# The Vaccine Hoax is over.



## National Socialist (Jul 22, 2013)

The Vaccine Hoax Is Over: Secret Documents Reveal Shocking Truth | REALfarmacy.com | Healthy News and Information

No shit they are dangerous...no sane parent puts this crap in their kids.


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## Luissa (Jul 22, 2013)

Oh! This is another vaccines causes autism thread. Fun. Lol


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## TakeAStepBack (Jul 22, 2013)

No, it's not. Lol


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## Katzndogz (Jul 22, 2013)

Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.


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## Luissa (Jul 22, 2013)

TakeAStepBack said:


> No, it's not. Lol



Did you read the article?


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## Luissa (Jul 22, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.



You don't have to, but it might hard to have them stay in school.


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## National Socialist (Jul 22, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.


Or you could just poison them with that crap they put in the vaccines its more dangerous than the disease they are SUPPOSED to protect u from but don't.



Luissa said:


> Katzndogz said:
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Nope. My daughter has been in school 2 years and we haven't had any problems with her not having shots. Only 2 states that don't allow anything but medical exemptions are West Va and Mississippi. We use philosophical or religious exemption excuse and seeing how they can't question what religion or philosophy its quite easy to deal with. Just gotta get a paper saying you don't want the shots done notarized which is free.


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## National Socialist (Jul 22, 2013)

Figures the dictators moved this to the wrong forum...nazis..


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## Mad Scientist (Jul 22, 2013)

I've taken no vaccinations or Flu Shots for at least 25 years and my kids were never vaccinated. We're all just fine thank you.


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## National Socialist (Jul 22, 2013)

Same here.


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## Unkotare (Jul 22, 2013)

AnCapAtheist said:


> Figures the dictators moved this to the wrong forum...nazis..




The moderators moved it to the appropriate forum, you nut case.


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## National Socialist (Jul 22, 2013)

Blow it out your ass clown.


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## martybegan (Jul 22, 2013)

AnCapAtheist said:


> Same here.



Yes, because the word of an anonymous internet poster is SOOOO rock solid.

I find it quite idiotic that people hanker back to the days of measles, polio, tetanus and rabies due to some pseudo-scientifc hackery that has been debunked more times than stale air ear-farts out of Jenny Mcarthay's empty twaddled head.


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## daws101 (Jul 22, 2013)

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## eots (Jul 22, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.



why is that crazy lady..


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## eots (Jul 22, 2013)

martybegan said:


> AnCapAtheist said:
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debwunked by who,where when ?


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## eots (Jul 22, 2013)

The federal Vaccine Injury Compensation Program, better known as "vaccine court," has just awarded millions of dollars to two children with autism for "pain and suffering" and lifelong care of their injuries, which together could cost tens of millions of dollars.

David Kirby: Vaccine Court Awards Millions to Two Children With Autism


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## Unkotare (Jul 22, 2013)

AnCapAtheist said:


> Blow it out your ass clown.






You need to loosen up your tinfoil hat, Bugsy.


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## daws101 (Jul 22, 2013)

eots said:


> Katzndogz said:
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anyone who would risk a mass outbreak of disease  on the miniscule probability of damage to their kid should be jailed for creating a clear and present danger to the general population.


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## eots (Jul 22, 2013)

daws101 said:


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as usual you make no sense..if your kid is vaccinated or your vaccinated what are you worried about ?..lol


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## eots (Jul 22, 2013)

American Communist said:


> I've taken no vaccinations or Flu Shots for at least 25 years and my kids were never vaccinated. We're all just fine thank you.



I was never vaccinated for anything and none of my 3 children


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## eots (Jul 22, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.



settle down chicken little..


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## Quantum Windbag (Jul 22, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Katzndogz said:
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Most states allow parents to opt out of the vaccination requirements and remain in school.


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## Luissa (Jul 23, 2013)

Quantum Windbag said:


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My son starts kindergarten in the fall, I either have to have him vaccinated or have documentation from his doctor. I cannot just tell my son's school I am not going to do it.


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

Luissa said:


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what kind of _documentation_ from a doctor ?


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## martybegan (Jul 23, 2013)

eots said:


> The federal Vaccine Injury Compensation Program, better known as "vaccine court," has just awarded millions of dollars to two children with autism for "pain and suffering" and lifelong care of their injuries, which together could cost tens of millions of dollars.
> 
> David Kirby: Vaccine Court Awards Millions to Two Children With Autism



The vaccines caused a noticable encephilitis, a swelling of the brain, which is a possible side affect. All the other supposed "autism" cases parents said thier kids developed said autism without any other noticable symptoms.

Trying to make this a link to vaccines causing autism is sick and sad.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

Luissa said:


> Katzndogz said:
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The government FORCES us to put our kids through that conditioning and brainwashing.  And you think the threat of not letting them go to school unless we let them poison them and weaken their immune system is supposed to be some sort of effective threat?

So what, we get to keep them home and teach them what ever we want?  Like, oh, I don't know.  Who really starts wars on the planet.  Who really shot Kennedy.  The real purpose of the education system.  Why the government and the press push the "terrorism" paradigm.  Why the financial cabal donates to both parties.  What really happened on 9/11.  How to actually READ.  How to actually WRITE.  How to really do arithmetic.  etc.  Like government schools are really that great.

They don't actually expect taxes if they aren't going to provide services do they?


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## daws101 (Jul 23, 2013)

eots said:


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another classically  stupid, arrogant and ignorant reply from eots..
the point of vaccinations is so no kid is at risk of infection or infecting others.


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## daws101 (Jul 23, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> Luissa said:
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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

eots said:


> American Communist said:
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> > I've taken no vaccinations or Flu Shots for at least 25 years and my kids were never vaccinated. We're all just fine thank you.
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I'm struggling with this question right now.  The Department of Health, and the School just sent me a whole list of eight vaccines that want my boy to get before entering the sixth grade.  If it were just up to me?  I'd tell them to bugger off.  But his mom and I have been apart now for well over ten years, and sadly, she is now part of the hive mind.

So what I need is some good, solid EVIDENCE.

I need evidence showing that the risks outweigh the chances of contracting the disease.  I KNOW that vaccines have all these horrendous side effects.  They weaken your immune system. cause severe  side effects, etc.  But are these more detrimental than the chances of "catching" something?  How do you convince someone that is a "TV watcher," you know the type, one of the HIVE MIND?  I just don't know what to do.  I don't want to let them get a hold of my little man and pump him full of that poison.  I have half a mind to just not let her know.  But hat is not in my character.  We have joint legal custody, but I have full physical custody.  The means we make all medical decisions together.

We got all of the "early" infant vaccines.  I just don't think he needs any vaccines at the age of twelve.  They are for corporate profits, I mean, c'mon, really?  I never had EIGHT vaccines at twelve.  I'm fine.  This is bullshit. 

And yet, there is the irony.  The establishment won't let me HAVE that evidence.  I mean, WTF?!  I want those statistics so I can make an informed choice.  Nope, sorry.  It either hasn't been compiled, or it isn't available.


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## Montrovant (Jul 23, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


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Can I assume, based on your need for strong evidence, that you have such evidence regarding the horrendous side effects, weakening of the immune system, etc. of vaccines?  You said you KNOW about these things....where do you get that knowledge?  Why do you trust the source(s) that tell you that but not ones that tell you vaccines are safe and worthwhile?


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## Katzndogz (Jul 23, 2013)

I remember the days before these vaccines.  I didn't have any vaccination until I stood in line for the polio sugar cube.

Diseases that we consider minor today, measels, chicken pox, whooping cough would sweep through killing dozens of children at a time.  Families had many more children in those days hoping one or two would live.   I can't imagine anyone wanting the child mortality rate of a third world village.  I accept that some people find this desirable.  When a child does get sick, is struggling for its next breath or has eyeballs covered with measels or chicken pox it's amazing how quicky these parents forget putting chemicals in the child's body and nonsense about poisoning them and demand antibiotics that might not even work any more.  Bring on the chemicals!


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

I had measles as a kid...so did ever other kid I knew  no one died


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LfipChRciY]Vaccines and Toxins Cause Autism, Sudden Infant Death Syndrome, SIDS & Crib Death - YouTube[/ame]


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZs1V8mpcoY]Origin of AIDS: The Polio Vaccine (CBC 'Witness', 2004) - YouTube[/ame]


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## daws101 (Jul 23, 2013)

eots said:


> I had measles as a kid...so did ever other kid I knew  no one died


you'll understand when I say you're lying..Causes, incidence, and risk factors

The infection is spread by contact with droplets from the nose, mouth, or throat of an infected person. Sneezing and coughing can put contaminated droplets into the air.

Those who have had an active measles infection or who have been vaccinated against the measles have immunity to the disease. Before widespread vaccination, measles was so common during childhood that most people became sick with the disease by age 20. The number of measles cases dropped over the last several decades to almost none in the U.S. and Canada. However, rates have started to rise again recently.

Some parents do not let their children get vaccinated because of unfounded fears that the MMR vaccine, which protects against measles, mumps, and rubella, can cause autism. Large studies of thousands of children have found no connection between this vaccine and autism. Not vaccinating children can lead to outbreaks of a measles, mumps, and rubella -- all of which are potentially serious diseases of childhood.
n roughly the last 150 years, measles has been estimated to have killed about 200 million people worldwide.[64] During the 1850s, measles killed a fifth of Hawaii's people.[65] In 1875, measles killed over 40,000 Fijians, approximately one-third of the population.[66] In the 19th century, the disease decimated the Andamanese population.[67] In 1954, the virus causing the disease was isolated from an 11-year old boy from the United States, David Edmonston, and adapted and propagated on chick embryo tissue culture.[68] To date, 21 strains of the measles virus have been identified.[69] While at Merck, Maurice Hilleman developed the first successful vaccine.[70] Licensed vaccines to prevent the disease became available in 1963.[71] An improved measles vaccine became available in 1968.[72]

Measles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
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> > I had measles as a kid...so did ever other kid I knew  no one died
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Beezy Marsh, Health Correspondent12:01AM GMT 13 Feb 2006

Eighteen babies and toddlers have died following childhood vaccinations in just four years, a secret Government report reveals.
Four deaths have been linked to suspected adverse reactions to the measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) triple jab, according to documents prepared for the Government's expert advisers on immunisation.
Secret report reveals 18 child deaths following vaccinations - Telegraph


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## OohPooPahDoo (Jul 23, 2013)

AnCapAtheist said:


> No shit they are dangerous...no sane parent puts this crap in their kids.



Jesus Christ you're a moron, I sincerely hope you never pro-create. If you do, keep your disease ridden children away from mine.


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

According to an Informasalus.it article dated July 4, it has been determined that, in 2003, a hexavalent vaccine (the 4-in-one vaccine that is considered mandatory for children plus two optional vaccines) proved to be fatal to a six month old baby girl in Pesaro, Italy and a civil court judge in Pesaro has found the Italian Ministry of Health guilty as charged. The court has established a 200,000 Euro compensation to the baby girl's family, a lifetime award of about 700 Euros per month, plus additional compensation that still needs to be calculated.

Baby's family awarded damages after hexavalent vaccine ruled cause of her death - Miami healthy living | Examiner.com


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> AnCapAtheist said:
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if your children are vaccinated why would you care ???..You make no sense


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## daws101 (Jul 23, 2013)

eots said:


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and? thousands babies die from preventable diseases every minute...
18 deaths over how many month or years?

Who needs facts? These vaccine conspiracy pieces write themselves&#8230;
As I write this, Chief PR Man and Publicist of the &#8220;New Wave&#8221; Vaccines-Cause-Autism-No-They-Really-Do movement, David Kirby, should have done his turn in the House of Lords and be winding up his &#8220;free public lecture&#8221;. I won&#8217;t wish him the stocks and some rotten fruit &#8211; that would be churlish &#8211; though I might hope his audience includes some of the London-based Badscience fraternity, and/or a few sceptical scientists and doctors.

(Sadly, an audience of rabid mercury obsessives, anti-vaccine nuts, ambulance-chasing lawyers, credulous journalists, nutritionistas, Patrick Holford and Dr John Briffa seems more likely. But let&#8217;s hope I&#8217;m wrong).

What I am really, really hoping is that Kirby&#8217;s turns at the HoP and later do not produce more dismal newspaper articles tomorrow like the one the Daily Telegraph ran last week.

Ah, the Telegraph.

Those snippy satirists over at Private Eye have been running stories for some weeks suggesting that all is not well at the Telegraph, that once esteemed bastion of the more pepper-ish end of the British Establishment.
http://draust.wordpress.com/2008/06...-vaccine-conspiracy-pieces-write-themselves…/


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## whitehall (Jul 23, 2013)

Pretty good trade off though even if there is a connection between Polio and viral meningitis. At it's peak Polio was killing or paralyzing an estimated half a million people per year worldwide.


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

daws101 said:


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 if it makes you feel any better...I think you personally should get as many vaccines as you possible can


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## daws101 (Jul 23, 2013)

eots said:


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another non answer..
what would make me feel better is if you were sterilized, you've already used the in home lobotomy kit...


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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> Can I assume, based on your need for strong evidence, that you have such evidence regarding the horrendous side effects, weakening of the immune system, etc. of vaccines?  You said you KNOW about these things....where do you get that knowledge?  Why do you trust the source(s) that tell you that but not ones that tell you vaccines are safe and worthwhile?


Maybe you didn't read my post, or fully grasp the content.  I'd rather err on the side of caution.  I, me, personally, I HAVEN'T gotten those recommended immunizations.  Neither has anyone my age.  In fact, I am willing to bet, all of you people here that are over the age of thirty, NONE of you has got any of these shots they are pushing onto kids.  So that is my deal.  And yet we KNOW, we have seen the documentation about the possible side effects.  What I don't know, is the prevalence, what are the chances that kids will suffer these side effects.  They don't disclose that information.  These are known side effects.  They have been released.  The pharmaceutical companies even have a fund to pay out claims related to law suits.  You need to ask yourselves a question;  If there is no harm to vaccines; *Why is there a whole sub-section of laws devoted to liability claims Vis-à-vis vaccines?*


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

daws101 said:


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you never posed a question ..cretin


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCgkfKlPZYw]Early Vaccines Don't Help Infants - YouTube[/ame]


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## Katzndogz (Jul 23, 2013)

The anti vaccine idiots hae no idea what the results of their folly would be.  They think these deadly diseases are just a few days of sniffles.   They have never seen a face ravaged by pockmarks from chicken pox.   Maybe these idiots think their children will thank them for taking their looks.


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## eots (Jul 23, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> The anti vaccine idiots hae no idea what the results of their folly would be.  They think these deadly diseases are just a few days of sniffles.   They have never seen a face ravaged by pockmarks from chicken pox.   Maybe these idiots think their children will thank them for taking their looks.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> Can I assume, based on your need for strong evidence, that you have such evidence regarding the horrendous side effects, weakening of the immune system, etc. of vaccines?  You said you KNOW about these things....where do you get that knowledge?  Why do you trust the source(s) that tell you that but not ones that tell you vaccines are safe and worthwhile?


And to answer you question in the affirmative, here are the statistics.  So what I need to know now, are what are the chances my child will succumb to the diseases these poisons are meant to protect against.  Otherwise, as the Stats on this page point out, very convincingly I might add, it looks like it is better to shy away from vaccines, than to risk exposing your kid to these deadly toxins.

Mind you, this just has to do with the weakening of the immune system, not possible quality of life issues, sterilizing the population, etc. . . . 

*Vaccines and Mortality Rates*



> Did you know one of the most important indicators of public health conditions of a country is the infant mortality rate (IMR). Many people assume since the United States has arguably the best health system in the world, they have the healthiest children.
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http://vactruth.com/vaccines-and-mortality-rates


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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> The anti vaccine idiots hae no idea what the results of their folly would be.  They think these deadly diseases are just a few days of sniffles.   They have never seen a face ravaged by pockmarks from chicken pox.   Maybe these idiots think their children will thank them for taking their looks.



