# Qaddafi and sons leave libya



## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

From the Huffington Post:



> Embattled Libyan leader Moammar Gaddafi may be preparing to flee the country within days, according to NBC News.
> 
> U.S. officials told NBC that intelligence reports suggest Gaddafi is in the process of making plans to evacuate from Libya with his family. The reports indicate he may be headed to Tunisia, where it is possible he will be granted exile.
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Good news. Probably easier pickings in Tunisia. My bet is he doesn't live to long after settling in..


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## California Girl (Aug 19, 2011)

So speculation is 'news' now? 

Interesting concept.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

Well if it doesn't happen..

My bad.

I also speculated about the "US government official" that killed 2 men in Lahore. I said he was a spook before any other news agency even picked up on that.

How'd that turn out..


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## Toro (Aug 19, 2011)

Here's hoping.


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## California Girl (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> Well if it doesn't happen..
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> My bad.
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Well, nothing like taking credit for other people's speculation. You're nothing if not an idiot. You didn't speculate about this - someone else did - as have a variety of others. But it's hardly 'good news' because it hasn't actually happened. 

See how that works? News is what actually happens. Speculation is what might - or might not - happen. It doesn't take a rocket scientist intellect to speculate that Gadaffi is in serious shit - or that he's likely to be gone shortly. But it ain't 'good news' until it's actually 'news'.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Sallow said:
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Second post in the thread...and an insult.

That's a record..for you.

Lets try to beat it next time.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

Toro said:


> Here's hoping.



My ultimate hope for this asshole is a dirt nap.

I don't know how anyone defends someone who authored the deaths of over 200 people most of which were American.


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## California Girl (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


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I'm speculating.  Based on your own thread title... and your 'good news' which, upon even basic examination is not actually news. 

You provide me the evidence of idiocy. All I did was state the obvious. It it's insulting, that's your problem. You've called me a racist and a Nazi - just for the craic of it so don't get all hissy about it now, moron.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 19, 2011)

My question is, how did the war change from a stalemate to Qadaffi being cut off in Tripoli? 

I guess the MSM was too busy paying attention to Ames... 

I'm not sure if this IS a good thing.  The people we're backing have links to Al Qaeda, and overall, a street level Islamist middle East is not going to be friendlier to the US.  

Qadaffi was an asshole, but he was an asshole we could live with.  Who knows what these other jokers are going to be like.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


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Gee maybe you are catching on to the reality of Cali Girl who hates cali and is no longer a girl even though she acts like a petulant teenager.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

California Girl said:


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Third post..second insult.


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## iamwhatiseem (Aug 19, 2011)

Why do we care? Other than it stops the monetary bleeding of this administration of course.
Even if Gaddafi does leave...whoever takes his place will likely be about the same - or maybe even worse.


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## MeBelle (Aug 19, 2011)

Geez, talk about a pile on!

Whatever happened to civility?


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


> My question is, how did the war change from a stalemate to Qadaffi being cut off in Tripoli?
> 
> I guess the MSM was too busy paying attention to Ames...
> 
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Oh really?

He authored Lockerbie. He's a fucking terrorist.

Not someone to live with.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Why do we care? Other than it stops the monetary bleeding of this administration of course.
> Even if Gaddafi does leave...whoever takes his place will likely be about the same - or maybe even worse.



You may not care when a terrorist kills Americans..but I do.

There's only one answer.

For people who scream "Never forget" about 9/11 you sure do alot of forgetting.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 19, 2011)

Its was merely a slogan they will dump any previous postion for political gain except tax cuts.


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## High_Gravity (Aug 19, 2011)

I won't believe it until it happens, they been saying Gaddafi has been trying to leave for months now and than Gaddafi always turns around and says he is going to die in his country.


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## High_Gravity (Aug 19, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


> My question is, how did the war change from a stalemate to Qadaffi being cut off in Tripoli?
> 
> I guess the MSM was too busy paying attention to Ames...
> 
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I agree with you, we knew what we were getting with Gaddafi, with these rebels its all question marks.


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## High_Gravity (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> JoeB131 said:
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> > My question is, how did the war change from a stalemate to Qadaffi being cut off in Tripoli?
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I understand your anger however before all this happened Gaddafi paid reparations to the victims of the Lockerbie bombing, renounced terrorism and his WMD program, helped us track Al Qaeda agents in the region and re-established diplomatic relations with the US and the West, we took Libya off of the state terror list and he was playing ball.


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## FuelRod (Aug 19, 2011)

He'll live out the rest of his days somewhere in South America with Elvis, Jim Morrison and others.


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## editec (Aug 19, 2011)

Wonder if he's planning on taking the 144 metric tonnes of gold with him?


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## iamwhatiseem (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> iamwhatiseem said:
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Pheh...seriously? 
Saudi Arabia has more to do with terrorism than Gaddafi ever dreamed of.
If that is the reason to dethrone Gaddafi...then that is sorta like convicting the guy who made bullets for murder while leaving the guy who shot the gun alone.
If the reason is to protect "innocent civilians"...pheh on that too.
Syria is killing more innocent people than Gaddafi...yet...we do nothing.

Keep right on excusing Obama for opening a new theater of war for questionable reasons...with end results that are overwhelmingly unknown and possible worse.


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## iamwhatiseem (Aug 19, 2011)

And BTW Sallow...as for this line..





> _You may not care when a terrorist kills Americans..but I do._


Bad form and a cheap shot. 
I have received more than one PM asking why do I give Sallow a break...I always tell them I see actual intelligence with this one, and maybe he will outgrow his youthful lack of insight...but when you make post like this - it makes me rethink that line of thought.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


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I personally don't care if Obama had a gay affair with Gaddafi.

Gaddafi's in serious need of a 2 to the Chest and one to the head.

I think my posts make it clear I don't give a fuck if it's a "friendly" terrorist or not.

You kill Americans You die.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

iamwhatiseem said:


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What makes you think I am a fan of the Saudis or the Syrians?


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## High_Gravity (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


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Gaddafi is an asshole and I won't shed any tears if he goes down however there are alot of question marks about these rebels and what kind of government they will form, could very well be another Islamic theocracy as many of these rebels have Islamic militant backgrounds.


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## Truthseeker420 (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> From the Huffington Post:
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Bet News I have heard in a while. can anyone confirm this?


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

iamwhatiseem said:


> And BTW Sallow...as for this line..
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My bad.

Didn't mean to attack you personally..but as I am from NYC and as Terrorism has affected me in a very personal way..I get a little hot headed about it.

My apologies.


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## Truthseeker420 (Aug 19, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


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There is always that question. But the great people of Libya deserve better.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


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The Arab League, China and Russia as well as Europe signed on to this Military action.

That's a very real coalition of the willing. And it got through the UN.

If the world didn't think that Gaddafi was a threat..this would not be happening.

The only real criticism I hear is from our own Country.

I mean really..does anyone want to be on Gaddafi's side?


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## High_Gravity (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


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I'm not on his side I'm just worried about the aftermath, the new government that props up could very well make Gaddafi look like a pussy cat.


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## Baruch Menachem (Aug 19, 2011)

from the Sydney Morning Herald, a bit more reliable than huff puff.



> Libyan rebels sense victory amid talk of Gaddafi exit
> Libya
> August 20, 2011
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the reality for most of this Arab Spring is most of the new Regimes have been more batshit than the old regimes.  I don't want a continuation of Qadaffi, but I don't want worse either.


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## California Girl (Aug 19, 2011)

MeBelle60 said:


> Geez, talk about a pile on!
> 
> Whatever happened to civility?



Oh, I do apologize. I really should be more accepting of fucking assholes who call me a Nazi lovin' racist just for the craic of it. My bad.


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## California Girl (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> iamwhatiseem said:
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Terrorism has affected lots of us in a very personal way. But please don't let reality get in the way of your victimhood.


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## Truthseeker420 (Aug 19, 2011)

> My bad.
> 
> Didn't mean to attack you personally..but as I am from NYC and as Terrorism has affected me in a very personal way..I get a little hot headed about it.
> 
> My apologies.



What part. I was just in Brooklyn.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

Truthseeker420 said:


> > My bad.
> >
> > Didn't mean to attack you personally..but as I am from NYC and as Terrorism has affected me in a very personal way..I get a little hot headed about it.
> >
> ...



Use to work for the NYSE. Lots of our people were in the Building when the attack happened. We saw debris on our side as well.

My ex-wife was working in the WTC during the first attack. Luckily she got out with a little smoke damage on her clothes.


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## iamwhatiseem (Aug 19, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


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And therein lies the problem to the entire Mid-Eastern theatre. 
The old empirical ways of the British and France in days long by look more and more attractive all the time. The sheer short-sightedness of the entire world in both enriching these insane nations and then supplying them with military equipment and technology is perhaps the single dumbest collective thing world leaders have done in the history of the world.
The middle-east has a history of non stop bloodshed since the dawn of man, and entire region of intolerance and bickering - and we modernized them!!
Unbelievable.


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## Truthseeker420 (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


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Damn! Glad you guys made it out okay. I heard people who suvived always qestion why they were the lucky ones,  do you feel that way or did she every relate that to you?


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## JoeB131 (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> JoeB131 said:
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> > My question is, how did the war change from a stalemate to Qadaffi being cut off in Tripoli?
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Oh, now you guys are upset about terrorists?  

Funny, I remember some liberal Grafitti from UIC back in the 1980's."Bomb the Contras, not Libia"  (Yes, they spelled it wrong! Fine Public Education Liberals, obviously.) 

 I remember liberals in the 1980's saying Lockerby was justified because Reagan had killed Khadafy's imaginary daughter in his bombing raid in response to the Berlin Disco bombing.  

But now that he's a scalp the Community Organizer can nail to his mantlepiece, you all want to kill the bastard. 

The thing is, the guys we are supporting are terrorists, too.  They are the ones who fought against our troops in Iraq before going home.


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## Trajan (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


> iamwhatiseem said:
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your knee jerkism is as usual over the top. geo-politics is mean game, yesterdays son of a bitch is tomorrows "hes our son of a bitch"...this is life. everyone plays the game. 

the sad fact is we had Qaddafi neutered, this was all BS. this was to help pimp nato as viable and pay back for mediocre sppt in Afghanistan. what io did is paint nato as exactly what it is, American funded and befuddled without our leadership, many have taken notice and this will not end happily. there's my prophecy.


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## Sallow (Aug 19, 2011)

Trajan said:


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He wasn't "neutered" at all. Just because he took his attention off the US doesn't mean he wasn't up to things. He's tried to assassinate leaders all over the Middle East. They don't like him and they want him out.

After Lockerbie..I wanted him out. 

So it's a good time to first get him out of country.

They get him off this mortal coil.

Savvy?


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## Ropey (Aug 19, 2011)

trajan said:


> the sad fact is we had qaddafi neutered, this was all bs. This was to help pimp nato as viable and pay back for mediocre sppt in afghanistan. What io did is paint nato as exactly what it is, american funded and befuddled without our leadership, many have taken notice and this will not end happily. There's my prophecy.



+2


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## Trajan (Aug 19, 2011)

Sallow said:


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

Qaddafi and Two Sons Rumored To Have Fled Libya - Ujala Sehgal, The Atlantic Wire - NationalJournal.com


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## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

Next up..Gaddafi will have Bin Laden drinks.

2 shots and a splash of water.


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## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> If true not.good for the gop.although i dont think people care.



and why is this " not good for the gop"?


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## CrusaderFrank (Aug 21, 2011)

It reminds me of when Carter got the Shah to leave Iran


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## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

CrusaderFrank said:


> It reminds me of when Carter got the Shah to leave Iran



give it time, we'll see.


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## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

and he was offered a deal last week, and if I were him, I would not believe it, give it 2 years and they will be after him and the gov. who has given him asylum will give him up. 




Under the proposal presented at negotiations in Tunisia last week, Gaddafi, 69, would escape facing the International Criminal Court in the Hague, which has issued a warrant for his arrest for crimes against humanity.

Sensing victory, the rebel National Transitional Council published a plan to hand over power to an elected assembly within a year, to draft and adopt a new constitution.

The priority for many, however, is Gaddafi's fate. Mansour Seif al-Nasr, the NTC's envoy to Paris, said rebels were willing to spare Gaddafi, his family and lieutenants from judicial retribution to prevent further bloodshed.

"Gaddafi is responsible for many crimes at home and abroad. He executed 1200 political prisoners in one night in 1996, he was behind the bombing of the Pan Am jet in 1988 over Lockerbie (which killed 270 people), he's responsible for more than 30,000 deaths," Mr Nasr said.

Deal gets dictator out to end killing | The Australian


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## BoycottTheday (Aug 21, 2011)

I thought it was only going to take a week or so.


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## Soggy in NOLA (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> If true not.good for the gop.although i dont think people care.



Whatever.


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## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

CrusaderFrank said:


> It reminds me of when Carter got the Shah to leave Iran



The shah was a terrorist?


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## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


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he terrorized his own people...did he not?


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## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> Qaddafi and Two Sons Rumored To Have Fled Libya - Ujala Sehgal, The Atlantic Wire - NationalJournal.com



It's interesting that your title states it as a fact, but the article you links says it is rumors.



> One source also indicated that Al-Jazeera wrote that Qaddafi "reportedly" left for Italy, although there is no mention of this on its Libya liveblog yet (only that a top Qaddafi aide fled to Italy)





> More recently, Engel tweeted that "Rebels themselves don't know if reports of qaddafi's departure are true. 'we hope' they say..."





> Update: Top rebel commander in west can NOT confirm Qaddafi has left, according to Engel.


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## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

How long before the GOP takes credit?  Then, if something goes wrong, it's all Obama.

Remember Bin Laden?

Remember "We got 98% of what we wanted"?

"The Godly Party of Morals" lies a lot.

The only thing they won't take is "responsibility".


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

Trajan said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
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Gary Sick - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> If true not.good for the gop.although i dont think people care.



I don't see how anyone would care one way or the other, really.  

How does Khadafy leaving Libya improve the job situation at all?  

Frankly, I could see this really backfiring on The Community Organizer if the rebels go on a spree of killing Khadafy loyalists when Tripoli falls.


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## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Another dishonest title by the mistress of dishonest thread titles.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

what is with your inability to call the president of the united states the president of the united states?


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## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> what is with your inability to call the president of the united states the president of the united states?



What is it with you that you report a rumor as fact?

Is that a left wing trait? Because shallow does the same thing.


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## WillowTree (Aug 21, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Truthmatters said:
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> > Qaddafi and Two Sons Rumored To Have Fled Libya - Ujala Sehgal, The Atlantic Wire - NationalJournal.com
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Just goes to show ya *TruthDon'tMeanShit. * donut?


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## Truthseeker420 (Aug 21, 2011)

CrusaderFrank said:


> It reminds me of when Carter got the Shah to leave Iran



How so?


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## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


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But how much credit can "The Worst Affirmative Action Hire Ever"TM really take?

The Brits and French did most of the heavy lifting in this campaign. 

The rebels are probably just as bad as Khadafy, maybe worse. A lot of them are the same guys who worked for Khadafy for the last 40 years.  There are multiple factions of the rebellion, do you think they are all going to sit down and play nice with all this oil money lying around?


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## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


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uh huh. thought so.....get back your legos...


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## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


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No, you are npt allowed to parse, iraq afghan bush failures,  libya? Obama win, and thats it, any critique is wanting him to fail.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


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they are the people of Libya.

You dont get to pick who you think qualifies for a go at Democracy.


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## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

Republicans screamed at Obama to help the Libyan Population.

Republicans screamed at Obama for helping the Libyan Population.

The operative words, "Republicans screamed at Obama".


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## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


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Any chance that you're gonna explain why you lied in the title of this thread?


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> they are the people of Libya.
> 
> You dont get to pick who you think qualifies for a go at Democracy.



And what makes you think that Libya is going to become a Democracy?

Im sure that's the intent of the Al Qaeda members in the rebels.


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## Rozman (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> what is with your inability to call the president of the united states the president of the united states?



I would take it easy here...
There are way too many Libs who to this day
don't believe W was elected not once but twice.


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


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Knowing her track record, no


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## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Avatar4321 said:


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She made the same claim about Eygpt.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

How is it a lie.

Its the subject of the article.


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## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


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None at all. She'll either keep trying to change the subject, or run away.


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## WillowTree (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Republicans screamed at Obama to help the Libyan Population.
> 
> Republicans screamed at Obama for helping the Libyan Population.
> 
> The operative words, "Republicans screamed at Obama".



I'm glad you people don't have problems helping people out. Because soon Israel is going to need our help. Soon.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

They have plenty of nukes


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## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

Trajan said:


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Savak were a nasty bunch. 

How'd you feel about the Shah? And Operation Ajax. BAU?


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> How is it a lie.
> 
> Its the subject of the article.



Rumor \= fact


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## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> How is it a lie.
> 
> Its the subject of the article.



No it's not.


> Qaddafi and Two Sons *Rumored* To Have Fled Libya



There is the subject of the article. Notice the bolded word.



> Qaddafi and sons leave libya



There is your title for this thread. What word is missing?


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## WillowTree (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> They have plenty of nukes



would you rather we help them defend themselves by conventional means or would you rather they used their nukes? Which..


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## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

WillowTree said:


> rdean said:
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9 billion in aid for their military isn't enough?


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

Its the subject of the article.

I linked to the article.


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## Truthseeker420 (Aug 21, 2011)

If he has left or not is only a matter of time. But this is good for the people of Libya.


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## del (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


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depends on who you talk to


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## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


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YOu think they are really going to have "Democracy" over there.  That Qadaffy's ex-thugs and some militant Al-Qaeda Muslims are going to suddenly magically turn into Jeffersonian Democrats?  Really?   

Did you folks on the left used to rip on Bush for this kind of magical thinking?  

Like I said earlier, I suspect the first thing that is going to happen is that they are going to slaughter those people who stayed loyal to Qadaffi, which will make the whole,"We're going to war to save lives" excuse sound a bit retarded.  They won't be able to get Libya's oil back on the market in a timely manner, which will keep the price at the pump high.


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## Wry Catcher (Aug 21, 2011)

BoycottTheday said:


> I thought it was only going to take a week or so.



You thought?  Stop with the lies!


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## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


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What is he wrong about? Or are you discounting the whole post because of the first sentence?


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> Its the subject of the article.
> 
> I linked to the article.



No it's not the subject of the article. Lying to avoid admitting that your lying doesn't help your case.

The subject of the article is a RUMOR. You keep ignoring this and attempt to misreprsent this rumor as fact.

That is a lie. You are a liar. Stop lying to yourself and to others or you will never truly learn anything


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## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> Its the subject of the article.
> 
> I linked to the article.



You made a statement, namely 'Gaddafi and sons leave Lybia'. The article is a rumor. There is nothing to substantiate your statement that they have left. 

This is why you struggle with even basic arguments. You can't tell the difference between a 'fact' and a 'rumor'.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


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I believe in Democracy.

When you do it means you believe that it is the finest form of government and can transform a society to its best behavior.

What form of government would you perfer they have?

Fascism, socialism, dictatorship?


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## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


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Grow up.


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


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Because he's right in this matter?

So why should any of us take you seriously? Ive yet to see you make a valid point on this board.


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## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Republicans screamed at Obama to help the Libyan Population.
> 
> Republicans screamed at Obama for helping the Libyan Population.
> 
> The operative words, "Republicans screamed at Obama".



And how is that any different than "Democrats screamed at Bush"?  

