# Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America, we must do it



## kaz

In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.

The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.

The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.

I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.

But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.

I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.

Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


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## JoeB131

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.



Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago. 

And the Germans 100 years ago. 

And the Poles 50 years ago.  



kaz said:


> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.



Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.  

We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.) 



kaz said:


> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.



Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...  

Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.  

The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.


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## kaz

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago
Click to expand...


Wrong, they came here legally and had to prove they had the ability to support themselves and we could check to ensure they weren't criminals.  Your argument falls apart right there.  My issue is illegal aliens self selecting and then going on welfare and bringing crime, drugs and guns with them.  Mexicans who prove they can support themselves and they aren't already criminals is all I want, just like with the Irish, Germans and Poles.

That's all I want.  Come legally, let us check them out.

Sorry, guy, your argument falls apart right there as a false equivalency


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## MACAULAY

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
Click to expand...

____________

Irish, Germans and Poles came over LEGALLY.

I didn't read the rest of your post as I feared being blinded by Sophistry and Obfuscation.

_____


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## Siete

aint gonna be no goddamn wall ... deal with it dipshits.


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## aaronleland

You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.


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## kaz

Siete said:


> aint gonna be no goddamn wall ... deal with it dipshits.



Your stats missed congress at about 6%


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## kaz

TheMoreYouKnow said:


> "I'll  bring back the check this weekend..I promise."
> \



Another government school failure who needs to go back  and learn basic English, such as how to paraphrase.

And no one gives a shit who pays for the wall except leftists


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## kaz

aaronleland said:


> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.



Based on what?


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## usmbguest5318

> Will you vote for Trump in 2020?


Hell, no!  And I'm not guessing; it's 100% certainty that I won't vote for Trump in 2020.  I will vote for Bobo the Bonobo before I vote for Trump.


----------



## aaronleland

kaz said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Based on what?
Click to expand...


I don't know. The fact that we don't have the funding to lay a single brick yet?


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.


----------



## kaz

aaronleland said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Based on what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know. The fact that we don't have the funding to lay a single brick yet?
Click to expand...


Funding is tiny as a percent of the Federal budget, that's not an issue other than the political issue of Democrats trying to stop it.  Which is what my OP is about, right?


----------



## kaz

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.
Click to expand...


It's hate to not want criminals who ignore our laws as their first act entering the country to come here through self selection.  Got it.

You remind me of someone ...


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## Michelle420

Who is running in 2020 against Trump?


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## kaz

Xelor said:


> Will you vote for Trump in 2020?
> 
> 
> 
> Hell, no!  And I'm not guessing; it's 100% certainty that I won't vote for Trump in 2020.  I will vote for Bobo the Bonobo before I vote for Trump.
Click to expand...


You have three options in the poll that cover that


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## aaronleland

kaz said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Based on what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know. The fact that we don't have the funding to lay a single brick yet?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Funding is tiny as a percent of the Federal budget, that's not an issue other than the political issue of Democrats trying to stop it.  Which is what my OP is about, right?
Click to expand...


The GOP doesn't want the wall. Mexico doesn't want the wall. Nobody is paying for the wall.


----------



## usmbguest5318

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.
Click to expand...

My disdain and dissatisfaction with Trump has only to do with his character, and that's not going to convincingly change for the better between now and 2020.  Build the wall, or don't.  Effect universal peace on Earth and goodwill amongst all mankind.  It matters not.  Donald Trump yet will remain a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale.


----------



## kaz

drifter said:


> Who is running in 2020 against Trump?



The poll asks for your "best guess"


----------



## toomuchtime_

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


The wall will be built, it will cost about 20% of what the Democrats clain it will and it will be about 99% effective in keeping illegals from Mexico out, but since Trump came into office illegal immigration from Mexico is already dramatically down from the reckless Obama years due to Trump's tough talk and tough actions, so we have time.


----------



## kaz

aaronleland said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Based on what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know. The fact that we don't have the funding to lay a single brick yet?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Funding is tiny as a percent of the Federal budget, that's not an issue other than the political issue of Democrats trying to stop it.  Which is what my OP is about, right?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The GOP doesn't want the wall. Mexico doesn't want the wall. Nobody is paying for the wall.
Click to expand...


True, true and we'll see


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## Rambunctious

I voted for Trump because our nations leaders were screwing up...stupid wars we either couldn't or wouldn't win or the ridiculous idea to rebuild nations that we destroyed even though they don't want us there...

Out of control spending...Obama doubled the nations debt. and couldn't get the nation back on track economically...

The malls were empty...shut down stores...lawless communities were growing not getting smaller with kids being killed over a street corner...and no one seemed to care...new normal they called it...

Then they made the ultimate sin and messed with what was mine...my health insurance...I had been responsible and paid for an insurance plan that worked for me and my employees...it was affordable and it was a PPO which meant my employees didn't have to jump through hoops to see a specialist...

They took that away from me and gave me an unaffordable mess in return...
I figured that DC was broken at that point and needed an outsider...a businessman that could return America to a prosperous nation again and here came Trump down the stairs at his hotel...at first I laughed and cringed a little but then I realized he was saying the same things I had said and thought...

Obama blew it...he could have been great but he set his sights on eliminating the GOP...he wanted revenge for himself and his community...Big mistake...
Trump will call out congress even members of his own party...That's long overdue...

We are and have been played like fools from our nations leaders...they say one thing but do what they want...they prosper in ways that would toss us in prison if we tried it and they get away with it because the media and they are best of friends...

If the libs on this board could for one day put their blind hatred for Trump aside they would realize that an outsider like Trump that will battle the do nothing house and especially the broken Senate is a good thing...

If the libs on this board would stop swallowing the MSM line that comes straight from the DNC and think about what really is important to themselves they would be voting for Trump in 2020 too...


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## Thinker101

Xelor said:


> Will you vote for Trump in 2020?
> 
> 
> 
> Hell, no!  And I'm not guessing; it's 100% certainty that I won't vote for Trump in 2020.  I will vote for Bobo the Bonobo before I vote for Trump.
Click to expand...


Then you better hope Bobo the Bonobo comes back from India in one piece.


----------



## kaz

Xelor said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My disdain and dissatisfaction with Trump has only to do with his character, and that's not going to convincingly change for the better between now and 2020.  Build the wall, or don't.  Effect universal peace on Earth and goodwill amongst all mankind.  It matters not.  Donald Trump yet will remain a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale.
Click to expand...


Fair enough.  The wall was my argument.  I gave you several poll choices that disagree with me


----------



## usmbguest5318

Xelor said:


> Will you vote for Trump in 2020?
> 
> 
> 
> Hell, no!  And I'm not guessing; it's 100% certainty that I won't vote for Trump in 2020.  I will vote for Bobo the Bonobo before I vote for Trump.
Click to expand...




Thinker101 said:


> Then you better hope Bobo the Bonobo comes back from India in one piece.


Oh, dear....How droll....


----------



## Thinker101

Xelor said:


> Xelor said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will you vote for Trump in 2020?
> 
> 
> 
> Hell, no!  And I'm not guessing; it's 100% certainty that I won't vote for Trump in 2020.  I will vote for Bobo the Bonobo before I vote for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then you better hope Bobo the Bonobo comes back from India in one piece.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh, dear....How droll....
Click to expand...


Good to know you get amused easily.


----------



## Timmy

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.



Wall is a silly waste of money .  There are more efficient ways to fight illegal immigration.

By the way, there are no illegals voting .  The whole illegal issue is not that big of a deal, it’s a distraction.  Easy scapegoats .


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## C_Clayton_Jones

“The data show that fences don’t keep migrants out — they just keep them from going home.”

Donald Trump’s Mexican Border Wall Is a Moronic Idea

The moronic border ‘wall’ is the idea of a moronic president.


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## C_Clayton_Jones

Xelor said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My disdain and dissatisfaction with Trump has only to do with his character, and that's not going to convincingly change for the better between now and 2020.  Build the wall, or don't.  Effect universal peace on Earth and goodwill amongst all mankind.  It matters not.  Donald Trump yet will remain a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale.
Click to expand...

Trump is a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale who is also wrong on the issues – all the more reason to not vote for him.


----------



## Rambunctious

Timmy said:


> Wall is a silly waste of money . There are *more efficient ways to fight illegal immigration*.


But the libs fight them as well...they don't want cheap labor and future dependent people to stop coming here...it's time to go to the summer lawn....who's gonna plant it? disgraceful...


----------



## kaz

Timmy said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wall is a silly waste of money .  There are more efficient ways to fight illegal immigration.
> 
> By the way, there are no illegals voting .  The whole illegal issue is not that big of a deal, it’s a distraction.  Easy scapegoats .
Click to expand...


Yeah, more efficiently than physically blocking them.

What you mean is exactly what my post said.  You want illegal immigration and you know the wall will work, you must stop it at any cost


----------



## kaz

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Xelor said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My disdain and dissatisfaction with Trump has only to do with his character, and that's not going to convincingly change for the better between now and 2020.  Build the wall, or don't.  Effect universal peace on Earth and goodwill amongst all mankind.  It matters not.  Donald Trump yet will remain a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Trump is a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale who is also wrong on the issues – all the more reason to not vote for him.
Click to expand...


Typical leftist argument.  No logic, just attack.  And anyone who disagrees with you is not just wrong, they are evil.

It's the only bullet in your gun because your stupid ideas are illogical and don't work


----------



## kaz

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> “The data show that fences don’t keep migrants out — they just keep them from going home.”
> 
> Donald Trump’s Mexican Border Wall Is a Moronic Idea
> 
> The moronic border ‘wall’ is the idea of a moronic president.



Why would we stop anyone from going back to Mexico?  Talk about a moronic idea


----------



## TomParks

Bottom line Democrats cant win national elections with their current base thus they need the large influx of illegals to turn southern border states blue. Until the wall is built we need a large increase of ICE and fines for employers hiring them.....also cutting out the entitlements to illegals will work maybe better than a wall....free stuff quits they head home.


----------



## beagle9

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


 .The wall is thee most contentious issue to be used against the republicans in the 2020 election (if it is attempted to be built), and if huge dollars are spent, and then it fails.

Building specific barriers suitable for the landscape along the border in order to conform to the needs within the areas that are at risk is Ok, and repairing or upgrading other barriers already in place is also OK.  Mix that with better technology, drones, new roads, sensors, troops where needed, unchained border patrol, e-verify (enforced big time), sanctuary cities stopped, and the deportation starts yielding great results, and then look for the instant results in everything associated with the issue.

If can do all this in concert, the elections in 2020 will be Trump, Trump, Trump.

Right now the wall is like a huge target that has been placed on the backs of the GOP.

The Demon-crats are locked and loaded for the failure or they will do their level best to cause the failure.


----------



## Timmy

kaz said:


> Timmy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wall is a silly waste of money .  There are more efficient ways to fight illegal immigration.
> 
> By the way, there are no illegals voting .  The whole illegal issue is not that big of a deal, it’s a distraction.  Easy scapegoats .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, more efficiently than physically blocking them.
> 
> What you mean is exactly what my post said.  You want illegal immigration and you know the wall will work, you must stop it at any cost
Click to expand...


40% of illegals come in legally .  Wall does zero for that .

Ever notice no one else would run on this dumb wall idea?  Why?  Cause it’s stupid .  We are talking 1200 miles . Mostly thru wasteland .


----------



## kaz

TomParks said:


> Bottom line Democrats cant win national elections with their current base thus they need the large influx of illegals to turn southern border states blue. Until the wall is built we need a large increase of ICE and fines for employers hiring them.....also cutting out the entitlements to illegals will work maybe better than a wall....free stuff quits they head home.



Yep.  And Democrats are turning blue collar whites back into Republicans because of their anti-jobs policies


----------



## kaz

beagle9 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> .The wall is thee most contentious issue to be used against the republicans in the 2020 election (if it is attempted to be built), and if huge dollars are spent, and then it fails.
> 
> Building specific barriers suitable for the landscape along the border in order to conform to the needs within the areas that are at risk is Ok, and repairing or upgrading other barriers already in place is also OK.  Mix that with better technology, drones, new roads, sensors, troops where needed, unchained border patrol, e-verify (enforced big time), sanctuary cities stopped, and the deportation starts yielding great results, and then look for the instant results in everything associated with the issue.
> 
> If can do all this in concert, the elections in 2020 will be Trump, Trump, Trump.
> 
> Right now the wall is like a huge target that has been placed on the backs of the GOP.
> 
> The Demon-crats are locked and loaded for the failure or they will do their level best to cause the failure.
Click to expand...


Americans overwhelmingly want the southern border secured.  I just see no evidence of this


----------



## kaz

Timmy said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Timmy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wall is a silly waste of money .  There are more efficient ways to fight illegal immigration.
> 
> By the way, there are no illegals voting .  The whole illegal issue is not that big of a deal, it’s a distraction.  Easy scapegoats .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, more efficiently than physically blocking them.
> 
> What you mean is exactly what my post said.  You want illegal immigration and you know the wall will work, you must stop it at any cost
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 40% of illegals come in legally .  Wall does zero for that .
> 
> Ever notice no one else would run on this dumb wall idea?  Why?  Cause it’s stupid .  We are talking 1200 miles . Mostly thru wasteland .
Click to expand...


Again your desperation to stop the wall because you know it will work, not because you think it won't. And yes, we need to deal with the other 40% too.   We need to deal with both


----------



## Michelle420

kaz said:


> drifter said:
> 
> 
> 
> Who is running in 2020 against Trump?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The poll asks for your "best guess"
Click to expand...


It all depends on who is running. Your poll does not have the option of,"voted 3rd party but can be swayed to the mainstream vote."


----------



## beagle9

kaz said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> .The wall is thee most contentious issue to be used against the republicans in the 2020 election (if it is attempted to be built), and if huge dollars are spent, and then it fails.
> 
> Building specific barriers suitable for the landscape along the border in order to conform to the needs within the areas that are at risk is Ok, and repairing or upgrading other barriers already in place is also OK.  Mix that with better technology, drones, new roads, sensors, troops where needed, unchained border patrol, e-verify (enforced big time), sanctuary cities stopped, and the deportation starts yielding great results, and then look for the instant results in everything associated with the issue.
> 
> If can do all this in concert, the elections in 2020 will be Trump, Trump, Trump.
> 
> Right now the wall is like a huge target that has been placed on the backs of the GOP.
> 
> The Demon-crats are locked and loaded for the failure or they will do their level best to cause the failure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Americans overwhelmingly want the southern border secured.  I just see no evidence of this
Click to expand...

. Secured yes, but that includes a comprehensive attack on all things illegal. A wall in some areas is needed yes, but not a huge Jericho wall as was dipicted in the Bible. There's political hype, and then there is reality.


----------



## JoeB131

kaz said:


> Wrong, they came here legally and had to prove they had the ability to support themselves and we could check to ensure they weren't criminals. Your argument falls apart right there.



Uh, guy, all you had to do was get here on a boat back in the day.. All these sponsorship and other restrictions came later. 



kaz said:


> My issue is illegal aliens self selecting and then going on welfare and bringing crime, drugs and guns with them.



Which isn't really happening, but don't let that stop your bigotry, Cleetus. 



kaz said:


> Mexicans who prove they can support themselves and they aren't already criminals is all I want, just like with the Irish, Germans and Poles.
> 
> That's all I want. Come legally, let us check them out.
> 
> Sorry, guy, your argument falls apart right there as a false equivalency



Um, you really need to see what people were SAYING back in those days.  I can tell you right now, no one was happy to see my Grandparents when they came over from Germany 90 years ago.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

I voted for neither candidate in 2016.

I will wait until 2020 to decide pending the candidates.


----------



## Pogo

Why is there no choice for "are you insane, no I sure as fuck didn't vote for Rump then and ain't about to go there in this lifetime"?

Bogus "poll".  Belongs on fucking Drudge.


----------



## MindWars

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
Click to expand...


----------



## protectionist

JoeB131 said:


> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.


I'm half Hispanic.  No reason for American Hispanics to go against Trump.  He represents a protectionist stance for ALL Americans.   Since when do American Hispanics get invulnerable  against losing jobs to foreign invaders ? (wherever they may be from)

And since when do Americans (any of us) not lose out, when countries like Mexico and China pillage our economy for Billions$$ per year, as they've been doing ?

As for all your talk about race, for your edification, dark skinned people aren't the only foreigners that Democrats have been throwing at us, to build votes for themselves.  >>>


----------



## protectionist

Xelor said:


> Hell, no!  And I'm not guessing; it's 100% certainty that I won't vote for Trump in 2020.  I will vote for Bobo the Bonobo before I vote for Trump.


You own stock in outsourcing companies, including ones with illegal alien labor ? You're in prison and want to be released 20 years early ?  You're good with Sharia law ?  You're OK with racial discrimination (affirmative action), as long as blacks are the beneficiaries, and whites are the victims ?  Planning a mass shooting attack at some "gun-free zone" establishment ? 

If yes, then no, you wouldn't be voting for Trump.


----------



## JoeB131

protectionist said:


> I'm half Hispanic. No reason for American Hispanics to go against Trump. He represents a protectionist stance for ALL Americans. Since when do American Hispanics get invulnerable against losing jobs to foreign invaders ? (wherever they may be from)



Why would Hispanics support "protectionism". 

Do you know what Protectionism is? It's an admission that Americans are lazier and produce lower quality products, and need to be protected in their own markets for foreign competition.  Not sure why anyone supports that. 



protectionist said:


> And since when do Americans (any of us) not lose out, when countries like Mexico and China pillage our economy for Billions$$ per year, as they've been doing ?



Um, guy, here's the thing. we aren't losing out.  We give them money, they give us products.  If  consumers didn't want their products, they don't have to buy them.  Protectionism is 'We can't trust ourselves not to buy foreign products!!!"  

The reality- most manufacturing jobs weren't lost to foreign competition, they were lost to automation.  



protectionist said:


> As for all your talk about race, for your edification, dark skinned people aren't the only foreigners that Democrats have been throwing at us, to build votes for themselves. >>>



Exactly my point.  150 years ago, the bigots said this about the Irish, 100 years ago about the Germans, 50 years ago about the Poles.


----------



## Two Thumbs

the wall is the singal most ignorant idea since the hoover dam


----------



## Mac1958

The largest band-aid in the history of historical histories.


----------



## BluesLegend

We don't get Mexico's best and brightest, we get their filth. They pour across the border killing and raping Americans. We get their brutal gangs who hack people to death with machetes. We get their deviants who rape 6 and 9 year old girls. They ignore our laws, drive drunk as shit killing our citizens, no insurance, no licenses. Many can't even read the damn public road signs. They commit millions of crimes, 200,000 illegals in Texas committed 600,000 crimes alone. The illegals in our jails and prisons cost us $7 billion a year.

Now, do we have the same problem with Canada? Hell no. Canada is a well behaved neighboring country, no wall needed. But if we are going to protect our citizens from these filth in the south yeah we need a wall, the border must be secured.


----------



## JoeB131

BluesLegend said:


> Now, do we have the same problem with Canada? Hell no. Canada is a well behaved neighboring country, no wall needed. But if we are going to protect our citizens from these filth in the south yeah we need a wall, the border must be secured.



We don't have that problem with Canada because Canada is actually a nicer place to live, except for the weather.


----------



## BluesLegend

JoeB131 said:


> BluesLegend said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now, do we have the same problem with Canada? Hell no. Canada is a well behaved neighboring country, no wall needed. But if we are going to protect our citizens from these filth in the south yeah we need a wall, the border must be secured.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We don't have that problem with Canada because Canada is actually a nicer place to live, except for the weather.
Click to expand...


Thanks for agreeing with me, no issues with Canada no wall needed. Mexican filth pouring across our borders killing and raping our citizens, build a wall and shut them out.


----------



## Two Thumbs

JoeB131 said:


> BluesLegend said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now, do we have the same problem with Canada? Hell no. Canada is a well behaved neighboring country, no wall needed. But if we are going to protect our citizens from these filth in the south yeah we need a wall, the border must be secured.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We don't have that problem with Canada because Canada is actually a nicer place to live, except for the weather.
Click to expand...

are you calling Mexico a shithole nation?


you fucking racist


----------



## BluesLegend

Two Thumbs said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluesLegend said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now, do we have the same problem with Canada? Hell no. Canada is a well behaved neighboring country, no wall needed. But if we are going to protect our citizens from these filth in the south yeah we need a wall, the border must be secured.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We don't have that problem with Canada because Canada is actually a nicer place to live, except for the weather.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> are you calling Mexico a shithole nation?
> 
> 
> you fucking racist
Click to expand...


You got JoeB by the balls now.


----------



## Old Rocks

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


Yes, let us build a wall around Trump, and install iron bars in the windows.


----------



## Two Thumbs

BluesLegend said:


> Two Thumbs said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluesLegend said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now, do we have the same problem with Canada? Hell no. Canada is a well behaved neighboring country, no wall needed. But if we are going to protect our citizens from these filth in the south yeah we need a wall, the border must be secured.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We don't have that problem with Canada because Canada is actually a nicer place to live, except for the weather.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> are you calling Mexico a shithole nation?
> 
> 
> you fucking racist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You got JoeB by the balls now.
Click to expand...

He's such a racists he actually hands them to me.


----------



## Lysistrata

The wall is no where near the "most critical political issue in America." At most, it is a money-draining boondoggle.


----------



## Jackson

aaronleland said:


> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.


So, now you are an expert on building?  Well if a president 20 years ago would just have followed through with the talk there would be far fewer illegals not and a tall (disgusting, lol) wall up already.


----------



## BluesLegend

Lysistrata said:


> The wall is no where near the "most critical political issue in America." At most, it is a money-draining boondoggle.



Illegals cost us billions each year, the wall will pay for itself in short order then return a huge profit.


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.



I can't say I'd be happy to see Democrats win, but the thought of Trumpsters being smothered is appealing.


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.



I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.  

We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.

According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.  

The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.  

If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.

First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.

Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor. 

Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.

If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.

On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> I voted for Trump because our nations leaders were screwing up...stupid wars we either couldn't or wouldn't win or the ridiculous idea to rebuild nations that we destroyed even though they don't want us there...
> 
> Out of control spending...
> ...



We are on track to add 2.6 trillion dollars to the national debt this year.  How did voting for Trump help with that out of control spending?

The deficit for this year, after only 79 days is 551 billion dollars.  That is more than the deficit for the entire years of 2014 and 2015 and almost equal with the total added in 2016.  

Seems out of control spending has not changed much.


----------



## kaz

drifter said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> drifter said:
> 
> 
> 
> Who is running in 2020 against Trump?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The poll asks for your "best guess"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It all depends on who is running. Your poll does not have the option of,"voted 3rd party but can be swayed to the mainstream vote."
Click to expand...


No, I didn't put in 57 different options.  Be an adult.  The poll even says *BEST GUESS*. 

You know Trump will be the Republican nominee
You know a Marxist will be the Democrat nominee
The Libertarians have three straight elections of not picking a libertarian candidate.

Even in my OP I said I will vote for Trump if he builds the wall.  I won't if he doesn't.  I'll probably vote Libertarian if he doesn't build the wall.  No, I don't know yet. So  I guessed he will. 

How can I tell you who will be the nominees in three years?  What is the point of this?  It's an early guess


----------



## kaz

beagle9 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> .The wall is thee most contentious issue to be used against the republicans in the 2020 election (if it is attempted to be built), and if huge dollars are spent, and then it fails.
> 
> Building specific barriers suitable for the landscape along the border in order to conform to the needs within the areas that are at risk is Ok, and repairing or upgrading other barriers already in place is also OK.  Mix that with better technology, drones, new roads, sensors, troops where needed, unchained border patrol, e-verify (enforced big time), sanctuary cities stopped, and the deportation starts yielding great results, and then look for the instant results in everything associated with the issue.
> 
> If can do all this in concert, the elections in 2020 will be Trump, Trump, Trump.
> 
> Right now the wall is like a huge target that has been placed on the backs of the GOP.
> 
> The Demon-crats are locked and loaded for the failure or they will do their level best to cause the failure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Americans overwhelmingly want the southern border secured.  I just see no evidence of this
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . Secured yes, but that includes a comprehensive attack on all things illegal. A wall in some areas is needed yes, but not a huge Jericho wall as was dipicted in the Bible. There's political hype, and then there is reality.
Click to expand...


OK, I agree with that, but it isn't what you said the first time.  The first time you said let's cower to the left and avoid it looking like a wall.  Now you're saying we shouldn't build a wall just because wall.  I agree with that.  There are mountain ranges and such where a wall is not the best solution.  I want the best solution.  But I don't want to cringe and say please don't be mad at me.  Cringing and caving to the left is a losing strategy, not a winning one


----------



## kaz

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong, they came here legally and had to prove they had the ability to support themselves and we could check to ensure they weren't criminals. Your argument falls apart right there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh, guy, all you had to do was get here on a boat back in the day
Click to expand...


Racist liar worshiping your orange God again

Ellis Island - Wikipedia


----------



## kaz

protectionist said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm half Hispanic.  No reason for American Hispanics to go against Trump.  He represents a protectionist stance for ALL Americans.   Since when do American Hispanics get invulnerable  against losing jobs to foreign invaders ? (wherever they may be from)
> 
> And since when do Americans (any of us) not lose out, when countries like Mexico and China pillage our economy for Billions$$ per year, as they've been doing ?
> 
> As for all your talk about race, for your edification, dark skinned people aren't the only foreigners that Democrats have been throwing at us, to build votes for themselves.  >>>
Click to expand...


Low end voters in every country are going to vote more socialist because politicians are going to always offer them other people's money.

That's why Democrats want to import low end Mexicans rather than the general population.  It's a voter drive.  The goal is to import poor Mexicans then keep them poor like they do to poor Americans


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
Click to expand...


I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.

And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
Click to expand...


Who called Trump's wall "asinine".


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.



ummmmm....


----------



## kaz

Old Rocks said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, let us build a wall around Trump, and install iron bars in the windows.
Click to expand...


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't say I'd be happy to see Democrats win, but the thought of Trumpsters being smothered is appealing.
Click to expand...


Totalitarian authoritarian leftists just don't scare you.

And it's not good for us if either party smothers the other one.  Stagnation in DC is our only hope since neither respects our liberty


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't say I'd be happy to see Democrats win, but the thought of Trumpsters being smothered is appealing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Totalitarian authoritarian leftists just don't scare you.
Click to expand...


Trump does.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one



Lost interest right here.  Typical leftist.  You need to start with ad hominem attacks on people you disagree with because you can't back up your positions with actual logical arguments.  What you said is you're a bigot, don't bother reading the rest of your crap because it won't make sense either.

That's all the left has because your ideas are illogical and don't work.

This is a voter drive for you.  You don't oppose the wall because you think it won't work, you oppose the wall because you know it will.

Then there's how drugs, guns, gangs, criminals, rapists and murderers come across the border with the illegal aliens and completely ignore that.

We are talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not immigration


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lost interest right here.  Typical leftist.  You need to start with ad hominem attacks on people you disagree with because you can't back up your positions with actual logical arguments.  What you said is you're a bigot, don't bother reading the rest of your crap because it won't make sense either.
> 
> That's all the left has because your ideas are illogical and don't work.
> 
> This is a voter drive for you.  You don't oppose the wall because you think it won't work, you oppose the wall because you know it will.
> 
> Then there's how drugs, guns, gangs, criminals, rapists and murderers come across the border with the illegal aliens and completely ignore that.
> 
> We are talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not immigration
Click to expand...


I gave 3 steps to stop those things and you have no rebuttal to them so you choose to ignore them.  What else would we expect from the most dishonest person on this forum.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.



Skimmed the rest.  So you're a racist who thinks only brown people are criminals and enter our country illegally and white people only come here legally?  Yeah.  Only brown people are criminals.  How Grand Wizard of you


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
Click to expand...


How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lost interest right here.  Typical leftist.  You need to start with ad hominem attacks on people you disagree with because you can't back up your positions with actual logical arguments.  What you said is you're a bigot, don't bother reading the rest of your crap because it won't make sense either.
> 
> That's all the left has because your ideas are illogical and don't work.
> 
> This is a voter drive for you.  You don't oppose the wall because you think it won't work, you oppose the wall because you know it will.
> 
> Then there's how drugs, guns, gangs, criminals, rapists and murderers come across the border with the illegal aliens and completely ignore that.
> 
> We are talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not immigration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I gave 3 steps to stop those things and you have no rebuttal to them so you choose to ignore them.  What else would we expect from the most dishonest person on this forum.
Click to expand...


"We?"  And your dick shrivels up further.  It's not you, you have legions of posters following your every word cheering you on propping up your manhood.

Listen you race bating lech.  We are talking about ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION.  Not immigration.  You know that, you just don't have the wit to back up your stupid crap or the manhood to stand on actual principles.  So that's how you roll.

Illegal alien is no more legal immigrant than shoplifter is customer.

Only Democrats want the illegal aliens because you know they will go on welfare, be chained to government, then you own them


----------



## LordBrownTrout

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
Click to expand...


Nope, they came here legally.


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
Click to expand...


I was a math major. 

Leftist math isn't math in any sense of the word of which I am aware


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Skimmed the rest.  So you're a racist who thinks only brown people are criminals and enter our country illegally and white people only come here legally?  Yeah.  Only brown people are criminals.  How Grand Wizard of you
Click to expand...


You are the one that brought up hispanics you dishonest moron.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lost interest right here.  Typical leftist.  You need to start with ad hominem attacks on people you disagree with because you can't back up your positions with actual logical arguments.  What you said is you're a bigot, don't bother reading the rest of your crap because it won't make sense either.
> 
> That's all the left has because your ideas are illogical and don't work.
> 
> This is a voter drive for you.  You don't oppose the wall because you think it won't work, you oppose the wall because you know it will.
> 
> Then there's how drugs, guns, gangs, criminals, rapists and murderers come across the border with the illegal aliens and completely ignore that.
> 
> We are talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not immigration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I gave 3 steps to stop those things and you have no rebuttal to them so you choose to ignore them.  What else would we expect from the most dishonest person on this forum.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "We?"  And your dick shrivels up further.  It's not you, you have legions of posters following your every word cheering you on propping up your manhood.
> 
> Listen you race bating lech.  We are talking about ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION.  Not immigration.  You know that, you just don't have the wit to back up your stupid crap or the manhood to stand on actual principles.  So that's how you roll.
> 
> Illegal alien is no more legal immigrant than shoplifter is customer.
> 
> Only Democrats want the illegal aliens because you know they will go on welfare, be chained to government, then you own them
Click to expand...


And I gave you a three step plan that is more effective than a wall and cheaper than a wall.  But you will not address it because you are the most dishonest person on this forum.


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
Click to expand...


“*On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time. Thank you for dropping the charade.”*

Do you typically put your libertarian beliefs ahead of Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
Click to expand...


You would first have to explain how the wall will generate revenue, otherwise it cannot pay for itself. 

Then tell me how building and maintaining a wall is cheaper than bringing home our troops and putting them on the southern border.  We are already paying for the troops and stationing them in America vice Europe saves the DOD money.


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time. Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Do you typically put your libertarian beliefs ahead of Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
Click to expand...


What is it about using the military to defend our country goes against the Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
Click to expand...


So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
Click to expand...


According to your OP, you didn't vote in 2016...


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time. Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Do you typically put your libertarian beliefs ahead of Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What is it about using the military to defend our country goes against the Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
Click to expand...


Because it's a stupid plan.  Instead of just building and defending a wall, you want the military chasing thousands of people across the desert every night.  Only a moron would propose that.  Or someone who wants them to fail ...


----------



## Pogo

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
Click to expand...


When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?

Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
Click to expand...


Not at all. Just ribbing you.


----------



## Rocko

I voted for Trump because I didn’t like the alternative, however, I too disagree with him on trade. I do agree that the wall is the number one critical issue that will determine whether he gets re-elected. The wall needs to be approved before the dems take the house.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ummmmm....
> 
> View attachment 183847
Click to expand...


I did not vote for Trump in 2016, but I will in 2020.  Read the poll above


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time. Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Do you typically put your libertarian beliefs ahead of Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What is it about using the military to defend our country goes against the Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because it's a stupid plan.  Instead of just building and defending a wall, you want the military chasing thousands of people across the desert every night.  Only a moron would propose that.  Or someone who wants them to fail ...
Click to expand...


You have a very shity opinoin of the capabilities of our military.  

And if you implement the first two steps you no longer have 1000s crossing the border every night.


----------



## aaronleland

Jackson said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that at this rate if we started building the wall today about 2% of it would be finished by 2020.
> 
> 
> 
> So, now you are an expert on building?  Well if a president 20 years ago would just have followed through with the talk there would be far fewer illegals not and a tall (disgusting, lol) wall up already.
Click to expand...


You're right. My math was way off. Considering we haven't started, at this rate 0% of the wall will be built by 2020.


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You would first have to explain how the wall will generate revenue, otherwise it cannot pay for itself.
> 
> Then tell me how building and maintaining a wall is cheaper than bringing home our troops and putting them on the southern border.  We are already paying for the troops and stationing them in America vice Europe saves the DOD money.
Click to expand...


No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ummmmm....
> 
> View attachment 183847
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did not vote for Trump in 2016, but I will in 2020.  Read the poll above
Click to expand...


" voted that I did not vote for 2016..."


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.



So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...


----------



## aaronleland

Jackson said:


> Well if a president 20 years ago would just have followed through with the talk there would be far fewer illegals not and a tall (disgusting, lol) wall up already.



Why a president 20 years ago? Why not a president 30 years ago? Oh, that's right. We want to forget the gift Saint Ronnie gave to illegals.


----------



## LordBrownTrout

Pogo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
Click to expand...


O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.


----------



## LoneLaugher

Kaz loves him some Trump. But he definitely didn't vote for him. No way.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't say I'd be happy to see Democrats win, but the thought of Trumpsters being smothered is appealing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Totalitarian authoritarian leftists just don't scare you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Trump does.
Click to expand...


Exactly.  He's a mixed bag.  And you're sympathetic to totalitarians over that.  And you think you're libertarian.  It's a joke


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lost interest right here.  Typical leftist.  You need to start with ad hominem attacks on people you disagree with because you can't back up your positions with actual logical arguments.  What you said is you're a bigot, don't bother reading the rest of your crap because it won't make sense either.
> 
> That's all the left has because your ideas are illogical and don't work.
> 
> This is a voter drive for you.  You don't oppose the wall because you think it won't work, you oppose the wall because you know it will.
> 
> Then there's how drugs, guns, gangs, criminals, rapists and murderers come across the border with the illegal aliens and completely ignore that.
> 
> We are talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not immigration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I gave 3 steps to stop those things and you have no rebuttal to them so you choose to ignore them.  What else would we expect from the most dishonest person on this forum.
Click to expand...


When you couch your arguments with that it's a phallic symbol for Trump and only racists oppose illegal immigration, you are completely clear what you are.

And yeah, you did give the stupid idea of having our military chase thousands of people across the desert every night


----------



## Golfing Gator

LoneLaugher said:


> Kaz loves him some Trump. But he definitely didn't vote for him. No way.



Kaz has become the number one defender of Trump on this board.


----------



## Pogo

LordBrownTrout said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
Click to expand...


Actually I've never posted on the stimulus.  You pulled this post out of your ass just to draw a comparison that never existed.  

Now remember to put your shit back where it belongs.


----------



## LordBrownTrout

Pogo said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually I've never posted on the stimulus.  You pulled this post out of your ass just to draw a comparison that never existed.
> 
> Now remember to put your shit back where it belongs.
Click to expand...



Its a great comparison.  O wasted a trillion.  Why are you concerned with 20 billion now?


----------



## protectionist

JoeB131 said:


> Why would Hispanics support "protectionism".  Do you know what Protectionism is? It's an admission that Americans are lazier and produce lower quality products, and need to be protected in their own markets for foreign competition.  Not sure why anyone supports that.
> 
> Um, guy, here's the thing. we aren't losing out.  We give them money, they give us products.  If  consumers didn't want their products, they don't have to buy them.  Protectionism is 'We can't trust ourselves not to buy foreign products!!!"
> 
> The reality- most manufacturing jobs weren't lost to foreign competition, they were lost to automation.
> 
> Exactly my point.  150 years ago, the bigots said this about the Irish, 100 years ago about the Germans, 50 years ago about the Poles.



Hispanics, like any other Americans, would (and do) support protectionism the same way we all support protection of our personal things. Do we have locks on our house doors and windows ?  Yup. And I'll bet you do too, Joe.

Do we have locks and burglar alarms on our cars ? Sure.  Well, the wall is simply a "lock" of sorts, on our country, to help prevent it from being invaded by people engaging in foreign imperialism.  The parasites who cross our border without inspection from US immigration authorities are not only committing that immigration crime.  They are:
1.   stealing millions of jobs from us (all of us, of all races)
2.   pillaging our economy for $133 Billion/year in remittances (US is #1 victim worldwide) depriving US businesses of all those sales, and further eliminating US jobs.
3.   grabbing Billion$$ of our tax $$ via the anchor baby racket.

As for Protectionism (in the current political/economics), it is equalizing trade with protective tariffs (which our country has used for hundreds of years under many presidents), so that US business are not unfairly competed against.  Why should China have unrestricted access to our huge, wealthy market, while our exports going to them have to pay big tariffs to enter their country ?

That, plus the big difference in corporate tax (fixed by Trump) is what has pushed companies to go where its simply economical for them to operate. Sure there's some automation.  Always has been.  Always will be.  But it's a small, minor factor.

As far as the quality of goods is concerned, your post is laughable.  Maybe you're not too old.  I remember when TV sets, stereos, and other electronics would last us 25 years.  NOw with the foreign-made junk, you're lucky if your 3 years without a break down. I had a VCR that used to have to stick a pencil in the hole where the eject button fell out.  Had a China TV set that wouldn't respond to any remote control.  Ho hum.

Globalism on the way out.  America being made great again.  It's about time, after 30 years of irresponsible presidential mismanagement.

As for your bigot card, oh please.  That ran its course years ago.


----------



## Pogo

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
Click to expand...


I'm thinking it will come with what used to be called a "peep show" every half-mile or so.  You plunk ten pesos in there and you get to watch Americans shooting each other up, or fleecing the poor, or whatever we're up to that day.  Kind of a pay-per-view soap opera.  

Of course we collect all the change, and Mexico has paid for the wall.  Should be paid up in less than a hundred thousand years.


----------



## DrLove

None of the above 

Voted 3rd party in 2016 but as long as Dems can come up with a better candidate than Hillary (not hard) in 2020 - will vote Dem


----------



## Pogo

LordBrownTrout said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually I've never posted on the stimulus.  You pulled this post out of your ass just to draw a comparison that never existed.
> 
> Now remember to put your shit back where it belongs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Its a great comparison.  O wasted a trillion.  Why are you concerned with 20 billion now?
Click to expand...


Here's the difference, Spunknoid:

The stimulus was invested directly in this country.  Infrastructure, stuff that would actually affect and improve everyday activity.

The "wall" by comparison is a fantasy tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, representing nothing but a cheap way to mine emotions for votes from the chronically gullible.  The latter were identified by Cambridge Analytica, and y'all freaks who live in a fantasy comic book, as profusely demonstrated up and down this thread, bought that snake oil hook line and sinker, to mix a metaphor.  It's based on the equally comic-book idea that "Mexicans" (read: rapists) are scurrying across the wide open spaces of  a border that exists only on paper, like a stream of cucarachas.  That too, is bullshit, and that too was bought up like it was water in a desert.

All of this is an ages-old tactic of exploiting fear.  That of course is despicably dishonest, but it takes a buyer to complete the transaction.  Doesn't it.

Hope this helps.  Considering the frank confession of "deaf ears" --- I doubt it will.


----------



## Rocko

Pogo said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually I've never posted on the stimulus.  You pulled this post out of your ass just to draw a comparison that never existed.
> 
> Now remember to put your shit back where it belongs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Its a great comparison.  O wasted a trillion.  Why are you concerned with 20 billion now?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the difference, Spunknoid:
> 
> The stimulus was invested directly in this country.  Infrastructure, stuff that would actually affect and improve everyday activity.
> 
> The "wall" by comparison is a fantasy tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, representing nothing but a cheap way to mine emotions for votes from the chronically gullible.  The latter were identified by Cambridge Analytica, and y'all freaks who live in a fantasy comic book, as profusely demonstrated up and down this thread, bought that snake oil hook line and sinker, to mix a metaphor.  It's based on the equally comic-book idea that "Mexicans" (read: rapists) are scurrying across the wide open spaces of  a border that exists only on paper, like a stream of cucarachas.  That too, is bullshit, and that too was bought up like it was water in a desert.
> 
> All of this is an ages-old tactic of exploiting fear.  That of course is despicably dishonest, but it takes a buyer to complete the transaction.  Doesn't it.
> 
> Hope this helps.  I doubt it will.
Click to expand...


You really live in your own world


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
Click to expand...


Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!


----------



## Siete

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
Click to expand...



so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?

news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.


----------



## Pogo

Will you vote for Trump in 2020? This is best guess only

Voted for Trump in 2016 and will again in 2020
Voted for Trump in 2016 but won't in 2020
Didn't vote for Trump in 2016 but will in 2020
Voted for Hillary in 2016 and will vote Democrat in 2020
Voted third party in 2016 and will vote third party in 2020

Inherent flaws in the "poll"

Does not provide choice for "Didn't vote for Rump, will continue not to"
Assumes Rump will be a candidate at all, doesn't provide for "will vote for whoever the Republican is"
Does not provide for "didn't vote in 2016 but will in 2020"
Does not provide for "didn't vote in 2016 and again will not in 2020"

Results are not visible until after voting, inciting reader to cast a bogus vote just to see the results


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!



Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries. 

So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?


----------



## Pogo

LoneLaugher said:


> Kaz loves him some Trump. But he definitely didn't vote for him. No way.



He/She has also sworn up and down that he/she is "not a Republican".

