# More people saved by guns.



## PredFan

Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.


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## srlip

I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.


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## PredFan

I'd rather kill 1,000 bad guys saving one good person's life, so it's always a good thing.


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## HenryBHough

srlip said:


> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.



Seriously, if any of those young men were sufficiently troubled to use a gun do you really believe they would not have found an alternative had they been denied firearms?


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## PredFan

Conversely, there is the "Come in and rob me" sign on a door:

NC Restaurant With "No Weapons" Sign Robbed at Gunpoint - Christine Rousselle


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## WinterBorn

HenryBHough said:


> srlip said:
> 
> 
> 
> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, if any of those young men were sufficiently troubled to use a gun do you really believe they would not have found an alternative had they been denied firearms?
Click to expand...


This is exactly why I don't pay attention to the suicide numbers. If someone uses a gun to kill themselves, they were not crying out for attention. They wanted to die. They would have found another way.


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## PredFan

Another person to add to the list of people saved by guns:
http://www.13abc.com/story/25559271/toledo-woman-with-gun-stops-mugger-with-bat


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## PredFan

Lives and property saved by a CCW holder and his gun:

Concealed carrying clerk stops teenage robbers armed with rifle (Ohio)


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## strollingbones

Two Men Use Girl As Human Shield ? Until Her Father Guns Them Down


i wonder what the outcome would have been for an unarmed household?


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## PredFan

strollingbones said:


> Two Men Use Girl As Human Shield ? Until Her Father Guns Them Down
> 
> 
> i wonder what the outcome would have been for an unarmed household?



I don't know, why don't you start a thread about it.


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## PredFan

Good guys with guns save lives again:
Armed Guards Ended Reynolds High School Attack


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## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.



many kids got saved from the shooter 

in the Oregons Reynolds High School

because of two armed guards


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## jon_berzerk

strollingbones said:


> Two Men Use Girl As Human Shield ? Until Her Father Guns Them Down
> 
> 
> i wonder what the outcome would have been for an unarmed household?



why take a chance


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## PredFan

Another good guy with a gun:

Coeur d'Alene man says concealed weapon saved his life | KREM.com Spokane


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## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> Another good guy with a gun:
> 
> Coeur d'Alene man says concealed weapon saved his life | KREM.com Spokane



there are self defense stories everyday

The man went behind the counter and threw the cash register on the floor to break it, Small said, then began collecting the money scattered on the floor. He then put the knife to the womans chest, Small said, and she sprang into action.
She drew a gun and fired a single shot into the mans chest, Small said. The man collapsed on the floor.
When police arrived moments later, the suspect was still clutching some cash in his left hand, Small said. A knife was found nearby.
The man was pronounced dead shortly afterward at Aria Health-Torresdale Campus. His name has not been released.

Officer-turned-shopkeeper kills robber in Mayfair


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## PredFan

jon_berzerk said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun:
> 
> Coeur d'Alene man says concealed weapon saved his life | KREM.com Spokane
> 
> 
> 
> 
> there are self defense stories everyday
> 
> The man went behind the counter and threw the cash register on the floor to break it, Small said, then began collecting the money scattered on the floor. He then put the knife to the womans chest, Small said, and she sprang into action.
> She drew a gun and fired a single shot into the mans chest, Small said. The man collapsed on the floor.
> When police arrived moments later, the suspect was still clutching some cash in his left hand, Small said. A knife was found nearby.
> The man was pronounced dead shortly afterward at Aria Health-Torresdale Campus. His name has not been released.
> 
> Officer-turned-shopkeeper kills robber in Mayfair
Click to expand...


It does happen every day, unless you live in liberal la la land.


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## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun:
> 
> Coeur d'Alene man says concealed weapon saved his life | KREM.com Spokane
> 
> 
> 
> 
> there are self defense stories everyday
> 
> The man went behind the counter and threw the cash register on the floor to break it, Small said, then began collecting the money scattered on the floor. He then put the knife to the womans chest, Small said, and she sprang into action.
> She drew a gun and fired a single shot into the mans chest, Small said. The man collapsed on the floor.
> When police arrived moments later, the suspect was still clutching some cash in his left hand, Small said. A knife was found nearby.
> The man was pronounced dead shortly afterward at Aria Health-Torresdale Campus. His name has not been released.
> 
> Officer-turned-shopkeeper kills robber in Mayfair
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It does happen every day, unless you live in liberal la la land.
Click to expand...


it happens there too 

--LOL


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## PredFan

There are so many if these stories. 

Female Store Clerk Shoots and Kills Armed Robber With One Shot | Right Wing News


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## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> There are so many if these stories.
> 
> Female Store Clerk Shoots and Kills Armed Robber With One Shot | Right Wing News



every day


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## Luddly Neddite




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## RetiredGySgt

Luddite still posting old tired proven wrong statistics.


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## PredFan

RetiredGySgt said:


> Luddite still posting old tired proven wrong statistics.



Considering that Luddly never has a thought of her own, it's not surprising.


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## Noomi

PredFan said:


> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.



You cannot prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that those lives would have been saved with or without a gun.


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## Noomi

RetiredGySgt said:


> Luddite still posting old tired proven wrong statistics.



Prove it wrong. I would especially like you to prove that abused women do not have a greater risk of being murdered if a gun is in the home.


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## Yarddog

Luddly Neddite said:


>




If you take away a persons option to defend themselves you take away their freedom.
You can choose not to exercize that option but you still benefit by the fact that that option is available.

Example,  the fort Hood shooter was able to shoot so many people because the people on base did NOT have the option to defend themselves. Im sure someone thought they might accidentaly shoot themselves or commit suicide and maybe thats why they were not allowed to have guns?


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## PredFan

Noomi said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cannot prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that those lives would have been saved with or without a gun.
Click to expand...


In many if those cases, it's pretty obvious but you are right, I cannot prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I don't have to.


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## PredFan

Luddley is an idiot. The next time someone breaks into your home, or assaults you, quote statistics at him, see how far that gets you.


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## PredFan

More bad guys stopped by a good guy with a gun:

Jewelry store employees hold three robbers at gun point


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## PredFan

Yet another life saved by a gun:

Teen defends mother from attacker, exchanges gunfire with mom's ex-boyfriend (Tennessee)


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## PredFan

More lives saved:

TX Concealed Carrier Shoots and Kills Man in 4 Star Hotel Who Was ?Looking for Someone to Kill?


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## jon_berzerk

A concealed carrier in Florida is being described as a good Samaritan after he stepped in following a stabbing attack and captured the suspect at gunpoint.

Orlando Sentinel


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## PredFan

jon_berzerk said:


> A concealed carrier in Florida is being described as a good Samaritan after he stepped in following a stabbing attack and captured the suspect at gunpoint.
> 
> Orlando Sentinel



You beat me to it and I live here! Good job.


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## jon_berzerk

*Suspected Home Invader Shows Up at ER With Gunshot Wound and Claims He Has Amnesia
*

Springfield, Missouri &#8211; Ah yes, the old &#8220;No officer, I have no idea how I got shot routine.&#8221;
This is an interesting case in how one of the suspects got caught.
According to KY3, Joseph Allen was sleeping in his home around 4am last Friday morning when multiple home invaders broke into his home.
Allen grabbed a gun and a brief gunfight ensued. Allen was not shot, but did suffer minor injuries which required treatment at a local hospital.
While being treated at the hospital, Allen recognized the voice of one of the suspects in a room near his. He alerted police who then questioned the suspect.
That&#8217;s when the suspect pulled out the ol&#8217; amnesia card and claimed he didn&#8217;t remember how he got shot.
The authorities aren&#8217;t buying it and 20 year old Tre Williams was placed in police custody in the hospital. He is charged with burglary and assault.
The other suspects remain at large.

Man treated for gunshot wounds is charged for home break-in | Local - Home


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## 2aguy

This is the thing...in each case where a good person used a gun to stop a. Crime...a robbery, rape or murder, the stance,of the anti-gunner is that they would prefer the victim suffer that murder, rape or robbery rather than let that victim have the gun...right?  given the choice they would take the gun away...

so, let's say the gun grabbers get their paradise...no guns except for the police and military...then they are more than happy to let people be defenseless against criminals who use knives, clubs,  or illegal guns, or attack in groups...right?

Sooo...if, according to gun grabber numbers, 100,000"people use guns to stop these attacks each year ...it is better that they submit to those 100,000 criminals...rather than use a gun...right?


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## PredFan

Another bad guy with a gun is eliminated from society:

VIDEO: Thief Attempts to Rob the WRONG Mechanic... | Conservative Outfitters


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## jon_berzerk

*A grandmother in Alabama, identified as 63 year old Phyliss Law, is now keeping her pump action shotgun close at hand after she was forced to shoot a home intruder last week*.

A 63-year-old grandmother spoke exclusively to FOX10 News after shooting a suspected burglar in her living room. The terrifying ordeal happened Friday on Thorr Avenue in Prichard.

Phyliss Law says this is the second time she&#8217;s been burglarized. She said during the last incident she had jewelry and electronics stolen.

we heard this crackling&#8230; Like wood popping and stuff. I said oh my god. He trying to come in. So I backed up to my room and got my gun and got my extra clip,&#8221; Law said.

She was hoping the suspect would go away. Instead, Law said he came closer.

&#8220;Next thing I know, he hit the lights and put all the lights on and I&#8217;m saying to myself, &#8216;This person been here before to know where all my lights at,&#8217;&#8221; she said. &#8220;This is ridiculous. He just comes strolling walking around. By the time&#8230;He was right here I saw the blue jogging basketball pants he was wearing. And when he got there I jumped up and just start shooting. I have no idea where I hit him. He fell right there on the floor there. &#8220;

Law&#8217;s granddaughter hid in a closet while she moved closer to the living room and got down on the ground.

Prichard police say she shot the suspect in the head.

Grandmother shoots burglary suspect | FOX10 News - Mobile


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## jon_berzerk

*in violation of policy 

doctor saves lives with a firearm *

A troubled patient opened fire on a caseworker and psychiatrist in a small office at a unit of Mercy Fitzgerald Hospital in Delaware County on Thursday afternoon, police said, leading the doctor to draw his own weapon and shoot the assailant.

The confrontation left the caseworker, 53-year-old Theresa Hunt, dead and the 52-year-old psychiatrist, a veteran doctor at the hospital whom sources identified as Lee Silverman, with a graze wound to the head. The patient, Richard Plotts, was in critical condition Thursday night from three gunshot wounds.

The violence sent a shock wave through the normally quiet campus of the medical center on the border of Darby Borough and Yeadon. Police vehicles swarmed the scene and armed officers charged through the building &#8211; the Sister Marie Lenahan Wellness Center, across Lansdowne Avenue from the main hospital &#8211; to evacuate doctors, nurses, and patients waiting for routine appointments.

Donald Molineux, chief of the Yeadon Police Department, said that if Silverman returned fire and wounded Plotts, he "without a doubt saved lives."