Hey, guy, that's in the job description.  And this is my main problem with the Community Organizer.  He whinges about how he's just not being loved like he thought he would.  He seriously needs to find Harry's old "THe Buck Stops Here" sign and put it on his desk. 

My problem with Obama was that he went at this half-heartedly.  If you commit us to taking out Qadaffi, you take out Qadaffi. You terminate Colonel Qadaffi's command the way you did Colonel Kurtz's - with extreme prejudice.  YOu don't "Lead from behind" and prolong the agony for six months, which is pretty much what happened here.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



Who really needs to grow up? The person who lies and refuses to admit it or the person speaking the truth?


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



We prefer Republics, which have a far better success rate than mobocracies.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



In other words, you can't deal with the substance in his post so you are ignoring it completely.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



The emotional response to a logical comment. You dislike anyone who holds your own dishonesty up in front of you.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



I haven't stated an opinion about you. I asked you a question of why we should take you seriously when you havent made a valid point.

You really arent in a position to challenge the credibility of someone else who is offering substantive discussion


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> JoeB131 said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



But you live in a Republic.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



It must simply be too painful for her to admit that she is lying about something for whatever reason. It damages her ego. She needs to learn that it's alright to let go of the pride and the "perfect" self image we sometimes we have of ourselves. Learning humility and looking at ourselves as we truly are help us grow. 

I dont know it makes you feel unsecure TM. But letting go of the pride voluntarily is much easier than letting life destroy you.


----------



## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> I believe in Democracy.
> 
> When you do it means you believe that it is the finest form of government and can transform a society to its best behavior.
> 
> ...



Probably like most Democrats, or republicans, for that matter, you believe in Democracy when your guy wins.  Somehow, I really doubt you looked at the 2010 midterms as "Wow, what a great day for Democracy".  Don't picture you doing that based on what I've seen of your postings here.  

I frankly don't care what kind of government the backwards, superstitious savage tribes of Libya have for themselves.  They'll still be the same backward savages they were before Qadaffi left.   We should stay out of it. We should stay out of the entire middle east. All we've managed to do is insert ourselves in their affairs, and who do you think they are going to blame when Allah doesnt' bless them with instant prosperity?  

 Many of these rebels are linked to Al Qaeda. I have a hard time wanting to get on any side of a fight when I think both sides are equally bad. 

 The only thing this conflict did is expose that NATO is a paper tiger. If it could barely impose its will on Libya (a country with less people in it than Metropolitian Chicago), an alliance with five of the richest countries on Earth, how could it really mount a defense against a real threat- Russia, China or Iran?


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > I believe in Democracy.
> ...



Again, we live in a Republic.


----------



## BoycottTheday (Aug 21, 2011)

Im sure the enemies of the West see all this "success" in Libya and tremble in fear now.

[/sarcasm]


----------



## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

JoeB131 said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > I believe in Democracy.
> ...



Believing in democracy is not believing you get your way every time.

Its not about YOUR approval of all they do.

Its about believing man can rise to his best intentions with democracy.

Light and air infused in the debate will always produce  the Better nature of mans progress.

Democracy is mans best hope, these people ( no matter how prejudice you are) are just people.


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

Trajan said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



The Shah was also installed after a CIA instigated take-over Trajan. How'd that work out 
publicly the Repubs will just mumble some incoherent babble but privately they'll be seething


----------



## WillowTree (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



not when the missiles start flying.. oh wait,, those darn Palestinians are letting loose with the missiles again izzin't they/


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



Yeah. Whats the deal w/ Avatar?


----------



## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> Believing in democracy is not believing you get your way every time.
> 
> Its not about YOUR approval of all they do.
> 
> ...



pardon my Godwins, but Hitler was democratically elected.  Democracy is not all that and a bag of chips. Some of the worst things in history have had full support of the people. oh, afterwards, they all blamed the leaders, like children who got sick after eating too much candy.   

Democracy works well if people are educated enough to understand what they are voting for. Otherwise, it's just a popularity contest, and anyone from High School remembers how valid those were.. 

These are people who mutilate their daughter's genitals so they won't shame the family by enjoying sex outside their pre-arranged marriages, who think it is perfectly acceptable to strap bombs onto their children to blow up people they don't like or don't worship the same sky pixie they do. "Democracy" isn't going to elevate them.  

_"And then, there's the noble man bullshit; that man is a noble creature that can order his own world; who needs God? Well, if there's anybody out there that can look around this demented slaughterhouse of a world we live in and tell me that man is a noble creature, believe me: That man is full of bullshit."-_ Howard Beale


----------



## Missourian (Aug 21, 2011)

*NATO succeeds!* 



Hope this isn't just a rumor.

NATO - Topic: NATO and Libya - Operation Unified Protector​


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Qaddafi and Two Sons Rumored To Have Fled Libya - Ujala Sehgal, The Atlantic Wire - NationalJournal.com
> ...



consider the source of the OP. Rumor = fact to TM


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> How is it a lie.
> 
> Its the subject of the article.



Unless you have PROOF, it is a lie.

Even a dip shit like you should be able to comprehend that.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> Its the subject of the article.
> 
> I linked to the article.



you're a lying moron.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



WHY do you ignore the preponderance of evidence that you lied?


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

It is NATO (Britain & France for the most part at this stage) led but the gains made have been a direct result of the U.S. CINC taking decisive action from the beginning of the operation.


----------



## Truthmatters (Aug 21, 2011)

why are you people so emotionally involved with finding fault in  the title of a thread.

The thread title correctly discribes the subject of the article.

I never anywhere claimed that the article was wrong and that Gaddfi was proven to have left Libya.


----------



## editec (Aug 21, 2011)

Yeah?

Did he take the nation's 144 metric tons of gold with him, too?


----------



## Kuros (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > How is it a lie.
> ...



She linked to the article.  Within the article it says 'rumors' which evolve into 'unconfirmed reports.'  

You guys are being way too harsh.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Kuros said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



But she didn't say it was a rumor in her title. She was trying to imply that they had left already.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Oh my, it seems that the statement


			
				truthmatters thread title said:
			
		

> Qaddafi and sons leave libya


was false after all.


> TRIPOLI, Libya &#8212; Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi said Sunday he will stay in Tripoli "until the end" and called on his supporters around the country to help liberate the capital from a rebel offensive.
> 
> He said in an audio message played over state television he was "afraid that Tripoli will burn" and he said he would provide weapons to supporters to fight off the rebels.



Gadhafi says he'll stay in Tripoli 'until the end' - World news - Mideast/N. Africa - msnbc.com


----------



## Liability (Aug 21, 2011)

President Obama will someday tell us the compelling and principled U.S. National interest in getting militarily involved in Libya.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 21, 2011)

Trajan said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > If true not.good for the gop.although i dont think people care.
> ...



Because it mean the new giant as Democratic war party can justify being part of killing the shit out of people... "We Won!" Lets start another war! 

They never understood the issue in the first place... If this is all true I bet we see Obama taking credit for it and running on it for 2012, that's right he will admit he played a part in it and it was a war... if that helps him gain votes lol!


----------



## bripat9643 (Aug 21, 2011)

CrusaderFrank said:


> It reminds me of when Carter got the Shah to leave Iran



Yep.  When the Taliban takes over in Libya, it won't help Obama's reelection prospects.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> It is NATO (Britain & France for the most part at this stage) led but the gains made have been a direct result of the U.S. CINC taking decisive action from the beginning of the operation.



America! FUCK YEAH! Here to save, the mother fuckin day yeah!


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> why are you people so emotionally involved with finding fault in  the title of a thread.
> 
> The thread title correctly discribes the subject of the article.
> 
> I never anywhere claimed that the article was wrong and that Gaddfi was proven to have left Libya.



Why do you ignore the preponderance of evidence that you're a lying moron?


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Republicans screamed at Obama to help the Libyan Population.
> 
> Republicans screamed at Obama for helping the Libyan Population.
> 
> The operative words, "Republicans screamed at Obama".



lots of Democrats also screamed at Obama to help the Libyan Population.

lots of Democrats also screamed at Obama for helping the Libyan Population.

The operative words,Dean did not mention this......


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> why are you people so emotionally involved with finding fault in  the title of a thread.
> 
> The thread title correctly discribes the subject of the article.
> 
> I never anywhere claimed that the article was wrong and that Gaddfi was proven to have left Libya.



Man, you are dumb. Your title implies that Gaddafi and his sons have left Libya. That is not true. It is a rumor. You misrepresented the information in the article. You are a disingenuous little critter.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> Avorysuds said:
> 
> 
> > Trajan said:
> ...



The 'victors' in this instance are the Libyan people.... not your fucking Messiah, you moron. Honestly, "you people" (the morons of the left) never tire of trying to steal what belongs to other people.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

Obama has made it clear that we're not really involved beyond a support roll. So will he try to take credit for what all the other countries have done on the front lines? His words not mine. And who deserves the credit? 

Meanwhile Syrian civilians are dying by the thousands under the boot of their tyrant.


----------



## Common_Tater (Aug 21, 2011)

Obama will rejoice as he did when the Muslims took over Egypt.  He'll rejoice because the Muslims will then be in control of Libya as well.  I am ashamed of our president.


----------



## Patrick2 (Aug 21, 2011)

He won't do anything in particular.  Except for apology tours, foreign affairs aren't his thing.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

Who wants to bet if they catch or kill mumar (the rebels that is) Obama will break into tv programs to claim success. As if average Americans give a shit. He is clueless and desperate to raise his ratings. That's a dangerous combination.


----------



## gautama (Aug 21, 2011)

Trajan said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



Nothing compared to what the fucking Khomeini and the ensuing Mullah Theocracy did.

In Realpolitik, the Shah was clearly a better alternative.

Not only for Iran ...... but for us, and the peace in the Mid East.

No question about that.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

So, since Gaddafi's son has been captured.... I'm guessing he hadn't left Libya.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Who wants to bet if they catch or kill mumar (the rebels that is) Obama will break into tv programs to claim success. As if average Americans give a shit. He is clueless and desperate to raise his ratings. That's a dangerous combination.



I agree, Obama has gone the Bush route x10. He is starting wars left and right in hopes that something sticks and his base will get behind him. People like Zona/RW/Shaman/TM and a few others love Obama killing people in the ME but most of America is not taking to that idea very well.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Oh, and Tipoli has fallen to the rebels.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > Avorysuds said:
> ...



I think it would be rather difficult for Obama to claim credit for anything in Libya, when we had no boot on the ground. However, I don't put it past his supporters to heap the credit onto him.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

When? 

It's happening live on tv right now.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

It's on Fox. Bsnbc as usual is lagging behind. Showing some bullshit reruns


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

If Bush was bombing Libya so the Europeans could get cheaper oil from Libya, then the left-wing trash would be screaming No Blood for Oil.

The Europeans only care about Libya because of BP's oil interests there, Syria has had more people killed by their leaders the past 30 years but not a peep about bombing them.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

If he cuts short his vacation for this but not for American problems it will be telling.


----------



## BoycottTheday (Aug 21, 2011)

And now everyone will forget about the place, although it will be hell for those who stay.

The media will give Obama credit, even though everyone has said he wasnt doing anything

The war was France's fault,the victory Obama's.

 Now on to the next crises so what Obama is really doing continues to go unreported.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> So, since Gaddafi's son has been captured.... I'm guessing he hadn't left Libya.



But TruthNeverMatters said he left with his dad. 

Maybe he decided to go back. Yeah, that's the ticket.


----------



## Warrior102 (Aug 21, 2011)

Did Obama get him from a golf cart, via cell phone, on some fucking golf course in Martha's Vineyard? Or was he cowering behind a TV monitor in a bunker with Hillary and Biden, like when OBL was taken out by the U.S. Navy ?


----------



## WillowTree (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Oh, and Tipoli has fallen to the rebels.



Then it's time to get the hell outta dodge.. yep..


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

GoneBezerk said:


> If Bush was bombing Libya so the Europeans could get cheaper oil from Libya, then the left-wing trash would be screaming No Blood for Oil.
> 
> The Europeans only care about Libya because of BP's oil interests there, Syria has had more people killed by their leaders the past 30 years but not a peep about bombing them.



I'm still wondering where all my $1.00 gas is. You know, the gas I was supposed to get from our 'blood for oil' thingy in Iraq? Last time I checked, I was paying $1.70 a gallon before the Iraq war. 

What up with dat?


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > So, since Gaddafi's son has been captured.... I'm guessing he hadn't left Libya.
> ...



As usual.. the little bitch lied.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

Oh...Bush from Texas and Cheney from Wyoming are controlling the price of gas from their top secret bunkers that even Obama doesn't know about. 



Conservative said:


> GoneBezerk said:
> 
> 
> > If Bush was bombing Libya so the Europeans could get cheaper oil from Libya, then the left-wing trash would be screaming No Blood for Oil.
> ...


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Aug 21, 2011)

Go on vacation?


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

I'm really pretty shocked that nobody really remembers this asshole, Gaddafi, was the author of Lockerbie.

No terrorist that kills Americans, especially in mass numbers, should have safe harbor anywhere in the world.

There should only be one answer to murderous terrorists that kill Americans.

Either they get brought to American justice or die.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

In about a year when the Muslim Brotherhood or Al Qai'da are turning Libya into Sudan/Somalia/Yemen, etc....this will look like a "great" idea.

Liberals will try to claim it was Bush's fault...


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

*Mumar is on state tv right now calling for back up and one of his sons have been captured. *

Your thread is full of shit.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

So you support our wars in Iraq and Afghanistan....



Sallow said:


> I'm really pretty shocked that nobody really remembers this asshole, Gaddafi, was the author of Lockerbie.
> 
> No terrorist that kills Americans, especially in mass numbers, should have safe harbor anywhere in the world.
> 
> ...


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

GoneBezerk said:


> So you support our wars in Iraq and Afghanistan....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I fully supported the invasion of Afghanistan.

That should have been the beginning and end to the "war on terrorism" and it should have ended with the death of Bin Laden.

There was no reason to attack Iraq. Al Qaeda had little or nothing to do with Saddam Hussien. I am pretty sure they made contact but like most dictators, they have little use for terrorists. Eventually what winds up happening is they turn against you.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> *Mumar is on state tv right now calling for back up and one of his sons have been captured. *
> 
> Your thread is full of shit.



As is she.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

Dumbfuck, terrorists went to Iraq from Afghanistan to get medical care. 

Saddam started a war with our friend, Kuwait, by invading them and killing/raping the people there. We just finished off the war that was on hold ever since the mid-90s.

People like you should just kill yourselves for being wasting O2.



Sallow said:


> GoneBezerk said:
> 
> 
> > So you support our wars in Iraq and Afghanistan....
> ...


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

When Egypt and Libya are the new Irans, Obama will be like Jimmy Carter....whitewashed by the historians and media trying to cover his tracks.

Afterall, they need to elect another one in 15 or so years like clockwork.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

GoneBezerk said:


> Dumbfuck, terrorists went to Iraq from Afghanistan to get medical care.
> 
> Saddam started a war with our friend, Kuwait, by invading them and killing/raping the people there. We just finished off the war that was on hold ever since the mid-90s.
> 
> ...



You're a very stupid person.

And know nothing about history.

Repeating incorrect data on the internet doesn't make it correct.

No matter how much you do it.


----------



## Charles_Main (Aug 21, 2011)

It's Great to see Gaddafi going, but I am still a little unclear on just who we just helped take over that Country.

Liberals Pound Bush for Iraq, and Claim we left a Pro Iran, Islamic Country in it's Place.

So what do you have to say on Libya? You can hide Behind NATO all you want but the fact is over 70% of all the strikes, and Power was US power. 

So who in the Hell did we just help Take Over Libya?

Really would like to know.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

So you claim Saddam wasn't supporting terrorists fleeing Afghanistan. 

You claim Saddam didn't start a war with Kuwait and that was still on hold with a UN mandate that he allow open inspections of his country.

You claim Saddam wasn't paying for terrorists to attack our friend, Israel. 

Saddam killed more people than Qadaffi, dumbass. He killed more Americans than Qadaffi.

Liberal trash like you just invent history to fit your fucked up mind and agenda.



Sallow said:


> GoneBezerk said:
> 
> 
> > Dumbfuck, terrorists went to Iraq from Afghanistan to get medical care.
> ...


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


> GoneBezerk said:
> 
> 
> > So you support our wars in Iraq and Afghanistan....
> ...



Killing bin Laden happened because it was expedient now. It didn't happen before because it wasn't expedient. We needed to destroy AQ, not bin Laden. Once the Allies had bitchslapped AQ back to the stone age, killing bin Laden became a good thing. People really should learn to think beyond what the media and the politicians say.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

*When the Libyan Rebels throw out their leader what will Obama do?*

Probably play a round at the Mink Meadows Golf Club.


----------



## BDBoop (Aug 21, 2011)

Oh, look; a circle jerk.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

GoneBezerk said:


> So you claim Saddam wasn't supporting terrorists fleeing Afghanistan.
> 
> You claim Saddam didn't start a war with Kuwait and that was still on hold with a UN mandate that he allow open inspections of his country.
> 
> ...



You've got a terrible recollection of anything. That's probably because you only visit right wing propaganda sites.

Saddam, who was encouraged by the United States to enter into a war with Iran, did attack Kuwait. He did so because Iraq had some heavy debts to Kuwait who were making some very big threats. That and they wanted a port city. Hussien appraised April Glaspie of the situation and she essentially green lighted the whole thing. However, Iraq went further into Kuwait then Glaspie "thought" he would. That's why Iraq got into trouble for that.

The rest of what you have here is conflation and at best ridiculous.

There was no reason to commit the war crime known as the invasion and conquering of Iraq.

Idiot.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > GoneBezerk said:
> ...



It wasn't "expedient" because it would have made the invasion of Iraq impossible.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



Could not give a rat's ass what your "opinion" is. We are not the 'victors', the Libyan people are.

And.... Bush didn't 'catch' Saddam. That was the Military. idiot.


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

And that book "Liberal Fascism" is "absolute drivel" ( the Economist, and everyone else), as well as everything you say. Turn off the BS, Rush/Beck/Foxbot.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Could not give a rat's ass what your "opinion" is. We are not the 'victors', the Libyan people are.



If Gaddafi dies as a result of American actions..we will be the victors.

It will send a very clear message to every would be terrorist would fate awaits them if they kill Americans.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

Oh, it was ok for Saddam to invade Kuwait over the debt he couldn't pay back. 

Tell that to the people he killed and raped. 

You are an idiot posting on this website because you are not allowed to go outside and play in the road anymore. 

Iraq will be a better place to visit in 10 years than Libya, mark my words dumbfuck. Libya will be a terrorist launching pad into southern Europe and into western Africa. 

Go away tool.



Sallow said:


> GoneBezerk said:
> 
> 
> > So you claim Saddam wasn't supporting terrorists fleeing Afghanistan.
> ...


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Could not give a rat's ass what your "opinion" is. We are not the 'victors', the Libyan people are.
> ...



What if he dies as a result of French actions? We are part of NATO, they are part of NATO, so would that count? 

Personally, I think y'all are getting a tad overly emotional about this whole thing. Sure, Gaddafi deserves to die because of Lockerbie. But the victors will still be the Libyans - it's their country.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

You can't read and it's not a coloring book, so you don't like it.



hellofromwarsaw said:


> And that book "Liberal Fascism" is "absolute drivel" ( the Economist, and everyone else), as well as everything you say. Turn off the BS, Rush/Beck/Foxbot.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

BDPoop with a typical response of a moron.



