# WWII Heavy Bomber B-24 "Miss-I-Hope" New Info!



## Mad Scientist (May 28, 2013)

My Grandfather, Lt. Donald L. Bone, flew B-24's in WWII. He flew 39 Missions and even one with Lt. George McGovern long before he was the Democrat nominee for President in 1972.

While he and his crew were training stateside he decided to have my Grandmother painted on the side in all her natural glory! When she found out she was furious but that's another story. Here she is:





When they finally arrived in Italy the crew was assigned to one squadron and the plane a different one so my Grandfather never flew her in combat.

But just tonight I received an e-mail from the son of the man who *did* fly her over Europe and won the DFC with her. He said he has a lot of pictures of her and the crew and I promise when I get them I will share them all with you!


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## Pumpfakes (Aug 10, 2013)

Hello,

My uncle was a ball turret gunner in WWII on the ship Multa Bona and I am looking over some of his photos and military items as he recently passed away.  There was a negative of him and two other gentlemen in front of the Miss-I-Hope and I went to a photography store today to have a picture made from the negative.  They have to send it out and it will take about a week.  In his diary an entry for August 27th, 1944 is as follows:

Blechhammer Molto flak- Hal got back as far as Yugo and then dropped back and disappeared.  He was flying Bone's crew on their first mission in "Section Eight".  2 of his gunners have been reported dead by partisans-nothing from Hal.  Col. Gunn came back from Rumania in an ME 109 with a Rumanian Pilot.

I read that your grandfather did not end up flying the Miss-I-Hope in combat but that you received an email from the son of someone who did.  My uncle received the DFC for action on July 27th flying on a ship piloted by a Captain Adams. I am wondering if Adams was flying the Miss-I-Hope that day?

Once I get the negative developed I will send you a scan if you can send me your regular email address.

Thanks for reading this, I am enthralled searching for information about my uncle and his crew.  My name is Paul and I live in Rhode Island.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 11, 2013)

Hello PumpFakes, thanks for joining and posting!

I have records of my Grandfather flying Missions on August 26th and 28th 1944 (his 2nd and 3rd Missions respectively)

26th: German Barracks, Rumania. Lt. Bailey was the Pilot in Command of the crew my Grandfather trained with Stateside in tail number 166 "Rosalie Mae". 
28th: Aviso Aquaduct, Italy. For some reason I don't have the Crew Manifest.

I had previously though that Miss-I-Hope was assigned to the 459th Bomb Group but apparently she was assigned to the 455th BG, 742nd Squadron.

The individual Mission folders for the 455th contain *all* the remaining Crew Manifests and assorted info on the 740th, 741st, 742nd and 743rd Squadrons to include quite a few "bombs away" photos from those few Bombers equipped with cameras.

I go to College Park a few times a year to research my relatives War Records, apparently may family has fought in every conflict dating back to the Revolutionary War. (Just like Lt. Dan!)  My Great Grandfather, Lt. Bone's Father, won the Silver Star at Belleau Wood in WWI.

Anyway, enough of me! That's not why you posted! 

If we can determine what Squadron your Uncle was assigned to I'd be happy to research those records for you (no charge of course!) I did the same for this gentleman who flew with my Grandfather. I met him at his home in San Jose and we flew on the Collings Foundation B-24!

I posted about 200 some odd pics here:

Sgt Thomas Boyd May 2012 Photos by uhhuh35 | Photobucket


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## namvet (Aug 11, 2013)

my late uncle flew a PBY black cat out of S america. convoy escort and a uboat killer


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## Pumpfakes (Aug 11, 2013)

Ha, I could picture your family falling like a stack of dominoes over the ages ala Lt. Dan.  My uncle did fly on August 28th to what he has listed as bridges in northern Italy.  His diary mentions that it was Old Bill Disbrow's last mission and that he went along as his ball gunner.  I do have a picture of Disbrow with a ship called "Swamp Angel" but I don't know if that was the bomber they were on that day. He mentioned that flak was light but they did get a B-24 and everybody bailed out. He states that the ball screwed up and he had no interphone or heat suit.  He told me that he once was stuck in the ball for 30 minutes and I am inclined to think that this may have been the mission when that took place.  

Thanks for your generous offer.  My Uncle was with the 741st, Raymond A. LaFazia , S/Sgt. 31291378

Funny that you mention tail number 166 as my uncle apparently went for some R&R to Cairo for five days on tail number 165, missed it by one digit.  Can you determine which ship was 165?

We saw some Collings crafts in Rhode Island in 2004 but uncle had no interest in going up again.   If you go to youtube and search Raymond A LaFazia you can watch a video from that day.  It won't let me post the url here as I don't have enough posts yet.

