# I ain't no Birther, but what's up with this?



## Elutherian (Oct 15, 2009)

Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate


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## ncarolinadixie (Oct 15, 2009)

Interesting indeed. Don't worry, it will all be explained away and justified with great aplomb.


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## L.K.Eder (Oct 15, 2009)

great reporting, they did not even get his name right.

i am surprised they got illinois right.

i am not surprised they knew everything about jery ryan, though.


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## Modbert (Oct 15, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



Kenyan-born US Senate hopeful, Barrack Obama

Is his name suddenly spelled Barrack? 

If they don't even bother to get the name right, I doubt they got his birth place right.


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## ncarolinadixie (Oct 15, 2009)

I can't help myself, I just gotta do it..............and just how do you know that THEY spelled it wrong. Maybe the current spelling is the one that is wrong. lol Sorry, I couldn't help myself.


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## Ringel05 (Oct 15, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



You found it on the internet which begs the question, "is it real or is it memorex?"


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## rayboyusmc (Oct 15, 2009)

When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.

Now we can post whatever we want and it becomes right wing gospel.

Sad little people who don't like to lose fair and square.


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## Sinatra (Oct 15, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



What the hell?

I would hope this is followed up - gotta be a hoax.

In related news, a federal judge actually fined the birther leader $20 grand in an effort to protect the "integrity" of the courts.

Now this up to this point all the birther stuff seems rather silly, but fining someone for bringing a case before the court?  That seems a bit...something.


Judge Fines &#039;Birther&#039; Leader | Georgia Public Broadcasting


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## Elutherian (Oct 15, 2009)

Hey, I ain't taking a side on this issue. I don't know enough about it... the article just caught me a little off gaurd is all. It is interesting.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 15, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate




The article is about Ryan, and contains a misleading headline, that's what's "up" with it. There is absolutely no further mention of "Kenyan-born" Obama in the article. Not a Birther? But seems like you're hunting and pecking in order to become one.


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## Emma (Oct 15, 2009)

Good grief. The birthers have latched onto an article allegedly posted online in Kenya as proof! he was born outside the US, yet refuse to accept an official state document and statements from Hawaiian officials (who are in charge of these records) that he was indeed born in Hawaii. 

The stoopid burns especially bright this morning.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 15, 2009)

He was born in Kenya. His Granny said so.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 15, 2009)

Sinatra said:


> Elutherian said:
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Many states have rules and resulting penalties for filing frivolous lawsuits, which cost the states millions and tie up the courts for more serious business. The "birther" shit is no exception. Unfortunately, there have been several lawsuits that made it through the court system, personally costing Obama thousands in lawyer's fees to defend against them. If he didn't, he could lose one of these frivolous suits by default.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 15, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> He was born in Kenya. His Granny said so.



The "Granny" in question barely speaks English and is in her 90's. Let's have Mr. Phillips or Corsi foot the bill to bring her to the United States for a deposition, shall we?


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 15, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
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Why are you calling her a liar? Are you a racist?


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## Emma (Oct 15, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Hey, I ain't taking a side on this issue. I don't know enough about it... the article just caught me a little off gaurd is all. It is interesting.



btw, my post wasn't directed toward you.


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## Elutherian (Oct 15, 2009)

Emma said:


> Elutherian said:
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> > Hey, I ain't taking a side on this issue. I don't know enough about it... the article just caught me a little off gaurd is all. It is interesting.
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Yeah, I know. I just figured I better get my opinions out before somebody accused me of something.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 15, 2009)

It's an African newspaper, you know, made by Africans, I'm just saying, do you expect them to be as smart as white American journalists?


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## Sinatra (Oct 15, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


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___

I'm cool with that - but where were you chiming in on all those frivilous lawsuits being filed against Sarah Palin?

Were you calling those out as rubbish?

Keep it honest...


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## PubliusInfinitum (Oct 15, 2009)

rayboyusmc said:


> When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.
> 
> Now we can post whatever we want and it becomes right wing gospel.
> 
> Sad little people who don't like to lose fair and square.



ROFLMNAO...

Now did you just attribute truth to fraudulence?

LOL...

Ya can't make this crap up.

And she's absolute CERTAIN of it... rest assured... we're fine...  I wouldn't worry about it; nothing here really...  

It's just a few folks who have absolutely NO means to reason, who believe those things which they state are fraudulent to be truth... who have the right to VOTE...

How bad could it get?


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## PubliusInfinitum (Oct 15, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


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ROFLMNAO...

Which would require him to do what?  


It would require him to produce an actual Birth certificate...  OH THE HORROR!  

Something that every American President has had to do... and given that this is the first president of the US whose birth origin rest on such dubious grounds.

The certainty is that Hussein was not born in the US... and that certainty rests on the millions that have been spent to protect the records...

People who have nothing to hide, don't spend millions hiding...  they just produce the document.

The highest probability is that he was born in Kenya, as his Grandmother stated...


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## Emma (Oct 15, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



A week after the above, posted on the same news site: 

Inteligence | Left&#146;s face it, Obama is not &#145;our own&#146;


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## Emma (Oct 15, 2009)

1. AP 2004 Story re Obama - Political News Version - 771 Words
Illinois Senate candidate Jack Ryan dropped out of the race Friday amid a furor over lurid sex club allegations that horrified fellow Republicans and caused his once-promising candidacy to im-plode in four short days. 

"It's clear to me that a vigorous debate on the issues most likely could not take place if I remain in the race," Ryan, 44, said in a statement. "What would take place, rather, is a brutal, scorched-earth campaign - the kind of campaign that has turned off so many voters, the kind of politics I re-fuse to play." 

The campaign began to come apart Monday following the release of embarrassing records from Ryan's divorce. In those records, his ex-wife, "Boston Public" actress Jeri Ryan, said Ryan took her to kinky sex clubs in Paris, New York and New Orleans and tried to get her to perform sex acts with him while others watched. 
***


2. AP 2004 Story - National Political News Version - 768 Words
Illinois Senate candidate Jack Ryan dropped out of the race Friday amid a furor over lurid sex
club allegations that horrified fellow Republicans and caused his once-promising candidacy to implode
in four short days.

"It's clear to me that a vigorous debate on the issues most likely could not take place if I remain
in the race," Ryan, 44, said in a statement. "What would take place, rather, is a brutal, scorchedearth
campaign - the kind of campaign that has turned off so many voters, the kind of politics I refuse
to play."

The campaign began to come apart Monday following the release of embarrassing records from
Ryan's divorce. In those records, his ex-wife, "Boston Public" actress Jeri Ryan, said Ryan took her
to kinky sex clubs in Paris, New York and New Orleans and tried to get her to perform sex acts with
him while others watched.

Ryan disputed the allegations, saying he and his wife went to one "avant-garde" club in Paris
and left because they felt uncomfortable.
***

3. AP 2004 Story re Obama - International/Africa Distribution Version - 508 Words
U.S. Senate candidate Jack Ryan dropped out of the race Friday amid a furor over lurid sex club
allegations that horrified fellow Republicans and caused his once-promising campaign to implode in
four short days.

The campaign began to come apart Monday following the release of embarrassing records from
Ryan's divorce. In those records, his ex-wife, "Boston Public" and former "Star Trek: Voyager" actress
Jeri Ryan, said Ryan took her to kinky sex clubs in Paris, New York and New Orleans and
tried to get her to perform sex acts with him while others watched.

Ryan disputed the allegations, saying he and his wife went to one "avant-garde" club in Paris
and left because they felt uncomfortable.

"It's clear to me that a vigorous debate on the issues most likely could not take place if I remain
in the race," Ryan, 44, said in a statement. "What would take place, rather, is a brutal, scorchedearth
campaign - the kind of campaign that has turned off so many voters, the kind of politics I refuse
to play."
***


Source: LexisNexis Paid Subscription Service.

You can read many "versions" of the AP story here, Illinois Senate candidate Jack Ryan dropped out of the race Friday - Google Search


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## chanel (Oct 15, 2009)

What does everyone think? If you could take a guess, real or hoax?


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 15, 2009)

Emma said:


> Elutherian said:
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Um, yeah, it looks like they got the word to forget that whole "Granny witnessed the Kenyan birth" thingy


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## Catbert (Oct 15, 2009)

Catbert deleted content.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 15, 2009)

Sinatra said:


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Some probably are. I don't follow Sarah Palin's life except when someone mentions it on this board.


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## Emma (Oct 15, 2009)

chanel said:


> What does everyone think? If you could take a guess, real or hoax?



The article was obviously edited for their local readers.


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## Article 15 (Oct 15, 2009)

*Threads merged.

~A15*


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## MaggieMae (Oct 15, 2009)

PubliusInfinitum said:


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He's already produced his birth certificate which has been verified by everyone except God. Only you weirdos want more, and any person in their right mind (no pun intended) wouldn't kow to the maniacal fringers, especially a sitting president who *before he was even elected *would have been fully investigated by the FBI from the day he popped out.