And yet ---- right there in the OP for all to see:



kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> ....
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.



I left the latter irrelevant paragraph unsnipped because I just love the way he pretends to white-knight for "women" and them proceeds to describe them as "hoes".


----------



## Golfing Gator

Siete said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?
> 
> news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.
Click to expand...


These statist have no problem with the Govt taking land from private owners.


----------



## BrokeLoser

Siete said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?
> 
> news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.
Click to expand...


This is third grade shit pussy.
(what part of that filthy shithole Mehico are you from and how long have you been fucking over REAL Americans?)

em·i·nent do·main
_noun_
LAW
noun: *eminent domain*

the right of a government or its agent to expropriate private property for public use, with payment of compensation.


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?
> 
> news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is third grade shit pussy.
> (what part of that filthy shithole Mehico are you from and how long have you been fucking over REAL Americans?)
> 
> em·i·nent do·main
> _noun_
> LAW
> noun: *eminent domain*
> 
> the right of a government or its agent to expropriate private property for public use, with payment of compensation.
Click to expand...


Yep, one of those powers you statist love to use!  Not a very conservative thing to do, but we all know that you folks are just faux conservatives.


----------



## Siete

Golfing Gator said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?
> 
> news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These statist have no problem with the Govt taking land from private owners.
Click to expand...


southern border Texans have oil and gas wells sitting at their front gate ... they have enough free $$ to keep the courts in knots for decades.


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
Click to expand...


“The wall is forever.”


----------



## BrokeLoser

Siete said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> 
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?
> 
> news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These statist have no problem with the Govt taking land from private owners.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> southern border Texans have oil and gas wells sitting at their front gate ... they have enough free $$ to keep the courts in knots for decades.
Click to expand...


Awesome...build around them for now and stick border patrol agents in the gaping holes...TA-DA!


----------



## jillian

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
Click to expand...


that's true of black people, too, for the most part -- church-going, religious, have little sympathy for gays and reproductive choice. if the GOP didn't fly the bigot flag, they'd still be republicans because it was the party of Lincoln. (now perverted by white supremacists).


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.



Man...you sure do have some pent up hatred for brown people. 

You won't see a wall built. And it won't matter because American FREE CAPITALIST corporations want them some Mexican labor. And they will have it. 
No wall will stop them.


----------



## jillian

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
Click to expand...


so is being a broke loser


----------



## Siete

BrokeLoser said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, tell me again how the wall will generate revenue...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> so tell everyone exactly how you plan to go about building a wall on private land in Texas?
> 
> news flash -- wont happen in your lifetime you dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These statist have no problem with the Govt taking land from private owners.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> southern border Texans have oil and gas wells sitting at their front gate ... they have enough free $$ to keep the courts in knots for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Awesome...build around them for now and stick border patrol agents in the gaping holes...TA-DA!
Click to expand...


BP is aready there .. TA DA !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NO WALL- PERIOD.


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
Click to expand...


So is our military.


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
Click to expand...


Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.


----------



## LordBrownTrout

Pogo said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually I've never posted on the stimulus.  You pulled this post out of your ass just to draw a comparison that never existed.
> 
> Now remember to put your shit back where it belongs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Its a great comparison.  O wasted a trillion.  Why are you concerned with 20 billion now?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the difference, Spunknoid:
> 
> The stimulus was invested directly in this country.  Infrastructure, stuff that would actually affect and improve everyday activity.
> 
> The "wall" by comparison is a fantasy tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, representing nothing but a cheap way to mine emotions for votes from the chronically gullible.  The latter were identified by Cambridge Analytica, and y'all freaks who live in a fantasy comic book, as profusely demonstrated up and down this thread, bought that snake oil hook line and sinker, to mix a metaphor.  It's based on the equally comic-book idea that "Mexicans" (read: rapists) are scurrying across the wide open spaces of  a border that exists only on paper, like a stream of cucarachas.  That too, is bullshit, and that too was bought up like it was water in a desert.
> 
> All of this is an ages-old tactic of exploiting fear.  That of course is despicably dishonest, but it takes a buyer to complete the transaction.  Doesn't it.
> 
> Hope this helps.  Considering the frank confession of "deaf ears" --- I doubt it will.
Click to expand...


The stimulus was sold as an investment but in reality didn't help the economy recover.  Mexicans are scurrying across the border and some are killers and rapists.  Many want a better life...I don't blame them.  I've watched a family swim across the rio grande and escape into the US while border patrol was just across the road.  The real reason the mexicans are coming across is that mexico is a dump in regards to its horrid economy which is due to a lawless govt that caters to the drug industry.  Eliminate the corrupt govt, and kill the drug gangs and mexico turns into a wonderful oasis.  I'd love to move down there.  It's beautiful but its too dangerous and corrupt.


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
Click to expand...


The same POTUS could just stop monitoring or defending or repairing the wall and the wall become nothing but a albatross.


----------



## Pogo

LordBrownTrout said:


> The stimulus was sold as an investment but in reality didn't help the economy recover.



Uh HUH.  So it was just a happy coincidence huh.  Yeah that's the ticket --- the economy righted itself IN SPITE OF a stimulus.  Just shook it off like a case of fleas.  You run with that.


----------



## Golfing Gator

LordBrownTrout said:


> The stimulus was sold as an investment but in reality didn't help the economy recover.  Mexicans are scurrying across the border and some are killers and rapists.  Many want a better life...I don't blame them.  I've watched a family swim across the rio grande and escape into the US while border patrol was just across the road.  The real reason the mexicans are coming across is that mexico is a dump in regards to its horrid economy which is due to a lawless govt that caters to the drug industry.  Eliminate the corrupt govt, and kill the drug gangs and mexico turns into a wonderful oasis.  I'd love to move down there.  It's beautiful but its too dangerous and corrupt.



I pretty much agree with most of this.  That is why I wish we as a country would go after the companies that hire the illegals.  Make it so painful to hire them that no company would dare do it, and the reason to come stops.  

Then implement a true guest worker program and let those that just want a better life come provide the labor that so many companies want.


----------



## LordBrownTrout

Pogo said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stimulus was sold as an investment but in reality didn't help the economy recover.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh HUH.  So it was just a happy coincidence huh.  Yeah that's the ticket --- the economy righted itself IN SPITE OF a stimulus.  Just shook it off like a case of fleas.  You run with that.
Click to expand...


It has taken the country 10 years to right itself.


----------



## Pogo

LordBrownTrout said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stimulus was sold as an investment but in reality didn't help the economy recover.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh HUH.  So it was just a happy coincidence huh.  Yeah that's the ticket --- the economy righted itself IN SPITE OF a stimulus.  Just shook it off like a case of fleas.  You run with that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It has taken the country 10 years to right itself.
Click to expand...


Think so huh.




See that deep notch?  That's where the stimulus went in.

You gotta admit, for a pure coincidence that has no causal relationhip, The O'bama sure knew how to set it up to make it look good.  Huh.


----------



## bendog

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
Click to expand...


Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.


----------



## Vandalshandle

For some reason, Trumpettes seem to think that Mexicans don't know how to operate shovels and ladders. Not that they have to, since half of all illegal aliens simply overstayed their visas.


----------



## BluesLegend

A tiny fraction of Americans killed or murdered by illegals...

Edwin Jackson, 26
Grant Ronnebeck, 21
Kristopher Eggle, 28
Terry Wendover, 45
Daniel Durden, 30
Kenneth Mahr, 18
Jamica Williams, 42
Michael Furlow, 49
Kaybrin Ingoldsby, 8
Halle Ingoldsby, 8
Kevin Will, 38
Brandon Mendoza, 32
LaDonna Brady, 45
Robin Shelhammer, 60
Barbara Shelhammer, 56
Whitney Meinke, 33
Brandy Lee Thorne, 22
Corey Wride, 44
Dennielle Schermock, 25
Joshua Wilkerson, 18
Eric Zepeda
Shayley Estes, 22
Jamiel Shaw, 17
Jesse Benavides, 33
Emily Cortez, 7 weeks
Sviatlana Dranko, 30
Spencer Golvach, 25
Margaret Kostelnik, 60
Kate Steinle, 32
Bob Barry, 58
Michael Grubbs, 63
Jamie Oxendine, 43
Mary Oxendine, 40
Shane Oxendine, 17
Parker Moore, 20
Amos Jones, 54
Naomi Mercury, 18
Brittany Williams, 24
Michael Davis, 42
Daniel Oliver, 47
Delilah McDaniel, 61
Daryl Raetz, 29
Diann Jones, 55
Arnett Chandler, 58
A'Janae Jones, 12
Wanda Beach, 68
Leone Turpin, 28
Jose Chavez, 26
Lauren Bump, 24
Lenny Shay, 37
Abigail Robinson, 11
Anna Eckert, 6
Heather Coble, 25
Madison Coble, 24
Louise Sollowin, 93
Chad Nelson, 29
Serenity Reedy, 9 months
Dwayne Polk, 47
Blake Cohorn, 5
Jasmine Owens, 20
Dimitri Smith, infant
Drew Rosenberg, 25
Joe Storie
Vanessa Pham, 19
Terrell Horne, 34
Kenneth Carroll, 72
Kyle Wible, 20
Brandon Sullivan, 16
Clarisse Grime, 16
Jacqueline Walsh, 59
Olivia Wilson, 17
Ryan Scholz, 9
Jean McCarthy, 71
Alexander Atkin, 22
Jerry Laury, 61
Kathleen Byham, 45
Daniel Pollack, 31


----------



## LoneLaugher

bendog said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
Click to expand...


That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.


----------



## bendog

LoneLaugher said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
Click to expand...


I've never said I was against legal immigration.


----------



## Golfing Gator

BluesLegend said:


> A tiny fraction of Americans killed or murdered by illegals...
> 
> Edwin Jackson, 26
> Grant Ronnebeck, 21
> Kristopher Eggle, 28
> Terry Wendover, 45
> Daniel Durden, 30
> Kenneth Mahr, 18
> Jamica Williams, 42
> Michael Furlow, 49
> Kaybrin Ingoldsby, 8
> Halle Ingoldsby, 8
> Kevin Will, 38
> Brandon Mendoza, 32
> LaDonna Brady, 45
> Robin Shelhammer, 60
> Barbara Shelhammer, 56
> Whitney Meinke, 33
> Brandy Lee Thorne, 22
> Corey Wride, 44
> Dennielle Schermock, 25
> Joshua Wilkerson, 18
> Eric Zepeda
> Shayley Estes, 22
> Jamiel Shaw, 17
> Jesse Benavides, 33
> Emily Cortez, 7 weeks
> Sviatlana Dranko, 30
> Spencer Golvach, 25
> Margaret Kostelnik, 60
> Kate Steinle, 32
> Bob Barry, 58
> Michael Grubbs, 63
> Jamie Oxendine, 43
> Mary Oxendine, 40
> Shane Oxendine, 17
> Parker Moore, 20
> Amos Jones, 54
> Naomi Mercury, 18
> Brittany Williams, 24
> Michael Davis, 42
> Daniel Oliver, 47
> Delilah McDaniel, 61
> Daryl Raetz, 29
> Diann Jones, 55
> Arnett Chandler, 58
> A'Janae Jones, 12
> Wanda Beach, 68
> Leone Turpin, 28
> Jose Chavez, 26
> Lauren Bump, 24
> Lenny Shay, 37
> Abigail Robinson, 11
> Anna Eckert, 6
> Heather Coble, 25
> Madison Coble, 24
> Louise Sollowin, 93
> Chad Nelson, 29
> Serenity Reedy, 9 months
> Dwayne Polk, 47
> Blake Cohorn, 5
> Jasmine Owens, 20
> Dimitri Smith, infant
> Drew Rosenberg, 25
> Joe Storie
> Vanessa Pham, 19
> Terrell Horne, 34
> Kenneth Carroll, 72
> Kyle Wible, 20
> Brandon Sullivan, 16
> Clarisse Grime, 16
> Jacqueline Walsh, 59
> Olivia Wilson, 17
> Ryan Scholz, 9
> Jean McCarthy, 71
> Alexander Atkin, 22
> Jerry Laury, 61
> Kathleen Byham, 45
> Daniel Pollack, 31



 Not a single person in this thread seems to be against stopping illegal immigration.  


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Skimmed the rest.  So you're a racist who thinks only brown people are criminals and enter our country illegally and white people only come here legally?  Yeah.  Only brown people are criminals.  How Grand Wizard of you
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are the one that brought up hispanics you dishonest moron.
Click to expand...


Once again, you prove what a fundamentally dishonest piece of shit you are.  Here is what I responded to



Golfing Gator said:


> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lost interest right here.  Typical leftist.  You need to start with ad hominem attacks on people you disagree with because you can't back up your positions with actual logical arguments.  What you said is you're a bigot, don't bother reading the rest of your crap because it won't make sense either.
> 
> That's all the left has because your ideas are illogical and don't work.
> 
> This is a voter drive for you.  You don't oppose the wall because you think it won't work, you oppose the wall because you know it will.
> 
> Then there's how drugs, guns, gangs, criminals, rapists and murderers come across the border with the illegal aliens and completely ignore that.
> 
> We are talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not immigration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I gave 3 steps to stop those things and you have no rebuttal to them so you choose to ignore them.  What else would we expect from the most dishonest person on this forum.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "We?"  And your dick shrivels up further.  It's not you, you have legions of posters following your every word cheering you on propping up your manhood.
> 
> Listen you race bating lech.  We are talking about ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION.  Not immigration.  You know that, you just don't have the wit to back up your stupid crap or the manhood to stand on actual principles.  So that's how you roll.
> 
> Illegal alien is no more legal immigrant than shoplifter is customer.
> 
> Only Democrats want the illegal aliens because you know they will go on welfare, be chained to government, then you own them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And I gave you a three step plan that is more effective than a wall and cheaper than a wall.  But you will not address it because you are the most dishonest person on this forum.
Click to expand...


WTF are you talking about?  I said sending the military in to chase thousands of people across the desert every night is a stupid idea.

And when you call people racists for opposing illegal immigration, you prove you are not interested in any sort of discussion.  That is just a pure discussion ender.  Don't do that then whine when you don't get responses.

And you also don't expect responses when you don't answer questions. I've already withdrawn your right to ask questions until you start answering them.

Every way this post is a fail


----------



## LoneLaugher

bendog said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've never said I was against legal immigration.
Click to expand...


You didn't. But taking a severe hard line stance on those who are already here will harm our economy while it 
takes a piss on human beings who are only here because we needed them and they wanted a better life.


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “*On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time. Thank you for dropping the charade.”*
> 
> Do you typically put your libertarian beliefs ahead of Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
Click to expand...


It's even more than that.  His post was pure racist.  He said only "non-whites" ignore immigration laws and come here illegally.

On the libertarian though, I'm a libertarian to maximize my liberty.  I would like as an objective to tear down borders because hopefully one day we will evolve to not need them.

But to declare that day is now is fundamentally dishonest and clearly does NOT maximize my liberty.  Any "libertarian" who opposes borders is a libertarian ideologue only and isn't a libertarian to maximize their liberty in their life


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
Click to expand...

Did I rig your results?


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Skimmed the rest.  So you're a racist who thinks only brown people are criminals and enter our country illegally and white people only come here legally?  Yeah.  Only brown people are criminals.  How Grand Wizard of you
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are the one that brought up hispanics you dishonest moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once again, you prove what a fundamentally dishonest piece of shit you are.  Here is what I responded to
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


In your OP you are the one that brought up Hispanics, you lying fuck. 

It is so cute how I called you dishonest and you are parroting me.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You would first have to explain how the wall will generate revenue, otherwise it cannot pay for itself.
> 
> Then tell me how building and maintaining a wall is cheaper than bringing home our troops and putting them on the southern border.  We are already paying for the troops and stationing them in America vice Europe saves the DOD money.
Click to expand...


He's obviously talking about cost avoidance, brainiac.  Any business person would consider cost avoidance = profit generated.  Do you post from your garbage truck?


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
Click to expand...

Trumps not capitalistic enough for you?


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The same POTUS could just stop monitoring or defending or repairing the wall and the wall become nothing but a albatross.
Click to expand...


That’s why it is paramount that the wall be impenetrable


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> WTF are you talking about?  I said sending the military in to chase thousands of people across the desert every night is a stupid idea.



And I gave a way to remove the reason for 1000s of people to be crossing the desert every night, so the military will only have to focus on the few that are left.  Though you clearly do not think our military is up to the task. 



> And when you call people racists for opposing illegal immigration, you prove you are not interested in any sort of discussion.  That is just a pure discussion ender.  Don't do that then whine when you don't get responses.



If you do not want this to be about race, you should not have made your opening triade about Hispanics.  Seems simple enough


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The same POTUS could just stop monitoring or defending or repairing the wall and the wall become nothing but a albatross.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That’s why it is paramount that the wall be impenetrable
Click to expand...


No such thing exist except in video games and movies.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Skimmed the rest.  So you're a racist who thinks only brown people are criminals and enter our country illegally and white people only come here legally?  Yeah.  Only brown people are criminals.  How Grand Wizard of you
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are the one that brought up hispanics you dishonest moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once again, you prove what a fundamentally dishonest piece of shit you are.  Here is what I responded to
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In your OP you are the one that brought up Hispanics, you lying fuck.
> 
> It is so cute how I called you dishonest and you are parroting me.
Click to expand...

OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.

kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"

You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.

I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.  That's why I want a wall.  To prevent poor Hispanics from coming here and going on welfare like poor WHITE people do, Grand Wizard.

And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.

I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?


----------



## jillian

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
Click to expand...


only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.
> 
> kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"
> 
> You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.
> 
> I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.
> 
> And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.
> 
> I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?



So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well. 

More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all. Just ribbing you.
Click to expand...


Yes, obviously when you continually argue what Democrats do and you argue again what Democrats do, you were joking ...


----------



## IsaacNewton

So cons that want to build a wall how much have you donated to the 'build a wall' gofundme? Surely you've sent in your check already because, you know, Trump lied about Mexico paying for it. "Trust me" he said and you did and he lied an inch away from your face and you still smell his prostitute breath. So pay for it. His lawyer paid $130,000 for one of his hookers so let's see you Littlle Lying Donald sycophants pay for this wall to nowhere. 

I hear Mexico will pay for the impeachment.


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all. Just ribbing you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, obviously when you continually argue what Democrats do and you argue again what Democrats do, you were joking ...
Click to expand...


Very well said. You should copyright that one.


----------



## kaz

Pogo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
Click to expand...


A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground. With electric monitoring and surveillance and thousands of more border control agents.

They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!

Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...

So Pogo:  You fill in the blank.

What's particularly funny about you leftists is you think the electronic monitoring and surveillance and more border agents will work without the wall, but it won't work with it!

LMAO.  What a hillbilly


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
Click to expand...


Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time. Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Do you typically put your libertarian beliefs ahead of Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What is it about using the military to defend our country goes against the Constitutional authority and the legal responsibility of our federal government?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because it's a stupid plan.  Instead of just building and defending a wall, you want the military chasing thousands of people across the desert every night.  Only a moron would propose that.  Or someone who wants them to fail ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You have a very shity opinoin of the capabilities of our military.
> 
> And if you implement the first two steps you no longer have 1000s crossing the border every night.
Click to expand...


Um ... what?

That I think building a wall and defending it is more efficient than the military chasing thousands of people across the desert every night is a reference to the "capabilities" of our military?  Seriously?

My God, why on earth do you want to subject your children to the same crappy government education that you got?

Oy vey.  If the military is capable of chasing thousands of people across the desert every night, they need to do it!  Wow.  That was your actual argument


----------



## BrokeLoser

jillian said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
Click to expand...


My job requires an IQ and communication skills… The only people competing with illegal five foot tall silver tooth smelly wetbacks are the barely legal five foot tall silver tooth smelly wetbacks...oh, and they compete with blacks for that welfare …You know this .


----------



## Siete

jillian said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your rhetorical tone screams “let’s play semantics”...I’ll play along...The wall reduces expense on thirdworld human cockroaches. The ROI is in the savings....TA-DA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
Click to expand...



uneducated RW idiots yammer about Mexicans taking their jobs.

solution;

GET AN EDUCATION - GE A BETTER JOB.

DUMBASSES.


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You would first have to explain how the wall will generate revenue, otherwise it cannot pay for itself.
> 
> Then tell me how building and maintaining a wall is cheaper than bringing home our troops and putting them on the southern border.  We are already paying for the troops and stationing them in America vice Europe saves the DOD money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No Mexicrat POTUS would ever demo a $25 billion dollar wall..the wall is forever.
> Further, I’ll go out on a limb and bet you’re not privy to “real” costs and expense. My guess is; people far smarter than you and I and privy to more information have the math worked out.
Click to expand...


The idea that we'd let criminals come here whether the math supports it or being a net profit to the country is stupid anyway.  I know you know that, just saying don't let the left draw you into their stupid crap.  And as if the left ever cared about a profit.

But on the math.  What is undeniable is that we're way better off allowing normal people to come here who are capable of supporting themselves than the low end uneducated poor of any country.  And the left of course in all their calculations ignore the cost of all our poor who they put out of jobs


----------



## bendog

LoneLaugher said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've never said I was against legal immigration.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You didn't. But taking a severe hard line stance on those who are already here will harm our economy while it
> takes a piss on human beings who are only here because we needed them and they wanted a better life.
Click to expand...


used to be that if you had a toolbelt and knew how to use what were in it, you'd always get a paycheck, or that was the saying.  During the recession of 73-75, that didn't work out for me, but with public education I got through college.

I'm ok with temporary guest workers and regulated immigration for new citizens, but good with deporting people who broke the law to get here.  And imo we should remove incentives and disincentives that keep Americans from moving to where there are jobs and leaving places where there is not likely to be an uptick in economies


----------



## BrokeLoser

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
Click to expand...


 The wetbacks destroying our nation can’t afford to buy plane tickets… You know this


----------



## bendog

Siete said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> uneducated RW idiots yammer about Mexicans taking their jobs.
> 
> solution;
> 
> GET AN EDUCATION - GE A BETTER JOB.
> 
> DUMBASSES.
Click to expand...

some people are less capable than others in gaining skills in higher education.  The dems used to be their party.


----------



## Golfing Gator

BrokeLoser said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for that.  Now that we have that settled, my plan also reduces expenses from illegal immigration and does so in a manner that saves money instead of spending money, as it is cheaper to have troops stationed on our home soil than in foreign countries.
> 
> So, my plan saves the country even more in the long run.  Why are you so opposed to the military defending our country vice Europe?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> My job requires an IQ and communication skills… The only people competing with illegal five foot tall silver tooth smelly wetbacks are the barely legal five foot tall silver tooth smelly wetbacks...oh, and they compete with blacks for that welfare …You know this .
Click to expand...


Either you put on a really good act here or you suck at your job


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## bendog

BrokeLoser said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The wetbacks destroying our nation can’t afford to buy plane tickets… You know this
Click to expand...


and the dems had their share of racist trash.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ummmmm....
> 
> View attachment 183847
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did not vote for Trump in 2016, but I will in 2020.  Read the poll above
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> " voted that I did not vote for 2016..."
Click to expand...


So that's in the middle.  It has "for" but it doesn't have "Trump."  

This is what a dick you are.  It's reasonable to ask if I voted.  I did, I voted for Gary Johnson.

You got a typo though, congrats!  Wow, you were military, I believe you now!  I only dropped the word Trump and you're a proud as a poodle who found a deer leg in a neighbor's garage and is dragging it around the neighborhood


----------



## bendog

Golfing Gator said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> My job requires an IQ and communication skills… The only people competing with illegal five foot tall silver tooth smelly wetbacks are the barely legal five foot tall silver tooth smelly wetbacks...oh, and they compete with blacks for that welfare …You know this .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Either you put on a really good act here or you suck at your job
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...

Well, he could work in a prison and interface with unarmed prisoners.  (-:


----------



## kaz

jillian said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> that's true of black people, too, for the most part -- church-going, religious, have little sympathy for gays and reproductive choice. if the GOP didn't fly the bigot flag, they'd still be republicans because it was the party of Lincoln. (now perverted by white supremacists).
Click to expand...


Get mental help.  Seriously


----------



## LoneLaugher

bendog said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> “The wall is forever.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> uneducated RW idiots yammer about Mexicans taking their jobs.
> 
> solution;
> 
> GET AN EDUCATION - GE A BETTER JOB.
> 
> DUMBASSES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> some people are less capable than others in gaining skills in higher education.  The dems used to be their party.
Click to expand...


Only one major party has retraining of displaced workers in its platform. Hint: It ain't the party which elected Trump.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ummmmm....
> 
> View attachment 183847
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did not vote for Trump in 2016, but I will in 2020.  Read the poll above
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> " voted that I did not vote for 2016..."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So that's in the middle.  It has "for" but it doesn't have "Trump."
> 
> This is what a dick you are.  It's reasonable to ask if I voted.  I did, I voted for Gary Johnson.
> 
> You got a typo though, congrats!  Wow, you were military, I believe you now!  I only dropped the word Trump and you're a proud as a poodle who found a deer leg in a neighbor's garage and is dragging it around the neighborhood
Click to expand...


A unique way to apologize for calling someone a liar, but from the most dishonest person on the forum, I guess it is a good start


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Man...you sure do have some pent up hatred for brown people.
> 
> You won't see a wall built. And it won't matter because American FREE CAPITALIST corporations want them some Mexican labor. And they will have it.
> No wall will stop them.
Click to expand...


Another racist who thinks that only brown people break immigration laws.

kaz:  I want middle class Hispanics, not poor ones

You see a racist behind every tree, that while you push racist bigotry, grand wizard


----------



## bendog

LoneLaugher said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> So is our military.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> uneducated RW idiots yammer about Mexicans taking their jobs.
> 
> solution;
> 
> GET AN EDUCATION - GE A BETTER JOB.
> 
> DUMBASSES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> some people are less capable than others in gaining skills in higher education.  The dems used to be their party.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Only one major party has retraining of displaced workers in its platform. Hint: It ain't the party which elected Trump.
Click to expand...

The current position of the gop on supporting students in higher education including trade schools is dismal.


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Man...you sure do have some pent up hatred for brown people.
> 
> You won't see a wall built. And it won't matter because American FREE CAPITALIST corporations want them some Mexican labor. And they will have it.
> No wall will stop them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Another racist who thinks that only brown people break immigration laws.
> 
> kaz:  I want middle class Hispanics, not poor ones
> 
> You see a racist behind every tree, that while you push racist bigotry, grand wizard
Click to expand...


Why are you afraid to admit that you prefer white people over brown people? Nobody here knows who you are. You can 
still go through your real life hiding your true nature. Why hide it here? Free yourself.

Or...just once in your sad life....say something that leads a thinking person to believe that you are in favor of ethnic and racial diversity.
Call out some TRUE racists when you see them. Give us a hint that you understand why the rebel flag is a racist symbol and
statues honoring Robert E. Lee are tributes to bigotry. FFS.....we see you!


----------



## LoneLaugher

bendog said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Military usage is appropriated by POTUS...a Mexicrat POTUS wouldn’t keep troops on the border...they need to grow their constituency, they love illegals...you know this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> uneducated RW idiots yammer about Mexicans taking their jobs.
> 
> solution;
> 
> GET AN EDUCATION - GE A BETTER JOB.
> 
> DUMBASSES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> some people are less capable than others in gaining skills in higher education.  The dems used to be their party.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Only one major party has retraining of displaced workers in its platform. Hint: It ain't the party which elected Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The current position of the gop on supporting students in higher education including trade schools is dismal.
Click to expand...


Yes it is. As is their position on elementary and grade schools. Dismal.


----------



## kaz

Vandalshandle said:


> For some reason, Trumpettes seem to think that Mexicans don't know how to operate shovels and ladders. Not that they have to, since half of all illegal aliens simply overstayed their visas.



Somehow leftists don't understand that shovels and ladders aren't a realistic way for the million Mexicans who come here a year to get here.  Your standard is if one illegal gets through the whole thing is a failure.

You also don't understand that it's even harder to carry kilos of drugs, illegal weapons, etc. when you're crawling through a tunnel or climbing over a 30 foot wall designed to make that difficult.

Your most inane argument is that more electric monitoring and surveillance and more border patrols will work if we don't build a wall and won't work if we do.

Another failure who was educated (sic) in a government school


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
Click to expand...


The best possible scenario is to stop the illegal immigration of poor people and bring better educated normal people from those same countries instead.  We make it simple to come here illegally and very difficult to do it legally.  That is what is stupid, and it's your policy.

Of course your real goal is a voter registration drive and middle class won't be virtually exclusively Democrat like the poor people you want are.


----------



## bendog

LoneLaugher said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> only in the delusional minds of people who are such failures that they compete for jobs with people who don't speak English.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> uneducated RW idiots yammer about Mexicans taking their jobs.
> 
> solution;
> 
> GET AN EDUCATION - GE A BETTER JOB.
> 
> DUMBASSES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> some people are less capable than others in gaining skills in higher education.  The dems used to be their party.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Only one major party has retraining of displaced workers in its platform. Hint: It ain't the party which elected Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The current position of the gop on supporting students in higher education including trade schools is dismal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes it is. As is their position on elementary and grade schools. Dismal.
Click to expand...

I'm open to charter schools when public schools have failed.


----------



## kaz

bendog said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've never said I was against legal immigration.
Click to expand...


To leftists illegal immigration = immigration.  So when you say you're against illegal immigration, they hear you're against immigration


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've never said I was against legal immigration.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You didn't. But taking a severe hard line stance on those who are already here will harm our economy while it
> takes a piss on human beings who are only here because we needed them and they wanted a better life.
Click to expand...


Not if you export the poor welfare whores and import middle class educated people who are qualified for real jobs


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Did I rig your results?
Click to expand...


No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long


----------



## bendog

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The best possible scenario is to stop the illegal immigration of poor people and bring better educated normal people from those same countries instead.  We make it simple to come here illegally and very difficult to do it legally.  That is what is stupid, and it's your policy.
> 
> Of course your real goal is a voter registration drive and middle class won't be virtually exclusively Democrat like the poor people you want are.
Click to expand...


ummmm, I think it is NOT in our interest to close off all immigration of low skilled people from hellish situations.  We can't take everybody, but I think we should be seen as compassionate.  It helps counter the narratives of those who wish us harm, because "they hate our freedoms."
And helping silicon valley lower wages with HBI is not in out interest.


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Trumps not capitalistic enough for you?
Click to expand...


No, he's not.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism and Trump is not for free trade.

"Fair" trade is a euphemism for government controlled trade.  That and that Trump has been a pig to women is why I voted for Gary Johnson


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF are you talking about?  I said sending the military in to chase thousands of people across the desert every night is a stupid idea.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I gave a way to remove the reason for 1000s of people to be crossing the desert every night, so the military will only have to focus on the few that are left.  Though you clearly do not think our military is up to the task.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And when you call people racists for opposing illegal immigration, you prove you are not interested in any sort of discussion.  That is just a pure discussion ender.  Don't do that then whine when you don't get responses.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you do not want this to be about race, you should not have made your opening triade about Hispanics.  Seems simple enough
Click to expand...


Mentioning Hispanics once towards the end of my OP and saying they are like Americans is making my OP about Hispanics.  Got it.

Once again you prove the failure of government educations to critical thinking


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.
> 
> kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"
> 
> You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.
> 
> I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.
> 
> And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.
> 
> I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well.
> 
> More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.
Click to expand...


For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.

Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all. Just ribbing you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, obviously when you continually argue what Democrats do and you argue again what Democrats do, you were joking ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Very well said. You should copyright that one.
Click to expand...


Thanks, man.  I'll look into that


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
Click to expand...


To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.

We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way


----------



## Golfing Gator

bendog said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The best possible scenario is to stop the illegal immigration of poor people and bring better educated normal people from those same countries instead.  We make it simple to come here illegally and very difficult to do it legally.  That is what is stupid, and it's your policy.
> 
> Of course your real goal is a voter registration drive and middle class won't be virtually exclusively Democrat like the poor people you want are.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ummmm, I think it is NOT in our interest to close off all immigration of low skilled people from hellish situations.  We can't take everybody, but I think we should be seen as compassionate.  It helps counter the narratives of those who wish us harm, because "they hate our freedoms."
> And helping silicon valley lower wages with HBI is not in out interest.
Click to expand...


Not to mention that there are many high labor agricultural operations that are always in need of laborers.


----------



## kaz

bendog said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've never said I was against legal immigration.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You didn't. But taking a severe hard line stance on those who are already here will harm our economy while it
> takes a piss on human beings who are only here because we needed them and they wanted a better life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> used to be that if you had a toolbelt and knew how to use what were in it, you'd always get a paycheck, or that was the saying.  During the recession of 73-75, that didn't work out for me, but with public education I got through college.
> 
> I'm ok with temporary guest workers and regulated immigration for new citizens, but good with deporting people who broke the law to get here.  And imo we should remove incentives and disincentives that keep Americans from moving to where there are jobs and leaving places where there is not likely to be an uptick in economies
Click to expand...


I want to acknowledge I said I never see you arguing with Democrats.  I recognize that you are here


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.
> 
> kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"
> 
> You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.
> 
> I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.
> 
> And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.
> 
> I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well.
> 
> More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
Click to expand...


They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.


----------



## TroglocratsRdumb

The Democratic Party regards educated mainstream middle class taxpayers as its arch enemy and illegal aliens as its army of voters are against them.
The Left Wing is on a mission to change America into a third world country.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way



Roughly 2/3 of the illegal immigrants in our country are visa overstays.


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Man...you sure do have some pent up hatred for brown people.
> 
> You won't see a wall built. And it won't matter because American FREE CAPITALIST corporations want them some Mexican labor. And they will have it.
> No wall will stop them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Another racist who thinks that only brown people break immigration laws.
> 
> kaz:  I want middle class Hispanics, not poor ones
> 
> You see a racist behind every tree, that while you push racist bigotry, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why are you afraid to admit that you prefer white people over brown people? Nobody here knows who you are. You can
> still go through your real life hiding your true nature. Why hide it here? Free yourself.
> 
> Or...just once in your sad life....say something that leads a thinking person to believe that you are in favor of ethnic and racial diversity.
> Call out some TRUE racists when you see them. Give us a hint that you understand why the rebel flag is a racist symbol and
> statues honoring Robert E. Lee are tributes to bigotry. FFS.....we see you!
Click to expand...


And LoneLaughers limp goes limp again.  He realizes he's losing and badly.  So he goes to the conversation ender to clear the path so he can run away.

Got it, all you have left is you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist, you're a racist ...


----------



## bendog

kaz said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've never said I was against legal immigration.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You didn't. But taking a severe hard line stance on those who are already here will harm our economy while it
> takes a piss on human beings who are only here because we needed them and they wanted a better life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> used to be that if you had a toolbelt and knew how to use what were in it, you'd always get a paycheck, or that was the saying.  During the recession of 73-75, that didn't work out for me, but with public education I got through college.
> 
> I'm ok with temporary guest workers and regulated immigration for new citizens, but good with deporting people who broke the law to get here.  And imo we should remove incentives and disincentives that keep Americans from moving to where there are jobs and leaving places where there is not likely to be an uptick in economies
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I want to acknowledge I said I never see you arguing with Democrats.  I recognize that you are here
Click to expand...

Oh, I disagreed with most of Obama's foreign policy.  I thought he should have more aggressively negotiated an Iraq deal that would let us keep basically a brigade size force with airpower that could only be used if the central govt was threatened.  The gop is just not the same gop of Ford and Nixon's economics.  And it's not party of Reagan.

I don't see any evidence of you being a racist in this thread, btw.


----------



## kaz

The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.

Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.

Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.

Not seeing the blue wave here ...


----------



## bendog

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Roughly 2/3 of the illegal immigrants in our country are visa overstays.
Click to expand...

True.  We really need an metaphysical wall to keep GM out of Mexico and Mexican truckers out of the US.  (-:


----------



## kaz

bendog said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The best possible scenario is to stop the illegal immigration of poor people and bring better educated normal people from those same countries instead.  We make it simple to come here illegally and very difficult to do it legally.  That is what is stupid, and it's your policy.
> 
> Of course your real goal is a voter registration drive and middle class won't be virtually exclusively Democrat like the poor people you want are.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ummmm, I think it is NOT in our interest to close off all immigration of low skilled people from hellish situations.  We can't take everybody, but I think we should be seen as compassionate.  It helps counter the narratives of those who wish us harm, because "they hate our freedoms."
> And helping silicon valley lower wages with HBI is not in out interest.
Click to expand...


I will agree with that if we clean out our our current overload of poor people and give our own poor more job opportunities first.  If you want to donate to Mexico (or other countries) before that it's fine.  We don't need to import everyone's problems though


----------



## Reasonable




----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
Click to expand...


The wall won't stop anyone. Especially since it won't be built.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.
> 
> Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.
> 
> Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.
> 
> Not seeing the blue wave here ...



You didn’t really think anyone on a political forum was going to change their mind, did you?

You would have better luck with that on a religious forum


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.
> 
> Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.
> 
> Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.
> 
> Not seeing the blue wave here ...



You and Pumpkin are serious posters? That's so cool.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bendog said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wanting an end to illegal immigration is not racist.  The Wall is a racist euphemism for Mexicans.  And illegal immigration for Mexico has already lessened.  I'm all for deporting illegal immigrants and splitting up families and doing all kinds of unpleasant things to them ... legally.  They need to be dissuaded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's because you don't understand that we need them for our economy to flourish....and that is the best possible scenario.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The best possible scenario is to stop the illegal immigration of poor people and bring better educated normal people from those same countries instead.  We make it simple to come here illegally and very difficult to do it legally.  That is what is stupid, and it's your policy.
> 
> Of course your real goal is a voter registration drive and middle class won't be virtually exclusively Democrat like the poor people you want are.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ummmm, I think it is NOT in our interest to close off all immigration of low skilled people from hellish situations.  We can't take everybody, but I think we should be seen as compassionate.  It helps counter the narratives of those who wish us harm, because "they hate our freedoms."
> And helping silicon valley lower wages with HBI is not in out interest.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not to mention that there are many high labor agricultural operations that are always in need of laborers.
Click to expand...


And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.

But too many of the Americans are black, which is a problem for you, grand wizard


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.
> 
> kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"
> 
> You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.
> 
> I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.
> 
> And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.
> 
> I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well.
> 
> More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
Click to expand...


There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.

And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard


----------



## LoneLaugher

Instead of penalizing corporations who hire low wage immigrants ( documented or not ) you want the boss to build a wall that won't keep anyone out. 

Good head on those shoulders.


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.
> 
> kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"
> 
> You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.
> 
> I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.
> 
> And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.
> 
> I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well.
> 
> More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
Click to expand...


Sure it is.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> But too many of the Americans are black, which is a problem for you, grand wizard



You are so damn cute...

I call you out for being dishonest, so you start to call me dishonest. 

I call you out for singling out hispanics in your OP and now you call me a racist.

They say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, so I guess I should feel honored.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.



Three problems with your statement.

First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed. 

Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall. 

Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.


----------



## kaz

Reasonable said:


> View attachment 183890



You're just swilling the kool-aid.  Careful, that stuff will kill you


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard



Actually, it really is not.  The system is designed to keep most people in the class they were born into and allow a few to break through to the next level to keep the peasants like you happy.


----------



## kaz

bendog said:


> I don't see any evidence of you being a racist in this thread, btw.



Yeah, I don't hate my wife and kids, LOL.

Democrats have a failed, irrational, illogical ideology.  That's why they can only argue hate


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The wall won't stop anyone. Especially since it won't be built.
Click to expand...


That's why leftists are laying yourself on the ground to stop it.  


You know that's the only way it won't be built, and you know it will work if it is.  It would be the end of the Democrat party as we know it.  Your entire farm system will be obliterated.

So once that happens, are you going to try to get the blue Americans you've been spitting on back?


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.
> 
> Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.
> 
> Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.
> 
> Not seeing the blue wave here ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t really think anyone on a political forum was going to change their mind, did you?
> 
> You would have better luck with that on a religious forum
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


Cool.  You have anything on what I said?


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.
> 
> Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.
> 
> Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.
> 
> Not seeing the blue wave here ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You and Pumpkin are serious posters? That's so cool.
Click to expand...


Yes, we are.  Thanks man


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.
> 
> Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.
> 
> Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.
> 
> Not seeing the blue wave here ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t really think anyone on a political forum was going to change their mind, did you?
> 
> You would have better luck with that on a religious forum
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cool.  You have anything on what I said?
Click to expand...


You didn’t say anything other than nobody has changed, and you seemed shocked by that.  Which made me laugh at loud at you 


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, so it was your twisting what I said, you dishonest piece of crap.
> 
> kaz:  "Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful"
> 
> You said I only want "non-whites" here.  You're the liar.
> 
> I said I want NORMAL Hispanics.  Not poor Hispanics because Hispanics are as I said "like all other Americans."  The poor ones are owned by Democrats and vote for them.
> 
> And you think you were honest???  You can't be serious.
> 
> I'll tell you what.  Let's take all the poor white Americans and trade them for middle class Mexicans.  I'll take that deal in a heart beat.  Will you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well.
> 
> More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
Click to expand...


Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> But too many of the Americans are black, which is a problem for you, grand wizard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are so damn cute...
> 
> I call you out for being dishonest, so you start to call me dishonest.
> 
> I call you out for singling out hispanics in your OP and now you call me a racist.
> 
> They say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, so I guess I should feel honored.
Click to expand...


Once again, gator, what you just said, right back at you!  LOL.  It's all you have.  Even when I say that


----------



## emilynghiem

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.



I am guessing I'd vote for Trump again in 2020 because change is so slow.
But if it were to happen by 2020 that all the candidates of all parties work together
to build military bases, teaching hospitals, production facilities, campus towns and service centers
across the border, as a multi-party multi-state multi-national solution to trafficking and border crimes,
then a different set of candidates might be running by then.

