# Fat Acceptance Movement?



## Said1 (Feb 21, 2009)

You learn something new everyday.  I had no idea there was a fat acceptance movement, I assumed advocates came from numerous organizations. 

And yes this is from a Feminist magazine. 



> Becky1 has been active in the fat acceptance movement for a good half-dozen years. She attends and organizes awareness-raising events, takes part in her local fat social scene, and fights to end discrimination against fat people with a powerful combination of weary sadness and righteous anger. She wears her weight like well-adorned armor, betraying no sense of regret or shame in her 480-pound body.
> 
> Becky also has an eating disorder. When I asked her how she reconciles these two parts of her life, she replied simply, I dont. Becky hasnt come out about her eating disorder to her peers in the fat acceptance movement and has no plans to do so anytime soon. A binge eater who uses food as a control mechanism, Becky literally shakes when discussing what would happen if she were found out within the movement. That kind of stuff just isnt talked about, she explains. If I actually admitted that I cant control when or what I eat, and that I hate myself because of it. I mean, youre kidding, right?
> 
> ...



Big Trouble | Bitch Magazine


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## dilloduck (Feb 21, 2009)

Said1 said:


> You learn something new everyday.  I had no idea there was a fat acceptance movement, I assumed advocates came from numerous organizations.
> 
> And yes this is from a Feminist magazine.
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stop reading those magazines, woman !  You'll go mad !


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## Said1 (Feb 21, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> Said1 said:
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> > You learn something new everyday.  I had no idea there was a fat acceptance movement, I assumed advocates came from numerous organizations.
> ...



Ok.


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## catzmeow (Feb 22, 2009)

Some people who are fat REALLY can't help it.  But, they don't represent that vast majority of people who are fat.

I think it is also important to recognize that Americans (and perhaps, the rest of the world) have very fucked up body image issues.

It was interesting to me to work with Tongans and Samoans.  To the average Tongan man, beautiful = big.  In the Islands, being large is a sign of wealth.  

In the U.S., increasingly, fat is a sign of poverty.  The rich are thin because they have the time to exercise and access to healthier food.

For me, at least, I think it would be an improvement if we focused on being HEALTHY, versus thin.


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## dilloduck (Feb 22, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> Some people who are fat REALLY can't help it.  But, they don't represent that vast majority of people who are fat.
> 
> I think it is also important to recognize that Americans (and perhaps, the rest of the world) have very fucked up body image issues.
> 
> ...



So where are all the pictures of healthy people ?


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## William Joyce (Feb 22, 2009)

I'm crusading for the Fat Rejection Movement, personally (and really personally, on and off).

Fat is disgusting.  It's unhealthy.  It's unnatural.  There can be obsessions with thinness, but this is not our main problem.  Just go to the mall and look around.  To me, it's a sign of a fucked-up, diseased culture.  No exercise.  Too much TV.  Junk food.  If nothing else, it just freakin' looks bad.

I'll say this about the Mulatto Messiah:  he's in shape.


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## editec (Feb 22, 2009)

I accept fat women for what they are. 

I am even sympathetic to their claim that there is nothing they can do to lose weight because I have seen many woman who can't lose weight no matter what they do.

I still won't have sex with them.

Does that make me a bad person?


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## catzmeow (Feb 22, 2009)

editec said:


> I accept fat women for what they are.
> 
> I am even sympathetic to their claim that there is nothing they can do to lose weight because I have seen many woman who can't lose weight no matter what they do.
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> ...



I see nothing wrong with being selective about who you are attracted to and are intimate with.  I don't have sex with fat men.  My lifestyle includes taking care of my body, lifting weights, and running, and I would not have a lot of respect for a man who didn't take care of himself.

I guess when I say healthy, I think someone like Catherine Zeta Jones versus the latest heroin addict scary skinny super high fashion model.  A woman who is in shape, with curves.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

Here is the gist of it all:

Fat people may or may not be beautiful, it is in the eye of the beholder.
Fat people who accept themselves tend to be well adjusted and quite cool (my best friend is one).
Fat people who complain about being fat are either lazy idiots or denialists.
Fat people are normally no less healthy than us skinny fucks, actually, if you go by the BMI crap people who classify as fat generally have better health, the extremely fat though have about the same number of health issues as us scrwanny fucks.

Oh, and in case you didn't get it, I hate being skinny, and I have several health problems caused by being under weight, though according to the BMI I am average ... whatever, I would rather be fat and healthy.
Watch Penn and Tellers: Bullshit on Fat People ... it's a great episode and dismisses a LOT of myths.


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## michiganFats (Feb 22, 2009)




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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

michiganFats said:


>



Brings up the joke I heard: Why is it all the fat obnoxious men on TV have such hot wives?


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## Amanda (Feb 22, 2009)

I don't think we need a fat acceptance movement, i think we need a eat less and exercise more movement.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

I suspect that a lot of people are hypothyroid and not even know it.  Not only that a new normal reference TSH range from 0.5 to 2.5 mIU/L has been adopted but not all labs or doctor's even know this.  One of the chief symptoms out of many is weight gain and unable to lose it no matter how much they eat less or exercise.​


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

I also want to add that the studies shows that the majority of people do well with no symptoms with their TSH level at or below 1.0 mIU/L.  Why I had a doctor who saw my labs of a 6.84 and thought I was normal.  After a year of HELL, another doctor started me on meds.  6.84 isn't very high but enough to put on pounds and have the classic symptoms of Hypothyroidism.


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## alan1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> I don't think we need a fat acceptance movement, i think we need a eat less and exercise more movement.



You'd probably be kind of hot if you would put on 20 pounds and 20 years.


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## Amanda (Feb 22, 2009)

Terry said:


> I suspect that a lot of people are hypothyroid and not even know it.  Not only that a new normal reference TSH range from 0.5 to 2.5 mIU/L has been adopted but not all labs or doctor's even know this.  One of the chief symptoms out of many is weight gain and unable to lose it no matter how much they eat less or exercise.​



I don't know anything about science so that all flew over my head. What I do know is that everytime you hear about someone that was starved while they were in a prison they lost weight. I'm not saying people should starve themselves, I'm just saying that it sounds like BS to me when people say they can't lose weight no matter what they do. It seems like I usually hear people say it between bites of their bacon double cheesburger which has enough calories for 3 meals in it. Then they top it off with some fries and chocolate shake. All this happens over a wild game on the XBox too. So, ok, maybe there are a handful of people who really can't do anything about it but I don't believe it about the vast majority. And when there's nothing you can do there's still surgery.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

The diet industry has made a fortune on the "fat scare", which is just sick. In reality, most fat people do eat healthy, based on what or species is suppose to eat. My best friend ... even she falls for it sometimes and I have to remind her not to ... eats LESS than I do and is far more active, I am just over half her weight. People will be the weight they are suppose to be, no matter what they do, you can't and shouldn't change it. Those surgeries are the worst, they are VERY dangerous and unnatural, yet they get billions per year. 
MEGAVIDEO - I'm watching it


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> Terry said:
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> > I suspect that a lot of people are hypothyroid and not even know it. Not only that a new normal reference TSH range from 0.5 to 2.5 mIU/L has been adopted but not all labs or doctor's even know this. One of the chief symptoms out of many is weight gain and unable to lose it no matter how much they eat less or exercise.​
> ...


 It sounds to me that those people with eating habbits like that you are lumping them in one mold of all fat people.  That is not the case.  People with thyroid problems cannot loose weight no matter what they do. 

I've been 103 lbs all my life, I couldn't gain a pound no matter what I ate. (suspected hyperthyroid at the time) within 3 weeks I put on 23 lbs and my diet didn't change.  I took in few calories, with other symptoms I was finally diagnosed with Hypothoridism.  I've read up on the subject and there are many people out there that are overweight not because of diet and lack of exercise but indead their thyroid.  Read up on it.


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## Anguille (Feb 22, 2009)

I accept michigan fats.


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## dilloduck (Feb 22, 2009)

Anguille said:


> I accept michigan fats.



and I accept you too, hon.


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## xsited1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Governments from all over the world are getting more and more involved in people's lives, including controlling their weight.  These women better be careful or they might get deported.


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## michiganFats (Feb 22, 2009)

Anguille said:


> I accept michigan fats.



That's cool, but my fat ass may trade you in on a newer model.


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## Againsheila (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> I don't think we need a fat acceptance movement, i think we need a eat less and exercise more movement.



Not eat less, eat healthier, and yes, we need more exercise as a culture.  

Unfortunately, eating healthier is really expensive.


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## Anguille (Feb 22, 2009)

michiganFats said:


> Anguille said:
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> > I accept michigan fats.
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I'll nag you till you do.


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## michiganFats (Feb 22, 2009)

xsited1 said:


> Governments from all over the world are getting more and more involved in people's lives, including controlling their weight.  These women better be careful or they might get deported.



To Japan. It's a sumo culture there, they pay by the pound.  ............Free rep to the first person to say what movie that's from.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

Hypothyroidism and Weight Gain :: Health-Science.Com ::



> Interference with thyroid hormone is often an underlying cause of hypothyroidism, which, in turn, is responsible for more than 100 different symptoms. There are many undesirable effects which include weight gain and fatigue that cannot be controlled by diet or exercise.


 
Not all cases but I bet more are out there since the Lab TSH level range has changed from .05 to 6.00 to now 0.5 to 2.5 mIU/L That is all I have to say, some people that are having a problem losing weight despite exercising and taking in a lot less calories should suspect Hypothyroidism, see your doctor.


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## xsited1 (Feb 22, 2009)

michiganFats said:


> xsited1 said:
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> > Governments from all over the world are getting more and more involved in people's lives, including controlling their weight.  These women better be careful or they might get deported.
> ...



It's sad I know this:  There's Something About Mary


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## dilloduck (Feb 22, 2009)

Anguille said:


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oh shut up, Ed.


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## Anguille (Feb 22, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> Anguille said:
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 Okay, but only because i'm getting hoarse.


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## michiganFats (Feb 22, 2009)

Anguille said:


> michiganFats said:
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## Againsheila (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> Terry said:
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> 
> > I suspect that a lot of people are hypothyroid and not even know it.  Not only that a new normal reference TSH range from 0.5 to 2.5 mIU/L has been adopted but not all labs or doctor's even know this.  One of the chief symptoms out of many is weight gain and unable to lose it no matter how much they eat less or exercise.​
> ...



Watched a documentary on fat on PBS years ago...they took a bunch of thin convicts and stuck them in a room for 2 weeks and didn't allow them to exercise but allowed them to eat all kinds of fatty foods.  Only one of them gained weight.  They took too people one fat, on thin, gave them the same diet and exercise plan and it was followed.  the fat man gained weight, the thin one lost weight.

Another study I read in college had a group of fat people weighed before they entered a bakery and weighed afterward.  None of them had eating anything, there was a miniscule increase in their weight.

I guess what I'm saying is there is more to weight than meets the eye.

Most fat people have eating and exercise problems, but not all.  Some of them have medical problems, since you can't tell which is which my just looking at them, why not just treat them all the same way you would anyone else?

One of my favorite bumper stickers:

Oh Lord, if I can't be thin, please make my friends fatter.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

Againsheila said:


> Amanda said:
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Acutally to be honest with you, heavy people do not bother me.  I use to get really pissed off and would speak up from time to time when people would say to me "You are lucky to be so thin"  I would respond to them with "If I was fat would you say to me how lucky I am to be fat"?  That would shut them up. 

Thin people have health issues also! We are all human, and that is how I see it.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

Againsheila said:


> Amanda said:
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Another one was Penn and Tellers "Fat Olympics" which pitted skinny against fat in several Olympic events, the skinny guy only got third and that was just because one of the fat guys sprained an ankle and had to leave.


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## Amanda (Feb 22, 2009)

I knew I'd catch crap for it, but I had to say it.

It's not about being down on anyone it's about people taking responsibility for themselves or shutting up. Of course I've never met every fat person, but everyone of them I have met that has said anything about it in front of me has moaned about how hard (or impossible) it was to lose weight. And all of them... ALL OF THEM... ate like I described and rarely exercised, if you could call finally getting tired of what was on TV and getting up to search for the remote 'exercising'.

Weight lose doesn't come easy to me, I can't eat whatever I want. If I linger too long over fattening items on a menu my thighs get bigger. But I try to eat healthy and I exercise. I want to drop 10-15 more pounds and I'll be happy but I'm not obsessed. But you don't hear me crying about how it's impossible. I want something and I'm working toward my goal. I can't believe someone that weighs 480 can't find a way to drop a few pounds.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> I knew I'd catch crap for it, but I had to say it.
> 
> It's not about being down on anyone it's about people taking responsibility for themselves or shutting up. Of course I've never met every fat person, but everyone of them I have met that has said anything about it in front of me has moaned about how hard (or impossible) it was to lose weight. And all of them... ALL OF THEM... ate like I described and rarely exercised, if you could call finally getting tired of what was on TV and getting up to search for the remote 'exercising'.
> 
> Weight lose doesn't come easy to me, I can't eat whatever I want. If I linger too long over fattening items on a menu my thighs get bigger. But I try to eat healthy and I exercise. I want to drop 10-15 more pounds and I'll be happy but I'm not obsessed. But you don't hear me crying about how it's impossible. I want something and I'm working toward my goal. I can't believe someone that weighs 480 can't find a way to drop a few pounds.


 Amanda dear, I do know a woman who is close to 450 pounds and she eats salads, with no dressing, a lot of fish, and drinks water.  She doesn't take a lot of calories in a day, she works full time, and has 3 kids to run after.  She is active, exercises, so there are people out there even though you never met one.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> I knew I'd catch crap for it, but I had to say it.
> 
> It's not about being down on anyone it's about people taking responsibility for themselves or shutting up. Of course I've never met every fat person, but everyone of them I have met that has said anything about it in front of me has moaned about how hard (or impossible) it was to lose weight. And all of them... ALL OF THEM... ate like I described and rarely exercised, if you could call finally getting tired of what was on TV and getting up to search for the remote 'exercising'.
> 
> Weight lose doesn't come easy to me, I can't eat whatever I want. If I linger too long over fattening items on a menu my thighs get bigger. But I try to eat healthy and I exercise. I want to drop 10-15 more pounds and I'll be happy but I'm not obsessed. But you don't hear me crying about how it's impossible. I want something and I'm working toward my goal. I can't believe someone that weighs 480 can't find a way to drop a few pounds.



Sorry, but this is one case where you are judging what you think people are based on what you want to be, that's just not right.


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## alan1 (Feb 22, 2009)

Terry said:


> Acutally to be honest with you, heavy people do not bother me.  I use to get really pissed off and would speak up from time to time when people would say to me *"You are lucky to be so thin"  I would respond to them with "If I was fat would you say to me how lucky I am to be fat"?*  That would shut them up.
> 
> Thin people have health issues also! We are all human, and that is how I see it.


I'm gonna have to remember that.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

BatBoy said:


> Terry said:
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> 
> > Acutally to be honest with you, heavy people do not bother me. I use to get really pissed off and would speak up from time to time when people would say to me *"You are lucky to be so thin" I would respond to them with "If I was fat would you say to me how lucky I am to be fat"?* That would shut them up.
> ...


 sorry about that but so true. I wish I had a penny for every time someone said that to me.  I'm back down to 108 lbs and that is very thin to most people but for me since I was 103 my entire life that 20+pounds on me felt like 100 to the normal person.  

It's been a tough road and I now know the other half of people not like me.  I never thought bad of heavy people in my life, but gaining that weight sure did solidify how not to judge other's based on weight.  

Now other judgements...yeah I'm guilty....LOL


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

Terry said:


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108 ... ouch. I managed to get up to 130 and still feel like a twig at only 5 feet.


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## dilloduck (Feb 22, 2009)

Terry said:


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oh shaddup----you looked great the other night. 10 pound knockers look great on a woman like you.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

dilloduck said:


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 *bonks you on the nose* I told you that was divey not me.


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Terry said:
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Yes I know that is how most people feel and respond to me, but they have no idea.  Think if you only weight 100 lbs all your life. Living in that body then out of nowhere the pounds come on?  I would have gained more if I wasn't put on meds and a strong dosage as I was.

I still feel fat, and it's not an image thing with me.  My clothes do not fit and I don't have the money to buy new ones.  I want to lose that 5 lbs so i can wear my clothes.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

Terry said:


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Wanna know a secret that most doctors won't tell you, worrying about weight will actually cause most people to shift the opposite direction. A very hard to find study actually proved this, but it's hard to find now because the pharmacutical and weight loss companies can't make any money off it. People who never worry about their weight are the healthy weight for their body type, whether they are bigger than the mythical "healthy" weight or smaller. The real test to see if you are healthy is walk a mile, if it's easy then you are as healthy as you can be, if not then you may need to change something.


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## Sky Dancer (Feb 22, 2009)

Amanda said:


> I don't think we need a fat acceptance movement, i think we need a eat less and exercise more movement.



