# Western Canadiens consider succession form Canada...



## insein (Aug 9, 2005)

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2005/08/09/1165467-cp.html



> Poll: Westerners considering separation
> 
> CALGARY (CP) - More than one-third of western Canadians surveyed this summer thought it was time to consider separation from Canada, a poll suggests.
> 
> ...


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## dilloduck (Aug 9, 2005)

insein said:
			
		

> http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2005/08/09/1165467-cp.html


 well--It sure as hell is big enough to split up. Maybe they will come up with some cool names like the Republic of Frozen Moose Bones or something. :


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 9, 2005)

What would be the reasons behind this? out of curiosity.


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## archangel (Aug 9, 2005)

Avatar4321 said:
			
		

> What would be the reasons behind this? out of curiosity.




For the most part Western Canada is Conservative...Eastern is Liberal(Ultra)...
Canada is starting to feel the embarrassment of the Ultra Liberal party...and war protestors!


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## Avatar4321 (Aug 9, 2005)

archangel said:
			
		

> For the most part Western Canada is Conservative...Eastern is Liberal(Ultra)...
> Canada is starting to feel the embarrassment of the Ultra Liberal party...and war protestors!



ah well if they want to seceed and join the US we would gladly welcome them then


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## Said1 (Aug 9, 2005)

archangel said:
			
		

> For the most part Western Canada is Conservative...Eastern is Liberal(Ultra)...
> Canada is starting to feel the embarrassment of the Ultra Liberal party...and war protestors!



Actually no, it's about money and representation in the house of commons.


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## archangel (Aug 9, 2005)

Said1 said:
			
		

> Actually no, it's about money and representation in the house of commons.




Of all the Western Canadians I met at the Reno,Nevada rodeo would beg to differ with you!


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## Said1 (Aug 9, 2005)

archangel said:
			
		

> Of all the Western Canadians I met at the Reno,Nevada rodeo would beg to differ with you!



Ok, you're right, I'm wrong.  You're the all wise and all knowing master Yoda Poo-bah. Ali-salemah. It's about the ultra Liberal party...and war protestors. Nothing to do with transfer payments, resource control and federal representation to name a few. Ok. You win, I lose. From this day forward, I will walk around with a bag over my head in shame. I know nothing about my country or the province where I grew up.....shame on me. I suck.


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## archangel (Aug 9, 2005)

Said1 said:
			
		

> Ok, you're right, I'm wrong.  You're the all wise and all knowing master Yoda Poo-bah. Ali-salemah. It's about the ultra Liberal party...and war protestors. Nothing to do with transfer payments, resource control and federal representation to name a few. Ok. You win, I lose. From this day forward, I will walk around with a bag over my head in shame. I know nothing about my country or the province where I grew up.....shame on me. I suck.




Y'all from the North come in here and tell us southerners all about our country...and how we suck...then when we tell ya about how we see your country...geez..we are the know it alls! :baby:


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## Said1 (Aug 9, 2005)

archangel said:
			
		

> Y'all from the North come in here and tell us southerners all about our country...and how we suck...then when we tell ya about how we see your country...geez..we are the know it alls! :baby:



I don't recall doing that, and yes, you are acting like a know it all. You wrote what a few people at a rodeo think about the feds and anit-war protestors. I'm sure they know that what really lies at the heart of the matter involves money and more recently, Kyoto. The Kyoto accord would have adversely affected Alberta (energy industry) and Ontario, but Ottawa (the feds) exempted the Ontario auto industry from the accord. And Albertians are also strongly opposed to the same sex marriage bill. Anyway, Klein seems to be downplaying the idea of seperation now. He's a big mouth, lots of bark but only able to chase a cat up a tree.


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## archangel (Aug 9, 2005)

Said1 said:
			
		

> I don't recall doing that, and yes, you are acting like a know it all. You wrote what a few people at a rodeo think about the feds and anit-war protestors. I'm sure they know that what really lies at the heart of the matter involves money and more recently, Kyoto. The Kyoto accord would have adversely affected Alberta (energy industry) and Ontario, but Ottawa (the feds) exempted the Ontario auto industry from the accord. And Albertians are also strongly opposed to the same sex marriage bill. Anyway, Klein seems to be downplaying the idea of seperation now. He's a big mouth, lots of bark but only able to chase a cat up a tree.





gotta run...however we are both know it all's...as witnessed by your above commentary...I just made a comment based on real time exchange of views between a few good old boys....ya want to chastize me for that....be my guest!....Kiss Kiss-Hug...hug!


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## Said1 (Aug 9, 2005)

archangel said:
			
		

> gotta run...however we are both know it all's...as witnessed by your above commentary...I just made a comment based on real time exchange of views between a few good old boys....ya want to chastize me for that....be my guest!....Kiss Kiss-Hug...hug!




Does it hurt.......I mean all that flip flopping?  :tng:


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## MrMarbles (Aug 9, 2005)

I'm from Manitoba, and I have never heard people talk of splitting the province off from Canada. I've only heard of sentiments like that (in the West) from small niche groups in Alberta.


