# Trump Wanted So Stay In Office. Long Live Trump.



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.


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## TNHarley (Sep 13, 2022)

Its crazy how easy yall rubes fall for his trolls.
Blows the mind actually.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

This is from the new book by journalist Maggie Haberman:


Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.

“I’m just not going to leave,” Trump told one aide, according to Haberman.

“We’re never leaving,” Trump told another. “How can you leave when you won an election?”

Trump’s insistence that he would not be leaving the White House, which has not been previously reported, adds new detail to the chaotic post-election period in which Trump’s refusal to accept his defeat and numerous efforts to overturn the election result led to the January 6, 2021, attack on the US Capitol by pro-Trump rioters.

Haberman’s book, “Confidence Man: The Making of Donald Trump and the Breaking of America,” is being released on October 4. 

The revelations from the book come as investigators in the US House and the Justice Department probe Trump’s refusal to cede power after the 2020 election. The House select committee investigating January 6 is planning more hearings and a final report this fall, while federal investigators have recently served several former Trump aides with subpoenas.

Haberman, a CNN political analyst, has covered Trump for the New York Times since his 2016 presidential campaign. Her stories made her a frequent target of Trump’s vitriol on Twitter.

Haberman writes that in the immediate aftermath of the November 3 elections, Trump seemed to recognize he had lost to Biden. He asked advisers to tell him what had gone wrong. He comforted one adviser, saying, “We did our best.” Trump told junior press aides, “I thought we had it,” seemingly almost embarrassed by the outcome, according to Haberman.

But at some point, Trump’s mood changed, Haberman writes, and he abruptly informed aides he had no intention of departing the White House in late January 2021 for Biden to move in. 

He was even overheard asking the chair of the Republican National Committee, Ronna McDaniel, “Why should I leave if they stole it from me?” 

Trump’s vow that he would refuse to vacate the White House had no historical precedent, Haberman writes, and his declaration left aides uncertain as to what he might do next. The closest parallel might have been Mary Todd Lincoln, who stayed in the White House for nearly a month after her husband, President Abraham Lincoln, was assassinated, the author noted.

Publicly, Trump dismissed questions about whether he would leave office. On November 26, 2020, he was asked by a reporter whether he would leave the White House if the Electoral College voted for Biden. “Certainly I will, and you know that,” Trump said in response, as he continued to spread lies about the election being stolen.

A longtime New York-based reporter who has worked for both of the city’s tabloid newspapers, Haberman writes that Trump’s post-election period was reminiscent of his attempts to claw his way back from dire financial straits three decades earlier, in which he tried to keep all options open for as long as he could.

But Trump couldn’t decide which path to follow after his 2020 defeat. Haberman writes that he quizzed nearly everyone about which options would lead to success – including the valet who brought Diet Cokes when Trump pressed a red button on his Oval Office desk.

The reporting provided to CNN from the forthcoming book also reveals new details on what those around Trump were doing in the aftermath of an election loss he refused to accept. Trump’s son-in-law, Jared Kushner, was reluctant to confront Trump on the loss, according to Haberman. 

When he encouraged a group of aides to go to the White House and brief the then-President, Kushner was asked why he wasn’t joining them himself. Trump’s son-in-law likened it to a deathbed scene, Haberman writes.

“The priest comes later,” Kushner said.










						Exclusive: 'I'm just not going to leave': New book reveals Trump vowed to stay in White House
					

Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.




					www.cnn.com


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## 22lcidw (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from the new book by journalist Maggie Haberman:
> 
> 
> Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.
> ...


I was taught what evil can be. You were taught ethnic/cultural superiority and the arrogance that goes with it.


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## OhPleaseJustQuit (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2022 elections, during and after, to this day.


*BE OWNED.*


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

22lcidw said:


> I was taught what evil can be. You were taught ethnic/cultural superiority and the arrogance that goes with it.


I see.  You cannot read. 

Trump posted his dreams for Presidency and you think that I.....am arrogant and superior, etc, etc  for posting what he thinks, what his dreams continue to be.

Never mind what his dreams for continuous Presidential position continue to be, which as his own post on his own social media shows.......he wishes to continue to be President for the next 20 to 30 years.

Which would make him what?  Since a President's run is four years? 

Never mind.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

WASHINGTON — Former President Donald Trump's team orchestrated a plot to overturn the 2020 election by organizing slates of alternate "fake electors" in seven pivotal states, according to testimony and documents presented Tuesday by the House Jan. 6 committee.

During its fourth public hearing, the committee revealed that the fake electors submitted false certifications of Trump victories to the National Archives in hopes of having then-Vice President Mike Pence substitute them for the actual electoral votes that made Joe Biden president.


Republican National Committee Chair Ronna McDaniel said in pre-recorded testimony that Trump called her so that one of his lawyers, John Eastman, could outline how the party organization could play its part in trying to certify Trump slates from states that voted for Biden.

"Essentially he turned the call over to Mr. Eastman who then proceeded to talk about the importance of the RNC helping the campaign gather these contingent electors in case any of the legal challenges that were ongoing changed the result of any of the states," McDaniel said, revealing Trump's direct knowledge of the effort to undermine the election.

The effort to organize counterfeit electors was one part of a broader campaign by the just-defeated president to cling to power.

But, according to the committee, it demonstrated Trump's willingness to use any means — regardless of their legality — to reverse the will of voters. Trump's team turned to the "fake electors" plan when it became clear that state officials in Georgia, Arizona, Pennsylvania and other key battlegrounds would not overturn the results in their states and replace Biden electors with Trump electors.

(full article online)










						Trump team orchestrated 'fake electors' to try to overturn election, Jan. 6 committee details
					

False certifications from seven pivotal states were submitted to the National Archives in hopes of reversing the will of American voters.




					www.nbcnews.com


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## Hugo Furst (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2022 elections, during and after, to this day.





Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media. It tells his state of mind before the 2022 elections, during and after, to this day.


2022?


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## Nostra (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2022 elections, during and after, to this day.


Trump trolls you morons so easily.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

What Trump supporters do not want to hear from his own words:


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## TNHarley (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> I see.  You cannot read.
> 
> Trump posted his dreams for Presidency and you think that I.....am arrogant and superior, etc, etc  for posting what he thinks, what his dreams continue to be.
> 
> ...


We need a retard emoji sooooooooo bad


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Trump's forever as President, like Putin and others,  resides on his mind full time:

*TIMELINE*

1. *Nov. 4, 2020*: Former Secretary of Energy in the Trump administration, *Rick Perry* texts White House Chief of State *Mark Meadows* proposing an“AGRESSIVE[sic] STRATEGY” to have state legislatures ignore the will of their voters and deliver their states’ electors to Trump:

“HERE’s an AGRESSIVE[sic] STRATEGY: Why can t (sic) the states of GA NC PENN and other R controlled state houses declare this is BS (where conflicts and election not called that night) and just send their own electors to vote and have it go to the SCOTUS.”

2. *Nov. 5, 2020* at 12:51pm: *Donald Trump Jr.* texts *Meadows *proposing that Republican-controlled state assemblies “step in” and put forward separate slates of “Trump electors.” “Republicans control Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Michigan, North Carolina etc we get Trump electors,” Trump Jr. adds. “We have multiple paths We control them all,” he writes.

3. *Nov. 6, 2020*: *Rep. Andy Biggs* texts Mark Meadows about efforts to encourage Republican legislators in certain States to send alternate slates of electors which Biggs acknowledges would be *“highly controversial.”* He asks Meadows, “Is anybody on the team researching and considering lobbying for that?” *Meadows replies: “I love it.”




*

4. *Meadows* responds to a similar message by saying *“We are’*’ and another such message by saying *‘‘Yes. Have a team on it” *(House of Representatives contempt report).






5. *Nov. 7, 2020*: In an email that *Meadows *produces for the select committee, a message discusses appointment of alternate slate of electors as part of a *“direct and collateral attack”* after the election (Letter from Bennie Thompson to Mark Meadows’ attorney).






6. *Nov. 18, 2020*: Kenneth Chesebro provides a 7-page memorandum to James R. Troupis, a lawyer for the Trump Campaign in Wisconsin, which Chesebro states is written upon Troupis’s request.

The memo describes January 6th as the ultimate date of significance and the “hard deadline,” and outlines the need for alternate slates of electors to meet on Dec. 14 and issue a certification for Trump. He writes that “a court decision (*or, perhaps, a state legislative determination*) rendered after December 14 in favor of the Trump-Pence slate of electors should be considered timely” for the counting of electoral votes on Jan. 6 (emphasis added). Chesebro describes in detail the Hawaii 1960 case in Kennedy-Nixon, in which Democrats met to issue a declaration during the state’s recount (which Kennedy ultimately won).

[Aside: See below also Chesebro memo to Troupis on Dec. 9; Chesebro memo to Giuliani on Dec. 13; Chesebro forwarding his Giuliani memo to Eastman on Jan. 2.]

The New York Times reported that Chesebro’s memos later formed part of the Trump lawyers’ efforts:

“The [Nov. 18 and Dec. 9 Chesebro] memos were initially meant to address Mr. Trump’s challenge to the outcome in Wisconsin, but they ultimately became part of a broader conversation by members of Mr. Trump’s legal team as the president looked toward Jan. 6 and began to exert pressure on Mr. Pence to hold up certification of the Electoral College count.”

“The language and suggestions in the memos from Mr. Chesebro to Mr. Troupis closely echo tactics and talking points that were eventually adopted by Mr. Trump’s top lawyers.”

[Aside: Chesebro’s Dec. 13 memo to Giuliani was not yet public at the time of the NYT report, nor Eastman’s collaboration with Chesebro on Eastman’s own memos.]

7. *Nov. 23, 2020*: *Sen. Mike Lee* (R-UT) texts Meadows:

“John *Eastman* has some really interesting research on this. The good news is is that Eastman is proposing an approach that unlike what Sidney Powell has propose could be examined very quickly.”

Sen. Lee texts again:

“But to do this, you’d have to act very soon. Some believe today might be the deadline for some of this in PA.”

8. *End of November and first week of December*: “*Eastman sent memos to high-level White House staff *explaining that the January 6 plan required legislators ‘to determine the manner of choosing electors, even to the point of *adopting a slate of electors themselves,’” *according to Judge Carter’s June 2022 opinion (emphasis added).

[See Eastman 7-page memo sent to White House on Nov. 28, 2020, entitled, “The Constitutional Authority of State Legislatures to Choose Electors.” This third memo has not received the same attention as Eastman’s other two subsequent memos.]

9. *Dec. 6, 2020*: *Meadows* (using his gmail account) emails *Jason Miller*, a senior aide on the Trump Campaign. The email includes a Chesebro memo (attachment “2020-11-20 Chesebro memo on real deadline2.pdf”). Meadows tells Miller: *“We just need to have someone coordinating the electors for states.”

(full article online)*









						Timeline: False Alternate Slate of Electors Scheme, Donald Trump and His Close Associates
					

The most comprehensive factual record available of Donald Trump and his close associates coordination of the false electors scheme.




					www.justsecurity.org


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Nostra said:


> Trump trolls you morons so easily.


Trump's mind cannot get off his idea, belief, that he MUST be made President of the USA for life.


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## Nostra (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump's mind cannot get off his idea, belief, that he MUST be made President of the USA for life.


See.


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## TNHarley (Sep 13, 2022)

Nostra said:


> See.


I do. Sadly, that poor sap doesnt. 
But thats ok. Its excellent entertainment


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## OhPleaseJustQuit (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> What Trump supporters do not want to hear from his own words:


Oh, my goodness.  It's as if you believe that hearing that for the 650,012th time is going to make it any more important to anybody but you TDS afflicted.

Y'all sure do love saying things a whole lot of times.


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## BlindBoo (Sep 13, 2022)

I wanted the USFL to be a successful football league too.

Have some cake.


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## OhPleaseJustQuit (Sep 13, 2022)

BlindBoo said:


> I wanted the USFL to be a successful football league too.
> 
> Have some cake.


Oh, look!  Isn't it nice that you have some input!  Bless your heart!


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

2/2 ...this proof Trump knew he'd lost but permitted the Big Ripoff to proceed—assuming DOJ can show Trump directed/participated in the grift—is what prosecutors need to move forward. At bottom, this is just a garden variety fraud case, albeit one involving a former president.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)




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## TNHarley (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>


You are either a troll or a complete moron.


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from the new book by journalist Maggie Haberman:
> 
> 
> Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.
> ...


A Trump hater has a book full of hate. What else is new?


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

TNHarley said:


> You are either a troll or a complete moron.


I say he or she is both.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

But all those giggles served to obscure the more pressing fact: that in a departure from all precedent, Trump had used Independence Day to stage a military display, in which M1A2 tanks and Bradley armoured vehicles rolled into Washington, while fighter jets and helicopters filled the sky. The generals, mindful of the need to separate military and political power, had long opposed this extravaganza and, tellingly, most of the joint chiefs contrived to stay away. They understood that such a pageant is the stuff of despots, not democrats.

Another image framed this split-screen 4 July: that of the children, separated from their parents, who are caged in detention camps on America’s southern border. Accounts by lawyers and doctors who were allowed brief visits to these hellish places are almost unbearable to read: children deprived of sleep, denied access to blankets or mattresses, not allowed to wash their hands or brush their teeth; toddlers left alone on cold, hard floors, so traumatised they sit in stunned, tearless silence. I’m especially haunted by the report of “a suicidal four-year-old whose face was covered in bloody, self-inflicted scratches”.

This too is what dictators do: demonising a group – in this case, migrants – as an alien threat, an army of invaders, so intensely and for so long that eventually any fate, no matter how brutal or inhumane, seems deserved, even when it is inflicted on that group’s youngest and most vulnerable members. Breaking up families, caging children in hot, fetid, disease-ridden camps – this is what dictators do.

But we hesitate to see it for what it is. Again, the laughter gets in the way. So we snigger at Ivanka Trump ludicrously barging her way into a powwow of world leaders, making a meme of #uninvitedIvanka, rather than confronting head-on the reality that Trump is doing what dictators always do: he’s building a hereditary dynasty, so that his power won’t end with his death. Those images at the G20 looked absurd to us, but they will take their place in the showreel, so that, come the 2024 or 2028 elections, they can be used as proof of Ivanka’s supposed experience on the global stage.

It’s all there, if you can bear to look at it. From the kleptocratic impulse – Trump pushing to meet foreign leaders at his hotels, so that he can profit – to his undisguised admiration for his fellow strongmen. Trump can’t get enough of Kim Jong-un, handing him another propaganda gift last weekend by setting foot in, and thereby legitimising, the slave state Kim rules so bloodily – and, once again, getting nothing in return. But in Osaka, at the G20 summit, he was also palling around with Mohammed bin Salman, even though the UN and the CIA both agree the Saudi leader was directly responsible for the violent murder of US resident Jamal Khashoggi. As for the simpering deference Trump shows Vladimir Putin, it’s a wonder Trump’s supporters describe him as a strongman at all: next to the Russian president, he looked like a teenager with a crush.

Draw up a checklist of the semiotics of dictatorship and Trump ticks every one. He muses out loud about being president for life, saying it would be “great”. He’s indicated often that he would not accept the outcome of an election he lost. He’s threatened to jail his political opponents. He has the despot’s attitude to the truth – lying routinely, even about trivial matters, partly to demonstrate power. So great is his sway over his devotees, he can make them believe even what is provably false.

And he has the despot’s contempt for a free press, forever railing against the “fake news” media and all but abolishing the White House daily briefing, which at least aimed to hold successive administrations to account. Note his abuse of power to pursue vendettas against the companies that own media organisations that displease him: seeking to raise postal charges on Amazon, as retaliation against the Washington Post, owned by Amazon’s Jeff Bezos; and moving to block the AT&T-Time Warner merger to hurt CNN.


The most chilling moment of his encounter with Putin last weekend came when the two men bonded over their shared loathing of journalists: “Get rid of them,” Trump said to his Kremlin counterpart, perhaps envious of the toll of 26 murdered journalists notched up in Russia during the Putin years.


(full article online)










						Donald Trump wants to be a dictator. It’s not enough just to laugh at him | Jonathan Freedland
					

He cages children, he holds a military parade, he muses about being president for life. Yet we fail to see him for what he is, says Guardian columnist Jonathan Freedland




					www.theguardian.com


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> But all those giggles served to obscure the more pressing fact: that in a departure from all precedent, Trump had used Independence Day to stage a military display, in which M1A2 tanks and Bradley armoured vehicles rolled into Washington, while fighter jets and helicopters filled the sky. The generals, mindful of the need to separate military and political power, had long opposed this extravaganza and, tellingly, most of the joint chiefs contrived to stay away. They understood that such a pageant is the stuff of despots, not democrats.
> 
> Another image framed this split-screen 4 July: that of the children, separated from their parents, who are caged in detention camps on America’s southern border. Accounts by lawyers and doctors who were allowed brief visits to these hellish places are almost unbearable to read: children deprived of sleep, denied access to blankets or mattresses, not allowed to wash their hands or brush their teeth; toddlers left alone on cold, hard floors, so traumatised they sit in stunned, tearless silence. I’m especially haunted by the report of “a suicidal four-year-old whose face was covered in bloody, self-inflicted scratches”.
> 
> ...


TLDR.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

In closed-door remarks obtained by CNN, President Trump praised China's President Xi Jinping for recently consolidating power and extending his potential tenure, musing he wouldn't mind making such a maneuver himself.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> TLDR.


Better than being brain dead like you and others.



And now, back to Trump's history of embracing dictatorship for life.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Johnston notes that personality traits like closed mindedness, along with aversion to change and discomfort with diversity, are linked to authoritarianism: “As these social and cultural conflicts have become a bigger part of our political debates, citizens have sorted into different parties based on personality, with citizens high in openness much more likely to be liberals and Democrats than those low in openness who are more likely to be conservatives and Republican.”

Karen Stenner’s seminal book The Authoritarian Dynamic describes how authoritarianism has grown more rapidly and in greater force than anyone had imagined, in the personage of Donald Trump and his norm-shattering rise.

According to Stenner’s theory, there is a certain subset of people who hold latent authoritarian tendencies. These tendencies can be triggered or “activated” by the perception of physical threats or by destabilizing social change, leading those individuals to desire policies and leaders that we might more colloquially call authoritarian.

Authoritarians prioritize social order and hierarchies, which brings, for them, a sense of control to a chaotic world. Challenges to that order — diversity, influx of outsiders, breakdown of the old order — are experienced as personally threatening because they risk upending the status quo order people equate with basic security.

Authoritarianism experts agree on the basic causality of authoritarianism. People do not support extreme policies and strongman leaders just out of an affirmative desire for authoritarianism, but rather as a response to experiencing certain kinds of threats.

Amanda Tauba, writing in Vox, conducted a survey the results of which prompted her to argue the following: “The first thing that jumped out from the data on authoritarians is just how many there are. Our results found that 44 percent of white respondents nationwide scored as ‘high’ or ‘very high’ authoritarians, with 19 percent as ‘very high.’ That’s actually not unusual, and lines up with previous national surveys that found that the authoritarian disposition is far from rare. The key thing to understand is that authoritarianism is often latent; people in this 44 percent only vote or otherwise act as authoritarians once triggered by some perceived threat, physical or social.”

*The Rise of Populism*​ 

Authoritarian populism is a significant challenge to democratic politics on both sides of the Atlantic. An increasing number of extreme populist politicians are making headway across the world’s established democracies.

Western societies, including the United States, are becoming more diverse, especially in urban centers. Cosmopolitan urban centers, such as the metropolitan areas on the East and West Coasts, are seeing concentrations of economic dynamism, growth, and new opportunities. Combining diversity, openness, and economic dynamism, cities have grown into an economic and cultural antithesis of the less diverse and economically stagnant suburban and rural areas.

In the U.S. context, the rise of authoritarian populism has gone hand in hand with the decline of trust in government and political institutions; the decline in lawmakers’ responsiveness to the public’s expressed policy preferences; and the rise of ideological polarization. Taken together, these should be seen as warning signs of the declining strength of America’s democracy.

The decline of trust in the U.S. government dates back to the mid-1960s. Fifty years ago, close to three-quarters of the U.S. population trusted the federal government; that number has dropped to below 25 percent. During the first year of the Trump administration, this decline has continued. A similar erosion of trust can be seen in other areas of U.S. society— such as media, churches, corporations, and universities. This makes it difficult to see the decline of political trust as an isolated phenomenon. Furthermore, in some situations, low levels of trust in government could be benign. Citizens who are distrustful and scrutinizing, for example, might be in a better position to hold elected representatives accountable than citizens who hold a more romantic view of politics and politicians.

Cas Mudde, a Dutch political scientist, wrote in a 2015 column for The Guardianthat “populism is an illiberal democratic response to undemocratic liberalism.” This is why Kurt Weyland, a University of Texas political scientist, wrote, in a 2013 academic article, “Populism will always stand in tension with democracy.”

Populism is spreading across the globe. In Europe, populist parties have won victories in Greece, Hungary, Italy, Poland, Slovakia, and Switzerland; and they have joined governing coalitions in Finland, Norway, and Lithuania. More broadly, strongmen with populist agendas have become president — including Rodrigo Duterte in the Philippines and Donald Trump in the United States.

Various causes lie behind populist upsurges, ranging from increased economic hardship and inequality to growing frustrations with globalization and immigration. But the consequences are worrisome, because research suggests the very real possibility of democratic backsliding worldwide. Populist takeovers are associated with dictatorships and the dismantling of democratic institutions.

Contemporary populists share the objectives of their historical predecessors in Latin America and Europe. They promote a disdain for traditional political institutions, praise the advantages of strong and decisive leadership, and vocalize deep distrust of experts and the “establishment.” Today’s populists use new tactics, however. They no longer signal a quick break from democracy, but rather set in motion a subtle chipping away at democratic institutions.

Venezuela’s Hugo Chávez, Russia’s Vladimir Putin, and Turkey’s Recep Tayyip Erdogan illustrate this dynamic. Rather than gaining control through coup or revolution, which can incite domestic and international pushback, these leaders came to power via elections. Once in office, they stoked widespread discontent to undermine institutional constraints on their power, sideline the opposition, and weaken civil society. The tactics used are straightforward and subtle enough each step of the way to make it hard for supporters of democracy to take strong oppositional action.

(full article online)









						Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams May 19, 2020   Part 1: The Rise of Authoritarianism and Decline of Democracy in America   “ First they cam for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the Communists and I did not speak out because I was not […]




					raywilliams.ca


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 1

Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the Presidential election that Joe Biden won is an attempt to stage a coup, straight out of the dictator’s handbook. and the signs are clear. Itt’s time that people should not only take notice, but also speak out, because the implications affect the world. History has shown us that democracies can easily slide into becoming authoritarian states.

Even if Trump is unsuccessful in his efforts to hold onto power, many observers have indicated that he will continue to exert his control over the Republican party, including a plan to run for the 2024 Presidential election. And he has a large supportive citizenry which will be courted and manipulated through his powerful media apparatuses.

In a recent article in The Atlantic, “Why Do Republican Leaders Continue to Enable Trump?”  Anne Applebaum , former editor at The Economist and The Spectator, and was a member of the editorial board of The Washington Post, writes:”In practice, Trump has governed according to a set of principles very different from those articulated by his original intellectual supporters. Although some of his speeches have continued to use that populist language, he has built a Cabinet and an administration that serve neither the public nor his voters but rather his own psychological needs and the interests of his own friends on Wall Street and in business and, of course, his own family. His tax cuts disproportionately benefitted the wealthy, not the working class. His shallow economic boom, engineered to ensure his reelection, was made possible by a vast budget deficit, on a scale Republicans once claimed to abhor, an enormous burden for future generations…”

“He worked to dismantle the existing health-care system without offering anything better, as he’d promised to do, so that the number of uninsured people rose. All the while he fanned and encouraged xenophobia and racism, both because he found them politically useful and because they are part of his personal worldview. More important, he has governed in defiance—and in ignorance—of the American Constitution, notably declaring, well into his third year in once, that he had “total” authority over the states. His administration is not merely corrupt, it is also hostile to checks, balances, and the rule of law. He has built a proto-authoritarian personality cult, ring or sidelining officials who have contradicted him with facts and evidence—with tragic consequences for public health and the economy…”

“Politicians here who have spent their lives following rules and watching their words, calibrating their language, giving pious speeches about morality and governance, may feel a sneaking admiration for someone like Trump, who breaks all the rules and gets away with it. If there is no such thing as moral and immoral, then everyone is implicitly released from the need to obey any rules. Far too many Trump collaborators say to themselves ‘If the president doesn’t respect the Constitution, then why should I? If the president can cheat in elections, then why can’t I? If the president can sleep with porn stars, then why shouldn’t I?'”

Burt Neuborne, the Norman Dorsen Professor of Civil Liberties and founding legal director of NYU School of Law’s Brennan Center for Justice and has participated in more than two hundred cases in the U.S. Supreme Court. Neuborne is the author the book When at Times the Mob Is Swayed: A Citizen’s Guide to Defending Our Republic, sounds the alarm bells by drawing a parallel between Trump and Hitler. He says, “But I can’t ignore the fact that Trump’s savagely divisive political rhetoric, both as a candidate and as our 45th President, closely tracks the tropes that Adolf Hitler used from 1932-36 to persuade a critical mass of the German people to trade their democratic birthright for a Nazi pottage of xenophobia, bigotry, and scapegoats. Hitler did not take power by force…”

“Germany dropped into his maw like a piece of overripe fruit spoiled by years of poisonous, corrosive rhetoric. The real risk to American democracy posed by Trump’s talent for invective and divisiveness is not a military putsch. It is the erosion of the bonds of mutual respect and common decency that hold constitutional democracies together. One key to Hitler’s success in talking German democracy to death can be found in the Holocaust Museum in Jerusalem, where two small green plastic cubes rest almost unnoticed on small display tables—surviving examples of the miniature radios distributed free of charge by the Nazi Party in the years following 1932.”

“Both Trump and Hitler waged war on the idea of objective truth, relentlessly disseminating a pastiche of lies and half-truths designed to persuade a populist jury of the Leader’s distorted version of reality. Hitler coined the term “lugenpresse” (lying press) to castigate the mainstream newspapers bent on exposing his lies. Trump insists that he is the target of ‘fake news’ invented by a lying mainstream press. Hitler derided scientific experts who disagreed with his crackpot racial and economic theories. Trump attacks climate scientists and economists who disagree with his policies. 

“Both Hitler and Trump excelled at scapegoating. Hitler’s poisonous rants blamed Jews, Roma, and the ‘elites’ for Germany’s problems. Trump blames Muslims, undocumented immigrants from Central America, and ‘the elites’ for America’s problems…” 

“Hitler hardened Germany’s border, restricting travel to and from the country, and engaging in trade wars designed to benefit German industry. Trump bans Muslims, wants to build a wall on the Southern border, and has initiated trade wars with China, India, Europe, Canada, and Mexico. Hitler used the pretext of the Reichstag fire in 1933 to declare a ‘national emergency’ justifying the exercise of unilateral Executive power. Trump has used multiple declarations of non-existent national emergencies to ignore Congress.”











						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 2

*The Use of Government To Perpetrate Violence on Citizens*

We are all familiar with Trump encouraging violence towards protestors at his rallies, and encouragement of police to get “tough” with and dominate suspects and demonstrators. And of course, his direction to use excessive force and violence including by unmarked “paramilitary or mercenary” forces to quell a peaceful Washington D.C. demonstration. This added to his comments about White Nationalists and Neo-Nazis as being “good people” emphasizes his willingness to use government security forces and violence to serve his ends.

Violence on the streets is a particular characteristic of fascism and Nazism, after World War I had really got people used to violence and military bands roaming the street beating up their opponents. That is obviously not happening in America today. I think anyone who wanted to destroy America, American democracy, and American institutions is going to use the power of the state to do so. 

*The Miscalculation of Trump’s and Hitler’s Character*

Many people thought that Hitler was a buffoon. He was a joke. He wasn’t taken seriously. Alternatively, they thought that he could calm down when he assumed the responsibilities of office. That was a very common belief about Hitler. There is a major difference in the sense that Trump speaks off the cuff in a very unguarded, spontaneous way. I think that’s true with his tweets. Hitler very carefully prepared all his speeches. They might seem spontaneous, but they were carefully prepared.

When the character of Hitler and Trump are compared, the issue of rationality comes up .What that means is just really not adhering to the conventions of normal political life. That’s something that Hitler did. He did not rule, for example, through a Cabinet. He didn’t use the accepted institutions of government. He had a clique of people around him, Goebbels, Hermann Göring, and so on: a whole group of top Nazis who were his cheerleaders, really. They’re the ones who do the work. 

Within just a few years, the Cabinet didn’t meet at all. It’s just a very informal way of ruling that of course leads to a lot of chaos, because competencies are not clearly defined and there are a lot of rivalries within Hitler’s group of leading Nazis that prove often counterproductive. 

It’s interesting there again to see how the civil service, that’s the administration at every level, really, did not provide a very serious resistance to the orders that came down from above.But Hitler did bring everything back to himself. His standard speech begins with his own partly fabricated life story, where he basically was poor, and he was different. He got his identity in the war fighting for Germany. Germany instead collapsed. He rebuilt Germany and so on. It does go back to himself. 

When you look at his rambling and incoherent table talk, which was recorded during the war at lunchtime and dinner times by his entourage or written down, there again it’s quite narcissistic. He’s constantly talking about himself, or he’s laying down the law about all kinds of subjects of one sort or another.

In the book Hitler’s Thirty Days to Power, by the historian Henry Ashby Turner, he describes the political machinations that allowed Hitler to seize the chancellorship of Germany. In January 1933, the Nazi party’s vote share had begun to decline, and its party was undergoing a serious internal crisis, with dues falling, members drifting off, and other leaders questioning Hitler’s direction. A widely shared belief across the political spectrum at the time held that Hitler would not and could not win the chancellorship, because Germany’s revered conservative president, Paul von Hindenburg, had long vowed to deny such a position to Hitler. 

Hindenburg and the German right viewed Hitler in strikingly similar terms to how Republican elites view Trump. Yes, they badly underestimated his fanaticism, which Hitler had downplayed in public. While they failed to anticipate that Hitler would launch a total war and industrial-scale genocide, they did consider him a buffoon. His appeal, the German elite believed, came from his outsider status, which allowed him to posture against the political system and make extravagant promises to his followers that would never be tested against reality. What’s more, Hitler’s explicit contempt for democracy made even the authoritarian German right nervous about entrusting him with power. 

That reality is stark. Trump’s admiration for ironfisted dictators in Russia, China, and North Korea, is the ideological lodestar of his long history of political musings. Over the years, Trump has weaved left and right on health care, abortion, taxes, and even the issues currently central to his campaign, like immigration and trade, but has never wavered from his foundational belief that strong leaders are those who crush their enemies without restraint. Whatever norms or bounds that we think limit the damage a president could inflict are likely to be exceeded if that president is Trump.

Benjamin Carter Hett, professor of history at Hunter College and the City University of New York and author of the new book The Death of Democracy: Hitler’s Rise to Power and the Downfall of the Weimar Republic, argues the following: “Poor economic conditions would not have brought Hitler into power if it had not been for a number of very powerful people in high positions in government and in business. They looked around and said, basically, ‘This guy Hitler is kind of crude and he’s kind of rough — but we can use him.’  It was elite accommodation that allowed Hitler to get through the doors of power. 