Or in some cases, surgery.  Is that what worked for you?


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## Terry (Feb 22, 2009)

walking a mile today is not going to happen. *lol* I probably could do it if my life depended on it but I'm not going to.   I'm not very healthy because my diet sucks, for I'm a very picky eater.  I'm not a vegertarian but pretty damn close and not by choice.  I have a lot of hang ups about food.  To me food is a chore, I don't enjoy eating but I eat to stay alive.  
Things I don't eat:
Chicken
Pork (sometimes crispy bacon)
Mushrooms
Steak (well done about once a month with a lot of A1 steak sauce)
squash
all seafood 

That's about all my dislikes...If I see any read beef, I probably won't eat any beef for months.  

Some came about when I was pregnant and very sick, some from childhood memories of gross stuff i've seen.

I don't eat breakfast, don't eat lunch most of the time, at dinner I eat veggies, starch, fruit, salads etc.  All the trimmings except for the meat. Obviously I don't cook either.

So when I gained the 20+ pounds with this diet I knew something wasn't right!


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## Sky Dancer (Feb 22, 2009)

"Research has shown that in many cases a significant, underlying cause of morbid obesity is genetic. 

Studies have demonstrated that once the problem is established, efforts such as dieting and exercise programs have a _limited ability to provide effective long-term relief_." 
Causes of Morbid Obesity


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## KittenKoder (Feb 22, 2009)

Terry said:


> walking a mile today is not going to happen. *lol* I probably could do it if my life depended on it but I'm not going to.   I'm not very healthy because my diet sucks, for I'm a very picky eater.  I'm not a vegertarian but pretty damn close and not by choice.  I have a lot of hang ups about food.  To me food is a chore, I don't enjoy eating but I eat to stay alive.
> Things I don't eat:
> *Chicken
> Pork (sometimes crispy bacon)
> ...



Awesome! More for me.


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## Amanda (Feb 23, 2009)

Sky Dancer said:


> Amanda said:
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> > I don't think we need a fat acceptance movement, i think we need a eat less and exercise more movement.
> ...



I've never been really fat Sky. I have eaten too much really good food since moving to the city and and have put on a few pounds. You'll have a hard time zinging me about my weight with all the guys that look at me like I was a sandwich. But keep trying if it will make you feel better, it doesn't mean anything to me when others have their issues. I only try to fix mine because they are the only ones I can affect.

FWIW, I don't care if others are fat. Not my problem. I just don't want t hear the boo hooing while you shovel fries in your mouth. That's when it's time for a big cup of STFU.


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## LiveUninhibited (Feb 23, 2009)

Most people can gain or lose weight, but it's much harder for some people than others and weight per se is not equivalent to health. Our society has a problem with judging people based weight but it's not a level playing field and there is far more to a person than their weight. That should be the message for an organization that is an advocate for overweight people, not that losing weight makes you a sellout.



KittenKoder said:


> Here is the gist of it all:
> 
> Fat people may or may not be beautiful, it is in the eye of the beholder.
> Fat people who accept themselves tend to be well adjusted and quite cool (my best friend is one).
> ...



The BMI is nearly worthless. A better predictor would be body composition, i.e. percentage of body mass that is not lean. According to the BMI bodybuilders are morbidly obese, but we know that Jabba and Arnold are not going to have the same health problems. The BMI also does not take many critical things into account such as body frame. 



Amanda said:


> I don't think we need a fat acceptance movement, i think we need a eat less and exercise more movement.



Portion control is a simple way of helping to keep ones fat stores down. However, the major rules in terms of diet are to eat foods that make you feel fuller per calorie and are nutrient dense. Also, it is helpful to eat more often in smaller portions. People who skip breakfast tend to be fatter than people who eat breakfast even if the people who eat breakfast consume more calories per day, _ceteris paribus_. Given equivalent calories, the more meals you eat per day the higher your basal metabolic rate will be. Your body is designed to go into a sort of "famine mode" when you eat few meals per day, which translates into storing more calories as fats.

Thus the problem of yo-yo dieting. If you eat less, you will lose weight in the short term. But at the cost of metabolic rate. So then when you do eat more than you were on the diet, you will gain weight more quickly than before.

Exercising will increase your metabolic rate in addition to the additional calories burned during exercise. The benefits of exercise go well beyond weight management and even cardiovascular health. What people in our society really need to learn is that no medication, procedure, or any combination thereof is going to replace exercise. 

Overall, it should be emphasized that people need to make changes in their lifestyle that they can stick to, and doing it incrementally is okay.


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## editec (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> Amanda said:
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I don't doubt it.

The only way my weight ever changes is if I pump iron.  

My top weight _ever_ was 175 and that took an hour a day lifting and a half hour biking. 

_Sans_ excercise I settle down to about 155 lb.  

Been like that since the late 60s.


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## catzmeow (Feb 23, 2009)

I have hypothyroidism, too.  It was diagnosed about 10 years ago, when my son was 2.  I take levothyroxin for it and have to watch my levels very closely because if I get above a 3.0 in my TSH levels, I will start gaining weight out of the blue.  It is what it is.   The biggest issue has been finding a doctor who will help me manage it.  Some doctors think 5 is normal, some think 3 is normal, for me, I feel better at under 1.


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## Zoom-boing (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> Amanda dear, I do know a woman who is close to 450 pounds and she eats salads, with no dressing, a lot of fish, and drinks water.  She doesn't take a lot of calories in a day, she works full time, and has 3 kids to run after.  She is active, exercises, so there are people out there even though you never met one.




She really eats like this and weighs that much?  Sounds to me like she isn't eating enough calories to sustain her size.  She likely needs say 2,600 cals/day (I'm just ballparking here; there are formulas you can use to get more accurate numbers) and if she's only eating 1,600 cals/day, her body thinks it's in 'starvation mode' and will not let go of any weight.  If she upped her calories and continued exercising (exercising is great but calories are the magic bullet in weight loss) she would likely lose weight.  

If you don't eat enough to support your body, your body will think it's in 'starvation mode' and hang onto every, single lb. it can.  Finding the right number of calories that will sustain you but not put your body into 'starvation mode' vs. eating over what will sustain you thus causing weight gain (or no loss) -- it's a tricky little sucker.  And it's requires constant tweaking.


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## jillian (Feb 23, 2009)

Zoom-boing said:


> She really eats like this and weighs that much?  Sounds to me like she isn't eating enough calories to sustain her size.  She likely needs say 2,600 cals/day (I'm just ballparking here; there are formulas you can use to get more accurate numbers) and if she's only eating 1,600 cals/day, her body thinks it's in 'starvation mode' and will not let go of any weight.  If she upped her calories and continued exercising (exercising is great but calories are the magic bullet in weight loss) she would likely lose weight.
> 
> If you don't eat enough to support your body, your body will think it's in 'starvation mode' and hang onto every, single lb. it can.  Finding the right number of calories that will sustain you but not put your body into 'starvation mode' vs. eating over what will sustain you thus causing weight gain (or no loss) -- it's a tricky little sucker.  And it's requires constant tweaking.



Actually, if she were eating as she says, her body would be in ketosis and she would be losing a great deal of weight (albeit in a very unhealthy fashion). And while you're correct that the body stores fat if it thinks it's being starved, it seems more likely that she either has a very big snacking problem or a serious metabolic problem. Either way, it's dangerous for someone to be 450 lbs.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Zoom-boing said:


> Terry said:
> 
> 
> > Amanda dear, I do know a woman who is close to 450 pounds and she eats salads, with no dressing, a lot of fish, and drinks water.  She doesn't take a lot of calories in a day, she works full time, and has 3 kids to run after.  She is active, exercises, so there are people out there even though you never met one.
> ...



That's the smartest response I have seen.

Something else many people deny or forget is that our bodies crave flavors based on what vitamins and minerals are naturally associated with those flavors, however with processed food this is no longer the case. If you crave sweet things it's most likely you need citric acid and natural sugars. Basically the best way to be sure you have a balanced diet is to eat anything that's natural your body craves, and in doing so you can actually eat as much as you want. What's happening with people who gain weight because of over eating isn't the amount they eat, it's the fact that what they are eating (based on the flavors they are craving) are not giving their bodies what they really need, instead it's filling them up with what their bodies may already have enough of.

I eat like a pig, but I only what what I crave, the only difference between me and many others is I don't eat junk food when I crave it, instead I find the natural food with the same flavor and fill up on that. Then if I feel like it I snack on the junk food. I eat a LOT of meat, and never lean (I can't stand anything that is "fat free") and I am less active than most people. I can sometimes gain weight ... in the winter, but normally I fall below average. When I asked the doctor how to gain weight they just looked at me funny and said to eat more, then after telling them that a large pizza is only the main course for many of my meals she almost had a heart attack. I have no problems with cholesterol in spite of a family history, and no weight gain in spite of my mother being 300 at my height.


----------



## Zoom-boing (Feb 23, 2009)

jillian said:


> Actually, if she were eating as she says, her body would be in ketosis and she would be losing a great deal of weight (albeit in a very unhealthy fashion). And while you're correct that the body stores fat if it thinks it's being starved, it seems more likely that she either has a very big snacking problem or a serious metabolic problem. Either way, it's dangerous for someone to be 450 lbs.



Yup.  I know of no one who can live off of fish, salads and water . . . and not much else or not much more variety.  How boring is that anyway?  Her body isn't getting _whatever _number of calories needed in order to lose weight at a sensible and reasonable 1-2 lb. rate/wk.  And yes 450 on anyone is dangerous, period.  



KittenKoder said:


> That's the smartest response I have seen.
> 
> Something else many people deny or forget is that our bodies crave flavors based on what vitamins and minerals are naturally associated with those flavors, however with processed food this is no longer the case. If you crave sweet things it's most likely you need citric acid and natural sugars. Basically the best way to be sure you have a balanced diet is to eat anything that's natural your body craves, and in doing so you can actually eat as much as you want. What's happening with people who gain weight because of over eating isn't the amount they eat, it's the fact that what they are eating (based on the flavors they are craving) are not giving their bodies what they really need, instead it's filling them up with what their bodies may already have enough of.
> 
> I eat like a pig, but I only what what I crave, the only difference between me and many others is *I don't eat junk food when I crave it, instead I find the natural food with the same flavor and fill up on that. Then if I feel like it I snack on the junk food.* I eat a LOT of meat, and never lean (*I can't stand anything that is "fat free"*) and I am less active than most people. I can sometimes gain weight ... in the winter, but normally I fall below average. When I asked the doctor how to gain weight they just looked at me funny and said to eat more, then after telling them that a large pizza is only the main course for many of my meals she almost had a heart attack. I have no problems with cholesterol in spite of a family history, and no weight gain in spite of my mother being 300 at my height.




    I agree 100% Kitten.  If you give you body what it_ needs _first (vs. what your mouth wants) then if you still want 'junk' have some, you will likely eat much less of the 'junk' because you've paid attention to your body's needs.  A lot of people eat mindlessly (I'm guilty of that myself at times).  Paying attention really makes a difference.  As for the fat free thing - fat takes longer to break down and helps satiate, making you feel full longer.  I'd rather spend more calories on a full fat item (say olive oil in a stir fry) and stay full longer rather than going with 'non-stick spray' and being hungry again much sooner, because I'd end up overeating.  Also, combining protein and carbs for meals and snacks goes a looong way in staving off hunger.  I've found the best approach is balance and moderation.  The government should try this.


----------



## Againsheila (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> Againsheila said:
> 
> 
> > Amanda said:
> ...



I used to have a friend that was always a minimum of 10 pounds underweight.  Oh if only I could have given her 10 of my pounds, we would have both been happy.


----------



## Amanda (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Amanda said:
> 
> 
> > I knew I'd catch crap for it, but I had to say it.
> ...



What's the judgment? That someone that's stuffing junk food in their body at an alarming rate and not exercising could probably be doing more to lose weight? Yeah I guess I'm guilty of that.


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Amanda said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Amanda said:
> ...



This is where you are wrongly judging someone. Most fat people do not, many follow the "fad diets" in which they do just the opposite, and while Americans are generally sedentary I see more "big" people out walking than I see skinny fucks like me. I walk a lot simply because I don't like cars so to get from one place to the next it's walking or sometimes the bus. You do realize that the diet industry, or "health food" makes billions. Do you really think it's skinny people buying this garbage? No, it's fat people made self conscious by people as uneducated as yourself telling them it's their fault even when it usually has nothing to do with them eating too much, but because they are eating too little of what they need.


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## Terry (Feb 23, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> I have hypothyroidism, too. It was diagnosed about 10 years ago, when my son was 2. I take levothyroxin for it and have to watch my levels very closely because if I get above a 3.0 in my TSH levels, I will start gaining weight out of the blue. It is what it is. The biggest issue has been finding a doctor who will help me manage it. Some doctors think 5 is normal, some think 3 is normal, for me, I feel better at under 1.


 I suggest you print out this page and take it to your doctor!

http://www.thyroidtoday.com/TTLibrary/current/AACE Newsletter.pdf

Everyone is different, we finally found out that I do better with my TSH at .25.  Anything over that I have classic hypo symptoms.  Mainly migraine headaches, hair falling out, fatigue, feeling cold, and dry skin.

Even when my TSH was in the normal range of 1.71 I was extremely having a hard time with the symptoms.  I finally out of chance (military moves) found a doctor that knew everyone was different and knew about the new lab levels.  

Some doctors and most endo doctors are lazy!  Good Luck.


----------



## Terry (Feb 23, 2009)

Zoom-boing said:


> Terry said:
> 
> 
> > Amanda dear, I do know a woman who is close to 450 pounds and she eats salads, with no dressing, a lot of fish, and drinks water. She doesn't take a lot of calories in a day, she works full time, and has 3 kids to run after. She is active, exercises, so there are people out there even though you never met one.
> ...


My point is she doesn't eat junk food, she doesn't gorge herself on food, she isnt' the kind to eat ice cream then drink a diet soda type.  She eats healthy foods, and takes care of herself.  She has had her thyroid tested but that was years ago.  Her family (mother and father) are skinny but her great grand mother was very large.  Her doctor suggested to her that it was genetic.


----------



## catzmeow (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> Everyone is different, we finally found out that I do better with my TSH at .25.  Anything over that I have classic hypo symptoms.  Mainly migraine headaches, hair falling out, fatigue, feeling cold, and dry skin.



Do you find that you can tell when yours is getting out of whack even before it shows up in your TSH levels?  For instance, I know mine is creeping towards 3 (just had my meds adjusted) because I am FREEZING all the time right now.


----------



## Amanda (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Amanda said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...



I guess I stand corrected. Apparently pounding cheesburgers and sitting around all the time is a great way to lose weight and these poor misunderstood people are in fact doing everything in their power but are sadly helpless.

I don't care if the "diet industry" is making millions. It's irrelevant. 

I've never told any fat people how to get skinny or that they were too fat. None of my business and I really don't care. Whenever anyone asks me how I do it I just them hard work. The only time I can imagine caring would be if I got stuck sitting next to someone on an airplane and they were spilling over their seat onto me, that would just be gross. But I don't fly very often so I don't see it being a problem.

I'm surprised to see all the people jumping to the defense of fat people. I didn't realize they were a protected class.


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## Terry (Feb 23, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> Terry said:
> 
> 
> > Everyone is different, we finally found out that I do better with my TSH at .25. Anything over that I have classic hypo symptoms. Mainly migraine headaches, hair falling out, fatigue, feeling cold, and dry skin.
> ...


 
Big time for me, it's been a year and my dosage is still not right. I go back on the 27th of this month to get levels checked. Three months ago my levels was .01 and the doctor said to me "We over shot you" I pleaded with her because I was feeling better, no more migraines! She agreed to let me stay on the dosage for another 3 months. Now I go back. I fear she will lower my dosage and those migraines return. The migraines is the first clue I get my levels are bad. I wake up with it and it doesn't go away. I've been so cold that I took a hot show (No cold water at all) for 30 minutes, to raise my body temp. I then laid in bed with a heated blanket and 2 others. I was still cold! I felt hypothermia and I thought that strange being my levels couldn't be that off. Now I'm thinking maybe my body is just hyper sensitive and therefore my symptoms though real are magnified. 

Only twice have I felt a body temp. of feeling hot, so I believe I&#8217;m pretty much on the correct dosage. I have no idea maybe I was Hyper for years and now hypo. I had surgery back in 2002 they took out a 5cm Microfollicular adenoma so I lost my left thyroid. I remember years before this nodule showing up that I was having hypo symptoms but my TSH was always in that normal range of 1.70 to 1.86. I knew something wasn&#8217;t right by try finding a doctor that will listen? I saw a total of 10 doctors in 3 years that basically laughed at me for suggesting I was hypo. I gave up on that, and my migraines got so bad I thought maybe it was my eyes. I went to see a new doctor here when we moved here and first thing out of her mouth was &#8220;It&#8217;s your thyroid&#8221; I actually laughed out loud at her. That was over a year ago and we are still trying to figure my levels out. I&#8217;m starting to get headaches again so not sure that means my dosage needs to go down or up. **shrugs** My TSH when I went in over a year ago thinking it was my eyes was 6.89 and then it went up again.


