# The stock market



## Windship

A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....



Yeah! Cuba doesn't have a stock market and they're doing fine. DERP!


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## SassyIrishLass

Jealousy rearing it's ugly head in the guise of class war.


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## Windship

Its not jealousy, its anger. You get everything you want but thats not enough. You have to push your unfettered capitalism to the point of ruining an entire class of people. Along with our criminal government making policy and laws to pave to way. Oh, lol we're not there yet but its comin and you mfrs know it. Its not enough you bastards get all the money but you have to turn around and dump on the very people who make it for you and turn the world upside down. 
 Its comin. Its deff comin.


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## SassyIrishLass

Windship said:


> Its not jealousy, its anger. You get everything you want but thats not enough. You have to push your unfettered capitalism to the point of ruining an entire class of people. Along with our criminal government making policy and laws to pave to way. Oh, lol we're not there yet but its comin and you mfrs know it. Its not enough you bastards get all the money but you have to turn around and dump on the very people who make it for you and turn the world upside down.
> Its comin. Its deff comin.



What's coming? Because we invest and make money you're all butt hurt? LOL Nobody is stopping you from doing it. Here I'll even give you a good one, CLNE...up almost 2.00 a share in the last month and still rising and cheap enough anyone can get in


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## Windship

The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.


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## Windship

ok, how many shares should I buy?


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## SassyIrishLass

Windship said:


> ok, how many shares should I buy?



Only invest what you can afford to lose. Many are saying a correction is due...maybe 10%


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## Windship

Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?


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## SassyIrishLass

Windship said:


> Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?



It's been going on for decades...and will for decades more. It's bigger than you


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## Windship

ok, the average income is around 23,000usd. How many shares is that? They have 17usd's to invest...or they can buy food and some gas?


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## Windship

SassyIrishLass said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Its not jealousy, its anger. You get everything you want but thats not enough. You have to push your unfettered capitalism to the point of ruining an entire class of people. Along with our criminal government making policy and laws to pave to way. Oh, lol we're not there yet but its comin and you mfrs know it. Its not enough you bastards get all the money but you have to turn around and dump on the very people who make it for you and turn the world upside down.
> Its comin. Its deff comin.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's coming? Because we invest and make money you're all butt hurt? LOL Nobody is stopping you from doing it. Here I'll even give you a good one, CLNE...up almost 2.00 a share in the last month and still rising and cheap enough anyone can get in
Click to expand...




SassyIrishLass said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's been going on for decades...and will for decades more. It's bigger than you
Click to expand...


Lmao..oh fkn A ist bigger than me! and THATS already here. Oligarchic inverted totalitarianism has arrived and its been going on since the beginning of automation in the early 60's but 1970 really kicked it off. Its all gonna happen, I know it, you know it and its all avoidable but it wont be avoided. Unfettered capitalism will ruin the world.


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## SassyIrishLass

Windship said:


> ok, the average income is around 23,000usd. How many shares is that? They have 17usd's to invest...or they can buy food and some gas?



It's trading at 4.61...I'm in at 3.12 a share. The target is around 6.00-8.00 depending on who you believe, I'm leaning towards the 6.50 range if the market doesn't correct as some predict. If it does I have a S/L in place to stop my losses


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## SassyIrishLass

Windship said:


> SassyIrishLass said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Its not jealousy, its anger. You get everything you want but thats not enough. You have to push your unfettered capitalism to the point of ruining an entire class of people. Along with our criminal government making policy and laws to pave to way. Oh, lol we're not there yet but its comin and you mfrs know it. Its not enough you bastards get all the money but you have to turn around and dump on the very people who make it for you and turn the world upside down.
> Its comin. Its deff comin.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's coming? Because we invest and make money you're all butt hurt? LOL Nobody is stopping you from doing it. Here I'll even give you a good one, CLNE...up almost 2.00 a share in the last month and still rising and cheap enough anyone can get in
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SassyIrishLass said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's been going on for decades...and will for decades more. It's bigger than you
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lmao..oh fkn A ist bigger than me! and THATS already here. Oligarchic inverted totalitarianism has arrived and its been going on since the beginning of automation in the early 60's but 1970 really kicked it off. Its all gonna happen, I know it, you know it and its all avoidable but it wont be avoided. Unfettered capitalism will ruin the world.
Click to expand...


Like I said, nobody is forced to participate


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## Windship

ok so Ill buy 17usd worth of that stock. Now, Ive just spent thegas money on an investment that will pay me a 300% profit!!...in about 2 years. If you think working ppl can invest enough money to MAKE money?...you have the mind of a child.


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.



* The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy.*

Wrong, Commie breath.

*The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take.*

How does it do that?
*
Thats what unfettered capitalism does.*

Unfettered capitalism ≠ the stock market
The stock market ≠ unfettered capitalism
*
Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do.*

Don't Cuba and Venezuela have working people?
How are their economies doing?


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## Windship




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## Windship




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## Windship




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## Windship

The crash is comin and your causing it. Its comin sure as the sun will rise. And so will the subsequent. You stupid, greedy people dont even realise...the ruling elite want YOUR money too. They wont stop till they get it. And they'll get...Lol, your shitting on your own face and cant even see it.


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## eflatminor

Windship said:


> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....



Greedy?  You do understand that the majority of Americans are invested in stock markets, right?  Are the majority of Americans greedy for doing so? 

Fk the country?  How is investing in businesses, our job creators, fk'ing anyone?

Sounds like someone's simply jealous of success he didn't achieve.  

Class war, eh?  Try bringing that shit up my driveway.


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## eflatminor

Windship said:


> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.



My God you're dumb.  

Let's have a little business 101 lesson.  Exactly how do you think "working people" get a job in the first place?  They do when businesses are able to raise capital to invest in their operations.  No capital, no business, no jobs.  

Those companies raise capital by selling shares of stock.  The best place to value the worth of those shares are stock markets.  Without them, companies could raise capital only from very rich individual investors that could supply significant chunks of money.  Stock markets simply allow lots of people to invest.

By your reasoning, only the top one percenters should be able to invest in companies and no one else.

Ironic, and incredibly ignorant.

Good luck with that.


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## eflatminor

Windship said:


> Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?



In lieu of capitalism, you propose what?

Socialism?  How's that working out in Venezuela?
Communism?  Talk about devouring everything and pushing people to their limits!  Of course, the Soviet Union is still thriving, right?
So what is it to be?

By chance is your idea so darn good, it would have to be MANDATORY?

I'm guessing yes, whatever nonsense you're about the spew.


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## eflatminor

Windship said:


> The crash is comin and your causing it. Its comin sure as the sun will rise. And so will the subsequent. You stupid, greedy people dont even realise...the ruling elite want YOUR money too. They wont stop till they get it. And they'll get...Lol, your shitting on your own face and cant even see it.



Lots of vile hyperbole, little on solutions.

Let's hear it genius.  How do you suggest businesses find the capital that creates jobs?

This ought to be awesome!


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## Windship

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy.*
> 
> Wrong, Commie breath.
> 
> *The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take.*
> 
> How does it do that?
> *
> Thats what unfettered capitalism does.*
> 
> Unfettered capitalism ≠ the stock market
> The stock market ≠ unfettered capitalism
> *
> Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do.*
> 
> Don't Cuba and Venezuela have working people?
> How are their economies doing?
Click to expand...


Lol, you cant see the difference? or you  just playing dumb for sake of your point?
Explain to me why our economy grew after the industrial revolution and  became the world superpower and number one consumer ...CONSUMER... nation?The working class fought for and won what never should have been denied to them. They were payed well enough to spend and acquire credit. Thats what builds a strong economy. Whats your spin?


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## Windship

1900-1970. Ended with prosperity for all. 
   1971-2016. Con tinuing with prosperity for the ruling elite and corporations.
What did we do different after 1970. Want me to list it all....be a pain in the butt, but I will if ya want an education. But...you already know it.
Im not one of your uneducated, ignorant sheep. Ill bury you with facts and truth as you hang on to your traitorous rantings.


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy.*
> 
> Wrong, Commie breath.
> 
> *The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take.*
> 
> How does it do that?
> *
> Thats what unfettered capitalism does.*
> 
> Unfettered capitalism ≠ the stock market
> The stock market ≠ unfettered capitalism
> *
> Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do.*
> 
> Don't Cuba and Venezuela have working people?
> How are their economies doing?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol, you cant see the difference? or you  just playing dumb for sake of your point?
> Explain to me why our economy grew after the industrial revolution and  became the world superpower and number one consumer ...CONSUMER... nation?The working class fought for and won what never should have been denied to them. They were payed well enough to spend and acquire credit. Thats what builds a strong economy. Whats your spin?
Click to expand...


*Lol, you cant see the difference?*

Yes, I can see the difference between the failure of Cuba and Venezuela and the success of the US.
Can you?

*Whats your spin?*

Pointing out your idiocy is anti-spin, eh comrade?

*The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take*

You never answered....how?


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## RoshanNair

As someone who studied and has been employed in finance (I-banking) over the past 6 years.....I'm triggered by these moronic threads.

This poster is probably a middle-schooler parroting the words of his far-left social studies teacher. Nothing else could explain such a rudimentary grasp on corporate finance. I have had more substantive conversations on this topic with attractive starbucks baristas.....


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## WheelieAddict

The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.


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## Andylusion

Windship said:


> ok so Ill buy 17usd worth of that stock. Now, Ive just spent thegas money on an investment that will pay me a 300% profit!!...in about 2 years. If you think working ppl can invest enough money to MAKE money?...you have the mind of a child.



First off........ LOL........   Never say to someone "you have the mind of a child", directly after typing "ppl" because "people" was too difficult.

Just trying to help you out.   You want to be taken seriously....  You can't be so ignorant, as to type "ppl" and then call people names.  Friendly advice 

Second....   Both of my parents were public school teachers.   They now have a net-worth over a million dollars.  And half of that is in stocks in the stock market.

In fact, the vast majority of the stocks in this world today, are owned by the public, or are owned as retirement for the public.



 
35% is owned by private households.
20% is owned by mutual funds, 401Ks, Roth 401Ks, IRAs, and Roth IRAs.
9% is owned by Pension funds, usually for Union pensions.
8% owned by government pension funds.  This would be 403b plans for government workers.

71% of the market is owned by the public, and by retirement plans that benefit the public.

If you eliminated the stock market, not only would you harm the companies, and workers whose jobs exist because of the stock market..... but you would also ruin possibly hundreds of millions of people, particularly the elderly that depend on their retirement plans and pensions.


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## Andylusion

WheelieAddict said:


> The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.



Alan Greenspan did not by any stretch, have a free-market ideology.   While he spoke about free-markets often, he did not as Fed Chair, enact free-markets.    He was extremely interventionist in his approach.