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## 007 (Oct 15, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


> He's already produced his birth certificate...



For the love of *GOD* girl, *STOP LYING!*

What obama "produced," was a "copy" of thingie called a *"CERTIFICATION OF LIVE BIRTH,"* which in 1961 Hawaii was handing out to anyone including people that weren't even born in this country!! To date, obama has *NEVER* "produced" a *REAL ***BIRTH CERTIFICATE***.
*
There is not *ONE DOCUMENT IN EXISTENCE TODAY* readily available for all to see that clearly states *WHAT HOSPITAL* obama *WAS BORN IN, *the *DELIVERING DOCTORS NAME,* attending *NURSES NAMES, WITNESSES.... ZERO* is available for *ANYONE* to see, and obama is spending *MILLIONS TO KEEP IT THAT WAY. ANYTHING and EVERYTHING* that *MIGHT* shed light on where obama was truly born is *HIDDEN*. And one more tid bit, obama's *FIRST OFFICIAL ACT AS PRESIDENT* when stepped into the Oval Office was to *SIGN AN EXECUTIVE ORDER HIDING ALL HIS PERSONAL RECORDS!!!
*
So *THINK* about it people. Does that sound like a person with *NOTHING TO HIDE?!* Get real...


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## Emma (Oct 15, 2009)

Pale Rider said:


> And one more tid bit, obama's *FIRST OFFICIAL ACT AS PRESIDENT* when stepped into the Oval Office was to *SIGN AN EXECUTIVE ORDER HIDING ALL HIS PERSONAL RECORDS!!!
> *



For the record: 

National Coalition for History » Blog Archive » President Obama Revokes Bush Presidential Records Executive Order (updated Jan. 26)



> *PRESIDENT OBAMA REVOKES BUSH PRESIDENTIAL RECORDS EXECUTIVE ORDER* (UPDATED JAN. 26)
> 
> On January 21, in one of his first official acts, _*President Barack Obama revoked the Bush administration&#8217;s Executive Order 13233 that severely limited access by the public to presidential records*_*.*
> 
> ...



His executive order made accessing presidential records LESS restrictive by reversing what Bush had put into place. 


http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2009/pdf/E9-1712.pdf

_&#8216;&#8216;Presidential records&#8217;&#8217; refers to those documentary materials maintained by NARA pursuant to the Presidential Records Act, including Vice Presidential records._
--------------
*Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978*

_Requires that the President and his staff take all practical steps to *file personal records separately from Presidential records*._

Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978


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## Zona (Oct 15, 2009)

Oily Taint?


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## Godboy (Oct 15, 2009)

rayboyusmc said:


> When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.
> 
> Now we can post whatever we want and it becomes right wing gospel.
> 
> Sad little people who don't like to lose fair and square.



Right wingers dont question Obamas birth place. Crazy weirdo fringers do that, and they can be found on both sides of the aisle.


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## L.K.Eder (Oct 15, 2009)

Godboy said:


> rayboyusmc said:
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which isle, oahu? i thought obama was liked there.


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## Godboy (Oct 15, 2009)

L.K.Eder said:


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Corrected for the spell police.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 15, 2009)

I'll take "Obama birthplace" for $2,000, Alex

Answer: An African Newspaper, Obama's Grandmother, Obama Half Brother, Obama half sister, Ambassador to Kenya

Jeopardy Question: Name some of the people close to Obama who claim he was born in Kenya.

You are correct!


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## Polk (Oct 16, 2009)

Sinatra said:


> Now this up to this point all the birther stuff seems rather silly, but fining someone for bringing a case before the court?  That seems a bit...something.
> 
> Judge Fines 'Birther' Leader | Georgia Public Broadcasting



It's not used often. It's an action taken against those who keep filing the same suit over and over and over.


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## Emma (Oct 16, 2009)

Polk said:


> Sinatra said:
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> > Now this up to this point all the birther stuff seems rather silly, but fining someone for bringing a case before the court?  That seems a bit...something.
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He should read the original suit filed, the order, her response, and then the order for sanctions. Then he'll understand.


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## sitarro (Oct 16, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


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He produced a computer generated joke(obviously produced on a computer that didn't exist when the liar was born) that is not a birth certificate but a certificate of live birth......... different documents.


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## DiveCon (Oct 16, 2009)

Emma said:


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good find emma
i was gonna say that more than likely the author of the piece in the OP was claiming it without knowing the facts
typical for news orgs today anyway


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## DiveCon (Oct 16, 2009)

Sinatra said:


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because Alaska doesnt have laws against filing those law suits
something Palin herself did away with


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## MaggieMae (Oct 16, 2009)

Pale Rider said:


> MaggieMae said:
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Did you ever stop to think that by today's standards, attending medical staff might not WANT their names revealed? As I've said in many other theads, I have two birth certificates: One just lists the basic information, and the other has places for medical conditions at time of birth. If I had been born with some genetic defect, I most certainly would not want ASSHOLES LIKE YOU to know about it. And no, I'm not suggesting Obama was born with any either. But that information is P.R.I.V.A.T.E. So go back to diddling yourself while you wait for that information to appear publicly. You'll be suffering from a myriad of medical conditions yourself just due to old age by the time that happens, if ever.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 16, 2009)

Pale Rider said:
			
		

> And one more tid bit, obama's FIRST OFFICIAL ACT AS PRESIDENT when stepped into the Oval Office was to SIGN AN EXECUTIVE ORDER HIDING ALL HIS PERSONAL RECORDS!!!



Strangely enough, Mr. Knowitall, Obama REVERSED an existing Executive Order signed by George W. Bush. The links below verify that fact. You might try tearing yourself away from the rabid right-wing bloggers who can't seem to ever source anything correctly and continue to make up shit which only the most ignorant believe as gospel.

President Obama revoke&#8217;s Executive Order 13233 on day one! &#8211; George Allen Miller

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2009/pdf/E9-1712.pdf

2009 Executive Orders Signed by Barack Obama


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## Zona (Oct 16, 2009)

Godboy said:


> rayboyusmc said:
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Lefty's are asking for the birth certificate?    Did tey ask for Bush's as well?


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## Zona (Oct 16, 2009)

By the way, how is Oily Taint doing in court with her suits?  I wish her luck and i know a judge will see it her way......oh wait, he threw it out, fined her for contually filing bogus suits and she looks like a fool.  

good luck Burthers.....lol


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## sitarro (Oct 17, 2009)

Zona said:


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Why would anyone need to see President Bush's birth certificate, he is an American, born on American soil to two real Americans?


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

sitarro said:


> Why would anyone need to see President Bush's birth certificate, he is an American, born on American soil to two real Americans?



How do you know?


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## sitarro (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


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I'm not an idiot liberal.


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## Fatality (Oct 17, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



thats pretty intresting, wonder why obam never tried to have them correct it?


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Fatality said:


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they corrected it anyway
look for the post by emma

http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...ats-up-with-this-post1619813.html#post1619813


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

Fatality said:


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They'd edited the AP copy, but why should Obama (or _any_ politician) concern himself with what is posted on the interwebs in other countries ?


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## sitarro (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


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It was posted in the country he was born in and he has spent a lot of Soros' money to bribe plenty of people, mostly skum politicians and appointees like himself, to keep it a secret from the dimwits that think he is someone he isn't. If the truth comes out it will complicate his master's plans to destroy our country, his master will be very pissed. I can't believe you had to ask, it's so ridiculously obvious. Geez!


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


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Because being born in Kenya disqualifies him for the Presidency and the Arabs had too much investing in Obama to let that get in the way


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

You're a lunatic, frank. 

Sorry 'bout that, but there's no kinder way to say it. You never used to be crazy. It's obvious the election tossed you completely over the edge, though.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> You're a lunatic, frank.
> 
> Sorry 'bout that, but there's no kinder way to say it. You never used to be crazy. It's obvious the election tossed you completely over the edge, though.



Get your face out of the KoolAid Can.

Percy Sutton admits he pulled strings to get Obama into Harvard at the behest of Khalid Monsour

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EcC0QAd0Ug[/ame]

How much can you possibly ignore?


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## L.K.Eder (Oct 17, 2009)

wouldn't it like be, totally, like awesome, if some patriotic real american internet user could like end this uppity usurpation by the kenyan boy king.


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## Scotty (Oct 17, 2009)

Look at the brightside, Better he be born in Kenya than Mexico.


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## Care4all (Oct 17, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



it appears to be fabricated...

i found the newspaper's REAL site I believe....  The Standard | Online Edition :: Home

searched their archives and could not find the article....

then found another site that could be it...Report the credit crunch from an African perspective - Sunday Standard

couldn't find the article there...either!

then saw that these sites list their names of the writer of their articles and they list their dates like the EU, where the date is before the month....the article about obama lists the date, the AMERICAN WAY, with no author credited....my best guess is that the whole thing is a fraud....


