# Are Preferred Stocks even worth it?



## Wake

I like the concept of these kinds of stocks. You buy them, and sit on them while they generate dividends every quarterly or monthly period. 

However, one thing that's been popping up lately is that these stocks shouldn't be used because of rising interest rates. 

Should investors consider preferreds? Is an APY around 6.5%-8% good?

-Edited out Mentions List in spoiler tag-


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## syrenn

LOL.... that is some list you got there


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## Wake

AHA, so it does work! Neat! 

Since it works, I'll edit it out. Apologies if this experiment annoyed anyone.


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## Book of Jeremiah

I wouldn't invest in stocks, annuities of any kind, Wake.  I'd pay the penalties for anything holding my money and cash out right now.


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## Mertex

Wake said:


> AHA, so it does work! Neat!
> 
> Since it works, I'll edit it out. Apologies if this experiment annoyed anyone.




Not annoyed, just puzzled....came to see and didn't see where I was "mentioned' and got confused....then I read where you edited them out.  It is a neat little feature....


Now about the stocks....my husband and I invested in Mutual Funds a long time ago and were sitting on a really nice nest egg, until the economy crashed under Bush.....they dropped terribly.....but several years later, we recovered quite a bit of it, so instead of keeping in the stocks we decided to do  major renovation to the house....added a game room, so I guess it turned out okay....we didn't lose as much as we thought of at first...we still have some, but not buying any more.


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## Wake

I feel like that neanderthal who discovered fire.


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## Spoonman

I utilize them quite often. in fact high yield dividend stocks had been a very large part of my portfolio last year.   most of the really high yields were tied into interest rates and they become risky as they rise.  I've pulled out of stocks like NLY, CLS, IVR.  Actually I think it was late last spring i pulled out of them.  But those companies make insanely high profits when interest rates are low. so they can afford to pay the big dividends  10% +     I guess it all depends on whether or not you are willing to ride out the drop in stock vallue but still retain the high dividend yield.   i pulled out and went into stocks like american airlines and philip morris, michael kors.    but i'll probably buy back into some of the high yields at lower rates again in the future


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## Dot Com

are these available to anyone who wishes to buy stock? How does one get the "preferred" status? YES, I know, google is my friend BUT I want to get the inside dope from our experts. I'm a novice in this field except to say that I watch how banks have increased their stranglehold over this great nation's gov't


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## william the wie

Preferreds ain't my cup of tea but if you limit yourself to convertible preferreds with an optionable underlying common that pays a dividend you can use puts to limit interest rate risk. Check with Zander, Sallow and/or Toro but what I would do is

make sure I could afford 4-6 issues for diversification.

Buy puts 3-6 months out that are slightly in the money so that I pay low or no pure premium.

Double-check that my put costs will not eat up my dividend income without either turning a profit on options or capital gains on my preferred. 

It is much easier to lose money than to make it. And it is much harder financially to regain money than to take a small loss and say "oops" but vice versa for bragging rights so never make an investment out of a speculation or a speculation out of an investment.


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## Zander

The vast majority of individual investors should stay away from them.  Preferred are complicated and each issue is unique. Caveat Emptor....


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## Mr. H.

I got nothin', sorry.


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## william the wie

Spoonman said:


> I utilize them quite often. in fact high yield dividend stocks had been a very large part of my portfolio last year.   most of the really high yields were tied into interest rates and they become risky as they rise.  I've pulled out of stocks like NLY, CLS, IVR.  Actually I think it was late last spring i pulled out of them.  But those companies make insanely high profits when interest rates are low. so they can afford to pay the big dividends  10% +     I guess it all depends on whether or not you are willing to ride out the drop in stock vallue but still retain the high dividend yield.   i pulled out and went into stocks like american airlines and philip morris, michael kors.    but i'll probably buy back into some of the high yields at lower rates again in the future


Yeah, dividends matter a lot.


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## Sunshine

The best way to choose stocks is to go into the marketplace and see what is selling.  The population is getting very top heavy with older folks.  Items that they use should be good investments.