If the parties cannot get their act together, Trump may still be the bull dog yelling that this bipartisan mess isn't working.
I thought he could use his business connections and media strategies to CREATE JOBS FOR ALL PARTY LEADERS
arguing they have a solution. Oh yeah? then PROVE it. Use your party platforms and outreach to BUILD that solution
and then use that to run for office instead of empty campaigns and donations wasted on rhetoric. Raise and invest 
donations and create jobs in building sustainable communities and programs along the border.

That's what we are going to need.

More than just a wall.

But a whole series of city states for all these populations to manage their own demands
by owning their own property and programs so the workers and residents learn self-government.
That's how Texas was settled, that's how America was founded, by people building and owning it themselves.

www.earnedamnesty.org

How many jobs and schools for "Dreamers" could Trump create by working WITH all the other
party leaders and States instead of fighting and wasting resources while these problems continue to kill people and budgets?

Whoever can unite the people, parties and states to work together,
that's what is going to decide WHICH people and WHICH parties hold WHICH offices.

I'd put all the parties in charge of different areas,
and create enough jobs fixing economic and social problems
by delegating these instead of fighting to control everything.

Greens can supervise jobs and education in environmental corrections and restoration
needed in CA, the Gulf and other areas destroyed by man made pollution and development.

Democrats can take on prison reform to finance health care, and set up
schools and teaching hospitals for inmate and immigrants to work jobs
providing public health care and prevention of mental and criminal ills behind drug addiction, gun violence, and other crimes.

Republicans can reform the VA and create jobs for Vets in border security,
running the Post Office and keeping the Internet free of criminal abuses,
and training communities in law enforcement, gun safety, etc for effective security.

Libertarians can set up and manage a grievance system by party precinct and Electoral District,
to check abuses of govt at every level, by taking and addressing complaints of abuse and
conflicts of interest, violations of due process or obstruction of justice, and assessing
the cost of debts and damages so that taxpayers can collect restitution or credits for govt abuses.

This would create enough jobs to fix the problems that politics has cost this country.

And the restitution for the past wrongs can be charged back to the wrongdoers,
so taxpayers receive CREDIT and restitution, and are not burdened with debts
from damages caused by the crimes and violations of others.  Between the Greens
who developed a system of independent currency based on labor, and the Libertarians
arguing for Federal Reserve reform, every state can set up its own Federal Reserve
type currency system to assess past debts and credit back Taxpayers for wrongful
abuses and charges, then use that credit to finance reforms and sustainable programs
to replace govt bureaucracy and failures.  Taxpayers and investors who lend money
to govt or states to finance these reforms against past debts can claim shares of
ownership in the programs or property, so people are REWARDED not punished.

We need to take back the country from corrupt abuses charged to taxpayers
not represented by debts and damages we didn't authorize.

Instead of Refuse and Resist,
we need to Reclaim, Rebuild and Refinance.

If Trump doesn't lead these teams, let us all lead together.
It takes all of us doing the work if it's going to get done!


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
Click to expand...


Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working. 

Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life

Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life


----------



## emilynghiem

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
Click to expand...


Dear kaz 
Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.

Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.

Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
have a legal track for claiming residency.

From there, just like other international school programs, students
or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.

As for how to finance all this construction and development,
as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.

So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.


----------



## Dragonlady

MACAULAY said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> ____________
> 
> Irish, Germans and Poles came over LEGALLY.
> 
> I didn't read the rest of your post as I feared being blinded by Sophistry and Obfuscation.
> 
> _____
Click to expand...


Immigration laws as we know them, didn’t exist 100 years ago. Much European immigration to North America took place in the wake of WWII, and Stalin’s take-over of Eastern Europe. 

But once Europe recovered economically and rebuilt after WWII, and especially after the USSR collapsed in the early 1990’s, Europeans have been staying put. Better education and opportunities exist at home. Health care and child birth won’t bankrupt you or your family. Mass shootings aren’t a huge problem 

Only people from shit hole countries want to leave home.  People who are worse off where they are. I notice you’re not building a wall to keep Canadians out.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The vote itself isn't surprising because while leftists on the board are louder, there are fewer of them.  What is interesting is how few of us are changing our votes.  Again, I asked for best guess, meaning on information known now.
> 
> *Not Trump (2016) to Trump (2020).  Two.  Pumpkin Row and me and we're both serious posters.
> 
> Trump to (2016) to not Trump (2016).  One.  Sealybo claimed this, but he's obviously lying as he's 100% true blue Democrat.  That's why I make people identify themselves.  Flewism, who I don't know also said this.  Since I don't know him/her I'll take them at face value.*
> 
> Not seeing the blue wave here ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t really think anyone on a political forum was going to change their mind, did you?
> 
> You would have better luck with that on a religious forum
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cool.  You have anything on what I said?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You didn’t say anything other than nobody has changed, and you seemed shocked by that.  Which made me laugh at loud at you
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


I did?  Actually I said only a few people changed.  Do you EVER read posts you respond to?  CAN you read?  Just another government school failure.

As for few changing, I just said this blue wave you morons are predicting isn't backed up.  Most people aren't changing their votes.  On this site, more are going from not Trump to Trump than the reverse.  Particularly when you toss out Sealybo's obvious lie


----------



## kaz

emilynghiem said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz
> Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
> why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
> border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.
> 
> Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
> similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.
> 
> Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
> to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
> an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
> have a legal track for claiming residency.
> 
> From there, just like other international school programs, students
> or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
> work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
> system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.
> 
> As for how to finance all this construction and development,
> as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
> restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
> plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
> home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.
> 
> So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
> amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
> costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
> And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
> of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
> of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
> endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
> status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.
Click to expand...


I like people who think of alternate approaches.  I'm not sure this would satisfy anyone though including the illegal aliens here getting welfare


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com



As for few changing, I just said this blue wave you morons are predicting isn't backed up.  Most people aren't changing their votes.  On this site, more are going from not Trump to Trump than the reverse.  Particularly when you toss out Sealybo's obvious lie[/QUOTE]

Wait, so because a bunch of partisan hacks on an internet political forum do not change their minds, you think that somehow translates to the rest of the country?  are you really that stupid. 

90% of the people that come to forums like this are not the "undecideds" or the "swing votes" they are the people that are loyal to their side no matter what. There are a few of us that are not tied to one party or the others, but most are like you and have sold their soul to a party.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.



Companies will not pay better wages as long as there is a source of cheaper labor, and they will always be a source of cheaper labor till you do something to stop it.  A wall will not stop it because they will find a way to come here as long as someone is willing to pay them.

Why are you so opposed to enforcing the laws of the land on the companies that hire illegals and pay them to come here?   Is it because most of those companies are owned white people and not hispanics?  or because those companies are owned by "NORMAL" people and not poor people?


----------



## kaz

Dragonlady said:


> MACAULAY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> ____________
> 
> Irish, Germans and Poles came over LEGALLY.
> 
> I didn't read the rest of your post as I feared being blinded by Sophistry and Obfuscation.
> 
> _____
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Immigration laws as we know them, didn’t exist 100 years ago. Much European immigration to North America took place in the wake of WWII, and Stalin’s take-over of Eastern Europe.
> 
> But once Europe recovered economically and rebuilt after WWII, and especially after the USSR collapsed in the early 1990’s, Europeans have been staying put. Better education and opportunities exist at home. Health care and child birth won’t bankrupt you or your family. Mass shootings aren’t a huge problem
> 
> Only people from shit hole countries want to leave home.  People who are worse off where they are. I notice you’re not building a wall to keep Canadians out.
Click to expand...


Bloodthirsty hoards do sweep down from Mongolia, I mean Canada, and plunder American villages.  But there aren't enough of you to make that much different though and you mostly use rubber tomahawks anyway.

But back to reality, the situation along Mexico and Canada is so dramatically different that it's an absurd comparison.  Yes, there is a threat that bad guys would fly into Canada and cross here, but that would would be far more expensive for a far lower benefit than a wall with Mexico, and you know that


----------



## bendog

Dragonlady said:


> MACAULAY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bigot like you said the same thing about the Irish 150 years ago.
> 
> And the Germans 100 years ago.
> 
> And the Poles 50 years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades. But this is it. The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom. That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall. They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, the right wing cares about the freedom of rich people to exploit working folks.
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country. (Most undocumented workers actually entered the country legally or through another route.)
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall. If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done. Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful. But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, um.... funny thing about that.. the blacks have been waiting a lot longer than the Hispanics have...
> 
> Okay, here's the real problem you guys have.  You've spent the last few decades scaring white people into voting against their own economic interests by telling them the Darkies are out to get them.... which worked fine up until the 1980's, but really doesn't work now because there are too many of them, and some white people aren't really comfortable with racism.
> 
> The ironic thing is, Hispanics SHOULD be a conservative block now. religious, hard working and pro-family.  They'll probably drag the Democrats closer to the center.  But you guys have so thoroughly alienated them you've probably lost them for generations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> ____________
> 
> Irish, Germans and Poles came over LEGALLY.
> 
> I didn't read the rest of your post as I feared being blinded by Sophistry and Obfuscation.
> 
> _____
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Immigration laws as we know them, didn’t exist 100 years ago. Much European immigration to North America took place in the wake of WWII, and Stalin’s take-over of Eastern Europe.
> 
> But once Europe recovered economically and rebuilt after WWII, and especially after the USSR collapsed in the early 1990’s, Europeans have been staying put. Better education and opportunities exist at home. Health care and child birth won’t bankrupt you or your family. Mass shootings aren’t a huge problem
> 
> Only people from shit hole countries want to leave home.  People who are worse off where they are. I notice you’re not building a wall to keep Canadians out.
Click to expand...


Keep Kanucks OUT!


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> Wait, so because a bunch of partisan hacks on an internet political forum do not change their minds, you think that somehow translates to the rest of the country?  are you really that stupid.
> 
> 90% of the people that come to forums like this are not the "undecideds" or the "swing votes" they are the people that are loyal to their side no matter what. There are a few of us that are not tied to one party or the others, but most are like you and have sold their soul to a party.



This is dull.  Pull the stick out or don't.  But be more interesting


----------



## emilynghiem

kaz said:


> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz
> Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
> why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
> border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.
> 
> Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
> similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.
> 
> Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
> to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
> an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
> have a legal track for claiming residency.
> 
> From there, just like other international school programs, students
> or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
> work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
> system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.
> 
> As for how to finance all this construction and development,
> as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
> restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
> plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
> home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.
> 
> So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
> amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
> costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
> And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
> of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
> of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
> endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
> status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I like people who think of alternate approaches.  I'm not sure this would satisfy anyone though including the illegal aliens here getting welfare
Click to expand...


Dear kaz: The Dreamers have called out Democrats for not working with Trump
on a legal solution.  The solution, of setting up sustainable campuses
where benefits can be earned by working and studying under supervised school programs,
would also resolve issues of how to cover "welfare" instead of
charging this to taxpayers without our consent and representation.

If Democrats want to fund THAT instead of war, why not
offer this choice on tax forms? 

And if Democrats like Obama and Pelosi owe taxpayers billions
if not trillions from unauthorized payouts to insurance companies and lobbies
as "corporate welfare" on our dime, why not DEMAND that those
costs be PAID BACK. Then Democrats can use that to start their
budget for health care, and create a sustainable program for those members
who they promised such benefits to. If the party promised it, and advertised
it to get donations, votes and support, then they owe it to provide the services they promise
or it's fraud. So charge them with fraud and demand restitution, and then all
their fundraising needs to go pay for the legislation and consequences
they set up that wasn't constitutional, but violated the rights and due process
of taxpayers not represented by those terms. So by "conspiracy to violate
equal civil rights" the Democrats responsible should be sued for damages
and be required to pay back all debts to taxpayers. And in turn, they can
equally sue or petition for all the war spending they didn't approve to 
get paid back to taxpayers, and use that to support VA and health care reform too!


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> Companies will not pay better wages as long as there is a source of cheaper labor, and they will always be a source of cheaper labor till you do something to stop it



Yes, that's exactly what I'm arguing



Golfing Gator said:


> A wall will not stop it because they will find a way to come here as long as someone is willing to pay them



Will some get through?  Sure.  A million?  Not.  Nowhere near that, which is exactly why you're so hysterically against the wall.

And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid



Golfing Gator said:


> Why are you so opposed to enforcing the laws of the land on the companies that hire illegals and pay them to come here?



Strawman.  I'm for that and never said I wasn't.  We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here.  Here's the thing.  Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else.  Again, that terrible government education you got



Golfing Gator said:


> Is it because most of those companies are owned white people and not hispanics?  or because those companies are owned by "NORMAL" people and not poor people?



Yes, poor people are brown, criminals are brown, you mentioned that, Grand Wizard.  Who ya lynching tonight?  Another uppity negro like last night?


----------



## emilynghiem

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Companies will not pay better wages as long as there is a source of cheaper labor, and they will always be a source of cheaper labor till you do something to stop it.  A wall will not stop it because they will find a way to come here as long as someone is willing to pay them.
> 
> Why are you so opposed to enforcing the laws of the land on the companies that hire illegals and pay them to come here?   Is it because most of those companies are owned white people and not hispanics?  or because those companies are owned by "NORMAL" people and not poor people?
Click to expand...


Build more than a wall, then Golfing Gator
Build production plants and programs where jobs and training can be moved back to America
and not outsourced to Asia.

Paying people is not enough. People need to own their own land
and invest in ownership to break the cycle of poverty and oppression.

Property rights for world's poor could unlock trillions in 'dead...


----------



## kaz

emilynghiem said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz
> Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
> why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
> border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.
> 
> Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
> similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.
> 
> Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
> to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
> an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
> have a legal track for claiming residency.
> 
> From there, just like other international school programs, students
> or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
> work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
> system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.
> 
> As for how to finance all this construction and development,
> as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
> restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
> plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
> home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.
> 
> So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
> amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
> costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
> And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
> of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
> of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
> endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
> status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I like people who think of alternate approaches.  I'm not sure this would satisfy anyone though including the illegal aliens here getting welfare
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz: The Dreamers have called out Democrats for not working with Trump
> on a legal solution.  The solution, of setting up sustainable campuses
> where benefits can be earned by working and studying under supervised school programs,
> would also resolve issues of how to cover "welfare" instead of
> charging this to taxpayers without our consent and representation.
> 
> If Democrats want to fund THAT instead of war, why not
> offer this choice on tax forms?
> 
> And if Democrats like Obama and Pelosi owe taxpayers billions
> if not trillions from unauthorized payouts to insurance companies and lobbies
> as "corporate welfare" on our dime, why not DEMAND that those
> costs be PAID BACK. Then Democrats can use that to start their
> budget for health care, and create a sustainable program for those members
> who they promised such benefits to. If the party promised it, and advertised
> it to get donations, votes and support, then they owe it to provide the services they promise
> or it's fraud. So charge them with fraud and demand restitution, and then all
> their fundraising needs to go pay for the legislation and consequences
> they set up that wasn't constitutional, but violated the rights and due process
> of taxpayers not represented by those terms. So by "conspiracy to violate
> equal civil rights" the Democrats responsible should be sued for damages
> and be required to pay back all debts to taxpayers. And in turn, they can
> equally sue or petition for all the war spending they didn't approve to
> get paid back to taxpayers, and use that to support VA and health care reform too!
Click to expand...


If someone starts a serious campaign to do that, I'd be glad to look more closely at it


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid



No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side. 

But you want the wall and nothing else matters. 



> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else



Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
Click to expand...


Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?


----------



## Golfing Gator

emilynghiem said:


> Build production plants and programs where jobs and training can be moved back to America
> and not outsourced to Asia.
> 
> Paying people is not enough. People need to own their own land
> and invest in ownership to break the cycle of poverty and oppression.
> 
> Property rights for world's poor could unlock trillions in 'dead...



Now you are moving past a discussion on illegal immigration and getting into much bigger things.


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?



You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.  

Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The wall won't stop anyone. Especially since it won't be built.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's why leftists are laying yourself on the ground to stop it.
> 
> 
> You know that's the only way it won't be built, and you know it will work if it is.  It would be the end of the Democrat party as we know it.  Your entire farm system will be obliterated.
> 
> So once that happens, are you going to try to get the blue Americans you've been spitting on back?
Click to expand...


No it isn't. It's the fact that it's stupid. It sends the wrong message and is a waste of money. 

Ya dumb shit.


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, now in your world poor people are not normal?  really that is where you want to go to now?   So, you are not only a racist you are an classist as well.
> 
> More and more about you just keeps coming out with every post.  By all means do not stop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
Click to expand...


You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.


----------



## Golfing Gator

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
Click to expand...


The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.


----------



## bendog

On the poverty issue, I heard this story on the radio while driving.  I thought it was interesting.

Forget Wealth And Neighborhood. The Racial Income Gap Persists

To me, the wall is just a politically divisive thing, and that's why Trump ran it up the campaign wall in the first place.  If the US is place very hostile to illegal immigrants, of all stripes, I think we'll see fewer.  It won't end, and the wall won't end it either.  I think a war on drugs analogy is apt.

When a guy is convicted of selling drugs, and goes to jail, his family is separated.  He's separated from his buds.  His job.  Choosing what to eat.  Generally, that's why we put people in jail.  To make them miserable over doing something we don't like. 

Yet, people still sell drugs.  Imo for two basic reasons.  1.  They're addicts who need to pay for their own drugs, and they can't get honest work because they're addicts.  I don't think there's an immigration analogy there, because these people usually have physical/psychological reasons affecting their addictions.  2.  Other people, and I see them all the time, sell drugs because that's the way they can make the most money.  Taking away their families and friends and freedom to be in the US, are not effective because ..... they're willing to chance it to have more stuff for them and their families.

As inhumane as it is, I think you see some changes in illegal immigration if you make it very hostile for families here, and very difficult  to send remittances back.  We will always see young people selling themselves into sexual slavery to get out of even worse hell holes.  We will always see people willing to sail across seas filled with sharks because their situations are so awful.  But a wall doesn't change that.


----------



## Siete

Golfing Gator said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
Click to expand...


mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.


----------



## toomuchtime_

Siete said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
Click to expand...

If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.


----------



## Golfing Gator

toomuchtime_ said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.
Click to expand...


Many ag products are not suitable for machines to harvest.

Here is a strawberry picking machine....


----------



## emilynghiem

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
Click to expand...


Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.

kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
to pull that many people.

Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.

So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
complexes, and cities can be built around that.

kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.

We need more than that.

If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.

What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working 
either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!

Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc 
organizing sustainable Development along the border:

www.paceuniversal.com
Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking

UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
what a concept

www.campusplan.org
Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts

the expanded plan to restore the historic district
of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
through business management of property and programs was
already posted www.freedmenstown.com

and replicating that plan along the border
might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org

So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the 
same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.

kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
ask for a conference between parties and how to use
the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
with parties and start working out common proposals.

Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!


----------



## emilynghiem

Golfing Gator said:


> toomuchtime_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Many ag products are not suitable for machines to harvest.
> 
> Here is a strawberry picking machine....
Click to expand...


I'd hate to see a mass "nose picking" machine!
Ouch!!!


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.
> 
> Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?
Click to expand...


Do the math...he’s not far off with his figure of speech that you’ve taken literally...Bear in mind the numbers are way down.

“Border Patrol agents nabbed 16,089 illegal immigrants trying to sneak in, while Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officers identified another 5,570 illegal immigrants who showed up without authorization at the ports of entry.
The combined 21,659 illegal immigrants are still the lowest numbers for June in years, but the spike is worrisome because illegal immigration generally begins to slow in the summer months. Indeed, the last four years saw an average drop of 10 percent in Border Patrol apprehensions in June — but this year saw an 11 percent rise.“
Illegal immigration spikes along U.S.-Mexico border


----------



## toomuchtime_

Golfing Gator said:


> toomuchtime_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Many ag products are not suitable for machines to harvest.
> 
> Here is a strawberry picking machine....
Click to expand...

No, here is a strawberry picking machine.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
Click to expand...


You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.

I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.

Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.

And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.
> 
> Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?
Click to expand...


Bull shit.  1 million illegal aliens come here across the southern border a year.  That is almost 2,740 people a night on average, which is by definition "thousands"


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.
> 
> Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit.  1 million illegal aliens come here across the southern border a year.  That is almost 2,740 people a night on average, which is by definition "thousands"
Click to expand...


Link for your number please.

And you keep ignoring the fact that if they had nobody willing to pay them, most would not come.  But you, again, refuse to even talk about that side of it.  Why is that?


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
Click to expand...


i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.

I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Trumps not capitalistic enough for you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, he's not.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism and Trump is not for free trade.
> 
> "Fair" trade is a euphemism for government controlled trade.  That and that Trump has been a pig to women is why I voted for Gary Johnson
Click to expand...


I disagree with you libertarians.  You think there should be no referee in the game of business but that's ridiculous.  

Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.



All I can go by is what you post and you've have not talked about anything but the wall,the wall, the wall....




> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.



how does the wall fix this problem?



> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.



Holy shit, that would get really expensive really quick.




> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year



Bull shit, the military members are alrday paid for, there is money being saved by not having them in other countries and guarding the border could be tied into their training.   Every pilot has to have a set number of NVG hours every month, the infantry practices patrolling, UAV guys could be used.


----------



## Golfing Gator

toomuchtime_ said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toomuchtime_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Many ag products are not suitable for machines to harvest.
> 
> Here is a strawberry picking machine....
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, here is a strawberry picking machine.
Click to expand...


Have you ever been in a large scale strawberry farm? they are not growing that that high off the ground and that far apart.


----------



## edward37

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
Click to expand...

Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
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> LoneLaugher said:
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> kaz said:
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> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The wall won't stop anyone. Especially since it won't be built.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's why leftists are laying yourself on the ground to stop it.
> 
> 
> You know that's the only way it won't be built, and you know it will work if it is.  It would be the end of the Democrat party as we know it.  Your entire farm system will be obliterated.
> 
> So once that happens, are you going to try to get the blue Americans you've been spitting on back?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No it isn't. It's the fact that it's stupid. It sends the wrong message and is a waste of money.
> 
> Ya dumb shit.
Click to expand...


Gotcha, because illegal aliens can walk through walls like they aren't there.  I think you're thinking of space aliens.  Like the ones that live in your brain.  Oh, and your sock drawer.

So you oppose fencing around nuclear power plants because they don't work too, right?


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> LoneLaugher said:
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> kaz said:
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> Golfing Gator said:
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> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> For most people, poor is a choice.  They don't work for an education, they don't work at their jobs, they just accept their lot in life and make choices that keep them poor.
> 
> Unlike you, I don't tie that to race.  Race is irrelevant.  And there are plenty of poor white people, Grand Wizard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
Click to expand...


So now you think I hate white people?  What a stupid douche


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> kaz said:
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> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
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> kaz said:
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> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
Click to expand...


Yes comrade, it's the corporations and the rich, the bourgeois is oppressing the proletariat.

Actually, you study in school, you can go to college.  Period.  And you clean yourself up, work at your job, you will keep getting better paying jobs.  You save, you live below your means.  You won't be poor.

Explain in your Marxist mind how that isn't true


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
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> 
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> kaz said:
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> LoneLaugher said:
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> kaz said:
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> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The wall won't stop anyone. Especially since it won't be built.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's why leftists are laying yourself on the ground to stop it.
> 
> 
> You know that's the only way it won't be built, and you know it will work if it is.  It would be the end of the Democrat party as we know it.  Your entire farm system will be obliterated.
> 
> So once that happens, are you going to try to get the blue Americans you've been spitting on back?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No it isn't. It's the fact that it's stupid. It sends the wrong message and is a waste of money.
> 
> Ya dumb shit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotcha, because illegal aliens can walk through walls like they aren't there.  I think you're thinking of space aliens.  Like the ones that live in your brain.  Oh, and your sock drawer.
> 
> So you oppose fencing around nuclear power plants because they don't work too, right?
Click to expand...


Whoa! What an argument! You are so smart! 

There won't be a wall. And whatever is built will be incomplete. There will be gaps. 

Have you been paying attention to the omnibus bill? Your hero is going to sign a bill that doesn't give him funding for his wall. This time next week, I expect that you will forget this thread and give us more reasons why you feel it is imperative to support the moron. 

You like him. Admit it. You like Trump.


----------



## kaz

Siete said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
Click to expand...


They didn't refuse to take it because of the minimum wage.  They refused to take it because in your example Juan took it for $7 an hour.

My God, why would you want to inflict your horrible government school education on your children?


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> They are all races, but they are not NORMAL in your view.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So now you think I hate white people?  What a stupid douche
Click to expand...


I said no such thing. But, now that you mention it, I think you hate liberal white people. And poor white people. But, you prefer them to brown liberal people and brown poor people. That's not hard to see.


----------



## kaz

toomuchtime_ said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.
Click to expand...


Yep.  Or they'd have to pay market rates and the poor in this country would earn better wages


----------



## Pogo

kaz said:


> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground. With electric monitoring and surveillance and thousands of more border control agents.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> So Pogo: You fill in the blank.



Okay.

_A million Mexicans_..... walk up to a bar. A long horizontal bar of reinforced concrete and dug into the ground.

Before they order a _cerveza_, they stop to gape in wonder at how such a structure could be dug into the Rio Grande River.

The next thing they do is look among themselves and say (in Spanish) "what the fuck are we doing here? Even the United States knows that most illegal immigrants go in via legitimate everyday means and then overstay their visas!"

Then they give the finger to the cartoonist that drew them there and return home, content in the knowledge that their foray to the border never did exist except in the comic book fantasies of message board Rumpbots who line up to buy any mindless snake oil the Orange Oaf sells them.






kaz said:


> What's particularly funny about you leftists is you think the electronic monitoring and surveillance and more border agents will work without the wall, but it won't work with it!



Not sure who "you leftists" are but I (which is singular) have never posted anything about "electronic monitoring and surveillance" with or without "more border agents" so once again, posting apparently to the comic book.

Of which here comes an example right now.....




kaz said:


> hat I think building a wall and defending it is more efficient than the military chasing thousands of people across the desert every night



"thousands of people every night" huh.  
But I repeat myself about Gullibles' Travels....


----------



## kaz

emilynghiem said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
> I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
> Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
> to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.
> 
> kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
> for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
> keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
> It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
> such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
> it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
> people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
> They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
> to pull that many people.
> 
> Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
> development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
> Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
> to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.
> 
> So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
> complexes, and cities can be built around that.
> 
> kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
> is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
> and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.
> 
> We need more than that.
> 
> If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
> then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.
> 
> What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
> with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working
> either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
> all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
> DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!
> 
> Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
> for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc
> organizing sustainable Development along the border:
> 
> www.paceuniversal.com
> Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
> women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking
> 
> UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
> UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
> what a concept
> 
> www.campusplan.org
> Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
> to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
> creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
> while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
> and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts
> 
> the expanded plan to restore the historic district
> of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
> through business management of property and programs was
> already posted www.freedmenstown.com
> 
> and replicating that plan along the border
> might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org
> 
> So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
> to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
> similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the
> same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.
> 
> kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
> better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
> ask for a conference between parties and how to use
> the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
> with parties and start working out common proposals.
> 
> Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
> each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
> DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
> ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!
Click to expand...


I'm for military support of the wall, just not as a replacement for it.  The military trying to chase almost 3K illegal aliens around the desert as Gator proposes a night is insane.  And he wants that not because he believes it will work, but because he knows it won't.  The opposite of why he opposes the wall.

And Trump is already there advocating the wall.  Why would I go grass roots for something that is already in the White House?  That's why after not voting for Trump I'm advocating him and his ideas.

And contrary to the lies of the left, he isn't just proposing a wall, he's proposing electronic security, more border agents, a focus on Visa overstays.  We have to do all of those things to secure our border


----------



## The Sage of Main Street

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
Click to expand...

*Treason Is Not a Property Right*

Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price. 

 It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.
> 
> Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do the math...he’s not far off with his figure of speech that you’ve taken literally...Bear in mind the numbers are way down.
> 
> “Border Patrol agents nabbed 16,089 illegal immigrants trying to sneak in, while Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officers identified another 5,570 illegal immigrants who showed up without authorization at the ports of entry.
> The combined 21,659 illegal immigrants are still the lowest numbers for June in years, but the spike is worrisome because illegal immigration generally begins to slow in the summer months. Indeed, the last four years saw an average drop of 10 percent in Border Patrol apprehensions in June — but this year saw an 11 percent rise.“
> Illegal immigration spikes along U.S.-Mexico border
Click to expand...


Border crossings down is a recent, short term phenomena which even if it lasted through Trump would end when he leaves.  Which is what Gator and the leftists are counting on, that we don't solve the problem.

Also, it's the ones who aren't bad that aren't coming.  Trump isn't scaring murderers, rapists, drug dealers, gun dealers or any other criminals.

But 1,000,000 / 365 = 2,740. 

Even if you reduce that by 2/3, it's over 900 people a night average


----------



## dblack

sealybobo said:


> You think there should be no referee in the game of business but that's ridiculous.



Nah. We need a referee. The problem is when government wants to be the coach.


----------



## Pogo

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
Click to expand...


Zackly, which is how most of it happens.  But cracking down on visa overstays doesn't sell nearly as well as an image of a thousands-of-miles-long "wall" that "Mexico will pay for".

Easy to imagine and sell to the intellectually mouth-agape ---- not so easy to make a reality.


----------



## toomuchtime_

Golfing Gator said:


> toomuchtime_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toomuchtime_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> The chances of moving up the economic ladder in the US are 2nd worst in the industrialized world, only England lags behind the US.  There is very little economic mobility in this country.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mention raising min wage and RW's crap flames ... Juan got the $7 an hour job that Americans refuse to take.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If Juan weren't here, most of the agricultural jobs he is doing would be done by machines, which would boost sales for the equipment makers, providing good paying manufacturing jobs for Americans and better paying agricultural jobs for those few agricultural workers still needed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Many ag products are not suitable for machines to harvest.
> 
> Here is a strawberry picking machine....
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, here is a strawberry picking machine.
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Have you ever been in a large scale strawberry farm? they are not growing that that high off the ground and that far apart.
Click to expand...

Of course, and the land would have to be reconfigured to accommodate the machine, just as roads were paved to accommodate the automobile, but once that has been done and the cost of the equipment and reconfiguration has be amortized over the life of the machine, it should cost less to harvest strawberries and the modernization of harvesting will give a boost to the equipment manufacturers.  The point is there is no need for illegal agricultural migrants in America.  If you want to advocate for illegal immigrants for other reasons, go ahead, but don't pretend we need them.


----------



## The Sage of Main Street

kaz said:


> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
> I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
> Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
> to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.
> 
> kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
> for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
> keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
> It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
> such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
> it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
> people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
> They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
> to pull that many people.
> 
> Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
> development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
> Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
> to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.
> 
> So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
> complexes, and cities can be built around that.
> 
> kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
> is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
> and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.
> 
> We need more than that.
> 
> If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
> then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.
> 
> What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
> with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working
> either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
> all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
> DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!
> 
> Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
> for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc
> organizing sustainable Development along the border:
> 
> www.paceuniversal.com
> Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
> women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking
> 
> UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
> UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
> what a concept
> 
> www.campusplan.org
> Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
> to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
> creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
> while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
> and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts
> 
> the expanded plan to restore the historic district
> of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
> through business management of property and programs was
> already posted www.freedmenstown.com
> 
> and replicating that plan along the border
> might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org
> 
> So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
> to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
> similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the
> same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.
> 
> kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
> better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
> ask for a conference between parties and how to use
> the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
> with parties and start working out common proposals.
> 
> Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
> each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
> DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
> ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm for military support of the wall, just not as a replacement for it.  The military trying to chase almost 3K illegal aliens around the desert as Gator proposes a night is insane.  And he wants that not because he believes it will work, but because he knows it won't.  The opposite of why he opposes the wall.
> 
> And Trump is already there advocating the wall.  Why would I go grass roots for something that is already in the White House?  That's why after not voting for Trump I'm advocating him and his ideas.
> 
> And contrary to the lies of the left, he isn't just proposing a wall, he's proposing electronic security, more border agents, a focus on Visa overstays.  We have to do all of those things to secure our border
Click to expand...

*Think About the Objections You Are Told to Recite*

For every border bandito we kill, thousands will be scared into vamoosing.  It is illogical to think of numbers on each side when the power of a lethal solution is magnified far beyond the individual incident.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.
> 
> Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit.  1 million illegal aliens come here across the southern border a year.  That is almost 2,740 people a night on average, which is by definition "thousands"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link for your number please.
> 
> And you keep ignoring the fact that if they had nobody willing to pay them, most would not come.  But you, again, refuse to even talk about that side of it.  Why is that?
Click to expand...


And you keep ignoring that this doesn't affect the violent criminals or the drug dealers?  Why is that?

And I agreed with you that we need to punish people who hire illegal aliens, you stupid cvnt.  Try to follow a discussion


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
Click to expand...


You were a Republican because you're a socialist who wanted to help poor people and you left the Republican party because they wouldn't vote?

WTF?  

You need to call time out, get your shit together, and try again


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Yes comrade, it's the corporations and the rich, the bourgeois is oppressing the proletariat.
> 
> Actually, you study in school, you can go to college.  Period.  And you clean yourself up, work at your job, you will keep getting better paying jobs.  You save, you live below your means.  You won't be poor.
> 
> Explain in your Marxist mind how that isn't true



Just simply not true, no matter how many knute rockne speeches you give.  It is not about having a marixt mind, it is about having a mind that actually works and one that understands the statistics of the matter, so that leaves you out of luck once again. 

The chances of moving out of the class you are born into are terrible in this country, the 2nd worst in the industrialized world.


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Trumps not capitalistic enough for you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, he's not.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism and Trump is not for free trade.
> 
> "Fair" trade is a euphemism for government controlled trade.  That and that Trump has been a pig to women is why I voted for Gary Johnson
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I disagree with you libertarians.  You think there should be no referee in the game of business but that's ridiculous.
> 
> Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class
Click to expand...


Swish. 

Totally wrong.  We think specifically there should be a referee.  We're not anarchists.

What we oppose is government being a kindergarten teacher


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> And you keep ignoring that this doesn't affect the violent criminals or the drug dealers?  Why is that?



There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming. 





> And I agreed with you that we need to punish people who hire illegal aliens, you stupid cvnt.  Try to follow a discussion



Actually, no you never did, not even once.  But I am glad to hear you say it now, we are making progress.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All I can go by is what you post and you've have not talked about anything but the wall,the wall, the wall....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> how does the wall fix this problem?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Holy shit, that would get really expensive really quick.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit, the military members are alrday paid for, there is money being saved by not having them in other countries and guarding the border could be tied into their training.   Every pilot has to have a set number of NVG hours every month, the infantry practices patrolling, UAV guys could be used.
Click to expand...


OMG.  You seriously don't get why I said we need to fix the Visa overstay problem before we implement a guest worker program???

My God.  This is going to be hard.  Sit here.  Take my hand.  Now, dude, you're stupid.  You're seriously stupid.  You're completely and utterly stupid.  Someone had to tell you.

As for the rest of your crap.  I've clearly said that without the wall, nothing else will work.  I want to punish anyone who hires illegals.   I want the military to support the wall.  I want jail terms for illegal aliens, including Visa overstays.

Saying that none of the rest will work without the wall means I oppose everything is just you being an utter idiot.  See above for details on that.  Dude, you're stupid ...


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You didn’t vote? Then I’ve lost all respect for you loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
Click to expand...


I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> To buy a plane ticket they have to have a Visa.  Sure, some could get here that way, but nowhere near a million.  And seriously, border check points?  They don't check ID?  Of course they do.
> 
> We need to close off the Visa overstay, but obviously you have not proposed how anywhere near a million will get through the wall that way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The wall won't stop anyone. Especially since it won't be built.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's why leftists are laying yourself on the ground to stop it.
> 
> 
> You know that's the only way it won't be built, and you know it will work if it is.  It would be the end of the Democrat party as we know it.  Your entire farm system will be obliterated.
> 
> So once that happens, are you going to try to get the blue Americans you've been spitting on back?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No it isn't. It's the fact that it's stupid. It sends the wrong message and is a waste of money.
> 
> Ya dumb shit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotcha, because illegal aliens can walk through walls like they aren't there.  I think you're thinking of space aliens.  Like the ones that live in your brain.  Oh, and your sock drawer.
> 
> So you oppose fencing around nuclear power plants because they don't work too, right?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whoa! What an argument! You are so smart!
> 
> There won't be a wall. And whatever is built will be incomplete. There will be gaps.
> 
> Have you been paying attention to the omnibus bill? Your hero is going to sign a bill that doesn't give him funding for his wall. This time next week, I expect that you will forget this thread and give us more reasons why you feel it is imperative to support the moron.
> 
> You like him. Admit it. You like Trump.
Click to expand...


So you confuse yourself when you flip flop between arguing there won't be a wall and walls don't work?  Seriously?   Damn


----------



## toomuchtime_

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
> I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
> Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
> to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.
> 
> kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
> for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
> keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
> It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
> such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
> it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
> people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
> They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
> to pull that many people.
> 
> Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
> development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
> Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
> to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.
> 
> So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
> complexes, and cities can be built around that.
> 
> kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
> is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
> and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.
> 
> We need more than that.
> 
> If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
> then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.
> 
> What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
> with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working
> either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
> all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
> DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!
> 
> Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
> for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc
> organizing sustainable Development along the border:
> 
> www.paceuniversal.com
> Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
> women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking
> 
> UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
> UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
> what a concept
> 
> www.campusplan.org
> Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
> to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
> creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
> while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
> and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts
> 
> the expanded plan to restore the historic district
> of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
> through business management of property and programs was
> already posted www.freedmenstown.com
> 
> and replicating that plan along the border
> might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org
> 
> So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
> to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
> similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the
> same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.
> 
> kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
> better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
> ask for a conference between parties and how to use
> the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
> with parties and start working out common proposals.
> 
> Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
> each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
> DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
> ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm for military support of the wall, just not as a replacement for it.  The military trying to chase almost 3K illegal aliens around the desert as Gator proposes a night is insane.  And he wants that not because he believes it will work, but because he knows it won't.  The opposite of why he opposes the wall.
> 
> And Trump is already there advocating the wall.  Why would I go grass roots for something that is already in the White House?  That's why after not voting for Trump I'm advocating him and his ideas.
> 
> And contrary to the lies of the left, he isn't just proposing a wall, he's proposing electronic security, more border agents, a focus on Visa overstays.  We have to do all of those things to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Think About the Objections You Are Told to Recite*
> 
> For every border bandito we kill, thousands will be scared into vamoosing.  It is illogical to think of numbers on each side when the power of a lethal solution is magnified far beyond the individual incident.
Click to expand...

On the other hand, when confronted with tens of thousands of illegal immigrants from Africa via Sinai, Israel built exactly the kind of fence Trump is talking about and brought it in at about $2.9 million per mile.  The fence has reduced illegal immigration from Sinai by 99%.  This means the US could build the fence along the border with Mexico for under $6 billion and virtually end all illegal immigration from Mexico.  

GOP senator says Israel border fence cut illegal immigration


----------



## kaz

LoneLaugher said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is something wrong with them, yes.  There is no reason to be poor in this country.  It's within the power of every American who does not have mental issues to not be poor.
> 
> And the majority of those people are white, grand wizard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So now you think I hate white people?  What a stupid douche
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I said no such thing. But, now that you mention it, I think you hate liberal white people. And poor white people. But, you prefer them to brown liberal people and brown poor people. That's not hard to see.
Click to expand...


Yes, you said i hate white people.  You said it was racist to criticize the poor.  The majority of the poor in this country are white.  Do you even read your own crap?


----------



## BrokeLoser

kaz said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously?  How many nights will cover the military chasing a thousand people a night across the desert cover?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep repeating the lie of a thousand people a night across the desert cover.  If you take away their reason for coming, the only ones crossing will be the ones here to do harm, and there are not thousand of those a night.
> 
> Let me ask you this, do you see illegal immigration as a threat to our nation?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do the math...he’s not far off with his figure of speech that you’ve taken literally...Bear in mind the numbers are way down.
> 
> “Border Patrol agents nabbed 16,089 illegal immigrants trying to sneak in, while Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officers identified another 5,570 illegal immigrants who showed up without authorization at the ports of entry.
> The combined 21,659 illegal immigrants are still the lowest numbers for June in years, but the spike is worrisome because illegal immigration generally begins to slow in the summer months. Indeed, the last four years saw an average drop of 10 percent in Border Patrol apprehensions in June — but this year saw an 11 percent rise.“
> Illegal immigration spikes along U.S.-Mexico border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Border crossings down is a recent, short term phenomena which even if it lasted through Trump would end when he leaves.  Which is what Gator and the leftists are counting on, that we don't solve the problem.
> 
> Also, it's the ones who aren't bad that aren't coming.  Trump isn't scaring murderers, rapists, drug dealers, gun dealers or any other criminals.
> 
> But 1,000,000 / 365 = 2,740.
> 
> Even if you reduce that by 2/3, it's over 900 people a night average
Click to expand...


Agreed...you’re 100% correct.
Keep in mind, with the amount of thirdworld filth here these days there’s a damn good chance that most of the Lefties here are either illegal, barely legal or have very strong ties to the thirdworld filth. 
Their point of view on the matter stems from a personal connection...There’s really no other way to explain their lack of logic, respect for our founders, the constitution and REAL Americans.


----------



## kaz

Pogo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground. With electric monitoring and surveillance and thousands of more border control agents.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> So Pogo: You fill in the blank.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Okay.
> 
> _A million Mexicans_..... walk up to a bar. A long horizontal bar of reinforced concrete and dug into the ground.
> 
> Before they order a _cerveza_, they stop to gape in wonder at how such a structure could be dug into the Rio Grande River.
> 
> The next thing they do is look among themselves and say (in Spanish) "what the fuck are we doing here? Even the United States knows that most illegal immigrants go in via legitimate everyday means and then overstay their visas!"
> 
> Then they give the finger to the cartoonist that drew them there and return home, content in the knowledge that their foray to the border never did exist except in the comic book fantasies of message board Rumpbots who line up to buy any mindless snake oil the Orange Oaf sells them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's particularly funny about you leftists is you think the electronic monitoring and surveillance and more border agents will work without the wall, but it won't work with it!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sure who "you leftists" are but I (which is singular) have never posted anything about "electronic monitoring and surveillance" with or without "more border agents" so once again, posting apparently to the comic book.
> 
> Of which here comes an example right now.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> hat I think building a wall and defending it is more efficient than the military chasing thousands of people across the desert every night
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "thousands of people every night" huh.
> But I repeat myself about Gullibles' Travels....
Click to expand...