WTF are you talking about?  I had the chicken pox, so did my sister.  It isn't a big deal.  What the hell are you going on about?  You would never be able to tell.  Well, except that three days after she ignorantly had her second child get the chicken pox vaccine, she got a nasty case of shingles.  If only she had known better. . . .


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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYI-dC9G0us]Vaccine Zombie video www.VaccineZombie.com - YouTube[/ame]


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## nia588 (Jul 23, 2013)

American Communist said:


> I've taken no vaccinations or Flu Shots for at least 25 years and my kids were never vaccinated. We're all just fine thank you.



Because everyone else was vaccinated.  You can't catch a disease when no one around you doesn't get it.

We don't see diseases like polio and measels as being dangerous because we don't see the devastating affects of them anymore ( thanks to vaccines ). So people think skipping the shots is no big deal.

But one of my co workers nephew didn't get any vaccines. Got the measles and winded up dying. Her sister now wishes she had got him vaccinated. 

Sent from my Galaxy S4 using Tapatalk 2


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## MisterBeale (Jul 23, 2013)

nia588 said:


> American Communist said:
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Fair enough.  Good argument.  I agree.  So we need to see the open and honest discussion.  But the pharmaceutical corporations and the government WON'T allow it.  It won't allow people to see what the chances of adverse reactions are, compared to the chances of catching the disease are.  That is all I would like to know.  And did you see what happened when I honestly asked the question?  I came under attack.  How dare the concerned parent even ask that question.

Well, that only leads a person to get very suspicious that the profit motive and the elites eugenics agenda seems to be of more paramount importance the keeping herd immunity at peak efficacy.  One wonders if the damn things even work.  We hear anecdotal cases all the time of persons that were vaccinated that still came down with the disease.  So while I am very sorry your co-workers nephew died, there is no indication that if he had got the shot, he would be alive today.


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 23, 2013)

A measles outbreak in Brooklyn, N.Y., this year shows how easily one of the most contagious diseases leaps hemispheres.

In March, New York City health authorities saw a sudden rise in measles cases in several densely populated Orthodox Jewish communities.
More

    Fifteen Years After Autism Panic, a Plague of Measles Erupts 

The disease quickly spread. Among the 58 measles cases reported thus far, a child contracted pneumonia and two pregnant women were hospitalized, according to the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene. One of the women had a miscarriage.

The department traced the outbreak to a person who it concluded brought the virus from a trip to London, says Jay Varma, the department's deputy commissioner for disease control. Overall, vaccination rates are high in the communities, he says*, but the outbreak then started in a small group of families with members who refused vaccines, he says.*

Brooklyn Measles Outbreak Shows Risks - WSJ.com


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## dukect45 (Jul 23, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-cKzzPkz2o]How Herd Immunity Works (and Why Anti-Vaccination Is Dangerous) - YouTube[/ame]


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## Montrovant (Jul 23, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> Montrovant said:
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> > Can I assume, based on your need for strong evidence, that you have such evidence regarding the horrendous side effects, weakening of the immune system, etc. of vaccines?  You said you KNOW about these things....where do you get that knowledge?  Why do you trust the source(s) that tell you that but not ones that tell you vaccines are safe and worthwhile?
> ...



So again I ask....why do you trust this source?  Ignoring the fact that the name of the site leads one to believe they have an anti-vaccine agenda, what about the information provided do you find compelling, especially compared to any countering information?  Why would you accept that the infant mortality rate is based on vaccinations without some causal evidence?

I get the impression (which may well be completely off, this is just my own personal take) that you lean towards assuming vaccination is bad before any evidence is even presented.  Perhaps this is based on a distrust of the government, a belief that a conspiracy of some sort is involved may appeal to your worldview, but while some of what you are saying is about needing to find information, there is an undercurrent in your posts of having already drawn the conclusion that vaccines are bad.

I'm not going to dismiss possible side effects or dangers, but I certainly think that the concept of a vaccinated populace being safer than one that isn't vaccinated, or is only sporadically vaccinated, is a fairly simple one.  The fewer people able to get a disease, the less chance for it to thrive and potentially infect those without protection.  So, the more that people decide to avoid vaccination, the greater the chance that previously prevented illnesses will crop up again.  

The anti-vaccine rhetoric seems all too often to be of the Jenny McCarthy, it's wrong because I SAY SO! type.  If you truly are unsure and looking for evidence, I hope that you are looking for scientific research rather than opinionated blogs.


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## gslack (Jul 23, 2013)

AnCapAtheist said:


> The Vaccine Hoax Is Over: Secret Documents Reveal Shocking Truth | REALfarmacy.com | Healthy News and Information
> 
> No shit they are dangerous...no sane parent puts this crap in their kids.



Any site with a name like Realfarmacy is already facing 2 strikes in my book. And the fact it points to other stories with titles like "biblical code turns $40,000 into $396,000", tells me it's along the lines of any other tabloid like "national enquirer" and so on..

There is some compelling evidence to suspect some immunizations, but I hardly believe it's as definite as the tabloid is trying to imply.

Personally, I don't think it's the vaccines themselves actually causing the increases in the various diseases and afflictions. I believe it's more along the lines of the lifestyle we live now, and the chemicals we are full of, and then add in some other things like babies being raised on formula instead of breast milk, or the chemicals in the parents at conception, coupled with diet and lack of exercise, pollution, you name it, any number of factors and then you add a touch too much extra of a chemical that alone may be harmless (like mercury) which effects the nervous system, and BAM!.. You got all kinds of nervous system disorders in the young..

I just don't see doctors and medical professionals knowingly and willfully giving bad medicine to children.. It's not logical, and as far as population control it's highly ineffective..


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## Coyote (Jul 23, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> A measles outbreak in Brooklyn, N.Y., this year shows how easily one of the most contagious diseases leaps hemispheres.
> 
> In March, New York City health authorities saw a sudden rise in measles cases in several densely populated Orthodox Jewish communities.
> More
> ...



Vaccines only work when enough people are vaccinated to prevent a large scale outbreak.  I think many people, insulated form the devastations of serious childhood diseases forget how horrific polio, diptheria, rubella and other diseases could be.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> A measles outbreak in Brooklyn, N.Y., this year shows how easily one of the most contagious diseases leaps hemispheres.
> 
> In March, New York City health authorities saw a sudden rise in measles cases in several densely populated Orthodox Jewish communities.
> More
> ...


 
if vaccinations protect you then its nobodies business if one chooses not to vaccinate


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Coyote said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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so if your vaccinated and someone else isn't your vaccine wont work ?..lol


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## gslack (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


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> > SFC Ollie said:
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Not really. Realistically not everyone will get vaccinated anyway. Be it irresponsibility or a choice not to, no one in the medical profession actually thinks 100% vaccinated. And it doesn't rely on that premise. It relies on statistics. If this generation has 70% vaccinated, then that means only 30% at risk going into the next and so on until a war of attrition of sorts is won over the disease. There is no 100% cure of anything, they know this..

Also vaccination is not 100% either. The disease is still there, the vaccine tries to limit the number of infected is all. The disease can mutate and come back..


----------



## Coyote (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



The real value of vaccine's is in public health and protecting populations - if enough individuals are vaccinated, then it doesn't matter so much that a few, who legitimately can't be vaccinated - aren't.  They can still get the disease but the chances are insignificant.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Jul 24, 2013)

> MMR Vaccine and Autism
> 
> On November 12, 2000, the CBS television show 60 Minutes featured a story on the MMR vaccine and its alleged link to autism. In 1998, investigators published a report12(pp637-41) on 12 children referred to a London pediatric gastroenterology unit for the evaluation of gastrointestinal diseases associated with developmental regression. *The parents of eight of these children associated the onset of behavioral symptoms with the administration of MMR vaccine.* The investigators identified lymphoid nodular hyperplasia in 10 children and postulated that &#8220;the consequences of an inflamed or dysfunctional intestine may play a part in behavioural changes in some children.&#8221;12(p639) However, behavioural symptoms preceded bowel symptoms in four of the six children for whom the onset of bowel symptoms was known. The investigators stated, &#8220;We did not prove an association between measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine and the syndrome described.&#8221;12(p641)
> 
> ...




Anyone know anything about statistics?

http://www.aafp.org/afp/2002/1201/p2113.html


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> > MMR Vaccine and Autism
> >
> > On November 12, 2000, the CBS television show 60 Minutes featured a story on the MMR vaccine and its alleged link to autism. In 1998, investigators published a report12(pp637-41) on 12 children referred to a London pediatric gastroenterology unit for the evaluation of gastrointestinal diseases associated with developmental regression. *The parents of eight of these children associated the onset of behavioral symptoms with the administration of MMR vaccine.* The investigators identified lymphoid nodular hyperplasia in 10 children and postulated that &#8220;the consequences of an inflamed or dysfunctional intestine may play a part in behavioural changes in some children.&#8221;12(p639) However, behavioural symptoms preceded bowel symptoms in four of the six children for whom the onset of bowel symptoms was known. The investigators stated, &#8220;We did not prove an association between measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine and the syndrome described.&#8221;12(p641)
> >
> ...



The infant mortality rate (IMR) is one of the most important indicators of the socio-economic well-being and public health conditions of a country. The US childhood immunization schedule specifies 26 vaccine doses for infants aged less than 1 year&#8212;the most in the world&#8212;yet 33 nations have lower IMRs. Using linear regression, the immunization schedules of these 34 nations were examined and a correlation coefficient of r = 0.70 (p < 0.0001) was found between IMRs and the number of vaccine doses routinely given to infants. Nations were also grouped into five different vaccine dose ranges: 12&#8211;14, 15&#8211;17, 18&#8211;20, 21&#8211;23, and 24&#8211;26. The mean IMRs of all nations within each group were then calculated. *Linear regression analysis of unweighted mean IMRs showed a high statistically significant correlation between increasing number of vaccine doses and increasing infant mortality rates,* with r = 0.992 (p = 0.0009). Using the Tukey-Kramer test, statistically significant differences in mean IMRs were found between nations giving 12&#8211;14 vaccine doses and those giving 21&#8211;23, and 24&#8211;26 doses. A closer inspection of correlations between vaccine doses, biochemical or synergistic toxicity, and IMRs is essential.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3170075/


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > Can I assume, based on your need for strong evidence, that you have such evidence regarding the horrendous side effects, weakening of the immune system, etc. of vaccines?  You said you KNOW about these things....where do you get that knowledge?  Why do you trust the source(s) that tell you that but not ones that tell you vaccines are safe and worthwhile?
> ...


you'd lose your bet ...when I was in grade school (1965-1971) it was mandatory that every child was vaccinated for all know communicable diseases at that 
time..


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


didn't need to everything you've posted in this thread is a non answer.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > Montrovant said:
> ...



they have added at least 2O more vaccines since then


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > A measles outbreak in Brooklyn, N.Y., this year shows how easily one of the most contagious diseases leaps hemispheres.
> ...


how fucking typical and childish....how self involved can one person be.
it's everybody's  business  you ignorant shit.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

In the fall of 1997, the Centers for Disease Control confirmed that the number of Americans living with diabetes has skyrocketed in the past 40 years with a record sixfold increase in this chronic disease since 1958. It is estimated that nearly 16 million Americans are suffering with diabetes and 5 million more may have it but not know it.

Over the past four decades, intensive national mass vaccination campaigns have dramatically increased vaccination rates among American children who now are getting *34 doses of 10 different *viral and bacterial vaccines before they enter kindergarten. Recent published data in the medical literature suggest increasing numbers of childhood vaccines may be playing a role in the big jump in the number of cases of juvenile diabetes.

Diseases and Vaccines - National Vaccine Information Center


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Why ?  you never answered the question..if you and yours have vaccinations what is your concern about the health choices others make ?


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

vaccines, sandy hook, 9/11, Boston bombers....

I understand if some people think they've uncovered a grand conspiracy or two in their lives.

But if you subscribe to ALL of the major conspiracy theories, you are not a truth seeker, you're a delusional enthusiast.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


didn't need to as  it was asked and answered already..

because, you ignorant shit, selfish choices affect everybody.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



spare the histrionics..


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> vaccines, sandy hook, 9/11, Boston bombers....
> 
> I understand if some people think they've uncovered a grand conspiracy or two in their lives.
> 
> But if you subscribe to ALL of the major conspiracy theories, you are not a truth seeker, you're a delusional enthusiast.



strawman


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

Your existence is a strawman.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> Your existence is a strawman.



that doesn't even make sense..much like your out dated raps


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

I don't want to compare sounds with you, bro. My Daughter bangs enough pots and pans erratically in the kitchen and my ears are ringing.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Measles vaccine introduction

Measles vaccination in the US and many other countries started in the early 1960s, at the time when measles was naturally abating and was heading for the 18 year low. That&#8217;s why the vaccine seemingly lowered the incidence; however, this was only coincidental with the natural dynamics of measles.

As one of many examples involving all infectious diseases of childhood against which vaccines have been developed, ever since any measles vaccines have been introduced and used in mass proportions, reports of outbreaks and epidemics of measles in even 100% vaccinated populations started filling pages in medical journals.

Reports of serious reactions including deaths also appeared with increasing frequency. They are the subject of a separate essay.

Atypical measles &#8211; a new phenomenon only in the vaccinated

It is less well known to the general public that vaccinated children started developing an especially vicious form of measles, due to the altered host immune response caused by the deleterious effect of the measles vaccines. It resisted all orthodox treatment and carried a high mortality rate.

It has become known as atypical measles. (AMS)

Rauh and Schmidt (1965) described nine cases of AMS which

- See more at: Measles Vaccines Part I; Ineffectiveness of Vaccination and Unintended Consequences. ~ by Dr Viera Scheibner (PhD) | International Medical Council on Vaccination


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> I don't want to compare sounds with you, bro. My Daughter bangs enough pots and pans erratically in the kitchen and my ears are ringing.



the acorn does not fall far from the tree...


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > I don't want to compare sounds with you, bro. My Daughter bangs enough pots and pans erratically in the kitchen and my ears are ringing.
> ...



Yea, but she's not your kid. Your music sounds like dog-shit.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > G.T. said:
> ...



and what instrument do play again ?


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



Something a few steps higher than dog anus.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > G.T. said:
> ...



you play with dogs balls ?..you need to chill dude...
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8zkSaBPoP4]ex·chilla·ra·tion ...the eots - YouTube[/ame]
ex·chilla·ra·tion
The state of being stimulated, refreshed, or elated while maintaining a low key


----------



## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > Montrovant said:
> ...



But what I AM trying to get at, is for all those vehemently supporting vaccines, is have YOU been in to get your updated vaccine scheduled shot?  I am willing to bet you haven't, have you?  By your own admission, the last time you were poked was back in the 70's.  You are way behind mister.  I am willing to bet Ollie is too, along with just about everyone else that wants these kids poked full of these vaccines that haven't been tested for cross reactions.  But hey, we aren't the ones that will be reproducing, so they don't push them on us, the one's they want to decrease fertility, functionality, and increase mortality is the kids. . .


----------



## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



This sounds low-fi. A poor mixing job, nothing excellent or worth noting in there except that the visual effects were troubling to the eyes. Not in any way relaxing, more-so, it forced you to blink every few seconds because your eyes became too blurry. 

But I wouldn't expect you to see things with a clear head - its too busy fantasizing that it's running away from the big secret society of elites that rules the world.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieziJT6sHPE]The Greater Good Vaccines Documentary, - YouTube[/ame]


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


stll not an answer.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



you asked no question


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



Not a believer in dogma myself, but there is knowlege to be found there. . . 