I am new at researching all this and appreciate your help.  I have discovered that all of my uncle's fellow crew members are deceased so he was the last one standing until his death this past December.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 12, 2013)

I have the Crew Manifest from that day and Lt. Disbrow and his crew are listed as flying tail #279 but as you can see, the Ball Turret Gunner is left blank.

Was your Uncle a last minute replacement? That seems to have happened quite a bit although it usually shows up on these Manifests as an erase and re-type of whomever went. I can only *guess* that they knew ahead of time that a Ball Turret Gunner was needed but your Uncles' name was never entered for whatever reason.

But I can tell ya', an Airmans' personal flight log is even MORE accurate than these Crew Manifests. I got a look at my Grandfathers Pilot's Log back in 1979 when I visited him as a young boy.

Thanks for the info on your Uncle, could you give me a *general* time frame, month and year, he was in theater? That would help a lot too!


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## jwoodie (Aug 12, 2013)

My dad flew a B-17 out of England (379th BG) in WW2.  During his first mission (1943), he and the other pilot were hit by an ME-109 in a head-on attack over Wilhelmshaven.    Ironically, they were the only members of their flight crew to survive the war.  After several months in the hospital, he returned to complete 33 missions and was awarded the DFC.

According to B-17 pilots, the ungainly B-24 was the package that the B-17 came in.  ;-)


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 12, 2013)

jwoodie said:


> My dad flew a B-17 out of England (379th BG) in WW2.  During his first mission (1943), he and the other pilot were hit by an ME-109 in a head-on attack over Wilhelmshaven.    Ironically, they were the only members of their flight crew to survive the war.  After several months in the hospital, he returned to complete 33 missions and was awarded the DFC.
> 
> According to B-17 pilots, the ungainly B-24 was the package that the B-17 came in.  ;-)


Yeah, except for the fact that the B-24 was *faster*, could fly *farther* and with a *heavier bomb load*, the B-17 was superior in every way. 

My Grandfather was slated to fly the P-80 after the war but was scratched from training when it was found that he *could not fit* his 6'3" frame in the cockpit. He told me *could not* close the canopy with his flight helmet on!


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## Pumpfakes (Aug 13, 2013)

The manifest is great.  My uncle did fly that flight with "Old Bill" Disbrow.  His diary states that Disbrow was a good pilot but was a flak magnet and always brought back the most shot-up ship in the squadron. For some reason, my uncle joined him for his last mission, which of course, many people sweated out.

My uncle flew on the following dates in 1944 for a total of 38 missions:

July, 7, 12, 15, 16, 17, 20, 21, 22, 25, 27, 31;  August 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 18, 21, 22, 27, 28, 29; September 2, 3, 6, 8, 10, 18, 20; October 4, 11, 13, 16, 17, 20, 21; November 4, 5

I don't want to drive you crazy with research so I am most interested in July 27th when his actions earned him the DFC.  He was flying with a Captain Adams and guys named, Baker, Hussman and Kavanaugh.

 *I am interested in identifying the name of the ship in the manifest you posted,   A/C 279.
 * I am also interested in finding the name of a radar mickey ship, B-24H-25-DT Serial Number 42-51131

  * Also the name of tail number 165 that he was on for his jaunt to Cairo.

Thanks again.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 13, 2013)

September 2nd, 1944. Niswest Yugoslavia. Tail #279, Tail Gunner.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 13, 2013)

November 5th, 1944. Mitrovica Yugoslavia. Tail #917, Left Waist Gunner.
"Not Off" meaning they were either standbys in case others couldn't take off or they had mechanical problems. I'm thinking they were Standbys because they were the last two Bombers manifested.


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## Pumpfakes (Aug 14, 2013)

Thanks, his diary entries for both of those days are very short.  September 2, "Milk run to Nise, Bulgaria."

November 5, "Wade came get us out of bed for a special mission.  It was a softie to Jugoslavia.  That night they told me I was grounded but I couldn't believe it until I saw the official order 2 days later."   That was it, he was done.  6 of the other guys were part of his regular crew.  Don't know what the "not off" means as he they did fly that mission.   On December 1st he left on the USS Monticello for the states and arrived in NY on December 14th.

Thanks for your effort.  I may make the trip to College Park myself someday.  Is there a way to search for people using their service numbers?  I am trying to determine the fate of his crew mate Arthur A. Miller # 35052394 but have been stymied so far.  Miller is a common name.


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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)

Considering the great danger, terrible losses and obvious great possibility they would be shot down and killed; these guys must have had balls of pure brass.
You have to respect that total bravery.

Ialso have a great love of aircraft, especially military stuff so this thread is of interest anyway.
In Yogyakarta, Indonesia, there's a very good aircraft museum but, unlike many places, you are allowed right up to the exhibits and actually touch them.