You could draw a kind of rough and ready analogy from that to how mainstream Republicans have found themselves either wanting Trump or feeling compelled to adopt Trump and his base as a means of keeping themselves in power… 

“There is another aspect that is also a striking parallel. The Nazis were very much involved with cultivating deliberate lies for political purposes. In a way I think you could say the Nazis were the inventors of “’are news’ as a political tool. Trump had strong support from white voters across the socioeconomic spectrum. This is comparable to how Christian Germans felt about Jews in the 1920s or 1930s. This is a kind of resentment of the minority which can be mobilized as political passion. That is never going to lead anywhere good. It obviously led somewhere spectacularly bad in Germany in that era. It’s not going to lead anywhere good for us.”

In an essay at the Atlantic, George Packer describes this ominous and pitiful moment in which America under Donald Trump appears more like a failed state than a great nation.

Trump’s 2020 re-election campaign sent an email to supporters that referred to a “Trump Army,” which should not entirely be understood as a metaphor. “The President wants YOU and every other member of our exclusive Trump Army to have something to identify yourselves with, and to let everyone know that YOU are the President’s first line of defense when it comes to fighting off the Liberal MOB.”

Dr. Lance Dodes, a retired assistant clinical professor of psychiatry at Harvard Medical School and now a training and supervising analyst emeritus at the Boston Psychoanalytic Society and Institute has warned that Donald Trump is a sociopath (defined as psychopathic personality type) who will do anything to stay in power. Dodes also spoke about Trump’s use of the term “dominate,” and what it tells us about his desire to control the American people, the country’s elected officials, the military and other institutions of power by any means necessary. Dodes also issued an ominous warning about Trump’s character and behavior, warning that our president is a moral weakling, coward and bully who will continue to lash out at any and all people who he feels have wronged or disrespected him. 

Trump’s ultimate desire, Dodes says, is to put his boot on the neck of everyone on the planet.










						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Better than being brain dead like you and others.
> 
> 
> 
> And now, back to Trump's history of embracing dictatorship for life.


You stupid shill. This country is being destroyed. The crap you post is filled with lies and opinions that have no basis in fact.


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Part 2
> 
> *The Use of Government To Perpetrate Violence on Citizens*
> 
> ...


Hitler? You lose this argument.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 3

*The Slippery Slope from an Authoritarian/Autocratic State to a Fascist One*​ 

The main problem people have in understanding Fascism is that they confuse it with Nazism. They have heard that Hitler was a fascist and so America can never be like that.

Madeleine Albright, a highly respected historian by education who served as the US secretary of state from 1997 to 2001, published an op-ed in the New York Times titled, “Will we stop Trump before it’s too late?” and recently published her new book Fascism: A Warning. The book is the work of a woman who knows authoritarianism when she sees it. And she sees the seeds of it in leaders who have aimed to subvert democratic norms— Turkey’s Erdoğan, Venezuela’s Maduro, Hungary’s Orbán, and others—but also in Donald Trump, whom she calls in the book ‘the first antidemocratic president in modern U.S. history.’”

A widely accepted definition of fascism and fascist governments has been a complicated and highly disputed subject. The exact nature of fascism and its core tenets has been debated amongst historians, political scientists, and other scholars since Benito Mussolini first used the term in 1915. A significant number of scholars agree that a “fascist regime” is foremost an authoritarian form of government, although not all authoritarian regimes are fascist.

Authoritarianism is thus a defining characteristic, but most scholars will say that more distinguishing traits are needed to make an authoritarian regime fascist. Similarly, fascism as an ideology is also hard to define. Originally, it referred to a totalitarian political movement linked with corporatism which existed in Italy from 1922 to 1943 under the leadership of Benito Mussolini. Many scholars use the word “fascism” without capitalization in a more general sense, to refer to an ideology (or group of ideologies) which was influential in many countries at many different times.

For this purpose, they have sought to identify what Roger Griffin professor of modern history and political theorist at Oxford Brookes University, England, calls a “fascist minimum”—that is, the minimum conditions that a certain political movement must meet in order to be considered “fascist”.

According to most scholars of fascism, there are both left and right influences on fascism as a social movement, and fascism, especially once in power, has historically attacked both left, moderate right wing and the opposition in the radical right in order to maintain power.



*Facism*​ 

“Many of Hitler’s opponents did initially dismiss him as a buffoon. But one year into power? They either were dead, in concentration camps or funning for their lives.”—*Richard Evans, *The Coming of the Third Reich.

 “Experience shows us that every man invested with power is apt to abuse it, and to carry his authority as far as it will go.”—*Montesquieu,*1748.

 “Where you have a concentration of power in a few hands—all too frequently—men with the mentality of gangsters get control.”—*Lord Acton,*1866.

 “The totalitarian mass leaders based their propaganda on the correct psychological assumption that, under such conditions, one could make people believe the most fantastic statements one day, and trust if the next day they were given irrefutable proof of their falsehood, they would take refuge in cynicism; instead of deserting the leaders who had lied to them, they would protest that they had known all along the statement was a lie and would admire the leaders for their superior tactical cleverness.”—*Hannah Arendt*, in The Origins of Totalitarianism.

 “If this [U.S.] government every became a tyrant, if a dictator ever took charge in this country, the technological capacity that the intelligence community has given the government cold enable it to impose total tyranny, and there would be no way to fight back because the most careful effort to combine together in resistance to the government, no matter how privately it was done, is within the reach of the government to know.”—*Frank Church*, American lawyer and U.S. Senator, chairman of the Church Senate Committee in an interview on the TV program “Meet the Press, ” 1975.

“When Facism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flage and carrying the cross.”—*Sinclair Lewis,*American author of the book, It Can’t Happen Here, a novel bout the election of a fascist to the American presidency.



*The Fundamental Characteristics of Fascism:*​ 


*Right wing conservative orientation. *Fascists are fervently against Marxism, Socialism, Anarchism, Communism, Environmentalism, etc.—in essence they are against the progress left in total, including moderate leftists such as social democrats. Fascism is an extreme right wing ideology, although it can be opportunistic.
*Nationalistic: *Fascism places a very strong emphasis on patriotism and nationalism. Criticism of the nation’s main ideals, especially war, is lambasted as unpatriotic at best, and treason at worst. State propaganda consistently broadcasts threats of attack, while justifying pre-emptive war. Fascism invariably seeks to instill in its people the warrior mentality: to always be vigilant, wary of strangers and suspicious of foreigners.
*Hierarchical: *Fascist society is ruled by a “righteous” leader, who is supported by an elite secret vanguard of capitalists. Hierarchy is prevalent throughout all aspects of society – every street, every workplace, every school, will have its local Hitler, part police informer, part bureaucrat – and society is prepared for war at all times. The absolute power of the social hierarchy prevails over everything, and thus a totalitarian society is formed. Representative government is acceptable only if it can be controlled and regulated, direct democracy (e.g. Communism) is the greatest of all crimes. Any who oppose the social hierarchy of fascism will be imprisoned or executed.
*Anti-equality*: Fascism loathes the principles of economic equality and disdains equality between immigrant and citizen.Some forms of fascism extend the fight against equality into other areas: gender, sexual, minority or religious rights, for example.
*Religious: *Fascism contains a strong amount of reactionary religious beliefs, harking back to times when religion was believed to be “strict, potent, and pure”. Nearly all Fascist societies are Christian, and are supported by Catholic and Protestant churches.
*Capitalist: *Fascism does not require revolution to exist in capitalist society: fascists can be elected into office (though their disdain for elections usually means manipulation of the electoral system).They view parliamentary and congressional systems of government to be inefficient and weak, and will do their best to minimize its power over their policy agenda. Fascism exhibits the worst kind of capitalism where corporate power is absolute, and all vestiges of workers’ rights are destroyed.
*Militaristic*: Fascism is capitalism at the stage of impotent imperialism. War can create markets that would not otherwise exist by wreaking massive devastation on a society, which then requires reconstruction! Fascism can thus “liberate” the survivors, provide huge loans to that society so fascist corporations can begin the process of rebuilding.
“*Voluntarist” Ideology*: Fascism adopts a certain kind of “voluntarism;” they believe that an act of will, if sufficiently powerful, can make something true. Thus all sorts of ideas about racial inferiority, historical destiny, even physical science, are supported by means of violence, in the belief that they can be made true. It is this sense that Fascism is subjectivist.
*Anti-Modern: *Fascism loathes all kinds of modernism, especially creativity in the arts, whether acting as a mirror for life (where it does not conform to the Fascist ideal), or expressing deviant or innovative points of view. Facism is also selectively anti-science, choosing to support science that supports its agenda. Fascism invariably burns books and victimizes artists; artists who do not promote the fascists ideals are seen as “decadent.” Fascism is hostile to broad learning and interest in other cultures, since such pursuits threaten the dominance of fascist myths. The peddling of conspiracy theories is usually substituted for the objective study of history.
Fascism stuns us with fresher and larger outrages, that make yesterday’s seem irrelevant, winnowing away our decency.  Fascism makes it more and more costly to be your better self. This shock-and-awe strategy of moral violation was an explicit goal of the Nazis — Hitler called it the Big Lie technique, to every day tell a bigger lie, and yesterday’s would soon be forgotten. It’s also one the Russians use this technique today to first overwhelm us, until we are left numb and paralyzed by the sheer scale and scope of all these transgressions against civilization, wondering which outrage to speak out against first, and thus, we weary of morality itself.

What is its effect? It raises the cost of being your better self. Fascism depends on fear and despair and a return to the past rather than a vision for a better society. People are fearful about what will happen to them, feel disenfranchised or feel like the country no longer cares about them, and want a return to “better times” in the past.

Fascism proceeds through a series of authoritarian collapses, each one a little more severe than the last. A series of actions by the leader(s) occur, sometimes on a daily basis, so that people begin to feel like it’s the norm, or become numb because of the overwhelming stressful impact.

Fascism is just like an epidemic of a lethal virus. Those who follow the leader take their cues from him, and have license to act in the same ways because they know there will be few or no consequences. Behavior becomes viral. Sixty-eight percent of voters polled by two researchers believed the President Trump’s repeated claims that widespread “voter fraud” cost him the popular vote in the 2016 election, and 52 percent said they would support postponing the 2020 election in order to make sure only “legal” citizens cast ballots.

Fifty-six percent answered that they would support the measure if Trump and Congress approved of it. “At a minimum, [the survey results] show that a substantial number of Republicans are amenable to violations of democratic norms that are more flagrant than what is typically proposed,” wrote Ariel Malka and Yphtach Lelkes, in the Washington Post.










						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You stupid shill. This country is being destroyed. The crap you post is filled with lies and opinions that have no basis in fact.


And you keep wasting your time not showing any evidence that it is not coming from Trump and those following him.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 4

*Donald Trump, the Autocratic Ruler*​ 

Donald Trump was a few steps from becoming an elected dictator.

Trump’s specific policies aren’t the thing that most sets him apart from the rest of the field of GOP candidates. Rather, it’s his rhetoric and style. The way he reduces everything to black-and-white extremes of strong versus weak, greatest versus worst. His simple, direct promises that he can solve problems that other politicians are too weak to manage.

And, perhaps most importantly, his willingness to flout all the conventions of civilized discourse when it comes to the minority groups that authoritarians find so threatening. That’s why it’s a benefit rather than a liability for Trump when he says Mexicans are rapists or speaks gleefully of massacring Muslims with pig-blood-tainted bullets: He is sending a signal to his authoritarian supporters that he won’t let “political correctness” hold him back from attacking the outgroups they fear. Trump has a classic authoritarian leadership style: simple, powerful, and punitive.

 There were plenty of signs that show Trump is attempting to make the U.S. into an authoritarian state, and some that frankly have echoes of a fascist nation. Here’s a few:

*Systematic attacks on the media*. Often referring to the news media (except his news outlet, Fox News) as the “enemy of the people,” and “fake news,” there’s little doubt that Trump and his associates have repeatedly tried to intimidate mainstream media organizations, whether through tweets deriding the supposedly “failing” New York Times, the repeated references to the “Amazon Washington Post,” or White House chief strategist and former Breitbart head Stephen Bannon’s referring to media organizations as “the opposition party.”

Trump and Fox News also falsely accused the Times of thwarting efforts to kill or capture top Islamic State leaders, and the White House has arbitrarily excluded reporters of some organizations from press pools, press conferences, and other events. And in the lead up to the mid-term elections, Trump harangued his audience nonstop about the “criminal and diseased” immigrant caravan that was going to invade the U.S. and attack innocent American citizens. And that’s just a small sample of Trump’s war on the press.







*Building an official pro-Trump media network*: There’s little doubt Trump has tried to favor outlets that embrace him, which is why the White House gave press credentials to the right-wing blog Gateway Pundit and has given the reliably wacky and pro- Trump Breitbart privileged access. And as one might expect, the Trump administration has backed the expansion plans of the conservative Sinclair Broadcast Group. But Fox News and Sinclair act more like the administration’s publicity firms than independent news organizations.










						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 5

*Politicizing the civil service, military, National Guard, or the domestic security agencies.*An obvious counterweight to executive overreach are career civil servants who remain sensitive to precedents, have lots of expertise, and tend to follow the rule of law. And as Samuel Huntington, former director of Harvard’s Center for International Affairs and White House Coordinator of Security Planning for the National Security Council under President Jimmy Carter, pointed out many years ago, an important barrier to excessive militarization is having a professional military whose direct political role is limited. Trump has taken steps to politicize the civil service in various ways or turn the military and the intelligence and domestic security agencies, including the Department of Justice into tools of the White House instead of independent defenders of the Constitution.

Trump has demanded that senior officials resign or fired people who declined to do his bidding, such as former Deputy Attorney General Sally Yates and FBI Director James Comey and more recently, independent Inspector Generals. He has declined to make top appointments in a number of agencies, at one point telling Fox News,“A lot of those jobs, I don’t want to appoint, because they’re unnecessary.” Trump has also questioned the integrity of the nonpartisan and highly respected Congressional Budget Office, and recently the CDC and he crossed another line by telling uniformed military personnel to call Congress and lobby for his defence spending and health care proposals.

*Enforcing the law for only one side. *A systematic crackdown on left-wing opposition has not occurred, but Trump & Co. do not seem at all concerned by the growing level of rightwing extremism in the country and utterly indifferent to such tendencies abroad. Trump has been quick to condemn terrorist attacks by Muslims and the shooting of Rep. Steve Scalise (R-La.) in June but said nothing after a disturbed right-wing sympathizer murdered an innocent black American and also when an Israeli-American teenager issued a series of bizarre threats against Jewish synagogues and community centers, and more recently death threats aimed at Democratic politicians. It is hard to escape the impression that Trump thinks the law is something that applies to other people — and mostly to those who probably didn’t vote for him.

*Questioning the validity of the election system unless it’s in his favour. *Trump’s current attempt to call the results of the 2020 Presidential election invalid, corrupt and claim that he won is classic dictator strategy. And he is supported by the vast majority of Republican politicians and voters.No serious scholar of U.S. voting behavior believes that electoral fraud is widespread or politically consequential, but Trump, and other Republican politicians would like to make it as hard as possible for people they deem unlikely to vote their way to actually go to the polls. He has even intimated that if he lost the election it would not be legitimate, and that his supporters would need to “do something about it.”

*Fear mongering. *As he did during the campaign, Trump has continued to issue dark warnings about various dangers from which he supposedly needs to protect us. His inaugural address conjured up a weird, Gothamesque description of “American carnage,” and in a speech in Poland openly asked whether “the West” still had the will to defend itself. He has continued to rail against Muslims (except for the rich ones in Saudi Arabia) and to inflate threats from North Korea and Iran. And he has stoked fear about immigrants. 

Witness the fear campaign about the immigrant caravan from central America headed to the U.S. border, composed of as Trump described them, of rapists, murderers, middle eastern terrorists and disease ridden people.

*Creating a scapegoats who are intent on destroying America.*Trump has targeted immigrants, particularly Hispanics, and non-whites as the “enemy” who threaten American “national security” and safety. This includes the separation of immigrant children from their parents and establishing detention camps for them.










*Demonizing anyone who opposes him. *No American president has been as prone to treat his opponents with contempt, disregard, and blatant hostility. Trump spent the campaign belittling his Republican opponents and vowing to “lock up” Hillary Clinton. Now he is on a campaign to accuse former President Obama and his administration of “crimes.” He has continued to blame America’s problems on everyone but himself, accuse anyone who opposes him of betraying the country, and offers self-pitying “tweetstorms” about the vast opposition he faces from his supposed enemies (some of whom used to be allies).

He uses the language of “nationalism,” ignoring its connotations in history in Germany, Japan and Italy. In his America first policy, and his withdrawal from international treaties and agreements, his rhetoric and action is both insular and stokes the aggressive attitude in his followers of “us and them,” and the rest of the world being against the U.S.










						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> And you keep wasting your time not showing any evidence that it is not coming from Trump and those following him.


Any evidence Trump has is denied by you traitors. This is a one-sided clusterfuck for you. The chaos you are enabling is devastating this country. All to make lies the truth. That cannot be done and that is why you are failing.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 6








*Surrounding himself with sycophants and corrupt people who are blindly loyal and acting out of their own self gain.*Trump is unwilling and unable to separate his own personal financial and personal interests (and those of his businesses) from that of the Presidency and the country, raising serious constitutional, legal and ethical concerns. His loyal followers and appointees have taken the cue from him, and have already been embroiled in corruption and unethical practices.

*Seeking to operate mostly through the power of the Presidency and his administration (eg: Executive Orders and Directives). *He sees the other equal branches of government (Congress and the courts) as only valid and useful if they serve his interests and agree with him.

*Deliberately and frequently lying to the American public.*The Washington Post, CNN and other media outlets have fact-checked Trump’s statements. The Fact Checker’sdatabase analyzes, categorizes and tracks every suspect statement uttered by the president. As of day 558 of his presidency, he made 4,229 false and misleading claims — an increase of 978 in just two months. That’s an overall average of nearly 7.6 claims a day. Autocrats and dictators throughout history have been known to use false information and lies as a way of controlling the populace.

Harvard Professors Steven Levitsky and Daniel Ziblatt have authored the new book How Democracies Die, which details the warning signs Trump showed as a candidate. In a healthy democracy, they argue, those traits should have derailed his bid for the presidency.

“Trump was easily identifiable as someone who is not committed to the democratic rules of the game,” Levitsky told Newsweek on Thursday. “There is real cause for concern for the health of our democratic institutions.”

The four markers are:


Rejecting or showing weak commitment to democratic rules.
Denying the legitimacy of political opponents.
Encouraging or tolerating violence.
A readiness to stifle or limit civil liberties of opponents, including media.
“Those are things that democratic candidates in the U.S. simply do not have,” Levitsky said. At least, until Trump. The checklist is meant to be a litmus test for candidates—not incumbents—for good reason, Levitsky said. “Once they’re in office, it’s too late,” he said. “The point is the best way to stop an authoritarian is to prevent them from getting into office in the first place. Once they get elected to office, it gets much more difficult to stop them.”

The typical paths to autocracy used to be through revolution or military coup. No longer. Today’s strongmen — Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey, Viktor Orban of Hungary, Vladimir Putin of Russia, Rodrigo Duterte of the Philippines and others — came to power through elections and then used the institutions of government to subvert democracy and expand their own powers. Trump regularly praises the current batch of autocrats and clearly longs to rule as they do.

How could an elected autocracy take hold in the United States? After all, it has three branches of government, with built-in checks and balances. But these days, it is not so clear that America’s constitutional framework could readily repel Donald Trump’s autocratic impulses, especially when supported by the Republican party determined to do Trump’s will.

Trump clearly admires foreign strongmen who have been able to dismantle democratic institutions and amass executive power. He praises them not because their policies are compatible with American interests and values, but because they repudiate those values with impunity. Trump and his allies in Congress, and potentially the Supreme Court, are laying out a path that would make it possible for him to emulate the authoritarians.












						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Any evidence Trump has is denied by you traitors. This is a one-sided clusterfuck for you. The chaos you are enabling is devastating this country. All to make lies the truth. That cannot be done and that is why you are failing.


I am patiently waiting for you to show evidence that he never wanted to be a dictator.  That he never used his power of the Presidency to get his way on many things, that he never treated people like nothing, etc, etc, as these two articles very clearly do a synopsis of his stay at the WH.


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> I am patiently waiting for you to show evidence that he never wanted to be a dictator.  That he never used his power of the Presidency to get his way on many things, that he never treated people like nothing, etc, etc, as these two articles very clearly do a synopsis of his stay at the WH.


I am waiting for you to show evidence that there was no fraud in 2020. You first.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 7









As for the Supreme Court, a moment of truth is approaching. 

With three Trump appointees to the U.S. Supreme Court — Neil M. Gorsuch, Brett M. Kavanaugh, Amy Coney Barrett  —it is possible that the court’s conservative majority will vote to shield a conservative president and accept his far-reaching claims of executive immunity. Such an outcome would further diminish the ability of the judicial branch to check executive powers and conduct.

These developments and strategies mirror what authoritarian leaders abroad have used to enlarge and entrench their powers. They almost invariably target the three key institutions that can hold them accountable as they move to consolidate power: independent courts, a free press, and civil society organizations.

These indicators are not irreversible, but they offer alarming signs of where the US may be headed. With the Republican Senate on a path of blind support for Trump and a Supreme Court that may accept his claim of absolute immunity from any kind of investigation, the legislative and judicial branches appear to be unable or unwilling to exercise their constitutional duty to check the presidency. And now, after three years in office, Trump seems even less restrained by the norms of presidential conduct that were guard rails for previous occupants of the White House.

According to Javier Corrales, writing in the New York Times, Trump is using the legal system like an autocrat.

Presidents across the world use diverse tactics to achieve unlimited government, but a common approach is to erode the impartiality of the law. The goal is always to use and abuse the law to protect yourself and your allies. This is called “autocratic legalism.”

The impeachment outcome and the Roger Stone and General Flynn scandals tell us that the process of creating autocratic legalism is already underway. The executive branch seems to have all that is needed to use, abuse and ignore the law to reward loyalists and perhaps even punish critics.

The president has been embracing the principle of impunity to loyalists since the 2016 campaign. At a famous violent rally that year, he told a crowd of supporters: “If you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of ’em, would you? … I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees.”

This is the quintessential autocratic cry: “Support me, and both the law and I will be on your side”. The biggest winner from autocratic legalism was of course the president. A famous study found that none of the 45,000 court rulings between 2004 and 2013 successfully challenged the president’s authority.

Autocratic legalism is not easy to achieve in democracies, but it is not impossible. Trump is reminding us how it is done. First, the president needs the ruling party to serve as a legal shield. Check. Then you saturate the legal system with partisan judges. In progress. Next, you begin to interfere in sentences. 

Trump has already demonstrated an affinity for legal pressuring. His recent tirade against Justices Sonia Sotomayor and Ruth Bader Ginsburg for being critical, demanding that they recuse themselves on all “Trump related matters,” betrays an impulse for turning the justice system into a support system.

The subsequent step in autocratic legalism is to use and abuse the law to target critics. This, too, is commonplace today among many countries with democratically elected presidents.

President Donald Trump is a most excessive person in anything he does or says. For example, he likes to take the so-called authoritarian “Mussolini pose”. He also likes to embark on totalitarian style “purges” of persons working for the United States government who do not heel to his commands, —persons he considers his “enemies”.










He surrounds himself with hard-core sycophants, lackeys and puppets, who are expected to give him a loyalty pledge, not a pledge to the U.S. Constitution or to the American people. Consequently, it is said that the U.S. under Trump is turning into a “banana republic.”

The current American president constantly attacks the freedom of the press, which is protected by the U.S. Constitution, calling journalists “enemies of the people” —an expression used in Nazi Germany. Donald Trump also shamelessly befriends other countries’ dictators and autocrats, while making fun of democratic leaders. And, to top it all, Trump has used in public the hubristic Nazi slogan of “God is on our side”, (‘Gott mit uns’).

As an authoritarian, Donald Trump is going further and further toward turning the USA into a one-man government, with himself a dictator-in-the-making, who openly yearns for unchecked, and if possible, absolute power. His plan, notwithstanding the U.S. constitution and its founding principles, is to transform the USA into a militaristic and neo-fascist state, with all the trappings, under his control, and with as few constraints as possible.

He is, by far, the most unprincipled and the most dangerous occupant of the White House that the United States ever had. He has no qualms in bulldozing American institutions if he feels such institutions are an impediment to him exercising full powers.

David Frum, writing in The Atlantic magazine, writes, “When early Americans wrote things like “Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty,” they did not do so to provide bromides for future bumper stickers. They lived in a world in which authoritarian rule was the norm, in which rulers habitually claimed the powers and assets of the state as their own personal property.”  He goes on to argue: “If citizens learn that success in business or in public service depends on the favor of the president and his ruling clique, then it’s not only American politics that will change.

The economy will be corrupted too, and with it the larger culture. A culture that has accepted that graft is the norm, that rules don’t matter as much as relationships with those in power, and that people can be punished for speech and acts that remain theoretically legal—such a culture is not easily reoriented back to constitutionalism, freedom, and public integrity.”










						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> I am waiting for you to show evidence that there was no fraud in 2020. You first.


That was proven in other threads.  Look them up.

Trump himself is aware that he lost the election fairly.
He may not have liked losing, but he is more than aware that he did.


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Your whole article is projection. Are you smart enough to realize that? No, you are not.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 8

*Conclusions*​ 

George Orwell once said: “in a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” If that phrase were a test, would you say that we — in fact you, yourself — are passing or failing it? Why don’t Americans seem to have any power over the authoritarian and fascist forces and tendencies in their midst? Why have those forces run amok, gleefully shattering institution after institution, norm after norm, to the point that concentration camps for infants have arisen in just two years — mere months — after the election of a demagogue?

More than any other political system, democracy—as Plato pointed out long ago—has the inherent ability to actualize its own demise. By manipulating the democratic process, elites can limit the freedoms of individuals or social groups and put in place authoritarian and autocratic leaders who are not democratically inclined. In a very concrete sense, democracy depends upon ordinary citizens’ capacities and motivations to absorb democratic values and tolerate those with diverse social, cultural, ethnic, and ideological backgrounds.

These are precisely the values that those on the right wing have been attacking for years, and they have exploited the inherent popularity of conservative ideology to do so. Social scientists have long known that highly threatening historical periods are accompanied by an increase in authoritarianism in the general population. Thus, following the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, there was a predictable uptick in support for authoritarian conservatism, as well as decreased commitment to tolerance and the protection of civil liberties.

Whatever the proximal psychological causes, we are bearing witness—all over the world—to the rebirth of extreme right-wing movements that thrive under conditions of anxiety. These movements promise a return to “traditional” (often religious) values, a curtailing of reproductive and other rights of women (as well as sexual minorities), and a revival of nationalistic (often ethnic) pride and the “restoration” of national boundaries, along with a dismantling of the “administrative” welfare state and the imposition of illiberal reforms and vindictive immigration policies.

Once in power, right-wing movements flirt with (and sometimes embrace) totalitarian practices, such as intimidating and even incarcerating protestors, journalists, academics, and any others whom they find potentially threatening or disruptive. With the support of conservative voters, illiberal governments have gained power in Hungary, Poland, Turkey, Brazil and many other countries. Radical right-wing parties are also resurgent in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, the Netherlands, France, and the United Kingdom.

Understanding mass psychology in this day and age, and the ways in which authoritarian politicians have so successfully tapped into it, is of paramount importance for understanding how this happened and how it can be fought; that is, for the long-term preservation of democratic systems.

To believe that America will retain its commitment to a vibrant democracy, and that any threats to it, including the authoritarian leadership of Donald Trump is only a temporary aberration, is wishful thinking and ignores the requirement that an informed and active citizenry represents all the citizens and protects democratic institutions. There’s an old story about how to boil a live frog so that it doesn’t notice you’re killing it slowly. You turn up the heat incrementally, but it is only aware of mild discomfort along the way and does nothing to save itself. And then it’s too late.










						Did President Trump Want to be a Dictator? - Ray Williams
					

By Ray Williams November 30, 2020   Part 2 of the Article: Are Americans Becoming More Authoritarian Under An Autocratic President? Many observers have argued that America was slipping into an autocratic state under President Trump, and his current efforts to undermine the results of the...




					raywilliams.ca


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Your whole article is projection. Are you smart enough to realize that? No, you are not.


You are the one projecting.  Gosh forbid you ever come to your senses.


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> That was proven in other threads.  Look them up.
> 
> Trump himself is aware that he lost the election fairly.
> He may not have liked losing, but he is more than aware that he did.


Trump has never conceded. And you people proved nothing because you said you do not have to. If you did those ballots and other things requested would not have been blocked from public scrutiny. These people could not act more guilty if they tried.


----------



## MinTrut (Sep 13, 2022)

TNHarley said:


> Its crazy how easy yall rubes fall for his trolls.
> Blows the mind actually.


Their cultish adoration of Trump is summin elz, right?


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You are the one projecting.  Gosh forbid you ever come to your senses.


What am I projecting? I am telling you your posts are bullshit propaganda.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Trump has never conceded. And you people proved nothing because you said you do not have to. If you did those ballots and other things requested would not have been blocked from public scrutiny. These people could not act more guilty if they tried.


This thread is not about the election.
GO find the threads which talk about it.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> What am I projecting? I am telling you your posts are bullshit propaganda.


Then do not read them.  No one is forcing you to come to this thread and read or post to it.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 1

President Donald Trump reliably tells the truth on one thing: He likes the way dictators do business.

“He speaks, and his people sit up at attention,” Trump said on Friday morning of North Korean despot Kim Jong Un in an interview with Fox News — a network where he receives no shortage of praise. “I want my people to do the same.”

Some of the people who worked for Kim have been fired, “Fox & Friends” hype man Steve Doocy pointed out. Trump corrected him: “Fired may be a nice word.”

Some less nice words: Poisoned. Blown apart by anti-aircraft guns. Sent to work camps. 

It’s not that Trump isn’t aware. Fox’s Bret Baier reminded the president of Kim’s record earlier this week during their Air Force One interview en route home from the Trump-Kim summit in Singapore that Kim is “clearly executing people.”

But the president blew Baier off. “He’s a tough guy. Hey, when you take over a country, tough country, tough people, and you take it over from your father I don’t care who you are, what you are, how much of an advantage you have. If you could do that at 27 years old, I mean, that’s one in 10,000 that could do that,” Trump explained. “I think we understand each other.” 

Vladimir Putin’s also a tough guy whom Trump praises for running his country well. So is Rodrigo Duterte, whose executions of drug dealers without trial in the Philippines is something Trump has said he’s looking into.

He’s spent the three years — to the day — since riding down that escalator in Trump Tower demanding loyalty, fantasizing about torture, dividing the country into “followers” and enemies. 

“Using even language like ‘the enemy of the people’ — it’s a Stalin phrase. People say, ‘He’s a loudmouth, he’s never had the governing experience,’” said Eric Edelman, President George W. Bush’s ambassador to Turkey during the early days of Recep Tayyip Erdoğan’s consolidation of power. “But what he has done is begun to stress these norms and stress them constantly, and people become inured to it.”











