# Signups for Official USMB Mafia Game #4



## Wake

*Hi guys.

I've got a simple game I'd like to share with you.*

*Friends and Enemies*

*It's simple, and fun. Open Setup, so you know what's what.*

*3 Mafia Goons
3 Masons
7 Townies*

*Role PMs:*



> *Mafia Goon*
> 
> Welcome, [Player Name]. You are a Mafia Goon, along with your partners, [Player Name] and [Player Name].
> 
> *Abilities:*
> *Factional communication:* During the night phase you may talk with your partners here [QuickTopic link].
> 
> *Factional kill:* Each night phase, one of you or your partners may perform the factional kill.
> 
> *Win condition:*
> You win when all members of the town have been eliminated or nothing can prevent this from occurring.





> *Town Mason*
> 
> Welcome, [Player Name], you are a Town Mason, along with your partners, [Player Name] and [Player Name].
> 
> *Abilities:*
> *Factional communication:* During the night phase you may talk with your partners here [QuickTopic link].
> You are confirmed town to your partners, and them to you.
> 
> *Win condition:*
> You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated.





> *Vanilla Townie*
> 
> Welcome, [Player Name], you are a Vanilla Townie.
> 
> *Abilities:*
> Your weapon is your vote, you have no night actions.
> 
> *Win condition:*
> You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated.



*Are you in?* 



Spoiler: Invitations



[MENTION=13580]CaféAuLait[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=30820]Moonglow[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=26838]Ropey[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=39075]Shaitra[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=45321]armada[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=5262]Immanuel[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=43625]Mertex[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=34688]Grandma[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=45739]Jughead[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=854]Avatar4321[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=27986]R.D.[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=31178]MeBelle60[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=48997]sameech[/MENTION]
                  [MENTION=21905]FA_Q2[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=39688]RosieS[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=30065]dblack[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=41527]Pogo[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=45104]WelfareQueen[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=43888]AyeCantSeeYou[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=49365]tn5421[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=29688]derk[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=19727]Darkwind[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=31092]Kooshdakhaa[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=46151]HelenaHandbag[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=11865]Luissa[/MENTION]
                      [MENTION=49728]ScarletRage[/MENTION]
 [MENTION=8806]manifold[/MENTION]


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## sameech

[MENTION=44124]Wake[/MENTION] I am out unless you cannot otherwise find that last player or need a replacement to keep a game alive.  Just no point butting heads further on game states.  It isn't healthy for either of us.


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## FA_Q2

I am in.


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## Shaitra

I'm in.


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## boedicca

I'm out unless you create a category for a Ladies Garden Club that brainwashes sleepers who they can  wake up with playing cards to assassinate all the other players in the game.


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## Jughead

Thanks for the invite, Wake. 

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to commit the time, so I'll need to decline.


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## AyeCantSeeYou

I'm in.


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## Wake

Jughead said:


> Thanks for the invite, Wake.
> 
> Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to commit the time, so I'll need to decline.



I understand. Thanks, Jughead. If you wish I'll not @mention you regarding Mafia any more.


----------



## Wake

boedicca said:


> I'm out unless you create a category for a Ladies Garden Club that brainwashes sleepers who they can  wake up with playing cards to assassinate all the other players in the game.



I'm not sure about that, but I daresay you might enjoy this game if you try it.


----------



## boedicca

Thank you, but it's too much of a commitment.


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## boedicca

HOWEVER, if you created a category for GIRL SCOUTS & BROWNIES who poisoned the other members with nefarous cookies, I might reconsider.


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## Wake

Well, darn. You seem like you might enjoy Mafia's subtleties, Boedicca. With simple games come smaller commitments, too. I see you came here by yourself, which means you might be interested.


----------



## boedicca

Nyeah.   It's still too much of a commitment.  I don't want to feel obligated to participate when I might have other demands on my time.


----------



## ScarletRage

/in in in


----------



## boedicca

However, I will note that your categories are painfully pedestrian.

Why not:   Refugee South American Cannibals who kill off their opponents with Poisoned Darts?

Why not:   Sun Tan Parlor Franchisees who burn their opponents to death in sun tan beds?

Why not:   Certified Public Accountants who torture their opponents to death with recitations of the tax code and GAAP accounting standards?


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## Wake

When it comes to themed games, absolutely anything is possible. ;-)


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## RosieS

I shall play. 

Regards from Rosie


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## boedicca

A gang of 5 year old girls vs. obese Type II diabetics in wheelchairs!


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## boedicca

Circus Freaks vs. former White House Spokespersons!


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## Wake

If you guys know of any friends who might want to play, please ask them!


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## Wake

boedicca said:


> Circus Freaks vs. former White House Spokespersons!



I once played a Plants vs. Zombies Mafia game, which was neat.


----------



## sameech

boedicca said:


> HOWEVER, if you created a category for GIRL SCOUTS & BROWNIES who poisoned the other members with nefarous cookies, I might reconsider.



That reminds me.  The poisoner role is a neat one [MENTION=44124]Wake[/MENTION] You should add it into one of your games.  It has the potential to really shake up some players analysis to have an extra person croak at sunset and it allows someone to kill from the grave.


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## MeBelle

Meeeee!


----------



## RosieS

Killing from the Dead Zone is freaking AWESOME!

Poison, poison, poison!

Regards from Rosie


----------



## Wake

Alright, so far we've got *7/13*.

*AyeCantSeeYou
RosieS
Shaitra
FA_Q2
CafeAuLait
ScarletRage
MeBelle60*

You guys want in, too? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 [MENTION=8806]manifold[/MENTION]
 [MENTION=854]Avatar4321[/MENTION]
 [MENTION=43625]Mertex[/MENTION]
 [MENTION=34688]Grandma[/MENTION]
 [MENTION=27986]R.D.[/MENTION]


----------



## sameech

RosieS said:


> Killing from the Dead Zone is freaking AWESOME!
> 
> Poison, poison, poison!
> 
> Regards from Rosie



You have to put the hit in before you die and then it can take effect after you are dead.  Unfortunately you really do not get to order the hit from the dead zone, though I think that would be pretty awesome too.  We should create such a role and call it the Rosiefier or something


----------



## MeBelle

boedicca said:


> However, I will note that your categories are painfully pedestrian.
> 
> Why not:   Refugee South American Cannibals who kill off their opponents with Poisoned Darts?
> 
> Why not:   Sun Tan Parlor Franchisees who burn their opponents to death in sun tan beds?
> 
> Why not:  * Certified Public Accountants who torture their opponents to death with recitations of the tax code and GAAP accounting standards?*



*^^^yes^^^​*


----------



## Wake

RosieS said:


> Killing from the Dead Zone is freaking AWESOME!
> 
> Poison, poison, poison!
> 
> Regards from Rosie



Yeah, there's definitely poison setups, too! Also there are games that have arsonists, mwahaha....

Next game I'd like to try the VERY simple and popular Fire and Ice Setup. If you guys want, we'll try them all!


----------



## CaféAuLait

I know I said this earlier, but I am going to repeat myself and forgive me if I sound annoying. 

If someone claims they will be V/LA can it be a rule where there is no reason stated at all. 


"Everyone lies" comes to mind, some may use whatever situation as a ploy, this way if someone mentions it they wont be accused of attacking family. 

Example, you said V/LA on the 10th but I saw you elsewhere playing. This way there will be no confusion at all. 

Anyway that is all!


----------



## Grandma

Of course I'm in!


----------



## Mertex

Wake said:


> Alright, so far we've got *7/13*.
> 
> *AyeCantSeeYou
> RosieS
> Shaitra
> FA_Q2
> CafeAuLait
> ScarletRage
> MeBelle60*
> 
> You guys want in, too?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [MENTION=8806]manifold[/MENTION]
> [MENTION=854]Avatar4321[/MENTION]
> [MENTION=43625]Mertex[/MENTION]
> [MENTION=34688]Grandma[/MENTION]
> [MENTION=27986]R.D.[/MENTION]




Okay, I'll play.


----------



## Wake

With V/LA, that's an almost impossible thing for a game mod to deal with. As Scum I can utilize that at times, or when I simply need a break from the game. I would rather players who go on V/LA not feel they have to give a reason. We're humans, and sometimes going on vacay is better than shooting your computer screen and lynching your monitor.


----------



## Mertex

CaféAuLait;9462499 said:
			
		

> I know I said this earlier, but I am going to repeat myself and forgive me if I sound annoying.
> 
> If someone claims they will be V/LA can it be a rule where there is no reason stated at all.
> 
> 
> "Everyone lies" comes to mind, some may use whatever situation as a ploy, this way if someone mentions it they wont be accused of attacking family.
> 
> Example, you said V/LA on the 10th but I saw you elsewhere playing. This way there will be no confusion at all.
> 
> Anyway that is all!




I think if a players is going to be gone, that's all they need to say V/LA, no need to mention family or reasons.....(that's what starts the drama).


