# Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy?



## Howey (Aug 10, 2014)

At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?


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## Peach (Aug 10, 2014)

No question of murder, manslaughter is being investigated.


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## Howey (Aug 10, 2014)

I certainly hope that he goes away for a long time.


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## hjmick (Aug 10, 2014)

From all that I have read, it was nothing but a tragic accident. Granted, I am not terribly familiar with NASCAR and its satellite entities, but I can read. I would also question the judgment of any driver who climbs from his or her car onto the track in order to confront another driver still racing.




Do not misinterpret my last sentence. I am in no way blaming Ward for what happened.


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## Dont Taz Me Bro (Aug 10, 2014)

Natural selection

Video: Tony Stewart Runs Over Driver During Confrontation, Killing Him


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## Sunni Man (Aug 10, 2014)

Howey said:


> I certainly hope that he goes away for a long time.


Why?......because you have a crush on him and hoping they will put him in the same cell with you??    ...     

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## Papageorgio (Aug 10, 2014)

Peach said:


> No question of murder, manslaughter is being investigated.



Really? You got all that from the video?

We don't know intent, we don't know much at all at this point. There is an investigation, we have not heard the results. All I am hearing are people opinions and they don't mean a lot.


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## UllysesS.Archer (Aug 10, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



First of all, this was not a Nascar race. This was a sprint car race, not to be confused with the Sprint car series. 

These cars are very hard to see out of, especially on your sides, you have a very small opening to see out of. 

I have been watching racing all my life, we have the fastest dirt track in the world here in Bulls Gap, and things are different on dirt, when you add the fact that those sprint cars are very hard to drive when going slower, it was a very dangerous combination.

The kid never should have gotten out of his car, and Stewart never should have gotten that close to the kid, but the kid was walking down the track. 

I don't know where this is going to end up, but Stewart is going to have to live with it, for the rest of his life, and for a man with any kind of morals, that can be a very hard thing to accept.


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## Howey (Aug 10, 2014)

Dont Taz Me Bro said:


> Natural selection
> 
> Video: Tony Stewart Runs Over Driver During Confrontation, Killing Him



ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww that dude's splattered all over NY.


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## Howey (Aug 10, 2014)

Look...i don't know if he intentionally did or not but around here the guy is infamous for his temper, fighting and run ins with the law. He's your typical redneck schmuck.

Most of all waiters and waitresses around here hate him because he's a shitty tipper...ever watch "Waiting"? All that and more has ended up on his meals.


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## JimH52 (Aug 10, 2014)

So did anyone actually watch the videos of the incident?  Obviously not....Stewart was driving at yellow flag speed and did not maneuver to hit the man.  In the past few year Stewart's temper has subsided.

Your subjective reasoning and prejudice conjecture does not warrant anything, other than a tragic accident at the track.  If your unsubstantiated assertions persist, please be prepared to defend yourself with facts.  Otherwise, I strongly urge you to wait for all the facts to come out before making "what if" summations.


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## Papageorgio (Aug 10, 2014)

JimH52 said:


> So did anyone actually watch the videos of the incident?  Obviously not....Stewart was driving at yellow flag speed and did not maneuver to hit the man.  In the past few year Stewart's temper has subsided.
> 
> Your subjective reasoning and prejudice conjecture does not warrant anything, other than a tragic accident at the track.  If your unsubstantiated assertions persist, please be prepared to defend yourself with facts.  Otherwise, I strongly urge you to wait for all the facts to come out before making "what if" summations.



I watched it, however the police have many more videos available, so they can make the determination.


Sent from my iPad using an Android.


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## Gracie (Aug 10, 2014)

Manslaughter


> The unjustifiable, inexcusable, and intentional killing of a human being without deliberation, premeditation, and malice. The unlawful killing of a human being without any deliberation, which may be involuntary, in the commission of a lawful act without due caution and circumspection.
> 
> Manslaughter is a distinct crime and is not considered a lesser degree of murder. The essential distinction between the two offenses is that malice aforethought must be present for murder, whereas it must be absent for manslaughter. Manslaughter is not as serious a crime as murder. On the other hand, it is not a justifiable or excusable killing for which little or no punishment is imposed.


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## Gracie (Aug 10, 2014)

Watch the vid again. Stewarts car seemed to rev engine...then skid. Personally, I think he was trying to bump him or scare him and didn't plan on killing him. Then again, I could be wrong. 

But do LISTEN to the vid. That engine is revving up just before it skitters into the guy.

With that said..the guy is an idiot for walking into oncoming racers.


