# for those who would jail me for hiring illegals



## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.


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## DaGoose (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



If you can't afford to run your business legally then you can't afford to run your business at all.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

I'm in your situation and I say your full of grade A shit. I've been in business over 20 years in the construction industry. 

YOU ARE MORE OF THE PROBLEM THAN THE IRS EVER WAS. COCKSUCKERS LIKE YOU MAKE IT DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE LIKE ME TO COMPETE. 

FUCK YOU


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



Oh Brother....................

Yup they tell you if you pay them you are responsible for the taxes until the discrepancy is cleared up.

Very scary stuff.


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## paulitician (Nov 27, 2011)

I agree Big Government is completely out of control. It's almost like they're an enemy to the People now. They sure are making it very difficult for small businesses to succeed. That being said,hiring Illegals has only created a Slave Labor epidemic in this country. Wages have been stagnant while the cost of living has skyrocketed. I do sympathize with your plight but i still feel it's vital we hire American Citizens. We're in some pretty awful times and our own Citizens sure could use the work. But again,i am very sorry you've had so much trouble. I hope things get better for you. I really do.


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. .




What do YOU call them if not "illegals"?


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## Warrior102 (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



USArmyRetarded's sock


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## uscitizen (Nov 27, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> pvsi.net said:
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> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. .
> ...



I think he calls them increased profit.

I personally think the any company with a history of hiring illegals should have their business licences revoked for a period of time.
And or be prohibited form getting any government contracts.

corporations are not people you cannot put them in jail for crimes.
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## WillowTree (Nov 27, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> pvsi.net said:
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> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. .
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I guess you noticed you didn't get an answer? and the asswipe is still online.. just ask for pertinent information and it shuts the stupid up every single solitary time..


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



You are a good man.

Continue hiring "illegals" - don't worry about what the neonazis' , clansmen, aryans, know-nothings have to say.


"To remind him that our ancestors, before their emigration to America, were the free inhabitants of the British dominions in Europe, *and possessed a right which nature has given to all men, of departing from the country in which chance, not choice, has placed them, of going in quest of new habitations, and of there establishing new societies, *under such laws and regulations as to them shall seem most likely to promote public happiness"

Thomas Jefferson

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## uscitizen (Nov 27, 2011)

promote public Happiness???

LMAO!


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.
> ...



only a moron would advise another moron to continue breaking the law. 

Enjoy the neg asswipe


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## R.C. Christian (Nov 27, 2011)

All illegals should burn in hell. All scumbags who hire illegals will burn in hell. Of course, the definition of hell varies so I suppose karma will suffice.


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## The T (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.


 
Mitt? Is that you?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5Xa8k_xL8k]Romney: I&#39;m Running For Office, For Pete&#39;s Sake, I Can&#39;t Have Illegals. - YouTube[/ame]


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## Lovebears65 (Nov 27, 2011)

So what your saying is your giving jobs to illegals instead of Americans.  We need to send your ass to Mexico if you want to work for illegal mexicans!  You doofas


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## WillowTree (Nov 27, 2011)

Lovebears65 said:


> So what your saying is your giving jobs to illegals instead of Americans.  We need to send your ass to Mexico if you want to work for illegal mexicans!  You doofas



Doofas the Stupid has left da building.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


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Is it necessary to use foul language in this here forum?

Can we all get along without the necessity to cuss?

OMG.

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## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> pvsi.net said:
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> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. .
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People trying to provide a better life to their families?

Damn them all to hell for their self-centered greed.


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## WillowTree (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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So you are on record as being in favor of tax paying Americans giving up their hard earned money? Money they could have spent on their own children but now have to give it to illegals?? You think Mexico would put up with that shit? Also yo are on record as being in favor of illegals taking American jobs while unemployment stands at 9%??? that will sure help obama the asswipe won't it?


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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Well, don't take a holier than thou attitude. 

Prior to 1965 we had open borders with Mexico and Canada. 

But when your boy LBJ made the US a welfare state the powers-that-be were forced to expel the Mexicans because they can not vote in US elections. 

.


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## RadiomanATL (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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So do bank robbers.


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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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What about Americans who are out of work and would like to provide a better life for their families? Maybe they should just continue to live out of their cars, stand in line at the soup kitchen.  Damm Americans --- how dare they want a job. How dare they complain about line jumpers.

If you pitty illegals so much let them have your job---not mine or my neighbors.


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## Warrior102 (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


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Yes it is fuckwit


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## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Laddie said:


> What about Americans who are out of work and would like to provide a better life for their families? Maybe they should just continue to live out of their cars, stand in line at the soup kitchen.  Damm Americans --- how dare they want a job. How dare they complain about line jumpers.
> 
> If you pitty illegals so much let them have your job---not mine or my neighbors.



I don't buy the zero sum game nonsense. There is as much wealth, and as many jobs as there are people who want to work. Our economy gets out of balance and people sometimes end up sitting around waiting for a job opportunity to appear - but the notion that every immigrant hired for a job equals an American out of work just doesn't hold up.

The unfairness of all this is that the illegal immigrants are working off the books and not contributing to the tax base, _and_ working as second-class citizens. We can get angry at them and spew xenophobic hatred - but in my view what's broken is the body of immigration law.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Warrior102 said:


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You and that Grampa Murked U guy have ruined it for the rest of us. Our lives will no longer be pure.

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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Laddie said:
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> > What about Americans who are out of work and would like to provide a better life for their families? Maybe they should just continue to live out of their cars, stand in line at the soup kitchen.  Damm Americans --- how dare they want a job. How dare they complain about line jumpers.
> ...




You obviously are clueless about the effects of illegals in the construction industry. 

They cause depressed wages across the board. And right now while construction is hurting so bad it makes it ten times worse. Not to mention it takes jobs from legal residents. Then you have to consider that a good portion of the money they make is sent back to family in Mexico rather than spent in our economy. 

Here in KC illegal hires are killing several fields in construction. 

I have also lost jobs to illegals because they undercut bids by more than half. Now how the fuck can I as a legit operator compete with that? Cut my helps salaries? Remove their benefits? Lay more off? 

Get real and check out reality


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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Laddie said:
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> > What about Americans who are out of work and would like to provide a better life for their families? Maybe they should just continue to live out of their cars, stand in line at the soup kitchen.  Damm Americans --- how dare they want a job. How dare they complain about line jumpers.
> ...



I don't know where your getting your facts from. But the general numbers go like this: There are roughly 11 million plus illegal aliens in the United States. At the same time there are 10 million Americans out of work.  Deport all illegals and jobs will open for Americans.

Not only that I see first hand what hiring illegal aliens has done to my community and it is disgusting. Packing sheds, manufactures, and retail stores alike hire illegal after illegal and when an American ask for an application the response is almost always, "Sorry we don't have job for you."  

Not only is it unfair for an employer to have its employees work off the books and not pay taxes. This mentality has created unfair labor competition by keeping wages low and increasing profit for the company, while these same employers use the local roads to transport goods to and from where ever they need their services to travel. Yet arn't paying the taxes to pave the roads.  Putting that burden on ligitimate companies.


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## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> You obviously are clueless about the effects of illegals in the construction industry.
> 
> They cause depressed wages across the board. And right now while construction is hurting so bad it makes it ten times worse. Not to mention it takes jobs from legal residents. Then you have to consider that a good portion of the money they make is sent back to family in Mexico rather than spent in our economy.
> 
> ...



This is sort of funny really, because I _did_ work construction for about ten years - and in KC no less! It was that experience, probably more than anything else, that led me to the conclusion that our attitude toward 'illegals' was deeply hypocritical and cruel.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Warrior102 said:
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 [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZC6mxpgSYg&feature=youtube_gdata_player]Metallica My Friend Of Misery with lyrics - YouTube[/ame]


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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> > You obviously are clueless about the effects of illegals in the construction industry.
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So you used a hammer. Big fucking deal. I have to meet payroll and follow rules all the while trying to compete with those that cheat. 

Like I said, get real.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


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I feel your pain.

So I have written to my congresscritter demanding that all the mexicans and your competition be sent to Mexico and that you be given monopoly powers.

happy now, douchebag ?