----------



## Wolfsister77

CaféAuLait;9462499 said:
			
		

> I know I said this earlier, but I am going to repeat myself and forgive me if I sound annoying.
> 
> If someone claims they will be V/LA can it be a rule where there is no reason stated at all.
> 
> "Everyone lies" comes to mind, some may use whatever situation as a ploy, this way if someone mentions it they wont be accused of attacking family.
> 
> Example, you said V/LA on the 10th but I saw you elsewhere playing. This way there will be no confusion at all.
> 
> Anyway that is all!




Right!! Except a person can post on V/LA like I already said a billion times. And experienced players have said they do too. This is not an area to go when attacking a person. Just leave it alone. Again, even the experienced people have said they don't touch this. Why? Because V/LA has to do with "real world" issues and whether or not someone posts while on it  shouldn't matter.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Wolfsister77 said:


> CaféAuLait;9462499 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know I said this earlier, but I am going to repeat myself and forgive me if I sound annoying.
> 
> If someone claims they will be V/LA can it be a rule where there is no reason stated at all.
> 
> "Everyone lies" comes to mind, some may use whatever situation as a ploy, this way if someone mentions it they wont be accused of attacking family.
> 
> Example, you said V/LA on the 10th but I saw you elsewhere playing. This way there will be no confusion at all.
> 
> Anyway that is all!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right!! Except a person can post on V/LA like I already said a billion times. And experienced players have said they do too. This is not an area to go when attacking a person. Just leave it alone. Again, even the experienced people have said they don't touch this. Why? Because V/LA has to do with "real world" issues and whether or not someone posts while on it  shouldn't matter.
Click to expand...


I posted that some time ago.

Again, I was not attacking you. 

I just mentioned you were still here and referred to your reason for believing you may have been playing the game. It was not meant as a personal attack in the least. 

It is a tactic used by scum. I read Scum will sometimes post a bunch in the beginning then claim V/LA so they can sit back and watch. Drop a few things to cause drama, and keep a low profile. You happened to do just that. It just so happens it coincided with a real issue you were having. 

It was not meant as an attack on you but an observation on my part while trying to sleuth out scum. 

My post above should clear anything like that up again. This way other will not feel as if any reason being mentioned is a personal attack.


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## tn5421

I am so */in*


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## AyeCantSeeYou

Mertex said:


> CaféAuLait;9462499 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know I said this earlier, but I am going to repeat myself and forgive me if I sound annoying.
> 
> If someone claims they will be V/LA can it be a rule where there is no reason stated at all.
> 
> 
> "Everyone lies" comes to mind, some may use whatever situation as a ploy, this way if someone mentions it they wont be accused of attacking family.
> 
> Example, you said V/LA on the 10th but I saw you elsewhere playing. This way there will be no confusion at all.
> 
> Anyway that is all!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think if a players is going to be gone, that's all they need to say V/LA, no need to mention family or reasons.....(that's what starts the drama).
Click to expand...


I agree 100%. Do not ever state why anywhere in the game thread or anywhere else on this forum. What is said in the game can and will be used against that player, whether or not they like it.


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## Avatar4321

I'm in


----------



## manifold

i'm in, but I want to be a mason.


----------



## Avatar4321

So since we have Masons, I presume there are no power roles?


----------



## Avatar4321

manifold said:


> i'm in, but I want to be a mason.



I'd rather be a stone cutter. Or a member of the No Homers


----------



## AyeCantSeeYou

Avatar4321 said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> i'm in, but I want to be a mason.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd rather be a stone cutter. Or a member of the No Homers
Click to expand...


There's an app for that! Seriously! I play it on my iPad.


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## Avatar4321

One more person and we can start getting this ready. I'd like to have this going by the time my mafiascum site game is over. Which could be within an hour.


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## Avatar4321

[MENTION=27986]R.D.[/MENTION] So are you in or out? We only need 1 more.


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## boedicca

Now this would be epid:

Ladies of the Kit Kat Klub vs. Mr. Temple's Swing Dance Class vs. Steampipe Fitters Local 139


----------



## boedicca

Or this one:

Rodeo Clowns vs. Mary Kay Premier Club Directors vs. the Oakland CA DMV


----------



## ScarletRage

The Oakland DMV better be scum. Driver's Safety Office should be their PR.


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## R.D.

Avatar4321 said:


> [MENTION=27986]R.D.[/MENTION] So are you in or out? We only need 1 more.



Ok. I'm in


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## Wake

*13/13*. That was fast. 

_AyeCantSeeYou
RosieS
Shaitra
FA_Q2
CafeAuLait
ScarletRage
MeBelle60
Grandma
Mertex
tn5421
Avatar4321
manifold
R,D._

*Alright, the shuttle's revving up, and this game is getting ready to begin. What I'd like is maybe one more potential Backup player besides Sameech, just in case life happens. You guys are about to get a dose of pure, classic Mafia.* 

*I wonder who'll get lynched first.*





*Okay, I'll be back in a little bit with the game thread and Role PMs. Be back soon.*


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## Wolfsister77

I'll be a second back-up Wake after Sameech. 

Otherwise, I'm happy to watch.


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## ScarletRage

Yippie. It is the same group minus Sammech and Wolf.


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## CaféAuLait

SR drinks on me this time! 

drinks for everyone. Here's to a great game and may whatever team I am on may win.


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## CaféAuLait

lol I'm scrolling through channels and some guy gets arrested on Cops  as I'm about to switch the channel, they announce he is being arrested for throwing a chicken leg at someone! No joke! Made me laugh since it was a role last game.


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## FA_Q2

ScarletRage said:


> Yippie. It is the same group minus Sammech and Wolf.



lol.  Less drama and hostile demands that they are completely correct and know all the scum players.  

Lets get this show on the road already - I am ready to lynch some scum.  

I am sure that we would have won last game and I really want to win this one cleanly.


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## Wake

Getting closer.


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## Ropey

I'm watching a good EpicMafia game right now and there's no whining.

Go figure.


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## sameech

FA_Q2 said:


> ScarletRage said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yippie. It is the same group minus Sammech and Wolf.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *lol.  Less drama and hostile demands that they are completely correct and know all the scum players.  *
> 
> Lets get this show on the road already - I am ready to lynch some scum.
> 
> I am sure that we would have won last game and I really want to win this one cleanly.
Click to expand...


So far that does not seem to be the case


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## Avatar4321

Just won my first mafiascum site game. So aside from the game you guys killed me first round and the game three kerfuffle I haven't lost.


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## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> FA_Q2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ScarletRage said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yippie. It is the same group minus Sammech and Wolf.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *lol.  Less drama and hostile demands that they are completely correct and know all the scum players.  *
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So far that does not seem to be the case
Click to expand...


I take no pleasure in it but yeah, there ya go.


----------



## Wolfsister77

Avatar4321 said:


> Just won my first mafiascum site game. So aside from the game you guys killed me first round and the game three kerfuffle I haven't lost.



Congratulations Avi and good luck in your next games.


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## sameech

Avatar4321 said:


> Just won my first mafiascum site game. So aside from the game you guys killed me first round and the game three kerfuffle I haven't lost.




Yeah I had never lost until I came here either.  There are some very bizarre interpersonal and ego-sensitive dynamics at this site that trump game strategy.


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## boedicca

sameech said:


> There are some very bizarre interpersonal and ego-sensitive dynamics at this site that trump game strategy.



This is one of the most insightful posts ever on USMB!


And again, I protest the PEDESTRIAN factions for the game.    I'd rather see:


Transvestite Game Show Contestants vs. Little League State Championship Finalists vs. Short Order Fry Cooks


----------



## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just won my first mafiascum site game. So aside from the game you guys killed me first round and the game three kerfuffle I haven't lost.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I had never lost until I came here either.  There are some very bizarre interpersonal and ego-sensitive dynamics at this site that trump game strategy.
Click to expand...


Very true but I think ego and personalities occur in this game everywhere for example here's what someone said to Wake in a game he's in, not out of line really:

Don't fucking kid yourself. Nobody's worth more than a literal 100% confirmed town result. Clears > reads, despite what your ego might lead you to think.

Wake responded with this, which was over the top:

IS THAT THE ANGRY SWAMP EUNUCH I'M HEARING AGAIN? Maybe you should ask your girlfriend to pull that swamp crab out of your ass with a trusty FORCEPS. With its bulky pincer no longer clutching your throbbing dark meat, I reckon you'll start speaking with some vestige of civility again.


----------



## Wake

At Mafiascum people contort their personas in order to not be read. Now players at Mafiascum routinely predict me incorrectly, because that is the nature of the game. Who I am here is not the players I turn myself into there. If there is one thing I dislike, it's being read, Meta'd. Unpredictibility is extremely important. I now have people in the same game recalling that I'm passive when Scum, and others saying I'm aggressive when Scum. It is all deliberate, in order to throw off the perpetual chase.