BDBoop said:


> Oh, look; a circle jerk.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

GoneBezerk said:


> Oh, it was ok for Saddam to invade Kuwait over the debt he couldn't pay back.
> 
> Tell that to the people he killed and raped.
> 
> ...



The thing about asking people to go away..is that you should be able to make them go away.

And it's obvious you ain't up to the task.

And you haven't a clue about what you are talking about.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



I get a little pissed about terrorists. I have seen up close and personal what they can do.

And it should be Americans that off this scumbag.


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

To sum up the stupidity of the left...

Attacking Saddam and removing him from power for starting a war with Kuwait, supporting terrorists and not allowing open IAEA inspections on his CBRNE program.....BAD.

Attacking Qaddaffi  and allowing renegade muslim groups aligned with terrorists to remove him from power, so that Europe can keep their oil assets intact (maybe)......GOOD.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



Your opinion doesn't have jack shit to do with me, idiot. Your opinion can't make me look like a moron, your opinion can only reflect on you. I am, however, not at all surprised that you're too fucking stupid to know that.


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

Everything Saddam did to us was a result of Ronnie Raygun's STUPID adventurism, covert BS, and basic  idiocy. His legacy is Bush's stupidest wars ever, and the collapse of our economy due to VOODOO deregulation and pandering to the rich. Oh, and all these brainwashed Rush/Fox/Pub Dupes. Pffft!!


----------



## JimH52 (Aug 21, 2011)

Did the old man forget these?

Rebel officials: Two of Gadhafi's sons arrested in Tripoli - CNN.com


----------



## Sallow (Aug 21, 2011)

JimH52 said:


> Did the old man forget these?
> 
> Rebel officials: Two of Gadhafi's sons arrested in Tripoli - CNN.com





Opps.


----------



## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Could not give a rat's ass what your "opinion" is. We are not the 'victors', the Libyan people are.
> ...



talk about history challenged....


----------



## GoneBezerk (Aug 21, 2011)

Just shoot yourself, but you're probably too stupid to do that....



hellofromwarsaw said:


> Everything Saddam did to us was a result of Ronnie Raygun's STUPID adventurism, covert BS, and basic  idiocy. His legacy is Bush's stupidest wars ever, and the collapse of our economy due to VOODOO deregulation and pandering to the rich. Oh, and all these brainwashed Rush/Fox/Pub Dupes. Pffft!!


----------



## ekrem (Aug 21, 2011)

I see French, Qatari and Turkish flags on that square on Al-Jazeera.
And 99.9% only men on screen since I watch this.
Important is to manage the transition carefully, should this indeed mean, that the phase of violence ends.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 21, 2011)

Trajan said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



It's a gift with some.


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

A great success for Obama's diplomacy- and Pubs and their silly dupes WRONG AGAIN...


----------



## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> It's Great to see Gaddafi going, but I am still a little unclear on just who we just helped take over that Country.
> 
> Liberals Pound Bush for Iraq, and Claim we left a Pro Iran, Islamic Country in it's Place.
> 
> ...



Here's the problem.  I don't think they know.  

About half these rebels are Qadaffi defectors... Guys who had no problem with what Qadaffi was doing before this all started.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Reagan couldn't get rid of Qaddafi, but Obama did.

Bush couldn't get rid of Bin Laden, but Obama did.

Bad news for Republicans....


----------



## Trajan (Aug 21, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Trajan said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



not to mention the sheer hypocrisy...


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

BDBoop said:


> Oh, look; a circle jerk.



And YOUR the guest of honor. Bend over like your accustomed to the left requiring.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Reagan couldn't get rid of Qaddafi, but Obama did.

Bush couldn't get rid of Bin Laden, but Obama did.

Bad news for Republicans....


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

70% maybe in the first few weeks, but not since the WPA said no more. Vive la France!! Vive la Democratie! Fegging ugly 'Merican a-holes...


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Clinton couldn't get rid of Qaddafi, but Obama did.

Clinton couldn't get rid of Bin Laden, but Obama did.

Bad news for Clinton.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Clinton couldn't get rid of Qaddafi, but Obama did.
> 
> Clinton couldn't get rid of Bin Laden, but Obama did.
> 
> Bad news for Clinton.



Chrissy Lewinsky doesn't think so.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Republicans desperately looking for a negative spin on the fall of Qaddafi...


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris desperately looking for a reason to gargle on Obama's semen.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Reagan couldn't get rid of Qaddafi, but Obama did.
> 
> Bush couldn't get rid of Bin Laden, but Obama did.
> 
> Bad news for Republicans....



Really? Obama got rid of Qaddafi? I thought that was the Libyan rebels doing that.

And I thought it was Seal Team 6 that 'got' Bin Laden. Obama pulled the trigger? Planned the mission specifics? Did the recon? Gathered the intelligence? And all this time, I though he just gave a green light. Silly me.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Republicans desperately looking for a negative spin on the fall of Qaddafi...



Liberal mouth breathers like you trying desperately to give Obama the credit.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > Reagan couldn't get rid of Qaddafi, but Obama did.
> ...



Chrissy Lewinsky hates the military, so all this has to be a result of Obama's heroics.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Republicans desperately looking for a negative spin on the fall of Qaddafi...



Now, now, dry those tears little boy. I didn't mean to hurt your feelings by pointing out how much better Obama is than Clinton was.

Here, have a tissue.


----------



## waltky (Aug 21, 2011)

Looks like Bachmann already workin' on gettin' dem gas prices down to $2/gal.

*With Gadhafi out of power, oil prices should fall*
_21 Aug.`11 - Full effect of his ouster on the market may not be felt for months_


> Oil prices around the world should start falling if Libyan rebels succeed in toppling Moammar Gadhafi's regime, though the full effect won't be felt for months.
> 
> On Sunday night, rebel forces pushed into Tripoli without meeting much resistance, hours after they overran a major military base that defended the capital. The opposition's leaders said Gadhafi's son and one-time heir apparent, Seif al-Islam, has been arrested.
> 
> ...


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

McCain, Bush, and Raygun would have let Gadhafi slaughter the rebels- and in Egypt and Tunisia. Can't stand liberty if it's a little messy...and the Foxbots...pfffft!!


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Sallow said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Could not give a rat's ass what your "opinion" is. We are not the 'victors', the Libyan people are.
> ...



We have no boots on the ground in Libya. If Qaddafi dies, it is because of the rebels. Obama cannot claim credit.


----------



## random3434 (Aug 21, 2011)

That's funny you asked that. I was just watching the NBC Nightly News tonight with my daughter, and I asked her, "Are the Rebels the 'good guys' or the bad guys?"

Does anyone know? 

Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet?


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Can't wait to see how Fox spins this...

I believe they will win four Pinocchios on this one!


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Echo Zulu said:


> That's funny you asked that. I was just watching the NBC Nightly News tonight with my daughter, and I asked her, "Are the Rebels the 'good guys' or the bad guys?"
> 
> Does anyone know?
> 
> Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet?



We'll probably have to send in a few thousand "advisers" to help the rebels get up and running.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

We already have people in Libya.


----------



## random3434 (Aug 21, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Echo Zulu said:
> 
> 
> > That's funny you asked that. I was just watching the NBC Nightly News tonight with my daughter, and I asked her, "Are the Rebels the 'good guys' or the bad guys?"
> ...



Do you think the special ops forces are/were helping the rebels overthrow the government there?


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Echo Zulu said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Echo Zulu said:
> ...



I know for a fact they are.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> It's Great to see Gaddafi going, but I am still a little unclear on just who we just helped take over that Country.
> 
> Liberals Pound Bush for Iraq, and Claim we left a Pro Iran, Islamic Country in it's Place.
> 
> ...


America's enemy  Al Qadea


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Echo Zulu said:


> That's funny you asked that. I was just watching the NBC Nightly News tonight with my daughter, and I asked her, "Are the Rebels the 'good guys' or the bad guys?"
> 
> Does anyone know?
> 
> Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet?



no troops in Libya. unless of course the President lied about that.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Charles_Main said:
> 
> 
> > It's Great to see Gaddafi going, but I am still a little unclear on just who we just helped take over that Country.
> ...



Want to bet?


----------



## ekrem (Aug 21, 2011)

Tunisian and Egyptian flag I saw also.
On Benghazi place is also a bigger US flag, behind mounted on a house-wall on that place. 

The flag the Libyans are waving is the flag of the Kingdom of Libya which existed before Ghaddafi  overthrew that state-system.

Under Ghaddafi this was the flag of Lybia:


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Echo Zulu said:
> 
> 
> > Rat in the Hat said:
> ...



you know jack shit for a fact.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Can't wait to see how Fox spins this...
> 
> I believe they will win four Pinocchios on this one!





Chris said:


> We already have people in Libya.



So FOX is now pro obama?


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Nice try, but Obama backed the rebels with air power.

You guys kill me.

If Obama walked on water, you would say, "OBAMA CAN'T SWIM!"


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



You already think he walks on water.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > Echo Zulu said:
> ...



Actually I do.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

BILL O'REILLY, HOST: In the "Impact" segment tonight: Not much new to report out of Libya other than Qaddafi's ground forces continue to be hammered by NATO warplanes. Some Americans fear there will be boots on the ground in Libya. The Obama administration says that's not going to happen, but what is happening on the ground may surprise you.

Joining us now from Washington, Lt. Col. Tony Shaffer, a former Army intelligence officer, and from Boston, Col. David Hunt, a Fox News military analyst. So we hear special forces are already on the ground in Libya. True, Col. Hunt?

RET. COL. DAVID HUNT, U.S. ARMY: Yes, absolutely. You've got British service been in there about three weeks ago and actually got captured and released. The French GIGN have been in there and our special forces and our U.S. intelligence operatives and their assets. We do not conduct operations like this, large scale air operations, without people on the ground. They have been very successful, very good, not a lot of contact with the rebels because you don't know who to talk to. But, yes, we have got intel gathering and rescue guys and special operations guys on the ground, have had them for about 12 days.

O'REILLY: Now, do you agree with that, Col. Shaffer?

LT. COL. TONY SHAFFER, FORMER ARMY INTELLIGENCE OFFICER: Yes, I have heard from my sources -- I got a call from one of my key sources on Monday and that's exactly what's going on. Let's be really clear here. You have got to have these individuals doing what Dave just said, especially when you are talking about trying to protect, and the stated goal here, Bill, is humanitarian support. So you don't want to have weapons hitting the wrong targets. So, Dave is very good on the fact that we have special operations guys sitting there with laser designators. 

Are U.S. Troops Already on the Ground in Libya? - Interviews - The O'Reilly Factor - FoxNews.com


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

"Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet? "

We have no "troops" there, and never did. Brilliant, super cheap success.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

hellofromwarsaw said:


> "Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet? "
> 
> We have no "troops" there, and never did. Brilliant, super cheap success.



We had a few troops there, but it was a super cheap success.

Now let's move on to Syria...


----------



## random3434 (Aug 21, 2011)

hellofromwarsaw said:


> "Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet? "
> 
> We have no "troops" there, and never did. Brilliant, super cheap success.



Uh, yes we do. You just don't read or hear  about them in the news. I guess the cat's out of the bag now though.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



They won't run Libya.

It won't happen.


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

Echo Zulu said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Echo Zulu said:
> ...



I'm sure they were passing intelligence on Qadaffi's troop positions to the rebels. But now we will have to send troops in to help them set up police forces, security, and government.

We'll be there for years.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Can't wait to see how Fox spins this...
> 
> I believe they will win four Pinocchios on this one!



Here is how FOX News is 'spinning' it...

Libyan Rebels Reportedly Within 2 Miles Of Tripoli&#39;s Center | FoxNews.com



> An Associated Press reporter with the rebels saw them take over the base of the Khamis Brigade, 16 miles west of the capital, on Sunday. The base has been defending Qaddafi's stronghold of Tripoli. After a brief gunbattle, Qaddafi's forces fled.
> 
> Inside the base, hundreds of rebels cheered wildly and danced, raising the rebel flag on the front gate of a large, gray wall enclosing the compound. They seized large stores of weapons from the base, driving away with truckloads of whatever arms they could get their hands on. One of the rebels carried off a tube of grenades, while another carted off two mortars.
> 
> ...



Looks like they have the nerve to credit the rebels with all this, and not Obama. How DARE they!


----------



## edjax1952 (Aug 21, 2011)

If Truth Matters, tell me some facts,not suppositions and rumors. Please repost after the fact. This is just supposition and any comments would be words in the wind without facts to refer to.


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

THE HAGUE (AFP)--Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi's son Seif al-Islam, for whom the International Criminal Court issued arrest warrants for crimes against humanity, is in detention, the ICC prosecutor said Monday. 

"I have received confidential information stating he has been arrested," Luis Moreno-Ocampo said. 

Moreno-Ocampo told CNN Seif al-Islam's transfer to The Hague to likely face war crimes charges would be discussed Tuesday with rebel leadership. 

Earlier, the chairman of Libya's rebel National Transitional Council told Al-Jazeera television from Benghazi he had "information that Seif al-Islam has been captured". 

"He is being kept in a secure place under close guard until he is handed over to the judiciary," Abdel Jalil said, without giving a date or place for the reported capture of Gadhafi's son. 

Before the revolt which erupted in February, Seif al-Islam was increasingly seen as the successor to his father, despite publicly ruling out any dynastic ambitions in the North African country. 

Seif Al-Islam Gadhafi's Arrest, Transfer To Be Discussed Tuesday - ICC - WSJ.com


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...



I reallyt don't give a shit who runs what
What pisses me off is that tyrant in the white hous gave aid to our enemy and you cheer leading what he did.


----------



## Charles_Main (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> hellofromwarsaw said:
> 
> 
> > "Are our troops done there now? Can they come home yet? "
> ...



How can you call it a success when we have no idea who is going to end up running the place?


----------



## Mr. Shaman (Aug 21, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> It's Great to see Gaddafi going, but I am still a little unclear on just who we just helped take over that Country.


How "odd" that question was never asked (by *Teabaggers*), before Saddam Hussein was ousted.

It surely does take you folks exceptionally-long to kick your (excuse for) _brains_ "into-gear".


----------



## BoycottTheday (Aug 21, 2011)

So what was it, Obama was at war or wasnt he, if he was at war dint he need ....

Oh never mind, what does it matter.


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

All the Foxbots have the inside info on our secret forces. We WON"T BE THERE, and our spotters if any left back in May when WE stopped bombing. Any advisors, if any, are already on the payroll. Never seen so much histrionics as from our poor idiot RWers, who are ALWAYS WRONG, it appears...


----------



## Charles_Main (Aug 21, 2011)

Mr. Shaman said:


> Charles_Main said:
> 
> 
> > It's Great to see Gaddafi going, but I am still a little unclear on just who we just helped take over that Country.
> ...



I had a clear Idea of who would be in Charge of Iraq when we toppled Saddam. THE US MILITARY. In Libya we have no control at all, we have no idea who is going to take the place over. We have no plan.

Are you really going to sit here and say it is ok we don't know in Libya, Because we did it in Iraq? We made a mistake in Iraq thinking we would end up with a friendly, Democratic Country. How does it make any sense to now make a similar Mistake in Libya? Only this time we don't have any Boots on the Ground, and therefore no way to control who takes over.

Did we just create another Muslim Theocracy? 

huh?


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...





Great spin, keep it up!


----------



## Chris (Aug 21, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> Mr. Shaman said:
> 
> 
> > Charles_Main said:
> ...



Damn democracy!

So messy without us in charge.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...



You hold the title for biggest dipshit of USMB. Keep it up.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...



What spin I said obama was helping America's enemy al-Qaeda in libya and you are cheering obamna exactly who's spinning what?


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

I'll give it 18 hours. Even though we weren't really involved according to him.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> I'll give it 18 hours. Even though we weren't really involved according to him.



chris has already given him credit in this thread.


----------



## Wry Catcher (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > bigrebnc1775 said:
> ...



How can that be?  You're still here.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Wry Catcher said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...



Are you Chrissy's new lover?  he needs a protector.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> Mr. Shaman said:
> 
> 
> > Charles_Main said:
> ...



Since al-Qaeda were the rebels you can be asured it will be another al-Qaeda training ground.

Maybe that was obama's plan for more aggression, 2012 two months before the next election Libya mysteriously has  al-Qaeda training within it's borders planning a major atrtack on American soil, and we must go in and destroy it with boots on the ground. What better way to motivate the non obama base to vote for him.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Wry Catcher said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...



Maybe you should stop looking in the mirror while posting.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

I'll give it 18 hours. Gotta maximize opportunities ya know. Even though Obama said "were not really involved"


----------



## Wry Catcher (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> I'll give it 18 hours. Even though we weren't really involved according to him.



Yet the right wing has posted (ad nauseaum) President Obama started a third (or was it a fourth) war.  Not only are those of the New Right hypocrites, they're stupid hypocrits if they (you) believe you have any credibility or sense.

Have a nice day.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

Who do you think "deserves" the credit - If not Obama?  It's his policy.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

A.. pretty sure there are threads on this already.
B.. i doubt Obama is dumb enough to try and take credit for Libya, when we have no boots on the ground and he's been very careful to say all our actions in the area were NATO actions.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Who do you think "deserves" the credit - If not Obama?  It's his policy.



How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?


----------



## bodecea (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> I'll give it 18 hours. Gotta maximize opportunities ya know. Even though Obama said "were not really involved"



Let's keep track of the time....KK?


----------



## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.

The only time Republicans have told the truth is when they screamed, even before the black guy was sworn in, that they wanted him to fail.  They still do.


----------



## Wry Catcher (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



LOL, not very clever, not even a good effort.


----------



## BoycottTheday (Aug 21, 2011)

id say BP was the big winner in this one.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?



Okay, if Obama deserves NO credit, why was he criticized by the right for getting involved in the first place?


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

We're part of NATO, WE stopped Gadhaffi back in March, got this done with little cost by friends, all against hysterical Pub and silly dupe complaining- why wouldn't he?


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.
> 
> The only time Republicans have told the truth is when they screamed, even before the black guy was sworn in, that they wanted him to fail.  They still do.




Shut up, dipshit.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, if Obama deserves NO credit, why was he criticized by the right for getting involved in the first place?



What do those two statements have to do with one another? Answer is nothing.


----------



## Wry Catcher (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



Nope.  I've been married to my lover for over 35 years and she is the mother of our children.  My aka is not that of a male singer; kind of makes me wonder about you.  Not that I care, what ever floats your boat, elvis.


----------



## Missourian (Aug 21, 2011)

If you loan me your most accurate weapon,  and I win first place in the shooting competition, the weapon gets part of the credit,  but you don't get the trophy.


NATO won the battle and the U.S. military gets part of the credit.

Obama gets a thank you note from NATO.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Wry Catcher said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Wry Catcher said:
> ...



married people cheat and some married people are BIsexual


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Who do you think "deserves" the credit - If not Obama?  It's his policy.



Obama was pulled in dragging and screaming. The Europeans were in the forefront and other Muslim countries armed the rebels. The people did the fighting and Obama gave lip service, after all the deaths in the beginning. He didn't want to be involved in this. Now time will tell who gets power and if they will be friendly to the US.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Wry Catcher said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Wry Catcher said:
> ...



well the way you defend Chris the moron, who would know.