Further, the 'failure' was in fact caused by regulation.  The government forced, and incentivised banks to make bad loans, which created the bubble.   There was nothing capitalist or free-market about it.


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## WheelieAddict

Andylusion said:


> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alan Greenspan did not by any stretch, have a free-market ideology.   While he spoke about free-markets often, he did not as Fed Chair, enact free-markets.    He was extremely interventionist in his approach.
> 
> Further, the 'failure' was in fact caused by regulation.  The government forced, and incentivised banks to make bad loans, which created the bubble.   There was nothing capitalist or free-market about it.
Click to expand...


Uh huh:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/business/economy/24panel.html?_r=0

Greenspan Admits Free Market Ideology Flawed

Is Greenspan himself admitting his free market ideology was flawed enough for you to admit you are full of shit?


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## xband

WheelieAddict said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alan Greenspan did not by any stretch, have a free-market ideology.   While he spoke about free-markets often, he did not as Fed Chair, enact free-markets.    He was extremely interventionist in his approach.
> 
> Further, the 'failure' was in fact caused by regulation.  The government forced, and incentivised banks to make bad loans, which created the bubble.   There was nothing capitalist or free-market about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Uh huh:
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/business/economy/24panel.html?_r=0
> 
> Greenspan Admits Free Market Ideology Flawed
> 
> Is Greenspan himself admitting his free market ideology was flawed enough for you to admit you are full of shit?
Click to expand...


The stock market is in a bubble and the bubble can either grow or bust.


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## Andylusion

WheelieAddict said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alan Greenspan did not by any stretch, have a free-market ideology.   While he spoke about free-markets often, he did not as Fed Chair, enact free-markets.    He was extremely interventionist in his approach.
> 
> Further, the 'failure' was in fact caused by regulation.  The government forced, and incentivised banks to make bad loans, which created the bubble.   There was nothing capitalist or free-market about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Uh huh:
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/business/economy/24panel.html?_r=0
> 
> Greenspan Admits Free Market Ideology Flawed
> 
> Is Greenspan himself admitting his free market ideology was flawed enough for you to admit you are full of shit?
Click to expand...


No.  Of course not.   If you tell me that you believe in vegetarianism, and then I see you eating steak every day, then you have an ulcer, and get on TV and proclaim that your faith in vegetarianism was flawed...... that just makes you a hypocrite.

Greenspan did not practice what he preached.    That's all there is to it.    Doesn't matter what he said, when he didn't practice what he said.

Greenspan's actions didn't match his words.   He was extreme interventionist.   He interfered with the markets constantly.    Even Joseph Stiglitz who was economic advisor to Bill Clinton in the 1990s, said this.

Analysis - The Alan Greenspan Era | The Warning | FRONTLINE | PBS

Greenspan, remember, always said that he was a believer in Ayn Rand, a believer in free market. Little bit curious for a central banker, because what is central banking? It's a massive intervention in the market, setting interest rates. So to me, that kind of perspective, to say, "I believe in free markets, but I'm going to accept the job at central banking," is a contradiction. You almost have to be schizophrenic.​And he was schizophrenic.  I believe in free-markets, so I'm going to take a massive government interventionist position, and screw with markets throughout the entire country.   Which is exactly what he did.

So when the system blew up and Greenspan, who hasn't practiced a free-market in the last 20 years, says "his free market ideology was flawed"....   that has zero credibility.  You have to practice a free-market first, before you can claim it is flawed or doesn't work.


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## Andylusion

xband said:


> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alan Greenspan did not by any stretch, have a free-market ideology.   While he spoke about free-markets often, he did not as Fed Chair, enact free-markets.    He was extremely interventionist in his approach.
> 
> Further, the 'failure' was in fact caused by regulation.  The government forced, and incentivised banks to make bad loans, which created the bubble.   There was nothing capitalist or free-market about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Uh huh:
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/business/economy/24panel.html?_r=0
> 
> Greenspan Admits Free Market Ideology Flawed
> 
> Is Greenspan himself admitting his free market ideology was flawed enough for you to admit you are full of shit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The stock market is in a bubble and the bubble can either grow or bust.
Click to expand...


By what measurement, do you believe the stock market is currently in a bubble?


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## WheelieAddict

Andylusion said:


> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WheelieAddict said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market is part of capitalism in the USA and it certainly should not be eliminated. It should however be regulated and not be given free reign with the assumption it will regulate itself being a free market. Failures like Alan Greenspan tried this approach with capitalism and it backfired spectacularly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alan Greenspan did not by any stretch, have a free-market ideology.   While he spoke about free-markets often, he did not as Fed Chair, enact free-markets.    He was extremely interventionist in his approach.
> 
> Further, the 'failure' was in fact caused by regulation.  The government forced, and incentivised banks to make bad loans, which created the bubble.   There was nothing capitalist or free-market about it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Uh huh:
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/business/economy/24panel.html?_r=0
> 
> Greenspan Admits Free Market Ideology Flawed
> 
> Is Greenspan himself admitting his free market ideology was flawed enough for you to admit you are full of shit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No.  Of course not.   If you tell me that you believe in vegetarianism, and then I see you eating steak every day, then you have an ulcer, and get on TV and proclaim that your faith in vegetarianism was flawed...... that just makes you a hypocrite.
> 
> Greenspan did not practice what he preached.    That's all there is to it.    Doesn't matter what he said, when he didn't practice what he said.
> 
> Greenspan's actions didn't match his words.   He was extreme interventionist.   He interfered with the markets constantly.    Even Joseph Stiglitz who was economic advisor to Bill Clinton in the 1990s, said this.
> 
> Analysis - The Alan Greenspan Era | The Warning | FRONTLINE | PBS
> 
> Greenspan, remember, always said that he was a believer in Ayn Rand, a believer in free market. Little bit curious for a central banker, because what is central banking? It's a massive intervention in the market, setting interest rates. So to me, that kind of perspective, to say, "I believe in free markets, but I'm going to accept the job at central banking," is a contradiction. You almost have to be schizophrenic.​And he was schizophrenic.  I believe in free-markets, so I'm going to take a massive government interventionist position, and screw with markets throughout the entire country.   Which is exactly what he did.
> 
> So when the system blew up and Greenspan, who hasn't practiced a free-market in the last 20 years, says "his free market ideology was flawed"....   that has zero credibility.  You have to practice a free-market first, before you can claim it is flawed or doesn't work.
Click to expand...


That's some hilarious spin! Bahaha! Yeah the man himself admitting his free market ideology was flawed is false because he controlled interest rates. Greenspan an "extreme interventionist"? That's friggin hilarious! But by all means, continue your delusion and bullshitting to try and justify your ridgid ideology of stupidity. Morons like you would destroy our economy again. You will never learn.


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## WheelieAddict

"Greenspan, 82, acknowledged under questioning that he had made a “mistake” in believing that banks, operating in their own self-interest, would do what was necessary to protect their shareholders and institutions. Greenspan called that “a flaw in the model ... that defines how the world works.”

Yeah what an "extreme interventionist" he was. rofl!


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## WheelieAddict




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## WheelieAddict




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## Windship

Dig this you jerks. Lol, you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...gues what/...they want YOUR money to! Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...you and I are going to be in the same boat....but your greed has blinded you. I siggest you watch this:


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## Windship

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy.*
> 
> Wrong, Commie breath.
> 
> *The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take.*
> 
> How does it do that?
> *
> Thats what unfettered capitalism does.*
> 
> Unfettered capitalism ≠ the stock market
> The stock market ≠ unfettered capitalism
> *
> Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do.*
> 
> Don't Cuba and Venezuela have working people?
> How are their economies doing?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol, you cant see the difference? or you  just playing dumb for sake of your point?
> Explain to me why our economy grew after the industrial revolution and  became the world superpower and number one consumer ...CONSUMER... nation?The working class fought for and won what never should have been denied to them. They were payed well enough to spend and acquire credit. Thats what builds a strong economy. Whats your spin?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Lol, you cant see the difference?*
> 
> Yes, I can see the difference between the failure of Cuba and Venezuela and the success of the US.
> Can you?
> 
> *Whats your spin?*
> 
> Pointing out your idiocy is anti-spin, eh comrade?
> 
> *The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take*
> 
> You never answered....how?
Click to expand...


..and what you fail to say is that cuba and venezuela are not oligarchies masquerading as democracies. You compare The US to cuba and venezuela...thats desperate.


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Dig this you jerks. Lol, you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...gues what/...they want YOUR money to! Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...you and I are going to be in the same boat....but your greed has blinded you. I siggest you watch this:



*you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...*

How are the corporations going to take my bank account? Which corporations?

*Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...*

You're seeing a whole team of psychiatrists, aren't you?


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy.*
> 
> Wrong, Commie breath.
> 
> *The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take.*
> 
> How does it do that?
> *
> Thats what unfettered capitalism does.*
> 
> Unfettered capitalism ≠ the stock market
> The stock market ≠ unfettered capitalism
> *
> Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do.*
> 
> Don't Cuba and Venezuela have working people?
> How are their economies doing?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol, you cant see the difference? or you  just playing dumb for sake of your point?
> Explain to me why our economy grew after the industrial revolution and  became the world superpower and number one consumer ...CONSUMER... nation?The working class fought for and won what never should have been denied to them. They were payed well enough to spend and acquire credit. Thats what builds a strong economy. Whats your spin?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Lol, you cant see the difference?*
> 
> Yes, I can see the difference between the failure of Cuba and Venezuela and the success of the US.
> Can you?
> 
> *Whats your spin?*
> 
> Pointing out your idiocy is anti-spin, eh comrade?
> 
> *The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take*
> 
> You never answered....how?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> ..and what you fail to say is that cuba and venezuela are not oligarchies masquerading as democracies. You compare The US to cuba and venezuela...thats desperate.
Click to expand...


*..and what you fail to say is that cuba and venezuela are not oligarchies masquerading as democracies*

What are they? Tell me more!


----------



## Windship

so,you pick the head of the federal reserve, alan greenspan to back up your bs?  The federal reserve...center for unfettered, economy killing capitalism?...thats another funny one and a bunch of horseshit and you know it.


----------



## Indeependent

eflatminor said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greedy?  You do understand that the majority of Americans are invested in stock markets, right?  Are the majority of Americans greedy for doing so?
> 
> Fk the country?  How is investing in businesses, our job creators, fk'ing anyone?
> 
> Sounds like someone's simply jealous of success he didn't achieve.
> 
> Class war, eh?  Try bringing that shit up my driveway.
Click to expand...


The majority can barely pay their bills.


