# When is U.S. Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the High seas



## 52ndStreet

When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals 
involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.


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## catzmeow

It's a big ocean, 52nd,.  How much are you willing to spend on this?  Or, is it the responsibility of the freight shippers to protect their cargos?

Piracy has been a big issue since before the days of Julius Caesar.


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## aka520

You can rest assured the US Navy has been ordered to stand down. Would you have expected any other order with this appeasement, Socialist cabal in charge.
So far Obama, aka POS has refused to even acknowledge the existence of a pirate, hostage problem. You can be certain as soon as he agrees to pay the ransom, his next official act will be to pardon the brave Somali freedom fighters.
gb


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## WorldAHope

aka520 said:


> You can rest assured the US Navy has been ordered to stand down. Would you have expected any other order with this appeasement, Socialist cabal in charge.
> So far Obama, aka POS has refused to even acknowledge the existence of a pirate, hostage problem. You can be certain as soon as he agrees to pay the ransom, his next official act will be to pardon the brave Somali freedom fighters.
> gb


aka - you got any proof of that ridiculous statement ? Are you calling the entire us navy a bunch of cowardly libs ? Or just Obama. you want us to think he's hiding in his office, scared and crying and biting his nails, is that it ? 
Everything you say is twisted like a swizzle stick chewed by a meth addict in rehab. Factually wrong and based on lies, or worse - based upon your own twisted bilous imagination. 
I pester on this current event because I have a personal stake in this particular situation. And also because I am very familiar with operations on naval and merchant vessels, in those waters and ports. And I pester because I refuse to allow ignorant slimewipers from spreading their disgusting  filth unchallenged.


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## strollingbones

big ocean out there...how many ships are you willing to put there...and then how long will you keep them...the priates arent fools...put a large force they will stop...how long can you maintain open shipping lanes...and why isnt egypt out there doing it...affect their commerce...


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## Angel Heart

I'm figuring the press will use this to over shaddow the Tea Party.


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## aka520

WorldAHope said:


> aka520 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can rest assured the US Navy has been ordered to stand down. Would you have expected any other order with this appeasement, Socialist cabal in charge.
> So far Obama, aka POS has refused to even acknowledge the existence of a pirate, hostage problem. You can be certain as soon as he agrees to pay the ransom, his next official act will be to pardon the brave Somali freedom fighters.
> gb
> 
> 
> 
> aka - you got any proof of that ridiculous statement ? Are you calling the entire us navy a bunch of cowardly libs ? Or just Obama. you want us to think he's hiding in his office, scared and crying and biting his nails, is that it ?
> Everything you say is twisted like a swizzle stick chewed by a meth addict in rehab. Factually wrong and based on lies, or worse - based upon your own twisted bilous imagination.
> I pester on this current event because I have a personal stake in this particular situation. And also because I am very familiar with operations on naval and merchant vessels, in those waters and ports. And I pester because I refuse to allow ignorant slimewipers from spreading their disgusting  filth unchallenged.
Click to expand...


Ok WAH, you can consider me challenged. I made no comment about the ability of the Navy to do it's duty other than they are following orders, which is commendable. The Navy has a huge arsenal of offensive tactics at it's disposal. The only reasonable explanation for this charade continuing, is they have been ordered to stand down. Obama, aka POS has not commented about the situation which I fine odd. If not just to reassure the family of the hostage that everything is being done to gain his safe return, However, not a peep. Granted, this is just my opinion but not as wild as you claim. I know nothing of swizzle stick chewing so I will leave that to the more familiar and experienced swizzle stick chewers such as you. 
gb


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## Ravi

Good work, aka...I applaud your continual efforts to make Republicans look like slime balls. You and Glenn Beck between you should keep Republicans out of office for the next century.


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## aka520

Ravi said:


> Good work, aka...I applaud your continual efforts to make Republicans look like slime balls. You and Glenn Beck between you should keep Republicans out of office for the next century.



Why should I care Ravi? I am leaning Libertarian but still an Independent. Besides, you can't tell the difference between the two parties. I like Glen Beck, he's got the nerve to say what others won't. 
gb


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## SassyIrishLass

WorldAHope said:


> aka520 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can rest assured the US
> I pester on this current event because I have a personal stake in this particular situation. And also because I am very familiar with operations on naval and merchant vessels, in those waters and ports. And I pester because I refuse to allow ignorant slimewipers from spreading their disgusting  filth unchallenged.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Me thinks you pester too much.
Click to expand...


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## WorldAHope

aka520 said:


> WorldAHope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aka520 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can rest assured the US Navy has been ordered to stand down. Would you have expected any other order with this appeasement, Socialist cabal in charge.
> So far Obama, aka POS has refused to even acknowledge the existence of a pirate, hostage problem. You can be certain as soon as he agrees to pay the ransom, his next official act will be to pardon the brave Somali freedom fighters.
> gb
> 
> 
> 
> aka - you got any proof of that ridiculous statement ? Are you calling the entire us navy a bunch of cowardly libs ? Or just Obama. you want us to think he's hiding in his office, scared and crying and biting his nails, is that it ?
> Everything you say is twisted like a swizzle stick chewed by a meth addict in rehab. Factually wrong and based on lies, or worse - based upon your own twisted bilous imagination.
> I pester on this current event because I have a personal stake in this particular situation. And also because I am very familiar with operations on naval and merchant vessels, in those waters and ports. And I pester because I refuse to allow ignorant slimewipers from spreading their disgusting  filth unchallenged.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ok WAH, you can consider me challenged. I made no comment about the ability of the Navy to do it's duty other than they are following orders, which is commendable. The Navy has a huge arsenal of offensive tactics at it's disposal. The only reasonable explanation for this charade continuing, is they have been ordered to stand down. Obama, aka POS has not commented about the situation which I fine odd. If not just to reassure the family of the hostage that everything is being done to gain his safe return, However, not a peep. Granted, this is just my opinion but not as wild as you claim. I know nothing of swizzle stick chewing so I will leave that to the more familiar and experienced swizzle stick chewers such as you.
> gb
Click to expand...