I don't know hillbilly math and leftist math is just math where your calculations are self serving.  So here's the regular kind of math.

1 million illegal aliens come across our southern border a year.

1 million / 365 = 2,740

That means the military would be chasing literally thousands of people around the desert a night.

BTW, I don't know how it works for drunken leftist hillbillies, but in the normal world there are 365 days in a year if you're wondering where that came from


----------



## Mr Natural

You kick out all the illegals, and who's gonna mow my lawn?

American kids?

Fat chance!


----------



## kaz

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
Click to expand...


I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border


----------



## kaz

Pogo said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Zackly, which is how most of it happens.  But cracking down on visa overstays doesn't sell nearly as well as an image of a thousands-of-miles-long "wall" that "Mexico will pay for".
> 
> Easy to imagine and sell to the intellectually mouth-agape ---- not so easy to make a reality.
Click to expand...


Visa overstays need to start doing jail time


----------



## kaz

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
> I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
> Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
> to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.
> 
> kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
> for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
> keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
> It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
> such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
> it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
> people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
> They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
> to pull that many people.
> 
> Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
> development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
> Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
> to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.
> 
> So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
> complexes, and cities can be built around that.
> 
> kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
> is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
> and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.
> 
> We need more than that.
> 
> If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
> then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.
> 
> What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
> with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working
> either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
> all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
> DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!
> 
> Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
> for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc
> organizing sustainable Development along the border:
> 
> www.paceuniversal.com
> Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
> women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking
> 
> UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
> UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
> what a concept
> 
> www.campusplan.org
> Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
> to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
> creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
> while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
> and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts
> 
> the expanded plan to restore the historic district
> of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
> through business management of property and programs was
> already posted www.freedmenstown.com
> 
> and replicating that plan along the border
> might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org
> 
> So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
> to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
> similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the
> same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.
> 
> kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
> better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
> ask for a conference between parties and how to use
> the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
> with parties and start working out common proposals.
> 
> Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
> each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
> DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
> ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm for military support of the wall, just not as a replacement for it.  The military trying to chase almost 3K illegal aliens around the desert as Gator proposes a night is insane.  And he wants that not because he believes it will work, but because he knows it won't.  The opposite of why he opposes the wall.
> 
> And Trump is already there advocating the wall.  Why would I go grass roots for something that is already in the White House?  That's why after not voting for Trump I'm advocating him and his ideas.
> 
> And contrary to the lies of the left, he isn't just proposing a wall, he's proposing electronic security, more border agents, a focus on Visa overstays.  We have to do all of those things to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Think About the Objections You Are Told to Recite*
> 
> For every border bandito we kill, thousands will be scared into vamoosing.  It is illogical to think of numbers on each side when the power of a lethal solution is magnified far beyond the individual incident.
Click to expand...


I don't know what that means


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes comrade, it's the corporations and the rich, the bourgeois is oppressing the proletariat.
> 
> Actually, you study in school, you can go to college.  Period.  And you clean yourself up, work at your job, you will keep getting better paying jobs.  You save, you live below your means.  You won't be poor.
> 
> Explain in your Marxist mind how that isn't true
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just simply not true, no matter how many knute rockne speeches you give.  It is not about having a marixt mind, it is about having a mind that actually works and one that understands the statistics of the matter, so that leaves you out of luck once again.
> 
> The chances of moving out of the class you are born into are terrible in this country, the 2nd worst in the industrialized world.
Click to expand...


Democrats are out there every day repeating your lie to the poor in this country that they are victims, it's no wonder they don't try.

Also, no one else is importing millions of poor people to take their jobs as you're fighting to continue to do.

That doesn't contradict that if you clean yourself up and work hard, you will get ahead.  It's just your Marxist ideology that disagrees with that


----------



## edward37

kaz said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted for Gary Johnson, liar.  I never said I didn't vote.
> 
> And you are why I make people identify themselves.  You're a leftist socialist and you claim to have voted for Trump.  What a load
> 
> 
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
Click to expand...

kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year


----------



## BrokeLoser

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you keep ignoring that this doesn't affect the violent criminals or the drug dealers?  Why is that?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I agreed with you that we need to punish people who hire illegal aliens, you stupid cvnt.  Try to follow a discussion
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, no you never did, not even once.  But I am glad to hear you say it now, we are making progress.
Click to expand...


“*There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.”*

The ole...“they’re just coming here for a better life” bunch of bleeding heart nobility bullshit....haha
Every single one coming across is a liability to REAL Americans in one way or another...period. They come for a better life at the expense of REAL Americans compromising their own quality of life...they come for a free ride for their anchor babies / money trees.
Stop selling yourself on bullshit...start looking out for your fellow countrymen.


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you keep ignoring that this doesn't affect the violent criminals or the drug dealers?  Why is that?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I agreed with you that we need to punish people who hire illegal aliens, you stupid cvnt.  Try to follow a discussion
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, no you never did, not even once.  But I am glad to hear you say it now, we are making progress.
Click to expand...


I did not say there are "thousands of violent criminals" and "drug dealers" coming "every day."

Now you're just swilling Democrat kool-aid.

But there are a lot of them.  23% of federal inmates are illegal aliens according to the department of homeland security.

And our country is awash with drugs, ostrich


----------



## BrokeLoser

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
Click to expand...


Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!


----------



## Vandalshandle

kaz said:


> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> For some reason, Trumpettes seem to think that Mexicans don't know how to operate shovels and ladders. Not that they have to, since half of all illegal aliens simply overstayed their visas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Somehow leftists don't understand that shovels and ladders aren't a realistic way for the million Mexicans who come here a year to get here.  Your standard is if one illegal gets through the whole thing is a failure.
> 
> You also don't understand that it's even harder to carry kilos of drugs, illegal weapons, etc. when you're crawling through a tunnel or climbing over a 30 foot wall designed to make that difficult.
> 
> Your most inane argument is that more electric monitoring and surveillance and more border patrols will work if we don't build a wall and won't work if we do.
> 
> Another failure who was educated (sic) in a government school
Click to expand...


For your viewing pleasure:

tunnel in nogales - Yahoo Image Search Results


----------



## BrokeLoser

Vandalshandle said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> For some reason, Trumpettes seem to think that Mexicans don't know how to operate shovels and ladders. Not that they have to, since half of all illegal aliens simply overstayed their visas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Somehow leftists don't understand that shovels and ladders aren't a realistic way for the million Mexicans who come here a year to get here.  Your standard is if one illegal gets through the whole thing is a failure.
> 
> You also don't understand that it's even harder to carry kilos of drugs, illegal weapons, etc. when you're crawling through a tunnel or climbing over a 30 foot wall designed to make that difficult.
> 
> Your most inane argument is that more electric monitoring and surveillance and more border patrols will work if we don't build a wall and won't work if we do.
> 
> Another failure who was educated (sic) in a government school
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For your viewing pleasure:
> 
> tunnel in nogales - Yahoo Image Search Results
Click to expand...


Weird what those thirdworld human cockroaches will do..huh?
Dig tunnels to rob American taxpayers and distribute heroin, behead people with chainsaws, hang people from bridges...those filthy wetbacks are awesome fucking humans....let’s bring in another 20 million....whatta ya say LefTards?


----------



## edward37

BrokeLoser said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
Click to expand...

you'll have to get along with this

Day Change
-$74,409.09


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did I rig your results?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
Click to expand...


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you keep ignoring that this doesn't affect the violent criminals or the drug dealers?  Why is that?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I agreed with you that we need to punish people who hire illegal aliens, you stupid cvnt.  Try to follow a discussion
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, no you never did, not even once.  But I am glad to hear you say it now, we are making progress.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “*There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.”*
> 
> The ole...“they’re just coming here for a better life” bunch of bleeding heart nobility bullshit....haha
> Every single one coming across is a liability to REAL Americans in one way or another...period. They come for a better life at the expense of REAL Americans compromising their own quality of life...they come for a free ride for their anchor babies / money trees.
> Stop selling yourself on bullshit...start looking out for your fellow countrymen.
Click to expand...


It's what it's like debating gator.  I say there are violent criminals and drug dealers coming here and I also say almost 3K people come the border across a day, and gator actually hears there are almost 3K violent criminals and drug dealers coming here a day.  You can debate him for hours and he hears everything that twisted way


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, but you're obviously dishonest as you do nothing but argue for Democrats and Democrat policies all day long
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
Click to expand...


I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> We are on track to add 2.6 trillion dollars to the national debt this year. How did voting for Trump help with that out of control spending?


We will not get out of this debt. mess Obama put us in by sitting on our asses and calling it a new normal...we will have to invest to increase capitol to the national treasury...if you knew anything about business you would already know that...The wall will save our nation millions once it's in place...it will pay for it's self...


----------



## Decus

*Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:

_“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,” 

 “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,” 

“*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.

 “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
_
Go figure.
_
._


----------



## BrokeLoser

kaz said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you keep ignoring that this doesn't affect the violent criminals or the drug dealers?  Why is that?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I agreed with you that we need to punish people who hire illegal aliens, you stupid cvnt.  Try to follow a discussion
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, no you never did, not even once.  But I am glad to hear you say it now, we are making progress.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> “*There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day.  Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.”*
> 
> The ole...“they’re just coming here for a better life” bunch of bleeding heart nobility bullshit....haha
> Every single one coming across is a liability to REAL Americans in one way or another...period. They come for a better life at the expense of REAL Americans compromising their own quality of life...they come for a free ride for their anchor babies / money trees.
> Stop selling yourself on bullshit...start looking out for your fellow countrymen.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's what it's like debating gator.  I say there are violent criminals and drug dealers coming here and I also say almost 3K people come the border across a day, and gator actually hears there are almost 3K violent criminals and drug dealers coming here a day.  You can debate him for hours and he hears everything that twisted way
Click to expand...


Oh believe me...I read his posts, he’s as twisted and confused as it gets.
He’s a self proclaimed Libertarian yet everything he says and position he takes couldn’t be more Alt-Left. He likes playing make-believe.
It’s tough to reason with the unreasonable.


----------



## edward37

kaz said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night
Click to expand...

good for you kaz   lol I do have MSFT  and AAPL  and FB  + about 11 others


----------



## kaz

Vandalshandle said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> For some reason, Trumpettes seem to think that Mexicans don't know how to operate shovels and ladders. Not that they have to, since half of all illegal aliens simply overstayed their visas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Somehow leftists don't understand that shovels and ladders aren't a realistic way for the million Mexicans who come here a year to get here.  Your standard is if one illegal gets through the whole thing is a failure.
> 
> You also don't understand that it's even harder to carry kilos of drugs, illegal weapons, etc. when you're crawling through a tunnel or climbing over a 30 foot wall designed to make that difficult.
> 
> Your most inane argument is that more electric monitoring and surveillance and more border patrols will work if we don't build a wall and won't work if we do.
> 
> Another failure who was educated (sic) in a government school
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For your viewing pleasure:
> 
> tunnel in nogales - Yahoo Image Search Results
Click to expand...


Yes, which is why we need a better wall and we also need border security and electronic surveillance.  But today most of the people don't go through the tunnel, they walk across  the border.

And as I said before, it's a lot harder to carry kilos of drugs and weapons that way.  Our choices are not that the wall stops everyone or no one.  It just isn't


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
Click to expand...


I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.

I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story


----------



## BrokeLoser

kaz said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
Click to expand...


Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> good for you kaz   lol I do have MSFT  and AAPL  and FB  + about 11 others
Click to expand...


I don't mean Microsoft stock.  I mean the company.  The problem is that it would be too small a percent of my portfolio to deal with


----------



## edward37

kaz said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.
> 
> I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story
Click to expand...

that's what I lost today  ,,and I'm going out for dinner soon


----------



## BrokeLoser

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> good for you kaz   lol I do have MSFT  and AAPL  and FB  + about 11 others
Click to expand...


Oh look...he’s telling the truth...he knows ticker / stock symbols. I totally believe him now.


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
Click to expand...


Bud!  This is Larry Ellison.  We have to have lunch tomorrow!


----------



## edward37

BrokeLoser said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
Click to expand...

hey jeff ,,can you lend me a billion?


----------



## LoneLaugher

kaz said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup.  Anyone who studies in school can go to college.  Anyone who cleans themselves up and works hard at work can keep getting better jobs.  Being poor in this country is a choice that you make through poor decisions to keep yourself poor
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are wrong. I'm gonna go with intentionally wrong cuz it's the only way you can justify your utter disdain for entire groups of people. It is even worse than being wrong due to being a moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So now you think I hate white people?  What a stupid douche
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I said no such thing. But, now that you mention it, I think you hate liberal white people. And poor white people. But, you prefer them to brown liberal people and brown poor people. That's not hard to see.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, you said i hate white people.  You said it was racist to criticize the poor.  The majority of the poor in this country are white.  Do you even read your own crap?
Click to expand...


You have confused me with someone else again. Are you elderly?


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.
> 
> I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that's what I lost today  ,,and I'm going out for dinner soon
Click to expand...


You said that was a lot of money to make a year


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> hey jeff ,,can you lend me a billion?
Click to expand...


I don't deal in petty cash


----------



## BrokeLoser

kaz said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bud!  This is Larry Ellison.  We have to have lunch tomorrow!
Click to expand...


Great idea....I know an amazing place in Paris...we can take my Airbus 380


----------



## BluesLegend

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.
> 
> I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that's what I lost today  ,,and I'm going out for dinner soon
Click to expand...


Don't you get free meals at the KFC?


----------



## Decus

Decus said:


> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._



Here is the man who argued against illegal immigration:


----------



## edward37

kaz said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.
> 
> I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that's what I lost today  ,,and I'm going out for dinner soon
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You said that was a lot of money to make a year
Click to expand...

What I said was I could make or lose more in a day than MOST repubs make in a year  That was just todays results   NBD but I've made and lost well into  triple figures in a day   Don't really expect you to believe me


----------



## edward37

BluesLegend said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.
> 
> I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that's what I lost today  ,,and I'm going out for dinner soon
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't you get free meals at the KFC?
Click to expand...

chicken breasts   are on the house


----------



## BrokeLoser

Decus said:


> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._



Circa 2006, King Hussein?


----------



## BrokeLoser

Decus said:


> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the man who argued against illegal immigration:
Click to expand...


What do you know....the same filthy fuck grew the illegal alien population by 2.5 million during his eight year reign of terror.


----------



## Decus

BrokeLoser said:


> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the man who argued against illegal immigration:
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know....the same filthy fuck grew the illegal alien population by 2.5 million during his eight year reign of terror.
Click to expand...


Sad but true. 

.


----------



## edward37

BrokeLoser said:


> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Circa 2006, King Hussein?
Click to expand...

GOD bless him


----------



## BrokeLoser

edward37 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Circa 2006, King Hussein?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> GOD bless him
Click to expand...


The truth comes out...you’re black and poverty stricken?


----------



## edward37

BrokeLoser said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Circa 2006, King Hussein?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> GOD bless him
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The truth comes out...you’re black and poverty stricken?
Click to expand...

lol lol  you guys tear me up    Dems are not allowed to be well off   and god forbid ,,black?


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> OMG.  You seriously don't get why I said we need to fix the Visa overstay problem before we implement a guest worker program???
> 
> My God.  This is going to be hard.  Sit here.  Take my hand.  Now, dude, you're stupid.  You're seriously stupid.  You're completely and utterly stupid.  Someone had to tell you.
> 
> As for the rest of your crap.  I've clearly said that without the wall, nothing else will work.  I want to punish anyone who hires illegals.   I want the military to support the wall.  I want jail terms for illegal aliens, including Visa overstays.
> 
> Saying that none of the rest will work without the wall means I oppose everything is just you being an utter idiot.  See above for details on that.  Dude, you're stupid ...





Damn dude...that was an epic rant!  well fucking done!    You might want to take short time out and have a beer or 6!  

Holy fuck you take this place too serious!  This place is entertainment, it is a time sink to fill in a minute or two while a program runs.

Nobody gives a fuck what you or I think about them, the sooner you learn that the better for your poor little heart.

But I do appreciate the rant, the made me laugh out loud.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> We are on track to add 2.6 trillion dollars to the national debt this year. How did voting for Trump help with that out of control spending?
> 
> 
> 
> We will not get out of this debt. mess Obama put us in by sitting on our asses and calling it a new normal...we will have to invest to increase capitol to the national treasury...if you knew anything about business you would already know that...The wall will save our nation millions once it's in place...it will pay for it's self...
Click to expand...


So, you do not give a shit about Trump adding 2.6 trillion dollars this year.    Thanks for clearing that up.  You only care about debt when there is a Dem in the White House. Well, I am not surprised, but it is good to hear it from the horse's mouth.


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> So, you do not give a shit about Trump adding 2.6 trillion dollars this year.


2.6 trillion added to 20 trillion? No I don't...first of all it won't be 2.6 and you know it but even if it is like I said we will need to invest in our country and our infrastructure...Obama promised it but never did it...
So why now? why do you cry about debt now? because we have a republican president? you are a hypocritical jackass...


----------



## BrokeLoser

edward37 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Circa 2006, King Hussein?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> GOD bless him
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The truth comes out...you’re black and poverty stricken?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> lol lol  you guys tear me up    Dems are not allowed to be well off   and god forbid ,,black?
Click to expand...


Come on man....just calling it like I see it. Nobody legitimate supports that filthy Kenyan with the oversized ears and unAmerican name....you must have got a free phone and a free ride on the backs of REAL Americans.


----------



## edward37

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, you do not give a shit about Trump adding 2.6 trillion dollars this year.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.6 trillion added to 20 trillion? No I don't...first of all it won't be 2.6 and you know it but even if it is like I said we will need to invest in our country and our infrastructure...Obama promised it but never did it...
> So why now? why do you cry about debt now? because we have a republican president? you are a hypocritical jackass...
Click to expand...

RAM  what happened??
*Whatever happened to the party of fiscal responsibility?*


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Decus said:


> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the man who argued against illegal immigration:
Click to expand...


Wow, that is so........DACA!


----------



## edward37

BrokeLoser said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Circa 2006, King Hussein?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> GOD bless him
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The truth comes out...you’re black and poverty stricken?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> lol lol  you guys tear me up    Dems are not allowed to be well off   and god forbid ,,black?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Come on man....just calling it like I see it. Nobody legitimate supports that filthy Kenyan with the oversized ears and unAmerican name....you must have got a free phone and a free ride on the backs of REAL Americans.
Click to expand...

All you fiscal responsible Americans   the family value bull shitters All those Real Americans???


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> 2.6 trillion added to 20 trillion? No I don't...first of all it won't be 2.6 and you know it



no, I don't know it.  That is the pace we are on and I do not see anything changing that in the near future. 



> but even if it is like I said we will need to invest in our country and our infrastructure...Obama promised it but never did it...



And Trump has not done it either, yet 79 days into the year our deficit is already 558 billion dollars.  What do we have to show for those 558 billion dollars that have been added to the debt in the last 79 days?    

What infrastructure spending have we had to account for the 558 billion dollars added to the debt in the last 79 days?




> So why now? why do you cry about debt now? because we have a republican president? you are a hypocritical jackass...



I have been crying about the debt since Reagan was in office, unlike you I am not a partisan sheep.


----------



## Golfing Gator

edward37 said:


> Rambunctious said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, you do not give a shit about Trump adding 2.6 trillion dollars this year.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.6 trillion added to 20 trillion? No I don't...first of all it won't be 2.6 and you know it but even if it is like I said we will need to invest in our country and our infrastructure...Obama promised it but never did it...
> So why now? why do you cry about debt now? because we have a republican president? you are a hypocritical jackass...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> RAM  what happened??
> *Whatever happened to the party of fiscal responsibility?*
Click to expand...


That is a joke.  The last fiscally conservative president we have had was a guy named Calvin.


----------



## Rambunctious

edward37 said:


> RAM what happened??
> *Whatever happened to the party of fiscal responsibility?*


Our nation needs rebuilding...if it costs us a couple more trillion so be it...Obama fucked up...took the money and did nothing positive with it...


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> I have been crying about the debt since Reagan was in office, unlike you I am not a partisan sheep


BULLSHIT!!!!!


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> no, I don't know it. That is the pace we are on and I do not see anything changing that in the near future.


2.6 added to 20 trillion is nothing...it's unfortunately necessary...thanks to the last president...


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have been crying about the debt since Reagan was in office, unlike you I am not a partisan sheep
> 
> 
> 
> BULLSHIT!!!!!
Click to expand...


Nope, it is true.  I know that for someone like you who is so devoted to a political party it is hard to grasp, but some of us hate the Dems as much as the Repubs and hate the Repubs as much as the Dems.


----------



## edward37

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have been crying about the debt since Reagan was in office, unlike you I am not a partisan sheep
> 
> 
> 
> BULLSHIT!!!!!
Click to expand...

lol lol ram you calling bullshit is like trump saying he's going to show his tax returns


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> no, I don't know it. That is the pace we are on and I do not see anything changing that in the near future.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.6 added to 20 trillion is nothing...it's unfortunately necessary...thanks to the last president...
Click to expand...


You are fucked up and you are the reason our country is fucked.  Holy shit, you spend 8 years whining like a 12 year old girl about the debt and when Trump will add a trillion more in a single year than Obama ever did it no longer matters. 

On behalf of my kids and grandchildren I say "Fuck you very much".  They are the ones that will be paying for your greed.


----------



## edward37

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> no, I don't know it. That is the pace we are on and I do not see anything changing that in the near future.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.6 added to 20 trillion is nothing...it's unfortunately necessary...thanks to the last president...
Click to expand...

but the 10 or so trillion of obamas  wasn't necessary   because of gwb?    you mean you're a 1 way jones type of guy?


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

edward37 said:


> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year



Not  surprising.   Seems that  most on the left here are  either wealthy,  have their  own  business,  work from  home, or  comfortably early retired from well paying career.  Me?  I'm the only truck driver here.


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> Nope, it is true. I know that for someone like you who is so devoted to a political party it is hard to grasp, but some of us hate the Dems as much as the Repubs and hate the Repubs as much as the Dems


You're a liar..you didn't raise a fuss or say anything about Obama doubling the debt. ....Obama added 10 trillion!!!!!.... more than any other administration ever has and you say nothing but you are sure quick to point to Trump's 2.6 please...


----------



## edward37

Ray From Cleveland said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not  surprising.   Seems that  most on the left here are  either wealthy,  have their  own  business,  work from  home, or  comfortably early retired from well paying career.  Me?  I'm the only truck driver here.
Click to expand...

good luck to you


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> no, I don't know it. That is the pace we are on and I do not see anything changing that in the near future.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.6 added to 20 trillion is nothing...it's unfortunately necessary...thanks to the last president...
Click to expand...


Obama added 9 trillion in 8 years and that is bad in your book, but adding almost 30% that much in one year is good in your book.

Fuck I hate partisans.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Mr Clean said:


> You kick out all the illegals, and who's gonna mow my lawn?
> 
> American kids?
> 
> Fat chance!



We don't have many illegals up north, and all our lawns are cut just fine.


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> You are fucked up and you are the reason our country is fucked. Holy shit, you spend 8 years whining like a 12 year old girl about the debt and when Trump will add a trillion more in a single year than Obama ever did it no longer matters.
> 
> On behalf of my kids and grandchildren I say "Fuck you very much". They are the ones that will be paying for your greed.


Wrong buttkiss...you are whats wrong with America...the duped snowflakes that sat quiet while Obama bankrupted us and now you start whining over 2.6 trillion? fuck off hypocrite...take your hate Trump crap someplace else...it ain't gonna work...


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nope, it is true. I know that for someone like you who is so devoted to a political party it is hard to grasp, but some of us hate the Dems as much as the Repubs and hate the Repubs as much as the Dems
> 
> 
> 
> You're a liar..you didn't raise a fuss or say anything about Obama doubling the debt. ....Obama added 10 trillion!!!!!.... more than any other administration ever has and you say nothing but you are sure quick to point to Trump's 2.6 please...
Click to expand...


2.6 in one year!  not 2.6 for his whole term, 2.6 for one single year.  At that pace he will pass what Obama added in less than 4 years.  

and you are good with that.  What the fuck is wrong with you


----------



## Rambunctious

edward37 said:


> but the 10 or so trillion of obamas wasn't necessary because of gwb? you mean you're a 1 way jones type of guy?


Please explain....idiot...I know you can't...


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> 2.6 in one year! not 2.6 for his whole term, 2.6 for one single year. At that pace he will pass what Obama added in less than 4 years.
> 
> and you are good with that. What the fuck is wrong with you


When you begin to bash Obama for what he did to our debt then maybe you will get my attention until then you are just a one sided hack...


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> What the fuck is wrong with you


You democrats and progressives blew it...you allowed Clinton and Obama to get away with murder and now you can't get anything to stick to Trump...why on earth are you surprised? what is ok for one is ok for all...


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day. Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.



ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming. 

If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.

They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything. 

In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything. 

For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.  

We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?   

They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country. 

Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 2.6 in one year! not 2.6 for his whole term, 2.6 for one single year. At that pace he will pass what Obama added in less than 4 years.
> 
> and you are good with that. What the fuck is wrong with you
> 
> 
> 
> When you begin to bash Obama for what he did to our debt then maybe you will get my attention until then you are just a one sided hack...
Click to expand...


Obama is gone, move on!  

I bashed Obama for 8 years, now he is gone and no amount of you talking about him will bring him back.

Let’s deal with the here and now for once.

All you partisans are the same...for 8 years the Dems could not stop talking about Bush II and now you Repubs will never stop talking about Obama.




Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

This ‘wall’ idiocy is yet another pointless distraction preventing actual debate concerning immigration reform.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day. Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming.
> 
> If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.
> 
> They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything.
> 
> In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything.
> 
> For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.
> 
> We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?
> 
> They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country.
> 
> Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.
Click to expand...


I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries. 

Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians. 

I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.


----------



## Golfing Gator

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> This ‘wall’ idiocy is yet another pointless distraction preventing actual debate concerning immigration reform.



Post of the day.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day. Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming.
> 
> If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.
> 
> They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything.
> 
> In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything.
> 
> For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.
> 
> We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?
> 
> They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country.
> 
> Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries.
> 
> Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians.
> 
> I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.
Click to expand...


While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.   

The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.


----------



## BrokeLoser

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> This ‘wall’ idiocy is yet another pointless distraction preventing actual debate concerning immigration reform.



Huh...How do you figure?
There’s no need for reform...our founders made it simple, it’s time for politicians to do their fucking jobs...that’s all.
We don’t OWE Mexicans shit...your idea of “reform” is in making it even easier for wetbacks to fuck over REAL Americans...am I right?


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> Obama is gone, move on!


Trump won he is president get used to it...


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day. Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming.
> 
> If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.
> 
> They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything.
> 
> In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything.
> 
> For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.
> 
> We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?
> 
> They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country.
> 
> Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries.
> 
> Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians.
> 
> I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.
> 
> The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.
Click to expand...



This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not. 

I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.  

The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.


----------



## JoeB131

BluesLegend said:


> Thanks for agreeing with me, no issues with Canada no wall needed. Mexican filth pouring across our borders killing and raping our citizens, build a wall and shut them out.



I think we need to build walls around all the White trash trailer parks to keep you away from decent folks, but never mind.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Rambunctious said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> Obama is gone, move on!
> 
> 
> 
> Trump won he is president get used to it...
Click to expand...


I am used to it, but it seems you are not because every comment about Trump is met with "oh yeah, what about Obama".    

How about we just focus on Trump and the 2.6 trillion he is on track to add to our debt this year, can you do that?


----------



## Rambunctious

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> This ‘wall’ idiocy is yet another pointless distraction preventing actual debate concerning immigration reform.


If you worked in an industry where wages and positions were affected by illegal immigrants you would not take the situation so lightly...If you lived in a area of town greatly affected by crime with illegal aliens heavily involved you would feel differently...We have talked this situation to death...maybe if we just enforce the laws we have we wouldn't need a wall did you ever think of that? No it's time for bold action...we can't allow this to continue...if we bring back law and order to immigration it will benefit all involved....


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day. Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming.
> 
> If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.
> 
> They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything.
> 
> In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything.
> 
> For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.
> 
> We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?
> 
> They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country.
> 
> Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries.
> 
> Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians.
> 
> I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.
> 
> The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not.
> 
> I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.
> 
> The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.
Click to expand...


That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.

Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I spent that on breakfast.  I flew to New York and went to Tiffany's.
> 
> I am shocked that you think $74K a year is a lot.  Wow, that undercuts your whole story
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that's what I lost today  ,,and I'm going out for dinner soon
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You said that was a lot of money to make a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What I said was I could make or lose more in a day than MOST repubs make in a year  That was just todays results   NBD but I've made and lost well into  triple figures in a day   Don't really expect you to believe me
Click to expand...


I don't believe you or not believe you.  Frankly it's not that impressive and it's just douche to post that way on a message board.

Not only that, but you post like an angry 13 year old just ranting that Republicans are poopy pants and gay and meanie boys all day long.  You can't write a coherent argument to save your life


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OMG.  You seriously don't get why I said we need to fix the Visa overstay problem before we implement a guest worker program???
> 
> My God.  This is going to be hard.  Sit here.  Take my hand.  Now, dude, you're stupid.  You're seriously stupid.  You're completely and utterly stupid.  Someone had to tell you.
> 
> As for the rest of your crap.  I've clearly said that without the wall, nothing else will work.  I want to punish anyone who hires illegals.   I want the military to support the wall.  I want jail terms for illegal aliens, including Visa overstays.
> 
> Saying that none of the rest will work without the wall means I oppose everything is just you being an utter idiot.  See above for details on that.  Dude, you're stupid ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn dude...that was an epic rant!  well fucking done!    You might want to take short time out and have a beer or 6!
> 
> Holy fuck you take this place too serious!  This place is entertainment, it is a time sink to fill in a minute or two while a program runs.
> 
> Nobody gives a fuck what you or I think about them, the sooner you learn that the better for your poor little heart.
> 
> But I do appreciate the rant, the made me laugh out loud.
Click to expand...


Just got back from the beer store.  Bought a six pack of Raging Bitch.  Great Belgian IPA.

It's just classic that you have no idea why I said we need to fix the Visa overstay program before we start a guest worker VISA program.  You're just as stupid as the day is long.  It's unbelievable


----------



## Rambunctious

Golfing Gator said:


> I am used to it, but it seems you are not because every comment about Trump is met with "oh yeah, what about Obama".
> 
> How about we just focus on Trump and the 2.6 trillion he is on track to add to our debt this year, can you do that?


I voted for Trump...I've seen great improvement in our local economy and my business is soaring...huge difference from the Obama days of malaise...
I will vote for him again in 2020 and will defend him here and anywhere else I see him being unduly attacked by hypocrites with short memories...
He is making America better in spite of the constant daily attacks and accusations...just think what he could do with a little help and support from the media and the swamp...from the status quo everything is wonderful out of touch swamp...


----------



## Golfing Gator

kaz said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> OMG.  You seriously don't get why I said we need to fix the Visa overstay problem before we implement a guest worker program???
> 
> My God.  This is going to be hard.  Sit here.  Take my hand.  Now, dude, you're stupid.  You're seriously stupid.  You're completely and utterly stupid.  Someone had to tell you.
> 
> As for the rest of your crap.  I've clearly said that without the wall, nothing else will work.  I want to punish anyone who hires illegals.   I want the military to support the wall.  I want jail terms for illegal aliens, including Visa overstays.
> 
> Saying that none of the rest will work without the wall means I oppose everything is just you being an utter idiot.  See above for details on that.  Dude, you're stupid ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn dude...that was an epic rant!  well fucking done!    You might want to take short time out and have a beer or 6!
> 
> Holy fuck you take this place too serious!  This place is entertainment, it is a time sink to fill in a minute or two while a program runs.
> 
> Nobody gives a fuck what you or I think about them, the sooner you learn that the better for your poor little heart.
> 
> But I do appreciate the rant, the made me laugh out loud.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Just got back from the beer store.  Bought a six pack of Raging Bitch.  Great Belgian IPA.
Click to expand...


At least you have good taste in beer.  



Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are not thousands of violent criminals or the drug dealers coming across the border every day. Most coming across are just looking for a better life and since there is someone to pay them they keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming.
> 
> If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.
> 
> They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything.
> 
> In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything.
> 
> For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.
> 
> We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?
> 
> They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country.
> 
> Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries.
> 
> Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians.
> 
> I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.
> 
> The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not.
> 
> I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.
> 
> The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
Click to expand...


So, your plan to show that we need a 30 foot tall concrete wall is to show that a fence works just as well if not better?  

Logic is not your thing I see


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> ONE of the reasons  they keep   coming.
> 
> If they have their illegal kids  here, they get to go on  our social programs.
> 
> They go to our schools--some not even  knowing the language and they hold up American students. Nobody does  anything.
> 
> In liberal states, they even give illegals drivers licenses.  In populated areas, banks are allowed to give them loans for cars, houses or just about anything.
> 
> For  protection, they run to any one of our over 400 sanctuary cities in the country.   Whether they are criminals or  not, those cities do not participate with the federal government in  getting rid of them.  Now the Democrats are starting sanctuary states.
> 
> We  are now cowering to them by changing our country to a bilingual nation.  Why should they bother learning our language?
> 
> They are allowed to have peaceful protests against our government with nobody being hauled  off to jail and then out  of  the  country.
> 
> Every  deportation has to be   heard  in  court.   We can't just find them and throw them out of  the country.  Until their hearing (which many don't even attend) they are allowed to stay here which could be years.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries.
> 
> Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians.
> 
> I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.
> 
> The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not.
> 
> I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.
> 
> The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, your plan to show that we need a 30 foot tall concrete wall is to show that a fence works just as well if not better?
> 
> Logic is not your thing I see
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


No, just to  show that  a border  (anything)  will work.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I can say I do not disagree with anything here, we have a fucked up country in many ways.  People have been turning a blind eye to the problem for 4 decades or more because everyone wants their cheap lettuce and strawberries.
> 
> Never once has the country actually tried to crack down on those that do the hiring, because those that do the hiring own the politicians.
> 
> I do not agree with sanctuary cities and have no problem with Trump going after them, while I am  big states rights supporter, immigration and border control by its very nature has to a federal matter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.
> 
> The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not.
> 
> I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.
> 
> The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, your plan to show that we need a 30 foot tall concrete wall is to show that a fence works just as well if not better?
> 
> Logic is not your thing I see
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, just to  show that  a border  (anything)  will work.
Click to expand...


I am not against a border anything, just a 30 foot tall wall along our southern border 


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
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> 
> 
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> sealybobo said:
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> kaz said:
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> 
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> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Who called Trump's wall "asinine".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Trumps not capitalistic enough for you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, he's not.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism and Trump is not for free trade.
> 
> "Fair" trade is a euphemism for government controlled trade.  That and that Trump has been a pig to women is why I voted for Gary Johnson
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I disagree with you libertarians.  You think there should be no referee in the game of business but that's ridiculous.
> 
> Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Swish.
> 
> Totally wrong.  We think specifically there should be a referee.  We're not anarchists.
> 
> What we oppose is government being a kindergarten teacher
Click to expand...

You said you didn’t like fair trade because that’s a euphemism for government controlled.

You must not realize every country has their government control trade. Or you didn’t mean what you said


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> While I  believe the Republicans could try to do more,  look at how the left as been able to stop what they are trying to do with immigration now.  If it's not voting no on laws or  spending, it's having their  commie  judges put a stop to Trump  by usurping his authority.
> 
> The truth is the left is hell bent on keeping  things the  way they are or making them worse.  Very few on the left will disagree with that.   They have an open border  mentality and that's difficult to overcome in one year.  They don't want the wall because that's something they can't reverse when they get power again.  They are even willing to shut down the government over  it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not.
> 
> I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.
> 
> The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, your plan to show that we need a 30 foot tall concrete wall is to show that a fence works just as well if not better?
> 
> Logic is not your thing I see
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, just to  show that  a border  (anything)  will work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am not against a border anything, just a 30 foot tall wall along our southern border
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


If you're going  to do it, do it right I always say.  Like Hungary, use razor wire.   With our technology, make sure we have  video  monitoring with night vision,  sensors  deep within  the  ground to detect tunnel digging, and high tech motion sensors.


----------



## BluesLegend

JoeB131 said:


> BluesLegend said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for agreeing with me, no issues with Canada no wall needed. Mexican filth pouring across our borders killing and raping our citizens, build a wall and shut them out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think we need to build walls around all the White trash trailer parks to keep you away from decent folks, but never mind.
Click to expand...


That's because you are an irrational triggered libwit.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a left or a right thing, it has been going on for 40 plus years and nobody has truly tried to fix it, and they still are not.
> 
> I do not say this because I want open borders...but a wall is not the answer. The wall ignores the root of the problem, the wall is like putting a bandage on a cancerous lesion so that germs do not get into it.  Yeah, it might keep the germs out but it does not deal with the cancer.
> 
> The wall is a waste of money that will just continue to cost more as it ages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, your plan to show that we need a 30 foot tall concrete wall is to show that a fence works just as well if not better?
> 
> Logic is not your thing I see
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, just to  show that  a border  (anything)  will work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am not against a border anything, just a 30 foot tall wall along our southern border
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you're going  to do it, do it right I always say.  Like Hungary, use razor wire.   With our technology, make sure we have  video  monitoring with night vision,  sensors  deep within  the  ground to detect tunnel digging, and high tech motion sensors.
Click to expand...


What can I say, I guess I am truly the odd man out that actually gives a shit about the amount of debt we leave our children and grandchildren. 





Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is nothing  more than  leftist propaganda.  You  can have your opinion  and I can have  mine, but our  border forces seem to  agree with President Trump on the wall.  Saying a wall will do no good is like saying it's stupid for us to lock the doors  on our home  when we leave for work or play.  Locks, alarms and even dogs don't guarantee that our home won't get broken into, but it will sure make it much harder and less likely to happen.
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, your plan to show that we need a 30 foot tall concrete wall is to show that a fence works just as well if not better?
> 
> Logic is not your thing I see
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, just to  show that  a border  (anything)  will work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am not against a border anything, just a 30 foot tall wall along our southern border
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you're going  to do it, do it right I always say.  Like Hungary, use razor wire.   With our technology, make sure we have  video  monitoring with night vision,  sensors  deep within  the  ground to detect tunnel digging, and high tech motion sensors.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What can I say, I guess I am truly the odd man out that actually gives a shit about the amount of debt we leave our children and grandchildren.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


Trump  wants  about 30 billion for a wall.   That's about half of what we spent  on food stamps for last year alone.  

I went to a funeral for a friends son two months  ago.  He was a known user and died at the age of 53.  Tell her about our debt.  Or tell my cousin.  She lost her son three years ago at the age of  27  from an OD.


----------



## sealybobo

edward37 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
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> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> i have a thread titles I'm a Republican now.  Clearly I'm not a Republican now.  BUT, I make some good points why I have abandoned the Democratic party.  Why do I care about poor people when 80% of them don't even vote?  The 80% deserve to be poor and don't deserve any attention from any politicians.  THey need to understand if you don't vote you don't matter.
> 
> I'll be ok if Republicans get their way.  I'd prefer Democrats be in charge but if poor people like you want Republicans then I won't stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
Click to expand...

I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have. 

Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Trump  wants  about 30 billion for a wall.   That's about half of what we spent  on food stamps for last year alone.



Right now our country is 21 trillion dollars in debt and this year we are on pace to add another 2.5 trillion to that amount.   So, I think we need to spend our money wisely.  If a fence can do the job of a wall at half the cost, why build the wall?   Sooner or later we have to start to do something about it.




> I went to a funeral for a friends son two months  ago.  He was a known user and died at the age of 53.  Tell her about our debt.  Or tell my cousin.  She lost her son three years ago at the age of  27  from an OD.



There is no way to say this without sounding harsh, so I will just say it...nobody made those two young men take drugs, no illegal immigrant forced them to do it, they made a choice.  A wall will not stop that from happening.  Meth is made locally from cold medicine, no wall will stop that either.


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> So your standard is you only vote for people you agree with on every issue?  Wow, what a stupid standard.  Is that seriously your point?
> 
> 
> 
> Trumps not capitalistic enough for you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, he's not.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism and Trump is not for free trade.
> 
> "Fair" trade is a euphemism for government controlled trade.  That and that Trump has been a pig to women is why I voted for Gary Johnson
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I disagree with you libertarians.  You think there should be no referee in the game of business but that's ridiculous.
> 
> Democracy - Not "The Free Market" - Will Save America's Middle Class
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Swish.
> 
> Totally wrong.  We think specifically there should be a referee.  We're not anarchists.
> 
> What we oppose is government being a kindergarten teacher
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said you didn’t like fair trade because that’s a euphemism for government controlled.
> 
> You must not realize every country has their government control trade. Or you didn’t mean what you said
Click to expand...


How does your second paragraph contradict the first???


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
Click to expand...


Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
Click to expand...

I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Right now our country is 21 trillion dollars in debt and this year we are on pace to add another 2.5 trillion to that amount. So, I think we need to spend our money wisely. If a fence can do the job of a wall at half the cost, why build the wall? Sooner or later we have to start to do something about it.



I'll trust the engineers over you; no offense.  I'd hate  to spend the  money for a  fence  only to find out they figured  away around  it.  And did you ever go to the site Open Secrets and see what we are spending money on?  Are you worried about the money we spend for abortions?  Are you worried about the subsidizing of NPR and PBS which has been outdated for over 20 years?  

