# Christianity more dangerous than Atheism.



## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.

An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"

These are NOT Atheist doing this great deception, its believers in Christ, coming in HIS name; in other words, " Christians!" The largest group on earth that comes in Jesus name. And here Jesus is teaching that these are the kind of people who will reach many and deceive them.

The real deceivers are those who are doing their deception in Jesus name; they are the real dangerous ones. Not the Atheist, or any group of unbelievers; its these believers who are fooling this world.

Because they have fooled themselves.


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## Ozone (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> 
> These are NOT Atheist doing this great deception, its believers in Christ, coming in HIS name; in other words, " Christians!" The largest group on earth that comes in Jesus name. And here Jesus is teaching that these are the kind of people who will reach many and deceive them.
> 
> ...


how do you know that jesus wasn't talking about himself? for many shall come in his name saying that he is christ...


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

Ozone said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> ...




 Clearly Jesus was speaking about " Many" coming in his name, not just one, or himself. This was a future prophecy, describing a very unique deception that will be heaped on this world; believers in Jesus, actually deceiving others. People who pray in Jesus name, sing about Jesus, teach and preach Jesus, deceiving a whole lot of unspecting believers. Misleading people with their false righteousness and religious zeal. Church going Christians and pastors, Christian evangelist who influence millions, deceiving people in the name of Jesus.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.





Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.





Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Dear Mickiel let's compare bad apples to bad apples, good apples to good apples, bad oranges to bad oranges etc. If you are going to mix fruits and compare apples with oranges, at least compare good with good and bad with bad. Comparing bad to good apples will also work if it's done right.

For example:
Let's compare the good Christians and spiritual healing vs misguided false faith healing or cults and religious abuse.  The people who do the real spiritual healing save lives and help ppl recover from addiction disease and even abuse done by the cults and false religions. So the good outweighs the bad and actually cures it. That's comparing good apples with bad apples.

Let's compare good atheists with good Christians, by defining these as people who forgive and work together regardless if they are nontheist or believers. They both do good work to solve problems in society and relations by having faith in humanity peace and justice especially restorative justice. The advantage of Christians is they can invoke spiritual healing to cure sickness of spirit and otherwise incurable mental and physical ills on a collective scale because they join in prayer on this level. The advantage of atheists or nontheist is they can help prove these healing methods medically and objectively in ways that Christians cannot do as well on their own. So I would credit the Christians as saving lives health and relationships that atheists can't do. And also that the secular humanists and nontheists can work with laws of science and the secular realms that require neutrality and objectivity ie black and white thinking in ways I find are lost to people who feel such spiritual connections on a holistic scale they make leaps in logic and lose concreteness  as my atheist friends seem to focus on.

Now in terms of rejection that becomes dangerous : when the misguided religion cults either reject science and medicine or turn to war and violence and abuse to control ppl that is greater in collective groups that atheists tend not to use. Th e closest you might compare is when atheists and secularists DENY and REJECT Christianity as negative and prevent more ppl from seeking life saving help , then that is collectively Killing people who could have been helped to save their lives. Political wars can be prevented including genocide by teaching spiritual healing that breaks the generational cycles of hateful sick patterns of oppression abuse and retribution. Atheism doesn't cure the spiritual causes of war crime abuse addiction and other social ills that Christianity has. The forgiveness and healing of relations has to come first before ppl can sit down and talk out rationally the cause and solutions for problems.

So Mickiel if you really look at the Good and bad extremes of both

I'd say both the good and bad that Christianity can do is greater, by the power of collective institutions, but the good outweighs the bad.

The good and the bad that individual atheists can do on their own is less by individual nature, but the good on a collective scale still depends on working with Christians who recognize and invoke connections with the source of natural laws. The Christians can include natural laws and science without depending on atheists (though they are needed to reach secular audiences and prove these laws to the public) but atheists cannot invoke the same authority unity and healing that Christians invoke without their help.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

The deception called Christianity is VERY well done, it has been excellent seduction on a world wide and historical level. In Gen. 2:9 God actually formed a tree,  ( or created a system on earth), that grew both good and evil knowledge, out from the same tree, or same source, or same earth. This was really the beginning of human religion, and much later the actual birth of Christianity in Rome at Antioch. God actually wanted a mixture of good and evil to exist on earth, and for all of humanity to be adversely affected by it. Religion is the perfect example of that kind of confusion, and Christianity its star pupil.

Its the seduction of the ages, the very people who claim to represent God on earth, are actually being used to pump deception onto the human consciousness. Jesus said " Many"  will be deceived by this, that " Many" are those in Matt. 7:13 who entered into what they perceived was a " Straight gate", the gate was wide, or popular, very broad, but it lead that many to destruction. Destruction meaning simply spiritually blinded.

Now, after its jump start in Rome, Christianity will begin its historical assault on all of humanity, using the bible to thump its way into the human consciousness, and preach and plant its insane message of eternal hell punishing.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

emilynghiem said:
			
		

> I'd say both the good and bad that Christianity can do is greater, by the power of collective institutions, but the good outweighs the bad.
> 
> The good and the bad that individual atheists can do on their own is less by individual nature, but the good on a collective scale still depends on working with Christians who recognize and invoke connections with the source of natural laws. The Christians can include natural laws and science without depending on atheists (though they are needed to reach secular audiences and prove these laws to the public) but atheists cannot invoke the same authority unity and healing that Christians invoke without their help.




I disagree totally, the harm Christianity has inflicted on the believing consciousness of humanity, is greater by far than any perceived harm all the Atheist have done. Christianity infected even science, as it tried to control it in history. Science finally got tired of church regulated science, and the great rebellion came as science broke away from the self righteous controlling Christians. The " Bad" that Christianity does is masked as good, when its really evil. Christianity tries to hide its evil, or lie about it, claiming they have none. They are killing humanity, and don't even know it.

I would rather the person killing me is aware that they are,  Christianity is not even aware of its unrighteousness; they are the perfect tool of satan. It was these artful self righteous believers who were behind the death of Christ, and they will be behind  the spiritual death of this world.


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## rdean (Jun 4, 2016)

Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

rdean said:


> Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.



Being human is potentially dangerous. Being Atheist, is no doorway to righteousness, but in my view, neither is being Christian. I just think Christians are more of a threat to humanity, but they are not perceived to be that; which is part of the danger. When a human claims to represent God, or when a group thinks themselves to be the anointed of God, when they are not; that is dangerous in my view. Yet, they are self convinced by a very powerful illusion that they represent God himself.

Christianity thinks the bible was written by them; it has 40 authors, the vast majority of them were not Christians. They actually think the bible was written FOR them; when it was written for all of humanity. But this level of self righteousness is unparrelled in history; imagine a human telling others that they speak for God. I have actually heard some Christian leaders tell their people, " God told me to tell you this!" And the people actually believe it! A VERY strong power is on display here.

Religion has crippled the human consciousness more than anythingelse I am aware of.


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 4, 2016)

The OP and the arguments in behalf of it are an excellent example of why atheism is to be avoided by the weak headed.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

JakeStarkey said:


> The OP and the arguments in behalf of it are an excellent example of why atheism is to be avoided by the weak headed.




What we are has nothing to do with our weakness or strength; there are strong and weak Atheist; we are what we are supposed to be. I believe in destiny. All Atheist are supposed to be Atheist, all Theist are supposed to be Theist. If you are Atheist, you should be one.

If you are a Theist, your supposed to be one. Life gave you what you are. I think there is a purpose to all things.

I do not believe that Christianity represents God; no way! I don't think any group of humans does. I personally don't think anyone knows God; or enough about him to amount to anything. No religion represents God, but all of them have distorted his reputation.


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > The OP and the arguments in behalf of it are an excellent example of why atheism is to be avoided by the weak headed.
> ...


I said avoided by the weak headed, not everyone.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

JakeStarkey said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...




One does not need to be strong headed to be an Atheist; they just need to be. Being weak is a human state of being that no one group has cornered the market on.


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


So choosing to be an atheist is not a meaningful choice.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I disagree totally, the harm Christianity has inflicted on the believing consciousness of humanity, is greater by far than any perceived harm all the Atheist have done.



^ SEE Mickiel you did it AGAIN.
You are only comparing apples to BAD oranges . You completely leave out the GOOD oranges that outweigh the bad ones. You missed the point entirely.

Because you keep going on and on about BAD oranges I assume you have never studied REAL spiritual healing unique to Christianity.

Thus your research is BIASED and missing the very key and reason why Christianity has the respect influence and following it has.

Mickiel do you realize by leaving out the lifesaving life changing benefits of Christianity YOU are guilty of what you accuse Christians of by skewing and screwing up science. You do that here without even knowing you are projecting a bias excluding the real practice and meaning of Christianity!

All the things you say below about Christianity, you are doing the equivalent by basing all your studies on oranges on BAD oranges and missing the benefits of GOOD oranges that contain Vitamin C which you haven't even considered much less studied.

I will give you three resources to study on REAL spiritual healing methods doctors have documented the benefits of. I bet you not 1 million but 10 million dollars that medical research into these methods (ie not false faith healing but natural voluntary spiritual healing taught and practiced by these three reputable sources) will change your mind and change the world:
1. Dr. Francis and Judith MacNutt
http://www.christianhealingmin.org
2. Dr. Phillip Goldfedder licensed neurosurgeon
Healing is Yours. Alternative Medicine Healing Ministry.
3. Either Olivia Reiner in Houston 713-829-0899 whose nonprofit volunteer outreach offers the same methods of free spiritual healing help as the MacNutts
Nonprofit outreach, or the book by Dr. Scott peck describing how he changed his mind about exorcism and spiritual healing after he tried it out in curing two schizophrenic patients and discovered it worked in accordance with the scientific method. Scott pecks book: Glimpses of the Devil.
I listed these resources on a Web page for promoting medical research and development of these therapy methods freespiritualhealing

Mickiel the good news is that if this field of therapy and cure based on forgiveness of generational baggage taught and used by Christians is therapy ONLY thing missing from your knowledge, this can be fixed logically by adding it.

If you cannot research it objectively because you can't forgive Christianity and the problems you blame on it, then you demonstrate why atheists depend on Christians. If they can forgive atheists and work with science, but you cannot forgive Christians and work with them.

I hope you are more open and objective, and not as close-minded and biased against scientific proof of spiritual healing, as you blame Christians for below:



			
				Mickiel said:
			
		

> Christianity infected even science, as it tried to control it in history. Science finally got tired of church regulated science, and the great rebellion came as science broke away from the self righteous controlling Christians. The " Bad" that Christianity does is masked as good, when its really evil. Christianity tries to hide its evil, or lie about it, claiming they have none. They are killing humanity, and don't even know it.
> 
> I would rather the person killing me is aware that they are,  Christianity is not even aware of its unrighteousness; they are the perfect tool of satan. It was these artful self righteous believers who were behind the death of Christ, and they will be behind  the spiritual death of this world.





Mickiel said:


> I disagree totally, the harm Christianity has inflicted on the believing consciousness of humanity, is greater by far than any perceived harm all the Atheist have done. Christianity infected even science, as it tried to control it in history. Science finally got tired of church regulated science, and the great rebellion came as science broke away from the self righteous controlling Christians. The " Bad" that Christianity does is masked as good, when its really evil. Christianity tries to hide its evil, or lie about it, claiming they have none. They are killing humanity, and don't even know it.
> 
> I would rather the person killing me is aware that they are,  Christianity is not even aware of its unrighteousness; they are the perfect tool of satan. It was these artful self righteous believers who were behind the death of Christ, and they will be behind  the spiritual death of this world.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

JakeStarkey said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...




I personally don't believe Theism or Atheism is a choice; its a given from life. You either are one, or your not. Confusion is when you don't know what you are.

I personally would not choose to be an Atheist, I am not one, and I don't want to be one.

And I am not proud of what Theist have done to religion; I could care less for either group really.


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 4, 2016)

Confused much?


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

I hold no need to defend Christianity, I am  not swayed by their arua. I am not Christian, and don't want to be one. I think Christianity is more full of paganism and guilt than they know. I know God does not like what they are doing, and I know Jesus has things against Christianity.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Ozone said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> ...


Dear Ozone and Mickiel 
Two ways I would translate the name of jesus or spirit if Christianity is
* the name of the Law or sake of Justice
* the spirit of Charity or compassion for fellow human beings

So let's discuss how to tell true charity from false charity and this is the same as true Christianity from false christianity.
* if it is for selfish gain, to show off in public to make up for guilt over wrongs or to compete for more credit, those are examples of false charity, quid pro quo, and expecting reward in return as a condition on giving.
* if it truly to help others with no expectation of payback or reward, but faith that helping someone will pay forward, without condition, that is an example of true charity. Some of the most selfless acts of charity are in private unseen or unknown. And the greatest dearest act of charity of all is forgiveness, that is worth more the less it is deserved where the reward is as great as the sacrifice of pride ego anger and attachment required to give up and receive healing in place of pain caused by unforgiveness.

Let's compare true justice in the name of the law ( or universal truth and equal justice as the name of the Lord) with injustice and lawlessness.

When Hitler claimed to be doing the work of God and took over got claiming authority of law, he was actual acting as Antichrist. Instead of truth and love which the spirit of God represents, 
He preached and acted based on fear which is the opposite. Instead of love of conscience that Christ represents collectively, instead of restorative justice or Christ Jesus that brings healing harmony and peace or the Holy Spirit uniting humanity as one, he preached Retributive Justice which is Antichrist and brings war by division not true peace by true unity.

The jihadist terrorists also preach in the name of God and justice, but are based on anger fear Retribution and ill-will that is selfish not selfless. So they are the opposite of love of truth by living by fear. And causing injustice claiming it is justice. 

In short if it based on unforgiveness and ill-will that is the opposite of loving and forgiving all ppl equally as one humanity for the sake of greater good will for all which is what God's will represents as the highest good possible.

If it is justice with mercy, peace and justice for all humanity, equal justice for all ppl included, restorative justice that heals and unites, then that is Christ Jesus that's brings salvation from suffering by bringing ppl together to right the wrongs and correct and prevent problems in the future by forgiving and learning from the past.

We can't learn the causes and cures of ills if we are too busy fighting over blame, left blaming right while right blames left, atheists blaming Christians or Christians blaming atheists. To study and resolve problems objective ly with clear minds, it help to forgive and let go negative emotions and stereotypes. Then we can collaborate and fix problems together using the best that each person or group has to offer.

Does this help explain the difference
Between true advocates of justice
And true charity for neighbors vs false


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Being free from faith isn’t ‘anti-religion,’ it’s simply the acknowledgement of the fact that religion and ‘god’ as perceived by theists are creations of man.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I hold no need to defend Christianity, I am  not swayed by their arua. I am not Christian, and don't want to be one. I think Christianity is more full of paganism and guilt than they know. I know God does not like what they are doing, and I know Jesus has things against Christianity.


The true Christians I know ALL agree with you. The difference is they take responsibility for correcting and rebuking false teachers who abuse and do wrong. Mickiel if you can't correct the problem the way Christians can correct their own peers, that is what I mean by atheists depending on Christians to do this work. That is why the good in Christianity outweighs the bad because Christians are called to clean up their own camps.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

The fight between Theist and Atheist cannot be stopped by anything human, in my view. Its going to last until the end. I just personally blame Theist more because they do their dirt in the name of a God who is good and merciful. Christianity is not a true advocate of Justice in my view, if anything, they advocate greed and are trying to even sell passage into the free Kingdom of God.

Not all Christians are bad people, no; but I think most of their doctrines are bad.


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## IndependantAce (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Atheism is more dangerous because it tends to lead people to hell.

Plus there's no reason that atheists shouldn't condemn others; atheism is simply "do whatever one feels like for whatever reason", so in extreme cases this leads to people becoming serial killers and rapists because they have no meaning in life other than pursuing sick thrills.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I hold no need to defend Christianity, I am  not swayed by their arua. I am not Christian, and don't want to be one. I think Christianity is more full of paganism and guilt than they know. I know God does not like what they are doing, and I know Jesus has things against Christianity.
> ...




Christianity cannot correct itself, and what little good it does, is not because of the religion, its because of a few good people. Christianity is an  over rated system, with blown up reputation and unbiblical support. Christianity cannot clean itself , the way to do that is not even in man, Jer. 10:23. Christianity was destined for dirt and it has the most horrible doctrines I know of in religion. They have perverted the salvation of God.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...


Dear C_Clayton_Jones 
Although man wrote down the laws of science and physics, do you agree we didn't create the world and the laws of how energy and matter work and relate. We just developed the language and terms to express these laws that are inherent in the world.

Likewise are you able to admit that the natural laws of how human psychology works weren't made up by man. Just because our civil govt laws as in the Constitution reflect and are inspired by natural laws were written down by man doesn't mean we made up the laws of human nature we are born with.

Do you acknowledge any natural laws that exist on their own before humans wrote them down. Or do you only see laws as whatever ppl pass through govt.

Do you see religions as local Languages for universal laws that everyone expresses in different ways. So again just because man developed these systems of terminology and mythology, that doesn't mean we made up the universal laws of humanity that inspired these man made lamguages.

Do you perceive or believe in any higher sense of truth and justice we didnt create ourselves behind man made laws and religions we did, as attempts to capture this self existent body of laws and knowledge of the world.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

IndependantAce said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Christianity is FAR more dangerous because they are teaching the insane doctrine of eternal hell punishing; completely ruining the reputation of God in history. They have perverted the gospel more than all religions combined in my view.


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## IndependantAce (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> emilynghiem said:
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> > Mickiel said:
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Pales in comparison to Stalinism and state atheist doctrines.



> They have perverted the salvation of God.


And what is your religion?


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## IndependantAce (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> IndependantAce said:
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It's only natural that wickedness be repaid; nearly all religions have a doctrine of punishment for wickedness; and those which don't are degenerate because they eliminate "hell" just to justify nihilism and depraved behavior.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> emilynghiem said:
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Look into spiritual healing my friend, and get back to this . You'll be relieved and grateful to understand how Christians are the key to correcting the religious abuses as well as the injury and damage resulting . There is far more good news than bad, and you will rejoice to know how committed the Good Christians are in this battle they all take seriously as their life calling. 

For all the bad and horrors you've seen, the healing and happiness that overcomes these is far far greater. The bigger the debts and damages, the greater the restitution and rewards. That is the power of justice and salvation by grace. That is the meaning behind faith in Jesup is faith in justice.

Take heart Take courage Take care
Commit to truth and it sets us free from division and strife. 

Love of truth love of justice
Love of peace for all humanity

May your love be greater than your fear

May your willingness toward change be greater than your fear of the unknown

May your inclusion of all humanity in seeing corrections and prevention of abuse and wrongs be greater than your fear of evil and selfish rejection and conflict.

May all the best things in humanity overcome and outweigh our worst wrongs

In Christ jesus name, for the sake of restorative justice and lasting peace amen


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...





IndependantAce said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > emilynghiem said:
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I have no religion, I want nothing between me and God but empty space; no human meddling. The Christian doctrine of eternal hell punishing is more barbaric and insane that ANY thing Stalin or Hitler did. This devils doctrine is teaching that God will keep an unbeliever alive and punish them for 10 million years, plus another 50 billion years, plus another 900 trillion years and keep hurting them on into infinity!

That is INSANE!


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## IndependantAce (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
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You don't know much about theology


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
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Well thank you for your concern, but Christianity has absolutely nothing to do with my healing, and will have nothing to do with God healing this world. Christianity has no " Holy Image" in my mind and I don't equate anything spiritual to them and their namesake religion.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

IndependantAce said:


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In Christianity you get the justice you give. If you forgive others and allow corrections and restitution to heal the relations and restore justice, then you will be granted the same grace.

If you don't forgive but judge punish and reject, then so will you be treated.

Thus justice is a double edged sword.
If you live by retributive justice you reap what you sow and are judged by your own words.

If you live by justice with mercy, then you will receive the same. 

This way we learn the difference between the two paths, and choose by reason. Living by ill will and unforgiveness Attracts negative reactions in a vicious cycle of bad karmic suffering and war. Living by forgiveness and correction of wrongs leads to healing and peace by restoring justice.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

IndependantAce said:


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I know theology is meaningless to salvation. And I know salvation is not in the hands of Christianity. If it was, we all would be in serious trouble.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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Forgiveness is what correlates with healing. The more forgiving you are the more healing energy flows through your thoughts words and actions, mind body and spirit, and relations with others in greater society. BTW Mickiel my top favorite atheist in the world, Ray Hill, teaches forgiveness and free grace in life, the same as Christians, but doesn't use God or Jesus to teach that. He considers it a natural law or process in life. So the difference between you and him is he does understand forgiveness and healing is better for his mental health and clarity to let go. But you want to keep holding on to your unforgiveness and blame of Christianity, not considering how this is harming you to Harbor that negative thinking that affects you not them.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
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I keep holding on to what I see as the truth; Christianity is the great Trojan horse that imploded inside of this world and helped pervert the true gospel of the salvation of all of humanity. My mental health is outside of Christian influence; I am free of the Christian web. I hold no slave mentality to any religion; my forgiveness comes from God, and neither you or any Christian can do anything about that.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> IndependantAce said:
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1. In order to communicate to resolve conflicts and unite tribes/denominations, the language of theology is necessary for those who rely on "common terms" to organize and unite behind agreement on points and principles
2. As for salvation and Christianity.
Between Christians who commit to the faith in scriptural authority, yes, likewise, reaching agreement on truth to establish justice and peace by accord, DOES rely on Christianity and scriptural process.

Again Mickiel please take courage in knowing that making peace between and among Religious memberships is easier and will come first BEFORE making peace between political groups and nations which is much much harder. The process is only possible once the spiritual leadership and unity pulls together. Then the rest will follow but will take years if not generations to repair all the damage and rebuild on a unified foundation of peace and justice for all. The spiritual change will lead the physical changes.

You are right the world is in trouble and thats why the Christian leadership has a major role to play. The leap of faith required is to forgive first so we can share in corrections as a consequence. Most secular thinking calls to prove the problems are corrected first before forgiving and letting go. But humans are not even able to work together on solutions until after we've forgiven enough to tolerate people or groups we blame. So again that's why we're in trouble, because it's hard to forgive in advance without higher faith .


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

In my view, Christianity is one of the churches of God; just a church in deception. After Jesus left and his followers were " Branded the term Christianity", given to them by the Romans, the seduction of the Christian church began then. 7 churches of God are discussed in Revelations chapter 2-4. Actual churches of God, some stages of these churches were perhaps Christians. Not out of biblical possibility. Notice Jesus view of these churches of HIS; in Rev. 2:4, he has something against HIS church at Ephesus. In 2:15 Jesus reveals he actually hates things HIS church at Pergamos was doing; imagine that, Jesus actually hating things his own church is doing. A serious thing. In 2:20 Jesus has things against his church called  Thyatira;, in Rev. 3:17 the prosperity ministries spirit appears in Jesus church at Laodicea, in Rev.3:20 notice the position of Christ, he is on " The outside knocking"; he is not even IN this church age of his. Not even a true part of them; simply stunning.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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Sure Mickiel if you can truly forgive and let go without relying on Christian prayer to do this, Great! You may be like my friend Ray who doesn't need the Bible to forgive and let the truth and justice and peace guide humanity for the better. My friend Ed is also naturally forgiving and inclusive and nonjudgmental. He is atheist and humanist. Ray is a peace and justice activist who lives by restorative justice I consider one of the secular names of Christ Jesus. As long as you do not reject true justice and true charity as the spirit of truth and love embodied in humanity, then you are still a neighbor in Christ even if you are nontheist as a secular gentile. The gentiles under natural laws of science and reason are still included as the second fold of the one flock governed by the LAWs of Justice which "Jesus the Lord" translates into. The spirit of truth and justice is one; but the secular gentiles express this in terms of natural laws and empirical science while believers under scriptural authority use church laws to describe the world and their relationship between individual and collective will. I use Constitutional laws which bridge the gap between natural laws of the secular world and spiritual laws of believers depending which systems they use for their default language. I try to speak the language of the person or audience I'm addressing.


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## Mickiel (Jun 4, 2016)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
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I hold no need at all to fall under any of your terms or labels. I walk alone in my views , and I don't need the crutch of any group to help me define my beliefs. But I do like the sense of unity that you give out.

Peace.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 5, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> emilynghiem said:
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Dear Mickiel
Sorry I missed where you are coming from.
Yes, I agree that the forgiveness that makes the difference (not just between effective/true or abusive/false practice of Christianity but of Atheism, Buddhism, Constitutionalism and any other laws or systems)
comes from Nature or God. It is not dependent on Christianity as the "only denomination."

What I mean by Christianity is the universal sense of true Charity and true Justice
that ALL people can embrace.

What makes people equal is living and embodying these laws equally,
and that is ultimately what Christian faith means -- when people "take the laws of restorative
justice to HEART and live them by CONSCIENCE" we become neighbors "in Christ"
Or by conscience COLLECTIVELY whether we are Jew or Gentile, Believer or nontheist,
or we put church before state or state before church authority. As long as we put
universal justice or equal justice first which includes "our neighbor as ourselves"
then we have that spirit that Christians call Christ Jesus that allows us
to establish "God's will through Christ on earth" or the ultimate ideal good will
for all humanity for Peace and Justice on earth or the Kingdom of God/heavenly peace.

I was on my phone last night, and could barely scroll up and down and reply.
So I missed what you were saying, sorry.

I thought you were arguing from the viewpoint of an atheist,
so I was wondering why you were so consistent sounding if you were atheist!
But I see you are a theist, but may be some other denomination other than
what you call Christianity.

I believe that ALL tribes will be joined together in the spirit of Christ and 
are included in the Kingdom of God, so there is no need to "judge people
by denomination or affiliation" people organize by Groups for a reason,
just like the several states united under one union.  Just because we
are all under one unifying law that is the spirit of the entire collective
of people, that doesn't nullify the diverse state laws that govern people locally.

So Christianity has two meanings, it can mean the culture and local laws
that not everyone subscribes to.  Or it can mean the universal spirit of
the laws of "Truth Justice and Peace" that all humans are governed by
inherently by our human nature: the gentiles may use Natural Laws to
describe these universal laws that are built into human nature, while
the believers may use Scriptural or religious terms to describe spiritual laws.

Again, just because our languages for the laws are diverse and RELATIVE,
where they are NOT required or a condition for any person to put one over the other
(in fact, our Constitution forbids Govt from doing this, from favoring or excluding
one religion over another), doesn't means they don't all "represent universal laws
that govern all humanity."  Those laws like you said "come from God" and
the religions are relative expressions used to try to capture convey and 
represent those laws so people can study, learn, resolve conflicts and agree on common terms.

Mickiel what I will say is mandatory is that if Christians have committed
to Christian practice laws and authority, then Christians are bound to correct
themselves and fellow Christians. So if you don't want to be responsible for
that, I suggest you neither judge or criticize Christians either, or else you
share responsibility for the process. Like if I  don't want to get involved in
proving or disproving global warming, I should not do research halfway
and start publishing opinions on that I might have to go correct later.

I would suggest leaving the rebuke of Christianity to Christians
who have committed to resolving all such conflicts. If you would
like to help with this, I suggest you fully research the difference
between effective/natural/voluntary Spiritual Healing that saves lives vs. false
faith healing that is dangerous and spreads misinformation that gets people killed.

Since you and I commit to God I think we can speak a common language
that way by using your terms to describe these same laws.

I have committed to learning and using the languages in Christianity
and also Constitutionalism to check both church and state from abuses.
Where I am not technical enough, at least I know to refer to other experts
who can go even further into the history and interpretations of church
and state laws to correct the record and resolve conflicts with others.
I can only go so far, and try to stick to layman's terms the average
person can get, so I learn the very minimum necessary to resolve
conflicts and teach these things uniformly and publicly.

Thanks for explaining where you are coming from Mickiel
As long as you can forgive and include ALL neighbors in the
spirit of truth justice and peace to unite all humanity as one
that is the spirit of Christianity.  When we call on Jesus it may
be by secular names of Justice or Conscience but it is still
the Universal Justice that unites humanity "by conscience"
that is the Meaning behind praying and agreeing "in Christ Jesus"

I feel that you have this spirit Mickiel but you
just don't relate it to the Christian Jesus because
you see most of Christianity as Antichrist and contradicting
the God that you know to be true. Again, all the true
Believers I know would AGREE with you, and the main
difference is the degree to which we FORGIVE Christians
for abuses of that faith, and we give equal weight to the good
that Christians and Christianity does bring to the world.


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

Christianity is just a religion that got lucky enough to be named after Christ; that's all it is. Jesus is not a Christian, God is not a Christian, nobody in the Old Testament was a Christian, and the Kingdom of God will have nothing to do with Christianity. Its just a religion that used to follow Christ, then got watered down with paganism, and then it grew large with the help of satan. Christianity is meaningless to God. It only means something to  Christians because they have been seduced into loving it.


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

No, I am not an Atheist; I am not supposed to be one. In my view, God himself gives life, it is he who constructs and controls the human population ,in the year 2016,  again in my view, God wanted a certain amount of Atheist and Theist to be alive. And so we are what we are; what we were supposed to be; destined to be.


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

In Psalms 136:16 it describes the Mercy of God as a thing that last forever. This is what religion is trying to tear down, religion does not want the Mercy of God to last forever, they WANT humans punished forever. They WANT God to hurt humans forever. And Christianity is leading this unholy invasion of the scripture.


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

Christianity is the racism in the spirit world. It is thought, if you believe in God, you must be Christian. Christianity feels that it holds a monopoly on the truth; it thinks it is the truth itself,. They are dominant; arrogant, confident and the worse thing- they think themselves  to be the very prodigy of God.


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

The world has nothing to fear from Atheist, but Christianity holds the power to pervert the biblical message of salvation; that makes it a very present danger to humanity because they will keep trying to limit salvation as much as they can. Again Jesus in Matt. 23:13, he was speaking to the believers in God of that time, "But woe unto you, Scribes and Pharisees, for you " Shut up the Kingdom of Heaven against men." They were teaching limited atonement, or eternal hell fire; they were teaching that many will not be in Gods kingdom.

And they are still teaching it, trying to shut the door of the Kingdom to unbelievers.


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

Here is a biblical look at Christianity, in Rev. 6:2,"  And I saw a White Horse, and he who sat on him had a bow, and a crown was given  to him and he went forth conquering and to conquer." This is biblical Christianity, the first seal opened and unleashed on unsuspecting humanity. A White Horse, so the world thinks its pure, a Bow- or a weapon, which I think is the bible being misused,  and he went forth conquering, converting people into deception.

The perfect curse. No one will ever suspect. And it will slay most of humanity.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 5, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is the racism in the spirit world. It is thought, if you believe in God, you must be Christian. Christianity feels that it holds a monopoly on the truth; it thinks it is the truth itself,. They are dominant; arrogant, confident and the worse thing- they think themselves  to be the very prodigy of God.



^ This description is not the lasting meaning of Christianity that I understand ^

I think you are describing the OLD testament ways of living and enforcing the LETTER of the law
and RETRIBUTIVE JUSTICE that focuses on judgment and punishment; I understand this to
be the EARLY phases of development like the parent spanking or grounding the child who'
is to understand the reasons behind the rules of the household for protection and survival.

What I look at is the FUTURE of humanity in the NEW Testament
about living by the SPIRIT of the laws and RESTORATIVE JUSTICE that brings lasting peace.

Clearly this is in contrast if not conflict with what you describe above.

Let us agree to use common terms.
What term do you use for FALSE religion that only focuses on judgment and punishment for POWER by FEAR
What term do you use for TRUE religion that teaches forgiveness and correction for TRUTH that sets us free

I told you I use retributive justice for the punitive type, and restorative justice for the healing approach to restoring relations and establishing lasting peace and harmony.

If you use Christianity to mean the false punitive destructive religious abuse
and I use it to mean the positive corrective and liberating spiritual process
then we will talk past each other, using the same word to mean opposing things!

How do you propose we fix this.
Should we drop the term altogether,
or attach a distinction such as
False Christianity and religious abuse
vs.
True Christianity and consistent practice

What is your term you use for the consistent practice of spiritual laws and teachings?
Thanks Mickiel


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## Mickiel (Jun 5, 2016)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is the racism in the spirit world. It is thought, if you believe in God, you must be Christian. Christianity feels that it holds a monopoly on the truth; it thinks it is the truth itself,. They are dominant; arrogant, confident and the worse thing- they think themselves  to be the very prodigy of God.
> ...




Well see that is the contradiction, the term " Christianity" has been used to describe things  spiritual and things considered " True Teaching"; I think that has been seriously misleading, Christianity should have never been the term to describe righteousness, because the term really describes a group of humans who believe in God. There is no term to describe righteousness, other than " Righteousness." When we try to use the term " Christianity" to be equated with describing righteousness, we have perverted the term already. If Christianity is now being used to " Describe things spiritual", then those things are corrupted already. If Christianity describes the Kingdom of God, then his Kingdom has been corrupted.

There should be no such thing as " True or False" Christianity, because we are then giving the term superiority it does not have; the term is only used in the bible twice, and not at all in some translations. It is too late to drop the term, is too transfixed into the human consciousness. That is HOW satan has deceived a " Whole world, Rev. 12:9", by entering into the entire human consciousness. Planting things that we humans are powerless to remove.  Christianity is now the standard , and I know that is by design; its what God wanted; but not for the purpose of righteousness, but the purpose of deception.

Christianity will be God's prime example to humanity , to show us just how deceived we can be without his guidance, and what happens when we guide ourselves. Christianity is satan, " Dressed to appear as god!" It is a religion that has the mind and ear of humanity, that " Looks like God is leading and inspiring." When the devil wants a false or misleading concept planted within humanity, he just gives it to the leadership of Christianity, and they take it to the world. This is the main method of deception used by satan for centuries; use the very churches of God to spread his lies into the masses; and no believer knows its being done, except those believers who have no clout anyway. In this manner, satan has rendered the truth into an unknown thing; and believers are calling lies, the truth. Its what we have inherited; Jer.16:19, " Surely our fathers have inherited lies and things of vanity."


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## emilynghiem (Jun 6, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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Ok Mickiel so you recommend to use Righteousness to mean what is right by God.
That reminds me of the Rastafarians that use that principle of Righteousness.
It also brings to mind the Righteous Gentiles. (also: the prayers of the Righteous,
Righteous indignance which is different from anger from unforgiveness;
and judging not but judging Righteous judgment.) Yes, that is all consistent with
following God's will and judgment for the sake of correction by God's laws.

May I ask which way you relate to the meaning of Jesus
1. as representing a teacher or role model to live the law by example
2. as representing God's Divine Law or Justice embodied in man so Jesus and God are one in spirit, one will indivisible and perfect

If you are more like #1 then you may be one of the Righteous Gentiles
who does not relate to Scriptural Authority as the Christians do,
but you are more under the Natural Laws of Truth and Justice
as the nontheists/atheists and secular humanists/gentiles.

So you may be one of the good apples comparing how the bad apples
are still not as dangerous as the bad oranges.


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## Mickiel (Jun 6, 2016)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
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I don't agree with either view.  Jesus was not a role model; of that day, but he was a teacher. And  Jesus not teach a bunch of laws, he tore down more laws that he taught. I myself am not one of the righteous ones, I am not a good apple; I am a sinner in search of his God, I have  not progressed beyond that.


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## hobelim (Jun 6, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I don't agree with either view. Jesus was not a role model; of that day, but he was a teacher. And Jesus not teach a bunch of laws, he tore down more laws that he taught. I myself am not one of the righteous ones, I am not a good apple; I am a sinner in search of his God, I have not progressed beyond that.




If you have not been a good apple and have not progressed beyond being a sinner, I suggest you make striving to become a better person your first priority before you continue to try and pass yourself off as a spokesman for a God who is righteous without having found him and without being righteous yourself..


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## Mickiel (Jun 6, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I don't agree with either view. Jesus was not a role model; of that day, but he was a teacher. And Jesus not teach a bunch of laws, he tore down more laws that he taught. I myself am not one of the righteous ones, I am not a good apple; I am a sinner in search of his God, I have not progressed beyond that.
> ...





hobelim said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I don't agree with either view. Jesus was not a role model; of that day, but he was a teacher. And Jesus not teach a bunch of laws, he tore down more laws that he taught. I myself am not one of the righteous ones, I am not a good apple; I am a sinner in search of his God, I have not progressed beyond that.
> ...




You have made an error  , I speak for no one but myself. I don't know God personally, and I am far from being righteous, I walk alone in my life and am part of no group. And I have nowhere in these archives tried to pass myself as being something I am not.


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## hobelim (Jun 6, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> hobelim said:
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Well you certainly seem to be trying to act like you know something about which you can not possibly know anything if what you have just admitted is true.

You say things like Jesus was not a role model but was a teacher even though Jesus himself said that he set an example to be followed. John 13:15. What kind of teacher does not practice what they preach?


Does being accurate or not matter at all you?

.


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## Mickiel (Jun 6, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Mickiel said:
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Jesus was not a role model, people hated him. In Johnn15:18 Again Jesus himself teaching, " If the world hates you,  know that it hated me before it hated you." Here Jesus taught that " The WORLD hated him"

Hey, they killed him. Even the believers in God of that time hated Jesus.


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## Mickiel (Jun 6, 2016)

Jesus should have been a role model during his time on earth, and he is more of one now, but they killed him when he came.

And they will try to kill him when he returns.

Strange, he died for the killers who murdered him. I think it would be quite something to know him.


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## Mickiel (Jun 7, 2016)

Interesting article;

Dangerous Christianity


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

There are Christians that treat their dog better than their neighbors. They think God should allow their dog in heaven, and think human sinners should go to their hell.

I think that's dangerous.


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## westwall (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.









Religion for the last 2,500 years is responsible for maybe 2,000,000 deaths.  This is a hugely optimistic number, the conservative estimates are closer to 800,000.  Atheistic collectivist governments have murdered well over 200,000,000 people in the last 120 years, so atheism has murdered more people, more rapidly than all of the religions the world has seen over the last 2,500 years.  So, this is about as epic a thread fail as you could make.


----------



## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

westwall said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Atheist, or any other form of human ways of life, have the ability to kill other humans; but only religions, with Christianity leading the pact,  can kill an unbelievers effort to understand how God really is.

I don't care how many human bodies you add up, when one human interferes with another humans view of God, that is the most awful thing to do on earth. There is no fear in who can kill the body, but when an organization can kill the human consciousness of wanting to know the truth about God, religion has slaughtered billions.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Atheists are dangerous in that they have no moral grounding. They are no different than savages in that they have the same moral code of a dog.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> 
> These are NOT Atheist doing this great deception, its believers in Christ, coming in HIS name; in other words, " Christians!" The largest group on earth that comes in Jesus name. And here Jesus is teaching that these are the kind of people who will reach many and deceive them.
> 
> ...


I agree but, atheists are dangerous and cannot be trusted in any way. Preachers, false prophets and "televangelists" are what we were warned about but make no mistake about it they are atheists also. Dangerous and in need of removal.


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> ...




Atheist have done absolutely nothing to harm the salvation of humanity, but religion has thrown FAR more confusion about our salvation into the human consciousness. Nothing is more important than our future with God; and religion IS the biggest roadblock to that than anything I have seen. Jesus said in John 6:39 that he would lose NOTHING God has given him, in John 17:2 God gives him ALL of humanity, and Jesus said he will not lose ANY of them.

Oh but religion is teaching that Christ will lose most of created humanity. That is insanity perverted nonsense of the future of humanity.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Atheists paved the way for the destruction of 50,000,000 unborn babies. They have done no harm? Hitler is a mere child compared to atheists.


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




The most savage I know of in life, is the Christian teaching of eternal hell punishing. A savage insane teaching, it completely insults the grace of God.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Thank God you figured it out! After 2,000 years you came along.


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Thank God you figured it out! After 2,000 years you came along.




Are you dense? Which is more savage, killing humans by the millions, or keeping them alive for all eternity in a punishing mode of existence?


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Killing humans by the millions. Plain and simple atheists are vermin and need to be treated as such.


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Killing humans by the millions. Plain and simple atheists are vermin and need to be treated as such.




I am curious, did Jesus come to save the righteous people like you, or did he teach that he came not for the righteous, but for vermin?


