# Fracking



## Speaker (Dec 31, 2011)

My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies. 
As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.


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## Jeremy (Dec 31, 2011)

fuck off.


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## Lakhota (Dec 31, 2011)

I watched the documentary, Gasland, again a couple nights ago.  I still find it unbelievable that this is allowed to continue.


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## Jeremy (Dec 31, 2011)




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## Speaker (Dec 31, 2011)

Agreed. And I know it is hard to take in. But I think America's biggest problem, is that it is very ignorant. When the truth is brought to the surface after years of big important people telling them "its all good" you feel uneasy. What to think....You can kick and scream all you want Jeremy but the truth will catch up to you once you have cancer because they lied to you about radiation, or certain cemicals in your childs toy who now has autism because of it, or HOLES IN YOUR LUNGS because of facking. Open your mind.


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## Jeremy (Dec 31, 2011)

Fuck it. Let's just get more throught the Straight of Hormuz.


..dumb fucks.


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## Lakhota (Dec 31, 2011)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



The people experiencing problems are spread out too far for a unified stand against these criminals.  It will likely take a major incident to bring them to justice.  However, by that time it'll be too late for all those already hurt that are spread out across the country.  The frackers have made it very plain - get an attorney.  This immoral fracking is not only destroying water supplies - it is destroying animal and human health.


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## Speaker (Dec 31, 2011)

I am sorry Jeremy, what are you trying to say. You see it helps when you articulate when you are speaking to somebody. Remember that sentences have adjectives and verbs...Why don't you try that comment again. Shal we?


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## Speaker (Dec 31, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Speaker said:
> 
> 
> > My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> ...



It is hard. you bring them to court, but it will not stop the problem. What we need to do is stand as a people and give it to them.


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## Conservative (Dec 31, 2011)

damn... I thought this thread was about the sex scenes in Battlestar Galactica


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## Lakhota (Dec 31, 2011)

Leave it to a wingnut to equate fracking with porn.


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## Lakhota (Dec 31, 2011)

Sadly, many landowners have already signed land leases to hydraulic fracking companies - like Haliburton.

Big Oil Fracking Companies Screw Homeowners - YouTube

Fracking: The Haliburton Loophole That Poisons America's Drinking Water - YouTube


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## Charles_Main (Dec 31, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Sadly, many landowners have already signed land leases to hydraulic fracking companies - like Haliburton.
> 
> Big Oil Fracking Companies Screw Homeowners - YouTube
> 
> Fracking: The Haliburton Loophole That Poisons America's Drinking Water - YouTube



OMG the Sky is falling.


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## uscitizen (Dec 31, 2011)

Why do we have fracking?
Because there is money to be made in it.


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## Political Junky (Dec 31, 2011)

The 1% won't be harmed by fracking. Their poorer supporters might not be so lucky.


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## Mr. H. (Dec 31, 2011)

This thread.


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## skookerasbil (Dec 31, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> I watched the documentary, Gasland, again a couple nights ago.  I still find it unbelievable that this is allowed to continue.




you dummy..........best buckle up your chinstrap because in the next decade, we'll be fracking our asses off in America, especially as green energy continues to dive bomb into oblivion.


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## editec (Dec 31, 2011)

> The Environmental Protection Agency on Thursday linked hydraulic fracturing with groundwater contamination in Wyoming &#8212; a first-of-its-kind conclusion by the federal agency that could trigger new scrutiny of the practice used to extract oil and natural gas nationwide.
> The EPA announced its findings as part of a three-year probe into possible water pollution in Pavillion, Wyo.
> The agency said it discovered synthetic chemicals associated with gas production and hydraulic fracturing fluids inside deep water wells in the region.
> 
> ...


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## Speaker (Jan 1, 2012)

You see? People, we say that if it is happening then there is no stopping it. This is terrible. the earth will never be the same. ANd not just Fracking either. Think about everyone living now and in the future, think of living a happy, healthy life! Don't feed into this belief that everything willl be ok  ie. the world will even it out or some scientist will figure it out...If we put a solar panel on every building in america, electric cars. high speed electric trains instead of huge gas using planes-this needs to be our future or else there won't be any. Make the change. These companies don't care. This is a huge problem, but they just dont want you to know it.


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## AquaAthena (Jan 1, 2012)

*"Fracking" *

It IS a great word, though.


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## JWBooth (Jan 1, 2012)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.









TM you naughty girl you...


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## auditor0007 (Jan 1, 2012)

Jeremy said:


> Fuck it. Let's just get more throught the Straight of Hormuz.
> 
> 
> ..dumb fucks.



Honestly, there are multiple solutions to our energy problems.  What I find absurd is that fact that idiots like you bow so blindly to the big energy companies regardless of the facts.  And what really bothers me is that so few people give a shit about this planet 200 years or 1000 years from now.  It seems like forever, but in many ways it is right around the corner.  This planet is billions of years old with millions of years of living history, yet we think a thousand years is forever and what we do to this planet today won't matter in the next millennium.


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## auditor0007 (Jan 1, 2012)

skookerasbil said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > I watched the documentary, Gasland, again a couple nights ago.  I still find it unbelievable that this is allowed to continue.
> ...



With people like you keeping the blinders on, that would not be surprising.


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## auditor0007 (Jan 1, 2012)

Speaker said:


> You see? People, we say that if it is happening then there is no stopping it. This is terrible. the earth will never be the same. ANd not just Fracking either. Think about everyone living now and in the future, think of living a happy, healthy life! Don't feed into this belief that everything willl be ok  ie. the world will even it out or some scientist will figure it out...If we put a solar panel on every building in america, electric cars. high speed electric trains instead of huge gas using planes-this needs to be our future or else there won't be any. Make the change. These companies don't care. This is a huge problem, but they just dont want you to know it.



They will only be happy if the planet looks like 2149 in Terra Nova.


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## Lakhota (Jan 1, 2012)

I have friends that live in fracking areas - and they ain't happy!


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## editec (Jan 1, 2012)

Humankind is not always going to need hydrocarbons for its power needs.

but I can assure you that humakind will always need clean potable water.

So if fracking cannot be done without polluting the ground water?


It not ought to be done UNTIL it can be done safely..


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## waltky (Mar 27, 2013)

Fracking Linked To 2011 Oklahoma Earthquake...

*Scienctists link 2011 Oklahoma quake to drilling waste injections*
_Tue Mar 26 2013 - WASHINGTON A team of scientists has determined that a 5.6 magnitude quake in Oklahoma in 2011 was caused when oil drilling waste was injected deep underground._


> That makes it the most powerful quake to be blamed on deep injections of wastewater, although not everyone agrees. Oklahomas state seismologists say the quake was natural.
> 
> The Nov. 6 earthquake near Prague, Okla., injured two people, damaged 14 houses and was the strongest Midwestern quake in decades.
> 
> ...


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 27, 2013)

auditor0007 said:


> Jeremy said:
> 
> 
> > Fuck it. Let's just get more throught the Straight of Hormuz.
> ...



Whoa there Auditor, you think his adoration for the oil companies comes after looking at facts?  Or better, you believe he knows anything about fracking at all?

