# I think arming 12 and 13 years olds is a GREAT idea!



## rdean

I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.

Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.

I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?


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## PaintMyHouse

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?


Let's stick to grounding them.  It's less mess.


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## TheOldSchool

Give em a blunt and a couple rounds


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## CaféAuLait

I found the video:



I would like to see the entire piece, it airs tomorrow.


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## Noomi

If he was able to do that so easily, it is just wrong.


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## Manchester

I'm eagerly awaiting the condemnation ofthat video as "fascist propaganda"


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## Pennywise

Is there an age restriction on this boy's 1st Amendment rights?


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## RetiredGySgt

Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence ? Gun Law Information Experts

Licensed dealers may not sell to anyone under 18. Private citizens are not so restricted. There is no age limit on possessing a long gun. One must be 21 to own a handgun.

Again licensed dealers may not sell firearms or ammunition to anyone they believe is under the age of 18. If someone did so they violated the law.


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## Politico

You hate guns we get it.


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## Delta4Embassy

Despite California's waiting-period, way back when I left a gun show with a Federal Ordance .45 1911. Being a 'curios' piece it was exempt from the waiting period. Was ready to fire as-is (after cleaning out the grease) though with modern JHP was stovepiping so I eventualy took it to a gunsmith to get bevelled and updated. Also bought some Second-Chance soft body armor (2a rated) for work. 

Gunshow loopholes are a concern, but ultimately much-ado-about-nothing. There's so many guns out there, fretting over new sales is redundant at best.

Now if they'd just sold the porn to the 13yo, maybe he'd have just gone home instead of to buy a weapon.


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## rdean

RetiredGySgt said:


> Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence ? Gun Law Information Experts
> 
> Licensed dealers may not sell to anyone under 18. Private citizens are not so restricted. There is no age limit on possessing a long gun. One must be 21 to own a handgun.
> 
> Again licensed dealers may not sell firearms or ammunition to anyone they believe is under the age of 18. If someone did so they violated the law.



I guess you have a point.  Since someone posted a vid of the kid buying the gun legally, I'm not sure what your point is.


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## RetiredGySgt

rdean said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence ? Gun Law Information Experts
> 
> Licensed dealers may not sell to anyone under 18. Private citizens are not so restricted. There is no age limit on possessing a long gun. One must be 21 to own a handgun.
> 
> Again licensed dealers may not sell firearms or ammunition to anyone they believe is under the age of 18. If someone did so they violated the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess you have a point.  Since someone posted a vid of the kid buying the gun legally, I'm not sure what your point is.
Click to expand...


Federal Law is specific.If a Licensed dealer sold to someone under 18 they broke the law. I realize you are to stupid to grasp the concept but guess what RETARD? It is already illegal we don't need a new law.


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## alan1

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



How many young men under the age 18 were in the US revolutionary war?
Just asking.


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## alan1

rdean said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence ? Gun Law Information Experts
> 
> Licensed dealers may not sell to anyone under 18. Private citizens are not so restricted. There is no age limit on possessing a long gun. One must be 21 to own a handgun.
> 
> Again licensed dealers may not sell firearms or ammunition to anyone they believe is under the age of 18. If someone did so they violated the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess you have a point.  Since someone posted a vid of the kid buying the gun legally, I'm not sure what your point is.
Click to expand...


Actually they posted a video of the young man buying a gun illegally.
Do you understand law?


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## Moonglow

Want to put your young children at high risk, give them a four wheeler...


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## Luddly Neddite

TheOldSchool said:


> Give em a blunt and a couple rounds



Whatever will fit in their backpacks. Take a few books out because the right doesn't believe in education and they'll be able to carry more ammo.

Remember when the nutters here defended the 6yo who brought a gun to school?


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## alan1

Luddly Neddite said:


> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> Give em a blunt and a couple rounds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever will fit in their backpacks. Take a few books out because the right doesn't believe in education and they'll be able to carry more ammo.
> 
> Remember when the nutters here defended the 6yo who brought a gun to school?
Click to expand...


It never ceases to amaze me how the left is stuck on that false talking point.
Repeat a lie often enough and the foolish will believe it, say it, perpetuate it.


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## Luissa

alan1 said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> 
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> 
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many young men under the age 18 were in the US revolutionary war?
> 
> Just asking.
Click to expand...



Different time. 
And a lot of them died.  


Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.


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## Jarlaxle

13?  I think my uncle was eight when he got his first rifle!


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## flacaltenn

Jarlaxle said:


> 13?  I think my uncle was eight when he got his first rifle!



Exactly.. I had a couple trophies and a $400 Anshutz Competition rifle when I was 12.






Then I TAUGHT marksmanship along side my dad who ran the Civitan sponsored team. 
RDean will pass out when I tell him that our ammo came VIRTUALLY free from the DOD civilian markmanship program.

Got pulled over when I was 17 with a tailgate full of 20 rifles and 5000 rounds of ammunition.
Cop saw my shooting jacket lying on the seat and we had a nice chat. Before my time, many HIGH SCHOOLS had markmanship programs and INDOOR GUN RANGES.. 

There is NO problem with kids having supervised recreation with firearms. And it builds family trust like no other endevour.


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## alan1

Luissa said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> 
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> 
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many young men under the age 18 were in the US revolutionary war?
> 
> Just asking.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Different time.
> And a lot of them died.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.
Click to expand...

I asked the question because I was curious, you ignored the question, thanks for nothing.


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## Asclepias

Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.


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## Katzndogz

The only 12 and 13 year olds that can have guns are gang bangers.  They need them for robberies and initiations.


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## Luissa

alan1 said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many young men under the age 18 were in the US revolutionary war?
> 
> 
> 
> Just asking.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Different time.
> 
> And a lot of them died.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I asked the question because I was curious, you ignored the question, thanks for nothing.
Click to expand...



Why does it matter? You are comparing apples and oranges. 


Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.


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## Harry Dresden

Asclepias said:


> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.



an 18 year old in the military can go to Afghanistan and be shot at and shoot back and kill someone.....but over here he is considered to immature to buy a beer.....funny how those age laws work....


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## Asclepias

I think in certain areas of the country where hunting is a common thing its ok for a child to have a shotgun but I still dont get the wisdom of a 13yr old  being able to purchase it without a parent being there.


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## RetiredGySgt

Asclepias said:


> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.



No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.


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## flacaltenn

We're all arguing about a "teaser video" that no one has yet seen.

Private sales and possession ARE REGULATED BY AGE in most states. 
So unless you can show ABUSE and CARNAGE in states like Tenn where age is not as big a deal --
you're just getting all juiced up bout nuttin.. 

For instance.. 