----------



## syrenn (Aug 21, 2011)

Missourian said:


> If you loan me your most accurate weapon,  and I win first place in the shooting competition, the weapon gets part of the credit,  but you don't get the trophy.
> 
> 
> NATO won the battle and the U.S. military gets part of the credit.
> ...





And we the tax payers get the bill.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.
> 
> The only time Republicans have told the truth is when they screamed, even before the black guy was sworn in, that they wanted him to fail.  They still do.



Why do dip shits like you always play the race card?

I don't recall Republicans screaming 'they' got Bin Laden. I seem to remember us screaming 'SEAL TEAM 6 got Bin Laden', while the Liberal mouth breathing crowd screamed 'Obama got Bin Laden!'

The adults are talking. Go back to your Barbie dolls.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

Obama ordered warplanes and Tomahawk cruise missiles.

Libya: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya - ABC News


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.
> ...



rdean is a special kind of dipshit.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> A.. pretty sure there are threads on this already.
> B.. i doubt Obama is dumb enough to try and take credit for Libya, when we have no boots on the ground and he's been very careful to say all our actions in the area were NATO actions.



Yes, I had 2 threads about it but BDBoop soiled herself in them and they were removed.


----------



## Full-Auto (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> I'll give it 18 hours. Gotta maximize opportunities ya know. Even though Obama said "were not really involved"



I THINK YOU CALLED THAT ONE.

It should start with WH press office of apology.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



kinda like 'special' Ed...
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijFetGGrhRw]Stephen Lynch - special Ed - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.
> 
> The only time Republicans have told the truth is when they screamed, even before the black guy was sworn in, that they wanted him to fail.  They still do.



Go sit in the corner and color.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

Dennis Kucinich: Obama's Libya Attack An Impeachable Offense | TPMDC


----------



## Missourian (Aug 21, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> this is a victory for nato, america and freedom....and the people of Libya..
> 
> there you go




Almost agree with this.

The jury's still out on freedom...I hope the Libyan can build a free society.


----------



## Wry Catcher (Aug 21, 2011)

"Mission Accomplished"!  I've heard from a very credible source that President Obama has ordered the Navy to make him a flight suit so he can stand on the Flight Deck of CVN 65 and claim credit for Mission Accomplished in Lybia.


----------



## Lovebears65 (Aug 21, 2011)

Obama deserves no credit. If anyone in power deserves it , it is Hillary.  Plus the guys who fly the jets  to get the no fly zone in place.  since it was America that did most of the work. I give all the benefits to Hillary and our brave military personal!


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

GOP seizes on Kucinich idea as a way to condemn Obama on Libya - CSMonitor.com

House rips Obama Libya policy  CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs


----------



## edjax1952 (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, if Obama deserves NO credit, why was he criticized by the right for getting involved in the first place?


 
I can't see how you think Obama had anything to do with the success of the rebellion.  NATO moved to help the rebels.  France and Italy used their jets for the initial missions.  The US refueled the jets and offered some drones for surveillance as a member of NATO forces.  Now you want Obama to claim credit for the victory.  Geeesss


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

Lotta dumb insults from the losers in the argument, AGAIN and always...


----------



## SFC Ollie (Aug 21, 2011)

I don't believe we have any idea who is going to end up running the show in Libya. I'm not even sure if we know what's going to happen in Egypt even.............


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

Let's see.....a terroristic regime falls
no American lives were lost
We utilized a NATO coalition to bring about change


Yes......you are right
Another Obama foreign policy blunder


----------



## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, if Obama deserves NO credit, why was he criticized by the right for getting involved in the first place?



At first he was criticized by Republicans for NOT getting involved.  Republicans think they can rewrite history just by telling a lie.  It's not that "simple".


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

Lovebears65 said:


> Obama deserves no credit. If anyone in power deserves it , it is Hillary.  Plus the guys who fly the jets  to get the no fly zone in place.  since it was America that did most of the work. I give all the benefits to Hillary and our brave military personal!



Yup...

And if it was a diplomatic blunder, we know who would get the blame


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Obama ordered warplanes and Tomahawk cruise missiles.
> 
> Libya: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya - ABC News



First paragraph...


> More than 112 Tomahawk cruise missiles struck over 20 targets inside Libya today in the opening phase of an *international military operation* the Pentagon said was aimed at stopping attacks led by Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi and enforcing a U.N.-backed no-fly zone.





> The first air strikes, in what is being called Operation Odyssey Dawn, were launched from a *mix of U.S. surface ships and one British submarine* in the Mediterranean Sea





> Gortney said no U.S. troops were on the ground in Libya and that *no U.S. aircraft participated* in the initial attacks.



Your own article contradicts you. Learn to read the article before you post it, not just the headline.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> I can't see how you think Obama had anything to do with the success of the rebellion. NATO moved to help the rebels. France and Italy used their jets for the initial missions. The US refueled the jets and offered some drones for surveillance as a member of NATO forces. Now you want Obama to claim credit for the victory. Geeesss



Who authorized the U.S. airwar against Gadhafi (airplanes and cruise missiles)?  What about CIA boots on the ground coordinating with Libyan rebels?  Who authorized that?

Obama again expands role In Libyan war | Sun Journal

The American Conservative » Obamas Libyan War


----------



## Ringel05 (Aug 21, 2011)

I thank Frank Whittle, Hans von Ohain, Wernher von Braun and Robert H. Goddard to name just a few..........


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

Maybe we should credit the Republicans

After all, they did want to defund this "war"


----------



## hellofromwarsaw (Aug 21, 2011)

The USA did most of the bombing until the WPA stopped them. Pubs called it the slaughter of Libyan women and children. Are you amnesiac idiots and/or great LIARS? Unbelievable.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

Libyan Rebels Close In On Gaddafi


----------



## Full-Auto (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Libyan Rebels Close In On Gaddafi



I bet France even sends a thank you card. After all we did it for them.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> Politics Discuss government policies and candidates...



This is definitely "government policies"...


----------



## Rat in the Hat (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> ...



I'm sorry, I didn't realize you ran out. Here's some more for you.






Now go back to your corner. That's a good little boy.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

This is a government policy thread - specifically, Obama's government policy!


----------



## Full-Auto (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> This is a government policy thread - specifically, Obama's government policy!



Protect the oil. Obamas policy.  Just not at home.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Aug 21, 2011)

> Okay, if Obama deserves NO credit, why was he criticized by the right for getting involved in the first place?



True. And lets expand on that. If Obama gets no credit for Libya then he gets no credit for killing OBL. 

But

Hes also not responsible for unemployment, the struggling economy, and the debt downgrade. 

The right needs to make up its mind  it cant have it both ways. 



> Let's see.....a terroristic regime falls
> no American lives were lost
> We utilized a NATO coalition to bring about change
> 
> ...



No, all thats fine  the snag is its was a democratic president who presided over the operation.


----------



## Patrick2 (Aug 21, 2011)

The OP is absurd - obama did next to nothing.  He doesn't know HOW to do anything but apologize.  The credit is all due the rebels, and secondarily non-US NATO airstrikes.


----------



## Toome (Aug 21, 2011)

What next?  Thank Obama for the sun rising?


----------



## Vel (Aug 21, 2011)

Ummmmm.. Can anyone tell us who is taking over in Libya?


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

How many Republicans voted to pull the plug for funding the Libyan effort?

Great leadership by John Boehner. Republicans once more on the wrong side of history


----------



## whitehall (Aug 21, 2011)

Pick a side and bomb them with American planes while denying that the US is involved? You mean that policy?


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

Obama authorized warplanes, cruise missiles, and CIA boots on the ground.  He probably authorized much more we don't yet know about.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > Politics Discuss government policies and candidates...
> 
> 
> 
> This is definitely "government policies"...



Please... give us Obama's 'Libya policy' in detail, explaining how it got Libya to the point it is at today.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Chris desperately looking for a reason to gargle on Obama's semen.



does he need a reason?......


----------



## SFC Ollie (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Libyan Rebels Close In On Gaddafi



Do you even know who will be in charge in Libya and what their feelings toward the USA will be? Because no one else knows............ Obama and NATO Policy was to toss the dice......


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> *WHO KEEPS DELETING MY POSTS AND THREADS? wtf? Why isn't this thread deleted like mine. *



they are getting moved and merged, not deleted.


----------



## thereisnospoon (Aug 21, 2011)

Patrick2 said:


> The OP is absurd - obama did next to nothing.  He doesn't know HOW to do anything but apologize.  The credit is all due the rebels, and secondarily non-US NATO airstrikes.



My comment is I have no comment other than to state the OP started an idiotic no mind thread.
A large group of very pissed off Libyans have had enough of Ghadifi's buillshit and OBAMA GETS THE FUCKING CREDIT?!!!! 
Jesus Christ, these fucking Obamatons will never stop worshiping this guy.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...


yes he has proven that enough times.....


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Obama authorized warplanes, cruise missiles, and CIA boots on the ground.  He probably authorized much more we don't yet know about.



You are either stupid, a liar, or a sock puppet.

Obama outlines limited U.S. role in Libya intervention | The Envoy - Yahoo! News


> Obama told Congressional leaders that "*he had not authorized troops on the ground or airplanes*," a staffer to one of the Congress members briefed Friday said on condition of anonymity. "He stressed the U.S. is diplomatically supporting the no-fly zone, not the enforcement itself."


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Can't wait to see how Fox spins this...
> 
> I believe they will win four Pinocchios on this one!



well you still have them beat....your book won six.....


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

House Libya Vote: Smell of Victory for Moammar Gadhafi

When it came time to choose sides, the GOP chose Gadhafi over Obama


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Obama ordered warplanes and Tomahawk cruise missiles.
> 
> Libya: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya - ABC News



How many threads are you going to start with this outright lie?

From your own article...


> Gortney said no U.S. troops were on the ground in Libya and that no U.S. aircraft participated in the initial attacks.


----------



## JoeB131 (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Libyan Rebels Close In On Gaddafi



And again, how does this help the unemployment thing?  

Seriously. 

I mean, if Khadafy died of old age, you'd call it a success on Obama's part... 

I guess now that Al Qaeda has a new base of operations, we can all be cheery.  Make sure you mark these guys down for when they become "the enemy" later.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> Do you even know who will be in charge in Libya and what their feelings toward the USA will be? Because no one else knows............ Obama and NATO Policy was to toss the dice......



Libyan rebels started this rebellion.  Obama made the decision to help them before they were slaughtered.  Obama is helping give Libya a shot at freedom, while the true outcome is yet unknown.  The outcome does not need to mimic American democracy to be successful.


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 21, 2011)

Didn't I call it months ago?

And as predicted, the Cons are FUMiNG w/envy and rage.

LoL!

So much for their claptrap that Dems aren't capable of being wartime leaders.

Obamas doing a BANGUP job of keeping us safe.

Buh bye Khaddafi!


----------



## TruthSeeker56 (Aug 21, 2011)

I'd like to know who the hell these "rebels" are?  Are they Islamo-terrorists?  Are they connected to Hamas or Hezbollah or Al Qaeda?  Nobody has an answer to that question.  

This same question has never been answered in Egypt.  Who are the "rebels" who now govern Egypt?  

It's much more "romantic" to call the rebels "freedom fighters".  Once again, the leftists in this country don't want anybody to "look behind the curtain".


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

Chris said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...


if he was able to walk on it......he would not need to know how to swim....


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> I mean, if Khadafy died of old age, you'd call it a success on Obama's part...



Too bad Saddam isn't dying of old age...


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > I can't see how you think Obama had anything to do with the success of the rebellion. NATO moved to help the rebels. France and Italy used their jets for the initial missions. The US refueled the jets and offered some drones for surveillance as a member of NATO forces. Now you want Obama to claim credit for the victory. Geeesss
> 
> 
> 
> ...



there is NOTHING in the first linked piece about US planes.
there is NOTHING in the second linked piece about US planes.

You're a liar. A bad one at that.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Aug 21, 2011)

TruthSeeker56 said:


> I'd like to know who the hell these "rebels" are?  Are they Islamo-terrorists?  Are they connected to Hamas or Hezbollah or Al Qaeda?  Nobody has an answer to that question.
> 
> This same question has never been answered in Egypt.  Who are the "rebels" who now govern Egypt?
> 
> It's much more "romantic" to call the rebels "freedom fighters".  Once again, the leftists in this country don't want anybody to "look behind the curtain".



And don't expect an answer from the Obamabots because they haven't a clue......


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 21, 2011)

This is my 3rd post in this god damn thread. Will it be invisible too? 

Obama was dragged into this kicking and screaming. Hillary if anyone was in front of this issue.


----------



## Patrick2 (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > Do you even know who will be in charge in Libya and what their feelings toward the USA will be? Because no one else knows............ Obama and NATO Policy was to toss the dice......
> 
> 
> 
> Libyan rebels started this rebellion.  Obama made the decision to help them before they were slaughtered.  Obama is helping give Libya a shot at freedom, while the true outcome is yet unknown.  The outcome does not need to mimic American democracy to be successful.



This is another one of those obamabot masturbation fantasies.   The rebels on the ground would probably die laughing if they heard this fairy tale about how "obama won the war".


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

SFC Ollie said:


> TruthSeeker56 said:
> 
> 
> > I'd like to know who the hell these "rebels" are?  Are they Islamo-terrorists?  Are they connected to Hamas or Hezbollah or Al Qaeda?  Nobody has an answer to that question.
> ...



Side note... yer 'boys is gettin smacked around by the freaking Chargers tonight


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 21, 2011)

LoL............hilarious!!!


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> And don't expect an answer from the Obamabots because they haven't a clue......



Since Obama authorized CIA boots on the ground in Libya to coordinate with the rebels, I suspect the CIA has a pretty good idea exactly WHO these rebel freedom fighters are.


----------



## BDBoop (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, if Obama deserves NO credit, why was he criticized by the right for getting involved in the first place?



They wanted to IMPEACH him for Libya. And now he gets no credit?

I rue the day they installed internet access at the RWNJ mental health facility.


----------



## del (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Libyan Rebels Close In On Gaddafi



he did a nice job on the sunrise this morning, too.

kudos


----------



## Full-Auto (Aug 21, 2011)

MarcATL said:


> Didn't I call it months ago?
> 
> And as predicted, the Cons are FUMiNG w/envy and rage.
> 
> ...



LOL WHAT TRIPE.  Obama was just being a french lackey. He didnt intervene in the other simialar slaughters because there was no oil.

You can climb back in his lap now.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

BDBoop said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> ...



He shouldn't get any credit anyway.  It's not our business, just like Iraq wasn't.


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> he did a nice job on the sunrise this morning, too.
> 
> kudos



Yes, he did...  Much better than Bush's...


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > And don't expect an answer from the Obamabots because they haven't a clue......
> 
> 
> 
> Since Obama authorized *CIA boots on the ground in Libya* to coordinate with the rebels, I suspect the CIA has a pretty good idea exactly WHO these rebel freedom fighters are.



proof from credible source please?


----------



## BDBoop (Aug 21, 2011)

edjax1952 said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> ...



Okay - so kindly explain to me why what he DID do was an "impeachable offense" per the Republican party.


----------



## del (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > he did a nice job on the sunrise this morning, too.
> >
> > kudos
> 
> ...



doubtless


----------



## SFC Ollie (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > TruthSeeker56 said:
> ...



Yeah, they don't look real good, but it is preseason.......


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

BDBoop said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > > How about the rebels in Libya who did the fighting and dying?
> ...



The GOP and Gadhafi......perfect together

They threatened to impeach Obama for messing with their boy Gadhafi


----------



## TruthSeeker56 (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > TruthSeeker56 said:
> ...



Ah, you're playing the "since I can't coherently contribute to this topic, I'll spin this into an NFL football game smackdown" card.  

Good move, "Slingin' Sammy".


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

rightwinger said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



You're an idiot.


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

Hey Republicans......you still want to impeach Obama over his Libya policy?


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 21, 2011)

> proof from credible source please?



http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/31/world/africa/31intel.html?_r=1

Obama again expands role In Libyan war | Sun Journal

Obama &#8216;authorizes&#8217; CIA support for Libya rebels | The Raw Story

NEWS: Obama sent CIA operatives & authorized arms to Libyan rebels 'weeks ago'


----------



## Nosmo King (Aug 21, 2011)

TruthSeeker56 said:


> I'd like to know who the hell these "rebels" are?  Are they Islamo-terrorists?  Are they connected to Hamas or Hezbollah or Al Qaeda?  Nobody has an answer to that question.
> 
> This same question has never been answered in Egypt.  Who are the "rebels" who now govern Egypt?
> 
> It's much more "romantic" to call the rebels "freedom fighters".  Once again, the leftists in this country don't want anybody to "look behind the curtain".


Would you like to campaign to restore Qaddafi to power?

When the president authorized air strikes, the right howled.  Now that the air strikes have proven effective, the right howls again!

Seems the right is just flabbergasted.  They were for it before they were against it.

And there's always the flicker of paranoia, isn't there?  Egypt deposed a dictator and the right fears extremists.  Libya overthrows a man who kept the sainted Ronald Reagan awake at night and the right again sees nothing but a dark cloud, never a silver lining.

I guess any authoritarian is a good authoritarian so long as he's either in our pocket or in power as long as a Democrat sits in the White House. 

Ah politics!  It brings out the weirdest in Conservatives!


----------



## Big Black Dog (Aug 21, 2011)

Didn't we send our Marines in there many many years ago to clear out the pirates????  They sing about it all the time.  Semper Fi to those that it applies to.


----------



## Dr.House (Aug 21, 2011)

We should just make him emperor now....

Get the petitions going....


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 21, 2011)

Sometime this week you will see the GOP and Bush's cronies trot out the RW revisionists on FOX claiming how Bush's policies setup this victory....watch.


----------



## Dr.House (Aug 21, 2011)

0bama:  Making spreading 'mocracy OK again!


----------



## BDBoop (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> BDBoop said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



Really not the point. We WERE there. A lot of Republicans wanted to impeach him, because of it. Impeach.

But now that "all's well that ends well", they don't want him to get credit. Just like they didn't want him to get credit for bin Laden.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> Mr. Shaman said:
> 
> 
> > Charles_Main said:
> ...



Charley.......unless you color your words.....this Dickhead wont understand a word your saying....he has to have his Mom interpret for him now....


----------



## Ringel05 (Aug 21, 2011)

BDBoop said:


> edjax1952 said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



To score political talking points.


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

House Libya Vote: Smell of Victory for Moammar Gadhafi

When the going got tough......the Republicans supported Gadhafi


----------



## Full-Auto (Aug 21, 2011)

MarcATL said:


> Sometime this week you will see the GOP and Bush's cronies trot out the RW revisionists on FOX claiming how Bush's policies setup this victory....watch.



Doubtful, but it would be wishful thinking for the left. You guys cant discuss achievements


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



Wry will let Chris wear his new Crocks.....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.
> 
> The only time Republicans have told the truth is when they screamed, even before the black guy was sworn in, that they wanted him to fail.  They still do.



you do to much bitching Dean....your like an old cackling Rooster....


----------



## TruthSeeker56 (Aug 21, 2011)

Nosmo King said:


> TruthSeeker56 said:
> 
> 
> > I'd like to know who the hell these "rebels" are?  Are they Islamo-terrorists?  Are they connected to Hamas or Hezbollah or Al Qaeda?  Nobody has an answer to that question.
> ...



Once again, NO ANSWER as to who is going to be "in charge" in Libya when Qaddafi is gone.  And still NO ANSWER as to who is "in charge" in Egypt.