Wisdom of the ancients;

"_Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you._"


----------



## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > G.T. said:
> ...



thats your fantasy.. I am running from nothing...but I am questioning the status quo as it has historically been less than truthful or accurate


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

I fuckin love you, bro


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> I fuckin love you, bro



back at ya buddy..


----------



## Katzndogz (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > A measles outbreak in Brooklyn, N.Y., this year shows how easily one of the most contagious diseases leaps hemispheres.
> ...



How does "let them die" sound to you as a solution?


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


 false assumtion


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


 love it when you showcase your ignorance.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



again with the histrionics..like everyone who does not get the vaccination regime is going to die..dont be silly


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


there's a high probability you will...


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> false assumtion


Then by all means, please, post an image of your updated vaccination report.  We all already know your last name is actually Daws, so go on, put up or shut up.

Frankly, I don't believe you.  Why?  Because you would have mentioned it in your first post when you told us about how you were vaccinated in the seventies.  But you are so ignorant on this topic, you didn't even KNOW about the 20 plus new vaccines that are recommended that you have never gotten.  That you never mentioned that you have supposedly received and when.  So bugger off if you aren't going to post some proof.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > false assumtion
> ...


another false assumption...


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

In fact, any of you . . . . all of you that want to have credibility on this debate?  Let's see your updated vaccination report, I don't care, scan it, whip out your camera phone, I don't care, redact your name, but prove that you have since had updated vaccines since the 60's, 70's and 80's.  I've read so many article that show they just don't push them on adults. . . JUST THE KIDS!

Something stinks.  I just can't seem to put my finger on it.  Herd immunity seems to only work if EVERYONE is involved, not just the kids folks.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



You're starting to sound like a parrot you know?  

False assumption because. . . . . 

Because you "SAY SO?"  Sorry if I say it'll take a bit more than your say so, mmmkay?


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## Montrovant (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> In the fall of 1997, the Centers for Disease Control confirmed that the number of Americans living with diabetes has skyrocketed in the past 40 years with a record sixfold increase in this chronic disease since 1958. It is estimated that nearly 16 million Americans are suffering with diabetes and 5 million more may have it but not know it.
> 
> Over the past four decades, intensive national mass vaccination campaigns have dramatically increased vaccination rates among American children who now are getting *34 doses of 10 different *viral and bacterial vaccines before they enter kindergarten. Recent published data in the medical literature suggest increasing numbers of childhood vaccines may be playing a role in the big jump in the number of cases of juvenile diabetes.
> 
> Diseases and Vaccines - National Vaccine Information Center



Do you think the way the country has gotten fat could have anything to do with it?

Or is the large rate of obesity merely another conspiracy to cover up the vaccine issue?


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


False Assumption.


----------



## Katzndogz (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



Of course not.   Not every body died before we had vaccinations.  People just had much larger families in those days because people knew there was a chance that most of their children would not survive to adulthood.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


lol! it's not because I say so it's because it's fact.. 
an example of your inaccuracy :you told us about how you were vaccinated in the seventies
and:
 you are so ignorant on this topic, you didn't even KNOW about the 20 plus new vaccines that are recommended that you have never gotten."

both are specious ...


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



And when is the last time you had your vaccines schedule updated?


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


fact! anyone who is not vaccinated has a very high probability of death from any diseases they are not vaccinated for..


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


a very small percentage were immune...


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



people in the 1963 had large famlies because they thought most of their children would die of measles??...really ?...link


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


when was the last time you had a prostate exam?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> OohPooPahDoo said:
> 
> 
> > > MMR Vaccine and Autism
> ...



From Most to least Infant deaths the USA is at 174 out of 124. The USA has 5.9 deaths per 1000. All those countries ranked higher  (or better) than the USA are within 4 deaths per 1000...
Not much of a difference..... BTW most seem to get better and better each year....I wonder why that is???

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2091rank.html


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



and the rest died ???


----------



## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



really I know many mult -generation families with no vaccinations...none died of any of these diseases..where did you pull this "fact "out of


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> lol! it's not because I say so it's because it's fact..
> an example of your inaccuracy :you told us about how you were vaccinated in the seventies
> and:
> you are so ignorant on this topic, you didn't even KNOW about the 20 plus new vaccines that are recommended that you have never gotten."
> ...


Saying it's specious, and proving it's specious are two different animals sir.

Fact, you did tell us that you were vaccinated in the 70's.  


daws101 said:


> you'd lose your bet ...when I was in grade school (1965-1971) it was mandatory that every child was vaccinated for all know communicable diseases at that
> time..



Why not mention any more recent vaccinations?  We have to assume that you haven't had any unless you provide some proof otherwise.  To state so now after you have been shown proof that you are not fully vaccinated is to be disingenuous, and frankly, dishonest.

You can call it a specious argument all you like.  But lacking proof or even the claim that your vaccinations are indeed current, which you have not even attempted to make, belies the fact that indeed, you are just being argumentative.


----------



## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


I thought that the topic was vaccines?  I mowed my lawn two days ago if that will help.


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


another outstanding show of ignorance there eots..
people had large families for several reasons.
1. until late in the 19th century we were an agrarian society ,the more hands to help the better the harvest ,also you didn't have to pay a wage to your kids.
2. religious beliefs and lack of reliable contraception.  
3. it was an accepted fact that some of your kids would die from disease or accidents.
so yes having lot of kids was a kind of insurance...


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


oh so you haven't had a prostate exam?


----------



## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > OohPooPahDoo said:
> ...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWe8_Gg8fjE]In Memoriam: Infant Death & Vaccination, May 25, 2011 - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


ever hear of the black death?


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > lol! it's not because I say so it's because it's fact..
> ...


the queen of false assumptions yammers!


----------



## Jimmy_Jam (Jul 24, 2013)

> I need evidence showing that the risks outweigh the chances of contracting the disease. I KNOW that vaccines have all these horrendous side effects. They weaken your immune system. cause severe side effects, etc. But are these more detrimental than the chances of "catching" something? How do you convince someone that is a "TV watcher," you know the type, one of the HIVE MIND? I just don't know what to do. I don't want to let them get a hold of my little man and pump him full of that poison. I have half a mind to just not let her know. But hat is not in my character. We have joint legal custody, but I have full physical custody. The means we make all medical decisions together.



If vaccines have all of these severe side effects, then it should be no problem finding hard evidence of it. Good luck.


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


sure you do...you can back that up?


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



it was caused by rats...


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


not an excuse.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


wow! even more ignorance..


----------



## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



I'm doomed, Chickend Pox is going to get me!  

And it will get my son too.  Because no matter what decision I make on this score of new vaccine they want to give him, one I know he will not receive is the Chicken Pox.  Who the hell needs a bunch of artificial shit in their body for a disease that will just strengthen the immune system and be a good experience for him?  I mean, WTF?  Do I hope he doesn't get it?  Sure.  But if he does, it isn't the end of the world.  It certainly isn't worth the risks associated with artificial chemicals pumped into a body.  

We are getting weaker and weaker as a species because of these vaccines.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X29lF43mUlo]George Carlin - Germs, Immune System - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


if we're really lucky you'll get whooping cough ,be delirious  and step out in front of a truck delivering vaccines for it!


----------



## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



well that would be a little difficult to post proof of people in my personal life..but how about you back this claim that those not vaccinated are have "a very high probability of dying from the diseases they are not vaccinated for" a generic statement like that should have some readily available stats... if it was true


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


heres' an Idea, look up the stats for yourself...


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



The lesson of these outbreaks is that the modern medical paradigm is deeply flawed. Now it&#8217;s caught with its knickers down and no decent explanation, since those it claims to have protected are victims. 


by Heidi Stevenson 
(Orig. pub. June 2011)

Incidents of whooping cough have been growing more and more common since the mid-nineties, according to a report in the American Journal of Nursing(1) Those most likely to be infected are infants. However, there has been an increasing trend to the disease in adolescents and adu



The one thing that is apparent about whooping cough is that it&#8217;s becoming more common, and the victims are proving to be vaccinated more often than not. That, of course, doesn&#8217;t stop the vaccinators from blaming unvaccinated people for the outbreaks&#8212;though there never seems to be an adequate explanation for the claim.

Whooping Cough Outbreaks in Vaxed Children More and More Frequent


----------



## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


eots reaches into his ass and pulls out another non expert: Heidi Stevenson has worked at Self (Gaia Health Admin, Chief Bottle Washer), studied at BRITISH INSTITUTE OF HOMEOPATHY


----------



## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

Jimmy_Jam said:


> > I need evidence showing that the risks outweigh the chances of contracting the disease. I KNOW that vaccines have all these horrendous side effects. They weaken your immune system. cause severe side effects, etc. But are these more detrimental than the chances of "catching" something? How do you convince someone that is a "TV watcher," you know the type, one of the HIVE MIND? I just don't know what to do. I don't want to let them get a hold of my little man and pump him full of that poison. I have half a mind to just not let her know. But hat is not in my character. We have joint legal custody, but I have full physical custody. The means we make all medical decisions together.
> 
> 
> 
> If vaccines have all of these severe side effects, then it should be no problem finding hard evidence of it. Good luck.



Well, you could watch post  #87   http://www.usmessageboard.com/7587839-post87.html


----------



## SFC Ollie (Jul 24, 2013)

And none of the non believers care to answer why the death rate for children is getting better in almost every country each year.....

No chance it could be because more and more are getting vaccinations and health care, could it?


----------



## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...





SFC Ollie said:


> And none of the non believers care to answer why the death rate for children is getting better in almost every country each year.....
> 
> No chance it could be because more and more are getting vaccinations and health care, could it?



your facts are skewed Europe gives half the vaccinations and has half the infant mortality rate.many third world countries with high infant mortality are also heavily into vaccinations


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5xV3VYWWKw]Comparing the American Infant Mortality Rate: The state of American Healthcare? - YouTube[/ame]


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> And none of the non believers care to answer why the death rate for children is getting better in almost every country each year.....
> 
> No chance it could be because more and more are getting vaccinations and health care, could it?


to me, the odd thing is these so called deaths by vaccination are only a miniscule fraction of preventable child deaths.
more babies are killed each year by bad parenting than any other cause.
why not go batshit over that?
too real for you guys?


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations
> 
> Comparing the American Infant Mortality Rate: The state of American Healthcare? - YouTube


lol!


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > And none of the non believers care to answer why the death rate for children is getting better in almost every country each year.....
> ...



red herring


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

accines are proclaimed to save babies&#8217; lives. But is it true? This study provides compelling evidence that it is not, that in reality they&#8217;re killers.

Multicolored Vaccines in Ranksby Heidi Stevenson

The reason for giving vaccinations to infants is supposedly to protect them from harm. If that&#8217;s true, then it would follow that the countries giving the most vaccines would have the lowest rates of infant mortality.

But they don&#8217;t. In fact, a new study documents just the opposite. The Journal of Human & Experimental Toxicology(1) published a study in which the authors carefully compared the vaccination rates of the nations with the lowest infant mortality rates to see if there&#8217;s a correlation between number of vaccines and death rates of infants. The results could not be clearer:

More Vaccines Equal More Infant Deaths: Study Documents |


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


another spectacular show of ignorance by eots..
he's here all week!


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## Jimmy_Jam (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> Jimmy_Jam said:
> 
> 
> > > I need evidence showing that the risks outweigh the chances of contracting the disease. I KNOW that vaccines have all these horrendous side effects. They weaken your immune system. cause severe side effects, etc. But are these more detrimental than the chances of "catching" something? How do you convince someone that is a "TV watcher," you know the type, one of the HIVE MIND? I just don't know what to do. I don't want to let them get a hold of my little man and pump him full of that poison. I have half a mind to just not let her know. But hat is not in my character. We have joint legal custody, but I have full physical custody. The means we make all medical decisions together.
> ...



You're right. I could.


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

I'm sure there's a chart that shows why they died / cause of death, and consequently a reason why the person who made that video didn't seek that information out. All conspiracy theorists leave out pertinent information that doesn't paint their picture.


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations
> ...



Is this your attempt to dispute the high U.S Infant mortality rate ?


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> accines are proclaimed to save babies lives. But is it true? This study provides compelling evidence that it is not, that in reality theyre killers.
> 
> Multicolored Vaccines in Ranksby Heidi Stevenson
> 
> ...


Heidi Stevenson has worked at Self (Gaia Health Admin, Chief Bottle Washer), studied at BRITISH INSTITUTE OF HOMEOPATHY.

Homeopathy: The Ultimate Fake


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## G.T. (Jul 24, 2013)

HEY EOTS, here is the U.S. infant mortality rates, per 1, 000 babies, for 5-year ranges from the 1950's to 2010. 

Notice a trend, or no?

30.46, 27.33, 25.38, 22.67, 18.39, 14.34, 11.60, 10.37, 8.81, 7.49, 6.92, 6.81.

Link, with actual sources at the bottom:

List of countries by infant mortality rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


is this your way of attempting to change the subject...?
as already shown, "death" by vaccine is an extremely low probability.
as always you're embellishing.

there are far more substantial causes for infant death.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> I'm sure there's a chart that shows why they died / cause of death, and consequently a reason why the person who made that video didn't seek that information out. All conspiracy theorists leave out pertinent information that doesn't paint their picture.



Actually, in the video, there are several researches who present their peer reviewed reports on substances that are in vaccines, things like aluminum, how it differs from aluminum that we ingest in our diet, what aluminum does when it is directly injected into the body, what their research showed, how the CDC, NIHS and industry reacted,  stuff like that.  But if you don't want to bother educating yourself?  Not my problem.  Stick your head in the mud, attack people with your ad hominem, anything to fend of cognitive dissonance.  This is peer reviewed science mind.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > I'm sure there's a chart that shows why they died / cause of death, and consequently a reason why the person who made that video didn't seek that information out. All conspiracy theorists leave out pertinent information that doesn't paint their picture.
> ...


oh no! not the cognitive dissonance ploy!
as opposed to MB'S AND eots' cognitive bias.....lol!


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> I'm sure there's a chart that shows why they died / cause of death, and consequently a reason why the person who made that video didn't seek that information out. All conspiracy theorists leave out pertinent information that doesn't paint their picture.



The point is that the chicken little rantings and falsehoods of dawshits and his 'fact" that all these vaccinations are required or "the person is a very high probability of dying from the disease they are not vaccinated for".. is complete nonsense as countries that give half the vaccinations have substantially lower infant mortality rates and are clearly not at a high probability of dying from diseases they were not vaccinated for


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > I'm sure there's a chart that shows why they died / cause of death, and consequently a reason why the person who made that video didn't seek that information out. All conspiracy theorists leave out pertinent information that doesn't paint their picture.
> ...


yes dear! now take your meds!


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > G.T. said:
> ...



 cognitive dissonance is you holding on to the belief corporations would not try to sell you products you do not need  or that are even harmful for you...


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > G.T. said:
> ...



???...lol ..loser...trying to run away from the _FACT _you claimed




Originally Posted by daws101 View Post
fact! anyone who is not vaccinated has a very high probability of death from any diseases they are not vaccinated for..


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

G.T. said:


> HEY EOTS, here is the U.S. infant mortality rates, per 1, 000 babies, for 5-year ranges from the 1950's to 2010.
> 
> Notice a trend, or no?
> 
> ...


I love that chart.  You know why?  Because it shows something very very important.  CAUSATION FALLACY.

What we have here is a causation fallacy.  You want to attribute the infant mortality and child death rate to one thing, when it is another.

It has to do with food and nutrition.  When families and children eat better, they survive.  When they have no food, they die.  It is as simple as that.  With out food and sunshine, an immune system can not operate.  Better nourishment means healthier people.

What was passed in 1966?  Bueller?  Bueller?  That's right, The Child Nutrition Act.  
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_Nutrition_Act
And WIC to follow in 1969.

This had a lot more to do with the survival of children than a bunch of chemicals.  The body doesn't lack drugs to survive, it lacks nutrients.


