# Deflate-gate? Report: Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs



## Alex.

"The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.

The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces. 

The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."

Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports



I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.



Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.


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## Freewill

The only deflated balls on the field were those of the Colts after that ass beating.

But it is funny that the deflated balls story even makes headlines.  It is only because we know that the Patriots have been caught cheating in the past.  Once a thief always a thief.

I doubt I watch.


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## Alex.

The Patriots soundly kicked butt.


Beli-cheat has taken the game down a bad road. I would not take free tickets and spent my time anymore because of this type of activity.


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## longknife

The winners boast and go on while the losers whine and try to find blame with everyone but themselves.


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## hortysir

As much as this Dolphin despises the Pats, just coz they won doesn't mean they cheated.
I had high hopes for Luck and the Colts but their game play made me wonder howthe he'll they made it to this game.

Super Bowl IL should be a really good match up


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## HereWeGoAgain

Even if true I find it hard to believe it would account for the ass whipping they received.


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## iamwhatiseem

No amount of minor cheating would have changed the game's outcome. The Colts were trounced.
However - if I was a Patriots fan I would be embarrassed. Bellicheat is a disgrace to the league.
I could not stomach supporting a franchise that allows a head coach to cheat and continue coaching.
 I remember years back when Dallas went through a similar deal - everyone called them the "Dallas Convicts"
At least they changed their ways.
The Patriots? Apparently they think it is okay.


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## Alex.

From the posts here it looks like cheating is an accepted practice. smh


The Patriots soundly beat the Colts, why cheat? the Patriots did not need any help.


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## manifold

Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum! 

The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.

suck it, losers.


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## Alex.

manifold said:


> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.



Allegedly, the NFL asked Belichick for the Patriots' balls so they could further test them. Belichick, through a Patriot spokesman said, "We do not have any balls". 




j/k


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## TruthSeeker56

Alex. said:


> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.



There will always be PLENTY of Patriots haters out there, spewing nonsense about deflated balls, spying on other teams (like THAT is something new in the NFL), and other assorted NONSENSE.

A lot of people HATE success. A lot of people have serious problems with jealousy and envy. A lot of people are nothing more than useful idiots.

Let's face the facts.  Even if there were a SHRED of truth to the footballs being deflated, the balls were deflated for BOTH teams. So there was no advantage gained by either team. Unless of course somebody has film of a mysterious Patriots flunky deflating the footballs that only the Patriots used. LMAO!

Get over it, Patriots haters. Suck it up, and move on to some other "conspiracy theory". There are plenty of them out there.


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## Iceweasel

So Andrew Luck doesn't know what a regulation football feels like? Doubt it. 
I think someone must have inflated the Seahawks' tires at the last minute though.


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## Nutz

Cheating is cheating, no matter how minor or how big the Patriots won. This is not the first time they have been accused.  The last time, the were found to be cheaters...this time, we will see. 

I am not a hater, but if they did cheat...they need to lose more than a draft pick and someone needs to be banned from the NFL.


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## Nutz

TruthSeeker56 said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There will always be PLENTY of Patriots haters out there, spewing nonsense about deflated balls, spying on other teams (like THAT is something new in the NFL), and other assorted NONSENSE.
> 
> A lot of people HATE success. A lot of people have serious problems with jealousy and envy. A lot of people are nothing more than useful idiots.
> 
> Let's face the facts.  *Even if there were a SHRED of truth to the footballs being deflated, the balls were deflated for BOTH teams*. So there was no advantage gained by either team. Unless of course somebody has film of a mysterious Patriots flunky deflating the footballs that only the Patriots used. LMAO!
> 
> Get over it, Patriots haters. Suck it up, and move on to some other "conspiracy theory". There are plenty of them out there.
Click to expand...


Not true...each team supplies their OWN footballs.


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## Nutz

Iceweasel said:


> So Andrew Luck doesn't know what a regulation football feels like? Doubt it.
> I think someone must have inflated the Seahawks' tires at the last minute though.


Again, Luck wouldn't have used New England's footballs.


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## Iceweasel

Nutz said:


> Iceweasel said:
> 
> 
> 
> So Andrew Luck doesn't know what a regulation football feels like? Doubt it.
> I think someone must have inflated the Seahawks' tires at the last minute though.
> 
> 
> 
> Again, Luck wouldn't have used New England's footballs.
Click to expand...

I heard him say any advantage would have benefited the Colts as well.


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## manifold

Nutz said:


> Cheating is cheating, no matter how minor or how big the Patriots won. This is not the first time they have been accused.  *The last time, the were found to be cheaters*...this time, we will see.



False


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## Freewill

longknife said:


> The winners boast and go on while the losers whine and try to find blame with everyone but themselves.



Problem, it is the NFL investigating.


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## Alex.

TruthSeeker56 said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There will always be PLENTY of Patriots haters out there, spewing nonsense about deflated balls, spying on other teams (like THAT is something new in the NFL), and other assorted NONSENSE.
> 
> A lot of people HATE success. A lot of people have serious problems with jealousy and envy. A lot of people are nothing more than useful idiots.
> 
> Let's face the facts.  Even if there were a SHRED of truth to the footballs being deflated, the balls were deflated for BOTH teams. So there was no advantage gained by either team. Unless of course somebody has film of a mysterious Patriots flunky deflating the footballs that only the Patriots used. LMAO!
> 
> Get over it, Patriots haters. Suck it up, and move on to some other "conspiracy theory". There are plenty of them out there.
Click to expand...



Nope not a "Patriot hater" but a hater of those that cheat.


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## Freewill

Alex. said:


> TruthSeeker56 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There will always be PLENTY of Patriots haters out there, spewing nonsense about deflated balls, spying on other teams (like THAT is something new in the NFL), and other assorted NONSENSE.
> 
> A lot of people HATE success. A lot of people have serious problems with jealousy and envy. A lot of people are nothing more than useful idiots.
> 
> Let's face the facts.  Even if there were a SHRED of truth to the footballs being deflated, the balls were deflated for BOTH teams. So there was no advantage gained by either team. Unless of course somebody has film of a mysterious Patriots flunky deflating the footballs that only the Patriots used. LMAO!
> 
> Get over it, Patriots haters. Suck it up, and move on to some other "conspiracy theory". There are plenty of them out there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Nope not a "Patriot hater" but a hater of those that cheat.
Click to expand...


I won't hide it, I think I hate the Patriots and the Cowboys, not sure in which order.  I am not even I know why.  I think mostly because they put on the airs of being America's team.

Old Billychek is supposedly such a football genius yet he didn't know that video taping the opponents defensive calls was cheating?  Really?  I hope that the Patriots lose just like GB lost, the whining and crying will be deafening.


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## Alex.

Freewill said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TruthSeeker56 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There will always be PLENTY of Patriots haters out there, spewing nonsense about deflated balls, spying on other teams (like THAT is something new in the NFL), and other assorted NONSENSE.
> 
> A lot of people HATE success. A lot of people have serious problems with jealousy and envy. A lot of people are nothing more than useful idiots.
> 
> Let's face the facts.  Even if there were a SHRED of truth to the footballs being deflated, the balls were deflated for BOTH teams. So there was no advantage gained by either team. Unless of course somebody has film of a mysterious Patriots flunky deflating the footballs that only the Patriots used. LMAO!
> 
> Get over it, Patriots haters. Suck it up, and move on to some other "conspiracy theory". There are plenty of them out there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Nope not a "Patriot hater" but a hater of those that cheat.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I won't hide it, I think I hate the Patriots and the Cowboys, not sure in which order.  I am not even I know why.  I think mostly because they put on the airs of being America's team.
> 
> Old Billychek is supposedly such a football genius yet he didn't know that video taping the opponents defensive calls was cheating?  Really?  I hope that the Patriots lose just like GB lost, the whining and crying will be deafening.
Click to expand...

The America's Team thing is bullshit, I agree. It is not about a team, I respect the efforts of any ball players regardless of who they play for; not cheaters though.


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## Nutz

manifold said:


> Nutz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is cheating, no matter how minor or how big the Patriots won. This is not the first time they have been accused.  *The last time, the were found to be cheaters*...this time, we will see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> False
Click to expand...

They didn't lose a draft pick after the last scandal of filming the opposition?


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## C_Clayton_Jones

The much-hated Patriots.


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## Freewill

Nutz said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nutz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is cheating, no matter how minor or how big the Patriots won. This is not the first time they have been accused.  *The last time, the were found to be cheaters*...this time, we will see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> False
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They didn't lose a draft pick after the last scandal of filming the opposition?
Click to expand...


A cool 3/4 of million and a first round draft pick.

NFL fines Belichick strips Patriots of draft pick - NFL.com

New England coach Bill Belichick was fined the NFL maximum of $500,000 Thursday and the Patriotswere ordered to pay $250,000 for spying on an opponent's defensive signals.

The commissioner also ordered the team to give up next year's first-round draft choice if it reaches the playoffs and second- and third-round picks if it doesn't. If the Patriots lose their first-rounder next season they still will have a first-round pick, obtained from San Francisco in the deal that brought Moss from Oakland.

"This episode represents a calculated and deliberate attempt to avoid longstanding rules designed to encourage fair play and promote honest competition on the playing field," Goodell said in a letter to the Patriots.


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## Nutz

Freewill said:


> Nutz said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nutz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is cheating, no matter how minor or how big the Patriots won. This is not the first time they have been accused.  *The last time, the were found to be cheaters*...this time, we will see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> False
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They didn't lose a draft pick after the last scandal of filming the opposition?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A cool 3/4 of million and a first round draft pick.
> 
> NFL fines Belichick strips Patriots of draft pick - NFL.com
> 
> New England coach Bill Belichick was fined the NFL maximum of $500,000 Thursday and the Patriotswere ordered to pay $250,000 for spying on an opponent's defensive signals.
> 
> The commissioner also ordered the team to give up next year's first-round draft choice if it reaches the playoffs and second- and third-round picks if it doesn't. If the Patriots lose their first-rounder next season they still will have a first-round pick, obtained from San Francisco in the deal that brought Moss from Oakland.
> 
> "This episode represents a calculated and deliberate attempt to avoid longstanding rules designed to encourage fair play and promote honest competition on the playing field," Goodell said in a letter to the Patriots.
Click to expand...

Thank you.


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## manifold

Nutz said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nutz said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is cheating, no matter how minor or how big the Patriots won. This is not the first time they have been accused.  *The last time, the were found to be cheaters*...this time, we will see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> False
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They didn't lose a draft pick after the last scandal of filming the opposition?
Click to expand...


They did.

But being found in violation of league policy =/= cheating.  They weren't even using the video during the game and the alleged policy they violated was a memo sent out over a year earlier. Goodell is a petty twat, which is the only reason the punishment was so harsh.

Sean Payton was suspended for a year for Bounty-gate, was that cheating?

Pretty much every team in the league has lost draft picks over the years for tampering, is that cheating?

I guess an argument can be made that it's all cheating, if one takes a very liberal view of what constitutes cheating, but I would disagree.


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## Alex.

"The investigation of illegally under-inflated footballs possibly being used by the Patriots in their AFC Championship Game triumph Sunday began following a second-quarter interception of Brady by Colts linebacker D’Qwell Jackson, a source told Newsday.

Jackson, picking off a pass intended for tight end Rob Gronkowski near the goal line with the Patriots ahead 14-0, returned to the Colts sideline and gave the ball to a member of the team’s equipment staff. That person reportedly noticed the ball seemed under-inflated and notified coach Chuck Pagano, who passed the information up the food chain to general manager Ryan Grigson, who contacted NFL director of football operations Mike Kensil."

NFL investigating whether New England Patriots deflated footballs against Indianapolis Colts - ESPN Boston

I say throw the rule book out.


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## HUGGY

The receivers should have an easier time catching hard thrown footballs that land "softer".  THAT effect could be significant.  Two of Wilson's ints probably would not have skipped off Kearse's hands had the balls been more forgiving.


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## JoeMoma

It seems that 11 of 12 of the Patriots footballs were under inflated.  IMHO, if this proves that the Patriots cheated, the win should be overturned and the colts should go to the SB.


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## hortysir

HUGGY said:


> The receivers should have an easier time catching hard thrown footballs that land "softer".  THAT effect could be significant.  Two of Wilson's ints probably would not have skipped off Kearse's hands had the balls been more forgiving.


Apparently that's what tipped them off (pun).
When Indy intercepted the ball the guy that caught the ball took it to their bench coz he thought it was softer than usual


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## ChrisL

Hmm, I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.


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## ChrisL

I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.


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## ChrisL

The Colts are the ones with the deflated balls after the ass whooping they took.


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## hortysir

I agree with all of the above.
But if I fail a test and someone else passes because they cheated doesn't null the point that they cheated


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## Alex.




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## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Hmm, I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.


The question is not why the Colts lost it is how the Patriots won. 

Great playing 




and deflated balls. CHEATING!


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## deltex1

Do you have to know a ball is deflated in order to take advantage of the deflated ball?  Does a deflated ball affect the way the offensive line makes their blocks?


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## HereWeGoAgain

So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.

    But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.


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## Alex.

HereWeGoAgain said:


> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.




It is not whether NE would have won, it is NE repeatedly breaks the rules that everyone has to follow. The intergrity of the game has been damaged once again by Beli-cheat & Company


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## HereWeGoAgain

Alex. said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is not whether NE would have won, it is NE repeatedly breaks the rules that everyone has to follow. The intergrity of the game has been damaged once again by Beli-cheat & Company
Click to expand...


 Which I addressed.
I think the penalty should be harsh since this is his second infraction.
   I wouldnt be opposed to a multi year ban for Bellacheat or maybe a loss of all draft picks for a season or two.


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## JoeMoma

HereWeGoAgain said:


> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.


Unless the punishment for the offense really hurts, the Ps will keep on cheating.  Don't you think if given the option that they would pay a few million and give up a draft pick to win the Super Bowl.  Got to really make it hurt when a team knowing cheats.  Void the win!  kick them out of the Super Bowl.


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## HereWeGoAgain

JoeMoma said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> Unless the punishment for the offense really hurts, the Ps will keep on cheating.  Don't you think if given the option that they would pay a few million and give up a draft pick to win the Super Bowl.  Got to really make it hurt when a team knowing cheats.  Void the win!  kick them out of the Super Bowl.
Click to expand...



   You obviously missed post #40.


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## manifold

JoeMoma said:


> Void the win!  kick them out of the Super Bowl.



Never gonna happen.


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## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.



Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.


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## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> Hmm,* I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too*?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.



In a way yes.  The rain on a properly inflated ball is much harder to catch than one that conforms to the receivers hands upon arrival.

You can scoff if that's how you deal with finding out a win may very well be tainted..and YES it is VERY feasible that a 6 TD advantage in those conditions could have occurred.  

There is a REASON why the balls must be inflated to a certain pressure.


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## SwimExpert

HereWeGoAgain said:


> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.



We know he was video taping other teams for seven years.  And we know that as early as 2011 Tom Brady was favoring deflated footballs.  So I'm guessing that this is not the first time they've done this.

Belichick should be suspended indefinitely.  He's a known cheater who is not changing his ways.  And considering the fact that Goodell already has one mark against him this season for under-addressing bad behavior in the league, I would think it would be an easy decision for him to do so.


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## HUGGY

If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.

If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.


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## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm,* I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too*?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In a way yes.  The rain on a properly inflated ball is much harder to catch than one that conforms to the receivers hands upon arrival.
> 
> You can scoff if that's how you deal with finding out a win may very well be tainted..and YES it is VERY feasible that a 6 TD advantage in those conditions could have occurred.
> 
> There is a REASON why the balls must be inflated to a certain pressure.
Click to expand...


Did you watch the game?  The Patriots played a MUCH better game, clearly.  It had nothing to do with "deflated balls."  Lol.


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## aaronleland

It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.


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## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
Click to expand...


Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.


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## ChrisL

aaronleland said:


> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.



The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.


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## aaronleland

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm,* I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too*?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In a way yes.  The rain on a properly inflated ball is much harder to catch than one that conforms to the receivers hands upon arrival.
> 
> You can scoff if that's how you deal with finding out a win may very well be tainted..and YES it is VERY feasible that a 6 TD advantage in those conditions could have occurred.
> 
> There is a REASON why the balls must be inflated to a certain pressure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did you watch the game?  The Patriots played a MUCH better game, clearly.  It had nothing to do with "deflated balls."  Lol.
Click to expand...


They cheated. End of story. Whether or not they still would have won changes nothing.


----------



## ChrisL

That's even if any of this is true.  Also, if officials got complaints during the FIRST half, or since the beginning of the game, then I am sure they were watching out for this afterwards.  The whole thing is just stupid, IMO.


----------



## ChrisL

aaronleland said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm,* I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too*?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In a way yes.  The rain on a properly inflated ball is much harder to catch than one that conforms to the receivers hands upon arrival.
> 
> You can scoff if that's how you deal with finding out a win may very well be tainted..and YES it is VERY feasible that a 6 TD advantage in those conditions could have occurred.
> 
> There is a REASON why the balls must be inflated to a certain pressure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did you watch the game?  The Patriots played a MUCH better game, clearly.  It had nothing to do with "deflated balls."  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They cheated. End of story. Whether or not they still would have won changes nothing.
Click to expand...


Do you have proof?  I'll wait for your proof.   

Also, the Patriots played a better game.  End of story.  Deflated footballs does not explain why the other team could not score against the Pats defense.  Sorry.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
Click to expand...

Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?  


Pats cheat plain and simple.


----------



## ChrisL

If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
Click to expand...


You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.


----------



## Alex.

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is not whether NE would have won, it is NE repeatedly breaks the rules that everyone has to follow. The intergrity of the game has been damaged once again by Beli-cheat & Company
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Which I addressed.
> I think the penalty should be harsh since this is his second infraction.
> I wouldnt be opposed to a multi year ban for Bellacheat or maybe a loss of all draft picks for a season or two.
Click to expand...



A concurrence is more than welcome in this thread. I wonder where all the people who crawled up my ass claiming I was a hater are now that it is proven the balls were deflated?


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
Click to expand...


Cheating is cheating.  There's no excuse for it.  I know we live in a liberalized instant-gratification world where gimme-gimmie-gimmie is said to be the justification of everything, so you probably can't get that through your head.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
Click to expand...


Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.


----------



## Desperado

Did the NFL also check the footballs the Colts used?


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Do you have proof?



Report 11 of Patriots game balls were underinflated


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cheating is cheating.  There's no excuse for it.  I know we live in a liberalized instant-gratification world where gimme-gimmie-gimmie is said to be the justification of everything, so you probably can't get that through your head.
Click to expand...


Pats played better.  End of story.    Now you can pout if you want, but those are the facts.  Anyone with an ounce of sense who watched the game would know that much.  Lol.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have proof?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Report 11 of Patriots game balls were underinflated
Click to expand...


It's an accusation under investigation, moron.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Pats played better.



Cheating has that effect.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have proof?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Report 11 of Patriots game balls were underinflated
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's an accusation under investigation, moron.
Click to expand...


No, it's been confirmed that 11 of the balls were under inflated.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm,* I wonder if those deflated balls are the reason why the Colts couldn't score too*?    Sounds like a bunch of sore losers to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In a way yes.  The rain on a properly inflated ball is much harder to catch than one that conforms to the receivers hands upon arrival.
> 
> You can scoff if that's how you deal with finding out a win may very well be tainted..and YES it is VERY feasible that a 6 TD advantage in those conditions could have occurred.
> 
> There is a REASON why the balls must be inflated to a certain pressure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did you watch the game?  The Patriots played a MUCH better game, clearly.  It had nothing to do with "deflated balls."  Lol.
Click to expand...


You are clearly not the brightest bulb on the XMas tree are you sugar tits.  If you can't understand how an under inflated ball is easier to catch in wet conditions than one that is rock hard then you had probably better stay out of the conversation.


----------



## ChrisL

The Pats win games because:

1)  They are an ELITE football team.  
2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.  
3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.  

Nuff said, haters.


----------



## JoeMoma

JoeMoma said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> Unless the punishment for the offense really hurts, the Ps will keep on cheating.  Don't you think if given the option that they would pay a few million and give up a draft pick to win the Super Bowl.  Got to really make it hurt when a team knowing cheats.  Void the win!  kick them out of the Super Bowl.
Click to expand...

Perhaps I did considering thpe time it takes me to make a post on my little iPad.  However, my opinion in post # 41 remains the same.


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.



Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> The Pats win games because:
> 
> 1)  They are an ELITE football team.
> 2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.
> 3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.
> 
> Nuff said, haters.



Then why the need to cheat?  They have a long documented history of cheating.  If everything you say is true, why all the cheating?


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have proof?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Report 11 of Patriots game balls were underinflated
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's an accusation under investigation, moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, it's been confirmed that 11 of the balls were under inflated.
Click to expand...


In your own link it says "citing "league sources either involved or familiar with the investigation."  There is an investigation underway.  There has been NO outcome announced as of yet that I'm aware of.  

"NFL spokesman Michael Signora said in an email the league is "not commenting on the matter at this time."


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> In your own link it says "citing "league sources either involved or familiar with the investigation."  There is an investigation underway.  There has been NO outcome announced as of yet that I'm aware of.
> 
> "NFL spokesman Michael Signora said in an email the league is "not commenting on the matter at this time."





Someone's in denial.  Probably due to your strong desire to have Brady's penis inside your mouth.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> In your own link it says "citing "league sources either involved or familiar with the investigation."  There is an investigation underway.  There has been NO outcome announced as of yet that I'm aware of.
> 
> "NFL spokesman Michael Signora said in an email the league is "not commenting on the matter at this time."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone's in denial.  Probably due to your strong desire to have Brady's penis inside your mouth.
Click to expand...


Well, given your apparent obsession with him and the Patriots and cheating, and considering that you brought it up, perhaps it's you who wants his penis in YOUR mouth?


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
Click to expand...


Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> In your own link it says "citing "league sources either involved or familiar with the investigation."  There is an investigation underway.  There has been NO outcome announced as of yet that I'm aware of.
> 
> "NFL spokesman Michael Signora said in an email the league is "not commenting on the matter at this time."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone's in denial.  Probably due to your strong desire to have Brady's penis inside your mouth.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, given your apparent obsession with him and the Patriots and cheating, and considering that you brought it up, perhaps it's you who wants his penis in YOUR mouth?
Click to expand...


----------



## Jroc

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats win games because:
> 
> 1)  They are an ELITE football team.
> 2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.
> 3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.
> 
> Nuff said, haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why the need to cheat?  They have a long documented history of cheating.  If everything you say is true, why all the cheating?
Click to expand...

Hater


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> In your own link it says "citing "league sources either involved or familiar with the investigation."  There is an investigation underway.  There has been NO outcome announced as of yet that I'm aware of.
> 
> "NFL spokesman Michael Signora said in an email the league is "not commenting on the matter at this time."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone's in denial.  Probably due to your strong desire to have Brady's penis inside your mouth.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, given your apparent obsession with him and the Patriots and cheating, and considering that you brought it up, perhaps it's you who wants his penis in YOUR mouth?
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


Funny, yet proves nothing.


----------



## Papageorgio

And Carroll cheated. So, what, every game there are penalties for cheating.

Holding, pass interference, illegal formation all cheating, all penalties.


----------



## ChrisL

Jroc said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats win games because:
> 
> 1)  They are an ELITE football team.
> 2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.
> 3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.
> 
> Nuff said, haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why the need to cheat?  They have a long documented history of cheating.  If everything you say is true, why all the cheating?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hater
Click to expand...


Any of them would take any member of the Patriots, players or staff, gladly as a member of their respective teams, I'm sure.  Lol.  The Pats ROLLED the Colts.  None of this deflated football stuff explains the stomping the Colts received.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
Click to expand...


I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.  

Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.

In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.  

When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.

Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.  

Have a nice day cupcake.


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> And Carroll cheated. So, what, every game there are penalties for cheating.
> 
> Holding, pass interference, illegal formation all cheating, all penalties.



Please feel free to point out how Carroll cheated last Sunday.


----------



## HUGGY

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
Click to expand...


At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
Click to expand...


The Seahawks game has nothing to do with the NE game.  Two entirely different games with two entirely different teams, so  . . .  . no point was made.  NE rolled over the Colts like a train.  Brady is a Hall of Fame QB for a reason, and it isn't because he plays with deflated balls.  Lol.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
Click to expand...


That's what you wish anyway.  Lol.


----------



## ChrisL

This is all well and good though, because Brady and the Patriots play their absolute BEST under pressure it seems, and when they are the underdog.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
Click to expand...


Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.


----------



## HUGGY

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats win games because:
> 
> 1)  They are an ELITE football team.
> 2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.
> 3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.
> 
> Nuff said, haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why the need to cheat?  They have a long documented history of cheating.  If everything you say is true, why all the cheating?
Click to expand...


Nothing ChrisL says is true.  She doesn't know what she is talking about.  Having never caught a football thrown hard in the rain she is out of her league and experience level to comment truthfully about this topic.


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
Click to expand...

Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
Click to expand...


Please, your spiel is getting lame.  Obviously you are a hater, that is why you jumped right on the hater bandwagon, being a poster who never participates in the NFL forums.  

  That's what I think of you and your opinions about the Patriots.


----------



## HUGGY

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
Click to expand...


Seattle won the game. Suck it.


----------



## Alex.

NFL Network is producing another Football Life series about Beli-cheat

This will be the theme song


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats win games because:
> 
> 1)  They are an ELITE football team.
> 2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.
> 3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.
> 
> Nuff said, haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why the need to cheat?  They have a long documented history of cheating.  If everything you say is true, why all the cheating?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Nothing ChrisL says is true.  She doesn't know what she is talking about.  Having never caught a football thrown hard in the rain she is out of her league and experience level to comment truthfully about this topic.
Click to expand...


  That means nothing.  Obviously, deflated balls has nothing to do with why the Colts offense was SO ineffective against the Patriots defense.  Give me a break.


----------



## hangover

Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
Click to expand...

Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and Brady and isn't choke job Peyton Manning


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, your spiel is getting lame.  Obviously you are a hater, that is why you jumped right on the hater bandwagon, being a poster who never participates in the NFL forums.
> 
> That's what I think of you and your opinions about the Patriots.
Click to expand...


LOL the facts are the balls were deflated. Much like your argument.


----------



## ChrisL

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
Click to expand...


I wasn't impressed with Seattle either.  They really didn't look that good out on the field, not like the Patriots anyway.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Brady is a Hall of Fame QB for a reason



Deflated balls.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, your spiel is getting lame.  Obviously you are a hater, that is why you jumped right on the hater bandwagon, being a poster who never participates in the NFL forums.
> 
> That's what I think of you and your opinions about the Patriots.
Click to expand...


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seattle won the game. Suck it.
Click to expand...


Hopefully the Pats will be making Seattle suck it.  Tee-hee!


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Brady is a Hall of Fame QB for a reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls.
Click to expand...


Don't talk about yourself like that.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, your spiel is getting lame.  Obviously you are a hater, that is why you jumped right on the hater bandwagon, being a poster who never participates in the NFL forums.
> 
> That's what I think of you and your opinions about the Patriots.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


I can't WAIT for the Superbowl, Huggy bear!


----------



## hortysir

hangover said:


> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.


In all fairness a ref has no idea how a 50mph ball feels like when caught


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Brady is a Hall of Fame QB for a reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't talk about yourself like that.
Click to expand...


And considering this is the extent of your intellect, you'd be doing your team a better service to stay quiet and stop highlighting how pathetic Patriots fans are, and how pathetic their team is.


----------



## HUGGY

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and *Brady and isn't choke job* Peyton Manning
Click to expand...


Neither is Aaron Rodgers..   Oh wait!  He *DOUBLE CHOKED *last Sunday.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
Click to expand...


So you feel the same about Carroll?


----------



## HUGGY

hortysir said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.
> 
> 
> 
> In all fairness a ref has no idea how a 50mph ball feels like when caught
Click to expand...


We Seattle fans are NOT desperate.  We are happily awaiting our 2nd Super Bowl appearance in so many seasons.  Thank you very much.


----------



## hortysir

HUGGY said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and *Brady and isn't choke job* Peyton Manning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Neither is Aaron Rodgers..   Oh wait!  He *DOUBLE CHOKED *last Sunday.
Click to expand...

"Discount double" choked?


----------



## hangover

Brady is the Obama of the NFL. The haters look for any chance to undermine and disrespect him. Or maybe it's Belicheck. Think they'll get them both banned from the HOF?


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and *Brady and isn't choke job* Peyton Manning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Neither is Aaron Rodgers..   Oh wait!  He *DOUBLE CHOKED *last Sunday.
Click to expand...

Rodgers played great on one leg it, wasn't his fault they blew it. Conservatives coaching lost that game and a little Seattle luck they played like shit (at home)...and if Rodgers was healthy it'd have been a blow out.... Try to keep it real shall we?


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, your spiel is getting lame.  Obviously you are a hater, that is why you jumped right on the hater bandwagon, being a poster who never participates in the NFL forums.
> 
> That's what I think of you and your opinions about the Patriots.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't WAIT for the Superbowl, Huggy bear!
Click to expand...


I can't wait to re-visit this thread after the game.


----------



## HUGGY

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and *Brady and isn't choke job* Peyton Manning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Neither is Aaron Rodgers..   Oh wait!  He *DOUBLE CHOKED *last Sunday.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rodgers played great on one leg it wasn't his fault they blew it. Conservatives coaching lost that game and a little Seattle luck they played like shit
Click to expand...


Ya...he was GREAT!  How many TDs?  One?  Wilson 3.  

Oh my!  Wilson threw for more yards than Rodgers!

How could THAT be?.  

Wilson going to his second Super Bowl in his three years playing in the NFL.

Rodgers is crying in his beer telling anyone that will listen that Green Bay was the better team.


----------



## HUGGY

hortysir said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> If Seattle wins big against NE when both teams will be playing under the same conditions including the properties of the very focus of the game, The Football, there will be further talk and probably testing by the NFL to determine somehow what actual advantage the under inflated footballs gave the Patriots in their game with the Colts.
> 
> If it can be determined that the Pats had an unfair advantage then they should be punished.  If the trail of the cheating lands on Belichick's desk then he should be suspended from the NFL just like Sean Payton was in New Orleans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and *Brady and isn't choke job* Peyton Manning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Neither is Aaron Rodgers..   Oh wait!  He *DOUBLE CHOKED *last Sunday.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> "Discount double" choked?
Click to expand...


Ya...That's the one!


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tom Brady will win his 4th of 6 superbowls!! Which would put him at the top of the list of the best Quarterbacks to ever play the game. Did i mention he's a "Michigan man"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At the end of the Super Bowl Brady will be crying just like Peyton Manning was last year.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle is not the team they were last year. They'll loose and *Brady and isn't choke job* Peyton Manning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Neither is Aaron Rodgers..   Oh wait!  He *DOUBLE CHOKED *last Sunday.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rodgers played great on one leg it wasn't his fault they blew it. Conservatives coaching lost that game and a little Seattle luck they played like shit
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ya...he was GREAT!  How many TDs?  One?  Wilson 3.
> 
> Oh my!  Wilson threw for more yards than Rodgers!
> 
> How could THAT be?.
> 
> Wilson going to his second Super Bowl in his three years playing in the NFL.
> 
> Rodgers is crying in his beer telling anyone that will listen that Green Bay was the better team.
Click to expand...

Aaron Rodgers on one leg is a much better quaterback that Russell Wilson on two legs...4 interceptions!!  You should be embarrassed at the way Seattle played at home


----------



## aaronleland

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats win games because:
> 
> 1)  They are an ELITE football team.
> 2)  They are excellently coached and play well together as a team with little to no fuss going on in the locker room.  Patriots don't tolerate that.
> 3)  They have an excellent Hall of Fame QB, as well as many other very good players on the team.
> 
> Nuff said, haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why the need to cheat?  They have a long documented history of cheating.  If everything you say is true, why all the cheating?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Nothing ChrisL says is true.  She doesn't know what she is talking about.  Having never caught a football thrown hard in the rain she is out of her league and experience level to comment truthfully about this topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That means nothing.  Obviously, deflated balls has nothing to do with why the Colts offense was SO ineffective against the Patriots defense.  Give me a break.
Click to expand...


They cheated. It doesn't matter how much they won by.


----------



## JoeMoma

manifold said:


> JoeMoma said:
> 
> 
> 
> Void the win!  kick them out of the Super Bowl.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never gonna happen.
Click to expand...

You are most likely right,  but it's what should happen.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Read the previous cited sources. I do agree no one like a liar and the only one posted about here is Beli-cheat he is a lair and a cheater.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, your spiel is getting lame.  Obviously you are a hater, that is why you jumped right on the hater bandwagon, being a poster who never participates in the NFL forums.
> 
> That's what I think of you and your opinions about the Patriots.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't WAIT for the Superbowl, Huggy bear!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't wait to re-visit this thread after the game.
Click to expand...


Me neither.  I hope the Pats roll the Seagulls too.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Brady is a Hall of Fame QB for a reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Deflated balls.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Don't talk about yourself like that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And considering this is the extent of your intellect, you'd be doing your team a better service to stay quiet and stop highlighting how pathetic Patriots fans are, and how pathetic their team is.
Click to expand...


  Waa-waa!


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Deflated balls are not tricks. they are cheats. What is this the NFL version of Halloween?
> 
> 
> Pats cheat plain and simple.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You should STFU unless you have some evidence, I think.    Not to mention, you probably aren't even a football fan.  You NEVER post in this forum.  LOL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Evidence is amply provided by the NFL.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The NFL has declined to comment.  Don't lie.  No one likes a liar.
Click to expand...



Here's your proof hater 







j/k


----------



## ChrisL

This is all you need to see haters.


----------



## ChrisL




----------



## aaronleland

Everybody acknowledges that deflated balls wouldn't have made much difference in such a one-sided game. But their 35-31 win against the Ravens...?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> 
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> 
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.



It clearly had no bearing on the game but its one more asterick next to the allegedly great coach Beli-CHEAT.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> This is all you need to see haters.



Uh, you think anything about the Ravens/Pats game says anything good about your team?  The Ravens secondary had been decimated with injuries this season.  They had some 7 or 8 players from the secondary on the IR list this year, and by the time the post season came around they were starting 6th stringers.  And yet they held strong against Brady and the Pats offense that you think so grand.  The Patriots had to pull out every trick they could think of, including their ineligible receiver fiasco that they only got away with because they officials didn't know what was going on.

So yeah, maybe all we need to know about the Patriots is right there in the Ravens game.  Seems to all really point to the conclusion that the Pats can't win without playing fast and loose with the rules.


----------



## ChrisL

aaronleland said:


> Everybody acknowledges that deflated balls wouldn't have made much difference in such a one-sided game. But their 35-31 win against the Ravens...?



Well, I thought I would show both of the Pats playoff games to be fair.  They won because of skill and persistence.


----------



## Papageorgio

aaronleland said:


> Everybody acknowledges that deflated balls wouldn't have made much difference in such a one-sided game. But their 35-31 win against the Ravens...?



We're the balls deflated?  

I find it all amusing, Carroll cheated at USC, Seattle fans have no issue with him cheating and Belichek, the Patriot fans have no issue with him cheating.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is all you need to see haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh, you think anything about the Ravens/Pats game says anything good about your team?  The Ravens secondary had been decimated with injuries this season.  They had some 7 or 8 players from the secondary on the IR list this year, and by the time the post season came around they were starting 6th stringers.  And yet they held strong against Brady and the Pats offense that you think so grand.  The Patriots had to pull out every trick they could think of, including their ineligible receiver fiasco that they only got away with because they officials didn't know what was going on.
> 
> So yeah, maybe all we need to know about the Patriots is right there in the Ravens game.  Seems to all really point to the conclusion that the Pats can't win without playing fast and loose with the rules.
Click to expand...


Obviously not, because regardless they won that game too, along with the fact that they are pretty much contenders every year because they are a GOOD team, whether you want to acknowledge that fact or not, hater.


----------



## ChrisL

Hmmm, well how did the Patriots get those interceptions?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

aaronleland said:


> Everybody acknowledges that deflated balls wouldn't have made much difference in such a one-sided game. But their 35-31 win against the Ravens...?



we haven't heard anything from the raven players on that so we don't know if they were in that game. Beli-CHEAT will have to enjoy deflate ball all he can because while he is in the superbowl,the officials are going to thoroughly more than they ever have before in any of the playoff games this year,make sure there is nothing wrong with balls of the seahawks,that they are proper footballs.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is all you need to see haters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh, you think anything about the Ravens/Pats game says anything good about your team?  The Ravens secondary had been decimated with injuries this season.  They had some 7 or 8 players from the secondary on the IR list this year, and by the time the post season came around they were starting 6th stringers.  And yet they held strong against Brady and the Pats offense that you think so grand.  The Patriots had to pull out every trick they could think of, including their ineligible receiver fiasco that they only got away with because they officials didn't know what was going on.
> 
> So yeah, maybe all we need to know about the Patriots is right there in the Ravens game.  Seems to all really point to the conclusion that the Pats can't win without playing fast and loose with the rules.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Obviously not, because regardless they won that game too, along with the fact that they are pretty much contenders every year because they are a GOOD team, whether you want to acknowledge that fact or not, hater.
Click to expand...


There are several teams who are contenders nearly every single year.  The Colts are one.  The Ravens are one.  The Steelers are one, the Broncos are one.  And that's just in the AFC.  But none of those teams are known cheaters.


----------



## aaronleland

Papageorgio said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everybody acknowledges that deflated balls wouldn't have made much difference in such a one-sided game. But their 35-31 win against the Ravens...?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We're the balls deflated?
> 
> I find it all amusing, Carroll cheated at USC, Seattle fans have no issue with him cheating and Belichek, the Patriot fans have no issue with him cheating.
Click to expand...


Sources within the NFL have confirmed that 11 of the 12 balls were deflated. It's not a question of whether or not it happened anymore. The question is how the Patriots will be penalized.


----------



## ChrisL

Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.


----------



## aaronleland

9/11 inside job said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everybody acknowledges that deflated balls wouldn't have made much difference in such a one-sided game. But their 35-31 win against the Ravens...?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we haven't heard anything from the raven players on that so we don't know if they were in that game. Beli-CHEAT will have to enjoy deflate ball all he can because while he is in the superbowl,the officials are going to thoroughly more than they ever have before in any of the playoff games this year,make sure there is nothing wrong with balls of the seahawks,that they are proper footballs.
Click to expand...


Jim Harbaugh reported just recently that the Ravens organization has been contacted by the NFL about the investigation. He said they had no way of knowing because they never handled the Patriots' balls (tee hee) during that game


----------



## LA RAM FAN

interesting.lol


----------



## aaronleland

ChrisL said:


> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.



I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.

Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.


----------



## ChrisL

aaronleland said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.
> 
> Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.
Click to expand...


All I know is that I watch every single one of the Pats games, and they are a great team.  That is why they win games.  You can see that by watching the highlights.  If the allegations are true, then I have no idea why the Patriots would do that because, obviously, they do not have to do such things in order to win games.  We have MANY weapons.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

aaronleland said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.
> 
> Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.
Click to expand...

well you DID have hometown refs in the superbowl against the seahawks.I spoke to many steeler fans back then and they said they did not feel good about winning that game the way so many bad calls were given to the steelers.I did not care one way or another who won that game back then but it was clear in that game,they had hometown refs.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.
> 
> Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well you DID have hometown refs in the superbowl against the seahawks.I spoke to many steeler fans back then and they said they did not feel good about winning that game the way so many bad calls were given to the steelers.I did not care one way or another who won that game back then but it was clear in that game,they had hometown refs.
Click to expand...


Oh God, a conspiracy theory would be nothing new out of your pie hole, that's for sure.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

ChrisL said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.
> 
> Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well you DID have hometown refs in the superbowl against the seahawks.I spoke to many steeler fans back then and they said they did not feel good about winning that game the way so many bad calls were given to the steelers.I did not care one way or another who won that game back then but it was clear in that game,they had hometown refs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh God, a conspiracy theory would be nothing new out of your pie hole, that's for sure.
Click to expand...


oh please,bone up on your reading skills,I didn't give a shit who won that game but it was obvious the refs  had it hard up for the steelers conspiracy THEORIST.

oh and love how as always,you ignore FACTS the one that many steeler fans I spoke to back then said they did not feel good about winning that game the way it was given to them.according to YOUR warped logic,all those steeler fans were conspiracy theorists as well. idiot.grow up and keep politics out of it conspiracy THEORIST.


----------



## Papageorgio

ChrisL said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.
> 
> Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> well you DID have hometown refs in the superbowl against the seahawks.I spoke to many steeler fans back then and they said they did not feel good about winning that game the way so many bad calls were given to the steelers.I did not care one way or another who won that game back then but it was clear in that game,they had hometown refs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh God, a conspiracy theory would be nothing new out of your pie hole, that's for sure.
Click to expand...


Refs gave the Super Bowl to the Steelers, Lol! I love how these nutters love the conspiracy.


----------



## manifold

ChrisL said:


> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.



Less likely to fumble too.


----------



## Oldstyle

It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".

Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.


----------



## manifold

Oldstyle said:


> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.



Then why did it take until today to release the news that 11 of 12 balls were under-inflated?

Something doesn't add up here.


----------



## ChrisL

Oldstyle said:


> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.



They had a great game.  Everybody was on.    The defense had a good game as well.  I hope to see more of that kind of playing at the Superbowl!


----------



## LA RAM FAN

back to shit all over the floor again huh kid chris?


----------



## Papageorgio

ChrisL said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They had a great game.  Everybody was on.    The defense had a good game as well.  I hope to see more of that kind of playing at the Superbowl!
Click to expand...

Belichek is known for pushing the rules and this one may cost them. I don't think it made a difference in the games outcome.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They had a great game.  Everybody was on.    The defense had a good game as well.  I hope to see more of that kind of playing at the Superbowl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Belichek is known for pushing the rules and this one may cost them. I don't think it made a difference in the games outcome.
Click to expand...


It definitely did not, since the defense played a big role in us winning that game, as well as the run game.  With a couple of exceptions, this was the case from the beginning of the game until the end of the game.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> back to shit all over the floor again huh kid chris?



You're an idiot.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Oldstyle said:


> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.



   I dont think anyone questions the outcome. Fact is Belachick got caught cheating..again.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

manifold said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why did it take until today to release the news that 11 of 12 balls were under-inflated?
> 
> Something doesn't add up here.
Click to expand...

chris cant handle the truth that Beli CHEAT is at it again.lol


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why did it take until today to release the news that 11 of 12 balls were under-inflated?
> 
> Something doesn't add up here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> chris cant handle the truth that Beli CHEAT is at it again.lol
Click to expand...


Sorry, but you are NOT clever.  Lol.


----------



## aaronleland

ChrisL said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Patriots won fair and square.  Blount had an excellent game too.  Deflated balls certainly had nothing to do with how he dominated the Colts defense.  Lol.    Face it, the Patriots won because they played a better game.  Of course, the haters are going to accuse them of cheating.  It happens EVERY year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only remember them being accused of cheating twice, and both times it was confirmed that they had.
> 
> Try being a Steelers fan. We're accused of having the refs on our side every other game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> All I know is that I watch every single one of the Pats games, and they are a great team.  That is why they win games.  You can see that by watching the highlights.  If the allegations are true, then I have no idea why the Patriots would do that because, obviously, they do not have to do such things in order to win games.  We have MANY weapons.
Click to expand...


Why does a Wall Street executive, already making millions a year, push the envelope to make a couple million more?

Why does a man like Nixon, already expected to win by a landslide, push the envelope, and break into DNC headquarters.

It's a mentality most of us don't understand, but it's far from uncommon.


----------



## Oldstyle

manifold said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why did it take until today to release the news that 11 of 12 balls were under-inflated?
> 
> Something doesn't add up here.
Click to expand...


That news was a leak...as was the news that the officials re-inflated the balls at half-time.  Who knows what is correct and what isn't?


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why did it take until today to release the news that 11 of 12 balls were under-inflated?
> 
> Something doesn't add up here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> chris cant handle the truth that Beli CHEAT is at it again.lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry, but you are NOT clever.  Lol.
Click to expand...



Can you meet this challenge...probably not


"Patriots reporter Tom Curran wrote for Comcast Sports Net in New England:

This is officially a big deal.

It doesn't matter if every other team in the league screws with the PSI. It doesn't matter if Bill Belichick didn't even know the balls were manipulated (if they were). It doesn't matter that they would have bludgeoned the Colts anyway.

The Patriots cannot comport themselves with a 'do business as business is being done' mentality. They forfeited the right to that mentality in 2007 when they got pinched for filming defensive signals and the 72 miles of fire and sharp glass the team got dragged through as a result should have convinced them.

I want fans defending the Patriots to consider this scenario: The Patriots lost their last two Super Bowls to the Giants. What if it was discovered in those games that the Giants had some sort of edge the Patriots did not? And that edge was illegal?

What would you think? What would you say?"

Cheating Scandals Will Forever Tarnish the Brady-Belichick Legacy Bleacher Report


----------



## Alex.

*Pereira on #DeflateGate "This is cheating and it is something the league will deal with harshly" *


----------



## HUGGY

Some people want to succeed without regard to fair play.  Some people don't want to win if that means they must take an unfair advantage.  

Maybe the Colts would have lost anyway.  Maybe over the course of the season the Patriots don't win enough games to end up with home field advantage without cheating.

Maybe on their own field without the Patriots working an unfair advantage the Colts win.  

Belichick and Brady are constantly bragging about knowing the rules better than the other teams.  By that admission they obviously knew they were cheating.  

Why would the Patriots do such a thing and take the chance they would be caught if it didn't help their team win?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's now being reported that the 11 balls were re-inflated by the officials *before the start of the second half* after the Colts brought it to their attention that the ball they had intercepted felt "soft".
> 
> Just to remind you Patriots haters...the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why did it take until today to release the news that 11 of 12 balls were under-inflated?
> 
> Something doesn't add up here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> chris cant handle the truth that Beli CHEAT is at it again.lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry, but you are NOT clever.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Can you meet this challenge...probably not
> 
> 
> "Patriots reporter Tom Curran wrote for Comcast Sports Net in New England:
> 
> This is officially a big deal.
> 
> It doesn't matter if every other team in the league screws with the PSI. It doesn't matter if Bill Belichick didn't even know the balls were manipulated (if they were). It doesn't matter that they would have bludgeoned the Colts anyway.
> 
> The Patriots cannot comport themselves with a 'do business as business is being done' mentality. They forfeited the right to that mentality in 2007 when they got pinched for filming defensive signals and the 72 miles of fire and sharp glass the team got dragged through as a result should have convinced them.
> 
> I want fans defending the Patriots to consider this scenario: The Patriots lost their last two Super Bowls to the Giants. What if it was discovered in those games that the Giants had some sort of edge the Patriots did not? And that edge was illegal?
> 
> What would you think? What would you say?"
> 
> Cheating Scandals Will Forever Tarnish the Brady-Belichick Legacy Bleacher Report
Click to expand...


Yeah if Beli-CHEAT had not been caught before in 97 cheating with spygate,I would think nothing of it but this is FAR TOO COINCIDENTAL.


----------



## Papageorgio

Is that why Carroll ran from USC?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> *Pereira on #DeflateGate "This is cheating and it is something the league will deal with harshly" *


Too bad the joke NFL considers dealing with something harshly is depriving them of merely a   first round pick and a $500.000 fine.mere pocket change to these multi millionaires. the NFL is a mockery,these players like Michael Irvin go out and do drugs and get a mere slap on the wrist and pocket change fine.you do that in college or what belicheat did in college,you get kicked off the team or in belicheats case,kicked out of the university.


----------



## Alex.

*New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*


----------



## Papageorgio

If this were your favorite team pulling these stunts not a one of you would complain and it would be justified.


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Some people want to succeed without regard to fair play.  Some people don't want to win if that means they must take an unfair advantage.
> 
> Maybe the Colts would have lost anyway.  Maybe over the course of the season the Patriots don't win enough games to end up with home field advantage without cheating.
> 
> Maybe on their own field without the Patriots working an unfair advantage the Colts win.
> 
> Belichick and Brady are constantly bragging about knowing the rules better than the other teams.  By that admission they obviously knew they were cheating.
> 
> Why would the Patriots do such a thing and take the chance they would be caught if it didn't help their team win?



Maybe the Colts would have lost?  Seriously?  You just made that statement?  Seriously?

It's now being reported that the officials re-inflated those balls at half time.  So would you like to take a crack at explaining why the Patriots then outscored the Colts 28 to 0 for the rest of the game?  I suppose that if they'd had softer balls they would have outscored them 48 to 0 in the second half?  

This is the STUPIDEST "scandal" ever!


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*


----------



## Oldstyle

And just to put "Spygate" in context...it's legal to *photograph* your opponent's sideline...it's illegal to *videotape* it which is about as STUPID a rule as I've ever heard.

By the way the Patriots went undefeated for that season until they reached the Super Bowl and lost on a miracle play by the Giants.  If not they would have been the first team under the current format to go undefeated for the season.  They also have the best record in the NFL SINCE Spygate which makes the charge that they only win because they "cheat" laughable!


----------



## mudwhistle

The Colts suspected this from the regular season. 

Just heard it on the radio.


----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
Click to expand...


You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.


----------



## Mad Scientist

How can I gamble on these games if there's so much cheating? That the real important question.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
Click to expand...

Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.


----------



## mudwhistle

Papageorgio said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
Click to expand...


Democrats love cheaters.


----------



## Alex.

mudwhistle said:


> The Colts suspected this from the regular season.
> 
> Just heard it on the radio.



"Chris Mortensen of ESPN reported that 11 of the 12 balls the Patriots used were found to be under-inflated and Mike Florio of _PFT_ reported Wednesday that the league has found that the balls were properly checked by officials before the game. There’s also a report from Adam Schefter of ESPN that* the Colts informed the league of suspicions that balls the Patriots used in a November game between the teams were under-inflated,* although there’s no word on whether the league looked into it at that time"

NFL continuing review of under-inflated balls will provide information 8220 as soon as possible 8221 ProFootballTalk


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
Click to expand...

oh yeah thats right,the asshole cheater WAS the coach of the Giants back then.Yeah now that i am reminded of that,i also wont look at those victorys by them the sae way the giants won their last two superbowls either anymore.


----------



## Oldstyle

Do one of you conspiracy "Einsteins" want to take a crack at explaining why the Patriots performed better after the officials re-inflated the balls at halftime?  Or would that interrupt your I hate the Patriots rants?


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
Click to expand...


I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.

Cheating is relative.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
Click to expand...

The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
Click to expand...


Give me a break, do Seattle fans worry about Carrol and his cheating past? Isn't Sean Payton still coaching and Saint fans were justifying bounties? SF fans still see no wrong in what Barry Bonds did. hell, on this board, 911 inside job is saying moving without league approval is ok. 

Every holding call that is not called, is still cheating. That is why there is a penalty if caught. Every pass interference is cheating, every offsides not called. It is all relative.

It matters what team you follow and what you are excusing as behavior. 

And you got to love all the NE haters, they yell, take away draft picks, lower their cap limit, like that isn't going to give other teams an advantage? 

I'm a Colts fan and no way does the game that is 17-7 at the half, 11 of 12 balls are aired to NFL regulation at halftime. The end of the second half and the ball are checked out to be fine and they only out score the Colts 20-0. Please deflate the ball.


----------



## Oldstyle

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> *New England Patriots Cialis Commercial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
Click to expand...


So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...

Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?


----------



## Oldstyle

You want to stop tampering with balls?  Treat it just like any OTHER violation in the game.  If one team feels the other is using a ball too soft or too hard...then they should call them on it...have the ball checked and if it is illegal then they lose down and distance.  If the ball is legal then the team who challenged loses fifteen yards.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Give me a break, do Seattle fans worry about Carrol and his cheating past? Isn't Sean Payton still coaching and Saint fans were justifying bounties? SF fans still see no wrong in what Barry Bonds did. hell, on this board, 911 inside job is saying moving without league approval is ok.
> 
> Every holding call that is not called, is still cheating. That is why there is a penalty if caught. Every pass interference is cheating, every offsides not called. It is all relative.
> 
> It matters what team you follow and what you are excusing as behavior.
> 
> And you got to love all the NE haters, they yell, take away draft picks, lower their cap limit, like that isn't going to give other teams an advantage?
> 
> I'm a Colts fan and no way does the game that is 17-7 at the half, 11 of 12 balls are aired to NFL regulation at halftime. The end of the second half and the ball are checked out to be fine and they only out score the Colts 20-0. Please deflate the ball.
Click to expand...



I do not care who you root for I am talking about the brand and the game as a whole.


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
Click to expand...

If rule breaking is allowed on any level then it does impact on the integrity of the game


----------



## Oldstyle

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> 
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If rule breaking is allowed on any level then it does impact on the integrity of the game
Click to expand...


Is it against the rules to run pick plays?


----------



## Oldstyle

This nonsense about the "integrity" of the game is a joke!  It's why you have officials.  Has anyone here asked the very obvious question why none of the officials involved in the game didn't notice any difference between the balls being used in the game?  Or do you think that they were in on the deception as well?


----------



## Oldstyle

Players and coaches are ALWAYS looking for an edge.  I used to play goalie in high school and college.  There were regulations as to the size of your goalie pads.  They could only be so wide and some officials would measure them before a game started.  I would lay mine on their sides and jump on them to make them narrower and then when the game would be about to start i would jam down on them from the top to make them as wide as I could.  Where did I learn that trick?  From one of my coaches who did the same thing when he played in the NHL.  It's why you see a pitcher rub a ball up when he gets a new one from the umpire.  It's why you see Lebron James put talcum on his hands.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> 
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Give me a break, do Seattle fans worry about Carrol and his cheating past? Isn't Sean Payton still coaching and Saint fans were justifying bounties? SF fans still see no wrong in what Barry Bonds did. hell, on this board, 911 inside job is saying moving without league approval is ok.
> 
> Every holding call that is not called, is still cheating. That is why there is a penalty if caught. Every pass interference is cheating, every offsides not called. It is all relative.
> 
> It matters what team you follow and what you are excusing as behavior.
> 
> And you got to love all the NE haters, they yell, take away draft picks, lower their cap limit, like that isn't going to give other teams an advantage?
> 
> I'm a Colts fan and no way does the game that is 17-7 at the half, 11 of 12 balls are aired to NFL regulation at halftime. The end of the second half and the ball are checked out to be fine and they only out score the Colts 20-0. Please deflate the ball.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I do not care who you root for I am talking about the brand and the game as a whole.
Click to expand...

Then don't bring the Giants in the argument. 

I understand you are trying to be self righteous but there is a whole more to the brand than this. Bounty gate was a farce, you seriously believe that the Saints are the only team that puts bounties on players? Yet, you only punish them? Seriously? 

Tell me about the brand when you mishandle a domestic violence case so bad and then screw it up worse by suspending the guy indefinitely because you didn't do the right thing to begin with. 

