# Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism



## Menerva Lindsen (Feb 6, 2015)

It is unfair. 
It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.


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## Skylar (Feb 6, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.



Of course not. Anymore than criticism of Obama's policies is racism.


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## Disir (Feb 6, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.




Did you want to purchase an olive tree?  Or did you donate money to pay the wages of Palestinians to show up at protests?  You don't mind if people demand financial information of the NGOs, do you?


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## toxicmedia (Feb 6, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.


Yeah...I think you can examine that struggle, and not think that Israel is 100% good, and the Palestinians 100% evil.

Having said that...I am historically prone to unconventional positions.

In the 90's I was pro Palestinian and pro South African/Apartheid. Don't ask me to explain that either.

And I see anyone who is anti Isarel, and pro American, a hypocrite.

The formation of the state of Israel is no different in scope than the formation of the US...from the perspective of Native Americans and displaced Palestinians.

So maybe that's why Republicans are more likely to be John Wayne fans


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## Contumacious (Feb 6, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.




Excellent post.

Unfortunately , the zionists use anti-antisemitism in order to perpetrate a fraud.

many Jews are not Zionists - the zionists refer to them as 'self-hating" Jews

Those of us who object to the 1925 Zionist invasion , and most importantly to Truman.s 1949  declaration , and subsequent massive US  foreign aid which subsidizes the Palestinian Holocaust.

.


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## Skylar (Feb 6, 2015)

toxicmedia said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...



The primary difference would be the Geneva Conventions. We had no rules of war in when we took over Indian land. The Geneva Conventions explicitly forbid much of what Israel is doing.

Worse, if its just a stand up fight where who ever has the biggest guns wins, why are we involved? If however, we're defending the rule of law, which explicitly recognizes Israel's right to exist AND requires Israel to abide international law.......then we have every reason to be involved.

I'm down with Israel as long as she's not flagrantly violating international law. And she is.


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

Arabs are also Semitic!


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## ScienceRocks (Feb 6, 2015)

And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.


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## Contumacious (Feb 6, 2015)

Matthew said:


> And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.




Excuse me dingle berry, Palestine is THEIR LAND, the zionists are the invaders.


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## LeftofLeft (Feb 6, 2015)

Just as criticizing at Black President is NOT Racism.


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## ScienceRocks (Feb 6, 2015)

Contumacious said:


> Matthew said:
> 
> 
> > And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.
> ...



Faggot,

The jews have been part of this land for over 5,000 years. Wtf are you saying?  They built a first world nation that is constantly being attacked by the savages we call palestines. 

Islam has the entire middle east to fucking destroy. Israel has a little sliver of land to buiid what these bastards can't. 

You support islamic thugs? Idiots like you would be slaughtered if it wasn't for our troops defending your faggot ass.


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## TheOldSchool (Feb 6, 2015)

toxicmedia said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
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> > It is unfair.
> ...





Matthew said:


> Contumacious said:
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> > Matthew said:
> ...


Oooh the little grammar deficient racist pokes out her claws


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

Dr. Ghada Karmi’s latest book _Married to Another Man: Israel’s Dilemma in Palestine_ opens with the problem European Zionists faced over a century ago when they first mooted the idea of a Jewish state in Palestine. They found then that there was already a well-established Palestinian society existing in the land they wished to claim as their own. Hence the message sent back to Vienna by the two rabbis who made the discovery: “The bride is beautiful, but she is married to another man.”

It is the essence of “Israel’s dilemma”: how to effect the disappearance of the ever-present Palestinians so that a purely Jewish state can exist on Palestinian land? The Zionist program of ethnic cleansing that has been going on since Israel’s creation has not solved the problem. Neither has the living hell of occupation.

Married to Another Man

Jews are squatting on Palestinian land - and trying to steal more.


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## Staidhup (Feb 6, 2015)

Palestine was first used by the Romans to describe the region after the second invasion, destruction of Israel, and removal of their puppet Royalty. It was an attempt to once and for all erase the memory and traditions of the country, its Kings, history, and people to insure this region of hostility would never riser again. Before Roman conquest the Babylonians,Egyptians, Phoenicians, and others, referenced the area as the country of Israel. In 1948 Arab countries adopted the name Palestine to reference non Jewish population living in the area, a way to segregate native Jews and Arabs for their own gain. No such country known as Palestine ever existed. The English Empire adopted the word Palestine from the Roman description of the region. 
Efforts toward resurrection and reestablishment of Israel well preceded the contraction and dissolution of the English Empire at the close of WW2.
So what rights do the Palestinian people have to the land, nothing more than that of sub tribes residing in the general proximity for the political benefit of others.


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## Tom Sweetnam (Feb 6, 2015)

If you feel the need to constantly apologize for your convictions, well then they're not convictions, are they?


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Arabs are also Semitic!


 
Really? Well I'm a native American ... I was born here.


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

SAYIT said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > Arabs are also Semitic!
> ...



Are you classified by the U.S. Government as Native American?  If not - you ain't a Native American.


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## JakeStarkey (Feb 6, 2015)

Then the Arabs should not have attacked the Jews, nu?


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## Mr. H. (Feb 6, 2015)

Jews are thin-skinned. African-Americans are black-skinned. To criticize either metes the same sentence of either anti-semitism or racism. And frankly, Shirley, I'm tired of this shit. Live and let live, don't live and let die. And please stop deluding yourselves with the God Complex. We are alone on a nondescript clod of earth meandering about a galaxy that is but one of trillions of trillions. Fucking conceited idiots.


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## irosie91 (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Dr. Ghada Karmi’s latest book _Married to Another Man: Israel’s Dilemma in Palestine_ opens with the problem European Zionists faced over a century ago when they first mooted the idea of a Jewish state in Palestine. They found then that there was already a well-established Palestinian society existing in the land they wished to claim as their own. Hence the message sent back to Vienna by the two rabbis who made the discovery: “The bride is beautiful, but she is married to another man.”
> 
> It is the essence of “Israel’s dilemma”: how to effect the disappearance of the ever-present Palestinians so that a purely Jewish state can exist on Palestinian land? The Zionist program of ethnic cleansing that has been going on since Israel’s creation has not solved the problem. Neither has the living hell of occupation.
> 
> ...



bullshit-----the  "married to another man" IF IT WAS ACTUALLY SAID OR WRITTEN in the nineteenth century  refers to the fact that ----at that time it was ruled by the fucking turks.     
The really interesting aspect of the situation is that the turks
hated the squatter arabs and were delighted to sell land to jews----
THEIR LAND------the turks owned it------the arabs had transformed it into a cesspit of cholera,  tuberculosis,   shistosomiasis,  polio and even leprosy.    Palestine was never  ARABIA.       Arabic is a foreign language in the land
that was called  "Palestine" for almost 2000 years.   The one
extant language native to that land is Hebrew

now who was it that wrote     "married to another man"?---
can we have a NAME?       There was no time in the past
3000 years that the land later called Palestine harbored no
jews.       A clue to the islam Nazi  POV is revealed in the statement  "when European jews.........."     More than half of the population of Israel   THEN AND NOW----have roots in the middle east-------             words is words and that is all you scum have


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> SAYIT said:
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I'm using your Semitic "logic." Since I was born here in America, I'm a native. 
Now according to the dictionary, anti-Semite refers to those who are "hostile toward or prejudiced against Jews" and even comes with a pic of you:


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

Some food for thought...

The Origin of the Palestine-Israel Conflict


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## abu afak (Feb 6, 2015)

There seems to be alot of controversy, as everywhere, about about Israel critism and anti-semitism. A discussion that needs airing.

There's plenty of anti-semitism on this board, most, NOT ALL, of the 'ant-zionists' on this particular board are.
(Not on many others however)

Anti-zionism to me being objecting to Israel's existence, not as some/many now use it to describe 'aggressive' policies of Israel. *The accusation/Epithet 'zionist' as if this means "aggressive Israeli" or "aggressive Jew" however, IS antisemitic.*

To me 'zionism' is a done deal.
There are Israelis who are for retreat to the 1967 borders, those wanting some sort of compromise (those two being the vast majority) and those few settlers who want all of the WB.
But ALL of these people, including those of us who support Israel's existence and right to defend itself, are 'Zionists'.
Just as here in the USA there are those for a more or less strong foreign policy. That doesn't make any of them more or less American.

Of course, Not all Israel critics are biased. But Proxy-anti-semtism/'The New anti-semitism' IS quite common.

A good piece on this by Alan Dershowitz on HuffingtonPost. July 2005.
Also like the quote by Thomas Friedman.
*Alan Dershowitz: When Legit Criticism Crosses the Anti-Semitism Line*



> "It's interesting how quickly the bigots -- Jews and non-Jews alike -- crawl out from under their rocks as soon as Israel is mentioned. *The Newest form of Bigotry is to claim that I and others who generally support Israel argue that "Anyone who Criticizes Israel is an anti-Semite." **This is a Bald-faced Lie. I always criticize specific Israeli policies, Israeli leaders, and Israeli actions.*
> 
> *Most Israelis criticize specific policies.* Israel is among the most self-critical countries in the world. Several years ago, I offered a large monetary award (payable to the PLO) for anyone who could actually come up with a quote by a prominent pro-Israeli writer who equated mere criticism of Israel with anti-Semitism. No one came to collect the reward, because no respectable person has ever made this absurd claim.
> As Thomas Friedman of The New York Times accurately put it, _"Criticizing Israel is not anti-Semitic, and saying so is vile. But Singling out Israel for opprobrium and international sanction -- Out of all proportion to any other party in the Middle East -- is anti-Semitic, and not saying so is dishonest"._
> ...


From above:
*As Thomas Friedman of The New York Times accurately put it, "Criticizing Israel is not anti-Semitic, and saying so is vile. But Singling out Israel for opprobrium and international sanction -- Out of all proportion to any other party in the Middle East -- is anti-Semitic, and not saying so is dishonest".*
_`_


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

SAYIT said:


> Lakhota said:
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> > SAYIT said:
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You pitiful little retard.  Try looking up Semitic.

The Myth of Anti-Semitism - The Ugly Truth

Semitic people - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


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## TemplarKormac (Feb 6, 2015)

Cute the Israel bashing here in this thread... but the same facts exist. Israel and its people have ancient ties to that land. Face it, Israel will not die, much to your dismay.


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> SAYIT said:
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> > Lakhota said:
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We're not discussing Semites but rather anti-Semites. Look it up and while you're at it, look up the word "native."

: born in a particular place
—used to refer to the place where a person was born and raised
: belonging to a person since birth or childhood

Native - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary[1]


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

Israel is losing the public relations war:

The Netanyahu Disaster - The Atlantic

Netanyahu Government Suggests Israelis Avoid Marrying American Jews - The Atlantic

Netanyahu snubs Obama, shocks the Jews and gambles on Iran and the elections

Israel will lose all American Jews but the crazies

On how American Jews are Mostly the Opposite of Israeli PM Binyamin Netanyahu


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## Billo_Really (Feb 6, 2015)

Disir said:


> Did you want to purchase an olive tree?


Did you kill someone trying to plant an olive tree?


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## Dogmaphobe (Feb 6, 2015)

Criticizing certain actions of the Israeli government is not antisemitic, but the vilification of  everything and anything associated with Israel sure is.

 The op was written by an antisemite who wants to indulge in its hatred of Jews but doesn't want to be called on it. The tip-off is the creature's questioning of Israel's very legitimacy.


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Israel is losing the public relations war:
> 
> The Netanyahu Disaster - The Atlantic
> 
> ...



Yeah, yeah, yeah ... meanwhile the hapless Palestinians wallow in squalid "refugee" camps. Some friend you are.


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## irosie91 (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Some food for thought...
> 
> The Origin of the Palestine-Israel Conflict



your article consists of both some HISTORY  and a very clear
BIAS       It is not so much the facts but their INTERPRETATIONS that is faulty.     I really enjoyed that
"jews and arabs lived in 'relative' harmony'   
   in the middle east and in  'palestine'-----my own
   hubby and his family and community had lived in
   the middle east-------forever---eventually --for the past
   approximately 2500 years-----until the 20th century AD-----
   in a land now  100% muslim----for about the past 1200
   years.     They were a literate people-----with a REAL
   ..... not conjecture.    Your article is full of nonsensical
   conjecture


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## Billo_Really (Feb 6, 2015)

toxicmedia said:


> The formation of the state of Israel is no different in scope than the formation of the US...from the perspective of Native Americans and displaced Palestinians.


So when do the Pals get their casino's?


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Billo_Really said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > The formation of the state of Israel is no different in scope than the formation of the US...from the perspective of Native Americans and displaced Palestinians.
> ...


 
Not a bad idea. They have a nice strip of land right on the Mediterranean that seems like a great location but they'll have to divert resources from tunnel-digging and weapons purchases to build them. Atlantic City on the Mediterranean! Beautiful!


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

*Semite* - *a member of a group of people originally of southwestern Asia that includes Jews and Arabs*

Semite - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Hence, anti-Semite applies equally to Arabs and Jews - even though Jews have tried to hijack it.


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## Rocko (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> SAYIT said:
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> > Lakhota said:
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You're a hopeless moron. Antisemitism does not include all Semitic people, it's limited to who specifically hates just the jews, retard...look up the word in a dictionary...but you can't stop blurting out your Nazi talking point...I'm mean if if you were right it would just be semantics. ..but you're not right, which makes you that much more of a moron, fake indian.


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> *Semite* - a member of a group of people originally of southwestern Asia that includes Jews and Arabs
> 
> Semite - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
> 
> Hence, anti-Semite applies equally to Arabs and Jews.



No, it doesn't:

"_*Anti*_-_*Semitism*_: (1) hostility toward Jews as a religious or racial minority group, often accompanied by social, political or economic discrimination (2) opposition to Zionism (3) sympathy for the opponents of Israel."

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...T6zIBI&usg=AFQjCNE0SxDB63XE4YYGaGDocTkXv9avYg


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## Rocko (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> *Semite* - *a member of a group of people originally of southwestern Asia that includes Jews and Arabs*
> 
> Semite - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
> 
> Hence, anti-Semite applies equally to Arabs and Jews - even though Jews have tried to hijack it.



Now show us a definition of anti-Semite,  idiot.


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## Rocko (Feb 6, 2015)

SAYIT said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > *Semite* - a member of a group of people originally of southwestern Asia that includes Jews and Arabs
> ...



Even if the fake I Dian was right it would just be semantics, but since the fake Indian is stupid - he does not realize this and is hung up on this stupid argument.


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## irosie91 (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> SAYIT said:
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> > Lakhota said:
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Lak-----anyone can quote islamo Nazi propaganda----it is nothing new.      I first read it as a child under the age of ten---
circa  1960       I heard it quoted a bit more than ten years later  from the mouths of  ----muslims born---FAR FAR AWAY--------their ability to quote the filth got them into
medical school in their third world muslim countries.   At the
time  I first read it ----back then  circa 1960----it was already
OLD STUFF--------btw---tammy is nothing more than an hysterical  "professional"   parrot of the old stuff


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

I used to be indifferent toward Jews - but Nutanyahoo and his hardliners (including some assholes on this board) are changing my indifference.  Jews are a whiny bunch of land thieves.