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## OohPooPahDoo (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations.



We also have the most television sets per capita - so how are you sure it isn't the TV's that are killing the babies?


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > G.T. said:
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Hey, you know what Daws?  You got me!  I'll admit it, I DO have a cognitive bias!    I don't fucking trust the establishment.  Why should I?  I know it lies.  My grandfather was a thirty-second degree Freemason, my father always told me, don't trust them all, any of them might be lying, you must ALWAYS follow the money.  I KNOW president Clinton lied, don't you?  I KNOW president BUSH lied, don't you?  How can you be so tuned out to not know the establishment is constantly deceiving us in so many ways.  You must not just take what they tell you at face value.  Does that mean you should take what others read at face value?  No.  We must SEE the results of these things in reality, and not seek to deny what we see.

I have had over seven years of Political Science at University.  I have been well trained in interest groups, revolving door politics, and Iron triangles.  My skepticism if VERY high.  I KNOW what the elites think the masses are there for.  Sure, my cognitive bias is there, and it is extremely skeptical.  If you bothered to watch that piece, you would KNOW it isn't a hit piece on vaccines, it is a middle of the road skepticism piece that acknowledges the great wonder and benefit that vaccines have played in our society.  And I am willing to bet, that even Eots would say, there _was_ a time when vaccines were a boon to our civilization. 

But you know, have you ever heard the saying, "Too much of a good thing?"  Isn't it just possible that drug companies have seen something that can be used for the masses as a way to make millions, perhaps billions, and have cut manufacturing processes using cheap ingredients to save costs, have skipped safety trials, and have pushed unnecessary vaccines for diseases that aren't truly a threat to public safety, all in the search of the almighty profit?  Did you know that drug companies control the FDA and the CDC?  If you don't see or believe that, you aren't a skeptic, you aren't reserving judgement, and you are letting them corrupt something that is probably hugely beneficial for society, only to let it have become deadly dangerous.  In my parents day, and my day, vaccines weren't causing the epidemic of health problems that they are causing today.  They used to save lives.  Now?  I'm not sure the cost is worth the gain.  That is all I am trying to put forward.

Why don't you ever want to think for yourself?


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## Montrovant (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > HEY EOTS, here is the U.S. infant mortality rates, per 1, 000 babies, for 5-year ranges from the 1950's to 2010.
> ...



Why is your use of statistics regarding infant mortality and vaccinations not causation fallacy?  Why is it only when someone else brings up statistics regarding infant mortality that you assume their inference is not causal?


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations.
> ...



Not quite, but close.  I quite my TV a decade ago.  It is prohibitive of free thought and controls your consciousness.  Fluoride in pharmaceuticals, the water and food helps this process along. 

Google "Silent Sound Spread Spectrum (SSSS)"  The implementation and switching to all digital format was especially important for this issue.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> Why is your use of statistics regarding infant mortality and vaccinations not causation fallacy?  Why is it only when someone else brings up statistics regarding infant mortality that you assume their inference is not causal?


Because the use of vaccines in nations with out the same nutritional food opportunities as the US does not yield the same results.


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## Steven_R (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> G.T. said:
> 
> 
> > HEY EOTS, here is the U.S. infant mortality rates, per 1, 000 babies, for 5-year ranges from the 1950's to 2010.
> ...



Pediatric and neonatal medicine advances since WW2 has more to do with rates of infant mortality than anything else. 

If we didn't count every baby as a live birth (meaning not count ones that are going to die or count ones that are simply to premature to live), our rates would be even lower. As it is, if the baby takes a single breath outside of the womb, it's a live birth...even if that one breath is the only one it ever takes.


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations
> 
> Comparing the American Infant Mortality Rate: The state of American Healthcare? - YouTube



So what does socialized Medicine have to do with vaccinations? Didn't know Eots was a socialist....


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

steven_r said:


> misterbeale said:
> 
> 
> > g.t. said:
> ...



infant mortality is based on the first year of life in reality and the over all mortality rate is also lower and longevity higher...fail


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

sfc ollie said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations
> ...



socialized medicine ?...whatever are you babbling about ..this has no relation to the fact these children receive half the vaccines yet have both lower infant mortality and  greater longevity..


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 24, 2013)

It appears that about 2/3s of child deaths happen in the first month...

I don't believe they get any vaccinations that soon....

I could be wrong......But ........

Products - Data Briefs - 120 - April 2013


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> sfc ollie said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



Your video was all about socialized medicine...really, once again I find you don't watch your own shit..


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

OohPooPahDoo said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > the highest mortality rate of any developed country gives the most vaccinations.
> ...



the point is they receive half of these vaccines claimed as necessary for health yet experience greater health ...so what would that indicate...can you say snake-oil


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

sfc ollie said:


> eots said:
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> 
> > sfc ollie said:
> ...



the video was to supply statistics on infant mortality rates and inoculation rates in various nations


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## Steven_R (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> steven_r said:
> 
> 
> > misterbeale said:
> ...



No, the failure is that other countries count infant mortality in different way. In the US, if the baby is alive, it counts. In Germany, it is if the baby is after 30 weeks. If a baby more premature lives, great. If a <30 weeker dies, it was never counted as a live birth so doesn't end up on an infant mortality chart.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


false assumption... causation- cognitive bias..


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Steven_R said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > steven_r said:
> ...



The link I provided said the stats listed are based on 1st year of life


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
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> > daws101 said:
> ...



its hardly a false assumption it is a reality of everyday life


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## Steven_R (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Steven_R said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



I'm just going off the M&M conferences I was at when I worked at a hospital. I figured people from the NIH talking to physicians might have an inkling of what they're talking about and where they get their statistics.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


no that would be you attempting to change the subject. 
What is the death rate of plague?

In the pre-antibiotic era (1900 through 1941), mortality among those infected with plague in the United States was 66%. Antibiotics greatly reduced mortality, and by 1990-2010 overall mortality had decreased to 11%. Plague can still be fatal despite effective antibiotics, though it is lower for bubonic plague cases than for septicemic or pneumonic plague cases. It is hard to assess the mortality rate of plague in developing countries, as relatively few cases are reliably diagnosed and reported to health authorities. WHO cites mortality rates of 810%, however some studies (WHO, 2004) suggest that mortality may be much higher in some plague endemic areas.
Infectious Diseases :: What Are Infectious Diseases?

infectious diseases more common than in developed countries. One such disease is tuberculosis, a bacterial disease which killed 1.7 million people in 2004. Malaria causes about 400900 million cases of fever and 13 million deaths annually. 10 Leading Causes of Mortality Worldwide


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


you're right you're paranoia and cognitive bias are a fact. your assumptions about me are not.


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## daws101 (Jul 24, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


wow the classic and totally false paranoid rambling..

always has the same ending too !:"Why don't you ever want to think for yourself?" that's ironic since everything you asshats post is a rehash of every other conspiracy theorist's    
  paranoid rambling..the antistasis of thinking for yourself...


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## MisterBeale (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



O.K.  I tried being logical, rational, and reasonable with you.  But I know you well enough to know that is not possible.  You don't like to read and take seriously what I have to say, because it causes you serious difficulties.  I know what your problem is. . .


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Steven_R said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Steven_R said:
> ...



Irrelevant how the people you speak of calculate their statistics .. the statistics listed are based on first year of life


*"Infant mortality rate is the number of infants dying before reaching one year of age" *


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## Montrovant (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Steven_R said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



How is it irrelevant if other countries don't count certain things as infant mortality that the US does?

*I'm neither confirming nor denying the veracity of the claims, just questioning their relevance


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Steven_R said:
> ...



because it was statistics for a many nations and these specific statistics were calculated based on the parameter  of "the number of infants dying before reaching one year of age"


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## eots (Jul 24, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



I am convinced there is ample evidence that a corporation will sell a product that is not needed or can cause the body harm..I do not think any rational person would even attempt deny this


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## Montrovant (Jul 24, 2013)

eots said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



But if the different nations use different criteria to determine that number, it could easily skew things.  

This doesn't even speak to the question of whether any of the statistics show cause, which certainly has not been shown here.


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Montrovant said:
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how can you not get this ..the criteria was set  the same for all the stats for each nation "the number of infants dying before reaching one year of age" that may not be the criteria used by some governments..but that was the criteria of this study and the point is not causation..the point is that countries doing less then half the amount of vaccinations are not appearing to suffer from it and in fact seem to have a lower infant mortality rate and greater longevity


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_wUaw7Ph34]Fox News Reports on Flu Shots Being Ineffective - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbm-CB6A_Qs]CDC INFECTS 30 MILLION MORE CHILDREN THIS FLU SEASON 2008 - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkhX5W7JoWI]Money - Pink Floyd + Lyrics - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHur7u13woc]Former Finland health minister speaks out against Vaccinations! - YouTube[/ame]


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 25, 2013)

And there are people who truly believe that seatbelts do not save lives because a few people have been trapped by them.....

Same difference.....

Some people will have an allergic reaction to something as basic as cinnamon. We should ban it....

And Tylenol, and aspirin, and every other thing that we can eat or put into our bodies...

Someone somewhere will have a reaction to everything........ Forget the greater good....


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## Katzndogz (Jul 25, 2013)

I know people who refuse to get their dogs vaccinated for the same reason.  One of my clients got her dog a rabies vaccination because it was the law but she refused all others.   I told her there was a good chance her beloved pet would die of parvo.  The vaccination was worse, but 6 months later her dog was dead.   I feel sorry for these silly people.  But, they are asking for it.  No doubt about it, they are asking for it.  So there's no reason to actually mourn the dead children of these silly parents.  You take care of your own kids.  You start behaving like living in the US is the same as visiting some third world diseased shithole.


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## Montrovant (Jul 25, 2013)

eots said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



It is you who seem to not get this.  If the information provided by the various nations is different (some nations do not count premature births before a certain time when listing infant deaths) the numbers will be skewed.  Unless you think the information from the different countries was gathered completely independently, they likely got it from various government sources which could have gathered it differently.


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## daws101 (Jul 25, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...


again another false assumption.
nothing you post is logical, rational or reasonable.
anyone who believes fluoridated water is a hypnotic that makes you watch TV, is several neurons short of a properly functioning brain.
what you call  serious difficulties. are in actuality brilliant but unintended comedy..


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## daws101 (Jul 25, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
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nice dodge !


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## Michelle420 (Jul 25, 2013)

CDC ?Disappears? Page Linking Polio Vaccines To Cancer-Causing Viruses | Health Impact News

Looks like it was up on the cdc website and then taken down, someone took a screen shot.


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 25, 2013)

Amazing how much the incidents of these diseases has gone down the more and more that people are vaccinated against them.....


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## daws101 (Jul 25, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> Amazing how much the incidents of these diseases has gone down the more and more that people are vaccinated against them.....


almost as if they actually worked.....?hmmm.


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

daws101 said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



Environ Health Perspect. 2012 October;
Review
*Developmental Fluoride Neurotoxicity: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis*
esults: The standardized weighted mean difference in IQ score between exposed and reference populations was &#8211;0.45 (95% confidence interval: &#8211;0.56, &#8211;0.35) using a random-effects model. Thus, children in high-fluoride areas had significantly lower IQ scores than those who lived in low-fluoride areas. Subgroup and sensitivity analyses also indicated inverse associations, although the substantial heterogeneity did not appear to decrease.

Conclusions: *The results support the possibility of an adverse effect of high fluoride exposure on children&#8217;s neurodevelopment. Future research should include detailed individual-level information on prenatal exposure, neurobehavioral performance, and covariates for adjustment.*

Developmental Fluoride Neurotoxicity: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis


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## Montrovant (Jul 25, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > MisterBeale said:
> ...



Interesting report, but it doesn't in any way say that fluoride is a hypnotic.


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## daws101 (Jul 25, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...


one other little thing if eots has lived anywhere in the US he's already carrying a load of fluoride.


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## LA RAM FAN (Jul 25, 2013)

someone farted in here.


----------



## daws101 (Jul 25, 2013)

9/11 inside job said:


> someone farted in here.


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 25, 2013)

daws101 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> > someone farted in here.



totally ignore the fart posts and his IQ might go up a point.....In 10 or 12 years......


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

Chemical name - (RS)-N-methyl-3-phenyl-3-[4-(trifluoromethyl)phenoxy]propan-1-amine

The Chemical symbol for Fluorine is F

How does it work?
Prozac capsules and liquid contain the active ingredient fluoxetine, which is a type of medicine called an antidepressant. It is a type of antidepressant known as a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SSRI). (NB. Fluoxetine is also available without a brand name, ie as the generic medicine.)
Antidepressant medicines act on nerve cells in the brain. In the brain there are numerous different chemical compounds called neurotransmitters. These act as chemical messengers between the nerve cells. Serotonin is one such neurotransmitter and has various functions that we know of.


Read more: Prozac (fluoxetine) 
Follow us: @NetDoctor on Twitter | NetDoctorUK on Facebook


----------



## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

The effect of co-administration of zolpidem with fluoxetine: pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics.
Piergies AA, Sweet J, Johnson M, Roth-Schechter BF, Allard S.
Source
Clinical Pharmacology Unit, The Evanston Hospital, Evanston, IL, USA.
Abstract
Since early treatment of depression with Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor (SSRI) can be associated with insomnia, daytime antidepressive therapy with SSRI is often *combined with nighttime administration of a hypnotic.* This study attempted to evaluate the pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic interactions between zolpidem 10 mg, a short-acting hypnotic, and fluoxetine 20 mg, an SSRI. Twenty-seven healthy male volunteers (mean age 23.5 years, range 20 - 29) received zolpidem and fluoxetine in the following open design: zolpidem on night 1, a morning dose of fluoxetine daily from day 2 through day 18 and zolpidem on night 18. Using HPLC, plasma levels of zolpidem, fluoxetine, and norfluoxetine were determined throughout night 1 for zolpidem, night 18 for zolpidem, fluoxetine, and norfluoxetine on days 16 and 17 for fluoxetine and norfluoxetine. Morning psychomotor tests were performed on days 1, 2, 18, and 19. Statistical analysis of data consisted of repeated measures of ANOVA. There was no significant difference in AUC, C(max), and T1/2 of zolpidem plasma concentrations between night 1 (zolpidem) and night 18 (zolpidem and fluoxetine). There was a significantly higher zolpidem plasma level at 0.5 hours after dosing together with a significantly shorter T(max) on night 18 compared to night 1. There was no significant difference in C(min) of plasma fluoxetine and norfluoxetine levels between day 16 and 17 of fluoxetine dosing, and there was no difference in T(max) between day 17 (fluoxetine) and day 18 (fluoxetine and zolpidem). There was a 3 - 4% increase in AUC and C(max) of fluoxetine and norfluoxetine plasma concentrations in the presence of zolpidem. There was no difference in the next morning performance tests after nighttime treatment of zolpidem alone after 17 consecutive days of fluoxetine treatment, or after zolpidem in the presence of steady-state plasma concentrations of fluoxetine. Both zolpidem and fluoxetine were well tolerated alone or in combination. It is concluded that the onset of action of zolpidem may possibly be shortened in the presence of fluoxetine, but no other significant pharmacokinetic or pharmacodynamic interactions occurred between zolpidem and fluoxetine.
PMID: 8861737 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

I received a timely answer from one of their pros, Neil Sandow, Pharm. D. &#8220;Each molecule of fluoxetime HCL (Prozac) contains three fluoride atoms.&#8221;

I queried back to find out whether &#8220;fluoride atoms&#8221; meant &#8220;FLUORINE atoms,&#8221; since it was my understanding that fluoride is a term that applies to molecules (combinations of atoms), whereas fluorine is the element and therefore any atoms would be called fluorine. I was told that I was correct.

With that little personal confusion straightened out, I asked RxList another question: Could they tell me the weight, in milligrams, of the fluorine in a standard daily dose of Prozac? After all, you always want to know about dose level.