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## Papageorgio (Aug 10, 2014)

Gracie said:


> Watch the vid again. Stewarts car seemed to rev engine...then skid. Personally, I think he was trying to bump him or scare him and didn't plan on killing him. Then again, I could be wrong.
> 
> But do LISTEN to the vid. That engine is revving up just before it skitters into the guy.
> 
> With that said..the guy is an idiot for walking into oncoming racers.



Is that his car or another one of a dozen cars that revved its engine?


Sent from my iPad using an Android.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 10, 2014)

Unless Tony Stewart *planned* on running that guy over *BEFORE* the race started, *and* there's proof, it's manslaughter or possibly just negligence.

Either way I think the Track has *some kind* of Insurance against such thing happening and the Drivers sign *some sort* of Waiver before they race.


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## Gracie (Aug 10, 2014)

Could be another car. I dunno.


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## Carlsen (Aug 10, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



It look like a accident because Kevin Ward he get hit with the back of Stewart car.  Stewart he is driving in yellow flag speed when Ward he walk out from his car to middle of track.

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## Big Black Dog (Aug 10, 2014)

Guess nobody wants to wait for the results of the official inquiry to come out before jumping to all sorts of wild opinions.  I'm holding my judgement until then but one thing is for certain.  If the kid would have stayed in his car after the accident, he would still be alive today.  At this point, the rest is just pure speculation.


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## Papageorgio (Aug 10, 2014)

Big Black Dog said:


> Guess nobody wants to wait for the results of the official inquiry to come out before jumping to all sorts of wild opinions.  I'm holding my judgement until then but one thing is for certain.  If the kid would have stayed in his car after the accident, he would still be alive today.  At this point, the rest is just pure speculation.



I'm holding my opinion until we get final results of the investigation.

I never have liked Stewart, but I will hold judgement.


Sent from my iPad using an Android.


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## BobPlumb (Aug 10, 2014)

Big Black Dog said:


> Guess nobody wants to wait for the results of the official inquiry to come out before jumping to all sorts of wild opinions.  I'm holding my judgement until then but one thing is for certain.  If the kid would have stayed in his car after the accident, he would still be alive today.  At this point, the rest is just pure speculation.



And speculate is one of the many things we do on a message board.

I speculate that nothing will stick on TS concerning this incident.  When someone runs out on a racetrack like that he's sending the grim reaper an invitation for a visit.


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## Mr. H. (Aug 10, 2014)

Tony Stewart is a sports professional, and a well-paid one at that. With a host of sponsors. 

To suggest otherwise is an affront to the spectacle of sports itself. 

Howey is a bitch for starting this thread in the first place. 

Ergo, he earns today's bitch-slap.


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## BobPlumb (Aug 10, 2014)

Mr. H. said:


> Tony Stewart is a sports professional, and a well-paid one at that. With a host of sponsors.
> 
> To suggest otherwise is an affront to the spectacle of sports itself.
> 
> ...



I think Howey enjoys that.


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## Mr. H. (Aug 10, 2014)

BobPlumb said:


> Mr. H. said:
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> > Tony Stewart is a sports professional, and a well-paid one at that. With a host of sponsors.
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Git some 

Plenty to go around.


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## UllysesS.Archer (Aug 11, 2014)

BobPlumb said:


> Mr. H. said:
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> > Tony Stewart is a sports professional, and a well-paid one at that. With a host of sponsors.
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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

Papageorgio said:


> Big Black Dog said:
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> > Guess nobody wants to wait for the results of the official inquiry to come out before jumping to all sorts of wild opinions.  I'm holding my judgement until then but one thing is for certain.  If the kid would have stayed in his car after the accident, he would still be alive today.  At this point, the rest is just pure speculation.
> ...



Sounds like a job for Issa and his crackpot team of investigators.


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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

He can make Lois Lerner testify.


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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

And Clinton.


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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

Obama lied, Ward died.


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## Two Thumbs (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?


run someone over on national TV?

That's so crazy


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## TheGreatGatsby (Aug 11, 2014)

1. Stewart had hit a race driver out of his car before.
2. Stewart was the guy who caused the crash.
3. Other racers went around the guy, yet somehow Stewart does not.
4. The engine revs and Stewart's back wheel hits him as he fishtails.

Don't know if there's enough evidence. But I don't believe this was an accident.


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## strollingbones (Aug 11, 2014)

UllysesS.Archer said:


> Howey said:
> 
> 
> > At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?
> ...



all valid points....but you miss one......tony loves the dirt track...and he knows how to drive on it....an intentional fishtail he knew where the rear of his car would go....upwards...now he may not have known ward was there but he knew that wards car was there.....

and ward should not have gotten out of the car ...but is that really a reason to kill a man?  more likely stewart flashed his temper and thought about just bumping him ......but who knows what evil lurks in the heart of men...and remember tony was more than willing to race on sunday.....a moral man?  hmmmm i dont think if i just killed someone accidentally i would be engaging in that behavior quite that soon


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## strollingbones (Aug 11, 2014)

you have a veteran driver and a hot headed young driver.....someone should have been more mature and you are right gg everyone else went around him....they could see him....