You make stuff up, pull it out of the frightened confused cobwebs that clog your head, and you share your fabrications with the rest of the world as if your were presenting proven fact. 
You are uninformed and clueless on what is involved in any kind of military operations. Go do a search "somali pirates news" and read a few of the many informative articles about what's happened off the coast of Somalia and about this current situation. Before you post any more of your nonesense, Try picking up a few facts, for a change. Lay off tossing out idiotic boogers. 
No matter what happens, in this or any other situation, you will still indulge in your compulsion to bad mouth Obama. Like a dope fiend who can do nothing but put a flame to his crackpipe.


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## krotchdog

Yep, its a big ocean, you cant do anything about it. Think about it, how are they suppose to know that the Merchant Marine activists (so called pirates) from Somalia were not going to protest off the coast of Oregon. Take a look at the map, you see the south pole, they have to watch for "Merchant Marine activists" there as well. What about Maine, the Somalians  could be there so before you post think about how big the ocean is.


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## aka520

WorldAHope said:


> aka520 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WorldAHope said:
> 
> 
> 
> aka - you got any proof of that ridiculous statement ? Are you calling the entire us navy a bunch of cowardly libs ? Or just Obama. you want us to think he's hiding in his office, scared and crying and biting his nails, is that it ?
> Everything you say is twisted like a swizzle stick chewed by a meth addict in rehab. Factually wrong and based on lies, or worse - based upon your own twisted bilous imagination.
> I pester on this current event because I have a personal stake in this particular situation. And also because I am very familiar with operations on naval and merchant vessels, in those waters and ports. And I pester because I refuse to allow ignorant slimewipers from spreading their disgusting  filth unchallenged.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ok WAH, you can consider me challenged. I made no comment about the ability of the Navy to do it's duty other than they are following orders, which is commendable. The Navy has a huge arsenal of offensive tactics at it's disposal. The only reasonable explanation for this charade continuing, is they have been ordered to stand down. Obama, aka POS has not commented about the situation which I fine odd. If not just to reassure the family of the hostage that everything is being done to gain his safe return, However, not a peep. Granted, this is just my opinion but not as wild as you claim. I know nothing of swizzle stick chewing so I will leave that to the more familiar and experienced swizzle stick chewers such as you.
> gb
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You make stuff up, pull it out of the frightened confused cobwebs that clog your head, and you share your fabrications with the rest of the world as if your were presenting proven fact.
> You are uninformed and clueless on what is involved in any kind of military operations. Go do a search "somali pirates news" and read a few of the many informative articles about what's happened off the coast of Somalia and about this current situation. Before you post any more of your nonesense, Try picking up a few facts, for a change. Lay off tossing out idiotic boogers.
> No matter what happens, in this or any other situation, you will still indulge in your compulsion to bad mouth Obama. Like a dope fiend who can do nothing but put a flame to his crackpipe.
Click to expand...


Bad mouthing the messenger is a cop out WAH. Have you nothing to contribute to my analysis but flames? I think I made a very reasonable argument to support my opinion. The US Navy is not as impotent as you suggest. Just for one, Navy Seals could have easily from underwater sank the lifeboat thereby dumping all occupants in the water. Seals are trained to overpower and subdue others while in the water. This is just one of no doubt many solutions. The lack of naval action leads to my stand down analysis. The lack of comment by Obama aka POS, gives to several observations. Mine being, he hasn't a clue of how to handle the situation. His brushing off the question when talking about housing from a teleprompter, only shows his inability to think while on his feet. Try working on my analysis by showing where I am wrong instead of just calling names. Any child can do that.

You seem to have a lot of experience with drugs and drug paraphernalia. Are you an addict?
gb


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## Gunny

52ndStreet said:


> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.



Ask the President.  The US Navy is a tool of war.  It is not an autonomous entity.  I guarantee you that if given the orders to do so, the US Navy is more than capable of handling the job.

It is not up to the US to police foreign waters.  It is up to the US to protect its own interests (ships) only.


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## aka520

Gunny said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ask the President.  The US Navy is a tool of war.  It is not an autonomous entity.  I guarantee you that if given the orders to do so, the US Navy is more than capable of handling the job.
> 
> It is not up to the US to police foreign waters.  It is up to the US to protect its own interests (ships) only.
Click to expand...


Makes sense to me Gunny. The Navy could have neutralized this life boat problem in a matter of hours had that been their mission. I stand by my original analysis, they have been ordered to observe, nothing more. 
gb


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## 52ndStreet

America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
Pirates.!!?$$?!!%


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## Annie

52ndStreet said:


> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%



Up until this incident, I don't think there were incidents with US flagged ships, so it wasn't US paying tribute. However my guess is the company will pay the ransom to get the captain released. THEN the question becomes, will the US lead for a change in either allowing mercenary armed guards or allowing the crews to be trained and armed. Or they could send in the Marines as they did in the early 1800's?


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## Ravi

52ndStreet said:


> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%


Pirates have been around since boats existed. Are they more prevalent now? I don't think the evidence supports that, but as the economy sours, criminals will engage in more criminal activity.


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## editec

52ndStreet said:


> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.


 
The SEALS probably couldn't save the day in this case, as I vaguely understand the tactical situation.

Certainly not without putting the hostage's and their lives at enormous risk.

I commend whoever is doing absolutely everything (which looks like nothing to we who are not involved) they can do to get that guy back _alive._

If that means standing down and negotiating, so be it.

I'm informed (by Fox news, ironically) that the so-called pirates have hundreds of other hostages from previous prizes taken.

They're being held in the city of Ely, and probably elsewhere, too. 

Given how obviously these pirates are _massive_ organized criminal cabal of corrupt governments and outright seagoing thugs, perhaps the rest of the world is reluctant to move because -- _even if they get the hostage at sea --_ these thugs can retaliate against those hostages?

We just don't know what's happening behind the scenes to comment intelligently on the specifcs of this event.

And in this case, I don't think we have _the need to know_, either.

Diplomacy is saying "nice doggie" until you can find a big stick.

Obviously the piracy issue is bigger than just this one hostage, too.


