# Elementary school shooting



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 14, 2012)

Shooting Reported at Newtown School | NBC Connecticut



> State police are responding to a report of a shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School, at 12 Dickenson Drive in Newtown.



An elementary school.
Inevitable?

Hope no one dies.


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## Mr. H. (Dec 14, 2012)

Shooters gonna shoot.


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## Katzndogz (Dec 14, 2012)

Early reports were two shooters.


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## bodecea (Dec 14, 2012)

Again, the price of freedom.   Just like car accidents, we are starting to expect these and move on after the initial "Awwwwww".


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

bodecea said:


> Again, the price of freedom.   Just like car accidents, we are starting to expect these and move on after the initial "Awwwwww".



It is the price we pay for our second amendment rights. America has long ago accepted that we are willing to accept these shootings so as not to impede the rights of citizens to be armed


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## Katzndogz (Dec 14, 2012)

Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.

Reports are now that the gunman is dead.  The pity is, gunmen get to keep shooting until the police show up and terminate the threat.   Lives would be saved and injuries prevented if someone with a gun acted earlier.  A principle, a teacher, an armed guard, someone, rather than stand around waiting to die until the police get there.

When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.


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## Mad Scientist (Dec 14, 2012)

How could this happen? I mean, Schools are gun free zones aren't they?


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## bodecea (Dec 14, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
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> Reports are now that the gunman is dead.  The pity is, gunmen get to keep shooting until the police show up and terminate the threat.   Lives would be saved and injuries prevented if someone with a gun acted earlier.  A principle, a teacher, an armed guard, someone, rather than stand around waiting to die until the police get there.
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> When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.



It's the price we pay.   Except for those directly involved, this is just another day.   OK?


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## Katzndogz (Dec 14, 2012)

It's the price we pay for the entitlement culture, yes.


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> It's the price we pay for the entitlement culture, yes.



You are entitled to shoot people?


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## The Infidel (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Katzndogz said:
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Nope... I'm entitled to protect myself.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Home schooling gets more appealing by the day.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

On a cheery note, Ravi has a hat!


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Was the shooter killed by their own hand or by police?

Had there been prior contact by police with the gunman?

Does a 30 day cooling off period with gun possession make sense, if you have been arrested?


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bodecea said:
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You two are AWESOME!... 



peace...


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

CBS News: At least 1 child dead in Newtown school shooting - WFSB 3 Connecticut

Damn... 



peace...


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

mal said:


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Just pragmatic

The US has 270 million guns in circulation, that genie is not going back in the bottle. The US has a gun culture that is not going to accept any gun regulations whether they save lives or not.

As citizens, we just have to accept the occaisional gun massacres as part of being an American


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

Arm the Teachers not hormone raging teens. Teachers can have a safe inside their desk to prevent any student from accessing their gun. We also have tazers & other less than lethal devices we could issue teachers. Teachers should be armed to protect the students & themselves.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

Multiple deaths reported in shooting at Conn. school

Multiple Children... 



peace...


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## RetiredGySgt (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Was the shooter killed by their own hand or by police?
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> Had there been prior contact by police with the gunman?
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> Does a 30 day cooling off period with gun possession make sense, if you have been arrested?



Actually if arrested for a felony they can confiscate your weapons and if convicted you lose the right to keep them.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


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As do Societies that have Gun Bans.

Blowing up that School would have been EASY and Killed more people.

Oh yeah... Fuck you. 



peace...


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## WillowTree (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Shooting Reported at Newtown School | NBC Connecticut
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Lots of people including children have died. The shooter came to Conneticut from New Jersey.5 children 4 adults dead.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> luddly.neddite said:
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My Daughter is in First Grade... This makes me Sick to my Stomach...

You may remember recently a little girl (Jessica) went missing in my town...

That was the next school over from my Daughter's and where my Wife Teaches.

It's really too bad this Fuckstain is Dead.



peace...


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## blastoff (Dec 14, 2012)

Drudge headline now says 27 dead!!!


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


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What?  You mean gun control laws already exist and people still get killed?  Go figure.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

WTOP BREAKING NEWS

CBS News quotes officials as saying *27 people are dead*, more than a dozen children, in Connecticut school shooting.

More: Official: Gunman killed in Conn. school shooting - WTOP.com

For more information visit WTOP.com or tune to 103.5 FM.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


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SHOVE your poltical crap up your ass you ghool


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## WillowTree (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> WTOP BREAKING NEWS
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> CBS News quotes officials as saying *27 people are dead*, more than a dozen children, in Connecticut school shooting.
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My god!


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

There is no god there is only man and we need to find a way to stop this hate filled world view that worships guns


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## WillowTree (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> There is no god there is only man and we need to find a way to stop this hate filled world view that worships guns



stfu


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> There is no god there is only man and we need to find a way to stop this hate filled world view that worships guns


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## blastoff (Dec 14, 2012)

Heard two different reports the shooter was the father of a student.


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> saveliberty said:
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You can also lose gun rights if a doctor or councilor says you are unstable or suicidal.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUv9pjxq5QI"]Lost Gun Rights[/ame]


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

guns dont solve every problem.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

WillowTree said:


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Evil does exist.  OMG.


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## blastoff (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


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PSA....We believe the idiot means ghoul.


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## TruthSeeker56 (Dec 14, 2012)

Wait a minute. This shooting in Connecticut must be a HOAX.

According to the "Brady Campaign To Prevent Gun Violence", Connecticut has the FIFTH toughest gun laws in the United States.

How come these two shooters didn't know that?  How come they broke the law?

Personal IRRESPONSIBILITY, perhaps?

Too bad a few teachers in that school weren't packing heat.


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

Too bad we didn't have some second graders packing heat


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Lots of specualtion on the news.  Some are saying the gunman lives in NJ and swat teams are outside his NJ residence.

From Reuters an entire kindergarten class is unaccounted for.

Ugh.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

blastoff said:


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He must have missed that day in schoul.


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## Mr. H. (Dec 14, 2012)

Sickening, heartbreaking, gut-wrenching. 

Fok.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Too bad we didn't have some second graders packing heat



Douchebag. 



peace...


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## WillowTree (Dec 14, 2012)

I'm wishing the mods would merge these threads. Also there is speculation that the shooter was the father of one of the students.


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## wavingrl (Dec 14, 2012)

I don't know if stricter gun laws would help. Personally, I don't understand why any private citizen would need assault weapons--much stricter laws for that sort of gun make sense to me. 

What goes through the mind of someone who is compelled to shoot random others--that would be worth knowing. 

Turning the clock back  100 years or so--if such incidents occurred I am not familiar with them. 

Possibly 18 kindergarteners killed.  There just are no words.


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## Mr. H. (Dec 14, 2012)

News just reported the shooter was a parent of a student.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

mal said:


> rightwinger said:
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You really are a Shit to swim in those Children's Blood for your Polticial Agenda...

26 dead... 18 are grade school children...

Save your Poltics for when the bodies are cold you Sorry Bastard!



peace...


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

Fire proof bullet-proof doors making class rooms into safe rooms & can be opened from inside but must be buzzed in from outside. Armed teachers with tazers. Everyone including parents should have passed background check prior to being allowed on school property. Armed security restricting admittance while 50 or more students are present.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

News is reporting that the school locks down daily and that visitors must be buzzed in after visual identification.


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> News is reporting that the school locks down daily and that visitors must be buzzed in after visual identification.



Going to need to background check & metal detect parents along with everyone coming in. If a parent failed the background check, to fucking bad. You can't visit your kids inside. Will send them out or talk over phone.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

18 kids dead. Okay, I am back in the gun control camp. This is just fucking out of hand.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

KissMy said:


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Is something wrong with your moral compass?


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## WillowTree (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> 18 kids dead. Okay, I am back in the gun control camp. This is just fucking out of hand.



If I thought gun control would work I'd be there with you but it won't guns are everywhere, there is no such thing as gun control.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> I'm wishing the mods would merge these threads. Also there is speculation that the shooter was the father of one of the students.



Mods are currently reviewing the naughty and nice list to see if your wish can be granted.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> Ravi said:
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Don't kid yourself, Ravi never left the gun control campfire.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> 18 kids dead. Okay, I am back in the gun control camp. This is just fucking out of hand.



_The worst mass school murder in American history took place on May 18,1927 in Bath Township, Mich., when a former school board member set off three bombs that killed 45 people._

Your Disgusting Politicizing of this ain't gonna stop Crazy...





peace...


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

The answer to a gun wielding monster is NOT a knife or baton.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

mal said:


> Ravi said:
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I substituted in that district back in the 80s.  Its a true story.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

These two would have used bombs if they didn't have guns...

Stop Fucking Politicizing this you Rotten Douchebags... It just Fucking happened.



peace...


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

I'm in favor of a law that makes it illegal to ever publish or transmit the name(s) of the shooters.  Let them die and stay in nothingness forever in an unmarked grave.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> Ravi said:
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I can't stand looking at the pictures of the frightened children.

There is something wrong with our country that we have this level of violence so commonly.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> I'm in favor of a law that makes it illegal to ever publish or transmit the name(s) of the shooters.  Let them die and stay in nothingness forever in an unmarked grave.



Scum like that don't deserve a grave. Throw them in the nearest forest and forget about them.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> 18 kids dead. Okay, I am back in the gun control camp. This is just fucking out of hand.




26 total dead... 18 are kids.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Its frustration and more so division Ravi.  Since division takes at least two sides, there are fingers to point in at least two directions.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

It is time to have a serious discussion.


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## RetiredGySgt (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Remind us how the press reports nationally the  murders that occur daily in Chicago? I wonder why that is? As for common, mass shootings are NOT common. And taking away the rights of law abiding citizens won't stop them.


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


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Unstable parents should not be allowed endanger others. Anyone with access must pass background check. I think cameras in the classroom is a good idea. Parents can watch their children & teacher on-line or in a remote building. Bullies & problem children can be easily identified. Parents & principals in a remote building can discuss what is going on in the classroom they are viewing from a TV monitor while the class is in session instead of heated arguments in front of children.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


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Most people don't really care about gang bangers killing each other off. Mass shootings are becoming increasingly common. This shit doesn't happen in other countries to the extent that it happens here. 

Something needs to be done and our lax gun control laws do not seem to be working.


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## The Infidel (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> It is time to have a serious discussion.



Will this discussion include violent video games and movies?


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

KissMy said:


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Make schools more like prisons? 

Like I said before, homeschool is getting more attractive by the day.


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## Valerie (Dec 14, 2012)

Ugh I just heard about this and am sick to my stomach.. JFC


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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So we need more gun control laws that don't work.


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## WillowTree (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


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An excellent question.


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## liarintheWH (Dec 14, 2012)

This is terrible. Reports say shooter killed his mother before going to the school.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


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And the violent lyrics in rap songs?


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## skookerasbil (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bodecea said:
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Of course the brainless left are the first of the assholes to chime in on this sort of stuff........a brain pathology fuck up where the common sense connectors are left out. jacksasses will want to talk about gun laws because they live in a place called Disney where the percieved solution makes the whole problem go away. Moral superiority is gay........and gets lost of people dead.

The debate needs to be about one thing moving foward. We spend countless billions on senseless government programs but our schools are unprotected. There needs to be at least one person in every single school across America who is well trained and well paid to carry a firearm at all times. Period. Whatever the cost.........and stop spending tens of millions on bullshit like solar energy.


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## mal (Dec 14, 2012)

It's my Anniversary today... Wife and I are going out on the town... If I stay and read any more of this Disgusting Politicizing of this I am going to end up eating a ban...

A few of you are fucking Shameless...

Have a good afternoon. 



peace...


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

liarintheWH said:


> This is terrible. Reports say shooter killed his mother before going to the school.





so this is not about gun control....


this ass wanted to go out in a blaze. He has a plan...


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> It is time to have a serious discussion.



We are not allowed to discuss guns in this country

The guns are out there, nobody is going to take them away. An occasional massacre is the price we pay for "freedom"


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

So, decades ago when we had LESS gun laws, we didn't see this sort of thing.

Now, we have MORE gun laws and we see MORE of this sort of thing.



Is this a gun problem or a societal problem?  I say the latter - too many folks are fucked in the head.  Why?


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Yes - locked down like a prison. But also the camera in the classroom can also assist home schoolers or children home from school sick or contagious. Everyone can keep up with what is going on in class without disturbing or endangering the class.


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## Misty (Dec 14, 2012)

We don't know if he legally owned the gun. Remember columbine guns were illegally obtained. No law can stop that.


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## skookerasbil (Dec 14, 2012)

Of course the brainless left are the first of the assholes to chime in on this sort of stuff........a brain pathology fuck up where the common sense connectors are left out. jacksasses will want to talk about gun laws because they live in a place called Disney where the percieved solution makes the whole problem go away. Moral superiority is gay........and gets lost of people dead.

The debate needs to be about one thing moving foward. We spend countless billions on senseless government programs, like renewable energy BS but our schools are unprotected. There needs to be at least one person ( and probably two) in every single school across America who is well trained and well paid to carry a firearm at all times. Period. Whatever the cost.........and stop spending tens of millions on bullshit like solar energy.


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## tooAlive (Dec 14, 2012)

Parents, love your children.

Looks like the suspect's own mother was a teacher at the school.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

24 year old from New Jersey identified as shooter.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

https://www.facebook.com/ryan.lanza1


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

skookerasbil said:


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truthfully, i dont think its about the schools or fire arms...


its about* how parents* are being up their children. Its about parents instilling in children there there is a values on life.  Its about parents paying attention to what their children are doing and what they identify with.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

May be son of the the teacher whos class was targeted


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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you will NEVER be able to mandate that with laws.


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## tooAlive (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> https://www.facebook.com/ryan.lanza1



That's a kid from the Philippines. I doubt he had anything to do with it.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> So, decades ago when we had LESS gun laws, we didn't see this sort of thing.
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its not the guns.... its about the sensationalized idea of going out in a blaze of "glory"  Thanks the muslims for bringing the idea of mass killings and how to do it into open discussion.... the idea of "soft targets for maxim effect"


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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 Wasn't Columbine before 9/11?


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

tooAlive said:


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Don't tell me she posted ANOTHER link without reading it.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Mad Scientist said:


> How could this happen? I mean, Schools are gun free zones aren't they?


I was about to say that, Anyway how dare they bring a gun to a place they shouldn't have.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


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idiot.. who said anything about mandating what parents do or dont do with laws.....  though sterilizing you may not be a bad idea for a the government mandated law.


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## Oldguy (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> May be son of the the teacher whos class was targeted




Oh, no!  I hope he's alright.  Please keep us informed.


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## Plasmaball (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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oook this has nothing to do with what happened,but thanks for playing.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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i am not just talking about 911....

there were plenty of suicide bombers before that.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Yes, it was.  And, I don't know if anyone noticed, but for years after the 9/11 attacks, we didn't have any of this sort of shit.  My take on that is that too many folks did not want to do something that was similar to what happened on 9/11.

Now, we have it again.  This guy is 24...he was just a kid when 9/11 happened.  What went wrong with his (or others who do the same) moral compass?


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

Oldguy said:


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Sorry to confuse you.

The shooter may be the son of the teacher who normally teaches the targeted class.

She was found dead at their nearby home


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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It's a bit of a stretch to blame this on suicide bombers.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Plasmaball said:


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so you say.....


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## Truthmatters (Dec 14, 2012)

Ryan J Lanza - Bing Images


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## Plasmaball (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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yeah i did, because it has nothing to do with this.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

And look who decides to give the shooter his moment of fame by posting a link to his picture.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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I am not blaming it on anything...

i am pointing out that people with issues are exposed to ideas that may not have occurred to them before.... grander plans and such.


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

RIP to the dead....this is too sad....and angering....


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## elvis (Dec 14, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> And look who decides to give the shooter his moment of fame by posting a link to his picture.



She has no class.  Never has.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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You're talking about human (or inhuman) nature. That's never going to change. People are always going to kill each other. 

Enabling them by providing the tools is the problem, imo.


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## skookerasbil (Dec 14, 2012)

Social engineering is gay.........and focus on how people should be parenting is accurate but there will ALWAYS  be k00ks amongst us. These people are mentally fucked...........

The focus needs to be on protection. It needs to be publicized that every single school has at least 2 armed and trained professionals in each building. You cannot prevent this shit from happening..........EVER.........but you sure as hell can save some lives and if you save ONE, its money well spent. It needs to happen yesterday............


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

The same politicizing is going on in this thread so why was the one I was in moved? So stupid. Whatever, rhetorical question but all my posts are in the other damn thread.


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## tjvh (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


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What do you mean? We have shootings every day... The *only* difference the ones that get the *full attention of the media* happen to be the ones that have scarier looking guns, Yet those guns function exactly the same as every other semi- automatic hunting rifle out there. It's about the gun control nuts *targeting* certain guns like the AR-15... Because they look scary. Nothing more than idiots playing on people's emotions to accomplish their tyrannical agenda... To disarm Law abiding citizens.


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


> Ravi said:
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Syreen. Shut the fuck up you're becoming more outrageous then I thought you were. Blame the Muslims...wtf do they have to do with this? You moron, it hurts to know we have mass shooters in our country who are non Muslims. That's according to you, you're sick and your argument isn't even possible. 

Dec. 14, 2012: A gunman opened fire inside a Newtown, Conn., elementary school Friday in a shooting that left 27 people dead, including 18 children.
Aug. 13, 2012: A 30-minute shootout near the Texas A&M University campus in College Station, Texas, resulted in the deaths of a police constable, a bystander, the shooter, and the injury of four others.
Aug. 5, 2012:  A gunman opens fire at a Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wis. killing six people and wounding three. Police shot and killed the suspect, Wade Michael Page, after the attack.
July 17, 2012: A gunman stood outside of a crowded downtown bar and opened fire from two different sending patrons running or crawling for cover. At least 17 people were hurt. Nathan Van Wilkins, 44, surrendered about 10 hours after the shooting near the University of Alabama campus in Tuscaloosa, police said.
July 20, 2012: During a midnight screening of the film "The Dark Knight Rises" inAurora, Colo., a gunman opens fire on the crowded theater. At least 12 people are killed and 58 others are wounded. The suspect, James Holmes, set off a smoke device in the front of the theater before opening fire. Directly after the incident, Holmes, age 24, was arrested in a parking lot behind the theater.
June 9, 2012: A gunman opens fire at an apartment complex near the campus of Auburn University. Three people were killed  - among them Auburn football player Edward Christian, a former star at Lowndes High School in Valdosta, Ga., and former teammate Ladarious Phillips - and three others were wounded.
April 2, 2012:  One Goh, a 43-year-old former student at Oikos University, a Christian school, opened fire on the Oakland, Calif., campus, killing seven people and wounding several others.
March 6, 2012: Shane Schumerth, a 28-year-old teacher at Episcopal High School in Jacksonville, Fla., returned to the campus after being fired and shot and killed the headmistress, Dale Regan, with an assault rifle.
Feb. 27, 2012:  At Chardon High School in Ohio, a former classmate opened fire, killing three students and injuring six. Arrested shortly after the incident, the shooter said that he randomly picked students.
Dec. 8, 2011: A Virginia Tech police officer was shot and killed by a 22-year old student of Radford University. The shooting took place in a parking lot on Virginia Tech's campus in Blacksburg, Va.
May 10, 2011:  Three people were killed in a parking garage at San Jose State University. Two former students were found dead on the fifth floor of a garage at the  San Jose, Calif., campus. A third, the suspected shooter, died later at the hospital.
Jan. 5, 2011: Two people opened fire during a Worthing High School powder-puff football game in Houston, Texas. One former student died. Five other people were injured.
Jan. 8, 2011: Arizona Rep. Gabrielle Giffords was shot in an assassination attempt. At least 17 others are shot by a gunman, identified as Jared Lee Loughner, who opened fire on the congresswoman's constituent meeting outside a grocery store in Tuscon, Ariz. Six people are fatally wounded, including U.S. District Court Judge John Roll, and a young girl.
Jan. 5, 2011:  Two people were killed and two more injured in a shooting at Millard South High School in Omaha, Neb. Shortly after being suspended from school, the shooter returned and shot the assistant principal, principal, and the school nurse. The shooter then left campus and took his own life.
Feb. 12, 2010: During a meeting on campus, Amy Bishop, a biology professor, began shot her colleagues, killing three and wounding three others in Huntsville, Ala.
March 9, 2010: A man opens fire at Ohio State University in Columbus, Ohio, killing two employees and wounding one other.
Feb. 14, 2008: Gunman killed five students and then himself, and wounded 17 more when he opened fire on a classroom at Northern Illinois University in DeKalb, Ill. The gunman, Stephen P. Kazmierczak, was identified as a former graduate student at the university in 2007.
Feb. 8, 2008: A nursing student shot and killed two women and then herself in a classroom at Louisiana Technical College in Baton Rouge.
Oct. 10, 2007: A 14-year-old student at a Cleveland (Ohio) high school, Asa H. Coon, shot and injured two students and two teachers before he shot and killed himself. The victims' injuries were not life-threatening.
April 16, 2007: A 23-year-old Virginia Tech student, Cho Seung-Hui, killed two in a dorm, then killed 30 more 2 hours later in a classroom building on the Blacksburg, Va., campus. His suicide brought the death toll to 33, making the shooting rampage the most deadly in U.S. history. Fifteen others were wounded.
Oct. 3, 2006: 32-year-old Carl Charles Roberts IV entered the one-room West Nickel Mines Amish School in Nickel Mines, Pa., and shot 10 schoolgirls, ranging in age from 6 to 13 years old, and then himself. Five of the girls and Roberts died.
Sept. 27, 2006: Adult male held six students hostage at Platte Canyon High School in Bailey, Colo., and then shot and killed Emily Keyes, 16, and himself.
Aug. 24, 2006: Christopher Williams, 27, looking for his ex-girlfriend at Essex Elementary School in Essex, Vt., shot two teachers, killing one and wounding another. Before going to the school, he had killed the ex-girlfriend's mother.
Nov. 8, 2005: One 15-year-old shot and killed an assistant principal at Campbell County High School in Jacksboro, Tenn., and seriously wounded two other administrators.
March 21, 2005: Jeff Weise, 16, killed grandfather and companion, then arrived at school where he killed a teacher, a security guard, 5 students, and finally himself, leaving a total of 10 dead in Red Lake, Minn.
Sept. 24, 2003: Two students are killed at Rocori High School in Cold Spring, Minn., by John Jason McLaughlin, 15.
April 14, 2003: One 15-year-old killed, and three students were wounded at John McDonogh High School in New Orleans by gunfire from four teenagers (none were students at the school). The motive was reportedly gang-related.
October 2002:  A series of sniper-style shootings leave 10 dead around the Washington, D.C., area.
Oct. 28, 2002: Robert S. Flores Jr., 41, a student at the nursing school at the University of Arizona in Tucson, shot and killed three female professors and then himself.
March 22, 2001:  One teacher and three students wounded by Jason Hoffman, 18, at Granite Hills (Calif.) High School. A policeman shot and wounded Hoffman.
March 5, 2001:  Two killed and 13 wounded by Charles Andrew Williams, 15, firing from a bathroom at Santana High School in Santee, Calif.
May 26, 2000: One teacher, Barry Grunow, shot and killed at Lake Worth Middle School by Nate Brazill, 13, with .25-caliber semiautomatic pistol on the last day of classes in Lake Worth, Fla.
March 10, 2000: Two students killed by Darrell Ingram, 19, while leaving a dance sponsored by Beach High School in Savannah, Ga.
Sept. 16, 1999:  A gunman, identified as as Larry Gene Ashbrook, opened fire at a prayer service in Fort Worth, Texas, killing six people before committing suicide.
July 1999: A stock exchange trader in Atlanta, killed 12 people including his wife and two children before taking his own life.
April 1999: Two teenage schoolboys shot and killed 12 schoolmates and a teacher at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colo., before killing themselves.
Dec. 1, 1997: Michael Carneal opened fire with a .22-caliber pistol in the lobby of Heath High School in Paducah, Ky., shooting eight teenagers during their morning prayer circle meeting. Three students were killed, five others were wounded.
Aug. 1, 1966: A University of Texas engineering student and former Marine, Charles Joseph Whitman, fired at random targets from the 28th floor observation deck of the Main Building, killing 13 and wounding 32 others, before being shot and killed by an Austin, Texas, police officer.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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But ravi, decades ago we had less gun control laws - guns were much more readily available to persons...the tools were more available.

Now they are less available, yet we have more of this shit.  I don't think it's the tools' availability that is the problem because the correlation is inverted.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

ok before you gun grabbers go off on a tangent about being able to buy guns 
The murderer was 20 years old
A 20-year-old man dressed in all black carrying two guns killed 26 people -- including his mother and 18 children -- during morning announcements at a Newtown elementary school on Friday, NBC has learned. The massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School is one the worst school shooting in American history.
26 Dead at Newtown School: NBC | NBC Connecticut


he used two hand guns
you cannot buy a handgun in Connecticut unless you are at least 21
What Are the Gun Laws in Connecticut?


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

No one and I mean no one on this forum here knows why this man did this. We just know that lots of people and young children are dead and that fact is breaking lots of hearts right now.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

bodecea said:


> Again, the price of freedom.   Just like car accidents, we are starting to expect these and move on after the initial "Awwwwww".



The alternative is to lock up everyone because that would be that alternative to "putting up" with these shootings.


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## laughinReaper (Dec 14, 2012)

Keep Newtown in prayer.

Got family there, it's not a big place.


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## Merchant_of_Meh (Dec 14, 2012)

Awful stuff. As a father, this rends my heart. 

That's really all I have to say about this.


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## skookerasbil (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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The idea they need to be exposed to is thinking BEFORE they go into the school and snap that if they start shooting people, they are dying because somebody IN the school is going to put one between their eyeballs. THATS just the possible deterrent factor..........the more important thing is to dramatically reduce the carnage and number of deaths.


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## The Infidel (Dec 14, 2012)

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I kind of hate engaging in this type of discussion so soon after the tragedy, but do we ban axes, hammers, baseball bats, cars, knives, ropes, screwdrivers, etc etc....   ?
All of the listed have been used to kill.
In fact baseball bats are the most popular murder weapon out there.

This is a tragic situation, but we can't act emotionally and pass more dumb laws.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

tjvh said:


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Untrue. The mass shootings get more attention, not the size of the gun.

Are you this stupid in real life?


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## skookerasbil (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> ok before you gun grabbers go off on a tangent about being able to buy guns
> The murderer was 20 years old
> A 20-year-old man dressed in all black carrying two guns killed 26 people -- including his mother and 18 children -- during morning announcements at a Newtown elementary school on Friday, NBC has learned. The massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School is one the worst school shooting in American history.
> 26 Dead at Newtown School: NBC | NBC Connecticut
> ...





Wont stop the gun law nuts from hammerring their k00k narrative. By tonight, it'll be in full swing.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


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Were they? Maybe rifles were more available, I know my dad always had them. But handguns? Decades ago we didn't have every other person owning a handgun or automatic weapon.


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


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Yup. Knee jerk reactionaries. The breed on message boards. I am still trying to understand the what and why.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

tjvh said:


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Bullshit.  The attention is due to the fact that mass murder has happened....lots of folks randomly, or not so randomly, killed.

Who gives a shit what gun was used?  I don't.  The kids or movie goers are still dead.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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good to know you understand... its the people and not the guns.


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## bodecea (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> ok before you gun grabbers go off on a tangent about being able to buy guns
> The murderer was 20 years old
> A 20-year-old man dressed in all black carrying two guns killed 26 people -- including his mother and 18 children -- during morning announcements at a Newtown elementary school on Friday, NBC has learned. The massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School is one the worst school shooting in American history.
> 26 Dead at Newtown School: NBC | NBC Connecticut
> ...



I believe he was 24, last stated.

And I agree that gun control laws don't help stop killings.


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## tjvh (Dec 14, 2012)

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Of course they do numbskull, I'm talking about the media's knack for reporting gun violence when the term assault rifle can be freely be used... It gets *more* attention when an AK-47, or AR-15 is used regardless of how many victims there are. Got it pea brain?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

skookerasbil said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> > ok before you gun grabbers go off on a tangent about being able to buy guns
> ...


of course they will


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


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Except for the fact that if this fucker didn't have the guns he wouldn't have been able to kill so many people.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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This is from Mother Jones (ugh) about gun ownership since 1973....it has gone from 50% in 1973 to 30% in 2010.  Dunno about hand guns, though.  I'll keep looking.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

bodecea said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> > ok before you gun grabbers go off on a tangent about being able to buy guns
> ...


I provide the source from NBC OR did you miss that part?
Anyway do you have supportive links to say otherwise?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Is that why the talking heads on the news are speculating about extended magazines when there is no evidence that they were even used in the shooting?


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## tjvh (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Decades ago we didn't have people owning automatic weapons???? You really are an idiot... Semi-automatic firearms have been in the public's hands *long before* you and I were around numbskull.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Dreamy said:


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More like the straw that broke the camel's back.

If you don't support gun control, what is your answer to stop the ever more common mass killings? Don't be part of the problem, that isn't a way to solve anything.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> The Infidel said:
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Why does the numbers matter too you? One death is too many in a gun free zone. He was at a school with little children he could have silently killed more children with a knife.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

tjvh said:


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A simple yes to my question would have sufficed.


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## Valerie (Dec 14, 2012)

> NEWTOWN, Conn.At least 25 people, including 18 children, were shot and killed at a Connecticut elementary school on Friday, law-enforcement officials with knowledge of the matter said.
> 
> A single shooter, identified only as a 20-year-old man by a law-enforcement official, began shooting inside the Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., at about 9:40 a.m.
> 
> ...




Dozens Killed in Newtown, Connecticut, School Shooting - WSJ.com


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## The Infidel (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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I can't disagree with ya on that Rav


Wish I could give ya a hug... I think you need one, I know I do.


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## tjvh (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


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Um... You started with the personal insults, so fuck off loon.


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## Jos (Dec 14, 2012)

Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor
Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## NLT (Dec 14, 2012)

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## liarintheWH (Dec 14, 2012)

Father of shooter reportedly found dead in NJ.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


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That was a little confusing....


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## namvet (Dec 14, 2012)

Fox News has confirmed that the suspected shooter at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown Connecticut was 24-year-old Ryan Lanza (pictured above). He reportedly was from Newtown, but was living in Hoboken, N.J.

Fox News has learned that Lanza was a Newtown High School graduate in 2006 and an honor roll student there from 2004-06. It is believed he graduated from Connecticuts Quinnipiac University in 2010


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

tjvh said:


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Did I say that? Why, no, I didn't.

Piss off, moron.


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> So, decades ago when we had LESS gun laws, we didn't see this sort of thing.
> 
> Now, we have MORE gun laws and we see MORE of this sort of thing.
> 
> ...



When I grew up, these massacres were few and far between (Texas Tower). We had to contend with assasinations as a way for someone to gain infamy. JFK, MLK, RFK, John Lennon, Reagan, Ford, the Pope...

Now, when someone wants attention they pack as much ammo as they can and try to set a new record for massacres


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## namvet (Dec 14, 2012)

Fox News has confirmed that the suspected shooter at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown Connecticut was 24-year-old Ryan Lanza (pictured above). He reportedly was from Newtown, but was living in Hoboken, N.J.

Fox News has learned that Lanza was a Newtown High School graduate in 2006 and an honor roll student there from 2004-06. It is believed he graduated from Connecticuts Quinnipiac University in 2010

good humor man slays 26


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


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Thanks....I started crying when I saw pics of those terrified kids outside and imagined my children in their place. Hugs to you, too.


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## TNHarley (Dec 14, 2012)

I dont understand how the bloody liberals hate guns but support abortion.. RW is yelling killing kindergarteners and blah blah. What about before they are born? They have to be a certain age to matter? YALL STFU


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

People forget the gun control debates right now....this is sad....and Si modo and Syreen need to fuck off when they try making a case Muslims paved way for this, what two viciously bigoted individuals. Scum.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Si modo said:
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sad sad sad... i agree. Its that whole going out with a blaze thing.....


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

Well, the shooter got what he wanted. Two posters have either posted his picture or a link.

He wanted to be famous on his way out. He got it.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> People forget the gun control debates right now....this is sad....and Si modo and Syreen need to fuck off when they try making a case Muslims paved way for this, what two viciously bigoted individuals. Scum.



People died in a gun free zone


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## The Infidel (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Now, when someone wants attention they pack as much ammo as they can and try to set a new record for massacres




Sounds like the plot of many a video games


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Hero teacher Kaitlin Roig tells ABC News that she barricaded her first grade students in classroom bathroom and locked the door when she first heard gun shots. &#8220;The kids were being so good. They asked: &#8216;Can we go see if anyone is out there? &#8230; I just want Christmas&#8230; I don&#8217;t want to die, I just want to have Christmas.&#8217; I said, you&#8217;re going to have Christmas and Hanukkah.. I tried to be positive.

LIVE UPDATES: Newtown, CT School Shooting - ABC News


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## RosieS (Dec 14, 2012)

Lanza's mother worked as a teacher at the school. She is dead, the principal and school psychologist are dead, 18-20 students dead.

Regards from Rosie


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Well, the shooter got what he wanted. Two posters have either posted his picture or a link.
> 
> He wanted to be famous on his way out. He got it.



The murder will rot in hell


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


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What you are failing to understand is that axes, hammers, baseball bats, cars, knives, ropes, screwdrivers etc etc all serve a useful purpose _other than to kill something_.  

Guns are used to kill and serve no other purpose.


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
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i don't believe in hell.

but he is dead.

i'm always sorry they don't shoot themselves BEFORE they shoot other people.


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## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCAXhK1E5-k]Violence, Killing Sprees & Psych Meds Part 1: Columbine, Yates, Holmes, Colin Ross & Corrina Rachel - YouTube[/ame]


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Well, the shooter got what he wanted. Two posters have either posted his picture or a link.
> 
> He wanted to be famous on his way out. He got it.



how do you know he wanted to be famous?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


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You can bet your last dollar to starvation their is a hell and that cock sucker is their right now.


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## syrenn (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


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there is no fame in that.


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## mjollnir (Dec 14, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Well, the shooter got what he wanted. Two posters have either posted his picture or a link.
> 
> He wanted to be famous on his way out. He got it.



Uh, it's not like his image isn't going to be all over the world through every form of electronic and print media imaginable.

It probably already is.


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## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

watch...he will have been on psych drugs...they always are


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> People forget the gun control debates right now....this is sad....and Si modo and Syreen need to fuck off when they try making a case Muslims paved way for this, what two viciously bigoted individuals. Scum.


Get a brain cell, Muslim terrorist pig.  I said nothing about Muslims being responsible for this.

You are obviously thrilled about this as so many infidels are dead.

Pig.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
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> > Well, the shooter got what he wanted. Two posters have either posted his picture or a link.
> ...



He obviously wanted to kill his parents, but instead of just doing that he shot up a school too. I really think that was added on just so he would be remembered for a long time.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> The Infidel said:
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Many people find shooting to be relaxing as a sport.  Gathering food is also a use.  Protecting yourself or others is a useful purpose.


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


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he shot up the school where his mother worked.

i'd think fame wasn't a primary concern.


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## RetiredGySgt (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


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What you are failing to understand is firearms serve a useful purpose also. For the people not aware, the Countries with the most stringent gun control laws violent crimes are higher then in the US. Further if somehow magically we removed all firearms from civilian and criminal hands one can make a bomb out of fertilizer. How many would be dead if he drove a pickup truck or truch with a bomb in it to the school?

I will repeat, the second amendment is not going away. If you don't think we should have the right to be armed, propose and get passed Congress a new amendment and get 37 States to agree, failing that we have enough laws on the books for firearms.


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
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> > People forget the gun control debates right now....this is sad....and Si modo and Syreen need to fuck off when they try making a case Muslims paved way for this, what two viciously bigoted individuals. Scum.
> ...



Hey whore, you added to Syreens comment, go fuck yourself. I expressed anger and sadness when I first saw this, and my first post here was stating that. And you and syreen try to make a stupid stupid sick argument at the worst time one could, bigots like you are scum of the scum.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


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Why didn't he just shoot her instead of going all Columbine in the place?

He wanted his day of infamy.


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## bodecea (Dec 14, 2012)

syrenn said:


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"Thank the Muslims".........


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## Wiseacre (Dec 14, 2012)

Can we delay the gun control argument for another day please?   Should we not grieve for those who were lost today and their families?   Can we not support in any possible way the traumatized kids who survived?   Pray for all of them if you want to, and give thanks if your kids or parents or loved ones come home tonight.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


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As I said, you need at least one brain cell.  I never said Muzzie terrorist pigs like yourself had anything to do with this.

I certainly DID say that for a few years after 9/11, there weren't many of these sorts of things going on.  Likely because no one wanted to be compared to Muzzie terrorist pigs such as yourself.

Now, don't you have a gay to hang and a woman to stone?  Daylight is running out.


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> sfcalifornia said:
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By gathering food, do you mean to kill for food?  And by protecting yourself, do you mean threatening to kill?  I understand target practice and skeet shooting but do you need a semi-automatic weapon for that?


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

bodecea said:


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She has issues, can she come out and explain to us why she says such stupid things? How can someone be more hateful than a Nazi?


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

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That's not true you retard Nazi. You opened hell gates. I'm gonna humiliate you on every thread from now on, I hate bigoted comments like that, I will never stop replying to your retarded posts, every post you make, even if its about shopping, anything, I'm gonna humiliate you skank. Shut your mouth.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


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At least Nazi's don't kill over cartoons.  Of course, no one ever said Nazis were stupid, either.


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 14, 2012)

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> > bodecea said:
> ...



You're the Nazi, now shut the fuck up and quit politicizing this. That the people post on this thread, not your sick shit trying to blame Muslims, you sick fucks. Shame on you.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...




You gonna stone me, too?

I know some gays....maybe you can hang them.






Retard.  But thanks for the comic relief during such a tragic situation.


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



I said guns serve ONE purpose.

I said nothing about the Second Amendment.


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## elvis (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Everybody must get stoned.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



Better question is, what are you willing to give up to stop them? Gun control is not going to stop them, Connecticut already requires a permit to purchase a handgun, yet this guy had two of them.


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## RetiredGySgt (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



You can not discuss banning firearms without addressing the second amendment. And you lose on that. The 2nd is clear and the Courts have made it clearer. The type of firearm protected by the 2nd is military types. Semi automatic rifles, shotguns and hand guns. Further you can not ban people from owning them without a specific provable reason as listed by law.


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## LAfrique (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Shooting Reported at Newtown School | NBC Connecticut
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Wishful thinking, but unfortunately we have no luck - Connecticut school shooting claims nearly 30 lives, source says - CNN.com 


I just do not know what is becoming of the world when someone can enter an Elementary School, point guns and kill little defenseless children. So tragic.

My *condolences to the families of the deceased, and prayers for all those affected by this senseless tragedy. May souls of all the deceased (including disturbed gunman) RIP.
*


----------



## Zoom-boing (Dec 14, 2012)

Just got in and saw this on the news.  My God, what the hell is wrong with people?  How can someone be such a sicko as to shoot people, let alone little kids????

My heart goes out to the victims and all affected.  They were freakin' _kindergarteners_ that he shot, five and six year olds!  I am going to be sick.


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



he didn't live in connecticut he lived in hoboken, nj.

and maybe that means there should be real criteria for obtaining a license... like psychological testing... 

it's harder to get a drivers license than a gun license.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

If you want an idea...

I think its Sweden that requires military service.  Everyone gets their gun after and they are required to keep it.  Really low murder rate.


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## bayoubill (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> The Infidel said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



not true...

research has shown that, each and every year for the past several years, there has been more than one million instances where the simple act of showing of a firearm by a person in a defensive position has warded off the predations of a person with bad intent... i.e., the bad guy backed off with no shots being fired...

it should also be pointed out that only a tiny fraction-of-a-percent of the tens of millions of guns in this country ever actually end up being fired in the direction of another person...


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



WHERE did I say anything about banning guns here?  I am pragmatically pointing out the fallacy in comparing cars, bats etc as weapons to guns.  Nothing more.


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



It is not easy to get a concealed carry weapon permit. Are saying not allow gun ownership at all without a CCW permit?


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

bayoubill said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



In other words, showing the gun as a warning that you will kill if needed.

Guns are used to kill.  It is fallacious to compare cars, ropes and baseball bats to guns because these items serve an entirely different purpose.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


No it's not easier to get a gun license in NJ than a driver's license.  You should do a simple google search before posting.

How to Acquire a Gun License in New Jersey: 16 steps - wikiHow

Nor is it easier to get a gun permit in Connecticut than a driver's license.  How to Get a Gun License in CT | eHow.com


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## elvis (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


We don't have an amendment that says right to drive a car.


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## Meister (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> bayoubill said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



I use all my guns and pistols at the target range....not looking to kill anything.


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## skookerasbil (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...




OMG........let the k00k analysis begin...........and we're all going to hear alot more nutty-ass stuff on gun laws in the following days. Nothing more than nonsense.

We need to put two cops in every single school in America tomorrow. Period. Whateve the cost. We spend billions on BS like solar power and government agencies that have their thumbs up their asses...........beyond k00k. You can never stop a person who snaps.......but sure as hell you can reduce the damage with some common sense. If ONE single life is saved through preventing these massacres, it is money well spent. We need to knock off the Disney chatter and apply some plain old common sense in an effort to prevent these kinds of unthinkable nightmares.


Unfortunately, in a state like mine where you have nut politicans like Carolyn McCarthy, protecting our schools wouldnt be considered. 


The people need to be heard..........


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

elvis said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



just because there is an amendment doesn't make a 'right' absolute. heller was a terrible decision. breyer's dissent is much more on target. that said, even the right to free speech is subject to reasonable time, place and manner restrictions... commercial speech is subject to controls.. 

the 4th amendment has restrictions to the warrant requirement.. and there are reasonable circumstances absent a warrant when someone can be searched.

i'm certainly not asserting any type of ban. but i don't think the answer to gun violence is more guns. and honestly, i'm not sure we can ever address the real problem... which is the childishness of certain pro gun types... as if it's a toy and not a weapon. they actually like the idea of the wild west where in their minds they get to shoot the bad guys.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...


Link?


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

skookerasbil said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



quiet loon, grown ups are talking.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Wiseacre said:


> Can we delay the gun control argument for another day please?   Should we not grieve for those who were lost today and their families?   Can we not support in any possible way the traumatized kids who survived?   Pray for all of them if you want to, and give thanks if your kids or parents or loved ones come home tonight.



Satans evil never sleeps just like the gun grabbers will use anything to push their agenda. So I will not back off.
Bless the Children that were murdered in a gun free zone.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> https://www.facebook.com/ryan.lanza1



Makes little sense to me....

Ryan Lanza
Yesterday via mobile
Pasok pasok dn bka malate  see yah

Ryan Lanza
Yesterday via mobile
Jsp here i come 


Ryan Lanza
Yesterday
tuwang tuwa ako nkakapag css n ko ahhaha
ngaun lng ntuto mg css kasu mejo d p gamay masyado
practice practice n hehehe


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## Meister (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Glad to hear your opinion, Jillian.
Just like everybody else, they all have their opinion.
No more weight with your than theirs.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

KissMy said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


It's easy enough. In Florida you just have to take a safety course and not have certain criminal records.


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## RoadVirus (Dec 14, 2012)

Alright Lefties....let's get this over with:

This shooting is caused by the Right Winger Gun happy culture that has an obsession with guns and wanting to have access to all kinds of powerful weapons regardless of who you are, your criminal background or mental state.

We need to have stricter gun laws that take guns out of the hands of everyone except law enforcement and military personnel so we can prevent tragedies like this in the future.

There. We now return to the thread in progress.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 14, 2012)

27 killed including himself.  How many shots were fired?  Certainly a bolt action hunting rifle, a six shot revolver or even a pump action shotgun could not hold enough ammunition to wreck so much carnage.  He must have used an assault rifle to kill so many.

Shouldn't such weapons belong in a "well regulated militia" and not on the streets or in an elementary school?


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...


Here are some interesting data.  Note that gun crimes decreased in states that allowed conceal carry and increased in areas where there were bans on handguns.































Gun Control - Just Facts


----------



## Mad Scientist (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> just because there is an amendment doesn't make a 'right' absolute. heller was a terrible decision. breyer's dissent is much more on target. that said, even the right to free speech is subject to reasonable time, place and manner restrictions... commercial speech is subject to controls..


I know you're a Liberal, but there are times here when you show your true Authoritarian Leanings.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> 27 killed including himself.  How many shots were fired?  Certainly a bolt action hunting rifle, a six shot revolver or even a pump action shotgun could not hold enough ammunition to wreck so much carnage.  He must have used an assault rifle to kill so many.
> 
> Shouldn't such weapons belong in a "well regulated militia" and not on the streets or in an elementary school?



Six shot revolver? ever heard of speed loaders for revolvers?



> Shouldn't such weapons belong in a "well regulated militia" and not on the streets or in an elementary school


Maybe you should ask the murderer why he did that?


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


I'm sure most of us are thankful that you'll never be a justice.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Your a lawyer?
REMIND me what the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringe means.


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## Mad Scientist (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> 27 killed including himself.  How many shots were fired?  Certainly a bolt action hunting rifle, a six shot revolver or even a pump action shotgun could not hold enough ammunition to wreck so much carnage.  He must have used an assault rifle to kill so many.
> 
> Shouldn't such weapons belong in a "well regulated militia" and not on the streets or in an elementary school?


If you can carry it, you should be able to own it.

And why not? The US Gov't does. In fact they use our Tax Money to pay for those weapons and ship them to Mexico or use them in Undeclared Wars in the Middle East but there's never the same amount of rage from gun-grabbers when the Military and the Gov't commit even worse atrocities. 

Why *shouldn't* we be able to own many of the same things?


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Crazy killer with a gun is when the shooter knows most have a gun and fires anyways.  An angry coward does what we saw today.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> The Infidel said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


Bullshit.  I've been shooting since I was a teen.  I never killed a thing, unless you think clay pigeons are alive.  

And, I totally enjoyed killing those clay pigeons.


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



you understand half the court disagreed with heller, right?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > 27 killed including himself.  How many shots were fired?  Certainly a bolt action hunting rifle, a six shot revolver or even a pump action shotgun could not hold enough ammunition to wreck so much carnage.  He must have used an assault rifle to kill so many.
> ...


Without weaponry of this kind, his toll would never hve climbed beyond a handful.  It's high capacity magazines and automatic weaponry that has no place, no defendable, logical, reasonable place in our society.  Such weapons should be in the hands of "WELL REGULATED MILITIAS" not in the hands of the public.  

There is no justification for such weapons other than to fulfill the purient yens of Rambo wannabes and potential mass murders.  Neither of those two groups deserve respect or the right to hold such weapons.  

No defense can be made to hold such weapons as they have one and only one legitimate design use: to kill as many people as quickly as possible.  They are a *blight* on our society and the sooner we all realize the truth about these weapons, the sooner we can get about the important work of ridding our streets of them now and forever.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> edited for brevity


Just looking at Florida and Texas, murder rates were already dropping before concealed carry was allowed so I am far from convinced that there is a correlation.

(not to mention it's a rightwingloon website )


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.  ~ Jillian's sig

Using your second amendment right is apparently NOT to be excerised however.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 14, 2012)

Mad Scientist said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > 27 killed including himself.  How many shots were fired?  Certainly a bolt action hunting rifle, a six shot revolver or even a pump action shotgun could not hold enough ammunition to wreck so much carnage.  He must have used an assault rifle to kill so many.
> ...


Bazookas?  RPGs?  Nuclear warheads?  Abrams M-1 A-1 tanks?  There is a sensible line that has been obliterated by the gun lobby.  Automatic weapons, weapons with high capacity magazines have no legitimate use other than in war.  Such weapons have no real reason to be other than weapons of war.  They should be banned and outlawed and destroyed when confiscated.  And that work needs to begin now.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Without gun free zones their would not be any mass shooting


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

4:17 p.m.:  Federal sources initially identified the suspect as Ryan Lanza, 24, of New Jersey, but there appears now to be confusion over the gunman&#8217;s identity.

LIVE UPDATES: Newtown, Conn., School Shooting - ABC News


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.  ~ Jillian's sig
> 
> Using your second amendment right is apparently NOT to be excerised however.



again... there are reasonable restrictions on speech, too, or libel and slander wouldn't be actionable.

people lose their common sense when they talk about guns.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


You can make that staement shorter and then it would make sense.  Without guns there would not be any mass shooting.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Mad Scientist said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



The second amendment protects only military style firearms that are to be used in protection against the government.
Your agenda is a NO FUCKING SALE.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.  ~ Jillian's sig
> ...



You act as if no restrictions on gun ownership exist.  We know better.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


How many persons are half of nine persons?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Mass shootings always happen in gun free zones.
When the police military and obama's secret service detail dis arm we'll talk


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

I like lawyers.  Many can play bridge and some can make a good argument.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.  ~ Jillian's sig
> ...


Of course there are zero restrictions on gun ownership.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Again what does shall not be infringed mean?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Mad Scientist said:
> ...



It must sicken you to defend the indefensible.  And when reading the 2nd amendment, why ignore the entire clause outlining "well regulated militias"?  There is no reason,. no rational reason why citizens should be armed as soldiers.  When they are, we endure unspeakable tragedies like the one today in Connecticut.

But there remains intractable, unreasonable, wholly ignorant people who somehow jettison all morality and step up to defend such horrid weapons.  Senseless.


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## TNHarley (Dec 14, 2012)

Keep trying to kill our freedom libys


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## Nosmo King (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


If specious logic drives your argument, you have no argument.


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## Soggy in NOLA (Dec 14, 2012)

> The worst mass school murder in American history took place on May 18,1927 in Bath Township, Mich., when a former school board member set off three bombs that killed 45 people



CBS News: 27 Dead, Including 20 Children, In Elementary School Shooting « CBS Connecticut


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Can the mods carry sidearms?  I mean if the liberal keep firing blanks...


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

TNHarley said:


> Keep trying to kill our freedom libys


What about the freedom of the kids to attend school without getting killed?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Keep trying to kill our freedom libys
> ...



Arm the teachers.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > TNHarley said:
> ...


No. Too many teachers abuse kids they don't need weapons.


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

If the teacher had had a gun, they wouldn't have been killed.

If the principal had had a gun, they wouldn't have been killed.

You want to see kids continue to get killed? Continue to lock them up in schools with absolutely no method of defense.

Israeli teachers are armed.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Keep trying to kill our freedom libys
> ...


Cool.  But, there's always school bombings so we'll make bombs illegal.

Oh wait....they already are, too.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



You have no common sense
Where do mass shooting happen?
A.gun free zones
B police departments
C GUN RANGES
d Gun shows


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > TNHarley said:
> ...



You know what? I think these shooters wouldn't get as big of a charge out of it if they did it with a bomb. Case in point, I've seen one article stating that that has ever happened.


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

I guess the most deadly mass murder of school kids was in the 20s when someone set off 2-3 bombs in a school.

People who are pro-abortion probably aren't the people you want determining how to best defend children from attack. Just saying.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I guess the most deadly mass murder of school kids was in the 20s when someone set off 2-3 bombs in a school.
> 
> People who are pro-abortion probably aren't the people you want determining how to best defend children from attack. Just saying.


At least you're consistent.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



That leaves home schooling.  Now you get to dis parents.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

4:41 p.m.: Federal law enforcement sources now say Connecticut school shooting gunman was Adam Lanza, 20, and not his brother Ryan Lanza, 24, as earlier reported. Adam was found dead in the school along with his mother, a kindergarten teacher there.

LIVE UPDATES: Newtown, Conn., School Shooting - ABC News


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


Could be....there are some sick...very sick....fucks walking the face of the earth.  In fact, I would bet sick fucks have been walking the face of the earth since the dawn of man.


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > I guess the most deadly mass murder of school kids was in the 20s when someone set off 2-3 bombs in a school.
> ...


 
You guys are doing a great job of keeping this nation's kids safe.


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## AmyNation (Dec 14, 2012)

How did he get in????My elementary school had doors that were locked and prevented people from just walking in during school hours.


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## Luissa (Dec 14, 2012)

The Infidel said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is time to have a serious discussion.
> ...



They watch and play violent video games and movies in other countries, and this stuff doesn't happen as often as here. 
Michael Moore is a nut case but he made a very good point in Bowling For Columbine. It isn't the video games, it isn't the guns, it is the fear we have as Americans and that is put into us by politicians and the media.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



New Jersey also requires a permit to purchase a gun. so where he lives is not a factor. Do you know of any type of psychological test that is not, ultimately, come down to the opinion of the person administering the test? Would you be willing to base your driver's license on a test like that?

What makes you think it is harder to get a driver's license anyway? Does a drivers license require a criminal background check? Are there conditions on drivers licenses that prohibit them from being issued to people with a history of psychiatric illness? Are you aware of any instances of police confiscating people's cars because they make vaguely threatening statements or say they are depressed?


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Absolutely. Arming them just makes it easier for them to be sick fucks.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


I understand what you are saying....guns and emotions don't mix well at all.  But, I keep going back to this being more of a societal problem than a gun problem.  Guns were more available decades ago, but we rarely saw this shit.

What is going on in society that causes folks to kill like this?  There have been school bombings, too.  What is going on in our society?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



They shouldn't be teaching.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



I am still waiting for one person that believes in restricting people's rights to explain what restrictions should be placed on abortion.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

You simply can't design a test to predict future actions of anyone.  I might be completely sane and mild mannered in all things.  Then my pet squirrel gets run over and I'm blasting at red Mustangs all day.

What can be done, is when a person notices a sharp change in the behavior of someone they know, report it to the police.  Then law enforcement needs to follow up.  Most times these people have a new pattern of behavior.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


That's the million dollar question.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

We haven't had a murder with a gun here in a while.  A seventeen year old DID kill another driver, without a license on Wednesday.  This happens much more often in most places.


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> You simply can't design a test to predict future actions of anyone. I might be completely sane and mild mannered in all things. Then my pet squirrel gets run over and I'm blasting at red Mustangs all day.
> 
> What can be done, is when a person notices a sharp change in the behavior of someone they know, report it to the police. Then law enforcement needs to follow up. Most times these people have a new pattern of behavior.


 
Human beings. Free and dangerous at times. I will not give up freedom to garner some faux sense of safeness.


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## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

Meister said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



no offense, but i do have greater weight to what i said as it accurately portrays the state of the law viz the other amendments.

but thanks for your 'opinion'.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



In Illinois I have to consent to a medical and criminal background check to get a FOID card before I can legally buy or own guns.

I don't have to do that to get a driver's license.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



And you shouldn't own guns.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.  ~ Jillian's sig
> ...



One would think that a lawyer would understand the difference between free speech and libel.

One would, obviously, be wrong.


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


 
The rubber met the road with this post.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

4:52 p.m: Ryan Lanza, 24, brother of  gunman Adam Lanza, 20, tells authorities that his younger brother is autistic, or has Asperger syndrome and a personality disorder.  Neighbors described the younger man to ABC as odd and displaying characteristics associated with obsessive-compulsive disorder.

LIVE UPDATES: Newtown, Conn., School Shooting - ABC News


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Meister said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


Bullshit.  You are implying that there are no restrictions on gun ownership like there are on speech and searches.

There are restrictions on speech...thankfully few because it is an inherent right.

There are restrictions on searches....thankfully few because it is an inherent right to be protected from them.

There are restrictions on gun ownership....not all that few and it is in inherent right.


Your ego has a bad case of the delusions.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Well, that's got to be some personality disorder, jesus.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Why do you ignore the fact that the right to bear arms is designated to beling to the people, not to militias?


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## JOSweetHeart (Dec 14, 2012)

If Hell is where the shooter is now, and I believe that is *EXACTLY* where he is now, may he be burning *HARD* now.   

God bless you and every impacted family always!!!

Holly

P.S. I just have one question for the Lord right now...If people have to die, why can't they live to be 100 years old at least?


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## skye (Dec 14, 2012)

What a horrible tragedy.... so sad.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Keep trying to kill our freedom libys
> ...



That would explain why they made schools gun free zones.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Well, that's got to be some personality disorder, jesus.


 
I am familiar with Asperger syndrome with a family member who is the most gentle of beings. That alone is not an insight into this violence imo but thanks for the link with the added details.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> 4:52 p.m: Ryan Lanza, 24, brother of  gunman Adam Lanza, 20, tells authorities that his younger brother is autistic, or has Asperger syndrome and a personality disorder.  Neighbors described the younger man to ABC as odd and displaying characteristics associated with obsessive-compulsive disorder.
> 
> LIVE UPDATES: Newtown, Conn., School Shooting - ABC News



...and the guns belonged to whom?

Mentally imbalanced with access to guns.  Can anyone say parental error?


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


 
Romans 1:28 And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; 32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

Matthew 24:12  Because lawlessness is increased, most peoples love will grow cold.

That's what's going on.


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## Ravi (Dec 14, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Well, that's got to be some personality disorder, jesus.
> ...


I realize that and it would be a shame to see those that suffer from it tarred. 

The personality disorder is another story, if true.


----------



## Meister (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> Meister said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



You do have quite an ego, Jillian.  Not sure if it's deserved.
But, your opinion on the Heller decision means nothing to me and most on this board.
Your thoughts on the "Wild West" is certainly entertaining but is not realistic. just sayin.....
Thank YOU for playing.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

A legal opinon is still an opinion Jillian.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


 
True. After some time has passed, like so many, I want to understand what causes people to make these horrible decisions. I feel this after many of these mass killings but even when there is a single hard to understand death. The workings of the mind of those who kill. I have never felt any desire to harm others ever. I get angry at times like most people, I have had arguments and have been furious but not once has anyone every reached me to the level I want to kill them. What makes some so young snap so violently?  I drive alot for work and see more anger on the roads and often wonder what is causing it.

Of course I suppose if someone hurt someone I loved that calmmess and reason would be out the window.


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## Luissa (Dec 14, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



Shut up.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Clearly pet squirrels are undervalued.

I mean the next thing I know cats won't ....

Whoa!  You folks are sick.


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## NoNukes (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Home schooling gets more appealing by the day.



These shootings are one of the reasons that I am happy not to be raising my children in the United States.


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## Politico (Dec 14, 2012)

That's why I love this place. 19 pages of 'facts'. 90 percent of which were wrong and stated before anyone knew anything lol.

On a side not it's no surprise luddly started it. It's like he leaves a new thread window open 24x7 just in case


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## NoNukes (Dec 14, 2012)

mal said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > mal said:
> ...



Not true, and stupid.


----------



## Meister (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Home schooling gets more appealing by the day.



Home schooling does have benefits, but also....the non interaction with the children has it's draw backs IMO.  There are all types of children personalities.....I think children need to be exposed to them to have a well rounded character.  
Just a rabbit trail, my apologies.