> Gun laws in Wisconsin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> WI statute 175.37[32]
> *Possession of a dangerous weapon by anyone under 18 is a class A misdemeanor. Giving/loaning/selling a dangerous weapon to someone under 18 is a class I felony.*
> WI statute 948.60[33]
> Defenses to prosecution under this statute:
> Target practice under the supervision of an adult
> Members of armed forces or police under 18 in the line of duty
> Hunting (either with an adult or having passed hunter's safety)
> For hunting purposes, the following exceptions to the age limit apply, as specified in statute 29.304[34] for firearms with barrels 12" or longer.
> under 10 may not hunt with a firearm or bow under any circumstances
> under 10 can only possess firearm/bow in Hunter Safety class, or while cased/unloaded and under adult supervision while going to/from Hunter Safety class, or while under adult supervision while at a target range.
> anyone age 10 or over may hunt when accompanied by an adult (within arms reach, both must be licensed, only _one_ firearm/bow between the adult and mentor (no hunter safety course requirement for the mentored hunter).
> 12-13 may hunt when accompanied by an adult and the child has successfully completed a Hunter Safety class.
> 12-13 may possess firearm when accompanied by an adult, or while transporting cased/unloaded firearm to/from Hunter Safety class, or in Hunter Safety class
> 14-17 is the same as 12-13, except Hunter Safety graduates can hunt and possess firearms (rifles/shotguns) without adult supervision.


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## Asclepias

RetiredGySgt said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.
Click to expand...


Not arguing but are you saying the narrator in the video is mis-informed?  He specifically said the purchase was legal.


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## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.



Allow me to introduce you to some fine literature you evidently are unaware of.

Transcript of the Constitution of the United States - Official Text


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## Asclepias

kwc57 said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Allow me to introduce you to some fine literature you evidently are unaware of.
> 
> Transcript of the Constitution of the United States - Official Text
Click to expand...


I'm aware of the constitution. What was your point? Is there a specific quote that has anything to do with my post?


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## TheGreatGatsby

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



Are you pms'ing, eating mint n' chip ice cream and watching Michael Moore flicks again? 

BTW - Whether a 13-year-old can buy girlie magazines, lottery tix, cigs has no bearing on the actual debate of whether 13-year-olds should be entrusted with guns.


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## rdean

Asclepias said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not arguing but are you saying the narrator in the video is mis-informed?  He specifically said the purchase was legal.
Click to expand...


Because HBO is in the habit of posting lies?  They sued for the right to lie.  Oh wait, that would be "Fox News".  OK, so it wasn't a lie.


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## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Allow me to introduce you to some fine literature you evidently are unaware of.
> 
> Transcript of the Constitution of the United States - Official Text
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm aware of the constitution. What was your point? Is there a specific quote that has anything to do with my post?
Click to expand...


Wow, I led you to water AND I have to show you how to drink.  The right to bear arms is a constitutional right.  Buying a lottery ticket isn't.


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## Asclepias

kwc57 said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Allow me to introduce you to some fine literature you evidently are unaware of.
> 
> Transcript of the Constitution of the United States - Official Text
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm aware of the constitution. What was your point? Is there a specific quote that has anything to do with my post?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wow, I led you to water AND I have to show you how to drink.  The right to bear arms is a constitutional right.  Buying a lottery ticket isn't.
Click to expand...


What does that have to do with a 13 year old being able to buy a weapon capable of killing someone and not being able to purchase a lottery ticket? Last I heard you had to be 18 to vote and be considered an adult.  

Regardless of it being a right or not it still puts things in perspective that this can happen.


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## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm aware of the constitution. What was your point? Is there a specific quote that has anything to do with my post?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, I led you to water AND I have to show you how to drink.  The right to bear arms is a constitutional right.  Buying a lottery ticket isn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with a 13 year old being able to buy a weapon capable of killing someone and not being able to purchase a lottery ticket? Last I heard you had to be 18 to vote and be considered an adult.
> 
> Regardless of it being a right or not it still puts things in perspective that this can happen.
Click to expand...


I've danced with you before and as I now recall, you have two left feet.  You'll have to find another willing partner to pity your abilities as you are unwilling or worse, unable to employee common sense.  Good day.


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## Asclepias

kwc57 said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, I led you to water AND I have to show you how to drink.  The right to bear arms is a constitutional right.  Buying a lottery ticket isn't.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with a 13 year old being able to buy a weapon capable of killing someone and not being able to purchase a lottery ticket? Last I heard you had to be 18 to vote and be considered an adult.
> 
> Regardless of it being a right or not it still puts things in perspective that this can happen.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I've danced with you before and as I now recall, you have two left feet.  You'll have to find another willing partner to pity your abilities as you are unwilling or worse, unable to employee common sense.  Good day.
Click to expand...


Dont be sore you assumed i was saying something and you didn't have the intellect to inquire about it instead of posting your stupid post.  Lesson for the day is to make sure you know what you are talking about before you assign some random meaning to someone elses words.


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## flacaltenn

Asclepias said:


> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm aware of the constitution. What was your point? Is there a specific quote that has anything to do with my post?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, I led you to water AND I have to show you how to drink.  The right to bear arms is a constitutional right.  Buying a lottery ticket isn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with a 13 year old being able to buy a weapon capable of killing someone and not being able to purchase a lottery ticket? Last I heard you had to be 18 to vote and be considered an adult.
> 
> Regardless of it being a right or not it still puts things in perspective that this can happen.
Click to expand...


I will wager that when the piece airs --- we can answer some questions like..... 

1) What STATE did this occur in?

2) Was this a REAL  Gun Show or just some random rural ad hoc flea market meetup?

3) If it was a Gun Show --- then did the kid buy his OWN TICKET and waltz right in? Because all minors must be escorted by an adult at these shows.. No vendor wants juveniles running amok and fondling their expensive goods.

Given the production company -- this is more likely than not to be at least as fabricated as the NBC crew who planted pyro charges in the pickup truck gas tank to get their "documentary" footage.. 

Any bets??


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## whitehall

You gotta stop watching videos about 13 year old children.


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## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with a 13 year old being able to buy a weapon capable of killing someone and not being able to purchase a lottery ticket? Last I heard you had to be 18 to vote and be considered an adult.
> 
> Regardless of it being a right or not it still puts things in perspective that this can happen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've danced with you before and as I now recall, you have two left feet.  You'll have to find another willing partner to pity your abilities as you are unwilling or worse, unable to employee common sense.  Good day.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dont be sore you assumed i was saying something and you didn't have the intellect to inquire about it instead of posting your stupid post.  Lesson for the day is to make sure you know what you are talking about before you assign some random meaning to someone elses words.
Click to expand...


Not sore at all.  I'd point you back to your original post that I responded to to help clear up your confusion, but you obviously aren't intelligent enough to find your way there or to understand now what you didn't understand then.  It's gotta suck to always be the clueless guy in the room who thinks he's way smarter than everyone else when he isn't.  Cheers.


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## Vandalshandle

If he had bought the gun first, he would not have had to _buy_ the other things. I know, because I used to live in New Orleans.


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## Asclepias

kwc57 said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've danced with you before and as I now recall, you have two left feet.  You'll have to find another willing partner to pity your abilities as you are unwilling or worse, unable to employee common sense.  Good day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dont be sore you assumed i was saying something and you didn't have the intellect to inquire about it instead of posting your stupid post.  Lesson for the day is to make sure you know what you are talking about before you assign some random meaning to someone elses words.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sore at all.  I'd point you back to your original post that I responded to to help clear up your confusion, but you obviously aren't intelligent enough to find your way there or to understand now what you didn't understand then.  It's gotta suck to always be the clueless guy in the room who thinks he's way smarter than everyone else when he isn't.  Cheers.
Click to expand...