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## Wolfsister77

It makes sense, change it up to avoid being read. I get that. But still over the top. Game related aggression would of been better. 

These are better:

What is silly is your lack of reading comprehension.

If you're Scum, don't even try and appeal to some perceived sense of self-preservation. You will fail.

I make life difficult for Scum, so I have no problem being called hyper-paranoid in a game with deceitful Scum trying to murder and manipulate everyone.

Those are great and I would never have a problem with that kind of talk. Your over the top one, I would  have.

Just giving some examples of game related aggression vs personal attack. Hell, swearing should definitely be part of the game. 

We should be able to call someone a liar too but that was a big deal last game.

So if we want to fix the USMB dynamic, these are some things to think about.

New players would also help because they can't be read like a book like people who play together a lot can be and it would be interesting to figure them out.


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## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Avatar4321 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just won my first mafiascum site game. So aside from the game you guys killed me first round and the game three kerfuffle I haven't lost.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I had never lost until I came here either.  There are some very bizarre interpersonal and ego-sensitive dynamics at this site that trump game strategy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Very true but I think ego and personalities occur in this game everywhere for example here's what someone said to Wake in a game he's in, not out of line really:
> 
> Don't fucking kid yourself. Nobody's worth more than a literal 100% confirmed town result. Clears > reads, despite what your ego might lead you to think.
> 
> Wake responded with this, which was over the top:
> 
> IS THAT THE ANGRY SWAMP EUNUCH I'M HEARING AGAIN? Maybe you should ask your girlfriend to pull that swamp crab out of your ass with a trusty FORCEPS. With its bulky pincer no longer clutching your throbbing dark meat, I reckon you'll start speaking with some vestige of civility again.
Click to expand...


it is beyond the level of flaming allowed IMO.  Some examples:

The I should play in the main thread the way I did in the QT post:  You cannot play in the mainthread the way we did in the QT because we could discuss things without interference, including specific players, plot ploys/plans, share information, etc also free of scum.

Someone acting like I claimed to have 'Expertise":  I have never claimed to be an expert, quite the opposite.  I have pointed out that I am still learning the game, but I at least take into account what other players are possibly doing.  It was one of the things I pointed out in my QT about SR--not being sure if she was playing off my rabble rousing or not.

The lying thing:  I never said I wasn't in a neighborhood but some people could not let it go that they fell for a ruse that was not intended for them to begin with even when explained to them.  I specifically cautioned RD & Ayes not to say they were not in a neighborhood to further my move because of the lying being bad for town.  Nuance is lost on some people.  Even when I explained my Day 1 get people talking by being abrasive move, nobody bought it so why bother discussing things with them?

Too many people just cannot play as a town team.  They have no appreciation for strategy, tactics, sacrifice, etc.  There is too much sitting on their hands with their noses in the air.   The people who offer little to nothing should be the most suspicious in a game, but here they are the most protected.  It is just bad for town game after game after game.


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## R.D.

> The lying thing: I never said I wasn't in a neighborhood but some people could not let it go that they fell for a ruse that was not intended for them to begin with even when explained to them. I specifically cautioned RD & Ayes not to say they were not in a neighborhood to further my move because of the lying being bad for town. Nuance is lost on some people. Even when I explained my Day 1 get people talking by being abrasive move, nobody bought it so why bother discussing things with them?
> 
> Too many people just cannot play as a town team. They have no appreciation for strategy, tactics, sacrifice, etc. There is too much sitting on their hands with their noses in the air. The people who offer little to nothing should be the most suspicious in a game, but here they are the most protected. It is just bad for town game after game after game.



This is true, because it's an ongoing learning process for a lot of us.  Others don't seem to care as long as they survive forgetting it's town V scum, not each man for himself.


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## Mertex

R.D. said:


> The lying thing: I never said I wasn't in a neighborhood but some people could not let it go that they fell for a ruse that was not intended for them to begin with even when explained to them. I specifically cautioned RD & Ayes not to say they were not in a neighborhood to further my move because of the lying being bad for town. Nuance is lost on some people. Even when I explained my Day 1 get people talking by being abrasive move, nobody bought it so why bother discussing things with them?
> 
> Too many people just cannot play as a town team. They have no appreciation for strategy, tactics, sacrifice, etc. There is too much sitting on their hands with their noses in the air. The people who offer little to nothing should be the most suspicious in a game, but here they are the most protected. It is just bad for town game after game after game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is true, because it's an ongoing learning process for a lot of us.  Others don't seem to care as long as they survive forgetting it's town V scum, not each man for himself.
Click to expand...


Exactly, but how do we get that across to players?  It appears that after a few games, some still don't get it.


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## Wolfsister77

Here's the deal. It depends on your role. If you are scum, you better believe you will be trying to stay alive as long as possible. You will try to keep your team mates alive also. If you are a town PR, your best strategy is to try to stay alive so you can use your PR to help take out scum. If you are a VT, you should be willing to sacrifice yourself if necessary. However, that does not mean you should roll over and not defend yourself. A dead townie instead of a dead scum still hurts town. Play to your win condition. Like Wake says, fight the good fight and don't give up.


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## Wolfsister77

Second point, town unity. This is hugely important and not working here at USMB so far. Game 2 it was a disaster. Game 3 it was a split over mebelle-NL vs mislynch. As scum, I was perfectly happy with that. Town is concentrating on that and not me. One of the reason I took out Grandma is she's a unifier for town. And that's exactly what townies need to do to beat scum. Unify. The times town was able to do that made me nervous. So that's when scum will try to cause chaos. So these are things that have to be thought about going forward.


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## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> Second point, town unity. This is hugely important and not working here at USMB so far. Game 2 it was a disaster. Game 3 it was a split over mebelle-NL vs mislynch. As scum, I was perfectly happy with that. Town is concentrating on that and not me. One of the reason I took out Grandma is she's a unifier for town. And that's exactly what townies need to do to beat scum. Unify. The times town was able to do that made me nervous. So that's when scum will try to cause chaos. So these are things that have to be thought about going forward.



There are pluses and minuses.  Town being too keen on jumping anyone but themselves is why things like the mislynches are easy to pull off IMO.  what I sense is the lack of direction toward narrowing down suspects/analysis.  The mebelle ML was hideous in that so many people jumped on it without even questioning SR's sketchy logic.  That is part of why I was asking for people to stand on their own convictions--to get them thinking/analyzing instead of using others as a crutch.  Sure there will be bad calls, but you can make good use of those bad calls if people are actually giving reasons of their own.  If we even understood each other's thought process, it makes it possible to work in the same direction even if we disagree about tactics/conclusions.


----------



## Wake

Wolfsister77 said:


> It makes sense, change it up to avoid being read. I get that. But still over the top. Game related aggression would of been better.



That I understand, but there was quite a bit before that. Some players are very crappy. Shaitra was in that game, too, and noted the way that player was speaking to me when I had simply asked him questions. He was an ass without reason here and here. At times I respond to vitriolic trolling with silence, and other times I will respond with a bit in kind. 

The rules on trolling at the main site are very lax, because the rules change from game mod to game mod. I had initially reported his trolling to the game mod and staff, but they did nothing, so if they did nothing against that, they will do nothing against this.


----------



## CaféAuLait

sameech said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I had never lost until I came here either.  There are some very bizarre interpersonal and ego-sensitive dynamics at this site that trump game strategy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very true but I think ego and personalities occur in this game everywhere for example here's what someone said to Wake in a game he's in, not out of line really:
> 
> Don't fucking kid yourself. Nobody's worth more than a literal 100% confirmed town result. Clears > reads, despite what your ego might lead you to think.
> 
> Wake responded with this, which was over the top:
> 
> IS THAT THE ANGRY SWAMP EUNUCH I'M HEARING AGAIN? Maybe you should ask your girlfriend to pull that swamp crab out of your ass with a trusty FORCEPS. With its bulky pincer no longer clutching your throbbing dark meat, I reckon you'll start speaking with some vestige of civility again.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> it is beyond the level of flaming allowed IMO.  Some examples:
> 
> The I should play in the main thread the way I did in the QT post:  You cannot play in the mainthread the way we did in the QT because we could discuss things without interference, including specific players, plot ploys/plans, share information, etc also free of scum.
> 
> Someone acting like I claimed to have 'Expertise":  I have never claimed to be an expert, quite the opposite.  I have pointed out that I am still learning the game, but I at least take into account what other players are possibly doing.  It was one of the things I pointed out in my QT about SR--not being sure if she was playing off my rabble rousing or not.
> 
> The lying thing:  I never said I wasn't in a neighborhood but some people could not let it go that they fell for a ruse that was not intended for them to begin with even when explained to them.  I specifically cautioned RD & Ayes not to say they were not in a neighborhood to further my move because of the lying being bad for town.  Nuance is lost on some people.  Even when I explained my Day 1 get people talking by being abrasive move, nobody bought it so why bother discussing things with them?
> 
> Too many people just cannot play as a town team.  They have no appreciation for strategy, tactics, sacrifice, etc.  There is too much sitting on their hands with their noses in the air.   The people who offer little to nothing should be the most suspicious in a game, but here they are the most protected.  It is just bad for town game after game after game.
Click to expand...