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## kiwiman127 (Dec 14, 2012)

Yes, guns/guns were involved as a tool but in the end, I bet the determining factor was a mental health issue that came to a boiling point.
Maybe we should be looking at how this country looks upon and treats mental health.
Across this nation, states have been cutting funding to treatment mental health by over 1.8 billion dollars since 2009 because of the effects their budgets have experienced since the Great Recession.  It's obvious that mental health isn't taken seriously in the US.  
It's hard to head off instances like this and identifying potential threats to society when there is little attention being focused on mental health and treating it as a minor issue that doesn't deserve the proper funds.
Some food for thought.


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> Just got in and saw this on the news.  My God, what the hell is wrong with people?  How can someone be such a sicko as to shoot people, let alone little kids????
> 
> My heart goes out to the victims and all affected.  They were freakin' _kindergarteners_ that he shot, five and six year olds!  I am going to be sick.


The pictures of the kids with absolute terror on their faces makes my heart ache.  Ugh.


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## NoNukes (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Too bad we didn't have some second graders packing heat



Yeah, they died because it was a gun free zone.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > Just got in and saw this on the news. My God, what the hell is wrong with people? How can someone be such a sicko as to shoot people, let alone little kids????
> ...


 
 It hurts so bad. That age is scared so easily by even little things. I can only imagine the deep awful fear these little ones went through today. 

Kindergarten should be the safest place on Earth, next to the womb. No I am not going into that discussion here, it is just how I feel about babies and children. I despise those who harm children.


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

kiwiman127 said:


> Yes, guns/guns were involved as a tool but in the end, I bet it the determining factor was a mental health issue that came to a boiling point.
> Maybe we should be looking at how this country looks upon and treats mental health.
> Across this nation, states have been cutting funding to treatment mental health by over a billion dollars since 2009 because of the effects their budgets have experienced since the Great Recession.  It's obvious that mental health isn't taken seriously in the US.
> It's hard to head off instances like this and identifying potential threats to society when there is little attention being focused on mental health and treating it as a minor issue that doesn't deserve the proper funds.
> Some food for thought.



I agree.

A common thread appears to be that the people around the killer say that he was freak'n nuts and they were afraid of him. The parents say they have been trying to get him help for years. And still, he can go out and buy as many guns and as much ammo as he wants

We need to stop protecting their rights and start protecting the safety of the community. If you are reported, get him help. Take away his gun rights until he has been cleared by a psychologists. It may inconvenience some people but we have repeatedly seen the results when we do nothing


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

Luissa said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



That is pretty much what happens every time I mention that.


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## NoNukes (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



It is too late for gun control. America is fucked.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...


 
More gun laws will not make us safer is my position. More drugs laws will not stop illegal drug activity.


----------



## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



Bullshit.  Target practice = glorified killing practice.

Even so, are you using your semi-automatic assault rifle for that?  Probably not.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> kiwiman127 said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, guns/guns were involved as a tool but in the end, I bet it the determining factor was a mental health issue that came to a boiling point.
> ...


I don't know if we know Adam actually bought the guns.  Maybe Ryan owned them or his father.

I know if I had a hinky family member, I would not have guns in my house, or at least I would have them locked up tighter than a Fort Knox safe.


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

I'm sorry if this has been posted but has it been revealed who owned the guns and their status? Legal etc...?


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## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Oh, and Obama's comments were touching.  Good for him.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 14, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> I'm sorry if this has been posted but has it been revealed who owned the guns and their status? Legal etc...?



We probably won't know that for a few days, if ever.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...


Piss off.  I enjoy shooting clay pigeons.  I have been invited to go hunting and refuse because I refuse to kill anything (except spiders, wasps, hornets, ants, and houseflys).

I am the world's foremost authority on my views, motivations, thoughts, feelings, etc.  You are a moron on that topic.


----------



## Connery (Dec 14, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



I agree. There is no safeguard to protect anyone from that which is unpredictable. Even if the shooter had a propensity towards violence and showed those tendencies  I do not believe it was predictable that he would have directed it at the school, unless he specified that at an earlier time.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



I agree.

The next step is arming kindergartners and turning schools into veritable prisons.  Really sad state of affairs in America.


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## sfcalifornia (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



You didn't answer my question.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

Actually, armed teachers is a pretty good precaution. 

I don't see it happening. But I'll bet every one of the teachers hiding kids wished they had a gun.


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## Amelia (Dec 14, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> How did he get in????My elementary school had doors that were locked and prevented people from just walking in during school hours.




I heard that they had some sort of checkpoint, but that since the shooter's mother worked at the school the shooter was probably known and that might be how he got in.


----------



## Connery (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Actually, armed teachers is a pretty good precaution.
> 
> I don't see it happening. But I'll bet every one of the teachers hiding kids wished they had a gun.



I would not trust the safety of my child to teachers in a  school where they  carry any kind of weapons.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## Rozman (Dec 14, 2012)

Doesn't sound like the school had any sort of security setup.


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

They had something, they had just initiated some new sort of security protocol or something.

If someone wants to do this, they're going to do it.


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

Which is why it's nice to allow lawful citizens to be armed.


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## bayoubill (Dec 14, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



lol... such an attitude...

here's a tune just for you...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWLAaCz0fQk]I&#39;m a loser baby (so why don&#39;t you kill me?) - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> kiwiman127 said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, guns/guns were involved as a tool but in the end, I bet it the determining factor was a mental health issue that came to a boiling point.
> ...



I heard on the radio that all three guns were owned by and registered to his mother......


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## Meister (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > kiwiman127 said:
> ...



And didn't the mall shooter steal the weapon from his friend?


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 14, 2012)

Connery said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Actually, armed teachers is a pretty good precaution.
> ...



Same here.


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## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Like I said many posts back, who's guns were they?

I followed that with parental error.

She lived with him too and had no idea?


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Connery said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Given the options, I'd like the kids to have a fighting chance.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> 
> Reports are now that the gunman is dead.  The pity is, gunmen get to keep shooting until the police show up and terminate the threat.   Lives would be saved and injuries prevented if someone with a gun acted earlier.  A principle,* a teacher*, an armed guard, someone, rather than stand around waiting to die until the police get there.
> 
> When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.



Except we now know the guns used in today's massacre were in fact owned by a teacher. 

Namely the mother of the mentally ill man who did the shooting.  And she was his first victim.  

Hey, but more guns will definitely make us safer. Really. I know you all need to believe that.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Wonder why she thought she needed the guns?

A mentally unstable son who could overpower her perhaps?


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## AmyNation (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Connery said:
> ...



Accidental gun deaths are far more common than a crazy guy going off the rails and mass killing people.


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > kiwiman127 said:
> ...



Sad isn't it?

Her own guns and bullets were used to kill not only her but the children she knew and loved


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...


 
No they aren't, you fucking idiot.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

WillowTree said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > 18 kids dead. Okay, I am back in the gun control camp. This is just fucking out of hand.
> ...



How come rightwingers will insist all day they can make an abortion law work but gun control laws are unworkable....  

Common sense would seem to indicate it's the other way around.  

I don't think we should ban all guns, but we should treat them like controlled items.  

Apparently we have a teacher with a mentally ill son who still felt the need to have no less than four guns in the house. And a lot of ammo.  Didn't make her any safer, did it?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Meister said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Yes he did.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

RetiredGySgt said:


> [
> Remind us how the press reports nationally the  murders that occur daily in Chicago? I wonder why that is? As for common, mass shootings are NOT common. And taking away the rights of law abiding citizens won't stop them.



1) Why always the need to pick on Chicago?  

2) As far as I'm concerned, mass shootings are too common. We've had four so far this year that I can recall. (Aurora, the Sihk Temple, the Mall and this abomination.)  And every time we have one of these things, we find out two things. 

a) The person involved was seriously mentally ill.

b) They still had way too easy access to guns.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


The only firearms that are protected by the second amendment are those in common use for the military.


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



1500 people die each year from gun accidents. As tragic as this is, we don't have 1500 crazy guys going on shooting sprees each year.


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

1500 people don't die from gun accidents...

And while there may not be as many who die in shooting sprees as there are in accidents (though I think it's a lot closer than you think) there are tens of thousands of firearm homicides.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > syrenn said:
> ...



1) Mass shooting incidents are as common now as they were then.  Do you really think we didn't have mass shooting incidents in the 1960's?  Overall, the murder rate has gone down. But that has more to do with the fact we are getting older as a nation. 



2) GUns aren't that much harder to get.  In fact, there are more guns now.  More powerful guns, as well.  

Now, there are some changes. First, it's just a lot harder to get a mentally ill person incarcerated for his own good.  Thank the combination of liberals thinking locking up the mentally ill was "inhumane" and the conservatives underfunding mental health services. 

Probably doesn't help when the media glorifies this stuff with wall to wall coverage, either.


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## AmyNation (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> 1500 people don't die from gun accidents...
> 
> And while there may not be as many who die in shooting sprees as there are in accidents (though I think it's a lot closer than you think) there are tens of thousands of firearm homicides.



Accidental gun deaths, intentional gun deaths, and gun control

1500 accidental gun deaths per year ^^^

The Appalling Frequency of the Shooting Spree -- Daily Intelligencer

125 fatal shooting sprees since Columbine.


I'm not discussing gun violence, but "crazy gun mass shooting people".


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...


No hell no you lying piece of shit
Mass shootings didn't go up until something Clinton had done.


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## KissMy (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...


It says arms in the 2nd amendment. I should be allowed to keep a tank if I am competent


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> ...



Try busting down my door, I feel perfectly safe...........Most people don't do well walking through a wall of lead and brass.....


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

KissMy said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



It says too keep and bear arms can you carry a tank?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



How impressive. What a man!


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## koshergrl (Dec 14, 2012)

I know what's causing it...

People spit in the face of God, they embrace depravity, they kill the unborn and fight for the right to kill more people based on their *value* to society....

What do you expect?


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Try busting down my door, I feel perfectly safe...........Most people don't do well walking through a wall of lead and brass.....



Most murders are committed by someone the victim knows.  You need to be less worried about me and more worried about the guy next to you..


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Yes i am....Thank you.....


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I know what's causing it...
> 
> People spit in the face of God, they embrace depravity, they kill the unborn and fight for the right to kill more people based on their *value* to society....
> 
> What do you expect?



I expect you to embrace magic men in the sky instead of looking for pragmatic solutions. 

Now if this teacher had an abortion instead of a crazy kid, imagine the problems that could havbe been solved.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> ...



The idiots here are the idiots that think laws prevent crimes.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.



The problem is, once they admit society or the state has a compelling reason to limit who can own a gun or what kind of gun they can own, the whole charade falls apart for them. 

THIS person never should have had access to a gun.  

But once you start down that road, to hear the gun fetishists tell it, they'll take away all your guns.


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## Plasmaball (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I know what's causing it...
> 
> People spit in the face of God, they embrace depravity, they kill the unborn and fight for the right to kill more people based on their *value* to society....
> 
> What do you expect?



yes thats it, you so nailed it allie.

You are embarrassing you know this? 

I expected you to be a fucking moron about this, and you proved me right.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



How come left wingers insist that abortion laws are unworkable but insist that gun control laws work?


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## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

This is disgusting.


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## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



That teacher did not have someone busting through her door. It was her own mental case son using her weapons against her

Sure made her sleep safely


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Too common compared to what? I think incompetent doctors are too common, do you see me calling for stupid laws to make them illegal?


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## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Love to hear the gun fanatics comment on this story. (not)


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## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...


 
Let's be honest. I have no idea what state this man's mental illness was or at least was known at this point but in the end if he was a dangerous as it has been proven with these killings then he probably should not have been free to access anything including knives, baseball bats, frying pans or bows and arrows. You can't bumper pad the world sir. Dangers and dangerous people will always exist and some will be in our midst and some will always find a way to act on their mental illness or anger or violent nature. This is all called life. We have gun laws. Connecticut has some tough ones I was told. A person wanting a gun or any weapon to do harm to others will find one.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

KissMy said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



It says keep and bear, which means you have to be able to carry anything you want to keep. Can you carry a tank?


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## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

How about an honest, human response to this story?


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



But I was responding to a different statement. Made by someone else... But you knew that...


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## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

people really need to look at the link between the psych drugs and these incident it says .. can cause Homicidal ideations ..right on the FN label yet no one speaks of it and even use it to support more drugging...

Dr. Moira Dolan, executive director of the watchdog group Medical Accountability Network, criticized Wyeth for not doing more to publicize it, saying "homicidal ideation" is listed on page 36 of Effexor XR's label.

Dolan said she discovered the labeling change about two weeks ago after stumbling across the FDA's MedWatch November newsletter.

"Families don't know to be aware of this possible effect," said Dolan, an Austin, Texas, doctor who reviewed Yates' medical records after her first trial at the request of her then-husband. "As doctors we're not going to look through 36 pages of labeling."

'Homicidal ideation' added to list of antidepressant Effexor's rare adverse events


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.



I am all for having a serious discussion, why don't you start by explaining why you think doing something, even if it won't make a real difference in the end, is a serious approach? If the only intent is to do something to make us feel better about this why don't we just pass a law declaring that it is illegal to kill your mother?


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.



Virginia Tech
Tucson
Aurora
Sihk Temple
Sandy Hook

What do they have in common?  Known crazy fucks armed to the teeth and shooting up a crowd 

Why does the NRA insist on ensuring the gun rights of crazy people?  Don't they realize these massacres are the biggest threat to the gun rights they hold so dear?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> How about an honest, human response to this story?



That has been posted by most everyone. It is a tragedy. A heart breaking tragedy. 

But more gun control laws would not have prevented it.......


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



It is still true.

The biggest tragedy of todays massacre was her own guns being used against her and the children she loved


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## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

20 kindergarteners are dead and seven adults, including the shooters mother and all you give a shit about is gun control?  Heartless wonder.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...



one thing in common all were gun free zones.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...



The real problem here is once you give the state the power to tell people they can't own guns you also have to give them the power to enforce the law. Should we give the government the power to search people's homes without a warrant to make sure they do not have guns? Stop them while driving down the street in order to make sure they don't have guns? Maybe we should just give them the right to watch everything we do and ignore the idiots that think the constitution actually means something.

Or, maybe, you are the one not thinking things through.


----------



## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

how about we make a law that we do not prescribe anti-depressants to children and prescribe them only to adults  as a last resort under medical supervision ?..without question lives would be saved


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> 20 kindergarteners are dead and seven adults, including the shooters mother and all you give a shit about is gun control?



If that's what you want to believe..................


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Arthur said:
> 
> 
> > How about an honest, human response to this story?
> ...



Honestly Ollie

Haven't you had enough?  What would you like to see done to stop these massacres?


----------



## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...



all on anti-depressant medications...true story


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Arizona?


----------



## Missourian (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



As a law abiding gun owner,  she was disarmed by a gun free zone law...which stopped the shooter about as effectively as we told you it would...as in not at all.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> 20 kindergarteners are dead and seven adults, including the shooters mother and all you give a shit about is gun control?  Heartless wonder.



I care about a lot more than gun control, which is why I refuse to let idiots talk about it and then demand that I STFU because an idiot killed some children.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...



He did not have access to those firearms he took them
I really wished you would stop lying.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Arthur said:
> ...



No, he's only concerned about keeping his own fucking guns.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Arthur said:
> 
> 
> > 20 kindergarteners are dead and seven adults, including the shooters mother and all you give a shit about is gun control?  Heartless wonder.
> ...


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...



I think you are putting words into my mouth again.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

eots said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...


 
Really? Interesting aspect to explore for sure.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

Missourian said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Her house is a gun free zone?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



You are so right I am too. damn you gun free zone supporters I guess mass shooting aren't enough for you.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Missourian said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



She had to leave her guns to enter a gun free zone fuck wit.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

There has got to be some reflection. What we have been doing is not working. There needs to be some changes made.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

I can't believe some idiot on this thread thinks arming five year olds is the answer.

I don't like to name call, but that is the fucking dumbest suggestion I ever heard.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Am I? You want to have a serious discussion, but you don't have any stupid suggestions at all?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> There has got to be some reflection. What we have been doing is not working. There needs to be some changes made.



I have an idea, lets kill everyone. That will end all the shootings,


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

Let's throw away HALF OF OUR GUNS.


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## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> I can't believe some idiot on this thread thinks arming five year olds is the answer.



I cant believe we have a nation that thinks drugging 5yr olds is the answer but its grows more routine every year...just like school shoootings


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> How about an honest, human response to this story?


 
The are many such responses Arthur on theses threads.

How are you? I know you teach children this age.


----------



## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYC-EJ18IT0]3-year-old prescribed six psychotropic drugs in CPS&#39; care ~ 4th Report - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

eots said:


> Arthur said:
> 
> 
> > I can't believe some idiot on this thread thinks arming five year olds is the answer.
> ...



I agree.  I met a teacher who at the first trimester had already written off six kindergarteners as failures.

Who do you think the future shooters of kindergarteners will be?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

Here is a hypothetical question to test your sanity. 

If you had the ability to disarm this planet so that no human being is ever killed by gunfire again......would you do it?


----------



## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

7 out of 12 school shooters hopped up on psychotropic drugs 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WsMJVem0lQ]Confirmed German Shooter on Anti Depressants - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Here is a hypothetical question to test your sanity.
> 
> If you had the ability to disarm this planet so that no human being is ever killed by gunfire again......would you do it?


OK we disarm everybody including the governments of the world. What will we do with the body killed with swords knives bow and arrows clubs rocks and spears


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Arthur said:
> ...



If I had the answer to that would i be sitting here?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Fuck you sky


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



So, Do nothing is an acceptable response to you?

Aren't you sick of this shit?  Why must we always accept "nothing we can do about it" as an answer?


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

He's a heartless bastard.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



There goes that inability to comprehend again.... I never said there was nothing we could do about it. I said I don't know what to do about it....I'm sure you see the difference there.... I know what doesn't work..... Gun free zones obviously......


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Here is a hypothetical question to test your sanity.
> ...



Drat!  Foiled again by your superior intellect! You are just too clever for me. I never anticipated that someone would make that startlingly brilliant argument.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

All you care about is violence and being the one who inflicts it.  Being the big man gun owner.  

I guess you didn't get enough killing going to war, you have to get off on kindergarteners being murdered.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



There are functionally gun free countries where gun deaths are in the single digits annually. 

Will you admit that gun free zones are not NECESSARILY danger zones?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


One death by a firearm in a country that has gun restriction is just as bad as a mass shooting is for one reason their should not be any deaths by a firearm in a gun free country.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



OK....you can now bring your gun anywhere you want

How do you prevent a bunch of kindergartners from being executed?  When is enough going to be enough Ollie?

How do we keep guns away from crazy people?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



I responded with respect to your question maybe you should return in like.
So how will we stop the deaths with all those weapons I mentioned?


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Ollie doesn't care.  He's a heartless bastard more concerned about oiling his pistols and marching than 20 dead children.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Fuck you for thinking vets aren't haunted by any klling they did.

Self centered asshole.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Here is a hypothetical question to test your sanity.
> ...



This shooter killed 26 people in a matter of only a few minutes. Same with the Aurora theater mass murder. Same with every other mass murder. 

The murderer could not have killed that many people in such a very short few minutes if he had not had a gun.

We need to stop making excuses, stop making false comparisons with cars and doctors. It really is time we faced this, head on and pulled together to fight back against powerful lobbies. 

And, if the answer were more guns, we would have solved this long ago. 

We need to care more about our children's safety than we do the ongoing politically-motivated fighting. 

When our founding fathers wrote the second amendment, they did not defend mass murderers of children.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 14, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



There you go again! So smart I can hardly stand it.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

Fuck you.

I'm with 21 beautiful and innocent kindergarteners day after day week after week and YOU don't expect me to be grieving this tragedy?

Take your smug NRA attitude and shove it up your ass.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 14, 2012)

Our founding fathers also did not have in mind Glocks and Bushmasters.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Actually, Ollie is one of those on the right who do care

That is why I am asking him and not the others who only care about their precious guns


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Our founding fathers also did not have in mind Glocks and Bushmasters.



Nor did they have in mind computers radios TV OR SCIENTOLOGY
only those laws written on parchment and quell should be enforced 
and only certain religions would be protected by the first amendment.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



You are correct I am smart. but don't allow me to beat you up any further walk away.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Arthur said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



No, he's not.  He doesn't care.  He only cares about HIS right to kill others.


----------



## elvis (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Arthur said:
> ...



You really are a waste of skin.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



The are no longer any guns what's your plan to protect the weak from being slaughtered with a Machete that was the weapon of choice in Rwanda


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

Look, we all take this in a different way.  I've said things that aren't kind toward strangers who post here.

I'm grieving and I want to blame someone for this so gun owners come up for me.

At the same time, I know that talking to a bunch of anonymous strangers isn't the way to mourn.

I'll be at a staff Christmas party with my elementary school colleagues and we will put this tragedy in some kind of perspective together.

later.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 14, 2012)

57% of NRA members believe gun buyers should have to pass a background check. 

We spend almost $40Million a year on the more than 30 murders that are committed in the US every day, in addition to the mass killers. 

We need to stop making excuses why we can't mitigate this horrendous crime. We have given up before we've even tried. Since when does the US just give up and let our own be mowed down?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> 57% of NRA members believe gun buyers should have to pass a background check.
> 
> We spend almost $40Million a year on the more than 30 murders that are committed in the US every day, in addition to the mass killers.
> 
> We need to stop making excuses why we can't mitigate this horrendous crime. We have given up before we've even tried. Since when does the US just give up and let our own be mowed down?


You're the one making excuses. Now about those Machete's being the weapon of choice in Rwanda


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Never said they were. But putting up a sign saying gun free zone does not stop an idiot or a disturbed person with a gun.......


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 14, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



When one of the adults present could have cut the killing spree short by firing back?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



That's a concept the gun grabbers can't handle 
"we must protected the children from those lawfully armed teachers,"


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 14, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



More people are carrying guns than ever before but I have not been able to find even one case of a civilian taking down a mass murderer. 

In Tucson, there was a guy who said he had a gun but he stayed in the Walgreen's where he was buying cigs. There were unarmed women and one man who wrestled the gun away from Loughner. 

There's an article about an off-duty cop shooting a mass killer but in all the mass killings, where are the fantasy heroic civilians who kill the killer?


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> Look, we all take this in a different way.  I've said things that aren't kind toward strangers who post here.
> 
> I'm grieving and I want to blame someone for this so gun owners come up for me.
> 
> ...



Make a plan, be ever prepared.

Many of us won't seem like strangers soon Arthur.  Some of us you will like a lot and some you'll appreciate even though they disagree with you many times.  We are probably in opposite camps, but I do mourn with you.

God help this nation find a solution that makes this tragedy have a purpose and protect many children on the future.

I personally think the answer lies in separating mentally ill people from guns more often and quickly.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

I'm sick about this.  I never should have commented on it.


----------



## Arthur (Dec 14, 2012)

America's glorifying guns.  I blame this tragedy on you.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...





> More people are carrying guns than ever before but I have not been able to find even one case of a civilian taking down a mass murderer.


Only because a law abiding citizen would never carry a firearm into a gun free zone.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> America's glorifying guns.  I blame this tragedy on you.



I think you are being too specific.  Violence in general seems to be a theme in the US.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Here is a hypothetical question to test your sanity.
> 
> If you had the ability to disarm this planet so that no human being is ever killed by gunfire again......would you do it?



No


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> 57% of NRA members believe gun buyers should have to pass a background check.
> 
> We spend almost $40Million a year on the more than 30 murders that are committed in the US every day, in addition to the mass killers.
> 
> We need to stop making excuses why we can't mitigate this horrendous crime. We have given up before we've even tried. Since when does the US just give up and let our own be mowed down?



We didn't try? Are you trying to say there are no background checks on purchasing firearms?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 14, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You should look harder, I found four without even trying.

MISSISSIPPI GOTHIC - TIME
Again, Student Held In Slaying Andrew Wurst Is Accused Of Killing Edinboro, Pa., Teacher John Gillette And Wounding Three. - Philly.com
Three dead in shooting at Winnemucca bar - News - ReviewJournal.com
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/12/us/12brfs-GUNMANKILLED_BRF.html?fta=y&pagewanted=print&_r=0


----------



## Amelia (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> I'm sick about this.  I never should have commented on it.




Since you can't seem to stop yourself from saying horrible things about good people, I think you're right.


----------



## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



yet you agree that there needs to be something that would act to keep guns away from the mentally ill. i agree. i don't think it's unreasonable to think there should be basic protections.


----------



## jillian (Dec 14, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I guess the most deadly mass murder of school kids was in the 20s when someone set off 2-3 bombs in a school.
> 
> People who are pro-abortion probably aren't the people you want determining how to best defend children from attack. Just saying.



don't be a dumbass


----------



## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

jillian said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Wouldn't you think not giving children to drugs that increase the risk of suicide and homicide..might be a prudent step ?


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 14, 2012)

I give it till tomorrow then the progressive scumbags start blaming guns instead of the sick fuck who did it and then they will use this tragic event as a political hammer and we the people will be called evil for defending our rights.


----------



## eots (Dec 14, 2012)

> yet you agree that there needs to be something that would act to keep guns away from the mentally ill. i agree. i don't think it's unreasonable to think there should be basic protections.



You have doctors drugging healthy 3 yr olds and you want to trust them to decide gun ownership ??

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYC-EJ18IT0]3-year-old prescribed six psychotropic drugs in CPS' care ~ 4th Report - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Si modo (Dec 14, 2012)

Arthur said:


> Fuck you.
> 
> I'm with 21 beautiful and innocent kindergarteners day after day week after week and YOU don't expect me to be grieving this tragedy?
> 
> Take your smug NRA attitude and shove it up your ass.


Who said I don't expect your griveing this, retard?

But grieving by attacking another is indicative of a weak character with no morals.

Get a baseball bat and beat him to death because he has guns.  Then let us all know  the animal cruelty streak you have you fucking sociopath.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

I find it a little nauseating that everyone agrees that psychos shouldn't have guns..but get them anyway...and so the best way to protect children is to make sure the people taking care of them NEVER, under ANY circumstance, EVER have the wherewithal to actually STOP a bullet-spraying psycho.

Fucking weirdos. This is what comes of convincing yourselves that killing infants is for their own good. Now you actually believe that you should lay down your arms to protect them from people who want to turn them into hamburger.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Seriously. You act like overcrowded rats in a cage. They start eating each other, and it has nothing to do with being hungry.


----------



## Noomi (Dec 15, 2012)

The coward who shot himself, rather than face the consequences of his actions should rot in hell for the rest of eternity and get anal raped by the devil.

Sick fucker.


----------



## jan (Dec 15, 2012)

Noomi said:


> The coward who shot himself, rather than face the consequences of his actions should *rot in hell for the rest of eternity **and get anal raped by the devil.*
> 
> Sick fucker.



But...I bet that would be some hot sex!  

Sorry...yes I know...I warped!


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.

The people who have issues now are the ones who were sitting in the school while he wiped out the entire kindergarten class, and were powerless to do anything to stop him.

I'd have some serious guilt issues. I'll bet every adult survivor wished they had a gun while he was killing those babies.


----------



## Noomi (Dec 15, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.
> 
> The people who have issues now are the ones who were sitting in the school while he wiped out the entire kindergarten class, and were powerless to do anything to stop him.
> 
> I'd have some serious guilt issues. I'll bet every adult survivor wished they had a gun while he was killing those babies.



You know what I wish? That he was never able to get close to a gun in the first place.

Shooting a person does not prevent shootings.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Shut up, nitwit.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Yes, shooting people who are trying to shoot people certainly DOES prevent shootings, you irrevocably retarded loo.


----------



## Noomi (Dec 15, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Yes, shooting people who are trying to shoot people certainly DOES prevent shootings, you irrevocably retarded loo.



'Trying' to shoot people? No, before YOU shoot them, they have ALREADY shot innocent people. So shooting them doesn't prevent shootings at all, does it - because the gunman has already shot people, and so have you.

You idiot.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Moron.

So what if someone had shot this kid in the office?
What if the person who screamed on the intercom had had a gun, and shot him?

I think there wouldn't be 26 people dead. There'd only be 1 person dead.

So does that prevent shootings?

Why yes, yes it does. Now go back to resenting your dogs for not being grateful enough.


----------



## Noomi (Dec 15, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Moron.
> 
> So what if someone had shot this kid in the office?
> What if the person who screamed on the intercom had had a gun, and shot him?
> ...



Again, you would need to get close enough to the gunman to get a good shot, and you would also need to make sure that there were no civilians in the way before you fired. Or do you expect to just rise up and blindly fire the killing shot?


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Have you been in a school office?

You really have no understanding of guns at all, and should probably shut up.  I can put a serious hurt or kill a person without even really thinking about it up to 100 feet.
I doubt if the office was 100 feet across.


----------



## Ancient lion (Dec 15, 2012)




----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > It is really time to have a serious discussion about this issue. We have got to determine what factor(s) are contributing to this shit and do something about it. This is not a time to dig in your heels.
> ...



so now it's the NRA's fault 

SMH


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Noomi said:


> The coward who shot himself, rather than face the consequences of his actions *should rot in hell for the rest of eternity and get anal raped by the devi*l.
> 
> Sick fucker.


For once we agree.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



I'm sorry Ollie

But I can't buy into guns in schools with untrained teachers expected to make life and death decisions. It is hard enough for police to go into a situation with a deranged gunman and you are expecting a teacher to do it

I don't like the idea of guns being kept in schools with little children around. How long before a child figures out how to get at the teachers gun when it is unattended?  

We have 270 million guns in this country of 315 million. More guns is obviously not the answer


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.
> ...



It stops it at that point an time unless you are suggesting that zombies are carrying firearms now.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Actually, yes it is

NRA has been at the forefront of blocking any and all gun legislation. They used to be the leaders in gun safety, now they realize there is no money to be made in safety classes and make their money whipping the nation into a second amendment frenzy

Keep guns out of the hands of madmen NRA....it's not that hard


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...





> But I can't buy into guns in schools with untrained teachers expected to make life and death decisions.


No one that I know has suggested that. What has been suggested is train teachers in firearms by a state certified firearms instructor.



> I don't like the idea of guns being kept in schools with little children around. How long before a child figures out how to get at the teachers gun when it is unattended?


The child can't get to the firearm is the teacher is concealed carrying/ OPEN CARRY. That's one thing you are taught in firearms training, firearms awareness and how to prevent from being disarmed.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, shooting people who are trying to shoot people certainly DOES prevent shootings, you irrevocably retarded loo.
> ...



OK we have 25 people in a room enters a lone gunman starts shooting 15 of them, enters an armed citizen he shoots the gunman before he shoots victim number 16. Does shooting someone prevent more shootings? Yes I believe it would.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Moron.
> ...



I  really hate it when anti gun people try to tell someone how to use a firearm. Those who carry a firearm are trained I have many years of training.


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## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



It just gets worse doesn't it?

We have a hard enough time getting good teachers who know how to teach Johnny to read, now you want them trained in SWAT tactics on how to take out an armed assassin

Open carry in the classrooms?

Are you fucking nuts?


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > It's the price we pay for the entitlement culture, yes.
> ...



Trouble understanding the statement?  Nowhere did the poster even come close to implying that anyone was entitled to shoot people.


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## Ravi (Dec 15, 2012)

Missourian said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


She was killed in her home.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > syrenn said:
> ...



my dad told me a story of how he and his high school classmates would bring their shotguns to school so they could go hunting after school was over. they stacked the guns in the corner. late 1930's

No one got shot.

But it was a different day and age. Everyone knew each other and had some kind of connection whether through friends or family.

Nowadays people interact via computer on facebook and the internet. 

No personal contact. Human interaction is increasingly less personal.

Actually knowing a person makes it less likely to treat them as a disposable object. 

The good old days ,in some respects , were the good old days


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## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



I'm living proof you can teach Johnny to read AND operate a firearm safely and effectively. 

and no I'm not fucking nuts but I'm not too certain about you.


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## mal (Dec 15, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



rightwinger and ravir are REALLY shitty people who have been gleefully swimming in the blood of murdered children since the second the story broke yesterday...

If they had ANY Shame...



people...


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## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

Connery said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Actually, armed teachers is a pretty good precaution.
> ...



why not?


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> ...



how did "more guns" enter the picture?


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## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

sfcalifornia said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



I left the United States 16 years ago, and one of the reasons is because I do not want to raise my children with such a gun culture around. My wife and I have never regretted our decision, and shootings such as this reaffirm our decision.


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## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

bayoubill said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



When you see all of these senseless killings, how can you think that I am wrong?


----------



## notoriety (Dec 15, 2012)

I also agree that it is too late for gun control. there are just too many guns out there. you'd have to send policemen into every housefold to check every inch of every house for weapons and you still wouldn't find them all.


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## tjvh (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



Gun culture? Yup... Grandma's waving her .45 because someone just cut the line at the supermarket...  Get a grip. Wow... I do hope you protect your kids with numerous layers of bubble wrap every time you leave the house... Don't want those dangerous automobiles getting the best of them. You sound like a paranoid delusional freak. Newsflash: The World is full of murderers, and sometimes they commit evil acts against innocents... It's been happening long before we were around. I hope you find the strength to leave your house someday... It's a scary world out there. Your poor kids... Growing up in a family that lives in delusional fear. Odds are very good that your *more likely* to get killed by a drunk driver than a madman shooting a gun... Deal with it.


----------



## KissMy (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > The Infidel said:
> ...



The number does matter. That is why a responsible adult in the school needs to be armed. Otherwise they continue to get picked off. Wackos don't silently killed more children with a knife. That is because the rest of the kids scream & dial 911. They go for murderous speed like multiple guns, bombs, airliners, poison gas, etc. In order to kill as many as possible as fast as possible, before they get taken out or suicide.

A gun free zone is a magnet for the mass murdering shooters. Just like rental cars with logo stickers on them became magnets in Florida when they passed CCW laws. The Criminals figured only the tourist were un-armed. After the 1987 Florida CCW law passed an increasing number of tourists, most of them foreign, were victims of carjackings there. Because tourists in well-marked rental cars were common carjacking victims, Florida passed legislation in 1993 (F.S.A. § 320.0601) that outlawed company logos and license plates that made rental and leased cars obvious.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

KissMy said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



Fort hood also was a gun free zone. Also one death by a firearm is to many in a gun free zone. So yes the numbers do matter ONE IS TO MANY IN A GUN FREE ZONE.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



I would like to comment on your "gun culture" statement


I come from a rural and small town background.

My grandparents and uncles all had firearms and carried barlow pocket knives .They were tools used on farms, woodlots and around town. 

It certinly was part of the rural and small town culture. But......

No one shot anyone. No one stabbed anyone with their barlow pocket knife. everyone knew each other and did not blame others for their mistakes and did not shirk their responsibilites. 

There is a rabid contingent around USMB that refers to rural and small town people as Hillbillies. Hicks, racists and other insulting and ignorant epithets.

They laugh at "white suburbia in the 1950s"  Trust me. It was a better place then.
Unfortunately those days are gone. 

What do you have left?

The urban areas where no one even knows their next door neighbor and  there are those that what to do nothing more than shirk their responsibility and look for ways to live off the labors of others are increassing and winning national elections.

If you look at an election map the rural areas went red and the urban areas went blue. 

The rural gun culture you refer to is losing ground and the urban culture of greed and nastiness is taking over. 

Good luck America. yiou will need it.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Anyone who wants gun free zones are nuts. Why do you want unarmed people murdered?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



What anti gun people don't understand is they are supporting the same thing the KKK was in support of back in the late 19th century and early 20th century.


----------



## JOSweetHeart (Dec 15, 2012)

I believe that someone earlier in this chat said that the shooter took his own self out. If they did, they are definitely in the Devil's possession now. What I would like to know is that if his fate had been in the hands of someone, do you think that he should have been given the chance to repent before taking his final breath?

God bless you always!!!

Holly

P.S. That is another thing that I have thought about. How does the Lord feel about us putting people to death with they do stuff such as this? The only thing that right now comes to me is that the Lord did say this: *"Vengeance is mine."*


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 15, 2012)

You know, Reb....you might be right here. I have thought about it all night. It does seem that fewer people are killed in cases where everyone involved is armed with guns. In fact, I can't think of a single example of a scenario where people die in large numbers when every single one of them is armed.


----------



## tjvh (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



Oh, I think they know it very well. They are basically telling poor people that not only must they be held in place with finite Taxpayer funded incomes, they should *not* have the Right to defend themselves or protect what little they have either.


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



Then shut the fuck up about how we wish to live


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

What this is is not a gun problem... We have had guns for centuries. What this is is a culture problem.  Think about how much more violent we are now then we were 20, 30 years ago. No it isnt video games and movies or music it is the hippie parents. Makes me wonder if all the drugs taken by the baby boomers didn't fuck up our kids. Mental health seems to be growing like a virus all around us.


----------



## Luissa (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> What this is is not a gun problem... We have had guns for centuries. What this is is a culture problem.  Think about how much more violent we are now then we were 20, 30 years ago. No it isnt video games and movies or music it is the hippie parents. Makes me wonder if all the drugs taken by the baby boomers didn't fuck up our kids. Mental health seems to be growing like a virus all around us.



Nah, we just don't lock them up anymore. It is hard to commit someone now.


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

tjvh said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



These school shootings almost never happen outside of the United States. When you go into a restaurant in Europe there are no signs concerning who can bring firearms into the restaurant, because people do not carry them, do not need them. Go out into the world and look around before you start calling me names.


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## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



I am sorry that you fear my opinion.


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

Luissa said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > What this is is not a gun problem... We have had guns for centuries. What this is is a culture problem.  Think about how much more violent we are now then we were 20, 30 years ago. No it isnt video games and movies or music it is the hippie parents. Makes me wonder if all the drugs taken by the baby boomers didn't fuck up our kids. Mental health seems to be growing like a virus all around us.
> ...



I never thought about that......Interesting point


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## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



Really? 

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/25/world/europe/anders-behring-breivik-murder-trial.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


----------



## peach174 (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> What this is is not a gun problem... We have had guns for centuries. What this is is a culture problem.  Think about how much more violent we are now then we were 20, 30 years ago. No it isnt video games and movies or music it is the hippie parents. Makes me wonder if all the drugs taken by the baby boomers didn't fuck up our kids. Mental health seems to be growing like a virus all around us.



It is not just Americans, mental illnes is rising worldwide.
Omar Shahid: Why is Mental Illness on the Rise?
New findings from the European College of Psychopharmacology reports that 164.8 million Europeans - 38.2% of the population - suffers from a mental disorder.

Mental Illness on the Rise in the U.S. | Psychology Today

What would be the common denominator among people worldwide?
This is what we should be asking.
Maybe it's the mind altering drugs being give to our young? I don't know.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

Arthur said:


> Fuck you.
> 
> I'm with 21 beautiful and innocent kindergarteners day after day week after week and YOU don't expect me to be grieving this tragedy?
> 
> Take your smug NRA attitude and shove it up your ass.


Fuck you for thinking that vets are not haunted by any killings they did.  You pathetic excuse for a human.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 15, 2012)

What most led to these killings happening? Mental illness or legal guns? 

Israel and Switzerland make a gun license available on demand to every law-abiding adult. Both countries also allow CCW and yet both countries have low rates of homicide.

The Columbine killers violated around 20 firearms laws. So much for the rule of law. Murder is illegal but people still kill. Drugs are illegal but people still use and traffic them.

I think it is time to focus on what the common denominator is for these mass killings. Is it certain prescription drugs? The treatment and outpatient care of the mentally ill in general? The culture we live in? The lack of respect for life? All or some of the above?

People trying to blame guns with no concern it seems for cause, the motive, are truly shortsighted imo.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

elvis said:


> Arthur said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...





Arthur said:


> Look, we all take this in a different way.  I've said things that aren't kind toward strangers who post here.
> 
> I'm grieving and I want to blame someone for this so gun owners come up for me.
> 
> ...


I don't give a shit.  You lashed out at someone who didn't deserve a thing, and you lashed out in a very evil way.  The kindergratners you claim you hang with have more class and control over themsleves than you do.

You are a fucking bitch.  I don't give a shit if you had a bad day.  If you need to "take it out" on someone (quite an immature attitude and exactly what the fucking shooter did), go to the fucking gym and run for an hour or beat the punching bag.  See, that's what a grown up would do because most actually have a moral compass.

You are one of the meanest posters ever.

Fuck you.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

Still would like to know what his mother did to him to make him hate her so much.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Arthur said:
> ...



Now tell him how you really feel.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

jillian said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


Already exists.  No one who has been committed by a judge or others (involuntarily institutionalized) can own a gun.


----------



## RightNorLeft (Dec 15, 2012)

You cant ban guns and confiscate enough guns to stop the murderous intent of any nutjob.
Just like illegal drugs and illegal anything you want and have the money to pay for is always available in this country so will guns.
    Why is shooting up schools a relatively new phenomena, WHY...why didnt this happen with the same regularity as in the 1960s and 70s when there were just as many guns...Why has this mentality festered in our youth ?...you can try to take guns but if you leave TV, MOVIES, VIDEO GAMES and the INTERNET available to all...you will produce just as many nutjobs with murderous intent. Lets get real and stop the bullshit


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## Dreamy (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> Still would like to know what his mother did to him to make him hate her so much.



Only heard one neighbor/friend comments. Indicated she was maybe rigid. Not her exact word but something like that.

Reportedly she has not worked at the school lately, like a few years since her divorce. I can't understand why he went to that school to commit these crimes.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

Ancient lion said:


>


You know what?  I don't think he was really crying, either, but that doesn't matter.  The POTUS handled this with class, poise, and the correct words.  He did a great job.

So, please, don't bring him into this.


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

Hey I am sure if you ask nicely all the criminals will just give up their guns.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ancient lion said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



The correct words were to say we need to seriously talk about gun laws now?


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## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

notoriety said:


> I also agree that it is too late for gun control. there are just too many guns out there. you'd have to send policemen into every housefold to check every inch of every house for weapons and you still wouldn't find them all.


From 1973 to 2010, households with guns has gone from 50% to 30% (link posted earlier).  Less guns, more shootings?  Seems like it's not the guns' fault, here.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



A gun was in a place where he could get it.  That's "access".  

I realize you have a hard time with words. "Well-Regulated Militia" just sends you into a tizzy. 

If Conniticutt says you can't have a gun if you are a crazy person or under 21, just take Mom's!  And shoot her with them.  And her kids who were getting more attention than he was.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

I dont understand why progressives always blame the tool and not the person using the tool.....Do they really think people are not responsible for their actions? We made life cheap with abortions and euthanasia.....We have told kids for decades now that life is not sacred.


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



Bullshit, here in Michigan anybody over 18 can walk in and come out with 50 guns if they want, non CSO.


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## LilOlLady (Dec 15, 2012)

Guns don't kill until they fall into the hands people who do kill.

I am sick to death of hearing the *FoxNews rhetoric and spin they spew *for news about this tragedy.


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## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...


Fundamentally, what that poster is doing - lashing out on someone who did nothing to her - is no different than what the shooter did, except for the fact that Ollie is still alive.  Her mentality is just the same as the shooter's, though..


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## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


Thats a fucking lie.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 15, 2012)

The media loves to blame guns.

Maybe the media aids and breeds these mass killings to some degree? All the attention these 24/7 networks offer makes a deranged killer quite aware he will get the attention some of them crave or seek.


----------



## LilOlLady (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ancient lion said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



Obama did not start the killing of innocent men, women and children, it was Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld and other right wing radicals. Stop these crazies in the womb is the only way to stop these kind of killings.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


Poor little Muslim terrorist pig forgets that I lived in Michigan for 17 years.

You are lying.

It is a FEDERAL law that no one who has been involuntarily admitted to a looney bin can own a gun - part of the mandatory FBI background check in every state before ownership is allowed.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

I find it amusing that the gun-fetishist really think the solution to this problem would have been to give all the teachers guns.  

These would be the same teachers they don't trust with collective bargaining rights, whom they don't want teaching things like evolution or sex education to their kids. But dammit, they will totally trust these teachers to make a life or death decision. 

Consider the mindsets.  

Killer- Crazy person, been planning this for a long time.  Has absolutely no compunction about killing another human being.  Even a child.  

Teacher- Just trying to get through the day, biggest thing he was expecting to worry about was whether little Billy's parents gave him his Ritalin this morning like they were supposed to.  Like most normal people, would probably be hesitant to shoot another human being. 

You tell me which one is going to get a round off first.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 15, 2012)

LilOlLady said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ancient lion said:
> ...



So we should abort every pregnancy to make sure we get all the crazies?

Great strategy.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> LilOlLady said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



No what she sounds like she is suggesting is kill all conservatives parents unborn babies


----------



## LilOlLady (Dec 15, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> The media loves to blame guns.
> 
> Maybe the media aids and breeds these mass killings to some degree? All the attention these 24/7 networks offer makes a deranged killer quite aware he will get the attention some of them crave or seek.



Guns don't kill but they do play a role in hands of people who want to kill a lot of people. How else could he have killed 20 children is such a short time? This refuse do not deserve a burial, he should be thrown to the wolves t and buzzards to fertilize the forests.
Guns don't kill? Then Fast and Furious guns don't kill either and neither do the 200,000 guns lost in Iraq do not kill. Cannot stop crazies from killing but you can stop then from using guns to kill. Some how I don't believe this was a crazie at all. Some one pushed him over the edge and we are all living on the edge of insanity.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> I find it amusing that the gun-fetishist really think the solution to this problem would have been to give all the teachers guns.
> 
> These would be the same teachers they don't trust with collective bargaining rights, whom they don't want teaching things like evolution or sex education to their kids. But dammit, they will totally trust these teachers to make a life or death decision.
> 
> ...


WOW an idiot with no knowledge of  firearms thinks he has the solution and should dictate his version of gun control. Not in a million years would I have seen that one coming.


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



I live in Michigan right now, to have a carry license you need an FBI check you shithead. 

Not buy a weapon.


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## BecauseIKnow (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Non CSO means non carry, you need FBI checks for a carry license, as for buying you don't, it requires gun in trunk, magazine in glovebox.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> sfcalifornia said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



And stay out....I'm sure there are no criminals where you are...

Gun culture my ass......


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...


To buy a weapon as well you lying piece of  shit.


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > LilOlLady said:
> ...



Killing all the conservatives would be much easier if they couldn't defend themselves.


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Not for approval, for a check, that's it. You live in Florida you lying piece of shit. Don't come here and try to teach us what goes on here.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

LilOlLady said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > The media loves to blame guns.
> ...



Air planes don't kill either but they were used to kill over 3000 people one day not too long ago. Should we ban airplanes?
oh and a van was used in 1993 that killed six people and injured  1,042 at the same building that was hit with two airplanes.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 15, 2012)

LilOlLady said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > The media loves to blame guns.
> ...



Then it is time to find out what is making some people in society behave as they do. To blame the guns without truly having explored the cause of this behavior is shortsighted and not the answer to stopping this type of behavior.

This same apparently mentally ill man could have taken a vehicle and plowed into a huge group of children playing out in the schoolyard. Do you not see this truth?


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > I find it amusing that the gun-fetishist really think the solution to this problem would have been to give all the teachers guns.
> ...



Was in the army for 11 years, guy. Have fired the M16, M203, M2, M60, M1911A1, and knew how to field strip all of them.  Furthermore, my MOS was 76Y, which means that a large part of my job was small arms maintenance. 

And you know what, with all that gathered experience, if I were confronted with a crazy person going around shooting, I would probably hesitate just as long as any normal person would, more than enough time for a determined crazy person to shoot me.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 15, 2012)

If everyone would approach this from the position that what we have been doing is not acceptable and that we need to make some changes, we might be able to get somewhere. 

The mere existence of firearms is not the primary problem. Likewise, the lack of them in certain places is not the primary problem. It lies elsewhere. Focusing on the guns ( or lack of them ) is pointless.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > LilOlLady said:
> ...



The really bizarre thing is that she wants to stop killings of innocent children by killing innocent children.


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



Bullshit. Stop lying. I sam from Michigan and have bought guns there I know what they do. You are a lying cockbite.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Gun laws are like treating the symptoms of a condition rather than treating the causation. 

You don't just take an aspirin for a tumor.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> [
> 
> Air planes don't kill either but they were used to kill over 3000 people one day not too long ago. Should we ban airplanes?
> oh and a van was used in 1993 that killed six people and injured  1,042 at the same building that was hit with two airplanes.



Well, funny you should bring that up. 

There were a lot of CONTROLS on airplanes before that incident, and more controls were put into place AFTER that incident.  (For instance, we replaced minimum wage rent-a-cops with real professionals making sure no one was bringing weapons on board.) 

In short, we figured out what went wrong, and we tightened controls.  

That never happens with gun incidents, because Al Qaeda doesn't know how to game the system like the NRA does.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



On Thursday, one day before the tragedy in Connecticut where at least 29 people were killed at an elementary school, the Republican-controlled Michigan legislature passed a bill that would allow people to bring guns into schools.
Day Before Connecticut Shooting Massacre, Michigan Legislature Passed Bill Allowing Guns In Classrooms | ThinkProgress


----------



## jillian (Dec 15, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.
> 
> The people who have issues now are the ones who were sitting in the school while he wiped out the entire kindergarten class, and were powerless to do anything to stop him.
> 
> I'd have some serious guilt issues. I'll bet every adult survivor wished they had a gun while he was killing those babies.



why did a sick 20 year old have a gun?

most of these huge killing sprees are done with legal guns.

the adult survivors shouldn't wish they had a gun... they should wish he didn't.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



And you don't know your own laws..... it's so easy to look when you have the internet....

 Handguns

    Permit to purchase a handgun? Yes (*License to purchase - see below)

    Registration of handguns? Yes

    Licensing of owners of handguns? No

    Permit to carry handguns? Yes. Carrying concealed or openly in a motor vehicle requires a license.

Michigan Gun Laws - What are the Gun Laws in Michigan?

So becauseyoudon't know, look it up next time instead of passing on BS....


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 15, 2012)

Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools



> "We ask why there is violence in our schools, but we have systematically removed God from our schools," Huckabee said on Fox News. "Should we be so surprised that schools would become a place of carnage?"



What a vile man he is. He needs to go spend more time wit his good friend, Poopy Pants Nugent. 

Not just indefensible and stupid, it makes no sense. 

If its the fault of these kids not praying in school, then is it also the fault of the Aurora victims for not praying in the theater?


----------



## peach174 (Dec 15, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.
> ...




The kid shot his Mother in the face and stole her legally registered guns. That's how he got the guns.


----------



## Intense (Dec 15, 2012)

LilOlLady said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ancient lion said:
> ...



In fairness, I believe His tears were sincere. In fairness, I believe the killing of innocents began with Cain, not Bush. We need to better our Public School Education, It is rotting too many brains. Too many Zombies running around parroting Sound bites.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

as usual the Israelis are light years ahead of the entire world when it comes to security. always have always will


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Obama must be ether the luckiest SOB on the planet or the unluckiest. 

He wanted to stop drilling and we got the Gulf oil spill.

It was well known that he wanted to tackle private gun ownership after the election and now this happens.

I think the guy is bad news. 

Gay marriage, gun ownership, racism. 
We should be thinking about peace, prosperity, and goodwill to everyone but instead we're constantly at each others' throats over his pet issues. 

We need to stop this shit.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 15, 2012)

The victims were the ones who removed God from the schools?

Who knew?


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 15, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



It's true, I've been to gun stores as well and know people who buy guns, it's not as hard as you make it sound, that's not regulation. There should be a limit on how many guns one can have as well.


----------



## lovemymutts (Dec 15, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Mike Huckabee ,Now there is a poster child for birthcontrol. What a waste he is.


----------



## LilOlLady (Dec 15, 2012)

*"People turn to GOD's during tough times"* Same thing Obama said and he was attacked for, a priest on FOXNEWS is saying the very same thing and he is commended for it. *"People calling in and offering prayers"* *"Prayer vigils*"?????



> *Obama Was Right, People &#8216;Clinging To Their Guns And Religion&#8217; *
> http://conservativebyte.com/2012/06...t-people-clinging-to-their-guns-and-religion/
> *
> Paul Ryan: I'm 'happy' to be clinging to guns and religion*
> http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0812/79965.html


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 15, 2012)

Intense said:


> LilOlLady said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Soundbytes...ugh I know. As I said I think the media's potentially negative role in some of these killings need to be explored. Does their often excessive coverage of tragedies like this rattle around in the brain of the mentally ill in a way that causes more unstable people to choose to commit these acts. 

We can seek many potential causes for why these killings happen but to focus only on the weapons used is truly shortsighted and tunnel vision imo.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

LilOlLady said:


> *"People turn to GOD's during tough times"* Same thing Obama said and he was attacked for, a priest on FOXNEWS is saying the very same thing and he is commended for it. *"People calling in and offering prayers"* *"Prayer vigils*"?????



praise the lord and pass the ammo


----------



## Intense (Dec 15, 2012)

Link on Michigan Gun Laws.

*Purchase*
No permit is required for the purchase of a rifle or shotgun.

No rifle, shotgun or handgun may be sold to a minor under 18 years of age, a convicted felon, or a person under indictment.

To purchase a handgun from either a dealer or private individual, the buyer must obtain a license to purchase from the chief of police if the buyer lives in a city, or the county sheriff if he lives in an area without an organized police department.

The buyer must be 18 years of age, a U.S. citizen, a resident of Michigan, have no felony conviction, have never been adjudged insane (unless later restored by court order), and score 70 percent on a basic pistol safety review questionnaire.

The license to purchase must be filled out in triplicate at the time of purchase. The license shall include a description of the handgun sold and the signatures of both the buyer and seller. The seller may retain one copy and the buyer retains the other two.

After purchase and delivery of the handgun is completed, the buyer must return the license to purchase along with the purchased handgun, unloaded and encased or trigger locked, to the local licensing (law enforcement) authority within 10 days.

The buyer (licensee) will then be issued a safety inspection certificate (registration) for the handgun. One copy of the license will be held by the local authority for six years and the remaining copy shall be forwarded to the Commissioner of State Police.

The license, once issued, becomes void if not used within 10 days. A valid Michigan CCW holder is exempt from license to purchase requirement, however is still subject to the registration requirements and a criminal background (NICS) check. 

Michigan Gun Laws - What are the Gun Laws in Michigan?


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

The problem with gun violence isn't that so many have them rather that we see the glorification of gun violence in film constantly. 

If Hollywood really believes something needs to be done then they can start by not producing movies that have gun welding criminals fighting gun welding good guys. Where do you think all of these nut cases got the idea from in the first place?


----------



## ERGO (Dec 15, 2012)

*School shooter Adam Lanza likely on meds; labeled as having personality disorder*

*Gun control? We need medication control!*

*In mass shootings involving guns and mind-altering medications, politicians immediately seek to blame guns but never the medication.* Nearly every mass shooting that has taken place in America over the last two decades has a link to psychiatric medication, and it appears today's tragic event is headed in the same direction.

*According to ABC News, Adam Lanza, the alleged shooter, has been labeled as having "mental illness" and a "personality disorder." **These are precisely the words typically heard in a person who is being "treated" with mind-altering psychiatric drugs.
*

*One of the most common side effects of psychiatric drugs is violent outbursts and thoughts of suicide.
*

*The Columbine High School shooters were, of course, on psychiatric drugs at the time they shot their classmates in 1999.* Suicidal tendencies and violent, destructive thoughts are some of the admitted behavioral side effects of mind-altering prescription medications.

No gun can, by itself, shoot anyone. It must be triggered by a person who makes a decision to use it. And while people like NY Mayor Bloomberg are predictably trying to exploit the deaths of these children to call for guns to be stripped from all law abiding citizens who have done nothing wrong whatsoever, nobody calls for medication control.

source link: Gun control? We need medication control! Newton elementary school shooter Adam Lanza likely on meds; labeled as having 'personality disorder'

*Former FBI Informant: Obama will Destroy America Once He Has All The Guns*

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=1ESiUYg40d4]Former FBI Informant: Obama will Destroy America Once He Has All The Guns - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 15, 2012)

We've systematically removed God from more than the schools.  We've removed God from everything.  God has been replaced by the idea that everyman is God, which made Adam Lanza his own God.  Now Adam Lanza has become the victim that no one dare blame.  

We have a serious problem, not with guns, with mental illness.   They aren't just like everyone else.  It's not wrong to identify them and remove them.


----------



## PredFan (Dec 15, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> The victims were the ones who removed God from the schools?
> 
> Who knew?



Luddy is a dumb fuck.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...





> For instance, we replaced minimum wage rent-a-cops with real professionals making sure no one was bringing weapons on board.



Really professionals or professional pedophiles?
Report: TSA hires thieves, pedophiles - Action News 5 - Memphis, Tennessee
I don't think so.
OH and by the way when did the underwear bomber get captured even though his father had notified the authorities about his son? How did he get on the plane?


----------



## bodecea (Dec 15, 2012)

I read this somewhere else here...what about the Amish shooting?   Don't think they'd removed god from their school.

Furthermore, if they had a prayer everyday in the schools that had this happen, how would it have protected them?

In other words, Huckabee is a pandering moron.  Enough said.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 15, 2012)

The, you need to regulate gun purchases because a third party can STEAL your gun and use it, argument is not very bright.

Guns aren't and should not go away.

If a person wants to use a gun they will:

1. Buy them.
2. Steal them.
3. Make them.  (didn't think about that did you?)


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 15, 2012)

Intense said:


> Link on Michigan Gun Laws.
> 
> *Purchase*
> *No permit is required for the purchase of a rifle or shotgun.*
> ...



Exactly.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



good riddance I say.

Look at my sig


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Where's zeke.......he wanted to shoot any non-union advocate that got in his way last week.


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 15, 2012)

Mayor Bloomberg is surrounded by armed guards.   He's like Dianne Feinstein who wants gun control, except for the piece she carries 24/7.  

What would go a long way to putting an end to this kind of carnage is to stop with the absurd idea that there is nothing wrong with the mentally ill that a little medication wouldn't fix.   Mainstream them.  Don't take away their rights.   Accommodate them instead.  Don't humiliate them by saying they are mentally ill.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Obama must be ether the luckiest SOB on the planet or the unluckiest.
> 
> He wanted to stop drilling and we got the Gulf oil spill.
> 
> ...



again, you'd never have had to deal with Obama to start with if you guys hadn't been so greedy.  

You did this to yourselves...  

But let's put this in perspective.  It wasn't like his first term was absent tragedies involving the combination of crazy people and guns.  We had plenty. And by and large, Obama gave those a pass because his own party has been gun-shy about these kinds of crisis. 

Clinton would be out making statements about gun tragedies before the shooting stopped! 

Obama has been reluctant to do so, until now.  This is simply just too big to ignore. 

Frankly, though, I have doubts even this tragedy will move gun control all that much.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

Intense said:


> Link on Michigan Gun Laws.
> 
> *Purchase*
> No permit is required for the purchase of a rifle or shotgun.
> ...



"No permit is required for the purchase of a rifle or shotgun." especially in Detroit


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Rat in the Hat said:
> ...



