woman is to provide completely, guaranteed, 100 percent consequence-free sex to whomever. It's a sick dynamic. They maintain that power is sex, and if a woman can't be taken advantage of without eliminating all the risk, then she has no worth at all.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> But really it's easy.
> 
> If a woman believes she has no option to pregnancy but abortion, and she's married, then yeah, she can abstain. If you're in such dire straits that you feel compelled to kill any babies you might conceive, then you have more important things to think of than getting laid.
> 
> Lefties think the first and foremost duty of a woman is to provide completely, guaranteed, 100 percent consequence-free sex to whomever. It's a sick dynamic. They maintain that power is sex, and if a woman can't be taken advantage of without eliminating all the risk, then she has no worth at all.



it is just a false premise whatsoever.

woman can get 100% pregnancy-free sex if she wants to - tons of options available. And who cares how she does it as long as the stupid bitch does not use abortion as a birth control method.

*Abortion is not about having sex, it is about murdering innocent children.*


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > But really it's easy.
> ...



100% pregnancy free sex? Like Anal? 
Because it would be weird if a doctor said that about birth control.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



go buy a cheap brochure about sex and educate yourself. or search google for that matter.

your dire need to get laid is all too obvious.

*abortion is not about having sex - it is about murdering innocent children.*


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I thought I was a slut? If I was a slut wouldn't that mean I was getting laid all the time? Shit, make up your mind.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

And if I google, won't it tell me that any form of birth control is not 100%?


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

I prefer skank.

A slut is someone who just sleeps with whomever.

A skank sleeps around and likes to advertise it, generally using the most rude and offensive language and behavior conceivable.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> And if I google, won't it tell me that any form of birth control is not 100%?


 
Abstinence.

I'm not surprised it doesn't spring immediately to your mind.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Plus I am pretty sure when my doctor put me on birth control he told me it wasn't 100% effective. 
So it's weird a doctor would say that. Do you know about a birth control that is? That my OBGYN hasn't heard about it?


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> And if I google, won't it tell me that any form of birth control is not 100%?



moron, we are not talking about birth control methods we are talking about sex methods.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > And if I google, won't it tell me that any form of birth control is not 100%?
> ...



she is changing the subject, as usually leftard liars do.

there are tons of ways a woman can have sex and not even involve birth control - and she is pretending she has never heard of it.

or, maybe, she did not - that is why she is so angry always


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > And if I google, won't it tell me that any form of birth control is not 100%?
> ...



Read what the doctor wrote, KG. He said 100% pregnancy free SEX. Last time I checked abstinence meant not having sex. 
I asked if the doctor meant Anal, but the doctor didn't answer.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



you are a slut - you are advertising murder as a method of birth control.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...


 
But what you said was 100 percent effective birth control.

Last I checked, the #1 purpose of sex is to create offspring.
I mean, that's why animals do it. That's the biological purpose of the activity in our species.

It is not necessary for maintaining life... 
So why do you maintain that people should never abstain? Did someone tell you that you have no other purpose in life except to spread your legs for people you don't want to have children with, and who don't want children with you?


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I am? I had no idea stating I am pro choice was an advertisement for abortion. I thought it just meant I was Pro Choice.
I am learning all kinds of stuff today. There is birth control that is 100% effective, you don't have sex while having an abortion, and that even if you aren't having sex you are still a slut. 
This all too much.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

No, your pro choice stance doesn't make you a slut.

Your online litany of sexual activity does.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



It is  too early for you to not make any sense at all.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

But your apparent belief that women are incapable of resisting their own sexual urges, and your obvious belief that no woman should ever say no to a man, combined with your stated belief that it's okay to kill the offspring of these unions, leaves one with the impression that you probably are slutty, if *no* is so seldom an option.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Too early for you, Luissa. Logic isn't your forte.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> No, your pro choice stance doesn't make you a slut.
> 
> Your online litany of sexual activity does.



You mean what you made up in your head? Yeah! Sorry, your delusions don't count.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 21, 2013)

vox 





> ...woman can get 100% pregnancy-free sex if she wants to...



If you know of a 100% guaranteed form of birth control, you need to share that with the world. 

Last I knew, there was no such thing. 

When you grow up and actually have sex, you will learn that no form of birth control is 100% "pregnancy free".


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> But your apparent belief that women are incapable of resisting their own sexual urges, and your obvious belief that no woman should ever say no to a man, combined with your stated belief that it's okay to kill the offspring of these unions, leaves one with the impression that you probably are slutty, if *no* is so seldom an option.



You got all that from me stating birth control is not 100% effective? 
I guess 2+2=1000


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## BDBoop (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



She must have had Really Bad sex for her to never want to have it again, and nobody else should, either.

I can't even imagine sex that was that horrific.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Don't feel bad.

I asked for men to say they would not mind if the state took control of their reproduction and not one has answered. 

Surprised?

Me neither.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



I didn't change the subject. A doctor would realize that. 

And just wait, KG is going to explain women shouldn't be doing what you speak of. Sex is for procreation, not pleasure. Come on, Vox. You are a doctor.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 21, 2013)

Is someone saying that there is a doctor in this thread?


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 21, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



YOU have not paid for abortion.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 21, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



The state does control men's reproductive rights.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 21, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Yes I have, liar.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Point flew right over your head.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



No it didn't.
Perhaps you should re read it.


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## Steven_R (Oct 21, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



I'd go so far as to argue the state has more control over a man's reproductive rights than a woman's just based on the fact that if a woman wants to opt out of a baby, she can get scrapped and hoover away the burden, but if a man wants to opt out of a baby, tough shit. Pay support or enjoy prison.


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 21, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



Who's?


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## Luddly Neddite (Oct 21, 2013)

Steven_R said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...



Post the law that forces you to reproduce.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Our point exactly!!

There is no "you must have sex or else" law!


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...


 

We all pay for Planned Parenthood. They are federally subsidized.


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## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Can someone please answer my question that is yet to be answered?
> 
> If a woman would have an abortion if she became pregnant, should she refrain from ever having sex, even if it meant never having sex with her husband?



Wifey can get a tubal ligation, or hubby can get fixed. I thought you people were all educated and stuff on all this "reproductive health" and shit


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## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Pick your poison.


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## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



That is what they refer to as PAS. But watch as the anti lifers deny this. Why they hate women I will never understand. Their claim that they care about a woman's health is a lie, that has continued since Doe v. Bolton

The anti lifers will either ignore the following or call it a lie. They are calling millions of women liars when they do this

Symptoms of Post Abortion Stress

    Guilt
    Numbness
    Emotionally cold and unresponsive
    Anxiety
    Depression
    Suicidal impulses
    Alcohol and/or drug use
    Nightmares
    Eating disorders
    Anxiety over fertility and childbearing issues
    Loss of interest in sex OR promiscuity
    Avoidance of baby reminders (like baby showers, baby stores, etc.)
    Control issues
    Over-protection of living children
    Pre-occupation with becoming pregnant again
    Strained relationship with living children even abuse
    Resentment toward those who were involved in the abortion decision
    "Anniversary" syndrome--an increase in symptoms around the time of the anniversary of the abortion or due date of the child


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



Thank god you guys are around to tell women how they feel after having an abortion.


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## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I didn't tell them, they old me, and thousands of others who are there for them after the fact. They are seeking help and you guys are clueless. So freaking sad


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



They told you? 
What is sad, is someone who pretends to know how someone else feels. 
I will give you a clue. None of you understand what it's like to make that decision or what it feels like afterwards. So please don't post some list that you probably got off some website explaining how SOMEONE ELSE feels after having an abortion. If you didn't have an abortion, don't lecture me or others on how one might feel or why the chose to have an abortion,


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

How do you know "none of you" knows?

What is with the presumption that you're the only person who "knows" what it feels like?

My primary objection to abortion, aside from the flagrant human rights violations it represents, is that it feeds on an ignorant, vulnerable, mislead and abused population of women and girls.

Girls like you, who believe everything they're told by this machine that COUNTS on your stupidity, that COUNTS on your victimization, that COUNTS on coercion, and DISMISSES the risk that abortion represents, are the ones who suffer the most. Their bodies suffer, their souls suffer and their minds suffer, because they are told that they are nothing but sexual creatures, and that it is a sign of their *STRENGTH* that they be allowed to put themselves at risk for the sake of sexual urges that they are convinced is their RIGHT to be subjected to/succumb to.

It's disgusting. You support the monster that most demeans you, and best protects the ones who do the worst damage to your sex, and pose the greatest threat to women in general.


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## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



I don't need to pretend. I have a real life and reach out to real people. 

How do you know that none of us know what it feels like? You know what they say about assumption.


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## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> How do you know "none of you" knows?
> 
> What is with the presumption that you're the only person who "knows" what it feels like?
> 
> ...



With the  guilt that the woman carries brought on by her abortion.. Also carries into her actions to her future family. .

Not only that, but she will feel she does not deserve any help with her issues, because she "chose" to have an abortion. In her mind with all the pro abortion rhetoric, she feels she has no right to get any help for her psychological issues.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> vox
> 
> 
> 
> ...



don't LIE.

I am not talking about birth control


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> How do you know "none of you" knows?
> 
> What is with the presumption that you're the only person who "knows" what it feels like?
> 
> ...



So you and Pixie have had an abortion? 
If so I would hope you would dial down the judgments towards Boop.. Or maybe call out Vox.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > vox
> ...



Sure you weren't, doctor.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



*you did change a subject.

a sex method is not a birth control method.

you, leftards, are supposedly so sophisticated and empowered and liberated when it comes to sex but when it comes to the subject you all blink innocently as if you never have heard that there are sex methods not involving pregnancy possibility.

I am shocked. 
You are stuck in the XIX century puritan world and that is, probably, why you are so retarded and think abortion is the only birth control method available under the sun to "empower" women 

Seriously, go book a visit to sexology specialist, which might help improve your life

And no, I am not taking bread from my colleague enlightening you online 
*


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I asked if you meant Anal. Why didn't you just say yes? 
Or could you be back tracking now?


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

And I stated abortion is the only form of birth control?


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

*hey, leftard vaginas with vocal cords, so the very reason you are so bitter and angry, and screechy, and hateful and always in a murderous mood towards the innocent babies is that you don't know how to be satisfied without constant scare of getting pregnant?

Poor souls, go get some advice *


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

I also loved how you called the hypothetical woman in your quote a stupid bitch. Are most women stupid bitches to you, Vox?


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



if you want to know - go book a visit to a sexologist


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> I also loved how you called the hypothetical woman in your quote a stupid bitch. Are most women stupid bitches to you, Vox?



no, just the likes of you, who consider abortion to be birth control


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> *hey, leftard vaginas with vocal cords, so the very reason you are so bitter and angry, and screechy, and hateful and always in a murderous mood towards the innocent babies is that you don't know how to be satisfied without constant scare of getting pregnant?
> 
> Poor souls, go get some advice *



A woman cannot be satisfied having anal sex? 
Why don't you explain how a woman can be satisfied. You seem to be the expert, doctor.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > How do you know "none of you" knows?
> ...


 
I don't judge anyone for getting a legal abortion..I pity them.

I judge the morons like you, and Boop, who spend a lot of time and energy promoting the victimization of women, and the murder of children.


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## Luissa (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > I also loved how you called the hypothetical woman in your quote a stupid bitch. Are most women stupid bitches to you, Vox?
> ...



But that isn't how you put it, is it. 
Are all women stupid bitches to you?


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 21, 2013)

I don't get how liberal women can dictate to conservative women one what abortion feels like or that they should capitulate to the "norm."

Funny, I thought all of you had the same pair of ovaries in your pelvic cavity... I must be wrong then. I'll need to consult the nearest anatomist about this. What a revelation!


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



I judge the sheep that have propagated the greatest lie in all of history. They have no idea of the ramifications, or maybe they do.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...


 
Some, certainly.

The ones who sell abortion to their sisters as a rite of passage.


----------



## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Pauli007001 said:
> ...



There is the whole plethora of problems after abortion - both physical and mental.
Denying it is a simple mechanism of defense but it does not mean it works.

The very ones, who are supposedly "liberated" and "empowered" and "elevated" by the availability of abortion anytime, anywhere, at any gestational age and on the taxpayer's tab are the most ignorant on the anatomy, on physiology, on basic pathology, on the very sex that they are supposedly enjoying so much, and the whole life purpose.

how can this happen?
where is the "liberation"?
where is the "empowerment"?
where is the "freedom" as all they can think is a pregnancy scare while having sex - as in the prehistoric era


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

If we're going to go the propaganda route, we can play that.

You guys like the "I had an abortion" advertisement...

I like these:


----------



## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > *hey, leftard vaginas with vocal cords, so the very reason you are so bitter and angry, and screechy, and hateful and always in a murderous mood towards the innocent babies is that you don't know how to be satisfied without constant scare of getting pregnant?
> ...



I already told you, moron - I am not giving medical advices online.
Go visit a sexologist - and pronto


----------



## tinydancer (Oct 21, 2013)

I'd like the chance to talk. To say I had my children probably under the worst conditions but still rocked it. Because it is a baby inside you. 

Now I am a huge rocker. Always have been, but there was no way on the planet I was going to rip a baby out of my belly. It was mine.


----------



## tinydancer (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



My husband will tell you that the way to heal is to name the child you aborted and pray for him or her.


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## tinydancer (Oct 21, 2013)

Those that say that abortion does not hurt the soul well they don't understand this. Haven't been thru it.

I've talked to men who want to sob at what has happened. I dont think any of us understand what has all been happening to all of us.


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## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



There are many ways of healing and the one you describe requires the person to be a believer in God - and that alone will help - finding Our Lord.

However, the healing part can start only if the deed is understood as it is - a murder.
You can not heal if you are in denial.


----------



## Vox (Oct 21, 2013)

tinydancer said:


> Those that say that abortion does not hurt the soul well they don't understand this. Haven't been thru it.
> 
> I've talked to men who want to sob at what has happened. I dont think any of us understand what has all been happening to all of us.



That is partially what I can not understand about those whole "my body/privacy/choice" issue in this country - everywhere else in the world where abortion is legal it is still a shameful,and regrettable option and it is unthinkable to parade it around with pride.
It is also very well known and propagated the risks and complications and inevitable problems connected to it, as the options for avoidance are offered as well - unlike here, in the US. The vast majority of American women ( and men) consider abortion's seriousness to be not more than smoking a cigarette


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

Vox said:


> tinydancer said:
> 
> 
> > Those that say that abortion does not hurt the soul well they don't understand this. Haven't been thru it.
> ...



Shit to them smoking is more dangerous.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

No, not really.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Plus there are the women and girls who die from abortions...that the left studiously ignores and pretends don't exist.
> 
> Because they're all about female *empowerment* and *health*.
> 
> Scum.



abortion is safer than childbirth... 

Abortion Safer for Women Than Childbirth, Study Claims - US News and World Report



> The risk of death associated with a full-term pregnancy and delivery is 8.8 deaths per 100,000, while the risk of death linked to legal abortion is 0.6 deaths per 100,000 women, according to the study. That means a woman carrying a baby to term is 14 times more likely to die than a woman who chooses to have a legal abortion, the study finds.
> 
> "Regardless of one's sentiments about abortion, legal abortion is very safe, and dramatically safer than continuing the pregnancy," said the study's lead author, Dr. David Grimes, a clinical professor in the department of obstetrics and gynecology at the University of North Carolina School of Medicine at Chapel Hill.



Koch-er Girl's response. "This is all a plot by the Porn Industry to keep their stars looking good...or something!!!"


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

That would mean something if we had real numbers.

But we don't. It's all made up stuff, by ghouls who are motivated to exploit women and kill children.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

"
Health care providers are failing to detail abortion complications to the state as required by law, one of many gaps in a surveillance system viewed as crucial to protecting patients, a Tribune review has found.
The state's system for tracking abortions is so broken that regulators also may be missing more than 7,000 of the procedures per year."

And that ^^ was in Illinois alone.

State's abortion records woefully incomplete - Chicago Tribune


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Plus there are the women and girls who die from abortions...that the left studiously ignores and pretends don't exist.
> ...


Only to sick fucks like you who celebrate every baby killed.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

"Induced abortions are often severely underreported in national surveys, hampering the estimation and analysis of unintended pregnancies"

"Underreporting of induced abortions has rendered surveys such as the NSFG virtually unusable for description or analysis of unintended pregnancy and induced abortion, items of key social and policy interest in the United States. "

"only about six in 10 abortions were reported in 1995, so the usefulness of the NSFG for analyses using abortion data remains extremely limited.&#8224;&#8224; "

Measuring the Extent of Abortion Underreporting In the 1995 National Survey of Family Growth


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

"
abortion-related maternal mortality is generally underreported.
One reason for this is that codes in hospitals report
only the presenting cause of death, not the underlying reason
which, for example, in the case of abortion-related
death, might be hemorrhage, infection, embolism, or ectopic
pregnancy. In fact, the reporting systems in Canada, the
United States and in the World Health Organization are so
imprecise that deaths related to a previous abortion are hard
to track: Death certificates are inaccurately completed and,
either to protect the privacy of the woman and her family
or to avoid a possible lawsuit, hospital staff or doctors may
deliberately avoid coding an abortion-related death.
Another reason for underreporting bias is that many of the
statistics provided by the Centers for Disease Control (CDC)
come from unreliable hospital and clinic records. Statistics
from abortion providers in both Canada and the United
States tend to underreport negative findings, presumably so
that abortion will be seen as a safe procedure. At highest
risk of death related to abortion are African-American and
other minority women.
A recent authoritative Scandinavian study has established
that women who undergo induced abortion experience, over
the following twelve months, a death rate nearly four times​greater than women who give birth to their children."

http://www.deveber.org/text/chapters/Chap6.pdf


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

"
WHO&#8217;s claim
that legal abortion (an abortion procedure performed by a
licensed practitioner) is safe depends on a voluntary system
of death certification which has been shown to be inherently
unreliable. WHO&#8217;s statistics come from physicians who are
not told that they must specify the type of abortion that led
to maternal death &#8211; spontaneous, induced, legal or illegal.​​​​6​
Physicians are not even told that they must specify that the
terminal illness (e.g. sepsis) followed an abortion.
In addition, the July 1999 CDC Surveillance on Abortion
noted that official statistics show twelve per cent fewer
abortions than does the Alan Guttmacher Institute, the
research arm of Planned Parenthood.​​​​7 Before raising this
issue, Surveillance reports maternal death rates as if their​
own numbers are accurate, with no further explanation."

http://www.deveber.org/text/chapters/Chap6.pdf


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## JoeB131 (Oct 21, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



An egg is not a chicken
an acorn is not a tree
A fetus is not a baby...


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

"
1. In the United States, 93 per cent of all abortions
are performed in free-standing abortion clinics. A
woman whose post-abortion condition is lifethreatening
will be admitted to a general hospital
through an emergency department. The attending
emergency room doctor will not be the physician
who performed the abortion and may not record a
subsequent death as resulting from an abortion.
2. If the woman dies, it is not usually the abortion
provider but a casualty officer or the family doctor
who must complete the death certificate, and it is
this information upon which the death may or may
not be reported to the CDC.​​​​10 In 1995, Statistics
Canada noted that &#8220;if complications ensue after a
patient has been discharged from hospital, the
condition is treated as a separate case and does not
appear in the original abortion record&#8221;.11​
3. Inadequate information may be provided on the​physician&#8217;s or coroner&#8217;s report."

http://www.deveber.org/text/chapters/Chap6.pdf


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## emilynghiem (Oct 21, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Obviously, you have never had to make that decision. You have never been forced to do the one thing you did not want to do.
> 
> Attacking someone you know nothing about is nothing more than cyber-bullying. If you met her in real life, you would not say this to her face.
> 
> Shut up until you have some frikken clue what you're preaching about.



Also Luddly
have you "ever been in a position to make the decision" whether to  invest
your income directly into health services, education and training to serve the public
or paying insurance or fines into a system that is not proven to work yet or ever.

you call this cyberbullying, to mock or preach against people for wanting certain choices

what about insulting the intelligence and intent of people
who would rather invest in OTHER CHOICES besides ACA insurance or fines

you defend this choice
what about that one?


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 21, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Then why does an egg hatch into a chicken, an acorn turn into a tree, or a fetus turn into a human being? Would you care to answer that little conundrum?

It's called DNA. And insomuch as it makes them what they are, they belong to the species their genetic design dictates. An egg is a chicken, an acorn is a tree, and a fetus is a baby. Deal with it.


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## koshergrl (Oct 21, 2013)

I would love to hear the testimony of all these women that have been "forced" to give birth against their will.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 21, 2013)

Oh, Koch-er Girl, your threats of dangerous abortions are about as serious as your threats of Eternal Damnation and Fire.  

Hey, maybe instead of threatening women with things that don't happen - death, breat cancer, Hell - you could try to give them incentives to either have their babies or not get pregnant to start with.  

What a novel idea.


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## emilynghiem (Oct 21, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> "
> 1. In the United States, 93 per cent of all abortions
> are performed in free-standing abortion clinics. A
> woman whose post-abortion condition is lifethreatening
> ...



Dear KG: major problem with abortion legislation is holding the men equally responsible for either the unwanted pregnancy or coercing the woman to have an abortion. That is not taken into consideration, but all the burden legally and financially is on the woman.

laws would need to hold men equally accountable, like policing at the point
that abuse of the sex or abuse of the relationship OCCURS which is BOTH people's
responsibility equally. So that would require health related protections against abuse on another level of law, not criminalizing abortion after the fact, when it's all on the woman.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 21, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> [
> 
> Then why does an egg hatch into a chicken, an acorn turn into a tree, or a fetus turn into a human being?
> 
> It's called DNA. Deal with it.



Most eggs end up at Denny's. 

Most Acorns end up in a squirrel's nest for the winter.  

2/3rd of zygotes never attach to the uterine wall.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Just because you lie about to yourself about a fetus doesn't make you less of a sick fuck


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



So are you saying we should eat our unborn you sick fuck?


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## NLT (Oct 21, 2013)

Sometimes I wish I was at the baby shower of some of the liberal leftard posters in here, I would leave a nice gift.







somthing for thier toolbox


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 21, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



You never cease to amaze me, Joe.

Should they survive, an acorn will grow into an oak, that latter third of the time the zygote WILL attach itself to the uterine wall, and the egg will become a chicken. 

You make me chuckle with your idiotic facts, Joe. You didn't rebut my claim either. If you can't attribute a unborn human "fetus" to a human, or an acorn to a tree, or an egg to a chicken... what are they then?

And spare me your smart-assed responses, Joe. Your argument has been brushed to the wayside.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 21, 2013)

NLT said:


> Sometimes I wish I was at the baby shower of some of the liberal leftard posters in here, I would leave a nice gift.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



And its this sort of ignorance and hate exhibited by the right that proves social conservatism is indeed the bane of America.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 21, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> > Sometimes I wish I was at the baby shower of some of the liberal leftard posters in here, I would leave a nice gift.
> ...



Geez... if I had a dollar for each time you said the word "ignorant" the national debt would be an afterthought.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 21, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> NLT said:
> 
> 
> > Sometimes I wish I was at the baby shower of some of the liberal leftard posters in here, I would leave a nice gift.
> ...



Aww is the image to much for you?


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## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Who taught you how to structure a sentence?  

Fetuses aren't babies, dude.  We don't have funerals for miscarriages.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...



But that's the problem.  They aren't all designed to reach the finish line.   That's kind of the point.  

Natural Selection has given way to unnatural selection.   Chickens that are fatter and tastier wouldn't live in the wild, but we've bred them like that.  The eggs of the skinny chickens end up in omelets.  

The point is, I don't really want the fetus born to a woman who looks at it with a "You fucked up my life, you lttle bastard" to reach the finish line.  The prisons are full of those people.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...



Unborn is a made up word.  Either you are born or you aren't.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Who says?
I have Freinds who have.
You don't get to decide.

Ariel Castro, liberal hero, was charged with murder of an unborn.
I guess you liberals change the rules to suit you.
When liberals attempted to murder Douglas Kennedy's newborn( more than 24 hours after full seperation from the mother and the cord cut) it was not a crime.
I guess that was Barbera boxers interpretation, not fully born until the child gets home from Hospital!!

If there were clear rules rather than today's garbled interpretations, things might help.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



The liberal Ariel Castro was charged with murder of an unborn.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



So it's a spartan thing your going for.

Throw the weak to the wolves?

Beat the strong until they are void of humanity?
More liberal voters then!!


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## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



They would have charged Castro with Witchcraft if they thought they could get away with it.  I mean, it's easy to throw the kitchen sink at someone if they are already guilty of so much you can sneak in some bogus charge.   The day you charge a woman with aborting her own fetus, that's the day you guys can be taken seriously.  But they didn't even do that when Abortion was "illegal".  

I agree, the rules are garbled.  If a woman wants it, it's a "baby".  If she doesn't, it's "that thing I need to take care of."


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## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> [
> 
> So it's a spartan thing your going for.
> 
> ...



I'll take the "humanity" of the right more seriously when you care about the kids who already here, and not the potential ones.  