When you consider what we spend on illegals in this country, a wall would actually be an investment that pays for itself.  



Golfing Gator said:


> There is no way to say this without sounding harsh, so I will just say it...nobody made those two young men take drugs, no illegal immigrant forced them to do it, they made a choice. A wall will not stop that from happening. Meth is made locally from cold medicine, no wall will stop that either.



You are correct, but on the other hand, if it wasn't here  in the first place, maybe those people would still be here with us. 

With over 60,000 Americans a year now dying from drug use, not to mention the ten times more that were saved, I think it's high time (no pun intended) to  limit the drugs coming in.   If  we can't save the people who are hooked already, the least we can do is try to  stop more people from  getting hooked.  In order to do that, limit the supply as much as possible.  Given  that  most of our opioid products come across that border, it's the best thing we can do for drug prevention right  now.


----------



## BrokeLoser

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
Click to expand...


What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it
Click to expand...

That’s just it! The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours.

I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to

My brother is a vp of a Fortune 500. Me? I make less than $100k but not much less and I have no bills. Condo paid off, just bought a boat and bought a quad a couple years ago. Ok I do have a lease payment but that’s it other than insurance, heat, condo dues

I’m frugal. I can’t remember the last shirt I bought. My brother gives me the ones he’s sick of. 

How many Americans have as much as I do? Not many.

But again, if Paul Ryan wants to give seniors $7000 and tell us to go get private insurance on the free market, blue cross will take every dime from all of us. Especially if they allow insurance companies to do away with pre existing conditions which every old person has.

Republicans frighten me and should you too. You don’t make enough to be a republican


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
Click to expand...

They vote republican.


----------



## Thinker101

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
Click to expand...


Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
Click to expand...

And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s just it! The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours.
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to
> 
> My brother is a vp of a Fortune 500. Me? I make less than $100k but not much less and I have no bills. Condo paid off, just bought a boat and bought a quad a couple years ago. Ok I do have a lease payment but that’s it other than insurance, heat, condo dues
> 
> I’m frugal. I can’t remember the last shirt I bought. My brother gives me the ones he’s sick of.
> 
> How many Americans have as much as I do? Not many.
> 
> But again, if Paul Ryan wants to give seniors $7000 and tell us to go get private insurance on the free market, blue cross will take every dime from all of us. Especially if they allow insurance companies to do away with pre existing conditions which every old person has.
> 
> Republicans frighten me and should you too. You don’t make enough to be a republican
Click to expand...


The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours....yikes, you must have some sorry life.


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
Click to expand...


I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
Click to expand...

But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?


----------



## BrokeLoser

sealybobo said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever the over sights whatever their faults I'll be a dem till the end of time  I despise republicans ,their lies  their bullying ,their bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
Click to expand...




sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
Click to expand...


Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight. 
None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s just it! The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours.
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to
> 
> My brother is a vp of a Fortune 500. Me? I make less than $100k but not much less and I have no bills. Condo paid off, just bought a boat and bought a quad a couple years ago. Ok I do have a lease payment but that’s it other than insurance, heat, condo dues
> 
> I’m frugal. I can’t remember the last shirt I bought. My brother gives me the ones he’s sick of.
> 
> How many Americans have as much as I do? Not many.
> 
> But again, if Paul Ryan wants to give seniors $7000 and tell us to go get private insurance on the free market, blue cross will take every dime from all of us. Especially if they allow insurance companies to do away with pre existing conditions which every old person has.
> 
> Republicans frighten me and should you too. You don’t make enough to be a republican
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours....yikes, you must have some sorry life.
Click to expand...

Go to Switzerland you’ll never bend your rim on a pothole. And if you get hurt don’t worry, you’re covered


----------



## BrokeLoser

Thinker101 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
Click to expand...


Exactly.
“I deserve some of your shit because I breathe oxygen in America.”


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
Click to expand...

No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.

College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
Click to expand...


Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> Thinker101 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> kaz said:
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> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.
> “I deserve some of your shit because I breathe oxygen in America.”
Click to expand...

If you don’t get it you never will


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.
Click to expand...

You would have paid more dummy if school wasn’t subsidized.

How old are you? 

And your parents benefitted too. You cons believe you were born in the log cabin you built with your own two hands


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## BrokeLoser

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
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> edward37 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> edward37 said:
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> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
Click to expand...


Who said anything about removing social programs or changing rules?


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## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> kaz said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> 
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s just it! The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours.
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to
> 
> My brother is a vp of a Fortune 500. Me? I make less than $100k but not much less and I have no bills. Condo paid off, just bought a boat and bought a quad a couple years ago. Ok I do have a lease payment but that’s it other than insurance, heat, condo dues
> 
> I’m frugal. I can’t remember the last shirt I bought. My brother gives me the ones he’s sick of.
> 
> How many Americans have as much as I do? Not many.
> 
> But again, if Paul Ryan wants to give seniors $7000 and tell us to go get private insurance on the free market, blue cross will take every dime from all of us. Especially if they allow insurance companies to do away with pre existing conditions which every old person has.
> 
> Republicans frighten me and should you too. You don’t make enough to be a republican
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours....yikes, you must have some sorry life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Go to Switzerland you’ll never bend your rim on a pothole. And if you get hurt don’t worry, you’re covered
Click to expand...


Not sure what state you live in but here in California we've got plenty of potholes.  The city doesn't have money to repair the streets because all the money goes to the state.  We pretty much know what the state spends the money on....and it certainly ain't the roads.


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## skye

Build that wall...

Walls make  good neighbors

I've always believe in this and   today I do more than any other time!


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## BrokeLoser

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.
> “I deserve some of your shit because I breathe oxygen in America.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don’t get it you never will
Click to expand...


The candid nature of my comment hurts your feelings...you prefer to frame it in a different way....right?
Break it down for us. 
I said...”I deserve some of your shit because I breathe oxygen in America.”
What’s your spin on that?


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## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> 
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You would have paid more dummy if school wasn’t subsidized.
> 
> How old are you?
> 
> And your parents benefitted too. You cons believe you were born in the log cabin you built with your own two hands
Click to expand...


I come from a time and family that felt 10 cents a week allowance was plenty.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.
Click to expand...

You know what? I truly don’t care. I don’t have kids and I’ve already got a bachelors. So I have no selfish reason to argue with you. I just appreciate what help I got along the way. You clearly don’t realize all the government programs you took advantage of throughout your lives. You may even deny but we know too many lyin cons.

Anyways, my brother spends probably $40,000 a year on private school.  He just got a huge tax break. My family won’t suffer from your plans other than maybe you’ll cost me my Medicare and social security


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## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
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> Thinker101 said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You would have paid more dummy if school wasn’t subsidized.
> 
> How old are you?
> 
> And your parents benefitted too. You cons believe you were born in the log cabin you built with your own two hands
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I come from a time and family that felt 10 cents a week allowance was plenty.
Click to expand...

College was affordable because some rich guy was paying your share. Now you don’t want to pay it forward


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
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> 
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> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> 
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You know what? I truly don’t care. I don’t have kids and I’ve already got a bachelors. So I have no selfish reason to argue with you. I just appreciate what help I got along the way. You clearly don’t realize all the government programs you took advantage of throughout your lives. You may even deny but we know too many lyin cons.
> 
> Anyways, my brother spends probably $40,000 a year on private school.  He just got a huge tax break. My family won’t suffer from your plans other than maybe you’ll cost me my Medicare and social security
Click to expand...


Evidently you care enough to make assumptions.  I'm just telling you they're wrong.


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
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> Thinker101 said:
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> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.
> “I deserve some of your shit because I breathe oxygen in America.”
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don’t get it you never will
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The candid nature of my comment hurts your feelings...you prefer to frame it in a different way....right?
> Break it down for us.
> I said...”I deserve some of your shit because I breathe oxygen in America.”
> What’s your spin on that?
Click to expand...

You’re alright with me. If you keep winning elections I’ll survive. I’m no snowflake


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## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
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> sealybobo said:
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> Thinker101 said:
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> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't mind paying my fair share, but hell if I'm going to pay your share too.
> 
> 
> 
> But when you were going to school rich people were paying your share. Now you want to to get tax breaks that will cause college costs to go up. Now that you climbed the ladder you want to pull it up?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hate to disappoint but only people that paid my share were my parents and me, and we were far from rich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You would have paid more dummy if school wasn’t subsidized.
> 
> How old are you?
> 
> And your parents benefitted too. You cons believe you were born in the log cabin you built with your own two hands
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I come from a time and family that felt 10 cents a week allowance was plenty.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> College was affordable because some rich guy was paying your share. Now you don’t want to pay it forward
Click to expand...


WTF!? Is this a recording?


----------



## Unkotare

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
Click to expand...



Brainless liberals never tire of lying.


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
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> 
> kaz said:
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> edward37 said:
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> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
Click to expand...


Sealybo: Trump's a poopy pants and a meanie pie salamander salad colander and i hate him I hate him I hate him!!!!

You mentioned that.  At some point will you have some content?


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
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> sealybobo said:
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> edward37 said:
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who said anything about removing social programs or changing rules?
Click to expand...

What gets cut when you get a tax break? Usually a program that benefits the masses. People like you.

What year did you go to college? How much a year was it?


----------



## kaz

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
Click to expand...


Not being a Democrat


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sealybo: Trump's a poopy pants and a meanie pie salamander salad colander and i hate him I hate him I hate him!!!!
> 
> You mentioned that.  At some point will you have some content?
Click to expand...

Quiet the adults are talking.

Which are you btw?


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire



One million before you retire is "rich?"  OMG, that's just sad


----------



## sealybobo

Unkotare said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
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> 
> 
> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
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> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Brainless liberals never tire of lying.
Click to expand...

See you guys tomorrow. Have fun talking to unkotare. He’s a deep thinker


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
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> 
> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
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> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
Click to expand...


LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit


----------



## kaz

Thinker101 said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
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> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
Click to expand...


Bingo


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One million before you retire is "rich?"  OMG, that's just sad
Click to expand...

I didn’t say rich. Richer than what percent of Americans? 90%? Am I in the top 10%? Ok 20% I’ll take it.

And if I have $1 million and my bills are only $1000 a month, that’s rich


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And republicans distance anyone who makes less than them. Republicans lack empathy and want to change the rules so they don’t have to pay their fair share
Click to expand...


Republicans are meany pants banana eye of newt ice cream sandwiches and I hate them hate them hate them.

Oh, and you voted for Trump ...


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
Click to expand...

No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
Click to expand...


Republicans are orange peel loser curb blenders and I hate them, hate them, hate them.

Oh, and you voted for Trump ...


----------



## kaz

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s just it! The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours.
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to
> 
> My brother is a vp of a Fortune 500. Me? I make less than $100k but not much less and I have no bills. Condo paid off, just bought a boat and bought a quad a couple years ago. Ok I do have a lease payment but that’s it other than insurance, heat, condo dues
> 
> I’m frugal. I can’t remember the last shirt I bought. My brother gives me the ones he’s sick of.
> 
> How many Americans have as much as I do? Not many.
> 
> But again, if Paul Ryan wants to give seniors $7000 and tell us to go get private insurance on the free market, blue cross will take every dime from all of us. Especially if they allow insurance companies to do away with pre existing conditions which every old person has.
> 
> Republicans frighten me and should you too. You don’t make enough to be a republican
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours....yikes, you must have some sorry life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Go to Switzerland you’ll never bend your rim on a pothole. And if you get hurt don’t worry, you’re covered
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sure what state you live in but here in California we've got plenty of potholes.  The city doesn't have money to repair the streets because all the money goes to the state.  We pretty much know what the state spends the money on....and it certainly ain't the roads.
Click to expand...


You can't get pot holes, it's a blue state


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sealybo: Trump's a poopy pants and a meanie pie salamander salad colander and i hate him I hate him I hate him!!!!
> 
> You mentioned that.  At some point will you have some content?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quiet the adults are talking.
> 
> Which are you btw?
Click to expand...


You think you're an adult???  Wow, that's classic.

All you're posting is you hate Republicans, you hate them hate them hate them.  And you voted in the poll that you voted for Trump.

You're the lamest lying ass leftist ever, and you post like an angry 13 year old


----------



## Thinker101

kaz said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Further proof that your self identified persona as a Vanderbilt is a load of crap.  If you were funding government, you sure the hell would care at the crappy return you're getting from it
> 
> 
> 
> That’s just it! The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours.
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to
> 
> My brother is a vp of a Fortune 500. Me? I make less than $100k but not much less and I have no bills. Condo paid off, just bought a boat and bought a quad a couple years ago. Ok I do have a lease payment but that’s it other than insurance, heat, condo dues
> 
> I’m frugal. I can’t remember the last shirt I bought. My brother gives me the ones he’s sick of.
> 
> How many Americans have as much as I do? Not many.
> 
> But again, if Paul Ryan wants to give seniors $7000 and tell us to go get private insurance on the free market, blue cross will take every dime from all of us. Especially if they allow insurance companies to do away with pre existing conditions which every old person has.
> 
> Republicans frighten me and should you too. You don’t make enough to be a republican
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The rest of the world pays more taxes but their lives are so much better than ours....yikes, you must have some sorry life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Go to Switzerland you’ll never bend your rim on a pothole. And if you get hurt don’t worry, you’re covered
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sure what state you live in but here in California we've got plenty of potholes.  The city doesn't have money to repair the streets because all the money goes to the state.  We pretty much know what the state spends the money on....and it certainly ain't the roads.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You can't get pot holes, it's a blue state
Click to expand...


True, they're not pot holes anymore, more like moon craters.


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One million before you retire is "rich?"  OMG, that's just sad
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I didn’t say rich. Richer than what percent of Americans? 90%? Am I in the top 10%? Ok 20% I’ll take it.
> 
> And if I have $1 million and my bills are only $1000 a month, that’s rich
Click to expand...


Your bills are $1,000 a month?  What ghetto do you live in?


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
Click to expand...


Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bingo
Click to expand...

That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..

So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?

So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One million before you retire is "rich?"  OMG, that's just sad
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I didn’t say rich. Richer than what percent of Americans? 90%? Am I in the top 10%? Ok 20% I’ll take it.
> 
> And if I have $1 million and my bills are only $1000 a month, that’s rich
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your bills are $1,000 a month?  What ghetto do you live in?
Click to expand...

Condo dues $150
Heat, electric, cable, internet $300

I’m talking about when I retire but even now my bills aren’t $1000 a month.

F150 $350 mo

Am I missing anything?


----------



## sealybobo

Insurance $100 mo


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
Click to expand...

That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
Click to expand...


You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.


----------



## sealybobo

BrokeLoser said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I give you permission to be a Democrat.  The only way you're earning a living is to vote yourself one
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe him.  I mean I'm a billionaire.  I would have bought Microsoft but it wasn't expensive enough.  I also am a male model and date actresses and models.  I have a different one every night.  What about you BrokeLoser?  Aren't you a spy who flies into Russia and sabatoges their nuclear weapon systems?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
Click to expand...

A part of me agrees with a lot of what you guys say. Ultimately poor people shouldn’t have kids they can’t afford and I seriously want to reduce the population. It’s supply and demand really.

And I think the republican way will deter young women from having kids they can’t afford and won’t raise


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
Click to expand...

It is nice to have a rich brother. He bought 65 acres I bought the quad runner. He’s building a home on it so I bought the pontoon so now we have everything we want.

His wife has a home in Greece too so I get to go on cheap European vacations when I want


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It is nice to have a rich brother. He bought 65 acres I bought the quad runner. He’s building a home on it so I bought the pontoon so now we have everything we want.
> 
> His wife has a home in Greece too so I get to go on cheap European vacations when I want
Click to expand...


Yup, sounds like you aren't paying your fair share either.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

sealybobo said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> kaz I'll tell you the same thing I told old red the other day   I have made and lost more in a day than most of you lol patriots make in a year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha...actually since we’re all coming clean and being totally honest. I’m just gonna expose myself now...I’m really Jeff Bezos.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
Click to expand...


When was college ever funded by taxpayers?  

College is a business.   As with  any  other  business, their  prices are built on supply and demand.  The more supply than demand, the lower the cost. 

As years went  on, more  and more  high school  graduates started to attend college.  This is particularly true with females as they left the stay-at-home mom  gig. 

So now the  demand  is more than the  supply, and that dictates prices will increase.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
Click to expand...

You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner. 

But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate


----------



## sealybobo

Ray From Cleveland said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bullshit...post a bank statement or STFU!
> 
> 
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really do want to know what situation you guys are in. Am I dealing with a greedy rich dude or an ignorant poor racist Bible thumping gun toting man
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When was college ever funded by taxpayers?
> 
> College is a business.   As with  any  other  business, their  prices are built on supply and demand.  The more supply than demand, the lower the cost.
> 
> As years went  on, more  and more  high school  graduates started to attend college.  This is particularly true with females as they left the stay-at-home mom  gig.
> 
> So now the  demand  is more than the  supply, and that dictates prices will increase.
Click to expand...

I’m pretty sure state colleges used to be federally funded.

They aren’t for profit. That’s university of phoenix


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
Click to expand...


That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

sealybobo said:


> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire. I’m not rich but I’ll be able to retire, maybe even early. If healthcare isn’t too expensive. If republicans don’t do away with social security like I know you all want to



If we wanted to do that we had (have) plenty of opportunity to do it.  Bush presided with a Republican House and Senate; Trump the same.  Besides Bush's idea  to take a small  fraction of our SS  money to put into a  personal IRA, when did Republicans ever consider the idea of totally doing away with SS?


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

sealybobo said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> you'll have to get along with this
> 
> Day Change
> -$74,409.09
> 
> 
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When was college ever funded by taxpayers?
> 
> College is a business.   As with  any  other  business, their  prices are built on supply and demand.  The more supply than demand, the lower the cost.
> 
> As years went  on, more  and more  high school  graduates started to attend college.  This is particularly true with females as they left the stay-at-home mom  gig.
> 
> So now the  demand  is more than the  supply, and that dictates prices will increase.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I’m pretty sure state colleges used to be federally funded.
> 
> They aren’t for profit. That’s university of phoenix
Click to expand...


Okay, if they were federally funded, what years were  those and  when did this so-called funding stop?


----------



## danielpalos

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


there is no hurry and it isn't even important; ask the right wing.  they believe in lower taxes for business as usual not high taxes for high priority stuff.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> When was college ever funded by taxpayers?



Now.

20 years ago

50 years ago

100 years ago.

Every state college receives tax dollars to operate. And 74% of all college graduates are from public universities.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

“Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”

Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.

It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.

And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> “Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”
> 
> Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.
> 
> It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.
> 
> And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.



That is correct.  Trump  hates the idea  that over  60,000 Americans  (mostly young Americans) are dying from  overdoses of  opioid  products every year.  He also hates allowing new criminals  to enter our country.

What a Fn bigot that Trump is.  GO  LIBERALISM!!!!!!


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> “Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”
> 
> Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.
> 
> It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.
> 
> And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is correct.  Trump  hates the idea  that over  60,000 Americans  (mostly young Americans) are dying from  overdoses of  opioid  products every year.  He also hates allowing new criminals  to enter our country.
> 
> What a Fn bigot that Trump is.  GO  LIBERALISM!!!!!!
Click to expand...


Here is a napkin, you dribbled some kool aid down the front of your shirt


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> You hate the poor



You don't hate the poor, that's for sure.  You want as many poor from the world as you can get over here then you want to keep them poor like you want to keep Americans poor.

You love poor!  The more the better!  It's the Democrat voting machine


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I’ll tell you how rich I am. I’ll have a million before I retire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One million before you retire is "rich?"  OMG, that's just sad
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I didn’t say rich. Richer than what percent of Americans? 90%? Am I in the top 10%? Ok 20% I’ll take it.
> 
> And if I have $1 million and my bills are only $1000 a month, that’s rich
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your bills are $1,000 a month?  What ghetto do you live in?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Condo dues $150
> Heat, electric, cable, internet $300
> 
> I’m talking about when I retire but even now my bills aren’t $1000 a month.
> 
> F150 $350 mo
> 
> Am I missing anything?
Click to expand...


$1K a month is well below the poverty line.  I thought you were rich?  Now you're in poverty?


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> What makes someone a “greedy rich dude”?
> 
> 
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
Click to expand...


Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons


----------



## edward37

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
Click to expand...

how come all those republicans in red states are collecting blue state money  while only contributing spit?


----------



## Toro

The idea that tens of thousands of illegal immigrants are voting is one of the dumbest things in American political discourse today.

Most illegal immigrants come here because they are motivated to make a better life for themselves.  They have no other motive. They do not want publicity. They want to stay in the shadows.  They want to provide for their families. Voting illegally in a public election is a great way to expose yourself and threaten your existence in America.

I’m against illegal immigration, and I’ve spent tens of thousands of dollars as a legal immigrant so I could stay. But I’m also against the wall, and think that this issue has become emotionally irrational.


----------



## del

Ray From Cleveland said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> “Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”
> 
> Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.
> 
> It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.
> 
> And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is correct.  Trump  hates the idea  that over  60,000 Americans  (mostly young Americans) are dying from  overdoses of  opioid  products every year.  He also hates allowing new criminals  to enter our country.
> 
> What a Fn bigot that Trump is.  GO  LIBERALISM!!!!!!
Click to expand...

trump doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself, and only a complete boob or a trumpling, pardon the repetition, could believe otherwise


----------



## kaz

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> 
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how come all those republicans in red states are collecting blue state money  while only contributing spit?
Click to expand...


Not interested in a talking point debate.  I don't even know what that actually means.  Then again, neither do you


----------



## danielpalos

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
Click to expand...

applied capitalism to solve our illegal problem not socialism on a national basis, right wingers!


----------



## danielpalos

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> 
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how come all those republicans in red states are collecting blue state money  while only contributing spit?
Click to expand...

i hear Southern girls are pretty good at, "lip service".


----------



## The Sage of Main Street

kaz said:


> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
Click to expand...

*Spirit of 1845*

Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.


----------



## The Sage of Main Street

kaz said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A million Mexicans walk up to a reinforced concrete 30 foot wall dug down into the ground.
> 
> They laugh and say wow, that might as well not be there at all!
> 
> Then they proceed to ___ and the million illegal aliens enter the United States ...
> 
> You fill in the blank
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Buy plane tickets. Go around the wall. Enter through a border check point.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Zackly, which is how most of it happens.  But cracking down on visa overstays doesn't sell nearly as well as an image of a thousands-of-miles-long "wall" that "Mexico will pay for".
> 
> Easy to imagine and sell to the intellectually mouth-agape ---- not so easy to make a reality.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Visa overstays need to start doing jail time
Click to expand...

*Left Multicultism = Right Greed*

The ruling businessmen won't allow their cheap technies to be inhibited.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac

Didn't vote for him but might consider it in 2020 depending heavily on the economy.


----------



## LoneLaugher

Grampa Murked U said:


> Didn't vote for him but might consider it in 2020 depending heavily on the economy.



Of course.


----------



## The Sage of Main Street

kaz said:


> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
> I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
> Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
> to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.
> 
> kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
> for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
> keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
> It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
> such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
> it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
> people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
> They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
> to pull that many people.
> 
> Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
> development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
> Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
> to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.
> 
> So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
> complexes, and cities can be built around that.
> 
> kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
> is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
> and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.
> 
> We need more than that.
> 
> If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
> then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.
> 
> What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
> with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working
> either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
> all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
> DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!
> 
> Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
> for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc
> organizing sustainable Development along the border:
> 
> www.paceuniversal.com
> Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
> women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking
> 
> UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
> UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
> what a concept
> 
> www.campusplan.org
> Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
> to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
> creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
> while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
> and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts
> 
> the expanded plan to restore the historic district
> of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
> through business management of property and programs was
> already posted www.freedmenstown.com
> 
> and replicating that plan along the border
> might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org
> 
> So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
> to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
> similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the
> same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.
> 
> kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
> better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
> ask for a conference between parties and how to use
> the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
> with parties and start working out common proposals.
> 
> Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
> each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
> DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
> ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm for military support of the wall, just not as a replacement for it.  The military trying to chase almost 3K illegal aliens around the desert as Gator proposes a night is insane.  And he wants that not because he believes it will work, but because he knows it won't.  The opposite of why he opposes the wall.
> 
> And Trump is already there advocating the wall.  Why would I go grass roots for something that is already in the White House?  That's why after not voting for Trump I'm advocating him and his ideas.
> 
> And contrary to the lies of the left, he isn't just proposing a wall, he's proposing electronic security, more border agents, a focus on Visa overstays.  We have to do all of those things to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Think About the Objections You Are Told to Recite*
> 
> For every border bandito we kill, thousands will be scared into vamoosing.  It is illogical to think of numbers on each side when the power of a lethal solution is magnified far beyond the individual incident.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know what that means
Click to expand...

*The Lonestar Is a Red Supergiant*

"One riot, one Ranger"


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
Click to expand...

In my defense he’s got to lodge his 2 sons and their friends. Want to divide the room into 6 fine. Lol

But he also drives and I never pay for gas


----------



## sealybobo

Ray From Cleveland said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I make more than that.... in a year. But I never cry about how much taxes I pay. What kind of person with money is complaining about taxes? I’ll tell you who. The ones that have country club memberships, a second home, kids in school, expensive cars, insurance on all the toys they have.
> 
> Can you imagine what the insurance is for a Ferrari? I considered a mustang once. They aren’t expensive but the insurance was outrageous
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> They vote republican.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When was college ever funded by taxpayers?
> 
> College is a business.   As with  any  other  business, their  prices are built on supply and demand.  The more supply than demand, the lower the cost.
> 
> As years went  on, more  and more  high school  graduates started to attend college.  This is particularly true with females as they left the stay-at-home mom  gig.
> 
> So now the  demand  is more than the  supply, and that dictates prices will increase.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I’m pretty sure state colleges used to be federally funded.
> 
> They aren’t for profit. That’s university of phoenix
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Okay, if they were federally funded, what years were  those and  when did this so-called funding stop?
Click to expand...

I don’t know all the details just the history.

You are just repeating their excuse for why costs have quadrupled and meanwhile they are also cutting professor salaries


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the liberal definition "anyone with a dollar more than I have"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
Click to expand...

And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.


----------



## kaz

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And again, your argument is the military can stop them, but IF and ONLY IF we don't build a wall.  That's just stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strawman. I'm for that and never said I wasn't. We need to do EVERYTHING to stop illegal immigration here. Here's the thing. Proposing one thing is not saying I oppose everything else
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
Click to expand...


Um ... OK?


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bingo
> 
> 
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
Click to expand...


Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You hate the poor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't hate the poor, that's for sure.  You want as many poor from the world as you can get over here then you want to keep them poor like you want to keep Americans poor.
> 
> You love poor!  The more the better!  It's the Democrat voting machine
Click to expand...

I think I made a good point that you hate the poor we don’t hate the rich and you come back with this hypothesis?


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac

LoneLaugher said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for him but might consider it in 2020 depending heavily on the economy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course.
Click to expand...

Down boy. No need to hump my leg.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> That’s ridiculous. We want us all to chip in to help the poor. You hate the poor. You don’t want to pony up. You’ve been convinced most of them are lazy slackers milking the system..
> 
> So if it makes you feel better telling yourself we hate people who have more than me, I don’t get shit from welfare. I pay in to welfare I don’t get welfare. So his premise is debunked. Unless you think I personally get foodstamps. Do you believe that?
> 
> So fuck you guys saying we hate someone who has more than us. You are ignorant greedy bastards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
Click to expand...

What defense I agreed with you.

I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.

Unless he’s greedy


----------



## Mr Natural

How long would it take to build a 2,000 mile wall?


----------



## sealybobo

Grampa Murked U said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for him but might consider it in 2020 depending heavily on the economy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Down boy. No need to hump my leg.
Click to expand...

The good economy didn’t make you vote gore or hillary


----------



## sealybobo

Mr Clean said:


> How long would it take to build a 2,000 mile wall?


Trump told Mexico he was coming to visit. They changed their mind about paying for it and it’ll be done in two weeks


----------



## The Sage of Main Street

kaz said:


> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
Click to expand...

*You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*

The Wall is a Maginot Line.


----------



## kaz

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, my argument is that the military can stop them more effective and cheaper than a wall that we do not need if we would first go after the companies paying them and created a realist, workable guest worker program that benefited both side.
> 
> But you want the wall and nothing else matters.
> 
> Every time it has been mentioned by anyone you ignore ti and go of on some rant about NORMAL people.  This is the first time you have even acknowledged it as an idea put forth, and were very careful not to endorse it directly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dear kaz and Golfing Gator
> I agree that it will take more than just a wall.
> Both for security reasons and for unity between people states and parties
> to agree and focus on a unifying solution. We need to spell out more of the plans.
> 
> kaz I'm glad you see there needs to be SERIOUS support
> for any such alternatives to work. The problem with Dems is that they
> keep asking for things, but not showing any responsibility for how to build these solutions.
> It's as if they are  CLUELESS how much work, labor, time and resources are involved,
> such as in promising "universal health care" -- when I brought up the realization that
> it will take having hospitals in every county or district to meet the full demand because
> people are already dying while waiting in line for care as it is, I get blank stares.
> They want to ask for the carts without counting how many horses it will take
> to pull that many people.
> 
> Golfing Gator and I both agree and envision there needs to be military
> development along the border.  So we can build jobs around that.
> Gov Schwarzenegger had proposed to build prisons in Mexico
> to accommodate Mexican nationals costing CA billions in resources every year.
> 
> So the military can be in charge of guarding prisons that will create
> complexes, and cities can be built around that.
> 
> kaz just building a wall is like liberals yelling that "agreeing to global warming arguments"
> is going to magically save the planet. No, it still takes all the work to stop pollution
> and save resources.  Whether we give a FLIP about global warming or walls or whatever.
> 
> We need more than that.
> 
> If you are waiting on "someone else" to lead a movement kaz
> then that's also like liberals waiting on party or depending on govt.
> 
> What it is going to take is everyone supporting solutions, organizing
> with our local party precincts, finding out who is leading or working
> either for or against Trump, Democrats, Republicans, and asking
> all these people, whether taxpayers or future leaders, to invest
> DONATIONS into CREATING JOBS not more campaigns!
> 
> Here are model programs we can cite and ask to create JOBS
> for leaders, dreamers, workers, veterans, students, etc
> organizing sustainable Development along the border:
> 
> www.paceuniversal.com
> Pace Universal builds schools and daycares to create safe jobs and centers for
> women children and workers in regions otherwise exploited for trafficking
> 
> UTRGV - <system-page-title/>
> UT at Brownsville already HAS an international student program that CROSSES the BORDER
> what a concept
> 
> www.campusplan.org
> Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee signed on to this innovative plan
> to transform public housing into sustainable community campuses,
> creating onsite programs for student interns to earn their education
> while providing assistance and services to families to break the cycle of poverty
> and get people off welfare instead of growing more dependent on govt and handouts
> 
> the expanded plan to restore the historic district
> of Freedmen's Town into a campus for teaching self government
> through business management of property and programs was
> already posted www.freedmenstown.com
> 
> and replicating that plan along the border
> might look like this www.earnedamnesty.org
> 
> So anyone can take these links and ask more party members and leaders
> to start investing "campaign donations" into actually BUILDING
> similar solutions within EACH DISTRICT. Then we can do the
> same across states, nations, and the border. Build locally, expand globally.
> 
> kaz if you agree with any of these ideas, or you have
> better ones, then take those to your local party leaders,
> ask for a conference between parties and how to use
> the Electoral College District system to set up meetings
> with parties and start working out common proposals.
> 
> Instead of parties competing to raise money to OUTVOTE
> each other at the polls, why not invest our resources
> DIRECTLY in solutions that would CREATE JOBS FOR
> ALL PARTIES, not just one office that several people can't all hold!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm for military support of the wall, just not as a replacement for it.  The military trying to chase almost 3K illegal aliens around the desert as Gator proposes a night is insane.  And he wants that not because he believes it will work, but because he knows it won't.  The opposite of why he opposes the wall.
> 
> And Trump is already there advocating the wall.  Why would I go grass roots for something that is already in the White House?  That's why after not voting for Trump I'm advocating him and his ideas.
> 
> And contrary to the lies of the left, he isn't just proposing a wall, he's proposing electronic security, more border agents, a focus on Visa overstays.  We have to do all of those things to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Think About the Objections You Are Told to Recite*
> 
> For every border bandito we kill, thousands will be scared into vamoosing.  It is illogical to think of numbers on each side when the power of a lethal solution is magnified far beyond the individual incident.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know what that means
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *The Lonestar Is a Red Supergiant*
> 
> "One riot, one Ranger"
Click to expand...


So you're stealing Daniel Palos method of posting inane drivel?  He's on my ignore list.  If you want to write nonsense, don't bomb me with it or you will join him


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You hate the poor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't hate the poor, that's for sure.  You want as many poor from the world as you can get over here then you want to keep them poor like you want to keep Americans poor.
> 
> You love poor!  The more the better!  It's the Democrat voting machine
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think I made a good point that you hate the poor we don’t hate the rich and you come back with this hypothesis?
Click to expand...


It's not just a hypothesis.  Everything the left post is that the poor are a voter drive for you.  Nothing you post indicates you care about helping them stop being poor.  All your solutions are to increase dependency and accept their lot in life as poor


----------



## kaz

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> 
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
Click to expand...


I'm going to give you a time out


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You really need to get your fair share from your brother, spending that kind of money for a private schools puts him up there with other lefty elitists.
> 
> 
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What defense I agreed with you.
> 
> I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.
> 
> Unless he’s greedy
Click to expand...


Pretty sure neither one of us "hangs out" with any billionaires.  Hell, I don't even know any other millionaires.  Hanging out with well to do folks, I wouldn't want or expect them to pay for my air fare or hotel.


----------



## kaz

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What defense I agreed with you.
> 
> I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.
> 
> Unless he’s greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pretty sure neither one of us "hangs out" with any billionaires.  Hell, I don't even know any other millionaires.  Hanging out with well to do folks, I wouldn't want or expect them to pay for my air fare or hotel.
Click to expand...


Sealy said his goal is to have a million when he retires.  Nope, he has nothing to do with billionaires


----------



## Golfing Gator

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> 
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
Click to expand...


He is not pretending, he is really not a very bright person


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## kaz

Golfing Gator said:


> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He is not pretending, he is really not a very bright person
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


I understood what he eventually said after he got past the stupid WMD shit.  All he said is the wall won't work.  And his example was inane as the Nazis could blow through the Maginot Line or go around it.  Neither of which applies to the wall on the southern border


----------



## Thinker101

kaz said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> 
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What defense I agreed with you.
> 
> I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.
> 
> Unless he’s greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pretty sure neither one of us "hangs out" with any billionaires.  Hell, I don't even know any other millionaires.  Hanging out with well to do folks, I wouldn't want or expect them to pay for my air fare or hotel.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sealy said his goal is to have a million when he retires.  Nope, he has nothing to do with billionaires
Click to expand...


Yup, that million should be enough if he retires when he's 75.


----------



## Pogo

The Sage of Main Street said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're a liar, I don't ignore other proposals.  You just made that up.
> 
> I'm totally for a major guest worker program.  But not until we solve the problem of people coming here with visas and not leaving when they expire.
> 
> Besides the wall, we need to clean things up then implement jail time for anyone here illegally.  Minimum three months for a first offense.
> 
> And your idea to have the military chase thousands of people around the desert would be insanely expensive.  We'd burn through $20 billion in months, and the $20 billion is one time to build the wall.  Maintaining it would be far cheaper than that a year
> 
> 
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
Click to expand...


More like a Mendoza line.  You have to have a sub-par IQ to take it seriously.

Ironic thread title is ironic --- arguably the "most critical political issue in America" is not a wall, but the fact that there are those walking aroung gullible and self-deluded enough to believe that building a wall on the border is on the list of the top 358 things to do.  That sort of emotionally-triggered self-delusion is a bigly issue.


----------



## danielpalos

Applied Capitalism, right wingers!  

The Great Walls of America can simply charge admission and provide a federal id. at the borders!

let's find capital opportunities and make, "lots of money"!


----------



## kaz

Pogo said:


> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Treason Is Not a Property Right*
> 
> Our Navy can easily seize the offshore Mexican oilfields, which will pay for the wall.  By encouraging and aiding its citizens to invade us, Mexico has committed an act of war.  American traitors who have gone along with this must pay the price.
> 
> It's time we take the law back into our own hands; it's obvious that letting the ruling class and its anti-democratic Constitution protect us hasn't been working for decades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like a Mendoza line.  You have to have a sub-par IQ to take it seriously.
> 
> Ironic thread title is ironic --- arguably the "most critical political issue in America" is not a wall, but the fact that there are those walking aroung gullible and self-deluded enough to believe that building a wall on the border is on the list of the top 358 things to do.  That sort of emotionally-triggered self-delusion is a bigly issue.
Click to expand...


Gotcha.  Dealing with a million illegal aliens taking the jobs away from poor people, flooding our schools, hospitals and taking billions in welfare from America isn't in the "top 358 things to do."  It's just not a big deal.

And 23% of federal inmates according to homeland security are illegal aliens.  Naw, not in the top 358 things to do.  You're a sheep.

Again you obviously don't want a wall because you want the voters for your authoritarian leftist cause


----------



## LoneLaugher

Grampa Murked U said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for him but might consider it in 2020 depending heavily on the economy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Down boy. No need to hump my leg.
Click to expand...


Why did you lie?


----------



## LoneLaugher

sealybobo said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for him but might consider it in 2020 depending heavily on the economy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Down boy. No need to hump my leg.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The good economy didn’t make you vote gore or hillary
Click to expand...


That dude thinks the economy sucked until last year.


----------



## Mr Natural

Yeah, right.  Like you’re going to get Americans to pizza lettuce.

Dream on!


----------



## Pogo

kaz said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> 
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like a Mendoza line.  You have to have a sub-par IQ to take it seriously.
> 
> Ironic thread title is ironic --- arguably the "most critical political issue in America" is not a wall, but the fact that there are those walking aroung gullible and self-deluded enough to believe that building a wall on the border is on the list of the top 358 things to do.  That sort of emotionally-triggered self-delusion is a bigly issue.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotcha.  Dealing with a million illegal aliens taking the jobs away from poor people, flooding our schools, hospitals and taking billions in welfare from America isn't in the "top 358 things to do."  It's just not a big deal.
> 
> And 23% of federal inmates according to homeland security are illegal aliens.  Naw, not in the top 358 things to do.  You're a sheep.
> 
> Again you obviously don't want a wall because you want the voters for your authoritarian leftist cause
Click to expand...


The mark of the dishonest hack.  Can't deal with the point?  No prob, just change what the point was, to what you wish it had been.  SO simple.

What a great tactic.  Bet no one's ever thought of this before.  Stop the presses.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can’t be a total freeloader. Whenever we go up north I never pay for the hotel but I take everyone to dinner.
> 
> But this is a great example. He doesn’t make me split everything down the middle. If he was you he’d be a cheapskate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What defense I agreed with you.
> 
> I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.
> 
> Unless he’s greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pretty sure neither one of us "hangs out" with any billionaires.  Hell, I don't even know any other millionaires.  Hanging out with well to do folks, I wouldn't want or expect them to pay for my air fare or hotel.
Click to expand...


Well I wouldn't get the hotel room if I had to pay.  I'd go to a dump or I'd meet him up the morning after.  I've actually done that by the way.  We were going hunting and I snore so I told him I'd just meet him up at the property at 5am. 

So if you had a rich buddy with 65 acres of hunting property, you wouldn't go use his property?  You would insist on paying your brother to use the property?  What kind of family is that? 

Anyways, I feel like I am more than generous with him based on what I make and what he makes.  He has access to my $26K boat and $7K quadrunner whenever he wants.  I have access to his property up north.  His property is worth more than my boat and quad.  So what? 

I have friends who think my brother is cheap because he lets me pay for anything.  When they say that shit then I start sounding like you.  I don't want to be dead weight so I try to pay for things when I can so I'm contributing.  And his kids are expensive.  Going to KFC ends up costing $35 when you have that many kids with you.

Oh, and I just went and bought his two kids and my other two niece/nephew really sweet life jackets for their birthdays.  I spent $400.  My brother recognizes I spend a lot on his kids and I don't have kids so they don't ever spend money on my family or me.  So when I go up north hell yea I stay for free and I don't pay for gas.  No one is more generous than uncle sealybobo.  LOL


----------



## sealybobo

kaz said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know.  I think it's our job to secure our own border, not their job to secure our border
> 
> 
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like a Mendoza line.  You have to have a sub-par IQ to take it seriously.
> 
> Ironic thread title is ironic --- arguably the "most critical political issue in America" is not a wall, but the fact that there are those walking aroung gullible and self-deluded enough to believe that building a wall on the border is on the list of the top 358 things to do.  That sort of emotionally-triggered self-delusion is a bigly issue.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotcha.  Dealing with a million illegal aliens taking the jobs away from poor people, flooding our schools, hospitals and taking billions in welfare from America isn't in the "top 358 things to do."  It's just not a big deal.
> 
> And 23% of federal inmates according to homeland security are illegal aliens.  Naw, not in the top 358 things to do.  You're a sheep.
> 
> Again you obviously don't want a wall because you want the voters for your authoritarian leftist cause
Click to expand...


Wow you just woke me up on this

DHS reported a total of 58,766 "known or suspected" aliens in the custody of federal authorities. According to the Federal Bureau of Prisons, there are 184,379 total federal inmates, meaning that almost 32 percent of all federal inmates are aliens. The number of aliens in federal custody has risen since the last report: At that time, the Justice Department estimated that there were 42,000 aliens, representing 24 percent of the federal prison population.

Even 24% is unacceptable.  I saw once they serve their time we deport them.