The last time a Democrat President was involved in "deposing" a "hated dictator" was when Jimmy Carter gave the Shah of Iran the boot, and the Ayatollah Khomeini took over.

And we all know how that worked out.

What's that saying about history repeating itself?


----------



## Nosmo King (Aug 21, 2011)

Has the Obama plan just demonstrated how to conduct regime change on the cheap?  Imagine those brave deficit hawks in the Tea Party caucus tomorrow railing against this development!  Why it took a trillion dollars and nearly 4,000 American lives lost (and countless American lives forever shattered by wounds) to achieve regime change in Iraq.

How can those Tea Partiers balance the books with the Iraq bill staring them in the face while six months, a few air strikes and no dead soldiers did the same in Libya.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > First Republicans screamed at him to do something.  Then they screamed at him to stop.  They screamed he was soft on terror.  Then they screamed that it was Republicans that got Bin Laden.
> ...



and try and do the right thing Dean......bring your GI Joe figure along and play with that.....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

Wry Catcher said:


> "Mission Accomplished"!  I've heard from a very credible source that President Obama has ordered the Navy to make him a flight suit so he can stand on the Flight Deck of CVN 65 and claim credit for Mission Accomplished in Lybia.



who is that?....Chris?....


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Harry Dresden said:


> Wry Catcher said:
> 
> 
> > "Mission Accomplished"!  I've heard from a very credible source that President Obama has ordered the Navy to make him a flight suit so he can stand on the Flight Deck of CVN 65 and claim credit for Mission Accomplished in Lybia.
> ...



Yeah.  Chris was whispering sweet nothings in Wry's ear.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



watch out......Shaman is out too....could be a fight.....my moneys on Dean....he hates white people.....


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

those sharpeners kicked ass.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

rightwinger said:


> How many Republicans voted to pull the plug for funding the Libyan effort?
> 
> Great leadership by John Boehner. Republicans once more on the wrong side of history



it aint over with yet RW......we dont know yet who is going to be on the "wrong" side....


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Harry Dresden said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > How many Republicans voted to pull the plug for funding the Libyan effort?
> ...



if hell breaks loose in Libya, RW will blame the republicans for that, too.


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 21, 2011)

Nosmo King said:


> Has the Obama plan just demonstrated how to conduct regime change on the cheap?  Imagine those brave deficit hawks in the Tea Party caucus tomorrow railing against this development!  Why it took a trillion dollars and nearly 4,000 American lives lost (and countless American lives forever shattered by wounds) to achieve regime change in Iraq.
> 
> How can those Tea Partiers balance the books with the Iraq bill staring them in the face while six months, a few air strikes and no dead soldiers did the same in Libya.



Obama and Hillary played their cards right on this one. Make Europe do the heavy lifting, no big investment in US lives or funding. End result, we got the regime change we wanted since Reagan


----------



## Dr.House (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



as sure as the sun rises in the east....


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 21, 2011)

Full-Auto said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Sometime this week you will see the GOP and Bush's cronies trot out the RW revisionists on FOX claiming how Bush's policies setup this victory....watch.
> ...



You're being disengenous. Isn't that exactly what they did the last time? You know, concerning Osama.


----------



## MeBelle (Aug 21, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> This is my 3rd post in this god damn thread. Will it be invisible too?
> 
> Obama was dragged into this kicking and screaming. Hillary if anyone was in front of this issue.



Gramps???
Where'd you go??


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 21, 2011)

BDBoop said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



Thank you! You see, it never ends with these RW idiots.

*SMH*


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

rightwinger said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Has the Obama plan just demonstrated how to conduct regime change on the cheap?  Imagine those brave deficit hawks in the Tea Party caucus tomorrow railing against this development!  Why it took a trillion dollars and nearly 4,000 American lives lost (and countless American lives forever shattered by wounds) to achieve regime change in Iraq.
> ...



So now it's Europe that "overthrew" Qaddafi.  Obama had little or nothing to do with the result.  Thanks for clarifying.


----------



## Wiseacre (Aug 21, 2011)

I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

BDBoop said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > BDBoop said:
> ...



I gave him credit for getting bin Laden and still do.  I don't give him any credit for this.  It's not our business.  I don't want him impeached cause nothing comes of that anyway.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

rightwinger said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Has the Obama plan just demonstrated how to conduct regime change on the cheap?  Imagine those brave deficit hawks in the Tea Party caucus tomorrow railing against this development!  Why it took a trillion dollars and nearly 4,000 American lives lost (and countless American lives forever shattered by wounds) to achieve regime change in Iraq.
> ...



Why is obama assiting America's enemy in Libya? Why is obama helping the people who we are atill fighting?


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Wiseacre said:


> I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.



He didn't get rid of him.  Europe and the Libyan rebels did.


----------



## Toro (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.
> ...



Obama gets some credit.

The Europeans were running out of weapons FFS.


----------



## Wiseacre (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.
> ...




Well yeah, but with our bombs and missiles.   Hey the guy is apparently dead or gone and we didn't lose any American lives and it didn't cost an arm and a leg and it didn't take 10 years either.   Of course he had shit for a military and was a complete dickhead idiot, but still.   How about this:  Obama didn't fuck it up.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Wiseacre said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Wiseacre said:
> ...



He didn't fuck it up.  But I still don't think we should have been involved.


----------



## Dr Grump (Aug 21, 2011)

I love this thread - a microism of all that is America.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Dr Grump said:


> I love this thread - a microism of all that is America.



oh yeah?  What are we Yanks saying that amuses you this time?


----------



## Wiseacre (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...




Well, that's true.   But Obama had to show us the correct way to start a war and then not show up to fight it.


----------



## Unkotare (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> He didn't get rid of him.





George Bush did. Same for Zine Al Abidine Ben Ali, Mubarak, etc.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > He didn't get rid of him.
> ...



I don't think so.  Bush is a fucking idiot.  And no he won't be revered by historians the way Lincoln is.


----------



## Dr Grump (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > I love this thread - a microism of all that is America.
> ...



Libya is being freed from the yoke of tyranny (although what it is going to be replaced with is unknown at this stage) and all you Yanks are going on about is who does or doesn't get the credit.

As per usual for such an ego/ethnocentric society it's all about ME ME ME !!


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Dr Grump said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



I'm skeptical that they're being freed anymore than the Iranians were from the Shah.  I don't think anyone really *deserves credit* for this.  I only know who was responsible for it.


----------



## KissMy (Aug 21, 2011)

Tripoli falls to Libyan rebels


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> > proof from credible source please?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



First link, NY Times...


> ...according to American officials.


That's the extent of the proof they offer. You have GOT to be kidding me. If I offered that as proof, you'd laugh me off the board.

Second link...
simply points to the NY Times piece. Nothing new or corroborating. Just a repeat. Worthless.

Third link...
Again with the 'government sources'. No names, ranks, positions, etc. I'd get laughed off this board if I claimed this tripe constituted proof.

Fourth link...
 UFPPC.ORG is a credible source for this information? You have GOT to be kidding. You are kidding, right?

Essentially, you've got a single story in the NY Times, no corroboration from your other links... ant THAT is proof?

You seriously need to rethink your life.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Aug 21, 2011)

Dr Grump said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Dr Grump said:
> ...



Actually I've been asking what is going to happen and who will be in charge in Libya, you notice no one seems to want to attempt an answer.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > Wry Catcher said:
> ...



you know they were talking about Chrisse's latest book....."Birkenstocks....With Or Without Socks".....


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...


see comment below dummies


elvis said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.
> ...



It would'nt have been possible w/o the President supplying U.S. power IN THE BEGINNING to take out AA batteries, ememy aircraft, air facilities, etc... at the beginning of the campaign. The U.S. was the only power w/ the advanced sensors/weaponry to do that.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Well congrats.  Let's applaud Obama on defending us from the great threat to the US that Qaddafi was.


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Dot Com said:
> 
> 
> > Conservative said:
> ...



Did you read ANYTHING about the reason for the participation in this operation?  It was to prevent Qaddafi from massacreing his own people. Geez!!!  If I remember correctly, the Repubs messiah- Reagan wasn't too fond of him either but let him remain in power


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Dot Com said:
> ...



Yeah.  Sure it was.....


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 21, 2011)

SFC Ollie said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



Its an asisine redundant question.

We all already know that there's no way to know the answer tob that at this time.

So why ask it dunce?


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Dot Com said:
> ...



WOW what a double standard. You left turds bashed bush because it was said he went to I Iraq to defend the Iraqis in the north.


----------



## elvis (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Dot Com said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



It was bullshit when Bush did and it's bullshit now that Obama's doing it.


----------



## Dr Grump (Aug 21, 2011)

SFC Ollie said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



It does appear that there is secular council of sorts in charge of the rebels. They seem to be pretty organised at the moment. No doubt they will split into factions over the next few months. However, if they do it right, they could be OK.... The world is watching and their diplomats know this...


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> bigrebnc1775 said:
> 
> 
> > Dot Com said:
> ...



I didn't say it was true, just pointing out the bullshit of the left.
Bush supposedly did it and they bitched and called it a lie, obama does it and everything is great.


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

Can't wait to see what RuperTV/Fox spins about this on Monday LOL. BTW- BOTH Republican- instigated operations are close to 10 yrs going and over $5 trillion +/- on this great nation's (read-"children's/future generation's") credit card. Last I heard The admin had only spent < 1.5 billion +/- on Libya.


----------



## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Can't wait to see what RuperTV/Fox spins about this on Monday LOL. BTW- BOTH Republican- instigated operations are close to 10 yrs going and over $5 trillion +/- on the nation's (read-"children's/future generation's") credit card. Last I heard The admin had only spent < 1.5 billion +/- on Libya.



Actually bush got the admitted mastermind of 9/11 try again


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Dot Com said:
> 
> 
> > elvis said:
> ...



43 said al qaeda was there along w/ weapons of mass destruction dummy  Turns out they only went there after Bush II invaded. You aint that bright.  Go back to the Oathkeeper thread


----------



## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

Gaddafi Safe With Obama - Conservative Voices

Libya&#8217;s leader Muammar al-Gaddafi has a bright future with President Obama running America&#8217;s foreign policy if the messages to the dictator coming from the White House are trustworthy.

Analysis: Obama Mum on Qaddafi

Republican Senators John Kyl and Mark Kirk released a joint statement calling upon Obama to speak out clearly in support of the Libyan people. Some Republicans. such as former House Speaker Newt Gingrich enjoyed goading the president. Gingrich accused Obama of practicing a conspiracy of silence when dealing with anti-American governments such as Libya and Iran.

At a Tea Party event in South Carolina, another Republican presidential hopeful and conservative favorite, representative Michele Bachman, gave her audience plenty of sound bites when she accused "Our Peace Prize-winning president" of fawning over dictators and potentates.

Noted columnist Charles Krauthammer repeated the accusation: "If you are ally of the United States, Israel, Egypt, Honduras, elsewhere; Obama is not a friend. If you are an enemy of the United States he might give you a pass,"

Obama Should Impose No-Fly Zone on Libya and Aid Insurgents, Senators Say

Speaking on the same program, McCain said: "I understand that America's security and safety of American citizens is our highest priority. It is not our only priority." He said, "The British prime minister and the French president and others were not hesitant and they have citizens in that country."

Sarah Palin upset with Obama, again

"We should not be afraid of freedom, especially when it comes to people suffering under a brutal enemy of America," Palin wrote. "Here's to freedom from Gaddafi for the people of Libya."

---------------------------------






*Republicans are like "Sour Patch Candies".*
*First they're Sour
Then they're Sweet*

*No matter what the President does, they are the "opposite".  If he said, "Let's subsidize the oil companies and give money to rich people", *Republicans would "Subsidies the oil companies and give money to rich people".  

What did you think I was going to say?  Republicans would never turn against their "patrons" and "masters".

--------------------------------

Republicans turn to doves over Obama's war in Libya

Republican leaders demanded a written justification of military involvement in Libya from President Obama Wednesday as the traditionally hawkish party shows signs of losing its appetite for war.

Lou Dobbs: Republicans Who Voted "No" on Defunding Obama's War in Libya

After a lot of tough talk and posturing, these are the 89 House Republicans who voted to "no" on defunding the president's war in Libya:


----------



## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> Dot Com said:
> 
> 
> > Can't wait to see what RuperTV/Fox spins about this on Monday LOL. BTW- BOTH Republican- instigated operations are close to 10 yrs going and over $5 trillion +/- on the nation's (read-"children's/future generation's") credit card. Last I heard The admin had only spent < 1.5 billion +/- on Libya.
> ...



Are you saying George "I never think about him" Bush?

You mean George "I closed the CIA unit assigned to finding Bin Laden" Bush?

That Bush?  That's the Bush that got him?  You sure?


----------



## DiAnna (Aug 21, 2011)

As happy as I am that the Libyan people might get the freedom they seek, I'm not sure if the devil they don't know is going to be better than the devil they knew.  Tunisia seems to be doing well.  Egypt, not so much.

Obama had nothing to do with the Tunisian and Egyptian revolutions.  The people of those countries did it all by themselves.  As for Libya, France and Italy took the reigns on this, followed by the UK.  Obama agreed to be part of a NATO force.  That means team, and there's no "i" in team.  Obama deserves neither blame nor credit on this... it's all in the hands of the Libyan people themselves and NATO support.

Some posts in this thread seem to think that America actually mattered in all these revolutions.  We didn't.  NATO would have supported the rebels whether America joined in or not.  Being a team player, we went... and probably paid the lion's share of costs involved.

So I wait anxiously and hopefully to see if the Libyans will get their wish, or find like the Egyptians did that tyrants slip easily into a power vacuum.  I'm hoping for the best.  I'd love to see strong, stable democracies in that part of the world.  If it happens, we'd better not be patting ourselves on the back or pointing fingers.  We didn't bleed for their freedom.  They did.


----------



## Unkotare (Aug 21, 2011)

elvis said:


> Dr Grump said:
> 
> 
> > I love this thread - a microism of all that is America.
> ...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3Pp8DElR2E&feature=related]Joe Pesci is funny - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



Outright lie, as the British were involved in the first NATO strikes in Libya.


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

DiAnna said:


> As happy as I am that the Libyan people might get the freedom they seek, I'm not sure if the devil they don't know is going to be better than the devil they knew.  Tunisia seems to be doing well.  Egypt, not so much.
> 
> Obama had nothing to do with the Tunisian and Egyptian revolutions.  The people of those countries did it all by themselves.  As for Libya, France and Italy took the reigns on this, followed by the UK.  Obama agreed to be part of a NATO force.  That means team, and there's no "i" in team.  Obama deserves neither blame nor credit on this... it's all in the hands of the Libyan people themselves and NATO support.
> 
> ...



Sometimes the cure is worse than the disease, these people have never lived in a Democracy, there are warring factions over there, 32 different tribes fighting for power. I don't know but after all the high fiving, the celebration, reality sets in and it might be a reality that none of us want to witness. Civil war could erupt, I certainly hope that the U.N with peace keeping troops move in before all chaos breaks out. If looting begins, which I think it will, many innocent people could be in harm's way. I don't want our people bleeding for their freedom, I don't want American boots on the ground over there.


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

Conservative said:


> Outright lie, as the British were involved in the first NATO strikes in Libya.



The U.S. did the heavy lifting in the beginning. Taking out AA batteries, enemy aircraft, enemy airfields, etc...


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Gaddafi Safe With Obama - Conservative Voices
> 
> Libya&#8217;s leader Muammar al-Gaddafi has a bright future with President Obama running America&#8217;s foreign policy if the messages to the dictator coming from the White House are trustworthy.
> 
> ...



Good post. Republicans...


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

Wiseacre said:


> I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.



You better hope that Obama knew what he was doing, there are Al Queda factions in those rebels and if this goes south which I think it will, Obama won't want his name on it. I think there will be a civil war, many of these people are not for Democracy, many want a total Islamic state, there will be a power grab going on with the 32 different tribes and if Obama has his name tied to this action, where many innocent lives could be lost, it's gonna be ugly for him. It already is with our economy, this would be a second death blow for him.


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Gaddafi Safe With Obama - Conservative Voices
> ...



This isn't over until the fat lady sings and she has not sung on this. We have no idea who these rebels are, many are al queda, Libya has 32 tribes which will all fight for power. This could turn out to be one more disaster for the Obama administration and if we have to put boots on the ground to stem the chaos, he will be blamed for it by all Americans. I am betting tomorrow the party is over and the looting and violence starts.


----------



## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

Maple said:


> Wiseacre said:
> 
> 
> > I'd feel better about giving Obama some credit for getting rid of Qaddafi, if I thought he knew what he was doing.
> ...



Actually, the reason Bush Sr. stopped at the Iraqi border was because he didn't want to "own" the Iraq mess.  Nation building doesn't work.  Look at how Bush Jr. and Iraq have helped bankrupt this nation.  Not only is there the cost of the 900 billion lost, but thousands of soldiers who have brain and spinal injuries.  That will probably cost another trillion.  Then there is rebuilding the military and.....oh well, you get the picture.  Fortunately, Republicans have passed all that over to Obama.  Republicans aren't very good at the "responsibility" thing.


----------



## rdean (Aug 21, 2011)

Maple said:


> Dot Com said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



So you are saying it was better under Qaddafi?


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > Dot Com said:
> ...



After this, it might be a massacre anyway, civil war is likely with all the different factions, all vying for power. No semblance of a government ready to move in and  take over the reigns. Choas begins tomorrow.


----------



## Kuros (Aug 21, 2011)

I think some of those with Obama Derangement Syndrome need some lessons in manners.  

Here's what you should say in this situation:  

Congratulations, LIBYA.


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Maple said:
> 
> 
> > Dot Com said:
> ...



I am saying that there is no government ready to move in and take power, turn on the water, get things moving. I had no love for Gaddafi either, he is a mad man and criminal, but sometimes the cure is worse than the disease. There is no leadership, no organization, no police, no order and no law. Thugs can start forming gangs who roam the streets and terrorize the innocent. 
There are 32 different tribes over there including Al queda members who want power, now what do you think is going to happen after the party is over. Chaos.  These people have never known freedmon they may have traded one stituation for a worse situation. It certainly happened in Iran after they threw out the shaw and the Iatolla took over. They want the shaw back now.


----------



## Kuros (Aug 21, 2011)

Maple said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Maple said:
> ...



Why don't you give it five minutes, jeez.  It took them, what, 5 months to force Q out?  Can't they have 5 days before you get to grousing about the spectre of Chaos?  

Ah, I know.  You think this is like Iraq.  Nope.  This movement has broad nation-wide legitimacy and wasn't imposed upon the country by the outside.


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

rdean said:


> Maple said:
> 
> 
> > Wiseacre said:
> ...



There is a huge difference between Iraq and Libya, first and foremost, we don't have any boots on the ground over there to quell any violence that could occur. That's irresponsible, there is no representative government ready to take the reigns over there, we should have stayed completely out of it, because we may have to go in now to stop a massacre. Time will tell but I don't have any hope of a positive outcome with this. These people have no idea how to set up a Democracy let alone know what freedom is, there will be a power grab by certain groups, there was no plan for a transfer of power and that is why the Republicans did not want to get involved in the first place. It's typical though of our spender in chief, he rarely has a plan at least not one that anyone has seen.


----------



## Maple (Aug 21, 2011)

Maple said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Maple said:
> ...



Clinton spent 4.5 million a day.

Bush spent 1.2 billion a day----- after 9-11.