Then you talk about the brand as a whole while you, yourself diminish It? 

Give me a break, the Pats are wrong for deflating the balls, they should be fined and that is it. 

Any draft picks, any salary cap BS is just silly for as little impact it had on the game.


----------



## Papageorgio

Oldstyle said:


> This nonsense about the "integrity" of the game is a joke!  It's why you have officials.  Has anyone here asked the very obvious question why none of the officials involved in the game didn't notice any difference between the balls being used in the game?  Or do you think that they were in on the deception as well?



Yep, they handled both teams footballs and they didn't notice, maybe it's a conspiracy!


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If rule breaking is allowed on any level then it does impact on the integrity of the game
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is it against the rules to run pick plays?
Click to expand...

i'm not a referee I wouldn't comment on that. you were just pissed because the patriots got caught once again cheating


----------



## Papageorgio

Oldstyle said:


> Players and coaches are ALWAYS looking for an edge.  I used to play goalie in high school and college.  There were regulations as to the size of your goalie pads.  They could only be so wide and some officials would measure them before a game started.  I would lay mine on their sides and jump on them to make them narrower and then when the game would be about to start i would jam down on them from the top to make them as wide as I could.  Where did I learn that trick?  From one of my coaches who did the same thing when he played in the NHL.  It's why you see a pitcher rub a ball up when he gets a new one from the umpire.  It's why you see Lebron James put talcum on his hands.



Remember Belintikoff from the Raiders, you'd throw a ball anywhere near him and the stick'em caught the ball. He never had to, he just had to make sure it hit him somewhere. LOL!


----------



## Oldstyle

I'm not "pissed" at all.  I'm *amused* by you experts who somehow think the Patriots won that game because of the inflation level of the footballs...a difference that the REAL officials couldn't discern in the game and a difference that was rectified before the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.


----------



## Oldstyle

Papageorgio said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Players and coaches are ALWAYS looking for an edge.  I used to play goalie in high school and college.  There were regulations as to the size of your goalie pads.  They could only be so wide and some officials would measure them before a game started.  I would lay mine on their sides and jump on them to make them narrower and then when the game would be about to start i would jam down on them from the top to make them as wide as I could.  Where did I learn that trick?  From one of my coaches who did the same thing when he played in the NHL.  It's why you see a pitcher rub a ball up when he gets a new one from the umpire.  It's why you see Lebron James put talcum on his hands.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Remember Belintikoff from the Raiders, you'd throw a ball anywhere near him and the stick'em caught the ball. He never had to, he just had to make sure it hit him somewhere. LOL!
Click to expand...


And what stopped that practice, Papa?  They didn't fine Fred Biletnikoff.  They didn't penalize the Raiders with a loss of draft choices.  They simply had the officials check player uniforms for foreign substances.


----------



## Oldstyle

"Spygate" was a joke just as THIS controversy is a joke.  You don't like the fact that the Patriots have won more in the past decade and a half than any other team so you start a whiny thread like this one to make yourself feel better about your rooting for a team that sucks.


----------



## BluePhantom

Oldstyle said:


> I'm not "pissed" at all.  I'm *amused* by you experts who somehow think the Patriots won that game because of the inflation level of the footballs...a difference that the REAL officials couldn't discern in the game and a difference that was rectified before the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.



It probably didn't change the outcome, but it *is *cheating. I have seen a lot of quarterbacks chime in on this all day and they all agree that softer balls settle far more comfortably in the hand enhancing your performance.


----------



## depotoo

And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big 
deal.

If the NFL doesn't deal harshly with this, then it will continue and grow.  

Some of those blatantly obvious bad calls?  Probably paid off refs.  Where does it stop.  Either you want to believe in the winner of a game to actually be just that, a winner.  
Let me ask you, if your employer cheats you, just say, what the heck.   Or if they overpay you,  would you be the one saying, I deserve it anyway, and never report it.  Maybe not, but I know I wouldn't trust you.




ChrisL said:


> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
Click to expand...


----------



## depotoo

Wow, what a justification for your letting cheating go unpunished.  You lost before you ever played the game.



Oldstyle said:


> "Spygate" was a joke just as THIS controversy is a joke.  You don't like the fact that the Patriots have won more in the past decade and a half than any other team so you start a whiny thread like this one to make yourself feel better about your rooting for a team that sucks.


----------



## depotoo

And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?  





ChrisL said:


> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.


----------



## depotoo

Sure, they would have probably won the game anyway, so why the hell did they have to cheat?

Now they have tainted that win by cheating.  Was it worth it?


----------



## ChrisL

depotoo said:


> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
Click to expand...


I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!  

I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.   

Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Papageorgio said:


> If this were your favorite team pulling these stunts not a one of you would complain and it would be justified.



     Wrong. I'd be highly pissed if my team got caught cheating.
But then the Texans have the most integrity of any team in the NFL if you wanna go by arrest records.
   Bob Doesnt put up with bullshit from his players for the most part and I like it that way.


----------



## Papageorgio

depotoo said:


> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> If the NFL doesn't deal harshly with this, then it will continue and grow.
> 
> Some of those blatantly obvious bad calls?  Probably paid off refs.  Where does it stop.  Either you want to believe in the winner of a game to actually be just that, a winner.
> Let me ask you, if your employer cheats you, just say, what the heck.   Or if they overpay you,  would you be the one saying, I deserve it anyway, and never report it.  Maybe not, but I know I wouldn't trust you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaronleland said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's unlikely the deflated balls drastically changed the outcome of the game, but the fact that they cheated must be addressed. Also, how many close games have they had this season where they did the same thing, and didn't get caught? Patriots fans can scream "sore losers" all they want, but their team has a history of cheating, and something should be done about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pats aren't the ONLY team to pull these little tricks, I'm sure.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


So, during the game, you hold a player, do you go tell the ref that you held so he can call the penalty for cheating?


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

ChrisL said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
Click to expand...


  Why do you keep having to mention that you watch all the games?
Sounds like you're trying to convince us of something...


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
Click to expand...


 You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
    They're not even close to the same thing.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Oldstyle said:


> I'm not "pissed" at all.  I'm *amused* by you experts who somehow think the Patriots won that game because of the inflation level of the footballs...a difference that the REAL officials couldn't discern in the game and a difference that was rectified before the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.



 I havent heard one person say it changed the outcome of the game.
In fact I've heard just the opposite.
   Bellyache just seems to have a penchant for cheating,kinda like the wealthy socialite who shoplifts even though she could easily afford to pay.


----------



## ChrisL

HereWeGoAgain said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you keep having to mention that you watch all the games?
> Sounds like you're trying to convince us of something?
Click to expand...


I'm more familiar with the Patriots games than a lot of you, especially you haters.    Anyone who watched that game knows that the Pats would have rolled over the Colts no matter what.  They just way outplayed them in every aspect.


----------



## ChrisL

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> If this were your favorite team pulling these stunts not a one of you would complain and it would be justified.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong. I'd be highly pissed if my team got caught cheating.
> But then the Texans have the most integrity of any team in the NFL if you wanna go by arrest records.
> Bob Doesnt put up with bullshit from his players for the most part and I like it that way.
Click to expand...


Oh come on, it was defective balls.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.


Exactly, it gives an unfair advantage which is why it is against the rules.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly, it gives an unfair advantage which is why it is against the rules.
Click to expand...


Shut up, Alex.  You don't even watch football.  You probably watch soccer or something.  Lol.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

ChrisL said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you keep having to mention that you watch all the games?
> Sounds like you're trying to convince us of something?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm more familiar with the Patriots games than a lot of you, especially you haters.    Anyone who watched that game knows that the Pats would have rolled over the Colts no matter what.  They just way outplayed them in every aspect.
Click to expand...


   I watch all the games,but I dont feel the need to tell everyone. NFL replay is a wonderful thing.


----------



## ChrisL

HereWeGoAgain said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you keep having to mention that you watch all the games?
> Sounds like you're trying to convince us of something?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm more familiar with the Patriots games than a lot of you, especially you haters.    Anyone who watched that game knows that the Pats would have rolled over the Colts no matter what.  They just way outplayed them in every aspect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watch all the games,but I dont feel the need to tell everyone. NFL replay is a wonderful thing.
Click to expand...


That's why I posted some highlights from the game.  Did you watch them?  Deflated balls had nothing to do with that beating.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not "pissed" at all.  I'm *amused* by you experts who somehow think the Patriots won that game because of the inflation level of the footballs...a difference that the REAL officials couldn't discern in the game and a difference that was rectified before the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I havent heard one person say it changed the outcome of the game.
> In fact I've heard just the opposite.
> Bellyache just seems to have a penchant for cheating,kinda like the wealthy socialite who shoplifts even though she could easily afford to pay.
Click to expand...

as one poster said before,it was more than deflated balls that cost the colts the game.however in a close game like the ravens game,it could be instrumental in winning.


----------



## ChrisL

Besides, if you can't squeeze the ball in your hand, what difference would it make to the game in reality?  How much better could you grip the ball with 1 or 2 PSI?  Balls are supposed to be between 12-1/2 to 13, the balls were allegedly at about 11 PSI.  Could it be that the refs made a mistake?  Why was it 11 out of 12 balls and not all 12?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

I love jerry rices comment,he called it like it is when he said that spells cheating.

Report NFL found 11 of 12 Patriots footballs underinflated - Yahoo Sports


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

ChrisL said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you keep having to mention that you watch all the games?
> Sounds like you're trying to convince us of something?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm more familiar with the Patriots games than a lot of you, especially you haters.    Anyone who watched that game knows that the Pats would have rolled over the Colts no matter what.  They just way outplayed them in every aspect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watch all the games,but I dont feel the need to tell everyone. NFL replay is a wonderful thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's why I posted some highlights from the game.  Did you watch them?  Deflated balls had nothing to do with that beating.
Click to expand...


 No doubt about that.
It's the whole cheating thing that bothers me.


----------



## ChrisL

HereWeGoAgain said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you keep having to mention that you watch all the games?
> Sounds like you're trying to convince us of something?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm more familiar with the Patriots games than a lot of you, especially you haters.    Anyone who watched that game knows that the Pats would have rolled over the Colts no matter what.  They just way outplayed them in every aspect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watch all the games,but I dont feel the need to tell everyone. NFL replay is a wonderful thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's why I posted some highlights from the game.  Did you watch them?  Deflated balls had nothing to do with that beating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt about that.
> It's the whole cheating thing that bothers me.
Click to expand...


Well, if Bill did do this, then I don't understand it at all because it is entirely unnecessary.  The Patriots are a good team, and they don't need to cheat to win games.


----------



## Papageorgio

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are all for teams cheating and bending rules as long as it is your team.
> 
> 
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
Click to expand...


A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.

Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.

Sounds like baseball more than football.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

9/11 inside job said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not "pissed" at all.  I'm *amused* by you experts who somehow think the Patriots won that game because of the inflation level of the footballs...a difference that the REAL officials couldn't discern in the game and a difference that was rectified before the Patriots outscored the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I havent heard one person say it changed the outcome of the game.
> In fact I've heard just the opposite.
> Bellyache just seems to have a penchant for cheating,kinda like the wealthy socialite who shoplifts even though she could easily afford to pay.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> as one poster said before,it was more than deflated balls that cost the colts the game.however in a close game like the ravens game,it could be instrumental in winning.
Click to expand...



 Exactly!! 
Just as I mentioned earlier ...how many times has he gotten away with shit in the past?
    I find it hard to believe that he got caught both times he tried it.


----------



## depotoo

Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.



Papageorgio said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Asshole was the coach for the Giants back in the 80 90 I do not look at those victories the same way I do the last two. and this goes across the board for all cheaters on any team. Just sucks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
Click to expand...


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

ChrisL said:


> Besides, if you can't squeeze the ball in your hand, what difference would it make to the game in reality?  How much better could you grip the ball with 1 or 2 PSI?  Balls are supposed to be between 12-1/2 to 13, the balls were allegedly at about 11 PSI.  Could it be that the refs made a mistake?  Why was it 11 out of 12 balls and not all 12?




    They didnt have enough time to get to that last ball?


----------



## ChrisL

One would think that if the balls were deflated enough for it to be noticeable at all, that the refs would have picked up on that.  After all, that is a part of their job, and they are the ones who squeeze the balls and check them all the time throughout the game.  Lol!  Gosh, there are SO many innuendos in that sentence.    It's hard to talk about balls without innuendos.


----------



## depotoo

And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?


----------



## depotoo

Payoff to not notice?





ChrisL said:


> One would think that if the balls were deflated enough for it to be noticeable at all, that the refs would have picked up on that.  After all, that is a part of their job, and they are the ones who squeeze the balls and check them all the time throughout the game.  Lol!  Gosh, there are SO many innuendos in that sentence.    It's hard to talk about balls without innuendos.


----------



## ChrisL

depotoo said:


> Payoff to not notice?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> One would think that if the balls were deflated enough for it to be noticeable at all, that the refs would have picked up on that.  After all, that is a part of their job, and they are the ones who squeeze the balls and check them all the time throughout the game.  Lol!  Gosh, there are SO many innuendos in that sentence.    It's hard to talk about balls without innuendos.
Click to expand...


You must be a friend of 911's.  Lol.  Why on earth would the referees, and that would have to be more than just ONE of them, risk their great jobs for the Patriots?  Good grief, that's just stupid.  Now you are insinuating nefarious conduct on the part of the referees too?


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

depotoo said:


> And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?



 Thats one thing I always liked about Charles Barkely.
He always said he wasnt a role model and not to make him one.


----------



## ChrisL

If you notice, the refs, when they pick up the balls, they squeeze them and inspect them, just for these reasons.  If a ball is defective in some manner, they take it out of play and get a new ball.


----------



## depotoo

Or was there a bait and switch going on.
Tom Brady and the Patriots will not be forgotten for this taint forever.


HereWeGoAgain said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Besides, if you can't squeeze the ball in your hand, what difference would it make to the game in reality?  How much better could you grip the ball with 1 or 2 PSI?  Balls are supposed to be between 12-1/2 to 13, the balls were allegedly at about 11 PSI.  Could it be that the refs made a mistake?  Why was it 11 out of 12 balls and not all 12?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They didnt have enough time to get to that last ball?
Click to expand...


----------



## ChrisL

depotoo said:


> Or was there a switch and bait going on.
> Tom Brady and the Patriots will not be forgotten for this taint forever.
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Besides, if you can't squeeze the ball in your hand, what difference would it make to the game in reality?  How much better could you grip the ball with 1 or 2 PSI?  Balls are supposed to be between 12-1/2 to 13, the balls were allegedly at about 11 PSI.  Could it be that the refs made a mistake?  Why was it 11 out of 12 balls and not all 12?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They didnt have enough time to get to that last ball?
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


Oh yeah, Lol.  That must be it.  Some of you idiots are just ridiculous.  Get a life.


----------



## Papageorgio

depotoo said:


> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

You said earlier 





> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.



So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay. 

I'm trying to define where the line is? 

A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word. 

Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty? 

Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
Click to expand...


Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

ChrisL said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Or was there a switch and bait going on.
> Tom Brady and the Patriots will not be forgotten for this taint forever.
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Besides, if you can't squeeze the ball in your hand, what difference would it make to the game in reality?  How much better could you grip the ball with 1 or 2 PSI?  Balls are supposed to be between 12-1/2 to 13, the balls were allegedly at about 11 PSI.  Could it be that the refs made a mistake?  Why was it 11 out of 12 balls and not all 12?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They didnt have enough time to get to that last ball?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh yeah, Lol.  That must be it.  Some of you idiots are just ridiculous.  Get a life.
Click to expand...


   Missed the sarcasm.....
 But seriously,who gives a crap about one ball out of twelve being right?
If anything it proves they know what the ball should be inflated to....but they missed the other eleven.
    Yeah ..thats how it happened.


----------



## Papageorgio

depotoo said:


> And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?



What did BountyGate teach our kids? Don't get caught, because bounties were and are wide spread. 

What does seeing a guy hold on a play and not get called don't get caught? 

Carroll left USC and went to Seattle to escape NCAA penalties. He cheated and now he is revered in Seattle, what does that teach your kids? 

Belichick cheated he got caught, so the kid learns, don't get caught.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Papageorgio said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
Click to expand...


   From what I understand the refs check the balls two and a half hours before the game and give them right back to the team.
  So finding the time to let some air out of em wouldnt be a problem in the least.
For all we know they deflated the balls halfway through the first quarter and no one noticed till the interception.
    See thats the thing about known cheaters,they dont get the benefit of the doubt.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
Click to expand...


Ok look.  A football to an NFL quarterback is like a scalpel in the hands of a surgeon or a golf club in the hands of a PGA pro.  There is a very specific way Phil Mickelson wants his irons.  He wants a very specific grind.  he wants a very specific weighting.  He wants a very specific flex in the shaft because all those things impact what he can do with the ball and how he swings a golf club.  To the average hacker such minimal details would make no difference in their game at all, but to a tour professional they make all the difference in the world. 

A football to an NFL quarterback is the same thing.  It's not like they take these balls out of the box on game day and say "here you go".  The balls are treated exactly to the specification of the quarterback. They are worked in, they are rubbed down to remove the slippery finish...there's a whole bunch of stuff they do to them.  So when those balls get to the sideline they are in the exact shape the quarterback wants and according to the specifications he wants.

Now they were checked by the refs and found to be ok and then suddenly they all lose 2 psi?   It's clear that New England knew what was legal and what wasn't so they made sure they were legal for the inspection and afterwards adjusted them to Brady's preferences.  Unless you are suggesting that a ball boy or equipment manager took it upon themselves to alter the balls which is absolutely ludicrous. The balls were adjusted because that's how Brady wanted them.  It's illegal.  They knew it.  They did it anyhow.  It's cheating and it's on Brady and it's on Belichick because Belichick doesn't give two shits how the balls are as long as they are what his quarterback wants.


----------



## Papageorgio

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> From what I understand the refs check the balls two and a half hours before the game and give them right back to the team.
> So finding the time to let some air out of em wouldnt be a problem in the least.
> For all we know they deflated the balls halfway through the first quarter and no one noticed till the interception.
> See thats the thing about known cheaters,they dont get the benefit of the doubt.
Click to expand...


Where in the hell did I say cheater should get the benefit of anything. I'm asking where is the line.

Please answer the question, if you hold someone and the flag is not thrown, do you go to the ref and tell the ref that you held and need penalized or do you not say anything about you being a cheater?


----------



## depotoo

And that is my point.  

You start making punishment so costly they wouldn'-t dare.





Papageorgio said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did BountyGate teach our kids? Don't get caught, because bounties were and are wide spread.
> 
> What does seeing a guy hold on a play and not get called don't get caught?
> 
> Carroll left USC and went to Seattle to escape NCAA penalties. He cheated and now he is revered in Seattle, what does that teach your kids?
> 
> Belichick cheated he got caught, so the kid learns, don't get caught.
Click to expand...


----------



## depotoo

Unfortunately, those that play ball in school do, though, whether they like it or not.





HereWeGoAgain said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats one thing I always liked about Charles Barkely.
> He always said he wasnt a role model and not to make him one.
Click to expand...


----------



## Pop23

I've done a lot of thinking on this subject and.......



It makes me yawn


----------



## Papageorgio

depotoo said:


> And that is my point.
> 
> You start making punishment so costly they wouldn'-t dare.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did BountyGate teach our kids? Don't get caught, because bounties were and are wide spread.
> 
> What does seeing a guy hold on a play and not get called don't get caught?
> 
> Carroll left USC and went to Seattle to escape NCAA penalties. He cheated and now he is revered in Seattle, what does that teach your kids?
> 
> Belichick cheated he got caught, so the kid learns, don't get caught.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


And that would be.....


----------



## depotoo

Let it be the owner that suffers, even if unaware.  Hit him with game suspensions, fines so high the cheating doesn'-t pay for itself because it hurts so badly, no  matter the infraction..  Maybe no draft picks at all for a year.  Repeated offenses, same owner?  Three strikes and they are out.  The league and the owners all need to be held responsible. Coaches caught cheating repeatedly?  No longer able to  coach in the NFL. The commissioner, so many infractions by teams over a certain number of years?   He is out.
Money talks in the NFL.   And hit their pocketbooks hard enough they will learn to fly right. 
 It has become nothing but a big syndicate anymore. 





Papageorgio said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And that is my point.
> 
> You start making punishment so costly they wouldn'-t dare.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And another thing, what the hell do you think this teach kids?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did BountyGate teach our kids? Don't get caught, because bounties were and are wide spread.
> 
> What does seeing a guy hold on a play and not get called don't get caught?
> 
> Carroll left USC and went to Seattle to escape NCAA penalties. He cheated and now he is revered in Seattle, what does that teach your kids?
> 
> Belichick cheated he got caught, so the kid learns, don't get caught.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And that would be.....
Click to expand...


----------



## BluePhantom

depotoo said:


> Let it be the owner that suffers, even if unaware.  Hit him with game suspensions, fines so high the cheating doesn'-t pay for itself because it hurts so badly, no  matter the infraction..  Maybe no draft picks at all for a year.  Repeated offenses, same owner?  Three strikes and they are out.  The league and the owners all need to be held responsible. Coaches caught cheating repeatedly?  No longer able to  coach in the NFL. The commissioner, so many infractions by teams over a certain number of years?   He is out.
> Money talks in the NFL.   And hit their pocketbooks hard enough they will learn to fly right.
> It has become nothing but a big syndicate anymore.



As a Seahawks fan this is a tough one for me.  If a player is caught taking PEDs (cheating) he gets suspended.  Hell they threatened to suspend Lynch from the Super Bowl if he wore his gold cleats. Now I don't know anyone who is suggesting that the Colts would have won that game had New England not cheated...but New England cheated so some suspensions are in order.  I would suspend Belichick *and *Brady, because as I mentioned earlier, there is no way in hell those balls were deflated on anyone's orders other than Brady's. No chance under the sun.

But do it next year.  I don't want to give Patriots fans any excuse if and when Seattle wins the Super Bowl (which I think they will anyhow).  I would rather have them at full strength.  In a way it sucks for the Seahawks too because if Belichick or Brady is suspended for the Superb Owl Seattle will never get proper recognition for winning it.


----------



## depotoo

That's why it has to be so harsh, it never comes to that.   Sadly, Seattle is an  indirect victim in  this.





BluePhantom said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Let it be the owner that suffers, even if unaware.  Hit him with game suspensions, fines so high the cheating doesn'-t pay for itself because it hurts so badly, no  matter the infraction..  Maybe no draft picks at all for a year.  Repeated offenses, same owner?  Three strikes and they are out.  The league and the owners all need to be held responsible. Coaches caught cheating repeatedly?  No longer able to  coach in the NFL. The commissioner, so many infractions by teams over a certain number of years?   He is out.
> Money talks in the NFL.   And hit their pocketbooks hard enough they will learn to fly right.
> It has become nothing but a big syndicate anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As a Seahawks fan this is a tough one for me.  If a player is caught taking PEDs (cheating) he gets suspended.  Hell they threatened to suspend Lynch from the Super Bowl if he wore his gold cleats. Now I don't know anyone who is suggesting that the Colts would have won that game had New England not cheated...but New England cheated so some suspensions are in order.  I would suspend Belichick *and *Brady, because as I mentioned earlier, there is no way in hell those balls were deflated on anyone's orders other than Brady's. No chance under the sun.
> 
> But do it next year.  I don't want to give Patriots fans any excuse if and when Seattle wins the Super Bowl (which I think they will anyhow).  I would rather have them at full strength.  In a way it sucks for the Seahawks too because if Belichick or Brady is suspended for the Superb Owl Seattle will never get proper recognition for winning it.
Click to expand...


----------



## BluePhantom

depotoo said:


> That's why it has to be so harsh, it never comes to that.   Sadly, Seattle is an  indirect victim in  this.



Well I hope they don't do Superb Owl suspensions as I have heard some people (a lot actually) suggest.  Without Brady that game will be a complete slaughter and it will rob the fans of both teams and football in general of what should be a great game.  It would be totally the Patriots fault, but I don't want to win that way and I don't know anyone else who does.....well...except Brady and Belichick and apparently everyone else that thinks that cheating is no big deal.


----------



## depotoo

I agree as in next year, everything must change.
This year?  For the owner?  Cut the profits from the game.  Let other owners see a taste.  This isn't this owner's first time around this  block.





BluePhantom said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Let it be the owner that suffers, even if unaware.  Hit him with game suspensions, fines so high the cheating doesn'-t pay for itself because it hurts so badly, no  matter the infraction..  Maybe no draft picks at all for a year.  Repeated offenses, same owner?  Three strikes and they are out.  The league and the owners all need to be held responsible. Coaches caught cheating repeatedly?  No longer able to  coach in the NFL. The commissioner, so many infractions by teams over a certain number of years?   He is out.
> Money talks in the NFL.   And hit their pocketbooks hard enough they will learn to fly right.
> It has become nothing but a big syndicate anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As a Seahawks fan this is a tough one for me.  If a player is caught taking PEDs (cheating) he gets suspended.  Hell they threatened to suspend Lynch from the Super Bowl if he wore his gold cleats. Now I don't know anyone who is suggesting that the Colts would have won that game had New England not cheated...but New England cheated so some suspensions are in order.  I would suspend Belichick *and *Brady, because as I mentioned earlier, there is no way in hell those balls were deflated on anyone's orders other than Brady's. No chance under the sun.
> 
> But do it next year.  I don't want to give Patriots fans any excuse if and when Seattle wins the Super Bowl (which I think they will anyhow).  I would rather have them at full strength.  In a way it sucks for the Seahawks too because if Belichick or Brady is suspended for the Superb Owl Seattle will never get proper recognition for winning it.
Click to expand...


----------



## HenryBHough

Why not a do-over?

Think of the millions in ad revenue for the networks!


----------



## BluePhantom

*And I would have gotten away with it if not for those pesky kids*


----------



## BluePhantom

HenryBHough said:


> Why not a do-over?
> 
> Think of the millions in ad revenue for the networks!



The Colts didn't lose because the Patriots cheated.  They lost because New England is a flat out better team.  Even if they did now Seattle has two weeks of rest and the winner of the do-over has one.  Even if the Colts were to win they are still at a huge disadvantage. Can't do that


----------



## Papageorgio

Just cancel the Super Bowl, this is such a big issue. Give the title to the Hawks, disbanded the Patriots, ban all the Patriot players for life, then take Brady and Belichick and give them the electric chair. 

Will that take care of the sanctimonious fans? 

Then in 2015 we can have officials run over every play in a booth and make sure there is no cheating going on, like pass interference or hold. Also lets kick out every player and coach that has ever cheated. Including Carroll. 

That way the integrity of the game can be upheld.  

You people are a bunch of hypocrites.


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> Just cancel the Super Bowl, this is such a big issue. Give the title to the Hawks, disbanded the Patriots, ban all the Patriot players for life, then take Brady and Belichick and give them the electric chair.
> 
> Will that take care of the sanctimonious fans?
> 
> Then in 2015 we can have officials run over every play in a booth and make sure there is no cheating going on, like pass interference or hold. Also lets kick out every player and coach that has ever cheated. Including Carroll.
> 
> That way the integrity of the game can be upheld.
> 
> You people are a bunch of hypocrites.



Yeah it's Pete Carroll's fault that Reggie Bush took money from an agent on the side.


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just cancel the Super Bowl, this is such a big issue. Give the title to the Hawks, disbanded the Patriots, ban all the Patriot players for life, then take Brady and Belichick and give them the electric chair.
> 
> Will that take care of the sanctimonious fans?
> 
> Then in 2015 we can have officials run over every play in a booth and make sure there is no cheating going on, like pass interference or hold. Also lets kick out every player and coach that has ever cheated. Including Carroll.
> 
> That way the integrity of the game can be upheld.
> 
> You people are a bunch of hypocrites.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah it's Pete Carroll's fault that Reggie Bush took money from an agent on the side.
Click to expand...


That's why Carroll ran, he knew all about it and turned away.


----------



## BluePhantom

No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"



You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.

Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
Click to expand...


If you think Pete Carroll condoned Reggie Bush taking money from an agent on the side or even knew about it you are out of your mind.  Yes he was the head coach so the buck ultimately stops there, but there's a big difference between a kid breaking the rules under the table and behind everyone's back and a quarterback breaking the rules on the field. No way in hell Carroll knew Bush was breaking the rules...Belichick knew for 100% certain. Totally different circumstances and regardless what happened at USC I couldn't give two shits about.  If it were to come out that he encouraged or encourages cheating as the coach of the Seahawks then I will condemn him just as much as I condemn Belichick


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
Click to expand...


If you think Pete Carroll condoned Reggie Bush taking money from an agent on the side or even knew about it you are out of your mind.  Yes he was the head coach so the buck ultimately stops there, but there's a big difference between a twenty something year old kid breaking the rules under the table and behind everyone's back and a veteran NFL quarterback breaking the rules on the field. No way in hell Carroll knew Bush was breaking the rules...Belichick knew for 100% certain. Totally different circumstances and regardless what happened at USC I couldn't give two shits about.  If it were to come out that he encouraged or encourages cheating as the coach of the Seahawks then I will condemn him just as much as I condemn Belichick[/QUOTE]


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
Click to expand...


Poster is a Seahawks fan.    Of course he or she is all over the "cheating" thing, even though it probably REALLY does not make a difference.  If it was that noticeable a difference, the refs would have been on to that immediately.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Poster is a Seahawks fan.    Of course he or she is all over the "cheating" thing, even though it probably REALLY does not make a difference.  If it was that noticeable a difference, the refs would have been on to that immediately.
Click to expand...


Ridiculous.  You think the refs can tell the difference between a 13 psi ball and an 11 psi ball by feel?  They already checked them before the game.  They are going to assume they are in the same state they were when they checked them.  The officials are grabbing the ball, putting it on the line of scrimmage, and getting the hell out of the way.  To suggest that an official has any more ability to tell the difference in inflation than you or I is delusional


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Poster is a Seahawks fan.    Of course he or she is all over the "cheating" thing, even though it probably REALLY does not make a difference.  If it was that noticeable a difference, the refs would have been on to that immediately.
Click to expand...



Think of it like this.  Before I became a business manager I was a professional chef for 15 years.  When I hold a knife there is a certain way I want it to feel in my hand.  I want a certain weight and balance to it.  I want a certain edge on the blade and before I start to prep I check my knives to make sure they are how I want them and if they aren't I will straighten the blade or sharpen it or whatever.  Could one of my general managers grab one of my knives and feel any difference at all between that and one of my chef's knives?  Pfft....hell no.  I can.  If I have to use one of my chef's knives it feels totally uncomfortable in my hand. You reach deeply my friend.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Poster is a Seahawks fan.    Of course he or she is all over the "cheating" thing, even though it probably REALLY does not make a difference.  If it was that noticeable a difference, the refs would have been on to that immediately.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ridiculous.  You think the refs can tell the difference between a 13 psi ball and an 11 psi ball by feel?  They already checked them before the game.  They are going to assume they are in the same state they were when they checked them.  The officials are grabbing the ball, putting it on the line of scrimmage, and getting the hell out of the way.  To suggest that an official has any more ability to tell the difference in inflation than you or I is delusional
Click to expand...


Bull crap!  Part of their job is to check the balls.  They sometimes switch out balls too, if there is a problem.  Obviously you don't watch much football.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> No he left because he had one of those now legendary dinners with Paul Allen where Paul pulls out his checkbook and says "$35 million ok?"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to believe what you need to believe, however you support the theory that people will defend their cheaters.
> 
> Carroll's team was penalized and forfeited games, he was the coach, he was caught cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Poster is a Seahawks fan.    Of course he or she is all over the "cheating" thing, even though it probably REALLY does not make a difference.  If it was that noticeable a difference, the refs would have been on to that immediately.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Think of it like this.  Before I became a business manager I was a professional chef for 15 years.  When I hold a knife there is a certain way I want it to feel in my hand.  I want a certain weight and balance to it.  I want a certain edge on the blade and before I start to prep I check my knives to make sure they are how I want them and if they aren't I will straighten the blade or sharpen it or whatever.  Could one of my general managers grab one of my knives and feel any difference at all between that and one of my chef's knives?  Pfft....hell no.  I can.  If I have to use one of my chef's knives it feels totally uncomfortable in my hand. You reach deeply my friend.
Click to expand...


If the refs couldn't feel the difference in the balls, then it was negligible difference.


----------



## Papageorgio

Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,



Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
Click to expand...


Denial aint just a river in Egypt


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
Click to expand...


Who do you think is deflating balls for Bill?  Do you think he's on the sidelines himself doing that 10 minutes before a game?  Maybe they hired someone to deflate balls?    The refs, oh they didn't notice or just ignored it, and all the other teams they played and won against?  How do you know the balls weren't deflated from use or something?  Simple answer is that you do not know.


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
Click to expand...

 You both are in denial.


----------



## ChrisL

I got a real kick out of it this morning on the Today show too, when the clueless bitches were talking about the alleged PSI being a couple (at most) above the acceptable limits, and saying "oh, that's a lot," then they looked expectantly at the only man there, and he was just like shrugging, and they were like, "oh yeah, that's a lot."  I was like, shut up stupid bitches.  You know NOT of what you are talking about.    They were so clueless.  Lol.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who do you think is deflating balls for Bill?  Do you think he's on the sidelines himself doing that 10 minutes before a game?  Maybe they hired someone to deflate balls?    The refs, oh they didn't notice or just ignored it, and all the other teams they played and won against?  How do you know the balls weren't deflated from use or something?  Simple answer is that you do not know.
Click to expand...


Read earlier when I explained that the balls are going to be in the precise condition Tom Brady wants them in and to think anything else is insanity. Belichick knows this and he doesn't care and to think anything else is insanity.  Do surgeons inspect their instruments before they operate?  Hell yes!  Does a pilot inspect his plane before he takes off?  Hell yes!  Does a chef check his knife before he preps?  Hell yes!  And you are trying to tell me that an NFL quarterback just says "yeah toss me whatever ball happens to be there and we're ok"?

That's complete delusion!  Defective balls my ass.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You both are in denial.
Click to expand...


Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who do you think is deflating balls for Bill?  Do you think he's on the sidelines himself doing that 10 minutes before a game?  Maybe they hired someone to deflate balls?    The refs, oh they didn't notice or just ignored it, and all the other teams they played and won against?  How do you know the balls weren't deflated from use or something?  Simple answer is that you do not know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read earlier when I explained that the balls are going to be in the precise condition Tom Brady wants them in and to think anything else is insanity. Belichick knows this and he doesn't care and to think anything else is insanity.  Do surgeons inspect their instruments before they operate?  Hell yes!  Does a pilot inspect his plane before he takes off?  Hell yes!  Does a chef check his knife before he preps?  Hell yes!  And you are trying to tell me that an NFL quarterback just says "yeah toss me whatever ball happens to be there and we're ok"?
> 
> That's complete delusion!  Defective balls my ass.
Click to expand...


What did I say?  I said DEFECTIVE BALLS.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You both are in denial.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.
Click to expand...


Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You both are in denial.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
Click to expand...


Maybe at least 6 times though.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You both are in denial.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
Click to expand...


Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> 
> 
> You both are in denial.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
Click to expand...


Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> You both are in denial.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
Click to expand...



Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!


----------



## BluePhantom

maybe Jesus deflated the raft


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
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> BluePhantom said:
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> ChrisL said:
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> BluePhantom said:
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> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, 300+ pound guys spiking the balls in the end zone could contribute to a little deflation, and there was a lot of that going on during that game on our side.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
Click to expand...


What does that have to do with defective balls?


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> maybe Jesus deflated the raft



Good point.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
Click to expand...


You talk about these footballs like you just dropped in from outer space. 

First of all the balls were not under inflated.  The refs checked them then ten minutes before the game they gave them to the Patriots.  The balls were messed with by letting air OUT of each ball not intended for kicking.  The process takes just a few seconds.  I'm sure that the kickers know who is doing it for Belichick.  They have access to the footballs at all times for practicing kicking into a net on the sidelines. The device to deflate the football and measure the remaining air pressure is about the size of a "Sharpie".

The Pats didn't need to get the whole deed done in ten minutes.  The kick off ball is a hard ball for both teams.  By the time the Pat's Offense takes the field and they run the commercials or the Colts run their first series it could be 20-25 minutes before Brady needs a doctored ball to play with.  He only needs a couple ready to send in.  The rest can be deflated as needed.  I'm sure that the kickers have a mark on their ball so they can quickly find it.

As a side note the Patriots may use deflated balls for the whole season.  ORRRrr... at least all their home games rain or shine.  Using harder balls in the Super Bowl may be a disadvantage because they may be used to playing in games and practice with the under-inflated ball.

Every Patriot Receiver, RB, Kicker and QB *KNOWS* they have been playing with a non regulation ball. They have been handling footballs for most of the time they have been alive and awake for most of their entire lives. Believe me...they know what a regulation football feels like and they know what a Patriot doctored  football feels like.

The entire team is wise to this deceit.  If there is a punishment handed out it should be levied against the whole team.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with defective balls?
Click to expand...


yeah     the only person who can legitimately claim defective balls in regards to their job is Tom Byron. Just stop


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You talk about these footballs like you just dropped in from outer space.
> 
> First of all the ball were not under inflated.  The refs checked them then ten minutes before the game they gave them to the Patriots.  The balls were messed with by letting air OUT of each ball not intended for kicking.  The process takes just a few seconds.  I'm sure that the kickers know who is doing it for Belichick.  They have access to the footballs at all times for practicing kicking into a net on the sidelines. The device to deflate the football and measure the remaining air pressure is about the size of a "Sharpie".
> 
> The Pats didn't need to get the whole deed done in ten minutes.  The kick off ball is a hard ball for both teams.  By the time the Pat's Offense takes the field and they run the commercials or the Colts run their first series it could be 20-25 minutes before Brady needs a doctored ball to play with.  He only needs a couple ready to send in.  The rest can be deflated as needed.  I'm sure that the kickers have a mark on their ball so they can quickly find it.
> 
> As a side note the Patriots may use deflated balls for the whole season.  ORRRrr... at least all their home games rain or shine.  Using harder balls in the Super Bowl may be a disadvantage because they may be used to playing in games and practice with the under-inflated ball.
> 
> Every Patriot Receiver, RB, Kicker and QB *KNOWS* they have been playing with a non regulation ball. They have been handling footballs for most of the time they have been alive and awake for most of their entire lives. Believe me...they know what a regulation football feels like and they know what a Patriot doctored  football feels like.
> 
> The entire team is wise to this deceit.  If there is a punishment handed out it should be levied against the whole team.
Click to expand...


Oh sure.  Lol.  You're crazy.    But everyone already knew that.


----------



## HUGGY

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who do you think is deflating balls for Bill?  Do you think he's on the sidelines himself doing that 10 minutes before a game?  Maybe they hired someone to deflate balls?    The refs, oh they didn't notice or just ignored it, and all the other teams they played and won against?  How do you know the balls weren't deflated from use or something?  Simple answer is that you do not know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read earlier when I explained that the balls are going to be in the precise condition Tom Brady wants them in and to think anything else is insanity. Belichick knows this and he doesn't care and to think anything else is insanity.  Do surgeons inspect their instruments before they operate?  Hell yes!  Does a pilot inspect his plane before he takes off?  Hell yes!  Does a chef check his knife before he preps?  Hell yes!  And you are trying to tell me that an NFL quarterback just says "yeah toss me whatever ball happens to be there and we're ok"?
> 
> That's complete delusion!  Defective balls my ass.
Click to expand...


ChrisL probably couldn't tell the difference in a regulation Football and a Patriot doctored one but I gaurandamntee that every skill player on the Pat's team can tell the difference instantly.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with defective balls?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yeah     the only person who can legitimately claim defective balls in regards to their job is Tom Byron. Just stop
Click to expand...


No, I will not.  That is why I'm here, and I still say . . . defective.    And you can't prove otherwise.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at it this way, the two coaches going to the Super Bowl this year are known cheaters. Spin it anyway you want, they both got caught cheating,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defective balls, I tell you.    As of yet, I have heard no evidence implicating Bill Belichick in a cheating scheme.  Balls were under-inflated.  That is all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Denial aint just a river in Egypt
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who do you think is deflating balls for Bill?  Do you think he's on the sidelines himself doing that 10 minutes before a game?  Maybe they hired someone to deflate balls?    The refs, oh they didn't notice or just ignored it, and all the other teams they played and won against?  How do you know the balls weren't deflated from use or something?  Simple answer is that you do not know.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Read earlier when I explained that the balls are going to be in the precise condition Tom Brady wants them in and to think anything else is insanity. Belichick knows this and he doesn't care and to think anything else is insanity.  Do surgeons inspect their instruments before they operate?  Hell yes!  Does a pilot inspect his plane before he takes off?  Hell yes!  Does a chef check his knife before he preps?  Hell yes!  And you are trying to tell me that an NFL quarterback just says "yeah toss me whatever ball happens to be there and we're ok"?
> 
> That's complete delusion!  Defective balls my ass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ChrisL probably couldn't tell the difference in a regulation Football and a Patriot doctored one but I gaurandamntee that every skill player on the Pat's team can tell the difference instantly.
Click to expand...


And what about the referees?  Are they in on this scheme too?  Hmm.  All of the other teams the Pats played against this year who did not file a formal complaint are also liable too, I suppose.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah well he didn't do it 11 times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with defective balls?
Click to expand...








*Hey Tom Brady, I have defective balls too*


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe at least 6 times though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with defective balls?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Hey Tom Brady, I have defective balls too*
Click to expand...


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly Gronkowski spiking the ball probably does deflate the ball a bit.  A PGA golfer needs a new ball each hole because after one hole of play the ball is no longer round and it will affect how the ball plays.  They hit the ball that hard and they can notice the difference between how a ball flies as a result.  To the average person it makes no difference at all.  But come on.....I am hoping you are saying this in jest.  Surely you don't believe that 11 out of 12 balls were low because someone spiked them.   Come on man......let's be real here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with defective balls?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yeah     the only person who can legitimately claim defective balls in regards to their job is Tom Byron. Just stop
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I will not.  That is why I'm here, and I still say . . . defective.    And you can't prove otherwise.
Click to expand...


Your argument may work at a Tupper Ware party Sweetie, but you are attempting to persuade people that have actually played football.  

Give it up.  You REALLY don't know what you are talking about with people that really do know what they are talking about.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, they just don't make things like they used to, cars, footballs . . .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh uh....and it doesn't seem strange to you at all that both conference championships were played in heavy rain....Russell Wilson struggled with control, Aaron Rodgers struggled with control, Andrew Luck struggled with control...but holy shit....Tom Brady had no problem at all!!!!  We haven't seen this kind of command over water since Jesus walked on the Sea of Galilee!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with defective balls?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yeah     the only person who can legitimately claim defective balls in regards to their job is Tom Byron. Just stop
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I will not.  That is why I'm here, and I still say . . . defective.    And you can't prove otherwise.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your argument may work at a Tupper Ware party Sweetie, but you are attempting to persuade people that have actually played football.
> 
> Give it up.  You REALLY don't know what you are talking about with people that really do know what they are talking about.
Click to expand...


It's called "Gronking" sweetie.   

New England Patriots Rob Gronkowski has perfect explanation for Patriots deflated footballs - Extra Mustard - SI.com


----------



## TrinityPower

I think I smell a Patriot fan in here


----------



## ChrisL

Sorry you all, but the 6 touchdowns and one field goal, and all the missed opportunities by the Colts, and screw ups are NOT attributed to the Pats playing with deflated balls.


----------



## BluePhantom

TrinityPower said:


> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here



Damn Trinity....nice icon.  You remind me of my second wife.


----------



## ChrisL

TrinityPower said:


> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here



I think I smell jelly in here!


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> Sorry you all, but the 6 touchdowns and one field goal, and all the missed opportunities by the Colts, and screw ups are NOT attributed to the Pats playing with deflated balls.



Well who knows?  Lance Armstrong dominated his sport with defective balls too


----------



## TrinityPower

It didn't hurt their cause either.Why did they spy on other teams before when they claimed t be so superior?


----------



## HUGGY

Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry you all, but the 6 touchdowns and one field goal, and all the missed opportunities by the Colts, and screw ups are NOT attributed to the Pats playing with deflated balls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well who knows?  Lance Armstrong dominated his sport with defective balls too
Click to expand...


Nope, the Colts did not play well.  The Patriots played a great game.  That's why they won.  Three SBs and 5 AFC championships SINCE the "spy gate" controversy.  Sorry boys, you are just wrong.


----------



## ChrisL

TrinityPower said:


> It didn't hurt their cause either.Why did they spy on other teams before when they claimed t be so superior?



Are you asking a question to someone in particular or just making stupid random comments?


----------



## HUGGY

Rules are rules Cupcake.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.



I can't wait for the Pats to make seafood out of the Seagulls, Huggy!  This is going to FUN!


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell jelly in here!
Click to expand...


Honestly what baffles me is the question "why?"   I mean we can mess around and have some fun with it but the reality is...they cheated.  Why?  They would have beaten Indianapolis like a drum anyhow.  No one outside of Indiana thought the Colts had a prayer in hell to win that game. The Patriots are a fantastic team...why cheat?  Is it some obsessive compulsive disorder where they can't help themselves?  The Patriots are good enough that they don't have to cheat, but it's clear that they do anyhow and have on multiple occasions.  What is it with them that they feel they have to cheat? It baffles me.  It really does.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell jelly in here!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly what baffles me is the question "why?"   I mean we can mess around and have some fun with it but the reality is...they cheated.  Why?  They would have beaten Indianapolis like a drum anyhow.  No one outside of Indiana thought the Colts had a prayer in hell to win that game. The Patriots are a fantastic team...why cheat?  Is it some obsessive compulsive disorder where they can't help themselves?  The Patriots are good enough that they don't have to cheat, but it's clear that they do anyhow and have on multiple occasions.  What is it with them that they feel they have to cheat? It baffles me.  It really does.
Click to expand...


Do you honestly believe that these are tricks only the Patriots pull?  God, you are SO naive.


----------



## BluePhantom

HUGGY said:


> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.



That may not bode well for the Seahawks dude.  Nothing brings a team together and gives them motivation like a scandal.


----------



## TrinityPower

BluePhantom said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That may not bode well for the Seahawks dude.  Nothing brings a team together and gives them motivation like a scandal.
Click to expand...

And nothing brings a team together like a miracle win


----------



## ChrisL

Aaron Rodgers mentioned something about hating underinflated balls and prefers them OVER the recommended guidelines set.   

Aaron Rodgers likes his footballs overinflated ProFootballTalk

“‘I like to push the limit to how much air we can put in the football, even go over what they allow you to do and see if the officials take air out of it,'” Simms said Rodgers told them before the game.

Simms pointed out that Rodgers is the exception.

“Everybody wants it smaller and soft, so they can dig their fingers into,” Simms said. “[Rodgers is] such a feel thrower.  You can tell.  The one touchdown he threw down the field to the tight end is such feel; then he flicks it.  That shows you he just has great control of it, with his fingers and hand.”

On his weekly radio show with ESPN Milwaukee, Rodgers confirmed that he prefers the balls to be overinflated, and that he doesn’t think there should be a maximum air pressure.

“It’s not an advantage when you have a football that’s inflated more than average air pressure. We’re not kicking these footballs,” Rodgers said, via Rob Demovsky of ESPN.com.

Look for more anecdotes to emerge regarding the things teams do to make the footballs the way their quarterbacks like them.  While on one hand it takes some of the sting out of the possibility that the Patriots broke the rules, on the other hand it’s yet another case where, at a time when everyone may be getting away with it, the Patriots are the ones who got caught.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell jelly in here!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Honestly what baffles me is the question "why?"   I mean we can mess around and have some fun with it but the reality is...they cheated.  Why?  They would have beaten Indianapolis like a drum anyhow.  No one outside of Indiana thought the Colts had a prayer in hell to win that game. The Patriots are a fantastic team...why cheat?  Is it some obsessive compulsive disorder where they can't help themselves?  The Patriots are good enough that they don't have to cheat, but it's clear that they do anyhow and have on multiple occasions.  What is it with them that they feel they have to cheat? It baffles me.  It really does.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you honestly believe that these are tricks only the Patriots pull?  God, you are SO naive.
Click to expand...


Of course not, but the Patriots have a bad habit of getting caught. We can't punish what we don't catch.  If it was any other team including the Seahawks I would be just as critical.  Two years ago our CB Brandon Browner got caught using PEDs and he got suspended.  Damn right.  He cheated and deserved to get punished and he made me and almost all Seahawks fans ashamed.  Just because "all teams do it" doesn't mean it's right and when it's caught it ought to get punished.  That goes for my Hawks, any other team, and your Patriots


----------



## TrinityPower

And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> Aaron Rodgers mentioned something about hating underinflated balls and prefers them OVER the recommended guidelines set.
> 
> Aaron Rodgers likes his footballs overinflated ProFootballTalk
> 
> “‘I like to push the limit to how much air we can put in the football, even go over what they allow you to do and see if the officials take air out of it,'” Simms said Rodgers told them before the game.
> 
> Simms pointed out that Rodgers is the exception.
> 
> “Everybody wants it smaller and soft, so they can dig their fingers into,” Simms said. “[Rodgers is] such a feel thrower.  You can tell.  The one touchdown he threw down the field to the tight end is such feel; then he flicks it.  That shows you he just has great control of it, with his fingers and hand.”
> 
> On his weekly radio show with ESPN Milwaukee, Rodgers confirmed that he prefers the balls to be overinflated, and that he doesn’t think there should be a maximum air pressure.
> 
> “It’s not an advantage when you have a football that’s inflated more than average air pressure. We’re not kicking these footballs,” Rodgers said, via Rob Demovsky of ESPN.com.
> 
> Look for more anecdotes to emerge regarding the things teams do to make the footballs the way their quarterbacks like them.  While on one hand it takes some of the sting out of the possibility that the Patriots broke the rules, on the other hand it’s yet another case where, at a time when everyone may be getting away with it, the Patriots are the ones who got caught.



Well Kurt Warner, Mark Brunell, Jerry Rice, and Jerome Bettis have gone on TV today disagreeing with Rodgers.  Just like the knives girl....I like mine a certain weight, other chefs like them at another weight.  Rodgers like his over-inflated, Brady likes his under-inflated.  What is important is that they are inflated within the rules of the game.  Apparently, you struggle to grasp that.  Do whatever a quarterback wants to the ball, but if it's illegal and they do it anyhow, it's cheating and only a total homer fan can argue otherwise.


----------



## BluePhantom

TrinityPower said:


> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner



Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Aaron Rodgers mentioned something about hating underinflated balls and prefers them OVER the recommended guidelines set.
> 
> Aaron Rodgers likes his footballs overinflated ProFootballTalk
> 
> “‘I like to push the limit to how much air we can put in the football, even go over what they allow you to do and see if the officials take air out of it,'” Simms said Rodgers told them before the game.
> 
> Simms pointed out that Rodgers is the exception.
> 
> “Everybody wants it smaller and soft, so they can dig their fingers into,” Simms said. “[Rodgers is] such a feel thrower.  You can tell.  The one touchdown he threw down the field to the tight end is such feel; then he flicks it.  That shows you he just has great control of it, with his fingers and hand.”
> 
> On his weekly radio show with ESPN Milwaukee, Rodgers confirmed that he prefers the balls to be overinflated, and that he doesn’t think there should be a maximum air pressure.
> 
> “It’s not an advantage when you have a football that’s inflated more than average air pressure. We’re not kicking these footballs,” Rodgers said, via Rob Demovsky of ESPN.com.
> 
> Look for more anecdotes to emerge regarding the things teams do to make the footballs the way their quarterbacks like them.  While on one hand it takes some of the sting out of the possibility that the Patriots broke the rules, on the other hand it’s yet another case where, at a time when everyone may be getting away with it, the Patriots are the ones who got caught.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well Kurt Warner, Mark Brunell, Jerry Rice, and Jerome Bettis have gone on TV today disagreeing with Rodgers.  Just like the knives girl....I like mine a certain weight, other chefs like them at another weight.  Rodgers like his over-inflated, Brady likes his under-inflated.  What is important is that they are inflated within the rules of the game.  Apparently, you struggle to grasp that.  Do whatever a quarterback wants to the ball, but if it's illegal and they do it anyhow, it's cheating and only a total homer fan can argue otherwise.
Click to expand...


Yeah well, again, you don't know any specifics, and the NFL has not made any official statements and has not concluded a proper investigation yet.  So there.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
Click to expand...


Ah-ha!  Just like I thought, trying to speak as if you are all reasonable, but the REAL motive comes out.  Just another loser hater.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
Click to expand...


Well, you and your hater friends have fun with your hate.  Just remember, the Patriots do not need to cheat to win games.  They are one of the BEST teams in the NFL.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Nightie night now!


----------



## TrinityPower

No need to hate when you are a  fan of the best team two years running


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't wait for the Pats to make seafood out of the Seagulls, Huggy!  This is going to FUN!
Click to expand...


Now don't go off in a huff after the game.  


ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry you all, but the 6 touchdowns and one field goal, and all the missed opportunities by the Colts, and screw ups are NOT attributed to the Pats playing with deflated balls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well who knows?  Lance Armstrong dominated his sport with defective balls too
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Nope, the Colts did not play well.  The Patriots played a great game.  That's why they won.  Three SBs and 5 AFC championships SINCE the "spy gate" controversy.  Sorry boys, you are just wrong.
Click to expand...


This rule violation has nothing to do with the Colt's performance.  It is cheating by the Patriots to gain an unfair advantage. Pure and simple. No doubt there will be a rather big investigation to find out who(The entire Patriot team) knew what and when(the whole 2014 season).

They(The NFL) might end up fining every player and coach that had knowledge they were breaking the rules.

That's $25,000(the actual fine for tampering) times around 60 people.  ORRRrr... about a million and a half bucks. AND possibly game suspensions and pay docking.  This could easily reach into the multi millions of dollars.  We are talking record penalties.


----------



## TrinityPower

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you and your hater friends have fun with your hate.  Just remember, the Patriots do not need to cheat to win games.  They are one of the BEST teams in the NFL.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Nightie night now!
Click to expand...

you are correct, they do not need to cheat but the fact is that they have 3 times now so that says something


----------



## HUGGY

BluePhantom said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That may not bode well for the Seahawks dude.  Nothing brings a team together and gives them motivation like a scandal.
Click to expand...


ORRrr...it could just cause chaos and back biting and back stabbing as the players and coaches are scurrying like cockroaches when the light is turned on.


----------



## TrinityPower

So just curious...was the cupcake reference directed toward me?


----------



## HUGGY

TrinityPower said:


> So just curious...was the cupcake reference directed toward me?



No.