----------



## Thinker101

sealybobo said:


> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> That would have to be some damn expensive dinner to make up for the hotel....unless the hotel is some real dump.
> 
> 
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What defense I agreed with you.
> 
> I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.
> 
> Unless he’s greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pretty sure neither one of us "hangs out" with any billionaires.  Hell, I don't even know any other millionaires.  Hanging out with well to do folks, I wouldn't want or expect them to pay for my air fare or hotel.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I wouldn't get the hotel room if I had to pay.  I'd go to a dump or I'd meet him up the morning after.  I've actually done that by the way.  We were going hunting and I snore so I told him I'd just meet him up at the property at 5am.
> 
> So if you had a rich buddy with 65 acres of hunting property, you wouldn't go use his property?  You would insist on paying your brother to use the property?  What kind of family is that?
> 
> Anyways, I feel like I am more than generous with him based on what I make and what he makes.  He has access to my $26K boat and $7K quadrunner whenever he wants.  I have access to his property up north.  His property is worth more than my boat and quad.  So what?
> 
> I have friends who think my brother is cheap because he lets me pay for anything.  When they say that shit then I start sounding like you.  I don't want to be dead weight so I try to pay for things when I can so I'm contributing.  And his kids are expensive.  Going to KFC ends up costing $35 when you have that many kids with you.
> 
> Oh, and I just went and bought his two kids and my other two niece/nephew really sweet life jackets for their birthdays.  I spent $400.  My brother recognizes I spend a lot on his kids and I don't have kids so they don't ever spend money on my family or me.  So when I go up north hell yea I stay for free and I don't pay for gas.  No one is more generous than uncle sealybobo.  LOL
Click to expand...


If nothing else, sounds like you need different friends.


----------



## sealybobo

Thinker101 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinker101 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And the condos he rents at boyne mountain are not cheap.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your defense is growing weaker by the minute.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What defense I agreed with you.
> 
> I contribute enough. If don jr wants you to hang out he’s going to pay your air fair and hotel. He’s rich.
> 
> Unless he’s greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pretty sure neither one of us "hangs out" with any billionaires.  Hell, I don't even know any other millionaires.  Hanging out with well to do folks, I wouldn't want or expect them to pay for my air fare or hotel.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I wouldn't get the hotel room if I had to pay.  I'd go to a dump or I'd meet him up the morning after.  I've actually done that by the way.  We were going hunting and I snore so I told him I'd just meet him up at the property at 5am.
> 
> So if you had a rich buddy with 65 acres of hunting property, you wouldn't go use his property?  You would insist on paying your brother to use the property?  What kind of family is that?
> 
> Anyways, I feel like I am more than generous with him based on what I make and what he makes.  He has access to my $26K boat and $7K quadrunner whenever he wants.  I have access to his property up north.  His property is worth more than my boat and quad.  So what?
> 
> I have friends who think my brother is cheap because he lets me pay for anything.  When they say that shit then I start sounding like you.  I don't want to be dead weight so I try to pay for things when I can so I'm contributing.  And his kids are expensive.  Going to KFC ends up costing $35 when you have that many kids with you.
> 
> Oh, and I just went and bought his two kids and my other two niece/nephew really sweet life jackets for their birthdays.  I spent $400.  My brother recognizes I spend a lot on his kids and I don't have kids so they don't ever spend money on my family or me.  So when I go up north hell yea I stay for free and I don't pay for gas.  No one is more generous than uncle sealybobo.  LOL
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If nothing else, sounds like you need different friends.
Click to expand...


The guy who said that to me doesn't have a brother, is jealous, and yes, it's easy for his broke ass to say what he would do if he had that kind of money. He doesn't understand it doesn't work that way.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

sealybobo said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you have such a hard time understanding why good quality, hard working people whom have paved their own paths would want to keep more of what they work so hard for?
> Look, while broke low-life bastards were fucking around ditching school, not trying in school, having babies, dropping out, drinking and smoking weed I was busting my ass playing football, wrestling, taking all honors courses and studying until 2-3am every night....And where were all you noble, giving mother fuckers when I had to pony up tuition for my high dollar degree and work two or three jobs to cover it. Envious, lowlife piece of shits can go fuck themselves...they can pave their own paths...stop riding on the backs of others....pull your own fucking weight.
> None of this makes any sense to bottom feeding leeches....I get it.
> 
> 
> 
> No I get why you feel this way. Middle class conservative people hate poor slackers. But you’ve been brainwashed to want to remove social programs and safety nets.
> 
> College was only $5k a year when I went. That’s because rich people paid higher taxes. Many of them went to affordable colleges too. Now you want to change the rules? Greedy
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When was college ever funded by taxpayers?
> 
> College is a business.   As with  any  other  business, their  prices are built on supply and demand.  The more supply than demand, the lower the cost.
> 
> As years went  on, more  and more  high school  graduates started to attend college.  This is particularly true with females as they left the stay-at-home mom  gig.
> 
> So now the  demand  is more than the  supply, and that dictates prices will increase.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I’m pretty sure state colleges used to be federally funded.
> 
> They aren’t for profit. That’s university of phoenix
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Okay, if they were federally funded, what years were  those and  when did this so-called funding stop?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don’t know all the details just the history.
> 
> You are just repeating their excuse for why costs have quadrupled and meanwhile they are also cutting professor salaries
Click to expand...


Why would I be making  excuses for them?  Colleges are liberal  so it's likely run by liberals. 

Non-profit colleges have an average 21%  profit.  Seems  like  they are cleaning up to  me.   

If you're going to make an accusation, you should have some evidence  to back it  up. To my knowledge  (and I could  be  wrong)  the  federal government has never subsidized colleges.  State?  County?  City?  Yes, those are community colleges they fund.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

del said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> “Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”
> 
> Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.
> 
> It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.
> 
> And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is correct.  Trump  hates the idea  that over  60,000 Americans  (mostly young Americans) are dying from  overdoses of  opioid  products every year.  He also hates allowing new criminals  to enter our country.
> 
> What a Fn bigot that Trump is.  GO  LIBERALISM!!!!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> trump doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself, and only a complete boob or a trumpling, pardon the repetition, could believe otherwise
Click to expand...


Then that must be me because I do believe otherwise.   Trump is  not politically correct; he doesn't  pander to his party.  He does what he thinks is  best, and  the best thing we  can do is seal off the southern  border.  Finally we have somebody willing  to say it  in plain English.  That way the illegals won't  be able to  understand  him.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Toro said:


> Most illegal immigrants come here because they are motivated to make a better life for themselves. They have no other motive. They do not want publicity. They want to stay in the shadows.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

edward37 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, my answer was just posted, they aren't a Democrat, nailed it.  You're a partisan hack.  You can be a Democrat and cheat on your taxes, sexually assault women, and all is good!  Being a Republican, that's a crime.  Oh, but you voted for Trump.  Lying sack of shit
> 
> 
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how come all those republicans in red states are collecting blue state money  while only contributing spit?
Click to expand...


States don't  collect money--people do.  

If you don't like it, find a way to get those blue people  out of  our  states.   Nothing would  make us happier.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Golfing Gator said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> “Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”
> 
> Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.
> 
> It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.
> 
> And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is correct.  Trump  hates the idea  that over  60,000 Americans  (mostly young Americans) are dying from  overdoses of  opioid  products every year.  He also hates allowing new criminals  to enter our country.
> 
> What a Fn bigot that Trump is.  GO  LIBERALISM!!!!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here is a napkin, you dribbled some kool aid down the front of your shirt
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


Truth really hurts.........doesn't it?


----------



## Golfing Gator

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> “Building the wall is the most critical political issue in America”
> 
> Actually not, there are many other issues far more critical and important.
> 
> It may be ‘critical’ for hateful bigots, but not for the rest of America.
> 
> And with regard to the issue of immigration, Trump’s ‘wall’ of bigotry and hate is in no manner a ‘solution’ – in fact, it serves to only make matters worse.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is correct.  Trump  hates the idea  that over  60,000 Americans  (mostly young Americans) are dying from  overdoses of  opioid  products every year.  He also hates allowing new criminals  to enter our country.
> 
> What a Fn bigot that Trump is.  GO  LIBERALISM!!!!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here is a napkin, you dribbled some kool aid down the front of your shirt
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Truth really hurts.........doesn't it?
Click to expand...


Yes, the truth does hurt sheep like you.


----------



## edward37

Ray From Cleveland said:


> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, you minded Slick Willy but don’t mind slimy trump. Why?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how come all those republicans in red states are collecting blue state money  while only contributing spit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> States don't  collect money--people do.
> 
> If you don't like it, find a way to get those blue people  out of  our  states.   Nothing would  make us happier.
Click to expand...

Alabama 49th in everything  Thank you Mississippi


----------



## kaz

Pogo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like a Mendoza line.  You have to have a sub-par IQ to take it seriously.
> 
> Ironic thread title is ironic --- arguably the "most critical political issue in America" is not a wall, but the fact that there are those walking aroung gullible and self-deluded enough to believe that building a wall on the border is on the list of the top 358 things to do.  That sort of emotionally-triggered self-delusion is a bigly issue.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotcha.  Dealing with a million illegal aliens taking the jobs away from poor people, flooding our schools, hospitals and taking billions in welfare from America isn't in the "top 358 things to do."  It's just not a big deal.
> 
> And 23% of federal inmates according to homeland security are illegal aliens.  Naw, not in the top 358 things to do.  You're a sheep.
> 
> Again you obviously don't want a wall because you want the voters for your authoritarian leftist cause
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The mark of the dishonest hack.  Can't deal with the point?  No prob, just change what the point was, to what you wish it had been.  SO simple.
> 
> What a great tactic.  Bet no one's ever thought of this before.  Stop the presses.
Click to expand...


Say what, Hillbilly?

What are you talking about I didn't deal with the point?  You argued that a million illegal aliens a year is no real thing, it doesn't the top "358" issues in this country.  That's exactly what I argued.  What is your problem?  Did you drink too much moonshine, fall off your porch and hit your head ... again ???


----------



## kaz

sealybobo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Sage of Main Street said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Spirit of 1845*
> 
> Not having a wall is equivalent to Mexico having WMDs and using them against us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Um ... OK?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *You're Pretending You Don't Get My Point*
> 
> The Wall is a Maginot Line.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like a Mendoza line.  You have to have a sub-par IQ to take it seriously.
> 
> Ironic thread title is ironic --- arguably the "most critical political issue in America" is not a wall, but the fact that there are those walking aroung gullible and self-deluded enough to believe that building a wall on the border is on the list of the top 358 things to do.  That sort of emotionally-triggered self-delusion is a bigly issue.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gotcha.  Dealing with a million illegal aliens taking the jobs away from poor people, flooding our schools, hospitals and taking billions in welfare from America isn't in the "top 358 things to do."  It's just not a big deal.
> 
> And 23% of federal inmates according to homeland security are illegal aliens.  Naw, not in the top 358 things to do.  You're a sheep.
> 
> Again you obviously don't want a wall because you want the voters for your authoritarian leftist cause
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow you just woke me up on this
> 
> DHS reported a total of 58,766 "known or suspected" aliens in the custody of federal authorities. According to the Federal Bureau of Prisons, there are 184,379 total federal inmates, meaning that almost 32 percent of all federal inmates are aliens. The number of aliens in federal custody has risen since the last report: At that time, the Justice Department estimated that there were 42,000 aliens, representing 24 percent of the federal prison population.
> 
> Even 24% is unacceptable.  I saw once they serve their time we deport them.
Click to expand...


Yep.  Then they walk back across the border back to the US


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

“Trump often points to China's Great Wall as an example of physical barrier success.

If only that were true.

The Great Wall of China was built and rebuilt and rebuilt over a couple of thousand years, costing hundreds of thousands of lives and who knows how much fortune.

And it never actually stopped China's invaders.

However, Trump might hope that his wall, like China's, will someday become a rousing success on another level:

Tourist attraction.”

Montini: Trump's border wall, like China's 'Great Wall,' will fail

Supporters of Trump’s moronic ‘wall’ of hate and bigotry are just as ignorant and ridiculous as Trump.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

edward37 said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edward37 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't vote for either.   You voted twice for a sexual predator, misogynist
> 
> 
> 
> That’s how much I hate republicans. They are the dark side
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, Republicans want you to work and pay your own bills.  They are just demons
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> how come all those republicans in red states are collecting blue state money  while only contributing spit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> States don't  collect money--people do.
> 
> If you don't like it, find a way to get those blue people  out of  our  states.   Nothing would  make us happier.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Alabama 49th in everything  Thank you Mississippi
Click to expand...


What you should do  is watch HGTV for a couple  weeks and take note of housing prices and values across our land. 

What you will notice (as I did repeatedly) is that what you can buy in  Alabama for 180K would cost you over  850K in a typical blue  state.  

Cost of living is the real factor.  You could live a better life here in Ohio making $15.00 an hour than you could in NYC making $25.00 an hour.  

This is why blue states are screaming like pigs with the new tax laws Trump created.  Red and  purple states have no problem with it because not many have a home they paid over 750K.  A 750K or more expensive home just about buys you a mansion  in our states.  750K houses in blue states are middle-class because of their cost of living.  

Because their wages are so inflated,  of course they pay more in taxes.  It's not that they have that much  more  than people  in other states, it's that their purchasing power is so weak  compared to  other  states.


----------



## Mr Natural

Ray From Cleveland said:


> What you will notice (as I did repeatedly) is that what you can buy in Alabama for 180K would cost you over 850K in a typical blue state.



But then you’d have to live in Alabama.


----------



## oreo

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.




You mean that WALL that Mexico was supposed to pay for?    The 1.6 billion they just appropriated is to *fix *existing *fences* along the border.



> The bill provides $1.6 billion for barriers along the U.S.-Mexico border, but with some serious strings attached. Of the total, $251 million is earmarked specifically for “secondary fencing” near San Diego, where fencing is already in place; $445 million is for no more than 25 miles of “levee fencing”; $196 million is for “primary pedestrian fencing” in the Rio Grande Valley; $445 million is for the replacement of existing fencing in that area.


Here’s what Congress is stuffing into its $1.3 trillion spending bill – The Denver Post

Here is how effective they've been.  If you watch the entire video they'll tell about *the 240 tunnels* they have already found in the San Diego Region alone.  Basically if you build a 1000 mile wall you'll have a 1000 tunnels underneath it, as soon as it's built.


Border patrol agent explores newly discovered US-Mexico drug tunnel with GoPro camera


As for as voting for Trump for a second term, he's not going to make it through his 1st term.

Not when he's stupid enough to do this.


----------



## kaz

oreo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You mean that WALL that Mexico was supposed to pay for?
Click to expand...


Don't give a shit who pays for the wall as long as it's built.  It's a pittance of spending for the result.  So you only care about illegals going to emergency rooms if Mexico pays for it?  Should illegals go to schools only if Mexico pays for it?  Or do you suddenly not give a shit?


----------



## oreo

kaz said:


> oreo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You mean that WALL that Mexico was supposed to pay for?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't give a shit who pays for the wall as long as it's built.  It's a pittance of spending for the result.  So you only care about illegals going to emergency rooms if Mexico pays for it?  Should illegals go to schools only if Mexico pays for it?  Or do you suddenly not give a shit?
Click to expand...



It's not going to be built--can you READ what I just gave you?   They're spending the 1.6 billion that they just appropriated to FIX existing fences.

*"The bill provides $1.6 billion *for barriers along the U.S.-Mexico border, but with some serious strings attached. Of the total, $251 million is earmarked specifically for “secondary fencing” near San Diego, where fencing is already in place; $445 million is for no more than 25 miles of “levee fencing”; $196 million is for “primary pedestrian fencing” in the Rio Grande Valley; $445 million is for the replacement of existing fencing in that area."
Here’s what Congress is stuffing into its $1.3 trillion spending bill – The Denver Post

*While Trump says Mexicans are great climbers they're also great diggers.*






There's many more pictures of these tunnels at this link.
pictures of mexican tunnels - Yahoo Search Results Yahoo Image Search Results

Most Americans right now, don't want to waste money on building the WALL.
Analysis | Most Americans don’t want the wall, don’t think Mexico will pay for it and don’t believe it will happen

Not when this money could be better spent on high tech motion detectors, and more border patrol stations. *Something they can SEE--can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they CAN'T see--they won't even attempt to cross.*


In this video you'll get to see one of their drive-thru tunnels.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Mr Clean said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> What you will notice (as I did repeatedly) is that what you can buy in Alabama for 180K would cost you over 850K in a typical blue state.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But then you’d have to live in Alabama.
Click to expand...


Yeah,  so?  

Prices of everything is cheaper.   Your dollar goes a long way compared to blue states.


----------



## kaz

oreo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oreo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You mean that WALL that Mexico was supposed to pay for?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't give a shit who pays for the wall as long as it's built.  It's a pittance of spending for the result.  So you only care about illegals going to emergency rooms if Mexico pays for it?  Should illegals go to schools only if Mexico pays for it?  Or do you suddenly not give a shit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's not going to be built--can you READ what I just gave you?   They're spending the 1.6 billion that they just appropriated to FIX existing fences.
> 
> *"The bill provides $1.6 billion *for barriers along the U.S.-Mexico border, but with some serious strings attached. Of the total, $251 million is earmarked specifically for “secondary fencing” near San Diego, where fencing is already in place; $445 million is for no more than 25 miles of “levee fencing”; $196 million is for “primary pedestrian fencing” in the Rio Grande Valley; $445 million is for the replacement of existing fencing in that area."
> Here’s what Congress is stuffing into its $1.3 trillion spending bill – The Denver Post
> 
> *While Trump says Mexicans are great climbers they're also great diggers.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's many more pictures of these tunnels at this link.
> pictures of mexican tunnels - Yahoo Search Results Yahoo Image Search Results
> 
> Most Americans right now, don't want to waste money on building the WALL.
> Analysis | Most Americans don’t want the wall, don’t think Mexico will pay for it and don’t believe it will happen
> 
> Not when this money could be better spent on high tech motion detectors, and more border patrol stations. *Something they can SEE--can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they CAN'T see--they won't even attempt to cross.*
> 
> 
> In this video you'll get to see one of their drive-thru tunnels.
Click to expand...


If you can't dazzle them with your wit, baffle them with your bull shit.

So stupid bitch.  Simple question.  You only want to pay for illegal aliens if Mexico pays for them?  Education, medical care, welfare?  You say send the stupid bitches back unless Mexico pays for them????

What about that question don't you understand?


----------



## danielpalos

applied capitalism not socialism on a national basis!


----------



## oreo

kaz said:


> oreo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oreo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You mean that WALL that Mexico was supposed to pay for?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't give a shit who pays for the wall as long as it's built.  It's a pittance of spending for the result.  So you only care about illegals going to emergency rooms if Mexico pays for it?  Should illegals go to schools only if Mexico pays for it?  Or do you suddenly not give a shit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's not going to be built--can you READ what I just gave you?   They're spending the 1.6 billion that they just appropriated to FIX existing fences.
> 
> *"The bill provides $1.6 billion *for barriers along the U.S.-Mexico border, but with some serious strings attached. Of the total, $251 million is earmarked specifically for “secondary fencing” near San Diego, where fencing is already in place; $445 million is for no more than 25 miles of “levee fencing”; $196 million is for “primary pedestrian fencing” in the Rio Grande Valley; $445 million is for the replacement of existing fencing in that area."
> Here’s what Congress is stuffing into its $1.3 trillion spending bill – The Denver Post
> 
> *While Trump says Mexicans are great climbers they're also great diggers.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's many more pictures of these tunnels at this link.
> pictures of mexican tunnels - Yahoo Search Results Yahoo Image Search Results
> 
> Most Americans right now, don't want to waste money on building the WALL.
> Analysis | Most Americans don’t want the wall, don’t think Mexico will pay for it and don’t believe it will happen
> 
> Not when this money could be better spent on high tech motion detectors, and more border patrol stations. *Something they can SEE--can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they CAN'T see--they won't even attempt to cross.*
> 
> 
> In this video you'll get to see one of their drive-thru tunnels.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you can't dazzle them with your wit, baffle them with your bull shit.
> 
> So stupid bitch.  Simple question.  You only want to pay for illegal aliens if Mexico pays for them?  Education, medical care, welfare?  You say send the stupid bitches back unless Mexico pays for them????
> 
> What about that question don't you understand?
Click to expand...



Look Dumbass there's PROOF that walls and fences don't WORK.


*You're not trying to keep them out, what you're trying to do is pump up TRUMP.* *You have no interest in keeping illegals out of this country*.





Border patrol agent explores newly discovered US-Mexico drug tunnel with GoPro camera

You're just an ass wipe of Donald Trump--and want to him keep his main campaign promise--so you can see "look" he kept his promise.  Build a fucking worthless 60+ billion dollar --1000 mile wall, that would have a 1000 tunnels underneath it as soon as it's built.   * That's what you really want.*


----------



## danielpalos

Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

oreo said:


> Look Dumbass there's PROOF that walls and fences don't WORK.



Actually........more proof that they do  work:  

Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration


----------



## g5000

I hope we build the wall.  I really do.

It will be worth whatever taxes it cost just so I can have a giant belly laugh when the pseuedocons eagerly wait for the wall to improve our economy and create jobs all around the nation.

That laugh will be worth every penny.  Every penny.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

g5000 said:


> I hope we build the wall.  I really do.
> 
> It will be worth whatever taxes it cost just so I can have a giant belly laugh when the pseuedocons eagerly wait for the wall to improve our economy and create jobs all around the nation.
> 
> That laugh will be worth every penny.  Every penny.



Right.  Because the Democrats are so scared to  death of  the  wall because of the humor  involved.


----------



## Golfing Gator

So. How is that wall coming along?


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## g5000

Ray From Cleveland said:


> g5000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope we build the wall.  I really do.
> 
> It will be worth whatever taxes it cost just so I can have a giant belly laugh when the pseuedocons eagerly wait for the wall to improve our economy and create jobs all around the nation.
> 
> That laugh will be worth every penny.  Every penny.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  Because the Democrats are so scared to  death of  the  wall because of the humor  involved.
Click to expand...

I'm not scared of the wall.  I find it hilarious how sexually stimulated you pseudocons have become over Trump's erotic descriptions of it.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

g5000 said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> g5000 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope we build the wall.  I really do.
> 
> It will be worth whatever taxes it cost just so I can have a giant belly laugh when the pseuedocons eagerly wait for the wall to improve our economy and create jobs all around the nation.
> 
> That laugh will be worth every penny.  Every penny.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  Because the Democrats are so scared to  death of  the  wall because of the humor  involved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'm not scared of the wall.  I find it hilarious how sexually stimulated you pseudocons have become over Trump's erotic descriptions of it.
Click to expand...


Oh,  so it's sexually stimulating now? 

When are you on the left going to realize this  reverse psychology thing  doesn't work on us?


----------



## g5000

"On day one, we will begin working on an impenetrable, physical, tall, powerful, beautiful, Southern border wall."  - Donald Trump, August 31, 2016.


----------



## g5000

Trump is a world class huckster, a master at telling the marks exactly what they want to hear.  I gotta give it to him.


----------



## beagle9

Ray From Cleveland said:


> oreo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look Dumbass there's PROOF that walls and fences don't WORK.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually........more proof that they do  work:
> 
> Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration
Click to expand...

. Yes.. Different ideas bring different results. 

Razor wire fence eh ??

Hmmm.. The do gooder leftist worry when a death row inmate (responsible for some of the most henious crimes ever), might feel a bit uncomfortable when administering a drug to end his pathetic life, so you know how they would scream bloody hell if someone cut themselves on razor wire.


----------



## dblack

g5000 said:


> "On day one, we will begin working on an impenetrable, physical, tall, powerful, beautiful, Southern border wall."  - Donald Trump, August 31, 2016.



Hubba, hubba

You're making my jack boots tingle.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

danielpalos said:


> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?


Clearly not.

They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.


----------



## dblack

g5000 said:


> Trump is a world class huckster, a master at telling the marks exactly what they want to hear.  I gotta give it to him.


I have to disagree. Trump is a fairly clumsy and amateurish huckster. Both Clintons were better.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

g5000 said:


> I hope we build the wall.  I really do.
> 
> It will be worth whatever taxes it cost just so I can have a giant belly laugh when the pseuedocons eagerly wait for the wall to improve our economy and create jobs all around the nation.
> 
> That laugh will be worth every penny.  Every penny.


…and it won’t keep the scary brown people out who don’t speak American.


----------



## beagle9

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
Click to expand...

. The wall of bigotry, fear, and hate eh ?? Go pedal your bullcrap to the fools who will listen, because most Americans know the game with these cheap labor illegals, and these no background checked criminal aliens now being protected in these so called sanctuary cities.


----------



## Progressive Democrat

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.



Just let it go Trump is a conartist the wall will never be built.


----------



## beagle9

Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ?? 

Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??

You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.

Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??

Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

beagle9 said:


> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??



Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it. 

IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.  

When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.   

So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.


----------



## dblack

Ray From Cleveland said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
Click to expand...



Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?

I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.


----------



## beagle9

Ray From Cleveland said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
Click to expand...

 The priorities should have been in this order.

1. Drain the swamp

2. Investigate the investigators if we're set up.

3. Stop the insane leftist agenda on this country.

4. Stop sanctuary cities immediately. Take quick actions using the laws already on the books. Lock up any official breaking those laws.

5. Assess the border for a comprehensive reform that includes taking actions to stop illegal crossings, tunnelling, violations of employers hiring illegals without proper authorization.  They would then have them bused across the border at legal checkpoints for temporary work  status in country. Apply technology in areas of need along with man power to stop the crossings.  Create a repatriotation program in concert with the Mexican government for the illegal crossers to be accepted back to Mexico, and a promise by the Mexican government that they will create a program that monitors those who are accepted back for 2 years in order to assure us that they won't be crossing again.

6. Process all illegals here, and if they currently are holding a job, and have been on that job for 1 year, then they are given a work pass that allows them to remain in country while working on that same job.  If the job changes, then the employer must notify the feds, and the foriegn worker is to report to the nearest social security office in order to get his or her status upgraded and changed to the new employer for which they are transferring to.

Note - All Military matters here and abroad are intertwined with all of the above, and of course holds no specific order in the President's administering of such matters as is needed.


----------



## Camp

Why did Liar in Chief Trump lie about the new budget funding his dopey wall? Why do the sucker Trump supporters not acknowledge that he tricked and lied to them again?


----------



## beagle9

Camp said:


> Why did Liar in Chief Trump lie about the new budget funding his dopey wall? Why do the sucker Trump supporters not acknowledge that he tricked and lied to them again?


. May not have been a trick, but more of a realization of exactly what can be done within a polarized nation fighting with each other constantly.  Imagine what could be done if the nation wasn't so polarized, and could sit down at the table to work things out ?  Trump if listening to the people, and the people were better unified, then great things could happen. Pipe dream ??  Might be after the radicalization of this country has gone way to far now.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

dblack said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
Click to expand...


Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.


----------



## dblack

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.
Click to expand...

Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it. 



> Commie  Care  was radical  change.



Yep. Radical change, pushed through with a slim majority. How well did that work out?


----------



## dannyboys

The day before yesterday I was giving the REPs a fifty fifty chance of holding Congress. After Trump signed the budget I give the REPs a five percent chance of holding the Congress.
And a ten percent chance of holding the Senate. 
I now give Trump a ten percent chance of being reelected. That's IF he at least starts building the wall.
I'm VERY disappointed in Trump.
He got rolled by the DEMs.
In September the DEMs WILL happily shut down the government until the midterms. 100% guaranteed. 
The REPs had it all and they fucked up!


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

dblack said:


> Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it.



What's radical about  it?  We have fences up already.


----------



## beagle9

dblack said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep. Radical change, pushed through with a slim majority. How well did that work out?
Click to expand...

. The belief that Trump was thinking he could WALL off the nation from Mexico with a physical wall (by the Demon-crats interpreting of this in that way), uh is radical thinking on the Demon-crats part, but if they could sell it as a talking point in the overall discussion, then of course the political attacks are enhanced by any means nessesary by those crats right ??

Has Trump been set up, and is he constantly being set up ??


----------



## dblack

beagle9 said:


> Has Trump been set up, and is he constantly being set up ??



Duh?


----------



## beagle9

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's radical about  it?  We have fences up already.
Click to expand...

. Heck the actual drawing of a line of separation is a wall.  It's called a border line for a reason, and laws to enforce the line is there for a reason. Some nations will shoot, and ask questions later if the line is crossed. Others take crossers into custody for interrogation purposes for national security, and then deport them. A nation without borders is no nation at all, and that leads to complete chaos over time.


----------



## Mr Natural

dannyboys said:


> The REPs had it all and they fucked up!




It's what they do best.


----------



## dblack

beagle9 said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's radical about  it?  We have fences up already.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . Heck the actual drawing of a line of separation is a wall.  It's called a border line for a reason, and laws to enforce the line is there for a reason. Some nations will shoot, and ask questions later if the line is crossed. Others take crossers into custody for interrogation purposes for national security, and then deport them. A nation without borders is no nation at all, and that leads to complete chaos over time.
Click to expand...


But can you do a triple toe loop?


----------



## beagle9

dblack said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's radical about  it?  We have fences up already.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . Heck the actual drawing of a line of separation is a wall.  It's called a border line for a reason, and laws to enforce the line is there for a reason. Some nations will shoot, and ask questions later if the line is crossed. Others take crossers into custody for interrogation purposes for national security, and then deport them. A nation without borders is no nation at all, and that leads to complete chaos over time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> But can you do a triple toe loop?
Click to expand...

. Ran out of something to say ?


----------



## kaz

Progressive Democrat said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just let it go Trump is a conartist the wall will never be built.
Click to expand...


Trump Derangement Syndrome is a curious thing


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

beagle9 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . The wall of bigotry, fear, and hate eh ?? Go pedal your bullcrap to the fools who will listen, because most Americans know the game with these cheap labor illegals, and these no background checked criminal aliens now being protected in these so called sanctuary cities.
Click to expand...

The ‘wall’ is a symbol of bigotry and hate common to most on the right, representing the unwarranted fear conservatives have of change and diversity, having nothing to do with ‘securing’ the border or ‘facilitating’ public safety.

Criminals seeking to enter the country will find the means to do so, unimpeded by a ‘wall,’ rendering a ‘wall’ a waste of time, money, and resources.


----------



## Camp

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
Click to expand...

You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Camp said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
Click to expand...


Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year. 

I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Criminals seeking to enter the country will find the means to do so, unimpeded by a ‘wall,’ rendering a ‘wall’ a waste of time, money, and resources.



Yet your famous leftists  and  Hollywood types live  behind those very same walls and fences.  Better tell them they wasted their  money.


----------



## dblack

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
Click to expand...


I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?


----------



## beagle9

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . The wall of bigotry, fear, and hate eh ?? Go pedal your bullcrap to the fools who will listen, because most Americans know the game with these cheap labor illegals, and these no background checked criminal aliens now being protected in these so called sanctuary cities.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The ‘wall’ is a symbol of bigotry and hate common to most on the right, representing the unwarranted fear conservatives have of change and diversity, having nothing to do with ‘securing’ the border or ‘facilitating’ public safety.
> 
> Criminals seeking to enter the country will find the means to do so, unimpeded by a ‘wall,’ rendering a ‘wall’ a waste of time, money, and resources.
Click to expand...

 You use the tired old bullcrap play about the word bigotry and hate as if it applies to everything when it don't, and people see through the bullcrap now.  There is such things as security, character, safety, unity, sovereignty, and culture you know, and that trumps your blanket use of those words in order to narrow the field for political reasons.


----------



## Camp

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did Trump come up with the WALL talk on his own during the campaign or did he have specific groups feeding him his talking points about illegals and the wall to stop them ?? If it was a group or groups, then where are they now ??
> 
> Who were Trumps handlers, and are they even in his circle any longer ??
> 
> You know alot of people/supporters got on board with the big talk just because they knew that if he could make the Demon-crats uncomfortable for even a split second, then they would cheer him on no matter how outrageous the rehtoric was. You had the build that Wall crowd, the lock her up crowd, the support the middle class crowd, the reformer for everything wrong crowd, and it all resonated big time.
> 
> Wasn't Trump led by the birther crowd to challenge the legitamacy of Obamas birth certificate ?  What happened to that crowd ??
> 
> Otherwise, is Trump really just a mouthpiece for all those who lost their voice in America, and a heroe to their causes even if some of their causes may have been a little off in their accuracy on what their overall problems actually we're or is it that Trump is being taken away from them by a far more powerful group be it the establishment crowd in Washington DC ??  Are we losing to the establishment crowd, the deep state crowd or just the status quoe crowd who just can't stand any shake up to the game in which they have created over many years now ??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
Click to expand...

Your opinion about a wall doing the job is just an opinion, and an opinion disputed by empirical data. What you are claiming is that smuggling can be controlled by just building a barricade. Thousands of years of history proves you wrong. Smugglers will find a way around any wall or barricade you build.


----------



## beagle9

dblack said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
Click to expand...

. Agree with the consensus being important, but do you really think that Demon-crats understand that word anymore ?


----------



## beagle9

Camp said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your opinion about a wall doing the job is just an opinion, and an opinion disputed by empirical data. What you are claiming is that smuggling can be controlled by just building a barricade. Thousands of years of history proves you wrong. Smugglers will find a way around any wall or barricade you build.
Click to expand...

 .The wall is a bust I think, but stay tuned for some serious measures to be taken in order to stop the problem of illegal immigration to this country. Sanctuary cities will be ending, and tougher measures all around will become the norm in order to set examples that we are no longer the fool's that we all have been for the American traitorous business community in this country.


----------



## dblack

beagle9 said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . Agree with the consensus being important, but do you really think that Demon-crats understand that word anymore ?
Click to expand...


Irony much?

I think lots of people do. But we're pulled to partisan extremes by a voting system that's broken.


----------



## Camp

beagle9 said:


> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your opinion about a wall doing the job is just an opinion, and an opinion disputed by empirical data. What you are claiming is that smuggling can be controlled by just building a barricade. Thousands of years of history proves you wrong. Smugglers will find a way around any wall or barricade you build.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> .The wall is a bust I think, but stay tuned for some serious measures to be taken in order to stop the problem of illegal immigration to this country. Sanctuary cities will be ending, and tougher measures all around will become the norm in order to set examples that we are no longer the fool's that we all have been for the American traitorous business community in this country.
Click to expand...

The answer is inexpensive and not complicated. You said it. Business community. Hold them accountable and the problem will quickly solve itself.


----------



## danielpalos

beagle9 said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . The wall of bigotry, fear, and hate eh ?? Go pedal your bullcrap to the fools who will listen, because most Americans know the game with these cheap labor illegals, and these no background checked criminal aliens now being protected in these so called sanctuary cities.
Click to expand...

a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage!


----------



## danielpalos

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Walling off our nation is radical change. And there's no consensus behind it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's radical about  it?  We have fences up already.
Click to expand...

just right wing, "feel good" policies.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Camp said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your opinion about a wall doing the job is just an opinion, and an opinion disputed by empirical data. What you are claiming is that smuggling can be controlled by just building a barricade. Thousands of years of history proves you wrong. Smugglers will find a way around any wall or barricade you build.
Click to expand...


Some  may, but many, many less  than there would be with no wall. 

Chances are rare that you will be  killed by a drunk driver.  Why?  Because we have laws against drunk drivers.  That  doesn't' mean you are guaranteed never to get hit by one,  but your odds would increase tenfold or more if we didn't have those laws. 

Does the lock on your door and the right to own a gun guarantee you will never be a victim of home invasion?  Of course not, but imagine if we lived in a society where locking your door and owning a gun was illegal.  

I  never said a wall will totally end illegals, but the border agencies all support Trump in  building  the wall.  Why would that be if they knew it wouldn't' help the problem?  

Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

beagle9 said:


> You use the tired old bullcrap play about the word bigotry and hate as if it applies to everything when it don't, and people see through the bullcrap now. There is such things as security, character, safety, unity, sovereignty, and culture you know, and that trumps your blanket use of those words in order to narrow the field for political reasons.



Liberals have this fantasy that reverse psychology works on us on the right.  They have no  idea that we see right through their attempted guilt trip.  Here is how a Democrat  thinks it's supposed to work:

_I want to see us build a wall  to secure our country. 

No, you want  to build  a wall because you  are  a racist and a bigot! 

Well gee, I didn't think anybody thought  of me  that way.  I don't  want  to be called or known as a bigot!  So  please, please don't call  me  that anymore.  I won't support  a wall for any reason.  _

In  their little  minds, they think this is actually going to happen.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

dblack said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump was smart enough (or  I thought he was) to appeal  to voters who found  the immigration issue the  most  serious of all.  He understood that other candidates were just dancing around the problem with their idiotic talk about reform.   But  we did"t ask for any reform and Trump knew it.
> 
> IMO, he now not only lost  reelection, but the Congress and  Senate to boot.  Many from his largest  group of supporters won't come out to vote Republican any longer.  People are pissed.
> 
> When he first signed a budget, he didn't get the wall  and promised us "next time."  Well......next time is here, and instead of a wall, we got funding for PP, funding  for sanctuary cities, funding for liberal media outlets, and some additional military spending.  We  only got one  thing on our list, and that one thing was  not at the top of our list.
> 
> So the  libs were  right all along.  Trump won't come through for us either.  Now  the  country will continue it's cesspool into demise as we keep racking  up debt  and getting very little  in  return.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
Click to expand...


Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine: 

Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.   

We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.


----------



## dblack

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Trump realized that pushing through radical change, that's only supported by a narrow majority of the country, is counter-productive and harmful to the country (even if you approve in the short term)?
> 
> I'm just kidding of course. Trump realizes nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine:
> 
> Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.
> 
> We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.
Click to expand...


Do you think you could get real consensus for your plan?


----------



## Cellblock2429

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


/——/ There is a gofundme account on Facebook to pay for the wall on the southern border. I’m not sure if I can post a link on USMB without violating some obscure rule but it’s easy to find.


----------



## beagle9

danielpalos said:


> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . The wall of bigotry, fear, and hate eh ?? Go pedal your bullcrap to the fools who will listen, because most Americans know the game with these cheap labor illegals, and these no background checked criminal aliens now being protected in these so called sanctuary cities.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage!
Click to expand...

 .No socialism... Employees are all different, and they are to be paid according to their contributions to the job. Yes a minimum wage should be required under state guidelines, but the rate should be set by the cost of living standard of the state in each case. The wage should be a start out wage, but not a long term wage for an employee.  A percentage of profit sharing coupled with a ladder wage system in each company should exist beyond the minimum wage.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

dblack said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stopping illegal   immigration is radical  change?  No, that's not radical change.   Commie  Care  was radical  change.
> 
> 
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine:
> 
> Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.
> 
> We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think you could get real consensus for your plan?
Click to expand...


Not at all.  That's the problem with politics today.  Nobody has a set to take a stand.  

Even  if they did, some commie lib judge would  put a stop to it one way or another.  That's what they've been doing with all of the other Trump issues the minority couldn't stop.


----------



## dblack

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine:
> 
> Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.
> 
> We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think you could get real consensus for your plan?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all.  That's the problem with politics today.  Nobody has a set to take a stand. .
Click to expand...


Right. So why not focus on what you can find consensus on?


----------



## TroglocratsRdumb

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
Click to expand...


Being for open borders is racist


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

dblack said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine:
> 
> Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.
> 
> We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think you could get real consensus for your plan?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all.  That's the problem with politics today.  Nobody has a set to take a stand. .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right. So why not focus on what you can find consensus on?
Click to expand...


The only consensus would be  doing  everything the  Democrat  way.  I'm  sorry, but some  things are  worth fighting  for.  I'm  sick of  Republicans caving  all the  time.  When was the  last  time  Democrats caved  on  any major issue?


----------



## danielpalos

beagle9 said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beagle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . The wall of bigotry, fear, and hate eh ?? Go pedal your bullcrap to the fools who will listen, because most Americans know the game with these cheap labor illegals, and these no background checked criminal aliens now being protected in these so called sanctuary cities.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> .No socialism... Employees are all different, and they are to be paid according to their contributions to the job. Yes a minimum wage should be required under state guidelines, but the rate should be set by the cost of living standard of the state in each case. The wage should be a start out wage, but not a long term wage for an employee.  A percentage of profit sharing coupled with a ladder wage system in each company should exist beyond the minimum wage.
Click to expand...

you can do that anywhere above the minimum wage, dear.


----------



## danielpalos

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Camp said:
> 
> 
> 
> You may be confusing stopping illegal immigration by building a wall on the southern border. Many thoughtful citizens in favor of effective and efficient immigration control consider the wall to be a huge waste of money that will not solve the problem. Worse, it is seen as an issue of ego for Trump.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Walls would do the job.  Much of our opioid products come from that southern border and  over 60,000  Americans are dying from them every year.
> 
> I mean really.........if the Democrats thought the wall would be an utter failure, WTF would they be fighting so hard against it?  If they thought it would destroy  the Republicans, they would even help them get that wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine:
> 
> Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.
> 
> We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think you could get real consensus for your plan?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all.  That's the problem with politics today.  Nobody has a set to take a stand.
> 
> Even  if they did, some commie lib judge would  put a stop to it one way or another.  That's what they've been doing with all of the other Trump issues the minority couldn't stop.
Click to expand...

what a Difference, a Constitution makes.


----------



## danielpalos

TroglocratsRdumb said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does the right wing, have no Faith in Capitalism?
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly not.
> 
> They also have no faith in fiscal responsibility – the ‘wall’ of bigotry, fear, and hate is the epitome of wasteful government spending.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Being for open borders is racist
Click to expand...

All foreign nationals in the US should have a federal id.