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## JimH52 (Aug 11, 2014)

Gracie said:


> Watch the vid again. Stewarts car seemed to rev engine...then skid. Personally, I think he was trying to bump him or scare him and didn't plan on killing him. Then again, I could be wrong.
> 
> But do LISTEN to the vid. That engine is revving up just before it skitters into the guy.
> 
> With that said..the guy is an idiot for walking into oncoming racers.



You are delusional.  Stewart had slowed   It was an accident.


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## TruthSeeker56 (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



Your thought processes are DISTURBING.

You have a lot of maturing to do when it comes to logic and conclusions.

Maybe when you graduate from high school, the light bulb will slowly go on.


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## rightwinger (Aug 11, 2014)

I think it could be manslaughter

They were under caution driving around 35 miles an hour. I think Stewart saw him out on the track and tried to teach him a lesson by spraying him with dirt from his back tires. The car got away from him and he hit him

That said. I don't think Stewart will ever be convicted given the reckless role the other driver played in his own death and Stewart having access to a high powered law team


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## Marianne (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



No the dumbass walked in front of moving race cars. It's the same as if he'd walked into traffic on a major interstate. The last thing any of those drivers were expecting to see if some idiot having a temper tantrum in the middle of the track. They are going fast enough that they can't stop on a dime and swerving may not be possible. What did you expect him to do? Stewart may be a jerk, but that doesn't make him a murderer.


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## Desperado (Aug 11, 2014)

Nothing but an accident.  
The driver that was killed should never have been out on the track even when the cars were running under the caution.  Now about the track itself, it was dark compared to a NASCAR track with lighting for the tv cameras, and most importantly it was a dirt track!!!!  Not the best traction for man or car.
Maybe the driver tried to get out of the way but slipped while doing so.  We may never know but that is a distinct possibility.


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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

TruthSeeker56 said:


> Howey said:
> 
> 
> > At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?
> ...



lol...you don't know me at all do you?

Given Stewart's anger issues (you do agree he has anger issues, right?) and previous run in's both with the law and other drivers, it's perfectly natural to assume the worst in this case.


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## ogibillm (Aug 11, 2014)

Mad Scientist said:


> Unless Tony Stewart *planned* on running that guy over *BEFORE* the race started, *and* there's proof, it's manslaughter or possibly just negligence.
> 
> Either way I think the Track has *some kind* of Insurance against such thing happening and the Drivers sign *some sort* of Waiver before they race.



you can't waive away criminal prosecution.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> I think it could be manslaughter
> 
> They were under caution driving around 35 miles an hour. I think Stewart saw him out on the track and tried to teach him a lesson by spraying him with dirt from his back tires. The car got away from him and he hit him
> 
> That said. I don't think Stewart will ever be convicted given the reckless role the other driver played in his own death and Stewart having access to a high powered law team



I agree with this assessment and hope Stewart is banned from racing.


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## martybegan (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> Look...i don't know if he intentionally did or not but around here the guy is infamous for his temper, fighting and run ins with the law. He's your *typical redneck schmuck.*
> 
> Most of all waiters and waitresses around here hate him because he's a shitty tipper...ever watch "Waiting"? All that and more has ended up on his meals.



Bigot.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

Desperado said:


> Nothing but an accident.
> *The driver that was killed should never have been out on the track even when the cars were running under the caution. * Now about the track itself, it was dark compared to a NASCAR track with lighting for the tv cameras, and most importantly it was a dirt track!!!!  Not the best traction for man or car.
> Maybe the driver tried to get out of the way but slipped while doing so.  We may never know but that is a distinct possibility.



The driver, Ward, had just been clipped into banging into a wall. Who knows if his head got bumped or not and addled his thinking.

Jeesh. Way to blame the victim.


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## Desperado (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


> Desperado said:
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> > Nothing but an accident.
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Really????   Sorry but when you walk onto a dirt track with race cars still moving you are taking your life into your own hands.  You don't have to be Einstein to figure that out.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

Desperado said:


> Ravi said:
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No, you don't. But you also don't need to be Einstein to figure out that someone just involved in an accident won't be thinking clearly.


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## chikenwing (Aug 11, 2014)

No charges will be filed,local police investigation reports tragic accident.

Sorry no pound of flesh for the hateful.