						Donald dreams of dictators
					

In the three years since he first descended his golden escalator to announce his presidential bid, Trump has made clear he yearns for fealty along with authority.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 2

Edelman went on: “I’ve seen this play out in Turkey, and that’s how this stuff gets normalized. And after a while, people say, OK, that’s the way it is.”

This is perhaps the most important aspect of Trump’s approach: Make it seem normal. Old guardrails become distant memories. Is this time that he declared himself above the law such a big deal, or is it old news already, since he also said it last week or last month or last year?

He stocks his staff with supplicants and family members, then pits them against one another to watch them fight for his favor in a nonstop West Wing soap opera. His lawyer says, echoing Trump himself, that he could murder people and no one would be able to do anything about it unless they impeached him first.

Political enemies should be investigated and jailed, Trump says. He’ll pardon whom he wants to, whomever gets his attention by running to a Fox News set. He blames it on a justice system he undercuts. He says the Department of Justice inspector general’s report “blew it,” but also that it “totally exonerates me,” with the same logic that has him attacking NFL players for kneeling during the anthem but also saying he would pardon Muhammad Ali for refusing to be drafted on his own beliefs (although Ali’s conviction was already overturned by the Supreme Court, so he doesn’t need a pardon). 

Debate over whether special Russia prosecutor Robert Mueller could be fired becomes a general acceptance that he probably will be — and then, among Republicans vying to demonstrate their fealty, an inevitability. Even Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, with whom Trump has openly feuded, has gotten into the act, saying that he believes Mueller should “wrap it up.” 

“We should definitely be concerned,” said Steve Levitsky, who included a dictator litmus test in the first chapter of the book he co-authored, “How Democracies Die.” “Unambiguously, Trump checks off all the boxes for a very authoritarian figure.”

If you’re offended, Trump and his aides say, if you disagree, if you want an explanation, you’re either an idiot or not a patriot. Free speech, by the White House’s definition last week, doesn’t cover protesting police. Trump’s press secretary and secretary of state both personally attacked reporters this week for asking for details on what the administration was doing, and in the course of it, said a number of things that were completely and clearly not true. 


Or maybe you didn’t realize Trump was joking. That’s a go-to line for the president and his aides. Like when he said Democrats who disagree with him are committing treason, or said he thinks police should be “rough” when they’re arresting suspects. After yearning on Fox News for the treatment Kim enjoys at home, Trump told reporters he “was kidding and you don’t understand sarcasm” — then turned to the one who asked him about his praise for Kim and said, “You’re the worst.”











						Donald dreams of dictators
					

In the three years since he first descended his golden escalator to announce his presidential bid, Trump has made clear he yearns for fealty along with authority.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 3

Accept whatever Trump says, Trump says, because he says that’s the only way to stay alive. That’s how he answered a reporter Friday who asked him how he could have so many nice things to say about the same man responsible for the death of Otto Warmbier, whom he spoke so passionately about last year.

“I don’t want to see a nuclear weapon destroy you and your family,” he said. 

Trump and his aides insist that separating parents from their children is the law, though it’s not. He says that he’ll consider doing something for the kids if he can leverage it against Democrats for money to pay for his border wall. That would be, as he tweeted, Friday, a “WIN!” 




> The Democrats are forcing the breakup of families at the Border with their horrible and cruel legislative agenda. Any Immigration Bill MUST HAVE full funding for the Wall, end Catch & Release, Visa Lottery and Chain, and go to Merit Based Immigration. Go for it! WIN!
> — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) June 15, 2018



Meanwhile federal contractors are holding migrant kids in former Wal-Marts, where the walls are decorated with murals of presidents — including Trump. 

“He’s completely reversing the vision that I encapsulate with Lady Liberty holding up the torch to the world and saying, ‘If you are an immigrant, we care about you,’” said Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.), who tried to tour a detention center two weeks ago and is leading a congressional delegation on another attempt for Father’s Day. “Deliberately injuring children to send a message, to send a message of deterrence to the world is the complete opposite.”

Merkley said a president who cared more about democracy and American ideals would have taken a different approach, but “Trump doesn’t have the ability to recognize and admit, ‘I did this, I am changing the policy, I am choosing to treat children horrifically.’” He added, “You can see the arc of the dehumanization of immigrants that created the grounds for treating immigrants like this.”

But Trump understands the dynamics of power and the media better than perhaps anyone who’s ever lived. He sees what people say he can’t do — and see what they don’t do to stop him when he does it.

When Franklin Roosevelt tried to pack the courts during the Great Depression and Richard Nixon tried to bend the Justice Department to stop the Watergate investigation, they were eventually stopped by their own parties. Trump, however, seems to have cowed the Republican Party into shrugging off whatever he does.


“It’s one thing to elect somebody with authoritarian impulses, which we clearly have done,” Levitsky said. “Our people and our institutions need to stop him. What worries me most is that Republicans seem increasingly unwilling or unable to do that.”

When Pew Research last year polled the statement, “A system in which a strong leader can make decisions without interference from parliament or the courts would be a good way to govern our country,” a third of Republicans and 17 percent of Democrats agreed. When the Economist and YouGov asked, “Do you favor giving the government power to shut down ‘biased or inaccurate’ media outlets?” 45 percent of Republicans said yes and 18 percent of Democrats agreed.










						Donald dreams of dictators
					

In the three years since he first descended his golden escalator to announce his presidential bid, Trump has made clear he yearns for fealty along with authority.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Everything President Trump Has Said That Sounds Like He Wants to be a Dictator (No, Really)
					

As Donald Trump praises dictator Kim Jong-un, look back at some of his most eyebrow-raising comments about history's worst tyrants




					people.com


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Then do not read them.  No one is forcing you to come to this thread and read or post to it.


No, but someone has to be paying you. Are there substantial payments for selling out your country?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 1

Autocracy expert Ruth Ben-Ghiat believes that while America remains a democracy on the national level, the system has been eroded particularly at a state level. | Erin Baiano


Michael Kruse: We’re coming up on seven years since Donald Trump came down the escalator at Trump Tower and announced he was running for president. I’m wondering where in your estimation we are in this country in the timeline of increasing authoritarianism.

Ruth Ben-Ghiat: When somebody like Trump comes on the scene and holds office, it’s really like an earthquake or a volcano, and it shakes up the whole system by gathering in this big tent all the extremists, all the far-right people, and giving them legitimation. The GOP was already going away from a democratic political culture, but he accelerated it and normalized extremism and normalized lawlessness. And so the GOP over these years has truly, in my estimation, become an authoritarian far-right party. And the other big story is that his agenda and his methods are being continued at the state level. Some of these things were on the agenda way before he came in, like getting rid of abortion rights and stuff like that. But these states are really laboratories of autocracy now, like Florida, Texas.


The final thing I’d say is machismo [is] up there as a tool of rule alongside propaganda and corruption. Getting ahead as a man [in this political system] means being more like Trump. And so you saw Mike Pompeo, who started talking about “swagger” and he was a very different kind of State Department head. And now you have people like Ron DeSantis who even absorbed the hand gestures of Trump. And so at the elite level, the political system is shaped by Trump, and every day we see his legacy.

Kruse: What would you say to those in this country who say, “No, the Republicans aren’t the autocrats. It’s the Democrats who are the autocrats. It’s Joe Biden. It’s other Democrats with power who are making us wear masks or take vaccines we don’t want to take. They’re the ones who are behaving more in autocratic ways, not the Republicans.”

Ben-Ghiat: One of the big talking points and strategy of right-wing authoritarianism, is to label democratic systems as tyrannical. Mussolini was the first to say that democracies are tyrannical, democracies are the problem. And there’s a whole century’s worth of the strategy of calling sitting Democrats, who you want to overthrow, dictators. Biden as a social dictator, [is] a phony talking point. It has so many articulations from “They’re forcing us to wear masks.” And you have people like DeSantis who are doing this very subversive thing of saying, “Florida’s the free state. You can have refuge from the dictatorship of Biden here.” And what this is designed to do is discredit the sitting democratic administration in order to create, a myth of freedom. January 6 was actually marketed as the violence [being] in the service of freedom, and you were overthrowing a dictator.

Kruse: Where is Trump in his own timeline? Is he in your estimation getting weaker, getting stronger, in a holding pattern?

Ben-Ghiat: The genius of the “big lie” was not only that it sparked a movement that ended up with January 6 to physically allow him to stay in office. But psychologically the “big lie” was very important because it prevented his propagandized followers from having to reckon with the fact that he lost. And it maintains him as their hero, as their winner, as the invincible Trump, but also as the wronged Trump, the victim. Victimhood is extremely important for all autocrats. They always have to be the biggest victim.
So the “big lie” maintained Trump’s personality cult versus seeing him as just another president who was voted out of office. Americans traditionally always accepted that when your time is up, no matter how popular you were, you were gone. Trump disrupted that because he’s different from any other president, Republican or Democrat. He’s an authoritarian, and they can’t leave office. They don’t have good endings and they don’t leave properly. And I predicted — I had to turn in [my] book in the summer of 2020 — and I just predicted that he wouldn’t leave in a quiet manner. The “big lie” allowed him to psychologically never leave. So he’s in this kind of limbo. As an authoritarian, his other job has been to make sure to keep hold of the party so no rivals emerge, so that he could [not] be eclipsed by a younger version of himself. And that would be DeSantis.












						The One Way History Shows Trump’s Personality Cult Will End
					

An expert on autocracy assesses how far America has slipped away from democracy, and what it will take to get it back.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> No, but someone has to be paying you. Are there substantial payments for selling out your country?


Find some courage and learn, on your own, what Authocracy is.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 2

Kruse: Have you been surprised at how successful he’s been in this regard, especially considering he doesn’t have Twitter? As you referenced, Truth Social has been more or less a failure to this point. He is doing this through emails and [conservative] media hits.

Ben-Ghiat: The Twitter was for the masses, to keep the masses indoctrinated, and I see Trump as one of the most successful propagandists of the early 21st century. He tweeted over 120 times a day. But that was for the masses. I wasn’t talking about voters as much as how has he kept the elites tethered to him. And that has nothing to do with Twitter. That has to do with what he’s always done: collecting compromising information, threatening, and he’s changed the party to an authoritarian party culture. So not only do you go after external enemies, but you go after internal enemies. You’re not allowed to have any dissent. And it’s not just when the leader was going to be impeached. In February 2021, during the second impeachment, and Republicans who voted to impeach him had to buy body armor because they were being threatened.

The big question will be what will happen in the coming months so that he can retain that power because he’s very toxic. There’s always this worry that maybe the investigations will bring more things out, so it’s not a done deal that he will get the nomination. But he’s been remarkably successful in ways that don’t surprise me at all. Because that’s how authoritarians are. They’re personality cults, even if they rule in a democracy like [Italy’s former prime minister Silvio] Berlusconi did. Berlusconi’s personality cult did not deflate until he was convicted, which he eventually was. That’s what it takes. It takes prosecution and conviction to deflate their personality cults.

Kruse: You recently wrote, “Ron DeSantis is turning Florida into his own mini-autocracy.” Why is he an autocrat?


Ben-Ghiat: He has autocratic tendencies. What’s so interesting is he was a Reaganite and then he had clearly some kind of epiphany when Trump came on the scene. He had that campaign video that showed his house being transformed into an altar for Trump. And he got the endorsement. He has absorbed the lessons of what you need to get ahead in the GOP today. And that is to be a forceful bully, even to high school students. The way he carries himself and speaks has gotten much more aggressive. And he’s also very smartly tried to turn Florida into this refuge for all who are oppressed by Biden. He invited New York city cops and people from all over the nation who are oppressed by federal government vaccine [rules], or state mandates, [to] come to Florida and be free. And so that’s one way he’s setting up Florida to be the fiefdom of a certain politics, a certain ideology, that he clearly then wants to take national. And in fact his spokesperson, Christina Pushaw, says, “Make America Florida.”










						The One Way History Shows Trump’s Personality Cult Will End
					

An expert on autocracy assesses how far America has slipped away from democracy, and what it will take to get it back.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 3

Kruse: Is it fair to see DeSantis as a very capable, committed student, whereas Trump is more of an instinctual autocrat?

Ben-Ghiat: There are limits to the comparison because Trump truly is an autocratic individual. He was as a businessman and he has surrounded himself with people from [Paul] Manafort and [Roger] Stone to [Steve] Bannon who have decades of experience helping and working for dictators. They’re on a crusade to ruin democracy. And DeSantis had a very different career path. And so what’s notable about him is he has sensed, like all smart politicians, what you need to get ahead in today’s America, in today’s GOP, what kind of leader you need to seem to be, what policies, what talking points, [such as] election fraud. What you need to do is turn citizens against each other, which he does with the “Don’t Say Gay” bill. His election security office has a hotline where you can call and tip off your fellow Floridians doing bad things. These are in themselves all things that match up with autocratic policies. Yes, he’s a very capable student of what is going to have success in today’s GOP and with today’s electorate.

Kruse: Is Ron DeSantis the non-Donald Trump politician doing this in the most stark, arguably most effective way, or are there others that you are paying attention to?

Ben-Ghiat: There are lots of others. In terms of his policies and his aggression, Greg Abbott stands out, of course. I’ll never forget that he posed smiling with his target practice sheet and joked about shooting journalists during the Trump years. But Ron DeSantis stands out because, one, he has made clear his aspirations to national leadership, and two, he’s smooth. Just as [Viktor] Orbán is a more palatable Putin — you don’t hear about poisoning [enemies], you don’t hear about people falling out of windows — DeSantis doesn’t have all that baggage Trump has. He’s younger and he’s smoother. He’s more measured in what he says. He’s trained as a lawyer. Trump is a much more outrageous personality and that’s the source of Trump’s charisma, but DeSantis is extremely popular. And so he has his own form of relating to audiences that people like.

Kruse: Given Trump, DeSantis, Abbott and so on, is the United States of America still a full democracy?

Ben-Ghiat: It’s deceptive because Trump did an enormous amount of damage. And that was why he was there. He was there to wreck our democracy. And then he was voted out. We can never forget that in the middle of a pandemic, 80 plus million people turned out to get rid of him. And that’s very rare in history where you interrupt an autocratic personality who’s in the middle of his project. And now the individual states are continuing this. And what’s so worrying is that they’re continuing it in a very accelerated fashion.












						The One Way History Shows Trump’s Personality Cult Will End
					

An expert on autocracy assesses how far America has slipped away from democracy, and what it will take to get it back.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 4

Also, the midterms are so close. I do believe if [Republicans] capture Congress after the midterms, you always have to assume the worst with people who have been very open about wanting to wreck democracy. And so that’s why they float these scary things, like making Trump speaker of the House. You have to realize that these people have left democracy, and nothing is off the table. And that’s why to go back to DeSantis, it’s very ominous that he established this office of election security. It’s very bad because it has its own prosecutors, and it makes things that used to be a misdemeanor a felony. If you look at the details of it, it’s not only an intimidation machine. It has some prosecutorial powers, and it has informing mechanisms, the tip line, and the whole idea of election integrity as this buzzword, which really means how are we going to start making elections come out the way we need to, is a very anti-democratic thing.

Kruse: So the answer I heard to the question — “Is America still a full democracy?” — was … maybe not?

Ben-Ghiat: No. David Pepper, who wrote this book _Laboratories of Autocracy_, has always said that many states are no longer functioning democracies. I would say that nationally, we are a functioning democracy. That’s how we got rid of Trump. But the system has been eroded and many states are shifting, are evolving over time to a condition where votes are going to mean less. And then you get into a situation which is like what happened in Hungary where over time Viktor Orbán has developed a system where it’s almost impossible for the opposition to win.

Kruse: Is it fair then to see the U.S. as an “anocracy,” neither completely democratic nor completely autocratic?

Ben-Ghiat: It’s in transition. However, I do believe it’s extremely important to never fall into fatalism. I believe it’s my job to warn people what could happen, but it’s very important — that’s why I keep bringing up the 2020 election and also the 2018 midterms — that these are recent events, and there is this energy of protest and love for democracy and freedom, real freedom, not the Republicans’ idea of freedom, that we can’t lose, because once you decide that it’s all rigged and there’s nothing you can do, then you do lose democracy.

Kruse: There has been increasing talk of the inevitability of civil strife, of civil war. And full democracies don’t have civil wars. Autocracies also don’t have civil wars, right? It’s sort of those places that are in some worrying state of transition that might be susceptible to that kind of violence. Are we on the way to civil war?










						The One Way History Shows Trump’s Personality Cult Will End
					

An expert on autocracy assesses how far America has slipped away from democracy, and what it will take to get it back.




					www.politico.com


----------



## struth (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.


um....he'd be over 100 years old in 2048....are you all really not capable of thinking?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Part 5

Ben-Ghiat: I actually believe the possibility of true, active civil war — meaning violence on both sides — is not likely. It’s something that the Republicans, the right, wants us to think is happening, and they use that to get people on their side as armed up as possible, as weaponized, literally weaponized, as possible, as fearful as possible. But I don’t think that we would fall into that state. It’s much more likely that the midterms go the Republicans’ way, and you fall into a system where your vote doesn’t mean much. I do see perhaps an increase of another round of protests. Often protests, big protests, materialize around an event. So the Women’s March was the shock of Trump winning and coming to power. Then you had George Floyd, which sparked the Black Lives Matter protests. I respect a lot Barbara Walter, who wrote the book about our likelihood [for civil war], where we’ve passed these guardrails. But the ones who really want a civil war, it’s only the extremist Republicans. Because civil war is bad for business. Civil war is bad for health. It’s bad for the nation. And so it’s really a scare talking point.

Kruse: A scholar who studies violent conflict, Thomas Homer-Dixon, recently wrote, “By 2025 American democracy could collapse causing extreme domestic political instability, including widespread civil violence. By 2030, if not sooner, the country could be governed by a right-wing dictatorship.” Does that sound right to you or too extreme?

Ben-Ghiat: It could happen in a quieter way. I think that it’s not out of the realm of possibility, because if the Republicans tried to impeach Biden and impeach Harris, there would be protests. Whether that becomes a civil war is very different because it’s predominantly only one side which is armed, first of all. So Walter is right. She wanted to point out how far our democracy has eroded. And it’s not out of the realm of possibility that we could end up with some kind of form of autocracy because that’s what’s being set up by all of the assaults on our electoral system. And Bannon’s been working very hard at this, too, from his own vantage point. It’s intimidation of voters, removing voters, look at all these threats to election officials — so you get them out of the system — this all corresponds to what we call “autocratic capture.” There’s a movement going on. This is what I mean by more — it’s more legalistic and quieter. And that doesn’t tend to bring out people into the streets. Because it’s an evolution and it’s happening slowly, slowly, slowly, and big protests are occasioned by an event.

Kruse: Are there signs in these developments of a particularly American style of autocracy?

Ben-Ghiat: The wild card is guns. No other country in peace time has 400 million guns in private hands. And no other country in peacetime has militias allowed to populate, has sovereign sheriffs, has so many extremists in the military, and that matters because of these other things. And in fact, if January 6 didn’t bring out a massive protest, what is going to bring out a massive protest? Because that showed that groups of people who were there were people unaffiliated with any Proud Boys or any radical group. And Robert Pape, who studied them, called them middle-aged, middle class, but they were all armed. Some of them had private arsenals and they showed up at January 6. So that’s the wild card. That’s one thing that’s extremely American, that violence, that the population believes it has the right to rebel against tyrannical government. Like Matt Gaetz says: The Second Amendment is not just about hunting. And here we go back to the idea of Biden as a dictator. And that only works if your citizenry is armed and ours is to a degree that no other country is in the entire world.

Kruse: Given the stakes, what are Democrats doing wrong right now?

Ben-Ghiat: The reason that Trump was able to shift the political culture, Trump and his allies, is that he imposed an authoritarian party culture [with] unified messaging. Propaganda needs to be repeated with small variations. All the different Fox News hosts, all the GOP politicians, you can tell when the various talking points come up, because they get echoed by all these lawmakers and throughout Fox. Now Democrats by their nature are not going to impose unified messaging. And so Democrats don’t have that force of concentration of message, that repetition, and that’s a failing in this environment.










						The One Way History Shows Trump’s Personality Cult Will End
					

An expert on autocracy assesses how far America has slipped away from democracy, and what it will take to get it back.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

“This is genius,” former President Trump declared as Russia began its invasion of Ukraine. “[Russian President Vladimir] Putin declares a big portion of the Ukraine — of Ukraine — Putin declared it as independent. Oh, that’s wonderful.”

“Putin is now saying, ‘It’s independent,’ a large section of Ukraine,” he repeated. “How smart is that? And he’s gonna go in and be a peacekeeper.” 

At a fundraiser at Mar-a-Lago, the former president could barely contain himself: “I mean, he’s taking over a country for two dollars’ worth of sanctions. I’d say that’s pretty smart.”

In his address to the Conservative Political Action Conference last Saturday, Trump belatedly condemned Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, but he doubled down on his claims that Putin was “smart” and that the leaders of Western Europe were “dumb.”

Trump’s praise of Putin isn’t surprising. Dictators — not small-d democrats — have long been his role models.

Trump knows that Putin, Chinese President Xi Jinping and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un possess power that is unchecked by legislatures, courts, and free and fair elections. They jail or kill their critics, are indifferent to the welfare of the people they are supposed to serve, and steal billions of dollars for themselves, their families and their cronies. That appears to be why he envies them.

In 2017, when Fox News host Bill O’Reilly reminded Trump that Putin “is a killer,” the then-president replied, “There are a lot of killers. You think our country’s so innocent? … Our country does plenty of killing also.”

In 2018, despite the conclusions of U.S. intelligence agencies that Russia meddled in U.S. elections, Trump told reporters at the Helsinki summit that Putin “just said it’s not Russia. I will say this: I don’t see any reason why it would be.” During a photo-op with Putin during the Group of 20 summit in 2019, Trump referred to media criticism. “You don’t have this problem in Russia,” he said. “But we do.”

In 2020, despite substantial evidence that Russian agents had poisoned dissident Alexey Navalny with a nerve agent, Trump toed the Kremlin line: “We haven’t had any proof yet, but I will take a look.”

During his cringeworthy courtship of Kim, the third-generation leader of the world’s most repressive regime who ordered the murder of his half-brother and uncle, Trump praised Kim’s “great and beautiful vision for his country.” When Otto Warmbier died shortly after his release — in a vegetative state — from prison in North Korea on a bogus charge of subversion, Trump said he “did not believe [Kim] would have allowed” the American college student to be mistreated. Trump expressed confidence that Kim would conclude a nuclear weapons treaty with the United States that would fully “realize the great economic potential of North Korea” because “he is far too smart not to, and he does not want to disappoint his friend, President Trump.” Again and again, Trump declared that he “fell in love” after he read Kim’s “beautiful letters” to him.

It’s not a new infatuation.

“When students poured into Tiananmen Square,” Trump told Playboy in 1990, “the Chinese government almost blew it. Then they were vicious, they were horrible, but they put it down with strength. That shows you the power of strength.”

In 2018, Trump characterized Xi as “a great gentleman.” Xi is “now president for life, president for life. And he’s great. And look, he was able to do that. Maybe we’ll have to give that a shot someday.” A year later, Trump was still musing about Xi’s grip on power: “President Xi, who is a strong man, I call him ‘King.’ Xi said, ‘I am not King, I am president.’ ‘No, you’re president for life, and therefore you’re King.’”

Asked why he declined to press Xi to free the 1 million Uighurs in indoctrination camps in the Xinjiang region, Trump indicated, “Well, we were in the middle of a major trade deal.” According to then-national security adviser John Bolton,Trump told Xi to “go ahead with building the camps, which Trump thought was exactly the right thing to do.”

Xi is “for China, I’m for the United States, but other than that we love each other,” Trump declared in January 2020. The relationship between the countries has “probably never been better.” That February, Trump said, “Terrific working with President Xi, a man who truly loves his country.” More recently, as he had when asked about Putin, Trump shrugged off Bartiromo’s comment that Xi “is a killer.”

Trump has denied telling his White House chief of staff (and former four-star Marine general) John Kelly that “Hitler did a lot of good things.” The comment, however, rings true, as does the report that before canceling a trip to the Aisne-Marne American Cemetery near Paris, the president — reminiscent of candidate Trump’s assertion that John McCain was not a war hero: “I like people who weren’t captured” — asked, “Why should I go to that cemetery? It’s filled with losers.”

Our would-be autocrat is intent on returning to the White House. We should also assume if he succeeds, he intends to put in place the priorities, policies and practices of his role models.













						Forget the critics, listen to Trump — and consider his role models
					

Dictators — not small-d democrats — have long been his role models.




					thehill.com


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Find some courage and learn, on your own, what Authocracy is.


Look at the news we are living under one. Like I said, stupid or just a dime a dozen sellout.


----------



## Clipper (Sep 13, 2022)

Nostra said:


> Trump trolls you morons so easily.


You mean like when he sucker's you rubes out of money?


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Look at the news we are living under one. Like I said, stupid or just a dime a dozen sellout.


You have just shown everyone who does know what Authoritarianism is, that you do NOT know what Authoritarianism is.

You do not have to look at the meaning of the word.  Or why Trump has always had a nice word to say about some of the Authoritarian leaders around the world.

One of articles I posted above deals with the things he has said about those Authoritarians.  There should be videos of that as well.

You can in denial all you like, and call me names all you like.

I know what Trump has said about Authoritarians around the world that no Republican President has even dreamed of saying, in public or in private.


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You have just shown everyone who does know what Authoritarianism is, that you do NOT know what Authoritarianism is.
> 
> You do not have to look at the meaning of the word.  Or why Trump has always had a nice word to say about some of the Authoritarian leaders around the world.
> 
> ...


Sure thing, idiot.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Sure thing, idiot.


Sure thing, one who does not need to ask, does not need to know.


----------



## struth (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> But all those giggles served to obscure the more pressing fact: that in a departure from all precedent, Trump had used Independence Day to stage a military display, in which M1A2 tanks and Bradley armoured vehicles rolled into Washington, while fighter jets and helicopters filled the sky. The generals, mindful of the need to separate military and political power, had long opposed this extravaganza and, tellingly, most of the joint chiefs contrived to stay away. They understood that such a pageant is the stuff of despots, not democrats.
> 
> Another image framed this split-screen 4 July: that of the children, separated from their parents, who are caged in detention camps on America’s southern border. Accounts by lawyers and doctors who were allowed brief visits to these hellish places are almost unbearable to read: children deprived of sleep, denied access to blankets or mattresses, not allowed to wash their hands or brush their teeth; toddlers left alone on cold, hard floors, so traumatised they sit in stunned, tearless silence. I’m especially haunted by the report of “a suicidal four-year-old whose face was covered in bloody, self-inflicted scratches”.
> 
> ...


um historically we have had military parades regularly 

The fact we fire fireworks is a testimony the bombs bursting in air.  The 4th of July is literally about celebrating a military victory


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## Lastamender (Sep 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Sure thing, one who does not need to ask, does not need to know.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 13, 2022)

Former President George W. Bush derided his Republican Party on Tuesday for what he said it has become in the era of Donald Trump and misinformation, describing the GOP as "isolationist, protectionist and, to a certain extent, nativist."

Bush, who has been relatively quiet on the political scene since he left office in 2009, let loose in a rare TV appearance, saying the Jan. 6 insurrection "made me sick" and was a "terrible moment in our history" that taints the image of the United States around the world.

"This sends a signal to the world that we're no different," Bush said on NBC's "Today" show Tuesday, countering the beloved conservative idea of American exceptionalism.

------
And the 43rd president's observations are a mixed offer for Trump critics. On one hand, Bush – who said he still hopes for GOP victory in 2024 – vindicated their repeated warnings that the twice-impeached former leader was taking the GOP in a dangerous direction.

Yet Bush also became just another Republcian, selling a book, who waited until after Trump was gone to sound an alarm. Former Republican House Speaker John Boehner teared up last week as he talked about what had happened to his party – and how people can learn more about it in his book.
"What the f--- George W Bush? Like Boehner, you come out NOW and speak out against Trumpism? NOW? So many of us former Republicans lost everything publicly opposing Trump these past few years, yet you said & did nothing. And NOW you speak?" tweeted former Rep. Joe Walsh, Illinois Republican who has been a prominent Trump critic.

"Pardon my rant, but come on man," Walsh wrote.

Bush also discussed the value of immigrants to American society – itself an implicit criticism of Trump and the anti-immigrant sentiment of some of the party's more nationalist members. An amateur portraitist, Bush has a new book, "Out of Many, One: Portraits of America's Immigrants," which tells the stories of 43 men and women who have immigrated to the United States.

(full article online)



			https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2021-04-20/george-w-bush-condemns-the-trump-era-republican-party


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 15, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 17, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 19, 2022)

[ I am curious.  Why do the people at the bottom lift their arms, but the people on the side above do not?  What is the difference between the two groups? ]


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 19, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 19, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 19, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 25, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 25, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 26, 2022)

Former US President Donald Trump was surprised by supporters’ fervent loyalty toward him and sometimes derisive, The New York Times’ Maggie Haberman has said.

The former Amerian leader once called his fans “fucking crazy,” Haberman wrote in The Atlantic, while describing three post-presidency interviews she held with Trump in the run-up to the release of a book, “Confidence Man: The Making of Donald Trump and the Breaking of America.”

When the two spoke of the January 6 storming of the US Capitol — during which Trump has been widely documented to have been giddily watching television while refusing to take action to stop the assault on the halls of power — the ex-president claimed otherwise.

“I had heard that afterward and actually on the late side,” he claimed. “I was having meetings. I was also with Mark Meadows and others. I was not watching television.”

Haberman said overwhelming evidence showed the statement to be a lie.

Said Haberman: “His impulse to try to sell his preferred version of himself was undeterred by the stain that January 6 left on his legacy and on the democratic foundations of the country – if anything, it grew stronger.”

Haberman described Trump’s life at his Mar-A-Lago estate just after departing the presidency, in March 2021.

“After the headiness of being at the center of the world’s gaze, his time after the White House made him seem shrunken,” she wrote.

“He often played golf and then went to his newly built office at the club for meetings with whoever traveled down to seek his approval. He would watch television before going to dinner, where club members would sometimes applaud him, and then it would start all over again the next day, so removed from the daily rhythms of the broader world that he was oblivious to holidays on the calendar and staff had to remind him.”

In July, the investigating committee into the January 6 events said that despite desperate pleas from aides, allies, a Republican congressional leader and even his family, Trump refused to call off the January 6 mob attack on the Capitol, instead “pouring gasoline on the fire” by aggressively tweeting his false claims of a stolen election and celebrating his crowd of supporters as “very special.”

The panel documented how for some 187 minutes, from the time Trump left a rally stage sending his supporters to the Capitol to the time he ultimately appeared in the Rose Garden video that day to call for calm, nothing could compel the defeated president to act. Instead, he watched the violence unfold on TV.

The defeated president turned his supporters’ “love of country into a weapon,” said the panel’s Republican vice chair Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming.

“Donald Trump made a purposeful choice to violate his oath of office,” Cheney declared.