Psych patient shoots two at Darby hospital, doctor returns fire - Philly.com


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## PredFan

I acknowledge that you don't always need a gun, like if you just happen to be a trained MMA fighter. However, any time a couple of worthless thugs get their Karma served up, it's a good thing to watch.

It Looked Like an Easy Target ? But These Robbers Probably Didn?t Know a Champion MMA Fighter Worked Inside | Video | TheBlaze.com


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## Luddly Neddite

srlip said:


> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.



Oh my fucking god, WHERE do you live?


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## PredFan

Luddly Neddite said:


> srlip said:
> 
> 
> 
> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh my fucking god, WHERE do you live?
Click to expand...


I'll give you that point Luddley. I should have named this thread"More people saved by a good guy with a gun." I will be careful in the future to word this correctly. You are still wrong blaming the gun.


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## PredFan

Another good guy with a gun comes to the aid of police:

Video: Watch as good Samaritan holds stabbing suspect at gunpoint for deputies


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## 2aguy

> I acknowledge that you don't always need a gun, like if you just happen to be a trained MMA fighter.



Or...you just might be small, young, female, old, handicapped, sick, injured, out numbered, faced with multiple attackers with weapons, or one attacker with a gun...


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## jon_berzerk

14 Year Old Uses 12 Gauge Shotgun to Defend His Mother From Abusive Boyfriend

Locust Fork, Alabama &#8211; A 14 year old boy used a 12 gauge shotgun to shoot and kill a man who was romantically linked to his mother.
The suspect in the case, identified as 34 year old Ayatollah Mohammad, was actually escorted by law enforcement off of the property owned by the boy&#8217;s mother that morning, but walked 7 miles back to the home and snuck onto the property.
When the suspect was discovered, the boy used a shotgun to defend himself and his mother from a man he obviously considered to be a threat.

Locust Fork shooting could fall under ?stand your ground? | WIAT 42


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## PredFan

Battering boyfriend won't be abusing any more women, ever.

Deputies: Woman shot and killed boyfriend - KPTV - FOX 12


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## PredFan

Teenager uses rifle to save father's life:

Teenage Boy Uses His Rifle to Defend His Father From Would-Be Murderer


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## PredFan

The knockout game it seems, can be prevented by a potential victim with a gun:

Evidence that guns deter: "Knockout game" attacker asks victim if he is armed before hitting him - Crime Prevention Research Center


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## PredFan

Another worthless thug taken out by a good guy with a gun. I wonder how many future deaths this guy just prevented?


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## PredFan

Luddley and the other idiot gun grabbers are polluting the board with their stupidity. Every single day good guys with guns are saving lives. Luddley and his ilk don't care. It doesn't serve their agenda.

Armed Robber Shot and Killed at Hookah Shop Where Owners Encouraged Employees to Carry Guns


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## PredFan

CONTRAST: Armed guy shoots back and kills assailant; unarmed guy gets beaten senseless | GunsSaveLife.com


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## PredFan

Homeowner Shoots and Kills Home Invader Who Assaulted 11yr Old Boy 2 Women and Killed Family Dog


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## Yarddog

Luddly Neddite said:


>


looks like you need to be more responsible with your gun then.  Maybe you should just keep it in the garage.
but for everybody else,  well at least that means they have the option to defend themself if they live in a bad neighbor
hood with people kicking in their door. theres almost a 100 percent chance the cops wouldnt get there in time
and the reason guns may not be so often used in self defense is because you dont have to fire it. just point it at someone and they will probably think twice about assaulting you.
I have family members who did just that while camping in the desert when armed men rolled up in a pick up truck.


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## C_Clayton_Jones

_More people saved by guns. _

And more _post hoc_ fallacies from the right.


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## PredFan

Another good guy with a gun:

73-year-old Omahan shoots man coming through window of his home - Crime Courts - Omaha.com Breaking news and local coverage from the Omaha World-Herald


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## PredFan

Who knows how many lives in the future, this guy saved:

 Video Store Clerk in Houston Shoots Armed Robber in the Neck 8211 8220 For my safety I had to pull my trigger 8221


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## PredFan

More people saved by a good guy with a gun, and another worthless piece of shit taking a dirt nap:

 Video Dairy Queen Employee Shoots and Kills Armed Robber


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## PredFan

Here are 5 examples of good guys with guns saving lives and property:

5 Examples Of Gun Owners Stopping A Crime Are A Good Reason Why Shops Are Embracing Open Carry


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## Wry Catcher

HenryBHough said:


> srlip said:
> 
> 
> 
> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, if any of those young men were sufficiently troubled to use a gun do you really believe they would not have found an alternative had they been denied firearms?
Click to expand...


Spontaneity and sureity.  Years ago, when the Golden Gate Bridge's 50th birthday was being celebrated, a columnist for the SF Chronicle  interviewed several jumpers who survived.  The one takeaway was each regreted  jumping on the way down and were thankful they had survived.


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## 2aguy

> The one takeaway was each regreted jumping on the way down and were thankful they had survived.



but they didn't use a gun...?   They still tried to kill themselves and no gun was involved.  You find this in Japan.  They have absolute gun control...and they have twice the rate of suicides that we do.  Guns aren't the problem...perhaps more help for people who need it...


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## Wry Catcher

Billc said:


> The one takeaway was each regreted jumping on the way down and were thankful they had survived.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but they didn't use a gun...?   They still tried to kill themselves and no gun was involved.  You find this in Japan.  They have absolute gun control...and they have twice the rate of suicides that we do.  Guns aren't the problem...perhaps more help for people who need it...
Click to expand...


Look, we know you're a gun lover, but the fact is more than 50% of all suicides in the United States are committed by the use of a firearm.  The two next means are hanging/suffication or poisoning.


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## 2aguy

Yeah, but the gun isn't the problem...the underlying desire to end their life is and you just pointed out that there are other means of killing oneself...the Japanese, Chinese and others from gun control countries kill themselves at a higher level than we do.  As I used to argue with another guy...he kept telling me suicide was cultural...and it is...


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## PredFan

Billc said:


> Yeah, but the gun isn't the problem...the underlying desire to end their life is and you just pointed out that there are other means of killing oneself...the Japanese, Chinese and others from gun control countries kill themselves at a higher level than we do.  As I used to argue with another guy...he kept telling me suicide was cultural...and it is...


Exactly. If you took away guns, the number of suicides would remain constant, the only change would be the method.


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## Wry Catcher

Billc said:


> Yeah, but the gun isn't the problem...the underlying desire to end their life is and you just pointed out that there are other means of killing oneself...the Japanese, Chinese and others from gun control countries kill themselves at a higher level than we do.  As I used to argue with another guy...he kept telling me suicide was cultural...and it is...


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## Wry Catcher

PredFan said:


> Billc said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, but the gun isn't the problem...the underlying desire to end their life is and you just pointed out that there are other means of killing oneself...the Japanese, Chinese and others from gun control countries kill themselves at a higher level than we do.  As I used to argue with another guy...he kept telling me suicide was cultural...and it is...
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. If you took away guns, the number of suicides would remain constant, the only change would be the method.
Click to expand...


That is your opinion, if you have  evidence that your statement is true  post it.  A child in our little league was told by his father he could not play baseball if he got a "D"; the ten year old got a "D", begged the teacher to change it and she did not.  He went home, got his team jacet out of his closet, his dad's gun from the night stand, and after folding the jacket in his lap took his own life.

You want us to believe, he would have found a new way to take his life had the gun not been easily accessable?  How do you think he would have accomplished the act - decided and done in a moment.


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## Wry Catcher

Yarddog said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks like you need to be more responsible with your gun then.  Maybe you should just keep it in the garage.
> but for everybody else,  well at least that means they have the option to defend themself if they live in a bad neighbor
> hood with people kicking in their door. theres almost a 100 percent chance the cops wouldnt get there in time
> and the reason guns may not be so often used in self defense is because you dont have to fire it. just point it at someone and they will probably think twice about assaulting you.
> I have family members who did just that while camping in the desert when armed men rolled up in a pick up truck.
Click to expand...


Gee, my neighbor's ex-wife's former boss told her that his father-in-law from his second marriage second cousin had a friend in Nebraska who bought his 28 year old son a gun and this poor kid shoot himself in the head the first time he cleaned it.


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## Wry Catcher

If it's written on the internet and on the USMB it MUST be true. 

Sarcasm alert.


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## 2aguy

which part is supposedly untrue...that Japan has a higher suicide rate...or that people planning on killing themselves,will still do it...gun or not...?


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## PredFan

Wry Catcher said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Billc said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, but the gun isn't the problem...the underlying desire to end their life is and you just pointed out that there are other means of killing oneself...the Japanese, Chinese and others from gun control countries kill themselves at a higher level than we do.  As I used to argue with another guy...he kept telling me suicide was cultural...and it is...
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. If you took away guns, the number of suicides would remain constant, the only change would be the method.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is your opinion, if you have  evidence that your statement is true  post it.  A child in our little league was told by his father he could not play baseball if he got a "D"; the ten year old got a "D", begged the teacher to change it and she did not.  He went home, got his team jacet out of his closet, his dad's gun from the night stand, and after folding the jacket in his lap took his own life.
> 
> You want us to believe, he would have found a new way to take his life had the gun not been easily accessable?  How do you think he would have accomplished the act - decided and done in a moment.
Click to expand...

It's you opinion that the guns are at fault. If you have evidence that guns cause suicides then post it.


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## PredFan

Billc said:


> which part is supposedly untrue...that Japan has a higher suicide rate...or that people planning on killing themselves,will still do it...gun or not...?



Wrycatcher doesn't even believe the shit he posts.


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## Moonglow

*More people saved by guns*

*I still can't get my gun to change my flat tire and save me the effort...*


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## PredFan

Moonglow said:


> *More people saved by guns*
> 
> *I still can't get my gun to change my flat tire and save me the effort...*



I said "people saved" not "time saved".


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## 2aguy

I think the gun grabbers have  realized the numbers don't add up to their beliefs..they are now changing their numbers...keep an eye out for new fake stats coming our way...


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## MXdad

Billc said:


> I think the gun grabbers have  realized the numbers don't add up to their beliefs..they are now changing their numbers...keep an eye out for new fake stats coming our way...


I am sure one of the Bloomberg anti-gun Loon groups will be out soon with more made up stats


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## jon_berzerk

Moonglow said:


> *More people saved by guns*
> 
> *I still can't get my gun to change my flat tire and save me the effort...*




wrong tool for the job 

next time try a jack and a tire iron 

hope that helps 

if not 

leave it to the professionals


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## PredFan

One perp in the morgue, others sent running, who knows how many lives saved:

Armed robbery attempt on Milwaukee 8217 s south side leads to robber being shot FOX6Now.com


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## jon_berzerk

CRYSTAL LAKE, ILLINOIS – A mother was forced to defend herself, her children and her home when two homeless men, identified as Brandon Mendez and Nicholas Porcayo kicked in her door.

2 teens charged in Crystal Lake break-in that resulted in shooting Northwest Herald


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## PredFan

Mother saves her own life and the lives if her kids:

Mother Shoots 1 of 2 Homeless Home Invaders Who Kicked in Her Door


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## PredFan

Oops! Looks like we both posted the same thing.