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## Papageorgio (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> TruthSeeker56 said:
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His anger issues have been met with anger management classes and his temper has cooled over the years.

You can ASSume what you want, I'd rather wait for the facts.


Sent from my iPad using an Android.


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## BobPlumb (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


> Desperado said:
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You are right that he may not have been thinking clearly.  That doesn't negate his responsibility not to walk out into traffic.  This should be and most likely is part of their training about what not to do when involved in a wreck.  When it's the victim at fault, that's who gets the blame.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

BobPlumb said:


> Ravi said:
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So.

Dude gets clipped, car spins around and flips or hits wall.
Dude gets his head banged and can't think rationally.
Gets out of car.
Gets killed.

And this is his fault?


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## rightwinger (Aug 11, 2014)

BobPlumb said:


> Ravi said:
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As reckless as the victim was, Stewart still has an obligation to try to avoid him. Especially under caution

Stewart appears to be hot dogging trying to spray the other driver in dirt to rub it in. He guns it just as he is passing by. If so, he is also negligent


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## Desperado (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


> BobPlumb said:
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Pure speculation on your part to say he got his head banged and could not think straight.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

Desperado said:


> Ravi said:
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Absolutely. But you just jumped in and blamed the victim. Which is why I speculated that he might have not been thinking clearly due to the original accident.


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## Desperado (Aug 11, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> BobPlumb said:
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Im pretty sure I watched the same film you did and I saw Tony turn left to avoid the driver.
That is about the only thing you can actually see from the video.


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## DriftingSand (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



I happen to agree that Stewart is a very angry dude and I think he could have avoided hitting the other driver.  However, the other driver shouldn't have been on the track.  Stewart *may *be guilty of committing a crime if more evidence surfaces.


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## rightwinger (Aug 11, 2014)

Desperado said:


> rightwinger said:
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He guns and jerks left spinning his rear end to the right. Odd thing to do as you are passing a pedestrian. It was the rear end of his car that hit Ward


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## Desperado (Aug 11, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> Desperado said:
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Ever drive a Sprint car on dirt?  



rightwinger said:


> It was the rear end of his car that hit Ward



 No Kidding, Now you can also say that the hit driver did not loose his balance on the dirt track and fall into the tire?  You don't know because the video does not show that either.


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## JimH52 (Aug 11, 2014)

ogibillm said:


> Mad Scientist said:
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> 
> > Unless Tony Stewart *planned* on running that guy over *BEFORE* the race started, *and* there's proof, it's manslaughter or possibly just negligence.
> ...



You can when there are no facts to support any kind of charges.  There is *NO EVIDENCE* that TS intentionally went after the kid.  I have watched several videos and there is no evidence to support any changes.   The sheriff has already said that Stewart was driving the yellow flag limit.

The kid should have never gotten out of his car until track personnel got to the wreck.  Sorry for him and his family, but it is hard way to learn a simple lesson.


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## rightwinger (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


> BobPlumb said:
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Dude got sent into the wall
Dude got pissed
Dude ran out on the track to get revenge
Dude ended up dead


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## Rocko (Aug 11, 2014)

I don't know squat about NASCAR or Toney Stewart so I'm not the best person to comment on this issue. Having said that, walking on the track by the guy who died was beyond stupid.


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## JimH52 (Aug 11, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> Ravi said:
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Anger is a NASCAR reliable emotion.  The kid knew exactly what he was doing when he ran onto the track.  He was mad, just like many other drivers who have done the same thing before.  But the way he walked right into the cars was something I am not sure I have ever seen in all the NASCAR races I have watched over the years.

I am sorry for him.  I am sorry for his family.  I am sorry for Tony and his family also, but this young man should never had gotten out of the car, and certainly should not have began walking across the track.  It was a fatal mistake.


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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

What a friendly looking guy! (if you're a child molester/wife beater/serial killer!)


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## Papageorgio (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> What a friendly looking guy! (if you're a child molester/wife beater/serial killer!)



What a shallow way to look at people.


Sent from my iPad using an Android.


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## Quantum Windbag (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



It would be more natural to assume that you are an idiot.

NASCAR's Tony Stewart hits, kills driver Kevin Ward Jr. - CNN.com


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## JakeStarkey (Aug 11, 2014)

Apparently not.

Need a new rule for all of racing: if you get out of your car, you lose the race, and if you endanger anyone, drivers or public, you lose your car.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

JimH52 said:


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I was in my car today and I didn't rev up my engine around pedestrians. In fact, the idea would never enter my mind.