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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)

This baby is one of my personal favourites. There's just something about them.


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## Pumpfakes (Aug 14, 2013)

Aha, I found the answer to tail number 165 that my uncle flew in to Cairo and the A/C # 279 that he flew on in the first manifest that you posted.  They are both the same ship the Swamp Angel.  I found the explanation online as follows:

"The 165 for Swamp Angel is the manufacturing block number.  This number was located in the fuselage data block located on the left side of the aircraft near the cockpit.  I've attached an example of this fuselage data block for B-24-J-2-DT, serial number 42-51279. 

For the 455th BG (after May 1944), the large two-digit number on the aft fuselage was a squadron aircraft identifier (00 - 19 for the 740th, 20 - 39 for the 741st, 40 - 59 for the 742nd, and 60 - 79 for the 743rd).  The 455th BG also added the last three digits of the serial number to the nose, like the "499" visible in the Swamp Angel photo.  Sometimes there was also a three digit construction number painted on the nose, so photo ID can be tricky some times.  This number was usually located further forward, and used a slightly smaller stencil."


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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)

You can even go inside some of the aircraft.


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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)




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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)

At the time of the Indonesian war of independence from the Dutch, Indonesia had little by way of aircraft. Mostly stuff the Japanese had left to them and that was old and not up to a lot.
There were some other aircraft such as DC3 but the Indonesian took to using anything as a stopgap.


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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)

I was a bit slow off the mark yesterday or I would have got a far better shot of these babies as they flew by.

You have to admit, that's an interesting mixed flight.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 14, 2013)

Indofred said:


>


Indofred did this picture get reversed somehow? Zero's didn't have left handed engines. It's either that or someone grafted a Russian M-14 radial onto it! (Or the *whole thing* is a replica)


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## Indofred (Aug 14, 2013)

American Communist said:


> Indofred said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



Well spotted.
As to the answer, I have no clue but there are several possibilities.
It's unlikely there were any Russian aircraft around Indonesia at the end of WWII but such an engine could have been fitted at a later date.
It could also be something as simple as they didn't have the correct prop when they set the thing up as an exhibit.

If I get chance to return to the museum, I'll try to find out but this could suggest my guess has merit.
Pacific Wrecks - A6M5 Model 52 Zero Tail 30-1153


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## Pumpfakes (Aug 22, 2013)

I had the negative of Miss -I- Hope developed but don't have enough posts to put it up on this site yet.  I put it up on the B-24bestweb group on facebook if you are on there.  Or reach me through the email on my son's web site:     kurtshistoricsites.com


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 22, 2013)

Pumpfakes said:


> I had the negative of Miss -I- Hope developed but don't have enough posts to put it up on this site yet.  I put it up on the B-24bestweb group on facebook if you are on there.  Or reach me through the email on my son's web site:     kurtshistoricsites.com


That's great! 

Sorry but I don't have a FaceBook account, could you send it to me via PM here? I'll post it for ya'.

EDIT: I'll make a FaceBook account just for this.


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## Mad Scientist (Aug 23, 2013)

Here it is! This is the first picture I've seen with the entire stateside crew listed.


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## jwoodie (Aug 23, 2013)

American Communist said:


> jwoodie said:
> 
> 
> > My dad flew a B-17 out of England (379th BG) in WW2.  During his first mission (1943), he and the other pilot were hit by an ME-109 in a head-on attack over Wilhelmshaven.    Ironically, they were the only members of their flight crew to survive the war.  After several months in the hospital, he returned to complete 33 missions and was awarded the DFC.
> ...



The B-24 had superior stats, but couldn't take a punch.  Without air superiority, they would have been flying coffins.  The B-17 was the only heavy bomber of WW2 that could fight its way into enemy-controlled airspace and deliver precision daylight bombing.

My dad was also 6'3" and couldn't fit into a P-38.


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## jwoodie (Aug 28, 2013)

In 1943 a mid-air collision on February 1, 1943, between a B-17 and a German fighter over the Tunis dock area, became the subject of one of the most famous photographs of WW II. An enemy fighter attacking a 97th Bomb Group formation went out of control, probably with a wounded pilot, then continued its crashing descent into the rear of the fuselage of a Fortress named "All American", piloted by Lt. Kendrick R. Bragg, of the 414th Bomb Squadron. When it struck, the fighter broke apart, but left some pieces in the B-17. The left horizontal stabilizer of the Fortress and left elevator were completely torn away. The two right engines were out and one on the left had a serious oil pump leak. The vertical fin and the rudder had been damaged, the fuselage had been cut almost completely through connected only at two small parts of the frame, and the radios, electrical and oxygen systems were damaged. There was also a hole in the top that was over 16 feet long and 4 feet wide at its widest; the split in the fuselage went all the way to the top gunner's turret.