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## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> I feel your pain.
> 
> So I have written to my congresscritter demanding that all the mexicans and your competition be sent to Mexico and that you be given monopoly powers.
> 
> happy now, douchebag ?.



I read an excellent, tongue-in-cheek commentary (supposedly by some Mexican official), offering a one-to-one amnesty exchange. For every "illegal" we send back, they'll send back an expat hippie.


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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Oh, so there aren't already plenty of Americans who are trying to provide better lives to their families?  There aren't Americans who are in need of jobs to just be able to provide a STATUS QUO life for their families?  In case you hadn't noticed, we have laws in this country that are intended to protect the interests of our citizens.  When people come here in violation of our laws THEY ARE ILLEGALS.  When they willfully violate our laws, they undermine our ability and right to establish our own rules to serve our own interests, as if their own interests and desires are more important than ours.  In other words, THEY ARE BEING SELF CENTERED.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


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How about we just expect all employers play by the same set of rules moron?


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> There is as much wealth, and as many jobs as there are people who want to work.



Uh, no.  Flat out not true.  Flamingly stupid.  Are you high?  Can I hit that?


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## Zoom (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> I'm in your situation and I say your full of grade A shit. I've been in business over 20 years in the construction industry.
> 
> YOU ARE MORE OF THE PROBLEM THAN THE IRS EVER WAS. COCKSUCKERS LIKE YOU MAKE IT DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE LIKE ME TO COMPETE.
> 
> FUCK YOU



Then why are so many corporations leaving the country?


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
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> > I'm in your situation and I say your full of grade A shit. I've been in business over 20 years in the construction industry.
> ...



Neither him nor I are corporations. Your analogy fails on its face.


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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Contumacious said:
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Exactly!  Also, the DOJ needs to enforce immigration laws and politicans need to stop holding American Jobs Hostage while they pander for the Latino Vote.

Their is a path to citizenship in this country and illegals need to come into America through those channels.  Line jumping just encourges lawlessness and criminal activity.  

In addition too the illegals from Mexico there are many illegal aliens now coming to America from Greece.  When will it end? When will our boarders be secure?


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## Zoom (Nov 27, 2011)

R.C. Christian said:


> All illegals should burn in hell. All scumbags who hire illegals will burn in hell. Of course, the definition of hell varies so I suppose karma will suffice.



So Illegal children should burn in hell?  Karma indeed.


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## Harry Dresden (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
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> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.
> ...




Continue hiring "illegals" - *don't worry about what the* neonazis' , clansmen, aryans,* know-nothings have to say.*



then should you be giving him advice?.....just askin.....


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## Zoom (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


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I will ask this again.  Why are coorporations leaving this country?


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


> I will ask this again.  Why are coorporations leaving this country?



Okay, you've asked it again.  Now stop asking.  It's an irrelevant question that has nothing to do with this topic.


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## Warrior102 (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


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Good.


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## Harry Dresden (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


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let me help ruin it for you.....GO FUCK YOURSELF.....did that help?.....


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


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You can ask till you're blue in the face. I'm not playing your game. This thread is about the legality and impact of hiring illegals. If you want to discuss the legitimacy of IRS regulations start your own thread.


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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


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Coorporations are leaving America because they would rather pay a child tens cents a day for the same labor they would have to pay an American fifty dollars a day.

It it about the coorporations bottom line---profit.  There is no humanity is this mentality.
If they can't exploit the worker in the US--they will exploit workers somewhere.


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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Contumacious said:
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This adds nothing to the conversation.  It only shows your lack of ability to stand with your premise that has fallen about fast.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
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> > I'm in your situation and I say your full of grade A shit. I've been in business over 20 years in the construction industry.
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Greener pastures. 

The welfare/warfare regulatory state has become a hostile territory for corporations to exist.

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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


> R.C. Christian said:
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> > All illegals should burn in hell. All scumbags who hire illegals will burn in hell. Of course, the definition of hell varies so I suppose karma will suffice.
> ...



Their parents should of considered the ramifications of their actions before either having anchor babies or being them across the border illegally.

Don't try to make American feel guilty for what illegals aliens did to their families.  These parents and only these parents are responsible for the outcome of what decisions they made on behalf of their children.  

Is skirting the law---a moral way to raise a family??? That is what they are and have taught their children to believe.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Laddie said:


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Jes, indeed they do.

BTW, which Constitutional proviso authorizes fedgov to interdict, detain and deport.

Grassy Ass

Your Latino Brother 

Juan Contumacious

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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

You jackoffs are a trip. 

You bitch about big bizz taking American jobs overseas but have no problem with small bizz taking jobs from Americans to give to illegals. 

Hypocrites


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## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Laddie said:


> This adds nothing to the conversation.  It only shows your lack of ability to stand with your premise that has fallen about fast.



It shows I've yet to see a rational argument on this topic. The immigrant bashers are so full of fear and hatred it's virtually impossible to discuss how we might reform immigration policy in a productive way. So jokes aren't a bad alternative.


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> It shows I've yet to see a rational argument on this topic.



This coming from the person who claimed that jobs available is based on how many people want to work.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


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This add jocularity to the conversation, but we don't need that at this time. 

What we need you to do is blame the Mexicans for our problems just like Adolf blamed the Jews. Never mind that no one single federal politician is of Mexican descent. 

As always , Heil Hitler.

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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Laddie said:
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Wrong, you failed to comprehend rational explanations. I gave you firm examples of how it hurts Americans and our economy and you chose to ignore it. And by the way I'm for Newts plan. I have no fear of illegals. I fear the corrupt employers that kill a fair market by breaking the rules.


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## Laddie (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Laddie said:
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Still your argument doesn't hold.  There is a legal way to immigrate to the United States and these immigrants like Americans are following the law while the illegal immigrants are not following the law---Line jumpers.  

Lets discuss illegal immigrants who break the law and are rewarded with jobs taken from legal immigrants and American's alike.  

The "bashers" as you call them are disgusted with lack of enforcement and in my opionion are not "...full or fear and hatred..." They are tired of line jumpers skirting the system and being rewarded. Taking jobs, schools seats, keeping wages low, while they pay  more taxes at the State and Local level to cover the cost of illegals aliens education, medical care, ect....

Amnesty is  not the answer. This only undermines legal immigrants  who worked hard and played by the rules.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


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Hey dickhead, I'm the one involved in this debate and not once have I blamed the illegals. I've blamed the employers like the op for creating the problem. So stop changing the facts to suit your own stupid argument. 

You have failed.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


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Stupid fuck.

It didn't bother you in the least when war criminal Bush broke the rules by invading countries under false pretenses and blew 1 trillion in the process!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Laddie said:


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Oh brother......

The Drama...The Suspense.....


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## paulitician (Nov 27, 2011)

Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much. From Health Care to Slave Labor Wages,it has taken a huge toll on American Citizens. I know some will be quick to throw the 'Racism' accusation out there,but i assure you i'm not coming at it from a racial standpoint. Illegal Immigration has lowered wages significantly for American Workers. I'm always surprised when many complain about poor wages but don't even know the reasons why. Why would a business want to pay an American Citizen a decent wage when they can pay an Illegal Alien a slave wage? It's just common sense. 

But so many just want to play politics and play the Race-Baiting Game. It's all about pandering for votes in the end. But the sad irony is that those who support open borders are only hurting themselves. The Unions especially,really have sold their members out. Illegal Immigration is killing them. So i really do feel for this OP's plight,but we need to help our own Citizens out. If you want to be paid a decent wage,you better start opposing Illegal Immigration. Otherwise,stop complaining.


----------



## The T (Nov 27, 2011)

Laddie said:


> Zoom said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...


 
^^Obviously a Union Thug.


----------



## The T (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Laddie said:
> 
> 
> > This adds nothing to the conversation. It only shows your lack of ability to stand with your premise that has fallen about fast.
> ...


 No jackass. We have laws about not hiring people that are here illegally.

What part of that don't you get?


----------



## uscitizen (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...


To a great extent that applies to both sides of the "fence".

The issue here is we do have a fence and we do have laws in our sovern nation just as every nation does (I think?).  Virtually all at least have immigration laws and rules and such.


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

paulitician said:


> Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much..



Nonsense.

The advise I gave my children, and giving to my grandchildren, is to learn a marketable skill, be the best the can be , be flexible and ready to move to wherever the jobs are and not to worry about the competition.