Of note: mom used a Raven Arms 25 cal. I have one of those that I used to carry. But I left it at home in favor of my KelTec 380 P3 because I thought that a 25 was too small for self defense.


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## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> Oops! Looks like we both posted the same thing.
> 
> Of note: mom used a Raven Arms 25 cal. I have one of those that I used to carry. But I left it at home in favor of my KelTec 380 P3 because I thought that a 25 was too small for self defense.




i have one also never even shoot it these days


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## PredFan

jon_berzerk said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oops! Looks like we both posted the same thing.
> 
> Of note: mom used a Raven Arms 25 cal. I have one of those that I used to carry. But I left it at home in favor of my KelTec 380 P3 because I thought that a 25 was too small for self defense.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have one also never even shoot it these days
Click to expand...

It's hard to find 25 ACP these days and when you do it's expensive. I'm going to start reloading it.


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## PredFan

Another person saved by a person with a gun. How many more people will be alive because this killer was taken out. You almost can't count the huge number of innocent people save by good guys with guns every single day.

Texas Store Owner Defends His Sister and Shoots an Armed Thug Dead PICTURES


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## PredFan

Luddly Neddite said:


>



I gun in the home is five times more likely to save your life than kill you.


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## PredFan

Another worthless thug taking a dirt nap and who knows how many lives saved.

SMOKEY IS THE BANDIT Concealed Carrier Kills Carjacker Posing As a Cop in Texas - Bearing Arms


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## PredFan

Not just lives but property can be saved with a gun:
The gun doesn't even have to be fired.

In Texas Even the Pastors Pack Heat 8211 as One Package Stealing Thief Found Out the Hard Way


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## PredFan

A good guy with a gun takes three thugs of the streets, two permanently.

 Video Store Clerk Shoots and Kills 2 of 3 Armed Robbers in Gunfight


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## 2aguy

> A good guy with a gun takes three thugs of the streets, two permanently.
> 
> Video Store Clerk Shoots and Kills 2 of 3 Armed Robbers in Gunfight



The old story of the fox and the rabbit...the fox is chasing dinner...the rabbit is running for it's life....the robbers were shooting for money...the clerk was shooting for his life....


----------



## PredFan

Here an 11 year old girl saves her mother's life.

VIDEO 11-Year-Old Girl Called 8216 Hero 8217 for a Very Good Reason


----------



## PredFan

Good guy with gun saves more lives:

Good Guy With a Gun Shoots Stabbing Spree Suspect Multiple Times at OK Factory


----------



## PredFan

Unfortunately too late for the woman who was beheaded:

Woman Beheaded In Oklahoma By Newely Fired Employee Further Attacks Stopped By Armed Owner Concealed Nation


----------



## PredFan

Doubtless the woman saved her life:

 Holy Sh t. I Survived. Woman Shoots Elusive Stalker Who Tormented Her For Six Months Then Bares Her Soul Online - Bearing Arms


----------



## PredFan

If I didn't have a job and a family, I could post these things 24/7/365. Guns in the hands of good guys (and gals) save lives almost constantly. Making it harder to own a gun only makes it safer to be a criminal.

This criminal encountered a good Samaritan with a gun and ran as fast as he could Rare


----------



## PredFan

A young man saves his family's lives. Thank god it wasn't locked in a safe, or had a trigger lock, or some other such nonsense.

Son Kills One Of Three Home Invaders In Texas Possibly Saving EIGHT Lives Bearing Arms


----------



## 2aguy

Thanks Predfan....that is a great report on that story, the first version I saw only mentioned the mother and granddaughters, not the other people.."can you imagine what might have happened to these people....?  and these stories,do happen when the victim can only stand there and do nothing because they have no weapons....but I guess the anti gunners don't care....they just want guns gone, and they don't think beyond that step.....sad really...


----------



## PredFan

One good guy with a gun takes out two of 4 armed robbers:
Single customer wins shootout with four armed robbers in Texas bar Hot Air


----------



## PredFan

Stupid perp brought a knife to a gun fight:

PA Concealed Carrier Shoots Attacker Who Was Wielding 13in Hunting Knife in the Groin


----------



## PredFan

Another life saved.

Flint mother grateful for pistol-packing neighbor bystanders who saved daughter from alleged attack MLive.com


----------



## PredFan

3 robbers break into the wrong house:

Homeowner shoots burglar on NW Side


----------



## PredFan

Wrong house!


----------



## PredFan

A good guy with a gun sends another worthless thug to his eternal dirt nap. More lives saved. Video Father Shoots and Kills Career Criminal in Gunfight During Home Invasion


----------



## PredFan

How many lives did this one guy save I wonder?

Sergeant at Arms Shot and Killed Canadian Parliament Shooter


----------



## PredFan

More lives saved:

AL Homeowner Uses .22 Rifle to Fight Off Two Intruders


----------



## PredFan

A 17 year old girl saves her family with a gun:

 Video 17 Year Old Girl Wins Gunfight With Home Invader Saves Mother and Siblings


----------



## PredFan

More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun:

Concealed Carrier Stops Robbery at Subway Restaurant in Texas


----------



## PredFan

More people saved by a good guy with a gun:

Concealed Carrier Stopped Mass Shooting at Texas Night Club


----------



## Conservative65

WinterBorn said:


> HenryBHough said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> srlip said:
> 
> 
> 
> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, if any of those young men were sufficiently troubled to use a gun do you really believe they would not have found an alternative had they been denied firearms?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is exactly why I don't pay attention to the suicide numbers. If someone uses a gun to kill themselves, they were not crying out for attention. They wanted to die. They would have found another way.
Click to expand...


I had a friend that killed himself with a gun.  He had never owned one in his life and purchased that one for the sole purpose of killing himself.


----------



## Conservative65

PredFan said:


> Conversely, there is the "Come in and rob me" sign on a door:
> 
> NC Restaurant With "No Weapons" Sign Robbed at Gunpoint - Christine Rousselle



That's funny and fitting.


----------



## PredFan

More lives and property saved by a good guy (or girl, in this case) with a gun:

GUNFIGHT Dumb Criminals Assume Gun Store Employees are Unarmed VIDEO


----------



## Carla_Danger

PredFan said:


> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.




We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?


----------



## PredFan

Carla_Danger said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
Click to expand...


Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.


----------



## Carla_Danger

PredFan said:


> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
Click to expand...



Entitlement?


----------



## 007

Carla_Danger said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
Click to expand...

Yes, maybe you could call someone on your OBAMA PHONE and they can explain it to you...


----------



## Carla_Danger

007 said:


> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yes, maybe you could call someone on your OBAMA PHONE and they can explain it to you...
Click to expand...


----------



## 007

Carla_Danger said:


> 007 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yes, maybe you could call someone on your OBAMA PHONE and they can explain it to you...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## Carla_Danger

007 said:


> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 007 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yes, maybe you could call someone on your OBAMA PHONE and they can explain it to you...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...





Q: Has the Obama administration started a program to use "taxpayer money" to give free cell phones to welfare recipients?

A: No. Low-income households have been eligible for discounted telephone service for more than a decade. But the program is funded by telecom companies, not by taxes, and the president has nothing to do with it.

The Obama Phone


----------



## PredFan

Carla_Danger said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
Click to expand...


Entitlement and violence, yes.


----------



## Roadrunner

srlip said:


> I  personally know a dozen or more.  But I also know 5 who have shot themselves on purpose, and a relatively healthy, young man who committed suicide with one.  so it's about 2 to 1 to the good, but it's not a "good only" sort of deal.


I've seen suicide by gun, suicide by hanging, suicide by drugs, suicide by single auto accident and suicide by cop.

You know what they all had in common?

They all wanted to kill themselves, and nobody was going to stop them.


----------



## Carla_Danger

PredFan said:


> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement and violence, yes.
Click to expand...



So, what you're saying is that we need more guns and we need more Bibles?  Or are you simply saying that Obamaphones are the leading cause of deaths in this country?


----------



## PredFan

Carla_Danger said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement and violence, yes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So, what you're saying is that we need more guns and we need more Bibles?  Or are you simply saying that Obamaphones are the leading cause of deaths in this country?
Click to expand...


Typical Progressive with selective hearing. I said culture of violence first and foremost but you continually ignore that. I never said anything about bibles or obamaphones.

You people are the reason these killings happen. As long as you keep focussing on the tool used to kill and not the reasons for killing, we will always suffer these kind of tragedies.


----------



## Carla_Danger

PredFan said:


> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> We should be the safest country in the world....why aren't we?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement and violence, yes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So, what you're saying is that we need more guns and we need more Bibles?  Or are you simply saying that Obamaphones are the leading cause of deaths in this country?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Typical Progressive with selective hearing. I said culture of violence first and for most but you continually ignore that. I never said anything about bibles or obamaphones.
> 
> You people are the reason these killings happen. As long as you keep focussing on the tool used to kill and not the reasons for killing, we will always suffer these kind of tragedies.
Click to expand...



Okay, you'll have to explain what you mean by adding "entitlement" for the reason why America is such a dangerous country.  Your friend used the Obamaphone as an example.

I'll wait here for you to explain that one.

It seems odd that you think adding additional guns to a culture of violence is the answer.  Seeing how we have more guns than any other country....how's that working out so far?


----------



## PredFan

Carla_Danger said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carla_Danger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because of a culture of violence and entitlement that exists here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Entitlement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Entitlement and violence, yes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So, what you're saying is that we need more guns and we need more Bibles?  Or are you simply saying that Obamaphones are the leading cause of deaths in this country?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Typical Progressive with selective hearing. I said culture of violence first and for most but you continually ignore that. I never said anything about bibles or obamaphones.
> 
> You people are the reason these killings happen. As long as you keep focussing on the tool used to kill and not the reasons for killing, we will always suffer these kind of tragedies.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, you'll have to explain what you mean by adding "entitlement" for the reason why America is such a dangerous country.  Your friend used the Obamaphone as an example.
> 
> I'll wait here for you to explain that one.
> 
> It seems odd that you think adding additional guns to a culture of violence is the answer.  Seeing how we have more guns than any other country....how's that working out so far?
Click to expand...


I'll try to explain it to you but you are a progressive anti-gun nut who probably won't listen. Robbery is essentially a feeling of entitlement. You feel you can just take what you want. You want it so you should have it.

As far as your other point, again you focus only on the tool used. You don't care about the reasons people kill, mainly because it doesn't fit the narrative or further your agenda.

Now, I don't expect YOU to listen, much less agree, and this is not a thread for debate. I am posting examples of people who's lives and property are saved because someone had a gun. These are facts.


----------



## Carla_Danger

PredFan said:


> I'll try to explain it to you but you are a progressive anti-gun nut who probably won't listen. Robbery is essentially a feeling of entitlement. You feel you can just take what you want. You want it so you should have it.



Do you have any stats showing gun deaths resulting from robberies compared to all other types of gun deaths?