“Every American must consider this: Can a president who is willing to make the choices Donald Trump made during the violence of Jan. 6 ever be trusted in any position of authority in our great nation?” she asked.

Trump, who is considering another White House run, dismissed the committee as a “Kangaroo court,” and name-called the panel and witnesses for “many lies and misrepresentations.”











						Trump called fans ‘f***ing crazy,’ denied watching TV during Capitol attack — book
					

NY Times reporter who interviewed former president after his departure from office describes him in immediate aftermath as adrift, 'shrunken'




					www.timesofisrael.com


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## surada (Sep 26, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> What Trump supporters do not want to hear from his own words:



200,000 forged signatures? Trump is crazy as an outhouse rat.


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## Correll (Sep 26, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>




"related to"? Bullshit, it's a fishing expedition, like all the others. Look until you find something, anything, that you can spin as something.


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## Correll (Sep 26, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Former US President Donald Trump was surprised by supporters’ fervent loyalty toward him and sometimes derisive, The New York Times’ Maggie Haberman has said.
> 
> The former Amerian leader once called his fans “fucking crazy,” Haberman wrote in The Atlantic, ....




Every President has over zealous supporters. 

Trump's base was some of the quietest and sanest member of society, ie working class whites. Sure,  lefties like to talk about 1/6.


THere were HUNDREDS of lefty race riots during that time period. DOZENS of deaths. Hundreds of millions in damages. Whole communities permanetly ruined.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 26, 2022)




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## Correll (Sep 26, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>




Do you believe in teh Southern Strategy Conspiracy Theory?

That is a lie with some serious and large and poisonous consequences. It has turned large segments of the population against each other.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 26, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 26, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 27, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Sep 27, 2022)

Tomorrow morning, jury selection begins in the case of the leader and four members of the Oath Keepers group, indicted on seditious conspiracy and other charges. The trial itself, with opening statements, is expected to begin later in the week, and could have serious implications for Trump.

_The Washington Post_ reports, “Prosecutors plan to call as many as 40 witnesses over a projected five-week trial, draw from 800 statements by those charged and summarize tens of thousands of messages, hundreds of hours of video footage and hundreds of phone call, location and financial records, according to pretrial proceedings.” 

*How We Got Here*

The history of the case is interesting. It started in late January, just after the insurrection when a grand jury charged Defendants Thomas Caldwell, Jessica Watkins and Donovan Crowl, in a four-count indictment that focused on a conspiracy to prevent or delay Congress from certifying the Electoral College vote (general conspiracy under 18 U.S.C. 371) and obstructing an official proceeding (obstruction under 18 U.S.C 1512).

Over time, new defendants and charges were added to the original indictment. This process is referred to as superseding an indictment. By the time the 6th Superseding Indictment was returned in December of 2021, there were 17 defendants, charges with 7 different counts, but the lead charges continued to be conspiracy and obstruction. This group of defendants is sometimes referred to as the Caldwell defendants.

In mid-January 2022, the _Caldwell_ matter split into three different cases. The grand jury returned the indictment in the present case, titled _United States v. Rhodes_, on January 12, 2022, against 11 defendants alleging eight separate violations of law over 17 counts. The lead charge was seditious conspiracy. The indictment includes other charges including conspiracy to obstruct and obstruction of the certification of the 2020 vote. The people who were charged include nine original _Caldwell_ defendants, the leader of the Oath Keepers, Elmer Stewart Rhodes, III, and one additional member.

The remaining _Caldwell_ defendants were named in a new indictment re-titled _United States v. Crowl_. One defendant, Jonathan Walden, was charged in a stand-alone case. 

Three member of the Oath Keepers, Joshua James, Brian Ulrich and William Todd Wilson have since pleaded guilty to seditious conspiracy. They are expected to be among approximately a dozen witnesses who will testify for the government.

(full article online)










						The Oath Keepers Go To Trial
					

Tomorrow morning, jury selection begins in the case of the leader and four members of the Oath Keepers group, indicted on seditious conspiracy and other charges. The trial itself, with opening statements, is expected to begin later in the week, and could have serious implications for Trump.




					joycevance.substack.com


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## Correll (Sep 27, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>




Yet, it is you people that want a large group of Americans to be silenced forever and to be forever ignored, not us.


NOte it is you people that are constantly working to silence people, not us.


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## Sixties Fan (Sep 28, 2022)

[ Sadly, what can happen to those who blindly follow Trump's words and his need to stay in office ]


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Trump has never conceded. And you people proved nothing because you said you do not have to. If you did those ballots and other things requested would not have been blocked from public scrutiny. These people could not act more guilty if they tried.



Actually he did concede.  He is living in Florida and not DC.  If he was/is the man's man that his cult believes him to be he would have stayed to the end or died trying.
MAGA


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Actually he did concede.  He is living in Florida and not DC.  If he was/is the man's man that his cult believes him to be he would have stayed to the end or died trying.
> MAGA


Trump did not concede and I am not going to even consider what you think a man would do because you haven't a clue.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Trump did not concede and I am not going to even consider what you think a man would do because you haven't a clue.



Why did the manly man leave if he knows he won the election?


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Why did the manly man leave if he knows he won the election?


Stupid question, even for you.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Stupid question, even for you.



Why would the manl man leave the Whitehouse knowing he won the election?


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Why would the manl man leave the Whitehouse knowing he won the election?


Are you really as stupid as you sound? Think before you answer.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Are you really as stupid as you sound? Think before you answer.



Why did this god among men leave the Whitehouse after winning the election?


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Why did this god among men leave the Whitehouse after winning the election?


He had to and you know it. None of it changes the fact he was defrauded. Kind of like you when they handed out brains.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> He had to and you know it. None of it changes the fact he was defrauded. Kind of like you when they handed out brains.



This God among men left office, knowing he was still president?


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> This God among men left office, knowing he was still president?


You have a point, stupid? Fill us in on exactly what it is.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You have a point, stupid? Fill us in on exactly what it is.



That your God among men most certainly conceded since he left the Whitehouse. Why would the God/King leave office if he knew he won the election?


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> That your God among men most certainly conceded since he left the Whitehouse. Why would the God/King leave office if he knew he won the election?


I never called Trump a god. Put words in someone else's mouth and get the balls out of yours.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> I never called Trump a god. Put words in someone else's mouth and get the balls out of yours.



Why did this manly man, this God among men leave office if he knew he won the election?


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Why did this manly man, this God among men leave office if he knew he won the election?


I have already answered you troll. Carry on.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> I have already answered you troll. Carry on.



You have answered nothing because you are nothing.  Just like your manly man, this God among men you and your cult worship!!!!!


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> You have answered nothing because you are nothing.  Just like your manly man, this God among men you and your cult worship!!!!!


If I am nothing why ask me anything or even reply, stupid?


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> If I am nothing why ask me anything or even reply, stupid?



Because it is fun smacking an imbecile like you around.


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## Mac1958 (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> That your God among men....


Literally, for many of them.  Because cult.


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Because it is fun smacking an imbecile like you around.


You are slapping no one but your stupid self. Carry on, moron.


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You are slapping no one but your stupid self. Carry on, moron.



I have been beating your ass on this board since you showed up.  Don't get me wrong it isn't very tough to do since you are both an imbecile and insane.  But it is very funny.


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Mac1958 said:


> Literally, for many of them.  Because cult.


The cult that grooms children? The cult that lines up for deadly vaccines? The cult that says dissent is treason? You belong to everyone of those cults filled with hacks, liars and dishonest American hating traitors.


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> I have been beating your ass on this board since you showed up.  Don't get me wrong it isn't very tough to do since you are both an imbecile and insane.  But it is very funny.


The six years I was here before you?


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## Mac1958 (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> The cult that grooms children? The cult that lines up for deadly vaccines? The cult that says dissent is treason? You belong to everyone of those cults filled with hacks, liars and dishonest American hating traitors.


And bless you too, cafeteria Christian.


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## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Mac1958 said:


> And bless you too, cafeteria Christian.


I never claimed to be a Christian. Who don't you hate?


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## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> The six years I was here before you?


 Doesn't actually matter, been beating your ass since our first engagement on this board.   Again not a tough chore.


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Doesn't actually matter, been beating your ass since our first engagement on this board.   Again not a tough chore.


No you haven't. You are a dime a dozen sycophant making sure everyone knows you are on the side you perceive as winning because you haven't the brains or the courage to think for yourself.


----------



## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> No you haven't. You are a dime a dozen sycophant making sure everyone knows you are on the side you perceive as winning because you haven't the brains or the courage to think for yourself.



Says a simpleton that bleats "stolen election".


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> Says a simpleton that bleats "stolen election".


The election was stolen, suck puppy.


----------



## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> The election was stolen, suck puppy.


You better get this irrefutable evidence to Rudy, the Kraken Lady, Mike Pillow and the rightwing nutters nuz pronto. They are in immediate need of it.


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> You better get this irrefutable evidence to Rudy, the Kraken Lady, Mike Pillow and the rightwing nutters nuz pronto. They are in immediate need of it.


You better come up with something else because there is all kinds of evidence without any of those people. You better quit now stupid before I clean your fascist clock again.


----------



## Mac1958 (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> You better get this irrefutable evidence to Rudy, the Kraken Lady, Mike Pillow and the rightwing nutters nuz pronto. They are in immediate need of it.


What are you talking about!

These message board Trumpsters know MUCH more than Trump's Justice Department, Trump's DHS, Trump's Attorney General, Trump's Supreme Court, Trump-appointed judges, Trump's White House staff, Trump's White House lawyers, Trump's campaign manager, Trump cybersecurity officials, several Republican lawmakers, Republican state and local election officials, state Supreme Courts and Republican State Attorneys General, and the GQP's very own handpicked Cyber Ninjas!

THEY GOTS DA TROOF I TELL YOU


----------



## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You better come up with something else because there is all kinds of evidence without any of those people. You better quit now stupid before I clean your fascist clock again.



There is exactly 0 evidence nutter.  No you cannot clean my cock ever!


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Mac1958 said:


> What are you talking about!
> 
> These message board Trumpsters know MUCH more than Trump's Justice Department, Trump's DHS, Trump's Attorney General, Trump's Supreme Court, Trump-appointed judges, Trump's White House staff, Trump's White House lawyers, Trump's campaign manager, Trump cybersecurity officials, several Republican lawmakers, Republican state and local election officials, state Supreme Courts and Republican State Attorneys General, and the GQP's very own handpicked Cyber Ninjas!
> 
> THEY GOTS DA TROOF I TELL YOU


Another excuse for the circular file. Congress was complicit and Trump never had any control over the weaponized agencies you claim he did. Try the truth you sorry son of a bitch.


----------



## Lastamender (Sep 28, 2022)

Aldo Raine said:


> There is exactly 0 evidence nutter.  No you cannot clean my cock ever!


There is digital evidence that will never get to court as long as this country is run by traitors. But you know that. Keep sucking parasite.


----------



## Aldo Raine (Sep 28, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> There is digital evidence that will never get to court as long as this country is run by traitors. But you know that. Keep sucking parasite.



Yet still EXACTLY 0 evidence of any of the bullshit you and Mike Pillow are peddling.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 28, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Sep 28, 2022)




----------



## Correll (Sep 28, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> [ Sadly, what can happen to those who blindly follow Trump's words and his need to stay in office ]




Seven years?  How badly hurt was the officer?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 2, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)




----------



## surada (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> I am waiting for you to show evidence that there was no fraud in 2020. You first.



Trump has to prove fraud. He made the accusation.


----------



## surada (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> The election was stolen, suck puppy.



Where's Trump's evidence?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

surada said:


> Trump has to prove fraud. He made the accusation.


Trump has proven fraud to me and over half the country. You live on lies. The truth would have the same effect on you a vampire has to sunlight.


----------



## whitehall (Oct 3, 2022)

Why aren't democrats concerned about whether the current president wants to stay in office?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

whitehall said:


> Why aren't democrats concerned about whether the current president wants to stay in office?


Only if legally elected.  What is the problem with running for a second turn?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Trump has proven fraud to me and over half the country. You live on lies. The truth would have the same effect on you a vampire has to sunlight.


Trump has tried 62 times and with the Supreme Court.  No proof of fraud at all.

The bats are staying in their caves because they know some humans are full of it, as Trump and others are.

Plenty of proof of Trump engaging in asking for votes to turn the election to him.  Georgia is one of them.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump has tried 62 times and with the Supreme Court.  No proof of fraud at all.
> 
> The bats are staying in their caves because they know some humans are full of it, as Trump and others are.
> 
> Plenty of proof of Trump engaging in asking for votes to turn the election to him.  Georgia is one of them.


All kinds of evidence was never investigated. The election was stolen. Public opinion is on Trump's side, not yours.


----------



## whitehall (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Only if legally elected.  What is the problem with running for a second turn?


Bullshit aside, with Trump you know what you have. Not so much with the current president who is protected by the media. Democrats seem to have a problem with the capability of Biden to function in another term but all anyone wants to talk about is Trump.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> All kinds of evidence was never investigated. The election was stolen. Public opinion is on Trump's side, not yours.


There are plenty of Republicans who can give any amount of time for that investigation.  It is not happening.

Why?  Because there is nothing positive to find in order to turn the election back to make Trump the winner.

Conspiracies and allegations are not evidence.

Evidence is evidence.

Come back with any of it, and I will be more than happy to look at and consider it.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

whitehall said:


> Bullshit aside, with Trump you know what you have. Not so much with the current president who is protected by the media. Democrats seem to have a problem with the capability of Biden to function in another term but all anyone wants to talk about is Trump.


Do not worry with another Biden term.  He is dealing with this one, as he should.

Democrats are not having any problems with his capabilities.  It is his capabilities which are doing the right thing for the country, considering all the wins he has had in the past 18 months.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> There are plenty of Republicans who can give any amount of time for that investigation.  It is not happening.
> 
> Why?  Because there is nothing positive to find in order to turn the election back to make Trump the winner.
> 
> ...


Conspiracies and allegations are all you have against Trump, right?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Conspiracies and allegations are all you have against Trump, right?


Still not bringing any evidence.  What, cannot find any?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Still not bringing any evidence.  What, cannot find any?











						Here is the Evidence
					

Crowdsourcing evidence for journalists.



					hereistheevidence.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Conspiracies and allegations are all you have against Trump, right?


Is there a reason why you do not ask yourself why the Republicans in Congress have not started an investigation into the 2020 election if they fully believe that Trump won it?  Cruz, Hawley, Gaetz, Green, McConnel, Kevin McCarthy who is the minority leader.

Get in touch with any of them and demand that they investigate as they should.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Here is the Evidence
> 
> 
> Crowdsourcing evidence for journalists.
> ...


Good, now send it to the Republicans in Congress and the Supreme Court and have them take action on it.


----------



## whitehall (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Do not worry with another Biden term.  He is dealing with this one, as he should.
> 
> Democrats are not having any problems with his capabilities.  It is his capabilities which are doing the right thing for the country, considering all the wins he has had in the past 18 months.


Do not worry about another Biden term? His capabilities? You gotta be kidding. Even democrats would probably agree to invoking the 25th Amendment if we didn't end up with Kamala.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

“True the Vote has compiled evidence of organized ballot tracking in six states. In Georgia, the group alleges* there were 242 traffickers who made 5,662 trips to ballot drop-boxes between the early morning hours of midnight and 5 a.m., ‘potentially unloading hundreds of thousands of illegally harvested ballots over the course of several weeks,*’ according to Citizens Free Press,” the WND report stated.

That is digital evidence that is accepted in courts. The illegitimate administration won't allow it to get there with help from the thoroughly corrupt GA. government.* Repeated trips for weeks by the same people.*





						BREAKING! GEORGIA! Watch How Thousands Of ‘Mules’ Dropped Harvested Ballots In 2020 | Tea Party Pac
					






					teapartypac.org


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

whitehall said:


> Do not worry about another Biden term? His capabilities? You gotta be kidding. Even democrats would probably agree to invoking the 25th Amendment if we didn't end up with Kamala.


Keep dreaming.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> “True the Vote has compiled evidence of organized ballot tracking in six states. In Georgia, the group alleges* there were 242 traffickers who made 5,662 trips to ballot drop-boxes between the early morning hours of midnight and 5 a.m., ‘potentially unloading hundreds of thousands of illegally harvested ballots over the course of several weeks,*’ according to Citizens Free Press,” the WND report stated.
> 
> That is digital evidence that is accepted in courts. The illegitimate administration won't allow it to get there with help from the thoroughly corrupt GA. government.* Repeated trips for weeks by the same people.*
> 
> ...


The mules dropped on your head, that is for sure.  All nonsense.

It was shown as  evidence in court?  Well, it was not brought up, was it?

Evidence from the TEA PARTY ????

They use the word MIGHT HAVE a lot.  Why would that be?
Video APPEARS TO SHOW.........  Where is the actual proof that it was for real?

And none of that was shown in the 62 court lawsuits by Trump?  They must have been.


So, what happened when Trump's lawyers showed all of the evidence you have posted here, and probably more?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> The mules dropped on your head, that is for sure.  All nonsense.
> 
> It was shown as  evidence in court?  Well, it was not brought up, was it?
> 
> ...


It can be proven that activity went on by digital evidence. The same kind law enforcement gets convictions on. Fact.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> The mules dropped on your head, that is for sure.  All nonsense.
> 
> It was shown as  evidence in court?  Well, it was not brought up, was it?
> 
> ...


All you have is the word of proven liars that it did not happen. Why that is good enough for you makes you look like more of a fool than you already do.

Why didn't the AZ. audit ever get the routers from Maricopa County they requested and why won't Dominion release their source codes and put this all to rest?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> It can be proven that activity went on by digital evidence. The same kind law enforcement gets convictions on. Fact.


There is only that ONE video.  How many people do not have large families and many in them vote, and ONE of them takes ALL of the ballots to be dropped in the Election Drop Boxes?

Is that not a possibility to what we see in that video?

Where are all the other videos?

Where is the ACTUAL proof that that person was "harvesting" fake election ballots and dropping them so that the Democrats would win? 

What if the family is Republican and all voted for Republicans?

You continue to not provide actual, factual evidence of corruption.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> There is only that ONE video.  How many people do not have large families and many in them vote, and ONE of them takes ALL of the ballots to be dropped in the Election Drop Boxes?
> 
> Is that not a possibility to what we see in that video?
> 
> ...


GA. destroyed their videos from the dropbox cameras. Why?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> All you have is the word of proven liars that it did not happen. Why that is good enough for you makes you look like more of a fool than you already do.
> 
> Why didn't the AZ. audit ever get the routers from Maricopa County they requested and why won't Dominion release their source codes and put this all to rest?


Who are those proven liars?

Stop wasting time writing an essay about liars, etc, etc.  You have not shown one evidence.

Ask AZ and Dominion.  They will be more than happy to tell you.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Who are those proven liars?
> 
> Stop wasting time writing an essay about liars, etc, etc.  You have not shown one evidence.
> 
> Ask AZ and Dominion.  They will be more than happy to tell you.


Your fucking government and the criminals in power. Dominion has not cooperated in any way shape or form. All they did was intimidate people and file lawsuits that have gone nowhere.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> GA. destroyed their videos from the dropbox cameras. Why?


EVIDENCE. !!!!!


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Your fucking government and the criminals in power. Dominion has not cooperated in any way shape or form. All they did was intimidate people and file lawsuits that have gone nowhere.


Actually, Dominion rightfully sued for being accused of fraud, for defamation. 









						Top Fox News personalities face questioning as Dominion Voting's defamation lawsuit moves forward
					

Maria Bartiromo will be deposed in Dominion's defamation lawsuit, joining Fox News hosts Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and others.




					www.cnbc.com
				












						8 Top Experts on Strength of Dominion Suing Trump for Defamation, If It Wants To
					

"Almost every expert said a defamation suit brought by Dominion against Trump would be very strong."




					www.justsecurity.org
				












						Judge tosses Sidney Powell's counterclaims in Dominion defamation case
					

A Washington, D.C., federal judge on Wednesday dismissed claims by conservative lawyer Sidney Powell that Dominion Voting Systems Inc abused the legal system by bringing a $1.3 billion defamation lawsuit against her.




					www.reuters.com
				






Lies should have consequences


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> EVIDENCE. !!!!!


Destroying it was illegal. Why has no one been charged? What does that tell even an idiot, like yourself?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Actually, Dominion rightfully sued for being accused of fraud, for defamation.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I agree. Dominion will pay.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Destroying it was illegal. Why has no one been charged? What does that tell even an idiot, like yourself?


What is the proof that any videos were destroyed?  Without any evidence it is nothing more than allegations.

One video, like that one, would have been enough.

Courts need evidence, even courts led by Judges appointed by Trump, as many of those in the lawsuits were.  Not one of them accepted any of the evidence, or the lack of evidence Trump lawyers showed when they appeared in front of them.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> I agree. Dominion will pay.


It is Dominion which is suing.  It will come to a conclusion some day, as it is going forward.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> What is the proof that any videos were destroyed?  Without any evidence it is nothing more than allegations.
> 
> One video, like that one, would have been enough.
> 
> Courts need evidence, even courts led by Judges appointed by Trump, as many of those in the lawsuits were.  Not one of them accepted any of the evidence, or the lack of evidence Trump lawyers showed when they appeared in front of them.


The proof is that True to Vote asked for them and GA. told them they had none.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> It is Dominion which is suing.  It will come to a conclusion some day, as it is going forward.


No it won't without Dominion proving those people lied. They cannot do that without revealing their source codes.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> The proof is that True to Vote asked for them and GA. told them they had none.


Maybe, truly, they had none, as in there were none on video, none filmed doing the same, and none destroyed.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> No it won't without Dominion proving those people lied. They cannot do that without revealing their source codes.


You do not know anything about the case.  Let the case take its time and we will see what comes out of it.

It is against Fox and the Pillow Guy, who said that Dominion did something to change the votes, or something like that.

The burden of proof that Dominion did anything to give the election to the Democrats is on Fox, Pillow Guy and any others who made such allegations.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Nevada's Republican gubernatorial candidate, Joe Lombardo, sought in a debate on Sunday to distance himself from former President Donald Trump over his lies about the 2020 election, but said Trump's policies were better than those under the Biden administration, which he blames for inflation and rising interest rates.

“It’s an abysmal failure. In my opinion Trump moved the country forward," Lombardo said. But when asked whether Trump was “a great president,” Lombardo hesitated, saying, “I wouldn’t say great, I think he was a sound president."

Lombardo said he was bothered by Trump's false claims of a stolen election, saying that he was “not shying away from that" and agreeing that Trump lying about election fraud undermined the confidence of the voters.


(full article online)










						Republican tepid on Trump in Nevada gubernatorial debate
					

Nevada's Republican gubernatorial candidate, Joe Lombardo, said he was bothered by Trump's false claims of a stolen election and didn't agree that he was "a great president."




					www.aol.com


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Maybe, truly, they had none, as in there were none on video, none filmed doing the same, and none destroyed.


Prove it. True to Vote says they were.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You do not know anything about the case.  Let the case take its time and we will see what comes out of it.
> 
> It is against Fox and the Pillow Guy, who said that Dominion did something to change the votes, or something like that.
> 
> The burden of proof that Dominion did anything to give the election to the Democrats is on Fox, Pillow Guy and any others who made such allegations.


Then why are the lawsuits going nowhere?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Prove it. True to Vote says they were.


Stop making me laugh.

Where are your investigators and proof which would pass muster in front of Trump appointed Judges?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

10/3/2022

Mike Lindell, a prominent ally of former President Donald Trump, must face a $1.3 billion lawsuit by Dominion Voting Systems Inc accusing him of defamation for pushing false claims that its voting machines rigged the 2020 presidential election, with the U.S. Supreme Court on Monday turning away his appeal.

The justices rejected a bid by Lindell and his company My Pillow Inc to immediately appeal a federal judge's refusal to toss the lawsuit. A lower court also snubbed his effort to quickly review the case, allowing the litigation to proceed.

Denver-based Dominion's lawsuit against Lindell is one of a number that the company and a competitor, Smartmatic USA Inc, have filed against Trump allies and conservative media outlets over false claims that the 2020 presidential election was stolen from Trump through widespread voting fraud.

Dominion sued Lindell and Chaska, Minnesota-based My Pillow in 2021 in federal court in Washington, accusing him of making claims he knew were not supported by evidence. "But Lindell - a talented salesman and former professional card counter - sells the lie to this day because the lie sells pillows," Dominion's lawsuit stated.

U.S. Judge Carl Nichols in August 2021 rejected Lindell's request to dismiss the case, finding that Dominion "adequately alleged that Lindell made his claims knowing that they were false or with reckless disregard for the truth."

(full article online)










						U.S. Supreme Court rejects Trump ally Lindell's defamation case appeal
					

Mike Lindell, a prominent ally of former President Donald Trump, must face a $1.3 billion lawsuit by Dominion Voting Systems Inc accusing him of defamation for pushing false claims that its voting machines rigged the 2020 presidential election, with the U.S. Supreme Court on Monday turning away...




					www.aol.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Then why are the lawsuits going nowhere?


Lawsuits do take time.  You are very impatient .


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Stop making me laugh.
> 
> Where are your investigators and proof which would pass muster in front of Trump appointed Judges?


You said they were not destroyed.


> _*“According to state and federal law, all elections records must be retained. In fact, federal law requires a 22-month retention period for election records while state law requires a 24-month retention period for election documents that are formerly considered to include videos or electronic digital files.”*_





> _“SEB Rule 183-1-12-.13 (c) tells Elections Superintendents t\hey can overwrite memory cards containing ballot images in conflict with state and federal law. SEB Rule 183-1-14-0.6-*.14 requires drop box videos to be retained for 30 days, which some counties falsely assumed was the only required retention period. “*_








__





						Over 100 Georgia Counties Can’t Produce The Drop Box Videos! – Patriots Beacon
					





					patriotsbeacon.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You said they were not destroyed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You gave the rules, not the evidence that there were any videos besides that one, and much less that they were destroyed.   The court knows the rules.  It needs the evidence.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You said they were not destroyed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The link only gives allegations from a Republican site.  No proof of anything.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You gave the rules, not the evidence that there were any videos besides that one, and much less that they were destroyed.   The court knows the rules.  It needs the evidence.


They cannot produce them, stupid, that is the evidence.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> They cannot produce them, stupid, that is the evidence.


Guess what!!!!!

If I Google for GA Election  drop boxes  cameras being destroyed I find.........

ZERO   links to anything like that happening.

Your source is a partisan Republican group set on making believe that cameras were destroyed on purpose.

Google it yourself and find me ONE news agency which covered that .


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)




----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Guess what!!!!!
> 
> If I Google for GA Election  drop boxes  cameras being destroyed I find.........
> 
> ...


Fuck Google.they bury stuff like that. You are just very easy to fool. Your posts prove your lock step lying bullshit. Try your crap on someone else you are getting nowhere fast here.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Fuck Google.they bury stuff like that. You are just very easy to fool. Your posts prove your lock step lying bullshit. Try your crap on someone else you are getting nowhere fast here.


You....are unfortunately.....the one easy to fool.

Those allegations were not taken to court. Nor to the news agency. The Trump lawyers would not dare.

One cannot even find a news agency on tv which would have told about it.

That site is the ONLY site which dares to allege such a thing.

No FOX
No OAN
No Newsmax

And Google would be able to bury that story without any of those making an issue of it, or a Republican in Congress. ???????


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You....are unfortunately.....the one easy to fool.
> 
> Those allegations were not taken to court. Nor to the news agency. The Trump lawyers would not dare.
> 
> ...


Trump had no idea. It was not revealed until well after the election. You are getting dumber.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Trump had no idea. It was not revealed until well after the election. You are getting dumber.


You are grasping at straws.

He sued and sued, after the election.

Call or email Fox, OAN and Newsmax
If such videos were allegedly destroyed and they had it broadcast on tv on the same day, or thereabouts as the  article did,  or on their sites,  they should know about it and send you the articles via email.

If you do call them and they do have something, let me know.  Post them here.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You are grasping at straws.
> 
> He sued and sued, after the election.
> 
> ...


We were talking about destroyed videos. Stupid.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> We were talking about destroyed videos. Stupid.


We are talking about the NEWS media.  And that all the agencies should have heard about it and not only this 
One moment, please... 

site, Patriots Beacon,  which put this allegations about it.

Such allegation should have come out on EVERY news site and on tv, including FOX, OAN, and NEWSMAX.

But you keep insisting that because the videos were allegedly destroyed, that NOT ONE news agency would have reported about it, especially since Patriots Beacon did.


In other words, Patriots Beacon cannot back up its allegations because NO OTHER news media, or site has ever reported about these videos, or any other videos.


----------



## Billo_Really (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.


Don't you dare bring your sick, fascist government to our shores!  Trump is worse than your former PM Netanfuckyou.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> We are talking about the NEWS media.  And that all the agencies should have heard about it and not only this
> One moment, please...
> 
> site, Patriots Beacon,  which put this allegations about it.
> ...


Yes other media has and the bottom line is that the videos were destroyed. You are expecting people to believe a MSM with 0 credibility. It is not going to happen. Admit you are wrong or GTFO.


----------



## kaz (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.



LOL, it always cracks me up how Democrats are too stupid to not take jokes seriously.

Trump was mocking YOU.  And you just started a thread to credit him with it working, LOL.  What a dolt.  I'm not the first to observed that about you, am I?


----------



## kaz (Oct 3, 2022)

Billo_Really said:


> Don't you dare bring your sick, fascist government to our shores!  Trump is worse than your former PM Netanfuckyou.



Another dumb ass leftist who doesn't recognize when you are being mocked.   This is hysterical.   Continue, please ...


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Yes other media has and the bottom line is that the videos were destroyed. You are expecting people to believe a MSM with 0 credibility. It is not going to happen. Admit you are wrong or GTFO.


I want it from FOX, OAN or NEWSMAX.  Not one of them reported on this allegation.  Not one reporter.

It only comes out in this non News site.

I want it from Tucker or Hannity or Laura Ingram.  There is not one video with any one of them alleging that such a thing may have happened and that there was an investigation going on about it.

There is NOTHING.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

kaz said:


> LOL, it always cracks me up how Democrats are too stupid to not take jokes seriously.
> 
> Trump was mocking YOU.  And you just started a thread to credit him with it working, LOL.  What a dolt.  I'm not the first to observed that about you, am I?


Trump is the joke and you may be the joker in training.

That is all there is to it, from all the evidence I have seen.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> I want it from FOX, OAN or NEWSMAX.  Not one of them reported on this allegation.  Not one reporter.
> 
> It only comes out in this non News site.
> 
> ...


They have been silenced by the network. A lawsuit from Dominion caused that.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> They have been silenced by the network. A lawsuit from Dominion caused that.


All 3 Networks?  I do not see Tucker being silenced about anything, especially if there were actually videos showing illegal dumping of ballots.

And those ballots have nothing to do with Dominion, the other company and the counting of ballots.

The  article you posted came out today.  With only that video as alleged evidence.

I will check the news in the coming weeks to see if anything else comes out.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> All 3 Networks?  I do not see Tucker being silenced about anything, especially if there were actually videos showing illegal dumping of ballots.
> 
> And those ballots have nothing to do with Dominion, the other company and the counting of ballots.
> 
> ...