In her twisted demented mind conservatives parents unborn baby's are guilty by association.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 15, 2012)

ERGO said:


> *School shooter Adam Lanza likely on meds; labeled as having personality disorder*
> 
> *Gun control? We need medication control!*
> 
> ...



Don't know about all these links but I will say that I am much more troubled by the prescription drugging of children than I am of legal gun ownership. I have never done a check on all the common ground these drugs have in these shootings but I am definitely concerned about the over-prescription of some drugs. 

I knew of a little rambunctious toddler(one I would call normal) now a 6 year old placed on certain psychotropic drugs in order to alter his "behavior".  His behavior seemed like the behavior of many children. His behavior now that he is under the care of a doctor and is taking these drugs is troubling.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



a gun free zone is an area where an armed criminal can do their thing without fear of reprisal.


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 15, 2012)

The left protects children.   After all didn't they stop kids from attending a Charlie Brown play.  That's got to be more important than embarrassing some crazy guy from shooting up an elementary school.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Indefensible?
How many school shootings did they have when they had school prayer everyday the first thing in the morning?


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> The left protects children.   After all didn't they stop kids from attending a Charlie Brown play.  That's got to be more important than embarrassing some crazy guy from shooting up an elementary school.



Not sure what the logic here is, exactly.  

Are you saying that if they let the kids watch the corny Charlie Brown play, that would have stopped the guy in another state from takng his mothers guns and shooting up a school?


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> luddly.neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools
> ...



What's really amusing is that he thinks the victims were the ones who had God removed from the schools.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Terrorist love gun-free zones.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> luddly.neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools
> ...



Most public schools never had school prayer in the morning.  It was only a few communities that still did when the SCOTUS said it was unconstitutional to do so.  

So a court decision 50 years ago is relevent, but the fact mom had a small arsenal lying around the house with her crazy son who still lived at home didn't constitute "access".   

What the hell are you smoking?


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Obama must be ether the luckiest SOB on the planet or the unluckiest.
> 
> He wanted to stop drilling and we got the Gulf oil spill.
> 
> ...



Good point.   obama is just very clever about getting what he wants.   He knows how to engineer circumstances.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> The left protects children.   After all didn't they stop kids from attending a Charlie Brown play.  That's got to be more important than embarrassing some crazy guy from shooting up an elementary school.



I think removing the insanity in politics would go a long way towards ending some of the more recent gun violence.


----------



## bodecea (Dec 15, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> We've systematically removed God from more than the schools.  We've removed God from everything.  God has been replaced by the idea that everyman is God, which made Adam Lanza his own God.  Now Adam Lanza has become the victim that no one dare blame.
> 
> We have a serious problem, not with guns, with mental illness.   They aren't just like everyone else.  It's not wrong to identify them and remove them.



How has removing god caused this?

How would replacing god stop this?

Please be specific with your answers.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Jamie Foxx joked about killing white people last Saturday night. It was cool then.


----------



## wavingrl (Dec 15, 2012)

I'll leave it to greater minds to officially sort this out but I don't think 'more gun control', 'more mental health intervention' or any of the usual solutions would apply to preventing a situation like this.

?? 'If' he was suffering from a personality disorder/unspecified and/or autism from my meager understanding it sounds like he fixated on 'a thought/feeling' and then developed a plan and took action. 

This sort of thing seems to fall into beyond mortal control. 

Maybe someone else will have more pragmatic ideas.

How this doesn't happen even more frequently--that is what I am wondering right now.


----------



## Luddly Neddite (Dec 15, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Obama must be ether the luckiest SOB on the planet or the unluckiest.
> ...



I will never understand how anyone can politicize the mass murder of 20 little children and 7 adults. Really, I don't want to understand how anyone can use those deaths to further their agenda of hate and fear for something that does not exist.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



you lefties started to politicize the tragedy with posts 4 and 5


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> luddly.neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



Yeah, why does so much gun violence happen on school grounds?

Maybe they need to make schools illegal.


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Jamie Foxx joked about killing white people last Saturday night. It was cool then.



It was also cool when union thugs in Michigan threatened to kill Rick Snyder's daughter.   

These mass shootings have happened in the same kind of areas, Oregon, Aurora, Colorado, Newtown Connecticut.  All areas mostly white and liberal.    All perpetrated by someone well known to be mentally ill who has not had contact with anyone for months.

The common denominator isn't the guns, otherwise they'd be happening in Watts, Oakland, and the slums of the Bronx where guns are MUCH more prevalent than in these whitebread communities.   The common denominator isn't the mentally ill perpetrators.   There are mentally ill people on the streets all the time.  The common denominators are the chosen victims.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Jamie Foxx joked about killing white people last Saturday night. It was cool then.
> ...



Black on black crime doesn't make for good headlines.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

All of the shootings that take place around Obama's home in Chicago don't even get a squeak from the mainstreamers.


----------



## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

Is some of the staff had a gun the shooter may have been stopped.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

I wonder how many Syrians have died since Obama decided that Assad has to go. 

Of course they never gave one rebel any guns or training.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

CMike said:


> Is some of the staff had a gun the shooter may have been stopped.



Having a gun and knowing how to use it are two different things. 

Guess we need to turn our schools into prisons.


----------



## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

The shooter got the guns from his mother.

This has nothing to do with background checks or keeping guns from the mentally ill.


----------



## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > Is some of the staff had a gun the shooter may have been stopped.
> ...



Of course they should know how to use it.

We should have some people there who can defend the children.


----------



## novasteve (Dec 15, 2012)

I'm curious will the usual liberal suspects complain about the prayer vigils being held?


----------



## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

Notice how the police came after it was over.


----------



## Zoom (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > The left protects children.   After all didn't they stop kids from attending a Charlie Brown play.  That's got to be more important than embarrassing some crazy guy from shooting up an elementary school.
> ...



Dammit.  I knew it.  I knew somehow this was obama's fault.


----------



## Zoom (Dec 15, 2012)

novasteve said:


> I'm curious will the usual liberal suspects complain about the prayer vigils being held?



Because crucifix's are appropriate  here.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



You must be seeing things. I don't see Obama anywhere in my post. 

However somebody did politicize this somewhere around post number 4.


----------



## Zoom (Dec 15, 2012)

It's fucking sickening how you idiots are making this about obama.   Damn.  When this shooter turns out to be a fox loving, Glenn beck spouting rush supporter, will you make it about politics then?  Stfu you heartless right wing idiots.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

CMike said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...



I think we need to do something about the causes not just try to prevent the effects.


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Zoom said:


> It's fucking sickening how you idiots are making this about obama.   Damn.  When this shooter turns out to be a fox loving, Glenn beck spouting rush supporter, will you make it about politics then?  Stfu you heartless right wing idiots.



Fuck you asshole. Chances are he isn't even political. 


He probably saw a movie or played a video game that gave him the idea.


----------



## Zoom (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> All of the shootings that take place around Obama's home in Chicago don't even get a squeak from the mainstreamers.


Mudwhistle....oh yeah.  You never mentioned obama.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Zoom said:


> It's fucking sickening how you idiots are making this about obama.   Damn.  When this shooter turns out to be a fox loving, Glenn beck spouting rush supporter, will you make it about politics then?  Stfu you heartless right wing idiots.



Try as you may the left from what I can remember from any shooting in the past have tried their damnedest from the beginning of the shooting to pin it on the right wing.
However this is the first shooting I haven't heard that from the left.


----------



## Zoom (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > It's fucking sickening how you idiots are making this about obama.   Damn.  When this shooter turns out to be a fox loving, Glenn beck spouting rush supporter, will you make it about politics then?  Stfu you heartless right wing idiots.
> ...



Then why are YOU making this about politics.  Fucking hack.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 15, 2012)

Zoom said:


> mudwhistle said:
> 
> 
> > All of the shootings that take place around Obama's home in Chicago don't even get a squeak from the mainstreamers.
> ...



Where does he say the shootings were Obama's fault?

Be specific.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > luddly.neddite said:
> ...



Or children...

Soon.


----------



## mal (Dec 15, 2012)

Zoom said:


> novasteve said:
> 
> 
> > I'm curious will the usual liberal suspects complain about the prayer vigils being held?
> ...



Anything else you'd like to allow?... 



peace...


----------



## Harper (Dec 15, 2012)

A lot of angry people are going to look at both extremes in this situation in order to push their agenda. Hard core conservatives will demand less gun control so that good citizens can assist in taking down a gunman and hard core liberals will demand that guns be dramatically regulated and reduced so that guns won't commit crimes anymore.

The fact of the matter is that if a bat shit crazy psycho wants to kill people then he will find a way and there's not a lot of ways to preemptively stop something like that. I do think that it should be tougher for someone to buy and own a gun and that the background check should include mental history but there would be so much red tape around that and probably law suits too. The best we can do is teach kids that violence is not the answer, keep a close eye on kids and young adults that show sons of trouble and be proactive in finding them help, and teaching and demanding gun owners be more responsible with how they collect and store their guns.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It's his religion, are you against a man making a statement based upon his religion?

I'm not, whether i agree or not........


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > sfcalifornia said:
> ...



First if all, I will go anywhere that I damn please. Second, I live in a country with very strict gun laws. The only gun killings that you hear about are criminals killing other criminals.


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



Are you really this thick?


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

To think all of the children that could be alive today...............

























...............if it weren't for abortion.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...




So when you outlaw guns only criminals have guns....And they would never use them on the unarmed populace...BullShit............What country are you living in,  Fantasia?


----------



## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



I'm glad you left bye bye


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



I don't believe that for one second.


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



For the most part, the police do not even carry firearms.


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

CMike said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



You are not near as glad as I am.


----------



## bodecea (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> luddly.neddite said:
> 
> 
> > Mike Huckabee: Newtown Shooting No Surprise, We've 'Systematically Removed God' From Schools
> ...



He can speak about it all he wants...and we can point out that he's an idiot all we want too.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> So when you outlaw guns only criminals have guns....And they would never use them on the unarmed populace...BullShit............What country are you living in,  Fantasia?



So how is it that countries that have tough gun laws have so few gun deaths.  

Murders with firearms statistics - countries compared - NationMaster Crime

 4  	  United States:	9,369 

11  	  Germany:	269 	
14  	  Canada:	144 	
28  	  Japan:	47


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

Seems to me that so much violence takes place in gun-free zones.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

Liberals say controlling guns is the answer. Controlling alcohol and drugs havent worked. What makes liberals think controlling guns will?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

bodecea said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > luddly.neddite said:
> ...




You got that right....Still why get on someone because of their religion? I could care less what a man's religion is as long as they aren't forcing it down my throat......


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

namvet said:


> Liberals say controlling guns is the answer. Controlling alcohol and drugs havent worked. What makes liberals think controlling guns will?



Guns would be a lot easier to control. 

Just regulate the manufacture of them and the sales.  

Frankly, the rest of the world does this just fine.  But they don't have the plague of an NRA, which I'm sure is working overtime this weekend on how to spin this.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > So when you outlaw guns only criminals have guns....And they would never use them on the unarmed populace...BullShit............What country are you living in,  Fantasia?
> ...



Yes, now if you could take that chart and place it into percentage per 100,000 people so that we could actually get a more fair comparison.....


----------



## mudwhistle (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> bodecea said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



It's because of our clinging to our guns and our religion.

Obama sure talks like a Christian....don't he?


----------



## bodecea (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> To think all of the children that could be alive today...............
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ah, mudwhistle never met a tragedy he didn't like..........to use.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



We'd still look pretty awful.  

Japan has a population of 126 Million compared to 308 million for the US.  So if there were as many Japanese as Americans... they'd be up to a whopping 115 gun deaths compared to our 9000.   

In fact, when a Japanese teenager was shot because some redneck thought he was attacking his house, (the kid simply got the wrong address to a Haloween party), Japanese people were absolutely shocked at the pure stupidity of it.  

Not that you could blame them.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


We're number 14

Overall homicide rate > per 100,000 pop. (most recent) by country
Gun Violence homicides statistics - countries compared - Nation Master


----------



## JOSweetHeart (Dec 15, 2012)

CMike said:


> Notice how the police came after it was over.


How many more people would be dead if they never came at all?

God bless you always!!!

Holly

P.S. I just saw on the TV that the guy forced his way into that school. If he wasn't able to get in there quietly, couldn't something have been done about him right then and there or did he shoot those who may have tried to take him down when he first got in?


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> namvet said:
> 
> 
> > Liberals say controlling guns is the answer. Controlling alcohol and drugs havent worked. What makes liberals think controlling guns will?
> ...



Guns would be a lot easier to control ??  ever hear of the black market???


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



And the 13 countries ahead of us are places like South Africa and Thailand where poverty and criminality are rampant.  

Meanwhile, to find your first industrialized G-7 country, you have to go down to #29 for Germany.  

Other countries have such few gun deaths, they don't even rate.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

So at 9.1 per 100,000 we are way under the average of 16.1 per 100,000.......

I wonder how far that would drop if we cut out all the gang/drug related killings.....


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

namvet said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > namvet said:
> ...



Um... yeah.  

And you know what, again, countries without widespread gun ownership don't have as many murders as we do.  

Will we eliminate ALL gun deaths? Nope.  

Will we greatly reduce them? You Betcha! 

Because a gun in the house is 43 times more likely to kill someone in the house than a bad guy...


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



You mean like our inner cities where most of these gun deaths occur?

Guess how many gun deaths we've had in my town in ten years......ZERO, unless you count one suicide.......


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> So at 9.1 per 100,000 we are way under the average of 16.1 per 100,000.......
> 
> I wonder how far that would drop if we cut out all the gang/drug related killings.....



And if we got rid of all the rednecks who shoot each other over who got the last sausage link, we could drop that number further.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



And here we go with the "inner city" and other racial dog whistles...

That didn't take long at all.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



The sign of surrender go below the belt with you're a racist attack when it never happened.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > So at 9.1 per 100,000 we are way under the average of 16.1 per 100,000.......
> ...



Another sign of the defeated name calling when it not warranted.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> namvet said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



so you prefer to be carried by six than judged by 12 ???


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Given the history of you guys to use racist remarks, it's not a high threshold.  

"Inner City".  "Gangs"


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

namvet said:


> [
> 
> so you prefer to be carried by six than judged by 12 ???



I prefer to not live in a place where crazy people can get easy access to guns.  

if the "responsible gun owners" can't police that or don't want to, then it's pretty much everyone out of the pool, as far as I'm concerned...


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Dumb ass now maybe we should explore how those people in those countries were killed?
Since the link is a separate link from gun deaths those countries lead the U.S. by killing people with things other than a firearm.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Given the history of you guys to use racist remarks, it's not a high threshold.
> 
> "Inner City".  "Gangs"


More "code".  

But, being the racist you are, you assume gangs are just a single race.  News flash, moron:  MS-13 aren't black.  Skinheads aren't black either.

Fucking racist.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> namvet said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



and you live in Chicago??? LMFAO !!!!!


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Given the history of you guys to use racist remarks, it's not a high threshold.
> ...



Ever notice how fast they run like scalded dogs when someoen calls them out on their dog-whistles... 

I have.


----------



## JOSweetHeart (Dec 15, 2012)

namvet said:


> Liberals say controlling guns is the answer. Controlling alcohol and drugs haven&#8217;t worked. What makes liberals think controlling guns will?


To me that won't work because people who don't care about gun control laws *will* find a way to get what they want no matter what it takes.

God bless you always!!!

Holly


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Given the history of you guys to use racist remarks, it's not a high threshold.
> 
> "Inner City".  "Gangs"



you are the only one in this thread that mentioned race

race card rom Joe once again


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

namvet said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > namvet said:
> ...



Yes, I do.  One of the great cities in this country, thank you.  

And frankly, no worse than the rest of the country as far as too easy access to guns.  

They tried to ban guns, and the gun sellers just set up shop in mobbed up suburbs like Cicero.  

It's why a NATIONAL gun law is needed.


----------



## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

JOSweetHeart said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > Notice how the police came after it was over.
> ...



Zero since he shot himself.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Given the history of you guys to use racist remarks, it's not a high threshold.
> 
> "Inner City".  "Gangs"



WTF? Now that is racist to think only blacks are gang members.


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 15, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


> Seems to me that so much violence takes place in gun-free zones.



I find it amazing that there is such a thing as a gun free zone in a civilized country.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Given the history of you guys to use racist remarks, it's not a high threshold.
> ...



So you think if you just use the "code words" like "Welfare" and "Gangs", that makes it okay,then?  

Really?  

Ollie tried to imply that our gun violence wouldn't be so bad if we just took those "inner city" people who get killed out of the mix.  Because they don't count. Somehow.  Draw your own conclusions.  

Let's just say, I wouldn't have wanted to be a black guy in his platoon.  Or in his platoon at all. 

Fact is, we don't have a race problem. We have a gun problem. We have too many guns, they are too easy to get. 

Period.  

Again, the rest of the world has figured this out. At least the wealthy countries.  This ain't fucking brain surgery.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> namvet said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Right gun dealers take to the streets to sale their firearms
You lying sack of shit

Hundreds of guns stolen from Des Plaines gun shop; four teens charged - Chicago Sun-Times


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Learning gun safety and going to a target range to plink targets is a lot different than facing an armed assassin who s ready to die. Many police are not qualified in SWAT tactics. Do you think teachers can be?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


You are the problem with America. You and those like you are the true enemy and should be dealt with.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > namvet said:
> ...



actually yes they do. they nailed some kid here that drove around with guns for rent. just bring it back when your done


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



I have been qualified in the past so yes they can.
While in the Air Force I was a member of the EST


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > namvet said:
> ...



They don't have to.  The various crooks just walk into their stores. 

Study: Suburban shops main source of guns in Chicago crime - Chicago Tribune



> A new study on guns seized by Chicago police shows that suburban gun shops are a main source of guns used in crimes in the city.
> 
> The research shows that some 29 percent of the guns recovered on Chicagos streets between 2008 and the end of March were bought in the Cook County suburbs. Lake County, Ind., was the second largest source, accounting for six percent of the weapons, and other counties surrounding Chicago  including Lake County, Ill., and Will, DuPage and Kane counties  were also in the top 10 sources.
> 
> *Two gun stores in suburban Lyons and Riverdale accounted for more than 10 percent of the guns recovered.*


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Ever notice how fast they run like scalded dogs when someoen calls them out on their dog-whistles...
> ...



No, the real problem are dumb-ass white trash who side with the plutocrats because you think you can stay one-step above minorities... 

Just not very bright, overall.  

But you are clinging to your gun and your bible, that's for sure.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

namvet said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Some "KID" was he a licensed gun dealer or a petty thief?


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...





yes.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You are what you and and are the reason America is heading down the shit hole.
Fucking trash has more use than scum like you.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> You are what you and and are the reason America is heading down the shit hole.
> Fucking trash has more use than scum like you.



Guy, I realize this is a horrible weekend for you and all, as all your silly beliefs about guns just got dashed on the rocks... but you really need to take a chill pill.  

Not my fault you cling to a philosophy that has been proven false.


----------



## namvet (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> namvet said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



neither. a businessman. supply and demand. BTY he was black.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



why do you believe it's alright to use the term "white trash" ?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You are a lying sack of shit
oh so it';s the gun dealers fault because they followed the steps but the buyers sold the gun illegally?



> He knows men whose full-time job in the underground economy is to buy guns from suburban stores and illegally sell them to criminals.


You truely do live in a fucked up city. Know god damn wonder obama lived their. He found an untapped well of stupid people.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> why do you believe it's alright to use the term "white trash" ?



Because it perfectly describes the gun-toting, bible thumping morons who keep putting the Republicans back into office... and voting against their own self-interest.  

"I hates them welfare people! Has the disability check shown up yet, honey?"


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You are a racist piece of shit I would not have wanted you in my squad.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > why do you believe it's alright to use the term "white trash" ?
> ...





you are so full of racial stereotypes today aren't you. 

In other news.......


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > why do you believe it's alright to use the term "white trash" ?
> ...



My self interest is to get rid of scum like you.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...


It's nothing new with obama supporters they have always been this way.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

Noomi said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, shooting people who are trying to shoot people certainly DOES prevent shootings, you irrevocably retarded loo.
> ...



By that logic, police should just wait at the station until people come in and surrender.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Train them.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> What most led to these killings happening? Mental illness or legal guns?
> 
> Israel and Switzerland make a gun license available on demand to every law-abiding adult. Both countries also allow CCW and yet both countries have low rates of homicide.
> 
> ...



Let me see, the last two shootings involved guns that were obtained illegally, and at least one of the shooters was mentally ill.


Gee, you might have a point.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> You know what?  I don't think he was really crying, either, but that doesn't matter.  The POTUS handled this with class, poise, and the correct words.  He did a great job.
> 
> So, please, don't bring him into this.



I almost agree with that, he actually called for meaningful action during his blathering, which tells me it was all about the politics.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



He killed the legal owner of the guns, so that proves he had access.

Want to explain that logical failure?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Liar.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

LilOlLady said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > You know what?  I don't think he was really crying, either, but that doesn't matter.  The POTUS handled this with class, poise, and the correct words.  He did a great job.
> ...



Obama is the one that is using drones in countries Bush never fired a shot in.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



joe has no logic just straw man and obama shit stain on his upper lip.


----------



## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > why do you believe it's alright to use the term "white trash" ?
> ...



Is that OKTexas?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



I can top that, you can't even buy a gun if you are under indictment in Michigan.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Police trained in SWAT tactics have years of experience and operate as a team in full body armor

You expect a second grade teacher to take out an armed assassin with her .38?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> I find it amusing that the gun-fetishist really think the solution to this problem would have been to give all the teachers guns.
> 
> These would be the same teachers they don't trust with collective bargaining rights, whom they don't want teaching things like evolution or sex education to their kids. But dammit, they will totally trust these teachers to make a life or death decision.
> 
> ...



Every time I think you have gotten as stupid as you can get you do something to prove me wrong.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



Still lying.


----------



## bayoubill (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



you wanna deny her the chance to do it...?


eta: head-up-the-ass elitest libs make me wanna take 'em home and try to show 'em the real world...


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



Doesn't matter, you cannot buy a handgun without a license, even if you have no plans to carry it.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



how long will it take the SWAT team to get there?

I would use my .357

that should do it.

BTW all teachers are not female and not all females are as pussy as you


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



Michigan Gun Laws - What are the Gun Laws in Michigan?


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...



You should not even be allowed to be armed let alone protect young children


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



We did? When did we do that? 

Wait, you are talking about the TSA, the people that think 12 year old girls in wheelchairs are terrorist threats because they use hand cream.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...



You should not even be allowed to be armed


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.
> ...



Because he killed his mother and stole them. We obviously need laws that prevent sick people from killing people and then stealing their guns.

Wait...


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



I would say that you should not be allowed to own testicles but there is no need


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Come a git'em bitch
I have mine and will continue to have them


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Intense said:
> 
> 
> > Link on Michigan Gun Laws.
> ...



He just proved you wrong, idiot.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



He doesn't have any he gave to up to be a girly man for obama.


----------



## bayoubill (Dec 15, 2012)

a tune for the elitest we-know-what's-best-for-you contingent... 

you ain't gettin' the guns from the good citizens of this country without a nation-rending fight...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo8s5fuSwo8]Jane Child - Welcome To The Real World - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## bayoubill (Dec 15, 2012)

and another...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc3IEdllaxc]Tina Turner One Of The Living - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

Why do these people keep thinking their guns are going to get taken away? This is bordering on the psychotic.


----------



## freedombecki (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> Why do these people keep thinking their guns are going to get taken away? This is bordering on the psychotic.


Good afternoon, Mr. Brunswick. I just got here, but it could be a reaction to 15 threads yesterday to ban guns (take everyone's guns away because there are bad people in the world who go after schoolchildren, which actually number fewer than people who win the 12 million dollar lottery every year.)

You think that might have something to do with it?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Piss on you bitch 
*XXXXXX-Meister*


----------



## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

freedombecki said:


> BallsBrunswick said:
> 
> 
> > Why do these people keep thinking their guns are going to get taken away? This is bordering on the psychotic.
> ...



No, I'm betting it's partially mental illness actually.


----------



## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Relax, don't go shoot up a school now.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

bayoubill said:


> a tune for the elitest we-know-what's-best-for-you contingent...
> 
> you ain't gettin' the guns from the good citizens of this country without a nation-rending fight...
> 
> Jane Child - Welcome To The Real World - YouTube





nope
[ame=http://youtu.be/EAqA2sJM-qg]Hogjaw - Gitsum - YouTube[/ame]


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



I'm not a liberal.
I've served my country in the Air Force and my community as a police officer I don't deserve bullshit comments like that.


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## freedombecki (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> freedombecki said:
> 
> 
> > BallsBrunswick said:
> ...


And you received your Doctorate in Psychiatry from which medical school?


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Fuck you Joe, I grew up on those streets and you want to claim racism? Try again ass wipe. I know about gang violence, I have a half black nephew doing 9 years for it right now. I know about Drugies and their stupid violence, I have a brother who did 37 months Federal time for that...And you want to call racism.....You haven't a fucking clue...


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> namvet said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



Yet it says there by your name that you live in Chicago....murder city USA.........


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## eots (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> Why do these people keep thinking their guns are going to get taken away? This is bordering on the psychotic.



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BoLSk_BjGuo]Australia Protests Gun Ban Wake Up American Your Next.flv - YouTube[/ame]


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You are a total idiot. Expect to go down some more when the Mods permit me......... Yes that is a promise.


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## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

freedombecki said:


> BallsBrunswick said:
> 
> 
> > freedombecki said:
> ...



I have an Associates in Psychology from the UW, thank you.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> Why do these people keep thinking their guns are going to get taken away? This is bordering on the psychotic.



Its the unfortunate consequence of the propensity of many on the right to politicize gun ownership, where gun ownership is some sort of a requirement of being conservative. 

Many conservatives also incorrectly believe that conservatives alone understand what gun ownership represents, such as independence and self-reliance. They refuse to acknowledge the fact that most liberals and moderates also own guns, also value independence and self-reliance, and understand and support current Second Amendment jurisprudence and its importance with regard to limited government. 

They know their guns arent going to be taken away, but they need to keep the lie of confiscation alive to continue using it as some sort of political weapon.


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## eots (Dec 15, 2012)

everyone wants to make it a gun debate instead of addressing the fact these shooters are all on psych drugs and we are creating more of these time bombs as we speak across the nation


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## rightwinger (Dec 15, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



OK 

Let's do this. Wherever you work let your boss keep a .357 locked in his desk drawer. If someone starts shooting he can call you in, hand you the gun and say

Go get him honey


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## eots (Dec 15, 2012)

bodecea said:


> syrenn said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



this is joke...right ????


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## bayoubill (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> BallsBrunswick said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



relax big... haters' gonna hate... dumbfucks' gonna dumbfuck... ain't no thang...


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## freedombecki (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> freedombecki said:
> 
> 
> > BallsBrunswick said:
> ...


That's enough education to be a _little_ dangerous...


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## eots (Dec 15, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRJN_NfyiH4]CCHR PSA: Psychiatric Drugs and Violence - YouTube[/ame]


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## squeeze berry (Dec 15, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...





There will be no need to go to my boss's desk drawer. I will have the piece holstered.


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## bayoubill (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



I been there... lived "downtown" among the black folks for nearly two decades...

the stories practically tell themselves...


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## JOSweetHeart (Dec 15, 2012)

CMike said:


> JOSweetHeart said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...


Do you believe that he would have done that if they had not shown up?

God bless you always!!!

Holly

P.S. To me, he did his own self in because he did not want to face the consequences of his actions. Well I believe that thanks to what he did to himself, he is facing them now and he will never see the end of the sentence that he is serving now.


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## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

JOSweetHeart said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > JOSweetHeart said:
> ...



Since he is dead we can't ask.


However if someone there was trained and had a gun some of those children may be alive today.


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## CMike (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



In Michigan you need to have a background check to buy any firearm from a gun store.


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## KissMy (Dec 15, 2012)

BallsBrunswick said:


> freedombecki said:
> 
> 
> > BallsBrunswick said:
> ...



So what is the diagnosis here Doc?

Son felt mom loved her students more than him?


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## JOSweetHeart (Dec 15, 2012)

CMike said:


> JOSweetHeart said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...


Amen.

God bless you and every impacted family always!!!

Holly


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



A person who apparently told him where the guns were, left them unlocked where he could get at them AND even took him to the shooting range so he could practice.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > I find it amusing that the gun-fetishist really think the solution to this problem would have been to give all the teachers guns.
> ...



The fact you are reduced to name-calling shows I proved my point, thanks.  

More guns in the schools are NOT a solution.   Frankly, they can lead to more problems.  Now you have all these other kids who have access to a gun. 

Oh, wait. Wouldn't want to offend you with that word.  

You have all these kids who could potentially take a gun from its rightful owner when that owner's back is turned or he forgets and leaves it in his desk when he takes a piss-break.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



What evidence do you have that they were not locked up?


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## Si modo (Dec 15, 2012)

KissMy said:


> BallsBrunswick said:
> 
> 
> > freedombecki said:
> ...


Word is now that his mother never taught at the school...never even subbed.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Fuck you Joe, I grew up on those streets and you want to claim racism? Try again ass wipe. I know about gang violence, I have a half black nephew doing 9 years for it right now. I know about Drugies and their stupid violence, I have a brother who did 37 months Federal time for that...And you want to call racism.....You haven't a fucking clue...



Funny, I've never had a relative go to prison... and we grew up in the big city, too.  

SO why did you need to emphasize that your nephew is "half-black" and went to prison? 

I'm really trying to help you out here, because, honestly I am starting to think you don't realize how you come off half the time.  

Yes, we do have too much crime in this country.  Especially compared to other industrialized democracies. So how do we go about fixing that. 


More guns. Definitely not the answer.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > namvet said:
> ...



No more than any other major city.  And frankly, I'd like to ban guns from here, too.  

Especially here. 

I mean, I used to be kind of okay with private gun ownership, but frankly, the gun fetishist don't even want to meet halfway on an issue.  

They see 20 pre-schoolers being brought out in Body Bags and they start talking shit about "Liberty" and "Founding Fathers"....  

We have 10,000 gun murders and 15,000 gun suicides every year in this country. It's too high a price to pay.


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## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Sure it is. More guns, less crime.

Oh and fewer progressives. Win/win.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I did not call you any names, I simply pointed out that your depths of stupidity always amaze me.

Can I point out the obvious here, less guns in the schools is not the answer. If it were, these shootings would have already stopped. Your repeated insistence that we keep doing the same thing that has already failed just adds to your reputation for not understanding logic.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You are on the side with the idiot that started a thread that said we should lock up everyone who is mentally ill, refuse to give them any medication, and let cops beat the crap out of anyone who they think deserves it. Why would anyone want to meet you halfway?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> You are the idiot that started a thread that said we should lock up everyone who is mentally ill, refuse to give them any medication, and let cops beat the crap out of anyone who they think deserves it. Why would anyone want to meet you halfway?



I did? 

I think you maybe need to check your own medications...  whatever they are giving you isn't working.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Fuck you Joe, I grew up on those streets and you want to claim racism? Try again ass wipe. I know about gang violence, I have a half black nephew doing 9 years for it right now. I know about Drugies and their stupid violence, I have a brother who did 37 months Federal time for that...And you want to call racism.....You haven't a fucking clue...
> ...



Maybe because some asshole on the internet called me a racist. And I was pointing out my family diversity. I could also mention my Puerto Rican nieces and my Mexican wife. But you might think I was even more racist.  And no you calling me a racist is not trying to help me out, and I don't give a rats ass how you think i come off even one one hundredth of a time.

You start shit, you eat shit...........


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



But you didn't talk about them, you talked about you "half-black" nephew who went to prison.  

If you stop acting like a racist, I'll stop calling you that.


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## ERGO (Dec 15, 2012)

*Gun control expert, John Lott, debunks myths that banning handguns reduce crime.*

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALTEsF6RyH8]John Lott: Myths of gun crime - YouTube[/ame]


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You Lied again...........Shame on you.......

Chicago officials have taken a lot of heat this summer over the rising homicide numbers compared to this time in 2011. Though *Chicago has logged more homicides than any other U.S. city, *it does not have the highest homicide rate. RedEye took a look at how Chicago's rate compares to other large U.S. cities and cities that reported more than 100 homicides last year. Numbers come from the cities' respective police departments. Rates are per 100,000 residents. 
Homicide rates of large U.S. cities - redeyechicago.com


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


How in the hell do you know this shit for brains?
Ever thought he might have pull a knife on his mother or started beating the crap out of her to get the keys? and then killed her. Or killed by stabbing her get the key and do what he did?
You are a fucking clueless bastard.


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## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> BallsBrunswick said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Then I strongly suggest you don't act like a fucking lunatic in every thread.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



So according to the site you just posted,  there were FIVE major cities with lower rates and SEVEN with higher ones...  

And the gap between Chicago (10) and NYC (3) wasn't that great compared to the ones that are really up there like Detroit and NOLA (27 and 32, repectively.)  

But you know how them big city people are....


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## BallsBrunswick (Dec 15, 2012)

KissMy said:


> BallsBrunswick said:
> 
> 
> > freedombecki said:
> ...



I don't know, I'm not really following the story because the way the MSM sensationalizes things irritates me to no end and they usually get it wrong. On the boards here? There's a plethora of mental irregularities.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Dumb ass the only one in this thread who has insinuated they were a racist was you


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



So if we find out he SHOT her, will you shut up on this whole, "Well, I'm sure she never meant for him to have the gun!"  nonsense. 

Names of victims in Connecticut school shooting released - U.S. News



> Investigators believe that Adam Lanza, the alleged gunman, shot his mother at her home near Sandy Hook Elementary before driving to the school and killing 26 others.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Oh, wait, more on Mama Lanza...  

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/16/n...st-victim-recall-her-as-generous.html?hp&_r=0



> Nancy Lanza was the first victim in a massacre carried out on Friday by her son Adam Lanza, 20, who shot her dead with a gun apparently drawn from her own collection, then drove her car to Sandy Hook Elementary School, where he killed 26 people, 20 of them small children, officials said.



It would appear she didn't work at the school after all... in the name of full disclosure, so you got that on the "an armed teacher would have helped" argument.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


I'm not the one saying what happen and accusing the mother of anything you are. As I said how do you know he didn't pull a knife on her and get the key then shoot her?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> I'm not the one saying what happen and accusing the mother of anything you are. As I said how do you know he didn't pull a knife on her and get the key then shoot her?



If this woman didn't have guns in her house with her crazy kid, this never would have happened.  

Period.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Just pointing out that you made the statement about not wanting to live where guns were so easy to get or something along those lines yet you chose to live in one of the most dangerous cities in the country...... Or were you just hitting the talking points ?????????


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not the one saying what happen and accusing the mother of anything you are. As I said how do you know he didn't pull a knife on her and get the key then shoot her?
> ...



And if you weren't spouting your paranoid Anti-gun bull shit this thread would be more about the loss of those 20 beautiful innocent children......


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Just pointing out that you made the statement about not wanting to live where guns were so easy to get or something along those lines yet you chose to live in one of the most dangerous cities in the country...... Or were you just hitting the talking points ?????????



The whole fucking country is dangerous thanks to you gun loons.  Your kid can get killed in a nice suburban pre-school, apparently, because guns are so easy to get. 

Which city I happen to be in (and, BTW, I live in a rather nice suburb with milion dollar houses and cheap condos) is sort of irrelevent to that point... 

But I know you all hate Chicago because Obama's from there.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Children who never would have died if a crazy person couldn't get a gun...


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Just pointing out that you made the statement about not wanting to live where guns were so easy to get or something along those lines yet you chose to live in one of the most dangerous cities in the country...... Or were you just hitting the talking points ?????????
> ...



Actually there you go again spouting shit from your mouth that you know nothing about. I happen to have 2 cousins living in Chicago...... I don't hate any city in the USA. 

So how cheap is your condo........


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## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

Bullshit. Half those kids would be dead already if you had your way, you baby killing piece of shit.

Seriously. Why in the world would anyone take anything you say about the safety of children seriously?

They don't.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



So he would have used a sword or knife. Take away all the guns and people will still find a way to kill others...Started with someone named Cain and a rock if the book is true......


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## saveliberty (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You can *make* a gun moron.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not the one saying what happen and accusing the mother of anything you are. As I said how do you know he didn't pull a knife on her and get the key then shoot her?
> ...



So she should have had her son committed.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)




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## saveliberty (Dec 15, 2012)

A sign with a gun on it in a school zone is highly unacceptable.


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## eots (Dec 15, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrQaKFsNcpc]Why Switzerland Has The Lowest Crime Rate In The World !! - YouTube[/ame]


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Dec 15, 2012)

As with those who seek to ban abortion, those who seek to ban guns never give specific details as to how that would come about.


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## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



He was supposedly a smart kid. If he hadn't gotten mom's weapons, he would have just gotten them somewhere else, or built a bomb.

Progressives are idiots. The lives of children mean less than nothing to them. The safety of schools are secondary to their desire to build up a fascist state.


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## Connery (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


>




Neither, if someone  is intent on killing they will kill. Those signs are effective on people who abide by the law and are not evil or sick enough to go on a killing spree.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 15, 2012)

Connery said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



This is true. I was talking with the Chief the other day telling him and a police Sergeant about my newest pistol and he said he'd like to see it. I told him to come by the house because i couldn't carry it into city hall...... The sergeant told me to come on down and he would meet me at the door any time to carry it into the building..... I do so love this village........


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## tap4154 (Dec 15, 2012)

New pic out of the Goth killer, a computer geek hypnotized by too many violent video games...


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 15, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> A sign with a gun on it in a school zone is highly unacceptable.



Making a gun with your fingers gets you suspended in a school zone.

Boy, 6, gets suspended from school after making gun sign with fingers, pointing at classmates - NY Daily News


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 15, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > A sign with a gun on it in a school zone is highly unacceptable.
> ...



I live behind a middle school.  Guess its me and the baseball bat in a crisis here.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Connery said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



No. You aren't a tool. Not at all.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



It isn't... so I don't worry about that.  

There's no way this guy could have killed 27 people with a sword.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



No proof she gave him the keys, or told him the combination, or that the guns were not locked, interesting.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not the one saying what happen and accusing the mother of anything you are. As I said how do you know he didn't pull a knife on her and get the key then shoot her?
> ...



Her "crazy kid" did not live in the house.

I bet you think that women wouldn't get raped if they didn't dress like whores, don't you?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Actually, he did live in the house, and he was a handful.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Because everyone knows that crazy people never use knives or cars to kill people.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Crazy people should be locked up so no one has to see them, right?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Last time someone killed 20 kids with a knife in one shot? 

thanks....


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## JoeB131 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Well, gee, you are taking this all kind of personally, aren't you?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Not according to people who told me the gun laws in Connecticut didn't make a difference because he lived in New Hampshire.

The guy was autistic, want me to bring some autism activists in here to tell you how stupid you are to call people with autism crazy?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Not at all, I just enjoy mocking idiots.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



That would seem to be what Joe wants if you are a gun owner.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Well isn't that what you want from gun owners?


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## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Or a Christian.
Or a republican.
Or a conservative.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 15, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Joe's more of a Mormon hater.


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## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

It's all the same.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

It's all the same. Fascists are fascists, whatever they decide to hate.


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## saveliberty (Dec 15, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Not according to people who told me the gun laws in Connecticut didn't make a difference because he lived in New Hampshire.
> 
> The guy was autistic, want me to bring some autism activists in here to tell you how stupid you are to call people with autism crazy?



The kid had personality disorders on top of the autism QW.  That is what made him a psycho.


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## koshergrl (Dec 15, 2012)

We don't know. We might never know. We often don't, when it comes to these things.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 15, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Not according to people who told me the gun laws in Connecticut didn't make a difference because he lived in New Hampshire.
> ...



Just because the news and the police speculate about personality disorders does not mean that they exist.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



while the activists are in here can they explain why  some one with autism can not have a mental disorder as well?


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

notoriety said:


> I also agree that it is too late for gun control. there are just too many guns out there. you'd have to send policemen into every housefold to check every inch of every house for weapons and you still wouldn't find them all.



And some people would shoot any police that came to their house to confiscate their Constitutionally protected firearms.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> notoriety said:
> 
> 
> > I also agree that it is too late for gun control. there are just too many guns out there. you'd have to send policemen into every housefold to check every inch of every house for weapons and you still wouldn't find them all.
> ...



some of the police I know would not look very hard for guns either.

Cop: " Do you have any guns? "
citizen: "nope"
cop: " OK, thanks"


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> notoriety said:
> 
> 
> > I also agree that it is too late for gun control. there are just too many guns out there. you'd have to send policemen into every housefold to check every inch of every house for weapons and you still wouldn't find them all.
> ...



And some people would say that.......and then shit their pants when the time came. 

We all know blowhards like you.


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## Noomi (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> notoriety said:
> 
> 
> > I also agree that it is too late for gun control. there are just too many guns out there. you'd have to send policemen into every housefold to check every inch of every house for weapons and you still wouldn't find them all.
> ...



I am sure some would believe that would be the appropriate thing to do.


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## NoNukes (Dec 16, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



This is true, but there are not mass killings without guns.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Noomi said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > notoriety said:
> ...


Regardless of whether one is a cop or not, if they enter your house without authorization to do so, you can shoot them dead...at least in Virginia you can.


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## Noomi (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



And I believe that you should have the right to defend yourself against anyone who enters your home without your permission.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > notoriety said:
> ...




Here's the thing Nancy.  You don't know me, you don't know what my values are, you don't know what I place a higher value than life on, you don't know what I've done in the past or what I'm capable of doing in the future, so I'll take your comment with a grain of salt, figuring you're basing your statemen on what you know about yourself, not what you know about me, or the millions of others that have placed a higher value on Freedom and a better world for their kids and grandkids than they do on their own lives.  You run along now Nancy, you're liable to look even more foolish and faggy if you continue to bloviate on subjects and people you know nothing about.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...




Really? Funny enough arson and bombings account for more dead in "mass killings" than firearms do, even in this nation.  See what happens when you make statements from "facts" you pull out of your ass?  You end up being called on it and you end up proving your ignorance.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Actually, we are finding out today his mom was a gun-nut and she home schooled him.  

No wonder he went nuts.  

Just keeps getting worse for you guys.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



Tough guys don't talk tough.  They don't tell you what they are going to do to you.......nevermind TYPE it. Like I said......we all know blowhards like you.


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## BallsBrunswick (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Meh, don't mind him. He's just using the internet to get out all his real thoughts and feelings as he's obviously a little racist homophobic pussy piece of shit and he has to hide these things in his real life. That's why we get to read his silly bullshit and laugh at him here just like all the people in his real life do behind his back.


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## NoNukes (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



When was the last time 20 schoolchildren were murdered in school because of an act of arson or bombing?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Noomi said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > notoriety said:
> ...



It would be the only thing too do.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Lol, point being, people whose first language is English realize that the phrase "Some people" means just that, some people.  Maybe you need to press 2 for La gente estúpida.


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## rightwinger (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > notoriety said:
> ...



Up until the point that gun nuts turn into cop killers

Then they won't be so polite


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > notoriety said:
> ...



All the police I know will never confiscate any firearms  from law abiding citizens. No matter what order or law that might come.


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## rightwinger (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



Internet tough guys scare me

You never know what they will type


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...


You mean home invader killers?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Why is it that someone says they'll defend themselves and an idiot will insult them by calling them a internet tough guy? I know me I would do exactly the same thing. I'd take them at their word.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Noomi said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



As opposed to handing over your guns and complying with the law?  

Man, what a crazy idea that is.


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## rightwinger (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



_.     Here's the thing Nancy. You don't know me, you don't know what my values are, you don't know what I place a higher value than life on, *you don't know what I've done in the past or what I'm capable of doing in the future,* so I'll take your comment with a grain of salt, figuring you're basing your statemen on what you know about yourself, not what you know about me, or the millions of others that have placed a higher value on Freedom and a better world for their kids and grandkids than they do on their own lives. You run along now Nancy, you're liable to look even more foolish and faggy if you continue to bloviate on subjects and people you know nothing about.  _


Internet tough guy......I'm skeered


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


All I can say is It would be advisable to take him at his word.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



You have the right to resist an unjust law.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Murderers think the murder laws are "unjust".  Rapists think the sexual assault laws are "unjust".  

That's pretty much the most restarded thing you've said yet, and frankly, you say retarded things all day.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Dude shut the fuck up with your whinny ass liberal bull shit. It's a straw man argument.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



No, it isn't.  It's the price of living in a civilized society.  

It's why I can't nude sunbath on my front porch.  I might think it's an "unjust law", but everyone else has a different opinion, especially if they saw me in all my glory.  

If society finally stops having a brain fart and say, "Yeah, we shouldn't let crazy people who go around talking about shooting cops have guns!" then that's what society has decided upon, and there's nothing 'unjust" about it.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



His word about what? What he is typing is that he would kill police officers if they came to his home to take his guns?  That is something that will never happen.....unless he causes it to happen. It is a blowhard bullshitting.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Killing an home invader.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Stupid once again you're using a straw man crazy people aren't allowed to buy guns

Why does a state with the toughest gun laws have a mass shooting?

Connecticut gun laws among the toughest in the U.S. - The York Daily Record


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Stupid once again you're using a straw man crazy people aren't allowed to buy guns
> 
> Why does a state with the toughest gun laws have a mass shooting?
> 
> Connecticut gun laws among the toughest in the U.S. - The York Daily Record



Because being the "toughest gun law in the US" is like being the "Leper with the most fingers".  

It's still rotten.  

A crazy person was able to get guns.  Guns were too easy for him to get.  

Crazy Person + Gun = Tragedy. 

Crazy Person - Gun = Unhappy crazy person who probably still needs help.


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## Stephanie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Stupid once again you're using a straw man crazy people aren't allowed to buy guns
> ...


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## thanatos144 (Dec 16, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > He was a sick 20 year old. He's dead.
> ...



He stole it from his mother. Then killed her with it. The real I guess your going to balme the victim some more?


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## thanatos144 (Dec 16, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > BecauseIKnow said:
> ...



No there shouldn't be a limit on how many guns I can own..... I need as many as I can to fight off your terrorist heroes like Hamas if they attack me and a bunch of other innocent victims.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Stupid once again you're using a straw man crazy people aren't allowed to buy guns
> ...



No what this mass shooting has proven is that gun control does not work.


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## KissMy (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Stupid once again you're using a straw man crazy people aren't allowed to buy guns
> ...



Too Stupid. It's illegal for crazy people to have guns.

Sain Person + Gun = Some protection from Crazy Person.

The only gun control we need is to control your own guns. Not Government Gun Control! That government control shit has NEVER worked & will NEVER work.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 16, 2012)

why do you guys even try to debate with joe????It is a exercise in futility. He has proven he cant understand the simplest of things and is programed to lick progressive boots.


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## Stephanie (Dec 16, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> why do you guys even try to debate with joe????It is a exercise in futility. He has proven he cant understand the simplest of things and is programed to lick progressive boots.



Didn't you know, Joe knows all


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Stupid once again you're using a straw man crazy people aren't allowed to buy guns
> ...



Crazy Person + Vehicle = Tragedy
Crazy Person + Knives = Tragedy
Crazy Person + Chemicals =Tragedy
Crazy Person + Hammer = Tragedy
Crazy Person + Poisoned Kool Aid =Tragedy

See the common theme?

The issue is and always will be the breakdown in understanding and caring for those suffering with mental illness.

The issue today is trying to understand whether the use of prescription psychotropic medications in children and teens is creating a new crisis or issue.

The issue today is exploring whether the healthcare and support system we offer the mentally ill is working properly to protect the sick from harming themselves and harming others.

Don't let politics cloud your thinking. I am more than willing to discuss assault weapons but others should be willing to address the huge role mental illness often plays in these mass killings.


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## mudwhistle (Dec 16, 2012)




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## Katzndogz (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



All the while knowing he was insane and refusing to treat him differently.


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## Katzndogz (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



This is why we have the increase in violence.  The idea that the insane aren't getting enough support, enough care.   They can be treated and made whole if only they had the proper application of understanding and compassion.  

Then when we, as a people, refuse to call evil what it is, find excuses and take on some kind of societal blame what do we get for such sackcloth and ashes efforts?   We get MORE.

Oklahoma teen arrested in school shooting plot

Fortunately in the Oklahoma case, someone stepped forward to identify the nut before he was able to sympathy he way into murder.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

mudwhistle said:


>



When will it sink in for some people that bad people and mentally ill people do not follow the laws so making more gun laws is truly not the answer.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



And what would have stopped him? Someone else with a sword? How long do you think it would take? And remember a sword is nearly silent.....


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## mudwhistle (Dec 16, 2012)

Bloomberg is on "Meet The Depressed" and all he's talking about is politics and how little political pull the NRA has now. 

This guy is an ambulance chaser.


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

When DC's gun laws became the most restrictive in the land, that instantly became the place where innocent civilians were most likely to be gunned down.

Progressive yahoos know this, just as they know that abortion for all results in increased abortions. THEY DON'T CARE. Their primary objective is #1, disarm law abiding people, and #2, reduce the population.

Seriously. DO NOT LISTEN TO THEM. They do not care if children are mowed down. Dead children are secondary to establishing a totalitarian regime. In fact, they generally have plans of their own for reducing the population.


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## mal (Dec 16, 2012)

I am still disgusted by those who went after Guns and the 2nd Amendment before the bodies were cold and counted.

Motherfuck each and every single one of you Shameless Douchebags. 



peace...


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I believe the cry to add more gun laws or to ban some guns is the solution for those who don't want to deal with the complexities of why mass killings happen. Understanding mental illness, and there are so many forms and degrees of such, is much more complicated and honestly less of a political card to play for those who like to politicize everything.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
> ...



This will never become law..........How crazy is that?


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## mal (Dec 16, 2012)

The worst attack on a school ever was almost 100 years ago and done with Bombs by a Disgruntled School Board Member...

Fuck you. 



peace...


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Now that is a stupid statement......... Do carry on, you are so entertaining.....Scary that you can vote, but entertaining....


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Did the tragic phenomena of mass shooting exist before citizens were allowed to have the weaponry of soldiers and law enforcement?  Was it at all possible to fire four or five shots per second into a crowd, mowing them down like summer wheat?  Is there a legitimate need for citizens to own the weaponry designed for warfare and law enforcement?  And is that need greater than the right of citizens to assemble in schools, theaters and restaurant without the fear of semi or fully automatic weapon fire?  Don't give me the esoteric speculative answer of a 'free citizenry is an armed citizenry'.  There is no freedom for the victims of mass shootings.

It's time to take "mass" out of "mass murder".  If the only reason people want high capacity magazines and semi or fully automatic firing actions is to satisfy a prurient adolescent desire to play army or act out scenes from Rambo movies, I submit that the rights of people not to be subjected to gun violence on a 'mass' scale far outweigh the childish desires of a few to be able to fire 5 shots a second.

The second amendment says "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."  Do assault rifles and semi automatic weapons belong on the streets, or are they the type of weaponry that belong in the hands of a well regulated militia?


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## Katzndogz (Dec 16, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



How was the Manson Family stopped?  They stabbed their victims to death.  Houseloads of them.  An unarmed houseload by the way.

With no one to stop him, how many people could Lanza have killed with an axe?


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

I am not convinced he can.

I think about half the posters on here are convicted felons.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> why do you guys even try to debate with joe????It is a exercise in futility. He has proven he cant understand the simplest of things and is programed to lick progressive boots.



But he is entertaining.........


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

mal said:


> I am still disgusted by those who went after Guns and the 2nd Amendment before the bodies were cold and counted.
> 
> Motherfuck each and every single one of you Shameless Douchebags.
> 
> ...



Political opportunists are everywhere. That is what a life seen only through a political eye sees.

Personally I am aching deeply for all those who are suffering and for all that we have lost. I want to understand more than anything what happened to this killer in his life to cause him to decide this path of violence. We know now that he should not have been free to harm others but did we know that before Friday morning?

In the end I know there are many more good and sane people in our lives and that going to school, the mall or the movies is really quite a safe thing to do because it is almost all of the time. However the horror of these events still makes myself and others person wanting more understanding.


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## Katzndogz (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Did the tragic phenomena of mass shooting exist before citizens were allowed to have the weaponry of soldiers and law enforcement?  Was it at all possible to fire four or five shots per second into a crowd, mowing them down like summer wheat?  Is there a legitimate need for citizens to own the weaponry designed for warfare and law enforcement?  And is that need greater than the right of citizens to assemble in schools, theaters and restaurant without the fear of semi or fully automatic weapon fire?  Don't give me the esoteric speculative answer of a 'free citizenry is an armed citizenry'.  There is no freedom for the victims of mass shootings.
> 
> It's time to take "mass" out of "mass murder".  If the only reason people want high capacity magazines and semi or fully automatic firing actions is to satisfy a prurient adolescent desire to play army or act out scenes form Rambo movies, I submit that the rights of people not to be subjected to gun violence on a 'mass' scale far outweigh the childish desires of a few to be able to fire 5 shots a second.
> 
> The second amendment says "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."  Do assault rifles and semi automatic weapons belong on the streets, or are they the type of weaponry that belong in the hands of a well regulated militia?



There is no freedom for the UNARMED victims of mass shootings.  There is freedom for the man with the gun, which is the whole point of having guns.  This shooting started in the administrative office.  That's where it should have ended.  If the staff had been armed that's where it would have ended.


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Did the tragic phenomena of mass shooting exist before citizens were allowed to have the weaponry of soldiers and law enforcement?  Was it at all possible to fire four or five shots per second into a crowd, mowing them down like summer wheat?  Is there a legitimate need for citizens to own the weaponry designed for warfare and law enforcement?  And is that need greater than the right of citizens to assemble in schools, theaters and restaurant without the fear of semi or fully automatic weapon fire?  Don't give me the esoteric speculative answer of a 'free citizenry is an armed citizenry'.  There is no freedom for the victims of mass shootings.
> 
> It's time to take "mass" out of "mass murder".  If the only reason people want high capacity magazines and semi or fully automatic firing actions is to satisfy a prurient adolescent desire to play army or act out scenes form Rambo movies, I submit that the rights of people not to be subjected to gun violence on a 'mass' scale far outweigh the childish desires of a few to be able to fire 5 shots a second.
> 
> The second amendment says "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."  Do assault rifles and semi automatic weapons belong on the streets, or are they the type of weaponry that belong in the hands of a well regulated militia?



The weapons didn't belong to the kid. They belonged, legally, to his mother...who may or may not have been well regulated militia. She used to take her kids to the shooting range, this was  a hobby she engaged in with them.

This isn't an issue of whether or not gun control actually reduces gun crime. In our country, there's zero evidence that it does..but that's not the issue.

The issue is, should we provide our schools with the tools to protect children from armed gunmen? Obviously, they are going to occasionally come under attack from them...so should we train school personnel to protect them and give them the capability to do so?

What sort of idiot says no to that question?

Progressives. They are not motivated by any desire to protect the vulnerable..let alone children. Children, to progressives, are chattel.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Did the tragic phenomena of mass shooting exist before citizens were allowed to have the weaponry of soldiers and law enforcement?  Was it at all possible to fire four or five shots per second into a crowd, mowing them down like summer wheat?  Is there a legitimate need for citizens to own the weaponry designed for warfare and law enforcement?  And is that need greater than the right of citizens to assemble in schools, theaters and restaurant without the fear of semi or fully automatic weapon fire?  Don't give me the esoteric speculative answer of a 'free citizenry is an armed citizenry'.  There is no freedom for the victims of mass shootings.
> 
> It's time to take "mass" out of "mass murder".  If the only reason people want high capacity magazines and semi or fully automatic firing actions is to satisfy a prurient adolescent desire to play army or act out scenes from Rambo movies, I submit that the rights of people not to be subjected to gun violence on a 'mass' scale far outweigh the childish desires of a few to be able to fire 5 shots a second.
> 
> The second amendment says "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."  Do assault rifles and semi automatic weapons belong on the streets, or are they the type of weaponry that belong in the hands of a well regulated militia?



I don't know of a semi automatic weapon that can fire 5 shots per second.........
just saying...........


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

mal said:


> I am still disgusted by those who went after Guns and the 2nd Amendment before the bodies were cold and counted.
> 
> Motherfuck each and every single one of you Shameless Douchebags.
> 
> ...



Holy shit. Shut the fuck up about it. The conversation needed to be had before the fucking massacre. It needs to be had now. If you were disgusted by anything, you'd have stayed away from the board instead of shitting all over it the way you have. 

You suck.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Did the tragic phenomena of mass shooting exist before citizens were allowed to have the weaponry of soldiers and law enforcement?  Was it at all possible to fire four or five shots per second into a crowd, mowing them down like summer wheat?  Is there a legitimate need for citizens to own the weaponry designed for warfare and law enforcement?  And is that need greater than the right of citizens to assemble in schools, theaters and restaurant without the fear of semi or fully automatic weapon fire?  Don't give me the esoteric speculative answer of a 'free citizenry is an armed citizenry'.  There is no freedom for the victims of mass shootings.
> ...


Fortress Kindergarten.  Armed guards in schools, on campuses, in theaters, all over.  That's the answer?  An assailant firing hundreds of rounds a minute seems to be the problem.  And that seems to be the way to eliminate this modern and tragic phenomena of mass shootings.  Such tragedies were impossible before weapons designed to kill as many human beings as possible were foisted upon the American public by gun manufacturers and their lackey lobbyists.  There certainly were shootings, but not on a mass scale.  The answer to the fire isn't pour on more gasoline.  The answer is to stop access to weapons better held by a well regulated militia.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> When DC's gun laws became the most restrictive in the land, that instantly became the place where innocent civilians were most likely to be gunned down.
> 
> Progressive yahoos know this, just as they know that abortion for all results in increased abortions. THEY DON'T CARE. Their primary objective is #1, disarm law abiding people, and #2, reduce the population.
> 
> Seriously. DO NOT LISTEN TO THEM. They do not care if children are mowed down. Dead children are secondary to establishing a totalitarian regime. In fact, they generally have plans of their own for reducing the population.





> THEY DON'T CARE. Their primary objective is #1, disarm law abiding people, and #2, reduce the population.



You may have hit the target on this.
Wouldn't more gun control be an effective tool to gain number 2.
Reduce the population?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

mal said:


> The worst attack on a school ever was almost 100 years ago and done with Bombs by a Disgruntled School Board Member...
> 
> Fuck you.
> 
> ...



DO WE REGULATE EXPLOSIVES? Idiot.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> > I am still disgusted by those who went after Guns and the 2nd Amendment before the bodies were cold and counted.
> ...


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > When DC's gun laws became the most restrictive in the land, that instantly became the place where innocent civilians were most likely to be gunned down.
> ...


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > mal said:
> ...



Nope. Annoyed. Different.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Connecticut has done it the gun grabbers way for years . Now Connecticut has proven gun control does not work. Now it's time to do it my way. Arm the citizens of the state.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

What is your way, SPECIFICALLY? Where is it done your way? Any examples?