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## Jarlaxle (Aug 11, 2014)

hjmick said:


> From all that I have read, it was nothing but a tragic accident. Granted, I am not terribly familiar with NASCAR and its satellite entities, but I can read. I would also question the judgment of any driver who climbs from his or her car onto the track in order to confront another driver still racing.
> 
> Do not misinterpret my last sentence. I am in no way blaming Ward for what happened.



I am!  The idiot should NOT have been on the damn track!  Death by idiocy, plain and simple!


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## JakeStarkey (Aug 11, 2014)

Ward was at fault.  A death is a tragedy, even more so when it did not have to happen.


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## chikenwing (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


> JimH52 said:
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And you on a RACE track??  Has anything entered your mind??


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## Jarlaxle (Aug 11, 2014)

Gracie said:


> Watch the vid again. Stewarts car seemed to rev engine...then skid. Personally, I think he was trying to bump him or scare him and didn't plan on killing him. Then again, I could be wrong.
> 
> But do LISTEN to the vid. That engine is revving up just before it skitters into the guy.
> 
> With that said..the guy is an idiot for walking into oncoming racers.



Important note on Outlaw sprint cars: you steer them with the throttle.  Seriously: they are steered maybe 75-80% with power and braking, and 20-25% with the steering wheel!  They are twitchy, unstable, very top-heavy, and very hard to control at lower speeds...the tires pack up with mud & don't grip, the steering becomes very heavy, and the engines (high-string methanol-burners) are designed to run flat-out, and tend load up and misfire.  Under caution, you will see/hear ALL the racers revving their engines.  They do this to fling dirt off the rear tires, and to clear out the engines.

Another critical note: a WoO car can't turn right.  Just doesn't work.  Also, hitting the brakes makes the back of the car swing right.  Remember how I said they steer with power & braking?  One way they do so is that there is no right front brake!  Had Stewart nailed the brakes to avoid the idiot on the track, he would have spun right into him (and quite possibly rolled the car onto him).

Watch the video again: the car before Stewart's (bright-blue #45) JUST missed Ward.

A final note: it was a night race, the cars have no headlights, Stewart's helmet visor was moire than likely very dirty (WoO drivers pretty much wear the track!)...and Ward was wearing head to toe BLACK!


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

chikenwing said:


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What difference does that make. It appears that Stewart acted like a vindictive child.


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## ChrisL (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



I don't think that just because someone has a short fuse and had an altercation indicates that he is guilty of murder.  That is a rather premature assumption considering there is absolutely NO evidence to indicate that at all.  Citizens in the United States are entitled to a trial before you convict them.  Anger issues does not equal murderer.


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## Jarlaxle (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


> Desperado said:
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First rule of racing *Unless it is on fire, you DO NOT GET OUT OF THE CAR UNTIL CRASH CREWS ARRIVE!*


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## Jarlaxle (Aug 11, 2014)

rightwinger said:


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You don't even know that you don't know anything about how a WoO car handles.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

Jarlaxle said:


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Cool. You get in a crash and we will see how rational you are.


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## Ravi (Aug 11, 2014)

Jarlaxle said:


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I guess Stewart doesn't either


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## ChrisL (Aug 11, 2014)

Jarlaxle said:


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I don't know much about racing, but I've heard that saying, and I've also heard that the drivers ignore it much of the time.


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## ChrisL (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> What a friendly looking guy! (if you're a child molester/wife beater/serial killer!)



Convicting the man in the court of public opinion before he's even been charged with a crime.  Hmmm.  Interesting to say the least.


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## chikenwing (Aug 11, 2014)

Ravi said:


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You should just back out know your lost,its racing everyone crashes at one time or another often those are the rules unless your you then you would get out and walk across an active race track at night in all black.Then wonder ass your dumb ass is run over.


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## Howey (Aug 11, 2014)

ChrisL said:


> Howey said:
> 
> 
> > What a friendly looking guy! (if you're a child molester/wife beater/serial killer!)
> ...



Like Lois Lerner?


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## Tuatara (Aug 11, 2014)

Jarlaxle said:


> First rule of racing *Unless it is on fire, you DO NOT GET OUT OF THE CAR UNTIL CRASH CREWS ARRIVE!*


That will probably become mandatory now.


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## ChrisL (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> > Howey said:
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Oh, so now you're going to bring politics into it?  Nice.  I suppose you think you're pretty clever.


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## UllysesS.Archer (Aug 11, 2014)

*I AM GOING TO PULL A GIS(LOVE YOU GIS) AND WRITE THIS IN ALL CAPS AND BOLD LETTERS SO EVERYONE CAN READ THIS.

THIS IS NOT NASCAR RELATED. THIS WAS A SPRINT CAR, ON A DIRT TRACK. THIS WAS A RACING RELATED INCIDENT, ALL RACING IS NOT NASCAR(AS MUCH AS I WISH IT WAS).*

Now back to your regularly scheduled argument.