I spent many years in college where I learned a profession in which I can earn an excellent salary. I paid my dues. Let everyone else do the same.

.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...



first of all I wasn't on this board when bush started the wars so how the hell do you know what my position on that issue was? (I think that makes you the stupid fuck btw)

Secondly your so far off topic you can't even see the topic. ( ill accept that as your admission of debate failure)


----------



## paulitician (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much..
> ...



I'm happy for you but it's not nonsense. Illegal Immigration has lowered wages significantly for American Workers. And the Unions have sold their members out. They get paid to get Democrats elected yet they're the ones who are in full support of open borders. The Union Bosses have been bought off for sure. Illegal Immigration and Outsourcing have crippled American wages. It's time to help American Citizens out. It's time to secure our borders.


----------



## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

The T said:


> We have laws about not hiring people that are here illegally.
> 
> What part of that don't you get?



I think they are stupid laws. I don't, in general, support disobeying the law. But when the law is irrational and unjust, civil disobedience is a reasonable response.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > We have laws about not hiring people that are here illegally.
> ...



Hiring an illegal is not civil disobedience. It's criminal disobedience.


----------



## uscitizen (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much..
> ...



Many do and still wind up in need of assistance in life.

Just too bad?


----------



## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...



Pay him no mind.  The only argument he has is OMGHITLERBAD.  It's the ultimate failure of reasoning.


----------



## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> It didn't bother you in the least when war criminal Bush broke the rules by invading countries under false pretenses and blew 1 trillion in the process!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



And how the Hell does that mean that we should stop enforcing immigration laws or that we should make those laws weaker?


----------



## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> I think they are stupid laws. I don't, in general, support disobeying the law. But when the law is irrational and unjust, civil disobedience is a reasonable response.



What is so stupid about having a reasonable immigration policy that preserves the interests of our citizens?


----------



## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Inthemiddle said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > I think they are stupid laws. I don't, in general, support disobeying the law. But when the law is irrational and unjust, civil disobedience is a reasonable response.
> ...



Nothing at all. We should get one of those.


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## mudwhistle (Nov 27, 2011)

I say fuck the damn government.

They're corrupt and since Obama doesn't follow the law why the fuck should everyone else.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...




They sure should try to provide a better life for their families - in their home countries. Or, they could try to provide that better life here if they come legally and respect our laws and our sovereignty. What part of that is so fucking hard to understand?


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## alan1 (Nov 27, 2011)

Laddie said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Laddie said:
> ...


I've known a few small business owners in the construction industry.
This is what they told me.

Hire an American citizen for $15.00 an hour (or more).  Withhold federal and state income tax.  Withhold SS tax and match it.  Withhold Medicare tax.  *Send those withholding's to the government.*

Hire an illegal alien for $15.00 an hour (or more).  Withhold federal and state income tax.  Withhold SS tax and match it.  Withhold Medicare tax.  *Don't send those withholding's to the government.*

Both employees see the same amount in their paycheck, but it costs a lot less for the employer to hire illegals.  It's not like the illegals can complain about it.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> [ - but in my view what's broken is the body of immigration law.




How do you know until we enforce them?


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## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > [ - but in my view what's broken is the body of immigration law.
> ...



Enforcement is the tell. Any law that can't be enforced without police state tactics, or walling off our country, has serious issues.


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

uscitizen said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > paulitician said:
> ...



I will temporarily support any one who I PERSONALLY KNOW that through no fault of their own, are unemployed.

Fedgov has no authority whatsoever to steal from A in order to support B.

.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> uscitizen said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...




Considering how dumb you are you probably don't have many friends so your risk is minimal to make such statements about supporting others.


----------



## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

Thank god at least ONE Pub has spoken some truth on illegals. They are HERE and have been working (94% of men in 2007), paying taxes (67%) and owning homes 35%, Pew). They are NEVER going to be thrown out and are an important oart of our society, and MANY of their jobs are ones Americans won't do fcs.

Myself, I believe mega rich Pubs love the cheap labor and their harassment of Hispanic, unconstitutional laws are just BS for the dupes, and their  talk of an un-American, useless,stupid, incredibly expensive fence is also for the dittoheads- works GREAT and has for YEARS, GD MORONS tyvm.

  Dems aren't for open borders, shytteheads, they're for a good (computer chip) SS work card that will stop NEW illegals from getting work, and actually having strong laws and enforcement. It's called the Schumer/Graham bill and is the only real answer. Newt is halfway there only. 

I am optimistic that in conjunction with Obamacare and Schumer we'll finally have a modern country. Try thinking, racist corporate tools LOL.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Laddie said:
> 
> 
> > This adds nothing to the conversation.  It only shows your lack of ability to stand with your premise that has fallen about fast.
> ...




Are you another of these liberals who cannot distinguish between legal and illegal immigration?


----------



## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

francoHFW said:


> and MANY of their jobs are ones Americans won't do fcs.



That is not true.  There's no such thing as a job that Americans won't do.  They just refuse to accept unsafe work conditions for pennies on the dollar.


----------



## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

#82-Are you one of those Fox/Rush/Moonie/Kochbots who can't distinguish BS propaganda/hate talk from reality?- get ready to get fooled again...


----------



## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

Inthemiddle said:


> francoHFW said:
> 
> 
> > and MANY of their jobs are ones Americans won't do fcs.
> ...



Actually, I agree, if you pay a good wage and Obamacare. At the moment though, well, ask farmers in Ga and Alabama...


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > uscitizen said:
> ...


----------



## thereisnospoon (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



What is your point? That you or any other business owner should be permitted to hire illegals? Or is it the crushing regulations?
Quite frankly if your problem is the lack of freedom to hire cheap labor and thus supplant Americans, you'll earn my contempt.
If it is the overbearing and intrusive government regulations, I stand by you 100%.


----------



## thereisnospoon (Nov 27, 2011)

uscitizen said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...


How about permanently. 
That won't stop it though. There are so many fly by night companies that operate under the radar unlicensed it's really a mockery of the system.
As far as I am concerned, hiring illegals is the ultimate crime against American workers. 
The punishment should be so draconian that it push the envelope of cruel and unusual.
Take away the incentive of hiring illegals and the flow of them stops. Problem solved.


----------



## WillowTree (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...



Open borders means you have no country asswarp!


----------



## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

Nobody's for open borders, brainwashed moron.ty


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

WillowTree said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Unkotare said:
> ...



Stupid injuns

"In late 1875, Sioux and Cheyenne Indians defiantly left their reservations, outraged over the continued intrusions of whites into their sacred lands in the Black Hills. They gathered in Montana with the great warrior Sitting Bull to fight for their lands. The following spring, two victories over the US Cavalry emboldened them to fight on in the summer of 1876."

.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...



President Bush is NOT a war criminal. Start a new thread if you want to be wrong about that separate topic.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...




And where are they now after an ineffective defense of their land? 

Now go sit down and color or something.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > We have laws about not hiring people that are here illegally.
> ...




There is nothing "irrational and unjust" in controlling our own borders and protecting our national sovereignty.


----------



## Jackson (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



Is there a particular reason you don't like hiring citizens of the US?  The "your" economy is actually part of yours.  Don't forget their are high unemployment numbers that every small business has a chance to help.  Hiring illegals doesn't help but you are actually taking advantage of a bad situation to better your own personal income.

Hiring citizens seems to be more patriotic than hiring those who break the law and send their dollars to their own country.  I hope you reflect upon this maneuver.


----------



## paulitician (Nov 27, 2011)

Illegal Immigration and Outsourcing are what have completely sunk American wages. It's just common sense. We have become a Slave Labor Nation. Wages have stayed stagnant while the cost of living has skyrocketed. The incentive to hire slaves has been there for American Businesses for a long time. Our Immigration Laws have rarely been enforced. Only recently have they even tried to end this practice. But i still think it's only a half-hearted gesture. 

I don't think American wages will ever recover. Even the Union Bosses have sold their members out. They get paid to get Democrats elected and they're fully supporting open-borders. This open-border policy is killing American Workers,so shame on the Union Bosses too. I do feel bad for this OP but i also feel bad for Millions of American Workers who have been getting screwed for years.