----------



## Indeependent

Andylusion said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> ok so Ill buy 17usd worth of that stock. Now, Ive just spent thegas money on an investment that will pay me a 300% profit!!...in about 2 years. If you think working ppl can invest enough money to MAKE money?...you have the mind of a child.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First off........ LOL........   Never say to someone "you have the mind of a child", directly after typing "ppl" because "people" was too difficult.
> 
> Just trying to help you out.   You want to be taken seriously....  You can't be so ignorant, as to type "ppl" and then call people names.  Friendly advice
> 
> Second....   Both of my parents were public school teachers.   They now have a net-worth over a million dollars.  And half of that is in stocks in the stock market.
> 
> In fact, the vast majority of the stocks in this world today, are owned by the public, or are owned as retirement for the public.
> 
> View attachment 88309
> 35% is owned by private households.
> 20% is owned by mutual funds, 401Ks, Roth 401Ks, IRAs, and Roth IRAs.
> 9% is owned by Pension funds, usually for Union pensions.
> 8% owned by government pension funds.  This would be 403b plans for government workers.
> 
> 71% of the market is owned by the public, and by retirement plans that benefit the public.
> 
> If you eliminated the stock market, not only would you harm the companies, and workers whose jobs exist because of the stock market..... but you would also ruin possibly hundreds of millions of people, particularly the elderly that depend on their retirement plans and pensions.
Click to expand...


Parents were teachers...enough said.


----------



## Darkwind

Windship said:


> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.


Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.

Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.


----------



## Windship

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dig this you jerks. Lol, you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...gues what/...they want YOUR money to! Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...you and I are going to be in the same boat....but your greed has blinded you. I siggest you watch this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...*
> 
> How are the corporations going to take my bank account? Which corporations?
> 
> *Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...*
> 
> You're seeing a whole team of psychiatrists, aren't you?
Click to expand...


Because the corporations want it all. Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well. You think its just the poors money that they want? Your the one that needs a psychiatrist? Show me how your going to avoid being a consumer in order to avoid the melt down?


----------



## Indeependent

Darkwind said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
Click to expand...

Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.


----------



## Windship

Darkwind said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
Click to expand...


True. A huge misbelief caused by government propaganda.


----------



## Darkwind

Indeependent said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
Click to expand...

Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.


----------



## Indeependent

Darkwind said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
Click to expand...


There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.


----------



## Darkwind

Windship said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> True. A huge misbelief caused by government propaganda.
Click to expand...

Its more of a political tool to attack political enemies than anything.  If the market is doing well, the opposition party are evil profiteers, blubbering in their greed.  If its doing poorly, the opposition is responsible for the destruction of the elderly and their retirement safety nets....

The economy is based upon many things.  Mostly the enactment of commerce between business and nations.


----------



## Darkwind

Indeependent said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
Click to expand...

I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.


----------



## Windship

Economy at a Crossroads on
*Why stock market doesn’t reflect the economy*
NEW YORK — The stock market is not the economy.

The market's painful slide downward may be ending. The economy's suffering has a long way to go.

Do NOT post entire articles on this forum. Read the Rules.


----------



## Andylusion

WheelieAddict said:


>



Not one post that you have created in response, changed or even addressed, nor contradicted, anything I said.

Do you have nothing else to say?


----------



## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Economy at a Crossroads on
> *Why stock market doesn’t reflect the economy*
> *Wall Street has traditionally recovered before Main Street rights itself*
> 
> 
> *Below:*
> 
> 
> x
> *Jump to discussLoading comments...*
> Discuss
> 
> 
> Data
> 
> 
> Related
> 
> Print
> 
> Font:
> NEW YORK — The stock market is not the economy.
> 
> Loading stock quotes…
> Major Market Indices
> 
> The market's painful slide downward may be ending. The economy's suffering has a long way to go.
> 
> How do we know that? Washington is telling us. It's saying the economy is still in serious trouble and opening the possibility of another government-funded stimulus package.
> 
> "With the economy likely to be weak for several quarters, and with some risk of a protracted slowdown, consideration of a fiscal package by the Congress at this juncture seems appropriate," Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke told Congress on Monday.
> 
> The financial world has been buzzing over whether the all-out panic that fueled the recent stock rout could really be over.
> 
> On Oct. 10, the Dow Jones industrial average plunged to a close of 8,451.19 — its lowest in 5 1/2 years. Then it spent most of last week seesawing, but finished with its best weekly performance in five years.
> 
> Investors are feeling like we might have reached a turning point. They point to improving credit conditions. The London interbank offered rate, or Libor, has retreated from recent highs, which means lower interest rates on consumer loans like adjustable-rate mortgages.
> 
> There is also evidence that the market had faced extreme conditions that couldn't last. For instance, a closely watched "fear gauge" — the Chicago Board Options Exchange Volatility Index, which is known as the VIX — topped a record high of 80 last week, well above its typical level that runs closer to 50.
> 
> None of this means the economy is poised to begin healing, though. Historically, the stock market has turned a corner months before recessions end.
> 
> In the 21 recessions from the start of the 20th century, the average economic decline lasted 14.4 months and the Dow industrials tended to bottom out just over 8 months into that, according to Bespoke Investment Group.
> 
> The situation is more troubling when you break out the 10 recessions that took place before World War II, which economists say better reflects the severity of today's economic woes. Those lasted 19.1 months on average, and the Dow bottomed a year after they started.
> 
> A recession hasn't even been formally declared in the United States yet, at least when using the typical gauge of two or more quarters of negative economic growth. But most economists agree that conditions have turned so weak there is a great likelihood that we are already there.
> 
> Dean Baker of the Center for Economic and Policy Research, a Washington, D.C. think tank, points out that higher or lower stock prices aren't what drive companies' investment decisions or their hiring plans. Those decisions are made based on economic conditions and what is happening in specific markets.
> 
> "The market may be OK," Baker said, "but we are still facing a tough recession."
> 
> A big hurdle: The continuing collapse in the real-estate market, where some $5 trillion of housing wealth has been lost in the last few years. Even if stock prices surge, consumers will remain leery about spending if they don't see some bounce in home prices. That hits the economy hard because two-thirds of its growth comes from consumer spending.
> 
> If people don't spend, companies will have to cut jobs. The nation's unemployment rate — now at 6.1 percent — could hit 7.5 percent or higher by next year, according to some economists' predictions.
> 
> That's why momentum is building in Washington for another economic stimulus package to help cash-strapped Americans.
> 
> Earlier this year, most individuals and couples received tax rebate checks of $600-$1,200 through the $168 billion stimulus package enacted in February. The government also passed earlier this month a $700 billion rescue plan for the financial system.
> 
> President Bush and Bernanke said Monday they were open to the idea of a new stimulus program.
> 
> Whatever they ultimately do will take time — something the economy is running short of.



Great!  You successfully showed us you can cut and paste like the best.

So what?


----------



## Windship

eflatminor said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In lieu of capitalism, you propose what?
> 
> Socialism?  How's that working out in Venezuela?
> Communism?  Talk about devouring everything and pushing people to their limits!  Of course, the Soviet Union is still thriving, right?
> So what is it to be?
> 
> By chance is your idea so darn good, it would have to be MANDATORY?
> 
> I'm guessing yes, whatever nonsense you're about the spew.
Click to expand...


You find me one post, ANYWHERE, where I cursed capitalism you boob. What we have here, now is an oligarchic inverted totalitarian country not democracy. Our criminal government and the criminal corporations took care of that. You dont matter and your vote doesnt matter. Ill come up your fucking driveway alright. If not me, someone else will sure. And why do you fuckers always go to the worst possible example every time! Lol, why didnt you use Scandinavia as an example?


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dig this you jerks. Lol, you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...gues what/...they want YOUR money to! Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...you and I are going to be in the same boat....but your greed has blinded you. I siggest you watch this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...*
> 
> How are the corporations going to take my bank account? Which corporations?
> 
> *Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...*
> 
> You're seeing a whole team of psychiatrists, aren't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because the corporations want it all. Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well. You think its just the poors money that they want? Your the one that needs a psychiatrist? Show me how your going to avoid being a consumer in order to avoid the melt down?
Click to expand...


*Because the corporations want it all.*

If wants were horses.........yada yada.
*
Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well.*

Defiantly, well, sounds serious for sure.


----------



## Windship

Andylusion said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> ok so Ill buy 17usd worth of that stock. Now, Ive just spent thegas money on an investment that will pay me a 300% profit!!...in about 2 years. If you think working ppl can invest enough money to MAKE money?...you have the mind of a child.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First off........ LOL........   Never say to someone "you have the mind of a child", directly after typing "ppl" because "people" was too difficult.
> 
> Just trying to help you out.   You want to be taken seriously....  You can't be so ignorant, as to type "ppl" and then call people names.  Friendly advice
> 
> Second....   Both of my parents were public school teachers.   They now have a net-worth over a million dollars.  And half of that is in stocks in the stock market.
> 
> In fact, the vast majority of the stocks in this world today, are owned by the public, or are owned as retirement for the public.
> 
> View attachment 88309
> 35% is owned by private households.
> 20% is owned by mutual funds, 401Ks, Roth 401Ks, IRAs, and Roth IRAs.
> 9% is owned by Pension funds, usually for Union pensions.
> 8% owned by government pension funds.  This would be 403b plans for government workers.
> 
> 71% of the market is owned by the public, and by retirement plans that benefit the public.
> 
> If you eliminated the stock market, not only would you harm the companies, and workers whose jobs exist because of the stock market..... but you would also ruin possibly hundreds of millions of people, particularly the elderly that depend on their retirement plans and pensions.
Click to expand...


So, your source is a chart created by fucking goldman sachs?...lmfaorotf...you call me ignorant? Im anything but ignorant and you know it unless you dont know how it all works but you say that knowing all too well what is causing the destruction of our country. You go ahead and play dumb...your pretty good at it.


----------



## Indeependent

Darkwind said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> The stock market doesnt do anything for the economy. The stock market takes and takes and takes till there nothing left to take. Thats what unfettered capitalism does.  Dont you know what builds a healthy economy? Working people do. Look it up.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
Click to expand...

No one said that.
What happens is that investment values are never audited.
Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?


----------



## Windship

when the next bank failure and bailout happens, tell me again how well it works. If the tax payer working class didnt bail them out, unfettered capitalism would have died in 1970. So,...how many times have the working class bailed out the banks?


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> when the next bank failure and bailout happens, tell me again how well it works. If the tax payer working class didnt bail them out, unfettered capitalism would have died in 1970. So,...how many times have the working class bailed out the banks?


*
when the next bank failure and bailout happens, tell me again how well it works*

You mean like TARP that was very profitable?