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


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They why print the Mea culpa that Emma found?


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## Luissa (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


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good thing he was born in Hawaii then!


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


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because the internet is the perfect Orwellian interface
its there one day, gone the next

and Emma found the standards correction story


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## Care4all (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


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i don't know?  her article had an author at least....  the one being passed around doesn't....that's just wrong...articles are not printed without the author noted...?


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## sitarro (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


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There's enough doubt that the argument is still going and this thread is 3 pages.......... it would be very simple to stop it but for some unexplained reason the boyKing doesn't want it to stop.


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## L.K.Eder (Oct 17, 2009)

sitarro said:


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the boyKing is too busy laughing now, that he fooled all the real patriotic americans.


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## RetiredGySgt (Oct 17, 2009)

rayboyusmc said:


> When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.
> 
> Now we can post whatever we want and it becomes right wing gospel.
> 
> Sad little people who don't like to lose fair and square.



Provided some evidence Dan Rather was right, ohh and that he was fired as well.  Rather claimed Bush received favorable treatment in promotions and such and used an obvious forgery to do it. If it were true and you know it, provide us some actual paper work to back it up.

As regards the supposed feelings of his commanding officer, the family of the conveniently dead commander disagree completely with Rather's report and tell a different story, one where the Commander LIKED Bush and thought he was a promising Officer. Go figure.


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## ABikerSailor (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> It's an African newspaper, you know, made by Africans, I'm just saying, do you expect them to be as smart as white American journalists?



You know......I generally never neg rep someone first, but, in this case, Cruising Aids Skank, I'll make an exception.

Fucking racist............

Yeah, I know, same thing I said on your neg.


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


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The article I DID find in their archives posted on July 4th wasn't a 'mea culpa'. It never mentioned the other article. And according to the archives, I find no correction was made to the article (allegedly) posted online June 27th. My point of posting that 2nd article is that it seems a bit strange this new outlet's editorial board would deem him 'Kenyan-born' (editor because the original AP story did NOT contain those words) and then a mere _one week later_ post an article chastising people for claiming the same. And that they _didn't_ cite the one from the 27th in the piece on the 4th just provides that much more proof to me that the link to the first article is a fake.


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


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It credited AP, so if it WAS actually posted as such, the editor at eastandard added the copy 'Kenyan-born'.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
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Go spank yer monkey.

It was a joke you fucking moron


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


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Emma the Kool Aid snorting has damaged your brain. 

You're telling me that they're responding to something that wasn't in their paper the week before?

LOL

Hysterical!


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## Joe_Penalty (Oct 17, 2009)

Ringel05 said:


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What do you mean by begs the question?


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## Joe_Penalty (Oct 17, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


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That is what I noticed about the article, it seems to be more about Ryan than Obama.


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## Care4all (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


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They were not responding to anything...it was just an article about Barak Obama, as IF THE OTHER ARTICLE NEVER EVEN EXISTED.....

Why isn't there the name of who wrote the article listed btw?  Don't you find that strange?

Don't you find it strange that the Kenya born obama is not mentioned once in the article itself?

I can sell ya the Brooklyn bridge for a couple of thousand if you want....how about it?  

Care


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


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Jesus Christ, you're a moron. If you read the article, it apparent they're talking about more than just one incident. That particular article isn't even mentioned. Now get your conspiracy-fueled brain cranked up and tell us why their editor would include "Kenyan-born" on the 27th, and then a week later post an article that chastises people for claiming Obama as their own (including "kenyan-born"). C'mon Frank. Don't let me down. I've not added any new folks to the conspiracy since Land handed down his decision.


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


did you notice the link in the OP was to an internet archive site?
they copy pages and store them
so you are barking up the wrong tree
they DID post that story on the website then took it down
it happens all the time on the internet

welcome to 1984


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


emma, look at the site for the OP
it is an archive site
you claiming THEY faked this?
thats just as big a conspiracy as the birfer nonsense


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## Modbert (Oct 17, 2009)

I'm not sure why this thread has gone on this long. They didn't even spell his name right. How do you expect them to get anything else right?


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



No, I'm not. I posted the article from a week later where they chastise those there who claim Obama as Kenyan; I was pointing out there was no 'mea culpa' in that particular article. Funny how Frank and the other nutters will accept the first article as a "smoking gun" yet completely ignore the second.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

Sunday, July 4, 2004

Lefts face it, Obama is not our own
By Wallace Kantai
It is looking increasingly likely that Barrack Obama will be elected in November as Senator of the State of Illinois. The number of prospective voters has increased after his presumptive opponent in the election was felled by accusations of sexual impropriety.

Simultaneous with Obamas rising stature is the increasing desire by Kenyans to identify with him. *Typical newspaper headlines and messages flying around the Internet tend to lead with the theme "Kenyan-linked", or "Kenyan-American", or even, erroneously, "Kenyan-born".
*
People like identifying with winners, especially when they can be linked to them in a direct way. However, Kenyans are mistaken in attempting to claim Mr Barrack Obama as one of their own, for two very important reasons."

Inteligence | Left&#146;s face it, Obama is not &#145;our own&#146;

Do you ever bothering what you link to?

It says right in the rebuttal that they're addressing Obama's Kenyan birth!


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


clearly the Kenyan paper put that story on the net, then took it down


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> Sunday, July 4, 2004
> 
> Lefts face it, Obama is not our own
> By Wallace Kantai
> ...


Yes, they do. They did not specifically mention their OWN (alleged) article.


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## Care4all (Oct 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



It's very strange Dive....you go to this link and read the article, and then hit HOME for the newspaper's site and it does not ring you to the news site home for TODAY's paper, which most all archived articles that i have gone in to, when you click HOME for the newpaper, it brings you to TODAY'S home, today's date for the home page....but on this site with this article it brings you to the home page for that day???  it is very weird....

then when you go to the newspaper, the east african Standard, the same address that this article gives, The Standard | Online Edition :: Home, and you search their archives and you don't find the article...

And also, the video that showed the birther guy finding this began by saying someone emailed him a link forn the Kenya Daily, with the article title, but when he finally was done sleuthing and got the article through archives, this article says it is from the east afreican Standard online, and NOT the Kenya Daily...which is totally a different newspaper than the Standard...?

There are so many things that are not right about it....

no name for the author of the article....have you EVER SEEN THIS?


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...


Hard to say. They have archives for 'editions' before and after that day. I can't find any contact info for them or else I'd email and ask them directly. (what they have on their site is covered by a vertical banner ad)


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
> 
> 
> > Sunday, July 4, 2004
> ...


uh, its not alleged
they DID publish it


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


i know it doesnt
its an ARCHIVE Site


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Care4all said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


yes it does list an author

AP
its at the bottom


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
> 
> 
> > Sunday, July 4, 2004
> ...



Got me again, Em. They must have been talking about all those articles in the Washington Post and NY Times.

No way they were talking about their own article of a week ago


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



Probably, but it's not in their archives. If they were to going to change anything, why not simply drop the words 'kenyan born' from the beginning? Whether they posted it or not, the fact remains that claims Obama was born there are utter bullshit, as they stated just a week later.


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


why? US papers do that on their websites all the time and have no record of it
why do you think archives sites got started in the first place
but, the only way you can actually use them is to know the original address to check from


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



Why?

Because it IS utter bullshit.


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


it's utter bullshit that they actually published a story with errors in it????

thats not what i was talking about emma
get off your kick of wanting to be disagbreable with me on everything for a change and you might understand what i actually asked you


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## Old Rocks (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> He was born in Kenya. His Granny said so.



You were hatched in a hen house, the rooster said so.


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## Modbert (Oct 17, 2009)

Old Rocks said:


> You were hatched in a hen house, the rooster said so.



I doubt it, chickens are decent people. CF isn't.


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## Old Rocks (Oct 17, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



Of course, just like the joke in the picture in this post


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...


No. Why don't you try reading what I wrote: 

_Whether they posted it or not, the fact remains that *claims Obama was born there are utter bullshit*, as they stated just a week later._


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## DiveCon (Oct 17, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


then maybe YOU should go back and read what i was saying
cause you seem to be arguing a position i have NEVER taken


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## Emma (Oct 17, 2009)

I was posting to dumbass about the 2nd article and how it didn't reference the first. That is what started all of this. I never said YOU believed any of that crap.


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## CrusaderFrank (Oct 18, 2009)

Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes. - The Tamar Yonah Show - Blogs - Israel National News


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## DiveCon (Oct 18, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes. - The Tamar Yonah Show - Blogs - Israel National News


c'mon man

you gotta have something better than a blog


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## MaggieMae (Oct 18, 2009)

sitarro said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > sitarro said:
> ...



No, just an idiot.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 18, 2009)

sitarro said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Fatality said:
> ...



