# It’s time we stop calling China a communist country



## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

*com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*

n.
A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
*fasc•ism făsh′ĭz″əm*
*►*


n.
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, a capitalist economy subject to stringent governmental controls, violent suppression of the opposition, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism. 


Now, which of these definitions is more fitting to what China actually is. They have a free market system, but business are beholden to the government. Whatever the party says goes. If the party tells them to install spyware into the computer chips they manufacture, they do so. Opposition to the party is disappeared. 2 million Muslims are in concentration camps and forcibly sterilized by the party. China believes it was the 1st empire and its going to “take its place” as the dominant empire of the world...Like I said, it’s time to stop calling China a communist country.


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## Rambunctious (Jul 7, 2020)

But ANTIFA loves China.....


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## BluesLegend (Jul 7, 2020)

I'll just continue calling them the ChiComs


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## theHawk (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...


Communism is when the state literally owns much of the industries, which in China’s case it does.

Fascism allows private ownership of companies, but the government abuses its authority and forces the private companies to do their bidding.  Like a legitimized mafia.  For example, when the Hussein rounded up all the health insurance companies and told them “this is how its going to happen” and forced ObamaCare on them.  In America we don’t have a free market healthcare system, it is straight up fascist.


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## Missouri_Mike (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...


That’s some fine hair splitting you have going on here.


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## Bootney Lee Farnsworth (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...


It's a mix.

It's a system of government marked by centralization of authority in which the state plans and controls a capitalist economy subject to stringent governmental controls, and a single, authoritarian party holding power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order.

They are Fascist Commies.


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

theHawk said:


> sakinago said:
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They don’t, they are capitalist. Not a very free market but neither was nazi germany. People do privately own the businesses there. But when the party calls their number, their business will answer. This is why they haven’t collapsed and can actually produce, feed their population, and be somewhat innovative (just like Germany), even though they’re stealing most of the tech they’re producing. They paved the way on 5G. They beat us to ultra-hypersonic missiles. They’re making submersible battleships. They’re starting to spread their innovative wings.


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## Likkmee (Jul 7, 2020)

BluesLegend said:


> I'll just continue calling them the ChiComs


Thats cool because any computer you type on is a Chi-com.


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## TheGreatSatan (Jul 7, 2020)

BluesLegend said:


> I'll just continue calling them the ChiComs


Or Chinese Democrat party


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## theHawk (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> theHawk said:
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They are not capitalists.  They are communists.  The government owns nearly all important sectors of business: banking, energy, construction, communications, etc.

Sure, there are “privately owned” businesses, but they can be taken over by the government if it wishes.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...


I agree whole heartedly but fools have to have their new iphones


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

theHawk said:


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That’s exactly how nazi germany worked too. And there’s a fuck ton more privately owned business in China per capita than there was in nazi germany. Communism and fascism are very similar. Ones just slightly less arrogant and slightly less narcissistic in that they realize they can’t control the production and distribution of everything (which leads to starving masses fields of bodies that didn’t tow the party line, which is exactly what happened when China was an actual communist country).


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## Sunsettommy (Jul 7, 2020)

China is NOT a true Communist nation, just as the CCCP was never a true communist nation either, they were actually Nationalist Socialists state.

If you read the Communist Manifesto, you will see that never has a true Communist state ever existed.


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

Missouri_Mike said:


> sakinago said:
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No it’s an important distinction in today’s world, not so much in the overall big picture of political definitions since communism and fascism are extremely similar. Why I say it’s important is because do you think businesses and organizations like the NBA are going to continue to bend the knee to a country that’s PROPERLY labeled a fascist country? The answer is no. People barely consider it a communist country because it really hasn’t been for 30 years. Even if it was communism is no longer seen as the evil it should be. Fascism on the other hand is seen as the ultimate evil.

China is even aggressively expanding and building up their military, just like 1930s nazi Germany. Look at Hong Kong. Look at the South China Sea. Look at how they claim Taiwan is their rightful territory. What the fuck is the point of teaching the history of the nazis when we don’t recognize when that history is beginning to rhyme?


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

Sunsettommy said:


> China is NOT a true Communist nation, just as the CCCP was never a true communist nation either, they were actually Nationalist Socialists state.
> 
> If you read the Communist Manifesto, you will see that never has a true Communist state ever existed.