You keep saying cheers but you keep coming back. 
You still havent explained what the second amendment had to do with my original post.  Can you tie it all together for those of us with lower intellects or is it you just didn't know what the hell you were talking about?


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## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dont be sore you assumed i was saying something and you didn't have the intellect to inquire about it instead of posting your stupid post.  Lesson for the day is to make sure you know what you are talking about before you assign some random meaning to someone elses words.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not sore at all.  I'd point you back to your original post that I responded to to help clear up your confusion, but you obviously aren't intelligent enough to find your way there or to understand now what you didn't understand then.  It's gotta suck to always be the clueless guy in the room who thinks he's way smarter than everyone else when he isn't.  Cheers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You keep saying cheers but you keep coming back.
> You still havent explained what the second amendment had to do with my original post.  Can you tie it all together for those of us with lower intellects or is it you just didn't know what the hell you were talking about?
Click to expand...


I'm kind of like a cat with a mouse.  I like to keep toying with you and slapping you around.  It's your post assclap, how can you not understand it's meaning?  You're bemonaing that he can buy a gun when he can't even buy a lottery ticket.  My response is he has a constitutional right to purchase a weapon.  No such right exists for purchasing a lotto ticket.  Now you know......again.


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## Asclepias

kwc57 said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not sore at all.  I'd point you back to your original post that I responded to to help clear up your confusion, but you obviously aren't intelligent enough to find your way there or to understand now what you didn't understand then.  It's gotta suck to always be the clueless guy in the room who thinks he's way smarter than everyone else when he isn't.  Cheers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You keep saying cheers but you keep coming back.
> You still havent explained what the second amendment had to do with my original post.  Can you tie it all together for those of us with lower intellects or is it you just didn't know what the hell you were talking about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm kind of like a cat with a mouse.  I like to keep toying with you and slapping you around.  It's your post assclap, how can you not understand it's meaning?  You're bemonaing that he can buy a gun when he can't even buy a lottery ticket.  My response is he has a constitutional right to purchase a weapon.  No such right exists for purchasing a lotto ticket.  Now you know......again.
Click to expand...


Well like I pointed out to you the first time. You should ask for clarification before assuming. I was not bemoaning anything. What makes you think I was bemoaning? How stupid do you feel now?


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## WillowTree

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



Too chicken to post the video or what?


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## WillowTree

rdean said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence ? Gun Law Information Experts
> 
> Licensed dealers may not sell to anyone under 18. Private citizens are not so restricted. There is no age limit on possessing a long gun. One must be 21 to own a handgun.
> 
> Again licensed dealers may not sell firearms or ammunition to anyone they believe is under the age of 18. If someone did so they violated the law.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess you have a point.  Since someone posted a vid of the kid buying the gun legally, I'm not sure what your point is.
Click to expand...



The point is if he's thirteen he didn't buy the gun legally. It's not that hard a concept.


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## Howey

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



lol.

Did he pass the background check? Will he grow up to be a responsible gun owner???

No, seriously, these gun shows need to be shut down. Period.


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## Luddly Neddite

whitehall said:


> You gotta stop watching videos about 13 year old children.



What is this?

Yet another rw accusation of pedophilia?


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## Luddly Neddite

Vandalshandle said:


> If he had bought the gun first, he would not have had to _buy_ the other things. I know, because I used to live in New Orleans.



In AZ, people can walk in and buy a gun. 

Gunshow Undercover - Arizona

Undercover investigators buy guns without background checks - CNN.com

Undercover Arizona Gun Show Probe: New York Investigation of Semi-Automatic Weapons, No Background Check - ABC News

For those who want videos, here they are -

Gun Show: Undercover - YouTube

Has this changed?

Children's lives mean nothing to the radical right nutters. Not when compared to the value of guns. 


`


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## flacaltenn

Luddly Neddite said:


> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If he had bought the gun first, he would not have had to _buy_ the other things. I know, because I used to live in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In AZ, people can walk in and buy a gun.
> 
> Gunshow Undercover - Arizona
> 
> Undercover investigators buy guns without background checks - CNN.com
> 
> Undercover Arizona Gun Show Probe: New York Investigation of Semi-Automatic Weapons, No Background Check - ABC News
> 
> For those who want videos, here they are -
> 
> Gun Show: Undercover - YouTube
> 
> Has this changed?
> 
> Children's lives mean nothing to the radical right nutters. Not when compared to the value of guns.
> 
> 
> `
Click to expand...


You are confusing ELIGIBLE BUYERS with children here. It's a different issue. Spare me the emotional fluffing..


----------



## rdean

Vandalshandle said:


> If he had bought the gun first, he would not have had to _buy_ the other things. I know, because I used to live in New Orleans.



That's what I said.


----------



## rdean

flacaltenn said:


> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If he had bought the gun first, he would not have had to _buy_ the other things. I know, because I used to live in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In AZ, people can walk in and buy a gun.
> 
> Gunshow Undercover - Arizona
> 
> Undercover investigators buy guns without background checks - CNN.com
> 
> Undercover Arizona Gun Show Probe: New York Investigation of Semi-Automatic Weapons, No Background Check - ABC News
> 
> For those who want videos, here they are -
> 
> Gun Show: Undercover - YouTube
> 
> Has this changed?
> 
> Children's lives mean nothing to the radical right nutters. Not when compared to the value of guns.
> 
> 
> `
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are confusing ELIGIBLE BUYERS with children here. It's a different issue. Spare me the emotional fluffing..
Click to expand...


In my eyes, a 12 or 13 year old IS a "child".


----------



## Sunshine

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



And you will see kids younger than that with guns and using them during hunting season here in KY.  You stay on the rag more than anyone I know.  Get over it.  People are going to own guns.


----------



## Sunshine

rdean said:


> flacaltenn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> In AZ, people can walk in and buy a gun.
> 
> Gunshow Undercover - Arizona
> 
> Undercover investigators buy guns without background checks - CNN.com
> 
> Undercover Arizona Gun Show Probe: New York Investigation of Semi-Automatic Weapons, No Background Check - ABC News
> 
> For those who want videos, here they are -
> 
> Gun Show: Undercover - YouTube
> 
> Has this changed?
> 
> Children's lives mean nothing to the radical right nutters. Not when compared to the value of guns.
> 
> 
> `
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are confusing ELIGIBLE BUYERS with children here. It's a different issue. Spare me the emotional fluffing..
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In my eyes, a 12 or 13 year old IS a "child".
Click to expand...


Well FYI, that 'child' is old enough to bag a nice deer for the family freezer if he is a good shot.  Go clean out your little pink panties.  That's just one more family not standing in the food stamp line with you.


----------



## Sunshine

Kentucky Department of Fish & Wildlife License and Permit Fees 

Note the ages.


----------



## Sunshine

You know rdumbass, you just stay in a green snit about something every goddamned day of your life.  You have no idea what real life is, what real people who don't want to be on the dole are willing to do to support themselves and their families.  We teach our children to use guns responsibly here.  They can hunt right along with the big boys.  And truth be told they need the food.  What you need is a good lay with a gun straight up your ass.  That would be right in line with your hobby of running down good hard working people.  All you know is eating out of someone's hand.  And in the process you bite it as often  as you can.  Are you offended by my post?  Good!  I'm offended that pieces of shit like you get everything for damn free while people, including teens get out and hustle their asses to make ends meet without taking money from the government.