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## Gunny

editec said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The SEALS probably couldn't save the day in this case, as I vaguely understand the tactical situation.
> 
> Certainly not without putting the hostage's and their lives at enormous risk.
> 
> I commend whoever is doing absolutely everything (which looks like nothing to we who are not involved) they can do to get that guy back _alive._
> 
> If that means standing down and negotiating, so be it.
> 
> I'm informed (by Fox news, ironically) that the so-called pirates have hundreds of other hostages from previous prizes taken.
> 
> They're being held in the city of Ely, and probably elsewhere, too.
> 
> Given how obviously these pirates are _massive_ organized criminal cabal of corrupt governments and outright seagoing thugs, perhaps the rest of the world is reluctant to move because -- _even if they get the hostage at sea --_ these thugs can retaliate against those hostages?
> 
> We just don't know what's happening behind the scenes to comment intelligently on the specifcs of this event.
> 
> And in this case, I don't think we have _the need to know_, either.
> 
> Diplomacy is saying "nice doggie" until you can find a big stick.
> 
> Obviously the piracy issue is bigger than just this one hostage, too.
Click to expand...


Interesting.  I was unaware they were part of a cabal that still had other hostages.  That puts the entire situation in a different light.  

If they have literally "hundreds" of hostages it's past time somebody took some action to stop this crap.


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## Annie

Gunny said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The SEALS probably couldn't save the day in this case, as I vaguely understand the tactical situation.
> 
> Certainly not without putting the hostage's and their lives at enormous risk.
> 
> I commend whoever is doing absolutely everything (which looks like nothing to we who are not involved) they can do to get that guy back _alive._
> 
> If that means standing down and negotiating, so be it.
> 
> I'm informed (by Fox news, ironically) that the so-called pirates have hundreds of other hostages from previous prizes taken.
> 
> They're being held in the city of Ely, and probably elsewhere, too.
> 
> Given how obviously these pirates are _massive_ organized criminal cabal of corrupt governments and outright seagoing thugs, perhaps the rest of the world is reluctant to move because -- _even if they get the hostage at sea --_ these thugs can retaliate against those hostages?
> 
> We just don't know what's happening behind the scenes to comment intelligently on the specifcs of this event.
> 
> And in this case, I don't think we have _the need to know_, either.
> 
> Diplomacy is saying "nice doggie" until you can find a big stick.
> 
> Obviously the piracy issue is bigger than just this one hostage, too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting.  I was unaware they were part of a cabal that still had other hostages.  That puts the entire situation in a different light.
> 
> If they have literally "hundreds" of hostages it's past time somebody took some action to stop this crap.
Click to expand...


They have over 200 hostages I believe. But, they are not Americans. Seriously I don't think it in our interest to worry about others, as it would strain belief to think another country would worry about ours. 

I agree with you Gunny, first we get the Captain back, then we should do something. I don't think we will though, other than perhaps to those 4 keystone pirates. I hope I'm wrong.


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## Gunny

aka520 said:


> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ask the President.  The US Navy is a tool of war.  It is not an autonomous entity.  I guarantee you that if given the orders to do so, the US Navy is more than capable of handling the job.
> 
> It is not up to the US to police foreign waters.  It is up to the US to protect its own interests (ships) only.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Makes sense to me Gunny. The Navy could have neutralized this life boat problem in a matter of hours had that been their mission. I stand by my original analysis, they have been ordered to observe, nothing more.
> gb
Click to expand...


And I would agree.  If they had been ordered to act, they would have and it would be over.  The fact that I know the tactical assets of the USS Boxer helps because I know what they do and don't have.

They don't have a SEAL team.  They DO have a Recon platoon that is highly-trained in Visual Boarding Search and Seizure (VBSS) and while not one to brag, they're badasses at it if they are half as good as they were in my day.  

US Naval presence is for intimidation, and to act if necessary.  Otherwise, any rescue attempt in this situation would have to be authorized by the President himself.


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## Gunny

52ndStreet said:


> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%



You really aren't very bright, are you?  This isn't a cut-n-dried, black-or-white only situation.  

Yes, the issue should be addressed.  However, try seeing the forest, not just the trees.  If editiec is correct, there is more at stake than one life.


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## Gunny

Annie said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Up until this incident, I don't think there were incidents with US flagged ships, so it wasn't US paying tribute. However my guess is the company will pay the ransom to get the captain released. THEN the question becomes, will the US lead for a change in either allowing mercenary armed guards or allowing the crews to be trained and armed. Or they could send in the Marines as they did in the early 1800's?
Click to expand...


Being unbiased and all , I say turn the Marines loose.  The more practical solution however would be to arm the crews.

You are aware that is the original reason for the existence of the Marine Corps?  Crews were usually press gangs.  The Marines were a unit that answered only to the Captain of the ship.  They enforced discipline on the ship.


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## elvis

This situation makes me really wish McCain had won.


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## Gunny

elvis3577 said:


> This situation makes me really wish McCain had won.



Why?  In this situation, I'd rather have Hillary.  I would trust her judgment in a situation like this before I would McCain.  McCain would be doing the same thing Obama is doing.  

For all the criticism Bush takes, notice this never happened on his watch?  There IS an advantage to having a redneck for a President.


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## elvis

Gunny said:


> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This situation makes me really wish McCain had won.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why?  In this situation, I'd rather have Hillary.  I would trust her judgment in a situation like this before I would McCain.  McCain would be doing the same thing Obama is doing.
> 
> For all the criticism Bush takes, notice this never happened on his watch?  There IS an advantage to having a redneck for a President.
Click to expand...


Well, I was thinking in terms of the general election.


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## Annie

Gunny said:


> Annie said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Up until this incident, I don't think there were incidents with US flagged ships, so it wasn't US paying tribute. However my guess is the company will pay the ransom to get the captain released. THEN the question becomes, will the US lead for a change in either allowing mercenary armed guards or allowing the crews to be trained and armed. Or they could send in the Marines as they did in the early 1800's?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Being unbiased and all , I say turn the Marines loose.  The more practical solution however would be to arm the crews.
> 
> You are aware that is the original reason for the existence of the Marine Corps?  Crews were usually press gangs.  The Marines were a unit that answered only to the Captain of the ship.  They enforced discipline on the ship.
Click to expand...