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



This chart would be effective if progressives actually cared about protecting school children.

They don't.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> What is your way, SPECIFICALLY? Where is it done your way? Any examples?



Can you read?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > What is your way, SPECIFICALLY? Where is it done your way? Any examples?
> ...



Don't want to repeat yourself? Can't sum it up in a few sentences? Don't know the answer? What is your reason for not responding to a direct question?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

What is your way? How would you regulate firearms? Specifically.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I belong to a wll regulated militia.. There is one member at the moment. 

Capt Squeeze Berry


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)




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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


Within my lifetime the access to semi and fully automatic weaponry, the "Saturday Night Special" cheap handgun, and high capacity magazines has eased to the point their availability is common.  Also in that time, the phenomena of mass shootings has blossomed into an almost acceptable fact of modern life.  Before access to weapons designed for soldiers and law enforcement, there were practically no mass gun shootings.  After, we have what we are enduring today.

Can you justify the absolute need for high capacity weapons?  The need for semi or fully automatic firing actions?  These weapons are responsible fro the modern phenomenon of mass murder by gunfire.  Is there really a reason more necessary than the lives of the victims to have such weapons in the hands of ordinary citizens and not well regulated militias?

Such weapons have no place in society.  If rational heads prevail, the adolescents who think these weapons are cool would be schooled in the tragic consequence of the reality of such weapons, not the virtual video game prurient pleasure of their use.  Such weapons belong in well regulated militia, not on the streets.  Once confiscated, I suggest they be melted down and rendered into manhole covers to cap the putrid sewer of death they have wrought.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

link SM?


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Take away all the legal guns we the people might possess. Now tell me this. Can you promise me 100 percent that no mass killings will ever happen again? If you can't make me that promise I rest my case.


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## mal (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> mal said:
> 
> 
> > The worst attack on a school ever was almost 100 years ago and done with Bombs by a Disgruntled School Board Member...
> ...



WE REGULATE GUNS IDIOT...

And ingredients to make Explosives are Numerous Fuckstain. 



peace...


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> link SM?



To what?


It helps to quote someone when you ask a question.


Just sayin'


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...


Well regulated.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



link?


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



our by laws state that we are well regulated.

Our defintion is that the ammo is stored safely, gun safety is practiced and all firearms are obtained legally.


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## Katzndogz (Dec 16, 2012)

According to the last report.  Lanza killed himself when he heard the authorities in the building and knew that they were going to kill him when they saw him.   Then he shot himself.   Likely if he knew that by going into that school he was going into a situation where he would be the first to die, he wouldn't have done it.


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## Luddly Neddite (Dec 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



What is wrong with you people?

Do you believe that only rw children were murdered? Do you really believe that libs are untouched by this horrible tragedy?

WHY do you now use this horror for your political agenda?

I wish you wouldn't. I wish the right could join the country in trying for an answer but just as with the lies about President Obama, an answer to this national tragedy is not what you want. Instead, as so many of you have said, you actually want more guns, more deaths, more dead children. 

And, if you get what you want, you'll blame the left for those dead children.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Ravi said:


> Home schooling gets more appealing by the day.



I'm sure a few parents have had that same thought cross their minds. The killer was home schooled himself some it has been reported. Just saying. There are no promises in life that violence or death won't befall us or those we love and that is why I believe in what I do in my own personal life.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Then, what's the answer?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


The gun grabbers start this fight long ago they are the ones who always make it political. Now a gun grabber wants to stop making it political?
OH right here's the deal end all gun control .


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## Luddly Neddite (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Take away all the legal guns we the people might possess. Now tell me this. Can you promise me 100 percent that no mass killings will ever happen again? If you can't make me that promise I rest my case.



Who said that "all the legal guns" should be taken away?


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...





You have now joined the ranks of the officially insane.........


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...


So you own semi or fully automatic weapons?  Weapons fitted with high capacity magazines?  May I ask why?  What use are they?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Gun Control - Just Facts


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## Luddly Neddite (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> luddly.neddite said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



If by "gun grabber" you mean someone who wants to ban guns, you're wrong and you know it. Making up lies doesn't help. 

If you did not mean me, please show me where someone else said they want to "grab guns". 

My point still stands. You're using this to further a really disgusting agenda and then you blame the left when you get the inevitable outcome.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

We have a problem.  We need to solve the problem. The reluctance to seek solutions to the problem is difficult for me to understand. Your fears are getting in the way of rational thought.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Bull shit Connecticut has the toughest gun control laws the shooting has proven you are a lying cock sucker and gun control does not work.


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## Luddly Neddite (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



You are absolutely correct and you have stated it very well.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > luddly.neddite said:
> ...


Horse shit you lying son of a bitch.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> We have a problem.  We need to solve the problem. The reluctance to seek solutions to the problem is difficult for me to understand. Your fears are getting in the way of rational thought.



we need to use all the facts at our disposal to make better laws to end this.



some only want the NRA to tell us how to respond


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Take away all the legal guns we the people might possess. Now tell me this. Can you promise me 100 percent that no mass killings will ever happen again? If you can't make me that promise I rest my case.
> ...



I have heard/read various "solutions" here and elsewhere and that was one. Remember there are multiple discussions happening about this topic.

Tell me how you would guarantee 100% that mass killings will never happen again. What would you do to make that promise a truth we can all count on?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



More proof gun grabber are lying scum.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

If more guns were the solution we would already be the safest nation in the world.

we have the most guns


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

why are all our guns not  already keeping us safe?


Oh yeah because guns kill


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## wavingrl (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> > Home schooling gets more appealing by the day.
> ...



I hadn't heard  that the gunman was homeschooled. His high school adviser has been quoted in several articles. It is possible that he was homeschooled at some point?

Everyone has questions  and wants to find solutions. Maybe there is something that can be done. It  seems to be a very small percentage of the population that commits such heinous crimes. 

I just don't know.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> If more guns were the solution we would already be the safest nation in the world.
> 
> we have the most guns



Solution for what? What are you talking about. Quote the post that said guns were a solution for something.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I own them and will keep them


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

A hypothetical question to test your sanity:

Would you rather have your children attend a school with or without armed guards and security checkpoints?


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## Luddly Neddite (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> We have a problem.  We need to solve the problem. The reluctance to seek solutions to the problem is difficult for me to understand. Your fears are getting in the way of rational thought.



Yes. 

This is not and should not be about gun "control". It needs to be about gun "safety". 

Our children have the right to be safe in their schools and we all have the right to be safe anywhere and everywhere we go. 

In our madness to protect our rights we are actually giving them up. As it is now, we do not have the right to be safe and that must change.

No, I don't know the answer any more than any of the rest of you do. But, I'm certain that the answer does not lie in more guns. If more guns were the answer, we would already have solved the problem because there are more guns in our society than ever before. All we've gotten for those guns is more than 30 murders every day and horrendous mass murders like this one.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> why are all our guns not  already keeping us safe?
> 
> 
> Oh yeah because guns kill



Having a billion guns outside a gun free zone does nothing to stop a crazy person who has a gun inside a gun free zone.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

wavingrl said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Ravi said:
> ...



Yes it was reported that he was home schooled *some *as I stated in my post.

Adam Lanza's Mom Pulled Him Out of School: Relative - ABC News


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## Luddly Neddite (Dec 16, 2012)

> I own them and will keep them


Please stop the drama queen stuff. It does not help.




LoneLaugher said:


> A hypothetical question to test your sanity:
> 
> Would you rather have your children attend a school with or without armed guards and security checkpoints?



That's easy. I want kids to be able to be free and safe. 

I grew up with guns in my house but it never occurred to me that I wasn't safe as i went to and from school. 

As I said, in our madness to keep one right, one freedom, we have given up other rights and freedoms.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


What clearly doesn't work is the expansion of access to weapons of mass destruction.  Before such weapons were widely available, there were not mass shootings.  Since the NRA, gun manufacturers and paid lobbyists bought more lax gun laws, our streets are awash with death.  

And calling me a lying cock sucker does not help your case.  It merely shows I am dealing with a lesser person in so many ways.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> A hypothetical question to test your sanity:
> 
> Would you rather have your children attend a school with or without armed guards and security checkpoints?



I can not support armed guards and security checkpoints at schools and still support the right to possess legal guns and my 2nd Amendment. 

I would like to understand why this man did what he did first.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> A hypothetical question to test your sanity:
> 
> Would you rather have your children attend a school with or without armed guards and security checkpoints?



What kind of fucking question is that?To a gun grabber if a person says yes to arm guards it's insane
If a supporter of guns asked that question and a gun grabber answered it with no to armed teachers the supporters of guns would think the gun grabber was insane.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...


What use are they?
What legitimate use are they?  What reason can be given that trumps the lives of so many fallen by the use of such weapons?  Why should the rights of an owner of such weapons be greater than the rights of children anticipating Christmas?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


Dude when lives are at stack we don't have the time to experiment on what  form of gun control works. Connecticut has proven it does not work.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Would we benefit more from:

A) making sure all teachers and school admin are trained in the use of firearms and armed at all times. 

B) making sure all teachers and school admin are trained in the methods of identifying unstable, potentially violent young people and provided with a plan of action if needed?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > A hypothetical question to test your sanity:
> ...



Sane answer.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > A hypothetical question to test your sanity:
> ...



What kind of question? A hypothetical one. With or without. Simple question.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Would we benefit more from:
> 
> A) making sure all teachers and school admin are trained in the use of firearms and armed at all times.
> 
> B) making sure all teachers and school admin are trained in the methods of identifying unstable, potentially violent young people and provided with a plan of action if needed?



and then cut their pay


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Fuck you and your knee jerk reaction if you really cared about children you would stop supporting gun control.
As for why I have them. As an adult I choose to have them to fight a tyrannical government. That is their one and only purpose. Don't like it come git it.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



By continuing to say that, you are announcing that your ability to process information is compromised.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



It's a fail question depending on who would ask it.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

If you owned ten guns and the people of the USA vote to ban one of them what would you do if the police came for it?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Don't like the facts? I really don't give a shit continue to support a failed system and you will continue to have the same ending effects.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> If you owned ten guns and the people of the USA vote to ban one of them what would you do if the police came for it?



I've my mu point very clear on that police come for guns they will be treated like any home invader.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> If you owned ten guns and the people of the USA vote to ban one of them what would you do if the police came for it?



Hey, wait a minute. I thought voting away someone's rights was a bad thing? (gay marriage)


----------



## wavingrl (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



ok. In one article it  said that she had was there/at school if  he had a problem. 

Maybe by this time next week  we will have some semblance of 'facts'. 

Yesterday, somewhere online, I read  that his mother was some sort of 'survivalist'. Then later heard on the news that she was a friendly person who enjoyed gardening and also collected guns.  Much speculation about why she would collect guns but I dismissed that--some people do. Perhaps her father collected guns --the possibilities are endless.

So--she worked in finance, had 2 boys, got a divorce, enjoyed landscaping her yard, homeschooled her son and was generally described as an average member of the community. 

It sounds like her son had these issues for many years and that they more than likely sought professional help.


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



And by continuing to dispute it, you are announcing your stance that the lives of children are secondary to failed ideology.

You're willing to sacrifice children.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


Fight a tyrannical government?!?  Rather esoteric, isn't it?  you believe that you can hold off the agents of the government like some lone desperado or John Rambo or Dirty Harry?  If so, you are a fool, and a dangerous fool at that.

Because we are allowed to have weapons designed for soldiers, we endure mass shootings.  Controlling such weapons, confiscating them and prosecuting those who refuse to surrender them will go a long way toward relieving our society of the blight these weapons bring.  I am concerned about children.  And that's why I'm all for a total ban of semi and fully automatic firing systems and high capacity magazines.  Only the delusional, like yourself, see any use for them.  The rest of Sane America recognizes the need to eliminate them from our midst.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Dude my group right now has 15 police officer from surrounding area departments, 10 deputy's from three county's  some state troopers two U.S. Deputy Marshal's and one FBI agent. not to mention a doctor and two lawyers, I am not a lone wolf.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Would we benefit more from:
> 
> A) making sure all teachers and school admin are trained in the use of firearms and armed at all times.
> 
> B) making sure all teachers and school admin are trained in the methods of identifying unstable, potentially violent young people and provided with a plan of action if needed?



A.)I( don't agree that all teachers should be trained in firearms usage. Just a few in each floor would do. 

B.)  the 2nd contingent is somewhat in place. It's experience with kids and we know who to notify.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



If you were sane and of normal intelligence, you might get accused of trolling for a reaction. As it is, however, you are just a dimwitted whack-job. Please know that nothing of say is ever given a moment of serious consideration.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


The point is there is much more danger that is tragically real from weapons designed for war on our streets than any perceived danger from the government.  Your skewed politics has clouded your judgement.  Which priority holds first: safe streets or 'tin soldiers and Nixon coming'?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Your group? You have a group poised to fight the government? 

You are a loon who lies. You have no group.


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



You won't give consideration to protecting children. You maintain that they should remain at risk, while idiots like you continue to pretend that gun control reduces crime...or that the way to protect vulnerable children is to allow them to continue to be slaughtered, while moronic progressive acolytes debate over what *causes* crazy people to target unprotected groups of children.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Ban airplanes.  Too many folks die because of them.

Ban cars, too.  Especially ban alcohol.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ban airplanes.  Too many folks die because of them.
> 
> Ban cars, too.  Especially ban alcohol.


ban alcohol? What has gods gift to ugly women ever done too you>?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



<sigh> your denial can't change facts. sorry.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



And this coming from a obamush supporter? holy shit.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



you do realize that you need a special federal license to have a full auto weapon, correct?

I can't afford a MG 42 or a MP 44 for that matter. They are expensive and out of the price range of most people. There are not that many out there. 

most of my guns are pump shotguns, bolt rifles, revolvers and black powder.

Pretty run of the mill.

would a Ruger 10/22 fall under your definition of assault rifle? 

Last weekend I developed a load and zeroed a flintlock rifle for example.

The previous two weekends were spent doing the same thing for a pair of civil war repro muskets. 

Wanna regulate them too?


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ban airplanes.  Too many folks die because of them.
> ...


Alcohol and drug related deaths in the USA far exceed gun  related deaths.  So, ban alcohol.  It worked so well 90 years ago.

And, it looks like vehicles are the most deadly tools.  Ban them, too.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...


My idea for gun control  is simple.  Bolt action rifles, pump action shotguns and revolvers are perfectly legal and should not be regulated other than registration in a national data base and ballistic fingerprinting for identification if these weapons are used to commit a crime.  

Any and all weapons with semi or fully automatic firing systems, all magazines that can hold more than ten rounds are illegal and the sale, import, distribution and ownership of such weapons is subject to federal law.  Such weapons must be surrendered at once to local law enforcement.  Any such weapons discovered after the surrender period will also be confiscated and the owner subject to a mandatory prison term in federal prison.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


----------



## bodecea (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Ban airplanes.  Too many folks die because of them.
> 
> Ban cars, too.  Especially ban alcohol.



When planes crash, there is a HUGE effort to trace causes and come up with solutions.

There is not a concerted effort to say "Oh well, price of flying" and wholesale bashing of those who come up with concerns.


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## bayoubill (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



America's gun owners will not stand for registration... and rightfully so... so that's not ever gonna happen...

and ballistic fingerprinting has been shown to be a complete waste of time and money where it's been tried...


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bayoubill said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...


I own  gun and registering it would not present any restriction on my freedom to own it.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bayoubill said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



The less information the government has the better for the American people.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Buzz kill I was joking.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


I know.  I just want to keep it real in this thread.  As we all know, sometimes reality sucks.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bayoubill said:
> ...


Ignorance as an answer now?  Tell me, how has ignorance served the greater good?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I guess you don't know but a revolver has the same function as a semi automatic firearm? Ever saw a speed loader for a revolver?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Weapons registration serves any government well that now has strict gun control and out right bans.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



well at least we have a definition 

my Ruger 10/22 is a semi-auto .22 rimfire

Still wanna confiscate that? 

there are semi-auto shotguns out there as well as semi sporting rifles.

Wanna confiscate them too? 

Wannna melt down museum pieces? 

Any of the semi-auto firearms that the Feds want will need to be purchased at fair market value.

The aforementioned 10/22 has had a VQ drop in accurizing kit installed. The Feds will need to come up with some loot to get it.

Will you gun grabbbers, yes that is what you are, be willing to pony up money to buy them back b/c you are not using my tax dollars to do it.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
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> > bayoubill said:
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This from the guy whose fantasy group is made up of some of the most scrutinized, well documented citizens in America....Law Enforcement Officers.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
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> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Fine!  I think we should know who owns weapons designed for soldiers and take those weapons away right now.


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## Katzndogz (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
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shhhhh

they will want to ban speed loaders too


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
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> > squeeze berry said:
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When you legally surrender your weapons you will receive a receipt that will allow you to deduct the price of the weapon from your income tax.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> squeeze berry said:
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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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no way

full market vaule and then some

put your money where your mouth is


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

bodecea said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ban airplanes.  Too many folks die because of them.
> ...


Still, vehicles and alcohol cause more deaths per year than guns.

Ban them both.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
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> > squeeze berry said:
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Fine! Deduct the full market value.  Just get the weapons of war off the streets.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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> > Nosmo King said:
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when you deduct on your taxes you get back pennies on the dollar.

and my guns are not on the street


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


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  My Mossberg holds nine rounds.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
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And my gun control proposal guarantees that.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> squeeze berry said:
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they might want to ban long barreled goose guns so that we can't shoot down airliners too


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> squeeze berry said:
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My Mossberg holds eight rounds.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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I guarantee your "proposal" will never happen


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Si modo said:
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And, I bet you could take out dozens of kindergartners with that, too.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
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And I guarantee that without some realistic ban on weapons of mass destruction, there will be further tragedies and mass shootings.  Take the "mass" out of "mass shooting" by taking high capacity magazines and semi or fully automatic firing systems out of the hands of the citizenry.  Such shootings never happened until the gun lobby got its way.  And now we all suffer.  Suffer in the truest sense.  Not the bleating and braying of some gun nuts bitterly clinging to their Rambo fantasies.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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There is an international treaty and ban on WMDs.

We're talking guns here.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Nosmo King said:
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Eight rounds?  Dozens of victims?  Check your math.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Si modo said:
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Dunno about you, but my pants have pockets.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Si modo said:
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> > squeeze berry said:
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They also need to ban Danny Vermin's .88 magnum.







It was made for him special. It "shoots through schools"


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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a semi 22 is a weapon of mass destruction?

You are a loon


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Nosmo King said:
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There are guns designed for sport.   there are guns designed for self defense.  And then there are guns designed for the military and law enforcement.  Those guns fire multiple rounds per second and can continue to fire so long as a high capacity magazine is attached.  Those guns are weapons of mass destruction.  Those are the weapons responsible for the modern phenomena of the "mass shooting".  Those are the weapons a well regulated militia should be responsible for.


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## Zoom-boing (Dec 16, 2012)

Just got back from running errands, one of them at Target.  I kept looking at all the families there with their small children and just cannot stop thinking of those poor little kids.  I cannot imagine what kind of sick individual could do something like this.  What was going through their mind?  What was the point of this heinous act?  They killed themselves in the end ... why kill so many others too?   How does anyone pull the trigger and kill a six year old kid?  It all just makes me cry.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
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When I stopped being a police officer do you think I would also stop having any contact with with my friends? They are also fed up with what is going on.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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Please by all means lead the charge stay in front. Don't send in others that you wouldn't do yourself.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> squeeze berry said:
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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Nosmo King said:
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If it is fitted with a magazine capable of holding more than ten rounds I submit that the presence of a .22 semi automatic weapon in any public venue can be used as a weapon of mass destruction.  We're not talking about some rednecks at the gun range or a few hillbillies shooting rats behind the trailer park.  I'm talking about someone carrying a semi automatic rifle into a school, a theater, a restaurant and opening up on the innocent.  Wouldn't you agree that then a semi auto .22 is a weapon of mass destruction?


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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You are a jack ass.

Yeah, the US military found tons of nerve gas stockpiled in Iraq but that wasnt enough to justify our invasion, and yet a 22 with more than ten rounds is a WMD?

Apparently you libtard fascists are not realizing that people are catching on to your bullshit.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
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My life is worth more money than the government can print. No fucking sale.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Three out of five Internet forum posters who claim that they were once police officers are lying.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
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And what value do you place on the lives of the victims of your precious utterly ridiculous weapons of war?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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I could care less what the other three say., or for what it's worth what you think your opinion and speculation doesn't change what I have accomplished in my life.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

wavingrl said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > wavingrl said:
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At this time we are at the mercy of what is being reported and often times the media is incorrect or twists things to fit an agenda. I just offered a link to show where I read he was home schooled. I only mentioned home schooling because Ravi addressed it as an  option in her post.

I have no idea what help he received if any nor what was sought by his parents. I am not even certain he has been diagnosed with any illness. Just here like everyone else discussing issues.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> > Nosmo King said:
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You place less value on life when  you prevent that life from defending itself.
The government has proven itself too be untrustworthy My weapons will remain in my possession . Your knee jerk reaction is just that nothing more nothing less.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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  WMDs are not guns.  They have specific qualities and definitions.  You can keep trying to say that guns are WMDs, but definitions disagree.

Get a grip...you're looking stupid using an inaccurate term.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

bodecea said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Ban airplanes.  Too many folks die because of them.
> ...



Gunshots were the manner of death but not the motive for the killings.

Many objects and things can kill us and do in the hands of the wrong people or when other human factors intercede or something or someone fails. The objects in themselves are not dangerous.

A safely parked car does no harm. Put a drunk driver behind the wheel of that same car and it can do the same harm and destruction as a gun.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> bodecea said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


Still, it actually IS the price of flying.  Each time anyone gets on an airplane, there is a chance that it will crash or some POS will make it crash.

Life is rough, but I think it would be harder if I had to spend my life as a bubble boy.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > bodecea said:
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Definitely. And I long ago decided I  did not need nor want government over-regulating my life in order to keep me "safe". I know life is without guarantees. I accept all the obvious laws but to think more gun laws will prevent what happened Friday is simply shortsighted imo.

If we banned every gun no one still would be able to guarantee us these mass killings will never happen again. No one.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Yeah.....I'm leaning toward not believing that you were once a police officer.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
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Yup.  They'd just use bombs...and already have on several occasions.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



I said your opinion is irrelevant I don't care if you believe me or not. It does not change one thing about me and that is all that counts.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



You seem like such a sweet, nice person. I can almost hear soft music playing when I read your gently written comments. 

That doesn't excuse the fact that you have  bought into the nutter lie machine and think that our government is bent on stripping you of your freedom. Your apparently even-handed approach is exposed for what it is by the assumptions that you make......and reference in such a casual manner. 

You looking for guarantees? Not going to get them. You also won't find anyone here who is suggesting that we ban all guns. But that sure sounds scary....don't it?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Why would a person lie about such a thing?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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Why don't you ask someone who has lied?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Nosmo King said:
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26 victims in less than five minutes.  Was that mass destruction?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Si modo said:
> 
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> > Nosmo King said:
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Knee jerk reaction will never accomplish anything.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
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> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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I just did.


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## mal (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



The Jews are familiar with that in the modern Age... As we were in the 20's when the Deadliest School Attack in American History occurred.

Chinese children are Targeted with Blades in their Classrooms...



peace...


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


You can thank me for clearing up your confusion, later:

The U.S. military refers to WMD as:

    Chemical, biological, radiological, or nuclear weapons capable of a high order of destruction or causing mass casualties and exclude the means of transporting or propelling the weapon where such means is a separable and divisible part from the weapon. Also called WMD.

For the general purposes of national defense,[23] US Code[24] defines a weapon of mass destruction as:

    any weapon or device that is intended, or has the capability, to cause death or serious bodily injury to a significant number of people through the release, dissemination, or impact of:
        toxic or poisonous chemicals or their precursors
        a disease organism
        radiation or radioactivity[25]

For the purposes of the prevention of weapons proliferation,[26] US Code defines weapons of mass destruction as "chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons, and chemical, biological, and nuclear materials used in the manufacture of such weapons."[27]

For the purposes of US Criminal law concerning terrorism,[28] weapons of mass destruction are defined as:

    any destructive device defined as any explosive, incendiary, or poison gas bomb, grenade, rocket having a propellant charge of more than four ounces, missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter ounce, mine, or device similar to any of the devices described in the preceding clauses[29]
    any weapon that is designed or intended to cause death or serious bodily injury through the release, dissemination, or impact of toxic or poisonous chemicals, or their precursors
    any weapon involving a biological agent, toxin, or vector
    any weapon that is designed to release radiation or radioactivity at a level dangerous to human life[30]


The Federal Bureau of Investigation's definition is similar to that presented above from the terrorism statute:[31]

    any explosive or incendiary device, as defined in Title 18 USC, Section 921: bomb, grenade, rocket, missile, mine, or other device with a charge of more than four ounces
    any weapon designed or intended to cause death or serious bodily injury through the release, dissemination, or impact of toxic or poisonous chemicals or their precursors
    any weapon involving a disease organism
    any weapon designed to release radiation or radioactivity at a level dangerous to human life
    any device or weapon designed or intended to cause death or serious bodily injury by causing a malfunction of or destruction of an aircraft or other vehicle that carries humans or of an aircraft or other vehicle whose malfunction or destruction may cause said aircraft or other vehicle to cause death or serious bodily injury to humans who may be within range of the vector in its course of travel or the travel of its debris.





Weapon of mass destruction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Or the black market guns that will always exist would be used to commit the same exact crime. 

When will people learn to focus on the reasons people do what they do and stop blaming but one object only, guns, that can be used to kill others.

That same killer could have wiped out as many kids in the school playground or on a soccer field with his car. There is no call to ban or restrict the use of cars.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
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> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Hmmm, I can fire my revolver as fast as my Semi auto 308......


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Si modo said:
> 
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> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



A car can do the same, perhaps in less time, in the hands of someone intent on killing others in large numbers. What should we do about cars? Keep trying to impede the 2nd Amendment with more gun laws and I promise you that those whose desire is to kill many will use other means. If mental illness is in play anything is possible.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
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> > Si modo said:
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The 9/11 hijackers killed hundreds if not thousands of victims in seconds. Maybe we need plane control laws?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Si modo said:
> 
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> > Dreamy said:
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Nobody is blaming but one object. Nobody. Got it. Nobody. 

But....it is strange that so many concerned citizens wish to avoid considering that guns might have something to do with mass murders committed by people using guns. 

They need to be part of the discussion....don't you agree?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
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Prove I lied shit stain?
If you can't do that that makes you a liar.


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## Truthmatters (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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many laws changed after 911


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

Truthmatters said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



Did they outlaw the 757 & 767 jets that were used to kill the victims?
Did they require medical & criminal background checks before you can get on a plane?
Did they restrict how many times you can get on a plane?
Did they enact a 3 day waiting period before you can get your boarding pass?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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I have to prove that you're lying....but you don't have to prove that you are not? That doesn't seem like much of a bargain.  

I don't believe that you were ever a police officer. I have never read a comment of yours that led me to think you have a law enforcement background. You don't strike me as intelligent enough to pass the tests. I am just not buying it. 

Say something to make me believe you......and I will.


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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Have you not travelled by plane since then?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Rat in the Hat said:
> ...



I hope you didn't hurt yourself coming up with this brilliant train of thought. You are really taking this discussion to uncharted depths. I'm not sure I can handle it.


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
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Yes, I have. And not once have I had to have a background check before I could possess a plane ticket.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



I am not naive enough sir to not know there are people who want to remove guns from the people so please do not pee on my shoe and try to convince me it is raining.

Now let me dissect your words.



> so many concerned citizens wish to avoid considering that guns might have something to do with mass murders committed by people using guns.



Concerned citizens are the only ones who even discuss these issues so that added word of concerned is not needed.

Sir we all are quite aware that guns can kill. I am not aware of anyone here or elsewhere disputing this elementary fact. Please show me someone here who is.

Tell me exactly how you can promise me/us with 100% certainty that no more mass killings will ever happen in the US. You're in charge for the moment. Give me your answers. Remember I want 100% surety that this will never happen again.


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## Connery (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



I agree. The means by which someone kills is not as important as why they kill and how to adequately predict who will be violent and to what degree. I believe it is a matter of how advanced the field of metal health is rather than whether adequate services are being offered/provided.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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You're the one accusing me of lying I am not accusing you.




> I don't believe that you were ever a police officer. I have never read a comment of yours that led me to think you have a law enforcement background. You don't strike me as intelligent enough to pass the tests. I am just not buying it.


Your opinion and what you buy or don't buy is irrelevant. So we both have the same opinion of each other. but does that change either of us?


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> idb said:
> 
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Pardon?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
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Who wants to ban all guns? Name names, please. I have seen measured responses from those who think certain types of weapons need better regulation. I have not seen anyone advocating a total gun ban. YOU, on the other hand, have made the remark that you want to be 100% guaranteed that banning all guns will prevent mass killings. It is YOU that has suggested a total gun ban. 
You might be pissing on your own shoes, miss.

I want the discussion to include possible gun regulations that could be a part of the solution. You do not. That is where we differ.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
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C'mon, man. Just say something that will convince me that you were once a cop. My son is a cop, so I will have no problem verifying your statement. 

C'mon.....make me look silly and force me to apologize.


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...





> I want the discussion to include possible gun regulations that could be a part of the solution



Tell me what you know about Connecticut gun laws and tell me what new law or laws you would add to have prevented these killings.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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What additional gun regulations would prevent this?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...





> My son is a cop


I don't believe it. Prove it. is that how it's done?


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## saveliberty (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Truthmatters said:
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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> bodecea said:
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So you really couldn't answer her point, then? 

Here's the thing.  When we found out the threshold for DUI was too high, we lowered it. When the Ford Pinto was found to be the "Barbaque that seats four", there were actions taken against Ford to make them correct it.   We've mandated seat belt laws and air bags and other things to make cars safer.  

If we treated guns like cars - licensed, registered and insured before you could own one, we'd have a lot less tragedies like Friday's.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

To both of you.......I do not pretend to know. But I want our lawmakers to approach this problem in a comprehensive manner. To ignore the firearms completely is kind of dumb. 

We are a people who value our right to own guns. They will always be part of our deal. We have to figure out a way to deal with this problem while preserving that right. Sometimes, in order to preserve something, some concessions need to be made.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > bodecea said:
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And, gun regulations get stricter and stricter.

She had no point.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> To both of you.......I do not pretend to know. But I want our lawmakers to approach this problem in a comprehensive manner. To ignore the firearms completely is kind of dumb.
> 
> We are a people who value our right to own guns. They will always be part of our deal. We have to figure out a way to deal with this problem while preserving that right. Sometimes, in order to preserve something, some concessions need to be made.



I agree. The gun nuts are the ones who aren't willing to even go halfway. And that's the problem. 

I have no problem with gun ownership if the gun-owner registers, licenses and safely stores his weapon, and carries insurance for any damage that gun might cause.  Just like you'd be required to do if you wanted to engage in any number of other activities. 

Some guns simply should not be in civilian hands.  Anything that fire semi-automatically, or has a high capacity clip.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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You have yet to even try to convince me. Why is that again?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
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Oh, please. if anything, they are getting looser.  How many states have "concealed Carry laws" now compared to 20 years ago?  

The gun regulations are not strict enough.  Not when Joker Holmes can walk into a gun store and buy a 100 round clip despite being batshit crazy.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> To both of you.......I do not pretend to know. But I want our lawmakers to approach this problem in a comprehensive manner. To ignore the firearms completely is kind of dumb.
> 
> We are a people who value our right to own guns. They will always be part of our deal. We have to figure out a way to deal with this problem while preserving that right. Sometimes, in order to preserve something, some concessions need to be made.


Concessions on infringement of the right to bear arms have been made for decades and during those decades, gun fatalities have increased.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
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> > bodecea said:
> ...



How many criminals do you think will allow the firearms they have to be licensed, registered and insured 
How many gang banger will march in lock step to have this done?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



I don't believe your son is a cop prove.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 16, 2012)

You can make your own gun AND ammunition idiot lefties.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Oh, dear.

We have another one who doesn't know the difference between a clip and a magazine.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > To both of you.......I do not pretend to know. But I want our lawmakers to approach this problem in a comprehensive manner. To ignore the firearms completely is kind of dumb.
> ...



You make these blanket statements that do not show cause and effect. They are meaningless. A combination of factors has resulted in the increase in mass killings with and without firearms. The concessions you speak of ( if the reall have been any considering the sheer number of guns in the country ) are not the sole reason for the increase in gun fatalities. I don't think that they are even a part of the reason. 

I could waste some breath and argue that the ban on guns in Japan is responsible for the fact that there are no more than a handful of gun related deaths in Japan each year. But that would ignore all the other cultural factors that go along with the ban. So...I'll just say that the ban has something to do with it. 

Logic. Try it sometime.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Why would I lie about that?


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Habit?


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> To both of you.......I do not pretend to know. But I want our lawmakers to approach this problem in a comprehensive manner. To ignore the firearms completely is kind of dumb.
> 
> We are a people who value our right to own guns. They will always be part of our deal. We have to figure out a way to deal with this problem while preserving that right. Sometimes, in order to preserve something, some concessions need to be made.



You are calling for increased regulations but you can't name one new law to bring forth that would have prevented this mass killing.

Would it be wrong for me to consider you just another person trying to politicize this tragedy by going after a hot button issue but with you, like far too many, offering no real solutions that will actually prevent this from ever happening again?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Logic? Well let's use England as an example when they went for hand gun bans the citizens gave concessions and allowed their right too own a hand gun away for the safety of the public. then the government went further and started taking other firearm rights away.
All because the people gave concessions.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


I can't say that I have caught him in a lie, but I can say that I have not been to concern to pay attention.


----------



## NoNukes (Dec 16, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > why do you guys even try to debate with joe????It is a exercise in futility. He has proven he cant understand the simplest of things and is programed to lick progressive boots.
> ...



You cannot debate with Joe because he is so much smarter and clued in than any of you.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Wrong.

"No scholars now claim that legalizing concealed weapons causes a major increase in crime."

'More Guns, Less Crime' Thesis Rests on a Flawed Statistical Design, Scholars Argue - Research - The Chronicle of Higher Education  Although some of the data is flawed in the study, the study is solid on indicating that legalizing concealed carry does not increase crime.

Less than 1% of gun deaths in 2009 were by those with conceal carry permits.  FBI &mdash; Crime2009


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > To both of you.......I do not pretend to know. But I want our lawmakers to approach this problem in a comprehensive manner. To ignore the firearms completely is kind of dumb.
> ...



Sweet like sugar. 

Yes that would be wrong of you. I am not focused on gun regs. I am focused on getting the discussion moving toward a place where solutions can be reached. Are you? You seem very focused on gun rights. 

I'm not proposing laws. I'm proposing that we consider the matter fully. Can you see the difference. Others have suggested possible regulations. I'm open to considering all of them. 

I'll bet when you read "consider" you think " accept". But that is a you problem.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Interesting.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...


Of course the ban on guns has something to do with less gun deaths in Japan, moron.  However, guns are not the ony way to kill.

Regulations on gun ownership have increased during the last several decades.  Fact.  Households with guns has decreased.  Fact.  Gun deaths have also increased.  Fact.  (all citations posted earlier in this thread, many by me)

So, let me know what ADDITIONAL gun regulations would prevent this.

Moron.


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## saveliberty (Dec 16, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



I would never want to stand in the way of Joe looking like the retarded ass he is.  Why too funny on his own.


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## NoNukes (Dec 16, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Could you write this again so that it makes sense?


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Tell me what you want done. Is that simple enough of a question to ask you? I have read your posts and you seem to be here, there and everywhere. You mention concessions. Tell me more. You have the floor. You are the boss. What should we do boss to prevent mass killings?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Both you and Joe are the blind leading the blind.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...




I  have caught you in a lie.

That is partly why I am pushing you on this point. You have yet to even attempt to convince me that you were a cop. I am here waiting to issue an apology. All you have to do is say something that makes me believe that you were once a cop.

It shouldn't be too hard.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



Did those big 3 and 4 letter words stump you?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



No you have not you lying sack of shit.
So I guess I have caught you in a lie.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



People with autism do not need a mental disorder, they are potential monsters as they are.

The monster inside my son - Salon.com


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


I don't believe you are a human.  Prove it.



How stupid can your questions about the personal lives of others be?  <---  That's rhetorical, by the way.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> How many criminals do you think will allow the firearms they have to be licensed, registered and insured
> How many gang banger will march in lock step to have this done?



Most gun deaths are suicides and domestic arguments and accidents.  That hoarde of criminals you think are out there being not white with intent isn't actually out there anywhere.  

You've bought into an industry based on fear...


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## Rat in the Hat (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > How many criminals do you think will allow the firearms they have to be licensed, registered and insured
> ...



I'd really like to know where in that post you read him saying criminals are "not white".


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > How many criminals do you think will allow the firearms they have to be licensed, registered and insured
> ...



Isn't pushing gun control based on fear?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



OH shit how did I miss that part? Didn't you know Joe is a racist?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

NoNukes said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > NoNukes said:
> ...



9 Oct 2012, why?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You really should stop posting when you are drunk. Name one murderer that ever argued that laws against murder were unjust.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > How many criminals do you think will allow the firearms they have to be licensed, registered and insured
> ...



I'm not even going to waste my time trying to disprove this one....You prove your numbers that you are claiming please....


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



They all drank Kool-Aid?


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Yup


The People's Temple in Jonestown under the direction of Jim Jones. Crazy people can kill large groups in many different manners.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


Isn't fear the preferred tactic of the NRA every election?  I live in a very pro-gun area and every four years I'm told by NRA advertisement that Democrats want to take away our guns.

Look, we're never going to be able to take away crazy.  We can't ever take away violent impulses.  But we have to do something to take "mass" out of "mass shooting".

The tool used to accomplish mass shooting is the high capacity magazine and the semi and fully automatic firing system.  The second amendment clearly states the need for a well regulated militia.  That doesn't mean forty guys dressed in camouflage re-enacting scenes from their favorite action movies or a batch of paranoid reactionaries who believe that the federal government is their darkest adversary.  It means a well regulated militia.  It means placing the weapons that make mass shootings possible unavailable to the general public and in control of the well regulated militias.

No gun enthusiasts rights will be infringed.  Guns for sport and personal defense aren't the problem.  But the guns that tear up city streets, our schools and our public places with fusillade after fusillade of bullets ARE the problem.  These weapons are living up to the reason they were designed: to kill as many people as quickly as possible.  They are not used legitimately for any other purpose and deserve to be banned from our society.


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You forget the other NRA tactic of blaming the victims for not being armed themselves.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


This was Joe's argument



> Most gun deaths are suicides and domestic arguments and accidents. That hoarde of criminals you think are out there being not white with intent isn't actually out there anywhere.
> 
> You've bought into an industry based on fear...



Isn't pushing for more gun control or ban based on fear?



> No gun enthusiasts rights will be infringed.  Guns for sport and personal defense aren't the problem.


Your position is flawed since you do not understand the concept and reason for the second amendment.
It has never been about hunting or home defense against a thief.  It is for the protection of the people against a tyrannical government. You want Americans to hand over the tool that would help fight against that?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



My goodness. A demand for a plan! Whatever shall I do? I think this really sweet  cookie wants to catch me contradicting myself.....and thinks I will surely do so if I accept her sugary challenge.

Shall I discuss my ideal society? Or shall I consider the realities of our American society? Surely, if I choose one, she will reply to the other! Worry....worry...worry!

Listen here, miss. 

I am a gun owner and have been one all my life. I am someone who has never fired a gun at another human being, but who thinks he could if the threat was clear. I like having my gun in my home. It is a little ol' thing...but it shoots real bullets and I can shoot straight. I don't anticipate ever having to give it up. 

Now....I cannot imagine ever needing a weapon that can mow down a half dozen humans in a few seconds. I'm thinking that we could do something about those kinds of guns. You know....make it really hard to get one and even harder to get ammunition for one. 
I'm not too confident that you and BigReb and Matthew, with your full arsenal, could hold off the US Military if they went nuts and decided to turn their weapons on the citizens. I'd probably live longer than you in that situation. 

As I have said.....our system of government is based on the will of the people. And the will of the people is that we shall have the right to own guns. But I think that there is an appetite for a real discussion about what types of guns are necessary to meet the will of the people. I am advocating that we have that discussion. Being silly and equating bullets aimed and fired with car accidents and plane crashes......and an attempt to avoid having the discussion.....gets us nowhere fast. As we have seen in this thread.

Along with that discussion..........there is a need to discuss other causes of the increase in these types of slaughters. The guns need a finger. The finger is operated by a brain that has problems. Those problems were caused by something.

let me know if you want that ideal society plan too. My ideal society kicks ass!


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## NoNukes (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> NoNukes said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



Details.


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Has Obama knocked on your door yet?
It's been weeks since the election, how come he hasn't taken your guns yet, as you predicted.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Sure I have. A silly little one. Don't you remember? Do I need to remind you?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...





> I am a gun owner and have been one all my life.



Like old rocks is a gun owner? Who thinks only a hunting rifle should be used as a home defense weapon? I don't believe you.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


  Your potential revolution is costing us the lives of innocents.  You and others like you who believe your arsenal can hold back the force to weaponry arrayed against it by the US Army are living in a fool's paradise.  We need to address the problem before us: mass shootings.  Not the paranoiac musings of reactionary minds.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...


Prove it.It hard to prove something when it didn't happen


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## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



 Ruffled feathers noted. You talk in broad terms but go weak when asked to commit to anything with details. I honestly don't care but if you are going to claim to want change and concession then perhaps some details to what you are wanting to see happen would help aid the discussion here.

So which weapons would you like regulations or changes put on?

Assault weapons and cars can do the same thing in the hands of crazy people even if you do think that premise is silly.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



You think a person has the right to self defense unless he is attacked by 6 people at once. 

I have to admit I stopped reading your post at that point.


----------



## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.

Guess what? It is a pistol free zone, however, the psycho didn't care,

It only stoped law abiding people who could make a difference.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Here it is. 

http://www.usmessageboard.com/6275111-post42.html

Silly, huh?


----------



## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.
> 
> Guess what? It is a pistol free zone, however, the psycho didn't care,
> 
> It only stoped law abiding people who could make a difference.



His mother was armed, and she's dead.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.
> 
> Guess what? It is a pistol free zone, however, the psycho didn't care,
> 
> It only stoped law abiding people who could make a difference.


The way to put out a fire is not adding gasoline.  More guns aren't the answer.  Eliminating the one tool that makes "Mass Shootings" "Mass" is the answer.  

Ban weapons designed for military and law enforcement use to the general public.  No one "needs" a semi or fully automatic firing system.  No one "needs" a high capacity magazine.  In fact, before such horrid weapons were made cheaply and in great quantities, there was no such thing as a "Mass Shooting".

No, the way to stop gun violence isn't adding more guns, it's subtracting them.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



You think I said that? 

You sure do take license.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



OH that constitutes a lie? a spelling error?


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...



When he started getting prickly and personal with me and behaving as if he knows me by stereotyping me and lumping me into some group of posters here I realized I wasted my time. He's a lightweight with no real argument just an agenda he refuses to comment on in detail.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


And your argument is flawed who said the army would violate there oath against the Constitution?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Oh no! YOU think I am a lightweight! This might be the end. 

What is my agenda, genius?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



The spelling error was not the lie. But you knew that. 

Silly lie.........silly liar.

Now....please convince me that you were once a cop. Please.


----------



## Dreamy (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Dreamy said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



I tried to discuss this issue respectfully with you in numerous posts and you danced around every question and then when cornered got personal. Honestly you are boring me now and there are too many other posters here to discuss this topic with to waste my time with childish crap. Besides I have to leave  now anyhow.  Enjoy your evening boss.


----------



## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.
> ...



How do you know she was carrying at the time her son shot her?


----------



## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...



I never claimed that, and I don't know.


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## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.
> ...



My constitutional rights are not based on what you think I need.

No one needs the right to give any stupid opinion but they have a right to do so.

And what is wrong with a semi-automiatic firearm? You want only revolvers to be legal? That's rather rediculous.

Any yeah it is needed. Why? Because criminals will obtain them whether they are legal or not. They don't care about following laws.

However, if a criminal that is armed breaks into my house, I want to have my AR-15 to defend myself, not a Swiss Army Knife.

I am a gun collector myself.

I have a:

 S&W Model 15 AR-15
Glock 19 9 mm
Glock 35 9 mm
Sig Sauer P220 .45
S&W M&Pc 9 mm
Kimber Pro Raptor II .45
A Colt Python .357
Two shotguns

Why? Because it's fun. I enjoy shooting. It's my hobby. 

Also both my wife and my wife have a Concealed Pistol License, so we also use our firearms for self defense.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



No, it's based on pragmatism. 

You don't need a fucking gun, and the cost of your lifestyle is too high for the rest of us to pay.


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## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



You said she was armed? How do you know? Owning guns doesn't mean you are armed at any given time.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Murderers don't argue anything, their lawyers do.   

Are you always this stupid, or just when your medications aren't kicking in?


----------



## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You don't need a fucking right to vote but you have one anyway.


----------



## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...



I'm not going to argue semantics with you.
She did everything that the NRA advises by purchasing suitable weapons for self defence, but she's still dead.
Oh, I know, she's only got herself to blame for not carrying them on her.

Would teachers be required to carry weapons at all times?
Should they penalised if they put them down for a moment?


----------



## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



I think they should be allowed to carry.

However, in almost all states schools are pistol free zones, and they are not allowed to carry. Aside from that they would probably get fired if they did.

Conn. has one of the most anti-gun ownership rights laws. It didn't help, did it?

The problem is that criminals don't care about pistol free zones. If anything, it attracts them to attack this target, because they know honest citizens are not allowed to carry firearms in this area.

Also, the firearms is useless if it's not accessible when you need it.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



There's a right to vote enshrined in the constitution. 

There's only a right to militias in the second Amendment.  If you aren't part of a well-regulated militia, you don't need a gun. 

Now, personally, I'd have no problem with reasonable people having guns... if you guys could police yourselves.  you simply refuse to do it.  

So again, if we have to impose a bunch of laws on you, I'm completely good with that.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...



My goodness! What a cache! And both of your wives are prepared for action.....you are 
my hero.

Are all of those firearms legally owned by you? How long have you had them?


----------



## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
> ...


Too many whine about a problem but are too timid (or stupid) to be part of a solution.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> I think they should be allowed to carry.
> 
> However, in almost all states schools are pistol free zones, and they are not allowed to carry. Aside from that they would probably get fired if they did.
> 
> ...



You really think this guy picked out this school because it was a "gun free zone"?  

He picked it out because he had a history with it, dumbass. 

Only in NRA bizarro world do you think the answer to too many guns is more guns.


----------



## uscitizen (Dec 16, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...



We have tons (literally) of chemical WMDs stockpiled here in KY.
Will we be invaded?


----------



## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


The SCOTUS says otherwise.  I would bet they are much brighter and wiser than you are and would bet a king's ransom that they know the Constitution better than you do (except for that idiot Ginsberg...she's a bit scatterbrained).  Plus, a not-so-minor detail, it's the law.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > How many criminals do you think will allow the firearms they have to be licensed, registered and insured
> ...



the DOJ statistics say otherwise but keep on a lyin Joe


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Gun control is not based on fear? if their is no fear why push for it?



> You don't need a fucking gun


Who the fuck are you to say what I do and don't need? I guess your religion is faith based in the government prayer line 911.
Do you know the police are not legally obligated to protect you?


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> The SCOTUS says otherwise.  I would bet they are much brighter and wiser than you are and would bet a king's ransom that they know the Constitution better than you do (except for that idiot Ginsberg...she's a bit scatterbrained).



Sorry, mutants like Scalia and Clarance Thomas were not picked for their "brilliant minds".  

They were picked because they vote for stupid shit. 

Scalia has a heart attack, Obama appoints his replacement, and the Second Amendment is about Miliitias again.   

This is not a game you're going to win.  Not with the Democrats dominating the presidency for the next few decades.   Alito was the last knuckled dragger you guys are going to get, so you might as well enjoy him.

Oh, and you don't think Kennedy and Roberts aren't having second thoughts about Heller this evening?  Betcha they are!


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



What lie was that liar?


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > I think they should be allowed to carry.
> ...



show us one post that clamors for "more guns"

the world is waiting for your brilliant retort


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> JoeB131 said:
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Lol..the world is going to be waiting a looong time.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> CMike said:
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Liar.


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

CMike said:


> idb said:
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But, should they be *required* to carry, to keep the kids safe?

The gun lobby in the US seems unable to accept any discussion at all on gun laws.
Although I'm sure there are many people that would like to get rid of guns altogether, the sensible discussion is more nuanced than that.
Things like the appropriateness of assault weapons, automatics, open or concealed carry, handguns.
Where I come from, these sorts of weapons are allowed, but only to registered collectors.


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## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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I made a typo. I meant by me and my wife.

My wife owns the S&W M&Pc 9 mm. That's her carry gun.

I have accumulated them.

What does the period of time matter?


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> Nosmo King said:
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link?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
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Obviously, they didn't teach you the difference between fear and valid concern in Home Skule.  

Hey, turns out old Adam was a Home Skule Valedictorian, just like you were. 

Crazy people shouldn't have guns.  If they can legally buy them, then they are too easy to get.  If they can take them from their parents, they are too easy to get.  




> > You don't need a fucking gun
> 
> 
> Who the fuck are you to say what I do and don't need? I guess your religion is faith based in the government prayer line 911.
> Do you know the police are not legally obligated to protect you?



Again, a gun in the house is 43 times more likely to kill someone in the house than someone trying to get in. 

Proven. Fact.


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

What do gun laws have to do with protecting children from those who target them at school?


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
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> > JoeB131 said:
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Ask bigrednec for his opinion then.


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## koshergrl (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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Then link it, puke.


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## CMike (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> CMike said:
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> > idb said:
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No they should be allowed to required.

I think the gun lobby is more than happy to accept a discussion regarding giving honest citizens more of their gun rights.

Any weapon can be considered an assault weapon. Any weapon can be use to assault.

Automatics are illegal in Michigan without a special license.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
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Feeling kind of sad, huh?

That's what really big fingers do to a man. All the blood that normally would flow to your brain has to be used up so you can pick your nose and scratch your balls.


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## bodecea (Dec 16, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Dreamy said:
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Yes they did.   Afterwards were those asking that something be done vilified?


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
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> > bodecea said:
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the firearms used were licensed and registered.

Do you think their "being insured" would have made a difference too?

What an idiot you are


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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and there will be 100% chance that someone who attempts to confiscate my firearms will be killed

and I believe that our lawmakers and law enforcement personnel know that which is why there will be no radical changes in gun laws as you far left rabid mongrels suggest


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> Obviously, they didn't teach you the difference between fear and valid concern in Home Skule.



Covering your ass with the double talk must really be exhausting.  Gun control is based on fear.



> Crazy people shouldn't have guns.  If they can legally buy them, then they are too easy to get.  If they can take them from their parents, they are too easy to get.


Who is saying crazy people should be allowed guns? Crazy people cannot buy any firearms and you need to stop saying they can it does nothing to promote your view but makes you into a liar.


> Again, a gun in the house is 43 times more likely to kill someone in the house than someone trying to get in.



The study by Arthur Kellermann from which that statistic is pulled doesn't say that. The number includes suicides. The study doesn't take into account defensive uses in which a shot was not fired (99% of the uses), and it doesn't reflect intruders avoiding homes with firearms inside.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


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To the bolded:  Citation, please.  (And a picture of your ass won't do.)


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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Still waiting on that lie you think I said, LIAR.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> [
> 
> Then link it, puke.



I've linked to teh Kellerman study a bunch of times.  

And even though it's validity has been verified by the CDC, the gun nutters will still go out there and claim, "THAT'S NOT TRUE" 

Kellerman study if proven fact.  A gun in the house is 43 times more likely to kill a member of the household than an intruder. 

Arthur Kellermann - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In his first publication on the subject, in 1986, Kellermann studied all gunshot related deaths in Seattle over six years, and found that
54% of firearm-related deaths occurred in the home where the gun was kept
70.5% of these (firearm-related deaths in the home where the gun was kept) involved handguns
0.5% of these (firearm-related deaths in the home where the gun was kept) involved an intruder shot while attempting entry
1.8% of these (firearm-related deaths in the home where the gun was kept) were judged by police as self-defense
there were 1.3 times as many accidental firearm-related deaths in the home where the gun was kept as self-protection shootings
there were 4.6 times as many criminal firearm-related homicides in the home where the gun was kept as self-protection shootings
there were 37 times as many suicides in the home where the gun was kept as self-protection shootings.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Posted long ago. You must have missed it. Maybe those massive digits got in the way.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Posted long ago. You must have missed it. Maybe those massive digits got in the way.



I read the post..... still waiting liar.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
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The* actual* study by Arthur Kellermann from which that statistic is pulled doesn't say that. The number includes suicides. The study doesn't take into account defensive uses in which a shot was not fired (99% of the uses), and it doesn't reflect intruders avoiding homes with firearms inside.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> [
> 
> The study by Arthur Kellermann from which that statistic is pulled doesn't say that. The number includes suicides. The study doesn't take into account defensive uses in which a shot was not fired (99% of the uses), and it doesn't reflect intruders avoiding homes with firearms inside.



No, and it doesn't include cases where the Hillbilly redneck father terrorized his family by threatening to shoot the family dog, either.  

Kellerman found that for every INTRUDER killed, 43 HOUSEHOLD members were.  

Which is pretty much good enough for me.  The suicides are just as dead as the spouse who gets shot in an argument over who got the last sausage link.  

Both of which are far more likely to happen than plugging a bad guy. 



> Who is saying crazy people should be allowed guns? Crazy people cannot buy any firearms and you need to stop saying they can it does nothing to promote your view but makes you into a liar.



Loughner, Holmes and Cho.  All crazy. Able to buy guns with little difficulty.  

And until you offer a way to keep them from buying guns, you condone their ability to do so.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
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> > koshergrl said:
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I know that's the talking point. "No fair counting suicides!!!!"  

It's bullshit.  A gun in the house makes it a lot easier to kill yourself.   In fact, the ONLY two gun fatalities I know of personally were sucides.


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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Does the name Russell Pearce ring any bells?
Russell Pearce Blames Victims for Dark Knight Massacre (w/Update) - Phoenix - News - Feathered Bastard


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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What you like to repeatedly quote and use "wiki" as a source
Handguns are 43 times more likely to kill a member of your own family than an intruder."
Is not found in the actual study \ so stop fucking lying.


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


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Can Owning a Gun Really Triple the Owner's Chances of being Murdered?
The Anatomy of an Implausible Causal Mechanism

    GARY KLECK

Abstract

Using a case-control design comparing homicide victims with matched nonvictims, Kellermann et al. (1993) concluded that keeping a gun in one's home increased the risk of being murdered by a factor of 2.7. The authors' underlying assumption was that a significant elevation in homicide risk derived from the risk of being murdered with a gun kept in the victim's home. *This article shows that homicides are rarely committed with guns belonging to members of the victim's home and that such killings could be responsible for no more than a 2.4% increase in the relative risk of being murdered.* Guns in one's own home have little to do with homicide risk. Scholars need to attend more closely to the mechanisms by which an alleged causal effect is supposed to operate and to consider their plausibility before concluding that an association reflects a causal effect.​[emphasis added]   Can Owning a Gun Really Triple the Owner's Chances of being Murdered?

That's not 43 times more, Joe.  Not even close.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
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here I thought you were going to come up with a Wayne Lapierre quote.

FAIL


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## longknife (Dec 16, 2012)

*SANDY HOOK ELEMENTARY: The Sickness of the Media*

by directorblue at Doug Ross @ Journal: SANDY HOOK ELEMENTARY: The Sickness of the Media blogs this:






During a special service at St. John's Church in Sandy Hook:
"Bunch of over-zealous photographers were just asked to leave."

with this followup

*MEANWHILE, in the nation's safest city... *

by directorblue

Chicago, Illinois must be the safest city in the U.S. because: (a) it has the most draconian gun restrictions; and (b) it resides in the state with the strictest firearm regulations in the country.








> Shootings across the city Friday afternoon and night wounded at least ten people, according to Chicago police, including four teens in three separate South and West side attacks.



Read more with links at Doug Ross @ Journal: MEANWHILE, in the nation's safest city...

*Rules of Gunfighting*

by Craig Newmark at &#8220;These Are The 13 Rules Of Gunfighting Everyone Should Know&#8221; | Right Wing News 



> Heres one: The average response time of a 911 call is 23 minutes, the response time of a .357 is 1400 feet per second.



*Response*

by Owen of Boots & Sabers blog


Thats about right: Here we go again | Rachel Lucas 



> Another horrific massacre by another psychopath, another inevitable several weeks of hyper-coverage and heartbreaking stories about innocent-child victims who are somehow more worthy of public displays of grief than all the other innocent-child victims of tragic death on the same day, another orgy of sickening anti-American smugness in the international press, and of course another shrieking chorus of poorly-thought-out demands for more gun control laws because evidently our murder control laws arent enough.
> 
> Its downright Pavlovian.




*A second mass shooting avoided on Friday*

by Jazz Shaw @ A second mass shooting avoided on Friday « Hot Air 



> It looks like there might be one bit of good news from yesterday, if such is even possible. Police in Oklahoma are indicating that there was a second mass shooting in a school planned there for the same day, but sharp police work thwarted it before it got off the ground.


BARTLESVILLE, Okla.  A []


*New Details About Sandy Hook Shooting Suspect Adam Lanza*

by Michael Kelley



> New details are emerging about the troubling circumstances surrounding Adam Lanza, who allegedly shot and killed his mother Nancy at their home in Newtown, Conn. Friday morning before going to Sandy Hook Elementary school and killing 20 children, six adults and himself.



Read more: Who Was Adam Lanza, The Sandy Hook Shooter - Business Insider 

*More than 50 shots fired at Fashion Island mall; suspect held*



> Marcos Gurrola, 42, of Garden Grove is suspected of firing a handgun in the mall parking lot in Newport Beach. No one was hit.



From More than 50 shots fired at Fashion Island mall; suspect arrested - latimes.com 


* Thinking the Unthinkable*





Michael holding a butterfly



> In the wake of another horrific national tragedy, its easy to talk about guns. But its time to talk about mental illness.



Read more of this horrified mother's story @ The Anarchist Soccer Mom: Thinking the Unthinkable courtesy of FARK


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Joe I'm going to use wiki since you seem to like the source


> 1 Bleeding
> 1.1 Wrist cutting
> 2 Drowning
> 3 Suffocation
> ...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_methods
Guns are one of the last choices to use.
What do you ban in that list?


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## idb (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > squeeze berry said:
> ...



Well...SURPRIIIISE!!!!
There are more nutters representing the gun lobby than you realised.