----------



## alan1

I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
Just wondering.


----------



## flacaltenn

rdean said:


> flacaltenn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luddly Neddite said:
> 
> 
> 
> In AZ, people can walk in and buy a gun.
> 
> Gunshow Undercover - Arizona
> 
> Undercover investigators buy guns without background checks - CNN.com
> 
> Undercover Arizona Gun Show Probe: New York Investigation of Semi-Automatic Weapons, No Background Check - ABC News
> 
> For those who want videos, here they are -
> 
> Gun Show: Undercover - YouTube
> 
> Has this changed?
> 
> Children's lives mean nothing to the radical right nutters. Not when compared to the value of guns.
> 
> 
> `
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are confusing ELIGIBLE BUYERS with children here. It's a different issue. Spare me the emotional fluffing..
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In my eyes, a 12 or 13 year old IS a "child".
Click to expand...


Exactly Bullwinkle.. Very good.. We agree on "child". Problem is Luddly is whining about GENERAL Gun Show issues.. Had nothing much to do with THIS discussion about laws applying to AGE.. My information is that Gun Shows ALLOW children to attend if they are ACCOMPANIED by an adult. If you know different -- please let me know.


----------



## MeBelle

rdean said:


> In my eyes, a 12 or 13 year old IS a "child".



My family has a few favorite restaurants we like to eat at.

One is at a casino...I love seafood night and the steaks are mouth watering.

The other is a Chinese place. Sushi galore!

Both places are buffet.

They charge *children, @ the age of 12, the adult price*. 