I know there are people out there actually dumber than you are, but so far, you're topping my list today.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 18, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > You're a lunatic, frank.
> ...



Wasn't Khalid Monsour the same one who swore he actually SAW Saddam's WMD and gave a followup story to World Net Daily that became so convoluted, even WND had to retract it?


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## Care4all (Oct 18, 2009)

i tried to find it on the AP archive since it said it came from the AP and i could not find it...do you think obama had the power to wipe that off the record WITH NO SNAPSHOT at all on it in any cache or mirror sites?

THIS is the third time I have mentioned this but don't news articles have to list their writer/author?

WHY did the news article not have a writer/journalist attributed?  That's the maine thing that bothers me on this....


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## MaggieMae (Oct 18, 2009)

CrusaderFrank said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > You're a lunatic, frank.
> ...



Yeah, the fabrications of this guy (who also uses an alias at times) can strangely only be found in right-wing blogs. _Sure_, I believe it.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 18, 2009)

sitarro said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > Elutherian said:
> ...



I think Obama probably continues to believe that most THINKING Americans aren't as stupid as The Birthers are. You people wouldn't be satisfied if Obama's lawyers could produce the actual OBGYN who delivered him in a Hawaiian hospital. You would then allege that the doc was coerced, and *that's* the story that would take up 5 pages in a Google search. See how it works? It's a pandemic: Gullible-itis.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 18, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> CrusaderFrank said:
> 
> 
> > Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes. - The Tamar Yonah Show - Blogs - Israel National News
> ...



Whatever the truth, it is disturbing that the Obama campaign/administration has spent time and money blocking requests for information. It is not just his birth certificate but his college records as well.  The man is a total blank slate.  If we had a functioning press in this country they would be all over it.


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## The Rabbi (Oct 18, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


> sitarro said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



Everyone would be satisfied by a full and complete disclosure of records, much like John McCain did when the question arose.
But that isnt going to happen with this administration.


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## MaggieMae (Oct 18, 2009)

RetiredGySgt said:


> rayboyusmc said:
> 
> 
> > When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.
> ...



Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh.................


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## DiveCon (Oct 18, 2009)

MaggieMae said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> > rayboyusmc said:
> ...


this is why i and many others think you are a moron


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## HUGGY (Oct 18, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > CrusaderFrank said:
> ...



Rove, Cheney and Bush killed the press.  Its not obamas fault the state the media is in. Bush's power grab is now obamas inheritance.

Obama does have alot of REAL power a president shouldn't have that is truly troubling thanks to Bush.  You assholes were so stupid you thought Bush would be the only president we would ever have?


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## DiveCon (Oct 18, 2009)

HUGGY said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...


more stupidity from huggys


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## The Rabbi (Oct 18, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


That;s why he's on my ignore list. There's only so much stupidity a person can read.


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## Emma (Oct 18, 2009)

sitarro said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > sitarro said:
> ...



Until you show his original birth certificate with the names of the hospital and doctor --- and one each from his mother and father to prove that they TOO were born in America --- you have no proof GWB is a natural born American citizen. 

So get crackin'.


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## HUGGY (Oct 18, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
> ...



Ignore this...Fuck you ya ignorant jew fuck.


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## ABikerSailor (Oct 18, 2009)

Emma said:


> sitarro said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Hey dipshit..........what part of you ONLY HAVE TO BE BORN HERE, NOT YOUR PARENTS do you not get?

You're listening to that birther chick ain't ya?

Ummmm...........question for you.......ever heard of "anchor babies"?


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## DiveCon (Oct 18, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > sitarro said:
> ...


WTF?!?!?!?

um, you need to actually read what she said
and maybe read a few of her posts in this thread


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## Emma (Oct 18, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > sitarro said:
> ...



Are you posting that to me?


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## Emma (Oct 18, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



I guess we need a sarcasm smilie lol. 

I think any time that's brought up, toss it right back to 'em. How do we know _any_ of our presidents were natural born citizens? After all, we took them at their word with no proof of their or their parents' place of birth.


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## DiveCon (Oct 18, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...


i dont know if any presidential candidate had their citizenship challenged like we had in the 2008 election where BOTH major party's had their candidates challenged for proof of it


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## American Horse (Oct 18, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate




It appears that this is innocent enough, the spelling I mean.  Back then, in 2004, Obama was not a well known political figure.  His opponent Ryan was moreso. So it appears back then,  accurate or not, to be thought that Ryan's opponent was Kenyan born, and not an issue of creating birther proof a priori.


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## Emma (Oct 18, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



Yup. Although they did take Obama's to a whole 'nother level. I'm not sure how extensive it was for Arthur, but being back in that time it didn't take hold anywhere near the extent as it has with Obama (and it died off before he took office, from what I can tell).


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## MaggieMae (Oct 19, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> MaggieMae said:
> 
> 
> > RetiredGySgt said:
> ...



Awww, I thought you were starting to like me. Sob sob. But hey, I like to subtly point out why it's okay for you guys to suddenly remember that George W. Bush's policies set the scene for the following administration, yet it's taboo when my "side" does it.


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## jvn (Oct 20, 2009)

Can you imagine when, five years from now, people post articles from WorldNutsDaily or the Sludge Report as PROOF of something?


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## LA RAM FAN (Oct 20, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



Pale Rider has made many multiple threads in the past that proved beyond a doubt that socialist Obama is a kenyan born citizen and that  there is no shread of evidence that proves he is a us citizen.People around here only see what they WANT to see though so  of course they  ignored it and typed in all kinds of crap to try and save face though.


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## xotoxi (Oct 20, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate


 
Holy Crap!

I had always thought that Orally Titz and all of the other birthers were a bunch of wingnuts...but this article from The Standard Ltd in Kenya that mentions "Kenyan born" and "Barrack Obama" in the same sentence, has gotten me to jump on the birther's bandwagon.

It also brings into question the spelling of his name.  It appears that we have been misspelling his name as "Barack" all along.

He DUPED us!!!


----------



## xotoxi (Oct 20, 2009)

American Horse said:


> It appears that this is innocent enough, the spelling I mean. Back then, in 2004, Obama was not a well known political figure. His opponent Ryan was moreso. So it appears back then, accurate or not, to be thought that Ryan's opponent was Kenyan born, and not an issue of creating birther proof a priori.


 
Additionally, there is _absolutely no way_ that this article could have been written recently, as it is clearly dated "Sunday, June 27, 2004".

Facts like this cannot be falsified on the internet.


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## ABikerSailor (Oct 20, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> Elutherian said:
> 
> 
> > Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate
> ...



Yeah....right.......Pole Rider is SOOOOOOOO correct.

Never mind the birth certificate, statements by the doctors, the birth announcement in the papers.................

Yeah.........better to ignore the facts.

You really are a 'tard ain't ya?  Bet you're a Hannity refugee.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Oct 20, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> > Elutherian said:
> ...



you mean the fake and phony birth ceritificate they have displayed,the announcement in the corporate controlled media which is a horrible source for true facts? yeah thats what you frady cats love to do,ignore the facts and only see what you WANT to see.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 20, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > 9/11 inside job said:
> ...



Well......you're obviously a conspiracy theorist as referenced by your user name, so that means you're willing to believe any kind of bullshit that is heaped into your tiny skull by FAUX News.

You also realize that Orly Taitz is trying to say that the whole reason SHE believes Obama isn't a citizen is because his PARENTS weren't born here.

Anchor babies for immigrants anyone?  You are a citizen if you are born in the confines of the United States.

Oh yeah.........wanna talk about that fake birth certificate from Kenya?


----------



## manu1959 (Oct 20, 2009)

so the first time they lied and spelled his name wrong so we aren't to believe them.....until they say he wasn't born there and spell his name right and then we are suposed to believe them.....


----------



## Emma (Oct 20, 2009)

Why don't we just believe what the director of the Hawaii department of health has stated--- twice:  she's seen the record and Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 20, 2009)

Emma said:


> Why don't we just believe what the director of the Hawaii department of health has stated--- twice:  she's seen the record and Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.



Because when a gov't official assures you something is perfectly fine, you want to check twice.

But it begs the question: Why do we need to take a bureaucrat's word on something this important?  Why don't they just release the damn thing?  Why is the Obama administration fighting release of what ought to be routine information?
Why have they fought against releasing his college records as well?  What is there they don't want people to see?
Idont know where he was born. I have a hard time believing 90+ year old women.  I dont beliieve a lot of circumstantial evidence.  But there is no denying that Obama is spending time and money to prevent publication of this information.  It brings the question, why?  I keep coming back to that.  I am not a conspiracy theorist at all.  But I cannot get past this question and this one fact.


----------



## jvn (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't we just believe what the director of the Hawaii department of health has stated--- twice:  she's seen the record and Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.
> ...



He has made the scan of his COLB public - that is above and beyond what any other President has ever done - try to get past THAT.