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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bigot much?


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## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> squeeze berry said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
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Well...SURPRIIIISE!!!!
there are more liars and nutters from New Zealand than you realised


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Posted long ago. You must have missed it. Maybe those massive digits got in the way.
> ...



Hey, I have an idea for you. If you call me a liar enough times.....like in every post addressed to me......maybe someone who doesn't know better will get the impression that I am a liar. Isn't that cool! 

It is such an effective strategy.....maybe you should pass it on to some of your friends. Who knows, maybe a cable network will adopt it too.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
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So who is "you guys"? I've owned weapons as long as i can remember, i have never had any reason to use my privately owned weapon on a person and hope that i never have to.  Yet all you do is talk shit about my lifestyle when you know nothing about it....And then you hit us with these calls of racist and paint "you guys" with a broad brush....

Why don't you just quit while you can save some face....


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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I dunno, but I would imagine a poster knows more about himself than you do, yet you make claims as "facts" about a person whose name you don't even know.



That's pretty fucking stupid.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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Most everyone i know has at least one gun in their house....Always have, and i cannot remember one person ever being shot or any accidental firings in any of those houses....You would think......


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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I have an idea why don't you prove it or shut the fuck up?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> LoneLaugher said:
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> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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I am more than willing to admit my mistake and apologize to the BR if he can just say something that makes me believe that he was once a police officer. He has said that he was. So far........not even an attempt.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
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I'm the forgiving sort, BR. I won't hold it against you. But believing what you say has become a bit difficult, as you can imagine. For some reason, I have a pretty accurate bullshit detector. Not perfect......but usually on target.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

idb said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.
> ...



For all you know his mother had trigger locks on all her weapons.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > If there were people at the school who were armed they may have stopped the shooter.
> ...



Isn't that what they said about alcohol and drugs?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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Are you saying you didn't post this?



> I cannot imagine ever needing a weapon that can mow down a half dozen  humans in a few seconds. I'm thinking that we could do something about  those kinds of guns.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

Dreamy said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
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I stopped treating idiots with respect a long time ago. I find it easier to mock them.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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What does it take to make you understand I don't give a fuck if you believe me or not?
How are Police supposed to talk on the internet? Do you want my arrest record, the citations I issued? Court docket numbers? How many investigation I was a part of?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
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Why don't you just admit you are afflicted with posting with your head up your ass?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
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I said that. But I did not say that a person who is attacked by 6 people at once does not have the right to defend himself. You said that. I said that I cannot imagine ever needing a weapon that can mow down a half dozen humans in a few seconds. definitely not the same thing.

I think you know this.....but every once in a while your stupid act is really, really effective and I'm not sure. If you think I said that people lose their right to defend themselves when the attackers are many......you are a fucking idiot.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
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Strike 2
Once you accused me of lying without producing any evidence that makes you a liar.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
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If we are to believe the experts in the FBI who make their living profiling people like this they pick schools because they are soft targets. Have you ever heard of a guy who has a history with cops going into a police station and trying to shoot people?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> CMike said:
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There is a right to militias in the 2nd Amendment? Where?


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## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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If I were he, I wouldn't make any attempt, either.  First, out of principle because I don't give a flying fuck if posters believe a thing I say about myself; and secondly, if I did give a flying fuck what they believe or don't believe about me, I sure as hell would not post anything that could possibly self-identify me to the psychos at USMB.  Not all are psychos, but many are.  (Unfortunately, some sharp poster recently figured out who I am, so I will have to be more careful.  I trust her to keep that info under her hat, though.)

And finally, pissing matches are boring and that's all this is between you two - a pissing match....no you aren't....yes I am....lather, rinse, repeat.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

bodecea said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamy said:
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Only by people that knew what would happen if we gave the government power to control airport security.


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## zakdavis (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
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She home schooled him because she didn't like the way the school system was dealing with his autism. He even went to high school for I don't know how long, but it was long enough to be an honors student. If she was a gun nut or not, I don't know. From what I've seen she legally owned a .223 Rifle, a Sig Saur, and a 10mm Glock.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > CMike said:
> ...


There have been what we'll call 'advancements' in drug technology.  Crack cocaine, ecstasy, crystal meth, and purer, more potent heroin.  No one is suggesting that enforcement and prevention efforts be stopped when faced with these perils.

Advancements in weapons technology have wrought the cheap hand gun (formerly referred to as a Saturday Night Special), high capacity magazines and fully or semi automatic firing systems.  

To use your comparison, crack cocaine and crystal meth haven't shown to be benefits to society.  Can you say that this new gun technology has benefitted us well?  Why are such guns allowed to be sold to the public?  Seems we got along okay before we could walk into a school or theater or restaurant or campus and fired scores of bullets in the blink of an eye.  Hunters still bagged their game.  Gun enthusiasts still were able to satisfy their lust for power or deny their penis envy.  

But now we must endure mass shootings because gun makers developed new super guns.  The solution is to revert to the gun technology and laws we had before the advent of designers of death toiling away in gun factories.

If laws were passed stating the manufacture, sale, distribution and possession of semi or fully automatic firing systems as well as magazines capable of holding more than ten rounds was a federal crime, all in an effort to rid ourselves of these super guns, would that be the wrong step?  Further, gun owners would have a reasonable time frame to turn in such guns and receive a tax credit equal to the value of each gun.  Any guns held by people other than law enforcement or military would be then confiscated and those in possession of such guns would face a mandatory prison term.  Any such gun used in commission of a crime would be confiscated and the possessor again would face a mandatory prison term.

All in the greater effort to rid society of the blight of mass shootings and violent street crime.


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## mal (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
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Hey Joe... Shove it up your ass!...  



peace...


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Si Modo Hates pissing matches. Good to know.


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## jillian (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> bodecea said:
> 
> 
> > Rat in the Hat said:
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government ALWAYS had the right to control airport security.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> 
> > JoeB131 said:
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Hanging is the most common method of suicide, maybe we should outlaw belts.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Noomi said:
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I will not give credence to illegal "laws" and any law that violates my Constitutional right is illegal, and yeah, I would shoot any sob that came into my home to take my property and to violate my rights.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
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Except you do not want him to have a weapon that would be effective if that happened. Care to explain how you think a right to self defense works if you do not also have a right to the tools needed to do the job?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Illegal laws. A moron with and oxymoron. Sweet.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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You don't have any Constitutional right to bare your naked ass in public, I on the ohter hand have a Constitution right, no, take that back, a Constitutional duty, to bear arms, so your argument is worthless.  As a patriot I am willing to fight to protect my Constitutional rights, and as a former Marine I swore an oath to defend those Constitutional rights with my life if neccessary, an oath that had no time limit on it slick.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Illegal laws. A moron with and oxymoron. Sweet.




Spoken like the moron you are.  Here's a clue for you dude.  EVERY time the Supreme Court knocks down a law as being un-Constituional, they are saying the law was illegal to begin with, therefore un-enforcible.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Hmmm, You are a slippery one. Never willing to just admit when you are wrong. How about you pay attention. I never said that someone should not have a weapon like that I said that I can't imagine needing one. I have also said that these types of weapons need to be more strictly regulated..........not banned. If the jerkoff in question can demonstrate a need for said weapon....let him get it......but let him have to jump through a few hoops to do so. 

I don't know about you, but I have never felt that making laws that take the most improbable circumstances into account is a very efficient or effective strategy. Think about it. You'll probably agree.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Illegal laws. A moron with and oxymoron. Sweet.
> ...



And then.........only then......it is a law that YOU get to ignore as "illegal" because it IS NO LONGER A LAW. You are special.


----------



## jillian (Dec 16, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Illegal laws. A moron with and oxymoron. Sweet.
> ...



theoretically. but the reality is that for the law to have gotten to the supreme court, it would have already BEEN enforced because only someone against whom it had been enforced would have standing to bring a challenge.


----------



## Samson (Dec 16, 2012)

jillian said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...





And your point, then would be?


----------



## jillian (Dec 16, 2012)

Samson said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



to respond to his misleading statement.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> There have been what we'll call 'advancements' in drug technology.  Crack cocaine, ecstasy, crystal meth, and purer, more potent heroin.  No one is suggesting that enforcement and prevention efforts be stopped when faced with these perils.



I wouldn't be so sure of that if I were you. I bet I can find hundreds of people that think we should end all law enforcement and prevention efforts against drugs, quite a few of them active duty law enforcement.

Let's End Drug Prohibition - WSJ.com

LEAP | Law Enforcement Against Prohibition

Maybe you should pay more attention to the real world.



Nosmo King said:


> Advancements in weapons technology have wrought the cheap hand gun (formerly referred to as a Saturday Night Special), high capacity magazines and fully or semi automatic firing systems.



None of those are new technology. The simple fact is that large capacity magazines only work in movies, in real life they tend to jam. I don't know anyone who actually uses their weapons that even owns one. 



Nosmo King said:


> To use your comparison, crack cocaine and crystal meth haven't shown to be benefits to society.  Can you say that this new gun technology has benefitted us well?  Why are such guns allowed to be sold to the public?  Seems we got along okay before we could walk into a school or theater or restaurant or campus and fired scores of bullets in the blink of an eye.  Hunters still bagged their game.  Gun enthusiasts still were able to satisfy their lust for power or deny their penis envy.



Things have to show a benefit to society to be legal? Can you explain Coca Cola using that logic? 



Nosmo King said:


> But now we must endure mass shootings because gun makers developed new super guns.  The solution is to revert to the gun technology and laws we had before the advent of designers of death toiling away in gun factories.



What new super guns are you talking about? The only new super guns I know of are the vehicle mounted microwave guns that are designed to disperse crowds.



Nosmo King said:


> If laws were passed stating the manufacture, sale, distribution and possession of semi or fully automatic firing systems as well as magazines capable of holding more than ten rounds was a federal crime, all in an effort to rid ourselves of these super guns, would that be the wrong step?  Further, gun owners would have a reasonable time frame to turn in such guns and receive a tax credit equal to the value of each gun.  Any guns held by people other than law enforcement or military would be then confiscated and those in possession of such guns would face a mandatory prison term.  Any such gun used in commission of a crime would be confiscated and the possessor again would face a mandatory prison term.



You want to make the standard issue police Glock illegal? The Sig Sauer that the Secret Service uses? Just because you have trouble counting above 10?

Why?



Nosmo King said:


> All in the greater effort to rid society of the blight of mass shootings and violent street crime.



It is already illegal for most gang members to won guns, yet they routinely use them to shoot each other. Do you think a federal law regulating magazine capacity would somehow magically make these people comply with the law?

This is a fairly nice blog that can explain to you why you are being stupid without actually calling you stupid, you should read it.

The facts of life on high capacity magazines | United Liberty | Free Market - Individual Liberty - Limited Government


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

jillian said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > bodecea said:
> ...



Governments do not have rights.


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 16, 2012)

jillian said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...




And what happens to the defendent when the Surpreme Court rules a law they had been arrested for was an illegal law?  They are set free, becuase they were detained and inprisoned on an unenforceable law.


----------



## bodecea (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Oh?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



You can't imagine getting attacked by 6 people at once?

By the way, you said we should do something about weapons like that, which means I am accurately representing your words. 

I don't know about you, but I think laws should be able to deal with anything that comes along, even the improbable. I think that is why politicians spend so much time babbling about the unlikely events, and why they created things like safe have laws, for those extremely rare occasions when a mother wants to give up her child.

Unless, of course, you think we should get rid of those laws.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 16, 2012)

bodecea said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Yes.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


 
There, there.........I won't make you admit your mistake. Consider yourself off the hook. You are going to twist yourself into a knot.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...


Such a witty and trollish retort. Did you get from jokes are us dot com?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

I love that word "retort". Just love it.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> I love that word "retort". Just love it.



Because it closely resemble's what you are retard?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Wooohooo! You ain't funny. I know it burns your ass........but there is nothing you can do about it. You are what you are.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> I love that word "retort". Just love it.


Great.  Maybe you can strive to make one at some point.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Wooohooo! You ain't funny. I know it burns your ass........but there is nothing you can do about it. You are what you are.



Who said I was trying to be funny, does the truth give you a chapped ass?


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 16, 2012)

Lord knows Lone has committed enough torts.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

It's funny to watch the poseur LoneLaughter beg for a discussion about the topic, but all it does is bitch about a problem without providing any....not a single....idea for a solution.

Whiny cowards do that.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Come on now.......why all the hostility? You all seem like such likeable people. My feelings are gonna get hurt.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Come on now.......why all the hostility? You all seem like such likeable people. My feelings are gonna get hurt.



Poor baby go cry on truth don't matter avatar.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> It's funny to watch the *poseur* LoneLaughter beg for a discussion about the topic, but all it does is bitch about a problem without providing any....not a single....idea for a solution.
> 
> Whiny cowards do that.



Oh! French! Are you trying to woo me? How's about a reach around?


----------



## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Come on now.......why all the hostility? You all seem like such likeable people. My feelings are gonna get hurt.


I can't speak for others, but I am only hostile toward those about whom I give a damn.  You just provide entertainment when the board is slow.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 16, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > Come on now.......why all the hostility? You all seem like such likeable people. My feelings are gonna get hurt.
> ...



Please, Copper.............please have mercy!


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...


It's not in me to give.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 16, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > There have been what we'll call 'advancements' in drug technology.  Crack cocaine, ecstasy, crystal meth, and purer, more potent heroin.  No one is suggesting that enforcement and prevention efforts be stopped when faced with these perils.
> ...


I'll take this blog under advisement and give it all the credence it's due.


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 16, 2012)

Holy crap it sounds like Obama will change the gun laws, he's leading up to it.


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 16, 2012)

Obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

I doubt it......


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 16, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> I doubt it......



He was leading up to it, then he kind of ended his speech....maybe later this week they will discuss it more...


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 16, 2012)

Not going to happen...Cooler heads will prevail with all the time it would take for a constitutional amendment.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 16, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > I doubt it......
> ...



He didn't want to politicize the event...

..too much...

...until next week.

I smell another campaign!!!


----------



## Si modo (Dec 16, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!


You're pretty clueless about how our government works.


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!
> ...


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 16, 2012)

BecauseIKnow said:


> Obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!



don't you mean allah akbar?


----------



## BecauseIKnow (Dec 16, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> becauseiknow said:
> 
> 
> > obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!
> ...



.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 16, 2012)

Si modo said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!
> ...



Yes I'm pretty sure you are right.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Dec 17, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> BecauseIKnow said:
> 
> 
> > Obama will modify second amendment. Takbeer!
> ...



I think this is what he means.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 17, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Joe I'm going to use wiki since you seem to like the source
> 
> 
> > 1 Bleeding
> ...



Guy, not even a nice try.  They didn't even give percentages.  Here, let's help you out... 






55% of sucides are with firearms... Get rid of the firearms, you could reduce the sucide rate by 55%.  Hypothetically, because all those other methods are a lot harder.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 17, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



No, guns are the most common method of sucide... look it up.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 17, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Anyone convinced of suicide will find a way to do it if firearms don't exist.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 17, 2012)

jillian said:


> you understand half the court disagreed with heller, right?



 How many persons are half of nine?


----------



## KissMy (Dec 17, 2012)

Rat in the Hat said:


> The 9/11 hijackers killed hundreds if not thousands of victims in seconds. Maybe we need plane control laws?



Until the early 1960s, American commercial passenger pilots were required to carry handguns. An Federal Aviation Administration rule that allowed commercial airline pilots to be armed was inexplicably rescinded two months before the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 17, 2012)

Progressives give a lot of lip service to trying to find out *why* more people die today, at the hands of others, *why* children are at higher risk of being slaughtered than ever before, why crime and disease run rampant at levels never before seen in our country; *why* there is more child abuse and teen pregnancy.

Yet they refuse to acknowledge that all those things have increased in lock step with the advancement of progressive principles and laws in our society.


----------



## jillian (Dec 17, 2012)

Si modo said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > you understand half the court disagreed with heller, right?
> ...



4.5 but since clarence thomas may have 1/2 the intellect of the other justices, but a full vote, well... you know the answer.

snarky, pointless question, because i assume you understood that my point was that the majority position (by one vote) in a decision written by scalia, isn't the only interpretation of the amendment.

that would have been in response to an insulting post that pretends that the other pov either doesn't exist or is stupid. so the point, in a nutshell, is half the court isn't stupid.

capice?


----------



## Ancient lion (Dec 17, 2012)

Prayer for CT Shooting Victims by Dr. Shabir Ally
Prayer for CT Shooting Victims by Dr. Shabir Ally 

However..,it's an alarming point !



> Though I empathize deeply with the victims&#8217; families, it&#8217;s a shame that even after this small taste of her own bitter medicine, America won&#8217;t decide to stop the other &#8216;shootings&#8217; going on around the world. She&#8217;ll lower flags for a few days over the 26 killed, but Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and so many others, have millions of children to mourn. Twenty-six/millions. You do the math. We&#8217;ve been crying a lot longer than you have.
> 
> Élisabeth Strout


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Joe I'm going to use wiki since you seem to like the source
> ...



Interesting, a chart with nothing to back it up. I bet you think it proves something.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 17, 2012)

It proves he can access an infogram-maker.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I did, feel free to refute my source.

Evans, Glen, et. al. 2003. _The Encyclopedia of Suicide. _2nd ed. New York, NY: Facts on File, Inc.


----------



## peach174 (Dec 17, 2012)

Si modo said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



China has the highest suicide rate in the world.
The private citizens are not allowed to possess guns.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 17, 2012)

So guns cause suicide and homicide?

Huh.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 17, 2012)

Do fists cause child abuse?

Do penises cause rape?

We'd better start cutting off hands and dicks.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Do fists cause child abuse?
> 
> Do penises cause rape?
> 
> We'd better start cutting off hands and dicks.



Let's not get carried away here.......


----------



## Politico (Dec 17, 2012)

Why not? There's so much bullshit flying around at this point from everyone. I just heard the governor of CT talking about how the first responders put their lives on the line that day. The news media have moved their offices to CT and turned this thing into a three ring circus. My relative got out ok. But they can't go to school. That's gonna be closed for months for some unnecessary reason. Can't leave the house without being harrassed. Diane Feinstein even skipped her botox to go on meet the press.


----------



## wavingrl (Dec 17, 2012)

Politico said:


> Why not? There's so much bullshit flying around at this point from everyone. I just heard the governor of CT talking about how the first responders put their lives on the line that day. The news media have moved their offices to CT and turned this thing into a three ring circus. My relative got out ok. But they can't go to school. That's gonna be closed for months for some unnecessary reason. Can't leave the house without being harrassed. Diane Feinstein even skipped her botox to go on meet the press.



The Sandy Hook elementary is determined a crime scene by LE and they anticipate that it will take several months to complete investigations.

The students will be housed at a former middle school in a neighboring town--when it is decided they should/can return to school. 

I suppose the media will be there for another week or two. The officer in charge of things told them there wouldn't be any further press releases and to check the web page for updates. 

Unfortunately the town is picturesque, the story has many human interest angles and political angles--just too perfect for journalists.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)




----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 17, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


>



Not ideal, Ollie. Not for sane people.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


>



And none of the children take the weapon away from their teachers to shoot each other?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



You think it is the sign of sanity to let children be killed by crazy people?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



Not a one of them..... I'll bet they even say please and thank you......


----------



## Si modo (Dec 17, 2012)

jillian said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


  Testy.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 17, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Whoa.......deep.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 17, 2012)

On arming teachers and/or staff...

May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.

And you propose arming school staff.  Are these armed school personnel better marksmen?  Do they have keenly honed reaction times?  Are they trained to be cool in a hot situation?

Because the Secret Service and the D.C. cops were at the scene and armed.

And who pays for the weaponry and training for school staff?  Schools go hat in hand to state houses and are told the well has run dry.  No additional funding for public schools.  Don't tell me you think guns and not textbooks makes for a wise choice!


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 17, 2012)

Which is why there weren't more people killed.

Though that particular shooter only had one target. If his goal had been to take out 24 people or so, he would have been stopped before 24 ppl died.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 17, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Which is why there weren't more people killed.
> 
> Though that particular shooter only had one target. If his goal had been to take out 24 people or so, he would have been stopped before 24 ppl died.


The only shots fired that afternoon were from Hinckley's gun.  They wrestled him to the ground, they never shot back.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> ...



Several teachers gave their lives for the students.  Sounds like a secret service agent to me.  Six shots in 1.7 seconds, the school shooter had almost ten minutes.  Reading skills don't help much, if you aren't breathing.  I can't help but think you were about to make a valid point.  Please make the attempt.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> ...



I'll supply my own weapon and I'm already trained


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Which is why there weren't more people killed.
> ...



Well there you have it.  They should have just left their guns at home...

Dimwit.


----------



## KissMy (Dec 17, 2012)

Sign The Arm The Teachers Petition! 7,269 signed so far.

The state of Utah has always allowed teachers to carry guns in class & has never had an incident. Why can't we all have that?

Texas School District Will Let Teachers Carry Guns


----------



## jillian (Dec 17, 2012)

Si modo said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



not in the least. more that i was embarrassed for you.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> ...



The Principal from what we have been told charged the gunman unarmed. She died. Her kids died. Had she had a gun she may have been able to stop this madman......


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 17, 2012)

jillian said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Embarrassed has a definition in the dictionary.  Its okay, we'll wait while you look it up.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Sign The Arm The Teachers Petition! 7,269 signed so far.
> 
> The state of Utah has always allowed teachers to carry guns in class & has never had an incident. Why can't we all have that?



Signed.......


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



It's insane to keep thinking gun control works.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 17, 2012)

Gun control is critical to a clean shot.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



I suggest using two hands..........


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 17, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > On arming teachers and/or staff...
> ...


If an assailant can shoot the president, there is no real safety.  And to arm school staff with a minimum of training, to introduce guns into a normal school environment and to provide funding when funding for actually useful material has been roundly denied  adds up to a series of extraordinarily poor decisions when a truly wise decision is called for.

I remember the first time I went to Europe.  It was Spring of 1990.  The Berlin Wall had just come down the Autumn before.  I was stunned and intimidates by guards with Uzi's and other makes of assault weaponry.  I can't imagine the impression a gun toting school employee would make on Elementary aged kids.  Believe me, it's a factor worth weighing.

The political hypocrisy of funding what certainly promises to be, a multi-billion dollar project to arm, train and pay people to patrol a playground is something Republicans will have to come to grips with.  Certainly the gun lobby would be on board.  Look at the boost to sales.  What a pity text books don't have the political power  hand guns do.

Finally, I don't believe putting out a fire calls for throwing gasoline on it.  I believe the way out of this cycle of gun violence to to subtract the threat of guns, not add guns to the mix.  No one should have weapons designed for the military and law enforcement.  Guns that can be fitted with high capacity magazines and tuned to an extraordinary rate of rounds per minute.  No sportsman would need thirty rounds to fell his quarry.   If you can hit your target after firing thirty rounds, perhaps hunting isn't your pastime.  Try model railroading or stamp collecting.

I would propose this: Magazines holding greater than 10 rounds are now banned.  All owners of such equipment are to turn them in to authorities within one year.  A voucher providing for a tax credit based on the full market value of the magazines will be issued.  

Any one not complying after the turn in period has expired will face a mandatory three year federal prison term.  Any crimes committed using such magazines gets life without parole.

We have to take the 'mass' out of 'mass shooting'.  I know crazy will always be around, and so will guns.  But this is a problem to be solved by us because we created it.  Our lives and our children's lives are certainly worth making an honest effort.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 17, 2012)

There are no words to describe how stupid of an idea it is to arm teachers in school. Just no words.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Well it's a proven fact that the gun grabbers method of creating more gun free zones do not work


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> There are no words to describe how stupid of an idea it is to arm teachers in school. Just no words.



What's worse dead children or you having a stupid feeling about teachers armed in school?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...




While I was working in Japan, I was assigned to the Phillippines for a few months. I was struck by the fact that there were soldiers with assault rifles stationed at the entrance to the shopping center and other buildings. 

Made an impression on me. Not one that I'd want for my kids.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 17, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> There are no words to describe how stupid of an idea it is to arm teachers in school. Just no words.



Usually aren't when it is the clear solution.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

What seems to be ignored is the reason we have a second amendment..........

Not to protect concealed carry, but to remind the Government that the citizenry is armed.....


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> What seems to be ignored is the reason we have a second amendment..........
> 
> Not to protect concealed carry, but to remind the Government that the citizenry is armed.....


nor does it have anything to do with hunting.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

It seems we have had a marked upturn in the number of massacres in the last twenty years. They were virtually unknown until the early 90s. The perpetrators tend to be white males 17-30 years old. 

What changed in the last twenty years?  Violent video games that let you pretend to murder dozens of people. The same age group that buys these games are the ones doing the massacres


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> What seems to be ignored is the reason we have a second amendment..........
> 
> Not to protect concealed carry, but to remind the Government that the citizenry is armed.....



I'm sure every congressman is terrified of his armed constituents


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > What seems to be ignored is the reason we have a second amendment..........
> ...



Every Congressman doesn't need to be.............


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> It seems we have had a marked upturn in the number of massacres in the last twenty years. They were virtually unknown until the early 90s. The perpetrators tend to be white males 17-30 years old.
> 
> What changed in the last twenty years?  Violent video games that let you pretend to murder dozens of people. The same age group that buys these games are the ones doing the massacres



Early 90's>? OH I remember now Clintons gun ban was signed into law around that time.


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## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > It seems we have had a marked upturn in the number of massacres in the last twenty years. They were virtually unknown until the early 90s. The perpetrators tend to be white males 17-30 years old.
> ...



I remember how Bush/ Cheney allowed the assault weapons ban expire


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 17, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > There are no words to describe how stupid of an idea it is to arm teachers in school. Just no words.
> ...



You might be smarter than you are letting on. I hope so.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



When was the last time our leaders have had to be worried about an armed citizenry?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 17, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> What seems to be ignored is the reason we have a second amendment..........
> 
> Not to protect concealed carry, but to remind the Government that the citizenry is armed.....


And we must remember that the second amendment states clearly the need for a well regulated militia to that purpose.  But for citizens to possess and discharge weapons better suited in the hands of a well regulated militia has brought us unbearable tragedies.   I wouldn't advocate taking away any weapons designed for sport.  Bolt action rifles, shot guns, revolvers.  But I cannot see the sense of high capacity magazines.  Weapons fitted with them are military weapons, not civilian weapons.

No civilian can own the most sophisticated weaponry in our military's arsenal.  And I believe that any weaponry built for warfare is better in the hands of a well regulated militia than the general public.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...




Thank God because remember mass shooting were unheard of until clinton signed the assault weapons ban.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> It seems we have had a marked upturn in the number of massacres in the last twenty years. They were virtually unknown until the early 90s. The perpetrators tend to be white males 17-30 years old.
> 
> What changed in the last twenty years?  Violent video games that let you pretend to murder dozens of people. The same age group that buys these games are the ones doing the massacres


What changed was designs from gun makers that provided for more powerful, high capacity weapons.  Video games didn't make the kill shot.

It's like saying "There was Ben Franklin with that kite and key, and then 150 years later, there were people stepping on the third rail and electrocuting themselves by taking toast from the toaster with a fork.  What happened?  Why pictures of lightening bolts!  That's the reason!"

What changed between 1966 when Charles Whitman climbed the tower in Austin and the early 90s?  The assault rife, the Glock, the Saturday night Special.


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## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > It seems we have had a marked upturn in the number of massacres in the last twenty years. They were virtually unknown until the early 90s. The perpetrators tend to be white males 17-30 years old.
> ...




I see the young white males living out their fantasies on violent video games. The easy access to the weapons of their choice makes it easier to live out those fantasies


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## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

So, where do we go from here?

Starting next year..

The assault weapons ban will go back in effect
Large capacity magazines will be banned
Gun shows will have to operate under the same rules as gun shops
Increased restrictions on the mentally ill to buy guns

The votes are there


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## KissMy (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> So, where do we go from here?
> 
> Starting next year..
> 
> ...



Just try that crap & Dem's will lose the Senate & House next election. Democrats only got where they are because they dropped the gun control plank. They will pay dearly if they try to pick it back up again.


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## skye (Dec 17, 2012)

Evil can not be stopped.

As simple as that.

If you have a lunatic bent on killing...he or she or them...will find a way.

Sad but true.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> ...



Those men were there to make sure that any attempt to kill Reagan failed, not to prevent any such attack from the get go. Unless you live in alternate universe they succeeded in that goal.

Tell me something, is there a reason the media is not mentioning this man's story?

Media blackout: Oregon mall shooter was stopped by an armed citizen - Virginia Beach Conservative | Examiner.com


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Which is why there weren't more people killed.
> ...



Thnk about why the Secret Service, unlike NYPD, opted not to fire into a crowd to take down a lone gunman.


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## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

KissMy said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > So, where do we go from here?
> ...



No they won't

This was the last straw. Even the NRA would be advised to pick it's battles wisely. Republicans are starting to back away from their knee jerk support of the NRA agenda

Even NRA members are supporting enhanced background checks


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> And you propose arming school staff.  Are these armed school personnel better marksmen?  Do they have keenly honed reaction times?  Are they trained to be cool in a hot situation?



Did you make the same argument against arming airline pilots? Can you point to some examples of how badly that worked out for those of us who thought it would help?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> There are no words to describe how stupid of an idea it is to arm teachers in school. Just no words.



There were at least 20 words.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



Hate to burst your bubble, but they were not soldiers.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> It seems we have had a marked upturn in the number of massacres in the last twenty years. They were virtually unknown until the early 90s. The perpetrators tend to be white males 17-30 years old.
> 
> What changed in the last twenty years?  Violent video games that let you pretend to murder dozens of people. The same age group that buys these games are the ones doing the massacres



Not according to the experts.

Mass shootings are not growing in frequency, experts say - NY Daily News

Feel free to ignore facts and insist your version of reality is the only one that matters though.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > What seems to be ignored is the reason we have a second amendment..........
> ...



Have you ever read about debate surrounding the passing of the 14th Amendment and how northern states were specifically worried that southern states would pass laws making it illegal for freed slaves to own guns to defend themselves?


Does it make you feel special to make the same arguments against individual gun ownership that the KKK used?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> So, where do we go from here?
> 
> Starting next year..
> 
> ...



Got to pass the house.
Gun shows already operate   the same has gun shops 


> Large capacity magazines will be banned


No they won't


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> So, where do we go from here?
> 
> Starting next year..
> 
> ...



Basically the same thing we have now. Interesting that you think this will somehow make a difference.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Gun bans don't work, no firearms will be turned in. nothing will be accomplished people will continue to die at thew wrong end of a gun. While gun grabbers will path themselves on the back America will burn.


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## Si modo (Dec 17, 2012)

jillian said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...


More likely I called out an "attorney" for not knowing there are nine justices.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > So, where do we go from here?
> ...



We shall see...we shall see


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## rightwinger (Dec 17, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



The market will dry up when you can no longer sell or shoot your assault rifle. You will find yourself arrested for possession


----------



## MDiver (Dec 17, 2012)

I had to shake my head at a comment some preacher said, after the school shootings.  He said something to the effect that this happened because we were less religious.  The people who brought down the twin towers were deeply steeped in religion.  The followers of Jim Jones were steeped in religion.  The followers of the Heaven's Gates preacher were steeped in religion.  The pilgrims were steeped in religion and persecuted those that didn't follow their specific teachings.  Thousands were killed during the Inquisition, because people were deeply steeped in religion.  Too much religion causes problems and in this case, it was just a parent who should have known better than to have guns in the same house as a mentally unstable son.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 17, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You're talking out your ass.


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Lol, you are a fucking loonatic.


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



So you think all Isrealis are insane?

What hubris to think you have the right to judge an entire nation of people, not for failing, but to contradict your notions with things that actually work.

I.E. you are a typical libtard ass hat.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 18, 2012)

jillian said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...




Racist bitch.


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 18, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Considering where his head is permanently stuck, he has no other means of talking.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Yes, you will see, you fascist scum.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Do you think that "all Israeli's" find the situation depicted in that photo to be ideal? Do you think that "any Israeli's" do? I'm guessing they don't. 

You have limited capacity, I know, but you could give things a little thought before you decide to respond.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



It was the Isrealis that insisted that their government allow this to protect their kids, you stupid fuck.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



Personally, I would hyphenate 'gun grabber' thus - 'gun-grabber'.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



Who are they protecting them from?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



Apart from the fact that you pulled that comment right out of your ass and have no idea what anyone asked anyone to allow.......you have not demonstrated that even a single Israeli considers this to be the ideal. You cannot point to even one Israeli mother would not prefer to be able to send their kid to school in a place that was absent of weapons. Can you? The situation depicted in the picture is not the ideal.....to anyone who is sane.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



My daughter in law is Jewish and has an uncle and two aunts that live in Israel, and they would disagree with you.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

idb said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Personally I could care less about what someone thinks who lives in a country that has a gun ban and they know that it has failed and supports it being pushed in another country.
Do we have an understanding on this?


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



No. No they wouldn't. Unless they are insane.


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 18, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> ...



Apples and oranges slick.  What you gave us was an assasinaiton attempt which like you showed us, takes but a few seconds of less to carry out.  What the photo and SFC are proposing is arming teachers to stop a person from waliking through a school, for 5, 10, 15 20 minutes or more randomly shooting helpless and unarmed people like fish in a barrell.


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Nobody considers this ideal, but the FACT is that there are murderous scum in Israel that have shown us that they have no problem murdering Israeli children.  In this nation, Columbine, VA Tech, CT, etc has shown us that we have murderous scum in this nation that have no problem going into schools and murdering our children, so yeah, you can poiint to many Israeli mothers that prefer seeing an armed school teacher than seeing their kids being slaughtered because there is NOT an armed teacher nearby, just as there would be many American mothers who would be thankful today if Sandy Hook, VA Tech, Columbine, etc, had some armed teachers.  Nobody is saying it's the ideal but it is reality, your "ideal" is not.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



In a moment of sanity, this lunatic acknowledges that arming teachers is not the ideal. Wonderful.


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



In a moment of sanity this moron may acknowledge that we don't live in his ideal utopia but rather in the real world, where predators prey on our children at our schools and where we should give those responsible for their safety and well being the means to defend our kids and themselves.  How many teachers have died in these mass shooting trying to protect our kids with words while the bad guys had semi-automatic weapons?


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



There are no words to describe how stupid that is. Do yourself a favor. Spend a few minutes playing the Devil's advocate. Make a list of all the negatives associated with arming our teachers. If you are sane, you will convince yourself that it is not the way to go.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > KissMy said:
> ...



The handwriting is on the wall

Unlike our other massacres which the NRA led Republicans shooed away....this one is not going away

You will still have your guns, but your AR-15s, Glocks, 40 round magazines will be gone. Gun shows will be regulated as they always should have been. And guess what?  Your life will go along just fine without them


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> On arming teachers and/or staff...
> 
> May I remind you that when Ronald Reagan was shot, along with James Brady and Officer Tom Delahanty, there was a cadre of armed men and women present.  All of them throughly trained and expertly proficient in the use of guns.  All those experts could not prevent John Hinckley from firing six shots in 1.7 seconds and wounding three.
> 
> ...



Hinkley wounded FOUR people. Timothy McCarthy, a Secret Service Agent, was also wounded. 

Other than that small oversight, your point is excellent.  Despite being heavily guarded and precautions being taken, one crazy person was able to nearly kill the POTUS because he was able to get a gun.  And if he isn't safe, what chance do the rest of us have?


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Negatives in arming teachers.
O
Positives in arming teachers.
1.  They will be able to protect our children from the lunatics in this world that go to schools to slaughter helpless people KNOWING nobody there can stop them.



The Positives have it.  As a matter of fact, even you you could make up some negatives, which is what you would have to do, for there isn't a single valid negative in the world, the ONE positive would outweight ALL the false negatives you could come up with.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



Let me guess. You have a hard time getting people to carry on a discussion with you for an extended period of time. That happens to people who are flatly dishonest.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> Negatives in arming teachers.
> O
> Positives in arming teachers.
> 1.  They will be able to protect our children from the lunatics in this world that go to schools to slaughter helpless people KNOWING nobody there can stop them.
> ...



No Negatives?  

Really?  

Frankly, thinking back to some of the idiot teachers I had in HS, I don't picture any of them having guns being a good thing.  

And unless they are going to have their guns holstered on them at all times, you always have the possibility a kid might get one of those guns.  

More to the point, as another poster pointed out, a single crazy person with a gun was able to shoot four people despite one of those people being the President and the others being armed and precautions being taken.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



Negatives of arming teachers
1. Unqualified armed people running around our children
2. Guns getting into the hands of children
3. Unqualified teacher making a wrong decision and shooting a student
4. Poorly trained teacher getting killed unnecessarily
5. Poorly trained teacher turning a hostage situation into a killing zone

Positives of arming teachers
1. Gun rights advocates wet dream


----------



## Zoom-boing (Dec 18, 2012)

If someone at a school is going to be armed it should be hired, trained professional security personnel.  Imagine if Sandy Hook had an armed security person or two.  Chances of those killed being alive would be so much greater.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> If someone at a school is going to be armed it should be hired, trained professional security personnel.  Imagine if Sandy Hook had an armed security person or two.  Chances of those killed being alive would be so much greater.



I find it amusing that the people who want to reduce the number of government employees are now calling for MORE government employees... if the alternative is giving up their penis subsitutes....


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...


1.  Easy solution...train them.
2.  Easy solution...trigger locks and/or locked cabinets
3.  Proper training would prevent that.
4.  Ditto
5.  Ditto


Not that I agree all teachers should be armed, but I am all for a few teachers and/or administrators being armed.  Even better, have armed security in all schools.

These assholes don't go into cop stations to massacre.  They know they wouldn't get too far.  They don't go into malls too often to do so, either, at least in states with conceal carry laws.  They go to gun free zones.  Arm a few folks in the gun free zones, and maybe this shit will stop.

At the high school down the road, there are three cops there every day.  They have guns.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Dec 18, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > If someone at a school is going to be armed it should be hired, trained professional security personnel.  Imagine if Sandy Hook had an armed security person or two.  Chances of those killed being alive would be so much greater.
> ...



Are you saying that if Sandy Hook had trained and armed security it wouldn't have made any difference?  

Getting rid of redundant and useless gov't employees is good.  Why do you have a problem with that?


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Sign The Arm The Teachers Petition! 7,269 signed so far.
> 
> The state of Utah has always allowed teachers to carry guns in class & has never had an incident. Why can't we all have that?
> 
> Texas School District Will Let Teachers Carry Guns



Lets be more like Israel

What are Israel's gun laws like? How do they regulate firearms ownership over there? - Yahoo! Answers

4. Applicant must fall into one of the following categories:

a. Part-time reservist (volunteer) for 3 years- may own 1 handgun
b. Such a reservist (volunteer) is a member of a gun club- may own 1rifle
c. Professional, licensed public transportation driver, transportinga minimum of 5 passengers- may own 1 handgun
d. Licensed animal control officer- may own 2 hunting rifles, *not*full automatic weapons, or semi-automatic weapons with a limitedcapacity magazine.
e. Full-time dealer of jewelry or large sums of cash or valuables-may own 1 handgun

A)According to the law, anything with a barrel that shoots objects that can harm a human, or any part of such an item is a firearm. MoI has discretion. Currently, airguns are firearms. Further, the Ministry of Defense has the authority to define what firearms are "military firearms" - barring access to common serfs. Ever since 1950, any rifle larger than .22 and any automatic weapon were firearms

.22 rifles are banned, except grandfathered ones, hunting with rifles is illegal. Any form of outdoor shooting is illegal. People may only buy 50 rounds per year, except those shot at public ranges.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Because they are only "Redundant" and "useless" when you guys get to tax time. 

A hurricane hits, a crazy person storms a school, terrorists slam a plane into a building and those "useless" government workers become "Brave first responders".  At least until after the crisis is over.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Sign The Arm The Teachers Petition! 7,269 signed so far.
> ...



I'm not sure if I would want to live in a country where half the population lives in mortal fear of the other half, because the other half would surely exterminate them if given a chance.


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## Zoom-boing (Dec 18, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Ignoring my question and changing the subject, nicely done.




Are you saying that if Sandy Hook had trained and armed security it wouldn't have made any difference?


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...


And you expect an armed Kindergarten teacher to have the same level of discipline?


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

Si modo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



It is easy to train someone to shoot a gun, any retard can do it. What is difficult is to train WHEN to shoot a gun. Many police officers with years of training make the wrong decision on when to shoot a gun

What if we train and arm EVERY teacher?  What next?

Do we train nursery schools?
How safe are you really when you go to church?
Shopping malls are a big target, lets arm all clerks
Is Little League or Soccer safe?  Should coaches be armed?
Movie Theaters are easy targets. Arm the guy selling popcorn....Minimum wage workers make the best security guards


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


If you're making a stab at correlating this debate to that one, perhaps you should also factor the weapons themselves.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


And what if the moon fell out of the sky?  What if pigs flew out of my butt?



Those who argue for perfection are a waste of oxygen.


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 18, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Why not?   If someone is intelligent enough to be entrusted with the education of children, surely they can be adequately trained with a firearm.  How mentally slow do you think teachers are?


----------



## KissMy (Dec 18, 2012)

The relationship between school shootings and psychiatric drugs.

At least fourteen recent school shootings were committed by those taking or withdrawing from psychiatric drugs resulting in 109 wounded and 58 killed;

Between 2004 and 2011, there have been over 11,000 reports to the U.S. FDA&#8217;s MedWatch system of psychiatric drug side effects related to violence


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

Si modo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Its your solution to massacres not mine

What happens if we turn schools into armed camps?

Will shooters just choose an easier target?  You ready to go to Church and pass through armed guards?


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## saveliberty (Dec 18, 2012)

Churches have already been targets.


----------



## Samson (Dec 18, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Churches have already been targets.



Yep.

Psyhcopaths will really need to step up their creativity.

How about a public pool? Soccer game?


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## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Churches have already been targets.


So have day care centers.


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## saveliberty (Dec 18, 2012)

I guess one could break into death row and cause some havoc.


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## Samson (Dec 18, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> I guess one could break into death row and cause some havoc.





Among who?

ACLU members?


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Sometimes things have no solutions; we just strive for the best and fairest methods to prevent the problem.  I think having armed security in schools is not a bad idea at all.  

If I could ensure that all sociopaths and psychopaths were safely locked away, I would.  But, that can't happen, just like the moon won't fall out of the sky and just like pigs won't fly out of my butt.

Life is dangerous, especially as a human as we hang with each other and are the most lethal mammal on the planet.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

Si modo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



Very true

But I see more lives being taken with these assault weapons than being saved


----------



## Samson (Dec 18, 2012)

Si modo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...



You have made me seriously consider the leathal consequences of pigs flying out your butt.


Hope you're happy now.


----------



## Samson (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You do realise that the purpose of a weapon, any weapon, is not to save lives?


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

Samson said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


You only need to worry about the lethality of my butt if I eat avocados.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



I have no real problem with background checks. The rest of it goes against the grain.....


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...




Because he is JoeB and he knows everything, ask him he'll tell you........


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 18, 2012)

What about sealed records?  Some of these kids have protected backgrounds, which would in some cases make them poor gun owners.


----------



## peach174 (Dec 18, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > If someone at a school is going to be armed it should be hired, trained professional security personnel.  Imagine if Sandy Hook had an armed security person or two.  Chances of those killed being alive would be so much greater.
> ...



Zoom said nothing about them having to be government employees.
There are plenty of trained professional security personnel who work in the private industry.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

peach174 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Who pays their salaries?

The taxpayer


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


The taxpayer in that district.

But, if you don't want kids protected, you can go to another district.  When we moved as a family when I was a kid, the location where my parents looked for houses was based on the school district they wanted.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

Si modo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > peach174 said:
> ...



You won't find a better school district than Middleton


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > So, where do we go from here?
> ...



Looks like we are going to find out


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

Samson said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Churches have already been targets.
> ...



I suggest wherever line-dancers gather.


----------



## KissMy (Dec 18, 2012)

Believe It or Not Mass Killings Are Not on the Rise, They Are on the Decline


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

KissMy said:


> Believe It or Not Mass Killings Are Not on the Rise, They Are on the Decline



Phew!
No need to worry then.


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 18, 2012)

When a horrific event happens it is not a good thing to punish the innocent! Progressives need to learn this! You are enabling the criminal element!


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> When a horrific event happens it is not a good thing to punish the innocent! Progressives need to learn this! You are enabling the criminal element!



It should be worthy of a serious discussion though, shouldn't it?


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 18, 2012)

idb said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > When a horrific event happens it is not a good thing to punish the innocent! Progressives need to learn this! You are enabling the criminal element!
> ...



There is no serious discussion when your only idea is to punish the innocent ....That is not serious that is fucking retarded.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

thanatos144 said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



But, there should be serious discussion, right?
Serious discussion would include discussing options other than just 'punishing the innocent'.


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## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

idb said:


> thanatos144 said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



Do you have serious reasons you need a military type assault rifle to justify the threat to public safety?

The Supreme Court will want to know


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## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Sure, but not limited to that.
Why is the US so violent?

Try this


> Half the firearms in the entire world are in the United States. The rate of murders by gunfire in the United States is almost 20 times higher than the average rate in 22 other populous, high-income countries where the frequency of other crimes is about the same.
> 
> There is clearly a connection between these two facts, but it is not necessarily simple cause-and-effect.
> 
> Here's one reason to suspect that it's not that simple: the American rate for murders of all kinds - shooting, strangling, stabbing, poisoning, pushing people under buses, etc - is seven times higher than it is in those other 22 rich countries. It can't just be guns.


Gwynne Dyer: Culture of personal violence to blame - Crime - NZ Herald News

He's saying the the US is an extraordinarily violent culture.


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## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Because progressives have fostered a society that scorns morality, self-respect, and responsibility.

They've built us a society of criminals, murderers, and baby killers.

It will get worse. Obama hasn't even gotten rolling yet. Each day will bring new horror. Brace yourself.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Because progressives have fostered a society that scorns morality, self-respect, and responsibility.
> 
> They've built us a society of criminals, murderers, and baby killers.
> 
> It will get worse. Obama hasn't even gotten rolling yet. Each day will bring new horror. Brace yourself.



It projects.


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## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Nothing a progressive hates more than someone willing to protect the innocent.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Because progressives have fostered a society that scorns morality, self-respect, and responsibility.
> 
> They've built us a society of criminals, murderers, and baby killers.
> 
> It will get worse. Obama hasn't even gotten rolling yet. Each day will bring new horror. Brace yourself.



Good grief...you never stop do you?
You might have thought that crap would have stopped after the election.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Nothing a progressive hates more than someone willing to protect the innocent.



You're not even very good at this.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

I'm very good at it.


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## saveliberty (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Nothing a progressive hates more than someone willing to protect the innocent.



I have an acceptable level of causalities I'm willing to accept...

...for liberals.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Nothing a progressive hates more than someone willing to protect the innocent.


Derp, derp, derp, hurrderp, derp, derpaderp, derp, derp, derp, derp, derp...............................


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Pretty much the level of discourse one expects from those who defend baby killers.


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## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Pretty much the level of discourse one expects from those who defend baby killers.


I think those who kill babies should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Do you believe in protecting them?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

idb said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Palestinian terrorists.

Oops, I repeated myself.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > thanatos144 said:
> ...



Um, yes actually. Though many will disagree. the original intent of the second amendment. That the government knows the citizenry is armed and can take action against tyranny. It's not really about protecting your home or going hunting but keeping the Government from taking your freedoms... My 308 and shotgun for instance is no match for a dumb private with an M4......


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



Ridiculous.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Fact, try studying a little....


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Do you believe in protecting them?


Well, if I want baby murderers prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, the only protection they should have is that allowed in the Constitution - due process, defense, cross witnesses, etc.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Actually, I meant, do you believe in protecting their victims...kids.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Anyone who has even a casual knowledge of the rationale behind the Constitution and the Bill of Rights knows that was the exact intent of the 2nd.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



Bull

The country never envisioned the need for a standing Army. National defense was built around local militias. The ability of a citizen to be armed to support his local militia was paramount 

In terms of controlling the government. If you have a strong first amendment, you don't need a second


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



My ideal would be if people like you were never born, Unlike you, I accept the fact that reality and my ideal will never meet.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

Si modo said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...




My oh my......I am being schooled.

This bullshit strategy of hanging onto the words of the USC as though the authors were supreme beings is ridiculous.  It seems nutters envision an us vs them struggle for the soul of America. Problem is, there is us, them and them and them and them and them and them...............

There will be no armed revolt. This is not a TV miniseries.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

There will be an armed revolt.

And loons like you are going to be slaughtered, I'm afraid. Probably by your own heroes.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...



Lucky for you and your children, my seed is strong and I have given life to three more just like me.....only biracial and even MORE liberal. 

Life is good. We are making progress.


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> There will be an armed revolt.
> 
> And loons like you are going to be slaughtered, I'm afraid. Probably by your own heroes.



Promise me that YOU and yours will be the ones who knock on my door first.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 18, 2012)

If there is an uprising by the loony far right, they will die.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



England has a gun ban.

In England it is illegal to write a story about what it will be like after the Queen dies and Charles is made King.

Just saying.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Tell that to Cuba.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Wrong my friend, I quote The Constitution of the United States, copyright 1937 By William Guitteau and Hanson Webster. (This appears to be a teachers handbook)

"This amendment prohibits Congress from passing any law to prevent the people from keeping and carrying arms. Without this right the people would be helpless if an attempt were made to take away their liberties by force.
 The State Constitutions generally contain a similar provision. But this does not prohibit laws against the carry of concealed weapons, or measures to regulate the sale and use of firearms."


----------



## LoneLaugher (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Who gives a shit? Are we in a 4th grade Social Studies class?


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Nonsense...that is just a textbooks interpretation

The people do not have the power to take over the government with arms. The Constitution gave them a stronger weapon, the power to take over the Government by vote and a free press to inform the people exactly what their government is doing


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Except in the event the government becomes tyrannical.

In the course of human events....


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 18, 2012)

We the People in our laws enacted by our state and federal legislators are far stronger than wack radicals from the far right or the far left.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Lol...


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I know that hiring a minimum wage Rent a Cop wouldn't have made a difference. WHich is what I think this moron was suggesting.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

You don't know that, liar. 

I know that if the principal had been armed, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Well, maybe the progressive nutters would claim that she was the reason the boy tried to kill anyone...


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 18, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



Yeah, that's pretty much what I'm saying....  

First, how many armed guards do you think Newton CT, which had only one homicide in a decade, was going to really spring for?  

Second, what kind of quality of a guard do you think they were going to get?  

I've been to security buildings, and frankly, they are pretty much good at making you sign in and that's about it.  

For those playing along at home, I do resumes as a side business. And one of my clients told me he used to work for an Armored Car company.   He got no training and the company issued gun they gave him "Was used to play floor hockey", it was in such poor shape. 

And that was an armored car company.  Where real money was involved.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Tyranny will not be overcome by vote or a free press...

Try reading up on a guy named Tench Coxe....


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

I know, it's funny. Did we overcome the tyranny of England via vote?

Hilarious.


----------



## jillian (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> You don't know that, liar.
> 
> I know that if the principal had been armed, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
> 
> Well, maybe the progressive nutters would claim that she was the reason the boy tried to kill anyone...



Right ... B/c there was nooooo possible way that a semi auto would have taken her out before she could even reach for her weapon

This fantasy you have is beyond naive... It's dangerous


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Really? The vote? What was your opinion of the vote in 2004?


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Uh huh.

Do you even know what a semi-auto is?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > You don't know that, liar.
> ...



How many non free gun zones have  had a mass shooting?


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

Do you honestly think it's safer just to wait for killers to grow tired of shooting children, than it is to attempt to stop them?


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

I don't even know what to say in the face of such lunacy. They are actually saying we can best protect children by not doing anything to protect them.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > You don't know that, liar.
> ...



She rushed at an armed person, she died, Had she been able to stand in a doorway and fire back things *could have* been different.....


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Seriously Ollie, I expect better from you

You served over 20 years in the Army. Do you seriously think that a bunch of rednecks with shotguns are going to defeat a modern Army?

The US has existed for over 235 years. During that time, we have relied on our Constitution to protect us. Armed civilians have never come close to taking over our country. How did John Brown make out?

And yet, our open press and vote of We the people have kept our government in check


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 18, 2012)

She might have still died, but the shooter could have been stopped.

Chances are, she wouldn't have rushed at the shooter, but would have taken aim from a different vantage point.

How that's more dangerous than a gunman walking unhindered through a kindergarten classroom and shooting every single child in it multiple times, I don't know.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Tucson
Arizona has the most lenient gun laws in the country

University of Texas
Texas has open carry


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You are even misleading yourself.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 18, 2012)

The only times the citizens and local militia arose against the national government, Lincoln and the US Army murdered them.

The same would happen again.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Chances are very slim that we will ever have a tyrannical Government. Even if some believe we already do. But there is that chance, and I believe the 2nd gives us the right to at least fight against it should it happen. And that is just it, shotguns cannot do much against an M4. But an AR 15 can..... And if we had a president and congress who ,shall we say,  decided to take powers for themselves that would take away the freedoms under the bill of rights, do you think it would only be a bunch of rednecks who would revolt?

I would hope that left and right leaning patriots would come together...

Not that any of this will ever happen.........But it's not as impossible as you make it out to be......


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> The only times the citizens and local militia arose against the national government, Lincoln and the US Army murdered them.
> 
> The same would happen again.



So we can't count on you to help overthrow tyranny........... Got it........


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> LoneLaugher said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


Old laws from centuries past can be silly can't they?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Safeway grocery store is a gun free zone. That's where the shooting took place. On their property.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > The only times the citizens and local militia arose against the national government, Lincoln and the US Army murdered them.
> ...


 More yankee's lost their lives Than southerns.


----------



## jillian (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > The only times the citizens and local militia arose against the national government, Lincoln and the US Army murdered them.
> ...



You mean commit treason? 

Got it


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

jillian said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...


Wouldn't it be treasonous to become a tyrannical government?
Just saying.


----------



## Aristotle (Dec 18, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> 
> Reports are now that the gunman is dead.  The pity is, gunmen get to keep shooting until the police show up and terminate the threat.   Lives would be saved and injuries prevented if someone with a gun acted earlier.  A principle, a teacher, an armed guard, someone, rather than stand around waiting to die until the police get there.
> 
> When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.



Very good idea. Arm teachers with guns especially those with horrible psychological profiles.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

jillian said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...



Not under my definition of tyranny..........


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



You have seen firsthand the Army we have built. We can issue each citizen an M4 and a thousand rounds of ammo and they would not have a prayer

But guess what?  We do not have a tyrannical government an because of the strength of our Constitution, we never will. Any time that our government has leaned towards tyranny the power of a free press and the wrath of the voters has straightened them out


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> ...



Why would you even hire a teacher with a "horrible psychological profile"?????????


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



And I hope you remain correct for 1000 years or better........ But I also hope that there will always be citizens willing to step up if ever needed.......


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Car accidents are accidents.   Random shootings are more the result of people being so self centered that nothing matters but them.  Sort of like the way the unions shut down airports and close freeways.   It's all about them.   They aren't getting what they think they are entitled to.  Even the nutcases believe they are entitled to feel good and if they don't, it's someone's fault and everyone should be punished.
> ...



If that is the case maybe they shouldn't be teaching anyway.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

A couple of months back teachers were labelled as parasites, suckling on the tax dollars of the hard-working middle class while indoctrinating the next generation with Marxist dogma.
Now they are to be the heroic gun-totin' avenging protectors of that very same next generation.

They might end up a little confused doncha think?


----------



## Aristotle (Dec 18, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



That's a very good question. You may want to ask the school that especially in light of the teachers who've been caught sexing up students.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > jillian said:
> ...



Texas does not have open carry. In fact it did not even have concealed carry when the UT shooting went down. Even now, you can't carry on a college campus unless you are a police officer.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

idb said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



They still enforce it, don't pretend it is one of those laws they pretend is not on the books.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



The strength of our Constitution protects us from the PATRIOT Act.

Wait a second.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Damn he took a big swallow of the kool aid.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



I wasn't pretending any such thing.
Maybe they should re-examine the law in light of the world having changed in, oh I don't know, say the last 223-odd years.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 18, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



As bad as it is.......yes it does

The Patriot Act was enacted in a period of hysteria against the threat of terrorism. But regardless, it represented the will of the people. We the People elected them. Bad legislation is part of the government we have built

The Patriot Act was not forced on the people by a tyrannical government. It was voted on and approved by Congress. In time we will repeal it


----------



## Zoom-boing (Dec 18, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



You don't read very well, do you?

This is what I said:



Zoom-boing said:


> If someone at a school is going to be armed it should be hired, trained professional security personnel.  Imagine if Sandy Hook had an armed security person or two.  Chances of those killed being alive would be so much greater.



Rent-a-cop is what _you_ suggest, not me.




JoeB131 said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Once again,_ you_ assume a low-paid, poorly trained person would be hired.  That's the first thing _you_ think of and who _you'd_ hire to protect the kids in school.  

If someone at a school is going to be armed it should be *hired, trained, professional security personnel*.  If Sandy Hook had such personnel in the school those kids and teachers would be alive and Adam Lanza would be the one shot 11 times.


----------



## Meister (Dec 18, 2012)

I think that an armed person on each campus would by itself be enough to deter a coward coming on to the gun free campus.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 18, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



It represented the will of the politicians, not the people.


----------



## syrenn (Dec 18, 2012)

jillian said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > You don't know that, liar.
> ...



how about the school nurse? She was hiding under her desk and could see him though the hole in the back of the desk. 

He turned around and walked away.....  perfect time to have put him down with a shot to the back of the head.

The teachers were doing what they could to protect the children.... i would rather have them armed in that attempt.  


There is a thing i tell my sil.... HER son is safer with ME then with her. Why? Because i am ready and willing to kill to protect her son.... she is not.


----------



## syrenn (Dec 18, 2012)

Meister said:


> I think that an armed person on each campus would by itself be enough to deter a coward coming on to the gun free campus.




no one ever wants ..... someone shooting back. It spoils all the fun!


----------



## Zoom-boing (Dec 18, 2012)

syrenn said:


> Meister said:
> 
> 
> > I think that an armed person on each campus would by itself be enough to deter a coward coming on to the gun free campus.
> ...



I keep saying that criminals prefer their victims unarmed.  But the left wants us all unarmed so the armed bad guys and loons can wreck havoc in even more places.


----------



## syrenn (Dec 18, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> syrenn said:
> 
> 
> > Meister said:
> ...




i always laugh at how fast the tune changes..... once_ they _are victims of violence themselves.


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

Zoom-boing said:


> syrenn said:
> 
> 
> > Meister said:
> ...