I had my first .22 when I was 10...maybe 8.
The stock had to be cut down to fit my arms.
I was raised around firearms and knew how to respect them not fear them.

~~~~~

Rather than waste your faux outrage about a teaser clip, how about you get outraged @ the* juvie gangs *in Oakland, LA, etc where *children* have illegal hand guns? 

Think of how much you could accomplish venting your outrage towards a solution instead of rambling on a message board.


----------



## Asclepias

Regardless of the law or constitution, do you guys think its odd that we dont allow 13 yr olds to do a lot of potentially dangerous things but we do allow them to operate a device that potentially can take a human life?


----------



## rdean

Sunshine said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And you will see kids younger than that with guns and using them during hunting season here in KY.  You stay on the rag more than anyone I know.  Get over it.  People are going to own guns.
Click to expand...


Guns they buy themselves without their parents knowing?  Got it.  Nice to know you "approve".


----------



## RetiredGySgt

Once again for the slow and stupid it is against the law for anyone under 18 to buy firearms.


----------



## flacaltenn

Asclepias said:


> Regardless of the law or constitution, do you guys think its odd that we dont allow 13 yr olds to do a lot of potentially dangerous things but we do allow them to operate a device that potentially can take a human life?



Law allows kids to solo an airplane at 16.  An ultralight at age 8.  A snowboard or skis is apotentially lethal weapon.  Having coached 12 to 18 yr olds in marksmanship, I've never witnessed a breach of trust. And I had their attention to safety issues at all times.  Biggest lapse was kids taking out the wooden legs on the target stands or an occasional snake.

Its actually a parents dream to know they understand the seriousness of the situation. Wouldnt put a kid on a lawn tractor if I couldnt trust him out shooting targets or skeet.

For those who arent destined to have a HS letter jacket,  its another chance to be good at something.  We should be doing more of this.


----------



## Asclepias

flacaltenn said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Regardless of the law or constitution, do you guys think its odd that we dont allow 13 yr olds to do a lot of potentially dangerous things but we do allow them to operate a device that potentially can take a human life?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Law allows kids to solo an airplane at 16.  An ultralight at age 8.  A snowboard or skis is apotentially lethal weapon.  Having coached 12 to 18 yr olds in marksmanship, I've never witnessed a breach of trust. And I had their attention to safety issues at all times.  Biggest lapse was kids taking out the wooden legs on the target stands or an occasional snake.
> 
> Its actually a parents dream to know they understand the seriousness of the situation. Wouldnt put a kid on a lawn tractor if I couldnt trust him out shooting targets or skeet.
> 
> *For those who arent destined to have a HS letter jacket,  its another chance to be good at something.  We should be doing more of this*.
Click to expand...


Good point.


----------



## rdean

RetiredGySgt said:


> Once again for the slow and stupid it is against the law for anyone under 18 to buy firearms.



Would you stop saying that?  You know you are lying.  Kids can legally buy guns at many gun shows.  How many links do I have to post to get it through your thick skull?

Vermont, however, stands out from the pack because it allows people as young as 16 to conceal carry without parental permission, as well as buy handguns. So a Vermont teenager aged 16 can't legally go to an R-rated movie alone or join the military, but he can buy a handgun and carry it in his jeans and be completely within the limits of the law.

Federal law mandates that licensed gun dealers only sell long guns to individuals 18 and older, and handguns to individuals 21 and older. But not all legal gun sellers are federally licensed. For instance, *many gun show participants sell guns legally without a federal license. That means that many under 18 and 21 are capable of buying guns legally.*

The age is usually set at 18, but in New York it's only 16, and in Montana it's 14. So in Helena, one can legally own a shotgun before graduating from 8th grade. *And in the 30 states with no such minimum age, you could own one when you're in elementary school*.

The 6 craziest state gun laws

------------------------------------------------

You give ex military a bad name.  Spouting bullshit when you could look up anything you want and actually know what you are talking about.


----------



## Sunshine

alan1 said:


> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.



I'm sure he's perfectly fine with it.  The more the better!  Knock up all the teens you can.  Kill all the babies you want.  He's a disgusting piece of shit.  I would like to get to vote on a referendum to abort  grown able bodied pieces of shit like him who won't turn a hand, but lives every day of his miserable little life off the taxpayers.


----------



## Sunshine

rdean said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And you will see kids younger than that with guns and using them during hunting season here in KY.  You stay on the rag more than anyone I know.  Get over it.  People are going to own guns.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Guns they buy themselves without their parents knowing?  Got it.  Nice to know you "approve".
Click to expand...


How do you know the parents didn't know?  Hmm, you little shithead welfare queen?  How do you know that?  Answer, you don't.  And it is that stupidity and complete lack of insight that causes you to be unable to  do anything but live off the taxpayers.  Maybe dad was working and sent the son to buy the gun.

One of the big problems in this country is the post war creation of the 'American Teenager.'  There is absolutely no use whatsoever for a teenager in this society.   In my grandmother's day they were marrying, working the farms, caring for family members, and being useful members of society.  Now they are 'children' with no skills, no motivation, and nothing but time on their hands.  Some use that time to develop themselves into productive citizens, but you and your kind are nothing but lazy worthless slugs who become gangs on the streets or on message boards and live off the ones who put effort into becoming someone.,


----------



## Spoonman

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



well of course your story is bullshit, but hey, we keep giving them birth control and engourageing them to have sex at younger and younger ages.


----------



## flacaltenn

rdean said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Once again for the slow and stupid it is against the law for anyone under 18 to buy firearms.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would you stop saying that?  You know you are lying. * Kids can legally buy guns at many gun shows.  How many links do I have to post to get it through your thick skull?*
> 
> Vermont, however, stands out from the pack because it allows people as young as 16 to conceal carry without parental permission, as well as buy handguns. So a Vermont teenager aged 16 can't legally go to an R-rated movie alone or join the military, but he can buy a handgun and carry it in his jeans and be completely within the limits of the law.
> 
> Federal law mandates that licensed gun dealers only sell long guns to individuals 18 and older, and handguns to individuals 21 and older. But not all legal gun sellers are federally licensed. For instance, *many gun show participants sell guns legally without a federal license. That means that many under 18 and 21 are capable of buying guns legally.*
> 
> The age is usually set at 18, but in New York it's only 16, and in Montana it's 14. So in Helena, one can legally own a shotgun before graduating from 8th grade. *And in the 30 states with no such minimum age, you could own one when you're in elementary school*.
> 
> The 6 craziest state gun laws
> 
> ------------------------------------------------
> 
> You give ex military a bad name.  Spouting bullshit when you could look up anything you want and actually know what you are talking about.
Click to expand...


Let's follow this thru Deanie.. HOW OLD do you have to be in those states to BUY A TICKET for a Gun Show WITHOUT  parental escort?  Do you think kids of all ages are allowed in to fondle expensive goods WITHOUT AN ADULT? Let's see how thick your skull is...


----------



## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> You keep saying cheers but you keep coming back.
> You still havent explained what the second amendment had to do with my original post.  Can you tie it all together for those of us with lower intellects or is it you just didn't know what the hell you were talking about?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm kind of like a cat with a mouse.  I like to keep toying with you and slapping you around.  It's your post assclap, how can you not understand it's meaning?  You're bemonaing that he can buy a gun when he can't even buy a lottery ticket.  My response is he has a constitutional right to purchase a weapon.  No such right exists for purchasing a lotto ticket.  Now you know......again.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well like I pointed out to you the first time. You should ask for clarification before assuming. I was not bemoaning anything. What makes you think I was bemoaning? How stupid do you feel now?
Click to expand...


Your words.


----------



## Asclepias

kwc57 said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kwc57 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm kind of like a cat with a mouse.  I like to keep toying with you and slapping you around.  It's your post assclap, how can you not understand it's meaning?  You're bemonaing that he can buy a gun when he can't even buy a lottery ticket.  My response is he has a constitutional right to purchase a weapon.  No such right exists for purchasing a lotto ticket.  Now you know......again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well like I pointed out to you the first time. You should ask for clarification before assuming. I was not bemoaning anything. What makes you think I was bemoaning? How stupid do you feel now?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your words.
Click to expand...


Whats bemoaning about my words? "It puts things in perspective...". Sounds pretty objective and matter of fact to me.  I know the internet does not readily avail itself to inflection but you are not very perceptive are you?  Or maybe you dont know what bemoans means. Which is it?


----------



## kwc57

Asclepias said:


> Regardless of the law or constitution, do you guys think its odd that we dont allow 13 yr olds to do a lot of potentially dangerous things but we do allow them to operate a device that potentially can take a human life?



No, not when you teach them to respect firearms and how to operate them safely.....as well as proficiently.  This will put it in perspective for you.

Girl, 11, shoots cougar that was following her brother in Washington State | Mail Online