Further, as Em has pointed out, the Director of the Hawaii DOH has twice verified that he was born in Hawaii.

Why won't he "publish" his BC?  Probably because it wouldn't accomplish much except to weaken the Office of the Presidency.


----------



## Emma (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't we just believe what the director of the Hawaii department of health has stated--- twice:  she's seen the record and Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.
> ...


She stated such. Twice.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 20, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


No, dweeb.  Not whether they said that.  Whether it's true or not.  You need independent confirmation.
The very fact it had to be repeated probably indicates it's false.

And nice dodging the main part of my post, which is that it is undeniable that Obama is blocking release.  The question is why.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Okay, so you want independent verification that what the doctor said is true.......

What?  The fucking newspaper announcement, the birth certificate that WAS SHOWN (it's been on several news channels), as well as the many people who were their neighbors ain't good enough?

I'm gonna start calling you Rabbit, as your logic has obviously ran away quick.


----------



## Emma (Oct 20, 2009)

jvn said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



First and foremost, it won't stop the nutters. In the minds of a conspiracy theorist, evidence to the contrary only PROVES to them they are in the right, and the conspiracy is even more widespread than they suspected. 

Go back to when all this crap started. In spite of taking _every other candidate---ever_ at their word that they were eligible to serve, it was demanded of Obama that he produce a BC. Time and again I heard, _"if he were to ONLY show a birth certificate, I'd believe he was born in the US!"_

So he posts a copy of his birth certificate. 

_"It's a forgery!!!"_

It was proven not to be a forgery. 

_"But it's a COLB, not a birth certificate!"_

It was proven that this is all the Hawaiian DOH releases upon request for birth records. 

_"That doesn't matter! ANYONE can get a Hawaiian birth certificate stating they were born there!"_

That was proven wrong. 

_"Well what about this one from [Indonesia, Canada, Kenya, etc.]?"_

Proven to be fake.

_"That doesn't matter! An article from an online kenyan news site says he was 'Kenyan born'_"

Director of the Hawaiian DOH _and_ the Republican governor of Hawaii state Obama was born in Hawaii. 

_"They're in on it too!"_

Judge Land issues a blistering decision against O Rly. 

_"He's committing treason! Obama is forcing him to rule that way! He's in on it too!"_

And in anticipation that Judge Carter will do the same: 

_"Judge Carter is paid by the FEDS and ALL equipment/facilities, training etc are paid for by the FEDS. It is entirely possible that the USURPER* has used the courts funding to insert his MAFIA into the court system.

If the FEDS shut off the funding of Judge Carters court then what? Is the judge still a judge and can WE THE PEOPLE withold taxes from the income tax and pay those taxes to Judge Carters court.
We need a strategy that will GUARANTEE that a JUdge will have the LEGAL right to carry this case forward as shown in the trial schedule.
It is my VIEW that the USURPER is pushing the FOREIGNER onto judge Carter."_

*[i.e. President Obama]


Yeah. Giving the nutters what they demand will stop 'em. 

Not.


----------



## Emma (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> No, dweeb.  Not whether they said that.  Whether it's true or not.  You need independent confirmation.
> *The very fact it had to be repeated probably indicates it's false.*


Yeah. They're in on it too. Thanks for so readily proving my point made in the above post. 

I'm going to have to update my list of conspirators. Amazing how, considering the sheer number of people in on this fraud, no one has _spilled the beans_. 



> And nice dodging the main part of my post, which is that it is undeniable that Obama is blocking release.  The question is why.



Answered by your comment here (bolded), and my post to jvn.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 20, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



When questions arose about McCain there was a full and complete disclosure of all records pertaining to his birth.
That's how you deal with the issue when a question arises.  Assuming of course that everything is on the up and up.
Would that satisfy everyone?  No, nothing will.  But there are enough people like me who can't get past the stonewalling of this administration to think some kind of disclosure would solve the problem and can't understand why they won't.
And how in the hell does releasing information "weaken the presidency"??  That is the most Nixonian thing I've heard here so far.  And that isn't comforting.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 20, 2009)

Hey..........I never had the chance to see McStupid's birth certificate.

Got a link?  Probably not.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 20, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Hey..........I never had the chance to see McStupid's birth certificate.
> 
> Got a link?  Probably not.



I dont know who McStupid is.  Probably your real name.  Ask the registrar where you were born.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Hey..........I never had the chance to see McStupid's birth certificate.
> ...



McStupid is what I called John McCain during the election.

C'mon RabbiTURDS, try to keep up.  Did McCain show his?  If so, I haven't seen it yet, so therefore, he shouldn't have been in the election either.

After all.......McCain was actually born in a foreign country, although on a US base, but still, on a US base that we paid rent to a foreign country for.

Where's McCains birth certificate?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 20, 2009)

John McCain Birth Certificate

Here ya go, asshole.

Here's over 1000 pages of medical records, jerk off:
John McCain releases 1,173 pages of medical records - Times Online

Here's more stuff from that Right Wing organ, the Washington Post, moron.
John McCain's Birthplace - Fact Checker

Here is an investigation of his record at Annapolis.
McCain Profile: At the Naval Academy
When you can produce similar documentation by Obama we can talk.  Until then, the man is an undocumented worker.
And you're a moron.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 20, 2009)

McCain was a shitty pilot.  He lost 5 jets and didn't shoot down even one.  Yeah........I'm a 20 year Navy vet, so I know about McCain.

So.......why is it again that you won't accept Obama's?


----------



## Dr Grump (Oct 20, 2009)

Why waste your time with these birther morons. You could have a home movie of Obama being born at Monticello and they still wouldn't believe he was born in the US...nutbags the lot of them..


----------



## Emma (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> John McCain Birth Certificate


[channeling birthers]That's just an image on a computer screen. Prove it's for real. Prove his parents were born on US soil. _Where's the footprint???_





> Here's over 1000 pages of medical records, jerk off:
> John McCain releases 1,173 pages of medical records - Times Online
> 
> Here's more stuff from that Right Wing organ, the Washington Post, moron.
> ...


None of which is relevant to his (or anyone's) eligibility to serve as President. His BC proves his age and place of birth, and that he is eligible to serve.


----------



## xotoxi (Oct 20, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Here's over 1000 pages of medical records, jerk off:
> John McCain releases 1,173 pages of medical records - Times Online


 
Do you think I can get a copy of the images from John McCain's colonoscopy?  I'd like to frame them.


----------



## Care4all (Oct 21, 2009)

Hipocrisy is about with the Rabb...no?

He defends mccain and condemns Obama while the mccain lawsuit for him not being a citizen was *fought by mccain's lawyers and dismissed* by the courts on the same grounds that Obama's lawyers are using now as their defense.

So, It was okay with Mccain to fight the person challenging his NATURAL BORN citizenship and not okay for Obama?

When mccain was born in Panama and according to our immigration and naturalization laws at the time, he was not a citizen of the united states, even though his parents were citizens.

*One year after he was born,* a law was passed making children born in the panama canal zone to an american citizen was a citizen of the united states and they made it that those born in panama from 1904 onward,  an american citizen..BUT THE LAW DOES NOT make these people that were not citizens at birth, retroactively, "natural born citizens"....when mccain was born, he was not a citizen at all of the usa under the law at the time, his parents had to apply for citizenship for him through the naturalization process.

Mccain's group argues that a 1790 law that had expired showed the true intentions of our founding fathers on who would be a natural born citizen, which in this 1790 law it says that children born overseas to an american citizen is a natural born citizen.

This law was not in effect when mccain was born, nor was the law that made children born in panama to a citizen of the usa a citizen....

However, if you read the law the founding fathers had in 1790 and say, yes, this was their intent, that citizens that traveled overseas and ended up having a child, the child would be a natural born citizen and this is why mccain was a natural born citizen (though our aw at the time said otherwise) and eligible to be president of the usa, then you have to say that since Obama was born to a citizen of the usa, NO MATTER WHERE HE WAS BORN, is a natural born citizen of the usa.

This is the law now, and since the 70's I believe, ...anyone born to an american citizen overseas is a citizen at birth...with some small requirements....but at the time of mccain's birth and at the time of Obama's birth, it was not...even THOUGH this was the founding father's intent...immigration laws were toyed with constantly...

GAME OVER!  



> Lawsuit over McCain citizenship should be tossed, GOP lawyers say
> 
> By Josh Richman
> 
> ...


----------



## DiveCon (Oct 21, 2009)

no, care, its not game over

[youtube]2eMkth8FWno[/youtube]

not as long as they have "the black knight" mentality


----------



## mal (Oct 21, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> McCain was a shitty pilot.  He lost 5 jets and didn't shoot down even one.  Yeah........I'm a 20 year Navy vet, so I know about McCain.
> 
> So.......why is it again that you won't accept Obama's?



Has someone Provided it, or is it still just some Person @ a Hospital Vouching for it?...



peace...