----------



## Oldstyle

depotoo said:


> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was responding to the 911 nutter, and he has already stated that in the Rams go outside the rules of the NFL to move to LA, that it is okay with him.
> 
> Cheating is relative.
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


So you're a Dolphins fan who can't stand the fact that the Patriots OWN your asses year in and year out...so you're here whining about balls that the officials handled on every damn play of the first half and didn't notice a problem...while you ignore the fact that the Patriots steamrollered the Colts in the second half...AFTER the balls had been re-inflated?  You're not worried about the integrity of the game...you just don't like the Patriots!


----------



## TrinityPower

ChrisL said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> It didn't hurt their cause either.Why did they spy on other teams before when they claimed t be so superior?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you asking a question to someone in particular or just making stupid random comments?
Click to expand...

Sorry it was suppose to be in response to a different comment


----------



## TrinityPower

BluePhantom said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn Trinity....nice icon.  You remind me of my second wife.
Click to expand...

I hope that is a good thing and if so congrats!


----------



## Oldstyle

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> From what I understand the refs check the balls two and a half hours before the game and give them right back to the team.
> So finding the time to let some air out of em wouldnt be a problem in the least.
> For all we know they deflated the balls halfway through the first quarter and no one noticed till the interception.
> See thats the thing about known cheaters,they dont get the benefit of the doubt.
Click to expand...


The balls remain under lock and key until about 5 minutes before game time when they are given to the ballboy on the sidelines.  So in the middle of a nationally televised playoff game with dozens of televisions capturing every angle of the field and tens of thousands of fans snapping pictures with their cameras...somehow the ballboy managed to deflate all but one ball to the same minus two pounds of pressure while at the same time escaping detection?

For all we *KNOW* the idiots who inspected them in the first place didn't put the right pressure in.  That's as plausible an explanation as what you're trying to sell.


----------



## TrinityPower

So let's throw this out there...the league fines Lynch 100,000 for not talking to the media but playing with sub par balls is a 25,000 fine and if Lynch wore the wrong colored shoes he would be suspended should Seattle go to the Superbowl but a team is found to have used sub standard equipment and investigated for cheating and no suspension?  Even Rice was suspended before a full story was known yet the Patriots get what for punishment for 3 different violations of foul play?


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ah-ha!  Just like I thought, trying to speak as if you are all reasonable, but the REAL motive comes out.  Just another loser hater.
Click to expand...


Haters gonna hate...delfaters gonna deflate


----------



## BluePhantom

TrinityPower said:


> So let's throw this out there...the league fines Lynch 100,000 for not talking to the media but playing with sub par balls is a 25,000 fine and if Lynch wore the wrong colored shoes he would be suspended should Seattle go to the Superbowl but a team is found to have used sub standard equipment and investigated for cheating and no suspension?  Even Rice was suspended before a full story was known yet the Patriots get what for punishment for 3 different violations of foul play?




Damn straight!!!! Tell 'em Trinity


----------



## BluePhantom

TrinityPower said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn Trinity....nice icon.  You remind me of my second wife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I hope that is a good thing and if so congrats!
Click to expand...


Well I have only been married once sooooooo


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you're a Dolphins fan who can't stand the fact that the Patriots OWN your asses year in and year out...so you're here whining about balls that the officials handled on every damn play of the first half and didn't notice a problem...while you ignore the fact that the Patriots steamrollered the Colts in the second half...AFTER the balls had been re-inflated?  You're not worried about the integrity of the game...you just don't like the Patriots!
Click to expand...


Where has it been proven that the footballs were re-inflated for the second half?

Oh...Ya..  Cuz ChrisL said so..   Got it!


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you're a Dolphins fan who can't stand the fact that the Patriots OWN your asses year in and year out...so you're here whining about balls that the officials handled on every damn play of the first half and didn't notice a problem...while you ignore the fact that the Patriots steamrollered the Colts in the second half...AFTER the balls had been re-inflated?  You're not worried about the integrity of the game...you just don't like the Patriots!
Click to expand...


Most people don't like cheaters.


----------



## SwimExpert

Now it's being reported that the Baltimore Ravens told the Colts to be on the lookout for deflated balls.

Ravens reportedly tipped off Colts about possible ball deflation by Patriots Fox News


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> Now it's being reported that the Baltimore Ravens told the Colts to be on the lookout for deflated balls.
> 
> Ravens reportedly tipped off Colts about possible ball deflation by Patriots Fox News



Yeah, I read your link, and first they were complaining about the formation, which was LEGAL.  Lol.  Now it's deflated balls.  Obviously they are just mad because they lost.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That may not bode well for the Seahawks dude.  Nothing brings a team together and gives them motivation like a scandal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ORRrr...it could just cause chaos and back biting and back stabbing as the players and coaches are scurrying like cockroaches when the light is turned on.
Click to expand...


That is NOT going to happen.  Wishful thinking on your part.  This is going to be GREAT for the Pats.  Like I said, they play their best under pressure.


----------



## ChrisL

TrinityPower said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you and your hater friends have fun with your hate.  Just remember, the Patriots do not need to cheat to win games.  They are one of the BEST teams in the NFL.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Nightie night now!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you are correct, they do not need to cheat but the fact is that they have 3 times now so that says something
Click to expand...


Oh really, what three times is that?  Name them please.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I smell a Patriot fan in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn Trinity....nice icon.  You remind me of my second wife.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I hope that is a good thing and if so congrats!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I have only been married once sooooooo
Click to expand...


Maybe you and old saggy tits need to get a room.  This thread is about the Patriots, NOT about you and your marriage/marriages.


----------



## ChrisL

Check it out, haters!   

How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports

*Weight: Negligible

A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.

Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.

Appearance: Also negligible

It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*


----------



## Freewill

HereWeGoAgain said:


> So the Patriots are caught bending the rules yet again.
> No surprise there,yet I highly doubt it would have changed the outcome of the game considering they were checking the balls in the second half...and we all saw what happened in the second half.
> 
> But the constant cheating by Bellecheat has to be addressed and it sure as hell makes you wonder what he's gotten away with in the past.



And still gets away with.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now it's being reported that the Baltimore Ravens told the Colts to be on the lookout for deflated balls.
> 
> Ravens reportedly tipped off Colts about possible ball deflation by Patriots Fox News
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I read your link, and first they were complaining about the formation, which was LEGAL.  Lol.  Now it's deflated balls.  Obviously they are just mad because they lost.
Click to expand...


Apparently you _didn't_ read the link.  It said that the attention after the game was focused on the coach's complaints about formations.  But apparently, there was also concern about the balls being deflated.

I really have to wonder why you are being so purposely stupid?  They're just mad because they lost?  What is that supposed to mean?  Are you suggesting that someone on the Ravens put into action a nefarious plot, whereby they tipped off the Colts before the game about deflated balls, then snuck onto the sidelines of the AFC Championship game and deflated the footballs, all in hopes of exacting some kind of petty revenge?


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> This is going to be GREAT for the Pats.  Like I said, they play their _*with *_best under pressure_*ized footballs*_.



I believe this is what you meant, ya?


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*



Congratulations.  You've disproven points made by nobody!


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean really, the score was 45-7.  Lol.  Of course, the Colts are embarrassed, so the Patriots must have cheated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I wasn't impressed with Seattle either.  They really didn't look that good out on the field, not like the Patriots anyway.
Click to expand...


Seattle played against a much better defense then did the Pats.  It was obvious throughout the game that the Colt's defense was not on the same page.  I don't think this will happen in Seattle.  Unless Sherman doesn't play.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*



What happens to a football when you let the air out?  It becomes non-regulation NFL football that's what.

I have a solution, fine Brady, Billycheck (sp) and the Partiots then change the rule to allow the team any pressure they want.

Maybe a deflated ball also helped Blount hold onto it.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is going to be GREAT for the Pats.  Like I said, they play their _*with *_best under pressure_*ized footballs*_.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe this is what you meant, ya?
Click to expand...


Oops!  You put the "with" in the wrong place.    To be fair, I DID say "under pressure."


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I wasn't impressed with Seattle either.  They really didn't look that good out on the field, not like the Patriots anyway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seattle played against a much better defense then did the Pats.  It was obvious throughout the game that the Colt's defense was not on the same page.  I don't think this will happen in Seattle.  Unless Sherman doesn't play.
Click to expand...


Well, I watched that game, and I must disagree.  I wasn't very impressed with either of those teams.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations.  You've disproven points made by nobody!
Click to expand...


Point being, the difference is negligible.  That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What happens to a football when you let the air out?  It becomes non-regulation NFL football that's what.
> 
> I have a solution, fine Brady, Billycheck (sp) and the Partiots then change the rule to allow the team any pressure they want.
> 
> Maybe a deflated ball also helped Blount hold onto it.
Click to expand...


No, I don't think they should be able to do that either.  However, I think this hoopla over 1 or 2 PSI is a bit over the top.  This is more a "bending of rules" than cheating, IMO.  Lol.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I wasn't impressed with Seattle either.  They really didn't look that good out on the field, not like the Patriots anyway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seattle played against a much better defense then did the Pats.  It was obvious throughout the game that the Colt's defense was not on the same page.  I don't think this will happen in Seattle.  Unless Sherman doesn't play.
Click to expand...


Well, we shall see, I guess.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Point being, the difference is negligible.





Just because the difference in weight is negligible does not mean that the difference in the overall effect is negligible.  Of course, you damn well know that your logic is bullshit.



> That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.



If it makes no difference, then why do it?  The fact that it was done is itself evidence of the fact that it can effect the results.

The fact that it is a preference of Brady's is, in and of itself, a change that creates an advantage.  Why not just use a smaller ball?  Why not use larger footballs for teams that want to?  Why not make the field 100 meters?  This is a game that will award or rescind touchdowns and first downs based on half an inch.  The league regulates footballs, and the Patriots willfully violated those rules with the intent of gaining an advantage.

Your entire position on this seems to be based on the batshit stupid idea that cheating doesn't matter if you win in the end.  You're pathetic.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Point being, the difference is negligible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because the difference in weight is negligible does not mean that the difference in the overall effect is negligible.  Of course, you damn well know that your logic is bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If it makes no difference, then why do it?  The fact that it was done is itself evidence of the fact that it can effect the results.
> 
> The fact that it is a preference of Brady's is, in and of itself, a change that creates an advantage.  Why not just use a smaller ball?  Why not use larger footballs for teams that want to?  Why not make the field 100 meters?  This is a game that will award or rescind touchdowns and first downs based on half an inch.  The league regulates footballs, and the Patriots willfully violated those rules with the intent of gaining an advantage.
> 
> Your entire position on this seems to be based on the batshit stupid idea that cheating doesn't matter if you win in the end.  You're pathetic.
Click to expand...


For the same reasons that Aaron Rodgers prefers an overinflated ball, because it probably really means nothing and is just some QB preference that does NOT affect the outcome of games.  You are acting as if they committed a MURDER or something.  Lighten up.  It was AT MOST underinflated equal to the weight of a PIECE OF PAPER.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> For the same reasons that Aaron Rodgers prefers an overinflated ball, because it probably really means nothing and is just asome QB preference that does NOT affect the outcome of games.



There would be no preference if there was no effect.



> You are acting as if they committed a MURDER or something.  Lighten up.  It was AT MOST underinflated equal to the weight of a PIECE OF PAPER.



Sure, it's just cheating.  No reason to care.  No reason to hold anyone in contempt.  That is, if you're like Chris, and have no sense of honor or integrity.

Of course, for most of us, if we get caught cheating at work, we can potentially lose our jobs.  But if it's the Patriots, we shouldn't think anything of it.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Point being, the difference is negligible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because the difference in weight is negligible does not mean that the difference in the overall effect is negligible.  Of course, you damn well know that your logic is bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If it makes no difference, then why do it?  The fact that it was done is itself evidence of the fact that it can effect the results.
> 
> The fact that it is a preference of Brady's is, in and of itself, a change that creates an advantage.  Why not just use a smaller ball?  Why not use larger footballs for teams that want to?  Why not make the field 100 meters?  This is a game that will award or rescind touchdowns and first downs based on half an inch.  The league regulates footballs, and the Patriots willfully violated those rules with the intent of gaining an advantage.
> 
> Your entire position on this seems to be based on the batshit stupid idea that cheating doesn't matter if you win in the end.  You're pathetic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For the same reasons that Aaron Rodgers prefers an overinflated ball, because it probably really means nothing and is just some QB preference that does NOT affect the outcome of games.  You are acting as if they committed a MURDER or something.  Lighten up.  It was AT MOST underinflated equal to the weight of a PIECE OF PAPER.
Click to expand...


What's easier to catch, a nerf football or a properly inflated regulation NFL football?  What do you think would be easier to carry without fumbling?  Yes there is a vast difference between the two but it is used to illustrate the effect of a  "softer" ball.

They have a rule for a reason.


ChrisL said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What happens to a football when you let the air out?  It becomes non-regulation NFL football that's what.
> 
> I have a solution, fine Brady, Billycheck (sp) and the Partiots then change the rule to allow the team any pressure they want.
> 
> Maybe a deflated ball also helped Blount hold onto it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I don't think they should be able to do that either.  However, I think this hoopla over 1 or 2 PSI is a bit over the top.  This is more a "bending of rules" than cheating, IMO.  Lol.
Click to expand...


The rules are clear it isn't bending them it is breaking them.  The ref checked the balls before the game and in between that and the start of the game they were deflated below NFL rules, that is not bending the rules it is breaking the rules.  If the Pats are so damn good then why do they have to bend the rules and sometimes outright break them?  There BS substitution game may have been a factor in beating the Ravens.  In that case they were bending the rules.


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you're a Dolphins fan who can't stand the fact that the Patriots OWN your asses year in and year out...so you're here whining about balls that the officials handled on every damn play of the first half and didn't notice a problem...while you ignore the fact that the Patriots steamrollered the Colts in the second half...AFTER the balls had been re-inflated?  You're not worried about the integrity of the game...you just don't like the Patriots!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where has it been proven that the footballs were re-inflated for the second half?
> 
> Oh...Ya..  Cuz ChrisL said so..   Got it!
Click to expand...


Where has any of this been "proven"?  All we have right now are anonymous leaks from anonymous sources...one of which stated that the balls were taken at half time and re-inflated.  That was what was reported on the Colin Cowherd show yesterday.

But you've already tried and convicted the Patriots...so why would you want to listen to something that contradicts what you already have decided?


----------



## Oldstyle

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Point being, the difference is negligible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because the difference in weight is negligible does not mean that the difference in the overall effect is negligible.  Of course, you damn well know that your logic is bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If it makes no difference, then why do it?  The fact that it was done is itself evidence of the fact that it can effect the results.
> 
> The fact that it is a preference of Brady's is, in and of itself, a change that creates an advantage.  Why not just use a smaller ball?  Why not use larger footballs for teams that want to?  Why not make the field 100 meters?  This is a game that will award or rescind touchdowns and first downs based on half an inch.  The league regulates footballs, and the Patriots willfully violated those rules with the intent of gaining an advantage.
> 
> Your entire position on this seems to be based on the batshit stupid idea that cheating doesn't matter if you win in the end.  You're pathetic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For the same reasons that Aaron Rodgers prefers an overinflated ball, because it probably really means nothing and is just some QB preference that does NOT affect the outcome of games.  You are acting as if they committed a MURDER or something.  Lighten up.  It was AT MOST underinflated equal to the weight of a PIECE OF PAPER.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What's easier to catch, a nerf football or a properly inflated regulation NFL football?  What do you think would be easier to carry without fumbling?  Yes there is a vast difference between the two but it is used to illustrate the effect of a  "softer" ball.
> 
> They have a rule for a reason.
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What happens to a football when you let the air out?  It becomes non-regulation NFL football that's what.
> 
> I have a solution, fine Brady, Billycheck (sp) and the Partiots then change the rule to allow the team any pressure they want.
> 
> Maybe a deflated ball also helped Blount hold onto it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I don't think they should be able to do that either.  However, I think this hoopla over 1 or 2 PSI is a bit over the top.  This is more a "bending of rules" than cheating, IMO.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The rules are clear it isn't bending them it is breaking them.  The ref checked the balls before the game and in between that and the start of the game they were deflated below NFL rules, that is not bending the rules it is breaking the rules.  If the Pats are so damn good then why do they have to bend the rules and sometimes outright break them?  There BS substitution game may have been a factor in beating the Ravens.  In that case they were bending the rules.
Click to expand...


"BS substitution game"?  LOL  Bottom line is that the Patriots coaching staff was smarter than the Raven's coaching staff.  They threw a new wrinkle at the Ravens and the Raven's didn't respond well to it.  Their players were covering Patriots players that were ineligible and leaving the eligible ones uncovered.  They tried the same thing against the Colts and the Colts were ready for it and it didn't work.  It's the same thing that took place when the Dolphins ran the Wildcat offense for the first time against the Patriots years ago and spanked an obviously better opponent.  You're the kind of whiner who hates it when your team loses because they get out smarted on the football field...hence the whines about the Raven's game.


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
Click to expand...


Like Sherman and Irwin? Two of the seven in recent years found to have PED while playing for the Saintly Seahawks. 

Remember Sherman's everybody does it statement. 

Of course those cheaters along with Carroll are different than Belichick and those cheaters.


----------



## Papageorgio

TrinityPower said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you and your hater friends have fun with your hate.  Just remember, the Patriots do not need to cheat to win games.  They are one of the BEST teams in the NFL.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Nightie night now!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you are correct, they do not need to cheat but the fact is that they have 3 times now so that says something
Click to expand...


Like Carroll cheating at USC and then all those PED problems in Seattle, what seven in the last few years, coincides with Carroll arriving.


----------



## SwimExpert

And in yet another "elevator video" incident, it's now revealed that the NFL was aware of deflated football allegations against the Patriots _*before the AFC Championship game began*._



> ESPN's Adam Schefter says the Colts' suspicions date back to their Nov. 16 game against New England, a 42-20 Patriots win. In that game, Indianapolis safety Mike Adams intercepted two passes and handed both balls to the Colts' equipment manager to hold as souvenirs. Both balls, Schefter's sources say, were noticeably underinflated.
> 
> *Those sources said the Colts raised concerns to the league, which was aware of the issue going into this weekend's AFC title game*.



Report NFL Was Aware Of Patriots Deflation Allegations Before Sunday


----------



## Papageorgio

TrinityPower said:


> So let's throw this out there...the league fines Lynch 100,000 for not talking to the media but playing with sub par balls is a 25,000 fine and if Lynch wore the wrong colored shoes he would be suspended should Seattle go to the Superbowl but a team is found to have used sub standard equipment and investigated for cheating and no suspension?  Even Rice was suspended before a full story was known yet the Patriots get what for punishment for 3 different violations of foul play?



If the NFL had waited for the whole story to come out, Rice's suspension would have been upheld. 

The investigation in the Patriots needs to be thorough, they will probably find the ballboy the one responsible for it all. They are left in charge of making sure the balls are properly inflated. A ballboy for the Broncos was on SVP and Russillo yesterday and it was his job to make sure all the balls were properly inflated.

Lynch knows the rules about talking and not talking to the press, so he is making a black and white decision. Lynch is a nut job, his last game for Seattle will be the Super Bowl, they won't be able to afford him after that. 

We don't want a knee jerk response to the Patriot's issue. This will change the way the NFL handles the footballs during games.

Trying to equate one penalty with another is never going to make sense. Look at penalties within the game. Some of those make no sense.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> They threw a new wrinkle at the Ravens and the Raven's didn't respond well to it.



The formation itself was not a problem.  Yes, you could describe it as a "new wrinkle."  The really sticky part was the way they did it.  The player stands in front of the official and says "Hey, I'm ineligible" and before the official even has a chance to comprehend what's just been said, the ball is snapped.  _That_ is the real issue.  The officials said they didn't even know what was going on.  Harbaugh had to run out onto the field and take a penalty in order to draw attention to the issue and prompt the officials to take control of the situation.  The normal thing would have been for the officials to allow the opposing team to know what was going on.  The Pats were trying to prevent that from happening by confusing the officials.

Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.


----------



## Papageorgio

Oldstyle said:


> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> The moment you quailfy cheating is when the integrity of the sport diminishes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you're a Dolphins fan who can't stand the fact that the Patriots OWN your asses year in and year out...so you're here whining about balls that the officials handled on every damn play of the first half and didn't notice a problem...while you ignore the fact that the Patriots steamrollered the Colts in the second half...AFTER the balls had been re-inflated?  You're not worried about the integrity of the game...you just don't like the Patriots!
Click to expand...


Old rehash, I'm not a Dolphins fan, I also stated that the inflation of the ball had nothing to do with the outcome of the .colts game, it seems you have comprehension issues.


----------



## MisterBeale

Alex. said:


> *Pereira on #DeflateGate "This is cheating and it is something the league will deal with harshly" *





hangover said:


> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.



Maybe the refs did notice. . . . 

Perhaps this is a manurfactured scandle to get the nation to hate the Patriots.  

Let's remember folks, the NFL is a business.  Their job is to attract viewers, to get ratings, to create a villian and a hero.  You create a paradigm that all the non-sport enthusiasts, the ones that aren't fanatics, can get behind for the Superbowl.  Now the talking heads will have something to talk about.

The league and the sport is FOR PROFIT.  As such, you don't leave a multi-billion dollar industry to chance, you manipulate it, you give instructions to your referees and officials_._


This years paradigm, especially after the conservative take over of the political land scape, is the team that represents the most progressive globalist Agenda 21city in America, the Sea-Hawks Vs. the no good cheatin' gun totin' angry low down Patriots representing old fashioned American out of touch values.

My real curiosity is if the elites will go so far with their anti-American brain washing as to have Lenny play his classic remake of American Woman during the half-time show and drive the mental conditioning all the way home?   


A little peak into what's going on. . . 

HOME - The Fix Is In


----------



## MisterBeale

I guess I'll be surprised if the Patriots win.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now that this deception has made it to the national evening news it won't go away.  It will be the hottest topic for the next ten days and flailed around during the Super Bowl Broadcast in front of one of the largest viewing audiences in history.  This is a serious black eye for the Patriots and the NFL which has had a bad season for defending it's image already.  There MUST be a serious punishment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That may not bode well for the Seahawks dude.  Nothing brings a team together and gives them motivation like a scandal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ORRrr...it could just cause chaos and back biting and back stabbing as the players and coaches are scurrying like cockroaches when the light is turned on.
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is NOT going to happen.  Wishful thinking on your part.  This is going to be GREAT for the Pats.  Like I said, they play their best under pressure.
Click to expand...


Lucky you.  The pressure is on.  Belichik responded to the media today and just threw Brady under the bus.  You may have unparalleled desire for more pressure but Billy B is being crushed under it.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
Click to expand...

that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in college the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> And not allowed.  What is it that you don't get?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anything at all, a deflated ball made it easier for them to grip.  That is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I just heard a news report about this.  Now, they said that two hours before game time, the officials check the balls and check the PSI, then hand the balls back to the ball boys.  Now, I must wonder WHO is on the sidelines deflating footballs without being noticed?  Lol!
> 
> I think those footballs must have been defective.  Maybe they should have had a recall.
> 
> Anyhow, maybe Bill is a bit of a sleaze, but the Pats would have beat the hell out of the Colts regardless (obviously).  I'm a little upset if this is true because the Patriots don't need to cheat to win games.  They are a great team.  I watch all of their games.  Also, one of the Colts said the Pats would have beat them if they had been playing with a ball of soap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ok look.  A football to an NFL quarterback is like a scalpel in the hands of a surgeon or a golf club in the hands of a PGA pro.  There is a very specific way Phil Mickelson wants his irons.  He wants a very specific grind.  he wants a very specific weighting.  He wants a very specific flex in the shaft because all those things impact what he can do with the ball and how he swings a golf club.  To the average hacker such minimal details would make no difference in their game at all, but to a tour professional they make all the difference in the world.
> 
> A football to an NFL quarterback is the same thing.  It's not like they take these balls out of the box on game day and say "here you go".  The balls are treated exactly to the specification of the quarterback. They are worked in, they are rubbed down to remove the slippery finish...there's a whole bunch of stuff they do to them.  So when those balls get to the sideline they are in the exact shape the quarterback wants and according to the specifications he wants.
> 
> Now they were checked by the refs and found to be ok and then suddenly they all lose 2 psi?   It's clear that New England knew what was legal and what wasn't so they made sure they were legal for the inspection and afterwards adjusted them to Brady's preferences.  Unless you are suggesting that a ball boy or equipment manager took it upon themselves to alter the balls which is absolutely ludicrous. The balls were adjusted because that's how Brady wanted them.  It's illegal.  They knew it.  They did it anyhow.  It's cheating and it's on Brady and it's on Belichick because Belichick doesn't give two shits how the balls are as long as they are what his quarterback wants.
Click to expand...

great watching you take the Beli -cheat apologists to school.


----------



## HUGGY

hangover said:


> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.



What do the Seahawks or their fans have anything to do with this ball deflation issue?

This is strictly between the Patriots and the Colts and the League.

The Seahawks haven't said a peep about this crazy situation.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
Click to expand...


Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.


----------



## Alex.

Beli-cheat throws Tommy under the bus.

"New England Patriots coach Bill Belichick said Thursday that he had "no knowledge whatsoever" of the underinflating of footballs for the Patriots' AFC championship win against the Indianapolis Colts.

But he said that kickers and quarterbacks, including Patriots star Tom Brady, "do have certain preferences" on how the football feels.


"I can tell you, and they will tell you, that there is never any sympathy whatsoever from me on that subject. Zero," the coach said. "Tom's personal preference in his footballs are something that he can talk about in much better detail." 

New England Patriots Coach Bill Belichick No Knowledge Whatsoever of Deflate-Gate - NBC News


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
Click to expand...



Not big bad criminals just cheaters


----------



## ChrisL

TrinityPower said:


> So let's throw this out there...the league fines Lynch 100,000 for not talking to the media but playing with sub par balls is a 25,000 fine and if Lynch wore the wrong colored shoes he would be suspended should Seattle go to the Superbowl but a team is found to have used sub standard equipment and investigated for cheating and no suspension?  Even Rice was suspended before a full story was known yet the Patriots get what for punishment for 3 different violations of foul play?



Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
Click to expand...


What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> You said earlier So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
Click to expand...

I know they are cheaters.


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Like Sherman and Irwin? Two of the seven in recent years found to have PED while playing for the Saintly Seahawks.
> 
> Remember Sherman's everybody does it statement.
> 
> Of course those cheaters along with Carroll are different than Belichick and those cheaters.
Click to expand...


No I don't remember Sherman's everybody does it statement as he was cleared


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you and your hater friends have fun with your hate.  Just remember, the Patriots do not need to cheat to win games.  They are one of the BEST teams in the NFL.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Nightie night now!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you are correct, they do not need to cheat but the fact is that they have 3 times now so that says something
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Like Carroll cheating at USC and then all those PED problems in Seattle, what seven in the last few years, coincides with Carroll arriving.
Click to expand...


You might want to look it up.  Only one player caught for PEDs is still on the team and Washington and Denver had more players suspended than Seattle.


----------



## hangover

HUGGY said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do the Seahawks or their fans have anything to do with this ball deflation issue?
> 
> This is strictly between the Patriots and the Colts and the League.
> 
> The Seahawks haven't said a peep about this crazy situation.
Click to expand...

The Colts have already said that the Pats would have beaten them with beach balls.

On another poll, Seattle fans want to play the Colts instead of the Pats. Shows how skeerd the Hawks fans are of the Pats.
What punishment do you think fits the Patriot s crime of deflating balls beyond league specs - Discussionist


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?



Why not?  You've spent half the thread comparing PSI to weight.  So any batshit crazy thing is possible.


----------



## BluePhantom

hangover said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do the Seahawks or their fans have anything to do with this ball deflation issue?
> 
> This is strictly between the Patriots and the Colts and the League.
> 
> The Seahawks haven't said a peep about this crazy situation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Colts have already said that the Pats would have beaten them with beach balls.
> 
> On another poll, Seattle fans want to play the Colts instead of the Pats. Shows how skeerd the Hawks fans are of the Pats.
> What punishment do you think fits the Patriot s crime of deflating balls beyond league specs - Discussionist
Click to expand...


Yeah 10 whole votes. PUHLEEZE


----------



## SwimExpert

hangover said:


> The Colts have already said that the Pats would have beaten them with beach balls.



Actually, that was New England's Brandon Browner who made that comment.

Brandon Browner on Twitter For my 2cents Blount scored 3 rushing touchdowns. He could ve carried a beach ball. Also doesn t hurt we only gave up 7 points inflatethis


----------



## hangover

BluePhantom said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boy, the Seattle fans are desperate. Maybe they can get the commissioner to spot them 21 points as punishment for the "deflated" balls. Or instead, just call off the SB and give the trophy to the Hawks. How come the refs didn't notice? They spot the ball on every down. I wonder if next year, every team will have to play with the SAME balls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do the Seahawks or their fans have anything to do with this ball deflation issue?
> 
> This is strictly between the Patriots and the Colts and the League.
> 
> The Seahawks haven't said a peep about this crazy situation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Colts have already said that the Pats would have beaten them with beach balls.
> 
> On another poll, Seattle fans want to play the Colts instead of the Pats. Shows how skeerd the Hawks fans are of the Pats.
> What punishment do you think fits the Patriot s crime of deflating balls beyond league specs - Discussionist
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah 10 whole votes. PUHLEEZE
Click to expand...

More than any other choices...


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> You said earlier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And just because someone hasn't gotten  caught  makes it ok, in your eyes.  Just wow!  Remind me to never play cards with you.
> Integrity you lack, along with all the others saying, no big
> deal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So if you hold, do you go to the ref and have them penalize you for holding?  You are cheating, and you said not getting caught doesn't make it okay.
> 
> I'm trying to define where the line is?
> 
> A rub is a very intentional play, yet if it is not called no one says a word.
> 
> Deflated ball, the refs are supposed to check them before the game, they handled the balls, they said nothing. Now, after the game it is a problem. Now that there is a problem, what is the solution? What is the penalty?
> 
> Before you can claim any of your free for all why are some forms of cheating allowed and others not?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
Click to expand...


yep.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> 
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know they are cheaters.
Click to expand...

only the Belicheat apologists live in denial on this.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why not?  You've spent half the thread comparing PSI to weight.  So any batshit crazy thing is possible.
Click to expand...


WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.


----------



## BluePhantom

HUGGY said:


> Lucky you.  The pressure is on.  Belichik responded to the media today and just threw Brady under the bus.  You may have unparalleled desire for more pressure but Billy B is being crushed under it.



He sure did, but honestly I am not sure what else he was supposed to say.  Anyone who thinks that when those balls hit the field that they are not in the exact shape the quarterback wants them is out of their minds. Had he said "oh the equipment manager took it upon himself" he would have gotten laughed out of the media room.  Had he said "hell I don't know how they got that way" he would have gotten laughed out of the media room.  This is completely obvious so what _can _he say?


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why not?  You've spent half the thread comparing PSI to weight.  So any batshit crazy thing is possible.
Click to expand...


Yeah, sorry but comparing a criminal act with deflating a ball is completely retarded.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know they are cheaters.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> only the Belicheat apologists live in denial on this.
Click to expand...


Shut up, tard.  No one cares what you think.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.





No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!



Time for bed, Chris.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheating is not accepted that is why there are rules. Break the rules pay the price.  You trying to rationalize and normalize that does not work.
> 
> 
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know they are cheaters.
Click to expand...


You don't know anything.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

two farts in a row from you kid. ahh the truth hurts the poor baby.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
Click to expand...


Whatever, you know I mean.  It's still measurement of the amount of air.    And THAT is quite different than equating this incident with Ray Rice, who allegedly had committed a CRIME at the time.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
Click to expand...


yep,time to have mommy tuck Chissy in after  all of his multiple farts in this  thread he has cut.

head for the hills,he is about to cut another a few more multiple ones.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yep,time to have mommy tuck Chissy in after  all of his multiple farts in this  thread he has cut.
> 
> head for the hills,he is about to cut another a few more multiple ones.
Click to expand...


Does anyone with a brain take any of your posts seriously?  Doubtful, so why do you post here?  Old demented weirdo.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yep,time to have mommy tuck Chissy in after  all of his multiple farts in this  thread he has cut.
> 
> head for the hills,he is about to cut another a few more multiple ones.
Click to expand...


Are you on drugs?  You can't even form a coherent post?  Your grammar and punctuation are ATROCIOUS, and that is 3rd grade level stuff.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whatever, you know I mean.  It's still measurement of the amount of air.
Click to expand...


No, it's not.  And yes, I know exactly what you mean.  You thought that PSI was related to weight.  That's why you kept arguing about the added weight of the football, even though *nobody anywhere* has said that any of this had anything to do with weight.

PSI does not measure the amount of air.  The same amount of air will have different PSI in different containers, and at different locations.  The same amount of air will result in a higher PSI in the same football at a higher altitude, due to the reduced atmospheric pressure at those altitudes.  You clearly know *nothing* about any of this, and are talking out of your ass.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whatever, you know I mean.  It's still measurement of the amount of air.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, it's not.  And yes, I know exactly what you mean.  You thought that PSI was related to weight.  That's why you kept arguing about the added weight of the football, even though *nobody anywhere* has said that any of this had anything to do with weight.
> 
> PSI does not measure the amount of air.  The same amount of air will have different PSI in different containers, and at different locations.  The same amount of air will result in a higher PSI in the same football at a higher altitude, due to the reduced atmospheric pressure at those altitudes.  You clearly know *nothing* about any of this, and are talking out of your ass.
Click to expand...


Yes it does, pounds per square inch is a way to measure the amount of air.  Yes or no?


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No it's not!  It's a measure of pressure, not weight!
> 
> 
> 
> Time for bed, Chris.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whatever, you know I mean.  It's still measurement of the amount of air.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, it's not.  And yes, I know exactly what you mean.  You thought that PSI was related to weight.  That's why you kept arguing about the added weight of the football, even though *nobody anywhere* has said that any of this had anything to do with weight.
> 
> PSI does not measure the amount of air.  The same amount of air will have different PSI in different containers, and at different locations.  The same amount of air will result in a higher PSI in the same football at a higher altitude, due to the reduced atmospheric pressure at those altitudes.  You clearly know *nothing* about any of this, and are talking out of your ass.
Click to expand...


You are just a nit-picking little bitch.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Yes it does, pounds per square inch is a way to measure the amount of air.  Yes or no?



  No.


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> They threw a new wrinkle at the Ravens and the Raven's didn't respond well to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The formation itself was not a problem.  Yes, you could describe it as a "new wrinkle."  The really sticky part was the way they did it.  The player stands in front of the official and says "Hey, I'm ineligible" and before the official even has a chance to comprehend what's just been said, the ball is snapped.  _That_ is the real issue.  The officials said they didn't even know what was going on.  Harbaugh had to run out onto the field and take a penalty in order to draw attention to the issue and prompt the officials to take control of the situation.  The normal thing would have been for the officials to allow the opposing team to know what was going on.  The Pats were trying to prevent that from happening by confusing the officials.
> 
> Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.
Click to expand...


You don't have a clue as to what happened in the Raven's game...do you?

Harbaugh drew a penalty because the Patriots ran the play three times in a row and the Ravens STILL didn't know how to respond to it.  The problem they faced...and it's TOTALLY legal...is that when Shane Vereen lines up as an "ineligible" receiver out from the formation and immediately retreats to behind Brady he is in fact now eligible to receive a lateral pass and advance the ball.  As such the Ravens were still forced to cover him.  It was brilliance by whoever came up with it on the Patriot's coaching staff.  It had zero to do with confusing the officials...which you'd know if you knew a damn thing about football.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> that is exactly why the NFL is a joke.You do those things in collge the patriots have done,they kick you out of the program.you get caught smoking even cigerretes,your off the team.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know they are cheaters.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't know anything.
Click to expand...


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> You are just a nit-picking little bitch.



Sure.  Letting facts get in the way is nit-picking.  Kinda like how you think cheating doesn't count as long as you win.


----------



## Oldstyle

Papageorgio said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depotoo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you remember hearing about the Dolphin game where a  Jets coach intentionally tripped our player?  Is this what you want to see happening in all the games?  A damn free for all?  Because the allowing of intentional infractions leads to episodes such as that and bounties being put on players, etc.  when  penalties for such are not severe.
> Personally, I would think playoff games should come with even  steeper punishment, if cheating is determined.
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> So all "cheating" destroys the "integrity" of the sport?  That includes defensive backs getting away with a hold...or an offensive player getting away with a push-off to catch a winning touchdown...pick plays of course should have offensive coordinators banned for life?  Kickers shouldn't be able to use different balls than everyone else...
> 
> Please explain to me why a "rub" play has more "integrity" than playing with a softer football?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You cant compare a heat of the moment hold to a planned and calculated attempt to cheat.
> They're not even close to the same thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A rub play is pretty intentional, it is planned and not a heat of the moment.
> 
> Also if you hold, do you tell the ref that you held, so, he can penalize the team. Integrity of the game and all.
> 
> Sounds like baseball more than football.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you're a Dolphins fan who can't stand the fact that the Patriots OWN your asses year in and year out...so you're here whining about balls that the officials handled on every damn play of the first half and didn't notice a problem...while you ignore the fact that the Patriots steamrollered the Colts in the second half...AFTER the balls had been re-inflated?  You're not worried about the integrity of the game...you just don't like the Patriots!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Old rehash, I'm not a Dolphins fan, I also stated that the inflation of the ball had nothing to do with the outcome of the .colts game, it seems you have comprehension issues.
Click to expand...


That was a post directed at Depotoo, Papa...not you.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> You don't have a clue as to what happened in the Raven's game...do you?



  Oh, I know.  Trust me, I know.  I was watching the game very intently.


----------



## Alex.

" Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one. 
To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."

Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.

He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.

And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."

Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have a clue as to what happened in the Raven's game...do you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, I know.  Trust me, I know.  I was watching the game very intently.
Click to expand...


Yet you don't understand why the Raven's "freaked out"...so obviously you don't understand what was happening right in front of your face!


----------



## Oldstyle

Alex. said:


> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious



Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are just a nit-picking little bitch.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure.  Letting facts get in the way is nit-picking.  Kinda like how you think cheating doesn't count as long as you win.
Click to expand...


You have yet to post any facts concerning the topic of the thread.  Just your own assumptions.  Also, your little nit picking hissy fit doesn't change the fact that the balls were deflated a negligible amount, which could happen while playing with them, especially if they were only inflated to the absolute minimal requirements.


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
Click to expand...



I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> It had zero to do with confusing the officials...which you'd know if you knew a damn thing about football.





Speaking of not knowing anything, I think you need to go back and take a look at what happened.  Vereen declaring himself as ineligible, and being covered by another receiver at the line of scrimmage, effectively became a lineman split out from the rest of the line.  This left five people on the "regular" line, appearing to be a regular set of linemen.  Except on the opposite side of the line, what appeared to be a tackle was now a tight end, who went uncovered in pass protection.

Next time you want to accuse someone of not knowing what they're talking about, you should make sure you know what you're talking about.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, RIIGHT!  Lol!  That is a crock of bull crap if I've heard it.  How many times have we heard of cheating scandals, sex scandals, bribing ref scandals, CHILD MOLESTATION scandals in the college sports?  But here you are bitching about a few that were under inflated, according to regulation guidelines, by about as much as a piece of paper, and that makes the Pats the big bad "criminals"?  Get a grip on yourself, you old fool.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know they are cheaters.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't know anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


Stuff it, dick head.


----------



## ChrisL

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
Click to expand...


I don't think Alex has a team.  He's just a prick.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It had zero to do with confusing the officials...which you'd know if you knew a damn thing about football.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of not knowing anything, I think you need to go back and take a look at what happened.  Vereen declaring himself as ineligible, and being covered by another receiver at the line of scrimmage, effectively became a lineman split out from the rest of the line.  This left five people on the "regular" line, appearing to be a regular set of linemen.  Except on the opposite side of the line, what appeared to be a tackle was now a tight end, who went uncovered in pass protection.
> 
> Next time you want to accuse someone of not knowing what they're talking about, you should make sure you know what you're talking about.
Click to expand...


THIS was already explained to you.  The NFL said it is a LEGAL maneuver.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> They threw a new wrinkle at the Ravens and the Raven's didn't respond well to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The formation itself was not a problem.  Yes, you could describe it as a "new wrinkle."  The really sticky part was the way they did it.  The player stands in front of the official and says "Hey, I'm ineligible" and before the official even has a chance to comprehend what's just been said, the ball is snapped.  _That_ is the real issue.  The officials said they didn't even know what was going on.  Harbaugh had to run out onto the field and take a penalty in order to draw attention to the issue and prompt the officials to take control of the situation.  The normal thing would have been for the officials to allow the opposing team to know what was going on.  The Pats were trying to prevent that from happening by confusing the officials.
> 
> Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.
Click to expand...


Peter King went back and watched the tape and found that there was 7, 10, and 7 seconds that passed between the refs announcing eligible receivers and the Patriots snapping the ball.  In fact, at one point the ref even announced to the Ravens that "34 is ineligible, do not cover 34".  Pretty specific thing to say for a ref who supposedly was so confused by the Patriots that he didn't even comprehend what was happening before the snap. 

It's not the Pats problem that the Ravens weren't quick enough to figure it out.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have a clue as to what happened in the Raven's game...do you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, I know.  Trust me, I know.  I was watching the game very intently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yet you don't understand why the Raven's "freaked out"...so obviously you don't understand what was happening right in front of your face!
Click to expand...




You're the one who apparently doesn't understand.  It had nothing to do with the possibility of receiving a handoff.  By not allowing adequate time for the Ravens be made aware that he was ineligible, the Ravens had no way of knowing to not cover him.  The Ravens "freaked out" because the left tackle was catching passes, which is normally against the rules.


----------



## mack20

Oldstyle said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Point being, the difference is negligible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because the difference in weight is negligible does not mean that the difference in the overall effect is negligible.  Of course, you damn well know that your logic is bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If it makes no difference, then why do it?  The fact that it was done is itself evidence of the fact that it can effect the results.
> 
> The fact that it is a preference of Brady's is, in and of itself, a change that creates an advantage.  Why not just use a smaller ball?  Why not use larger footballs for teams that want to?  Why not make the field 100 meters?  This is a game that will award or rescind touchdowns and first downs based on half an inch.  The league regulates footballs, and the Patriots willfully violated those rules with the intent of gaining an advantage.
> 
> Your entire position on this seems to be based on the batshit stupid idea that cheating doesn't matter if you win in the end.  You're pathetic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> For the same reasons that Aaron Rodgers prefers an overinflated ball, because it probably really means nothing and is just some QB preference that does NOT affect the outcome of games.  You are acting as if they committed a MURDER or something.  Lighten up.  It was AT MOST underinflated equal to the weight of a PIECE OF PAPER.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What's easier to catch, a nerf football or a properly inflated regulation NFL football?  What do you think would be easier to carry without fumbling?  Yes there is a vast difference between the two but it is used to illustrate the effect of a  "softer" ball.
> 
> They have a rule for a reason.
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Check it out, haters!
> 
> How serious is deflate-gate Yahoo Sports does its own ball-deflating test Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> *Weight: Negligible
> 
> A football weighs 14.5 ounces, discounting air. At 13 psi, the air inside the ball weighs about one-third of an ounce, or about the weight of two sheets of paper. At 11 psi, the air weighs about one-fourth of an ounce.
> 
> Verdict: If you can tell the difference between one-third and one-fourth of an ounce of air inside a one-pound football, you are lying.
> 
> Appearance: Also negligible
> 
> It's a football. It looks exactly the same at 13 or 11 psi. Take two pounds out of a regulation-inflated ball and it doesn't suddenly become a Salvador Dali-esque melting chunk of leather.*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What happens to a football when you let the air out?  It becomes non-regulation NFL football that's what.
> 
> I have a solution, fine Brady, Billycheck (sp) and the Partiots then change the rule to allow the team any pressure they want.
> 
> Maybe a deflated ball also helped Blount hold onto it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I don't think they should be able to do that either.  However, I think this hoopla over 1 or 2 PSI is a bit over the top.  This is more a "bending of rules" than cheating, IMO.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The rules are clear it isn't bending them it is breaking them.  The ref checked the balls before the game and in between that and the start of the game they were deflated below NFL rules, that is not bending the rules it is breaking the rules.  If the Pats are so damn good then why do they have to bend the rules and sometimes outright break them?  There BS substitution game may have been a factor in beating the Ravens.  In that case they were bending the rules.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "BS substitution game"?  LOL  Bottom line is that the Patriots coaching staff was smarter than the Raven's coaching staff.  They threw a new wrinkle at the Ravens and the Raven's didn't respond well to it.  Their players were covering Patriots players that were ineligible and leaving the eligible ones uncovered.  They tried the same thing against the Colts and the Colts were ready for it and it didn't work.  It's the same thing that took place when the Dolphins ran the Wildcat offense for the first time against the Patriots years ago and spanked an obviously better opponent.  You're the kind of whiner who hates it when your team loses because they get out smarted on the football field...hence the whines about the Raven's game.
Click to expand...


Actually, it did work against the Colts, they just applied it differently.  It was pretty brilliant, actually. That's how they set up the Solder TD.  Fleming reported as eligible all game but was never targeted, and they suddenly reported Solder as eligible and Fleming as ineligible. The Colts were conditioned to keep an eye on Fleming and weren't prepared for Solder.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are just a nit-picking little bitch.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure.  Letting facts get in the way is nit-picking.  Kinda like how you think cheating doesn't count as long as you win.
Click to expand...

thats kid chris for you.pesky facts hurt his feelings.lol


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have a clue as to what happened in the Raven's game...do you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, I know.  Trust me, I know.  I was watching the game very intently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yet you don't understand why the Raven's "freaked out"...so obviously you don't understand what was happening right in front of your face!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're the one who apparently doesn't understand.  It had nothing to do with the possibility of receiving a handoff.  By not allowing adequate time for the Ravens be made aware that he was ineligible, the Ravens had no way of knowing to not cover him.  The Ravens "freaked out" because the left tackle was catching passes, which is normally against the rules.
Click to expand...


The refs literally told the Ravens not to cover 34, how much more help do they need?  This is professional football, I didn't realize that the Ravens needed their hands held on every play.


----------



## TrinityPower

ChrisL said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> So let's throw this out there...the league fines Lynch 100,000 for not talking to the media but playing with sub par balls is a 25,000 fine and if Lynch wore the wrong colored shoes he would be suspended should Seattle go to the Superbowl but a team is found to have used sub standard equipment and investigated for cheating and no suspension?  Even Rice was suspended before a full story was known yet the Patriots get what for punishment for 3 different violations of foul play?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?
Click to expand...

I am saying that there are a lot of punishments that are dealt and not all of them carry as much penalty as others.  Some are over the top and some are overlooked.  In past the violations of the Patriots have not carried enough penalty for them to stop pulling somethng else.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have a clue as to what happened in the Raven's game...do you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, I know.  Trust me, I know.  I was watching the game very intently.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yet you don't understand why the Raven's "freaked out"...so obviously you don't understand what was happening right in front of your face!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're the one who apparently doesn't understand.  It had nothing to do with the possibility of receiving a handoff.  By not allowing adequate time for the Ravens be made aware that he was ineligible, the Ravens had no way of knowing to not cover him.  The Ravens "freaked out" because the left tackle was catching passes, which is normally against the rules.
Click to expand...


Too bad.  It was a legal maneuver.


----------



## Valerie

short of a confession, i wonder how they could ever prove who deflated those balls, or if they were ever properly inflated in the first place...

other than that, i wonder isn't it the official's JOB to check for proper inflation before the game starts...?








if they can't prove who did what, why should the patriots be punished just because the officials failed to do their JOB?  





_According to the NFL Rule Book, the each team is responsible for proving their own game balls two hours before kickoff.


*Each team will make 12 primary balls available for testing by the Referee two hours and 15 minutes prior to the starting time of the game to meet League requirements. The home team will also make 12 backup balls available for testing in all stadiums. In addition, the visitors, at their discretion, may bring 12 backup balls to be tested by the Referee for games held in outdoor stadiums.* For all games, eight new footballs, sealed in a special box and shipped by the manufacturer to the Referee, will be opened in the officials’ locker room two hours and 15 minutes prior to the starting time of the game. These balls are to be specially marked by the Referee and used exclusively for the kicking game._

Deflategate 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know Heavy.com


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> Too bad.  It was a legal maneuver.



Yes, it was.  Which is what I've said the whole way through.  Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.  It's very much in line with a team who, under Belichick, has a long history of cheating.


----------



## SwimExpert

Valerie said:


> short of a confession, i wonder how they could ever prove who deflated those balls, or if they were ever properly inflated in the first place...
> 
> other than that, i wonder isn't it the official's JOB to check for proper inflation before the game starts...?



The officials do, and did, check the balls before the game.  That's how they known that they were properly inflated to begin with.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad.  It was a legal maneuver.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, it was.  Which is what I've said the whole way through.  Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.  It's very much in line with a team who, under Belichick, has a long history of cheating.
Click to expand...


Why was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  I've already shown above that the previous reasons you've given aren't valid.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not big bad criminals just cheaters
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you know about it?  Oh, that's right, nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know they are cheaters.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't know anything.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Stuff it, dick head.
Click to expand...


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> It had zero to do with confusing the officials...which you'd know if you knew a damn thing about football.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of not knowing anything, I think you need to go back and take a look at what happened.  Vereen declaring himself as ineligible, and being covered by another receiver at the line of scrimmage, effectively became a lineman split out from the rest of the line.  This left five people on the "regular" line, appearing to be a regular set of linemen.  Except on the opposite side of the line, what appeared to be a tackle was now a tight end, who went uncovered in pass protection.
> 
> Next time you want to accuse someone of not knowing what they're talking about, you should make sure you know what you're talking about.
Click to expand...


And what pray tell is "illegal" about that formation?  The Raven's problem is that they didn't know how to defend an "ineligible" receiver who when he retreated from the line to a position that made him eligible to receive a lateral pass while at the same time defending the tackle eligible player lined up on the left of the line.  The Patriots in effect created an extra eligible play-maker who needed to be accounted for in their defensive scheme.  The reason that Harbaugh threw a tantrum wasn't because what the Patriots did was illegal...he threw a tantrum because he didn't know what to do when Belichick sprung that formation on him.  Harbaugh was going ballistic because he knew he was being out coached in a MAJOR way in front of a national TV audience!


----------



## Oldstyle

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
Click to expand...


The New England Patriots have won more games than any other franchise over the past fifteen years not because they "cheat"...they've won more games that anyone else because they have a better organization from top to bottom then anyone else.

You like the Giants?  If you're a New Yorker that means you're probably a Jets fan who jumps ship to the Giants whenever the Jets stink the joint out.  No wonder you're so whiny this year...both of your teams suck!


----------



## Valerie

Valerie said:


> short of a confession, i wonder how they could ever prove who deflated those balls, or if they were ever properly inflated in the first place...
> 
> other than that, i wonder isn't it the official's JOB to check for proper inflation before the game starts...?





SwimExpert said:


> The officials do, and did, check the balls before the game.  That's how they known that they were properly inflated to begin with.




okay, looks like it's true that they reportedly checked...



_

"We are not commenting at this time," said Greg Aiello, the NFL's senior vice president of communications.


*League sources have confirmed that the footballs were properly inspected and approved by referee Walt Anderson 2 hours and 15 minutes before kickoff, before they were returned to each team.*


ESPN Sports Radio 810 in Kansas City *reported that the Patriots' footballs were tested at the half, reinflated at that time when they were found to be low, then put back in play for the second half*, and then tested again after the game. The report did not reveal the results of the test following the game. All of the balls the Colts used met standards, according to the report.


Meanwhile, a source told WEEI.com that *the Patriots used 12 backup balls for the second half against the Colts after issues were found* with most of the originals. Patriots spokesman Stacey James confirmed that the team had 24 balls total available, WEEI reported._


_

Under NFL rules, no alteration of the footballs is allowed once they are approved. *If a person is found breaking league rules and tampering with the footballs, that person could face up to a $25,000 fine and potentially more discipline.*_

NFL says New England Patriots had under-inflated footballs in AFC championship Game - ESPN Boston



still, i  wonder how they could ever prove how that happened, short of a confession.  ^




_Part of the investigation that needs further vetting is how the 11 footballs became underinflated.


The balls are required to be inflated between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch and weigh between 14 and 15 ounces. *Once approved by the referee, the balls are then put into ball bags and are set on the sidelines for each team. The ball bags are not guarded or watched in any way. When an official calls for a new football, a team's designated ball boy will get a new football from the ball bag and give it to the official.*_









          1st - 2nd - 3rd - 4th
Colts      0  - 7 - 0 - 0 
Patriots 14 - 3 -  21 - 7


just a reminder of the scoring breakdown ^

guess the first half balls must've caused the colts to not score in the second half.


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The New England Patriots have won more games than any other franchise over the past fifteen years not because they "cheat"...they've won more games that anyone else because they have a better organization from top to bottom then anyone else.
> 
> You like the Giants?  If you're a New Yorker that means you're probably a Jets fan who jumps ship to the Giants whenever the Jets stink the joint out.  No wonder you're so whiny this year...both of your teams suck!
Click to expand...



NE are proven to be cheaters, period. This is just another episode in their cheating ways.

NYG sucked big deal. I am not whining.


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad.  It was a legal maneuver.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, it was.  Which is what I've said the whole way through.  Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.  It's very much in line with a team who, under Belichick, has a long history of cheating.
Click to expand...


You really are an incredible idiot on this topic.  Is a half back option "dishonest" because it tries to trick the secondary?  Is a flea flicker "dishonest" because it also tries to trick the secondary?  Is a naked bootleg "dishonest" because it tries to trick the outside contain?  How is that formation "dishonest"?  

What it did was challenge the defensive scheme.  What Harbaugh SHOULD have done was call time out and react to what was being done to his defense by the Patriot's formation.  He didn't do that.  The Patriots ran the play three times in a row without any response from the Ravens at all.  Your coach got vapor lock at a crucial time in a crucial game and it was because the Patriots coaching staff out thought him.


----------



## Oldstyle

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The New England Patriots have won more games than any other franchise over the past fifteen years not because they "cheat"...they've won more games that anyone else because they have a better organization from top to bottom then anyone else.
> 
> You like the Giants?  If you're a New Yorker that means you're probably a Jets fan who jumps ship to the Giants whenever the Jets stink the joint out.  No wonder you're so whiny this year...both of your teams suck!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> NE are proven to be cheaters, period. This is just another episode in their cheating ways.
> 
> NYG sucked big deal. I am not whining.
Click to expand...


Dude, all you've done in this thread is whine.


----------



## Valerie

Oldstyle said:


> Dude, all you've done in this thread is whine.




maybe _he_ was the one who deflated them...   

hmm coulda been anyone who wished to deflate the patriots' legacy...



it's not like they haven't crushed the colts many times before...