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## Rocko (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> I used to be indifferent toward Jews - but Nutanyahoo and his hardliners (including some assholes on this board) are changing my indifference.  Jews are a whiny bunch of land thieves.



Don't ever complain about racism, you don't have the moral authority.


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

*Dems Lining Up To Skip Netanyahu Speech

Fuck Nutanyahoo!*


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## abu afak (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> S*emite* - *a member of a group of people originally of southwestern Asia that includes Jews and Arabs*
> Semite - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
> 
> *Hence, anti-Semite applies equally to Arabs and Jews - even though Jews have tried to hijack it.*


*Note the DISHONESTY of not looking up the precise term in question.
Yes, the old antisemitic sophistry of redefining antisemitism.*
I know it well from many boards.
*
The word means/always meant Anti-Jewish ALONE.*
One Cannot just "connect the dots" (Alert!), by assuming adding the prefix to the term makes a new word that the two might otherwise suggest.
ie
*If one was to combine "anti" and "missile" one would get a word that Only means defense from ONE kind of missile** (as opposed to a sock thrown by your brother), Not ALL missiles. (Nor, similarly, all Semites)*

*And it certainly wasn't done by "zionists"
The word first used in 1860, the year Herzl was Born.*

Antisemitism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


> "*Despite the use of the prefix anti-, the terms "Semitic" and "antisemitic" are Not directly opposed to each other, making the term a misnomer. "Antisemitism" refers Specifically to prejudice against Jews ALONE* and in general,[3] Despite the fact that there are other speakers of Semitic languages (e.g Arabs, Ethiopians..) and that not all Jews speak Semitic language.
> 
> Altho Wilhelm Marr is generally credited with coining the word "anti-Semitism", Alex Bein writes that* the word was first used in 1860* by the Austrian Jewish scholar Moritz Steinschneider in the phrase "anti-Semitic prejudices".[14] Steinschneider used this phrase to characterize Ernest Renan's ideas about how "Semitic races" were inferior to "Aryan races." [.......]



*And I note Lakhota is now just DUMPING anti-Netanyahu stuff into a string he intentionally put in the WRONG Section to get more attention. Not even on HIS own Topic of what criticism is.
`*


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> I used to be indifferent toward Jews - but Nutanyahoo and his hardliners (including some assholes on this board) are changing my indifference.  Jews are a whiny bunch of land thieves.


 
Yanno, I've yet to encounter a raging anti-Semite who didn't have an endless supply of excuses for their mindless hate but I admire your willingness to admit it. I never understand why goose-steppers deny it. Be proud of what you are!


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)




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## Esmeralda (Feb 6, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.


I agree. Criticizing the Israel government is not antisemitism.  Criticizing people just because they are Jews is antisemitism.  As well, denying the Holocaust is antisemitism because people were killed because they were Jews.  It was genocide, and denying it denies the value of Jewish people as human beings.


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Esmeralda said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...



Believe it or not, there are people who couch their anti-Semitism in anti-Israelism.
True story.


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

*Netanyahu says UN should scrap Gaza war probe by 'anti-Israeli body'*

JERUSALEM — Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu called Tuesday for scrapping a UN commission, which is tasked with investigating potential war crimes committed last summer in Gaza, after the inquiry's chief resigned amid accusations from Israel that he was biased against the country.

Mr. Netanyahu said the commission, set up by the Geneva-based UN Human Rights Council, was an "anti-Israeli body" that had a proven track record of doing nothing about true human rights violations around the world.

The UN commission is due to issue its report next month. Israel did not cooperate with it, saying it was hostile to Israel and that its conclusions were known in advance.

More: Netanyahu says UN should scrap Gaza war probe by anti-Israeli body - CSMonitor.com

Nutanyahoo is not only evil - he's also a whiny bastard.  I get tired of President Obama protecting that piece of shit.


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## ScienceRocks (Feb 6, 2015)

So israel shouldn't do anything when the palestines are shooting missiles into their land? Oh'yesss, the jews need to get out of muslim land.

Pretty soon Brition, France and America will be Muslim lands. LIberals are traitors.


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## Rocko (Feb 6, 2015)

My experience with the anti Israel crowd is an overwhelming amount of them are indeed antisemitic.


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## ScienceRocks (Feb 6, 2015)

Rocko said:


> My experience with the anti Israel crowd is an overwhelming amount of them are indeed antisemitic.



These people hate jews and think only muslims should control the entire middle east.


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## Lakhota (Feb 6, 2015)

*Arabs are also Semitic* - although Jews have tried to hijack exclusive use of the word.


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## abu afak (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Arabs are also Semitic - although Jews have tried to hijack exclusive use of the word.


*Now just repeating/Trolling his Rabid refuted Lie of the last page...
Lakhota is not even coherent nor conversant.*
AGAIN


*Note the DISHONESTY of not looking up the precise term in question.
Yes, the old antisemitic sophistry of redefining antisemitism.*
I know it well from many boards.
*
The word means/always meant Anti-Jewish ALONE.*
One Cannot just "connect the dots" (Alert!), by assuming adding the prefix to the term makes a new word that the two might otherwise suggest.
ie
*If one was to combine "anti" and "missile" one would get a word that Only means defense from ONE kind of missile** (as opposed to a sock thrown by your brother), Not ALL missiles. (Nor, similarly, all Semites)*

*And it certainly wasn't done by "zionists"
The word first used in 1860, the year Herzl was Born.*

Antisemitism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


> "*Despite the use of the prefix anti-, the terms "Semitic" and "antisemitic" are Not directly opposed to each other, making the term a misnomer. "Antisemitism" refers Specifically to prejudice against Jews ALONE* and in general,[3] Despite the fact that there are other speakers of Semitic languages (e.g Arabs, Ethiopians..) and that not all Jews speak Semitic language.
> 
> Altho Wilhelm Marr is generally credited with coining the word "anti-Semitism", Alex Bein writes that* the word was first used in 1860* by the Austrian Jewish scholar Moritz Steinschneider in the phrase "anti-Semitic prejudices".[14] Steinschneider used this phrase to characterize Ernest Renan's ideas about how "Semitic races" were inferior to "Aryan races." [.......]



*And I note in addition to repeating his anti-Joo LIE, Lakhota is now just DUMPING anti-Netanyahu stuff into a string he intentionally put in the WRONG Section to get more attention. Not even on HIS own Topic of what criticism is.
`*


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Rocko said:


> My experience with the anti Israel crowd is an overwhelming amount of them are indeed antisemitic.



Campus Incitement Proves Anti-Zionism Still Equals Anti-Semitism - Commentary Magazine Commentary Magazine

Supporters of the effort to isolate Israel have tried to argue that their BDS—boycott, divest, and sanction—campaign is aimed only at the State of Israel and not Jews. But just as the demonstrations throughout Europe protesting Israel’s efforts to defend itself against Hamas terrorism were conducted in a manner that is indistinguishable from traditional anti-Semitic incitement so, too, have the pro-BDS crowd at universities and colleges often quickly descended into expressions of Jew-hatred. This unfortunate truth was demonstrated again last week at the University of California, Davis when a debate about a BDS resolution led to anti-Semitic activity.


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## Rocko (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Arabs are also Semitic - although Jews have tried to hijack exclusive use of the word.



Those evil jews hijacking words!!! Seriously you're possibly the biggest idiot on this board, which is impressive.


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## SAYIT (Feb 6, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> *Arabs are also Semitic* - although Jews have tried to hijack exclusive use of the word.



Jews did not hijack the term, NaziGirl, it was imposed on them by "people" just like YOU.

"While the conjunction of the units anti, Semite and ism indicates antisemitism as being directed against all Semitic people, the term was popularized in Germany in 1873 as a scientific-sounding term for _Judenhass_ ("Jew-hatred"),[4] although it had been used for at least two decades prior,[5] and that has been its normal use since then.[6] For the purposes of a 2005 U.S. governmental report, antisemitism was considered "hatred toward Jews—individually and as a group—that can be attributed to the Jewish religion and/or ethnicity."

Antisemitism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


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## Esmeralda (Feb 7, 2015)

SAYIT said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> > Menerva Lindsen said:
> ...


Yes, I know. I've met many.


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## Skylar (Feb 7, 2015)

Matthew said:


> And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.



Sure you can. You can criticize any illegal action taken by anyone in the region. Who said otherwise?


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## elektra (Feb 7, 2015)

Contumacious said:


> Matthew said:
> 
> 
> > And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.
> ...


If Palestine is THEIR LAND, why do they use a name for Palestine that is of the Philistines? Why do Palestinians continue to describe themselves as, Arabs. People from Arabia? 

Invaders? Arab history is the history of Invaders, fighting and raiding other tribes. 

At best Palestinians are those who were pushed out of Arabia by the stronger tribes, migrating to Palestine. Hell, many Mosques are simply Christian or Jewish churches, repainted by Arabs.


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## elektra (Feb 7, 2015)

Skylar said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > Menerva Lindsen said:
> ...


Which law of the Geneva Convention are you referring to?


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## elektra (Feb 7, 2015)

Yes, criticism is not anti-Semitic. 

Yet being a liar about Israel is.


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## Penelope (Feb 7, 2015)

TemplarKormac said:


> Cute the Israel bashing here in this thread... but the same facts exist. Israel and its people have ancient ties to that land. Face it, Israel will not die, much to your dismay.



Israel and its people include the Pals and the Christians.


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## Penelope (Feb 7, 2015)

Esmeralda said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...


Denying the story of the Jewish holocaust is not anti-Semitic, its reading history and not believing all the made up BS.


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## Lakhota (Feb 7, 2015)

Personally, I don't deny the holocaust - any more than some deny the genocide of Native Americans.


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## SAYIT (Feb 7, 2015)

Penelope said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > Cute the Israel bashing here in this thread... but the same facts exist. Israel and its people have ancient ties to that land. Face it, Israel will not die, much to your dismay.
> ...


 
Indeed! For a tiny country surrounded by hateful neighbors the Jewish Homeland has a remarkably diverse population. Thanks for making that point.


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## SAYIT (Feb 7, 2015)

Penelope said:


> Esmeralda said:
> 
> 
> > Menerva Lindsen said:
> ...



The Holocaust is not a Jewish story but I do appreciate your eagerness to expose your Nazi underbelly and, regrettably, that of most "anti-Israel" posters here.


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## Daniyel (Feb 7, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.


Its not the criticism bothers me, its the criticizers -


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## Rocko (Feb 7, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Personally, I don't deny the holocaust - any more than some deny the genocide of Native Americans.



In other words you're willing to compromise on truth.


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## IlarMeilyr (Feb 7, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen  said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.



*Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism *

*to CORRECT that thread headline, one would need to insert an appropriate modifier or two.*

*Criticism of Israel is NOT ALWAYS Anti-Semitism.*

*But of course, often times it is nothing BUT anti-Semitism.*


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Feb 7, 2015)

"Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism"

Correct. 

Unfortunately there are many who seek to propagate the lie that it is anti-Semitism in an effort to shield Israel from criticism, rendering any meaningful, intelligent discussion on the issue impossible.


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## SAYIT (Feb 7, 2015)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> "Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism"
> 
> Correct.
> 
> Unfortunately there are many who seek to propagate the lie that it is anti-Semitism in an effort to shield Israel from criticism, rendering any meaningful, intelligent discussion on the issue impossible.


 
And those who merely couch their anti-Semitism in anti-Israelism.


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## Penelope (Feb 7, 2015)

elektra said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > Matthew said:
> ...






Daniyel said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...



Because you know its true, you just hate people who tell the truth about things.


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## TemplarKormac (Feb 7, 2015)

Penelope said:


> elektra said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...



Such a base argument. The hate card.


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## Penelope (Feb 7, 2015)

TemplarKormac said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> > elektra said:
> ...



What, that is as bad as this statement: *Its not the criticism bothers me, its the criticizers*
What does that mean?

Its like" its not the stealing of the land that bothers me, its the people stealing it"


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## TemplarKormac (Feb 7, 2015)

Penelope said:


> TemplarKormac said:
> 
> 
> > Penelope said:
> ...



I don't know what you're talking about. You make zero sense. 

It isn't the Israelis bothering me, it's the people trying to kill them. 

Got it?


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## MaryL (Feb 7, 2015)

That is why Iran is having a Cartoon festival mocking the genocide of Jews?  Hardy har har, how hilarious. But if you mock Islam, you get a fatwa or whatever those muslim  pigs call it, Charlie Hebdo. Salman Rushdie. Let alone 9/11. Death to Islam. A pox on all their houses.


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Skylar said:


> toxicmedia said:
> 
> 
> > Menerva Lindsen said:
> ...






 Then you will have no problems in producing these international laws and showing when and where Israel has breached them. And no ISLAMONAZI, white supremacist and NAZI websites please as they are biased.


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Arabs are also Semitic!






 Not when it comes to anti-Semitic racism


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Contumacious said:


> Matthew said:
> 
> 
> > And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.
> ...






 Not according to CUSTOMARY INTERNATIONAL LAW which very clearly shows that the Jews own all of Palestine and the arab muslims are illegal immigrants. It is the arab muslims who are and always have been the invaders.


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Contumacious said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...



Oh my , another brainwashed deluded pro Palestinian 
There was never a Zionist invasion. An invasion is a military offensive. 
Immigration does not mean invasion. The term Zionist invasion is a Palestinian term that brainwashed people like yourself use.
Palestinian Holocaust? Yikes, you're more demented than I thought !


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Some food for thought...
> 
> The Origin of the Palestine-Israel Conflict



Food for thought from the most anti Israel site which is full of lies...


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> I used to be indifferent toward Jews - but Nutanyahoo and his hardliners (including some assholes on this board) are changing my indifference.  Jews are a whiny bunch of land thieves.


There you go ! Finally your true colors come out. 
Now that you are officially a bigot, don't ever try playing the racist card, you fake Indian.
BTW, this post of yours shows that you couldn't handle losing the precious argument


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.



Fairness has nothing to do with it. It is Zionist policy always to conflate Zionism with Judaism; that way any justified criticism of the Zionist colonisation project (aka Israel) can be painted as "Anti-Semitism". The word has now been so over-used by the Zionists that it has lost any real impact or power over their genuine critics and it never had any power over true Anti-Semites in the first place. 

The word is thrown around as Israeli Hasbara policy with the intent to intimidate anyone with little or no real knowledge of the conflict, other that what they've picked up in the mass media, from delving further and discovering the  truth of the matter. It's the 21st century equivalent of being called a "Heretic" in medieval times.

I'd give it no further concern; remember, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me."


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...








 DEFINE what yiu mean by zionoism


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Penelope said:


> elektra said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...


Telling the truth is something you never do


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Menerva Lindsen said:
> 
> 
> > It is unfair.
> ...


No it isnt you liar. I can think of one poster here that uses it but that's all.

Oh and if Israel is a colonial project, then why did they give back the Sinai, offered to give back the Golan Heights to Syria, and make several offers through the Palestinians to give back the West Bank? Not to mention withdraw from Gaza. 
The term colonial project is part of the long long lonnnnnng list of Palestinian lies that you have fallen for.
Pro Palestinians are so easily brainwashed, it's quite pathetic actually


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## Penelope (Feb 8, 2015)

toastman said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> > elektra said:
> ...



Tell me where I lied if your calling me a liar.