PredFan said:


> As far as your other point, again you focus only on the tool used. You don't care about the reasons people kill, mainly because it doesn't fit the narrative or further your agenda.



The claim in your title is that more people are saved by guns. However, statistics prove you wrong, especially for women.

Having a Gun in the House Doesn t Make a Woman Safer - The Atlantic




PredFan said:


> Now, I don't expect YOU to listen, much less agree, and this is not a thread for debate. I am posting examples of people who's lives and property are saved because someone had a gun. These are facts.



This is not a thread for debate?  Wow, I was under the impression that this is a debate forum.


----------



## PredFan

Carla_Danger said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll try to explain it to you but you are a progressive anti-gun nut who probably won't listen. Robbery is essentially a feeling of entitlement. You feel you can just take what you want. You want it so you should have it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have any stats showing gun deaths resulting from robberies compared to all other types of gun deaths?
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> As far as your other point, again you focus only on the tool used. You don't care about the reasons people kill, mainly because it doesn't fit the narrative or further your agenda.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The claim in your title is that more people are saved by guns. However, statistics prove you wrong, especially for women.
> 
> Having a Gun in the House Doesn t Make a Woman Safer - The Atlantic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now, I don't expect YOU to listen, much less agree, and this is not a thread for debate. I am posting examples of people who's lives and property are saved because someone had a gun. These are facts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is not a thread for debate?  Wow, I was under the impression that this is a debate forum.
Click to expand...


Wow! On top of all of your other shortcomings, you are illiterate too!

There are two or more meanings when someone uses the word "more". One would be " more" in comparison to something else, the other would be "more" as in additional. If I had used the word "more" in comparison, as you are implying, I would have said "more than (something). I meant "more" as in additional examples of lives and property saved by a person with a gun.

And as far as this thread, it's purpose is exactly what I (the OP) intended it to be. I did not intend for it to be a debate thread. Yes, it's a debate forum and I can't stop you from spouting you silliness here but do you know the difference between a thread and a forum? Probably not.

Your lack of education explains why you are both a liberal and an anti-gun lunatic.


----------



## PredFan

More* lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun:
Farmer Returned Home After Receiving a Call From His Concerned Wife. As Soon as He Entered the House Mayhem Broke Loose. TheBlaze.com

*for you illiterate liberals, "more" in this case means "additional".


----------



## PredFan

A concealed carrier saves more lives:

Guns Save Lives Gunman Opens Fire on Pastor in Church Pastor Pulls His Concealed Gun and Returns Fire


----------



## Gunman

Was stopped by two guys one had a knife out.. Pulled up my shirt showed pistol butt.. Walked on into store bought my Lotto Tickets and went home.. No problem.. Guess outcome if I did not have pistol..


----------



## PredFan

More lives saved by a good guy with a gun.

Santa Fe Homeowner Uses Warning Shot To Dissuade Burglar


----------



## PredFan

One good guy with a gun helps cops nab 4 bad guys:

Good Samaritan With Gun Helps Cops Nab a Quartet of Thugs John Hawkins Right Wing News


----------



## 2aguy

PredFan said:


> One good guy with a gun helps cops nab 4 bad guys:
> 
> Good Samaritan With Gun Helps Cops Nab a Quartet of Thugs John Hawkins Right Wing News



And the best part....not a shot was fired......unlike what the anti gunners say about situations like this....and another thing to point out.....one man vs. 4 violent criminals and he was able to capture them...because he had a gun......how many other crimes have been stopped because he caught them and held them for police.....

Of course....since no shots were fired, and no one was killed....it won't be counted in the plus column for guns.....


----------



## PredFan

A good guy with a gun ends a criminal's career:

Concealed Carrying Customer Kills Criminal In Milwaukee Barbershop Robbery - Bearing Arms


----------



## Gunman

Just look on the back of NRA news letters ... their is always 4-5 story's like this ....


----------



## PredFan

Gunman said:


> Just look on the back of NRA news letters ... their is always 4-5 story's like this ....



Well you know those idiot left wing gun grabbers, they have to have a link.


----------



## PredFan

Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:

Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News


----------



## Gunman

Just be glad it not Right Wing Dismissive Disorder...! ! !


----------



## Gunman

OOp's Make that Left Wing Dismissive Order.... Right Wing Bee OK... ! ! !   '' Hell I don't know '' what's right...


----------



## Mr. H.

PredFan said:


> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News


One of the robbers was shot at while fleeing? 
That doesn't seem right.


----------



## PredFan

Gunman said:


> OOp's Make that Left Wing Dismissive Order.... Right Wing Bee OK... ! ! !   '' Hell I don't know '' what's right...


Lol, and I just changed it, right before I saw your post.


----------



## PredFan

Mr. H. said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News
> 
> 
> 
> One of the robbers was shot at while fleeing?
> That doesn't seem right.
Click to expand...


It's right. Let him go he can do it again. Probably save more lives.


----------



## Mr. H.

PredFan said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News
> 
> 
> 
> One of the robbers was shot at while fleeing?
> That doesn't seem right.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's right. Let him go he can do it again. Probably save more lives.
Click to expand...

I was taught otherwise. It may just be Illinois statute, but a fleeing perpetrator is hardly a threat.


----------



## Gunman

I guess you saw those guys in France were running ,,, then they stopped as Cop was Backing up as fast as
he could... Bad guys got out and killed Cop as he was Running away... OK for Bad guys to kill Cops that are Fleeing... BUT ... NOT Ok for good guys to kill Bad guys that are Fleeing.. Right...? ? ?


----------



## Politico

Mr. H. said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News
> 
> 
> 
> One of the robbers was shot at while fleeing?
> That doesn't seem right.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's right. Let him go he can do it again. Probably save more lives.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I was taught otherwise. It may just be Illinois statute, but a fleeing perpetrator is hardly a threat.
Click to expand...

You are from Illinois? Not surprising.


----------



## Mr. H.

Politico said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News
> 
> 
> 
> One of the robbers was shot at while fleeing?
> That doesn't seem right.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's right. Let him go he can do it again. Probably save more lives.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I was taught otherwise. It may just be Illinois statute, but a fleeing perpetrator is hardly a threat.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are from Illinois? Not surprising.
Click to expand...

Git some, Brotch.


----------



## Gunman

Gunman is from TEXAS--- Just look in the back window of most Pick-up trucks here ... Nothing like a old 30-30...


----------



## PredFan

Mr. H. said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News
> 
> 
> 
> One of the robbers was shot at while fleeing?
> That doesn't seem right.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's right. Let him go he can do it again. Probably save more lives.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I was taught otherwise. It may just be Illinois statute, but a fleeing perpetrator is hardly a threat.
Click to expand...


Well, if he gets charged then you are right. If not.....


----------



## Gunman

Their are what,,3.5 guns for every Human in the USA,, how you gonna get all them guns now,,, how you gonna control who gets a gun,, all you gun control freaks are gonna do is keep on crying,, Guess your mamma must have spanked you as a child,, and you are still crying..! ! !


----------



## PredFan

Idiot perp brings a machete to a gun fight. More lives and property saved by a GGWAG:

Man SHOOTS Machete-Wielding Neighbor when He Busts THROUGH the Door Warning Disturbing Video


----------



## PredFan

Another worthless thug takes a dirt nap at the hands of a good guy with a gun.

Thug 8217 s last words 8220 I Thought YOU Couldn 8217 t own a Gun in New Jersey 8221


----------



## PredFan

A compilation of people who's lives and property were saved by a good guy with a gun:


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News


Had it gone sour, what then?  Robbers is plural.  If they are there to take the money, is a civilians life worth a couple of hundred bucks?  Pulling that hogleg is more likely to get bystanders killed than not.  You watch way too many hero movies.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yet more lives and property saved by good guys with guns:
> 
> Restaurant Owners Forced to the Ground by Armed Robbers Then Out of Nowhere the Tables Turn John Hawkins Right Wing News
> 
> 
> 
> Had it gone sour, what then?  Robbers is plural.  If they are there to take the money, is a civilians life worth a couple of hundred bucks?  Pulling that hogleg is more likely to get bystanders killed than not.  You watch way too many hero movies.
Click to expand...


We can play the "what if" game back and forth until the cows come home, but the facts are that it didn't happen that way. There are many other examples in this thread.  "What if" is childish nonsense.


----------



## PredFan

I get these on my Twitter and Facebook feeds every day, I'm too busy to post them all. Yet the gun grabbing idiots here and our idiot president claim that this never happens.

Police: Concealed carry license holder kills armed gunman


----------



## 2aguy

PredFan said:


> I get these on my Twitter and Facebook feeds every day, I'm too busy to post them all. Yet the gun grabbing idiots here and our idiot president claim that this never happens.
> 
> Police: Concealed carry license holder kills armed gunman




you beat me.....


----------



## PredFan

Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey



The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:



> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.



Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.


----------



## jon_berzerk

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
Click to expand...


i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital 

where they got arrested 

hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store


----------



## Daryl Hunt

jon_berzerk said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
Click to expand...


Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.


----------



## jon_berzerk

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
Click to expand...


well it didnt go badly 

could have gone much worse 

had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
Click to expand...


Yet every single day lives and property are saved by good guys with guns. I don't recall innocents ever getting shot by one of these guys who protect themselves and their families. You don't know how many lives he saved that say but we do know how many innocents were killed or injured: 0.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
Click to expand...


He's very much a hero. You must be a bit angry that no one but the bad guys got injured. It would help you with your gun hatred if they did, wouldn't it?


----------



## 2aguy

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
Click to expand...




And when 2 men point guns at you and say they will murder you if you don't cooperate…do you believe them?  Or do you play the odds…..?   When it is you….you make the choice…I am not faulting him for his since too often these thugs murder people after the robbery.


----------



## 2aguy

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yet every single day lives and property are saved by good guys with guns. I don't recall innocents ever getting shot by one of these guys who protect themselves and their families. You don't know how many lives he saved that say but we do know how many innocents were killed or injured: 0.
Click to expand...



Pred…..you should post these in current events…there are more issues than just guns here….


----------



## Wry Catcher

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
Click to expand...


Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.


----------



## PredFan

Wry Catcher said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
Click to expand...


How very ironic.

Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:

#lives saved = 1
#innocents injured = 0

There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.


----------



## Wry Catcher

PredFan said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
Click to expand...


Here's the problem, gun safety:

*1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*

LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.


----------



## PredFan

Wry Catcher said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
Click to expand...


Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.

This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?

Go ahead try.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

jon_berzerk said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
Click to expand...


Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
Click to expand...


"Could have"
"Would have"
"If"
"Would be"

You are creating an imaginary scenario that is tailor made to fit your fears. Until you can show how anyone was in danger or injured (other than the perps), or cases where an innocent was injured by a good guy with a gun, you have absolutely nothing at all and this clerk is exactly the hero we all know him to be.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
Click to expand...


The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
Click to expand...


Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.

"Might have" there you go again.

I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.

Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.

You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.


----------



## Wry Catcher

I don't have too.  It is self evi


PredFan said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
Click to expand...