Colts Patriots rivalry - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

*2010s (Patriots 6-0)*
*Year* *Date* *Winner* *Result* *Loser* *Location* *Colts QB* *Patriots QB*
2010 November 21 *New England Patriots* 31-28 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Peyton Manning Tom Brady
2011 December 4 *New England Patriots* 31-24 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Dan Orlovsky Tom Brady
2012 November 18 *New England Patriots* 59-24 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
2014 January 11 *New England Patriots* 43-22 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
2014 November 16 *New England Patriots* 42–20 Indianapolis Colts Lucas Oil Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
2015 January 18 *New England Patriots* 45-7 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady


----------



## Oldstyle

They played with "regulation" balls in the second half and outscored the Colts twenty eight to nothing!  This is by far the STUPIDEST "scandal" I've seen in a long...long...long...time!


----------



## Valerie

Oldstyle said:


> They played with "regulation" balls in the second half and outscored the Colts twenty eight to nothing!  This is by far the STUPIDEST "scandal" I've seen in a long...long...long...time!




feels like a set-up... i'd like to see the league prove it wasn't!  

makes me sad for the players who work so hard and do all the right things and now their legacy is tainted.

i am especially sad for my man tom brady.  i hope they absolutely crush seattle!


----------



## rightwinger

Who really cares?

Why not just let the QB use any inflation he is comfortable with?


----------



## featherlite

haha... Deflatriots.   True or not...its not the reason the Colts lost.


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The New England Patriots have won more games than any other franchise over the past fifteen years not because they "cheat"...they've won more games that anyone else because they have a better organization from top to bottom then anyone else.
> 
> You like the Giants?  If you're a New Yorker that means you're probably a Jets fan who jumps ship to the Giants whenever the Jets stink the joint out.  No wonder you're so whiny this year...both of your teams suck!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> NE are proven to be cheaters, period. This is just another episode in their cheating ways.
> 
> NYG sucked big deal. I am not whining.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, all you've done in this thread is whine.
Click to expand...



Didja know Beli-cheat threw Tommy under the bus? I ain't whining, I am watching the finger pointing and laughing my ass off.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why not?  You've spent half the thread comparing PSI to weight.  So any batshit crazy thing is possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
Click to expand...


No it isn't dumbass.


----------



## HUGGY

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why not?  You've spent half the thread comparing PSI to weight.  So any batshit crazy thing is possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No it isn't dumbass.
Click to expand...


Pressure and gross weight are two separate things.


----------



## rightwinger

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
Click to expand...

 
Giants own the Patriots

Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants


----------



## Alex.

Valerie said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dude, all you've done in this thread is whine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe _he_ was the one who deflated them...
> 
> hmm coulda been anyone who wished to deflate the patriots' legacy...
> 
> 
> 
> it's not like they haven't crushed the colts many times before...
> 
> Colts Patriots rivalry - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
> 
> *2010s (Patriots 6-0)*
> *Year* *Date* *Winner* *Result* *Loser* *Location* *Colts QB* *Patriots QB*
> 2010 November 21 *New England Patriots* 31-28 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Peyton Manning Tom Brady
> 2011 December 4 *New England Patriots* 31-24 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Dan Orlovsky Tom Brady
> 2012 November 18 *New England Patriots* 59-24 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
> 2014 January 11 *New England Patriots* 43-22 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
> 2014 November 16 *New England Patriots* 42–20 Indianapolis Colts Lucas Oil Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
> 2015 January 18 *New England Patriots* 45-7 Indianapolis Colts Gillette Stadium Andrew Luck Tom Brady
Click to expand...

I do not inflate, deflate or touch another man's balls in any way, shape or form no how no way madam.


----------



## Alex.

rightwinger said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
Click to expand...



Truer words were never spoken


----------



## Oldstyle

rightwinger said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
Click to expand...


With all due respect, Winger...the Giants hardly own ANYONE at the moment.  That one play in the Super Bowl...which was amazing...did indeed keep the Patriots from a perfect season...saying that the Giants "own" them because of it is a bit of a stretch.


----------



## Iceweasel

Russell Wilson says he ain't worried about it as long as it has laces.


----------



## Oldstyle

If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".


----------



## Valerie

Alex. said:


> Didja know Beli-cheat threw Tommy under the bus? I ain't whining, I am watching the finger pointing and laughing my ass off.




naah, he just answered a question... 




_Bill Belichick didn’t leave any room for misinterpretation: If you have any questions about the condition of game balls being used by the Patriots, go talk to Tom Brady.

*“Tom’s personal preferences ... on his footballs is something that he can talk about in much better detail and information than I could possibly provide,” *said Belichick at this morning’s packed Gillette Stadium press conference.

And guess what: *Brady plans to speak with the media this afternoon at 4.*

Which is fascinating, considering Brady wasn’t scheduled to meet with the media until tomorrow._

_Buckley Deflategate the sequel Go ask Brady Boston Herald_


----------



## rightwinger

Oldstyle said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> With all due respect, Winger...the Giants hardly own ANYONE at the moment.  That one play in the Super Bowl...which was amazing...did indeed keep the Patriots from a perfect season...saying that the Giants "own" them because of it is a bit of a stretch.
Click to expand...

 
Giants 2   Patriots 0

Yes the Giants own them. If not for the Giants, Patriots under Belichick and Brady would be 5-0 in the Superbowl and would be without question the greatest team, coach and QB of all time. They would also have had a 19-0 record


----------



## Valerie

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
Click to expand...




sounds like eli is just like the princess and the pea... 

i wonder if anyone ever busted_ his_ balls over it.. (pun intended)



_The New York Times reported that it takes months to get a football to Eli Manning’s preference, saying, “the ball has been scoured, scrubbed, soaked and seasoned, a breaking-in process that takes months and ensures that every ball used by the Giants in a game will meet Manning’s exact preferences. The leather will have been softened, the grip enhanced and the overall feel painstakingly assessed.”_

_Deflategate 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know Heavy.com
_


----------



## Freewill

Papageorgio said:


> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you and your hater friends have fun with your hate.  Just remember, the Patriots do not need to cheat to win games.  They are one of the BEST teams in the NFL.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Nightie night now!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you are correct, they do not need to cheat but the fact is that they have 3 times now so that says something
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Like Carroll cheating at USC and then all those PED problems in Seattle, what seven in the last few years, coincides with Carroll arriving.
Click to expand...


I agree, there is no one worth rooting for.


----------



## Iceweasel

PED problems?


----------



## Oldstyle

rightwinger said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> With all due respect, Winger...the Giants hardly own ANYONE at the moment.  That one play in the Super Bowl...which was amazing...did indeed keep the Patriots from a perfect season...saying that the Giants "own" them because of it is a bit of a stretch.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants 2   Patriots 0
> 
> Yes the Giants own them. If not for the Giants, Patriots under Belichick and Brady would be 5-0 in the Superbowl and would be without question the greatest team, coach and QB of all time. They would also have had a 19-0 record
Click to expand...


The play where Eli escapes a sure sack...throws up a prayer...and has his receiver make one of the most miraculous catches in Super Bowl history hardly has the Giant's "owning" anyone.  That's football...a game can turn on a single play.  If Manning is sacked...the Patriots of that year would go down as the single greatest team of all time...if the receiver doesn't manage to trap the ball one handed against his helmet and make that catch...the Patriots go down as the single greatest team of all time.  It's why winning Super Bowls are so hard to do.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad.  It was a legal maneuver.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, it was.  Which is what I've said the whole way through.  Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.  It's very much in line with a team who, under Belichick, has a long history of cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really are an incredible idiot on this topic.  Is a half back option "dishonest" because it tries to trick the secondary?  Is a flea flicker "dishonest" because it also tries to trick the secondary?  Is a naked bootleg "dishonest" because it tries to trick the outside contain?  How is that formation "dishonest"?
> 
> What it did was challenge the defensive scheme.  What Harbaugh SHOULD have done was call time out and react to what was being done to his defense by the Patriot's formation.  He didn't do that.  The Patriots ran the play three times in a row without any response from the Ravens at all.  Your coach got vapor lock at a crucial time in a crucial game and it was because the Patriots coaching staff out thought him.
Click to expand...


I agree that the Ravens ought to have called a timeout.  It was a creative play, and it caught the Ravens off guard.  I do not challenge any of that.  If you go back and re-read you'll see that what I said was that the complaint some people have is not that the play was illegal.  It was that the ineligible declarations were made in conjunction with a rushed snap.  A player declaring himself ineligible is an odd thing as it is.  The officials said they were confused themselves and weren't sure what was going on.  After the Ravens coach finally got the officials' attention they took more care to make sure that adequate notice was given.  The officials are just as much at fault as anyone.

After the game Belichick said that he doesn't understand why the play was confusing.  Really?  Why in the hell do you design such a play, if not to create confusion?  It seems to me that the play being successful relies entirely on creating confusion.  Does any of this amount to cheating?  No, of course not.  But it does highlight that Belichick is completely dishonest.


----------



## rightwinger

Oldstyle said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> With all due respect, Winger...the Giants hardly own ANYONE at the moment.  That one play in the Super Bowl...which was amazing...did indeed keep the Patriots from a perfect season...saying that the Giants "own" them because of it is a bit of a stretch.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants 2   Patriots 0
> 
> Yes the Giants own them. If not for the Giants, Patriots under Belichick and Brady would be 5-0 in the Superbowl and would be without question the greatest team, coach and QB of all time. They would also have had a 19-0 record
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The play where Eli escapes a sure sack...throws up a prayer...and has his receiver make one of the most miraculous catches in Super Bowl history hardly has the Giant's "owning" anyone.  That's football...a game can turn on a single play.  If Manning is sacked...the Patriots of that year would go down as the single greatest team of all time...if the receiver doesn't manage to trap the ball one handed against his helmet and make that catch...the Patriots go down as the single greatest team of all time.  It's why winning Super Bowls are so hard to do.
Click to expand...

 
Patriots won each of their three superbowls by 3 points. They could just as easily have been 0-5 in superbowls if not for a "lucky play" here or there.
Giants made the plays in the fourth quarter, Patriots didn't
All they had to do was stop two 80 yard plus touchdown drives and they couldn't do it


----------



## SwimExpert

Valerie said:


> still, i  wonder how they could ever prove how that happened, short of a confession.



The league is not a court of law, and they don't need to operate under those kinds of burdens of proof.  As long as the investigation results make the league satisfied they reasonably can assign responsibility, that they can take action as they see fit.

Consider the following:

-Belichick has a documented history of breaking the rules, having been caught in the 2008 spygate scandal, which went back as far as 2000.
-Brady has been on record since 2011 saying that he prefers deflated footballs
-The Colts apparently raised concerns back in November about the Patriots using deflated balls
-The Baltimore Ravens apparently raised similar concerns in the Divisional Playoff round
-*Someone* intentionally deflated the footballs
-Realistically speaking, there was no way that Brady or any other player who handled the footballs would not have noticed the ball was not fully inflated

It would be perfectly reasonable based on all of that for the league to conclude that several players on the Patriots were aware that the balls were deflated, they chose to play with deflated balls, and that the likelihood that the coach was involved in it happening is very low.



> guess the first half balls must've caused the colts to not score in the second half.



There's a reason you play the entire game.  The plays you call on first down are different than the plays you call on second down.  By the same token, the plays you call when down by 10 points at the beginning of the second half are different than the plays you call when you're up by 10 points at the beginning of the second half.  Who knows, perhaps the Patriots would not have scored at all in the first half if not for the deflated footballs.  If the second half score had been 10-0 in favor of the Colts, every play would have been called differently.  It's really impossible to know for certain what the difference would have been.

But at the end of the day it doesn't matter if the deflated footballs had any impact or not.  The fact is that they intentionally cheated.  The absence of integrity is the problem, especially with a team who has been caught cheating in the past.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
Click to expand...


Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.


----------



## ChrisL

rightwinger said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> With all due respect, Winger...the Giants hardly own ANYONE at the moment.  That one play in the Super Bowl...which was amazing...did indeed keep the Patriots from a perfect season...saying that the Giants "own" them because of it is a bit of a stretch.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants 2   Patriots 0
> 
> Yes the Giants own them. If not for the Giants, Patriots under Belichick and Brady would be 5-0 in the Superbowl and would be without question the greatest team, coach and QB of all time. They would also have had a 19-0 record
Click to expand...


What does that have to do with this year's superbowl?  The Giants are not in the superbowl, so they are irrelevant.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad.  It was a legal maneuver.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, it was.  Which is what I've said the whole way through.  Was it cheating?  No.  Was it dishonest and poor sportsmanship?  Yes.  It's very much in line with a team who, under Belichick, has a long history of cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You really are an incredible idiot on this topic.  Is a half back option "dishonest" because it tries to trick the secondary?  Is a flea flicker "dishonest" because it also tries to trick the secondary?  Is a naked bootleg "dishonest" because it tries to trick the outside contain?  How is that formation "dishonest"?
> 
> What it did was challenge the defensive scheme.  What Harbaugh SHOULD have done was call time out and react to what was being done to his defense by the Patriot's formation.  He didn't do that.  The Patriots ran the play three times in a row without any response from the Ravens at all.  Your coach got vapor lock at a crucial time in a crucial game and it was because the Patriots coaching staff out thought him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree that the Ravens ought to have called a timeout.  It was a creative play, and it caught the Ravens off guard.  I do not challenge any of that.  If you go back and re-read you'll see that what I said was that the complaint some people have is not that the play was illegal.  It was that the ineligible declarations were made in conjunction with a rushed snap.  A player declaring himself ineligible is an odd thing as it is.  The officials said they were confused themselves and weren't sure what was going on.  After the Ravens coach finally got the officials' attention they took more care to make sure that adequate notice was given.  The officials are just as much at fault as anyone.
> 
> After the game Belichick said that he doesn't understand why the play was confusing.  Really?  Why in the hell do you design such a play, if not to create confusion?  It seems to me that the play being successful relies entirely on creating confusion.  Does any of this amount to cheating?  No, of course not.  But it does highlight that Belichick is completely dishonest.
Click to expand...


Shut up, you said it was unsportsmanlike conduct, amongst other things.  Nice back pedaling from your prior matter of fact arrogant statements, huh?


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you seriously comparing this to beating your wife?  WTF is WRONG with you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why not?  You've spent half the thread comparing PSI to weight.  So any batshit crazy thing is possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> WTF do you think pounds per square inch is?  That is a form of weighing the amount of air, dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No it isn't dumbass.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pressure and gross weight are two separate things.
Click to expand...


It's a way to measure the amount air, correct?  Yes, then STFU.


----------



## ChrisL

rightwinger said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> " Bill Belichick is either a fool or thinks he can play us for one.
> To recap Belichick: "I have no explanation," and "I've told you everything I know."
> 
> Now, if this were some other coach, maybe those lines would fly. This, however, is Belichick, the most secretive and controlling person in the NFL.
> 
> He repeatedly manipulates the injury report so no one, not even the players themselves, know who is really hurt or how badly. He has signed players before facing their former teams for the seemingly sole purpose of gathering intel. He has skirted the letter of the law with trick plays.
> 
> And, of course, he was the architect of Spygate."
> 
> Armour Control Freak Bill Belichick claims to be oblivious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
Click to expand...


The Giants suck.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The New England Patriots have won more games than any other franchise over the past fifteen years not because they "cheat"...they've won more games that anyone else because they have a better organization from top to bottom then anyone else.
> 
> You like the Giants?  If you're a New Yorker that means you're probably a Jets fan who jumps ship to the Giants whenever the Jets stink the joint out.  No wonder you're so whiny this year...both of your teams suck!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> NE are proven to be cheaters, period. This is just another episode in their cheating ways.
> 
> NYG sucked big deal. I am not whining.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, all you've done in this thread is whine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Didja know Beli-cheat threw Tommy under the bus? I ain't whining, I am watching the finger pointing and laughing my ass off.
Click to expand...


Yes you were whining throughout the thread about everything, just like a big fat crying baby.


----------



## rightwinger

Belichicks plan for the Superbowl is to fill the balls with helium

The Pats will be able to kick 90 yard Field Goals


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TrinityPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> And isn't interesting that the Patriots picked up Browner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well according to Belichick and Brady "if you aint cheating you aint trying"  Browner fits in perfectly
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Like Sherman and Irwin? Two of the seven in recent years found to have PED while playing for the Saintly Seahawks.
> 
> Remember Sherman's everybody does it statement.
> 
> Of course those cheaters along with Carroll are different than Belichick and those cheaters.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No I don't remember Sherman's everybody does it statement as he was cleared
Click to expand...

The most penalized team for PED use has been under Carroll in Seattle.

Sherman got,off on a technicality, which means he did it, but wasn't honest enough to admit it. A leaky cup doesn't change the contents of the sample. 

But as I keep saying and you keep proving, excusing one's own team or coach is pretty standard with NFL fans. Carroll's college team cheated, causing USC to forfeit wins and suffer other penalties. Carroll's Seattle team was also fined for contact in summer workouts. But that is all okay and justified and excused by you. 

Keep denying and keep proving my point.


----------



## Iceweasel

SwimExpert said:


> But at the end of the day it doesn't matter if the deflated footballs had any impact or not.  The fact is that they intentionally cheated.  The absence of integrity is the problem, especially with a team who has been caught cheating in the past.


A few times. Some others have probably done similar stuff, it doesn't make it right but it should be treated proportional to the crime. I listened to Joe Theisman this morning and he tested out footballs with the pressures mentioned and said it made no difference to his throwing. He could feel it a little but that was about it.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> It's a way to measure the amount air, correct?



No.  Now shut the fuck up.


----------



## ChrisL

rightwinger said:


> Belichicks plan for the Superbowl is to fill the balls with helium
> 
> The Pats will be able to kick 90 yard Field Goals



If they wanted to use something full of helium, they could just kick around Eli's air head.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's a way to measure the amount air, correct?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No.  Now shut the fuck up.
Click to expand...


You're stupid.  Yes it is.  Notice it says UNIT OF MEASURE.  Now you shut the fuck up.  

"In the USA the PSI pressure unit is the pimary unit of measure for pressure and almost all pressure instruments are specified and display in pounds per square inch."


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's a way to measure the amount air, correct?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No.  Now shut the fuck up.
Click to expand...


Maybe you should stick to swimming or something.


----------



## SwimExpert

Iceweasel said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> But at the end of the day it doesn't matter if the deflated footballs had any impact or not.  The fact is that they intentionally cheated.  The absence of integrity is the problem, especially with a team who has been caught cheating in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> A few times. Some others have probably done similar stuff, it doesn't make it right but it should be treated proportional to the crime. I listened to Joe Theisman this morning and he tested out footballs with the pressures mentioned and said it made no difference to his throwing. He could feel it a little but that was about it.
Click to expand...


I think that ultimately, the effect will be different for different people.  But by and large, there have been many professional football players in the media the past few days who have said that it would definitely be an advantage, particularly in the cold and rainy conditions where holding onto the ball would be naturally more difficult.  Tom Brady himself has said that he prefers deflated footballs.  There's a reason for that, and it's not because it deflated footballs make no difference to how he performs.

I do agree that punishment needs to fit the crime.  But I also believe that a singular incident does not have to be seen in a vacuum.  What we have here is a consistent pattern of breaking the rules.


----------



## Alex.

Valerie said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> Didja know Beli-cheat threw Tommy under the bus? I ain't whining, I am watching the finger pointing and laughing my ass off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> naah, he just answered a question...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Bill Belichick didn’t leave any room for misinterpretation: If you have any questions about the condition of game balls being used by the Patriots, go talk to Tom Brady.
> 
> *“Tom’s personal preferences ... on his footballs is something that he can talk about in much better detail and information than I could possibly provide,” *said Belichick at this morning’s packed Gillette Stadium press conference.
> 
> And guess what: *Brady plans to speak with the media this afternoon at 4.*
> 
> Which is fascinating, considering Brady wasn’t scheduled to meet with the media until tomorrow._
> 
> _Buckley Deflategate the sequel Go ask Brady Boston Herald_
Click to expand...


 As the head coach, he is responsible for what happens on the field.  Ignorance is not an excuse. Deflection and passing the buck are not answers


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> You're stupid.



  Says the dumb bitch who thinks that PSI measures weight.



> Notice it says UNIT OF MEASURE.



A light year is a unit of measure.  Are you going to tell us that light years are the same as weight?



> "In the USA the PSI pressure unit is the pimary unit of measure for pressure and almost all pressure instruments are specified and display in pounds per square inch."



Pressure.  Apparently you need to go back to middle school.  Pressure is not weight.  Good lord, you are a sad indictment on the American education system.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Let's cut to the chase here, Alex...you hate Belichick because he beats your team...so you come on here with this whine about under-deflated balls like THAT is what made the Patriots romp over the Colts!  My suggestion to you is for your team to hire someone EXACTLY like Bill Belichick so you can win games and stop being such a little girl!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the Giants I said that before in this thread, Mister Apologist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants own the Patriots
> 
> Belichick, Brady and the Pats would all be the greatest of all time if it weren't for Eli and the Giants
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> With all due respect, Winger...the Giants hardly own ANYONE at the moment.  That one play in the Super Bowl...which was amazing...did indeed keep the Patriots from a perfect season...saying that the Giants "own" them because of it is a bit of a stretch.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Giants 2   Patriots 0
> 
> Yes the Giants own them. If not for the Giants, Patriots under Belichick and Brady would be 5-0 in the Superbowl and would be without question the greatest team, coach and QB of all time. They would also have had a 19-0 record
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with this year's superbowl?  The Giants are not in the superbowl, so they are irrelevant.
Click to expand...



Your fanboy brought up the issue


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're stupid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Says the dumb bitch who thinks that PSI measures weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Notice it says UNIT OF MEASURE.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A light year is a unit of measure.  Are you going to tell us that light years are the same as weight?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "In the USA the PSI pressure unit is the pimary unit of measure for pressure and almost all pressure instruments are specified and display in pounds per square inch."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pressure.  Apparently you need to go back to middle school.  Pressure is not weight.  Good lord, you are a sad indictment on the American education system.
Click to expand...


No, I was right.  Is it a way to measure how much air.


----------



## ChrisL

Deflating footballs may not be as easy as it sounds

If the New England Patriots intentionally deflated footballs used in Sunday's AFC championship win over the Indianapolis Colts, it wouldn't have been as easy to pull off as it might seem.

NFL rules require each team to provide 12 primary balls to the referee for testing 2 hours, 15 minutes before kickoff to ensure they fall between the proper inflation limits of 12½ to 13½ pounds per square inch. The home team also must provide 12 backup balls, and the visiting team has the option to provide 12 more for outdoor games such as Sunday's at Gillette Stadium.

The referee "shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications" and the balls "remain under the supervision of the Referee until they are delivered to the ball attendant just prior to the start of the game," according to Rule 2, Section 1.

A person with intimate knowledge of the process told USA TODAY Sports the ball attendant is a uniformed official – generally the same person each week at a given stadium – who comes to the locker room to pick up the balls and takes them to the officials' locker room for testing.




USA TODAY

Bell: Bill Belichick has some serious explaining to do about Deflategate


The ball attendant delivers the balls to the ball boys – usually four provided by the home team and two traveling with the visiting team – who make sure their quarterback's preferred balls get into the game, said the person, who spoke on condition of anonymity because they weren't authorized to speak publicly.

At halftime, the balls return to the officials' locker room, the person said. So, if proper protocol is followed, the only opportunity to manipulate the balls is minutes before kickoff or during the game on the sideline, where there's a risk of anyone in the stadium and dozens of TV cameras seeing it.


----------



## SwimExpert

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're stupid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Says the dumb bitch who thinks that PSI measures weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Notice it says UNIT OF MEASURE.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A light year is a unit of measure.  Are you going to tell us that light years are the same as weight?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "In the USA the PSI pressure unit is the pimary unit of measure for pressure and almost all pressure instruments are specified and display in pounds per square inch."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pressure.  Apparently you need to go back to middle school.  Pressure is not weight.  Good lord, you are a sad indictment on the American education system.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I was right.  Is it a way to measure how much air.
Click to expand...


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
Click to expand...



You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow


----------



## ChrisL

I also found this which was quite interesting.   

Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl

Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:


Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.


The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.


The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.

*Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.


For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're stupid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Says the dumb bitch who thinks that PSI measures weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Notice it says UNIT OF MEASURE.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A light year is a unit of measure.  Are you going to tell us that light years are the same as weight?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "In the USA the PSI pressure unit is the pimary unit of measure for pressure and almost all pressure instruments are specified and display in pounds per square inch."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Pressure.  Apparently you need to go back to middle school.  Pressure is not weight.  Good lord, you are a sad indictment on the American education system.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, I was right.  Is it a way to measure how much air.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


Yup, you're a dummy.    See my last post.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
Click to expand...


Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
Click to expand...



Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all
Click to expand...


Stop being such a fag.  That is all.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all
Click to expand...


Even if they were cheaters, they would still be better men than you.


----------



## ChrisL

ChrisL said:


> I also found this which was quite interesting.
> 
> Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl
> 
> Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:
> 
> 
> Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.
> 
> 
> The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.
> 
> 
> The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.
> *Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.
> 
> 
> For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
> edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.



What?  No comments on this science teacher's analysis?  


So . . .  It IS entirely possible that the balls just deflated due to weather conditions and other external factors, like being played with.  Suck on that, haters.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Even if they were cheaters, they would still be better men than you.
Click to expand...


Inane statement


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Even if they were cheaters, they would still be better men than you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Inane statement
Click to expand...


You're inane.


----------



## ChrisL

Oh, deflated balls and the Patriots, MUST be cheating!  Couldn't possibly be anything else, even though you jerks have no evidence at all.  Jerks.


----------



## Jroc

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> Except that the whole thing was begun in the first half of the game, not after it was over.  There was even one point where an official removed a ball from play because he suspected it was not inflated sufficiently.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I wasn't impressed with Seattle either.  They really didn't look that good out on the field, not like the Patriots anyway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seattle played against a much better defense then did the Pats.  It was obvious throughout the game that the Colt's defense was not on the same page.  I don't think this will *happen in Seattle. * Unless Sherman doesn't play.
Click to expand...


Umm.....the Superbowl is in Arizona not Seattle


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Giants weren't such an awful team, Alex wouldn't be spending all of his time here whining about the team that they supposedly "own".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all
Click to expand...

And so are the Seahawks, not sure what your,point is.


----------



## Jroc

SwimExpert said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Point being, the difference is negligible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because the difference in weight is negligible does not mean that the difference in the overall effect is negligible.  Of course, you damn well know that your logic is bullshit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is not why the Pats win games.  Perhaps this is some preference of Tom Brady's, but obviously it doesn't REALLY make a difference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If it makes no difference, then why do it?  The fact that it was done is itself evidence of the fact that it can effect the results.
> 
> The fact that it is a preference of Brady's is, in and of itself, a change that creates an advantage.  Why not just use a smaller ball?  Why not use larger footballs for teams that want to?  Why not make the field 100 meters?  This is a game that will award or rescind touchdowns and first downs based on half an inch.  The league regulates footballs, and the Patriots willfully violated those rules with the intent of gaining an advantage.
> 
> Your entire position on this seems to be based on the batshit stupid idea that cheating doesn't matter if you win in the end.  You're pathetic.
Click to expand...


they don't necessarily regulate footballs from what i hear most quarterbacks slightly modify footballs to their liking. Scuff them up, Eli manning soaks his in water ect... It's only the haters who hate Brady and New England because  they've been on top for so long. What's it like to be a hater?


----------



## SwimExpert

Jroc said:


> they don't necessarily regulate footballs from what i hear most quarterbacks slightly modify footballs to their liking. Scuff them up, Eli manning soaks his in water ect... It's only the haters who hate Brady and New England because  they've been on top for so long. What's it like to be a hater?



There are no rules against soaking in water.  No rules against scuffing.  There _are_ rules about the size and inflation.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look at him, what a fag.    Just like Alex.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are having a meltdown just like that special fellow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why?  Because I think you're a fag?  I don't think so, buddy.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Go have another drink, it may help you to calm down.  The Patriots are cheaters that is all
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And so are the Seahawks, not sure what your,point is.
Click to expand...



I am talking about the Patriots and their deflated balls.  Both Beli-cheat and Brady had problems today.


----------



## Alex.




----------



## BluePhantom

Alex. said:


>



All three of the former NFL players on that panel looked like someone just shot their dog.  They were so disappointed and angry with Brady and you could see it in their eyes and hear it in their voices.  You could tell each of them wanted to say "what a total bunch of bullshit" but had to be more political with their responses.  Dawkins explained how the equipment manager made sure details like the tape on his shoulder pads had to be an exact certain way and his cleats broken in and stretched in a precise way and it was always done to the exact specifications.   Brady trying to suggest that those footballs were not precisely how he asked for them is so incredible only a Patriots fan would believe it


----------



## SwimExpert




----------



## Alex.

*Troy Aikman: Patriots punishment should exceed Saints bounty punishment*


"Aikman made an appearance on Sportsradio 1310 The Ticket on Thursday and said he believed that it is “obvious” quarterback Tom Brady was involved in deflating the footballs. He also referenced Commissioner Roger Goodell’s punishment of the Saints for running a bounty program that rewarded players for hurting opponents when explaining why he believed the Patriots needed more than the “slap on the wrist” Aikman feels they got for videotaping their opponents’ sideline in 2007."

Troy Aikman Patriots punishment should exceed Saints bounty punishment ProFootballTalk


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> *Troy Aikman: Patriots punishment should exceed Saints bounty punishment*
> 
> 
> "Aikman made an appearance on Sportsradio 1310 The Ticket on Thursday and said he believed that it is “obvious” quarterback Tom Brady was involved in deflating the footballs. He also referenced Commissioner Roger Goodell’s punishment of the Saints for running a bounty program that rewarded players for hurting opponents when explaining why he believed the Patriots needed more than the “slap on the wrist” Aikman feels they got for videotaping their opponents’ sideline in 2007."
> 
> Troy Aikman Patriots punishment should exceed Saints bounty punishment ProFootballTalk



I'm not sure what the punishment should be, but with BountyGate the only team punished was the team that got caught and most pros would tell you it went on, on a number of teams and I would be willing to bet it still does. 

The PSI is regulated and should be, how much that helped or hurt any team seems to be more than verified by other QBs that retired. 

The issue I have with Belichick's denial is the same one I have with Carroll's denials at USC and the Seahawks and PEDs. Those are their teams they damn well better know what is going on with their teams.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> Oh, deflated balls and the Patriots, MUST be cheating!  Couldn't possibly be anything else, even though you jerks have no evidence at all.  Jerks.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, deflated balls and the Patriots, MUST be cheating!  Couldn't possibly be anything else, even though you jerks have no evidence at all.  Jerks.
Click to expand...


Did you watch the whole video?  At the 45 second, a man says he doubts the Pats will have to give up a draft pick nor will it be anything like spygate.  

I really only think the haters are caring SO much about this.  I also heard on my local news that they were on the low end PSI to begin with and that it might be totally normal for the balls to have deflated by the time half time rolled around.   

But, all you all can do is post pictures and videos and cry "cheaters!" with absolutely NO validity.  THAT is what makes you dumb.  I don't think the NFL is going to do too much with this.  It really isn't that big a deal, regardless of how much you fairies whine.


----------



## Freewill

Jroc said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Please, I watched the game from beginning to end.  The Pats played a better game and won.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I watched the game too.  Luck is a more accurate passer than Brady.  He throws a much harder pass.
> 
> Look at it from what happened in the Seahawk game.  Wilson's passes kept skipping off of the hands of our receivers because the properly inflated balls were much harder to catch than the balls Brady was throwing also in rainy conditions.  The balls that skipped out of our receivers hands landed into the hands of Green Bay players.  The field position and change of possession cost Seattle the opportunity to sustain drives and immediately gave GB at the very least Field goals because they were already close enough when the interceptions occurred.
> 
> In the Seattle game the Hawks threw 4 ints.  That's 4 lost opportunities to score and 4 gifts to GB to get points already close to the Seahawk goal line.
> 
> When it stopped raining at the end of the game in Seattle the Seahawks scored 3 TDs in around three minutes.
> 
> Oh God..nevermind.  You probably have never caught a hard thrown football in the rain.  You will never get it because you don't understand what I am saying and never will.
> 
> Have a nice day cupcake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seattle played like shit. They should have never won that game GB played not to loose at the end of the game. they thoroughly out played settled who will loose in the Superbowl
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I wasn't impressed with Seattle either.  They really didn't look that good out on the field, not like the Patriots anyway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seattle played against a much better defense then did the Pats.  It was obvious throughout the game that the Colt's defense was not on the same page.  I don't think this will *happen in Seattle. * Unless Sherman doesn't play.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Umm.....the Superbowl is in Arizona not Seattle
Click to expand...


Please accept my fullest apologies and insert IN THE GAME WITH SEATTLE in place of in, thanks.


----------



## Freewill

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, deflated balls and the Patriots, MUST be cheating!  Couldn't possibly be anything else, even though you jerks have no evidence at all.  Jerks.
Click to expand...


LOL


----------



## ChrisL

Seahawks Richard Sherman Nothing s going to happen after Deflategate


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Oh, deflated balls and the Patriots, MUST be cheating!  Couldn't possibly be anything else, even though you jerks have no evidence at all.  Jerks.



Hmmnm, reported 11 out of 12 balls were deflated after the refs checked them, yeah no evidence at all.


----------



## HenryBHough

Terrible example - CHEATING - for impressionable children (defined by law as those up to age 26)!  This demands a special prosecutor with an eye toward outlawing football entirely.  

There, I've played liberal activist enough for one afternoon......


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> I also found this which was quite interesting.
> 
> Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl
> 
> Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:
> 
> 
> Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.
> 
> 
> The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.
> 
> 
> The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.
> *Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.
> 
> 
> For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
> edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.



Did the Colts' balls lose that much pressure, and it was 51 as I remember.


----------



## ChrisL

The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.  

31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com

A couple of excerpts:  

*1. Buffalo Bills*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*2. Miami Dolphins*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*3. New York Jets*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*4. Baltimore Ravens*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*5. Cincinnati Bengals*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*6. Cleveland Browns*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*7. Pittsburgh Steelers*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*8. Houston Texans*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*9. Indianapolis Colts*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

*10. Jacksonville Jaguars*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I also found this which was quite interesting.
> 
> Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl
> 
> Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:
> 
> 
> Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.
> 
> 
> The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.
> 
> 
> The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.
> *Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.
> 
> 
> For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
> edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the Colts' balls lose that much pressure, and it was 51 as I remember.
Click to expand...


As far as I'm aware, they did not and have no plans to check the Colts' balls.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I also found this which was quite interesting.
> 
> Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl
> 
> Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:
> 
> 
> Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.
> 
> 
> The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.
> 
> 
> The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.
> *Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.
> 
> 
> For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
> edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the Colts' balls lose that much pressure, and it was 51 as I remember.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> As far as I'm aware, they did not and have no plans to check the Colts' balls.
Click to expand...


they have to, that would prove or disprove your whole post.  They can not come to a conclusion without testing the Colts' footballs, but it might be too late now.  I have been reading and it wasn't just that a defender gave the ball to the equipment manager the NFL was going to investigate anyway, the Ravens ratted out the Pats.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I also found this which was quite interesting.
> 
> Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl
> 
> Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:
> 
> 
> Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.
> 
> 
> The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.
> 
> 
> The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.
> *Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.
> 
> 
> For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
> edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the Colts' balls lose that much pressure, and it was 51 as I remember.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> As far as I'm aware, they did not and have no plans to check the Colts' balls.
Click to expand...


*"All of the balls the Colts used met standards, according to the report."*

NFL says New England Patriots had under-inflated footballs in AFC championship Game - ESPN Boston


----------



## SwimExpert

Freewill said:


> the Ravens ratted out the Pats.



Apparently, it wasn't just that.  Seems the Colts already had suspicions from their game back in November, which they had already communicated to the league.


----------



## Freewill

SwimExpert said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the Ravens ratted out the Pats.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently, it wasn't just that.  Seems the Colts already had suspicions from their game back in November, which they had already communicated to the league.
Click to expand...


So the NFL is onto the Pats so they check the balls 2 hours before the game and they are all OK.  Then at half time they check again and only the Pats balls are low in pressure?  If so then they really need to be penalized.


----------



## Oldstyle

Since every quarterback in the league appears to have a preference over the ball that "they" play with...my question to those of you that maintain that because the Colt's balls were legal when checked...that somehow proves that the Patriot's balls were purposely deflated below league standards...is how do you know what Andrew Luck's preference is for pressure?  Is he like Aaron Rogers who likes his footballs over-inflated because he has big hands?  Correct me if I'm wrong here but isn't Andrew Luck a rather LARGE individual?  So if the balls that he sent to the officials to be inspected were in the top end of the pressure scale and subsequently lost pressure wouldn't they still be in the margin of legality?  If the balls that the Patriots sent to be inspected were as under-inflated as they thought they could get away with (as is Tom Brady's preference) and then those balls lost pressure then it would stand to reason that they would no longer be in the allowable margin.

This is all taking for granted that the referee did his job correctly when he examined the 36 footballs that could be used in the game.  Gee, if he didn't...is he going to admit that he kind of gave them a quick once over and thought they were fine?  Is he going to do that knowing that admitting that was the case will most likely mean he never referees another big game in the NFL?


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the Ravens ratted out the Pats.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently, it wasn't just that.  Seems the Colts already had suspicions from their game back in November, which they had already communicated to the league.
Click to expand...


So let me see if I understand how this plays out...you maintain that the Colts are suspicious of the Patriots using illegal balls from way back in November...*BUT DURING THE MOST IMPORTANT GAME OF THEIR SEASON...THE GAME THAT WILL DECIDE IF THEY GO TO THE SUPER BOWL...THEY DON'T RAISE THE ISSUE WITH THE OFFICIALS UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE HALFTIME?*


----------



## Oldstyle

If that WERE the case...then the entire coaching staff of the Colts should be sent packing because they are a bunch of incompetent idiots.  I don't buy that story for a second however...it's so unbelievable that only the truly naive would buy into it!


----------



## Oldstyle

Which brings us back to a game where you have officials handling balls on virtually every single play of the game and none of THEM senses anything wrong with the Patriot's footballs!  How is that possible?  Is the officiating crew secretly all New England fans who were on the take?


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I also found this which was quite interesting.
> 
> Deflate-gate Could the weather have an effect on ball pressure nfl
> 
> Science teacher here. Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:
> 
> 
> Guy-Lussac's Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.
> 
> 
> The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Farenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a gauge pressure of 13 psi. This makes the absolute pressure of the ball 27.7 psi (gauge + atmosphere). Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.
> 
> 
> The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (27.7/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have an absolute pressure of 26.2 psi and a gauge pressure of *11.5*, below league specifications.
> *Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.
> 
> 
> For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi gauge), it's pressure would drop to *11.1 psi* during the game... enough to be considered massively underinflated.
> edit: As the poster noted below, forgot to account for the difference between gauge and absolute pressure. Calculations have been updated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the Colts' balls lose that much pressure, and it was 51 as I remember.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> As far as I'm aware, they did not and have no plans to check the Colts' balls.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> they have to, that would prove or disprove your whole post.  They can not come to a conclusion without testing the Colts' footballs, but it might be too late now.  I have been reading and it wasn't just that a defender gave the ball to the equipment manager the NFL was going to investigate anyway, the Ravens ratted out the Pats.
Click to expand...


Well, how much time will have passed?  How can that possibly give an accurate idea of anything at all?  The bottom line is, this is going to be a very difficult allegation to prove!


----------



## Oldstyle

The truth of the matter is that just about every quarterback plays with the balls to get them to his liking.  “Every team tampers with the footballs,” Matt Leinart said on Twitter.  “Ask any Qb In the league, this is ridiculous!!”
But it's the Patriots...so people like Alex have their panties in a bunch!


----------



## ChrisL

Oldstyle said:


> Which brings us back to a game where you have officials handling balls on virtually every single play of the game and none of THEM senses anything wrong with the Patriot's footballs!  How is that possible?  Is the officiating crew secretly all New England fans who were on the take?



That's what some people think.  They think the entire Patriots organization is involved.  I wonder if they realize just how many people are on the sidelines during a game and how difficult it would be to pull this off, regardless of what they claim.  We certainly know that Bill or Tom Brady are NOT on the sidelines deflating balls during games!  That is retarded as all hell!


----------



## Oldstyle

The Patriots coaching staff throws the Ravens a curve ball with a "tackle eligible" formation that Harbaugh doesn't know how to counteract...and suddenly the Patriots are "cheaters"?  Hey, it's the Patriots...people like Alex don't need anything else.  Bill Belichick is Darth Vader in a hoodie and Foxboro Stadium is the Death Star.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the Ravens ratted out the Pats.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently, it wasn't just that.  Seems the Colts already had suspicions from their game back in November, which they had already communicated to the league.
Click to expand...


Well, that's an interesting comment, considering that the Colts coach said he didn't notice an issue with the balls, according to the link Alex posted.  Why would he say that?  

"Colts coach Chuck Pagano said he did not notice issues with the footballs and didn't specify when asked whether the Colts had reported the issue to officials."


----------



## Oldstyle

And what makes this ABSOLUTELY ridiculous is that after the under-inflated balls were made to conform during halftime...the Patriots go on to outscore the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So the big advantage...the big "cheat" that the Patriots were supposedly pulling off seemingly did NOTHING to help them in the first half but when they didn't have the softer balls in the second half THEY KICKED THE EVER LOVING TAR OUT OF THE COLTS!

And that makes sense to you Patriots haters?  Really?


----------



## Oldstyle

Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.

Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.



What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?

Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?  

Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.

Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
Click to expand...

Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game


----------



## ChrisL

Don't both teams play with all the balls anyways?  When the other team takes the


Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
Click to expand...


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> *Don't both teams play with all the balls anyways*?  When the other team takes the
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


*No.

The offense uses their own balls.*


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
Click to expand...


What Tom Brady "claims" is that he tells the equipment people what he's looking for with his game balls.  Brady likes his footballs to be as soft as allowable.  Aaron Rogers on the other hand likes his footballs to be as hard as allowable.  So is Aaron Rogers "obviously" breaking the rules when he instructs his equipment manager to prep his footballs that way?  Or is it only Tom Brady who's guilty of this *HEINOUS* crime?

As for Sean Payton's suspension?  In my humble opinion that was one of the stupidest things I've EVER seen the NFL do!  To claim that the New Orleans Saints were doing something that other teams haven't done for decades...reward players for hard hits on opponents...is laughable.  Payton got screwed.  The whole thing was farce of the first order.


----------



## mack20

Here's what we all know for sure about this supposed scandal: ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOTHING.  The NFL hasn't made any official statements and multiple things have been contradicted.  For example, they've been reporting for days that D'Qwell Jackson brought the football to the Colts coaching staff because he thought it felt suspicious, and today Jackson said he didn't notice any issues with the ball and that he was bummed he wasn't able to keep it. 

There has been zero proof that the Patriots deliberately tampered with the footballs.  We've heard jack shit from the NFL about what they suspect the Pats did or why or how. So, and I know this might sound crazy to the drama and scandal obsessed whine-bags, but how about we wait for a fucking confirmed fact or two before we proceed on this witch hunt.  

I'm not even going to get into how fucking dumb I think this "scandal" is in the first place.


----------



## percysunshine

.

*PV=nRT
*
A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..

It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.

.


----------



## Oldstyle

percysunshine said:


> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .



To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
Click to expand...


Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.

I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.

As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> So let me see if I understand how this plays out...you maintain that the Colts are suspicious of the Patriots using illegal balls from way back in November.



_During that Nov. 16 game, Colts safety Mike Adams twice intercepted quarterback Tom Brady and gave the balls to the Colts' equipment manager to save. Both times there were concerns about the balls feeling under-inflated, sources earlier this season had told ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter. _

_ Those sources also said that the Colts raised concerns to the league, which was aware of the issue going into this Sunday's AFC Championship game._

Deflate-gate Indianapolis Colts Raised Concerns in November About Under-Inflated New England Patriots Balls - ABC News



> *BUT DURING THE MOST IMPORTANT GAME OF THEIR SEASON...THE GAME THAT WILL DECIDE IF THEY GO TO THE SUPER BOWL...THEY DON'T RAISE THE ISSUE WITH THE OFFICIALS UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE HALFTIME?*



Actually, they raised the issue with the league, not the on-the-field officials.  And you have no idea whether the Colts mentioned anything to the officials before the game.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> If that WERE the case...then the entire coaching staff of the Colts should be sent packing because they are a bunch of incompetent idiots.  I don't buy that story for a second however...it's so unbelievable that only the truly naive would buy into it!



How do you know what further discussions took place?  Suspicion and evidence are two different things.  For all you know, the league had already told the Colts that nothing could be done without evidence, and told them that if they could produce actual evidence they should call 555-555-5555 immediately.

It's funny, your reaction is that the Colts staff should be fired because they didn't raise enough alarms.  Yet you give the Patriots staff a pass for *doing the actual cheating in the first place!*  It really shows how entirely deluded you are in all of this.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> Which brings us back to a game where you have officials handling balls on virtually every single play of the game and none of THEM senses anything wrong with the Patriot's footballs!  How is that possible?  Is the officiating crew secretly all New England fans who were on the take?



Listen, this is not speculation or accusation.  *The NFL has confirmed that the Patriots were using deflated footballs.  It is fact.*  That you are trying to argue that it might not be true is further evidence of your entirely delusional perspective on this subject.


----------



## Papageorgio

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Which brings us back to a game where you have officials handling balls on virtually every single play of the game and none of THEM senses anything wrong with the Patriot's footballs!  How is that possible?  Is the officiating crew secretly all New England fans who were on the take?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Listen, this is not speculation or accusation.  *The NFL has confirmed that the Patriots were using deflated footballs.  It is fact.*  That you are trying to argue that it might not be true is further evidence of your entirely delusional perspective on this subject.
Click to expand...


I'm not saying cheating wasn't involved, however, wouldn't an NFL official notice something like an under inflated ball? They handle them more than any other person during a game. I have seen the, squeeze the before setting them down. I do think the balls were deflated but I'm wondering if refs were just letting it go. Now, if they let it go here, where else did they let it go?


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> Since every quarterback in the league appears to have a preference over the ball that "they" play with...my question to those of you that maintain that because the Colt's balls were legal when checked...that somehow proves that the Patriot's balls were purposely deflated below league standards...is how do you know what Andrew Luck's preference is for pressure?





You really are desperately stretching.  It doesn't matter what Luck's preference is.  The fact of the matter is that the Patriots were using deflated footballs.  At best.....and in and of itself this is truly a ridiculous stretch....but _at the very, very, very, best_ your hypothesis implies gross incompetence by the Patriots' equipment personnel for failing to maintain the correct pressure.  But anyone with a halfway functioning brain can put two-and-two together.  *There is now an established pattern of behavior of the Patriots using deflated footballs.*  Not only that, but _*your hypothesis that Tom Brady has been repeatedly using footballs that have been anything other than exactly the way he wanted them is more fantastic than a hobbit story.*_


----------



## SwimExpert

Papageorgio said:


> I'm not saying cheating wasn't involved, however, wouldn't an NFL official notice something like an under inflated ball? They handle them more than any other person during a game. I have seen the, squeeze the before setting them down. I do think the balls were deflated but I'm wondering if refs were just letting it go. Now, if they let it go here, where else did they let it go?



I'm not sure how much officials would notice, generally speaking.  I think there's a difference between simply handling and spotting the football, and handling it in the scope of game play.  I suspect they'll be more focused on simply trying to distinguish between game balls and the kicking balls, as was Qadry Ismail's suggestion during the third quarter delay where the ball was changed out.  Those guys always seem to be running so fast and in such a rush just trying to keep the game pace up, I imagine it's the kind of thing that doesn't really register with them so much.  Of course, I suspect that's going to change from now on.


----------



## Papageorgio

I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.


----------



## rightwinger

ChrisL said:


> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.


 
Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?


----------



## Alex.

Oldstyle said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
Click to expand...



I never said it was a conspiracy I said  they are cheaters.   Cheating starts at an early age.  Beli-cheat got his nickname early on.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.


IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.


----------



## ChrisL

rightwinger said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
Click to expand...


Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.   


*17. New York Giants*

*————————————————————————————————————————————–*

The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I never said it was a conspiracy I said  they are cheaters.   Cheating starts at an early age.  Beli-cheat got his nickname early on.
Click to expand...


Not too bright, are you?


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
Click to expand...



Would have been 2 more rings simple math explodes your theory


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Don't both teams play with all the balls anyways*?  When the other team takes the
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *No.
> 
> The offense uses their own balls.*
Click to expand...


I don't believe that.  I'm quite sure that both teams play with each others' balls.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I never said it was a conspiracy I said  they are cheaters.   Cheating starts at an early age.  Beli-cheat got his nickname early on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not too bright, are you?
Click to expand...



Hungover much?


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Don't both teams play with all the balls anyways*?  When the other team takes the
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *No.
> 
> The offense uses their own balls.*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't believe that.  I'm quite sure that both teams play with each others' balls.
Click to expand...

Only when Brady threw the fateful interception.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Would have been 2 more rings simple math explodes your theory
Click to expand...


You are an idiot.  This isn't my theory, you moron.


----------



## ChrisL




----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Would have been 2 more rings simple math explodes your theory
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are an idiot.  This isn't my theory, you moron.
Click to expand...


You post it, you own it. Now go have a hair of that dog that bit you last night you will feel better and not be so nasty.


----------



## ChrisL




----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


>




Except in the SB when they beat NE ass TWICE...............


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Would have been 2 more rings simple math explodes your theory
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are an idiot.  This isn't my theory, you moron.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You post it, you own it. Now go have a hair of that dog that bite you last night you will feel better and not be so nasty.
Click to expand...


You are obviously an uneducated doofus.    Probably ugly too.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


>




They were not in contention to begin with...sober up before posting and get your facts straight


----------



## ChrisL




----------



## ChrisL




----------



## ChrisL




----------



## ChrisL




----------



## rightwinger

ChrisL said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
Click to expand...

 
Where would the Giants be without the Patriots folding in two Superbowls?

18-0 Patriots walk in as 13 point favorites over the lowly Giants. They had already printed those undefeated t shirts. They left Phoenix with their tail between their legs

Where is this years Superbowl?


----------



## ChrisL

rightwinger said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where would the Giants be without the Patriots folding in two Superbowls?
> 
> 18-0 Patriots walk in as 13 point favorites over the lowly Giants. They had already printed those undefeated t shirts. They left Phoenix with their tail between their legs
> 
> Where is this years Superbowl?
Click to expand...


Yup, wallow in your HISTORY.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


>


----------



## rightwinger

ChrisL said:


>


 

I guess Eli did eliminate the Patriots.....TWICE

The Patriots have put Eli into the Hall of Fame

I'm sure he appreciates it


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where would the Giants be without the Patriots folding in two Superbowls?
> 
> 18-0 Patriots walk in as 13 point favorites over the lowly Giants. They had already printed those undefeated t shirts. They left Phoenix with their tail between their legs
> 
> Where is this years Superbowl?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup, wallow in your HISTORY.
Click to expand...



Speaking of history..
“I think that Belichick will be remembered as one of the best coaches ever in the NFL -- but perhaps with an asterisk,” Corinne Farneti, an assistant professor of sport management at Maryland’s Mount St. Mary’s University, said in an e-mail to Sports Line.


“It’s his arrogance that he can knowingly, and repeatedly , break NFL rules -- combined with his less-than-gregarious public persona -- that will lead to that asterisk,” Farneti said."

 Beli-Cheat Legacy Earns an Asterisk With Deflategate - Businessweek



Beli-cheat did it to himself.


----------



## ChrisL

rightwinger said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess Eli did eliminate the Patriots.....TWICE
> 
> The Patriots have put Eli into the Hall of Fame
> 
> I'm sure he appreciates it
Click to expand...


Ancient history.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> The REAL reason why people hate the Patriots.    So true, so true.
> 
> 31 Reasons why NFL teams hate the Patriots - NFL.com
> 
> A couple of excerpts:
> 
> *1. Buffalo Bills*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots had a surplus of quarterbacks after the 2001 season, so, of course, the Bills ended up with Drew Bledsoe and not Tom Brady.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *2. Miami Dolphins*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The obvious rivalry aside, to find the true root of the Dolphins’ fans hatred, you have to go back to the 1985 AFC Championship Game. The Patriots took apart the Dolphins in Miami, 31-14. The Patriots would go on to lose in Super Bowl XX to the Chicago Bears. You know, the team the Dolphins beat in the regular season and would have had a good chance of beating again in the rematch.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *3. New York Jets*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Outside of the recent beatings, Bill Belichick was the coach of the Jets, for like a day. And then he ended up with the New England Patriots. I’m not saying the Jets would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowls but, oh wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *4. Baltimore Ravens*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> You know, for a team that just won the Super Bowl, guys like Terrell Suggs sure are talking a lot about a team they beat in the playoffs. Apparently Brady and Co. still has space rented out between Suggs’ ears.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *5. Cincinnati Bengals*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Bengals have no real reason to hate the Patriots, but much like how your younger siblings like the things you like and hate the things you hate, the Bengals likely hate the Patriots because the big brothers of the AFC North do. If anything, the Bengals might actually like the Patriots. If not for the Patriots, the Bengals would have the universally recognized worst uniform in the NFL. So they have that going for them.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *6. Cleveland Browns*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Belichick coached the Browns and was poised for a big 1995 season (the team started 3-1) until rumors of an impending move surfaced to ruin the team. Now, I’m not trying to say the Browns would have ended up with Tom Brady and three Super Bowl titles, but wait, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *7. Pittsburgh Steelers*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Patriots won two AFC Championship Games in Pittsburgh during the Brady-Belichick era. Bledsoe came off the bench to lead the Patriots over the Steelers in the 2001 AFC Championship Game (please don’t bring up the spot, Steelers fan). Brady engineered a blowout in the 2004 AFC Championship Game, with a 41-27 romp at Heinz Field.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *8. Houston Texans*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Somebody convinced the Texans it would be a cool idea to wear letterman’s jackets for a huge showdown in New England on Monday night football in Week 14. And then the Patriots made them look like a freshman squad in a 42-14 beat down. Now those jackets live in infamy in the dark closets of those Texans players or on the shelves of the Sugar Land, Texas Goodwill center.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *9. Indianapolis Colts*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> Whenever the debate for best quarterback of the era heats up, Patriots fans will point out Brady has three rings to Manning’s single Super Bowl win. The Colts did exercise a matter of revenge in the 2006 AFC Championship Game, but you still get the sense Indy fans are still smarting from the dismissiveness of the Patriots fans. And judging by the number of Manning jerseys still in Indianapolis, this one isn’t going away any time soon.
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> *10. Jacksonville Jaguars*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Jaguars have made the playoffs just twice since the year 2000, and both times they were eliminated by the Patriots. New England got Jacksonville, 28-3, in the 2005 wild card playoffs. The Jags were a little more competitive in the 2007 divisional round, but still lost, 31-20.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Want to know why the NY Football Giants LOVE the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well actually, the Giants are irrelevant.  Did they even make the playoffs this year?  Oh, and Eli Manning.  Lol.
> 
> 
> *17. New York Giants*
> 
> *————————————————————————————————————————————–*
> 
> The Giants really have no reason to hate Tom Brady’s Patriots since they have the distinction of being the only team to beat him in the Super Bowl. And they did it twice. However, legendary Giants head coach Bill Parcells retired from coaching after winning his second Super Bowl with the Giants in 1991. His retirement was short, however, as just two years later he returned to coach the New England Patriots, leading them to a Super Bowl in just three years, while the Giants stumbled through the 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where would the Giants be without the Patriots folding in two Superbowls?
> 
> 18-0 Patriots walk in as 13 point favorites over the lowly Giants. They had already printed those undefeated t shirts. They left Phoenix with their tail between their legs
> 
> Where is this years Superbowl?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yup, wallow in your HISTORY.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of history..
> “I think that Belichick will be remembered as one of the best coaches ever in the NFL -- but perhaps with an asterisk,” Corinne Farneti, an assistant professor of sport management at Maryland’s Mount St. Mary’s University, said in an e-mail to Sports Line.
> 
> 
> “It’s his arrogance that he can knowingly, and repeatedly , break NFL rules -- combined with his less-than-gregarious public persona -- that will lead to that asterisk,” Farneti said."
> 
> Beli-Cheat Legacy Earns an Asterisk With Deflategate - Businessweek
> 
> 
> 
> Beli-cheat did it to himself.
Click to expand...