Yeah because the communist manifesto was such a dumb and impractical idea that lead to the death of hundreds of millions. Even Marx said the only way to get to true communism is to work your way there with a socialist country.


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## Muhammed (Jul 7, 2020)

Bootney Lee Farnsworth said:


> sakinago said:
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All commies are fascists.


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## daveman (Jul 7, 2020)

Bootney Lee Farnsworth said:


> sakinago said:
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The American left's desired end state.


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## Muhammed (Jul 7, 2020)

theHawk said:


> sakinago said:
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They are communist/socialist, but since communism/socialism is not really a feasible economic system they have created Special Economic Zones in order to siphon wealth, jobs and technology from western liberal democracies.


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## daveman (Jul 7, 2020)

Muhammed said:


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With the help and encouragement of American Democrats.


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## Andylusion (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...



Yeah it's no longer a strict communist country.  They have limited free markets in specific locations.

They still hold 100% power of the communist party.


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## night_son (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...



Thanks. Whatever they are they're a fascinating if not terrifying contained dichotomy of a civilization.


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## Death Angel (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> They don’t, they are capitalist


Sorry, NO!


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## Death Angel (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> That’s exactly how nazi germany worked too.


Nazi Germany wasnt capitalist either


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## Mac-7 (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...


In practical terms  I agree with your premise.

but communism and fascism are so close to each other that it makes little difference which label we use

china is not a real communist economy anymore but it still relies on a great deal of central planning


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## depotoo (Jul 7, 2020)

Governed by the Communist Party of China, the state exercises jurisdiction over 22 provinces, five autonomous regions, four direct-controlled municipalities, and the special administrative regions of Hong Kong and Macau.


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

Mac-7 said:


> sakinago said:
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I agree they’re very similar. It’s important because China is the worlds greatest threat. If we correctly start labeling them as fascist, do you think companies and organizations like the NBA will continue to bend the knee to a fascist country? The nazis and fascist have been so thoroughly vilified that the NBA would be crazy to continue to dance to a fascist countries tune. Communism does not get the vilification it deserves for sure.


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

Death Angel said:


> sakinago said:
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They were fascist though, correct?


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## Rye Catcher (Jul 7, 2020)

It seems many of the posters above missed taking Poli Sci 102 before they dropped out of High School, or Middle School.  The ignorance above is _exceptional._


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## eagle7-31 (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...


Tell that to the people of Hong Kong. China is a one party dictatorship. End of story.


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

eagle7-31 said:


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Germany wasn’t? Italy wasn’t?


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## eagle7-31 (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


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Under Hitler and Mussolini yes they were dictatorships as well.


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## sakinago (Jul 7, 2020)

eagle7-31 said:


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And both fascist yes?


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## eagle7-31 (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


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Yes and China is communist. Like I said before ask the people in Hong Kong about the communist Chinese.


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## Pete7469 (Jul 7, 2020)

Rambunctious said:


> But ANTIFA loves China.....






Queen antifa's minions do as they're told, they believe what they're told is true by their masters. Leftism is a cult. For now they do indeed support china, and this covid hoax is nothing more than a distraction from Hong Kong, Epstein, the failed ridiculous impeachment, and an opportunity to destroy our economy. The objective of the marxists is a global collectivist government and china will be used to further that end, but the results will make Mao's purges look like a German beer fart.

The elites have made it perfectly clear they want the population cut by 92%, in other words they want to liquidate 7.2 billion people.

.


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## 9thIDdoc (Jul 7, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...







__





						Notebooks of Lazarus Long
					





					www.angelfire.com
				




Political tags--such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and. so forth--are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire. The former are idealists acting from highest motives for the greatest good of the greatest number. The latter are surly curmudgeons, suspicious and lacking in altruism. But they are more comfortable neighbors than the other sort. 

Any government will work if authority and responsibility are equal and coordinate. This does not insure “good” government; it simply insures that it will work. But such governments are rare--most people want to run things but want no part of the blame. This used to be called the “backseat-driver syndrome.”