Maybe if you stop trying to cut food stamps and education and head start and day care, that'd be a good start.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



So since Roe vs Wade the welfare rolls have shrunk?

Let me repeat, for the thousandth time.

If they wanna fuck , let em.
If they don't want kids , birth control.
Or Abortion.
If they have bastards, they should raise them.

Show me where I hold any responsibility for their choices ?

Easy question, easy points, now go with them.

My kids are well raised.
I give to many charities( recently stopped donating to domestic violence charities since noomi informed me it didn't exist.
I stopped giving to breast cancer too, noomi told me breast cancer was harmless, no one died from it.
I work in my community to improve it.
I am a humane caring person.

I gave more to the jimmy fund last year than you earned!


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



You need to work on your grammar.
A third grader would be ashamed of that one!!

Not long since you attacked someone for their use of English?

People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



That's a direct contradiction of what you just said!
It's a life or it's not.
It depends on how I feel?
Feelings are not the basis of good governance.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Yes, a fetus IS a baby 

no matter how much you hate those babies  - the fetus IS A BABY. and abortion IS a MURDER of that BABY


----------



## mamooth (Oct 22, 2013)

Not that this applies to anyone here ... oh wait, it does ...

Pope Francis at Mass calls for greater openness
---
October 17, 2013: If a Christian becomes a disciple of the ideology, he has lost the faith.
This was the theme of Pope Francis homily during his Thursday morning Mass at the Domus Sanctae Marthae. During his homily, the Pope warned Christians against behaving as though the key is in [their] pocket, and the door closed. He reiterated that without prayer, one abandons the faith and descends into ideology and moralism. Woe to you, scholars of the law! You have taken away the key of knowledge! (Luke 11: 52)
...
The faith passes, so to speak, through a distiller and becomes ideology. And ideology does not beckon [people]. In ideologies there is not Jesus: in his tenderness, his love, his meekness. And ideologies are rigid, always. Of every sign: rigid. And when a Christian becomes a disciple of the ideology, he has lost the faith: he is no longer a disciple of Jesus, he is a disciple of this attitude of thought 
---


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## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Not that this applies to anyone here ... oh wait, it does ...
> 
> Pope Francis at Mass calls for greater openness
> ---
> ...


 



This is relevant to this discussion..how?


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

rw's are just sick. 
They say they don't want any responsibility and yet they want control.
And, if that's not sick enough, now they're saying a fetus isn't worth any more than an egg or an acorn. And, they vote for really sick fucks too. They threw a fit at the teenager who carried her dead baby around with her but praised Santorum for doing the same thing. And, of course, its okay with them that Karen Santorum had an abortion. 

When you think these idiots can't get any worse, they trot out another radical religious right wing nutter. 







Is there any part of our lives the rw's don't want to control? How big is their government gonna get before they stop peeking in bedroom windows?

Disgusting creeps. 


.


----------



## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> rw's are just sick.
> They say they don't want any responsibility and yet they want control.
> And, if that's not sick enough, now they're saying a fetus isn't worth any more than an egg or an acorn. And, they vote for really sick fucks too. They threw a fit at the teenager who carried her dead baby around with her but praised Santorum for doing the same thing. And, of course, its okay with them that Karen Santorum had an abortion.
> 
> ...



You don't half make up some shite do you!!
JoeB131 made the acorn egg comparison.
Santorum murdered a live born baby then went shoplifting with the dead body in his bag ?
You really are a liar.
You even lied to cover up for your idol, Peter Tatchill!!


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> rw's are just sick.
> They say they don't want any responsibility and yet they want control.
> And, if that's not sick enough, now they're saying a fetus isn't worth any more than an egg or an acorn. And, they vote for really sick fucks too. They threw a fit at the teenager who carried her dead baby around with her but praised Santorum for doing the same thing. And, of course, its okay with them that Karen Santorum had an abortion.
> 
> ...


 
Seriously, we pray every single day that you will please keep your depraved lifestyles in your own bedrooms, and your hands in your own pockets.

You may start any day now. We support you fully in that endeavor.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Not that this applies to anyone here ... oh wait, it does ...
> ...



If the left loses the discussion they turn their arguments to Jesus.
Or Pope 

Since they are ignorant on both the diversion is always pretty hilarious.
But they can't understand why everybody will be laughing at them.Or ignore.


----------



## emilynghiem (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> An egg is not a chicken
> an acorn is not a tree
> A fetus is not a baby...



Whoa, there Joe. I see what you were trying to say but this analogy went off track. 
You would flunk the SAT with analogies like this.

SEED
if the "acorn is a seed," then the closest human equivalent is like the "sperm" maybe?

so you could say a sperm is not a complete human and get away with that.
I would agree with that and so would most people.

EGG
the human "egg" is not the same as the "fetus"
so equating EGG and FETUS was too far, different stages that are clearly distinct.

ACORN : TREE
SEED : PLANT
SPERM? : HUMAN
not perfect but closer to making the same point

EGG --> CHICK formed inside the EGG --> CHICK outside egg --> grown CHICKEN
EGG --> fetus inside the womb --> baby outside the womb --> adult human

The way one person advised a group of prochoice and prolife advocates
to avoid any of this "baby/fetus" argument is to use the word
"INDIVIDUAL"

that it is shown from conception, those DNA couplings and combination
are UNIQUE TO THAT INDIVIDUAL

I don't think anyone talks about acorns/trees, seeds/plants, in terms of "individuals"

with eggs/chickens, and other animals, many ppl do believe individual animals
have souls, and it does indeed impose suffering to take life from animals who
are aware and have fear response to killing and dying. it has been shown that
ingesting the enzymes released during stress in animals killed is adverse to human health.

so there is some impact and effect in animals that we dismiss similar to prolife arguments.

NOTE: to refrain from judgmentally charged language such as "sin" or "crime"
if you look at these things in terms of "suffering"
YES it causes suffering to kill chickens for food and
YES it causes suffering to experience abortion as well as unwanted pregnancy, unwanted children, etc.

if we focused on reducing the root causes of abuse and suffering (no matter which we thought were worse than others)
we would solve a lot more problems across the board, even if we disagree on them individually.


----------



## mamooth (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Not that this applies to anyone here ... oh wait, it does ...
> ...



You and Vox are worshiping anti-abortion ideology. The Pope is pointing out how you have become disciples of ideology, and thus lost the faith.


----------



## emilynghiem (Oct 22, 2013)

mamooth said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



Close, I would explain the key difference is FORGIVENESS

I have friends that may well be more prolife and antiabortion than even Koshergirl
but as long as they are FORGIVING we can work together to eradicate abortion
by prevention by free will and educated choices, and without making it illegal or anti-choice by law.

I cannot blame the "antichoice" people who are unforgiving about it, fearbased, etc.
because of the hypocrisy on the prochoice side that even scares ME TO DEATH.

both sides would have to forgive and quit fearing each other, or you can hardly blame one without blaming the other. I forgive both, but most ppl don't. They fear each other, it's sad.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

mamooth said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > mamooth said:
> ...



and what makes you think Pope's words are relevant for either of us? 
Maybe I am Jewish and Koshergirl is Protestant? Or I am Orthodox and she is Buddhist?
referring to religious authorities by the leftards who abhor religion is ridiculous and if you think that nobody is going to call you on such blatant hypocrisy you must be living in a la-la land.

Not to even mention that neither of prolife people discussing on this thread have ever mentioned religious perspective to the murder in utero.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

emilynghiem said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...


*until the militant angry vaginas with vocal cords are denying that abortion is  MURDER - there is absolutely no ground not only for forgiveness, but for mere cooperation.*
You don't forgive a non-repentant murderer.
it is pertinent both from the secular and religious perspective ( though I totally object to bringing religion into the simple discussion of life and death).

but if you do - in all religions sin to be forgiven first has to be recognized as sin.
So far the sinners not only deny it is sin, they flaunt around their disgusting approval of the murder and their own murders as well.


----------



## emilynghiem (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> rw's are just sick.
> They say they don't want any responsibility and yet they want control.
> And, if that's not sick enough, now they're saying a fetus isn't worth any more than an egg or an acorn. And, they vote for really sick fucks too. They threw a fit at the teenager who carried her dead baby around with her but praised Santorum for doing the same thing. And, of course, its okay with them that Karen Santorum had an abortion.
> 
> ...



OK Luddly so again:
how is it OK for federal govt to mandate health care and exclude individual choice
instead of states and people voting or choosing their own directly?

explain away, please!

do I need to post a gofundme fundraiser and pay money for a good answer out of you?
that's only fair. if it takes 10 hours or 10 days to come up with an answer,
you could get paid for your consulting time or writing/advice.

Is there some place to post a bet. Either that I can pay you to explain these conflicting
statements, or pay someone who can explain or talk you out of it, whichever works.
I would love to see a consistent answer come out of this, and don't mind
raising money to pay you to resolve it or someone else who can do a better job.

If they can explain your view to me where we both agree that it  makes sense,
or that person can explain my view to you where we both agree, that's fine

but as is, this isn't making any sense at all to me. I would like an explanation of
how you see it this way and don't see a contradiction with it. I came very close,
but if you don't agree with my explanations, those aren't the ones explaining your views.


----------



## emilynghiem (Oct 22, 2013)

Vox said:


> *until the militant angry vaginas with vocal cords are denying that abortion is  MURDER - there is absolutely no ground not only for forgiveness, but for mere cooperation.*
> You don't forgive a non-repentant murderer.
> it is pertinent both from the secular and religious perspective ( though I totally object to bringing religion into the simple discussion of life and death).
> 
> ...



Hi Vox
I think you mean something different by forgiveness then.

people forgive murderers all the time, who still face the punishment for their crimes.

emotional/spiritual forgiveness is SEPARATE from physical consequences etc.
we still "owe restitution" for wrongs we commit on others, even if we're "forgiven"

Does this make sense?

Also, I understand what you mean that "people aren't forgiven until they forgive"
I find that people who don't forgive others, project that fear, and then find they aren't forgiven either!

It becomes a vicious trap. At some point when we accept God's forgiveness, then we free both sides from being trapped in mutual fear.
So perfect love casts out all fear. And once one side forgives, the other does too, and the truth can be understood and received more fully.

2. as for prochoice prolife

even if ppl don't see it in terms of sin and murder, life at conception,
just stopping the suffering to women alone is enough to prevent unwanted 
pregnancy and abortion. not all people have to see it the same way to
AGREE TO PREVENT ABORTION

There are many ways to agree to work together on prevention
I've had more success focusing on "preventing the abuse" to begin with that causes it.

not waiting for abuse to lead to unwanted pregnancy, rape, abortion etc.

If you also do not believe in abortion even for rape and incest, my friend
Juda has been helping women who don't want to abort their babies after rape/incest:
CHOICES4LIFE_Home
If you can please connect with her, very few people understand the outreach she does.
She does not spend energy on blame, but healing and forgiveness to reach more ppl.

She and I agree on prevention and also restitution for rape and abuse so that
more women and families help to break the cycle of poverty and abuse.

I wish more prochoice feminists would work with prolife groups like Juda's.
we could eradicate trafficking, rape, abuse and thus abortion by working together.

but this political division can't keep blocking us and wasting resources fighting.
so that is where I have faith that forgiveness will bring healing, and the rest will follow.
both sides will get what they want, when we focus on prevention instead of fighting in fear.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

emilynghiem said:


> Hi Vox
> I think you mean something different by forgiveness then.
> 
> people forgive murderers all the time, who still face the punishment for their crimes.


 Not if they brag about what they did.


> emotional/spiritual forgiveness is SEPARATE from physical consequences etc.
> we still "owe restitution" for wrongs we commit on others, even if we're "forgiven"


what emotional forgiveness are you talking about? one internet nickname towards the other internet nickname? This is a discussion board and therefore the hot topics produce clashes.
In real life I have never met the angry militant vaginas with vocal cords - the ones who consider themselves pro-choice perfectly well realize it is a murder, they usually do not support it for THEMSELVES and their daughters/sisters etc ( which is hypocrisy as well) but I have yet tot see anybody parading around with a motto - "I had an abortion and I would do it all over again".
yet on the internet boards you meet such sluts - and you name them as such.





> 2. as for prochoice prolife
> 
> even if ppl don't see it in terms of sin and murder, life at conception,
> just stopping the suffering to women alone is enough to prevent unwanted
> ...



which suffering? what are you talking about? there is no women suffering in the US - nobody is undergoing abortion because they "suffer".
Or you, people, have no idea what real suffering is.


> There are many ways to agree to work together on prevention
> I've had more success focusing on "preventing the abuse" to begin with that causes itnot waiting for abuse to lead to unwanted pregnancy, rape, abortion etc.
> 
> If you also do not believe in abortion even for rape and incest, my friend
> ...



that is in real life.
this is an internet board.
people vent here, nothing more.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

emilynghiem said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > "
> ...



If you want to held men equally responsible ( which I am all for) - men should have equal say in the fate of the child. If the man says - NO - than that is it - the woman is carrying the pregnancy until the end and if she tries to murder the child - she is criminally prosecuted for murder.
It is already extremely unfair towards men - if the woman keeps the child - the man is responsible for 18 ears but does not have equal rights for the child, when the woman wants to murder the child in utero - man has no say in the issue - how much more do you want to discriminate men?
You do realize that coersion ( which obviously exists) is a direct consequence of the "blame men" policies?
If you want real responsibility - make it EQUAL first of all


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

The biology is what it is.

Women are the ones who get pregnant. 

Once they're pregnant, they're pregnant. No turning back the clock. Stop stigmatizing pregnancy and devaluing children, and instead celebrate pregnancy and children. If you'd quit punishing women for getting pregnant, fewer of them will feel compelled to risk their lives to eliminate it.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> The biology is what it is.
> 
> Women are the ones who get pregnant.
> 
> Once they're pregnant, they're pregnant. No turning back the clock. Stop stigmatizing pregnancy and devaluing children, and instead celebrate pregnancy and children. If you'd quit punishing women for getting pregnant, fewer of them will feel compelled to risk their lives to eliminate it.



Exactly. Celebrate motherhood and childbearing instead of gloryfying murder.

But,but, but it may decrease the number of those who want to abort and that will bring down thr profits of abortion clinics - and that what all this absolvation and gloryfication of murder in utero is about. Plus control over undesired populace.


----------



## mamooth (Oct 22, 2013)

Vox said:


> and what makes you think Pope's words are relevant for either of us?



They're applicable to any religion.

Your religion, of course, is anti-abortionism, and your devotion to that religion precludes any other religious beliefs on your parts.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

What is with you racists and your compulsion to bring God into the abortion debate?

It's not about God. It's about human rights, and the violations that you maintain are *necessary*.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> [
> 
> That's a direct contradiction of what you just said!
> It's a life or it's not.
> ...



It isn't a matter of governance, Double-Wide.  

It's a matter of how people are going to run their lives.  

WOmen who find themselves pregnant WILL have abortions.  No matter what the law is.


----------



## mamooth (Oct 22, 2013)

Planned Parenthood clinic firebomber suspect in Joplin, Missouri also confesses to mosque attack.

The Joplin Globe : UPDATED: Suspect allegedly confessed to setting Joplin mosque fire

Nah, no religious issues there.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

So? People commit murder and burglary and child abuse every day, no matter what the law is.

That doesn't mean murder, burglary and child abuse need to be legalized and federally funded...


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Planned Parenthood clinic firebomber suspect in Joplin, Missouri also confesses to mosque attack.
> 
> The Joplin Globe : UPDATED: Suspect allegedly confessed to setting Joplin mosque fire
> 
> Nah, no religious issues there.


 
Arsonists are generally liberals.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > rw's are just sick.
> ...



And THAT is the whole point.  What consenting adults do in the privacy of their own homes, their own lives, is none of your business. 

Stop with the constant meddling.

Stay out of other people's business.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> What is with you racists and your compulsion to bring God into the abortion debate?
> 
> It's not about God. It's about human rights, and the violations that you maintain are *necessary*.



Exactly.

Women are the sole owners of their bodies and they have the right to decide when to reproduce. 

So stop peeking in people's windows. 

Mind your own business


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

Good. We're agreed. No more public funding for the abortion industry, contraceptives, or *sex education* .


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Pauli007001 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



And, the idea that doctors won't perform therapeutic d&c's is asssinine. 

There have always been and will always be doctors who do not and will not but, by and large, doctors put their patient's welfare first. That's the way it was before Roe v Wade and that's the way it will always be.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Good. We're agreed. No more public funding for the abortion industry, contraceptives, or *sex education* .



Are you saying that you're one of the idiots who believes federal (tax) money has been used to fund abortion?

We already had this conversation but if you have forgotten, do some friggin research already.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

Which is why we never needed legalized abortion in the first place.

Doctors have never failed to treat women appropriately when their health is truly in jeopardy. That, like everything else the death cultists spout, is a lie, along with the lie that if we don't have abortion clinics funded by the state, the few women who do actually require abortion for medical reasons will just DIE.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Planned Parenthood clinic firebomber suspect in Joplin, Missouri also confesses to mosque attack.
> ...



Never mind.

Anyone who is dumb enough to type this lie does not have the intelligence to research anything.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Good. We're agreed. No more public funding for the abortion industry, contraceptives, or *sex education* .
> ...


 
I've done my research. The feds fund Planned Parenthood up the ying yang.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Good. We're agreed. No more public funding for the abortion industry, contraceptives, or *sex education* .
> ...



And more to the point, I am guessing that if people could check off boxes on their 1040's, Planned Parenthood would get funded long before the War ON Terror.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Which is why we never needed legalized abortion in the first place.
> 
> Doctors have never failed to treat women appropriately when their health is truly in jeopardy. That, like everything else the death cultists spout, is a lie, along with the lie that if we don't have abortion clinics funded by the state, the few women who do actually require abortion for medical reasons will just DIE.



Too late.

Its legal and its none of your business unless its you who is having the abortion. 

Deal with it.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

I am dealing with it.

By publicly identifying it as the human rights violation it is.

And also pointing out, RvW was a bad law, established illegally, against the will of the people.

Not that it matters. Good law, bad law, it doesn't make any difference. Abortion is a human rights violation, and the industry protects those who abuse women and children.

Deal with that, baby killer.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Before the idiot tee potties did their lying smear campaign, I would agree. But, if this board is a microcosm, there are many rw's who have no friggin clue what PP actually does. Hell, some of these brain dead dummies believe their taxes have been paying for abortions. 

It really is true that you can't cure stupid. The rw's are proof of that.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> I am dealing with it.
> 
> By publicly identifying it as the human rights violation it is.
> 
> ...



As usual, you are free to hold any opinion you wish.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

I know intimately what PP does. I'm much, much better informed than you are, luddly.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

Thank you, but I don't need your permission to hold my opinion, baby killer.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

NLT said:


> Sometimes I wish I was at the baby shower of some of the liberal leftard posters in here, I would leave a nice gift.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So, its not abortion you're against. You'd love to see all fetuses of lib-rule women killed in the most horrendous way possible. Further, I'd bet you're in favor of killing the babies born to lib-rules as well. 

I'd bet most rw's would agree and I'd bet they're more than happy to lie about it. 

People Who Call Themselves "Pro-Life" Are Lying, Here Are 10 More Accurate Descriptions -


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> I am dealing with it.
> 
> By publicly identifying it as the human rights violation it is.
> 
> ...



I agree, _Roe v. Wade _was a bad ruling because it found a right to one's body that doesn't exist in other areas of law while not clearly identifying when life begins.  

I will even go further to say we'd have been better off had we had the national discussion in the 1970's and won legal abortion that way.  

But the reality- Roe just legalized what everyone was already doing.


----------



## Pauli007001 (Oct 22, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > I am dealing with it.
> ...



Did it reduce welfare rolls?


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 22, 2013)

Pauli007001 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Read Freakonomics.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

lololol...


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > What is with you racists and your compulsion to bring God into the abortion debate?
> ...


What they kill isnt their body but the body of another human you evil fuck.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 22, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



In your subjective, personal opinion, not as a matter of fact or law. 

Youre allowed to wallow in your own hate and ignorance; but are thankfully forbidden to attempt to codify that hate and ignorance.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 22, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...


LAW? Since when is law the defining factor of what is human or not? It isn't opinion that abortions kills humans.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Luddly Neddite said:
> ...


 
Actually, as a matter of fact, it is a separate individual body.

And law does not dictate humanity.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

Does anyone else find it wildly ironic that the moron says it's not an individual per fact or law...

When in fact, a fetus IS an individual, which is why it must be KILLED for an abortion to take place.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 22, 2013)

And, in fact, per the law...most law does recognize the individuality of the unborn:

"*Scott Lee Peterson* (born October 24, 1972) is a man convicted of murdering his wife, Laci Peterson, and their unborn son"

Scott Peterson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > What is with you racists and your compulsion to bring God into the abortion debate?
> ...



Now cry me a river of your crocodile tears over the victims of the latest shootings in the USA and expect anybody will believe your lies about oh, how deeply, how extremely sorry you are over those children killed in a shooting.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > and what makes you think Pope's words are relevant for either of us?
> ...



no, they are not.

and what makes you think they will impress anybody if provided by an abortion crazie?

you are simply ridiculous.
Oh, and did you do your chore for today and cried crocodile tears over killed people in the shooting thread? No? oh, you ought to join the ranks of other lying leftards who are just shining there in their hypocrisy - for everybody to observe.


----------



## Vox (Oct 22, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> What is with you racists and your compulsion to bring God into the abortion debate?
> 
> It's not about God. It's about human rights, and the violations that you maintain are *necessary*.



if leftards are losing the debate they ALWAYS bring Jesus, God and Pope into the debate.

It is a signal - they have lost it.

One more of the typical hypocrisy of the left.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 22, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



The law is the defining factor of what is *legal or not*, such as the legal fact that abortion is not murder, and its ignorant idiocy to argue otherwise. 

The courts have wisely left the matter of when human life begins to each individual to decide in his own good faith and conscience, and the courts have just as wisely forbidden the state from getting involved in making such a determination; we do not want politicians and bureaucrats deciding when human life begins.  

If you believe abortion is murder, then dont have an abortion, but you have no legal grounds whatsoever upon which to attempt to foist that subjective opinion on fellow citizens through the authority of the law  and thankfully so.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 22, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Killing innocent human babies may be legal but it is still evil and people like you who cheer it are sick


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

They are not babies, and are not considered babies until they are born. And rightfully so.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> They are not babies, and are not considered babies until they are born. And rightfully so.



Just because you lie to yourself about supporting infanticide doesn't hide the truth.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 23, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > They are not babies, and are not considered babies until they are born. And rightfully so.
> ...



Kidney bean sized fetuses aren't "infants". 

Infants are a lot bigger and they poop a lot.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 23, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



So should it be legal to kill all dwarfs? They are small as well


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



No, they're not.  They are human beings in the very early stages of development.  They are human beings from the time the cells start dividing.  They may not look like a 9 month old newborn but they are a human being, not just a 'blob of cells or tissue'; a human being in the very early stages of development.  You can tap dance around all you want, spewing nonsense till the cows come home but the fact of the matter is that abortion terminates the life of that human being.  It snuffs out the life of another unique individual.  It ends the existence of another human being.  They cease to be, they cease to exist, they cease to have a chance at life.  That is what the 'choice' of abortion does.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



There are millions of "unique individuals" who starve every day that you simply don't give a crap about.  

This has never been about caring about people for you wingnuts... it's about keeping women in their place.  

When you stop trying to cut food stamps and head start and WIC and such, then I will take your concern about "unique individuals" a bit more seriously.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I noticed you didn't disagree with the fact that abortion ends the life of another human being.  Progress in small increments is still progress. Good for you, Joe.


----------



## Sallow (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Well if that's the case, if the body they are living in chooses not to have them there..they gotta go.

It's like a rent thing.

I mean you folks are fine with landlords kicking out people if they can't pay the rent..even if that action means their death.

Or an Arizona governor denying health care to her citizens, even if that action means their death.

So what's the problem?


----------



## Sallow (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



So does war and the death penalty.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

Sallow said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Yes, they do.  People who choose to enlist know full well they may lose their life in war.  People who choose to commit heinous crimes, are caught and found guilty are often executed.  People who choose to have an abortion make a choice to end the life of another human being. In these three scenarios, the ones who don't have a choice in dying are the innocent victims in war (civilian casualties), the innocent victims of killers, the innocent victims of abortion.  In the end those who had no choice are dead.


----------



## Vox (Oct 23, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



It is not a responsibility of individual taxpayer to "feed the world" so raising the child is a sole responsibility of the parents.
It is a responsibility of individual taxpayer to stop murder of the innocents as murder is a violation of the human rights - in this case a right to life of the unborn child . If one can be prosecuted for a murder of the unborn in case of the harm to pregnant woman with a wanted child - that automatically elevates any murder of the "kidney bean" to the category of murder. You can not have it both ways, even if selective murder through abortion is NOW legal.
The key word here is "now"


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 23, 2013)

Progressive is the ideology of cheering for  dead babies


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...


 
You give the leftist baby killers waaay too much credit when you assume they care about killing human beings.