Lol.  Do you think I care about Bill's legacy?  I don't.  I like to watch the Patriots win games.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.



That's because it probably was not noticeable.  The whole thing is retarded and is being blown out of proportion by the haters, as per usual.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
Click to expand...


The temperature had rapidly dropped into the low 40s.  That is how NE weather is.  It can go from 60 to 30 in just a few hours.


----------



## ChrisL

So . . .  show of hands, who thinks that Brady or Belichick are on the sidelines deflating balls?  Or maybe it was the ball boy, hmmm.  He must be the devil.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the Ravens ratted out the Pats.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently, it wasn't just that.  Seems the Colts already had suspicions from their game back in November, which they had already communicated to the league.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, that's an interesting comment, considering that the Colts coach said he didn't notice an issue with the balls, according to the link Alex posted.  Why would he say that?
> 
> "Colts coach Chuck Pagano said he did not notice issues with the footballs and didn't specify when asked whether the Colts had reported the issue to officials."
Click to expand...


Sounds like the cover 2 defense to me.


----------



## Freewill

And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the Ravens ratted out the Pats.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently, it wasn't just that.  Seems the Colts already had suspicions from their game back in November, which they had already communicated to the league.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, that's an interesting comment, considering that the Colts coach said he didn't notice an issue with the balls, according to the link Alex posted.  Why would he say that?
> 
> "Colts coach Chuck Pagano said he did not notice issues with the footballs and didn't specify when asked whether the Colts had reported the issue to officials."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sounds like the cover 2 defense to me.
Click to expand...


Whatever it "sounds like," the Colts coach says he knows nothing about deflated balls.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.



Nope, they won fair and square.  Even Brady scored a touch down on them.  Lol.    That guy can't run worth anything, and he was able to score a TD.


----------



## Freewill

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
Click to expand...




Oldstyle said:


> The Patriots coaching staff throws the Ravens a curve ball with a "tackle eligible" formation that Harbaugh doesn't know how to counteract...and suddenly the Patriots are "cheaters"?  Hey, it's the Patriots...people like Alex don't need anything else.  Bill Belichick is Darth Vader in a hoodie and Foxboro Stadium is the Death Star.



The Pats used a trick pure and simple.  There is a convention to how games are run.  Other then special teams players have no reason to report ineligible.  So yeah it was within the rules but there is a reason that people wear the numbers they do.

Come on, wearing a receiver number and lining up in the slot, that is just trickery which they used once.  They tried it against the colts and it didn't work.  It only worked because they took advantage of the rules and bent them.


----------



## SwimExpert

Freewill said:


> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.



Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots coaching staff throws the Ravens a curve ball with a "tackle eligible" formation that Harbaugh doesn't know how to counteract...and suddenly the Patriots are "cheaters"?  Hey, it's the Patriots...people like Alex don't need anything else.  Bill Belichick is Darth Vader in a hoodie and Foxboro Stadium is the Death Star.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Pats used a trick pure and simple.  There is a convention to how games are run.  Other then special teams players have no reason to report ineligible.  So yeah it was within the rules but there is a reason that people wear the numbers they do.
> 
> Come on, wearing a receiver number and lining up in the slot, that is just trickery which they used once.  They tried it against the colts and it didn't work.  It only worked because they took advantage of the rules and bent them.
Click to expand...


No they did not.  The NFL has said the play is perfectly legal.  You just don't like it.  Well, keep crying because it's too bad, and it's too late.  Your team lost, and it was not because of a football being 1 or 2 PSI off of guidelines either.  That is stupid as all hell.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
Click to expand...


So then you think the refs knew about it all along?


----------



## Papageorgio

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because it probably was not noticeable.  The whole thing is retarded and is being blown out of proportion by the haters, as per usual.
Click to expand...


Ever gone to the fair and tried to shoot hoops? The balls are way over inflated and it makes them hard to make baskets.   If a basketball is under inflated it is tough to dribble. 

Without the correct air pressure the ball responds differently. Same with a football.

I do think the ballboy at the direction of the team deflated balls on the sideline, with everything that goes on at the sidelines, you can deflate a ball pretty easily without it going noticed.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So then you think the refs knew about it all along?
Click to expand...

What the refs did has been established previously in this thread.


----------



## mack20

Freewill said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Chuck Pagano knows that the pressure in the balls had ZERO to do with who won that football game.  He's too classy an individual to use that as an excuse for losing that game.
> 
> Even John Harbaugh backed off on his claim that the Patriots were breaking the rules with their tackle eligible formation.  Why?  Because he knew that it wasn't illegal and he knew that claiming it was would only make him look like a whiny loser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does breaking the rules have to do with who won the AFC Championship game?
> 
> Sean Peyton was suspended a year for just being the coach on a team that supposedly had a bounty on other teams players. He just looked the other way. How many games did New Orleans win because of that?
> 
> Tom Brady obviously decided to break the rules in instructing the equipment manager the characteristics he wanted in a game-ready prepared football.  Tom Brady knows what the rules are in the allowable pressure of an OFFICIAL NFL football.  Both Tom and Bill have bragged on TV interviews that they thoroughly know all the rules and that's what gives them an advantage preparing for games with other teams.
> 
> Now Tom claims he knows nothin about nothin.  Bill knows nothin about nothin.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cant wait till the Pats kick the shit outta Seattle who should have lost the last game
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots coaching staff throws the Ravens a curve ball with a "tackle eligible" formation that Harbaugh doesn't know how to counteract...and suddenly the Patriots are "cheaters"?  Hey, it's the Patriots...people like Alex don't need anything else.  Bill Belichick is Darth Vader in a hoodie and Foxboro Stadium is the Death Star.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Pats used a trick pure and simple.  There is a convention to how games are run.  Other then special teams players have no reason to report ineligible.  So yeah it was within the rules but there is a reason that people wear the numbers they do.
> 
> Come on, wearing a receiver number and lining up in the slot, that is just trickery which they used once.  They tried it against the colts and it didn't work.  It only worked because they took advantage of the rules and bent them.
Click to expand...


Actually, it did work against the Colts. I could also claim that the Seahawks used trickery to win (fake field goal), but I'm not an idiot about it.


----------



## mack20

Papageorgio said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's because it probably was not noticeable.  The whole thing is retarded and is being blown out of proportion by the haters, as per usual.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ever gone to the fair and tried to shoot hoops? The balls are way over inflated and it makes them hard to make baskets.   If a basketball is under inflated it is tough to dribble.
> 
> Without the correct air pressure the ball responds differently. Same with a football.
> 
> I do think the ballboy at the direction of the team deflated balls on the sideline, with everything that goes on at the sidelines, you can deflate a ball pretty easily without it going noticed.
Click to expand...


What is the specific difference in feel between a football inflated to 10.5 psi and one inflated to 12.5 psi?


----------



## mack20

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So then you think the refs knew about it all along?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What the refs did has been established previously in this thread.
Click to expand...



Has it?


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So then you think the refs knew about it all along?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What the refs did has been established previously in this thread.
Click to expand...


Please Alex, just because you say they were to busy to notice doesn't make it so.

I don't think you are being honest.

I can tell if a football is over or under inflated just by squeezing it, I tried it yesterday.  You take 10%-20% of the air out of a football, believe me you can tell. It doesn't sting as much when you catch, if you squeeze it there is give. The refs had to know and that is an issue the NFL has to look into.

In football games you see refs squeezing the football, they have to feel it, I can't imagine a novice like myself can and yet you claim a professional such as a ref can't.

You are BSing. Especially if you want the brand and integrity to be upheld as you claim.


----------



## Theowl32

The results of the AFC championship game is totally irrelevant to this story. That has nothing to do with this story.

IF a baseball player is caught corking their bat, no one brings up the result of the game. If a pitcher doctors the ball, the issue is not the result of the game.


If you are a golfer, you know if you do ANYTHING to the equipment or do ANYTHING that violated any of the rules DELIBERATELY you are ostracized from the sport.

The issue IS NOT what the Pats did to the Colts. The issue is they violated the rules. The footballs being inflated to a league standard is the rule. Period.

Is it ticky tack? I tend to think so. However, if they are going to say it is perfectly fine to fuck with the footballs, then do not make it a rule. Do not even inspect the footballs. Not before the game, not at halftime.

The point is there was a rule and the Pats deliberately altered the footballs. That is the ONLY ISSUE. Anyone bringing up the 45-7 score is bringing a fallacy to the debate.

Unless someone is expecting me to assume that Patriots never did this before. I am pretty sure it is perfectly ok for me to assume they have been doing this for a while. Years even.


----------



## Alex.

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So then you think the refs knew about it all along?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What the refs did has been established previously in this thread.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please Alex, just because you say they were to busy to notice doesn't make it so.
> 
> I don't think you are being honest.
> 
> I can tell if a football is over or under inflated just by squeezing it, I tried it yesterday.  You take 10%-20% of the air out of a football, believe me you can tell. It doesn't sting as much when you catch, if you squeeze it there is give. The refs had to know and that is an issue the NFL has to look into.
> 
> In football games you see refs squeezing the football, they have to feel it, I can't imagine a novice like myself can and yet you claim a professional such as a ref can't.
> 
> You are BSing. Especially if you want the brand and integrity to be upheld as you claim.
Click to expand...

I never said that


----------



## Theowl32

manifold said:


> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.



Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence. 

How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were. 

Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I find it all suspect, I see those officials squeezing them, I would think a two pound difference would be noticeable. Just saying, I can tell when a basketball or football are over or under inflated pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So then you think the refs knew about it all along?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What the refs did has been established previously in this thread.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please Alex, just because you say they were to busy to notice doesn't make it so.
> 
> I don't think you are being honest.
> 
> I can tell if a football is over or under inflated just by squeezing it, I tried it yesterday.  You take 10%-20% of the air out of a football, believe me you can tell. It doesn't sting as much when you catch, if you squeeze it there is give. The refs had to know and that is an issue the NFL has to look into.
> 
> In football games you see refs squeezing the football, they have to feel it, I can't imagine a novice like myself can and yet you claim a professional such as a ref can't.
> 
> You are BSing. Especially if you want the brand and integrity to be upheld as you claim.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I never said that
Click to expand...


I'm saying the refs need to be investigated, it is like saying Brady didn't know the ball were under inflated. They had to know, they handle balls from both sidelines, if they couldn't tell the difference then there was know difference and we know that isn't true.


----------



## rightwinger

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> IIRC Brady stated he could not feel the difference which lead lead Jerome Bettis to have this reaction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So then you think the refs knew about it all along?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What the refs did has been established previously in this thread.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Please Alex, just because you say they were to busy to notice doesn't make it so.
> 
> I don't think you are being honest.
> 
> I can tell if a football is over or under inflated just by squeezing it, I tried it yesterday.  You take 10%-20% of the air out of a football, believe me you can tell. It doesn't sting as much when you catch, if you squeeze it there is give. The refs had to know and that is an issue the NFL has to look into.
> 
> In football games you see refs squeezing the football, they have to feel it, I can't imagine a novice like myself can and yet you claim a professional such as a ref can't.
> 
> You are BSing. Especially if you want the brand and integrity to be upheld as you claim.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I never said that
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm saying the refs need to be investigated, it is like saying Brady didn't know the ball were under inflated. They had to know, they handle balls from both sidelines, if they couldn't tell the difference then there was know difference and we know that isn't true.
Click to expand...

 
Any veteran QB can tell if a ball is underinflated just by handling it. Brady knows how a ball should feel

That said, is he obligated to report it?


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
Click to expand...


Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?


----------



## Theowl32

mack20 said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
Click to expand...


Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.

Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.

Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.

"I do not know."

Could have saved us a lot of time.

This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.




> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.



Maybe to you, that is not official.


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.
> 
> Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.
> 
> "I do not know."
> 
> Could have saved us a lot of time.
> 
> This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe to you, that is not official.
Click to expand...


ESPN and a former NFL official?  Nope, that is not, in fact, an official statement from the NFL, as far as I'm concerned. It shouldn't be as far as you're concerned either.


----------



## Theowl32

mack20 said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.
> 
> Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.
> 
> "I do not know."
> 
> Could have saved us a lot of time.
> 
> This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe to you, that is not official.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ESPN and a former NFL official?  Nope, that is not, in fact, an official statement from the NFL, as far as I'm concerned. It shouldn't be as far as you're concerned either.
Click to expand...


Ahhhh, so are you saying they did not have deflated balls, and are you saying there is no rule and the referees did not replace them at half time?

Is, this your claim? It is only being reported and so therefore it did not actually happen until the NFL acknowledges that it happened?

Or.....

Are you all saying if it is true, then it is not a big deal? I personally think that is what you are saying. That would of course mean a baseball player ought to be able to alter their bats and cork them. I think pitchers ought to be able to whatever they want to do with the balls. I mean so long as we think altering official balls and changing it from the stated standard is no big deal, then why not? 

Or is it that you think like many think that this all about picking the poor Patriots?

Should golfers be able to alter their equipment? I mean, why have any rules if the rules are not really a big deal.

----------

Pats fans are funny. Were the Saints picked on when they suspended their coach for a year? Were the Ravens picked on after the commissioner decided to suspend Ray Rice indefinitely after he had already decided on the punishment?

The Pats were not "picked on" for spy gate. They are not being "picked on" now. There are rules, they violated them deliberately. Period. There is no gray area. It is black and white.


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.
> 
> Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.
> 
> "I do not know."
> 
> Could have saved us a lot of time.
> 
> This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe to you, that is not official.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ESPN and a former NFL official?  Nope, that is not, in fact, an official statement from the NFL, as far as I'm concerned. It shouldn't be as far as you're concerned either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ahhhh, so are you saying they did not have deflated balls, and are you saying there is no rule and the referees did not replace them at half time?
> 
> Is, this your claim? It is only being reported and so therefore it did not actually happen until the NFL acknowledges that it happened?
> 
> Or.....
> 
> Are you all saying if it is true, then it is not a big deal? I personally think that is what you are saying. That would of course mean a baseball player ought to be able to alter their bats and cork them. I think pitchers ought to be able to whatever they want to do with the balls. I mean so long as we think altering official balls and changing it from the stated standard is no big deal, then why not?
> 
> Or is it that you think like many think that this all about picking the poor Patriots?
> 
> Should golfers be able to alter their equipment? I mean, why have any rules if the rules are not really a big deal.
> 
> ----------
> 
> Pats fans are funny. Were the Saints picked on when they suspended their coach for a year? Were the Ravens picked on after the commissioner decided to suspend Ray Rice indefinitely after he had already decided on the punishment?
> 
> The Pats were not "picked on" for spy gate. They are not being "picked on" now. There are rules, they violated them deliberately. Period. There is no gray area. It is black and white.
Click to expand...


I actually wasn't saying any of those things.  Full disclosure: I don't think it's a big deal and I think that this week has been a fucking joke. 

What I was saying is that until the NFL makes an official statement, we don't have any concrete facts to proceed with.  A lot of the reporting has been contradicted.  I think it's fair to say that the balls were under inflated, but until we know what the NFL has found we don't actually know how they got that way.  Schefter reported the other day that the NFL was having trouble linking the Patriots to anything.  There are reports that the NFL set up a sting operation, which, if true, would be fucking ridiculous. 

And my personal opinion on the matter isn't fact.  Neither is yours.  Having said that, I have a hard time believing that Brady and Belichick would deny it so vehemently if there was any chance they would be proven wrong.   This is a team known for stonewalling the media at every turn.  Keeping their mouths shut might not have endeared the media toward them, but it would've been par for the course.  IIRC, during Spygate Belichick never claimed he didn't do it, just that he believed it was within the rules, which the NFL disagreed with.


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> manifold said:
> 
> 
> 
> Already tried and convicted in the court of public opinion... ossum!
> 
> The NFL's investigation will conclude that the allegations are false. And then you haters will claim that was fixed too.
> 
> suck it, losers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.
> 
> Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.
> 
> "I do not know."
> 
> Could have saved us a lot of time.
> 
> This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe to you, that is not official.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ESPN and a former NFL official?  Nope, that is not, in fact, an official statement from the NFL, as far as I'm concerned. It shouldn't be as far as you're concerned either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ahhhh, so are you saying they did not have deflated balls, and are you saying there is no rule and the referees did not replace them at half time?
> 
> Is, this your claim? It is only being reported and so therefore it did not actually happen until the NFL acknowledges that it happened?
> 
> Or.....
> 
> Are you all saying if it is true, then it is not a big deal? I personally think that is what you are saying. That would of course mean a baseball player ought to be able to alter their bats and cork them. I think pitchers ought to be able to whatever they want to do with the balls. I mean so long as we think altering official balls and changing it from the stated standard is no big deal, then why not?
> 
> Or is it that you think like many think that this all about picking the poor Patriots?
> 
> Should golfers be able to alter their equipment? I mean, why have any rules if the rules are not really a big deal.
> 
> ----------
> 
> Pats fans are funny. Were the Saints picked on when they suspended their coach for a year? Were the Ravens picked on after the commissioner decided to suspend Ray Rice indefinitely after he had already decided on the punishment?
> 
> The Pats were not "picked on" for spy gate. They are not being "picked on" now. There are rules, they violated them deliberately. Period. There is no gray area. It is black and white.
Click to expand...


Also, um yeah, the way that Goodell handled Bountygate and Ray Rice has been a complete joke.  Goodell is a piece of crap commissioner.


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Which brings us back to a game where you have officials handling balls on virtually every single play of the game and none of THEM senses anything wrong with the Patriot's footballs!  How is that possible?  Is the officiating crew secretly all New England fans who were on the take?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Listen, this is not speculation or accusation.  *The NFL has confirmed that the Patriots were using deflated footballs.  It is fact.*  That you are trying to argue that it might not be true is further evidence of your entirely delusional perspective on this subject.
Click to expand...


Yes, that is a "fact"!  What is not established fact however is how those balls came to BE deflated.


SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I understand how this plays out...you maintain that the Colts are suspicious of the Patriots using illegal balls from way back in November.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _During that Nov. 16 game, Colts safety Mike Adams twice intercepted quarterback Tom Brady and gave the balls to the Colts' equipment manager to save. Both times there were concerns about the balls feeling under-inflated, sources earlier this season had told ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter. _
> 
> _ Those sources also said that the Colts raised concerns to the league, which was aware of the issue going into this Sunday's AFC Championship game._
> 
> Deflate-gate Indianapolis Colts Raised Concerns in November About Under-Inflated New England Patriots Balls - ABC News
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *BUT DURING THE MOST IMPORTANT GAME OF THEIR SEASON...THE GAME THAT WILL DECIDE IF THEY GO TO THE SUPER BOWL...THEY DON'T RAISE THE ISSUE WITH THE OFFICIALS UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE HALFTIME?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually, they raised the issue with the league, not the on-the-field officials.  And you have no idea whether the Colts mentioned anything to the officials before the game.
Click to expand...


So let me see if I'm understanding this...you now claim from unnamed "sources" that the Colts raised concerns about under-inflated balls earlier in the season with the league yet in the AFC Championship game...the most important game of the Colt's season to that date...nobody raised that issue with the on the field officials?  The league didn't?  The Colts didn't?  Why do I find that to be the most unbelievable scenario I've EVER heard?  It would be akin to a baseball team believing that an opposing pitcher was doctoring the ball in some games during the regular season but when that pitcher took the mound during game seven...which will decide who goes to the World Series...they forget to mention that to the umpires and forget to have the ball checked that's in the game!  You REALLY buy that story?  I mean REALLY!!!


----------



## Theowl32

mack20 said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you saying the 11 balls that were found to be deflated was a lie? I think you ought to know, that is a fact in evidence.
> 
> How, did the Pats balls get deflated while none of the Colts were.
> 
> Is there a plausible explanation for that? Name it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.
> 
> Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.
> 
> "I do not know."
> 
> Could have saved us a lot of time.
> 
> This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe to you, that is not official.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ESPN and a former NFL official?  Nope, that is not, in fact, an official statement from the NFL, as far as I'm concerned. It shouldn't be as far as you're concerned either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ahhhh, so are you saying they did not have deflated balls, and are you saying there is no rule and the referees did not replace them at half time?
> 
> Is, this your claim? It is only being reported and so therefore it did not actually happen until the NFL acknowledges that it happened?
> 
> Or.....
> 
> Are you all saying if it is true, then it is not a big deal? I personally think that is what you are saying. That would of course mean a baseball player ought to be able to alter their bats and cork them. I think pitchers ought to be able to whatever they want to do with the balls. I mean so long as we think altering official balls and changing it from the stated standard is no big deal, then why not?
> 
> Or is it that you think like many think that this all about picking the poor Patriots?
> 
> Should golfers be able to alter their equipment? I mean, why have any rules if the rules are not really a big deal.
> 
> ----------
> 
> Pats fans are funny. Were the Saints picked on when they suspended their coach for a year? Were the Ravens picked on after the commissioner decided to suspend Ray Rice indefinitely after he had already decided on the punishment?
> 
> The Pats were not "picked on" for spy gate. They are not being "picked on" now. There are rules, they violated them deliberately. Period. There is no gray area. It is black and white.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I actually wasn't saying any of those things.  Full disclosure: I don't think it's a big deal and I think that this week has been a fucking joke.
> 
> What I was saying is that until the NFL makes an official statement, we don't have any concrete facts to proceed with.  A lot of the reporting has been contradicted.  I think it's fair to say that the balls were under inflated, but until we know what the NFL has found we don't actually know how they got that way.  Schefter reported the other day that the NFL was having trouble linking the Patriots to anything.  There are reports that the NFL set up a sting operation, which, if true, would be fucking ridiculous.
> 
> And my personal opinion on the matter isn't fact.  Neither is yours.  Having said that, I have a hard time believing that Brady and Belichick would deny it so vehemently if there was any chance they would be proven wrong.   This is a team known for stonewalling the media at every turn.  Keeping their mouths shut might not have endeared the media toward them, but it would've been par for the course.  IIRC, during Spygate Belichick never claimed he didn't do it, just that he believed it was within the rules, which the NFL disagreed with.
Click to expand...


Official or unofficial statement does not mean we cannot express an opinion. My point is there is an argument that is an actual fallacy that it had nothing to do with the result of the AFC Championship game. 

That seems to be the JUSTIFICATION for the violation of the rule. Deliberate violation btw. There is no justification. 

The NFL will not make official statement until AFTER the super bowl. The NFL is a business, and that is the way it will be handled. I cannot stand Goodell, but his job to be the guy to take arrows for the owners. 

Now, there were elements of spygate that were not within the rules. The fact the Mangini is the one that reported it is also telling, considering he knew what the effects of the taping was. He took part in it after all when he was with the Pats staff. If, it was not really a big deal and it had no effect at all, then I doubt Mangini would have cared all that much. 

The Pats right now have a reputation that they brought in themselves. I certainly do not buy into the notion that they had no idea. I also do not think they only did it against the Colts. 

Is it a big giant deal? No. It really isn't. Then again, it is a violation, and something will need to be done. 

Make no mistake, this will effect the Pats in the SB one of two ways. Either the distraction will be so great that they will be playing a horrific game. Or, it will really inspire Brady to have a great game, ala when people were writing him off after the Chiefs game this year.


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since every quarterback in the league appears to have a preference over the ball that "they" play with...my question to those of you that maintain that because the Colt's balls were legal when checked...that somehow proves that the Patriot's balls were purposely deflated below league standards...is how do you know what Andrew Luck's preference is for pressure?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You really are desperately stretching.  It doesn't matter what Luck's preference is.  The fact of the matter is that the Patriots were using deflated footballs.  At best.....and in and of itself this is truly a ridiculous stretch....but _at the very, very, very, best_ your hypothesis implies gross incompetence by the Patriots' equipment personnel for failing to maintain the correct pressure.  But anyone with a halfway functioning brain can put two-and-two together.  *There is now an established pattern of behavior of the Patriots using deflated footballs.*  Not only that, but _*your hypothesis that Tom Brady has been repeatedly using footballs that have been anything other than exactly the way he wanted them is more fantastic than a hobbit story.*_
Click to expand...


All that's been "established" is that Tom Brady prefers the ball to be under-inflated.  THAT is his pattern of behavior!  Aaron Roger's pattern of behavior is that he likes an over-inflated ball.  Does that make Roger's guilty?

There has been ZERO proof provided that Tom Brady had anything to do with the condition of those balls other than his preference to have the balls as under-inflated as possible!  There is ZERO proof that anyone tampered with the balls once they were taken from a locked area and given to the ball boys five minutes before game time!  You've got a nationally televised game watched by millions with literally dozens of TV cameras scrutinizing every inch of that field.  You've got side line reporters.  You've got thousands of fans in the stands taking pictures of what's in front of them.  Yet with all of that taking place...I haven't seen one incriminating picture of someone affiliated with the Patriots deflating game balls on the sidelines.  How can that be?


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh nice, I hadn't seen that the NFL made an official statement on the matter.   Would you mind linking to it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that your explanation for the 11 deflated balls? Are you saying there was not a rule? I cannot tell.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to with the result of the game. It has to do with violating the rules. Patriots did it.
> 
> Their press conferences yesterday should have been boiled down to one statement.
> 
> "I do not know."
> 
> Could have saved us a lot of time.
> 
> This whole thing is going to fall on some scapegoat. I am predicting the ball boy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ESPN has reported that during New England’s 45-7 victory against the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium, 11 of the Patriots’ 12 game balls were under-inflated by 2 pounds of air pressure. Rules call for 12.5 to 13.5 pounds per square inch when the officials gauge the balls two hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff and any other time during the game.
> 
> Former NFL official Gerry Austin told ESPN yesterday that the Patriots’ 12th ball was also under-inflated but not by 2 pounds. Austin also said all 12 of the Colts’ balls were properly inflated when they were measured at halftime.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe to you, that is not official.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ESPN and a former NFL official?  Nope, that is not, in fact, an official statement from the NFL, as far as I'm concerned. It shouldn't be as far as you're concerned either.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ahhhh, so are you saying they did not have deflated balls, and are you saying there is no rule and the referees did not replace them at half time?
> 
> Is, this your claim? It is only being reported and so therefore it did not actually happen until the NFL acknowledges that it happened?
> 
> Or.....
> 
> Are you all saying if it is true, then it is not a big deal? I personally think that is what you are saying. That would of course mean a baseball player ought to be able to alter their bats and cork them. I think pitchers ought to be able to whatever they want to do with the balls. I mean so long as we think altering official balls and changing it from the stated standard is no big deal, then why not?
> 
> Or is it that you think like many think that this all about picking the poor Patriots?
> 
> Should golfers be able to alter their equipment? I mean, why have any rules if the rules are not really a big deal.
> 
> ----------
> 
> Pats fans are funny. Were the Saints picked on when they suspended their coach for a year? Were the Ravens picked on after the commissioner decided to suspend Ray Rice indefinitely after he had already decided on the punishment?
> 
> The Pats were not "picked on" for spy gate. They are not being "picked on" now. There are rules, they violated them deliberately. Period. There is no gray area. It is black and white.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I actually wasn't saying any of those things.  Full disclosure: I don't think it's a big deal and I think that this week has been a fucking joke.
> 
> What I was saying is that until the NFL makes an official statement, we don't have any concrete facts to proceed with.  A lot of the reporting has been contradicted.  I think it's fair to say that the balls were under inflated, but until we know what the NFL has found we don't actually know how they got that way.  Schefter reported the other day that the NFL was having trouble linking the Patriots to anything.  There are reports that the NFL set up a sting operation, which, if true, would be fucking ridiculous.
> 
> And my personal opinion on the matter isn't fact.  Neither is yours.  Having said that, I have a hard time believing that Brady and Belichick would deny it so vehemently if there was any chance they would be proven wrong.   This is a team known for stonewalling the media at every turn.  Keeping their mouths shut might not have endeared the media toward them, but it would've been par for the course.  IIRC, during Spygate Belichick never claimed he didn't do it, just that he believed it was within the rules, which the NFL disagreed with.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Official or unofficial statement does not mean we cannot express an opinion. My point is there is an argument that is an actual fallacy that it had nothing to do with the result of the AFC Championship game.
> 
> That seems to be the JUSTIFICATION for the violation of the rule. Deliberate violation btw. There is no justification.
> 
> The NFL will not make official statement until AFTER the super bowl. The NFL is a business, and that is the way it will be handled. I cannot stand Goodell, but his job to be the guy to take arrows for the owners.
> 
> Now, there were elements of spygate that were not within the rules. The fact the Mangini is the one that reported it is also telling, considering he knew what the effects of the taping was. He took part in it after all when he was with the Pats staff. If, it was not really a big deal and it had no effect at all, then I doubt Mangini would have cared all that much.
> 
> The Pats right now have a reputation that they brought in themselves. I certainly do not buy into the notion that they had no idea. I also do not think they only did it against the Colts.
> 
> Is it a big giant deal? No. It really isn't. Then again, it is a violation, and something will need to be done.
> 
> Make no mistake, this will effect the Pats in the SB one of two ways. Either the distraction will be so great that they will be playing a horrific game. Or, it will really inspire Brady to have a great game, ala when people were writing him off after the Chiefs game this year.
Click to expand...


Mangini made a big deal about it because he was the coach of the Jets at that point and wanted to harm the Patriots.  It's a testament to the kind of person that Mangini "is".


----------



## percysunshine

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
Click to expand...


According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.

The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.

Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.

.


----------



## Oldstyle

And the whole point of having game balls provided by the teams is so that the quarterbacks playing IN the game will be comfortable throwing the ball that they are.  It's why Aaron Roger's footballs are going to be as inflated as he can get them...that's what HE likes!  It's why Tom Brady's footballs are going to be as un-inflated as he can get them...that's what HE likes!  Has anyone in the media thought to ask Andrew Luck what HE likes in a football?  Did he start out with balls that were inflated at the high range of NFL allowances?  Has anyone in the media thought to ask some past officials if they REALLY checked game balls that stringently or whether it's done in a ho-hum...close enough...let's go play fashion!


----------



## Theowl32

percysunshine said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
Click to expand...


Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported. 

Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls. 

Well, that would have to be the explanation.


----------



## Papageorgio

First off how do you prove New England did anything? With all the cameras and all the people, no one saw a ballboy or anyone else deflating balls. Did it happen, I'm sure but with no evidence...you ain't got nuthin. Could the air pressure gauge been off? Could the refs not really check the air pressure? 

So many angles to the story, yet it won't effect the Super Bowl and I doubt you get nothing but a fine out of the whole deal.


----------



## Theowl32

Papageorgio said:


> First off how do you prove New England did anything? With all the cameras and all the people, no one saw a ballboy or anyone else deflating balls. Did it happen, I'm sure but with no evidence...you ain't got nuthin. Could the air pressure gauge been off? Could the refs not really check the air pressure?
> 
> So many angles to the story, yet it won't effect the Super Bowl and I doubt you get nothing but a fine out of the whole deal.



Someone did. There is your fact. What are your theories?

Maybe Brady and Belichick really did not know anything about it. 

Uhh huh. 

Is that what you believe? 

Could the pressure gauge have been off? They worked fine for the Colts balls. 

Wow......just wow.


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> All that's been "established" is that Tom Brady prefers the ball to be under-inflated.



If that's what you think, then you really are helplessly deluded.


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
Click to expand...


Perhaps the Colt's balls were inflated to 13.5 and even though they lost pressure they remained in the acceptable range?


----------



## mack20

Papageorgio said:


> First off how do you prove New England did anything? With all the cameras and all the people, no one saw a ballboy or anyone else deflating balls. Did it happen, I'm sure but with no evidence...you ain't got nuthin. Could the air pressure gauge been off? Could the refs not really check the air pressure?
> 
> So many angles to the story, yet it won't effect the Super Bowl and I doubt you get nothing but a fine out of the whole deal.



There's a suggested fine amount in the NFL rule book for a reason.  That's roughly where the NFL values over or under inflating the ball.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> All that's been "established" is that Tom Brady prefers the ball to be under-inflated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If that's what you think, then you really are helplessly deluded.
Click to expand...


What else has been definitively established?


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> Yes, that is a "fact"!  What is not established fact however is how those balls came to BE deflated.



Slut magic.  I'm sure it was just slut magic.



> So let me see if I'm understanding this...you now claim from unnamed "sources" that the Colts raised concerns about under-inflated balls earlier in the season with the league



Those are the reports coming out.  I wasn't there.  But several reputable media outlets have been reporting it from their sources.  I'm inclined to give it alot of credibility at this point.  Certainly is more credible than the bullshit you're trying to sell.



> yet in the AFC Championship game...the most important game of the Colt's season to that date...nobody raised that issue with the on the field officials?  The league didn't?  The Colts didn't?



Actually, *you're* *the only person making that claim*.  I've already pointed out to you that you don't know that none of those things happened.



> Why do I find that to be the most unbelievable scenario I've EVER heard?



Because right now you're strictly in the business of *believing whatever you want to believe.*  You lack the common fucking sense to realize that you've relegated yourself to birther territory.


----------



## SwimExpert

mack20 said:


> What else has been definitively established?



For starters, the fact that the Patriots were using deflated footballs last Sunday.  It is also reasonably established that this is not the first time.  Two teams made independent reports of such prior to Sunday's game.  That's pretty damn convincing.


----------



## Papageorgio

Theowl32 said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> First off how do you prove New England did anything? With all the cameras and all the people, no one saw a ballboy or anyone else deflating balls. Did it happen, I'm sure but with no evidence...you ain't got nuthin. Could the air pressure gauge been off? Could the refs not really check the air pressure?
> 
> So many angles to the story, yet it won't effect the Super Bowl and I doubt you get nothing but a fine out of the whole deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone did. There is your fact. What are your theories?
> 
> Maybe Brady and Belichick really did not know anything about it.
> 
> Uhh huh.
> 
> Is that what you believe?
> 
> Could the pressure gauge have been off? They worked fine for the Colts balls.
> 
> Wow......just wow.
Click to expand...


Did they use the same gauge before the game and at halftime or were different gauges used?

I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story. 

If different gauges were used before the game for the Pats and one for the Colts, what if they were off?

Now at halftime the same pressure gauge was used on all balls? 

I don't know, what happened and guess what, neither do you.

I don't buy it but the NFL overturned a players drug test because the cup had a leak. How it makes one innocent is beyond me but that is the NFL.


----------



## SwimExpert

mack20 said:


> Perhaps the Colt's balls were inflated to 13.5 and even though they lost pressure they remained in the acceptable range?



Pure conjecture, lacking evidence, and flying in the face of common sense.  There is no good explanation for how 11 footballs might lose 2 psi worth of pressure over the course of one half of game play.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What else has been definitively established?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For starters, the fact that the Patriots were using deflated footballs last Sunday.  It is also reasonably established that this is not the first time.  Two teams made independent reports of such prior to Sunday's game.  That's pretty damn convincing.
Click to expand...


I've not seen any statements from the Colts or the Ravens stating that they were involved in instigating a league investigation. 

It has been reported, yes.  It was also reported that Jackson told the Colts the ball felt under inflated after the interception.  Turns out that wasn't true.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps the Colt's balls were inflated to 13.5 and even though they lost pressure they remained in the acceptable range?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pure conjecture, lacking evidence, and flying in the face of common sense.  There is no good explanation for how 11 footballs might lose 2 psi worth of pressure over the course of one half of game play.
Click to expand...


Notice that I used the word "perhaps".  Indicting that I acknowledge that it was conjecture.  But it's not any more conjecture than some of the claims you've been making.  Difference between us is that I'm not insisting that my conjectures or opinions are facts.

Notice how you immediately dismiss my conjecture?  Has the NFL stated that this is not the case?  Do you know what PSI Luck prefers?  Can you tell me definitively that the Colts balls were the EXACT same pressure the entire game or can you just tell me that they remained in an acceptable range (just a hint: it's the latter)?

You saying "pfft, SO NOT TRUE" doesn't make it so.  Sorry, buddy.


----------



## Theowl32

Papageorgio said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> First off how do you prove New England did anything? With all the cameras and all the people, no one saw a ballboy or anyone else deflating balls. Did it happen, I'm sure but with no evidence...you ain't got nuthin. Could the air pressure gauge been off? Could the refs not really check the air pressure?
> 
> So many angles to the story, yet it won't effect the Super Bowl and I doubt you get nothing but a fine out of the whole deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone did. There is your fact. What are your theories?
> 
> Maybe Brady and Belichick really did not know anything about it.
> 
> Uhh huh.
> 
> Is that what you believe?
> 
> Could the pressure gauge have been off? They worked fine for the Colts balls.
> 
> Wow......just wow.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did they use the same gauge before the game and at halftime or were different gauges used?
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> If different gauges were used before the game for the Pats and one for the Colts, what if they were off?
> 
> Now at halftime the same pressure gauge was used on all balls?
> 
> I don't know, what happened and guess what, neither do you.
> 
> I don't buy it but the NFL overturned a players drug test because the cup had a leak. How it makes one innocent is beyond me but that is the NFL.
Click to expand...


Lol


----------



## Alex.

*"the evidence thus far supports the conclusion that footballs that were under-inflated were used by the Patriots"*

NFL investigation of balls in AFC title game led by Pash Wells - NFL.com


----------



## SwimExpert

Papageorgio said:


> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.



I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.

The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.

It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
Click to expand...


Except that according the those reports you so love, the Ravens supposedly had suspicions about the kicking balls, which the Patriots have no access to.


----------



## mack20

Also, just to reiterate, this is the stupidest fucking scandal.


----------



## SwimExpert

mack20 said:


> Notice that I used the word "perhaps".  Indicting that I acknowledge that it was conjecture.  But it's not any more conjecture than some of the claims you've been making.  Difference between us is that I'm not insisting that my conjectures or opinions are facts.



I haven't been making conjecture.  I've been reciting the facts, and have established well reasoned arguments consistent with the principles of logic.  Everything I've said has been supported in the news reports.

-Patriots were using deflated footballs in the AFC championship
-Ravens informed Colts of suspicions about NE using deflated balls, after the divisional round
-Colts reported suspicions to the league in November about NE using deflated balls
-Tom Brady is on record as long ago as 2011 stating he prefers deflated balls
-Belichick has a documented history of cheating going back to 2000

Those are facts.  



> Notice how you immediately dismiss my conjecture?



Because it is meaningless.  It is without any support or evidence.  It flies in the face of common sense, as there is no good explanation available for how it might come to pass.  In short, it is nothing more than an invention of your own mind, and your own wishes for what you want.



> Has the NFL stated that this is not the case?



The NFL has stated that the Colts' balls were within regulation every time they were checked.



> Do you know what PSI Luck prefers?



Red herring and irrelevant.



> Can you tell me definitively that the Colts balls were the EXACT same pressure the entire game or can you just tell me that they remained in an acceptable range (just a hint: it's the latter)?



Whether they were the exact same pressure the entire game is irrelevant.  They were within regulation each time checked.  Thus, the only relevant information is that there was no substantial change.  This is exactly what one would expect.  Once inflated, there is no good reason a functional football should lose any substantial air pressure over the course of a single football game.



> You saying "pfft, SO NOT TRUE" doesn't make it so.  Sorry, buddy.



A lack of evidence for your outlandish speculation is entirely sufficient for a logical mind to dismiss your conjecture as being entirely without merit.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> *"the evidence thus far supports the conclusion that footballs that were under-inflated were used by the Patriots"*
> 
> NFL investigation of balls in AFC title game led by Pash Wells - NFL.com



Gee, isn't that what we knew on Sunday?


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Notice that I used the word "perhaps".  Indicting that I acknowledge that it was conjecture.  But it's not any more conjecture than some of the claims you've been making.  Difference between us is that I'm not insisting that my conjectures or opinions are facts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't been making conjecture.  I've been reciting the facts, and have established well reasoned arguments consistent with the principles of logic.  Everything I've said has been supported in the news reports.
> 
> -Patriots were using deflated footballs in the AFC championship
> -Ravens informed Colts of suspicions about NE using deflated balls, after the divisional round
> -Colts reported suspicions to the league in November about NE using deflated balls
> -Tom Brady is on record as long ago as 2011 stating he prefers deflated balls
> -Belichick has a documented history of cheating going back to 2000
> 
> Those are facts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Notice how you immediately dismiss my conjecture?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because it is meaningless.  It is without any support or evidence.  It flies in the face of common sense, as there is no good explanation available for how it might come to pass.  In short, it is nothing more than an invention of your own mind, and your own wishes for what you want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Has the NFL stated that this is not the case?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The NFL has stated that the Colts' balls were within regulation every time they were checked.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you know what PSI Luck prefers?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Red herring and irrelevant.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can you tell me definitively that the Colts balls were the EXACT same pressure the entire game or can you just tell me that they remained in an acceptable range (just a hint: it's the latter)?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whether they were the exact same pressure the entire game is irrelevant.  They were within regulation each time checked.  Thus, the only relevant information is that there was no substantial change.  This is exactly what one would expect.  Once inflated, there is no good reason a functional football should lose any substantial air pressure over the course of a single football game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You saying "pfft, SO NOT TRUE" doesn't make it so.  Sorry, buddy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A lack of evidence for your outlandish speculation is entirely sufficient for a logical mind to dismiss your conjecture as being entirely without merit.
Click to expand...


"Fact" - that word does not mean what you think it means. 

Though you basically supported my conjecture about the PSI in the Colt's balls, so thanks for that, bro.


----------



## Papageorgio

SwimExpert said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
Click to expand...


I'm throwing it all out there. I find it difficult for Belichick, Brady and the refs couldn't tell the balls were under inflated. Now is Brady under obligation to tell anyone? Is a player obligated to tell a ref that held on the play? 

To me, logic says the Pats cheated, to prove it, it is tougher. After a week of investigating and interviewing 40 people all the NFL has, the balls the Patriots used in the first half were under inflated and regained and refilled at halftime. Not exactly proof.


----------



## mack20

Papageorgio said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm throwing it all out there. I find it difficult for Belichick, Brady and the refs couldn't tell the balls were under inflated. Now is Brady under obligation to tell anyone? Is a player obligated to tell a ref that held on the play?
> 
> To me, logic says the Pats cheated, to prove it, it is tougher. After a week of investigating and interviewing 40 people all the NFL has, the balls the Patriots used in the first half were under inflated and regained and refilled at halftime. Not exactly proof.
Click to expand...


Thanks for being logical about this.  I'd respect swimexpert a whole lot more if he was to say, "you know what?  I think they cheated. Actual proof of that doesn't matter to me because I think they're a team that cheats and this scandal makes sense to me in that regard. Regardless of what the NFL decides, I will continue to believe that the Patriots deliberately deflated these footballs to gain a strategic advantage over the Colts, making them cheaters."

I might think that's wrong, but I could at least appreciate the honesty in it.


----------



## SwimExpert

mack20 said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm throwing it all out there. I find it difficult for Belichick, Brady and the refs couldn't tell the balls were under inflated. Now is Brady under obligation to tell anyone? Is a player obligated to tell a ref that held on the play?
> 
> To me, logic says the Pats cheated, to prove it, it is tougher. After a week of investigating and interviewing 40 people all the NFL has, the balls the Patriots used in the first half were under inflated and regained and refilled at halftime. Not exactly proof.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thanks for being logical about this.  I'd respect swimexpert a whole lot more if he was to say, "you know what?  I think they cheated. Actual proof of that doesn't matter to me because I think they're a team that cheats and this scandal makes sense to me in that regard. Regardless of what the NFL decides, I will continue to believe that the Patriots deliberately deflated these footballs to gain a strategic advantage over the Colts, making them cheaters."
> 
> I might think that's wrong, but I could at least appreciate the honesty in it.
Click to expand...


I'm highly intelligent.  Maybe you just aren't smart enough to understand the logic.  Regardless, everything I've said has been on the facts as they are known.  Your insistence that people should not comprehend the information better than you're so able is irrelevant.


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm throwing it all out there. I find it difficult for Belichick, Brady and the refs couldn't tell the balls were under inflated. Now is Brady under obligation to tell anyone? Is a player obligated to tell a ref that held on the play?
> 
> To me, logic says the Pats cheated, to prove it, it is tougher. After a week of investigating and interviewing 40 people all the NFL has, the balls the Patriots used in the first half were under inflated and regained and refilled at halftime. Not exactly proof.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thanks for being logical about this.  I'd respect swimexpert a whole lot more if he was to say, "you know what?  I think they cheated. Actual proof of that doesn't matter to me because I think they're a team that cheats and this scandal makes sense to me in that regard. Regardless of what the NFL decides, I will continue to believe that the Patriots deliberately deflated these footballs to gain a strategic advantage over the Colts, making them cheaters."
> 
> I might think that's wrong, but I could at least appreciate the honesty in it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm highly intelligent.  Maybe you just aren't smart enough to understand the logic.  Regardless, everything I've said has been on the facts as they are known.  Your insistence that people should not comprehend the information better than you're so able is irrelevant.
Click to expand...

Calling people who are being perfectly respectful toward you "dumb" isn't the most intelligent strategy.  I never thought you were stupid, stubborn and a bit dishonest about your reasoning maybe.


----------



## SwimExpert

mack20 said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm throwing it all out there. I find it difficult for Belichick, Brady and the refs couldn't tell the balls were under inflated. Now is Brady under obligation to tell anyone? Is a player obligated to tell a ref that held on the play?
> 
> To me, logic says the Pats cheated, to prove it, it is tougher. After a week of investigating and interviewing 40 people all the NFL has, the balls the Patriots used in the first half were under inflated and regained and refilled at halftime. Not exactly proof.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thanks for being logical about this.  I'd respect swimexpert a whole lot more if he was to say, "you know what?  I think they cheated. Actual proof of that doesn't matter to me because I think they're a team that cheats and this scandal makes sense to me in that regard. Regardless of what the NFL decides, I will continue to believe that the Patriots deliberately deflated these footballs to gain a strategic advantage over the Colts, making them cheaters."
> 
> I might think that's wrong, but I could at least appreciate the honesty in it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm highly intelligent.  Maybe you just aren't smart enough to understand the logic.  Regardless, everything I've said has been on the facts as they are known.  Your insistence that people should not comprehend the information better than you're so able is irrelevant.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Calling people who are being perfectly respectful toward you "dumb" isn't the most intelligent strategy.  I never thought you were stupid, stubborn and a bit dishonest about your reasoning maybe.
Click to expand...




You have a funny concept of "respect."


----------



## mack20

SwimExpert said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm throwing it all out there. I find it difficult for Belichick, Brady and the refs couldn't tell the balls were under inflated. Now is Brady under obligation to tell anyone? Is a player obligated to tell a ref that held on the play?
> 
> To me, logic says the Pats cheated, to prove it, it is tougher. After a week of investigating and interviewing 40 people all the NFL has, the balls the Patriots used in the first half were under inflated and regained and refilled at halftime. Not exactly proof.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thanks for being logical about this.  I'd respect swimexpert a whole lot more if he was to say, "you know what?  I think they cheated. Actual proof of that doesn't matter to me because I think they're a team that cheats and this scandal makes sense to me in that regard. Regardless of what the NFL decides, I will continue to believe that the Patriots deliberately deflated these footballs to gain a strategic advantage over the Colts, making them cheaters."
> 
> I might think that's wrong, but I could at least appreciate the honesty in it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm highly intelligent.  Maybe you just aren't smart enough to understand the logic.  Regardless, everything I've said has been on the facts as they are known.  Your insistence that people should not comprehend the information better than you're so able is irrelevant.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Calling people who are being perfectly respectful toward you "dumb" isn't the most intelligent strategy.  I never thought you were stupid, stubborn and a bit dishonest about your reasoning maybe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have a funny concept of "respect."
Click to expand...


And you have a funny concept of "facts".


----------



## percysunshine

Theowl32 said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
Click to expand...


.

 The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.

Infer as you wish from there.


----------



## Theowl32

percysunshine said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
Click to expand...


lol


----------



## percysunshine

mack20 said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Perhaps the Colt's balls were inflated to 13.5 and even though they lost pressure they remained in the acceptable range?
Click to expand...

.

No one is reporting the temperatures at the time the pressures were measured. Without that information, making shit up is both easy, and convenient.

.


----------



## Pop23

After all the stories, all the press conferences, all the hate and all the assertions. 

I still don't give a rip.


----------



## percysunshine

Pop23 said:


> After all the stories, all the press conferences, all the hate and all the assertions.
> 
> I still don't give a rip.


.

Obviously, your focus is on the cheerleaders.

.


----------



## SwimExpert

percysunshine said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
Click to expand...


I fail to understand what makes you assume a given starting temperature.  Why do you assume that the balls weren't inflated and checked outdoors, or in an area so ventilated as to be of comparable temperature to the outdoor temperature?


----------



## percysunshine

SwimExpert said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I fail to understand what makes you assume a given starting temperature.  Why do you assume that the balls weren't inflated and checked outdoors, or in an area so ventilated as to be of comparable temperature to the outdoor temperature?
Click to expand...


The starting temperature has to be something. Maybe you will share your best guess with us.

(I am assuming nothing.)
.


----------



## SwimExpert

percysunshine said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I fail to understand what makes you assume a given starting temperature.  Why do you assume that the balls weren't inflated and checked outdoors, or in an area so ventilated as to be of comparable temperature to the outdoor temperature?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The starting temperature has to be something. Maybe you will share your best guess with us.
> 
> (I am assuming nothing.)
> .
Click to expand...


You are assuming.  You're assuming an initial temperature of around 23* Celsius, and a final temperature of 0* Celsius.


----------



## Rocko

percysunshine said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> *PV=nRT
> *
> A ball inflated to 13 lbs, at room temperature, will have a pressure of 10.7 lbs when taken outside and cooled to 32 degrees..
> 
> It is not a mystery, nor a conspiracy. It is physics.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
Click to expand...


Well, perhaps the laws of physics cease to exist on your stove


----------



## Theowl32

Rocko said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, perhaps the laws of physics cease to exist on your stove
Click to expand...




Rocko said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, perhaps the laws of physics cease to exist on your stove
Click to expand...


Maybe they bought the balls from the same place Jack bought his beanstalk beans.


----------



## Freewill

SwimExpert said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.
Click to expand...


I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.


----------



## Freewill

Here is the statement from the NFL.  They confirm that they verified the pressure prior to the game and at half time and the pressure changed.  Then then put in properly inflated balls and checked them after the game and they were still good.  Which means, to me, someone definitely adjusted the balls and it was not just temperature.

Pats fans, don't worry nothing is going to come from this they have circled the wagons.  I am just not sure why they didn't tell Brady to STFU about it, he isn't helping his case.

NFL issues statement on Deflategate investigation ProFootballTalk

So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.
Click to expand...


Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.  

Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens


----------



## SwimExpert

Freewill said:


> So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?



Ban Belichick for life.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.
> 
> Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens
Click to expand...


the Colts are not my team.  And I gotja, win at all cost.


----------



## Freewill

SwimExpert said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ban Belichick for life.
Click to expand...


That ain't gonna happen.  Maybe for a game?


----------



## HUGGY

Freewill said:


> Here is the statement from the NFL.  They confirm that they verified the pressure prior to the game and at half time and the pressure changed.  Then then put in properly inflated balls and checked them after the game and they were still good.  Which means, to me, someone definitely adjusted the balls and it was not just temperature.
> 
> Pats fans, don't worry nothing is going to come from this they have circled the wagons.  I am just not sure why they didn't tell Brady to STFU about it, he isn't helping his case.
> 
> NFL issues statement on Deflategate investigation ProFootballTalk
> 
> So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?



No..The NEXT question is how long this has been going on.  

Then we ask what to do.


----------



## SwimExpert

Freewill said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ban Belichick for life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That ain't gonna happen.  Maybe for a game?
Click to expand...


It depends on how much Goodell is feeling the heat.  I agreed with Aikman when he said the punishment has to be more harsh than the whole bountygate deal.  We're talking about multiple acts of cheating over the years.  As Goodell said of Sean Payton, ignorance is no excuse.  But more importantly, there seems to be a cheating culture within the Patriots, and that is absolutely something a head coach should be held accountable for.

Ultimately, I think Goodell is going to be wary of coming down too soft.  He's already had to deal with one scandal this season because he didn't come down hard enough on someone.  It might be hard for him to err on the side of sympathy this time around.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.
> 
> Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the Colts are not my team.  And I gotja, win at all cost.
Click to expand...


I was referring to the Ravens.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> Here is the statement from the NFL.  They confirm that they verified the pressure prior to the game and at half time and the pressure changed.  Then then put in properly inflated balls and checked them after the game and they were still good.  Which means, to me, someone definitely adjusted the balls and it was not just temperature.
> 
> Pats fans, don't worry nothing is going to come from this they have circled the wagons.  I am just not sure why they didn't tell Brady to STFU about it, he isn't helping his case.
> 
> NFL issues statement on Deflategate investigation ProFootballTalk
> 
> So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?



Thankfully, what it means to YOU does not matter one bit.


----------



## percysunshine

SwimExpert said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I fail to understand what makes you assume a given starting temperature.  Why do you assume that the balls weren't inflated and checked outdoors, or in an area so ventilated as to be of comparable temperature to the outdoor temperature?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The starting temperature has to be something. Maybe you will share your best guess with us.
> 
> (I am assuming nothing.)
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are assuming.  You're assuming an initial temperature of around 23* Celsius, and a final temperature of 0* Celsius.
Click to expand...


No. I am calculating the pressure drop from 298 degrees Kelvin to 273 degrees Kelvin for an ideal gas.