----------



## Windship

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dig this you jerks. Lol, you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...gues what/...they want YOUR money to! Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...you and I are going to be in the same boat....but your greed has blinded you. I siggest you watch this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...*
> 
> How are the corporations going to take my bank account? Which corporations?
> 
> *Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...*
> 
> You're seeing a whole team of psychiatrists, aren't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because the corporations want it all. Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well. You think its just the poors money that they want? Your the one that needs a psychiatrist? Show me how your going to avoid being a consumer in order to avoid the melt down?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Because the corporations want it all.*
> 
> If wants were horses.........yada yada.
> *
> Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well.*
> 
> Defiantly, well, sounds serious for sure.
Click to expand...


Oh, wel...thats not bashing, thats fact.


----------



## Darkwind

Indeependent said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> 
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
Click to expand...

You're not making any sense.

Brokerages make money by having their investors keep their money in the portfolio's.  The agents earn their commission on their clients keeping money in the portfolio.  

People, who wish to sell shares to take profits to spend on vacations homes, and boats, and trips to far away lands do so based upon their own sense of doing well.  It is, after all, their money.  However, to blame others for their choices is simply wrong.  No brokerage or retirement manager is going to advise a client to sell stock for material goods gains.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Toddsterpatriot said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dig this you jerks. Lol, you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...gues what/...they want YOUR money to! Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...you and I are going to be in the same boat....but your greed has blinded you. I siggest you watch this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *you think the corporations will let you keep your 100,400 or 800thousand dollar bank accounts...*
> 
> How are the corporations going to take my bank account? Which corporations?
> 
> *Truth is is that if your not part of those 62 families that run the world,...*
> 
> You're seeing a whole team of psychiatrists, aren't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because the corporations want it all. Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well. You think its just the poors money that they want? Your the one that needs a psychiatrist? Show me how your going to avoid being a consumer in order to avoid the melt down?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Because the corporations want it all.*
> 
> If wants were horses.........yada yada.
> *
> Your bank account is most defiantly going to be in their sights as well.*
> 
> Defiantly, well, sounds serious for sure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh, wel...thats not bashing, thats fact.
Click to expand...


That's not fact, that's idiotic.


----------



## Indeependent

Darkwind said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> 
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You're not making any sense.
> 
> Brokerages make money by having their investors keep their money in the portfolio's.  The agents earn their commission on their clients keeping money in the portfolio.
> 
> People, who wish to sell shares to take profits to spend on vacations homes, and boats, and trips to far away lands do so based upon their own sense of doing well.  It is, after all, their money.  However, to blame others for their choices is simply wrong.  No brokerage or retirement manager is going to advise a client to sell stock for material goods gains.
Click to expand...


Fee, Commissions and reinvestments.
Firms make money from Transactions.
I don't blame the Firms for the fact that less than 1% of investors know anything about how their investments are invested or "protected".


----------



## AyeCantSeeYou

How about NOT copying and pasting entire articles on this forum? Read the rules. You are supposed to provide a small sample of the content ALONG with your OWN thoughts about it.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

AyeCantSeeYou said:


> How about NOT copying and pasting entire articles on this forum? Read the rules. You are supposed to provide a small sample of the content ALONG with your OWN thoughts about it.



He has no original thoughts about any of this.


----------



## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> ok so Ill buy 17usd worth of that stock. Now, Ive just spent thegas money on an investment that will pay me a 300% profit!!...in about 2 years. If you think working ppl can invest enough money to MAKE money?...you have the mind of a child.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First off........ LOL........   Never say to someone "you have the mind of a child", directly after typing "ppl" because "people" was too difficult.
> 
> Just trying to help you out.   You want to be taken seriously....  You can't be so ignorant, as to type "ppl" and then call people names.  Friendly advice
> 
> Second....   Both of my parents were public school teachers.   They now have a net-worth over a million dollars.  And half of that is in stocks in the stock market.
> 
> In fact, the vast majority of the stocks in this world today, are owned by the public, or are owned as retirement for the public.
> 
> View attachment 88309
> 35% is owned by private households.
> 20% is owned by mutual funds, 401Ks, Roth 401Ks, IRAs, and Roth IRAs.
> 9% is owned by Pension funds, usually for Union pensions.
> 8% owned by government pension funds.  This would be 403b plans for government workers.
> 
> 71% of the market is owned by the public, and by retirement plans that benefit the public.
> 
> If you eliminated the stock market, not only would you harm the companies, and workers whose jobs exist because of the stock market..... but you would also ruin possibly hundreds of millions of people, particularly the elderly that depend on their retirement plans and pensions.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, your source is a chart created by fucking goldman sachs?...lmfaorotf...you call me ignorant? Im anything but ignorant and you know it unless you dont know how it all works but you say that knowing all too well what is causing the destruction of our country. You go ahead and play dumb...your pretty good at it.
Click to expand...




Windship said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> ok so Ill buy 17usd worth of that stock. Now, Ive just spent thegas money on an investment that will pay me a 300% profit!!...in about 2 years. If you think working ppl can invest enough money to MAKE money?...you have the mind of a child.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First off........ LOL........   Never say to someone "you have the mind of a child", directly after typing "ppl" because "people" was too difficult.
> 
> Just trying to help you out.   You want to be taken seriously....  You can't be so ignorant, as to type "ppl" and then call people names.  Friendly advice
> 
> Second....   Both of my parents were public school teachers.   They now have a net-worth over a million dollars.  And half of that is in stocks in the stock market.
> 
> In fact, the vast majority of the stocks in this world today, are owned by the public, or are owned as retirement for the public.
> 
> View attachment 88309
> 35% is owned by private households.
> 20% is owned by mutual funds, 401Ks, Roth 401Ks, IRAs, and Roth IRAs.
> 9% is owned by Pension funds, usually for Union pensions.
> 8% owned by government pension funds.  This would be 403b plans for government workers.
> 
> 71% of the market is owned by the public, and by retirement plans that benefit the public.
> 
> If you eliminated the stock market, not only would you harm the companies, and workers whose jobs exist because of the stock market..... but you would also ruin possibly hundreds of millions of people, particularly the elderly that depend on their retirement plans and pensions.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So, your source is a chart created by fucking goldman sachs?...lmfaorotf...you call me ignorant? Im anything but ignorant and you know it unless you dont know how it all works but you say that knowing all too well what is causing the destruction of our country. You go ahead and play dumb...your pretty good at it.
Click to expand...


Can you argue against the evidence given?  Yes or no?      Answer:  No you can not.

Do you have counter evidence?   Yes or no?   Answer:  No, you have no evidence.

Do you have an argument to make?  Yes or no?    Answer: No, you are a mindless troll incapable of arguing with the facts.

Especially since the source included the Federal Reserve.     If the Federal Reserve lied, and Goldman Sachs lied, then you are not just ignorant, you are one of those tin foil hat people "everyone is lying but meeee!"

Well... that just makes you a freak, and waste of time.


----------



## Andylusion

Indeependent said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thats because the stock market is NOT the economy.
> 
> Perhaps you should learn the differences before making a bigger fool of yourself.
> 
> 
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
Click to expand...


I don't understand this.

Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.

I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.

If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.

So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".

As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.

There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.

If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.

Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.

Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?

Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.

So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.

Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.

But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.

If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.


----------



## Indeependent

Andylusion said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most people expand or build new homes, go on vacations and buy vehicles based on their Stock Portfolio.
> To claim the Stock Market is not de facto the economy is foolish.
> 
> 
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
Click to expand...


Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.


----------



## Andylusion

Indeependent said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> Its not a claim, its a fact.  Because people make foolish choices does not alter that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
> NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
> My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.
Click to expand...


Yeah.  Ok, so what?

Everything you do in this world, is subject to people breaking promises.   You can marry a wife, spend your life with her, and she can run off with another man, and leave you wrecked.

You can take your car to a mechanic, and he can break the engine, and leave town.   I know someone that this happened to.

There are no guarantees in life.  None.

So I don't understand what your point is.     So what about broken promises in China?  Does that change the fact my stock in Prudential, and Novartis, are both up?

Let me explain how this works.

I do not buy single stocks.  No one ever should.  You buy mutual funds, and own stocks through mutual funds.

Moreover, you should buy more than one mutual fund.  Possibly 4 or 5.

So here is how it works out.    If my mutual fund discovers that my stock in say.... Croda International, or Banca Popolare Di Milano, or Hermès International, is not doing so well, or they find the company lied about "brick and mortar" in China....    they sell the stock, on my behalf.   And buy stock in companies that have not lied, or are performing better.

See, people like you and me, we don't have the time, or the resources, or even the interest in doing the continuous research, to determine which stocks to buy and sell.    Mutual funds on the other hand, that is specifically what they do.  I worked for a short time at a pension fund which is basically a mutual fund, only dedicated to a captive customer base.    The stock traders were shut away in a glass room, with dozens of monitors on all the walls, with all the major news networks on 24-7, and every computer had the stock tickers running 24-7 of all the major exchanges, and every major news paper was delivered to the room every morning, before they even arrived.

All the traders did, all day long from morning until closing, was read, watch, and learn everything they could, both about the companies whose stocks they owned already, and the stocks of companies they were considering buying.

Since I own stocks through a mutual fund, those guys work for me.    So I don't care about some broken promise in China.  If it matters, the traders at my mutual fund will read about it, learn about it, research it, and buy, or sell, stocks in response to it.

That's why my investments are up 75% over how much I've put into them, over the past decade.   If things keep going as they have been, I'll have literally twice as much money in investments, than how much I've put into my investments, in about 3 years.


----------



## Indeependent

Andylusion said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> 
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
> NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
> My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah.  Ok, so what?
> 
> Everything you do in this world, is subject to people breaking promises.   You can marry a wife, spend your life with her, and she can run off with another man, and leave you wrecked.
> 
> You can take your car to a mechanic, and he can break the engine, and leave town.   I know someone that this happened to.
> 
> There are no guarantees in life.  None.
> 
> So I don't understand what your point is.     So what about broken promises in China?  Does that change the fact my stock in Prudential, and Novartis, are both up?
> 
> Let me explain how this works.
> 
> I do not buy single stocks.  No one ever should.  You buy mutual funds, and own stocks through mutual funds.
> 
> Moreover, you should buy more than one mutual fund.  Possibly 4 or 5.
> 
> So here is how it works out.    If my mutual fund discovers that my stock in say.... Croda International, or Banca Popolare Di Milano, or Hermès International, is not doing so well, or they find the company lied about "brick and mortar" in China....    they sell the stock, on my behalf.   And buy stock in companies that have no lied, or are performing better.
> 
> See, people like you and me, we don't have the time, or the resources, or even the interest in doing the continuous research, to determine which stocks to buy and sell.    Mutual funds on the other hand, that is specifically what they do.  I worked for a short time at a pension fund which is basically a mutual fund, only dedicated to a captive customer base.    The stock traders were shut away in a glass room, with dozens of monitors on all the walls, with all the major news networks on 24-7, and every computer had the stock tickers running 24-7 of all the major exchanges, and every major news paper was delivered to the room every morning, before they even arrived.
> 
> All the traders did, all day long from morning until closing, was read, watch, and learn everything they could, both about the companies whose stocks they owned already, and the stocks of companies they were considering buying.
> 
> Since I own stocks through a mutual fund, those guys work for me.    So I don't care about some broken promise in China.  If it matters, the traders at my mutual fund will read about it, learn about it, research it, and buy, or sell, stocks in response to it.
> 
> That's why my investments are up 75% over how much I've put into them, over the past decade.   If things keep going as they have been, I'll have literally twice as much money in investments, than how much I've put into my investments, in about 3 years.
Click to expand...