The spender in chief ( Obama)  spends 4.2 billion a day, now do the math, that's 3 billion more a day than Bush. Bush had 9-11 to deal with, what's Obama's excuse??? Oh, I forgot " we have to spend more to get OUT of debt."


----------



## Conservative (Aug 21, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Conservative said:
> 
> 
> > Outright lie, as the British were involved in the first NATO strikes in Libya.
> ...



But they were NOT the only ones with the technology, as the post I was responding to indicated. Therefore, that post was a lie. And the 'heavy lifting' mantra is a dem talking point.

NATO launches 74 airstrikes in Libya on first day of operations
NATO Unleashes Blistering Airstrikes in Libya
NATO Airstrikes Take Out 8 Libyan Warships

The US ran the initial airstrikes, which were a JOINT EFFORT. Period. To say otherwise is an attempt to rewrite history.


----------



## Douger (Aug 22, 2011)

Mee murkinz


----------



## Lakhota (Aug 22, 2011)

*2011 military intervention in Libya*

*USA:* The United States has deployed a naval force of 11 ships, including the amphibious assault ship USS Kearsarge, the amphibious transport dock USS Ponce, the guided-missile destroyers USS Barry and USS Stout, the nuclear attack submarines USS Providence and USS Scranton, the cruise missile submarine USS Florida and the amphibious command ship USS Mount Whitney.[137][138][139] Additionally, A-10 ground-attack aircraft, B-2 stealth bombers, AV-8B Harrier II jump-jets, EA-18 electronic warfare aircraft, and both F-15 and F-16 fighters have been involved in action over Libya.[140] U-2 reconnaissance aircraft are stationed on Cyprus.[141] On 18 March, two AC-130Us arrived at RAF Mildenhall as well as additional tanker aircraft.[citation needed] On 24 March 2 E-8Cs operated from Naval Station Rota Spain, which indicates an increase of ground attacks.[citation needed] An undisclosed number of CIA operatives are said to be in Libya to gather intelligence for airstrikes and make contacts with rebels.[142] The US also began using MQ-1 Predator UAVs to strike targets in Libya on 23 April.[143]

MORE: 2011 military intervention in Libya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## RetiredGySgt (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> Toro said:
> 
> 
> > Here's hoping.
> ...



So the US should assassinate those we disagree with? Did you feel the same about Saddam Hussein?


----------



## Unkotare (Aug 22, 2011)

rdean said:


> Actually, the reason Bush Sr. stopped at the Iraqi border was because he didn't want to "own" the Iraq mess.  Nation building doesn't work.




President Bush stopped at the border because that was the agreement he had reached with Arab leaders to gain their acquiescence for the operation. 

Nation building _has_ worked in Iraq. The democracy that stands where recently there was a brutal dictatorship, and the courage of Iraqis in defying death threats from terrorists, insurgents, and Iranian operatives to go and vote and claim their own future is the water that has irrigated the on-going Arab Spring.


----------



## Unkotare (Aug 22, 2011)

elvis said:


> And no he won't be revered by historians the way Lincoln is.




Do you expect anyone to be revered the way Lincoln is?


----------



## elvis (Aug 22, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > And no he won't be revered by historians the way Lincoln is.
> ...



Bush won't be revered at all.  and he has compared himself to Lincoln in that he says historians will vindicate him.  They won't.


----------



## Unkotare (Aug 22, 2011)

elvis said:


> he says historians will vindicate him.  They won't.





Well, either way we're going to have to wait and see on that one, wouldn't you admit?


----------



## elvis (Aug 22, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > he says historians will vindicate him.  They won't.
> ...



Kind of like waiting to see if the Cubs win the World Series next year... yes.


----------



## Nosmo King (Aug 22, 2011)

rightwinger said:


> Nosmo King said:
> 
> 
> > Has the Obama plan just demonstrated how to conduct regime change on the cheap?  Imagine those brave deficit hawks in the Tea Party caucus tomorrow railing against this development!  Why it took a trillion dollars and nearly 4,000 American lives lost (and countless American lives forever shattered by wounds) to achieve regime change in Iraq.
> ...


It really shows how coalition building can accomplish more than a "coalition of the willing".  I wonder how Bush Jr. failed to learn the lesson originally taught by his father.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 22, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> *2011 military intervention in Libya*
> 
> *USA:* The United States has deployed a naval force of 11 ships, including the amphibious assault ship USS Kearsarge, the amphibious transport dock USS Ponce, the guided-missile destroyers USS Barry and USS Stout, the nuclear attack submarines USS Providence and USS Scranton, the cruise missile submarine USS Florida and the amphibious command ship USS Mount Whitney.[137][138][139] Additionally, A-10 ground-attack aircraft, B-2 stealth bombers, AV-8B Harrier II jump-jets, EA-18 electronic warfare aircraft, and both F-15 and F-16 fighters have been involved in action over Libya.[140] U-2 reconnaissance aircraft are stationed on Cyprus.[141] On 18 March, two AC-130Us arrived at RAF Mildenhall as well as additional tanker aircraft.[citation needed] On 24 March 2 E-8Cs operated from Naval Station Rota Spain, which indicates an increase of ground attacks.[citation needed] *An undisclosed number of CIA operatives are said to be in Libya* to gather intelligence for airstrikes and make contacts with rebels.[142] The US also began using MQ-1 Predator UAVs to strike targets in Libya on 23 April.[143]
> 
> MORE: 2011 military intervention in Libya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



A... anyone who uses Wiki as Gospel proof is a moron. I can and have edited Wiki in any way I like.

B... Yes, we know the US was involved. .. as part of NATO actions. So were a number of other countries.

C... 'said' is the operative word on the CIA. Until there is some official notice of it, it's hearsay.


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 22, 2011)

Nosmo King said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Nosmo King said:
> ...



I liked how for once, the US wasn't the one who had to put boots on the ground while Europe gave us support troops. Libya was a European creation and it was their responsibility to clean up their mess


----------



## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

RetiredGySgt said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Toro said:
> ...



Disagree with?

No.

Orders terrorist attacks against American Civilians?

First we issue a warrant.

Then we give them an hour to comply.

If no compliance..oh well.


----------



## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

Wow looks like the rebels are going to pull it off, I wish them the best in rebuilding their country and I hope they keep an open mind and don't become a religious theocracy.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> Wow looks like the rebels are going to pull it off, I wish them the best in rebuilding their country and I hope they keep an open mind and don't become a religious theocracy.



The best thing about this was the way it was done.

NATO leveled the playing field. And a popular revolution kicked ass.

Now it's their country. It's not being "given" to them. They fought for it..bled for it..and when you pay that sort of price..you are basically alot more careful with the outcome.


----------



## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Wow looks like the rebels are going to pull it off, I wish them the best in rebuilding their country and I hope they keep an open mind and don't become a religious theocracy.
> ...



Yup I'm glad it all worked out, for a while it looked like this stalemate was going to last for a while. Libya has alot of potential, I think after they sort everything out with their new government is can be quite a country.


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Wow looks like the rebels are going to pull it off, I wish them the best in rebuilding their country and I hope they keep an open mind and don't become a religious theocracy.
> ...



It will take time for the political structure to work its way out. But Libya is not populated by savages. They have immense oil wealth and need to maintain a certain political stability to keep the oil money flowing. It was the common Libyan who did the fighting and dying in the Libyan revolution but it will be the rich power brokers who decide on the government structure


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 22, 2011)

Maple said:


> Dot Com said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



YOU LIE!!!  (JoeWilson-speak)  So you admit that you know nothing about the Libyan Transitional Council?  I accept that 
Sarkozy To Speak With Libyan Transition Council Monday - WSJ.com


----------



## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

Okay..I admit it..I sorta got this wrong.

The Gaddafis *are *leaving..

But it may be in pine boxes.


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 22, 2011)

Kuros said:


> Maple said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...


Maple is unaware of the Rebel's insistence on going it alone, as far as the ground action is concerned, or she's feigning ignorance of the fact. This doesn't surprise me as Maple comes-off as being quite partisan. All they wanted was air assets to stop the slaughter by gaddafi's planes and advisors from Britain. Methinks Maple is upset because the President took the step to stop humanitarian crisis and he's a Democrat 


Maple said:


> Maple said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



Thanks for letting us know your agenda you partisan  This operation cost less than one week in Iraq in 2007.


----------



## Political Junky (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> Okay..I admit it..I sorta got this wrong.
> 
> The Gaddafis *are *leaving..
> 
> But it may be in pine boxes.


One of his sons tried to escape the country in drag, but was captured.


----------



## BDBoop (Aug 22, 2011)

Political Junky said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Okay..I admit it..I sorta got this wrong.
> ...



BWAAAAAhahahahahahahahaaaaaa!!!


----------



## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

Political Junky said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Okay..I admit it..I sorta got this wrong.
> ...


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 22, 2011)

Wonder how Fox News is handling this given they're the communications-arm of GObP?


----------



## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

Political Junky said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Okay..I admit it..I sorta got this wrong.
> ...



Are you serious? which one tries this? Seif?


----------



## rightwinger (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> Political Junky said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



That is a common rumor that has been used for centuries (They said it about Lincoln and Jeff Davis) just to demean the outgoing leader

I'd like to see more proof


----------



## L.K.Eder (Aug 22, 2011)

rightwinger said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Political Junky said:
> ...




yeah, it's like this.

Osama Bin Laden Killed While Sitting On Toilet, Nation Likes To Imagine | The Onion - America's Finest News Source


> NEW YORKOsama bin Laden, 54-year-old leader of the international  terrorist group al-Qaeda and mastermind of the 9/11 attacks that took  nearly 3,000 American lives in 2001, was killed early Monday morning in  Pakistan while sitting on the toilet, the U.S. populace took great  pleasure in imagining today. Just thinking about the stupid look on  that evil bastards face when those Navy SEALs kicked in the bathroom  door and started blasting awayits so totally priceless, said Queens,  NY resident Rachel Sumner, one of 311 million Americans who reveled in a  fictional scenario in which bin Laden met his gruesome and humiliating  end while sitting on the commode, humming to himself, and reading a  newspaper. And him frantically trying to pull up his boxer shorts  seconds before some badass Special Forces guy blows his head offha, ha!  What a fucking moron. *Some Americans have disputed this fabricated  version of bin Ladens death, explaining they prefer to imagine the  terrorist leader being surprised by Navy SEALs while wearing bright red  lipstick, trying on ladies clothing, sashaying in front of a  full-length mirror, and saying, Whos the prettiest little girl?  Osama's the prettiest little girl!*


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## SFC Ollie (Aug 22, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Wonder how Fox News is handling this given they're the communications-arm of GObP?



The morning news "Fox and Friends" simply reported what was believed to be happening, without bias. You know, the way news is supposed to be......


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 22, 2011)

Plasmaball said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Plasmaball said:
> ...



No. It's called an observation. An opinion would involve my personal thoughts or judgment. I haven't made any. It's sort of like saying "Water is wet". No opinion there, it just is.

Now, I know my observation has upset you for some odd reason otherwise you wouldn't have had to resort to name calling and negative repping (Seriously, as if rep means anything). So clearly you don't like anyone pointing out that your record is lacking substantive discussion. 

There are two ways of dealing with this: attack the messenger to deflect from your personal defects. Or change yourself and start making substantive comments. I'm disappointed that you haven't chosen the latter, but I never thought you would without serious Divine Intervention. 

Oh, and that last part, was an opinion.

have a good day.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 22, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > Avatar4321 said:
> ...



It's called analyzing and reasoning. 

As of now he is still completely ignoring the point and hasn't dealt with the substance. One does not go to this length to avoid something that's easy to deal with.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> I'm really pretty shocked that nobody really remembers this asshole, Gaddafi, was the author of Lockerbie.
> 
> No terrorist that kills Americans, especially in mass numbers, should have safe harbor anywhere in the world.
> 
> ...



That Qaddafi was evil is not being disputed.

I don't think I'd have half the trouble I have with this incursion if the President went through proper channels and obtained support for Congress in this. But he hasn't. This whole military excursion has been illegal. It's amazing the Democrats complained about Iraq being illegal when it was legally authorized but there isn't a peep over Libya when Congress hasn't been consulted and the people haven't been given clear reasons why our military is being used there.

Not to mention I don't really like the fact that we now have rebels, which include Al Qaeda, poised to take over. I don't really think we want Al Qaeda to have another safe haven thanks to us.

I haven't supported this, not because I don't think Qaddafi needs to be brought to justice, but because we are using American lives, money, and resources to bring further chaos to that reason with no really clear purpose and no evidence that we will benefit from anything that happens. It's just foolishness.

Let Qaddafi find justice before the Lord Almighty. Let's just not become someone as bad as he is in our quest for justice.


----------



## Avatar4321 (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Could not give a rat's ass what your "opinion" is. We are not the 'victors', the Libyan people are.
> ...



A pyrrhic victory indeed.


----------



## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

Avatar4321 said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > I'm really pretty shocked that nobody really remembers this asshole, Gaddafi, was the author of Lockerbie.
> ...



Congress would have kiboshed the Osama bin Laden operation if they'd known about it.

The primary goal of the GOP is to make President Obama a one term president.

That's it.


----------



## elvis (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> > Sallow said:
> ...



I doubt if they'd known bin Laden would be killed, they'd go as far as to kill the mission just to obama gone.


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## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

elvis said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> > Avatar4321 said:
> ...



I don't. There are some very radical people in congress right now.

The whole debt ceiling debacle illustrated that in a very clear way.


----------



## Chris (Aug 22, 2011)

(CNN) -- With Libyan rebels reaching Tripoli, the endgame is at hand. Intense fighting may lie ahead, but three of Moammar Gadhafi's sons are reportedly in custody and the power of the regime appears to be rapidly eroding.

Many questions and uncertainties remain, especially regarding the character of the new regime and whether Gadhafi loyalists go quietly or continue to resist, but one point is clear: The apparent collapse of the Gadhafi government is a major success for NATO and a vindication of President Barack Obama's policy of multilateral humanitarian interventionism.

In making the case for a limited military intervention in Libya, Obama emphasized the moral and political obligation of states to protect those who are victimized by genocide or mass killing, especially when such crimes are perpetrated by their own governments. The principle of the "responsibility to protect" entered the international policy lexicon over the past decade as a response to genocidal killings in Rwanda, Serbia and Sudan.

When governments are unable or willing to protect their citizens, or when governments are terrorizing their own people and committing mass murder, the international community has a responsibility to step in and help those who are victimized.

A major win for Obama's Libya policy - CNN.com


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## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

Hey if guys like Gaddafi get toppled without 1 American troop dying, how can I get mad at that?


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## SFC Ollie (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> Hey if guys like Gaddafi get toppled without 1 American troop dying, how can I get mad at that?



I love it. However, our involvement should have legally gone before congress..


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## Two Thumbs (Aug 22, 2011)

So now it's good to be a warmongering murderer as long as NATO leads the way?


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## elvis (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> Hey if guys like Gaddafi get toppled without 1 American troop dying, how can I get mad at that?



because it wasn't our business.  Just like Iraq wasn't.


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## manifold (Aug 22, 2011)

Another budding totalitarian Islamic theocracy.

Well done!


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## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

elvis said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > Hey if guys like Gaddafi get toppled without 1 American troop dying, how can I get mad at that?
> ...



Maybe so, I was against getting involved as well but Gaddafi is an asshole with American blood on our hands, if he meets his end this way I will shed no tears over him.


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## California Girl (Aug 22, 2011)

Sallow said:


> Okay..I admit it..I sorta got this wrong.
> 
> The Gaddafis *are *leaving..
> 
> But it may be in pine boxes.



No 'sort of' about it. You lied in your title and created reality from a rumor. Are you related to truthmatters? Perhaps you are one of her 'high functioning' siblings?


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## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

manifold said:


> Another budding totalitarian Islamic theocracy.
> 
> Well done!



That is very possible but I hope not.


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## elvis (Aug 22, 2011)

manifold said:


> Another budding totalitarian Islamic theocracy.
> 
> Well done!



Could be a democracy..  one where they vote in the most brutal fundamentalist you can imagine.


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## BoycottTheday (Aug 22, 2011)

I love the Obama'ettes, something gets completely broken and its called a success!


----------



## konradv (Aug 22, 2011)

Two Thumbs said:


> So now it's good to be a warmongering murderer as long as NATO leads the way?



It's good to help people who are trying to help themselves.  The oil in Libya made it a vested national interest.  We didn't commit any of our own troops and none of our people died.  What are you crying about?  Just can't take it that Obama got Osama AND Khadafi?  I won't give an inch on this, because if Obama hadn't done something, many of the same people would have said he allowed freedom to be crushed.  It's a lot different than invading a country whose people hadn't risen up, where our oil supply wasn't threatened and whose leader was effectively bottled up and impotent militarily.


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## elvis (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> elvis said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



I'm not shedding tears over him or Saddam, either, for that matter.  I'm tired of Wilson's 14 points being played out year after year.


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## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

konradv said:


> Two Thumbs said:
> 
> 
> > So now it's good to be a warmongering murderer as long as NATO leads the way?
> ...



Very true, Obama is damned if he did, damned if he didn't with the people that hate him. The oil in Libya is very promising however alot depends on what kind of government rises from the ashes of Gaddafi, if its an Islamic theocracy than it will have been a bad decision to get involved, if its an actual democracy than this will be a success.


----------



## California Girl (Aug 22, 2011)

Avatar4321 said:


> Plasmaball said:
> 
> 
> > Avatar4321 said:
> ...



I concur with your observation, having observed similar myself.


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## California Girl (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> konradv said:
> 
> 
> > Two Thumbs said:
> ...



I agree, I was heartened to see the rebels continually thanking NATO for their efforts on the BBC today. Several times, different rebels spoke about NATO's support. I just hope they remember this when forming their new government. 

What is funny is how very few on the left are announcing that this is a glorious day for democracy in the region.... I guess they must still be smarting over Egypt.


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## High_Gravity (Aug 22, 2011)

California Girl said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > konradv said:
> ...



I'll tell you what CG 10 years ago if you told me Saddam Hussein, Gaddafi and Mubarak would be ousted from power and Bashar Assad would be on the ropes I would have never believed you in a million years, I am glad these tin pot dictators are falling I just hope the people do what is right. So far the Egyptians don't seem to be, lets see what the Libyans do.


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## SFC Ollie (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> > Another budding totalitarian Islamic theocracy.
> ...



We've had enough hope and change.......


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## Sallow (Aug 22, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...



No ending to a revolution is pretty. It's magical thinking to think that everything will immediately fall into place.

Setting up a government is a long and very hard process.

We are still working on it.


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## High_Gravity (Aug 23, 2011)

Sallow said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



No doubt, it took this country 100 years and a civil war to find out who we were.


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## Unkotare (Aug 23, 2011)

konradv said:


> where our oil supply wasn't threatened .




Most of Lybia's oil ends up in Europe.


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## California Girl (Aug 23, 2011)

Sallow said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



That kind of depends how you're defining 'we', doesn't it. The left seem to be of the opinion that it is their country to run, and the rest of us should 'STFU'. That's not 'we', idiot.


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## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

...without unnecessarily endangering American lives in the process.

Yup, NATO (with the help of the US, of course) now has a major victory under its belt (a first, by the way), and the Libyan people are now rid of Gaddafi, and no American lives were lost in the process.  That's called a win-win-win situation.

Of course, conservatives are uspest (they're always upset) about it.  They criticized the policy when it was started, and they were never really supported the action seeing as how the Republican led House issued a rebuke of President Barack Obama's Libya policy on June 3 by a vote of 268-145 .