Here was the reply from Sandow. I am giving you the details, in case anyone wants to challenge these facts or the arithmetic. F stands for fluorine in the message I received: &#8220;F molecular weight=18.9984032. There are 3 F&#8217;s in each Prozac molecule, so 3 x 18.9984032 = 57.

&#8220;The molecular weight of the Prozac molecule is 345.79.

&#8220;The proportion of Fluorine to Prozac is 57 / 345.79 = .165 or 16.5%.

&#8220;So, for a typical daily dose of 20mg of Prozac the amount of fluorine would be .165 x 20 = 3.3mg (or 6.6mg for a 40mg/day dose).&#8221;

Every day that a person takes a standard dose of Prozac, he gets 3.3 milligrams of fluorine. At the higher dose, he gets 6.6 milligrams of fluorine.

The effect of co-administration of... [Int J Clin Pharmacol Ther. 1996] - PubMed - NCBI

*
GABAA receptor pharmacology of fluorinated derivatives of the novel sedative-hypnotic pyrazolopyrimidine indiplon.*
Wegner F, Deuther-Conrad W, Scheunemann M, Brust P, Fischer S, Hiller A, Diekers M, Strecker K, Wohlfarth K, Allgaier C, Steinbach J, Hoepping A.
Source
Department of Neurology, University of Leipzig, Leipzig, Germany. Florian.Wegner@medizin.uni-leipzig.de
Abstract
The function of gamma-aminobutyric acid type A receptors (GABA(A) receptors) is enhanced by various clinically important drugs including benzodiazepines that act on an allosteric site formed at the interface between the alpha and gamma subunits. In contrast to classical benzodiazepines, the novel pyrazolopyrimidine indiplon (N-methyl-N-{3-[7-(thiophene-2-carbonyl)-1,5,9-triazabicyclo[4.3.0]nona-2,4,6,8-tetraen-2-yl]phenyl}acetamide; N-methyl-N-{3-[3-(thiophene-2-carbonyl)-pyrazolo[1,5-a]pyrimidine-7-yl]phenyl}-acetamide) demonstrates relative binding selectivity for the alpha1 subunit containing receptor subtypes, which are the most frequently expressed in the mammalian central nervous system. To investigate the pharmacological properties at GABA(A) receptors and to promote the development of alpha1 subunit selective radiotracers for positron emission tomography imaging, we have started with the evaluation of various fluorinated indiplon derivatives. Binding affinities were determined in homogenates from newborn and adult rats suggesting an alpha1 preference of the reference compounds indiplon, zaleplon as well as for all newly synthesized indiplon derivatives. In homogenated cerebellar tissue obtained from adult rat brain, known to primarily express alpha1 containing GABA(A) receptors, the high affinity of the basic indiplon structure was only slightly affected by an elongation of the alkyl substituent of the amide N from methyl (indiplon; K(i) 3.1 nM) via ethyl (2a, N-(2-fluoro-ethyl)-N-{3-[3-(thiophene-2-carbonyl)-pyrazolo[1,5-a]pyrimidine-7-yl]phenyl}-acetamide; K(i) 5.4 nM) to propyl (2b, N-(3-fluoro-propyl)-N-{3-[3-(thiophene-2-carbonyl)-pyrazolo[1,5-a]pyrimidine-7-yl]phenyl}-acetamide; K(i) 2.4 nM). Whole cell patch-clamp recordings at neuronal and recombinant GABA(A) receptors indicated that the fluorinated derivatives 2a and 2b have a high potency at alpha1beta3gamma2L isoforms comparable to indiplon (EC(50): 105, 158, and 81 nM, respectively), with 2b displaying the most pronounced efficacy at alpha3beta3gamma2L subtypes. In conclusion, the affinity profiles and functional properties of the newly synthesised fluorinated indiplon derivatives make compounds 2a and 2b suitable for the development of [(18)F]-labelled ligands at GABA(A) receptors containing the alpha1 subunit.


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## Godboy (Jul 25, 2013)

9/11 inside job said:


> someone farted in here.



Dude, how many times are you going to use that joke? It was corny the first time you used it, let alone the hundredth time. What is wrong with you? Its like you have zero social skills or something. An adult should know better.


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 25, 2013)

And I'll bet Eots will tell us that he understands all that stuff perfectly....And what it has to do with vaccinations.....Or am I on the wrong thread?


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> And I'll bet Eots will tell us that he understands all that stuff perfectly....And what it has to do with vaccinations.....Or am I on the wrong thread?



your troll friend dawgshit brought up fluorides ...and yes I understand what I posted enough to see that the main ingredient in Prozac is essintialy fluoride and that it is classified as a hypnotic..also it does speak to my point that corporations will sell you products  from vaccines to prozac and fluoride that have no benefit and can potentially harm


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## Noomi (Jul 25, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.



Then the parents can be jailed for manslaughter or something.


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## eots (Jul 25, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.
> ...



stop being retarded...


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## OohPooPahDoo (Jul 25, 2013)

AnCapAtheist said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.
> ...



According to a bunch of bat shit crazy wackjobs - yes. But hey - why should you have to get your kid vaccinated? He probably won't catch any of that stuff - because the REST of us get OUR kids vaccinated. So a fucking thank you would be in order.


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## Montrovant (Jul 26, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > And I'll bet Eots will tell us that he understands all that stuff perfectly....And what it has to do with vaccinations.....Or am I on the wrong thread?
> ...



I only did a cursory read, but I think you are misconstruing things.  First, you have to clearly define what you mean by fluoride - just what's in our drinking water, or any compound which contains fluorine?  Next, you have to determine if fluorine is an hypnotic by itself, when combined with other elements, what those other elements are, if that is the case in drinking water, etc.  Last is the question of whether the term hypnotic drugs constitutes what you seemed to infer; that they are a tool of mind control.  My limited understanding is that hypnotic drugs are sleep-inducers in the main.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 26, 2013)

Noomi said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Any parent that does not want to give their child a vaccine shouldn't have to.  The kids can die instead.
> ...



Yeah, because you can prove that vaccines are 100% effective and their children getting sick was due to their negligence.

Were you born hateful and ignorant, or did television make you that way?


Explain to me something, what sort of arrogance makes a person get involved in the politics of a message board that is devoted to a nation the isn't even theirs?  I really don't get that?  There are lots of people on this site from Australia, New Zealand, Israeli, etc. chiming in with their opinions.  Why don't they discuss these things with their own countrymen on a message board in the own nation?  What makes them think that their opinions are welcome in a place where most Americans' value LIBERTY over communal security and communal values?  Only by securing liberty have we traditionally felt will our nation remain the bastion of freedom and democracy it has always been.  We don't need your filthy polluted wrong headed ideas mucking up the works.  You are free to read and learn, but butt out, will ya?  YOU DON'T BELONG HERE.

Frankly Noomi WE DON'T CARE about what you think.  You are from a different culture.  You believe in the collective.  You are of a different mindset.  What American parents do with their children is none of the businesses of the State, but you would never be able to fathom that notion, b/c you are of a different culture entirely.  So butt the hell out, ok?  You make yourself look so entirely ignorant about Americans and our culture when you make such stupid ass comments.  

I am sure that might seem like a reasonably thing to type out in, oh, Great Britain, Canada, Australia, but in the States, where we value the sovereignty of the individual over the sovereignty of the STATE, that sort of thinking sounds like utter tripe, nonsense.  It is none of the government's damn business how a parent raises their kids, if they believe, truly believe they are doing the best for them out of love.  If you don't believe it, go look up the Christian Scientists.  Frankly, I think they a barking mad lunatics.  BUT THAT IS THEIR PARENTAL RIGHT.  And god bless them, it should be.  If a Sioux from the reservation wants to keep their kid out of the Allopathic medical system and use traditional methods, again, that is their right, they can.  In your system, you  Statists would probably force them into the socialized medical system, and take away their kids, thinking the STATE knows best.  But here?  We still have sovereignty over our own.  So again, mind our own business.


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## eots (Jul 26, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



I never said anything about mind control...only you did..I said corperations will happly sell you products you do not need or that may even cause you harm...and as you point those are a lot of unanswered question for something we put in our drinking water and food supply


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## eots (Jul 26, 2013)

*Head Vaccine Developer Admits Gardasil Isn't Safe*

We want to believe any vaccine that is recommended by doctors and given to our kids is relatively safe. Sure, there are risks. We have to do our research, trust our instincts, think of our kids, and then decide what vaccines we want them to have and when to give them. No matter where you stand on the vax debate, all parents need to know about what one lead developer in the vaccine world is saying. It's apparently weighed so heavily on her mind that she couldn't keep it in any longer and went public so she can "sleep at night."
Head Vaccine Developer Admits Gardasil Isn't Safe | The Stir


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## eots (Jul 26, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljAcDEkn27M]BOYS - Forced Thinking About Gardasil Shot - YouTube[/ame]
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZW5CCMPWcbg]Michele Bachmann Rips Into Rick Perry's Forced Gardasil Shots at CNN Debate! - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7LH9TRCHuA]HPV Gardasil Vaccine Proves Lethal - 47 Girls Now Dead - YouTube[/ame]


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## Montrovant (Jul 26, 2013)

eots said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



You first posted about fluoride in response to daws's post in which he mentioned fluoride as a mind control agent.


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## daws101 (Jul 26, 2013)

eots said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


classic non sequitur...


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## Katzndogz (Jul 26, 2013)

People are pretty much basically ignorant and can be told just about anything to get them activated over nonsense.

DJs In Hot Water Over Dihydrogen Monoxide Prank

Two Florida DJs are in hot water after a dihydrogen monoxide April Fools prank. Val St John and Scott Fish have been suspended from Gator Country 101.9 after telling listeners that the water in Lee County contained the suspicious sounding substance. Dihydrogen monoxide (H2O) is simply a different way of describing water.


Numerous area residents contacted Lee County Utilities concerned about the safety of the water supply. The panic led to indefinite suspensions and possible felony charges against the WWGR DJs.


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## daws101 (Jul 26, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > And I'll bet Eots will tell us that he understands all that stuff perfectly....And what it has to do with vaccinations.....Or am I on the wrong thread?
> ...


it's no answer to the question of the load of fluoride you're carrying...


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## eots (Jul 26, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



How to detox fluoride from your body

is becoming an increasingly sought-after area of knowledge. People are waking up to the truth, and they want to learn how to detox fluoride, and get it out of their bodies, fast! Widespread fluoridation of municipal water is nothing more than forced mass medication. And thats putting it kindly, for that assumes that fluoride is a kind of medicine, which it isnt. We have been living under the fluoride deception for decades

How to Detox Fluoride: Nascent Iodine


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## daws101 (Jul 26, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


so you haven't done it?


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## LA RAM FAN (Jul 26, 2013)

at 3:15 pm today someone farted in here.


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## MisterBeale (Jul 27, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



Yeah, I knew that, I switched back from Sea-salt to Iodized when I realized.  Also, regular apples, because of the way they're fertilized, do not take up boron from the soil.  However, organic apples are the best source of dietary boron.  Like they say, "an apple a day."  lol  Everyone should make sure they have these extremely important micro-nutrients, especially in the world we live in.  Otherwise, they can not fight the affects of the mental programming they are assaulted with daily.

Again. Look up Silent Sound Spread Spectrum (SSSS).


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## Katzndogz (Jul 27, 2013)

Liberals want rotting teeth!

Who knew.


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## eots (Jul 27, 2013)

Katzndogz said:


> Liberals want rotting teeth!
> 
> Who knew.



*liberals ?...oh you poor woman you are so deep within the matrix*

A new study in the Journal of the American Dental Association finds once again that, contrary to what most people have been told, fluoride is actually bad for teeth.

Exposure to high levels of fluoride results in a condition known as fluorosis, in which tooth enamel becomes discolored. The condition can eventually lead to badly damaged teeth. The new study found that fluoride intake during a child&#8217;s first few years of life is significantly associated with fluorosis, and warned against using fluoridated water in infant formula.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) is of a similar opinion. According to their website:

&#8220;Recent evidence suggests that mixing powdered or liquid infant formula concentrate with fluoridated water on a regular basis may increase the chance of a child developing &#8230; enamel fluorosis.&#8221;

It was 2007 when the American Dental Association (ADA) first warned that parents of infants younger than a year old &#8220;should consider using water that has no or low levels of fluoride&#8221; when mixing baby formula, due to concerns about fluorosis.

Now the Journal of the American Dental Association has published a study that found increased fluorosis risk among infants who were fed infant formula reconstituted with fluoride-containing water, as well as used fluoridated toothpastes.
American Dental Association Admits Fluoride Is Bad For Teeth AND Health | The Therapy Book


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## daws101 (Jul 27, 2013)

eots said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Liberals want rotting teeth!
> ...


the matrix ploy fuuuuuuck me!


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## eots (Jul 27, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > katzndogz said:
> ...



but it so fits..she lives in a world of total illusion where friendly moral corporations sell you vaccines and fluoride to help you and heal you and  anyone who begs to differ is a "libtard"...its sad


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## daws101 (Jul 27, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


it never occurs to you or any of you paranoids that the damage is already done no matter how hard you attempt to eat it or drink it away..
if you've been drinking fluoridated water your entire life the  "cure" with only wash away the newest contamination.
it's a bit like curing syphilis ,


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## eots (Jul 27, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



continuing the poisoning makes no sense and in removing toxins bodies and minds can still heal...and I can do better for my children..


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## daws101 (Jul 27, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


only to a point.. the damage will remain..


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## dukect45 (Jul 29, 2013)

Measles is back. It had help - The Globe and Mail



> From Prince Edward Island to British Columbia, doctors across Canada are grappling with a highly infectious disease the likes of which theyve never seen before: measles.
> 
> Measles was supposedly stamped out years ago, along with whooping cough, polio and other nasty maladies. But now its made a comeback, thanks to people who dont believe in vaccinations. France, northern England and Wales have all been hit with serious measles outbreaks. Wales alone has had 1,200 cases since November of last year, mostly among children and adolescents under 18. Dozens more cases have appeared in pockets of the United States.


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## National Socialist (Jul 29, 2013)

Unkotare said:


> AnCapAtheist said:
> 
> 
> > Figures the dictators moved this to the wrong forum...nazis..
> ...



I'm back dickface...


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## eots (Jul 29, 2013)

dukect45 said:


> measles is back. It had help - the globe and mail
> 
> 
> 
> ...



big deal some kids got the measles...


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## eots (Jul 29, 2013)

Now this isn&#8217;t from some wacky anti-vaccine blog. This is coming from the MMWR which is the CDC&#8217;s own weekly publication. Here are 2 examples showing that we&#8217;ve always known that vaccinated kids can contract measles from the MMR vaccine itself.

The first instance is from Illinois, in which 17 high school students came down with measles even though 99% of the high school got the MMR vaccine.   
Measles Outbreak among Vaccinated High School Students -- Illinois


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## Montrovant (Jul 29, 2013)

eots said:


> Now this isnt from some wacky anti-vaccine blog. This is coming from the MMWR which is the CDCs own weekly publication. Here are 2 examples showing that weve always known that vaccinated kids can contract measles from the MMR vaccine itself.
> 
> The first instance is from Illinois, in which 17 high school students came down with measles even though 99% of the high school got the MMR vaccine.
> Measles Outbreak among Vaccinated High School Students -- Illinois



And the funny thing is, your link says nothing at all about the vaccine being the cause of the measles.  It says, first, that the cause of the original infection is unknown.  Second, that many of the instances of measles contraction were by unvaccinated persons.  Third, it speculates on reasons the measles may have been able to take hold in such a highly vaccinated population, wondering if there was a problem with the manufacture, storage, or delivery of the vaccines.  Last, it speculates on the likelihood that the outbreak would have been sustained much longer and spread further in a population with a lower vaccination percentage.