Indeed I am. While my focus never was 'military' per se, can't get degree in history without pretty good knowledge of Barbary Pirates and Tripoli.  On the other hand, I will say the atrocities by the pirates upon crews were not brought up in classes. Interestingly enough, the 'barbarities' committed on the Muslims by the Christians in the Crusades, oh yeah. That was before 9/11.


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## Yurt

Annie said:


> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Annie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Up until this incident, I don't think there were incidents with US flagged ships, so it wasn't US paying tribute. However my guess is the company will pay the ransom to get the captain released. THEN the question becomes, will the US lead for a change in either allowing mercenary armed guards or allowing the crews to be trained and armed. Or they could send in the Marines as they did in the early 1800's?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Being unbiased and all , I say turn the Marines loose.  The more practical solution however would be to arm the crews.
> 
> You are aware that is the original reason for the existence of the Marine Corps?  Crews were usually press gangs.  The Marines were a unit that answered only to the Captain of the ship.  They enforced discipline on the ship.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Indeed I am. While my focus never was 'military' per se, can't get degree in history without pretty good knowledge of Barbary Pirates and Tripoli.  On the other hand, I will say the atrocities by the pirates upon crews were not brought up in classes. *Interestingly enough, the 'barbarities' committed on the Muslims by the Christians in the Crusades, oh yeah. That was before 9/11*.
Click to expand...


are you talking cause and effect?


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## Annie

Yurt said:


> Annie said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> Being unbiased and all , I say turn the Marines loose.  The more practical solution however would be to arm the crews.
> 
> You are aware that is the original reason for the existence of the Marine Corps?  Crews were usually press gangs.  The Marines were a unit that answered only to the Captain of the ship.  They enforced discipline on the ship.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed I am. While my focus never was 'military' per se, can't get degree in history without pretty good knowledge of Barbary Pirates and Tripoli.  On the other hand, I will say the atrocities by the pirates upon crews were not brought up in classes. *Interestingly enough, the 'barbarities' committed on the Muslims by the Christians in the Crusades, oh yeah. That was before 9/11*.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> are you talking cause and effect?
Click to expand...

No. I was making an observation, that was all, about college, not events in history.


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## Yurt

Annie said:


> Yurt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Annie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed I am. While my focus never was 'military' per se, can't get degree in history without pretty good knowledge of Barbary Pirates and Tripoli.  On the other hand, I will say the atrocities by the pirates upon crews were not brought up in classes. *Interestingly enough, the 'barbarities' committed on the Muslims by the Christians in the Crusades, oh yeah. That was before 9/11*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> are you talking cause and effect?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No. I was making an observation, that was all, about college, not events in history.
Click to expand...


oh


----------



## Gunny

elvis3577 said:


> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> This situation makes me really wish McCain had won.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why?  In this situation, I'd rather have Hillary.  I would trust her judgment in a situation like this before I would McCain.  McCain would be doing the same thing Obama is doing.
> 
> For all the criticism Bush takes, notice this never happened on his watch?  There IS an advantage to having a redneck for a President.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, I was thinking in terms of the general election.
Click to expand...


You mean the last one?  Where the media chose both candidates?


----------



## elvis

Gunny said:


> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why?  In this situation, I'd rather have Hillary.  I would trust her judgment in a situation like this before I would McCain.  McCain would be doing the same thing Obama is doing.
> 
> For all the criticism Bush takes, notice this never happened on his watch?  There IS an advantage to having a redneck for a President.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I was thinking in terms of the general election.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You mean the last one?  Where the media chose both candidates?
Click to expand...


Yes, that one.


----------



## dilloduck

Ravi said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%
> 
> 
> 
> Pirates have been around since boats existed. Are they more prevalent now? I don't think the evidence supports that, but as the economy sours, criminals will engage in more criminal activity.
Click to expand...


Look out, Ravi. You nearly claimed that poverty causes piracy.


----------



## Gunny

elvis3577 said:


> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I was thinking in terms of the general election.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You mean the last one?  Where the media chose both candidates?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, that one.
Click to expand...


The sad truth is, and as much as I don't care for some of her beliefs, Hillary was the best of the lot and I probably would have voted for her.  That's not saying much, and has to be kept in context with the choices.  

So far, Obama has turned out to be exactly everything I predicted he would be.


----------



## Annie

Gunny said:


> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> You mean the last one?  Where the media chose both candidates?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, that one.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The sad truth is, and as much as I don't care for some of her beliefs, Hillary was the best of the lot and I probably would have voted for her.  That's not saying much, and has to be kept in context with the choices.
> 
> So far, Obama has turned out to be exactly everything I predicted he would be.
Click to expand...


I didn't think he'd be as bad as he appears to be, but I didn't vote for him.


----------



## elvis

Gunny said:


> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> You mean the last one?  Where the media chose both candidates?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, that one.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The sad truth is, and as much as I don't care for some of her beliefs, Hillary was the best of the lot and I probably would have voted for her.  That's not saying much, and has to be kept in context with the choices.
> 
> So far, Obama has turned out to be exactly everything I predicted he would be.
Click to expand...


What did you predict he would be?  did you vote for Hillary in the Texas primaries?  I certainly think she was more qualified than obama, but  it would have been tough for me to vote for her in the general election.  
I voted for Giuliani in the primaries.  I was shocked when McCain didn't choose him as a running mate.


----------



## krotchdog

Annie


> They have over 200 hostages I believe. But, they are not Americans. Seriously I don't think it in our interest to worry about others, as it would strain belief to think another country would worry about ours.



Americans do not "act" based on how others act. We are the worlds leaders, not because it was our choice, our position in the world was forced on us by the history of tyrants and dictators, our place in history is destined not by our actions, but the actions of kingdoms long since gone. 

So many state its not our place, we are not the worlds police, what these people are ignorant of is that we fled those tyrants.

Citizens of America are refugees of the world, we have fled the tyrants, the dictators, the kings, the communists, the facists, we are the victims of all that is bad in the world.

Yes, what right do we have to interfere in the business of the tyrants we fled

What right do the refugees in the United States of America have to stop the dictators from killing our family we had to leave behind.