House rips Obama Libya policy - CNN

But Obama was proven right, and Republicans have shown themselves to be a party that is more interested in undermining a Democrat President than they are in supporting the troops and the commander-in-chief in a time of war.

Bad form


----------



## Mr Natural (Aug 23, 2011)

But how do we know that what they get next won't be worse.

"The better the devil you know."


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## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Mr Clean said:


> But how do we know that what they get next won't be worse.
> 
> "The better the devil you know."


 
That's always a concern, but Gaddafi has been running Libya like a egomanical nut case since Nixon's first year in office.  This year, with the whole Arab Spring thing sweeping the ME, it was time to take him down when the opportunity presented itself.  Hopefully, this will hasten Assad's (and a few others) departure.


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## hortysir (Aug 23, 2011)

Which conservatives, exactly, are upset by this victory?


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## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Yay! now we get to spend billions/trillions trying to re-build it over the next 5-20 years and hope that we don't arm terrorists or put in another puppet Government that ends up killing it's people... yay!

America, fuck yeah! 

Obama: Killing people in the middle east, because their lives don't matter if it can possibly give me a bump in the polls for that week!

And all the pro military nation building Democrats come out cheering! YAyayayayYAYayay WAR yayYAYaYAY!


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## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

hortysir said:


> Which conservatives, exactly, are upset by this victory?


Infidel, Uncensored, Kissmy for starters.


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## Truthmatters (Aug 23, 2011)

There is no need to rebuild it , the lybian people will rebuild it with the vast oil wealth Gaddafi was stealing from them for decades.

I know some of you prefer dictatorships but I perfer democracy


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## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

Avorysuds said:


> Yay! now we get to spend billions/trillions trying to re-build it over the next 5-20 years and hope that we don't arm terrorists or put in another puppet Government that ends up killing it's people... yay!
> 
> America, fuck yeah!
> 
> ...


You do know that everything you're mad about hasn't actualy happened.....don't you?


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## Dot Com (Aug 23, 2011)

cost of under $2 billion and ZERO American lives lost.


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## oreo (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> ...without unnecessarily endangering American lives in the process.
> 
> Yup, NATO (with the help of the US, of course) now has a major victory under its belt (a first, by the way), and the Libyan people are now rid of Gaddafi, and no American lives were lost in the process.  That's called a win-win-win situation.
> 
> ...



Well most of us are taking bets on when these new "free" rebels will be turning the guns that we supplied them with--on US--

Over 20 different TRIBAL groups all vowing for the power grab in Libya--spells a lot more violence in the ensuing months to come.

We really don't know who these rebels are.  _Been there done that before._


----------



## Two Thumbs (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> ...without unnecessarily endangering American lives in the process.
> 
> Yup, NATO (with the help of the US, of course) now has a major victory under its belt (a first, by the way), and the Libyan people are now rid of Gaddafi, and no American lives were lost in the process.  That's called a win-win-win situation.
> 
> ...



I love the hypocracy.

Thank you for being such a blantant partisan party before country leftist hack job.


we bombed and killed innocent people.

But since it's a (D) in the WH, you are alllll good with murder.

vomitous puke stain


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 23, 2011)

Avorysuds said:


> Yay! now we get to spend billions/trillions trying to re-build it over the next 5-20 years and hope that we don't arm terrorists or put in another puppet Government that ends up killing it's people... yay!
> 
> America, fuck yeah!
> 
> ...





oreo said:


> Well most of us are taking bets on when these new "free" rebels will be turning the guns that we supplied them with--on US--
> 
> Over 20 different TRIBAL groups all vowing for the power grab in Libya--spells a lot more violence in the ensuing months to come.
> 
> We really don't know who these rebels are.  _Been there done that before._



So you two disagree w/ Reagan who tried to kill that terrist (Ghaddafi)?


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 23, 2011)

At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.

Then it became he's doing too much.

It's now shifted to, Obama didn't do it fast enough.

I bet before the week's over it will be Obama just followed Bush's prescription, hence he didn't do anything.

[I just edited the 2nd step]


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

MarcATL said:


> At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.
> 
> Then it became he didn't do anything.
> 
> ...


Right now the thing is "it's going to go bad like things did in Iraq" thing.


----------



## High_Gravity (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.
> ...



Even it does, we don't have hundreds of thousands of American Troops on the ground that will have to fight for their lives against a Libyan insurgency, the Libyans overthrew Gaddafi on their own and that makes things alot different than the case in Iraq where we just went in there and did it for them.


----------



## pete (Aug 23, 2011)

oreo said:


> mustang said:
> 
> 
> > ...without unnecessarily endangering american lives in the process.
> ...


fast and furious!!!


----------



## hortysir (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> hortysir said:
> 
> 
> > Which conservatives, exactly, are upset by this victory?
> ...




Thanks for your input, but my question was directed towards Mustang who, apparently, had certain ones in mind when he said "conservatives are upset".

I took it to mean more 'publicly-known' conservatives.


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...


I know...I know....but they're saying we will.


----------



## High_Gravity (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> High_Gravity said:
> 
> 
> > toxicmedia said:
> ...



I don't want American troops anywhere near Libya, injecting another element into this situation will make a combustible situation even worse.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Truthmatters said:


> There is no need to rebuild it , the lybian people will rebuild it with the vast oil wealth Gaddafi was stealing from them for decades.
> 
> I know some of you prefer dictatorships but I perfer democracy



Didn't "you people" predict the Libya war to last like a couple weeks and cost a million bucks or something?

Now you want people to believe we wont play a hand (money) in re building that country just like Iraq?

LOL@u...

How's that degree you think is incredibly important but still don't have TM?


http://www.usmessageboard.com/military/170716-libyan-war-cost-skyrockets.html


Libya war costs for U.S.: $896 million so far - Checkpoint Washington - The Washington Post


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

MarcATL said:


> At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.
> 
> Then it became he's doing too much.
> 
> ...


 
It's sad, really.

If Obama said he was in favor of mothers being able to nurse their babies in public (discretely, of course), conservatives would scream that he was abandoning the long held American value of modesty in public places (and probably worse).  If Obama said he was against mothers nursing their babies in public, conservatives would accuse Obama of not supporting women and families.

Nothing ever changes but the particular topic being demagogued.


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 23, 2011)

Avorysuds said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > There is no need to rebuild it , the lybian people will rebuild it with the vast oil wealth Gaddafi was stealing from them for decades.
> ...



if 896 million= "skyrocket", what does $3 TRILLION + for iraq =?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> hortysir said:
> 
> 
> > Which conservatives, exactly, are upset by this victory?
> ...



Izzatrite?

Well, you are consistent with your facts - you just make up virtually everything you post, so why should this be different?


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

High_Gravity said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > High_Gravity said:
> ...


Exactly!....and so far....nobody has proposed we send troops there.....has anyone from our government proposed anything like that?...hope not!


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Avorysuds said:
> 
> 
> > Yay! now we get to spend billions/trillions trying to re-build it over the next 5-20 years and hope that we don't arm terrorists or put in another puppet Government that ends up killing it's people... yay!
> ...



Why are we talking about Reagan? Are you trying to say Obama is like Reagan, who is like Bush and that makes it all better... again? Thx for helping prove that without a doubt Obama is in fact a Neocon, along with his supporters because you can't call Reagan and Bush Neocons and then claim Obama is not when they share the same fucking policies LOL!


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > hortysir said:
> ...


You mean you're not upset that Obama's policies resulted in the ousting of K-daff? and not one American death?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

MarcATL said:


> At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.



Yeah, bullshit.

You're such a fucking liar - but that's a big part of being a leftist.


----------



## Jarhead (Aug 23, 2011)

Hussein was "dethroned" in a matter of days...and captured not long after that.
Defeating a dictator is the easy part.
Maintaining stability so a demoicratic government can properly form is the difficult part.
We dont even know of the insurgents yet...if any.

I suggest all of us sit back and see what happens....but this time around, our brave soldiers may be following the orders of the UN....not OUR military leaders....


----------



## Jarhead (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.
> ...



I dont even respond to that flip flopping hypocritical partisan jerk anymore.


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > toxicmedia said:
> ...


 
They were down with the whole shock 'n' awe thing that had over a hundred thousand ground troops sent into Iraq for nonexistent WMDs (which just so happened to result in over 4,400 American deaths).  But that was a Republican president.  But no American deaths with an American president as commander-in-chief?  That's beyond the pale in some strange way.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> You mean you're not upset that Obama's policies resulted in the ousting of K-daff? and not one American death?



I'm not unhappy to see Gaddaffi go. Only the most scummy of partisan dumbfucks would claim Obama played a significant role, though.....


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

So the new rule of the Democratic party... well Democratic fringe, because their base is degrading quickly just like the Republican base did under Bush (you know fracturing the party and all). Anyways, the new rule is if a Republican is elected all they have to do is run over to NATO (pretty much the US) and then attack whoever they want and never set "US" boots on the ground so that no Americans die and BAM! It's a "not war" that was worth fighting? Fuck, can we use nukes or do these new rules only allow drones and the use of other people militaries armed and directed by us?


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.
> ...


 
Au contraire...

Gingrich: U.S. Military Should Go To War With Libya &#8216;This Evening,&#8217; NATO &#8216;Won&#8217;t Bring Much To The Fight&#8217; | ThinkProgress


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Jarhead said:


> Hussein was "dethroned" in a matter of days...and captured not long after that.
> Defeating a dictator is the easy part.
> Maintaining stability so a demoicratic government can properly form is the difficult part.
> We dont even know of the insurgents yet...if any.
> ...



This has been my point... Now comes the real costs.


----------



## TakeAStepBack (Aug 23, 2011)

So, as long as no Americans were killed everything is everything? Forget the international and domestic laws that were broken. Forget the breach of the UN resolution regarding libya. Forget the civilians that were killed during NATO bombings in Libya (the breach and then some). Forget the fact that it wasn't a considered or sold as a war until people stopped paying attention, it was a humanitarian crisis. 

NATO did a great job at all of the above and the best you all can talk about are fucking party politics? How shocking....


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 23, 2011)

Avorysuds said:


> Why are we talking about Reagan? Are you trying to say Obama is like Reagan, who is like Bush and that makes it all better... again? Thx for helping prove that without a doubt Obama is in fact a Neocon, along with his supporters because you can't call Reagan and Bush Neocons and then claim Obama is not when they share the same fucking policies LOL!



Because Reagan is deified  by the right, especially Kristol (neocon) and he tried to take out Ghaddafi. Also, who said anything about neocons? This was a "joint" venture. Neocons like Bill Kristol of Fox News & founder of the PNAC generally want everything for themselves.  You know what the PNAC was/is?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> They were down with the whole shock 'n' awe thing that had over a hundred thousand ground troops sent into Iraq for nonexistent WMDs



In other words, you're just a mindless fucking partisan. R-war BAD, D-war GOOD, Oh Bahhh Bahhh Bahhh Mahhh

How do you even fucking breath? You don't seem to have enough IQ points for autonomous functions....


----------



## TakeAStepBack (Aug 23, 2011)

Greatest Come Back Ever - YouTube


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > You mean you're not upset that Obama's policies resulted in the ousting of K-daff? and not one American death?
> ...


So you're not upset about K-daff...does it upset you that Obama might be able to use it in the 2012 election?


----------



## Dot Com (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > You mean you're not upset that Obama's policies resulted in the ousting of K-daff? and not one American death?
> ...



Wrong again dummy. HEY!! You are in your usual form today, snippy


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> So you're not upset about K-daff...does it upset you that Obama might be able to use it in the 2012 election?



Do you really think anyone outside the single digit IQ Huffingglue and KOS partisans will be influenced by this?

ROFL

A bit of advice, don't believe your own bullshit - no one else does.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Avorysuds said:
> 
> 
> > Why are we talking about Reagan? Are you trying to say Obama is like Reagan, who is like Bush and that makes it all better... again? Thx for helping prove that without a doubt Obama is in fact a Neocon, along with his supporters because you can't call Reagan and Bush Neocons and then claim Obama is not when they share the same fucking policies LOL!
> ...



So thanks for proving Obama and YOU are nothing but a bunch of war loving Neocons. All it took was a Democrat killing people and starting wars to give you that hard on you long for.


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > They were down with the whole shock 'n' awe thing that had over a hundred thousand ground troops sent into Iraq for nonexistent WMDs
> ...


 
Not at all.  I KNEW that the Iraq War was a monumental mistake when Bush launched it.  The only surprise to me was that it turned out to be an even bigger fiasco than I first believed it to be.  That belief was not born out of partisanship, unlike conservatives support of the Iraq War and their lack of support for the NATO led effort in Libya.

I wasn't particularly happy with Bush before the 9-11, but I supported him right up until he attacked Iraq.  That's when I knew that he would screw up probably everything he touched.  And again, I'm only surprised by the degree to which Bush messed things up.


----------



## WillowTree (Aug 23, 2011)

obie wan know nothing bypassed the US Congress and the dimretarted wits on the left 



and of course the American Taxpayer picks up the bill. Where in the fuck was Scotland when Libya needed them? huh?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Dot Com said:


> Wrong again dummy.



Really?

Hmmm... Scheiß Maus, Toxic media, Mustang..

My point is proven, beyond all refute.


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not unhappy to see Gaddaffi go. Only the most scummy of partisan dumbfucks would claim Obama played a significant role, though.....
> ...





Uncensored2008 said:


> Do you really think anyone outside the single digit IQ Huffingglue and KOS partisans will be influenced by this?
> 
> ROFL
> 
> A bit of advice, don't believe your own bullshit - no one else does.


I don't watch cable news or visit righty blogs so I don't know what peope think. I only know Obama got lucky, and pulled it off without one American death, and that seems like nothing to complain about.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Avorysuds said:


> So thanks for proving Obama and YOU are nothing but a bunch of war loving Neocons. All it took was a Democrat killing people and starting wars to give you that hard on you long for.



But that's DIFFFERNT,,,,,

D-War is good war, healthy and good, Obama akbar!


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Not at all.  I KNEW that the Iraq War was a monumental mistake when Bush launched it.



Of course, Bush had and "R" after his name.

R-war bad, D-war GOOD - Oh Bahhh Bahhh Bahhh Mahhh....


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Avorysuds said:
> 
> 
> > So thanks for proving Obama and YOU are nothing but a bunch of war loving Neocons. All it took was a Democrat killing people and starting wars to give you that hard on you long for.
> ...


You know what!.....right here you have a good point. 100% advocacy media is the cause of this. Any war started by a Republican is patriotic and neccessary as far as Fox and Rush are concerned, and really bad and wrong as far as the D's think. And visa versa.....that is the problem! Nobody is doing any independent thinking and analysis.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> I don't watch cable news or visit righty blogs so I don't know what peope think. I only know Obama got lucky, and pulled it off without one American death, and that seems like nothing to complain about.



Why would there be American deaths when the only contribution is dropping bombs from 50,000 feet?

I realize that you're just a partisan, you say what you do to promote the party, but you don't really believe even a word of what you post, do you? You're so absurd that you're almost a caricature of a mindless partisan fool.

Shit, where is Bil Stunbmun when I need him?


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > I don't watch cable news or visit righty blogs so I don't know what peope think. I only know Obama got lucky, and pulled it off without one American death, and that seems like nothing to complain about.
> ...


I'm not a Democrat. I'm not a liberal. I didn't vote for Obama, and I'm not sure who I'll vote for in 2012. 

Conservative media has trained you to categorize anyone who strays from thier talking points as a liberal who defends Obama.


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Not at all. I KNEW that the Iraq War was a monumental mistake when Bush launched it.
> ...


 
I didn't give a damn about Bush's party affiliation when he launched the Iraq War.  I would have felt the same way if he was a Democrat because it was an incredibly stupid move that was almost certain to blow up in our collective faces.  You see, >I< knew about the Sunni/Shia rivalry, and the tribal rivalry, AND the fact that the Kurds didn't even want to be part of Iraq.  Any ordinary fool could have educated himself enough to learn about these things if he had half a mind to realize that having the courage of your convictions is not enough.  You  have to actually KNOW stuff.

But Bush wasn't just any fool; he was an exceptional one.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Avorysuds said:
> ...



Oooor it's idiots like you that support the wars Because of the letter next to the Presidents name...

How many time a day to you have to defend your position with "But when Bush did it *you* didn't have a problem." Well... believe it or not Bush was very un-liked, you know 28% approval ratings and all... So it's very possible that even if someone (not myself) did support the wars under Bush, before he was out of office they were against them. Hell, lots of Democrats supported the wars when they started.


----------



## WillowTree (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > toxicmedia said:
> ...



What you are is a liar. Nothing comes out of your mouth except liberal propaganda,, try again moron.


----------



## Stephanie (Aug 23, 2011)

man oh man, I NEVER thought I'd see the day.

You never knew winning a Peace Prize meant going over and helping drop bombs on a country who never did anything to us.

SO,  all those Bush anti-war PROTESTER were just a bunch of full of shit UNAMERCIAN people afterall.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...



But now under Obama you never bitch about Afghanistan/Iraq/Pakistan/Libya or Syria... No, you fully support Obama on these wars, you just say you hate them because Bush started them, despite Obama keeping them going, expanding them and starting new wars.

More or less you hope you have to debate an idiot, someone you can use childish talking points against. You literally on your own destroy yourself, its entertaining to watch and point out. It would only be sad or suck if most the country bought youre BS but the country and world is rejecting the Necon/Progressive Big Government Big wars mentality.


Fact is you can't afford to keep it going for much longer so none of it really matters.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

Stephanie said:


> man oh man, I NEVER thought I'd see the day.
> 
> You never knew winning a Peace Prize meant going over and helping drop bombs on a country who never did anything to us.
> 
> SO,  all those Bush anti-war PROTESTER were just a bunch of full of shit UNAMERCIAN people afterall.



Well not all, but many... Most I think just feel let down and that will hit hard when Obama needs their votes... Many will be asking themselves "why would I want to vote again?"


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 23, 2011)

WillowTree said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> I didn't give a damn about Bush's party affiliation when he launched the Iraq War.



Party affiliation is the ONLY thing you care about.

Who do you think you're fooling?

You are 100% partisan hack, and nothing more.


----------



## Avorysuds (Aug 23, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > toxicmedia said:
> ...


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > I didn't give a damn about Bush's party affiliation when he launched the Iraq War.
> ...


 
No.  I've never been a member of ANY political party.  I've never contributed money to any candidate, or PAC, or any partisan organization.  And I've voted for Republicans as well as Democrats.

However, what I don't like (and happily admit it) is how the Republican Party just moves further and further to the right.  You see, I don't like extremism, and I like extremists even less.  I would feel the same way about Democrats if the extemist wing of the Democratic Party was running the party.  But Reps like Kucinich and Bernie Sanders are marginalized for the most part.  At the very least, they're not in the leadership, and they don't drive the debate.  If they did, and if they had the same kind of influence in the Democratic Party as the tea party folks do in the Republican Party, I would be against them too.


----------



## Stephanie (Aug 23, 2011)

OH OH, better not be cheering and thanking JUST YET.

SNIP:

NATO's Libya generals should be hauled to court, says Dennis Kucinich

Dennis Kucinich wants NATO 'held accountable' for its airstrikes in Libya. | Reuters 
CloseBy REID J. EPSTEIN | 8/23/11 1:02 PM EDT Updated: 8/23/11 1:09 PM EDT 
NATO commanders who authorized the Libya bombing campaign should be &#8220;held accountable&#8221; to international law and hauled before the world court for civilian deaths, Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) said Tuesday.