There are plenty of people stuffing ballots.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> There are plenty of people stuffing ballots.


Words. Nothing but.

Empty in evidence.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Words. Nothing but.
> 
> Empty in evidence.


Wrong again. There are videos that have been posted.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Wrong again. There are videos that have been posted.


You showed me only one video of a man dropping many ballots into a Mail box.

That is what we are talking about.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You showed me only one video of a man dropping many ballots into a Mail box.
> 
> That is what we are talking about.


Here is another and a lot of information








						Stunning Video Catches HUGE Voter Fraud Operation in Action!
					

Okay, so the cheating liberal left has an answer for video proof of people stuffing dozens of election ballots into drop boxes. These noble individuals are simply helping the less fortunate make their vote count. It’s a bogus explanation, but without the ballots, the fraud is otherwise difficult...




					steadfastclash.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Here is another and a lot of information
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Please, find some legitimate sources.
--------------
A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency, and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source. See all Questionable sources.

*Overall, we rate Steadfast Clashl Right Biased and Questionable based on the promotion of one-sided right-wing propaganda, the use of poor sources, and a few false claims.*
Detailed Report​Questionable Reasoning: * Propaganda, Conspiracy Theories, Poor Sourcing, False Claims, Lack of Transparency.*
Bias Rating:* RIGHT*
Factual Reporting: *MIXED*
Country: *USA*
Press Freedom Rank:* MOSTLY FREE*
Media Type: *Website*
Traffic/Popularity: *Minimal Traffic*
MBFC Credibility Rating: *LOW CREDIBILITY*












						Steadfast Clash
					

QUESTIONABLE SOURCE A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no




					mediabiasfactcheck.com


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Please, find some legitimate sources.
> --------------
> A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency, and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source. See all Questionable sources.
> 
> ...


Those source checkers are bought and paid for. Them and fact checkers have 0 credibility. You should identify with that.

Also it was a video you wanted, The source just posted it.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Those source checkers are bought and paid for. Them and fact checkers have 0 credibility. You should identify with that.
> 
> Also it was a video you wanted, The source just posted it.


Fact checkers are not bought and paid for only because you wish to believe that.
I can fact check on Democrats as well.   There is no difference on finding facts.


Ok, Now find where that post office worker was found, questioned, and what was she doing dropping those ballots in the election drop box.

The same with the others in those videos.

They were caught, interrogated,  and indicted, correct?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Fact checkers are not bought and paid for only because you wish to believe that.
> 
> 
> Ok, Now find where that post office worker was found, questioned, and what was she doing dropping those ballots in the election drop box.
> ...


That lady was never prosecuted.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> That lady was never prosecuted.


Who was she, where are the articles following the story?  That she was caught, or even questioned?
What was her name, as she worked for the post office?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Who was she, where are the articles following the story?  That she was caught, or even questioned?
> What was her name, as she worked for the post office?


Ask the authorities in those Democratic shitholes, not me.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Ask the authorities in those Democratic shitholes, not me.


You should be asking all of those detectives, so to speak, from your last link, who were describing these videos.  What?  No follow up?

All of that would have been laughed out of court, because it is all circumstantial.   Totally lacks evidence, concrete evidence.

If I were a Journalist or Lawyer, I have asked for proof in order to go ahead with the story or lawsuit.  You have given nothing concrete for me to go to any Judge and prove that there was massive fraud, even a small amount of it.

The Judge would say:  Case Closed.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You should be asking all of those detectives, so to speak, from your last link, who were describing these videos.  What?  No follow up?
> 
> All of that would have been laughed out of court, because it is all circumstantial.   Totally lacks evidence, concrete evidence.
> 
> ...


They are not the authorities. They notified the authorities and they did nothing. What does that tell you Einstein?.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> They are not the authorities. They notified the authorities and they did nothing. What does that tell you Einstein?.


How do you know they notified the authorities?  Does it say so in the video?
Shall I watch the whole thing to make sure?

I am sure that there is plenty of nothing going on here if these people were not caught while other people who voted twice got caught and prosecuted.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> How do you know they notified the authorities?  Does it say so in the video?
> Shall I watch the whole thing to make sure?
> 
> I am sure that there is plenty of nothing going on here if these people were not caught while other people who voted twice got caught and prosecuted.


You did not watch the video? What an asshole. You do not know what you are talking about.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> They are not the authorities. They notified the authorities and they did nothing. What does that tell you Einstein?.


[Gregg Phillips knows how to make money off of those allegations.  Why would I believe his or the other 3 allegations of fraud ?]

Gregg Phillips, a former Texas official who claims that “2,000 mules” stole the 2020 election from Donald Trump, has raised millions of dollars to chase nonexistent fraudulent votes.

If your movie preferences lean toward the likes of _Top Gun: Maverick_, or if your politics fall anywhere to the left of Liz Cheney, you might have missed the theatrical release of a documentary titled _2000 Mules_. But if you tuned in to the January 6 hearings, you might have caught a reference to the film by former attorney general William Barr, who, doubling as a movie critic, dismissed it as “singularly unimpressive” and “indefensible.” 

Directed by right-wing provocateur Dinesh D’Souza, _2000 Mules_ purports to prove that Democrats engaged in widespread voter fraud during the 2020 election and stole the presidency from Donald Trump—who, coincidentally or not, pardoned D’Souza in 2018 after his felony conviction for making illegal campaign contributions. Trump, who hosted a screening of _2000 Mules _at Mar-a-Lago, called it the “greatest and most impactful documentary of our time.” 

As with so many things hyped by the former president, the film became a viral sensation, complete with its own eponymous hashtag. It is among the highest-grossing documentaries of the year so far, having earned nearly $1.5 million at the box office since its May release. (Documentaries don’t tend to attract Marvel franchise–size audiences.) Streaming revenues—D’Souza’s website sells the film for $19.99 a pop—totaled $10 million in just the first two weeks of release, according to Salem Media Group, the conservative Christian company that financed the film.









						How True the Vote Fabricates Claims of Election Fraud, for Fun and Profit
					

Gregg Phillips, a former Texas official who claims that “2,000 mules” stole the 2020 election from Donald Trump, has raised millions of dollars to chase nonexistent fraudulent votes.




					www.texasmonthly.com


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

J6?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> You did not watch the video? What an asshole. You do not know what you are talking about.


I watched some of it.  What I do best is research about the people on the video, which says a lot about what they are alleging on the video.

I just posted about Gregg Phillips.  Nice to know how to make money off these allegations.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> J6?


?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> I watched some of it.  What I do best is research about the people on the video, which says a lot about what they are alleging on the video.
> 
> I just posted about Gregg Phillips.  Nice to know how to make money off these allegations.


To help pay for the investigations. There is nothing wrong with that. Are you worried?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> J6?


[ Do due research ]

Ray Epps, a Marine veteran and business owner from Arizona, traveled to Washington D.C. to show his support for former President Donald Trump on January 6, 2021.

And although he's not among the hundreds of Capitol rioters who were arrested and charged, the events that followed ruined his life, he said.

Epps, 61, became the center of a conspiracy theory, pushed by the former president himself, that would cause him to sell his business and his home and go into hiding, according to an interview he gave to The New York Times that was published Wednesday.

"And for what — lies?" Epps told The Times. "All of this, it's just been hell."

The baseless theory stemmed from attempts by some on the right to blame the Capitol riot on federal agents, who they claimed wanted a reason to provoke a crackdown on conservatives.

A video of Epps taken on January 5 showed him telling other Trump supporters they needed to go into the Capitol the following day. Epps was never arrested, prompting right-wing internet sleuths to accuse him of being an undercover FBI agent or informant trying to stir up violence — despite videos that show Epps urging others to be peaceful and trying to deescalate confrontations between police and the rioters on January 6.

The theory was eventually picked up by right-wing media and Republican politicians, including Rep. Thomas Massie and Sens. Ted Cruz and Tom Cotton, among others. Trump himself mentioned Epps's name at a rally in January, suggesting he may have been working for the feds.

Epps told The Times he and his wife began receiving death threats via email and had people trespassing on their property starting in October, when right-wing site Revolver News first published a story about it. The attacks intensified after Fox News host Tucker Carlson and lawmakers promoted the claims.

Epps eventually found shell casings on his property and received a letter, potentially a hoax, saying Mexican cartel members were planning to kill him. He ended up selling his business and home, losing hundreds of thousands of dollars, and moving into a mobile home somewhere in the Rocky Mountains. He agreed to The Times interview as long as his current location was not disclosed.

"I am at the center of this thing, and it's the biggest farce that's ever been," he said. "It's just not right. The American people are being led down a path. I think it should be criminal."

The FBI has not publicly commented on allegations that Epps was working with them or why he was not charged.

Epps said he never entered the Capitol and told The Times he immediately contacted the FBI's National Threat Operations Center two days after the Capitol riot, when he found out they had flagged him in a be-on-the-lookout alert. The outlet confirmed his phone records showed he spoke to the FBI and obtained transcripts from additional interviews.












						Republicans spread the conspiracy theory that Trump supporter Ray Epps was an undercover FBI agent who incited the Capitol riot. Epps says it ruined his life.
					

Ray Epps, a target of January 6 conspiracy theory pushed by Donald Trump himself, said he had to sell his home and business and go into hiding.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> To help pay for the investigations. There is nothing wrong with that. Are you worried?


Not worried at all.  How much did he give to the investigations?  How much did he keep?


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Not worried at all.  How much did he give to the investigations?  How much did he keep?


Ask him.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Ask him.


No need.  Just like Trump, he has kept the money for himself.  One grifter is just like any other one.

And Trump is a darn good grifter.


----------



## Lastamender (Oct 3, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> No need.  Just like Trump, he has kept the money for himself.  One grifter is just like any other one.
> 
> And Trump is a darn good grifter.


Prove it.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Finalizing this evening with the subject of this thread:

From Big Lie to Big Rip-off: The Trump campaign’s fundraising tactics are in the spotlight this week after the January 6th hearings exposed a fake “Official Election Defense Fund” that raised $250 million to pay for legal fees to overturn the 2020 presidential election results. Former Trump fixer and former personal attorney for Donald Trump, Michael Cohen, tells Michael Steele that Trump is a “menace” and “it’s sad to see that there are so many people out there that have so much faith in him, after they see exactly what is going on.”


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

If you want to see how Donald Trump’s world works, register on his campaign Web site—it’s still active. To help keep tabs on the Trump campaign’s activities, I took this step many months ago, and, since then, I’ve been receiving text messages and e-mails every day, purportedly from Trump and his sons, asking for money. After the election, I thought these fund-raising alerts might stop arriving, but they didn’t. They just changed topic. Instead of requesting donations to help reëlect the President, they asked for money to finance his flailing challenge to the results. In the past few weeks, there seem to be more texts than ever.

“Eric Trump: Almost out of time!” said one that arrived on Monday morning. “Our End-of-Month fundraising Deadline is almost here. Pres Trump activated a 1000% IMPACT for 1 HOUR. Donate.” After I failed to click the accompanying link to the WinRed online fund-raising platform, and become one of the campaign’s “IMPACT” donors, the Trumps kindly gave me another chance. “This is Don Jr.,” said a message that hit my inbox on Monday afternoon. “I spoke with my father & he’s REACTIVATED your 1000% offer for 1 more HOUR!... Donate NOW.” Again, I failed to click the link, but that didn’t get me off the hook. “Pres Trump: I UPPED the stakes & EXTENDED our End-of-Month Election Defense Deadline!” said a text that arrived the following afternoon. “All gifts in the NEXT HR will make a 1000% IMPACT! ACT!”

Alas, I never did make it onto this exclusive donor list. It’s safe to assume, however, that some of Trump’s supporters did. Since the election, according to the _Times_, the President has raised about a hundred and seventy million dollars by continuing to “aggressively solicit donations.” Trump is no stranger to high-pressure sales tactics, of course. Years before he became President, employees of his Trump University, which wasn’t a university at all, allegedly encouraged people, including the elderly, to max out their credit cards to take courses that many said were worthless. In soliciting donations, his campaign is similarly relentless. On Tuesday morning, I got another message, which said, “FINAL NOTICE! Pres Trump EXTENDED your 1000% Offer. We need YOU to help us stop this CHAOS…Donate NOW.”

After deciding to write this column, on Wednesday, I clicked on one of the fund-raising links. It took me to a WinRed Web page that featured a picture of Trump holding two thumbs up. “President Trump is counting on YOU to DEFEND the Election, so he asked us to EXTEND your 1000% offer,” said an accompanying piece of text. A bit farther down the page, there were a number of boxes with suggested donations, ranging from forty-five to twenty-eight hundred dollars. If I contributed the higher amount, the page said, I could join the “Election Defense Team,” the “Trump 100 Club,” and the “First Family Circle.”

I didn’t cough up any money, of course. But if I had done so, where exactly would it have gone? Below the suggestion boxes, a piece of text said, “Your contribution will benefit Trump Make America Great Again Committee.” That seemed straightforward enough. In the past few years, the Trump Make America Great Again Committee has raised money for the President’s campaigns and the Republican National Committee, both of which have been deeply engaged in his post-election legal battles. Many Trump supporters who made modest donations may have assumed that their money was being passed on to the election-defense fund. But it wasn’t.











						Donald Trump’s Latest Grift May Be His Most Cynical Yet
					

In fund-raising appeals to supporters, the Trump campaign is asking for donations to continue challenging the election results. But the bulk of the money appears to be going elsewhere.




					www.newyorker.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 3, 2022)

Within hours of learning that he, his family business, and three of his children were being prosecuted on civil charges for fraud, Donald Trump was trying to make money off of it.

“Can you believe it?” the former president exclaimed in a fundraising emailsent on the afternoon of September 21. “Radical New York Attorney General Letitia James is SUING ME and MY FAMILY. This is an absolute WITCH HUNT, Friend.”

Trump assured recipients of this appeal that he was “prepared to FIGHT BACK,” but just needed to know “that I have your support.” He asked supporters to “add your name IMMEDIATELY to publicly stand with me,” something that would be accomplished by going to a page that allowed for a range of contributions, with the box for a $20 donation highlighted in sky blue and shaking back and forth like a hula dancer. After a few seconds on the page, this pop-up message appears:







There is nothing new about the Maximum Grifter seizing every opportunity to raise huge sums from his gullible supporters for no clearly designated purpose, other than that it will “benefit” his Save America Joint Fundraising Committee. In recent weeks, many of these appeals have focused on the FBI serving a search warrant on August 8 at Trump’s Florida home to seize unlawfully hoarded government documents, many classified.


Here’s what Trump had to say about it in a recent fundraising email:



> Friend, You’ll never believe this. Not only did the FBI steal my passports in the FBI raid of my home, Mar-a-Lago, but it has just been learned through court filings that they also improperly took my complete and highly confidential medical file and history (at least they’ll see that I’m very healthy, an absolutely perfect physical specimen!).
> They also took my personal tax records (this is ILLEGAL) and lawyer-client privileged information – a definite NO, NO. This reminds me of the Soviet Union!
> They will NEVER stop coming after me, Friend. They’re out to get me because they’re afraid we’ll SAVE AMERICA from Joe Biden’s terrible presidency. I need YOU to go on record with what YOU think about this:


This appeal includes a one-question poll: “Do you agree that I am being politically persecuted?” This time it was the $100 box, among the many options, that was blue and dancing. Underneath this survey question was this box:






Let’s say it is a safe assumption that those who click on this option are not just being urged to donate an additional $50 automatically, but agreeing to it.

As I have discussed in a previous article, I receive messages like these from Donald Trump about a dozen times per day, having somehow found my way on to his email list. Some offer opportunities to buy merch. Some tout his rallies. Some include what appear to be defenses of his most violent supporters (“Dozens of amazing Patriots who stand for America, including wonderful young people, are being targeted and harassed by the Department of ‘Justice’ and FBI”). All ask for money.

A particularly brazen one found its way to my inbox on September 20:



> Friend,
> Pelosi is a failure.
> We know it.
> You know it.
> ...


This led to a single-question survey (“DO YOU AGREE THAT NANCY PELOSI IS A FAILURE?”) and a range of donation amount options, including a dancing $250 box.

And then there was this missive, sent September 23:



> Friend,
> I recently was at my home in Florida, Mar-a-Lago, and I saw firsthand the aftermath of the unwarranted, unjust, and illegal raid.
> Instead of focusing on solving problems for our country, the Washington Swamp has put us through one monstrous witch hunt after another:
> Russia, Russia, Russia
> ...


It goes on, ending in an appeal to “contribute $50 IMMEDIATELY to stand with me as an Official AMERICA FIRST FREEDOM DEFENDER.”

Misleading pressure tactics to compel donations are hardly uncommon in the world of political fundraising. One recent email solicitation I received from Democratic Leadership—a project of AMERIPAC, a leadership PAC that Democratic Rep. Steny Hoyer launched in 1992 to help elect members of his party to Congress—opened with this strangely hostile appeal from “Alyssa B.” regarding a survey that leads to a donation page:



> Hello Bill,
> We’re currently [14] responses short from your state in this critical poll, so I’m asking you to please respond immediately. As a top informed local Democrat, your input is vital to our polling. If our smartest Democrats like you don’t respond, I’ll have no choice but to disqualify your state from our results.


But nothing can compare to the sheer aggression of Trump’s appeals, some of which resemble a “your money or your life” stick-up. Consider this plea from a recent Trump email: “We are in the battle of our lives, Friend. If we don’t raise enough money, our nation is dead.”


(full article online )










						The Neverending Story (of Trump’s Grift)
					

Trump’s legal troubles have inspired a relentless fundraising campaign. The appeals are grandiose, petulant, cynical—and very effective.




					www.thebulwark.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 4, 2022)




----------



## Billo_Really (Oct 4, 2022)

kaz said:


> Another dumb ass leftist who doesn't recognize when you are being mocked.   This is hysterical.   Continue, please ...


Me mocked? Never happen. I'm too respected.....eventually!


----------



## Billo_Really (Oct 4, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Within hours of learning that he, his family business, and three of his children were being prosecuted on civil charges for fraud, Donald Trump was trying to make money off of it.
> 
> “Can you believe it?” the former president exclaimed in a fundraising emailsent on the afternoon of September 21. “Radical New York Attorney General Letitia James is SUING ME and MY FAMILY. This is an absolute WITCH HUNT, Friend.”
> 
> ...


You know, beer makes your posts more palatable.


----------



## kaz (Oct 5, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump is the joke and you may be the joker in training.
> 
> That is all there is to it, from all the evidence I have seen.



Nothing that isn't on CNN 85 times a day, racist


----------



## kaz (Oct 5, 2022)

Billo_Really said:


> Me mocked? Never happen. I'm too respected.....eventually!


----------



## lennypartiv (Oct 5, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Prove it.


They can't.


----------



## Jim H - VA USA (Oct 5, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.


That's okay.  It was just a meme which Trump liked.  He is quite fond of himself, but he's also got fantastic policies which work great for America.

Meanwhile, Biden is telling people he is going to run again in 2024, when it is more likely than not that he will not finish his first term.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 6, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 10, 2022)

Postmaster General Louis DeJoy has somehow managed to remain in his job, one of the last high-profile Trump holdovers, even though he has been under an ethical and legal cloud for the entirety of his tenure. We heard from one of those clouds Thursday, when a federal judge ruled that DeJoy’s changes to the U.S. Postal Service prior to the 2020 election harmed the service, but didn’t break election laws. Nonetheless, the judge blocked DeJoy from doing it again.

Federal Judge Emmet Sullivan found that the changes DeJoy made to the U.S. Postal Service in the months leading up to the 2020 elections to remove sorting machines and prevent carriers from making extra deliveries hurt mail delivery. He also found that DeJoy should not have made those operational changes unilaterally, without permission from the Postal Regulatory Commission. The judge put orders in place to prevent DeJoy from repeating those actions.

The suit was brought by Democratic-led state and local governments who argued that the slowdowns DeJoy created at the Postal Service with equipment cuts and eliminating overtime hindered those governments’ efforts to fight the COVID-19 pandemic because it impacted mail-in voting, forcing people to vote in person to ensure that their ballot was received and counted.










						Judge finds DeJoy harmed the Postal Service in 2020 election balloting interference
					

Postmaster General Louis DeJoy has somehow managed to remain in his job, one of the last high-profile Trump holdovers, even though he has been under an ethical and legal cloud for the entirety of his tenure. We heard from one of those clouds Thursday,...




					www.dailykos.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 11, 2022)




----------



## surada (Oct 11, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Trump has proven fraud to me and over half the country. You live on lies. The truth would have the same effect on you a vampire has to sunlight.



Trump is an old hand at fraud. Remember Trump University?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 11, 2022)




----------



## Whodatsaywhodat. (Oct 11, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from the new book by journalist Maggie Haberman:
> 
> 
> Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.
> ...











						Jessica❤️🤍💙🇺🇸 on TikTok
					

Jessica❤️🤍💙🇺🇸's short video with ♬ original sound




					www.tiktok.com
				




We wish.


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 11, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 13, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 13, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 13, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)

A member of the 9/11 Commission explains what the Jan. 6 committee should do next
					

Former Rep. Tim Roemer, D-Ind., who was a member of the 9/11 Commission, says that the Jan. 6 committee has skillfully created a public record of what happened in the assault on the U.S. Capitol.




					www.aol.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)

Former President Donald Trump on Friday released a letter to Rep. Bennie Thompson, D-Miss., chairman of the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6, 2021, Capitol riot, after the panel voted to subpoena Trump over his role in the insurrection.

In the 14-page letter — which includes a 10-page appendix and photos of the crowd at his rally that preceded the attack — Trump rants about the committee’s investigation and repeats false claims about the 2020 election. But the former president did not say whether he would comply with a subpoena.
-----

The letter, which was released a day after the committee’s 10th and potentially final public hearing, did not directly address Thursday’s presentation, including the dramatic video showing congressional leaders — including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., — sheltering in an undisclosed location as a violent mob of Trump’s supporters stormed through the halls of Capitol.

In the footage, Pelosi and then-Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., are seen at the height of the violence, calling various Trump administration officials to ask for help from federal law enforcement and requesting that they deploy the National Guard.

In his letter, Trump claims that he “fully authorized” National Guard troops to be present at the Capitol before Jan. 6, but that Democrats, including Pelosi, refused the authorization.

However, there is no record of Trump authorizing National Guard troops to be at the U.S. Capitol before the attack, and no evidence that Democrats denied such a request.

Christopher Miller, who was serving as acting defense secretary on the day of the insurrection, testified to the committee that Trump never gave an order to have National Guard troops ready.

(full article online)









						Trump releases letter to Jan. 6 committee ranting about its investigation
					

The former president's letter to Rep. Bennie Thompson, chairman of the House select committee investigating the U.S. Capitol insurrection, came in response to the panel voting to subpoena him.




					www.aol.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)

Read Trump's Jan. 6 Speech, A Key Part Of Impeachment Trial
					

The former president's remarks are being used by Democrats hoping to convict him for incitement of insurrection — and are being defended by his lawyers in the Senate proceedings.




					www.npr.org


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)

TIMELINE: From a presidential speech to insurrection, here's how the Capitol riots evolved
					

It took about an hour from the time rioters arrived at the Capitol to breach all police barricades and overtake the legislative building.




					www.wusa9.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 14, 2022)

Trump summoned supporters to "wild" protest, and told them to fight. They did
					

The chaos in the U.S. Capitol on Wednesday unfolded after President Donald Trump spent weeks whipping up his supporters with false allegations of fraud in the Nov. 3 election, culminating in a call to march to the building that represents U.S. democracy.




					www.reuters.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 15, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 17, 2022)

[ If that happens, that goes his 2024 candidacy, or any other ]

Neal Katyal, a former Justice Department official, thinks former President Donald Trump's written response to the House panel's intention to subpoena him looks like an insanity defense.

Katyal — a law professor and an Obama-era acting solicitor general — made an appearance on NBC on Sunday, three days after the House panel investigating the Capitol riot unanimously voted to subpoena Trump. The subpoena will compel the former president to cooperate with the committee or be held in contempt of Congress and referred to the DOJ for prosecution — much like Trump allies Steve Bannon and Peter Navarro.

In response to the decision, Trump sent a document to the panel that started off with the sentence, "THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION OF 2020 WAS RIGGED AND STOLEN!" and contained multiple baseless claims of election fraud. It also included four photos of the crowd near the Washington Monument on January 6, 2021.

"Yeah, so, this is a 14-page screed, Jonathan, that's very hard to follow. But it does seem to dig the hole in deeper for Donald Trump," Katyal told MSNBC host Jonathan Capehart.

"I can't see it in any legal way helping him unless he is trying to go for the insanity defense, of which this paper seems, you know, to be some evidence of," Katyal added.

Katyal added that he thought it was a "pretty fanciful" idea that Trump would just give in and testify to the panel because of the congressional subpoena.

"I mean, this is a man who took the Fifth Amendment more than 400 times the last time he was questioned under oath. And I doubt he's suddenly become eager to testify," Katyal said.

Katyal was referencing Trump's deposition in New York in August during New York Attorney General Leticia James' probe of the Trump Organization's business practices, during which he pleaded the Fifth more than 440 times and only answered a question about what his name was.

Katyal also added that he thinks Attorney General Merrick Garland will indict Trump, seeing as there is overwhelming evidence to do so and "no contrition whatsoever" on Trump's part.

A representative at Trump's post-presidential press office did not immediately respond to Insider's request for comment.











						Former DOJ official says Trump's reaction to the January 6 panel is starting to look like the makings of an insanity defense
					

Neal Katyal, an ex-DOJ official, shared his view on former President Donald Trump's written response to the House panel's intention to subpoena him over the Jan. 6 insurrection at the U.S. Capitol.




					www.aol.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 17, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 18, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Oct 20, 2022)

Former President Donald Trump lashed out at a judge who found that Trump knowingly pushed false claims of voter fraud while fighting his loss to President Joe Biden.
U.S. District Judge David Carter ordered pro-Trump attorney John Eastman to turn over dozens of documents to the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6 Capitol riot.
They include emails that “demonstrate an effort by President Trump and his attorneys to press false claims in federal court for the purpose of delaying the January 6 vote,” Carter wrote.

(full article online)









						Trump lashes out at judge who said former president knowingly pushed false voter fraud case
					

U.S. District Judge David Carter ordered pro-Trump attorney John Eastman to turn over dozens of documents to the House probe of the Jan. 6 Capitol riot.




					www.cnbc.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 20, 2022)

Today, federal judge David Carter ruled that John Eastman’s emails, which he has been fighting to protect from the January 6 committee’s subpoena since January of this year, must be turned over. Eastman argued that he was Trump’s attorney, and the communications were protected by the attorney-client privilege. Judge Carter disagreed and found that the privilege didn’t apply because of the crime-fraud exception. You can read his full order here.


This is not a criminal judgment against the former president. This is a civil case and the issue before Judge Carter is whether to enforce the subpoena the J6C sent to Eastman. We should not overread it. It doesn’t mean an indictment of Trump will automatically follow. But it is still highly significant. Judge Carter’s 18-page opinion is careful and deliberate. He’s not taking any leaps of faith to stretch to his conclusions that some of these emails were about committing crimes, namely obstruction of Congress and a conspiracy to defraud the government. It’s the measured approach Judge Carter takes that’s so compelling here. He could have gone further, but he didn’t. And the emails that Congress will now have access to are deeply damaging to the former president.

Who is John Eastman? This is how he’s described in the court’s order: Plaintiff Dr. John Eastman (“Dr. Eastman”), a former law school dean at Chapman University (“Chapman”), is a “political conservative who supported former President [Donald] Trump” and a self-described “activist law professor.” While he was a professor at Chapman, Dr. Eastman worked with President Trump and his campaign on legal and political strategy regarding the November 3, 2020 election.

More than 500 disputed emails, each of which the Judge reviewed, are involved in this order. After his review, he reached this conclusion: the crime-fraud exception applies to a number of emails related to President Trump and Dr. Eastman’s (1) court efforts to delay or disrupt the January 6 vote; and (2) their knowing misrepresentation of voter fraud numbers in Georgia when seeking to overturn the election results in federal court.

The attorney-client privilege protects confidential communications between attorney and clients, so long as they are made for the purpose of facilitating the provision of professional legal advice. To be confidential, communications must be limited to attorney and client, or in some cases their representatives. They must be for the purpose of seeking legal advice. If communications are used to commit or are in furtherance of crimes, they lose the protection the privilege normally provides.

That’s what happened here. The procedure is a little bit complicated. First, the Judge decided that 536 of the communications he reviewed were protected by either the attorney-client privilege or because they were attorney work product (to which the crime-fraud exception also applies). Second, he had to consider whether any of those documents should be disclosed to the committee, nonetheless, because they went afoul of the crime-fraud exception.

There’s a two-part legal test used to decide when the crime-fraud exception applies. The client must have consulted an attorney “for advice that will serve [them] in the commission of a fraud or crime,” and the communications must be both “sufficiently related to” and made “in furtherance of” the crime. It doesn’t matter whether the defendant successfully pulled off the crime or not, it’s the abuse of the confidential relationship between lawyer and client that shuts off the protection these communications would normally receive.

Judge Carter found in earlier proceedings that Trump had, more likely than not been involved in:

·      A plan to obstruct Congress’s official proceedings to confirm the electoral college vote on January 6, 2021, and

·      A conspiracy to defraud the United States

when he consulted Eastman. So, his consideration here involved whether the communications were sufficiently related to and in furtherance of those two crimes. He concluded there were eight documents where the crime-fraud exception applied.

That may be sound like a small percentage of the total number of communications, but it’s an astonishing conclusion to reach regarding a then-sitting president of the United States. Eight communications indicates an ongoing course of conduct instead of an inquiry that was quickly abandoned. And there were still more documents that the Judge considered to be “close calls” —for instance, some were related to disrupting the January 6 vote, but that the Court couldn’t “conclusively determine” furthered the obstruction—and didn’t order disclosed. But there was no question in Judge Carter’s mind about the eight.

There are four communications in which Eastman and other attorneys suggest that the primary goal of filing lawsuits “is to delay or otherwise disrupt the January 6 vote.” In one of the emails, Trump’s attorneys advise that “merely” having a case pending in the Supreme Court may delay consideration of Georgia’s election results. Judge Carter concludes Trump filed suits, not to get legal relief he was entitled to, but to disrupt the certification of the election. He finds that the communications Eastman tried to withhold from the committee were in furtherance of the obstruction. In other words, they were all involved in committing that crime together.

Judge Carter ruled that four additional emails involved the effort by Trump and his attorneys to make false claims in federal court to delay the January 6 vote. He says there is evidence of this in at least one Georgia lawsuit. In my experience with Alabama elections, Republicans spend a lot of time on claims Democrats engage in voter fraud. A lot of their complaints center on unfounded allegations of dead people, people with prior felony convictions, and unregistered people voting. That’s what Trump argued in Georgia. He attached specific numbers to each of the claims: 10,315 deceased people, 2,560 felons, and 2.423 unregistered people. He did it first in a lawsuit filed in state court in Georgia in early December and then again, in a lawsuit filed in federal court in Georgia to challenge the election.