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## Dogmaphobe (Feb 8, 2015)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> "Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism"
> 
> Correct.
> 
> Unfortunately there are many who seek to propagate the lie that it is anti-Semitism in an effort to shield Israel from criticism, rendering any meaningful, intelligent discussion on the issue impossible.




If there is any actual lie being promoted, it is that of idiots who think that complete demonization of everything and anything about Israel is anything BUT antisemitism.  

 The relentless singling out of one tiny nation-state that represents the self-determination of a persecuted minority without even so much as the tiniest shred of human decency, fairness, even-handedness or compassion is anything BUT meaningful or intelligent, even if those with low IQs such as yourself try to foist it off as such.

 Intelligent people indulge in actual criticism. They say "I don't support the policy on building in disputed territory", or "The settlers are part of the problem in achieving peace". Stupid Pallywood parrots never indulge in actual criticism, however, as they are too busy repeating all the framing mechanisms and platitudes they have learned from propagandists. "They deserve the terrorism", "They have too much influence on American politics", "They indulge in "apartheid", "They are European colonizers", "They don't belong there", "They are the real Nazis",  "They are racists", "They use the Holocaust in order to gain leverage", and all the rest of the twaddle to which literally every single Pallywood clone resorts.

"Intelligent discussion" my ass.  The reason so many posters sing the same exact tune is because they AREN'T intelligent enough to see through all the B.S. they spout. All they know is what they are being spoon fed on Pro-Arab hate sites.


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Penelope said:


> toastman said:
> 
> 
> > Penelope said:
> ...



Whenever I catch you lying, I confront you and it's happened many times.
Oh , and for the 100th time, it's you're, not your!!


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## SAYIT (Feb 8, 2015)

Rocko said:


> SAYIT said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



It's called "Playing Semantics with Semitics" and I don't think Lakhota is stupid but rather just brimming with mindless hatred. It's a leftist thing.


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## Penelope (Feb 8, 2015)

toastman said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> > toastman said:
> ...


I don't lie, my opinions are not lies.


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## Lakhota (Feb 8, 2015)

SAYIT said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> > SAYIT said:
> ...



Actually, it's called telling the truth.  Arabs are Semites!  Therefore, anti-Semitism also applies to them.


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## Rocko (Feb 8, 2015)

SAYIT said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> > SAYIT said:
> ...



Lakhota can't even spell Lakota Lakota people - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia, of course he is stupid. How many explanations did people give her about the word anti-Semite and she still doesn't get it? She is hateful fuck though, I'll give you that.


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## aris2chat (Feb 8, 2015)

Rocko said:


> SAYIT said:
> 
> 
> > Rocko said:
> ...



actually it is a valid spelling alternative, much like color and colour


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## Rocko (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> > SAYIT said:
> ...



Prove it.


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## aris2chat (Feb 8, 2015)

Rocko said:


> aris2chat said:
> 
> 
> > Rocko said:
> ...



Lakhota Define Lakhota at Dictionary.com


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## aris2chat (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> > aris2chat said:
> ...



Lakhota Syntax Typology and Information Structure Max Planck Institute for Psycholinguistics


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## aris2chat (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> aris2chat said:
> 
> 
> > Rocko said:
> ...



Lakota Language Consortium
at Lakhota dot org


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## Rocko (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> > aris2chat said:
> ...



Ok my mistake. Still think he's full of shit, but I was wrong.


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## aris2chat (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> aris2chat said:
> 
> 
> > aris2chat said:
> ...



Lakhota - Wiktionary


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## Rocko (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> aris2chat said:
> 
> 
> > Rocko said:
> ...



I get it, you can stop.


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## Daniyel (Feb 8, 2015)

toastman said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > I used to be indifferent toward Jews - but Nutanyahoo and his hardliners (including some assholes on this board) are changing my indifference.  Jews are a whiny bunch of land thieves.
> ...


Precisely, Jews.


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## aris2chat (Feb 8, 2015)

Daniyel said:


> toastman said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



American native/indians were nearly wipe out, comparable to the holocaust and pogroms in percentages, but designating a homeland/reservation has saved the tribes/people from extinction.

Natives are protected people but have their own laws and rights within their land.  Natives and americans are not longer at war with each other.  Disagreements are dealt with mediation and courts.


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## Dogmaphobe (Feb 8, 2015)

aris2chat said:


> actually it is a valid spelling alternative, much like color and colour




Or Anti-semitism and Antisemitism.

 The stupid fake Native American has had the etymology of the term explained to it several times.  It prefers to wallow in its ethnic hatred, however.

 I prefer the term antisemitism with no hyphen, however,. because it does not mean anti-semitic people. Since it was originally coined in German as all one word to indicate a unique hatred of Jews, I prefer to write it as such in English so as to give less room to hateful things such as the fake Native American.


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Menerva Lindsen said:
> ...



Erm....is it a noise Zionists make? (zionoism)


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

toastman said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Menerva Lindsen said:
> ...



Even if only "one poster here that uses it" I can't be lying can I? The reality, however, is that there are far more than one Hasbarist on this forum and they all toe the line on Hasbara policy. 

Even if you chose not to believe me, Shulamit Aloni, winner of the Israel Prize, the highest honour awarded by the state, said much the same thing:


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> SAYIT said:
> 
> 
> > Rocko said:
> ...






 Not when it comes to using their racial background to be racist towards them, this term only applies to the Jews. It has entered into common usage as another name for Jew hatred, racism and Nazism and does not apply to any other group but the Jews. Much as you would like to have it changed to water down the RACISM you throw around anti-Semitism is RACIST JEW HATRED and should be dealt with by severe punishments in a court of law up to and including a custodial sentence as well as a fine of $20,000  ( £10,000  12,000 Euro's )


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...







 SO you are too cowardly to define Zionism in your own words are you, is this because it will show you to be a hate filled NAZI ANTI SEMITIC JEW HATER


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> toastman said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...








 Now how about a LINK ? to your claims made here that there are far more than one hasbarist on this forum and they toe the the line on habara policy. You could of course refuse and show that you are just brainwashed ISLAMONAZI PROPAGANDIST


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...



I've already defined Zionism in my own words, unfortunately you must have been too busy ranting and bloviating away, capitalising your favourite hate phrases, and so missed it. Never mind.


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## Phoenall (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...







NO I have watched your posts since you were first asked and not once have you given a personal definition of Zionism. In fact you have refused point blank to even accept that you have not defined Zionism .


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## Penelope (Feb 8, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > SAYIT said:
> ...





Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...



Ok little child, all Nazis did not have Hitler mentality, actually he had many failed attempts on his life from within his close men, and also the MAJORITY of Nazi's were Christian men, not unlike the US men , British and Frenchmen in WWII. Now I can't speak to the amount who disliked Jews but I imagine many Jews disliked Germans. Anti Semitic was really coined into use in the mid to late 1800's in reference to Jews ,Semites include Arabs as well,  although Jews were not well like before that. To be a Jew hater means one would hate all Jews, and well who would know all Jews, so your name calling is just absurd and really makes you sound  not so bright.

One need not be a jew to be a Zionist, as  shown in the US government, but they are fakes, as they are mainly worried about their position, as they know who has the deep pockets. I imagine more than a few lapdog politicians would rather not to have to deal with faking a prayer to the west wall while wearing a stupid skull cap, but they put up with it. That is where they pledge allegiance to Israel to keep or get a job in Congress.


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## Penelope (Feb 8, 2015)

Known as the father of modern antisemitism, Wilhelm Marr led the fight to overturn Jewish emancipation in Germany.

Born in 1819, Marr entered politics as a democratic revolutionary who favored the emancipation of all oppressed groups, including Jews. However, when he became embittered about the failure of the 1848-49 German Revolution to democratize Germany, and about his own rapidly declining political fortunes, he turned his venom against the Jews. His essay _“Der Sieg des Judenthums über das Germanenthum von nicht confessionellen Standpunkt_” (“The Victory of Judaism over Germandom: From a Non-Denominational Point of View”) reached its 12th edition in 1879.

Marr’s conception of antisemitism focused on the supposed racial, as opposed to religious, characteristics of the Jews. His organization, the League of Antisemites, introduced the word “antisemite” into the political lexicon and established the first popular political movement based entirely on anti-Jewish beliefs.

Wilhelm Marr Jewish Virtual Library


Phoenall said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > SAYIT said:
> ...



Isn't that something , how they can control  other people's tongues and put the fear of heavy fines and prison on people that *they deem anti-Semitic* which doesn't' t take much.


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## abu afak (Feb 8, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...


*Antisemites like Challenger can never give their definition of Zionism.
It betrays their position for what it is. You'll Never get one from him
So he has to Lie alot.*
Note he couldn't repeat his definition' nor link to the post he claimed it was in. A complete Fraud.

People who use the term 'Zionist' as an epithet, are dead giveaways.
Lakhota is downright Rabid..
Penelope is Off the Charts.

It's actually difficult to find Israel critics who aren't transparent Jew haters, at least on This board, where lax rules on the issue have left the dregs.
I myself, though generally pro-Israel, am a strong critic of the Current Netanyahu Govt policies.
But among the Klan here, it's difficult to do anything but Defend Israel.
`


----------



## fanger (Feb 8, 2015)

*Zionism* (Hebrew: צִיּוֹנוּת, translit._Tziyonut_) is a nationalist and political movement of Jews and Jewish culture that supports the reestablishment of a Jewish homeland in the territory defined as the historic Land of Israel (also referred to as Palestine, Canaan or the Holy Land).[1][2][3][4] Zionism emerged in the late 19th century in central and eastern Europe as a national revival movement, and soon after this most leaders of the movement associated the main goal with creating the desired state in Palestine,
Zionism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


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## Penelope (Feb 8, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



If you are anti Netanyahu Gov. policies you must of been against the Zionist gov since its inception as there are no differences fundamentally.


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## toastman (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> toastman said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



Accusing pro Israelis of Hasbara is another bullshit Pro Palestinian technique that you people always use. 
As for the accusation of calling others anti-Semitic I never hear pro Israelis use that. I do however see a lot of anti-Semitism here . I'm sure you've seen it too and I'm also sure that you never protested it once.


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## Hossfly (Feb 8, 2015)

fanger said:


> *Zionism* (Hebrew: צִיּוֹנוּת, translit._Tziyonut_) is a nationalist and political movement of Jews and Jewish culture that supports the reestablishment of a Jewish homeland in the territory defined as the historic Land of Israel (also referred to as Palestine, Canaan or the Holy Land).[1][2][3][4] Zionism emerged in the late 19th century in central and eastern Europe as a national revival movement, and soon after this most leaders of the movement associated the main goal with creating the desired state in Palestine,
> Zionism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


Yes,and..............?


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > toastman said:
> ...



OK The Jewish Press Shilling for Shalom Israel Hiring Students to Defend It Online


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...



That's because I gave a definition on 23rd January this year, and I'll even give you the post number, 22 and that's enough spoon feeding of trolls from me, go find it yourself.


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## abu afak (Feb 8, 2015)

Challenger said:


> .....
> *
> That's because I gave a definition on 23rd January this year, and I'll even give you the post number, 22 and that's enough spoon feeding of trolls from me, go find it yourself.*


You're LYING again.
*In fact, and Laughably, to try and cover that LIE, you went back, Found 'the' post, and refer to it here, but don't Link to it NOR quote it because, as we All Know, it is NOT the definition for Zionism, it's your perverse sentiments/characterization of it*.
UN special session on anti-Semitism Page 3 US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum
said post #22


			
				Challenger supposed definition-NOT said:
			
		

> So I distiguish between Jewish people and Zionists, who are both Christian and Jewish, and* I personally detest the irridentist, racist, ideology called Zionism. *How does that make me an anti-Semite?


*You merely characterize/Curse Zionism but you did NOT define it.*
You're Lying like a Sieve AGAIN.
As I said, you can never define it as it will out you as the Bigot you are.

Along those lines..
*The Vast Majority of Jews ARE 'Zionists' in that they support Israel's existence.
ie, Even Jews wanting a return to the 1967 Borders are 'Zionists'.*
Yes there are some wacky ultra-orthodox like NKusa and a few leftists who aren't.

But if you "just" hate the Vast Majority of Jews, the term of art still applies.

All your posts are Raging Lies or, as this one, a Obvious DODGE to avoid being outed.
*
Imag!ne going back, Find!ng a post, and Instead of Link!ng/Quoting !t (because You KNOW You're LYING), you transparently make it into some Riddle! we all must go find. Hoping we won't.
Too bad Clown
I did, 
and as 1000% predictable, it's NO 'definition'.*


*
EDIT:
There really should be some sort of Sanction for devious LIES like Challenger's when caught.
Additionally, when outed above and having NO Answer....
Below he emptily calls/Trolls ME a "troll" for Catching HIS Lie!*

`


----------



## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

Another Jewish "anti-Semite" criticising the Zionist Paradise (aka Israel).

I am a Jew and I insist it is not anti-semitic to criticise Israel for its Gaza crimes - Stop the War Coalition

Well worth the read.


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## Challenger (Feb 8, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > .....
> ...



Wasn't difficult , was it?  and I got you to admit you are a troll, thanks. Next.


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## Coyote (Feb 8, 2015)

toastman said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > toastman said:
> ...



I hear it a lot from pro-Israeli's here.


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## abu afak (Feb 8, 2015)

Coyote said:


> toastman said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...


*Since you are the only poster since 'Challenger' and similarly anti-Israel..

Did you, as an arbiter here, really give an 'agree' to a poster who just Trolled me with that post after getting caught Blatantly LYING to the board?

What are posters in the section to make of that?
How can we trust such behavior?
We Cannot, in fact, Should Not.


Edit, Note Coyote's COP OUT/TROLL Below.
He could Not answer what a DISGRACE it is to USMB to have such a Wildly Partisan mod.
A mod who Thanked a Blatant Liar's TROLLING post after getting caught in that Lie!
Now below, EMBARRASSED, says absolutely Nothing, but himself TROLLS more!*
`
`


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## Coyote (Feb 8, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> > toastman said:
> ...



You seem to think a lot of yourself.


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## 50_RiaL (Feb 8, 2015)

At a dinner held at the Cambridge, MA home of Martin Peretz, Dr King said the following to a student who had impugned the integrity of Zionism:
"When people criticize Zionists they mean Jews, you are talking anti-Semitism." -- Martin Luther King, JR., October 27, 1967.


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## toastman (Feb 9, 2015)

Coyote said:


> abu afak said:
> 
> 
> > Coyote said:
> ...


Abu is right. Challenger got caught lying bigtime and you defended it. Not cool.


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## Challenger (Feb 9, 2015)

50_RiaL said:


> At a dinner held at the Cambridge, MA home of Martin Peretz, Dr King said the following to a student who had impugned the integrity of Zionism:
> "When people criticize Zionists they mean Jews, you are talking anti-Semitism." -- Martin Luther King, JR., October 27, 1967.



In 1967, I was a supporter of Israel, then I grew up and learned the truth. MLK, had he survived, may well have had a different view today.


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## Challenger (Feb 9, 2015)

Can someone explain how "Zionism is a racist, irridentist, ideology" is *not* a definition of Zionism? The word "define" itself has many meanings, including, "To describe the nature or basic qualities of" and "to give form or meaning to".