The neighborhood thing was not the only thing you lied about.  In one breath you are calling me scum for not stating if I was in Grandma's neighborhood, all the while making it sound as if you were not in a neighborhood, not to mention you told your neighborhood not to mention theirs. But, I'm scummy because I won't reveal my neighbors or neighborhood? Do you see the issue there? Hypocrisy much? 

Your premise about Rosie's post was so far blown out of proportion it was not funny. The other issue is, Rosie's post was wrong, one of our neighbors had posted, I was not telling you such, since your behavior came off as scummy and not town. So, please don't sit there with your "_Too many people just cannot play as a town team_". Your play was highly anti-town.


----------



## Wake

Did you like the Neighborhood function?

I thought it was a neat twist.


----------



## Wolfsister77

The problem I had with the neighborhoods was there was 2 neighborhoods that were all town which basically made them masons that could talk 24/7. That with all the PR's that most everyone had, made it a hostile environment for a scum win. I do like the balance you put in with putting a redirector and a roleblocker in there and 4 scum which does make it much more balanced. I'm sure it isn't easy in a game that complex to balance everything. Still, IMO, seem weighted to town. But only slightly.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Wake said:


> Did you like the Neighborhood function?
> 
> I thought it was a neat twist.



It was cool, I believe we could probably benefit from it and have a smaller arena to out possible scum.

The first night I tracked Rosie was because of a post she made there, stating "Scum was in all neighborhoods". I thought this was a slip on her part.  I was wrong! LOL 

But I thought it was cool having ideas to bounce off one another.


----------



## sameech

CaféAuLait;9478740 said:
			
		

> The neighborhood thing was not the only thing you lied about.  In one breath you are calling me scum for not stating if I was in Grandma's neighborhood, all the while making it sound as if you were not in a neighborhood, not to mention you told your neighborhood not to mention theirs. But, I'm scummy because I won't reveal my neighbors or neighborhood? Do you see the issue there? Hypocrisy much?
> 
> Your premise about Rosie's post was so far blown out of proportion it was not funny. The other issue is, Rosie's post was wrong, one of our neighbors had posted, I was not telling you such, since your behavior came off as scummy and not town. So, please don't sit there with your "_Too many people just cannot play as a town team_". Your play was highly anti-town.



Never lied about being in a neighborhood, but thanks for proving my point.  No matter how many times you say I said I wasn't in a neighborhood, you are wrong every time.  Nobody in town knows anything but that which is in their role PM on Day 1, and they spend most of the game not knowing anything but that which they did except that which is objectively verifiable like votes, deaths, and mod provided info (though Wake has made the last part a bit sketchy).  Your assumptions are going to keep killing town if you expect people to only state that which they "know" and qualify everything they say because they must bow down before your judgment and not exercise their own.   What you call "hypocrisy" is that which I have learned is the best way to get the game moving.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Wolfsister77 said:


> The problem I had with the neighborhoods was there was 2 neighborhoods that were all town which basically made them masons that could talk 24/7. That with all the PR's that most everyone had, made it a hostile environment for a scum win. I do like the balance you put in with putting a redirector and a roleblocker in there and 4 scum which does make it much more balanced. I'm sure it isn't easy in a game that complex to balance everything. Still, IMO, seem weighted to town. But only slightly.



 It was not easy. It was measured, and TBH no one really knew who was or was not scum. I asked questions and put up  "reads" but they were not always my true reads in case I had scum in my neighborhood. It was not comfortable as it may seem, even if we all were town, we really did not know that.


----------



## Wake

At the main site Neighborhoods are seen as having little if any benefit in Town's favor. 

As the game goes on and people start dying, paranoia starts to grow and erupt in them.


----------



## Wolfsister77

You know one of the problems I had playing town was figuring out who to trust. You aren't going to be as likely to listen to someone if you think they might be scum. I knew you were not Sameech but others were suspicious of you. 

On the other side, as scum, I couldn't figure out how to post because I already knew who was who and had zero interest in sharing info. with town. And coming up with reads on who is town or scum is very difficult.

Both legitimate issues whether you are town or scum. I would love a civil discussion on play tactics and mafia theory.


----------



## Wake

My rule of thumb while playing Mafia is to trust no one.

Have a list with varying levels of suspiciousness. 

I've experienced and played enough as Scum to know that you can't trust the most trustworthy and honestest player in the game.


----------



## Wake

Wolfsister77 said:


> I would love a civil discussion on play tactics and mafia theory.



If you start the thread, you will have it.


----------



## CaféAuLait

sameech said:


> CaféAuLait;9478740 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The neighborhood thing was not the only thing you lied about.  In one breath you are calling me scum for not stating if I was in Grandma's neighborhood, all the while making it sound as if you were not in a neighborhood, not to mention you told your neighborhood not to mention theirs. But, I'm scummy because I won't reveal my neighbors or neighborhood? Do you see the issue there? Hypocrisy much?
> 
> Your premise about Rosie's post was so far blown out of proportion it was not funny. The other issue is, Rosie's post was wrong, one of our neighbors had posted, I was not telling you such, since your behavior came off as scummy and not town. So, please don't sit there with your "_Too many people just cannot play as a town team_". Your play was highly anti-town.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never lied about being in a neighborhood, but thanks for proving my point.  No matter how many times you say I said I wasn't in a neighborhood, you are wrong every time.  Nobody in town knows anything but that which is in their role PM on Day 1, and they spend most of the game not knowing anything but that which they did except that which is objectively verifiable like votes, deaths, and mod provided info (though Wake has made the last part a bit sketchy).  Your assumptions are going to keep killing town if you expect people to only state that which they "know" and qualify everything they say because they must bow down before your judgment and not exercise their own.   What you call "hypocrisy" is that which I have learned is the best way to get the game moving.
Click to expand...


You highly suggested you were not in a neighborhood, everyone can agree on that. Since you did that, it threw the neighborhood count off so we could figure out where scum might possible be. 

Did you or did you not call me scum on several occasions and tell me I was not town because I refused to answer your questions all the while YOU WERE doing the same and encouraging your neighbors to do the same, not mentioning they were in a neighborhood. 

Yes you did. 

Secondly,

You stated in several posts I said I had some crazy list I targeted you with, I never did and never stated such. Another lie on your part. This all read as scummy to me and others. 

You said:

_"Your assumptions are going to keep killing town if you expect people to only state that which they "know" and qualify everything" _

Whose *Ass*umptions started a wagon on me? Do tell, Sameech. You also stated I was buddying Grandma, the furthest thing from the truth- and then, had scum jump on that wagon you started on me too. 

What I call "hypocrisy" was just that. You said I was being ant-town and scum for not outing my neighborhood- all the while YOU were doing the same. 

///


----------



## Wolfsister77

CaféAuLait;9478820 said:
			
		

> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> The problem I had with the neighborhoods was there was 2 neighborhoods that were all town which basically made them masons that could talk 24/7. That with all the PR's that most everyone had, made it a hostile environment for a scum win. I do like the balance you put in with putting a redirector and a roleblocker in there and 4 scum which does make it much more balanced. I'm sure it isn't easy in a game that complex to balance everything. Still, IMO, seem weighted to town. But only slightly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It was not easy. It was measured, and TBH no one really knew who was or was not scum. I asked questions and put up  "reads" but they were not always my true reads in case I had scum in my neighborhood. It was not comfortable as it may seem, even if we all were town, we really did not know that.
Click to expand...




Wake said:


> At the main site Neighborhoods are seen as having little if any benefit in Town's favor.
> 
> As the game goes on and people start dying, paranoia starts to grow and erupt in them.



Good point and something I didn't consider. Since alignment isn't known, that can cause a lot of friction. I know it did in ours.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Wake said:


> At the main site Neighborhoods are seen as having little if any benefit in Town's favor.
> 
> As the game goes on and people start dying, paranoia starts to grow and erupt in them.



I can see that happening... I know I was paranoid, and I saw the same from my neighbors.