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## Terry (Feb 23, 2009)

If I miss one day of my pills I feel that racey feeling and a migraine.


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## Sunni Man (Feb 23, 2009)

Amanda said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Amanda said:
> ...


These human water buffalos will soon be a protected class and will be given legal victim status under the law.

Then it will be a hate crime to eat a hamburger in front of them and not offer them a bite.


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## Sky Dancer (Feb 23, 2009)

Thyroid levels fluctuate.  I have hypothyroidism, secondary to Graves Disease.  I developed it after being treated with radioactive isotope for hyperthyroidism.

Graves nearly killed me.


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## Terry (Feb 23, 2009)

Sky Dancer said:


> Thyroid levels fluctuate. I have hypothyroidism, secondary to Graves Disease. I developed it after being treated with radioactive isotope for hyperthyroidism.
> 
> Graves nearly killed me.


 We should start a seperate thread and call it Thyroid Support Thread. LOL

Thyroid problems SUCK period!  I don't wish this on anyone.


----------



## Sky Dancer (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> Sky Dancer said:
> 
> 
> > Thyroid levels fluctuate. I have hypothyroidism, secondary to Graves Disease. I developed it after being treated with radioactive isotope for hyperthyroidism.
> ...



I hear you.  It's hell on the nervous system.


----------



## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Personally, I don't really care if people are fat or not, we all have our flaws. What I don't condone is fat acceptance to the point of severe obesity in the way it's describe in the article. I'm not saying they should be judged negatively, I'm saying that accepting your weight at a reasonable level is one thing, accepting  your weight at 500 pounds and saying screw it, is not healthy both mentally or physically .

I never had problems with weight until my late 20's. I was sick and given massive doses of steroids to fight an eye infection (iritis). I gained a lot of weight, really FAST and had trouble losing it afterwords. It took me 2 years to lose 60 lbs - the last 20 taking up most of the 2 years! My doctor claimed steroids 'aged' my metabolism and recommend an Atkins like diet. this didn't really work well for me, but a nutritionist suggested trying an anti-yeast diet that worked much better and addressed symptoms and digestive problems I was having.  I guess yeast is a problem for some after steroid treatment. Who knew?


----------



## Sky Dancer (Feb 23, 2009)

I have known a few morbidly obese individuals.    Most of them had genetic predisposition and a lifetime of dieting--which is known to screw with metabolism.

Most died early.

It's a serious health issue, and the presumption that ANYONE who wants to be thin, can be is crap.


----------



## catzmeow (Feb 23, 2009)

Said1 said:


> I guess yeast is a problem for some after steroid treatment. Who knew?



Steroids in general can really fuck up your system.  My mom has a terminal lung condition and takes steroids.  They've fucked up her equilibrium, hearing, and they make her incredibly nervous and edgy, too.


----------



## catzmeow (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> Sky Dancer said:
> 
> 
> > Thyroid levels fluctuate. I have hypothyroidism, secondary to Graves Disease. I developed it after being treated with radioactive isotope for hyperthyroidism.
> ...



I think the odd part for me is being perimenopausal at a relatively young age (43) because of my thyroid.  That leads to all kinds of issues.  And the thyroid controls EVERYTHING, I've found.


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> Said1 said:
> 
> 
> > I guess yeast is a problem for some after steroid treatment. Who knew?
> ...



 My doctor said I 'might' be a bit more emotional and hungrier than normal. OMG, understatement of the year. I was very paranoid and had severe anxiety, too. My moods were all over the place - I spent $100 on cafeteria food on top of three meals provided. Then I was treated as an out-patient, getting was I was getting over a 24 hr period, condensed in 3 treatments a day, for 2 weeks. Then pills for months.

Is your mother taking anything to help with the 'mood' side effects? I can't imagine facing a terminal illness, let alone on a heavy regiment of steroids, making things worse.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

People just eat shit, thats the problem...no execuses

fast food is all shit


if you can stick to 1500-2000 calories a day

take a lot of protien, usually 1 gram of protien per pound

and stay within 100 carbs you will be healthy

take a multi vitmain every day and drink water

But

When you drink coke, diet coke, all the other shit, and go to wendys, thats all bad for you.

However the real problem is, it's more expensive to eat healthy then it is to eat shit


----------



## Anguille (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> That's the smartest response I have seen.
> 
> Something else many people deny or forget is that our bodies crave flavors based on what vitamins and minerals are naturally associated with those flavors, however with processed food this is no longer the case. If you crave sweet things it's most likely you need citric acid and natural sugars. Basically the best way to be sure you have a balanced diet is to eat anything that's natural your body craves, and in doing so you can actually eat as much as you want. What's happening with people who gain weight because of over eating isn't the amount they eat, it's the fact that what they are eating (based on the flavors they are craving) are not giving their bodies what they really need, instead it's filling them up with what their bodies may already have enough of.
> 
> I eat like a pig, but I only what what I crave, the only difference between me and many others is I don't eat junk food when I crave it, instead I find the natural food with the same flavor and fill up on that. Then if I feel like it I snack on the junk food. I eat a LOT of meat, and never lean (I can't stand anything that is "fat free") and I am less active than most people. I can sometimes gain weight ... in the winter, but normally I fall below average. When I asked the doctor how to gain weight they just looked at me funny and said to eat more, then after telling them that a large pizza is only the main course for many of my meals she almost had a heart attack. I have no problems with cholesterol in spite of a family history, and no weight gain in spite of my mother being 300 at my height.


 All I crave today is Three Musketeers Mint Bars. What nutrient am I lacking and what is the natural food with the same flavor? 

I hope it's not Peppermint Patties. I hate those!


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Iron or zinc. I used to work with a girl who craved mint and that's what she claimed.


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## Sky Dancer (Feb 23, 2009)

Another problem with steroid use is diabetes.  There is actually a steroid induced form of diabetes.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

want good snack foods that are good for you

Yogurt, yoplait lite and fit is excellent and tastes great

Polly-O string cheese lowfat- delicious

Breyers Smart Carb ice cream-  The bars are great for on the go and the scoops are good for when you're home..add a little peanut butter= yummy

Celery-  Can't go wrong. Taste good, dip it in peanut butter..you burn more calories eating it then you consume


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## nia588 (Feb 23, 2009)

this is frightening that an Obese person can walk around thinking there's nothing wrong. i am a person who have suffered with weight issues in the past. im not going to lie it was really hard work to lose weight but in the long run it was worth it. i just wish other people with weight problems could also see the importance of losing weight. there is a movement for society to accept fat people. now im not saying people should just bash them or call them hurtful names or discriminate because trust me the more you discriminate against someone who is obese the more they are wounded emotional and tend to eat even more food.


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## nia588 (Feb 23, 2009)

Sunni Man said:


> These human water buffalos will soon be a protected class and will be given legal victim status under the law.
> 
> Then it will be a hate crime to eat a hamburger in front of them and not offer them a bite.



these are the kinda of statements which makes obese people want to say "F the world, im going to embrace being obese and not worry about my health and size". comments like these do not push or encourage obese people to lose weight. in fact they make obese people to eat even more because of the emotional pain such comments like these cause.

Obesity is a disease/disorder. losing weight is a whole long process. it takes months even years to take off extra weight and takes a lot of work to keep it off. losing weight isn't as simple as "putting the donuts down". most obese people eat the way they do due to emotional issues or busy lifestyles. it usually doesn't have any thing to do with being greedy.


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> want good snack foods that are good for you
> 
> Yogurt, yoplait lite and fit is excellent and tastes great
> 
> ...



Raisins are good, too. They're like a handful of candy. I'm not supposed to eat them, but I do anyway.


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## Zoom-boing (Feb 23, 2009)

Nuts (in moderation), whole grain breads/pasta, fresh fruit, peanut butter (again, moderation), proteins like turkey, cottage cheese , tuna, (watch out for tuna and sushi - mercury contents are high in these foods) and the ever portable cheesestick - also great snicky-snack foods.   Raisins and peanuts mixed together are really, really good.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

Raisins and peanut butter are great....I used to put them ina bowl with whip cream on top...yummy

Dip your celery in peanut butter, throw some raisins on there and boom, got yourself a tasty snack


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## catzmeow (Feb 23, 2009)

Said1 said:


> Is your mother taking anything to help with the 'mood' side effects? I can't imagine facing a terminal illness, let alone on a heavy regiment of steroids, making things worse.



My mom would be resistant to taking mood enhancers, being of the sturdy midwestern stock variety who would prefer to rely on God for her mood enhancement.

The rest of us would love it if she were on meds, though.  Trust me.


----------



## Terry (Feb 23, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> Said1 said:
> 
> 
> > Is your mother taking anything to help with the 'mood' side effects? I can't imagine facing a terminal illness, let alone on a heavy regiment of steroids, making things worse.
> ...


 I do not blame your mom! A lot of time meds give a person more side effects and problems.  I will not take meds unless it will keep me alive just about.  I refuse to take pain meds but will if the pain is off the scale.  

I have to take my meds for Thyroid but my doctor knows she be hard pressed to give me anything else.  She actually tried to get me to accept a prescription to treat migraines! No way, migraines are because my dosage is not right I said.  

Heck I was put in the hospital on a Friday night (In Germany) and learned by CHANCE they were going to do some major surgery on me Monday morning.  Those hospitals in Germany are not like the USA.  Their wards are locked.  What did I do?  With IV lead in my hand, I asked the German nurse if I can go downstairs and get coffee.  She looked at me and buzzed the door so I can leave.  They didn't know it but I had all my stuff tucked under my hospital gown.  I walked across the street and waited a few hours for when my husband was suppose to show up.  He saw me, stopped, and I said.."Take me home"  He laughed, went up there and told them I'm not coming back.  I had a neighbor who was a nurse take the IV out of me.  

After returning to the USA and seeing a doctor I learned that the surgery they wanted to perform was very uncalled for.  Surgery was to remove my intestines!


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Sunni Man said:


> Amanda said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...



How about that Amanda, you are right in line with the biggest hatemonger on USMB. 
As for what you think the typical fat person does, too much TV rots the brains. Homer Simpson is not a typical fat person, that is the humor in his character, same for all the others on TV. You think these characters would really be that funny if that's what they were really like? Again though, use you brain, who pays billions per year on diet fads? Do you by only diet food? I know a LOT of fat people in real life, and a few "morbidly obese". The morbidly obese (I love that phrase is sounds scarier) ones do have health issues because of their weight, but most don't even eat half what I do. Why do they confide in me? Because I don't judge them based on their weight but on how they treat other people (that's how I judge everyone).

However, so many who don't like people being fat love to repress ... without the fat people we wouldn't have survived as a species. "The ability to eat and fuck is what made our species so strong." If you don't like it fine, but don't try to make it sound like fat people are lazy or pigs, most are not.


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## alan1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Terry said:


> I still feel fat, and it's not an image thing with me.  My clothes do not fit and I don't have the money to buy new ones.  *I want to lose that 5 lbs so i can wear my clothes.*



So, does this mean you go around naked all the time?


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

BatBoy said:


> Terry said:
> 
> 
> > I still feel fat, and it's not an image thing with me.  My clothes do not fit and I don't have the money to buy new ones.  *I want to lose that 5 lbs so i can wear my clothes.*
> ...



Now that is hot ...


----------



## dilloduck (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> BatBoy said:
> 
> 
> > Terry said:
> ...




homo


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > BatBoy said:
> ...



Sometimes ...


----------



## alan1 (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > BatBoy said:
> ...



Homosexuality is ok, 
as long as it's two hot women.


----------



## dilloduck (Feb 23, 2009)

BatBoy said:


> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...



I always forget that rule--ty batboy.


----------



## alan1 (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> BatBoy said:
> 
> 
> > dilloduck said:
> ...



I'm only here to help.


And cause trouble.


----------



## Agnapostate (Feb 23, 2009)

Apparently I look about forty or fifty pounds lighter than I am...it's all good.


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Agnapostate said:


> Apparently I look about forty or fifty pounds lighter than I am...it's all good.



The thing many people forget: muscle weighs a LOT more than fat.


----------



## Anguille (Feb 23, 2009)

In other words, Agna is not a fathead.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

don't know why anyone would let themselves get fat...it's so easy to stay in shape


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> don't know why anyone would let themselves get fat...it's so easy to stay in shape



Are you really that dense?


----------



## alan1 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > don't know why anyone would let themselves get fat...it's so easy to stay in shape
> ...



It's all about stopping Supermans x-ray vision.


----------



## dilloduck (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Agnapostate said:
> 
> 
> > Apparently I look about forty or fifty pounds lighter than I am...it's all good.
> ...



fat tastes better tho


----------



## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Agnapostate said:
> ...



Finger lickin' good. 




Ew.


----------



## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > don't know why anyone would let themselves get fat...it's so easy to stay in shape
> ...



...would you be suggesting otherwise?

cause it's really not hard to stay healthy and in shape...


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Agnapostate said:
> ...



Damn, I just ate and you put me in the mood for bacon ... oh well, breakfast is soon.


----------



## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



All the tests not funded by the companies who sell these diet fads prove that weight has nothing to do with activity level and food consumption. While there isn't a "fat" gene, people are predisposed to be specific weights based on their bodies needs. So not everyone is suppose to be thin, and most fat people are perfectly healthy, while many skinny people are not. The fat people that are not healthy often use diet fads or starvation, and usually they gain weight instead of losing it. Our species survived because of the mix of fat and skinny, the fat people were generally those who survived in hard winters, while the skinny people hunted in the summer. Also, many people will just start gaining fat layers as they get older, naturally, stopping this is not only unnatural but unhealthy.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

fad diets?

I'm not talking about fad diets

I am talking about taking care of yourself, and sorry I don't buy into the bullshit of I was born a fat guy.  Sure some people are born bigger then most, that is totally seperate.

When I say take care  of yourself i'm not telling you to take the atkins diet

Instead of 3 giant meals, eat 6 small portions...keeps your metabolism up and you dont feel as hungry.  Watch what you eat?  That means look at the thing called the nutritional label.

Eat fiber, fiber makes you feel full and your digestive system burns more calories digesting it.

and the biggey

stay away from fast fucking food...everything on the menu is bad

Getting a chicken sandwhich?  don't eat the bread...eat the chicken, you will fill up just fine.


You can always have your cheat days also.

Starvation?  That is the WORST thing you can do for a diet, it slows down your metabolism and your muscles begin to cannablize on themselves.  

Sorry, I don't buy anything you said, and I used to be a former fat kid, I lost 105 pounds from 14-17


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> fad diets?
> 
> I'm not talking about fad diets
> 
> ...



You really think fat people are those you see on TV, like other morons I recommend you actually get to know some, I mean learn what they eat and how often. You will find that a majority eat less than a skinny person does. I was born skinny, I cannot gain weight no matter how hard I try, many fat people are just like that, almost all are actually. Also, the weight of a person changes naturally with age, it's just the way it is, you were just one of the reverse who start off big then get smaller. A vast majority of humans work just the opposite. You sound like that asshole who thinks everyone should look like a body builder, or the scum that cons people into thinking anyone can. Those weight loss product and program claims have all been proven wrong (those that were challenged).


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew is just projecting. Inside, he's still a fattie.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Said1 said:


> Andrew is just projecting. Inside, he's still a fattie.



LOL ... probably.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > fad diets?
> ...



I just think your fucking clueless and only make excuses...

I wasn't born fat, I was fat cause I ate like shit when I was younger

I know plenty of fat people and you know what they all have in common genius?

Bad Nutrition and no exercise 

Please point me to a 350 pound person who eats right and exercises 5 times a week.

Also, you don't have to be a fucking bodybuilder you dolt to go to the gym....there hundreds of types of workouts you can do.  Some to gain size and others to stay where you're at and just tone.

Most important is keeping your heart rate up, how many 350 pounders you know doing cardio 3 times a week?

You say a fat person might eat less then a skinny person....you may be right...usually you're wrong but in small cases you are right.. Because the skinny person most likely exercises and has a high metabolism

Michael Phelps takes in 12k calories per day when training, perfect example.

The fat guy tho may eat less but take a look at what hes eating...he eats shit, takes in a lot of carbs, sugars, fat (the badkind) and calories...you may think because the fat guy is eating less cause he eats 3 times a day but the shit he eats has triple the calories and sugar intake that I would take in eating 6 times a day.

Like I said, I don't look like a body builder, but I am in shape...everyone doesn't need to be a body builder to be in basic healthy shape...you don't need a 6 pac either....however if you get winded cause your fat ass gets up from the couch to get the remote you have a fucking problem


This country is first or 2nd in the world in obesity and all of a sudden its I was born with this...it's such a bunch of horseshit...put the fucking fork down, eat right and take care of yourself.