If you invested since 2008 your investments are definitely doing well.
The Stock Market is a gambling casino and there are way too many companies out there to audit.
Personally, if your investments are doing well, that's fine.
As long as you don't try to make it sound like any Investment Firms give a damn about whether or not your investment choices make any sense in the real world.
You can thank the US Government for investing and propping up the market.
Just make sure to move your investments to Money Markets before the next crash within the next year.


----------



## eflatminor

Indeependent said:


> eflatminor said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greedy?  You do understand that the majority of Americans are invested in stock markets, right?  Are the majority of Americans greedy for doing so?
> 
> Fk the country?  How is investing in businesses, our job creators, fk'ing anyone?
> 
> Sounds like someone's simply jealous of success he didn't achieve.
> 
> Class war, eh?  Try bringing that shit up my driveway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The majority can barely pay their bills.
Click to expand...


Yet well over half are invested in the markets.  Sorry if the truth doesn't fit your narrative.


----------



## Indeependent

eflatminor said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> eflatminor said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greedy?  You do understand that the majority of Americans are invested in stock markets, right?  Are the majority of Americans greedy for doing so?
> 
> Fk the country?  How is investing in businesses, our job creators, fk'ing anyone?
> 
> Sounds like someone's simply jealous of success he didn't achieve.
> 
> Class war, eh?  Try bringing that shit up my driveway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The majority can barely pay their bills.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yet well over half are invested in the markets.  Sorry if the truth doesn't fit your narrative.
Click to expand...

Strawman.. 
Most people in the market have a few thousand dollars at most invested by their employers and probably don't even realize it until they get fired.


----------



## Andylusion

Indeependent said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> 
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
> NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
> My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah.  Ok, so what?
> 
> Everything you do in this world, is subject to people breaking promises.   You can marry a wife, spend your life with her, and she can run off with another man, and leave you wrecked.
> 
> You can take your car to a mechanic, and he can break the engine, and leave town.   I know someone that this happened to.
> 
> There are no guarantees in life.  None.
> 
> So I don't understand what your point is.     So what about broken promises in China?  Does that change the fact my stock in Prudential, and Novartis, are both up?
> 
> Let me explain how this works.
> 
> I do not buy single stocks.  No one ever should.  You buy mutual funds, and own stocks through mutual funds.
> 
> Moreover, you should buy more than one mutual fund.  Possibly 4 or 5.
> 
> So here is how it works out.    If my mutual fund discovers that my stock in say.... Croda International, or Banca Popolare Di Milano, or Hermès International, is not doing so well, or they find the company lied about "brick and mortar" in China....    they sell the stock, on my behalf.   And buy stock in companies that have no lied, or are performing better.
> 
> See, people like you and me, we don't have the time, or the resources, or even the interest in doing the continuous research, to determine which stocks to buy and sell.    Mutual funds on the other hand, that is specifically what they do.  I worked for a short time at a pension fund which is basically a mutual fund, only dedicated to a captive customer base.    The stock traders were shut away in a glass room, with dozens of monitors on all the walls, with all the major news networks on 24-7, and every computer had the stock tickers running 24-7 of all the major exchanges, and every major news paper was delivered to the room every morning, before they even arrived.
> 
> All the traders did, all day long from morning until closing, was read, watch, and learn everything they could, both about the companies whose stocks they owned already, and the stocks of companies they were considering buying.
> 
> Since I own stocks through a mutual fund, those guys work for me.    So I don't care about some broken promise in China.  If it matters, the traders at my mutual fund will read about it, learn about it, research it, and buy, or sell, stocks in response to it.
> 
> That's why my investments are up 75% over how much I've put into them, over the past decade.   If things keep going as they have been, I'll have literally twice as much money in investments, than how much I've put into my investments, in about 3 years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If you invested since 2008 your investments are definitely doing well.
> The Stock Market is a gambling casino and there are way too many companies out there to audit.
> Personally, if your investments are doing well, that's fine.
> As long as you don't try to make it sound like any Investment Firms give a damn about whether or not your investment choices make any sense in the real world.
> You can thank the US Government for investing and propping up the market.
> Just make sure to move your investments to Money Markets before the next crash within the next year.
Click to expand...


I started investing in 2004. My investments are doing fantastic.

My investment firm does care.

The only time investment firms don't care, is if you are bound and determined to make bad investments.   If you walk in and say "I want to invest in X"... then they are going to help you invest in X, whether they think that is smart or not.  Why?  Because you are the customer.  If you demand to do X, they are the service provider.  They'll provide that service.

Now if you ask them "Is investing in X wise?", they'll tell you what they believe is best for you to do.

And again I don't need to audit every company.   My mutual fund has full time paid staff to do that.  And even they don't audit every company.  Only those companies they have stock in, or are considering buying stock in.

The government only needs to enforce justice, and prosecute fraud.  I thank them for that.   All the government regulations have not been a benefit to the market, or investing.  In fact, the very opposite.

No, I'm not going to invest in money markets.  Please.   Money markets are terrible investments.   If I had invested in money markets before 2008, I would not have half the value I do now.   Terrible idea.


----------



## Andylusion

Indeependent said:


> eflatminor said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greedy?  You do understand that the majority of Americans are invested in stock markets, right?  Are the majority of Americans greedy for doing so?
> 
> Fk the country?  How is investing in businesses, our job creators, fk'ing anyone?
> 
> Sounds like someone's simply jealous of success he didn't achieve.
> 
> Class war, eh?  Try bringing that shit up my driveway.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The majority can barely pay their bills.
Click to expand...


Which doesn't change the fact that most people own stock in the market.

If you can't pay your bills, it's likely because you are either not working, or spending too much, and more likely the latter.

Sell the car, buy a beater.  Stop eating out.  Do you really need a cell phone?  Cut the cable TV.


----------



## Windship

Unless your a super rich, your in the sights as well.


----------



## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Unless your a super rich, your in the sights as well.



Which explains why more people are able to become super rich in our country, than any other.    If you are poor today... you have better chance of becoming the super wealthy in our country, than any other in the world.   That's why we have immigrants that come here, and are now part of the super wealthy.

If what you claim was true, then people should be swimming to Cuba, to have a better life, not swimming here from Cuba.


----------



## Vandalshandle

Windship said:


> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....



Class war is coming? 

Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!


----------



## Windship

Andylusion said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are MANY people making foolish choices because they have been fed the nonsense that Investment Firms are honest and know what they're doing.
> 
> 
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
> NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
> My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah.  Ok, so what?
> 
> Everything you do in this world, is subject to people breaking promises.   You can marry a wife, spend your life with her, and she can run off with another man, and leave you wrecked.
> 
> You can take your car to a mechanic, and he can break the engine, and leave town.   I know someone that this happened to.
> 
> There are no guarantees in life.  None.
> 
> So I don't understand what your point is.     So what about broken promises in China?  Does that change the fact my stock in Prudential, and Novartis, are both up?
> 
> Let me explain how this works.
> 
> I do not buy single stocks.  No one ever should.  You buy mutual funds, and own stocks through mutual funds.
> 
> Moreover, you should buy more than one mutual fund.  Possibly 4 or 5.
> 
> So here is how it works out.    If my mutual fund discovers that my stock in say.... Croda International, or Banca Popolare Di Milano, or Hermès International, is not doing so well, or they find the company lied about "brick and mortar" in China....    they sell the stock, on my behalf.   And buy stock in companies that have not lied, or are performing better.
> 
> See, people like you and me, we don't have the time, or the resources, or even the interest in doing the continuous research, to determine which stocks to buy and sell.    Mutual funds on the other hand, that is specifically what they do.  I worked for a short time at a pension fund which is basically a mutual fund, only dedicated to a captive customer base.    The stock traders were shut away in a glass room, with dozens of monitors on all the walls, with all the major news networks on 24-7, and every computer had the stock tickers running 24-7 of all the major exchanges, and every major news paper was delivered to the room every morning, before they even arrived.
> 
> All the traders did, all day long from morning until closing, was read, watch, and learn everything they could, both about the companies whose stocks they owned already, and the stocks of companies they were considering buying.
> 
> Since I own stocks through a mutual fund, those guys work for me.    So I don't care about some broken promise in China.  If it matters, the traders at my mutual fund will read about it, learn about it, research it, and buy, or sell, stocks in response to it.
> 
> That's why my investments are up 75% over how much I've put into them, over the past decade.   If things keep going as they have been, I'll have literally twice as much money in investments, than how much I've put into my investments, in about 3 years.
Click to expand...


People like you with your seemingly reasonable outlook on life are very scary...flailing around pure unfettered capitalistic bull shit. Yes. All of those things can happen. The point you are missing because of your beliefs that it is ok to screw everyone for profit, even the country, is that these things are not ok. They are considered wrong behavior by sane people. Not people drunk and driving the automobile of greed with  exaggerated feelings of self importance. What you dumb asses dont realize, as you comadasize the poor, is that you are a commodity too. As long as you have money, you know, the money you stole from the working class and made them poor, somebody with just a little more is gonna want yours too. And guess what?...their gonna get it. Thats capitalism right? Lmfao. Suckers.


----------



## Windship

Vandalshandle said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
Click to expand...


Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture. 
You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> 
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
> NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
> My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah.  Ok, so what?
> 
> Everything you do in this world, is subject to people breaking promises.   You can marry a wife, spend your life with her, and she can run off with another man, and leave you wrecked.
> 
> You can take your car to a mechanic, and he can break the engine, and leave town.   I know someone that this happened to.
> 
> There are no guarantees in life.  None.
> 
> So I don't understand what your point is.     So what about broken promises in China?  Does that change the fact my stock in Prudential, and Novartis, are both up?
> 
> Let me explain how this works.
> 
> I do not buy single stocks.  No one ever should.  You buy mutual funds, and own stocks through mutual funds.
> 
> Moreover, you should buy more than one mutual fund.  Possibly 4 or 5.
> 
> So here is how it works out.    If my mutual fund discovers that my stock in say.... Croda International, or Banca Popolare Di Milano, or Hermès International, is not doing so well, or they find the company lied about "brick and mortar" in China....    they sell the stock, on my behalf.   And buy stock in companies that have not lied, or are performing better.
> 
> See, people like you and me, we don't have the time, or the resources, or even the interest in doing the continuous research, to determine which stocks to buy and sell.    Mutual funds on the other hand, that is specifically what they do.  I worked for a short time at a pension fund which is basically a mutual fund, only dedicated to a captive customer base.    The stock traders were shut away in a glass room, with dozens of monitors on all the walls, with all the major news networks on 24-7, and every computer had the stock tickers running 24-7 of all the major exchanges, and every major news paper was delivered to the room every morning, before they even arrived.
> 
> All the traders did, all day long from morning until closing, was read, watch, and learn everything they could, both about the companies whose stocks they owned already, and the stocks of companies they were considering buying.
> 
> Since I own stocks through a mutual fund, those guys work for me.    So I don't care about some broken promise in China.  If it matters, the traders at my mutual fund will read about it, learn about it, research it, and buy, or sell, stocks in response to it.
> 
> That's why my investments are up 75% over how much I've put into them, over the past decade.   If things keep going as they have been, I'll have literally twice as much money in investments, than how much I've put into my investments, in about 3 years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People like you with your seemingly reasonable outlook on life are very scary...flailing around pure unfettered capitalistic bull shit. Yes. All of those things can happen. The point you are missing because of your beliefs that it is ok to screw everyone for profit, even the country, is that these things are not ok. They are considered wrong behavior by sane people. Not people drunk and driving the automobile of greed with  exaggerated feelings of self importance. What you dumb asses dont realize, as you comadasize the poor, is that you are a commodity too. As long as you have money, you know, the money you stole from the working class and made them poor, somebody with just a little more is gonna want yours too. And guess what?...their gonna get it. Thats capitalism right? Lmfao. Suckers.
Click to expand...


Quit yer whining and get me my fries already.


----------



## saveliberty

Windship said:


> People like you with your seemingly reasonable outlook on life are very scary...flailing around pure unfettered capitalistic bull shit. Yes. All of those things can happen. The point you are missing because of your beliefs that it is ok to screw everyone for profit, even the country, is that these things are not ok. They are considered wrong behavior by sane people. Not people drunk and driving the automobile of greed with  exaggerated feelings of self importance. What you dumb asses dont realize, as you comadasize the poor, is that you are a commodity too. As long as you have money, you know, the money you stole from the working class and made them poor, somebody with just a little more is gonna want yours too. And guess what?...their gonna get it. Thats capitalism right? Lmfao. Suckers.



So buy stock and take back the profit you think you deserved.


----------



## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> 
> I know of absolutely no brokerage firm that will tell you to go ahead and buy a house or a boat based upon your stock return.   That is not what it is for or how it is used.
> 
> 
> 
> No one said that.
> What happens is that investment values are never audited.
> Clients believe their Financial Statement and Online Screens.
> Clients spend money like there's no tomorrow.
> And why shouldn't clients spend money that the Exchanges tell them they have.
> After all, aren't people paying all those Free Market companies Fees to ensure that the illusion is real?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't understand this.
> 
> Investment values can't be audited, because the values of stocks change by the minute.
> 
> I own stock in Walmart.   In just 3 hours, stock values went from $73.2, to $72.5.    They go up and down, up and down.   Constantly change.  Even when the stock market itself is closed, there are after-hours trading, and price go up and down constantly.
> 
> If you did a value audit, the results of that audit would be obsolete between the time where you clicked 'print', and the paper spit out of the printer.
> 
> So I'm not real sure what you mean by "no one audits the investment values".
> 
> As for clients spend money like no tomorrow.   That's their problem.   If the client wants to spend money until he's broke.... that is going to happen regardless of what the investment firm does.
> 
> There is no investment firm, that is going to magically invest your money, so brilliantly, that he can out earn, your stupidity as a person.
> 
> If you are determine to buy everything you want, regardless of if you have the money to cover it.... then it doesn't matter if the CEO of Goldman Sachs is your golfing partner or not.  You are going to be broke.
> 
> Lastly, exchanges do not tell you that if you have, or don't have, any money.   Exchanges can only tell you that based on the last trades, the assets you own have X value if you can sell them at the last value they sold for.
> 
> Let me put it another way.   I have a grand marquis.  I bought my grand marquis with only 60,000 miles on it, for only $3,000.    Meanwhile another person who bought the same car, paid $6,000.    How did I get my car for so cheap, while someone else had to pay twice a much?
> 
> Easy.  I bought my car in 2008, when gas was hitting $4 a gallon.   He bought his, in 2010, when gas was half that.    When I bought my car, people were freaking out that the evil oil companies which supposedly controlled gas prices, were going to keep driving up the price until it was $8 a gallon.
> 
> So the value of a V8 massive luxury land yacht, was low.   By 2010 when people saw the gas-Apocalypse wasn't coming, the values came back.
> 
> Everything changes in value over time.  Everything does.   Nothing in this world has 'intrinsic value'.     Thus the stock exchange does not lie, or manipulate.  They can only tell you want the value of your investment is, based on the last known trade.
> 
> But that doesn't mean the value will stay there.  If another Enron happens, and they find out that X Corp was fabricating sales data, and you own stock in X Corp, the value of that stock is going to go down.
> 
> If the government institutes protectionism, and eliminates imports, and that kills domestic companies, the value of your stock will go down.   No value is static.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most people I know under the age of 70 invest in CHINA; they couldn't give a damn about Brick & Mortar.
> NO ONE even knows if the companies in China even exist or are producing a product.
> My friend goes to China 4 times a year and India 4 times a year and has SIGNIFICANT issues with production and broken promises.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah.  Ok, so what?
> 
> Everything you do in this world, is subject to people breaking promises.   You can marry a wife, spend your life with her, and she can run off with another man, and leave you wrecked.
> 
> You can take your car to a mechanic, and he can break the engine, and leave town.   I know someone that this happened to.
> 
> There are no guarantees in life.  None.
> 
> So I don't understand what your point is.     So what about broken promises in China?  Does that change the fact my stock in Prudential, and Novartis, are both up?
> 
> Let me explain how this works.
> 
> I do not buy single stocks.  No one ever should.  You buy mutual funds, and own stocks through mutual funds.
> 
> Moreover, you should buy more than one mutual fund.  Possibly 4 or 5.
> 
> So here is how it works out.    If my mutual fund discovers that my stock in say.... Croda International, or Banca Popolare Di Milano, or Hermès International, is not doing so well, or they find the company lied about "brick and mortar" in China....    they sell the stock, on my behalf.   And buy stock in companies that have not lied, or are performing better.
> 
> See, people like you and me, we don't have the time, or the resources, or even the interest in doing the continuous research, to determine which stocks to buy and sell.    Mutual funds on the other hand, that is specifically what they do.  I worked for a short time at a pension fund which is basically a mutual fund, only dedicated to a captive customer base.    The stock traders were shut away in a glass room, with dozens of monitors on all the walls, with all the major news networks on 24-7, and every computer had the stock tickers running 24-7 of all the major exchanges, and every major news paper was delivered to the room every morning, before they even arrived.
> 
> All the traders did, all day long from morning until closing, was read, watch, and learn everything they could, both about the companies whose stocks they owned already, and the stocks of companies they were considering buying.
> 
> Since I own stocks through a mutual fund, those guys work for me.    So I don't care about some broken promise in China.  If it matters, the traders at my mutual fund will read about it, learn about it, research it, and buy, or sell, stocks in response to it.
> 
> That's why my investments are up 75% over how much I've put into them, over the past decade.   If things keep going as they have been, I'll have literally twice as much money in investments, than how much I've put into my investments, in about 3 years.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People like you with your seemingly reasonable outlook on life are very scary...flailing around pure unfettered capitalistic bull shit. Yes. All of those things can happen. The point you are missing because of your beliefs that it is ok to screw everyone for profit, even the country, is that these things are not ok. They are considered wrong behavior by sane people. Not people drunk and driving the automobile of greed with  exaggerated feelings of self importance. What you dumb asses dont realize, as you comadasize the poor, is that you are a commodity too. As long as you have money, you know, the money you stole from the working class and made them poor, somebody with just a little more is gonna want yours too. And guess what?...their gonna get it. Thats capitalism right? Lmfao. Suckers.
Click to expand...


First off, you don't know who you are talking to.

Lemme esplain you a little about who you are talking to.

When I was a sophomore in high school, I started worked at McDonalds.  From then, until now at 39, I have been continuously employed.  For the last 3 years, I got up at 3 AM, to get to work by 5 AM, to work until 4 PM.   For some of that time, I worked two jobs.

Over the course of the past 20 years, I have worked about 30 different jobs.   When I went to college, I started off in computer programming.   I failed out of college.  I went back twice, and failed out each time.   So then I went to college to be an auto mechanic.  While I passed all my classes, I broke every car I touched.   I was working at a dealership at the time, and they started docking my pay, to pay other mechanics to fix the cars I broke, that they had to repair.

From there, I tried many different jobs, including big-rig truck driver, and fell asleep at the wheel of a large semi-truck, while driving 65 mph on the highway.   Obviously I quit that job.

Because of my inability to get an education of value, or a trade skill I was good at, I have done manual labor jobs since high school.   Today I am earning $11/hour, the exact same wage I was earning in 1999.

So when you say something stupid, like "you comadasize the poor"... *I AM THE POOR*.   I have never in my life, earned more than $23,000 in a single year.  This year is on track for about $19,000.

When you say "the money you stole from the working class"....  *I AM THE WORKING CLASS*.   Every dollar I have, is a dollar that *I* earned.   Every investment I own, ever stock I've purchased, came from *MY WORK*.

When people were on Welfare, I was working.  When people were collecting unemployment, I was working.   When people in 2009, 2010, and 2011, where complaining about the lack of jobs, I was getting hired, and working my butt off.

I have not screwed over anyone anywhere.    The only people being screwed over, is the working class people, BY YOU!.   YOU PEOPLE are the ones screwing *US* over.   We're the ones paying all your taxes.  We're the ones paying for all your programs.   We're the ones paying for your green energy plans.   We're the ones working to pay the taxes to fund programs for people who don't work.

You spoiled brats likely haven't worked for an honest days wage yet.   Spare me your ignorance based lectures.  I paid over $4,000 in taxes, on my $22,000 in wages, to pay for programs you people demand.... then claim that I am screwing over the working people?      Idiots.  Foolish, stupid, mindless idiots.  All of you.  All the same.


----------



## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
Click to expand...


You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.

By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.