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > WillowTree said:
> ...



You ignored the indians' rights and slaughtered them like dogs. Then stole their land and placed them in reservations.

Isn't it true that what is good for the goose is good for the gander?

Just think that someday in Arizona , there will be a small reservation known as Aryanland. And of course you will be their Chief.

.


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## paulitician (Nov 27, 2011)

If you support open borders and illegal immigration,you have no right to complain about low wages. Slave Labor Wages could be here for good unless something changes. I'm not optimistic things will change though. Too much politics involved.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...



I did all that? Damn I'm a terrible person. Oops my bad, I forgot you were reading stories from your coloring book. 

And shame on you for thanking his bullshit slander of another poster loh


----------



## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

The only thing that will stop illegal workers is a good SS ID and enforcement. Period. Pubs won't do it. And they distract the dupes with bad laws and stupid talk of a idiotic, un-American fence. Pffffft!

  Oh , and idiotic talk of open borders, that no one supports...


----------



## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > We have laws about not hiring people that are here illegally.
> ...








What makes them stupid laws?  You do realise that the hiring of illegals hurts not just the citizens who have no marketable skills, like georgephillip for instance, but high schoolers who would love to have a job but can't find one at the local fast food joint because they are all employing illegals.

Additionally the "taxes" paid are for the most part sales taxes only (and that rarely if you've ever been to what used to be called swap meets they are now open air mercados and I can assure no sales taxes are being collected there!) as they get paid under the table for most of the jobs they do.

Then toss in the rampant identity fraud that they participate in to get the actual legal jobs they do pursue and you have the cost to the innocent victims to contend with (I myself, according to the IRS have 6 illegals using my social security number.  The IRS knows who they are but they allow them to continue, hows that for justice for you?) and then the constant drain on school resources (imagine if the illegals were sent home, class sizes would drop by 10 students here in Nevada) or how about the medical cost, last time I checked there were 40+ hospitals that had been forced to close in AZ and CA.

And all of this is so that the elite who rule Mexico can continue to screw over the peasants.
They push the excess people here to the US to defuse their own internal corrupt problems and you are forced to pay for it.  Just think, you rail against the "Man" and the Mexican "Man" is laughing all the way to the bank as you are forced to pay for his cast offs.

Nice job chumps.


----------



## paulitician (Nov 27, 2011)

If you can pay a foreigner slave wages,why would you pay an American Citizen a decent wage? It really is that simple. Illegal Immigration & Oursourcing have sunk the American Worker. And that's just fact. The Illegal Immigration issue has been turned into a political game and that's just sad. That whole PC Race-Baiting game has become so tired & stale. And the American Worker only continues to suffer.


----------



## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...



You need to come down from that horse for some air.


----------



## Charles_Main (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



You are making your Living off Exploiting a class of People. That's the Dark side of this problem. Both sides for their own reasons are trying to keep the Status Qua, However Status Qua involves an entire group of people. Able to be exploited to do work for far less than it should pay, work hard hours, with no benefits and no real Protections like most workers have. 

If Paying Illegal workers sub standard wages is what you need to do to sustain your company, then maybe you should not have a company?


----------



## thereisnospoon (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...


Are you advocating the wanton hiring of illegals? If so


----------



## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...







Ummmm, no but nice try.  Actually the white man did screw over one group of indians and that was the Cherokee.  They did everything the white man asked of them to keep their land, they developed a written language and basically did everything possible to be thought of as a civilised race.  The white man fucked them over and sent them down the Trail of Tears.  That is an outrage and a blight on this country that will be hard to resolve.

The others (and I am part indian) lost a war.  At the time the war was fought losing was a really bad thing.  The fact they weren't extirminated or otherwise dealt with actually speaks well of the white man.  Lastly the white man finally has started to really work hard at repairing the terrible mistakes and crimes of the past most notably with the Alaska Native Claims Settlement Act of 1971 where the native peoples of Alaska were given a great deal of land and money to make them whole again after decades of abuse and exploitation.

As usual, you only focus on the crimes of the past and ignore the progress that has been made.


----------



## thereisnospoon (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...


That's a bullshit excuse. It is rejected out of hand.
Listen, there are millions of people are are immigrating legally , going through proper channels and becoming productive members of the distinct American culture. 
Even they are having to take a back seat to these criminal bastards.
Greed is when an employer hires and illegal to take the place of an American worker so he or she can pay them less and break all the laws involving immigration and labor.
BTW, most of the Latino illegals do not come here to make a better life for their families because 3/4ths of them never bring their families. The fact is these workers make as much money as they can send it back to where ever it is they came from and soon after move back to where ever it is they came from.
In no other country except maybe Canada is such wanton violation of borders is permitted.
And you sit there in your unmitigated gall and call people who want the government to do it's rightful and lawful job of keeping out illegals, greed?


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

thereisnospoon said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



Absolutely.

I do. 

I even translated the 2nd Amendment into Spanish so they will be ready when the neonazis start encroaching.

*La Segunda Enmienda a la Constitución de los Estados Unidos

"Siendo una milicia bien preparada necesaria para la seguridad de un estado libre, el derecho del Pueblo a tener y portar armas no será vulnerado"*

.


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

westwall said:


> As usual, you only focus on the crimes of the past and ignore the progress that has been made.



Yeah man. I should forget the past :

*Lesley Stahl on U.S. sanctions against Iraq: We have heard that a half million children have died. I mean, that's more children than died in Hiroshima. And, you know, is the price worth it?

Secretary of State Madeleine Albright: I think this is a very hard choice, but the price--we think the price is worth it.*

*--60 Minutes (5/12/96)*

.


----------



## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> I'm in your situation and I say your full of grade A shit. I've been in business over 20 years in the construction industry.
> 
> YOU ARE MORE OF THE PROBLEM THAN THE IRS EVER WAS. COCKSUCKERS LIKE YOU MAKE IT DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE LIKE ME TO COMPETE.
> 
> FUCK YOU


In your mouth


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> thereisnospoon said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...



You and those like you need to spend some time in jail for undermining and violating our laws and causing great disfunction to our society. 

I'm really glad I negd you earlier. Only wish I could smack you around a bit.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > I'm in your situation and I say your full of grade A shit. I've been in business over 20 years in the construction industry.
> ...



Spoken like a true dick lover. Fuck off traitor.


----------



## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

paulitician said:


> I agree Big Government is completely out of control. It's almost like they're an enemy to the People now. They sure are making it very difficult for small businesses to succeed. That being said,hiring Illegals has only created a Slave Labor epidemic in this country. Wages have been stagnant while the cost of living has skyrocketed. I do sympathize with your plight but i still feel it's vital we hire American Citizens. We're in some pretty awful times and our own Citizens sure could use the work. But again,i am very sorry you've had so much trouble. I hope things get better for you. I really do.


No, I'm ok, thanks. I was talking about something 5-10 years ago while I was living in the city of Philadelphia (north) full of welfare people. since I moved out into the country, my opinion about Americans changed a LOT - much harder working, more decent people. and besides, there's no illegals here.


----------



## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> What do YOU call them if not "illegals"?



Undocumented people that can work better then lazy welfare class? - if you ever lived in North Philadelphia, you would understand...


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > I agree Big Government is completely out of control. It's almost like they're an enemy to the People now. They sure are making it very difficult for small businesses to succeed. That being said,hiring Illegals has only created a Slave Labor epidemic in this country. Wages have been stagnant while the cost of living has skyrocketed. I do sympathize with your plight but i still feel it's vital we hire American Citizens. We're in some pretty awful times and our own Citizens sure could use the work. But again,i am very sorry you've had so much trouble. I hope things get better for you. I really do.
> ...



So your op was complete bullshit irrelevant to todays issues ment to just stir up shit and troll. 


Your an ass


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> You are a good man.
> 
> Continue hiring "illegals" - don't worry about what the neonazis' , clansmen, aryans, know-nothings have to say.
> 
> ...


Amen brother! spoken like a true Christian! 
Oh, that was Thomas Jefferson, sorry. who's that?


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > thereisnospoon said:
> ...