I may also be implying something about the cognitive awareness of the Commissioner of the National Football League, but that is a seperate issue.


.


----------



## SwimExpert

percysunshine said:


> No. I am calculating the pressure drop from 298 degrees Kelvin to 273 degrees Kelvin for an ideal gas.









   Same thing.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> And the pats should have lost to the Ravens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.
> 
> Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the Colts are not my team.  And I gotja, win at all cost.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was referring to the Ravens.
Click to expand...


neither are the Ravens.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps.  I don't comprehend how the Ravens managed to do as well as they did, considering the nightmare they've dealt with this season in the secondary.  They were half a step away from signing kids off of high school squads.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.
> 
> Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the Colts are not my team.  And I gotja, win at all cost.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was referring to the Ravens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> neither are the Ravens.
Click to expand...


Well, you sure seem awfully pouty about them losing.


----------



## ChrisL

SwimExpert said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> No. I am calculating the pressure drop from 298 degrees Kelvin to 273 degrees Kelvin for an ideal gas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same thing.
Click to expand...


Lol!  Shut up!  You don't know what that poster is talking about!


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the statement from the NFL.  They confirm that they verified the pressure prior to the game and at half time and the pressure changed.  Then then put in properly inflated balls and checked them after the game and they were still good.  Which means, to me, someone definitely adjusted the balls and it was not just temperature.
> 
> Pats fans, don't worry nothing is going to come from this they have circled the wagons.  I am just not sure why they didn't tell Brady to STFU about it, he isn't helping his case.
> 
> NFL issues statement on Deflategate investigation ProFootballTalk
> 
> So the rule was broken, by one team, the question now is, what do they do?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No..The NEXT question is how long this has been going on.
> 
> Then we ask what to do.
Click to expand...


And who else does it.


----------



## BluePhantom

Very interesting article

_*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_











The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics


----------



## Freewill

BluePhantom said:


> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics



I wonder if the spike in 2013 is when they first got rid of Blont.


----------



## Freewill

ChrisL said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't really understand it either other then the Pats do suck and their scheldule did them good.  Pittsburgh lit up the Colts and the Ravens for 6 touchdowns each, so yeah their secondary was suspect.   How things might have been different if Bell had not had his knee taken out by a defensive back.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.
> 
> Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the Colts are not my team.  And I gotja, win at all cost.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was referring to the Ravens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> neither are the Ravens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you sure seem awfully pouty about them losing.
Click to expand...


I am not pouty about them losing, if I were pouty and not just discussing cheating, it would be over the Pats continuing bending and breaking of the rules.


----------



## Freewill

the hilarious thing is that considering their performance in the second half obviously they didn't need to cheat.  Maybe it was just like a baby pacifier and now that they don't need to cheat and they won't but they sure are taking a beating over it.

Or, is this just some sort of BS publicity stunt?


----------



## HUGGY

BluePhantom said:


> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics



WOW!  The second chart is EXTREMELY damning to the Patriots.


----------



## ChrisL

Freewill said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Face facts, baby, your team lost.    The Patriots beat them fair and square.  You can see by watching the game highlights.  And explain those interceptions.  You cannot.  Your stupid deflated balls theory does not add up.
> 
> Watch all the Patriots highlights from the win over the Ravens
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the Colts are not my team.  And I gotja, win at all cost.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I was referring to the Ravens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> neither are the Ravens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, you sure seem awfully pouty about them losing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am not pouty about them losing, if I were pouty and not just discussing cheating, it would be over the Pats continuing bending and breaking of the rules.
Click to expand...


You all are blowing this out of proportion.  At most the footballs were deflated by 1.5 to 2 PSI, which is not much at all.  The science teacher on the link I quoted said that weather and/or use CAN cause a football to lose that much air pressure, and it would not be enough of an amount to be noticeable.  You would still not be able to squish the ball in your hand, so exactly WHAT benefit do you think they would get from that?


----------



## ChrisL

I should apologize for being such a bitch, but you must understand that the Patriots are my team, and I am a loyal fan and will defend them viciously until the end.


----------



## mack20

HUGGY said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WOW!  The second chart is EXTREMELY damning to the Patriots.
Click to expand...


By the way, that dive also roughly coincides with BJGE being their primary back.  Not to mention how much fuss has been made over the years about how quick Belichick is to bench any RB on his team who does fumble.


----------



## ChrisL

This "scandal" is just as stupid as idiotic spy gate.  Are you aware that you can take still PICTURES of the opposing teams during their practices, etc., but NOT videos?


----------



## ChrisL

mack20 said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WOW!  The second chart is EXTREMELY damning to the Patriots.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> By the way, that dive also roughly coincides with BJGE being their primary back.  Not to mention how much fuss has been made over the years about how quick Belichick is to bench any RB on his team who does fumble.
Click to expand...


That is incredibly idiotic.  OF course they bench players who fumble.  DUH!


----------



## ChrisL

mack20 said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WOW!  The second chart is EXTREMELY damning to the Patriots.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> By the way, that dive also roughly coincides with BJGE being their primary back.  Not to mention how much fuss has been made over the years about how quick Belichick is to bench any RB on his team who does fumble.
Click to expand...


They aren't the Cowboys, you know.


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> percysunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> To people like Huggy and Alex...physics *IS* a conspiracy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why include me in this?  I just want a good Super Bowl.  Seattle is not responsible for this situation in any way what so ever.
> 
> I am satisfied that the Patriots will be under so much scrutiny up to and including the game that to a Seahawks players, coaches or us fans it's a non issue.
> 
> As for physics??  Why cool the balls to 32 degrees?  It was raining in New England during their game with the Colts.  SOOoo... OBVIOUSLY the temperature was above freezing.  The reported game time temp in Foxburough/Gillette stadium was in the low 50's.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to Yesterday s and last weeks weather in Boston Massachusetts U.S.A. the temperature at game time was 46 degrees. Re-running the calculation gives a game time ball inflation pressure of 11.8 lbs. Still out of specs.
> 
> The point is, that having a  +/- .5  psi NFL specified pressure range, where typical environmental conditions can easily exceed that range by five times the rule, is stupid.
> 
> Of course, no one in the NFL ever took Physics 101 in college either. Jocks usually major in some weird liberal arts subject. So the omission is understandable.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, so those laws of physics only apply to the Pats balls, all of which were deflated. NOT ONE of the Colts balls were. That was 12 total. That is what is being reported.
> 
> Perhaps the laws of physics ceased to exist on the Colts balls. Perhaps the Colts had magic balls.
> 
> Well, that would have to be the explanation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> .
> 
> The laws of physics apply equally to everyone.
> 
> Infer as you wish from there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I fail to understand what makes you assume a given starting temperature.  Why do you assume that the balls weren't inflated and checked outdoors, or in an area so ventilated as to be of comparable temperature to the outdoor temperature?
Click to expand...


You think the officials sit in a freezing cold room to replicate the game time temperature when they check the balls?  Or take them all out to the fifty yard line in a driving rain storm to do that job?  That's some amusing stuff, Swim!


----------



## Oldstyle

SwimExpert said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have stated I believe they cheated, however proving it is another story.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are suffering from the impossible burden bias.  You seem to be looking for such a burden of proof as to preempt and rule out every fanciful hypothetical that might be imagined.  Your line of reasoning could continue to extend further.  Maybe the used the same gauge both times, but maybe it became damaged during the first half.  Maybe it was originally malfunctioning and after being dropped it started operating properly again.  Maybe it remains damaged and is operating correctly at random moments.
> 
> The Colts reported suspicions of the Pats using deflated balls in November.  The Ravens raised similar concerns after the divisional round.  And when officials tested these suspicions, lo and behold!  The Patriots were caught red handed with deflated balls.
> 
> It's proven already.  The Patriots have been using deflated balls.  I'm sure the league wants to continue digging deeper to get more information and gain a better picture of who said what and when.  But it's been proven that the Patriots were using deflated balls.  Empirically proven, without any doubt whatsoever.  And there is enough evidence to satisfy a court of law that this is not the first time the Patriots have done so.
Click to expand...


Dude it you went into a court of law with the "evidence" that you've provided here the judge would not only laugh you out of the courtroom...they would probably call to see if you actually passed the bar and were licensed to practice law in the first place!


----------



## Oldstyle

At this point the judge would look at you sternly and say "Mr. Swim...my patience is wearing thin...do you have any *evidence* that Tom Brady or Bill Belichick altered those balls prior to the game being played?  If so please produce it.  I'm tired of these unsubstantiated allegations."


----------



## Theowl32

I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant. 

Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor. 

Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING. 

Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny. 

They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve. 

Sorry.


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.



Must feel pretty impressive to be judge, jury, and executioner.


----------



## Theowl32

mack20 said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Must feel pretty impressive to be judge, jury, and executioner.
Click to expand...


Whatever you call it.


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.



So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...

Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!  

The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.

This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?


----------



## ChrisL

mack20 said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Must feel pretty impressive to be judge, jury, and executioner.
Click to expand...


Bunch of self-righteous little crap tards.


----------



## ChrisL

This stuff has been going on forever in the NFL apparently.  The only reason why it's being blown all out of proportion is because it's the well hated Patriots.  Maybe they should come up with some new rules regarding the handling of the balls, but THIS is not why the Pats win games, that's for sure.  

Deflate-gate A look at NFL cheating and gamesmanship through the years - CBS News


----------



## BluePhantom

Freewill said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if the spike in 2013 is when they first got rid of Blont.
Click to expand...



According to the article the 2013 numbers were because of a freak game in Denver where it was ridiculously icy and snowy and they fumbled like 6 times. Without that game there would not be that 2013 peak


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> This stuff has been going on forever in the NFL apparently.  The only reason why it's being blown all out of proportion is because it's the well hated Patriots.  Maybe they should come up with some new rules regarding the handling of the balls, but THIS is not why the Pats win games, that's for sure.
> 
> Deflate-gate A look at NFL cheating and gamesmanship through the years - CBS News




Every team that has lost a close game to the Patriots in rainy or cold weather in the last ten years has a legitimate concern if the Pats were cheating enough to give them a winning advantage.

That's a lot of teams and a hell of a lot of fans.  

A fan that invests thousands of dollars every season in their team should have the right to expect a level playing field.  

If Brady is ordering and getting doctored footballs that give him an unfair advantage there MUST be consequences for breaking the rules.


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
Click to expand...


Then let us not have rules at all! Let baseball players cork bats! Let the pitchers put snot or vaseline or ball sweat on the balls they pitch! Let golfers alter their clubs and allow them to bring in whatever fucking ball they want! 

No, there were rules, the Pats broke the rules. 11 balls were significantly deflated. All of them were Pats balls. 

Yeah, the poor Pats are so fucking picked on by everyone. They were actually caught ILLEGALLY VIDEO TAPING. No, they were not allowed to do it. They were fined and draft picks were taken. I know to tuck rule Pats fans the NFL is just so jealous and they just target the poor Pats, who have not won it all since 2004. 

I wonder what the Saints fans think. Their coach was suspended for a year for something every team does. 

The poor Pats. I think we should let the Pats do whatever they want.


----------



## Papageorgio

Freewill said:


> the hilarious thing is that considering their performance in the second half obviously they didn't need to cheat.  Maybe it was just like a baby pacifier and now that they don't need to cheat and they won't but they sure are taking a beating over it.
> 
> Or, is this just some sort of BS publicity stunt?



Could very well be, I don't put anything the Pats.


----------



## rightwinger

I can't believe that after one of the greatest comebacks in NFL history we spend the week discussing psi in footballs


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the hilarious thing is that considering their performance in the second half obviously they didn't need to cheat.  Maybe it was just like a baby pacifier and now that they don't need to cheat and they won't but they sure are taking a beating over it.
> 
> Or, is this just some sort of BS publicity stunt?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Could very well be, I don't put anything the Pats.
Click to expand...


IF it were a publicity stunt, it would be the NFL organization who was behind orchestrating it, not the Patriots.  The NFL cares most about making money.


----------



## Freewill

Papageorgio said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the hilarious thing is that considering their performance in the second half obviously they didn't need to cheat.  Maybe it was just like a baby pacifier and now that they don't need to cheat and they won't but they sure are taking a beating over it.
> 
> Or, is this just some sort of BS publicity stunt?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Could very well be, I don't put anything the Pats.
Click to expand...


I think we all know that nothing is going to come from this incident.

But, usually the NFL, or anyone else holds off on comments until they are pretty sure of the facts.  The NFL came out pretty soon afterwards so I am thinking they have been looking into this in other games and already know the truth.

Now they are huddled up letting the free publicity run it course and then  they will slap the Pats on the wrist and that will be it.  If they even do that much.

One thing that will come out of it is that the Pats won't cheat with the footballs.


----------



## Freewill

rightwinger said:


> I can't believe that after one of the greatest comebacks in NFL history we spend the week discussing psi in footballs



Great for whom?

Start a thread, call it the incredible luck of the Irish.


----------



## Freewill

Oldstyle said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
Click to expand...


the refs did check the balls at the beginning of the game.  They checked them again at half time.  The article I read indicated that they had planned on doing that before the game started.


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then let us not have rules at all! Let baseball players cork bats! Let the pitchers put snot or vaseline or ball sweat on the balls they pitch! Let golfers alter their clubs and allow them to bring in whatever fucking ball they want!
> 
> No, there were rules, the Pats broke the rules. 11 balls were significantly deflated. All of them were Pats balls.
> 
> Yeah, the poor Pats are so fucking picked on by everyone. They were actually caught ILLEGALLY VIDEO TAPING. No, they were not allowed to do it. They were fined and draft picks were taken. I know to tuck rule Pats fans the NFL is just so jealous and they just target the poor Pats, who have not won it all since 2004.
> 
> I wonder what the Saints fans think. Their coach was suspended for a year for something every team does.
> 
> The poor Pats. I think we should let the Pats do whatever they want.
Click to expand...


Let's revisit "Spygate"...shall we?  The Patriots are singled out for doing something that *multiple* other coaches admitted was common practice.  What idiots like you don't seem to know is that videotaping opponents wasn't illegal at all as long as you do it from certain areas.
*The "Game Operations Manual" states that "no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." The manual states that "all video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."  *The Patriots were singled out and fined $250,000 plus the loss of a first round draft pick because they had someone taping signals from the sideline instead of from an "approved" shooting location.  Even Eric Mangini admitted that what the Patriots were doing didn't give them any advantage. 
"In 2012, nearly five years removed from the incident, former Jets head coach Eric Mangini stated that "I think when you look at the history of success that [the Patriots] had after that incident, it’s pretty obvious that it didn’t play any type of significant role in the victories [the Patriots] had or the success that [the Patriots] had."[14] As of the conclusion of the 2011 NFL season, the Patriots had the best record in the NFL since Spygate, compiling a 48-16 record from 2008-11 (the Pittsburgh Steelers and New Orleans Saints were second best over that span at 45-19).[27]  Mangini was employed by the Patriots as an assistant coach and has three Super Bowl rings with the team.  The Patriots won 69.3 percent of their games while they were presumably taping signals; they have won 75.6 percent of games after the spygate scandal.

The TRUTH is that "Spygate" was as big an overreaction to a minor rules violation as "Deflategate" has become.  Jealous fans who support losing teams have their panties in a bunch because they think the Patriots win by "cheating".  It's laughable.  The Patriots win because they have a better coaching staff than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better quarterback than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better owner than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better TEAM than you do!


----------



## Oldstyle

Freewill said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the refs did check the balls at the beginning of the game.  They checked them again at half time.  The article I read indicated that they had planned on doing that before the game started.
Click to expand...


So they "planned" to check the balls before the game started?  Did they just forget to do so?  Do you have any idea how implausible that article is if that's what they are claiming?


----------



## Freewill

Oldstyle said:


> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the refs did check the balls at the beginning of the game.  They checked them again at half time.  The article I read indicated that they had planned on doing that before the game started.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So they "planned" to check the balls before the game started?  Did they just forget to do so?  Do you have any idea how implausible that article is if that's what they are claiming?
Click to expand...


As required by the NFL rules the balls WERE checked before the game as always.  They are not always check at half time.  That is the difference.

They did it that way to prove without doubt someone doctored the balls.


----------



## BluePhantom

mack20 said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting article
> 
> _*"For whatever reason, the Patriots do have exceptional ball security, especially for an outdoors team. And I mean exceptional..NE's ball security was an outlier to the tune of several standard deviations. The charts are convincing, and the implication is that NE benefitted from under-inflated balls is unmistakable. "*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots Have Incredible Ball Security - Advanced Football Analytics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WOW!  The second chart is EXTREMELY damning to the Patriots.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> By the way, that dive also roughly coincides with BJGE being their primary back.  Not to mention how much fuss has been made over the years about how quick Belichick is to bench any RB on his team who does fumble.
Click to expand...


Perhaps but it's three standard deviations better sustained over six seasons.  One season where they accomplished that would be amazing.....six?!?!?  Impossible to have occurred naturally or by simple player substitution


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then let us not have rules at all! Let baseball players cork bats! Let the pitchers put snot or vaseline or ball sweat on the balls they pitch! Let golfers alter their clubs and allow them to bring in whatever fucking ball they want!
> 
> No, there were rules, the Pats broke the rules. 11 balls were significantly deflated. All of them were Pats balls.
> 
> Yeah, the poor Pats are so fucking picked on by everyone. They were actually caught ILLEGALLY VIDEO TAPING. No, they were not allowed to do it. They were fined and draft picks were taken. I know to tuck rule Pats fans the NFL is just so jealous and they just target the poor Pats, who have not won it all since 2004.
> 
> I wonder what the Saints fans think. Their coach was suspended for a year for something every team does.
> 
> The poor Pats. I think we should let the Pats do whatever they want.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Let's revisit "Spygate"...shall we?  The Patriots are singled out for doing something that *multiple* other coaches admitted was common practice.  What idiots like you don't seem to know is that videotaping opponents wasn't illegal at all as long as you do it from certain areas.
> *The "Game Operations Manual" states that "no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." The manual states that "all video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."  *The Patriots were singled out and fined $250,000 plus the loss of a first round draft pick because they had someone taping signals from the sideline instead of from an "approved" shooting location.  Even Eric Mangini admitted that what the Patriots were doing didn't give them any advantage.
> "In 2012, nearly five years removed from the incident, former Jets head coach Eric Mangini stated that "I think when you look at the history of success that [the Patriots] had after that incident, it’s pretty obvious that it didn’t play any type of significant role in the victories [the Patriots] had or the success that [the Patriots] had."[14] As of the conclusion of the 2011 NFL season, the Patriots had the best record in the NFL since Spygate, compiling a 48-16 record from 2008-11 (the Pittsburgh Steelers and New Orleans Saints were second best over that span at 45-19).[27]  Mangini was employed by the Patriots as an assistant coach and has three Super Bowl rings with the team.  The Patriots won 69.3 percent of their games while they were presumably taping signals; they have won 75.6 percent of games after the spygate scandal.
> 
> The TRUTH is that "Spygate" was as big an overreaction to a minor rules violation as "Deflategate" has become.  Jealous fans who support losing teams have their panties in a bunch because they think the Patriots win by "cheating".  It's laughable.  The Patriots win because they have a better coaching staff than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better quarterback than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better owner than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better TEAM than you do!
Click to expand...


Waaaaaa! People were just jealous!

That is it? Fucking pats fans.

We will never know the real impact and sure as shit do not know the full story. The tapes were burned. Either way they violated the rules and they knowingly did it. You can sit there as a biased pats fan with your biased opinions and pretend the Patriots should be allowed to just illegally video tape teams walk troughs, illegally fuck with the footballs, or just be able to do whatever the fuck they want.

What the fuck ever. The pats have had 15 years of beneficial calls, starting with the fucking "tuck rule." Brady's little head or little knees cannot be grazed without 10 yellow flags being thrown.

Fuck pats fans thinking their spoiled team ought to be allowed to violate rules just because they are "minor."


----------



## Oldstyle

Freewill said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the refs did check the balls at the beginning of the game.  They checked them again at half time.  The article I read indicated that they had planned on doing that before the game started.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So they "planned" to check the balls before the game started?  Did they just forget to do so?  Do you have any idea how implausible that article is if that's what they are claiming?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> As required by the NFL rules the balls WERE checked before the game as always.  They are not always check at half time.  That is the difference.
> 
> They did it that way to prove without doubt someone doctored the balls.
Click to expand...


So you're claiming that even though they suspected that the Patriots were "doctoring" the balls...they let them play an entire half of football in a game that would determine who would go to the Super Bowl with balls that were illegal?  Why would NFL officials do THAT to the Indianapolis Colts?  It would be akin to an umpire thinking that a pitcher in game 7 of a championship game was doctoring the ball but letting him continue doing so until the 5th inning before taking the ball from him.  I'm sorry but that's *RIDICULOUS!!!*


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then let us not have rules at all! Let baseball players cork bats! Let the pitchers put snot or vaseline or ball sweat on the balls they pitch! Let golfers alter their clubs and allow them to bring in whatever fucking ball they want!
> 
> No, there were rules, the Pats broke the rules. 11 balls were significantly deflated. All of them were Pats balls.
> 
> Yeah, the poor Pats are so fucking picked on by everyone. They were actually caught ILLEGALLY VIDEO TAPING. No, they were not allowed to do it. They were fined and draft picks were taken. I know to tuck rule Pats fans the NFL is just so jealous and they just target the poor Pats, who have not won it all since 2004.
> 
> I wonder what the Saints fans think. Their coach was suspended for a year for something every team does.
> 
> The poor Pats. I think we should let the Pats do whatever they want.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Let's revisit "Spygate"...shall we?  The Patriots are singled out for doing something that *multiple* other coaches admitted was common practice.  What idiots like you don't seem to know is that videotaping opponents wasn't illegal at all as long as you do it from certain areas.
> *The "Game Operations Manual" states that "no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." The manual states that "all video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."  *The Patriots were singled out and fined $250,000 plus the loss of a first round draft pick because they had someone taping signals from the sideline instead of from an "approved" shooting location.  Even Eric Mangini admitted that what the Patriots were doing didn't give them any advantage.
> "In 2012, nearly five years removed from the incident, former Jets head coach Eric Mangini stated that "I think when you look at the history of success that [the Patriots] had after that incident, it’s pretty obvious that it didn’t play any type of significant role in the victories [the Patriots] had or the success that [the Patriots] had."[14] As of the conclusion of the 2011 NFL season, the Patriots had the best record in the NFL since Spygate, compiling a 48-16 record from 2008-11 (the Pittsburgh Steelers and New Orleans Saints were second best over that span at 45-19).[27]  Mangini was employed by the Patriots as an assistant coach and has three Super Bowl rings with the team.  The Patriots won 69.3 percent of their games while they were presumably taping signals; they have won 75.6 percent of games after the spygate scandal.
> 
> The TRUTH is that "Spygate" was as big an overreaction to a minor rules violation as "Deflategate" has become.  Jealous fans who support losing teams have their panties in a bunch because they think the Patriots win by "cheating".  It's laughable.  The Patriots win because they have a better coaching staff than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better quarterback than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better owner than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better TEAM than you do!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Waaaaaa! People were just jealous!
> 
> That is it? Fucking pats fans.
> 
> We will never know the real impact and sure as shit do not know the full story. The tapes were burned. Either way they violated the rules and they knowingly did it. You can sit there as a biases pats fan with your biased opinions and pretend the Patriots should be allowed to just illegally video tape teams walk troughs, illegally fuck with the footballs, or just be able whatever the fuck they want.
> 
> What the fuck ever. The pats have had 15 years of beneficial calls, starting with the fucking "tuck rule." Brady's little head or little knees cannot be grazed without 10 yellow flags being thrown.
> 
> Fuck pats fans thinking their spoiled team ought to be allowed to violate rules just because they are "minor."
Click to expand...


Man, you are foaming at the mouth, Dude!  Read that post.  You're so delusional about the entire subject of the Patriots that it's scary.  The tapes were "burned" at the request of the NFL...it wasn't something the Patriots requested.  Will you at least admit that taping opposing defensive signals was in no way illegal?  That the Patriots were fined only because they weren't taping them in the "approved" manner?  That to fine a team's coach a quarter of a million dollars and to take away a first round draft pick is such a ridiculously harsh penalty for a such a minor offense as to be farce?

No, you'll never do that because you hate the Patriots so much that you want them thrown out of the league.  Why?  Because that's the only way that the shitty team YOU support has a chance of winning.


----------



## BluePhantom

I know what happened....the gravitational pull of the moon was centered right over the Patriots' footballs and 11 of their fill holes were all pointing up while the other ball the the Colts' ball were all pointing down.  Thus the moon's gravity sucked 2 psi of air from 11 of the balls while the other balls were not affected for lack of a place for the air to escape.  There it is....BLAME MOTHER MOON!!!!


----------



## hangover

If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.


----------



## BluePhantom

hangover said:


> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.



Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"


----------



## Papageorgio

Freewill said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freewill said:
> 
> 
> 
> the hilarious thing is that considering their performance in the second half obviously they didn't need to cheat.  Maybe it was just like a baby pacifier and now that they don't need to cheat and they won't but they sure are taking a beating over it.
> 
> Or, is this just some sort of BS publicity stunt?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Could very well be, I don't put anything the Pats.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think we all know that nothing is going to come from this incident.
> 
> But, usually the NFL, or anyone else holds off on comments until they are pretty sure of the facts.  The NFL came out pretty soon afterwards so I am thinking they have been looking into this in other games and already know the truth.
> 
> Now they are huddled up letting the free publicity run it course and then  they will slap the Pats on the wrist and that will be it.  If they even do that much.
> 
> One thing that will come out of it is that the Pats won't cheat with the footballs.
Click to expand...



That's the nice thing about Seattle and New England, you never know what either team will do to push the limits or outright cheat.


----------



## Jroc

BluePhantom said:


> I know what happened....the gravitational pull of the moon was centered right over the Patriots' footballs and 11 of their fill holes were all pointing up while the other ball the the Colts' ball were all pointing down.  Thus the moon's gravity sucked 2 psi of air from 11 of the balls while the other balls were not affected for lack of a place for the air to escape.  There it is....BLAME MOTHER MOON!!!!




45 -7  I'm blaming "mother moon"


----------



## hangover

BluePhantom said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"
Click to expand...

So something that doesn't effect the outcome of the game is cheating, but something that DOES effect the outcome of a game ISN'T cheating. You must be the ref that picked up the flag in the Detroit/Dallas game.


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"
Click to expand...


Not much difference. If you hold a player, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Testing positive for PEDs there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Having a football inflated outside the specs of the rule book, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. 

The fine is $25,000, per ball that comes to $275,000 fine and it could be more.


----------



## mack20

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if anyone knows the first time this was brought to attention of the NFL was after the first Colts Pats game this year. Brady threw two ints and the equipment manager had access to both of those balls. He saw the balls were under pressure and it was significant.
> 
> Hence, the reasons why the refs checked the ball pressure are half time of the championship game. The first game was in a dome and the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Those of you bringing up that the Pats won the game continue to use a fallacy. That is totally irrelevant. No one mentions who won a game if a baseball player is caught corking their bat or if a pitcher doctors the baseball. It is not part of the conversation. It is all about the fact that they were caught altering the official ball, outside of regulations which is in essence......CHEATING.
> 
> Sorry, this is not a gray area. This is black and white. Cheating is cheating. I know it is hard to hear for the Pats fans, but that is what it is. Now, spare us with the temperature, or there is no proof they did anything (11 balls were way under and that is not a debate and all of the balls altered were only Pats balls). There is proof someone did something,just we do not know who. Belichick and Brady know this, and have been told this. They will deny deny deny.
> 
> They will get away with it as a result. However, the sporting world will know. They will have the reputation they deserve.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me see if I'm following your non "gray area" here, Owl...
> 
> Supposedly the Colts brought to the attention of the NFL that the Patriots were cheating by using underinflated balls...yet the officials waited until halftime to check the balls that the Patriots were using?  Why would they do that?  That makes absolutely ZERO sense!  If a team went to the NFL with this it's inconceivable that the NFL would do nothing about it until the second half of a playoff game.  I keep hearing all these claims that someone went to the NFL about this earlier and yet it's NEVER substantiated!
> 
> The same is with the story that the officials investigated because the Colts defensive back who intercepted Brady thought the ball was soft.  That player has subsequently come out and said he did not make any such claim.  So who's making up all of these claims from "un-named sources"?  Is the media in such a lather to "break" this story that they're running with a guy who heard a guy who heard it from another guy as their "proof"?  If so that's pretty pathetic.
> 
> This whole "scandal" is a joke!  The Patriots supposedly have this huge advantage of playing with a softer ball in the first half but the score is 17 to 7 at the end of the second quarter and it's still anyone's game!  So the officials test the Patriot's balls...find them too soft...inflate them and then the Patriots proceed to steamroll the Colts 28 to 0 in the second half!  So where was the huge advantage?  Was Tom Brady suddenly unable to throw balls to his receivers?  Were they suddenly unable to catch them?  DID YOU MORONS EVEN WATCH THAT GAME?  I mean seriously...what the hell is this all about?  Do you hate the Patriots that much that you're seriously calling for Tom Brady to be suspended from the Super Bowl?  Are you really that far around the bend on this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then let us not have rules at all! Let baseball players cork bats! Let the pitchers put snot or vaseline or ball sweat on the balls they pitch! Let golfers alter their clubs and allow them to bring in whatever fucking ball they want!
> 
> No, there were rules, the Pats broke the rules. 11 balls were significantly deflated. All of them were Pats balls.
> 
> Yeah, the poor Pats are so fucking picked on by everyone. They were actually caught ILLEGALLY VIDEO TAPING. No, they were not allowed to do it. They were fined and draft picks were taken. I know to tuck rule Pats fans the NFL is just so jealous and they just target the poor Pats, who have not won it all since 2004.
> 
> I wonder what the Saints fans think. Their coach was suspended for a year for something every team does.
> 
> The poor Pats. I think we should let the Pats do whatever they want.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Let's revisit "Spygate"...shall we?  The Patriots are singled out for doing something that *multiple* other coaches admitted was common practice.  What idiots like you don't seem to know is that videotaping opponents wasn't illegal at all as long as you do it from certain areas.
> *The "Game Operations Manual" states that "no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." The manual states that "all video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."  *The Patriots were singled out and fined $250,000 plus the loss of a first round draft pick because they had someone taping signals from the sideline instead of from an "approved" shooting location.  Even Eric Mangini admitted that what the Patriots were doing didn't give them any advantage.
> "In 2012, nearly five years removed from the incident, former Jets head coach Eric Mangini stated that "I think when you look at the history of success that [the Patriots] had after that incident, it’s pretty obvious that it didn’t play any type of significant role in the victories [the Patriots] had or the success that [the Patriots] had."[14] As of the conclusion of the 2011 NFL season, the Patriots had the best record in the NFL since Spygate, compiling a 48-16 record from 2008-11 (the Pittsburgh Steelers and New Orleans Saints were second best over that span at 45-19).[27]  Mangini was employed by the Patriots as an assistant coach and has three Super Bowl rings with the team.  The Patriots won 69.3 percent of their games while they were presumably taping signals; they have won 75.6 percent of games after the spygate scandal.
> 
> The TRUTH is that "Spygate" was as big an overreaction to a minor rules violation as "Deflategate" has become.  Jealous fans who support losing teams have their panties in a bunch because they think the Patriots win by "cheating".  It's laughable.  The Patriots win because they have a better coaching staff than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better quarterback than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better owner than you do!  The Patriots win because they have a better TEAM than you do!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Waaaaaa! People were just jealous!
> 
> That is it? Fucking pats fans.
> 
> We will never know the real impact and sure as shit do not know t full story. The tapes were burned. Either way they violated the rules and they knowingly did it. You can sit there as a biased pats fan with your biased opinions and pretend the Patriots should be allowed to just illegally video tape teams walk troughs, illegally fuck with the footballs, or just be able to do whatever the fuck they want.
> 
> What the fuck ever. The pats have had 15 years of beneficial calls, starting with the fucking "tuck rule." Brady's little head or little knees cannot be grazed without 10 yellow flags being thrown.
> 
> Fuck pats fans thinking their spoiled team ought to be allowed to violate rules just because they are "minor."
Click to expand...


Now we're starting to see the depths of your hatred for the Pats.  I'd like to make a few points:

1. The tapes were also played on a loop in front of assembled media outlets prior to a NFL press conference.  It's not as if they never saw the light of day. 

2. The Patriots have always acknowledged that they taped from the sideline.  They never tried to hide their camera guy.  Belichick has always maintained that he believed he was abiding by the letter of the rule, the NFL disagreed.  It wasn't nearly as shadowy cabal-esque on the part of the Pats as people often believe. 

3. What walk through was taped?

4. You do know that the tuck rule was called properly, right?  It was a stupid rule, but it was called correctly. Also, it was called against the Patriots when they played the Jets earlier that same season. 

5. Ah yes, the Brady Rule.  Which of course you know is actually the Palmer Rule because the NFL instituted it after the 2006 season when Palmer was knocked out of a playoff game with a destroyed knee, right?  And Brady didn't get injured until the first game of the 2008 season?

6. How would you define Brady getting favorable called regarding players getting to him?  An analysis of Brady's 2010 season showed that he got 0.16 roughing the passer calls for every 100 attempts.  That's one call in every 625 attempts.  By comparison, that season Jay Cutler got 1.28 RTP calls for every 100 attempts.


----------



## mack20

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not much difference. If you hold a player, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Testing positive for PEDs there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Having a football inflated outside the specs of the rule book, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game.
> 
> The fine is $25,000, per ball that comes to $275,000 fine and it could be more.
Click to expand...


I'm not positive, but the fine may actually be a straight $25k, not $25k per ball.  Which would indict just how minor this infraction has traditionally been before this week.  Marshawn Lynch was just fined $20k for making an obscene gesture (grabbing his crotch).  If the fine for tampering with footballs is in fact only $5k more than that, wouldn't it possibly follow that this entire thing has been overblown to an absolutely absurd level?


----------



## BluePhantom

mack20 said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not much difference. If you hold a player, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Testing positive for PEDs there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Having a football inflated outside the specs of the rule book, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game.
> 
> The fine is $25,000, per ball that comes to $275,000 fine and it could be more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not positive, but the fine may actually be a straight $25k, not $25k per ball.  Which would indict just how minor this infraction has traditionally been before this week.  Marshawn Lynch was just fined $20k for making an obscene gesture (grabbing his crotch).  If the fine for tampering with footballs is in fact only $5k more than that, wouldn't it possibly follow that this entire thing has been overblown to an absolutely absurd level?
Click to expand...


It's "not limited to" $25,000. Goodell can impose whatever he wants


----------



## Oldstyle

If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.


----------



## BluePhantom

Oldstyle said:


> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.




As a Seahawks fan I don't want either of them suspended for the Super Bowl simply because I don't want to give Patriots fans (or anyone else) any excuses.  I feel confident Seattle will win this game and we don't need the help...frankly it pisses me off as a fan that New England's actions could tarnish Seattle's legacy if a suspension of that nature were to take place (which I doubt it will).  That being said, if it does happen New England has no one to blame but themselves.  If a player were to test positive for PEDs today they would be suspended for the Super Bowl (although it would be challenged and they would be allowed to play pending appeal) and it would be the fault of the player.

Now that I think of it even if the league does suspend Brady or Belichick, they will appeal and they will be allowed to participate pending that appeal...in other words they will be there for the game.  Just depends on what message the NFL wants to send, but I don't see any way either of them are not participating in the Super Bowl


----------



## hangover

BluePhantom said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As a Seahawks fan I don't want either of them suspended for the Super Bowl simply because I don't want to give Patriots fans (or anyone else) any excuses.  I feel confident Seattle will win this game and we don't need the help...frankly it pisses me off as a fan that New England's actions could tarnish Seattle's legacy if a suspension of that nature were to take place (which I doubt it will).  That being said, if it does happen New England has no one to blame but themselves.  If a player were to test positive for PEDs today they would be suspended for the Super Bowl (although it would be challenged and they would be allowed to play pending appeal) and it would be the fault of the player.
> 
> Now that I think of it even if the league does suspend Brady or Belichick, they will appeal and they will be allowed to participate pending that appeal...in other words they will be there for the game.  Just depends on what message the NFL wants to send, but I don't see any way either of them are not participating in the Super Bowl
Click to expand...

I'd love to see Brady and Belicheck suspended for the SB, and then the rest of the team refuse to play. That would be the end of the NFL, because they'd never get another dime from the sponsors.


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.



Oh, there you go. Make it like the NHL.Why not make it like baseball when a player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher who doctors the ball, or like a golfer who is DQ'd. 

Are the tuck rule Pats fans still thinking the Patriots should be allowed to break rules and those who think they should not be allowed are Patriot haters.

Hilarious.


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, there you go. Make it like the NHL.Why not make it like baseball when a player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher who doctors the ball, or like a golfer who is DQ'd.
> 
> Are the tuck rule Pats fans still thinking the Patriots should be allowed to break rules and those who think they should not be allowed are Patriot haters.
> 
> Hilarious.
Click to expand...


I suppose that now you're going to tell me that the Patriots broke the rules in the "Tuck Game"?  You're so scarily delusional about the Patriots that it's not even funny, Dude!  Full disclosure time...what team is it that you root for that has you so apoplectic about the Patriots?


----------



## Oldstyle

The Patriots lost their first round draft choice and Bill Belichick lost a quarter of a million dollars because they videotaped the opposing team's defensive signals from the field instead of from above the field...but you don't think they were punished enough?  Seriously, Dude...you need to stop sticking needles in your Tom Brady and Bill Belichick voodoo dolls and go get a freaking life!


----------



## hangover

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, there you go. Make it like the NHL.Why not make it like baseball when a player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher who doctors the ball, or like a golfer who is DQ'd.
> 
> Are the tuck rule Pats fans still thinking the Patriots should be allowed to break rules and those who think they should not be allowed are Patriot haters.
> 
> Hilarious.
Click to expand...

The best part about the SB is whoever wins, IT'S GOING TO BE FROM A "LIBERAL" state. NA NA NA NA NA!


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, there you go. Make it like the NHL.Why not make it like baseball when a player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher who doctors the ball, or like a golfer who is DQ'd.
> 
> Are the tuck rule Pats fans still thinking the Patriots should be allowed to break rules and those who think they should not be allowed are Patriot haters.
> 
> Hilarious.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I suppose that now you're going to tell me that the Patriots broke the rules in the "Tuck Game"?  You're so scarily delusional about the Patriots that it's not even funny, Dude!  Full disclosure time...what team is it that you root for that has you so apoplectic about the Patriots?
Click to expand...



Wow.

Waaaaaaa!  waaaaaa!

The pats or so picked on.


----------



## BluePhantom

Oldstyle said:


> The Patriots lost their first round draft choice and Bill Belichick lost a quarter of a million dollars because they videotaped the opposing team's defensive signals from the field instead of from above the field...but you don't think they were punished enough?  Seriously, Dude...you need to stop sticking needles in your Tom Brady and Bill Belichick voodoo dolls and go get a freaking life!



I think the Patriots would be perfectly fine sacrificing a first round pick to win a Super Bowl. Pfft....big deal


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you play in the NHL and get caught with a stick that has an illegal amount of curve in it your team is given a two minute minor.  Someone like Owl would demand that the player be banned from the playoffs because of it.  Why?  Because he HATES the Patriots!  All rationality has gone right out the window on this issue.  Seriously...it's the "biggest" scandal I've ever seen over the "smallest" issue.  If you REALLY think this is a problem make it just like the NHL...if you think the opposing team is using an illegal ball...you challenge them on it and if it is indeed illegal the officials hit them with a fifteen yard penalty.  That's it.  This talk by some of suspending Brady from the Super Bowl or suspending Belichick for the season for this miniscule violation is SO ridiculous that you've literally got me laughing at some of the posts I'm seeing here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, there you go. Make it like the NHL.Why not make it like baseball when a player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher who doctors the ball, or like a golfer who is DQ'd.
> 
> Are the tuck rule Pats fans still thinking the Patriots should be allowed to break rules and those who think they should not be allowed are Patriot haters.
> 
> Hilarious.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I suppose that now you're going to tell me that the Patriots broke the rules in the "Tuck Game"?  You're so scarily delusional about the Patriots that it's not even funny, Dude!  Full disclosure time...what team is it that you root for that has you so apoplectic about the Patriots?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Wow.
> 
> Waaaaaaa!  waaaaaa!
> 
> The pats or so picked on.
Click to expand...


The only person crying here is you!  You've been whining for the harshest penalties possible since this whole joke started.  

So did you want to admit which team it is you're a fan of?  Or did you want to duck that answer completely?


----------



## Oldstyle

BluePhantom said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Patriots lost their first round draft choice and Bill Belichick lost a quarter of a million dollars because they videotaped the opposing team's defensive signals from the field instead of from above the field...but you don't think they were punished enough?  Seriously, Dude...you need to stop sticking needles in your Tom Brady and Bill Belichick voodoo dolls and go get a freaking life!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Patriots would be perfectly fine sacrificing a first round pick to win a Super Bowl. Pfft....big deal
Click to expand...


Since Bill Belichick has a long history of trading his first round draft picks for future draft picks it probably wouldn't affect them as badly as most teams.  If that WAS the penalty for this however it would be ridiculous...as were the penalties for "Spygate".


----------



## JimBowie1958

For all the Patriots in this great land.

Don't let the fuckers know you're distracted


----------



## BluePhantom

Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".

On the question of physics I will take his word.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

BluePhantom said:


> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.



Yeah sure.  Lol!  My brother the rocket scientist says your brother is wrong.    Your stupid anecdotes don't mean anything.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.



I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not much difference. If you hold a player, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Testing positive for PEDs there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game. Having a football inflated outside the specs of the rule book, there is a penalty for violating the rules of the game.
> 
> The fine is $25,000, per ball that comes to $275,000 fine and it could be more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not positive, but the fine may actually be a straight $25k, not $25k per ball.  Which would indict just how minor this infraction has traditionally been before this week.  Marshawn Lynch was just fined $20k for making an obscene gesture (grabbing his crotch).  If the fine for tampering with footballs is in fact only $5k more than that, wouldn't it possibly follow that this entire thing has been overblown to an absolutely absurd level?
Click to expand...


I think it is much ado about nothing however it plays into Belichick's hand. The chip on the shoulder, show the world, and blah, blah, blah. If it works, not a bad gamble.


----------



## HUGGY

9/11 inside job said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
Click to expand...


Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
Click to expand...

Cant believe this under inflated football thing is still going on. Anyone with half a brain, who is honest with themselves, knows this would be a trivial issue if it wasn't the Patriots


----------



## HUGGY

Every minute Brady, Belichick and the Patriots have to spend on this investigation and answering all the questions and preparing to answer all the questions is time they won't have to prepare for playing the Seahawks.

Preparation is paramount in a game of this magnitude.

If for no other reason the Hawks have a huge advantage in the time available to prepare for playing the actual game. 

If this media "Inflate-Gate" blitz keeps going through next week I would say that Seattle will be at least TWICE as prepared as New England just because of the media interference.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> Every minute Brady, Belichick and the Patriots have to spend on this investigation and answering all the questions and preparing to answer all the questions is time they won't have to prepare for playing the Seahawks.
> 
> Preparation is paramount in a game of this magnitude.
> 
> If for no other reason the Hawks have a huge advantage in the time available tpared for playing the actual game than get ready for the Patriots.
> 
> If this media "Inflate-Gate" blitz keeps going through next week I would say that Seattle will be at least TWICE as prepared as New England just because of the media interference.



Ha-ha!  Some might say that's cheating.


----------



## Jroc

HUGGY said:


> Every minute Brady, Belichick and the Patriots have to spend on this investigation and answering all the questions and preparing to answer all the questions is time they won't have to prepare for playing the Seahawks.
> 
> Preparation is paramount in a game of this magnitude.
> 
> If for no other reason the Hawks have a huge advantage in the time available to prepare for playing the actual game than get ready for the Patriots.
> 
> If this media "Inflate-Gate" blitz keeps going through next week I would say that Seattle will be at least TWICE as prepared as New England just because of the media interference.




Belichick will be prepared no doubt about that


----------



## GWV5903

This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it. 

Why is this an issue?


----------



## HUGGY

GWV5903 said:


> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?



You think the media attention is because the Colts lost?

It is an issue because the footballs were altered.  The fact that eleven were out of regulation and one ball was IN regulation is proof that an important rule had been violated.

The rule is there for a reason.  The reason is so both teams are playing with the same equipment.  It's called a level playing field.  Most people would argue that it is a fair rule.  Otherwise it would not be a rule would it.

The discovery of the Patriot cheating just happened to co-inside with the Colts game.  

Do you think the Patriots can break the rules without repercussion?


----------



## ChrisL

Jroc said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Every minute Brady, Belichick and the Patriots have to spend on this investigation and answering all the questions and preparing to answer all the questions is time they won't have to prepare for playing the Seahawks.
> 
> Preparation is paramount in a game of this magnitude.
> 
> If for no other reason the Hawks have a huge advantage in the time available to prepare for playing the actual game than get ready for the Patriots.
> 
> If this media "Inflate-Gate" blitz keeps going through next week I would say that Seattle will be at least TWICE as prepared as New England just because of the media interference.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Belichick will be prepared no doubt about that
Click to expand...


I was thinking that the Pats scored a LOT during that game.  Maybe all the celebrating and spiking the ball in the end zone deflated the balls.  Of course the Colts balls were not being used as much, so theirs were not as deflated.  Lol.  It's a possibility!


----------



## Valerie

*Bill Belichick After Further Review of Deflategate Charges: *
*'We Did Everything As Right As We Could Do It'*
_
"At no time was there any intent whatsoever to try to compromise the integrity of the game, or to gain an advantage," a defiant Belichick said. "Quite the opposite. We feel like we followed the rules of the game to the letter, in our preparations, in our procedures, alright, and in the way that we handle every game that we competitively played in as it relates to this matter, alright. 


"We try to do everything right. We err on the side of caution. It's been that way now for many years. Anything that's close, we stay as far away from the line as we can, and in this case I can say that we are – as far as I know and everything that I can do – we did everything as right as we could do it. And we welcome the league's investigation in this matter. I think there are a number of things that need to be looked into on a number of levels but that's not for this conversation. I'm sure that will be taken up at another point in time.”


Belichick said he wanted to take this opportunity to share information on what the team has been looking into the past week as it relates to this controversy._

_..._

_"I feel like this is important because there have been questions raised and I believe now 100 percent that I have personally, and we as an organization, have absolutely followed every rule to the letter. I just feel that on behalf of everyone in the organization, everyone that’s involved in this organization, that we need to say something."
_

Bill Belichick After Further Review of Deflategate Charges We Did Everything As Right As We Could Do It - Extra Points - Boston.com
_
_


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
Click to expand...


Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"

What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!


----------



## JimBowie1958

BluePhantom said:


> In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%.
> .



Yeah, makes TOTAL sense.


----------



## JimBowie1958

Oldstyle said:


> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"



Or the footballs were taken in from the cold at half-time, the Pats were checked first and as the footballs warmed up to the indoors room temps, they tested less and less under pressure till the last one passed. And the Colts footballs all passed because the footballs had all warmed up by then.

Does anyone know what the air temperature was in the room and also for the footballs when the pressure was checked? There is no NFL standard for these two variables.



Oldstyle said:


> What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!



I agree on all three claims. Brady, Belichek and Kraft explain a hell of a lot more than some slightly underinflated footballs used only in the first half. The Colts got totally shut down in the second half, 28-0 and all the Pats footballs were spec.


----------



## BluePhantom

Oldstyle said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!
Click to expand...



They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.


----------



## BluePhantom

ChrisL said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
Click to expand...



You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".

His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.

We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.

The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.

Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.

Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.

So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.

It's really not that tough


----------



## BluePhantom

JimBowie1958 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or the footballs were taken in from the cold at half-time, the Pats were checked first and as the footballs warmed up to the indoors room temps, they tested less and less under pressure till the last one passed. And the Colts footballs all passed because the footballs had all warmed up by then.
> 
> Does anyone know what the air temperature was in the room and also for the footballs when the pressure was checked? There is no NFL standard for these two variables.
Click to expand...



Uh huh....and then the moon's gravity centered over 11 of the balls but not the 12th enhancing the effect, and the tidal forces were pulling on each end of the balls making it even worse, and then there was a CME that disrupted the Earth's magnetic field in such a way that those 11 balls lost a couple more psi....dude....just stop it.

Someone let the air out of the balls.  Good Lord.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
Click to expand...


You are so full of it.    Get a life, will you?


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
Click to expand...


What an idiot you must be to think anyone is buying your bogus lies.  You cannot duplicate the conditions that were present at the stadium during game time and everything that may or may not have been done with those balls.  You are an idiot.

Do you even LIVE in New England?  Do you know anything about how rapidly the temperatures change around here?  Do you know anything at all?  

YOU said if we needed to SEE the math, you would provide it.  Obviously, you are a liar and you lack integrity, probably more so than the Patriots.


----------



## ChrisL

^^^

YOU conducted experiments.  Pfft.  What a douche!


----------



## Theowl32

So we are going to go with the Patriots balls were magic balls? I guess those balls were bought from the same place Jack bought his beanstalk beans. 

The laws of physics apparently ceased to exist on the Colts balls. 







Like I said, just let the poor picked on Pats do whatever they want. 

After all, here is Goodell partying with Kraft the night before the AFCCG. Notice, the call girl hovering over Kraft?


----------



## HUGGY

Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.

No matter what science lecture Billy Boi thinks he is presenting and all of the glib movie references he dredges up the fact he can't get around is that the colt's balls were all within regulation and 11 out of 12 Patriots balls were 10% out of specs.  That may not seem like a lot but it is cheating plain and simple.


----------



## JimBowie1958

BluePhantom said:


> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.



*Link or its nothing but bullshit.*


----------



## HUGGY

JimBowie1958 said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Link or its nothing but bullshit.*
Click to expand...


I don't think he needs to link.

I give him credit points for an excellent presentation.  His graphs were far more believable than Belichick's science class.


----------



## JimBowie1958

BluePhantom said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or the footballs were taken in from the cold at half-time, the Pats were checked first and as the footballs warmed up to the indoors room temps, they tested less and less under pressure till the last one passed. And the Colts footballs all passed because the footballs had all warmed up by then.
> 
> Does anyone know what the air temperature was in the room and also for the footballs when the pressure was checked? There is no NFL standard for these two variables.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh huh....and then the moon's gravity centered over 11 of the balls but not the 12th enhancing the effect, and the tidal forces were pulling on each end of the balls making it even worse, and then there was a CME that disrupted the Earth's magnetic field in such a way that those 11 balls lost a couple more psi....dude....just stop it.
> 
> Someone let the air out of the balls.  Good Lord.
Click to expand...


Moron, air temperature affects the air pressure of the footballs.

Fuck, how do you people let jealousy shut down your brain so badly?


----------



## JimBowie1958

HUGGY said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Link or its nothing but bullshit.*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think he needs to link.
> 
> I give him cre
Click to expand...


Lol, who the fuck are you to say he needs no links?

Eat shit, mother fucker.


----------



## JimBowie1958

HUGGY said:


> Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.



Dude, air temperature affects air pressure and vice versa. That is how refrigeration works.

And it isn't magic, it is science, dick.


----------



## JimBowie1958

HUGGY said:


> I give him credit points for an excellent presentation.  His graphs were far more believable than Belichick's science class.



Then you are an idiot.


----------



## HUGGY

JimBowie1958 said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or the footballs were taken in from the cold at half-time, the Pats were checked first and as the footballs warmed up to the indoors room temps, they tested less and less under pressure till the last one passed. And the Colts footballs all passed because the footballs had all warmed up by then.
> 
> Does anyone know what the air temperature was in the room and also for the footballs when the pressure was checked? There is no NFL standard for these two variables.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh huh....and then the moon's gravity centered over 11 of the balls but not the 12th enhancing the effect, and the tidal forces were pulling on each end of the balls making it even worse, and then there was a CME that disrupted the Earth's magnetic field in such a way that those 11 balls lost a couple more psi....dude....just stop it.
> 
> Someone let the air out of the balls.  Good Lord.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Moron, air temperature affects the air pressure of the footballs*.
> 
> Fuck, how do you people let jealousy shut down your brain so badly?
Click to expand...


*Of course it does.*..Just only Patriots footballs.  The Colts footballs are immune to the New England laws of physics.


----------



## HUGGY

When Bill Nie the science guy says it then I'll believe it.

Till then ....


----------



## HUGGY

I'm just an idiot helping my team by keeping the conversation going.

Can't hurt.











The Seahawks.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.
> 
> No matter what science lecture Billy Boi thinks he is presenting and all of the glib movie references he dredges up the fact he can't get around is that the colt's balls were all within regulation and 11 out of 12 Patriots balls were 10% out of specs.  That may not seem like a lot but it is cheating plain and simple.



You are forgetting.  The Colts sucked and weren't on offense NEARLY as much as the Pats, and there was NO celebrating by spiking balls in the end zone by the Colts.  The amount of times you handle your balls plays a role, as well as 300-pound men handling them.  They are MUCH stronger than you and your silly little science geek friend.


----------



## ChrisL

BluePhantom said:


> JimBowie1958 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or the footballs were taken in from the cold at half-time, the Pats were checked first and as the footballs warmed up to the indoors room temps, they tested less and less under pressure till the last one passed. And the Colts footballs all passed because the footballs had all warmed up by then.
> 
> Does anyone know what the air temperature was in the room and also for the footballs when the pressure was checked? There is no NFL standard for these two variables.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Uh huh....and then the moon's gravity centered over 11 of the balls but not the 12th enhancing the effect, and the tidal forces were pulling on each end of the balls making it even worse, and then there was a CME that disrupted the Earth's magnetic field in such a way that those 11 balls lost a couple more psi....dude....just stop it.
> 
> Someone let the air out of the balls.  Good Lord.
Click to expand...


You are stupid.  Did you ever think for a second that MAYBE they hadn't yet USED the 12th ball?  Maybe they had used the other 11?  You have absolutely NO common sense, and I think it is quite clear that you WANT the Patriots to be cheaters.  You are a hater, but that's fine because I don't like or respect you much anyway.


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
Click to expand...


Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it. 

I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.

This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
Click to expand...


That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.


----------



## Papageorgio

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
Click to expand...


It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
Click to expand...


It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.


----------



## ChrisL

Here is some REAL science, not some internet hack . . . 

But here’s a poster on Reddit, supposedly a local science teacher, and his formula sounds logical to even the most removed student of Newton, describing how the elements that night may have played a role. Honestly, it’s the best breakdown I’ve seen yet this week explaining how this whole mess may have come to fruition.