----------



## Vandalshandle

Windship said:


> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
Click to expand...


You too, can become rich, with this simple advice:

Buy low, and sell high.


----------



## Indeependent

Andylusion said:


> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.
> 
> By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.
Click to expand...

That's a Rush Limbaugh answer.
Hyperbole is a poor smokescreen with which to conceal chicanery.
People made lots of money before Reagan.


----------



## Andylusion

Indeependent said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.
> 
> By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's a Rush Limbaugh answer.
> Hyperbole is a poor smokescreen with which to conceal chicanery.
> People made lots of money before Reagan.
Click to expand...


Yeah, and I know I'm right, and you can't deny it.  That's why all you can do is "Well that is a Rush Limbaugh answer".

Hyperbole is a smoke screen, and so is deflection.   

The only difference is, I'm confronting the claim head on, and I do mean it.  Go to Venezuela.  There are no rich people there anymore (unless in government), and all the major corporations have left.   By the claims here, that should mean Venezuela is a Utopia.

There is no country, around this world, and throughout history, which has been hostile to the rich, the wealth, the job makers, and wealth producers, that has had a positive and prosperous result, by driving out the wealthy.

If you think the rich are screwing over the lower and middle class.... then show me an example of any country where they drove out the rich, and had a good result.    Where is it?  Where is the workers paradise?

Yes, people made tons of money before Reagan, and there were tons and tons of wealthy people before Reagan.

And quiet frankly, there is absolutely no evidence from anywhere, that show people are worse off today, than before Reagan.  Haven't met a person yet who lived through the 1970s, that suggest we should go back there.   Nor have I met anyone that suggested the 1980s were worse.... unless they didn't live through it.   Pretty easy to claim the 80s were bad, when you grew up in the 1990s.


----------



## Indeependent

Andylusion said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.
> 
> By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's a Rush Limbaugh answer.
> Hyperbole is a poor smokescreen with which to conceal chicanery.
> People made lots of money before Reagan.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, and I know I'm right, and you can't deny it.  That's why all you can do is "Well that is a Rush Limbaugh answer".
> 
> Hyperbole is a smoke screen, and so is deflection.
> 
> The only difference is, I'm confronting the claim head on, and I do mean it.  Go to Venezuela.  There are no rich people there anymore (unless in government), and all the major corporations have left.   By the claims here, that should mean Venezuela is a Utopia.
> 
> There is no country, around this world, and throughout history, which has been hostile to the rich, the wealth, the job makers, and wealth producers, that has had a positive and prosperous result, by driving out the wealthy.
> 
> If you think the rich are screwing over the lower and middle class.... then show me an example of any country where they drove out the rich, and had a good result.    Where is it?  Where is the workers paradise?
> 
> Yes, people made tons of money before Reagan, and there were tons and tons of wealthy people before Reagan.
> 
> And quiet frankly, there is absolutely no evidence from anywhere, that show people are worse off today, than before Reagan.  Haven't met a person yet who lived through the 1970s, that suggest we should go back there.   Nor have I met anyone that suggested the 1980s were worse.... unless they didn't live through it.   Pretty easy to claim the 80s were bad, when you grew up in the 1990s.
Click to expand...

Who us hostile towards rich people.
Most of my friends are quite wealthy.
I'm talking about sheer greed and excess and the legalized gambling casino called the Stock Market.


----------



## Andylusion

Indeependent said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vandalshandle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Class war is coming?
> 
> Definitely time to switch my investments to the weapons industry!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.
> 
> By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's a Rush Limbaugh answer.
> Hyperbole is a poor smokescreen with which to conceal chicanery.
> People made lots of money before Reagan.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, and I know I'm right, and you can't deny it.  That's why all you can do is "Well that is a Rush Limbaugh answer".
> 
> Hyperbole is a smoke screen, and so is deflection.
> 
> The only difference is, I'm confronting the claim head on, and I do mean it.  Go to Venezuela.  There are no rich people there anymore (unless in government), and all the major corporations have left.   By the claims here, that should mean Venezuela is a Utopia.
> 
> There is no country, around this world, and throughout history, which has been hostile to the rich, the wealth, the job makers, and wealth producers, that has had a positive and prosperous result, by driving out the wealthy.
> 
> If you think the rich are screwing over the lower and middle class.... then show me an example of any country where they drove out the rich, and had a good result.    Where is it?  Where is the workers paradise?
> 
> Yes, people made tons of money before Reagan, and there were tons and tons of wealthy people before Reagan.
> 
> And quiet frankly, there is absolutely no evidence from anywhere, that show people are worse off today, than before Reagan.  Haven't met a person yet who lived through the 1970s, that suggest we should go back there.   Nor have I met anyone that suggested the 1980s were worse.... unless they didn't live through it.   Pretty easy to claim the 80s were bad, when you grew up in the 1990s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who us hostile towards rich people.
> Most of my friends are quite wealthy.
> I'm talking about sheer greed and excess and the legalized gambling casino called the Stock Market.
Click to expand...


There is nothing about the stock market that is 'gambling'.   It's not comparable in any way.

Stop being ridiculous.    Gambling by it's nature, is a net loser.   Your odds of coming out ahead are always far negative.   If it wasn't, then no one would ever open a casino.

Your chances of losing playing the lottery, are 258,890,850 to 258,890,851.

If you think buying stocks, has the same inherently negative chances, then you are crazy.




 

Does that look like a consistent losing streak to you?

If you buy stocks, and just hold them.... and just keep them.... over the past 100 years, the value of that stock would have increased 1,000 fold.  And that's buying the stock, before the Great Depression.

Heck I wish I had been smart enough to invest when I was in high school, working at McDonalds.  When I was working there, I could have purchased McDonald's stock at $20 a share.  Today, it's up near $130 a share.  I could have $100,000 in stock by now.  Unfortunately I as stupid left-tard in High school, and still believed "the big evil companies hold us down"...  so now I'm just getting my investments up.    Left-tardian thought, keeps people poor.  I cite my own experiences as proof.

And by the way, this graph, is just the increase in the value of the stock you buy.

Even if that graph was completely flat, and McDonald's stock had remained at $20 a share for the last 30 years..... 

It doesn't include dividends.     You own part of the company, whose stock you buy.  As a part owner, you are entitled to a sliver of the profits.   McDonald's has paid out 50¢ to a dollar per share, since the 2000s.   You own a couple hundred shares, that's hundreds of dollars in growth every year.

So even if the value of the individual shares never changed, you would still grow your investment over time.

How is this..... ANYTHING LIKE.... gambling?   Name one single way, this is like gambling?


----------



## Windship

Andylusion said:


> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Windship said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lol. Of course there's a class war comin. Do you think the people your fucking over are just going to sit and take it forever?
> You know what I hate about you mother fuckers? You get everything you want but thats not enough. You want it all. And how do you treat the people that made it for you. You bend them over and screw them. I think a thank you and a raise would be a nice gesture.
> You people know whats coming. Im not causing it, you are. More crashes and more tax payer bailouts. Dont feel bad about being a sucker cause the working class are suckers for trusting you ass holes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.
> 
> By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's a Rush Limbaugh answer.
> Hyperbole is a poor smokescreen with which to conceal chicanery.
> People made lots of money before Reagan.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, and I know I'm right, and you can't deny it.  That's why all you can do is "Well that is a Rush Limbaugh answer".
> 
> Hyperbole is a smoke screen, and so is deflection.
> 
> The only difference is, I'm confronting the claim head on, and I do mean it.  Go to Venezuela.  There are no rich people there anymore (unless in government), and all the major corporations have left.   By the claims here, that should mean Venezuela is a Utopia.
> 
> There is no country, around this world, and throughout history, which has been hostile to the rich, the wealth, the job makers, and wealth producers, that has had a positive and prosperous result, by driving out the wealthy.
> 
> If you think the rich are screwing over the lower and middle class.... then show me an example of any country where they drove out the rich, and had a good result.    Where is it?  Where is the workers paradise?
> 
> Yes, people made tons of money before Reagan, and there were tons and tons of wealthy people before Reagan.
> 
> And quiet frankly, there is absolutely no evidence from anywhere, that show people are worse off today, than before Reagan.  Haven't met a person yet who lived through the 1970s, that suggest we should go back there.   Nor have I met anyone that suggested the 1980s were worse.... unless they didn't live through it.   Pretty easy to claim the 80s were bad, when you grew up in the 1990s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who us hostile towards rich people.
> Most of my friends are quite wealthy.
> I'm talking about sheer greed and excess and the legalized gambling casino called the Stock Market.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is nothing about the stock market that is 'gambling'.   It's not comparable in any way.
> 
> Stop being ridiculous.    Gambling by it's nature, is a net loser.   Your odds of coming out ahead are always far negative.   If it wasn't, then no one would ever open a casino.
> 
> Your chances of losing playing the lottery, are 258,890,850 to 258,890,851.
> 
> If you think buying stocks, has the same inherently negative chances, then you are crazy.
> 
> View attachment 89296
> 
> Does that look like a consistent losing streak to you?
> 
> If you buy stocks, and just hold them.... and just keep them.... over the past 100 years, the value of that stock would have increased 1,000 fold.  And that's buying the stock, before the Great Depression.
> 
> Heck I wish I had been smart enough to invest when I was in high school, working at McDonalds.  When I was working there, I could have purchased McDonald's stock at $20 a share.  Today, it's up near $130 a share.  I could have $100,000 in stock by now.  Unfortunately I as stupid left-tard in High school, and still believed "the big evil companies hold us down"...  so now I'm just getting my investments up.    Left-tardian thought, keeps people poor.  I cite my own experiences as proof.
> 
> And by the way, this graph, is just the increase in the value of the stock you buy.
> 
> Even if that graph was completely flat, and McDonald's stock had remained at $20 a share for the last 30 years.....
> 
> It doesn't include dividends.     You own part of the company, whose stock you buy.  As a part owner, you are entitled to a sliver of the profits.   McDonald's has paid out 50¢ to a dollar per share, since the 2000s.   You own a couple hundred shares, that's hundreds of dollars in growth every year.
> 
> So even if the value of the individual shares never changed, you would still grow your investment over time.
> 
> How is this..... ANYTHING LIKE.... gambling?   Name one single way, this is like gambling?
Click to expand...


There are many ups and downs. The curve is anything but strait. What a crock of shit. Not gambling, lmao. If a poker never loses, he is not gambling?? No foreseen future. Jeeze! According to you, no one ever lost money in the stock market.