You still haven't shown the federal "law' and with good reason : there is no federal law ...or so said Founding Father and 3rd President Thomas Jefferson:

* 4. _Resolved_,* That alien friends are under the jurisdiction and protection of the laws of the State wherein they are: that no power over them has been delegated to the United States, nor prohibited to the individual States, distinct from their power over citizens. And it being true as a general principle, and one of the amendments to the Constitution having also declared, that "the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people," *the act of the Congress of the United States, passed on the -- day of July, 1798, intituled "An Act concerning aliens," which assumes powers over alien friends, not delegated by the Constitution, is not law, but is altogether void, and of no force. *

.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > What do YOU call them if not "illegals"?
> ...



So your saying you job was to either take advantage of poor Americans or illegal aliens. 

You are the scum of our society.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > You are a good man.
> ...



Christianity was born in the middle east. They weren't white people jackass.


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## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > You are a good man.
> ...



An illegal alien from Virginia. He was declared an enemy noncombatant by the Patriot Act.

.


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Unkotare said:
> ...



First, he has a point about work ethic.

Second, I bitched about this thirty years ago. I Use to yell immigration on the job site and watch the site go quiet, with the other contractor asking me to stop doing that. 

This issue our government has intentionally ignored for such a very long time. Hard to be angry at someone for doing whats allowed.


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

paulitician said:


> Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much. From *Health Care *to Slave Labor Wages,it has taken a huge toll on American Citizens.





> HEALTH CARE... Special interests are directly responsible for high cost of health care: (nothing to do with left or right) some of the most basic medicine, that was invented a long time ago, is now unavailable to the general public. for example, I know someone who had an eye rash. all he needed was eye drops. so he went to the pharmacy, but he was told he first needs to go to the doctor to get a prescription. So he went to the hospital, waited half a day, the doctor then measured his heart beat, his pulse, some other things, and finally gave him a perscription. he then went back and paid $90 for a small bottle of eye drops that should not have cost any more then 50 cents, and then, he got a bill for the doctors visit in the mail, which was another $1,200...
> 
> 
> A government representing the people, will repeal all the obsurd laws benefiting pharmaceutical industry, then, our health care will become affordable for all, once again.
> ...


I rest my case.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Full-Auto said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...



He clearly targeted the poor and illegal. What's his point? That he's a fucking idiot who doesn't know how to run a proper business. 

You don't start a business with the plan of only hiring the indigent. You hire the best you can afford. If that's all he could afford he isn't worth the permit he paid for to start his business. 


OR HE IS JUST A FRAUD.


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> You are the scum of our society.


I am the working class and you are the lazy ass.


----------



## Ravi (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



I don't totally understand your post. But I don't think businesses should have to enforce federal immigration law...and in fact should be able to hire whomever they please.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much. From *Health Care *to Slave Labor Wages,it has taken a huge toll on American Citizens.
> ...



Omg


You rest your case with a quote from YOUR OWN website? 


Your a fucking idiot.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > You are the scum of our society.
> ...



Your the working class and I'm lazy? 


JMSTILE.COM

that's my website, my work, my multiple surgeries, my grown kids, my retirement. 


What you got fraud?


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Full-Auto said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



You did see my response at post number 4. Ive dealt with this on several occasions. Each time it was our government with the head planted.


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> He clearly targeted the poor and illegal. What's his point? That he's a fucking idiot who doesn't know how to run a proper business.
> 
> You don't start a business with the plan of only hiring the indigent. You hire the best you can afford. If that's all he could afford he isn't worth the permit he paid for to start his business.
> 
> OR HE IS JUST A FRAUD.


Go find something productive to do rather then looking for some business people to munch off you fucking cock sucker


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## xotoxi (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



The root of the problem is people like YOU...for if you and others were not hiring illegals, there would be no work for illegals to do, and they would not come.

Regarding the IRS and their rules and laws...that's the game.  If you choose to not play by it, then you are cheating.  

I hope you get caught and lose your business.


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > He clearly targeted the poor and illegal. What's his point? That he's a fucking idiot who doesn't know how to run a proper business.
> ...



You have done yourself no favors along demonstrating any business credibility.

Why dont you start there?


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > He clearly targeted the poor and illegal. What's his point? That he's a fucking idiot who doesn't know how to run a proper business.
> ...



You are so utterly clueless. I gave you the web address to MY COMPANY that I built over 20 years and never once hired an illegal. My phone number is on that site. Call me, get my address and come meet me face to face with your highschool gibberish and well see who the cock sucker is.


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## xotoxi (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



Just a little feedback on your website...it doesn't tell where you are located.  I mentions that you were voted #1 in the metro, but where is the metro?


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



A little bit better, but that;s off topic


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

xotoxi said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...





Lol oops 

I'm in Kansas City. 

I switched from Network Solutions to Go Daddy a couple months back to save money. As such I had to build it myself and their templates are a pain. I will have to look into that.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...



Please explain how me demonstrating building a business within the confines of the rules and laws of our land is off topic in this topic about a business breaking the rules.


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## xotoxi (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> xotoxi said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



It probably would be good to stick your address on there somewhere.

I think those template websites for business really suck.  It gives you a good foundation, but then you have to personalize.


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## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

Cool. The only thing that will stop illegal workers is a good SS ID and enforcement. Period. Pubs won't do it. And they distract the dupes with bad laws and stupid talk of a idiotic, un-American fence. Pffffft!


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> You are so utterly clueless. I gave you the web address to MY COMPANY that I built over 20 years and never once hired an illegal. My phone number is on that site. Call me, get my address and come meet me face to face with your highschool gibberish and well see who the cock sucker is.


Here's the real deal gramps: I'm a native American, and you are a fake immigrant with false documents in my land - now get the fuck out and back to Islamabad.


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## thereisnospoon (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Unkotare said:
> ...


Well we don't now and that's a good thing.
When this illegal problem came to light studies were done to predict the effect of illegal immigration and population.
These studies concluded that somewhere around 2050, there would no longer be a majority racial demographic in the US. Quite frankly I think that's bunk because the overall population of blacks has been stagnant for some time.
However, for the sake of clarity, let us stipulate the studies are still valid.
Now, in the course of human history any nation or territory absent of a racial or cultural majority had been for the most part at war with itself . Unless of course there existed in said states or territories a ruling party or individual with an iron fist. 
Examples.....Iraq. That nation has three distinct tribes. Shites, Sunnis and Kurds. Each had it's own unmarked area of the nation. In each case the Kurds were the targets of the equally powerful and influential Sunnis and Shiites. The Hussein regime as do all totalitarian leaders, need a scapegoat in order to deflect the failures of government away from itself. This system worked as long as the iron fisted ruler was in place. Once gone(Hussein) the nation fell into chaos with tribal infighting for control of the country.
The former Yugoslavia Republic....Here we had Muslims, Croats and Orthodox Serbs and Bosnian Serbs all living in the same country but very far apart but held together by a totalitarian government
When a coalition government was formed in the now broken up nation( Bosnia-Herzegovina in this case) it included all of these groups. Soon after the war broke out. The Bosnian  Serbs who had a slight majority population led by Slobodan Milosovic and enjoyed more wealth began with ethnic cleansing of their country. Once again tribal factions fought among themselves for control of a nation. Eventually the former Yugoslavia has become 5 fragmented countries with relatively homogenous populations.
The above mentioned Bosnia, with Serbia, Croatia, Slovenia and Montenegro.
The point is when a nation has no cultural or racial majority inevitably tribal cliques form and these factions eventually will find they cannot live together in peace. They fight for control of government, wealth and natural resources. Most of all they fight to become the dominant culture.
Human beings are inherently shit heads. We may tolerate others of different cultures but we all wish to control our surroundings.  
Some of us claim to be more enlightened and those people try to force their idea of societal harmony on the rest of us. 
Throughout the history of man kind, this has never worked. Eventually the system breaks down and fighting ensues. What ends up being the case is a nation of very pissed off people that cannot govern themselves.
I do not intend to approve of this. I simply state an understanding of it.
Flame away.


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## mskafka (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.



On behalf of the majority of the United States, we would like to thank you for starting a business, and giving LEGAL citizens hope of getting a job...with no intention of hiring someone who might expect a wage that will support electricity and running water in their homes. (Too luxurious)  

We would also like to thank you for the exponential increase in crime in our major cities, as many of these illegals bring their gang activity with them.  There were three shootings in my city last night alone.  At least two were in areas with a high population of illegals.