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

Luke 5:32, Jesus himself explaining WHY he came to earth, " I came NOT to call the righteous, but for SINNERS ( or vermin), to repentance, ( or to forgive and change their nature). This is why Christians are dangerous, they are teaching that sinners are vermin and Jesus wants nothing to do with them. When Jesus taught he CAME for them.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> chris.murray said:
> 
> 
> > Killing humans by the millions. Plain and simple atheists are vermin and need to be treated as such.
> ...


The vermin IF he could convert them but you, a product of what you are instructed to think, most likely will miss the boat.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Luke 5:32, Jesus himself explaining WHY he came to earth, " I came NOT to call the righteous, but for SINNERS ( or vermin), to repentance, ( or to forgive and change their nature). This is why Christians are dangerous, they are teaching that sinners are vermin and Jesus wants nothing to do with them. When Jesus taught he CAME for them.


Yeah, we just covered this.


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > chris.murray said:
> ...




I'll miss the Christian boat , because I want no part of their passage. The boat I will get on is the one that includes the vermin you dislike so much. Because I know the vermin NEED God more than you self righteous people who seek to limit the great salvation of God.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> chris.murray said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Keep demanding babies blood for your sacrafices at the altar of atheism.


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## Meriweather (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Oh but religion is teaching that Christ will lose most of created humanity. That is insanity perverted nonsense of the future of humanity.



Not all Christian sects teach this.  Catholic sects certainly do not.  The Catholic Church teaches the path of salvation the same way Christ taught it two thousand years ago.  Anyone the Church cannot reach it entrusts to the mercy and love of God.  Catholic teaching is that no human knows who, if anyone, is in hell.  It notes, particularly, the eternal Covenant God has with the Jews.  

In Romans, Paul notes that God's laws and ways are written on each individual's heart.  Those who have no belief will be judged by their own hearts--and our own judgement is often harsher than that of a merciful and loving God.  

In short, forget what you have heard about only a few will be saved.  Twelve signifies completion.  Twelve Tribes times Twelve (the complete Tribe) times a thousand (countless).  Some who do not understand the symbolism mark that number as 144,000 individuals, and they could not be more wrong.  Through this symbolism Revelation assures us the number saved is great--countless--and it includes all who love God.  

Those who have no wish to know God or to be near him will not be forced to endure him.  To most of us, _that_ is the "hellish" existence--but it is one we choose, not one we are assigned.  So, (as Christ said) "Peace be with you." All is well.


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## Meriweather (Jun 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I'll miss the Christian boat , because I want no part of their passage. The boat I will get on is the one that includes the vermin you dislike so much. Because I know the vermin NEED God more than you self righteous people who seek to limit the great salvation of God.



Catholics make up the greatest majority of Christians--and we do NOT limit the great salvation of God.  Take heart.


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I'll miss the Christian boat , because I want no part of their passage. The boat I will get on is the one that includes the vermin you dislike so much. Because I know the vermin NEED God more than you self righteous people who seek to limit the great salvation of God.
> ...




Salvation is a done free deal.

But God hides himself from humanity; that is not our fault.

And he knows that.

He knows how ignorant we are.

I think that is in our favor. I think that is WHY we are so safe with him; he knows this is not in our hands. We are really in his hands; and I trust that, because of how HE is. He has got to be quite something and a being of undescribable compassion and wisdom.


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## IsaacNewton (Jun 11, 2016)

The worst thing religion does is it gives the believer an iron-clad get out of jail free card on how they treat, or even kill, other human beings. The human mind has infinite capacity to justify what it does. Religion provides this natural tendency not only permission to do whatever it wants but overwhelming 'who are you to question god's authority' to carry out the most heinous acts. And once a religion takes over the powers of and subsumes the powers of government then it's a free-for-all. The weaker minds are the ones that are drawn to religion in the first place, a need for comfort in a world where there is little, and once these minds gain power over other human beings it is like putting a 9 year old in charge of the water-boarding and execution squad, without any rules. 

People who don't believe in a supernatural being can also act in such a way if they weren't brought up with a social scaffolding in their minds that says other people should be treated as they would like to be treated. 

Religion codifies this thought/feeling into an absolute good. THAT is why it is so dangerous. The person doing it actually believes they are doing good.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

IsaacNewton said:


> The worst thing religion does is it gives the believer an iron-clad get out of jail free card on how they treat, or even kill, other human beings. The human mind has infinite capacity to justify what it does. Religion provides this natural tendency not only permission to do whatever it wants but overwhelming 'who are you to question god's authority' to carry out the most heinous acts. And once a religion takes over the powers of and subsumes the powers of government then it's a free-for-all. The weaker minds are the ones that are drawn to religion in the first place, a need for comfort in a world where there is little, and once these minds gain power over other human beings it is like putting a 9 year old in charge of the water-boarding and execution squad, without any rules.
> 
> People who don't believe in a supernatural being can also act in such a way if they weren't brought up with a social scaffolding in their minds that says other people should be treated as they would like to be treated.
> 
> Religion codifies this thought/feeling into an absolute good. THAT is why it is so dangerous. The person doing it actually believes they are doing good.


You really are insecure aren't you? Bad childhood I assume? Someone touched you in bad places did they?


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## IsaacNewton (Jun 11, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> IsaacNewton said:
> 
> 
> > The worst thing religion does is it gives the believer an iron-clad get out of jail free card on how they treat, or even kill, other human beings. The human mind has infinite capacity to justify what it does. Religion provides this natural tendency not only permission to do whatever it wants but overwhelming 'who are you to question god's authority' to carry out the most heinous acts. And once a religion takes over the powers of and subsumes the powers of government then it's a free-for-all. The weaker minds are the ones that are drawn to religion in the first place, a need for comfort in a world where there is little, and once these minds gain power over other human beings it is like putting a 9 year old in charge of the water-boarding and execution squad, without any rules.
> ...



You're are weirdo. 

Why weirdos like you always think of some bizarre sexual crap is a mystery but you are who you are.


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## chris.murray (Jun 11, 2016)

IsaacNewton said:


> chris.murray said:
> 
> 
> > IsaacNewton said:
> ...


hahahahhahahhahahahahaahaha


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## Mickiel (Jun 11, 2016)

IsaacNewton said:


> The worst thing religion does is it gives the believer an iron-clad get out of jail free card on how they treat, or even kill, other human beings. The human mind has infinite capacity to justify what it does. Religion provides this natural tendency not only permission to do whatever it wants but overwhelming 'who are you to question god's authority' to carry out the most heinous acts. And once a religion takes over the powers of and subsumes the powers of government then it's a free-for-all. The weaker minds are the ones that are drawn to religion in the first place, a need for comfort in a world where there is little, and once these minds gain power over other human beings it is like putting a 9 year old in charge of the water-boarding and execution squad, without any rules.
> 
> People who don't believe in a supernatural being can also act in such a way if they weren't brought up with a social scaffolding in their minds that says other people should be treated as they would like to be treated.
> 
> Religion codifies this thought/feeling into an absolute good. THAT is why it is so dangerous. The person doing it actually believes they are doing good.




Yes, I agree. Religion thinks its good, and all else is evil. The perfect mind for a devil to seduce. The so called saviors of the world, blinded by the fact that the savior has saved a world;

without their help.


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## Mickiel (Jun 12, 2016)

Another thing that makes Christianity dangerous,  is that they are killing the truth, but they don't know they are doing it.

That's like having a person who is killing you, but they are not aware that they are. Just a very present danger.


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## chris.murray (Jun 12, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Another thing that makes Christianity dangerous,  is that they are killing the truth, but they don't know they are doing it.
> 
> That's like having a person who is killing you, but they are not aware that they are. Just a very present danger.


Says Satan?


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## chris.murray (Jun 12, 2016)

Atheists are unwitting satanists. They are trapped by their own arrogance.


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## Mickiel (Jun 12, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Atheists are unwitting satanists. They are trapped by their own arrogance.




I disagree, Satanist is a religion, Atheist are not religious. If they don't believe in God, why would they believe in the enemy of God? I think Christians are far more arrogant than Atheist. No atheist here or anywhere I debate has implied that I am a devil, but hundreds of Christians have, including you.

I think satan has deceived millions more of Christians, than he has Atheist. I really do not think satan is even interested in Atheist, he is far more interested in deceiving and confusing believers in God.

satan has far more Theist under his power than he does Atheist; Atheist are meaningless to the devil.


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## Mickiel (Jun 12, 2016)

In Rev.2:16, Jesus said, of HIS church, that they held to the doctrines of the " Nicolaitians", which he said he " Hated!"

This means that there were Christians who had one foot in the church of God, and the other into paganism. It was they who brought in the pagan doctrines that still exist in the church today. Christmas and Easter ceremonies, using graven images like crosses, wedding and funeral ceremonies, it would just shock you the present day practices from paganism that Christianity still holds onto.


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## LittleNipper (Jun 12, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> IsaacNewton said:
> 
> 
> > The worst thing religion does is it gives the believer an iron-clad get out of jail free card on how they treat, or even kill, other human beings. The human mind has infinite capacity to justify what it does. Religion provides this natural tendency not only permission to do whatever it wants but overwhelming 'who are you to question god's authority' to carry out the most heinous acts. And once a religion takes over the powers of and subsumes the powers of government then it's a free-for-all. The weaker minds are the ones that are drawn to religion in the first place, a need for comfort in a world where there is little, and once these minds gain power over other human beings it is like putting a 9 year old in charge of the water-boarding and execution squad, without any rules.
> ...


I don't know about other "religions." I can tell you that as a Christian, I know that I am far from good. God is good. Anyone who thinks he is "good" is in essence calling himself GOD. And frankly, there are many people who don't go to church or read the Bible who say, "But I'm a "good" person. I don't hurt anyone."


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## Hawkins (Jun 17, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> chris.murray said:
> 
> 
> > Atheists are unwitting satanists. They are trapped by their own arrogance.
> ...



In the contrary, in all and every Christian forums it is the atheists only capable of casting doubt on humans to lead them away from God.

So under the invisible influence of Satan, atheists apply their knowledge of good and evil to influence other humans to ignore what God says (in Word of God), leading to their very death in the end.

Looks familiar? The same day you choose to eat of it (under the influence of Satan), the same day you shall surely die.

All left is, in order to keep your soul, on the judgment day Satan will accuse you of murdering souls in public forums by leading human souls away from God. Will you accept his accusation quietly at that moment?


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## Mickiel (Jun 18, 2016)

Hawkins said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > chris.murray said:
> ...




I personally see it like Christ taught in Matt. 24: 5," For MANY shall come in my name and deceive MANY!" Believers are far more misleading than unbelievers are. Many are being mislead by people who believe in Christ and teach in his name. Atheist have a simple message of unbelief ,  its far more dangerous to be mislead by a  believer who is not teaching a proper truth.


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## Mickiel (Jun 19, 2016)

chris.murray said:


> Atheists are unwitting satanists. They are trapped by their own arrogance.




I am curious, why   would satan be interested in an unbeliever,when he can get far more deceptive widespread results from deceiving  believers?


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## koshergrl (Jun 19, 2016)

This is a joke thread, right? Because nobody in their right mind would claim that atheists are less 'dangerous' than anyone, given their kill record. 

I hate it when people use words disingenuously.


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## koshergrl (Jun 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Hawkins said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


What does that have to do with the relative danger of atheism?

The danger of atheism is that when humans convince themselves there is no power above them, they unlock the gates of hell on each other. Human rights don't exist to atheists because they do not accept that humans are granted innate rights by a higher power.


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## Mickiel (Jun 19, 2016)

koshergrl said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Hawkins said:
> ...




The danger of Christianity is their distorted view of what the biblical hell  really is ;  and their selfish view of salvation. Jesus came to earth to gather those who do not believe in him.  For sinners , or unbelievers ; those humans that Christians are counting out.


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## koshergrl (Jun 19, 2016)

The danger of Christrianity to atheists is that we will stop you from killing people because we believe humans are worthy of protection from those who would exploit and kill them. So I guess we are dangerous..if that's what you want to do. Which it always is.


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## Mickiel (Jun 19, 2016)

koshergrl said:


> The danger of Christrianity to atheists is that we will stop you from killing people because we believe humans are worthy of protection from those who would exploit and kill them. So I guess we are dangerous..if that's what you want to do. Which it always is.



In my view, and I am not Christian or Atheist, it is simply awful to assume that Atheist want to kill people; simply untrue. Now history has shown that both Atheist and Theist have done their share of killing; one interesting historical killing was that of Jesus being crucified. It was not Atheist, or unbelievers in God who conspired to kill him; no,  the dangerous people then were the believers in God , the Pharisees and Scribes. In my view, the modernday Pharisees, or Christianity, are still the most dangerous.

They are killing Jesus without even being aware that they are doing that.


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## Agit8r (Jun 19, 2016)

As Francis bacon put it: "IT WERE better to have no opinion of God at all, than such an opinion, as is unworthy of him."


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## Mickiel (Jun 19, 2016)

Agit8r said:


> As Francis bacon put it: "IT WERE better to have no opinion of God at all, than such an opinion, as is unworthy of him."




Oh I like that !


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## Mickiel (Jun 20, 2016)

You know what I think about how God really feels about religion , Atheism, human beliefs and our thinking? How he really feels about Christianity and Islam? Our nations and human governments?

Our opinions?

Isaiah 40:17," All nations before him are as nothing;  they are counted to him as "Less than nothing" and meaningless!"

This is how I think, again in my personal view, God thinks about religion and Atheism both. I don't think he cares for either one ;I think he cares for humans , but not our  beliefs and unbeliefs and our views on life. I totally disagree with the Theist thinking that God is giving humans a choice in their destiny, like its in our control; our hands. Like God is  "Asking" for our permission, that we must " Accept him" , or he will reject us.

No. I think God is a being that gets his way reguardless of what we do or say.  I think human destiny is totally based on him,not us; not our will, but his will.


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## Hawkins (Jun 21, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I personally see it like Christ taught in Matt. 24: 5," For MANY shall come in my name and deceive MANY!" Believers are far more misleading than unbelievers are. Many are being mislead by people who believe in Christ and teach in his name. Atheist have a simple message of unbelief ,  its far more dangerous to be mislead by a  believer who is not teaching a proper truth.



No. It is said the many are deceived, including those classified as God's Elect. It is also said in revelation that "they will come out like sands to deceive the world".

*Revelation 20:7-9 (NIV) *
When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison 
and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth--Gog and Magog--to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them.


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## AVG-JOE (Jun 21, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God.





True.  

It seems like God would have shown a little favoritism and picked one by now, eh?



`​


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## AVG-JOE (Jun 21, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.
> ...



This is why the good, the bad, the ugly and the followers of (insert your preferred Deity here) won't find peace until all agree to define righteous at home and learn to tolerate the unrighteous behavior of their neighbors, as long as everyone adheres to a democratically agreed upon code of civil conduct.

Killing each other over which ancient, unprovable stories are the truth may not be the only stupidity visible from space on this planet but it's been the bloodiest.


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## Mickiel (Jun 21, 2016)

AVG-JOE said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God.
> ...



Thats  why Christianity is so  dangerous , they got the world thinking they are chosen by God to be his anointed ;when they are not. God has not yet chosen his end time church.


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## AVG-JOE (Jun 21, 2016)

I am intrigued.  

What God do you claim to speak for?


----------



## sealybobo (Jun 21, 2016)

IndependantAce said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...


Is that why you pretend to believe? Because you think this God is the only thing stopping people from being bad? People need a God watching them? He knows who's naughty and who's nice?

Is God the only thing stopping you from being a murderer or rapist? Tell us more


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## sealybobo (Jun 21, 2016)

AVG-JOE said:


> I am intrigued.
> 
> What God do you claim to speak for?


The one who spoke to Joseph Smith. See Jesus happened 2000 years ago but the Catholic, Baptist, Protestants Presbyterian Lutheran churches lost their authority. They essentially all got corrupted. So God visited Joseph Smith in 1800 and started the one true church of Mormons. The chain from Joseph Smith to their current leader hasn't been broken. They have gods authority not traditional Christians. Those churches are all corrupt. Their stories are lies. Corruption


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## Mickiel (Jun 22, 2016)

AVG-JOE said:


> I am intrigued.
> 
> What God do you claim to speak for?





AVG-JOE said:


> I am intrigued.
> 
> What God do you claim to speak for?




I have made  no claims of speaking for anyone other than myself. I speak for myself.


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## Mickiel (Jun 22, 2016)

sealybobo said:


> IndependantAce said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




Yes, speaking for myself ,God is the only thing that has stopped me from killing some jokers I have wanted to kill.


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## AVG-JOE (Jun 22, 2016)

If you're not speaking for God, how do you know that He has not chosen his church?   (post #103)


Moot point based on semantics - If you're not speaking *for* a particular god, you seem to speaking *about* a particular god...   

Name Him.

Please.


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## Mickiel (Jun 22, 2016)

AVG-JOE said:


> If you're not speaking for God, how do you know that He has not chosen his church?   (post #103)
> 
> 
> Moot point based on semantics - If you're not speaking *for* a particular god, you seem to speaking *about* a particular god...
> ...



The God of the bible.


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## Carla_Danger (Jun 22, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> AVG-JOE said:
> 
> 
> > If you're not speaking for God, how do you know that He has not chosen his church?   (post #103)
> ...





Which Bible?


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## AVG-JOE (Jun 22, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> AVG-JOE said:
> 
> 
> > If you're not speaking for God, how do you know that He has not chosen his church?   (post #103)
> ...



The God of Abraham, as described in The Torah, The New Testament and The Qur'an...

I can work with that. 

Thank you.

Step one in any worthwhile discussion of religion on earth is to name the God(s) being discussed.


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## Mickiel (Jun 22, 2016)

Carla_Danger said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > AVG-JOE said:
> ...




You can choose any of these 42 bibles ; any one of them. Or the "Moffat " translation , I like that one too.
How many times is hell mentioned in the Bible?


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## Mickiel (Jun 22, 2016)

AVG-JOE said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > AVG-JOE said:
> ...




Your welcome.


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## Mickiel (Jun 23, 2016)

The concept of saying you are something that you are not , is popular in religion. Notice Rev. 3: 9  "  Behold I will make them of the synagogue of satan , which say they are Jews and are not." People claim they have God's  spirit and they do not.


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## Mickiel (Jun 24, 2016)

Christianity is a world power and a large church; do you think that is the church that satan persues in Revelations? Do you think this fits scripture or God? Why would God have a large world wide church? Why would God have a church so big, that has so many off shoots and divisions?

Why do you think God would do that?


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## Mickiel (Jun 25, 2016)

If  the  Kingdom  of  God  is to be a  Christian Kingdom  , then its corrupt  already.


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## Mickiel (Jun 26, 2016)

Christianity has swelled the cranium of the human society consciousness ,  its influence has covered history and this world with their education.  The church history has influenced religion itself , through basically four stages of theological education. They are ; episcopal , monastic , scholastic  and seminarian.  This system has blanketed humanity . But their theology in the patristic age , or the third to fifth centuries ,  got into their frontal lobe ;  and pagan philosophy severely diluted the Christian faith. And Christian education has never recovered from this unique invasion.

They , in turn , have invaded the consciousness of humanity with the effect of the seduction of the Christian mind.


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## Mickiel (Jun 27, 2016)

Christianity more dangerous than Atheism, because they are using their position to pimp the doctrine of hell.


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## Mickiel (Jun 30, 2016)

Christianity has inherited traditional lies ; Jer. 16:19," Surely our fathers have inherited lies , vanity , and things of no profit." And they are spreading those lies like wild fire!


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## Mickiel (Jul 11, 2016)

Atheist don't lie and claim to speak for God, only Christians do that.


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## LittleNipper (Jul 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Atheist don't lie and claim to speak for God, only Christians do that.



Christians will tell you what the Bible has to say on a subject. Atheists claim to speak on behalf of the people. Examples include The USSR, the People's Republic of China, and North Korea. "Big Brother is Watching," is not a Christian term.


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## Mickiel (Jul 11, 2016)

Christians distort what the bible has to say , Atheist don't bother with the bible.


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## Mickiel (Jul 14, 2016)

What's the best way to confuse a world? Fill it with Christianity.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Atheist are in no manner  as dangerous as Christians are ;  Christians can twist  and pervert  the message of God ; Atheist don't do that.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Pagan symbols adopted by Christianity;

Pagan symbols adopted by Christianity


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## the_human_being (Jul 19, 2016)

I want to say something about the spirituality debate. You don't believe in God? Fine. Why is it so important for many of you to mock those of us that do? If we're wrong, what have we lost when we die? Nothing! How does our believing in Jesus bring you any harm? You think it makes me stupid? Gullible? Fine. How does that affect you? If you're wrong your consequence is far worse. I would rather live my life believing in God and serving Him, and find out I was right, than not believe in Him and not serve Him, and find out I was wrong. Then it's too late.
Ain't no shame in my game! I believe in Jesus Christ. He said deny me in front of your friends & I will deny you in front of my Father.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

the_human_being said:


> I want to say something about the spirituality debate. You don't believe in God? Fine. Why is it so important for many of you to mock those of us that do? If we're wrong, what have we lost when we die? Nothing! How does our believing in Jesus bring you any harm? You think it makes me stupid? Gullible? Fine. How does that affect you? If you're wrong your consequence is far worse. I would rather live my life believing in God and serving Him, and find out I was right, than not believe in Him and not serve Him, and find out I was wrong. Then it's too late.
> Ain't no shame in my game! I believe in Jesus Christ. He said deny me in front of your friends & I will deny you in front of my Father.




Oh I believe in God and Christ with all my heart, I just don't believe in Christianity. I don't let believers like you taint my view of the bible , God and Christ. Because your professional at perverting those things.


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## the_human_being (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> the_human_being said:
> 
> 
> > I want to say something about the spirituality debate. You don't believe in God? Fine. Why is it so important for many of you to mock those of us that do? If we're wrong, what have we lost when we die? Nothing! How does our believing in Jesus bring you any harm? You think it makes me stupid? Gullible? Fine. How does that affect you? If you're wrong your consequence is far worse. I would rather live my life believing in God and serving Him, and find out I was right, than not believe in Him and not serve Him, and find out I was wrong. Then it's too late.
> ...



No. I am a professional electrical engineer. I am not a member of any clergy and I don't let it worry me what you believe or do not believe.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Ignorance is the mother of persecution.
- William Gurnall


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

the_human_being said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > the_human_being said:
> ...




Well  we have that in common  , I don't let what you believe bother me  .


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Consider this, Mickiel.  You believe in the here and now but all of creation tells us something to the contrary.  How can you explain this?  Even all creation in the earth proves there is life after death!

Read this by Dumitru Duduman:

In the entire world we cannot find any proof that anything, no matter how small, just ceases to exist. There is no past that did not prepare the future, and there is no end that did not show a beginning. Every life in particular only leaves behind its aged shell when it goes into the ground, the essence having gone to unseen realms. The sun sets that it may rise once again. The stars disappear in the morning, and reappear in the night. Ages end, and then they begin again. Rivers bury themselves in seas only to be reborn in the springtime. The entire plant world dies in the fall and is reborn in the springtime. The seed dies in the ground and is reborn as grass or as a tree.
The caterpillar dies to make way for the butterfly. If all the inferior creatures are destroyed so they can be reborn, then what of man, the crown jewel of God's creation? Will he simply fall into the grave and turn to dust for no reason at all?

There is so much that speaks to us in parables about life after death: Proof can even be seen in the way God describes the soul. Without a doubt God exists because He makes Himself known to man not only in our souls, but also in nature that is all about us. He is righteous and just. He sowed into the heart of man a desire to do right and to hate evil. There are many who live a righteous life and are persecuted for it, even unto death. Yet, there are many sinners who live happy lives. If there were no life after death in which the righteous are rewarded for their faithfulness, then God would be neither righteous nor just.

For the simple fact that God is a righteous judge, there must be a day when every man, woman, and child will receive a just reward.

Life in Christ
pg. 106-107
Author Dumitru Duduman


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

*You are the vessel in this story and The Word of Almighty God - the Rock of Ages - the Ancient of Days - is like this Light House.  He can be your light, your salvation & your guide or you can destroy yourself by not changing the course you are presently on.  Your choice.  I hope that you will make the wise decision and change the course you're on. *


A battle ship was on exercise at sea in bad weather. The captain was on the bridge. It was foggy. Just after dark the look out spotted a light on the starboard side. The captain asked if it was steady or moving. The look out replied the light was steady meaning they were on direct collision course with that ship! The captain ordered the lookout signal to the other ship:

_“Change course 20 degrees. We are on collision course.”_

The signal came back_ ‘”Advisable for you to change course.”_

The captain signalled_ ‘”I am a captain. Change course 20 degrees.”_

_“I am a seaman second class. You had better change course 20 degrees” _came the reply.

The captain was furious. He sent back _‘”I am a battleship. Change course!”_

Back came the signal, _“I am a lighthouse. Your call._

PONDER AND CONSIDER

THE LIGHTHOUSE AND THE SHIP


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Christian theology is meaningless to me , the salvation of the world of sinners is in Christ hands , not you Christians. You can condemn me all you wish ;  such is your nature.


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## westwall (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Atheist don't lie and claim to speak for God, only Christians do that.







No, they lie, cheat, and steal for themselves.  No difference.  Face it dude, atheism is a religion too.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christian theology is meaningless to me , the salvation of the world of sinners is in Christ hands , not you Christians. You can condemn me all you wish ;  such is your nature.


I believe I already made it clear to you (on your other thread) that I am not condemning you, Mickiel. In fact, if you will have a look at your thread title it does appear that you are condemning Christians - even accusing our faith of being "dangerous."  

I find that interesting considering that the religions of Islam, Satanism, Atheism, Wicca, Communism, Catholicism...... have been *proven* to be dangerous (look at their history - not good!) while you are making statements about my faith which follows the teachings of Jesus Christ - not to be violent or cause harm to others. 

I find that it is has been the nature of atheists to target Christianity because you know that we are not going to retaliate as Islam, Satanism, Communism & so forth would.  What does that say about atheism except that there is an element of fear and torment in it?   There is no torment or fear in following Jesus Christ.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

westwall said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Atheist don't lie and claim to speak for God, only Christians do that.
> ...




Are you suggesting that no Christian lies , cheats , or steals? I think its you who needs to face some things.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christian theology is meaningless to me , the salvation of the world of sinners is in Christ hands , not you Christians. You can condemn me all you wish ;  such is your nature.
> ...




Atheist never killed Christians for not being Atheist;  but during the Christian inquisition  ,  you Christians killed thousands of people for not being Christian.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



He didn't say that.  Of course there are Christians who profess Christ but refuse to obey Him.  Some of them lie, cheat and steal.  They will not be able to enter the kingdom of heaven if they do not stop sinning.  Without holiness no one will see the LORD.  They will be judged along with the world - there are no exemptions for born again Christians.  If they do not live holy unto the Lord and stay out of sin they will find themselves in hell one day.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


You are speaking of the Roman Catholic Institution and Vatican and you have spoken rightly about them, Mickiel, but they are not Christians and do not believe in the authority of the KJV Holy Bible. Also they didn't kill thousands.  They murdered almost 68 million people in just one inquisition.  They are probably responsible for over 200 million murders and counting...  The followers of Catholicism consider the Pope's authority to be higher than God's and listen to him and the priests rather than God's Word which tells them to depart and get out of there.  Catholics need to be born again - they (most of them) do not have any idea what their leadership is doing behind closed doors.  They do not realize (many of them) that their religions' roots are out of the Babylonian Occult.  The religion of Catholicism is Baal worship, Mickiel.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...




I totally disagree with you and your claim that only holy people will see God;  in Luke 3:6, " And ALL flesh shall see the salvation of God." And even see Jesus, EVERY eye shall see him.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...




I totally disagree , they are Christians , and they were the Christians in Rome who began the evolution of Christianity. The first Christians evolved into the Roman Catholic church.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Heaven isn't opening its gates for the unholy.  I do not know what book you are reading but it isn't the KJV Bible, Mickiel.  

You need to read the verses before Luke 3:6 to understand that verse.  Here Look:
*Luke 3:3-6 King James Version (KJV)*
3 And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;

4 As it is written in the book of the words of Esaias the prophet, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

5 Every valley shall be filled, and every mountain and hill shall be brought low; and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough ways shall be made smooth;

6 And all flesh shall see the salvation of God.

*King James Version (KJV)*
Public Domain

All flesh shall _see_ it but not all flesh shall _receive _ it.  Have you repented of your sins and turned away from your sins? Have you received Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior and are you living an obedient life unto Christ now?


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Wrong.  Constantine was a sun god worshipper unto the day he died.  Roman Catholicism was based off of the worship of baal god Tammuz and his mother Semiramis ( a witch ) Nimrod was into the occult - Semiramis set up confessionals to spy on her own people after her husand - Nimrod was killed by his uncle for performing human sacrifice on infants........RCC followed their pattern down to many details including the mass which is like the black mass Satanists engage in. Roman Catholics are not Christians.  Look up my threads on it and you'll learn what you need to know.

note - One of Semiramis's names is "Queen of heaven." Catholics who pray to "Mary" are in reality praying to a witch - Semiramis.  Amazing, isn't it?  Satan really has so many people deceived.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...




They are Christians , where do you think your Christianity and its paganism came from? You can't deny your historical parent. Christianity morphed into Roman Catholcism , then   Roman Catholicism morphed into Christianity once again. The Christian pagan holidays of Christmas and Easter came from Roman Catholocism.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

lol.  My historical parent?  Who ever taught you such a thing? Paul was not a Catholic. Neither was Peter.  Peter never preached in Rome.  Paul preached to the Romans.  Not Peter. In fact, not one single apostle of Jesus Christ was ever a Catholic!   Peter was called to preach to the Jews.  Your religion has no biblical foundation, Mickiel.  None. Believe on Jesus Christ and you'll see the difference between dead religion and a relationship with Jesus Christ. You've been called to have a relationship with God through His Only begotten Son Jesus Christ.  Not through a statue or a demon goddess!  Through Jesus Christ who died for you upon a cross at Calvary.  There is no salvation in Catholicism, Mickiel.  If you stay in it, you'll be destroyed.  The Lord does not want you to destroy your own soul!  He wants to set you free from dead rituals and doctrines of devils!


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> lol.  My historical parent?  Who ever taught you such a thing? Paul was not a Catholic. Neither was Peter.  Peter never preached in Rome.  Paul preached to the Romans.  Not Peter. In fact, not one single apostle of Jesus Christ was ever a Catholic!   Peter was called to preach to the Jews.  Your religion has no biblical foundation, Mickiel.  None. Believe on Jesus Christ and you'll see the difference between dead religion and a relationship with Jesus Christ. You've been called to have a relationship with God through His Only begotten Son Jesus Christ.  Not through a statue or a demon goddess!  Through Jesus Christ who died for you upon a cross at Calvary.



No , Paul and Peter were not Catholic , but their church evolved into Catholocism.
You have made a serious error in judgment , I have no religion , I am not a part of any group.

You deny your true historical origins in your religion , this is one of the things which make Christians so dangerous , they are blind to so much truth;

Christianity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel, this man is a former Roman Catholic who explains how Satan has deceived the precious Roman Catholic people.  Watch this:


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > lol.  My historical parent?  Who ever taught you such a thing? Paul was not a Catholic. Neither was Peter.  Peter never preached in Rome.  Paul preached to the Romans.  Not Peter. In fact, not one single apostle of Jesus Christ was ever a Catholic!   Peter was called to preach to the Jews.  Your religion has no biblical foundation, Mickiel.  None. Believe on Jesus Christ and you'll see the difference between dead religion and a relationship with Jesus Christ. You've been called to have a relationship with God through His Only begotten Son Jesus Christ.  Not through a statue or a demon goddess!  Through Jesus Christ who died for you upon a cross at Calvary.
> ...


Skip Wikipedia - they are a corrupted source when it comes to facts on RCC.  You'll have to do your own research.  I can give you some excellent material. Dr. Alberto Rivera ex-Jesuit who exposed what is really going on inside is a must read.  There are also videos.  I have a link on it - hang on.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel, this man is a former Roman Catholic who explains how Satan has deceived the precious Roman Catholic people.  Watch this:




In Rev. 12:9 satan has deceived the WHOLE WORLD! And any religious group that tries to exclude themselves from that deception , must remove that verse from the bible.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Okay begin with the King James story as that will fill you in on how desperately the RCC wanted to stop the King James Bible from going forward.  The RCC bible is based on the corrupted Alexandrian text.  If you've got one toss it.  Better yet burn it.  You don't want anyone else reading that trash.

Here you go, this will also give you some serious background on the RCC that you wouldn't see elsewhere.

King James

Testimony of Alberto Rivera - Ex-Jesuit
Begin with Alberto Rivera.  Do you have a King James Version bible?  I have posted some of the Books of the KJV Bible on here.  Hold on, I'll go get you the Book of John.

The Gospel According to John

This ought to get you started.  Save it to your favorites and read at your leisure, Mickiel.  You'll be very surprised at what you learn about the RCC!  Things are not as they appear to be! Not at all!


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...




I have links of my own;

Christianity, A History of the Catholic Church


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## HUGGY (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



What is tricky is that since it, religion, is all made up even the belief in satan varies completely from one christian to the next.  So what drives the wacky ones, called satan, could be ANYTHING they can dream up. 

What religists can't fathom is the peace of mind atheism is.  Without the made up foundation lies become obvious.  Without fantasy gods to please and equally fantastic devils to drive one to madness life can be so clear and simple. 

I'm a happy atheist.  Few things anger me.... mostly just willful ignorance.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

HUGGY said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Well you should be happy ;  Atheist are Atheist because they are supposed to be Atheist. Theist are Theist because they are supposed  to be  Theist. We are supposed to be what  we are .


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

The world.  Not the elect of God, Mickiel.

It is written:
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Matt: 24:24

IF it were possible.  For those who abide in Christ and his words abiding in Him, it isn't possible.  My trust is in God alone, Mickiel.  Not my own intellect. God's ways are higher than our ways. Trust in God.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> The world.  Not the elect of God, Mickiel.
> 
> It is written:
> For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
> Matt: 24:24




In Rev. 2:4, 2:15 , 2:20, 3:14-20 Jesus gives us an insight as to how HIS churches have been deceived ; his elect , HIS flock. HIS church was even doing things he HATED!

Hello!


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Not true.  His problem is written in 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11

And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2 Thessalonians 2:10-11


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > The world.  Not the elect of God, Mickiel.
> ...


You are misinterpreting scripture, Mickiel.  Note that in each of the 7 churches Jesus gave them a commendation for something (even some small thing) and then told them what they needed to correct.  Let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.  Okay?


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
> ...




Baloney , you Christians may be willing that people perish , but God is not willing that ANY perish , but that ALL repent.


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## HUGGY (Jul 19, 2016)

t


Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
> ...



You people crack me up!    You have a bible quote for every occasion don't you.  That's probably where "Hallmark" got his idea for greeting cards.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > The world.  Not the elect of God, Mickiel.
> ...


Hello.  The Nicolatians which taught that which he hated was not acknowledged as one of his churches.  Note that the deeds of the Nico (Controllers) laity (lay people) are the deeds of the Roman Catholic Cult.


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## HUGGY (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


 
I refuse to submit to your silly nonsense.  I really do have better things to do with what time I have.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...




Baloney , you said the elect cannot be deceived, Jesus revealed they can. In Jer. 23:11 God himself said both prophets and priest in HIS HOUSE can be wicked.

Hello!


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



If you are so concerned with people perishing what are you in fear of them perishing into?  You say you do not believe in hell.  What does perish mean but for a soul to perish in hell?  You see, you are holding the truth in unrighteousness.  That is your problem, Mickiel.  You know the Word of God but deny the power of God.  This is a serious situation that you must go before the Lord about.  God has always had a remnant and He has got one even now. You're using scripture and then twisting it into a lie.  The problem is your heart. Something isn't right.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

HUGGY said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...




See you at the top.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

HUGGY said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...



With what time you have?  Are you not well?


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

I'll leave you now with the links I've provided, Mickiel. I believe I have given you enough material to look at for now.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Jeremiah said:
> ...




As long as I do not have to go before Christians , I'll be fine. I'll take my grace with God.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


It's all a lie.  Look at the ex-Jesuit Alberto Rivera link and you'll find that out.


----------



## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> I'll leave you now with the links I've provided, Mickiel. I believe I have given you enough material to look at for now.




I am not going to look at any of it ; Christian material is useless for me.


----------



## HUGGY (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



No, I'm fine.  But I am 67.  People in my family usually die of natural causes just under 90.


----------



## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

Well you should be happy ;  Atheist are Atheist because they are supposed to be Atheist. Theist are Theist because they are supposed  to be  Theist. We are supposed to be what  we are .[/QUOTE]
Not true.  His problem is written in 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11

And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2 Thessalonians 2:10-11[/QUOTE]


Baloney , you Christians may be willing that people perish , but God is not willing that ANY perish , but that ALL repent.[/QUOTE]

If you are so concerned with people perishing what are you in fear of them perishing into?  You say you do not believe in hell.  What does perish mean but for a soul to perish in hell?  You see, you are holding the truth in unrighteousness.  That is your problem, Mickiel.  You know the Word of God but deny the power of God.  This is a serious situation that you must go before the Lord about.  God has always had a remnant and He has got one even now. You're using scripture and then twisting it into a lie.  The problem is your heart. Something isn't right.[/QUOTE]


As long as I do not have to go before Christians , I'll be fine. I'll take my grace with God.[/QUOTE]


Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > I'll leave you now with the links I've provided, Mickiel. I believe I have given you enough material to look at for now.
> ...


That's a shame because if you die and go to hell you'll be wishing throughout eternity that you had read it and spared yourself such suffering.


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## Book of Jeremiah (Jul 19, 2016)

HUGGY said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
> ...


Alright.  I'm happy to hear it.


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Jeremiah said:


> Well you should be happy ;  Atheist are Atheist because they are supposed to be Atheist. Theist are Theist because they are supposed  to be  Theist. We are supposed to be what  we are .


Not true.  His problem is written in 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11

And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2 Thessalonians 2:10-11[/QUOTE]


Baloney , you Christians may be willing that people perish , but God is not willing that ANY perish , but that ALL repent.[/QUOTE]

If you are so concerned with people perishing what are you in fear of them perishing into?  You say you do not believe in hell.  What does perish mean but for a soul to perish in hell?  You see, you are holding the truth in unrighteousness.  That is your problem, Mickiel.  You know the Word of God but deny the power of God.  This is a serious situation that you must go before the Lord about.  God has always had a remnant and He has got one even now. You're using scripture and then twisting it into a lie.  The problem is your heart. Something isn't right.[/QUOTE]


As long as I do not have to go before Christians , I'll be fine. I'll take my grace with God.[/QUOTE]


Mickiel said:


> Jeremiah said:
> 
> 
> > I'll leave you now with the links I've provided, Mickiel. I believe I have given you enough material to look at for now.
> ...


That's a shame because if you die and go to hell you'll be wishing throughout eternity that you had read it and spared yourself such suffering.[/QUOTE]


There is no such thing as the Christian hell ; my mind is absolutely free from that garbage. I  do not fear Christian myths.


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## TNHarley (Jul 19, 2016)

I want us to be more secular. That much is for certain. Though I don't agree with how we are going about now. Conformity without standards is worse than conformity with standards.
I would like humans to advance past delusion and do what's best for our species rather than each individual. Also, stop with this emotional bullshit. REAL solutions might suck but that's the way it is. Band aids are nothing more than a big ass circle of stupidity. A "fools party" I like to call it.
Basically, I can't say I agree. All I have seen from atheists is just as bad as Christians. Look at the millions of murders done by atheists and self described "communists" the last hundred years. 
There are numerous athiest fanatics today, just like Christians. 
Most Christians have evolved from barbaric Christian ideals. A lot to consider..
I probably would have agreed if you would have went with "religion". Islam is a thousand times worse than present day Christianity. Hell, there are even fanatic Buddhists that go fuckin nuts and claim THEY are the true Buddhists..
Humans have ALOT of growing up to do!


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## Mickiel (Jul 19, 2016)

Christianity is the worse in my view, because they pimp their unholy doctrine of eternal hell  and they rape the true biblical message of salvation. Christianity has perverted the human consciousness in manners still unrecognized.


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## Mickiel (Jul 20, 2016)

Atheist marriages last longer than Christian ones;

Atheist Marriages May Last Longer Than Christian Ones


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## Mickiel (Jul 20, 2016)

More interesting stats about Atheist; contrasting Christians;

Interesting Statistics Contrasting Atheism and Christianity


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## Mickiel (Jul 21, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous , because its willing to condemn most of humanity.