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## Tom Paine 1949 (Jul 7, 2020)

I think this is an important, if theoretical, question. I disagree with everybody’s comments above. History provides examples of many forms of “dictatorships,” and the history of 20th century “communist” and “fascist” movements, parties and states don’t exhaust 21st century possibilities. The same can be said of 20th and 21st century “democracies.” The connection between failed democracies that ended in fascist or communist dictatorships, and failed dictatorships that evolved into “democracies” are also important to understand. A fixed definition of present day China as either “Communist” or “Fascist” necessarily misunderstands Chinese reality and potential. Calling the U.S. a “stable democracy” equally misses key aspects of U.S. reality.

Adding in the question of “Is it capitalist?” or “Is it belligerent?” doesn’t help much. The U.S. is capitalist. But it has changed mightily in the last 200 years. China has changed far more in real terms over 75 years than we have over two centuries.

I would suggest that the Chinese experiment in modernization is hardly complete. For the time being, it is probably best to understand China as an authoritarian bureaucratic state capitalist system. Call it “Capitalism with Chinese characteristics” if you will — remembering that China has thousands of years of culture during which the model of good government was central imperial rule moderated and administered by a more or less “meritocratic” Confucian bureaucracy.

Chinese “democracy” — if it comes — will almost certainly not look much like “U.S. democracy.” China’s present repressive course under Xi is not politically fated to lead anywhere in particular. A great deal depends of how the U.S reacts to the challenge of China’s economic rise and it’s own loss of primacy. The “Thucydides Trap” of rising and falling empires, geo-politics, culture and demographics, these will also determine how this process works out in the end.


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## Mac-7 (Jul 8, 2020)

sakinago said:


> If we correctly start labeling them as fascist, do you think companies and organizations like the NBA will continue to bend the knee to a fascist country?


I think businesses will ignore labels such as communist or fascist for the sake of their bottom line

potentially china could be a bigger market for the NBA than America

and with a product that china cant steal or clone

but thats just one “company” so to speak

the other companies are run by CEOs who simply dont give a damn about America and have no loyalty whatsoever


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## Unkotare (Jul 9, 2020)

It's a corrupt totalitarian state with a capitalism-based economy subject to government control in any way and at any time the CCP deems it necessary. A small portion of the population has made an enormous amount of personal wealth, but that is subject to government fiat. That's one reason why so many people who do manage to amass a significant amount of money get the hell out of Dodge at the first opportunity.


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## Mindful (Jul 15, 2020)

sakinago said:


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You trust them, after their reneging on the Hong Kong deal?

Looks like capitalism, but it  isn’t.

The tentacles of the Chinese Communist State are everywhere.


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## Mindful (Jul 15, 2020)

Mac-7 said:


> sakinago said:
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They're manoeuvring into real estate now.


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## sakinago (Jul 15, 2020)

Mindful said:


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No of course not I don’t trust them.


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## Mac-7 (Jul 15, 2020)

Mindful said:


> They're manoeuvring into real estate now.


Its a funny thing about china

liberals in America have more faith in the chinese communist government than the chinese do

I think much of the real estate investment in democratic nations is by individual chinese who are desperate to put their wealth beyond the reach of the Xi dictatorship


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## Bob Blaylock (Jul 15, 2020)

sakinago said:


> *com•mu•nism kŏm′yə-nĭz″əm*
> 
> n.
> A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single, often authoritarian party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.
> ...



  Marx described and defined Communism, not only according to how he thought a Communist society would be governed, but about the process by which Communism would take hold, displacing the more traditional forms of government that he wanted to eradicate.  He defined how he thought transitions into Communism would begin, and how they would progress toward the sort of society that he envisioned.

  It turns out that he made many assumptions about human and social behavior that turned out to be outrageously wrong.

  Everywhere that a nation has tried to transition to Communism, the movement failed to progress in the manner that Marx envisioned, and eventually led to a disastrous tyranny, based on principles that Marx described, but producing very different results than he expected.

  The excuse is always being made, by those who still foolishly defend Communism, that Communism has never really been tried, because every attempt to implement it has gone badly astray; as if by now, any sane person ought to consider there to be any possibility that an attempt could yet be made to implement Communism, that would go the way Marx meant for it to go.  The cliché that defines insanity as doing what has been done before, and expecting a different results, seems apropos here.


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## daveman (Jul 15, 2020)

Bob Blaylock said:


> sakinago said:
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## EvilCat Breath (Jul 18, 2020)

Rambunctious said:


> But ANTIFA loves China.....


Biden loves China. He quotes Mao.


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