----------



## Wolfsister77

CaféAuLait;9478852 said:
			
		

> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CaféAuLait;9478740 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The neighborhood thing was not the only thing you lied about.  In one breath you are calling me scum for not stating if I was in Grandma's neighborhood, all the while making it sound as if you were not in a neighborhood, not to mention you told your neighborhood not to mention theirs. But, I'm scummy because I won't reveal my neighbors or neighborhood? Do you see the issue there? Hypocrisy much?
> 
> Your premise about Rosie's post was so far blown out of proportion it was not funny. The other issue is, Rosie's post was wrong, one of our neighbors had posted, I was not telling you such, since your behavior came off as scummy and not town. So, please don't sit there with your "_Too many people just cannot play as a town team_". Your play was highly anti-town.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never lied about being in a neighborhood, but thanks for proving my point.  No matter how many times you say I said I wasn't in a neighborhood, you are wrong every time.  Nobody in town knows anything but that which is in their role PM on Day 1, and they spend most of the game not knowing anything but that which they did except that which is objectively verifiable like votes, deaths, and mod provided info (though Wake has made the last part a bit sketchy).  Your assumptions are going to keep killing town if you expect people to only state that which they "know" and qualify everything they say because they must bow down before your judgment and not exercise their own.   What you call "hypocrisy" is that which I have learned is the best way to get the game moving.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You highly suggested you were not in a neighborhood, everyone can agree on that. Since you did that, it threw the neighborhood count off so we could figure out where scum might possible be.
> 
> Did you or did you not call me scum on several occasions and tell me I was not town because I refused to answer your questions all the while YOU WERE doing the same and encouraging your neighbors to do the same, not mentioning they were in a neighborhood.
> 
> Yes you did.
> 
> Secondly,
> 
> You stated in several posts I said I had some crazy list I targeted you with, I never did and never stated such. Another lie on your part. This all read as scummy to me and others.
> 
> You said:
> 
> _"Your assumptions are going to keep killing town if you expect people to only state that which they "know" and qualify everything" _
> 
> Whose *Ass*umptions started a wagon on me? Do tell, Sameech.* You also stated I was buddying Grandma, the furthest thing from the truth- and then, had scum jump on that wagon you started on me too. *
> 
> What I call "hypocrisy" was just that. You said I was being ant-town and scum for not outing my neighborhood- all the while YOU were doing the same.
> 
> ///
Click to expand...


I jumped on that right away using the same reasoning-buddying Grandma, just to see if it would go anywhere. When it didn't, I moved on.


----------



## Wake

This link is valuable.

It includes these.

A Beginner's Guide to being Awesome at Mafia
A Guide to Focusing on Scum and Getting them Lynched
A Beginner's Guide to Claiming
How to Win as Mafia: Calculated Inaction


----------



## CaféAuLait

That's totally cool Wolf. That was a great scummy move! Jump on something which is pushed over and over by a townie to keep the suspicion moving!


----------



## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> I jumped on that right away using the same reasoning-buddying Grandma, just to see if it would go anywhere. When it didn't, I moved on.



Yet that is what she was doing whether she was intending to or not and it is a recognized scum tactic.  The lack of inquiry in your Day 2 posts was your big tell.  Something to consider in the future if you are scum.  If nothing else, pretend to be confused, unsure, whatever after the mislynch or nightkill.  That is usually a hard read to break through in my experience, and usually effective for scum to get through a day's play as town usually won't lynch someone early who just isn't sure--at least at other places.  Here, who the hell knows.  People want you to roleclaim just so they can declare you a lying scum and lynch you anyway.  Just don't play the confused/unsure thing two days in a row.


----------



## Wake

It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.


----------



## Wolfsister77

Wake said:


> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.



Wow, WTF is that all about?


----------



## Wake

Wolfsister77 said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, WTF is that all about?
Click to expand...


I don't really understand it. Some want to stamp out the games here, for this reason or that. It won't work, because our games will get better, we'll all get better at playing, and more people will join on in to play.


----------



## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I jumped on that right away using the same reasoning-buddying Grandma, just to see if it would go anywhere. When it didn't, I moved on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yet that is what she was doing whether she was intending to or not and it is a recognized scum tactic.  The lack of inquiry in your Day 2 posts was your big tell.  Something to consider in the future if you are scum.  If nothing else, pretend to be confused, unsure, whatever after the mislynch or nightkill.  That is usually a hard read to break through in my experience, and usually effective for scum to get through a day's play as town usually won't lynch someone early who just isn't sure--at least at other places.  Here, who the hell knows.  People want you to roleclaim just so they can declare you a lying scum and lynch you anyway.  Just don't play the confused/unsure thing two days in a row.
Click to expand...


I figured that would be a give away when I didn't post for days when the whole mebelle mislynch vs NL was going on. That was gamble and I wasn't sure it would work. Mostly because I posted a lot in game 2 as town.

So yeah, I decided Day 3 to be more active and then all that guilty stuff went on and the darn hex. But I was going to post more to make up for it.

I'm certain I should of posted more Day 2, just wasn't expecting town to take so damn long to come to a decision.


----------



## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> You know one of the problems I had playing town was figuring out who to trust. You aren't going to be as likely to listen to someone if you think they might be scum. I knew you were not Sameech but others were suspicious of you.
> 
> On the other side, as scum, I couldn't figure out how to post because I already knew who was who and had zero interest in sharing info. with town. And coming up with reads on who is town or scum is very difficult.
> 
> Both legitimate issues whether you are town or scum. I would love a civil discussion on play tactics and mafia theory.



IMHO, it doesn't matter early on who you do or do not trust.  I take it all with a grain of salt, and say and do it all with a grain of salt.  the only time it really matters as town is when you are getting near the end.  Since we knew there was 1 more hood than most knew for certain, i knew there was a better chance than most knew that mine was clean.  In the end, however, I just worked the QT as best I could for town whether one of them was scum or not.  It was a calculated risk that would pan out in the end.   The worst case scenario was RD was scum and would mislynch me and then kill Ayes that night to stop her shot and neither of us would be alive to out RD, but town would have figured it out from the role posts that the last one in was scum.


----------



## Wolfsister77

Wake said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, WTF is that all about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it. Some want to stamp out the games here, for this reason or that. It won't work, because our games will get better, we'll all get better at playing, and more people will join on in to play.
Click to expand...


They will not succeed in stamping out the games. They live or die based on the players and we won't let them be destroyed like that.


----------



## sameech

Wake said:


> Did you like the Neighborhood function?
> 
> I thought it was a neat twist.



I probably would had liked it better had there been factions within town or something.  Hard to believe you didn't in a group this big.  I would have stuck in the 4th scum as a 2 shot-vig/SK who had to live until the end and scum had to win in order to win but not give them access to the scum QT at the very least.


----------



## Grandma

Wake said:


> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.



Any ideas on who it/they is/are?


----------



## CaféAuLait

sameech said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I jumped on that right away using the same reasoning-buddying Grandma, just to see if it would go anywhere. When it didn't, I moved on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Yet that is what she was doing whether she was intending to or not and it is a recognized scum tactic.*  The lack of inquiry in your Day 2 posts was your big tell.  Something to consider in the future if you are scum.  If nothing else, pretend to be confused, unsure, whatever after the mislynch or nightkill.  That is usually a hard read to break through in my experience, and usually effective for scum to get through a day's play as town usually won't lynch someone early who just isn't sure--at least at other places.  Here, who the hell knows.  People want you to roleclaim just so they can declare you a lying scum and lynch you anyway.  Just don't play the confused/unsure thing two days in a row.
Click to expand...



My posting I was suspicious of you is not buddying, I did not even address Grandma personally. I saw a post *Mertex* put up and I thought she may be right and commented on her post.  Buddying is being overtly nice to someone, or subtly nice to someone.  Because you had some ridiculous reason to be suspicious because of Rosie's post ( which was wrong)  and kept jumping on me for 11 days straight was silly IMO. You did not even give me a chance to try to play the game with accusation after accusation, in fact 11 days of accusations. I'm unsure if you decided I was town who was expendable and wanted to lynch me or not. I may not have had a great PR, but I had one which could have helped if I had been able to concentrate on the game and not your ranting. 

Your posts in your QT were much more reasonable. I saw you post you somewhere, saying you can't post this way on the forum, but what you fail to realize your erratic play on the forum made it so, even if you were headed in the right direction, it would be hard for many to agree with you. You made claims such as you fought against Ropey being lynched when you did not, this again came off as scummy. It was your erratic play on the forum which had many question your helpfulness to the game. Your neighbors may have understood your reasoning as it sounded more sane in your QT, the forum however, you came off as someone not to look to for wisdom.


Edit I was wrong, I actually quoted FA_Q2 post.


----------



## sameech

Grandma said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any ideas on who it/they is/are?
Click to expand...


Only thing I could find is that it says the person who starts a thread can add the tags, and possibly others, which is no help.  I think google custom search tries to assign tags based on content going on what I have read about it, depending on what set up the site has though.


----------



## Wake

All of those are interesting ideas, and in the future I would like to try them all. There was a game I played with 7 factions and various alliances, and it was fascinating. One monstrosity of a game I'm planning for the future elsewhere will be comprised of 40 players, multiples lynches per day, more than 7 factions, alliances that can be made and broken at will with their own protections and consequences, Neighborhoods, reviving players thanks to Scum or Town Necromancers, and 3 new players entering the storm every 3 Days. I need to put more effort into the encompassing subtleties of flavor text, and work in roles along those lines, like Flavor Cops.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Grandma said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any ideas on who it/they is/are?
Click to expand...


I suppose it can't be turned off in this forum only?