If you stand by and do nothing in the face of tyranny you stand on the side of tyranny


----------



## Ravi

dilloduck said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%
> 
> 
> 
> Pirates have been around since boats existed. Are they more prevalent now? I don't think the evidence supports that, but as the economy sours, criminals will engage in more criminal activity.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Look out, Ravi. You nearly claimed that poverty causes piracy.
Click to expand...

It is one of the causes...but that doesn't excuse it or make it acceptable. Somehow I think if Somalia had a stable government and economy these pirates wouldn't have so many members.


----------



## dilloduck

Ravi said:


> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pirates have been around since boats existed. Are they more prevalent now? I don't think the evidence supports that, but as the economy sours, criminals will engage in more criminal activity.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look out, Ravi. You nearly claimed that poverty causes piracy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It is one of the causes...but that doesn't excuse it or make it acceptable. Somehow I think if Somalia had a stable government and economy these pirates wouldn't have so many members.
Click to expand...


So do you think Blackbeard came from a ghetto ?


----------



## Annie

Ravi said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> America should be the country to put an end to this cycle of High seas hijacking, that seems now to be developing into a bussiness for the Somali Pirates, who are being given large ransom payments. How  we are to put a stop to those Pirate criminals, if we are rewarding them for their criminal activity with huge million dollar ransom payments. Is this not just more gasoline on the fire,thus fueling even more desparate
> Pirates.!!?$$?!!%
> 
> 
> 
> Pirates have been around since boats existed. Are they more prevalent now? I don't think the evidence supports that, but as the economy sours, criminals will engage in more criminal activity.
Click to expand...


It's not just since the economy 'soured', been on the increase for over a decade:

RAND Research Brief | Piracy and Terrorism at Sea: A Rising Challenge for U.S. Security

Full report link at site:



> Piracy and Terrorism at Sea
> 
> A Rising Challenge for U.S. Security
> 
> Piracy and maritime terrorism are on the rise. In the period 2000 to 2006, the incidence of piracy rose 68 percent compared to the previous six years. During the same period, there was a modest yet discernible spike in high-profile terrorist attacks and plots at sea, such as the 2004 bombing of the Philippine SuperFerry 14, which left 116 dead.
> 
> These trends are the result of a range of phenomena, including a surge in commercial maritime traffic and a decline of coastal and port-side security (due to financial instability or government corruption). Maritime surveillance has proved challenging even for the United States because of the technical difficulties associated with inspecting incoming cargo and the need to balance sea- and land-based security requirements.
> 
> RAND Project AIR FORCE (PAF), a unit of the RAND Corporation, examined the nature of piracy and maritime terrorism to assess their overall relevance to U.S. security. The study resulted in the following conclusions:
> 
> ...



PPI: Piracy Rates Are Rising

More at site:



> PPI | Trade Fact of the Week | March 10, 2004
> Piracy Rates Are Rising
> Editor's Notes: The PPI "Trade Fact of the Week" is a weekly email newsletter published by PPI's Trade & Global Markets Project. To sign up for a free subscription, click here. (Just make sure to check the box next to "Trade & Global Markets.")
> Original links are included though some may have expired.
> 
> The Numbers:
> 
> Number of pirate attacks on ships, 2003:	445
> Number of pirate attacks on ships, 2002:	370
> Number of pirate attacks on ships, 2001:	335
> 
> What They Mean:
> 
> Last week, according to the International Maritime Organization, pirates attacked seven ships. The attacks ranged from the fairly small (the theft of a life-raft off Colombia by pirates armed with knives) to the very alarming -- notably the hijacking of a tug-boat and barge en route from Borneo to peninsular Malaysia. The week's seven-attack total is about average these days, but far above the levels common a decade ago: annual reports published by IMO show that pirate attacks averaged about 100 a year in the early 1990s, and now routinely exceed 400. The record was set in 2000, with 469 attacks recorded worldwide; last year's figure of 445 ranks second. Pirates also seem more daring and violent: 100 attacks last year used guns, as opposed to 70 in 2002; and 19 whole ships were hijacked, as compared to eight in 2000. Pirates took 359 people hostage during the 2003 attacks and killed 21; 71 people are still listed missing.
> 
> ....


----------



## editec

Gunny said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The SEALS probably couldn't save the day in this case, as I vaguely understand the tactical situation.
> 
> Certainly not without putting the hostage's and their lives at enormous risk.
> 
> I commend whoever is doing absolutely everything (which looks like nothing to we who are not involved) they can do to get that guy back _alive._
> 
> If that means standing down and negotiating, so be it.
> 
> I'm informed (by Fox news, ironically) that the so-called pirates have hundreds of other hostages from previous prizes taken.
> 
> They're being held in the city of Ely, and probably elsewhere, too.
> 
> Given how obviously these pirates are _massive_ organized criminal cabal of corrupt governments and outright seagoing thugs, perhaps the rest of the world is reluctant to move because -- _even if they get the hostage at sea --_ these thugs can retaliate against those hostages?
> 
> We just don't know what's happening behind the scenes to comment intelligently on the specifcs of this event.
> 
> And in this case, I don't think we have _the need to know_, either.
> 
> Diplomacy is saying "nice doggie" until you can find a big stick.
> 
> Obviously the piracy issue is bigger than just this one hostage, too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting. I was unaware they were part of a cabal that still had other hostages. That puts the entire situation in a different light.
> 
> If they have literally "hundreds" of hostages it's past time somebody took some action to stop this crap.
Click to expand...

 
Yeah, probably. But what action, exactly?

Did you follow that link?

If Fox is giving us the real deal, then any overt military action gets a whole lotta hostages in Somalia killed.

Apparently these hostages hail from many nations, so acting unilaterally is probably not something that the USA can do without getting a whole lot of those folks killed.

Looks to me like this is not just a few bold guys with a boat and a gun, but a whole society forming around piracy in Somalia as a means of survival.

Looks like none of us is very well informed about what really going on in Somalia, doesn't it?

I know I'm not up to speed on this issue.

So if we don't understand the situation on the sea OR on the ground, all our armchair digital generalship is just so much speculative pompousity, isn't it?

I STILL want to understand _how this situation developed._

Obviously this priacy problem has been brewing for quite some time.