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## Wake

Spoonman said:


> I utilize them quite often. in fact high yield dividend stocks had been a very large part of my portfolio last year.   most of the really high yields were tied into interest rates and they become risky as they rise.  I've pulled out of stocks like NLY, CLS, IVR.  Actually I think it was late last spring i pulled out of them.  But those companies make insanely high profits when interest rates are low. so they can afford to pay the big dividends  10% +     I guess it all depends on whether or not you are willing to ride out the drop in stock vallue but still retain the high dividend yield.   i pulled out and went into stocks like american airlines and philip morris, michael kors.    but i'll probably buy back into some of the high yields at lower rates again in the future



OK, I understand a bit better. Thank you very much. Right now my only stock is Green Hunter Resources Series C (GHRprC). It's taken a bit of a hit in value, but it's been coming back. On 12/2/13 bought 35 shares @ $679, and they charge $7 when either buying or selling shares @ Scottrade. Right now it is sitting @ $651.0035. It pays monthly, so each share I'm harvesting $0.2083 a month, or $7.29 at the end of each month. Not bad, but I don't know if it's worth the anxiety when it keeps dipping down in value and then back up. Gets the stomach knotted at times. Been considering some dividend aristocrats like AT&T (T), but it's so expensive just to buy one stock, like around $40-50 or more.



Dot Com said:


> are these available to anyone who wishes to buy stock? How does one get the "preferred" status? YES, I know, google is my friend BUT I want to get the inside dope from our experts. I'm a novice in this field except to say that I watch how banks have increased their stranglehold over this great nation's gov't



Oh yeah. I use an online brokerage firm called Scottrade. Absolutely anyone can buy any kind of stock, to my knowledge (which ain't much ). Basically when it comes to stocks there are two main kinds: Common and Preferred stocks. Common stocks are your typical stocks. You buy fractions of a company, and with its successes and losses your shares increase or decrease in value. If your fortunate, and you buy a lot of common stock, and then that company does really well and its value shoots up, you can then sell that stock and make a good profit, which is called capital appreciation. For example, if you buy shares(also called stocks) at $8, and in that day it shoots up to $15, if you sell all of that stock you make a profit (before taxes) of $7 per each stock. So just imagine if you had bought 1,000 shares, and each share appreciated by $7. That's, like, $7,000 in profit from that one trade. When you buy and sell a stock, that's known as a trade. 

With preferred stocks, you buy a stock and it pays you a lot more in dividends. HOWEVER, preferred stocks don't budge much when there are shifts in the market, so if a company has a windfall, its common stock will shoot up with it, but its preferred stock won't go up much, if at all. Then again, preferreds not going up or down much when there are major shifts in the market is a good thing, because they're staying near their value, and still paying dividends. 

Also, common stock owners get more influence when it comes to the upper management of that stock's corporation, whereas preferred stocks don't. But, if a company goes bankrupt, common stock owners get paid dead last, whereas preferred stock owners get paid before common stock owners, and after bondholders.

If you want to go where I went to learn about everything stock markets and investing, check out Investopedia.com. To get you started here are the links I used to learn about common and preferred stocks.


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## Spoonman

Dot Com said:


> are these available to anyone who wishes to buy stock? How does one get the "preferred" status? YES, I know, google is my friend BUT I want to get the inside dope from our experts. I'm a novice in this field except to say that I watch how banks have increased their stranglehold over this great nation's gov't



yes, they are avaiable to anyone.  let your protfolio manager know you have an interest and they will work with you


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## Wake

While I was a homeless homecare-CNA, I met and cared for a very old and wealthy client who was a stock broker. The misery I had endured, plus a nearly unlimited supply of knowledge from his experiences, is what sparked my interest in investing.


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## Sallow

These are for investors who are in it for the long term. And getting a dividend is nice.


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## Wolfsister77

Yep, it worked. OK


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## Misty

Heehee. It depends. Some are some aren't. 

Just as you learn this message board you learn how to trade.


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## Foxfyre

We don't deal in preferred stocks, but have almost all of our modest investments in 401Ks in conservative mutual funds that weather the wild fluctuations in the market pretty well.  We were heavily invested in a much more aggressive portfolio when the housing bubble burst in 2008 and 2009 and we took a blood bath.  But we reinvested what we had left in new more conservative funds--and they have earned back most of what we lost.  Now we take the required distribution each year to supplement our other income and they have been earning enough to cover those distributions while leaving the principle intact and even increasing a bit each year.