He heard oil and ran in to suck oils big throbbing knob.  He thought fracking is what big oil does to his mouth


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 27, 2013)

editec said:


> Humankind is not always going to need hydrocarbons for its power needs.
> 
> but I can assure you that humakind will always need clean potable water.
> 
> ...



What happens to the water, happens to the people


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## healthmyths (Mar 27, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



Right away I totally discounted the rest of your screed when you wrote: "Millions of people have hads their water ruined,"

HOW MANY MILLIONS????

That kind of MAKING THE EXCEPTION the RULE is what is continually people like you do!
Jumping to conclusions!  Using HYPERBOLE!


The following is an ever-growing list of the 1,123 of people and families that have been harmed by fracking (or shale gas production) in the US.

List of the Harmed | Pennsylvania Alliance for Clean Water and Air


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 27, 2013)

healthmyths said:


> Right away I totally discounted the rest of your screed when you wrote: "Millions of people have hads their water ruined,"
> 
> HOW MANY MILLIONS????
> 
> ...



Ok, Thousands...make your point.  Just in case Hundreds, tens, a few...make your point?


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## peach174 (Mar 27, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



Gasland is an environmental propaganda movie.
Commonwealth Foundation - Gasland Debunked

Water contamination from Fracking has been debunked.
Methane was in the water way before fracking.
When Europeans first arrived from Europe and dug their wells on their farms, they found Methane in their water.


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## boedicca (Mar 27, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.





Link?  And the Matt Damon movie doesn't count as a source.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 27, 2013)

peach174 said:


> Speaker said:
> 
> 
> > My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> ...



Gasland is an environmental movie
Water contamination from Fracking is real
Cool story bro...Many fisherman from Europe used sticks to fish...Comparing that to modern day fishing would be stupid....thats what you just did


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## boedicca (Mar 27, 2013)

Nevermind.  He's just not worth the energy.


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > Speaker said:
> ...



I'm interested in seeing documented and verified proof of that water contamination claim.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 27, 2013)

There's a whole video on it called a documentary.  It's called Gasland.  If you don't believe it I'd like to see your documented and verified proof that it's not real.  It's funny because I know you don't have it so you'll come back with lip service and name calling.


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## thereisnospoon (Mar 27, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



"Gasland" has been discredited as anti-fracking propaganda.
But...You'll believe what you wish based on your agenda.
Tell ya what. If you want to appear credible, sell your car. Heat your house with firewood, etc.
If you're going to protest the stuff, don't use the stuff.


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## thereisnospoon (Mar 27, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



BTW, it's "Allowed" not "aloud".


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## thereisnospoon (Mar 27, 2013)

Lakhota said:


> I have friends that live in fracking areas - and they ain't happy!



Because they are not reaping the rewards. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!


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## Freewill (Mar 27, 2013)

Once again the left wing liberals are going to take care of people.  The ONLY good economic news in years is just too much for them they must interject their negativity.  Primarily because they are jealous.  They ain't getting any so why should anyone else?  If they are getting land leases or royalties then they are the biggest hypocrites to walk the Earth.

Well water catching on fire has been going on as long as people have been drilling wells.  Do you think that just because someone wants water and not gas the gas gives a crap?  What I would do if gas started coming out my spigot is buy a gas furnace.  I might try howling at the moon but I doubt that would be as effective.  Or I might try and soak some money out of the local gas company, but I doubt it.

So some farmers are going to become rich and the left wing liberals can't stand it.  It should be a cold dark world they live in. Not using energy and all.  But I don't see any of them stop using their coal fired laptops.

http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2011/0...8.html?sq=gasland&st=cse&scp=1&pagewanted=all


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 27, 2013)

I think the inability to drink their own water might be more of an issue than jealousy.


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> I think the inability to drink their own water might be more of an issue than jealousy.



Again, I'm interested in seeing documented and verified proof of that water contamination claim and that it was directly and irrefutably connected to the practice of hydraulic fracturing.


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## Samson (Mar 27, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been *aloud*? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, .



My question is why we pay attention to the extraordinarily ignorant arguements that those who oppose natural resource development and do not know the difference between the words "allowed" and, "aloud."


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

Or fracking and fracing (the correct spelling).


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## LogikAndReazon (Mar 27, 2013)

How comically illiterate.........


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

Well, that's beside the point of the thread.


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## Samson (Mar 27, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> Well, that's beside the point of the thread.





Its beside the point of the entire activist community that opposes natural resource development.


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

Samson said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> > Well, that's beside the point of the thread.
> ...



"It's" not its.


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## Samson (Mar 27, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > Mr. H. said:
> ...





No, I refuse to acknowledge that everone cannot know "Its" is the contraction of "It is," without the use of the apostophe.

Its The New English.


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

Illinois could be on the cusp of an energy revolution in terms of this state's hydrocarbon production, which began in 1853. Hydraulic fracturing has been in practice for 60 years without incident.

Granted these have been vertical frac completions, with more recent horizontal frac jobs being used. Where we are headed is into the realm of high-volume high-pressure horizontal fracturing which would also incorporate "slickwater" treatment. This method introduces trace chemicals in order to increase fluids flow. This itself is nothing new. But it's new to our state. 

With few exceptions, existing DNR rules and regulations are sufficient for protecting groundwater during drilling and completion as well as production. 

But that doesn't seem to be "good enough" for the enviro-whackjobs and legislators who have no clue as to the process. They aren't even familiar with existing regulations. 

So in a State that is dying on the vine on so many fronts - unemployment, flight of businesses, unfunded pensions, unpaid bills... we insist on shooting ourselves in the foot by over-regulating this practice that has proven itself in other states. 

Many big players have already spent tens of millions of dollars on leases in hopes that the New Albany Shale will be economically productive. The Illinois Chamber of Commerce estimates that over 40,000 new and new-indirect jobs could be created with millions flowing into the treasury. 

But that doesn't seem to be "good enough". What I see happening are these companies getting very impatient and they are ready to say "fuck it" and leave. And that will leave us with nothing. 

A few crazy ignorant fucking fools are holding everyone hostage. This could literally save Illinois... 
but that's not "good enough".

Fuck it.


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## OKTexas (Mar 27, 2013)

Lakhota said:


> Sadly, many landowners have already signed land leases to hydraulic fracking companies - like Haliburton.
> 
> Big Oil Fracking Companies Screw Homeowners - YouTube
> 
> Fracking: The Haliburton Loophole That Poisons America's Drinking Water - YouTube



Your ignorance in showing again, Haliburton is an oil services company, they don't lease land for drilling, oil and gas companies do that. And I challenge you to provide on shred of evidence that any ground water has been effected by fracking that hasn't been debunked.

It's funny to see how you're so eager to swallow BS when it's warped in a nice package. You do know Graslands is fiction.


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## LordBrownTrout (Mar 27, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> Illinois could be on the cusp of an energy revolution in terms of this state's hydrocarbon production, which began in 1853. Hydraulic fracturing has been in practice for 60 years without incident.
> 
> Granted these have been vertical frac completions, with more recent horizontal frac jobs being used. Where we are headed is into the realm of high-volume high-pressure horizontal fracturing which would also incorporate "slickwater" treatment. This method introduces trace chemicals in order to increase fluids flow. This itself is nothing new. But it's new to our state.
> 
> ...



