# My Game Change



## Wake

From this point on I'm enacting Zone 1 USMB rules in the games I host.

Your voice counts. Please discuss if you wish.


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## Moonglow

that means we can discuss your toenail fungi??


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## Grandma

Crap, now I have to go read the rules...


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## Avatar4321

Grandma said:


> Crap, now I have to go read the rules...



I don't. Dont know what they are but i havent broken one in the 10 years i've been here.

I just realized ive been here way too long


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## FA_Q2

Has it really gotten that bad in game 2?  I am a day behind but it seems to me that people are being overly sensitive for absolutely no reason and that zone 1 rules is a WAAAAAY overkill in this scenario.  Poking is almost required from the way I read the game &#8211; it&#8217;s part of the mental side of the strategy.  Take that away and you end up with very little to work with.

Sometimes a well-placed fuck you might be in order 


Your game though and we will, of course, play to the rules that you set.


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## Wake

Provocation and antagonism are excellent tools in Mafia, and can be used with Zone 1 rules.

It becomes a problem when it becomes personal. However, you can attack a player's arguments and cases as viciously and violently as you want. Attack, provoke, and antagonize players BY refuting their posts, dumping suspicion on them, applying pressure, etc. Attack positions and posts, not players. I can dunk someone into a pressure cooker without flinging one insult. 

If you call a player a "faggot," or whatever while playing the game, that's crap. But if you find a half-dozen or more loose threads sticking out in a player's posts, and you grasp and slowly start to unravel them, that REALLY gets a response, and can make the player nervous. My skin can be incredibly think, so I shrug it off (I toilet hostile clients for a living, et al). Start taking my posts and game-related intentions though... and I'll be forced to play the game by refuting, accusing, and reading.


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## Moonglow

Can we call them faggots if they are the town arsonist?


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## R.D.

Wake, really.  No one thinks they crossed a line. You need to be a firm host or forget it.  Make rules, stick with them

-I liked mani's suggestion about days being Mon to Thurs.  Friday starts night and Monday day again.

-Another rule  I like many boards use are posting expectations.   For example everyone most post at least every 36 to 72 hours.

-Another is only players are able to participate.  Period.

-one you seem to be pushing, and I agree with, strictly stay within the game when posting.   No BS about the other forums, members or politics.  Plus RL is not a weapon to be used.  

Just my two cents


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## Avatar4321

I see no reason why we can't kindly kill one another. We are playing a game.


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## Wolfsister77

I think zone 1 is fine because it will stop the BS that hurt this game. JMO

We can still go after each other with game related tactics in zone 1.

And without the other crap, it'll be a lot more fun for everyone.

I know it will be for me.


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## RosieS

I think flexibility with the rules is important as we are still learning this game and some are learning each others' way of posting.

One of the things they pointed out as very important at the main Mafia site is that you have to trust the people you play with. Plot to kill them, sure, but trust is crucial for the game to proceed smoothly.

Regards from Rosie


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## sameech

Wolfsister77 said:


> I think zone 1 is fine because it will stop the BS that hurt this game. JMO
> 
> We can still go after each other with game related tactics in zone 1.
> 
> And without the other crap, it'll be a lot more fun for everyone.
> 
> I know it will be for me.



I couldn't make it long without calling someone an idiot.  I really see no way that Zone 1 would allow any trash talk whatsoever, and in a big game, trash talk might come in handy as Please and Thank You just don't illicit the same level of "Talk you scummy bastard or I will wrap barbed wire around your throat and wring your pencil neck".  Just saying ......


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## Wolfsister77

sameech said:


> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think zone 1 is fine because it will stop the BS that hurt this game. JMO
> 
> We can still go after each other with game related tactics in zone 1.
> 
> And without the other crap, it'll be a lot more fun for everyone.
> 
> I know it will be for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I couldn't make it long without calling someone an idiot.  I really see no way that Zone 1 would allow any trash talk whatsoever, and in a big game, trash talk might come in handy as Please and Thank You just don't illicit the same level of "Talk you scummy bastard or I will wrap barbed wire around your throat and wring your pencil neck".  Just saying ......
Click to expand...


I think you can say all that in zone 1. I don't think the mods are gonna crack down on game related trash talk.

I think this is in response to personal insults, trolling, flaming that goes beyond the normal game stuff, off topic stuff things being brought into the game, etc. that would be cracked down upon anywhere the game is played I would think.

Of course Wake and the mods here at USMB would have to clarify.


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## Wake

I don't want to have to deal with another drama-fest like the crap you find downstairs. Personal insults, trolling and flaming I don't want to see in our games any more. It's complicated enough accidentally killing other crazed, paranoid Townies while the Scum laugh their evil butts off. 

If it's not related to our game, I don't want to see it. If I'm a Townie trying to lynch Larry, I don't want to hear him go on a personal tangent about something completely different. 

Putting down the fine line is, well, a fine line. If some insults are allowed and some aren't, which ones are ok? For sure I don't want to see any more personal attacking and such. You can destroy a person in Mafia without calling names or trolling. Just come up with damned good reasons to lynch a person and watch as he or she struggles back to regain control and keep from being lynched. 