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## Toro

It depends on the preferred stock.

They can be illiquid, or difficult to sell.  

I'd also agree that they could come under pressure when interest rates rise.  

You shouldn't buy it just for the yield.  Too many people have been buying for the yield, and that has made many investments overpriced and vulnerable to a pullback.


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## william the wie

Toro said:


> It depends on the preferred stock.
> 
> They can be illiquid, or difficult to sell.
> 
> I'd also agree that they could come under pressure when interest rates rise.
> 
> You shouldn't buy it just for the yield.  Too many people have been buying for the yield, and that has made many investments overpriced and vulnerable to a pullback.


Rep coming your way. I couldn't figure out any better euphemism than promiscuous rent seeking, which obviously is not a huge improvement over the usual term of endearment for this behavior. Sorry, I got the spread rep message when I hit Toro's button. Will someone cover for me, please?


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## Zander

Toro said:


> It depends on the preferred stock.
> 
> They can be illiquid, or difficult to sell.
> 
> I'd also agree that they could come under pressure when interest rates rise.
> 
> You shouldn't buy it just for the yield.  Too many people have been buying for the yield, and that has made many investments overpriced and vulnerable to a pullback.



Totally agree with your comments about chasing yield.


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## Moonglow

I put my money in land. My initial investment  vs my current value is +4x yield.


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## Geaux4it

I heard the bell so came to see whats up.

I'm a market timer and have done well, with the exception of last year when the buy and holders out performed us timers. Still made ~12% last year. I have a Barclays account but am working the NASDAQ and S&P 500 from the cheap seats

Start early, dollar cost average on the downturns, jump in an earn 2% then get out and always keep an eye on that little dirty chart otherwise known as the VIX  lol

-Geaux


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## asterism

Preferred stocks have historically been the "buy and hold and leave the equities to your heirs" type of investments.  In the past, they were typically more stable investments due to their place in the liquidity pecking order and their traditionally higher yields than the common stocks.  

Today I don't think that's the case due to overvaluing based on the "security" of them.  In public companies for small (anyone smaller than an Institutional Investor) investors they are glorified junk bonds.  At best a preferred stock will provide a relatively high dividend without the capital appreciation common stock for the same company would have and at worst you are higher on the food chain for a liquidation so you have a larger share of a worthless company (you get a higher percentage of zero).

That's my 2¢


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## AVG-JOE

Jeremiah said:


> I wouldn't invest in stocks, annuities of any kind, Wake.  I'd pay the penalties for anything holding my money and cash out right now.



I'm long in every market and betting it all on Momma's little bastards.


Have you kids reached the stars yet?




`​


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## editec

Wake said:


> I like the concept of these kinds of stocks. You buy them, and sit on them while they generate dividends every quarterly or monthly period.
> 
> However, one thing that's been popping up lately is that these stocks shouldn't be used because of rising interest rates.
> 
> Should investors consider preferreds? Is an APY around 6.5%-8% good?
> 
> -Edited out Mentions List in spoiler tag-




It DEPENDS entirely on how the corporation structured the STOCK'S PREFERENCES.

I'd say an APY of 6.5-8% is a good return in this market..._especially if you are also getting a reduction in risk associated with most Preferred stocks._


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## RKMBrown

editec said:


> Wake said:
> 
> 
> 
> I like the concept of these kinds of stocks. You buy them, and sit on them while they generate dividends every quarterly or monthly period.
> 
> However, one thing that's been popping up lately is that these stocks shouldn't be used because of rising interest rates.
> 
> Should investors consider preferreds? Is an APY around 6.5%-8% good?
> 
> -Edited out Mentions List in spoiler tag-
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It DEPENDS entirely on how the corporation structured the STOCK'S PREFERENCES.
> 
> I'd say an APY of 6.5-8% is a good return in this market..._especially if you are also getting a reduction in risk associated with most Preferred stocks._
Click to expand...


Depends is the best answer.  Every stock is different, and every stock is a risk.  But then, not investing is also a risk.  

That said, the gambling house welcomes you to the table, belly up!