Liberals need to understand that the scary boomsticks are not always used for evil purposes.  The majority of the time they are used for recreation and defense by responsible gun owners.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

We use to ride around on dirt bikes with a shotgun or .22 depending on what we were hunting at 12.
Cops would just wave. 
  Sucks what has happened to our country.


----------



## rdean

Sunshine said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sure he's perfectly fine with it.  The more the better!  Knock up all the teens you can.  Kill all the babies you want.  He's a disgusting piece of shit.  I would like to get to vote on a referendum to abort  grown able bodied pieces of shit like him who won't turn a hand, but lives every day of his miserable little life off the taxpayers.
Click to expand...


In high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex.  He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded.  He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out.  I knew her for many years.  In those days, children were pretty much property.  There weren't the child protection laws that exist today. 

If she had gotten pregnant, I'm sure your kind would have been thrilled if he tortured her to death.  Tell us how you see him doing it.  

Then there is your other solution.  She could have killed herself and spared him the humiliation.  Tell us the best way.  How you would have counseled her to kill herself.


----------



## rdean

alan1 said:


> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.



Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today. 

So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.  

Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.

Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.


----------



## flacaltenn

rdean said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
Click to expand...


The State of Whereeveryousprouted is not her Daddy or Mommy.. UNLESS she wants to TELL THEM about the abuse. And something sucks about your UNDERSTANDING of the story. (or mine).. Because even back in WhenEverYouGrewUp (if you have), no "juvy" would have taken in a battered kid for physical rehab without charging the parents. 

Are you fleeing the thread or just trying to make folks sad???


----------



## alan1

rdean said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
Click to expand...

Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
What held you back from helping her?

I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.


----------



## Sunshine

rdean said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
Click to expand...


I would not make up a story like that and post it on a message board.  Do you realize that you have just implicated yourself as an accessory to a crime.


----------



## rdean

flacaltenn said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The State of Whereeveryousprouted is not her Daddy or Mommy.. UNLESS she wants to TELL THEM about the abuse. And something sucks about your UNDERSTANDING of the story. (or mine).. *Because even back in WhenEverYouGrewUp (if you have), no "juvy" would have taken in a battered kid for physical rehab without charging the parents*.
> 
> Are you fleeing the thread or just trying to make folks sad???
Click to expand...


Bull fucking shit.  That shows how much you know.  

50 years ago, there weren't the laws protecting children.  Child services was almost unheard of.  It wasn't that long ago labor unions were able to pass child labor laws.  When right wingers see what we have today, they don't connect it to what liberals have done in the past.  When you see laws protecting children, minorities, women, gays or whoever, it was NEVER conservatives who worked to pass those laws.  I could even see conservatives throwing helpless mentally ill people right out into the street.

Ronald Reagan and the Commitment of the Mentally Ill: <br>Capital, Interest Groups, and the Eclipse of Social Policy

Critics of Community Mental Health charged that in the rush to shrink the state hospital population, many patients were released prematurely (Robitscher, 1976; Yarvis et al, 1978). Some patients went off their medications after being released into the community. The criteria of "dangerousness" for civil commitment also meant that some patients who needed treatment but were not a danger could not be committed. As a result, patients whose behavior was considered odd by the community in which they lived were increasingly arrested for bothersome and minor infractions such as vagrancy. These individuals were thus detained in the criminal justice system rather than the mental health system (Abramson, 1972; Conrad and Schneider, 1980).

Even today:

Former judge sentenced to prison for kids for cash scheme | Reuters

There are two types of Republicans.  The scum of the earth we will fuck you over type and the sheeple who put them into office.


----------



## rdean

Sunshine said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would not make up a story like that and post it on a message board.  Do you realize that you have just implicated yourself as an accessory to a crime.
Click to expand...


45 years ago, it was considered "discipline" and not a crime.

But look at what you said you disgusting turd:

Knock up all the teens you can. Kill all the babies you want. He's a disgusting piece of shit. I would like to get to vote on a referendum to abort grown able bodied pieces of shit like him who won't turn a hand, but lives every day of his miserable little life off the taxpayers.

and in your very next post:

One of the big problems in this country is the post war creation of the 'American Teenager.' There is absolutely no use whatsoever for a teenager in this society. In my grandmother's day they were marrying, working the farms, caring for family members, and being useful members of society. Now they are 'children' with no skills, no motivation, and nothing but time on their hands. Some use that time to develop themselves into productive citizens, but you and your kind are nothing but lazy worthless slugs who become gangs on the streets or on message boards and live off the ones who put effort into becoming someone.,
_________

You are dirty.  A terrible person.  If there is a crime here, it's having to share air with lowlife such as yourself.  And your kind calls me a "hater".  Ha!


----------



## Sunshine

rdean said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would not make up a story like that and post it on a message board.  Do you realize that you have just implicated yourself as an accessory to a crime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 45 years ago, it was considered "discipline" and not a crime.
> 
> But look at what you said you disgusting turd:
> 
> Knock up all the teens you can. Kill all the babies you want. He's a disgusting piece of shit. I would like to get to vote on a referendum to abort grown able bodied pieces of shit like him who won't turn a hand, but lives every day of his miserable little life off the taxpayers.
> 
> and in your very next post:
> 
> One of the big problems in this country is the post war creation of the 'American Teenager.' There is absolutely no use whatsoever for a teenager in this society. In my grandmother's day they were marrying, working the farms, caring for family members, and being useful members of society. Now they are 'children' with no skills, no motivation, and nothing but time on their hands. Some use that time to develop themselves into productive citizens, but you and your kind are nothing but lazy worthless slugs who become gangs on the streets or on message boards and live off the ones who put effort into becoming someone.,
> _________
> 
> You are dirty.  A terrible person.  If there is a crime here, it's having to share air with lowlife such as yourself.  And your kind calls me a "hater".  Ha!
Click to expand...


You claim to have witnessed a crime and done nothing about it.  That makes YOU the terrible person.  55 years ago my parents and some neighbors reported other neighbors to the police for doing just what you describe.  Some people are decent.   You are not one of them.  You will just sit on your ass listening to a crime in progress, and gossip about it, when all you had to do was pick up the phone.  You disgusting piece of shit.  There, I accepted what you said as truth.  Congratulations you are an accessory to a crime, you stinking piece of filth.


----------



## rdean

alan1 said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if rdean has a problem with a 13 year old getting an abortion in a state like say California, where fetal homicide is against the law and has been successfully prosecuted?
> Just wondering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
Click to expand...


Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.  

You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.  

So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.

Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.


----------



## Sunshine

rdean said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> 
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.
> 
> You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.
> 
> So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.
> 
> Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.
Click to expand...


 Your story gets larger I see.   Make it up as you go.  Father was sheriff?  (Bullshit) Call federal marshals.  You are a shithead, and self confessed accessory to crime.


----------



## rdean

Sunshine said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> I would not make up a story like that and post it on a message board.  Do you realize that you have just implicated yourself as an accessory to a crime.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 45 years ago, it was considered "discipline" and not a crime.
> 
> But look at what you said you disgusting turd:
> 
> Knock up all the teens you can. Kill all the babies you want. He's a disgusting piece of shit. I would like to get to vote on a referendum to abort grown able bodied pieces of shit like him who won't turn a hand, but lives every day of his miserable little life off the taxpayers.
> 
> and in your very next post:
> 
> One of the big problems in this country is the post war creation of the 'American Teenager.' There is absolutely no use whatsoever for a teenager in this society. In my grandmother's day they were marrying, working the farms, caring for family members, and being useful members of society. Now they are 'children' with no skills, no motivation, and nothing but time on their hands. Some use that time to develop themselves into productive citizens, but you and your kind are nothing but lazy worthless slugs who become gangs on the streets or on message boards and live off the ones who put effort into becoming someone.,
> _________
> 
> You are dirty.  A terrible person.  If there is a crime here, it's having to share air with lowlife such as yourself.  And your kind calls me a "hater".  Ha!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You claim to have witnessed a crime and done nothing about it.  That makes YOU the terrible person.  55 years ago my parents and some neighbors reported other neighbors to the police for doing just what you describe.  Some people are decent.   You are not one of them.  You will just sit on your ass listening to a crime in progress, and gossip about it, when all you had to do was pick up the phone.  You disgusting piece of shit.  There, I accepted what you said as truth.  Congratulations you are an accessory to a crime, you stinking piece of filth.