I don't have to, it is self evident that innocents have beenh shot when the target is missed, as anyone who watches the news knows,


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
Click to expand...

 Wow, brick and mortar stopped being used when they discovered drywall with an aluminum framing.  The fake walls you see aren't really bricks at all.  Bricks cost too much for construction of a wall that will be moved or removed every time the store changes businesses.

I own a gun to protect myself from the nutz that are carrying guns like you.  The chances of being confronted by a Bad Guy blasting away is almost nil.  The chances of you shooting another person is much higher than that.  There are reasons that many states have the charges of illegal firearm discharge and public endangerment.


----------



## Wry Catcher

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
Click to expand...


The moron ^^^ doth protest too much.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

Wry Catcher said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The moron ^^^ doth protest too much.
Click to expand...


----------



## jon_berzerk

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another good guy with a gun saves lives and property.
> T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
Click to expand...

*Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*

that is a bunch of hogwash


----------



## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
Click to expand...


the only "might have" the guy misses is 

the bad guys with gun might have killed the clerks


----------



## PredFan

Wry Catcher said:


> I don't have too.  It is self evi
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Correct and spot on.  Sadly predan is a dope and lacks any ability to think beyond the talking points he has been told to believe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't have to, it is self evident that innocents have beenh shot when the target is missed, as anyone who watches the news knows,
Click to expand...


That's just a plain old lie. That's all you have is lies.

Dismissed.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> How very ironic.
> 
> Here's a thought you idiots aren't able to have:
> 
> #lives saved = 1
> #innocents injured = 0
> 
> There is nothing correct or spot on about his post, and another uneducated parroting hack like you supporting him doesn't change that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wow, brick and mortar stopped being used when they discovered drywall with an aluminum framing.  The fake walls you see aren't really bricks at all.  Bricks cost too much for construction of a wall that will be moved or removed every time the store changes businesses.
> 
> I own a gun to protect myself from the nutz that are carrying guns like you.  The chances of being confronted by a Bad Guy blasting away is almost nil.  The chances of you shooting another person is much higher than that.  There are reasons that many states have the charges of illegal firearm discharge and public endangerment.
Click to expand...


Jesus you gun grabbers are ignorant. They don't build 7-11s out of drywall and aluminum.

Yet none of you liars can show me one single incident where some innocent person was killed while a good guy was trying to stop a bad guy.

Spin, lie and deflect, that is all you have. You are finished until you can prove what you claim. 

Dismissed.


----------



## PredFan

jon_berzerk said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
Click to expand...


Bull shit is all he has.


----------



## Wry Catcher

Daryl Hunt said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the problem, gun safety:
> 
> *1. Treat all guns as though they are loaded.
> 2. Never point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to destroy.
> 3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target and you’re prepared to fire.
> 4. Always confirm your target, as well as what’s in front, behind, and around it.*
> 
> LE is trained on the use of force in crowded urban environments; Civilians are trained at a range.  Point #4 is at issue, and your opinions are all biased and all ill considered.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The moron ^^^ doth protest too much.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


Very good and very appropriate.  I sure miss that show,  too bad Nixon and his pals disrespected the spirit of the First Amendment.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

jon_berzerk said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> The alleged bad guys never fired a shot.  But yet the place was riddled with bullet holes.  From your own cite:
> 
> Do you know just how lucky no innocents weren't hit from this nut with a gun going off like that?  He fired multiple times and hit only two.  The rest went off target.  Bullets don't know the difference between a bad guy or an innocent.  The money isn't worth one single innocent.  Or even the chance of hitting an innocent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
Click to expand...


LEt's look at the law.  



> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.





> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.



This is where I live.


> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> i like the part where the two suspects drove themselves to the hospital
> 
> where they got arrested
> 
> hopefully they will think twice before they rob another store
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


ZZZZZZZZzzz......

Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gun Shot Wounds have that tendency.    Let's try real hard not to make the store clerk a hero.  It could have gone very badly with all those misses.  A bullet has no conscience.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
Click to expand...


LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.  

No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
Click to expand...


Zero credibility, moron.


----------



## 2aguy

Wry Catcher said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bull shit. Walls are very good bullet stops. Prove that there were people there that nearly got shot. What you and the guy you are defending are doing is paranoid "what-ifs". FACT is that no one was injured other than the perps, and lives were likely saved.
> 
> This thread and others are full of examples where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Can you match them with examples of a good guy with a gun injuring innocents while trying to stop a bad guy?
> 
> Go ahead try.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The 9mm and up will pass through the walls of a chain store like a knife though butter.  And there might have been hits inside the store.  "Everyone hit the ground" is an indication that there WERE others in the store.  Only heroes in the movies should be doing this.  Next you will say he intentionally hit them in the groin and leg.  Sometimes, it's better to just give them the money and let the security cameras help the cops bring them in.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong doofus. Only if the walls of the store are made of drywall only. They don't call them "brick and mortar" stores for nothing.
> 
> "Might have" there you go again.
> 
> I'm sure there were others inside the store but they didn't get hit so it means that the good guy did know where the others were and took pains to avoid casualties. The FACT remains that no one else got hit.
> 
> Security cameras do not act as bullet proof vests. When you are dead, it's too late to draw your weapon.
> 
> You are wrong, he is a hero, no innocents were injured, another clear example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy with a gun. You cannot change those facts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The moron ^^^ doth protest too much.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Very good and very appropriate.  I sure miss that show,  too bad Nixon and his pals disrespected the spirit of the First Amendment.
Click to expand...



And the clintons actually broke laws....and not only the spirit but the actual protections in the Bill of Rights.....


----------



## 2aguy

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
Click to expand...



You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....

kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...


----------



## PredFan

2aguy said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> 
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
Click to expand...


He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.


----------



## jon_berzerk

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> well it didnt go badly
> 
> could have gone much worse
> 
> had the clerks been at the mercy of the bad guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, it could have had collateral damage as well.  Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes.  Misdemeanors but crimes just as well.  Or, if he hit any bystanders with his misses (sounds like he unloaded his gun out the barrel) he would be facing Manslaughter chargers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
Click to expand...


we have open carry out here 

and we do not see that happening out here 

why lie 

is that all you got


----------



## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Most states would have charged the teller with two crimes*
> 
> that is a bunch of hogwash
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “…consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that circumstances exist or that a result will follow… and that disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would exercise in the situation…” 720 ILCS 5/4-6.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *14A.60.020 Discharge of a Firearm.*
> (Amended by Ordinance No. 178428, effective May 26, 2004.)
> 
> *A.* It is unlawful for any person to discharge a firearm in the City or upon its boundaries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 1.  Unlawful to fire any firearm, including BB or pellet gun within the city limits, unless (AD):
> -- on-duty law enforcement
> -- as a part of an authorized class at a shooting range
> -- permission is granted by the chief of police
> 2.  Firearm will be confiscated upon any violation of this section.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So we have quotes directly out of the laws of 3 states that the sales associate would have been charged with two counts for firing that weapon.  And that is if they don't hit anyone or anything.
> 
> You will notice that your article doesn't say that the two were armed and brandishing weapons.  They were suspected and the associate fired on them.  Chances are, the associate will be disassociated from the store and face a ton of civil suits.  Not to worry, the two charges that would have been charged if he hadn't hit anyone would be misdemenors and only cost a few hundred bucks.  But he hit both parties.  This whole thing stinks from the first sentence on.  You want to shoot someone, be willing to pay the price.  It might be very high like in this case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
Click to expand...


from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be 

out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry


----------



## PredFan

This thread is full of examples of good guys with guns stopping bad guys with or without guns, and it isn't even listing every single event. This stuff happens every day. But the gun grabbers here can't seem to find one time where a good guy with a gun ever injured an innocent bystander. Likely, it's because they ae full of shit.


----------



## jon_berzerk

PredFan said:


> This thread is full of examples of good guys with guns stopping bad guys with or without guns, and it isn't even listing every single event. This stuff happens every day. But the gun grabbers here can't seem to find one time where a good guy with a gun ever injured an innocent bystander. Likely, it's because they ae full of shit.



 most of them are kooks that is why 

an example 

they depend on "it could happen" that some by stander might get hit 

yet

find it impossible that a situation  "could happen"  as to why one carries a concealed firearm 

they also live in some fairy tale land 

where the bad guy will always do the right thing 

--LOL


----------



## Daryl Hunt

jon_berzerk said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's look at the law.
> 
> This is where I live.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
Click to expand...


In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.
Click to expand...


I'm still waiting for you to show where innocent people got hurt from someone using their CCW weapon to stop crime.  You still haven't and you still are completely full of shit.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm still waiting for you to show where innocent people got hurt from someone using their CCW weapon to stop crime.  You still haven't and you still are completely full of shit.
Click to expand...


LEt's use your own cite.  The wall was covered with bullet holes and he only hit the bad guys with 3.  That means he probably had an 18 shot and emptied it.  That is 15 shots that missed.  Take from an old Combat Troop, there is nothing friendly about friendly fire.  I know that Law Enforcement also makes the same charge.  It's for a reason.  Even one innocent life taken is a tragedy.  And there isn't enough money in the till to pay that price.

I support CCW yet you keep calling me a gun grabber.  Newsflash:  The only reason I may go armed is to protect me from the hero complex fruitcakes like you.


----------



## jon_berzerk

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.
Click to expand...


we are open carry here 

i dont see what you say at all


----------



## 2aguy

Daryl Hunt said:


> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> ZZZZZZZZzzz......
> 
> Wake me when they charge the guy with anything. You need to be providing those examples of innocent bystanders getting shot by good guys with guns because until you do you have exactly zero credibility on anything.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.
Click to expand...



wrong.....carrying a gun is a right....and you can't use fees, taxes or tests of any kind to prohibit the exercise of a right....that is what the democrats found out when they tried to use Poll Taxes and literacy tests to keep blacks from voting.

If you charge any fee for CCW classes then it becomes unconstitutional.......since the poor will be unable to pay that fee and will be denied the exercise of that right...see the "Equal Protection" clause of the 14th Amendment....the one that knocked out the democrats and their Poll Taxes and literacy tests....