These whackjobs don't understand permeability and porosity, H.  If you broke it down to as simple as 1+1 = 2, they still wouldn't get it.  They don't understand that casing for is run through the drilled section of the water table.


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## OKTexas (Mar 27, 2013)

editec said:


> > The Environmental Protection Agency on Thursday linked hydraulic fracturing with groundwater contamination in Wyoming  a first-of-its-kind conclusion by the federal agency that could trigger new scrutiny of the practice used to extract oil and natural gas nationwide.
> > The EPA announced its findings as part of a three-year probe into possible water pollution in Pavillion, Wyo.
> > The agency said it discovered synthetic chemicals associated with gas production and hydraulic fracturing fluids inside deep water wells in the region.
> >
> > ...



I wouldn't put allot of faith in a preliminary report, even deep water wells are thousands of feet above oil and gas wells, especially in the Rockies.


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## OKTexas (Mar 27, 2013)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> > Illinois could be on the cusp of an energy revolution in terms of this state's hydrocarbon production, which began in 1853. Hydraulic fracturing has been in practice for 60 years without incident.
> ...



Not only casing but the casing in encased in concrete, which seals it in the bedrock and the fracking occurs thousand of feet below that.


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## depotoo (Mar 27, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> Illinois could be on the cusp of an energy revolution in terms of this state's hydrocarbon production, which began in 1853. Hydraulic fracturing has been in practice for 60 years without incident.
> 
> Granted these have been vertical frac completions, with more recent horizontal frac jobs being used. Where we are headed is into the realm of high-volume high-pressure horizontal fracturing which would also incorporate "slickwater" treatment. This method introduces trace chemicals in order to increase fluids flow. This itself is nothing new. But it's new to our state.
> 
> ...



we had given one of our leases to the company in TX that was found NOT GUILTY of contaminating the water table there, one of the first such charges by the EPA.  They were forced into not drilling in that area when renewals came up because they were having to deal with all the crap there and had not yet been exonerated.  Once again government shows it doesn't know what the hell it is doing.


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

depotoo said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> > Illinois could be on the cusp of an energy revolution in terms of this state's hydrocarbon production, which began in 1853. Hydraulic fracturing has been in practice for 60 years without incident.
> ...



Sounds like there is pending litigation. Or at least some loose ends to be resolved. 
For your sake I hope it's cleared up and you're drilled up. 
Good luck with all that.


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## depotoo (Mar 27, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> > Mr. H. said:
> ...



Government drops water pollution charges against Range | Reuters
Texas Officials Clear Gas Driller of Harming Water | The Texas Tribune
other than this?
And thanks.  Me too!


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

waltky said:


> Fracking Linked To 2011 Oklahoma Earthquake...
> 
> *Scienctists link 2011 Oklahoma quake to drilling waste injections*
> _Tue Mar 26 2013 - WASHINGTON A team of scientists has determined that a 5.6 magnitude quake in Oklahoma in 2011 was caused when oil drilling waste was injected deep underground._
> ...



With deference (and kudos) to waltky - the best thread reviver evah...

until further review, I'll opt on the side of "natural".


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## LordBrownTrout (Mar 27, 2013)

OKTexas said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> > Mr. H. said:
> ...



Exactly and the fracturing may extend out from the lateral 400, 500 feet which still leaves thousands of feet unfractured.  The gas has no way of escaping beyond the fracture due to the composition of the bedrock.


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## ScienceRocks (Mar 27, 2013)

Fracking is a wonderful thing!


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## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

Matthew said:


> Fracking is a wonderful thing!



I wouldn't exactly call it win-win, but it is pretty damn sweet. 

The thing is, industry has proven itself capable of complying with government imposed rules regulations and restrictions since the 1800's. And in the process, oil and natural gas companies have developed technology that rivals NASA. 

You want to bake some bread, sure you're going to spill some flour. But (and that's a big butt) the successes and benefits by far outweigh any setbacks. 

Unlike agriculture. Ag couldn't exist without massive amounts of hydrocarbon input. 
Ag couldn't exist without continually fouling the environment - polluting our air, ground, and water. 

Yet the public is silent. Government is silent. 

They are paid to pollute. Agriculture is paid to produce, they are paid to not produce, they are paid when the weather goes south, they are granted floor prices. They are allowed insurance against non-production. 

Who is fucking who?


----------



## OKTexas (Mar 27, 2013)

LordBrownTrout said:


> OKTexas said:
> 
> 
> > LordBrownTrout said:
> ...



I have personally sat at a well head as fracking was being done, people don't understand the technology involved. They can actually do real time 3D mapping of the area being fracked through acoustical and seismic sensors.


----------



## Mr. H. (Mar 27, 2013)

OKTexas said:


> LordBrownTrout said:
> 
> 
> > OKTexas said:
> ...



And THIS ^ is what many hope for the state of Illinois. Yet there are a very few uninformed radical extremist elements as well as legislators who are hell-bent on preventing it. 

Why?

Beats the fuck of me.


----------



## Darkwind (Mar 28, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.


I wasn't aware that fracking was all that noisy unless you are on the well site....


Be that as it may, you have been mislead.

Do you know why some towns are called "Burning Springs" or how some are called, "Fire Lake"?

Prior to Fracking, did you know that there are creeks and streams and even small ponds that can and have caught fire!?

Because the natural gas seeps out of the ground and often does so through the water aquifers.

The stories you hear of peoples water being contaminated are overblown and made to seem like they are happening everywhere.

I will admit that some people have had their water destroyed, and for that, the oil and gas companies should be forced to clean it up and pay a hefty restitution to the owners.

However, it is NOT widespread as you have been led to believe.  I live right in the heart of the Marcellus Shale and I see wells being opened about every other week.  Its kind of neat to see them 'light' one up and burn off the excess pressure.

However, no ones water has been destroyed in this area and the accidents that have happened, are the kinds of accidents that happen in any heavy industry.

Take a chill pill and do some research.


----------



## tjvh (Mar 28, 2013)

Speaker said:


> *My question is how has Fracking been aloud?* Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



They should turn fracking down to a more reasonable volume.


----------



## OKTexas (Mar 28, 2013)

Here's an article you folks might want to read on the subject.

"In the film's signature moment Mike Markham, a landowner, ignites his tap water. The film leaves the viewer with the false impression that the flaming tap water is a result of natural gas drilling. However, according to the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, which tested Markham's water in 2008, there were "no indications of oil & gas related impacts to water well." Instead the investigation found that the methane was "biogenic" in nature, meaning it was naturally occurring and that his water well was drilled into a natural gas pocket."

The Truth About Gasland - America's Natural Gas Alliance

You might come away a bit less ignorant.


----------



## ScienceRocks (Mar 28, 2013)

WE need more fracking. Lots more. 

The whole fucking planet needs more fracking. 

It isn't loud
It is good

We need more fuel and so we can frack the planet under our ground to get it.


----------



## tjvh (Mar 28, 2013)

Hell fracking yeah!!


----------



## DaGoose (Mar 28, 2013)

It's not hard to see that the Wingnuts have no problem ruining the earths resources as long as it.....

a. Doesn't affect them personally, and 

b. Someone can make a buck

But just ask them to pony up a couple of dollars to clean up any mess this creates (that they supported) and just listen to them holler. (Kinda like the Iraq War)

.