Click to expand...


Now you're the one who is making up a lie.  People didn't get involved with parents disciplining their children.  What we call a crime now, back then, it was called discipline.  I remember when any adult could spank a child not theirs and no one thought anything of it.  Today, that would be called "assault".

But you really are dirty scum.  No really.

This looks like a good candidate for a signature line:  Sunshine: Knock up all the teens you can. Kill all the babies you want. He's a disgusting piece of shit. I would like to get to vote on a referendum to abort grown able bodied pieces of shit like him who won't turn a hand, but lives every day of his miserable little life off the taxpayers.


----------



## rdean

Sunshine said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.
> 
> You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.
> 
> So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.
> 
> Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your story gets larger I see.   Make it up as you go.  Father was sheriff?  (Bullshit) Call federal marshals.  You are a shithead, and self confessed accessory to crime.
Click to expand...


Deputy sheriff.  At least get it right.  What are you?  About 14 or 15?  Cuz you don't seem to know very much.


----------



## alan1

rdean said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> 
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.
> 
> You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.
> 
> So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.
> 
> Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.
Click to expand...

What is more hilarious is how your story keeps evolving (making more shit up) in an attempt to support your lies.
FYI, the police and the sheriff office are different entities.
So evolve (make up) your story even better and now announce that her mother worked for the police (or FBI or CIA), so you didn't have that option.


----------



## Spoonman

rdean said:


> flacaltenn said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The State of Whereeveryousprouted is not her Daddy or Mommy.. UNLESS she wants to TELL THEM about the abuse. And something sucks about your UNDERSTANDING of the story. (or mine).. *Because even back in WhenEverYouGrewUp (if you have), no "juvy" would have taken in a battered kid for physical rehab without charging the parents*.
> 
> Are you fleeing the thread or just trying to make folks sad???
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bull fucking shit.  That shows how much you know.
> 
> 50 years ago, there weren't the laws protecting children.  Child services was almost unheard of.  It wasn't that long ago labor unions were able to pass child labor laws.  When right wingers see what we have today, they don't connect it to what liberals have done in the past.  When you see laws protecting children, minorities, women, gays or whoever, it was NEVER conservatives who worked to pass those laws.  I could even see conservatives throwing helpless mentally ill people right out into the street.
> 
> Ronald Reagan and the Commitment of the Mentally Ill: <br>Capital, Interest Groups, and the Eclipse of Social Policy
> 
> Critics of Community Mental Health charged that in the rush to shrink the state hospital population, many patients were released prematurely (Robitscher, 1976; Yarvis et al, 1978). Some patients went off their medications after being released into the community. The criteria of "dangerousness" for civil commitment also meant that some patients who needed treatment but were not a danger could not be committed. As a result, patients whose behavior was considered odd by the community in which they lived were increasingly arrested for bothersome and minor infractions such as vagrancy. These individuals were thus detained in the criminal justice system rather than the mental health system (Abramson, 1972; Conrad and Schneider, 1980).
> 
> Even today:
> 
> Former judge sentenced to prison for kids for cash scheme | Reuters
> 
> There are two types of Republicans.  The scum of the earth we will fuck you over type and the sheeple who put them into office.
Click to expand...


50 years ago kids weren't bringing guns to school either and blowing other kids away.  come to think of it there weren't restrictive liberal gun laws either.   man you libs have really fucked up this country


----------



## Spoonman

alan1 said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.
> 
> You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.
> 
> So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.
> 
> Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is more hilarious is how your story keeps evolving (making more shit up) in an attempt to support your lies.
> FYI, the police and the sheriff office are different entities.
> So evolve (make up) your story even better and now announce that her mother worked for the police (or FBI or CIA), so you didn't have that option.
Click to expand...


that's why they call it spin.  rdean is a master spin doctor. rdean spins so much he has his own gravitational force


----------



## flacaltenn

rdean said:


> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> Like I told "Sunshine",  in high school, I knew a girl whose father beat her unconscious and shaved her head because he heard a rumor she had sex. He put her in Juvie until her hair grew out and the bruises faded. He didn't replace the tooth he knocked out. I knew her for many years. In those days, children were pretty much property. There weren't the child protection laws that exist today.
> 
> So tell us.  How would you protect that girl from a father who would do such things?  What did you say?  You wouldn't?  That she would get what what deserved?  Do you feel she should kill herself instead?  How?  Shot to the head?  She could hang herself.  Cut her wrists.  Or tell her father and give him the pleasure.
> 
> Go ahead.  Tell us how you would counsel her.  Would you tell her to let dad kill her or should she kill herself.  We know she couldn't run away.  They would just bring her back and hand her over to her father.
> 
> Come on you turds.  Tell us what you would do.
> 
> 
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.
> 
> You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.
> 
> So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.
> 
> Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.
Click to expand...


"there was no one to go to" back then in the Jurasssic Era.. In your tale, the Father put the girl into Juvenile Detention.. Which means that she legally was in the CUSTODY of the government. What was their interest in doing this? Was it to help her grow her hair back? Maybe save her the embarassment of going to school with bruises? Was this a standard practice for abusive parents to drop off battered children for the State to nurse back to health no questions asked? 

And WHY in the WORLD couldn't folks like you go to the "juvy" system and SUGGEST that they question the father? I can't understand how juvenile detention ever became a baby-sitting, nursemaid for abusive parents. Did she commit a crime? Was she examined by a doctor? What judge would lock a battered young girl into detention without a charge?


----------



## Luissa

Sunshine said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> flacaltenn said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are confusing ELIGIBLE BUYERS with children here. It's a different issue. Spare me the emotional fluffing..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In my eyes, a 12 or 13 year old IS a "child".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well FYI, that 'child' is old enough to bag a nice deer for the family freezer if he is a good shot.  Go clean out your little pink panties.  That's just one more family not standing in the food stamp line with you.
Click to expand...



You mean with you? 
Some people don't want to arm their teenagers. That doesn't translate to being on welfare, you bitch. 


Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.


----------



## Luissa

RetiredGySgt said:


> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.
Click to expand...



But he can use it legally, which was his point. Are you slow and stupid? 
I could really care less if people arm their children, I just hope they are smart enough to teach them gun safety. 


Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.


----------



## flacaltenn

Luissa said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> But he can use it legally, which was his point. Are you slow and stupid?
> I could really care less if people arm their children, I just hope they are smart enough to teach them gun safety.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.
Click to expand...


Thats  quite rational of you..  State laws vary about juvy possession and ownership. And the seemingling subtle difference about who OWNS a particular gun in the family cabinet is important to the firearms training that you mentioned..  Nobody takes ANYTHING out the cabinet unless its theirs.  And giving "ownership" is one of the most important milestones in the firearms safety training.  THIS is the job of the parent or the trainer,  NOT a collective judgement.....


----------



## alan1

flacaltenn said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> alan1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Had I known something like that, I'd have gone to the police with it.  Did you?  If not,
> What held you back from helping her?
> 
> I'm guessing that what held you back is that you just made up a lie to try and prove your point(less).  Or maybe you are a coward.  Or maybe you didn't care.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Her father was a deputy sheriff.  You guys just don't understand how the country has changed in the last 50 years.  You don't see how it's better because you don't want to.  Thank God for liberals.  Conservatives would NEVER fight for children's rights.
> 
> You seem to think because we have child labor laws and "Children's services", that we always had them.  Not true.
> 
> So you say, "Well, you should have gone to.......who?"  There was no one to go to.  Papers would never print such news.  Not unless the child was killed in a brutal way and was part of other crimes.  No one would put it on one of the three TV stations.  And TV didn't even become widespread until the 60's.  Papers were local.  Anyone with any power could squash any story if it was about their family.
> 
> Hilarious the way Republicans complain about government and accept it's protections without a second thought.  Not even knowing the history of those protections or where they came from.  Course, education was never their strong suit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "there was no one to go to" back then in the Jurasssic Era.. In your tale, the Father put the girl into Juvenile Detention.. Which means that she legally was in the CUSTODY of the government. What was their interest in doing this? Was it to help her grow her hair back? Maybe save her the embarassment of going to school with bruises? Was this a standard practice for abusive parents to drop off battered children for the State to nurse back to health no questions asked?