----------



## jon_berzerk

2aguy said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> LEt's see.  Ever wonder why the State of Texas had a no open carry from 1871 to recently?  They got tired of cleaning up the bodies laying around the streets.
> 
> No matter how hard you cry, the laws are tightening up.  Now go back to sleep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> wrong.....carrying a gun is a right....and you can't use fees, taxes or tests of any kind to prohibit the exercise of a right....that is what the democrats found out when they tried to use Poll Taxes and literacy tests to keep blacks from voting.
> 
> If you charge any fee for CCW classes then it becomes unconstitutional.......since the poor will be unable to pay that fee and will be denied the exercise of that right...see the "Equal Protection" clause of the 14th Amendment....the one that knocked out the democrats and their Poll Taxes and literacy tests....
Click to expand...



well such a move would certainly target the poor and minorities


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jon_berzerk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> You realize that you made that up out of your behind.......do you realize that Texas is not the first state to have open carry....not even the 2nd or 3rd.....there are over 30 states that already have it........and the gun murder rate has gone down, not up....
> 
> kind of shoots your point to crap....doesn't it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He has zero credibility. He thinks he can just say shit and we are supposed take it as fact.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> from my perspective the Texas open carry law is more restrictive then need be
> 
> out here we do not need permission from the state to open carry
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In myOpinion, Texas has it right.  In order to open carry, you must qualify for CCW.  We don't have that here and there are some pretty scary nutcases running around with guns on their hips with Hero Complexes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm still waiting for you to show where innocent people got hurt from someone using their CCW weapon to stop crime.  You still haven't and you still are completely full of shit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LEt's use your own cite.  The wall was covered with bullet holes and he only hit the bad guys with 3.  That means he probably had an 18 shot and emptied it.  That is 15 shots that missed.  Take from an old Combat Troop, there is nothing friendly about friendly fire.  I know that Law Enforcement also makes the same charge.  It's for a reason.  Even one innocent life taken is a tragedy.  And there isn't enough money in the till to pay that price.
> 
> I support CCW yet you keep calling me a gun grabber.  Newsflash:  The only reason I may go armed is to protect me from the hero complex fruitcakes like you.
Click to expand...


Yet no one got hurt but the bad guy. And you still can't come up with even one incident where an innocent was hurt. You are talking out of your ignorant ass. Nothing you say has any validity.


----------



## PredFan

Cop saved by a good guy with a gun.

Police: Gun owner saved cop from attack by kids


----------



## sealybobo

PredFan said:


> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.


Google valet with gun stops attack on gm worker. A woman came up to the woman's work and they went outside to discuss and the woman started stabbing the woman. The valet pulls out his gun and stops the woman. The victim is in critical condition. 

Is he a hero? Gm fired him. Not supposed to have a gun at work. Ain't that a bitch?


----------



## sealybobo

They would have killed 


strollingbones said:


> Two Men Use Girl As Human Shield ? Until Her Father Guns Them Down
> 
> 
> i wonder what the outcome would have been for an unarmed household?


The father and daughter may have been raped or murdered


----------



## PredFan

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> Google valet with gun stops attack on gm worker. A woman came up to the woman's work and they went outside to discuss and the woman started stabbing the woman. The valet pulls out his gun and stops the woman. The victim is in critical condition.
> 
> Is he a hero? Gm fired him. Not supposed to have a gun at work. Ain't that a bitch?
Click to expand...


More importantly, a life was saved.


----------



## sealybobo

PredFan said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> Google valet with gun stops attack on gm worker. A woman came up to the woman's work and they went outside to discuss and the woman started stabbing the woman. The valet pulls out his gun and stops the woman. The victim is in critical condition.
> 
> Is he a hero? Gm fired him. Not supposed to have a gun at work. Ain't that a bitch?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More importantly, a life was saved.
Click to expand...

He may not have been fired. Or gm changed their mind. He had a ccw permit


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> Google valet with gun stops attack on gm worker. A woman came up to the woman's work and they went outside to discuss and the woman started stabbing the woman. The valet pulls out his gun and stops the woman. The victim is in critical condition.
> 
> Is he a hero? Gm fired him. Not supposed to have a gun at work. Ain't that a bitch?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More importantly, a life was saved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He may not have been fired. Or gm changed their mind. He had a ccw permit
Click to expand...



It should be a civil rights case.....if bakers have to make cakes for gay couples as a civil right, how can businesses deny employment to someone exercising another right?


----------



## TyroneSlothrop

*31* cases of voter impersonation since 2000.

*32,000 *gun deaths in America THIS YEAR.

* Guess which problem the GOP is trying to fix.*


----------



## 2aguy

TyroneSlothrop said:


> *31* cases of voter impersonation since 2000.
> 
> *32,000 *gun deaths in America THIS YEAR.
> 
> * Guess which problem the GOP is trying to fix.*




357 million guns in private hands.

Less than 8,124 used to commit murder, the majority are career criminals murdering other career criminals and using the guns illegally.

That leaves 356,991,8767 million guns in private hands.....not used by the law abiding owners to commit murder.....

Can you tell which number is bigger?


There were 35,000 accidental car deaths....

in 2013 there were 505 accidental gun deaths....

Guess which object the left hates the most........


----------



## sealybobo

2aguy said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> Google valet with gun stops attack on gm worker. A woman came up to the woman's work and they went outside to discuss and the woman started stabbing the woman. The valet pulls out his gun and stops the woman. The victim is in critical condition.
> 
> Is he a hero? Gm fired him. Not supposed to have a gun at work. Ain't that a bitch?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More importantly, a life was saved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He may not have been fired. Or gm changed their mind. He had a ccw permit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It should be a civil rights case.....if bakers have to make cakes for gay couples as a civil right, how can businesses deny employment to someone exercising another right?
Click to expand...

Not at their workplace.

Not in court either.


----------



## PredFan

TyroneSlothrop said:


> *31* cases of voter impersonation since 2000.
> 
> *32,000 *gun deaths in America THIS YEAR.
> 
> * Guess which problem the GOP is trying to fix.*



As evidenced in this thread, many many lives and much property have been saved by good guys with guns. Your point is moot.


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> Google valet with gun stops attack on gm worker. A woman came up to the woman's work and they went outside to discuss and the woman started stabbing the woman. The valet pulls out his gun and stops the woman. The victim is in critical condition.
> 
> Is he a hero? Gm fired him. Not supposed to have a gun at work. Ain't that a bitch?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More importantly, a life was saved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He may not have been fired. Or gm changed their mind. He had a ccw permit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It should be a civil rights case.....if bakers have to make cakes for gay couples as a civil right, how can businesses deny employment to someone exercising another right?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Not at their workplace.
> 
> Not in court either.
Click to expand...



Can a business discriminate in hiring based on Race?


----------



## PredFan

Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.

Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber


----------



## sealybobo

PredFan said:


> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber


I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?

We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.  

Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows

*Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*

*Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
Click to expand...



That study is wrong.....it hasn't come close to tripling...they started counting every incident with guns they could find......is hemenway involved.....?


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
Click to expand...



Yeah...I have posted the Mother Jones data....and they have not been increasing...they are lying.


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
Click to expand...



And this is how they lie.........

We used a Statistical Process Control method that analyzes the time interval between each incident. *This is more effective than counting the annual number of incidents because it is more sensitive to detecting changes in frequency when the number of events per year is small,* as is the case with public mass shootings.

Soooooo...actually counting the incidents that happen each year isn't accurate.....but estimating time between the incidents is........

Never...ever trust gun grabbers....the truth, the facts and the reality do not support any of their claims...so they have to make them up......


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
Click to expand...



And the FBI report they cite....the FBI also reported that those numbers they reported were off....

I have posted about these things in particular quite often........


----------



## 2aguy

2aguy said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> And this is how they lie.........
> 
> We used a Statistical Process Control method that analyzes the time interval between each incident. *This is more effective than counting the annual number of incidents because it is more sensitive to detecting changes in frequency when the number of events per year is small,* as is the case with public mass shootings.
> 
> Soooooo...actually counting the incidents that happen each year isn't accurate.....but estimating time between the incidents is........
> 
> Never...ever trust gun grabbers....the truth, the facts and the reality do not support any of their claims...so they have to make them up......
Click to expand...



Yes....actually counting the number of events each year....to see how many there actually were....would be the wrong way......because it would actually show no increase in the actual number of mass public shootings.......

And that would just ruin their whole agenda to push for more gun control.......

So they came up with this pixie dust way to show more mass public shootings.....


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
Click to expand...




And here is the actual Mother Jones Mass shooting data.....notice anything about the number of mass public shootings.....and Mother Jones is not a pro gun organization...

If you go to their link, below,  you can actually count the number of mass shootings each year.......I have that somewhere but couldn't find it right away.....

Here is the left wing news source...Mother Jones...they hate guns, ..they too have tracked mass shootings...and here is what they found...

If you go to the link they list each year and the specific mass shootings with details....injured, killed, weapons used.....

US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

Sooooo....


US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

*US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation*



How many deaths on average according to Mother Jones...anti gun, uber left wing Mother Jones.......each year, well less than 73.

*2015......37*
2014..... 9
2013..... 36
2012..... 72
2011..... 19
2010....9
2009...39
2008...18
2007...54
2006...21
2005...17
2004...5
2003...7
2002...not listed by mother jones
2001...5
2000...7


----------



## PredFan

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
Click to expand...


You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.


----------



## sealybobo

PredFan said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
Click to expand...

I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun


----------



## PredFan

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
Click to expand...


Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.

And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.


----------



## sealybobo

PredFan said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
Click to expand...

What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?


----------



## Ringel05

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?
Click to expand...

The economy, mostly.


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
Click to expand...



You just used the magic words "Background Check" as if it has some bearing on criminals and guns......

How does a background check keep criminals from getting guns...or mass shooters?  I am still waiting for an anti gunner to explain how they work....since criminals simply use people with clean records to buy their guns, or simply steal them.....nullifying the background check...even the universal background check.....


The only reason for a background check...is to show they don't work to stop gun crime.....then the anti gunners can push universal background checks....and then they won't work...and then the anti gunners can move on to what they really want...registering all guns in private hands...since you can't have Universal background checks without universal gun registration......


----------



## 2aguy

PredFan said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
Click to expand...



No.....it isn't Americans who are violent...it is a tiny number of people, mostly confined to tiny, multi block areas in our democrat controlled cities.......

Out of a country of over 320 million people, we have 8,124 gun murders.....and those are majority  committed by career criminals with long histories of crime and violence and  are done against other career criminals with long histories of crime and violence.......

Americans own over 357 million guns...and less than 8,124 are used to commit gun murder....that is not a majority, it isn't even a larger minority......it is in fact a statistically insignificant number..........


----------



## sealybobo

Ringel05 said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The economy, mostly.
Click to expand...

True. Uber drivers don't make shit

But also people shoot other people because of religion and politics.


----------



## sealybobo

2aguy said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You just used the magic words "Background Check" as if it has some bearing on criminals and guns......
> 
> How does a background check keep criminals from getting guns...or mass shooters?  I am still waiting for an anti gunner to explain how they work....since criminals simply use people with clean records to buy their guns, or simply steal them.....nullifying the background check...even the universal background check.....
> 
> 
> The only reason for a background check...is to show they don't work to stop gun crime.....then the anti gunners can push universal background checks....and then they won't work...and then the anti gunners can move on to what they really want...registering all guns in private hands...since you can't have Universal background checks without universal gun registration......
Click to expand...

If you buy a gun for someone who shouldn't have one you should go to jail. In fact you will.


----------



## Ringel05

sealybobo said:


> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The economy, mostly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> True. Uber drivers don't make shit
> 
> But also people shoot other people because of religion and politics.
Click to expand...

People kill people for all kinds of reasons and have since humans existed.