I haven't seen a wendy's mcdonalds or burger king in over 3 years, those places are just fucking awful

I'm a con for trying to convince people that anyone can do it?  Thats a con you idiot...well fuck you

Cause guess what EVERYONE CAN DO IT!  Sorry you don't have the determination or mindset to have a goal like that....you would be surprised how many people do.  Everyone can take care of themselves...People just don't do it...thats the bottom line


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

Said1 said:


> Andrew is just projecting. Inside, he's still a fattie.



inside me there is a fat kid trying to get out 

i dont let him tho, its not fun being fat


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
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Almost all kids eat nothing but junk food, but the vast majority are still very thin. Most fat adults eat healthy and even do more than most skinny adults. Explain why that is possible if your idiotic and non-scientific concept is real?


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> Said1 said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew is just projecting. Inside, he's still a fattie.
> ...



Aww. Come on. Let him have that deep fried ice cream.

You find it easy because you're used to doing things differently and I'm sure you feel like crap the day after falling off the wagon. I know I do and that's enough for me to not touch booze......erp......I mean cheese cake, for a long time. Exercise is a natural anti-depressant, too - good for emotional eaters.


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## dilloduck (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> Said1 said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew is just projecting. Inside, he's still a fattie.
> ...



If the fat kid in me wouldn't always try to try to just come out of my belly, he may not be so bad.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
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simple?

Because when your younger your metabolism is as high as it will ever be in your life.

YOu ever say in your life "Man I could eat that back in the day but not now"  That is pretty much common fucking sense, sorry that eludes you.

Please show me the fat adults that eat healthy...I am waiting.  Show me the fat adult that  takes in 2000 calories which is a lot to me but I will be conservative and exercises regularly. 

Let me guess, you think Diet Coke is good for your right?


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

Said1 said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
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> > Said1 said:
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ahha

You want real good guilt free ice cream

Breyers Carb Smart Ice Cream, only got like 4 carbs I think and its REAL good.

I'm a big fan...

and you're right exercise is an excellent anti-depressant, when your body feels good you will feel good


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > Said1 said:
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Well .. why did you eat him in the first place?


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

dilloduck said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > Said1 said:
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lol, guy has got skillz


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> Said1 said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



Eeew ... and you do realize that the "healthy" foods like that are not natural ... nor healthy, right? Here's a hint about the law, there are NO regulations that a product has to actually be healthy to place the claim on the label (they don't even have to be safe for that claim) and in order to make foods low in carbs or fat they have to use artificial products, because natural and truly healthy foods are found i farmers markets, loaded with fats, carbs, and even cholesterol.


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## dilloduck (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> dilloduck said:
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> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



Already told ya--fat is yummy


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > Said1 said:
> ...



sorry to break it to you sherlock...but unless you are eating fruits and veggies 24/7, nothing in your diet is "natural".

Let me guess you're one of the loons that looks at me funny cause I would rather use equal or splendor rather then pure sugar right?

Also, 4 carbs for ice cream is spectscular especially when a normal serving would have about 25 carbs and there is no difference in taste.

Do you drink Diet Coke?  Wtf do you think they put in there to make it calorie, carb, and sugar free?  Nothing is natural, the important thing is to know what you are eating and portion yourself.

You like french fries?

Here's an idea, buy a sweet potato or yam and peel them yourself and bake them instead of frying them...much better for you and better tasting


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> Said1 said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
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I don't eat dairy anymore. I avoid dairy and sugar as much as possible. I really can't tolerate either since I've cut it out as much as possible. I have enzyme tablets I can take two hours before eating (Candizym?), but I just avoid both,  as much as possibe.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

Yeah, thats a digestive aid I think.  I couldn't live cutting out dairy out of my life, more power to you.  I still love milk and cheese


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



Actually, ice cream can be natural if made from natural ingredients ... meat IS natural though much of it contains preservatives now (which are not the real problem). Soda isn't natural, no, but that's because of the carbonation, not carbs. 
I eat a LOT, bacon, ham, beef, and my favorite if chicken (love the skin). I rarely eat veggies, but all my meat is natural. I also eat a lot of natural ice cream, made with real milk if I haven't had too much dairy already (lactose intolerance sucks), I munch on some candy, and a lot of nuts (sunflower seeds rule!). I eat lots of bread, it holds the meat the best, and never touch anything that says "healthy" because I know what they make those products out of. I fry a lot of food, and I eat all day. Funny thing, I am female, 125 lbs average, at 5'3" ... I do almost no physical activity all day. So how is that possible?

Then my best friend (almost 300 at 5'4") who eats salads most of the time, only one small meal a day, maybe a sandwich or couple of pizza slices once a week. She is on her feet and moving around a lot all day. She lifts heavy objects at work a lot to. Also she doesn't drink soda (I go through about 1 liter a day myself), and rarely drinks coffee even (very rare in Seattle I know). Explain that one?

Your logic isn't based on fact, it's based on ignorance and TV shows (most likely sitcoms). Learn something some day, or at least make some more friends.


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## Said1 (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> Yeah, thats a digestive aid I think.  I couldn't live cutting out dairy out of my life, more power to you.  I still love milk and cheese



I still use cream in my coffee. I'd _die_ without my daily XL Starbucks!


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> Yeah, thats a digestive aid I think.  I couldn't live cutting out dairy out of my life, more power to you.  I still love milk and cheese



Oh ... you do realize that dairy has the highest fat content of all foods, especially the natural forms. Cheese IS fat, so is cream.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
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> > KittenKoder said:
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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Then I call bullshit on you ever being "fat". Also, if you want to see a 400 lb person running a mile watch Penn and Tellers: Bullshit - Eat This episode. You might learn something as well.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > Oh ... you do realize that dairy has the highest fat content of all foods, especially the natural forms. Cheese IS fat, so is cream.
> ...


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Then I call bullshit on you ever being "fat". Also, if you want to see a 400 lb person running a mile watch Penn and Tellers: Bullshit - Eat This episode. You might learn something as well.



thats fine, and you are within your rights to do that...however here is the difference.

I know what I'm talking about and you are fucking clueless


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

lmao penn and teller

ok, good night on that note


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Then I call bullshit on you ever being "fat". Also, if you want to see a 400 lb person running a mile watch Penn and Tellers: Bullshit - Eat This episode. You might learn something as well.
> ...



Coming from someone who can't explain how their ideas are completely opposite of what the reality is. Odd ... you can't even prove what you say to yourself, but I have personal experiences and people I know in real life, as well as medical science to back it up (non-biased) as well as a couple of entertainers who gathered even more of the proof into a neat and humorous little format ... and you have ... propaganda put out by diet dealers who make billions a year on selling this garbage to fat people by making them feel insecure about themselves. So ... who is it that really has no clue?


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

lol what medical data do you have you fucking dunce

you really want to get into a arguement on what doctors say is better for a healthy diet?

Your drink soda, high sugar, high carb, high fat, high calorie, no exercise theory 

or 

eating right and small portions

You have no data to prove such bull shit...you have penn and teller lol.

It's ok, if you do eat the way you do you keep going.  I don't give a shit...your personal experiences are ...i have a friend who weighs a lot and eats right...well sorry i don't buy it... let me talk to your friend I guarantee I can tell you why she weighs 300 pounds.

Bodies all work generally the same in concept even though everyone is different.

Please show me medical data that says eat whatever the fuck you want and dont exercise because I would love to join that program


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

first of all that penn and teller documentary stuided the so called hollywood "diet" which is water for 48 hours and starve...which is a bullshit and not legit way to diet.


tPenn and Teller take a look into the movement to ban genetically engineered food, even though it may produce more food for the poor and may even make it healthier.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> lol what medical data do you have you fucking dunce
> 
> you really want to get into a arguement on what doctors say is better for a healthy diet?
> 
> ...



I have more data than you, just I also know posting links and the like to morons like you won't do any good because you never read them, in spite of the fact that all my info is from non-biased sources. If being fat is so bad then how did we ever survive the Victorian era? Much less how is it that all the strongest royal families were all fat? 

This just proves how stupid you are: "Bodies all work generally the same in concept even though everyone is different."

As for Penn and Teller, reread what I said about it. Penn and Teller are no less accurate than the news which spouts off about "weight issues" all the time, while using doctors who are actually working for the diet companies (many of them pitching their own "systems") and so far the only thing any of these has done is cause even more severe health concerns. So really ... natural isn't bought in a package, like your "low carb" crap, though it can be packaged as such sometimes (Dryers hand churned, the most natural you can buy, but also very high in fat). The labels that say "healthy" or "low fat" etc. do not even have to be accurate, they just have to come up with some product that is worse than theirs, and there is NO regulation for them. Also, my best friend isn't the only person I know like that, she is the rule not the exception. Again, stop getting your info from sitcoms.


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## LiveUninhibited (Feb 23, 2009)

Amanda said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Amanda said:
> ...



A better thing to take away from this would be that it's not the same struggle for everybody so you shouldn't judge somebody based upon their weight. Not all fat people are doing anything wrong. Not all skinny people are doing anything right. There are some factors within any given person's control and some factors not within their control. Hence some people can do more about their apperance than others even when it comes to weight. The average person certainly can benefit from exercise above all, and eating a nutrient-dense diet. Emotional eating, the tendency to eat whatever is in front of you, and other problems complicate what could be simple. Eat when you're hungry, eat slowly, eat often (always eat breakfast). Doing these things will not guarantee being skinny but they will make it more likely that you will be healthy and more likely that you will be skinny, which incidentally are not the same thing.

People with thyroid problems are an example of people with a special struggle and you can't tell who has it by looking at them usually. Hyperthyroidism is particularly problematic in that it gets you used to a lifestyle where you can eat whatever you want and not gain weight, and then have a real struggle on your hands when your thyroid is burnt out and you have hypothyroidism.




Andrew2382 said:


> don't know why anyone would let themselves get fat...it's so easy to stay in shape



Depends on who you are. I had a friend in high school with 2% bodyfat. He was a bodybuilder but you know what he ate every day? Whoppers from BK. He ate at least a dozen whoppers every day. He never got tired of them for at least a year straight. There were plenty of fat people in high school who did not eat as badly as him, but I also knew nobody who exercised as much as him.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > lol what medical data do you have you fucking dunce
> ...




lmao, you fail on so many levels!

Please post away...please sow me a link to the eat whatever the fuck you want and dont exercise program...cause I am dead serious I want to join!

Victorian Age?  Do you even know what the fuck you blab about?

Throughout the Victorian Age, obesity was associated with lower class status and poverty. Dress designs of their period stressed full breasts and tiny waistlines; for instance, the "Gibson girl" image of the last 19th century America. Women stayed away from food in order to be slim and to create the hourglass shape. In 1864 Ebstein distinguished three types of obesity: stout, comical, and severe (Beumont, 1991). Some poor immigrant mothers during the 1930's who suffered from hunger in their childhood and youth did not see overweight in their children as negative. To them plumpness meant security and success. Slenderness was at its peak during the 1960's with the arrival of "Twiggy" (5'7", 92 pounds). Severe abstinence from food and various forms of weight control were used to achieve a type of malnourished figure which was heralded as the standard of beauty. It was of no surprise that during this time there was both an increase in medical and psychaitric recognition of eating disorders and more women diagnosed as anorexic or bulimic.


"Bodies all work generally the same in concept even though everyone is different."

yes, that makes perfect sense....I wouldn't expect someone with the intelligence of a grapefruit to comprehend it tho.  The  body works the same for everyone, however people react differently to certain things...its not that fucking hard to understand is it?  Want me to write  a book for you....I'll put in some pop up pictures and some coloring areas...you will love it..

Yes, I guess all of the cardiolgists out there and nutrionists and doctors are all working for the evil diet corporations lmao

Really, please link me the

Kittenkodder, eat whatever the fuck you want dont exercise diet

I really would love to join


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

LiveUninhibited said:


> Amanda said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...




yeah he burned all that shit off...those whoppers have a lot of protien thats why he eats it


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## KittenKoder (Feb 23, 2009)

Andrew has such low self esteem he has to find an excuse to drag others down just to feel better. How sad, yet very common.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

still waiting on the

Eat whatever the fuck you want and dont exercise diet...I really want to join

Admit it kitten

you weigh 450 pounds, not a doubt in my mind


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 23, 2009)

I only bring down the stupid...you seem to be falling in that category very quickly


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## Agnapostate (Feb 24, 2009)

Fuck, I never knew fat could inspire all of this.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> I only bring down the stupid...you seem to be falling in that category very quickly



As I have said ... no proof will suffice for morons, I wish I was 450 lbs, then I wouldn't want to stay away from the leering breeders so much. You will ignore all facts just because you like this fantasy world you live in based on movies, sitcoms, and ratings hungry "news".


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

lol you have provided no facts you fucking idiot

Please show me the 

eat whatever the fuck you want and dont exercise diet please


I am still waiting...tell me what doctor says that is the way to go other then doctor kevorkian


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Agnapostate said:


> Fuck, I never knew fat could inspire all of this.



It's fun isn't it. Toying with morons on any subject can be fun, but this one has a lot of idiots fooled into believing hype and sale pitches more than reality, which makes it even more fun to see them regurgitate the propaganda.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

yes, doctors, nutritionists, cardiologists etc... are all fantasy world

keep doing drugs

its working out well for you


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> yes, doctors, nutritionists, cardiologists etc... are all fantasy world
> 
> keep doing drugs
> 
> its working out well for you



You do realize that most doctors get paid for pushing drugs ... of course you have to acknowledge that. Unless you really think that EVERY single problem is real (Restless Leg Syndrome ... really, find another excuse to peddle those drugs). Also, almost all nutritionists I have spoken to (not currently paid to campaign for the diet companies) have said that the cravings you have are your own body telling you that you need something that is contained in the natural food associated with that flavor. It is you who needs to get off drugs ... TV is a drug and it does rot your brain, thanks for proving it.


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## LiveUninhibited (Feb 24, 2009)

To summarize, Andrew thinks that it is "easy" for anybody to lose weight and all fat people should be blamed for their obesity equally? And that is what Kitten is disagreeing with? Or is it the implication that some people can do everything right and still not appear to be at a healthy weight? I don't dispute that everybody should exercise and eat healthy, but I doubt that this is equally easy for everybody.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

LiveUninhibited said:


> To summarize, Andrew thinks that it is "easy" for anybody to lose weight and all fat people should be blamed for their obesity equally? And that is what Kitten is disagreeing with? Or is it the implication that some people can do everything right and still not appear to be at a healthy weight? I don't dispute that everybody should exercise and eat healthy, but I doubt that this is equally easy for everybody.



Perty much ... it seems you catch on quick sometimes. I have a feeling that Andrew is that scumbag Jack Lelane (however you spell the dick heads name).


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

LiveUninhibited said:


> To summarize, Andrew thinks that it is "easy" for anybody to lose weight and all fat people should be blamed for their obesity equally? And that is what Kitten is disagreeing with? Or is it the implication that some people can do everything right and still not appear to be at a healthy weight? I don't dispute that everybody should exercise and eat healthy, but I doubt that this is equally easy for everybody.



actually the arguement is according to Kitten no matter what some people do it is physically impossible for them to get in shapeso its a lost cause

Also according to her the best diet is to eat whatever the fuck you want and never exercise

I think Kitten is a large person pretending to be skinny and making execuses for herself on the boards

Kitty,

Still waiting on one link from you showing me the

Eat all the shit and never exercise stay in shape plan


Please show me


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > yes, doctors, nutritionists, cardiologists etc... are all fantasy world
> ...



lol, cause the doctors I get my info from are from TV?

Perhaps you need to speak to real doctors and not the bums you see off teh street.

You apparently know nothing about the human body...stick with computer programming or whatever it is you do., cause you are failing at this arguement.

Please show me where the nutrinoist or doctor tells you to go to mickey d's eat like a fat fuck and dont exercise


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



*smirks* Now to point out the circle you have talked yourself into by twisting and not really paying attention to most of what I say. McDonalds (and other fast food places) are not real food, we know this, and yet ... here's the kicker .. they are made of the same stuff all the "health" foods you have mentioned are. Funny how that works. I never said eat anything you want, what I did say is that the natural foods which have the tastes your body craves contain the nutrients your body needs at the time of the craving, the unnatural and processed foods sharing this flavor do not. By eating the "healthy" (ie unnatural) foods which share the flavor you are starving part of your body. When your bodies chemistry becomes that out of sync you will lose energy or develop serious health problems regardless of your weight. People have a predetermined weight height ratio, and as you already said, everyone's is different. Thus fat people are most often just the way they are at their healthiest. Do you really think it's natural to crave a Snickers bar? No, however the sweet, chocolatey taste with peanuts are a natural craving, sweet being the fruit, peanuts ... well any nuts will usually do but sometimes it has to be peanuts, and chocolate actually has major health benefits as they have recently published (and I even think the news reported this fact for once). The problem is that the Snickers bar is mostly unnatural and over processed products. So, what to do, buy some chocolate syrup (most of the cheap brands are more natural), strawberries (or some other fruit you like), and peanuts, then chow until you no longer crave it. After that you can pretty much eat anything (which will likely be only a small amount because of already being full). However, you completely took it into your own context simply because your self hatred is still strong in your own mind, so you project it onto fat people. Historically, fat people have actually been the strongest, for many reasons, in cold climates for instance, a skinny person is more likely to get hypothermia, while someone well insulated could probably avoid it for a lot longer (thus why most vikings were pretty heavy and many Europeans of all walks). Fat people are also less likely to be harmed in a fall, though some less likely to be able to right themselves afterward quickly, but that's another issue. There are benefits and risks with both sides of the spectrum, you do know most body builders have VERY weak bones, even the ones that remember to take their calcium suppliments, right? The health issues do not come from being over weight, they come from eating too much unnatural foods, no matter how "healthy" the companies say they are. Oh, but that requires logic to realize ...