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## ScienceRocks (Mar 28, 2013)

dagoose, 

how does it pollute? How does it destroy?

We need fuel one way or the other.


----------



## Grandma (Mar 28, 2013)

Matthew said:


> dagoose,
> 
> how does it pollute? How does it destroy?
> 
> We need fuel one way or the other.



Methane.

Garbage produces it naturally as it decomposes. It also produces it as it burns. But instead of building compost pipelines and incinerators we send garbage out onto the open sea in barges and we waste valuable land building dumps.

The US produces enough garbage every year to power the entirety of the 3 west coast states, with enough left over to light up Vegas.


----------



## zeke (Mar 28, 2013)

This is so cool. We have found not one, but two great ways to pollute our water.

Fracking for gas and shale oil production. Both take millions of gallons of fresh water and turns them into millions of gallons of polluted water.

Is that cool or what. And we are doing both things in a big way here in North America. Wait till we export this technology all over the planet. We won't be satisified untill there is no unpolluted water left on the earth.

You know that we are out of our ever loving fuking minds when we have to stoop to polluting water sources and supplies just so the oil companies can make a few more hundreds of millions of dollars.


----------



## zeke (Mar 28, 2013)

Here in the great state of Ohio. Kasich has made it possible for the gas fracking companies to not even have to disclose what wonderful chemicals they are pumping into the ground.

Makes you feel all warm and fuzzy knowing that the state doesn't really care to divulge what these companies are doing to the ground water.

Why you think that is?


----------



## chikenwing (Mar 28, 2013)

zeke said:


> Here in the great state of Ohio. Kasich has made it possible for the gas fracking companies to not even have to disclose what wonderful chemicals they are pumping into the ground.
> 
> Makes you feel all warm and fuzzy knowing that the state doesn't really care to divulge what these companies are doing to the ground water.
> 
> Why you think that is?



So you have turned off your gas service if you have one,and now buy nothing that has been ,manufactured,or processed with natural gas in support of your ideals right??


----------



## editec (Mar 28, 2013)

All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.

Most of it will be shipped overseas. m

Unless you own stock in those companies this fracking does you no good.


----------



## there4eyeM (Mar 28, 2013)

Developing natural resources is a good thing. It should be started with the most abundant; Solar.


----------



## Mr. H. (Mar 28, 2013)

editec said:


> All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.
> 
> Most of it will be shipped overseas. m
> 
> Unless you own stock in those companies this fracking does you no good.



Seriously out of the loop.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > I think the inability to drink their own water might be more of an issue than jealousy.
> ...



From who?


----------



## Mr. H. (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> Mr. H. said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



Exactly.


----------



## Samson (Mar 28, 2013)

editec said:


> All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.
> 
> Most of it will be shipped overseas. m
> 
> Unless you own stock in those companies this fracking does you no good.



Your opinion is really not surprising, and far from stupid, as an extraordinary number of "educated" US citizens simply have never been taught how the lights come on in their homes.

The lack of knowledge associated with such a fundamental resource as LIGHT, or Electricity can only be the fault of a much less than effective education system, which emphasizes social studies: Everyone knows why Jimmy has two daddies, but almost know one knows why the TV comes on or what powers the microwave.

Most are not so ignorant to have never heard of electricity: However almost no one, like yourself knows how most electricity is generated: By burning coal or natural gas. Today many coal power plants are being re-fit to burn natural gas since it is cleaner, and more efficient, and currently cost less per BTU.


----------



## Intense (Mar 28, 2013)

Lakhota said:


> I watched the documentary, Gasland, again a couple nights ago.  I still find it unbelievable that this is allowed to continue.



The Movie Gasland was exposed as fraudulent.


----------



## Intense (Mar 28, 2013)

*Moved to Environment Forum.*


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Mr. H. said:
> ...



Who do you consider a legitimate source on this issue?


----------



## zeke (Mar 28, 2013)

So sammy, what's next?

We have pumped all the easy oil. We are now down to tar sands. We have pumped the easy gas. Now we are all enthused about "fracking" the last of the natural gas.

So when we have gone through all the dirty nasty water wasting sources of cheap energy, what is next?

Do you have any idea? Or you think this gas and oil thing will just go on forever?


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Intense said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > I watched the documentary, Gasland, again a couple nights ago.  I still find it unbelievable that this is allowed to continue.
> ...



Yeah, I keep hearing that and the evidence of that is posted below:


1.


----------



## DGS49 (Mar 28, 2013)

No offense, but you people are really ignorant about this subject.

As recently as last year, the Administrator of the EPA testified before Congress that there has not been a SINGLE DOCUMENTED CASE OF GROUNDWATER CONTAMINATION BY HYDRAULIC FRACTURING in the U.S.  Ever.  But I guess she's just a Right Wing Tool, right?  Maybe she didn't see the movie, "Gasland."  Where does she get her information?  It's a puzzle, isn't it?

And natual gas IS NOT EXPORTED.  It is simply too expensive to export quantities that are sufficient to make it economically feasible, even though natural gas in Europe (mainly coming from Russia) is more than four times as expensive as it is in the U.S.  Thanks to FRACKING!

And by the way, there is just as much gas potential in Europe as there is here, but the Greens have so far prevented any significant fracking activity there out of irrational fears of environmental catastrophe.  Just like here on this thread.  Not surprisingly, the Russians are big supporters of the Green movement in Germany.

Are any of you aware that fracking wells are much safer, environmentally speaking, than oil wells, and Pennsylvania, for example has more than 50 thousand oil wells in existence right now. And yet I've never heard of a single person dying from water poisoning in Pennsylvania.  Curious, isn't it?

Sorry for getting political for a moment, but Democrats are fond of saying that Republicans simply refuse to accept "science" when it comes to "Climate Change," and yet this entire, collossally ignorant anti-fracking movement is on the political Left.  Science be damned:  I saw GASLAND, so I KNOW that fracking is dangerous and ought to be OUTLAWED.

Fucking ridiculous.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

DGS49 said:


> No offense, but you people are really ignorant about this subject.
> 
> As recently as last year, the Administrator of the EPA testified before Congress that there has not been a SINGLE DOCUMENTED CASE OF GROUNDWATER CONTAMINATION BY HYDRAULIC FRACTURING in the U.S.  Ever.  But I guess she's just a Right Wing Tool, right?  Maybe she didn't see the movie, "Gasland."  Where does she get her information?  It's a puzzle, isn't it?.



Is Fracking Safe? The Top 10 Myths About Natural Gas Drilling - Popular Mechanics



> "[THERE'S] NEVER BEEN ONE CASEDOCUMENTED CASEOF GROUNDWATER CONTAMINATION IN THE HISTORY OF THE THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF HYDRAULIC FRACTURING [WELLS]"
> 
> SEN. JAMES INHOFE, R-OKLA., APRIL 2011
> 
> ...