----------



## Wake

Grandma said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any ideas on who it/they is/are?
Click to expand...


I have inklings, but nothing provable.


----------



## sameech

CaféAuLait;9479181 said:
			
		

> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I jumped on that right away using the same reasoning-buddying Grandma, just to see if it would go anywhere. When it didn't, I moved on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Yet that is what she was doing whether she was intending to or not and it is a recognized scum tactic.*  The lack of inquiry in your Day 2 posts was your big tell.  Something to consider in the future if you are scum.  If nothing else, pretend to be confused, unsure, whatever after the mislynch or nightkill.  That is usually a hard read to break through in my experience, and usually effective for scum to get through a day's play as town usually won't lynch someone early who just isn't sure--at least at other places.  Here, who the hell knows.  People want you to roleclaim just so they can declare you a lying scum and lynch you anyway.  Just don't play the confused/unsure thing two days in a row.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> My posting I was suspicious of you is not buddying, I did not even address Grandma personally. I saw a post *Mertex* put up and I thought she may be right and commented on her post.  Buddying is being overtly nice to someone, or subtly nice to someone.  Because you had some ridiculous reason to be suspicious because of Rosie's post ( which was wrong)  and kept jumping on me for 11 days straight was silly IMO. You did not even give me a chance to try to play the game with accusation after accusation, in fact 11 days of accusations. I'm unsure if you decided I was town who was expendable and wanted to lynch me or not. I may not have had a great PR, but I had one which could have helped if I had been able to concentrate on the game and not your ranting.
> 
> Your posts in your QT were much more reasonable. I saw you post you somewhere, saying you can't post this way on the forum, but what you fail to realize your erratic play on the forum made it so, even if you were headed in the right direction, it would be hard for many to agree with you. You made claims such as you fought against Ropey being lynched when you did not, this again came off as scummy. It was your erratic play on the forum which had many question your helpfulness to the game. Your neighbors may have understood your reasoning as it sounded more sane in your QT, the forum however, you came off as someone not to look to for wisdom.
Click to expand...


what you consider erratic doesn't concern me.  I pointed out very early that town was wasting time on me and ropey and they could come back to us.  I pointed out that ropey was likely town on more than 1 occasion.  when ropey and wolf went up against each other I was was just done with Ropey.  What you consider fighting and what I consider fighting for someone apparently are two different things.


----------



## CaféAuLait

I recall you saying that a few hours into the game. You even offered Ropey up as a *safe town lynch*. His role was a redirector. He was not a safe lynch at all. And this was stated before the drama really got rolling with Ropey and Wolfy. 

Why it is you think people won't perceive this as scummy, offering up others for lynching, or do you think we should all assume hours into the game that you are correct in your assumptions?


----------



## Wake

Mafia is so complex that it literally has various schools of thought on gameplay.


----------



## sameech

CaféAuLait;9479264 said:
			
		

> I recall you saying that a few hours into the game. You even offered Ropey up as a *safe town lynch*. His role was a redirector. He was not a safe lynch at all. And this was stated before the drama really got rolling with Ropey and Wolfy.
> 
> Why it is you think people won't perceive this as scummy, offering up others for lynching, or do you think we should all assume hours into the game that you are correct in your assumptions?



A redirector role in Ropey's hands made them the best town mislynch.  despite what you and Grandma think, there is virtue in killing off VT's and in a game like this, it was pretty obvious that there would be a boatload of weak PR's.  I even pointed that out early on--pretty much any townie who died was going to have some sort of power.


----------



## CaféAuLait

sameech said:


> CaféAuLait;9479264 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I recall you saying that a few hours into the game. You even offered Ropey up as a *safe town lynch*. His role was a redirector. He was not a safe lynch at all. And this was stated before the drama really got rolling with Ropey and Wolfy.
> 
> Why it is you think people won't perceive this as scummy, offering up others for lynching, or do you think we should all assume hours into the game that you are correct in your assumptions?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A redirector role in Ropey's hands made them the best town mislynch.  despite what you and Grandma think, there is virtue in killing off VT's and in a game like this, it was pretty obvious that there would be a boatload of weak PR's.  I even pointed that out early on--pretty much any townie who died was going to have some sort of power.
Click to expand...


And again, you made the claim he was a safe town lynch before the huge drama occurred. You did not know he was a redirector, I believe you assumed he was some VT when you made that statement. As far as stating he may not have known what to do with that PR is ridiculous IMO. We have no clue as to how the game would have continued without the drama. Before Ropey went, he was sure Wolfy was scum. Maybe he would have used that PR wisely. Who knows?


----------



## Wolfsister77

CaféAuLait;9479396 said:
			
		

> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CaféAuLait;9479264 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I recall you saying that a few hours into the game. You even offered Ropey up as a *safe town lynch*. His role was a redirector. He was not a safe lynch at all. And this was stated before the drama really got rolling with Ropey and Wolfy.
> 
> Why it is you think people won't perceive this as scummy, offering up others for lynching, or do you think we should all assume hours into the game that you are correct in your assumptions?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A redirector role in Ropey's hands made them the best town mislynch.  despite what you and Grandma think, there is virtue in killing off VT's and in a game like this, it was pretty obvious that there would be a boatload of weak PR's.  I even pointed that out early on--pretty much any townie who died was going to have some sort of power.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And again, you made the claim he was a safe town lynch before the huge drama occurred. You did not know he was a redirector, I believe you assumed he was some VT when you made that statement. As far as stating he may not have known what to do with that PR is ridiculous IMO. We have no clue as to how the game would have continued without the drama. Before Ropey went, he was sure Wolfy was scum. Maybe he would have used that PR wisely. Who knows?
Click to expand...


He did suspect me of being scum which is why I went for the kill so to speak to get him lynched. He wouldn't leave me alone and had to go. Some of the chaos was me doing it. A town redirector could of been useful if he knew who the scum PR's are or if he had some way of redirecting the scum NK to known scum but that probably wouldn't of been useful until much later in the game. In the beginning he could of for example, redirected Luissa who was investigating me to someone else and gotten an innocent on me which would of hurt town.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Wolfsister77 said:


> CaféAuLait;9479396 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> A redirector role in Ropey's hands made them the best town mislynch.  despite what you and Grandma think, there is virtue in killing off VT's and in a game like this, it was pretty obvious that there would be a boatload of weak PR's.  I even pointed that out early on--pretty much any townie who died was going to have some sort of power.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And again, you made the claim he was a safe town lynch before the huge drama occurred. You did not know he was a redirector, I believe you assumed he was some VT when you made that statement. As far as stating he may not have known what to do with that PR is ridiculous IMO. We have no clue as to how the game would have continued without the drama. Before Ropey went, he was sure Wolfy was scum. Maybe he would have used that PR wisely. Who knows?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He did suspect me of being scum which is why I went for the kill so to speak to get him lynched. He wouldn't leave me alone and had to go. Some of the chaos was me doing it. A town redirector could of been useful if he knew who the scum PR's are or if he had some way of redirecting the scum NK to known scum but that probably wouldn't of been useful until much later in the game. In the beginning he could of for example, redirected Luissa who was investigating me to someone else and gotten an innocent on me which would of hurt town.
Click to expand...


He may have messed it up, as sure as I could have messed it up. We are new. But at least we need to be able to learn the game to not make mistakes. We can't assume we need to kill someone because they won't do the correct thing with a PR. It seems a bit of a crazy thing to me. If this is the case, then the reasoning should be any newbie with a suspected PR should be killed since we might screw it up. Know what I mean??


----------



## Wolfsister77

CaféAuLait;9479541 said:
			
		

> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CaféAuLait;9479396 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And again, you made the claim he was a safe town lynch before the huge drama occurred. You did not know he was a redirector, I believe you assumed he was some VT when you made that statement. As far as stating he may not have known what to do with that PR is ridiculous IMO. We have no clue as to how the game would have continued without the drama. Before Ropey went, he was sure Wolfy was scum. Maybe he would have used that PR wisely. Who knows?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He did suspect me of being scum which is why I went for the kill so to speak to get him lynched. He wouldn't leave me alone and had to go. Some of the chaos was me doing it. A town redirector could of been useful if he knew who the scum PR's are or if he had some way of redirecting the scum NK to known scum but that probably wouldn't of been useful until much later in the game. In the beginning he could of for example, redirected Luissa who was investigating me to someone else and gotten an innocent on me which would of hurt town.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He may have messed it up, as sure as I could have messed it up. We are new. But at least we need to be able to learn the game to not make mistakes. We can't assume we need to kill someone because they won't do the correct thing with a PR. It seems a bit of a crazy thing to me. If this is the case, then the reasoning should be any newbie with a suspected PR should be killed since we might screw it up. Know what I mean??
Click to expand...


Oh I agree, all PR's are useful, there should be no reason for a townie to offer up another townie before knowing what they are and certainly not once they are found to have a PR. Once I found that out, I escalated to get him out ASAP. Not that it was that difficult because  he was basically a PL anyway. One which, at the time Sameech helped with quite aggressively, and then later recognized my moves as a scum tactic.