----------



## ncarolinadixie (Oct 21, 2009)

tha malcontent said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > McCain was a shitty pilot.  He lost 5 jets and didn't shoot down even one.  Yeah........I'm a 20 year Navy vet, so I know about McCain.
> ...




hmmmmmmmmm maybe you should read up a bit on the facts regarding McCain's supposed loss of 5 planes. Here's a good LIBERAL site for you that details it quite nicely.

FactCheck.org: Did McCain crash five planes? Did he cause the 1967 Forrestal fire?

The very first of the FACTCHECK article says it all.........

Q: Did McCain crash five planes? Did he cause the 1967 Forrestal fire?
Is the information below true? I have heard that McCain crashed five planes. In searching the web I found this information. It was located at [DELETED]

Thank you for more information. 
A: No. Chain e-mails and Internet postings that make that claim are mistaken. One crash was found to be his fault, but the Navy commended his piloting skills.


----------



## mal (Oct 21, 2009)

ncarolinadixie said:


> tha malcontent said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...



I Thought you were Referring to Barry's BC...

Has that been Provided outside of a Hospital Spokesperson Vouching for it?



peace...


----------



## ncarolinadixie (Oct 21, 2009)

I was going on the "McCain was a shitty pilot" thing. I've given up on the BC situation. For some reason to many people see nothing wrong with the fact that he refuses to do the one thing that would shut the entire speculation down once and for all. Something that would take him mere minutes to do but will not for some reason. I don't really know what to believe and have gotten to where I don't really care one way or the other. It doesn't matter anyway. Even if by some chance it was proven that he wasn't eligible to run in the first place, changes would be made and rules would be changed, IMO, to make it possible for him to stay right where he's at. So IMO there really is no sense in worrying about it. He was selected and put in place by the powers that be and we mere mortals have no say in it one way or the other.


----------



## mal (Oct 21, 2009)

ncarolinadixie said:


> I was going on the "McCain was a shitty pilot" thing. I've given up on the BC situation. For some reason to many people see nothing wrong with the fact that he refuses to do the one thing that would shut the entire speculation down once and for all. Something that would take him mere minutes to do but will not for some reason. I don't really know what to believe and have gotten to where I don't really care one way or the other. It doesn't matter anyway. Even if by some chance it was proven that he wasn't eligible to run in the first place, changes would be made and rules would be changed, IMO, to make it possible for him to stay right where he's at. So IMO there really is no sense in worrying about it. He was selected and put in place by the powers that be and we mere mortals have no say in it one way or the other.



It's Bait... He doesn't Provide it because it's Raw Meat for those who would Obsess on other MORE Important things...

And it's Working.



peace...


----------



## Care4all (Oct 21, 2009)

ncarolinadixie said:


> I was going on the "McCain was a shitty pilot" thing. I've given up on the BC situation. For some reason to many people see nothing wrong with the fact that he refuses to do the one thing that would shut the entire speculation down once and for all. Something that would take him mere minutes to do but will not for some reason. I don't really know what to believe and have gotten to where I don't really care one way or the other. It doesn't matter anyway. Even if by some chance it was proven that he wasn't eligible to run in the first place, changes would be made and rules would be changed, IMO, to make it possible for him to stay right where he's at. So IMO there really is no sense in worrying about it. He was selected and put in place by the powers that be and we mere mortals have no say in it one way or the other.



I'm not so certain it would shut them down carolina...

After the long form birth certificate is released, they will take the Doctor and Hospital's name and try to find the doctor to see if he falsified the info...if he is dead, they will say that Obama had him killed to hide the fact that he was born somewhere else, even though he would be in to his 90's by now more than likely, and probably dead of natural causes...

Seriously, this is what they are looking for, not the certificate itself, because the legal certificate of live birth that was issued which is notarized, seal shown, that it matches the information on the original long birth certificate, honolulu, as his birth place will be on the original certificate as well...but the original will have the name of his mother's doctor and hospital on there and this is the info they want....imo.

His birth certificate from the honolulu hawaii hospital and doctor who delivered him was filed with the Hawaii State Health Registrar of Vital statistics less than 72 hours after his birth...

His mother could NOT have even made it back to hawaii from kenya and the 5 or so connecting flights home before his birth was already registered with the state?  That's impossible....in 1961?


----------



## Care4all (Oct 21, 2009)

tha malcontent said:


> ncarolinadixie said:
> 
> 
> > tha malcontent said:
> ...



will a link really matter to you...?

FactCheck.org: Born in the U.S.A.
Born in the U.S.A.
August 21, 2008
Updated: November 1, 2008
The truth about Obama's birth certificate.
Summary
In June, the Obama campaign released a digitally scanned image of his birth certificate to quell speculative charges that he might not be a natural-born citizen. But the image prompted more blog-based skepticism about the document's authenticity. And recently, author Jerome Corsi, whose book attacks Obama, said in a TV interview that the birth certificate the campaign has is "fake."

We beg to differ. FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.

Update, Nov. 1: The director of Hawaiis Department of Health confirmed Oct. 31 that Obama was born in Honolulu.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> McCain was a shitty pilot.  He lost 5 jets and didn't shoot down even one.  Yeah........I'm a 20 year Navy vet, so I know about McCain.
> 
> So.......why is it again that you won't accept Obama's?



So your response is to attack McCain's character?  Pretty big of you.
When Obama's side can point to that much material released then I'll believe that there is nothing to hide.
But we havent seen the birth certificate.
We havent seen his college records
We havent seen anything.  The man is a total cipher with a faked biography.  No wonder it excites the paranoid in this country.
McCain released information.  Obama has behaved like a guilty party.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

Care4all said:


> Hipocrisy is about with the Rabb...no?
> 
> He defends mccain and condemns Obama while the mccain lawsuit for him not being a citizen was *fought by mccain's lawyers and dismissed* by the courts on the same grounds that Obama's lawyers are using now as their defense.
> 
> ...


Except it has nothing to do with Obama.  With McCain the facts are known and established.  With Obama no one knows anything for sure, except Obama and he ain't telling.
Your arguments are weak, at best.  Laughable most likely.


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> John McCain Birth Certificate
> 
> Here ya go, asshole.....
> 
> ...




Now, I think McCain was eligible, never doubted it - but I not have a few comments on your links.  

 There is a lie - either on the Birth Certificate (doubt it) or with the reporter who was "show(n)" McCain's BC by the campaign. 

*--------------> Wanna see it?*
​ 
Look, from the article you posted:

"As I reported earlier, the McCain campaign has declined to publicly release the senator's birth certificate. B*ut a senior campaign official showed me a copy of his birth certificate issued by the "family hospital" in the Coco Solo submarine base*. (McCain's grandfather commanded the Coco Solo Naval Air Station in 1936; his father was the executive officer of a submarine based in Coco Solo.)" John McCain's Birthplace - Fact Checker​Now look at his birth certificate (obtained by plaintiffs, with sworn affidavits) released in regard to the lawsuit (that McCain fought to have thrown out).

Here it is --------------------
... note the part where it says "Hospital:"






What does it  say?  That's right*. Colon Hospital*, not "Family Hospital," not CoCo Solo, as the article "verifying" to that reporter of McCain's birthplace.

For the record:   Colon is the capital of Colon Province in the Republic of Panama. *Never at any time has Colon been a part of the Panama Canal Zone, or any other entity, military or civilian, controlled by the U.S. Government*. Colon has for the entirety of its 150 year history been wholly a part of the Republic of Panama.
 Therefore Senator McCain was born in the Republic of Panama. Not on base.

 Therefore Senator McCain may be as much a citizen of Panama as the United States.

It should be noted, the *CoCo Solo Hospital was not built until 1941.*
 The order to build it was not given until December of 1941.  
---> Franklin D. Roosevelt: Executive Order 8981 - NAVY HOSPITAL AREA, COCO SOLO, CANAL ZONE 

Why would MCain and the reporter lie about the location of his birth? 

I will reiterate: McCain was eligible to me,  I do find this curious though.



> With McCain the facts are known and established.


No, they are not. 

No matter how you slice it - there is a lie there.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

There is no lie.
WIth Obama there is no evidence at all.


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> There is no lie.
> WIth Obama there is no evidence at all.


Are you unable to read?

There is a lie there and you know it.

I will repeat it.  Try reading slower this time:

----



Now, I think McCain was eligible, never doubted it - but I not have a few comments on your links.  

 There is a lie - either on the Birth Certificate (doubt it) or with the reporter who was "show(n)" McCain's BC by the campaign. 

*--------------> Wanna see it?*
​ 
Look, from the article you posted:
"As I reported earlier, the McCain campaign has declined to publicly release the senator's birth certificate. B*ut a senior campaign official showed me a copy of his birth certificate issued by the "family hospital" in the Coco Solo submarine base*. (McCain's grandfather commanded the Coco Solo Naval Air Station in 1936; his father was the executive officer of a submarine based in Coco Solo.)" John McCain's Birthplace - Fact Checker​Now look at his birth certificate (obtained by plaintiffs, with sworn affidavits) released in regard to the lawsuit (that McCain fought to have thrown out).