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You just used the magic words "Background Check" as if it has some bearing on criminals and guns......
> 
> How does a background check keep criminals from getting guns...or mass shooters?  I am still waiting for an anti gunner to explain how they work....since criminals simply use people with clean records to buy their guns, or simply steal them.....nullifying the background check...even the universal background check.....
> 
> 
> The only reason for a background check...is to show they don't work to stop gun crime.....then the anti gunners can push universal background checks....and then they won't work...and then the anti gunners can move on to what they really want...registering all guns in private hands...since you can't have Universal background checks without universal gun registration......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you buy a gun for someone who shouldn't have one you should go to jail. In fact you will.
Click to expand...



Yes....I agree.


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You just used the magic words "Background Check" as if it has some bearing on criminals and guns......
> 
> How does a background check keep criminals from getting guns...or mass shooters?  I am still waiting for an anti gunner to explain how they work....since criminals simply use people with clean records to buy their guns, or simply steal them.....nullifying the background check...even the universal background check.....
> 
> 
> The only reason for a background check...is to show they don't work to stop gun crime.....then the anti gunners can push universal background checks....and then they won't work...and then the anti gunners can move on to what they really want...registering all guns in private hands...since you can't have Universal background checks without universal gun registration......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you buy a gun for someone who shouldn't have one you should go to jail. In fact you will.
Click to expand...



And how does that have anything to do with background checks....this woman passed a background check, then gave the guns to her baby daddy, a felon 3x over.........


----------



## sealybobo

2aguy said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You just used the magic words "Background Check" as if it has some bearing on criminals and guns......
> 
> How does a background check keep criminals from getting guns...or mass shooters?  I am still waiting for an anti gunner to explain how they work....since criminals simply use people with clean records to buy their guns, or simply steal them.....nullifying the background check...even the universal background check.....
> 
> 
> The only reason for a background check...is to show they don't work to stop gun crime.....then the anti gunners can push universal background checks....and then they won't work...and then the anti gunners can move on to what they really want...registering all guns in private hands...since you can't have Universal background checks without universal gun registration......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you buy a gun for someone who shouldn't have one you should go to jail. In fact you will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> And how does that have anything to do with background checks....this woman passed a background check, then gave the guns to her baby daddy, a felon 3x over.........
Click to expand...

There is no one solution that will solve this.

I'm for lowering the risk.

A. More cops. Better cops. Better response times. 
B. More ccw carriers.
C. Background check or no straw purchases. We all know the NRA lobby's for the gun manufacturers. They like the status quo.

We can do things to lower the risks. No easy answer to this one. Not gonna ban guns and people be crazy. What cha gonna do?


----------



## PredFan

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good guy with a gun refuses to be a victim.
> 
> Minnesota Man With Firearm Permit Refuses to Be a Victim, Shoots Would-Be Robber
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?
Click to expand...


Obama. Reid.

Seriously, I'm not saying angry, I'm saying violent. I don't know why, but until we find out, people will continue to die even if we take all the guns away.


----------



## MaryL

PredFan said:


> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.


That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.


----------



## PredFan

MaryL said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.
Click to expand...

 It is in fact happening. This thread is full of examples and doesn't even scratch the surface.


----------



## sealybobo

PredFan said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've come to the conclusion we need to stop thinking we have a gun problem.  We have a nut problem.  If there were no guns we'd have people stabbing people to death or beating them with baseball bats.  Then what?  Ban knives and baseball?
> 
> We need to figure out why people in America are going nuts.
> 
> Rate of mass shootings has tripled since 2011, new research from Harvard shows
> 
> *Rate of Mass Shootings Has Tripled Since 2011, Harvard Research Shows*
> 
> *Why are 3 times the number of people today crazier than they were in 2011?  WHat has changed?  Is their lead in our drinking water?*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Obama. Reid.
> 
> Seriously, I'm not saying angry, I'm saying violent. I don't know why, but until we find out, people will continue to die even if we take all the guns away.
Click to expand...

It's right wing divisive propaganda


----------



## jon_berzerk

MaryL said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.
Click to expand...



it happens all the time


----------



## MaryL

PredFan said:


> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It is in fact happening. This thread is full of examples and doesn't even scratch the surface.
Click to expand...

It's full of facts? I am not seeing it. The last mass murder incident was caused by and stopped by firearms. What is the big plus in this I am missing? The math here is weak. It's a phony self sustaining argument. We NEED guns because....? To protect ourselves from other people with guns? Let's get past that argument.


----------



## 2aguy

sealybobo said:


> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You just used the magic words "Background Check" as if it has some bearing on criminals and guns......
> 
> How does a background check keep criminals from getting guns...or mass shooters?  I am still waiting for an anti gunner to explain how they work....since criminals simply use people with clean records to buy their guns, or simply steal them.....nullifying the background check...even the universal background check.....
> 
> 
> The only reason for a background check...is to show they don't work to stop gun crime.....then the anti gunners can push universal background checks....and then they won't work...and then the anti gunners can move on to what they really want...registering all guns in private hands...since you can't have Universal background checks without universal gun registration......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you buy a gun for someone who shouldn't have one you should go to jail. In fact you will.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> And how does that have anything to do with background checks....this woman passed a background check, then gave the guns to her baby daddy, a felon 3x over.........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> There is no one solution that will solve this.
> 
> I'm for lowering the risk.
> 
> A. More cops. Better cops. Better response times.
> B. More ccw carriers.
> C. Background check or no straw purchases. We all know the NRA lobby's for the gun manufacturers. They like the status quo.
> 
> We can do things to lower the risks. No easy answer to this one. Not gonna ban guns and people be crazy. What cha gonna do?
Click to expand...



And the inner twit comes out.....do you just accept the crap the anti gunners say without thinking about it.....yes..sadly you do if you post this crap.

Background checks do not keep guns out of the hands of criminals and mass shooters.....please...tell me how they kept a 3x felon from getting an AK variant rifle and a pistol....using them to shoot his coworkers...in a gun free zone........

And how do you stop a straw purchase?  The baby momma passed her background checks for those guns...background checks the NRA supports twit.

You lock up straw purchasers when you catch them and tell prosecutors and judges to actually lock them up...


There is one gap in the system.....that is what happens after cops arrest gun criminals....prosecutors and judges let them go.....


----------



## 2aguy

MaryL said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It is in fact happening. This thread is full of examples and doesn't even scratch the surface.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's full of facts? I am not seeing it. The last mass murder incident was caused by and stopped by firearms. What is the big plus in this I am missing? The math here is weak. It's a phony self sustaining argument. We NEED guns because....? To protect ourselves from other people with guns? Let's get past that argument.
Click to expand...



Get past it.....yes.....let's get rid of truth, reality and facts...and focus on unicorns and pixie dust....

Americans use guns 1,500,000 times a year to stop violent criminal attack and save lives...according to bill clinton and barak obama.......

In 2013 over 11.1 million people carried guns for self defense  and the gun murder rate went down......

In 2014 there were over 13 million people carrying guns for self defense...and the gun murder rate went down....

So how do you explain that with what you posted..........

1,500,000 violent criminals stopped by Armed Americans.

in 2014 there were 8,124 gun murders, the majority of which were violent career criminals murdering other career criminals....

So  

1,500,000 crimes stopped and lives saved   vs.    8,124 gun murders

Can you tell which number is bigger....and how wrong you are in your statements?


----------



## 2aguy

MaryL said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It is in fact happening. This thread is full of examples and doesn't even scratch the surface.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's full of facts? I am not seeing it. The last mass murder incident was caused by and stopped by firearms. What is the big plus in this I am missing? The math here is weak. It's a phony self sustaining argument. We NEED guns because....? To protect ourselves from other people with guns? Let's get past that argument.
Click to expand...



You realize that there are over 357,000,000 million guns in private hands right?  And the total number of mass public shootings in 2015 was 4...half of which were muslim terrorism...right.....?

And that means that with less than 8,124 guns used to commit gun murder, over 356,991,876 million guns in private hands were not used to commit murder.....owned by normal people who obey the law.....

Which numbers are bigger....?  Can you tell the significance of the difference between the numbers?

The total number of lives taken by these mass shooters....  37.

Here is the left wing news source...Mother Jones...they hate guns, ..they too have tracked mass shootings...and here is what they found...

If you go to the link they list each year and the specific mass shootings with details....injured, killed, weapons used.....

US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

Sooooo....


US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

*US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation*



How many deaths on average according to Mother Jones...anti gun, uber left wing Mother Jones.......each year, well less than 73.

*2015......37*
2014..... 9
2013..... 36
2012..... 72
2011..... 19
2010....9
2009...39
2008...18
2007...54
2006...21
2005...17
2004...5
2003...7
2002...not listed by mother jones
2001...5
2000...7


----------



## PredFan

sealybobo said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct. I've been saying that same thing for years. Instead of looking for answers to "why" people kill, our government and media focuses on the "how" people kill. We will ever stop the killing that way but I don't think the left cares.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think the right cares either. Not like they are big on paying for mental health services or doing background checks or preventing anyone from getting a gun
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now you are incorrect. We very much want to prevent criminals from getting guns, and those who are mentally unstable. The problem is that we still need to address the violence in our society. "Why" do people, even those who previously aren't mentally unstable, commit violent acts? Whatever is causing Americans to be more violent than other countries also has a effect on the mentally unstable, making them more likely to act out violently.
> 
> And it's proven that background checks do nothing to stop violent crime. They are needed for sure, but making them more stringent, more invasive and restricting won't do anything but infringe on our rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is making people so angry? Fox? Rush?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Obama. Reid.
> 
> Seriously, I'm not saying angry, I'm saying violent. I don't know why, but until we find out, people will continue to die even if we take all the guns away.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's right wing divisive propaganda
Click to expand...


Yeah well you are just an idiot. Dismissed.


----------



## PredFan

MaryL said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> That isn't happening. I wish it was, but not so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It is in fact happening. This thread is full of examples and doesn't even scratch the surface.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's full of facts? I am not seeing it. The last mass murder incident was caused by and stopped by firearms. What is the big plus in this I am missing? The math here is weak. It's a phony self sustaining argument. We NEED guns because....? To protect ourselves from other people with guns? Let's get past that argument.
Click to expand...


You didn't look at anything did you. This thread is full of links and stories of people and property saved by guns. You don't want to see anything that you disagree with, ok well then we have nothing to talk about.


----------



## PredFan

More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen



Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.


----------



## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
Click to expand...


Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
Click to expand...


Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.


----------



## Ringel05

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.
Click to expand...

Oh look ma!!  A poser troll!!


----------



## Daryl Hunt

Ringel05 said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh look ma!!  A poser troll!!
Click to expand...


I am the real deal.  In fact, I am an Ogre not a troll.  I do do business with trolls.  I run a Troll underthebridge Real Estate Operation.  And I have openings right now you can take advantage of.  It's affordable.  You move in, settle in then I eat up and place the underthebridge back on the market.  You trolls aren't very bright but Delicious when basted properly.


----------



## RandallFlagg

Folks make me laugh. I grew up with firearms. They sat (loaded) in my parents home for 30 years and never once did they kill anyone, except the yearly deer, rabbits and squirrels.