Perhaps those who insist on "definitions" should have been more precise defining what they meant by "definition"?


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Penelope said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...






 You are confusing Nazis with Germans. Yes many Germans were Christian men and just like the American's, British and French. They fought for their country because that is what was expected of them at the time, the Nazis ruled and forced the men to fight and die.

In the scheme of things appertaining to anti-Semitism the term only applies to ANTI JEW RACISM and HATRED. Look at any dictionary definition and it says this, it does not mention arabs at all.

 One need not be a muslim to show ANTI JEW RACISM, just be a stooge for islam.


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Penelope said:


> Known as the father of modern antisemitism, Wilhelm Marr led the fight to overturn Jewish emancipation in Germany.
> 
> Born in 1819, Marr entered politics as a democratic revolutionary who favored the emancipation of all oppressed groups, including Jews. However, when he became embittered about the failure of the 1848-49 German Revolution to democratize Germany, and about his own rapidly declining political fortunes, he turned his venom against the Jews. His essay _“Der Sieg des Judenthums über das Germanenthum von nicht confessionellen Standpunkt_” (“The Victory of Judaism over Germandom: From a Non-Denominational Point of View”) reached its 12th edition in 1879.
> 
> ...






Try reading it again and see that what I propose is nothing more than what is in place already for other racist acts. Just extending it to anti Semitism to be judged by a court of law and the maximum sentence that the criminals would receive. No different to anti arab racism or even anti muslim religious intolerance and incitement to violence.


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

fanger said:


> *Zionism* (Hebrew: צִיּוֹנוּת, translit._Tziyonut_) is a nationalist and political movement of Jews and Jewish culture that supports the reestablishment of a Jewish homeland in the territory defined as the historic Land of Israel (also referred to as Palestine, Canaan or the Holy Land).[1][2][3][4] Zionism emerged in the late 19th century in central and eastern Europe as a national revival movement, and soon after this most leaders of the movement associated the main goal with creating the desired state in Palestine,
> Zionism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia






 Yes that is the accepted definition of Zionism

 Now how about yours when you spew out the word as if it was a bad taste ?


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Penelope said:


> abu afak said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...







 Define Zionist in your own words ?


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...








 Sorry to say but I can not find one screen name in use on this board on that link.   Your exact claim was that there are far more than one hasbarist on this forum and they toe the the line on habara policy.   So name them via a link or withdraw your claim and never use it again ...........................


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Challenger said:


> abu afak said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...







 This one    Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism Page 3 US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum     If so then you admit to being two people which is against the rules .


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## Challenger (Feb 9, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...




The pertinent point raised in the article is that the said "hirees/hasbarists/hasbarats" don't have to reveal who they are. Got it now?

Did you know it is bad for your health and a sign of alcohol addiction  to be drunk this early in the morning? Here's a useful site for you: Get help now Newcomers About AA Alcoholics Anonymous Great Britain Ltd  No, don't thank me, happy to help.


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## Challenger (Feb 9, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > abu afak said:
> ...



See post #137. Even that idiot Abu Afak managed to find the right posting from the clues I left.


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






 Don't drink so how can I be drunk, but you claimed that there are more than one hasbarists on this forum and I asked you to provide a link proving your claim. This you have failed to do as your link does not mention this board or any of the members. So you FAIL ONCE AGAIN to substantiate your claims and show that you are an ISLAMONAZI PROPAGANDIST and LIAR.   It would be better if you just ran away and hid rather than try and LIE your way out of the hole you are digging ever deeper.


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






 Make your mind up is it post 22 or post 137 ?


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## Challenger (Feb 9, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...



No reason to run, no reason to hide.

"Son, never trust a man who doesn’t drink because he’s probably a self-righteous sort, a man who thinks he knows right from wrong all the time...." --James Crumley


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## Phoenall (Feb 9, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






 Doctors orders as I am suffering from a heart condition that would be made worse if I consumed alcohol with the medication I am on. So I have abstained since December until the meds have done their work. I would rather live than die for the sake of a drink.


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## Coyote (Feb 9, 2015)

toastman said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> > abu afak said:
> ...



"*As for the accusation of calling others anti-Semitic I never hear pro Israelis use that*."

That's bullshit.  Not cool. In fact it's an outright lie.

Second:* "Wasn't difficult , was it? and I got you to admit you are a troll, thanks. Next."*

Ya I thanked it, and I would again. AF acts like a troll with aspbergers.  Challenger is right on about it.


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## Mindful (Feb 10, 2015)

Criticism of Israel is not anti-semitism?

Just go and torch a synagogue:

German Court Rules Synagogue Firebombing an Act of Protest - The Daily Beast


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## toastman (Feb 10, 2015)

Coyote said:


> toastman said:
> 
> 
> > Coyote said:
> ...


I should have rephrased my comment. Yes there are some sccusation of anti Semitism, and many times it's accurate. There are a lot of Jew haters here and you like to take their sides...


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## Coyote (Feb 11, 2015)

toastman said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> > toastman said:
> ...



Yes, there are a lot of Jew haters.

Did you know there are a lot of Muslim haters too?

You not only take their sides, you join in the rhetoric.  I've never seen you denounce your own.

"Some" accusations of anti-semitism = many in reality.  And no, they aren't always accurate. Often - if you are think the Palestinian cause is just or if you refuse to jump on the Hate-Muslim bandwagon, you are labeled anti-semite.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.



Criticism of Israel isn't anti semitism. Israel as a free democracy has many critics within its borders that are allowed to voice their opinions. Anti Zionism on the other hand, is pure anti semetism.


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Anti-Zionism is no different than being against any nationalist movement.


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## Hossfly (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Anti-Zionism is no different than being against any nationalist movement.


Anti-Zionism means that anti-Zionists are against Jews having their own country.Therefore it means anti-Zionists are 'anti-Semitic' which is code for "Jew-hater. True story.


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Do you mean that Ukrainians cannot be against Russian nationalism of the people in the East of Ukraine?  Do you mean that Palestinians cannot be against an ideology that evicted them from their homes?  What an extraordinary notion.  Demonstrates how delusional these zionutters are.


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## Mindful (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Anti-Zionism is no different than being against any nationalist movement.


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## Hossfly (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Do you mean that Ukrainians cannot be against Russian nationalism of the people in the East of Ukraine?  Do you mean that Palestinians cannot be against an ideology that evicted them from their homes?  What an extraordinary notion.  Demonstrates how delusional these zionutters are.


O.K., Nostrodamus, what is your definition of anti-Zionist and remember, the subject  is about Jews.


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Hossfly said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > Do you mean that Ukrainians cannot be against Russian nationalism of the people in the East of Ukraine?  Do you mean that Palestinians cannot be against an ideology that evicted them from their homes?  What an extraordinary notion.  Demonstrates how delusional these zionutters are.
> ...



Disagreeing with this, for example.


"Representatives of American-Jewish businessman Irving Moskowitz on Monday took over a room in the home of the Hamdallah family in the East Jerusalem neighborhood of Ras al-Amud. As in previous cases, the emissaries of Moskowitz, whose foundation raises funds for Jewish housing projects in Arab neighborhoods, enjoy a privilege that East Jerusalem's Palestinians don't have: to get back property that was abandoned during the 1948 War of Independence."

 Advertisement


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## Challenger (Feb 11, 2015)

Hossfly said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > Do you mean that Ukrainians cannot be against Russian nationalism of the people in the East of Ukraine?  Do you mean that Palestinians cannot be against an ideology that evicted them from their homes?  What an extraordinary notion.  Demonstrates how delusional these zionutters are.
> ...



I thought the subject was about criticism of Israel, not Jewish people?


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## Hossfly (Feb 11, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Hossfly said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...


Is that what the OP says?


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## Challenger (Feb 11, 2015)

Hossfly said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Hossfly said:
> ...


Forgot, English isn't your first language.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Anti-Zionism is no different than being against any nationalist movement.


Anti Zionism is anti Semitism, and you are a Jew hater.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Do you mean that Ukrainians cannot be against Russian nationalism of the people in the East of Ukraine?  Do you mean that Palestinians cannot be against an ideology that evicted them from their homes?  What an extraordinary notion.  Demonstrates how delusional these zionutters are.



As Martin Luther King Jr., noted, anti Zionism is another word for anti semtism. 

Anybody who denies the right for Israel to exist as the only JEWISH stste in an ocean of intolerant Islamic barbaric shitholes is a Jew hater.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

Anti Zionism is a mental disorder, just like anti semetism. You can see the OCD Jew haters maturbating themselves to the destruction of Israel and genocide of Jews on a daily basis.


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

The least you could do is learn to spell antisemitism.  Being against Zionism, as some Jews are, is not antisemitism.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The least you could do is learn to spell antisemitism.  Being against Zionism, as some Jews are, is not antisemitism.


Fuck off, you are an anti Semetic pig, obsessed with the destruction of Israel, like a typical anti Semite.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Hossfly said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



What's yours Achmed, Arabic?


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Roudy said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > The least you could do is learn to spell antisemitism.  Being against Zionism, as some Jews are, is not antisemitism.
> ...



Learn to spell antisemitic and please show any post in which I have ever indicated that I favored the destruction of Israel.  More to the point, try to find any antisemitic statement I have made.  You on the other hand are constantly making racist statements (and the usual personal insults) against anyone who disagrees with you.  You are an immature little brat.


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## Yarddog (Feb 11, 2015)

Lakhota said:


> Dr. Ghada Karmi’s latest book _Married to Another Man: Israel’s Dilemma in Palestine_ opens with the problem European Zionists faced over a century ago when they first mooted the idea of a Jewish state in Palestine. They found then that there was already a well-established Palestinian society existing in the land they wished to claim as their own. Hence the message sent back to Vienna by the two rabbis who made the discovery: “The bride is beautiful, but she is married to another man.”
> 
> It is the essence of “Israel’s dilemma”: how to effect the disappearance of the ever-present Palestinians so that a purely Jewish state can exist on Palestinian land? The Zionist program of ethnic cleansing that has been going on since Israel’s creation has not solved the problem. Neither has the living hell of occupation.
> 
> ...









This is the map that i saw.   

Have you seen the Map of Armenia before Muslim Turks performed a real Genocide?  

The History Place - Genocide in the 20th Century Armenians in Turkey 1915-18

Youll never hear a Muslim complaining about that.  Those people will never get their homeland back.
And its very relevant to the conversation,  because its the same mindset Jews had to deal with in the early
days as now though swept under the rug.


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Yarddog said:


> Lakhota said:
> 
> 
> > Dr. Ghada Karmi’s latest book _Married to Another Man: Israel’s Dilemma in Palestine_ opens with the problem European Zionists faced over a century ago when they first mooted the idea of a Jewish state in Palestine. They found then that there was already a well-established Palestinian society existing in the land they wished to claim as their own. Hence the message sent back to Vienna by the two rabbis who made the discovery: “The bride is beautiful, but she is married to another man.”
> ...



What mindset is that?  The Jews were in Europe and went to Palestine and took over the land and homes of the Christian and Muslim Palestinians.  How is that different, except for the differences in numbers (there under a million or so Christians and Muslims in Palestine), from what happened to the Armenians?


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## Yarddog (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Yarddog said:
> 
> 
> > Lakhota said:
> ...



Jews were already in the area, as well as Christians and Muslims,  More Arabs also emmigrated to the area in early 1900s as well,  to get jobs.  it was a growing economy,  and the jews had something to do with that too. 
they was a war between the Jews and Arabs where the arabs wanted to drive Jews out completely.    The Armenians were all disarmed of their weapons before they were massacred,  its not even close in numbers and intensity.  The Muslims basicaly did what ISIS is doing now.   Israel did nothing like that but it keeps being called a genocide


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

"Jews were already in the area, as well as Christians and Muslims, More Arabs also emmigrated to the area in early 1900s as well, to get jobs."

Some facts from source documents:

Population of Jews in Palestine.

"There are now in the whole of Palestine hardly 700,000 people, a population much less than that of the province of Gallilee alone in the time of Christ.* (*_See_ Sir George Adam Smith "Historical Geography of the Holy Land", Chap. 20.) Of these 235,000 live in the larger towns, 465,000 in the smaller towns and villages. Four-fifths of the whole population are Moslems. A small proportion of these are Bedouin Arabs; the remainder, although they speak Arabic and are termed Arabs, are largely of mixed race. Some 77,000 of the population are Christians, in large majority belonging to the Orthodox Church, and speaking Arabic. The minority are members of the Latin or of the Uniate Greek Catholic Church, or--a small number--are Protestants.

*The Jewish element of the population numbers 76,000. Almost all have entered Palestine during the last 40 years. Prior to 1850 there were in the country only a handful of Jews. *- See more at: Mandate for Palestine - Interim report of the Mandatory to the League of Nations Balfour Declaration text 30 July 1921


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

As to immigration from 1920 to 1946 90% of the migrants were Jews.  (From the Survey of Palestine available at the Berman Jewish Policy Archive:

Publications from publisher Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry Berman Jewish Policy Archive NYU Wagner


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...



Anti Zionism means you believe that Israel does not have the right to exist as a Jewish state. Which is why it was spotted as anti semitism by Martin Luther King as far back as 1967. 

Good news is the Jewish national movement occurred in 1948 and the formation of Israel has been etched in stone. The Jewish state isn't going anywhere, regardless of how much you Jew hating, Islamo-terrorist loving donkeys keep braying.


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## Roudy (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> As to immigration from 1920 to 1946 90% of the migrants were Jews.  (From the Survey of Palestine available at the Berman Jewish Policy Archive:
> 
> Publications from publisher Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry Berman Jewish Policy Archive NYU Wagner


Again the one trick donkey pulls that bullshit chart out of his ass. There was no way anybody could keep track of the hoards of illegal Arab migrants into the region.  Besides, Arabs didn't control the land for about 800 years, the fact that they invaded it when the Ottoman Empire fell is meaningless.


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## skye (Feb 11, 2015)

Roudy said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > The least you could do is learn to spell antisemitism.  Being against Zionism, as some Jews are, is not antisemitism.
> ...



 I agree!

what a stupid thread  to begin with !


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Of course you would agree, you are a Zionutter.


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## skye (Feb 11, 2015)

and proud of it!   ^^^^^^^^^^


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## Yarddog (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> "Jews were already in the area, as well as Christians and Muslims, More Arabs also emmigrated to the area in early 1900s as well, to get jobs."
> 
> Some facts from source documents:
> 
> ...





montelatici said:


> "Jews were already in the area, as well as Christians and Muslims, More Arabs also emmigrated to the area in early 1900s as well, to get jobs."
> 
> Some facts from source documents:
> 
> ...




And there was the British mandate, so it wasnt illegal for Jews to buy land.   More than any other people , Jews have a historical tie to that land, Longer than anyone else. Much longer than the people called palestinians.   Seems only logical after WW2 especialy that Jews with nowhere else to go except maybe the US  try and settle there once again.     There definately may be varying degrees of unfairness,  but i have a problem with people who say Israel is practicing Genocide when they have tried to make peace.  (not that you have said that)


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## Yarddog (Feb 11, 2015)

Roudy said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > As to immigration from 1920 to 1946 90% of the migrants were Jews.  (From the Survey of Palestine available at the Berman Jewish Policy Archive:
> ...