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## Windship

fretrama said:


> A *stock market*, is the aggregation of buyers and sellers (a loose network of economic transactions, not a physical facility or discrete entity) of stocks (also called shares); these may include _securities_ listed on a stock exchange as well as those only traded privately.
> 
> Stock market participation refers to the number of agents who buy and sell equity backed securities either directly or indirectly in a financial exchange. Participants are generally subdivided into three distinct sectors; households, institutions, and foreign traders. Direct participation occurs when any of the above entities buys or sells securities on its own behalf on an exchange. Indirect participation occurs when an institutional investor exchanges a stock on behalf of an individual or household. Indirect investment occurs in the form of pooled investment accounts, retirement accounts, and other managed financial accounts.



Another crock of shit written by a do nothing wall street financier with no allegiance to anyone, any country or anything but money..


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## Windship

Your all a bunch of sick people that have lost their way. The great city of Babylon.


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## Windship

Here is what you greedy cock sucker have done. My friend got his job 35 years ago in retail. RETAIL!  Lol.  He now has 60,000usd in the bank, has completely paid off his house, drives a nice, late model car and, well, so far, has a retirement. It was and still is a union shop. Do that now. The middle just had too much wealth for you greedy bastards didnt they?


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> Your all a bunch of sick people that have lost their way. The great city of Babylon.



Waah...now get me my fries.


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## Windship

And, lol, what the pity really is, as Ive said before, is that the super rich?...if your not super rich?...you are their wrath's object as well. But you dont see it your so drunk.


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## Windship

How bout this: when the day comes and the banks dont open...will you be able to get your money? Are you that important to anyone?


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## Windship

...and if you cant get your money, lol, guess what...you are at the bottom with everyone else.


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> And, lol, what the pity really is, as Ive said before, is that the super rich?...if your not super rich?...you are their wrath's object as well. But you dont see it your so drunk.



*your not super rich?...you are their wrath's object as well.*

I'm the subject of super rich wrath?
Well, gosh, that's enough to make me cry.........


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> How bout this: when the day comes and the banks dont open...will you be able to get your money? Are you that important to anyone?



The day your McDonalds doesn't open, where are you going to make the fries?


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## Windship

You are a commodity too.


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## Windship

I dont eat at mcdonalds.


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## Windship

Lol...you are a commodity too you dope.  Ha, ha, ha and you dont have the conscientiousness  to see.


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## Toddsterpatriot

Windship said:


> I dont eat at mcdonalds.



Even with your employee discount?


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## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Indeependent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andylusion said:
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have to.  Move to Venezuela.  No rich people going to mess with you there.   Of course, no jobs, no food, no electricity, but hey, no one is screwing you over.
> 
> By all means, if you hate our system so much, go live under another system, and tell us how much better it is.
> 
> 
> 
> That's a Rush Limbaugh answer.
> Hyperbole is a poor smokescreen with which to conceal chicanery.
> People made lots of money before Reagan.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, and I know I'm right, and you can't deny it.  That's why all you can do is "Well that is a Rush Limbaugh answer".
> 
> Hyperbole is a smoke screen, and so is deflection.
> 
> The only difference is, I'm confronting the claim head on, and I do mean it.  Go to Venezuela.  There are no rich people there anymore (unless in government), and all the major corporations have left.   By the claims here, that should mean Venezuela is a Utopia.
> 
> There is no country, around this world, and throughout history, which has been hostile to the rich, the wealth, the job makers, and wealth producers, that has had a positive and prosperous result, by driving out the wealthy.
> 
> If you think the rich are screwing over the lower and middle class.... then show me an example of any country where they drove out the rich, and had a good result.    Where is it?  Where is the workers paradise?
> 
> Yes, people made tons of money before Reagan, and there were tons and tons of wealthy people before Reagan.
> 
> And quiet frankly, there is absolutely no evidence from anywhere, that show people are worse off today, than before Reagan.  Haven't met a person yet who lived through the 1970s, that suggest we should go back there.   Nor have I met anyone that suggested the 1980s were worse.... unless they didn't live through it.   Pretty easy to claim the 80s were bad, when you grew up in the 1990s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who us hostile towards rich people.
> Most of my friends are quite wealthy.
> I'm talking about sheer greed and excess and the legalized gambling casino called the Stock Market.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There is nothing about the stock market that is 'gambling'.   It's not comparable in any way.
> 
> Stop being ridiculous.    Gambling by it's nature, is a net loser.   Your odds of coming out ahead are always far negative.   If it wasn't, then no one would ever open a casino.
> 
> Your chances of losing playing the lottery, are 258,890,850 to 258,890,851.
> 
> If you think buying stocks, has the same inherently negative chances, then you are crazy.
> 
> View attachment 89296
> 
> Does that look like a consistent losing streak to you?
> 
> If you buy stocks, and just hold them.... and just keep them.... over the past 100 years, the value of that stock would have increased 1,000 fold.  And that's buying the stock, before the Great Depression.
> 
> Heck I wish I had been smart enough to invest when I was in high school, working at McDonalds.  When I was working there, I could have purchased McDonald's stock at $20 a share.  Today, it's up near $130 a share.  I could have $100,000 in stock by now.  Unfortunately I as stupid left-tard in High school, and still believed "the big evil companies hold us down"...  so now I'm just getting my investments up.    Left-tardian thought, keeps people poor.  I cite my own experiences as proof.
> 
> And by the way, this graph, is just the increase in the value of the stock you buy.
> 
> Even if that graph was completely flat, and McDonald's stock had remained at $20 a share for the last 30 years.....
> 
> It doesn't include dividends.     You own part of the company, whose stock you buy.  As a part owner, you are entitled to a sliver of the profits.   McDonald's has paid out 50¢ to a dollar per share, since the 2000s.   You own a couple hundred shares, that's hundreds of dollars in growth every year.
> 
> So even if the value of the individual shares never changed, you would still grow your investment over time.
> 
> How is this..... ANYTHING LIKE.... gambling?   Name one single way, this is like gambling?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There are many ups and downs. The curve is anything but strait. What a crock of shit. Not gambling, lmao. If a poker never loses, he is not gambling?? No foreseen future. Jeeze! According to you, no one ever lost money in the stock market.
Click to expand...


Are you saying that anything in life you have a chance of losing money, is therefore gambling?   You can lose money on anything.    Are you saying everything anyone does in this world is "gambling"?

You could lose money going to work.  Chances are low, but it could happen that you get sick, and have to go home, and spend more money on gas driving to and from work, than you earned at work.    Obviously getting up and going to work, is a gamble!   After all, don't act like no one ever lost money going to work.

I've actually had that happen.  Hour long commute... and puked my guts out at work, came right back home.   Earned about $5 for the 30 minutes I was there, and likely spent more in gas going there and back.    And if you have a car accident, the cost will likely be more than you made going work.  That was a bad 'gamble'.  Should have stayed home.

That's not gambling.    Nor is the stock market.   Can you lose money in the stock market?  Of course.   But the vast majority of those who lose money, do so by their own actions.  Not the action of the stock market.

The typical American method of losing money in the stock market, is real simple.  They see the market going up, and start buying.... so they buy high.   Then they see the market going down, and they sell... so they sell low.    Buy high, and sell low.  That's how people lose money... by making stupid choices.


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## Andylusion

Windship said:


> fretrama said:
> 
> 
> 
> A *stock market*, is the aggregation of buyers and sellers (a loose network of economic transactions, not a physical facility or discrete entity) of stocks (also called shares); these may include _securities_ listed on a stock exchange as well as those only traded privately.
> 
> Stock market participation refers to the number of agents who buy and sell equity backed securities either directly or indirectly in a financial exchange. Participants are generally subdivided into three distinct sectors; households, institutions, and foreign traders. Direct participation occurs when any of the above entities buys or sells securities on its own behalf on an exchange. Indirect participation occurs when an institutional investor exchanges a stock on behalf of an individual or household. Indirect investment occurs in the form of pooled investment accounts, retirement accounts, and other managed financial accounts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another crock of shit written by a do nothing wall street financier with no allegiance to anyone, any country or anything but money..
Click to expand...


First off....  I think you wouldn't pass the hypocritical test.

Let's say that we had a "wall street financier" who had complete allegiance to the country, the public, and money wasn't important.  Would you hire him to do your investing, if he lost money year over year?   Or let's even say 2% return, when everyone else gets 6% to 10%.    Would you still invest with such a person, when even an index fund (which has no allegiance to anyone, any country or anything but money), would completely out perform with consistently better results?

And the answer is... no.  You would not.  So in effect, you condemn yourself.

Second, the majority of "wall street financier" are the public.   As I have shown before, the vast majority of stocks are held by the American public.    Every time you whine about "wall street financier", you are equally saying "those old retirees and employees with 401ks, have 'no allegiance to anyone, any country or anything but money'.

That is in fact what you are saying.   We are the financiers.   We're the ones that buy the stock.


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## Andylusion

Windship said:


> Here is what you greedy cock sucker have done. My friend got his job 35 years ago in retail. RETAIL!  Lol.  He now has 60,000usd in the bank, has completely paid off his house, drives a nice, late model car and, well, so far, has a retirement. It was and still is a union shop. Do that now. The middle just had too much wealth for you greedy bastards didnt they?



I'm below he 'middle'.   Like I said, I earn $23,000 a year.  If I'm lucky.

So what are you talking about?

Besides that... you can still be a millionaire in today's world.  Just as easy.

Here's how a janitor amassed an $8M fortune

This guy, Ronald Reed, was a janitor.   He died with over $8 Million.

What did he do?   I owned stock.  GE, GM, AT&T, and a dozen other stocks.

So if he can work as a Janitor.... and end up with $8 Million.   Why do you think no one can do that today?

Do you want me to list off the endless names of immigrants that come here with ZERO, and end up millionaires?     How do you explain Phil Robertson?   Drunk guy whittling duck callers, now a multi-millionaire?     How does that happen in a world you claim you can't have a middle class?

See, we are arguing the facts.  You are arguing myths and claims, and hearsay.


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## Andylusion

Windship said:


> And, lol, what the pity really is, as Ive said before, is that the super rich?...if your not super rich?...you are their wrath's object as well. But you dont see it your so drunk.



And yet my parents worked as school teachers.  Today they have a million dollars net worth, and a house on lake Erie. 

I guess they missed the "wrath's object" memo.


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## sfchetzel

Windship said:


> A bunch of do nothing, screw the country, greedy ass mf'rs. Go to hell.How much is enough? Fu. You need to be watched and regulated just like a bunch of children so you dont fk the country up...oooops...to late. Class war comin....


Well I see trying to have a substantive conversation with this one is next to impossible.Try calming down and posting using logic instead of emotion!


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## sfchetzel

Windship said:


> Whats comin? When unfettered capitalism has devoured everything and pushed people to their limit?...what do YOU think will happen?


Then, maybe, you should move to Ethiopia. I do not think they embrace capitalism there. You should feel much better then!


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