I spent 22 years in the Army and the DIA. Carried a gun everyday, 365 days a year for 20 of those years. I have never shot anyone that the government of the United States didn't order me to.

Thousands upon thousand of hours spent on rifle and pistol ranges over the years. Still, never had one "accident".

But leave it up to the left to tell me that I, as a veteran, shouldn't be "allowed" to own firearms. I'm sorry, I don't get it.  Leftists are, without doubt, the biggest threat to the United States that we will probably see in our lifetime. Leftists.


----------



## Ringel05

Daryl Hunt said:


> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh look ma!!  A poser troll!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am the real deal.  In fact, I am an Ogre not a troll.  I do do business with trolls.  I run a Troll underthebridge Real Estate Operation.  And I have openings right now you can take advantage of.  It's affordable.  You move in, settle in then I eat up and place the underthebridge back on the market.  You trolls aren't very bright but Delicious when basted properly.
Click to expand...

Finally!  A worthy opponent!!


----------



## Daryl Hunt

RandallFlagg said:


> Folks make me laugh. I grew up with firearms. They sat (loaded) in my parents home for 30 years and never once did they kill anyone, except the yearly deer, rabbits and squirrels.
> 
> I spent 22 years in the Army and the DIA. Carried a gun everyday, 365 days a year for 20 of those years. I have never shot anyone that the government of the United States didn't order me to.
> 
> Thousands upon thousand of hours spent on rifle and pistol ranges over the years. Still, never had one "accident".
> 
> But leave it up to the left to tell me that I, as a veteran, shouldn't be "allowed" to own firearms. I'm sorry, I don't get it.  Leftists are, without doubt, the biggest threat to the United States that we will probably see in our lifetime. Leftists.



And if you insist in believing that the bulk of the Public is like you then maybe you shouldn't have a gun.


----------



## RandallFlagg

Daryl Hunt said:


> RandallFlagg said:
> 
> 
> 
> Folks make me laugh. I grew up with firearms. They sat (loaded) in my parents home for 30 years and never once did they kill anyone, except the yearly deer, rabbits and squirrels.
> 
> I spent 22 years in the Army and the DIA. Carried a gun everyday, 365 days a year for 20 of those years. I have never shot anyone that the government of the United States didn't order me to.
> 
> Thousands upon thousand of hours spent on rifle and pistol ranges over the years. Still, never had one "accident".
> 
> But leave it up to the left to tell me that I, as a veteran, shouldn't be "allowed" to own firearms. I'm sorry, I don't get it.  Leftists are, without doubt, the biggest threat to the United States that we will probably see in our lifetime. Leftists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And if you insist in believing that the bulk of the Public is like you then maybe you shouldn't have a gun.
Click to expand...





People like you make me smile. Shoot me an email and I'll give you my address in Montana. Then, you can come and try to take my guns. We'll see how long you last.


----------



## Daryl Hunt

RandallFlagg said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RandallFlagg said:
> 
> 
> 
> Folks make me laugh. I grew up with firearms. They sat (loaded) in my parents home for 30 years and never once did they kill anyone, except the yearly deer, rabbits and squirrels.
> 
> I spent 22 years in the Army and the DIA. Carried a gun everyday, 365 days a year for 20 of those years. I have never shot anyone that the government of the United States didn't order me to.
> 
> Thousands upon thousand of hours spent on rifle and pistol ranges over the years. Still, never had one "accident".
> 
> But leave it up to the left to tell me that I, as a veteran, shouldn't be "allowed" to own firearms. I'm sorry, I don't get it.  Leftists are, without doubt, the biggest threat to the United States that we will probably see in our lifetime. Leftists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And if you insist in believing that the bulk of the Public is like you then maybe you shouldn't have a gun.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People like you make me smile. Shoot me an email and I'll give you my address in Montana. Then, you can come and try to take my guns. We'll see how long you last.
Click to expand...


If I wanted to take your guns I would have already done it.  I just have to wait until you do something stupid and the guys in white hats with blue haul your sorry ass off as your froth at the mouth screaming about your rights.


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## PredFan

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.
Click to expand...


Dude, you are just a lying asshole. Dismissed.


----------



## Wry Catcher

PredFan said:


> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.



Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?

List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?

Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com


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## Daryl Hunt

PredFan said:


> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, you are just a lying asshole. Dismissed.
Click to expand...


Can I interest you in a nice 2br under a bridge?  Make up your mind, it's almost lunch time.


----------



## 2aguy

Wry Catcher said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
Click to expand...



And how many were saved by guns that ended slavery......and the socialist control of Europe...where they took unarmed and defenseless people and murdered them in gas chambers........took a  lot of guns to stop that.....

you are a twit.


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## PredFan

Wry Catcher said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
Click to expand...


Irrelevant.


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## Ringel05

Wry Catcher said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
Click to expand...

Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........ 

The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?


----------



## Wry Catcher

Ringel05 said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........
> 
> The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?
Click to expand...


"The assassination sent shockwaves throughout Europe. Austro-Hungarian officials discovered the Serbian roots of the plot and declared war on Serbia on July 28, 1914 -- exactly one month after the assassination."

The Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand


----------



## Ringel05

Wry Catcher said:


> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........
> 
> The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "The assassination sent shockwaves throughout Europe. Austro-Hungarian officials discovered the Serbian roots of the plot and declared war on Serbia on July 28, 1914 -- exactly one month after the assassination."
> 
> The Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand
Click to expand...

Guess the phrase; "the straw that broke the camel's back" means nothing to you.


----------



## Wry Catcher

Ringel05 said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........
> 
> The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "The assassination sent shockwaves throughout Europe. Austro-Hungarian officials discovered the Serbian roots of the plot and declared war on Serbia on July 28, 1914 -- exactly one month after the assassination."
> 
> The Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Guess the phrase; "the straw that broke the camel's back" means nothing to you.
Click to expand...


Of course, it's a cliche.  The assassination lit the fuse which cost the lives of millions.  If you want to revise history I'd not be surprised.


----------



## Ringel05

Wry Catcher said:


> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Add some more numbers to the countless lives and property saved bygood guys with guns.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........
> 
> The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "The assassination sent shockwaves throughout Europe. Austro-Hungarian officials discovered the Serbian roots of the plot and declared war on Serbia on July 28, 1914 -- exactly one month after the assassination."
> 
> The Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Guess the phrase; "the straw that broke the camel's back" means nothing to you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course, it's a cliche.  The assassination lit the fuse which cost the lives of millions.  If you want to revise history I'd not be surprised.
Click to expand...

Who's revising history?  If you look at the factors in total you'll find that WWI was inevitable.  If it wasn't the assassination of Ferdinand it would have been something else, many of those involved were looking for a reason to go to war.  Blaming guns (which is what you're obviously doing by default) is stupid at best.


----------



## Wry Catcher

Ringel05 said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> Saved by guns?  Such as the four American Presidents?
> 
> List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> How many millions died as a died a direct result of the shooting & assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand?
> 
> Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated - Jun 28, 1914 - HISTORY.com
> 
> 
> 
> Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........
> 
> The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "The assassination sent shockwaves throughout Europe. Austro-Hungarian officials discovered the Serbian roots of the plot and declared war on Serbia on July 28, 1914 -- exactly one month after the assassination."
> 
> The Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Guess the phrase; "the straw that broke the camel's back" means nothing to you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course, it's a cliche.  The assassination lit the fuse which cost the lives of millions.  If you want to revise history I'd not be surprised.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who's revising history?  If you look at the factors in total you'll find that WWI was inevitable.  If it wasn't the assassination of Ferdinand it would have been something else, many of those involved were looking for a reason to go to war.  Blaming guns (which is what you're obviously doing by default) is stupid at best.
Click to expand...


LOL  Stupid is your rebuttal, the best you've got?   

Do you have anything probative to offer?  If not my advice to you is to STFU, or prove yourself to be the stupid one.


----------



## Ringel05

Wry Catcher said:


> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ringel05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Simplifying the complex..........  Leave it to an agenda driven acolyte to do that........
> 
> The Top 5 Causes That Led to World War I. Could It Happen Again?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "The assassination sent shockwaves throughout Europe. Austro-Hungarian officials discovered the Serbian roots of the plot and declared war on Serbia on July 28, 1914 -- exactly one month after the assassination."
> 
> The Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Guess the phrase; "the straw that broke the camel's back" means nothing to you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course, it's a cliche.  The assassination lit the fuse which cost the lives of millions.  If you want to revise history I'd not be surprised.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who's revising history?  If you look at the factors in total you'll find that WWI was inevitable.  If it wasn't the assassination of Ferdinand it would have been something else, many of those involved were looking for a reason to go to war.  Blaming guns (which is what you're obviously doing by default) is stupid at best.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> LOL  Stupid is your rebuttal, the best you've got?
> 
> Do you have anything probative to offer?  If not my advice to you is to STFU, or prove yourself to be the stupid one.
Click to expand...

Sure thing, Mr "I'm a moderate"...... 

Obviously you're trying to deflect now, is that the best you can do, I mean, really.......  That's pathetic.


----------



## RandallFlagg

Daryl Hunt said:


> RandallFlagg said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RandallFlagg said:
> 
> 
> 
> Folks make me laugh. I grew up with firearms. They sat (loaded) in my parents home for 30 years and never once did they kill anyone, except the yearly deer, rabbits and squirrels.
> 
> I spent 22 years in the Army and the DIA. Carried a gun everyday, 365 days a year for 20 of those years. I have never shot anyone that the government of the United States didn't order me to.
> 
> Thousands upon thousand of hours spent on rifle and pistol ranges over the years. Still, never had one "accident".
> 
> But leave it up to the left to tell me that I, as a veteran, shouldn't be "allowed" to own firearms. I'm sorry, I don't get it.  Leftists are, without doubt, the biggest threat to the United States that we will probably see in our lifetime. Leftists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And if you insist in believing that the bulk of the Public is like you then maybe you shouldn't have a gun.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People like you make me smile. Shoot me an email and I'll give you my address in Montana. Then, you can come and try to take my guns. We'll see how long you last.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If I wanted to take your guns I would have already done it.  I just have to wait until you do something stupid and the guys in white hats with blue haul your sorry ass off as your froth at the mouth screaming about your rights.
Click to expand...



Like I said, sonny, anytime you feel froggy, mister internet tough-guy.


----------



## westwall

Daryl Hunt said:


> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Daryl Hunt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PredFan said:
> 
> 
> 
> More lives and property saved by a good guy with a gun.
> Hatchet Wielding Attacker Stopped by Concealed Carrying Citizen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mother was shot by her 4 year old in a car.   The suicides, accidental shootings and more don't get the press that your Good Guys with Guns get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull shit. It is exactly the opposite.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most retired Military and Cops are uneasy around you fruitcakes.  We end up carrying not to protect us from robbers but to protect us and our loved ones from you, you sick puppy.
Click to expand...








Bullcrap.  Like 90% of your "observations".


----------



## PredFan

Mom shoots intruder multiple times:

Armed mother shoots intruder who entered home through window in baby’s room


----------