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## Said1 (Aug 9, 2005)

MrMarbles said:
			
		

> I'm from Manitoba, and I have never heard people talk of splitting the province off from Canada. I've only heard of sentiments like that (in the West) from small niche groups in Alberta.



Darn tootin. D)  I've heard Klein mention it publiclly a few times, but he's downplaying it now. To my knowledge there is no movement, only small groups of ultra-conservatives - one of which is lead by  Earnest Zundle's lawyer.


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## archangel (Aug 9, 2005)

Said1 said:
			
		

> Does it hurt.......I mean all that flip flopping?  :tng:





Ya have to flip before you flop...I just gave a simple opinion...no stats,no links
just a good old boy conversation!


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## HorhayAtAMD (Aug 9, 2005)

MrMarbles said:
			
		

> I'm from Manitoba, and I have never heard people talk of splitting the province off from Canada. I've only heard of sentiments like that (in the West) from small niche groups in Alberta.



No kidding. I seriously doubt that 40%+ of Albertans want to split. I wonder what the poll questions were?


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## Said1 (Aug 9, 2005)

HorhayAtAMD said:
			
		

> No kidding. I seriously doubt that 40%+ of Albertans want to split. I wonder what the poll questions were?



If the article is any indication of the questions, every Westerner would consider it, if the price was right.


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## Markainion (Aug 9, 2005)

I watched some document about this a couple of years ago, with some Rocky Mountain Western Canadians feeling like they had more in common with Americans from states like Idaho and Montana.   I remember wondering what it would be like living in a Rocky Mountain and Western Canada States of America. 

More seriously I think it a feeling found by many ranchers and small town folks in certain regains of the United States and Canada that too much government intervention is beginning to erode their culture and way of life.    Many of my uncles being ranches feel the same way.  I dont take the talk of success seriously; I think it is just a desire to end the environment policy, which are hurting many of these communities.   Many environment want to make these regions into their personally playground, but dont care about the citizen that live their, even though most been their for more than a hundred year.


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## Merlin1047 (Aug 9, 2005)

Apparently we have an inadvertent double-post.  I'm going to remove the duplicate thread and leave this one.


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## USViking (Aug 9, 2005)

Said1 said:
			
		

> Ok, you're right, I'm wrong.  You're the all wise and all knowing master Yoda Poo-bah. Ali-salemah. It's about the ultra Liberal party...and war protestors. Nothing to do with transfer payments, resource control and federal representation to name a few. Ok. You win, I lose. From this day forward, I will walk around with a bag over my head in shame. I know nothing about my country or the province where I grew up.....shame on me. I suck.



I agree!

No, er, uh... I mean you're being too hard on yourself!

I'm guessing by transfer payments the West thinks the
East is hogging oil and perhaps other mineral revenues,
while not sending enough money back West.

Clue me in on the representation- is the West fairly
represented in proportion to its population?


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## HorhayAtAMD (Aug 9, 2005)

USViking said:
			
		

> Clue me in on the representation- is the West fairly
> represented in proportion to its population?


In a nutshell, yes. The biggest problem is that as long as Ontario votes for one party (the Liberal party for the last decade) and Quebec votes primarily for their separatist party (Bloc Quebecois), the rest of the country can vote any way they want (Conservative) and Ontario's selection wins. It isn't quite that black and white but that is the simplistic reason for the West's feeling that representation isn't fair.

I think the biggest anger stems from the fact that the West feels under-represented in proportion to its financial contribution to the country, Alberta especially. Alberta is one of only 2 provinces (Ontario is the other) that funds the shortfalls of the other 8 provinces (through transfer payments) yet we still get almost no say in the run of the country. In one sense, it isn't fair, but on the other hand, democracy is not based on representation by $$$.

Here are a couple links showing some relevant information in case you are curious:
Seats by party and province 
Populaton by year and province
Map of Canada showing regional voting preferences


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## Said1 (Aug 10, 2005)

HorhayAtAMD said:
			
		

> In a nutshell, yes. The biggest problem is that as long as Ontario votes for one party (the Liberal party for the last decade) and Quebec votes primarily for their separatist party (Bloc Quebecois), the rest of the country can vote any way they want (Conservative) and Ontario's selection wins. It isn't quite that black and white but that is the simplistic reason for the West's feeling that representation isn't fair.
> 
> I think the biggest anger stems from the fact that the West feels under-represented in proportion to its financial contribution to the country, Alberta especially. Alberta is one of only 2 provinces (Ontario is the other) that funds the shortfalls of the other 8 provinces (through transfer payments) yet we still get almost no say in the run of the country. In one sense, it isn't fair, but on the other hand, democracy is not based on representation by $$$.



Awww, quite your bellyachin' already and move to Ontario! The streets here are paved with gold I tells ya! In fact, I think I hear the Brinks truck coming with my Bag-O-Your-Alberta-Cash right now. 

In all seriousness, federal meddling in provincial affairs would be rather irksome in comparison to Ontario . Especially this Kyoto mumbo-jumbo. I don't blame Albertians for being pissed.

Also, maybe you can tell me why Ralph isn't making such a big stink about secession any more? If I remeber right, he was pretty vocal about it (not that anyone took it to heart or anything).


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