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## UllysesS.Archer (Aug 11, 2014)

Howey said:


> What a friendly looking guy! (if you're a child molester/wife beater/serial killer!)



First of all, enjoy your vacation Howey.

Secondly, we all know you dream about Tony, you ain't foolin anybody there, too bad he don't reciprocate that affection, huh?

Lastly, child molester? wife beater? serial killer? Well, enjoy your vacation Howey.


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## dblack (Aug 11, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> Desperado said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
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I'm not really interested in making excuses for Stewart. I saw it about like you did. But it's worth noting that these cars are idling at 35/mph, and the slightest tap of the accelerator pedal will cause the kind of rev we hear in the video. Even for a professional driver, the rev could have been a reflex twitch, a result of looking up and seeing someone standing right in front of him as he came around the turn.


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## ChrisL (Aug 11, 2014)

UllysesS.Archer said:


> *I AM GOING TO PULL A GIS(LOVE YOU GIS) AND WRITE THIS IN ALL CAPS AND BOLD LETTERS SO EVERYONE CAN READ THIS.
> 
> THIS IS NOT NASCAR RELATED. THIS WAS A SPRINT CAR, ON A DIRT TRACK. THIS WAS A RACING RELATED INCIDENT, ALL RACING IS NOT NASCAR(AS MUCH AS I WISH IT WAS).*
> 
> Now back to your regularly scheduled argument.



I didn't realize that.  Thanks for the info.  So is it still against the rules to get out the car, or are there different rules depending on the venue?


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## UllysesS.Archer (Aug 12, 2014)

ChrisL said:


> UllysesS.Archer said:
> 
> 
> > *I AM GOING TO PULL A GIS(LOVE YOU GIS) AND WRITE THIS IN ALL CAPS AND BOLD LETTERS SO EVERYONE CAN READ THIS.
> ...



In all the racing series, that I know of, which include all of Nascar, Arca, Sprint cars, and  my local dirt tracks, there is no rule for getting out of your car after an accident, or when your car has broken down on the track.

An incident like this was going to happen sooner or later, due to the fact, that there are hundreds of races every week of summer, all over the USA. Just look at the number of times we have seen race car drivers from Nascar, get out of their car and throw a helmet, or throw their arms up, when they feel another driver has wrecked them, now multiply that by 100 a week(minimum).

This incident would get no press at all, if not for the fact that the driver who was behind the wheel, is a 3 time Nascar Cup series champion.

One more thing. There will NEVER be a rule against getting out of the car. The rules that need changing are the fines and suspensions imposed for getting out of the car and acting like an idiot on the track.


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## rightwinger (Aug 12, 2014)

ChrisL said:


> Jarlaxle said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
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Drivers love the drama of popping out of a car unhurt after a bad accident


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## dblack (Aug 12, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> ChrisL said:
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> 
> > Jarlaxle said:
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So do the fans. And, lately, they've been loving the drama of the on track confrontations. With this incident, I expect that trend to change radically.


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## ChrisL (Aug 12, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> > Jarlaxle said:
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Well, yeah, I've seen that on television on the rare times I've actually watched racing!  Obviously they get really heated.  They were showing clips this morning on the news of drivers jumping out their cars, throwing their helmets at other cars and drivers.  I can understand that they get upset, but to step in front of a moving vehicle to confront it is rather silly.  Regardless, a terrible tragedy.  I really don't think the other driver meant to run him over and kill him though.


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## Quantum Windbag (Aug 12, 2014)

dblack said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > ChrisL said:
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One can hope.


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## ChrisL (Aug 12, 2014)

dblack said:


> rightwinger said:
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> > ChrisL said:
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A lot of fans only watch to see accidents anyway,or so I've heard.  It's kind of morbid.


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## Papageorgio (Aug 12, 2014)

I don't think Stewart intentionally meant to hit him, but the best driver on that track was the only guy that hit him.


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## dblack (Aug 12, 2014)

ChrisL said:


> dblack said:
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> 
> > rightwinger said:
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Yep. That's why I've never had much interest in NASCAR. Sprint car racing actually involves a lot more finesse and interesting racing action. There's something to watch besides waiting for the next crash.


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## dblack (Aug 12, 2014)

Papageorgio said:


> I don't think Stewart intentionally meant to hit him, but the best driver on that track was the only guy that hit him.



Stewart is not the best when it comes to sprint cars. Google Pennsylvania Posse.


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## ChrisL (Aug 12, 2014)

dblack said:


> ChrisL said:
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> > dblack said:
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I don't watch regularly, but I like motocross racing because on the bikes, they at least do the jumps and stuff.  I think it's much more exciting than watching cars go around and around a track.