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## editec (Feb 24, 2009)

I SUSPECT that some changes in the processed food (proably corn syrup replacing cane sugar) might have something to do with the obesity pandemic AND the recent pandemic of sugar diabetes, too.

One thing I am certain of is that AMERICANS (especially young americans) drink too damned much SODA. 

When I was a kid SODA was a TREAT, not the beverage of choice in most every situation.

When I was kid, sodas came in 7 oz bottles, and soda wasn't cheap relative to other things, either.

Now soda is cheaper than water, it comes in three liter bottles, there are entire aisles in my supermarket DEVOTED to selling nothing but soda and AMERICANS DRINK MORE SODA than they drink _anything else._

_That_ is a significant change in eating behavior of Americans the last generation or two.

And _loe and behold_ you can mark the obseity pandemic ,and you will note that obseity and soda consumption seem to be moving in statistical lockstep over time.

And what IS the sweetener in soda NOW?

It is no longer cane sugar, _it is CORN SUGAR._

I'm not a nutrutionist or a scientist, either, but I cannot help but think that corn sugar soda consumption and the FAT pandemic AND THE SUGAR DIABETES pandemic are _somehow_ related.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

editec said:


> I SUSPECT that some changes in the processed food (proably corn syrup replacing cane sugar) might have something to do with the obesity pandemic AND the recent pandemic of sugar diabetes, too.
> 
> One thing I am certain of is that AMERICANS (especially young americans) drink too damned much SODA.
> 
> ...



The increases usage of corn syrup in our foods has certainly been one of the major factors in the increase of diabetes, as for being fat a pandemic ... that's the point that's wrong. Look back at the historical evidence, the reality is that the number of fat people has not changed when compared as a percentage, it's just that there are more people over all so they can claim almost anything has increased to "dangerous" levels. What they did though was the major health diet companies found a cheap way to make food, one that doesn't use the more expensive natural products, but they couldn't market it well because let's face it, who wants to eat something that is unnatural. So they found a loophole in the FDA regulations, labeling it as a dietary suppliment. To market this they have to get people now afraid to eat the real food, by calling natural foods like meat and veggies dangerous, to back it up they use the increased population as a basis to call the number of fat people an epidemic. This created a huge marketing base, and allowed them to set their own prices for the products. The people became self conscious because Hollywood made us twig thin people look like the "pretty people", and thus the market for diet fads exploded. They are all diet fads, and the really funny thing is that almost all the products that claim to be healthy are made with tons of ... corn syrup. They however do not have to show all their ingredients in the labels, the dietary suppliment catagory for the FDA doesn't even have to be safe, just like herbal remedies and other fringe products. The reason for this loophole though is not the fault of law makers, the categories just didn't exist when the FDA was founded, but now the health food companies are spending money to keep it that way, so the FDA just looks the other way since there are no laws to hold them accountable.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Oh ... and you are right, the junk food is cheaper than real food ... unless it has the "health" label.


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## editec (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> > I SUSPECT that some changes in the processed food (proably corn syrup replacing cane sugar) might have something to do with the obesity pandemic AND the recent pandemic of sugar diabetes, too.
> ...


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## Valerie (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> *Some people who are fat REALLY can't help it. * But, they don't represent that vast majority of people who are fat.
> 
> I think it is also important to recognize that Americans (and perhaps, the rest of the world) have very fucked up body image issues.
> 
> ...



I agree with you.  Too much focus on "thin" isn't healthy either.  

I was fortunate enough to be born with a good metabolism, but I know fat people who have literally battled their weight all their life and they're still fat.  Metabolism is a huge factor for many fat people.  Not all fat people are lazy and a couple of them are my dearest friends, so I don't like when people are cruel to others because of their size.  Fat people are people too!


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## Zoom-boing (Feb 24, 2009)

The best way to shop is to shop the perimeter of the grocery store.  Fruits, veggies, proteins, dairy, eggs, whole grains.  Keep the aisles to a minimum.  Eat a balanced diet 75% of the time; treat yourself the other 25%.  Exercise, both cardio and strength; they offer different benefits.  If you're trying to lose weight, eat a balanced diet 85-90% of the time; treat yourself the other 15-10%.  Exercise, both cardio and strength.  In order to maximize your efforts, you can zig-zag your calories every day, instead of eating a set amount of cals everyday.  For example, eating 1500 one day, 1350 the next day, 1800 the following day, etc.  This keeps your body guessing.  Same goes for exercise.  If you run 5 times a week, initially your body will burn a greater number of cals.  But the body is a very efficient little bugger and soon you will have to put forth greater and greater effort to achieve the same results.  Interval sessions help to keep your body guessing with this too.  Running (or walking) at a moderate/slower pace for 2 minutes, increasing to an extremely high pace for 30 seconds, then returning to that moderate/slow pace for a 1 minute recovery.  Lather, rinse, repeat for 8 rounds or so.  20 minutes you're done and have blasted your fat burning rates up there for quite a while. (check out videos on this from craig ballantyne on youtube).   Strength workouts are a must; gotta keep those bones and muscles in tip top shape to stave off bone problems down the road as much as possible.  Besides, muscles are sexy. 

ETA:  Soda is the worst possible thing you can put into your body, imo.  Utter and total shit.  Need some flavorful fizz?  Try club soda with a little fruit juice added or lemon/lime.


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## catzmeow (Feb 24, 2009)

Valerie said:


> I agree with you.  Too much focus on "thin" isn't healthy either.
> 
> I was fortunate enough to be born with a good metabolism, but I know fat people who have literally battled their weight all their life and they're still fat.  Metabolism is a huge factor for many fat people.  Not all fat people are lazy and a couple of them are my dearest friends, so I don't like when people are cruel to others because of their size.  Fat people are people too!



I work with a girl who is probably in better physical condition than I am, she does aerobics 5 times a week (I run 4 days a week, but I think she does aerobics for like an HOUR.  Jeez.)

And guess what?  She's fat.  She's at least 60 pounds overweight.

I think she is probably doing everything she CAN to lose weight, and still can't seem to do it.  I suspect a hormone imbalance because she also has facial hair.

Can you imagine being in that situation?  I mean, seriously?  I have so much empathy for her.  Think about trying to date...and how it would affect your self-confidence?

I can't even imagine.  Even in my heaviest days, I was never more than 20 or 30 pounds overweight.  And, even then, I was under a size 12.

People who toss these words around offend me because I know how hurtful they can be to people who are really in these situations.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> Valerie said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you.  Too much focus on "thin" isn't healthy either.
> ...



Actually, the facial hair does betray a hormonal imbalance, but I doubt being fat is linked to it, at least not enough to make a huge difference. What you eat can cause hormone imbalances if you don't eat enough of the vitamins and minerals your specific body needs. Oh, and never bother with the vitamin pills, two reasons. The first is that your body doesn't get what it should from them, and the second is they are not balanced to your specific body. Tell your friend to look at exactly what she is craving, and find the natural version of that taste instead of ignoring it. If, for instance, she is craving cheesecake, try some sort of cheese and fruit combination. Cakes ... well ... whole wheat toast with honey comes to mind. The easiest way to figure it out, go shopping when hungry, but avoid ALL processed foods, especially the ones labeled "healthy" or "diet". Eventually their body will balance out, the hormones will become more what they are suppose to be for her (do not take hormone replacement, even if monitored by a doctor they are dangerous and will increase the health issues with little benefit). If she has "pudginess" then balancing the hormones will get rid of that, and she will look a healthy regardless of hew size. Another indicator for an unhealthy diet is the need for lotions on the skin. The body uses many of the oils we consume for lubrication, to keep our skin healthy, if you get enough of the natural oils (olive is one of the best) your skin will be soft and glow quite nicely without the use of lotions or other artificial chemicals.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

editec said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > editec said:
> ...


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

first of all kitten...for being a computer geek, you should know where the fucking enter button is.
If you are going to try an type a novel and seem intelligent then paragraphs would be greatly appreciated




KittenKoder said:


> *smirks* Now to point out the circle you have talked yourself into by twisting and not really paying attention to most of what I say. McDonalds (and other fast food places) are not real food, we know this, and yet ... here's the kicker .. they are made of the same stuff all the "health" foods you have mentioned are. Funny how that works. I never said eat anything you want, what I did say is that the natural foods which have the tastes your body craves contain the nutrients your body needs at the time of the craving, the unnatural and processed foods sharing this flavor do not. By eating the "healthy" (ie unnatural) foods which share the flavor you are starving part of your body. When your bodies chemistry becomes that out of sync you will lose energy or develop serious health problems regardless of your weight.



You are just dumb.  Healthy foods are not made up of the same stuff mcdonalds is you idiot.  Grilled chicken?  Tuna? Turkey?  Egg Whites?  Sorry to break it to ya champ but these are the main things that healthy people eat.  YOu are just showing everyone how fucking clueless you are.  When you eat CORRECTLY, you have more energy when you eat like shit you have less.  I mean i always see the 400 pounders doing jumping jacks cause they are bursting with energy.



> People have a predetermined weight height ratio, and as you already said, everyone's is different. Thus fat people are most often just the way they are at their healthiest. Do you really think it's natural to crave a Snickers bar? No, however the sweet, chocolatey taste with peanuts are a natural craving, sweet being the fruit, peanuts ... well any nuts will usually do but sometimes it has to be peanuts, and chocolate actually has major health benefits as they have recently published (and I even think the news reported this fact for once). The problem is that the Snickers bar is mostly unnatural and over processed products. So, what to do, buy some chocolate syrup (most of the cheap brands are more natural), strawberries (or some other fruit you like), and peanuts, then chow until you no longer crave it. After that you can pretty much eat anything (which will likely be only a small amount because of already being full).



you are wrong....the craving arguement is fucking flawed, just like your lifestyle.

If you are craving nuts, thats fine....Almonds aren't bad for you...the snickers fucking is!  

Yes buy choclate syrup, the cheap kind.

HERSHEY'S Syrup - HERSHEY'S

Serving Size  2 tbsp. (39 g)  
Amount Per Serving %DV *    
Total Calories 100 
  Calories from Fat  
Sodium 15 mg 1%    
Total Carbohydrate 24 g 8%    
  Dietary Fiber 1 g 4%    
  Sugars 20 g   
Protein less than 1 g 1%    

Umm 2 table spoons has 24 carbs and 20 grams of sugar with almost no protien an dno fiber.  Yes douse on that chocolate syrup!!!!  I really hope no one on this board takes you seriously because you give advise for the worst shit in the world.


Did you really say that fat people are healthy just the way they are because of their weight height ratio?   Are you realy this fucking dense or are you making a special effort today?  Guess what....weight to height ratio isn't a fixed fucking number.  Go to any doctor and ask them if someone 5'3 should weigh 245 pounds...


Yes, I know all about the MINOR benefits that chocolate gives...that is of course pure chocolate, so unless you are growing cocoa beans in your yard you are shit out of luck!

Is Chocolate a Health Food? | Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients | Find Articles at BNET

Positives

Chocolate is quite nutritious. Not only is it a good source of folic acid, [3] copper, [4] and magnesium, [5] but it is rich in antioxidant polyphenols, [6] including flavonoids. [7] The polyphenol content alone in a single 40 gram candy bar of dark chocolate is equivalent to 2 days' worth of fruits and vegetables. [8] In fact, cocoa powder is believed to surpass both green tea and garlic as a protective antioxidant food. [9]

Monomers of the flavonoid catechin in commercial dark chocolate are 4 times higher than those in black tea, and epidemiological studies suggest that tea, presumably because of these monomers, may have a protective effect against cardiovascular diseases, and possibly cancer. 7 This comparison is even more striking when the catechin oligomers are included, as they are abundant in chocolate, but are present in only minor amounts in tea. [10] These substances resemble the oligomeric proanthocyanidins found in Pycnogenol[R], a commercial antioxidant extract which has been studied extensively for its beneficial health effects. [11]

Chocolate's flavonoids are generally more powerful than vitamins in limiting the oxidation of cholesterol circulating in low-density, and very-low-density lipoproteins (LDL & VLDL cholesterol), [9] a process which has been found to be fundamental to the development of atherosclerosis. Indeed, when volunteers consumed cocoa in which the fat had been removed, the time it took for LDL to oxidize (lag time) was prolonged. [12] There is also evidence that cocoa has an aspirin-like effect on blood clotting. [13]

*It has very nice positives...however there are hudnreds of other foods that do the same shit or better and don't have the following negatives to it!
*

Negatives

*Chocolate is high in fat, the majority of which is saturated*, and cocoa butter has been shown to *raise serum cholesterol *concentrations. [14] Thirty percent of the fatty acids in chocolate consist of *stearic acid*, a long-chain saturated fatty acid. A study of 80,000 women found that stearic acid *increased the risk of coronary heart disease *(CHD) more than the other three long-chain saturates (lauric, myristic and palmitic acids). [15] The data also suggested, however, that moderate chocolate consumption is unlikely to have major adverse or beneficial effects on CHD risk. [16]

Rich in oxalates, chocolate may contribute to the development of kidney stones. [17] Its high content of methylxanthines (theobromine and caffeine) may foster the development of benign breast disease [18] and migraine headaches. [19] Chocolate ingestion relaxes the lower esophageal sphincter, [20] which may cause heartburn.

In addition, there have been numerous reports of hypersensitivity reactions to chocolate, resulting in headache, eczema, bronchial asthma and other illnesses. [21] However, some of these reactions can be attributed to its additives, such as soya lecithin, vanillin, and lactose.


Now am I saying to NEVER eat chocolate...not at all. I will have some rarely from time to time, its delicious.  Though I am more of a vanilla man myself.



> However, you completely took it into your own context simply because your self hatred is still strong in your own mind, so you project it onto fat people.



i am just trying to get to everyone else ont he board that everything you are spewing here is bullshit.  Like I said, I used to be large and I lost weight in my early teens.  I never hated skinny people fo rbeing in shape...you just sound like a fat person who hates the world and everyone in shape because they do something about it and you have no determination or will power to get there.




> Historically, fat people have actually been the strongest, for many reasons, in cold climates for instance, a skinny person is more likely to get hypothermia, while someone well insulated could probably avoid it for a lot longer (thus why most vikings were pretty heavy and many Europeans of all walks). Fat people are also less likely to be harmed in a fall, though some less likely to be able to right themselves afterward quickly, but that's another issue.



Yeah and also fat people were the first to be gutted and eaten by tribes because they supplied the most meat...wahts your fucking point.  The fat caveman was also the first to be eaten by the sabertooth tiger cause he couldn't run away fast enough.  Also, not all vikings were obese genius...Leif Erikson  was far from a fat guy.





> There are benefits and risks with both sides of the spectrum, you do know most body builders have VERY weak bones, even the ones that remember to take their calcium suppliments, right? The health issues do not come from being over weight, they come from eating too much unnatural foods, no matter how "healthy" the companies say they are. Oh, but that requires logic to realize ...



And like I said before, I am not talking about being a fucking body builder! Get the ring ding out of your mouth and try to soak that thought in for a second.  You have provided no medical data to prove your claims, no sources...nothing!

Your logic fails and as I said before I hope to God no one on this board takes any of the lunacy you say seriously because you are prescribing bad nutrition.

Yes, Health issures do not come from being over weight??????? LMAO  That is the most ridiuclous statement I have ever heard.....Keep typing really, I am enjoying all the messages from people telling me whata  fucking loon you are on this thread


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## editec (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> catzmeow said:
> 
> 
> > Valerie said:
> ...


 
Excellent advise.

Generally speaking just stay away from PROCESSED FOODS.

Not only will that cost you less at the grocery store, but the nutritional value of those foods is much lower than starting from scratch.

Add to that fact that if you are cooking for somebody else, you are doing something that psychologically benefits both YOU and them, too.

I stand in lines at the grocery store and note that manyt people's purchases are  MOSTLY packaged, pre-prepared and much more expensive than the food I buy.

And I cannot help but notice that they and their kids are quite often very fat, too.

Now I realize that it's impossible to entirely eliminate canned foods and some processed foods, too.