Personally...until you get legit...I would take great satisfaction in seeing an example made of you (prison), because YOU are one of the biggest problems of this country.  You make it more difficult for those who actually run legitimate businesses legally.

Again, thank you for contributing to some of American's more affluent citizens' expectation that we of the middle class should be willing to lower our of standards of living.

If you like their work ethic and corruption, perhaps you should move to Mexico, or El Salvador, or wherever else they can legally exploit their employees.  Oh....I forgot....somehow you're getting away with it here.


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## thereisnospoon (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > You are so utterly clueless. I gave you the web address to MY COMPANY that I built over 20 years and never once hired an illegal. My phone number is on that site. Call me, get my address and come meet me face to face with your highschool gibberish and well see who the cock sucker is.
> ...


Well how wonderful for you. 
If you've never hired an illegal then why bitch about it?
If you are being truthful ,then I say bravo to you.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > You are so utterly clueless. I gave you the web address to MY COMPANY that I built over 20 years and never once hired an illegal. My phone number is on that site. Call me, get my address and come meet me face to face with your highschool gibberish and well see who the cock sucker is.
> ...



The real deal is that we were both born here. Deal with it. 

Although it is funny that you would tell me (born here) to leave yet hire Mexican illegals. 


Your a fraud. Everything about you is fraudulent. 

Do tell in detail what kind of concrete work did you do? What did you specialize in? Did you get paid by the cubic foot or square foot or job? What kind of forms did you use? What kind of iron did you use? 


Or ignore and continue to fool a few........fraud.


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## mskafka (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > You are so utterly clueless. I gave you the web address to MY COMPANY that I built over 20 years and never once hired an illegal. My phone number is on that site. Call me, get my address and come meet me face to face with your highschool gibberish and well see who the cock sucker is.
> ...



I am part Chickasawan, and I still see a problem with this.  This doesn't give you a pass to break the law.


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## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > As usual, you only focus on the crimes of the past and ignore the progress that has been made.
> ...







  You talk of how the white man screwed the injuns then deflect when it is shown how the white man has repented.  What a typical lib you are.


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...


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## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > What do YOU call them if not "illegals"?
> ...







Really?  all the shitty work that was done out here on construction jobs was done either by union boys or illegals.  How'd you get so lucky?


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

mskafka said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...



There has been no mention of my nationality or origin so there are major problems with this idiot.


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> mskafka said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...





Catch and release brother.


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## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...







That's some nice work...looks like some of the bathrooms I visited in Little Italy when I was out there!


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Full-Auto said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > mskafka said:
> ...



You are right but this subject hits home.


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## Moonglow (Nov 27, 2011)

I run a masonry compny and refuse to hire illegals, period.  i hire American citizens, they do fine work and I pay them well, in cash.I would never undermine the importance of supporting my fellow countrymen and women.


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## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...







Socialists don't like it when you prove them wrong.  It makes their heads hurt.


----------



## dblack (Nov 27, 2011)

In light of the subtle, though-provoking dialog presented in this thread, I'd like to quote myself, from earlier:



dblack said:


> ... I've yet to see a rational argument on this topic. The immigrant bashers are so full of fear and hatred it's virtually impossible to discuss how we might reform immigration policy in a productive way. So jokes aren't a bad alternative.



Now, the following isn't a joke. But it is true, and kinda funny.

A few years back, my girlfriend and I visited San Antonio and took a tour of the Alamo. I didn't know much about the history of the region and it was really interesting to hear the story of the formation of the state - particularly the details leading up the the battle of the Alamo.

The tour guide told us the story: After Mexico won its independence from Spain, in 1821, they were eager to develop the wilderness region of Texas and passed a law encouraging settlement of the area. They welcomed anyone willing to work the land (and defend it from Indian attacks) to come and make land claims. They even advertised in US newspapers encouraging immigration to the area. 

But soon thereafter, a more conservative administration came to power in Mexico City and radically changed the immigration policy. In part because many of the US immigrants owned slaves and were ignoring Mexico's new law outlawing slavery, and in part because they feared Americans would threaten Mexican sovereignty in the region, they outlawed all future immigration of US citizens.

With a suspicious grin, the tour guide continued: He pointed out that when you have a land ripe with opportunity on one side of a border, and throngs of people eager to take advantage of that opportunity on the other, keeping them out isn't as easy as just passing a law. US immigrants continued to pour into the region, ignoring the Mexican immigration laws. Rather than welcome their new 'guests', the Mexican Army was ordered to do whatever it could to keep them out.

The rest is 'history', as they say. I guess we can chalk it up to "what comes around goes around, eh?"


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## xotoxi (Nov 27, 2011)

I wonder if the INS would have a difficult time finding a small, family-owned concrete business located in the Allegany National Forest...and if they found said business, I wonder what they would discover...


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

thereisnospoon said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > Grampa Murked U said:
> ...


I'm neither truthful nor serious about anything but the ignorance level on these message boards is both entertaining and scarry. you all jumped on me as if I was some sort of criminal, when all I did was hire people based on who would walk up asking for a job (never discriminating, or asking for any documents, but merely being an American) ... I assume this one guy was illegal because he hardly could speak english, but a very good worker. you on the other hand go around the world robbing countries installing your dictatorships, your presidents take credits for destroying nations, such as my former nation which was the USSR, and then you are outraged with me hiring someone other then your own kind. how much more pathetic you loons can get? both your presidents left and right illegaly bombarded countries in the middle east - you are all fraud beyond belief - I know my dogs can be fraud about accusing each other,  but they are just dogs. you on the other hand.... wow. no wonder you are trillions in debt. you all live off the tit of others, why don't you instead of invading middle east safeguard your borders? your hypocrisy is obsurd and pathetic. go vote for another demo republic rat and continnue your own demise - you are as helpless as a grass hopper in the fall...


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

xotoxi said:


> I wonder if the INS would have a difficult time finding a small, family-owned concrete business located in the Allegany National Forest...and if they found said business, I wonder what they would discover...



Be cautious. I was banned shortly after I joined for telling a (clear) terrorists I was going to report his posts to the FBI. 

I did report him (havent seen since) 
And I did get banned for interfering with a posters personal life. Didn't even know that was a rule.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> thereisnospoon said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...




Just as I suspected. 

THIS POSTER IS A FRAUD. EVERYONE SHOULD NEG HIM FOR TROLLING. 

HIS ENTIRE OP WAS A LIE.


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

xotoxi said:


> I wonder if the INS would have a difficult time finding a small, family-owned concrete business located in the Allegany National Forest...and if they found said business, I wonder what they would discover...



The INS wouldnt give a shit.


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## Wacky Quacky (Nov 27, 2011)

Zoom said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Zoom said:
> ...



Apples and oranges. They're talking construction, which cannot under any circumstances be outsourced. You're talking manufacturing, which has been leaving the country en mass thanks to Free-Trade deals and a horrifically broken tax code.


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Full-Auto said:


> xotoxi said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder if the INS would have a difficult time finding a small, family-owned concrete business located in the Allegany National Forest...and if they found said business, I wonder what they would discover...
> ...



I was a contractor for the feds when Clinton was potus. I was working at Whiteman Airforce Base just before one of his visits. Bus loads of illegals and criminals were carted off just hours before his visit. Including one of the job superintendents. 

It's amazing how little our govt cares unless the public is watching.


----------



## Wacky Quacky (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> paulitician said:
> 
> 
> > Illegal Immigration has cost this country so much..
> ...



So, what advise would you give them when an illegal comes in and steals their job by offering to do it for half what your children will? I doubt we have long before the University of Tijuana becomes accepted by US businesses.


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## Full-Auto (Nov 27, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Full-Auto said:
> 
> 
> > xotoxi said:
> ...



I phoned several times.................. *nothing* 

Do you recall Bernie Thompson threatening Cintas if they fired any illegals?


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## mskafka (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> thereisnospoon said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...



Yes.  There are a lot of SCARRY people in the United States.  Many of them bear scars from serving in our military, fire dept., EMS, Police....all of which you are probably too cowardly to do.

Oh...you meant SCARY?  No, most of the scary people are locked away in prisons or psych hospitals.