Before the federal case was filed, Eastman relayed what the Court calls “concerns” about the specific numbers and Trump’s “resistance” to signing when the specific numbers were included. Eastman explained in one of the communications he tried to withhold from the committee that after signing the Georgia state complaint, Trump had “since been made aware that some of the allegations (and evidence proffered by the experts) has been inaccurate.”

Nonetheless, Trump attached a signed verification to the federal lawsuit when it was filed, attesting that the information in it was correct, or at least believed to be to the best of the his knowledge, as he had previously done with the state lawsuit. And that’s a serious problem because before the federal case was filed, Eastman communicated that the numbers were made up junk. Those numbers were still incorporated into the federal complaint and attested to by Trump, without any effort to correct or delete them. Judge Carter concludes, “The emails show that President Trump knew that the specific numbers of voter fraud were wrong but continued to tout those numbers, both in court and to the public. The Court finds that these emails are sufficiently related to and in furtherance of a conspiracy to defraud the United States” and orders Eastman to disclose these four, along with the earlier four communications to the committee.

Eastman managed to delay the committee’s work for nine months at a critical juncture in the nation’s history. That delay is likely not over—he could still appeal. But this ruling should be all that both the Justice Department and Fani Willis, the Fulton County DA, need to get to work on these materials if they weren’t already on it. The devil is always in the details, but it sounds as though these documents go a long way towards establishing Trump’s intent to obstruct the January 6 election certification and specifically, the count of the Georgia votes. It’s more proof, and from the mouth of his own attorney, that he knew the Big Lie was a Big Lie. The wheels of justice may move slowly, but they do move. They moved a lot today.











						The Attorney-Client Privilege Doesn't Apply To Committing Crimes
					

Today, federal judge David Carter ruled that John Eastman’s emails, which he has been fighting to protect from the January 6 committee’s subpoena since January of this year, must be turned over. Eastman argued that he was Trump’s attorney, and the communications were protected by the...




					joycevance.substack.com


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## surada (Oct 20, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> All kinds of evidence was never investigated. The election was stolen. Public opinion is on Trump's side, not yours.



Trump should have provided evidence. He couldn't. Accusations aren't enough.


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

#TheFinal5: Michael Fanone on 1/6, “Hold the Line”​He’s been front and center as one of the strongest advocates for his fellow law enforcement officers after the Capitol riots, and now former Metropolitan Police Department Officer Michael Fanone is sharing his story in the new book “Hold the Line.” He joins Jim on "The Final 5" to talk about January 6th, what his life has been like after being attacked by pro-Trump rioters, and what he’d like to see happen to prevent another attempted insurrection.










						#TheFinal5: Michael Fanone on 1/6, “Hold the Line”
					

He’s been front and center as one of the strongest advocates for his fellow law enforcement officers after the Capitol riots, and now former Metropolitan Police Department Officer Michael Fanone is sharing his story in the new book “Hold the Line.” He joins Jim on "The Final 5" to talk about...




					www.fox5dc.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

A log of text messages sent and received by former Sen. Kelly Loeffler during the weeks leading up to the Jan. 6 Capitol attack is raising questions about potentially unauthorized access to investigative material relevant to probes of the 2020 election.

The messages, reviewed by POLITICO, shed light on Loeffler’s shifting political calculus as she weighed whether to lodge a challenge to the 2020 results at the urging of then-President Donald Trump. She announced she would challenge the results but ultimately decided against it as a violent mob ransacked the Capitol one day after she lost her reelection bid to Sen. Raphael Warnock (D-Ga.).

The 59-page log of 405 texts was obtained by media organizations via an anonymous sender who declined to reveal more details about the source of the messages, which begin on Nov. 8, 2020 and end Feb. 3, 2021. The document, which POLITICO is not publishing in full because it contains unauthenticated as well as authenticated conversations, focuses only on Loeffler’s election-related correspondence. It’s unclear if all of her messages sent on the subject are included, or just a selection.

Notably, the log of texts was sent as a report from Cellebrite, a service typically used by investigators to extract digital data from cell phones. The nature of the document suggests Loeffler’s phone may have been subpoenaed, otherwise provided to prosecutors or accessed as part of defense-related activity in one of several ongoing probes of Trump’s attempts to influence 2020 election results.

(full article online)









						Loeffler's texts post-2020 election go public, raising new investigative questions
					

The nature of the document that's circulating suggests the former Georgia GOP senator's phone may have been deemed relevant to probes of the 2020 election.




					www.politico.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

In the lead-up to Jan. 6, 2021, Kelly Loeffler — then a Republican senator from Georgia — found herself at the center of Donald Trump's efforts to subvert the 2020 presidential election results in her state.
At the time, Loeffler was in the midst of a tight runoff for re-election against Raphael Warnock, who won more votes than she did in a special election weeks earlier (and was en route to doing so again — his win on Jan. 5 capped her Senate career at just over a year).

Loeffler got desperate. 

She latched on to Trump’s baseless claims of election fraud in Georgia, and followed his lead in condemning fellow Republicans — like Georgia's Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger — who refused to fall in line. Now, thanks to a tranche of text messages obtained by The Atlanta Journal Constitution, we can see some of the frenzied and furious messages Loeffler is believed to have received while Trump world figures plotted their attempted coup with her in mind. 

The AJC received the texts in a document sent by an anonymous source. The newspaper confirmed the veracity of the texts with four people who were participants in the conversations. Neither NBC News nor MSNBC has independently verified the texts. 

In a statement to the newspaper, a spokeswoman for Loeffler called the public disclosure of the texts a “desperate attempt to distract voters 20 days from the election.”

Here are some of the most significant messages Loeffler received, according to the paper.
*Mrs. Raffensperger goes off *​One message, which apparently never got a reply from Loeffler, came from Raffensperger’s wife, Tricia. In it, she teed off on Loeffler for issuing a statement calling on Raffensperger to resign. 
In her message, Tricia Raffensperger said she holds Loeffler “personally responsible” for anything that happens to her family as a result of Loeffler’s lies, and she declared Loeffler "not worthy" of being a senator for helping spread Trump's lies. 
Brad Raffensperger testified to the House Jan. 6 Committee that he and his family faced death threats for his refusal to help Trump falsely declare himself the winner in Georgia.
*Marge in the middle*​Some of the most damning texts — the ones that seem to have the most legal liability attached to them — reportedly came from far-right then-Congresswoman-elect Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia. 

The Journal Constitution published texts Greene reportedly sent to Loeffler on Dec. 2, 2020, discussing “a plan we are developing” to challenge Joe Biden’s Electoral College votes on Jan. 6, and asking Loeffler to assist from the Senate. Weeks later, on Dec. 20, Greene reportedly texted Loeffler again with an invitation to a White House meeting where she, Trump and Trump’s legal team intended to discuss the plan. 

Those texts could implicate Greene in Trump's seemingly criminal scheme if investigators show she knowingly engaged in this cockamamie plan. Evidence overwhelmingly shows Trump knew his claims of election fraud — which he used as the basis of his plot to overthrow the election — were false. Multiple White House officials told congressional investigators that they had informed Trump voter fraud didn’t cost him the election. Lawsuits challenging the vote count were repeatedly tossed out of court. And on Thursday, a federal judge confirmed Trump signed on to a federal lawsuit challenging the vote count in Georgia despite knowing the allegations at the heart of the suit were false. 

That suit was filed in December, around the time Greene and other Team Trump members were discussing their anti-democratic plot to keep Trump in power.
*Internal squabbles over Jan. 6*​Other reported texts, apparently showing discussions among Loeffler’s team about whether to vote against certifying Biden’s victory on Jan. 6, seem to reveal some of Loeffler’s own staffers pushing back on the plan.

As pro-Trump rioters stormed the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, one of Loeffler's campaign advisers reportedly said, “This is a tinderbox and it’s beyond politics now. ... This objection will not ultimately prove to change anything but it will feed into the violence and condone it.”

Loeffler ultimately voted to confirm the results that day. But she also continued to target Raffensperger after being ousted from the Senate, calling for him to be investigated and questioning the legitimacy of the 2020 elections. 










						Marjorie Taylor Greene helped run point on 2020 election plot, reported texts show
					

A new report suggests Greene played a prominent role in pressuring a Georgia senator to go along with efforts to subvert the last presidential election.




					www.msnbc.com


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## lennypartiv (Oct 21, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Other reported texts, apparently showing discussions among Loeffler’s team about whether to vote against certifying Biden’s victory on Jan. 6, seem to reveal some of Loeffler’s own staffers pushing back on the plan.
> 
> As pro-Trump rioters stormed the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, one of Loeffler's campaign advisers reportedly said, “This is a tinderbox and it’s beyond politics now. ... This objection will not ultimately prove to change anything but it will feed into the violence and condone it.”
> 
> Loeffler ultimately voted to confirm the results that day. But she also continued to target Raffensperger after being ousted from the Senate, calling for him to be investigated and questioning the legitimacy of the 2020 elections.


Loeffler appears to be a RINO now.  Actions speak louder than words.


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

Despite his claims, former President Donald Trump privately conceded he lost to Joe Biden, according to video testimony from former administration officials. He also took dramatic steps to potentially withdraw troops from Afghanistan, steps that the committee showed he knew he had lost and wanted to make the move before incoming President Joe Biden took office.

(full article online)









						Trump Knew He Lost the Election, Aides Testify
					

Despite his claims, former President Donald Trump privately conceded he lost to Joe Biden, according to video testimony from former administration officials. He also took dramatic steps to potentially withdraw troops from Afghanistan, steps that the committee showed he knew he had lost and wanted to




					www.wsj.com


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## skye (Oct 21, 2022)

This thread is dripping with TDS!


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

Cassidy Hutchinson, a former aide to White House chief of staff Mark Meadows, testified that Donald Trump said he didn't want Americans to know that he lost the 2020 election and that he urged Meadows to "figure it out" to prevent the results from "embarrassing" him.

In a new video played during Thursday's public hearing held by the House committee investigating the January 6, 2021, Capitol riot, Hutchinson said at one point she asked Meadows, "Does the president really think that he lost?"

Meadows replied that Trump had told him "a lot of the time" that he knew he lost the election but that "he wants to keep fighting."


"[Trump] knows it's over. He knows he lost. But we're going to keep trying. There are some good options out there still," Meadows told Hutchinson.

Asked what had happened after the Supreme Court declined to take up his election case, Hutchinson described seeing Trump as being "fired up" and "just raging" when he found out about the decision.

According to Hutchinson, the former president "said something to the effect of 'I don't want people to know we lost, Mark. This is embarrassing. Figure it out. We need to figure it out. I don't want people to know that we lost.'" She said she was present during the conversation.

On December 11, 2020, the Supreme Court rejected a lawsuit filed in Texas that challenged the election results in Georgia, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin that Trump saw as "his last chance at success in the courts," according to Representative Adam Kinzinger, an Illinois Republican.


(full article online )










						Trump said he didn't want Americans to know "we lost": Cassidy Hutchinson
					

"I don't want people to know we lost, Mark. This is embarrassing," Trump allegedly told former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows.




					www.newsweek.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

Alyssa Farah and Cassidy Hutchinson tell January 6 panel former president acknowledged he had been defeated by Joe Biden

(full article online)









						Trump privately admitted he lost 2020 election, top aides testify
					

Alyssa Farah and Cassidy Hutchinson tell January 6 panel former president acknowledged he had been defeated by Joe Biden




					www.theguardian.com


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 21, 2022)

skye said:


> This thread is dripping with TDS!


It is preferable to all of those threads which drip of
those who have :

"Given Up Their Minds and Souls To A Dictator Wannabe "

Never listen to him saying that he KNEW that he had LOST the election.  Fairly.

Or ALL of his Aides and others who also knew that he had lost the election.

The Man who Hates losing.  Because it "Embarrasses him" to lose.

The Republicans in Congress knew he had lost.  Which is why they Certified Joe Biden on January 6th.


Repeat the nonsense of TDS, which is nothing more than an imitation of BDS, for GW Bush.

Republicans have absolutely nothing original to offer.

Long live Trump, or he will die of embarrassment and no one paying attention to him.

  And not paying attention to him means not being able to make money off of those who will follow him and donate to him, no matter what.



LLGT !!

Long Live Grifter Trump !!!


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## skye (Oct 21, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> It is preferable to all of those threads which drip of
> those who have :
> 
> "Given Up Their Minds and Souls To A Dictator Wannabe "
> ...



Wake up!


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## lennypartiv (Oct 21, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Or ALL of his Aides and others who also knew that he had lost the election.


Trump saw the stolen election coming.


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## dudmuck (Oct 21, 2022)

skye said:


> Wake up!
> 
> View attachment 713807


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 22, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Trump saw the stolen election coming.


He always sees something coming.  He has a crystal ball and always says that if he does not win, be it in 2016 or 2020, that the election was rigged against him.

He went to over 60 courts, and then the SC and they could not care less about the lack of proof he had his lawyers show to those Judges.

No evidence, means that there is no evidence, because it did not happen.

Wanting to stay in power, by being elected, is different from wanting to stay in power by alleging you are going to have the election stolen from you, which he started alleging in July of 2020, way before the elections happened.

Can Trump see the results of all the evidence against him from trying to manipulate the 2020 elections to being the mastermind of 1/6/20, to having taken documents from the WH he had no right to take?


What is his Crystal Ball saying to him?


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 22, 2022)

2/ Judge Carter ruled the crime-fraud exception to the attorney-client privilege applies to 8 emails related to Trump & Eastman’s lawsuits to delay/disrupt the 1-6 vote & knowing misrepresentation of voter fraud numbers in a fed'l case in GA trying to overturn the election.

3/ 8 may be sound like a small percent of the over 500 emails Judge Carter reviewed but it’s an astonishing conclusion to reach regarding a then-sitting president of the United States. It shows an ongoing course of criminality, not an inquiry that was quickly abandoned.

4/ Trump signed a verification to the fed'l lawsuit attesting that the information in it was correct to the best of his knowledge. That’s serious, because before the federal case was filed, Eastman communicated that the numbers were made up junk.

5/ if you're interested in how the crime-fraud exception to attorney-client privilege worked here, how much trouble Trump is in, & what it means for ongoing criminal investigations against him, I discuss topics like this in my newsletter, civil discourse.


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 22, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Trump saw the stolen election coming.


And he can see the consequences of his actions coming.


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 22, 2022)




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## bripat9643 (Oct 22, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from the new book by journalist Maggie Haberman:
> 
> 
> Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.
> ...


Why should anyone believe a NYT journalist?


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 22, 2022)

bripat9643 said:


> Why should anyone believe a NYT journalist?


Why should anyone believe you?


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## Sixties Fan (Oct 23, 2022)

We’ve been discussing, with good reason, the mounting legal problems the former president faces. It’s not just DOJ’s Big Lie/Insurrection investigation, it’s Mar-a-Lago, and it’s the possibility of contempt if Trump fails to comply with a Congressional subpoena. His company goes to trial this coming week, he faces a February trial in the E. Jean Carroll defamation case, the New York AG is after him civilly, the Fulton County, Georgia district attorney is investigating him criminally. There are so many that I’ve probably left out a few.
But in many of these investigations, it’s not just Trump who’s on the minds of prosecutors, and certainly not when it comes to the January 6 committee. If the (possibly) final hearing made anything clear, it’s that the committee has a conspiracy’s worth of targets in sight. That shouldn’t come as much of a surprise with Obama-era U.S. Attorney Tim Heaphy in place as Chief Investigation Counsel for the Committee. And Heaphy onboarded a staff flush with former prosecutors.

Prosecutors think conspiracy any time they see two or more people involved in a potential crime. Committee members seem to be thinking conspiracy too. In previous hearings, Liz Cheney invoked specific crimes, like conspiring to obstruct the electoral vote certification, and she squarely rejected the idea that Trump was being led by people around him. Instead, the committee had a laser beam focus on Trump’s central role in events. In the subpoena they sent to him on Friday, they clarified any doubt. In their view of the evidence, he “personally orchestrated and oversaw” the conspiracy..





In the federal system, there are numerous conspiracy charges prosecutors can choose from when it comes to indicting. Some are general and used across a broad spectrum of crimes. Others are more specific, like civil rights conspiracies or drug conspiracies. There is the seditious conspiracy statute currently being used to prosecute members of the Oath Keepers and the Proud Boys in connection with the insurrection. That statute requires proof of an agreement to use force in some way to interfere with, in the case of the militia groups, the transfer of power to the new administration. Publicly there is scant evidence that Trump himself entered into an agreement involving the use of force. While DOJ may have more, it would need to rise to the level of proof beyond a reasonable doubt. That could develop if the seditious conspiracy trials currently underway lead to more evidence and to cooperating witnesses. But, leaving seditious conspiracy aside, the more general conspiracy statute is something Trump’s lawyers have to be very concerned about at this point.

We’ve talked about the general conspiracy statute, 18 USC 371, before on Civil Discourse, using my very helpful chickens to illustrate key points about the law.
https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch...436b-090a-4285-8e1a-11481aa07077_452x802.jpeg
The basic gist of the statute is that it’s a crime for two or more people to agree to violate the law. The second prong of 18 USC 371 also makes it a crime “if two or more persons conspire . . . to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose.” That clause can also be used to address interference with governmental functions.
To convict on this charge, prosecutors would need to be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that (1) the defendant entered into an agreement, (2) to obstruct a lawful function of the Government, (3) by deceitful or dishonest means, and (4) committed at least one overt act in furtherance of the conspiracy. The notion of impeding a government function is broad. The statute doesn’t place limits on the methods a defendant uses to defraud the United States and extends generally to any interference with a lawful governmental function by dishonest means.

If interfering with certification of a presidential election doesn’t count as a violation of this statute, I don’t know what would. It’s the poster child for the crime.

So far, there is no direct evidence that Trump entered the conspiracy, at least not in public view. We don’t have a witness who will testify that he agreed with Trump or was there when Trump and others agreed to overturn the election. But there is plenty of circumstantial evidence and the absence of direct evidence isn’t a bar to a prosecution. You may not have a witness who can testify that they saw it snowing (direct evidence) but if you have one who can testify there was no snow on the ground when they went to sleep and the ground was covered in snow when they woke up six hours later, you have strong circumstantial evidence. Add in evidence that no one saw big trucks bringing in snow overnight and your evidence is getting very solid. That’s what the January 6 committee’s case against Trump is about. It’s a layering of circumstantial evidence into proof. It’s drawing inferences from Trump’s own statements about not accepting election results unless he won, and his campaign manager Brad Parscale’s testifying there was talk of claiming victory despite defeat as early as July of 2020. There is Trump’s refusal to call off his supporters as they overran the Capitol. There is so much more. The committee has neatly packaged up all of that circumstantial evidence, tied a big red ribbon around it, and presented it to DOJ.
The maximum sentence for a violation of 18 USC 371 is 5 years. While that might not seem like much, it’s a long time for someone in their late seventies. And I remain convinced Trump is likely to be indicted in connection with the documents found at Mar-a-Lago.

Whether or not DOJ will eventually charge Trump with a conspiracy is a different question, one they will answer on their own timeline, as the Attorney General has repeatedly said. They could be considering other charges as well.

There has been lots of criticism of Merrick Garland. Some people think he’s weak or slow. Others have said he’s afraid to charge Trump or that he’s too much of an institutionalist to do so. Although I still have questions about why DOJ doesn’t appear to have aggressively investigated the insurrection during Garland’s first year in office, I think the criticism that he’s too much of an institutionalist actually highlights one of his strengths, and perhaps, even the reason President Biden selected him for the job. At a time when one party is willing to burn down our institutions to hold onto power, we need someone who steadfastly believes the rule of law still matters.

One suspects Merrick Garland would have rather done anything than be the first Attorney General to indict a former president. The risk, of course, is becoming a banana republic where parties in power routinely prosecute their political opponents. But Trump’s conduct is so singular, and there is so much of it, that it is going to have to be addressed if the rule of law is going to continue to mean something in this country.

If Garland does prosecute, he’ll do it in a careful way precisely because of his commitment to the institutions. He won’t be out to get anyone; he’ll be out to do justice. He’ll do it in a way that is respectful of defendants’ rights, no matter what they’ve done and whether it’s the former president of the United States or other members of any conspiracy he may charge. That, of course, won’t be enough to make the former president’s fans happy, but it should be enough for the rest of the country. It will mean that in the face of great danger to the country, we got it right.

There are still so many unknowns. The clock is ticking, and Trump has an unpleasant knack for slipping out from underneath accountability. Whether he’s ultimately prosecuted or not, the committee has placed him squarely in a leadership role in the January 6 conspiracy. Trump is the drug kingpin of the insurrection.

Now, Trump can respond to those allegations and tell his side of the story by testifying in front of the committee. It’s unlikely he will—it would be more Trump’s style to demand an open mic and a televised appearance in front of the country than agree to the same questioning procedure with committee professional staff used with other witnesses. It’s not difficult to imagine he will refuse to show up if his demands aren’t met. But one way or the other, there will be a record of his response—ignoring a Congressional subpoena or complying with it, testifying under oath or refusing to do so. And we will all be able to draw the obvious conclusions from that.










						The January 6 Committee Lays Out A Conspiracy
					

Will DOJ take them up on it?




					joycevance.substack.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 23, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 23, 2022)

[ Trump seems to be afraid of Pence two years before the 2024 elections.  And still very unforgiving.  How I miss the good old days, quite recent, when elections were thought about the year of the election ]

Donald Trump has complained that it would be “very disloyal” if former Vice President Mike Penceor any other member of his Cabinet decided to run against him in the GOP primary for the 2024 presidential race.

The comment was startking, given the former president’s silence for hours as his supporters rampaged through the Capitol Jan. 6 last year calling for Pence to be hanged if he didn’t follow Trump’s orders to overthrow the presidential vote.

“Many of them have said they would never run if I run, so we’ll see whether or not that turns out to be true,” the former president said Thursday, referring to his Cabinet members, in a phone interview with Fox News Radio host Brian Kilmeade.

“I think it would be very disloyal if they did,” Trump added.


(full article online )

While a frontrunner among Republican voters in possible matchups, Trump falsely boasted to Kilmeade that polls “have me leading by 40, 50 points” against contenders. Trump said he’ll decide whether to run for the presidency again “in the not-too-distant future.”









						Trump Says 2024 GOP Presidential Primary Run By Mike Pence Would Be 'Very Disloyal'
					

Trump tries to reduce GOP presidential primary field with complaints of disloyalty.




					www.yahoo.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 24, 2022)




----------



## Arresmillao (Oct 24, 2022)

Nostra said:


> Trump trolls you morons so easily.


*Trump was a blessing in disguise for democrats, he was the only republican that Biden would be able to defeat, and indeed he did, destroying him by over 7 million votes. The only reason Biden was nominated was the fact that right wing MAGA radicals were salivating at the prospect that Bernie was going to be nominated, giving them a big target, however progressives figured it out, changed course and elected Biden. Biden is again playing his cards, he knows that he can not run again due to his frail physical condition, but he won't decline his intentions to run for re-election until after trump commits to run for the job, then who ever the Democrats nominate will easily beat trump who is currently involved in a plethora of criminal cases.




*


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 24, 2022)

Arresmillao said:


> *Trump was a blessing in disguise for democrats, he was the only republican that Biden would be able to defeat, and indeed he did, destroying him by over 7 million votes. The only reason Biden was nominated was the fact that right wing MAGA radicals were salivating at the prospect that Bernie was going to be nominated, giving them a big target, however progressives figured it out, changed course and elected Biden. Biden is again playing his cards, he knows that he can not run again due to his frail physical condition, but he won't decline his intentions to run for re-election until after trump commits to run for the job, then who ever the Democrats nominate will easily beat trump who is currently involved in a plethora of criminal cases.
> 
> View attachment 714923*


Trump was not a blessing to America, to Republicans or Democrats, etc.

Trump was a blessing for those who wanted to take voting rights, women's rights, and any and all human rights away from the American population.


Biden is in no "frail" condition, this is the Republicans trying to gaslight the Democrats based on their own edited videos to make Biden look weak.

We do not know what will be what in 2024.  There is a need to stop with looking so far ahead and stick to the present.


----------



## Arresmillao (Oct 24, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump was not a blessing to America, to Republicans or Democrats, etc.
> 
> Trump was a blessing for those who wanted to take voting rights, women's rights, and any and all human rights away from the American population.
> 
> ...


*I do agree trump is an idiot, but has created chaos in America, and has enabled the radical fringe of the right wing to spread idiotic nonsense. Good news is that his days as a ruling tyrant are over...



*


----------



## lennypartiv (Oct 24, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Donald Trump has complained that it would be “very disloyal” if former Vice President Mike Penceor any other member of his Cabinet decided to run against him in the GOP primary for the 2024 presidential race.


Trump deserves to be president again since the 2020 election was stolen from him.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 25, 2022)

Former President Trump responded angrily to Sunday's edition of '60 Minutes.'
The documentary featured the Dominion Voting Systems CEO rebutting Trump's claims.
He didn't directly address its arguments, but claimed the show was part of a plot against him.










						Trump raged against '60 Minutes' after it featured Dominion's CEO calmly dismissing his election-fraud theories
					

Dominion Voting CEO John Poulos offered a point-by-point argument against the election-fraud disinformation pushed by the former president.




					www.yahoo.com


----------



## Faun (Oct 25, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Trump deserves to be president again since the 2020 election was stolen from him.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 26, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Oct 27, 2022)

Mark Meadows ordered to testify in Georgia election interference investigation
					

The former Trump chief of staff has already tried to dodge attempts to talk about January 6.




					www.motherjones.com


----------



## toobfreak (Oct 27, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.



More like it tells YOUR state of mind.  Apparently, you are dim enough to actually believe Trump will be running for office in 2048 when he is 100 years old.


----------



## toobfreak (Oct 27, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Mark Meadows ordered to testify in Georgia election interference investigation
> 
> 
> The former Trump chief of staff has already tried to dodge attempts to talk about January 6.
> ...



I can save you the trouble, Meadows wasn't there that day nor tried to break in.  Anything else is just another fishing expedition treating people as guilty until proven innocent by digging and digging LOOKING for a crime.

Maybe we should send a bunch of police and FBI to your home right now and go fishing all through your house, your phone records, bank accounts and tax returns?  After all, they might find something they can charge you with!  Just like the J6 committee!


----------



## sartre play (Oct 27, 2022)

Mac1958 said:


> Literally, for many of them.  Because cult.


This is creepy, God said to put no man before him.


----------



## Mac1958 (Oct 27, 2022)

sartre play said:


> This is creepy, God said to put no man before him.


Maybe they've grown tired of waiting for Jesus to return.  Who knows.  But they've flushed the whole "morality" thing now, that's for sure.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 1, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 1, 2022)

The Supreme Court on Tuesday refused to halt a lower court order requiring Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham to testify before a Georgia grand jury investigating efforts by former President Donald Trump and his allies to reverse the outcome of the 2020 presidential election in the state, clearing the way for him to answer questions before the panel.

In a brief, unsigned order, the Supreme Court said that lower courts "assumed that the informal investigative fact-finding that Senator Graham assertedly engaged in constitutes legislative activity protected by the Speech or Debate Clause ... and they held that Senator Graham may not be questioned about such activities. The lower courts also made clear that Senator Graham may return to the district court should disputes arise regarding the application of the Speech or Debate Clause immunity to specific questions. Accordingly, a stay or injunction is not necessary to safeguard the Senator's Speech or Debate Clause immunity."









__





						Reconstruction and Its Aftermath - The African American Odyssey: A Quest for Full Citizenship | Exhibitions (Library of Congress)
					

After the Civil War, African Americans were allowed to vote, actively participate in politics, acquire land, seek employment, and use public accommodations. Opponents soon began to find means for eroding these gains.



					www.loc.gov


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 1, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> The Supreme Court on Tuesday refused to halt a lower court order requiring Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham to testify before a Georgia grand jury investigating efforts by former President Donald Trump and his allies to reverse the outcome of the 2020 presidential election in the state, clearing the way for him to answer questions before the panel.


Wanting to "stop the steal" is not reversing the outcome.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 1, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Wanting to "stop the steal" is not reversing the outcome.


Stop the steal was a lie.  Trump knew it then. He knows it now.  All in Congress know it.   

It was with the purpose of reversing the outcome of the election. 










						Trump privately admitted he lost 2020 election, top aides testify
					

Alyssa Farah and Cassidy Hutchinson tell January 6 panel former president acknowledged he had been defeated by Joe Biden




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 2, 2022)

Why did Democrats oppose all the election audits?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 2, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Why did Democrats oppose all the election audits?


The Republicans got all the audits they wanted.  Nobody stopped them. They found nothing wrong.

Arizona even found more votes for Biden than for Trump.









						GOP review finds no proof Arizona election stolen from Trump
					

PHOENIX (AP) — A Republican-backed review of the 2020 presidential election in Arizona’s largest county ended Friday without producing proof to support former President Donald Trump’s false claims of a stolen election.




					apnews.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 3, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 3, 2022)

Interesting how Democrats used to support the right to protest.  Now they want to use the January 6 protests to keep Trump off the 2024 ballot.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 3, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Interesting how Democrats used to support the right to protest.  Now they want to use the January 6 protests to keep Trump off the 2024 ballot.


You need to stop insulting people's intelligence as if no one saw what happened on 1/6/2020.  The whole world saw it.


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 4, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> You need to stop insulting people's intelligence as if no one saw what happened on 1/6/2020.  The whole world saw it.


Interesting claim on your part since you forget everyone saw the election being stolen on the night of the election.


----------



## surada (Nov 4, 2022)

TNHarley said:


> Its crazy how easy yall rubes fall for his trolls.
> Blows the mind actually.



Being a troll isn't presidential.


----------



## surada (Nov 4, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



That's Obama... Always take the high road.


----------



## j-mac (Nov 4, 2022)

Just how many threads do we need on this liberal crying?


----------



## surada (Nov 4, 2022)

j-mac said:


> Just how many threads do we need on this liberal crying?