But cutting back on those foods IS going to help A LOT.

Those are the foods that are laden with corn syrup, salt and chemicals, folks.

They are convenient, but they are not really THAT convenient.

Take a half hour out of you life to prepare you own food, and not only will that give you better food, but it will also SLOW YOU DOWN somewhat.

It reminds you, when you're cooking for yourself, that YOU COUNT enough that you are cooking real food for YOURSELF and the people you love.

Oh, another thing...learn to prepare food such that you have leftovers, and then EAT them.

Saves a small fortune if you do.

I'm feeding four people, three of them young men, and believe me, if I fed them pre prepared foods?

My shopping bill would be more than twice as high as it is now...probably more since that food doesn't stick with you like REAL FOOD.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

also, I'm prettyy sure the reason obesity has gone up in the past 20 years is the rising increase of fast food chains all over and parents taking their children to east there 4 times a week.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Oh, and to answer the question of why I know so much about dietary needs:

I am thin, have been my whole life, rail thin, twig thin, so thin that people thought I had an eating disorder (doctors always prod me because they doubt I eat like I do) and never could gain weight. Why would one want to gain weight? Disease. One of the common symptoms of very deadly diseases (cancer, AIDs, etc) is being too thin. Also, people like me are prone to illness because of being too thin (funny that only emergency room medics will tell you that, when you get sick). The result of being too thin is that when you are sick sleep is the best medicine, while sleeping your body will repair itself faster, however, this requires a LOT of fat to burn for energy and use to replace any damaged cells from illness or infection. If you have no fat stored you have to be constantly feed nutrients when fighting off major infections. So, after a few of these I tried to gain weight, in the hopes that I wouldn't have to suffer anymore and just "sleep it off". See, the infection I get is VERY common, but because of lacking the fat stores it often spreads too much thus requiring hospital care. I consulted a lot of nutritionists ... and every single one of them said I should be healthier than most people, and even ignored my medical records completely, even where the REAL doctors said I needed to gain some weight. So, after finding no answers there, I went deeper, talking to doctors and nurses about what the body needs and trying to figure out how best to maintain a truly healthy weight ... the end result: Listen ... listen to what your body needs. Don't give into the fads, the hype, or the fears. Your body tells you EXACTLY what you need and when you need it, the only problem is that most people have lost the ability to understand it. As I stated before, the flavor tells you what you need from the natural food selection, but because we have those flavors in so many of our artificial foods now, we eat the wrong things. Now I am a healthy 120-130, depending on how lazy I get in shopping. That's up from the 100 I weighed when eating only junk food and fast food.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew ... Hershey's isn't even real chocolate syrup, the label even says chocolate "flavored" syrup. Also, those are not the ingredients, those are the nutrients. People NEED carbs for energy, that's what the body uses them for. They need sugar to help keep the adrenal gland balanced, just not too much. They need fat for ... well a LOT of things. They need proteins for ... a lot of things to. Basically all you have shown is that someone decided they didn't like the stuff so they tried to make it look bad, in the wrong way. Chocolate syrup, the natural stuff, is sugar and cocoa, nothing else, and yes it is very healthy if consumed when your body needs it. Cocoa has many health benefits, I just can't remember them all, and Hershey's contains very little of it. Look at the ingredients, not the nutrients. Oh, and if Hershey's is the cheapest where you are there is something wrong in that store. I believe Western Family makes a truly natural chocolate syrup, though I haven't bought any in a long time so I don't know if they still do. Ingredients: Water, Sugar, Cocoa, nothing else. That's what chocolate syrup really is. Of course a genius like you knows that, right?


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## catzmeow (Feb 24, 2009)

editec said:


> Generally speaking just stay away from PROCESSED FOODS.
> 
> Not only will that cost you less at the grocery store, but the nutritional value of those foods is much lower than starting from scratch.
> 
> ...



It really shocks me how parents don't cook anymore.  My kids go to other kids' houses, and "dinner" is a frozen pizza.  WTF?  I'm not saying we NEVER eat that, because maybe once every couple of weeks we might eat a frozen pizza, but EVERY NIGHT?  Good lord.  

Last night, we had tilapia with roasted corn (I added red pepper and carmelized onion to the recipe), and stir fried vegetables (pea pods, carrots, red pepper, onion and mushrooms).  The night before that, we had lowfat enchilada casserole (with black beans, corn, corn tortillas, beef, light cheese, and diced tomatoes) and a green salad.

I really hate processed foods, and I like to know what my kids are putting into their bodies.

I've often thought that if we were to reform the welfare system, one component that should be added is teaching low income families how to cook healthy, nutritious meals from SCRATCH.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

editec said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > catzmeow said:
> ...



Actually, canned soups are quite healthy if your body is craving salt, they contain sodium as their primary preservative in most cases (but not all, again, read the ingredients). Simple rule of thumb I learned when I was young, if you can't say it out lowed without stumbling on the word, don't eat it. If you can then you probably already know what it is and should be able to make a smarter choice. Back when I was growing up it was a motto one company adapted, now it's being revived by Campbell's I think. Also, if you buy veggies or meat, the farmers markets if you can. Super markets have to by law use preservatives, for veggies it's almost always wax but sometimes they do spray with other chemicals. Meats ... well you're lucky if all they use is salt these days. But farmers markets are not held to such skewed standards, and they don't usually cost more. In Seattle the Pike Market is about the same price as Safeway, except meat is cheaper (I love liver ... with onions, fried with margarine ... damn I am getting hungry again).


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> > Generally speaking just stay away from PROCESSED FOODS.
> ...



As great as that would be, they would have to give them twice as many stamps. Fresh ingredients are more expensive now than junk food, in many areas (the further from the source the more expensive it is). Since junk food doesn't go bad as easily the cost isn't effected by distance shipped as much as fresh food is. Since most who rely on food stamps are deeper in the city and further from the farms, they generally have to pay more for the fresh stuff. Farmers markets (the only way to really get a good price) rarely take food stamps now that they are on cards.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew ... Hershey's isn't even real chocolate syrup, the label even says chocolate "flavored" syrup. Also, those are not the ingredients, those are the nutrients. People NEED carbs for energy, that's what the body uses them for. They need sugar to help keep the adrenal gland balanced, just not too much. They need fat for ... well a LOT of things. They need proteins for ... a lot of things to. Basically all you have shown is that someone decided they didn't like the stuff so they tried to make it look bad, in the wrong way. Chocolate syrup, the natural stuff, is sugar and cocoa, nothing else, and yes it is very healthy if consumed when your body needs it. Cocoa has many health benefits, I just can't remember them all, and Hershey's contains very little of it. Look at the ingredients, not the nutrients. Oh, and if Hershey's is the cheapest where you are there is something wrong in that store. I believe Western Family makes a truly natural chocolate syrup, though I haven't bought any in a long time so I don't know if they still do. Ingredients: Water, Sugar, Cocoa, nothing else. That's what chocolate syrup really is. Of course a genius like you knows that, right?




/facepalm

Yes, I know what carbs and protiens and sugars are for you nitwit....hwoever when you intake 30% of your daily carbs in 2 tablespoons of syrup that is a problem.

Also just looking at the ingredients not at the nutritional info is also idiotic.  Some people care about how many carbs and sugars and protiens they are taking in.  

Raw Certified Organic Chocolate Syrup » Wilderness Family

Total Fat
 0g (1%)

Saturated Fat
 <1g (1%)

Cholesterol
 0mg (0%)

Sodium
 3mg (0%)

Total Carbohydrate
 29g (10%)

Dietary Fiber
 1g (4%)

Sugars
 27g

Protein
 1g (2%

umm in 1 tablespoon you get all that...so when you douse it all over your oancakes or icecream and take in 120 carbs and 130 sugars in one meal....THATS A BAD THING!

Just showing everyone how fucking clueless you are once again...


Also, I know you can't remember the positives and negatives to chocolate, don't worry I know that you wouldn't know that so I provided that info for you...the negatives far outweight the bad if you eat the shit every day


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew ... Hershey's isn't even real chocolate syrup, the label even says chocolate "flavored" syrup. Also, those are not the ingredients, those are the nutrients. People NEED carbs for energy, that's what the body uses them for. They need sugar to help keep the adrenal gland balanced, just not too much. They need fat for ... well a LOT of things. They need proteins for ... a lot of things to. Basically all you have shown is that someone decided they didn't like the stuff so they tried to make it look bad, in the wrong way. Chocolate syrup, the natural stuff, is sugar and cocoa, nothing else, and yes it is very healthy if consumed when your body needs it. Cocoa has many health benefits, I just can't remember them all, and Hershey's contains very little of it. Look at the ingredients, not the nutrients. Oh, and if Hershey's is the cheapest where you are there is something wrong in that store. I believe Western Family makes a truly natural chocolate syrup, though I haven't bought any in a long time so I don't know if they still do. Ingredients: Water, Sugar, Cocoa, nothing else. That's what chocolate syrup really is. Of course a genius like you knows that, right?
> ...



Of course you missed the biggest point .. it's not chocolate syrup, it's chocolate "flavored" syrup. Look, the amount of cocoa (the important part of real and natural chocolate) is so small they don't even list it, if there is even any in it at all now. Also, again (repeating oneself is so annoying) oh clueless one, Hershey's in most stores is NOT the cheapest, in my local grocer it's 5 bucks for a SMALL bottle, while the real chocolate syrup (comes in a can) costs a whopping 3 bucks for twice as much. The real stuff contains only three ingredients ... remember what I said they were? As for the benefits, real cocoa is actually healthy for the heart and blood, again (and again ...) the REAL chocolate syrup has benefits, so when craving it you should eat it, but instead you would eat the Hershey's crap? You just ignored almost everything I posted for your own ignorant garbage. But oh well, such is the folly of people like you who talk themselves into corners.

Oh, I forgot to address what I was going to ... oh well. Anyhoo, what you posted here isn't chocolate syrup either, just because it tastes like chocolate doesn't mean it is. It's the easiest flavor to create artificially.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

you spew such utter fucking nonsense.

moron, almost every syrup will ahve some sort of preservative in it it...or else it would fucking SPOIL!.  HOWEVER THE ONE I LINKED YOU IS JUST THAT NATURAL YOU FUCKING DUNCE.

"Ingredient #1:
Agave syrup is a delicious natural sweetener, milder than honey, made from the blue agave plant, a cactus that grows in the desert.

Ingredient #2:
In addition to raw agave, this delicious raw chocolate syrup also contains raw cacao powder. Raw cacao powder comes from the bean that would eventually become chocolate. Unlike chocolate, however, these beans are never heated and they still retain most of their natural antioxidants. While the ORAC score on fresh blueberries is around 32 (per gram), this natural raw chocolate syrup boasts of a ORAC score of 245 &#956;molTE/g, proving it is loaded with natural antioxidants!

No other ingredients:
Since there is no water added to this product, it is shelf stable without the addition of preservatives. There is no need for gums, artificial flavors or any other additives. That is it; there are no other ingredients. Yet this completely natural syrup is shelf stable and does not require any refrigeration!
"

try reading next time



 also if you just mix those 3 ingriedients together...you have a lot of fat, carba and sugar in just 1 or 2 tablespoons if fucking syrup.....you are fucing dense...

also you don't need to go try sound all smart what the benefits of chocolate is since I already listed it in a post prior to this one....difference is I listed the negatives also.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> you spew such utter fucking nonsense.
> 
> moron, every natural syrup will have some sort of preservative in it...or else it would fucking SPOIL!, also if you just mix those 3 ingriedients together...you have a lot of fat, carba and sugar in just 1 or 2 tablespoons if fucking syrup.....you are fucing dense...
> 
> also you don't need to go try sound all smart what the benefits of chocolate is since I already listed it in a post prior to this one....difference is I listed the negatives also.



Um .. you do realize that sugar is a natural preservative, as is sodium of course. Also again, you focus on something that real biology states we MUST have in our diet, and ones that our bodies happen to burn off rather quickly. Cane sugar also has more carbohydrates in it, but has been PROVEN healthier than corn syrup, which has less carbohydrates than cane sugar. Cocoa itself has almost none, and almost no fat, until it's processed to spread it out more. It's expensive when pure. What you listed is your falling for hype, nothing more. There is no real science involved in it. Biology states that the "health industry" is full of shit, but you of course like to ignore the real science and instead latch onto something that will justify your own self pity.


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## editec (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> > As great as that would be, they would have to give them twice as many stamps. Fresh ingredients are more expensive now than junk food, in many areas (the further from the source the more expensive it is).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

lol what real science you idiot...you haven't provided one fucking source or pieceof data to back up any of the shit you spew out of your twinkie filled mouth.

Still waiting on that diet of eat shit and dont exercise plan


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## editec (Feb 24, 2009)

I just bought a bottle of Hersheys chocolate FLAORED syrup last night.

I don't know when they made that change from REAL CHOCOLATE to choclate flavored, but it is apparent to me 

1. It's not as good

2. It's thinnner than real chocolate

3. It's not cheaper than the syrup used to be,

It's criminal what is happening to our food supplies, folks.


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## Againsheila (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



I wouldn't say diet coke is good for you, but how is it bad for you?  I doesn't have many calories and calories is what makes you fat.  Please explain how diet coke makes people fat?  My husband drinks diet coke all the time and he's not fat.  

BTW, I don't drink soda very often at all, mostly when I do, it's diet, but I'm a green tea and water person and for the most part and I have a weight problem.  I've lost 12 pounds in the last year and I consider that a win.


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## Againsheila (Feb 24, 2009)

editec said:


> I just bought a bottle of Hersheys chocolate FLAORED syrup last night.
> 
> I don't know when they made that change from REAL CHOCOLATE to choclate flavored, but it is apparent to me
> 
> ...



amen to that!


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## Said1 (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> lol what real science you idiot...you haven't provided one fucking source or pieceof data to back up any of the shit you spew out of your twinkie filled mouth.
> 
> Still waiting on that diet of eat shit and dont exercise plan



My ex-husband has a food 'absorption problem' and celiacs disease that is presently in remission. He eats crap, ALL the time and is very thing. Some of it is his body type (tall, lanky) and the rest of it is due to 'the more I eat, the more I shit'. And no, he isn't big on exercise, although he's quite muscular for some odd reason. If I ate the way he did, I'd weight a ton. Some people are lucky - can eat what they want, minimal exercise while remaining thin, with no  underlying health issues. I think it catches up with them eventually, sooner or later.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

editec said:


> I just bought a bottle of Hersheys chocolate FLAORED syrup last night.
> 
> I don't know when they made that change from REAL CHOCOLATE to choclate flavored, but it is apparent to me
> 
> ...



I agree. Worse they are using this fat scare to make even more changes just like it. Pretty soon there will be no real nutrients left in food if this keeps up, and we will all become sicker and need to buy the REALLY expensive meds they peddle, not to mention the high cost of having your body chemistry tested in order to determine what over priced suppliment pills you will be forced to take. The diet industry is one huge scam, and people buy into it, that's the sad part. Farmer market prices depend on the product and area, sometimes it's cheaper, sometimes more expensive. In Seattle it's about the same as grocery stores (Pike Market being the best if you avoid all the tourist shops). In the Pike Market there is a meat store tucked in the back, talk about good quality at a very reasonable cost. Better than anything even the fancy stores have and no more than Safeway or Albertson's. It's hard to find, but those tend to be the best shops anywhere, if they stay in business. Thinking of heading up there today myself, only a few blocks but it's raining so bus time. The one thing people need to pay attention to, which many products no longer print on the label now (stupid new laws don't make them) is the ingredients, not the nutritional facts. The nutritional facts are for the average physiology of what they consider a healthy person to be, but in reality most of us don't fit what they say is average. Many factors can change what a person needs in their diet. Race (not just skin color but bloodline race), climate, season, environment, and activity level. The complete test to determine what nutrient intake is healthy for one person is expensive and time consuming, and has to be done every couple of months to be accurate. Thus is why listening to your cravings is so important. It's how all living things survived, and how our species has been able to be so strong above the others, the ability to fulfill those cravings regardless of what they changed to because of food preservation and farming.


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## Said1 (Feb 24, 2009)

Againsheila said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...



It's the caffeine and sodium that can cause bloating. I'm sure you need to drink quite a bit of it to see serious changes in size and appearance.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Againsheila said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...



The funny thing is they did away with that myth a looong time ago. But instead of telling the truth they replaced it, first it was fat content, then cholesterol content, now carbs. Yes, they at one time said cholesterol was the reason people got fat off food ... 

Truth is, it's not the food that makes you fat. They just tell you that so they can get you to buy their product. Anyone who thinks doctors can't be bought by companies ... look back on what drugs they have peddled for what ailment and how each ailment tends to go through "cycles" of being more common one year then less the next. Doctors don't just make money on their patients, they make more money by gambling with our lives. Also, most doctors don't want you to be healthy, if you were they wouldn't be able to charge as much.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

Againsheila said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...




grats on your weight loss!

