# The Defenders (Netflix show)



## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

I loved seasons 1 and 2 of Daredevil, but I mainly loved it due to how grounded it felt. For the most part, there were no super powers except a bit from the bad guys, but that felt more like the paranormal and the occult. The Hand seemed more like R'as al Ghul and the League of Shadows in Batman.

I only watched 1 episode of Jessica Jones, none of Luke Cage, and I caught one of the later episodes of Iron Fist when I was at a friend's house. I wasn't really interested in those shows, because the characters were so strong in terms of super powers. I prefer the toned down blind man with heightened senses theme of Daredevil.

I also refused to watch Iron Fist, because it's basically yet another White person playing what could have been an Asian character (Marvel does a lot of that). 

Luckily, Iron Fist wasn't in episode 1 enough to annoy me too much. The episode as a whole was ok, but I still prefer the Daredevil characters over Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and Iron Fist. Jessica Jones is a bit better in this opening episode.

The strongest addition in terms of acting is definitely Sigourney Weaver. Not much is revealed about her in this opening episode, but you can tell she's a bad ass. I do look forward to finding out more about her character.

In the last 5-10 minutes of the episode, the show starts to build up to what looks like a big, epic cliffhanger. But then they cut it off right before they even give a hint of what's going on in terms of what the team is going up against this season.

Overall, I give this episode a 7/10. I might've bumped it up to 8/10 if it had a better cliffhanger, but it didn't. I do intend to keep watching.


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## aaronleland (Aug 18, 2017)

I was just getting ready to turn on the first episode.

I never understood this newfound criticism of Iron Fist now that he's a more mainstream character in the MCU. It's a character that has been a white guy since I think the 70's. I would have been pissed if they made him Asian just to cater to today's PC culture.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

aaronleland said:


> I was just getting ready to turn on the first episode.
> 
> I never understood this newfound criticism of Iron Fist now that he's a more mainstream character in the MCU. It's a character that has been a white guy since I think the 70's. I would have been pissed if they made him Asian just to cater to today's PC culture.



The criticism is that his character is all about tai chi, chi, buddhism, etc. Marvel will not hesitate to turn a character black for "diversity," but they will never turn a character Asian (especially an Asian male) for the same.


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## Gracie (Aug 18, 2017)

aaronleland said:


> I was just getting ready to turn on the first episode.
> 
> I never understood this newfound criticism of Iron Fist now that he's a more mainstream character in the MCU. It's a character that has been a white guy since I think the 70's. I would have been pissed if they made him Asian just to cater to today's PC culture.


Oh, like making Roland Despain of The Dark Tower a black man when he has NEVER been portrayed as black? Kinda like that?
King was all gungho to change it too since he is just so PC.


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## aaronleland (Aug 18, 2017)

Gracie said:


> aaronleland said:
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> > I was just getting ready to turn on the first episode.
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Remember Red from The Shawshank Redemption? In the short story they called him Red because he was a read-headed Irish guy. So naturally why wouldn't Morgan Freeman play him in the movie?


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## Gracie (Aug 18, 2017)

I read Shawshank once and promtply forgot about it. Have watched the movie a thousand times. Love Morgan Freeman. 
With that said, I have read Dark Tower many times. MANY times. All books. Roland IS NOT BLACK.

So, when is a hollyweird director going to make a new movie about Shaft and  Ben Affleck is hired to play him?


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## aaronleland (Aug 18, 2017)

Gracie said:


> I read Shawshank once and promtply forgot about it. Have watched the movie a thousand times. Love Morgan Freeman.
> With that said, I have read Dark Tower many times. MANY times. All books. Roland IS NOT BLACK.
> 
> So, when is a hollyweird director going to make a new movie about Shaft and  Ben Affleck is hired to play him?



Stephen King has said that he modeled Roland after a Clint Eastwood like character. I think Eastwood has some black in him.


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## Gracie (Aug 18, 2017)

aaronleland said:


> Gracie said:
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> > I read Shawshank once and promtply forgot about it. Have watched the movie a thousand times. Love Morgan Freeman.
> ...


We all have black in us, but that is beside the point. Yes, Roland is Eastwoodish.
I hated..yes HATED the IT movie. A walton boy playing the major character? I think not. But this NEW movie IT looks more along what the book was about.

Maybe the next Dark Tower movie will have Suzannah played by Meryl Streep.


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## aaronleland (Aug 18, 2017)

I have been reading the Dark Tower series since I was a little kid. When I was homeschooled my mom would give them to us as reading reports. For some reason the black Roland in the movie never bothered me. What bothered me the most was the black Human Torch in the most recent Fantastic Four movie. At least Roland was text. Johnny Storm has been nothing but visually represented for decades before the Dark Tower series even existed, and suddenly he's black?


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## Lewdog (Aug 18, 2017)

AsianTrumpSupporter said:


> aaronleland said:
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> > I was just getting ready to turn on the first episode.
> ...