Given the conditions of the game, a ball which meets specifications in the locker room could easily lose enough pressure to be considered under-inflated. Some math:- Guy-Lussac’s Law describes the relationship between the pressure of a confined ideal gas and its temperature. For the sake of argument, we will assume that the football is a rigid enough container (unless a ball is massively deflated, it's volume won't change). The relationship is (P1/T1) = (P2/T2), where P is the pressure and T is the temperature in Kelvins.- The balls are inflated to between 12.5 and 13.5 psi at a temperature of 70 degrees Fahrenheit (294.1 K). Let's assume an average ball has a pressure of 13 psi. Since these are initial values, we will call them P1 and T1.- The game time temperature was 49 degrees F (278 K). We are attempting to solve for the new pressure at this temperature, P2. We plug everything into the equation and get (13/294.1) = (P2/278). At the game time temperature, the balls would have a pressure of 12.3 psi, below league specifications.Furthermore, given that it was raining all day, the air in the stadium was saturated with water vapor. At 70 degrees, water has a vapor pressure of 0.38 psi. The total pressure of the ball is equal to the pressure of the air inside the ball and the vaporized water in the ball. At 49 degrees, the vapor pressure of water is 0.13 psi. Up to 0.25 additional psi can be lost if the balls were inflated by either the team or the refs prior to the game. Granted, it's unlikely that anyone would inflate balls from 0, but it easily could cost another couple hundredths of a psi in pressure.- For a ball that barely meets specifications (12.5 psi), it's pressure would drop to 11.8 psi during the game... enough to be considered massively under-inflated.


----------



## ChrisL

Pound per square inch to atmospheric pressure (psi to atm) conversion table shows the most common values for the quick reference. Alternatively, you may use the converter below to convert any other values.

*1 Psi = 0.0680459639 Atm*

Psi is defined as 1 pound of force per square inch. It is the primary pressure unit in united states and widely used in all kinds of applications. 1 pound per square inch (psi) equals to 6 894.75729 pascals.

Atm (or atmospheric pressure) is defined as the force per unit area by the weight of air above that point. 1 atmosphere is about 101.325 kilopascals.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
Click to expand...


Another thing that tells me it was not a noticeable amount, is that they had to test and measure the amount of air in the balls.  IOW, it was not obvious to them by simply holding them and inspecting them with the naked eye.


----------



## Valerie

_...per a league source, the NFL has reviewed the entire process and determined that the balls were properly checked by the officials before the game.  Which means that, when the balls left the possession of the referee, the pressure was at least 12.5 PSI and no more than 13.5 PSI. 

Second, as to *the fact that the officials didn’t notice anything wrong with the balls while handling them after every play, the source explains that a pressure difference of one or two pounds would not be obvious*, if the official is not specifically looking for it.


In this specific case,* the NFL indeed became aware of the issue in the first half *— as previously pointed out by Bob Glauber of Newsday.  Per the source,* the league opted not to stop the game during the first half but to test the balls at halftime*, which they did._

_Source Footballs were properly checked before Colts-Patriots game ProFootballTalk_


----------



## SwimExpert

Oldstyle said:


> You think the officials sit in a freezing cold room to replicate the game time temperature when they check the balls?  Or take them all out to the fifty yard line in a driving rain storm to do that job?  That's some amusing stuff, Swim!


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.
> 
> No matter what science lecture Billy Boi thinks he is presenting and all of the glib movie references he dredges up the fact he can't get around is that the colt's balls were all within regulation and 11 out of 12 Patriots balls were 10% out of specs.  That may not seem like a lot but it is cheating plain and simple.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are forgetting.  The Colts sucked and weren't on offense NEARLY as much as the Pats, and there was NO celebrating by spiking balls in the end zone by the Colts.  The amount of times you handle your balls plays a role, as well as 300-pound men handling them.  They are MUCH stronger than you and your silly little science geek friend.
Click to expand...


I really don't want to visualize 300 lb men handling their balls.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.
> 
> No matter what science lecture Billy Boi thinks he is presenting and all of the glib movie references he dredges up the fact he can't get around is that the colt's balls were all within regulation and 11 out of 12 Patriots balls were 10% out of specs.  That may not seem like a lot but it is cheating plain and simple.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are forgetting.  The Colts sucked and weren't on offense NEARLY as much as the Pats, and there was NO celebrating by spiking balls in the end zone by the Colts.  The amount of times you handle your balls plays a role, as well as 300-pound men handling them.  They are MUCH stronger than you and your silly little science geek friend.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I really don't want to visualize 300 lb men handling their balls.
Click to expand...


Hey if there was another way to word it, I would have.    I'm aware of all the innuendos, but it can't be helped when you are discussing balls.


----------



## hangover

72 pages on a non-issue. Well Patriot haters would obviously rather focus on that, than having to think about Brady getting his fourth ring, and Belicheck being the greatest coach in NFL history. Only a week left till they have to cry in their beer.


----------



## Oldstyle

BluePhantom said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.
Click to expand...


Correlation does not equal causation?  That's the understatement of the century...yet somehow you're here making the case that it does!

The Patriots were a great team before Spygate made them stop videotaping from the sidelines instead of from a fixed position higher up...and they were just as good AFTER.  All you have to do is look at their record.  It's the best in the NFL for the time that Belichick, Brady and Kraft have run that team.  It's the best by such a wide margin it's not even funny!  Your thinking that it has something to do with the Patriots balls is laughable.  It has to do with them doing their jobs better than anyone else.  Belichick is a better coach...Brady is a better quarterback...Kraft is a better owner.  THAT'S IT!  THERE IS NO MAGIC BEAN...THERE IS NO UNDERHANDED DEVIOUSNESS TAKING PLACE...YOUR TEAM IS SIMPLY GETTING OUT COACHED AND OUT PLAYED!


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.
> 
> No matter what science lecture Billy Boi thinks he is presenting and all of the glib movie references he dredges up the fact he can't get around is that the colt's balls were all within regulation and 11 out of 12 Patriots balls were 10% out of specs.  That may not seem like a lot but it is cheating plain and simple.



Since you have no idea what pressure the Colts balls *started at*...the fact that they ended up within regulation after a half of playing does not prove that the Patriots "cheated".  Perhaps the Colts footballs started out the game slightly over inflated.  Perhaps the "fact" that they were within regulations several hours later proves that cold does have an affect on ball pressure.  Quite frankly you are making assumptions based on things that have not been proven to be factual.


----------



## Papageorgio

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> I want to SEE your math, please.  Put out or get out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
Click to expand...


It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.


----------



## ChrisL

Oldstyle said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya ...Ya...  Belichick is stretching the laws of physics into magical areas where they only apply to his team's environments yet leave the Colt's out in the cold and of out of the known universe.
> 
> No matter what science lecture Billy Boi thinks he is presenting and all of the glib movie references he dredges up the fact he can't get around is that the colt's balls were all within regulation and 11 out of 12 Patriots balls were 10% out of specs.  That may not seem like a lot but it is cheating plain and simple.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since you have no idea what pressure the Colts balls *started at*...the fact that they ended up within regulation after a half of playing does not prove that the Patriots "cheated".  Perhaps the Colts footballs started out the game slightly over inflated.  Perhaps the "fact" that they were within regulations several hours later proves that cold does have an affect on ball pressure.  Quite frankly you are making assumptions based on things that have not been proven to be factual.
Click to expand...


Ah yes, great point!  Thanks!


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> You misunderstand.  I did not ask my brother for math, nor did he provide any.  He was pissed enough that I bothered him on a Saturday asking a football related question as it was.  His point was that he *could *write an equation to show anything someone wanted.  As he put it "pay me enough and I will write you an equation showing how an elephant can stand on a teacup without it breaking".
> 
> His point was that *math would only be required to prove the improbable rather than the other way around because basic common sense tells you all you need to know*.  I will spell it out for you a bit more slowly.
> 
> We have an experiment repeated twice.  In each experiment 12 balls were handled the same way and in the same environment.  All were inflated to 12.5 psi.  The balls were then introduced into the same colder environment and the difference was measured.  In the first run 11 of the balls dropped 2 psi and one stayed the same.  What that means it you somehow have a situation where the laws of physics are working one way in 11 of the balls and a different way in the 12th ball.  So you repeat the experiment and this time none of the balls show any change.
> 
> The only thing that has remained constant is the reaction of the 12th ball that showed no change in both experiments.  In the second run the other 11 balls re-enforced the results of the only thing that was constant in both experiments...the no change reaction of the 12th ball.  Hence a naturally occurring phenomenon is probably not the issue.
> 
> Could it be some form of physical defect?  Leaky valves or perhaps the inner bladders of the first 11 were damaged due to initial over inflation? Perhaps but if they leaked in the first half they would leak in the second half too.  So physical defection of the balls is probably not the case.
> 
> Ok what about a psi gauge that is not correctly calibrated? Possible, but provided it was left alone and not tampered with between experiments the gauge would show similar results.  So that's probably not the case.
> 
> So what else is left?  Human intervention which, either by accident or intent, resulted in the deflation of 11 balls in the first experiment only.  In other words, someone let air out of the balls.
> 
> It's really not that tough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
Click to expand...


Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.
Click to expand...


That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?


----------



## BluePhantom

Oldstyle said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Correlation does not equal causation?  That's the understatement of the century...yet somehow you're here making the case that it does!
> 
> The Patriots were a great team before Spygate made them stop videotaping from the sidelines instead of from a fixed position higher up...and they were just as good AFTER.  All you have to do is look at their record.  It's the best in the NFL for the time that Belichick, Brady and Kraft have run that team.  It's the best by such a wide margin it's not even funny!  Your thinking that it has something to do with the Patriots balls is laughable.  It has to do with them doing their jobs better than anyone else.  Belichick is a better coach...Brady is a better quarterback...Kraft is a better owner.  THAT'S IT!  THERE IS NO MAGIC BEAN...THERE IS NO UNDERHANDED DEVIOUSNESS TAKING PLACE...YOUR TEAM IS SIMPLY GETTING OUT COACHED AND OUT PLAYED!
Click to expand...


Actually my team beat them.


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?



Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me


----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me
Click to expand...


They won the Super Bowls long before that.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well just to get some personal expert perspective on this I called my brother who is an aerospace engineer and deals with atmospheric pressure on a daily basis.  Even better he is not a football fan so doesn't care a bit about the result.  According to him (I will give you the bottom line and a direct quote) "...as an aerospace engineer I could write you a very complicated and detailed explanation backed up with physics to explain every part of this perfectly, but in reality it would require an absolutely perfect storm for it all to come together and it would have such low odds of happening it would be practically impossible.  The fact that one of the balls behaved differently in the same environment and under the same controls is highly suspicious and the Patriots' success rate in regards to ball protection since the rules changed in the NFL is outrageously suspicious. In short, I can use math to prove they didn't cheat, even though the likelihood that they did cheat is about 99.99%".
> 
> On the question of physics I will take his word.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly.  The one ball that was at regulation pressure kills the "physics" argument all together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Really?  That's assuming that all the balls started at the same pressure.  That's assuming that the official who was supposed to check the balls actually DID!  Here's a radical concept...perhaps someone who was supposed to do his job...didn't!  Perhaps the referee picked up some balls...gave them a squeeze and said..."Yup...feels OK to me!  Let's go play some football!!!"
> 
> What's hilarious is that you think the Patriots success rate is "outrageously suspicious"!  Duh...they have arguably the best quarterback ever to play the game and arguably the best coach ever to coach in the league and arguably the best owner to own a team in league history...gee. why would someone think THAT would result in wins!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> They did before they changed the rules allowing teams to provide their own balls too.  Yet before then the Patriots were on par with the league average and had been for years.  The moment the rules were changed then suddenly they perform at three standard deviations better for six straight seasons?   Granted correlation does not equal causation, but that's *pretty damned suspicious*.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?
Click to expand...


This guy is a jerk, period.  He wants to believe the worst and nobody is going to change his mind.


----------



## BluePhantom

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They won the Super Bowls long before that.
Click to expand...


Yeah no shit...with Brady...so it's tough for me to see how New England's sudden improvement in ball security has anything to do with a new quarterback


----------



## Freewill




----------



## Papageorgio

BluePhantom said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They won the Super Bowls long before that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah no shit...with Brady...so it's tough for me to see how New England's sudden improvement in ball security has anything to do with a new quarterback
Click to expand...


I have a tough time believing they are the only team that is involved.


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now in said experiment, the officials, professionals mind you, could not determine that they were deflated? I have to think that the officials did not care, knew it all along or were in on it.
> 
> I have an uncle who is a finish carpenter, he can walk in to a kitchen and tell you I'd anything is off by as little as a sixteenth of an inch. I can't see it but he is a pro. I know a tile guy, he can walk into a room and tell you it it is out of square. I had a friend who worked in the post office, he could simply lift a package and tell you what it weighed within an ounce, another was a baggage agent, he could lift a bag and tell you the weight within a few ounces.
> 
> This leads me to believe that this goes on a lot, officials aren't that dumb, and if just by catching it, you can tell its light, an official squeezing it can tell it light. It is not that hard for pros, to be that sensitive to little minute things.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
Click to expand...


What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.

If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy. 

Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.

But they can't do the intelligent thing. 

Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.  

Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.

AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
Click to expand...


Why on earth should he?  I'm still going with the idea that the Pats had a great game, had a lot of "spiking the balls" in the end zone type of celebrations.  It's not only Gronk who does that, after all.  OTOH, the Colts were not doing those things because of the fact that they were losing badly from the very beginning of the game.  So, between touch down and first down celebrations, etc., there was a lot of man handling the balls by big strong men - Lol - sorry for the innuendo.  On top of that, there was a pretty rapid drop in temperatures.  It is not out of the realm of possibility that those two factors combined could have contributed to some loss in PSI.


----------



## TrinityPower

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why on earth should he?  I'm still going with the idea that the Pats had a great game, had a lot of "spiking the balls" in the end zone type of celebrations.  It's not only Gronk who does that, after all.  OTOH, the Colts were not doing those things because of the fact that they were losing badly from the very beginning of the game.  So, between touch down and first down celebrations, etc., there was a lot of man handling the balls by big strong men - Lol - sorry for the innuendo.  On top of that, there was a pretty rapid drop in temperatures.  It is not out of the realm of possibility that those two factors combined could have contributed to some loss in PSI.
Click to expand...

I think your brain is inflated as well as your libido for Brady


----------



## HUGGY

ChrisL said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why on earth should he?  I'm still going with the idea that the Pats had a great game, had a lot of "spiking the balls" in the end zone type of celebrations.  It's not only Gronk who does that, after all.  OTOH, the Colts were not doing those things because of the fact that they were losing badly from the very beginning of the game.  So, between touch down and first down celebrations, etc., there was a lot of man handling the balls by big strong men - Lol - sorry for the innuendo.  On top of that, there was a pretty rapid drop in temperatures.  It is not out of the realm of possibility that those two factors combined could have contributed to some loss in PSI.
Click to expand...


Naw...  Won't hold the water.

No football gets smacked like when it gets kicked or punted.  The kicking football bounces a hell of a lot farther than Gronk's whimpy spikes.

The one football that kept pressure for the test was the kicking ball.


----------



## ChrisL

TrinityPower said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why on earth should he?  I'm still going with the idea that the Pats had a great game, had a lot of "spiking the balls" in the end zone type of celebrations.  It's not only Gronk who does that, after all.  OTOH, the Colts were not doing those things because of the fact that they were losing badly from the very beginning of the game.  So, between touch down and first down celebrations, etc., there was a lot of man handling the balls by big strong men - Lol - sorry for the innuendo.  On top of that, there was a pretty rapid drop in temperatures.  It is not out of the realm of possibility that those two factors combined could have contributed to some loss in PSI.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think your brain is inflated as well as your libido for Brady
Click to expand...


  Still does not negate my post which makes complete sense.  You mad?


----------



## ChrisL

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why on earth should he?  I'm still going with the idea that the Pats had a great game, had a lot of "spiking the balls" in the end zone type of celebrations.  It's not only Gronk who does that, after all.  OTOH, the Colts were not doing those things because of the fact that they were losing badly from the very beginning of the game.  So, between touch down and first down celebrations, etc., there was a lot of man handling the balls by big strong men - Lol - sorry for the innuendo.  On top of that, there was a pretty rapid drop in temperatures.  It is not out of the realm of possibility that those two factors combined could have contributed to some loss in PSI.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Naw...  Won't hold the water.
> 
> No football gets smacked like when it gets kicked or punted.  The kicking football bounces a hell of a lot farther than Gronk's whimpy spikes.
> 
> The one football that kept pressure for the test was the kicking ball.
Click to expand...


I think it makes perfectly good sense.  That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They won the Super Bowls long before that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah no shit...with Brady...so it's tough for me to see how New England's sudden improvement in ball security has anything to do with a new quarterback
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have a tough time believing they are the only team that is involved.
Click to expand...


You think that players from other teams are sneaking around the Patriots sidelines deflating their footballs?

That's crazy !!!!!


----------



## mack20

Mike Florio is reporting that only one ball was at 10.5 and the rest were closer to 11.5.  I've also read elsewhere that the 12th ball was under regulation, but less so than the other 11. It would be nice if the NFL would say fucking ANYTHING about what they've found.  

Personally, the more adamantly the Patriots deny it, the more I believe them.  Think he's as evil as you want, Belichick is not stupid.  When Spygate happened he readily admitted to everything because he felt that was he was doing was within the rules.  The NFL disagreed. I've read articles about how after Spygate, the Pats began running anything and everything past their lawyers to make sure the same sort of thing didn't happen a second time. 

The Patriots aren't exactly known for being talkative with the press.  I don't think anyone would've been surprised if they refused to answer any questions about this whole thing.  And yet, not only have they answered questions, they've had numerous press conferences and denied any wrongdoing in the strongest possible terms.  If there was any chance of the NFL finding intentional deflation, why on earth would they do that?  They don't care about the court of public opinion. They know that Goodell would come down on them harder if he thinks they lied about it and made him look stupid.  It makes no sense for a team like the Patriots to issue such strong denials. 

Having said all that, I can't say for certain that they did nothing wrong.  The NFL hasn't given us much to work with as far as facts go.  But I think the team reaction makes no sense at all if they did something wrong.


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is as funny of an excuse as I have heard in a long time. It would have nothing to do with their new QB would it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They won the Super Bowls long before that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah no shit...with Brady...so it's tough for me to see how New England's sudden improvement in ball security has anything to do with a new quarterback
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have a tough time believing they are the only team that is involved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You think that players from other teams are sneaking around the Patriots sidelines deflating their footballs?
> 
> That's crazy !!!!!
Click to expand...


You idiot, is your reading comprehension as bad as you're implying?


----------



## mack20

HUGGY said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> That is because, as has been stated several times now, there was not ENOUGH air missing to make a noticeable difference in the feel of the ball.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is very noticeable, it's a 20% variable, it has to be noticeable otherwise the Pats wouldn't have taken the air out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
Click to expand...


If the PSI in the balls fell to below regulation due to weather or something of the sort, would the Patriots be allowed to reinflate them to spec?  Graham Gano's tweets lead me to believe that the Patriots would not be allowed to do that.


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh you mean Brady has only been playing for the Patriots since 2007?  That's news to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They won the Super Bowls long before that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah no shit...with Brady...so it's tough for me to see how New England's sudden improvement in ball security has anything to do with a new quarterback
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have a tough time believing they are the only team that is involved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You think that players from other teams are sneaking around the Patriots sidelines deflating their footballs?
> 
> That's crazy !!!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You idiot, is your reading comprehension as bad as you're implying?
Click to expand...


Possibly.

I'm having a difficult time taking any of this seriously.

When I lose attention my mind wanders.


----------



## HUGGY

This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.

Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.

That would end it.


----------



## mack20

HUGGY said:


> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.



But we don't know that they DID screw up.  They have already said that they will be inflating the balls to the higher end of the allowed limit to account for this from now on. 

Also, I'm now reading reports that the guy who started the on-site investigations is NFL VP of Game Operations Mike Kensil.  A man who was a Jets employee for 20 years, including during the time when Belichick resigned as HC of the Jets.  That's a bit suspicious to me.


----------



## mack20

Also, per Florio, the only ball that was at 10.5 was the one in the Colts possession (the intercepted ball). So if this is true, and all of the balls were within a range that could be explained scientifically, and the one ball in the Colts possession was the only one in a range not explainable by science, what conclusions could be fairly drawn?


----------



## ChrisL

mack20 said:


> Also, per Florio, the only ball that was at 10.5 was the one in the Colts possession (the intercepted ball).



Well that is interesting.  I had not heard of that until now.


----------



## mack20

ChrisL said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also, per Florio, the only ball that was at 10.5 was the one in the Colts possession (the intercepted ball).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well that is interesting.  I had not heard of that until now.
Click to expand...

 Here's what Florio said:


> But what has the NFL really found?  As one league source has explained it to PFT, the football intercepted by Colts linebacker D’Qwell Jackson was roughly two pounds under the 12.5 PSI minimum.  The other 10 balls that reportedly were two pounds under may have been, as the source explained it, closer to one pound below 12.5 PSI.



It's obviously not a fact, since it's just unnamed league sources, but given that literally everything in this so far has been unnamed sources, it's as worthwhile a point as any.


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.



How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.

That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"

I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
Click to expand...


It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.  

Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
Click to expand...


So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?

Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!


----------



## Oldstyle

My Dad always taught me that if you did something wrong the right thing to do was to take responsibility for your actions...he also taught me that if you didn't do anything wrong the right thing was to say so.  If someone doesn't want to believe you?  That's THEIR problem!


----------



## Oldstyle

And who the fuck *CARES* about the media?


----------



## HUGGY

Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?
> 
> Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!
Click to expand...


Dunno!  I'm not married any more.    And it's not because of her best friend.  I got rid of her because SHE was sleeping around.


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.



You don't know that the Patriots were caught red handed because you don't know the facts involved, Huggy.  You've *assumed* them...oh, boy have you assumed them...and we all know what happens when you assume things.  So stop declaring what you KNOW...when you in fact know very little!

And stop giving advice on women when you obviously aren't qualified!


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?
> 
> Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dunno!  I'm not married any more.    And it's not because of her best friend.  I got rid of her because SHE was sleeping around.
Click to expand...


I could see why, you spend all day obsessed with a football team that doesn't know you are alive and doesn't care.


----------



## Oldstyle

Papageorgio said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?
> 
> Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dunno!  I'm not married any more.    And it's not because of her best friend.  I got rid of her because SHE was sleeping around.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I could see why, you spend all day obsessed with a football team that doesn't know you are alive and doesn't care.
Click to expand...


For that matter...neither does his ex-wife...


----------



## JimBowie1958

HUGGY said:


> Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.



Yeah, the Pats were caught RED HANDED making the footballs contract in cold weather.

roflmao


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> This whole thing is in the Patriots hands.
> 
> Admit that SOMEHOW they screwed up. They don't know how they screwed up.  They take responsibility for the mistake.They will take extra care to make sure that in the future their game balls will be within regulations.
> 
> That would end it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?
> 
> Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dunno!  I'm not married any more.    And it's not because of her best friend.  I got rid of her because SHE was sleeping around.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I could see why, you spend all day obsessed with a football team that doesn't know you are alive and doesn't care.
Click to expand...


Yes they do care.  They care very much.  That's all they can talk about.  The 12's this..the 12's that.  They slobber all over the 12's every chance they get.  .It's embarrassing really.


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know that the Patriots were caught red handed because you don't know the facts involved, Huggy.  You've *assumed* them...oh, boy have you assumed them...and we all know what happens when you assume things.  So stop declaring what you KNOW...when you in fact know very little!
> 
> And stop giving advice on women when you obviously aren't qualified!
Click to expand...


I'll give advice as much as it pleases me.  You can stop taking it any time you want.

You internet Bozos that try to tell people what they can or can't do crack me up.  

IMO you take yourself and what you put on message boards a bit too seriously.  How do you know I didn't just make it up about the Ex?  It's the internets Einstein.  All entertainment all the time.  And if it starts getting too much to deal with push that off button.  It won't kill ya to take a break from all this nonsense.


----------



## Theowl32

So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them? 

BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated. 

Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor. 

Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it. 

Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score. 

It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really. 

Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.



I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!

So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots of playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!


----------



## Oldstyle

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know that the Patriots were caught red handed because you don't know the facts involved, Huggy.  You've *assumed* them...oh, boy have you assumed them...and we all know what happens when you assume things.  So stop declaring what you KNOW...when you in fact know very little!
> 
> And stop giving advice on women when you obviously aren't qualified!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll give advice as much as it pleases me.  You can stop taking it any time you want.
> 
> You internet Bozos that try to tell people what they can or can't do crack me up.
> 
> IMO you take yourself and what you put on message boards a bit too seriously.  How do you know I didn't just make it up about the Ex?  It's the internets Einstein.  All entertainment all the time.  And if it starts getting too much to deal with push that off button.  It won't kill ya to take a break from all this nonsense.
Click to expand...


Ah, Huggy?  I'm not the one who's telling people how to get along with their spouses when said spouse was out sleeping with other people...that would be you!  Just saying...

If you want to look like an internet *buffoon*...just keep on doing what you're doing!


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!
> 
> So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!
Click to expand...



I never said the db complained about it. I said the equipment manager in the first game they played in the dome noticed they were significantly under inflated and made the officials aware. No weather. Nothing like that at all.

The balls were deflated, they were done so deliberately. It has nothing to do with the score of the game or the hatred of the patriots. They deliberately altered the balls and that is not permitted.

You can blame the weather, claim we hate the patriots and that is the only reason why those of us who stand for principle make a deal out of it, or you can sit there and believe the pats bullshit story. Either way, they did what they did and we ALL know what they did. They deliberately broke the rules. Period.

There is no discussion. I am surprised by conservative thinkers that they would take on a double sided disposition like a left wing hypocrite.


Bowie, the fact that hangover and Rightwinger take on your view and agree with you should make you rethink your position. Those pieces of shit are on the wrong side on EVERYTHING?


----------



## Oldstyle

Funny how every b


Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!
> 
> So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I never said the db complained about it. I said the equipment manager in the first game they played in the dome noticed they were significantly under inflated and made the officials aware. No weather. Nothing like that at all.
> 
> The balls were deflated, they were done so deliberately. It has nothing to do with the score of the game or the hatred of the patriots. They deliberately altered the balls and that is not permitted.
> 
> You can blame the weather, claim we hate the patriots and that is the only reason why those of us who stand for principle make a deal out of it, or you can sit there and believe the pats bullshit story. Either way, they did what they did and we ALL know what they did. They deliberately broke the rules. Period.
> 
> There is no discussion. I am surprised by conservative thinkers that they would take on a double sided disposition like a left wing hypocrite.
> 
> 
> Bowie, the fact that hangover and Rightwinger take on your view and agree with you should make you rethink your position. Those pieces of shit are on the wrong side on EVERYTHING?
Click to expand...


What's laughable is that you actually seem to think that you *DO* know exactly what they did!  You don't.  What you *know* is a collection of rumors and suppositions derived from unnamed sources.  And please stop with the holier than thou declarations that *YOU* stand for principle!  You don't.  If you did you'd understand the "principle" of not assuming guilt when you don't know jack shit about the facts!  That isn't principled behavior...it's unprincipled behavior!  Lynch mobs operate on the same kind of principled behavior as you're displaying here.


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> Funny how every b
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!
> 
> So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I never said the db complained about it. I said the equipment manager in the first game they played in the dome noticed they were significantly under inflated and made the officials aware. No weather. Nothing like that at all.
> 
> The balls were deflated, they were done so deliberately. It has nothing to do with the score of the game or the hatred of the patriots. They deliberately altered the balls and that is not permitted.
> 
> You can blame the weather, claim we hate the patriots and that is the only reason why those of us who stand for principle make a deal out of it, or you can sit there and believe the pats bullshit story. Either way, they did what they did and we ALL know what they did. They deliberately broke the rules. Period.
> 
> There is no discussion. I am surprised by conservative thinkers that they would take on a double sided disposition like a left wing hypocrite.
> 
> 
> Bowie, the fact that hangover and Rightwinger take on your view and agree with you should make you rethink your position. Those pieces of shit are on the wrong side on EVERYTHING?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What's laughable is that you actually seem to think that you *DO* know exactly what they did!  You don't.  What you *know* is a collection of rumors and suppositions derived from unnamed sources.  And please stop with the holier than thou declarations that *YOU* stand for principle!  You don't.  If you did you'd understand the "principle" of not assuming guilt when you don't know jack shit about the facts!  That isn't principled behavior...it's unprincipled behavior!  Lynch mobs operate on the same kind of principled behavior as you're displaying here.
Click to expand...


I do know exactly what they did. The only ones that do not, are pats fans. Common sense, is all one needs


----------



## Oldstyle

Let me ask you a very simple question.  Don't you find it strange that nobody has informed the public what the pressures were of the game balls that were allegedly measured prior to the game?  Why haven't we been told what pressure the Patriot's game balls were when the referee measured them?  Why haven't we been told what pressure the Colt's game balls were?  Unlike so many of you...I don't take it as "fact" that a through measurement was done on those balls prior to the game.  I know that someone was supposed to do so.  I know that he maintains that he did.  I don't know however, whether that really took place.  I'd have to accept the referee's word on that.  Was he supposed to measure them but did so simply by squeezing a few?  I don't know.  Neither do you.


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Funny how every b
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!
> 
> So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I never said the db complained about it. I said the equipment manager in the first game they played in the dome noticed they were significantly under inflated and made the officials aware. No weather. Nothing like that at all.
> 
> The balls were deflated, they were done so deliberately. It has nothing to do with the score of the game or the hatred of the patriots. They deliberately altered the balls and that is not permitted.
> 
> You can blame the weather, claim we hate the patriots and that is the only reason why those of us who stand for principle make a deal out of it, or you can sit there and believe the pats bullshit story. Either way, they did what they did and we ALL know what they did. They deliberately broke the rules. Period.
> 
> There is no discussion. I am surprised by conservative thinkers that they would take on a double sided disposition like a left wing hypocrite.
> 
> 
> Bowie, the fact that hangover and Rightwinger take on your view and agree with you should make you rethink your position. Those pieces of shit are on the wrong side on EVERYTHING?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What's laughable is that you actually seem to think that you *DO* know exactly what they did!  You don't.  What you *know* is a collection of rumors and suppositions derived from unnamed sources.  And please stop with the holier than thou declarations that *YOU* stand for principle!  You don't.  If you did you'd understand the "principle" of not assuming guilt when you don't know jack shit about the facts!  That isn't principled behavior...it's unprincipled behavior!  Lynch mobs operate on the same kind of principled behavior as you're displaying here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do know exactly what they did. The only ones that do not, are pats fans. Common sense, is all one needs
Click to expand...


So *YOU* know exactly what they did?  I take it you work for the Patriots?  Were there in the team offices prior to the game?  Were there on the sidelines during the game?  Where exactly have you obtained your knowledge of EXACTLY what happened?


----------



## Oldstyle

Please don't embarrass yourself by stating that you know EXACTLY what happened from "unnamed sources"...


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> How exactly do you take responsibility for something...when you have no idea how it happened?  This might not be a screw up of the New England Patriots at all.  If the balls that they gave to the officials were at the very low end of the acceptable scale...or even a little below it...and were deemed acceptable by the referee...then because of use or weather conditions lost pressure over the course of the first half then I'm having a hard time seeing how THAT is a "screw-up" by the Patriots.
> 
> That's assuming of course that the referee of the game did in fact measure the balls in question correctly...something that so far nobody has shown me has been proven.  We're being asked to take that as a given that he did because he said that he did.  Well did he?  Did he painstakingly measure the pressure of each of the 36 balls to be used in the game?  Or did he simply pick up the balls and give them a squeeze test?  If so is he going to admit that if a subsequent uproar ensues over ball pressure?  Or is he going to say..."Yes, I tested each of the balls...just the way I'm supposed to!"
> 
> I'm sorry, Kiddies but the jury is not only still "out" on this topic...we haven't even heard the evidence yet!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?
> 
> Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dunno!  I'm not married any more.    And it's not because of her best friend.  I got rid of her because SHE was sleeping around.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I could see why, you spend all day obsessed with a football team that doesn't know you are alive and doesn't care.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes they do care.  They care very much.  That's all they can talk about.  The 12's this..the 12's that.  They slobber all over the 12's every chance they get.  .It's embarrassing really.
Click to expand...


You are delusional, if you died tomorrow, they wouldn't know, no tribute, no arm band, no feelings either way about you. The care about winning and making money, nothing more than that. The 12 BS is to get nut jobs to buy product, it's a gimmick.


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know that the Patriots were caught red handed because you don't know the facts involved, Huggy.  You've *assumed* them...oh, boy have you assumed them...and we all know what happens when you assume things.  So stop declaring what you KNOW...when you in fact know very little!
> 
> And stop giving advice on women when you obviously aren't qualified!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll give advice as much as it pleases me.  You can stop taking it any time you want.
> 
> You internet Bozos that try to tell people what they can or can't do crack me up.
> 
> IMO you take yourself and what you put on message boards a bit too seriously.  How do you know I didn't just make it up about the Ex?  It's the internets Einstein.  All entertainment all the time.  And if it starts getting too much to deal with push that off button.  It won't kill ya to take a break from all this nonsense.
Click to expand...


Good point, no women would probably touch you, that's why you fantasize about you and Wilson getting it on.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HUGGY said:


> Every minute Brady, Belichick and the Patriots have to spend on this investigation and answering all the questions and preparing to answer all the questions is time they won't have to prepare for playing the Seahawks.
> 
> Preparation is paramount in a game of this magnitude.
> 
> If for no other reason the Hawks have a huge advantage in the time available to prepare for playing the actual game.
> 
> If this media "Inflate-Gate" blitz keeps going through next week I would say that Seattle will be at least TWICE as prepared as New England just because of the media interference.


yeah I don't see how it can do anything but hurt the cheatriots.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

GWV5903 said:


> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?


actually its not because ESPN reported the ravens alerted the colts to the problem noticing it as well noticing it late in the game.while it wasn't a factor in the colts game,its absurd to think it wasn't in the ravens game,a very close game.


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> Please don't embarrass yourself by stating that you know EXACTLY what happened from "unnamed sources"...



The balls were deflated, they violated the rules.

Black and white.

That, is exactly what happened.

Deal with it.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Please don't embarrass yourself by stating that you know EXACTLY what happened from "unnamed sources"...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The balls were deflated, they violated the rules.
> 
> Black and white.
> 
> Deal with it.[/Q
Click to expand...


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Theowl32 said:


> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.



good point.thats the beli-cheat apologists for you,they cant deal with pesky facts.another fact they will ignore as well is what I just got done mentioning is that the ravens informed the colts as well in the days prior to the game that they noticed late in the game,their balls were underinflated.so lets see,the colts noticed it in novemeber,the ravens noticed it as well? mere coincidence? sure it is and I'm the president of the united states as well.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

TrinityPower said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's NOT noticeable amount.  I already posted a link somewhere in this thread where it says it is equal to the amount of the weight of a piece of paper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not the weight that matters, it is the difference in catching it. You can't throw it as far however you can catch it easier, their is a difference. Go out fill a football under fill, over fill, fill it the correct amount. There is a difference, so noticeable that Brady likes his under inflated. If it didn't matter, he would have no preference.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady says he likes them at low end of regulation guidelines.  He never said he likes them deflated under regulation guidelines.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What Brady says to reporters and what in fact were the balls measured at is the problem that won't go away.
> 
> If the NFL and the media had bar that was "Well? what did Tom Brady say?"  then there would be no controversy.
> 
> Tom Should have just said..  "Whoops!  Our Bad!  We screwed up."  then there would have been a fine and it would all go away.
> 
> But they can't do the intelligent thing.
> 
> Hell!  It doesn't matter how the balls got out of regs.  It was the Patriots responsibility to maintain them within the rules.
> 
> Nobody is charging Brady with first degree murder.  Just friggin man up Tommy and admit that SOMEBODY on your team screwed up.  If they keep this hard line about it ..well then they will be punished all the more.
> 
> AND they have nobody to blame but themselves.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why on earth should he?  I'm still going with the idea that the Pats had a great game, had a lot of "spiking the balls" in the end zone type of celebrations.  It's not only Gronk who does that, after all.  OTOH, the Colts were not doing those things because of the fact that they were losing badly from the very beginning of the game.  So, between touch down and first down celebrations, etc., there was a lot of man handling the balls by big strong men - Lol - sorry for the innuendo.  On top of that, there was a pretty rapid drop in temperatures.  It is not out of the realm of possibility that those two factors combined could have contributed to some loss in PSI.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think your brain is inflated as well as your libido for Brady
Click to expand...


welcome to the world of little chrissy.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!
> 
> So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I never said the db complained about it. I said the equipment manager in the first game they played in the dome noticed they were significantly under inflated and made the officials aware. No weather. Nothing like that at all.
> 
> The balls were deflated, they were done so deliberately. It has nothing to do with the score of the game or the hatred of the patriots. They deliberately altered the balls and that is not permitted.
> 
> You can blame the weather, claim we hate the patriots and that is the only reason why those of us who stand for principle make a deal out of it, or you can sit there and believe the pats bullshit story. Either way, they did what they did and we ALL know what they did. They deliberately broke the rules. Period.
> 
> There is no discussion. I am surprised by conservative thinkers that they would take on a double sided disposition like a left wing hypocrite.
> 
> 
> Bowie, the fact that hangover and Rightwinger take on your view and agree with you should make you rethink your position. Those pieces of shit are on the wrong side on EVERYTHING?
Click to expand...


exactly.well said.at least the part on rightwinger.

I've never noticed with Hangover him being on the wrong side of anything but ever since I been here,i have seen over a hundred people call out rightwinger   on his outright lies he makes up over the years when he know he is cornered and proven wrong,how he always evades facts all the time and then LIES to try and cover himself.

rightwinger for instance,I pointed out on my rams thread FACTS how the raiders will never come back to LA again because the owners and the city don't want them there and all he did was troll the thread with a pic saying LA RAIDERS 2016.never mind the fact they have a billionaire investor with a deal nearly signed for a new stadium to keep them in Oakland.

rightwinger as you said so well,is indeed a piece of shit.the fact that he is taking on his view as well as chrissy's,he should seriously reconsider his view. anytime either of those two-rightwinger and chrissy  take on their same view,someone sould seriously reconsider it.

they do know exactly what they did. The only ones that do not, are pats fans. Common sense, is all one needs


----------



## mack20

9/11 inside job said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> actually its not because ESPN reported the ravens alerted the colts to the problem noticing it as well noticing it late in the game.while it wasn't a factor in the colts game,its absurd to think it wasn't in the ravens game,a very close game.
Click to expand...


Except that supposedly the Ravens were suspicious about the kicking balls, which stay in the NFL's possession for the entire game.


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> actually its not because ESPN reported the ravens alerted the colts to the problem noticing it as well noticing it late in the game.while it wasn't a factor in the colts game,its absurd to think it wasn't in the ravens game,a very close game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Except that supposedly the Ravens were suspicious about the kicking balls, which stay in the NFL's possession for the entire game.
Click to expand...


Don't confuse 911 nut job, he confuses easily enough as it is.


----------



## Oldstyle

9/11 inside job said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good point.thats the beli-cheat apologists for you,they cant deal with pesky facts.another fact they will ignore as well is what I just got done mentioning is that the ravens informed the colts as well in the days prior to the game that they noticed late in the game,their balls were underinflated.so lets see,the colts noticed it in novemeber,the ravens noticed it as well? mere coincidence? sure it is and I'm the president of the united states as well.
Click to expand...


I would actually be more inclined to believe that you were President of the United States...than a coaching staff involved in a football playoff game to decide who gets to go to the Super Bowl somehow neglected to challenge the balls that the Patriots were using in that game even though they suspected they were illegal.

All you've done is add yet ANOTHER unsubstantiated story to the ones that other people, who have no way of knowing one way or the other, have come up with before.

So we've got ALL these team noticing that the Patriot's game balls are underinflated...yet nobody demanded that they be checked?  Is that REALLY the story that you're believing?  That the Colts simply let the Patriots play with balls they knew were illegal for an entire half of the most important game of the year for them?  You buy that?  Really?


----------



## Oldstyle

This in a business where grown men spend countless hours trying to find some new wrinkle that will give them the smallest advantage over their opponents!  Yet even though they KNEW the balls the Patriots were using were illegal...*THEY SOMEHOW FORGOT TO CHALLENGE THEM?????*

Just how naive are you?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

mack20 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> actually its not because ESPN reported the ravens alerted the colts to the problem noticing it as well noticing it late in the game.while it wasn't a factor in the colts game,its absurd to think it wasn't in the ravens game,a very close game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Except that supposedly the Ravens were suspicious about the kicking balls, which stay in the NFL's possession for the entire game.
Click to expand...


that's what I was saying earlier but detailed it more talking about how ESPN reported the ravens alerted the colts to them deflating the balls which the colts noticed earlier in the year as well when they  played them earlier in the season.overwhelming proof the cheatriots are back to their cheating ways again.

it had no impact on the colts game but to say it didn't in the ravens game is just asinine.


----------



## Theowl32

Oldstyle said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good point.thats the beli-cheat apologists for you,they cant deal with pesky facts.another fact they will ignore as well is what I just got done mentioning is that the ravens informed the colts as well in the days prior to the game that they noticed late in the game,their balls were underinflated.so lets see,the colts noticed it in novemeber,the ravens noticed it as well? mere coincidence? sure it is and I'm the president of the united states as well.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would actually be more inclined to believe that you were President of the United States...than a coaching staff involved in a football playoff game to decide who gets to go to the Super Bowl somehow neglected to challenge the balls that the Patriots were using in that game even though they suspected they were illegal.
> 
> All you've done is add yet ANOTHER unsubstantiated story to the ones that other people, who have no way of knowing one way or the other, have come up with before.
> 
> So we've got ALL these team noticing that the Patriot's game balls are underinflated...yet nobody demanded that they be checked?  Is that REALLY the story that you're believing?  That the Colts simply let the Patriots play with balls they knew were illegal for an entire half of the most important game of the year for them?  You buy that?  Really?
Click to expand...


I cannot tell, are you now shifting the debate and now claiming the balls were not deflated?

Wait wait wait....they were deflated but only due to the weather. (Even though of course none of the colts balls were deflated and the first time they were noticed was in a dome)

Wait wait wait....you are saying they were not actually deflated. (Even though they in fact were deflated and Bill claims ignorance much like Sean Peyton who was suspended for a year....and he is not a patriots coach.)

Wait wait wait.....you are saying altering the equipment is no big deal. (Even though it is in most sports like a baseball players corking a bat or a pitcher putting Vaseline on a ball)

Wait wait wait, the Patriots ought to be allowed to do what ever the fuck they want, cause the patriots are so good that they have not won a Super Bowl in 10 years.

I have no idea what pats fans are saying other than they feel they are being all picked on, they feel the pats simply should be allowed to alter the balls since it is minor, and well......they are just sooooooo good that we are just so jealous......and well they did not do anything.

Yes that last statement is confusing and yet I stated the thinking of the typical pats fan in regards to this issue.


----------



## GWV5903

HUGGY said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You think the media attention is because the Colts lost?
> 
> It is an issue because the footballs were altered.  The fact that eleven were out of regulation and one ball was IN regulation is proof that an important rule had been violated.
> 
> The rule is there for a reason.  The reason is so both teams are playing with the same equipment.  It's called a level playing field.  Most people would argue that it is a fair rule.  Otherwise it would not be a rule would it.
> 
> The discovery of the Patriot cheating just happened to co-inside with the Colts game.
> 
> Do you think the Patriots can break the rules without repercussion?
Click to expand...

 
BlahBlahBlah...

Did the refs not touch the balls? 

You need to worry if your Seahawks can pull off another miracle...

There is no issue, period end of story...


----------



## LA RAM FAN

GWV5903 said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You think the media attention is because the Colts lost?
> 
> It is an issue because the footballs were altered.  The fact that eleven were out of regulation and one ball was IN regulation is proof that an important rule had been violated.
> 
> The rule is there for a reason.  The reason is so both teams are playing with the same equipment.  It's called a level playing field.  Most people would argue that it is a fair rule.  Otherwise it would not be a rule would it.
> 
> The discovery of the Patriot cheating just happened to co-inside with the Colts game.
> 
> Do you think the Patriots can break the rules without repercussion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> BlahBlahBlah...
> 
> Did the refs not touch the balls?
> 
> You need to worry if your Seahawks can pull off another miracle...
> 
> There is no issue, period end of story...
Click to expand...

period,end of story is that you are in denial that belicheat is a cheater and liar and has now taught brady to do the same.


----------



## JimBowie1958

Theowl32 said:


> The balls were deflated, they were done so deliberately. It has nothing to do with the score of the game or the hatred of the patriots. They deliberately altered the balls and that is not permitted.



Well, placing them in the cold air was deliberate, so I guess they were deflated deliberately in that sense. Still it did not break the rules.



Theowl32 said:


> You can blame the weather, claim we hate the patriots and that is the only reason why those of us who stand for principle make a deal out of it, or you can sit there and believe the pats bullshit story. Either way, they did what they did and we ALL know what they did. They deliberately broke the rules. Period.



The presumption of guilt is not becoming. It sounds more like jealousy than a protest.




Theowl32 said:


> There is no discussion. I am surprised by conservative thinkers that they would take on a double sided disposition like a left wing hypocrite.



Now football teams fall into the ideological scope of issues as well?

I think I am going to retire to Honduras.



Theowl32 said:


> Bowie, the fact that hangover and Rightwinger take on your view and agree with you should make you rethink your position. Those pieces of shit are on the wrong side on EVERYTHING?



A broken clock is right twice a day, but is still fucking broken.

Seriously, we let politics divide us too much in this country. The left in this country starting with Obama and everything to the right of him is very conservative on the global stage.

The most conservative head of state on the globe right now is Cameron of the UK. Obama is more conservative than that screwball.


----------



## JimBowie1958

Theowl32 said:


> I do know exactly what they did. The only ones that do not, are pats fans. Common sense, is all one needs



Then you need to call the NFL offices, they need to know what you know, brainiac, lol.


----------



## BluePhantom

ok I am out of here and going to focus on the actual game.  Nothing but repeating the same arguments over and over on either side.


----------



## Oldstyle

Theowl32 said:


> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good point.thats the beli-cheat apologists for you,they cant deal with pesky facts.another fact they will ignore as well is what I just got done mentioning is that the ravens informed the colts as well in the days prior to the game that they noticed late in the game,their balls were underinflated.so lets see,the colts noticed it in novemeber,the ravens noticed it as well? mere coincidence? sure it is and I'm the president of the united states as well.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would actually be more inclined to believe that you were President of the United States...than a coaching staff involved in a football playoff game to decide who gets to go to the Super Bowl somehow neglected to challenge the balls that the Patriots were using in that game even though they suspected they were illegal.
> 
> All you've done is add yet ANOTHER unsubstantiated story to the ones that other people, who have no way of knowing one way or the other, have come up with before.
> 
> So we've got ALL these team noticing that the Patriot's game balls are underinflated...yet nobody demanded that they be checked?  Is that REALLY the story that you're believing?  That the Colts simply let the Patriots play with balls they knew were illegal for an entire half of the most important game of the year for them?  You buy that?  Really?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I cannot tell, are you now shifting the debate and now claiming the balls were not deflated?
> 
> Wait wait wait....they were deflated but only due to the weather. (Even though of course none of the colts balls were deflated and the first time they were noticed was in a dome)
> 
> Wait wait wait....you are saying they were not actually deflated. (Even though they in fact were deflated and Bill claims ignorance much like Sean Peyton who was suspended for a year....and he is not a patriots coach.)
> 
> Wait wait wait.....you are saying altering the equipment is no big deal. (Even though it is in most sports like a baseball players corking a bat or a pitcher putting Vaseline on a ball)
> 
> Wait wait wait, the Patriots ought to be allowed to do what ever the fuck they want, cause the patriots are so good that they have not won a Super Bowl in 10 years.
> 
> I have no idea what pats fans are saying other than they feel they are being all picked on, they feel the pats simply should be allowed to alter the balls since it is minor, and well......they are just sooooooo good that we are just so jealous......and well they did not do anything.
> 
> Yes that last statement is confusing and yet I stated the thinking of the typical pats fan in regards to this issue.
Click to expand...


I never said that the balls were not deflated by the Patriots.  It's a commonly accepted fact at this point that Tom Brady wants the balls as under-inflated as possible.  It only stands to reason that the balls the Patriots would have given to officials for use in the game would have been right at the limit. 

It is also an accepted fact that cold does affect ball pressure...lowering it. 

So put those two facts together.  You've got balls that were right at the limit...or even slightly below it depending on how thorough the referee doing the inspection was...and you've got temperatures outside that are lower than the room where the balls were inspected.

What would a logical person expect to have taken place?


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> Theowl32 said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, we are apparently in agreement then? The Colts have magic balls where the laws of physics ceased to effect them?
> 
> BTW, none of you seem to know or care (which is the telling part really) that the original complaint was from the first game in Indy in the dome. Where the equipment manager had two balls (yes pun intended) of Brady's and he noticed they were significantly deflated.
> 
> Ok? That was in November, in Indy under the dome where the weather was not a factor.
> 
> Then to stick with the notion that the Pats rubbed the balls so much that they became deflated and that was the reason their balls were deflated and the Colts were not deflated in the cold weather is absurd. You all know it and we all know it.
> 
> Again, this has nothing to do with the score in the game. That is a fallacy. Again, is a baseball player is caught corking their bats or a pitcher is caught doctoring their ball, the discussion is NOT ABOUT the score.
> 
> It is sad that people think the Pats ought to be able to do whatever they want just because it is a minor offense. It is pathetic really.
> 
> Now, please spare us with the weather thing. You are going to have to come up with something better than that. I mean holy shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love how you Patriots haters come up with these stories that have no basis in reality...stories that are subsequently denied by the people that supposedly originated them.  Case in point?  Those who said this investigation was prompted by the Colts DB who intercepted Tom Brady complaining to the officials that he thought the ball was under-inflated.  Great story except for one thing...the Colts DB says he never did any such thing!
> 
> So now you're claiming that the Colts complained to the league back in November that they thought the Patriot's balls were under-inflated.  Here's the problem with that whole scenario.  It doesn't make sense.  You're claiming that the Colts suspected the Patriots of playing with illegal balls in a regular season game but didn't demand that the officials check the Patriot's footballs until halftime in the playoff game that determines who goes to the Super Bowl?  A game that they were already heavy underdogs in?  A game that they would need every thing they could possibly get to go their way in order to win?  In order for THAT scenario to be plausible you would have to accept that the Colt's coaching staff were absolute idiots who somehow *forgot *to bring up their suspicions about ball inflation and let the Patriots play for half a game with balls that supposedly gave them an advantage.  Does any rational person who understands the hundreds of hours that NFL coaching staffs put into game preparation for the playoffs* REALLY* think that's the way it went down?  Seriously?  If you do...then all I can say is that you're some of the most naive people ever to walk the planet!
Click to expand...


I love how you resolve all of this interest in the rules being broken as "Patriot Haters"..  

I don't follow the Pats.  The Seahawks rarely play the Pats.  Last time was three years ago.  Seahawks won.

Hate the Patriots?   I didn't even think about the Patriots until we beat the Packers.


----------



## HUGGY

Oldstyle said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look!  The Patriots were caught red handed.  Saying they were not responsible is stupid.  Of COURSE they were responsible.  Even if a gofer crawled up in the ball bag and nibbled on 11 balls and they leaked enough air to be out of regs...THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE!  Stop being so juvenile.  The point is to diffuse the media's interest. ...not to prove you are right a week before the Super Bowl Game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't know that the Patriots were caught red handed because you don't know the facts involved, Huggy.  You've *assumed* them...oh, boy have you assumed them...and we all know what happens when you assume things.  So stop declaring what you KNOW...when you in fact know very little!
> 
> And stop giving advice on women when you obviously aren't qualified!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'll give advice as much as it pleases me.  You can stop taking it any time you want.
> 
> You internet Bozos that try to tell people what they can or can't do crack me up.
> 
> IMO you take yourself and what you put on message boards a bit too seriously.  How do you know I didn't just make it up about the Ex?  It's the internets Einstein.  All entertainment all the time.  And if it starts getting too much to deal with push that off button.  It won't kill ya to take a break from all this nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ah, Huggy?  I'm not the one who's telling people how to get along with their spouses when said spouse was out sleeping with other people...that would be you!  Just saying...
> 
> If you want to look like an internet *buffoon*...just keep on doing what you're doing!
Click to expand...


You take this medium too seriously.  I'm not telling anyone how to get along you goof.  I'm SUGGESTING that Tom and Bill could diffuse the Inflate-Gate hub bub in how they handle the questions.  They have handled it terribly.  They are eventually going to be held responsible no matter who actually changed the air pressure in the balls so denying responsibility now is silly and just promotes more questions.  That's all.


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oldstyle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> It doesn't matter what really happened.  What matters is getting the media off the blood trail.
> 
> Haven't you ever been married and got caught in some kind of a jam that was no way your fault but the little woman just won't let it go?  And YOU being the smarter part of the partnership just smiles and says.."you are absolutely right dear".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So your wife accuses you of sleeping with her best friend...which you didn't do...but because she won't "let it go"...you smile at her and say "you are absolutely right dear"?
> 
> Tell me how that works out for ya', Huggy!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dunno!  I'm not married any more.    And it's not because of her best friend.  I got rid of her because SHE was sleeping around.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I could see why, you spend all day obsessed with a football team that doesn't know you are alive and doesn't care.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes they do care.  They care very much.  That's all they can talk about.  The 12's this..the 12's that.  They slobber all over the 12's every chance they get.  .It's embarrassing really.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are delusional, if you died tomorrow, they wouldn't know, no tribute, no arm band, no feelings either way about you. The care about winning and making money, nothing more than that. The 12 BS is to get nut jobs to buy product, it's a gimmick.
Click to expand...


I don't have a clue what you are talking about.  When people die they don't think about anything.  They don't care who morns.  

As for missing me I know several people that value me being here and will miss what I offer.  But there are no vacuums so all needs will be met with or without me.

As for the Hawks...  I enjoy their success and see it as a reward for having the patience to hang on for so many years.


----------



## GWV5903

9/11 inside job said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You think the media attention is because the Colts lost?
> 
> It is an issue because the footballs were altered.  The fact that eleven were out of regulation and one ball was IN regulation is proof that an important rule had been violated.
> 
> The rule is there for a reason.  The reason is so both teams are playing with the same equipment.  It's called a level playing field.  Most people would argue that it is a fair rule.  Otherwise it would not be a rule would it.
> 
> The discovery of the Patriot cheating just happened to co-inside with the Colts game.
> 
> Do you think the Patriots can break the rules without repercussion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> BlahBlahBlah...
> 
> Did the refs not touch the balls?
> 
> You need to worry if your Seahawks can pull off another miracle...
> 
> There is no issue, period end of story...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> period,end of story is that you are in denial that belicheat is a cheater and liar and has now taught brady to do the same.
Click to expand...

 
So what was the advantage?

This should be good...