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## Mickiel (Jul 21, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous , because they think God is a pain pimp.


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## Mickiel (Jul 21, 2016)

Christians think that God thinks he cannot save everyone ;

they don't know God.


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## Mickiel (Jul 22, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous because they  have an " Us verses Them" attitude and they are teaching the world that God thinks like they do. In Isaiah 66:9 God is NOT going to shut the womb of salvation to any human!


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## LittleNipper (Jul 22, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christians think that God thinks he cannot save everyone ;
> 
> they don't know God.


Christians know that ANYONE can be saved but not everyone will accept the only payment for sin.


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## Mickiel (Jul 23, 2016)

LittleNipper said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christians think that God thinks he cannot save everyone ;
> ...




If God condemns anyone for being stupid enough to not accept him , then he is as stupid as they are.

Again Jesus, someone Christians ignore ;  in John 12:47 ," If any man hears my words and believes not , I judge him NOT! I did NOT come to judge the world , but to save THE WORLD!"  Here Jesus teaches a person can reject him and be saved anyway. Something Christians hate. If they don't believe ,they are rejecting him, Jesus clearly taught he did not come here to judge their unbelief ; he came here to save A WORLD!

He did not come to call the righteous , or people who accept him, he came to call sinners to repentance , or people who reject him. Get over it Christians , your hell is null and void , just like your beliefs.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

In Rev. 12:9  satan has deceived the" Whole World." The best way to deceive a whole planet , is to use its number one religion  to help mess up people's heads.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

Life is lived forwards but understood backwards! Martin Luther railed against the Roman Catholic church , the historical back round of Christianity.  Luther made preaching , rather than the Eucharist , the center of the church gathering. The pulpit became the throne of the Protestant Pastor, he became the MC and CEO of the Christian service. One big mouth talking to a congregation that had been reduced to being one giant ear, individual participation was eliminated. This is unbiblical but yet unseen in the Christian mind.

Millions have been historically turned into passive sheep! Letting Pastors create and dictate doctrines. This dynamic has crippled the church.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

I am not the only one to see these disturbing trends in Christianity ,  notice;

10 People Who Give Christianity a Bad Name - Listverse


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

Christianity is worse than Atheism because it is teaching both believers and unbelievers a message of elitism and this horror hell  and its perverting the message of salvation. And the whole world is listening to these jokers';


Christ Didn’t Condemn Non-Christians to Hell


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## LittleNipper (Jul 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> LittleNipper said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


John 3:18 He that believeth on him (JESUS), is not condemned: but he that believeth not, is *condemned already*, because he hath not believed in the name of the only-begotten Son of God.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

LittleNipper said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > LittleNipper said:
> ...




Of course the Christian condemnation in their message is eternal punishing hell, but in John 3:19 the real biblical meaning of just what the condemnation is , is clear in verse 19, " And THIS IS the condemnation, that light is come into the world, but men loved darkness rather than light!" In other words , the condemnation is spiritual blindness , NOT eternal madness in some Christian pain pit.

In fact the word " Condemned" should not even be in use here ; the term " Judgment" is more proper. Men that don't believe are judged already; and what is that judgment, blindness. Temporary  blindness.

And that is all that verse means , Christians just like bringing horror to the word of God.


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## LittleNipper (Jul 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> LittleNipper said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


 John 3:19
Whoever trusts in the Son has eternal life. But whoever disobeys the Son *will not see that life but remains subject to God’s wrath*.”

There is nothing TEMPORY about eternity (Life or Wrath).


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

LittleNipper said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > LittleNipper said:
> ...




Naturally I disagree with you Christian , the wrath of God is not eternal , you just want it to be; you want God to hurt humans forever ;  but you and your group do not know God ;  In Isaiah 57:16 , God disagreeing with you also , " For I will not be angry forever , neither will I always be  in wrath; for that spirit decreases in me."

That is how the real God is. And I praise him for not being like Christians say he is. And us sinners are fortunate of that.


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


You can inform the 160 million slaughtered by their own athiest governments in the past century.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Christians slaughtered a lot of  people during the inquisition ;  your religions hands are not clean. Christians can kill too.


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


About 600 were killed in the inquisition.
And I'm talking about today, not 600 years ago.


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...




Christians killed a lot of Blacks in America 150 years ago, care to talk about that?


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


They were all mostly Christians?

William Wilberforce ended slavery for much of the world, and he did it based upon his faith.

Slavery exists today promoted by atheists and Islam.


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...




The most insane slavery that I am aware of in life , is the Christian doctrine of enslaving unbelieving sinners in a place called hell and punish them for an eternity. Nothing Atheism or Islam promotes can be worse than that insanity;

hello!


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


So now that it's clear with your support of Athiesm and Islam that your only opposition is not to slavery but to God , now we can discuss your real point.

Why do you hate God?


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...




I hate the Christian view of God.
I hate limited salvation , this unholy teaching that not everyone will be saved.
I hate the splitting of God into three beings instead of the one God he is.
I hate the burden of tithing placed on believers who are tricked into believing its a command from God.
I hate that Christmas and Easter are taught to be holy days of God , when they are pagan holidays.
I hate that Christians teach they wrote the bible, when they did not.


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


It's your right to hate what is good in this world.


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...




And its a right that you did not give to me. I hate the perversion of the true gospel, and the degrading message of the Christian hell.


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Yes, Athiesm and Islam offer everything you desire.  Hate.  Lots and lots of hate.


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...




My hearts desire is to see all Atheist and Islam saved ,my biblical belief is that they are ; I trust in a God who is universal in his grace and love ; all of Christianity will be saved , and all of unbelievers will be saved.

That is my desire , and in 1 Tim. 2:3-4 it is exactly the desire of God himself.

Hello?


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## Weatherman2020 (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


You're a nutter cultist who needs to stick to the flame zone with the other kiddies.


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## koshergrl (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



Atheism and Mass Murder - Conservapedia


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## koshergrl (Jul 25, 2016)

State atheism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...




I hold absolutely no need to insult your personage, but I completely understand your need to insult mine. I mean you have to do something ; I am putting a lot of pressure on your religion. Because your religion puts a lot of pressure on humanity ; but see I know God is about to stop that mess.


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Christianity is dangerous because it wears a religious robe , but hell is its root message.


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## LittleNipper (Jul 25, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is dangerous because it wears a religious robe , but hell is its root message.


And what about funny hats?


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2016)

Notice;

10 Reasons I Don't Like Most Christians - TonyMorganLive.com


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## MizMolly (Jul 25, 2016)

I don't believe people need to be labeled as Christian, Atheist, etc. Your beliefs, faith and spiritualism is a personal experience. It doesn't matter what you call yourself, just be a good, caring, decent human being.


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## Mickiel (Jul 26, 2016)

MizMolly said:


> I don't believe people need to be labeled as Christian, Atheist, etc. Your beliefs, faith and spiritualism is a personal experience. It doesn't matter what you call yourself, just be a good, caring, decent human being.




Well most Christians don't feel that way , they worship their label as much as they do God. Many of them feel that you must be a Christian to be decent.


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## sizzler (Jul 26, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



  Islam is worse than Christianity.  Atheism is more sane.


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## Mickiel (Jul 26, 2016)

sizzler said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




No religion is worse than Christianity , no religion has smeared God more  and predict more humans to be condemned by their doctrines.


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## sizzler (Jul 26, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> sizzler said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



  If you are going to send me a post, I would appreciate it if you didn't sniff glue first.  Mohammed himself is said to have personally, with his own two hands, cut off between 600 and 900 people's heads with a knife.  Do you really suppose that made him better than Jesus?  Who preached forgiveness?


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## Mickiel (Jul 26, 2016)

sizzler said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > sizzler said:
> ...




Jesus was not a Christian, and I won't send you any more post if you keep insulting me.


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## Mickiel (Jul 27, 2016)

Atheist want people to live out their lives and die; if a Christian thinks your life was worthless ,  well then they feel you should be punished for 1,000 years plus, 7500 more years plus, 4 million more years of this insane level of existence plus, 95 billion more years of untold punishing, plus another 832 trillion more years of this hurt and then the cycle repeats itself on into infinity! And some how , incredibly the Christian mind feels this raw insanity is just fine.

What's wrong with them?

Something very powerful has gotten ahold of their belief system.


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## Mickiel (Jul 27, 2016)

More on paganism in Christianity ;


Are Holidays like Christmas and Easter  pagan or Christian?


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## sizzler (Jul 27, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> sizzler said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



  Jesus was a jew. But what he taught became the basis for Christianity.  Next, I call'em as I see'em.  To say that Christianity is worse than islam sounds like what a glue sniffer might say.


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## sizzler (Jul 27, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Atheist want people to live out their lives and die; if a Christian thinks your life was worthless ,  well then they feel you should be punished for 1,000 years plus, 7500 more years plus, 4 million more years of this insane level of existence plus, 95 billion more years of untold punishing, plus another 832 trillion more years of this hurt and then the cycle repeats itself on into infinity! And some how , incredibly the Christian mind feels this raw insanity is just fine.
> 
> What's wrong with them?
> 
> Something very powerful has gotten ahold of their belief system.



  The Christian cult was screwed up before there was even a Christianity.  Because the hebrew cult it sprang from was screwed up itself.


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## Mickiel (Jul 27, 2016)

sizzler said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > sizzler said:
> ...




Hey , if your stuck on Christianity , that's you; I think they are the most deceptive group on earth. Hellmongers that cripple the salvation message.


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## sizzler (Jul 27, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> sizzler said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



  I am an Atheist.  At least that's the closest term.  Because more than just not believe in god, I actually HATE religion.  As far as I know, there is no term like "Atheist" to describe that.  Also, I have a "salvation message" for you.  There's no such thing.  There are ways to mitigate any sins you may have committed.  But simply saying "I'm sorry" to Jesus isn't one of them.


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## Mickiel (Jul 27, 2016)

sizzler said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > sizzler said:
> ...




I don't like religion either. And I don't like Atheism.  And I don't like Theism.


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## sizzler (Jul 27, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> sizzler said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



  What is there to not like about Atheism.  It isn't some cult with a bunch of teachings to read or a lot of rules to be followed.  It simply means that you don't believe in god.


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## Mickiel (Jul 27, 2016)

sizzler said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > sizzler said:
> ...




I don't like unbelief in God.


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## sizzler (Jul 27, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> sizzler said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



  Well there is no such thing.  Deal with it.


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## Mickiel (Jul 28, 2016)

There is always yen and yang  , up and down,  in and out, belief and unbelief.


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## Mudda (Jul 28, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> There is always yen and yang  , up and down,  in and out, belief and unbelief.


You forgot piss and poop.


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## Mickiel (Jul 28, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > There is always yen and yang  , up and down,  in and out, belief and unbelief.
> ...




I hold no interest in your sarcasm, but I understand that you cannot speak without it. I mean we write how we think. I don't need scarcasm and insults , because I do not think that way.


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## Mudda (Jul 28, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


But you're into nonsense, and you forgot barf and shit too.


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## Mickiel (Jul 28, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Mudda said:
> ...




I hold no need for personal insults , my conversation is strong enough without them. Unlike the peacock , I don't need to spread my tail to get attention.


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## Mudda (Jul 28, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


You're more like chicken, poop and run.


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## Mickiel (Jul 28, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Mudda said:
> ...




I hold no need to insult you , I am not interested in useless hurting of others. The human language has been raped enough  , so I contribute to respectful conversation by practicing it.


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## Mudda (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Have you always been such a pussy?


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Mudda said:
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No ,I used to talk as reckless as you do, uncaring and violent; but I just got tired of it, wasting my mouth and always hurting others. I grew up and matured. Then I started liking being more mature , and now it has become a way of conversation.


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## Mudda (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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So you like being a pussy. Got it.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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Yes ,I like not raping the human language , I get no joy from ripping people apart with my tongue like its a knife. But I understand how the mouth can become a weapon that is being used by the mind behind it. My mind is a weapon also , so is my mouth , but I use mine with respect and admiration for   the human language. I don't need to tear at people and shame them;

I have long since seen its foolishness . Its a complete waste of time , except with those who can't  control the habit  of masturbation of the mouth.


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## Divine Wind (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Looks like somebody needs a hug.  

While mankind's perceptions of the imperceptible are largely flawed, the simple fact the vast majority of human beings believe in an existence beyond mortal life is evidence atheists are missing something.

The great philosopher Socrates was put on trial for "corrupting youth" and for "not believing in the gods of the state".  Socrates was spiritual and believed in an afterlife, but he didn't accept how the authoritarian government was using their power.  Given the choice of death or exile, Socrates famously chose death with the comment "An unexamined life is not worth living".

From Plato's "Apology": The Internet Classics Archive | Apology by Plato
"_I have said enough in my defence against the first class of my accusers; I turn to the second class, who are headed by Meletus, that good and patriotic man, as he calls himself. And now I will try to defend myself against them: these new accusers must also have their affidavit read. What do they say? Something of this sort: - That Socrates is a doer of evil, and *corrupter of the youth, and he does not believe in the gods of the state, and has other new divinities of his own*. That is the sort of charge; and now let us examine the particular counts. He says that I am a doer of evil, who corrupt the youth; but I say, O men of Athens, that Meletus is a doer of evil, and the evil is that he makes a joke of a serious matter, and is too ready at bringing other men to trial from a pretended zeal and interest about matters in which he really never had the smallest interest. And the truth of this I will endeavor to prove._ "


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

I am not against belief in God , I am of the view that most believers are more dangerous to humanity than unbelievers are.


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## Mudda (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Ok, try saying something intelligent. I'll wait.


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## Divine Wind (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I am not against belief in God , I am of the view that most believers are more dangerous to humanity than unbelievers are.


You seem to be speaking out of both sides of your keyboard.  Why are most believers more dangerous than unbelievers?  Two of the deadliests leaders in history were atheists: Joseph Stalin and Mao Zedong.   Does this mean atheists are more dangerous than "believers"?


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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I hold no interest in your sarcasm , your way of conversation. I guess you think I am just another person you can play your games with. Just another person for you to spit on and laugh and please yourself. I am glad I am free of what grips you. It took a long time to get that spirit out of me.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Divine.Wind said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I am not against belief in God , I am of the view that most believers are more dangerous to humanity than unbelievers are.
> ...




Believers are more dangerous because they pervert the true salvation of God and seriously limit his Kingdom. There is nothing worse than that.


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## Divine Wind (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Believers are more dangerous because they pervert the true salvation of God and seriously limit his Kingdom. There is nothing worse than that.


Non sequitur. If you believe in God, you aren't an atheist and that belief makes you a believer too.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Divine.Wind said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Believers are more dangerous because they pervert the true salvation of God and seriously limit his Kingdom. There is nothing worse than that.
> ...




Jesus had a lot of Atheist around him, but he really disliked certain believers in God who were around him , they were called Scribes and Pharisees , strict law keepers  , very self righteous. They loved to limit God's Kingdom In Matt. 23:13 Jesus confronts them, " Woe to you Scribes and Pharisees ( believers ),  hypocrites! For you " Shut up the Kingdom of Heaven." They  were teaching doctrines like eternal hell punishing, and teaching that not all humans are saved.

Christians are just modern day  Pharisees.


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## Divine Wind (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Divine.Wind said:
> 
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> > Mickiel said:
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Like I said, looks like you need a hug as does anyone who so blindly broad brushes over 2 Billion people.

Since you are a self-proclaimed atheist, I suspect ulterior motives on your part.  Either consciously or unconsciously.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Divine.Wind said:


> Mickiel said:
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Now, an opportunity here ;  2 billion people!  In Rev. 12:9 satan deceives the WHOLE WORLD! How in the world of reason  is this thing able to deceive all of humanity? One of the ways is that he used the largest religion to help him seduce  the consciousness of humanity. He used a church, masterfully used it , the last thing humans suspect. Used it to pimp his own confused doctrines.


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## Mudda (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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Still waiting...


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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I hold no interest in your sarcasm , why waste time on me? I am not going to participate in your name calling game ,but many on site will. Why waste your time on me? Why throw knives at people who will not throw back?


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## Mudda (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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Wassup? Can't do more intelligent than that?


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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No need. Your a predator, you have more exciting prey than me on this board,  you need the exchange , the put down , the trash  , the scarcasm;  your not getting that with me, you will soon grow tired.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Interesting article, see what you think of " The dechristianization  of America."

America's Religious Future: Dechristianization (Not Secularization)


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## Mudda (Jul 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
> 
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You're a saddo would likes to be put down. Cheaper than paying your dominatrix.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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I hold absolutely no need to insult you, your going to have to get someonelse.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Some people just need others to abuse, like Christians need bodies for their hell.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2016)

Christianity is  more dangerous than Atheism ,  because they think they are gods.


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## Mudda (Jul 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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You should learn how to spell, maybe your dominatrix can beat it into you when you're on your knees grovelling.


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## Mickiel (Jul 30, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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Come and let us reason together, I hold no interest in satire and sarcasm ;  are you able to converse without it?


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## yiostheoy (Jul 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is  more dangerous than Atheism ,  because they think they are gods.


Any religion is going to be dangerous.

But there are dangers to atheism and agnosticism as well.  The biggest danger is self centeredness and a total lack of any kind of ethics.

What is worse?  Being brainwashed by your own self into thinking you are the center of the Universe versus some other God is center of the Universe ??

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.


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## Mickiel (Jul 30, 2016)

yiostheoy said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is  more dangerous than Atheism ,  because they think they are gods.
> ...



I don't smoke.

The devil goes after the religious people , he already has the rest of humanity. Atheist and Agnostics are no danger to him;  he is looking to  pervert the reality of God.


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## yiostheoy (Jul 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> yiostheoy said:
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And you have met and interviewed The Devil when and where, so that's how you know this from ?!


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## Mickiel (Jul 30, 2016)

yiostheoy said:


> Mickiel said:
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I interviewed the bible, this can be found in there for those interested.


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## Mudda (Jul 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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Sure, just say something intelligent related to this thread.


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## Mickiel (Jul 30, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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Ahh were getting you close ; it is possible to speak without using insults , sarcasm , childish rigamore , cursing , and disrespect. You can do it. Just step into a new world. Come now , its not going to hurt you.


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## Mudda (Jul 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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That's what passes for an intelligent comment in your world? There's nothing for me to respond to.


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## Mudda (Jul 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> yiostheoy said:
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That's a lot of fartsmoke, even for you.


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## Mickiel (Jul 30, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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Come now , you can do it; just a bit more mature concern toward the language.  Just be more mindful of maturity , more adult ,more respectful, more sensible ; I admit , it does require more.


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## Mudda (Jul 31, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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I'm still waiting for you to say something intelligent. What's the matter, can't do it?


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## Mickiel (Jul 31, 2016)

Mudda said:


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There is no need to imply an insult ,I hold no interested in such implication.


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## Mudda (Jul 31, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
> 
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> > Mickiel said:
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Here, I'll help you out and throw you a softball:

Christianity IS more dangerous then Atheism, don't you think?


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## Mickiel (Jul 31, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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There you go  ,I knew you could do it .I knew you could be reasonable.

It's like a breath of fresh words.


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## Mudda (Jul 31, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Mudda said:
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You're supposed to say something on topic back, you fucking imbecile. Don't you know how this works? Why are you even here if it's just to be a moron?


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## Mickiel (Jul 31, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
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I must say that I am very proud of you. I have seen  your reasonable side.


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## Mickiel (Aug 6, 2016)

Christianity  is  FAR more seductive than Atheism, I mean by the millions!


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## Mickiel (Aug 7, 2016)

Christians are salvation strippers , experts at condemning unbelievers and selected groups of humanity.


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## Meriweather (Aug 7, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christians are salvation strippers , experts at condemning unbelievers and selected groups of humanity.


Too broad a brush.  Check the Catechism of the Catholic Church where all are entrusted to the mercy of God.


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## Mickiel (Aug 7, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christians are salvation strippers , experts at condemning unbelievers and selected groups of humanity.
> ...



Well good for them ; a few people can see that truth; but most of the world has been infected with the  Christian theology of hell.


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## Meriweather (Aug 7, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Well good for them ; a few people can see that truth; but most of the world has been infected with the  Christian theology of hell.



Catholicism makes up the largest Christian denomination so more than a few people see that truth.  Joining in are atheists who reject the teaching that unbelievers burn in hell for all eternity.  

What troubles me is that some who have been brought up with the hell fire version of Christianity run to the other side of the seesaw (so-to-speak) of unbelief.  There is another option, and that is balance--and balance is found at the center.  People should know there is a third option to investigate.


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## Mickiel (Aug 7, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Well good for them ; a few people can see that truth; but most of the world has been infected with the  Christian theology of hell.
> ...




You can add most Universalist to that growing list of truth seers.


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## Mickiel (Aug 7, 2016)

An Atheist would want you to die and that's it, some think reincarnation; if your an Atheist, the Christian expects you to die, then live forever in suffering in their hell. Is not it obvious who is more dangerous?


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## Mickiel (Sep 3, 2016)

The Atheist view of death ; we die and its over.

The Christian view ;  we die  and live in their suffering hell alive forever in pain.

Its academic which one is worse.


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## Luddly Neddite (Sep 3, 2016)

Almost 300 posts so I haven't read the whole thread but --

All god based religions are dangerous. The names of the gods change and some of the details are different but they all say the same thing. And their adherents all say the same thing. 

There's only one god.
My way is the only way.
I'm better than you. 
You will be punished if you don't believe in my god.


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## Luddly Neddite (Sep 3, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> The Atheist view of death ; we die and its over.
> 
> The Christian view ;  we die  and live in their suffering hell alive forever in pain.
> 
> Its academic which one is worse.






We hear from the christians that they hate ISIS for burning people alive. There's not doubt that's beyond horrifying to even think about. But, that terror and pain is over very quickly. According to christians, their "merciful" god requires you to fall on your knees and ask him not to burn you alive for all of eternity. 

Which of those choices is worse? 

A relatively quick, though cruel and barbaric death?
Or burning alive forever and ever and ever and ever and ever for all of eternity?


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## Luddly Neddite (Sep 3, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




There were no "christians" at the time the bible was written and Jesus himself wasn't christian. He was Jewish.


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## Luddly Neddite (Sep 3, 2016)




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## Meriweather (Sep 3, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> The Atheist view of death ; we die and its over.
> 
> The Christian view ;  we die  and live in their suffering hell alive forever in pain.
> 
> Its academic which one is worse.


You are in error about what the Christian view is.


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## Mickiel (Sep 3, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > The Atheist view of death ; we die and its over.
> ...



Well I stand ready to be corrected ;  explain where I am wrong?


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## Meriweather (Sep 3, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Well I stand ready to be corrected ;  explain where I am wrong?



Christianity is made up of many sects.  Some outspoken sects maintain all non-Christians (and some of these sects include Catholic and Orthodox as non-Christian) will burn in hell.  However the majority of Christianity teaches that non-Christians (including non-believers) are entrusted to the mercy and saving power of God.  Paul said something interesting in Romans:  That while believers are judged by the mercy of God, non-believers are judged by their own hearts.  Often we are much harder on ourselves than is anyone else.


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## Mickiel (Sep 4, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Well I stand ready to be corrected ;  explain where I am wrong?
> ...




I disagree , Catholics are Christians, they were among the first in history. I think some sects in Christianity have moved away from hell,  because knowledge is increasing. But most of them still teach condemnation  and a limited salvation.


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## Meriweather (Sep 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I disagree , Catholics are Christians, they were among the first in history. I think some sects in Christianity have moved away from hell,  because knowledge is increasing. But most of them still teach condemnation  and a limited salvation.



Of course Catholics are Christians!  So are Orthodox.  Together, this makes up the majority of Christians.  Catholicism teaches there is a hell--but we do not know who, if anyone, is in hell.  There is no reason to believe a lack of belief in the Christian faith automatically consigns one to hell.  Scripture tells us God alone judges the heart.


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## hobelim (Sep 4, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Catholicism teaches there is a hell--but we do not know who, if anyone, is in hell.




If you don't know that, how could you possibly presume to teach anyone about anything?


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## Mickiel (Sep 4, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I disagree , Catholics are Christians, they were among the first in history. I think some sects in Christianity have moved away from hell,  because knowledge is increasing. But most of them still teach condemnation  and a limited salvation.
> ...




I wish all Christians thought as you do;
in reality they do not.


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## Meriweather (Sep 4, 2016)

hobelim said:


> If you don't know that, how could you possibly presume to teach anyone about anything?



1.  Jesus speaks of hell, a place originally designated for angels who turned from God and evil men will find hell is their destiny as well.  
2.  God, not any human, judges each heart.  God is just and merciful.  God has not informed anyone who is in hell. 

What more is there to teach?


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## Meriweather (Sep 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I wish all Christians thought as you do;
> in reality they do not.



My grandfather was an atheist, so at a young age I did some investigating.  Also a priest asked me these questions:  Do you love your grandfather?  Do you imagine you can love your grandfather better than God, who is love?  I was taught that what the Church can do is teach everyone it can reach a sure way to heaven and into God's kingdom.  Some people, for whatever reasons, the Church cannot reach, but just because the Church cannot work with a person does not mean that the Holy Spirit isn't working within that person.  What is impossible for the Church is not impossible with God.  

Final answer:  Because my Grandfather was an atheist, the Church cannot guarantee he is with God, but on the other hand, the Church very much trusts in the love, mercy--and justice--of God.  Plus, God does not inform the Church who is in hell, and who isn't.


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## Mickiel (Sep 4, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I wish all Christians thought as you do;
> ...



Hell is simply the grave


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## Meriweather (Sep 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Hell is simply the grave



I see it differently because I see life continuing beyond the grave.  I believe each chooses the life they want for eternity:  A life with God (which we call heaven) or a life without God (which we call hell).  I do think hell fire is a metaphor, but paints a picture of what a life without God is like.  I don't see hell so much a punishment as an alternate way of living for those who cannot stand living in the presence of God.


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## hobelim (Sep 4, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > If you don't know that, how could you possibly presume to teach anyone about anything?
> ...



If you don't know the difference between heaven and hell you probably shouldn't be talking about such things as Gods representative. I heard that he could get a little testy with people who speak falsely in his name.


Whats more to teach? How about how to avoid it?

How about teaching that anyone who sets aside the law of God and worships the lifeless work of human hands will die in the very day that they do it and will immediately descend into the netherworld where they will remain tormented day and night by confusion until they have paid the very last farthing.

Isn't it sad that the ones already hell's keeping are usually the last to know,  if ever?


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## Votto (Sep 4, 2016)

rdean said:


> Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.








Right, atheists just want to kill off all religious folk and political rivals.

Nothing to see here!

Any idiot can see that the issue is the power of the state when it comes to snuffing out life and building armies.  They will subvert anything to accomplish their evil schemes, including religion.


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## Meriweather (Sep 4, 2016)

hobelim said:


> If you don't know the difference between heaven and hell you probably shouldn't be talking about such things as Gods representative. I heard that he could get a little testy with people who speak falsely in his name.
> 
> Whats more to teach? How about how to avoid it?
> 
> ...



hobelim, re-read your post and then look into the mirror.


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## hobelim (Sep 4, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > If you don't know the difference between heaven and hell you probably shouldn't be talking about such things as Gods representative. I heard that he could get a little testy with people who speak falsely in his name.
> ...




Sure, no problem. Done.

Nothing said applies to me. I always do exactly as God commands. You will never find me on my knees worshiping and seeking spiritual life from a false,  three for the price of one, god made man made matzo made by human hands.

I would rather be drawn and quartered.


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## Votto (Sep 4, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Meriweather said:
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> > hobelim said:
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Just make sure you don't have the embarrassment of shaking your hand defiantly at a God you swore your entire life never existed, like Joseph Stalin did.


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## hobelim (Sep 4, 2016)

Votto said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > Meriweather said:
> ...


 

Thanks for the heads up but I never said that I do not believe in the existence of God.

Its actually because I do believe that I would never participate in such an obvious fraud.


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## Mickiel (Sep 4, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Votto said:
> 
> 
> > hobelim said:
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I think God exist, but in my view much of religion is a fraud;  they misrepresent God because they really don't know him. But they have too much pride to see this.


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## Mickiel (Sep 5, 2016)

Why Atheist win arguments with Christians;

Why atheists win arguments with Christians about God


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 5, 2016)

rdean said:


> Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.



Some atheist want to kill religious people and have actually done so. Name 3 Christians in the United States that wants to kill gays.  Shoot.  I'll settle for 2.  Name 2 Christians in the United States that wants to kill gays.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 5, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Why Atheist win arguments with Christians;
> 
> Why atheists win arguments with Christians about God



Winning arguments almost never changes minds.  Whoop-ti-do!  You won an argument.  Congratulations.  You accomplished jack and squat.  Now pat yourself on the back for being a winner.


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## Mickiel (Sep 5, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.
> ...




If you actually believe there are no Christians who want gays dead ,  I feel sorry for your grip on reality.


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## Votto (Sep 6, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Votto said:
> 
> 
> > hobelim said:
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As a Christian I have to understand the institutionalized corruption within religious institutions that sent Jesus to the cross.

At the same time I respect him establishing a "church" and wanting Christians to have fellowship with each other.


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## Mickiel (Sep 6, 2016)

Votto said:


> hobelim said:
> 
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> > Votto said:
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Well yes ,it was the priest of Jesus day who inspired his death. But guess what , it was God's will that Jesus die for the sins of humanity, and its mainly Christians that teach limited atonement. The real corruption is within Christianity.


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## Mickiel (Sep 8, 2016)

I did not start this thread because of a weird like of Atheist , I started it because the topic is simply true. Christianity is a trip down confusion. I have argued with Atheist for years , been banned from most of their sites;
An unorthodox belief in God.

I have found Christianity to be a far greater danger to salvation than anything I have ever known.


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## Mickiel (Sep 8, 2016)

Notice;

10 Things Christians and Atheists Can (And Must) Agree On


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## Mickiel (Sep 9, 2016)

Theism and Atheism are just the flip side of the same coin!


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 9, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> vasuderatorrent said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...



Name 3 Christians in America that wants gays dead.  Take your time.  I'll wait.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 9, 2016)

Votto said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > Votto said:
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All human beings, governments, businesses, charities, religions and religious institutions operate under paradoxical conditions.  It's just how humans are wired.  We contradict ourselves all the time like a bunch of hypocrites.  It's just what humans do.  We are awesome like that.  We lie constantly but still manage to be true to our goals and our survival.  It's amazing really.


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## Mickiel (Sep 9, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > vasuderatorrent said:
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With pleasure;

Here's a Christian pastor , and you can choose any two of his members.

Christian Pastor Says Gays 'Worthy Of Death' At Conference With 3 GOP Presidential Candidates


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 9, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> vasuderatorrent said:
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Now you just need two more examples.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 9, 2016)

Every single atheist wants Christians dead.
One Christian wants gays dead.

There are less gays than Christians.  I think that would make atheist more dangerous.


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## Mickiel (Sep 9, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> Mickiel said:
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As you wish;

Christian Pastor Celebrates Nightclub Massacre: “There’s 50 Less Pedophiles in This World”


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 9, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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I was hoping you would name him.  I love Pastor Steve Anderson from Faithful Word Baptist Church in Tempe, Arizona.  Got another one?  You are one shy from your goal.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 9, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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Steve Anderson cured the world's AIDS problem with one single sermon.  He is an amazing guy.


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## Mickiel (Sep 9, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


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Heres more;

The Christians Who Want To Execute You–And The Republicans Who Court Them / Queerty


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

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I gave you credit for Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson.  I wasn't able to harvest a third name from the last article.  Technically you gave me zero names but I gave you credit for the first two.  You'll have to work harder for the last one and actually give me a name this time.  Politicians aren't Christians.  They will say whatever they have to say to get elected.  I'm pretty sure they don't have any opinions.  However if you can find a politician that said he thinks that homosexuals should be executed then I will give you half of a point for each politician.  That last article you gave me was written by a fanatical group that is going to exaggerate 10 times out of 10.  Just list the name and I'll do the background check to see if he/she is a Christian that wants to kill gays.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


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Here 's about 10more,I am sure you can get your one from here l;

Happy hunting,( no pun intended);

Anti Gay Pastors


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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You are the one that is trying to find 3 names not me.  You have given me 0 names so far but I have given you credit for 2.  All you have to do is give me one name.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


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I have given you 15 Christian pastors , all of which you are blind to or so selfish you cannot admit I gave more than what you asked. I am finished with your selfishness, your cold unfairness  no longer interest me.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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You gave me zero.  That third link was really hard to follow.  It had a lot of irrelevant names.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

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The first article you showed me referenced Kevin Swanson.  I gave you credit for that one.  The second article you showed me referenced Steve Anderson.  I gave you credit for that one.  The third article you showed me referenced about 20 people.  Some of them were opportunistic politicians.

My challenge was for you to name 3 Christians that want gays dead.  It has taken you 23 hours and you still haven't given me one name.

What if I would have been afraid to click those links?  You wouldn't have even received credit for those first two names.  Now I am asking you to give me one.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> your cold unfairness  no longer interest me.



All you have to do is type a name.  Please excuse my cruelty.  Let me go torture someone else.  Maybe I'll ask them to spell cat or something equally as torturous.  ah ha ha ha.  I love torturing people by making them do tasks that are next to impossible.

FYI: If you give up then I want to go on the record.  There are less than 3 Christians out of 280 million in the United States that want gays dead.  Finding 2 is possible.  Finding 3 is impossible.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> Mickiel said:
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> > your cold unfairness  no longer interest me.
> ...




I could care less what you do.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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So you don't mind if I go on the record?


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



An atheist is someone who doesn't believe in God.  Atheism is not anti-religious.  I am atheist and I think religion is a positive thing.  There are a lot of atheist that would never admit to being an atheist.  Anti-theist and atheist are not in the same.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


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If you consider my thread " A Record" ,I am honored.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

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Want to know the truth?  I honestly expected you to come up with the three names.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

3 out of 280,000,000 is .00000000107142857%.

It is such a small percentage even if you found 3 names.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> 3 out of 280,000,000 is .00000000107142857%.
> 
> It is such a small percentage even if you found 3 names.




I gave you many more than three , but it would take a reasonable mind to admit it.

These minds are unreasonable;
10 Most Wildly Anti-Gay Preachers in America


This Christian uses the bible in support of killing gays;
Should I Kill Gay People?

This Christians wants the killing of gays made law;

California lawyer seeks to put 'shoot the gays' proposal on 2016 ballot


Still more blood thirsty Christians ;

Salvation Army Says 'Gays Need to Be Put to Death'?


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> vasuderatorrent said:
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> 
> > 3 out of 280,000,000 is .00000000107142857%.
> ...



You named zero.  You gave me links.  I had to list the names for you.  I thought you gave up.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

This is what you said.  I quote you,

"With pleasure;

Here's a Christian pastor , and you can choose any two of his members.

Christian Pastor Says Gays 'Worthy of Death' At Conference With 3 GOP Presidential Candidates"

The number of names listed in that post was 0.  I counted them twice.  I came up with 0 both times.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

This is what you said.  I quote you,

"As you wish;

Christian Pastor Celebrates Nightclub Massacre: "There's 50 Less Pedophiles in This World" " 

The number of names listed in that post was 0.  I counted them three times just to make sure.  I came up with 0 all three times.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

This is what you said.  I quote you,

"Heres more;

The Christians Who Want To Execute You-And The Repuplicans Who Courth Them/ Queerty"

The number of names listed in that post was 0.  I counted them seven times.  I came up with 0 all seven times.

It doesn't matter any more.  You couldn't list any names whatsoever of Christians who want gays dead.  I was outrageously generous I gave you credit for listing 2 names.  All you had to do was come up with 1 name and you couldn't do it.  You gave up.  Don't you remember?   I have already assumed that you are incapable of listing one name of a Christian who wants gays dead.  I have moved on.  Stop worrying about it.  You can't do it.  You have proven that.

Get somebody to do it for you.  You are a quitter.  You have had your chance.  Now I have given up on you.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> This is what you said.  I quote you,
> 
> "Heres more;
> 
> ...




Well yes ,I have given up;

but I guess I am more stubborn than you ;

Like ISIS, US Christian Extremists Advocate Killing Gays – But ISIS Is Actually Doing It

Excuse me if I bring the world in on this stomping of your points;

1000s who died in anti-gay, anti-trans attacks (updates)

Sorry just one more, I guess I just like stomping on you ;
Doesn’t the Bible Tell Christians to Put Homosexuals to Death? | Desiring God


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson advocate a government that executes homosexuals not rogue vigilantes. That is a big difference if you consider that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson live in the United States. Within the United States it would require a lot of massive political hurdles to institute the death penalty for homosexuals.  An idiot can see with 100% clarity that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson are completely benign and irrelevant if that idiot has two or three brain cells to rub together.  I'm finding out that not all idiots have two or three brain cells.  The only potential harm that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson could inflict is hurt feelings.  They are not dangerous in any way shape or form yet some loony tunes with outrageous imaginations paint them as a great threat to the safety of homosexuals.  It's really funny if you think about it.  People really are that stupid.  I'm not making it up.



Mickiel said:


> vasuderatorrent said:
> 
> 
> > This is what you said.  I quote you,
> ...


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## sealybobo (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Did you hear about the Muslim marine who died because they hazed him too hard? You can bet the bullies were all Christians.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson advocate a government that executes homosexuals not rogue vigilantes. That is a big difference if you consider that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson live in the United States. Within the United States it would require a lot of massive political hurdles to institute the death penalty for homosexuals.  An idiot can see with 100% clarity that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson are completely benign and irrelevant if that idiot has two or three brain cells to rub together.  I'm finding out that not all idiots have two or three brain cells.  The only potential harm that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson could inflict is hurt feelings.  They are not dangerous in any way shape or form yet some loony tunes with outrageous imaginations paint them as a great threat to the safety of homosexuals.  It's really funny if you think about it.  People really are that stupid.  I'm not making it up.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just one more;

How Christian Religious Fanatics Kill Gay Teenagers Part Three - paulroebling


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> vasuderatorrent said:
> 
> 
> > Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson advocate a government that executes homosexuals not rogue vigilantes. That is a big difference if you consider that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson live in the United States. Within the United States it would require a lot of massive political hurdles to institute the death penalty for homosexuals.  An idiot can see with 100% clarity that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson are completely benign and irrelevant if that idiot has two or three brain cells to rub together.  I'm finding out that not all idiots have two or three brain cells.  The only potential harm that Kevin Swanson and Steve Anderson could inflict is hurt feelings.  They are not dangerous in any way shape or form yet some loony tunes with outrageous imaginations paint them as a great threat to the safety of homosexuals.  It's really funny if you think about it.  People really are that stupid.  I'm not making it up.
> ...



You can use google really well.  That wasn't the challenge.  Everybody can use google.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


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Oh come now , lets not get soft, you have pronounced yourself the winner ; I'm just stomping on you for the fun of it. Come now , have a heart; and have another website;

Baptist Minister: Christians Shouldn't Mourn 'Death of Sodomites'


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

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I absolutely love Roger Jiminez.  You should add him to your list of 0.  You would at least have one on your list.  It's personal with him.  His sister-in-law is a homosexual.  Roger Jiminez is a student of Steve Anderson.  I expected you to come across Roger Jiminez and Steve Anderson in your search.

You have 3 now.  You did it!  I'll overlook that fact that you didn't compile them into a list.  You have 3.


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

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I understand , its hard to overlook getting stomped!


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

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You did it.  You gave me 3.  What more is there to say?  You finally won.  It took you 30 hours to accomplish it but that's fine.  There is probably other things going on in your life.  You found 3.  I'm happy for you!


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

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I have enjoyed stomping on you ; you remind me of the Christians, they don't know when their getting stomped on either.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

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You won!  You gave me three names.  That's all I asked for and you did it.  I have acknowledged my defeat.  What are you talking about?


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 10, 2016)

*Kevin Swanson, Steve Anderson and Roger Jiminez are three Christians that want gays dead. I stand corrected.*


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## Mickiel (Sep 10, 2016)

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There you go , take your whipping like a man.


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## sealybobo (Sep 10, 2016)

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Ever hear of an atheist drill seargent picking on Christian recruits because they believe In God? No and you never will. 

Did you hear about the Muslim recruit hazed so bad he died? Ask any one of the murderers and you'll find they all believe in God and that America is a Christian nation.