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Is Fracking Safe? The Top 10 Myths About Natural Gas Drilling - Popular Mechanics



> It's an iconic image, captured in the 2010 Academy Award&#8212;nominated documentary GasLand. A Colorado man holds a flame to his kitchen faucet and turns on the water. The pipes rattle and hiss, and suddenly a ball of fire erupts. It appears a damning indictment of the gas drilling nearby. But Colorado officials determined the gas wells weren't to blame; instead, the homeowner's own water well had been drilled into a naturally occurring pocket of methane. Nonetheless, up to 50 layers of natural gas can occur between the surface and deep shale formations, and methane from these shallow deposits has intruded on groundwater near fracking sites. In May, Pennsylvania officials fined Chesapeake Energy $1 million for contaminating the water supplies of 16 families in Bradford County. Because the company had not properly cemented its boreholes, gas migrated up along the outside of the well, between the rock and steel casing, into aquifers. The problem can be corrected by using stronger cement and processing casings to create a better bond, ensuring an impermeable seal.
> 
> Read more: Is Fracking Safe? The Top 10 Myths About Natural Gas Drilling - Popular Mechanics


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Well dam, I guess ppl are allergic to facts


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> There's a whole video on it called a documentary.  It's called Gasland.  If you don't believe it I'd like to see your documented and verified proof that it's not real.  It's funny because I know you don't have it so you'll come back with lip service and name calling.



I suggest that you watch the Documentary called Fracknation, made by an Irish Journalist.
It tells the real truth about Fracking.
It exposes the lies that are told by Josh Fox in Gasland.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B03IYdHpvAM]FrackNation Movie Clips - The Truth About Fracking - YouTube[/ame]
You can watch it for free online.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

great but this is about Fracking not about Josh whathisname.  I posted links to Popular Mechcanics about Fracking.


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

editec said:


> All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.
> 
> Most of it will be shipped overseas. m
> 
> Unless you own stock in those companies this fracking does you no good.



It helps our Farmers or anyone who owners their land 
They get money from the Gas Company and it helps them keep their farms running, they can afford new equipment for running their farms.
Anywhere from new milking machines to tractors.
One farmer in Pennsylvania says if he really thought that Fracking would ruin his water, it would poison his cows.
He has had fracking on his farm for years and his milk cows are fine. His water is not being contaminated.
He said he loves his land and the farm his family has run for more than 6 generations and that he would never do something to harm the land that he loves.

Above Quote is from the movie Fracknation.


----------



## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> great but this is about Fracking not about Josh whathisname.  I posted links to Popular Mechcanics about Fracking.



and Popular Mechanics is an expert on the subject because??


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> great but this is about Fracking not about Josh whathisname.  I posted links to Popular Mechcanics about Fracking.



The Documentary is about Fracking.
It is made by the people, not the environmentalists lies.
You are the one who brought up Gasland.


----------



## longknife (Mar 28, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



I would expect that someone who posts here has a reasonable knowledge of the English - or at least uses a spellcheck to try to show a degree of education. I don't mind the subject but I tend not to bother when I see something that appears to come from someone who doesn't know what they're discussing.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > great but this is about Fracking not about Josh whathisname.  I posted links to Popular Mechcanics about Fracking.
> ...



I'll ask again, who do you consider a legitimate source on this subject?  Once you dont answer the jig is up, you dont know, you just question the experts..ALL the experts


----------



## Samson (Mar 28, 2013)

zeke said:


> So sammy, what's next?
> 
> We have pumped all the easy oil. We are now down to tar sands. We have pumped the easy gas. Now we are all enthused about "fracking" the last of the natural gas.
> 
> ...



Well, you could have asked the same questions 100 years ago.

Or 30 years ago.

Or 30 years from now.

Compared to "forever" even sunlight has a short lifespan.

Let's reel in the conversation to a realistic level, because nothing will last "forever."

You asked my prediction: We will exaust our natural resources; coal, gas, oil, radioactive material. As these resources become scarce, price will increase. As price increases humans will conserve (use less) and find substitutes. This will be inadequate to sustain the present human population's activity. Populations will decline until sustainable resources can support them.


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

Speaker said:


> My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As I all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; Fracking ain't good. Poisoning America's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie Gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.




If the human race did not have oil we would be living in the dark ages.
There are over 6,000 products made from Petroleum
Here is just a partial list;
A partial list of products made from petroleum

Without oil you would not be here sitting at your computer,the Keyboard, the encasing and the monitor, all of the plastic products are made from petroleum.


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

Samson said:


> zeke said:
> 
> 
> > So sammy, what's next?
> ...




New Technology will replace the natural resources.
We have enough natural resources now for about 100 years.
I think that we will get new and just as cheap resources in about 20 or 25 years.
Even the oil companies realize that the natural sources will not last forever. They are doing many experiments looking into new cheaper resources.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

peach174 said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > great but this is about Fracking not about Josh whathisname.  I posted links to Popular Mechcanics about Fracking.
> ...



Actually I didnt, it was brought up on page 1.  What say you to Popular Mechanics?  They lying too?  They dont know more than you?  You question their motives too?  Why?  Is it a secret?


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

peach174 said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > zeke said:
> ...



says who?


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > Samson said:
> ...




Our President Obama and the Potential Gas Committee made up of engineers and geoscientists.

President Obama words at his Sate of the Union address
"We have a supply of natural gas that can last America nearly one hundred years, and my Administration will take every possible action to safely develop this energy. Experts believe this will support more than 600,000 jobs by the end of the decade"

Potential Gas Committee Report Shows Unprecedented Increase in U.S. Natural Gas Resources

Even if they are off or wrong, it still give us enought to last for another 25 or more years to develop new technology.


----------



## kwc57 (Mar 28, 2013)

speaker said:


> my question is how has fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But i think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. The human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> As i all hope you know most of these oil companies also have a connection to a media source of some kind. All they have to do is tell the world that oil/natural gas ect. Creates jobs, or is the safest energy source or is finding new, cleaner technologies ;and then we are satisfied. As you have seen on that link and the other hundreds of videos is one thing; fracking ain't good. Poisoning america's water far beyond what any living soul should encounter. If you watch the movie gasland and other videos/articles you will see. They government doesn't care for us folks. I am very sorry to say. I love my country, but not when corporations are running it. Don't rely on your senator or represenetive or _president_ too fix our problems, do it your self. Think for yourself people.



Tissue?


----------



## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



Closedcaption, since you consider Popular Mechanics an expert, just maybe you should go back and read everything they actually posted.  Most all of it states that natural gas drilling can be safe.   It even disputes the documentary Gasland. 


> Claim No. 7
> "DO NOT DRINK THIS WATER"
> 
> HANDWRITTEN SIGN IN THE DOCUMENTARY GASLAND, 2010
> ...


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

peach174 said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > peach174 said:
> ...



Why do you believe them?  (Because I want to is not a valid reason)


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > peach174 said:
> ...



I did and posted it anyway....just like a closed minded enviro-nut would, wait....

You clipped that article too, here is the rest:



> Nonetheless, up to 50 layers of natural gas can occur between the surface and deep shale formations, *and methane from these shallow deposits has intruded on groundwater near fracking sites. In May, Pennsylvania officials fined Chesapeake Energy $1 million for contaminating the water supplies of 16 families in Bradford County. Because the company had not properly cemented its boreholes, gas migrated up along the outside of the well, between the rock and steel casing, into aquifers. The problem can be corrected by using stronger cement and processing casings to create a better bond, ensuring an impermeable seal.*
> Read more: Is Fracking Safe? The Top 10 Myths About Natural Gas Drilling - Popular Mechanics



I know you werent trying to be dishonest by leaving that part out...you just forgot


----------



## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



you see, you are comparing apples to oranges here.  Chesapeake was fined for violating environmental law (unsafe practices) there - not for water being contaminated from the fracking.  Two very different animals.