&#8220;NATO&#8217;s top commanders may have acted under color of international law, but they are not exempt from international law,&#8221; Kucinich said in a statement released by his office. &#8220;If members of the Qadhafi regime are to be held accountable, NATO&#8217;s top commanders must also be held accountable through the International Criminal Court for all civilian deaths resulting from bombing. Otherwise, we will have witnessed the triumph of a new international gangsterism.&#8221;

Kucinich, who in March suggested President Barack Obama&#8217;s authorizing of airstrikes on Libya were &#8220;an impeachable offense&#8221; and sponsored a July measure to defund the military effort there, criticized what he called an evolving rationale for the NATO offensive.

The seven-term Cleveland congressman released his statement just as forces loyal to Qadhafi appeared to have abandoned their defense of his heavily fortified Tripoli compound. It was not clear where Qadhafi is, though a Russian chess official said he spoke with the dictator and reported he remains in the capital.

&#8220;The reasons for the U.S./NATO intervention in Libya keep changing,&#8221; he said. &#8220;First, it was about the potential for a massacre in Benghazi. When the massacre did not materialize and once the war against Libya was under way, the reasons for intervention changed.&#8221;

*And Kucinich questioned the motivation behind U.S. intervention in Libya.*


Read more: NATO's Libya generals should be hauled to court, says Dennis Kucinich - Reid J. Epstein - POLITICO.com


----------



## Contumacious (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Thank-you, President Obama for helping the Libyan people overthrow Gaddafi...



Are you a Lybian?

If not, why the fuck do you want the US to get involved?

,


----------



## Stephanie (Aug 23, 2011)

Liberals are so desperate to give this President SOMETHING, because they see his approval numbers are FALLING LOWER here in this country every day.... that they are now in favor of WARS..


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Thank-you, President Obama for helping the Libyan people overthrow Gaddafi...
> ...


 
Ever hear of Pan American flight 103?

How about the 1986 Berlin discotheque bombing?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> No.  I've never been a member of ANY political party.



Oh bullshit. You do NOTHING here but worship Obama and shit on ANYTHING that is remotely associated with the hated opposition.

You are 100% partisan.



> And I've voted for Republicans as well as Democrats.



I simply don't believe you.

I can only go by what you post here, but you are about the most partisan poster on the board.

Yes, I know that KOS instructs you to "go forth and lie that you are independent," but you don't REALLY expect anyone to believe you, do you?

I mean, not really....



> You see, I don't like extremism, and I like extremists even less.



You ARE an extremist. You are a completely amoral Obamabot with zero ethics who defines right and wrong on the basis of what promotes your shameful party. 



> I would feel the same way about Democrats if the extemist wing of the Democratic Party was running the party.



Fucking Obama.

Good god, how much more extreme does it get? You have a self-described Marxist in college as the POTUS actively enacting a fully fascist economy. 



> But Reps like Kucinich and Bernie Sanders are marginalized for the most part.



What about ultra-left radicals like say, Barack Obama?

The Tea Party is regular Americans, and yes, I realize that you hate them and are at war against them.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Are you a Lybian?



Mustang is a partisan. Mustang worships all that Obama does, regardless of what it may be.


----------



## KissMy (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Of course, conservatives are uspest (they're always upset) about it.  They criticized the policy when it was started, and they were never really supported the action seeing as how the Republican led House issued a rebuke of President Barack Obama's Libya policy on June 3 by a vote of 268-145 .
> 
> House rips Obama Libya policy - CNN



I guess you can't read your own link to well retard. Republicans voted down the resolution  calling for the withdrawal of U.S. forces from Libya. That is Washington speak for we support the presidents war. John McCain told the president to get off his ass & help the rebels.



> House members rejected a resolution offered by Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, calling for the withdrawal of U.S. forces from the NATO-led military operation. Kucinich's measure was defeated in a 148-265 vote.


----------



## Conservative (Aug 23, 2011)

KissMy said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Of course, conservatives are uspest (they're always upset) about it.  They criticized the policy when it was started, and they were never really supported the action seeing as how the Republican led House issued a rebuke of President Barack Obama's Libya policy on June 3 by a vote of 268-145 .
> ...



He can't help it if he's a partisan hack and a lying sack of crap. It's just the way he is.


----------



## Chris (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> ...without unnecessarily endangering American lives in the process.
> 
> Yup, NATO (with the help of the US, of course) now has a major victory under its belt (a first, by the way), and the Libyan people are now rid of Gaddafi, and no American lives were lost in the process.  That's called a win-win-win situation.
> 
> ...



Republicans only want to cut taxes for the rich and kill Social Security, Medicare, and the EPA.


----------



## Moonglow (Aug 23, 2011)

Stephanie said:


> Liberals are so desperate to give this President SOMETHING, because they see his approval numbers are FALLING LOWER here in this country every day.... that they are now in favor of WARS..



Not all liberals are against war, just as all republicans are not for peace. I am a liberal and have been pro-military since my youth.


----------



## Chris (Aug 23, 2011)

I'm pro wars where Americans don't get killed.

Like the Balkans and Libya.


----------



## gautama (Aug 23, 2011)

I didn't read any of the posts preceding mine.

So, if I am repeating the thoughts of 1/2 a dozen of others ......and, I am probably doing so, I apologize.

Now, this is one of the few times, that I recall, since the LOSER, MONUMENTAL MARXIST, RACIST, MUSLIM PROTECTING, ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT CODDLING FRAUD, SAMBO OBAMBO, took office, that I agreed with him about his handling of the Libyan issue.

The reason being ....... and, I am still somewhat leery about this whole "victory" over the Contemptible Turd Gaddafi ...... is that: who will replace that Despicable Piece of Shit, Gaddafi ???

Will it be the fucking SUPER DANGEROUS Muslim Brotherhood ........ and, from where I sit, that is a distinct possibility.

At least with the Super Arsehole Gaddafi ....... the fucking arabs were slaughtering each other (which is something devoutedly wished for).

Anyways.......

I think it's somewhat disingenuous, and downright mendacious, for our leader, Sambo Obambo, to claim credit for rendering minimal help, as a powerful member of the UN  (even though it's probably more than, say, Switzerland) .....and, claim to be on the cutting edge of the "victory".

But, being the Pathological, Shameless, fucking LIAR, that our semi-black Political Charlatan is, it's par for the course.


----------



## TakeAStepBack (Aug 23, 2011)

guatamo, do you like money?


----------



## California Girl (Aug 23, 2011)

Chris said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > ...without unnecessarily endangering American lives in the process.
> ...



You can repeat those lies until the day you die, they will still be lies. You really need to learn to think for yourself - apply a little logic - before you believe whatever your current snakeoil salesman is selling.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

Chris said:


> I'm pro wars where Americans don't get killed.
> 
> Like the Balkans and Libya.



You're pro-wars where a democrat starts them. Just like Mustang, you are a mindless partisan who holds party above nation or principal.


----------



## elvis (Aug 23, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Chris said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...


Chris hates logic almost as much as he hates our servicemen and servicewomen.


----------



## hortysir (Aug 23, 2011)

Still trying to figure out who all these Conservatives are that Mustang keeps talking about??????


----------



## California Girl (Aug 23, 2011)

Chris said:


> I'm pro wars where Americans don't get killed.
> 
> Like the Balkans and Libya.



You're 'pro war'? Seriously? How odd. I just don't get how anyone could be supportive of war, and saying 'where Americans don't get killed' is just sick. You don't care about people, unless they are American? That's not very liberal of you. 

Personally, I am not at all 'pro war'. I think war is sometimes an evil necessity, and daily I give thanks that we have men and women who will put their lives at risk for others - even when those 'others' are not even Americans. 

Shame on you with your 'pro war' bullshit.


----------



## Trajan (Aug 23, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...



we made and came to an agreement with Qaddafi. I was not happy about it  but I bowed to reality. I guess you missed my post where in this was more than anything,   about  secure Oil ( just as the release of the lockerbie bomber was quid pro quo) as much as it was protecting people from harm and if protecting people from harm is now an excuse then bush took Saddam d now but don't knock yourself out patting him on the back and,  hows it going in Sudan these days, Darfur? 

please. if bush invaded Iraq for oil, well? don't let that hypocrisy choke you up....


snip-

Eni, with BP of Britain, Total of France, Repsol YPF of Spain and OMV of Austria, were all big producers in Libya before the fighting broke out, and they stand to gain the most once the conflict ends. American companies like Hess, ConocoPhillips and Marathon also made deals with the Qaddafi regime, although the United States relies on Libya for less than 1 percent of its imports. 



http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/23/b...e-for-access-to-libyas-oil-wealth-begins.html


----------



## California Girl (Aug 23, 2011)

Sallow said:


> From the Huffington Post:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So, to review. Libya has fallen to the rebels. And still no evidence that Gaddafi has fled the country. Quite the opposite, in fact. The rebels themselves believe he is still in the country. 

So, again, Shallow.... where is your proof that he and his sons have left?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 23, 2011)

California Girl said:


> Shame on you with your 'pro war' bullshit.



Chris is pro-democrat.

If a democrat does it, Chris is for it. It doesn't matter what "it" is.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Aug 23, 2011)

Gee, I remember when Americans fought their own wars.


----------



## Mustang (Aug 23, 2011)

Conservative said:


> KissMy said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...


 

You're projecting...AGAIN.


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 24, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > At first the right said that Obama wasn't doing enough in Libya.
> ...



No, liar. Lying is what YOU and your ilk do.

Watch "Libya: Are we doing enough?" Video at The Week looming gov't shutdown

Obama's Libya Policy Isn't A Muddle. It's A Disgrace. | The New Republic

Fox & Friends Reacts To Libya By Complaining Bush Was Criticized Over Iraq | Media Matters for America

As you go through the links and watch the videos and read the articles, you will see how the Right collectively went from "He's not doing enough" to "He's doing too much" and comes right around to "Not doing enough/didn't do it right."

The same RW BS. Liar.


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > MarcATL said:
> ...



Powerful evidence!!!


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...



Indeed, that RW dunce really FUBARed things.


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 24, 2011)

elvis said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Chris said:
> ...


I just wanted to make sure.......you didn't think most lefties hate our servicemen and servicewomen....do you?


----------



## Mustang (Aug 24, 2011)

MarcATL said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Uncensored2008 said:
> ...


 
Most fools never really get a chance to screw things up in a monumental way due to the simple fact that fools rarely ever get any real power.  Oh sure, fools can and do screw up their little corner of the world, but the ripple effects are usually very limited.

Bush was one hell of an exception to the rule.  And let's not forget which group foisted him on America and supported him all the way.  And now what do they say?  They say that Bush really was NOT a conservative.

I'm sorry, but I can't buy into the OOPS defense.  And why should America listen to anything conservatives say now when their track record sucks so bad?


----------



## Sallow (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> MarcATL said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...





It's worse then that..they are saying he was a democrat on the down low.

Except that they aren't doing anything differently in Congress..


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Most fools never really get a chance to screw things up in a monumental way due to the simple fact that fools rarely ever get any real power.  Oh sure, fools can and do screw up their little corner of the world, but the ripple effects are usually very limited.
> 
> Bush was one hell of an exception to the rule.



True, then it just got worse.

Say, that can be your campaign slogan: "Obama, making even Bush look competent!"


----------



## Truthseeker420 (Aug 24, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Most fools never really get a chance to screw things up in a monumental way due to the simple fact that fools rarely ever get any real power.  Oh sure, fools can and do screw up their little corner of the world, but the ripple effects are usually very limited.
> ...



lmao


----------



## Mustang (Aug 24, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Most fools never really get a chance to screw things up in a monumental way due to the simple fact that fools rarely ever get any real power. Oh sure, fools can and do screw up their little corner of the world, but the ripple effects are usually very limited.
> ...


 
Nobody is EVER going to make that happen.  Nobody.


----------



## MarcATL (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...


Damn right!

That dumb RW OAF from Texas will go down in history as THEE worst President...ever.

No one will forgot how the buffoon stumbled and fumbled and damn near crashed America.

We're all still smarting from his horrendous run.


----------



## toxicmedia (Aug 24, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Most fools never really get a chance to screw things up in a monumental way due to the simple fact that fools rarely ever get any real power.  Oh sure, fools can and do screw up their little corner of the world, but the ripple effects are usually very limited.
> ...


Bush did that on his own by leaving eight years of a presidency with two unfinished wars and a wrecked economy. It's amazing how the GOP has saddled Obama with ALL of the responsibility for it in less than three years, at least in the eyes of anti Obama folks.

How can your right hemisphere look at your left hemisphere with a straight face?


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Nobody is EVER going to make that happen.  Nobody.



TOO late, Obama already did.

Bush was a fuckup, but Obama takes fucking up to a whole new level.


----------



## Uncensored2008 (Aug 24, 2011)

toxicmedia said:


> Bush did that on his own by leaving eight years of a presidency with two unfinished wars and a wrecked economy. It's amazing how the GOP has saddled Obama with ALL of the responsibility for it in less than three years, at least in the eyes of anti Obama folks.
> 
> How can your right hemisphere look at your left hemisphere with a straight face?



For 7 out of 8 years under Bush, the economy was good - 87% of the time good. 

For 3 out of 3 years under your fucking Messiah®, the economy has been shit.  That's 0% of the time good.

I find 87% better than 0%. It's going to take a LOT of Affirmative Action to get Obama up to the level of Bush.

Oh BTW, Bush was a fucking disaster.


----------



## BoycottTheday (Aug 24, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Obama takes fucking up to a whole new level.



Thank God for Obama,

hes exposed the liberals for what they really are.

Best thing to happen, woke the people up.


----------



## Mustang (Aug 24, 2011)

Uncensored2008 said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody is EVER going to make that happen. Nobody.
> ...


 
That's the partisan in you talking since Obama's just trying to pick up the pieces.

Yes, Bush shattered American dreams.  I, too, wish that Obama had a magic wand that could put Humpty Dumpty (America in this case) back together again.  But such is not life.  It will take years of hard work.

But do you know what REALLY pisses me off.  Conservatives in Congress will fight any and all kinds of progress in that regard as long as a Democrat is in the WH.  It doesn't even matter who that Democrat is.  In this case, it just so happens to be Obama.


----------



## Stephanie (Aug 24, 2011)

With 10% unemployment, 3.50 for a gallon of gas, food through the roof, do YOU THINK the American people REALLY GIVE a SHIT about Obama "getting Gaddafi?"

what a friggen senseless waste of our time, money and military.

Obama is the scariest warmongering President I have ever seen, now he is threatening Syria.


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## BDBoop (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...



Not to mention - it's not just us. We're living in a literal "World of hurt."


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## Uncensored2008 (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> That's the partisan in you talking since Obama's just trying to pick up the pieces.



He picks up pieces like Lucy makes candy...

I Love Lucy Full Episode (Job Switching) - IMDb



> Yes, Bush shattered American dreams.



And pulled the wings off of kittens!



> I, too, wish that Obama had a magic wand that could put Humpty Dumpty (America in this case) back together again.  But such is not life.  It will take years of hard work.



Decades, after this fucking disaster is finished.



> But do you know what REALLY pisses me off.



People with IQ's greater than 20.

Those smart people with double your brains just get your goat..



> Conservatives in Congress will fight any and all kinds of progress



"Progress" being defined as "sharply raising taxes."



> In this case, it just so happens to be Obama.



And Obama just so happens to be the biggest fuckup in American history....


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## SFC Ollie (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Uncensored2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...



Is that why I saw in todays paper that the Obama administration was going to lift hundreds of regulations that would allow businesses to grow? Isn't this what Republicans have been saying all along? Oops is Obama learning from the right or is he just playing politics to get re-elected. I'll bet we'll hear during his campaign (like he ever stopped campaigning) about how he cut business regulations......


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## Mustang (Aug 24, 2011)

Stephanie said:


> With 10% unemployment, 3.50 for a gallon of gas, food through the roof, do YOU THINK the American people REALLY GIVE a SHIT about Obama "getting Gaddafi?"
> 
> what a friggen senseless waste of our time, money and military.
> 
> Obama is the scariest warmongering President I have ever seen, now he is threatening Syria.


 
Obama is the scariest warmongering President you have ever seen?  How young are you?  I guess you don't remember the constant bombing of Haiphong and Hanoi by Johnson during the vietnam war starting in 1966.  And that would mean that you probably can't recall the secret Christmas Eve bombing of Cambodia by Nixon.  

But SURELY you must remember the "shock and awe" campaign brought to a cable channel near and dear to you by the great and powerful "decider," George W. Bush!

Obama has done nothing comparable to what those presidents did.


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## SFC Ollie (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > With 10% unemployment, 3.50 for a gallon of gas, food through the roof, do YOU THINK the American people REALLY GIVE a SHIT about Obama "getting Gaddafi?"
> ...



You mean other than the double tap to Bin Ladens head?

It's almost funny, we can't water board em, but we can assassinate em......


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## Rat in the Hat (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Stephanie said:
> 
> 
> > With 10% unemployment, 3.50 for a gallon of gas, food through the roof, do YOU THINK the American people REALLY GIVE a SHIT about Obama "getting Gaddafi?"
> ...



If it was such a secret, how do you know about it?


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## Mustang (Aug 24, 2011)

Rat in the Hat said:


> Mustang said:
> 
> 
> > Stephanie said:
> ...


 
Not many secrets stay secret forever.  That's especially true when a lot of people know about it right from the beginning.


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## Rat in the Hat (Aug 24, 2011)

Mustang said:


> Rat in the Hat said:
> 
> 
> > Mustang said:
> ...



Well then, GWB must be our best President ever. According to the Truthers, he has kept his involvement in 9/11 secret for almost 10 years.


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## waltky (Aug 28, 2011)

Rebels thumbin' their nose at Moammar...

*Libya rebels reject regime offer to negotiate*
_28 Aug.`11  Libyan rebels on Sunday rejected an offer by Moammar Gadhafi to negotiate and said they have captured the eastern town of Bin Jawwad, forcing regime loyalists to flee after days of fighting._


> With his regime crumbling, Gadhafi is on the run, but his chief spokesman Moussa Ibrahim told the Associated Press the Libyan leader is still in Libya. As the call for negotiations came, new signs emerged of arbitrary killings of detainees and civilians by Gadhafi forces during the rebels' push into Tripoli earlier this week, including some 50 charred corpses at a regime lockup.  The rebels dismissed Gadhafi's proposal, relayed by Ibrahim by phone, to have his son al-Saadi lead talks on a transitional government as delusional.
> 
> "I would like to state very clearly, we don't recognize them. We are looking at them as criminals. We are going to arrest them very soon," Mahmoud Shammam, the information minister in the rebels' transitional government, told a news conference. "Talking about negotiations is a daydream for what remains of the dictatorship."  In London Sunday, British Foreign Secretary William Hague also dismissed the offer, saying the National Transitional Council was already in charge of the country and that Gadhafi should call on his supporters to stop fighting.
> 
> ...


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## MarcATL (Aug 28, 2011)

Khaddaffi is going to find himself in a cage or dead pretty soon.


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## Unkotare (Aug 28, 2011)

Or on Dancing with the Stars!


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## California Girl (Aug 29, 2011)

Sallow said:


> From the Huffington Post:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Still waiting for proof that he's left Libya. 

Idiot.


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