Yep, that's exactly what they want


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Apart from the fact we have no gun ban - but measured control measures - I'm interested in how you think they have failed us.
No, more than that, I'm *really* interested.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 18, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


Gee!  It must be astounding to believe that everyone can be trained to discharge weapons around children as easily as they might be trained for any other task.  I wonder why so many people wash out of training programs?  Are they all mentally slow?

Why aren't all fry cooks also physicists?  Why are some folks who are adaptable to underwater welding, not also great floral designers?

A simplistic mind would proffer something as simple as your post.  Tragically, life ain't that simple.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 18, 2012)

idb said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



You don't have a gun ban?
Can you have a semi automatic firearm?
What was that mandatory buy back of guns?
No gun ban huh?

AUSTRALIA: MORE VIOLENT CRIME DESPITE GUN BAN


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 18, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Because progressives have fostered a society that scorns morality, self-respect, and responsibility.
> 
> They've built us a society of criminals, murderers, and baby killers.
> 
> It will get worse. Obama hasn't even gotten rolling yet. Each day will bring new horror. Brace yourself.


A typicAlly ham handed and poorly rationalized deflection if ever one was posted.  The clear argument of a narrow, and shallow mind.  Wring your hands in despair because after the lust and depravity of the assault gun orgy, the bill is due.  It's been tallies in the blood of the innocent to pay for the adolescent lust of moron for gun.

The Rambo fantasies of hillbillies, red necks, paranoids and mouth breathers is coming to a tragic close.  Hopefully the result will be subtraction of the word "mass" from the phrase "mass shooting".

Incredible that there are people who can point to their warped and depraved hobby of lusting after military style weapons for their own bemusement as a "right" that trumps the rights of children to not be killed in their schools and churches.

How virulently selfish the gun nut is.  Worrying more about not being able to waste ammunition shooting milk jugs while classrooms bleed.  Can you say your gun ownership is that important?  Take your paranoia and move away from our village.  We cast thee out into the wilderness.  Your poisoned morality has no more credibility here.  Lives.  Human lives are far more precious than your prurient affection for deadly weaponry.  Be gone!


----------



## idb (Dec 18, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


Yes, I can have a semi-automatic firearm, I could walk 10 minutes to the local sports shop at the bottom of my hill and buy one tomorrow.
I missed the buy back...when did that happen?
I have several guns as I've told you before.

I'm not sure what an article about Australia has to do with me.....oh, I get it, you've got your Google mixed up and, as a gun-totin' good ol' boy, you have no idea of what the world looks like past the county line.
But I'm sure that Sheriff Roscoe P. Coltrane keeps you crazy kids in line.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 18, 2012)

Your choice would be the wrong one, Ollie.



SFC Ollie said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 19, 2012)

idb said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



My apologies I thought you were  Australian


----------



## jtpr312 (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Because progressives have fostered a society that scorns morality, self-respect, and responsibility.
> ...



Wow, you have a way with words slick.  All those pretty words just to say "I'm a brain dead idiot".


----------



## freedombecki (Dec 19, 2012)

Making sure the government is armed to the teeth against people who have been legally disarmed by laws is how Germany got away with killing 6,000,000 Jews.

Disarming American citizens would merely make us available to whoever the people in charge of government has sold us down the river to.

I think the Second Amendment should be left alone.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I know, it's funny. Did we overcome the tyranny of England via vote?
> 
> Hilarious.



"Tryanny" from England meaning making the rich assholes pay their fair share in taxes.  

And, no, we didn't.  We overcame it because after the British pretty much were kicking our asses from one side of the colonies to the other, the French decided to intervene.  Not because they were such great believers in Democracy, but because Louis XVI wanted payback for the territories France had lost in the Seven Years War.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

freedombecki said:


> Making sure the government is armed to the teeth against people who have been legally disarmed by laws is how Germany got away with killing 6,000,000 Jews.
> 
> Disarming American citizens would merely make us available to whoever the people in charge of government has sold us down the river to.
> 
> I think the Second Amendment should be left alone.



Oh, look everyone, it's a "Godwin Alert".  







Sign of a failed argument... 
Well, the Nazis did that. Maybe.


----------



## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

Fine, they want to ban guns, then lets suggest they ban abortions too

It's for the children


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

Stephanie said:


> Fine, they want to ban guns, then lets suggest they ban abortions too
> 
> It's for the children


----------



## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Fine, they want to ban guns, then lets suggest they ban abortions too
> ...



figures, can't talk banning ABORTIONS to you fucking hypocrites which isn't a RIGHT like our Second Amendment


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

No one is making you have an abortion.  

ON the other hand, crazy assholes walking around with guns are a threat to all of us.  

one guy puts a bomb in his shoe, we all have to take off our shoes to get on a plane.  

31 Gun Rampages in the last decade, no one talks about banning guns.


----------



## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> No one is making you have an abortion.
> 
> ON the other hand, crazy assholes walking around with guns are a threat to all of us.
> 
> ...



no one forces you to get a gun and use it either..

if not a gun, a car rammed into a building can do just as well..when will you all call for taking those away?

dumbass


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

Stephanie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > No one is making you have an abortion.
> ...



When was the last time someone with a car killed 28 people?  

Thanks.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 19, 2012)

Meister said:


> I think that an armed person on each campus would by itself be enough to deter a coward coming on to the gun free campus.



our school district has a uniformed police officer from the sheriff's dept. in each school. 

Our officer is upstairs in the front office.

My room is downstairs near a side entrance.

By the time the police officer would get to us there could be many casulties. It would be easy for an intruder to get in too.

But you are correct about the deterrent factor.

Arming a few teachers would be a deterrent too. I do NOT see than happening in our school disctrict. Ever.


----------



## squeeze berry (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



When was the last time someone armed with a car prevented a crime?

Thanks.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> freedombecki said:
> 
> 
> > Making sure the government is armed to the teeth against people who have been legally disarmed by laws is how Germany got away with killing 6,000,000 Jews.
> ...


She's right, though.

The purpose of the 2nd amendment is to deter the government from becoming tyrannical.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

Si modo said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > freedombecki said:
> ...



Sorry, I'm more worried about a crazy person shooting up a crowd I might be standing in than a " tyrannical" government.   Sometimes the "cure" is worse than the disease.  

While a Bushmaster can do a number on a room full of pre-schoolers, against a well armed Apache Helicopter, not so much.


----------



## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Yeah sure you are..
hypocrite


----------



## thanatos144 (Dec 19, 2012)

idb said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLaugher said:
> ...



Those old laws made us the greatest and most free country in the world....Why dont you stay on your side of the planet if you dont like having freedoms.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I don't spend my time worrying about low probability injuries/assaults to myself.  There are a lot more common ways to die and I take care to prevent them the best I can....like looking right, then left, then right again before making a left turn.

I always worry about the stupidity - by design - of our population about the Constitution.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 19, 2012)

Si modo said:


> I don't spend my time worrying about low probability injuries/assaults to myself.  There are a lot more common ways to die and I take care to prevent them the best I can....like looking right, then left, then right again before making a left turn.
> 
> I always worry about the stupidity - by design - of our population about the Constitution.



I don't think the constitution trumps common sense. 

Crazy people should not have access to military grade weapons. This is just common sense, except to the gun nutters...


----------



## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > I don't spend my time worrying about low probability injuries/assaults to myself.  There are a lot more common ways to die and I take care to prevent them the best I can....like looking right, then left, then right again before making a left turn.
> ...



then you brown shirts should go round up all the crazy people..Instead you want to step on the sane people in this country..that's the liberal solution to everything


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...


The brain dead idiots are the ones who have been worshiping at the altar of military style weaponry and finding any and all excuses for the tragedy such weapons inevitably bring.  They lust after penis extensions and pasted on muscle mass by buying and demanding more potent guns than required by civilians.  And when the tragedies happen, they point and say "It's the culture!  The culture must be changed!  Video games made these children dead!  The gun, the glorious gun, isn't at fault!  Just because it can fire 5 bullets per second."

Moloch!  Military weapons in civilian hands makes the god Moloch on Earth!  A seductive god that poisons the morals of the worshiper.  A destructive god that leaves carnage in its wake.  A jealous god that demands the hoodwinking of its acolytes making them believe that every other factor of modernity is to blame for the deaths it causes.  Moloch!

The problem is people with guns that should be in the hands of well regulated militias.  Guns awash on our city street bleaching homes with the blood of their victims. 

Civilians require bolt action rifles for hunting and other recreational sport shooting.  They don't need to spray bullets like a Taliban fighter.  Civilians need revolvers for self defense, not a gun capable of erasing scores of people without reloading.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


I have a shotgun that holds nine rounds for self defense.  

But, it's remarkable to see your hysterics over inanimate objects.

More households had guns decades ago, yet this sort of thing rarely happened.  This is a people problem.


----------



## mal (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



What's the Murder Rate in your City there?... Is that Chicago?... 

Tell me a Story about Gun Laws in Chicago. 



peace...


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

mal said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...




One of the jurisdictions with the most fascist gun laws and one of the highest gunshot murder rates.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Yet I can almost promise you that there are many many teachers who have concealed carry permits and leave their guns at home each morning because they are not permitted to carry them to work........


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 19, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Katzndogz said:
> ...



A lot of people who work in 7-11 too


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Your choice would be the wrong one, Ollie.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



My "choice" would be to back the constitution. If there is tyranny then the constitution is under attack..


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

Godwin Alert.



Stephanie said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Si modo said:
> ...


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

So Dodge City, when it enacted gun laws, during the Wild West days was under control of the fascists.  Godwin Alert.



Si modo said:


> One of the jurisdictions with the most fascist gun laws and one of the highest gunshot murder rates.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> So Dodge City, when it enacted gun laws, during the Wild West days was under control of the fascists.  Godwin Alert.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That would be Chicago.  Oppressive gun rules and one of the highest gunshot murder rates.

Make more gun control laws and I bet it will help.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

The point, Si Modo, is you know not what a fascist, or a brown shirt, or a Nazi applies to any of this.

You are merely throwing words.  None of them stick.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> The point, Si Modo, is you know not what a fascist, or a brown shirt, or a Nazi applies to any of this.
> 
> You are merely throwing words.  None of them stick.


OK.  If you don't believe those words are appropriate, then "authoritarian" works.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

Government is authoritarian by definition, even libertarian government.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Government is authoritarian by definition, even libertarian government.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

Support for more gun laws has also been declining for some time.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

That support has just reversed.  Survey a number of Republican legislators' sites.  Start with Ron Barber of Arizona.


----------



## peach174 (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> That support has just reversed.  Survey a number of Republican legislators' sites.  Start with Ron Barber of Arizona.



Ron Barber only represents the people of Tucson AZ. and not the rest of his constituents.
To him the rest of us don't exist.

Ron Barber is a Democrat.Not a Republican.


----------



## Katzndogz (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Tim McVeigh killed 168 people with a car.

Car bomb kills more than 25
Syria car bombing kills more than 25 in Aleppo - Los Angeles Times

It's easy for a car to cause mass casualties.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 19, 2012)

I wonder how many troops have been killed or injured by IED's instead of direct weapons fire?


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Si modo said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...


My hysteria, as you say, isn't over inanimate objects.  It's over the worship of all things destructive wrought by the potent guns designed to kill many quickly.  Shot guns, bolt action rifles and revolvers are more than adequate to provide responsible recreation and self defense.  AR-15s, Glocks with multiple round clips, bullets designed specifically to penetrate body armor are items demanded by gun nuts and bought by them in huge quantities all in an effort to effect an image of 'cool'.  And that is a particularly seductive and destructive muse.

That muse tells the feeble minded and weak that arming themselves makes them not only equal, but superior to others.  That acquiring the accouterment of the military endows them with the power of the military.  And that has left death and sorrow as a consequence.

You can't put out fires by dowsing them with gasoline.  Just as you can't stem the tide of gun violence by adding more guns to the mix.  That sounds like the prescription gun makers would have us follow.  The medicine they have provided so far has left the patient moribund.  The worship of guns and the ignorance of that consequence is our cross to bear.  We have to rid our society of the tools that make mass shootings possible and we must do that today.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Katzndogz said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...


It's the bombs in the cars that caused the destruction.  You may as well blame brass for deaths as that's what cartridges are made of.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

Ron Barber is a lifelong NRA member, kid.

He represents his district, pub and dem.

That's the way it is.

And he has a vote in Congress, which you don't.



peach174 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > That support has just reversed.  Survey a number of Republican legislators' sites.  Start with Ron Barber of Arizona.
> ...


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

No shit.


----------



## idb (Dec 19, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Them's fightin' words mister.
It would be like if I called you Canadian.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

idb said:


> Them's fightin' words mister.
> It would be like if I called you Canadian.



You sure?  Would you rather be called Canadian or Australian?


----------



## idb (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > Them's fightin' words mister.
> ...



Canadian of course.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

idb said:


> Zoom-boing said:
> 
> 
> > syrenn said:
> ...



Ever talk to a criminal? Ever think about the fact that gun stores are rarely victims of armed robbery, unlike 7-11s? Do you know what the major difference between the two are, other than gun stores being more likely to get the criminal a large amount of money?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > I know, it's funny. Did we overcome the tyranny of England via vote?
> ...



Ever notice how many rich assholes support gun control?


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 19, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> I wonder how many troops have been killed or injured by IED's instead of direct weapons fire?



When a classroom full of first graders gets taken out by IEDs we can start addressing the problem

Right now, the problem is guns.

Guns are our leading tool of murder in THIS COUNTRY. 67% of murders use a gun. We need to address our major cause of violence in this country and that is the gun


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> No one is making you have an abortion.
> 
> ON the other hand, crazy assholes walking around with guns are a threat to all of us.
> 
> ...



No one is making you buy a gun.

On the other hand, their are crazy assholes trying to pass laws that require me to pay for abortions.

One condom breaks and I am on the hook for an abortion and years of emotional therapy.

By the way, if you want to stop taking off your shoes when you get on a plane I suggest you stop letting the government make up arbitrary rules about airline security that are designed to fool idiots into thinking they  are doing something and insist they start actually doing something. I can site numerous security experts who are more than willing to point out the flaws in TSA procedures, and why they will never stop a real terrorist. They can't even find one that thinks they are doing things right, yet you still insist that I go along with the rules because it makes you feel better.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Seriously? 

Iraq Attacks Kill 26, Many in Kurdish-Claimed Areas

When are you going to learn to shut the fuck up and not prove to the entire world how stupid you are? Are you really a Republican shill paid to make Democrats look like idiots?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

squeeze berry said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...



  Believeit or not, I can come up with examples of that too.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



The only reason you  say that is because you never lived under a tyrannical government and are too stupid to understand the concept.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > I don't spend my time worrying about low probability injuries/assaults to myself.  There are a lot more common ways to die and I take care to prevent them the best I can....like looking right, then left, then right again before making a left turn.
> ...



You don't understand the purpose of the constitution at all if you don't think it trumps common sense.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

Thanks for making the case for RPG ownership Joe.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 19, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Si modo said:
> 
> 
> > I don't spend my time worrying about low probability injuries/assaults to myself.  There are a lot more common ways to die and I take care to prevent them the best I can....like looking right, then left, then right again before making a left turn.
> ...


Forgive me if I don't find your idea of what common sense is to be all that compelling.

You simply scare me, as most lunatics do.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Military style weaponry? Here are a few facts for you, military style weaponry is designed to be light and easy to carry. A few seconds of thought might explain why to you, if not, you are way too stupid to continue this discussion. They are also designed to use less powerful ammunition than hunting style weapons, are are, as a rule, less deadly than those hunting style weapons that you think are safer.

Seriously, you are letting a bunch of political hacks manipulate you into giving them power because you are scared. Grow up.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

QWB and those who support him are the true lunatics on this thread.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...


The clumsy tactic of demeaning your opposition may work on those you associate with (birds of a feather so to speak), but it fails to effect me.  Such tactics do, in fact, tell me that I am dealing with a lesser intellect.  So there you are.  

Military style weaponry is designed to give the bearer of such weapons a sense of cool and machismo.  It is designed to fire rapidly and is often fitted with magazines so the rate of fire can be sustained.  They have absolutely no legitimate use other than that which was designed.  They are a blight on society and should be forever banned from civilian use.

Gun enthusiasts tend to love their mechanical penis extensions and seek and seek all answers by expanding the gun culture.  The problem is guns in hands that should not have such guns, not to add more guns.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> So Dodge City, when it enacted gun laws, during the Wild West days was under control of the fascists.  Godwin Alert.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just an FYI for the less educated posters, fascism predates Hitler.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder how many troops have been killed or injured by IED's instead of direct weapons fire?
> ...



Actually, the problem is young males, not guns.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> QWB and those who support him are the true lunatics on this thread.



People support me? Can you point to one of them, I always wondered who was stupid enough to support anyone who calls themselves a windbag, especially a quantum one.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Really? Can you point o marketing studies that support that, or are you just posturing?


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


 


You had me at Moloch.


----------



## ERGO (Dec 19, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder how many troops have been killed or injured by IED's instead of direct weapons fire?
> ...



When guns were banned in Chicago and Washington, D.C. the murder rates went up. Criminals, like gang bangers, don't obey gun laws. Disarming good people with gun bans sets them up to be victimized by armed criminals. 
Would anyone put a sign up in their yard declaring their property a gun free zone? There are many stories in which an armed citizen stopped a crime in process because they were armed, but the filtered... agenda driven, so called, main stream media hardly ever reports these cases.


*Watch robbers run for the door after woman shoots at them*

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK4h_7YZHWE]Watch robbers run for the door after woman shoots at them - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


What apparatus is used by these frightening young males to kill scores of people?

The problem is guns.  If you love guns, I know it seems ridiculous that your beloved gun could be anything but an elegant, empowering, benign extension of your pseudo-machismo world outlook.

But here's a news flash:  guns shoot bullets at a ghastly rate into the bodies of innocent men, women and children.

If young males were the problem, and they had no access to the type of weapons soldiers and law enforcement officers should exclusively have, we would not see two dozen funerals in Connecticut or a dozen in Aurora Colorado or thousands more nationwide.


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

No, it's not guns. If the problem was guns, an increase in gun restrictions would lead to a decrease in gun death.

Hasn't happened. Hasn't reduced the incidence or severity of mass killings at schools, either.

So take your ridiculous, tired propaganda and spout it to the morons in France who actually believed it at one time. That's a pretty safe place now, I hear.

Oh, wait...


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



You don't believe that sex appeal has anything to do with marketing weapons?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> No, it's not guns. If the problem was guns, an increase in gun restrictions would lead to a decrease in gun death.
> 
> Hasn't happened. Hasn't reduced the incidence or severity of mass killings at schools, either.
> 
> ...


The assault weapons ban was lifted under the wise and thoughtful George W. Bush.  Every time REAL substantial gun restrictions are proposed, the NRA (lackeys of gun makers and hypnotized gun owners) steps in to water them down.  Making cosmetic changes rather than pragmatic and effective changes.  

If we want to rid our society of gun violence, the solution is not to add more guns.  The solution is to subtract them.  And to subtract them substantially.


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## idb (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom-boing said:
> ...



I was referring to the second sentence.


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King, are you too dense to recognize military weapons are the MOST protected by the Constitution?  Just what would a militia use?  You also attempted to demean your opponent, so that point is lost.


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## ERGO (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



More people die each year from alcoholism and drunk driving than from guns. Why isn't alcohol being made illegal? Because that would be collectivized punishment. Something a collectivist liberal no doubt can grasp, I'm sure. More people die each year in traffic accidents than from guns. Why don't we just make people take public transportation in order to stop people from dying in traffic accidents. This is another collectivist solution.
Just because some irresponsible crazy person uses a gun to murder with doesn't mean good responsible people should be collectively punished for it.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King, are you too dense to recognize military weapons are the MOST protected by the Constitution?  Just what would a militia use?  You also attempted to demean your opponent, so that point is lost.


I have no problem with gun manufacturers making weapons for our military or for export to other sovereign militaries.  I do not believe that such weapons belong on civilian streets in the hands of civilians.  There is no legitimate civilian use for them.  Just as a civilian can't have a flamethrower, a mortar, a tank or a battleship, civilians should not have guns whose rate of fire and sustainability of that rate is only effective against human targets.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

ERGO said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


Are you being punished by restriction on flame thrower ownership?  Are you being punished by having mortars and shell kept from you?  Is it a punishment to you not to be able to own an RPG launcher and the projectiles they launch?

Keep your guns.  Just surrender the ones designed for military use, not sport.


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## rightwinger (Dec 19, 2012)

ERGO said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



As a society, we have made harsh changes to combat the effects of Drunk Driving. Later ages when you can legally drink, harsher punishments against drunk drivers, penalties against those who serve alchohol

Why can't we do the same for guns?


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

luddly.neddite said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> > mudwhistle said:
> ...



Well you were the first one to do it...so stall that high horse of yours


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## Plasmaball (Dec 19, 2012)

citing Car bombs is not a reasonable excuse to renew a look at how we handle guns. Sensible actions can be taken without resorting to stupidity. 

You people can actually take the time and treat this as a serious issue, or you can continue being morons.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Depends.

Sometimes they use guns, sometimes they use bobs, they have even been known to use airplanes.

What's your point?


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## ERGO (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Your argument is ridiculous and not too realistic. Nobody has been caught using flame throwers, mortar shells or RPG's against other people within the U.S. if criminals have semi-auto military assault rifles, like the Bushmaster .223 or any other military semi-auto's, I want to be able to stop them with a military assault rifle. I would want to at least match their force. When criminals start using flame throwers, a good rifle will stop them. When criminals start using Mortars and RPG's, which isn't likely to happen, then yes I would like to be able to DEFEND myself with a matched force.


*Connecticut Shootings What No One Dares Say*

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gZn-Pq38B_Y]Connecticut Shootings What No One Dares Say - YouTube[/ame]


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I believe a lot of things, I try to have evidence to back those beliefs up before posting them. Do you, or do you not, have evidence?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

idb said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



Are you trying to deny that the left wants to categorically deny people the right to carry a weapon?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

morons will continue to moron

look at daveman, Uncensored, QWB, and the rest of the morons on the far right


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## Plasmaball (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Yes bobs are very dangerous!


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> morons will continue to moron
> 
> look at daveman, Uncensored, QWB, and the rest of the morons on the far right



and you


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

ERGO, means of military weapons violence is restricted to the military.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I can build a flame thrower in any garage with rudimentary tools, denying me the right to buy one only comforts idiots.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

I am neither far right nor a moron.  You just proved my point.



Stephanie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > morons will continue to moron
> ...


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Drunk driving is an action that is illegal, owning a gun is not. By the way, using a gun in a crime counts for an automatic 5 year sentence in most jurisdictions, so we already have laws about using guns to break the law.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

ERGO said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > ERGO said:
> ...


So, by your logic, if the problem is big guns, you want a big gun too rather than eliminate the big gun from the start.  And you call my point ridiculous.


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## ERGO (Dec 19, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Yes, but we don't collectively punish everybody (the responsible drinkers) by denying their access to alcohol because of the irresponsible drinkers do we. It's dealt with on a case by case basis.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > ERGO said:
> ...



The literalist reveals a shallow mind.  The point is (and follow closely if you can) there are weapons designed for military use.  The design mandate is the ability to kill as many people in as short a period of time as possible.  Such weapons are fitted out with semi or fully automatic firing systems or a semi automatic firing system modified to act as fully automatic.  They are also equipped with high capacity magazines to sustain that ghastly rate of fire.  Such weapons have no legitimate civilian use and should never be in the hands of civilians.

Steps have been taken to keep some military weapons out of civilian hands.  My position is the ban is incomplete.  All military weapons must be out of civilian hands.

Now, pick some fly shit out of that ground pepper, or bring logic.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

ERGO has just created a false derivative analogy below.



ERGO said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > ERGO said:
> ...


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## ERGO (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



You're not going to eliminate the big gun from start, we're long past that.  Criminal's aren't going to surrender their assault rifles because you make them illegal, Plus...A lot of criminals obtain their weapons in the black underground market. There's underground machine shops that make guns, modify guns and make bullets.

The world would be a safer place if all countries got rid of their nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. How likely is that to happen? The reason they maintain them is for defensive/offensive purposes.


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

"

Since the dawn of creation there has been both good & evil in the hearts of men and women. We all contain the seeds of kindness or the seeds of violence. The death of my wonderful daughter, Rachel Joy Scott, and the deaths of that heroic teacher, and the other eleven children who died must not be in vain. Their blood cries out for answers. 
The first recorded act of violence was when Cain slew his brother Abel out in the field. The villain was not the club he used.. Neither was it the NCA, the National Club Association. The true killer was Cain, and the reason for the murder could only be found in Cain&#8217;s heart. 
In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA &#8211; because I don&#8217;t believe that they are responsible for my daughter&#8217;s death. Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended. If I believed they had anything to do with Rachel&#8217;s murder I would be their strongest opponent. 
I am here today to declare that Columbine was not just a tragedy &#8212; it was a spiritual event that should be forcing us to look at where the real blame lies! Much of the blame lies here in this room. Much of the blame lies behind the pointing fingers of the accusers themselves. I wrote a poem just four nights ago that expresses my feelings best. 
Your laws ignore our deepest needs,
Your words are empty air.
You&#8217;ve stripped away our heritage,
You&#8217;ve outlawed simple prayer.
Now gunshots fill our classrooms,
And precious children die.
You seek for answers everywhere,
And ask the question &#8220;Why?&#8221;
You regulate restrictive laws,
Through legislative creed.
And yet you fail to understand,
That God is what we need! 
Men and women are three-part beings. We all consist of body, mind, and spirit. When we refuse to acknowledge a third part of our make-up, we create a void that allows evil, prejudice, and hatred to rush in and wreak havoc. Spiritual presences were present within our educational systems for most of our nation&#8217;s history. Many of our major colleges began as theological seminaries. This is a historical fact. What has happened to us as a nation? We have refused to honor God, and in so doing, we open the doors to hatred and violence. And when something as terrible as Columbine&#8217;s tragedy occurs &#8212; politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that contribute to erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. Eric and Dylan would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre. The real villain lies within our own hearts. 
As my son Craig lay under that table in the school library and saw his two friends murdered before his very eyes, he did not hesitate to pray in school. I defy any law or politician to deny him that right! I challenge every young person in America , and around the world, to realize that on April 20, 1999, at Columbine High School prayer was brought back to our schools. Do not let the many prayers offered by those students be in vain. Dare to move into the new millennium with a sacred disregard for legislation that violates your God-given right to communicate with Him. To those of you who would point your finger at the NRA &#8212; I give to you a sincere challenge.. Dare to examine your own heart before casting the first stone! 
My daughter&#8217;s death will not be in vain! The young people of this country will not allow that to happen!&#8221; Darrell Scott "

Columbine Father 12 Years Later&hellip; In the Wake of Another Tragedy | askmarion


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## idb (Dec 19, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> idb said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



There are some on the left that want that for sure...I'm sure there will be some on the right as well.
The sensible discussion though is not about total disarming. 

I reject the blanket statement 


> But the left wants us all unarmed so the armed bad guys and loons can wreck havoc in even more places.



As a matter of interest, why is the gun debate perceived as a left/right debate?
If you are Democrat do you have to reject guns with the opposite being true if you're a Republican?


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

The left does want to unarm the citizenry. They don't deny it.
You will not find a single person who values liberty (i.e., a member of the ideological right in this country) calling for more restrictive gun laws.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



The point is that weapons designed for infantry use tend to be lighter and less deadly than those designed for civilian use. Yet, for some reason that escapes me, you think we should get rid of these types of weapons and use only hunting weapons.

Can't find enough logic in that to pick an electron out of, much less fly shit.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> ERGO has just created a false derivative analogy below.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Actually, he just pointed it out.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

ERGO said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > ERGO said:
> ...


The solution is simple, but the political will is weak.  Gun makers hold too many legislators in their back pockets.  The NRA threatens congressmen with the same zeal Grover Norquist does.  Gun owners are painfully myopic and the paranoid alway believe that there is either a criminal at their door or an official ready to confiscate their toys and ruin their day.

Here's the solution: Only bolt action rifles, shot guns and revolvers will be legal to keep.  All other guns and accessories are to be turned in for a voucher providing a tax credit for any such equipment.  After the turn in period has expired, any guns found will be confiscated and the owner shall be imprisoned for a period of no less than three years.  If crimes are committed with such guns, the term is life without parole.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

idb said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > idb said:
> ...



It isn't, it is seen as a freedom/oppression type argument.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

quantum windbag said:


> nosmo king said:
> 
> 
> > quantum windbag said:
> ...


rate of fire


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Ever watch old TV westerns?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz3zHUsQWKE]The Rifleman opening credits with Alka Seltzer and One-A-Day - YouTube[/ame]


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> quantum windbag said:
> 
> 
> > nosmo king said:
> ...



Like the old bolt action M1903?

rate of fire is a function of the person using the weapon, not the weapon.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I got it bud, you're a brain dead moron.  You must also be a politician or a lawyer because it takes you 216 words to say, "I'm a brain dead idiot".


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> The solution is simple, but the political will is weak.  Gun makers hold too many legislators in their back pockets.  The NRA threatens congressmen with the same zeal Grover Norquist does.  Gun owners are painfully myopic and the paranoid alway believe that there is either a criminal at their door or an official ready to confiscate their toys and ruin their day.
> 
> Here's the solution: Only bolt action rifles, shot guns and revolvers will be legal to keep.  All other guns and accessories are to be turned in for a voucher providing a tax credit for any such equipment.  After the turn in period has expired, any guns found will be confiscated and the owner shall be imprisoned for a period of no less than three years.  If crimes are committed with such guns, the term is life without parole.



No you ignorant ass, the Constitution set this provision as a way to protect citizens from a tyrantical government.  Placing citizen militias with bolt action guns against the military is insane.  Thinking you are clever enough to fool anyone with your gun control idea fools no one but yourself.


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

The long winded explanation is necessary to hide the obvious flaws in Nosmo King's argument.  Shhh!


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> ERGO said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



wow, you all don't even TREAT a murderer that harsh...and you're talking about stepping on INNOCENT people's SECOND AMENDMENT RIGHTS...you would look good in a brown shirt


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

A criminal wants a gun regardless of consequences for two reasons:

1.  They are more likely to get what they want with the show of force.
2.  They can defend themselves should the property owner be armed or police arrive.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

We are talking about massacres at our schools, you fukwits.

Show some respect and leave off the false analogies and the irrational comments.

Change is coming, and you will be bound by it.  Tru dat.


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> We are talking about massacres at our schools, you fukwits.
> 
> Show some respect and leave off the false analogies and the irrational comments.
> 
> Change is coming, and you will be bound by it.  Tru dat.



ah sorry dear, it veered away from that a long time ago in this thread..you should go take your meds


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

Dear, you don't understand.  Some of you on the far right crazee gun crowed are going to go over the law, be caged either in a coffin or in a super max, and 90% of America will go "ho hum" and never think of those who do again.


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Dear, you don't understand.  Some of you on the far right crazee gun crowed are going to go over the law, be caged either in a coffin or in a super max, and 90% of America will go "ho hum" and never think of those who do again.




meds dear...and you should be telling the gang bangers, the mobsters, your gun tooten politicians that first, then come back and tell us legal gun owning citizens


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 19, 2012)

Stephanie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Dear, you don't understand.  Some of you on the far right crazee gun crowed are going to go over the law, be caged either in a coffin or in a super max, and 90% of America will go "ho hum" and never think of those who do again.
> ...



As I have pointed out to you, you are not part of any "us". The less intelligent nutters give you some of their attention because if you leave, they won't be able to say that they are not the least important person here.


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

^^uh huh.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 19, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> ^^uh huh.



You are mildly intelligent. But you're also batshit crazy.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The solution is simple, but the political will is weak.  Gun makers hold too many legislators in their back pockets.  The NRA threatens congressmen with the same zeal Grover Norquist does.  Gun owners are painfully myopic and the paranoid alway believe that there is either a criminal at their door or an official ready to confiscate their toys and ruin their day.
> ...


Oh!  Tyranny!  Tyranny is the threat!  Not the insane armed with military assault weapons but tyranny!  And you believe the forces arrayed by the federal government can be dissuaded by a bunch of paranoid reactionaries and mouth breathing 'survivalists' with AR-15's slung across their shoulders.  What did you call my position again?  Insane?  Are you the paradigm of sanity we should sacrifice our children to while you combat tyranny?  

Your wannabe revolution is your own pipe dream.   Something you talk about over cigarettes in the trailer park.  Here in real America, we're pretty satisfied, except for all the idiots who think they should have assault weapons, and then wind up shooting up a school or temple or shopping mall.  The real tyranny is the selfishness gun nuts have shown when they are faced with the ghastly consequences of their peculiar lust for high powered weapons.  The tyranny such nuts show is their unwillingness to believe that their little hobby can lead to deadly outcomes.  So they make us suffer and throw up incredulous smokescreens about "tyranny".


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> The long winded explanation is necessary to hide the obvious flaws in Nosmo King's argument.  Shhh!


We gladly suffer the inarticulate.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> We are talking about massacres at our schools, you fukwits.
> 
> Show some respect and leave off the false analogies and the irrational comments.
> 
> Change is coming, and you will be bound by it.  Tru dat.



Obama is talking about talking, not talking about change. The only people that believe talking is going to fix this are the lefty loons who believe Obama means what he says.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

Stephanie said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > ERGO said:
> ...


The second amendment is not a death sentence.  No one has a right to own military weapons except the military.  The amendment provides "A WELL REGULATED MILITIA" to maintain a free state.  It doesn't mean we must suffer the consequences of poor and ill informed minds when it comes to the ability to spray lead in mass quantities.


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > The long winded explanation is necessary to hide the obvious flaws in Nosmo King's argument.  Shhh!
> ...



well then spare us, please


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

I wish nosmo made sense.

Meanwhile, explain to me how taking my weapons is going to increase safety for my children in school, where no weapons are allowed now? How does this address the issue of children being vulnerable to attack from crazed criminals who specifically target gun-free zones?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Strangely enough, federal law disagrees with you.


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

Stephanie said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


 
We suffer the inarticulate?


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## NYcarbineer (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The solution is simple, but the political will is weak.  Gun makers hold too many legislators in their back pockets.  The NRA threatens congressmen with the same zeal Grover Norquist does.  Gun owners are painfully myopic and the paranoid alway believe that there is either a criminal at their door or an official ready to confiscate their toys and ruin their day.
> ...



The government has nuclear weapons.


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

Good for them.

You know who works in those nuclear plants?

Right wing conservatives. You don't find liberal nutjobs working those jobs. They're even more terrified of radiation than they are of guns.


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## Stephanie (Dec 19, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Good for them.
> 
> You know who works in those nuclear plants?
> 
> Right wing conservatives. You don't find liberal nutjobs working those jobs. They're even more terrified of radiation than they are of guns.



oh darn..that's going to leave a mark


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

I went to school in Los Alamos. My stepfather worked on gloveboxes and I have friends who still work at the labs. 

They aren't a liberal bunch.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



22 years in the Army and never once was I issued anything other than a 20 round magazine...........


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> The literalist reveals a shallow mind.  The point is (and follow closely if you can) there are weapons designed for military use.  The design mandate is the ability to kill as many people in as short a period of time as possible.  Such weapons are fitted out with semi or fully automatic firing systems or a semi automatic firing system modified to act as fully automatic.  They are also equipped with high capacity magazines to sustain that ghastly rate of fire.  Such weapons have no legitimate civilian use and should never be in the hands of civilians.
> 
> Steps have been taken to keep some military weapons out of civilian hands.  My position is the ban is incomplete.  *All military weapons must be out of civilian hands*.
> 
> Now, pick some fly shit out of that ground pepper, or bring logic.



If the second amendment is designed to protect us from government tyranny, then it is only logical that suitable weapons must be available to meet the government. 

You clearly are driven by your feelings and not logic in any form.  Fortuantely cowards like yourself are not in abundance and the rest of us will defend your rights that you so freely discard.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

steph, you are talking as if you are one one of the least intelligent posters on the board.  Just telling the truth.

The laws will pass, and any of your wack crowed gets violent, that person(s) will die.

All of us are part of the social compact, and all of us will comply with the laws of We the People.



Stephanie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Dear, you don't understand.  Some of you on the far right crazee gun crowd are going to go over the law, be caged either in a coffin or in a super max, and 90% of America will go "ho hum" and never think of those who do again.
> ...


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## koshergrl (Dec 19, 2012)

Jake, please put the cap back on, and go back into the corner. When we want you to talk, someone more intelligent than you, like rtard or gaybiker, will shove their hand up your ass and work your mouth with their hand.

Really. Your jakisms aren't needed or wanted...by anyone. I have yet to see anyone on any side give you any props, ever. Well except for the occasional ignorant noob, who usually are schooled immediately.

You're like the most shunned person on the site, next to rtard and tdm. You guys are the trifecta of usmb pariah dogs.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The literalist reveals a shallow mind.  The point is (and follow closely if you can) there are weapons designed for military use.  The design mandate is the ability to kill as many people in as short a period of time as possible.  Such weapons are fitted out with semi or fully automatic firing systems or a semi automatic firing system modified to act as fully automatic.  They are also equipped with high capacity magazines to sustain that ghastly rate of fire.  Such weapons have no legitimate civilian use and should never be in the hands of civilians.
> ...


The second amendment is clear on the fight against tyranny. "A well regulated militia...wait for it... being necessary to the security of a free State!  Well Regulated Militia!  That leaves out anyone who would not follow and obey the regulations part of "a well regulated militia".  And that leaves the safety aspect of this situation to the people.  If the people want high capacity clips and rapid rate of fire weapons out on the streets, let's flood the streets with them!  Surely things couldn't get much worse.  

But if you agree that such weapons have no place on our streets, in our schools, in our theaters and campuses, then you have to agree that they are weapons deserving to be 'well regulated', like that constitutionally mandated militia.

It ain't 'feelings'.  It's a logical way out of this maddness.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 19, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


Would a civilian need more fire power?


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The literalist reveals a shallow mind.  The point is (and follow closely if you can) there are weapons designed for military use.  The design mandate is the ability to kill as many people in as short a period of time as possible.  Such weapons are fitted out with semi or fully automatic firing systems or a semi automatic firing system modified to act as fully automatic.  They are also equipped with high capacity magazines to sustain that ghastly rate of fire.  Such weapons have no legitimate civilian use and should never be in the hands of civilians.
> ...



And yet, civilians arent allowed to own nuclear weapons.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I'm sure you will relate that in a meanful way soon.  At the moment it just looks lame.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



It could have just as easily said something like "A large penis, being necessary to date a supermodel, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be  infringed." Would that mean that only people with large penises could own guns? Do you know what a subordinate clause is?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty, you don't have the right to own military weapons platforms.  Read Heller.


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## AmyNation (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



And yet, it's the perfect response to the "we should be allowed to own military weapons so we can defend ourselves from the military".


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> saveliberty, you don't have the right to own military weapons platforms.  Read Heller.



Why would I want to own such an indiscriminate weapon?

(Not to mention the maintenance costs and inspections.)  lol

You have to look at the current conflicts around globe.  IEDs and semi to automatic weapons are the usual fare.


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



If you can sort out the combatants from innocents with a nuclear device, your way smarter than me.  It is a really, really poor response Amy.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty, you don't need or have a constitutional right to an automatic assault rifle.  Yes, the government can ban that.  Have in the past, will in the future.


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## AmyNation (Dec 19, 2012)

Lol! Thanks for the constructive criticism.


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## AmyNation (Dec 19, 2012)

Goverment can and does limit the type of weapons civilians can own. You cannot effectively defend yourself from the goverment with an assault rifle. We have evolved beyond that point.

That being said, I don't think banning the sale of certain types of guns will have any real effect on gun crime.


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> saveliberty, you don't need or have a constitutional right to an automatic assault rifle.  Yes, the government can ban that.  Have in the past, will in the future.



Has that ban been tested in the Supreme Court?  If so, what was the justification and limits to its use they placed on it?

My guess is it wasn't tested and partially because of the end date of the law.  Not permanent.

Thank you for the civil replies jake.  Appreciated as always.


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Goverment can and does limit the type of weapons civilians can own. You cannot effectively defend yourself from the goverment with an assault rifle. We have evolved beyond that point.
> 
> That being said, I don't think banning the sale of certain types of guns will have any real effect on gun crime.



Have you been watching Syria Amy?  Sure it takes a long time and lives, but that war is being won with just such weapons.  Military people defecting due to fighting their own people.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 19, 2012)

All of that was answered in Heller in 1(F).  Look it up.



saveliberty said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty, you don't need or have a constitutional right to an automatic assault rifle.  Yes, the government can ban that.  Have in the past, will in the future.
> ...


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## AmyNation (Dec 19, 2012)

If it gives you comfort to think you can effectively fight the US government with an assault rifle, then keep thinking that.

I happen to disagree.


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## saveliberty (Dec 19, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> If it gives you comfort to think you can effectively fight the US government with an assault rifle, then keep thinking that.
> 
> I happen to disagree.



You certainly have that right.  You also should have the right to not have me be snarky in my response earlier.  My apologies, you did not represent that to me, I should have not replied that way.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 19, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Give an idiot a 100 round mag and it will probably jam up within 30 rounds.
But the point is that I see nothing wrong with owning a Semi Automatic AR 15 or similar weapon....


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Dec 19, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The literalist reveals a shallow mind.  The point is (and follow closely if you can) there are weapons designed for military use.  The design mandate is the ability to kill as many people in as short a period of time as possible.  Such weapons are fitted out with semi or fully automatic firing systems or a semi automatic firing system modified to act as fully automatic.  They are also equipped with high capacity magazines to sustain that ghastly rate of fire.  Such weapons have no legitimate civilian use and should never be in the hands of civilians.
> ...



The Second Amendment is designed to protect us from government tyranny by placing limits on the power of the state, where the state is compelled to limit a right only after affording a citizen due process. 

Whether its the right to free speech, the right to privacy, or the right to self-defense, the government is required to be consistent in its application of limiting any right: 



> [T]he inherent right of self-defense has been central to the
> Second Amendment right. The handgun ban amounts to a
> prohibition of an entire class of arms that is overwhelmingly
> chosen by American society for that lawful purpose.
> ...



This is therefore not a right designed to meet the government, rather, it is a right designed to allow the citizen to protect his home, family, and self from criminal violence, and afford the citizen weapons suitable to realize that goal. 

Although the _Heller_ Court was addressing the issue of an outright ban of an entire class of arms, handguns, its logical to extrapolate that such a rationale may be applied to other weapons in common use at the time, which would include semi-automatic rifles. As the _Heller_ Majority noted: 

We therefore read _Miller _to say only that the Second Amendment does not protect those weapons not typically possessed by law-abiding citizens for lawful purposes, such as short-barreled shotguns. 

Given the vast number of AR 15s sold over the decades, such weapons are obviously typically possessed by law-abiding citizens for lawful purposes, the capacity and design of their magazines or other cosmetic configurations are undoubtedly irrelevant in determining whether or not their possession is protected by the Constitution. 

Last, the _Heller_ Court correctly acknowledges the fact that no right is absolute, that there are many appropriate restrictions with regard to Second Amendment rights, and that government has a compelling interest to apply those restrictions  *save that of an outright ban of a firearm legally possessed, in common use, and used for a lawful purpose.  *


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## jtpr312 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> steph, you are talking as if you are one one of the least intelligent posters on the board.  Just telling the truth.
> 
> The laws will pass, and any of your wack crowed gets violent, that person(s) will die.
> 
> ...



Yeah, tens of millions who thought just like you do suffered and died in the gulags of the Soviet Union.  As for me, better to die on my feet than live on my knees.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 20, 2012)

You should copyright that line, Jethro. You are a regular Patrick Henry. 

Such a manly man. Too bad you are a fucking lunatic.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Goverment can and does limit the type of weapons civilians can own. You cannot effectively defend yourself from the goverment with an assault rifle. We have evolved beyond that point.
> 
> That being said, I don't think banning the sale of certain types of guns will have any real effect on gun crime.


Yes the government can regulate certain firearms, those that does not have 'some reasonable relationship to the preservation or efficiency of a well-regulated militia'


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 20, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Goverment can and does limit the type of weapons civilians can own. You cannot effectively defend yourself from the goverment with an assault rifle. We have evolved beyond that point.
> ...



Those...........do.

Imbecile.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > steph, you are talking as if you are one one of the least intelligent posters on the board.  Just telling the truth.
> ...



You should apologize to Starkey for acusing him of the crime of thought.

I highly doubt that has ever happened to him at all.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



He is refering to established case law. What about that makes him an imbecile? For taking lawyers seriously?


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> You should copyright that line, Jethro. You are a regular Patrick Henry.
> 
> Such a manly man. Too bad you are a fucking lunatic.



You cant even get the mans name right; so shut the fuck up already.

Why are libtards so fucking stupid?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



Thanks for quoting my post .


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> If it gives you comfort to think you can effectively fight the US government with an assault rifle, then keep thinking that.
> 
> I happen to disagree.



The Taliban has done ore with far less, so why not?

And I thnk these ex-military will do a lot better than the Taliban should it come to that.

Hopefully it never will.


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## Stephanie (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> steph, you are talking as if you are one one of the least intelligent posters on the board.  Just telling the truth.
> 
> The laws will pass, and any of your wack crowed gets violent, that person(s) will die.
> 
> ...



oh good grief, spare us your predictions and we all a part of a social compact bull..
I don't run in a pact like animals..but it seems like a lot of you feel the need to so you don't have to stand on YOUR OWN two feet..


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > If it gives you comfort to think you can effectively fight the US government with an assault rifle, then keep thinking that.
> ...



So you want to be like the Taliban now?  

Seriously, Hitler?  

Yeah, and you wonder why we want to get the guns away from you whacks.  

Here's why your analogy doesn't hold up.   Besides the fact that the Taliban are being constantly resupplied by Pakistani intelligence, the fact is, they have popular support.  

Most Americans don't want Timothy McVeigh wannabes living next store.


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## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > If it gives you comfort to think you can effectively fight the US government with an assault rifle, then keep thinking that.
> ...



The Taliban has fully functional AK-47s and RPGs. They fire and run away

Anyone who is ex-military understands what it means to go head to head with US soldiers and Marines. It is not guns but training, tactics, communications and a fully funtioning command and control structure that wins the wars


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## thanatos144 (Dec 20, 2012)

When these things happen progressive always show their true fascist side.


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## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.


----------



## Si modo (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.


I rather think most in the military took their oath to the Constitution a hell of a lot more seriously than any elected official.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.



Morning Amy,

Defending the Constitution is the duty of all patriots.  I'd prefer to have the government stay within its limits, but freedom is not free.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.



Really? Now answer me this oh great thinker How many Soldiers will kill their family or neighbor cause of a fascist president told them to? And how many bullets do you need to end someone? Can we blow up a tank? You seem to think that people will just give up their liberty at gun point. If this was true Wilson or Roosevelt would have already done it.


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## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.



So many are ex-military too

Didn't they learn anything in the service?


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## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.
> ...



I'm sorry

But if the laws are legally changed in accordance with our Constitution you are no longer defending the Constitution
You are just an armed thug taking up arms against his country and you will be treated as such


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



The law cannot take away a Constitutional right.  This is clearly such a right.  I won't hunt down members of the government in defense of those rights, but I won't be hunted either.  By the way, the government will be shooting an unarmed person.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

This country is a democracy within a constitutional Republic.

Yes, you will obey the laws of We the People or pay the price.



Stephanie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > steph, you are talking as if you are one one of the least intelligent posters on the board.  Just telling the truth.
> ...


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



Why would the government shoot an unarmed person?

If a law is passed in accordance with our Constitution and it passes any Constitutional judicial challenge, then it is Constitutional


The courts decide what is Constitutional....not internet posters


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## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



What it really comes down is how deceitful partisan hacks *deliberately misinterpret* the Constitution to better fit their ideologies. Gun control is not about controlling guns... It's about *controlling people*.


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## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


 
Hmmmm....why DO governments shoot unarmed people?






2-year old victim at waco.


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## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

tjvh said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



If you believe that your rights and obligations as a citizen are to legally protest, campaign to elect those who support your political views. file legal challenges to the laws, write positions on your political views and bost them on the interweb

Just because the tide has turned against you does not give you the right to take up arms against your country. That is treason. If you do so, you will face the consequenses


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



The Branch Davidian compound was occupied by criminals who had shot US agents. 

They fought the law....and the law won


----------



## Si modo (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


Then the government better think long and hard about violating the Constitution.  Another one of those neat checks and balances.


----------



## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Who said anything about taking up arms numbskull? The fact remains is that gun control is *not popular with the majority*, and that is why the agenda *only* gets pushed when tragedies strike and bodies haven't even cooled off, or been put into the ground yet... People who push agendas based upon compromised emotions are the ones who are truly despicable.


----------



## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Children who died at Waco fought the Law... Really?


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

Si modo said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.
> ...



If and I honestly don't think it will ever happen, but if the government turns against the American people, they will do so only when they are sure that they have the military on their side.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.



Instead of pretending you know everything you should be happy to know that there are actually people out there willing to fight for your right to not have the government move into your bedroom, even if they think you are crazy for trusting the government.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.
> ...



I would hope they were paying enough attention to know that the People's Republic of China has a military that has almost twice as many people as we do, and that they can call on more men to fight that the total population of the US. That way they won't make absurd statements that the US has the largest military force in the world.


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Our military complex is the biggest and most powerful force on this planet. Your rifle cannot adequately defend you should the United States government turn on you. Im actually suprised so many seem to think they can seriously defend themselves agaisnt the all the power the United States has, with a rifle.
> ...



Been drinking? O.0


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Why would the government shoot an unarmed person? Seriously? 

Maybe because they do it all the time, and people like you let them get away with it.

Category:Unarmed people shot by police - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## ChrisfromDenver (Dec 20, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> I would hope they were paying enough attention to know that the People's Republic of China has a military that has almost twice as many people as we do, and that they can call on more men to fight that the total population of the US. That way they won't make absurd statements that the US has the largest military force in the world.



Cannon Fodder != bigger military


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

tjvh said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Parents using their own children as shields?

Horrific


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Those kids shot people? Seriously?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



You are the one that thinks the US Army is the biggest in the world.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

ChrisfromDenver said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > I would hope they were paying enough attention to know that the People's Republic of China has a military that has almost twice as many people as we do, and that they can call on more men to fight that the total population of the US. That way they won't make absurd statements that the US has the largest military force in the world.
> ...



More money does not make it bigger, or even better.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You really do keep popping up with stuff that you can't prove, don't you?


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


Global Firepower - 2012 World Military Strength Ranking

^^ #1, U.S.A.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > tjvh said:
> ...


 
Has he ever criticized hamas for doing the same?

Nope.

And that really is what they do...

Anyway, he will continue to defend killing children. It's what leftist scum do.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

I love how the left continues to maintain that although it's paranoid to think the government would turn on you...the government will squash you easily, along with your kids.

You guys rock. I like to see dangerous schizophrenia on display. It reminds us that we need to keep ourselves armed in case you decide to visit a school to wipe out those dangerous, rebellious children.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

You do not decide what the Constitution is for you.  Rebel against the USA, pay the consequences.



Si modo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > tjvh said:
> ...


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Actually it is, and among that large majority, about 50% of GOP believe in it.

Look it up.  You are the minority.



tjvh said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > tjvh said:
> ...


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

You shame the death of the children at Waco with that statement.



tjvh said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...


----------



## Si modo (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Actually it is, and among that large majority, about 50% of GOP believe in it.
> 
> Look it up.  You are the minority.
> 
> ...


You are wrong.

Support for more gun laws has been declining for some time now and is the minority.


----------



## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Actually it is, and among that large majority, about 50% of GOP believe in it.
> 
> Look it up.  You are the minority.
> 
> ...


 
Liar. Paid propagandist for baby killers, disregard.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



Two problems, we are talking about the Army, not the entire military here, and the guy admits he is mostly talking out of his ass.



> It goes without saying that lists such can be completely subjective, though the GFP intention is to be wholly unbiased.          The final GFP rankings are based on a formula taking some 45 factors into account and compiling totals against each country, applying   bonuses and penalties as needed to generate this list.


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



You may be talking about the Army, but I never said that. Are you enjoying the word twisting today?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



If by some small miracle the United States Government were to break down into some form of Tyrannical government do you really believe that the entire armed forces would stay true to the Government or to the constitution?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



Knowing just a little bit about the military and the military of the other countries in this world, I would say that yes the USA does have the strongest military at this time. But that chart is way off on a lot of countries.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

Si modo said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Actually it is, and among that large majority, about 50% of GOP believe in it.
> ...



In stead of a chart how about the actual shooting during Clinton's gun ban
School shooting during Clintons gun ban more than half are mass shootings.

January 12, 1995: Seattle Washington A student left school during the day and returned with his grandfather's 9mm. He wounded two students. The incident is portrayed in the documentary Cease Fire.

October 12, 1995: Blackville, South Carolina A suspended student shot two math teachers with a .32 caliber revolver.

November 15, 1995: Lynnville, Tennessee A 17-year-old boy shot and killed a student and teacher with a .22 rifle.[citation needed] February 2, 1996: Moses Lake, Washington Two students and one teacher killed, one other wounded when 14-year-old Barry Loukaitis opened fire on his algebra class.

February 19, 1997: Bethel, Alaska Principal and one student killed, two others wounded by Evan Ramsey, 16.[38] October 1, 1997: Pearl, Mississippi Two students killed and seven wounded by Luke Woodham, 16, who was also accused of killing his mother. He and his friends were said to be outcasts who worshiped Satan.

1997: West Palm Beach, Florida Conniston Middle School 14-year-old John Kamel was fatally shot in the chest at 8:40 a.m. outside school on a sidewalk by 14-year-old Tronneal Mangum after an argument over an Adidas watch that Mangum had taken from Kamel.

December 1, 1997: West Paducah, Kentucky Three students killed, five wounded by Michael Carneal, 14, as they participated in a prayer circle at Heath High School.

December 15, 1997: Stamps, Arkansas Two students wounded. Colt Todd, 14, was hiding in the woods when he shot the students as they stood in the parking lot

*March 24, 1998: Jonesboro, Arkansas Four students and one teacher killed, ten others wounded outside as Westside Middle School emptied during a false fire alarm. Mitchell Johnson, 13, and Andrew Golden, 11, shot at their classmates and teachers from the woods*

April 24, 1998: Edinboro, Pennsylvania One teacher, John Gillette, was killed and two students wounded at a dance at James W. Parker Middle School. Andrew Wurst, 14, was charged.

*May 21, 1998: Springfield, Oregon Two students killed, 22 others wounded in the cafeteria at Thurston High School by 15-year-old Kip Kinkel. Kinkel had been arrested and released a day earlier for bringing a gun to school. His parents were later found dead at home, shot to death by their son*

June 15, 1998: Richmond, Virginia One teacher and one guidance counselor wounded by a 14-year-old boy in the school hallway[38] December 10, 1998: Detroit, Michigan One professor killed by a graduate student.

*April 20, 1999: Littleton, Colorado 14 students (including 2 shooters) and one teacher killed, 27 others wounded at Columbine High School. Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17, had plotted for a year to kill at least 500 and blow up their school. At the end of their hour-long rampage, they turned their guns on themselves.*

May 20, 1999: Conyers, Georgia Six students injured at Heritage High School by Thomas Solomon, 15, who was reportedly depressed after breaking up with his girlfriend

February 29, 2000: Unidentified 6-year-old offender in Michigan school shooting. 1 student fatality.

May 26, 2000: Lake Worth, Florida Lake Worth Middle School Florida teacher Barry Grunow was fatally shot by his student, 13-year-old Nathaniel Brazill, who had returned to school after being sent home at 1 p.m. by the assistant principal for throwing water balloons. Brazill returned to school on his bike with a 5 inch Raven and four bullets stolen from his grandfather the week before. Brazill was an honor student. Grunow was a popular teacher and Brazill's favorite.

August 28, 2000: University of Arkansas shooting at Fayetteville, Arkansas At approximately 12:14 pm, Dr. John R. Locke, 67, Director of the Comparative Literature Program was shot and killed in his office by James E. Kelly, 36, a Comparative Literature PhD candidate who had recently been dismissed from the program for lack of progress towards his degree. Kelly shot Dr. Locke three times before taking his own life in Dr. Locke's office after it was cordoned off by campus police.

September 26, 2000: Darrel Johnson, 13, offender in Louisiana school shooting with 1 student fatality.

March 5, 2001: Charles Andrew William, age 15, offender in California school shooting, 15 wounded 2 of which died.

March 30, 2001: Donald R. Burt Jr., age 18, offender in Indiana school shooting with 1 student fatality.

September 24, 2003: John Jason McLaughlin, age 15, offender in Minnesota school shooting with 2 student fatalities.]

February 2, 2004: Unidentified offender in Washington, DC school shooting with 1 student fatality.

May 7, 2004: Unidentified 17 year old offender in Maryland school shooting with 1 student fatality.


----------



## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> AmyNation said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Valid. Although I think the top 3 are pretty spot on.


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## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



Even if only 80% stayed true, it will still be more force than a rifle can defend against.


The original point was, that I think the argument that citizens need military grade weapons in case we have to defeat the military is a poor argument for pro-gun advocates. I'd say this thread is full of much more valid reasons that citizens should not be denied the right to own assault rifles, just my opinion.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Give us all the polls, Si Modo, not the cherry picked ones that cater to the far right, please.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

I would think the reason fewer people are in favor of gun bans is, more and more folks don't trust their political leaders and government in general.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Let's have the latest polls, preferably since Newtown, saveliberty.  Your comment will change, I am sure.


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## AmyNation (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> I would think the reason fewer people are in favor of gun bans is, more and more folks don't trust their political leaders and government in general.



Could be.

Last poll I saw said something like 80% of Americans distrust government. I absolutely think that plays a part in how we shape our gun laws.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Let's have the latest polls, preferably since Newtown, saveliberty.  Your comment will change, I am sure.



Gun sales are spiking Jake, so I am not so sure there will be the numbers you want.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

I'm sure that if the poll question is, "If you knew for sure gun control would stop school shootings like Newtown, would you support it?", even I would say yes, despite that being a fantasy quesiton.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> I'm sure that if the poll question is, "If you knew for sure gun control would stop school shootings like Newtown, would you support it?", even I would say yes, despite that being a fantasy quesiton.



It did not stop any school shooting during the last ban much less mass shootings.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty, quit kick stepping.  Snap, Snap: all of the latest polls, please.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

Previous gun laws, particularly the Assault Weapons ban lifted by Bush/Cheney are heavily watered down due to NRA lobbying efforts.  The debates about the Assault Weapons Ban centered on cosmetic issues; grips, bayonet mounts, detachable stocks.  Nothing of any consequence, but picking over the bells and whistles of the guns.  No wonder they have been so damn ineffective. 

New legislation must be comprehensive.  No cosmetic exceptions.  The magazines and the firing mechanisms have to go.  There is no civilian justification for those.