No one had a problem with David Carradine being White and basically playing the same type of role.


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## Gracie (Aug 18, 2017)

The thing about books and comics is....the reader imagines what they look like in their head and when an actor is to portray that character and misses the mark..it ruins it forever in the readers mind. Which is why I will never, ever, watch Dark Tower. OR re read Shawshank. Red is Morgan Freeman to me. I want how I imagined them to stay put in my head.


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## aaronleland (Aug 18, 2017)

I thought Asians would be offended by their representation in film nowadays. It's 2017 and every Asian is a ninja? Why can't he just own a drycleaner like a real Asian?


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

Lewdog said:


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You're wrong. Asian people had a problem with that.


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## Lewdog (Aug 18, 2017)

AsianTrumpSupporter said:


> Lewdog said:
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Well he certainly became famous enough from it, that their ire sure didn't make much of a difference.


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## aaronleland (Aug 18, 2017)

Lewdog said:


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In fairness in those days you could get away with more. You could be found dead with a noose around your neck and cum on your leg. You still died a movie legend.


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## Lewdog (Aug 18, 2017)

aaronleland said:


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How do you know he came?  Were you there?


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## Lewdog (Aug 18, 2017)

I'll be honest, if I were Asian, the one role that would have really pissed me off is Tilda Swinson playing The Ancient One.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

Episode 2: 7/10


Lewdog said:


> I'll be honest, if I were Asian, the one role that would have really pissed me off is Tilda Swinson playing The Ancient One.



I wouldn't. Asians don't get roles as it is, and a role that big would be great.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

Episode 2:

This episode was about the same as episode 1. 7/10 for me.

Episode 3:

This episode starts out really strong. The first 13 minutes or so was about an 8/10 for me, but then they get into a loooooong patch with Iron Fist and Luke Cage, which, frankly, just bored the hell out of me. That knocked the score down to 7/10 for me. But then the final fight at the end bumped it up to 7.5/10. I would have given this an 8/10 if we got more Daredevil this episode, but he was barely in it.


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## Lewdog (Aug 18, 2017)

AsianTrumpSupporter said:


> Episode 2: 7/10
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I'm not sure what you are arguing... they took what is an Asian character and gave the role to an androgynous White person.  It was just horrible casting.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

Lewdog said:


> AsianTrumpSupporter said:
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> > Episode 2: 7/10
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You just listed what I'm arguing. I bolded it in case you still don't get it.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 18, 2017)

Episode 4: 

This felt like a filler episode. There were some good dialogue moments, and it builds up to the next episode, which I hope is better. But overall, 7/10.


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## Unkotare (Aug 19, 2017)

Lewdog said:


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Someone did.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 19, 2017)

Episode 5 was ok, but it's still not as good as Daredevil seasons 1 and 2. I give it a 7.5/10.

However, episode 6 is a 9/10. There's a twist in this episode that is quite unexpected. Then when you find out the reason for that twist, that's yet another twist. The episode as a whole was kind of average, but those two twists bumped it up to a 9/10 for me.


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## Montrovant (Aug 19, 2017)

Defenders was pretty good.  There were too many contrived fight set-ups......let's find a way to get the heroes all together in a circle, preparing to fight kind of scenes.  The writers are wildly inconsistent with Luke Cage's and Jessica Jones's strength.  There were some CGI background in the last couple of episodes that were just terrible, particularly when they are in the elevator.  I was not thrilled with where they went with the villains.  Despite the flaws, however, it was still an enjoyable, if somewhat short, season.

Better than Iron Fist, better than Luke Cage, not on par with DD or JJ.


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## Montrovant (Aug 19, 2017)

AsianTrumpSupporter said:


> I loved seasons 1 and 2 of Daredevil, but I mainly loved it due to how grounded it felt. For the most part, there were no super powers except a bit from the bad guys, but that felt more like the paranormal and the occult. The Hand seemed more like R'as al Ghul and the League of Shadows in Batman.
> 
> I only watched 1 episode of Jessica Jones, none of Luke Cage, and I caught one of the later episodes of Iron Fist when I was at a friend's house. I wasn't really interested in those shows, because the characters were so strong in terms of super powers. I prefer the toned down blind man with heightened senses theme of Daredevil.
> 
> ...



You really should give Jessica Jones a try.  In some ways it's got a more realistic feel than Daredevil, despite her power.

And while I consider Iron Fist the weakest of the Netflix Marvel shows, Danny Rand isn't that strong in terms of super powers.  He's got the fist, but as far as I can tell he can only use it for limited amounts of time.  Otherwise, he's just a martial artist.


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## Harry Dresden (Aug 19, 2017)

aaronleland said:


> I have been reading the Dark Tower series since I was a little kid. When I was homeschooled my mom would give them to us as reading reports. For some reason the black Roland in the movie never bothered me. What bothered me the most was the black Human Torch in the most recent Fantastic Four movie. At least Roland was text. Johnny Storm has been nothing but visually represented for decades before the Dark Tower series even existed, and suddenly he's black?


how about the little freckled red haired guy named Jimmy Olsen who is now a 6'4 bald black guy on Supergirl?....