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## Mickiel (Sep 11, 2016)

Oh Christians murder, no doubt it there are no sins that Christians are not guilty of.


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## Mickiel (Sep 11, 2016)

Christians are even converting Atheist to their nonsense.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christians are even converting Atheist to their nonsense.



I became a Christian when I was 11.  I didn't become an atheist until sometime in 2011 or 2012 around the age of 32 or 33.  I'm not sure exactly when it happened.  Habitually giving away money is good for you. Being a selfish pig will make you miserable or broke and miserable.  Some people can manage to refuse giving away money and just be miserable but most become broke too.  I know people that make $80,000 + per year but can't afford to buy groceries.  Do you think that is because they gave away $8,000 to the poor?  I don't think that is their problem at all.  I think their problem is that they didn't give away $8,000.  They become unaware of the realities of poverty by avoiding their duty to care for the poor.  All of us are vulnerable of becoming poor even Bill Gates. Giving reminds us of that reality.

People who refuse to give to others deserve everything they get.

*Whoops!  Wrong thread.  Oh well.  I'll let it stand.*


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## Mickiel (Sep 11, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christians are even converting Atheist to their nonsense.
> ...




I am not against giving , and I understand you complaining on the wrong thread; I mean you must do what your doing, but at least try to understand why I am doing it.


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## vasuderatorrent (Sep 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> at least try to understand why I am doing it.



Is it because you don't have much money and don't want to tithe anymore?  That's the limits of my imagination.


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## sealybobo (Sep 12, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Oh Christians murder, no doubt it there are no sins that Christians are not guilty of.



An Alabama pastor told the crowd at a high school football game to rise for the national anthem or get shot.  “If you don’t want to stand for the National Anthem, you can line up over there by the fence and let our military personnel take a few shots AT you since they’re taking shots FOR you,”  There was “crazy cheering” after the incendiary comments.  Most likely from Christians in the crowd. 

School officials quickly denounced Joyner, who announces football games at McKenzie High School in addition to serving as pastor at the Sweet Home Baptist Church. 

“Threats of violence are a violation of school policy and certainly not condoned by the school board.”  But at a church?  No problem.

Alabama Pastor Allen Joyner Says People Who Don't Stand For The National Anthem Should Be Shot | Huffington Post


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

vasuderatorrent said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > at least try to understand why I am doing it.
> ...




Its because I am no longer bound ,I am free to do with my money as I wish. And I know the truth ,God is not in the money mafia , and God does not want or  need my money. I am free to give as I wish. To whom I wish.


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

sealybobo said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Oh Christians murder, no doubt it there are no sins that Christians are not guilty of.
> ...




See Christians live behind a great wall of perception,( really personal deception ),they think they are greater than they really are; they believe they are actually holy. Yet in reality , they are among the greatest sinners on earth. The pride they have in  themselves is stunning.


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## sealybobo (Sep 12, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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And let's respond appropriately to anyone who tells us they know the meaning of life, how we got here and what happens after we die. 

And what should your reply be to anyone claiming these things?

Yet that's exactly what theists are claiming


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

sealybobo said:


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I am not clear on the meaning of life ,I believe a God is the origin of life , and I believe all humans are destined to live forever. Now I do not believe that life suddenly appeared out of nowhere for no reason. I reject the notion that magic matter suddenly appeared and evolved into rocks , and that mankind crawled out from under those rocks.

In my personal view , life is the result of a "Deliberate act." If I walk and find one dime on the ground , I think nothing of it. If I go further and find 3 dimes on the ground, I can suspect something.  If I go farther and find 100 dimes on the ground , each in rows of 10 and all perfectly balanced standing on their edges, I can correctly assume this was deliberately done.

In my view , life and the universe was deliberately done.


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## sealybobo (Sep 12, 2016)

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Believe doesn't mean you know.  So you don't know.

You can reject the notion that magic matter suddenly appeared and evolved into rocks and that mankind crawled out from under those rocks because no one is claiming that.  

The Universe, in it’s silent dwarfing beauty, may not care about human life – but we do. So our brief and improbable time here may best be spent experiencing its wonders together, not in indentured servitude to an imaginary celestial dictator.

_The significance of our lives and our fragile planet is determined only by our own wisdom and courage. We are the custodians of life’s meaning. We long for a Parent to care for us, to forgive us our errors, to save us from our childish mistakes. But knowledge is preferable to ignorance. Better by far to embrace the hard truth than a reassuring fable. If we crave some cosmic purpose, then let us find ourselves a worthy goal.”_ – Carl Sagan


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

sealybobo said:


> Mickiel said:
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In my view , God is not imaginary, I think he is real. I was once asked why , here is how I answered;

Is God Real?


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

Christianity has distorted the true gospel more than all other sources on earth combined;    and the world is totally unaware of this.

A stunning deception.


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## sealybobo (Sep 12, 2016)

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Let's not forget the good theists. I don't hate the sinners I hate the sin. A lot of good hearted people but I agree a lot of hypocrites too.

Think about it. If you saw a con would you warn others or stay silent? But in some parts of the world people still get killed for being atheists. Even my nephew told me he wouldn't like my athiest friend. So does he seem open minded or brainwashed? 

I went to a funeral tonight. Death and weddings are big business for the church.


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## sealybobo (Sep 12, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity has distorted the true gospel more than all other sources on earth combined;    and the world is totally unaware of this.
> 
> A stunning deception.


What is the true gospel? It's ancient writings from some holy men thousands of years ago.

Be honest. No one knows how we got here or what happens when we die. It's why we separate church and state


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## foggedinn (Sep 12, 2016)

Self righteous, judgemental, egotistical, sinners.
 When the church learns to deal with that man of sin, the Son of Perdition, I believe most if your objections to Christianity will be resolved.


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

sealybobo said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity has distorted the true gospel more than all other sources on earth combined;    and the world is totally unaware of this.
> ...



I have studied most of all the knowledge mankind  has stored on how we got here ;  the theories and speculation of both sciences and religions;  in my view , the God-creation theory has my vote as the most reasonable explanation out there, which my consciousness can accept.

But I understand that we can only be conscious of , those things we are conscious of. I consider it impossible for any human to be conscious of God in perfect confidence of a truth so  profound as he must be if he exist. And I think those humans who had a large faith in the truth of God's existence, must have had some kind of help believing so strongly - from God himself. Faith is confident belief in an extra ordinary truth.

I don't have faith; I believe from the available information that we have, as I showed in " Is God Real?"

Is God Real?


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## Mickiel (Sep 12, 2016)

One reason why I cannot be Christian , is because I disagree with them so much. I cannot be in any religion , because I disagree with them all. In example ,many Christians actually believe the earth is about 7,000 years old , because of how they misinterpret the bible. The earth is about 4.5 million years old, the universe around 13.7 million years old ,some theories have these even much more older. I can't agree with that 7,000 years old nonsense, archaeology won't allow me. The religious mindset is totally off its rocker.


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## sealybobo (Sep 12, 2016)

foggedinn said:


> Self righteous, judgemental, egotistical, sinners.
> When the church learns to deal with that man of sin, the Son of Perdition, I believe most if your objections to Christianity will be resolved.


I think most people just want to do what's right. They are just going about it wrong. There are too many pros and cons to go into but they need


Mickiel said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


I think we made it up. God, heaven. It smells like wishful thinking and organized religions were all started by con men and accepted by gullible people of often forced on us


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## Mickiel (Sep 13, 2016)

sealybobo said:


> foggedinn said:
> 
> 
> > Self righteous, judgemental, egotistical, sinners.
> ...




Religion was started by men , but spirituality was started by God.


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## Mickiel (Sep 14, 2016)

Evil, Satan, sin, anti-christ


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## foggedinn (Sep 14, 2016)

Why do people still claim that Judas is the Son of Perdition? Has no one else read 2 Thess 2?
 As Jesus is the Lamb, that Man of Sin is the scapegoat. (Ref. Leviticus 16 )


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## Mickiel (Sep 15, 2016)

Christianity is far more dangerous than Atheism because they are hell mongers ;  they want God to hurt unbelievers forever.


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## Mickiel (Sep 18, 2016)

Which came first , the Christian or the Atheist?


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## Mickiel (Sep 19, 2016)

Look at Pergamos ,a real church of God in Rev. 2:12-13, Jesus said satan "Has a seat in his church." Look at it yourself , he said satan "Dwells in his church."

Hey , this is Jesus speaking ; you think satans seat is gone? Please ;wake up.


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## Mickiel (Sep 22, 2016)

Look at the public and political sway Christianity has ;

no one could imagine they are wrong about so many things.

Its "The darkness" ,  Jesus once asked ; " How great is the darkness?"


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## Mickiel (Sep 23, 2016)

satan knows just what he is doing , he seduced all of Christianity with a brilliant  blindness ;standing in the place of a god ,  appearing as a being of light ,  he has masterfully introduced powerful religious deceptions ;  all 2.2 billion Christians are deceived and are totally unaware of it.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Again and again ,Rev. 12:9" And the GREAT dragon was cast out, that OLD serpent , called the devil and satan, which "Deceived the WHOLE WORLD!"

The whole world is deceived! Their are no exceptions! Me , you  ,everybody! This serpent ; this being ; is old, and I am not totally sure what the bible means by calling  this thing "Old."  On God's throne there are " 24 beings that are with him there" ,they are called "Elders", which  insinuates  they are perhaps old as well.

Listen ,satan CANNOT  fool us all , trick our minds , affect our total belief system , unless God himself is involved. I will go to my grave believing that. The whole world has been fooled, I believe NOTHING on such a dynamic scale can happen , unless God WANTS it to happen. And I believe that a giant religion is the perfect tool for BOTH God and satan to engage in this incredible world wide influence of power.

Use an influence that the whole world believes, a message that is broadcast nearly everywhere, using the BIBLE as their tool.

Use a people ,a giant group of believers; an " Empire!"

Like the Babylonian empire.


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## Weatherman2020 (Sep 24, 2016)

Democide: the murder of citizens by their government.
Godless government have quite a track record just in the past century.


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> satan knows just what he is doing , he seduced all of Christianity with a brilliant  blindness ;standing in the place of a god ,  appearing as a being of light ,  he has masterfully introduced powerful religious deceptions ;  all 2.2 billion Christians are deceived and are totally unaware of it.



A reflection from Ecclesiastes 3:

I have considered the task that God has appointed
for the sons of men to be busied about.
He has made everything appropriate to its time,
and has put the timeless into their hearts,
*without man’s ever discovering,*
*from beginning to end, the work which God has done.*

Perhaps Christians are not deceived.  Perhaps you haven't yet discovered the work God is doing.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > satan knows just what he is doing , he seduced all of Christianity with a brilliant  blindness ;standing in the place of a god ,  appearing as a being of light ,  he has masterfully introduced powerful religious deceptions ;  all 2.2 billion Christians are deceived and are totally unaware of it.
> ...




Perhaps. One thing is sure , we shall see. I hope God allows me to live to see Christianity humbled and knocked off its empire.

This is the work I see God doing ;  again this is not a word from Christians, its God speaking for himself; notice this most enigmatic being ; Isaiah 45:7 " I form the light , and create darkness ; I make peace and create evil ; I the Lord do all these things."

See Christianity cannot see this about God , because they really don't know how God is. Some of the things God does are terrifying! And absolutely nobody can do anything about this. God created the devil to do HIS will! This thing ,this dragon is under Gods control. He deceived the world , because God ordered him to. Isaiah 54:16,again God speaking ,not Christianity ; " Behold I created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire ",then latter part of verse ,"I have created the waster ,(  or satan ), to destroy!" God had Jesus create this thing to systematically destroy humanity. To tear our consciousness up.

This is the work I see God doing. Notice Ecclesiastes 7:13 , Consider the WORK of God : for who can make straight what he has made crooked?" Do you see that ? The work of God is to bend religion, to make humanity crooked.  But WHY?

Romans 11:32 ,"  For God has shut them ALL in unbelief ,so that he can show mercy to THEM ALL!"

That's it right there! THATS the work of God!


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




I see it a bit differently.  Let's use the gardener as an analogy.  The gardener goes out and creates chaos in the ecosystem, plowing through ant hills, worms, uprooting plants, etc.  not because he hates the ecosystem but because he envisions something greater than what is.   Sometimes plants are razed close to the ground, not because the plant is hated, but because it is loved, and such adversity is what ends in it becoming even more beautiful.  

It is true than humans do not know all that God is doing.  What we can trust is that all He does, or allows, He does because He can handle all the fall-out, or out of love.  There is an underside for every upper side.  

Is your hope to see Christianity demolished your will or God's will?  Christianity was founded on several principles:   The first, God loves us.  The second, we encounter true freedom and true knowledge of God by discerning the will of God and following it (obedience).  When we miss the mark (sin/fail) forgiveness is ours when we turn from our sin/failure to do God's will, and strive instead to do what is right.  

To hope that people fail to do the will of God, to miss out on God's great love for us even when we don't understand the disruption new creation entails, is to hate the people of God.  God calls us not to hate our fellow man, or people of different faiths, but to love.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Meriweather said:
> ...




In my belief and view ,all of humanity is saved ;none of us will be lost to the hell Christians preach. That is love in my view ,where no sheep is left behind. The teachings of Christianity will be destroyed , the people will be saved ;the last will be put first ,and those in humanity who TOOK first place will be last. Matt. 19:30 ,Jesus teaching , not Christianity. The last of humanity will be introduced to God first. They will be called first. All the people thought of as unbelievers and Atheist ;  all the wicked and weak people ;  you know , all the people that Christianity  brushed off as doomed and worthless.


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> In my belief and view ,all of humanity is saved ;none of us will be lost to the hell Christians preach. That is love in my view ,where no sheep is left behind. The teachings of Christianity will be destroyed , the people will be saved ;the last will be put first ,and those in humanity who TOOK first place will be last. Matt. 19:30 ,Jesus teaching , not Christianity. The last of humanity will be introduced to God first. They will be called first. All the people thought of as unbelievers and Atheist ;  all the wicked and weak people ;  you know , all the people that Christianity  brushed off as doomed and worthless.



Nothing wrong with being a Universalist.  Jesus also spoke of hell.  The largest Christian denominations teach that God sends no one to hell--but there are people who choose that existence--i.e. an eternity without God.  God forces no one into His presence or out of His presence.  That is the choice each individual makes.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > In my belief and view ,all of humanity is saved ;none of us will be lost to the hell Christians preach. That is love in my view ,where no sheep is left behind. The teachings of Christianity will be destroyed , the people will be saved ;the last will be put first ,and those in humanity who TOOK first place will be last. Matt. 19:30 ,Jesus teaching , not Christianity. The last of humanity will be introduced to God first. They will be called first. All the people thought of as unbelievers and Atheist ;  all the wicked and weak people ;  you know , all the people that Christianity  brushed off as doomed and worthless.
> ...




You stated "The largest Christian denominations teach God sends no one to hell", I dispute and disagree with that ;its a false statement in my view ; I request that you prove that ,if you would be so kind.

The Seventh Day Adventist are the 5th largest Christian group , they do not teach hell, as far as I know; and even they are only 17 million members.


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## PK1 (Sep 24, 2016)

Although i agree with thread's title, i believe "strong atheism" is intellectually    weak compared to agnosticism, which itself is philosophically weak compared to *ignosticism*.
.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

PK1 said:


> Although i agree with thread's title, i believe "strong atheism" is intellectually    weak compared to agnosticism, which itself is philosophically weak compared to *ignosticism*.
> .




I disagree. I do not view Atheist as intellectually weak , nor do I view Atheism or Agnostics as philosophically weak,( but I am not comparing this to other groups ,just those two ), I think they thirst for knowledge ,and search for wisdom.  They have a critical analysis of fundamental beliefs of others ;  if that is not philosophy , then what is?


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## PK1 (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> PK1 said:
> 
> 
> > Although i agree with thread's title, i believe "strong atheism" is intellectually    weak compared to agnosticism, which itself is philosophically weak compared to *ignosticism*.
> ...


A critical analysis would lead to ignosticism.


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> You stated "The largest Christian denominations teach God sends no one to hell", I dispute and disagree with that ;its a false statement in my view ; I request that you prove that ,if you would be so kind.
> 
> The Seventh Day Adventist are the 5th largest Christian group , they do not teach hell, as far as I know; and even they are only 17 million members.



I'm not that kind.  I'm telling you what the largest Christian denominations teach.  You are welcome to dispute and disagree, but I'm not going to do your research for you.  Keep in mind there is a difference between believing there is no hell--and believing people can choose separation from God (i.e., hell).


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > You stated "The largest Christian denominations teach God sends no one to hell", I dispute and disagree with that ;its a false statement in my view ; I request that you prove that ,if you would be so kind.
> ...




If I may translate your answer to my request: You can state with your mouth that the largest Christian denominations do not teach hell, or that God does not send people to hell, but you are not obligated to prove it. I say that is standard Christian evasion and deception. The real word of God suggests that its believers prove all things; I mean but we all know Christianity sets its own standards.

Allow me then to list the 5 largest Christian denominations , and ALL of them believe in hell;

Catholicism  --  1.2 billion members
Protestants   -- 800 million members
Eastern Orthodoxy  ---  300 million  members
Oriental Orthodoxy   --- 86 million members
Anglicanism   ---- 85  million members

 If you wish , you can add about 60% of the Christians in America who believe in hell. That number has declinded from a peak of about 90%.

May I question you further?


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> If I may translate your answer to my request: You can state with your mouth that the largest Christian denominations do not teach hell, or that God does not send people to hell, but you are not obligated to prove it. I say that is standard Christian evasion and deception. The real word of God suggests that its believers prove all things; I mean but we all know Christianity sets its own standards.
> 
> Allow me then to list the 5 largest Christian denominations , and ALL of them believe in hell;
> 
> ...



Re-read my last post.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > If I may translate your answer to my request: You can state with your mouth that the largest Christian denominations do not teach hell, or that God does not send people to hell, but you are not obligated to prove it. I say that is standard Christian evasion and deception. The real word of God suggests that its believers prove all things; I mean but we all know Christianity sets its own standards.
> ...




Allow me to say it is a pleasure to have speaks with a Christian , normally they avoid me , and I understand why. Your responses ,your words are becoming fewer and fewer ,like the life is being sucked out of them. But I know how it is. I have no more questions for you.

I mean ,for what?

What's the use in questioning a Christian? They are as evasive as mixing oil with water.


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Allow me to say it is a pleasure to have speaks with a Christian , normally they avoid me , and I understand why. Your responses ,your words are becoming fewer and fewer ,like the life is being sucked out of them. But I know how it is. I have no more questions for you.
> 
> I mean ,for what?
> 
> What's the use in questioning a Christian? They are as evasive as mixing oil with water.



In the meantime we're thinking, why talk when they clearly are not listening?  I've found if people are truly interested, then they want to do their own research at their own trusted sites.  Serious discussions about hell usually fall into three categories:

*1.  There is no hell--either the fiery kind or the eternal separation from God kind.  *These people are of the opinion no one can resist God and will become changed people and be good once they understand how good God is.  

*2.  There is a hell--an eternal separation of God kind of hell--but God sends no one there.*  People choose an existence without God.  

*3.  God sends people to hell, based on bad behavior and/or not being a member of the "right" faith or denomination.    

*


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Allow me to say it is a pleasure to have speaks with a Christian , normally they avoid me , and I understand why. Your responses ,your words are becoming fewer and fewer ,like the life is being sucked out of them. But I know how it is. I have no more questions for you.
> ...




One side of his mouth stated that the largest Christian churches do not believe in hell ,or that God sends people to hell ;  you provide the man  a list of the 5 largest Christian  churches in the world obviously believing different that he claims ;  it runs off his mind like water on a duck ;  he completely ignores that truth, yet he keeps talking like  he knows what he is talking about. And this is normal Christian behavior.

Good grief.


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


You really need to re-read my posts, from start to finish.  Carefully.  Or, better yet, just let it go.


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Meriweather said:
> ...




I admit ,its hard for me to read what Christians have to say ,  because I never trust what they say ; and never will.

Peace on your journey.


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## Meriweather (Sep 24, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I admit ,its hard for me to read what Christians have to say ,  because I never trust what they say ; and never will.


  And without trust, it is impossible to converse.  People are too apt to hear his/her own mind rather than to hear what was actually said (written).


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## Mickiel (Sep 24, 2016)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > I admit ,its hard for me to read what Christians have to say ,  because I never trust what they say ; and never will.
> ...




I have a habit of favoring what God has said, I find what he  has said is totally different than what Christianity is saying.


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## Mickiel (Sep 26, 2016)

Hey , Christianity cannot condemn people like me , people who refuse to be caught up in the grip of the Christian net. As if they own salvation. Notice with me :

Isaiah 53: 6 ," All we like sheep have gone astray, we all do our own thing ; and the Lord has laid on him the sin OF US ALL!"

Christianity cannot take any sin you commit off of Jesus back and use that sin to condemn you. The hell they preach is blasphemy.


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## Mickiel (Sep 27, 2016)

Isaiah 5:20 , Woe to those who call evil good.

 Christianity thinks its good.

This is a revolting  development.


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## Mickiel (Sep 28, 2016)

There is nothing more important to humanity than salvation; the complete total rehabilitation of all of humanity.  Christianity is trying to regress this great salvation , by teaching a limited salvation that is not all  inclusive! They preach a regressive gospel that is reducing the salvation of humanity.


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## Mickiel (Sep 29, 2016)

Christians have a weird habit of condemning people in seductive ways. They know the world is becoming more intolerant to their hell message and harsh judgments , so they are trying to " Soften their hell and condemnation message." Instead of eternal burning hell torture , now they have tried to change that to eternal separation form God. You know , sounds better. 

Instead of God sending you to hell , now you send yourself.

Instead of God deciding your salvation , you decide yourself ; effectively  dooming more people.

These are dangerous ways of thinking , dressed up in human light.


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## Mickiel (Sep 30, 2016)

You ever wonder why a thread in a religion section , putting down Christianity and giving more humanity to Atheism , is more popular?

Think about that.


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## tyroneweaver (Oct 1, 2016)

rdean said:


> Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.


You kill them every day by not giving them the message of salvation.


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## Mudda (Oct 1, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> You ever wonder why a thread in a religion section , putting down Christianity and giving more humanity to Atheism , is more popular?
> 
> Think about that.


Who are you talking to?


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## Mickiel (Oct 1, 2016)

Mudda said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > You ever wonder why a thread in a religion section , putting down Christianity and giving more humanity to Atheism , is more popular?
> ...




Well I am talking to any of the over 10,000 views on this thread ,  and people like yourself who read.

Now , are you suggesting anything here about the people who are reading?


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## Mickiel (Oct 2, 2016)

Remember Jesus came here to seek , and find and save those who are lost ; meaning Atheist . He came here not for the righteous  , but for the sinners , meaning unbelievers and again Atheist. Now keep that in mind as you read here what these Atheist are saying about Christians ;  then you can remove from your mind the absolute lie that God is using Christianity to convert others;

40 harmful effects of Christianity.

Would you use a people who are doing this to help someone?


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## Mickiel (Oct 2, 2016)

In John 3:16  "God SO LOVED THE WORLD!" Do you get that ;  God Loves this world and everyone in it! That is WHY we all are saved!

The Christians don't want that ; but they  just have absolutely nothing to do with it.

They are dangerous because they are trying to have something to do with the worlds salvation. Trying to limit it.


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## Mickiel (Oct 3, 2016)

Christians are more dangerous than Atheist ,because they can freely post at religious sites with free un noticed impunity.


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## Mickiel (Oct 4, 2016)

Christianity ;  The Trojan Horse of limited Atonement.

Planted in humanity to reek havoc on the good news.


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## social philosopher (Oct 4, 2016)

Atheism is not anti-religion. That actually means against religion in context. And while as an Atheist I am certainly against religion, that is not what atheism is. Atheism is, if you will, a disbelief in God or religion. It is an intellectual understanding that there is no deity. That there is no supernatural being and that the mythological nature of the philosophy surrounding such is both misleading and misinterpreted. Atheism is not a negative anti, but a positive acceptance of a non-contrived reality.

Religion is dangerous in that, for one, it is not true. And more so because people use it's tenets to make decisions in real life. People wonder why (largely speaking) what we are doing isn't really working. It isn't because the premise(s) used to draw conclusions are false.

While Islam is currently the most dangerous and demonstrative, in the final analysis, Christianity is just as bad.


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## Mickiel (Oct 5, 2016)

social philosopher said:


> Atheism is not anti-religion. That actually means against religion in context. And while as an Atheist I am certainly against religion, that is not what atheism is. Atheism is, if you will, a disbelief in God or religion. It is an intellectual understanding that there is no deity. That there is no supernatural being and that the mythological nature of the philosophy surrounding such is both misleading and misinterpreted. Atheism is not a negative anti, but a positive acceptance of a non-contrived reality.
> 
> Religion is dangerous in that, for one, it is not true. And more so because people use it's tenets to make decisions in real life. People wonder why (largely speaking) what we are doing isn't really working. It isn't because the premise(s) used to draw conclusions are false.
> 
> While Islam is currently the most dangerous and demonstrative, in the final analysis, Christianity is just as bad.




I disagree with Atheist that there is no God , but I agree that religion is dangerous; because it confuses the real story of God , and adds things to the  understanding of the bible that are not correct.


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## Avatar4321 (Oct 5, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



Wow. Where do you even begin with drivel like this? Atheism isn't a threat to humanity. This type of irrational thinking to argue for atheism, or any other ideology, on the other hand, is a huge threat to humanity.

You're atheists because you're supposed to be? That's seriously going to be your argument? So you are going to completely pretend we have no free agency and cannot choose what to believe? That's absurd, not to add you are begging the question.

And Christians think they are serving God but they are really serving Satan? You're an atheist for Pete's sake. How the heck can Christians really be serving Satan if neither he nor God exists???

And how can you say that speaking out against a Christ coming is no anti Christ? its one of the very definitions of anti Christ.

And how can anyone seriously agree or defend this nonsense? Its completely irrational.


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## Mickiel (Oct 5, 2016)

Avatar4321 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Its just not for you.


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## esthermoon (Oct 5, 2016)

Christianity and Atheism are both dangerous when they're infected with fanatism


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## Mickiel (Oct 5, 2016)

esthermoon said:


> Christianity and Atheism are both dangerous when they're infected with fanatism




I agree.  And both groups don't think it can happen to them on a large scale.

But large scales are the least seen by human ego.


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## Mickiel (Oct 6, 2016)

Avatar4321 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Why do Christians even bother to speak to me?

I don't get it??


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## Mickiel (Oct 7, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous  because the people are ripe for religious picking.


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## Mickiel (Oct 8, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous because they will distort your view of the bible ;  Atheist will not do that.


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## Mickiel (Oct 9, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous because it needs things to step on in order to life itself up. And unbelievers are the main thing it stomps on.


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## Mickiel (Oct 12, 2016)

When a religion can change one God , into three gods ;  its dangerous.


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## Mickiel (Oct 13, 2016)

Christianity thinks its more superior than the white race ;

how dare them.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

Christianity gets a pass from the world , and they condemn the world in return.


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## RWNJ (Oct 15, 2016)

rdean said:


> Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.


Atheists have murdered over one hundred million people, in the last century, and it's still going strong. They are currently killing Christians in several countries, right now. Every atrocity that has ever been committed was the result of those who reject God.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> rdean said:
> 
> 
> > Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.
> ...




Who has killed more humans ,God or Atheist?


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## RWNJ (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > rdean said:
> ...


Atheists, of course. Look it up. BTW. I assume you mean murdered.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...




No one has killed more humans than God. Starting from the days of Noah until now ,its not even close.


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## Divine Wind (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> No one has killed more humans than God. Starting from the days of Noah until now ,its not even close.


Disagreed, but go ahead and rant your hate.  Maybe you'll get this thread closed too. LOL


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## Divine Wind (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Who has killed more humans ,God or Atheist?


It'd have to be Atheist since they are human and it's humans that kill people.  Storms, volcanoes, gravity, that's all just chance.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

Divine.Wind said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > No one has killed more humans than God. Starting from the days of Noah until now ,its not even close.
> ...




The thread was a record run , like this one.


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## RWNJ (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


OK, smart ass. How many did God kill? You must first determine that, in order to have a valid argument. So...How many?


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...



I don't call you out of your name , I am requesting that same respect ; if its possible with you. In Rev.9:18 God kills a third of humanity ;  the world population now is around 7.4 billion, based on just that , God will kill at least 2.4 billion humans;

just on that number alone , God will have killed far more humans than all men combined.

Hello?


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## RWNJ (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


That is a future event. And everyone who dies will deserve to die. And I believe we were talking about murder anyway. The simple fact is that atheists have murdered far more people than Christians. Also, why are you arguing about how many God killed? I thought you didn't believe in Him. Rather silly, if you ask me.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...




What is more silly ,  is your assumption that I am not a believer. Oh I believe in God , Christ and the bible with all my heart ; I just don't believe in Christianity.

I know how God is really using Christianity , to confuse this world. To corrupt his word and the gospel. So I have no use for Christian opinion.


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## RWNJ (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


And you know this, how? And even the Devil believes in God. He can quote Scripture with the best of them. Satan has blinded you to Gods truth. If you really do believe in God, then you need to do some serious praying, and ask for his guidance. A belief in God, without believing that Jesus is the Son of God, is worthless. It's like a peanut butter sandwich without the peanut butter. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...




I believe Jesus is the Son of God , and you can't produce me saying otherwise. Your just misjudging me , as is common for Christians. You get off on judging people.


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## RWNJ (Oct 15, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


I was simply going by what you told me in your last reply. You said you believe in God and the Bible, yet you don't believe in Christianity.


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## Mickiel (Oct 15, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...




I don't believe in any religion. God is not a Christian, Jesus is not a Christian.  Believing in Christianity is not a requirement for salvation.


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## Mudda (Oct 16, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> I don't believe in any religion. God is not a Christian, Jesus is not a Christian.  Believing in Christianity is not a requirement for salvation.


When you get to hell, remember, don't pass Adolf the salt.


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## Mickiel (Oct 16, 2016)

The world is fooled by Christianity , but not me. They are not the generate of God.


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## RWNJ (Oct 16, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




Maybe it would help if you knew what Christianity is. It is a belief that Jesus is the Son of God. That He was born to a Virgin, had an Earthly ministry, was crucified and rose from the dead, to save us from sin.

It is also the belief that Jesus is the only way to make it to Heaven. We cannot earn our way. The only way is to renounce sin, repent, and ask Jesus to come into your heart and save you.

That's it, in a nut shell. What do you believe? How do you plan on meeting God someday?


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## Mickiel (Oct 16, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...




I know what Christianity is, its just a belief , like all other beliefs, it just has the most followers.  I agree with God , not Christians. In my view , God gets his way , not Christians. In Job 23:13" God is of one mind , and nobody can change that; what his soul desires , that he does!"

Well what does God desire? Because that is what he will do.

1 Tim. 2:3-4 , " For this is GOOD and ACCEPTABLE to God our Savior ,  who DESIRES that ALL men be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth."

This is what God desires ;  and what he desires , that he does.

THAT is what I believe , that ALL humans are saved! I do not believe what Christianity is teaching.


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## dani67 (Oct 16, 2016)

christianity= shiasm in islam
judaism= sunni moslem


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## RWNJ (Oct 16, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


What you refuse to believe is exactly what the Bible teaches. You said you believe in the Bible. If this were true, you would believe that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. I'll say it again. You lack understanding. Satan has blinded you to Gods truth. That truth is that He loved us so much, He sent His only Son to save us from eternal death and separation from God. I'll no longer reply to you, since it's obvious that you won't change your mind. Goodbye.


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## Mickiel (Oct 16, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
> ...



Peace on your journey.


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## Mickiel (Oct 19, 2016)

Don't you just get tired of religion and Christianity?

You just get tired of it.

How to Break Free from Organized Religion | Huffington Post


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## Mickiel (Oct 19, 2016)

Sin exist , evil exist , because God created it. Religions and Christianity are confused , because God wanted them confused.

Period!

Isaiah 45:7 , "I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create evil ; I the Lord  DO all these things."

Christians can't handle this truth.


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## Mickiel (Oct 20, 2016)

Christianity is white faced terrorist in holy garb who are systematically stealing the free salvation of the world and locking unbelievers up in their jail hell.


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## Mudda (Oct 20, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is white faced terrorist in holy garb who are systematically stealing the free salvation of the world and locking unbelievers up in their jail hell.


For you, we'll throw away the key.


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## Mickiel (Oct 20, 2016)

You would think IF God was working with Christianity , they would be working with all unbelievers ;

in my personal view God is NOT using anyone to bring salvation to humanity other than Jesus ;  he is NOT using men , women or churches ; not that I can see;

and not that Atheist can see either ;

6 Eye Opening Things Atheists Think About Christians |Misconceptions of Christians| Christian Stereotypes| Why Atheists Don't Like Christians|


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## Mickiel (Oct 22, 2016)

You can tell Christianity is not being used by God to help anyone's salvation but their own ,by the way they think about Atheist and unbelievers.


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## Mickiel (Oct 23, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> You can tell Christianity is not being used by God to help anyone's salvation but their own ,by the way they think about Atheist and unbelievers.




Look at the threads Christians are posting here; "  Are only Christians saved?" That is what they teach , its what they been taught ;  a selfish limited salvation.

 That's not how God is. Don't you believe that about God.


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## Mickiel (Oct 23, 2016)

Remember Christianity wants to put Atheism down , only to lift up their perverted view of God. They NEED humans under their feet in order to be "Spiritual."


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## Mickiel (Oct 24, 2016)

The Christian mindset is a total sweeping of their own consciousness into a preset pattern of thinking ;  they view themselves as right and they NEED to have " An enemy"  in order to fulfill their self righteous mission of being a holy example to the world.  Atheist fill that need in their minds. They need someone to crucify because they think the crucifixion of Christ gives them the right to crucify all unbelievers.

This thinking is far more dangerous than any perverted thinking on earth.


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## Mickiel (Oct 25, 2016)

Theism and Atheism are intertwined ; they really need each other. One created the other. I personally am not connected to either ; and hold absolutely no interest in becoming either one.  But the war they have with each other has influenced humanity for years.

In my personal view , God has used both groups  to spread confusion on this earth.

And that is exactly what has occurred.  And remember , nothing happens on this earth that God does not want to happen.  You need to really think about that. Trying to understand what God is doing ,  cannot be explained by any religion ; they are part of the confusion.


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## Mickiel (Oct 25, 2016)

Again Jesus teaching in Matt. 24: 5 " For MANY , ( Christianity is over 2.2 billion members),  shall come" In my name", ( Christ-tians), saying I am Christ,( the Christians teach that Jesus is Christ),  and DECEIVE MANY!"

There it is right there from Jesus own mouth. Who do you think " The many coming in Jesus name is?" How many religions do you know that are in  Christ name and teach that Jesus is the Christ? And can reach "Many?"

Its academic! Christianity!


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## Mickiel (Oct 26, 2016)

A religion is dangerous when its wrong , but it thinks its right , and its convincing the world to follow it.


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## Mickiel (Oct 27, 2016)

Hey , just look at how the Christians on this board are arguing for the condemnation of humans. They have a thing for it.  They MUST see unbelievers perishing. They will fight for it.

They long for it . They teach and preach for this condemnation.

And in my view, that is a very dangerous mindset for a religious person.


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## Mickiel (Oct 28, 2016)

Are Atheist the "Anti-Christ "  that the bible speaks of? In my view the Anti-Christ are believers in God who have misunderstood scripture and are teaching things that Christ does not agree with. These people are in the church ,not outside of it. And many of them are Christians.


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## ding (Oct 28, 2016)

This makes perfect sense now.  You are a concern troll.


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## Mickiel (Oct 28, 2016)

ding said:


> This makes perfect sense now.  You are a concern troll.




Why are you reading what a troll has to say? I do not insult you and call you personal names , but I have noticed that many Christians resort to doing that. That is dangerous behavior.


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## ding (Oct 28, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > This makes perfect sense now.  You are a concern troll.
> ...


It is not an insult if it is true.  Why are you reading what Christianity has to say?  Don't play games.  Your intent is to insult all Christians. It is your purpose here. 

Your play books is:

1. demoralize
2. destabilize
3. crisis
4. normalization


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## ding (Oct 28, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> A religion is dangerous when its wrong , but it thinks its right , and its convincing the world to follow it.


No other people has been a greater force for good in the history of mankind than Christians.


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## Mickiel (Oct 29, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > A religion is dangerous when its wrong , but it thinks its right , and its convincing the world to follow it.
> ...




Christianity then is a perfect choice to help confuse the world. Their heads are so messed up , that they cannot see themselves being used to deceive the whole world. They are a great force. Rev. 12:9, satan deceived a whole world by using the world and using religion ; especially the largest religion.


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## xyz (Oct 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> The Christian mindset is a total sweeping of their own consciousness into a preset pattern of thinking ;  they view themselves as right and they NEED to have " An enemy"  in order to fulfill their self righteous mission of being a holy example to the world.  Atheist fill that need in their minds. They need someone to crucify because they think the crucifixion of Christ gives them the right to crucify all unbelievers.
> 
> This thinking is far more dangerous than any perverted thinking on earth.


I am aware of non-believers being crucified in South America during colonialism, and of abuses of children by priests. 

Not that I'm a big fan of Catholicism, but I do respect the current Pope, and he condemns those things. Plus not all Christians are Catholics.

Also:

League of Militant Atheists - Wikipedia


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## Mickiel (Oct 29, 2016)

[QUOTE=". Plus not all Christians are Catholics.

Also:

League of Militant Atheists - Wikipedia[/QUOTE]

Do you see All Catholics as Christians?


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## Correll (Oct 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so.....




Here is where I stopped reading.

THAT IS ONE OF THE DUMBEST THINGS I have ever read.




"Mr. Madison, what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."


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## Mickiel (Oct 29, 2016)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so.....
> ...




Welcome to thread , see how it grows.


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## ding (Oct 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


The History of Western Civilization says otherwise.  The History of Islam?  Not so much.


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## Mickiel (Oct 29, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...




The whole world has been deceived ; obviously the deception is not something the average person can figure out ; its something the average believer cannot see. Its a mainstream religious deception.


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## ding (Oct 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> The whole world has been deceived ; obviously the deception is not something the average person can figure out ; its something the average believer cannot see. Its a mainstream religious deception.


The Word of God tells us that successful behaviors are His way and that they naturally lead to success.  It also tells us that failed behaviors, which are not God's way, leads to failure.  As it is Western Civilization, which was built on the foundation of Christianity, that has led to the greatest good in the history of mankind for mankind, it is clear that they were indeed following His way.  Despite what you may believe about Christians and Christianity, it was their work which allowed you to disparage them.  For if it were not for their work, the Book that you hold so dear, would not include the New Testament for it was Christians who made sure that God's Word was recorded in it.


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## Mickiel (Oct 29, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > The whole world has been deceived ; obviously the deception is not something the average person can figure out ; its something the average believer cannot see. Its a mainstream religious deception.
> ...




Why do you keep posting on my threads?


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## ding (Oct 29, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Why do you keep posting on my threads?


To correct your errors.


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## Mickiel (Oct 29, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Why do you keep posting on my threads?
> ...




You are welcome for whatever reasons you pretend.

I hold no need to follow you around and correct your errors.

Christians feel like they are the spiritual policemen of the world, another reason they are so dangerous.


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## xyz (Oct 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> [QUOTE=". Plus not all Christians are Catholics.
> 
> Also:
> 
> League of Militant Atheists - Wikipedia



Do you see All Catholics as Christians?[/QUOTE]

No, but you seem to according to the post I was answering.

Look, I agree that there have been lots of crazy Christians, also that the Crusaders, as well as some newer groups like the Westboro Baptist Church have some ideas like radical fundamentalist Islamists, that they will go to Heaven immediately if they kill in the name of Jesus.

Doesn't mean all Christians do.


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

xyz said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > [QUOTE=". Plus not all Christians are Catholics.
> ...



No, but you seem to according to the post I was answering.

Look, I agree that there have been lots of crazy Christians, also that the Crusaders, as well as some newer groups like the Westboro Baptist Church have some ideas like radical fundamentalist Islamists, that they will go to Heaven immediately if they kill in the name of Jesus.