Trump embraces Qanon.



			https://www.usnews.com/news/the-report/articles/2022-09-23/trumps-open-embrace-of-qanon


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 4, 2022)

Review​“This deeply researched and finely written story of the Trump presidency functions as the ultimate political cautionary tale. David Rothkopf has spent much of his life sailing the treacherous waters of Washington, and in American Resistance, he brings a sharply observed set of sensible observations and timely prescriptions to help us navigate the roiling waters of our dangerously turbulent republic. A necessary and riveting book.”―Admiral James Stavridis, USN (Ret.), former supreme allied commander, NATO

“Rothkopf has written the Trump administration story that needs to be told: how close we came to losing our democracy and the public servants who saved us. In American Resistance: The Inside Story of How the Deep State Saved the Nation, Rothkopf expertly explains how the much maligned ‘Deep State’ is actually a cohort of steadfast professionals committed to honoring the oaths they took to uphold the Constitution. This book offers essential insights into a vitally important world too few understand or appreciate.”―Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman, USA (Ret.), author of Here, Right Matters

“Finally—the inside story of Trump’s chaotic presidency and the extraordinary measures taken to keep the government from falling apart. A chilling and revealing portrait of how close America came to the brink under Trump. Rothkopf pulls back the curtain of the turbulent Trump presidency in a way others haven’t. Revelatory.”―Miles Taylor, author (as “Anonymous”) of A Warning and former chief of staff, US Department of Homeland Security

“The Deep State is real . . . and thank goodness for it. Rothkopf brings his insight and devout patriotism to a fascinating examination of the honorable, diligent, and skilled public servants who are critical to preventing democracy’s demise at the hands of MAGA authoritarians. This is a must-read if you want to know how government functions and care about America’s future.”―Jennifer Rubin, columnist, Washington Post, and author of Resistance

“With an almost-unparalleled knowledge of the inner workings of our government, Rothkopf has written a sobering and at times harrowing account not simply of how bad things were but of how much worse they could have been during the Trump administration. American Resistance is much more, and much more important than, a post-mortem of the Trump years. Exhaustively researched and bolstered by eye-opening interviews with dozens of experts and former government officials, Rothkopf’s book offers a clarion call for us to remain vigilant against anti-democratic forces and a long-overdue tribute to the often-maligned civil servants who saved us from the worst administration in modern history. In a very crowded field, what Rothkopf has written is not just compelling, it is essential.”―Mary L. Trump, clinical psychologist and author Too Much and Never Enough and The Reckoning

“Rothkopf, host of the invaluable Deep State Radio podcast, pays a long-overdue tribute to the ‘Deep State’ that tried to keep Trump from doing more damage. In the process he offers a powerful corrective to the negative stereotypes of ‘bureaucrats’ that are all too deeply rooted in American culture. Even if you remember all the Trump scandals he chronicles (there are so many!), you will feel outrage all over again reading this book—along with gratitude to all of the dedicated public servants who tried to do the right thing and shared their stories with Rothkopf.”―Max Boot, columnist, Washington Post, and senior fellow, the Council on Foreign Relations

“One of the biggest debates during the Trump years concerned those who went to work for him in all branches of the government. Were they serving the public by ‘saving’ the country from the worst of Trump’s excesses? Or were they ambitious careerists taking the jobs available while pretending that their service was in the nation’s best interests? Rothkopf’s fascinating, well written, and carefully researched book is essential reading for those interested in how the ‘Deep State’ performed in the Trump years—a topic that could well become worryingly relevant again.”―Robert Kagan, senior fellow, the Brookings Institution, and author of The Jungle Grows Back

“Rothkopf has been a strong and thoughtful critic of Trumpism from the start because he cares passionately about democratic institutions. American Resistance turns the idea of the ‘Deep State’ on its head, using it to describe the committed civil servants and policy experts who—imperfectly, but also, in key moments, courageously—worked to block or disrupt some of Donald Trump’s most dangerous initiatives. Rothkopf’s provocative insight: the Deep State is often the last line of defense against the dark state.”―E.J. Dionne Jr., coauthor of 100% Democracy and One Nation After Trump

“It’s the best work yet on how federal employees, military as well as civilian, helped preserve democracy from the ‘dark state’ during the gravest constitutional peril the U.S. has faced since 1860…A searing yet optimistic account of how true constitutional patriots preserved American democracy.”―Kirkus, starred review

“[T]his is one of the most revealing and disturbing accounts of Trump’s presidency yet published.”―Publishers Weekly

“This book is a worthy companion to recent books by Marie Yovanovitch (Lessons from the Edge) and Alexander Vindman (Here, Right Matters). It is an unrelenting indictment of Donald Trump’s abuse of the presidency.”―Library Journal

“The result is an eye-opening account of the Trump administration and a chilling snapshot of America on the brink.”―Celadon Books
About the Author​David J. Rothkopf  is a professor of international relations, political scientist and journalist. He is the founder and CEO of The Rothkopf Group, a visiting professor at the Paul H. Nitze School of Advanced International Studies at Johns Hopkins University. He is the author of The Great Questions of Tomorrow, National Insecurity: American Leadership in an Age of Fear, and most recently, Traitor: A History of American Betrayal from Benedict Arnold to Donald Trump. He is also the podcast host of Deep State Radio.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 5, 2022)




----------



## j-mac (Nov 5, 2022)

surada said:


> Trump embraces Qanon.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.usnews.com/news/the-report/articles/2022-09-23/trumps-open-embrace-of-qanon


Well, you libs sure love your Boogeymen....


----------



## surada (Nov 5, 2022)

j-mac said:


> Well, you libs sure love your Boogeymen....



Can't you face Trump's reality?


----------



## j-mac (Nov 5, 2022)

surada said:


> Can't you face Trump's reality?


Unlike liberals I don't obsess over someone who is not in power....Good grief is a never ending thing with you Karen's....Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump....

I understand you don't want to focus on the man who DOES sit in the Presidency because you can't defend his leadership that has driven this country into a ditch...


----------



## surada (Nov 5, 2022)

j-mac said:


> Unlike liberals I don't obsess over someone who is not in power....Good grief is a never ending thing with you Karen's....Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump....
> 
> I understand you don't want to focus on the man who DOES sit in the Presidency because you can't defend his leadership that has driven this country into a ditch...



Trump is a real threat because his values are so selfish and twisted. He laughs at honor, integrity and patriotism.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 5, 2022)

j-mac said:


> Unlike liberals I don't obsess over someone who is not in power....Good grief is a never ending thing with you Karen's....Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump....
> 
> I understand you don't want to focus on the man who DOES sit in the Presidency because you can't defend his leadership that has driven this country into a ditch...


Trump is not "in Power" but has plenty of Power over the Republicans.  And they are not ashamed of depending on his vouching for him.

It is in the news.  

Now stop denying the undeniable.


----------



## j-mac (Nov 5, 2022)

surada said:


> Trump is a real threat because his values are so selfish and twisted. He laughs at honor, integrity and patriotism.


Kind of like Democrats eh?


----------



## j-mac (Nov 5, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump is not "in Power" but has plenty of Power over the Republicans.  And they are not ashamed of depending on his vouching for him.
> 
> It is in the news.
> 
> Now stop denying the undeniable.


Aw, you guys are cute when you're scared....


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 5, 2022)

j-mac said:


> Kind of like Democrats eh?


Are you here to just post empty nothings three days before the elections?

Move on.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 5, 2022)

j-mac said:


> Aw, you guys are cute when you're scared....


You are the one posting nothing on a thread.  See how scared you are?  I see it.


----------



## surada (Nov 5, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump is not "in Power" but has plenty of Power over the Republicans.  And they are not ashamed of depending on his vouching for him.
> 
> It is in the news.
> 
> Now stop denying the undeniable.



Trump and his sons have said repeatedly that the GOP is the Trump party.


----------



## Faun (Nov 6, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Interesting claim on your part since you forget everyone saw the election being stolen on the night of the election.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 10, 2022)

Pence opens up on Trump and Jan. 6, GOP takes notice, after dismal midterms
					

In an excerpt of his forthcoming memoir published in the Wall Street Journal, Pence revealed a wealth of new details about his direct interactions with then-President Donald Trump in the weeks leading up to the Jan. 6, 2021, insurrection at the U.S. Capitol.




					www.aol.com


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 10, 2022)

Pence who?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 14, 2022)

[ Another reason Trump wanted to stay in office.  The salary is very, very good.  Hotel, Resorts.  The more they charge they better for the Trump Organization ]


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 15, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 16, 2022)

[ Still trying to stay in office in order to avoid any charges from wrong doing.  Waste of time, waste of money, waste of the people who are going to be involved in it ]


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 16, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 16, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 17, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 17, 2022)

Does Sixties Fan realize every president wants to stay in office?


----------



## Leo123 (Nov 17, 2022)

I think it's funny they way Trump trolls pearl clutching lefties.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 17, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Does Sixties Fan realize every president wants to stay in office?


Does Lennypartiv realize why Donald John Trump wanted so desperately to stay in office?


----------



## Leo123 (Nov 17, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Does Lennypartiv realize why Donald John Trump wanted so desperately to stay in office?


He wanted to stay in office to continue to Make America Great.  The Democrats cheated and took that away from him.   Their candidate hardly ever campaigned and is brain addled.  He wanted the election investigated but, instead he got an FBI incited protest that, with the help of federal agents like Ray Epps, turned into a breaching of the Capitol.   
Fewer and fewer people are believing the Democrat hoax.


----------



## Faun (Nov 17, 2022)

Leo123 said:


> He wanted to stay in office to continue to Make America Great.  The Democrats cheated and took that away from him.   Their candidate hardly ever campaigned and is brain addled.  He wanted the election investigated but, instead he got an FBI incited protest that, with the help of federal agents like Ray Epps, turned into a breaching of the Capitol.
> Fewer and fewer people are believing the Democrat hoax.



You rightards are always the victim, huh?


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 18, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Does Lennypartiv realize why Donald John Trump wanted so desperately to stay in office?


To finish the border wall.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 18, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> To finish the border wall.


So, then he was finally going to ask Steve Bannon, and all others, to return the Millions all of them stole from the Build the Wall Fund?

Could you please go ask Trump for the answer.

Not to count all the money kept from the 2016 campaign.  The 2020 donations.  The Hershel Walker donations where 90% goes to Trump and not Walker.

Yes, he has many more reasons to want to return to the WH then just build a wall, which he had plenty of time in office to finish.


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 18, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> So, then he was finally going to ask Steve Bannon, and all others, to return the Millions all of them stole from the Build the Wall Fund?
> 
> Could you please go ask Trump for the answer.
> 
> ...


It's not Trumps fault that Bannon didn't build more sections of the wall.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 18, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> It's not Trumps fault that Bannon didn't build more sections of the wall.


Bannon and others STOLE Millions of dollars which donors had given to specifically BUILD the wall.

But it is Trump's fault to have promised as he did and ONLY done a few fixes here and there, worthless ones by the way, and built very little during the whole FOUR years that he was President.

Exactly HOW LONG does it take to build the wall , to finish it?  40 years?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 19, 2022)




----------



## Faun (Nov 19, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Good thing Democrats still control the Senate and can block such a scheme, even if it does pass in the House.


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 19, 2022)

Faun said:


> Good thing Democrats still control the Senate and can block such a scheme, even if it does pass in the House.


The House will be able to impeach Biden.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 19, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 19, 2022)




----------



## Faun (Nov 19, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> The House will be able to impeach Biden.



Only if just about every Republican votes in favor of impeachment.


----------



## Faun (Nov 19, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Vote here...


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 19, 2022)

Fellow Republican Liz Cheney, who’s somehow never succumbed to Donald Trump’s oleaginous charms (and lost her House primary as a result), isn’t having it. In response to Pence’s comments, Cheney, the committee vice chair, released a statement Thursday with committee Chair Bennie Thompson, to remind him of how that “opportunity” was actually lost (and insert a mild mocking of his book tour).

It read, in part:



> “The Select Committee has proceeded respectfully and responsibly in our engagement with Vice President Pence, so it is disappointing that he is misrepresenting the nature of our investigation while giving interviews to promote his new book.
> “Our investigation has publicly presented the testimony of more than 50 Republican witnesses, including senior members of the Trump White House, the Trump Campaign, and the Trump Justice Department. This testimony, subject to criminal penalties for lying to Congress, was not ‘partisan.’ It was truthful.
> “Every member of the Select Committee supported the creation of an independent bipartisan commission. After initially supporting such a commission, Leader McCarthy withdrew his support and the bipartisan plan to create the commission was defeated by Republicans in the Senate. The Select Committee was formed only after the proposal for an outside commission was defeated.
> “Leader McCarthy had the opportunity to nominate five members of the Select Committee. Speaker Pelosi initially accepted three of those nominees and invited Leader McCarthy to propose two others. Rather than doing so, McCarthy _chose _to withdraw all his nominees and refused to participate at all—so that he could make the false claim that the Committee was entirely one-sided.  This was a cynical choice by Mr. McCarthy.
> ...


Pence knows this, even if he wants Americans to forget. Yet judging by the results of the Nov. 8 midterms, Americans haven’t memory-holed Jan. 6 just yet, despite Pence having used his vast stores of simpering twit energy to keep the wolves at bay.

*RELATED: What happened and when: A timeline of the Jan. 6 insurrection*

But why should Pence stop covering for Trump and his coterie of crooks now? He’s got loads of practice. In fact, it might be the only real skill he has left.


(full article online)









						Mike Pence claims the Jan. 6 committee has 'no right' to his testimony. Liz Cheney has thoughts
					

Mike Pence is angry and defiant. Can’t you tell? His customary blanched-potato pout has abruptly given way to a sinister shade of ecru—and following an exhaustive review in close consultation with Mother, he’s tentatively decided to put his hackles on...




					www.dailykos.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 20, 2022)

Faun said:


> Only if just about every Republican votes in favor of impeachment.


It should be an easy decision.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> It should be an easy decision.


No one is discussing ......."Impeached for what reasons".

What reasons are Republicans going to pursue to say that Biden has gone against the Constitution or the Rule of Law?


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 20, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> No one is discussing ......."Impeached for what reasons".
> 
> What reasons are Republicans going to pursue to say that Biden has gone against the Constitution or the Rule of Law?


Biden is a typical anti-American Democrat, I'm sure they can find some reason to impeach him.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Biden is a typical anti-American Democrat, I'm sure they can find some reason to impeach him.


Rotten answer.

The Republicans say that they are going to impeach Biden.  It requires a clear crime against the country, the Constitution and the Rule of Law.

They are very SURE that they are going to impeach, indict (that is what it means) Biden. Put him on trial and convict him.    They have been singing it for sometime.  Without pointing to ANYTHING that Biden might have done which has broken the law anywhere .

They cannot simply "find" a reason to impeach him.

So, in the past two years, what have you seen which would constitute breaking the law, going against the Constitution of the USA in Biden's case ?

What crime(s) has Biden committed against the country ?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Biden is a typical anti-American Democrat, I'm sure they can find some reason to impeach him.


Please define Anti American.


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 20, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Please define Anti American.


Communist.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Communist.


What you wrote means nothing.
It has no context.


----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 20, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> What you wrote means nothing.
> It has no context.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 20, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


>


Fine.

Where is Communism in America?
Give examples.


----------



## Faun (Nov 21, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Biden is a typical anti-American Democrat, I'm sure they can find some reason to impeach him.



LOLOL 

This reflects on how deranged you are. You're literally claiming it'll be easy for every Republican representative to vote to impeach Biden over something you can't even describe.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 22, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 22, 2022)

Last week, while on the interview circuit hawking his book, former Vice President Mike Pence had the audacity to maintain that the January 6 committee wasn’t entitled to his testimony. After all, Pence reasoned, he’d made his senior advisors available. He shook his head, made a face like he’d just eaten something Mother wouldn’t approve of, and indignantly dismissed the notion that he, Mike Pence, should have to testify under oath.

He’s wrong. 

Mike Pence not only owes Congress his testimony, he owes it to the American people. Pence seemed affronted by the prospect of being required to testify. His rationale was that it would violate the separation of powers, that permitting Congress to acquire testimony about internal White House deliberations between a President and the Vice President would upset our system of checks and balances. (I’m fleshing it out a little bit more than Pence did, for the sake of argument.)

While that argument could be put forward in normal circumstances, it’s not the case here. Pence acted as though these interactions with Trump were in the normal course of conducting the nation’s business. But even without Pence’s testimony, we know enough to know that isn’t the case. Trump solicited Pence’s interference with the certification of the 2020 election and tried to lure him into the propagation of the big lie.

But we don’t know the details. Investigators don’t know and the American people don’t know. And they won’t for certain unless and until Pence testifies. Pence’s top aides weren’t involved in the same way he was. They may have observed, but Pence was the man. When did Trump start discussing the idea of interfering with certification with Pence? Did he threaten? Offer anything? And how much earlier did it start? Was Pence privy to conversations about failing to concede a loss in the summer of 2020? Fake slates of electors? Did he push back and tell Trump it would be illegal? What did Trump say? There’s a full ticker of questions investigators need to ask Pence if the full picture is going to emerge. Americans are entitled to the full picture.

While the January 6 committee may be running out of time, the Justice Department isn’t. Pence is an important witness in their January 6 investigation because of his unique, close contact with Trump. His testimony, whatever it may be, is highly likely to illuminate whether the former president should be prosecuted.

.@JoyceWhiteVance: “The fact that Mike Pence is comfortable selling books but not comfortable testifying in bodies that are responsible for building a historical record and providing the American people with detail about what happened, that’s just shameful.” 
4:42 AM ∙ Nov 17, 2022

A simple example is illustrative. Imagine you’re an FBI agent investigating an attempted bank robbery. You learn that before the attempt, one of the key conspirators tried to enlist a friend to help with the scheme. The friend turned him down. 

You’d want to talk to the friend. His testimony would be essential to your case.

The friend has key evidence about the would-be bank robber’s intent and motive. He may know the contours of the entire plan. That evidence could be the linchpin in your efforts to charge people who came perilously close to pulling off a dangerous robbery. 

Of course, it’s even more important when the crime is an attempt to interfere with the peaceful transition of power in our country. That’s just common sense. 

Unless you’re Mike Pence. 

There are good reasons to make sure a president’s can protect certain types of privileged communications from disclosure via Congressional testimony. It helps to ensure a president can get the best advice from people who aren’t afraid their words will be reported and perhaps misconstrued. But that’s not the case here. This was about interfering with government, not executing its work. Executive privilege is not absolute. It can be overcome where Congress needs access to information to carry out its oversight function. Oversight is certainly necessary here.

If Pence was serious about protecting legitimate functions of the presidency, he wouldn’t have written a book and profited from his access. But he’s avoided testifying so far, simply be declining to do so. No one has tried to force the issue.

So here’s hoping DOJ sends a subpoena his way. That’s something the former Vice President can’t easily duck. 

Pence has given DOJ, and now the special counsel, every reason to believe he is a fact witness in possession of important information about a possible crime that they need to make a proper assessment of the situation. As recently as last week, in an ABC televised interview, Pence discussed Trump’s conduct toward him on January 6: “The president’s words were reckless. It was clear he decided to be part of the problem.” He went on to say, Trump’s “words … endangered me and my family and everyone at the Capitol building.” If you’re investigating Trump’s actions, you’d like to know more about what’s behind these statements.

Mike Pence worked for a president who believed he was above the law. Maybe some of that rubbed off on the former six-term member of the House of Representatives. But it’s still shocking that Pence, despite his time in the House, flouted their subpoena, diminishing the constitutional authority of an institution he dedicated so many years of his life to. Pence needs to be reminded that the law applies to him too. He’s a witness to a crime and in our system of laws, not men, high office doesn’t and can’t insulate a person from their responsibility to testify about facts they observed. The sooner we get back to enforcing those basics in a serious way designed to instill confidence in the rule of law, the better off we will be. The glare Mike Pence used on the journalist who interviewed him won’t work on DOJ. The American people deserve to know the truth.











						Why prosecutors are entitled to Mike Pence’s testimony
					

Last week, while on the interview circuit hawking his book, former Vice President Mike Pence had the audacity to maintain that the January 6 committee wasn’t entitled to his testimony. After all, Pence reasoned, he’d made his senior advisors available. He shook his head, made a face like he’d...




					joycevance.substack.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 23, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 25, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 26, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 29, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 29, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 30, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Nov 30, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Nov 30, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> “We’re never leaving,” Trump told another. “How can you leave when you won an election?”
> 
> He was even overheard asking the chair of the Republican National Committee, Ronna McDaniel, “Why should I leave if they stole it from me?”


These arguments help our side, not yours.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 1, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> These arguments help our side, not yours.


He was told by all around him that he had lost.

Trump....is the one who has gone around saying that the election was stolen from him.

He started saying it in July of 2020, that if he did not win, that the election was rigged.  Same thing he did in 2016, only that in 2016 he actually won.

60 courts and the Supreme Court.  His lawyers had nothing to show for it to turn the election his way.

You have no side.  Which is exactly why the Republicans did so badly this election, instead of the tsunami they expected.

Lies only live in some places, but the real world is another thing altogether.


----------



## surada (Dec 1, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> These arguments help our side, not yours.



What about Trump's new electors? What do you think about that scheme?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 1, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 1, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 1, 2022)

surada said:


> What about Trump's new electors? What do you think about that scheme?


If the fraudulent votes were to be thrown out, the new elector are the right electors.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 1, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> If the fraudulent votes were to be thrown out, the new elector are the right electors.


Except that Trump is really lousy at proving what he wishes others to believe under the Laws of the US.

Better luck in another country, one which does not have the laws the US has.


----------



## surada (Dec 2, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> If the fraudulent votes were to be thrown out, the new elector are the right electors.



There's no proof of fraudulent votes. Didn't he break the law to pick other electors?


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 2, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 2, 2022)

A former elections manager who prosecutors say assisted in a security breach of voting equipment in a Colorado county pleaded guilty on Wednesday under a plea agreement that requires her to testify against her former boss.

Sandra Brown is one of two employees accused of helping Mesa County Clerk Tina Peters allow a copy of a hard drive to be made during an update of election equipment last year in search of proof of the false conspiracy theories spun by former President Donald Trump.

Brown, 45, pleaded guilty to attempting to influence a public servant, a felony, and official misconduct, a misdemeanor, but will not be sentenced until right after she testifies at Peters' trial next year so her performance on the witness stand can be considered.

“There were things going on that I should have questioned and I didn't,” Brown told Judge Matthew Barrett.


(full article online)











						Worker pleads guilty in election equipment tampering case
					

A former elections manager who prosecutors say assisted in a security breach of voting equipment in a Colorado county pleaded guilty on Wednesday under a plea agreement that requires her to testify against her former boss.  Sandra Brown is one of two employees accused of helping Mesa County...




					www.yahoo.com


----------



## surada (Dec 2, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Wow. Now he claims the country is going Communist. Of course he also said he could be prime minister of Israel.


----------



## MagicMike (Dec 2, 2022)

TNHarley said:


> Its crazy how easy yall rubes fall for his trolls.
> Blows the mind actually.


Yeah.
Trump never means what he says or says what he means.
That phony idiot is incapable of telling it like it is.


----------



## TNHarley (Dec 2, 2022)

MagicMike said:


> Yeah.
> Trump never means what he says or says what he means.
> That phony idiot is incapable of telling it like it is.


Trump is full of shit. Every day of his life. Never believe a word he says.
Doesnt mean he doesnt you troll you tards.


----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 2, 2022)

surada said:


> Wow. Now he claims the country is going Communist.


That trend started with the liberals in the sixties.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 2, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> That trend started with the liberals in the sixties.


Start your own thread on that subject.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 3, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 4, 2022)

Sixties Fan doesn't realize it's a nothing burger.


----------



## BackAgain (Dec 4, 2022)

*BREAKING NEWS!*

Most people who seek re-election wish to stay in office. 

Film at 11.


----------



## Faun (Dec 4, 2022)

BackAgain said:


> *BREAKING NEWS!*
> 
> Most people who seek re-election wish to stay in office.
> 
> Film at 11.



Who else sends fake electors to Congress to compel the president of the Senate to unilaterally hand them the election they lost?


----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 4, 2022)

Faun said:


> Who else sends fake electors to Congress to compel the president of the Senate to unilaterally hand them the election they lost?


They would be the real and right electors if the fraudulent votes were thrown out.


----------



## Faun (Dec 4, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> They would be the real and right electors if the fraudulent votes were thrown out.



There were no fraudulent votes to throw out, you yokel. And all of the states had certified their election results. And there was nothing that could ever legally make them "real" or "right."


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 4, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan doesn't realize it's a nothing burger.



Coming up !!!!

A Nothing Burger with absolutely nothing in it.

HOLD THE BEEF !!!!!!


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 5, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 5, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 5, 2022)

[ It would have truly been better for him had he been able to join the Military, or done anything else with his life, but stay under his father's wing, the way his grandfather had forced Donald's older brother to follow the family business against his will and talent.  Fred Jr. ended up unhappy, family destroyed, an alcoholic and dead in his early 40s. ]


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 5, 2022)

Republican strategist Athan Koutsiouroumbas not only told Bannon that there was no mail-in election fraud in Delaware County, Pennsylvania (and presumably nowhere else in Pennsylvania), but that such fraud was nearly impossible to pull off, and that Republicans have put themselves at a disadvantage by eschewing mail-in voting.

“The first thing you want to do is try to establish, was there any fraud? Steve, there is no evidence that I’ve seen in Delaware County,” said Koutsiouroumbas. “In order to commit mail-in ballot fraud, you can do it in two places. No. 1 is that when you apply to vote by mail, you have to provide either your Social Security or driver’s license number. Now, we don’t have voter ID when you walk into a poll in Pennsylvania, but you need voter ID to vote by mail. So you need someone that builds a list, somehow steals a whole bunch of driver’s license numbers, submits an application without a voter’s knowledge, and then completes them. That didn’t happen.

“The second way you can have fraud is if there’s some type of conspiracy in a courthouse to not count ballots. I’ve seen no evidence of that in Delaware County. Ultimately, what the Democrats did is exactly what Republicans used to do prior to the pandemic. We used to have coordinated campaigns to get Republicans to vote by mail. The way we did that is we mailed everybody an application and we would chase it with a phone call.”

Okay, that election analysis is suspiciously lacking in pillow ads. Not sure I can trust it. Oh, and neither can Bannon’s minions!

As Raw Story pointed out, Bannon immediately noticed that his listeners were taken aback at the explosive no-fraud claims, and he appeared to realize that all of this non-conspiracy thinking was going to be difficult for his audience to digest.

(full article online)










						Bannon guest freaks out MAGAs by saying there was no election fraud—as GOP reconsiders its strategy
					

There’s a downside to cribbing your political strategy from Donald Trump—namely, Donald Trump doesn’t know what he’s talking about on any subject, ever. (Unless, of course, you want to know which 25 McDonald’s Dollar Menu items pair best with cutting...




					www.dailykos.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 5, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 5, 2022)

Wow, I thought liberals like Sixties Fan hated Twitter.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 6, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 6, 2022)




----------



## Faun (Dec 6, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Holy fuck.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 7, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 7, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 8, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 8, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 10, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 10, 2022)

Unprecedented fraud is right.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 10, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 10, 2022)




----------



## watchingfromafar (Dec 10, 2022)

*One pathological liar bites the dust.*
I say good riddance to bad rubbish

-


----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 10, 2022)

Sixties Fan wishes Twitter were still relevant.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 10, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan wishes Twitter were still relevant.



Musk is a Republican.  He is making Twitter  irrelevant.


----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 10, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Musk is a Republican.  He is making Twitter  irrelevant.


Twitter became irrelevant when they kicked Trump off.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 10, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Twitter became irrelevant when they kicked Trump off.


You just cannot live without Trump.
Truth Social is just not enough.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 10, 2022)

OhPleaseJustQuit said:


> Oh, my goodness.  It's as if you believe that hearing that for the 650,012th time is going to make it any more important to anybody but you TDS afflicted.
> 
> Y'all sure do love saying things a whole lot of times.


That’s the iPad shill for the mossads logic for ya.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 10, 2022)




----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 10, 2022)

TNHarley did you figure out years ago he is a paid shill fir Israel.the fact thst sockpuppet shill  from Langley surada aka toro got triggered proves thst.lol


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 10, 2022)

Lastamender said:


> Any evidence Trump has is denied by you traitors. This is a one-sided clusterfuck for you. The chaos you are enabling is devastating this country. All to make lies the truth. That cannot be done and that is why you are failing.


The understatement of the year,you sure are angering langley shill aldo with your truthful posts.the paid shills of Langley and Israel are out in full force on this thread  Lastamender


----------



## Faun (Dec 11, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Unprecedented fraud is right.



_*Unprecedented dementia is right.*_

Corrected that for ya.


----------



## Faun (Dec 11, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Twitter became irrelevant when they kicked Trump off.



LOL

Yeah, that must explain why Musk spent $44 million to buy it.

Rightards are so dumb.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 11, 2022)

For instance, a recent guest on _Steve Bannon’s War Room_ tried to talk some sense into Bannon’s listeners—which, granted, is a little like opening a cannabis dispensary in Mitt Romney’s basement. But hey, he’s doing what he can.

Republican strategist Athan Koutsiouroumbas not only told Bannon that there was no mail-in election fraud in Delaware County, Pennsylvania (and presumably nowhere else in Pennsylvania), but that such fraud was nearly impossible to pull off, and that Republicans have put themselves at a disadvantage by eschewing mail-in voting.

“The first thing you want to do is try to establish, was there any fraud? Steve, there is no evidence that I’ve seen in Delaware County,” said Koutsiouroumbas. “In order to commit mail-in ballot fraud, you can do it in two places. No. 1 is that when you apply to vote by mail, you have to provide either your Social Security or driver’s license number. Now, we don’t have voter ID when you walk into a poll in Pennsylvania, but you need voter ID to vote by mail. So you need someone that builds a list, somehow steals a whole bunch of driver’s license numbers, submits an application without a voter’s knowledge, and then completes them. That didn’t happen.

“The second way you can have fraud is if there’s some type of conspiracy in a courthouse to not count ballots. I’ve seen no evidence of that in Delaware County. Ultimately, what the Democrats did is exactly what Republicans used to do prior to the pandemic. We used to have coordinated campaigns to get Republicans to vote by mail. The way we did that is we mailed everybody an application and we would chase it with a phone call.”

Okay, that election analysis is suspiciously lacking in pillow ads. Not sure I can trust it. Oh, and neither can Bannon’s minions!

As Raw Story pointed out, Bannon immediately noticed that his listeners were taken aback at the explosive no-fraud claims, and he appeared to realize that all of this non-conspiracy thinking was going to be difficult for his audience to digest.


(full article online)











						Bannon guest freaks out MAGAs by saying there was no election fraud—as GOP reconsiders its strategy
					

There’s a downside to cribbing your political strategy from Donald Trump—namely, Donald Trump doesn’t know what he’s talking about on any subject, ever. (Unless, of course, you want to know which 25 McDonald’s Dollar Menu items pair best with cutting...




					www.dailykos.com


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 12, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 12, 2022)




----------



## lennypartiv (Dec 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan, where were you on election night?  Trump was winning when we went to bed, then after midnight all these votes for Biden mysteriously appeared out of nowhere.


----------



## OhPleaseJustQuit (Dec 13, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan, where were you on election night?  Trump was winning when we went to bed, then after midnight all these votes for Biden mysteriously appeared out of nowhere.


.


Sixties Fan lives in that magical world where, if he/she/it doesn't want something to be true, it isn't true.  All leftist vermin are members of a cult that believe this is the the real world.

I guess they'll learn, won't they?

Or not.

Their choice


.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 13, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan, where were you on election night?  Trump was winning when we went to bed, then after midnight all these votes for Biden mysteriously appeared out of nowhere.


It is called counting ALL the votes.  Including the ones which have come from Americans and the Military Abroad.

You make it black and white.  It is not.  You clearly know nothing about how votes are counted.  Or do not want to know.

ALL the votes are counted.  The one with the most votes wins.  That goes for the Presidency and for all other seats.

Get used to it.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 13, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan, where were you on election night?  Trump was winning when we went to bed, then after midnight all these votes for Biden mysteriously appeared out of nowhere.


You keep assuming that all Republicans voted for Trump.  They did not.  Thousands, and thousands of Republicans voted for Biden over Trump.

The same thing happened this year.  Republicans, many more of them, voted for Democratic candidates than Republican ones.