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



Because I used to work at one time for those engineers and geoscientists. They are good honest men. They love America and our land. If there really was potential harm in fracking and the ruination of our land and water they would be all over it in a heart beat, at getting the word out.


----------



## Dugdale_Jukes (Mar 28, 2013)

Intense said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > I watched the documentary, Gasland, again a couple nights ago.  I still find it unbelievable that this is allowed to continue.
> ...



By whom?

What is the evidence?

There are drill sites within a few miles of my home. I caught drillers taking water from one of my streams without permission which was denied at some expense to me by due process of law. The company has made a generous offer to make me whole and assured me the "rogue" site operator has been replaced. Not fired, mind you, replaced. 

Fracking may well be necessary. Stealing my water and being filthy god damned corporate scum is not. 

No question "Gasland" is propaganda. Is it even mostly false? Probably not.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

peach174 said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > peach174 said:
> ...



I said because I want to doesnt count


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...



Your mixing up the difference between wanting and knowing.


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

peach174 said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > peach174 said:
> ...



I think we both are...you knowing them doesnt mean what they say is gospel, no more than someone knowing the ppl against fracking means what they say is true.

See both sides are saying different things.  You choose to believe one (because you know them) and not the other.  Thats fine if we were talking about gossip but we're not.

Point is, you CHOOSE to believe one and CHOOSE not to believe the other...strickly because you WANT to.  Thats why I asked why you believe them.


----------



## peach174 (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > ClosedCaption said:
> ...




I happen to believe the reports and the people, rather the an the lying environmentalists who have an agenda rather that actually facts and truth.
How do I know about the environmentalists?
Because we had to deal with them in the 90's, that involved our San Pedro River.
They were caught red handed with their outright lies and authorities caught them stocking fish in the river at night, they claimed that these fish were a native species and needed protection. The fish were never a species found here in the San Pedro River.
The species came for the north part of the state.
There is a big difference between an agenda and actual truth.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot (Mar 28, 2013)

DaGoose said:


> It's not hard to see that the Wingnuts have no problem ruining the earths resources as long as it.....
> 
> a. Doesn't affect them personally, and
> 
> ...



Making bucks is good. It creates jobs.
Where has a mess been created?


----------



## Desperado (Mar 28, 2013)

Fracking Israel

According to this article, Fracking will allow Israel will Rule the New Middle East...

Why Israel will Rule the New Middle East?


----------



## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

peach174 said:


> ClosedCaption said:
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I get it....because you want to.  Cool story, bro


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## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> peach174 said:
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so are you stating that those that you believe have no agenda? And why do you believe that?  Have any facts to back it up? Or do you believe just because you believe...


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Everyone has an agenda.  Let's look at the pros and cons and let's see if it's important

Pro: reduce pollution, increase quality of life, cleaner water and cleaner air
Cons: it's gonna cost a lot of money

If you take out any talk of hidden agendas (or guessing as it's known) the pros outweigh the cons.  I understand it's going to cost a lot but I think the cost of doing nothing would cost more, not only in money.


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## ScienceRocks (Mar 28, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
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The lefts entire case is based on lies and spin. It is one big floating croak!


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## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> Everyone has an agenda.  Let's look at the pros and cons and let's see if it's important
> 
> Pro: reduce pollution, increase quality of life, cleaner water and cleaner air
> Cons: it's gonna cost a lot of money
> ...



speaking of increasing quality of life, guess you failed to hear those bulbs that have mercury are creating a potential environmental nightmare, huh? 

Public, agencies ill-informed of risks 
As long as the mercury is contained in the bulb, CFLs are perfectly safe. But eventually, any bulbs  even CFLs  break or burn out, and most consumers simply throw them out in the trash, said Ellen Silbergeld, a professor of environmental health sciences at Johns Hopkins University and editor of the journal Environmental Research.

This is an enormous amount of mercury thats going to enter the waste stream at present with no preparation for it, she said.

Manufacturers and the EPA say broken CFLs should be handled carefully and recycled to limit dangerous vapors and the spread of mercury dust. But guidelines for how to do that can be difficult to find, as Brandy Bridges of Ellsworth, Maine, discovered.

Shining a light on fluorescent bulbs - US news - Environment | NBC News


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## Freewill (Mar 28, 2013)

Lakhota said:


> I have friends that live in fracking areas - and they ain't happy!



I would think that would be true of most of your friends.


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## Freewill (Mar 28, 2013)

editec said:


> All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.
> 
> Most of it will be shipped overseas. m
> 
> Unless you own stock in those companies this fracking does you no good.



A trade surplus does help us ALL.


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## chikenwing (Mar 28, 2013)

my question is how has fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, yet the oil companies trudge 

My question is why do you let people lie too you,and why are you so easily fooled?


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## chikenwing (Mar 28, 2013)

Freewill said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> > All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.
> ...



Land owners,small business owners,from the barbershop to the electricians,trying to dismiss the economic advantages is really low down and despicable.

You know not what you talk about.

I live right on the boarder with Pa and New York,drive into pa,and you will NOT find a single no Fracking/Drilling sign,nor will you find many real estate for sale signs,drive back into NY and you get a mixed bag on the no drill side,and many homes for sale.The people of NE Pa are not unhappy,new york is just stuck on stupid,The feel good crowd from out of state and the City think they have the right to tell what I can and can't do with my gas thet i bought and paid for,but will anyone of them shut off their gas service?? not !!!


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## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

chikenwing said:


> my question is how has fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, yet the oil companies trudge
> 
> My question is why do you let people lie too you,and why are you so easily fooled?



Care to give us the links to those millions who have had their water ruined?


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## Freewill (Mar 28, 2013)

longknife said:


> Speaker said:
> 
> 
> > My question is how has Fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, Yet the oil companies trudge on. For people who support this madness, your reason must be because it creates jobs. But I think we all know this is a corporate lie to win the hearts of the gulable. the human race can live without oil. The only people who cannot (because of there excessive greed) is the oil companies.
> ...



I can't belief you hads brought this up it shouldn't be aloud!!!


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## Freewill (Mar 28, 2013)

chikenwing said:


> Freewill said:
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I don't think you were directing this at me but if so I am all for fracking, even more so since the liberals are going ape shit over someone getting money they are not.


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## chikenwing (Mar 28, 2013)

depotoo said:


> chikenwing said:
> 
> 
> > my question is how has fracking been aloud? Millions of people have hads their water ruined, yet the oil companies trudge
> ...



You will never get that magical link,because they can't prove 1 well was contaminated let alone millions.


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## chikenwing (Mar 28, 2013)

Freewill said:


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No I didn't,and I think you are onto the real anti fracking agenda,at least here in NY it appears to be part of the equation.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 28, 2013)

Yeah I'm for fracking too just to piss off liberals!  Who needs water besides those dam libs! ....wait


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## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

chikenwing said:


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yet that was your claim.


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## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> Yeah I'm for fracking too just to piss off liberals!  Who needs water besides those dam libs! ....wait



yeah, doesn't matter that all the claims of fracking itself has caused the wells to be contaminated have been disproved...