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## Synthaholic

Sunshine said:


> *The best way to choose stocks is to go into the marketplace and see what is selling*.  The population is getting very top heavy with older folks.  Items that they use should be good investments.


uhh...wh-_whut_?


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## Rocko

There are some banks that offer nice preferred stocks.


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## sjay

Rocko said:


> There are some banks that offer nice preferred stocks.



What a profound statement,it tells me everything about nothing.I wish there were more guys like you in the markets.I could make a fortune  doing everything the complete opposite of what your'e doing.


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## Sallow

Synthaholic said:


> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> *The best way to choose stocks is to go into the marketplace and see what is selling*.  The population is getting very top heavy with older folks.  Items that they use should be good investments.
> 
> 
> 
> uhh...wh-_whut_?
Click to expand...




I just skipped over that.


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## Rocko

One option I like if you're in to chasing yields are MLPs (master limited Partnerships). They're different from preferred stock in that they distribute capital profits, where as preferred stock generates interest, so they're taxed differently. I like MLPs for the income and capital appreciation. If you believe in fracking, there the way to go.


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## Rocko

sjay said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are some banks that offer nice preferred stocks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What a profound statement,it tells me everything about nothing.I wish there were more guys like you in the markets.I could make a fortune  doing everything the complete opposite of what your'e doing.
Click to expand...


It is a factual statement. Anyone who knows about the market will tell you the big banks offer the best preferred stocks in the marketplace. As far as you fortune off betting against my market intuition, I'm not going to lie, lately you would have


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## william the wie

Rocko said:


> sjay said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are some banks that offer nice preferred stocks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What a profound statement,it tells me everything about nothing.I wish there were more guys like you in the markets.I could make a fortune  doing everything the complete opposite of what your'e doing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It is a factual statement. Anyone who knows about the market will tell you the big banks offer the best preferred stocks in the marketplace. As far as you fortune off betting against my market intuition, I'm not going to lie, lately you would have
Click to expand...

Thus illustrating my extremely strong preference for hedges that permit a profit run but keep my losses small when everything goes south.


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## Rocko

Sallow said:


> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sunshine said:
> 
> 
> 
> *The best way to choose stocks is to go into the marketplace and see what is selling*.  The population is getting very top heavy with older folks.  Items that they use should be good investments.
> 
> 
> 
> uhh...wh-_whut_?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just skipped over that.
Click to expand...


What's so funny about taking advantage of weak sellers in the market?


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## Mac1958

Rocko said:


> One option I like if you're in to chasing yields are MLPs (master limited Partnerships). They're different from preferred stock in that they distribute capital profits, where as preferred stock generates interest, so they're taxed differently. I like MLPs for the income and capital appreciation. If you believe in fracking, there the way to go.




You can buy into MLP's via ETF's and get traditional 1099 tax treatment.  AMLP, for example.  Good yield right now, over 6%.

But yeah, dividend stocks became overvalued when traditional bond yields went into the shitter.

Lord Abbott just put two fascinating studies that show which bond classes react best historically during times of increasing interest rates:  Short term corporates, high yield (!), floating rate and convertibles.  And, obviously, shorting treasuries with TBT.

.


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## Rocko

Mac1958 said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> 
> One option I like if you're in to chasing yields are MLPs (master limited Partnerships). They're different from preferred stock in that they distribute capital profits, where as preferred stock generates interest, so they're taxed differently. I like MLPs for the income and capital appreciation. If you believe in fracking, there the way to go.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can buy into MLP's via ETF's and get traditional 1099 tax treatment.  AMLP, for example.  Good yield right now, over 6%.
> 
> But yeah, dividend stocks became overvalued when traditional bond yields went into the shitter.
> 
> Lord Abbott just put two fascinating studies that show which bond classes react best historically during times of increasing interest rates:  Short term corporates, high yield (!), floating rate and convertibles.  And, obviously, shorting treasuries with TBT.
> 
> .
Click to expand...


Didn't know that. Ill look in to AMLP. Does it move?