How you seem to go from that to 'vaccines are bad' I'm not sure...


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## eots (Jul 29, 2013)

For those 65 and older, though, it helped in just 9% of cases, a number too low to be statistically significant, according to a report in the CDC's Weekly Morbidity and Mortality Report released Thursday. The study was based on a survey of 2,697 children and adults by the U.S. Influenza Vaccine Effectiveness Network from Dec. 3, 2012, through Jan. 19, 2013.

Flu vaccine barely worked in people 65 and older


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## eots (Jul 29, 2013)

By Steven Reinberg
HealthDay Reporter

MONDAY, Oct. 6 (HealthDay News) -- Over the past two flu seasons, vaccinating children five and younger did not reduce the number of child hospitalizations or doctor's visits linked to influenza, according to results of a new study.

Given the poor match between the flu vaccine and circulating strains during the last two years, "this finding is not surprising," said Dr. Robert Belshe, a professor of medicine and pediatrics and director of the Center for Vaccine Development at the Saint Louis University Medical Center, who was not involved in the study.

Kids' Flu Shot Largely Ineffective Over Past Few Years - US News and World Report


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## SteadyMercury (Jul 30, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> And the funny thing is, your link says nothing at all about the vaccine being the cause of the measles.


Equally funny is he just ignored you and pretends he wasn't caught misrepresenting what he presented as evidence. Quick! Switch to some posts about flu instead!


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SteadyMercury said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > And the funny thing is, your link says nothing at all about the vaccine being the cause of the measles.
> ...



There was nothing to ignore..and nothing was misrepresented and the topic is vaccines so I also did not switch to another topic ....if anyone is ignoring anything its that these vaccines are ineffective and dargerouse


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Now this isnt from some wacky anti-vaccine blog. This is coming from the MMWR which is the CDCs own weekly publication. Here are 2 examples showing that weve always known that vaccinated kids can contract measles from the MMR vaccine itself.
> ...



*kind of says it all...*


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

MisterBeale said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > American Communist said:
> ...



*I KNOW that vaccines have all these horrendous side effects.*

You KNOW? You should publish.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Toddsterpatriot said:


> MisterBeale said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



why..there is plenty published already...the drug companies own inserts list many of them


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## Montrovant (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



What?  It says that you lied in your post by claiming the article said something about the vaccines causing the measles outbreak?  That's certainly true.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Montrovant said:
> ...



You are the only one lying.. I posted the beginning of the article and the link without any claim the vaccine caused measels..you lie..  and then.. you lie further when you say the vaccine was not the cause of the outbreak...when it was only SPECULATED it was not the cause and the cause was unknown....stop lying


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

And yet all these diseases that we have vaccinations against are slowly disappearing....Fewer and fewer cases all the time...I wonder why?


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

sfc ollie said:


> and yet all these diseases that we have vaccinations against are slowly disappearing....fewer and fewer cases all the time...i wonder why?



there can be many reason other than vaccinations for reduction in illness..and your belief that all illnesses vaccinated for have decreased is clearly not true many of these vaccines appear the ineffective

Kids' Flu Shot Largely Ineffective Over Past Few Years
Study finds it didn't keep them from hospitals, doctors' offices
http://health.usnews.com/health-new...ds-flu-shot-largely-ineffective-over-past-few


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## Montrovant (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



You said, and here's a direct quote if you're too lazy or ignorant to look at the post, "Here are 2 examples showing that we've always known that vaccinated kids can contract measles from the MMR vaccine itself.".   You then posted one link to the MMWR section of the CDC website, to an article about a small measles outbreak in Illinois.  

That link said absolutely nothing about the MMR vaccine causing measles.  As a matter of fact, the contents of the article pretty strongly suggest that was not and could not have been the case in this instance.  Here is a quote from that article, "From December 9, 1983, to January 13, 1984, 21 cases of measles occurred in Sangamon County, Illinois.* Nine of the cases were confirmed serologically. The outbreak involved 16 high school students, all of whom had histories of measles vaccination after 15 months of age documented in their school health records. Of the five remaining cases, four occurred in unvaccinated preschool children, two of whom were under 15 months of age, and one case occurred in a previously vaccinated college student (Figure 5)."  So we have 4 cases in which there was no vaccine.  Obviously those are out.  In the remaining 17 cases, one is described as a college student who was previously vaccinated, which certainly sounds like it happened long enough ago not to be the cause in this instance.  The rest were high school students, and again, since they had 'histories of measles vaccination after 15 months of age' it sounds as though those vaccinations occurred far enough in the past to not have been the cause in this instance.

So we have a post in which you claim you have 2 examples, then give only 1.  You claim the examples show that the MMR vaccine causes measles, and in the single example you gave, it says nothing of the sort.  That example did, in fact, provide evidence that seems to suggest the vaccine was not the cause in the instance described.

Yes, you lied.

I assume you want to make a point about the dangers of vaccination.  That would be better accomplished through honesty and relying on the actual evidence, rather than adding your own speculation and spin, especially when such additions are not supported in any way by the very evidence you provide.  There can be dangers from vaccines.  If you want anyone to actually heed your warnings about that, you might stop making things up.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > montrovant said:
> ...



I never made any such statement liar and you can provide no such link to me making that statement....and you lied some more when you claimed the vaccine did not cause the illness when that in fact was...speculation... and the cause was unknown


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> sfc ollie said:
> 
> 
> > and yet all these diseases that we have vaccinations against are slowly disappearing....fewer and fewer cases all the time...i wonder why?
> ...



Of all the vaccines that we have and all the sickness they have prevented all you got is a flu vaccine from one year to prove none of them work?

Really Eots, even you are not this stupid.



> The advent of the measles vaccine
> 
> The history of measles underwent a sea change in 1963 with the advent of the measles vaccine. The number of measles cases dropped by 99 percent. The vaccine was first licensed in the United States in 1963.



Measles History


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

WHY VACCINATION CONTINUES
"The propaganda in favour of immunization has won the minds of the masses and has influenced medical thinking, and government and international measures, relating to disease control. This has been at the expense of methods which might have raised the real level of well-being of the people at risk. This begins to impinge upon the realms of politics and economics, for the gains are great in this area, and the truth is not always palatable. The removal of the idea of protection, via immunization, and the implementation of expensive measures to improve nutrition in countries which can hardly make ends meet, would not be welcome themes for politicians, even if they could be made to listen to the facts.

Leon Chaitow
Vaccination And Immunization

That vaccination continues to this day is not because of its 'assumed' benefits, but (1) because it yields millions of dollars profit to the Drug Industry, (2) because it is one of the foundation stones of Medical Science upon which they have undeservedly built their power and prestige, and for that reason, must remain in place, and (3) because the majority of the public, brainwashed by medical propaganda, and unwilling to think for themselves, blindly accept it.
Vaccination: The Hidden Facts; Chapter 11


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## daws101 (Jul 30, 2013)

this thread in not about killer vaccines but eots fear of injections and prostate exams...


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> WHY VACCINATION CONTINUES
> "The propaganda in favour of immunization has won the minds of the masses and has influenced medical thinking, and government and international measures, relating to disease control. This has been at the expense of methods which might have raised the real level of well-being of the people at risk. This begins to impinge upon the realms of politics and economics, for the gains are great in this area, and the truth is not always palatable. The removal of the idea of protection, via immunization, and the implementation of expensive measures to improve nutrition in countries which can hardly make ends meet, would not be welcome themes for politicians, even if they could be made to listen to the facts.
> 
> Leon Chaitow
> ...



*That vaccination continues to this day is not because of its 'assumed' benefits, but (1) because it yields millions of dollars profit to the Drug Industry*

Only millions? Hardly worth it, if profit was the only motive.
You may have heard, many drug companies got out of the vaccine business.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Between 2004 and 2007, vaccine sales across the industry soared an average of 32 per cent each year, with flu vaccine leading the way. That is roughly four times faster than any other pharmaceutical product.

In a year that will be remembered for widespread public worry about the H1N1 virus, or swine flu, vaccines have become a $24-billion business. Analysts predict the global vaccine industry will top $40-billion by 2012. For companies like Glaxo, Sanofi-Aventis, Merck & Co., Novartis AG and Pfizer Inc., the fear of a pandemic has translated into a financial windfall that has been years in the making. Worldwide, nearly 1 billion doses of H1N1 vaccine have been ordered in 2009.

How vaccines became big business - The Globe and Mail


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

There go those evil corporations again, making money, giving people jobs, and worse of all saving lives...

Shame on them...


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Between 2004 and 2007, vaccine sales across the industry soared an average of 32 per cent each year, with flu vaccine leading the way. That is roughly four times faster than any other pharmaceutical product.
> 
> In a year that will be remembered for widespread public worry about the H1N1 virus, or swine flu, vaccines have become a $24-billion business. Analysts predict the global vaccine industry will top $40-billion by 2012. For companies like Glaxo, Sanofi-Aventis, Merck & Co., Novartis AG and Pfizer Inc., the fear of a pandemic has translated into a financial windfall that has been years in the making. Worldwide, nearly 1 billion doses of H1N1 vaccine have been ordered in 2009.
> 
> How vaccines became big business - The Globe and Mail



I thought we were talking about forcing school kids to get shots?
Now you're talking about flu shots?
Make up your mind.


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## Montrovant (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



Here you go :

http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...-the-vaccine-hoax-is-over-16.html#post7612850

That's post #232.  Anyone can see it, it's been quoted in subsequent replies, and here it is again.  So, ready to admit that you said exactly what I quoted?  Or are you going to lie in the face of direct proof?  

Oh, and while I never actually said the vaccine did not cause the outbreak, what I did say is that the evidence provided in the article linked BY YOU strongly suggests that it could not have been caused by vaccine, as those affected were vaccinated long before the incident occurred.  I provided a quote from the article YOU LINKED to show how that is the case.

So, again....you lied.  You continue to lie.  I am providing you with obvious, pretty indisputable proof of your continuing lies.  Want to keep going?


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## Montrovant (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Now this isnt from some wacky anti-vaccine blog. This is coming from the MMWR which is the CDCs own weekly publication. Here are 2 examples showing that weve always known that vaccinated kids can contract measles from the MMR vaccine itself.
> 
> The first instance is from Illinois, in which 17 high school students came down with measles even though 99% of the high school got the MMR vaccine.
> Measles Outbreak among Vaccinated High School Students -- Illinois



Here eots, I'll link this again for you just in case you are somehow going to argue it doesn't work in my previous post.  See the part where you say that the examples show that kids can contract measles from the vaccine?  Do you need it pointed out?  See how I quoted you directly, with no alterations?


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

toddsterpatriot said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > between 2004 and 2007, vaccine sales across the industry soared an average of 32 per cent each year, with flu vaccine leading the way. That is roughly four times faster than any other pharmaceutical product.
> ...


you think flu shots are not vaccines ?


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > now this isnt from some wacky anti-vaccine blog. This is coming from the mmwr which is the cdcs own weekly publication. Here are 2 examples showing that weve always known that vaccinated kids can contract measles from the mmr vaccine itself.
> ...



thats not my quote  that's the editorial remark by the blogger.. ..vaccines have caused the very illness they are to prevent but if this is the case in this instance was unknown as stated in the artical


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## rdean (Jul 30, 2013)

It's the whole "anti science" thing again.  It keeps popping up.  I know, if you can find one, ask a Republican scientist what they think.  If you can find one.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

sfc ollie said:


> there go those evil corporations again, making money, giving people jobs, and worse of all saving lives...
> 
> Shame on them...



corporations sell products for profit...period...you must live in alternative universe if you are not aware of the endless list of corporations that have both knowingly and unknowingly sold faulty or  dangerous products or products that do not live up to the claims and studies reported..


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

rdean said:


> it's the whole "anti science" thing again.  It keeps popping up.  I know, if you can find one, ask a republican scientist what they think.  If you can find one.



blah blah blah blah  huh ?


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

*YUK..YUK THESE PEOPLE IS PROBABLY TEA BAGGERS...*

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7LH9TRCHuA&list=PL21B192AA182DF7DF]HPV Gardasil Vaccine Proves Lethal - 47 Girls Now Dead - YouTube[/ame]


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## Montrovant (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> montrovant said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



You didn't provide any links to a blog, nor credit a blog in the post.  The only link is to the CDC's site.

If this has all come about because you accidentally left out a link to a blog, well, that's fine.  Those kinds of mistakes happen to all of us.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBAv1H0-dYc&list=PL21B192AA182DF7DF]Urgent Warning about Gardasil - YouTube[/ame]


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

montrovant said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > montrovant said:
> ...



thats what happened ,yes


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



You think schools force kids to get flu shots?


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

rdean said:


> It's the whole "anti science" thing again.  It keeps popping up.  I know, if you can find one, ask a Republican scientist what they think.  If you can find one.



They all died from Alar, or was it DDT, transmission lines?
Maybe it was GMOs? Agent Orange? AGW?

Liberal scientists keep finding stuff to kill us, we keep living.


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## rdean (Jul 30, 2013)

Toddsterpatriot said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > It's the whole "anti science" thing again.  It keeps popping up.  I know, if you can find one, ask a Republican scientist what they think.  If you can find one.
> ...



Birth Defects from Agent Orange

Enjoy!  Because you know, "It doesn't exist".


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Toddsterpatriot said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > toddsterpatriot said:
> ...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJu3y9AmH0I]Mandatory Vaccinations for US Citizens under Obama - YouTube[/ame]


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## daws101 (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> There go those evil corporations again, making money, giving people jobs, and worse of all saving lives...
> 
> Shame on them...


saving lives, how totally evil!


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVw1lqLkkPg]Shot in the arm: Flu shot now mandatory for some - YouTube[/ame]


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

daws101 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > There go those evil corporations again, making money, giving people jobs, and worse of all saving lives...
> ...



Is that what you believe ?


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

rdean said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z55d_bH0450]GENETICALLY MODIFIED FOOD Cause TUMORS And SEVERE Organ Damage In Rats ! - YouTube[/ame]


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## daws101 (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


and you're not a zealot ...
fact: a tiny portion of people will have a bad or lethal reaction to any giving vaccine or drug the majority will not.
while those deaths are unfortunate the greater good must take priority.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



and who decides whats the "greater good"..Merck ?..Monsanto


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## daws101 (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...


in the end the public decides...as always you fail to see that.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Pharmaceutical companies care about profits and shareholders, not your children.[4]
Since 1989, pharmaceutical companies have paid only 2.3 billion dollars for vaccine injuries. Given the total lifetime care of a vaccine-injured child, many parents believe this figure should be substantially higher.[5]
The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 (Public Law 99-660) created the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). Vaccine manufacturers (and doctors!) are given complete immunity from any legal liability if your child is harmed by their vaccine(s). No other industry enjoys this level of protection from a product that could injure a child! [6]
Some of the same pharmaceutical companies listed below have been charged with criminal acts by the Department of Justice.[7]
- See more at: Who Says There is No Money in Making Vaccines? At Least $5.7 Billion Given to Vaccine Manufacturers in 2011 by US Gov?t


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

daws101 said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > daws101 said:
> ...



I fail to see that how ??..you seem to be the one opposed to the public deciding and more likely the just leave in the good hands of Merk and "Rick Perrys" to decide...the "greater good"


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

Eots simply refuses to admit the fact that more lives have been saved by vaccinations than not....

Yes Eots I said fact........


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> Eots simply refuses to admit the fact that more lives have been saved by vaccinations than not....
> 
> Yes Eots I said fact........



what vaccinations  ?...because some vaccinations have helped all vaccinations are good...if one vaccinations is good 30 is 30 times as good ?...is that whats called Ollie logic ?


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

So according to you if one person has a bad reaction and 1 million are saved it's a bad vaccine....

Give it up Eots science is against you. History is against you......