----------



## CaféAuLait

Wolfsister77 said:


> CaféAuLait;9479541 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> He did suspect me of being scum which is why I went for the kill so to speak to get him lynched. He wouldn't leave me alone and had to go. Some of the chaos was me doing it. A town redirector could of been useful if he knew who the scum PR's are or if he had some way of redirecting the scum NK to known scum but that probably wouldn't of been useful until much later in the game. In the beginning he could of for example, redirected Luissa who was investigating me to someone else and gotten an innocent on me which would of hurt town.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He may have messed it up, as sure as I could have messed it up. We are new. But at least we need to be able to learn the game to not make mistakes. We can't assume we need to kill someone because they won't do the correct thing with a PR. It seems a bit of a crazy thing to me. If this is the case, then the reasoning should be any newbie with a suspected PR should be killed since we might screw it up. Know what I mean??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh I agree, all PR's are useful, there should be no reason for a townie to offer up another townie before knowing what they are and certainly not once they are found to have a PR. Once I found that out, I escalated to get him out ASAP. Not that it was that difficult because  he was basically a PL anyway. One which, at the time Sameech helped with quite aggressively, and then later recognized my moves as a scum tactic.
Click to expand...


Yeah. I agree it was a PL. But the way Sameech wrote it above, one would think he was offering up Ropey because of the drama, that was not the case, he offered up Ropey _before_ all the drama and  in fact reiterated his own "Vanillaness" , something which read as scummy.  Sameech's last words a few posts before the lynch of Ropey was to once again state Ropey was scum as well as me. Then Sameech claimed he tried to save Ropey following the lynch and this came off as dishonest when reading back.  This flip-flopping on his part is what I refer to as erratic play. 

You done good!  At first I was convinced it was Mani who was scum in your neighborhood, and not you. I did not figure it out, until a little before the _kerfuffle _  which ended the game.


----------



## Wolfsister77

CaféAuLait;9479687 said:
			
		

> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CaféAuLait;9479541 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He may have messed it up, as sure as I could have messed it up. We are new. But at least we need to be able to learn the game to not make mistakes. We can't assume we need to kill someone because they won't do the correct thing with a PR. It seems a bit of a crazy thing to me. If this is the case, then the reasoning should be any newbie with a suspected PR should be killed since we might screw it up. Know what I mean??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I agree, all PR's are useful, there should be no reason for a townie to offer up another townie before knowing what they are and certainly not once they are found to have a PR. Once I found that out, I escalated to get him out ASAP. Not that it was that difficult because  he was basically a PL anyway. One which, at the time Sameech helped with quite aggressively, and then later recognized my moves as a scum tactic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah. I agree it was a PL. But the way Sameech wrote it above, one would think he was offering up Ropey because of the drama, that was not the case, he offered up Ropey _before_ all the drama and  in fact reiterated his own "Vanillaness" , something which read as scummy.  Sameech's last words a few posts before the lynch of Ropey was to once again state Ropey was scum as well as me. Then Sameech claimed he tried to save Ropey following the lynch and this came off as dishonest when reading back.  This flip-flopping on his part is what I refer to as erratic play.
> 
> You done good!  At first I was convinced it was Mani who was scum in your neighborhood, and not you. I did not figure it out, until a little before the _kerfuffle _  which ended the game.
Click to expand...


Thanks, that neighborhood stuff was tough to deal with because I slipped and called Ropey an idiot so I had to cover that up somehow and I decided to verify mani's version of events and make Ropey look like a liar about neighborhood QT's and then, on top of him outing us right away, and then all the drama crap, he was gone. I think if I would of posted more townie posts and not gotten the investigation result which is not what set me off, that was fun BTW, I think it would of gone better. Still, we were doing o.k. until all that went down. Who knows how it would of turned out? Mertex probably would of made it to the end and maybe TN if he stepped it up but I already said in the QT that I didn't expect to and I didn't think ZZZX would either due to not even paying attention to the game which sucked for our team also.

Still, despite it all, it was fun.

I had a lot of fun playing scum and a lot of fun playing town. Not sure which role I like best yet. Probably would help if I could finish a game.


----------



## Grandma

Wake said:


> Grandma said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any ideas on who it/they is/are?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have inklings, but nothing provable.
Click to expand...


Shoot me a PM. I have some ideas too.


----------



## sameech

CaféAuLait;9479687 said:
			
		

> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CaféAuLait;9479541 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He may have messed it up, as sure as I could have messed it up. We are new. But at least we need to be able to learn the game to not make mistakes. We can't assume we need to kill someone because they won't do the correct thing with a PR. It seems a bit of a crazy thing to me. If this is the case, then the reasoning should be any newbie with a suspected PR should be killed since we might screw it up. Know what I mean??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I agree, all PR's are useful, there should be no reason for a townie to offer up another townie before knowing what they are and certainly not once they are found to have a PR. Once I found that out, I escalated to get him out ASAP. Not that it was that difficult because  he was basically a PL anyway. One which, at the time Sameech helped with quite aggressively, and then later recognized my moves as a scum tactic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah. I agree it was a PL. But the way Sameech wrote it above, one would think he was offering up Ropey because of the drama, that was not the case, he offered up Ropey _before_ all the drama and  in fact reiterated his own "Vanillaness" , something which read as scummy.  Sameech's last words a few posts before the lynch of Ropey was to once again state Ropey was scum as well as me. Then Sameech claimed he tried to save Ropey following the lynch and this came off as dishonest when reading back.  This flip-flopping on his part is what I refer to as erratic play.
> 
> You done good!  At first I was convinced it was Mani who was scum in your neighborhood, and not you. I did not figure it out, until a little before the _kerfuffle _  which ended the game.
Click to expand...


Then you need top reread the thread.  I did not agree to vote on Ropey until after the drama.  Your interpretation of events are lacking to say the least.  You voted for me until you found out that I was in a neighborhood and then act like I somehow used an alleged lie to my advantage.  Having someone voting for me is not exactly to my advantage.



Grandma said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Grandma said:
> 
> 
> 
> Any ideas on who it/they is/are?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have inklings, but nothing provable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Shoot me a PM. I have some ideas too.
Click to expand...


US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum - FAQ: General Forum Usage


----------



## Grandma

Sameech - I meant suspects. I have an FoS list. 

Maybe instead of bringing USMB into the game, maybe we should bring the game to USMB...


----------



## sameech

Grandma said:


> Sameech - I meant suspects. I have an FoS list.
> 
> Maybe instead of bringing USMB into the game, maybe we should bring the game to USMB...



I know what you meant, but I cannot edit those tags.  Perhaps you can.  When this came up in game 3, I looked at some of the tags here and some on other threads and concluded that many of them appeared to have been google analytics trying to create tags from pieces of posts just based on specific unique words or phrases that were used in the threads--like the tag about shooting your monitor appeared after we started discussing this and comes from a post Wake made.  The Kit Kat Klub one also comes from a post.   I could posit a theory about who is doing it, if it can be done, other than Wake, but so far, I have no basis to believe it could be done.


----------



## Mertex

Wake said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like someone's still trolling with the search tags.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, WTF is that all about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it. Some want to stamp out the games here, for this reason or that. It won't work, because our games will get better, we'll all get better at playing, and more people will join on in to play.
Click to expand...


I just never scroll that far down....and if you hadn't mentioned it I wouldn't have noticed...just like other foolish things...best thing is to just ignore it.  Making note of it just encourages more of it.  We already have an idea who is doing it.....and that type of behavior is no different than when they were here....


----------



## Grandma

None of those terms are appropriate search terms. I deal with googlebots on my own site, they don't work this way. Someone's manipulating them.


----------



## CaféAuLait

sameech said:


> CaféAuLait;9479687 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I agree, all PR's are useful, there should be no reason for a townie to offer up another townie before knowing what they are and certainly not once they are found to have a PR. Once I found that out, I escalated to get him out ASAP. Not that it was that difficult because  he was basically a PL anyway. One which, at the time Sameech helped with quite aggressively, and then later recognized my moves as a scum tactic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah. I agree it was a PL. But the way Sameech wrote it above, one would think he was offering up Ropey because of the drama, that was not the case, he offered up Ropey _before_ all the drama and  in fact reiterated his own "Vanillaness" , something which read as scummy.  Sameech's last words a few posts before the lynch of Ropey was to once again state Ropey was scum as well as me. Then Sameech claimed he tried to save Ropey following the lynch and this came off as dishonest when reading back.  This flip-flopping on his part is what I refer to as erratic play.
> 
> You done good!  At first I was convinced it was Mani who was scum in your neighborhood, and not you. I did not figure it out, until a little before the _kerfuffle _  which ended the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then you need top reread the thread.  I did not agree to vote on Ropey until after the drama.  Your interpretation of events are lacking to say the least.  You voted for me until you found out that I was in a neighborhood and then act like I somehow used an alleged lie to my advantage.  Having someone voting for me is not exactly to my advantage.
> 
> 
> 
> Grandma said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have inklings, but nothing provable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Shoot me a PM. I have some ideas too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum - FAQ: General Forum Usage
Click to expand...