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## william the wie

Rocko said:


> Sallow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Synthaholic said:
> 
> 
> 
> uhh...wh-_whut_?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just skipped over that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What's so funny about taking advantage of weak sellers in the market?
Click to expand...

mixing and matching momentum and fundamental investing will kill your portfolio and there are several variants of both that should not be intermixed. Take a Dow Dogs Strategy other than using Fibonacci numbers (2, 3, 5 & 8) and two fundamentalist screens there is nothing in common about the at least 171 lists of stocks to go long on. And if you are like me and you like to go short the Dow stars you need to use the same system with them to get dependable results.


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## Rocko

Rocko said:


> Mac1958 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> 
> One option I like if you're in to chasing yields are MLPs (master limited Partnerships). They're different from preferred stock in that they distribute capital profits, where as preferred stock generates interest, so they're taxed differently. I like MLPs for the income and capital appreciation. If you believe in fracking, there the way to go.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can buy into MLP's via ETF's and get traditional 1099 tax treatment.  AMLP, for example.  Good yield right now, over 6%.
> 
> But yeah, dividend stocks became overvalued when traditional bond yields went into the shitter.
> 
> Lord Abbott just put two fascinating studies that show which bond classes react best historically during times of increasing interest rates:  Short term corporates, high yield (!), floating rate and convertibles.  And, obviously, shorting treasuries with TBT.
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Didn't know that. Ill look in to AMLP. Does it move?
Click to expand...


Had a quick look. Pretty good yield, doesn't move, certainly liquid enough. Thanks for the tip. I tend to stay away from ETFs though.


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## emilynghiem

Wake said:


> I like the concept of these kinds of stocks. You buy them, and sit on them while they generate dividends every quarterly or monthly period.
> 
> However, one thing that's been popping up lately is that these stocks shouldn't be used because of rising interest rates.
> 
> Should investors consider preferreds? Is an APY around 6.5%-8% good?
> 
> -Edited out Mentions List in spoiler tag-



Hi Wake:
I am more interested in how to use these systems 
to reward citizens for investing in local business and community development,
and in creating government reforms themselves. this could be done through tax reforms,
or through issuing credits to taxpayers for public funds abused for fraud or waste,
and investing in building local economy, such as revamping hospitals, schools, etc. into sustainable campuses for democratically managed local governance.

Instead of the US govt owing debts to foreign countries, why not reward American citizens and businesses for buying out the debts, lending money to pay back for past damages from fraud abuse or other criminal violations, and maybe earning interest to give incentive. Or holding property as collateral until the debts are collected back over time from the wrongdoers responsible for the costs plus interest. So where corporate abusers of govt and public money destroyed environmental or historic sites (ex: Headwaters Forest in CA or Freedmen's Town in TX) then citizens can claim ownership of shares in these national landmarks by lending against the debts and damages until restitution is fully recovered.

For rate of interest on returns, using financing to invest in real estate as rental income, the mentors through successful networks that focus on single family and multi family property (ex: Lifestyles Unlimited - The education and mentor group for real estate investors) shoot for MUCH higher returns that you can get from stocks, while amassing equity from investments (in addition to the passive income from monthly rentals exceeding the monthly payments) in order to leverage financing for more property.

An extreme example was when the founder bought his current house as an investment, paying cash for it undervalue, then refinancing at 500,000 more so he pocketed this difference (as a DEBT, between two loans) tax-free since it isn't counted as income.  
If the house was bought for 3 or 3.5M and he refinanced it for 3.5 or 4M, to gain 500K tax free in 6 months (and he owns the property until he chooses to sell it, with the benefit of equity used to leverage further financing for more investments), what is the return on that?

That investment is his pride and joy. Most of the other purchases are not like that, but the experienced investors will follow the same formula, calculate the difference in rental value over the total monthly payments of all costs and expenses combined, and only buy properties that meet a high enough return level, higher than you would get from stocks, or 401K or these other methods, or else they don't buy that property. You can't predict stock values, like you can compare rental rates in a zip code, and calculate the range of price and value that a property has to meet in order to get the return you want. 

If I was going to invest, I would go for property. I believe all people should have equal access to education and training in the area of business, financial and property management, or else the disparity in socioeconomics causes worse problems.


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## SteveParker123

The best thing about preferred stocks is that it possesses the features of both shares and bonds. The benefit of this feature is that it makes the valuation of shares rather different from a common share. You can be the owner of the preferred stock similar to other common stocks. Additionally, preferred stock has kind of fix payment, which makes it very much similar to bond.