Yeah, thats true,   im sure bedouins may not have bothered to fill out a registration form,


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## montelatici (Feb 11, 2015)

Yarddog said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > "Jews were already in the area, as well as Christians and Muslims, More Arabs also emmigrated to the area in early 1900s as well, to get jobs."
> ...



But Jews owned less than 5% before partition.  The non-Jews owned more than 90%. Why did the Jews evict the people that owned the land?  Was it ok with you that Jews just stole the land from the people living there? wasn't it the Germans that killed the Jews?  What did the Christians and Muslims of Palestine have to do with the Holocaust?


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## Yarddog (Feb 11, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Yarddog said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...




Some things were unfair but it also goes both ways,  there was Islamic radicalizm back then as well. Hence my refrence to what had just happened to the Armenians,   non muslims were not really wanted back then.   The History of what happened with the Jews and palestine is not so black and white to me because i hear so much from both sides that is conflicting.  The other side of the coin is that Jews have also had to fight for their survival over there,  they were attacked by what? 5 arab countries?  

In recent times they have tried for peace and only received violence in return. Mostly probably because Arabs will refuse to let go of 1948 in order to start over again with peace.   Im sure THEY feel why should they?    But it is also not the Palestinians but every other outside Muslim group like Hezbolla etc. resisting peace.    If there are concessions due from Israel,  Palestinians can get them when they learn to live in peace.  Much like the Armenians did/ had to do because no one gave a fuck about what happened to them.  I had a few Armenian friends in Los Angeles where there are many, and believe me, they learned how to be peaceful, wonderful successful people ( of course they are christians not muslims)  , so the sooner the Palestinians can learn to live well,  then they can learn to live well with their neighbor.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Yarddog said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...



What are you braying again now?  Same shit different day. 

Again, Arabs invaded the region after the collapse of the Ottoman Empire approximately 1915 and with encouragement of the British.  Bunch of illegal 20th Muslim invaders doesn't turn anybody into a land owner.  

Arabs did not control the land nor was there this fictional Palestinian state at the time. The Ottoman Empire after 700 years was divided ENTIRELY into Muslim shitholes by the British and the French, the conquerors and victors of the war, except for Israel, which was designated to be the Jewish state and home of the Jewish people on their ancestral homeland.  

The Arabs decided to start murdering the Jews and commit ethnic cleansing, which started with the Hebron Massacre of 1929. The Jews armed themselves, won the civil war, and established a successful flourishing state that has since defended itself time and again against groups of Muslim savages. 

Israel is here to stay. The end.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

Yarddog said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > Yarddog said:
> ...



The Palestinians aren't allowed to make peace by nations like Iran, who pay their terrorist leaders like Hamas to continue the war for the destruction of the Jewish state. They too, like Arafat their previous terrorist leader and founder of the Palestinian movement will leave (escape) with the billions of stolen money in hidden foreign accounts, never returning a dime or bothering to even SPIT in the face of the so called "suffering Palestinians".

It's too late for a Palestinian state now. Problem with the Palestinians can't even move anywhere...they've caused so much death and destruction in the region, Lebanon, Syria, Kuwait, Egypt, Jordan, that no Arab country wants them.


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## Challenger (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Hossfly said:
> ...



English. Although I did learn French at school, along with Spanish, Greek and Latin, but I'm a bit rusty in all of those. I also know a bit of German, Swedish, Polish and Turkish from travelling to those countries in my time. Tried learning Arabic once, never could master it though, couldn't get to grips with the writing.

Interesting how you use the Russian/Eastern European spelling of the name "Ahmed"


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## Challenger (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> ....Israel is here to stay. The end.



They probably said that in every one of these former sovereign states

List of former sovereign states - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Nothing is ever here to stay...


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## aris2chat (Feb 12, 2015)

Yarddog said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...



Nomads might lay claim to a well but they would not choose to own land.  Beside paying taxes, they would have had to do their service to the military.  It would have been that way under the Ottoman, British or now with the Israeli.  Nomads are fading from existence in the region as a whole.  Travel freely across borders is no long possible.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



Well even though the Koran is written in Arabic, many Muslims don't actually speak the language. Interesting how you pinpointed the spelling of the Muslim name Achmed, and can designate a region of the world based on how it's spelled.  Must be from knowing so many Achmeds, Ahmed.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > ....Israel is here to stay. The end.
> ...



Some just stay much longer than others.

Indestructible Jews Max I. Dimont 9780451075949 Amazon.com Books

A compelling and readable account of the four thousand year history of a people that spans the globe and transcends the ages. From the ancient and simple faith of a small tribe to a global religion with adherents in every nation, the path of the Jews is traced through countless expulsions and migrations, the great tragedy of the Holocaust, and the joy of founding a homeland in Israel. Putting the struggle of a persecuted people into perspective, Max Dimont asks whether the tragic sufferings of the Jews have actually been the key to their survival, as other nations and races vanished into obscurity. Here is a book for Jews and non-Jews to enjoy, evoking a proud heritage while offering a hopeful vision of the future.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Yarddog said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > "Jews were already in the area, as well as Christians and Muslims, More Arabs also emmigrated to the area in early 1900s as well, to get jobs."
> ...



The people of Palestine (of changing religions but the same people) have lived in the area for over 5,000 years.  Far longer than the Europeans that started invading/settling in the late 1800s.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > Yarddog said:
> ...



The non-Jewish Palestinians not only controlled the land, they owned over 90% of it.

A Survey of Palestine Volume 2 Berman Jewish Policy Archive NYU Wagner


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...



Like Egypt?


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## Challenger (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...



Jewish people, maybe. It's hard to kill an idea, especially when it comes to religion. There are still Zoroastrians out there and they pre-date Judaism.


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## Challenger (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...



Nope, just Googled it.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Hinduism oldest "active" religion, apparently.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...



Documented evidençe of Arab invasion and defective logic? Land was Ottoman Empire territory for 700 years, if Arabs owned and controlled it, it would be Arab territory.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



Yeah right.  You googled the name Achmed. Sure, Ahmed. Ha ha ha.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



Keep holding your breath. The countries that are currently self destructing are Israel's enemies.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



Ancient Rome, Egypt, and Greece are gone, but not the Jewish people and Israel.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Yarddog said:
> 
> 
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Keep squirming all you want, Jew hater.

Jewish spiritual and physical ties to the land are undeniable and longer than anybody else.  The Jewish state is a done deal, and here to stay.

Anti Zionism is anti semetism.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Ancient Israel is gone too. Rome is called the Eternal City for a reason, and has been Rome continuously since Romulus and Remus, and the Romans never went anywhere they are in Italy today.  Same for Greece and Egypt.

But it reminds me of this.  You have the same unwarranted hubris that the Jew in this had, until straightened out:


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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Who's squirming gentile hater?  Demographic trends in the lands controlled by Israeli Jews  will result in either in the continuation of apartheid, genocide/ethnic cleansing of the non-Jews or the creation of a secular democratic state that, of course could not be a Jewish state.  There isn't a two-state solution anymore, unfortunately.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Ancient Israel is gone too. Rome is called the Eternal City for a reason, and has been Rome continuously since Romulus and Remus, and the Romans never went anywhere they are in Italy today.  Same for Greece and Egypt.
> 
> But it reminds me of this.  You have the same unwarranted hubris that the Jew in this had, until straightened out:



You played this idiotic clip before, you anti semtic asswipe.

There is no hubris. Jews are back in their ancient homeland, practicing the same religion, traditions, and speaking the same language that their ancestors did.   I'd say the years in exile have taught the Jewish people to survive and coexist, while maintaining their identity. 

If the Kurds end up getting their state, they too would also be a realization of an ancient people back in their homeland, having survived thousands of years of suffering and being in exile.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


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Keep dreaming. Jews are settling in their ancient homeland of Judeah and Samaria and will soon be annexing it and making it part of Israel. There is no other possible outcome.  It's only a question of when and not if.


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## aris2chat (Feb 12, 2015)

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there are a number of databases that give the origins, meanings and locations for names.  Even one for the FBI to help with unfamiliar names.
My father could tell you that origins, background and even some family history of names and faces.  Much like looking at the eyes and nose to determine where someone's family originated from.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> montelatici said:
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> > Ancient Israel is gone too. Rome is called the Eternal City for a reason, and has been Rome continuously since Romulus and Remus, and the Romans never went anywhere they are in Italy today.  Same for Greece and Egypt.
> ...



When one begins hurling personal insults on a talkboard, it is clear that the person hurling the insults has lost the plot. And, I have made no antisemitic remarks, ever.  You should learn to spell the word correctly, it would help disguise (for a while) your absolute ignorance and lack of education.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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So, we agree.  We only differ on what the best outcome is.  I would prefer a secular democratic state for all the people of Palestine (including Israeli Jews) and you probably prefer an Apartheid state or ethnic cleansing/genocide of the non-Jews.  Correct?


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

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Well actually Achmed is a Muslim name and you'll find it spelled only one way, in Arabic letters. How an individual Muslim decides to spell his Arabic origin name in the West in English, French, Spanish using Latin letters is pretty much up to them. You will find that immigrants from the same Muslim country with the same first or last name will often spell it differently, depending on the name, of course.  For example with "Ali" there isn't much wiggle room, but you get into certain names with consonants and vowels that don't even exist in the English language, and the spelling is all over the place.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


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> > Ancient Israel is gone too. Rome is called the Eternal City for a reason, and has been Rome continuously since Romulus and Remus, and the Romans never went anywhere they are in Italy today.  Same for Greece and Egypt.
> ...



What's an "anti semtic".  If you mean "antisemitic",  what leads you to that conclusion?  Differing with Israel's policies, does make one antisemitic.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


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The outcome is already happening. Israel will eventually annex the West Bank.  The Arabs that stay, will learn to live and love the Jewish state, as do the 1.8 Million Arab Muslims that are Israeli citizens with full rights. Might take a few generations, but it will happen.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


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As I said before differing with policies doesn't make one an anti semite. Even Israelis criticise Isrseli policies.

An anti ZIONIST, however,  which is what you are, is just another name for Jew hater.  Just as being an anti American, against the existence of America, would make you an America hater.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


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Why would Arab Christians and Muslims ever "love" a Jewish state?  The Arab Israelis do not love the Jewish state.  Why would a Christian or a Muslim "love" a state that declares itself of another religion.  You are dreaming.  As Roger Cohen of the NYT said:

"If there will be one state, it will be an Arab state. The other option is an Israeli dictatorship, probably a religious nationalist dictatorship, suppressing the Palestinians and suppressing its Jewish opponents.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/21/opinion/sunday/roger-cohen-what-will-israel-become.html?_r=0


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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One can be against the Zionist policy of removing the Christians and Muslims from Palestine and creating a Jewish State in Palestine just as an American can look back and be against "manifest destiny" which contributed to the genocide and ethnic cleansing of the native americans.  Your idea that anyone that is against genocide and ethnic cleansing is an antisemite if it is Israel committing it, is ludicrous.


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## aris2chat (Feb 12, 2015)

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Ahmad - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Variant form(s) Achmad, Achmat, Achmed, Achmet, Ahmat, Ahmet, Ahmadu, Amadou


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


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When a terrorist worshipper begins to play an anti Semetic clip that is stereotypical of Jews, he shouldn't be surprised when he gets insulted.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

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Yada yada yada. Poll after poll shows that the 1.8 million Arab Muslims that are Israeli citizens enjoy the highest standards of living, which is why they prefer living there over ANY other Muslim country.  Israel unlike Muslim shitholes is a tolerant democratic society.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


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You anti Semites keep blabbering the same idiotic things.  The Arabs were then ones that tried to commit ethnic cleansing and genocide, not the Jews. And it started with the Hebron massacre of 1929 where Muslim animals cleansed the presence of an ancient Jewish community.  The population of "Palestinians" in the region has multiplied exponentially in the last 90 years.  That's because they are recent invaders from neighboring lands. 

Pali Nazi lovers love to blurt out words like genocide and ethnic cleansing without even knowing what they mean. Must be because they apply best to the Arabs / Muslims.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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How can that be Ruddy?  The Jews were in Europe and went to Palestine and evicted the Christians and Muslims living there.  Of course the Christians and Muslims tried to resist the invasion of Europeans.

The facts show that the recent invaders are the Jews, of 414,456 migrants to Palestine from 1920 to 1946, 376,415 were Jews.  That is about 90% of the migrants were Jews.  These are just facts Ruddy.  You have bought the propaganda.


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## Phoenall (Feb 12, 2015)

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So they reclaimed Jewish owned property from the arab muslim land thieves, so what is so wrong about that then Abdul. Isnt that what you claim the arab muslims are trying to do in Israel with their brand new land deeds and rusty old keys ?


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## Phoenall (Feb 12, 2015)

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 Same thing isn't it, just as criticism of Palestinians is also criticism of ISLAMONAZI TERRORISTS


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## Phoenall (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The least you could do is learn to spell antisemitism.  Being against Zionism, as some Jews are, is not antisemitism.





 Depends on the individuals definition of Zionism. Any thing other than it is the belief that the Jews should have a national home in the region where their historic roots lie and the right to defend that nation and people from all acts of violence, war and belligerence.

So your definition of Zionism makes you ANTI_SEMITIC      ( 3 ways of spelling the same thing, and all are in common usage )


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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It was never Jewish owned.  Just stolen by a Jew. The Christians and Muslims owned 90% of the property in Palestine in 1946.


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## Phoenall (Feb 12, 2015)

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 Why do you concentrate on a 26 year window when the immigration to Palestine started in 1850 and carried on until 2007. Can you explain the almost miraculous 1200 births per 1000 people needed to show the increase that was achieved by the arab muslims during this time frame. The only possible answer to this is illegal immigration on a vast scale


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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What was antisemitic about the clip?


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## Phoenall (Feb 12, 2015)

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 LINK from a non partisan source that can be verified


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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As shown previously there was an insignificant permanent non-Jewish immigration to Palestine.  Word (insignificant) used in the U.S. State Department published Survey of Palestine.

And, since 1948 Muslims and Christians have emigrated or have been ethnically cleansed from Palestine, you nut. 

There are numerous population calculators available on line.  Take the 660,000 Christians and Muslims in Palestine in 1922 and calculate the growth with the approximate 3% growth rate average for 92 years (to 2014) and look to see how many Palestinians there should be.  There are actually 11 million Palestinians within Palestine/Israel and outside.  

Population Growth Rate Calculator -- EndMemo


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

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Non-Jews 24,670,455 dunums.  Jews 1,514,247 dunums.




 

A Survey of Palestine Volume 2 Berman Jewish Policy Archive NYU Wagner


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

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Yes, the Arabs invaded like insects with the encouragement of the British, and ended up stealing quite a lot of land.  Give Muslims ten more years, they'll claim all of Europe and US to be stolen Muslim lands.  Ooooops!  They already do.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

All this repetitive garbage and the fact remains, the land was Ottoman territory for 700 years, and British for another 40. 

At no time did Arabs have any inherent rights or control of the land, other than they invaded it in large numbers early in the 20th century once the Ottoman Empire collapsed. 