Although the tail actually bounced and swayed in the wind and twisted when the plane turned and all the control cables were severed, except one single elevator cable still worked, and the aircraft miraculously still flew!

The tail gunner was trapped because there was no floor connecting the tail to the rest of the plane. The waist and tail gunners used parts of the German fighter and their own parachute harnesses in an attempt to keep the tail from ripping off and the two sides of the fuselage from splitting apart.

While the crew was trying to keep the bomber from coming apart, the pilot continued on his bomb run and released his bombs over the target.


When the bomb bay doors were opened, the wind turbulence was so great that it blew one of the waist gunners into the broken tail section. It took several minutes and four crew members to pass him ropes from parachutes and haul him back into the forward part of the plane. When they tried to do the same for the tail gunner, the tail began flapping so hard that it began to break off. The weight of the gunner was adding some stability to the tail section, so he went back to his position. The turn back toward England had to be very slow to keep the tail from twisting off. They actually covered almost 70 miles to make the turn home. The bomber was so badly damaged that it was losing altitude and speed and was soon alone in the sky.  

For a brief time, two more Me-109 German fighters attacked the All American. Despite the extensive damage, all of the machine gunners were able to respond to these attacks and soon drove off the fighters. The two waist gunners stood up with their heads sticking out through the hole in the top of the fuselage to aim and fire their machine guns. The tail gunner had to shoot in short bursts because the recoil was actually causing the plane to turn.


Allied P-51 fighters intercepted the All American as it crossed over the Channel and took one of the pictures shown. They also radioed to the base describing that the appendage was waving like a fish tail and that the plane would not make it and to send out boats to rescue the crew when they bailed out.

The fighters stayed with the Fortress, taking hand signals from Lt. Bragg and relaying them to the base. Lt. Bragg signaled that 5 parachutes and the spare had been "used" so five of the crew could not bail out. He made the decision that if they could not bail out safely, then he would stay with the plane to land it.


Two and a half hours after being hit, the aircraft made its final turn to line up with the runway while it was still over 40 miles away. It descended into an emergency landing and a normal roll-out on its landing gear.


When the ambulance pulled alongside, it was waved off because not a single member of the crew had been injured. No one could believe that the aircraft could still fly in such a condition. The Fortress sat placidly until the crew all exited through the door in the fuselage and the tail gunner had climbed down a ladder, at which time the entire rear section of the aircraft collapsed.


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## tedgorton (Dec 6, 2013)

American Communist said:


> If we can determine what Squadron your Uncle was assigned to I'd be happy to research those records for you (no charge of course!) I did the same for this gentleman who flew with my Grandfather. I met him at his home in San Jose and we flew on the Collings Foundation B-24!



Hello--I apologize for picking up only on the proffered help point, but I wonder if you would have any leads for me.  My Dad Theodore H (Ted) Gorton was a pilot and then Squadron Commander with the 451 BG (725 Sq) then from June 44, the 484 BG.  He mentioned flying planes with names like Fertile Myrtle, the Belle of St Joe (his hometown in MO) or Pistol Packin' Mama.  He enlisted in 1939 and was a Lt Col by 1943 or 44 (aged 25 or 26).  He said he was based at "Foggia" but I think that was a generic name for several airfields in the "Boot".  He flew more than 30 missions and survived the war.
Many thanks for any ideas I could follow up, or information or photos you might come across
Ted Gorton (Jr)


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## daveman (Dec 6, 2013)

jwoodie said:


> In 1943 a mid-air collision on February 1, 1943, between a B-17 and a German fighter over the Tunis dock area, became the subject of one of the most famous photographs of WW II. An enemy fighter attacking a 97th Bomb Group formation went out of control, probably with a wounded pilot, then continued its crashing descent into the rear of the fuselage of a Fortress named "All American", piloted by Lt. Kendrick R. Bragg, of the 414th Bomb Squadron. When it struck, the fighter broke apart, but left some pieces in the B-17. The left horizontal stabilizer of the Fortress and left elevator were completely torn away. The two right engines were out and one on the left had a serious oil pump leak. The vertical fin and the rudder had been damaged, the fuselage had been cut almost completely through connected only at two small parts of the frame, and the radios, electrical and oxygen systems were damaged. There was also a hole in the top that was over 16 feet long and 4 feet wide at its widest; the split in the fuselage went all the way to the top gunner's turret.
> 
> 
> Although the tail actually bounced and swayed in the wind and twisted when the plane turned and all the control cables were severed, except one single elevator cable still worked, and the aircraft miraculously still flew!
> ...


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