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## Toro

Mac1958 said:


> Rocko said:
> 
> 
> 
> One option I like if you're in to chasing yields are MLPs (master limited Partnerships). They're different from preferred stock in that they distribute capital profits, where as preferred stock generates interest, so they're taxed differently. I like MLPs for the income and capital appreciation. If you believe in fracking, there the way to go.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can buy into MLP's via ETF's and get traditional 1099 tax treatment.  AMLP, for example.  Good yield right now, over 6%.
> 
> But yeah, dividend stocks became overvalued when traditional bond yields went into the shitter.
> 
> Lord Abbott just put two fascinating studies that show which bond classes react best historically during times of increasing interest rates:  Short term corporates, high yield (!), floating rate and convertibles.  And, obviously, shorting treasuries with TBT.
> 
> .
Click to expand...


I'd avoid most MLPs.

There is a fetish for yield right now, and most yield products are overpriced.


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## SteveParker123

Hi Everyone, 

I believe that buying U.S Preferred Stock is a great deal for local and foreign investors but the US stock market face challenges soon after terrorist attack on World Trade Center in September 11, 2001. We all know that the US stock market face recession and airline organizations of the country are most affected ones. However, President George H.W. Bush at that time sign the $18.6 billion bailout plan for the reform of airlines industry.
So, history confirms that the U.S government plays a prominent role in reforms for its local industries and always support them in recession period. Nowadays,the U.S stock market is touching the sky and every stock product is considered as an asset because of its strong economy indicators. I hope,now, you had better understand why every investor wants to invest in the U.S stock 
market.

Thanks,

Steve Parker.


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## Wake

I'm such a dumbass, lol.  My original financial strategy was to invest in an FDIC-insured money market account at a bank. At least twice bank attendants there confirmed that'd I'd be paid $17.50 on $2500 each month in interest. Yesterday I was in the area and the gut said it'd be a real good idea to check just one more time before committing to an account that penalizes you for withdrawing the total sum. Asked a new attendant, who checked with the manager, who clarified that the $17.50'd be earned _per the year_. That's it. Can't live on $17.50 a year. If it were $17.50 each month, that'd be nice, but no... *Imitates Archie Bunker's "PFFTBB!!" sound."

So, hopes of prospering that way went up in smoke, so now I pretty much have to invest in whatever the stock market has to offer. The higher the yield is the more risk, but if you buy a lot of those high-yield preferreds from all different kinds of sectors you'd protect yourself. Also, ALWAYS check the dividend history. If the stock started at 8% interest yield, but then shot up to 9.5%, that's probably a sign the company is in trouble. 

This morning I've been doing my rounds on this list: Highest Yielding Preferred Stocks - Slide 1 of 50. Then you go click on the "Dividend History" tab, so you can check its chart on how its common and preferred stocks have done over the years. ALWAYS check the dividend history. If it was giving $0.24 per month, but then dipped down to $0.18, what does that mean? Is that a good thing? I'm a guy of sub-average intellect so I've gotta analyze this stuff really hard just to ensure due diligence. If a company, say, has had a SOLID (non-changing) dividend for 5+ years, to me that sounds like a good thing. If you really want to sleep well at night invest in Dividend Aristocrats, which are preferreds that have paid solid dividends for the last 25 years, AND whose dividends have increased in amount.

Strategy is key when it comes to investing, and so's patience. You can't get emotional or faithful about it. Study the numbers religiously, question stuff, and keep in mind that successful investors understand and anticipate human behavior. Those who perceived the value of Viagra before it massively skyrocketed in value, well, they suspected humans would like the boost in sexual performance. Also keep in my futuristic technology and advancements in research... consider what's both futuristic and practical. Also, whenever you're at large malls, take a stroll around and look at the shops that are always busy and packed full of customers. If you're looking for stability over high yield, they might be good options, too.