I am kinda big into nutrition so if you want send me a PM if you have any questions

Reason diet soda is bad is because of Aspartame.  Its a terrible ingredient in the soda

It is linked to cancer and heart disease.

Studies also show that people who drink diet soda have a higher chance for high cholestoral an dobesity and other major health problems including diabtes


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Againsheila said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...





please tell us genius..if calories intake isnt the main reason for weight gain then what is.

I think I am going to love your nonsense answer


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Againsheila said:
> ...



Um .. we already addressed this, using biological sciences for the answer ... of course you just denied it anyway because you would rather live by media induced ignorance instead of utilizing real science.


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## jillian (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> grats on your weight loss!
> 
> I am kinda big into nutrition so if you want send me a PM if you have any questions
> 
> ...



I've been hearing that, too. I used to drink at least 1 can of diet soda a day, (actually, when I was in law school and not eating, I probably drank 6 cans of diet soda and 13 cups of coffee a day.. but that's another story). Anyway, I have maybe a can or two of diet soda a week now... no weight gain or loss.

But they say that for some reason, the artificial sweetner tricks your body into thinking it's had sugar so your body responds with the same types of cravings it would have if you drank sugar soda... increased appetite, desire for more sugar to maintain the increased glucose in your body. 

Personally, I never saw that... I guess I just find it strange that they would find a link between gaining weight and diet soda.

And I think sweet n low (good old fashioned saccharine) is better for you than aspertame.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

jillian said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > grats on your weight loss!
> ...



It's another myth, though oddly another of the few that when they found it was false they aired it on TV ... damn I watch too much TV sometimes. All my friends and I had a good laugh when they first made the cancer claim, even though we hated the taste of it still ... they said Microwave ovens caused cancer, proven wrong ... before that it was TVs, again proven wrong ... lately it's been cell phones, still no real link and will soon be proven wrong. They have to have something to make people afraid of, keeps you going to the doctor.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...





o thats right...I have been overwhelmed with all the medical data ytou have thrown at me I must have forgotten


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...



What more data do you need than the simple fact that geneticists and biologists have shown that humans are not suppose to be thin, and that no matter what you do, you will always be near your normal and natural weight and height. There is no changing it, your body may change on it's own but that's just nature. It's because of this trait that humans have survived, and if we continue to try to work against it we will just become another failed evolutionary step.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> > Andrew2382 said:
> ...




Aspartame: What You Don't Know Can Hurt You

Aspartame: What You Don't Know Can Hurt You 

According to researchers and physicians studying the adverse effects of aspartame, the following chronic illnesses can be triggered or worsened by ingesting of aspartame2) Brain tumors, multiple sclerosis, epilepsy, chronic fatigue syndrome, parkinson's disease, alzheimer's, mental retardation, lymphoma, birth defects, fibromyalgia, and diabetes.

Aspartame is made up of three chemicals: aspartic acid, phenylalanine, and methanol. The book "Prescription for Nutritional Healing," by James and Phyllis Balch, lists aspartame under the category of "chemical poison." As you shall see, that is exactly what it is.

What Is Aspartame Made Of?

Aspartic Acid (40 percent of aspartame) 

Dr. Russell L. Blaylock, a professor of neurosurgery at the Medical University of Mississippi, recently published a book thoroughly detailing the damage that is caused by the ingestion of excessive aspartic acid from aspartame. Blaylock makes use of almost 500 scientific references to show how excess free excitatory amino acids such as aspartic acid and glutamic acid (about 99 percent of monosodium glutamate (MSG) is glutamic acid) in our food supply are causing serious chronic neurological disorders and a myriad of other acute symptoms.(3) 


How Aspartate (and Glutamate) Cause Damage 

Aspartate and glutamate act as neurotransmitters in the brain by facilitating the transmission of information from neuron to neuron. Too much aspartate or glutamate in the brain kills certain neurons by allowing the influx of too much calcium into the cells. This influx triggers excessive amounts of free radicals, which kill the cells. The neural cell damage that can be caused by excessive aspartate and glutamate is why they are referred to as "excitotoxins." They "excite" or stimulate the neural cells to death.

Aspartic acid is an amino acid. Taken in its free form (unbound to proteins) it significantly raises the blood plasma level of aspartate and glutamate. The excess aspartate and glutamate in the blood plasma shortly after ingesting aspartame or products with free glutamic acid (glutamate precursor) leads to a high level of those neurotransmitters in certain areas of the brain.

The blood brain barrier (BBB), which normally protects the brain from excess glutamate and aspartate as well as toxins, 1) is not fully developed during childhood, 2) does not fully protect all areas of the brain, 3) is damaged by numerous chronic and acute conditions, and 4) allows seepage of excess glutamate and aspartate into the brain even when intact.

The excess glutamate and aspartate slowly begin to destroy neurons. The large majority (75 percent or more) of neural cells in a particular area of the brain are killed before any clinical symptoms of a chronic illness are noticed. A few of the many chronic illnesses that have been shown to be contributed to by long-term exposure to excitatory amino acid damage include:

Multiple sclerosis (MS) 
ALS 
Memory loss 
Hormonal problems 
Hearing loss 
Epilepsy 
Alzheimer's disease 
Parkinson's disease 
Hypoglycemia 
AIDS 
Dementia 
Brain lesions 
Neuroendocrine disorders 
The risk to infants, children, pregnant women, the elderly and persons with certain chronic health problems from excitotoxins are great. Even the Federation of American Societies for Experimental Biology (FASEB), which usually understates problems and mimics the FDA party-line, recently stated in a review that:

"It is prudent to avoid the use of dietary supplements of L-glutamic acid by pregnant women, infants, and children. The existence of evidence of potential endocrine responses, i.e., elevated cortisol and prolactin, and differential responses between males and females, would also suggest a neuroendocrine link and that supplemental L-glutamic acid should be avoided by women of childbearing age and individuals with affective disorders."(4)

Aspartic acid from aspartame has the same deleterious effects on the body as glutamic acid.

The exact mechanism of acute reactions to excess free glutamate and aspartate is currently being debated. As reported to the FDA, those reactions include5)

Headaches/migraines 
Nausea 
Abdominal pains 
Fatigue (blocks sufficient glucose entry into brain) 
Sleep problems 
Vision problems 
Anxiety attacks 
Depression 
Asthma/chest tightness. 

Phenylalanine (50 percent of aspartame) 

Phenylalanine is an amino acid normally found in the brain. Persons with the genetic disorder phenylketonuria (PKU) cannot metabolize phenylalanine. This leads to dangerously high levels of phenylalanine in the brain (sometimes lethal). It has been shown that ingesting aspartame, especially along with carbohydrates, can lead to excess levels of phenylalanine in the brain even in persons who do not have PKU.


Methanol (aka wood alcohol/poison) (10 percent of aspartame) 

Methanol/wood alcohol is a deadly poison. Some people may remember methanol as the poison that has caused some "skid row" alcoholics to end up blind or dead. Methanol is gradually released in the small intestine when the methyl group of aspartame encounter the enzyme chymotrypsin


click link for FULL ARTICLE

but don't worry Kitten, god knows you won't read real data...cause you have all your "biological sciences" wherever they may be


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > KittenKoder said:
> ...





lmao

first off where is your proof fo rany of that 

secondly,

thats not what they say you idiot


yes all bilogists say the natural thing for a human is to be fat an dobese right

I guess thats why Japan has one of the best life expectancy rates in the world...because they are fat. 


you will always be near your normal natural weight and height?

So what abou tthe tens, hundreds of thousands, or millions of people out there that lost 250+ pounds by working hard....what about the skinny people who were like that baturally all of a sudden balloned up 300 pounds becuase of their bad diet

I guess thats all genetics and was destined huh

You are fucking dumb


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew ... it hasn't been in wide usage long enough for them to gain any real data on aspartame. Not to mention that there was no real controlled study so the findings are not accurate even if they were from 100 years ago (it takes about that much time for any uncontrolled study to result in enough data to be accurate, controlled studies take at least 10 to 20 years depending on what they are looking for). 

Now, for your other post, you do realize why the fat sumo wrestlers in Japan are so revered .... it's because they all eat tons of carbs (rice) but only a few manage to get fat. Of course a genius such as yourself would know that, right?

Also yes, biologists have said that, one even went on national TV once and said it, but no one paid attention because people seem to enjoy self loathing or something to worry about more than hearing "life is just not really that bad or scary".


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

lol cause japenese peopel cant get fat is this the idioocy you are saying now?  Have you ever been to Japan?  I highly doubt it.  

The reason they are revered is no tbecause they were one of the lucky japanese to get fat you idiot...its because its a major sport in Japan!  God you cant be this dumb

Yes biologist went on national tv? lmao 1 biologist to which you have no proof...take a fucking walk you twinkie eating moron


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

lunch time!
Think i'll go get me a grilled chicken salad

OOO NOEZZZZ THERE MAY BE PRESERVATIVES IN THERE SOMEWHERE



as I am in the best shape of my life since I have been taking care of myself

bbl


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Keep going Andrew ... you may one day cease in making yourself look a fool. Learn the history of Japan, not the current culture, though their diet hasn't changed any. They still eat tons of rice .. being a genius like yourself you do know what grain has a LOT of ... right?


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Oh, and thanks for proving that you do not live in Western Washington.


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## catzmeow (Feb 24, 2009)

When are kitten and Andrew going to acknowledge their undeniable attraction and hook up?

That's the real question, I think.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> When are kitten and Andrew going to acknowledge their undeniable attraction and hook up?
> 
> That's the real question, I think.



Eeew ... he's probably too skinny, I'd break him in one minute.


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2009)

Wow, 3 pages since I last logged on here.  Can we all agree that everyone is different? What works for one will not work for another.  We are not cookie cutters!

Food is overrated! Just eat it to stay alive. LOL


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Keep going Andrew ... you may one day cease in making yourself look a fool. Learn the history of Japan, not the current culture, though their diet hasn't changed any. They still eat tons of rice .. being a genius like yourself you do know what grain has a LOT of ... right?



The history means nothing you imbicile.  You think that they are revered today because the outcome of the Japanese people may depend on a sumo match?

You do know that is the origins right..dates back to about 2000 years ago.

And I never once said I was from Washington, sorry to far from civilization....pretty sure that the majority of the board knows I live in South florida


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> When are kitten and Andrew going to acknowledge their undeniable attraction and hook up?
> 
> That's the real question, I think.



nah, i try to date girls that weigh less then my truck


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

also still waiting on one link from you tubby showing all that medical data of yours...you havent provided shit.

hence you're an idiot


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> also still waiting on one link from you tubby showing all that medical data of yours...you havent provided shit.
> 
> hence you're an idiot



*smirks* If I was stupid enough to post my pic online it would be more proof than anyone would need ... that you are just self hating.


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## del (Feb 24, 2009)

i've just got one comment on this thread.






*FOOD FIGHT!!!*​


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Andrew2382 said:
> 
> 
> > also still waiting on one link from you tubby showing all that medical data of yours...you havent provided shit.
> ...



I wasnt asking for a pic of you, you fucking oaf...I just ate, no need to vomit in my office from the rolls of skin hanging off your chin that you use as a napkin

I was asking for all this medical and scientific data you claim to have

reading comprehension is fun!


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## catzmeow (Feb 24, 2009)

God, former fatties are just as obnoxious as former smokers and former alcoholics.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

....aren't you a so called former fattie?


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

and I am now 4 months without a ciggerate and I like to be with smokers, tests me and I like the smell...I dont bitch about it


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## catzmeow (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew2382 said:


> ....aren't you a so called former fattie?




It depends on how you define fat.  I never exceeded the "normal" range for my height.  But, I felt fat, for me.


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## Gunnen4u (Feb 24, 2009)

If you're fat, lose weight. I'm a pretty big guy, but I try to keep it from becoming all fat. Anything is possible. If you want to be a big large, have fun with it, I don't care.

Fat Acceptance Movement.....good grief. 

Either it'll bankrupt health care providers and our tax fund, or the mov't will die off when obese people have health problems.


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2009)

I feel fat at 108 lbs! I'm 5' 4"  I got that belly roll going on and cannot get rid of it.  My husband tells me I'm crazy because he doesn't see the roll.  OMG a few months ago I looked 7 months pregnant! LOL

I smoke, quit for 6mths but started again.  *sigh*


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> God, former fatties are just as obnoxious as former smokers and former alcoholics.



Yes ... they are, the only difference is how self hating former fatties are sometimes.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

del said:


> i've just got one comment on this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



*tosses a pie at Del*


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> catzmeow said:
> 
> 
> > God, former fatties are just as obnoxious as former smokers and former alcoholics.
> ...



not at all you slob

Actually I enjoy helping people get back in shape cause I am very into fitness.

Don't think I hate large people, I don't...what pisses me off is people whoa re clueless like you anjd try to pass on what they know as fact when tis complete and utter bullshit and nonsense.


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2009)

I saw this picture and had to post it.  She is 320 lbs.  I have no idea how tall she is.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Terry said:


> I saw this picture and had to post it.  She is 320 lbs.  I have no idea how tall she is.



Yeah, now that's a fatso! LOL ... I dare you to call her that to her face ... Andrew?


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Terry said:
> 
> 
> > I saw this picture and had to post it. She is 320 lbs. I have no idea how tall she is.
> ...


 I wasn't trying to make your case or anyones! I just saw it found it a very one of a kind picture, so posted it.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Terry said:
> 
> 
> > I saw this picture and had to post it.  She is 320 lbs.  I have no idea how tall she is.
> ...



is she fat you fucking moron?

no

She is 9 feet tall, if she weighed 1200 pounds tho, then yes she would be fat


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2009)

If I was that tall I know I wouldn't be wearing heels like that! She looks meaty. LOL


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

According to the health industry she would be considered fat. But I think she is perfect, in spite of being tall.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Andrew, quit being a self hating dick just because you went through all that extra work only to find out you didn't have to.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

Awww, did I hurt the fat girls feelings?

Trying to make everyone else miserable like you isn't the way to be productive in life.

You may want to start by taking out the can of spam out of that abyss you call a mouth and go for a walk every now and again.

Don't be upset cause there are millions of people that have the will power and determination to lose weight and feel good about themselves while you just sit there and make execuses for yourself and say how being fat really isn't a bad thing cause the vikings were fat 

lmao

you are a joke, I'm just glad no one here takes you seriously cause I would hate to see someone jeapordize their health because of you


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

LOL ... you really are funny ... just in a sad and lonely way.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

far from sad and far from loney. My life is fantastic.

By the way

in these 6,7 pages whatever it is

NOT ONE FUCKING SOURCE FROM YOU TO BACK UP ANYTHING YOU SAY


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Here's a REAL list of causes, oh, and click on the "overeating" one for the real effects of of eating too much, notice it doesn't connect it to carbs, fats, cholesterol, or even sugar.

Misdiagnosis of Underlying Causes of Obesity - WrongDiagnosis.com

Geneticist, anthropological, and  findings:

Obesity Causes - Genetic, Environmental, Emotional

Here's some interesting findings:

What Causes Obesity? - Move It For Your Health News Story - KTVU San Francisco

Especially this part: "up to 10 percent of people who are mildly obese and try to lose weight on their own or through commercial weight loss programs have binge eating disorder"

Oh yeah, less than 10% is a lot ... sure. There are hundreds more ... but almost time for me to meet some friends for a mall trip (we make men jealous by acting like we are interested then acting like lesbians, it's a lot of fun). So, one last one. I chose this because it mentions an asshole who I met, and he is the reason I lost faith in doctors, see if you can spot who:

Big Fat Facts: The Truth About Fat, Obesity, Gastric Bypass, and Weight Loss

I also like it because it shows the opposite extreme to the extreme morons like Andrew claim ... damned extremists, if they would all only start looking at ALL the facts instead of just what supports their claims.


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## PoliticalChic (Feb 24, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> > Generally speaking just stay away from PROCESSED FOODS.
> ...



There are so many people out there that don't know how to cook and never took the time to learn.  

I understand people have busy lifestyles, but fast food and convenient prepackaged foods are so unhealthy.  And those kinds of food do not include enough fruit and vegetables.  If people don't have time, they should try to cook meals in big batches so that they can be reheated easily during the days when they need to jump from one activity to another.

But even I have to admit that it is just so easy to go to the drive-through especially on those days when you are run-down, tired, and don't want to start taking out the pots and pans once you get home.  That's why it's so helpful to have a frozen meatloaf in the freezer, so you won't be tempted to buy a sack of burgers.

BTW, Catz, your tilapia sounds excellent.  I guess it helps when you enjoy cooking for yourself and/or your family.


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2009)

PoliticalChic said:


> catzmeow said:
> 
> 
> > editec said:
> ...


 Or be like me and have a COOK to serve you. LOL


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## KittenKoder (Feb 24, 2009)

Cooking is sadly a lost art form to many. I enjoy cooking, stir fry is my specialty, though no one ever complains about my Bar-B-Que (father taught me, the great redneck he was).