----------



## danielpalos

Ray From Cleveland said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dblack said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't care about the success of Democrats or Republicans. But if you jackboots build a wall, I'll vote for the first candidate promising to tear it down. So will a lot of other people. And it will all have been a waste. Why not find a solution that has real consensus?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because nobody has the guts to offer a plan that would provide  real results.  Let me tell you mine:
> 
> Anybody caught  in the US illegally after May 1,  2018 will be subject to a minimum 5 year prison sentence.   It doesn't matter if you overstayed your VISA by one day, snuck across the border, or  were brought here by your parents.  When we catch you, you go to prison.
> 
> We would  go from 11  million illegals to about 500 at  most.  And we  wouldn't need  a  wall because everybody would be too scared to come here  illegally.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think you could get real consensus for your plan?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not at all.  That's the problem with politics today.  Nobody has a set to take a stand. .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right. So why not focus on what you can find consensus on?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The only consensus would be  doing  everything the  Democrat  way.  I'm  sorry, but some  things are  worth fighting  for.  I'm  sick of  Republicans caving  all the  time.  When was the  last  time  Democrats caved  on  any major issue?
Click to expand...

the right wing has nothing but socialism on a national basis; yet, they proclaim loudly in public venues, their alleged subscription to Capitalism.


----------



## BasicHumanUnit

Well, I wonder if the Right finally realizes there is no salvation....in elections.

None.  Zilch.  Nada.

If you have conservative values, you're on your own.   And the Left wants firearms confiscated and your neck in a noose asap.   They are closer to that than you might think.

This has been a rude awakening and a terrible day for Conservatives and Republicans.  Not to worry, lack of action by the Right guarantees it's gonna get MUCH worse.

I've said it so many times now i'm hoarse.   Politicians and elected officials are never going to stand up for your rights.   That's why the Constitution was written as it was.

All that was required for the Progressive Communists to take America was for so called "Good Americans" to do nothing.  Which is exactly what they did.   Same as Venezuelans.


----------



## beagle9

BasicHumanUnit said:


> Well, I wonder if the Right finally realizes there is no salvation....in elections.
> 
> None.  Zilch.  Nada.
> 
> If you have conservative values, you're on your own.   And the Left wants firearms confiscated and your neck in a noose asap.   They are closer to that than you might think.
> 
> This has been a rude awakening and a terrible day for Conservatives and Republicans.  Not to worry, lack of action by the Right guarantees it's gonna get MUCH worse.
> 
> I've said it so many times now i'm hoarse.   Politicians and elected officials are never going to stand up for your rights.   That's why the Constitution was written as it was.
> 
> All that was required for the Progressive Communists to take America was for so called "Good Americans" to do nothing.  Which is exactly what they did.   Same as Venezuelans.


 .Sad but true, and hopefully the eye opening will come quickly or it's over for this nation.


----------



## PoliticalChic

Decus said:


> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the man who argued against illegal immigration:
Click to expand...




Wellllll.....kinda.....sorta......


 Which party handed out applications for food stamps in Mexico to entice illegal aliens??????


*"Fat And Furious: Obama Pushes Food Stamps In Mexico"*
Fat And Furious: Obama Pushes Food Stamps In Mexico | Investor's Business Daily






And which party stymied immigration courts to smooth the way for illegal immigrants????

*"200,000 deportation cases quietly 'closed' under Obama*
....."administratively closed" without action, a move that left tens of thousands of illegal immigrants free to roam America, sometimes indefinitely, according to a new report.

When added to those cases still pending court action, it brings the backlog of cases to about 800,000, far more than previously known.

In his report, he said the exact number isn't known. "I believe that the Obama administration's use of the practice may have ‘cooked the books' as it relates to the true number of cases that are pending adjudication before the immigration courts."

The Trump administration has taken action to reverse the practice of letting authorities close the cases and is working to reschedule them, he added."
200,000 deportation cases quietly 'closed' under Obama


----------



## danielpalos

Nothing is critical if we can lower tax rates to non critical levels. 

Wartime Tax Rates for our alleged wars on crime, drugs, and terror.


----------



## kaz

LordBrownTrout said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
Click to expand...


I always like the leftists like Pogo who say we don't need a wall because 60% is a minority of illegal aliens.  I guess it's hillbilly math.  I'm only 60% drunk, honey, that's barely drunk at all!!!


----------



## danielpalos

kaz said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I always like the leftists like Pogo who say we don't need a wall because 60% is a minority of illegal aliens.  I guess it's hillbilly math.  I'm only 60% drunk, honey, that's barely drunk at all!!!
Click to expand...

We don't need a wall, because it is merely wasting money.  

All foreign nationals in the US should have a federal id. and be treated like tourists with work authorization.  It is up to them to apply for a green card or citizenship.


----------



## Pogo

kaz said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I always like the leftists like Pogo who say we don't need a wall because 60% is a minority of illegal aliens.  I guess it's hillbilly math.  I'm only 60% drunk, honey, that's barely drunk at all!!!
Click to expand...


Once AGAIN I made no mention of any "60%" of anything.  Not here, not in any other thread.
Once AGAIN -- this is at least three times in a row --- you're planting strawmen in other people's names.

Why are you doing that?

Because you're a dishonest hack who can't deal with what those people actually said.  So you make up your own.

Care to go for four in a row, hack?


----------



## kaz

Pogo said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> I voted third party in every election since 1996, will continue that trend in 2020.
> 
> We do not need a wall, building a wall is moving backwards, not forwards.  Trump wants a wall because he wants a viable, physical monument to his greatness and a wall is the only way he will get one.
> 
> According to Trump himself border crossings are down 80%, and that is without a wall and without a significant increase in the Border Patrol.
> 
> The wall is an expense we do not have the money to pay for and it will just become a bigger and bigger expense each year as the maintenance cost on it grow with time and age of the wall.
> 
> If you wish to control our southern border to keep the evil brown people out there are three easy steps to do it.
> 
> First, use our military for its base purpose, to defend the country.  We have roughly 97,000 troops in Europe.  Bring half of them home and station them along the border and give them the task of protecting the border.
> 
> Second, punish harshly those companies in the US that employ illegal immigrants.   Make an example out of a couple of bigger companies and make it so painful that no other company will take the chance of using illegal immigrants as labor.
> 
> Third, have a real guest worker program so that those industries that do rely on cheaper labor (agricultural comes to mind) have access to those willing to work.
> 
> If you do the 2nd and 3rd thing then the only people trying to sneak across the border are people with ill intent and then they become easy targets for the military guarding the border.
> 
> On a side note, wanting to build a wall to keep the non-whites is about the most anti-libertarian thing I have seen in a long time.   Thank you for dropping the charade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I always like the leftists like Pogo who say we don't need a wall because 60% is a minority of illegal aliens.  I guess it's hillbilly math.  I'm only 60% drunk, honey, that's barely drunk at all!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once AGAIN I made no mention of any "60%" of anything.  Not here, not in any other thread.
> Once AGAIN -- this is at least three times in a row --- you're planting strawmen in other people's names.
> 
> Why are you doing that?
> 
> Because you're a dishonest hack who can't deal with what those people actually said.  So you make up your own.
> 
> Care to go for four in a row, hack?
Click to expand...


You said that the 60% of people who come over the border are a minority of illegal aliens


----------



## The Original Tree

*It will cost $9 Trillion in Government services to absorb the number of Illegal Immigrants in this country right now.  It's far cheaper to deport them and keep them out than to absorb them.  The Wall and using Border Patrol and The National Guard to support them is right now The Cheapest thing we can do.

All those Social Safety Net Dollars should be going to Veteran Citizens, Elderly Citizens, Child & Baby Citizens, and Minority Citizens, and The Our Poor American Citizens.*


----------



## bodecea

kaz said:


> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> How doesn’t the wall pay for itself over time?
> You must be doing different math than we are...would you mind walking us through your arithmetic?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I always like the leftists like Pogo who say we don't need a wall because 60% is a minority of illegal aliens.  I guess it's hillbilly math.  I'm only 60% drunk, honey, that's barely drunk at all!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once AGAIN I made no mention of any "60%" of anything.  Not here, not in any other thread.
> Once AGAIN -- this is at least three times in a row --- you're planting strawmen in other people's names.
> 
> Why are you doing that?
> 
> Because you're a dishonest hack who can't deal with what those people actually said.  So you make up your own.
> 
> Care to go for four in a row, hack?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You said that the 60% of people who come over the border are a minority of illegal aliens
Click to expand...

He did?  Where?


----------



## kaz

bodecea said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pogo said:
> 
> 
> 
> When you spend twenty billion bucks, plus future maintenance which is considerable, on a fantasy wall that ignores the reality of where illicit immigration comes from in the first place and therefore has little effect --- where exactly is your ROI on that?
> 
> Remember the mantra:  "You don't sell products, benefits or solutions ---- you sell FEELINGS".  That's what the wall is.  It's already been sold, and you lot bought it.  The wall isn't an actual wall, it's a fantasy sold to the gullible  And Mexico didn't pay for it -- the rest of us in this country did.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> O spent a trillion on shovel ready jobs that fleeced the taxpayers and loaded his buds pockets.  We got some stimulus signs.  You were down with wasting a trillion and now screaming like a child over 20billion.  Lol.  Go pound sand.  Your concerns fall on deaf ears.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I always like the leftists like Pogo who say we don't need a wall because 60% is a minority of illegal aliens.  I guess it's hillbilly math.  I'm only 60% drunk, honey, that's barely drunk at all!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once AGAIN I made no mention of any "60%" of anything.  Not here, not in any other thread.
> Once AGAIN -- this is at least three times in a row --- you're planting strawmen in other people's names.
> 
> Why are you doing that?
> 
> Because you're a dishonest hack who can't deal with what those people actually said.  So you make up your own.
> 
> Care to go for four in a row, hack?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You said that the 60% of people who come over the border are a minority of illegal aliens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He did?  Where?
Click to expand...


It's in your quote, moron


----------



## danielpalos

The Original Tree said:


> *It will cost $9 Trillion in Government services to absorb the number of Illegal Immigrants in this country right now.  It's far cheaper to deport them and keep them out than to absorb them.  The Wall and using Border Patrol and The National Guard to support them is right now The Cheapest thing we can do.
> 
> All those Social Safety Net Dollars should be going to Veteran Citizens, Elderly Citizens, Child & Baby Citizens, and Minority Citizens, and The Our Poor American Citizens.*


We should be charging for a federal id.  How much money do we need?


----------



## The Original Tree

*All I know is that The President just rolled out a Zero Tolerance Illegal Immigration Policy and it's about time.
Justice Department announces 'zero-tolerance' policy on illegal border crossings*


----------



## The Original Tree

*Thanks Obama!
*
*TB is back and politicians bicker rather than do something -- Here we go again*


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

The Original Tree said:


> *It will cost $9 Trillion in Government services to absorb the number of Illegal Immigrants in this country right now.  It's far cheaper to deport them and keep them out than to absorb them.  The Wall and using Border Patrol and The National Guard to support them is right now The Cheapest thing we can do.
> 
> All those Social Safety Net Dollars should be going to Veteran Citizens, Elderly Citizens, Child & Baby Citizens, and Minority Citizens, and The Our Poor American Citizens.*



I disagree with where the money should go instead, but I  agree on stopping the problem.  All it would take  is a simple  law  passed by Congress  and  signed by Trump:  Anybody caught in this country illegally after May 1st is subject to a minimum five years in prison.  We  will go from  11 million illegals to about  three or four dozen, and  we won't need a wall either.


----------



## Siete

Ray From Cleveland said:


> The Original Tree said:
> 
> 
> 
> *It will cost $9 Trillion in Government services to absorb the number of Illegal Immigrants in this country right now.  It's far cheaper to deport them and keep them out than to absorb them.  The Wall and using Border Patrol and The National Guard to support them is right now The Cheapest thing we can do.
> 
> All those Social Safety Net Dollars should be going to Veteran Citizens, Elderly Citizens, Child & Baby Citizens, and Minority Citizens, and The Our Poor American Citizens.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I disagree with where the money should go instead, but I  agree on stopping the problem.  All it would take  is a simple  law  passed by Congress  and  signed by Trump:  Anybody caught in this country illegally after May 1st is subject to a minimum five years in prison.  We  will go from  11 million illegals to about  three or four dozen, and  we won't need a wall either.
Click to expand...


the 1.6 billion Trump got last week only goes to previously approved fence repair .. read the bill.

SUCKERS !!!!!


----------



## Siete

I almost forgot; 

 AIN'T GONNA BE NO DAMN WALL.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

Siete said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Original Tree said:
> 
> 
> 
> *It will cost $9 Trillion in Government services to absorb the number of Illegal Immigrants in this country right now.  It's far cheaper to deport them and keep them out than to absorb them.  The Wall and using Border Patrol and The National Guard to support them is right now The Cheapest thing we can do.
> 
> All those Social Safety Net Dollars should be going to Veteran Citizens, Elderly Citizens, Child & Baby Citizens, and Minority Citizens, and The Our Poor American Citizens.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I disagree with where the money should go instead, but I  agree on stopping the problem.  All it would take  is a simple  law  passed by Congress  and  signed by Trump:  Anybody caught in this country illegally after May 1st is subject to a minimum five years in prison.  We  will go from  11 million illegals to about  three or four dozen, and  we won't need a wall either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the 1.6 billion Trump got last week only goes to previously approved fence repair .. read the bill.
> 
> SUCKERS !!!!!
Click to expand...


Where did  I  say it  didn't?  Hearing  those  voices in your head?


----------



## danielpalos

The Original Tree said:


> *All I know is that The President just rolled out a Zero Tolerance Illegal Immigration Policy and it's about time.
> Justice Department announces 'zero-tolerance' policy on illegal border crossings*


we need, "zero tolerance" Tax Rates, or it is all talk.


----------



## IsaacNewton

They should build once 20 foot section of the wall and knock it over on it's side so Little Donald has something to ride the stock market to the bottom.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones

Siete said:


> I almost forgot;
> 
> AIN'T GONNA BE NO DAMN WALL.


Conservatives will never give up on their wall of fear, bigotry, and hate.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> I almost forgot;
> 
> AIN'T GONNA BE NO DAMN WALL.
> 
> 
> 
> Conservatives will never give up on their wall of fear, bigotry, and hate.
Click to expand...


Oh.   Are those the  new leftist names for our laws  in this country?


----------



## rightwinger

If Trump builds a wall

We will tear it down when he is gone


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

rightwinger said:


> If Trump builds a wall
> 
> We will tear it down when he is gone



Sounds good.  Explain to the taxpayers why you tore down a 20 billion dollar wall.  Explain that the Democrat  party is now the party of non-Americans.  Explain how they like the idea of drugs  and illegals pouring into this country.  Maybe they can do that after another news report of a MS-13 brutal murder.


----------



## rightwinger

Ray From Cleveland said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Trump builds a wall
> 
> We will tear it down when he is gone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds good.  Explain to the taxpayers why you tore down a 20 billion dollar wall.  Explain that the Democrat  party is now the party of non-Americans.  Explain how they like the idea of drugs  and illegals pouring into this country.  Maybe they can do that after another news report of a MS-13 brutal murder.
Click to expand...


The public doesn’t support the wall

Tear it down....tear it down

Mexico will even pay for it


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

rightwinger said:


> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Trump builds a wall
> 
> We will tear it down when he is gone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds good.  Explain to the taxpayers why you tore down a 20 billion dollar wall.  Explain that the Democrat  party is now the party of non-Americans.  Explain how they like the idea of drugs  and illegals pouring into this country.  Maybe they can do that after another news report of a MS-13 brutal murder.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The public doesn’t support the wall
> 
> Tear it down....tear it down
> 
> Mexico will even pay for it
Click to expand...


Right, just keep listening to the puppet masters.  Trump was elected because  of the wall.  If you really believe the leftist media and the public doesn't approve, just run with that in 2018.


----------



## danielpalos

Ray From Cleveland said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> I almost forgot;
> 
> AIN'T GONNA BE NO DAMN WALL.
> 
> 
> 
> Conservatives will never give up on their wall of fear, bigotry, and hate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh.   Are those the  new leftist names for our laws  in this country?
Click to expand...

applied socialism over applied capitalism, right wingers?


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

TheMoreYouKnow said:


> Voting.    You forgot a section, OP.



It's amazing  how brainwashing  works so well on Democrat constituents.  It's like if the Dems told their followers we were being invaded by martians from  another  planet, most of them would believe it.


----------



## Siete

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Siete said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ray From Cleveland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Original Tree said:
> 
> 
> 
> *It will cost $9 Trillion in Government services to absorb the number of Illegal Immigrants in this country right now.  It's far cheaper to deport them and keep them out than to absorb them.  The Wall and using Border Patrol and The National Guard to support them is right now The Cheapest thing we can do.
> 
> All those Social Safety Net Dollars should be going to Veteran Citizens, Elderly Citizens, Child & Baby Citizens, and Minority Citizens, and The Our Poor American Citizens.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I disagree with where the money should go instead, but I  agree on stopping the problem.  All it would take  is a simple  law  passed by Congress  and  signed by Trump:  Anybody caught in this country illegally after May 1st is subject to a minimum five years in prison.  We  will go from  11 million illegals to about  three or four dozen, and  we won't need a wall either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the 1.6 billion Trump got last week only goes to previously approved fence repair .. read the bill.
> 
> SUCKERS !!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where did  I  say it  didn't?  Hearing  those  voices in your head?
Click to expand...


addressing the board in general Ray. I used your quote to stay on topic.


----------



## PoliticalChic

Decus said:


> BrokeLoser said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decus said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Can you believe* a politician actually said this?:
> 
> _“We all agree on the need to better secure the border and to punish employers who choose to hire illegal immigrants,”
> 
> “We are a generous and welcoming people here in the United States,”
> 
> “*But those who enter the country illegally* and those who employ them *disrespect the rule of law*, and they show disregard for those who are following the law.
> 
> “We simply *cannot allow* people to pour into the United States *undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country.*”
> _
> Go figure.
> _
> ._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the man who argued against illegal immigration:
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know....the same filthy fuck grew the illegal alien population by 2.5 million during his eight year reign of terror.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sad but true.
> 
> .
Click to expand...





But the number is far, far larger.


That's why you always have to 'Press #1 for English.'


----------



## danielpalos

The Engineers of the Guard, should be in Puerto Rico, not our southern border.


----------



## protectionist

danielpalos said:


> The Engineers of the Guard, should be in Puerto Rico, not our southern border.


Puerto Rico should not be part of the US.  They speak a foreign language, are foreign culturally in almost every way, music, food, habits, etc.  And of what way are they any good to us ?


----------



## protectionist

rightwinger said:


> The public doesn’t support the wall
> 
> Tear it down....tear it down
> 
> Mexico will even pay for it


Build it up, Build it up.  Yes, Mexico is going to pay for it.  That's a foregone conclusion.


----------



## danielpalos

protectionist said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Engineers of the Guard, should be in Puerto Rico, not our southern border.
> 
> 
> 
> Puerto Rico should not be part of the US.  They speak a foreign language, are foreign culturally in almost every way, music, food, habits, etc.  And of what way are they any good to us ?
Click to expand...

you willing to give them back to Spain?


----------



## protectionist

danielpalos said:


> you willing to give them back to Spain?


Don't care where they go, as long as it isn't here.  We don't need them using up all our govt $$, every time there's a hurricane going through there.  They are straining Florida right now, and they bankrupted New York City back in the 70s.


----------



## danielpalos

protectionist said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> you willing to give them back to Spain?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't care where they go, as long as it isn't here.  We don't need them using up all our govt $$, every time there's a hurricane going through there.  They are straining Florida right now, and they bankrupted New York City back in the 70s.
Click to expand...

seems more like lousy management; and it is a pretty nice island.


----------



## toobfreak

JoeB131 said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country.
Click to expand...


Are you against the wall facing forward or with your back up against it?  And if your arms aren't up over your head please raise them now.  You see that wall?  It isn't ugly, nor a waste of money, we've already had a wall for umpteen years, the only problem is that the Mexicans won't respect it.  So we will build one they cant get around and make them pay for it out of our trade with them because they won't have any choice and need our trade.  So if anyone's wasting money, it is only the Mexican's.  As to an ugly image, I couldn't give a *flying crap* how it looks to anyone else, if they like it or not.   We can't guard the entire Mexican border.  As to an ugly image, why do we need the wail for that when we have plenty of people like you?


----------



## Harry Dresden

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> “The data show that fences don’t keep migrants out — they just keep them from going home.”
> 
> Donald Trump’s Mexican Border Wall Is a Moronic Idea
> 
> The moronic border ‘wall’ is the idea of a moronic president.


says one of the most moronic posters in this forum.....care to comment jones?....


----------



## Harry Dresden

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Xelor said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C_Clayton_Jones said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.
> 
> 
> 
> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My disdain and dissatisfaction with Trump has only to do with his character, and that's not going to convincingly change for the better between now and 2020.  Build the wall, or don't.  Effect universal peace on Earth and goodwill amongst all mankind.  It matters not.  Donald Trump yet will remain a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Trump is a frightfully dissolute mental midget with the natural grace of an intoxicated beluga whale who is also wrong on the issues – all the more reason to not vote for him.
Click to expand...

you do realize you are the same type of midget ....right jones?....


----------



## danielpalos

toobfreak said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Are you against the wall facing forward or with your back up against it?  And if your arms aren't up over your head please raise them now.  You see that wall?  It isn't ugly, nor a waste of money, we've already had a wall for umpteen years, the only problem is that the Mexicans won't respect it.  So we will build one they cant get around and make them pay for it out of our trade with them because they won't have any choice and need our trade.  So if anyone's wasting money, it is only the Mexican's.  As to an ugly image, I couldn't give a *flying crap* how it looks to anyone else, if they like it or not.   We can't guard the entire Mexican border.  As to an ugly image, why do we need the wail for that when we have plenty of people like you?
Click to expand...

I think the Engineers of the Guard should be deployed to Puerto Rico, to "regulate well, that island".


----------



## kaz

toobfreak said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Are you against the wall facing forward or with your back up against it?  And if your arms aren't up over your head please raise them now.  You see that wall?  It isn't ugly, nor a waste of money, we've already had a wall for umpteen years, the only problem is that the Mexicans won't respect it.  So we will build one they cant get around and make them pay for it out of our trade with them because they won't have any choice and need our trade.  So if anyone's wasting money, it is only the Mexican's.  As to an ugly image, I couldn't give a *flying crap* how it looks to anyone else, if they like it or not.   We can't guard the entire Mexican border.  As to an ugly image, why do we need the wail for that when we have plenty of people like you?
Click to expand...


It's hilarious when a Democrat objects to spending money because "it's a waste of money."  EVERYTHING they spend is a waste of money.  Suddenly it becomes a standard because it isn't a waste of money.  It will work and Joe knows it


----------



## danielpalos

kaz said:


> toobfreak said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us. They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States. Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue. And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We are against the wall because it's a waste of money and it presents an ugly image of our country.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Are you against the wall facing forward or with your back up against it?  And if your arms aren't up over your head please raise them now.  You see that wall?  It isn't ugly, nor a waste of money, we've already had a wall for umpteen years, the only problem is that the Mexicans won't respect it.  So we will build one they cant get around and make them pay for it out of our trade with them because they won't have any choice and need our trade.  So if anyone's wasting money, it is only the Mexican's.  As to an ugly image, I couldn't give a *flying crap* how it looks to anyone else, if they like it or not.   We can't guard the entire Mexican border.  As to an ugly image, why do we need the wail for that when we have plenty of people like you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's hilarious when a Democrat objects to spending money because "it's a waste of money."  EVERYTHING they spend is a waste of money.  Suddenly it becomes a standard because it isn't a waste of money.  It will work and Joe knows it
Click to expand...

most right wing legislation is help up in the Courts.

What a difference the left wing would have made, merely by having some Constitutional clue and some Constitutional Cause.


----------



## protectionist

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> “The data show that fences don’t keep migrants out — they just keep them from going home.”
> 
> Donald Trump’s Mexican Border Wall Is a Moronic Idea
> 
> The moronic border ‘wall’ is the idea of a moronic president.


Oh_ "the data"_, huh ?  LOL.  And what "data" is that.   Some dopey liberal think tank, or college professor loon ?

The FACT is, there are dozens of walls in countries all over the world, and they are working just fine.


----------



## protectionist

kaz said:


> It's hilarious when a Democrat objects to spending money because "it's a waste of money."  EVERYTHING they spend is a waste of money.  Suddenly it becomes a standard because it isn't a waste of money.  It will work and Joe knows it


Actually it will help to SAVE money, keeping out those who arrive illegally, birth anchor babies, and help themselves, and their large families to a lifetime of US taxpayer $$$$$$$$$$$$$


----------



## Vandalshandle

protectionist said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> you willing to give them back to Spain?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't care where they go, as long as it isn't here.  We don't need them using up all our govt $$, every time there's a hurricane going through there.  They are straining Florida right now, and they bankrupted New York City back in the 70s.
Click to expand...


Your whole philosophy of life is pretty much an endless exercise in defining those peoples who you want to demonize as being your enemy, is't it, Prot.?


----------



## Nova78

"Siete, post: 19548175, member: 49106"]aint gonna be no goddamn wall ... deal with it dipshits.


*It’s the perfect slogan for crybaby, liberal snowflakes: “MAMA: Making America Miserable Again.”

There will be a wall *


----------



## protectionist

Vandalshandle said:


> Your whole philosophy of life is pretty much an endless exercise in defining those peoples who you want to demonize as being your enemy, is't it, Prot.?


No it's not.  So what's your thing ? Demonizing posters in USMB ?


----------



## danielpalos

protectionist said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's hilarious when a Democrat objects to spending money because "it's a waste of money."  EVERYTHING they spend is a waste of money.  Suddenly it becomes a standard because it isn't a waste of money.  It will work and Joe knows it
> 
> 
> 
> Actually it will help to SAVE money, keeping out those who arrive illegally, birth anchor babies, and help themselves, and their large families to a lifetime of US taxpayer $$$$$$$$$$$$$
Click to expand...

better public polices could be making money, not losing money from foreign nationals.


----------



## Vandalshandle

protectionist said:


> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your whole philosophy of life is pretty much an endless exercise in defining those peoples who you want to demonize as being your enemy, is't it, Prot.?
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not.  So what's your thing ? Demonizing posters in USMB ?
Click to expand...


No need to Prot. Your posts define you.You remind me very much of someone I used to know who was basically a failure,  and he made it his lifelong job to blame it on Latinos, Muslims, Atheists, democrats, gays,blacks, welfare recipients, "gun grabbers", Chinese,  third world Asians, and even the British.


----------



## protectionist

danielpalos said:


> better public polices could be making money, not losing money from foreign nationals.


Well if the concept of allowing outsiders to come in and take away our wealth, doesn't bother you so much, then now how about if I come to your house, and take away YOUR wealth (TV set, computer, DVD player will do for starters).   Then, you _"could be making money"_ to make up for it, right ?


----------



## protectionist

Vandalshandle said:


> No need to Prot. Your posts define you.You remind me very much of someone I used to know who was basically a failure,  and he made it his lifelong job to blame it on Latinos, Muslims, Atheists, democrats, gays,blacks, welfare recipients, "gun grabbers", Chinese,  third world Asians, and even the British.



1.  I'm not a failure.

2.  I'm Latino myself.

3.  When I blame, there's a good reason, which I have often stated clearly.

And yes, my posts do indeed define me.  As a normal, heterosexual, Republican, gun-owner with CCW permit, American, nationalist conservative.  All of which add up to a very healthy individual.


----------



## danielpalos

protectionist said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> 
> better public polices could be making money, not losing money from foreign nationals.
> 
> 
> 
> Well if the concept of allowing outsiders to come in and take away our wealth, doesn't bother you so much, then now how about if I come to your house, and take away YOUR wealth (TV set, computer, DVD player will do for starters).   Then, you _"could be making money"_ to make up for it, right ?
Click to expand...

don't really really believe in Capitalism, right wingers?  interfere too much with your socialism on a national basis.


----------



## protectionist

danielpalos said:


> don't really really believe in Capitalism, right wingers?  interfere too much with your socialism on a national basis.


What prompts you to ask ?

Note:  Capitalism isn't the same as imperialism.


----------



## bodecea

How's that wall coming along with Mexico paying for it?


----------



## protectionist

bodecea said:


> How's that wall coming along with Mexico paying for it?


Why don't you look it up ? Google it.  They're in the set up stages.


----------



## candycorn

emilynghiem said:


> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz
> Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
> why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
> border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.
> 
> Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
> similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.
> 
> Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
> to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
> an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
> have a legal track for claiming residency.
> 
> From there, just like other international school programs, students
> or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
> work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
> system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.
> 
> As for how to finance all this construction and development,
> as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
> restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
> plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
> home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.
> 
> So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
> amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
> costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
> And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
> of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
> of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
> endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
> status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.
Click to expand...

He's only built like 5 miles of new wall in 4 years.  Massive failure to follow through on a campaign promise.

Good to see he has abandoned it though.


----------



## kaz

candycorn said:


> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz
> Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
> why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
> border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.
> 
> Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
> similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.
> 
> Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
> to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
> an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
> have a legal track for claiming residency.
> 
> From there, just like other international school programs, students
> or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
> work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
> system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.
> 
> As for how to finance all this construction and development,
> as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
> restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
> plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
> home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.
> 
> So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
> amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
> costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
> And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
> of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
> of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
> endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
> status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He's only built like 5 miles of new wall in 4 years.  Massive failure to follow through on a campaign promise.
> 
> Good to see he has abandoned it though.
Click to expand...


Gotta keep that Democrat voter pipeline flowing, huh?


----------



## Cellblock2429

candycorn said:


> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Golfing Gator said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> And we have millions of unemployed who won't do those jobs as long as wages are artificially driven down by illegal aliens who will work for low wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Three problems with your statement.
> 
> First, most of those unemployed do not live where the labor is needed.
> 
> Second, the wages are not artificially driven down, they are set by the companies doing the hiring. And you have no plan or desire to go after them so it will never stop, wall or no wall.
> 
> Third, the American people would not stand for the price of their producing tripling due to extra labor cost, there would be riots in the streets if that happened.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mexicans come work for several months in fields.  Why wouldn't other people do that if there were better wages?  Work a few months and go home.  And there are lots of local jobs mowing lawns, cleaning houses, baby sitting everywhere that poor people can use to get started on but won't when wages are artificially low and they get free money for not working.
> 
> Normal people: Teach someone to fish and they can eat for life
> 
> Democrats:  Give them a fish and you have a voter for life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dear kaz
> Since there are an est 12-20 million Mexican Nationals living on US soil,
> why not have Trump negotiate with Mexico to set aside LAND on THEIR side of the
> border for these Nationals to claim as Mexican citizens.
> 
> Give them the same ownership of property and programs they build there,
> similar to settlers colonizing Texas by giving land grants for them to work.
> 
> Once schools are built, to provide campus housing jobs and services
> to support self-governing communities and populations, this creates
> an enrollment system for people who want to comply with authority and
> have a legal track for claiming residency.
> 
> From there, just like other international school programs, students
> or workers registered with a university can apply to "transfer" and
> work or study in other cities, and it's still under a supervised managed
> system that the sponsoring schools is responsible for.
> 
> As for how to finance all this construction and development,
> as Trump said, Americans are owed billions if not trillions in
> restitution from crime committed by drug and human trafficking,
> plus rapes and murders and other crimes such as drunk driving,
> home invasions, gang and drug related robberies, fraud, etc.
> 
> So by assessing the total costs of restitution, and putting that
> amount in a bank fund similar to the Federal Reserve, the
> costs can be held as the responsibility of wrongdoers.
> And anyone who works off or pays restitution on behalf
> of these debts should be able to claim shares in ownership
> of the property or programs (similar to grantors giving to
> endowments to expand universities) and/or earn their
> status back in society if they are responsible for debts or damages themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He's only built like 5 miles of new wall in 4 years.  Massive failure to follow through on a campaign promise.
> 
> Good to see he has abandoned it though.
Click to expand...

/——/ Get your facts straight Fact check: Trump administration has built more border wall than meme claims


----------



## LoneLaugher

If that asshole had built that fucking wall, he be YELLING ABOUT IT every fucking minute. 

He thinks you are rubes, but he gives you some credit. He knows that he, the great builder, has failed to build that wall. 

Idiots


----------



## Seawytch

kaz said:


> Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.


Links to the voters of these states being “illegal”?


----------



## protectionist

candycorn said:


> He's only built like 5 miles of new wall in 4 years.  Massive failure to follow through on a campaign promise.
> 
> Good to see he has abandoned it though.


You say Trump has built 5 miles of new wall (with no source-link). So much for any credibility you might have ever had in this forum. Zap!

Trump, this week, said he's built over 300 miles. He's right.  The 5 miles of "new" wall claim is a deception from leftist media.  It refers to THEIR DEFINITION of _"new wall"_ built where there was none before - but so what ? The hundreds of miles of wall built by Trump where there was some kind of barrier already, is still good work, and could just as easily be called "new wall", because it is just that.  And it replaces barriers as pathetic as a 3 foot tall, flimsy, barbed wire fence, easily cut with wire cutter, or a  7 foot chain link fence, like the kind I used to climb over to retrieve a baseball in my old schoolyard.

Well, I suppose if we all were to restrict ourselves to the leftist media's definition of _"new wall"_, we'd all claiming the same thing they are, but were not fooled by that, because OUR DEFINITION (and the Border Patrol's) of _"new wall"_ is all the new wall (over 341 miles of it, that Trump has built which is 30 feet tall, and which I would hesitate to try climbing over now, or when I was a kid).  Most Mexican could not get over this wall. Women, children, overweight men. Forget it.  Only the very tall & skinny, and in top shape young men could even have a shot at getting over this wall, and since most Mexican men are short, that leaves maybe 10% of migrants (if that many) who could possibly ever get over this new wall, and it would take them a long time to do it, giving the Border Patrol lots of times to catch up with them before the get to the American side (in one piece)

And hey, what happened to my (and Obama's) idea of a moat on the American side, with hungry alligators waiting for the climbers to come down ? Plenty of them here in Florida, we're willing to get rid of, free of charge.   




 




On August 7, Mark Morgan, Acting Commissioner of Customs and Border Protection (CBP), said construction of the border wall continues on a daily basis, with hundreds of miles projected to be completed by year’s end.

_“The United States Army Corps of Engineers and CBP are actually moving faster than ever,”_ Morgan said. _“The last few months … we’re putting more wall system in place every single day than we have before.”_ 

He went on to say: _"We’re now up to 265 miles — I’ve probably got to check right now, we probably added a mile or two since I put this down in my talking points. And we remain confident by the end of this year, we’ve been saying for a very long time, even though we’ve had a lot of naysayers out there, by end of this year, we’re going to have 450 miles of new border wall system in the ground, and America will be safer because of it." _









						Border Chief: Wall Construction Ongoing, Stopping Illegals and Virus
					

Mark Morgan, CEO and Commissioner of CPB, said the southern border wall stops illegal immigration and the spread of coronavirus.




					www.breitbart.com
				








__





						Border Wall System
					

Securing America's Borders



					www.cbp.gov


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

protectionist said:


> You say Trump has built 5 miles of new wall (with no source-link).
> 
> Trump, this week, said he's built 300 miles.
> 
> On August 7, Mark Morgan, Acting Commissioner of Customs and Border Protection (CBP), said construction of the border wall continues on a daily basis, with hundreds of miles projected to be completed by year’s end.



Much of it is not adding walls to where none existed, but replacing walls that were easily compromised. I don't know why it's an issue.  If the old walls weren't worth a crap, then replacing them does the same thing as adding additional walls which is to keep people out.


----------



## protectionist

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Much of it is not adding walls to where none existed, but replacing walls that were easily compromised. I don't know why it's an issue.  If the old walls weren't worth a crap, then replacing them does the same thing as adding additional walls which is to keep people out.


That's what I just said, but thanks for the support. Leftist con jobbing needs to be exposed repeatedly.


----------



## danielpalos

They have HomeDepot in Mexico; buy American ladders!


----------



## Cellblock2429

danielpalos said:


> They have HomeDepot in Mexico; buy American ladders!


/----/ Hoh do they get down?


----------



## lennypartiv

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Building a ‘wall’ is among the most ignorant, idiotic manifestation of rightwing bigotry and hate, in addition to being a colossal waste of time and money.


Building the border wall makes a lot more sense than left wing boondoggles like social security and medicare.


----------



## candycorn

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


How'd it go?


----------



## lennypartiv

candycorn said:


> How'd it go?


Trump moved money around to get the wall built.  We need to vote for him in 2024 so he can finish the wall.


----------



## lennypartiv

Siete said:


> I almost forgot;
> AIN'T GONNA BE NO DAMN WALL.


And the libs are going to let thousands of Afghan refugees into America.  They'll do anything for a future Dem voter.


----------



## rightwinger

lennypartiv said:


> And the libs are going to let thousands of Afghan refugees into America.  They'll do anything for a future Dem voter.


Gotta laugh at Conservatives who criticize Biden for leaving Afghan allies behind and then scream..
Don’t bring them here!


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

rightwinger said:


> Gotta laugh at Conservatives who criticize Biden for leaving Afghan allies behind and then scream..
> Don’t bring them here!



We are for our allies that helped our military, but that's not what Dementia is shipping to our country.  They had to hire interpreters to talk to these people when they got here.  Why would we need interpreters to interpret the interpreters that were in Afghanistan?


----------



## rightwinger

Ray From Cleveland said:


> We are for our allies that helped our military, but that's not what Dementia is shipping to our country.  They had to hire interpreters to talk to these people when they got here.  Why would we need interpreters to interpret the interpreters that were in Afghanistan?


Are interpreters the only Afghans that helped us?


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

lennypartiv said:


> And the libs are going to let thousands of Afghan refugees into America. They'll do anything for a future Dem voter.



The number one mission for the Communists are to wipe out the white race for the first time in US history.  Once they get rid of us politically, they will have a sinlge-party country forever, which of course will quickly slip to Socialism and not far down the road, pure Communism.  

The Communists said many years ago they will take over this country, but do so without one bullet being fired.  They will take over from within, and that's what we are experiencing unfortunately.  

I didn't check it out yet, but according to Tucker Carlson, the commies are not sending these refugees to left-wing sanctuary cities and states, they are shipping them to swing states so they will no longer be swing states, and instead, turn them to blue states.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

rightwinger said:


> Are interpreters the only Afghans that helped us?



Not sure, but out of the thousands that were already shipped here, you would think a few hundred would be, wouldn't you?


----------



## rightwinger

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Not sure, but out of the thousands that were already shipped here, you would think a few hundred would be, wouldn't you?



You do realize there were tens of thousand of Afghan officers, local officials, Afghan civilians who helped the US
Not all were interpreters


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

rightwinger said:


> You do realize there were tens of thousand of Afghan officers, local officials, Afghan civilians who helped the US
> Not all were interpreters



Apparently none were.  What are the chances of that?


----------



## lennypartiv

rightwinger said:


> You do realize there were tens of thousand of Afghan officers, local officials, Afghan civilians who helped the US
> Not all were interpreters


But that doesn't mean they will make good Americans.


----------



## Nova78

rightwinger said:


> Gotta laugh at Conservatives who criticize Biden for leaving Afghan allies behind and then scream..
> Don’t bring them here!


*Maybe you could take in a few at your house? Nah didn't think so, as long as they are not in your backyard , Right?*


----------



## Nova78

lennypartiv said:


> But that doesn't mean they will make good Americans.


They hate Americans and beat their woman.


----------



## rightwinger

Nova78 said:


> *Maybe you could take in a few at your house? Nah didn't think so, as long as they are not in your backyard , Right?*



I would rather have an Afghan refugee as a neighbor than a Trump voter

Afghans never tried to overthrow an election


----------



## protectionist

rightwinger said:


> Gotta laugh at Conservatives who criticize Biden for leaving Afghan allies behind and then scream..
> Don’t bring them here!


Fool.  Nobody is screaming that.  They are screaming >> Don't bring unvetted/undocumented Afghans here (many of whom could be terrorists, murderers, rapists, etc)

 Unfortunately, common sense doesn't figure into the leftist calculation.


----------



## protectionist

rightwinger said:


> I would rather have an Afghan refugee as a neighbor than a Trump voter
> 
> Afghans never tried to overthrow an election


What do you think the Taliban just did ? And Democrats did also in 2020.

 You'll wind up with an Afghan "refugee", who will attempt to blow your brains out (in accordance with his Koran doctrine), and than your other neighbor, a Trump voter (in accordance with his 2nd amendment), will shoot that Afghan jihadist neighbor, and save your life.


----------



## lennypartiv

rightwinger said:


> I would rather have an Afghan refugee as a neighbor than a Trump voter


Yes, I know, your a typical liberal Democrat.


----------



## surada

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.



The wall is a dumb, waste of vanity. We should expand e-verify and fine any employers who hires illegals


----------



## surada

protectionist said:


> What do you think the Taliban just did ? And Democrats did also in 2020.
> 
> You'll wind up with an Afghan "refugee", who will attempt to blow your brains out (in accordance with his Koran doctrine), and than your other neighbor, a Trump voter (in accordance with his 2nd amendment), will shoot that Afghan jihadist neighbor, and save your life.



LOLOL.. You still don't know anything about the Koran.


----------



## protectionist

surada said:


> LOLOL.. You still don't know anything about the Koran.


I know as much as I need to know, to know that it is the most perverted piece of sickening trash that has ever been written, having caused the most human misery in all of history, and continues to do that now.

mass genocide murder (Koran 8:12..9:5..9:123..etc), 
Unconstitutional supremacy (Koran 13:17)
rape (Koran 4:24, 23: 1-6, 70:29-30, 2;223), 
wife-beating (Koran 4:34), 
sex discrimination (Koran 2:282), 
pedophilia (Koran 65:4), 
slavery (Koran 4:3, 4:36, 2:221) etc

And there's some lunacies of Islam that are or are not in the Koran - many having to do with misogyny - in countries like Saudi Arabia, where the laws and regulations are for the most part drawn from edicts in the Koran, and where “religious police” (note that they aren’t called the cultural police) patrol the streets, harassing women for showing their ankles, preventing women from driving, enforcing the laws that prevent women from working or travelling without permission from a male guardian, and oh, don’t forget “beating young girls” to prevent them from escaping a fire because they weren’t wearing proper religious dress.