Personally, I'm not sure whether to invest in multiple Real Estate sectors or not. That list mentioned earlier is chock-full of real estate companies. Then again there was that housing bubble burst thingy in 2008, I think...? Real estate looks promising, ESPECIALLY "Reality Income" (O), but the gut tells me this bubble could burst. Oh, and before I forget volatility is another important factor to consider. If memory serves the less volatile the stock is, the less likely it'll come crashing down from bankruptcy (I think?). Then again, less risk, less reward. If you're interested in trading stocks, consider taking advantage of volatility while using limit orders to ward against slippage, which is when you try to buy/sell a stock, but you get stiffed a bit (you buy 100 $20 stocks, and at the last moment each one shoots up to $25. Congrats, you're screwed. ). Also, if you use an online brokerage like Scottrade you can put all of the companies that interest you on a watchlist that updates around every 30 minutes when the market's open.

*DISCLAIMER: This is from a newbie investor. Please don't take my words as solid investment advice.


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## Mac1958

SteveParker123 said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I believe that buying U.S Preferred Stock is a great deal for local and foreign investors but the US stock market face challenges soon after terrorist attack on World Trade Center in September 11, 2001. We all know that the US stock market face recession and airline organizations of the country are most affected ones. However, President George H.W. Bush at that time sign the $18.6 billion bailout plan for the reform of airlines industry.
> So, history confirms that the U.S government plays a prominent role in reforms for its local industries and always support them in recession period. Nowadays,the U.S stock market is touching the sky and every stock product is considered as an asset because of its strong economy indicators. I hope,now, you had better understand why every investor wants to invest in the U.S stock
> market.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Steve Parker.



dafuq?

.


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## Zander

Wake said:


> I'm such a dumbass, lol.  My original financial strategy was to invest in an FDIC-insured money market account at a bank. At least twice bank attendants there confirmed that'd I'd be paid $17.50 on $2500 each month in interest. Yesterday I was in the area and the gut said it'd be a real good idea to check just one more time before committing to an account that penalizes you for withdrawing the total sum. Asked a new attendant, who checked with the manager, who clarified that the $17.50'd be earned _per the year_. That's it. Can't live on $17.50 a year. If it were $17.50 each month, that'd be nice, but no... *Imitates Archie Bunker's "PFFTBB!!" sound."
> 
> So, hopes of prospering that way went up in smoke, so now I pretty much have to invest in whatever the stock market has to offer. The higher the yield is the more risk, but if you buy a lot of those high-yield preferreds from all different kinds of sectors you'd protect yourself. Also, ALWAYS check the dividend history. If the stock started at 8% interest yield, but then shot up to 9.5%, that's probably a sign the company is in trouble.
> 
> This morning I've been doing my rounds on this list: Highest Yielding Preferred Stocks - Slide 1 of 50. Then you go click on the "Dividend History" tab, so you can check its chart on how its common and preferred stocks have done over the years. ALWAYS check the dividend history. If it was giving $0.24 per month, but then dipped down to $0.18, what does that mean? Is that a good thing? I'm a guy of sub-average intellect so I've gotta analyze this stuff really hard just to ensure due diligence. If a company, say, has had a SOLID (non-changing) dividend for 5+ years, to me that sounds like a good thing. If you really want to sleep well at night invest in Dividend Aristocrats, which are preferreds that have paid solid dividends for the last 25 years, AND whose dividends have increased in amount.
> 
> Strategy is key when it comes to investing, and so's patience. You can't get emotional or faithful about it. Study the numbers religiously, question stuff, and keep in mind that successful investors understand and anticipate human behavior. Those who perceived the value of Viagra before it massively skyrocketed in value, well, they suspected humans would like the boost in sexual performance. Also keep in my futuristic technology and advancements in research... consider what's both futuristic and practical. Also, whenever you're at large malls, take a stroll around and look at the shops that are always busy and packed full of customers. If you're looking for stability over high yield, they might be good options, too.
> 
> Personally, I'm not sure whether to invest in multiple Real Estate sectors or not. That list mentioned earlier is chock-full of real estate companies. Then again there was that housing bubble burst thingy in 2008, I think...? Real estate looks promising, ESPECIALLY "Reality Income" (O), but the gut tells me this bubble could burst. Oh, and before I forget volatility is another important factor to consider. If memory serves the less volatile the stock is, the less likely it'll come crashing down from bankruptcy (I think?). Then again, less risk, less reward. If you're interested in trading stocks, consider taking advantage of volatility while using limit orders to ward against slippage, which is when you try to buy/sell a stock, but you get stiffed a bit (you buy 100 $20 stocks, and at the last moment each one shoots up to $25. Congrats, you're screwed. ). Also, if you use an online brokerage like Scottrade you can put all of the companies that interest you on a watchlist that updates around every 30 minutes when the market's open.
> 
> *DISCLAIMER: This is from a newbie investor. Please don't take my words as solid investment advice.