But it's only now just becoming something we're thinking about.

I suspect the time to start complaining about how it's being dealt with NOW is premature.

We don't KNOW what the overall situation is, and we don't really know what's being done about this particular hostage right now, either.


----------



## Ravi

dilloduck said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> Look out, Ravi. You nearly claimed that poverty causes piracy.
> 
> 
> 
> It is one of the causes...but that doesn't excuse it or make it acceptable. Somehow I think if Somalia had a stable government and economy these pirates wouldn't have so many members.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So do you think Blackbeard came from a ghetto ?
Click to expand...

I've no idea. People are opportunists. If they cannot make money legitimately they often turn to crime. I'm pretty amazed that you don't know this. How long has Somalia been a toilet?


----------



## dilloduck

Ravi said:


> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> It is one of the causes...but that doesn't excuse it or make it acceptable. Somehow I think if Somalia had a stable government and economy these pirates wouldn't have so many members.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So do you think Blackbeard came from a ghetto ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I've no idea. People are opportunists. If they cannot make money legitimately they often turn to crime. I'm pretty amazed that you don't know this. How long has Somalia been a toilet?
Click to expand...


Conversely if you can succeed in life by being a criminal, why bother with the hum drum life of making a living legitimately ?


----------



## editec

dilloduck said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> So do you think Blackbeard came from a ghetto ?
> 
> 
> 
> I've no idea. People are opportunists. If they cannot make money legitimately they often turn to crime. I'm pretty amazed that you don't know this. How long has Somalia been a toilet?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Conversely if you can succeed in life by being a criminal, why bother with the hum drum life of making a living legitimately ?
Click to expand...

 
More importantly, and I suspect this might be the case in Somalia, if the only way you can live is to become criminal, then you can pretty much expect people to become criminals.

We see this over and over again, and _still _people pretend they cannot understand it, and play the outrage card.


----------



## dilloduck

editec said:


> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've no idea. People are opportunists. If they cannot make money legitimately they often turn to crime. I'm pretty amazed that you don't know this. How long has Somalia been a toilet?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Conversely if you can succeed in life by being a criminal, why bother with the hum drum life of making a living legitimately ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More importantly, and I suspect this might be the case in Somalia, if the only way you can live is to become criminal, then you can pretty much expect people to become criminals.
> 
> We see this over and over again, and _still _people pretend they cannot understand it, and play the outrage card.
Click to expand...


Quite an assumption to state that being a criminal is the ONLY way that someone can survive, isn't it ?


----------



## Annie

dilloduck said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> Conversely if you can succeed in life by being a criminal, why bother with the hum drum life of making a living legitimately ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More importantly, and I suspect this might be the case in Somalia, if the only way you can live is to become criminal, then you can pretty much expect people to become criminals.
> 
> We see this over and over again, and _still _people pretend they cannot understand it, and play the outrage card.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Quite an assumption to state that being a criminal is the ONLY way that someone can survive, isn't it ?
Click to expand...


Somalia is a failed state, there isn't a government, thus there really isn't a functioning economy. Now the people mostly prey on each other, but piracy has been lucrative for them, with little downsides. I don't see the West going in and fixing their problems, however we may see the US go in and encourage them with force, after the release of the Captain, to not mess with US flagged ships again.


----------



## editec

dilloduck said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> Conversely if you can succeed in life by being a criminal, why bother with the hum drum life of making a living legitimately ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More importantly, and I suspect this might be the case in Somalia, if the only way you can live is to become criminal, then you can pretty much expect people to become criminals.
> 
> We see this over and over again, and _still _people pretend they cannot understand it, and play the outrage card.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Quite an assumption to state that being a criminal is the ONLY way that someone can survive, isn't it ?
Click to expand...

 
In an _anarchic _state?

Not really, dillo, not really.


----------



## Ravi

dilloduck said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dilloduck said:
> 
> 
> 
> Conversely if you can succeed in life by being a criminal, why bother with the hum drum life of making a living legitimately ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More importantly, and I suspect this might be the case in Somalia, if the only way you can live is to become criminal, then you can pretty much expect people to become criminals.
> 
> We see this over and over again, and _still _people pretend they cannot understand it, and play the outrage card.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Quite an assumption to state that being a criminal is the ONLY way that someone can survive, isn't it ?
Click to expand...

Who ever said that?


----------



## Gunny

elvis3577 said:


> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, that one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The sad truth is, and as much as I don't care for some of her beliefs, Hillary was the best of the lot and I probably would have voted for her.  That's not saying much, and has to be kept in context with the choices.
> 
> So far, Obama has turned out to be exactly everything I predicted he would be.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What did you predict he would be?  did you vote for Hillary in the Texas primaries?  I certainly think she was more qualified than obama, but  it would have been tough for me to vote for her in the general election.
> I voted for Giuliani in the primaries.  I was shocked when McCain didn't choose him as a running mate.
Click to expand...


I did not vote for Hillary in the Texas primaries.  It wouldn't have mattered anyway.  Voting in primaries here is a scam.  



> After the polls are closed, anybody who has voted in their particular primary (they stamp your voter card) can stick around for a caucus.
> 
> The primary purpose of the caucus is to provide input for the State Party Convention. The State Party Convention writes the platform (that's a document that says what the Party's goals and objectives and plans are, and why you should vote for them). Party Platforms used to be very important and people paid attention to them... now a days nobody even reads them. The other thing the State Party Convention does is formally nominate who is going to be on the November Ballot, and it decides who is going to be a deligate to the National Party Convention.
> 
> Does Anyone Understand the Texas Voting Process Where Voting Twice is Allowed? - Yahoo! Answers



What that says in English is Hillary won the popular vote here and should have been given all the delegates.  The people who had time to hang around and caucus basically stole the votes from Hillary in favor of Obama.  

They ended up splitting the delegates between them when it's supposed to be winner take all.

I'm not a Democrat, nor am I any fan of Hillary Clinton.  I merely stated given the choices, I would support her over Obama, and was undecided between her and McCain.


----------



## trobinett

Gunny posts:



> I'm not a Democrat, nor am I any fan of Hillary Clinton. I merely stated given the choices, I would support her over Obama, and was undecided between her and McCain.