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## chikenwing (Mar 28, 2013)

depotoo said:


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Its not a claim when its a proven fact. 

just ask the EPA see what they claim.


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## depotoo (Mar 28, 2013)

chikenwing said:


> depotoo said:
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> IN SUMMARY
> 
> EPA SUPPORTS NATURAL GAS
> 
> ...


see page 60 for the above - 
http://www.epa.gov/region6/6en/x/workshops/2012-may/presentations/mike-overbay-fracking.pdf


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## Toddsterpatriot (Mar 28, 2013)

depotoo said:


> chikenwing said:
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He was repeating the idiocy of the OP, not agreeing with it.


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## Darkwind (Mar 29, 2013)

editec said:


> All this natural gas is not going to help Americans much.
> 
> Most of it will be shipped overseas. m
> 
> Unless you own stock in those companies this fracking does you no good.


I suggest you do more research.


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## Darkwind (Mar 29, 2013)

chikenwing said:


> depotoo said:
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Millions are a proven fact you say?  Fracking has polluted millions of people's water.  Water polluted by the millions!

You have proof of course?


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## ScienceRocks (Mar 29, 2013)

polluted it with what? Mud?


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah I'm for fracking too just to piss off liberals!  Who needs water besides those dam libs! ....wait
> ...



Yeah and it also doesn't matter that I linked to Popular Mechanics that says that fracking has cause water pollution and a company had to pay a settlement for doing just that.  It also doesn't matter that your claims that it has been disproved are backed up with nothing.
I guess facts don't matter.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

If relive have it their way the pros and cons are:

Pro: we could save money 
Con: the earth will become more polluted
Pro: well have more money on hand
Con: we may have to spend that money on fixing the problems rather than preventing it.  And quality of air, water and earth can or will suffer for it

So a safe bet would be to prevent because the cost to fix COULD be much greater.


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## Mr. H. (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> If relive have it their way the pros and cons are:
> 
> Pro: we could save money
> Con: the earth will become more polluted
> ...



Who's out there "fixing" agriculture? Air, land, and water pollution are rampant in that industry. I can't stand the hypocricy of continually giving a pass to agriculture while micro-regulating the little shit. 

40% of corn acres dedicated to ethanol production - a program that has attained only one of its goals... to boost the price of grains. So much ethanol produced that we export 20% of it - NOT one of its intended goals when the program was shoved down our throats 30 years ago. 

Fracturing is a pin-prick on the environment compared to agriculture.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

Mr. H. said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
> 
> > If relive have it their way the pros and cons are:
> ...



Agriculture is a pin-prick compared to our lust for war...But both are still a problem.  Just so happen we are talking about Fracking in this thread and not agricluture.


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## racewright (Mar 29, 2013)

If you are so against oil based products --what the fuck are you doing playing on a plastic key board that is powered by oil--living in a house heated by some oil product ===why are you not living in the woods like a mountain man'''''  go home with YoKo (loko) and live in Manhattans upscale penthouse thats oil ridden--fly ya jet and ride in ya limo  what a bunch of one sided smucks.

The only thing harming the USA in reguard to Fracking is that there are thousands of average americans that could prosper from the harvesting of natural gas  that will help here famlies both now and in the future.....But no you fools will have the rest of the world get richer while the USA gets poorer (remember the celeberties who negatively talk about natural gas already have theres).

But if oil does the harm you smucks think then how come it is ok to use it as it does come out of the ground somewhere on earth--oh thats right not in my back yard


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## depotoo (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


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it did not state that fracking itself caused the pollution.  It stated that their _lack of following regulations _caused it.  A huge difference of which you wish to not see.  
Do you not realize that if the act of fracking itself had caused it they would have shut down all fracking in Pennsylvania, not just issued a fine?  Get real here.  Even your article states that fracking can be done safely.
Here you go - 
In the Bradford County problems that contributed to the million-dollar fines, the department said that *improper well casing and cementing* allowed natural gas to seep into groundwater and contaminate 16 families' drinking water wells.

Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/business/article.aspx?subjectid=49&articleid=20110518_49_E1_HARRIS80433


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## Darkwind (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


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Keep moving those goalposts when you get shot down.

You posted a single article about a single well.  There are hundreds if not thousands of wells going in.  The water is safe.  When you post a 0.0000001% issue, don't be surprised that no one is impressed with your fear mongering.

No process is perfectly safe.  To stop every process on the off chance that someones water may get polluted is the very definition of insane.  Nothing would ever be created, accomplished, or utilized.


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## peach174 (Mar 29, 2013)

Yep!
There are over 500,000 fracking wells.
He puts up one that did not follow the regulations.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

Darkwind said:


> ClosedCaption said:
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Moving the goal posts?  I talk about Fracking you started in about Agriculture...


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
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Following Regulations?



> In the Bradford County problems that contributed to the million-dollar fines, the department said that *improper well casing and cementing allowed natural gas to seep into groundwater and contaminate 16 families' drinking water wells.* The department began investigating the complaints last year. In November, it won approval of stronger well-casing and cementing rules that a top DEP official has said would have prevented the gas migration.



Improper well casting not because they didnt follow regs, they just did shoddy work.  Oh yeah, here in your own article it says 16 families were affected in this case...moving on

In your own article it says the well were completed improperly not that they didnt follow regulations.  Also, they are fighting to get more regulators to inspect (from your article)



> In December, the agency announced a settlement with Houston-based Cabot Oil & Gas Corp. to pay $4.1 million to residents in the northern Pennsylvania town of Dimock where private water wells were also contaminated with methane gas. Cabot agreed to pay the state $500,000.



More than one guy, correct?  More than one well, correct?  



> In 2010, it was also one of Pennsylvania's most-penalized Marcellus Shale drillers, with 134 violations and 25 enforcements, state records show.



So it's more than 1 well...But lets be foreal, you dont care how many violations it is...You support it no matter what


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## Samson (Mar 29, 2013)

peach174 said:


> Yep!
> There are over 500,000 fracking wells.
> He puts up one that did not follow the regulations.



When was the last time someone hijacked an oil well and killed 3000 Americans?

Perhaps we should Ban Air Travel?


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## peach174 (Mar 29, 2013)

What have we got to replace it with that does not cost us up the ying yang to use?

The Technology will be found and in the meantime we use the cheapest that we can get and yes there is going to be some accidents and some pollution but not massive amounts.
Getting people jobs is much more important right now.

Natural Gas is the cleanest we have right now to use.


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## racewright (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> depotoo said:
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We better not catch you driving or flying or heating your home with any oil products---Just swim to were you wish to go and make sure you do not use a rubber based wet suit---Moron.


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## longknife (Mar 29, 2013)

*Ernest Moniz and Fracking Drive Environmentalists Off of the Rails* 

By Robert H. Nelson  |  Posted: Thu. March 28, 2013, 12:54pm PT
Also published in Forbes on Tue. 