But no law that doesn't effect the whole nation could be effective either.  State challenges will ensue, both legislatively and judicially.  States would have to produce overwhelming evidence that their citizens should access the banned weapons.


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## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Actually it is, and among that large majority, about 50% of GOP believe in it.
> 
> Look it up.  You are the minority.
> 
> ...



Nonsense... The gun grabbers cannot push their agenda *unless there is a tragedy* to help move their tyranny forward. You'd be surprised how many Democrats draw the line at the Second Amendment. I don't need to look it up... You made the ridiculous statement, you provide the link to back your own assertions up.


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## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



It isn't about fighting the Military. WTF... Can we have a little rational thought please?


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## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > I'm sure that if the poll question is, "If you knew for sure gun control would stop school shootings like Newtown, would you support it?", even I would say yes, despite that being a fantasy quesiton.
> ...



Yup... The assault weapon ban didn't work the last time, anyone can check the dates:
Time Line of Worldwide School Shootings &mdash; Infoplease.com


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## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

tjvh said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Actually it is, and among that large majority, about 50% of GOP believe in it.
> ...



If it were one tragedy you might have a point

Columbine
Virginia Tech
Tucson
Batman slayings
Sandy Hook

When is enough ENOUGH

You don't need those fucking guns


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## tjvh (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...



I need my guns to defend myself from tyrannical idiots like yourself... Enough said. BTW... How do you think you are going to take away my guns anyway??? Some re-hired census takers going to kick in my door, and go through my home? The Constitutionality of that would be really something to behold.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 20, 2012)

AmyNation said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



Actually that may have been true up until the last year or three. China has surpassed Russia...They have been building their military muscle and tech....


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## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

But lefties laugh at the thought that China could be a geo political threat.

Which shows you how smart they are.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 20, 2012)

Actually I give Obama credit for building up our forces in the Asian theater. Though I don't think we should totally disappear from the mid East yet.......


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> But lefties laugh at the thought that China could be a geo political threat.
> 
> Which shows you how smart they are.


Not that it's pertinent, but which Lefties where?  Being Liberal doesn't mean you take your eye off the world.  Was FDR a good wartime president?  Did JFK drop the ball over the Cuban Missile Crisis?

You have, no doubt, read several hundred posts written by Liberals like me on this board.  Do all Liberals appear mentally addled in some way to you?  Are Liberals, by your stereotyping, inarticulate boobs without cogent thought?  Or are you projecting your secret fears about other Conservatives, perhaps even yourself?


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## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

Yes, I like your description of them. I'll go with that.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > But lefties laugh at the thought that China could be a geo political threat.
> ...



There actually aren't that many Liberals like you on the board......


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

tjvh said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > tjvh said:
> ...


Had a lot of direct threats from tyrants lately?  Or perhaps you live in an isolated Syrian village.  Do you see an active tyrannical regime as a genuine threat?

Let me tell you a story of another boy who was scared of the tyrants.  Little Timmy was so frightened of tangible tyranny that he asked his friend Terry to help him fight back.  So they devised a magical truck and drove it to Oklahoma City one Spring.

Is that the position you hold?  So ideologically brainwashed that you see some esoteric "tyranny" as the genuine threat while 26 victims of gun violence are buried in New England.

Spare us your pipe-dream revolution.  You are a detonator away from the tactics of the Weather Underground and held in as much esteem if you think we should continue to sacrifice real lives, real men women and children so you can stroke your guns and sneer at "tyranny".

The actual tyranny at work here is the tyranny of the small mind.  The selfishness of the obsessed.  Someone who could hold that a hypothetical war on imagined tyranny is reason enough to put military weapons within reach of civilians and watch them massacre one another.  Shameful and stupid and always a tragic waste.


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## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

Oh brother.


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## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


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## koshergrl (Dec 20, 2012)

I never gave it much thought before, but it becomes obvious that Nosmo is yet another of the evicted state hospital tenants from the 1980s,  doomed to forever roam the face of the earth in "outpatient" status. Living in a small, stinky apartment, dutifully visited weekly by an underpaid and perpetually terrified state worker, hired to conduct welfare checks. 

We have a few...huggy, jake, cowman, shaman, lahkota and a couple others...it's always startling when you've been lulled into thinking someone is sane, then are suddenly hit full force in the face with their obvious inability to function in the real world.

I'm sorry, nosmo. Please don't forget your meds; when you don't take your meds, you have to be lodged. I know they're unpleasant, and that when you're medicated you FEEL normal...but trust me, you lose all normal mien the minute they wear off.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > AmyNation said:
> ...



Yeah and I said that was far less.... i.e. far less than strategic bombers, drones surveilance capabilities and electronic intel, etc.

Stupid ass.



rightwinger said:


> They fire and run away
> 
> Anyone who is ex-military understands what it means to go head to head with US soldiers and Marines. It is not guns but training, tactics, communications and a fully funtioning command and control structure that wins the wars



Michael Collinsbeat the Brits without all of that. He just focused on killing off the Brit CCCI cadre.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> tjvh said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You are a fucking moron, bitch.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > tjvh said:
> ...


Well argued, sir!  Concise, yet throughly logical.  Point well made!


And they put little cuckoo emoticons to bolster their position.  Isn't this grand debate of the issues of the day a stimulating past-time?  One is really are given a grand opportunity to size up the intellects on the other end of the wire!  Far too stimulating for my mind!


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



There is nothing mentally stimulating about debating libtards, but if you really want a discussion, tell me what is wrong with allowing concealed carry license holders among a schools faculty to take some extra training, get covered on liability insurance, be put on a list of guardians at the school and then carry guns concealed?

It works for Isreal and Thailand, so why cant it work here?

Respond to that with rationality and maybe we can have a real discussion. Else you are just another fatheaded libtard neoMarxist who just cannot wait till Obama goes all Chavez on us, or maybe evenStalinesque.


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## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



Israel has some of the strictest gun control regulations in the world. Do you want to go there too?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

One of the reasons that we are in a crisis as a country is that the civic virtue of radical extremist right and the radical extremist left threaten the vision of the Founders.

If the far left and far right and libertarians so corrupt American civic virtue, we will fall into a police state that will come gunning for them and then for the rest of us.

Stand down, fellows, stand down if you love America.



tjvh said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > tjvh said:
> ...


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

rightwinger said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



That has nothing to do with them using armed teachers to guard students, jack ass.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Those who lack American civic virtue like JimBowie are simply wad stains on the ground.

They have litte influence in America and the GOP.

They are worthless.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> One of the reasons that we are in a crisis as a country is that the civic virtue of radical extremist right and the radical extremist left threaten the vision of the Founders.
> 
> If the far left and far right and libertarians so corrupt American civic virtue, we will fall into a police state that will come gunning for them and then for the rest of us.
> 
> Stand down, fellows, stand down if you love America.



Eat shit, Starkey, you godam liar.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Those who lack American civic virtue like JimBowie are simply wad stains on the ground.
> 
> They have litte influence in America and the GOP.
> 
> They are worthless.



Gosh, thanks, Starkey.

If I had the approval of cumstained twinks like you, I would fucking kill myself.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...


Funding.


Liability and funding.


Schools have gone hat in hand for decades.  Money for books, the libraries to house the books, the Librarians to organize the books.  Electricity to illuminate the books.  And the whole time we're told public funding is tight and no extras can we afford.  Our public education system has been demeaned, ridiculed, under funded and under appreciated for so long, perhaps we're believing that, like spending hawks everywhere, education is something we don't care too much for in our budgets.

Well, maybe that's true.  We should not have a Department of Education or teachers making what the deserve.  But suddenly we have the means to arm and train school personnel?  We can't eek out a dime for books, but millions for new guns (who's the big winner there?)

Tell me where the money is suddenly coming from and will that guarantee safety as much as absolutely no assault weapons around anywhere?

If guns make safety, how was it that in 1981 an assailant wounded four with six shots while nearly everyone present was not only armed, but expert marksmen and proficient with guns?   Ronald Reagan was surrounded by an armed cadre.  He was wounded.  James Brady was surrounded by and armed cadre.  He too was wounded.  Thomas Delahanty was wounded.  He was a District of Columbia police officer.  Timothy MCarthy was wounded.  He was a Secret Service agent.

And a teacher's aide, responsible for the lives of children, should have quicker reactions, better discipline, more experience and training than the United States Secret Service and the District of Columbia Police Force?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

You have no influence at all.

You simply are hot air here letting out your rage.

And you have no civic virtue whatsoever.

Nosmo King has rhetorically bent you over backwards and stuck your head up your ass, so you can feel it as she metaphorically kicks your balls into your bowels.

You are simply no match for your betters on this Board.





JimBowie1958 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Those who lack American civic virtue like JimBowie are simply wad stains on the ground.
> ...


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



The volunteer guardians would provid etheir own weap[ons and pay for their own training, most of whom would have aleady had it if they are concealed carry license holders.

Anyway, not too bad for a liberal!

Keep it coming! That was fun!


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> You have no influence at all.
> 
> You simply are hot air here letting out your rage.
> 
> ...




Fuck off Starkey, you ass hole creep.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...


If corporations protect their facilities with professional security forces, if oil refineries and nuclear power plants are guarded by trained, competent security, why would you settle for unvetted volunteers with their own weapons (and what standards do we hold for those weapons?) guarding the most precious assets around, our children?

Does a concealed carry permit assure the mental stability of the bearer?  The competence?  The proficiency needed to carry guns around kids? 

Think about it, and take another swing.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King won't be happy until all the guns are gone and Nosmo's dull wit is the sharpest weapon on Earth.  Prevention is one of the best defenses available.  In some cases the attacker won't choose the school as a target to begin with, knowing there are people defending it.

The argument that everything must be perfect or the risk too great is painfully stupid.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King won't be happy until all the guns are gone and Nosmo's dull wit is the sharpest weapon on Earth.  Prevention is one of the best defenses available.  In some cases the attacker won't choose the school as a target to begin with, knowing there are people defending it.
> 
> The argument that everything must be perfect or the risk too great is painfully stupid.


The guns are the problem.  The massive number of guns awash on our streets are the problem.  Police, public health, social services, educators agree.  The only ones who seek an answer to the blight of shootings is to add more guns are the folks who really have not thought about all the consequences.

And if we're seriously considering putting a gun in every school, shouldn't there be a responsible and through discussion about it first?  No one speaks to the liability schools would face.  No one has spoken to the qualifications needed for school guards, other than volunteers carrying their own guns to school.  I haven't heard a syllable of responsible forethought that would make reasonable people sign on to a plan that throws guns at a gun problem.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

You are what you are, a creep who has no civic virtue, no real sense of the American narrative, a mere wannabee libertarian gangster.

You are what you are: not much.



JimBowie1958 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > You have no influence at all.
> ...


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King won't be happy until all the guns are gone and Nosmo's dull wit is the sharpest weapon on Earth.  Prevention is one of the best defenses available.  In some cases the attacker won't choose the school as a target to begin with, knowing there are people defending it.
> ...


Police agree? Some might most don't


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Most police disagree with your position, bigrebnc, on guns in society.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> You are what you are, a creep who has no civic virtue, no real sense of the American narrative, a mere wannabee libertarian gangster.
> 
> You are what you are: not much.
> 
> ...



It's hard for a person to dictate what someone is and is not when you don't even know what it is you are talking about.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King won't be happy until all the guns are gone and Nosmo's dull wit is the sharpest weapon on Earth.  Prevention is one of the best defenses available.  In some cases the attacker won't choose the school as a target to begin with, knowing there are people defending it.
> ...



That explains all the shootings at gun stores and conventions.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Most police disagree with your position, bigrebnc, on guns in society.



I've told you many many times that you do not know what you are talking about.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> The guns are the problem.  The massive number of guns awash on our streets are the problem.  Police, public health, social services, educators agree.  The only ones who seek an answer to the blight of shootings is to add more guns are the folks who really have not thought about all the consequences.
> 
> And if we're seriously considering putting a gun in every school, shouldn't there be a responsible and through discussion about it first?  No one speaks to the liability schools would face.  No one has spoken to the qualifications needed for school guards, other than volunteers carrying their own guns to school.  I haven't heard a syllable of responsible forethought that would make reasonable people sign on to a plan that throws guns at a gun problem.



Guns do not discharge on their own.  The shooter is always at fault.

Many a police officer has taken comfort in rural areas when the farmer or rancher shows  as back up.  The rest are basically ambassors of liberal thought.

As to liability, schools have liability when they don't adequately protect students too.  Your gun free zones are total failures in protecting students or staff.  Schools should be sued for acting that irresponsibly.  Liberals who deflect form the problem of mental health in our society are the problem.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

A person can be judged by his or her words, and so many of you, bigrebnc, have been weight and found wanting in the balance.



bigrebnc1775 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > You are what you are, a creep who has no civic virtue, no real sense of the American narrative, a mere wannabee libertarian gangster.
> ...


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

The entire board membership knows not to take anything you say as truth in any way, shape, or form.

You are what  you are: an unAmerican individual lacking civic virtue  who wants to do away with electoral and constitutional process.



bigrebnc1775 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Most police disagree with your position, bigrebnc, on guns in society.
> ...


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

The shooter is always at fault, no one has said anything differently.

However, the weapon he uses has far greater potential for mass murder than a shovel, or a knife, or an auto.

I may rethink the latter when you are able to get a vehicle through the front doors and down the halls of a school.



saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The guns are the problem.  The massive number of guns awash on our streets are the problem.  Police, public health, social services, educators agree.  The only ones who seek an answer to the blight of shootings is to add more guns are the folks who really have not thought about all the consequences.
> ...


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> The entire board membership knows not to take anything you say as truth in any way, shape, or form.
> 
> You are what  you are: an unAmerican individual lacking civic virtue  who wants to do away with electoral and constitutional process.
> 
> ...



Thing is when I say it about you. You give supportive evidence that what I say is true. Anyone can read a post can see that.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Anybody can read your post and laugh at you.  But you are a loon, so go for it.  We can all use the grins and chuckles.


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

Frankly, I'd rather have a shooter than arsonist or bomber.  The recent shooter could have bound his mom at home.  Packed the car with diesel fuel and fertilizer killing far more.  If mass murder is the goal, a gun really isn't the best choice.


----------



## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > The guns are the problem.  The massive number of guns awash on our streets are the problem.  Police, public health, social services, educators agree.  The only ones who seek an answer to the blight of shootings is to add more guns are the folks who really have not thought about all the consequences.
> ...


If the gun wasn't there in the first place, there would be no shooter.  Millions of guns available to disturbed shooters is the problem.  And it's not fair to place the blood of shooting victims exclusively on the shoulders of the mentally ill.  There's enough blood wrought by far too many guns to merely blame the mentally ill.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Tell that to Newtown, to Denver, to Norway, to a dozen other places.  The firearms are easily carried and disguised.

You try buying the amount of fertilizer you need for such a bomb, and you will end up in Gitmo before you get the truck out of your driveway.


----------



## rightwinger (Dec 20, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



I see

Only pick that part of Israeli security that supports your agenda


----------



## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> If the gun wasn't there in the first place, there would be no shooter.  Millions of guns available to disturbed shooters is the problem.  And it's not fair to place the blood of shooting victims exclusively on the shoulders of the mentally ill.  There's enough blood wrought by far too many guns to merely blame the mentally ill.



There is far more fertilizer and diesel fuel in the US than guns.  You want to kill people in quantity?  A gun is not a good choice.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Try it, Gitmore (heh heh) for you.  Firearms are great choices for mass murder.


----------



## MisterBeale (Dec 20, 2012)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCegKb55AGI]Suzanna Gratia-Hupp What the Second Amendment is REALLY For - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> The shooter is always at fault, no one has said anything differently.
> 
> However, the weapon he uses has far greater potential for mass murder than a shovel, or a knife, or an auto.
> 
> ...



You have very selective reading skills



Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King won't be happy until all the guns are gone and Nosmo's dull wit is the sharpest weapon on Earth.  Prevention is one of the best defenses available.  In some cases the attacker won't choose the school as a target to begin with, knowing there are people defending it.
> ...


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

I was getting to that Reb.  lol


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

Both of you have fail so far on this point.

Try accumulating the amount of fertilizer and diesel fuel for such an attach, and you won't make it out of the driveway without police assistance.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Both of you have fail so far on this point.
> 
> Try accumulating the amount of fertilizer and diesel fuel for such an attach, and you won't make it out of the driveway without police assistance.



Interesting story Jake.  So please explain how an unlicensed driver made it five miles to a school with three guns and a huge supply of bullets without police discovery.  See, my story actually happened and your just making stuff up.

Have a good night Jake and Reb.  Save some of this for our last day on Earth okay?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > If the gun wasn't there in the first place, there would be no shooter.  Millions of guns available to disturbed shooters is the problem.  And it's not fair to place the blood of shooting victims exclusively on the shoulders of the mentally ill.  There's enough blood wrought by far too many guns to merely blame the mentally ill.
> ...


If fertilizer was processed only to be rendered into explosives, if diesel fuel had only one use; that as a catalyst in a bomb, you may have a point.  What are assault rifles built to do?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 20, 2012)

False derivative analogy and a false comparison in logic by you, saveliberty.

I already stated that it is much easier to disguise firearms than the rolling bomb you want to make.

Your comment does infer a concern about mental illness.  That concern will need to be part of regulations.  A registration and waiting period for every gun show in America will need to be regulated as well.

The legislatures are going to be busy next year.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Scare the crap out of liberals and government officals.  Works like a charm.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> False derivative analogy and a false comparison in logic by you, saveliberty.
> 
> I already stated that it is much easier to disguise firearms than the rolling bomb you want to make.
> 
> ...



Wrong Jake.  Look up the largest mass killing in a school.  What was the weapon?  I'll give you two clues.  It was in Michigan and a longtime ago.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Both of you have fail so far on this point.
> 
> Try accumulating the amount of fertilizer and diesel fuel for such an attach, and you won't make it out of the driveway without police assistance.



You said



> The shooter is always at fault, no one has said anything differently.


In a post that was blaming guns. You have a selective reading skill.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Firearms have a purpose you seem to over look to defend with.


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## saveliberty (Dec 20, 2012)

Can I go to bed NOW???


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Can I go to bed NOW???


I wouldn't if I were you it's almost the end of the world.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


Seriously.  Please explain why it's so important to have millions of assault weapons at the disposal of civilians.  What is the great benefit?  Do you recognize the deadly operation of the assault rifle when in the hands of civilian shooters?  Does their amusement with the firing of an assault rifle make such rifles indispensable items of modern life, or do you recognize the absolute imperative to eliminate the threat altogether?

What is the virtue of an assault weapon?  Is that virtue greater than our safety?  Should we accommodate the assault weapon by arming Kindergartens all because some people feel sexy or powerful or aroused or superior whenever they are armed with ghastly fire power?

If your answer is as esoteric as combatting tyranny, and you rely on the constitution to make your point, how does the phrase "a well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state" not fulfill the means of combating tyranny?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
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I repeat: what are assault rifles built to do?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> > Nosmo King said:
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Not many people have assault rifles.


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Dec 20, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



The AR 15 is not an assault weapon, those sold to civilians are semi-auto only.   

Citizens are not required to justify the exercising of a Constitution right as a condition of indeed exercising that right. There are many things my fellow Americans say and do that I consider completely devoid of virtue and value; I am compelled nonetheless to acknowledge their right to engage in such activities, owing me no justification or explanation. 

As an aside, of the many virtues of the AR 15 is its accuracy, which is relatively rare among semi-auto rifles  as most semi-auto designs are inherently inaccurate. AR 15s are consequently sought-after target rifles. 

But you are correct about the nonsense of combating tyranny, at least in the context of armed civilians rising up against an unjust government. Rather, the Second Amendment does enable a consistent application with regard to limiting the power of government overall, in that the state is compelled to acknowledge due process, and provide evidence in support of its desire to curtail or prohibit the exercising of a given right.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


The military instructs soldiers to engage in semi automatic mode to enhance the accuracy of their fire.  Full automatic weapons have a tendency to 'drift up' when fired, making them less effective as weapons.  Can targets be  accurately hit with bolt action rifles?  

Does the semi automatic firing system enhance the safety of the weapon?  Are there products that pose a significant risk to life and health and are therefore excluded from the public?  

Should the next ghoulish development of the gun-makers craft prove even more devastating in its effect, will your argument still apply?  

Does public safety have to take a back seat while people exalt in greater fire power just for the fun of it?  Is the right to continue to live dispensable and the desire for military weaponry inviolate?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 20, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Again, I  repeat: what are assault rifles built to do?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 21, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Hmmmm....why DO governments shoot unarmed people?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So these are your heroes. A whacky cultist who was impregnating 11 year olds and a Nazi who was teaching his kids to hate?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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> > Nosmo King said:
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Protect and defend lives and again not many citizens have assault weapons.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...



I would almost consider POS reping you but for the last part of your post.
Let me correct you on one thing. The private citizen will not be fighting tyranny alone. Many police and military will join the fight. Those that remain will be out numbered and out gunned. You might also want to rethink your assertion.
14 United States Governors : Prepare State Militia Defenses, To Be Ready Against Obama


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Interesting how America expects every other nation to rise up against tyranny in their state, but in the US its an impossibility.  Since you expect failure, why do you sentence these foreign freedom fighters to death on what you call a fools errand?

The fact you assume the military will simply follow orders and kill Americans points to the tyranny that apparently already exists in your minds.  Also, the feelng I get is that you think there is nothing in your freedom that bears risking anything more than a broken finger nail on a message board.  I am throughly disgusted with your attitude and support of, at least my, Constitution.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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the same thing all guns are. They just look mean.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
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> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



In many foreign countries they are used in celebrations.


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## thanatos144 (Dec 21, 2012)

progressive like to use the deaths of children to push agendas. They are ghouls.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Both of you have fail so far on this point.
> 
> Try accumulating the amount of fertilizer and diesel fuel for such an attach, and you won't make it out of the driveway without police assistance.



Actually, most people who live in a farming area could get all that was needed with no questions asked.........


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Both of you have fail so far on this point.
> ...



This is true.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 21, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...



I know, starting about 1/2 mile from the house I can be in farm country and drive 40 miles or so seeing nothing but farms....


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

Guys, you have to get somewhere.  Since the OKC bombing, look up the number of plots such as that that have been foiled.  Your truck bomb comparison to firearms as the choice for mass weapons has been flimsy since 1996.

The "tool" argument used by extremists is simply not convincing.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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Swing and a miss.  What specifically was the assault rifle designed to do?

Your answer could apply to the Golden Retriever.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


Another swing and miss!  What specifically was the assault rifle designed to do?

You answer could apply to firecrackers or banners.


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## bestlink101 (Dec 21, 2012)

so sad....


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Guys, you have to get somewhere.  Since the OKC bombing, look up the number of plots such as that that have been foiled.  Your truck bomb comparison to firearms as the choice for mass weapons has been flimsy since 1996.
> 
> The "tool" argument used by extremists is simply not convincing.



Take a closer look at those plots some time. Most of them involve the FBI finding somebody, talking them into something, giving them everything they need, and then holding a press conference to announce the arrest.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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It would depend on the specific model we are talking about, but, in general, they are designed to use a portion of the gas from an explosion to propel a projectile down the barrel and use as much as possible of the rest to cycle the arming mechanism to bring another cartridge into position to be fired. This latter function is why semi automatic weapons are considered to be less powerful than older bolt action weapons.

Why do you ask?


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
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I give up, enlighten me and possibly others with your partisan answer.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
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> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...


You described the actions of a semi auitomatic firing system.  You did not answer the question which I now pose for a sixth time (it's getting tedious): What specifically was the assault rifle designed to do?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


Actually, the evasions offered up by you and others is quite telling.  It appears that you are afraid to confront the truth and keep throwing up nonsensical answers in the hope the question will just go away.

What was the assault rifle specifically designed to do?


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Guys, you have to get somewhere.  Since the OKC bombing, look up the number of plots such as that that have been foiled.  Your truck bomb comparison to firearms as the choice for mass weapons has been flimsy since 1996.
> 
> The "tool" argument used by extremists is simply not convincing.



I think you missed my point Jake.  It was that there are viable options to a gun in a mass killing.  If you make guns harder OR equally hard to obtain as say a bomb, it makes the using the more effective weapon more likely.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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...and I am certain you don't know the difference between a design and use.  I have no fear of your answer.  Just puzzled why you can't give an answer to your own question.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Taking a long time to answer your own question smart ass.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Remember the answer should be specific to the weapon you mentioned.  There should be no confusion with another weapon.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


I am trying to understand the virtue of the assault weapon.  Why America should be forced to accommodate such weapons rather than take the sensible step and eliminate them.  Someone, most gun nuts for my money, seems to love these weapons more than freedom and life itself.  I'm wondering if such gun nuts are capable of forming a reasonable answer to my simple question which I now pose for a seventh time:

What was the assault rifle specifically designed to do?


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...


 

Everyone I know has two huge tanks on their properties...

One for regular gasoline

One for diesel fuel.

And there are several huge distribution facilities within just a few miles of everywhere.

All managed and run by conservatives.

Fucking moron city dwelling progressive loons.


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


 
Don't worry about it. You don't have to approve it any more than you need to approve my ownership of horses, fast cars, or a greenhouse.


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## Meister (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



It was designed to do what every other rifle was designed to do.....there is your answer.
Should we get rid of all semi automatic weapons?  If not, why not?

This would be a slippery slope, IMO.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


There's no correlation between your horse, greenhouses or cars.  I'm asking a simple question.  Shall I repeat it?

What was the assault rifle specifically designed to do?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

Meister said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


I'm sorry, but you did not answer the question.  Some rifles are designed to practice target shooting.  Some of those rifles include sophisticated design element such as the rifles used in the Olympic sport of Biathlon.  Other riffs were specifically designed as sniper rifles.  Others were designed to bag a specific variety of game (see an elephant gun or deer rifle).

But assault rifles were designed with specific uses in mind.

What specifically was the assault rifle designed to do?


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> ]I am trying to understand the virtue of the assault weapon.  Why America should be forced to accommodate such weapons rather than take the sensible step and eliminate them.  Someone, most gun nuts for my money, seems to love these weapons more than freedom and life itself.  I'm wondering if such gun nuts are capable of forming a reasonable answer to my simple question which I now pose for a seventh time:
> 
> What was the assault rifle specifically designed to do?



Can't answer your own question huh?  

No one in a position of power in the Democratic Party is suggesting th elimination of assault weapons.  That makes you a leftwing loon by definition.

America is not being forced to accomodate such weapons.  They are currently covered by the Constitution AND federal law.

These people you belittle are true Americans who love freedom and life enough to use their time, talent and money to maintaining a means to keep life and freedom.  You prefer to think your life and freedom come at no cost.  That simply is not true.  You dishonor all service personnel present and past who had to use weapons in defense of your life and freedom.

Now answer your own question, so I can pick your insane answer apart.


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## Meister (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Meister said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



All rifles were *designed* for 1 purpose....get real Nosmo.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > ]I am trying to understand the virtue of the assault weapon.  Why America should be forced to accommodate such weapons rather than take the sensible step and eliminate them.  Someone, most gun nuts for my money, seems to love these weapons more than freedom and life itself.  I'm wondering if such gun nuts are capable of forming a reasonable answer to my simple question which I now pose for a seventh time:
> ...


You are no more adept at sidestepping the question than you are at making cogent point.  If you cannot answer, or if you are afraid of your answer, I can accept that as truth.

I'm asking the unanswerable question:

What specifically was the assault rifle designed to do?


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

I gave you many chances to answer your own question Nosmo.  Now I will answer.  I didn't up til now, because I wanted to just get to your stupid answer.

An assault weapon's PRIMARY purpose is to supress an enemy.  By delivering a large number of rounds down range, the enemy is forced to take defensive positions.  This allows other troops to engage the enemy with sniper fire, grenades and other weapons to wound, kill or force a retreat of the enemy.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

Meister said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Meister said:
> ...


If that were true, all rifles would be designed the same.  

What specifically was the assault rifle designed to do?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Protect and defend did I stutter?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> I gave you many chances to answer your own question Nosmo.  Now I will answer.  I didn't up til now, because I wanted to just get to your stupid answer.
> 
> An assault weapon's PRIMARY purpose is to supress an enemy.  By delivering a large number of rounds down range, the enemy is forced to take defensive positions.  This allows other troops to engage the enemy with sniper fire, grenades and other weapons to wound, kill or force a retreat of the enemy.



Thank you.  Are the virtues you described so important that such weapons should be in the hands of civilians?  Have civilians enemies to suppress?  Do civilians have the need to deliver large numbers of rounds down range?

Should America be forced to accommodate such weapons by arming school personnel, posting armed guards in stadiums and arenas?  Why should America be forced to make room for such weapons if civilians don't require them?  Is the privilege to own such a weapon greater than everyone else's right to live free in a world not threatened by them?


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
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> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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The key word is 'specifically'.  Should I define 'specifically' for you?


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

I view city dwelling progressive nut jobs as enemies, and if they ever come to my house and attempt to take anything from me, I will shoot them.

That's my primary motivation for wanting to keep my right to bear arms.

Well, that and I want to be able to kill the shit out of any criminal who tries to enter my house.

The two groups are pretty much one and the same.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Yep, the answer is to SUPRESS the enemy.

They are a light caliber weapon.  You can't deliver a round that does much through light armor.  That would be the 50 caliber.  You can't selectively hit an enemy at a great distance.  Sniper rifle.

An assault weapon is used by special ops to supress the enemy.  Many members of the group carry other types of weapons.  Ever wonder why?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > I gave you many chances to answer your own question Nosmo.  Now I will answer.  I didn't up til now, because I wanted to just get to your stupid answer.
> ...



The 2010 shooting took place at around 3:15PM MST on February 23, 2010, when 32-year-old Bruco Eastwood entered Deer Creek Middle School. After being stopped by custodian Kyle Sturbaum he checked in at the office asked for a tour, was denied, and then left. After the SRO had left and school had ended for the day, *he took a bolt action high-powered hunting rifle f*rom his car in the school parking lot, and then opened fire, wounding one female eighth grade student and one male eighth grade student. The male was rushed to a hospital and was in critical condition for about four days. The female was released from a hospital later on that night after the shooting occurred. The shooter was taken down by Deer Creek Middle School math teachers David Benke and Norm Hanne and was taken into custody by the police

Deer Creek Middle School - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Yep, the answer is to SUPRESS the enemy.
> 
> They are a light caliber weapon.  You can't deliver a round that does much through light armor.  That would be the 50 caliber.  You can't selectively hit an enemy at a great distance.  Sniper rifle.
> 
> An assault weapon is used by special ops to supress the enemy.  Many members of the group carry other types of weapons.  Ever wonder why?


Have you ever wondered why the tie that binds mass shooters is the assault weapon?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



That is what they are designed to do, even if you want to pretend otherwise.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



You cannot legally buy an assault rifle in the US unless you have a special license issued by the federal government. How, exactly, are we forced to accommodate them?


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > I gave you many chances to answer your own question Nosmo.  Now I will answer.  I didn't up til now, because I wanted to just get to your stupid answer.
> ...



Yes, protection is very important and since criminals and tyrrants rarely care what the law is, a necessary part of some people's right to be protected.  The possibility of your right being lost is not grounds for terminating the  rights of others.  Imposing your will on others is not a right you hold.

Take the bank robbery in LA several years ago as a case study.  The police had to go to a gun store in order to stop them.  Now you want to take those very weapons away from everyone, except the criminals.  This is the real world, not Nosmo fantasyland.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Meister said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



They are all designed the same.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Yep, the answer is to SUPRESS the enemy.
> ...



It doesn't bind them.  You choose to selectively pick cases.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Next time you want to play mind games Nosmo, bring one.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

When it comes to weapons, the enemy is always in pursuit of the best weapon.  That never changes.

What you can change is identifying your enemy and neutralizing them before an attack.  We have mentally ill people who are violent and have access to weapons.  Find them and monitor them.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

By the way idiot, an assault weapon is NOT DESIGNED to kill unarmed citizens, particularly children.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
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You imposed the words "except criminals".  Why do you imagine that?

And protection at any means is not protection but an open invitation to abuse the capabilities of the weapon.  Take them away from everyone.  EVERYONE and the scourge of assault;t weapons evaporates the way logic at an NRA convention evaporates.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
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> > saveliberty said:
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Please cite a mass shooting that did not include an assault weapon.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
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You could define assault weapon. I can assault with many different weapons from a rock to a missile...


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
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> > bigrebnc1775 said:
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You have a reasonable expectation that I'm asking about assault rifles and handguns.  Why not just give an honest answer instead of the ham handed picking fly shit out of ground pepper?  Does the truth about assault rifles and handguns awash on our streets give you pause, or is that a point of pride?  Have the massive numbers of specifically designed assault weapons provided a benefit to society, or has it made our world a more dangerous place.  Is there a legitimate use for civilians armed with assault weapons, or are those weapons best kept safely in the hands of a well regulated militia?  Are the lives of innocents merely to be tallied as the price of freedom, or should we stop killing each other with these weapons and man up and eliminate them from our midst?


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


 
Please cite a mass shooting where the killer continued to shoot after being shot dead by someone with an assault weapon.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 21, 2012)

Damn......let's play stupid for a whole fucking week, shall we?

An assault weapon, for the purpose of this discussion, is a firearm that is too aggressive to be considered a tool for hunting or self defense under normal circumstances. It is designed to fire rapidly and take little time to reload. 

You people all know what we are talking about. You are playing dumb because if you decided to treat the subject intelligently, you'd have to admit that you are wrong.  

Freaks.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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*Columbine 
http://acolumbinesite.com/weapon.html


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
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Do you admire these weapons so much that you're willing to rationalize everything in order to keep them?

Please cite a mass shooting that did not involve an assault weapon.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Damn......let's play stupid for a whole fucking week, shall we?
> 
> An assault weapon, for the purpose of this discussion, is a firearm that is too aggressive to be considered a tool for hunting or self defense under normal circumstances. It is designed to fire rapidly and take little time to reload.
> 
> ...



You are wrong but keep going.
Not too many civilians have a selective fire firearm.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
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I did and no assault weapon has ever been used in in American school mass shooting.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
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How do you sleep?


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

What assault weapon has been used? Which shooting?


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

Oh I see what you're doing. You're redefining assault weapons.

Like you guys redefined babies and marriage. Got it. If you can't make the facts work, you change the definitions. Typical left wing lunacy.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> You imposed the words "except criminals".  Why do you imagine that?
> 
> And protection at any means is not protection but an open invitation to abuse the capabilities of the weapon.  Take them away from everyone.  EVERYONE and the scourge of assault;t weapons evaporates the way logic at an NRA convention evaporates.



It has noting to do with imagining Nosmo.  You attempt to mislead or misrepresent what actually happens in the real world.

There are MANY assault weapons in American society.  Only a handful are used improperly.  You can't take weapons from criminals BEFORE a crime.  You are not applying logic or being rational in the least.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Assault weapons do not exist.

If you want a mass shooting that does not involve a scary looking rifle, most mass shooters use pistols, not long arms. The reason for this is obvious, if you think about it.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Damn......let's play stupid for a whole fucking week, shall we?
> 
> An assault weapon, for the purpose of this discussion, is a firearm that is too aggressive to be considered a tool for hunting or self defense under normal circumstances. It is designed to fire rapidly and take little time to reload.
> 
> ...



A single action revolver meets that definition, which is why I refuse to acknowledge it as a definition.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Oh I see what you're doing. You're redefining assault weapons.
> 
> Like you guys redefined babies and marriage. Got it. If you can't make the facts work, you change the definitions. Typical left wing lunacy.


I'm using saveliberty's very good definition of assault weapons:



> An assault weapon's PRIMARY purpose is to supress an enemy. By delivering a large number of rounds down range, the enemy is forced to take defensive positions. This allows other troops to engage the enemy with sniper fire, grenades and other weapons to wound, kill or force a retreat of the enemy.




Unless saveliberty has suddenly become part of this "left wing lunacy", you are not being honest in what was expected to be an honest debate.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


You are not being honest.


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## Ravi (Dec 21, 2012)

Maybe we should start calling the WMDs (Weapons of Mass Destruction). Maybe the nutters would like that better, because that is exactly what they are.


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

I'm sure you will. That's what propagandists do. Use language to scare people into huddling in a corner while they strip their rights, rape them up the ass, and then gas them.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I'm sure you will. That's what propagandists do. Use language to scare people into huddling in a corner while they strip their rights, rape them up the ass, and then gas them.


And cowards evade and sidestep arguing over minutia rather than accepting the real problem for what it is.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I am not being honest? The fracking law that defined assault weapons defined them as things that sorta look like assault rifles. Assault rifles exist, civilian versions of assault rifles exist, something that sorta looks like an assault rifle is only a valid class if you think looks matter more than function.

For the record, it is actually possible to build a paint gun that would meet the definition of assault weapon under that law.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


When Congress debated the Assault Weapons bill that was sunsetted by the wise and beneficent George W. Bush and his shot gun shooting Vice President Dick "I shot harry!" Cheney, the debate centered around detachable stocks and bayonet mounts and flash suppressors and grips.  Nothing that makes the weapons so deadly, but cosmetics.  And that debate was framed by the NRA.  Of course the legislation was ineffective, it was designed to be ineffective by the gun lobby.

Any new legislation must be comprehensive and inclusive and throughly rid ourselves of weapons more in tune with well regulated militias than civilians.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



How can you sleep?



bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > saveliberty said:
> ...


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


The blood that will be spilt will be on your and others like you hands.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 21, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...


And on who's hands is the blood on today?  I'm saying we need to rid ourselves of these deadly weapons.  You seem to think the answer to the problem posed by these weapons is to add more weapons.  And you say blood will be on my hands.  

either you are incapable of intellectual honesty, you are unfathomably stupid, or you don't have any real solutions to offer.  Pick two.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Since the only answer for you is making semi-automatic guns illegal Nosmo, there can be no compromise.  That move clearly makes everyone less safe.  It also makes it less likely citizens could mount a defense against the government, should that day come.

The problem with scared, ignorant people like you is, they want everything without a cost.  Freedom requires, nay demands strongmen be laid low by a freedom loving population.  That takes weapons.  There are many countries experimenting with a gun free society.  Feel free to live in what you consider freedom there.

Regardless of whether that comes to pass, criminals need to be somewaht afraid of us and our capacity to defend against them.  So far, you have offered nothing of substance for your point of view.  Its all isolated cases of mentally unstable people with violent tendencies and access to weapons.

Again, applying that logic to motor vehicles would ruin this country.  Some play out violent movies in real life.  Should we ban them?  What about ending the use of medicines that helps thousands,but kills a few?  You aren't getting out of this world alive.  Try focusing on real threats.  Your staircase is hundreds of times more likely to kill you than a gun.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

The, "I don't like guns they scare me and kill people" defense should be very entertaining for the Supreme Court.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> And on who's hands is the blood on today?  I'm saying we need to rid ourselves of these deadly weapons.  You seem to think the answer to the problem posed by these weapons is to add more weapons.  And you say blood will be on my hands.
> 
> either you are incapable of intellectual honesty, you are unfathomably stupid, or you don't have any real solutions to offer.  Pick two.



The blood is on your hands for focusing on gun control for decades, instead of violent mental health issues.  I can't believe making a society of sheep is so important to you that you let young people pay the ultimate price for your stupidity.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

I agree with you in some respects.

One, guns need to be for some people harder to get legally.

Two, guns and bombs can be regulated by law.

Three, LEO needs to be more involved.



saveliberty said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Guys, you have to get somewhere.  Since the OKC bombing, look up the number of plots such as that that have been foiled.  Your truck bomb comparison to firearms as the choice for mass weapons has been flimsy since 1996.
> ...


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


 
You go ahead and rid yourself of those nasty weapons.

I will keep mine, thank you. I say that we are a free country because we defend our freedom, and we do that with guns. You can't very well protect people without them. And in this world, today, people need to be protected, and some things are worth fighting for.

You creep back into your sterile little apartment and drink your bottled water...meanwhile my relatives will defend your freedom to live without having to worry that a Mexican war lord might decide to drag your dumb ass to a bridge and hang you off it as a warning to your neighbors.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> I agree with you in some respects.
> 
> One, guns need to be for some people harder to get legally.
> 
> ...



I like your style of finding some common ground, instead of just pounding away at the opposing view Jake.  The reduction in bombings since 1996 has not been the result of more secure bomb making materials though.  I can walk on to 90% of farms in America and walk out with enough for at least a small bomb.

What has changed is law enforcement had paid more attention to those types of thefts, run sting operations to identitfy suspects and the public has been more aware, so they report.

This issue is quite polarizing and I appreciate you reaching across the divide.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


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## koshergrl (Dec 21, 2012)

Jake's just trying to lend credence to the lie that he's a Republican, and representative of the majority of the country.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



Actually I'm serious. I have heard so many definitions about what an assault weapon is these past few days. Do you listen to Ron Verb? His show must have had 15 different definitions in the past 3 days....


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh I see what you're doing. You're redefining assault weapons.
> ...



In that case you are talking a fully automatic squad weapon..... One must have a federal license to purchase one legally....


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

Thank you, saveliberty.  The reasonable individuals are going to be the ones who make the ultimate decisions in legislatures and on courts.

The extremists, right or left, will not be making these choices, except whether to break the law, pay the consequences.



saveliberty said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you in some respects.
> ...


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



We're telling you what an assault weapon is you keep talking about semi automatics.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 21, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...


Those who do the shootings and those who create those gun free zones.


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## Aristotle (Dec 21, 2012)

There is nothing good about arming teachers. I really think recent tragedies have scared people into sensationalizing school shootings. I mean, in the 1990's in southern california gang violence was getting so bad that even kids were bringing guns to school. Today, kids are still bring guns to school and now we are talking about tragedies and second amendment rights, and arming teachers. I think this is a case of "it it don't happen in my backyard it don't matter."


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> There is nothing good about arming teachers.



Except for the simple fact that IT STOPS ASSAULTS ON INNOCENT SCHOOL CHILDREN, genius.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

Teachers should not be armed.  Armed and trained security personnel should be in every district in America, and the financing will come from a federal use tax on firearms, ammunition, and the technology that supports both industries.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Teachers should not be armed.  Armed and trained security personnel should be in every district in America, and the financing will come from a federal use tax on firearms, ammunition, and the technology that supports both industries.



You keep stating stupid bullshit like that, but you never give a WHY to your posts, just these unsuported assertions.

You do realize that your title of 'Oral Oracle of the Shithouse' is just a joke, right?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

JimBowie continues to drizzle down his own leg.

There will be armed security, can't stop it.  It will be paid for.  The correct right of center answer is a use tax on those who use firearms and their supporting companies.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> JimBowie continues to drizzle down his own leg.
> 
> There will be armed security, can't stop it.  It will be paid for.  The correct right of center answer is a use tax on those who use firearms and their supporting companies.



Once again, not one FACT to back up his self-declared statements like he thinks he is doesnt need such to support his decrees.

Starkey, your just a fucking basket case, lol, not a prophet.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 21, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > There is nothing good about arming teachers.
> ...



Except half of all teachers quit their jobs within five years due to stress....

Not seeing how arming them is going to make them less stressful.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

JimBowie is worried about fact he never posts, just like a fascist.  Lot of Big Lie screaming.

JB, you got no game, kid.



JimBowie1958 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie continues to drizzle down his own leg.
> ...


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



Because it is all voluntary, Joe. The ones that cant handle it just stop doing it. 

If the stress came from mere knowlege that someone might be armed among them then they need a new career or something.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> JimBowie is worried about fact he never posts, just like a fascist.  Lot of Big Lie screaming.
> 
> JB, you got no game, kid.



This isnt a game schmuck.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 21, 2012)

You are right, you got no game.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 21, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Because it is all voluntary, Joe. The ones that cant handle it just stop doing it.
> 
> If the stress came from mere knowlege that someone might be armed among them then they need a new career or something.



As someone whose mother was a teacher and realizes what a stressful environment that is under IDEAL circumstances, we don't need to be making it worse by having them have to be mindful of a firearm all day.  

A firearm is not a light responsibility. Especially if you are in a room full of pre-adolescents and have to be mindful of them and your gun on top of that?


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> You are right, you got no game.



Says the Oral Oracle of Bullshit.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 21, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Because it is all voluntary, Joe. The ones that cant handle it just stop doing it.
> ...



Dude people are ALREADY doing it. Teachers inthe USa are nto the frail little pussies you seem to think they are.

Of course we both no you are just throwing up rhetorical smoke and we both know that they can handle it easy peasy just like teachers do in Thailand and Isreal.



JoeB131 said:


> A firearm is not a light responsibility. Especially if you are in a room full of pre-adolescents and have to be mindful of them and your gun on top of that?



There are guns all around them already anyway. Kids sneak them into school, armed parents are outside in the pick up lanes, and on the way to and from school they are surrounded by armed concealed carry people; oh, my!  /sarc


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> There is nothing good about arming teachers. I really think recent tragedies have scared people into sensationalizing school shootings. I mean, in the 1990's in southern california gang violence was getting so bad that even kids were bringing guns to school. Today, kids are still bring guns to school and now we are talking about tragedies and second amendment rights, and arming teachers. I think this is a case of "it it don't happen in my backyard it don't matter."



Strange, teachers have carried guns in classrooms in scattered school districts across the country for years. Not one of those schools has ever been attacked by a crazy guy with a gun.

The people sensationalizing this are the idiots that think guns are the problem.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 21, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



Not seeing how that makes a any type of pertinent point.


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## saveliberty (Dec 21, 2012)

The liberal logic flaw, is they assume everyone fears the gun and not the gunman.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 22, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Since the only answer for you is making semi-automatic guns illegal Nosmo, there can be no compromise.  That move clearly makes everyone less safe.  It also makes it less likely citizens could mount a defense against the government, should that day come.
> 
> The problem with scared, ignorant people like you is, they want everything without a cost.  Freedom requires, nay demands strongmen be laid low by a freedom loving population.  That takes weapons.  There are many countries experimenting with a gun free society.  Feel free to live in what you consider freedom there.
> 
> ...


Let's talk about lessons in tyranny and how it was suppressed in at least my lifetime.  

If there was every tyranny in this country, it has happened over and over.  The tyranny shown to the Cherokee living in the American southeast.  Driving them westward on the Trail of Tears.  The tyranny shown by southern slave-holders who bartered human lives like any other commodity.  In both cases the issue was settled by guns.  

I want to talk about the Civil Rights movement.

The Civil Rights movement was by-in-large violent even though the source of the violence was largely the authorities or armed private citizens.  The Civil Rights marchers themselves were largely non-violent, preferring tactics like sit ins and boycotts.  In response, the authorities turned fire hoses and tear gas on them.  The Klan wasn't as benign.  Eventually, and after much torment, the Civil Rights marchers won.  They combatted tyranny and didn't fire a shot.

And that in my life time.  Actual tyranny faced down by something other than the flash of a muzzle or the concussion of an IED.  

You take a noble road combatting tyranny.  But the gun isn't as indispensable as it's characterized.  Not military weapons anyway.  

Gun rights will be preserved as bolt action rifles, shot guns and revolvers are not on the table.  High capacity magazines and semi automatic firing systems must be placed under the authority of well regulated militias, not the street.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 22, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



Exactly the point. We have too many guns in this society, and your solution is to put in more guns.   This is like, batshit crazy.  And you talk like it's a good idea.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 22, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> The liberal logic flaw, is they assume everyone fears the gun and not the gunman.



The Gunman is harmless without the gun.  

Then he is merely a man.... with a tiny penis.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 22, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



I'm sure you don't... and if I explain it to you you still wouldn't understand it.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 22, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Exactly the point. We have too many guns in this society, and your solution is to put in more guns.   This is like, batshit crazy.  And you talk like it's a good idea.



No, Joe, the problem is not too many guns as those areas with the most guns per capita (rural USA) are the most safe, and the least safe places are where guns are banned or highly restricted (Chicago, gun free school zones, Washington DC, malls and other public places that post gun keep out signs, etc).

If you could ever grasp that fact and stop looking at this problem through your emotional guns = 'evil thing' filter, maybe you would realize what the most effective step would be; allow those teachers so inclined to do concealed carry at school, AFTER being vetted, screened and validating their gun training record.

You libs can contineu to make our kids LESS SAFE if you want while patting yourself on the back for 'doin sumpin', but the things that are being recommended by the administration today (more laws pioled up on more laws that are already ignored and broken by perps) will ACCOMPLISH NOTHING AT ALL. Meanwhile more and mmore of our children will die so you liberal can have your feel good moments.

It is pathehtic when a grown adult substitutes fantasy divorced from any link to reall affect and impact to then form poilicies that have the EXACT OPPOSITE FROM INTENDED EFFECT.

That in short is the problem with post 1968 liberalism.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 22, 2012)

You are the guy who has feeding instructions for the nursing staff stamped on his forehead.



JimBowie1958 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > You are right, you got no game.
> ...


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## saveliberty (Dec 22, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> Let's talk about lessons in tyranny and how it was suppressed in at least my lifetime.
> 
> If there was every tyranny in this country, it has happened over and over.  The tyranny shown to the Cherokee living in the American southeast.  Driving them westward on the Trail of Tears.  The tyranny shown by southern slave-holders who bartered human lives like any other commodity.  In both cases the issue was settled by guns.
> 
> ...



Don't kid yourself, it was the point of a gun from the National Guard and law enforcement that allowed the protestors to protest and laws to be enforced.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 22, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Since the only answer for you is making semi-automatic guns illegal Nosmo, there can be no compromise.  That move clearly makes everyone less safe.  It also makes it less likely citizens could mount a defense against the government, should that day come.
> ...



Not about to give up my weapons that are semi-automatic. Not about to give up any weapons in fact. Not even my crossbow......


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 22, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Nope, not more guns.....For once JoeB is right. But we allow the teachers who do have a Concealed Carry License to go ahead and carry in the school. No one will know who has a gun or even if anyone in the building has one. But at least some asshole who wants a soft target will have to think about it first.....And probably get stopped cold...


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 22, 2012)

When it all boils down, armed security will be in our schools and very few of those will be CCW teachers.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 22, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Exactly the point. We have too many guns in this society, and your solution is to put in more guns.   This is like, batshit crazy.  And you talk like it's a good idea.
> ...



Rural USA is safer because less people live there.  So that statistic is a fraud.  

Here's the thing.  Japan has almost no private gun ownership.  In 2008, they had all of 11 gun murders.  And I think that was the last year they bothered to count.  

Australia cracked down on gun ownership after a particularly nasty mass shooting in 1996.  They haven't had a mass shooting incident since.  

The idea that arming teachers, who are pretty much the most stressed out profession in our society, is a sane and rational idea is laughable.


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## Nosmo King (Dec 22, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Let's talk about lessons in tyranny and how it was suppressed in at least my lifetime.
> ...


  You mean well regulated militias?


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## saveliberty (Dec 22, 2012)

Nosmo King said:


> You mean well regulated militias?



I didn't use that term.  Why don't you show us you know the difference?
Define militia, law enforcement and national guard.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 22, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



The stat is PER CAPITA, dumbfuck.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 22, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> When it all boils down, armed security will be in our schools and very few of those will be CCW teachers.



You do not know that as fact, unless you've taken up crystal ball reading...........


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 22, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



I would assume that the same statistic applies in Utah, they have allowed teachers to carry guns in school for years. If your point was something about teachers going crazy and shooting the kids, or letting the kids get the gun, or any other really bad thing that might happen, I am sure you can find plenty of examples to make your point for you.

Unless, of course, you didn't know that about Utah and just assumed that it is currently illegal everywhere.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 22, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> When it all boils down, armed security will be in our schools and very few of those will be CCW teachers.



I love it when FakeyJake pontificates like this.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 22, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Didn't you already try that argument, and get slapped down by reality? 

Monash University shooting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Jimmy_Jam (Dec 22, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > When it all boils down, armed security will be in our schools and very few of those will be CCW teachers.
> ...



How could it be a fact if it hasn't happened yet? Since when does making a prediction require the possession of a crystal ball? Economists and successful business people do it all the time.

I have worked with teachers and prospective teachers for years. In my experience, most would be unwilling to take on that responsibility, and I don't know how much I trust the judgment or capabilities of those that remain. They are teachers of children. Most of them have the accompanying temperament, meaning that the likelihood of any of them doing what is required at the moment of truth is remote. That is not a praise, nor a condemnation, nor a statement of fact. What it is is a pretty realistic observation.

Given that, and the weight that the shooting in Connecticut carries in the general American psyche, it doesn't take a crystal ball to make such a prediction. I also am compelled to agree with it. Time will tell, but I find it a little ridiculous to expect guns to be in the hands of very many (if any) teachers in the classroom any time soon.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 22, 2012)

I have been on two different school boards, private and public, superintendent for some years of the latter.

Jimmy Jam is accurate in explanation of the likely situation in the future.


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > There is nothing good about arming teachers.
> ...




No actually smart aleck it doest. 

For one, schools must have available funding, time and training.

If they arm teachers the city and school districts must have expendable funds to secure not only gun training, but proper permits such as concealed carry permits.

Not to mention testing teacher for psychological issues such as the process police cadets go through. Not to mention equipping teachers with bullet proof vest. The cheapest bulletproof vest runs you about $350 plus tax easy, I assume the fiscal idea of shelling out money to equip teachers with such especially to school districts hurting for money as is, will not be accepted.

Finally, even if we arm teachers this still doesn't prevent school shootings, and even if we assume that it does, what about the mental health of the teacher who had to take life? Most peace officers who kill suspects go on leave and receive a psych evaluation. 

This doesn't account for the teacher who is disgruntled because of personal issues, nor does your foolish opinion take into account for teachers who are about to get fired and are among those with nothing to lose and who may snap.....

Yes that is a genius idea


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 22, 2012)

Such argumentation by the JimBowies simply drive people toward the center and far far away from his position.  Americans believe that something must be done about semi-automatic and automatic weapons.


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## Jimmy_Jam (Dec 22, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



Your point is valid. However, you can be pretty confident that increased security measures _of some kind_ is more than likely, which will cost money one way or another. Schools in Michigan closed for their holiday break two days early yesterday because they were concerned after the Connecticut shooting that some wacko might try something crazy because of the widespread doomsday predictions accompanying 12/21. Nerves are hair-triggered (excuse the pun) and will be for some time, so I think heightened security, and the accompanying costs, are inevitable. 

Will that be charged to school budgets? Will a federal decision be made that funds it separately? I do not know.


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

In California, for many of our public schools police presence before and after schools have worked fine. Most kindergarten schools have unarmed security. I would assume for the simple fact that the presence of police is overkill (no pun intended) but also, a lot of school districts cannot afford it. Los Angeles Unified School District has been laying off teachers due to the budget. Hell, even UC and Cal State school teachers still have forloughs to accomodate the budget. The arming of teachers is at least, fiscally irresponsible.

Someone here also mention Utah teachers were allowed to carry guns. Well in financially stable school districts thats ok I guess. But whats interesting is suburban white upper middle class areas have the need to arm themselves


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

Jimmy_Jam said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



Good question. I don't know but I think our fear may be sensationalized which may lead all of our governmental leaders to make irrational decisions


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## Jimmy_Jam (Dec 22, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> In California, for many of our public schools police presence before and after schools have worked fine. Most kindergarten schools have unarmed security. I would assume for the simple fact that the presence of police is overkill (no pun intended) but also, a lot of school districts cannot afford it. Los Angeles Unified School District has been laying off teachers due to the budget. Hell, even UC and Cal State school teachers still have forloughs to accomodate the budget. The arming of teachers is at least, fiscally irresponsible.
> 
> Someone here also mention Utah teachers were allowed to carry guns. Well in financially stable school districts thats ok I guess. But whats interesting is suburban white upper middle class areas have the need to arm themselves



Maybe, but the CT shooting changes everything. 

You know, there is an element of this that reminds me of when I played little league baseball as a kid. While the kids were there to play a game and have fun, the adults were the ones fighting each other. But that was little league. Here we have kids who would like to go to school safely while the adults in government, AND in places like USMB, fight and bicker across party lines like a bunch of assholes.


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

Jimmy_Jam said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > In California, for many of our public schools police presence before and after schools have worked fine. Most kindergarten schools have unarmed security. I would assume for the simple fact that the presence of police is overkill (no pun intended) but also, a lot of school districts cannot afford it. Los Angeles Unified School District has been laying off teachers due to the budget. Hell, even UC and Cal State school teachers still have forloughs to accomodate the budget. The arming of teachers is at least, fiscally irresponsible.
> ...



You made a profound statement:

"The CT shootings everything."

Its like what I  have said in another thread, the CT shootings is a classic example of " I only pay attention only if its in my backyard."

Unfortunately we in America haven't addressed the is local to us like gang violence, human mental health, along with a host of other issues. Yet with incidents like Columbine, and the (insert school name here) CT shooting, only then we are now addressing adolescent mental health and revising gun laws. I think as a whole, comparable to your example of parents fighting at ball games we focus on trivial issues instead of the ones ahead of us.


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## 9thIDdoc (Dec 22, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



Actually I'd have to say your excuses are flimsey and your priorites suck.Is there *any* higher priority than protecting the lives entrusted to their care? If so my children would be elsewhere and I suspect a school without students would have budget issues. Teaching accomplishes nothing if the student are too dead to graduate.  
And there isn't a lot of demand for well educated corpses.
The budget for security should come before any thing else. Why not a qualified instructor who could train willing staff members and willing PTA vols. the needed instruction for carry licenses. He could also teach basic firarms safety classes to students.


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

9thIDdoc said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



This is a basic argument of sensationalizing something based on some sporadic events.

Ok, let me ask you something.

How often do school shootings happen in your area? What is the ratio of shootings per school, annually?

What is the fiscal budget of schools near where you live?

You say the protection of our children are important then ok, then how would you suggest balancing the budget of equipping every single teacher with bulletproof vest along with standard issued sidearm? Along with teacher cutbacks? Or what about school books, and after school programs? What about extracirricular activities such as competitive sports? Who pays for all of this if cities are struggling to get out of debt yet, makes funding personalized security via armed teachers a priority?


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 22, 2012)

I simply hope that we don't fall into the terrorism scare......This knee jerk reaction is nothing more than that....

Stop, slow down, think..........

The armed Americans make up the largest army in the history of the world, they will not give up their weapons.


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## LoneLaugher (Dec 22, 2012)

Oh! Now you are part of an army? A militia, perhaps.

Interesting. Absolutely insane........but interesting.


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## Jimmy_Jam (Dec 22, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> I simply hope that we don't fall into the terrorism scare......This knee jerk reaction is nothing more than that....
> 
> Stop, slow down, think..........
> 
> The armed Americans make up the largest army in the history of the world, they will not give up their weapons.



Maybe you won't. Maybe most of the people you know won't. However, many armed Americans will do just that, and with their tail between their legs.

Let's hope it doesn't come to that.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 22, 2012)

Armed Americans carry their weapons with the Constitution's blessing, which also permits the right to be regulated and managed.