They don't. They know we care, that's why they insist babies aren't really humans. But if you scratch the surface of any of them, you'll find they don't think it matters...they believe some people should be killed, and they think they are qualified to determine who and when.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 23, 2013)

Sallow said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


 
It's sad that you can't distinguish between a baby and a soldier, or a murderer.

But it's telling. You feel threatened by babies. 

Creepy.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



When was the last time you protested about the number of starving children in Africa? When was the last time you made a donation to feed those starving children? Eh?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



You as a taxpayer can stop the 'murder' of the fetus, simply by paying the woman's medical treatment, and any bills she needs paid, and adopting her baby once it is born.

But that won't happen, will it, because you care about fetuses, not about babies.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Oh, I see.  If I don't protest against everything, then I can't protest against anything.  Liberal logic is whack.

You have no idea what I donate to.

Shoo.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Just for once I'd like a leftist to show some kind of sense that they even remotely understand the concept of personal responsibility and stop wanting someone else to pay your bills, raise your kids, carry you through life.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

Have you adopted a baby that would otherwise have been aborted?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Just for once I'd like a leftist to show some kind of sense that they even remotely understand the concept of personal responsibility and stop wanting someone else to pay your bills, raise your kids, carry you through life.



So...if you can't afford to have a baby, don't have sex?


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 23, 2013)

Bingo!

If you can't afford to have a baby, you probably have more pressing issues than getting laid. Do what people have done for MILLENIA....divert that sexual energy towards getting ahead..and then when you can afford to support a child in the off chance you create one, then go for it!


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Bingo!
> 
> If you can't afford to have a baby, you probably have more pressing issues than getting laid. Do what people have done for MILLENIA....divert that sexual energy towards getting ahead..and then when you can afford to support a child in the off chance you create one, then go for it!



So if you do have sex, and get pregnant, you should be punished by being force to give birth?

Thanks for the honesty!


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Have you adopted a baby that would otherwise have been aborted?



No.  Oh, I know I know ... in your world this somehow means I can have no say about abortion.  

Abortion supporters believe that death of a human being is better than life via adoption or, here's a novel idea ... the parents raising the child.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Just for once I'd like a leftist to show some kind of sense that they even remotely understand the concept of personal responsibility and stop wanting someone else to pay your bills, raise your kids, carry you through life.
> ...



Where in the hell did I say that?????


----------



## Noomi (Oct 23, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



So if you can't afford to have a baby, you should have one anyway? Is that what you are saying?

Make up your mind, will you?


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



If you can't afford or don't want a child, use birth control.  If you become pregnant and can't afford or don't want the child, have the baby and give it up for adoption.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Bingo!
> ...


 
If you believe pregnancy is a punishment, you probably shouldn't be having sex anyway.


----------



## Vox (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



that is not her business to "protest" about anything going on in Africa.
She is a citizen of HER country and cares about that country.

Unlike the crazy leftards who lie how they "care" about the whole world, however, the ones who know a bit what "care" are we talking about will just advice the world to take care of itself and never ever let the "bleeding hearts" leftards even approach their country.
If they want to survive.


----------



## Vox (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



It is not my responsibility as a taxpayer to pay for anybody's medical treatment ( though my taxes are paying for a lot of that as well) neither is it MY responsibility to pay her bills.
And if I would like to adopt the baby I won't ask your directives - you may want first to take care of yourself until you are not on a taxpayer's tab as you clearly are, before you are eligible to give an"advice" to anybody. 
if the woman does not want a child - she can give her for adoption before she is even several weeks pregnant - and the willing people - and there are thousands of them - will take care of what needs to be done.


----------



## Vox (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Just for once I'd like a leftist to show some kind of sense that they even remotely understand the concept of personal responsibility and stop wanting someone else to pay your bills, raise your kids, carry you through life.
> ...



listen, crazy vagina with vocal cords, obsessed with sex - there are plenty of birth control available and sex does not always involve pregnancy scare.

it's 2013 for goodness gracious, why are you so .... uneducated and unsatisfied?


----------



## Vox (Oct 23, 2013)

Noomi said:


> You as a taxpayer can stop the 'murder' of the fetus, simply by paying the woman's medical treatment, and any bills she needs paid, and adopting her baby once it is born.
> 
> But that won't happen, will it, because you care about fetuses, not about babies.



No, as a taxpayer I can simply go the other way and eventually get the murder of the innocent babies prosecuted - as it should be.

It might take a while - but it will happen. Rome was not built in a year as wel


----------



## Vox (Oct 23, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Bingo!
> 
> If you can't afford to have a baby, you probably have more pressing issues than getting laid. Do what people have done for MILLENIA....divert that sexual energy towards getting ahead..and then when you can afford to support a child in the off chance you create one, then go for it!



It seems, though, that in this particular instance, not getting laid is resulting in obsession


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 24, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Have you adopted a baby that would otherwise have been aborted?



Have you stopped a woman from killing her babies yet?


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 24, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Just for once I'd like a leftist to show some kind of sense that they even remotely understand the concept of personal responsibility and stop wanting someone else to pay your bills, raise your kids, carry you through life.
> ...



Yes.... I know it is hard for you progressives to understand that women are not there just to fuck.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 24, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Have you adopted a baby that would otherwise have been aborted?
> ...


She in her quest for more babies dead ignores that there are millions of family's willing to adopt...


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 24, 2013)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Bingo!
> ...



That sums up well the arrogance and authoritarianism of the social right, as well as the contempt most conservatives have for the Constitution, its case law, the rule of law, and most importantly the right to individual liberty  the right of each person to make personal, private decisions free from interference by the state, such as dictating to a woman whether she may have a child or not.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



What did the baby do that you hate it so much to kill it?


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 24, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



No baby is being killed, thats your personal, subjective contrivance, not a fact of law; its Constitutionally and legally irrelevant, thankfully. 

And we indeed have a Constitution to protect citizens from the ignorance, hate, and arrogance you and others on the right exhibit, to safeguard each citizens individual liberty.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...


Is a walrus being killed instead?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 24, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > You as a taxpayer can stop the 'murder' of the fetus, simply by paying the woman's medical treatment, and any bills she needs paid, and adopting her baby once it is born.
> ...



Would you pay more in taxes to fund the legal system to prosecute these women, and pay for more prisons to house them?


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



That's the only thing that brings me joy, in threads like this. The knowledge that the sickest among them has no bearing on a woman's right to choose. They're toothless old haters.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 24, 2013)

The state should be able to choose when some
adult women should have abortions.

Even if they don't want one.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 24, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Nope, I just don't take you guys seriously, because you don't give a fuck about poor children.  

Thi sis about misogynists keeping women in their place.  

When you idiots talk about "Legitimate Rape" and "Gift from God Rape", you show your contempt for women.


----------



## j-mac (Oct 24, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...





Do you often make the mistake of generalization? The misogynist are those that still believe in the population manipulation that Sanger put in place for race control.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 24, 2013)

j-mac said:


> [
> 
> Do you often make the mistake of generalization? The misogynist are those that still believe in the population manipulation that Sanger put in place for race control.
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk



Maybe you should read a book about Sanger instead of accepting ANti-Abortion propaganda about her...


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> j-mac said:
> 
> 
> > Do you often make the mistake of generalization? The misogynist are those that still believe in the population manipulation that Sanger put in place for race control.
> ...



"Joe!"

/slap

"Snap out of it, Joe! You're dreaming!"


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 24, 2013)

Sorry... rough night....


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Sorry... rough night....



Understandable but whoa. You gave me quite a start, thinking they could read, comprehend, examine their locked minds ...


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 24, 2013)

Like Alice, I try to believe at least one impossible thing before breakfast.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 24, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


.


----------



## Lonestar_logic (Oct 24, 2013)

laughinReaper said:


> I don't know how to post a picture so I have the link here. It's a picture of a so called feminist named Gloria Steinem, smiling face proudly wearing a t-shirt that reads "I Had an Abortion".
> 
> 
> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?  This is what the picture really says.
> ...



Too bad her mother didn't.


----------



## Vox (Oct 24, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



if that is needed to stop the murder - yes.


----------



## Lonestar_logic (Oct 24, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



You're paying for their abortions, why not pay for their incarceration and/or tubal ligation?


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Like Alice, I try to believe at least one impossible thing before breakfast.



That works. I'm going to try that.

I believe that women who are forced to incubate will make wonderful mothers.


----------



## Lonestar_logic (Oct 24, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Like Alice, I try to believe at least one impossible thing before breakfast.
> ...



No one is forcing a women to incubate, just live with the choices she made.

If a women doesn't want children then she shouldn't be out spreading her legs.


----------



## j-mac (Oct 24, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> j-mac said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Lol, yeah I know, any of her true agendas must be denied by those in support today.

I would only give you back your own advice, as your suggestion reeks of projection.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 24, 2013)

Dead babies Coming to obamacare near you


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 24, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > You as a taxpayer can stop the 'murder' of the fetus, simply by paying the woman's medical treatment, and any bills she needs paid, and adopting her baby once it is born.
> ...



Someone cant be prosecuted for murder when he indeed has committed no murder, as abortion is not murder. 

But thank you for demonstrating the point that you and others on the right have nothing but contempt for individual liberty and the rule of law.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 24, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



It is a sickness, there is really no other word for it. 

A sickness afflicting conservatives brought on by their fear, hate, and ignorance.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Indeed. Always good to see their 'true colors.'


----------



## Dude111 (Oct 24, 2013)

laughinReaper said:
			
		

> My first reaction was disbelief. Are you kidding me lady. Does she think that the picture glorifiying her Abortion makes her some type of heroine?


Maybe she had 2nd thoughts about bringing a baby into this messed up world but in all fairness ITS A LITTLE TOO LATE I THINK TO THINK LIKE THAT MONTHS LATER!! (I didnt look @ the picture of her)


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

And again. I didn't read what Gloria herself had to say about it, but since abortion was legitimate in many states before RvW, and all states after, I think it's safe to say that people will try to shame a woman for having an abortion. Hell, it's happened to me so I know this to be true. 

I didn't do anything I should be ashamed of. 

And I don't do secondhand shame.

So you all can have fits of the screaming mimi's here, but I won't suddenly have an epiphany that NO!! I really SHOULD be ashamed!


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 24, 2013)

Lonestar_logic said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Funny part
the leftists won't demand that men don't pay
if she chooses to keep the baby and the man
wants nothing to do with it

funny how that works


----------



## Vox (Oct 24, 2013)

j-mac said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > j-mac said:
> ...



as if a book can not be written by pro-abort propaganda.

leftists are amazingly oblivious to the rules of simple logic


----------



## Vox (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



not YET.

But making a murder legal does not change it to liberation - it is still a MURDER OF THE BABY


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 24, 2013)

Vox said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Not ever. 

Not as long as citizens of good faith and good conscience respect the rule of law and the Constitutions protection of individual liberty. 

Youre allowed to bleat in ignorance about murder and babies to your hearts content, but such opinions remain subjective, wrong, and irrelevant.


----------



## Vox (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



LOL

segregationists thought so also


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 24, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Then don't ever let me catch you mourning for dead children in a school shooting. It's obvious you don't give a damn about them either way.


----------



## Vox (Oct 24, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



yep. they don't give a damn about dead children.
only their agenda.


----------



## NLT (Oct 24, 2013)

If it has a heart beat its murder


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 24, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Oh fuck off, you pretentious hack.


----------



## Vox (Oct 24, 2013)

NLT said:


> If it has a heart beat its murder



even before it - zygote started dividing - it is a life and getting rid of it IS a murder.

the first contractions of the not yet fully developed heart in a baby start at 4-6 weeks


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Lonestar_logic said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



I don't know, I think locking people up because you are a religious fanatic is kind of stupid, actually.  So is mutilating them.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> [
> 
> Then don't ever let me catch you mourning for dead children in a school shooting. It's obvious you don't give a damn about them either way.



Most people see a difference between a zygote and a child shot at a school.  

Sane people, anyway.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> [
> 
> Nope, I just don't take you guys seriously, because you don't give a fuck about poor children.
> 
> ...


.[/QUOTE]

So we were just imagining shit when the GOP Congress tried to cut Food Stamps, and almost shut down the government because more poor children might get health coverage under the ACA?  

You can't say, "I'm doing this for thet chlldren" and then yank food out of their mouths.

As for Polanski, I think it's kid of silly to still be punishing him for something that happened 40 years ago.  

Let's recap, he had sex with a young woman who was NOT a virgin, who was brought over by her mother probably for exactly the purpose of setting him up.  The Prosecutors decided this wasn't a big deal and gave him probation, until a grandstanding judge decided to play politics.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Nope, I just don't take you guys seriously, because you don't give a fuck about poor children.
> ...



The GOP raised food stamp spending by 57%.  The Dems wanted 65%.  Only in retarded liberal land does increasing something by 57% mean they cut spending.    The (un)aca is a fucking mess, Rs wanted to delay the mandate to give time to fix the problems (which obama is now doing.  talk about a derp).  The Dems are the ones who shut down the gov.  

"It wasn't 'rape, rape'".  Yeah, you just keep spinning it, Joe.

Young woman??????  _She was 13 years old_.  

You bash a moronically stupid Republican (and rightly so) for saying you can't get pregnant from being raped but give a free pass to Polanski for raping a 13 year old girl cause, you know ... it wasn't "rape, rape".

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFcI0kAypu8]Whoopi Defends Roman Polanski - "It wasnt rape-rape" REMIX - YouTube[/ame]

<blink, blink>

You're an idiot.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...




Sure

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv1afKaLhA]Planned Parenthood endorses post-birth abortion - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> [
> 
> The GOP raised food stamp spending by 57%.  The Dems wanted 65%.  Only in retarded liberal land does increasing something by 57% mean they cut spending.    The (un)aca is a fucking mess, Rs wanted to delay the mandate to give time to fix the problems (which obama is now doing.  talk about a derp).  The Dems are the ones who shut down the gov.



Then why does everyone blame the Republicans?  Because they were the ones who insisted on cuttting help to poor people.  

The REpublicans don't want to fix the problems, they want to kill it. 



> As for Food Stamps...
> 
> The bill would cause 3 million people to lose benefits while another 850,000 would see their benefits cut, according to the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office. The White House threatened Wednesday to veto the bill, calling food stamps one of the "nation's strongest defenses against hunger and poverty."
> 
> The battle over food stamps has left in limbo the future of farm policy, and slowed efforts to write a new five-year, $500 billion farm bill. The current law expires on Sept. 30.



Sorry, when people who get them now won't get them in the future, that's a cut. 






Zoom-boing said:


> [
> "It wasn't 'rape, rape'".  Yeah, you just keep spinning it, Joe.
> 
> Young woman??????  _She was 13 years old_.
> ...



No, I give him a pass because PROFESSIONAL PROSECUTORS recommended probation.  



> Under the terms of the plea agreement, the court ordered Polanski to report to a state prison for a 90-day psychiatric evaluation, but granted a stay to allow him to complete his current project. Under the terms set by the court, he traveled to Europe to complete filming.[27] Polanski returned to California and reported to Chino State Prison for the evaluation period, and was released after 42 days.[28] Polanski's lawyers had the expectation that Polanski would get only probation at the subsequent sentencing hearing, with the probation officer, examining psychiatrist, and the victim all recommending against jail time.[



And what does the "victim" think? 



> In a documentary for A&E Television Networks entitled Roman Polanski (2000), Samantha Gailey Geimer stated "he had sex with me. He wasnt hurting me and he wasnt forceful or mean or anything like that, and really I just tried to let him get it over with." She also claimed that the event had been blown "all out of proportion".



No, not really a Polanski fan.  I think he ought to be charged with Larceny for calling his movies "entertainment".


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...



Yeah, okay, hypothetically, when you go in for an abortion, you shouldn't be handed a mangled deformed permature baby and told "Enjoy Motherhood...and thousands of dollars in medical bills!"


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

The radical left believes in the gov't regulating everything but this....

Yet Planned Parenthood and the reactionary left is on the minority side of
how the majority feel about abortion
-majority of Americans do not believe in abortion with no restrictions
-majority do not support late term abortions

The radical left did not even support California from charging Scott Peterson, who killed his
pregnant wife, with the murder of his child.

Sadly, for the Democrats, they allow only the politician with the most extreme views on this
subject, act as their spokesperson - pitting them against the majority of Americans

For example

Papa Obama, as a state senator, fought a law that would have protected live infants accidentally delivered during an abortion. 
Senator Barbara Boxer once said that constitutional rights begin when you bring the baby home from the hospital.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> The radical left believes in the gov't regulating everything but this....
> 
> Yet Planned Parenthood and the reactionary left is on the minority side of
> how the majority feel about abortion
> ...



Scott Peterson killed his wife.  That's all he should have been charged with.  

The minute you start giving fetuses more rights than the women they are in, is the minute you turn women into second class citizens.  

Oh, the reason why Obama fought that law was the woman who said it was happening was a complete liar....


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

Sure

which is why the extreme left is against the majority of Americans on this issue


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Sure
> 
> which is why the extreme left is the majority of Americans on this issue



Does the majority of Americans have a medical degree?  

Let's stop demagouging the Late Abortion issue.  Only 1% of abortions are performed after the 20th week, and it is almost always for a good medical reason. 

Oh, do you know what Hospital Employees call fetuses born at the 20th week of pregnancy? 

they have an acronym for it. CTF- "Cleetus the Fetus".  They know it's going to die, because no baby has every survived earlier than 22 weeks of pregnancy.   But they go through the motions to humor the parents.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

"Does the majority of Americans have a medical degree?"
An ad hominem argument, so one can not know the truth

Have a degree like this guy?







The majority of Americans believe in limits on late term abortions
allowing for the life of the mother.

Only the most extreme, don't


----------



## Vox (Oct 25, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> "Does the majority of Americans have a medical degree?"
> An ad hominem argument, so one can not know the truth
> 
> Have a degree like this guy?
> ...



The vast majority of Americans clearly do not have any idea thathere is NEVER a reason to perform late-term ABORTION, as at that gestational age the baby can be delivered alive via emergency c-section which does not only spare the life of the baby but is also much safer than abortion performed at the advanced gestational age.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Polanski had sex with a 13 year old child.  She was raped, as she was a child.

Only in liberal idiotic moronic land does is a 26 year old adult considered a child so they can remain on their parents health insurance plan but a 13 year old child is considered a 'young woman' who you can have sex with.  

Quotes without links?


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > The radical left believes in the gov't regulating everything but this....
> ...



No, Joe.  Not _more_ rights.  Just the right to life, the same as women.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 25, 2013)

What this really boils down to is that liberals see women as nothing more than sex objects they like their hero Bill Clinton have no respect for women


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> "Does the majority of Americans have a medical degree?"
> An ad hominem argument, so one can not know the truth
> 
> Have a degree like this guy?
> ...



Idiotic argument.  Gosnell was a case of someone going very wrong.  

Most Americans aren't qualified to tell a woman when she should or shouldn't abort.  

But I have a great comprimise for you fuckwads who don't like abortion. 

If you don't like abortion, don't have one. 

Problem solved.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> [
> 
> Polanski had sex with a 13 year old child.  She was raped, as she was a child.
> 
> ...



So let me get this straight.  

Trayvon Martin, although legally not an adult, was fully responsible for being murdered by Zimmerman, because he was old enough to know better, 

But this woman, who says TODAY she doesn't think this was a big deal, and really didn't think so at the time, is a "child"?

Kind of a flexible definition, doncha think? 

Pssst- It's from the Wikipedia article....


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > "Does the majority of Americans have a medical degree?"
> ...




Indeed
He even had a medical degree which according to your prior post
qualifies his opinion on truth better than all

The majority of Americans believe in limits on late term abortions
allowing for the life of the mother.

Only the most extreme on the left , don't

the real, as you say,  "fuckwads"
The radical left did not even support California from charging Scott Peterson, who killed his
pregnant wife, with the murder of his child.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 25, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> The vast majority of Americans clearly do not have any idea thathere is NEVER a reason to perform late-term ABORTION, as at that gestational age the baby can be delivered alive via emergency c-section which does not only spare the life of the baby but is also much safer than abortion performed at the advanced gestational age.



So you should totally take those babies with Spina Bifida, with Brittle Bone Syndrome, with all the other horrible deadly diseases-  Just cut that lady open to get it out so it can live a few hours in horrific pain because, Gosh Darn It, My Invisible Friend in The Sky says Abortion is murder, even though he never, ever bothered to write it down in his big book of rules.... 

Unlike the important rules about not picking up sticks on Sunday and making sure your clothes have nice blue borders.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Trayvon Martin was killed by Zimmerman because he attacked Zimmerman.  

Yes, Joe, 13 is a child.  You should read the entire wiki article, not just cherry pick the parts that fit your deranged narrative that 13 somehow isn't a child.  Well, as I pointed out above, 13 isn't a child in liberal land ... but 26 is.  You guys are really strange.

Stop spinning.

Back on topic .... unborn fetus are human beings. Abortion kills a human being.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Thank you for the reminder. I came thisclose to picking up sticks on Sunday in clothes without blue borders.


----------



## Vox (Oct 25, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



spinida bifida is an operable syndrome and has variable degrees of expression - some are absolutely normal kids after the operation, some have minor deficiencies.
But you would murder them, right?
And yea, you will tear the baby in utero to pieces inflicting the horrible pain to the baby ( and the mother, eventually), because there US is suspicious for the spina bifida or any other defect ( which is almost never a 100% sure).
Spina bifida is corrected in the realm of fetal surgery nowadays.

But you will murder those babies, cutting them to pieces inside the womb, not even letting them be born via C-section - God forbid they might be alive and a neurosurgeon can actually evaluate the baby and might actually want to correct the defect - no, cut them to pieces in utero - even if it is exponentially more dangerous to the mother than a c-section!!!

You would be a good assistant of Dr. mengele.
And all the vaginas with vocal cords parading around their abortions -  too.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

Just can't wait for the same quality of people that designed and implemented 
Papa Obama care to do their wonderful work on the IPAB 

Hopefully the Supreme Court will rule that their word is final
Just like in Canada now.

This way the gov't can tell women when to have abortions
after all, it will save the state money




[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXzQD2SRESs]The Obsolete Man - YouTube[/ame]


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## Vox (Oct 25, 2013)

oh, and how nice of our followers of Dr. mengele to be sooooo concerned about the babies being born and then die "in horrible pain" ( from what?) but somehow being absolutely content with the same babies being cut to pieces and inflicting that horrible pain they are supposedly sooooo concerned with (after birth) inside the mothers womb - how very "caring" and how very "bleedingheartedly"

leftards, you are the worst scum of the earth imaginable - you want to torture the viable baby worse than Nazis and Stalinists combined but you are very very "concerned" that the baby, if born, will 
suffer "horrible pain" ( as if there are no narcotics and other methods to alleviate the pain in a newborn ) - and you want anybody to ever believe you have a heart?

that you don't have a brain is known a long time.
but you always pretend to have a heart and you have none.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 25, 2013)

Really
why stop with just end of life treatments to save the gov't money?

Why shouldn't the state tell women to have abortions of possible 'problem' children?
What somebody dying has less rights than some pregnant woman?


It would save the gov't money
As the reactionary left says "why pay for the welfare of those children"


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## BDBoop (Oct 25, 2013)

So true.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 25, 2013)

Vox said:


> oh, and how nice of our followers of Dr. mengele...



He who references Mengele  as with Hitler or Nazis  has lost the argument.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 26, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > oh, and how nice of our followers of Dr. mengele...
> ...



He who references no argument, has lost the argument.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Not spinning at all.  The Right Wing fought for years to get people executed for crimes they committed as children as young as that young lady was. 

I'm just not seeing it as a big deal because 1) The prosecutors at the time didn't and 2) the person involved doesn't.  

So we are still goign after this guy 40 years later because, why, he offends your sense of decorum? 




Zoom-boing said:


> [
> Stop spinning.
> 
> Back on topic .... unborn fetus are human beings. Abortion kills a human being.



No, they aren't.  

The only reason you started caring about "fetuses" is because women got fed up with men telling them what to do.  

The ironic thing is, you Pro-Lifers are the morons getting played. Do you really think the Koch Brothers give a fuck about abortion? Or Poor kids? Hell no. But they'll use your anger over it to get you to vote against your own economic interests.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> spinida bifida is an operable syndrome and has variable degrees of expression - some are absolutely normal kids after the operation, some have minor deficiencies.
> But you would murder them, right?
> ...



Okay, here's the thing. The only reason why the mother would feel pain is because you religous busy-bodies keep laying a guilt trip on her. 

The problem with your, "Let's do a C-section and see if it's okay" mentality is what if it isn't okay?  If you nuts won't let a woman have an abortion at 18 weeks, you aren't going to let they euthanize a fetus at 25 weeks.  

Again, here's a simple enough solution.  If you don't like abortions, don't have one, but otherwise, mind your own business.  

Sounds reasonable to me.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...


We both know progressives want all that is different killed.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 26, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > oh, and how nice of our followers of Dr. mengele...
> ...



It really bothers you when truthful comparisons are made doesn't it?


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> [
> We both know progressives want all that is different killed.



I think it's a matter of being more humane than to want something that is going to die slowly to be brought into this world. 