Doesn't mean all Christians do.[/QUOTE]


I  agree , but there are things common to Christianity that they all do , or at least most of them do. If I may give a partial list ;  they all ;

Tithe
Believe in a Trinity
Believe Adam "Fell."
Believe that satan created evil and sin instead of God
Believe that God speaks to them
Believe they have Gods spirit now
Believe the Kingdom is here now
Celebrate Christmas and Easter
Are heavily influenced by paganism
believe in limited Atonement
Believe in eternal punishing or eternal separation from God
believe in an unpardonable sin
believe that satan is Lucifer and that he " was once good and went bad"
that the bible is errorless
that the world is 7,000 years old
that Adam was the first man
that Christianity is a church of God in good standing

The list is much longer, but I contend that Christianity is totally deceived in all these areas and more! And has spread this stuff all over the world.

That Jesus is God
that salvation is up to human will, instead of God's will
That Christians wrote and own the bible
 That God is locked into some battle with satan for the world ( if that were true satan is winning hands down; but its not true)

The seduction of the Christian mind is so well done ,  any Christian can read this , and they cannot  , will not relate to it or understand it.

Because their not supposed to.


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## xyz (Oct 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> believe in an unpardonable sin


Definitely there is a belief that many consider the existence of a sin which has little to do with actual behavior, I'm not that well versed but I've heard/read about it.


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

xyz said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > believe in an unpardonable sin
> ...




Well many Christians think the unpardonable sin will not be forgiven- ever! I disagree with that , it only means in this life , then the next to come , but not in eternity. There will be no sin in God's eternity. We really don't know what the unpardonable sin  really is; people are just guessing at it. You must bear in mind that the Christian consciousness - when it sees judgmental things , or a chance to condemn others , they are conditioned to be harsh , they will always see condemnation.


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## ding (Oct 30, 2016)

Christianity more dangerous than Atheism?  The question should be is Christianity more dangerous than Militant Atheism?  Nothing is more dangerous than Militant Atheism.


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

ding said:


> Christianity more dangerous than Atheism?  The question should be is Christianity more dangerous than Militant Atheism?  Nothing is more dangerous than Militant Atheism.




Nothing is more dangerous than the Christian teaching of eternal hell punishing ; its not even close. To keep a human alive and punish them for 900,000, then 786,999 more years, then continue it for another million years , then another trillion years , then tell the human that this insanity will never ever end;

NOTHING is more dangerous than that.


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## ding (Oct 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity more dangerous than Atheism?  The question should be is Christianity more dangerous than Militant Atheism?  Nothing is more dangerous than Militant Atheism.
> ...


I don't care if you believe what I wrote.  I'm not trying to convince you.  Believe whatever you want.


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...




Remember that under the Christian doctrine of eternal hell ,the unbeliever must suffer for eternity ;  in mathematical terms that's ;

123,897,999 years plus
765,979,000 years plus
111,121,333 years plus
999,888,777,666,555,444,333,222, years plus on into infinity.

Now ,what is truly insane ,is the Christians don't see this as insane. They think its just fine.//?///

What's wrong with them?


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## ding (Oct 30, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Why are you trying to convince me.  I'm fine with you believing anything you want.  Who are you trying to convince?


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

Look close at  Christianity, Babylon the Great ;Mother of all Harlots;  perverting more of God's principals than any other religion.

Open your eyes to scripture, no other religion fits this like Christianity ; study; search.


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## RWNJ (Oct 30, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...


People like him are trying to convince themselves, or are deliberately spreading false information, for their own evil purposes. Everyone is born with an awareness of the Creator. But some would rather die than admit that they are not worthy of Heaven, without the atoning sacrifice of Christ, Our Lord and Savior. The Heavens declare the glory of God. I'm convinced that there is not a single human who is not aware of God. There is no such thing as an atheist. Only those who have seen Gods truth and rejected it out of sinful pride. There will be no excuses on Judgement Day.


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




Translation; We Christians are going to see most of created humanity punished and tortured with no excuses ;  there will be no forgiveness , no mercy , no grace ,no divine pardon for any one except us righteous Christians.

No excuses , no getting off the hook ,  no escape;

God is going to hurt you worthless sinners every day for all of eternity.

I am glad to announce that we are not in the hands of these self righteous  religious monsters.


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## Mickiel (Oct 30, 2016)

Look at Rev. 18: 1-3, its describing Babylon the GREAT , or Christianity ;  its the GREAT Christian church that has become the habitation of devils and all kinds of unclean doctrines.  ALL nations have drunk her wine ; only Christianity can fill that slot.

Think about it.


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## Mickiel (Oct 31, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Look at Rev. 18: 1-3, its describing Babylon the GREAT , or Christianity ;  its the GREAT Christian church that has become the habitation of devils and all kinds of unclean doctrines.  ALL nations have drunk her wine ; only Christianity can fill that slot.
> 
> Think about it.





The illusion is its satan " Appearing as god!" The devil leading a large church , without that church knowing it. Its brilliant! A stunning display of deceptive power!


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## Mickiel (Oct 31, 2016)

Join me and the Lady Atheist in a look at Christianity;

Lady Atheist: The Selfishness of Christianity


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## Mickiel (Nov 1, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Join me and the Lady Atheist in a look at Christianity;
> 
> Lady Atheist: The Selfishness of Christianity




Christians don't know how to help people who are Atheist. The whole Christian doctrine of evangelism is faulty ,as usual its deceived.  Christians think salvation is based on humans "Saving other humans". Or witnessing and converting others. So they TAKE credit even for the conversion of others. Salvation has absolutely nothing to do with a believer converting another unbeliever. Only God can draw a human heart ,John 6:44, but Christianity has put themselves in the place of God and totally perverted the truth about conversion.


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## Mickiel (Nov 2, 2016)

Christianity is WAY more dangerous than Atheism, because they have satan in their mist. Crawled up into Christianity like a tick on a dog ; well hidden and established. When you face Christianity , you face satan dressed up to appear like God.

That my friend , is dangerous!


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## ding (Nov 2, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


You should avoid me.  I'm a godless Catholic.


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## Mickiel (Nov 2, 2016)

What is one of the most dangerous things in scripture?

Think with me!

A church of God in rebellion.


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## Mickiel (Nov 3, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous because they " Assume they are not dangerous." They are actually deceived , but don't know their deceived ; their wrong about so much , but " Don't KNOW they are wrong." So their spreading lies and don't know it. Their causing confusion and don't even know it.

That's like having someone killing you , but they don't know they are killing you ; their not even aware they are killing you. I would rather be killed by someone who knows they are killing me. I mean at least "know the evil that you do."

Their teaching the people that Christmas and Easter is just fine with God, but God hates those things. Their teaching the Trinity is just fine with Christ , and Christ hates that doctrine.


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## Mickiel (Nov 3, 2016)

Christianity is dangerous because they think only Christians can pray.


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## Mickiel (Nov 4, 2016)

Hey ,notice with me , "Sixteen Small Stones";

Interesting Statistics Contrasting Atheism and Christianity


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## ding (Nov 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> What is one of the most dangerous things in scripture?
> 
> Think with me!
> 
> A church of God in rebellion.


We are all rebels.  Just because Christ defeated death doesn't change that fact.


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## Mickiel (Nov 4, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > What is one of the most dangerous things in scripture?
> ...



The church of God in rebellion are the most dangerous humans on earth ;  This is symbolized by  several examples in scripture , such as the church of God symbolized by the church  of God at Pergamos in Rev. 2:12-15 , satan is actually IN this church of God and they are actively doing things that Jesus Hates! Their doctrines or teachings are things Jesus HATES! So here we have a church of God that satan has gotten into and their teaching things Jesus hates ;  but they don't know it! These are dangerous people.

The "Laodicean church" of God is even worse ; this spirit , described in Rev. 3:14-20 more people of God , worshippers of God , a true church of God ,  but they are still blind , don't know their deceived , and Jesus still is not IN the church, vs. 20.ous people.

And in my view Christianity is a church of God deceived and in rebellion. Very dangerous humans.


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## ding (Nov 4, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Yeah, no.  I didn't see that distinction being made in the Bible, nor I have I observed it in my time on earth.  But if you want to believe that you are not one of the rebels, please do.


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## Mudda (Nov 4, 2016)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...


Mickey the tard found someone to play with. Cute.


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## ding (Nov 4, 2016)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Tard?  Really?


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## Mickiel (Nov 4, 2016)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




Welcome to thread , see how it grows.


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## Mickiel (Nov 5, 2016)

Christians are way more fake that Atheist.


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## Mickiel (Nov 5, 2016)

Religions become dangerous when they get inbetween you and God.


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## JohnPrewett (Nov 6, 2016)

“Put it all together and the situation is as clear as can be: 
*paedophilia and Satanism are the cement that hold the establishment control structure together in every country,* 
and these ‘national’ networks connect together to form a global network of paedophiles and Satanists 
all watching each others’ backs …..”  

JIMMY SAVILLE AND THE 9TH CIRCLE


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## Votto (Nov 6, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



Being a Christian should be so dangerous, people should want to nail you to a cross!


If not, maybe you are doing it wrong.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Votto said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...


Creating should be so much fun, that we should be told to take a day off.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


> Votto said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


So god literally had to take a day off but the story of Genesis didn't really happen? How does that work?


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Votto said:
> ...


The account of Genesis is allegorical. God did not magically create the universe in one step. He set the rules of nature and let nature take its course. You cannot dispute that the laws of nature are such that at the moment space and time came into existence, beings that know and create were pre-destined to eventually arise. Here is the proof you have been looking for. Maybe one day, you will realize that the exact moment you lost this argument was when you admitted that tangible items could be used as evidence. The reality is that the Bible correctly explains that the universe had a beginning and was created in steps. Science tells us that the universe did have a beginning and what we see today is a result of the evolution of matter and was a process that was done in steps. Subatomic particles evolved into hydrogen and helium. Hydrogen and helium formed cosmic structures. Supernovas created the other elements. Chemical evolution created all the compounds. Life mad the leap from inorganic matter to organic matter. Life made the leap from single cells to multi cells and to eventually beings that know and create. The laws of nature came into existence at the time space and time were created. Those laws predestined that beings that know and create would eventually arise. Check mate.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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"You cannot dispute that the laws of nature are such that at the moment space and time came into existence, beings that know and create were pre-destined to eventually arise." Other than hindsight, you have nothing, admit it.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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I have science that proves it.  What do you have that disproves it?


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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What scientific proof?


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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Science tells us that the universe did have a beginning and what we see today is a result of the evolution of matter and was a process that was done in steps. Subatomic particles evolved into hydrogen and helium. Hydrogen and helium formed cosmic structures. Supernovas created the other elements. Chemical evolution created all the compounds. Life mad the leap from inorganic matter to organic matter. Life made the leap from single cells to multi cells and to eventually beings that know and create. The laws of nature came into existence at the time space and time were created. Those laws predestined that beings that know and create would eventually arise.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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Let's suppose for a sec that this is true and provable, so your saying that aliens exist? Or did god make the laws so that only us humans and life on earth would exist in the entire universe?


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Woa, woa, woa... not so fast.  Do you have any scientific evidence that the universe did not have a beginning and that matter did not evolve from sub atomic particles, to hydrogen and helium, to cosmic structures, to all the elements that we see, to life and finally to beings that know and create?


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## hobelim (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


> The account of Genesis is allegorical. God did not magically create the universe in one step. He set the rules of nature and let nature take its course.




If the Genesis account is allegorical then it is not about the creation of the universe, solar system, the earth, sky, plants animals or the first human beings. How could it be? They knew nothing about the beginning of the universe or the origin of anything.

You are trying to prove true what the story is not about. Mudda is trying to prove false what the story is not about.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

hobelim said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > The account of Genesis is allegorical. God did not magically create the universe in one step. He set the rules of nature and let nature take its course.
> ...


No.  I am discussing Creation.  Creation is everything in the universe from inception to now.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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It's like saying "well, the universe from the beginning of time was predisposed to make the Cubs win the World Series this year. Easy to claim after it's all happened, that's all I'm saying.
So your saying that aliens exist? Or did god make the laws so that only us humans and life on earth would exist in the entire universe?


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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I know that is all you are saying.  You have also said you were agnostic and needed to find evidence of God's existence to believe in God.  Well... I have given it to you.  It is funny that you don't need any evidence to NOT believe in God, isn't it?


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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Not to believe in something that has no proof is logical. You have given absolutely zero solid proof.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


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lol, I'm pretty happy how this has played out.  Trust me.  People are laughing at you.  I'm having a good time making you look foolish.  I have never seen someone take the beatings you have and still come back for more.  Bravo.  Bravo.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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You're repeating yourself again, got alzheimer's or something similar? Let me remind you, your theory about the Big Bang shows that aliens must exist.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Not in this thread I didn't, lol.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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Catholics think that humans were the only intelligent beings made by god. We're special... So I already knew your position, which contradicts your own theory, lol.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Lashing out again, I see.  A sure sign that the ego needs to be paid for taking the beating I administered to you today.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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How Christian of you. You learn your obnoxious behaviour from Jesus?


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## Mickiel (Nov 6, 2016)

Christianity is more dangerous because they will claim they are the servants of God , then burn you at the stake,( or in their hell.).


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


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You don't believe Jesus existed.


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## Mudda (Nov 6, 2016)

ding said:


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Never said he didn't.


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## Mickiel (Nov 6, 2016)

Christians are dangerous because they are helping satan put doubt into this world concerning the precious promise of God. Their poisoning a world with their doctrines of demons.


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## ding (Nov 6, 2016)

Mudda said:


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You never said He did.


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## Mickiel (Nov 7, 2016)

In my personal view ,Christians lie more than Atheist ;

Study: White Evangelical Christians Are Paranoid, Delusional


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

ding said:


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Jesus possibly existed. In fact, reports say that several guys named Jesus were preaching in the same area at that time. But there's no proof that he did anything special, except get nailed to wood, maybe.


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## ding (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Thank yo for proving my point.  There are 24,000 manuscripts which say you are wrong.


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

ding said:


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The earliest fragment of your manuscripts is dated to several generations after the facts were said to have occurred. It's possible that events happened as described, but there's no proof yet.


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


> The earliest fragment of your manuscripts is dated to several generations after the facts were said to have occurred. It's possible that events happened as described, but there's no proof yet.




No, no person ever literally came out of their tomb after death.

If there is any truth to the story it was written in figurative language, the subjects not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used,  and is therefore about something else.

If you look and look and keep on looking for it, you will find it.

If you don't look any deeper,  you will find nothing.


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Mudda said:
> 
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> > The earliest fragment of your manuscripts is dated to several generations after the facts were said to have occurred. It's possible that events happened as described, but there's no proof yet.
> ...


Actually, a lot of people believe that a person actually did rise from the dead for real, as that's was the purpose of the story, to make people believe that jesus could do supernatural things...
You simply don't believe the stories of the bible, as it should be, but are so desperate to find god, that you make up new meanings for yourself to be able to wrap your head around all the nonsense.


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Even though the subject of the resurrection is still hotly debated even within Judaism, many of a more sober and rational mind understand that the subject of the resurrection was never about the resumption of a former existence after biological death but the elevation of the species into a higher sphere of intelligences, a new existence before biological death while still living in a physical body.


Jesus compared the pharisees to unmarked graves and whitewashed tombs. He renounced the beliefs and practices of the religion of his birth after three decades of life in the tomb and then bodily ascended in to heaven, day by day,  while still living on earth.

So yes, many believed that he actually rose from the dead and wrote about it because he actually did, just not in the way that fundamentalist wackos believe.


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


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If you would push your rationality all the way to the end, you'd toss out your bible. As I already stated "The earliest fragment of your manuscripts is dated to several generations after the facts were said to have occurred. It's possible that events happened as described, but there's no proof yet."


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Seriously? No proof?  There is overwhelming proof that the stories cannot be literally true, overwhelming evidence that the most dedicated and devout fundamentalist out there with even the largest and wealthiest congregations are just low life actors and lying frauds.

Why toss the Bible now? Have some fun! Think of the evil done, the blood shed, the lives destroyed by their lies?

Why not use it to pay those bastards back in their own coin?


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## irosie91 (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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I have never met an intelligent person who junked
scriptural writings----in general.     I have come across lots
of really stupid people who do-------some of the very stupid
JUNK all of the scriptural writings  NOT THEIR OWN----and
all but worship the same books that their parents liked. .  Those who junk them ALL are the very most moronic morons.    What does  "EARLIEST FRAGMENT"  got to do with anything?


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

irosie91 said:


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It means that the stories of the bible can't be proven to have even been written at the time the events were supposed to have happened. Making it all hearsay.


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


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Yes, you're right, there is proof that the flood never happened, for example, or that the world wasn't made in 6 days. I was more talking about things Jesus is said to have done.


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## irosie91 (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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so?     did someone tell you that  HERESAY is dirt?    You are a very confused person.   I will help----"HERESAY"  is evidence which may be introduced in court-----but cannot be
subjected to scrutiny in a given trial ---for several possible reasons.    Primarily because the actual witness to the event
is not available in the court-room at the time of the trial.     THUS ----even though it may be introduced----it cannot be used to PROVE anything in a trial.   Sometimes that judge just throws it out.     In fact,  sometimes judges based their decisions on heresay that they conclude is credible.   HOWEVER---the above fact is not THE POINT-----scriptural writings constitute almost all of what we have of ancient times.     Try to cope  "heresay" is not defined as "shit"


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

irosie91 said:


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In the case of the bible, hearsay means not proven, thus not yet credible. Ex: the flood never happened (among other things), geologists can tell you that. Making the rest of the book not credible.


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## irosie91 (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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wrong-----hearsay means  "cannot be challenged in court by cross examination of its SOURCE"      Not proven does not  mean not credible.    Lots of floods have happened-----we have had a few in the USA this year.    You have a serious vocabulary problem


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## Mudda (Nov 7, 2016)

irosie91 said:


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A worldwide flood lasting 40 days didn't happen. Ask a geologist.
The world wasn't made in 6 days. Ask an astrophysicist.
A woman wasn't made out of a man's rib. Ask a sane person.


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mudda said:


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Raising the dead, giving sight to the blind, turning water into wine, calming the storm, cleansing lepers, healing the paralyzed,  the multiplication of the loaves?

Every one of those so called miracles were actually included in the story as signs that God was with Jesus, and every single story can easily be interpreted in a rational way that conforms to reality which excludes the need for any unverifiable supernatural explanation.

When Jesus healed the blind man he wrote something on the ground,  put a paste of mud and spit in his eyes, then put his hand over that and asked the man what he saw. First the man saw trees, and after jesus told him to take a harder look he finally saw men. Obviously Jesus was teaching the man how to think rationally and interpret the figurative language used in scripture where trees are often symbolic of men.

It was a healing of perception,  not sight..

In the same way there are exactly seven miracles that act like seals placed on scripture which prevent people who do not think very deeply from comprehending what was written inside.

If you look and look and keep on looking you will find it, even if I don't spit in your eyes.

If you don't look, you will find nothing.


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## Mickiel (Nov 7, 2016)

Christians are more dangerous because they keep piling on lie after lie and think their helping the world.

And no one is putting them in check.


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christians are more dangerous because they keep piling on lie after lie and think their helping the world.
> 
> And no one is putting them in check.




Ahem....really?

It's clear to me that you don't seem to see anything at all beyond your own nose...


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## RWNJ (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > Christians are more dangerous because they keep piling on lie after lie and think their helping the world.
> ...


It seems to me that you are a clueless buffoon. Stop and think about how many Biblical Scholars disagree with you. If that doesn't clue you in, then you are beyond hope. Your suffering will be great in Hell.


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## Mickiel (Nov 7, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> hobelim said:
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This thread is not by any bible scholar , its by me. Its my work. There is no hell, you just want me to suffer ; that's why Christianity is dangerous ; they want and desire others to suffer. Yet they think its something wrong with you. Its arcane. Its demonic.


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## Mickiel (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > Christians are more dangerous because they keep piling on lie after lie and think their helping the world.
> ...




All I see is my thread and you on it.


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mickiel said:


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lol... like I said.....


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> hobelim said:
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How many? Let even one step forward and dispute with what is irrefutable.

The fact that you can't tell the difference between reality and fantasy or a fairy tale from a historical document or a blessing from a curse shows that you are already in hell.


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## Mickiel (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


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I reject your hell and the Christian hell.


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## hobelim (Nov 7, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> hobelim said:
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 And I reject your specious lie that everyone who ever lived will enjoy eternal life...

What then?


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## Mickiel (Nov 7, 2016)

hobelim said:


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Its not for you to accept or reject ; its not up to you; God is not asking humans for their permission or belief.

good thing he isn't.


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## Mickiel (Nov 8, 2016)

God has used Christianity to deceive the world , the world thinks he used Christianity to help it;

a stunning deception.


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## Mickiel (Nov 8, 2016)

The unspoken job of Christianity is to subtract sinners from salvation;  now they really can't do that , but they have convinced the world that they can. So they are a mental handicap to the motivation of the world ;

that makes them dangerous.


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## Mickiel (Nov 9, 2016)

I had a poster here insult me , and he was not even aware he did it. This is the danger we face in people now , they can mistreat you , but in their view its not mistreating you. They do things they are completely unaware of. Christianity is like that, they misinterpret the bible , but are completely unaware that they do. People are becoming severely selfish and lack responsibility, and its nothing anyone can do about it.

Its called "Deception."


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## Mickiel (Nov 9, 2016)

America has no official religion,  boy but you can't tell a Christian that. Because in their great pride they must be number one.


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## Mickiel (Nov 10, 2016)

Christianity puts the same two whores on the corner every year at this time ;  they pimp Christmas and Easter until they pump it dry and drain your purse. They beat these two whores to death every year and ram paganism down the throats of believers.

Are Holidays like Christmas and Easter  pagan or Christian?
ever learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.


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## Mickiel (Nov 11, 2016)

As I am in the process of exposing yet more lies from a Christian in another thread; you can catch a Christian lying , then they will tell more lies to hide their first one. Simple stuff they are used to getting away with every day.

I like catching them.


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## Dot Com (Nov 11, 2016)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is more dangerous because they will distort your view of the bible ;  Atheist will not do that.


Agreed

Friends request sent

Sent from my VS415PP using Tapatalk


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## Mickiel (Nov 11, 2016)

RWNJ said:


> Mickiel said:
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Nobody has killed more humans than God.


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## Mickiel (Nov 12, 2016)

One of these days believers will start realizing that Revelations 2nd and 3rd chapters is discussing what's going on with churches of God in deception. "Satan's seat" is IN these churches ,meaning the devil is doing and "Inside Job",  working from the inside out.

Meaning satan knows how to influence a church of God without them realizing it.


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## Mickiel (Nov 12, 2016)

Christianity is dangerous because they are believers in God who are not led by God. But they are convinced that they are led by God.

So Christian evangelism is really "The Blind Leading the Blind." People who think themselves converted , trying to convert a world.


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## Mickiel (Nov 13, 2016)

Even  the way most Christians view salvation is selfish ;

The Selfishness of Salvation | The Huffington Post


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## Mickiel (Mar 8, 2017)

Christianity is more dangerous than Islam , because they believe that they will judge the world themselves.


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## featherlite (Mar 8, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is dangerous because they are believers in God who are not led by God. But they are convinced that they are led by God.
> 
> So Christian evangelism is really "The Blind Leading the Blind." People who think themselves converted , trying to convert a world.



I think I need more coffee before tackling this but...you do realize you are proselytizing don't you?
Ive read you refer to "we" in regards to beliefs. What exactly do you follow...


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## emilynghiem (Mar 8, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is more dangerous than Islam , because they believe that they will judge the world themselves.



????
Mickiel 
Who has more power to put someone to death:
The Pope of the Catholic Church whose policies are PROLIFE, anti-war, anti-abortion, anti-death penalty.

Or the State of Texas that has sentenced more people to death
and executed more convicts and has LEGAL AUTHORITY to judge guilt or innocence
and whether life should be terminated as punishment for a capital crime.

WHICH "Christians" are you talking about?

Isn't it a function of whether such people operate as INDIVIDUALS
or operate as part of a collective church, cult or GOVERNMENT.

Now it's true that for the crimes threatening lives and safety every day
on the streets of America, these are caused by INDIVIDUALS. How many of them are Christian?

As for the organized traffickers of drugs and humans, that is not only infesting
American cities but Asia and other impoverished regions exploiting women and children especially,
HOW MANY OF THOSE DANGEROUS PEOPLE ARE CHRISTIAN?

Of the Jihadist genocide in the Middle East spilling into Europe and
terrorist attacks in Africa in addition to the tribal genocides in their history,
HOW MANY OF THAT IS CAUSED BY CHRISTIAN VS. JIHADIST OR ISLAMIC oppression.

NOTE: in the Middle East there are similar complaints that 
Jihadists are not law abiding Muslims but war mongering terrorists
as there are complaints that
Zionists and "post-millenial dispensationalist" cults are not law abiding Christians.

Are these Zionists that abuse scriptural authority
the "dangerous Christians" you are talking about?

What about the mass genocides going on in CHINA
is THAT being caused by CHRISTIANS?

Africa, Europe, what other mass killings and cult/terrorist threats
are you talking about that are so dangerous and caused by Christians?

When you put this in perspective with the wars and genocides
that humanity suffers, are you really saying the majority  is caused by Christians?


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## Mickiel (Mar 8, 2017)

featherlite said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is dangerous because they are believers in God who are not led by God. But they are convinced that they are led by God.
> ...




I don't drink coffee. I believe in  the salvation of all humans.


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## Mickiel (Mar 8, 2017)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is more dangerous than Islam , because they believe that they will judge the world themselves.
> ...




Christians pervert the word of God , that makes them worse than any sin on earth.


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## dani67 (Mar 8, 2017)

christianity=islam shiasm


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## JohnPrewett (Mar 8, 2017)

Title of this thread immediately takes a false path.   Before discussing it's alleged "danger" ... one would have to pin down what "Christianity" refers to. 

The NT revealed Christ is the only "Christ" believed in by the consensus of His followers.   

The only "sin" of the NT Christ boils down to  His making everyone else look so bad in comparison to Him.

Many just can't forgive Christ for that "sin" .... the "sin" of being uniquely sinless.


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## Mickiel (Mar 9, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Title of this thread immediately takes a false path.   Before discussing it's alleged "danger" ... one would have to pin down what "Christianity" refers to.
> 
> The NT revealed Christ is the only "Christ" believed in by the consensus of His followers.
> 
> ...




The  title of this thread cannot be seen by Christians because of their great pride; they think they are  no. 1 with God ;  they are a church in blind  rebellion to God;  they don't know they are in rebellion, and don't know how they have rebelled ,  which makes them dangerous.


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## Mickiel (Mar 9, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > Title of this thread immediately takes a false path.   Before discussing it's alleged "danger" ... one would have to pin down what "Christianity" refers to.
> ...




Now , Christianity is a church of God , in my view and understanding. I think they are the church of " Laodicea", in Rev.3: 14-22. A church infected with the prosperity spirit.  Verse 17 , They are increased with goods , money minded; and all messed up.


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## Mickiel (Mar 10, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > JohnPrewett said:
> ...



They are miserable , which means they are not telling the truth about themselves ; they are giving a false image ;  they think they are doing fine. Vs. 17 they are spiritually blind. Vs. 20 , Jesus is on the outside of this Christian church. These are dangerous believers. Because they don't know who they are.


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## Mickiel (Mar 11, 2017)

In Revelation 3:14-22 this was Christ message to  his church Laodicea but the " Timing" of the message is important;  its the final state of apostasy at the end of the church age . It reveals the place and the attitude of Christ. It shows Jesus positioned on the outside of his church .His church is still deceived in the end , this version of it. This version is not to be confused with the " Coming first fruits of God", God himself calls out these people, and they are unlike any of his prior churches.


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## ding (Mar 11, 2017)

There is nothing more dangerous to liberty and freedom than militant atheism.


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## Mickiel (Mar 11, 2017)

Christianity promotes a punishing fear mongering hell ;  one of their favorite gospel side dishes. This bankrupts common sense.


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## ding (Mar 11, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity promotes a punishing fear mongering hell ;  one of their favorite gospel side dishes. This bankrupts common sense.


Christianity promotes the virtues of thankfulness, forgiveness, humility, chastity, temperance, charity, diligence, patience and kindness.


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## Mickiel (Mar 11, 2017)

Hell , the Trinity and the fall; Christianity's three headed monster.


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## ding (Mar 11, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Hell , the Trinity and the fall; Christianity's three headed monster.


Christianity created wonderful charities and organizations.


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## Mickiel (Mar 12, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Hell , the Trinity and the fall; Christianity's three headed monster.



Monsters don't help people


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## ding (Mar 12, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Hell , the Trinity and the fall; Christianity's three headed monster.
> ...


Christians and Christian institutions are usually the first source of literacy, education, and healthcare in the poorer regions.


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## Mickiel (Mar 13, 2017)

Christians condemn Atheist because that is their way , its in their hearts to do that. Total forgiveness requires a heart like God's.


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## ding (Mar 13, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christians condemn Atheist because that is their way , its in their hearts to do that. Total forgiveness requires a heart like God's.


Christians have been the source of abundant human services from hospitals, orphanages, nursing homes, and schools, to advocacy on behalf of those with no voice, to supporting cultural outreaches, and seeking always to find ways in which to protect and promote human life and its authentic flourishing.


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## Mickiel (Mar 15, 2017)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christians condemn Atheist because that is their way , its in their hearts to do that. Total forgiveness requires a heart like God's.
> ...



" Seeking to find ways to protect humanity while at the same time promoting everlasting unforgiveness with your hellish doctrines.


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## ding (Mar 15, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Christianity promotes the concept of subsidiarity.


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## Mickiel (Mar 17, 2017)

The  danger of Christianity is their deep self righteousness;  they think its right to condemn people.


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## ding (Mar 17, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> The  danger of Christianity is their deep self righteousness;  they think its right to condemn people.


Christianity has done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility.


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## Mickiel (Mar 17, 2017)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > The  danger of Christianity is their deep self righteousness;  they think its right to condemn people.
> ...



In Rev. 12:9 satan has deceived the whole world; he is using Christianity to teach the whole world a deceived gospel; the devil choose Christianity because of their ability to teach the world. A stunning combination of powerful deception!


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## ding (Mar 17, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Christianity teaches accountability and responsibility.


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## Mickiel (Mar 17, 2017)

Christianity " Teaches", that is the interest and tool of satan. He does not seek to stop them from teaching, only to continue  to influence their teaching , and do so unawares. His deception is Great and perfect , because Christianity continues to teach , and their teaching is deceived; mixed with right and wrong,  a deadly mixture of false and true knowledge , that is how satan operates;  from the inside out!  Like a giant Trojan horse that walks in the book of Revelation.


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## ding (Mar 17, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity " Teaches", that is the interest and tool of satan. He does not seek to stop them from teaching, only to continue  to influence their teaching , and do so unawares. His deception is Great and perfect , because Christianity continues to teach , and their teaching is deceived; mixed with right and wrong,  a deadly mixture of false and true knowledge , that is how satan operates;  from the inside out!  Like a giant Trojan horse that walks in the book of Revelation.


Christianity teaches that we have a choice in how we behave.


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## Mickiel (Mar 17, 2017)

Atheism does not threaten anyone's eternal life , Christianity always does.


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## ding (Mar 17, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Atheism does not threaten anyone's eternal life , Christianity always does.


Christianity teaches that actions have consequences.


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## Mickiel (Mar 18, 2017)

Atheist do not claim that God speaks to them . Christians do . A person who thinks he hears Gods voice , is dangerous;  they could kill in the name of God and think it is right.


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## ding (Mar 18, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Atheist do not claim that God speaks to them . Christians do . A person who thinks he hears Gods voice , is dangerous;  they could kill in the name of God and think it is right.


Christianity inspires a sense of wonder in nature and the universe.


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## Mickiel (Mar 18, 2017)

Christianity is dangerous because they simply don't know their dangerous. They don't know how much spiritual junk mail they deliver daily to the world! They are seriously infecting people by the millions.


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## ding (Mar 18, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is dangerous because they simply don't know their dangerous. They don't know how much spiritual junk mail they deliver daily to the world! They are seriously infecting people by the millions.


Christianity helps us feel connected to one another and to nature.


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## Mickiel (Mar 19, 2017)

Christians equate themselves with God.


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## ding (Mar 19, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christians equate themselves with God.


Christianity helps us feel less alone in the world.


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## MizMolly (Mar 19, 2017)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is dangerous because they simply don't know their dangerous. They don't know how much spiritual junk mail they deliver daily to the world! They are seriously infecting people by the millions.
> ...


You don't need religion to feel connected.


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## task0778 (Mar 19, 2017)

MizMolly said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Some people don't have or know any other way.   And don't want any other way either.   For those people Christianity helps them feel connected, and if for no other reason that makes Christianity a good thing.


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## Mickiel (Mar 20, 2017)

MizMolly said:


> ding said:
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> > Mickiel said:
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You sure don't!


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## Mickiel (Mar 20, 2017)

task0778 said:


> MizMolly said:
> 
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> > ding said:
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That's true , and I understand people not knowing any other way.


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## Mickiel (Mar 21, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> task0778 said:
> 
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> > MizMolly said:
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God bless them.


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## ding (Mar 21, 2017)

MizMolly said:


> ding said:
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> > Mickiel said:
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Yep, is that a reason to tear down religion?  Or to only see the bad and not the good?


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## ding (Mar 21, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> task0778 said:
> 
> 
> > MizMolly said:
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Your actions say otherwise.


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## Mickiel (Mar 21, 2017)

Christianity is a wolf in sheep's clothing ;  and they don't even know it.


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## ding (Mar 21, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is a wolf in sheep's clothing ;  and they don't even know it.


Christianity serves to bind the community together.


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## Mickiel (Mar 21, 2017)

Christianity wants sinners to die a thousand deaths.


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## ding (Mar 21, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity wants sinners to die a thousand deaths.


Christianity inspires love, peace and happiness.


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## Mickiel (Mar 22, 2017)

Christianity ruins a salvation breakfast;  they eliminate whole groups of humans from salvation. They are Kingdom stumbling blocks, merciless and vain.


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## ding (Mar 22, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity ruins a salvation breakfast;  they eliminate whole groups of humans from salvation. They are Kingdom stumbling blocks, merciless and vain.


Christianity serves to create traditions.


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## Mickiel (Mar 24, 2017)

Jesus said in vain do they worship me because of their traditions.


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## ding (Mar 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Jesus said in vain do they worship me because of their traditions.


Did Jesus say that?  Or did Isaiah say that?


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

Some Christians are also more dangerous than radical Islamists:

Christian Dominionism-The Real Threat to Our Secular Government

Christian Dominionism-The Real Threat to Our Secular Republic
Disclaimer: I strongly disavow the blanket condemnation of any religion what so ever. Religion has the enormous potential to bring out the best in humankind but can also be a catalyst for oppression and violence. Recognizing this dark side to religion, I do in fact condemn those who disrespect  the  Constitution and our  tradition of   a secular government free of the undue influence of relgion-that is what this thread is about. 

 Xenophobes, bigots and conspiracy neurotics are wringing their hands, and lamenting the rise of Islam in our country, which they claim will bring about the implementation of Sharia law.
However, whether out of ignorance or the belief that religious freedom and the first amendment does not apply equally to all religions, they fail to focus on the real threat to secularism.

We are talking about Christian Dominionism,


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## ding (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> Some Christians are also more dangerous than radical Islamists:
> 
> Christian Dominionism-The Real Threat to Our Secular Government
> 
> ...


Ok, is Christian Dominionism a coordinated movement?  Can you tell me what their agenda is?  What they are seeking?


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## RWNJ (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> Some Christians are also more dangerous than radical Islamists:
> 
> Christian Dominionism-The Real Threat to Our Secular Government
> 
> ...


What a load of BS. Christians do not want a government run by any religion. They simply want everyone involved in government to be able to govern according to their conscience or religious beliefs. No Christian I know wants a Theocracy. They simply want to be left alone. Unfortunately, the majority of the people, on this ball of mud we call home, can't do that. They are constantly persecuting Christians. Then, when Christians fight back, they are accused of all kinds of crap that just ain't so. They are called Islamophobes, homophobes, racists...the list goes on. Christians are the most persecuted people on the planet. This is a fact. And whenever we try to stand up and defend ourselves, we get the inevitable and predictable replies from the oh-so-tolerant-atheist-left.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

ding said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > Some Christians are also more dangerous than radical Islamists:
> ...



Well, if you follow the link, you will find lots of information about the agenda, explained much better than I can. I'm not an expert on this stuff, but I have reason to believe that these sources are credible. As to the question of how "coordinated" it is, you might want to review the rhetoric coming out of gatherings such as the values voter summit that was held recently. Look at the role that the radical religious right played in the last election and in shaping the Republican platform. I would say that it is very much a "movement"  and a dangerous one.


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## ding (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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I did follow the link and didn't find any of those answers.  I am wondering if you aren't making a mountain out of a mole hill.  I don't see a coordinated movement or an agenda.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

ding said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
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> > ding said:
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Well I don't know how to help you then. It's my belief that anyone who can't see what is in plain sight is  blind to the reality and doesn't want to believe it.


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## ding (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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You could help me by actually backing up your claim with facts.  For instance an example of an assertion would be:  I believe that socialism has always sought to subordinate religion.

I would back that up with facts like this:

*The Khmer Rouge abolished all religion *and dispersed minority groups, forbidding them to speak their languages or to practice their customs. These policies had been implemented in less severe forms for many years prior to the Khmer Rouge's taking power.

or this...

The Communist Party of China (CPC) is letting its members know that the party’s official adherence to militant atheism has not changed; Party members are not allowed to be Christians, or to hold any other religious beliefs. That is the clear message sent by a top Party official in an editorial published on November 14 in the Global Times, the international version of People’s Daily, the official newspaper and mouthpiece of the CPC.

The editorial, written by Zhou Weiqun, chairman of the Committee on Ethnic and Religious Affairs of the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference, blasted Chinese academics who suggest that Communist Party members can also adhere to any religion. This prohibition against religion has been a “consistently upheld principle” since Mao Zedong, the founder of the People’s Republic of China, declared Zhou. “It’s impossible to have another choice besides the dialectical materialist worldview.”


Now do you understand?  I would be more than happy to believe it if it were true.  I looked and could not find anything.  Surely you have something, right?  Because if you don't maybe you are the one who is blind to reality and seeing things you want to see rather than seeing things as they really are.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

ding said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
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The problem is here that you are talking about things that have already happened. I am talking about forces at work within our culture and even our government that want to make certain things happen. Maybe these additional links will help.

‘Welcome To The War’ – Jim Garlow’s New Book On ‘Biblical Applicationalism’ | Right Wing Watch

Cruz, Huckabee And Jindal Joining ‘Liberty’ Conference Promoting Christian Reconstruction And Biblical Patriarchy | Right Wing Watch

Christian Reconstructionism And The GOP: ‘Biblical Justice’ vs Social Justice | Right Wing Watch

Open your eyes!!  You are in denial. Either that, or you and others like you would support this very real agenda and think that you can convince others that it is just fake news or a hoax long enough for it to be to late to stop.

And, before you call this fake news, Right Wing Watch is a well established and credible source:



> Right Wing Watch is a project of *People For the American Way (PFAW) dedicated to monitoring and exposing the activities and rhetoric of right-wing activists and organizations in order to expose their extreme agenda. *Our researchers monitor dozens of broadcasts, emails and websites, and use their expertise on right-wing movements to analyze and distill that information for media, allies and the general public. By shedding light on the activities of the right-wing movement, we help expose the risks its extreme and intolerant agenda presents to our country. We do not endorse the views of groups that we report on.


 About | Right Wing Watch


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## ding (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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So I didn't see any organization which is trying to bring about a theocracy.  All I saw were people exercising their right of free speech.  Would you like to silence them?  Should we round them up and put them in camps?


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

ding said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
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Oh please! Now you are becoming annoying and I think you know it. I am not suggesting   that they should not  be allowed to express their views and certainly not that they be put in camps. That is just as stupid as stupid gets. This is America! I am simply documenting what these people would like to do a cautioning against being complacent. Again, you do not see what you do not want to see or acknowledge and that is your problem, and yours alone.


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## RWNJ (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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You need to use Quote/reply, so we know who you're talking to.