Here it is --------------------
... note the part where it says "Hospital:"







What does it  say?  That's right*. Colon Hospital*, not "Family Hospital," not CoCo Solo, as the article "verifying" to that reporter of McCain's birthplace.

For the record:   Colon is the capital of Colon Province in the Republic of Panama. *Never at any time has Colon been a part of the Panama Canal Zone, or any other entity, military or civilian, controlled by the U.S. Government*. Colon has for the entirety of its 150 year history been wholly a part of the Republic of Panama.
 Therefore Senator McCain was born in the Republic of Panama. Not on base.

 Therefore Senator McCain may be as much a citizen of Panama as the United States.

It should be noted, the *CoCo Solo Hospital was not built until 1941.*
 The order to build it was not given until December of 1941.  
---> Franklin D. Roosevelt: Executive Order 8981 - NAVY HOSPITAL AREA, COCO SOLO, CANAL ZONE 

Why would MCain and the reporter lie about the location of his birth? 

I will reiterate: McCain was eligible to me,  I do find this curious though.



> With McCain the facts are known and established.


No, they are not. 

No matter how you slice it - there is a lie there.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

There is no lie.  The existence and provenance of the hospital was verified.

The only lie is that Obama has a valid BC showing he was born in Hawaii.


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> There is no lie.  The existence and provenance of the hospital was verified.
> 
> The only lie is that Obama has a valid BC showing he was born in Hawaii.


Willfully blind.

Like all conspiracy theorists. 

That's why you folks are considered the fringe of the fringe of the fringe.  A joke to most thinking human beings.


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> ...
> Here's over 1000 pages of medical records, jerk off:
> John McCain releases 1,173 pages of medical records - Times Online
> 
> ....



Yes, he did "release" them, sort of."The campaign will allow television reporters and three news services -- Bloomberg, Reuters and the Associated Press -- to review the records, in addition to the two newspapers. The reporters will have three hours to view about 400 pages and will not be allowed to photocopy them."

John McCain is releasing medical records, to a few - Los Angeles Times

"Only certain news networks and newspapers will be permitted to enter the room, and they will have only three hours to examine the papers. No cell phones or Internet access will be allowed in the room, located in a resort outside Phoenix, Arizona. Copying the records is also prohibited.
 Anyone who leaves the room for any reason except the bathroom will not be allowed back." ​McCain was not as forthcoming as you purport him to be.  Obama *did* release a summary of his medical records. ​Obama releases medical information: "excellent health." - Lynn Sweet



> When you can produce similar documentation by Obama we can talk.


You can't produce them either. A few guys were able to see McCain's records for 3 hours, with strict guidelines. 
Obama's summary by his doctor is _producable. _

​You continue to fail, Rab.  Regardless, medical records are not required to be released.  It is up to the campaign if and how they release them.​​


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

paperview said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > There is no lie.  The existence and provenance of the hospital was verified.
> ...



I think you're referring to yourself.
Compare the tremendous data available on McCain to that on Obama.  The differences ought to be immediately apparant to anyone with two brain cells.  What was Obama's GPA?  How did he pay for his education?  What classes did he take?  No one knows.
McCain's birth is probably one of the best documented events on earth.  Obama's is about like Jesus'.  Next they'll be saying he was born in a manger.


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



  What a riot. 

Tell me Rab:  What hospital was McCain born in?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

John McCain was born on August 29, 1936 at Coco Solo Naval Air Station in the Panama Canal Zone, Panama, to naval officer John S. McCain, Jr. (19111981) and Roberta (Wright) McCain (b. 1912).[2] At that time, the Panama Canal was under U.S. control.[3]


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> John McCain was born on August 29, 1936 at Coco Solo Naval Air Station in the Panama Canal Zone, Panama, to naval officer John S. McCain, Jr. (19111981) and Roberta (Wright) McCain (b. 1912).[2] At that time, the Panama Canal was under U.S. control.[3]


So why does his birth certificate (the one you linked to earlier) say* Colon Hospital?*

What hospital was he born in?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

I guess you've answered your own question.

But no one has answered my question:  Why is the Obama Administration spending time and money to block release of any records that pertain to his birth or schooling?  It is undeniable they are.  The question remains why?


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> I guess you've answered your own question.
> 
> But no one has answered my question:  Why is the Obama Administration spending time and money to block release of any records that pertain to his birth or schooling?  It is undeniable they are.  The question remains why?



great point Rabbi.good job of taking him to school.


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> I guess you've answered your own question.
> 
> ...



No.  It has not been answered, and you know it.

You said: "*McCain's birth is probably one of the best documented events on earth."*

So...what hospital was he born in?

C'mon, I know you can answer it.

Can't you?


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

Rab won't answer the question, and he knows why. *He can't.*

If he says it's the _*Coco Solo Family Hospital*_, as  McCain and his campaign said, then why does his Birth certificate state _*Colon Hospital  *_(Colon never being part of the PCZ).

If Rab says he was born at the Colon Hospital, as his BC states,  then why does McCain say CoCo Solo? 

And why wouldn't Mccain release his BC?

Questions.  Questions. 

Water under the bridge? Sure.  But you're not going to get away with making statements about how honest and forthcoming McCain was in this regard, to cherry top it with this nonsense: " "*McCain's birth is probably one of the best documented events on earth."

*Laughable.If it's so _documented_, why can't he answer the question?


----------



## candycorn (Oct 21, 2009)

the rabbi said:


> i guess you've answered your own question.
> 
> But no one has answered my question:  Why is the obama administration spending time and money to block release of any records that pertain to his birth or schooling?  It is undeniable they are.  The question remains why?



*any proof to back up what you say?

No?

Next!
*


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

candycorn said:


> the rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > i guess you've answered your own question.
> ...



Proof of what?  That they havent released any birth or educational records?  If they have, please post the links!
No links?
It must be true.
Another Obamabot.
NEXT!


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

paperview said:


> Rab won't answer the question, and he knows why. *He can't.*
> 
> If he says it's the _*Coco Solo Family Hospital*_, as  McCain and his campaign said, then why does his Birth certificate state _*Colon Hospital  *_(Colon never being part of the PCZ).
> 
> ...



The base is located in Colon.  The building still there from the base are inside the city of Colon.  Panama Guide - Reuters - John McCain Born in Racially Segregated Panama Canal Zone (Honkey Muth'a)
There is no contradiction here.  There is no problem.  And there is no conspiracy.
The only conspiracy is to prevent anyone from learning about barack Obama's past.  The question is why?  What are they hiding??


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > Rab won't answer the question, and he knows why. *He can't.*
> ...


No, it is not.  Not even your slurpy link says that.
(you might guide your eyes to the bottom of that page as well. 

Coco Solo is _near_ Colon, not part of it. 

His BC states he was BORN IN THE *COLON HOSPITAL*.

_Colon is the capital of Colon Province in the Republic of Panama. Never at any time has Colon been a part of the Panama Canal Zone, or any other entity, military or civilian, controlled by the U.S. Government. *Colon has for the entirety of its 150 year history been wholly a part of the Republic of Panama.

*_Notice fellow readers, Rab can't say what hospital MCain was born in.

_*Notice?*_


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

The question is settled for anyone with two functioning brain cells.

But mine remains: Why is Obama fighting release of any of his records?  What is he hiding?  What is it they don't want us to see??


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

> The question is settled for anyone with two functioning brain cells.



Notice fellow readers, Rab can't say what hospital MCain was born in.

_*Notice?*_


----------



## paperview (Oct 21, 2009)

This while he claims:  *"McCain's birth is probably one of the best documented events on earth."

*lol.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 21, 2009)

Where McCain was born doesn't come into play, He was born the son of an American Serviceman serving abroad. He was born as an American citizen same as my own son who was born in Germany.

Mr Obama however is hiding something. What we do not know. It is probably something really stupid. But the longer he hides the more people will believe he is hiding his non-citizenship.

He could end the debate very easily, yet refuses.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Where McCain was born doesn't come into play, He was born the son of an American Serviceman serving abroad. He was born as an American citizen same as my own son who was born in Germany.
> 
> Mr Obama however is hiding something. What we do not know. It is probably something really stupid. But the longer he hides the more people will believe he is hiding his non-citizenship.
> 
> He could end the debate very easily, yet refuses.



Which raises the question, why?  What does he gain by witholding?  It was theorized that Barack Obama was not actually listed as the father.  Still, who would really care?  Embarassing, yes.  But not his fault.  It wouldn't change my opinion of him at all.


----------



## Emma (Oct 21, 2009)

Who do you think is his father if not Obama Sr. ?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

Emma said:


> Who do you think is his father if not Obama Sr. ?