But at the end of the day, it's usually the parents' decision, not "progressives".  

I mean, you idiots all act like we've got the Abortion Mobile rolling down the street picking these women up. 

Uh, no. 

These women talk to their doctors and make an informed choice.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



No, it's a retarded comparison. 

Mengele tortured people at a prison camp. 

Women FREELY make the decision to end unwatned pregnancies, or pregnancies where the resulting children WOULD be severely deformed if they came to term. 

And here's the kicker.  91% of women who get a diagnosis of Down Syndrome or Tay-Sachs abort.  Including Conservative, Republican and Christian Women.   Put the rubber to the road, and those "Values" vanish pretty quickly.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



I find the act of infanticide a very good comparison with Nazi's I mean hell we all know you socialists have this need to KILL all you feel is UNWORTHY.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



I'm sure you do find that. 

But you didn't answer the question. 

Do you really think a woman who decides to end a pregnancy she probably wanted to be the equivlent of a Nazi?  

I mean, I could post pictures of what some of these kids look like, but the Mods would sanction me, so I won't.  But I would suggest you goodle images of "Spina Bifida" or "Brittle Bone Disease"... and then tell me how this God's plan and how anyone wanting to avoid inflicting this on their child is a "Nazi".  

Thankfully, I've never had to make a decision like this. I'd hope you'd never have to.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



In other words, Joe/Dr. Mengele wants to murder the babies cutting them in pieces no matter what - - and that is exactly what I had proven - you*, leftards, are the nazis of modern times.
*


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## Pauli007001 (Oct 26, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > oh, and how nice of our followers of Dr. mengele...
> ...



Godwin's law.
Developed by nazis to avoid being called nazis!!


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



It is not simply killed - they want them TORTURED and killed.
Cutting the baby into pieces while knowing she is suffering the unimaginable pain while there is an option of delivering the baby and if the baby has an untreatable condition - let that baby die humanly - including in the mothers hands - is not an option for the leftard nazis.
they want the baby to SUFFER.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Wow, I want to remind you of this every time you Conservatards complain that liberals act out of "emotion".  

Eggs aren't chickens
Acorns aren't Trees
Fetuses aren't "babies".


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



spina bifida or brittle bone disease does not mean that baby has to be tortured and cut in pieces so you can satisfy your sadistic needs, modern mengele.
some babies can be treated the others - can be let die in a human way with mother and family mourning them and not tortured and cut in pieces and disposed as a waste.

clearly, leftards are modern nazis.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> It is not simply killed - they want them TORTURED and killed.
> Cutting the baby into pieces while knowing she is suffering the unimaginable pain while there is an option of delivering the baby and if the baby has an untreatable condition - let that baby die humanly - including in the mothers hands - is not an option for the leftard nazis.
> they want the baby to SUFFER.



In 99% of abortions performed before 20 weeks, the abortion is performed before the pain receptors are even turned on. 

Fetuses Feel Pain at 20 Weeks, and 4 Other Anti-Abortion Myths | Mother Jones



> _Where does this premise for a 20-week abortion ban come from? In the debate on Tuesday, House members repeatedly cited the research of Dr. Kanwaljeet "Sunny" Anand, a University of Tennessee professor of pediatrics, anesthesiology, and neurobiology who has promoted the idea that 20 weeks post-conception is the point when a fetus begins to feel pain. His work, which has been the go-to resource for anti-abortion groups, was mentioned at least four times on the House floor. Citing Anand's findings, Rep. Virginia Foxx (R-N.C.) argued that "the baby responds the same way you and I respond to pain, by recoiling." She went on to claim that the pain of a fetus at 20 weeks is "possibly more intense than that felt by older newborns."
> 
> But Anand is an outlier. A 2005 paper in the Journal of the American Medical Association surveyed the medical literature and found little evidence to support his conclusions. There is an established body of evidence that finds that fetuses start developing the biological pathways related to pain sensation at this stage of gestation, but there is not enough evidence to suggest that they can actually experience pain as we do. The majority of the scientific literature on the subject finds that the brain connections required to feel pain are not formed until at least 24 weeks._




In short, this is another lie to try to scare women away from abortion.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I never said that - I do not consider leftards to have any emotions - and you demonstrate it very well - torture and cut the baby into pieces no matter how painful it is for her - because it is MY CONVENIENCE, which is at stake.

Modern nazis as you clearly demonstrate will dispose of any "human material" ( regardless of age, race, ethnic background or class) which they deem necessary - for the well being of the state - exactly as Nazis did.

you have just proven my point.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Actually, most abortion methods are pretty quick, and are performed before pain receptors are even active.  

And making a woman have a baby that is going to die in horrible pain or worse, live in horrible pain, is pretty much more sadistic than anything Mengele ever would have come up with.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> I never said that - I do not consider leftards to have any emotions - and you demonstrate it very well - torture and cut the baby into pieces no matter how painful it is for her - because it is MY CONVENIENCE, which is at stake.
> 
> ...



Women who are having late abortions aren't doing it for "convenience... they are doing it because something HAS gone horribly wrong.  You ghouls like to fixate on this group of abortions because the fetus looks almost like a baby (if you ignore the horrible deformities and ignore scale) and you think it makes your point.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



These poor children
Such decisions should be in the hands of the state
These children would cost the state a lot of money


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...




In short, this is another lie to try to scare women away from abortion.[/QUOTE]

That is a LIE.

babies start to feel pain extremely early  and that is why the fetal surgery involves fetal anesthesia.
If the baby in utero does not feel pain - as modern nazis want you to believe - why should anesthesia to the fetus being provided?


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Guy, where is the "State" even involved here?  Seriously, man, if you aren't going to even have an honest debate, what's the point.  

the VERY FEW Late abortions performed in this country are performed because a woman and her doctor decided to do so after some abnormality is discovered.  

Where do you even get "the State" out of that equation?  Unless you are some kind of absolute paranoid loon.... Oh, wait, I forgot who I was talking to.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> That is a LIE.
> 
> ...



Mostly to keep it flopping around while it's being cut on.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



there is absolutely no reason to have "late abortion" - the woman can have an emergency c-section. and if the baby has inborn problems which can be corrected - they will be corrected, if the problems are incompatible with life - the baby will die, humanely, with the family around, not tortured and cut in pieces.
Why the heck do you want that baby to suffer so tremendously?

Late abortion is a torture and a painful murder to the baby - plus it is an extremely dangerous operation for the woman - way more dangerous than c-section.
yet you insist on this barbaric method, which is absolutely not necessary and is not being performed in the vast majority of the civilized countries.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



you idiot, the baby is not flopping around if the cutting is not painful

you clearly are a nazi.

and an uneducated one, on top of that


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> there is absolutely no reason to have "late abortion" - the woman can have an emergency c-section. and if the baby has inborn problems which can be corrected - they will be corrected, if the problems are incompatible with life - the baby will die, humanely, with the family around, not tortured and cut in pieces.
> Why the heck do you want that baby to suffer so tremendously?
> ...



So you want these babies to die horribly over long periodsd of time, and you consider yourself "humane"?  Seriously?  

The reason why they aren't peformed in most civilized countries is most civilized countries have universal health care and these problems are addressed a lot earlier.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

.Giuntini, 2007, *It has also been shown that fetuses feel pain from week 18. This has given rise to the practice of using fetal anesthesia for surgery or invasive diagnostic procedures in utero.*

    L. Giuntini & G. Amato, Analgesic Procedures in Newborns., in NEONATAL PAIN 73 (Giuseppe Buonocore & Carlo V. Bellieni ed., 2007).

. Van de Velde, 2005, p.256, col.2, para.2, Therefore, it has been suggested that pain relief has to be provided during in utero interventions on the fetus from mid-gestation (20 weeks) on.32-34

    Van de Velde M, Van Schoubroeck DV, Lewi LE, Marcus MAE, Jani JC, Missant C, Teunkens A, Deprest J.  Remifentanil for Fetal Immobilization and Maternal Sedation During Fetoscopic Surgery: A Randomized, Double-Blind Comparison with Diazepam.  Anesthesia & Analgesia. 101 (2005) 251-258.

    32Giannakoulopoulos X, Sepulveda W, Kourtis P, Glover V, Fisk NM. Fetal plasma cortisol and &#946;-endorphin response to intrauterine needling Lancet. 344 (1994) 77-81.

    33Giannakoulopoulos X, Teixeira J, Fisk N. Human fetal and maternal noradrenaline responses to invasive procedures. Pediatric Research. 45 (1999) 494-499.

    34Anand KJS, Maze M. Fetuses, fentanyl, and the stress response. Anesthesiology.  95 (2001) 823-825.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



these babies do not "die horribly" - they die in a humane way if they can not be treated.

And you want these babies to be tortured and barbarically murdered just for your own convenience - where it has been PROVEN SCIENTIFICALLY that babies in utero can feel pain - and are being tortured by abortion - just because you do not want to 'see" them.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 26, 2013)

The reactionary left thinks it should be left in 
the hands of experts








The majority of Americans believe in limits on late term abortions
allowing for the life of the mother.

Only the most extreme, don't


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> these babies do not "die horribly" - they die in a humane way if they can not be treated.
> 
> And you want these babies to be tortured and barbarically murdered just for your own convenience - where it has been PROVEN SCIENTIFICALLY that babies in utero can feel pain - and are being tortured by abortion - just because you do not want to 'see" them.



Actually, the Scientists are in disagreement when fetuses feel pain.  Some say they don't until the 24th week.  


(See above.) 

And frankly, what I want is for you Anti-Abortionists to go away, because you are a bunch of stupid tools who help get idiots elected.  

You are no closer to your goals than you were 40 years ago. And you never spend a minute wondering about the irony of that. 

in the  meantime, you've managed to destroy the middle class and probably cause MORE abortions to happen.


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



13 is not a 'young lady'.  13 is a child.  Period.  26 is not a child.  26 is an adult.  Period.

The fact that you don't see a 43 year old man drugging up, sexually forcing himself and sodomizing a 13 year old as a 'big deal' tells me all I need to know about you.  

You brought Polanski into the discussion. And Trayvon Martin. 

Where do you come up with this shit?  

Koch Brothers?  wtf?


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



The goal being 
putting abortion in a place that the majority of Americans support

A lot closer
36 states have bans on late-term abortions 

13 states prohibit abortion after a certain number of weeks' gestation (usually 24, additional test
required if viability is in question) 

9 states have laws that require a second physician to be present during late-term abortion procedures in order to treat a fetus if born alive

As you can see the extreme leftist position is a loser


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



the "above" are NOT scientists - the above is a political body whose opinions are irrelevant to the science. AMA was also supporting obamacare, contrary to the opinion of most doctors and researchers of the field. AMA has monetary dependency on the government decisions as the federal government allowed AMA to be the monopolist for the coding business - and that is hundreds of millions of dollars annually - so AMA is not going to oppose whatever the government wants - ever.

babies in utero can feel pain even as early as 7 or 10th week gestational age - as nociceptive receptors are fully developed by that time, but at that stage of fetal development it is extremely difficult to PROVE experimentally that they do feel pain.

*It has been PROVEN experimentally that babies feel pain in utero at 18 weeks gestational age - PROVEN, not speculated - and there are many signs that the babies feel pain much earlier than that.*

But for the ghouls like you - it is CONVENIENT to spread the lie of babies in utero "not feeling pain" as in this way you can dumb down more stupid vaginas to be under governmental control forever.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



it is barbaric and not supported anywhere else in the world except the US - after 22 weeks gestational age abortions are almost never performed anywhere in Europe - the very procedure is not even KNOWN in some countries and physicians would feel offended if anybody suggest they should barbarically dismember a totally viable baby in uterus, because the woman feels like it. If there is any reason for termination of pregnancy at that stage - it is done either by inducing the normal labor or ( much more often) - by emergency c-section - to save the baby, if possible.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 26, 2013)

The lefts heroes are Mao, Che, Lenin, and Stalin all mass murderers. Is it any wonder why they love abortions?


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 26, 2013)

The left is a culture of death


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> The lefts heroes are Mao, Che, Lenin, and Stalin all mass murderers. Is it any wonder why they love abortions?



abortion is the means of control over the populace.
so you have to desensitize people and lie, lie, lie, that the baby in utero is just a "cluster of cells", that the baby does not experience pain and you can cut her in pieces without any remorse for your convenience, that the late term abortion is safe procedure for the mother, that the woman does not have any complications after abortions, because it is a benign procedure - ALL lies.

but repeated constantly by all the goebbels soldiers eventually makes the ignorant populace ( or at least part of it) believe the lies.


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## TemplarKormac (Oct 26, 2013)

LOL. 

Joe just had his ass handed to him. Vox is now my hero for the day.


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## mamooth (Oct 26, 2013)

Vox said:


> It has been PROVEN experimentally that babies feel pain in utero at 18 weeks gestational age - PROVEN, not speculated - and there are many signs that the babies feel pain much earlier than that.



Pure steaming bullshit. You're just making crap up, because you know jack about the actual science. But then, you're a pro-lifer, so that's a given. People who know the science become pro-choice.

I'll help you out. Plants show a stress response to injury, but that doesn't mean plants feel pain. Feeling pain requires a working conscious brain. 

And I'd tell you when that happens, but I find it more amusing to watch you flail about and make more stuff up.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 26, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > It has been PROVEN experimentally that babies feel pain in utero at 18 weeks gestational age - PROVEN, not speculated - and there are many signs that the babies feel pain much earlier than that.
> ...



Why do you support infanticide?


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## mamooth (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> I find the act of infanticide a very good comparison with Nazi's I mean hell we all know you socialists have this need to KILL all you feel is UNWORTHY.



You understand you're mentally ill, right?

What, has no one informed of that before?

Consider this to be your intervention. You need help. As do most of the pro-lifers on this thread. Y'all just aren't right in the head.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 26, 2013)

Speaking of....

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv1afKaLhA]Planned Parenthood endorses post-birth abortion - YouTube[/ame]


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> [
> 
> 13 is not a 'young lady'.  13 is a child.  Period.  26 is not a child.  26 is an adult.  Period.
> 
> ...



Yeah, I know like most puppets you don't know who pulls your strings... 

No one calls 26 a "child"... they merely state that until you are 26, you can stay on your parents plan.. which is a pretty good deal, actually.  

yeah, when that 13 year old says, "I don't see what all the fuss was about", I guess I have to wonder what all the fuss was about.  

Boy, you Funditards are probably the dumbest people on the planet.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 26, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> [
> 
> The goal being
> putting abortion in a place that the majority of Americans support
> ...



Since no one actually has abortions after 20 weeks unless something has gone wrong, it's not a big deal. 

It's even less of a big deal, as that law is pretty much unenforcable.  Only look at Gosnell's prosecution, where they whittled down hundreds of charges to just 3.   And that guy was a complete fuckup.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Of course thats not the goal of the right, to ban abortion  they couldnt care less about saving babies.

Its about empowering the state at the expense of individual liberty, compelling citizens to abide by their subjective morality, and undermining the rule of law.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 26, 2013)

The reactionary left is on the extreme of abortion.


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## Zoom-boing (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > 13 is not a 'young lady'.  13 is a child.  Period.  26 is not a child.  26 is an adult.  Period.
> ...



Dems do! 


> How to get coverage for adult children


 - https://www.healthcare.gov/can-i-keep-my-child-on-my-insurance-until-age-26/




> yeah, when that 13 year old says, "I don't see what all the fuss was about", I guess I have to wonder what all the fuss was about.



Jesus, you don't find anything wrong with a 43 year old having sex with a 13 year old?  What a sick bastard.  Guess you missed where she also said this:  "Geimer testified that Polanski provided champagne that they shared as well as part of a quaalude,[15] and despite her protests, he performed oral, vaginal, and anal sex acts upon her,[16][17] each time after being told 'no' and being asked to stop."; "Geimer has insisted that the sex was non-consensual"; "Geimer sued Polanski in 1988, alleging sexual assault, intentional infliction of emotional distress and seduction"; "In a 2003 interview,[13] Samantha Geimer said, "Straight up, what he did to me was wrong."; "decades of publicity as well as the prosecutor's focus on lurid details continues to traumatize her and her family." 

_He raped her.  _


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



yes it is a big deal. there is no reason to have an abortion after 20 weeks, but a c-section.
If you are human, not dr. mengele.


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

mamooth said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > It has been PROVEN experimentally that babies feel pain in utero at 18 weeks gestational age - PROVEN, not speculated - and there are many signs that the babies feel pain much earlier than that.
> ...



you idiot vagina with vocal cords - I provided links that it has been PROVEN. 

but all you want is to murder the innocent children and murder them by torturing - cutting to pieces when they experience excruciating pain.

abort nazi like yourself would gladly murder babies postnatal as well


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## Vox (Oct 26, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



because she is a vagina with vocal cords, not a human being.


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## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

mamooth said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > I find the act of infanticide a very good comparison with Nazi's I mean hell we all know you socialists have this need to KILL all you feel is UNWORTHY.
> ...



So in your mind a person who thinks infanticide is sick practice makes me mentally ill? You truly are a evil person.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> yes it is a big deal. there is no reason to have an abortion after 20 weeks, but a c-section.
> If you are human, not dr. mengele.



Actually, surviability at 20 weeks is ZERO.  

Surviability at 21 weeks is ZERO. 

At 23 weeks, it's 17%.  

the insanity that you are going to cut a fetus out of a woman to make her watch it die anyway is really the kind of mad science Dr. Mengele would have liked.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> [qu
> 
> Jesus, you don't find anything wrong with a 43 year old having sex with a 13 year old?  What a sick bastard.  Guess you missed where she also said this:  "Geimer testified that Polanski provided champagne that they shared as well as part of a quaalude,[15] and despite her protests, he performed oral, vaginal, and anal sex acts upon her,[16][17] each time after being told 'no' and being asked to stop."; "Geimer has insisted that the sex was non-consensual"; "Geimer sued Polanski in 1988, alleging sexual assault, intentional infliction of emotional distress and seduction"; "In a 2003 interview,[13] Samantha Geimer said, "Straight up, what he did to me was wrong."; "decades of publicity as well as the prosecutor's focus on lurid details continues to traumatize her and her family."
> 
> _He raped her.  _



When the 13 year old's m other is pimping her out, no, I don't think that's a big deal.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > [qu
> ...



I hope you never have kids for their sake.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Well, here's the thing.  If I did, I wouldn't take a bunch of money to leave one alone with a lecherous movie director, which is exactly what this girl's mother did.  

Which is why the prosecutor said, "Meh, no big deal" and decided to go for probation.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


So you advocate abusing kids if they are not killed in utero. Like I said you are a sick fuck.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



This girl and her mother knew EXACTLY what they were doing.  This was an extortion plan from the get-go.  

Roman Polanski rape victim now takes less horrified view - Hot Topics



> But Geimer, now 50 and author of a just-released autobiography called The Girl: My Life in the Shadow of Roman Polanski, told the Today Show this week that she didnt consider the incident as horrific as seemingly everyone else did.
> 
> How do I feel about him? I hope he is well, she says on the show. I was 13, that makes it rape. But I didnt experience it that way. In my mind, I didnt know that was illegal. I didnt understand he could go to jail for it. I was young.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



so?
*what has survivability at 20 weeks to do with the baby feeling excruciating pain in utero when being cut to pieces?*
c-section spares that pain. and there is never a dire need to perform an abortion at 20 weeks and not to wait to 25 or even 30 to perform a c-section and give a baby higher chances for survival.

if one is not dr. mengele, obviously, one understands that there is absolutely no reason to torture the baby to pieces in utero instead of delivering the baby via c-section


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Frankly, you haven't demonstrated to me that a fetus feels pain at 20 weeks. 

This is a decision that should be made by a woman and her doctor... 

NOT a bunch of religious idiots trying to impose their bronze age superstitions on the rest of us.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Or gov't bureaucrats
even if the woman wants to keep the baby

we can't have some sickly kid costing the gov't money


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Or gov't bureaucrats
> even if the woman wants to keep the baby
> 
> we can't have some sickly kid costing the gov't money



Please point out where the govenrment has ever coerced a woman into having an abortion. 

Thanks.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Not saying they did

but they should
don't you agree


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Not saying they did
> 
> but they should
> don't you agree



No, not really. 

I think that this decision should be between a woman and her doctor, and I've said this pretty consistantly all along.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

So the state should decide end of life issues
but not these where a birth defect could cost the state money 
in the long run. 

Seems inconsistent


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> So the state should decide end of life issues
> but not these where a birth defect could cost the state money
> in the long run.
> 
> Seems inconsistent



When did anyone say the state should decide "end of life" issues?  

Guy, you are setting up straw men to knock down because you aren't winning the argument at hand.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

In another post thread
you seemed to agree with the concept of the state
denying medical care for terminal ill or coma patients, against the person or family wishes

So what is different?




Oh yes
I forgot you are one of those posters that likes to claim or imply they always won
in some way. 

Straw man
not at all , avoidance on your part sure
easy question


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> In another post thread
> you seemed to agree with the concept of the state
> denying medical care for terminal ill or coma patients, against the person or family wishes
> 
> ...



First, can you produce that thread and point out EXACTLY what I said. 

Second, refusing to pay for a treatment is not the same as the state euthanizing someone.  Most medical plans don't pay for quack treatments desperate people want.  

So please, please, please keep beating that straw man.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Well, if didn't so sorry

So
You do agree with denying end of life/coma care
but don't want the state to require abortions for birth defects?

Again no straw man
easy question that you seem to avoid

If you makes you feel better
we can just say later that you "won"


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Well, if didn't so sorry
> 
> So
> You do agree with denying end of life/coma care
> ...



No, I don't think that end of life care should be denied, and by the way, Medicare largely doesn't.   11% of Medical spending in the US is on treatments for terminally ill people who are going to die regardless of their treatment.   So no one is denying anyone anything. 

But you keep beating that straw man of something no one actually said, about a subject that is completely irrelevent to the issue at hand.  

Yes or no, if a WOMAN and HER DOCTOR conclude that abortion is the best course of treatment, then no one else should be involved, correct?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Avoiding it does make it a straw man

Considering that I have posted that I tend to be more Libertarian than not
I will answer your question



But, it is only correct and proper to answer my first
Should that state require abortions in cases where the birth defects would
be too costly to the state, in the long run?
(imagine a question on abortion in a abortion thread)

thanks


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Avoiding it does make it a straw man
> 
> Considering that I have posted that I tend to be more Libertarian than not
> I will answer your question
> ...



No, it should not.  That decision should be up to the woman and her doctor.  

I will go even further. We should have single payer health insurance and if a woman chooses to keep her child, the government should provide for its medical care.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Thanks for the answer

I agree that the decision for any medical decision should
be between a person and their doctor without the state 
determining the allocation of resources.  Sadly, the left's insistence 
on gov't intrusion in the market will necessitate the gov't making such
decisions on death and birth. Most on the left choose to hide from that reality or
are comfortable with the likes of the idiots who planned the Papa Obamacare website making
decisions for us.

To answer your question
As a Libertarian I believe most things should be legal for adults
abortion, drugs, gambling etc. It is your god-given right to go 
to hell. I really don't care. However, I should not have to pay for it nor
would I advocate for one to do them. I personally find the procedure 
of abortion, in most cases(not rape incest etc), outside saving the life of a mother to be morally reprehensible 


By the way, for the left to be legally consistent a non-married man
should have the legal right to not pay for a child if they are willing to give up
all legal claim to the minor and assets of the minor. Since the man
has no choice in her aborting or not, they should not be indebted to their decision. 
Just like the Left would not want a man, even if married, making the decision for 
a women. After all why should he be "punished" with a child or for just having sex.
Why should we push our morality on them.

With abortion, like the majority of Americans, 
I agree in limits on late term abortions where the fetus is healthy
and there is no danger to the mother.

I do not choose the radical view of groups on the left like
planned parenthood


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > [qu
> ...



The mother def had a screw loose and should have been shot for allowing her 13 year old to be alone with Polanski.  I mean really, wtf??  That aside -- a 43 year old man drugged and sexually assaulted and sodomized a 13 year old child.  No matter how that 13 year old 'feels' about it, he raped her (she even says this in interviews as an adult.)

And not one peep from you about the complete and total wrongness of what he did.

Sick.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Polanski
was a scum

The left is always making excuses for these perverts
like Polanski and Woody Allen


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



frankly if you just LIE that something has not been demonstrated and it has been - it is possible only to prove it when you can be shoveled back in time to 20 weeks gestational age in your mothers womb and get in there with the utensils - and cut few of your toes - then you might get the proof under your skin - because lying idiots like you feel only when it gets to you. 

it is NOT a matter between the doctor and a woman - it is a murder and a torturous one and if there is anything suddenly going wrong at 18-20 weeks ( which medically wise can happen only to the baby - the midgestation is not the most risky time for the mother) the preterm labor should be considered, not the abortion.
abortion should never happen, but if there is any real risk to the mothers life - after 18 weeks of gestation the delivering of the baby can be done by c-section - in order to prevent the torturous death of the baby. the baby won't survive at 18-20 weeks, but at least it won't be tortured.