You said Ropey was "number 1" on your scum list 75 posts into the thread, _before_ the drama started. Then you voted OMGUS on Scarlet Rage and continued to call Ropey scum. Then you said Ropey would be a good safe mis-lynch since he had no real PR and offered him up for lynching. All before the serious drama got started. Then you voted for him and lynched him _after_ the drama started. In Twilight, _before_ his lynch you  _still_ stated he was scum. In day two you said you fought to save Ropey and no one would listen to you. 

I voted for you because at first I honestly thought you were scum, dividing town and accusing everybody and their brother of either being scum or lying and misstating facts to mislead.  It took me a bit to realize you were town and this was your erratic style of play- it had nothing to do with you being in a neighborhood.


----------



## Wolfsister77

The search tags in game 2 were vicious. I am almost certain of who was doing it then because that person was trolling the game as a non-player. Now, I don't know if it is the same person or someone else.

The Ropey thing at the time, Sameech did vote for him after he started all his mean spirited remarks but before things escalated. He tried to get others to do so too. Later, he used it against me saying I was responsible for Ropey's lynch and knew what I was doing.


----------



## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> CaféAuLait;9479687 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I agree, all PR's are useful, there should be no reason for a townie to offer up another townie before knowing what they are and certainly not once they are found to have a PR. Once I found that out, I escalated to get him out ASAP. Not that it was that difficult because  he was basically a PL anyway. One which, at the time Sameech helped with quite aggressively, and then later recognized my moves as a scum tactic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah. I agree it was a PL. But the way Sameech wrote it above, one would think he was offering up Ropey because of the drama, that was not the case, he offered up Ropey _before_ all the drama and  in fact reiterated his own "Vanillaness" , something which read as scummy.  Sameech's last words a few posts before the lynch of Ropey was to once again state Ropey was scum as well as me. Then Sameech claimed he tried to save Ropey following the lynch and this came off as dishonest when reading back.  This flip-flopping on his part is what I refer to as erratic play.
> 
> You done good!  At first I was convinced it was Mani who was scum in your neighborhood, and not you. I did not figure it out, until a little before the _kerfuffle _  which ended the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then you need top reread the thread.  I did not agree to vote on Ropey until after the drama.  Your interpretation of events are lacking to say the least.  You voted for me until you found out that I was in a neighborhood and then act like I somehow used an alleged lie to my advantage.  Having someone voting for me is not exactly to my advantage.
> 
> 
> 
> Grandma said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have inklings, but nothing provable.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Shoot me a PM. I have some ideas too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum - FAQ: General Forum Usage
Click to expand...


So this is saying others can add and remove tags including who started the thread. I wonder if Wake could remove them?


----------



## Wake

I've tried removing them last night, but couldn't. PM'd Staff awhile back and they weren't able to be removed, which is fine. I have no idea how to add them, or manipulate them, and no interest in doing so.


----------



## Wolfsister77

I tried finding out how to manipulate them also and realized it wasn't worth the effort because the person doing it would continue and it can't be proven anyway. 

So we can just ignore them.


----------



## Grandma

It can be proven.


----------



## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> I tried finding out how to manipulate them also and realized it wasn't worth the effort because the person doing it would continue and it can't be proven anyway.
> 
> So we can just ignore them.



You can.  My guess is that if the person who starts a thread tags it up pretty good though, there will be less likely the chance more tags will be stuck on, but who knows.


----------



## Wake

It's just pathetic that some people would stoop to trying to destroy or spirit and morale with these games. These games will only get better over time.  

Wolfie et al, if you guys want I'll teach you everything you need to know to make and run your own games. I want to play too, you know.


----------



## Wolfsister77

Wake said:


> It's just pathetic that some people would stoop to trying to destroy or spirit and morale with these games. These games will only get better over time.
> 
> Wolfie et al, if you guys want I'll teach you everything you need to know to make and run your own games. I want to play too, you know.



I'd be happy to mod one so you can play Wake. You'll have to teach me a few things and I'll need to get mod powers here, but sure. It would be fun.


----------



## Wake

The next game I'm planning to host is Fire and Ice Mafia.

If you'd like, you could be the Co-Mod, and I can show you the ropes.

*The process of making and running games is far easier than playing. Only when they start getting huge and complicated does it take more focus.


----------



## Wolfsister77

Wake said:


> The next game I'm planning to host is Fire and Ice Mafia.
> 
> If you'd like, you could be the Co-Mod, and I can show you the ropes.
> 
> *The process of making and running games is far easier than playing. Only when they start getting huge and complicated does it take more focus.



Yes, I'll be your co-mod. Let's start there.


----------



## sameech

[MENTION=44124]Wake[/MENTION] is there a reason you tagged me in this game today?  I assume it was today as that is when I got the notice.


----------



## Wake

Yes. I tag players past and present to current games, including others. I like being inclusive while promoting the games.


----------



## sameech

Wake said:


> Yes. I tag players past and present to current games, including others. I like being inclusive while promoting the games.



Fair enough.  I thought maybe you were paging the Hostage Rescue team to go in and save those poor souls from dying of boredom in that concentration camp you call Game #4


----------



## ScarletRage

Can I host next Wake?


----------



## Wake

You don't need to ask, Titus. 

I could use a break, too. 

EDIT: You would need to ask CK. I know that you have as much if not more Mafia experience than I do.

 [MENTION=36528]cereal_killer[/MENTION], would it be alright if Scarlet hosts a Mafia game? She has a ton of experience playing and running them.


----------



## sameech

Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.


----------



## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.



You should host a game here but not that one. Grandma or Cafe would modkill you in about 5 minutes just for the pleasure of it, even if that means you win.


----------



## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should host a game here but not that one. Grandma or Cafe would modkill you in about 5 minutes just for the pleasure of it, even if that means you win.
Click to expand...


Rosie would.  Cafe would struggle hard to decide if she wanted me to win--the game could last years 

No interest in modding.  I was just kidding.   I would be inclined to underandomize to a lot of players expectations.  If I did a theme game for instance with the White House.  I would want the POTUS to be a bad ass townie, not scum, not a VT, instead of having an intern being the bad ass townie.


----------



## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should host a game here but not that one. Grandma or Cafe would modkill you in about 5 minutes just for the pleasure of it, even if that means you win.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rosie would.  Cafe would struggle hard to decide if she wanted me to win--the game could last years
> 
> No interest in modding.  I was just kidding.   I would be inclined to underandomize to a lot of players expectations.  If I did a theme game for instance with the White House.  I would want the POTUS to be a bad ass townie, not scum, not a VT, instead of having an intern being the bad ass townie.
Click to expand...


That would be fun. These games need something to spice them up a bit. I think you'd be a good mod quite honestly, and that is coming from someone who would play in a game you modded even knowing you wouldn't tolerate any crap.


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## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should host a game here but not that one. Grandma or Cafe would modkill you in about 5 minutes just for the pleasure of it, even if that means you win.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rosie would.  Cafe would struggle hard to decide if she wanted me to win--the game could last years
> 
> No interest in modding.  I was just kidding.   I would be inclined to underandomize to a lot of players expectations.  If I did a theme game for instance with the White House.  I would want the POTUS to be a bad ass townie, not scum, not a VT, instead of having an intern being the bad ass townie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That would be fun. These games need something to spice them up a bit. I think you'd be a good mod quite honestly, and that is coming from someone who would play in a game you modded even knowing you wouldn't tolerate any crap.
Click to expand...


I actually tolerate more crap than most would--I just wouldn't put myself in the game at all.  I would never answer a question other than "When does the day end" and "What is the vote count".  Beyond that, the players just need to fight it out/figure it out amongst themselves rightly or wrongly.


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## manifold

sameech said:


> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.


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## Avatar4321

sameech said:


> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.



So essentially we all win just by ignoring the thread and letting you prattle on. I can live with that.


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## sameech

manifold said:


> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.
Click to expand...




Avatar4321 said:


> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> Shoot I want to host a game now.  The set up will be simple:  All the players will be moderators and I will be the Jester and I get to be as obnoxious as I want to be and when someone modkills me I automatically win.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So essentially we all win just by ignoring the thread and letting you prattle on. I can live with that.
Click to expand...


You two seem to be doing a lot of tandem posting recently, almost like one of you is a sock for the other or something.


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## Wake

They're not.

Please don't insinuate that, Sameech.


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## Wolfsister77

Mani is always that way Sameech. He's a dick to everyone and proud of it.  

Avi is a really good person who I like a lot. Heck, I like them both. But Avi doesn't have it in him to be like mani. No way are they socks.


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