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## ding (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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Dude, I can't tell one way or another with you fanatics.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

RWNJ said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
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Who are YOU talking to ? If it's me , I most certainly did use quote reply


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

ding said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
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I'm a fanatic? You don't want to tell one way or another. You just want to live in your bubble of blissful ignorance.


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## RWNJ (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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Post #634. You did not use Quote/Reply. You can tell because there is no Quote for your Reply.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

RWNJ said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
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Sue me Bubba. 
But actually I did. Do you have some cognition problems?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RWNJ (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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Here is your post in it's entirety.

Oh please! Now you are becoming annoying and I think you know it. I am not suggesting that they should not be allowed to express their views and certainly not that they be put in camps. That is just as stupid as stupid gets. This is America! I am simply documenting what these people would like to do a cautioning against being complacent. Again, you do not see what you do not want to see or acknowledge and that is your problem, and yours alone.


























_True patriotism is progressivism. True patriotism is working to fix what is wrong with America instead of pretending that it is just high taxes, too much government and liberal policies. True Patriotism is working to make America the truly great country that it can be for all, not just the wealth, white, heterosexual males. I am the Progressive Patriot_

Now, show me where the quote is that you were replying to.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Mar 24, 2017)

RWNJ said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > RWNJ said:
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Oh Christ!! \



Ding said is 633:  So I didn't see any organization which is trying to bring about a theocracy. All I saw were people exercising their right of free speech. Would you like to silence them? Should we round them up and put them in camps?
Click to expand...


I quote replayed : Oh please! Now you are becoming annoying and I think you know it. I am not suggesting that they should not be allowed to express their views and certainly not that they be put in camps. That is just as stupid as stupid gets. This is America! I am simply documenting what these people would like to do a cautioning against being complacent. Again, you do not see what you do not want to see or acknowledge and that is your problem, and yours alone.

Now get the fuck out of my face!


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## RWNJ (Mar 24, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> RWNJ said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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Get out of your face? Now why would I want to do that? You are free to leave anytime you want. No one is forcing you to read my posts.


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## Mickiel (Mar 25, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> Some Christians are also more dangerous than radical Islamists:
> 
> Christian Dominionism-The Real Threat to Our Secular Government
> 
> ...




Well yes, you are correct. But trying to get Christians to understand this, is like digging a tick out of a dog; its ingrained in there to stay, and it hurts them too much if you pull the truth out of this. They must be bypassed with this reality and treated just like we would treat a blind person. They just don't get it ; and their not supposed to!


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## ding (Mar 25, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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Yes, you seem to be.


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## ding (Mar 25, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> TheProgressivePatriot said:
> 
> 
> > Some Christians are also more dangerous than radical Islamists:
> ...


You've are a fanatic too.  Just a different flavor.


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## Mickiel (Mar 25, 2017)

Christianity, the wolf that lost its bite.


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## Mickiel (Mar 26, 2017)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > TheProgressivePatriot said:
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And Christians are not fanatics?


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## ding (Mar 26, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Just the ones that behave like you do.  

Some are, most aren't.


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## Cellblock2429 (Mar 26, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



/---- Hitler was an atheist and it was Christians who stopped his slaughter so STFU you blithering idiot. And don't forget the atheists Stalin and Mao.


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## Joy4Uall (Mar 27, 2017)

Christianity removes people from reality (a talking snake, a talking donkey, a talking burning bush, a talking invisible dead guy who will magically let you survive your own death, etc.), so it's dangerous. Atheism does not remove people from reality.


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## ding (Mar 28, 2017)

Joy4Uall said:


> Christianity removes people from reality (a talking snake, a talking donkey, a talking burning bush, a talking invisible dead guy who will magically let you survive your own death, etc.), so it's dangerous. Atheism does not remove people from reality.


Reality is arrived at through objectivity.  Dying to self is how one becomes objective which is what Christianity teaches.


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## Mudda (Mar 28, 2017)

No atheist ever waged war in the name of no god. Ever.


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## ding (Mar 28, 2017)

Mudda said:


> No atheist ever waged war in the name of no god. Ever.


200 million people in the 20th century would disagree with you.


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## Mudda (Mar 28, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > No atheist ever waged war in the name of no god. Ever.
> ...


They didn't do it because they didn't believe in a god.


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## ding (Mar 28, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
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Sure they did.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...


Prove it.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
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Prove they didn't.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
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Ex: the people the Chinese killed in the Great March was religious related, the only "religious" people they target are Falun Gong, and they're more of an exercise group. So name someone who kill for lack of religion. As opposed to all the killing still going on in the name of a god.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
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I already told you this in post #654.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
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Ok, so you can't name anyone, got it.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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I did.  The atheistic nations of the 20th century.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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You still didn't name anyone. Just more fartsmoke.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
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Sure I did.  They murdered 200 million people in the 20th century.  Maybe you heard about it.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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"They"? Who the fuck is "They"?


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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People like you.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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> > ding said:
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So I once again exposed you for having nothing. This is fun.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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Is it?  Then why are upset?


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > So I once again exposed you for having nothing. This is fun.
> ...


Only in your backwards world would a grinning emoticon signify being upset.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
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That's not why I believe you are upset. I believe you are upset because I don't satisfy what you seek.


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## Cellblock2429 (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> No atheist ever waged war in the name of no god. Ever.



/---- ever hear of the godless Nazis you blithering idiot?


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

Cellblock2429 said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > No atheist ever waged war in the name of no god. Ever.
> ...


They didn't kill because somebody believed in a god, it was for racial supremacy.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
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> > ding said:
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Which is?


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## JakeStarkey (Mar 29, 2017)

Kudos to the thread on proving that far right and alt right Christian cults, including those evangelical and fundamentalist and Pentecostal, are more dangerous than atheism.


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## RWNJ (Mar 29, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> Kudos to the thread on proving that far right and alt right Christian cults, including those evangelical and fundamentalist and Pentecostal, are more dangerous than atheism.


Kudos to the one who managed to resurrect your brainless corpse. Truly a miracle of science.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
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To be offended by what you write.


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## JakeStarkey (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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Yeah, the Christian nations of Germany and Italy and United Kingdom and the USA, among others.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> ding said:
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> 
> > Mudda said:
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You are confusing them with your atheist brothers.


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## RWNJ (Mar 29, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> ding said:
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I don't believe that there are any countries that could claim that they are Christian. That includes America. Christians have always been a minority. Even the majority of those who claim to be Christians are frauds, IMHO.


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## JakeStarkey (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> JakeStarkey said:
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I am a Christian, not a cultic Catholic heretic.


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## RWNJ (Mar 29, 2017)

Do you even know what is required in order to call yourself a Christian? Jesus gave three requirements. Do you know what they are? Forget labels. Tell us exactly what a Christian is.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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No, I could be WAY more offensive, lol.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> ding said:
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If you are a christian then I will have to rethink my position.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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Prove it


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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You're already offended because I've exposed you for the fraud that you are. That's enough.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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I hope you don't mind if I see that the other way around.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


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Of course you do, everything is backwards in your world.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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No, everything is backwards in this world.


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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So you admit that in this world, you're always wrong. Very good.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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I'm not sure how you made that leap in logic but I would have expected no less from you to do so.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 29, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> 
> These are NOT Atheist doing this great deception, its believers in Christ, coming in HIS name; in other words, " Christians!" The largest group on earth that comes in Jesus name. And here Jesus is teaching that these are the kind of people who will reach many and deceive them.
> 
> ...




"The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J Borstin -

Conservative media exists to inculcate as many conservatives as possible with the 'illusion of knowledge". This is how a large portion of conservatives believe the fake news that is thrown out by various entities. They have been conditioned over the last two decades to believe the unbelievable and to accept up as down and down as up. 

They've basically been reduced to Pavlovian People. Original thought has been displaced with emotional reaction.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Let me show you something Jesus said in Matt. 24:5, he said, " For MANY shall come " In my Name", saying that I am Christ, and shall " Deceive Many." Here Jesus is teaching that many, many gullible believers in God will actually be deceived " By people who believe in him!" These deceitful believers are followers of and believers in Jesus! They believe in Jesus, teach things in his name, BUT, they are " Deceiving Many!"
> ...


So all I have to do to change this is register as a Democrat?


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## Mudda (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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You think you're right about god... but yet you say everything is backwards in this world, which means that in this world, being backwards, you know that you're wrong.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Laughing leads to crying.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


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Go away, put together a coherent thought, come back. No mystery why you missed the point. And don't worry no one expects you to get it on your next try or the try after that. 

Enjoy the bubble bubbleboy.


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## ding (Mar 29, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


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I didn't miss anything.  I exposed your bias using humor.  Apparently, you don't have much of a sense of humor.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 29, 2017)

ding said:


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What bias needed exposing? It was in plain view and spelled out in detail. You're one who sees it raining outside and tells everyone it's raining outside. 

And you expect a cookie for it. Try to catch up junior, you are three moves behind. Nah, you won't get any smarter in the next hour so just go watch the rain skippy.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


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It seems I have struck a nerve.


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## Mudda (Mar 30, 2017)

ding said:


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We noticed that you couldn't disagree with what I said.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

Mudda said:


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You would have to go back two posts to see where you put words into my mouth to understand the error you made. Your disingenuous is off the chart.


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## Mudda (Mar 30, 2017)

ding said:


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You still didn't disagree with me. Good.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Only you could see it that way.


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## Mudda (Mar 30, 2017)

ding said:


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Again you had a chance to disagree with me but you chose not to.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

Mudda said:


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But I did.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 30, 2017)

ding said:


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You are self deluding again. A common malady of conservatives who can't respond with anything other than "well, you're a poopy-face". 

You are chidren pretending to be adults.


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## hobelim (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> You are self deluding again. A common malady of conservatives who can't respond with anything other than "well, you're a poopy-face".
> 
> You are chidren pretending to be adults.


 

lol...

And they're not even trying very hard ....

Like little children playing in the market while grownups are going about the business of living...


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


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So if I register as a Democrat I will be intelligent like you?  Accountants have a saying.  If you are young and are not a Democrat, you have no heart.  If you are old and not a Republican, you are not smart.  I let you figure out what that means.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 30, 2017)

hobelim said:


> IsaacNewton said:
> 
> 
> > You are self deluding again. A common malady of conservatives who can't respond with anything other than "well, you're a poopy-face".
> ...



The thing is they don't recognize their own ignorance. I feel sorry for them but what you going to do?

The OP notes Christianity more dangerous than atheism, I submit all religion is dangerous. It gives any 'believer' absolute authority over other humans because their god, by definition, is far above humans. So whatever they do in 'his/her name' is wholly sanctified. They need no other confirmation. You see this in their bumper stickers "god said it, I believe it, that settles it". For them it does. Whatever contrary viewpoint you have is, again by definition, wrong.

Atheists rely on reason. And though they are not perfect as no human is, most tend to be educated and rational.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> So whatever they do in 'his/her name' is wholly sanctified.



It is easier for you to construct a logical fallacy straw-man than it is for you to have reasonable arguments.  You mock what you do not understand.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> They need no other confirmation.



Confirmation comes in a variety of ways.  Virtue is the greatest organizing principle. When people behave virtuously, predictable success will NATURALLY follow. When people behave without virtue, predictable failures will NATURALLY occur. How is this not nature confirming our behaviors? Do you really believe that if there is Creator, He would not leave a way for us to figure out the difference between right and wrong? 

Man is born with the ability to know right from wrong and when he violates it, rather than abandoning the concept, he rationalizes that he did not violate it. Men don't do evil for evil's sake, they do evil for the sake of their own good. So from this we can know that man prefers good over evil. 

So getting back to the concept of confirmation, how can we know if we are truly doing good or doing evil and rationalizing that we are doing good? The answer is simple... outcomes. Moral laws are not like physical laws. When you violate a physical law, the consequence is immediate. Not so for moral laws. The consequence of violating a moral law is not usually immediate, but since error cannot stand it will eventually fail. And when it does, if we are honest and paying attention we will come to know the error of our way and repent (i.e. transform). Thus evolving our consciousness (i.e. growing as human beings) and continuing our march towards the next leap in the evolution of matter.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 30, 2017)

ding said:


> IsaacNewton said:
> 
> 
> > So whatever they do in 'his/her name' is wholly sanctified.
> ...



You're one that has a very hard time following logic. You have a tattered grab bag of terms like 'fallacy' that you don't understand but you feel good using them. You rely on dogma and illogic supported by lack of evidence and poor grasp of the meaning of words. 

Its easy to see which mindset is attracted to organised religion. The one that needs an 'all knowing all powerful' being to tell them what to do and crush their enemies. Because having to live in reality requires being personally responsible for all of your life.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> The OP notes Christianity more dangerous than atheism



History tells us that militant atheism is more dangerous than Christianity.

*The Khmer Rouge abolished all religion *and dispersed minority groups, forbidding them to speak their languages or to practice their customs. These policies had been implemented in less severe forms for many years prior to the Khmer Rouge's taking power.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> Atheists rely on reason. And though they are not perfect as no human is, most tend to be educated and rational.



Atheism is based om materialism, primitive instincts, the deification of man and has no no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. They practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural Marxism and normalization of deviance. They worship science but are the first to reject it when it suits their purposes.


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## ding (Mar 30, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


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Christianity promotes the virtues of thankfulness, forgiveness, humility, chastity, temperance, charity, diligence, patience and kindness. Christianity is responsible for the creation of wonderful charities and organizations which serve the betterment of man. Christians and Christian institutions are usually the first source of literacy, education, and healthcare in the poorer regions.Christians and Christian institutions have been the source of abundant human services from hospitals, orphanages, nursing homes, and schools, to advocacy on behalf of those with no voice, to supporting cultural outreaches, and seeking always to find ways in which to protect and promote human life and its authentic flourishing. Christianity gave us the concept of subsidiarity and has done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility Christianity teaches accountability and responsibility. Christianity teaches that we have a choice in how we behave and that actions have consequences. Christianity inspires a sense of wonder in nature and the universe and helps us feel connected to one another and to nature through regular community gatherings. Christianity helps us feel less alone in the world by binding the community together. Christianity serves to ennoble the human spirit and inspires love, peace and happiness. Christianity brings order to our lives by promoting the virtues of thankfulness, forgiveness and humility. Christianity brings comfort to the terminally ill and can act as a source of hope for the oppressed. Christianity teaches that we can transform ourselves. That it is possible to change for the better. Christian values were the foundation which Western Civilization was built upon. No other institution played a greater role in shaping Western Civilization than the Catholic Church. Modern science was born in the Catholic Church. Catholic priests developed the idea of free-market. The Catholic Church invented the university. Western law grew out of Church canon law. The Church humanized the West by insisting on the sacredness of all human life. The Church constantly sought to alleviate the evils of slavery and repeatedly denounced the mass enslavement of conquered populations and the infamous slave trade, thereby undermining slavery at its sources. Religion gave us great thinkers, leaders and humanitarians. Christianity gave us America. Christianity gave us incredible artwork, music and architecture. Christianity has spread democracy throughout the world. Christians fought other Christians in WWII to end their aggression and rebuilt Europe and Japan after WWII. Christians put a man on the moon and ended the cold war.


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## hobelim (Mar 31, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


> hobelim said:
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My question is,  if a person can't tell the difference between a book of children's fairy tales and a historical document are they even equipped to discern between true and false or what is the right or wrong course to take in any issue that might come up in pubic office given they got something so important so wrong, especially if they fall to their knees and pray to a figment of their unrestrained imagination for help and guidance during times of trouble instead of using reason and an intelligent thinking based on facts?

Could they ever be trusted to act responsibly in the interest of the public good or are they bound by their religious affiliation and irrational beliefs to promote their religious agenda by enacting unjust laws that reflect their perverted view of the world?


I know that it was firmly established that there should be no religious test for a person to hold public office but can't they be tested for sanity?

Shouldn't they be?


Can you imagine how screwed up the country would get if religious fanatics who are incapable of honesty, critical thinking,  and objective reasoning usurped places of authority in government?

Can you imagine what would happen if every cop on the beat believed that everyone who did not share their perverted religious views about Jesus was evil?

 An idiot would be elected, millions of unbelievers would be marginalized  and millions more would be criminalized and thrown in prison, in the name of the Lord of course.


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## Mudda (Mar 31, 2017)

ding said:


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Now you just did. 

Too late.


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

Mudda said:


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I'm not going to quibble with you.  Everyone knows about you.  They know what you do.  There is plenty of record.


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## Mudda (Mar 31, 2017)

ding said:


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But you are quibbling, just read your last post. QUIBBLE ON!


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Everyone does know about you.  They know you are a liar, a racist and an atheist masquerading as an agnostic.


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## Mudda (Mar 31, 2017)

ding said:


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qyibblequibblequibble...


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Now would be a great time to start being honest.  Don't be ashamed of what you are.  You should schedule a session with Czernobog.


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## Mudda (Mar 31, 2017)

ding said:


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I bought you off Cerny for a dead cat.


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## IsaacNewton (Mar 31, 2017)

hobelim said:


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We see this on a small scale in the various states where Republicans gain control and immediately try to put their religion into law. 

North Carolina passed a law last year that forced people to use a bathroom according to what was on their birth certificate. (By the way, it was in violation of federal directive. Now Republicans are demanding any state that opposes the current steaming turd in office be punished by taking their milk money.)

Many businesses and other entities cancelled events, new store openings, new building projects, and a slew of other business and sports related endeavours in the state. The NCAA told North Carolina if the law that passed was kept in place then many NCAA events in the state would be cancelled. Ahh, the clarity of losing basketball. The dopes in the legislature in North Carolina yesterday passed a law doing away with the previous law, just before an NCAA deadline for doing so. 

North Carolina had lost hundreds of millions if not billions in revenue because their elected officials attempted to codify their religion into state law. 

All religious people should keep their religion in their church or on their lips. The moment you try to pass laws forcing your religion on others is the moment your religion loses all credibility. If it can't stand on it's own what good is it.


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Winter is coming.  I hope you are ready for it. 

So you don't want to own your racism?  Is that correct?  You do realize that you are only a sick as your secrets, right?  Mudda, come out of the closet.


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


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Do you need help in figuring out which bathroom to use?


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## Mudda (Mar 31, 2017)

ding said:


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Tell Czerny I want my cat back.


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

Mudda said:


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I will but be prepared for him to ask you how it makes you feel that people laugh at you for believing in a life force or a soul.


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## Mudda (Mar 31, 2017)

ding said:


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Im not worried, he's as deluded as you are.


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## ding (Mar 31, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Given the similarity between Czernobog and you, it seems you have just judged yourself.


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## Mudda (Apr 1, 2017)

ding said:


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And I found myself hot, smart and good with any invisible person anyone ever manages to prove (so far none).


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## ding (Apr 1, 2017)

Mudda said:


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You mean like your beliefs in an invisible life force and an invisible soul or reincarnation?


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## Mudda (Apr 1, 2017)

ding said:


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For me it's just a theory that looks like the most logical one at this point. I don't live my life by this or anything, like you do. it's more of an interesting hobby for me to think about these things.


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## ding (Apr 1, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Sure it is.


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## hobelim (Apr 1, 2017)

IsaacNewton said:


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I am more at the point of enough is enough already. Religious people dedicated to their delusions cannot keep their perversions to themselves like a computer infected with malware will attempt to disable every other computer it comes in contact with.

When the free expression of religion was established, it was uncertain whether one religion or the professed beliefs of every religion was right or if one or every religion was wrong.

Until truth  came to light, permitting them all was the only just thing to do.

Since then knowledge has increased and facts have been discovered that refute most religious claims as either pure fantasy, deliberate deception or confusion about how to interpret figurative speech. Whats more the detrimental effects of adopting and perpetuating falsehood on the mind of the individual and society as a whole is no longer in question. I think it is high time that the people emerge from the age of darkness and overcome the tyranny of ignorance, perpetuated by those who have given their minds over to the self aggrandizing despotism of religious delusions.






_"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness._

_That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. *But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.*_


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Apr 1, 2017)

The problem with these fundamentalists or Evangelicals or whatever the hell that they are is that they are  using a bastardized interpretation of  religious freedom  to advance their  agenda and  oppress others:



> *Two meanings of religious freedom/liberty:1. Freedom of belief, speech, practice. 2. Freedom to restrict services, hate, denigrate, or oppress others.*
> 
> 1. The historical meaning of religious freedom:
> This term relates to the personal freedom:
> ...



2


> . A rapidly emerging new meaning of religious freedom: the freedom to discriminate and denigrate:
> 
> In recent years, religious freedom is taking on a new meaning: the freedom and liberty of a believer apply their religious beliefs in order to hate, oppress, deny service to, denigrate, discriminate against, and/or reduce the human rights of minorities.
> 
> ...





> One interesting feature of this "religious freedom to discriminate" is that it generally has people treating others as they would not wish to be treated themselves. It seems to be little noticed among those who practice or advocate "religious freedom to discriminate" that this way of treating people is a direct contradiction to the Golden Rule, which Jesus required all his followers to practice. See Matthew 7:12, Luke 6:31, and the Gospel of Thomas, 6.



Source: Religious freedom & the freedom to discriminate


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## Mudda (Apr 1, 2017)

ding said:


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You agree with me. Good for you.


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## ding (Apr 1, 2017)

Mudda said:


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lol, sure I did.


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## Mickiel (Apr 1, 2017)

Christianity is a well meaning organization no doubt about that ; that pride inside of them is why satan  can so easily mask their deception from them; unchecked group pride is secret  bomb in satans arsenal.


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## ding (Apr 2, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity is a well meaning organization no doubt about that ; that pride inside of them is why satan  can so easily mask their deception from them; unchecked group pride is secret  bomb in satans arsenal.


Sounds like you just just changed tunes, lol.


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## Mudda (Apr 2, 2017)

Nobody EVER went around talking about atheism and fucking little children in the ass like priests do while preaching for Jesus.


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## ding (Apr 2, 2017)

Mudda said:


> Nobody EVER went around talking about atheism and fucking little children in the ass like priests do while preaching for Jesus.


You seem more agitated than usual.  Did you run out of weed?


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## Mudda (Apr 2, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody EVER went around talking about atheism and fucking little children in the ass like priests do while preaching for Jesus.
> ...


We noticed again that you didn't disagree with me.


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## ding (Apr 2, 2017)

Mudda said:


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There were about 200 priests who were pedophiles.  The other 4,500 were homosexuals like yourself.


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## Mudda (Apr 2, 2017)

ding said:


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So what happens when deviance is the norm? They simply get moved from parish to parish?


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## ding (Apr 2, 2017)

Mudda said:


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When deviance is normalized, they forget the reason the higher standard existed in the first place and eventually they suffer the predictable surprise.  Sort of like you and your chronic pot smoking.


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## Mudda (Apr 2, 2017)

ding said:


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I never said that I was a chronic pot smoker, you made that up... like everything else.

Priests were simply moved to another parish, and only a couple were ever jailed. Still going on today.


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## ding (Apr 2, 2017)

Mudda said:


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You never answered the question on that, Einstein.  You still haven't.  Did you smoke your weed yet this morning?


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## Mickiel (Apr 3, 2017)

I tell you their dangerous.


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## ding (Apr 3, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> I tell you their dangerous.


Christianity brings order to our lives.


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## Mickiel (Apr 4, 2017)

Sin is dangerous , its the most dangerous thing that has ever gotten into me.


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## Mickiel (Apr 11, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Sin is dangerous , its the most dangerous thing that has ever gotten into me.




And the Christian ability to pervert the truth of God in public and it never be noticed , is evidence that satan is in charge of their teaching.


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## ding (Apr 13, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Sin is dangerous , its the most dangerous thing that has ever gotten into me.
> ...


Christianity brings comfort to the terminally ill.


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## Mickiel (Apr 13, 2017)

Christianity teaches a terminally ill gospel that affords billions to be " Lost" in their corrupt view of salvation.


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## ding (Apr 13, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity teaches a terminally ill gospel that affords billions to be " Lost" in their corrupt view of salvation.


Christianity acts as a source of hope for the oppressed.


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## Mickiel (Apr 13, 2017)

Christianity acts as a judge to condemn the unbelievers of this world. This religion is not what it seems!


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## ding (Apr 13, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity acts as a judge to condemn the unbelievers of this world. This religion is not what it seems!


Christianity teaches that we can transform ourselves


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## Mickiel (Apr 13, 2017)

Christianity equates itself with God, something even Jesus did not do!


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## ding (Apr 13, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity equates itself with God, something even Jesus did not do!


No, Christianity does not equate itself to God.  You don't understand scripture very well, do you?  

John 14:7-9


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## Mickiel (Apr 14, 2017)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity equates itself with God, something even Jesus did not do!
> ...




  I wonder why so many readers are attracted to a person that you think cannot understand scripture? Its simply stunning , the sheer number of readers who are attracted to my work.

A surreal blessing from God.


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## ding (Apr 14, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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You are a legend in your own mind.


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## Mickiel (Apr 14, 2017)

ding said:


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Well thank you, my mind is important to me; and I am speaking a truth, the threads are garnering a lot of attention, that fact speaks for itself. Thousands of views on each thread; people are interested, most just remain silent.

But I like that about you, you at least voice your views everyday;  and that  requires something.


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## ding (Apr 14, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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You are delusional.


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## Mickiel (Apr 15, 2017)

ding said:


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Can you explain to me why so many readers are interested in my delusion?


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## ding (Apr 15, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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That you believe so many readers are interested in what you write is your delusion.


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## Mickiel (Apr 16, 2017)

ding said:


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And it is also my pleasure ; I thank God that he gives the interest.


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## ding (Apr 16, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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I am certain that you enjoy disparaging Christianity and Christians.


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## Mickiel (Apr 16, 2017)

ding said:


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I am certain of my convictions;  the true danger is Christianity, they have perverted truth more than anything I know of.


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## ding (Apr 16, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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Really?  Worse than trying to tell people there is no God?


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## Mickiel (Apr 17, 2017)

ding said:


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Far worse.


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## ding (Apr 17, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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I'll let you explain that one to God.


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## Mickiel (Apr 18, 2017)

ding said:


> Mickiel said:
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I cannot explain anything on this subject to God,


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## ding (Apr 18, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> ding said:
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You can explain why attacked you attacked those that worship Him and defend those that worship what was created rather than the Creator.


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## Mickiel (Apr 19, 2017)

ding said:


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 Christianity is a danger, because its wrapped in sheep's clothing, but has a hell message underneath.


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## ding (Apr 19, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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No.  That is Fabian socialism.


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## Mudda (Apr 20, 2017)

Christianity is much more dangerous for children getting sexually abused than is atheism.


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## ding (Apr 20, 2017)

Mudda said:


> Christianity is much more dangerous for children getting sexually abused than is atheism.


Do you have any scientifically peer reviewed papers that prove that allegation?


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## Mudda (Apr 20, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is much more dangerous for children getting sexually abused than is atheism.
> ...


Science rightfully stays well clear of clergy and religious myths. But did carbon date the shroud of Turin to the Middle Ages. And the earliest fragments of the bible to several generations after the facts.


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## ding (Apr 20, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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Do you have any scientifically peer reviewed papers?


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## Mudda (Apr 21, 2017)

ding said:


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Actually, there are, just google the subjects.


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## ding (Apr 21, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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So you haven't actually read any of them?


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## Mudda (Apr 21, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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Actually, I have. If you want to know real things, search it on google, I don't care to do it for you.


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## ding (Apr 21, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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No, you haven't prove it.


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## Mudda (Apr 21, 2017)

ding said:


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Why? You want to see how it's done?


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## ding (Apr 21, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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No.  I don't believe they exist.  Prove me wrong.


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## Mudda (Apr 21, 2017)

ding said:


> Mudda said:
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You don't Believe the shroud and bible have been carbon dated? Or you don't believe in carbon dating? Or both?


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## ding (Apr 21, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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Your brain is addled by atheism.  Go back a few pasts to see what we are talking about, dumbass.


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## Mudda (Apr 21, 2017)

ding said:


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Is calling people names part of following Jesus?


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## ding (Apr 21, 2017)

Mudda said:


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No.  But you are a dumbass.


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## Mudda (Apr 22, 2017)

ding said:


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So you're not a Christian then. Now you know.


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## ding (Apr 22, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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It doesn't work that way, dumbass.  You don't behave like a human being but you are still a human being.


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## Mudda (Apr 22, 2017)

ding said:


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You're just frustrated because you're a clown, so you lash out. I understand, but will god?


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## ding (Apr 22, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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If that's how you want to see it, go for it.  I'm cool either way.  Shot an 86 today.  What did you do?


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## Mudda (Apr 23, 2017)

ding said:


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God saw you cheat at golf.


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## Mickiel (Apr 27, 2017)

Just watch how Christians here treat Atheist, and you can see how dangerous they really are to humanity. They claim to want to help you, but really they want to hell you.


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## sealybobo (May 26, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Just watch how Christians here treat Atheist, and you can see how dangerous they really are to humanity. They claim to want to help you, but really they want to hell you.


I was reading about the French Revolution and read this:

The French Revolution completely changed the social and political structure of France. It put an end to the French monarchy, feudalism, and took political power from the Catholic church. 

Does anyone think the Catholic Church acted responsibly with that power or were they corrupt as the day was long? 

So why would anyone believe this religions Jesus story?


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## sealybobo (May 27, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Just watch how Christians here treat Atheist, and you can see how dangerous they really are to humanity. They claim to want to help you, but really they want to hell you.


They are also liars and we are not. At least they aren't being intellectually honest. Last night my buddy was making stuff up and twisting Steven Hawkins words to suggest that scientists now agree that the big band had an intelligent creator. Of course he couldn't show me evidence.

Then he went on to talking about UFOs.

Oh yes, and in his house was 3 atheists and two theists. Only one who can call themselves a christian really.


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## Dan Stubbs (May 29, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Just watch how Christians here treat Atheist, and you can see how dangerous they really are to humanity. They claim to want to help you, but really they want to hell you.


*Why do so many people when they are near death deride that there is a God.  It is said that we all were created in his image.  The key word is image, just what is a image?  If you think about it you might have the right answer.*


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## featherlite (May 29, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Just watch how Christians here treat Atheist, and you can see how dangerous they really are to humanity. They claim to want to help you, but really they want to hell you.[/QUOTE
> 
> Oh please... atheist start the most obnoxious threads about christianity and dismiss/ mock any and all comments offered. Even your comment here is just bait.
> Pretty pointless and silly after awhile


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## koshergrl (May 29, 2017)

Mudda said:


> ding said:
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you think you have the authority to determine who is,nor isn't Christian?

You don't. No atheist does. But guess what...believers will sit in judgement of you. That thought sustains me quite frequently.


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## Mudda (May 30, 2017)

koshergrl said:


> Mudda said:
> 
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I'm agnostic, not atheist, so yes, I can judge either side because you're both deluded.

But you're saying that believers are the only ones who get to judge? Did they promise you candy as well?


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## koshergrl (May 30, 2017)

Mudda said:


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Not believers....even the demons in hell believe. And so will the judges unsaved.

The saved will stand with Christ and judge the lost. 

Anyway, you have no authority or understanding to determine who is saved, and who isn't. 

And I doubt you have a clear understanding of agnosticism, either.


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## guno (May 30, 2017)

koshergrl said:


> Mudda said:
> 
> 
> > koshergrl said:
> ...





koshergrl said:


> even the demons in hell believe


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## Mudda (May 30, 2017)

koshergrl said:


> Mudda said:
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So where's your proof that such judgement is going to happen?


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## Mickiel (Jun 7, 2017)

featherlite said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Just watch how Christians here treat Atheist, and you can see how dangerous they really are to humanity. They claim to want to help you, but really they want to hell you.[/QUOTE
> ...




The truth hurts doesn't it!


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## featherlite (Jun 8, 2017)

Mickiel said:


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The real truth? no, real truth brings peace. I was just stating what Ive witnessed time and time again on forums.


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## badger2 (Jun 9, 2017)

We suggest that the prisoners would do well to acquire Haegglund's Radical Atheism: Derrida and the Time of Life. 
"I Truth, lie." (Jacques Lacan)


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## sealybobo (Jun 9, 2017)

Mudda said:


> koshergrl said:
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> > Mudda said:
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Yesterday I said we are not a christian nation.  Now I see I was wrong


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## Mickiel (Jun 12, 2017)

featherlite said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > featherlite said:
> ...




And you actually think you have witnessed truth time and again on these forums?

God help us.


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## featherlite (Jun 12, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> featherlite said:
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> ...



Very funny. You know what I meant.

But there are kernels of truth here and there.


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## Mickiel (Jun 12, 2017)

featherlite said:


> Mickiel said:
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> > featherlite said:
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Well I would agree with that, truth pops up in many places like diamonds in a dessert.

Excuse me for poking fun at this , I try not to be so serious all the time.


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


I just heard a tele preacher admit to her congregation why Christians are the problem, not atheists. She said it's no good for them to hear what she tells them and not go out and spread the word.

But if I go out and spread my faith, logic and reason, I'm angry. I'm evil. I'm in denial. The list goes on of all the things they say are wrong with me if I speak out against religions.

So Christianity wants the advantage. They want to be free to spread the word but only their word.

I like Christians and Muslims and jehovas to keep it to themselves or don't be snowflakes when we call bs


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

If most televangelists are fos or wrong and we shouldn't listen to them please Christians let us know. Or let us know if you all agree there's one good one in the bunch. I don't want to hear who you like. Who do you all like?


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> The OP and the arguments in behalf of it are an excellent example of why atheism is to be avoided by the weak headed.


Why isn't there a atheist atheists show on one of those channels that run all those religious shows? I know there's an audience and enough material. Maybe snowflakes can't handle that. So things remain unfair. Maybe we are a christian nation. They are the favored one. So don't ask me to keep quiet or ask why I hate religion. I just explained several reasons. There are many more.

So since all her members went out and are spreading the word I'll keep spreading the truth. And I don't have a congregation to help me. Maybe that's why we're militant. Lol


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> I just heard a tele preacher admit to her congregation why Christians are the problem, not atheists. She said it's no good for them to hear what she tells them and not go out and spread the word.
> 
> But if I go out and spread my faith, logic and reason, I'm angry. I'm evil. I'm in denial. The list goes on of all the things they say are wrong with me if I speak out against religions.
> 
> ...



One of the closing prayers in the Catholic Church is to proclaim the Gospel by how we live our lives.  A comment attributed to Saint Francis is, "Preach the Gospel always.  When necessary, use words."  

Why speak out against logic and reason?  What would be the purpose for that?  Most of us don't speak out against logic and reason.  Likewise, why speak out against religion?  What is your purpose for doing that?  What do you hope to gain?  People incorporate different practices into their lives--such as bowling.  To me it makes about as much sense to speak out against the bowling league as it does to speak out against religion as practiced by the average person.


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## hobelim (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > I just heard a tele preacher admit to her congregation why Christians are the problem, not atheists. She said it's no good for them to hear what she tells them and not go out and spread the word.
> ...




  If a bowling league formed and started inciting all bowlers to unite and enact legislation that would criminalize all those who do not belong to a team,  then that would invite a response by those who don't like the game, don't own a ball and think the shoes they wear look rather silly.

True?


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

hobelim said:


> If a bowling league formed and started inciting all bowlers to unite and enact legislation that would criminalize all those who do not belong to a team,  then that would invite a response by those who don't like the game, don't own a ball and think the shoes they wear look rather silly.
> 
> True?



I was speaking of individuals and the activities individuals choose for individual lives. 

You are speaking of lobbyists.  Lobbyists, many of them which want to enact legislation that has nothing to do with religious beliefs, is a different topic.  I loathe the practice of lobbying, where special interest groups--and their money--work to influence legislation.  I am in favor of shutting down all lobbying.  

However, those in favor of lobbying must allow everyone to take part in this "branch" of legislation--not just the groups that person personally supports.  

Who do you see Christians attempting to "criminalize"?


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## hobelim (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > If a bowling league formed and started inciting all bowlers to unite and enact legislation that would criminalize all those who do not belong to a team,  then that would invite a response by those who don't like the game, don't own a ball and think the shoes they wear look rather silly.
> ...




Of course there are many Christians out there whose only dedication is to do their best to walk upright.

Having said that you are well aware that there are many more who have been actively seeking to criminalize behaviors antithetical to their perverse and irrational beliefs for decades, everything from human sexuality to reproductive rights to restricting a persons right to their own personal poison. By doing so they are attempting to hobble the freedoms and criminalize the behaviors of just about everyone who does not subscribe to their perverted views of the world.

Am I telling you something that you do not already know?


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

hobelim said:


> Of course there are many Christians out there whose only dedication is to do their best to walk upright.
> 
> Having said that you are well aware that there are many more who have been actively seeking to criminalize behaviors antithetical to their perverse and irrational beliefs for decades, everything from human sexuality to reproductive rights to restricting a persons right to their own personal poison. By doing so they are attempting to hobble the freedoms and criminalize the behaviors of just about everyone who does not subscribe to their perverted views of the world.
> 
> Am I telling you something that you do not already know?



There is a difference between criminalizing behavior and welcoming it into the public square.  I haven't noticed any branch of Christianity advocating throwing people with various sexual orientations (other than pedophiles) into jail.  

People laugh at the Victorian era, but in one respect they may have gotten it right.  Everyone was aware that all sorts of things went on--they just agreed/refused to talk about it--maybe because the topic was beginning to bore them all to death.  I know it bores me.


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## hobelim (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > Of course there are many Christians out there whose only dedication is to do their best to walk upright.
> ...


 
It bores you does it? lol...Are you really that blind or just some more pretending?

Maybe you are too young to remember but it really wasn't that long ago when a person risked being beaten or maimed on a daily basis for even being suspected of being gay.

How long ago was it when gay marriage was not legal? How many fought tooth and nail to prevent it from becoming legal and why if not because as they openly said it was against their perverted 'christian family values"?

Are they not still to this very day working to undo all of the progressive accomplishments of the past 50 years even by stooping to treason?


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

hobelim said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > sealybobo said:
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And if bowling were a lie but it's not. 

And bowlers don't try to gain an advantage by sending their members out to win over new bowlers and then say anyone who is against bowling is evil.  

This is if we thought bowling was bad for people.  It's not.  Atheists encourage people go bowl on Sunday instead of church.


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

hobelim said:


> It bores you does it? lol...Are you really that blind or just some more pretending?
> 
> Maybe you are too young to remember but it really wasn't that long ago when a person risked being beaten or maimed on a daily basis for even being suspected of being gay.
> 
> ...



Perhaps I grew up in more tolerant communities than you--and by that, I mean tolerant on all sides.


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> And if bowling were a lie but it's not.
> 
> And bowlers don't try to gain an advantage by sending their members out to win over new bowlers and then say anyone who is against bowling is evil.
> 
> This is if we thought bowling was bad for people.  It's not.  Atheists encourage people go bowl on Sunday instead of church.



Correct.  Bowling is not a lie, and neither is faith in God.  Of course, bowlers try to win over others who may be interested in bowling--and those whose livelihood relies on bringing in bowlers advertise and encourage people through word of mouth.  Bowling can be an issue for those who have joint problems.  

Part of my family enjoys bowling.  Others do not.  Part of my family attends church; others do not.  None of us feel the need to persuade others to join "their" side.  I'm wondering why you want people of faith to join your side.


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > And if bowling were a lie but it's not.
> ...


Why do they want me on their side?

And what's wrong with me trying to convince people I'm right?


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> Why do they want me on their side?
> 
> And what's wrong with me trying to convince people I'm right?



Speaking for myself, I don't want non-believers on my side.  They have their own side.  What I would like is for non-believers (or believers of other tenets) to understand my point and to help me understand his/her point.


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Why do they want me on their side?
> ...


That's what I'm here trying to do.  You have to understand what a bad reputation your religion has with the rest of us.  So many inconsistencies.  So many flaws.  So much spin.  And it's ok if you want to believe but you have to understand where the rest of us are coming from.  So I'm watching tv today and I hear a preacher lady saying how its not good enough they attend and worship.  They have to run out and tell everyone.  So your way is not to live and let live.  Your way is to tell other people the way.  Is that correct?  So would you like me telling your kids the truth as I see it?  I know you think you have the authority from a higher power but you don't, really you don't.  

A.  You don't want to really hear what we have to say.  Whenever we debate this you guys ask us why we are angry, denying god for ulterior reasons other than what we say our motivations are, you say we're going to hell, that we are mean.  Anything but having an honest debate.  So if we see you aren't listening to us or being intellectually honest, that's another couple strikes against you right there.      
B.  Even if you are prepared to hear what we have to say when we argue back, you would not like us standing on street corners and preaching to the masses that religion is a scam and bad for their brains.  It's mind control.  A lie.  Used to control the masses.  All the things we believe, you would not like to give us an equal platform in which we get to voice our opinions.