> Many environmentalists are unhappy about President Barack Obama&#8217;s nomination of Ernest Moniz, a professor of physics and engineering at MIT, to be Secretary of Energy.
> 
> As Director of the MIT Energy Initiative, Moniz assembled an all-star cast of MIT physical and social scientists to produce a June 2011 report that pointed to natural gas as an abundant, low-cost energy source that could sustain much of the world&#8217;s energy needs over the next several decades while we transition to wind, solar, tidal, geothermal and other carbon-free energy sources. It would also offer large environmental benefits because gas emits few conventional pollutants, and only about half as much carbon dioxide as the main transitional alternative: continued coal burning.
> 
> Implicit in the MIT vision was an understanding that shale gas development, using the technology known as &#8220;fracking,&#8221; should and will occur on a global scale. While a few groups such as the Environmental Defense Fund have been supportive, this is unacceptable to many others in the environmental movement. *So they are striking out to discredit Professor Moniz, his views, and the additional large body of academic research and practical experience proving the efficacy and safety of fracking.*



[emphasis added by me]

Read more @ Ernest Moniz and Fracking Drive Environmentalists Off of the Rails: Newsroom: The Independent Institute


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

Funny things happen when you post facts...ppl run


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## Toddsterpatriot (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> Funny things happen when you post facts...ppl run



But enough about you.....


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## Samson (Mar 29, 2013)

peach174 said:


> What have we got to replace it with that does not cost us up the ying yang to use?
> 
> The Technology will be found and in the meantime we use the cheapest that we can get and yes there is going to be some accidents and some pollution but not massive amounts.
> Getting people jobs is much more important right now.
> ...



Actually, the question would be simpler: What do we have to replace fossil fuels, regardless of cost?

Nothing.

But this is what "Peak Oil" seems to be based upon: Fossil fuels will suddenly disappear and human populations will be thrown into some sort of apocolyptical chaos. While this allows for idiotic imaginations to run wild, you need to completely divorce yourself from any rational judgement. This not a high hurdle for many in the anti-natural resources development community.


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## depotoo (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> depotoo said:
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Seriously?  16 families vs. your claim of millions? 
Seriously?  By not completely properly they were not following regulations.  
The object of fracking properly itself had nothing to do with the failure.


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## ClosedCaption (Mar 29, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
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Whoa whoa there, that was the *OP that claimed Millions.* 
The number doesnt matter...First it was "one family" and everyone said big whoop
It was one spill - Big deal
More than one spill - Still small, get over it
More than one family - Who cares
Your family - Wait a damn minute!  Something needs to be done!
Spilled on your land - HEY!!  THIS IS A PROBLEM GOTTDAMMIT!

The number doesnt matter, even if it was millions as long as you arent one of the millions its not a big deal...Water travels tho.  

Second point, no need to argue lets call them regulations...we can call it apple pie but thats not the point that we disagree on.


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## depotoo (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> depotoo said:
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So ,according to your logic, if a specific beef packing company has a lot (not alot) of tainted beef  due to their not following regulations properly that is sold and that company must pull their beef the others should as well as you never know when they may have tainted beef because they might not follow all regulations either.  Makes no sense at all.


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## chikenwing (Mar 29, 2013)

Cabot did NOT contaminate any wells in Dimick  Pa,they did pay for testing and for bottled water and what some would call extortion ,but at the end of the day,all investigations resulted in NO contamination from drilling,the gas and other stuff was already there. I work with people that live there what really was going was some people just wanted more money,and this is how they went about it.

Propaganda and out right lies are rampant from the no drill crowd.


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## thereisnospoon (Mar 29, 2013)

DaGoose said:


> It's not hard to see that the Wingnuts have no problem ruining the earths resources as long as it.....
> 
> a. Doesn't affect them personally, and
> 
> ...



Stop crying alligator tears.


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## ScienceRocks (Mar 29, 2013)

ClosedCaption said:


> Funny things happen when you post facts...ppl run



You must be joking? Wind and solar only works when there's wind or sun. 

We need fracking to run our civilization. You do know what a civilization is?


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## Mr. H. (Mar 30, 2013)

Hydraulic fracturing is ok. EPA said as much. 
Get over yourselves. And get the fuck out.


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## waltky (Apr 6, 2013)

Mr. H wrote: _(and that's a big butt)..._

... caught one o' Uncle Ferd's g/f's...

... readin' inna forum, did ya?


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## jon_berzerk (Apr 6, 2013)

Samson said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> > What have we got to replace it with that does not cost us up the ying yang to use?
> ...



how many hours per day 

or how days a month is anyone willing to go 

without electricity 

the alternative green energies 

do not have the ability to compensate for demand usage

like when it is really hot  or really cold 

if we drop using fossil fuels 

that is a question to be asked 

and answered


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## editec (Apr 6, 2013)

They'll keep fracking until there isn't a clean source of groundwater anywhere in America.

They cannot help themselves. They're sick, sick people.

Greed is a mental disease.

And this in world's leadership classes, it's a pandemic.


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## Mr. H. (Apr 6, 2013)

editec said:


> They'll keep fracking until there isn't a clean source of groundwater anywhere in America.
> 
> They cannot help themselves. They're sick, sick people.
> 
> ...



Like the greed you feel as you're driving down the highway, or heating your home?

From NPR, of all sources...

Waterless Fracking Makes Headway in Texas, Slowly | StateImpact Texas


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## peach174 (Apr 6, 2013)

Fracking has been around for 60 years.
If it really did contaminate ground water, we would already not have any clean groundwater.

I think it's greed when the left want to push high priced fuel, so that our poor and middle class can not afford to heat their homes.


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## Toddsterpatriot (Apr 6, 2013)

editec said:


> They'll keep fracking until there isn't a clean source of groundwater anywhere in America.
> 
> They cannot help themselves. They're sick, sick people.
> 
> ...



People who want to feed their kids and heat their homes are greedy and must be stopped!


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## freedombecki (Apr 6, 2013)

jon_berzerk said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > peach174 said:
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None. I don't use an electric can opener or the garbage compactor. That's my contribution. People should save all they can, but use what they need. I think lights improve people's spirits and warmth in winter helps prevent serious bouts bronchitis and pneumonia in people with chronic immune diseases like diabetes, arthritis, MS, COPD, fibromyalgia, and cancer.


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## waltky (Apr 8, 2013)

Toddster wrote: _People who want to feed their kids and heat their homes are greedy and must be stopped!_

possum thinks ya been fooled again.


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## Mr. H. (Apr 8, 2013)

waltky said:


> Toddster wrote: _People who want to feed their kids and heat their homes are greedy and must be stopped!_
> 
> possum thinks ya been fooled again.



Wouldn't it be easier just to click the "Quote" button?


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## ClosedCaption (Apr 8, 2013)

peach174 said:


> Fracking has been around for 60 years.
> *If it really did contaminate ground water, we would already not have any clean groundwater.*
> 
> I think it's greed when the left want to push high priced fuel, so that our poor and middle class can not afford to heat their homes.



According to who?  "Cause I said so" Magazine?


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## ClosedCaption (Apr 8, 2013)

depotoo said:


> ClosedCaption said:
> 
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Lets stick with the fracking topic since I've proved you wrong already...actually, if you read your own article before posting it you wouldn't have proven yourself wrong.

It was no spills, no families affected....Its several spills and 16 families in that one area affected.  Change your mind, nope.  You're for it and the number of ppl it affects is just an excuse you use and change.  Noone affected, ok just one guy...Ok, ok Around 10 big deal!....16 Families...yeah, but just 16 tho.

No number matters when an excuse is all you have


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