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> So according to you if one person has a bad reaction and 1 million are saved it's a bad vaccine....
> 
> Give it up Eots science is against you. History is against you......



1 person harmed and 1 million saved from what  Ollie ? where do you get these stats Ollie ?...how about millions vaccinated with no benefit and numerous injuries and deaths...there are in fact historical and scientific stats for that 


CBS 60 Minutes: 300 death claims from 1976 swine flu vaccine, only one death from flu - National US Intelligence | Examiner.com


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## daws101 (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> daws101 said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
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GOLLY mr. false assumption..how do you do it?
the public for the most part are self involved morons ,you're a prime example..
but anyway...pharmaceuticals ,vaccines like everything else live or die by the opinion of the consumer..if people don't buy it they don't make it.


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## daws101 (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > So according to you if one person has a bad reaction and 1 million are saved it's a bad vaccine....
> ...


Examiner.com is wholly owned by The Anschutz Corporation, one of the largest sports and entertainment companies in the world. Headquartered in Denver, CO, ..
thats what I'd call valid!


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

I already provided one historic example of the measles vaccine reducing the cases of measles by 99%. Do i really need to post it again? or do you think i should waste my time educating you on dozens of others only for you to ignore them...

Of course there have probably been some bad vaccines. No doubt, we are human and make mistakes. But If 300 died from a vaccine and only one died from the disease then i have to ask how many would have died without it? We don't have an answer to that do we....


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> I already provided one historic example of the measles vaccine reducing the cases of measles by 99%. Do i really need to post it again? or do you think i should waste my time educating you on dozens of others only for you to ignore them...
> 
> Of course there have probably been some bad vaccines. No doubt, we are human and make mistakes. But If 300 died from a vaccine and only one died from the disease then i have to ask how many would have died without it? We don't have an answer to that do we....



there was large number of unvaccinated people none of them died from swine flu ollie..


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> I already provided one historic example of the measles vaccine reducing the cases of measles by 99%. Do i really need to post it again? or do you think i should waste my time educating you on dozens of others only for you to ignore them...
> 
> Of course there have probably been some bad vaccines. No doubt, we are human and make mistakes. But If 300 died from a vaccine and only one died from the disease then i have to ask how many would have died without it? We don't have an answer to that do we....



yes then I posted a university study showing those numbers where inaccurate as they did not take into consideration historical natural rising and falling of the virus over various decades


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyaVxYYVfQE]The Dangers of Vaccines - Part 1 (MMR vaccination side effects DTaP vaccine dangers Autism SIDS HPV) - YouTube[/ame]


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

You really need to get away from youtube and start posting things like real studies that we can look at and see if they are legit and peer reviewed and all that good stuff. Any one can make a youtube video. I've done it myself.......


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## MisterBeale (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> You really need to get away from youtube and start posting things like real studies that we can look at and see if they are legit and peer reviewed and all that good stuff. Any one can make a youtube video. I've done it myself.......


Awesome!  I'd like to see that Ollie.  Put it on up!  I'd love to see it.  My Grandpa was involved in a covert operation, and my cousin made a video about that, would you like to see it?


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

Not really.......


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

My videos are rather boring but this is the most recent.....

Not that it means much to most people these days.....


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFenXDTP0Pc]Memorial Day 2013 - YouTube[/ame]


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> > eots said:
> ...



I'll ask again.
You think schools force kids to get flu shots?


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Pharmaceutical companies care about profits and shareholders, not your children.[4]
> Since 1989, pharmaceutical companies have paid only 2.3 billion dollars for vaccine injuries. Given the total lifetime care of a vaccine-injured child, many parents believe this figure should be substantially higher.[5]
> The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 (Public Law 99-660) created the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). Vaccine manufacturers (and doctors!) are given complete immunity from any legal liability if your child is harmed by their vaccine(s). No other industry enjoys this level of protection from a product that could injure a child! [6]
> Some of the same pharmaceutical companies listed below have been charged with criminal acts by the Department of Justice.[7]
> - See more at: Who Says There is No Money in Making Vaccines? At Least $5.7 Billion Given to Vaccine Manufacturers in 2011 by US Gov?t



*The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 (Public Law 99-660) created the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). Vaccine manufacturers (and doctors!) are given complete immunity from any legal liability if your child is harmed by their vaccine(s)*

Sounds like the rare, good idea from government.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> You really need to get away from youtube and start posting things like real studies that we can look at and see if they are legit and peer reviewed and all that good stuff. Any one can make a youtube video. I've done it myself.......



and anyone with any  discernment can view a video listen to the studies cited and the credentials of the the people speaking and cross reference the information I have posted several pdf links to studies ..only to receive corny one liners in response..


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## freedombecki (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > You really need to get away from youtube and start posting things like real studies that we can look at and see if they are legit and peer reviewed and all that good stuff. Any one can make a youtube video. I've done it myself.......
> ...


Count your blessings, Mr. eots.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> My videos are rather boring but this is the most recent.....
> 
> Not that it means much to most people these days.....
> 
> ...



sweet beard ollie...but then again it is a youtbe video it could all be actors and a fake beard


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

Exactly


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

That was awesome..almost like being there ...riding shot-gun with the ollieman groovin to the oldies cruzin through pleasant ville USA

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZR9t0NIv1NE]Driving home - YouTube[/ame]

(don't tell him but I was blazin a joint through the whole virtual ride along) _and windy has wings to fly..up up in the sky_


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## MisterBeale (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> My videos are rather boring but this is the most recent.....
> 
> Not that it means much to most people these days.....
> 
> ...



I think it means everything.  It is real.  I enjoyed it.  That is the thing about Youtube videos, they are quick efficient means of communicating large volumes of information quickly, with impact.  Can they be used as a propaganda means to sway emotions, and thus be accused of committing a fallacy?  Sure, but most people on this site get most of their views from television anyway, don't they?  So let's not be disingenuous. 

Deep down Ollie, do you believe vaccinations should be a choice?  Should Americans be free to choose what their hearts tell them is right, moral and ethical?  Did these soldiers in your video die for freedom?  Or did they die for a government that can force people to do as it tells them to, (or conditions them to believe is the proper course of action?)  My heart tells me you are a good man who really believes in the freedom of the sovereign individual.  Let not these soldiers have died in vain.  I also believe that you think everyone should get vaccinated and that vaccines are the right _choice_.  But if we don't question everything, and keep the corporations feet to the fire, how long will it be before the choice becomes a requirement?  How long before corners are cut and society begins to suffer?


On a different note, this mission has been declassified, if anyone is interested, the Sub that was captured, U-505, is now on display in the Chicago Museum of Science and Technology.  My grandfather was on the  Edsall-class destroyer escort USS Pillsbury (DE-133).

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZbqCVrwBJY&list=FLqAeF3zEY5mcCaq3ysBo3rw&index=15"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZbqCVrwBJY&list=FLqAeF3zEY5mcCaq3ysBo3rw&index=15[/ame]


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 30, 2013)

We are a nation of laws and regulations, I believe that most of those are either for our good or because those we elected believe that they are for our good. I can only trust my personal Doctor when it comes to what I should or shouldn't put into my body. he recommends I get the flu shot i get it. he recommends I get the pneumonia vaccine i get it. He tells me to stop taking a certain medication I stop taking it...Must work I'm still here.......And I'm quite certain he knows a lot more about healthcare than anyone on this board.......

Force someone to take a vaccine? Hard way to put it but certain ones yes,  unless a doctor says differently. Why? Because they have been tried and proven. And in many cases it is in our laws and regulations.... 

Don't want to take them, go see your doctor.......


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Oh I'm not just talking, I have never had a vaccine none of my three children has ever had a vaccine..my two very healthy oldest children thank me for my forward thinking in keep them free of childhood vaccines


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> We are a nation of laws and regulations, I believe that most of those are either for our good or because those we elected believe that they are for our good. I can only trust my personal Doctor when it comes to what I should or shouldn't put into my body. he recommends I get the flu shot i get it. he recommends I get the pneumonia vaccine i get it. He tells me to stop taking a certain medication I stop taking it...Must work I'm still here.......And I'm quite certain he knows a lot more about healthcare than anyone on this board.......
> 
> Force someone to take a vaccine? Hard way to put it but certain ones yes,  unless a doctor says differently. Why? Because they have been tried and proven. And in many cases it is in our laws and regulations....
> 
> Don't want to take them, go see your doctor.......


Doctors Are The Third Leading Cause of Death Pg1 - MS Reversed http://www.msreversed.com/PDF/Doctors Are The Third Leading Cause of Death.pdf


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## Toddsterpatriot (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Oh I'm not just talking, I have never had a vaccine none of my three children has ever had a vaccine..my two very healthy oldest children thank me for my forward thinking in keep them free of childhood vaccines



Hopefully a third world visitor won't give your kids a fatal disease.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Toddsterpatriot said:


> eots said:
> 
> 
> > Oh I'm not just talking, I have never had a vaccine none of my three children has ever had a vaccine..my two very healthy oldest children thank me for my forward thinking in keep them free of childhood vaccines
> ...



what strange tropical diseases are you concerned about that a healthy immune system could not handle and one should be vaccinated for?


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)




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## MisterBeale (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> We are a nation of laws and regulations, I believe that most of those are either for our good or because those we elected believe that they are for our good. I can only trust my personal Doctor when it comes to what I should or shouldn't put into my body. he recommends I get the flu shot i get it. he recommends I get the pneumonia vaccine i get it. He tells me to stop taking a certain medication I stop taking it...Must work I'm still here.......And I'm quite certain he knows a lot more about healthcare than anyone on this board.......
> 
> Force someone to take a vaccine? Hard way to put it but certain ones yes,  unless a doctor says differently. Why? Because they have been tried and proven. And in many cases it is in our laws and regulations....
> 
> Don't want to take them, go see your doctor.......



Interesting point of view, I understand your thinking.  I wish it were that simple.  Read the following article, with the included videos, then tell me if that sort of thinking still holds up to the scrutiny of the corrupting influence of the pharmaceutical industry in the medical industry and in your doctors office.

Here's just a little excerpt. . . . 
*Ask Your Doctor: Are You Being Bribed to Recommend This? *
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/06/02/bribery-affects-vaccination-rates.aspx


> *Story at-a-glance*
> 
> Many doctors are pushing vaccines on their patients for what amounts to a bribe from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) to increase the practices vaccination rates. The CDCs AFIX program encourages friendly competition among staff to see who can increase vaccination rates the most, and prizes include such things as scholarships to training and professional meetings, plaques and public recognition, and opportunities to partner with pharmaceutical companies for additional funding sources.
> 
> ...


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## freedombecki (Jul 30, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> I already provided one historic example of the measles vaccine reducing the cases of measles by 99%. Do i really need to post it again? or do you think i should waste my time educating you on dozens of others only for you to ignore them...
> 
> Of course there have probably been some bad vaccines. No doubt, we are human and make mistakes. But If 300 died from a vaccine and only one died from the disease then i have to ask how many would have died without it? We don't have an answer to that do we....


 
Kids today cannot appreciate what earlier generations went through, SFC Ollie, when there was a family member who suffered a childhood disease that was preventable when they were young. One of my family members contracted poliomyelitis two years before the salk vaccines were out. When he was a teenager, one of his arms was slightly deformed, and while he was out playing one day, he was jumped by bullies who saw the deformity and saw an easy mark. They banged his head really hard and he bore a lump for the duration. Years later, he acquired dementia, and the doctor was puzzled why he could do complex math problems. After investigating the case, he realized my family member had had a blow to the head, which can cause early onset dementia. Bad things happen to people who have handicaps, and idiot bullies come along and take advantage of any weakness they see. That's just human equation stuff and doesn't count the embarrassment a young child has growing up "different" from other people, and how they feel passed up for athletics and sports. 

I went and found for the board's perusal, a chart of deaths from this disease at the US. Center for Disease Control. Here's the result of my search:

*Table_2*

TABLE 2. Baseline 20th century annual morbidity and 1998 provisional morbidity fromnine diseases with vaccines recommended before 1990 for universal use in children-- United States=============================================================================================== Baseline 20th century 1998 Provisional %

Disease *annual morbidity* morbidity Decrease

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Smallpox *48,164** 0 100%

Diphtheria *175,885*+ 1 100%&

Pertussis *147,271*@ 6,279 95.7%'

Tetanus *1,314*** 34 97.4%

Poliomyelitis (paralytic) *16,316*++ 0&& 100%

Measles *503,282*@@ 89 100%&

'Mumps *152,209**** 606 99.6%

Rubella *47,745*+++ 345 99.3% 

Congenital rubella *823*&&& 5 99.4% syndrome

Haemophilus *20,000*@@@ 54**** 99.7% influenzae type b
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

* Average annual number of cases during 1900-1904 ( 1 ). + Average annual number of reported cases during 1920-1922, 3 years before vaccine development. & Rounded to nearest tenth. @ Average annual number of reported cases during 1922-1925, 4 years before vaccine development. ** Estimated number of cases based on reported number of deaths during 1922-1926 assuming a case-fatality rate of 90%. ++ Average annual number of reported cases during 1951-1954, 4 years before vaccine licensure. && Excludes one cases of vaccine-associated polio reported in 1998. @@ Average annual number of reported cases during 1958-1962, 5 years before vaccine licensure. *** Number of reported cases in 1968, the first year reporting began and the first year after vaccine licensure. +++ Average annual number of reported cases during 1966-1968, 3 years before vaccine licensure. &&& Estimated number of cases based on seroprevalence data in the population and on the risk that women infected during a childbearing year would have a fetus with congenital rubella syndrome ( 7 ). @@@ Estimated number of cases from population-based surveillance studies before vaccine licensure in 1985 ( 8 ). **** Excludes 71 cases of Haemophilus influenzae disease of unknown serotype.================================================================================================More statistical data and information is here: Achievements in Public Health, 1900-1999, Impact of Vaccines Universally Recommended for Children, United States, 1990-1998

It was published in April of 1999.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Increase in Autism Reflects Real Increases in Childhood Chronic Diseases and Disability
The connection between vaccination and autistic behavior, first reported in DPT: A Shot in the Dark (Coulter & Fisher, 1985) fifteen years ago and now being discussed in the medical literature, has finally entered the U.S. public arena after simmering for more than a decade. This enhanced public awareness has been fueled by persistent reports by parents in the U.S., Canada and Europe that their children were healthy, bright and happy until they received one or more vaccines and then descended into the isolated, painful world of autism marked by chronic immune and neurological dysfunction, including repetitive and uncontrollable behavior. Conservative estimates are that about 500,000 Americans are autistic but that number is growing daily, with new evidence that perhaps as many as 1 in 150 children are suffering from autism spectrum disorder that can include a range of neurological, behavior and immune system dysfunction.
  The incidence of autism, like that of learning disabilities, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), asthma, diabetes, arthritis, chronic fatigue syndrome, inflammatory bowel disease and other autoimmune and neurological disorders, has risen dramatically in the U.S. and other technologically advanced countries, while high vaccination rates have caused the incidence of childhood infectious diseases to fall just as dramatically in these countries. Instead of epidemics of infectious disease, there are now epidemics of chronic disease.

  A University of California study published by the U.S. Department of Education in 1996 found that "The proportion of the US population with disabilities has risen markedly during the past quarter-century . . . this recent change seems to be due not to demographics, but to greater numbers of children and young adults reported as having disabilities." The study concluded that "these changes may be partly accounted for by the increases in the prevalence of asthma, mental disorders (including attention deficit disorder), mental retardation, and learning disabilities that have been noted among children in recent years.

National Vaccine Information Center Archives


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## Noomi (Jul 30, 2013)

eots said:


> Oh I'm not just talking, I have never had a vaccine none of my three children has ever had a vaccine..my two very healthy oldest children thank me for my forward thinking in keep them free of childhood vaccines



Lets hope none of your kids gets measles or polio or something. 