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 24, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Here's a REAL list of causes, oh, and click on the "overeating" one for the real effects of of eating too much, notice it doesn't connect it to carbs, fats, cholesterol, or even sugar.
> 
> Misdiagnosis of Underlying Causes of Obesity - WrongDiagnosis.com
> 
> ...



lmao

wow, what to tear apart first...

lets start with the most ridiuclous of the links

Big Fat Facts: The Truth About Fat, Obesity, Gastric Bypass, and Weight Loss

lmao what a great site

bigfatfacts.com lol

THE CLAIM: Obesity is unhealthy. It causes heart disease, cancer, diabetes, hypertension, asthma, arthritis, impotence, depression, sleep apnea, deep vein thrombosis, and dementia.

THE TRUTH: Obesity has not been found to be the primary cause of any of these health problems. There is little evidence that adiposity (excess fat tissues) produces the claimed pathologies.

How about a real source you retard

Lets try this one?

Obesity and Overweight

American heart Association?

Obesity is now recognized as a major risk factor for coronary heart disease, which can lead to heart attack. Some reasons for this higher risk are known, but others are not. For example, obesity

    * raises blood cholesterol and triglyceride levels.
    * lowers HDL "good" cholesterol. HDL cholesterol is linked with lower heart disease and stroke risk, so reducing it tends to raise the risk.
    * raises blood pressure levels.
    * can induce diabetes. In some people, diabetes makes these other risk factors much worse. The danger of heart attack is especially high for these people.


Site says that obesity in the united states isn't as bad as people say and its mostly fabricated

lmao

Obesity and Overweight: Trends: U.S. Obesity Trends | DNPAO | CDC

Take a look at that map of the United States and see how the colors change for >30 BMI over the past 30 years,

Your site is bogus as are you.

What Causes Obesity? - Move It For Your Health News Story - KTVU San Francisco

this site does nothing to prove anything you were trying to say...I have already agreed that in some cases it is much harder for the person to lose weight however it doesn't mean ITS IMPOSSIBLE.  Just takes more work


Next

Obesity Causes - Genetic, Environmental, Emotional

Environment/Culture and Obesity

Environment also strongly influences obesity. *An environment where people eat high fat and high sugar diets and take little exercise, causes more problems with excess weight and obesity than one where people eat low fat diets and get regular exercise.*

wow, sounds like exactly what I have been syaing this whole time...thanks for proving my point kitten with your own source

Emotional Factors and Obesity

Many people over eat when they're stressed, bored or angry. Over time, the association between an emotion and food can become firmly fixed. Depression or stress are also causes of obesity and other patterns of disordered eating.

Exercising is a anti depressant

Lack of Physical Activity and Obesity

*Lack of physical exercise is definitely one of the major causes of weight gain and obesity. Lack of physical activity caused in part by too much TV/computer games is strongly linked with obesity levels, especially in young people.*

thanks again for proving my point....also this site is ridiculous just like you because this bitch anne collins talks about how some diet plans arent good and dont work and are mixed yet at the bottom she tries and promote.....HER OWN DIET PLAN!  WTF IS THAT!


Nice Sites! lol

FAIL


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

Okay ... so if obesity IS the leading cause of heart disease then the anti-smokers lied.

If smoking is actually the leading cause of heart disease the idiots like you lie.

You do know that BOTH these claims are backed by medical doctors, right? Now let's see if you brain functions at all. Here's the thing, for every medical problem they have claimed at least two, usually more, "leading causes". That's impossible mathematically. How are they able to make the claim, because there is no real evidence support any of the claims, so they can move them around as they see fit. They use hype and media to sell special foods and crap like over priced equipment to fools like you, who just happen to be mostly fat people made insecure about themselves by the media. The sad part ... you actually believe it.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

So ... I think I will light another cig, since it seems the tobacco companies were actually right. Obesity is actually the leading cause of death and all these ailments then I have nothing to worry about. Hell, may as well smoke two pack tomorrow ...


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 25, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Okay ... so if obesity IS the leading cause of heart disease then the anti-smokers lied.
> 
> If smoking is actually the leading cause of heart disease the idiots like you lie.
> 
> You do know that BOTH these claims are backed by medical doctors, right? Now let's see if you brain functions at all. Here's the thing, for every medical problem they have claimed at least two, usually more, "leading causes". That's impossible mathematically. How are they able to make the claim, because there is no real evidence support any of the claims, so they can move them around as they see fit. They use hype and media to sell special foods and crap like over priced equipment to fools like you, who just happen to be mostly fat people made insecure about themselves by the media. The sad part ... you actually believe it.



leads to heart disease not the leading

HOOKED ON PHONICS WORKED FOR ME!


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

So, according to the doctors anything but what they currently endorse is deadly ...


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 25, 2009)

Cause obesity is fun!


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

Really ... did you watch Health Watch this morning .. they said chocolate is good for you, and even showed images of popular candy bars.


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## catzmeow (Feb 25, 2009)

PoliticalChic said:


> There are so many people out there that don't know how to cook and never took the time to learn.
> 
> I understand people have busy lifestyles, but fast food and convenient prepackaged foods are so unhealthy.  And those kinds of food do not include enough fruit and vegetables.  If people don't have time, they should try to cook meals in big batches so that they can be reheated easily during the days when they need to jump from one activity to another.
> 
> ...



I LOVE to cook (and eat! - therein lies the rub).

The tilapia is super easy, it came from Rachel Ray's magazine, which I love for new ideas:

Tilapia with Roasted Corn recipe - Every Day with Rachael Ray

I added half of an onion, finely chopped, and about 1/4 cup of red bell pepper, sauteed in a tsp. of olive oil until carmelized, to the light mayo and chili powder, along with some salt and a tsp. of lemon juice.  I used canned corn instead of frozen, because I think it has more flavor.

Was VERY good.  My kids loved it.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

Thought I recognized the name ... sometimes I flip past her show looking for something good on.
Rachel is healthy to, very healthy, but not scrawny. Guess she is one of the exceptions to the rule.


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## catzmeow (Feb 25, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Thought I recognized the name ... sometimes I flip past her show looking for something good on.
> Rachel is healthy to, very healthy, but not scrawny. Guess she is one of the exceptions to the rule.



I think she is ADORABLE.


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

catzmeow said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Thought I recognized the name ... sometimes I flip past her show looking for something good on.
> ...



Very ... I just find her voice annoying when she chirps on her show.


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## editec (Feb 25, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> So ... I think I will light another cig, since it seems the tobacco companies were actually right. Obesity is actually the leading cause of death and all these ailments then I have nothing to worry about. Hell, may as well smoke two pack tomorrow ...


 

There's the spirit!

Defiance in the face of overwhelming scientific evidence is what makes America the great nation it is.

_Oh? Does my smoke bother you?_

_Well stop stealing it from me, then. _

_I was planning on breathing in that second hand smoke just as soon as I was done with this first hand smoke, and I surely do not appreciate you mooching it off me._


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

editec said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > So ... I think I will light another cig, since it seems the tobacco companies were actually right. Obesity is actually the leading cause of death and all these ailments then I have nothing to worry about. Hell, may as well smoke two pack tomorrow ...
> ...



Oddly ... what you said is true ... in spite of me trying to be extremely sarcastic.


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## Andrew2382 (Feb 25, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Really ... did you watch Health Watch this morning .. they said chocolate is good for you, and even showed images of popular candy bars.



fantastic...eat 3 a day for the next 5 years of your life


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

Bah! I actually hate the taste of chocolate ... *smirks* bet you didn't realize that. As a matter of fact, a bag of Skittles (I like the fruity taste and one of the three candies I can stand the taste of) will last about two or three months. The one thing I eat the most of ... sunflower seeds! Oh damn ... getting hungry again. Think I'll skip cooking and just do pizza today, craving something common in pizza right now anyhow.

Maybe a hamburger for lunch from my favorite cafe ... they cook them fresh with meat they buy from the store I shop at ... and they use real ingredients instead of all that "fat free" crap (which actually contains about the same fat, just in a different and less tasty form). Maybe some pickles or olives for snack today ... though I may do ice cream, I don't know which I am craving more. I may be low on calcium so probably ice cream.


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## Againsheila (Feb 25, 2009)

KittenKoder said:


> Okay ... so if obesity IS the leading cause of heart disease then the anti-smokers lied.
> 
> If smoking is actually the leading cause of heart disease the idiots like you lie.
> 
> You do know that BOTH these claims are backed by medical doctors, right? Now let's see if you brain functions at all. Here's the thing, for every medical problem they have claimed at least two, usually more, "leading causes". That's impossible mathematically. How are they able to make the claim, because there is no real evidence support any of the claims, so they can move them around as they see fit. They use hype and media to sell special foods and crap like over priced equipment to fools like you, who just happen to be mostly fat people made insecure about themselves by the media. The sad part ... you actually believe it.



I think you are confusing "a" with "the".


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## KittenKoder (Feb 25, 2009)

Againsheila said:


> KittenKoder said:
> 
> 
> > Okay ... so if obesity IS the leading cause of heart disease then the anti-smokers lied.
> ...



The word "leading" is used to reference the most significant in such cases ... thus there can only be one that is truly "leading", there can only be one above all the others. This is the trick they use, where a lot of people effected by something happens to have a vice they make people think there is more significant connections by using certain words. Like any advertiser will tell you, you have to make it seem bigger than it is, or people don't pay attention (advertisers annoy me). Just like the phrase "#1 movie in America", using it for almost every movie in theaters. Or the "best in the US" for slop houses which sell food that barely passes as waste. Same concept, same effect.


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## waltky (Mar 21, 2011)

Dey s-o-o-o fat (How fat are dey?)...

*Overweight Americans undermining safety of city buses*
_21 Mar.`11 - It's official: The federal government says more overweight Americans are squeezing onto buses, and it may have to rewrite bus safety rules because of it._


> The Federal Transit Authority (FTA) proposes raising the assumed average weight per bus passenger from 150 pounds to 175 pounds, which could mean that across the country, fewer people will be allowed on a city transit bus.  The transit authority, which regulates how much weight a bus can carry, also proposes adding an additional quarter of a square foot of floor space per passenger. The changes are being sought "to acknowledge the expanding girth of the average passenger," the agency says.
> 
> "This change is really just a bow to reality," says Joseph Schwieterman, who studies bus ridership as director of the Chaddick Institute for Metropolitan Development at DePaul University in Chicago. "With no small number of bus passengers tipping the scale at 200 pounds or more, this is much more realistic."  Current federal guidelines on average passenger weight are based on surveys in 1960-62 of what Americans weighed then. Today, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says, the average weight is 194.7 pounds for men 20 and older and 164.7 pounds for women that age range. "FTA believes that 175 pounds is an appropriate average weight to assume for testing buses," the agency says.
> 
> ...



... dey so fat dey bustin' the heavy duty shocks an' springs onna city buses!...

... Aw man, now dat's fat!


See also:

*400-pound marathoner celebrates nine hours, 48 minutes and 52 seconds of 'pure hell'*
_March 21, 2011 - Kelly Gneiting, a former national champion sumo wrestler, finishes the L.A. Marathon and may have set a Guinness record._


> After slowly but steadily working his way through a 26.2-mile course drenched by driving rain, mammoth distance runner Kelly Gneiting finished Sunday's Los Angeles Marathon in nine hours, 48 minutes and 52 seconds, probably establishing a Guinness world record for someone his size.  "I did it, but it was hell," Gneiting, 40, said, shortly after crossing the finish line in Santa Monica. "Pure hell." Featured in a Times profile last week, Gneiting is a former national champion sumo wrestler with a 60-inch waist who weighed in just before the race at 400 pounds.
> 
> Gneiting completed the marathon by jogging and walking and said there were several times when he feared he wouldn't finish, particularly when his rain-soaked feet developed terrible blisters.  "My feet were on fire," he said. "Twice, blisters popped and just about brought me to my knees.... But I kept going."
> 
> ...



Uncle Ferd wonderin' if dey had any 400 lb. womens in dat race?


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## waltky (Apr 7, 2011)

possum thinks mebbe dey could have separate boats so fat people could have their own fat flotilla...

*Heavier passengers on boats force Coast Guard rule change*
_6 Apr.`11 - Does the growing girth of Americans pose a risk to passenger vessels? The U.S. Coast Guard apparently thinks so, as it's planning to reduce the number of people it'll allow on ferries, sightseeing boats and other small passenger vessels operating in U.S. waters to compensate for the extra pounds Americans have been packing on in recent years, according to a report this week in South Florida's Sun Sentinel._


> The news outlet says the Coast Guard plans to reset the average weight per person used to calculate maximum occupancy for American-flagged passenger vessels to 185 pounds. Since the early 1960s, the average weight used in the calculation has been 160 pounds.
> 
> Under the new rules, a vessel rated for 16,000 pounds that until now has been allowed to carry 100 passengers would have its maximum occupancy cut to 86 people. The change will take effect Dec. 1.
> 
> ...


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## waltky (Dec 4, 2011)

Granny says dey shoulda made the fat guy pay the $200 fer the voucher...

*Fat man forces passenger to stand seven hours in plane*
_Nov 25, 2011, An American businessman had to stand for an exhausting seven-hour flight from Alaska to Philadelphia because an obese fellow passenger was taking up half his seat._


> Arthur Berkowitz, 57, said a 400-pound man (around 181 kg) squeezed next to his seat on a flight from Anchorage, the New York Post reported.  "He was the last one to board, and as he walked down to me, he said, 'I really want to apologize. I'm your worst nightmare'," Berkowitz was quoted as saying.  "He was a cordial person. But the facts are, he took half my seat, and half the seat of an exchange student who was pinned up against the window."
> 
> Berkowitz said he spent the majority of the time of flight on his feet.  "As the arm rests were up, and due to his girth, he covered about half my seat," he said. "I notified the stewardess that this is unacceptable and unsafe."  Berkowitz could not also move up to the business class as the plane was full, and he was also not allowed use of a flight-attendant seat.  "So I walked up and down. I tell people I didn't fly from Anchorage to Philadelphia -- I walked there!" he said.
> 
> ...


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## Againsheila (Dec 5, 2011)

waltky said:


> Granny says dey shoulda made the fat guy pay the $200 fer the voucher...
> 
> *Fat man forces passenger to stand seven hours in plane*
> _Nov 25, 2011, An American businessman had to stand for an exhausting seven-hour flight from Alaska to Philadelphia because an obese fellow passenger was taking up half his seat._
> ...



Seriously, considering how many Americans are overweight, they really ought to make the seats bigger.  I don't mind if they charge you twice as much to sit in them, but I imagine sitting across two seats is rather uncomfortable.  How about different size seats with different legroom and reasonable prices?  The itty bitty people can pay less and get less.
Personally, I'm sick of having to spread my legs everytime the guy in front of me decides to put his seat back.

Also, due to blood clots, when I fly, I spend a great deal of time walking...nobody has yet reimbursed me...  But yeah, if somebody was gonna be walking on that flight, it should have been the fat guy.


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## auditor0007 (Dec 5, 2011)

catzmeow said:


> Some people who are fat REALLY can't help it.  But, they don't represent that vast majority of people who are fat.
> 
> I think it is also important to recognize that Americans (and perhaps, the rest of the world) have very fucked up body image issues.
> 
> ...



A gym just opened up down the street from me.  They charge $10 per month.  Many poor people will tell everyone they are too poor to afford healthy food or $10 per month to go to the gym.  Of course, if they didn't spend $150 to $200 per month on cigarettes, well, you get the idea.


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## Againsheila (Dec 5, 2011)

auditor0007 said:


> catzmeow said:
> 
> 
> > Some people who are fat REALLY can't help it.  But, they don't represent that vast majority of people who are fat.
> ...



I've never seen a gym that only charged $10 a month, unless they also charged a big fee upfront.  If there was one around here, I'd be frequenting it, well maybe.  Balley's here really should be closed down due to sexual harassment.  What kind of gym forces women to pass by the heavy weightlifting room to get to the pool?  While the men's locker opens right out onto the pool?

There are even windows over looking the pool from rooms I've never seen and sometimes you see men looking down into the pool.  I was so happy to sell our membership that my husband bought.


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## waltky (Aug 14, 2012)

possum thinks mebbe dat's why Uncle Ferd prefers fat girls - `cause Granny always stressin' him out...

*Study: Stressed men prefer bigger women*
_Aug. 9,`12 (UPI) -- British researchers said their study indicates men who are going through stressful times prefer larger-sized women._


> The Westminster University team said they separated 80 male volunteers into two groups and submitted one of the groups to stressful activities including mock job interviews and math exams, The Daily Telegraph reported Thursday.
> 
> The researchers, who published their findings in the PLoS ONE journal, said they then showed all of the men pictures of women with various body sizes and asked them to rate the attractiveness of the women.  The men who were submitted to the stressful activities chose a significantly larger body type as the "ideal" than the men in the control group, the research team said.
> 
> ...


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