Judging from your spelling...you aren't too far off a tit.


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## mskafka (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> thereisnospoon said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...



So it was all bullshit.  Do you masquerade like this as well?  

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2wrU2tkl38]Supermodel - Rupaul - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5rXqAsZnGU]Tiny Tim - Tip Toe Through The Tulips 1968 Tiptoe - YouTube[/ame]


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## Charles_Main (Nov 27, 2011)

francoHFW said:


> Cool. The only thing that will stop illegal workers is a good SS ID and enforcement. Period. Pubs won't do it. And they distract the dupes with bad laws and stupid talk of a idiotic,* un-American fence*. Pffffft!



There is nothing at all un-american about a border fence. You infant. In fact our Constitution clearly tasks the government with Defending our Borders. Every other Nation on earth controls it's Borders, With fences where practical.

You are such fool. You can have Border Security and still have Immigration. Our past is one of Immigrants lining up and coming here through the Proper Channels. Only a fool thinks we are obligated to ignore thousands of people crossing our Border every year.


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

westwall said:


> Contumacious said:
> 
> 
> > westwall said:
> ...



"Let me explain to you the most fundamental principle of American foreign policy: Any country where the people have unpronounceable names can be bombed by the US with impunity. For you Rockwell readers who are a little slow on the uptake, "impunity" means they arent allowed to bomb us back. "We called no tag-backs." It hardly qualifies as impunity when they blow up our biggest buildings, now does it? They arent playing by the rules."

.


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## westwall (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> > Contumacious said:
> ...







So, are you capable of thinking for yourself or are you merely a parrot?


----------



## Contumacious (Nov 27, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> francoHFW said:
> 
> 
> > Cool. The only thing that will stop illegal workers is a good SS ID and enforcement. Period. Pubs won't do it. And they distract the dupes with bad laws and stupid talk of a idiotic,* un-American fence*. Pffffft!
> ...



Retarded Son of a Bitch, Sir:

As a civic service, would you be kind enough to identify by article, section and clause the constitutional proviso which authorizes the federal scumbags to defend our borders by interdicting and deporting our alien friends?

Thanks.

.


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## Ernie S. (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.


Are you still here?


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 27, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> Charles_Main said:
> 
> 
> > francoHFW said:
> ...




There is also no article or section or law that says we can't point out what a complete fucking moron you are. What say you?


By the way, there is a law here form the 1700 or 1800's that says its illegal to own or display a pig in your front yard. So what is your excuse everytime you walk out your front door? 

Better yet the bible says there were chariots of fire in the sky. Are you so fucking stupid as to not realize that it wasn't just a mere comet or asteroid? 

You take everything so literal that you just ask to be mocked.


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## pvsi. (Nov 27, 2011)

Ernie S. said:


> Are you still here?


Yea, why, checking in to see what else they going to complain about...


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## francoHFW (Nov 27, 2011)

Charles_Main said:


> francoHFW said:
> 
> 
> > Cool. The only thing that will stop illegal workers is a good SS ID and enforcement. Period. Pubs won't do it. And they distract the dupes with bad laws and stupid talk of a idiotic,* un-American fence*. Pffffft!
> ...



It wouldn't work, dimwit.

Thank god at least ONE Pub has spoken some truth on illegals. They are HERE and have been working (94% of men in 2007), paying taxes (67%) and owning homes 35%, Pew). They are NEVER going to be thrown out and are an important part of our society, and MANY of their jobs are ones Americans won't do fcs.

Myself, I believe mega rich Pubs love the cheap labor and their harassment of Hispanic, unconstitutional laws are just BS for the dupes, and their talk of an un-American, useless,stupid, incredibly expensive fence is also for the dittoheads- works GREAT and has for YEARS, GD MORONS tyvm.

Dems aren't for open borders, shytteheads, *they're for a good (computer chip) SS work card that will stop NEW illegals from getting work, and actually having strong laws and enforcement.*
 It's called the Schumer/Graham bill and is the only real answer. Newt is halfway there only. I am optimistic that in conjunction with Obamacare and Schumer we'll finally have a modern country. Try thinking, racist corporate tools LOL.


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...





Do you even bother to read what you wrote before posting?


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

francoHFW said:


> and MANY of their jobs are ones Americans won't do fcs.
> .





That's a fucking lie that liberals never seem to tire of repeating no matter how ridiculous.


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

francoHFW said:


> I am optimistic that in conjunction with Obamacare and Schumer we'll finally have a modern country. .





A "modern" country like Greece or Italy, moron?


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > What do YOU call them if not "illegals"?
> ...




ILLEGAL ALIENS are what they are. Your asinine doublespeak can't change that.


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> [ I'm a native American, and you are a fake immigrant with false documents in my land - .





That is clearly not true.


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## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2011)

Full-Auto said:


> xotoxi said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder if the INS would have a difficult time finding a small, family-owned concrete business located in the Allegany National Forest...and if they found said business, I wonder what they would discover...
> ...




There is no INS


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 27, 2011)

dblack said:


> Now, the following isn't a joke. But it is true, and kinda funny.
> 
> A few years back, my girlfriend and I visited San Antonio and took a tour of the Alamo. I didn't know much about the history of the region and it was really interesting to hear the story of the formation of the state - particularly the details leading up the the battle of the Alamo.
> 
> ...



So what we have here is that Mexico had flawed immigration policy, actively and passively encouraging unfettered immigration into its land.  The result was degradation to their sovereignty and offenses against their customs and culture and other laws, and eventually civil war.  And you think that we should repeat those mistakes?


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## francoHFW (Nov 28, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> francoHFW said:
> 
> 
> > and MANY of their jobs are ones Americans won't do fcs.
> ...



Check Alabama...

  Pub dupes go crazy against illegals in Pub recessions/depressions- otherwise love the cheap labor...stupid a-holes...


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## dblack (Nov 28, 2011)

Inthemiddle said:


> So what we have here is that Mexico had flawed immigration policy, actively and passively encouraging unfettered immigration into its land.  The result was degradation to their sovereignty and offenses against their customs and culture and other laws, and eventually civil war.  And you think that we should repeat those mistakes?


I think that's exactly where we're heading.


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## francoHFW (Nov 28, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> francoHFW said:
> 
> 
> > I am optimistic that in conjunction with Obamacare and Schumer we'll finally have a modern country. .
> ...




But before Booosh and his pals destroyed their economies- and a little less corrupt, and  w/o the greedy Pub like a-holes. ty
 and good night, chumps...


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## Lakhota (Nov 28, 2011)

Much More: The Hispanic Experience - Stolen Birthright


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## Unkotare (Nov 28, 2011)

francoHFW said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > francoHFW said:
> ...




You're too stupid to even understand to what you are trying to refer.


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## Unkotare (Nov 28, 2011)

francoHFW said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > francoHFW said:
> ...




Ah yes, President Bush forced European nations into decades long indulgence in unsupportable welfare largess and poor governance as well as large scale tax-evasion among their citizenry.  Even obama wouldn't be shameless enough to try and sell that bullshit.


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## Douger (Nov 28, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.


Fly down to Rio.You can finish concrete daily for the next 4-5 years and retire.


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## editec (Nov 28, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.


 

Why did you hire illegals?

Were there no Americans seeking work?


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 28, 2011)

Lakhota said:


> Much More: The Hispanic Experience - Stolen Birthright



This is the make believe that Mexico tries to peddle when it tries to justify encouraging its people to illegally immigrate into the US.


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## Lovebears65 (Nov 28, 2011)

editec said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.
> ...


 He hired them because he wanted more money in his own pocket and can care less  about fellow americans who are out of work


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## Contumacious (Nov 28, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> *You and those like you need to spend some time in jail for undermining and violating our laws and causing great disfunction to our society. *
> 
> I'm really glad I negd you earlier. Only wish I could smack you around a bit.



You still haven't shown the federal "law' and with good reason : there is no federal law ...or so said Founding Father and 3rd President Thomas Jefferson:

* 4. _Resolved_,* That alien friends are under the jurisdiction and protection of the laws of the State wherein they are: that no power over them has been delegated to the United States, nor prohibited to the individual States, distinct from their power over citizens. And it being true as a general principle, and one of the amendments to the Constitution having also declared, that "the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people," *the act of the Congress of the United States, passed on the -- day of July, 1798, intituled "An Act concerning aliens," which assumes powers over alien friends, not delegated by the Constitution, is not law, but is altogether void, and of no force. *

.[/QUOTE]


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 28, 2011)

Too bad Jefferson was wrong on that one.