If you are human, not dr. mengele


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Here's the thing.  This was not the girl's first time having sex.  

Too young? Absolutely.  But it was really a different time.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> frankly if you just LIE that something has not been demonstrated and it has been - it is possible only to prove it when you can be shoveled back in time to 20 weeks gestational age in your mothers womb and get in there with the utensils - and cut few of your toes - then you might get the proof under your skin - because lying idiots like you feel only when it gets to you.
> 
> ...



Again, forcing a woman to have a deformed baby to please your invisible sky man, and then slicing her open to get it out.  

That's just crazy talk.  

Again- only two people who should be involved- a woman and her doctor.   

Period.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



don't invent things.
a woman can deliver a baby, deformed, or not, via c-section, not inflict terrible pain on that innocent baby just because she does not want to see her.

incredible selfishness which you have demonstrated all over this thread is not the reason to torture an innocent human being for your convenience.
If the woman decides to terminate pregnancy after 18 week - a poven gestational age when the baby feels the pain 100% - she can do it through preterm labor or c-section.

No abortion or torture of the innocent baby at this gestational age. a doctor has nothing to do here - it should be the law. and it will be, as it is everywhere else, except this barbaric ( in this dimension) country.

PERIOD.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> don't invent things.
> a woman can deliver a baby, deformed, or not, via c-section, not inflict terrible pain on that innocent baby just because she does not want to see her.
> ...



*FETUSES ARE NOT BABIES!!!!!*

Done.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

even at 8 months 29 days?


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> even at 8 months 29 days?



wouldn't know.  

No one has an abortion at that point, do they? 

Actually, very few women have abortions at 20 weeks, for all Vox's whining, and the ones who do have DAMNED GOOD REASONS.  

Much like the pro-Choice side going on about Rape, (Less than 1% of all abortions performed), the Pro-Life side going on about late abortions because they almost look like babies if you ignore scale, the reality is, most abortions are performed on women between 8-12 weeks who happily spread their legs to concieve.  

Now, if you really want to see less of that, there's ways to do that.  Better sex education, better availability of contraception, better support of workers rights and paid family and medical leave.  

That would involve more government, although not as much government as you would need to force a woman to have  c-section to deliver a deformed baby she didn't want...


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

so 8 months then


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> so 8 months then



Again- what the woman and her doctor thinks is appropriate...


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Well the question is based on your statement 
"FETUSES ARE NOT BABIES!!!!!"

is it first breath
first day at school
when does the fetus become a human being for you?


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...


*
YES, THEY ARE - FETUSES AND EMBRYOS ARE HUMAN BABIES AT DIFFERENT STAGE OF DEVELOPMENT.*

period.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > so 8 months then
> ...



*no, it is NOT.

at 8 months whatever woman thinks is IRRELEVANT - the doctor is OBLIGED by the Hippocratic oath to deliver the baby - via usual birth or c-section*


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Somewhere in the country is a woman with self respect hurry liberals you  must now abuse her of this  and tell her she is only a vagina and the only choice she has is to kill her babies


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> YES, THEY ARE - FETUSES AND EMBRYOS ARE HUMAN BABIES AT DIFFERENT STAGE OF DEVELOPMENT.
> 
> period.



Show us the law where it states that a fetus is a person.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Ridiculous.  

Banning abortion is the least effective way to end the practice. 

Abortion is a complex, difficult problem that cant be solved at the ballot box or in the courts. 

If you want to see abortion continue and likely spread underground, unregulated and unchecked, then ban it.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



What woman would have an elective abortion at 8 months?


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > YES, THEY ARE - FETUSES AND EMBRYOS ARE HUMAN BABIES AT DIFFERENT STAGE OF DEVELOPMENT.
> ...



Do you get sexually aroused thinking about abortions or something? You seem very  fanatic about unborn babies being killed


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > YES, THEY ARE - FETUSES AND EMBRYOS ARE HUMAN BABIES AT DIFFERENT STAGE OF DEVELOPMENT.
> ...



a high school biology class states that.

but you are too dumb to know that.

are you a high-school dropout?

no wonder you are so dumb.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Again, show me a law where it states that a fetus is a person.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Still talking out of your ass I see


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



she is. she is clearly obsessed with murder in utero and hates children altogether - just to remind the thread about that pregnant idiot weightlifter - there this aussie unsatisfied vagina with vocal cords showed all her hatred


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



There used to be  laws that black people were property what does that say about laws?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



My biology class dealt in facts, not emotions.

Show me a law which states a fetus is a person or shut the fuck up.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



it starts with banning it. then the ways how to avoid criminal abortions can be discussed.
not when we have murder in utero frenzy like in this country


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Lifers have only two arguments:

1. That's exactly what Hitler thought

and

2. Blacks weren't considered people once

Black people and slaves have nothing to do with a fetus, do they?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> it starts with banning it. then the ways how to avoid criminal abortions can be discussed.
> not when we have murder in utero frenzy like in this country



How do you determine that a woman has had an abortion then? Do you examine every woman each month to check if she's pregnant?


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



listen, unsatisfied vagina with vocal cords, go get finally laid, so your unfulfilled desires are not sublimated in the death desires against innocent babies.

Don't forget to use birth control, though


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

You can't show me a law, can you?


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



I guess she will consider it emotions and her history class did not deal with emotions


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> You can't show me a law, can you?



I don't have to show you anything.

your brain is too small to discuss serious matters - because everything in your cranium is occupied by vagina mentality, so STFU and piss off


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



No, we knew what the difference was between someone who was born and something that was residing in someone else's body.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > You can't show me a law, can you?
> ...



You made the claim that a fetus is a person, you need to back it up, or you lose the argument.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



somebody being born or not being born does not change anything - a baby inside woman's body is as human a person as is that woman.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> You can't show me a law, can you?



Dummy do you need a law to tell you're human? Or as close to it as a raving lunatic liberal can get


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

loser unsatisfied vagina with vocal cords is surrendering and negging - what else is new


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > You can't show me a law, can you?
> ...



well, one can show her a law where a murder of a pregnant woman results in the charges filed for 2 murders - so an unborn baby is a person - as in Lacy Petersen case, but if she would have something more between the ears except vagina - she would already know that


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 27, 2013)

If conservatives truly wanted to end abortion, theyd find a solution that doesnt violate citizens civil liberties.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



No it isn't.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Fetal homicide laws do not state a fetus is a person. If it was, women who have abortions at 8 weeks would be charged with murder.
Why aren't they?


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



no, I do not.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> You can't show me a law, can you?



He cannot. 

As no such law exists.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



yes she is - a baby inside the woman's body is as human as is that woman.

and a person.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > You can't show me a law, can you?
> ...



yes, it does. the one which Lacy petersen husband was charged with


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



If its a person then show me the law that proves it.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Fetal homicide laws have never applied to abortion.

Try again.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> If conservatives truly wanted to end abortion, theyd find a solution that doesnt violate citizens civil liberties.



You have a civil liberty to kill someone what f****** country do you live in ?


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > If conservatives truly wanted to end abortion, theyd find a solution that doesnt violate citizens civil liberties.
> ...



A fetus is not a 'someone'.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > You can't show me a law, can you?
> ...



I didn't know people need laws ti tell them they are human. Of course I am speaking ti liberals the same people who invented the kkk.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Not yet.

they will be.

black people were considered property at some point of time as well.

so - try again


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



So it is only human if it isn't the mother killing the baby?


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



a human being or a baby inside the woman's body is a legal person and one can be prosecuted for killing that baby, even if they did not killed the mother - as Ariel castro was.

so that baby is not "someone" - she is a defined person


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Sadly, for the Democrats, they allow only the politician with the most extreme views on this
subject, act as their spokesperson - pitting them against the majority of Americans

For example

Papa Obama, as a state senator, fought a law that would have protected live infants accidentally delivered during an abortion. 
Senator Barbara Boxer once said that constitutional rights begin when you bring the baby home from the hospital.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Slaves have nothing to do with abortion.

Oh wait, yes they do - you lot want to make women into slaves.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



Even at 8 months and 15 days


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



PROVE a fetus is a legal person then!!!

I am still waiting!


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Not until it is born and has taken a breath.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



slaves were not considered human and people and persons by law, although unborn babies ARE considered human and persons in some cases of the law - so extension it to all cases will be much easier.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Well the descendants of slaves have something to do with abortion


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



The only people doing that two women are you and your kind


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



You already did that


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



In your personal, subjective opinion, not as a fact of law. 

Consequently, the courts have wisely left that determination to each individual to make in accordance with ones own good conscience, free from interference by the state. 

This is also a fundamental tenet of traditional conservative political dogma  that the individual knows best, as opposed to government; if the government mustnt dictate to individuals whether they should have healthcare or not, or whether or not one may own a certain type of firearm, so too is the government ill-equipped to dictate to a citizen whether or not she may bear a child. 

The inconsistency of the social right is the bane of traditional conservatism.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



So at 8 months 29 days 23 hours and 59 minutes 
if a women wants abortion for no medical reason to herself
or the "fetus" - that is ok with you


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



since the baby is conceived - she is a person by law.

if you attempt to induce an abortion even at few weeks of gestational age - you will face criminal charges - and rightfully so:

Baby Dies After Man Allegedly Tricks Girlfriend Into Taking an Abortion Pill | Video | TheBlaze.com

Welden could face life behind bars without parole if he is found guilty of murder under the Protection of Unborn Children Act, a federal statute.

here you go - a federal LAW


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



look, this abortion nazi vagina would murder babies in the fifth trimester , so talking reason to her is useless


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...




November 12, 2004 - Peterson is found guilty of 1st degree murder for Laci's death and 2nd degree murder for son Conner's death. 

She was still pregnant with Conner at the time of her murder


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



No, you didn't. You brought up fetal homicide laws, which don't apply to abortion.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Fetal homicide laws do not apply to abortion.

Try again.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



No woman would ever have an abortion that late. Stop pretending they do.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



He is in trouble because he caused an abortion without his girlfriends permission. That's assault, and bodily harm. It isn't murder, because no one was murdered.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Wrong.  

You confuse civil law (substantive due process) concerning privacy rights, with criminal law (procedural due process) concerning murder  they are not the same.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Your questions states
Prove a fetus is a legal person

In Conner's case, a fetus, they were a legal person
I answered the question


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Lifers are so stupid sometimes. The intelligent ones appear to have left this thread.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



We are talking about all fetus's, not just one fetus.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...




The point is that law does allow at times 
for fetuses to be considered, legally, people.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



it is the law. there is even the federal statute which I just posted in the previous post.'

all it take is change the angle of the discussion in the abortion - from idiotic "privacy" which has nothing to do with privacy to the reality of murder.

If there are already the laws which protect the unborn children - that task is even easier.

and it will be achieved.
in time. it is inevitable.

It would be even faster eliminated from the other end - when rvw passed in 1973 the vast majority of the abortions was performed by physicians - and today very small amount of physicians are willing to do it or provide any additional care for it - so are nurses and techs.
People know that they participate in the murder - unlike the stupid brainwashed public - they see what they are doing.
It is already an unspoken truth that the self-respecting doctors won't do it.
you can go through 4 year residency in OB/GYN and never perform it - and this is GOOD.

It will take time. But it will be recognized as it is - a murder of an innocent baby.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Lifers are so stupid sometimes. The intelligent ones appear to have left this thread.



defensive


----------



## Noomi (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



But not when applied to abortion, which is the point I have been making all along.


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## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



and that bridge will eventually be used legally as well


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## thanatos144 (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



You deathers always squirm so much when proven wrong


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



How about botched abortions

Dr. Kermit Gosnell was sentenced on Wednesday to life in prison without parole for the murder of a baby born alive in a botched abortion, who prosecutors said would have survived if the doctor had not &#8220;snipped&#8221; its neck with scissors.


Based on what you are saying
his mistake must have been letting it breath


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Also wrong. 

*Her* murder. 

Not that of a fetus. 

In the context of criminal law, the illegal act was carried out against the pregnant woman, the charge concerning the fetus stems from that illegal act. 

With regard to abortion, however, there is no outside violent act against the pregnant woman, as prior to viability and birth, her rights are paramount. See:_ Planned Parenthood v. Casey_ (1992).


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

Actually under that law, if he say stabbed her then she lived but the "fetus" did not
he could still be charged 

Cal. Penal Code § 187 (a) defines murder as the unlawful killing of a human being or a fetus with malice aforethought.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



no, it is right.

it is a base for the inevitable change.

if the same person is considered person in one instance - and not a person in the other - that is a conflict. 

and that conflict will be resolved.

the same conflict exists in some in the medical world - and they are TALKING about it - it is the start to the change.
and it is long overdue


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Actually under that law, if he say stabbed her then she lived but the "fetus" did not
> he could still be charged



of course.

ariel castro was charged with murder of the baby he forced to be aborted, although the woman is alive

the florida man who tricked his girlfriend into taking some pills which killed the baby - is charged with murder and could face life in prison.


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



He was charged with TWO MURDERS - her and the unborn baby

Scott Lee Peterson (born October 24, 1972) *is a man convicted of murdering his wife, Laci Peterson, and their unborn son in Modesto, California in 2002. *


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 27, 2013)

It is interesting to see the radical left work so hard
to dehumanize something

Must be guilt


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv1afKaLhA"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv1afKaLhA[/ame]


----------



## Vox (Oct 27, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



it is a murder of an innocent baby and he is charged with murder, not with bodily harm( you wish ), dumbo.

read the link


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 27, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



So if she had been a virgin it would have been rape but because she'd had sex before, it was no big deal?  What kind of fruit loop logic is that??  Wow.

wtF???  He raped her.  You refuse to condemn him for it you just keep making excuses for what he did.

Sick.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> it is a murder of an innocent baby and he is charged with murder, not with bodily harm( you wish ), dumbo.
> 
> read the link



The Blaze is a conservative website that deals in right wing bullshit, and not proper legal terms.

He is being charged because he caused the girlfriend to miscarry - he forced her to abort the pregnancy without her consent. 

Those laws do NOT apply to women who make a decision to abort.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 28, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Of course not, but lets be honest. The girl was 13, she had experience in taking drugs and getting drunk, and she had been sexually active for some time. She was a 13 year old whore. No offense, but lets call her what she was.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Well the question is based on your statement
> "FETUSES ARE NOT BABIES!!!!!"
> 
> is it first breath
> ...



The same time it does in the eyes of the law. 

When it's born.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



Okay, you keep telling yourself that.   Real world, Doctors do what they and the patient consider appropriate.  

I'll bet you are one of these nutters who cheered when Dr. Tiller was murdered in his church.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Possibly one who found that the fetus was going to have some horrible abnormality like Brittle Bone Syndrome that got missed on an earlier visit because her doctor got her degree in some Eastern European country.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Last time I checked, HS Biology classes aren't the law.  

The law is that abortion is legal up to the 24th week under _Roe v. Wade_, and after the 24th week under _Doe v. Boland _if the doctor determines there's a good reason.


----------



## Gracie (Oct 28, 2013)




----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Not at all.  

Maybe you need to educate yourself on Abortion in the Philippines.  Because they are a Catholic country, they'd done exactly what you nutters have said.  Despite that, 500,000 to 800,000 abortions are performed a year in the ROP.  

Legal Updates and free legal information Family Code Philippines: Laws, facts and statistics on abortions in the Philippines



> [1] In 2005, there were some 400,000 to 500,000 abortions in the Philippines. The World Health Organization estimate puts the figure at nearly 800,000, one of the highest rates of unsafe abortions in Asia.
> 
> [2] Seventy percent of unwanted pregnancies in the Philippines end in abortion, according to the WHO. Pro-Life Philippines, an anti-abortion group, says that one of four pregnancies in the Philippines end in abortion.
> 
> [3] According to the Department of Health, nearly 100,000 women who have unsafe abortions every year end up in the hospital.



Hey, but maybe they aren't trying hard enough.  Let's look at what Romania did. 

On abortion, we should study Romanian history | Ann Furedi | Comment is free | theguardian.com

Yup, a Communist country wasn't able to effectively ban abortion.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



If you want to use Gosnell as your example of your wet dream of the day you get to prosecute doctors for performing them, it's not particularly good case law.  

Gosnell only came to the law's attention because he killed an adult patient and was dealing drugs.   And because he was too dumb to dispose of the medical waste.  But even then, the prosecutors went from charging he had killed "hundreds" of babies down to just 7.  The judge threw out 3 of those, and the jury threw out another.  So you got it down to three fetuses, two of whom Gosnell didn't touch. (The people who did got sweetheart deals for less time served.) 

Then after all that money and time wasted, they dropped the death penalty charges on the promise he not appeal the verdict to someone who can actually read a law book. (Mind you, the guy was 72 years old and already going away for the drugs and malpractice.)  

Second point.  If the death of those fetuses was "Murder", why weren't ANY of the women involved charged.  If Gosnell and his associates were the hit men, those women were the contractees.    Yet not a single one of these women were charged.  

In fact, even before Roe v. Wade, women were never charged with having abortions.  The poor things had no idea what they were doing, really.


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## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



So why is it second degree murder for the fetus?  That implies a fetus has LESS rights than the woman it is in, which still makes Abortion AOK.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> It is interesting to see the radical left work so hard
> to dehumanize something
> 
> Must be guilt
> ...



Or a realization that you can't let the camel's nose under the tent. 

Kind of like when gun nutters fight against background checks to keep crazy people from buying 100 round magazines and semi-automatic weapons.  

Yeah, on paper it might SEEM like a good idea, but the people pushing it would ban ALL guns if they had their way.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Yawn, he had sex with her, and she knew what sex was. She had had it before. 

Shit, the indicent probably got her to straighten out her life.  She ought to be sending Roman a thank you note.  She's certainly whored her way to minor celebrity. 

Just not getting worked up. Just like I don't get worked up when Rush Limbaugh flies down to the Dominican Republic with a bottle of Viagra.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Dude
no one is going to support an argument that an adult having sex with a minor is in anyway 'OK"

Like Papa Obamacare, it is a loser, give it up


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Dude
> no one is going to support an argument that an adult having sex with a minor is in anyway 'OK"
> 
> Like Papa Obamacare, it is a loser, give it up



Dude, that woman is 50 years old now, and she's over it.  

You need to get over it, too.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Man up
the argument is weak, at best


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Man up
> the argument is weak, at best



I have. 

The only reason why you guys care is because you think Polanski is a liberal.  

The actual case is that a sexually active young woman had sex with a man, and after prosecutors determined he wasn't really a threat of being a repeat offender, a grandstanding judge decided to nail a celebrity hide to his wall.  

Everyone needs to take a step back and let sanity reign.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

desperate


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## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Yes, you are.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Your right
anyone who believes sex with a minor is wrong both, legally and morally
will have a hard to defend that one.


Guy, 
do you really want to be remembered as a poster justifying sex with a minor?


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Your right
> anyone who believes sex with a minor is wrong both, legally and morally
> will have a hard to defend that one.



Up until about a century ago, women were usualy married off at 14.  

now we consider them "children" when they are 26.  

reality check, most people have sex for the first time when they are teens.  Maybe not you, but most people.  

I just don't get worked up that an extortion scheme didn't go as planned 35 years ago.  

Just can't get worked up about it.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

> Your right
> anyone who believes sex with a minor is wrong both, legally and morally
> will have a hard to defend that one.
> 
> ...




I guess, you do...


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> > Your right
> > anyone who believes sex with a minor is wrong both, legally and morally
> > will have a hard to defend that one.
> >
> ...



No, I just don't care about your faux outrage.  

Now, Limbaugh flying down to see his Rent Boys in the Dominican Republic, that's another issue.


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## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Be careful, from your last few postings
some might believe you would have joined him


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## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Be careful, from your last few postings
> some might believe you would have joined him



Only if you have some kind of OCD.  

So we can admit that you've lost the abortion debate and we can move right on to character assassination.

Where was this outrage when Tim Foley was active?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Foley, at least the GOP kicks out their perverts, Democrats give them awards

oh yes,
the poster who likes to declare himself a "winner" in someway

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DIETlxquzY]Stuart Smalley's famous quote - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Vox (Oct 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



I don't care about the law.
the law can be changed.

Black people have been viewed as property not people by law as well.

It changed.

Murder of the innocent children is allowed now in some instances and is prosecuted in the others - which is an idiocy right there - either the law considers an unborn baby to be a person or not.
It does consider an unborn baby to be a person and murdering that baby is prosecuted.

so this is the bridge.

and barbaric law of allowing abortion on demand will also eventually change.

The change is fermenting from the bottom.

on the executive side ( the providers) it has changed dramatically - to the extent that in order to provide the services one state is now allowing non-physicians to perform it 
and that is leftwing California - it might be leftwing, but physicians there do not want to participate in a murder ( as they do not everywhere else)


and this is progress. slow. but in a right direction.

Murder of the innocent babies will be banned - as it should be.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



32 pages and the anti-freedom people still don't get it. 

Its not just legal. 

Its none of their business.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Don't be ridiculous. There has always been abortion and there will always be abortion. 

Its legal and its none of your business - unless - you are the one CHOOSING.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Until the gov't has full control of healthcare

The same reasons why the gov't may choose to deny end of life treatments
against their or their family's wishes...

are the same reasons they can choose an abortion for someone
even against the wishes of the mother


----------



## Diana1180 (Oct 28, 2013)

I just joined this site but after reading all 84 pages of this post.. i think I am in love with JoeB.

Good arguments.

Continue.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

Someone who defends adults having sex with a 13 year old?

You must not have read all the posts
or he paid you to post

Then again, maybe you guys were meant to be 
I didn't know 13 year olds could post on here?


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 28, 2013)

Diana1180 said:


> I just joined this site but after reading all 84 pages of this post.. i think I am in love with JoeB.
> 
> Good arguments.
> 
> Continue.


 
I take it you are a baby killing ghoul and abject liar as well, then?

Have you yet been privy to him defending Gosnell, calling the women who testified "liars" and describing the babies killed post-birth in abortion clinics as "medical waste"?

Have you ever heard him say that there are no coerced abortions, and that abortion is a good "solution" to our "colored" problems?


----------



## Diana1180 (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Someone who defends adults having sex with 13 years old?
> 
> You must not have read all the posts
> or he paid you to post
> ...



I am only talking of this post and his arguments for abortion that I have read in THIS post.

And yes, I am obviously pro-choice.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 28, 2013)

I don't care

I am just having fun with you
It is actually in this thread 

so if you are 13 don't take any candy from him


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 28, 2013)

Oh, and lest we forget, he's a staunch patron of the porn industry.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 28, 2013)

Definitely great husband material.

Just the sort you want to take home to mom and expose the younger set to.


----------



## Diana1180 (Oct 28, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Oh, and lest we forget, he's a staunch patron of the porn industry.



Whats wrong with porn?


----------



## Vox (Oct 28, 2013)

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



it is you and other pro-murder abortion nazis who are ridiculous.

oh, and I can almost hear the similar conversation in 1860 

It changed then for the black people and it will change for the unborn children.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



The question you were asked was "What law states a fetus is a person". 

Now I can see where you are easily confused, because you claim a HS biology book said so, but that isn't the law. (Also, I kind of doubt that's in HS biology books, because the veer away from controversial stuff.)  

Oh, speaking of Progress, today a judge slapped down the Texas Law... So yeah, that's progress.


----------



## Vox (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Until the gov't has full control of healthcare
> 
> The same reasons why the gov't may choose to deny end of life treatments
> against their or their family's wishes...
> ...



actually our proabort nazis which are also gubmint worshipers would be extremely surprised to learn that the moment the gubmint finds it is no more convenient to promote murder agenda - the whole business of the "choice" option will turn 180 degrees 
our demographic is not headed in the right direction.
come 2025 we will be in big trouble - and all the possible gubmint restrictions to get more working bodies would be applied.
what their leftard agenda is now might not be the same agenda in 10 years


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Diana1180 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, and lest we forget, he's a staunch patron of the porn industry.
> ...



It involves people enjoying sex, which obviously Koch-er Girl has serious problems with.  

Think of her as Piper Laurie's character in _Carrie, _and you get the image.


----------



## Vox (Oct 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I have provided you the FEDERAL STATUTE NAME which states that the unborn baby IS a person and murder of that baby is going to be prosecuted.
As it is right now in Florida with a guy who provoked a death of his baby in utero of his girlfriend by tricking her into taking some very specific pills.

And this law is not going away anywhere.
It is a base and the bridge.

No matter how annoying it is to you - but deep inside you know perfectly well that both medicine, science and human nature is against your barbaric clench over will to murder.


----------



## Vox (Oct 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Diana1180 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



do you have problems in sex life? ask your doctor if viagra will help


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 28, 2013)

Diana1180 said:


> I just joined this site but after reading all 84 pages of this post.. i think I am in love with JoeB.
> 
> Good arguments.
> 
> Continue.



I quite see your point - but even now, I am torn.

Because I was in love with The Doctor for a few years before I started reading David's posts.

... Joe's posts.

Right.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Diana1180 said:
> ...



No problems in that department.  

I don't spend one minute worried about what kind of sex other people are having like you and Koch-Er Girl do. 