According to Montelatici, an Arab demographic invasion equals ownership.  This is what Muslims did in Lebanon.  They committed ethnic cleansing and genocide on the Christians, with a big help from non other than the Palestinians, and now Lebanon is a Muslim majority country.  I'm sure Montelatici can show us how Muslims own more land after they've invaded and slaughtered all the Christians.  So now suddenly, Lebanon too has become stolen Muslim lands.


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## Hossfly (Feb 12, 2015)

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When Muslims get to the moon they will probably say it is stolen Muslim territory.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

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considering the mission of Islam is to conquer and submit the entire world and universe under it's rule, the moon and mars would also be stolen Muslim lands.  Even Hell itself is occupied Muslim lands, but the devil left a long time ago, it is ruled by an Islamic cleric now.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)

Roudy said:


> All this repetitive garbage and the fact remains, the land was Ottoman territory for 700 years, and British for another 40.
> 
> At no time did Arabs have any inherent rights or control of the land, other than they invaded it in large numbers early in the 20th century once the Ottoman Empire collapsed.
> 
> According to Montelatici, an Arab demographic invasion equals ownership.  This is what Muslims did in Lebanon.  They committed ethnic cleansing and genocide on the Christians, with a big help from non other than the Palestinians, and now Lebanon is a Muslim majority country.  I'm sure Montelatici can show us how Muslims own more land after they've invaded and slaughtered all the Christians.  So now suddenly, Lebanon too has become stolen Muslim lands.




The records show that 90% of the migration to Palestine in the 20th century was European and Jewish.


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## montelatici (Feb 12, 2015)




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## RandomVariable (Feb 12, 2015)

The tactics the Israelis used to get themselves through the first 60 years of existence or so worked well but are beginning to be counter productive. They run the risk losing everything. There were many dynamics involved in the 2006 Israeli/Hezbollah war which can be used to justify either side.


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## aris2chat (Feb 12, 2015)

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for now there is a fatwa against that.  In a few years that too might change.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
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> > All this repetitive garbage and the fact remains, the land was Ottoman territory for 700 years, and British for another 40.
> ...



Records can't and don't show the illegal hoards of Arab invaders, dipstick.

You aren't very bright are you?  It doesn't even fucking matter. Israel was SUPPOSED to be a Jewish state, by those who conquered Ottoman territory after 700 years.  Even if they wanted to establish a Chinese state they could have. Arabs had no say, especially after 99% of ottoman territory ended up becoming Muslim nations.     Why am I not feeling sorry for the Arab invaders who are used to getting their way through violence and terrorism?  

You better get used to it, Jew hater, Israel has been established as a Jewish state for over 65 years and is in the here and now, Palestine is in the never was and never will be.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

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What are you talking about?  Ask a local Imam, I have it from a very good Muslim source that when Neil Armstrong stepped on the moon, he heard in the back of his ears, this spiritual Islamic call to prayer and then he dropped on all fours and stuck his ass out and started doing the Islamic prayer. 

The first man on the moon was a Muslim!  Allahuakbar!


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## aris2chat (Feb 12, 2015)

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UAE Islamic affairs authority warns Muslims against a mission to Mars - CNN.com

Both the moon and mars over the last dacade.


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## Roudy (Feb 12, 2015)

aris2chat said:


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Muslim clerics change their word and opinions more than the wind changes direction.  They are constantly looking to see what benefits them personally and keep them in power.


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## Challenger (Feb 13, 2015)

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No such thing in either example; not all Jewish people are Israelis as not all Israelis are Jewish. Criticising the regime and it's ideology is legitimate. The same can be said for Palestinians; not all Palestinians are Islamist extremists or Muslim freedom fighters, just as not all Islamist extremists, etc.  are Palestinians.


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## aris2chat (Feb 13, 2015)

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Oh goody, over stating the obvious.  Like saying not all muslims are arabs but most arabs are muslim.  Behavior not understood, not within the social norms of the rest of the world, sometimes outside the norms and teachings of Islam.  Hate taught, incited to violence under the guise of Islam.  We all know this.
Criticism of that behavior it turned around to become an accusation of Islam-phobia to bring other muslims to the support, or against the critics, widening a rift.  Any criticism of a muslim become a hate crime, even though the reason for the criticism is behavior that is not true islamic but a misuse of the faith.  No one is supposed to criticize, satire, question of intellectually attack a muslim or islam, no matter how incorrect the actions or words being targeted.  They even tried to go to the UN to make is criminal to criticize or question a muslim or islam even what wrong.  It is creating an attitude of inequality.  Non-muslims should be silenced and follow what muslims tell them.  They should become subservient. "Muslims are always right, non-muslims are always wrong"
Muslims can do what ever they want and everyone else should be silent and let them.

A purple mad man can commit crimes and go on murder sprees because he is purple.  The fact that he is insane does not matter and no one is allowed to criticize or stop him.
A tiger become a man killer but no one can kill or capture him become he is endangered, so it wrecks havoc and continues to kill its way through young and old, from village to village.
A magic shield of protection of a group no matter how anormal or horrific the subset or individual behaves.  How is this logical?  How do we protect the rest of society?


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## Challenger (Feb 13, 2015)

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Sometimes one needs to state the obvious becuse some people seem to be unable to grasp the obvious. As for the rest of this post, it has nothing to do with the topic: "Criticism of Israel is NOT Anti-Semitism", get it?


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## Phoenall (Feb 13, 2015)

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 And that is where it falls down as the average for 3rd world countries was less than 1%, so controversial that the British Jew Haters had to come up with excuses for the population explosion.

 Yes they have by other muslims, the same people that are ethnically cleansing the Christians from Palestine. Cant be the Jews as the Christian population of Israel has increased by 3% every year since hamas came to power.


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## Phoenall (Feb 13, 2015)

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 YEP absentee Ottoman landlords that rented the land to Jews.  Unless you can produce proof otherwise abdullah


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## Phoenall (Feb 13, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
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> > All this repetitive garbage and the fact remains, the land was Ottoman territory for 700 years, and British for another 40.
> ...







 And those records have been shown to be wrong and based on ANTI SEMITIC LIES


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## Phoenall (Feb 13, 2015)

montelatici said:


> View attachment 36764








 Just shows the legal immigrants that should have only ever been Jews, the booklet refuses to give numbers for ILLEGAL ARAB MUSLIM IMMIGRANTS because they were so high. And Winston Churchill disagreed with these findings in the House of Commons calling the authors LIARS. He should know being a Minister in His Majesties Government at the time.


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## montelatici (Feb 13, 2015)

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A work of thousands of pages in three volumes is not a "booklet".   

The Survey does, in fact, make a clear statement on the sources of population growth for the three religious groups.  It is on page 140 of Volume 1, which clearly states that Muslim and Christian increases were from natural growth and the Jewish increase was due to immigration.






As usual you can go to the Berman Jewish Policy Archives at NYU/Wagner universities to confirm this fact. Remember page 140, volume 1.  You see, Phoney, unlike you I have the facts behind everyone of my assertions.  All you do is bullshit, constantly bullshit.
A Survey of Palestine Volume 1 Berman Jewish Policy Archive NYU Wagner


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## Roudy (Feb 13, 2015)

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Only Muslims are allowed to criticize, ridicule, and satire non Muslims, and go on killing sprees against the infidels.


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## Roudy (Feb 13, 2015)

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Meh...the illegal Arab invasion of the land was observed and noted by British officials in the Mandate as well as Arab rulers. There simply was no  infrastructure in place to record the vast numbers of Arabs flocking into the region, nor was there any interest in the investment in setting it up. After all, the land was conquered after a grueling war with the Germans and Ottomans, and it was designated as the future Jewish state, so it didn't really matter, the British were on their way out.


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## montelatici (Feb 13, 2015)

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Nope, the report is clear it concludes that there was substantial Jew immigration and insignificant non-Jewish immigration to Palestine.  And, the report was American as well as British and was published by the United States Department of State.  

Sorry that the facts don't jive with your propaganda. In fact, the report addresses this propaganda directly.  Amazing isn't it.  The Anglo-American committee understood how the Zionists, like Ruddy, would try to twist the facts.





and





A Survey of Palestine Volume 1 Berman Jewish Policy Archive NYU Wagner

Pages 211 and 212 of volume 1.


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## Roudy (Feb 13, 2015)

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Report?    People can't keep track of illegals today, with all the modern technology and advanced techniques. You want the British with a temporary govt. Established in territory they conquered after a grueling war with the Germans and Ottomans to have had such a system in place?  Ha ha ha. Get over it.

Besides, the land was designated to become The future Jewish state.  You can quote all the bogus numbers and propoganda you want. It really doesn't matter, the Arab invaders had no say. Just like they had no say when the Ottomans conquered the region and controlled it for 700 years.  Period, end of story.


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## montelatici (Feb 13, 2015)

I know, the facts are difficult to swallow after all the propaganda you have been force fed.  But the facts are there for everyone to see, unfortunately for you and the other ZioNazis.

Not only did the Christians and Muslims have a say, the British agreed with them and advised the Jews that the Christians and Muslims had those rights. This was in one of the letters between the British, The Palestinian Delegation and the Zionist Organization:

(By the way, it would do you good to read some factual source documentation rather than constantly making things up.)

"The tension which has prevailed from time to time in Palestine is mainly due to apprehensions, which are entertained both by sections of the Arab and by sections of the Jewish population. These apprehensions, so far as the Arabs are concerned, are partly based upon exaggerated interpretations of the meaning of the Declaration favouring the establishment of a Jewish National Home in Palestine, made on behalf of His Majesty's Government on 2nd November, 1917. Unauthorised statements have been made to the effect that the purpose in view is to create a wholly Jewish Palestine. *Phrases have been used such as that Palestine is to become "as Jewish as England is English." His Majesty's Government regard any such expectation as impracticable and have no such aim in view.* *Nor have they at any time contemplated, as appears to be feared by the Arab Delegation, the disappearance or the subordination of the Arabic population, language or culture in Palestine. They would draw attention to the fact that the terms of the Declaration referred to do not contemplate that Palestine as a whole should be converted into a Jewish National Home, but that such a Home should be founded *_*in Palestine *_In this connection it has been observed with satisfaction that at the meeting of the Zionist Congress, the supreme governing body of the Zionist Organisation, held at Carlsbad in September, 1921, a resolution was passed expressing as the official statement of Zionist aims "the determination of the Jewish people to live with the Arab people on terms of unity and mutual respect, and together with them to make the common home into a flourishing community, the upbuilding of which may assure to each of the peoples an undisturbed national development........*Further, it is contemplated that the status of all citizens of Palestine in the eyes of the law shall be Palestinian, and it has never been intended that they, or any section of them, should possess any other juridical status.   *

- See more at: UK correspondence with Palestine Arab Delegation and Zionist Organization British policy in Palestine Churchill White Paper - UK documentation Cmd. 1700 Non-UN document excerpts 1 July 1922


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## Roudy (Feb 13, 2015)

montelatici said:


> I know, the facts are difficult to swallow after all the propaganda you have been force fed.  But the facts are there for everyone to see, unfortunately for you and the other ZioNazis.
> 
> Not only did the Christians and Muslims have a say, the British agreed with them and advised the Jews that the Christians and Muslims had those rights. This was in one of the letters between the British, The Palestinian Delegation and the Zionist Organization:
> 
> ...



Hah? Get your head out of your ass. The land was to be the future Homeland for the Jews. Just as Arab Palestine aka Jordan was going to be for Arabs. Jewish Palestine was going to be governed and ruled by Jews.  That is the definition of statehood you friggin idiot. Arabs knew what was about to happen and failed to prevent it. 

"It was going to be the Homeland for the Jews but not the Jewish state."  Ha ha ha. You're just making up ridiculous shit now..typical IslamoNazi historical revisionism.


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## montelatici (Feb 13, 2015)

The way you spout the propaganda shows you were well trained by your handlers, but the facts are the facts.  The source documentation clearly shows that Jordan had nothing to do with Palestine territorially, a separate section in the Reports of The Mandatory was established for Trans-Jordan. To wit:

*X.--TRANS-JORDANIA.*

Included in the area of the Palestine Mandate is *the territory of Trans-Jordania.* It is bounded on the north by the frontier of Syria, placed under the mandate of France; on the south by the kingdom of the Hejaz; and on the west by the line of the Jordan and the Dead Sea; while on the east it stretches into the desert and ends--the boundary is not yet defined--where Mesopotamia begins. *Trans-Jordania has a population of probably 350,000 people.* It contains a few small towns and large areas of fertile land, producing excellent wheat and barley. The people are partly settled townsmen and agriculturists, partly wandering Bedouin; the latter, however, cultivate areas, more or less fixed, during certain seasons of the year.

When Palestine west of the Jordan was occupied by the British Army and placed under a British military administration, *over Trans-Jordania and a large part of Syria there was established an Arab administration, *with its capital at Damascus. The ruler was His Highness the Emir Feisal, the third son of H.M. King Hussein, the King of the Hejaz. When Damascus was occupied by French troops in July, 1920, and the Emir Feisal withdrew, it was necessary to adopt fresh measures in Trans-Jordania. I proceeded to the central town of Salt on August 20th, and, at an assembly of notables and sheikhs of the district, announced that His Majesty's Government favoured the establishment of a system of local self- government, assisted by a small number of British officers as advisers.

- See more at: Mandate for Palestine - Interim report of the Mandatory to the League of Nations Balfour Declaration text 30 July 1921 




Your reading comprehension is limited, but even you can understand what the British intended:

"*They would draw attention to the fact that the terms of the Declaration referred to do not contemplate that Palestine as a whole should be converted into a Jewish National Home, but that such a Home should be founded *_*in Palestine "

UK correspondence with Palestine Arab Delegation and Zionist Organization British policy in Palestine Churchill White Paper - UK documentation Cmd. 1700 Non-UN document excerpts 1 July 1922 

*_


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## Lipush (Feb 13, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.



Please.

Most of the Israeli criticizers ARE antisemitic. They hide their Jew hatred behind "anti-Zionism" because it's not politically correct to hate Jews anymore, just for being Jews. Many people are clever enough to see behind the mask, though. Is it always antisemitism? No. But I'd say most of the time, it is.


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## Lipush (Feb 13, 2015)

Contumacious said:


> Matthew said:
> 
> 
> > And yet we can't criticize palatine for their violent actions against Israel? Kind of one sided.
> ...



Funny, considered that word "Palestine" actually means "INVADER" in Hebrew, while "Zion" is the original name of Jerusalem given by the people of Israel.

Kind of like kattle and pot and black thingy.


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## montelatici (Feb 13, 2015)

Palestine is derived from the Greek word Παλαιστίνη adopted and Latinized by the Romans into Palaestina.


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## Roudy (Feb 14, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The way you spout the propaganda shows you were well trained by your handlers, but the facts are the facts.  The source documentation clearly shows that Jordan had nothing to do with Palestine territorially, a separate section in the Reports of The Mandatory was established for Trans-Jordan. To wit:
> 
> *X.--TRANS-JORDANIA.*
> 
> ...



In 1921, Colonial Secretary Winston Churchill severed nearly four-fifths of Palestine—some 35,000 square miles—to create a brand new Arab entity, Transjordan. As a consolation prize for the Hejaz and Arabia (which are both now Saudi Arabia) going to the Saud family, Churchill rewarded Sherif Hussein’s son Abdullah for his contribution to the war against Turkey by installing him as Transjordan’s emir.