Same way I felt about it Gunny, damn shame that.............


----------



## elvis

Gunny said:


> elvis3577 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> The sad truth is, and as much as I don't care for some of her beliefs, Hillary was the best of the lot and I probably would have voted for her.  That's not saying much, and has to be kept in context with the choices.
> 
> So far, Obama has turned out to be exactly everything I predicted he would be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did you predict he would be?  did you vote for Hillary in the Texas primaries?  I certainly think she was more qualified than obama, but  it would have been tough for me to vote for her in the general election.
> I voted for Giuliani in the primaries.  I was shocked when McCain didn't choose him as a running mate.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did not vote for Hillary in the Texas primaries.  It wouldn't have mattered anyway.  Voting in primaries here is a scam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After the polls are closed, anybody who has voted in their particular primary (they stamp your voter card) can stick around for a caucus.
> 
> The primary purpose of the caucus is to provide input for the State Party Convention. The State Party Convention writes the platform (that's a document that says what the Party's goals and objectives and plans are, and why you should vote for them). Party Platforms used to be very important and people paid attention to them... now a days nobody even reads them. The other thing the State Party Convention does is formally nominate who is going to be on the November Ballot, and it decides who is going to be a deligate to the National Party Convention.
> 
> Does Anyone Understand the Texas Voting Process Where Voting Twice is Allowed? - Yahoo! Answers
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What that says in English is Hillary won the popular vote here and should have been given all the delegates.  The people who had time to hang around and caucus basically stole the votes from Hillary in favor of Obama.
> 
> They ended up splitting the delegates between them when it's supposed to be winner take all.
> 
> I'm not a Democrat, nor am I any fan of Hillary Clinton.  I merely stated given the choices, I would support her over Obama, and was undecided between her and McCain.
Click to expand...


OH I knew you weren't a democrat.  I do wish hillary had been nominated because it least Obama wouldn't be President right now.


----------



## PubliusInfinitum

editec said:


> Gunny said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> editec said:
> 
> 
> 
> The SEALS probably couldn't save the day in this case, as I vaguely understand the tactical situation.
> 
> Certainly not without putting the hostage's and their lives at enormous risk.
> 
> I commend whoever is doing absolutely everything (which looks like nothing to we who are not involved) they can do to get that guy back _alive._
> 
> If that means standing down and negotiating, so be it.
> 
> I'm informed (by Fox news, ironically) that the so-called pirates have hundreds of other hostages from previous prizes taken.
> 
> They're being held in the city of Ely, and probably elsewhere, too.
> 
> Given how obviously these pirates are _massive_ organized criminal cabal of corrupt governments and outright seagoing thugs, perhaps the rest of the world is reluctant to move because -- _even if they get the hostage at sea --_ these thugs can retaliate against those hostages?
> 
> We just don't know what's happening behind the scenes to comment intelligently on the specifcs of this event.
> 
> And in this case, I don't think we have _the need to know_, either.
> 
> Diplomacy is saying "nice doggie" until you can find a big stick.
> 
> Obviously the piracy issue is bigger than just this one hostage, too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting. I was unaware they were part of a cabal that still had other hostages. That puts the entire situation in a different light.
> 
> If they have literally "hundreds" of hostages it's past time somebody took some action to stop this crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, probably. But what action, exactly?
> 
> Did you follow that link?
> 
> If Fox is giving us the real deal, then any overt military action gets a whole lotta hostages in Somalia killed.
> 
> Apparently these hostages hail from many nations, so acting unilaterally is probably not something that the USA can do without getting a whole lot of those folks killed.
> 
> Looks to me like this is not just a few bold guys with a boat and a gun, but a whole society forming around piracy in Somalia as a means of survival.
> 
> Looks like none of us is very well informed about what really going on in Somalia, doesn't it?
> 
> I know I'm not up to speed on this issue.
> 
> So if we don't understand the situation on the sea OR on the ground, all our armchair digital generalship is just so much speculative pompousity, isn't it?
> 
> I STILL want to understand _how this situation developed._
> 
> Obviously this priacy problem has been brewing for quite some time.
> 
> But it's only now just becoming something we're thinking about.
> 
> I suspect the time to start complaining about how it's being dealt with NOW is premature.
> 
> We don't KNOW what the overall situation is, and we don't really know what's being done about this particular hostage right now, either.
Click to expand...



Oh... My goodness... so a whole culture being formed around Piracy in Somalia, FOR SURVIVAL?  



FUCK THEM and their survival...  Your survival is not my responsibility and you've NO RIGHT TO SCREW ME FOR YOUR SURVIVAL.

Friends you can't make this crap up...  the secularist progressive has absolutely NO UNDERSTANDING of human rights... the next thing we'll hear are calls for the US to 'FIX SOMALIA FIRST'... we can't just allow Somalians to be whatever the hell they want to or CAN be... and kick the crap out of them when what they ARE, ARE TERRORISTS... Pirates, thugs, and other assorted facets of sub-humanity; each one VOID of anything APPROACHING human rights... by virtue of their overt usurpation of the rights of others.


----------



## 52ndStreet

I was watching a talk show on T.V..The guest said the way to put a stop to the Piracy off the cost of Somalia, is to deny the Pirates sanctuary. If they don't have a place to go they can not function?.
Would this "deny sanctuary" tactic work?.


----------



## Burp

52ndStreet said:


> I was watching a talk show on T.V..The guest said the way to put a stop to the Piracy off the cost of Somalia, is to deny the Pirates sanctuary. If they don't have a place to go they can not function?.
> Would this "deny sanctuary" tactic work?.



Do you know how to swim? 

Inquiring minds want to know.


----------



## 52ndStreet

Burp said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was watching a talk show on T.V..The guest said the way to put a stop to the Piracy off the cost of Somalia, is to deny the Pirates sanctuary. If they don't have a place to go they can not function?.
> Would this "deny sanctuary" tactic work?.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you know how to swim?
> 
> Inquiring minds want to know.
Click to expand...


Can you answer the question in the thread.


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## HUGGY

52ndStreet said:


> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.



As usual you are an idiot with an idiot suggestion.