----------



## Freewill

hangover said:


> BluePhantom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Pats hadn't scored more points with properly inflated balls in the second half, there might be a cheating issue. But if cheating is cheating, all players that get flagged for holding, clipping, or interference should be banned from the game. Consistency please.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dude stop it.  There is a difference between a penalty in a game (that the NFL has determined punishments for) and manipulating equipment to enhance performance.  Corked bats = suspensions.  Doctored baseballs = suspensions.  PEDs = suspensions. Car not up to specs in NASCAR = suspensions. Wearing gold cleats = apparently suspensions.  Doctoring footballs by the Patriots = "oh we'll have a look into it...hey look at that pretty butterfly over there"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So something that doesn't effect the outcome of the game is cheating, but something that DOES effect the outcome of a game ISN'T cheating. You must be the ref that picked up the flag in the Detroit/Dallas game.
Click to expand...


How in the hell they did that shows how rigged is the NFL.  Not only was it a proper call the penalty was announced.  Then there is no explanation as to why it was picked up.  It was a incredible bit of BS.  Whose yet it lead to shamo Christie hugging 1 percenter Jones on TV.


----------



## mack20

Here's a really interesting article worth a read. I've quoted my favorite part below. 

NFL Kickers Talk about Playing with Their Balls VICE Sports



> Referees certainly didn't care about it. The kickers were more likely to be scolded by their teammates. "Quarterbacks use the same balls," Husted says, and there's a risk that "they can't grip it and they're getting all pissed at you." Occasionally, when he was with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, Husted says, Trent Dilfer would let him know he needed to lay off. *Hollis says he would always run the balls by Jaguars quarterback Mark Brunell.*


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## HUGGY

Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!

STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!


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## mack20

HUGGY said:


> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!



Why shouldn't he demand an apology if the NFL finds the Pats did nothing wrong?  The NFL has let this spiral massively out of control right before his team is set to play in the biggest game of the year.  He SHOULD be pissed the fuck off. 

I'm starting to wonder if the Pats are about to go nuclear on the league.  Man, I'd love to see that.


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> Here's a really interesting article worth a read. I've quoted my favorite part below.
> 
> NFL Kickers Talk about Playing with Their Balls VICE Sports
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Referees certainly didn't care about it. The kickers were more likely to be scolded by their teammates. "Quarterbacks use the same balls," Husted says, and there's a risk that "they can't grip it and they're getting all pissed at you." Occasionally, when he was with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, Husted says, Trent Dilfer would let him know he needed to lay off. *Hollis says he would always run the balls by Jaguars quarterback Mark Brunell.*
Click to expand...


Pretty good article, it puts it all in better perspective.


----------



## HUGGY

mack20 said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why shouldn't he demand an apology if the NFL finds the Pats did nothing wrong?  The NFL has let this spiral massively out of control right before his team is set to play in the biggest game of the year.  He SHOULD be pissed the fuck off.
> 
> I'm starting to wonder if the Pats are about to go nuclear on the league.  Man, I'd love to see that.
Click to expand...


They'll have to have their temper tantrum AFTER they get SPANKED this coming Sunday.


----------



## hangover

HUGGY said:


> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!


My my, that's a big corn cob up yer butt!


----------



## Papageorgio

hangover said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> My my, that's a big corn cob up yer butt!
Click to expand...


lol! His hypocrisy makes his reactions all the more hilarious.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HUGGY said:


> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!


I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

BluePhantom said:


> ok I am out of here and going to focus on the actual game.  Nothing but repeating the same arguments over and over on either side.



that's what happens when you try and have a rational discussion with the Belicheat apologists,they ignore facts only seeing what they want to see so you end up repeating the same thing over and over again since they ignore them.thats why I have them all on ignore as everybody here should..


----------



## hangover

9/11 inside job said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
Click to expand...

Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

GWV5903 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You think the media attention is because the Colts lost?
> 
> It is an issue because the footballs were altered.  The fact that eleven were out of regulation and one ball was IN regulation is proof that an important rule had been violated.
> 
> The rule is there for a reason.  The reason is so both teams are playing with the same equipment.  It's called a level playing field.  Most people would argue that it is a fair rule.  Otherwise it would not be a rule would it.
> 
> The discovery of the Patriot cheating just happened to co-inside with the Colts game.
> 
> Do you think the Patriots can break the rules without repercussion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> BlahBlahBlah...
> 
> Did the refs not touch the balls?
> 
> You need to worry if your Seahawks can pull off another miracle...
> 
> There is no issue, period end of story...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> period,end of story is that you are in denial that belicheat is a cheater and liar and has now taught brady to do the same.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So what was the advantage?
> 
> This should be good...
Click to expand...

as I been saying many times,ESPN reported that the ravens informed the colts they noticed the balls were deflated to have them checked.as I have said many times,it had no factor in the colts game.the colts always self destruct in the playoffs.hell they let the KANSAS CITY "CLOWNS" football team pull far ahead of them last year,they only came back and won cause they really ARE the Kansas city clowns,the biggest joke of an NFL franchise ever.

it obviously HAD to be a factor in the ravens game though the fact it was so close as any open minded rational person would understand.lol


----------



## LA RAM FAN

hangover said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
Click to expand...

don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?

people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?

If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

what a lot of people dont know is Belicheat actually revealed what a classless organization the cheatriots are before deflategate.

It was a year before that when they beat the chargers in the playoffs.after the game was over,many of the pats players went to the middle of the field and started dancing on the chargers logo and that got Ladanian Tomlinson and a few other charger players so pissed off they charged after the players doing that and mixed it up with them.

at the time I did not think anything of it cause I was happy the chargers lost cause I hated marty shittenheimer and wanted him gone and Belicheat hadn't been revealed as a cheater yet at that time.

But LT called it correctly after the game saying that the players that did that had no class at all and demonstrated poor sportsmenship.He was so right in his words he spoke back then.Thats the kind of behavior I would expect out of that idiot jerk terrel owens who danced on the cowboys logo after scoring a touchdown twice in a game.a complete asshole who should have been thrown out of the league for his actions.

those pats players were no different than owens.

LT also correctly said later on that day after the game-That was just poor sportsmanship and thats a reflection of the head coach.He nailed it.

I was happy for LT when he got his revenge and joined the jets and they beat the cheatriots in a playoff game.was happy to see LT get his revenge on them.Him being a former charger and all.


----------



## mack20

9/11 inside job said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the dumbest issue to come out. The Colt's sucked last Sunday, the football had nothing to do with it.
> 
> Why is this an issue?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You think the media attention is because the Colts lost?
> 
> It is an issue because the footballs were altered.  The fact that eleven were out of regulation and one ball was IN regulation is proof that an important rule had been violated.
> 
> The rule is there for a reason.  The reason is so both teams are playing with the same equipment.  It's called a level playing field.  Most people would argue that it is a fair rule.  Otherwise it would not be a rule would it.
> 
> The discovery of the Patriot cheating just happened to co-inside with the Colts game.
> 
> Do you think the Patriots can break the rules without repercussion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> BlahBlahBlah...
> 
> Did the refs not touch the balls?
> 
> You need to worry if your Seahawks can pull off another miracle...
> 
> There is no issue, period end of story...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> period,end of story is that you are in denial that belicheat is a cheater and liar and has now taught brady to do the same.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So what was the advantage?
> 
> This should be good...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> as I been saying many times,ESPN reported that the ravens informed the colts they noticed the balls were deflated to have them checked.as I have said many times,it had no factor in the colts game.the colts always self destruct in the playoffs.hell they let the KANSAS CITY "CLOWNS" football team pull far ahead of them last year,they only came back and won cause they really ARE the Kansas city clowns,the biggest joke of an NFL franchise ever.
> 
> it obviously HAD to be a factor in the ravens game though the fact it was so close as any open minded rational person would understand.lol
Click to expand...


Speaking of ignoring facts, reports say that THE RAVENS HAD ISSUES WITH THE KICKING BALLS.  

Care to comment?


----------



## GWV5903

What's the matter 911?? 

What's the advantage? 

Oh I see there isn't one, you're just blowing hot air...


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
Click to expand...


Oh GAWD.


----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
Click to expand...


First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies? 

Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies?
> 
> Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.
Click to expand...


OOOoooOOoo...  How manly!


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies?
> 
> Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OOOoooOOoo...  How manly!
Click to expand...


You are so quick to defend 911 nutter, not sure why, he lies all the time, he draws stupid conclusions with his insane logic. Then again you couldn't answer the questions I posed either so, STFU.


----------



## Politico

Wow 84 pages. You sheeple really have no minds of your own lol.


----------



## Papageorgio

Politico said:


> Wow 84 pages. You sheeple really have no minds of your own lol.


We all take after you.


----------



## Muhammed

9/11 inside job said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now Kraft is demanding an apology!  What a POS!
> 
> STFU Robert!  Why don't you apologize to all the people you stole from in your life!
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
Click to expand...

Cheating happens when so much money is at stake.

There was even cheating and gambling by adults when I was an 8 year old in little league football. For example, one team would field players in their 20s when the age limit was 13.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

GWV5903 said:


> What's the matter 911??
> 
> What's the advantage?
> 
> Oh I see there isn't one, you're just blowing hot air...



No only the belicheat apologists blow hot air.

If your so dense that you cant even figure out what the advantage was for the pats in a CLOSE game between them and the ravens,then just like all belicheat apologists,i might as well be talking to a brick wall.

as I have said a thousand times already,it wasn't that big a factor in the colts game.the non defense the colts have and the fact luck goes into meltdown mode in big games was what hurt them.it was in the CLOSE game with the ravens where it mattered,they alerted the colts to how the balls were deflated.do you have alzheimers diseace or something?

it you cant figure out how it was an advantage in the ravens game,then you are beyond hopeless.

you belicheat apologists ignore facts so I'm done with you.Im out of here.


----------



## HUGGY

Papageorgio said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> I watched part ESPN last night and heard Kraft come on and defend Belicheat and Brady and chris carter even said afterwards,that he thought Kraft was full of bullshit.Not his words he used of course,he just pretty much confirmed it that he did not think Krafts words were sincere though,that they jived.
> 
> 
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies?
> 
> Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OOOoooOOoo...  How manly!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *You are so quick to defend 911* nutter, not sure why, he lies all the time, he draws stupid conclusions with his insane logic. Then again you couldn't answer the questions I posed either so, STFU.
Click to expand...


*Really?  Links?*


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> 
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies?
> 
> Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OOOoooOOoo...  How manly!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *You are so quick to defend 911* nutter, not sure why, he lies all the time, he draws stupid conclusions with his insane logic. Then again you couldn't answer the questions I posed either so, STFU.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Really?  Links?*
Click to expand...

Lol! You need links? Try this thread. You are very funny..


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HUGGY said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bet you eat crow by the time the truth comes out.
> 
> 
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies?
> 
> Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OOOoooOOoo...  How manly!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *You are so quick to defend 911* nutter, not sure why, he lies all the time, he draws stupid conclusions with his insane logic. Then again you couldn't answer the questions I posed either so, STFU.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Really?  Links?*
Click to expand...


seriously? you really hadn't heard about this one?

Report Ravens Notified Colts to be Aware of Patriots Deflated Footballs - Stampede Blue

NFL was ready to check New England Patriots footballs against Colts report says - Newsday


----------



## Roadrunner

Alex. said:


> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> 
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> 
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.


I tell ya, I don't follow NFL, but I have gotten the biggest kick out of the smirk on Rachel Nichol's face as she has discussed deflated balls.


----------



## percysunshine

.

I would like to point out that it took the entire staff of the New York Times 10 days to figure out what anyone with a freshman education in science knew in 5 minutes;








http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/30/s...ave-science-on-their-side-after-all.html?_r=0

.


----------



## Roadrunner

This should be in a NO SHIT SHERLOCK thread.

Any kid that ever left is football out overnight knows what happens when they cool off.


----------



## Alex.

Roadrunner said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> "The NFL will investigate the possibility that the New England Patriots deflated footballs during the AFC championship game, which they won 45-7 over the Indianapolis Colts, according to Bob Kravitz of WTHR.com.
> 
> The league has guidelines on how much pressure the ball must have — between 12.5 and 13.5 pounds per square inch, weighing between 14 and 15 ounces.
> 
> The Patriots have faced accusations that they've skirted the rules for years, and they were penalized for spying on the New York Jets during the 2007 season with the loss of a first-round draft pick and a hefty fine paid not by the team but by Bill Belichick himself."
> 
> Deflate-gate Report Patriots being investigated for using deflated footballs Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports
> 
> 
> 
> I would not be surprised, not one bit. Beli-cheat is a cheater.
> 
> 
> 
> Looking forward to a great super bowl,   maybe the best in a while.
> 
> 
> 
> I tell ya, I don't follow NFL, but I have gotten the biggest kick out of the smirk on Rachel Nichol's face as she has discussed deflated balls.
Click to expand...


The whole thing is so silly...that they have to cheat


----------



## Papageorgio

It's so silly that after decades of this only now and only one team, and now it is a big issue. Refs have known for years that teams have adjusted the air pressure and a ton of other things. But now and only now does anyone care. Why is that?


----------



## mack20

Papageorgio said:


> It's so silly that after decades of this only now and only one team, and now it is a big issue. Refs have known for years that teams have adjusted the air pressure and a ton of other things. But now and only now does anyone care. Why is that?



The Vikings were caught illegally heating up footballs on the sideline in November 2014.  That's two months ago. I follow football fairly closely and I hadn't heard about that until this week.  That about shows everyone what the reaction to this whole thing SHOULD'VE been.


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's so silly that after decades of this only now and only one team, and now it is a big issue. Refs have known for years that teams have adjusted the air pressure and a ton of other things. But now and only now does anyone care. Why is that?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Vikings were caught illegally heating up footballs on the sideline in November 2014.  That's two months ago. I follow football fairly closely and I hadn't heard about that until this week.  That about shows everyone what the reaction to this whole thing SHOULD'VE been.
Click to expand...


Yep, and it is done often and it is no big deal. I'm not saying it is right, I'm not saying it is not cheating, I'm saying it is common and only now, it's newsworthy.


----------



## ChrisL

9/11 inside job said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> don't tell me YOU are one of the belicheat apologists here as well?
> 
> people like pooper,trollstyle,and chrissy I can understand but YOU? please tell me that's not true?
> 
> If I do,then I will be in very good company with many famous sports celebritys the fact people like jerry rice,chris carter,and others have said its plain cheating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First off how would you know whether I was an apologist for the Pats or not, you have me on ignore, remember or are your forgetting you lies?
> 
> Secondly, I'm not apologizing anyone or any team. I raise some questions that no one has the balls to ask or answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OOOoooOOoo...  How manly!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *You are so quick to defend 911* nutter, not sure why, he lies all the time, he draws stupid conclusions with his insane logic. Then again you couldn't answer the questions I posed either so, STFU.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Really?  Links?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> seriously? you really hadn't heard about this one?
> 
> Report Ravens Notified Colts to be Aware of Patriots Deflated Footballs - Stampede Blue
> 
> NFL was ready to check New England Patriots footballs against Colts report says - Newsday
Click to expand...


I thought you said you were outta here?  GO.


----------



## GWV5903

9/11 inside job said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's the matter 911??
> 
> What's the advantage?
> 
> Oh I see there isn't one, you're just blowing hot air...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No only the belicheat apologists blow hot air.
> 
> If your so dense that you cant even figure out what the advantage was for the pats in a CLOSE game between them and the ravens,then just like all belicheat apologists,i might as well be talking to a brick wall.
> 
> as I have said a thousand times already,it wasn't that big a factor in the colts game.the non defense the colts have and the fact luck goes into meltdown mode in big games was what hurt them.it was in the CLOSE game with the ravens where it mattered,they alerted the colts to how the balls were deflated.do you have alzheimers diseace or something?
> 
> it you cant figure out how it was an advantage in the ravens game,then you are beyond hopeless.
> 
> you belicheat apologists ignore facts so I'm done with you.Im out of here.
Click to expand...

 
Hey dumbass the issue is with the Colt's game, and the Patriots had nothing to do with the kicking balls in any game you f'ing moron...

_"*Back in 1999, the NFL took the kicking balls out of the hands of the teams.*  Current rules require the referee to open six brand-new footballs before every game, marking them as kicking balls.  Those balls are used separately and apart from the balls used by each team’s offense."_

Thanks for making it clear your head is stuck up your ass, how do you get out of bed dumb dumb...


----------



## GWV5903

9/11 inside job said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's the matter 911??
> 
> What's the advantage?
> 
> Oh I see there isn't one, you're just blowing hot air...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No only the belicheat apologists blow hot air.
> 
> If your so dense that you cant even figure out what the advantage was for the pats in a CLOSE game between them and the ravens,then just like all belicheat apologists,i might as well be talking to a brick wall.
> 
> as I have said a thousand times already,it wasn't that big a factor in the colts game.the non defense the colts have and the fact luck goes into meltdown mode in big games was what hurt them.it was in the CLOSE game with the ravens where it mattered,they alerted the colts to how the balls were deflated.do you have alzheimers diseace or something?
> 
> it you cant figure out how it was an advantage in the ravens game,then you are beyond hopeless.
> 
> you belicheat apologists ignore facts so I'm done with you.Im out of here.
Click to expand...

 
So neither one of their kickers missed a beat in that game...

*J. Tucker** 1/1 100.0 25 4/4 7  
Team 1/1 100.0 25 4/4 7 *

*S. Koch** 4 201 50.3 0 0 53 
Team 4 201 50.3 0 0 53 *

So when you have zero creditability on every subject do you feel as dumb as you sound...


----------



## hangover

GWV5903 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's the matter 911??
> 
> What's the advantage?
> 
> Oh I see there isn't one, you're just blowing hot air...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No only the belicheat apologists blow hot air.
> 
> If your so dense that you cant even figure out what the advantage was for the pats in a CLOSE game between them and the ravens,then just like all belicheat apologists,i might as well be talking to a brick wall.
> 
> as I have said a thousand times already,it wasn't that big a factor in the colts game.the non defense the colts have and the fact luck goes into meltdown mode in big games was what hurt them.it was in the CLOSE game with the ravens where it mattered,they alerted the colts to how the balls were deflated.do you have alzheimers diseace or something?
> 
> it you cant figure out how it was an advantage in the ravens game,then you are beyond hopeless.
> 
> you belicheat apologists ignore facts so I'm done with you.Im out of here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey dumbass the issue is with the Colt's game, and the Patriots had nothing to do with the kicking balls in any game you f'ing moron...
> 
> _"*Back in 1999, the NFL took the kicking balls out of the hands of the teams.*  Current rules require the referee to open six brand-new footballs before every game, marking them as kicking balls.  Those balls are used separately and apart from the balls used by each team’s offense."_
> 
> Thanks for making it clear your head is stuck up your ass, how do you get out of bed dumb dumb...
Click to expand...

Gee wiliker wowey! After reading such an elegant post, I'm sure you're going to throw something at your TV when the Pats win the SB.


----------



## GWV5903

hangover said:


> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GWV5903 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's the matter 911??
> 
> What's the advantage?
> 
> Oh I see there isn't one, you're just blowing hot air...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No only the belicheat apologists blow hot air.
> 
> If your so dense that you cant even figure out what the advantage was for the pats in a CLOSE game between them and the ravens,then just like all belicheat apologists,i might as well be talking to a brick wall.
> 
> as I have said a thousand times already,it wasn't that big a factor in the colts game.the non defense the colts have and the fact luck goes into meltdown mode in big games was what hurt them.it was in the CLOSE game with the ravens where it mattered,they alerted the colts to how the balls were deflated.do you have alzheimers diseace or something?
> 
> it you cant figure out how it was an advantage in the ravens game,then you are beyond hopeless.
> 
> you belicheat apologists ignore facts so I'm done with you.Im out of here.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hey dumbass the issue is with the Colt's game, and the Patriots had nothing to do with the kicking balls in any game you f'ing moron...
> 
> _"*Back in 1999, the NFL took the kicking balls out of the hands of the teams.*  Current rules require the referee to open six brand-new footballs before every game, marking them as kicking balls.  Those balls are used separately and apart from the balls used by each team’s offense."_
> 
> Thanks for making it clear your head is stuck up your ass, how do you get out of bed dumb dumb...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Gee wiliker wowey! After reading such an elegant post, I'm sure you're going to throw something at your TV when the Pats win the SB.
Click to expand...

 
Dam you're sooooo perceptive...


----------



## LA RAM FAN

three farts in a row from you GWV.

thats all belecheat apologists can do when you know you are cornered with pesky facts you cant refute knowing you are defeated,is shit all over the floor.that and this as well of course.

since you are too immature to admit defeat,its time for me to follow this advise here.

this site sure seems to attract belicheat trolls like you.

Looks like my ignore list has grown larger.this is what everybody here trying to discuss these facts with how the pats cheat to thsi belicheat apologist should do with this troll as with all belicheat apologists..


----------



## Papageorgio

A QB admits every team deflates their footballs.

Ex-QB Jeff Blake Every team deflates footballs in NFL The Blitz with Jeff Howe Karen Guregian Boston Herald

I have been saying this all along, that is why the refs did nothing when they handled the footballs, they were normal to them. 

The refs had to know, no other explanation.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

^four farts in a row from the trolls.


----------



## manifold




----------



## hangover

Looks like Seattle fans are really looking for an excuse for later tonite.


----------



## GWV5903

9/11 inside job said:


> three farts in a row from you GWV.
> 
> thats all belecheat apologists can do when you know you are cornered with pesky facts you cant refute knowing you are defeated,is shit all over the floor.that and this as well of course.
> 
> since you are too immature to admit defeat,its time for me to follow this advise here.
> 
> this site sure seems to attract belicheat trolls like you.
> 
> Looks like my ignore list has grown larger.this is what everybody here trying to discuss these facts with how the pats cheat to thsi belicheat apologist should do with this troll as with all belicheat apologists..


 
Hey dumb dumb, you have yet to come up with anything that proves your point, but you already knew this...


----------



## mack20

Ian Rappaport reported today that only one of the Patriots footballs was 2 lbs under (the one the Colts had), and that the rest were "just a few ticks" under the allowable limit.  Goodell is such a fucking fraud.


----------



## HUGGY

hangover said:


> Looks like Seattle fans are really looking for an excuse for later tonite.



Drunk again?  I'm shocked!

My prediction "Hangover" won't make it to halftime.  Better record the game Sport .  Even if you don't officially Black Out you probably won't remember anything of the game.


----------



## Jroc

*New report says only one Patriots football was seriously deflated*





> But in case details matter to you, there's a new report that would significantly change what we think of the controversy involving the New England Patriots' deflated footballs in the AFC championship game.
> 
> NFL Network's Ian Rapoport said only one of the Patriots' 12 game footballs was two pounds under the minimum of 12.5 pounds per square inch (PSI). The report said 11 were under 12.5 PSI but many were "just a few ticks under the minimum."
> 
> That would change things, but there are two conflicting reports by respected writers on the matter. One of the reports that shaped the public opinion of deflate-gate came from ESPN.com's Chris Mortensen on Jan. 21. He said 11 of the 12 footballs were "significantly" under the 12.5 level, and that "the footballs were inflated 2 pounds per square inch below what's required by NFL regulations




New report says only one Patriots football was seriously deflated Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports


----------



## GWV5903

Bad call Pete, better check the balls PSI maybe that's where your play calling is...


----------



## hangover

HUGGY said:


> hangover said:
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like Seattle fans are really looking for an excuse for later tonite.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drunk again?  I'm shocked!
> 
> My prediction "Hangover" won't make it to halftime.  Better record the game Sport .  Even if you don't officially Black Out you probably won't remember anything of the game.
Click to expand...

Who's drowning their sorrows?


----------



## ChrisL

Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.



Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.

Here just to mark your special day.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
Click to expand...


Well, thankfully I don't drink.    So you can continue to be your nasty disgusting little weaner self.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
Click to expand...


Here's Tom Brady after our win last night.  See the look on his face?  Guess what he's saying to you?  Lol!


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's Tom Brady after our win last night.  See the look on his face?  Guess what he's saying to you?  Lol!
Click to expand...


You are deranged.....get sober lady....I do not know Tom Brady he does not know me.... However, I do respect his effort and execution yesterday


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's Tom Brady after our win last night.  See the look on his face?  Guess what he's saying to you?  Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are deranged.....get sober lady....I do not know Tom Brady he does not know me.... However, I do respect his effort and execution yesterday
Click to expand...


That was joke, you weiner.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's Tom Brady after our win last night.  See the look on his face?  Guess what he's saying to you?  Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are deranged.....get sober lady....I do not know Tom Brady he does not know me.... However, I do respect his effort and execution yesterday
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That was joke, you weiner.
Click to expand...




LOL you call me out rub my face in The Patriots, who I commend, and you go away all butt hurt and angry.


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's Tom Brady after our win last night.  See the look on his face?  Guess what he's saying to you?  Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are deranged.....get sober lady....I do not know Tom Brady he does not know me.... However, I do respect his effort and execution yesterday
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That was joke, you weiner.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL you call me out rub my face in The Patriots, who I commend, and you go away all butt hurt and angry.
Click to expand...


Hey, the point is that you started this nasty thread and made a whole slew of nasty comments about my favorite team.  Then, they win the Superbowl and YOU don't even have the class to say congratulations.  All you do is throw around MORE insults.  That says a lot about the kind of person you are.    I'm not butt hurt or angry.  I'm just pointing out what jerks the Patriots haters are and how they will NEVER be satisfied.


----------



## ChrisL

Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.


I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.


----------



## manifold

As a long-time, die-hard Pats fan, I'd like to apologize to everyone for ChrisL.

That whiny twat is a downright embarrassment to Patriot Nation.

true story


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
Click to expand...


This is what derangement is.  YOU.  He didn't do anything to the game.    It's called "PHDS"  Patriots Hater Derangement Syndrome.  Bill didn't do anything to the game of football.  

You only "commended" them after I commented about it.  And even that wasn't very sincere.  Lol.


----------



## ChrisL

manifold said:


> As a long-time, die-hard Pats fan, I'd like to apologize to everyone for ChrisL.
> 
> That whiny twat is a downright embarrassment to Patriot Nation.
> 
> true story



Oh sure, I'm the one who starts all the whiny threads here right?  No, I just respond to the whiners.


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is what derangement is.  YOU.  He didn't do anything to the game.    It's called "PHDS"  Patriots Hater Derangement Syndrome.  Bill didn't do anything to the game of football.
> 
> You only "commended" them after I commented about it.  And even that wasn't very sincere.  Lol.
Click to expand...

Get sober


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is what derangement is.  YOU.  He didn't do anything to the game.    It's called "PHDS"  Patriots Hater Derangement Syndrome.  Bill didn't do anything to the game of football.
> 
> You only "commended" them after I commented about it.  And even that wasn't very sincere.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Get sober
Click to expand...


You're the one drowning your sorrows old man.    I'm psyched!  My team won after all!


----------



## Alex.

ChrisL said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is what derangement is.  YOU.  He didn't do anything to the game.    It's called "PHDS"  Patriots Hater Derangement Syndrome.  Bill didn't do anything to the game of football.
> 
> You only "commended" them after I commented about it.  And even that wasn't very sincere.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Get sober
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're the one drowning your sorrows old man.    I'm psyched!  My team won after all!
Click to expand...



Get sober .   By now you have spent hours coming after me, you are drowning in your own bitter swill, looks like the only thing you have going for you is a game played by others who did an excellent job at succeeding for which you claim some vicarious victory.

In that time I have eaten, taken care of business and made plans for some winter fun. The time you have spent and your constant attacks are  sad testament to who you are don't you have a life to attend to?


----------



## ChrisL

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> This is what derangement is.  YOU.  He didn't do anything to the game.    It's called "PHDS"  Patriots Hater Derangement Syndrome.  Bill didn't do anything to the game of football.
> 
> You only "commended" them after I commented about it.  And even that wasn't very sincere.  Lol.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Get sober
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're the one drowning your sorrows old man.    I'm psyched!  My team won after all!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Get sober .   By now you have spent hours coming after me, you are drowning in your own bitter swill, looks like the only thing you have going for you is a game played by others who did an excellent job at succeeding for which you claim some vicarious victory.
> 
> In that time I have eaten, taken care of business and made plans for some winter fun. The time you have spent and your constant attacks are  sad testament to who you are don't you have a life to attend to?
Click to expand...


 Face it, you were WRONG about the Patriots.  You can stop responding to my posts anytime.    I'm just pointing out what jerks you Pats haters are is all.


----------



## Papageorgio

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
Click to expand...


You realize that it is beginning to look like Belichick and Brady were right when they said they knew nothing about it. There are reports surfacing that the whole story was made up. Just saying...not sure what is or isn't true, but I'll wait until all the evidence is in before I go forming an opinion.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You realize that it is beginning to look like Belichick and Brady were right when they said they knew nothing about it. There are reports surfacing that the whole story was made up. Just saying...not sure what is or isn't true, but I'll wait until all the evidence is in before I go forming an opinion.
Click to expand...


I heard CNN screwed up and it was only one ball that was deflated.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You realize that it is beginning to look like Belichick and Brady were right when they said they knew nothing about it. There are reports surfacing that the whole story was made up. Just saying...not sure what is or isn't true, but I'll wait until all the evidence is in before I go forming an opinion.
Click to expand...


Isn't it funny how Alex was posting pictures and calling the Patriots cheaters, saying they wouldn't win and being a holier than thou arse, and now that the Pats won he shut RIGHT up.  LOL.    He's got nothing now but to call other posters and Patriots fans "drunks."  What a loser that guy is.


----------



## ChrisL




----------



## TrinityPower

ChrisL said:


>


At least the real candidates for MVP are going to Disneyland.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

TrinityPower said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least the real candidates for MVP are going to Disneyland.
Click to expand...


says the cheatriot fan.lol


----------



## LA RAM FAN

wonder what the cheatriot apologists such as chrissy troll,mack,trinnity, papageorgio"pooper"and trollstyle have to say NOW about the men they worship Tom Brady and Bill Belicheat.

if they still like them now,well they love liars and cheaters.

With that line on Page 121 of the massive report, it again questions the validity of the Patriots' great dynasty, which included a Super Bowl victory this past February, the fourth for coach Bill Belichick and quarterback Tom Brady.

Brady was specifically implicated as well.

"Based on the evidence, we also have concluded that it is more probable than not that Tom Brady was at least generally aware of the inappropriate activities of McNally and Jastremski involving the release of air from Patriots game balls," the report said.


Long-awaited deflate-gate investigation implicates Pats Tom Brady Shutdown Corner - Yahoo Sports

the cheatriot apologists such as chris,mack,pooper,trollstyle and others can sugarcoat it all they want but since Brady and Belicheat have lied from day one,they will be remembered in the same breath as roger clemons,sammy sosa,barry bonds,and roger clemons.Players who had to cheat to achieve greatness.

If those two ever go into the hall of fame it will show the hypocrisy of sports the fact that pete rose is banned but these cheaters and liars get off scott free.

I love how it says Brady might be punished as well.so much for his legacy of being up there with Terry Bradshaw and Joe Montana as the greatest quarterback who ever played in a superbowl.

the only thing that is disgusting about it is he is taking the fall it appears for belicheat and kraft the fact they are covering up THEIR knowledge of it lying saying they probably did not know about it which is an obvious outright lie.everyone in the country knows they are as much guilty as Brady is.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alex. said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone should note, no congratulations from Alex after all his crying in this thread because THAT is the kind of person he is, just like I've been saying all along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations to you ChrisL? You did not play, so perhaps you have one day away from alcohol.
> 
> Here just to mark your special day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incidentally, I sent my congratulations to those I know who actually helped the Patriots win, they deserved it!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Here's Tom Brady after our win last night.  See the look on his face?  Guess what he's saying to you?  Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You are deranged.....get sober lady....I do not know Tom Brady he does not know me.... However, I do respect his effort and execution yesterday
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That was joke, you weiner.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL you call me out rub my face in The Patriots, who I commend, and you go away all butt hurt and angry.
Click to expand...



thats whining troll chris for ya.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

Alex. said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and then to boot, you accuse me of being a drunk.  Lol.  Classy, Alex.  You're just like most of the Patriot haters, a real class act.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Patriot hater I hate what Beli-cheat did to the game. Keep on guzzling. I commended the team for thier heads up ball playing and winning the game.
Click to expand...



exactly.Belicheat has tarnished the game.Dont forget to mention though that pete the cheat has tarnished it as well.


----------



## Papageorgio

The report says Brady probably knew and I'm willing to bet the officials knew.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

someone farted in here.^


----------



## LA RAM FAN

With that line on Page 121 of the massive report, it again questions the validity of the Patriots' great dynasty, which included a Super Bowl victory this past February, the fourth for coach Bill Belichick and quarterback Tom Brady.

that's basically pretty much what I along with many  others here were saying back then that no matter what the results of the superbowl were,regardless of the score,Brady and Belicheat are going to go down in history remembered in the same breath as Clemons,Sosa,McGuire,and Bonds as players who had to lie and cheat their whole careers to achieve greatness.

It all started with the worst call in NFL playoff history with the bullshit tuck rule invented because the NFL wanted the patriots in the superbowl that year since the NFL season started off that same year  9/11 happened so they wanted the see the name PATRIOTS in the superbowl.

the proof is in the pudding in that game as well cause I have that game on tape and its so obvious to any thinking objective rational person it is NOT a theory the NFL wanted the patriots in the superbowl.

You just watch that game.Not only did they invent the bullshit tuck rule so they could get to the superbowl that year,they ALSO in that game,made two very bad costly calls that went against the raiders costing them that game.here they are.

1.early in the game,Tim Brown picked up a first down as the game shows.The corrupt officials though said he was short.complete BS.

the announcers could not believe it either,you hear them saying they thought that brown had the first down and it was a bad call.Tim Brown was livid and infuriated yelling at the officials about it as he should have been.

2.Rich Gannon was scrambling late in the game when the protection broke down and longggg after he threw the ball,he was grasped from behind which Gannon was yelling at the officials for to throw the yellow flag because it was an obvious personal foul penalty the raiders should have had for 15 yards which would have set up a field goal with field position but were denied.


meanwhile the cheatriots did not have ONE SINGLE BAD CALL go against them that day.


and Im not being like a certain wacked seahawk fan  fool here does   at times who rambles on  about how the officials have a vendetta against  his seahawks and ignores it when people bring up facts they made bad calls against the other team they played as well either.


just watch that game and you see for yourself,two critical NON CALLS against the raiders happened that day that had they been called correctly by the officials,would have given the raiders a victory and NO BAD CALLS went against the patriots that day.fact.NOT theory cheatriot lovers.


----------



## mack20

9/11 inside job said:


> With that line on Page 121 of the massive report, it again questions the validity of the Patriots' great dynasty, which included a Super Bowl victory this past February, the fourth for coach Bill Belichick and quarterback Tom Brady.
> 
> that's basically pretty much what I along with many  others here were saying back then that no matter what the results of the superbowl were,regardless of the score,Brady and Belicheat are going to go down in history remembered in the same breath as Clemons,Sosa,McGuire,and Bonds as players who had to lie and cheat their whole careers to achieve greatness.
> 
> It all started with the worst call in NFL playoff history with the bullshit tuck rule invented because the NFL wanted the patriots in the superbowl that year since the NFL season started off that same year  9/11 happened so they wanted the see the name PATRIOTS in the superbowl.
> 
> the proof is in the pudding in that game as well cause I have that game on tape and its so obvious to any thinking objective rational person it is NOT a theory the NFL wanted the patriots in the superbowl.
> 
> You just watch that game.Not only did they invent the bullshit tuck rule so they could get to the superbowl that year,they ALSO in that game,made two very bad costly calls that went against the raiders costing them that game.here they are.
> 
> 1.early in the game,Tim Brown picked up a first down as the game shows.The corrupt officials though said he was short.complete BS.
> 
> the announcers could not believe it either,you hear them saying they thought that brown had the first down and it was a bad call.Tim Brown was livid and infuriated yelling at the officials about it as he should have been.
> 
> 2.Rich Gannon was scrambling late in the game when the protection broke down and longggg after he threw the ball,he was grasped from behind which Gannon was yelling at the officials for to throw the yellow flag because it was an obvious personal foul penalty the raiders should have had for 15 yards which would have set up a field goal with field position but were denied.
> 
> 
> meanwhile the cheatriots did not have ONE SINGLE BAD CALL go against them that day.
> 
> 
> and Im not being like a certain wacked seahawk fan  fool here does   at times who rambles on  about how the officials have a vendetta against  his seahawks and ignores it when people bring up facts they made bad calls against the other team they played as well either.
> 
> 
> just watch that game and you see for yourself,two critical NON CALLS against the raiders happened that day that had they been called correctly by the officials,would have given the raiders a victory and NO BAD CALLS went against the patriots that day.fact.NOT theory cheatriot lovers.



Oh shut the fuck up, the tuck rule was not invented for that game.


----------



## mack20

As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> With that line on Page 121 of the massive report, it again questions the validity of the Patriots' great dynasty, which included a Super Bowl victory this past February, the fourth for coach Bill Belichick and quarterback Tom Brady.
> 
> that's basically pretty much what I along with many  others here were saying back then that no matter what the results of the superbowl were,regardless of the score,Brady and Belicheat are going to go down in history remembered in the same breath as Clemons,Sosa,McGuire,and Bonds as players who had to lie and cheat their whole careers to achieve greatness.
> 
> It all started with the worst call in NFL playoff history with the bullshit tuck rule invented because the NFL wanted the patriots in the superbowl that year since the NFL season started off that same year  9/11 happened so they wanted the see the name PATRIOTS in the superbowl.
> 
> the proof is in the pudding in that game as well cause I have that game on tape and its so obvious to any thinking objective rational person it is NOT a theory the NFL wanted the patriots in the superbowl.
> 
> You just watch that game.Not only did they invent the bullshit tuck rule so they could get to the superbowl that year,they ALSO in that game,made two very bad costly calls that went against the raiders costing them that game.here they are.
> 
> 1.early in the game,Tim Brown picked up a first down as the game shows.The corrupt officials though said he was short.complete BS.
> 
> the announcers could not believe it either,you hear them saying they thought that brown had the first down and it was a bad call.Tim Brown was livid and infuriated yelling at the officials about it as he should have been.
> 
> 2.Rich Gannon was scrambling late in the game when the protection broke down and longggg after he threw the ball,he was grasped from behind which Gannon was yelling at the officials for to throw the yellow flag because it was an obvious personal foul penalty the raiders should have had for 15 yards which would have set up a field goal with field position but were denied.
> 
> 
> meanwhile the cheatriots did not have ONE SINGLE BAD CALL go against them that day.
> 
> 
> and Im not being like a certain wacked seahawk fan  fool here does   at times who rambles on  about how the officials have a vendetta against  his seahawks and ignores it when people bring up facts they made bad calls against the other team they played as well either.
> 
> 
> just watch that game and you see for yourself,two critical NON CALLS against the raiders happened that day that had they been called correctly by the officials,would have given the raiders a victory and NO BAD CALLS went against the patriots that day.fact.NOT theory cheatriot lovers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh shut the fuck up, the tuck rule was not invented for that game.
Click to expand...


I'm a life long Raider fan and I believe a true champion would have overcome the calls and won. We couldn't, hats off to the Pats.


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?



I think it is obvious that the footballs were deflated and I think Brady, the receivers and the officials knew about it.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.


----------



## mack20

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.



Interesting theory.  The Falcons were punished for pumping in crowd noise prior to the draft, and were docked a draft pick as a result.  Care to tell me what year that docked pick came from?


----------



## mack20

Papageorgio said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it is obvious that the footballs were deflated and I think Brady, the receivers and the officials knew about it.
Click to expand...


I reserve the right to be wrong here, but I have yet to see any actual evidence demonstrating that Brady asked them to inflate the balls below spec. Lots of circumstantial stuff that appears to make Brady look bad, but I haven't seen anything that shows that he asked them to inflate the balls to below 12.5, or that he asked anyone to deflate the balls after they had passed inspection.


----------



## HUGGY

mack20 said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it is obvious that the footballs were deflated and I think Brady, the receivers and the officials knew about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I reserve the right to be wrong here, but I have yet to see any actual evidence demonstrating that Brady asked them to inflate the balls below spec. Lots of circumstantial stuff that appears to make Brady look bad, but I haven't seen anything that shows that he asked them to inflate the balls to below 12.5, or that he asked anyone to deflate the balls after they had passed inspection.
Click to expand...


Brady wouldn't have to give the ball boy a specific pounds per sq in number.  When I check this tire on my Eldorado that has a slow leak I just push my thumb into it.  I can tell if it needs air by the deflection in the tire's side wall.  All Tom would have to do is hand the kid a ball that was exactly the pressure he desired and the kid would grip it and push a thumb into it to get the desired outcome on the other footballs.  

But to suggest that an NFL QB doesn't know what an under inflated football feels like is ridiculous.  Try to convince me that an athlete with that much riding on his ability to throw a football isn't tuned into how the ball feels.  That's the part that irks me...that Brady thinks we are stupid.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

mack20 said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting theory.  The Falcons were punished for pumping in crowd noise prior to the draft, and were docked a draft pick as a result.  Care to tell me what year that docked pick came from?
Click to expand...


   That'd be next year. So I guess there's still hope they'll get theirs come next year.
     The timing just seems a little convenient.


----------



## Papageorgio

HUGGY said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it is obvious that the footballs were deflated and I think Brady, the receivers and the officials knew about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I reserve the right to be wrong here, but I have yet to see any actual evidence demonstrating that Brady asked them to inflate the balls below spec. Lots of circumstantial stuff that appears to make Brady look bad, but I haven't seen anything that shows that he asked them to inflate the balls to below 12.5, or that he asked anyone to deflate the balls after they had passed inspection.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady wouldn't have to give the ball boy a specific pounds per sq in number.  When I check this tire on my Eldorado that has a slow leak I just push my thumb into it.  I can tell if it needs air by the deflection in the tire's side wall.  All Tom would have to do is hand the kid a ball that was exactly the pressure he desired and the kid would grip it and push a thumb into it to get the desired outcome on the other footballs.
> 
> But to suggest that an NFL QB doesn't know what an under inflated football feels like is ridiculous.  Try to convince me that an athlete with that much riding on his ability to throw a football isn't tuned into how the ball feels.  That's the part that irks me...that Brady thinks we are stupid.
Click to expand...


That means the officials had to know.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

someone farted in here.^


----------



## mack20

I've gotta say, it's slightly impressive how 9/11 could write a single sentence or a half cocked diatribe and still always manages to say nothing of substance.


----------



## Papageorgio

mack20 said:


> I've gotta say, it's slightly impressive how 9/11 could write a single sentence or a half cocked diatribe and still always manages to say nothing of substance.



I don't read his posts anymore, he is irrelevant.


----------



## ChrisL

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.



Well you are wrong.  I heard on my local sports channel that they are indeed losing some draft picks.  So there!  Happy pappy?


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've gotta say, it's slightly impressive how 9/11 could write a single sentence or a half cocked diatribe and still always manages to say nothing of substance.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't read his posts anymore, he is irrelevant.
Click to expand...


That must be the understatement of this century.    I have a few other words I would probably use . . . if I wanted to be mean.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.



_Indeed._


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HUGGY said:


> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it is obvious that the footballs were deflated and I think Brady, the receivers and the officials knew about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I reserve the right to be wrong here, but I have yet to see any actual evidence demonstrating that Brady asked them to inflate the balls below spec. Lots of circumstantial stuff that appears to make Brady look bad, but I haven't seen anything that shows that he asked them to inflate the balls to below 12.5, or that he asked anyone to deflate the balls after they had passed inspection.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady wouldn't have to give the ball boy a specific pounds per sq in number.  When I check this tire on my Eldorado that has a slow leak I just push my thumb into it.  I can tell if it needs air by the deflection in the tire's side wall.  All Tom would have to do is hand the kid a ball that was exactly the pressure he desired and the kid would grip it and push a thumb into it to get the desired outcome on the other footballs.
> 
> But to suggest that an NFL QB doesn't know what an under inflated football feels like is ridiculous.  Try to convince me that an athlete with that much riding on his ability to throw a football isn't tuned into how the ball feels.  That's the part that irks me...that Brady thinks we are stupid.
Click to expand...


that is why there are so many former NFL players saying Brady is a liar and cheater and these brady/belicheat worshippers cant stand to hear this inconvient truth.they can only sling shit in defeat like the monkey trolls they are.


----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^



Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team? 

You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.

You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet? 

Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination? 

Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.


----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Indeed._
Click to expand...


They took draft picks away dumb fuck, can you be any dumber?


----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mack20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for the Wells report, I haven't had time to read it yet, but I plan on doing so.  However, from the bits and pieces I've gathered so far, I definitely think some things sound odd.  I'll have to read the report to see if my questions are answered, but it sounds like the Colts also had 3 out of 4 tested footballs come in below the required PSI, it doesn't seem like the actual PSI of the Pats footballs were recorded before the game, the leaked texts I've seen indicate that the equipment guys underinflated the balls before the inspection, but not necessarily that they ever touched them after they'd been approved.  And also, "Brady more probably than not was generally aware"...3 months and all we get is that vague as fuck bullshit?  Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it is obvious that the footballs were deflated and I think Brady, the receivers and the officials knew about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I reserve the right to be wrong here, but I have yet to see any actual evidence demonstrating that Brady asked them to inflate the balls below spec. Lots of circumstantial stuff that appears to make Brady look bad, but I haven't seen anything that shows that he asked them to inflate the balls to below 12.5, or that he asked anyone to deflate the balls after they had passed inspection.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Brady wouldn't have to give the ball boy a specific pounds per sq in number.  When I check this tire on my Eldorado that has a slow leak I just push my thumb into it.  I can tell if it needs air by the deflection in the tire's side wall.  All Tom would have to do is hand the kid a ball that was exactly the pressure he desired and the kid would grip it and push a thumb into it to get the desired outcome on the other footballs.
> 
> But to suggest that an NFL QB doesn't know what an under inflated football feels like is ridiculous.  Try to convince me that an athlete with that much riding on his ability to throw a football isn't tuned into how the ball feels.  That's the part that irks me...that Brady thinks we are stupid.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> that is why there are so many former NFL players saying Brady is a liar and cheater and these brady/belicheat worshippers cant stand to hear this inconvient truth.they can only sling shit in defeat like the monkey trolls they are.
Click to expand...


Done spanking Huggy's monkey? Moron, you don't remember that you claim the NFL the entire NFL is rigged, so how can anyone cheat? You truly are the biggest troll bitch in the whole fucking world. Get a grip asshole.


----------



## SwimExpert

Papageorgio said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
Click to expand...


So angry....

You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.


----------



## Papageorgio

SwimExpert said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So angry....
> 
> You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.
Click to expand...


How don't care if Brady was suspended, I have said it was fair and I'm surprised he didn't get more. Are we clear there bud? In fact if his back up looks good, Brady may be done. I don't really care.

As far a 911 fuck job, he has trolled me for months and I ignored him but the other day he went to far and I am fucking done letting the lying shit get away with it. Everything I posted he has done, he needs to be called out for the lying sack of crap he is. 

Answer me one question. 911 fuck job is always saying the NFL is rigged. If the NFL is rigged, then how could anyone cheat because the games are all allegedly predetermined?


----------



## LA RAM FAN

someone farted in here.^


----------



## LA RAM FAN

SwimExpert said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So angry....
> 
> You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.
Click to expand...


Yep poopers mad his hero has been exposed.lol


----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> someone farted in here.^


More originality from the troll bitch.


----------



## SwimExpert




----------



## Papageorgio

9/11 inside job said:


> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So angry....
> 
> You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep poopers mad his hero has been exposed.lol
Click to expand...

Answer the question 911 fuck job, if the league is rigged as you claim how can anyone cheat?


----------



## Papageorgio

SwimExpert said:


>


Sorry you didn't have the ability to be one.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So angry....
> 
> You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep poopers mad his hero has been exposed.lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Answer the question 911 fuck job, if the league is rigged as you claim how can anyone cheat?
Click to expand...


I don't know why you even bother.  It's like trying to converse with a retarded animal.


----------



## Papageorgio

ChrisL said:


> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> three farts in a row from the belicheat/brady worshippers.^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So angry....
> 
> You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep poopers mad his hero has been exposed.lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Answer the question 911 fuck job, if the league is rigged as you claim how can anyone cheat?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know why you even bother.  It's like trying to converse with a retarded animal.
Click to expand...


He kept going after me, even after I stopped posting anything at or about him. Then this week he stepped it up. I have him on ignore this morning and he is the only one I have ever put on ignore. After every post I see from him, I am going to reply to him. If 911 fuck job wants to play games, then I'm all for exposing him for the liar he is.

Please don't insult retarded animals by comparing him to them, he isn't that smart.


----------



## ChrisL

Papageorgio said:


> ChrisL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SwimExpert said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Papageorgio said:
> 
> 
> 
> Troll bitch, have you figured out which is your favorite NL Cubs? Pirate? Is it another team?
> 
> You still sucking Kroenke's dick? That's right bitchboy preDICKed the Lambs in LA in 2015. How is that going troll bitch, you fucking liar.
> 
> You figured out how to spell the NFL Commissioner's name yet?
> 
> Back to the little bitches "someone farted" you still stuck on that? No imagination?
> 
> Seattle won't lose a game in 2015!  keep crying about that one. Of course the fucking league is rigged according to you, so how the fuck can anyone cheat, dumb shit. 911 fuck job.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So angry....
> 
> You mad bro?  You mad that your beloved Tommy got busted?  Should have been banned for life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep poopers mad his hero has been exposed.lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Answer the question 911 fuck job, if the league is rigged as you claim how can anyone cheat?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know why you even bother.  It's like trying to converse with a retarded animal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> He kept going after me, even after I stopped posting anything at or about him. Then this week he stepped it up. I have him on ignore this morning and he is the only one I have ever put on ignore. After every post I see from him, I am going to reply to him. If 911 fuck job wants to play games, then I'm all for exposing him for the liar he is.
> 
> Please don't insult retarded animals by comparing him to them, he isn't that smart.
Click to expand...


Lol.    I apologize to all the retarded animals out there.  

Okay then, if you insist.


----------



## antiquity

Here is my take...it was alleged that the balls were deflated during the first half of the Colts games..my question is were the balls deflated in the prior 16 games? Where did the Colts get their information they give to the refs that Brady was using deflated balls unless they had information about prior games?
Why were the ball boys hidden from the investigation and why were they suspended afterward if something wasn't happening with the balls? Did the ball boys get off with only getting fired after giving information about who gave them the go ahead to deflate the balls?
Why did Brady refuse to give up his cell phone and texts?

Now the penalties..I can understand the penalties but will they stick? One million fine...in pro football that chicken feed.
1st round next year and 4th round the year after...if the rules were broken, I am okay with that.
4 game suspension...a joke. Name me a top tier player who's suspension hasn't been reduced after whining to the commissioner during the hearings. For example Rice and AP. The enforcing of policies of the NFL are a joke. The suspension will be reduced for the 'good' of the game...meaning... lost revenue will not be tolerated.


----------



## SwimExpert

antiquity said:


> Name me a top tier player who's suspension hasn't been reduced after whining to the commissioner during the hearings. For example Rice and AP.



Rice's indefinite suspension was reversed in adjudication, not by the league.  If Rice had been suspended in definitely from the outset, there would have been no reduction later.  Brady and Belichick should have been banned for life too.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

HereWeGoAgain said:


> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.



   Delayed satisfaction..but satisfaction none the less.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Papageorgio said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Indeed._
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They took draft picks away dumb fuck, can you be any dumber?
Click to expand...


      Pretty sure this was before the decision.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

antiquity said:


> Here is my take...it was alleged that the balls were deflated during the first half of the Colts games..my question is were the balls deflated in the prior 16 games? Where did the Colts get their information they give to the refs that Brady was using deflated balls unless they had information about prior games?
> Why were the ball boys hidden from the investigation and why were they suspended afterward if something wasn't happening with the balls? Did the ball boys get off with only getting fired after giving information about who gave them the go ahead to deflate the balls?
> Why did Brady refuse to give up his cell phone and texts?
> 
> Now the penalties..I can understand the penalties but will they stick? One million fine...in pro football that chicken feed.
> 1st round next year and 4th round the year after...if the rules were broken, I am okay with that.
> 4 game suspension...a joke. Name me a top tier player who's suspension hasn't been reduced after whining to the commissioner during the hearings. For example Rice and AP. The enforcing of policies of the NFL are a joke. The suspension will be reduced for the 'good' of the game...meaning... lost revenue will not be tolerated.



sad but true that the suspension will be reduced.the cheatriots as i have said a million times are the rich spoiled brats of the NFL and get special treatment other teams do not because Goodel has his head up Krafts ass.Kraft has power and influence.some other team that did this like cleveland or baltimore for example,their coach and QB would get suspended for an entire season.

what happened to sean peyton in bountygate? he got suspended an entire season when there was far less evidence against him than there was for belicheat in spygate.you do what belicheat does in college,they kick you out of the program.that is why the NFL is a complete joke

a mere slap on the wrist for the cheats as always just as the first round pick the cheats lose for bountygate was a mere slap on the wrist for belicheat.

oh and since you are new joining the party,the ravens alerted the colts to the deflated balls.as i have said a thousand times,it wasnt a factor in the AFC game against the colts but any thinking person can see it WAS  a  factor the previous week against the ravens in a close game.anyone who says otherwise is fooling themselves because that is just plain asinine thinking especially with their history and the fact brady outright lied.

this is a scandal that rivals the black sox scandal whether you want to believe it or not. that is an uncomfortable truth for many around here which is why they are taking this way to serious and going into meltdown mode over pesky little facts they cannot get around.lol


----------



## LA RAM FAN

HereWeGoAgain said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ya gotta love how the findings come out after the draft making it impossible to punish the cheatriots by taking away draft picks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delayed satisfaction..but satisfaction none the less.
Click to expand...


thats the special treatment i was talking about the cheats always get that other teams dont.how convienent for them.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

SwimExpert said:


> antiquity said:
> 
> 
> 
> Name me a top tier player who's suspension hasn't been reduced after whining to the commissioner during the hearings. For example Rice and AP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rice's indefinite suspension was reversed in adjudication, not by the league.  If Rice had been suspended in definitely from the outset, there would have been no reduction later.  Brady and Belichick should have been banned for life too.
Click to expand...


and anybody who says otherwise  and keep defending these liars and cheats,should be ashamed to look themselves in the mirror when saying its no big deal because for the NFL not to do that,that just  sends the message to kids,that its okay to lie and cheat in the NFL.


----------



## LA RAM FAN

its too bad the discussion on these two threads ended,many people besides alex such as huggy,nutz,jim h,dot com,blue phantom,freewill,swim expert and anathema ALL posted some really great informative stuff on these two threads that took old fartstyle to school and gave him a major ass beating.


----------