I'll also guess I know more about Islamization in my little finger than you know in your whole body.  Wanna take my Islamization Quiz ?  Maybe you can top the highest leftist grade up to now. 10% (most got zero).


----------



## surada

protectionist said:


> I know as much as I need to know, to know that it is the most perverted piece of sickening trash that has ever been written, having caused the most human misery in all of history, and continues to do that now.
> 
> Unconstitutional supremacy, mass genocide murder (Koran 8:12..9:5..9:123..etc), rape (Koran 4:24, 23: 1-6, 70:29-30, 2;223), wife-beating Koran 4:34), sex discrimination (Koran 2:282), pedophilia (Koran 65:4), slavery, etc
> 
> And there's some lunacies of Islam that are or are not in the Koran - many having to do with misogyny - in countries like Saudi Arabia, where the laws and regulations are for the most part drawn from edicts in the Koran, and where “religious police” (note that they aren’t called the cultural police) patrol the streets, harassing women for showing their ankles, preventing women from driving, enforcing the laws that prevent women from working or travelling without permission from a male guardian, and oh, don’t forget “beating young girls” to prevent them from escaping a fire because they weren’t wearing proper religious dress.
> 
> I'll also guess I know more about Islamization in my little finger than you know in your whole body.  Wanna take my Islamization Quiz ?  Maybe you can top the highest leftist grade up to now. 10% (most got zero).



The girls were 3 blocks from the school when the religious police showed up not knowing there was a smokey fire in the attic of the school.

Your Islamization quiz is  an ignorant joke that's why you have been laughed off so many forums.

Hahahaa..You don't know squat about the religious police or Saudi Arabia or the Koran.


----------



## kaz

candycorn said:


> How'd it go?



Democrats ended democracy and stole the election


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> Democrats ended democracy and stole the election


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> The wall is a dumb, waste of vanity. We should expand e-verify and fine any employers who hires illegals



Well, yes, the wall is "dumb" if you're a fascist Democrat who doesn't believe in Democracy and you want to win elections and you're willing to do it Soviet Style.

You know, you ...


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


>



dblack:   Democrats are in trouble, run to their defense!     I'm coming, I'm coming!

So you went through all that in November and didn't smell a whiff of fraud as Democrats changed rules, knocked down verification and imported ballots at night.

The dblack rule:  Why am I a Democrat?    Emotion is more important than reason


----------



## surada

kaz said:


> Well, yes, the wall is "dumb" if you're a fascist Democrat who doesn't believe in Democracy and you want to win elections and you're willing to do it Soviet Style.
> 
> You know, you ...



The Saudis manage just fine. Penalizing employers who hire illegals is the only way to go..


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> The Saudis manage just fine. Penalizing employers who hire illegals is the only way to go..



So you're fine with the slavery, rape, drugs and criminals and want to keep out only the ones who want to work.

Sounds like you, fascist


----------



## Resnic

surada said:


> The wall is a dumb, waste of vanity. We should expand e-verify and fine any employers who hires illegals



I agree about verify and fines. My wife is a benefits manager at a production company and she is always having problems with people using either a fake, or more common case, using someone else's identification.

But I think the wall is important also because while it will keep out a small portion of illegals it's also a symbol, a symbol that says "we don't accept illegals" and that is important. As has been proven the last year but the vast amounts of illegals coming in because "they thought they were wanted and it was ok", which is Biden administration fault. Symbols are a powerful thing. It shows illegals we don't want illegals and it strengthens American resolve against illegals just flooding our country.

Like most Americans I am perfectly fine with immigrants that go through the system and become citizens. Most of our ancestors were immigrants that became citizens. But I am wholey and strongly against illegals.


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> dblack:   Democrats are in trouble, run to their defense!     I'm coming, I'm coming!
> 
> So you went through all that in November and didn't smell a whiff of fraud as Democrats changed rules, knocked down verification and imported ballots at night.
> 
> The dblack rule:  Why am I a Democrat?    Emotion is more important than reason




You're a very stupid person, kaz. You've been conned and you either can't admit it, or can't figure it out.


----------



## surada

kaz said:


> So you're fine with the slavery, rape, drugs and criminals and want to keep out only the ones who want to work.
> 
> Sounds like you, fascist



Foreigners have to have a sponsor and an Igama to work. if they overstay they are deported.. 

Most immigrants and sanctuary seekers are not criminals. Look at how many Trump has employed at his hotels and golf resorts.


----------



## surada

Resnic said:


> I agree about verify and fines. My wife is a benefits manager at a production company and she is always having problems with people using either a fake, or more common case, using someone else's identification.
> 
> But I think the wall is important also because while it will keep out a small portion of illegals it's also a symbol, a symbol that says "we don't accept illegals" and that is important. As has been proven the last year but the vast amounts of illegals coming in because "they thought they were wanted and it was ok", which is Biden administration fault. Symbols are a powerful thing. It shows illegals we don't want illegals and it strengthens American resolve against illegals just flooding our country.
> 
> Like most Americans I am perfectly fine with immigrants that go through the system and become citizens. Most of our ancestors were immigrants that became citizens. But I am wholey and strongly against illegals.



2020 crossings were at an historic low because of the pandemic.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

surada said:


> The Saudis manage just fine. Penalizing employers who hire illegals is the only way to go..



Yes but it's not that easy.  First off the authorities would have to prove the the employer knew who they were hiring were illegals.  With the advancement in fake identification that the drug cartels invested in, that's damn near impossible.  Secondly they would have to be found guilty by a judge.  Good luck with that one if it's a Democrat appointed judge.  Next an employer could be sued by denying employment to an illegal based on a discrimination charge.  Who wants to deal with that?  Just hire the SOB.


----------



## dblack

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Yes but it's not that easy.


Indeed. And, much like the abortion prohibition, it would require police state tactics to enforce.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

surada said:


> The wall is a dumb, waste of vanity.



Why would something that's worked successfully here and everywhere around the world be dumb?


----------



## protectionist

surada said:


> The wall is a dumb, waste of vanity. We should expand e-verify and fine any employers who hires illegals


You don't know much about the illegal immigration issue, it appears.  Fining employers as a way to stop illegal immigration has long been abandoned by illegal immigration opponents for the simple reason that it is too difficult to do.

It requires a court verdict of guilt on the employers, who routinely contest the charge based on the "knowingly" clause of immigration law.  It is very difficult for prosecutors to prove that an employer hired illegal aliens, *knowingly*.  The statistical record shows the overwhelming majority (almost all) cases having been dropped, because of insufficient evidence, to the point that it became a worthless waste of time and resources to press such charges.


----------



## surada

protectionist said:


> You don't know much about the illegal immigration issue, it appears.  Fining employers as a way to stop illegal immigration has long been abandoned by illegal immigration opponents for the simple reason that it is too difficult to do.
> 
> It requires a court verdict of guilt on the employers, who routinely contest the charge based on the "knowingly" clause of immigration law.  It is very difficult for prosecutors to prove that an employer hired illegal aliens, *knowingly*.  The statistical record shows the overwhelming majority (almost all) cases having been dropped, because of insufficient evidence, to the point that it became a worthless waste of time and resources to press such charges.



No its not too difficult.. The Employers don't want to pay a thousand dollars a day for each illegal.. They won't hire them.


----------



## protectionist

surada said:


> No its not too difficult.. The Employers don't want to pay a thousand dollars a day for each illegal.. They won't hire them.


Fool:  I just refuted that. Can you read ?


----------



## surada

protectionist said:


> Fool:  I just refuted that. Can you read ?



The Saudis do it very successfully. Maybe they are smarter than Trump.


----------



## dblack

surada said:


> The Saudis do it very successfully. Maybe they are smarter than Trump.


Or they have an authoritarian police state already set up.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

surada said:


> No its not too difficult.. The Employers don't want to pay a thousand dollars a day for each illegal.. They won't hire them.



And how are they supposed to know if they're illegal or not?  Even these fake id's get right past e-verify.


----------



## surada

Ray From Cleveland said:


> And how are they supposed to know if they're illegal or not?  Even these fake id's get right past e-verify.



What sort of fake IDs exactly?


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

surada said:


> What sort of fake IDs exactly?











						Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures
					

High-quality fake IDs are readily available on the internet




					www.techradar.com


----------



## protectionist

surada said:


> The Saudis do it very successfully. Maybe they are smarter than Trump.


They have a different legal system than ours, and not as good.


----------



## surada

protectionist said:


> They have a different legal system than ours, and not as good.



Hahaha.. Why would an illegal go to court?


----------



## protectionist

Ray From Cleveland said:


> Fake ID market bypasses anti-fraud measures
> 
> 
> High-quality fake IDs are readily available on the internet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.techradar.com


In my home area, county photo IDs sell in flea markets for $15 apiece. Been doing it for years.  Ho hum.  Liberals don't know anything.


----------



## protectionist

surada said:


> Hahaha.. Why would an illegal go to court?


Not an illegal, I'm talking about the employers, stupid.


----------



## Ray From Cleveland

surada said:


> Hahaha.. Why would an illegal go to court?



A lot of them don't which is why Dementia's policy of process and release will be a total failure.  They will never show up for their court dates and that gives us millions of illegals to deal with in the future.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> You're a very stupid person, kaz. You've been conned and you either can't admit it, or can't figure it out.




You looked at Democrat fraud after fraud after fraud in November and didn't see a thing ... and you call me stupid.

You're a totally emotional chick.  Politics is driven by emotions for you.

You are definitely not logically a Democrat, yet you worship them unquestioningly.   Leftist and libertarian are complete opposites in every way, yet you endlessly high five and butt slap leftists you have no logical connection with at all.   It's pure emotions for you


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> Foreigners have to have a sponsor and an Igama to work. if they overstay they are deported..
> 
> Most immigrants and sanctuary seekers are not criminals. Look at how many Trump has employed at his hotels and golf resorts.



You repeated what I said the first time.   You want to keep out the people who want to work and allow free access to the United States for criminals.

Democrats do love your criminals


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> You looked at Democrat fraud after fraud after fraud in November and didn't see a thing ... and you call me stupid.



Yes. The election wasn't stolen. You and you're dear leader are just whiners. That's all. Deluded whiners with no convictions or principles worth paying attention to.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> Yes. The election wasn't stolen. You and you're dear leader are just whiners. That's all. Deluded whiners with no convictions or principles worth paying attention to.



Yes, you trust the Democrats, absolutely.  Despite everything they did, all the rules changes, all the removal of accountability, all the middle of the night shenanigans, they did nothing dishonest.  You know deep in your heart the Democrats wanted nothing but a fair election and everything they did was totally trustworthy.   You trust Democrats, absolutely.   They can be totally dishonest and you know they didn't actually do anything wrong.   If there were a Democrat here now you'd high five and butt slap them.

Don't take telemarketing calls.  Seriously


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> Yes, you trust the Democrats, absolutely.  Despite everything they did, all the rules changes, all the removal of accountability, all the middle of the night shenanigans, they did nothing dishonest.  You know deep in your heart the Democrats wanted nothing but a fair election and everything they did was totally trustworthy.   You trust Democrats, absolutely.   They can be totally dishonest and you know they didn't actually do anything wrong.   If there were a Democrat here now you'd high five and butt slap them.
> 
> Don't take telemarketing calls.  Seriously


Listen, I've raised kids. I know how the "but they cheated" bullshit works. Sit down and shut up. It's over. Take your birtherism-qanon-paranoid shitshow and go away.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> Listen, I've raised kids. I know how the "but they cheated" bullshit works. Sit down and shut up. It's over. Take your birtherism-qanon-paranoid shitshow and go away.



With Democrats endlessly changing rules, removing accountability and engaging in endless nighttime shenanigans, that you think you have kids so you reject that as cheating is the shitshow.  I'd like to be your kids, you'll believe anything.

So when Democrats did that, you just sat there every time and said they want better elections, not to cheat.  Wow.   That can only be explained by your just not seeing it.   You only watch CNN, don't you?  Be honest


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> You only watch CNN, don't you?  Be honest


I don't watch TV. Is that what happened to you?


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> I don't watch TV. Is that what happened to you?



I suppose that sounded good to you.

So what is your preferred left wing propaganda source then?    Still reading newspapers?


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> I suppose that sounded good to you.
> 
> So what is your preferred left wing propaganda source then?    Still reading newspapers?


Are you seriously interested in media or are you just trolling me with the attempted "left wing" insult? Not everything is about your partisan left/right nonsense.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> Are you seriously interested in media or are you just trolling me with the attempted "left wing" insult? Not everything is about your partisan left/right nonsense.



I just specifically addressed that.  You're a left winger because for whatever reason you emotionally connect with evil.   You ignore that they disagree with you on every position.   You just personally trust them, they are to you good people and you're on their side no matter what and the first to jump in and defend them.

We just went through this.  How did you miss it?   Are you just stupid?


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> I just specifically addressed that.  You're a left winger because for whatever reason you emotionally connect with evil.   You ignore that they disagree with you on every ....



Maybe one day you'll let go of your weird fixations and we can have a real conversation. But I doubt it.


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> Maybe one day you'll let go of your weird fixations and we can have a real conversation. But I doubt it.



Funny, that's exactly what I was going to say to you!

A libertarian high fiving and butt lapping totalitarian leftists and being the first to run in and defend them whenever they are under attack is some funky shit.   I've never seen it before.  It's really strange.  And then you're so overt about it and yet endlessly deny it.   It's some weird juju


----------



## dblack

kaz said:


> Funny, that's exactly what I was ...


Where is that hand-jerking-off emoji??


----------



## kaz

dblack said:


> Where is that hand-jerking-off emoji??



I think you wore it out


----------



## candycorn

BrokeLoser said:


> That’s why it is paramount that the wall be impenetrable







__





						Trump’s boondoggle wall breached 3,000+ times!
					

$11 billion spent on a wall that can easily be penetrated by cheap power tools found in any hardware store. Over 3,000 times so far, since 2019. Totaling over $2.6 million in repairs, and counting. What a waste of taxpayer money. Has the check from Mexico cleared yet...



					www.usmessageboard.com


----------



## BrokeLoser

candycorn said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump’s boondoggle wall breached 3,000+ times!
> 
> 
> $11 billion spent on a wall that can easily be penetrated by cheap power tools found in any hardware store. Over 3,000 times so far, since 2019. Totaling over $2.6 million in repairs, and counting. What a waste of taxpayer money. Has the check from Mexico cleared yet...
> 
> 
> 
> www.usmessageboard.com


Trumps wall didn’t work?
How do you suppose he had the most secure border in nearly four decades?


----------



## Dragonlady

BrokeLoser said:


> Trumps wall didn’t work?
> How do you suppose he had the most secure border in nearly four decades?



Then why did he declare a "national emergency" at the Southern Border if it was so secure BEFORE he started building it.


----------



## rightwinger

Dragonlady said:


> Then why did he declare a "national emergency" at the Southern Border if it was so secure BEFORE he started building it.



It works like this 

Republicans whine that the border is not secure when a Democrat is President and that it magically becomes secure when a Republican is President 

Same thing applies to elections
Elections won by Republicans are secure while elections won by Democrats are stolen……even on the same ballot


----------



## Cellblock2429

rightwinger said:


> It works like this
> 
> Republicans whine that the border is not secure when a Democrat is President and that it magically becomes secure when a Republican is President
> 
> Same thing applies to elections
> Elections won by Republicans are secure while elections won by Democrats are stolen……even on the same ballot


/----/ Now you can whine about NBC.








						Attempted crossings at southern U.S. border hit 21-year high in June
					

The numbers were the highest since March 2000, when more than 223,000 immigrants were stopped by the Border Patrol at the southern border.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## Flash

Just as important as building a wall is getting the Mexicans to stop the Illegals on their side.

Trump did that and it significantly cut down on the Illegals.

Then we allowed Joe Potatohead to steal an election.

One of the first things he did was cancel the arrangement with the Mexicans.

Then we had and are now having millions of the Illegal filth flooding across the border.

Joe Potatohead is a fucking moron.  How could anybody do something that stupid?

Anybody that voted for Joe Potatohead and then ignored the fact he stole the election is a also a moron.


----------



## surada

BrokeLoser said:


> Trumps wall didn’t work?
> How do you suppose he had the most secure border in nearly four decades?


Trump's wall is a vanity.. his monument to himself.  He took a lot of minors from their parents. There was no border traffic because of COVID. Fine US employers and you will solve the problem of illegals.


----------



## BrokeLoser

surada said:


> Trump's wall is a vanity.. his monument to himself.  He took a lot of minors from their parents. There was no border traffic because of COVID.


Should we take your word for the effectiveness of the wall or should we trust what lead border agents say and have said?


surada said:


> Fine US employers and you will solve the problem of illegals.


Attacking the problem at its root, the point of origin (the border) should / would be far for impactful wouldn’t it?


----------



## surada

BrokeLoser said:


> Should we take your word for the effectiveness of the wall or should we trust what lead border agents say and have said?
> 
> Attacking the problem at its root, the point of origin (the border) should / would be far for impactful wouldn’t it?


It's been breached thousands of times. Why not do what has worked successfully in other countries?


----------



## kaz

kaz said:


> Wrong, they came here legally and had to prove they had the ability to support themselves and we could check to ensure they weren't criminals.  Your argument falls apart right there.  My issue is illegal aliens self selecting and then going on welfare and bringing crime, drugs and guns with them.  Mexicans who prove they can support themselves and they aren't already criminals is all I want, just like with the Irish, Germans and Poles.
> 
> That's all I want.  Come legally, let us check them out.
> 
> Sorry, guy, your argument falls apart right there as a false equivalency



Thanks for the like, LilOlLady .

Funny think about racist JoeB131 .  He's literally one of two people on the site I have on ignore for being an actual racist.   The other is from the right, it's not a right/left thing.  Democrats are lying about that.  I am a relocated northerner who spent much of my adult life in the south.   Joe's knowledge of the south is like a cartoon.  But then actual racists live life in their own world.

Isn't it funny how the asses like Joe who scream racist the loudest are the actual racists.     Yeah, funny.  Sorry, I forgot what my point I started with was


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> Trump's wall is a vanity.. his monument to himself.  He took a lot of minors from their parents. There was no border traffic because of COVID. Fine US employers and you will solve the problem of illegals.



Nice, a woman who supports women and girls being raped and sold into slavery in exchange for free shit.    How far the left has fallen


----------



## surada

kaz said:


> Nice, a woman who supports women and girls being raped and sold into slavery in exchange for free shit.    How far the left has fallen


Who are you talking about? Atlanta is a huge hub for trafficking under aged girls... Some 4000 a day.


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> Who are you talking about? Atlanta is a huge hub for trafficking under aged girls... Some 4000 a day.



And the majority of those came over the southern borders because you don't have a problem with drugs, crime, rape or murder if you get free shit from it.     You're a total sleazed ball


----------



## Dragonlady

rightwinger said:


> It works like this
> 
> Republicans whine that the border is not secure when a Democrat is President and that it magically becomes secure when a Republican is President
> 
> Same thing applies to elections
> Elections won by Republicans are secure while elections won by Democrats are stolen……even on the same ballot



If you look at illegal immigration since Reagan issued his amnesty in the 1980's, every Republican administration has basically done NOTHING to stop companies from hiring illegal immigrants.  They don't prosecute employers at all. 

Prosecuting employers not only discourages others from hiring illegals, but the millions of dollars paid in fines and penalties paid by the employers covers the costs of investigation and enforcing immigration laws.  Trump prosecuted one employer in 4 years.  Obama obtained more than 450 Orders against employers in the FIRST YEAR of his Administration.

Requiring employers to certify Social Security numbers on hiring would be one way of ensuring no hiring of illegals, but Republicans have steadfastly refused to put any legal onus on employers to verify status.  Canada puts ALL of the onus on employers


Flash said:


> Just as important as building a wall is getting the Mexicans to stop the Illegals on their side.
> 
> Trump did that and it significantly cut down on the Illegals.
> 
> Then we allowed Joe Potatohead to steal an election.
> 
> One of the first things he did was cancel the arrangement with the Mexicans.
> 
> Then we had and are now having millions of the Illegal filth flooding across the border.
> 
> Joe Potatohead is a fucking moron.  How could anybody do something that stupid?
> 
> Anybody that voted for Joe Potatohead and then ignored the fact he stole the election is a also a moron.



The wall is both useless and a gross waste of money and resources.

The way to stop the refugees from coming is to stop climate change and ensure that gangs aren't taking over their country.  These people aren't leaving for "free shit", like the fools you vote for are claiming.  They're running for their lives.

Trump LOST the election.  Or rather he THREW IT AWAY, with his hate, his incompetence, his pettiness, and his failure to manage the pandemic effectively.

Anyone still pushing the lie that Joe Biden "stole the election" is a liar or a fool.  You're both.


----------



## kaz

Dragonlady said:


> If you look at illegal immigration since Reagan issued his amnesty in the 1980's, every Republican administration has basically done NOTHING to stop companies from hiring illegal immigrants.  They don't prosecute employers at all.
> 
> Prosecuting employers not only discourages others from hiring illegals, but the millions of dollars paid in fines and penalties paid by the employers covers the costs of investigation and enforcing immigration laws.  Trump prosecuted one employer in 4 years.  Obama obtained more than 450 Orders against employers in the FIRST YEAR of his Administration.
> 
> Requiring employers to certify Social Security numbers on hiring would be one way of ensuring no hiring of illegals, but Republicans have steadfastly refused to put any legal onus on employers to verify status.  Canada puts ALL of the onus on employers
> 
> 
> The wall is both useless and a gross waste of money and resources.
> 
> The way to stop the refugees from coming is to stop climate change and ensure that gangs aren't taking over their country.  These people aren't leaving for "free shit", like the fools you vote for are claiming.  They're running for their lives.
> 
> Trump LOST the election.  Or rather he THREW IT AWAY, with his hate, his incompetence, his pettiness, and his failure to manage the pandemic effectively.
> 
> Anyone still pushing the lie that Joe Biden "stole the election" is a liar or a fool.  You're both.



Typical Democrat.    You want to send back the people who want to work and keep the criminals, rapists, pedophiles, slavers.    Note you want to keep the ones we want to get rid of and only get rid of the ones we want to keep, the ones who want to WORK.

No wonder you want to destroy US cities and drive successful blacks who do things like own businesses out and drive US cities to ruin.  It's your thing.  Is Bin Laden your big brother by chance?  Useless Saudi whore?


----------



## Harry Dresden

Dragonlady said:


> If you look at illegal immigration since Reagan issued his amnesty in the 1980's, every Republican administration has basically done NOTHING to stop companies from hiring illegal immigrants.  They don't prosecute employers at all.
> 
> Prosecuting employers not only discourages others from hiring illegals, but the millions of dollars paid in fines and penalties paid by the employers covers the costs of investigation and enforcing immigration laws.  Trump prosecuted one employer in 4 years.  Obama obtained more than 450 Orders against employers in the FIRST YEAR of his Administration.
> 
> Requiring employers to certify Social Security numbers on hiring would be one way of ensuring no hiring of illegals, but Republicans have steadfastly refused to put any legal onus on employers to verify status.  Canada puts ALL of the onus on employers
> 
> 
> The wall is both useless and a gross waste of money and resources.
> 
> The way to stop the refugees from coming is to stop climate change and ensure that gangs aren't taking over their country.  These people aren't leaving for "free shit", like the fools you vote for are claiming.  They're running for their lives.
> 
> Trump LOST the election.  Or rather he THREW IT AWAY, with his hate, his incompetence, his pettiness, and his failure to manage the pandemic effectively.
> 
> Anyone still pushing the lie that Joe Biden "stole the election" is a liar or a fool.  You're both.


if obama had orders against 450 employers and this is still going on than that doesnt work as well as you claim it does does it?...and why should we have to stop their gangs in their countries,what happened to their cops and militaries?..


----------



## Dragonlady

kaz said:


> Nice, a woman who supports women and girls being raped and sold into slavery in exchange for free shit.    How far the left has fallen



Republicans want women in slavery from the moment they reach child bearing age.   No choice for you sluts.

No Republican FuckBoi gives a rat's ass what happens to women.  No health care, no maternity leave, no abortions, highest death rate in childbirth in the first world, highest rate of infant mortality in the first world.

Oh yeah, and higher costs for health care on account of rape and childbirth.


----------



## kaz

Dragonlady said:


> Republicans want women in slavery from the moment they reach child bearing age.   No choice for you sluts.
> 
> No Republican FuckBoi gives a rat's ass what happens to women.  No health care, no maternity leave, no abortions, highest death rate in childbirth in the first world, highest rate of infant mortality in the first world.
> 
> Oh yeah, and higher costs for health care on account of rape and childbirth.



You made that up.

Fact:   Dragonlady votes all Democrat all the time and therefore is voting for the rape, murder and forced slavery of women and girls.

You can't deny it, shiksa, it's true.

John Adams:  Facts are pesky things ...


----------



## kaz

Dragonlady said:


> Republicans want women in slavery from the moment they reach child bearing age.   No choice for you sluts.
> 
> No Republican FuckBoi gives a rat's ass what happens to women.  No health care, no maternity leave, no abortions, highest death rate in childbirth in the first world, highest rate of infant mortality in the first world.
> 
> Oh yeah, and higher costs for health care on account of rape and childbirth.



Note Dyke you are getting hammered by facts since it's a fact you vote for the continued murder, rape and forced slavery of women and girls.    You need some serious soul reflection


----------



## Harry Dresden

Dragonlady said:


> Republicans want women in slavery from the moment they reach child bearing age.   No choice for you sluts.
> 
> No Republican FuckBoi gives a rat's ass what happens to women.  No health care, no maternity leave, no abortions, highest death rate in childbirth in the first world, highest rate of infant mortality in the first world.
> 
> Oh yeah, and higher costs for health care on account of rape and childbirth.


geezus.....


----------



## kaz

Harry Dresden said:


> geezus.....



Dragonlady has issues ...


----------



## Harry Dresden

kaz said:


> Dragonlady has issues ...


issues?....she aint much different than those she bitches about....


----------



## Dragonlady

kaz said:


> Typical Democrat.    You want to send back the people who want to work and keep the criminals, rapists, pedophiles, slavers.    Note you want to keep the ones we want to get rid of and only get rid of the ones we want to keep, the ones who want to WORK.
> 
> No wonder you want to destroy US cities and drive successful blacks who do things like own businesses out and drive US cities to ruin.  It's your thing.  Is Bin Laden your big brother by chance?  Useless Saudi whore?



Typical Republican.  Making up lies about Democrats because you have no plan or agenda, other than to waste taxpayers money on Trump's golf trips.


kaz said:


> You made that up.
> 
> Fact:   Dragonlady votes all Democrat all the time and therefore is voting for the rape, murder and forced slavery of women and girls.
> 
> You can't deny it, shiksa, it's true.
> 
> John Adams:  Facts are pesky things ...



Dragonlady has never voted for a Democrat in her entire life, you moronic FuckBoi.  

You're completely deranged, and you're blithering.  You "facts" are figments of your fevered mind.


----------



## Dragonlady

kaz said:


> Note Dyke you are getting hammered by facts since it's a fact you vote for the continued murder, rape and forced slavery of women and girls.    You need some serious soul reflection



You need an education, fool.  I'm a Canadian you fool.  I don't vote in your elections.

Furthermore your delusions about rape, murder and forced slavery is just you being an complete asshole, as usual.  Grow up FuckBoi.   You're embarrassing yourself.


----------



## LilOlLady

Walls, fences and border patrol has never stopped illegal immigration (10.5 million to 12 million,) and the only thing that will stop it is the enforcement of our immigration laws that include deportation and going after business that hire illegal aliens. Republicans nor Democrats want o do that. They prefer amnesty.


----------



## kaz

Dragonlady said:


> Typical Republican.  Making up lies about Democrats because you have no plan or agenda, other than to waste taxpayers money on Trump's golf trips.
> 
> 
> Dragonlady has never voted for a Democrat in her entire life, you moronic FuckBoi.
> 
> You're completely deranged, and you're blithering.  You "facts" are figments of your fevered mind.



So you don't know that slavery, drugs, sex trafficking and crime are coming over our southern border.   You don't know that.  That's what you just said.  Wow ...


----------



## kaz

Dragonlady said:


> You need an education, fool.  I'm a Canadian you fool.  I don't vote in your elections



Well, I'm glad you learned that.  Now if Democrats in the United States would learn about democracy


----------



## rightwinger

kaz said:


> So you don't know that slavery, drugs, sex trafficking and crime are coming over our southern border.   You don't know that.  That's what you just said.  Wow ...


Maybe to Conservatives, that is all they see

To the rest of us, we see hard working migrants picking crops, mowing lawns, making beds and doing whatever menial tasks they can.
Not to steal but to support their families and keep them safe


----------



## Meathead

rightwinger said:


> we see hard working migrants picking crops, mowing lawns, making beds and doing whatever menial tasks they can.
> Not to steal but to support their families and keep them safe


So you don't see drug & sex trafficing, murder, mayhem and another permanent underclass of the illiterate refuse of 3rd-world shitholes too?


----------



## Sunsettommy

surada said:


> Trump's wall is a vanity.. his monument to himself.  He took a lot of minors from their parents. There was no border traffic because of COVID. Fine US employers and you will solve the problem of illegals.



You just keep forgetting he was trying to fulfill the Border Fence law of 2006 which leftists tools dragged their feet on for years after its passage.


----------



## Magnus

kaz said:


> In the end, if we don't build the wall, the Democrats will smother us.  They have already flipped California and New Mexico into solid blue States.   Illegal voters have turned Nevada light blue.  And they have turned Texas and Arizona from solid to light red.
> 
> The issue of illegal immigration has been an endless game of kick the can for decades.  But this is it.  The authoritarian leftist Democrat party is on the verge of a stranglehold on the country and the end of our freedom.  That's why the Democrats fight so hysterically against the wall.  They don't think it won't work, they know it will.
> 
> The reason this is THE issue is that for that reason, every other issue is dependent on the wall.  If we don't build the wall, then Texas will eventually flip and with that alone we're done.  Hispanics over time like all other Americans become more conservative as they become more successful.  But that takes time and a million illegals coming here a year floods that.
> 
> I didn't vote for Trump last time for two main reasons.  First, I'm a capitalist and he isn't.  Free trade is the beating heart of capitalism.  Second, he has been a pig to women.  Unlike Democrats who voted twice for a sexual predator and again for his hoe who attacked his victims again, that does matter to me.
> 
> But now it's down to this.  We must end the endless flow now.  And for me, my decision of whether I will vote for him comes down to this.  Build the wall and I'll vote for him.  Don't, and I won't.  I can't imagine what would make me flip from that.  This is THE political question in our country.  We must build the wall, and build it now.
> 
> I voted that I did not vote for 2016 but I will in 2020 because I believe/hope he'll actually do it.
> 
> Please explain your vote if you voted you will change your vote regarding Trump either way.


Whatever happened to using Mexico's pesos to build the wall? Are we still waiting for the check to arrive?


----------



## surada

Sunsettommy said:


> You just keep forgetting he was trying to fulfill the Border Fence law of 2006 which leftists tools dragged their feet on for years after its passage.


It wouldn't have worked then and it won't work now. Expand e verify, give them a six month grace period .. then fine the employers and start deporting those who didn't leave. It worked like a charm in Saudi Arabia.


----------



## kaz

Magnus said:


> Whatever happened to using Mexico's pesos to build the wall? Are we still waiting for the check to arrive?



Are you on drugs?     Who is going to build a wall with pesos?


----------



## Mr Natural

What we need is a builder to build that wall.  You know, a guy like Donald Trump from NYC.  I’ll bet He could do a hell of a job!


----------



## kaz

Mr Clean said:


> What we need is a builder to build that wall.  You know, a guy like Donald Trump from NYC.  I’ll bet He could do a hell of a job!



Trump build the wall over government contractors??? Now that's a deal.   Done!!!


----------



## surada

kaz said:


> Trump build the wall over government contractors??? Now that's a deal.   Done!!!


Trump is a lousy builder. He made his money on marketing his brand.


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> Trump is a lousy builder. He made his money on marketing his brand.



Thanks, Saudi Slut.  I wanted an idiot to opine and you delivered!


----------



## surada

kaz said:


> Thanks, Saudi Slut.  I wanted an idiot to opine and you delivered!


He lost his shirt as a contractor. His father had to bail him out constantly. I'm neither an Arab or a slut.


----------



## Magnus

kaz said:


> Are you on drugs?     Who is going to build a wall with pesos?


Your orange douche bag, that's who.


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> He lost his shirt as a contractor. His father had to bail him out constantly. I'm neither an Arab or a slut.



Yeah, Trump was stupid and couldn't do what made him a billionaire.

This is just so tired.   You idiots are terrible at this, which is why you need so desperately to destroy people to silence them.  Go fuck yourself, useless moron


----------



## kaz

Magnus said:


> Your orange douche bag, that's who.



You couldn't say more clearly you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.   Stop taking comedy shows so seriously, stupid bitch.  My God, it's a COMEDY SKIT.  How stupid are you?   Be honest


----------



## Magnus

kaz said:


> You couldn't say more clearly you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.   Stop taking comedy shows so seriously, stupid bitch.  My God, it's a COMEDY SKIT.  How stupid are you?   Be honest


Moron. The original reference is to Rump claiming Mexico will pay for the wall. Get it now? Gad, do you all have to keep proving over and over that you are retards?


----------



## kaz

Magnus said:


> Moron. The original reference is to Rump claiming Mexico will pay for the wall. Get it now? Gad, do you all have to keep proving over and over that you are retards?



Your evidence was a COMEDY SKIT FROM A TV SHOW YOU STUPID FUCKING MORON


----------



## Magnus

kaz said:


> Your evidence was a COMEDY SKIT FROM A TV SHOW YOU STUPID FUCKING MORON


Did your orange douche bag claim that he was going to build the wall using Mexico's money? Yes or No?

Let's see if a retard like you can answer the question honestly. I have my doubts but hey, prove me wrong.


----------



## kaz

Magnus said:


> Did your orange douche bag claim that he was going to build the wall using Mexico's money? Yes or No?
> 
> Let's see if a retard like you can answer the question honestly. I have my doubts but hey, prove me wrong.



YOUR EVIDENCE WAS A COMEDY SKIT YOU STUPID FUCK.  GROW UP


----------



## Magnus

kaz said:


> YOUR EVIDENCE WAS A COMEDY SKIT YOU STUPID FUCK.  GROW UP


LOL. So, you proved me right. A right-wing retard can't answer the simple question - "_Did your orange douche bag claim that he was going to build the wall using Mexico's money? Yes or No?"_

Watch and learn...  

__


----------



## Captain Caveman

surada said:


> Trump's wall is a vanity.. his monument to himself.  He took a lot of minors from their parents. There was no border traffic because of COVID. Fine US employers and you will solve the problem of illegals.


It's not Trump's wall, never has been, you've been duped in believing so. It was built under Clinton and every incoming administration takes it on, and every opposition believes it's the current administrations wall.

So now, it's Biden's wall. So deal with that.


----------



## kaz

Magnus said:


> LOL. So, you proved me right. A right-wing retard can't answer the simple question - "_Did your orange douche bag claim that he was going to build the wall using Mexico's money? Yes or No?"_
> 
> Watch and learn...
> 
> __



You think you're bad ass offering SKITS FROM COMEDY SHOWS AS YOUR EVIDENCE, huh, Rambo?


----------



## surada

Captain Caveman said:


> It's not Trump's wall, never has been, you've been duped in believing so. It was built under Clinton and every incoming administration takes it on, and every opposition believes it's the current administrations wall.
> 
> So now, it's Biden's wall. So deal with that.


It's a vanity and a waste of money. The problem of illegals can be solved easily. I think they really don't want to stop illegals.


----------



## kaz

surada said:


> It's a vanity and a waste of money. The problem of illegals can be solved easily. I think they really don't want to stop illegals.



LOL, still zero in terms of what you just said.   So, Pedro, how is it "simple" to stop illegals without a wall.   Hey wait, I see what you did there, you just admitted you are a Democrat again, free access to goods, services and welfare for illegals!   But you will stop them without stopping anyone!  Just like Biden, Pelosi and every other Democrat !!!   LOL


----------



## Captain Caveman

surada said:


> It's a vanity and a waste of money. The problem of illegals can be solved easily. I think they really don't want to stop illegals.


Democrats won't, they need the votes. Congress need to enact laws to heavily fine employers of illegals, say $40,000 per illegal. Same with landlords renting to illegals.


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## surada

kaz said:


> LOL, still zero in terms of what you just said.   So, Pedro, how is it "simple" to stop illegals without a wall.   Hey wait, I see what you did there, you just admitted you are a Democrat again, free access to goods, services and welfare for illegals!   But you will stop them without stopping anyone!  Just like Biden, Pelosi and every other Democrat !!!   LOL


Expand e verify. Give employers and illegals 3 months notice. Give them an extension for a month. Start deporting illegals and fining employers. It been very successful in other countries that have problems with illegals and visa overstayers. Don't limit it to just Mexicans. Include South and central America as well as Iranians, Israelis... All illegals.


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## surada

Captain Caveman said:


> Democrats won't, they need the votes. Congress need to enact laws to heavily fine employers of illegals, say $40,000 per illegal. Same with landlords renting to illegals.


Well Trump did claim 3-5 million illegals voted in 2016, but he didn't do anything about it.


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## kaz

surada said:


> Expand e verify. Give employers and illegals 3 months notice. Give them an extension for a month. Start deporting illegals and fining employers. It been very successful in other countries that have problems with illegals and visa overstayers. Don't limit it to just Mexicans. Include South and central America as well as Iranians, Israelis... All illegals.



Other countries have walls because they work.      They don't follow your plan of inviting criminals, slavers, sex traffickers, drug dealers to stay while you deport only the people who want to work. That's  strictly the Democrat plan


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## surada

kaz said:


> Other countries have walls because they work.      They don't follow your plan of inviting criminals, slavers, sex traffickers, drug dealers to stay while you deport only the people who want to work. That's  strictly the Democrat plan


What countries are you talking about?


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## Captain Caveman

kaz said:


> Other countries have walls because they work.      They don't follow your plan of inviting criminals, slavers, sex traffickers, drug dealers to stay while you deport only the people who want to work. That's  strictly the Democrat plan


Strong borders makes for good neighbours. Democrats don't want borders.


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## Magnus

kaz said:


> You think you're bad ass offering SKITS FROM COMEDY SHOWS AS YOUR EVIDENCE, huh, Rambo?


In other words - You couldn't respond so will keep mindlessly repeating nonsense, yes? Yeah, now you know why you are a retard.  

But, hey, as a parting gift, you get to see your orange douchebag and his -  *Mexico Will Pay For The Wall* - video all over again. Enjoy!


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## Captain Caveman

surada said:


> Well Trump did claim 3-5 million illegals voted in 2016, but he didn't do anything about it.


Did he not


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## surada

Captain Caveman said:


> Did he not





			https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/01/23/at-white-house-trump-tells-congressional-leaders-3-5-million-illegal-ballots-cost-him-the-popular-vote/


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## surada

Trump claims millions voted illegally in presidential poll
					

President-elect Donald Trump says he won the popular vote "if you deduct the millions of people who voted illegally".



					www.bbc.com


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## kaz

surada said:


> What countries are you talking about?



You seriously don't know how to Google????









						Countries With Border Walls
					

The proposed wall between the United States and Mexico has been heavy in the news as of late. However, did you know that there are countries in the world who already have border walls?




					www.worldatlas.com
				




Teaching a Democrat to fish rather than just giving them a fish, the impossible dream ...


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## kaz

Magnus said:


> In other words - You couldn't respond so will keep mindlessly repeating nonsense, yes? Yeah, now you know why you are a retard.
> 
> But, hey, as a parting gift, you get to see your orange douchebag and his -  *Mexico Will Pay For The Wall* - video all over again. Enjoy!



No I'm not responding to your argument which when asked to support you gave me a TV SCENE FROM A COMEDY SHOW you fucking dyke


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## Magnus

kaz said:


> No I'm not responding to your argument which when asked to support you gave me a TV SCENE FROM A COMEDY SHOW you fucking dyke


Yup, I know you are not responding. That's why you are a retard. Get it now? 

But, since you confirmed you are a retard, you get to watch your orange douchebag and his - *Mexico Will Pay For The Wall* - video all over again. Enjoy!


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## kaz

Magnus said:


> Yup, I know you are not responding. That's why you are a retard. Get it now?
> 
> But, since you confirmed you are a retard, you get to watch your orange douchebag and his - *Mexico Will Pay For The Wall* - video all over again. Enjoy!



You're drooling again, ass hat


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## Magnus

kaz said:


> You're drooling again, ass hat


Aww... poor trumptard. Gets hammered defending his beloved fuhrer!!   

But, not to worry. Every time you respond you walk away with another link to your orange douchebag and his promise to use *Mexico's Money To Build The Wall!!!!

*


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## kaz

Magnus said:


> Aww... poor trumptard. Gets hammered defending his beloved fuhrer!!
> 
> But, not to worry. Every time you respond you walk away with another link to your orange douchebag and his promise to use *Mexico's Money To Build The Wall!!!!
> 
> *



So you'll spend $6Trillion at the drop of a hat but your still suffering from massive butt hurt over the $20 million wall, huh, LOL.  What a rube


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## Magnus

kaz said:


> So you'll spend $6Trillion at the drop of a hat but your still suffering from massive butt hurt over the $20 million wall, huh, LOL.  What a rube


I want to spend $6 trillion, you say? Sure, yup, I do have that much lying around in my piggy bank!   

And, just when I thought you couldn't go any more retard, you up and surprise me! For that, you deserve a prize. Here ya go... Rump in all his glory promising to use Mexico's money to build the wall!!!!


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