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> That's what I'm here trying to do.  You have to understand what a bad reputation your religion has with the rest of us.  So many inconsistencies.  So many flaws.  So much spin.  And it's ok if you want to believe but you have to understand where the rest of us are coming from.  So I'm watching tv today and I hear a preacher lady saying how its not good enough they attend and worship.  They have to run out and tell everyone.  So your way is not to live and let live.  Your way is to tell other people the way.  Is that correct?  So would you like me telling your kids the truth as I see it?  I know you think you have the authority from a higher power but you don't, really you don't.
> 
> A.  You don't want to really hear what we have to say.  Whenever we debate this you guys ask us why we are angry, denying god for ulterior reasons other than what we say our motivations are, you say we're going to hell, that we are mean.  Anything but having an honest debate.  So if we see you aren't listening to us or being intellectually honest, that's another couple strikes against you right there.
> B.  Even if you are prepared to hear what we have to say when we argue back, you would not like us standing on street corners and preaching to the masses that religion is a scam and bad for their brains.  It's mind control.  A lie.  Used to control the masses.  All the things we believe, you would not like to give us an equal platform in which we get to voice our opinions.



1.  You are in a Religion Forum.  Are you here in a Religion Forum to understand religion, or to get people to understand you?

2.  Of course I want to hear what you have to say.  My grandfather was an atheist.  My husband is an atheist.  Most of his family are atheists.  I've been around atheists all of my life.  I do understand their position(s).  

3.  Being an atheist does not consign one to hell.  There is much more to it than that--and because I do have so many atheists in my family I have done lots of research on it throughout my entire life.  People have to know who God is/who Jesus is--and then reject all God/Christ stand for before they are in danger of hell.  Neither God/Christ are part of your world.  The difference between 'my' atheists and you is that none of them shadow box with the idea of God.  They don't believe.  Period.  Therefore, nothing to talk about.  That is what I call intellectual honesty.  

4.  You (nor any other atheist) know what is bad for the brain.  Religion is no more mind control than a recipe for chocolate cake is a recipe for mind control.  Nor is faith a lie.  Most of us who practice continue practicing because we live scripture in our own lives--and find it works for us.  Gardening, photography, history, genealogy, and faith are all part of my life and bring meaning to my existence.  If you wouldn't convince me to give up gardening, photography, history, and genealogy why take the faith part of my life and try to eliminate that?  

5.  People stand on street corners, political platforms espousing all kinds of things.  My daughters had an English teacher who espoused witchcraft during class time.  So what.  We discussed it over dinner and how her beliefs differed from ours.


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > That's what I'm here trying to do.  You have to understand what a bad reputation your religion has with the rest of us.  So many inconsistencies.  So many flaws.  So much spin.  And it's ok if you want to believe but you have to understand where the rest of us are coming from.  So I'm watching tv today and I hear a preacher lady saying how its not good enough they attend and worship.  They have to run out and tell everyone.  So your way is not to live and let live.  Your way is to tell other people the way.  Is that correct?  So would you like me telling your kids the truth as I see it?  I know you think you have the authority from a higher power but you don't, really you don't.
> ...


You have a great attitude.  You're "one of the good ones".  LOL.

I agree.  While I don't agree with theism I don't really care if people practice or even try to sell me or anyone else on it.  That's their right.  I just don't like the double standard.  I realized it watching that lady this morning tell everyone to go out and spread the word.  I thought, "imagine if atheists went out spreading the word".  You may not mind it but I bet a lot of people would.  The extreme is in Muslim countries where they decapitate atheists.  You don't do that here but you sure don't give us an equal opportunity.

So from now on people should stop asking why us atheists preach.  It's our right and we think the truth is much better than a lie that makes you feel good.

Do you mind cults who lie to their members?  If your family member is joining one do you try to talk them out of it?  Why?  The lie makes them feel good.  Leave them alone.  Stop being a hater.  Why are you rejecting god?  That's what they say when you attack their cult just like you say when we attack your big cult.


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> So from now on people should stop asking why us atheists preach.  It's our right and we think the truth is much better than a lie that makes you feel good.
> 
> Do you mind cults who lie to their members?  If your family member is joining one do you try to talk them out of it?  Why?  The lie makes them feel good.  Leave them alone.  Stop being a hater.  Why are you rejecting god?  That's what they say when you attack their cult just like you say when we attack your big cult.



I see you have upped the ante by equating faith with a cult.  Let's look at the definition of cult/gang:

1.  restrict members' exercise of freedom in thought and belief
2.  demand unquestioning obedience from their members
3.  members are made to place group identity much higher than personal identity
4.  engage in illegal and/or socially unacceptable actions
5.  Leaders are self-appointed, self centered, authoritarian; only use the members for their personal agendas

Were you engaging in hyperbole, or do you see this is what faith and church attendance does to people?  Since you are in favor of people talking family members out of joining a church, are you also in favor of people talking family members out of joining any fraternity, corporation, bureaucracy, club, political party, or the military?  All of the above exercise some control, ask for some obedience yet we reserve the word "cult" for those who cross the line.  If you wish to define Church as Big Cult then you are going to have to define all these other organizations as Big Cult.  The term, then, loses all meaning.  

Secondly, are you arguing that people should avoid going to church because it may make them feel good?  

If you favor truth, then the truth of God should be welcomed.


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## sealybobo (Jun 19, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > So from now on people should stop asking why us atheists preach.  It's our right and we think the truth is much better than a lie that makes you feel good.
> ...


Do you see Islam has some of the characteristics of a cult?


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## Meriweather (Jun 19, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> Do you see Islam has some of the characteristics of a cult?



I don't know enough about Islam--or the Muslim culture--to say.  The Muslims I do know are students, and I don't see any evidence of cult characteristics in their behavior.  

Islam does see God very differently than the other two Abrahamic religions when it comes to freedom of choice.  The more radical sects of Islam do not dwell on good or evil, but rather the will of God.  The belief is that nothing happens without it being the will of God.  A person does not so much as lift a finger, without that act being the will of God.  Nor do they dwell on the concept of cause and effect.  They have a very different way of thinking about God and the relationship between God and man.  The closest we come to it in the West would be with a few Christian sects that teach double pre-destination--i.e., God deliberately created some individuals intending, from the beginning, to damn them.


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## RWNJ (Jun 20, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > sealybobo said:
> ...


I keep hearing all of these excuses for why people don't believe in God. The simple truth is that you hate Him. You hate the fact That He sent His Son to convict you of your sin. But you love your sin, and Jesus exposes it. That's why you hate Him. He shows you your true nature and your inevetible fate apart from God. So you hate Him. Make as many excuses as you like, it will not change the truth.


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## hobelim (Jun 20, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > It bores you does it? lol...Are you really that blind or just some more pretending?
> ...



I doubt it. I think you were just hiding. Consequently you have failed to grow up and instead have constructed for yourself some alternate reality where christians in this country haven't been demonizing unbelievers for decades, they haven't been legislating morality according to their perceived christian values and the 'war on drugs' was not some thinly veiled persecution against hippies and black people ...

Unfortunately ,Alexander, it may be that you have spent too much time on Pleasure Island and those donkey ears are there to stay ..


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

hobelim said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > hobelim said:
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A most stunning reply Hobelim , of which I agree. A Christian will condemn an unbeliever and walk away thinking they are working for God. A most perverted way of thinking about others.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

RWNJ said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Meriweather said:
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It is God who has blinded unbelievers and believers as well. Its the " Work of God now". Your just not consciously able to consider this. In Eccl. 7:13-14, " Consider the WORK of God,  who can make straight that which he has made crooked?" Its God working blindness to him in the total consciousness of humanity, including believers. In verse 14 God has " Set" it like this until the end of humanity so that no human can find out anything about him. This is WHY there are atheist and unbelievers. It is not their fault.


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## Meriweather (Jul 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> It is God who has blinded unbelievers and believers as well. Its the " Work of God now". Your just not consciously able to consider this. In Eccl. 7:13-14, " Consider the WORK of God,  who can make straight that which he has made crooked?" Its God working blindness to him in the total consciousness of humanity, including believers. In verse 14 God has " Set" it like this until the end of humanity so that no human can find out anything about him. This is WHY there are atheist and unbelievers. It is not their fault.



Ecclesiastes seems to be saying that for all round learning to occur, we must be able to experience both the positive and the negative life presents.  If all we have are sunny days, we are never going to learn about rain.  How does God work in good times?  How does God work in bad times?  To learn, we must experience both good times and bad times.


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## irosie91 (Jul 24, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > It is God who has blinded unbelievers and believers as well. Its the " Work of God now". Your just not consciously able to consider this. In Eccl. 7:13-14, " Consider the WORK of God,  who can make straight that which he has made crooked?" Its God working blindness to him in the total consciousness of humanity, including believers. In verse 14 God has " Set" it like this until the end of humanity so that no human can find out anything about him. This is WHY there are atheist and unbelievers. It is not their fault.
> ...



sheeeesh    Meri.    TODAY is Monday------save the billy graham level sermons for--------the autumn
sunday potluck luncheon------in the church basement


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > It is God who has blinded unbelievers and believers as well. Its the " Work of God now". Your just not consciously able to consider this. In Eccl. 7:13-14, " Consider the WORK of God,  who can make straight that which he has made crooked?" Its God working blindness to him in the total consciousness of humanity, including believers. In verse 14 God has " Set" it like this until the end of humanity so that no human can find out anything about him. This is WHY there are atheist and unbelievers. It is not their fault.
> ...




Well I think we do have to experience both good and evil, which is the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and why God put both of them in the same tree together. But God does not work how the Christians describe it, he works as the bible describes it.

We are locked into our learning and cannot be free from the influence of evil in this life.


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## Meriweather (Jul 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Well I think we do have to experience both good and evil, which is the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and why God put both of them in the same tree together. But God does not work how the Christians describe it, he works as the bible describes it.
> 
> We are locked into our learning and cannot be free from the influence of evil in this life.



There are many, many interpretations for every passage in the Bible.  Christians (and others as well) describe it in numerous different ways, according to their own ideas, learning and experiences.  My experience is we are not locked into our learning, and those who wish to, can avoid a lot of the evil in this life.


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## irosie91 (Jul 24, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Well I think we do have to experience both good and evil, which is the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and why God put both of them in the same tree together. But God does not work how the Christians describe it, he works as the bible describes it.
> ...



Keholet----is not  New Testament-------it is part of that  "superceded"  book


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## koshergrl (Jul 24, 2017)

irosie91 said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Alternative is that you retire to your own basement when others discuss such matters, if you find them so objectionable. 

Or at least don't troll threads about Christianity and then whine that people discuss the bible.


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## irosie91 (Jul 24, 2017)

koshergrl said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
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> > Meriweather said:
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the discussion is about the book called, in English   "ECCLESIASTES"     aka   KEHOLET.   
I remember when I was a kid----sunday was dominated by BILLY GRAHAM who  ALSO
provided explanations----usually on old testament stories------as if he was commenting on
Grimm fairly tales---------what evah the story meant to HIM--as a southern Baptist.   The book
called  KEHOLET  is not a southern Baptist story------its more like a semi-mystical work ----
very poetical and not actually-----something   "divinely written"  ----probably written about
500 BC-------a really tumultuous time.  ----think Ezra---trying to reorganize the entire
jewish people out of exile and confusion.   Think Talmud as a work in progress    It kinda amuses me that anyone would decide to personalize it from the POV of a southern Baptist.-----reminds me
of Billy Graham


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## featherlite (Jul 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > Meriweather said:
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If it turns into a useless or harsh argument...what exactly is the value in continuing such a discussion?
Its written in the Bible and its also just basic common sense in many situations.
Condemn and walk away...not true.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Well I think we do have to experience both good and evil, which is the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and why God put both of them in the same tree together. But God does not work how the Christians describe it, he works as the bible describes it.
> ...




My experience and belief is that evil cannot be avoided , only limited at best by behavior, but it still will affect everyone reguardless of how they live. And we can only learn a certain way and a certain amount of things, its what we learn that infects us.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

featherlite said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > hobelim said:
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Oh its true, Christians call it " Shaking the dust off their feet", or walking away knowing the person is condemned because they disagreed with you.


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## Meriweather (Jul 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> My experience and belief is that evil cannot be avoided , only limited at best by behavior, but it still will affect everyone reguardless of how they live. And we can only learn a certain way and a certain amount of things, its what we learn that infects us.



Could you give a specific example of what you mean?


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## Meriweather (Jul 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Oh its true, Christians call it " Shaking the dust off their feet", or walking away knowing the person is condemned because they disagreed with you.



Christians don't know anything of the sort.  Catholics, and most likely other sects, simply turn their failure to reach someone over to the Spirit of God to reach.  We have limitations.  God does not.


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## featherlite (Jul 24, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> featherlite said:
> 
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> > Mickiel said:
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In these cases it was "they" who rejected Gods saving grace through Jesus Christ and hearing the gospel. Its not about a simple disagreement. Its when someone has done all they can , are emotionally letting go and leaving the situation in Gods hands.


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > My experience and belief is that evil cannot be avoided , only limited at best by behavior, but it still will affect everyone reguardless of how they live. And we can only learn a certain way and a certain amount of things, its what we learn that infects us.
> ...




If I may use your own words, " We have limitations."


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## Mickiel (Jul 24, 2017)

featherlite said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > featherlite said:
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No, no, they more than likely rejected Christianity;  because none of them has ever met or known God. And the way God will handle human rejection is absolutely nothing like Christians handle it. God is merciful, forgiving and loving, Christianity is not.


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## Correll (Jul 25, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> hobelim said:
> 
> 
> > Meriweather said:
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These days the opposite is more likely, ie that an unbeliever will condemn a Christian and walk away thinking they are working for some vague notion of progress or anti-pervertedness.


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## irosie91 (Jul 25, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > hobelim said:
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well-----kinda both


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## Meriweather (Jul 25, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> No, no, they more than likely rejected Christianity;  because none of them has ever met or known God. And the way God will handle human rejection is absolutely nothing like Christians handle it. God is merciful, forgiving and loving, Christianity is not.



I've had a very different experience with Christianity.


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## Meriweather (Jul 25, 2017)

Correll said:


> These days the opposite is more likely, ie that an unbeliever will condemn a Christian and walk away thinking they are working for some vague notion of progress or anti-pervertedness.



Perhaps one of the problems for both believer and unbeliever is that too often what they are arguing against is a child's/teen's learning of Christianity.  Another problem is thinking a few years' learning will teach everything anyone needs to know.


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## Correll (Jul 25, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > These days the opposite is more likely, ie that an unbeliever will condemn a Christian and walk away thinking they are working for some vague notion of progress or anti-pervertedness.
> ...




The unbeliever is just as likely, if not more so, to have a child's understanding of his own philosophy. 

Most people are not deep thinkers.


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## irosie91 (Jul 25, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > These days the opposite is more likely, ie that an unbeliever will condemn a Christian and walk away thinking they are working for some vague notion of progress or anti-pervertedness.
> ...




children  pick up  ATTITUDES  more easily and firmly than do adults------their "learning" 
is more on the emotional level than the intellectual in both politics and religion and
"group"   issues.     ATTITUDES remain a more important force than intellect in
race and religious issues in society at large


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## Correll (Jul 25, 2017)

irosie91 said:


> Meriweather said:
> 
> 
> > Correll said:
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Adults are driven by emotion on race and religious issues.


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## irosie91 (Jul 25, 2017)

Correll said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
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> > Meriweather said:
> ...



so true--------and those emotions are internalized when they are children. 
FOR candid information-----LISTEN TO WHAT THE CHILDREN SAY.  
Adults use the FOREBRAIN -----to intellecturalize and  COVER
the emtions picked up in childhood----from the environment.   The forebrain---
that part of the brain just behind your forehead is a GIANT SUPPRESSOR
machine.    The bigger your forehead----the more you can STIFLE 
all kinds of "lower"  stuff.     Thanks to your forebrain----you do not 
"fart"  at the dinner table.      A little alcohol can do a job on your forebrain


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > hobelim said:
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Unbelievers condemn Christian beliefs, and I do as well. The eternal hell doctrine needs to be condemned, because it condemns humanity.


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## Correll (Jul 25, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
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Condemning a Christians beliefs is very different than condemning the Christian.


My point was about the unbeliever condemning the Christians, something we see a lot of from lefties.


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > Correll said:
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Unbelievers don't condemn Christians that's nonsense;  Christians are masterful at condemnation, trying to literally slap salvation out of all of humanity. Its just ugly, because they don't even know there doing it.


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## Correll (Jul 25, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
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> > Mickiel said:
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So, you claim that unbelievers don't condemn Christians IN THE SAME SENTENCE that you state that Christians are 

"masterful at condemnation, trying to literally slap salvation out of all of humanity".


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## Mickiel (Jul 25, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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Correct, and I stand by that 100%.


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## Correll (Jul 26, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
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> > Mickiel said:
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Do you not realize that you just condemned Christians in that sentence where you claimed that unbelievers don't condemn Christians?


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## Mickiel (Jul 26, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
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> > Correll said:
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Are you blind? I condemned no one; in my view ALL of humanity is saved, including unworthy Christianity. In John 17:2 the Father has given Jesus power over ALL of humanity, to give salvation to us all;  there is now no condemnation, it only exist in the heart of Christianity.


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## Correll (Jul 27, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
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> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Ah, sorry, thought you were using the word condemn in a more secular sense of the word.


Still, in your scenario, it is not Christians doing the condemning, they are just expressing their opinion on whether a person IS or IS NOT condemned. 


They don't actually make the call themselves.


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## Mickiel (Jul 27, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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Nonsense, their opinion IS the condemnation; their teachings ARE the condemnation. Christianity has a " Hell minded disposition", because they think God is mad, and he will insanely condemn humans into an eternal punishing. And actually hurt humans forever, insanity without end. In my scenario it IS the Christians doing this nonsense. No question about it. This insanity is  implanted into their consciousness.


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## Correll (Jul 27, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
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Thinking that someone is going to suffer for their sins, is not making them suffer for their sins.

You want to hold Christians responsible for what they believe the consequences of other people actions will be.


That is not reasonable.



I think that smoking likely leads to cancer. Thinking that does not make me responsible for smokers getting cancer.


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## Mickiel (Jul 29, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > Correll said:
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I don't think Christianity is responsible for their confusion, they are intentionally being misled by a higher power. And God is involved in that.


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## RWNJ (Aug 9, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Correll said:
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They hate Christions because they first hated Christ.


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## Mickiel (Oct 2, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
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> > Correll said:
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Many Christians think sin most likely leads to their concept of eternal hell punishing, they teach and preach that daily, in my view, that includes them in the irresponsible spreading of a false gospel that has crippled a world in its thinking about the salvation of God.


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## sealybobo (Oct 2, 2017)

RWNJ said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


But republicans and christians love the Jews today. Remember you guys say we're a judao Christian nation right?


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## Correll (Oct 2, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...




So, your religious views differ from theirs, and you are unhappy that they are preaching about religious views that you don't share.


YOu certainly have a right to feel that way. 


It is not reasonable of you to expect anyone else to share your opinion or to act on it in any fashion.


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## Weatherman2020 (Oct 2, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...





Mickiel said:


> Many Christians think sin most likely leads to their concept of eternal hell punishing, they teach and preach that daily, in my view, that includes them in the irresponsible spreading of a false gospel that has crippled a world in its thinking about the salvation of God.



You display your ignorance, and that is why you have such hateful and distorted views.
The fundamental foundation of Christianity is that everyone sins. Everyone. Which prevents us from being with God when we die.
But God knows we all sin, so sent a redeemer to wash away our sins IF we truly believe in the redeemer.
That is all that is required. A faith in our redeemer.

And since your next response will be that just means we think we can sin and get away with it, anyone who thinks that way does not truly believe in the redeemer, Jesus the Christ.


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## TroglocratsRdumb (Oct 2, 2017)

Actually Atheist have murdered millions of people, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot......


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## Mickiel (Oct 2, 2017)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Correll said:
> ...




I believe that every person Christianity announces condemnation on, is already saved by the Grace of God; being saved from the grasp of the Christian hell , is a  much heavy weight on unbelievers , more than any sin they already feel guilty from. Christianity is a greater burden on people than any problems I have seen cast on this world.


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## Weatherman2020 (Oct 2, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Weatherman2020 said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Yeah, that is why almost all good for our fellow man in the world is generated by Christians.  Belief in Jesus destroyed our lives.  Could have spent the night drinking and watching reruns of Leave It to Beaver but instead those horrible Christians were out with the homeless, the poor, the widows, the orphans ...........


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## Mickiel (Oct 2, 2017)

Weatherman2020 said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Weatherman2020 said:
> ...



Christians are trying to remove most of the salvation in the bible, and replace it with enrollment in their hell for most of humanity. They think Jesus was beaten on the cross in order that all unbelievers can be beaten for eternity!


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## Bonzi (Oct 2, 2017)

Perverted Christianity is much worse than Athiesm


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## Mickiel (Oct 2, 2017)

Bonzi said:


> Perverted Christianity is much worse than Athiesm




I think so ; perverted religion uses things about God, the bible, people and literature to mislead people, and it does not even know its misleading them; so the perversion of the Christian mind gives birth to the seduction of the human mind and the twisting of the bible and knowledge;  the whole world has been deceived ; 1/3 of the world are Christian, over 2.2 billion members, so they can sway this world easily.

This is a FAR greater threat than Atheism or any other dynamic in this world!


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## Correll (Oct 3, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Bonzi said:
> 
> 
> > Perverted Christianity is much worse than Athiesm
> ...





Give the worst current example of this "deception" that you are so concerned about, for discussion purposes.


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## Bonzi (Oct 3, 2017)

Correll said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Bonzi said:
> ...



The Catholic church practices many deceptions:

1.  The Pope has the authority of Christ (say what?)
2.  Mary delivers souls from death (uh, no.. just no)
3.  and of course, transsubstantiation


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## Correll (Oct 3, 2017)

Bonzi said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
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Valid theological complaints. 

I don't think that is what Micky is about.


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## emilynghiem (Oct 3, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Dear Mickiel More Christians I know DON'T teach that.
Name ONE Christian who is teaching this as judgment and punishment,
and let's try to correct that one person.

Otherwise, Mickiel if you "condemn all Christians for teaching this as punishment"
then you are committing the same mistake. You are preaching condemnation
instead of correcting the problem. Why would you do the very thing you are criticizing Christians for doing?


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## emilynghiem (Oct 3, 2017)

Bonzi said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Bonzi
1. Yes and No, the Pope has authority of Christ when God is speaking
in AGREEMENT THROUGH CHRIST through the Pope or through
anyone else speaking in Agreement through Christ.

This is true of anyone, including the Pope.

We can all embody the message and spirit of Christ
by remaining in agreement to establish God's will and truth at all times.

The difference is many people are praying in agreement with God
to use the Pope as a central leader. So the Pope has more people
praying in agreement to use the Pope and the Catholic authority to centralize the focus in Christ.

NOTE: there is a difference when the Pope is speaking "ex cathedra" or not.
Just like a lawyer can speak as an officer of the court when under oath, which has different weight of authority and law,
and that's different from when the same person speaks personally in private to friends as an individual.

When we all submit to one central universal governing authority of "God's truth" or "God's laws"
that's what it means to receive Equal Justice Under Law, and what it means for Jesus to be Lord of all, or the
central embodiment of universal Justice and universal Law for all people.

2. No, Mary is like the spirit of Mercy that accompanies Jesus as Justice.
Justice with Mercy is Jesus with the Holy Spirit.

Mary as a symbol of church embodiment of God's grace and Mercy is not a replacement
or substitute for Jesus, but a symbol of the Holy Spirit or Comfort and PEACE
that goes hand in hand with Jesus as God's Justice.

The church or people is symbolized as the BRIDE of Christ.
So this is a FEMALE role of RECEIVING the law and spirit as the PEOPLE, or body of Christ,
while Jesus/Lord is a male role of GIVING the law to the people.

These are not the same. but they work together as male/female, protectorate and people,
church and state or people and governing authority.

3. NO this isn't literal: the bread and water
REPRESENT the letter or body of the law
and the Spirit of the laws. When we meditate on these things, it's still symbolic.

You can take the metaphor as deep as you want to go with it.

But breaking bread and praying in communion is still just the first step.
The first step is praying in unity and agreement.
But the next step is living that prayer in word and action.

So the spirit and the letter are SUPPOSED to be one.
The spirit of prayer and the real life action embodied in the real world.

That's what it means to see these as "tied together".
Where what we AGREE in spirit becomes Manifested as God's will in the real world.

But we still have to take the necessary steps and actions to fulfill that manifestation.
It's not just "magic" where we break bread "symbolically" and this means it is done.
On God's level, yes, God's will is already done over all time and space.
But for man's reality, we still have to embody and enact God's will in the world.


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## emilynghiem (Oct 3, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Correll said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Mickiel name one Christian you have caught doing this
where you intervened to correct them. Instead you are preaching here
about a problem but haven't named the people actually doing it.

Can we start there?

How do you expect to solve this problem if you are preaching to people
who aren't doing it. Why aren't you addressing the people who need this correction
if you are so worried about it going on.

Do you expect to solve math problems and teach people to correct errors
if all you do is preach and complain to "other people" that there are math problems
"all over the place" that are being done wrong.
How does that fix anything?


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## Bonzi (Oct 3, 2017)

The Bible says diddle about Mary. What a joke


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## JohnPrewett (Oct 4, 2017)

The Vatican is valuable to Jesus ..... by it's fulfillment of Revelation 17&18, the Vatican provides visible and verifiable confirmation of the truth of Jesus and the NT.
Seeing the Vatican is the Great Whore of the Revelation sheds great light on past, present and future.


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## ScienceRocks (Oct 4, 2017)

Christianity is based on pure faith without *one ounce of evidence*. It's dangerous for the reality that it's based on nothing and yet thinks it should rule the world using violence and hard nose tactics. It is always right and you're wrong if you're against its pages.

Simply put it is dangerous as it is anti-logic, anti-critical thought and anti-reality in every way. It promotes idiocy and that idiocy gets people mistreated and even killed.

Lets just say for example that a scientific project was developing the  cure cancer but yet christiains think it is gods will for people to die from it. Well, guess what that research is less likely to be funded with Donald Trump in office than it would under Barack Obama.

Another Example of this is the Unacceptance of LGBT within our society. Guess what, Trump is governing as  a christian and he thinks those people don't deserve to be treated with rights or respect. This is dangerous. Logic and critical thought says that they're as human as you and me but christianity doesn't. It is based on stone aged logic that doesn't respect anyone besides its little tiny narrow view of the world.


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## hobelim (Oct 4, 2017)

emilynghiem said:


> 3. NO this isn't literal: the bread and water
> REPRESENT the letter or body of the law
> and the Spirit of the laws. When we meditate on these things, it's still symbolic.




You are wrong.

The catholic church teaches that the bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ *IN ACTUALITY.*


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## hobelim (Oct 4, 2017)

Bonzi said:


> The Bible says diddle about Mary. What a joke




The bible states that his mother and brothers came to "take charge of him" because people were saying that Jesus was out of his mind.

When Jesus was told that they were there and wanted to speak with him, he pretty much disowned them......Who is my mother,my brothers, my sister, etc?  "Those who hear the will of God and do it".....

That shows that his mother and family  thought he was crazy too., at least at that point.....


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## hobelim (Oct 4, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> The Vatican is valuable to Jesus ..... by it's fulfillment of Revelation 17&18, the Vatican provides visible and verifiable confirmation of the truth of Jesus and the NT.
> Seeing the Vatican is the Great Whore of the Revelation sheds great light on past, present and future.




You will hear people talking about the red heifer, a cow without blemish, (infallible?),  whose slaughter is necessary for purification of the people who have been contaminated by the dead, necessary to rebuild the Temple and necessary to bring about the appearance of the messiah.

The church of Rome was nothing special  without the power and authority given to her by the dragon. The bishop of Rome was just another bishop until the emperor of Rome, the scarlet beast that sits upon seven hills,  created the office of the papacy and conferred upon it power and authority to deceive the nations in the name of a triune god made man made matzo made by human hands, an edible mangod that does not correspond to any real living being ever in existence..

Scarlet is red btw........


----------



## RWNJ (Oct 4, 2017)

ScienceRocks said:


> Christianity is based on pure faith without *one ounce of evidence*. It's dangerous for the reality that it's based on nothing and yet thinks it should rule the world using violence and hard nose tactics. It is always right and you're wrong if you're against its pages.
> 
> Simply put it is dangerous as it is anti-logic, anti-critical thought and anti-reality in every way. It promotes idiocy and that idiocy gets people mistreated and even killed.
> 
> ...


A BOLD FACED LIE! There is evidence. Just because you reject it doesn't mean it does not exist.


----------



## JohnPrewett (Oct 4, 2017)

ScienceRocks said:


> Christianity is based on pure faith without *one ounce of evidence*. .....



Assert that all you want.   Sooner or later you'll see how you were in blind denial of evidence seen by many millions for centuries. 

All who  become saved think "how could I have been so blind to all the evidence all around us ?? "


----------



## sealybobo (Nov 6, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> ScienceRocks said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity is based on pure faith without *one ounce of evidence*. .....
> ...



Are you blind to what Muslims see?  Because you don't buy anything they're putting down, do you?

Oh, this just in.  The Texas shooter was a militant atheist.  Damn it!  He's making the rest of us look bad.

http://nypost.com/2017/11/06/ex-friends-say-shooter-was-creepy-atheist-who-berated-religious-people/


----------



## sealybobo (Nov 6, 2017)

Texas church shooter Devin Kelley was a “creepy” atheist “outcast” who never fit in and berated religious believers on social media, according to former friends and classmates.

“He was always talking about how people who believe in God we’re stupid and trying to preach his atheism,” wrote former classmate 

http://nypost.com/2017/11/06/ex-friends-say-shooter-was-creepy-atheist-who-berated-religious-people/


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## sealybobo (Nov 6, 2017)

Oddly, Kelley lists teaching vacation Bible school as volunteer experience on his LinkedIn page, and his wife Danielle Shields was previously a teacher at a Baptist church, according to the Mail.


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## westwall (Nov 6, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> Oddly, Kelley lists teaching vacation Bible school as volunteer experience on his LinkedIn page, and his wife Danielle Shields was previously a teacher at a Baptist church, according to the Mail.







Maybe he was also a pedo using the bible teaching gig to get victims?


----------



## sealybobo (Nov 6, 2017)

westwall said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Oddly, Kelley lists teaching vacation Bible school as volunteer experience on his LinkedIn page, and his wife Danielle Shields was previously a teacher at a Baptist church, according to the Mail.
> ...


Just like many many catholic priests.  

What's the difference between Santa and a Priest?  Santa only has kids sit on his lap one month a year.  Priests get lucky every week/day.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 6, 2017)

Oddly the gun bunnies defend Kelly's right to have firearms.


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## LittleNipper (Nov 6, 2017)

The pagan Romans hated the Christians because they believed them to be atheistic. The Romans equated atheism with anarchism. If a pagan can come to such a conclusion why wouldn't anyone else note that danger. Anarchism means tossing a bomb at a daycare center, or shooting up parishioners at a church service, or assassinating the President.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 6, 2017)

Well, that is nutty. ^^^


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## JohnPrewett (Nov 6, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > ScienceRocks said:
> ...



No man threatens me for changing my beliefs.   Not same with Islam.  Have a nice day. JP


----------



## Correll (Nov 6, 2017)

sealybobo said:


> Texas church shooter Devin Kelley was a “creepy” atheist “outcast” who never fit in and berated religious believers on social media, according to former friends and classmates.
> 
> “He was always talking about how people who believe in God we’re stupid and trying to preach his atheism,” wrote former classmate
> 
> http://nypost.com/2017/11/06/ex-friends-say-shooter-was-creepy-atheist-who-berated-religious-people/




So, who's missing from USM?

RW is here. What about Mattew?


----------



## sealybobo (Nov 6, 2017)

Correll said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Texas church shooter Devin Kelley was a “creepy” atheist “outcast” who never fit in and berated religious believers on social media, according to former friends and classmates.
> ...


----------



## badger2 (Nov 6, 2017)

Post # 904: Heresay. Show us Kelly's media texts and we'll able to see for ourselves where his brand of atheism was coming from. We've already a few clues: 1500 years ago xians were accused of atheism, getting a taste of their own medicine: 666 kuklos exothen.


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## LittleNipper (Nov 6, 2017)

It seems odd to me that more isn't being said regarding the mass shootings at the Texas church and also at the Country Western Concert. Both shooter seem to have claimed to be atheists. Is this a trend that the government does not wish to see copied? Are atheists really mild manner sophisticates or is this all a pretense hiding a far more dangerous facade. It seems that the authorities are perhaps trying to cover up a trend that they fear might bring terrible repercussions across the country if word gets out. Will the government have to close churches unless they (churches) have security guards? Perhaps there will be copycat events among other atheists.The shooting at the black church was reported as racial, but in fact wasn't that shooter also an atheist?


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 6, 2017)

Atheists like far right Christians can be killers, yes.


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## TheProgressivePatriot (Nov 6, 2017)

LittleNipper said:


> It seems odd to me that more isn't being said regarding the mass shootings at the Texas church and also at the Country Western Concert. Both shooter seem to have claimed to be atheists. Is this a trend that the government does not wish to see copied? Are atheists really mild manner sophisticates or is this all a pretense hiding a far more dangerous facade. It seems that the authorities are perhaps trying to cover up a trend that they fear might bring terrible repercussions across the country if word gets out. Will the government have to close churches unless they (churches) have security guards? Perhaps there will be copycat events among other atheists.The shooting at the black church was reported as racial, but in fact wasn't that shooter also an atheist?



They were mentally disturbed people who happened to be athletes 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## LittleNipper (Nov 6, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> Atheists like far right Christians can be killers, yes.


Atheists don't believe in either sin or retribution from GOD. Christians believe murder is a sin. Big difference.


----------



## TheProgressivePatriot (Nov 6, 2017)

LittleNipper said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Atheists like far right Christians can be killers, yes.
> ...


We believe in karma . We believe that we are all connected in our humanness by a life force . We believe that one can have a moral compass without the concept of sin and without fear of god. We believe that goodness and righteousness comes from within. We are not murderers.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 6, 2017)

LittleNipper said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > Atheists like far right Christians can be killers, yes.
> ...


. . . which does not stop Christians from being killers.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 6, 2017)

Trending is a more intelligent world, one not based on fear, coercion nor troubled spirit. Theologians have tapped into this guilt complex since at least the Neolithic when houses began to be placed in rows, and the undertakers of the time banked on a fundamental illusion of man: the illusion of not being dead once we already are.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 6, 2017)

"Security is an illusion."
(Helen Keller, 1933)


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## JohnPrewett (Nov 6, 2017)

Christ was a healer .... and taught such as "turn the other cheek"   "love your enemies"   etc etc   

yet when the Satanically controlled see a killer ,  they look for any possible way to construe that the killer should be referred to as a "Christian"


----------



## LittleNipper (Nov 7, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> LittleNipper said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...


 Karma is not a reality unless there is a reason behind why everything exists. Life forces, and moral compasses are just a very human way of saying there is something beyond us. And I believe that's GOD.


----------



## LittleNipper (Nov 7, 2017)

badger2 said:


> "Security is an illusion."
> (Helen Keller, 1933)


Helen Keller was a Christian.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 7, 2017)

Some of the far right Christians think, "No Hero!  Few Christians realize just how wicked some of the most revered people in history were. Helen Keeler (1880 to 1968) was a wolf in Sheep's clothing, NO hero. Just as Martin Luther King Jr., Einstein, and so many others...Keller was a Communist! She was also involved with the occult. Tragically, I see Christian websites praising this godless woman.  Wake up oh Christian, wake up! We must reprove the works of darkness (Ephesians 5:11)."

Helen Keller No Hero!

She was an occultist and a communist according to some of our Christian comrades of the far right.


----------



## Correll (Nov 7, 2017)

TheProgressivePatriot said:


> LittleNipper said:
> 
> 
> > JakeStarkey said:
> ...





None of that is part of the definition of atheist.

YOU might believe that stuff, but, I've certainly seen atheists that do not.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 7, 2017)

Well now you've done it. Hellen Keller links to Alexander Graham Bell, and this while the police are having trouoble getting into Kelly's cellphone.


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## badger2 (Nov 7, 2017)

We counter the Ephesians above with the connection to Corinthians I for the Juno-Chiron cycle. Hillary Clinton was airborne to Lebanon on the first day of the Juno-Chiron cycle in 2009. This cycle links to widows and unmarried women, just as it does to Corinth. Hillary Clinton is Methodist mafia, a delirious protection racket that links to prayer meetings held in abandoned gun factories.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 7, 2017)

^^^   Ok, then!


----------



## badger2 (Nov 7, 2017)

The argument that Helen Keller was a xian fails to document what she knew before she was coerced, which coercion then becomes a kind of theft. The same theft occurs with the islamic protection rackets: the Uighurs once lived in the same valley the Han call their original homeland, and this before the Uighurs fell under the sway of religious coercion. The Chinese still scapegoat the Uighurs, regardless of their affiliations, a primal knowledge envy as precondition, pretext.


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## badger2 (Nov 7, 2017)

For Keller, we linked Alexander Graham Bell (the current Kelly cellphone problem), though Mabel Gardiner Hubbard, Graham's wife, links to much more xian pathology, for example, the Fort Harrison Hotel in Clearwater, Florida.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 7, 2017)

badger2 have you met Dale Smith, LA RAM FAN, ShootSpeeders, Sicilianthing, and healthmyths?

I will happily facilitate a meeting.  No need to thank me.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Jake, we've seen La Ram Fan on JFK threads that your rump was not on. Are you afraid to get involved?


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## badger2 (Nov 8, 2017)

We will be posting the Southern Bell link to JFK. Hubbard DNA links to Ron Hubbard's Scientology at the Fort Harrison Hotel, Clearwater, Florida. Thus, Alexander's interest in Helen Keller reveals a possible unhealthy relationship. Was he ever allowed to be alone with her?


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 8, 2017)

badger2 said:


> Jake, we've seen La Ram Fan on JFK threads that your rump was not on. Are you afraid to get involved?


Conspiracy threads?  Not interested.  He stays away from me because I make him look silly every time.


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## badger2 (Nov 8, 2017)

Then badger will stay here and make you look stupid.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 8, 2017)

^^^ Badger has failed.


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## badger2 (Nov 11, 2017)

We notice that Starkey's reactions are composed of short, simple sentences. Starkey is correct in showing just where the dangers lie.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 11, 2017)

^^^   Short, simple sentences are all that is necessary to refute Badger 2.


----------



## TroglocratsRdumb (Nov 11, 2017)

Famous Atheist: Mao, Hitler, Stalin


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 11, 2017)

Hitler was Catholic, Stalin was Orthodox, Mao was animist.

Many of the alt right are atheistic.


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## badger2 (Nov 11, 2017)

One party, two right wings. (Gore Vidal)

You keep getting screwed by defining the left as anything but movement. There's no need for the prisoners to change this modus when substituting the pathologies of religious belief for political belief.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 11, 2017)

Constitutional conservatism, Christian dominionism, communism and its flip side libertarianism, and anarchy would be far worse than what we have now.


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## badger2 (Nov 11, 2017)

What is it that we have now? How is this defined for what
Starkey glosses over: the concept of the becoming-communist of capitalism. Therefore, we show how Starkey firstly misinterprets the materialist and formalist aspects of constitutional conservatism while in the same breath confounds it with religion, which is a critical mistake:

'Constitutional modifications follow the contemporary maturation of the material conditions of development. The laborist elements of the Constitution can only be raised up and celebrated in the context of this material relationship. These elements contained in the Constitution are indicative of the present nature of the State regime, even if they are aufgehoben with respect to their previous generic definition. This new characterization of the problematic presents us not with a normal rearrangement of the formal elements with respect to their material conditioning, but rather with a problem central to constitutional science: the problem of the relationship between the material foundation and the formal constitution of order. Constitutional science has long been conscious of the centrality of this problem.'
(Labor of Dionysus: A Critique of the State Form, p. 63)


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 11, 2017)

Badger is arguing for Michael Hardt's philosophical construct that labor becomes the footstool of capitalist oppression.  Interesting.  I recommend this link for people to come up to speed on him and his philosophies.  He's fun if erratic.