We are not responsible for all crime in the world.

We do rescue american citizens under some circumstances...but not everyone.  

Somalia is a small country run by whoever totes the most guns.

The nations that send ships to Somalia are free to rescue thier own ships and people.

I doubt WE ever have to worry about a ship waving an American flag will ever be attacked by Somali pirates again.

Three shots..three dead pirates..  I bet even a Somali pirate can count to three.


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## Gunny

HUGGY said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As usual you are an idiot with an idiot suggestion.
> 
> We are not responsible for all crime in the world.
> 
> We do rescue american citizens under some circumstances...but not everyone.
> 
> Somalia is a small country run by whoever totes the most guns.
> 
> The nations that send ships to Somalia are free to rescue thier own ships and people.
> 
> I doubt WE ever have to worry about a ship waving an American flag will ever be attacked by Somali pirates again.
> 
> Three shots..three dead pirates..  I bet even a Somali pirate can count to three.
Click to expand...


Uh huh ... keep talking ....


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## Kevin_Kennedy

52ndStreet said:


> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.



We can't afford to involve ourselves in every problem around the globe.  The hostage situation is over, it's time to move on.


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## Gunny

Kevin_Kennedy said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We can't afford to involve ourselves in every problem around the globe.  The hostage situation is over, it's time to move on.
Click to expand...


Ignoring a problem that DOES affect us isn't going to make it go away.  If nothing else, train and arm the crews.  Hire Blackwater.  They like to kill shit.  To carry on as if "we shoed them ... they won't screw with us again" is naive and foolish.


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## Kevin_Kennedy

Gunny said:


> Kevin_Kennedy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We can't afford to involve ourselves in every problem around the globe.  The hostage situation is over, it's time to move on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ignoring a problem that DOES affect us isn't going to make it go away.  If nothing else, train and arm the crews.  Hire Blackwater.  They like to kill shit.  To carry on as if "we shoed them ... they won't screw with us again" is naive and foolish.
Click to expand...


This I agree with.  Let the freighters be armed, absolutely.  I don't support sending in the navy to wipe them out, however.


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## shock

That which adversely affects one area of the ocean ultimately affects us all; a fact we all should share.



We have been told of a book entitled "About Face" written by Donna Leon that indicates a specious case is being made for such dumping by means of pseudo authorization obtained by the payment of bribes to people within the Somalia ruling establishment.



What we do know is that those who are, or who are alleged to be, "pirates" have complained of such dumping, and have also complained of the destruction of the fish stock of the areas by foreign fishing boats and have used such allegations as a means for justifying their actions.



*Whether the "pirates's" acts are motivated in whole or even in small part by such criminal and immoral (malum prohibitum) acts as they charge is not material to a discussion of the urgent need for humanity to prevent such acts, including piracy;  such a mission should be assigned to that godawfully large and expensive fleet that we maintain in the Mid East so when it comes home it can console itself for the time spent by showing it did some good and worthwhile acts. *



shock



think where we might be rated among the nations had we not been blessed by our military


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## Munin

aka520 said:


> WorldAHope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aka520 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ok WAH, you can consider me challenged. I made no comment about the ability of the Navy to do it's duty other than they are following orders, which is commendable. The Navy has a huge arsenal of offensive tactics at it's disposal. The only reasonable explanation for this charade continuing, is they have been ordered to stand down. Obama, aka POS has not commented about the situation which I fine odd. If not just to reassure the family of the hostage that everything is being done to gain his safe return, However, not a peep. Granted, this is just my opinion but not as wild as you claim. I know nothing of swizzle stick chewing so I will leave that to the more familiar and experienced swizzle stick chewers such as you.
> gb
> 
> 
> 
> You make stuff up, pull it out of the frightened confused cobwebs that clog your head, and you share your fabrications with the rest of the world as if your were presenting proven fact.
> You are uninformed and clueless on what is involved in any kind of military operations. Go do a search "somali pirates news" and read a few of the many informative articles about what's happened off the coast of Somalia and about this current situation. Before you post any more of your nonesense, Try picking up a few facts, for a change. Lay off tossing out idiotic boogers.
> No matter what happens, in this or any other situation, you will still indulge in your compulsion to bad mouth Obama. Like a dope fiend who can do nothing but put a flame to his crackpipe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Bad mouthing the messenger is a cop out WAH. Have you nothing to contribute to my analysis but flames? I think I made a very reasonable argument to support my opinion. The US Navy is not as impotent as you suggest. Just for one, Navy Seals could have easily from underwater sank the lifeboat thereby dumping all occupants in the water. Seals are trained to overpower and subdue others while in the water. This is just one of no doubt many solutions. The lack of naval action leads to my stand down analysis. The lack of comment by Obama aka POS, gives to several observations. Mine being, he hasn't a clue of how to handle the situation. His brushing off the question when talking about housing from a teleprompter, only shows his inability to think while on his feet. Try working on my analysis by showing where I am wrong instead of just calling names. Any child can do that.
> 
> You seem to have a lot of experience with drugs and drug paraphernalia. Are you an addict?
> gb
Click to expand...


Your "analysis"?  

First of all, US navy ships are in the area (in an international effort to protect civilian ships). Secondly, Obama already did more about pirates then the previous president ( by authorising the snipershots that saved captain richard phillips SAFE! US Ship Captain Saved in Dramatic Rescue | wowOwow ).

But clearly you don't care about facts, all you re here for is to give a load of crap about how much mr Obama sucks without anything to back it up.


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## Munin

I found a nice cartoon about somalia, maybe you guys can also apreciate it ...


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## editec

Kevin_Kennedy said:


> 52ndStreet said:
> 
> 
> 
> When is the United States Navy going to shut down Somali Pirates who are Terrorizing the the high seas off the coast of Somalia?. The current situation could have been avoided, if only
> the U.S. navy was patrolling the waters off the cost of Somalia. Get the U.S. Navy seals
> involved in the removal and elimination of these Terrorists on Water!?
> No other country is dealing with this issue, it is up to the U.S. Navy to police those waters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We can't afford to involve ourselves in every problem around the globe. The hostage situation is over, it's time to move on.
Click to expand...

 
This liberal agrees.


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