Because it really isn't any of my business. 

nor is it any of my business if they have abortions or not.  

Now, as policy, would it be nice if we had less abortions. Sure. It's not a pleasent procedures, and people who haven't evolved above religious stupidity feel bad about it.  

But you don't get there by banning it.  Because that never works.


----------



## Vox (Oct 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



looks like you do have problems.

otherwise you won't project on Koshergirl 

those slips of the tongue, oh the keyboard, are extremely revealing


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 28, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> looks like you do have problems.
> 
> ...



Uh, no, I've been arguing with Koch-Er Girl for years here... 

So, not really.  Of course, it's hilarious to watch her go off on tangents about porn or remembering me saying things I didn't say...  because that's always a laugh.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 28, 2013)

Diana1180 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, and lest we forget, he's a staunch patron of the porn industry.
> ...



It involves sex, which is very wrong, according to the right wing nutters here.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 28, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Diana1180 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



/wild-eyed

"Ix-nay on the ex-say!!!"


----------



## Noomi (Oct 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Your right
> anyone who believes sex with a minor is wrong both, legally and morally
> will have a hard to defend that one.
> 
> ...



A 17 year old is a minor. An 18 year old is a legal adult. Is it wrong for an 18 year old to have sex with a 17 year old?
IMO it is not. I guess it is for you, though?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Well 
in the conversation leading up to my statement
it was on sex between a 13 year old and a 30 year old
I guess for you, though, it is not wrong


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Well
> in the conversation leading up to my statement
> it was on sex between a 13 year old and a 30 year old
> I guess for you, though, it is not wrong



No, it was sex between a 13 year old hooker who was trying to extort a 30 year old man. 

Little bit of a difference you guys fail to make a distinction on.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

When you were defending Polanski's act
and he was in his in 40's, so sorry, the age was wrong on my part.

As for some other act of extortion between a 13 year year old and 30 yer old...
just as in many cases of being"hustled" or swindled, 
the "victim" was trying to get 'something to for nothing'

Really, how did this 13yr put an adult male in such a compromising 
position?


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> When you were defending Polanski's act
> and he was in his in 40's, so sorry, the age was wrong on my part.
> 
> As for some act between a 13 year year old and extortion...
> ...



You mean other than her mother driving her over for a nude photoshoot?  

Seriously?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Ok 
the mother should be charged with endangering a minor
and Polanski is still guilty of rape
Really blaming a child victim

Oh that's right, if he would had only had sex with her 
before her first breath of life

 in the extreme left world- that would not count

You must be confused, this one was breathing


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Ok
> the mother should be charged with endangering a minor
> and Polanski is still guilty of rape



Only because we define "rape" as a consenting teen having sex.  

And even that varies from state to state.  

You know, as a "Libertarian", you should know that bad law is your best argument.  

The prosecutor, the probation officer, the state psychologist all concluded that Polanski wasn't a threat, he was just a guy who made a bad decision.  There wasn't a line of women or girls who came out and said, "Hey, that happened to me!" 

But a judge decided he was going to nail one of them there celebrities to the wall.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Well
if you go back to my definition
I do say "adults".

there is no state that defines sex between a 13 year old and a 40 year old as legal.

Again, you will not win anyone over with your argument.
Really, there must be some better 'victim" the extreme left can defend
than a 40 year old who has sex with a 13 year old.

Stay with Clinton, a 50 year old married man who has sex with 22 year underlings
on gov't property and gov't time. At least there, you could argue that she seduced
the poor guy


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Well
> if you go back to my definition
> I do say "adults".
> 
> ...



Yawn, guy, a lot of shit ain't legal.   And people ignore stupid laws all the time.  

If we locked up everyone who had sex with a teen below the age of consent, we'd have no room in the prisons for the pot smokers we are locking up now.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

weak


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> weak



Not really.  Frankly, you right wing nutters all made David Koresh into a marytr, even though what he was doing with even younger girls was a 100 times worse than what Polanski did.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

David no
perhaps the poor children that were killed

But that is all conjecture, since no one has proof. Too bad, the gov't could not have caught him
alive so he could have been tried on the crimes you accuse him of doing.

But back to the argument, at hand 

An argument to justify a 13 year old having sex with a 40 year old
is not going to be supported by most, on both sides of the house.

Keep up the good fight


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> David no
> perhaps the poor children that were killed
> 
> But that is all conjecture, since no one has proof. Too bad, the gov't could not have caught him
> ...



So essentially, your defense is that we never proved what Koresh did because he committed suicide and killed all the victims in a mass suicide?  

Really? Is this what your are claiming, Spanky?  

Whew... good think Koresh wasn't a Hollywood Liberal, then.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



No, youve only provided evidence of your ignorance, where you and others on the right confuse criminal law with civil law. 

If youre serious about ending the practice of abortion, then start doing something about it; quit wasting time trying to ban abortion.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Diana1180 said:
> 
> 
> > I just joined this site but after reading all 84 pages of this post.. i think I am in love with JoeB.
> ...



For the record, the only one of those statements is kind of true is that I referred to aborted fetuses as "Medical Waste", which is how it's normally classified.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> I have provided you the FEDERAL STATUTE NAME which states that the unborn baby IS a person and murder of that baby is going to be prosecuted.
> As it is right now in Florida with a guy who provoked a death of his baby in utero of his girlfriend by tricking her into taking some very specific pills.
> ...



Again, the minute you "bridge" that into trying to prosecute a woman for ending an unwanted pregnancy is the day those laws are done.  

Reality- women have had abortions since Roman times.  

They will always be able to get them. 

Particularly now that you can simply take a pill.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > David no
> ...




Really

I was saying your poor attempt with an ad hominem
was moot since I would want both people in question to pay for their crimes

Where you apparently feel a a 40 year old having sex with a 13 year old should be forgiven

Again
good luck with that...


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> [
> 
> Really
> 
> ...



Again, that now 50 year old woman thinks it is no big deal. 

Can't see why I should be upset about it.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

No doubt it took her a long time to heal

I suggest you bring your idea to the next DNC meeting
It might work

At the last convention, they booed God
so anything is possible


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> No doubt it took her a long time to heal
> 
> I suggest you bring your idea to the next DNC meeting
> It might work
> ...



More lies... 

Guy, the only people who still care about Polanski is idiots who believe Hollywood is a nest of liberals harshing their mellow.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Truth is hard for left
In fact, it is their worst enemy

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUJE9YfsbNQ]Democrats BOO GOD At Convention - YouTube[/ame]


I could care less who the person is

I will state for the record that any 40 year old person having sex with a 13 year old is wrong

You choose to argue different
again

good luck with that....


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

You mean they didn't want language about Jerusalem and religion shoved into their platform, and they didn't have a fair vote on the matter. 

Nothing about booing God, they booed the procedure, which is exactly what they should have done.

You live in your own reality, don't you?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Whatever helps you sleep at night
besides, you hate religion anyway

Like the results of failed leftist programs
Be proud!


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Whatever helps you sleep at night
> besides, you hate religion anyway
> 
> Like the results of failed leftist programs
> Be proud!



I do hate religion. But let's not mischaracterized what happened there.  

The Chair tried to impose the kind of religious pandering that has already infected the GOP, and the delegates rejected it.  

And frankly, the only "Failed" programs I see is the one where you guys turned prosperity and peace into despair and war....


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

It is your story and you can tell anyway you want

If it is the right thing to do 
why worry about it


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 29, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



What makes one fetus (Lacy Peterson's fetus was considered a legal person) a legal person and another fetus not a legal person?


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



no, they won't. and a woman will be prosecuted. as she should be.
especially in the times when preventing the pregnancy is easiest than ever.
Murder of the innocents - and that is what abortion is - and everybody, including abortion nazis know that - should be prosecuted and will be.
Just takes time.
Killing a black man was not a crime not a very long time ago.
Killing a woman and a child was not a crime before that.

It changed. And so will change the approach to murder of children in utero.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB and Noomi have no problem with a 43 year old man having sex with a 13 year old child.

Sick, sick, sick.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...


 
Joe hates religion...but loves porn and abortion.

These are the subjects that populate his fantasy life.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 29, 2013)

Why do liberals confuse sex with killing babies?


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



I think that charging someone for murdering a person  that a birth certificate was never issued for is silly, but this is politics, not reason.  

The problem is of course, that no one has sympathy for guys who assault or murder pregnant women. 

So the camel's nose is under the tent.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> [
> 
> Joe hates religion...but loves porn and abortion.
> 
> These are the subjects that populate his fantasy life.



Yes, we all know about your Porn fixation... the very idea that people enjoy sex?  Horrible.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> no, they won't. and a woman will be prosecuted. as she should be.
> especially in the times when preventing the pregnancy is easiest than ever.
> ...



YOu religious idiots are never going to get your way on this. I'm just so sorry. 

Here's the thing.  Do you know how many women were arrested for HAVING abortions prior to _Roe v. Wade_?  Come on, take a guess. 

All of TWO. One in 1911, one in 1922.  

In fact, even the people who performed them were RARELY prosecuted.  

To educate yourself, read up on a lady named Ruth Barnett. She performed 40,000 Abortions in the Portland Area from 1913 to 1969.   She spent only a few years in jail, and went right back to performing abortions until she was too old to do them. 

And mind you, this was BEFORE it had been legal and accepted for 40 years.


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB and Noomi have no problem with a 43 year old man having sex with a 13 year old child.
> 
> Sick, sick, sick.



they also have no problem of murdering viable babies for convenience.
even more sick


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



you, moron, where did I ever connected murder of the baby to religion? I even asked someone from my side not to mention it as the religious aspect of the issue is absolutly separate one.

But the murderous liars like yourself think only about their own prejudicies and obsessions.

I get it - you have no problem with a 40 yo raping a 13 yo child and murdering the baby in utero - for your convenience.

What does RELIGION have to do with it?

Abortion IS a murder. Got it?

having sex with a 13 year old is RAPE. Comprende?

oh, and if you think that your vulgar freudism is going to impress me - you might want to think again.
Even if your ally - that cowardly bitch gracie is going to neg me for revealing your secret drives 

I don't care that only 2 women were arrested. I think they all should, but even marginalizing the act and the ones who do it would be sufficient to curb it substantially.
You want to murder your baby in utero?
well, then you will have to take the risk as all the murders do - that would at least be fair.

And yes, it is going to be prosecuted. Per my own prediction - starting circa 2030.


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



did you get your viagra prescription yet?

you clearly need it - talking about your painful issue every other post


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Why do liberals confuse sex with killing babies?



great question.

I find it wildly amusing as it clearly indicates which ones are really short on a supply side, since all they can talk on the topic of murder is sex


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> you, moron, where did I ever connected murder of the baby to religion? I even asked someone from my side not to mention it as the religious aspect of the issue is absolutly separate one.
> 
> ...



No, I have no problem with someone walking away from a sham conviction because a judge wanted to get a celebrity scalp. 



> What does RELIGION have to do with it?



You mean other than you trying to impose your religion on other people? 



> Abortion IS a murder. Got it?



That's a RELIGIOUS opinion, not a scientific or legal one. It's also one most people don't agree with. 



> having sex with a 13 year old is RAPE. Comprende?



Then there are a lot of 13 year old rapists out there.   Reality check, this is really a modern thing.  as recently as a century ago. you were of marriageable age at puberty...



> oh, and if you think that your vulgar freudism is going to impress me - you might want to think again.
> Even if your ally - that cowardly bitch gracie is going to neg me for revealing your secret drives



Oh, not trying to impress anything.. I've long ago trying to shrink anti-abortion types  Most of you are just religious nuts with sexual fixations.... 



> I don't care that only 2 women were arrested. I think they all should, but even marginalizing the act and the ones who do it would be sufficient to curb it substantially.



But you miss the point.  You can't have a law and then not enforce it.  Prostitution, Drug abuse, guns in "Gun Free Zones", Prohibition.  They all kind of show the folly of having a law that most people don't follow because they never really agreed to it. 





> You want to murder your baby in utero?
> well, then you will have to take the risk as all the murders do - that would at least be fair.
> 
> And yes, it is going to be prosecuted. Per my own prediction - starting circa 2030.



Actually, byt 2030, the REpublican Party will be a forgotten memory, and people will wonder why they were able to fool so many stupid people.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Yes, they will. 

If you want to ensure the practice of abortion continues, go ahead and ban it. 

And have you ever comprehensively examined the idiocy of your position? 

Youre actually willing the fill the courts and prisons with women whove committed no crime, save that of deciding whether or not to bear a child, a right guaranteed her by the Constitution. 

For example, what of women imprisoned for the crime of attempted abortion, obviously you realize that once born, the child must be placed in foster care, further overwhelming an already compromised system. And the child will be forced to remain in foster care for its entire childhood, or until adopted, assuming the mother sustains a lengthy prison stay as a consequence of her crime. 

Given these and other facts, the conservative position of banning abortion is clearly untenable, even with Constitutional ramifications notwithstanding. 

Instead of hyperbole, hysteria, and demagoguery from the right concerning the issue, a factual, pragmatic approach is the only viable solution.


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

No, they won't.

and they will be the bridge for the potential reversal of the idiocy about privacy, when it is a murder.

let the demographic pressure kick in - and all you leftard will start to sing the other way around, as the agenda will be - we need more people 

just takes time and some environmental changes - but those are inevitable


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



you idiot, baby in utero is a scientific opinion not a religious one. life starts at conception - as the zygote starts to divide - that is a medical FACT not a religious belief.

upgrade your biology as you clearly haven't heard anything for the last 45 years


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> No, they won't.
> 
> and they will be the bridge for the potential reversal of the idiocy about privacy, when it is a murder.
> 
> ...



NOt really.  

The problem is, we don't have enough work for the people who want to work now.... 

Point is, women will still end unwanted pregnancies.  And the day you ever get some young woman in the dock will be the day people rise up against you.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> [
> 
> you idiot, baby in utero is a scientific opinion not a religious one. life starts at conception - as the zygote starts to divide - that is a medical FACT not a religious belief.
> 
> upgrade your biology as you clearly haven't heard anything for the last 45 years



Life began 4 billion years ago. 

And is an ongoing process. 

Still doesn't make zygotes into people.  

Which is why we don't have funerals over tampons.


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



human life begins when zygote starts dividing. Period. It is a medical fact. deal with it.


----------



## Vox (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > No, they won't.
> ...



that is debatable.
and what will woman do when abortion will be a crime is going to be their choice to take the risk as any criminal does attempting murder.
tuff, but fair.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Oct 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Thank you for finally admitting that a fetus is a person.  Knew you could do it.

You didn't answer my question.


----------



## Katzndogz (Oct 29, 2013)

In the entire world only four countries consider that a baby is not a human being after 12 weeks gestation.  They are all hard left.  The US is one of them.  In times to come when sanity returns, this will be an example of a national holocaust.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 29, 2013)

Yes it will.

And the people responsible will be held accountable.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Oct 29, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> In the entire world only four countries consider that a baby is not a human being after 12 weeks gestation.  They are all hard left.  The US is one of them.  In times to come when sanity returns, this will be an example of a national holocaust.



Incorrect. 

The United States wisely and appropriate allows each individual to decide for himself when human life begins and to act accordingly in good faith and in good conscience, free from interference by the state. 

It is not the place of government to dictate to citizens what they must or must not believe concerning when human life begins, nor may the state interfere with decisions both personal and private as to whether or not to have a child. 

We are indeed fortunate to live in a great Nation whose government respects the privacy rights of the individual. 

And those who believe human life begins at conception and abortion to be wrong are at liberty in our great Nation to pursue solutions with the intent of ending the practice of abortion, save that of violating the civil liberties of other citizens.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 29, 2013)

"
*Karl Brandt* (January 8, 1904 &#8211; June 2, 1948) was a German Nazi war criminal. He rose to the rank of SS-Gruppenführer in the Allgemeine-SS and SS-Brigadeführer in the Waffen-SS. Among other positions, Brandt headed the administration of the Nazi euthanasia program from 1939 onwards and was selected as Adolf Hitler's personal physician in August 1934. In 1942, he became Reich Commissioner for Health and Sanitation. He was involved in criminal human experimentation, along with his deputy Werner Heyde and others. After World War II, Brandt was convicted of crimes against humanity. He was hanged on June 2, 1948.[1]

"Brandt's medical ethics, particularly regarding euthanasia, were influenced by Alfred Hoche whose courses he attended. Like many other German doctors of the period, Brandt came to believe that the health of society as a whole should take precedence over that of its individual members. Society being viewed as an organism that should be cured, its weakest, most invalid and incurable members were parts that had to be removed."

"Also planning and performing the mass murder of prisoners of war and civilians of occupied countries, stigmatized as aged, insane, incurably ill, deformed, and so on, by gas, lethal injections, and diverse other means in nursing homes, hospitals, and asylums during the Euthanasia Program and participating in the mass murder of concentration camp inmates;"
Karl Brandt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 29, 2013)

"
*Karl Brandt* (January 8, 1904  June 2, 1948) was a German Nazi war criminal. He rose to the rank of SS-Gruppenführer in the Allgemeine-SS and SS-Brigadeführer in the Waffen-SS. Among other positions, Brandt headed the administration of the Nazi euthanasia program from 1939 onwards and was selected as Adolf Hitler's personal physician in August 1934. In 1942, he became Reich Commissioner for Health and Sanitation. He was involved in criminal human experimentation, along with his deputy Werner Heyde and others. After World War II, Brandt was convicted of crimes against humanity. He was hanged on June 2, 1948.[1]"

"Cause of death, Execution by *Hanging* *...* Karl Brandt (January 8, 1904  June 2, 
1948) was a *German Nazi* war criminal. *...* one of the medical scientists who 
performed *abortions* in great numbers on women deemed genetically disordered"

"Brandt's medical ethics, particularly regarding euthanasia, were influenced by Alfred Hoche whose courses he attended. Like many other German doctors of the period, Brandt came to believe that the health of society as a whole should take precedence over that of its individual members. Society being viewed as an organism that should be cured, its weakest, most invalid and incurable members were parts that had to be removed."

"Also planning and performing the mass murder of prisoners of war and civilians of occupied countries, stigmatized as aged, insane, incurably ill, deformed, and so on, by gas, lethal injections, and diverse other means in nursing homes, hospitals, and asylums during the Euthanasia Program and participating in the mass murder of concentration camp inmates;"
Karl Brandt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 29, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > In the entire world only four countries consider that a baby is not a human being after 12 weeks gestation.  They are all hard left.  The US is one of them.  In times to come when sanity returns, this will be an example of a national holocaust.
> ...



This thread is a clear example of why logic cannot defeat faith - and why this is, therefore, not a country built on faith.

We are a nation of thinkers, or at least we were meant to be.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 29, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Life might begin at conception but personhood begins at birth.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 29, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> "
> *Karl Brandt* (January 8, 1904  June 2, 1948) was a German Nazi war criminal. He rose to the rank of SS-Gruppenführer in the Allgemeine-SS and SS-Brigadeführer in the Waffen-SS. Among other positions, Brandt headed the administration of the Nazi euthanasia program from 1939 onwards and was selected as Adolf Hitler's personal physician in August 1934. In 1942, he became Reich Commissioner for Health and Sanitation. He was involved in criminal human experimentation, along with his deputy Werner Heyde and others. After World War II, Brandt was convicted of crimes against humanity. He was hanged on June 2, 1948.[1]"
> 
> "Cause of death, Execution by *Hanging* *...* Karl Brandt (January 8, 1904  June 2,
> ...



What does abortion have to do with the Nazi Regime?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Actually, it is a good study on the potential abusive power of any CPE
Nothing is sacred with statism, including the womb.


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 29, 2013)

Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the &#8216;less fit&#8217;, including &#8216;inferior races&#8217; such as &#8216;Negroes&#8217;. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
*

&#8216;The lower down in the scale of human development we go the less sexual control we find. It is said the aboriginal Australian, the lowest known species of the human family, just a step higher than the chimpanzee in brain development, has so little sexual control that police authority alone prevents him from obtaining sexual satisfaction on the streets. According to one writer, the rapist has just enough brain development to raise him above the animal, but like the animal, when in heat, knows no law except nature, which impels him to procreate, whatever the result.&#8217; ~Margaret Sanger~*

Margaret Sanger is Noomi's hero


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

Oh great

now all the reactionary left are going to come out of the woodwork to 
defend this 'eugenicist' by trying to deny or downplay her past


They have to because Planned Parenthood gives out some crappy award with
her name attached- therefore she must be good. 

It is funny how they will knee jerk defend her without knowing her past

&#8216;Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.&#8217;
so true


----------



## Noomi (Oct 29, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the less fit, including inferior races such as Negroes. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
> *
> 
> The lower down in the scale of human development we go the less sexual control we find. It is said the aboriginal Australian, the lowest known species of the human family, just a step higher than the chimpanzee in brain development, has so little sexual control that police authority alone prevents him from obtaining sexual satisfaction on the streets. According to one writer, the rapist has just enough brain development to raise him above the animal, but like the animal, when in heat, knows no law except nature, which impels him to procreate, whatever the result. ~Margaret Sanger~*
> ...



Blah blah blah.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 29, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the less fit, including inferior races such as Negroes. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
> ...



The better part of 1300 posts, blah-blah-blah. Too bad you're not in utero, Noomi. They'd love you til you were born.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the less fit, including inferior races such as Negroes. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
> *
> 
> The lower down in the scale of human development we go the less sexual control we find. It is said the aboriginal Australian, the lowest known species of the human family, just a step higher than the chimpanzee in brain development, has so little sexual control that police authority alone prevents him from obtaining sexual satisfaction on the streets. According to one writer, the rapist has just enough brain development to raise him above the animal, but like the animal, when in heat, knows no law except nature, which impels him to procreate, whatever the result. ~Margaret Sanger~*
> ...



told you

to be fair, it is probably the first time she even bothered
to look up her past

Truth is hard for the Left
In fact, it is their worst enemy


----------



## Noomi (Oct 29, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...



They'd worship me and then feed me to the wolves.


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 29, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Oh great
> 
> now all the reactionary left are going to come out of the woodwork to
> defend this 'eugenicist' by trying to deny or downplay her past
> ...



Plus Planned Parenthood  do all they can to hide the facts of margaret sangers racism.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 29, 2013)

Noomi said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



Interesting!

"This fetus will grow up to be a feminist. You will treat her with utmost disrespect, and do anything and everything you can to eradicate her. If she becomes an abortionist - well. We can either end her life now, or you can shoot her in forty years. Your call."


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 29, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Oh great
> ...




No doubt


----------



## PixieStix (Oct 29, 2013)

Noomi said:


> PixieStix said:
> 
> 
> > Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the less fit, including inferior races such as Negroes. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
> ...



She blah blahed a whole lot. Maybe you should educate yourself. If you did, and then still believe what you do, I could respect that. But not when you choose to drink the koolaid


----------



## Noomi (Oct 29, 2013)

I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 29, 2013)

Noomi said:


> I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.



That makes two of us.


----------



## Noomi (Oct 30, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.
> ...



I used to insult people who were pro choice and wish they all died for having abortions. I hated women who had abortions and thought they were sluts, and I thought that people who bombed abortion clinics were heroes.

Then one day I decided to listen to the pro choice side. I decided to show them the respect they had shown me, for even as I insulted them, they never insulted me. I showed them respect, and I listened, asked questions, and for a time, became a fence sitter.

I was opposed to abortion but more open to women making the decision for themselves. Now, ten years later, I am supportive of abortion and strongly believe that it is a choice that should be made only by the person who is pregnant.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



Again, they didn't prosecute women when they had no rights, an abortion was illegal.  

Today, they get to VOTE.   Not seeing it going well for the politician who tries that one.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the less fit, including inferior races such as Negroes. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
> *
> 
> The lower down in the scale of human development we go the less sexual control we find. It is said the aboriginal Australian, the lowest known species of the human family, just a step higher than the chimpanzee in brain development, has so little sexual control that police authority alone prevents him from obtaining sexual satisfaction on the streets. According to one writer, the rapist has just enough brain development to raise him above the animal, but like the animal, when in heat, knows no law except nature, which impels him to procreate, whatever the result. ~Margaret Sanger~*
> ...



This was written in 1912, when anthropologists sincerely believed that different racial groups were at different levels of evolutionary development. 

For the record, Sanger also said this...  



> Yet despite her harangues against the Church and her insistence that for the welfare of children, for the happiness of husbands and wives, and for the full realization of Womens rights, birth control by scientific methods of contraception [should] properly and wisely be exercised, she did make one exception to an otherwise thorough pro-choice agenda: abortion.
> 
> Thats right. Margaret Sanger actually stated that: Birth control does not mean abortion. Here are her exact words:
> 
> ...



Yup.  You heard it.  Sanger was AGAINST abortion.  She was just like you nutters.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

oh good 
she thought birth control was enough to get rid of those "unfit people" 

that  makes so much better now




You have to admit, she would have been proud of Planned Parenthood's results


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Oh great
> ...



You mean the same racism that every white person in 1912 had?  Really?  


http://www.plannedparenthood.org/files/PPFA/OppositionClaimsAboutMargaretSanger.pdf



> Was Sanger racially motivated?
> Despite the admiration that African-American heroes
> like DuBois, Powell, and King held for Sanger,
> arguments continue about whether or not her
> ...