It's your life and your money. Do whatever you like. But personally, I think you need to educate yourself on passive investment strategies.  Spend your time increasing your marketable skills and leave your investments alone, to grow. Over the long haul you'll be much better off than trying to "time the market" or "trade". 

You can start here for some great information......Getting started - Bogleheads


> Develop a workable plan
> Invest early and often
> Never bear too much or too little risk
> Never try to time the market
> Use index funds when possible
> Keep costs low
> Diversify
> Minimize taxes
> Keep it simple
> Stay the course




Good luck!


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## sjay

Jeremiah said:


> I wouldn't invest in stocks, annuities of any kind, Wake.  I'd pay the penalties for anything holding my money and cash out right now.



Jeremiah,I know you got expert advice from your friend in Europe last year to sell everything.I'll repeat what I asked then,if you guys are such experts why don't you short the market.You didn't respond then, are you going to respond this time or are you going to run and hide with your tail between your legs again?


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## rennai

The purpose of a stock market is to facilitate the exchange of securities between buyers and sellers, reducing the risks of investing. Just imagine how difficult it would be to sell shares if you had to call around the neighborhood trying to find a buyer. Really, a stock market is nothing more than a super-sophisticated farmers' market linking buyers and sellers. 
 Before we go on, we should distinguish between the primary market and the secondary market. The primary market is where securities are created (by means of an IPO) while, in the secondary market, investors trade previously-issued securities without the involvement of the issuing-companies. The secondary market is what people are referring to when they talk about the stock market. It is important to understand that the trading of a company's stock does not directly involve that company.


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## srlip

Read William Oneil's HOW TO MAKE MONEY IN STOCKS, and his newspaper, THE INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY.  But my personal recommendation is that you get to know a vet really well, a decent one, use his school loans and home loan to get a big old house in the right area, and rent out small rooms for  $100 per week. Like at LEAST  20 rooms. Do the math. Check it out, it's already being done on a large basis, in many cities, it's a HUGE money maker, done my way. Both you and he can get  14k in loans/grants, in 5 months (start school in August) in return for attending classes for 3 weeks each of the 2 semesters, at a local junior college. You need not pass, or do any work, but you've gotta be there and turn in a few assignments. 28k, man. 

And there's a way to use 5k (each of you) of that to get you a 3rd worlder spouse (each) who will pay you 25k (each) per year, for 6 years, too.  Of course you and the vet have to live in the house (you can move out after a year or so) and the vet gets paid to stay there and manage the place. He's gotta have a job in order to get the VA home loan, so that's part of the money you gotta have. He's your teacher/ ghost- writer/consultant, don't you know?    His spouse's income (and loans and grants) become YOUR money.  Dont bring one here who can't get a MINIMUM of  $20 an hour job, almost immediately, and they'd better be able to make $30 an hour after they get their US bachelors, cause they will be giving you 15k per year (cash)  If you pick them carefully (engineers, MD's, Physicists, etc) they can have a bachelor's from here in 2 years of half time schooling, and then go to graduate school part time, too. If they then work for the right agency for a few years, their school-loans are "forgiven".  This is a VERY easy "sell" to an unemployed vet and to 3rd worlders, folks.  eff the stockmarket, etc.  

With inflation averaging  5% per year for the past 40 years, and homeloan interest at  4%, you'd be a fool to pay off the loan on the house. Instead, save up that money and get ANOTHER such house, and then 2 more, and then 4 more, etc. There's LOTS of unemployed vets and 4rd worlders with bachelar's degrees (who will do almost anything to come to US)/.  YOu need either  20k in hand for each house that you want to buy (for repairs and making payments while you get tenants)  or 10k and REAL, secure income.   Tenants can work off a lot of their rent, doing painting, carpet removal, tile installation, roofing, etc, under your watchful eye, of course.


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