It's a game. The less suspicion on you in general is a good thing. Your aim is to shift suspicion onto others, primarily those you find most suspicious. 

*Once these rules on civility are enacted, part of it will be up to the game mod's discretion. If someone is trolling you, send me a PM if it's that bad, with the post #, and I'll judge it for myself. Note I'm not perfect, but I'm not willing to do nothing either. Also, don't respond to trolling, because this just further damages our game. The same goes with accusations of cheating, and then responding in-game to accusations of cheating. Use the PM system. It is your friend. For the third game I'm going to enact a warning system, too, but because I'm pretty lenient it'll take 3 warnings to get modkilled. If I have to warn a player to not troll/respond to trolling or to not accuse players of cheating/responding to it in-game, I'll give the warning discreetly via PM. I'll be telling no one, so if you don't want anyone to know, don't share it.*

I'm trying to make the gaming atmosphere more pleasant. It's not always a walk through the rose garden when it comes to Mafia. This shit can be serious business at times. Getting all personal and dramatic and trollish is like adding fuel to the fire. A more relaxed and comfortable atmosphere would help. Besides, players threatening to quit and wanting to kills themselves over the personal crap runs counter to getting Mafia's roots ingrained deeply here at USMB. I am very grateful for everyone here who is making this fun goal a reality. 

Tomorrow I'm off work, so I'll have some time to put towards improving and simplifying the rules of our games.


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## Grandma

Moonglow said:


> Can we call them faggots if they are the town arsonist?



Or Mal?







j/k


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## Wolfsister77

Ummm Wake-You might want to change that from trying to kill themselves to trying to get lynched on purpose because if I didn't know the game and read that, I'd wonder. 

A clarification on voting for yourself would be good.

A clarification on outside influences in the game would too.


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## AquaAthena

Wolfsister77 said:


> sameech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wolfsister77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think zone 1 is fine because it will stop the BS that hurt this game. JMO
> 
> We can still go after each other with game related tactics in zone 1.
> 
> And without the other crap, it'll be a lot more fun for everyone.
> 
> I know it will be for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I couldn't make it long without calling someone an idiot.  I really see no way that Zone 1 would allow any trash talk whatsoever, and in a big game, trash talk might come in handy as Please and Thank You just don't illicit the same level of "Talk you scummy bastard or I will wrap barbed wire around your throat and wring your pencil neck".  Just saying ......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think you can say all that in zone 1. I don't think the mods are gonna crack down on game related trash talk.
> 
> I think this is in response to personal insults, trolling, flaming that goes beyond the normal game stuff, off topic stuff things being brought into the game, etc. that would be cracked down upon anywhere the game is played I would think.
> 
> Of course Wake and the mods here at USMB would have to clarify.
Click to expand...


Actually, we staff, leave it up to the forum moderator for checks and balances here. We do little intervening.


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## AquaAthena

Wake said:


> From this point on I'm enacting Zone 1 USMB rules in the games I host.
> 
> Your voice counts. Please discuss if you wish.



Zone 1:  -----Civil discourse is the focus here, regardless of topic matter. Constructive criticism and debate is the tone. No negative repping. No insulting, name-calling, or putting down other posters. Consider it a lesson in Civics.


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## Ropey

RosieS said:


> I think flexibility with the rules is important as we are still learning this game and some are learning each others' way of posting.
> 
> One of the things they pointed out as very important at the main Mafia site is that you have to trust the people you play with. Plot to kill them, sure, but trust is crucial for the game to proceed smoothly.
> 
> Regards from Rosie



And therein lies the rub.

The game loyalties are being transcended by the forum loyalties and when townies go after townies for friends who are scum in order to get the other game play?

Meh


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## R.D.

Ropey said:


> RosieS said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think flexibility with the rules is important as we are still learning this game and some are learning each others' way of posting.
> 
> One of the things they pointed out as very important at the main Mafia site is that you have to trust the people you play with. Plot to kill them, sure, but trust is crucial for the game to proceed smoothly.
> 
> Regards from Rosie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And therein lies the rub.
> 
> The game loyalties are being transcended by the forum loyalties and when townies go after townies for friends who are scum in order to get the other game play?
> 
> Meh
Click to expand...

Presactly.

My solution...I now hate all USMB members


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## AyeCantSeeYou

Would the other players feel better if the thread is locked to only those playing? 

Reading some of the posts on the other sites that host these games, this game is very tame here. If people can't handle what is said in the 2 games here so far, they'd never be able to handle the 'real' games elsewhere.


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## FA_Q2

Ropey said:


> RosieS said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think flexibility with the rules is important as we are still learning this game and some are learning each others' way of posting.
> 
> One of the things they pointed out as very important at the main Mafia site is that you have to trust the people you play with. Plot to kill them, sure, but trust is crucial for the game to proceed smoothly.
> 
> Regards from Rosie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And therein lies the rub.
> 
> The game loyalties are being transcended by the forum loyalties and when townies go after townies for friends who are scum in order to get the other game play?
> 
> Meh
Click to expand...