Parents who refuse to vaccinate their kids should not be parents, IMO.


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## eots (Jul 30, 2013)

Noomi said:


> eots said:
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> > Oh I'm not just talking, I have never had a vaccine none of my three children has ever had a vaccine..my two very healthy oldest children thank me for my forward thinking in keep them free of childhood vaccines
> ...



The oldest children are 23 and 25 the youngest is 7 and people as misinformed and reactionary as yourself are in no position to decide who should be a parent


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

eots said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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> > We are a nation of laws and regulations, I believe that most of those are either for our good or because those we elected believe that they are for our good. I can only trust my personal Doctor when it comes to what I should or shouldn't put into my body. he recommends I get the flu shot i get it. he recommends I get the pneumonia vaccine i get it. He tells me to stop taking a certain medication I stop taking it...Must work I'm still here.......And I'm quite certain he knows a lot more about healthcare than anyone on this board.......
> ...


all your "experts" are homeopaths or naturopaths 
 it's in their best interest to  talk shit about the competition.


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

eots said:


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Disease by vector

[edit]Insects
Mosquitoes
Malaria - a parasitic infection transmitted by infective mosquitoes, malarial infections require immediate qualified diagnosis and treatment, preventatives and treatments are available - no vaccine is available
Yellow fever - vaccine available
Dengue fever - a mosquito borne febrile virus transmitted by an infective Aedes aegypti or Aedes africanus mosquito. Causes high fever, headache, joint and muscle pain and may in some cases lead to a more severe manifestation, dengue hemorrhagic fever (DHF). Occurs in many tropical countries and is the most important tropical infectious disease after malaria and the worlds most serious (human) arbovirus disease. DHF infections require immediate qualified diagnosis and treatment - no vaccine is available
Chikungunya (CHIKV)- also known as epidemic polyarthritis and rash, and buggy creek virus. A febrile virus transmitted, like dengue by an infective Aedes aegypti or Aedes africanus mosquito. After 3-12 days flu-like symptoms develop including severe headaches, chills, fever, joint pain, nausea and vomiting - no vaccine is available
Filariasis
Encephalitis
West Nile virus
Ross River virus and possibly others

Lice or mites
Ricketsial Infections - cause a broad range of diseases. Symptoms often include fever, headache and malaise as well as a rash. Antibiotic treatment is available.
Rocky Mountain spotted fever
Cat-scratch disease
Q fever - transmission by contact with soil and dust contaminated with carcasses from goat, sheep, and cattle and probably also by unpasteurized milk
(Epidemic) Typhus - transmitted by the human body louse, vaccine available.
Others
Chagas disease
[edit]Water (or contaminated food)
Cryptosporidiosis/Cryptosporidium/Crypto. Found worldwide, this disease is an untreated and chlorine treated water risk. It can even be spread if an infected person bathes in a treated public swimming pool. It causes diarrhea, cramps and fever. Last about 10 days but feces carry infection for weeks. Prevention by avoiding mouth coming into contact with infected water or fecal matter and maintaining scrupulous toilet and bathing hygiene after being infected to prevent reinfection of self or others. There is no cure. Prevented by boiling all drinking water, including tap water, in infected areas.
Diarrhea, typically caused by bacteria in food or drinks. Also known as Delhi Belly, Montezuma's Revenge, and so on, this is the most common ailment of all for travellers. Extreme forms include cholera (watery massive diarrhea) and dysentery (bloody diarrhea). A cholera vaccine is available, but rarely used due to its ineffectiveness and the unlikeliness of the average traveller contracting the disease.
Hepatitis A. Can be spread by food contaminated with feces (unwashed hands), where the virus remains active for days. Symptoms may not appear for a month after infection, and may continue for as long as six months. Hepatitis A is common almost everywhere except in countries with a high standard of hygiene (see map of areas with high infection rates: US CDC FAQ). A vaccine is available for hepatitis A, but this will not protect against the more virulent forms of hepatitis, such as B C.
Typhoid fever. Caused by the bacterium Salmonella enterica Typhi. It causes high fever, headache, malaise as well as other symptoms and is a general health problem in all less developed countries. Transmission is by contaminated food and water, especially in rural areas. A vaccination is available but offers no absolute safety, so the best options are precautions with what you drink & eat. See also Travelers' Health | CDC.
Schistosomiasis/Bilharzia is a nasty parasite that can be picked up by swimming in contaminated fresh water. The worm is carried by freshwater snails, and emerges daily into the water, where it is attracted to water turbulence, shadows, and chemicals found on human skin. While unlikely to be fatal, Schistosomiasis is a devastating disease, which should be treated as soon as possible. Symptoms include abdominal pain, diarrhea, coughing, genital sores, itching especially around the feet, but above all serious fatigue. Schistosomiasis, while present throughout much of the world, is primarily a problem in sub-Saharan Africa, and is easily, if unhappily, prevented by not swimming in fresh water.
[edit]Food
Meat
Trichinosis - a tapeworm - from eating improperly cooked infected meats, particularly pork.
Hydatids - another tapeworm - from eating improperly cooked infected meats, particularly sheep/mutton. Can also be spread by dogs that have been eating infected meat.
Unpasteurized dairy products can transmit several diseases, including tuberculosis
[edit]Others
Avian Influenza. A viral infection normally affecting birds but the Avian Influenza A virus has also been found, albeit extremely rarely, in some human infections. Current outbreaks among animals occurred in South-East Asia (Cambodia, China, Indonesia, Laos, Malaysia, Thailand, and Vietnam). The disease is transmitted to humans by contact with infected birds (especially poultry) and their excrements and may cause serious disease. Precautions include avoiding contact to wild birds and their excrements (as far as this is possible...). Avian influenza infection appears frequently in the news because it could be a source for new influenza strains to which no one has immunity and which have the potential to evolve to cause deadly epidemics. However, from the traveler's perspective the personal risk from avian influenza is extremely low. Travelers should obey recommendations on contact with poultry as a matter of civic duty, to prevent spreading the avian disease to birds in other countries. There is no vaccination available in the moment.
Ebola. Found largely in West Sub-Saharan Africa after contact with infected primates (human and non-human), this disease is fatal if not treated aggressively and early and has a 50-90% fatality rate. Get to a hospital immediately upon experiencing symptoms.
Hepatitis B and C. Can be spread by entry of blood or bodily fluids from an infected person into the body, such as through sexual contact, sharing of hypodermic needles, or blood transfusion or organ donation (theoretically, if screening were not performed). Unlike Hepatitis A, "Hepatitis B is not spread through food or water, sharing eating utensils, breastfeeding, hugging, kissing, coughing, sneezing or by casual contact" (US CDC FAQ) A vaccine is available to prevent Hepatitis B, but no vaccine is available to protect against Hepatitis C.
HIV (AIDS virus). HIV is transmitted in the same ways as hepatitis B. Abstinence or monogamy, safe sex, and an absolute ban on needle-sharing are wise precautions in any country of the world. Travellers should note that rare strains of HIV, such as HIV-2 or Group O HIV-1, occur predominantly in West Africa and may not be detected by some rapid HIV screening tests. Some strains of HIV prevalent in Africa and Asia may be more infectious by heterosexual intercourse (see avert.org for further information)
Influenza. The common Flu kills an estimated 36,000 Americans each year, and results in 200,000 hospitalizations per year. (CDC Flu Page) As a general precaution an annual vaccination is often recommended for the latest strains prevalent in the countries you are visiting.
Lassa fever. An acute viral illness that occurs in West Africa. In areas of Africa where the disease is endemic (that is, constantly present), Lassa fever is a significant cause of morbidity and mortality. While Lassa fever is mild or has no observable symptoms in about 80% of people infected with the virus, the remaining 20% have a severe multisystem disease. Lassa fever is also associated with occasional epidemics, during which the case-fatality rate can reach 50%.
Polio. Causes paralysis and nerve damage - easily preventable by an oral vaccination that should normally be given in early childhood. Although polio was nearly eradicated in recent years, it is currently experiencing a resurgence in several nations, so travelers should be sure that they have received proper vaccination and boosters.
SARS. Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome - Caused by a common Corona virus that apparently crossed species and was highly infectious. Only a problem if undiagnosed travelers travel and spread the disease. Its control is an example of how unidentified (new) diseases are able to be controlled by simple but burdensome public health measures.
Tuberculosis. A third world disease due to poverty and poor health care. Can occur in first world countries where the health care system makes treatment expensive - generally responds to antibiotics but mis/incomplete treatment in some countries means antibiotic resistant strains are also a problem.
Tropical diseases - Wikitravel


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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lol...the paper was written by a medical doctor and published in the Journal of American medicine association
JAMA for the latest peer-reviewed information on a broad range of issues relating to the skin and its conditions&#8212;clinical studies, surgical ...


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

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duh! ass always you miss the point.


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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so you are suggesting vaccines for malaria and yellow fever...lol


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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you have no point..you made it but you were wrong


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

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if I had no point how could it be wrong?
another fine display of eot's ignorance.


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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flail on...


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

eots said:


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another classic dodge!
you ask what tropical diseases a healthy immune system couldn't handle ...
there's your answer...


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

eots said:


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Another fine display of eot's ignorance


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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No..I said what strange tropical diseases* are you concerned *about that a healthy immune system could not handle and *one should be vaccinated fo*r?


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

eots said:


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and I posted a range of them...oh ye of the constantly squeezed scrotum.


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 31, 2013)

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If my memory serves the Army gives a Yellow fever vaccine to troops on the fairst alert teams at Ft Bragg....It's the one that burns like hell going in.....


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## SFC Ollie (Jul 31, 2013)

And malaria....We called that one GG....Has the consistency of Peanut butter....


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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and you are suggesting americans need to be vaccinated from them to protect us from foreigners ?


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)




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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)




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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

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i'm not suggesting anything everyone needs to be vaccinated.


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

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for what  ?...how many vaccinations ?


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

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asked and answered


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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so the entire list of tropical dieases ...because thats the only answer you gave


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

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golly false assumption man.
the human immune system can only fight diseases it been exposed to and developed antibodies for,  if the exposed human survives.  
now do you get it!?


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## eots (Jul 31, 2013)

daws101 said:


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Well  more accurately the human immune system fights diseases it been exposed to by developing antibodies


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## daws101 (Jul 31, 2013)

eots said:


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that's what i said.
your's is no more accurate lol!


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## WilliamWatts (Aug 1, 2013)

Thanks for the information


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

*About 90 percent of Vermont children have been vaccinated,* Kelso said, but the immunization rate for adults is much lower, probably in the neighborhood of 10 percent. And adults are believed to be primarily responsible for spreading the disease, largely via coughing and sneezing.

Free clinics to administer the vaccine to adults will be open at regional health department offices Wednesday, Chen said. The adult booster, called Tdap, has only been available in Vermont since 2006, so most people probably have not received it. Tdap also immunizes against tetanus and diphtheria.

Neither TDap nor the child version of the vaccine, DTaP, is foolproof. *A majority of the 522 cases are in vaccinated children*

Whooping cough epidemic declared in Vermont


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## Montrovant (Aug 1, 2013)

eots said:


> *About 90 percent of Vermont children have been vaccinated,* Kelso said, but the immunization rate for adults is much lower, probably in the neighborhood of 10 percent. And adults are believed to be primarily responsible for spreading the disease, largely via coughing and sneezing.
> 
> Free clinics to administer the vaccine to adults will be open at regional health department offices Wednesday, Chen said. The adult booster, called Tdap, has only been available in Vermont since 2006, so most people probably have not received it. Tdap also immunizes against tetanus and diphtheria.
> 
> ...



Of course, the story is a bit different than your small quote would make it sound.  Let's look at an expanded quote from the article, shall we?

"Neither TDap nor the child version of the vaccine, DTaP, is foolproof. A majority of the 522 cases are in vaccinated children, Kelso said, adding that the effectiveness fades as years pass. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention website, DTaP vaccines are 80 percent to 90 percent effective, and "about seven of 10 kids are fully protected five years after getting their last dose." Children typically receive five doses of DTaP between the age of 2 months and 6 years.

The highest incidence in Vermont is in the 10-to-14-year-old age group, Kelso said.

As for the adult vaccine, the CDC website states: "Our current estimate is that Tdap vaccination protects 7 of 10 people who receive it."

Vaccinated people who come down with the disease tend have less severe cases, Kelso said."


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## SFC Ollie (Aug 1, 2013)

Montrovant said:


> eots said:
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> > *About 90 percent of Vermont children have been vaccinated,* Kelso said, but the immunization rate for adults is much lower, probably in the neighborhood of 10 percent. And adults are believed to be primarily responsible for spreading the disease, largely via coughing and sneezing.
> ...



Oh shit, it works............


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


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grasping for straws "majority of the 522 cases are in vaccinated children'


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3X4QiLIpERs]Great Kelso Moments - YouTube[/ame]


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## Montrovant (Aug 1, 2013)

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Did you not see that the most incidences were in the 10-14 year old range?  That apparently means the full effects of the vaccine may have lessened or even worn off if it was administered in early childhood.

It sounds like the issue is not whether the vaccine works, but how effective it is for how long.

You seem to be implying that this specific vaccination, and vaccinations in general, are ineffective.


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## SteadyMercury (Aug 1, 2013)

eots said:


> Neither TDap nor the child version of the vaccine, DTaP, is foolproof. *A majority of the 522 cases are in vaccinated children*





Montrovant said:


> Neither TDap nor the child version of the vaccine, DTaP, is foolproof. A majority of the 522 cases are in vaccinated children, Kelso said, adding that the effectiveness fades as years pass. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention website, DTaP vaccines are 80 percent to 90 percent effective, and "about seven of 10 kids are fully protected five years after getting their last dose." Children typically receive five doses of DTaP between the age of 2 months and 6 years.
> 
> The highest incidence in Vermont is in the 10-to-14-year-old age group, Kelso said.
> 
> ...



Hah thats pretty funny, busted him attempting the misleading partial quote technique. 

Eots has no shame, as many times as he's been made to look like a complete ass in this thread he just keeps popping back up asking for more.


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

SteadyMercury said:


> eots said:
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> > Neither TDap nor the child version of the vaccine, DTaP, is foolproof. *A majority of the 522 cases are in vaccinated children*
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iI posted it it with the link and the only thing misleading is someone called Kelso.. there is nothing offered to support any of his speculations and they certainly can not be considered as facts


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

Montrovant said:


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there is no question that some vaccines are ineffective or dangerouse but still heavily marketed


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udTmlhQaIeg]Merck - cancer viruses in vaccines - YouTube[/ame]


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## Montrovant (Aug 1, 2013)

eots said:


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That much sounds quite possible.  The question of which ones are ineffective or dangerous is important, however, and your posts seem to imply that they ALL are.


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

Montrovant said:


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 "Dr Maurice Hilleman: and I think that vaccines have to be considered the bargain basement technology for the 20th century."


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

A: Why? To give the illusion that these vaccines are useful. If a vaccine suppresses visible symptoms of a disease like measles, everyone assumes that the vaccine is a success. But, under the surface, the vaccine can harm the immune system itself. And if it causes other diseases -- say, meningitis -- that fact is masked, because no one believes that the vaccine can do that. The connection is overlooked.

Q: It is said that the smallpox vaccine wiped out smallpox in England.

A: Yes. But when you study the available statistics, you get another picture.

Q: Which is?

A: There were cities in England where people who were not vaccinated did not get smallpox. There were places where people who were vaccinated experienced smallpox epidemics. And smallpox was already on the decline before the vaccine was introduced.

The Alternative-Doctor - Sixteen Reasons to Question Vaccinations


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## eots (Aug 1, 2013)

caveat emptor....


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## eots (Aug 2, 2013)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3IMSUApeW4]Shocking Testimony About Vaccines ! - YouTube[/ame]


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