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## dblack (Aug 12, 2014)

ChrisL said:


> dblack said:
> 
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> > ChrisL said:
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That's funny. I grew up racing motocross. So did both my brothers. When we got older, they got into sprint cars - but for some odd reason I started programming computers.


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## ChrisL (Aug 12, 2014)

dblack said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
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That's definitely a different path!  Lol!


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## Papageorgio (Aug 13, 2014)

dblack said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> > I don't think Stewart intentionally meant to hit him, but the best driver on that track was the only guy that hit him.
> ...



Not the best, but he was the best and most experienced at that track that night. He has driven Sprint cars for years. He grew up on dirt tracks.

I think he may have thought he would play with the kid and throw some dirt at him, it matches his personality.


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## Politico (Aug 13, 2014)

*Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy?*

No.


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## Valerie (Aug 13, 2014)

> *Tony Stewart could still face criminal charges for running down Kevin Ward Jr. with his sprint car, even if the three-time NASCAR champion didn't mean to kill Ward, hurt him or even scare him.*
> 
> Ontario County Sheriff Philip Povero, who announced on Tuesday that the investigation is continuing, has said that his initial findings have turned up nothing that would indicate criminal intent in the crash at the Canandaigua Motorsports Park.
> 
> ...





reminds me of that time manifraud once bragged about purposely whipping a slap shot straight at a referee he was pissed at during a hockey game... the ref went down writhing in pain and that psycho with a hockey stick giddily bragged how it was the perfect pay-back since there was no way that anyone could ever prove his intent to do the ref harm...


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## Valerie (Aug 13, 2014)

Valerie said:


> > *Tony Stewart could still face criminal charges for running down Kevin Ward Jr. with his sprint car, even if the three-time NASCAR champion didn't mean to kill Ward, hurt him or even scare him.*
> >
> > Ontario County Sheriff Philip Povero, who announced on Tuesday that the investigation is continuing, has said that his initial findings have turned up nothing that would indicate criminal intent in the crash at the Canandaigua Motorsports Park.
> >
> ...







manifold said:


> I once drilled a hockey referee right in the shin with a slapshot, on purpose, because he was being a total asshole.  Of course I made it look unintentional.  He got a welt that swelled up the size of tennis ball and he had to leave the game.
> 
> Not my proudest moment for sure.  But the fucker was really asking for it.




oh my bad, the brag came with his typical weaselly disclaimer clause...


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## HUGGY (Aug 13, 2014)

*Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy? *

Obviously !!

A pedestrian always has the right of way.


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## chikenwing (Aug 13, 2014)

HUGGY said:


> *Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy? *
> 
> Obviously !!
> 
> A pedestrian always has the right of way.



There are no pedestrian on an active race track


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## HUGGY (Aug 13, 2014)

chikenwing said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > *Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy? *
> ...



I believe the NFL "one step under control" rule should apply.

Now if the individual had been thrown from the race car that would be an entirely different situation indeed.


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## chikenwing (Aug 13, 2014)

HUGGY said:


> chikenwing said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
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What?


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## Quantum Windbag (Aug 13, 2014)

HUGGY said:


> *Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy? *
> 
> Obviously !!
> 
> A pedestrian always has the right of way.



Really? So I can walk out in the middle of Le Mans and expect all the drivers to stop?


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## Quantum Windbag (Aug 13, 2014)

HUGGY said:


> chikenwing said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
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You are making up rules, and applying them to different sports. Do you think you are god?


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## Valerie (Aug 13, 2014)

he read it in your tag line.  "Thou art God"


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## Quantum Windbag (Aug 13, 2014)

Valerie said:


> he read it in your tag line.  "Thou art God"



I guess he didn't get what it really means.


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## HUGGY (Aug 13, 2014)

Quantum Windbag said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > chikenwing said:
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Is there an opening?


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## rightwinger (Aug 13, 2014)

Quantum Windbag said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > *Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy? *
> ...



I don't expect them to go out of their way to hit you either


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## dblack (Aug 13, 2014)

Quantum Windbag said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > *Did Tony Stewart Murder That Guy? *
> ...



Under a caution flag, drivers are expected to slow down and look out for emergency personnel - and yes, be ready to stop if necessary.


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## Quantum Windbag (Aug 13, 2014)

dblack said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
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Stewart did stop, but I still wouldn't walk out on a track just because ether is a caution flag. Especially at night, when the cars don't have headlights, and I am dressed in dark colors. Fuck, I don't even walk out in the street out front at night without looking, and there is rarely traffic on it, and there is a streetlight right across the street.