And there is simply nothing that can be done about that fact.  You cant erase relationships that you have - its simply impossible.  Those that you trust more on the boards simply are going to have more trust within the game until we become better players.

Considering that there will likely be new players coming and old ones going - that is a dynamic that will exist through the game because of the nature of this site.  We just need to learn how to deal.


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## Ropey

I'm sure Wake will figure it out. He's a Mafia aficionado.


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## Wolfsister77

Listen I have an opinion on all of this that I am going to keep to myself for the most part to keep from hurting the game, Mafia here at USMB, or Wake.

All I will say is I would have no trouble playing the game with game related aggressive play. I've also looked at the other sites and they would ban some folks outright for some of the crap that happened here. 

Besides, dead wolves shouldn't talk outside the dead zone and I won't vent there either. If any players hear some strange howling in the distance during the game, just ignore it. It's only me trying to psyche out the scum.


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## R.D.

FA_Q2 said:


> Ropey said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RosieS said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think flexibility with the rules is important as we are still learning this game and some are learning each others' way of posting.
> 
> One of the things they pointed out as very important at the main Mafia site is that you have to trust the people you play with. Plot to kill them, sure, but trust is crucial for the game to proceed smoothly.
> 
> Regards from Rosie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And therein lies the rub.
> 
> The game loyalties are being transcended by the forum loyalties and when townies go after townies for friends who are scum in order to get the other game play?
> 
> Meh
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And there is simply nothing that can be done about that fact.  You cant erase relationships that you have - its simply impossible.  Those that you trust more on the boards simply are going to have more trust within the game until we become better players.
> 
> Considering that there will likely be new players coming and old ones going - that is a dynamic that will exist through the game because of the nature of this site.  We just need to learn how to deal.
Click to expand...

We're not talking about misplaced trust of online friends.  At least I'm not,  it's about the inability to put those friendships aside and play the game.  Instead the game seems to have become fodder for their amusement.


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## Ropey

^


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## Wake

AquaAthena said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> From this point on I'm enacting Zone 1 USMB rules in the games I host.
> 
> Your voice counts. Please discuss if you wish.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Zone 1:  -----Civil discourse is the focus here, regardless of topic matter. Constructive criticism and debate is the tone. No negative repping. No insulting, name-calling, or putting down other posters. Consider it a lesson in Civics.
Click to expand...


That is what I want. Everyone here is older than me. I am so disappointed. 

But, that doesn't matter. I will enact these rules in our games for a reason.

Just a bit frustrated, is all. I don't want to see any more insulting that's not game-related. You can criticize a player's play and tear his or her's arguments apart. That I don't care about. What I do care about is the tone, and seeing this ugliness seep into our games, when it shouldn't even be. Receiving 50+ dramatic PMs in one day isn't fun.

Let's keep it civil, and lynch some scumfucks.


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## tn5421

Wake said:


> AquaAthena said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> From this point on I'm enacting Zone 1 USMB rules in the games I host.
> 
> Your voice counts. Please discuss if you wish.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Zone 1:  -----Civil discourse is the focus here, regardless of topic matter. Constructive criticism and debate is the tone. No negative repping. No insulting, name-calling, or putting down other posters. Consider it a lesson in Civics.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is what I want. Everyone here is older than me. I am so disappointed.
> 
> But, that doesn't matter. I will enact these rules in our games for a reason.
> 
> Just a bit frustrated, is all. I don't want to see any more insulting that's not game-related. You can criticize a player's play and tear his or her's arguments apart. That I don't care about. What I do care about is the tone, and seeing this ugliness seep into our games, when it shouldn't even be. Receiving 50+ dramatic PMs in one day isn't fun.
> 
> Let's keep it civil, and lynch some scumfucks.
Click to expand...


You want us to lynch scum?

*Vote: Wake* :3


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## Wolfsister77

Wake said:


> AquaAthena said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> From this point on I'm enacting Zone 1 USMB rules in the games I host.
> 
> Your voice counts. Please discuss if you wish.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Zone 1:  -----Civil discourse is the focus here, regardless of topic matter. Constructive criticism and debate is the tone. No negative repping. No insulting, name-calling, or putting down other posters. Consider it a lesson in Civics.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is what I want. Everyone here is older than me. I am so disappointed.
> 
> But, that doesn't matter. I will enact these rules in our games for a reason.
> 
> Just a bit frustrated, is all. I don't want to see any more insulting that's not game-related. You can criticize a player's play and tear his or her's arguments apart. That I don't care about. What I do care about is the tone, and seeing this ugliness seep into our games, when it shouldn't even be. Receiving 50+ dramatic PMs in one day isn't fun.
> 
> Let's keep it civil, and lynch some scumfucks.
Click to expand...


Can I still insult people in my head? Cuz I got some doozies stored up let me tell you. 

And only 50 PM's? Are you sure? Cuz by my count I sent you at least 75. 

And how dare you talk about my age. 

I think the mature thing to do would be to not listen to you like this.


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## R.D.

Showing up?


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