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> oh good
> she thought birth control was enough to get rid of those "unfit people"
> 
> You have to admit, she would have been proud of Planned Parenthood's results
> ...



The difference between a first world and third world country is it's women's ability to control their fertility.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

*You mean the same racism that every white person in 1912 had? Really? *

Generalization with no proof
really?

Besides, even if true, it does not mean everybody supported eugenics
now does it

Of course she was an alcoholic and Demerol addict, 
so she was probably not 'in the proper mind' all the time


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...





JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > oh good
> ...





and according to heroine of Planned Parenthood,   getting rid of those unfit people


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 30, 2013)

Noomi said:


> I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.



Yes... any liberal pro choice woman would love to educate herself in the art of murder. 

Geez. Do you realize what you're saying? No of course not. You educated yourself.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > oh good
> ...



So, nutters want to set back women's rights, yeah?

No shock there.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > PixieStix said:
> ...





Neotrotsky said:


> Oh great
> 
> now all the reactionary left are going to come out of the woodwork to
> defend this 'eugenicist' by trying to deny or downplay her past
> ...



See I told you



"The campaign for birth control is not merely of eugenic value, but is practically identical with the final aims of eugenics."
"The Eugenic Value of Birth Control Propaganda", October 1921, page 5.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> *You mean the same racism that every white person in 1912 had? Really? *
> 
> Generalization with no proof
> really?
> ...



Actually, Eugenics was considered a valid science in 1912.  We now know a lot more about genetics, but the real problem was that the Nazis applied it with no real understanding of science and gave it a bad name.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.
> ...



I grew up Catholic and got the whole pictures of aborted fetuses propaganda tour from the nuns.  (this was back in the 1970's when they still forced  unwitting Catholic Lesbians to become nuns and make children miserable.)  And I kept the anti-abortion beliefs until fairly recently.  

then I realized 2 things. 

1) The GOP and their masters on Wall Street and Corporate America have NO REAL INTEREST in ending abortion.   They really don't.  They just want the issue out there to keep stupid people like you and Vox and Kocher-Grill voting against your own economic interests.  

2) NO matter what the law is, women will get abortions anyway.  The place to stop abortion is before conception.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > *You mean the same racism that every white person in 1912 had? Really? *
> ...



By some.

Yes, it was terrible how the Nazi's ruined that whole eugenics things, for us


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



Actually, there will be apoint in history where every baby is genetically selected and we'll be free of most congenital defects and we are all going to be better off for it.

But it will because we applied science and not racism and religion like the Nazis did.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

and by the state, in your world

hey, what could go wrong


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> and by the state, in your world
> 
> hey, what could go wrong



Guy, "the state" is not  a bogeyman hiding under your bed. 

Here's the reality.  Genetic screening and selection will eventually be developed by science. 

We are practicing it to a degree now. 

91% of Down Syndrome fetuses are aborted.  So are 91% of the ones that have Taye-Sachs syndrome.  

This is a benefit, as these are horrible diseases.   

Unless you are a loon who thinks suffereing is part of "God's Plan".


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

Tell that to our European friends we spy on


Amazing how willing the left loves to prostrate themselves before the state.
So, you really didn't quit religion, you just changed faiths 

Delusional, the left buys into this crap that a women's womb is sacred.
Well it comes down to it, no amount of protests chants is going to stop
the gov't from what it wants. 


Well if the state can play a role in end of life medical treatments
that would hasten the time of death to save the state money.

why not beginning of life to save the state money?
A person could say anything about taking care of a sickly baby
what if they have no assets?

Talk about money. Odds are the dying person at least paid some money into the system
But a very handicapped child, they may never put any money into the system.
The state could save a lot of money. 

Why not?
Is there really any difference?

What's the big thing?
A doctor determines that an abortion would be the best 
medical treatment for the women.

We can legally subject a patient to court-ordered forced care
right now for a lot of things.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...


 So using your fucked up logic anyone born and living before they took birth records were not real humans? 



It is amazing how stupid you are.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Why do you always presume if your pro life your religious? Man your fear and hate of peace loving Christians is palpable.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



Whats logical about infanticide?


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Only to sick deathers like you


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

PixieStix said:


> Margaret Sanger was the founder of Planned Parenthood, the leading organization advocating abortion in the United States today. Darwinism had a profound influence on her thinking, including her conversion to, and active support of, eugenics. She was specifically concerned with reducing the population of the less fit, including inferior races such as Negroes. One major result of her lifelong work was to support the sexual revolution that has radically changed our society.
> *
> 
> The lower down in the scale of human development we go the less sexual control we find. It is said the aboriginal Australian, the lowest known species of the human family, just a step higher than the chimpanzee in brain development, has so little sexual control that police authority alone prevents him from obtaining sexual satisfaction on the streets. According to one writer, the rapist has just enough brain development to raise him above the animal, but like the animal, when in heat, knows no law except nature, which impels him to procreate, whatever the result. ~Margaret Sanger~*
> ...


She is also one of Hillary Clinton's heroes as well


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

Noomi said:


> I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.



I smell feces of a cow in this post.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > I used to be insanely pro life, until I educated myself.
> ...



I smell the same thing in this post as well


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Why  prosecute the woman? She didnt perform the abortion herself.


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 30, 2013)




----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

I hear you

Most Americans can't wrap their head around this...
How can Planned Parenthood defend this?


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv1afKaLhA]Planned Parenthood endorses post-birth abortion - YouTube[/ame]



Planned Parenthood is on the extreme when it comes to late term abortions 
In fact, the majority of Americans are against them


----------



## mamooth (Oct 30, 2013)

It must bug you a lot, how popular Planned Parenthood is across the nation. All the pro-life lies just aren't working.

So, what's Plan B?


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 30, 2013)

What lies would those be?

The lies about how many abortions are taking place?

Oh wait, that's a PP lie.

The lies about how qualified the abortionists are?

Oh wait, that's a PP lie.

The lies about the number of late term abortions take place?

Oh wait, that's a PP lie.

The lies about how medically safe abortion is?

Oh wait, that's a PP lie.

The lies about how NO federal funding goes towards abortion?

Oh wait, that's a PP lie.


----------



## koshergrl (Oct 30, 2013)

You do know that multiple PP clinics referred women to Gosnell, right? 

And that they covered for him for years?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

mamooth said:


> It must bug you a lot, how popular Planned Parenthood is across the nation. All the pro-life lies just aren't working.
> 
> So, what's Plan B?



Not really....

Planned Parenthood and the reactionary left is on the minority side of
how the majority feel about abortion

The radical left believes in the gov't regulating everything but this....


-majority of Americans do not believe in abortion with no restrictions
-majority do not support late term abortions

The radical left did not even support California from charging Scott Peterson, who killed his
pregnant wife, with the murder of his child.

Sadly, for the Democrats, they allow only the politician with the most extreme views on this
subject, act as their spokesperson - pitting them against the majority of Americans

For example

Papa Obama, as a state senator, fought a law that would have protected live infants accidentally delivered during an abortion. 
Senator Barbara Boxer once said that constitutional rights begin when you bring the baby home from the hospital.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



They've taken birth records as long as there's been humanity.  But you do bring up an interesting point. 

The Bible places no value on fetuses or infants less than one month old. 

And if it be from a month old even unto five years old, then thy estimation shall be of the male five shekels of silver, and for the female thy estimation shall be three shekels of silver. -- Leviticus 27:6 

Fetuses and infants less than one month old are not considered persons. 

Number the children of Levi after the house of their fathers, by their families: every male from a month old and upward shalt thou number them. And Moses numbered them according to the word of the LORD. -- Numbers 3:15-16


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> You do know that multiple PP clinics referred women to Gosnell, right?
> 
> And that they covered for him for years?



Not really.  But you keep telling yourself that.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> mamooth said:
> 
> 
> > It must bug you a lot, how popular Planned Parenthood is across the nation. All the pro-life lies just aren't working.
> ...



Again, you would never want your rights subject to what a majority thinks they should be.  Otherwise you'd have no guns and you'd better not belong to a religion most people think is strange. 





> The radical left did not even support California from charging Scott Peterson, who killed his
> pregnant wife, with the murder of his child.



They had no problem with him being charged with the murder of his wife, the only PERSON he actually killed.  





> Sadly, for the Democrats, they allow only the politician with the most extreme views on this
> subject, act as their spokesperson - pitting them against the majority of Americans



Guy, Abortion is a loser for you guys, which is why you see the GOP Desperately running away from the issue outside of the deepest red states.  When "The Cooch" goes down in flames next week, look for even more GOP waffling. 




> For example
> 
> Papa Obama, as a state senator, fought a law that would have protected live infants accidentally delivered during an abortion.
> Senator Barbara Boxer once said that constitutional rights begin when you bring the baby home from the hospital.



Again, I don't want my doctors being politicians,and I don't want my politicians being doctors. 

Besides the fact the woman who calimed that a hospital in IL was killing fetuses after abortions was proven to be a liar and fired...


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

Sorry
late term is extreme and viewed by the majority that way

Planned Parenthood is in the extreme
no matter how hard you try to spin it


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Sorry
> late term is extreme and viewed by the majority that way
> 
> Planned Parenthood is in the extreme
> no matter how hard you try to spin it



The "Majority" thinks that _Dancing with the Stars _is good entertainment.  And that those people actually qualify as being "Stars".  

I would never want my RIGHTS to be dictated by a majority of the stupid drooling masses and neither would you. 

Only two people who should be in on the decision of when to have an abortion. 

The woman and her doctor.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

Yes
a group of intellectual elites who know what is best for the masses



Judging by the opening day success of Papa Obamacare, I am sure
many are comforted by your vision


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Yes
> a group of intellectual elites who know what is best for the masses
> 
> 
> ...



In a month, the website will be working fine. 

In a year, everyone will be saying how wonderful ObamaCare is and the GOP will never touch it. 

Kind of like SOcial Security and Medicare....


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

The programs that are going broke?
Just like those....

Well, they can't change the lies
Hey, it is your story, tell it anyway you want 

From right wing NBC

Poll: Majority think health law needs overhaul or elimination

_A majority of Americans  52 percent  believe the health care law needs either a major overhaul or to be completely eliminated, a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll finds._​


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Plenty of money, you just have to make the rich douchebags pay their fair share...


----------



## Neotrotsky (Oct 30, 2013)

Really,
it is the middle class
but the left always moves the definition around
to suit their purposes


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 30, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Really,
> it is the middle class
> but the left always moves the definition around
> to suit their purposes



Um, no, not really. 

1% of the country has 43% of the wealth.  We can start with them.


----------



## thanatos144 (Oct 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


No they haven't taken birth records as long as there were humans.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Oct 31, 2013)

Funny how Joe here doesn't believe in God, but insists on using the Bible to justify murdering unborn children. How is that possible?


----------



## BDBoop (Oct 31, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Really,
> ...



That'd be nice, but they have all the poor Republicans running interference for them.


----------



## JoeB131 (Oct 31, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> Funny how Joe here doesn't believe in God, but insists on using the Bible to justify murdering unborn children. How is that possible?



I do it to point out that you guys who insist that you are fighting abortion on behalf of your invisible sky man really have no biblical basis to do so.  

In fact, your omniscient being who spent whole verses on such subjects as what kind of clothes to wear and how to wash your scrotum after a wet dream and why you should kill people if they gather sticks on the Sabbath didn't spend ONE VERSE saying, "Don't you dare end a pregnancy before birth!"  

You'd think he'd have made a note of it.  I mean, he spent whole chapters giving out rules for slavery, but not a peep on abortion. 

Not to mention that he was happy to kill fetuses if they were inside women who committed some kind of offense in his eye.


----------



## YoungRepublican (Nov 2, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > Funny how Joe here doesn't believe in God, but insists on using the Bible to justify murdering unborn children. How is that possible?
> ...



Hard to argue with the religiously blind my man.. God has been inspiring people to kill each other since we first created him in our minds to numb the realization that our lives meant nothing. These people just want to make the time we have on Earth as miserable as possible for you and I.


----------



## BDBoop (Nov 2, 2013)

YoungRepublican said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > TemplarKormac said:
> ...



I'm tellin ya. If it weren't for the Internet, I'd have no idea how much rabid ugliness is in the hearts of "Christians."


----------



## YoungRepublican (Nov 2, 2013)

BDBoop said:


> YoungRepublican said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



They almost hate more than the rest of us, maybe more. What really worries me about religion is it's prominence among the uninformed. It worries me that the smarter a society becomes, the less it buys into religion. Then you look at really poor, unintelligent places like the Middle-East, and Africa, and the American south where religion really flourishes and I just ask myself, is religion just a crutch for those who don't understand how the world works? It is a real concern for me. The more I look at who is religious and how it was so prevalent before we understood science, I really am just left thinking that it is just for people that aren't smart. Eventually, (if the world keeps going like its going) no one will believe in a religion. I wonder if people will look back at us and wonder how we could be so naive to let these stories guide our decisions with so much prevalence.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

Don't fool yourself kid

The Left has just changed gods- they worship state

Same reason they try to make saints out of their leaders.

They buy into the 'global cooling/warming whatever it is today' crap.
It is based on a non-falsifiable theory
that is not science that is like a religion

Same process- just a new god


Indeed,

look at the former Soviet Union and the Eastern Blocs and Cuba
God was officially dead by gov't edict 
they were just utopias on earth



Did the NJ office give you permission to use the official logo?
Do you know Tony?
How many active chapters does NJ have ?


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

I am always amazed that you think there are leftists who "worship" the state. 

And no argument would be complete without a walk down memory lane invoking the USSR...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrncuWmt7-g]Paul McCartney - Back In The USSR (Live in St. Petersburg 2003) - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

I liked John better

Really, why date yourself, old man  

We can be even more current...
No since the radical left that has taken over the Democrat party,
it has carried the love of 'state' to an even more perverse level 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4CM0Ld1aAo]PEOPLE PRAY TO OBAMA DELIVER US - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Guy, I'm not sure if you are a troll, or if you really believe the horseshit you post. 

I'm kind of hoping you are just a troll.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

it may be a 'rubber-glue' kind of thing


Don't hate because I speak the truth



If you prefer
Maybe you view this as normal behavior?
Which further supports my point,
the left has only really changed religions.  

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srk18X804hQ]Farrakhan Heralds Obama as Messiah - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Nope, definitely a troll...


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

'rubber-glue'

Considering that you interjected yourself into my
conversation with that fine "young republican" from NJ,
your accusation is rather amazing.

I mean, it is not like I am pretending to be a former 
Democrat


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

No, guy.  

because the Democrats didn't let religious crazies take over in the last few years... 

unlike the Republicans.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

No Sharpton and Jackson and Farrakhan are definitely main stream


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> No Sharpton and Jackson and Farrakhan are definitely main stream



Oooooh, scarey negroes...


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

Well, we were speaking about religion


Strange how the left needs to always bring up race
when they have no argument

Funny how that works


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Well, we were speaking about religion
> 
> 
> Strange how the left needs to always bring up race
> ...



No, I just find it amusing that when you needed to find an equivlent to the nutters on the right with religion, the only men of the cloth you could cite as "bad examples" were men of color.  

Even though these guys for the most part, are not making a religious argument for leftist policies.  They could, mind you.  Jesus would have been more at home with the OWS Crowd than the TEA Crowd.  

Leaving aside that Farakhan isn't really active in Politcal circles and doesn't get invited to anything. (Also, the guy is about half dead at this point.)


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

If the worst examples for the left of "men of cloth" happen to be black
then that is just the case. Telling,  is one focuses on the religion aspect and 
one has to default to race. 

Just like it is not the colour of Papa Obama's skin but the colour of his politics

But since the rest of the left is knee jerk to impose race, it is understandable.
The race card is an old friend for the left.

Interesting that you are confident in speaking in how Jesus would act...

No doubt, all part of that 'elitists telling the masses what to do '
doctrine the left is so comfortable with....

Of course, the implied "racism" is funny when one considers that
you do not even know what race I am.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Does "Troll" count as a race?  

Point was, when someone points out the GOP has been overtaken by religious nutters, you went for the "Scary Black Guys" on the Democrat side, one of whom isn't even involved in politics.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 2, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Does "Troll" count as a race?
> 
> Point was, when someone points out the GOP has been overtaken by religious nutters, you went for the "Scary Black Guys" on the Democrat side, one of whom isn't even involved in politics.



Your a idiot. Read the first amendment you communist.


----------



## BDBoop (Nov 2, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Does "Troll" count as a race?
> 
> Point was, when someone points out the GOP has been overtaken by religious nutters, you went for the "Scary Black Guys" on the Democrat side, one of whom isn't even involved in politics.



In World of Warcraft, it does.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Does "Troll" count as a race?
> 
> Point was, when someone points out the GOP has been overtaken by religious nutters, you went for the "Scary Black Guys" on the Democrat side, one of whom isn't even involved in politics.



like someone pretending to be a former Democrat?

The point is you went for race because what I stated was true 
The race card is all you had. Don't get mad at me because 
you can't man-up to using it. 

As for not involved in politics as based on your definitions
which if like your stat skills, amounts to very little.

But if you feel comfortable calling people racist based
on what race you think they are and how different races
should behave, go for it.

If it makes you feel better...
Jesus would feel the same way


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Does "Troll" count as a race?
> ...



No not Joel 
Self proclaimed Communists on posting boards are the most honest leftists out there. 
They don't feel the need to hide their true political intentions or pretend to be politically something else, like  "Progressives"


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Does "Troll" count as a race?
> ...



You mean the part about "Keep your fucking religion out of my government" First Amendment?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

It seems to say more keep the fucking gov't out of religion

_Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof....._


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> It seems to say more keep the fucking gov't out of religion
> 
> _Congress shall *make no law respecting an establishment of religion*, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof....._



Keep your religion the fuck out of my government.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

Bold print- wow you must be right 
Of course, since the other part says "prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
and apparently you are a big supporter of the 1st Amendment ...

then no doubt you are happy with today's ruling 

The Left and Obama apologists just had another setback
for their radical leftist agenda:


DC appellate court rules against HHS contraception mandate, for religious liberty


_The Obama administration said that the requirement is necessary to protect women&#8217;s health and abortion rights. The judges were unconvinced that forcing companies to violate their religious rights was appropriate.

Brown wrote that &#8220;it is clear the government has failed to demonstrate how such a right &#8212; whether described as noninterference, privacy, or autonomy &#8212; can extend to the compelled subsidization of a woman&#8217;s procreative practices.&#8221;

&#8220;The provision of these services &#8212; even without the contraceptive mandate &#8212; by and large fulfills the statutory command for insurers to provide gender-specific preventive care,&#8221; she wrote. &#8220;At the very least, the statutory scheme will not go to pieces.&#8221;_​
_
The HHS mandate burdens their exercise of religion by pressuring them to approve and endorse the inclusion of objectionable coverage in their companies&#8217; health plans. &#8220;They can either abide by the sacred tenets of their faith, pay a penalty of over $14 million, and cripple the companies they have spent a lifetime building, or they become complicit in a grave moral wrong.&#8221; (Slip op. at 20; see generally pp. 17-23.) The government&#8217;s supposedly compelling interest is nebulous (slip op. at 23-28), and even if it were compelling, the HHS mandate is not the least restrictive means of furthering that interest (slip op. at 28-32.)_​


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

No problem. 

Let's revoke their tax exemptions, too, while we are at it.  

But what I'd really like to see done with the churches is apply the consumer fraud laws to them.  Make them PROVE there is a heaven.  That would be interesting.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

Well it would seem to violate the imposed legal concept of "separation wall" between church and state. 

Conceptually, if we are talking revamping the tax system to a fair flat one with no deductions
I am on board.

God is not "provable", so by definition, it is a matter of faith. 
Really, atheists have a faith in no god- but they can not really prove it.
It is better to be agnostic. 


Then again,,,
Supporters of the non-falsifiable theory of global warming, errr cooling, errr climate change
are ultimately basing that on faith.

You seem to have no issue with that one?


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Well it would seem to violate the imposed legal concept of "separation wall" between church and state.
> 
> Conceptually, if we are talking revamping the tax system to a fair flat one with no deductions
> I am on board.
> ...



That's the point.  These churches take people's money when they can't prove....

1) If there is a God.
2) If they are the ones actually talking for him. 

Consumer Fraud.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 2, 2013)

Free choice 
so what

The gov't takes money by force from the people 
for the programs of the Great Society that have failed.

We have spent over 15 trillion since 1965 and have about
the same level of poverty.

Talk about consumer fraud

While I am enjoying this discourse and I know
one should never show their hand
but I must leave.

Any response from me will have to wait till
later


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 2, 2013)

Does anyone besides NeoTrollsky have anything to add to this thread, otherwise I'm done. 

Because, honestly, I'm getting bored with his Hate Radio talking points like he's having an original thought.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 3, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Does anyone besides NeoTrollsky have anything to add to this thread, otherwise I'm done.
> 
> Because, honestly, I'm getting bored with his Hate Radio talking points like he's having an original thought.



Too funny ... calling for 'back-up"

Your other habit of declaring that you won in some way
is more worthy of you. You should have stuck with that one,
it looks less weak...


Name calling really, I mean it is not like I am pretending to be a
former Democrat who has somehow "converted" - that would be more 
'troll" like, wouldn't you agree?


Yes 
hate... 
Strange, the only hate that has been seen here was from you

I find it amusing coming from someone who said, just in this abortion thread:



			
				JoeB131 said:
			
		

> I would never want my RIGHTS to be dictated by a majority of the stupid drooling masses and neither would you.





			
				JoeB131 said:
			
		

> When the 13 year old's m other is pimping her out, no, I don't think that's a big deal.





			
				JoeB131 said:
			
		

> Actually, Eugenics was considered a valid science in 1912. We now know a lot more about genetics, but the real problem was that the Nazis applied it with no real understanding of science and gave it a bad name





			
				JoeB131 said:
			
		

> this was back in the 1970's when they still forced unwitting Catholic Lesbians to become nuns and make children miserable


----------



## TemplarKormac (Nov 3, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Well it would seem to violate the imposed legal concept of "separation wall" between church and state.
> ...



Thing is, can you prove that this has anything to do with abortion?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 3, 2013)

Well to be fair to JoeB...

Let me explain,
apparently he needs the backup and help. 
While I can not speak for him like JoeB does,
I am sure it something Jesus would want me to do


The whole conversation was a sidetrack from the main issue of abortion.

I was posting to a nice "young Republican" from NJ when JoeB felt it necessary 
to interject himself into the conversation and side track the conversation. 

So you are correct...
Let us get back on track
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------






Planned Parenthood and the reactionary left is on the minority side of
how the majority feel about abortion
-majority of Americans do not believe in abortion with no restrictions
-majority do not support late term abortions


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 3, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



If it weren't for you religous nutters, Abortion would just be another medical procedure, and we wouldn't even be talking about this.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 3, 2013)

Again, does anyone besides NeoTrollsky have anything to add to this conversation?


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 3, 2013)

rubber-glue
from the poster who
pretends to be a former Republican

calling for backup
weak


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 3, 2013)

Okay, discussion's over. Unsubscribe.


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 3, 2013)

_Pride goeth before destruction..._


----------



## Neotrotsky (Nov 3, 2013)

Jackson said:


> My first sexual experience was when I was 21.  I was amazed to find I was pregnant but I welcomed the event for I thought it must be God's will.  (My parents were not so excited, lol, but I never seemed to notice)  I continued with my marriage plans and had a wonderful little boy.
> 
> I learned later on due to medical reasons I could not have more children but relished the time I had with my son.  He grew up to be a strapping young man, brilliant, handsome and a success at everything he tried.  Now a father of three delightful boys and a successful businessman, I often think what would my life be like  and the four people that came from that one night and decision be?
> 
> One night...one decision....four people and a lifetime of love.   Don't make the wrong choice.



Beautiful story- so true

A former colleague of mine, he and his wife had miscarriage after miscarriage.
They ultimately, adopted and that child brings much joy into their life.
But, they too think -thank God the mother gave up the child for adoption.


----------



## PixieStix (Nov 3, 2013)

Jackson said:


> My first sexual experience was when I was 21.  I was amazed to find I was pregnant but I welcomed the event for I thought it must be God's will.  (My parents were not so excited, lol, but I never seemed to notice)  I continued with my marriage plans and had a wonderful little boy.
> 
> I learned later on due to medical reasons I could not have more children but relished the time I had with my son.  He grew up to be a strapping young man, brilliant, handsome and a success at everything he tried.  Now a father of three delightful boys and a successful businessman, I often think what would my life be like  and the four people that came from that one night and decision be?
> 
> One night...one decision....four people and a lifetime of love.   Don't make the wrong choice.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 3, 2013)

Democrats are the party of death


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 27, 2013)

Vox said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



But its not a legal fact. 

Constitutional jurisprudence does not recognize a zygote/embryo/fetus as a person in the context of Constitutional rights, as such rights manifest only postnatally.