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## Roudy (Feb 14, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Palestine is derived from the Greek word Παλαιστίνη adopted and Latinized by the Romans into Palaestina.


Funny.  "Palestine" was such an established historical name, even the Ottomans didn't call it by that name for 700 years when it belonged to them.  They called it Southern Syria. 

Palestine, an invented name for an invented people.


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## TheGreatGatsby (Feb 14, 2015)

Menerva Lindsen said:


> It is unfair.
> It doesn't mean that you're denying the Holocaust ever happened. Please, stop throwing this word around whenever someone accuses Israel of war crimes, questions it's legitimacy etc as I think it's also offensive to the people who actually lost their lives in the Holocaust. Just my Opinion.



In theory, one can criticize Israel and not be an anti-semite. And by criticize, I pretty well mean detest. But I have yet to see that happen. Just my Experience.


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## Challenger (Feb 14, 2015)

Roudy said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...




It was actually a lot easier then as there was not so much in the way of the transport infrastructure we have now, even in a "modern" society you could go through a whole day without seeing a car or truck in the 1920's and 30's. Illegal immigrants had limited means of entry and these were usually under military, police or customs surveillance.  There was undoubtedly some bribery and corruption to allow Illegal immigrants in, especially when it came to over quota European Jewish immigrants, but it is generally accepted that the British censuses of 1922 and 1931 provide the most reliable figures.

No. "...the establishment *IN* Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine,"

*A* national home (tellingly, not THE national home) for the Jewish people was to be facilitated IN Palestine. At no point did the British promise the whole, or any part for that matter, of Palestine as a Jewish "state". This is just Zionist fantasy.

Zionist historiography likes to portray a mass Arab migration into Palestine but this is largely a myth. In the 7th century CE when the Arabs conquered Byzantine Palestine and Syria and Sassanian Mesopotamia, the Arab "elites" expelled the Byzantine "elites" from Palestine and took over their houses and estates. The "common" people were left alone and what Arab migration there was, was channelled towards southern Mesopotamia (Iraq) and Persia (Iran). The local Christian population, in Palestine became “Arabised” over the succeeding centuries, when Arabic replaced Greek as the official language, even Judaism was abandoned and almost died out until Nahmanides turned up and sparked a rebirth of the religion in the area. Two books well worth the read on the subject:

Empire and Elites after the Muslim Conquest The Transformation of Northern Mesopotamia Cambridge Studies in Islamic Civilization Amazon.co.uk Chase F. Robinson 9780521028738 Books

The Great Arab Conquests How The Spread Of Islam Changed The World We Live In Amazon.co.uk Hugh Kennedy 9780753823897 Books

For those that want an objective view from academic sources.


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## Phoenall (Feb 15, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...






 You mean hundreds don't you, and not thousands.   WHY DO YOU HAVE TO LIE WHEN THE EVIDENCE IS AVAILABLE .

 So if I use your link to discredit your posts does this mean that your posts are also bullshit ?


 Do you mean the demographics of Palestine that show the arab muslims always had the upper hand and increased their number above the level of any other impoverished disease ridden 3rd world culture. Most managing to break even or increase at less that 1%. Your link shows an increase in the arab muslim population from 1922 to 1941 of 472,100, and for the arab Christians of 64,083. A total of 536,183, the Jews increased by a much smaller figure of 117,226 mostly from invited legal immigration. Destroys your demographics baloney doesn't it as the arab muslims always had the numbers to wipe out the Jews from the end of WW1. It also shows that the numbers expelled cant be correct as this would mean the arab muslims had doubled in population size in less than 8 years.
 See how your links when used  correctly destroy all your claims, or show that you are deliberately lying about the facts because you have been told to.


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## Phoenall (Feb 15, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...






 The high rate of increase could not be achieved when the population growth of the surrounding area was at less than 1%, why did the arab muslims of Palestine produce more children and increase the population while the surrounding areas arab muslims were reducing as deaths overtook births. The only answer was the arab muslims were moving to Palestine illegally because the Jews were an easy touch.


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## Phoenall (Feb 15, 2015)

montelatici said:


> I know, the facts are difficult to swallow after all the propaganda you have been force fed.  But the facts are there for everyone to see, unfortunately for you and the other ZioNazis.
> 
> Not only did the Christians and Muslims have a say, the British agreed with them and advised the Jews that the Christians and Muslims had those rights. This was in one of the letters between the British, The Palestinian Delegation and the Zionist Organization:
> 
> ...







 And why do you ignore the facts that are unpleasant to muslims and try and put 2015 laws in place of 1920 laws. The rights of arab muslims and Christians were different in 1920 to what they are today, and the Jews did not have to give them anything they did not want to. But the Jewish declaration of independence spelt out what they could expect and what they had to do to achieve it. All this in line with the MANDATE words of not interfering with their political rights of 1921.


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## Phoenall (Feb 15, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The way you spout the propaganda shows you were well trained by your handlers, but the facts are the facts.  The source documentation clearly shows that Jordan had nothing to do with Palestine territorially, a separate section in the Reports of The Mandatory was established for Trans-Jordan. To wit:
> 
> *X.--TRANS-JORDANIA.*
> 
> ...





 You forget that the original mandate included what is Jordan as part of the Jewish National Home, and it was the ANSTI SEMITIC British that had the LoN change the mandate to give that land to the arab muslims. The proviso was that the arab muslims in Jewish Palestine were to be relocated in Jordan by force if necessary. The intention was for  A RESURECTED JEWISH NATIONAL HOME IN PALESTINE based on the words of the Balfour declaration and the terms of the Mandate.


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## Challenger (Feb 15, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > The way you spout the propaganda shows you were well trained by your handlers, but the facts are the facts.  The source documentation clearly shows that Jordan had nothing to do with Palestine territorially, a separate section in the Reports of The Mandatory was established for Trans-Jordan. To wit:
> ...



Complete and utter drivel. I like the way he calls the British "Anti-Semitic" in one breath then gives us credit for "resurrecting the Jewish national home in Palestine"...


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## montelatici (Feb 15, 2015)

The old guy is senile. He has an engrained hate for non-Jews the British included.


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## Roudy (Feb 15, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...



Yes, there were anti Semetic elements in the British, especially the Irish, who sided with the Nazis. So there were Nazi sympathizers at the time, and there still is. 

Palestine which included Jordan was supposed to be the Jewish national home, but after much whining from the Arabs, Jordan  was cut off and given as a "reward" to ruler who wasn't even Jordanian.  But even that wasn't enough for the greedy Arabs. Apparently turning 99% of conquered Ottoman Empire land into "Arab Muslim national homes" wasn't enough, they just couldn't accept ANY Jewish controlled territory. Arabs turned to violence and started killing Jews and a civil war erupted, which was won by the Jews.  The end.

"In 1921, Colonial Secretary Winston Churchill severed nearly four-fifths of Palestine—some 35,000 square miles—to create a brand new Arab entity, Transjordan. As a consolation prize for the Hejaz and Arabia (which are both now Saudi Arabia) going to the Saud family, Churchill rewarded Sherif Hussein’s son Abdullah for his contribution to the war against Turkey by installing him as Transjordan’s emir."


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## Roudy (Feb 15, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The old guy is senile. He has an engrained hate for non-Jews the British included.



All we see is the ingrained Jew hate coming from mentally ill morons like you.


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## Challenger (Feb 15, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...



Thing about the Myths and Facts website is that far too often they get the "Zionist myths" confused with the "facts".


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## abu afak (Feb 15, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Thing about the Myths and Facts website is that far too often they get the "Zionist myths" confused with the "facts".


*Hows it Going for the Longest Running Evasion on USMB?

You STILL Have NOT defined 'Zionist', just DISHONESTLY said you have.
Giving us riddles and Lies instead.

Anytime you're ready.

Perhaps your thanker, Mod-Coyote can point to your Definition for us?
Nope. 
Because Coyote posts are as DISHONEST as yours.
Coyote's posts are a DISGRACE to this message board too.
`*


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## Phoenall (Feb 15, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...





Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > montelatici said:
> ...







 Get it the right way round the British were instrumental in setting up the National Home for the Jews. After WW1 the British authorities became more and more Anti Semitic and reneged on every promise they made to the Jews. After WW2 they even turned Jews away from Palestine against the Mandate and put them into death camps. A very sad day for Britain and the Jews.


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## Phoenall (Feb 15, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The old guy is senile. He has an engrained hate for non-Jews the British included.






 Not as senile as you it seems that cant see the LIES in your own link's.  The only people I have a hatred for are the muslims that follow the Koran and worship allah.


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## Roudy (Feb 15, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...



We should be thanking Montelatici and challenger for proving our point, that anti Zionism is indeed anti semetism. They exhibit their anti semetism almost every time they post. Ha ha ha.


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## Roudy (Feb 15, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



That's not from the myths and facts website, idiot. Which by the way is pretty factual.


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## montelatici (Feb 15, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Phoenall said:
> ...



While included in the Mandate, Palestine did not include Jordan.  It was a separate territory,  As the source documents confirm.  Cut the propaganda. 

"

"Included in the area of the Palestine Mandate is* the territory of Trans-Jordania.* It is bounded on the north by the frontier of Syria, placed under the mandate of France; on the south by the kingdom of the Hejaz; and on the west by the line of the Jordan and the Dead Sea; while on the east it stretches into the desert and ends--the boundary is not yet defined--where Mesopotamia begins. *Trans-Jordania has a population of probably 350,000 people. *It contains a few small towns and large areas of fertile land, producing excellent wheat and barley. The people are partly settled townsmen and agriculturists, partly wandering Bedouin; the latter, however, cultivate areas, more or less fixed, during certain seasons of the year.

When Palestine west of the Jordan was occupied by the British Army and placed under a British military administration, over* Trans-Jordania and a large part of Syria there was established an Arab administration, with its capital at Damascus. *The ruler was His Highness the Emir Feisal, the third son of H.M. King Hussein, the King of the Hejaz. When Damascus was occupied by French troops in July, 1920, and the Emir Feisal withdrew, it was necessary to adopt fresh measures in Trans-Jordania. I proceeded to the central town of Salt on August 20th, and, at an assembly of notables and sheikhs of the district, announced that His Majesty's Government favoured the establishment of a system of local self- government, assisted by a small number of British officers as advisers.
- See more at: Mandate for Palestine - Interim report of the Mandatory to the League of Nations Balfour Declaration text 30 July 1921


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## montelatici (Feb 15, 2015)

And, just to insure that the propaganda you clowns constantly post is proven as such, here is the source documentation delineating the legal definition of Palestine geographically: So please stop with the propaganda.  

"Palestine lies on the western edge of the continent of Asia between latitude 30° N. and 33° N., Longitude 34° 30 E. and 35° 30' E.

On the south it is bounded by Egyptian and Saudi Arabian territory, *on the east by Trans-Jordan*, on the north by the French Mandated Territories of Syria and the Lebanon, and on the west by the Mediterranean.

The boundaries are described as follows:--



_South._--From a point west of Rafa on the Mediterranean to a point two miles west of Aqaba in the Gulf of Aqaba.

_East._--From a point two miles west of Aqaba in the Gulf of Aqaba up the centre of the Wadi Araba, the Dead Sea, and* the River Jordan*, to the junction of the latter with the River Yarmuk, thence up the centre of the River Yarmuk to the Syrian frontier.

_North._--The northern boundary was laid down by the Anglo-French Convention of the 23rd December, 1920, and its delimitation was ratified in 1923. Stated briefly, the boundary runs from Ras el Naqura on the Mediterranean eastwards to Metulla and across the upper Jordan valley to Banias, thence to Jisr Banat Yaqub, thence along the Jordan to the Lake of Tiberias on to El Hamme station on the Samakh-Deraa railway line.

_West._--The Mediterranean Sea.

- See more at: Mandate for Palestine - Report of the Mandatory to the League of Nations 31 December 1933


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## Roudy (Feb 16, 2015)

^^^^^^
Nope nope nope.  Transjordan was part of the Palestine mandate and was supposed to be included in the future Jewish state.  However, after much whining and back room wheeling and dealing, the British severed Transjordan and imposed a non Jordanian Saudi ruler upon the people of the region.  So again, like I said, the Arabs had no say as to how the British divided territory conquered from the Ottomans. 

The Hashemite emir Abdullah, elder son of Britain's wartime Arab ally Hussein bin Ali was placed on the throne of Transjordan. The applicable parts of the Mandatory Palestine were recited in a decision of 16 September 1922, which provided for the separate administration of Transjordan. The government of the territory was, subject to the mandate, formed by Abdullah, brother of king Faisal I of Iraq, who had been at Amman since February 1921. Britain recognized Transjordan as an independent government on 15 May 1923, and gradually relinquished control, limiting its oversight to financial, military and foreign policy matters. This had an impact on the goals of Revisionist Zionism, which sought a state on both banks of the Jordan. The movement claimed that* it effectively severed Transjordan from Palestine, and so reduced the area on which a future Jewish state in the region could be established.*

*Independence and establishment of Hashemite kingdom[edit]*
In March 1946, under the Treaty of London, Transjordan became a kingdom. *On 25 May 1946, the parliament of Transjordan proclaimed the emir king and formally changed the name of the country from the "Emirate of Transjordan" to the "Hashemite Kingdom of Transjordan". In April 1949 the country's official name became the "Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan".

*****In other words, Jordan became a state around the same time as Israel, both divided regions of the Palestine mandate.*


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## Challenger (Feb 16, 2015)

There was never an intent to create a future Jewish state except by the Zionist colonists themselves.  As your own source says, "This had an impact on the goals of Revisionist Zionism, which sought a state on both banks of the Jordan."


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## Challenger (Feb 16, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...



Pretty factual, but mostly mythical.


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






 Do you even bother to read your own cut and pastes Abdul, the very first words are    "Included in the area of the Palestine Mandate is* the territory of Trans-Jordania"*


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

montelatici said:


> And, just to insure that the propaganda you clowns constantly post is proven as such, here is the source documentation delineating the legal definition of Palestine geographically: So please stop with the propaganda.
> 
> "Palestine lies on the western edge of the continent of Asia between latitude 30° N. and 33° N., Longitude 34° 30 E. and 35° 30' E.
> 
> ...







 And what were the boundaries in 1919 when the LoN Mandate for Palestine was first agreed ?


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

Challenger said:


> There was never an intent to create a future Jewish state except by the Zionist colonists themselves.  As your own source says, "This had an impact on the goals of Revisionist Zionism, which sought a state on both banks of the Jordan."






 Read the Balfour declaration and the LoN Mandate for Palestine again and see that there was the intent to create THE JEWISH NATIONAL HOME  as in state or nation.


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

Challenger said:


> abu afak said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






FANTASY ISLAND ring any bells


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## Roudy (Feb 16, 2015)

Challenger said:


> There was never an intent to create a future Jewish state except by the Zionist colonists themselves.  As your own source says, "This had an impact on the goals of Revisionist Zionism, which sought a state on both banks of the Jordan."



And as my source said, the British gave Transjordan, land that was supposed to be given to the Jews, to a relative of the Saudi King as a bribe. So there doesn't seem to be a problem granting rulership rulers to a family that had aboluteky no ties to the land. As long as they were Arab Muslims, right? 