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## dblack (Aug 13, 2014)

Quantum Windbag said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Yep. I don't think anyone is claiming Ward was blameless. The question is whether Stewart was being stupidly reckless as well. It kind of looked like it to me, but I wasn't there. 

I heard today there are other videos, from different angles that might give the investigators more to work with.


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## Charles_Main (Aug 14, 2014)

Howey said:


> At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?



No it would not be. Rational would be realizing that NO driver is expecting or looking for a person walking on the track. Rational Would be knowing how a Sprint car drives. Rational would be knowing what the view from inside of a sprint car looks like. 

Rational would be knowing all these things before speculating about murder. The only person responsible for Ward Dying is WARD. You do not get out of your car on the track unless the thing is burning. PERIOD. You certainly do not walk into the middle of the track because you are pissed at someone and want to make hand gestures at them. You do not expect the other drivers to watch out for you. They have no reason to.


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## dblack (Aug 14, 2014)

Charles_Main said:


> Howey said:
> 
> 
> > At first I thought it was just an accident but given the facts that they'd had an earlier altercation and the other driver was out of his car, "pointing" at Stewart; and considering Stewart's documented anger issues, wouldn't it be natural to assume Stewart intentionally ran the guy down?
> ...



That's not entirely true. The whole point of a caution flag is for drivers to slow down and look for just such an occurrence. Emergency crews rely on the drivers NOT running over them while they're trying to clear a wreck. Which in no way excuses the stupidity of Ward marching down the track, into traffic, basically throwing a fit.

While I agree - it's not rational to assume it was intentional - Stewart should have been more careful, and regardless of what statements he's made, I promise you he's thinking the same thing about now.


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## BobPlumb (Aug 14, 2014)

dblack said:


> Charles_Main said:
> 
> 
> > Howey said:
> ...



What specifically should Stewart have done to have been more careful?  This is not too hard to answer using hindsight.  However, it's much more difficult to do before shit like this happens.


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## Ravi (Aug 14, 2014)

BobPlumb said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Charles_Main said:
> ...


Not revved his engine when he was near Ward.


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## UllysesS.Archer (Aug 14, 2014)

Ravi said:


> BobPlumb said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...



You can't prove that he did. The audio could have been any of the other drivers in the field revving their engine. 

Your argument might then be, well, the car's rear end came around, and yes it did. But, anyone who has ever driven a rear wheel drive car or truck on dirt knows, that when you are doing around 40 mph and turn the wheel hard left, the rear end likes to kick out to the right.

Thus to me, the video that I have seen is inconclusive. It could be that Stewart saw Ward on the track at the last moment, turned hard left and the back end whipped out and caught him. 

The only person who knows for sure, what happened, is Tony Stewart.


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## rightwinger (Aug 14, 2014)

UllysesS.Archer said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > BobPlumb said:
> ...



And that is why Stewart will not be prosecuted. He will lawyer up, say the right things and never admit what he really did that night


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## dblack (Aug 14, 2014)

BobPlumb said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Charles_Main said:
> ...



Of course. My guess is Stewart knew that Ward was grandstanding and thought it would be cute to throw some dirt on him. He just didn't expect him to be standing in the middle of the track.

There was ample stupidity on both sides of this - even stupidity on the part of the racing community for passively encouraging this kind of behavior. Hopefully it will be a wake up call.


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## chikenwing (Aug 14, 2014)

And that is why Stewart will not be prosecuted. He will lawyer up, say the right things and never admit what he really did that night

Please do tell us what really happened that night,oh please!!!??


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## rightwinger (Aug 14, 2014)

chikenwing said:


> And that is why Stewart will not be prosecuted. He will lawyer up, say the right things and never admit what he really did that night
> 
> Please do tell us what really happened that night,oh please!!!??



OJ never told either


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## Ravi (Aug 14, 2014)

UllysesS.Archer said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > BobPlumb said:
> ...


Isn't the speed limit under the flag supposed to be 35 mph?


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## Desperado (Aug 14, 2014)

There is no set speed limit for the cars under the yellow... It all depends on the track.


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## dblack (Aug 14, 2014)

Ravi said:


> UllysesS.Archer said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



That's about the slowest speed sprint cars can go. They have direct drive transmissions, with no clutch and no starters. The driver can take the car out of gear, but that's a one way operation. Once in neutral, they coast to a stop and require a push-truck to start back up again. That's one reason you'll see sprint cars spinning their wheels at low speeds. Often, it's the only way to keep the car running, as letting the rpms drop any lower would kill the motor.

It's plausible that Stewart saw Ward, hit the brakes, and then tapped the accelerator (instinctively) to keep the engine from dying.


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