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## LilOlLady (Nov 28, 2011)

pvsi.net said:


> I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.




I for one do not believe a word you say.


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## LilOlLady (Nov 28, 2011)

Lovebears65 said:


> editec said:
> 
> 
> > pvsi.net said:
> ...



 When are we going to stop blaming Obama for what Bush set in motion. And will be in motion long after Obama is gone.


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## Angelhair (Nov 28, 2011)

Contumacious said:


> pvsi.net said:
> 
> 
> > I have a small concrete business and I've hired what you call "illegals" in the past. many times. part time work. at first I proudly tried the legal way - fill out the right tax forms for ss, etc... then the IRS started bombarding me and and that was the absolute end of that: if you think I am exaggerating something here, then you were never in my shoes - it's downright scarry their regulations. I hope you are proud of your stinking government which drives small businesses like mine and my dads out of the cities (in our case we relocated to Allegheney national forest in the same state, others who can afford leave the country all together) and I hope you enjoy your economy that you deserve for looking at ways to rip someone off rather then unite and do something about your government. I did a very patriotic thing drawing up a plan pvsi and all your ignorance proves yet again that you deserve nothing better then what you have - you are all lead by special interests who capitalize on corruption rather then attempt to get to the root of the problem.
> ...



_But of course - keep exploiting the most in need. Why not? La Raza will thank you; Chirla will thank you; LULAC will thank you; the ACLU will thank you; ALL the Spanish media will thank you!  In fact, ALL of the pro-illegal organizations will also!  Yippee!!!_


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## Lovebears65 (Nov 28, 2011)

LilOlLady said:


> Lovebears65 said:
> 
> 
> > editec said:
> ...



When is left going to see Obama is causing more problems then Bush did!!!!  You blame Bush for everything. Every president gets something from the previous one.  When is he(Obama) going to  take responsibility for his own stuff. You guys think he is like GOD. NEWS flash he wakes up and puts his pants on the same way~


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## Remodeling Maidiac (Nov 28, 2011)

Lovebears65 said:


> LilOlLady said:
> 
> 
> > Lovebears65 said:
> ...



I failed to see where you brought up Obama. You never mentioned any president yet he/she claims you blamed Obama? Lol

Logic fail


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 28, 2011)

Lovebears65 said:


> LilOlLady said:
> 
> 
> > Lovebears65 said:
> ...



How in the Hell did this turn into a "Let's bash Obama and Bush" thread?  What does that have to do with this thread?


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## dblack (Nov 28, 2011)

dblack said:


> Inthemiddle said:
> 
> 
> > So what we have here is that Mexico had flawed immigration policy, actively and passively encouraging unfettered immigration into its land.  The result was degradation to their sovereignty and offenses against their customs and culture and other laws, and eventually civil war.  And you think that we should repeat those mistakes?
> ...



To follow up on this, imagine where Mexico might be now if, instead of fighting the current, they'd welcomed the US immigrants. The Texicans were never that excited about joining with the US and only did so reluctantly. If Mexico has handled it differently, if they'd encouraged the settlers and used their influx to build a stronger nation, they'd probably still hold Texas, and probably be in much better shape now.


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## LilOlLady (Nov 28, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Lovebears65 said:
> 
> 
> > LilOlLady said:
> ...





> When is left going to see Obama is causing more problems then Bush did!!!! You blame Bush for everything. Every president gets something from the previous one. *When is he(Obama) going to take responsibility for his own stuff*. You guys think he is like GOD. NEWS flash he wakes up and puts his pants on the same way


~

I think Obama has taken responsibility.


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## Inthemiddle (Nov 28, 2011)

dblack said:


> To follow up on this, imagine where Mexico might be now if, instead of fighting the current, they'd welcomed the US immigrants. The Texicans were never that excited about joining with the US and only did so reluctantly. If Mexico has handled it differently, if they'd encouraged the settlers and used their influx to build a stronger nation, they'd probably still hold Texas, and probably be in much better shape now.



Your argument, then, is that the only way they could have maintained their sovereign claim to the area would have been to abandon it.  

The problem was that they shouldn't have opened the flood gates to unfettered immigration in the first place.  BTW, your history is entirely warped.  The Republic of Texas declared independence before there was any talk of joining the Union.  They didn't do it just to become part of the US.  They did it because they didn't want to be part of Mexico.  That's why they fought a war with Mexico over their independence.


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## dblack (Nov 28, 2011)

Inthemiddle said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > To follow up on this, imagine where Mexico might be now if, instead of fighting the current, they'd welcomed the US immigrants. The Texicans were never that excited about joining with the US and only did so reluctantly. If Mexico has handled it differently, if they'd encouraged the settlers and used their influx to build a stronger nation, they'd probably still hold Texas, and probably be in much better shape now.
> ...



Not at all. My argument is that one of the best things we did to build such a strong nation was welcoming the 'teeming masses'. It's always been our great strength that we've been looked to as a ready refuge for people looking for a better life. If Mexico had done that wrt the US immigrants, they might have fared better. I think it's a mistake that we are, largely, giving up on that. In all honestly, we might as well take down the Statute of Liberty. Maybe put up a giant traffic cop or something instead.



> The problem was that they shouldn't have opened the flood gates to unfettered immigration in the first place.



Then I guess you could make the same argument about the US, that we should have never opened the flood gates, but history doesn't agree wouldn't agree with you. 



> The Republic of Texas declared independence before there was any talk of joining the Union.  They didn't do it just to become part of the US.  They did it because they didn't want to be part of Mexico.  That's why they fought a war with Mexico over their independence.



Yep. That's right. Except that Mexico rejected them first. That's what I was referring to in my last post. If Mexico had treated them right, they'd might have stayed with them instead.


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## Unkotare (Nov 28, 2011)

dblack said:


> I think it's a mistake that we are, largely, giving up on that. In all honestly, we might as well take down the Statute of Liberty. Maybe put up a giant traffic cop or something instead..





We have in no way, large or small, given up on immigration, you fucking moron.


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## Unkotare (Nov 28, 2011)

dblack said:


> Then I guess you could make the same argument about the US, that we should have never opened the flood gates, but history doesn't agree wouldn't agree with you. .





History would smack you in the back of the head and tell you that you are ignorant as hell about the history of immigration to this country, moron.


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## dblack (Nov 28, 2011)

Unkotare said:


> dblack said:
> 
> 
> > Then I guess you could make the same argument about the US, that we should have never opened the flood gates, but history doesn't agree wouldn't agree with you. .
> ...



so, what you're saying is, I'm a moron. Got it!


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## Unkotare (Nov 28, 2011)

dblack said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> > dblack said:
> ...




And ignorant. Don't forget ignorant.


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## thereisnospoon (Nov 28, 2011)

LilOlLady said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Lovebears65 said:
> ...


Taken responsibility for what?
Do you pay a lick of attention to what he says in his campaign speeches?
His entire campaign is based on blaming others.
He even said the American people just don't understand what I am doing( to them).
Are you so in awe of Obama that you simply do not hear anything he says? Do you believe Obama to be some kind of benevolent savior?


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## Lovebears65 (Nov 29, 2011)

Grampa Murked U said:


> Lovebears65 said:
> 
> 
> > LilOlLady said:
> ...



 I did not blame him LOL these left wing nuts like to make shit up in thin air


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## Lovebears65 (Nov 29, 2011)

LilOlLady said:


> Grampa Murked U said:
> 
> 
> > Lovebears65 said:
> ...


 Now that is the funniest thing I have heard all day.. Lets see what Obama blames for his responsibility, 

He blames  Bush, ATMs, Earthquakes, Europe, congress, The only thing I dont see is HIS NAME. He is the leader he should be the first to be blamed.  I live outside Jacksonville FLA. Today they fired the head coach. WHY because he did not deliver  a winning team..  He was the leader he did not deliver he got canned. Obama promised the moon. He has not delivered and it got worse. He should be canned.


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