Armed citizens do not guarantee our freedoms, our civic virtue as expressed in the 1st Amendment do.


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## 9thIDdoc (Dec 22, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> 9thIDdoc said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



More flimsey excuses, your priorities coninue to suck, and you've just added irrelevent bullshit.
My local school has an armed and uniformed LOE present although there has never been a shooting incident. Does your city or country not have any police officiers that could be assigned? I did not suggest or mention issued weapons vests or psychiatric care but since you mentioned it don't you think that the surviving teachers (if any) and students might need some psychiatic followup even though no friendly fire was involved? And don't you think a teacher deal with psycidtric trama better than being dead?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 22, 2012)

Edited.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 22, 2012)

LoneLaugher said:


> Oh! Now you are part of an army? A militia, perhaps.
> 
> Interesting. Absolutely insane........but interesting.



Never said that, but it's always possible........I am retired Army I can still kick it up if needed to....


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

9thIDdoc said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > 9thIDdoc said:
> ...




You keep stating that my argument is irrelevant but it is quite relevant! In any decision regarding whether to arm teachers or any armed security personnel requires the discussion of budgeting! You cannot supply equipment if your budget cannot support it that is my point. Alas your argument reeks of sensationalizing the issue.

Yes arm the teachers!

Our children are in danger!

But none of you school shooting freaks cannot come up with a solution as to how you can incorporate what I've mentioned. Teachers do not go to school in college to prepare to put on bulletproof vests and sidearms. Teachers don't look over their shoulders like that nor should they have to, that is what the police are for! Come up with a better argument!


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 22, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> 9thIDdoc said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



Guess how much it costs in Utah.


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## 9thIDdoc (Dec 22, 2012)

_You keep stating that my argument is irrelevant but it is quite relevant! In any decision regarding whether to arm teachers or any armed security personnel requires the discussion of budgeting!_

Bullshit. You simply budget whatever is needed for security *first*. Keeping the children a school has been entrusted with alive should be a school's first priority. If it isn't it doesn't deserve to exist.
I have suggested ways to help protect at little or no cost to the schools and you have ignored them. You have also ignored the fact that the school at Sandy Hook failed in it's responibily to it's staff, students, and their relatives and you have yet to consider any viable plan except to leave them vulnerable to whatever nutcase comes along next. "It costs too much!" is *not* an acceptable answer and your attitude is pathetic.


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## Aristotle (Dec 22, 2012)

9thIDdoc said:


> _You keep stating that my argument is irrelevant but it is quite relevant! In any decision regarding whether to arm teachers or any armed security personnel requires the discussion of budgeting!_
> 
> Bullshit. You simply budget whatever is needed for security *first*. Keeping the children a school has been entrusted with alive should be a school's first priority. If it isn't it doesn't deserve to exist.
> I have suggested ways to help protect at little or no cost to the schools and you have ignored them. You have also ignored the fact that the school at Sandy Hook failed in it's responibily to it's staff, students, and their relatives and you have yet to consider any viable plan except to leave them vulnerable to whatever nutcase comes along next. "It costs too much!" is *not* an acceptable answer and your attitude is pathetic.



What have you suggested? I forgot the memo.....I specifically stated that in school districts that have budget issues with little to no funding, it is nearly impossible to arm teachers especially with the appropriate credentials to lawfully and successfully arm them. I am not saying to not protect children, I am saying in order to protect our kids the type of security needs to be within the means of the school districts budget. Teachers shouldn't be armed, that is the job of police or armed security. Teachers primary duty is to teach kids.


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## PaulS1950 (Dec 23, 2012)

The NRA, leading trainer of military and security forces in the USA, has volunteered to fund the training for security at schools. There are a number of people already qualified to serve as volunteers and others that would gladly stand between the kids and an armed intruder. The cost is only the time it takes to convince the school districts to do it. If it isn't in place when the kids get back to school in January then it may be too late for some kids.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 23, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> 9thIDdoc said:
> 
> 
> > _You keep stating that my argument is irrelevant but it is quite relevant! In any decision regarding whether to arm teachers or any armed security personnel requires the discussion of budgeting!_
> ...



You seem to think the school districts will be buying the guns and issuing them to the teachers, is there a reason you think this will be the way it works, or is this simply another example of your total inability to actually think before you post?


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 23, 2012)

PaulS1950 said:


> The NRA, leading trainer of military and security forces in the USA, has volunteered to fund the training for security at schools. There are a number of people already qualified to serve as volunteers and others that would gladly stand between the kids and an armed intruder. The cost is only the time it takes to convince the school districts to do it. If it isn't in place when the kids get back to school in January then it may be too late for some kids.



You say that as if facts actually matter to the gun grabbing whores.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 23, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > 9thIDdoc said:
> ...



Well, just like concealed carry, the states buy the CCL holders their guns dont they?  NOT.

lol, gun grabbers are such fucking stupid little bitches.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 23, 2012)

9thIDdoc said:


> [
> 
> Actually I'd have to say your excuses are flimsey and your priorites suck.Is there *any* higher priority than protecting the lives entrusted to their care? If so my children would be elsewhere and I suspect a school without students would have budget issues. Teaching accomplishes nothing if the student are too dead to graduate.
> And there isn't a lot of demand for well educated corpses.
> The budget for security should come before any thing else. Why not a qualified instructor who could train willing staff members and willing PTA vols. the needed instruction for carry licenses. He could also teach basic firarms safety classes to students.



So what you are saying is, you just want to give up on getting guns out of the hands of people who shouldn't have them, instead, you want to just blow all the schools money on metal detectors, bullet proof vests, and armed security guards because, hey, that's more important. 

How about just getting rid of the guns?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 23, 2012)

"Listen to experts before arming teachers" 

Listen to experts before arming teachers | The Salt Lake Tribune


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 23, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> "Listen to experts before arming teachers"
> 
> Listen to experts before arming teachers | The Salt Lake Tribune



Experts? Such as New York City police department when they went on a shooting rampage?


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 23, 2012)

Your comment means nothing as you well know.


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## saveliberty (Dec 23, 2012)

Good guys with guns on scene is far preferable to good guys showing up to just place numbers by evidence.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 23, 2012)

I agree, and trained armed security personnel, preferably with recent military experience, would by the right guys and gals.


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## saveliberty (Dec 23, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> I agree, and trained armed security personnel, preferably with recent military experience, would by the right guys and gals.



Are you sure about the military experience?  Many of these folks have PTSD.  Last thing I want is a flashback from an ex military.


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## Aristotle (Dec 23, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > 9thIDdoc said:
> ...



This should be good...Tell me how does budgeting work, when school districts vote on a project that has passed?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 23, 2012)

saveliberty said:


> good guys with guns on scene is far preferable to good guys showing up to just place numbers by evidence.



like the mass shooting at the empire state building?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 23, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> 9thIDdoc said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



How about getting rid of the drugs?


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## Aristotle (Dec 23, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > 9thIDdoc said:
> ...



That is counter-productive and quite a foolish suggestion


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 23, 2012)

Properly screened applicants will certainly qualify for consideration of being hired.

With that concern for any applicant mediated, yes, the former military person is the right person for the job, much more preferable to citizens without experience.



saveliberty said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > I agree, and trained armed security personnel, preferably with recent military experience, would by the right guys and gals.
> ...


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 23, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Properly screened applicants will certainly qualify for consideration of being hired.
> 
> With that concern for any applicant mediated, yes, the former military person is the right person for the job, much more preferable to citizens without experience.
> 
> ...



Godamit, Starkey, you went all reasonable again and shit.

STOP IT, bitch!


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 23, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



How is pointing out the absurdity of prohibition as a policy counter productive and foolish?


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## Aristotle (Dec 23, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Because the war on drugs is a foolish endeavor and its counter-productive. More people who commit non-violent crimes are being placed in prison at a faster rate than those who commit violent ones. The point is doing away with drugs is not an answer, therefore its a foolish suggestion. As you can see, people are still doing drugs despite it being a punishable offense.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 23, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



You really are incredibly stupid, aren't you? Tell you what, why don't you go back and read my post, realize that you actually agree with me, and then shut the fuck up.


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## 9thIDdoc (Dec 23, 2012)




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## Aristotle (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...




Douchebag wait so you're saying that your statement in the form of a question was in essence was in agreement with me? Wow who would've known how such coded words would in effect, be something saying exactly the same thing I'm saying.....Dude get a fucking clue you idiot...

BTW you still haven't answered my question

Tell me how budgeting works since you tried to say I don't know shit about school financing.


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## Aristotle (Dec 24, 2012)

9thIDdoc said:


>



This says nothing in defense of your argument to arm teachers.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



I see English is not your first, or even your fifth, language. Let me spell it out for you.

I responded to this asinine post with a rhetorical question designed to indicate how idiotic the poster was for suggesting an outright ban on guns.



JoeB131 said:


> So what you are saying is, you just want to give up on getting guns out  of the hands of people who shouldn't have them, instead, you want to  just blow all the schools money on metal detectors, bullet proof vests,  and armed security guards because, hey, that's more important.
> 
> How about just getting rid of the guns?



For some obscure reason that probably escapes me because I cannot wrap my head around utter stupidity, you took offense off a comment that was not even directed at you.

Let me repeat that, I wasn't talking to your dumb ass.

You responded with this.



Aristotle said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > How about getting rid of the drugs?
> ...



I asked for clarification, and you pointed out the utter failure of the war on drugs. One would think that anyone with an IQ above room temperature would recall that I have often advocated for legalizing all drugs. Then again, people with IQs that high usually are smart enough not to be racist dickwads, so I should have known better.

I pointed out that we agree about the war on drugs, and now you want me to tell you about budgeting since I said you don't know anything about it. Care to point out where that happened? My guess is you can't, because I never said it. 

Want to explain again how you are the smart one here?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > 9thIDdoc said:
> ...



Kind of hard to get rid of things that grow naturally in the ground, guy.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Yes, he is another of these overly educated fools who cant use common sense and so they deny there is such a thing and go on stumbling their way through life fucking everything up for the rest of us.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Do you ever compare the process of making cocaine (and smuggling it into the US) in contrast to the difficulties of the manufacturing process behind a zip gun?

You libtards seem to  think that merely passing alaw fixes things, despite the fact that every one of these massacres already violates the laws in dozens of ways, not even including consideration of the laws against MURDER, you stupid fucktard.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



QW, this libtards goal was not to use reason to counter your argument or to make a point of order.

He is simply trying to get you to waste your time responding to his idiot bullshit instead of making more arguments that are effective with people who havent had their brains replaced with ideology like the libtards have.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> 9thIDdoc said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



Lol, you are such a fool, of course it defends his assertion since it counters the libtard rebutal that it would be too expensive to put armed guards in schools, an argument many libtards have made on this thread.

I cant believe you are that fucking stupid. You are just trolling now, which means you have nothing left to respond with.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



But if they couldn't GET the gun to start with, they'd never have been able to pull these crimes off. 

Yeah, you can get some ahole who can make "zip guns" in his garage, but they'd never have the capabilities of a mass-produced Bushmaster that is advertised like this..


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## Skull Pilot (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



One can deal the same damage with any semi auto rifle.

So why don't you be honest for once and just say that you want to ban all semiautomatic rifles and not just the scary looking ones.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Skull Pilot said:


> One can deal the same damage with any semi auto rifle.
> 
> So why don't you be honest for once and just say that you want to ban all semiautomatic rifles and not just the scary looking ones.



I think it would depend on the rifle and it's capabilities.  

In the case of an Bushmaster or AR-15, it has all the capabilities of an M-16. A max-effective range of 400 Meters, a 5.56 mm round that "tumbles", doing maximum damage when hitting a pre-schooler,  and a fire rate of 40 RPM in semi-automatic mode. 

This is a weapon for a soldier, not a Hockey Mom.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 24, 2012)

I see you are taking your meds again, and as foolish in temper as always.



JimBowie1958 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Properly screened applicants will certainly qualify for consideration of being hired.
> ...


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## Skull Pilot (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Skull Pilot said:
> 
> 
> > One can deal the same damage with any semi auto rifle.
> ...



A semi auto that shoots a .223 is a semi auto that shoots a .223.  It does not matter if the gun looks like a traditional style rifle or a military weapon.

It does not matter if it holds a 5, 10, 20 or 100 round magazine.  All semi auto .223 rifles can deal out the same damage in about the same time even with multiple magazine change outs.

Rounds per minute fired in a semi auto depends solely on how fast one can pull the trigger and is not dependent on any "mode".

SO maybe just maybe you should learn a little bit about the weapons you want to ban.

And then you would realize that you are indeed calling for the ban of all semiauto rifles and then you can start being honest about it.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Skull Pilot said:


> A semi auto that shoots a .223 is a semi auto that shoots a .223.  It does not matter if the gun looks like a traditional style rifle or a military weapon.
> 
> It does not matter if it holds a 5, 10, 20 or 100 round magazine.  All semi auto .223 rifles can deal out the same damage in about the same time even with multiple magazine change outs.
> 
> ...



Guy, I worked with M16's for 11 years in the US Army.  It's not a weapons civilians should have. 

The M-16 was specifically designed to make that .223 round a lot more deadly by increasing the tumble rate and the amount of propellent behind it.  It was made to require low maintenance, and a high rate of fire comparable to the damage meeted out by its contemporary, the AK-47.  

And it just plain shouldn't be in the hands of civilians.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Skull Pilot said:
> 
> 
> > A semi auto that shoots a .223 is a semi auto that shoots a .223.  It does not matter if the gun looks like a traditional style rifle or a military weapon.
> ...



Can't Understand Normal Thinking
And change your damn signature while you're at it.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Skull Pilot said:
> 
> 
> > A semi auto that shoots a .223 is a semi auto that shoots a .223.  It does not matter if the gun looks like a traditional style rifle or a military weapon.
> ...



So were you sleeping through the classes that taught facts about guns or what?

You plainly dont know what makes an M16 round tumble, what constitutes an aussalt weapon, and why a single shot auto-loader is not a military grade weapon.

You are an 11 year veteran? hah, I see no evidence of that claim.



JoeB131 said:


> It's not a weapons civilians should have.



In your fascist opinon. And besides, you arent talking about taking away M16,s you are talking about banning all guns that auto-load, an entirely unnecesary thing.



JoeB131 said:


> The M-16 was specifically designed to make that .223 round a lot more deadly by increasing the tumble rate and the amount of propellent behind it.  It was made to require low maintenance, and a high rate of fire comparable to the damage meeted out by its contemporary, the AK-47.



Again, the M16 is not what you are trying to ban. The M16 is alrady a restricted gun that requires a special icense from the ATF to buy.



JoeB131 said:


> And it just plain shouldn't be in the hands of civilians.



You really cant tell the difference between facts and your assinine opinion, can you?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> [....?



Sorry, guy, can't hear your squealing over the sound of dying preschoolers. 

Just shut the fuck up.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > [....?
> ...



Joeblowme, those arent squealing kids you are hearing, it is the sound of the wind blowing from one of your ears over to the next one.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



No, I'm really sure that it's those 20 dead kids that makes anything you say sound like it's full of shit to most sane people.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You are still hearing those kids? Bullshit, then why dont you support doing something that is PRVEN to STOP those types of killings?

Because you DONT WANT THEM TO STOP. You cry big crocodile tears and I wouldnt be surprised if most libtards are eagerly looking forward to the next massacre so they can push their gun grabgbing campaign yet more.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > [....?
> ...


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## saveliberty (Dec 24, 2012)

The Gregory children go to school with the children of President Barack Obama, according to the Washington Post. That school is the co-ed Quaker school Sidwell Friends.

According to a scan of the school&#8217;s online faculty-staff directory, Sidwell has a security department made up of at least 11 people. Many of those are police officers, who are presumably armed.

Michelle Malkin » Did NBC&#8217;s David Gregory violate DC gun law on Meet the Press?

Not to mention the Secret Service that visits on a regular basis.

For liberals, its do as I say, not as I do.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 24, 2012)

You, little fascist, continue to talk stupidly.  JoeB, while wrong about gun bans, is correct about the M16.  Those of us who carried it for a living (12 years in my case) agree with him.  You did not serve, you have no say in the matter.



JimBowie1958 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Skull Pilot said:
> ...


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> You are still hearing those kids? Bullshit, then why dont you support doing something that is PRVEN to STOP those types of killings?
> 
> Because you DONT WANT THEM TO STOP. You cry big crocodile tears and I wouldnt be surprised if most libtards are eagerly looking forward to the next massacre so they can push their gun grabgbing campaign yet more.



I do. 

I completely support removing guns from people who are mentally unstable or unqualified to have them.  

Everything else is bullshit.


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## JakeStarkey (Dec 24, 2012)

Merry Christmas to all.

Unsubscribe.


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## saveliberty (Dec 24, 2012)

JakeStarkey said:


> Merry Christmas to all.
> 
> Unsubscribe.





I hear you Jake, me too.

Unsubscribe.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > You are still hearing those kids? Bullshit, then why dont you support doing something that is PRVEN to STOP those types of killings?
> ...



I think most people agree with that, Joeblowme.

The trick, as you well know, is in what constitutes 'qualified to have them'. You want to leave guns only in the hands of the jack boots, while most of us want to keep them out of the hands of the criminals and mentally unstable.

So, once again, you FAIL.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Meth has to be mixed in a lab using hazardous chemicals. 

I suggest you go find another high school dropout to argue with.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



I actually enjoy putting pretentious jerks in their place.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Not me; it makes me feel like I need a shower after posting in response to Starkey and Joeblowme.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Skull Pilot said:
> 
> 
> > One can deal the same damage with any semi auto rifle.
> ...



I am confused. What, exactly, is it you do not like about that gun? A Winchester 750 does everything an AR-15 does, including take a removable magazine. The only real difference is that a 750 takes a high powered round that does more damage when it hits a preschool kid, or anything else.   Should we prevent hockey moms from buying those also?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Skull Pilot said:
> 
> 
> > A semi auto that shoots a .223 is a semi auto that shoots a .223.  It does not matter if the gun looks like a traditional style rifle or a military weapon.
> ...



You don't think civilians should have reliable weapons that are easy to maintain?

By the way, the newer NATO rounds are designed to penetrate, not tumble, not to mention that any bullet that actually tumbled when it went through the air would be highly inaccurate and leave a much larger hole in a paper target than the ones you get from firing even a Vietnam era round through an M-16.

Tell me something how is it that I, not being anything close to an expert on guns, routinely show you, a self declared Army expert on guns, up? Is the truth that, even though you were in the Army, you never actually learned about the gun you were using? 

REMF forever, right?


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > You are still hearing those kids? Bullshit, then why dont you support doing something that is PRVEN to STOP those types of killings?
> ...



What makes a person qualified to have a gun?


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## 9thIDdoc (Dec 24, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> 9thIDdoc said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



Just more evidence you either don't, or can't, read. My arguement is (and has been) that we require armed security in schools. Allowing school staff to arm themselves is an example of a possible way to provide that at little cost to the school system.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> [
> 
> I think most people agree with that, Joeblowme.
> 
> ...



No, guy, you want guns to be available to everyone... you haven't proposed one alternative to keep them out of the hands of criminals...


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > JimBowie1958 said:
> ...



1) A full training course
2) A full background check. 
3) Licenising, consumerate with the level of lethality of the weapon. 
4) Insurance, based on same.


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## Aristotle (Dec 24, 2012)

9thIDdoc said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > 9thIDdoc said:
> ...



This says nothing about arming teachers


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> [
> 
> By the way, the newer NATO rounds are designed to penetrate, not tumble, not to mention that any bullet that actually tumbled when it went through the air would be highly inaccurate and leave a much larger hole in a paper target than the ones you get from firing even a Vietnam era round through an M-16.
> 
> ...



Well, you couldn't get in because you're a crazy person...  

I wouldn't know about the "newer" NATO rounds, as I haven't been in for 21 years.   I do know that the M-16 is a pretty awesome weapons and not something any sane person would give to a crazy person to have in a room full of preschoolers.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...





Full training, what does that mean? As far as I am concerned, once a person knows which end the bullet comes out of they are qualified to have a gun. The military pretty much agrees with that assessment, which is why they let you have one.
We already do background checks on gun purchases, stop acting like it is a new idea.
Lethality of the weapon? Do some guns kill people more than once? if not, they are all equally lethal.
Insurance based on the fact that some guns can kill you two, or more, times. How do you expect to make that work?


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > [
> ...



We switched to the newer NATO round in the 1980s. Unless my math is off that was more than 30 years ago.

Want to prove your expertise again?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> Full training, what does that mean? As far as I am concerned, once a person knows which end the bullet comes out of they are qualified to have a gun. The military pretty much agrees with that assessment, which is why they let you have one.



If you really think that was the extent of the military's weapons training, you are kind of an idiot in addition to being a crazy person.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> We switched to the newer NATO round in the 1980s. Unless my math is off that was more than 30 years ago.
> 
> Want to prove your expertise again?



News to me... we used the same rounds the whole time I was in, 5.56 mm ball... 

But that's okay, I know you need to believe taht somehow, we made the weapons more humane....


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > Full training, what does that mean? As far as I am concerned, once a person knows which end the bullet comes out of they are qualified to have a gun. The military pretty much agrees with that assessment, which is why they let you have one.
> ...



I did not say that was the extent of it, I said that is all you need before they give you one.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



That's not true, either... but I'm really not wasting more time on you because you are a crazy person.


----------



## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > We switched to the newer NATO round in the 1980s. Unless my math is off that was more than 30 years ago.
> ...



You probably didn't notice anything because you know nothing about guns.


----------



## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Well, no, I know what I needed to know... 

I just don't have the weird fetish you guys have, clinging to your gun in fear the government will take it away... 

"Waaaah, the Founding Slave-Holders said I could have a gun!!!!"


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of, which is all you needed to know to qualify with a gun in the Army.

Thanks for making my point.

Another thing, I do not now, nor have I ever, owned a gun. Hopefully, I never will, I don't particularly like them. That does not mean I want the government telling me I can't own own one, nor does it mean I have to pretend to be an expert in order to argue about them.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> You know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of, which is all you needed to know to qualify with a gun in the Army.
> 
> Thanks for making my point.
> 
> Another thing, I do not now, nor have I ever, owned a gun. Hopefully, I never will, I don't particularly like them. That does not mean I want the government telling me I can't own own one, nor does it mean I have to pretend to be an expert in order to argue about them.



If you can't own a gun, it's probably because you are on every mental health watch list in the country, but that's neither here nor there. 

Point is, military grade weapons should not be in the hands of crazy people. Period. 

If you guys can't self-police, someone will do it for you.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 24, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > You know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of, which is all you needed to know to qualify with a gun in the Army.
> ...



Funny, I don't recall saying can't. Even if I was on one of those lists, I am willing to bet I could get a gun without to much trouble, but there is no legal reason for me not to get one.

Point it, you don't know what you are talking about. those so called military grade weapons are actually less lethal than hunting weapons.


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## Aristotle (Dec 24, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...




Joe the above bold says it all...


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 24, 2012)

Why does JoeB keep proposing regulations that we already have?


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 24, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Why does JoeB keep proposing regulations that we already have?



Because he's a senile bitch that has said he wants Wayne LaPeirre dead like old yeller.


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## Aristotle (Dec 24, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 I appreciate the exchange that you and I have so please don't take my aggressive stance as a hostile gesture towards you, I guess you and I have different views. Perhaps you and I can come to a common ground on this matter?


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

SFC Ollie said:


> Why does JoeB keep proposing regulations that we already have?



Why do you keep pretending these regulations exist?  Or are effectively being enforced when we haven't had a head of the ATF for six years.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Given how many people are killed in gun accidents or their children are killed in gun accidents or their deranged kid brings a gun to school and shoots up a bunch of people, I'd say that "knowing which end of the gun the bullet comes out of" is a tad inadequate as training.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Why does JoeB keep proposing regulations that we already have?
> ...



Are you denying the reality that they do exist? The only real complaint you have is that states do not share data that their laws prevent them from sharing, ie. the medical records of people who have not been charged with, or convicted of, a crime.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



If we are to believe everything you type n this board, it worked for you.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



40% of guns are sold without a background check. 

No, the gun laws aren't being enforced, and they aren't strong enough.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> Quantum Windbag said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



Bull shit if you're referring to private sales that is total bull shit. Private sales are between friends for the most part and their back ground has already been checked by the seller. Your 40% is a myth.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

Quantum Windbag said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Aristotle said:
> ...



Frankly, you believe in so much crazy shit, like Ron Paul is smart, it's kind of hard to take you seriously.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Quantum Windbag said:
> ...



Point is, law enforcement didn't do a background check, and "Cleetus seems like a good guy" is hardly a background check. 

Let us not forget, the Columbine shooters bought guns from friends, privately. Friends who are now doing hard time because the shooters weren't around to hang.


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## koshergrl (Dec 25, 2012)

Merry Christmas, gun yanker psychos. My children are enjoying the pellet gun I got my 9 y.o. son. We've been shooting the shit out of stuff. It's a hoot.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Merry Christmas, gun yanker psychos. My children are enjoying the pellet gun I got my 9 y.o. son. We've been shooting the shit out of stuff. It's a hoot.



Too bad there are 20 families in CT that aren't enjoying Christmas with their families this year.


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## koshergrl (Dec 25, 2012)

What a shame the principal wasn't armed. We wouldn't be having the same conversation, though I've no doubt that the baby killing pieces of shit opining in this thread would then have attacked her for daring to kill the poor soul who intended to slaughter a bunch of kids.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



What a stupid Statist thing to say. Friends know friends there isn't any Cleetus seems like a good guy. If I buy a firearm from a friend they know me they already know my background better than any police record check will ever show. There is not need for government getting involved in things that is not it's business.
Let us not forget those guns were taken from the homes of the fathers I don't think those kids bought those firearms.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> What a shame the principal wasn't armed. We wouldn't be having the same conversation, though I've no doubt that the baby killing pieces of shit opining in this thread would then have attacked her for daring to kill the poor soul who intended to slaughter a bunch of kids.



Do you have some brain disease that whenever you are shown up in an argument, you need to start talking about Abortion?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > What a shame the principal wasn't armed. We wouldn't be having the same conversation, though I've no doubt that the baby killing pieces of shit opining in this thread would then have attacked her for daring to kill the poor soul who intended to slaughter a bunch of kids.
> ...



Joe keeps repeating the same old shit no matter how many times it has be debunked and claims he won. Just like jake starkey.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Let us not forget, the Columbine shooters bought guns from friends, privately. Friends who are now doing hard time because the shooters weren't around to hang.
> ...



VPC - Where'd They Get Their Guns? - Columbine High School, Littleton, Colorado



> Robyn Anderson, a friend of Klebold and Harris, bought the shotguns and the Hi-Point 9mm Carbine at The Tanner Gun Show in December of 1998 from unlicensed sellers. Because Anderson purchased the guns for someone else, the transition constituted an illegal "straw purchase." Klebold and Harris bought the TEC-DC9 from a pizza shop employee named Mark Manes, who knew they were too young to purchase the assault pistol, but nevertheless sold it to them for $500.



Sorry, man, they got them from third parties...


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You don't think I can read?

*the transition constituted an illegal "straw purchase."*


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## JoeB131 (Dec 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



You claimed the Columbine shooters took their guns from their parents, not that they got them from third buyers who shouldn't have sold them.  

And that's the point.  40% of gun purchases happen without a background check.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...


Dumb ass the firearms were bought legally there was a back ground check, and you're trying to say 1 purchase and transfer is 40%. out of millions of gun sales in the U.S  STOP BEING SO FUCKING STUPID.
You claimed they bought them, we were both wrong.


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## Katzndogz (Dec 25, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Merry Christmas, gun yanker psychos. My children are enjoying the pellet gun I got my 9 y.o. son. We've been shooting the shit out of stuff. It's a hoot.
> ...



That is because we refuse to control the mentally ill.  Those kids may as well be bound hand and foot to be thrown into a pit of hungry tigers.  They join others who also been sacrificed on the altar of political correctness.


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## boedicca (Dec 25, 2012)

Public schools already destroy the intellect of children, so why should they be concerned with their bodies.


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## Luissa (Dec 25, 2012)

After reading this thread and reading the news.. I can tell you this, I don't want my son's teachers having guns, I don't want a guard outside his school etc. 
My son is not a prisoner, I don't want him going to school in prison. And I find it interesting that small government right wingers are the majority of the ones who want teachers armed and or armed guards at school.


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## Luissa (Dec 25, 2012)

boedicca said:


> Public schools already destroy the intellect of children, so why should they be concerned with their bodies.



Spoken like a true right wing loon.


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## koshergrl (Dec 25, 2012)

Luissa said:


> After reading this thread and reading the news.. I can tell you this, I don't want my son's teachers having guns, I don't want a guard outside his school etc.
> My son is not a prisoner, I don't want him going to school in prison. And I find it interesting that small government right wingers are the majority of the ones who want teachers armed and or armed guards at school.



So you are saying that you don't want your child protected if an armed gunman comes to his school.

Tell you what..why don't you just hang a sign on him that says "You can shoot me first. My mom has told my teachers not to protect me. I am expendable." That way, the killers can get tired shooting the children whose parents don't care about their safety, and the parents who do want their kids to survive will have a chance to lock and load, and kill the guy before he gets to their kids.


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## koshergrl (Dec 25, 2012)

I honestly think parents just don't care if their kids die. They are willing to make a stand against gun ownership and child protection, behind the bodies of their kids.


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## Quantum Windbag (Dec 25, 2012)

Luissa said:


> After reading this thread and reading the news.. I can tell you this, I don't want my son's teachers having guns, I don't want a guard outside his school etc.
> My son is not a prisoner, I don't want him going to school in prison. And I find it interesting that small government right wingers are the majority of the ones who want teachers armed and or armed guards at school.



You prefer dead teachers and kids to dean bad men with guns. Interesting.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 25, 2012)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



You say that like he has a choice; he doesnt, genetics short changed the poor boy.


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 25, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I honestly think parents just don't care if their kids die. They are willing to make a stand against gun ownership and child protection, behind the bodies of their kids.



Well, libtard parents, sure, but that is an increasingly more rare item as time goes on.


----------



## Aristotle (Dec 25, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > After reading this thread and reading the news.. I can tell you this, I don't want my son's teachers having guns, I don't want a guard outside his school etc.
> ...



This is the most silly way of thinking and in fact its downright stupid.....(No offense)

For one, as we've discussed a million times over there is no guarantee that arming teachers will protect nor prevent the killings of students. since the creation of this thread I've asked those of you since you have the belief that teachers ought to be armed I challenged you to solve the budgeting issue states have to fund such an initiative. None of you could challenge me on this issue therefore you failed.

I then switched my position to asking the question of who should be armed (college professors, kindergarten teachers, pre-school teachers, elementary teachers etc) nobody could articulate a cohesive response, as all I received was "your stupid" response....another fail.

Then I offered a scenario (since you gun phonbes failed to answer my questions) regarding a situatuion in which a professor whose back is turned in a lecture hall of +110 students and asked you guys how can a college professor be prepared for a school attacker with an assault rifle when a professor who maybe armed has their back turned? All I asked is in this situation how can a professor be an effective protector if their back is turned? Nobody on the gun-phobe side could even address this...another fail.....

So I say this koshergrl you guy arguing these points do not have a leg to stand on. So far in this thread if I'm either breaking down your argument with real-life scenarios or you guys just simply resort to personal attacks and insults. In all honesty not one person has demonstrated an effective scenario or argument to show their position. All you guys are doing is saying:

"If you don't want to arm teachers you might as well put a sign on your kid saying that 'I'm a target' blah blah blah."

Yet you cannot even display an effective argument as to how, despite police presence already at schools,  arming a teacher would be any different than having an unarmed teacher especially in light of unpredictable scenarios.

I await your failed response.


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 25, 2012)

Luissa said:


> boedicca said:
> 
> 
> > Public schools already destroy the intellect of children, so why should they be concerned with their bodies.
> ...



Lol, you dont know Boedicca, apparently, but I can promise you she is no *rightwing* loon.

Congrats, Boedicca, with the right thinking you're left, and the left thinking you're right, sounds like you are getting closer to the truth of things, but I might be presumptive.


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 25, 2012)

*sigh* more bullshit from this condescending ass hole, sheesh.



Aristotle said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Nothing in life is GURRANTEED, but arming teachers does have the best track record of being EFFECTIVE at stopping these kinds of masscres, dumbass.



Aristotle said:


> since the creation of this thread I've asked those of you since you have the belief that teachers ought to be armed I challenged you to solve the budgeting issue states have to fund such an initiative. None of you could challenge me on this issue therefore you failed.



Nobody 'failed' anything, other than your failure to think. Shit, in two seconds I thought of 1. letting parents VOLUNTEER to guard their local schools after being trained and vetted. 2. Allowing volunteer concealed carry permit  holders that teach to voluntarily carry at school. 3. Allow local folks to donate whatever resources are needed. 4. The rest of the country could use cerebrums from cadavers to put into the skulls of liberal nincompoops like you so that maybe you could catch a brain cell or two.



Aristotle said:


> I then switched my position to asking the question of who should be armed (college professors, kindergarten teachers, pre-school teachers, elementary teachers etc) nobody could articulate a cohesive response, as all I received was "your stupid" response....another fail.



'Cohesive response' being a libtard way of saying 'you agree with me'.

lol, you are so full of shyte.



Aristotle said:


> Then I offered a scenario (since you gun phonbes failed to answer my questions) regarding a situatuion in which a professor whose back is turned in a lecture hall of +110 students and asked you guys how can a college professor be prepared for a school attacker with an assault rifle when a professor who maybe armed has their back turned? All I asked is in this situation how can a professor be an effective protector if their back is turned? Nobody on the gun-phobe side could even address this...another fail.....



Not ALL proffessors would ahve their backs turned, Nimrod. Aside from the fact that the perp would not know who was armed and who wasnt in the first place.



Aristotle said:


> So I say this koshergrl you guy arguing these points do not have a leg to stand on. So far in this thread if I'm either breaking down your argument with real-life scenarios or you guys just simply resort to personal attacks and insults. In all honesty not one person has demonstrated an effective scenario or argument to show their position.



Just because you refuse to think about what people are telling you does not mean that the argumetns presented are ineffective, dumbass.



Aristotle said:


> All you guys are doing is saying:
> 
> "If you don't want to arm teachers you might as well put a sign on your kid saying that 'I'm a target' blah blah blah."



Funny, I dont see anyone saying blah, blah, blah, stupid.



Aristotle said:


> Yet you cannot even display an effective argument as to how despite police presence already at schools, how arming a teacher would be any different than having an unarmed teacher especially in light of unpredictable scenarios.



Lol, you cant see how that principle being armed and trained might have had a beter result than to throw her soon to be dead body at that punk?

You are fucking stupid for sher.



Aristotle said:


> I await your failed response.



OK, here you go....


----------



## JimBowie1958 (Dec 25, 2012)

Luissa said:


> After reading this thread and reading the news.. I can tell you this, I don't want my son's teachers having guns, I don't want a guard outside his school etc.
> My son is not a prisoner, I don't want him going to school in prison.



You apparently dont know what a prison is.

Is a bank a prison if it has armed guards?

Does the 11 guards that hover around the POTUS kid make her a prisoner?

Is the POTUS a prisoner of the Secret Service?

IS that fat ass Barr a prisoner of her armed guards she pays for herself?

Just say it like it is; you would rather your kids be murdered than to have any effective protection if itmeans you have to tell you libtard friends that you want guns to remain legal options for school protection.


----------



## Aristotle (Dec 26, 2012)

Jim this is my last response to you.....You are presenting yourself to be an uneducated loon, incapable of debating without the use of insults...So here is my final _reductio ad absurdum_ in response to you.

*JimBowie1958 said*

"Nothing in life is GURRANTEED, but arming teachers does have the best track record of being EFFECTIVE at stopping these kinds of masscres, dumbass."

*My response:*

Yes in life there are no guarantees (except death and taxes) but Jim, care to show any statistics in the United States (not other countries) where the above statement is true? Better yet, nevermind because there are no present data showing the success rate of armed teachers in the United States! Time.com states:

"One of the reasons why there are so few homicides at school is because these places are largely successful at keeping guns off the premises. Adult supervision and, in very high-risk schools, metal detectors have proven to be effective deterrents. While there are no specific data regarding having armed adults in schools, an analysis of U.S. mortality data found that people with guns in the home are at greater risk than those without guns in the home of dying from a homicide there. There is no reason to think schools would be any different: the more guns there are, the more opportunities there are to use them." See:School Shootings: Arming Teachers Isn't the Answer | TIME.com

"*The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention report that each day, an average of 13 people between the ages of 10 and 24 are victims of homicide in the U.S., making homicide the third leading cause of death among youth and young adults; it is the leading cause of death among African American youth. Yet very little of this violence occurs on school grounds. Children spend more than a third of their waking hours on campus, but less than 2% of youth homicides occur at school.*" 

See reference: School Shootings: Arming Teachers Isn't the Answer | TIME.com

*JimBowie1958 said*

"Nobody 'failed' anything, other than your failure to think. *Shit, in two seconds I thought of 1. letting parents VOLUNTEER to guard their local schools after being trained and vetted. 2. Allowing volunteer concealed carry permit holders that teach to voluntarily carry at school. 3. Allow local folks to donate whatever resources are needed.* 4. The rest of the country could use cerebrums from cadavers to put into the skulls of liberal nincompoops like you so that maybe you could catch a brain cell or two."

*My response*

I believe you mentioned retired military "vets" right? Ok. I also stated some pages ago that at what recompense does someone who volunteers their life and time? When you volunteer your life, especially at the expense of others like a school or a famous celebrity, there is a piece of paper that we working adults sign called a "contract." No school whether big or small is willing to risk someone who volunteers to protect their kids in getting killed and having some sort of financial or social backlash, the risk is too great. Even ex-navy SEALS who work privately for some contractors I'm sure sign sort of contract which says "if you get killed in the line of duty we are not responsible" but hey, these guys are not volunteering, they are getting paid pretty well. So I would assume some decorated Marine who is badass is not going to risk their life for a bunch of kids with no form of compensation, and if there is some form of compensation, then it is not volunteering. As for point *#2* in your post, um, they have classes for that when you get your concealed/exposed firearms permit anyway, so its a useless endeavor.

*JimBowie1958 said*

*'Cohesive response' being a libtard way of saying 'you agree with me'.

lol, you are so full of shyte.*

*My Response*

My point exactly. You cannot say anything sensible enough to debate my accusations so alas you prove me right by resorting to name calling.

*JimBowie1958*

"Not ALL proffessors would ahve their backs turned, Nimrod. Aside from the fact that the perp would not know who was armed and who wasnt in the first place."

*My Response*

It doesn't matter. There is a term called "reconnaissance." Sure your average mentally disabled person may just berserk the entire area without regards to who is and is not armed. But anyone can blend in a college classroom. All you need is a backpack and a look as if you belong at the university. You can definitely case the area to see how many people are in the classroom, and the position of the professor. Even if the professors back isn't turned, you can in many cases in classrooms, position yourself behind everyone else to conceal your weapon. If I really wanted to do damage and maximize my potential to escape I'd definitely position myself where I can complete my objective and increase my potential for escape. As I said before, the only people that do not think along these lines are those with a mental deficiency or those who truly just care about maximizing as much damage without concern of their escape. A good example of this is the "Batman movie theater shooter."

*JimBowie1958 said*

"Just because you refuse to think about what people are telling you does not mean that the argumetns presented are ineffective, dumbass."

*My Response*

Some more insults. Well, I've listened to your position, koshergrl's and others and there was not enough evidence that you all have demonstrated  the validity of both your claims.

*JimBowie1958 said*

"Funny, I dont see anyone saying blah, blah, blah, stupid."

*My Response*

You're right. I added that, because since none of you actually had well thought out responses, your subsequent points surmised what you think to be is true, which turned my brain off hence, the blah blah blah effect.

*JimBowie1958 said*

Lol, you cant see how that principle being armed and trained might have had a *beter* result than to throw her soon to be dead body at that punk?

You are fucking stupid for *sher.*

*My Response*

Before you call someone stupid, make sure your spelling is in order. I do not see why its so hard to spell "sure" and "better but I digress. Let me ask you something. Do you realize that in public schools there is 1 Principle and 1 Assistant Principle? Maybe times have changed but that is 1 person that is armed in a school of possibly 100 kids. Yes that would be an effective strategy for 1 person to protect over 100 kids. Good job at that response Jim.

*JimBowie1958 said*

"OK, here you go...."


Yes Jim, very tasteful. Jim, you are still a failure at debates. If I were you, before you respond in a debate especially with insults, I suggest you learn how to critically think your positions before you respond with emotion, vigor, and anger. Your attempts at refuting several of my previous and recent comments have failed. Since you're no fun in this debate I'll ignore you from here on out....Now that I've added you to the douchebag roledex, I can actually debate with someone who actually has a rational opinion.


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## koshergrl (Dec 26, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...




Mass killers target groups that they know have no protection. This is why they choose people, often children and other students, in "gun-free" zones.

Despite this proven fact, you insist that children remain unprotected. It shows a callous disregard for the lives of children, and in fact an outright desire that they continue to be targeted and killed.

Nothing new there.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 26, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...


.


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## Luissa (Dec 26, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> > After reading this thread and reading the news.. I can tell you this, I don't want my son's teachers having guns, I don't want a guard outside his school etc.
> ...



My son has a better chance of dying in a car wreck should I not drive him in a car?

I will also tell you this, other than the military people here I am probably one of the only posters here who has seen bullet fragments pulled out of their family member's face. My parents did everything to protect us, we lived in a good neighborhood, went to a good school, my mom even had a gun even though my dad is not into guns and my brother was still shot randomly.
It has nothing to do with not wanting to protect my son. It is smart enough to know that even though these incidents are horrible they don't happen every day, and that my son is better off going to school without an armed guard. He has a very very very small chance of being killed at school in this way. Right now he loves school, he is not scared to go to school. But as soon as you put an armed guard there he and others will start asking questions, and then become scared. 
The bigger problem today, is children losing their innocence, not the slight chance they might shot at school. Plus if you treat a school like a prison, and treat everyone who enters like a criminal, they are going to start thinking they are a criminal.
To add to that, my brother who was shot is a republican, my other brothers are also republican and none of them own gun except the one who lives on a ranch. The brother who was shot did talk a lot about owning a gun once, he lived with a lot of fear but he still doesn't own a gun.  
I have no problem with people owning guns, but I don't want my son going to school afraid. I don't want to give up that kind of freedom.


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## jtpr312 (Dec 26, 2012)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Then the problem is with your son, not with having an Officer in the school.  In my county, St Mary's Co. Md. and surrounding counties in Md, we have, and have had, Community Resource Officers, which are armed and uniformed Police Officers, in our schools for years and the kids are just fine with it.


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## JoeB131 (Dec 26, 2012)

JimBowie1958 said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > JoeB131 said:
> ...



You're the one supporting the right for crazy people to get ahold of military grade weapons... and slaughter children with them.  

Not only are you stupid but you're dangerous.


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## koshergrl (Dec 26, 2012)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Your son is afraid every time the school locks down and they herd him into a closet or against a wall to await death, and he's aware that there is nothing between him and death.

My kids have gotten to deal with that two times in the last year. I'm sorry, I wouldn't rather have my children dead than aware that there's the chance that they might be protected in the event an armed gunman comes down the hall. If they are going to be gunned down like rats in a cage, I prefer that they die with the HOPE that maybe a non-babykilling piece of shit MIGHT come through the door behind their assigned gunman to save them.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 26, 2012)

jtpr312 said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Yes, more good answers that this fascist bitch wont accept as resonable or valid because they dont agree with his opinons.

He is the epitome of why Jesus said to not throw pearls before swine.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 26, 2012)

JoeB131 said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Now you are back to telling the Big Lie.

I am now and have always been in favor of keeping legal access of guns from mentally disabled people and criminals, shit-for-brains.


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## koshergrl (Dec 26, 2012)

Since that will never happen, can we please protect the children?

Oh wait. The answer is no. They don't rate protection.


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## koshergrl (Dec 26, 2012)

Luissa said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> > Luissa said:
> ...



Do you put a seat belt on your child? Do you put him in a car seat, in order to protect him against the possibility that he will be in a wreck?

I'll bet you do, because it's the FUCKING LAW. So what you are saying is that unless you're ordered by the government, you will undertake no safety precautions to protect your child from a known threat.

BTW, your kid is going to be a lot more afraid, and dead, if he is huddling in a corner waiting for a gunman, knowing there is NO PROTECTION. He is going to die hysterical, terrified, and pissing himself if he listens to a gunman walk down the aisle, shooting each child on the way to your son. He is going to be terrified every time his school locks down because some retard shot off a pellet gun at the housing development across the street from the school (this happened a couple of months ago to my children) and every single time he is herded into the school yard because some teenaged freak calls his school with a fake bomb threat. All you're doing is guaranteeing that he be completely without hope in the event the worst does happen. Which I guess is the way you prefer your child to die.

Not me. I want my kids to think that someone is going to come take that fucker out before he gets to them.


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 26, 2012)

Aristotle said:


> Jim this is my last response to you.....You are presenting yourself to be an uneducated loon, incapable of debating without the use of insults...So here is my final _reductio ad absurdum_ in response to you.



Ah, so now your going to pull up your dress and run away crying? lolol




Aristotle said:


> *JimBowie1958 said*
> 
> "Nothing in life is GURRANTEED, but arming teachers does have the best track record of being EFFECTIVE at stopping these kinds of masscres, dumbass."
> 
> ...



That is because we are discussing it as a plausible policy. You libtards are funny; so well eddjumakated and yet you cant think your way through the simplest problems. To say that a proposal is invalid because it hasnt been tried yet in one specific place is fucking retarded, even for a libtard.



Aristotle said:


> Time.com states:
> 
> "One of the reasons why there are so few homicides at school is because these places are largely successful at keeping guns off the premises. Adult supervision and, in very high-risk schools, metal detectors have proven to be effective deterrents. While there are no specific data regarding having armed adults in schools, an analysis of U.S. mortality data found that people with guns in the home are at greater risk than those without guns in the home of dying from a homicide there. There is no reason to think schools would be any different: the more guns there are, the more opportunities there are to use them." See:School Shootings: Arming Teachers Isn't the Answer | TIME.com
> 
> ...



Yeah the New Jerk Times doesnt like an answer contrary to the neoMarxist talking points; I am so shocked. The tw o biggest factors in shooting deaths of youths at home is suicide and crime related activity. And Kelso's study is as sensible as stating that since most people who die in the US have been to the hospital within the previous month means that hospitals are more deadly than not going to one. Corelation does not equate to causal realationship.



Aristotle said:


> *JimBowie1958 said*
> 
> "Nobody 'failed' anything, other than your failure to think. *Shit, in two seconds I thought of 1. letting parents VOLUNTEER to guard their local schools after being trained and vetted. 2. Allowing volunteer concealed carry permit holders that teach to voluntarily carry at school. 3. Allow local folks to donate whatever resources are needed.* 4. The rest of the country could use cerebrums from cadavers to put into the skulls of liberal nincompoops like you so that maybe you could catch a brain cell or two."
> 
> ...



So we cannot have armed volunteers because it might risk lawsuits? lol, only a libtard thinks that makes sense.

If a state is going to pass laws putting armed teachers and volunteers in schools, passing a 'Good Samaritan' clause would have to be done as well, genius.




Aristotle said:


> *JimBowie1958 said*
> 
> *'Cohesive response' being a libtard way of saying 'you agree with me'.
> 
> ...



It isnt name calling when it is true, moron. You are so fucking stupid you dont think I know how to spell the word 'sure'? You are a total fool, jack ass.





Aristotle said:


> *JimBowie1958*
> 
> "Not ALL proffessors would ahve their backs turned, Nimrod. Aside from the fact that the perp would not know who was armed and who wasnt in the first place."
> 
> ...



The fucker can recon all he wants if there are twenty teachers that *could* be armed at the school and he doesnt know if he knows who they all are and if they are carrying that particular day then he CANNOT be assured of having a safe place to prep or shoot innocents.

Your arguments are total foolishness and it is more than just apparent that you want kids to die in gun free zones so that you and your ilk can continue to use these crises to advance your gun grabbing agenda.

Again,


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## koshergrl (Dec 26, 2012)

I also don't get the ridiculous belief that children are more terrified if they think they will be protected, than they are if they know they are completely exposed and at risk with no possibility of salvation in the event of an attack.

What sort of twisted mind believes something that stupid? You honestly think it's better that your child be afraid and hopeless, than afraid with a little hope?


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## Aristotle (Dec 26, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> Aristotle said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...



Look, you keep saying, that I'm saying, children should remain unprotected. First off, me saying teachers shouldn't have guns in classrooms does not equate to me saying children shouldn't be protected. The CDC has noted that the mortality rate at schools in the U.S is less than 2%

I've already listed references, can you prove arming teachers would work and how?

Wait, didn't a teacher bring a gun to school and was reprimanded?


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## JimBowie1958 (Dec 26, 2012)

koshergrl said:


> I also don't get the ridiculous belief that children are more terrified if they think they will be protected, than they are if they know they are completely exposed and at risk with no possibility of salvation in the event of an attack.
> 
> What sort of twisted mind believes something that stupid? You honestly think it's better that your child be afraid and hopeless, than afraid with a little hope?



The sort of mind is called 'modern liberal' and yes, they want everyones childeren to be at the mercy of wackos and criminals.


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## gr8feelings (Feb 6, 2013)

Teachers carrying consealed weapons would be an enormous detterant. Pay them for their extra duty same as the football coach is for coaching. If only 50% in a 50 teacher school carried a small 38 Special, 5 shot capacity, in seconds, any "shooter"  would be face to face with 40 to 75 rounds of potent, lethal, potential gun fire. Case Closed....No more shooter threats...SO MORE GUNS IS THE ANSWER, NOT LESS.


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## wavingrl (Feb 6, 2013)

gr8feelings said:


> Teachers carrying consealed weapons would be an enormous detterant. Pay them for their extra duty same as the football coach is for coaching. If only 50% in a 50 teacher school carried a small 38 Special, 5 shot capacity, in seconds, any "shooter"  would be face to face with 40 to 75 rounds of potent, lethal, potential gun fire. Case Closed....No more shooter threats...SO MORE GUNS IS THE ANSWER, NOT LESS.



I have yet to think of where these guns would be stored until needed in a school environment. 

The risk of weapons being used by students seems to overshadow the potential effectiveness of arming teachers.


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## SFC Ollie (Feb 6, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> gr8feelings said:
> 
> 
> > Teachers carrying consealed weapons would be an enormous detterant. Pay them for their extra duty same as the football coach is for coaching. If only 50% in a 50 teacher school carried a small 38 Special, 5 shot capacity, in seconds, any "shooter"  would be face to face with 40 to 75 rounds of potent, lethal, potential gun fire. Case Closed....No more shooter threats...SO MORE GUNS IS THE ANSWER, NOT LESS.
> ...



Where do I store my concealed weapon while walking down the street? While shopping (in the places that don't stop you from carrying). Same place i would as a school teacher.....


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## wavingrl (Feb 6, 2013)

SFC Ollie said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > gr8feelings said:
> ...



ok.

I still imagine some problems with that. 

ie--
-What type of weapons retention training has been provided to staff who are armed and what steps have been taken to reduce risks of a teacher or staff member being intentionally disarmed by a student or other person, or for having a firearm dislodged from a staff member's control when the teacher breaks up a fight in a cafeteria or hallway?   

-How is the district prepared to prevent and manage situations where teachers and/or staff members lose, misplace, or have stolen their firearms while on campus?

-How will the school district manage an accidental shooting that could occur?

-What is the impact of this type of board policy and practice on the school district's insurance and potential legal liability posture?  If self-insured, is the district able to handle potential lawsuit judgments against them for cases resulting from this practice?  If insured by a private carrier, what is the insurance provider's position and concerns, or will they even insure the district for such a practice?


It is neither here nor there. I basically do not think it would be a good idea to arm teachers.

The middle school in Atlanta where a student shot another student had two metal detectors which weren't working at the time. I think a good first step would be for each and every school system to review current security measures and be certain that everything is functioning properly. Strangely enough after it was reported that the metal detectors weren't working and would be repaired nothing more has been reported about that incident. I would have thought that the school system would have been sanctioned in some way for not paying closer attention to the security needs.


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## SFC Ollie (Feb 6, 2013)

Basic and simple, we do not arm any teacher. However we allow for a teacher who has a concealed carry permit to carry on the school grounds if they so desire.

No one will ever know if a teacher or if any teacher is carrying.......


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## wavingrl (Feb 6, 2013)

I don't pretend to possess expertise of knowledge of guns and all related topics.

'Concealed Weapon', to me that means you are 'armed'.

If you are on school property with a weapon there is a chance that the weapon can be taken from you. All sorts of complex issues could then arise.


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## jtpr312 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> gr8feelings said:
> 
> 
> > Teachers carrying consealed weapons would be an enormous detterant. Pay them for their extra duty same as the football coach is for coaching. If only 50% in a 50 teacher school carried a small 38 Special, 5 shot capacity, in seconds, any "shooter"  would be face to face with 40 to 75 rounds of potent, lethal, potential gun fire. Case Closed....No more shooter threats...SO MORE GUNS IS THE ANSWER, NOT LESS.
> ...



Stored?  Nobody is saying anything about "storing" firearms at school, though they used to be stored there for the various rifle teams throughout the nation, though some rifle teams, like many in NYC, had the students take their rifles back adn forth on the subway.  They are proposing that teachers CARRY a weapon at school if they choose to.  On their person, not "stored".


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## jtpr312 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> I don't pretend to possess expertise of knowledge of guns and all related topics.
> 
> 'Concealed Weapon', to me that means you are 'armed'.
> 
> If you are on school property with a weapon there is a chance that the weapon can be taken from you. All sorts of complex issues could then arise.



Not much on reading comprehension or vocabulary either are you?  Try re-reading his post, slowly, paying special attention to; "we do not arm anyone" as opposed to the part that says "we allow for a teacher who has a concealed carry permit to carry on the school grounds if they so desire".  As for the rest, yeah there's a chance someone can take your weapon, there's also a chance you can get struck by lightning does that make you hide under your bed every time there's a thunderstorm?


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

jtpr312 said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > I don't pretend to possess expertise of knowledge of guns and all related topics.
> ...



whatever. 
To simplify--you and others believe 'teachers with guns' would be beneficial. I have reservations. 

Not worth further discussion. If this becomes a reality, highly unlikely, imo--then the matter will be resolved one way or the other.

~~
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...use-bill-988-concealed-weapons_n_2623123.html

Somewhere in Mississippi--2 teachers per school allowed concealed weapons. I'm certain there are other systems that will also approve such a practice. 

No news of any system in Georgia considering this and there is strong support for the 2nd Amendment here. Another reservation I have is the 'type of individual' who should carry a concealed weapon.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> jtpr312 said:
> 
> 
> > wavingrl said:
> ...


No body is saying they want to force all teachers to carry firearms in school. How about we allow those teachers  who are willing and who already have the training CCW  to carry while on school grounds, (and carrying being concealed.)


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > jtpr312 said:
> ...


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## bigrebnc1775 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > No body is saying they want to force all teachers to carry firearms in school. How about we allow those teachers  who are willing and who already have the training CCW  to carry while on school grounds, (and carrying being concealed.)
> ...





> maybe--I really don't know and don't care that much.


Why in the hell are you in this discussion?


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



Why not? 

After hearing 'something must be done' ad infinitum --I truly wonder what is it that should be done?

I suppose that is why I expressed an opinion. I don't have an extreme opinion but I do have some concerns.

~~~~~~~
Last there was an exceptionally 'intense' food fight in a middle school. The administration warned the students that severe consequences would follow for those who participated. 100 or more chose to take the risk. In such a situation there is the potential for emotions to cloud judgment --I suppose that is my main concern. 

10 students face permanent suspension and several are facing criminal charges. fwiw.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > wavingrl said:
> ...





> Why not?



You don't care but you want to give your opinion which in my opinion is about the most stupidest thing anyone can do.



> After hearing 'something must be done' ad infinitum --I truly wonder what is it that should be done?


Something as to be done even if it hasn't worked in the past?
How about enforcing current laws
Allow teachers with concealed carry permit that are willing to carry on school grounds the opportunity to do so.
How about doing away with gun free zones?


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

ok--you have expressed your opinion.

I suppose I 'care' at some level. It is not clear to me at this point what would be best for schools. 

Those in positions of authority seem to agree that such decisions should be made at a local level. I am fairly certain that the leadership of my local school district will not be discussing this in the near future. The school system is in trouble, on probation for mismanagement of funds and they are now seeking a new superintendent, after replacing a corrupt superintendent 3 years ago. His trial will begin this spring. 

What may work for one school system might not be effective for another.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> ok--you have expressed your opinion.
> 
> I suppose I 'care' at some level. It is not clear to me at this point what would be best for schools.
> 
> ...


You know how to use the quote function
If you're addressing me use the god damn thing



> Something as to be done even if it hasn't worked in the past?
> How about enforcing current laws
> Allow teachers with concealed carry permit that are willing to carry on school grounds the opportunity to do so.
> How about doing away with gun free zones?


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > ok--you have expressed your opinion.
> ...



I apologize for failure to use the quote function.

I could have a similar exchange with a family member. No matter what I said I would be 'wrong'. Futile to do more than agree.

I can't adequately discuss 'doing away with gun free zones' or the other topics you suggested.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > wavingrl said:
> ...





> I apologize for failure to use the quote function.


Thank you, it's one of the little things that aggravates me about some on here they'll use the quote function one time and when you make a point they'll stop using it.



> I can't adequately discuss 'doing away with gun free zones' or the other topics you suggested.


Why can't you? You have an opinion and how your opinion can be carried out and used don't you?


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



I just forgot --to use the quote function.

It is too complex of an issue for me. 
I know I am not a person who should have a gun--anywhere. I taught for many years and can only think of a few people that I ever worked with who might be able to respond appropriately in volatile situations and therefore have some concerns about how this sort of plan could ever be implemented.

Some of my middle school students should have been in high school and would easily have been able to overpower me. 

In areas where 'illegal guns' will always be available --I don't know what can be done. That is about as far as I have gotten with all of this. 

It is 'significant' to me that this is not being discussed locally. Too 'hot' of a topic I can only assume.


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## bigrebnc1775 (Feb 8, 2013)

wavingrl said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > wavingrl said:
> ...



No one has mandated or even mentioned that teachers who don't want to carry should carry. What has been proposed id that those teachers who are willing and able to carry should be allowed to carry, with the right training.


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## wavingrl (Feb 8, 2013)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> wavingrl said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



I have always thought  that former military/that sort of individual --could work wonders in many schools, fwiw. 

So much goes on in schools. Emotions are always 'flying'--it is just difficult to imagine how the sort of individuals who could remain 'rational' and cool could ever be found in sufficient numbers. 

I hope things can be worked out somehow.


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