That left the remainder of the mandate for the Jews, period.  Arabs did their usual rioting and terrorism, a civil war between Jews and Arabs erupted, and guess what, the Jews won, declared statehood, and the rest is history.


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## Roudy (Feb 16, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> montelatici said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...


They are blind deaf and dumb, driven solely by their hatred of Jews. Most of the stuff they post contradicts their claims, but they are too mentally ill to comprehend.


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## Challenger (Feb 16, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > There was never an intent to create a future Jewish state except by the Zionist colonists themselves.  As your own source says, "This had an impact on the goals of Revisionist Zionism, which sought a state on both banks of the Jordan."
> ...



No, as in "tribal homeland" within Palestine.


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## Challenger (Feb 16, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > abu afak said:
> ...



See what I mean?


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## montelatici (Feb 16, 2015)

Roudy said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > There was never an intent to create a future Jewish state except by the Zionist colonists themselves.  As your own source says, "This had an impact on the goals of Revisionist Zionism, which sought a state on both banks of the Jordan."
> ...



If you can make up your own story line and you believe it, good for you.  But, you do realize you are full of shit.  Or, do you actually believe your own bullshit?


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






 Where does it say that then, is it in the neo Marxist version of the Mandate or the ISLAMONAZI version of the mandate.

 LINK


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

Challenger said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...







 If you cant give an answer the best policy is to keep quiet, otherwise you just show how incredibly stupid and immature you are.


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## Phoenall (Feb 16, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...






 Read what you wrote again and put your own name in it, then you will see what we have been saying about you since you surfaced


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## Daniyel (Feb 16, 2015)

So lets get this one clear shall we?
*The main argument is that criticism of Israel is not Antisemitism but it is Israel's fault for increasing anti-Antisemitism, did I got this one correctly?*


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## Challenger (Feb 16, 2015)

Phoenall said:


> ....
> If you cant give an answer the best policy is to keep quiet, otherwise you just show how incredibly stupid and immature you are.



Dear tea pot, love kettle.


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## Challenger (Feb 16, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > I never accused anyone of anything, merely pointed out the remarkable similarity in posting styles.  If you chose to jump to that conclusion, that's up to you.
> ...



Knock yourself out.


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## Coyote (Feb 17, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Challenger said:
> 
> 
> > I never accused anyone of anything, merely pointed out the remarkable similarity in posting styles.  If you chose to jump to that conclusion, that's up to you.
> ...



You sound more than a little bit obsessive.  Seriously.  Get over yourself.  You are not that important.


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## Coyote (Feb 18, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> > abu afak said:
> ...



Grow up.


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## Roudy (Feb 18, 2015)

montelatici said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > Challenger said:
> ...



No sane person believes your bullshit.


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## fanger (Feb 18, 2015)

*EVERYTHING YOU WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT ANTI-SEMITISM BUT WERE AFRAID TO ASK*

*



*
*



			“We Israelis must be careful lest we become not a source of pride for Jews but a distressing burden. Israel is the criterion according to which all Jews will tend to be judged. Israel as a Jewish state is an example of the Jewish character, which finds free and concentrated expression within it. Anti-Semitism has deep and historical roots. Nevertheless, any flaw in Israeli conduct, which initially is cited as anti-Israelism, is likely to be transformed into empirical proof of the validity of anti-Semitism. It would be a tragic irony if the Jewish state, which was intended to solve the problem of anti-Semitism, was to become a factor in the rise of anti-Semitism. Israelis must be aware that the price of their misconduct is paid not only by them but also Jews throughout the world. In the struggle against anti-Semitism, the frontline begins in Israel.”
		
Click to expand...

**EVERYTHING YOU WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT ANTI-SEMITISM BUT WERE AFRAID TO ASK Desertpeace*


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## Roudy (Feb 18, 2015)

fanger said:


> *EVERYTHING YOU WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT ANTI-SEMITISM BUT WERE AFRAID TO ASK*
> 
> *
> 
> ...



If we want to know about anti Semitism we'll just read some of your posts.  Ha ha ha.


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## Mindful (Mar 3, 2015)

montelatici said:


> The least you could do is learn to spell antisemitism.  Being against Zionism, as some Jews are, is not antisemitism.



No kidding?


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 3, 2015)

abu afak said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> > abu afak said:
> ...


ask a rabbi


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## Roudy (Mar 3, 2015)

One trick pony has this bullshit Naturea Karta he posts over and over as if that cult that comprises of .00001% of Jewish population represents what Jews really think.  Ha ha ha.


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## Roudy (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > I.P.Freely said:
> ...



Don't need to.  You're the nonJew running around spewing jew hate while posing as a Jew. PIG.


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## Roudy (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > I.P.Freely said:
> ...



Ha ha ha.  You see, this is what I like about Judaism, unlike Islam, it repels and disowns garbage like you.  

Heard you got kicked out of the tribe and publicly embarrassed because you didn't qualify.  Man I would have liked to be there, just to laugh my ass off at the man who pees freely on himself in public!


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 3, 2015)

Roudy said:


> I.P.Freely said:
> 
> 
> > Roudy said:
> ...


He He He Netanyahu speech to Congress will push Tehran closer to bomb Israeli ex-security commanders RT News Ho Ho Ho


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## aris2chat (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > I.P.Freely said:
> ...



how about we discuss the issues and not try to throw labels at each other?


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## Phoenall (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> Roudy said:
> 
> 
> > I.P.Freely said:
> ...






 Now only a stupid muslim would use the tern christonazi, they don't have the brains to find something that has meaning


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## aris2chat (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> aris2chat said:
> 
> 
> > I.P.Freely said:
> ...



the guardians believe a state will be established "after" the messiah comes, and that a state should not be forced into existence before the right time.  It is about their reading of the talmud.

Goy is a term for nation, usually other nation.  It have come to be used as someone who is not of the jewish nation.
Roudy don't have to try and be anything except himself.  We are all complex collection of out education and experiences.  Don't try to pigeon hold people into specific categories, we are all many things through out our life.


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## Dont Taz Me Bro (Mar 3, 2015)

Thread has been cleaned up, infractions given out.


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## aris2chat (Mar 3, 2015)

Dont Taz Me Bro said:


> Thread has been cleaned up, infractions given out.


 
Why is goy and other jewish terms used as insults left on posts but ruby, as in a precious stone, not???


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 3, 2015)

are these jews anti Semitic


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 3, 2015)

are these jews anti semetic
Iranian Jewish community holds rally in support of nuclear program - Iranian Threat - Jerusalem Post


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## Phoenall (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> are these jews anti Semitic





 Lets just say that they are misguided and extremist in their views, and this shows in their tiny numbers.


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## aris2chat (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> are these jews anti semetic
> Iranian Jewish community holds rally in support of nuclear program - Iranian Threat - Jerusalem Post



and those who speak against the theocracy, they would risk their life and those of their loved ones.


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## Phoenall (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> are these jews anti semetic
> Iranian Jewish community holds rally in support of nuclear program - Iranian Threat - Jerusalem Post






 More likely scared of putting a foot wrong and what will happen to their families


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## abu afak (Mar 3, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


> ​ask a rabbi


*Actually, These "Rabbis", are seen out of all proportion to their number.
They are a Tiny ultra-orthodox Kool Aid sect called Neturei Karta/NKusa/NK.uk, jewsnotzionists, etc.
In NY I occasionally see a few of them with even more photographers snapping pix. 

They and a few other similar Freak groups are all the rage with antisemites. "See even some Jews hate Israel, so it's not me who has an issue".
In fact, they object to Israel on Religious grounds. 
They believe a state should Not exist before the Messiah comes. 
IOW, Jesus ain't he.

In the name of glorifying antizionism, they Have unwisely dabbled in anti-semitism by attending things like A'jads holocaust denial conference. *

Neturei Karta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"..Neturei Karta opposes Zionism and calls for a peaceful dismantling of the State of Israel, in the Belief that Jews are Forbidden to have their own state until the Coming of the Jewish Messiah.[1][2]
[......]
Neturei Karta states that no official count of the number of members exists.[3] 
The Jewish Virtual Library puts their numbers at 5,000 [4] 
The Anti-Defamation League estimates that fewer than 100 members of the community take part in anti-Israel activism.".."​


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 3, 2015)

Phoenall said:


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drivel
*Iran s Jews It s Our Home And We Plan To Stay Parallels NPR*
The Jews' very presence in Iran demonstrates the complexity of a country that is hard for outsiders to understand. Our search to understand what keeps the Jews here begins in the kitchen of a kosher restaurant in Tehran.

The cooks were in the basement, cutting up meat. We took a table in the dining room, and talked with David Shumer, 28, the son of the owner. He says his family has run this place for 35 years, serving kebab and chicken on the bone.

"Many restaurant is better than this restaurant," he says.

I stopped him, wanting to be sure of his English.

"I am honest," he says with a laugh.

We asked Shumer for an honest answer to a more serious question: What is it like to be Jewish in an Islamic republic?

"It's so good and so happy," he says.

He contends that Jews have equal rights. They don't, as we came to learn, but Shumer does lead a comfortable middle-class life.

"I have a car, and a job. Everything I have is here," he says. "Why not?"






David Shumer handles takeout orders at a kosher restaurant in Tehran that his family has run for 35 years. He has a comfortable, middle-class life and says he is happy in Iran. An image of Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini and Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the past and present supreme leaders of Iran, hangs on the wall.

Molly Messick/NPR
*A Long History, A Changing Middle East*

Americans might start with a slightly different question: Why are thousands of Jews still in Iran?

The government assigns Jews a different status than Muslims, but still celebrates their presence. It holds them up as evidence of Iran's tolerance.

The truth is, Jews have lived here for millennia, and their story says much about a changing Middle East.

We heard part of that story from Iran's one Jewish member of Parliament, Siamak Moreh Sedgh. His seat is one of five that the government reserves for Iran's religious minorities.

"Iran is the country of unbelievable paradoxes," says Moreh Sedgh, who smoked one cigarette after another from a red-and-white pack of Winstons. "You can find that there is the greatest Jewish community in the Middle East in Iran, in the country with the greatest political problem with Israel."

In addition to being a member of Parliament, Moreh Sedgh is a general surgeon; he met us at the Jewish charity hospital he directs. It takes in patients of all faiths.

Tradition says the first Jews moved here in ancient times. They were forced to move eastward from what's now Israel to the kingdom of Babylon, which was later conquered by the rulers of ancient Persia.

*A Commitment To Stay*

Today, the Jewish lawmaker says simply that Iranian Jews are Iranians. They stay because it's their country. And Moreh Sedgh says he supports his country's foreign policy, even when it comes to the Jewish state.

He says Judaism is not the same as Zionism, the project of building Israel.





Siamak Moreh Sedgh is the only Jewish member of Iran's Parliament. Jews are not allowed to hold high office or be judges in Iran. Moreh Sedgh is also a surgeon who runs the Dr. Sapir Hospital and Charity Center. Most of the staff and patients are Muslims.

Molly Messick/NPR
"There is a great difference between being a Jew and being Zionist," he says.

The lawmaker draws more distinctions when it comes to Iran's controversial former president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, who raised questions about the Holocaust.

"I think that the Ahmadinejad case must be viewed from another window," Moreh Sedgh says. "He does not deny [the] Holocaust clearly. He said there is some question about [the] Holocaust, and this idea was not the official statement of the Iranian government. This was only a personal idea of President Ahmadinejad."
So you Toenail and Ahmadinejad are the same, you both deny parts of the Holocaust happened?


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 4, 2015)

aris2chat said:


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That is precisely Roudy problem! he is not a Jew but attempts to portray himself as one. And because I do not fit his wannabe image of a Jew he attempt to disprove my heritage. There are many  many Jews with views like mine.
*American Jews have mixed feelings about Benjamin Netanyahu s speech Public Radio International*
*More than 50 Democratic members of Congress, including six Jews, skipped Netanyahu's speech on Tuesday. Lowenthal says he wrestled with the decision and decided to attend, but he's angry that the speech has pitted Democrat against Republican, Jew against Jew. 

"The support for Israel, historically, has been a bipartisan effort," he says. "I think that two weeks before the Israeli elections ... it's an inappropriate time to both influence the United States Congress, and for the United States Congress to be involved in an election in Israel. I think that's totally inappropriate."

Many liberal American Jews agree with Lowenthal. "We published an ad in the New York Times that was signed by 2650 people. It says, 'No, Mr. Netanyahu, you do not represent American Jews,'" says Rabbi Michael Lerner, editor of Tikkun Magazine, a progressive Jewish quarterly.
No, Mr. Netanyahu you do not represent British Jews.
*


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## SAYIT (Mar 4, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


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In fact Roudy's Jewish nature is far more real and obvious than say ... yours or Guno's.


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## Roudy (Mar 4, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


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Ask the hundreds of thousands of Iranian Jews, Armenian Iranian Christians, and Bahaiis that have fled Iran.


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## Roudy (Mar 4, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


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So?  Doesn't make them anti Israel.  They're just playing party politics. The congress both Democrat and Republican,  has now inserted itself into the Iran talks. 

*For all the angst around Israeli Prime *Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s speech, the real showdown on Iran is coming next week. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., announced he will open floor debate on a bill that would give Congress a chance to review any U.S. deal with Iran — defying White House veto threats not to pursue the legislation because it would undermine the fragile talks.

The bill would require President Obama to submit any agreement with Iran to Congress, and would bar the Obama administration from lifting sanctions for two months in order to give lawmakers the chance to debate the deal. The “Iran Nuclear Agreement Review Act of 2015” is a newer version of earlier legislation from Sens. Bob Corker, R-Tenn. and Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., introduced on Friday with Bob Menendez, D-N.J. and Tim Kaine, D-Va.

“We think the timing is important. We think it will help prevent the administration from entering into a bad deal, but if they do then it will provide an opportunity for Congress to weigh in,” McConnell told reporters on Tuesday shortly after Netanyahu’s speech in Congress and President Barack Obama’s quick retort that it was “nothing new.”

McConnell’s office told _Defense One_ Tuesday it is too early to get a sense whether they could override a veto. 

I think everyone in America should want the House and the Senate to weigh in on this most important agreement that may be reached.
Corker, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee chairman and primary author of the proposal, said, “Since Congress ultimately is gonna have to permanently suspend any sanctions that take place, it allows us to vote on that at the front end.” Corker said that he doesn’t buy the administration’s argument it could threaten the international negotiations with Iran.


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 4, 2015)

Roudy said:


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Crooks and carpetbaggers who ran with the loot they helped the shahs steal.


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## I.P.Freely (Mar 4, 2015)

SAYIT said:


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Balmalocha are you askenazi or sephardim


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## Roudy (Mar 4, 2015)

I.P.Freely said:


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Ah, another subject you know absolutely nothing about.  Majority of the non Muslim minorities have left Iran because of oppression and persecution by the Islamist regime.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Bahá'ís

*UN report blasts Iran for persecution of Christians, other religious minorities*


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## Mindful (Mar 4, 2015)

Roudy said:


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He and his clones are not interested in facts. He's only  here to bait and provoke. Any reaction, however negative, turns him on.


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## Roudy (Mar 4, 2015)

Mindful said:


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Islamists and tolerance. What a joke that is.


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