----------



## Katzndogz (Nov 27, 2013)

Jeremiah said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > It is very common today for women to authenticate themselves by claiming they had an abortion even if they never had one.
> ...


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 27, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> Democrats are the party of death



Actually theyre the Party of individual liberty and prohibiting government from violating the right to privacy. 

And they are the Party of life by advocating for real solutions to end abortion, not banning abortion which will do nothing to end the practice.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Democrats are the party of death
> ...



Party of individual liberty huh? Like the liberty to buy your own health insurance for example? 

How does a party that advocates abortion end abortion?


----------



## BDBoop (Nov 28, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



We fight for free contraception and education on the use thereof.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Same way every other civilized country has. 

reducing economic inequality, family and medical leave, universal health care, thorough sex eduction.  

It's why France has only about a quarter the number of abortions we have per capita. 

The idiocy is telling a woman she has to have a baby because your magic sky man said so.


----------



## Immanuel (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Democrats are the party of death
> ...



Oh bullshit!

They are opportunists just like their major opponents.  They use this issue to win votes and if next year they believed that by outlawing ALL abortions, they would win more votes and more elections, they would change their platform in a heartbeat.  They deserve no more respect over this issue than Republicans do.  

Party of individual liberty and prohibiting government from violating the right to privacy?  What the hell have you been smoking?

Immie


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 28, 2013)

TemplarKormac said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



And yet more ignorance from the right. 

The ACA isnt an individual liberty issue, it has nothing to do with substantive due process, as is the case with privacy rights. The IM is Constitutional as part of Congress taxing authority  and no one is forced to buy insurance. If you believe otherwise, feel free to cite the criminal penalty provision of the Act.  

Otherwise, its incumbent upon you and others on the right to propose actual solutions to abortion that comport with the Constitution and its case law.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 28, 2013)

Immanuel said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Nonsense. 

Since before _Roe_ democrats have been advocates of privacy rights, and have consistently defended that right over the decades, just as they have consistently supported voting rights, immigrants rights, the rights of homosexuals, same-sex couples, and transgender persons currently. 

To deny these facts is ignorant partisan idiocy on your part.


----------



## novasteve (Nov 28, 2013)

Taking pride in having an abortion is like being proud about drunk driving


----------



## BobPlumb (Nov 28, 2013)

I had a classmate in college that was pro choice.  She would become hyper emotional anytime the issue of abortion came up.  She spoke once about an anti abortion display that a religious group put up.  A little cross on the ground was used to represent each million lives lost to abortion since the Roe vs. Wade decision.  She said that she went over an stomped down the crosses.  I have to wonder if my classmate was so emotional because she had previously had an abortion.  I dared not ask her such a personal question at the time because I did not want my head bitten off.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

BobPlumb said:


> I had a classmate in college that was pro choice.  She would become hyper emotional anytime the issue of abortion came up.  She spoke once about an anti abortion display that a religious group put up.  A little cross on the ground was used to represent each million lives lost to abortion since the Roe vs. Wade decision.  She said that she went over an stomped down the crosses.  I have to wonder if my classmate was so emotional because she had previously had an abortion.  I dared not ask her such a personal question at the time because I did not want my head bitten off.



And it was none of your business, anyway.  

But, yeah, I would imagine that most women who have had to make a tough decision about the rest of their lives don't need some bible-thumping asshole talking smack to them.


----------



## novasteve (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> BobPlumb said:
> 
> 
> > I had a classmate in college that was pro choice.  She would become hyper emotional anytime the issue of abortion came up.  She spoke once about an anti abortion display that a religious group put up.  A little cross on the ground was used to represent each million lives lost to abortion since the Roe vs. Wade decision.  She said that she went over an stomped down the crosses.  I have to wonder if my classmate was so emotional because she had previously had an abortion.  I dared not ask her such a personal question at the time because I did not want my head bitten off.
> ...



Do you find anything morally questionable about killing your own child as a form of birth control?


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

novasteve said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > BobPlumb said:
> ...



Since a fetus isn't a "child"... no, I don't.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > Democrats are the party of death
> ...



I was correct in my post.... You dont care about privacy just killing babies because if you did care about privacy then Obamacare wouldn't have gotten a single vote.


----------



## OODA_Loop (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...





> _But more than half the states have either legislation or court rulings saying that where an assault on a pregnant woman results in the death of the fetus, the fetus can be considered a person for the purpose of bringing homicide charges.
> 
> Some of those laws specifically provide that the fetus must be viable before it can be given the legal status of personhood. Generally, the threshold of viability is about 26 weeks, or six months of pregnancy._



When the Death of a Fetus Is Murder - NYTimes.com


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> novasteve said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



And this is how they lie to themselves to try and lessen the guilt of infanticide.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > novasteve said:
> ...



No, a fetus isn't an infant. 

An infant can survive outside the uterus.  

A fetus, usually less than an inch long when most abortions are performed, cannot.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Aww look at the pro baby killer..... Tell me how long can a baby survive out of the womb without a parent or ANYONE feeding it or clothing it?


----------



## novasteve (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> novasteve said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Is a bean sprout not a bean plant?


----------



## novasteve (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


By your own logic you must support abortion at all stages of pregnancy then


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



The point there is ANYONE could feed it or clothe it.  

But the Kidney=bean sized fetus ONLY survives if the woman it is in decides it does.  

Unless you are willing to put all pregnant women under house arrest.  

Heck, why stop there?  We need to totally regulate their diets and activities, because that kidney-bean sized fetus deserves the very best, right?  

Where does it stop?


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Now hyperbole to try and distract from your fail of a argument. You support killing human defenceless babies and all the excuses you try and make doesn't cover up this fact 

tapatalk post


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Vox said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


At one point the law didn't recognize a black man as a person ether.... I guess that why you democrats always want to enslave them.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

novasteve said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



I think that decision should be left up to the woman and her doctor.  

Everyone else- MYOFB


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



No, I support the right of a woman to make the best decisions for her own life.  

I don't put the rights of a fetus above the woman it is in.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Vox said:
> ...



The law said no such thing.  No one denied the humanity of slaves. (Not that there was a great emphasis on the value of humanity through most of history.)  

It just recognized some people could own other people.


----------



## Fang (Nov 28, 2013)

I support a woman's right to choose, but not a woman who glorifies that choice. It's not something anyone should ever be proud of.


----------



## Lib (Nov 28, 2013)

Fang said:


> I support a woman's right to choose, but not a woman who glorifies that choice. It's not something anyone should ever be proud of.



Huh? How does one glorify an abortion? Wave banners? 
It is not something a woman is proud of or ashamed of...it just is


----------



## Lib (Nov 28, 2013)

novasteve said:


> Taking pride in having an abortion is like being proud about drunk driving



It's more taking pride in a vasectomy. Your analogy is silly


----------



## Lib (Nov 28, 2013)

Neotrotsky said:


> Jackson said:
> 
> 
> > My first sexual experience was when I was 21.  I was amazed to find I was pregnant but I welcomed the event for I thought it must be God's will.  (My parents were not so excited, lol, but I never seemed to notice)  I continued with my marriage plans and had a wonderful little boy.
> ...



If there was a good god, she would have gotten pregnant. God gets all the credit and none of the blame


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

Lib said:


> novasteve said:
> 
> 
> > Taking pride in having an abortion is like being proud about drunk driving
> ...



You are truly a clueless idiot.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



You democrats denied that blacks are human ...  you evil assholes still do deny they are human.


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


It only survives if the woman decides. If it is surviving, then isn't it a life?


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Yeah i know if a black person actually thinks for himself. He is a uncle tom.


----------



## novasteve (Nov 28, 2013)

Lib said:


> novasteve said:
> 
> 
> > Taking pride in having an abortion is like being proud about drunk driving
> ...



That's the stupidest thing I have ever read on here


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

Lib said:


> Neotrotsky said:
> 
> 
> > Jackson said:
> ...


The devil is in charge of evil. Remember there is no hurt in heaven.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Nobody denied that.  

And actually, the 3/5th of a free man rule was insisted upon by Northern legislators to reduce the South's representation in COngress.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> Lib said:
> 
> 
> > Neotrotsky said:
> ...



But that begs the question of why God allows the Devil to be in charge of evil to start with, doesn't it?


----------



## Iceman (Nov 28, 2013)

Abortions are very whorish, women who get them equal damaged goods. Men who allow them to happen, pathetic shells of men.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


LOL stupid fuck the 3/5th clause was created by republicans LOL


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Actually, there were no Democrats or Republicans at the time the consitution was enacted. 

There were just Jefferson's "Democratic Republicans" and Adams' "Federalists"... and it was the Northern legislators who inisted on the 3/5th rule because otherwise the south would dominate congress if slaves were fully counted.


----------



## Iceman (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



LOL there was no GOP at the time of the Constitutional Convention.

The 3/5ths portion of the Constitution was proposed by the northern states to curb the power of the southern states. The southern states wanted the count the slaves as persons for more reps in Congress.

Three-Fifths Compromise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> jknowgood said:
> 
> 
> > Lib said:
> ...



Adam and eve made that decision. God gave humans the right to make choices, but we have live with whatever comes about, because of them. Goverment took religion out of everything it could and look at whats happened.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > jknowgood said:
> ...



So let me get this straight.  

God tells the Mud Man and the Rib Woman that they can't eat of the magic tree he put smack dab in the middle of their home instead of putting it let's say in Outer Mongolia where they couldn't find it.   Then a talking snake comes along (that was the devil in disguise, right) and tells them to eat from the tree, because, hey, Mud Man and Rib Woman don't know any better, they were just born last week, and didn't even realize they were freaking naked!  

So that's why this poor woman who wanted kids had multiple miscarriages because the Devil made Adam and Eve choose to eat magic fruit from a tree... or something.


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> jknowgood said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Pretty much, there is more go the story. Tell me your belief on the begining of mankind. Have you morphed global warming into the story yet?


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

Human beings evolved from primates.  Deal with it.  

Nothing special, no sky pixies, no talking snakes or magic trees.


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Human beings evolved from primates.  Deal with it.
> 
> Nothing special, no sky pixies, no talking snakes or magic trees.



Explain flagellum.


----------



## Noomi (Nov 28, 2013)

You gotta prove that Adam and Eve actually existed first.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

Noomi said:


> You gotta prove that Adam and Eve actually existed first.



You have never met an Adam or Eve?

tapatalk post


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 28, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > jknowgood said:
> ...



And when religion was in government we had slavery, women as chattel, and religious tests for political office. 

That you fail to understand the wisdom of the Framers to ensure church and state remain separate comes as no surprise.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> jknowgood said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Bullshit 

tapatalk post


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 28, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> > jknowgood said:
> ...



More evidence as to the wisdom of the Framers, where the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment was intended to protect citizens from the hate and arrogance of the Christian right.


----------



## thanatos144 (Nov 28, 2013)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > C_Clayton_Jones said:
> ...



You are again talking out of your ass it says no where in the Constitution of separation of state and church. It says state cannot form its own church and state cannot interfere with the way you worship.

tapatalk post


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 28, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Human beings evolved from primates.  Deal with it.
> ...



Where is that mentioned in the bible?


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_HVrjKcvrU]Irreducible Complexity (bacterial flagellum) debunked - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 28, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> jknowgood said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



It's not, just science proves it cannot just become, it has to have a creator.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 29, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > jknowgood said:
> ...



Actually, science has proven it can just become, if you had watched the video, he explains it pretty well. 

There are no sky pixies.  You can actually enjoy your life and go ahead and have an abortion.  no one is going to mind and there is no afterlife.


----------



## jknowgood (Nov 29, 2013)

Coming from someone who still thinks obama is doing a good job. Lol What i have read flagellum had to be created, just couldn't appear. As to abortion, well since it was legalized society on a moral level has gone into a downward spiral. Just saying.


----------



## JoeB131 (Nov 29, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> Coming from someone who still thinks obama is doing a good job. Lol What i have read flagellum had to be created, just couldn't appear. As to abortion, well since it was legalized society on a moral level has gone into a downward spiral. Just saying.



What you have read is absolute horseshit from Creationist websites.  

Yes, these things can really just appear.  

Actually, Abortion has been a boon to society.  People aren't being born to people who don't wan them.  

Frankly, what a great thing it would have been if Charles Manson's mother had had an abortion.


----------



## koshergrl (Nov 29, 2013)

Lib said:


> Fang said:
> 
> 
> > I support a woman's right to choose, but not a woman who glorifies that choice. It's not something anyone should ever be proud of.
> ...


 
You're wrong:

Health Controversy: Women Throwing "Abortion Parties"

"
"Maggie, a 22-year-old college senior with no intention of bringing a child into the world yet, was going to have an abortion," writes Duncan. "She told us that she had already made up her mind; she had even determined the time, date and location. ... 'We're having a party Friday to raise money,' Maggie said. 'You guys are obviously invited.' An abortion party. For the price of whatever we were willing to donate, she explained, we could partake of baked goods, beer and dancing. It was going to start at 10 p.m. at Maggie's."


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## JoeB131 (Nov 29, 2013)

Awesome.  Sounds like a great party to get laid at.


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## koshergrl (Nov 29, 2013)

Yeah, I'm sure the 22 year old co-eds line up to ball you, loser.


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## Iceman (Nov 29, 2013)

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She should be flogged in public for such behavior. What a whore.


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## jknowgood (Nov 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


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Maybe you should quit getting your information from global warming web sites. You make a strong point about manson, but his dad should've let him out on his mothers stomah. I guess on this subject we will have to agree to disagree.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 29, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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> Maybe you should quit getting your information from global warming web sites. You make a strong point about manson, but his dad should've let him out on his mothers stomah. I guess on this subject we will have to agree to disagree.



Uh, 95% of climate scientists think AGW is happening. 

95%.  

I want that number to sink in for a moment. 

The people who actually study this stuff and understand it far better than you or I ever could, and 95% say, "Yup, this is a problem!"  

Now, what percentage of molecular biologists believe in talking snakes?  

My guess would be, not many.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 29, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Yeah, I'm sure the 22 year old co-eds line up to ball you, loser.



Lots of girls out there with Daddy Issues... Just sayin'.  

(Pssst. Not that I actually have any desire to tap a 20 something. I have ties older than that. I just like watching you get pissed off at the thought of people enjoying themselves...)


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## koshergrl (Nov 29, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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So Joe maintains that men should be allowed to force women into abortions.

Not that I didn't know this already, but it's good to see him admitting it.

Women are at highest risk of murder when they're pregnant...because men like joe feel they have the right to kill their babies.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 29, 2013)

koshergrl said:


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Please point out where I suggested a man should be able to force an abortion. 

Okay, realizing English isn't your strong point.. here's what I said.. 

Frankly, what a great thing it would have been if Charles Manson's mother had had an abortion

In short, I'm sure Mrs. Manson was probably sorry she didn't have one after the Tate-Labianca murders...


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## Ernie S. (Nov 29, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


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> ...



Imagine that! I had no idea that you and Charley were brothers.


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


> Coming from someone who still thinks obama is doing a good job. Lol What i have read flagellum had to be created, just couldn't appear. As to abortion, well since it was legalized society on a moral level has gone into a downward spiral. Just saying.


Obama is doing a great job.....especially considering what he inherited
Abortion wasn't legal during the age of drugs, sex and rock and roll, so that argument is silly. 
What is so great, if you can't explain something you just say, "god did it"


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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Babies aren't in women's stomachs..if that was the case she could just poop him out.


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

Lib said:


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Excuse me i was trying to be politically correct. The real saying is his dad should've pulled out and shot him on the wall.


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## koshergrl (Nov 30, 2013)

If dad had been less of a monster, he wouldn't have been a killer to begin with.

It's scary that you baby killers don't understand that it is the depravity of society, that is exemplified and fed by legalized abortion, that results in monsters. Manson's mother was a prostitute...a noble profession, and one that the abortion industry props up.


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

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## Iceman (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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Nothing just appeared, matter has always existed. It cannot be created or destroyed.


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

Lib said:


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Obama is doing a horrible job. He is a liar. The age of drugs, sex, and rockin role helped bring abortion on. Just look goverment took God out of school and look what has happened.


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## ItsOnlyMe (Nov 30, 2013)

Jeremiah said:


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I totally agree with you.  But you know, I'm so tired of this being an issue with the candidates to the point that the Democrats win, I wish the Republicans would make the Democrats think that getting an abortion is something we WANT them to do, that we don't WANT them reproducing, they'd change their tune.  And they obviously are NOT taking their government birth control either. Convince them we have no intention of stopping them from aborting or using birth control.  On the contrary -  we PREFER they do!!  AND - in fact if they DON'T and produce a baby and have no means of support, don't think they will go on welfare, they will be forced to relinquish the baby and any parental rights.

The same for gay marriage.   ENCOURAGE it, make it something we INSIST they do.  This will be the only way they CAN get benefits is to BE married.


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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Lol...it was the generation that prayed in school, that grew up to be the generation of drugs sex and rock and roll. It is religion that is the root of all evil.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 30, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> If dad had been less of a monster, he wouldn't have been a killer to begin with.
> 
> It's scary that you baby killers don't understand that it is the depravity of society, that is exemplified and fed by legalized abortion, that results in monsters. Manson's mother was a prostitute...a noble profession, and one that the abortion industry props up.



Kochergirl, is there any ill in the world you are unwilling to blame on abortion?  

The heartbreak of psoriasis, perhaps. 

Incidently, there is nothing to indicate either Manson's biological or adopted fathers were "monsters".


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## JoeB131 (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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People started thinking for themselves.  

Frankly, after 2000 years of crusades, inquisittions, torture of heretics, burning of witches, etc... getting God out of all our lives would probably be a good thing.


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

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You do realize it was that generation that rebelled? They wanted to do as they pleased. Well we see the democrat party of today. Abortion on demand paid for and free birth control. Free love, the problem is everyone else is paying for it


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


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Know we have a crusade of everything without morales. My gosh we have trannies dancing around for kids at a parade. We teach small children that being gay is okay. Before the time sex shouldn't be an issue.


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## Avatar4321 (Nov 30, 2013)

I feel sorry for any woman who feels the need to kill their child or is forced to.


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## koshergrl (Nov 30, 2013)

Me too. 

I'm sorry for women who think killing a baby is more acceptable than carrying one to term.


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## Avatar4321 (Nov 30, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Me too.
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> I'm sorry for women who think killing a baby is more acceptable than carrying one to term.



If more men would step up and accept their responsibilities, I think there would be far less women feeling desperate and far fewer abortions.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 30, 2013)

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I'm not sure why you are dragging someone named Morales into this.  

Okay, but somehow, I think that trannies dancing in front of kids is a lot less serious than burning a woman at the stake for being a witch.  

I think teaching kids that being gay is okay (because 10% of them are) is a lot better than torturing a heretic who didn't think Jesus was made out of wafers.  (No, seriously, you Xians used to do this to each other.)


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## JoeB131 (Nov 30, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Me too.
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> I'm sorry for women who think killing a baby is more acceptable than carrying one to term.



You can make that decision for your life, but not for anyone else... 


Thank C'Thulhu.


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

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What burning at the stake happened over 200 years ago? Kinda like slavery? The religion i pratice doesn't do either. Remember it was the democrats that was against eqaul rights. Heck ya'll hold blacks back today.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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> What burning at the stake happened over 200 years ago? Kinda like slavery? The religion i pratice doesn't do either. Remember it was the democrats that was against eqaul rights. Heck ya'll hold blacks back today.



You know what, you need to turn off the Hate Radio and start doing some thinking for yourself. 

http://rendezvous.blogs.nytimes.com...-as-witches-in-papua-new-guinea-in-2013/?_r=0



> It was published last week before news shot around the world on Tuesday that the police in Papua New Guinea, in another case, had charged two people with torturing and killing a 20-year-old mother, Kepari Leniata, whom they accused of being a witch. Ms. Leniata was stripped, tortured with a hot iron rod, doused in gasoline and set alight on a pile of car tires and trash earlier this month in front of a crowd of hundreds of people, including young children, The Associated Press reported.


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## JoeB131 (Nov 30, 2013)

Thank god there were no trannies for those kids to see!


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

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A pregnant woman decides for a baby. Not for herself.


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## jknowgood (Nov 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Thank god there were no trannies for those kids to see!



Your blind, but so are you with obama.


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## Noomi (Nov 30, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Me too.
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> I'm sorry for women who think killing a baby is more acceptable than carrying one to term.



I'm sorry for the protesters who believe that verbally abusing women who have abortions is more acceptable than helping the abortion problem by adopting an unwanted child.


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## Noomi (Nov 30, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> Thank god there were no trannies for those kids to see!



Ssshh!!! Novasteve might pop by for a visit!


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## thanatos144 (Nov 30, 2013)

Noomi said:


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Why do you hate babies do much? 

tapatalk post


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 30, 2013)

koshergrl said:


> Me too.
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> I'm sorry for women who think killing a baby is more acceptable than carrying one to term.



Feel sorry for whomever you want. 

Just keep it out of secular law.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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In your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law. 

Which means you shouldnt have an abortion if thats your belief, but dont attempt to force that belief on society in general via secular law. 

You and others on the right need to stop whining about killing babies and focus instead on finding viable solutions to the problem of abortion that comport with privacy rights jurisprudence  unless, of course, youre not really interested in ending abortion, and see it rather as some valuable political weapon.


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

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We could teach children to think as you do....hate others. We teach kids respect for all people until they prove they don't deserve it


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

Avatar4321 said:


> I feel sorry for any woman who feels the need to kill their child or is forced to.



Women who kill children are committing a crime. We aren't talking about children


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## Lib (Nov 30, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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And do t leave out that when the civil rights acts passed the democrats who hated desegregation became republicans, Dixiecrats?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

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Fetuses aren't babies...  

And she does decide for herself.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

jknowgood said:


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But...but...but... Obama.  

Hey, here's the thing. The GOP could have gotten my vote if they didn't nominate a weird Mormon robot that hated working people.  

but they totally went with that.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 1, 2013)

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Lol what complete bullshit 

tapatalk post


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


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I voted for the Republican in every election between 1980 and 2008. 

But that was before they let the religious nutters completely take over the party.  

When you nominate a guy who thinks he's wearing magic underwear and is going to rule his own planet in the afterlife, you guys just went too nutty for me.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 1, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


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Who do you expect to buy that line of shit? 

tapatalk post


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


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Again, you believe in magic sky men, but not that a guy could change his mind after you all got too nutty?


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## Jarlaxle (Dec 1, 2013)

thanatos144 said:


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He has repeated it enough that HE believes it...and thinks everyone is as dumb as he is.  Joey is equal parts pathetic and hilarious.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

Jarlaxle said:


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Nope, I just know who I voted for in those previous elections.  

You don't. 

Sadly, the difference is, I finally figured out if you ain't rich, the GOP has nothing for you. 

I mean, you can sit there and hope they'll force a lady to have a baby she doesn't want or stop them queers from being queer, but the GOP is just about making sure that you are working very hard to make the rich richer.  

I figured that out, you are obviously too dumb to.


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## Jarlaxle (Dec 1, 2013)

You're too dumb to realize why you're dumb, boy.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

Jarlaxle said:


> You're too dumb to realize why you're dumb, boy.



Wrenchie, you are too dumb to realize you vote against your own economic interests. 

You just drive along the road all day listening to the Hate Radio and saying, "Yup, that's it, Rush, they all be socialists!!!"


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## jknowgood (Dec 1, 2013)

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Yeah tell that to senator byrd. Also i taught my son to treat everyone equally. Nkt to treat someone special, because their queer. I don't see any hate in that.


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## Jarlaxle (Dec 1, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


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I don't listen to Rush and haven't in something like fifteen years...but hey, you're wrong about everything else, what's one more display of your idiocy?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 1, 2013)

I'm always amazed how many right-wingers deny they listen to Rush while repeating his talking points verbatim.


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## Esmeralda (Dec 1, 2013)

JoeB131 said:


> I'm always amazed how many right-wingers deny they listen to Rush while repeating his talking points verbatim.



So true.  It's funny; you'd think if they thought so highly of someone to repeat everything he says, they'd admit to their admiration for him, but, instead, they are ashamed of him, so ashamed of him they deny listening to him.


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## Lib (Dec 1, 2013)

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Bet you use the word queer too. You sound like the skin heads who tell their kids to treat all kids the same even if they're niggahs.  I would tell senator Byrd, but he hasn't been around in a while.


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## Iceman (Dec 1, 2013)

Abortions are generally for whores, and the men that stand by and support them are shells of men.


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## jknowgood (Dec 1, 2013)

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Lol , i could care less how you think. I don't judge people by their color. In my opion, as you call it. There are white and black niggas. Also i could care less who you are screwing, just don't go out of your way to let me know.


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## novasteve (Dec 1, 2013)

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What does the q in lgbtqia stand for?


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## Jarlaxle (Dec 1, 2013)

Esmeralda said:


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Haven't listened to Rush in many years.  I listen to exactly two political talk radio shows regularly: Jeff Kuhner in the morning (6-10) and Howie Carr (3-7).  If I'm on the road late (usually in the summer), I might have Mark Levin on. (He follows Howie on the same station.)  The only other talk radio I listen to is WEEI's sports talk.


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