> 
> And WHY in the WORLD couldn't folks like you go to the "juvy" system and SUGGEST that they question the father? I can't understand how juvenile detention ever became a baby-sitting, nursemaid for abusive parents. Did she commit a crime? Was she examined by a doctor? What judge would lock a battered young girl into detention without a charge?
Click to expand...

rdean is liar.  If you're a liar, bullshit like this works in yer mind, even though it is bullshit.


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## freedombecki

rdean said:


> Bull fucking shit. That shows how much you know.
> 
> 50 years ago, there weren't the laws protecting children. Child services was almost unheard of. It wasn't that long ago labor unions were able to pass child labor laws. When right wingers see what we have today, they don't connect it to what liberals have done in the past. When you see laws protecting children, *minorities,* women, gays or whoever, it was NEVER conservatives who worked to pass those laws. I could even see conservatives throwing helpless mentally ill people right out into the street.
> 
> Ronald Reagan and the Commitment of the Mentally Ill: <br>Capital, Interest Groups, and the Eclipse of Social Policy
> 
> Critics of Community Mental Health charged that in the rush to shrink the state hospital population, many patients were released prematurely (Robitscher, 1976; Yarvis et al, 1978). Some patients went off their medications after being released into the community. The criteria of "dangerousness" for civil commitment also meant that some patients who needed treatment but were not a danger could not be committed. As a result, patients whose behavior was considered odd by the community in which they lived were increasingly arrested for bothersome and minor infractions such as vagrancy. These individuals were thus detained in the criminal justice system rather than the mental health system (Abramson, 1972; Conrad and Schneider, 1980).
> 
> Even today:
> 
> Former judge sentenced to prison for kids for cash scheme | Reuters
> 
> There are two types of Republicans. The scum of the earth we will fuck you over type and the sheeple who put them into office.


Bar of soap for your naughty mouth, rdean.

 And I want to examine this pants-on-fire minorities claim you made above about how you Democrats are heroes and Republicans are 'enemies.'

 Who won passage the antislavery Constitutional Amendment, Republicans or Democrats?



> Members of the Republican Party:
> 
> 
> Viewed the Civil War as a crusade against the institution of slavery and supported immediate emancipation.
> They advocated enlistment of black soldiers.
> They led the fight for ratification of the 13th Amendment.




 Democrats:


Fought for slave ownership 
Opposed using black soldiers on the battlefield 
Fought the 13th Amendment tooth and nail
 Who started the Ku Klux Klan? Answer: Democrats.

 Who opposed the KKK? Answer: Republicans.



> Republicans in the early 1870s urged Ulysses Grant to take action against the Ku Klux Klan.
> U.S. History


 
 Who pushed for citizenship rights for blacks (Amendment 14)? Answer again Republicans, yea; Democrats, nay.

 Who pushed for blacks the right to vote? (Amendment 15)? Answer: Republicans, yea; Democrats, nay.

 And who got fed up with Democrat tail-dragging on black rights all the way up to post WWII? Yep! Republican Dwight D. Eisenhower, who fought bitter democrats to hell and back to get the Civil Rights Act of 1957 passed, although Democrats severely thwarted its impact by passing nullifying amendments to the act. 

 Don't you ever lie to this board again about civil rights being the sole bailiwick of Democrats. Just the opposite is true. The only thing that changed them, and I do mean the only thing, is the power they perceived they would have to push communism on the masses by fooling black people into thinking only they were responsible for today's situation of pandering to convenience and expedience at the expense of Republicans.

 Naughty, naughty.


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## flacaltenn

Probably RDean has been wracked with guilt over this for decades. We'll never know what role he played in this mind opera..  Hopefully tho-- our little intervention here saved him some couch time and allows him to get on with his life...  Minor rights ARE an important issue..  Especially since the LARGEST threat to their rights comes from the hideous Progressive correctness instituted in our schools.  Where they now have LESS rights and freedom than State pen inmates..


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## Spiderman

rdean said:


> I was watching a video of a kid who just turned 13 try to buy beer, lottery tickets, girlie magazines, and cigarettes.  Of course, every time he was turned away as too young.
> 
> Then he went to a gun show and in a couple of minutes walked out with the rifle of his choice.
> 
> I think he could have bought those items if he bought the rifle first, don't you?



Hey we let those little hooligans run around with baseball bats and shit.  We all know that more people are killed with blunt objects like bats than they are with rifles so letting a kid have a rifle is statistically safer than letting him have a baseball bat.


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## Luissa

flacaltenn said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But he can use it legally, which was his point. Are you slow and stupid?
> 
> I could really care less if people arm their children, I just hope they are smart enough to teach them gun safety.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats  quite rational of you..  State laws vary about juvy possession and ownership. And the seemingling subtle difference about who OWNS a particular gun in the family cabinet is important to the firearms training that you mentioned..  Nobody takes ANYTHING out the cabinet unless its theirs.  And giving "ownership" is one of the most important milestones in the firearms safety training.  THIS is the job of the parent or the trainer,  NOT a collective judgement.....
Click to expand...



Your point? I don't think I stated anything differently. 


Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.


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## DriftingSand

I got my first rifle when I was 12.  A 30.30 Winchester, lever-action, deer rifle.  I hunted with it for several years before I sold it.  I took a hands-on safety course before I ever used it.  I now only have 13 firearms but am thinking of getting a couple of more.  I likes 'em a lot ... a whole lot.


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## DriftingSand

Luissa said:


> Luissa said:
> 
> 
> 
> But he can use it legally, which was his point. Are you slow and stupid?
> *I could really care less if people arm their children, I just hope they are smart enough to teach them gun safety. *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah ... what she said ^^^^^^
Click to expand...


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## Luissa

This is why I am fine with arming your children. 
http://m.nydailynews.com/1.1703614#bmb=1

This young girl also had a tag to shoot a cougar. If you want a cougar come to Washington right now.( not a pick up line) 
My brothers grew up on a ranch and had guns from a young age. Guns and gun training is very important in some people's lives. My son has actually shot a gun at the ranch my brother runs. 
I do love it when right wingers think I am anti gun. I do agree with background checks and being licensed. 


Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.


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## WinterBorn

I taught all my children to shoot before they were 12.  By the time she was 12, my step-daughter was an excellent marksman and followed the safety rules better than many adults at the gun range.

She didn't like recoil, but with a Ruger .22 rifle she was accurate, safe, and enjoyed it a great deal.


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## DriftingSand

WinterBorn said:


> I taught all my children to shoot before they were 12.  By the time she was 12, my step-daughter was an excellent marksman and followed the safety rules better than many adults at the gun range.
> 
> She didn't like recoil, but with a Ruger .22 rifle she was accurate, safe, and enjoyed it a great deal.



More than one kid has saved the lives of his or her family as a result of knowing how to use a gun and having one readily available.  I think that gun use and safety should be an elective in public schools.  If they can teach "safe sex" then thy can teach safe self defense.


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## 007

Jarlaxle said:


> 13?  I think my uncle was eight when he got his first rifle!



Exactly. I was 9 when I first ventured out into the woods carrying my own Remington, single shot .22 rifle.


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## Swagger

On the school playing field we fired a Luger one of our schoolmasters captured during the allied invasion of Europe. Can't remember how old I was, but I didn't have a pube to my name.


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## Spiderman

Swagger said:


> On the school playing field we fired a Luger one of our schoolmasters captured during the allied invasion of Europe. Can't remember how old I was, but I didn't have a pube to my name.



And it was fun, right?


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## RetiredGySgt

Luissa said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asclepias said:
> 
> 
> 
> Puts things in perspective.  He cant buy a lottery ticket legally but he can buy a device that can kill someone  and do it legally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No he can not. Again for the slow and stupid, Federal law bars anyone under 18 from buying a rifle or shotgun from a licensed dealer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> But he can use it legally, which was his point. Are you slow and stupid?
> I could really care less if people arm their children, I just hope they are smart enough to teach them gun safety.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using the tears of Raider's fans.
Click to expand...


Reading comprehension is not your strong suit I see. Your quoted statement CLEARLY says that the tyke could not buy certain things but that HE could buy a firearm and did. And implied that was the law.


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## Spoonman

Here is what liberal laws do.  NY passed the safe act and its registration claus goes into effect in April.   So what you have right now are a few things. some will register their guns, some will refuse to register their guns and you have a group who are saying i just don't want to deal with this and are now selling their guns before the date.  so now you have a rash of people just dumping guns to anyone who will buy them.  makes you wonder whose hands all of these unregistered, untraceable weapons will fall into .  But that's liberal legislation for you.    andrew Cuomo is a complete and total ass.


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