Michael Hardt - Wikipedia


----------



## badger2 (Nov 12, 2017)

Thanks for the link.


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## badger2 (Nov 12, 2017)

Starkey does what the other automatons do: jump right into subjectivity while not claiming the freedom they had to choose the objective material of the discussion. So it's Helen Keller (the commie) or Michael Hardt (the commie). Starkey fails to engage the concept of the becoming-comunist of capitalism, as if capitalism would never mature into anything different (ex-atheist on Jesus).


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 12, 2017)

badger has trouble that "becoming-communist of capitalism" is an issue on no worth to Americans when talking about Christianity and atheism.  Your two examples are the exceptions that prove the rule.


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## badger2 (Nov 13, 2017)

We've seen Starkey attempt this before: "Everybody knows that...." though if the assemblage, "xian-atheist" is truly a non-issue for every (why America here?) one, we would still not be surprised that Starkey cannot explain the concept "becoming-communist of capitalism" in front of the readers in this thread.


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## JakeStarkey (Nov 13, 2017)

We have seen badger try to wiggle and wriggle away but get flattened. When badger explains the concept, I can respond.  

But he can't.


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## Mickiel (Nov 28, 2017)

When you post lies about God, its nothing worse.


----------



## JakeStarkey (Nov 28, 2017)

Who is posting lies about God, Mickiel.


----------



## Mickiel (Nov 28, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> Who is posting lies about God, Mickiel.




Just a general statement, not pointing anyone out. I think all of religion post lies about God, in every public place; because its what they been taught. They post lies because were all deceived; Rev. 12:9; none are excluded from this. We lie because of it.


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## Mickiel (Dec 8, 2017)

You read the title of this thread, and you may think, this is foolish; but is it? Whens the last time you took a serious look at Christianity? For one, look at its sway on people, nearly one third of the whole world are Christians. That's a lot of people.

Now count the many different branches of Christianity there are; who really knows how many offshoots of Christianity there exist?

The Catholics were Christians before the Christians were Christians, so it can be confusing. Why would God filter such confusion?

Why? That is IF Christianity came from God, which I think it did not.

Consider a study of this unusual subject.

Even this;

White Supremacy and Orthodox Christianity: A Dangerous Connection Rears Its Head in Charlottesville

Would God really use a religion to communicate with man?

What do you think?


----------



## JakeStarkey (Dec 8, 2017)

I think the OP is idiocy.


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 8, 2017)

JakeStarkey said:


> I think the OP is idiocy.




Well I just may be; or maybe not.


----------



## JohnPrewett (Dec 8, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> ....
> The Catholics were Christians before the Christians were Christians, so it can be confusing. .......



You are confused, that much is true.   Your beliefs about "Catholics" is a fundamental reason and proof you are confused.

The Acts revealed Church of Jesus Christ  NEVER morphed into the Roman Catholic cult. 

Rather, in 380 AD  the Roman Empire created the Trinitarian Roman State 'church' and claimed it was the real Church. 

The real Church composed of real followers of Christ was among those labeled "heretic" by the Trinitarian cult leaders.


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 9, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > ....
> ...





JohnPrewett said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > ....
> ...




I disagree, many of the church members did morph into the Roman Catholic church, and it was not a cult. The idea of heart felt believers changing and adhering to other doctrines soon after Christ death is biblical. The gospel itself morphed many, many times over, and still is to this day. In Galatians 1:6 Paul even said he was " Amazed", or he " Marveled" that so many were " Soon Removed from the grace Christ taught, to that now of " Another gospel!"

Soon removed. Paul probably wrote that in A.D. 60, just 60 years after Jesus left earth. Just 60 years and the church was " Removed from the original gospel." They began spiritual, now they were getting carnal;" Gal. 3:3." In Rev. 2:4, they " Lost their first Love." They were morphing into the Roman Catholic church. I mean some no doubt did not go bad and kept the faith, but just not enough of them. These were not evil believers, they were like you and I; serious believers who just got misled by a great power. The church slowly morphed year after year, until its what we see today. All confused and fractioned off into group after group.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 9, 2017)

No doubt some Church members did fall away.  Nevertheless the Church never ceased to exist (in fact it grew and thrived).
Empowered by the Pagan Roman Empire, the Trinitarian imitation 'church' also grew and evolved into the multi cult monstrosity it is today.

When He walked in the flesh in ancient Israel,  Jesus spent almost all his time in rural villages,  unnoticed by common 'historians'
In like manner the real Christians and real Church are generally unnoticed by common 'historians' and commentators.
As Christ was generally not seen for who He really was/is,   real Christians are not generally seen for who/what they really are.


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 10, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> No doubt some Church members did fall away.  Nevertheless the Church never ceased to exist (in fact it grew and thrived).
> Empowered by the Pagan Roman Empire, the Trinitarian imitation 'church' also grew and evolved into the multi cult monstrosity it is today.
> 
> When He walked in the flesh in ancient Israel,  Jesus spent almost all his time in rural villages,  unnoticed by common 'historians'
> ...




I agree with much of what you say here. I do not associate the real church with the term " Christian", those two things are not the same thing.


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 12, 2017)

Its sad but a Christian would condemn you before an Atheist would. Its their mind set, they see too much hell in their hearts.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 12, 2017)

Scripture reveals  God/Jesus has a list.  A list of the saved (real Christians).    ("rather rejoice that you name is written in heaven")

No human on earth has access to that list.   (feel free to cite name of anyone you think has access to that list.)

So our human beliefs of who is on the list of saved and who isn't really doesn't matter.    

That being said,  when I hear someone say such as "Jesus is fraud"  then I am confident they are not (at least yet) on the list of saved.

When I hear someone say "Jesus is Lord",  I am confident they are on the list.  Can I be fooled ?  Maybe so ... but Jesus can't be fooled. 

And I pity anyone who pretends to be a Christian and really isn't.  I need not fear about it.


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 12, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Scripture reveals  God/Jesus has a list.  A list of the saved (real Christians).    ("rather rejoice that you name is written in heaven")
> 
> No human on earth has access to that list.   (feel free to cite name of anyone you think has access to that list.)
> 
> ...




Christianity does not hold a monopoly on salvation; there is no list of who is saved; in 1Tim. 2:3-4 God desires that ALL humans be saved;  in Isaiah 45:23 God swears to himself that he will save ALL of humanity.

This tendency of many believers to place people in hell is insane.


----------



## JohnPrewett (Dec 13, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > Scripture reveals  God/Jesus has a list.  A list of the saved (real Christians).    ("rather rejoice that you name is written in heaven")
> ...



Christ Himself has been given the monopoly on salvation.  Jesus alone was sent by God to be alone on the cross for our sins.  
Certainly it is the will of God that all be saved ... sadly, many will thwart-frustrate the the will of God and end up lost. 

To all:  If you come to believe God is going to save EVERYONE ...you will end up very disappointed.   

I could cite a lot of scripture showing that many will not be saved ... but most all are already aware of it.
If you don't believe it .... well,   so be it.    Have a nice day, JP


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 13, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > JohnPrewett said:
> ...




I believe these 600 scriptures that show the salvation of all.


http://haroldlovelace.com/lovelacelist.php

And these 100;


http://www.tentmaker.org/books/ScripturalProofs.html


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 14, 2017)

I just know some Christians hate this thread; but they need it more than they know.

And so do I.


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## Mickiel (Dec 14, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> I just know some Christians hate this thread; but they need it more than they know.
> 
> And so do I.




We don't need some eternal hell, and I see absolutely no reason for a being like God to create such a place; for what? Nothing like the Christian hell was even remotely mentioned in scripture , and no Atheist has ever devised such an ending for humanity. According to most Atheist, we just end at death.

The bible never suggested hell or eternal punishment as the fate for unbelievers. It was never mentioned to Adam, Eve, Noah, Abraham, Lot, Moses, David, Solomon, Cain, or even the people of Sodom and Gomorrah.  There is no mention of the creation of hell in all of the new testament, or the purpose of it, nothing in the entire bible gives a reason why a god would create such a place, and nowhere is it even explained a reason why such a place will be needed.

Jesus was not beaten so bad on the cross, in order to create a way that humans will be beaten an eternity for just sinning. That would make the punishment greater than the crime, something even humans do not really do that much. Our laws are not designed like that.

If their hell was real, it would mean that the results of sin are far greater than the shed blood of Christ and God's forgiveness, Mercy and Grace.

What's wrong with this picture?


----------



## JohnPrewett (Dec 15, 2017)

40 “The King will answer, ‘Truly I say to you, as you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’

41 “Then He will say to those at the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the eternal fire, prepared for the devil and his angels


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 15, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> 40 “The King will answer, ‘Truly I say to you, as you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’
> 
> 41 “Then He will say to those at the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the eternal fire, prepared for the devil and his angels




Prepared for the devil and his demons, NOT humans!


----------



## JohnPrewett (Dec 16, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > 40 “The King will answer, ‘Truly I say to you, as you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’
> ...



Jesus is clearly talking about humans .... which you can see but won't admit   .... cause you have become committed to a lie


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 16, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > JohnPrewett said:
> ...




Well yes, I am committed to the salvation of God, because in my view, God and Jesus are; they are because they completely love us all. Just as you are committed to a limited number of salvation, I am believing and hoping for an unlimited number; because I have seen too many humans who need that from God, their in bad shape. And according to the bible, I am allowed to hope ALL things; so your dismal assessment  of my commitments is meaningless, but I honor your belief in God. Sorry we disagree, that kind of thing happens.


----------



## JohnPrewett (Dec 16, 2017)

Some claim God-Jesus are going to save everyone.  The caveat is that if scripture is true and God-Jesus are not going to save everyone,  
 (but are in fact going to send some to an eternal damnation-fire) ,  then in their opinion,    ipso facto God-Jesus are evil.     

So... the 'all are saved' group claim,  if pertinent scripture is true ... then God-Jesus are evil.    To get God-Jesus 'off the hook' they must claim the pertinent scripture is false.


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 16, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Some claim God-Jesus are going to save everyone.  The caveat is that if scripture is true and God-Jesus are not going to save everyone,
> (but are in fact going to send some to an eternal damnation-fire) ,  then in their opinion,    ipso facto God-Jesus are evil.
> 
> So... the 'all are saved' group claim,  if pertinent scripture is true ... then God-Jesus are evil.    To get God-Jesus 'off the hook' they must claim the pertinent scripture is false.




Greetings John, I remember a bit of time ago during a study of Isaiah, I looked at chapter 45, verses 21-25. A stunning couple of verses again with God himself doing the talking. I am a firm believer that anything the Father has said in scripture, cannot be trumped or changed or over written by any other biblical character. Including Jesus. God calls himself , in verse 21 " A Just God and Saviour!"  He tells in 22, look unto him, ALL the ends of the earth and be saved! God is being all inclusive with this prophecy. But amazingly John, in verse 23 he continues with his prophecy but labels it " A Vow." A vow is an earnest promise to "Perform a specified act!" So what God is about to reveal is VERY serious and important to him. And its his only vow recorded in scripture.

Notice, " I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness and shall not return, that unto me EVERY knee shall bow, and EVERY mouth shall confess." Wow, God is swearing; and he said this word has been sent out into reality and will not return to him unaccomplished.  Every single human ever created shall bow to him and confess to him , and both of those are solid signs of human conversion. When you bow to God and confess to him, its going to be because God has already decreed that you will. You are saved, not because of anything you have done , this salvation came out of God's mouth IN RIGHTEOUSNESS, HIS Righteousness. Those believers who doubt this, simply doubt the true power of God.

In verse 25 it states in the Lord ALL the seed of Israel shall be justified. But the Fathers reason for this incredible justification and him topping it off with Jesus death, is to GIVE salvation to ALL, that is the true gospel, the stunning good news-- we ALL make it! In Romans 5:18, " Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation, ( Christianity sees that part , religion can always see condemnation, but the incredible mercy and grace of God must just be hard to see and believe), " Even so by the righteousness of one, the FREE GIFT came upon ALL MEN unto justification of life!

So true salvation is free; it cannot be earned, we don't have to bargain with God,  it is a gift! Its God given and its free. Christianity always tries to roadblock that, teaching we have to " Accept Christ", live good, go to church, it goes on and on, like a list of demands. They mean well , but once you learn the incredible simplicity in the salvation of God, it will increase your faith in the salvation of yourself, and others! You will no longer try to limit who gets into God's Kingdom. Jesus saw that in the Pharisees in Matt. 23:13, he taught they " Shut up the Kingdom of heaven against men." You know, just road block the free gift.


----------



## The Irish Ram (Dec 16, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > 40 “The King will answer, ‘Truly I say to you, as you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’
> ...



He was talking about both.  A question I have seen here is, "Why would God create a such a place for those He is suppose to love?" The verse above answers that.  He didn't.  It was created for Satan and the the angels that chose to follow Satan.  It will also be home to those who chose to follow their Father, Satan.  
Not all children are God's children.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 17, 2017)

Yes, salvation is a gift. Sadly some permanently reject the gift.   Some/many adamantly permanently claim the gift not given.   

At some point .... One must believe to receive ...... 

Claiming all will be saved is tantamount to telling people "believe anything you want to... behave any way you want to .... no need for any repentance  .... you'll still be saved"

Like the predestinationist that claims if you are 'predestined to be saved' , 
 then you could jump off the skyscraper and curse Jesus all the way down and still be saved ! 

Note from OT: 

'.......all flesh shall come to worship before Me, says the Lord. 
24 And they shall go forth and look on the corpses of the men who have transgressed against Me. 
*For their worm shall not die, nor shall their fire be quenched. *
And they shall be an abhorrence to all flesh.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 17, 2017)

I call heaven and earth to witnesses against you this day, that I have set before you *life* and death, blessing and curse. 
Therefore *choose* *life*, that both you and your descendants may live;
Deuteronomy 30:19


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## Mickiel (Dec 17, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> I call heaven and earth to witnesses against you this day, that I have set before you *life* and death, blessing and curse.
> Therefore *choose* *life*, that both you and your descendants may live;
> Deuteronomy 30:19




God is not stupid John, if any of his children choose death and curses, he still will not allow their ignorance to doom them. Would you do that to your children for choosing drugs and crime as a lifestyle? Would you punish your kids forever  for being stupid and ignorant? In Isaiah 66:9 God ask the question should he create humans , cause them to be born and have life, only not to allow them to have a greater birth? Should he close his womb to that? No, God will not shut off salvation for any stupid human reasoning coming from his confused blood thirsty  followers.

This is the future of human sin, Isaiah 65:17, " For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth,  and the former shall not be remembered , nor come to mind." All humans worthy of death and punishment , will be punished and then released and cleaned; and interestingly cleaned by the lake of fire, which I think is its purpose for humans, we all will be salted with this fire, Mark 9:49. This belief of eternal hell punishing is a VERY hard assessment to place on humans for being weak and surcomming to sin. I mean if you take a pin and stick it in my thumb 5 times a minute, for 24 hours a day, then do that to me for an eternity, listen most people would go mad in less than a year of this minor punishing. If you think about it, its insane and is an assault on the true character of God. It is teaching and has taught unbelievers and Atheist that God is an ego maniac, hurting you forever for just not believing in him. Something he can take care of in seconds.

Christ is ALL AND IN ALL, Col. 3:11. And for every negative scripture that is brought up to defend this arcane punishing, I can show humans being forgiven, changed and saved, praise God , with your same bible.

Hey listen, the REASON Jesus came to earth was to save the earth. Not the physical earth, but ALL the humans on it! All the horrible sin and reasons why you see humans not being granted God's Kingdom, have been removed! Listen to Jesus ; in Luke 5:32, " I came not to call the righteous, ( or believers),  but sinners to repentance, ( or unbelievers).  All those humans who you think are not going to make it, ARE the reason Jesus came to us, his focus is on unbelievers. And Jesus HAS the power to " Subdue all things to himself", Phil. 3:21, some Christians just don't believe he will use that power, largely because of their faulty views on this so called " Free will doctrine." Again error can corrupt a wonderful truth like the salvation of this world. Jesus is not going to stand there and allow humans to be neglected this great free gift of love from the Father.

In 1John 4:14, " We have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the World!" Jesus came to call sinners to repentance, ( so all sinners are " Called of God!),  and he did that because the Father sent him on this Holy mission, he has not failed.  If just ONE humans is lost, then we cannot call him a world savior, because world in scripture means All. This is good news, the guilt of sin no longer needs to haunt us, we no longer have to worry about our loved ones and those who had ragged corrupt lives. They are totally copvered.

One may rightfully ask or say, well if that's the case , people can live any kind of way they wish; news flash, that's what they were going to do anyway. Hey God has that covered. In Romans 11:32 For God has locked  them all up in unbelief, that he might have Mercy on them All." Lock them up now in their sin, with the Holy purpose of freeing them up later. That is part of his plan, and notice the use of the term " All." Still we see this great pattern of " Inclusion" in scripture.

Look at how " All" is constantly being used;


http://www.tentmaker.org/tracts/DoYouBelieve.html


----------



## Mickiel (Dec 17, 2017)

The Irish Ram said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > JohnPrewett said:
> ...




Well we agree partly, but I see no nothing in scripture that can subtract any human being birthed , or created by God, thus all humans belong to him. All are the actual children of God. Notice then Psalms 24:1, " The earth is the Lord's , and the FULLNEST thereof; the world and they who dwell on it!" In other words all humans are Gods children, you cannot tell anyone that they do not belong to God, but some Christians are separatist like that, they like to remove people from salvation. If anyone dares tell me I am not God's child, I would just show them Col. 3:11, where it states that Christ is all and IN All!"

Religion has been steered off the course of the true salvation God has issued, now this brutal separatist spirit has invaded their consciousness , and they are blind to it; infected with the burning pages of pagan history, they think God cannot change a human in sin. God, the author and finisher of salvation, they dare claim that he is going to loose millions of sheep, when Jesus said he would not loose one.

Don't you listen to that, God will do no such thing.


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## Death Angel (Dec 17, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


Still proselytizing your godless religion I see. You have nothing to offer.


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## Mickiel (Dec 17, 2017)

Death Angel said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




Nothing to offer to you, and I regret that you see no value in it; I wish that you could. I really do. I believe these things with all my heart.

So I offer all my heart and that what I am saying is the truth that I understand at this time. Can I be wrong?  Sure I can be, I been wrong about things all my life. I look back, because hindsight is better than foresight, and after I have learned, evolved and grew some, I can look back and find where I was in error . You just be glad you were corrected, change and move on.

But I love writing; I got nothing better to do.


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## TroglocratsRdumb (Dec 17, 2017)

Were not Hitler, Stalin and Mao atheist?


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## The Irish Ram (Dec 17, 2017)

A group of Jews weren't happy with Moses.  God started to drop them like flies, to the point that Aaron ran out in their midst and asked God to spare the rest.  No saving or changing of their minds before Aaron arrived.  Just Dead.
How many did David kill with a bone from an ass?  They are still dead.
Where is Judas?  Christ said he kept them all but one.  The one that was turned over to Satan.
Christ said there were those that make Him puke.  Those He tells to get away from Him because they used His protocol to create miracles, but never knew Him. 
God said in the end times, of those who reject Him, that He will turn them over to Satan.
Every human has the potential to be a child of God.  Not everyone chooses to be.  There is only one way to the Father and that is through Christ.  Those who refuse the gift that Christ offered, do not enter God's domain. You can either accept Christ's sin free record in place of your own sin covered record, to enter our Father's house*, or not*.
If you die covered in your sin, then you take your chances at the White Throne Judgment.


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## Mickiel (Dec 17, 2017)

The Irish Ram said:


> A group of Jews weren't happy with Moses.  God started to drop them like flies, to the point that Aaron ran out in their midst and asked God to spare the rest.  No saving or changing of their minds before Aaron arrived.  Just Dead.
> How many did David kill with a bone from an ass?  They are still dead.
> Where is Judas?  Christ said he kept them all but one.  The one that was turned over to Satan.
> Christ said there were those that make Him puke.  Those He tells to get away from Him because they used His protocol to create miracles, but never knew Him.
> ...


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## Mickiel (Dec 19, 2017)

Humanity was created by God to live, not to die and stay dead. Life is all of our destiny; life with Jesus and our incredible loving Father God. No religion, especially Christianity, can cut short the salvation of humanity; they cannot keep us away from God , nor can they hog the Kingdom unto themselves. No Christian has any say so in the salvation of another. Christians are too condemning for God to involve them in the salvation of sinners. No human stands between me and God. Or you and God.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 20, 2017)

Revelation makes it plain that whosoever takes "mark" and worship Beast/image will end up eternally tormented. 
Revelation makes it plain that whosoever refuses to take "mark" and refuses to worship Beast/image will "reign with Christ." 
Satan wants all to end up with Satan in eternal torment. 
Jesus's servants warn all to heed Revelation and decline taking of "mark" and decline worship of the Beast/image.
We are heading toward a simple test.  
Pass the test and one reigns with Christ.   Jesus's servants encourage all to pass the test. 
Fail the test and one spends eternity in torment.   Satan's servants hope you will fail the test. 

" I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and the authority to judge was given to them. 
And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness of Jesus and for the word of God. 
They had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. 
They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.   Revelation 20:4

 “If anyone worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, 
10 he also shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out in full strength into the cup of His anger. 
He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 
11 The smoke of their torment will ascend forever and ever. They have no rest day or night, 
who worship the beast and his image and whoever receives the mark of his name.”   Revelation 14:9-11


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## Mickiel (Dec 20, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Revelation makes it plain that whosoever takes "mark" and worship Beast/image will end up eternally tormented.
> Revelation makes it plain that whosoever refuses to take "mark" and refuses to worship Beast/image will "reign with Christ."
> Satan wants all to end up with Satan in eternal torment.
> Jesus's servants warn all to heed Revelation and decline taking of "mark" and decline worship of the Beast/image.
> ...




I think the mark of the beast is a religious way of thinking. More than likely the Christian way of thinking. Its a conscious way of false understanding.


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## Mickiel (Dec 22, 2017)

Christianity operates like a mob, and the pastors are the dons, and the members are treated like suckers who are led like mindless sheep.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 22, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Christianity operates like a mob, and the pastors are the dons, and the members are treated like suckers who are led like mindless sheep.



Organized christianish religion does operate the way you describe.    
Jesus's people have been and are heeding Jesus's command to "COME OUT" of the many cults that comprise organized christianish religion.


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## Mickiel (Dec 22, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christianity operates like a mob, and the pastors are the dons, and the members are treated like suckers who are led like mindless sheep.
> ...




In most of the Christian church services, you have a pastor who really is one big mouth, and the members who are many ears. They just sit and listen to the mouth. The first services in history was nothing like that, they all participated in the services. And they did it in homes, not buildings.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 22, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...



Yea,  I've known that for over 40 years.  I realized that shortly after becoming a believer and reading 1 Corinthians 14

26 How is it then, brothers? When you come together, every one of you has a psalm, a teaching, a tongue, a revelation, and an interpretation. Let all things be done for edification. 27 If anyone speaks in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and each in turn, and let one interpret. 28 But if there is no interpreter, let him remain silent in the church, and let him speak to himself and to God.

29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others judge. 30 If anything is revealed to another that sits by, let the first keep silent. 31 For you may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn and all may be encouraged. 32 The spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. 33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints. ............
36 What? Did the word of God come from you? Or did it come to you only? 37 If anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that what I am writing you is a command of the Lord. 38 But if anyone is ignorant, let him be ignorant.


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## Votto (Dec 23, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.



I see, so God is leading you to condemn the condemners..............

Nice.


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## Mickiel (Dec 23, 2017)

Votto said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




There is no condemnation in Christ Jesus; You cannot find, in these archives, me condemning anyone. Your observation of me is dead wrong.

You obviously can't read, or take the time to read???


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## Mickiel (Dec 23, 2017)

Christianity is more dangerous than Atheism because they are hiding behind God, using God as their back round.  Claiming that God speaks to them. Atheist don't do that.


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## Mickiel (Dec 25, 2017)

Christianity tries to put themselves in the place of God. A very dangerous thing to do. They are a dangerous people.


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## JohnPrewett (Dec 25, 2017)

"Christianity" is a nebulous vague label .... 
as you use it it it's just a way to slander everybody with even the most tenuous association with Christ


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## Mickiel (Dec 29, 2017)

JohnPrewett said:


> "Christianity" is a nebulous vague label ....
> as you use it it it's just a way to slander everybody with even the most tenuous association with Christ




It is a vague label, but it is being used by 2.2 billion people; they are thus placing themselves into the line of free game criticism.


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## Mickiel (Dec 31, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> JohnPrewett said:
> 
> 
> > "Christianity" is a nebulous vague label ....
> ...




For some strange prideful reason, Christianity thinks its above criticism. Their spiritual ego is a monster!


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## Meriweather (Dec 31, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> For some strange prideful reason, Christianity thinks its above criticism. Their spiritual ego is a monster!



No, that's missing the mark.  Christians understand that as humans we are not going to be able to live our faith perfectly or be perfect people or that even our rites are perfection.  Christians acknowledge valid criticism.  

What happens on forums is similar to a person showing up at a football game and criticizing it because no one bowled a strike.  Oftentimes criticism is so far out in left field, that we are on two different fields, talking about two different games.


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## Mickiel (Dec 31, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > For some strange prideful reason, Christianity thinks its above criticism. Their spiritual ego is a monster!
> ...




Well I agree that does happen, and I agree that" Some Christians" acknowledge criticism, just not enough of them. There are 2.2 billion Christians, and in my view, most of them think they are so spiritual, that they cannot be criticized. They think they hold a monopoly on righteousness.


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## Meriweather (Dec 31, 2017)

Mickiel said:


> Well I agree that does happen, and I agree that" Some Christians" acknowledge criticism, just not enough of them. There are 2.2 billion Christians, and in my view, most of them think they are so spiritual, that they cannot be criticized. They think they hold a monopoly on righteousness.



Perhaps you need to get around more Christians?  I know Christians of all denominations, none of whom use the term "spiritual" in regards to themselves.  They are are often the first to criticize themselves.  Rather than thinking we have a hold on monopoly on righteousness, most of us are striving just to reach out and touch it.  It is what draws us to religion.


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## Mickiel (Dec 31, 2017)

Meriweather said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Well I agree that does happen, and I agree that" Some Christians" acknowledge criticism, just not enough of them. There are 2.2 billion Christians, and in my view, most of them think they are so spiritual, that they cannot be criticized. They think they hold a monopoly on righteousness.
> ...




I was a Christian for 35 years, and I have met Christians from all over the world, and communicated with them. They are some of the most condemning religious folk I have ever known, eternal hell punishing is their idea of dealing with unbelievers. They think they are God's anointed. They feel they, and they alone hold the kingdom of God in their hands. They think they are kings!  The list goes on and on, I turned away from it because I got tired of the fertile deception, and their total blindness to it.

But some of them are good people, I have known some good Christians.


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## sealybobo (Jan 3, 2018)

Mickiel said:


> Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> 
> An Atheist, is an Atheist, because they are supposed to be Atheist; we are what we are, because we should be that way. Atheism is just " Anti-religion", it is not " The Anti-Christ." I believe Anti Christ are believers in Christ who just spread a perverted form of a messed up gospel. And they don't even know they are doing that, which is what makes them so dangerous. They think they are serving God, when actually  satan is leading them like a blind sheep. They have incredible large super ego's and a stunning form of self righteousness; a very dangerous people because there are over 2.2 billion of them on earth; that's one third of humanity. They hold incredible influence, and satan knows that he has used that in his deception of the whole earth, Rev. 12:9. What better way to get into humanities head, than to go through a self perceived pure religion? Its simply stunning how Christianity has deceived humanity.


 Do you know how you can tell Christianity is more dangerous than atheism? 99.9 percent of the prison population in America are religious. atheism almost doesn’t exist in prison.


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## Mickiel (Jan 4, 2018)

sealybobo said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Life is lived forward but often understood backwards. One thing I have learned, is that religion is more of a threat to human salvation than any kind of unbelief in God. If you receive a perverted  form of truth, you would be better off if you received nothing at all. I grow tired of reading some Christians complaining about Atheist , as if an Atheist is a treat to human salvation. More Christians hold a condemning view of other humans than any group of unbelievers have. Christianity  holds a monopoly on condemning others, and using the bible to do so. Using a book of salvation, to pronounce damnation on people; its unbelievable! In my view, Christianity is one of the largest roadblocks to human salvation on earth. They condemn far more humans than Atheist do. And its simply incredible how Christianity gets away with this daily. Christianity has muddied the resume of God.
> ...




I don't believe either one of those, but I would say that more religious people are in prison that Atheist.


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## sealybobo (Jan 4, 2018)

Mickiel said:


> sealybobo said:
> 
> 
> > Mickiel said:
> ...


Just know that the two times religion was forced on us (the crusades and Islam) math science logic and reason were attacked.

They still do it to this day. Tell a Christian you’re an atheist. Immediately they will equate that with immorality


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## rightwinger (Jan 4, 2018)

Nobody has ever been killed in the name of atheism


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## Mickiel (Jan 4, 2018)

rightwinger said:


> Nobody has ever been killed in the name of atheism




I doubt that is true, but I would offer my speculation that " Not many have been killed in the name of Atheism."


----------



## Mickiel (Jan 4, 2018)

Mickiel said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody has ever been killed in the name of atheism
> ...




Atheist Myth: “No One Has Ever Killed in the Name of Atheism”


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## daisiesRwild (Jan 27, 2018)

Christians are being just as deceived because Jesus would not be caught dead involved in any religions on earth today they are all corrupt and all began with evil intent


----------



## TyroneSlothrop (Jan 27, 2018)




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## daisiesRwild (Jan 27, 2018)

Jesus would not belong to any organized religion of today because they are all corrupt and is why he said he would send the Holy Spirit to teach us...


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## Mickiel (Jan 30, 2018)

daisiesRwild said:


> Christians are being just as deceived because Jesus would not be caught dead involved in any religions on earth today they are all corrupt and all began with evil intent




I agree.


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## Mickiel (Feb 3, 2018)

You know what makes religion and Christianity; Islam, Roman Catholics and all world religions so dangerous and sullen? And its so simple its being ignored; they have the arcane nerve to place more humans into their hells and pain pits and places of failure, than they do their spots of mercy and forgiveness and grace and love of life so live!

And they have more nerve to believe that God is like they are.


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## sealybobo (Feb 3, 2018)

Mickiel said:


> You know what makes religion and Christianity; Islam, Roman Catholics and all world religions so dangerous and sullen? And its so simple its being ignored; they have the arcane nerve to place more humans into their hells and pain pits and places of failure, than they do their spots of mercy and forgiveness and grace and love of life so live!
> 
> And they have more nerve to believe that God is like they are.


Here’s the problem with people believing in what’s in these holy books. Look at the Nunes memo. Look how some people believe that memo vindicates trump but then if Nunes is the gospel then I guess that means people are gullible and will swallow anything.

I’m not trying to make this political but I see one side pointing to the Nunes memo and treating it as if his opinions are fact. People are sheep. This notion preys on our fears and ignorance


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## Mickiel (Feb 3, 2018)

sealybobo said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > You know what makes religion and Christianity; Islam, Roman Catholics and all world religions so dangerous and sullen? And its so simple its being ignored; they have the arcane nerve to place more humans into their hells and pain pits and places of failure, than they do their spots of mercy and forgiveness and grace and love of life so live!
> ...




Well most humans are sheep like, which is why the more dynamic and powerful humans rule. If you look back through history, its always been that way. Minds are as easy to mold than baking flour to a shape. Many people are too lazy to think hard for themselves, and just as many are addicted to needing others to lead them to think. Politics is basically just the present foolishness of man. " All we like sheep have gone astray", each to our own addictive leaders and ways of being that we think is right.

Which is why I will always walk alone in this life and think only for myself.


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## Mickiel (Feb 8, 2018)

Christians condemn all Atheist to their sick morbid hell domain ;  that makes them a dangerous people; worst than cannibals.


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## Mickiel (Jun 17, 2018)

Mickiel said:


> Christians condemn all Atheist to their sick morbid hell domain ;  that makes them a dangerous people; worst than cannibals.




When you publish , or agree in public, these morbid doctrines, like the eternal punishing doctrine - which is a teaching that involves hurting people every moment for all of eternity, nothing can be worse than that. Then when you involve God in that horrid belief, I think its a public enemy number one kind of thing.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 17, 2018)

daisiesRwild said:


> Jesus would not belong to any organized religion of today because they are all corrupt and is why he said he would send the Holy Spirit to teach us...


Dear daisiesRwild
He came for the sick not the well.
If all religions, political parties, and greedy corporations are sick and abusive or oppressive, he'd be hanging out with the prostitutes who are at least honest about what's going on. He'd be converting the taxcollectors on the road to Damascus. He'd tell us to render unto Caesar what is Caesars and until God what is God. Separate all party and religious tribes to fund what is theirs. And forgive our differences and practice what we preach by our own policies instead of blaming our neighbors for theirs. He'd let God judge what is God's to judge. Fir everyone else, we'd be judged by the words and standards we live by and if we criticize others for contradicting themselves while we do the same when it comes to our own standards. Since all humans make hypocritical errors in judgment, we'd all be found at fault for jumping on other people while we are no better or worse relatively speaking. Jesus meaning equal justice for all would have us joining in correcting and restoring relations mutually to establish truth law and order and peace. Anyone who is in the business of rejecting others by judging as you do now would be part of the problem instead of the solution which is to correct the issues affecting us all, not just pointing fingers at a different group saying it's them not us that has to change. We all have to change our attitude and work together to make the corrections we want to see in the world. That's the change that's going to bring about justice or Jesus to return and save all humanity to live in peace not war.


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## emilynghiem (Jun 17, 2018)

Mickiel said:


> Christians condemn all Atheist to their sick morbid hell domain ;  that makes them a dangerous people; worst than cannibals.


Dear Mickiel doesn't that make all people equal who do this to each other. Whether it's atheists condemning Christian's, Republicans and Democrats condemning each other, rich vs poor or poor blaming the rich. Aren't we all in danger of judgment by judging who we blame more instead of treating all people and groups equally responsible for their share of corrections that need to be made. Isn't the point of equal Justice and humanity that all people are equal under law?


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## Cellblock2429 (Jun 17, 2018)

emilynghiem said:


> daisiesRwild said:
> 
> 
> > Jesus would not belong to any organized religion of today because they are all corrupt and is why he said he would send the Holy Spirit to teach us...
> ...


/——/ He’d also preach that a man shall not lay with a man as if a woman. It is an abomination


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## irosie91 (Jun 17, 2018)

Cellblock2429 said:


> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> > daisiesRwild said:
> ...



he also said that one need not wash his hands before eating------
--------try telling that one to my mama.  

The  NT is a very IMPORTANT BOOK-----it must be read with
discernment.      PS--I do not recall jesus saying anything about
men lying with men.    Moses said that-----prude that he was


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## emilynghiem (Jun 17, 2018)

Cellblock2429 said:


> emilynghiem said:
> 
> 
> > daisiesRwild said:
> ...


Moreover, any sexual relations between people who are not spiritually committed partners is adultery, even the act of lusting in the heart for someone who is the spiritually the wife or husband of someone else.

However there is Spiritual Healing that can remove the cause of lust addiction or other conflicting issue. Jesus would have more people receive Healing, which is based on Forgiveness so that natural healing can take place, rather than judging and rejecting based on Unforgiveness which is the only Unforgiveness sin even God cannot change. We have to he willing to ask help to remove Unforgiveness for God to help us receiving healing. And that's the key we are missing. If we don't ask we don't receive. 

Cellblock2429 judging and condemning just makes rejection worse. All the spiritual healers who have ever succeeded in helping people overcome homosexual or adulterous attractions know that to teach forgiveness and healing we have to practice and offer it for people to receive it. That's how healing works


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## emilynghiem (Jun 17, 2018)

irosie91 said:


> Cellblock2429 said:
> 
> 
> > emilynghiem said:
> ...


Jesus did say that lusting in ones heart was already the spirit of adultery. Just like anger in our hearts is already the spirit of murder which kills relationships with our neighbors instead of restoring them with grace forgivness and healing in Christ Jesus. we all want justice and peace and freedom that comes with truth, but have to ask with the spirit of forgiveness in order to receive in full. If we don't forgive first we still block ourselves with biases and cannot fully receive yet. irosie91 Cellblock2429
That's why humanity is stuck, but that's how we re going to get unstuck: the more we forgive the more we can receive and the more relations trust and truth we can reclaim. Jesus represents breaking the cycle of Injustice to bring in real peace and justice based on God's highest laws not man's selfish biased demands for justice that aren't universal as true Justice is that equally includes and saves all people from destruction. That univesal Justice is what it means for Jesus to be the Savior and Lord or Law for all people. To receive Jesus leads to committing and uniting to establish and enforce equal justice under law for all people.


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 17, 2018)

Christians, I advise you leave the evangelical-fundamentalist-Pentecostals to duke it out with the atheists.

True believes will not get involved in their demonish battles.


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## Cellblock2429 (Jun 17, 2018)

rdean said:


> Being an atheist is not dangerous.  We don't want to kill gays.


/———/ Neither do Christians. Love the sinner, hate the sin.


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 17, 2018)

*Evangelical Christians* Evangelizing *Hate* Must Be Stopped ...
Empathy and Relationships 18, 2017 *...* "The anti-*gay* violence, some experts contend, can be traced to Brazil's culture of machismo and a brand of *evangelical Christianity*, exported ...


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## Cellblock2429 (Jun 17, 2018)

JakeStarkey said:


> *Evangelical Christians* Evangelizing *Hate* Must Be Stopped ...
> Empathy and Relationships 18, 2017 *...* "The anti-*gay* violence, some experts contend, can be traced to Brazil's culture of machismo and a brand of *evangelical Christianity*, exported ...


/——-/ “some experts?”  Bwhahahaha Bwhahahaha Who decided they are experts? Bwhahahaha Bwhahahaha


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## JakeStarkey (Jun 17, 2018)

Cellblock2429 said:


> JakeStarkey said:
> 
> 
> > *Evangelical Christians* Evangelizing *Hate* Must Be Stopped ...
> ...


Oh, they are, and you are not.  Just the way it goes for evangies.


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## Mickiel (Jun 17, 2018)

emilynghiem said:


> Mickiel said:
> 
> 
> > Christians condemn all Atheist to their sick morbid hell domain ;  that makes them a dangerous people; worst than cannibals.
> ...




Yes , but in this particular thread I am targeting Christianity ,  so my focus is on them. Its a big target too!


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## JohnPrewett (Jun 17, 2018)

*Originally Posted by John Prewett:* _I very well understand why non-Christians consider it bizarre. However, Christians (at least those I deem fit to be labeled "Christian") understand why Jesus was crucified and thus can understand my reasoning. Everybody's body is going to die. I want the death of my body (and return a few days later) to be used by Jesus toward the salvation of souls. And confirmation of my life's work/activity.   _

* Originally Posted by Elvira * _What scripture supports that idea?_

John Prewett reply:  John 14:14 "If ye shall *ask* any thing in my name, I will do it"

*I've asked Jesus *to see to it that after a few days of empowerment (as per Isaiah 40:31) a hit squad (sent by minions of Satan's Pope led Globalist cabal) will in broad daylight in presence of a few witness come through my gate and after identifying me, without further adieu fire several rounds into my chest, then cut my head off and depart the scene .... 
leaving my body and head at the scene.  Then a few days later my Thai family and neighbors will take my body to the local Temple for cremation. When my family and some neighbors return to our home (scene of the killing) I will greet them,  sitting in my swing.         Jesus will either fix my old body, or spring for a brand new body. 

Won't they be surprised ?  Naturally some will ask how I went from headless-dead to living ... and this will give me opportunity to proclaim Jesus to them.  Great plan ... eh ! Bet you wish you'd thought of it first .... course *God thought of it first ....          you know, the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus*

There will be 2 different groups of empowered - Page 4 

www.mosquitonet.com/~prewett/


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## Mickiel (Jun 21, 2018)

Christianity is more dangerous than Atheism because they have the tools to the Kingdom, but are using those tools to dig eternal suffering graves for unbelievers.

Christianity will not give its life to save a world;  its religion must survive,.


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