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## Montrovant (Aug 19, 2017)

Harry Dresden said:


> aaronleland said:
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> 
> > I have been reading the Dark Tower series since I was a little kid. When I was homeschooled my mom would give them to us as reading reports. For some reason the black Roland in the movie never bothered me. What bothered me the most was the black Human Torch in the most recent Fantastic Four movie. At least Roland was text. Johnny Storm has been nothing but visually represented for decades before the Dark Tower series even existed, and suddenly he's black?
> ...



That's better than the one from BvS, a CIA agent who is killed in the early going of the movie.


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## AsianTrumpSupporter (Aug 19, 2017)

Montrovant said:


> AsianTrumpSupporter said:
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> > I loved seasons 1 and 2 of Daredevil, but I mainly loved it due to how grounded it felt. For the most part, there were no super powers except a bit from the bad guys, but that felt more like the paranormal and the occult. The Hand seemed more like R'as al Ghul and the League of Shadows in Batman.
> ...



I already watched 15 minute spoiler recaps for Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and Iron Fist on YouTube before watching the Defenders. I didn't see anything to make me a big fan of any of these characters, but Jessica Jones was good in Defenders. Luke Cage was ok as well. 

I still can't stand Finn Jones as Iron Fist. He has the charisma of a slimy used car salesman, and his acting is about on par with one as well, IMO.

Defenders still did not make me a fan of Finn Jones' Iron Fist, but, luckily, he was probably in the show less than the other three members of the Defenders.

What I also didn't like about Defenders is how they tried to make it more lighthearted and like the Netflix Avengers. I'm burned out on super hero teams in general. Daredevil was at his best when he was just your friendly, neighborhood Daredevil fighting Wilson Fisk, the Punisher, and the Hand. 

That said, Defenders is worth watching. I feel like it didn't have the heart of the Daredevil seasons, but I still thought it was ok and worth a watch. I'm glad it's over for now, and we can get back to the Punisher in his separate show and Daredevil season 3.

The Defenders finale also was just ok, IMO. Overall, I give the show a 7.8/10.


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## GHook93 (Aug 21, 2017)

AsianTrumpSupporter said:


> I loved seasons 1 and 2 of Daredevil, but I mainly loved it due to how grounded it felt. For the most part, there were no super powers except a bit from the bad guys, but that felt more like the paranormal and the occult. The Hand seemed more like R'as al Ghul and the League of Shadows in Batman.
> 
> I only watched 1 episode of Jessica Jones, none of Luke Cage, and I caught one of the later episodes of Iron Fist when I was at a friend's house. I wasn't really interested in those shows, because the characters were so strong in terms of super powers. I prefer the toned down blind man with heightened senses theme of Daredevil.
> 
> ...



Daredevil was awesome. Jessica Jones was better (mainly because the Purple man was the best villain yet from marvel). Luke Cage was pretty good but had flaws. Iron Fist was near unwatchable. He also is the sore spot on the Defenders. What they should do is kill off Danny Rand and make Colleen the Iron Fist


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## GHook93 (Aug 21, 2017)

aaronleland said:


> I was just getting ready to turn on the first episode.
> 
> I never understood this newfound criticism of Iron Fist now that he's a more mainstream character in the MCU. It's a character that has been a white guy since I think the 70's. I would have been pissed if they made him Asian just to cater to today's PC culture.



My issue is with the Danny Rand actor's horrible acting and the atrocious writing


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## GHook93 (Aug 21, 2017)

aaronleland said:


> Gracie said:
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Freeman nailed the part! 


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## GHook93 (Aug 21, 2017)

Lewdog said:


> I'll be honest, if I were Asian, the one role that would have really pissed me off is Tilda Swinson playing The Ancient One.



I am not Asian and that one pissed me off! It didn't ruin Dr Strange for me, but what an awful casting call!


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## GHook93 (Aug 21, 2017)

I got through 2 episodes and I am not that impressed. Too much Danny Rand! Every time he is on it is cringeworthy. Why have DD playing the reluctant hero?

So far not what I was hoping for



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## GHook93 (Aug 22, 2017)

AsianTrumpSupporter said:


> Montrovant said:
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I agree with Finn Jones! He is horrible. I say kill him off and make Colleen the Iron Fist! She was the one bright spot from Iron Fist. And for god sake have Iron Fist actually use the god damn Iron Fist more.


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## Montrovant (Aug 22, 2017)

GHook93 said:


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Didn't they just say in Defenders that he can only use it at limited intervals?


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## Unkotare (Aug 23, 2017)

Montrovant said:


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Well, you gotta rest for at least ten minutes or so...


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## Montrovant (Aug 23, 2017)

Unkotare said:


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I feel like rewatching Defenders just to find the part where this is mentioned.


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