Red wave?  Did not happen, because Republicans voted for Democrats.

Take over the Senate?  Did not happen, because Republicans voted for Democrats.

The new Republican Congress wants to impeach Biden.  I would watch the Sane Republicans, because they are NOT going to vote for any insanity as McArthy and Green, and many others are going to insist on.


I do not know what will happen, but if an impeachment goes forward, aka an incredible waste of time in pursuit of power by humiliation........expect Republicans to lose even more seats in 2024.


That is how it works.


----------



## OhPleaseJustQuit (Dec 13, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> It is called counting ALL the votes.  Including the ones which have come from Americans and the Military Abroad.
> 
> You make it black and white.  It is not.  You clearly know nothing about how votes are counted.  Or do not want to know.
> 
> ...


.


Translations:  "Dems gotta lie.  If you ain't cheatin, you ain't competin'.  Get used to it."


.


----------



## Faun (Dec 13, 2022)

OhPleaseJustQuit said:


> .
> 
> 
> Translations:  "Dems gotta lie.  If you ain't cheatin, you ain't competin'.  Get used to it."
> ...



Poor loser.


----------



## OhPleaseJustQuit (Dec 13, 2022)

Faun said:


> Poor loser.


.


Poor demon.   


.


----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 13, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 13, 2022)




----------



## Sixties Fan (Dec 13, 2022)

The texts are part of a trove Meadows turned over to the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6 attack that was obtained by TPM. For more information about the story behind the text log and our procedures for publishing the messages, read the introduction to this series. Meadows’ exchanges shed new light on the extent of congressional involvement in Trump’s efforts to spread baseless conspiracy theories about his defeat and his attempts to reverse it. The messages document the role members played in the campaign to subvert the election as it was conceived, built, and reached its violent climax on Jan. 6, 2021. The texts are rife with links to far-right websites, questionable legal theories, violent rhetoric, and advocacy for authoritarian power grabs.

One message identified as coming from Rep. Ralph Norman (R-SC) to Meadows on January 17, 2021, three days before Joe Biden was set to take office, is a raw distillation of the various themes in the congressional correspondence. In the text, despite a typo, Norman seemed to be proposing a dramatic last ditch plan: having Trump impose martial law during his final hours in office. 



> Mark, in seeing what’s happening so quickly, and reading about the Dominion law suits attempting to stop any meaningful investigation we are at a point of � no return � in saving our Republic !! Our LAST HOPE is invoking Marshall Law!! PLEASE URGE TO PRESIDENT TO DO SO!!
> Ralph NormanRN


The text, which has not previously been reported, is a particularly vivid example of how congressional opposition to Biden’s election was underpinned by paranoid and debunked conspiracy theories like those about Dominion voting machines. Norman’s text also showed the potentially violent lengths to which some congressional Republicans were willing to go in order to keep Trump in power. The log Meadows provided to the select committee does not include a response to Norman’s message. 

Reached via cell phone on Monday morning, Norman asked TPM for a chance to review his messages before commenting. 

“It’s been two years,” Norman said. “Send that text to me and I’ll take a look at it.”

TPM forwarded Norman a copy of the message calling for “Marshall Law!!” We did not receive any further response from the congressman.  

Based on TPM’s analysis, Meadows received at least 364 messages from Republican members of Congress who discussed attempts to reverse the election results with him. He sent at least 95 messages of his own. The committee did not respond to requests for comment. Some of Meadows’ texts — notably with Fox News personalities and a couple members of Congress — have already been made public by the committee, media outlets, and in the book “The Breach.” However, the full scope of his engagement with congressional Republicans as they worked to overturn the election has not previously been revealed. 

(full article online)









						Mark Meadows Exchanged Texts With 34 Members Of Congress About Plans To Overturn The 2020 Election
					

White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows exchanged text messages with at least 34 Republican members of Congress as they plotted to overturn President Trump’s loss in the 2020 election.



					talkingpointsmemo.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 13, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 14, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 14, 2022)

Yet another Jan. 6 insurrectionist has fucked around and is finding out that following former President Donald Trump, his MAGA Republican sycophants, and their Big Lie bullshit only leads to one place: a dead-end road full of charges, convictions, and ultimately severe and costly legal troubles.  

Devin Kiel Rossman’s attorney claims her client was a victim of the Trump machine and those fueling it. According to _The Kansas City Star_, defense attorney Ronna Holloman-Hughes wrote in her sentencing memorandum for Rossman that “before January 6, 2021, Mr. Rossman held a good faith belief the 2000 presidential election was in the process of being stolen by Joe Biden Democrat operatives.”

“Then President Trump trumpeted this claim to the nation repeatedly and loudly from the time of the 2020 election to January 6, 2021, and continues to press that claim today,” Holloman-Hughes wrote.

And it’s true, of course, that Trump and so many in the MAGA party furthered the false narrative, but falling back on claims of being duped hasn’t really saved his followers—especially those who breached the U.S. Capitol. 

Rossman, 38, from Independence, Missouri, pleaded guilty in September to his role in the Jan. 6 insurrection and was sentenced to 36 months probation with a condition of intermittent incarceration, per _The Kansas City Star_. He’s also on the hook for $500 compensation for damages to the Capitol building. Rossman “entered the Speaker’s Office suite and tried to open doors while the Speaker’s terrified staffers sought shelter under their desks.” 

_The Kansas City Star _reports that Holloman-Hughes’ document repeatedly cited examples of Trump’s fake stolen election claims, the former president’s directions to his rally audience to march to the Capitol, and various right-wing media outlets all pushing the bogus election conspiracy. 

“Trump’s false claims were bolstered by our very own elected officials — local, state, and national, including Senator Josh Hawley from Missouri, who infamously raised a clinched fist in faux solidarity with persons gathered outside the Capitol before its breach,” the document reads. 

“A defendant’s susceptibility to delusional thinking mitigates the severity of the offense and justifies leniency,” she wrote, adding that his beliefs were “cult-like” and “ill-informed” and his only drive was “to preserve the integrity of the 2020 presidential election.”

“From this factually flawed perspective, Mr. Rossman’s willingness to follow Trump’s explicit directive on January 6 to march on the Capitol is comparable to a misguided act of civil disobedience,” the defense attorney wrote. 

Rossman is the 14th Missouri resident to be sentenced in connection with the Capitol riot, _The Kansas City Star_ reports. But Rossman isn’t the first or last to blame Trump for encouraging them to participate in an armed insurrection on the country they claim to love. 

Dustin Thompson was the first. Thompson, 38, an exterminator from Columbus, Ohio, says he went down “the rabbit hole” of election lies months before the presidential election even took place. 

According to _The New York Times_, Thompson testified that he followed the former president’s calls to “fight like hell” when he joined the swarm of racists and domestic terrorists from Trump’s Stop the Steal rally at the Capitol. 

“If the president’s giving you almost an order to do something,” he said, “I felt obligated to do that.”

In the weeks that followed Jan. 6 and insurrections were being identified and charged, many attributed their actions director to Trump and claimed they were just following “the president’s instructions.”












						Jan. 6 insurrectionist sentenced to 36 months probation blames Trump, GOP, and right-wing media
					

Yet another Jan. 6 insurrectionist has fucked around and is finding out that following former President Donald Trump, his MAGA Republican sycophants, and their Big Lie bullshit only leads to one place: a dead-end road full of charges, convictions, and...




					www.dailykos.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 15, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 15, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 15, 2022)




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## Faun (Dec 16, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Maybe Trump can trade Putin a series of his trading cards in exchange for dirt on Hunter Biden.


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## lennypartiv (Dec 16, 2022)

Sixties Fan, why shouldn't the fraudulent votes from 2020 be thrown out?


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 16, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 16, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan, why shouldn't the fraudulent votes from 2020 be thrown out?


Which fraudulent votes?

Like these ones?  They were thrown out.









						3rd resident of The Villages admits to voting twice in the 2020 election
					

A third resident of The Villages has admitted to voting twice during the 2020 election, court records show.




					www.clickorlando.com
				





But here is the truth about voter fraud.  Read, learn, stop repeating what is not true.









						The Myth of Voter Fraud
					

Extensive research reveals that fraud is very rare. Yet repeated, false allegations of fraud can make it harder for millions of eligible Americans to participate in elections.




					www.brennancenter.org


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 16, 2022)

lennypartiv said:


> Sixties Fan, why shouldn't the fraudulent votes from 2020 be thrown out?


I really liked this story:


A week after the 2020 election, Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick announced that he was offering up to $1 million – paid from his campaign account – “to incentivize, encourage and reward people to come forward and report voter fraud.” 

Nearly a year later, Patrick, a Republican, has paid out his first reward: $25,000 to a Democrat in Pennsylvania, who reported a man for voting twice. 

Eric Frank, a poll worker, received the money earlier this month for his part in reporting Ralph Holloway Thurman, a Republican who after voting once, attempted to vote a second time as his son, as first reported by the Dallas Morning News. 

“Of course, I never do anything for money, that’s just how I was raised. I do things because it’s just the right thing to do. And I would have reported Thurman if he was a Republican or a Democrat,” Frank told CNN by phone on Friday. 


Frank reported Thurman after he recognized the 72-year-old came back and attempted to vote again with a “dark baseball hat and Ray Ban sunglasses.” Thurman pleaded guilty and was sentenced in September to three years probation, according to court documents. Frank noted he wasn’t supposed to be at the polls the day of the election but was asked to fill in last minute by his father, an election judge. 


“It was just ironic – it’s my opinion that (Patrick) put up, they put out this bounty to try to find Democrats committing voter fraud. And in fact, it was the complete opposite of what their intentions were,” Frank said.

In announcing the voter fraud bounty last year, Patrick said at the time, “I support President Trump’s efforts to identify voter fraud in the presidential election and his commitment to making sure that every legal vote is counted and every illegal vote is disqualified. President Trump’s pursuit of voter fraud is not only essential to determine the outcome of this election, it is essential to maintain our democracy and restore faith in future elections.”

This is not the only case of double voting. In Pennsylvania, a man in Delaware County in May was sentenced to five years probation after pleading guilty to casting a vote in the name of his deceased mother in an effort to reelect then-President Donald Trump. 












						Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick pays out $25,000 to Democrat who reported Republican voter fraud
					

A week after the 2020 election, Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick announced that he was offering up to $1 million -- paid from his campaign account -- "to incentivize, encourage and reward people to come forward and report voter fraud."




					www.cnn.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 17, 2022)

[ One of the reasons Trump wanted to stay as President ]


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 18, 2022)

How many times have you heard someone talk about the possibility of prosecuting Trump and then mention that it’s unprecedented, as though that’s somehow an obstacle to doing the thing? 

My thought is, thank goodness what Trump did is unprecedented. Thank goodness it’s not a frequent occurrence for presidents to disrupt the transfer of power when they lose an election. That’s not how our republic works, nor could we be considered in the democratic tradition if it was commonplace. 

*The fact that prosecuting a former president is unprecedented doesn’t mean DOJ shouldn’t do it. *It’s not an argument against doing it. It’s the very fact that what Trump has done is unprecedented that highlights the seriousness of the moment and informs judgment about how dangerous it would be to let him get away without being held to account. No other president has condoned and participated in events designed to interfere with the transfer of power, has told a mob to fight like hell and pointed them toward the Capitol as the vote was being certified by Congress. If prosecuting Trump would be unprecedented, that’s only because what he did to merit it is so unprecedented. Given the seriousness of what Trump did, prosecution for charges that are supported by admissible evidence is essential.

That doesn’t mean we become a banana republic, where the country’s leaders invariably use the criminal justice system to attack their political opponents when they gain power. That sort of corruption of the power of prosecutors is the polar opposite of what a prosecution of Trump would mean.

Part of DOJ’s core mission is to remain above politics, even if that involves investigating and prosecuting political figures in the party of the president, at whose pleasure the attorney general serves. But that wasn’t how Trump’s DOJ worked. He was always, sometimes openly, in search of an attorney general and an FBI director who would serve him, not the people. And when it was apparent he’d lost a fair election, Trump tried to weaponize the Justice Department for political purposes. He entertained the idea of appointing, as acting attorney general, a man singularly unqualified for the job, whose only defining characteristic was his willingness to show slavish loyalty to Trump and the big lie to keep Trump in power. One attorney general, Bill Barr, appears to have resigned just ahead of the end of the administration rather than summon the backbone necessary to shut Trump down. Holding the people who came dangerously close to corrupting the Justice Department and justice accountable is precisely the precedent the country needs to set.

What is most unprecedented here is the ascension of a man like Trump to the presidency. Trump is a lawless man. He is emboldened by escaping accountability, doubling down, as he did, for instance, in calling President Zelinsky on July 25, 2019, the day after the Mueller investigation ended with Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s testimony to Congress. Some people might have taken a moment to reassess, given such a narrow escape. Not Trump, who tried to extort a political favor out of Zelinsky the following day, asking for the production of dirt on Joe Biden, who Trump (rightfully, as it turned out) feared was the most lethal of his potential opponents in 2020. Trump’s plan? Withhold desperately needed security aid Congress had already voted to send to Ukraine to advance his own campaign. In hindsight, Trump’s self-serving abuse of the power of the presidency is even more clear than it was in that moment, with the war in Ukraine demonstrating how corrupt and damaging to both Ukrainian and American interests it was.

A lot has been made of the fact that there are so many firsts involved here, as the committee concludes its work and special counsel Jack Smith amps up his. There is a lot of concern over the fallout if we have the first prosecution of an American president. There is, and should be, not hesitation about such a moment so much as deliberation. If done for the wrong reasons and in the wrong way, prosecutions of presidents or other leaders could be a fast track to the end of democracy. You don’t have to look any further than the chants of “lock her up” when it came to Hillary Clinton to understand that. But that’s not what this is.

Trump’s crimes were committed in public. They were not made up. We heard him spew the big lie, and continue to do so long after judge after judge, including his own appointees, concluded he’d lost the election. We watched him tweet and trigger his supporters online and on the Ellipse the morning of January 6, 2021. We know he took classified documents out of secure channels and stored them at Mar-a-Lago after he left office, because he told us so, even as DOJ tried to keep its investigation under the radar. If Trump is prosecuted, it won’t be for his politics, it will be for his crimes.

Nothing happens without there being a first time for it to happen. The fact that a thing is unprecedented doesn’t make it wrong or unnecessary. Here, it’s the very unprecedented nature of the thing that is so compelling. If we are going to prevent another attack on America, Trump should be prosecuted for the crimes there is sufficient evidence to prove. That’s the best way to make sure that the unprecedented doesn’t become the new normal.










						But it’s unprecedented...
					

Just a quick note tonight. I wanted to share something I’ve been thinking about a lot, ahead of the January 6 committee business meeting on Monday. That meeting is expected to produce criminal referrals for Trump and perhaps others. We’ll discuss expectations for the committee’s work tomorrow in...




					joycevance.substack.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 18, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 18, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)

https://www.justsecurity.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/january-6-clearinghouse-executive-summary-december-19-2022.pdf


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 20, 2022)




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## lennypartiv (Dec 20, 2022)

Sixties Fan sure does like talking to himself.


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 21, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 21, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 21, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)

[ This is the link to the full Final Report on 1/6/21 ]



			https://thehill.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2022/12/Report_FinalReport_Jan6SelectCommittee.pdf
		


--------------
The House select committee investigating the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the Capitol released its highly anticipated final report on Thursday, capping off the panel’s year-and-a-half probe.

The report was initially set to publish on Wednesday but the committee punted the release to Thursday. The panel did not give a reason for the delay, but the announcement came a few hours before Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky delivered an address to a joint meeting of Congress.

The committee did, however, release the transcripts of a number of witness testimonies, including two conversations the panel had with Cassidy Hutchinson.










						Read the Jan. 6 committee’s final report
					

The House select committee investigating the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the Capitol released its highly anticipated final report on Thursday, capping off the panel’s year-and-a-half probe. The report …




					thehill.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)

The House Jan. 6 select committee on Thursday released its long-awaited final report, which includes detailed evidence compiled by the panel relating to the deadly attack on the U.S. Capitol.

*Why it matters: *The report provides the clearest look yet at what transpired before, during and after one of the most consequential events in American history.

*Details: *The panel estimates that between the November election and the Jan.6 insurrection, former President Donald Trump or his inner circle "engaged in at least 200 apparent acts of public or private outreach, pressure, or condemnation, targeting either State legislators or State or local election administrators, to overturn State election results," per the report.


Actions by Trump were "taken in support of a multi-part conspiracy to overturn the lawful results of the 2020 Presidential election," the panel wrote.
*Between the lines: *Tucked near the end of the Jan. 6 committee's report is a list of 11 recommendations. 


These include criminal and civil accountability for those accused of misconduct in the Jan. 6 report and asking Congress to create a formal mechanism to bar individuals from future office, using the 14th Amendment.
*What they're saying: "*Our country has come too far to allow a defeated President to turn himself into a successful tyrant by upending our democratic institutions, fomenting violence, and, as I saw it, opening the door to those in our country whose hatred and bigotry threaten equality and justice for all Americans," said panel Chair Bennie Thompson (D-Miss.) in the report's foreword.

*What he's saying: *Trump said on his Truth Social platform after the report was published that it was a "WITCH HUNT!" 


He claimed the report failed to "study the reason for the protest" by his supporters on Jan. 6, 2021.
*The big picture:* The report follows the months-long investigation into the Capitol riot and preserves the panel's findings before Republicans take control of the House next year and the Jan. 6 panel dissolves.


The committee voted Monday to refer Trump to the Department of Justice on at least four criminal charges, including insurrection and obstruction of an official proceeding of Congress.

It also released transcripts of 34 witness testimonies on Wednesday, including depositions with former Trump lawyer John Eastmanand Trump's acting Assistant Attorney General Jeffrey Clark.
*The backdrop:* The panel had said that it planned to make the final report public before the end of the year, but the scope of the report — and how much it would focus on Trump — remained uncertain.


The panel was also deliberating how to address a number of witnesses who refused to comply with subpoenas, including Trump, former Vice President Mike Pence, and several Republican members of Congress.
*Worth noting:* House Republicans are privately plotting to release their own 100+ page rebuttal in a bid to cast the select committee's report as partisan.










						Read: Jan. 6 final report alleges Trump engaged in "multi-part conspiracy"
					

The panel previously said it planned to make the report public by the end of the year.




					www.axios.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)

The Report
					

A few minutes before 10 p.m. Eastern on Thursday evening, the Select Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack on the United States Capitol issued its final report. It is 845 pages long, comprised of the executive summary we saw on Monday, eight chapters, and four appendices.




					joycevance.substack.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 23, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 24, 2022)

[ Pelosi has nothing to do with security. It is not her job.  Let us see how many Republicans in the new Congress will vote to actually go ahead with a Committee to waste time on MAGA grievances.  ]


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 24, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 24, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 24, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 24, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 25, 2022)

Donald Trump was slammed for another round of threats and incitement Saturday after evoking last year’s Jan. 6 insurrection — and then telling his followers it’s now time for the FBI and Justice Department “thugs” to be “dealt with.”

Critics considered the threatening messages to be a clear dog whistle to his followers, many of whom are armed. Some 62% of gun owners voted for Trump in the 2016 election. And his Oath Keeper supporters had a “massive stockpile” of weaponsstashed in the Washington, D.C., area last Jan. 6 to support Trump in the event he tried to seize control of the government and remain in power, according to trial evidence.

Trump baselessly insisted in a Truth Social post that the FBI was “absolutely” involved in a “coordinated effort to change election results” to make him a loser. That justified last year’s violent Jan. 6 “protest” at the U.S. Capitol, he insisted, even though nearly 1,000 rioters have been indicted for crimes related to the insurrection that day.

Now, Trump is urging his followers on Truth Social that the “weaponized thugs and tyrants” in the FBI and DOJ “must be dealt with.”

Trump supporters on Truth Social responded by blasting the FBI as the “gestapo” and members of “organized crime,” which could put agents lives in jeopardy among Trump acolytes.
Conde Nast legal affairs editor Luke Zaleski called Trump’s brutal message the “exact speech he gave on Jan. 6.”

“He’s continuing the rhetoric that incites violence against the United States and his thugs know what ‘must be dealt with’ means,” Zaleski tweeted.


(full article online)










						Trump Ominously Evokes Jan. 6, Tells Backers It's Time To 'Deal With' FBI, DOJ 'Thugs'
					

Donald Trump is urging his followers on Truth Social that the “weaponized thugs and tyrants” in the FBI and DOJ “must be dealt with.”




					news.yahoo.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 26, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 26, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 26, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 26, 2022)




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## miketx (Dec 26, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> This is from Trump's Social Media.  It tells his state of mind before the 2020 elections, during and after, to this day.


Humorless goons. Or, are you just stupid? This cannot stop talking about trump. Sounds like he's in love.


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 27, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 27, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 28, 2022)




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## krichton (Dec 29, 2022)

Make no mistake, the trump maga would rejoice loudly if Trump could be dictator forever.  This is why so many on the right praise putin.


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 29, 2022)




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## surada (Dec 29, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>


Excellent clip. Thanks.


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 29, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 29, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 29, 2022)




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## Orangecat (Dec 29, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump Wanted So Stay In Office.​


Lulz. Illiterate imbecile.


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Faun (Dec 30, 2022)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Fake news.









						Did Trump Defense Secretary 'Disarm' DC National Guard Before Insurrection?
					

The claim stemmed from a Jan. 4 memo authored by former acting Defense Security Christopher Miller.




					www.snopes.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)

Rioter who received call from White House landline on Jan. 6 ID'ed
					

Ahead of the Jan. 6 committee’s last expected public hearing this week, Denver Riggleman, a former Republican congressman and onetime adviser to the insurrection panel, stirred up a bit of controversy. In an interview for 60 Minutes on Sunday,...




					www.dailykos.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 30, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 31, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 31, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 31, 2022)

A retired New York police officer who was also a Marine veteranwas sentenced Thursday to 10 years in prison for assaulting police in the Capitol attack on Jan. 6, 2021 – the longest sentence yet from the riot.

Thomas Webster, 56, of Goshen, New York, was convicted in a federal jury trial in May of all six charges against him, including assaulting a police officer and engaging in violence on restricted grounds with a dangerous weapon.

Webster said he was swept up in politics and former President Donald Trump's rhetoric about a stolen election but wished he'd never come to Washington.

“I should have not been there on Jan. 6 to protest the election, and I wish the events of that horrible day had never happened," Webster said through sniffles. "People would still be alive. People would not have gotten hurt. And families would not be torn apart.”

*Jan. 6 rioter Julian Khater pleads guilty to assaulting late Officer Brian Sicknick*

Webster apologized to D.C. Metropolitan Police Officer Noah Rathbun, whom he was convicted of attacking and choking.

“I want to apologize to you and most importantly your family," Webster said. "I’m sorry."

U.S. District Judge Amit Mehta said Webster threw away a lifetime of respect for 20 years as a police officer and for his Marine service because of 46 seconds of violence recorded outside the Capitol. Mehta said the case reflected aberrant behavior that continues to tear at the country's fabric.










						Retired NY cop gets 10 years in prison, longest sentence yet in Jan. 6 Capitol attack
					

Thomas Webster, a retired police officer and Marine veteran, was sentenced to 10 years in prison for attacking an officer on Jan. 6, 2021.



					www.usatoday.com


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## Sixties Fan (Dec 31, 2022)




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## Sixties Fan (Dec 31, 2022)




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## schmidlap (Jan 1, 2023)

Sixties Fan said:


> Trump Wanted To Stay In Office.​











The American electorate wanted Trump to go away.

It made him go away.




_"AHHHHHH, PHOOEY!"_​


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 2, 2023)




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## Sixties Fan (Jan 2, 2023)




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## Sixties Fan (Jan 2, 2023)




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## Sixties Fan (Jan 2, 2023)

*

*​


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)




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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)




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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)




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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)

[ Congress People with something to fear from what happened on January 6 ]


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)

A text exchange between Ivanka Trump’s chief of staff Julie Radford and White House aide Hope Hicks reveals their anger over then-President Donald Trump’s actions on January 6, 2021, hurting them professionally, according to newly released documents collected by the House select committee investigating the Capitol Hill insurrection.

“In one day he ended every future opportunity that doesn’t include speaking engagements at the local Proud Boys chapter,” Hicks wrote to Radford on January 6, 2021. “And all of us that didn’t have jobs lined up will be perpetually unemployed. I’m so mad and upset. We all look like domestic terrorists now.”

Hicks added: “This made us all unemployable. Like untouchable. God I’m so f***ing mad.”

Radford responded by texting, “I know, like there isn’t a chance of finding a job,” and indicating she already lost a job opportunity from Visa, which sent her a “blow off email.” 

The new release is part of a steady stream of documents from the committee, complementing the release of its sweeping 845-page report. The latest comes as the panel winds down its work with the House majority set to change hands from Democrats to Republicans on Tuesday at the start of the new Congress.


(full article online)




			https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/02/politics/january-6-text-messages?link_id=11&can_id=6e84143cce349aec0c9a0b4e4a28c9c6&source=email-mccarthy-caves-to-gop-clown-caucus-in-speaker-quest&email_referrer=email_1777107&email_subject=newly-elected-gop-rep-hit-with-criminal-charges


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)

*

*
​


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)

Trump 'will always do the worst thing': Another Jan. 6 witness cites White House conniving and chaos
					

While the House Jan. 6 committee has proved beyond a reasonable doubt that Donald Trump was criminally responsible for the 2021 Capitol incursion, the transcripts it has released over the past several days have also conclusively shown that he’s unfit...




					www.dailykos.com


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 3, 2023)

Understanding the Report
					

And what the January 6 committee accomplished




					joycevance.substack.com


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## Sixties Fan (Jan 5, 2023)




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## Faun (Jan 5, 2023)

Sixties Fan said:


>



Cowards.


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## The5thHorseman (Jan 5, 2023)

TNHarley said:


> Its crazy how easy yall rubes fall for his trolls.
> Blows the mind actually.


Did you vote for him?


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## TNHarley (Jan 5, 2023)

The5thHorseman said:


> Did you vote for him?


Fuck no


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## Sixties Fan (Friday at 6:19 AM)




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## Sixties Fan (Friday at 12:02 PM)

[ Detailed account of what led to 1/6/21 and after ]









						Trump’s Long Campaign to Steal the Presidency: A Timeline
					

The insurrection wasn’t a one-day event. It was the culmination of a multifaceted, yearslong plot — and it isn’t over.




					nymag.com


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## Sixties Fan (Friday at 3:29 PM)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/10/11/kevin-mccarthy-jan-6-trump-book/


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## Dagosa (Friday at 3:29 PM)

TNHarley said:


> Its crazy how easy yall rubes fall for his trolls.
> Blows the mind actually.


So easy, they voted him out of office.


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## Sixties Fan (Saturday at 12:06 AM)




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## Sixties Fan (Saturday at 8:38 AM)




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## Sixties Fan (Sunday at 9:51 AM)

The Jan. 6 committee recently released its transcripts from interviews with election workers Ruby Freeman and Wandrea ArShaye Moss, two women who endured smears and death threats spurred by the former president, his attorney Rudy Giuliani, and a mass of Trump’s supporters who failed to discern fact from fiction when it came to the 2020 election. 


Freeman and Moss were election workers in Georgia targeted by Trump and Giuliani as the men publicly shared conspiracy theories about election fraud in Georgia.
Pointing to security footage of Moss and Freeman innocently working at a voting center, they publicly accused Moss of giving her mother “USB drives” containing votes for now-President Joe Biden.

Giuliani once said she passed them off to her mother like vials of cocaine.
The “USB” was, in fact, a ginger mint. 

After the committee published transcripts from its interviews with Freeman and Moss, on Jan. 3 Trump took to his social media platform TruthSocial and picked up right about where he left off with the women. 

“Wow! Has anyone seen the Ruby Freeman ‘contradictions’ of her sworn testimony? Now this is ‘BIG STUFF.’ Look what was captured by Cobb County police body cameras on January 4, 2021….” Trump wrote. 

He followed it up with two more posts sputtering similar lies about “suitcases” packed with ballots. Investigators have determined those “suitcases” were standard issue boxes used to transfer ballots. 

This conspiracy theory and others like it have been debunked at length. It would all seem merely to be a bit of horrible deja vu, but there is at least one critical difference this time around. Thanks to the select committee’s 18-month investigation of Jan. 6, there is a mountain of evidence featuring corroborated witness testimony from among the highest ranks of the Trump administration affirming that Trump was told, repeatedly and directly, that his accusations of election fraud were patently false. 


(full article online)









						It is happening again: Trump attacks election workers with election disinformation
					

Warning: The following article contains quotes from a witness who repeated a racial slur used against her. It is happening again: Former President Donald Trump is attacking innocent Americans and smearing them with dangerous lies. The Jan. 6 committee...




					www.dailykos.com


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## Sixties Fan (Monday at 12:42 AM)

[ Night and Day ]


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## Sixties Fan (Monday at 12:45 AM)




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## Sixties Fan (Monday at 9:32 AM)

[ The Pro Law and Order President ]

The former president, speaking from a podium, also insisted that a “lunatic” fatally shot Capitol rioter Ashli Babbitt during the Jan. 6 violence in 2021.

“There was no reason” for it, said Trump. “We’re not going to let this go on. These are people are horrible, horrible people,” he added, apparently referring to police protecting lawmakers that day. “What they’ve done to protesters ...”

Babbitt, a Trump supporter, was shot by a police officer during the insurrection as she was climbing through a smashed window in the Capitol as a violent mob tried to reach lawmakers in their bid to overthrow Trump’s defeat. (*See the video below*).

The Justice Department investigated Babbitt’s shooting and chose not to prosecute the Capitol police officer who shot her.

Trump again insisted the rioters were merely “protesting a dishonest election.” There’s no evidence the vote was dishonest.

Nearly 1,000 rioters have been charged or convicted in the Jan. 6 riot. The Justice Department continues investigating.

Micki Witthoeft, the mother of Ashli Babbitt, was arrested after blocking traffic in a protest on Capitol grounds on Friday, police said. She ignored orders to move and instead “turned around with her hands behind her back and asked to be arrested,” Capitol police said in a statement.


Frequent Mar-a-Lago visitor Kari Lakeappeared at the event with Trump. She has been baselessly calling herself the “duly elected governor” of Arizona, even though she lost the gubernatorial election to Democrat Katie Hobbs in November.

Trump has mostly been hunkered down at Mar-a-Lago, even though he announced in mid-November that he’s running for the presidency again. He’s surrounded by sycophants at his resort, which one Trump confidant recently referred to as a kind of “Barbie Dream House”where Trump can still pretend he’s president.












						Trump Says Biden 'Convinced' Putin To Bomb Ukraine In Mar-a-Lago Campaign Speech
					

He also again insisted violent Capitol rioters were simply "protesting a dishonest election," despite a complete lack of evidence of anything but a legitimate vote.




					news.yahoo.com


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## Sixties Fan (Monday at 12:11 PM)




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## Ivan88 (Monday at 5:45 PM)

No matter who you vote for,  evil always wins, because you are always voting for the lesser to 2 evils.


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## Sixties Fan (Monday at 6:49 PM)




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## Sixties Fan (Monday at 9:08 PM)




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