Harry Belafonte.

I have absolutely no idea.  That was one idea someone somewhere floated.  It is about as good as any other explanation for why he would refuse to release something that no one else has had trouble showing.


----------



## Emma (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Who do you think is his father if not Obama Sr. ?
> ...



The problem being... he _did_ show his birth certificate. The only form the Hawaii DOH releases.

And since he did do so, my prior post explains why he shouldn't cave to the birfers.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 21, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Well, no really he didnt.  You are simply lying here.


----------



## DiveCon (Oct 21, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


shes not lying
he released his COLB
and THAT IS what the Hawaiian DoH releases


----------



## Emma (Oct 21, 2009)

What he said


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Actually they never released that either.  Only a scan, which has probably been altered.
Anyway, we know the doctor who delivered McCain, since his birth is one of the best attested events in the century.
WHo was the doctor who delivered Obama?  What hospital was it in?  Where are the hospital records?
The Hawaiin DoH could release whatever the person in question wants released, esp if it happens to be the president of the US.
And since he did not release his birth certficiate she is certainly lying.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...




No he did not.  I cannot yet post links here but if you google Hawaii Birth certificate 1963 you will see what one looks like. It has the name of the Hospital, Signature of attendant, parents signature and the local registrars signature. Obama hasn't shown his.


----------



## Care4all (Oct 22, 2009)

bullcrap on that one rabb....his official COLB was released with the raised seal on it....

and NO WHERE in our constitution does it say YOU HAVE THE RIGHT to know who delivered them in delivery...THAT is NONE of your darn business....

you only need proof of citizenship at birth....that's it.  And the COLB from the State of Hawaii for obama is the legal document released by the state, which states such....besides the fact that our State dept had to approve his eligibility and got a notorized copy of the COLB, as part of their vetting....  i am pretty certain on that...


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


Since 2000 (or '01), the COLB is the only form Hawaii releases upon request for a birth certificate.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

Care4all said:


> bullcrap on that one rabb....his official COLB was released with the raised seal on it....
> 
> and NO WHERE in our constitution does it say YOU HAVE THE RIGHT to know who delivered them in delivery...THAT is NONE of your darn business....
> 
> you only need proof of citizenship at birth....that's it.  And the COLB from the State of Hawaii for obama is the legal document released by the state, which states such....besides the fact that our State dept had to approve his eligibility and got a notorized copy of the COLB, as part of their vetting....  i am pretty certain on that...



Have you seen the document?  Has anyone actually seen the document?  Not a scan of a document, but the document itself?
Since Obama is the president of the US I have every right as an American to know everything there is to know about him.
Where does it say that the State Dept approves candidates??  Hello??


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Has anyone actually seen the document?  Not a scan of a document, but the document itself?



Yes.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Oh......I get it.......so you think the fabricated one from Kenya (which has more than a few strange things on it), is the REAL one?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

No.
I truly don't know what the answer is.  But I come back to, why isn't the administration releasing this information given the number of questions out there?  When someone can answer that satisfactorily I will have my answer.  But the lack of transparency is appalling.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

Might be the most honest thing I've heard you say on here Rabbit.


----------



## Care4all (Oct 22, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > bullcrap on that one rabb....his official COLB was released with the raised seal on it....
> ...



i haven't seen any certificate of live birth or birth certificate from any president in my lifetime *in person, *have you?  

do you think the head of hawaii's State Health department of Vital statistics, a republican, who verified that his birth certificate for the state of hawaii was on file and that he was born in hawaii was not enough?

Factcheck . org also TOUCHED his colb with the RAISED NOTARIZED SEAL.....  i posted this for you before?  why ignore it?

FactCheck.org: Born in the U.S.A.

you have no legal right for his personal info...we are protected from such, under the law


----------



## Care4all (Oct 22, 2009)

Please birthers, show us ONE BIRTH CERTIFICATE issued by the State of Hawaii, where the Child listed on the Hawaiian Birth Certificate, was not Born in Hawaii.

Just show one case of this...if you think it can happen then show us one...show us how this could legally be done.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

Care4all said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



Because every president until now was not just born in the US but his parents were Americans.  Obama is the first one who's father was not a US citizen.
We have a right to any and every piece of information when it comes to the President.  Especially where questions as to his qualification for office arise.  Nothing should be off limits here.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

http://www.wnd.com/images/090728birthcert.gif

Why can't Obama show this again?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

You're an idiot the first water Ollie.

"Well, gee Ollie, I can't see any reason that you should continue being an idiot".


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

great response.  Not.

Yes, what is so hard about making that document available?  Unless, of course, it doesn't exist.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

It's already been displayed online, on MSNBC, CNN and other stations.

The only ones that deny it are the morons like Orly Taitz (who incidentally is not from the USA), as well as the fact that she THINKS that to become a natural born citizen your parents have to have been born here as well.

Unfortunately, that ain't the case.  Ever hear of "anchor babies"?  Those are the kids born to illegals, but because the child was born here, they are native born Americans.

Nope.....it's all bullshit.

Besides..........why the fuck are supposedly patriotic Americans taking the word of a stupid Russian/Jewish chick?


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Because every president until now was not just born in the US but his parents were Americans.


Wrong.


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> http://www.wnd.com/images/090728birthcert.gif
> 
> Why can't Obama show this again?



Because that isn't his?


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

btw Rabbi...

Are you saying President Obama is not the legitimate president and therefore wouldn't be eligible as a "natural born citizen' simply because his father was not an American citizen?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

Emma said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > http://www.wnd.com/images/090728birthcert.gif
> ...




No shit Sherlock. So why cannot Mr Obama show the one that looks just like it with his name on it. You know the one that shows the name of the hospital, the signature of attending physician, parents signature, and local registrars signature. That's all he need do and this controversy is over.

SO tell us why he cannot end this show.....


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> It's already been displayed online, on MSNBC, CNN and other stations.
> 
> The only ones that deny it are the morons like Orly Taitz (who incidentally is not from the USA), as well as the fact that she THINKS that to become a natural born citizen your parents have to have been born here as well.
> 
> ...



Didn't they teach you anything in the Navy?  No one has shown the Actual Birth Certificate with Attending Physicians signature, along with the local registrars signature, and the name of the Hospital. Simple solution is for him to have it shown. Why won't he do that?


----------



## paperview (Oct 22, 2009)




----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > It's already been displayed online, on MSNBC, CNN and other stations.
> ...



What?  Yes, they did teach me stuff in the Navy.  Mainly how to avoid being a tent dwelling knuckle dragging sloping foreheaded Neanderthal.

Takes more talent and smarts to survive on the water than it does on the land.  While I do enjoy camping as a hobby, it leaves much to be desired as a lifestyle.

You DO realize that Hawaii is just one of the 50 STATES that we have, right?  And, you also understand that each state has it's own way of doing things, right?

Just because Podunk Holler in the redneck country has different ways, don't mean that they are the only ones that can tell us how stuff is done.

Apparently, you didn't learn shit in the Army.  Fuck dude...you wouldn't even make a good bullet sponge.  What's your specialty?  Supply?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

Wow, are you dumb.  Take a good look at the form Olly posted.  It is from Hawaii.  That is his point.  If Obama was born there, then he has one that looks pretty much like it.  So where is that form?  Why aren't they releasing it?  It would quell virtually all of the controversy.

And I'd like to see one that lists his father race as "Negro" which was the proper term in 1961, rather than the absurd "African" in the online farce passed off.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...



You know I normally have a lot of respect for any veteran, and even more for retirees. But in your case you are just fucking stupid. In fact one of the dumbest squids i've ever heard of. You compare a Hawaiian Birth Certificate to redneck country? Who was the attending Physician asswipe? Which Hospital? Who was the local Registrar? All that Information is on a Hawaiian Birth certificate in 1961. It's not on what Obama has shown us.

Is that so hard to understand?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



No...........I didn't compare Hawaii's birth certificate to redneck country, I compared YOUR UNDERSTANDING of birth certificates to redneck country.

Like I said......where'd ya work, Supply?  I'm figuring a REMF quartermaster.......

And, the doctor has been interviewed, as well as many others.  Not my fault the Army gave you a lobotomy.

Kudos to your plastic surgeon by the way, your hair pretty much covers the scar.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

Ok, I can see that you have no respect nor will you ever present an intelligent argument. Enjoy life fool.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Ok, I can see that you have no respect nor will you ever present an intelligent argument. Enjoy life fool.



Actually, I DO enjoy life.  Retired at 38, been to 26 different countries, 49 different states, have the ability to go where I want, as well as enough to eat, and a beer every now and again.

I also don't listen to FAUX Noise.  Stress and lies will kill you quick, and you won't enjoy life.

Like I said.......why the fuck is a supposed patriot such as yourself, believing some Russian/Israeli chick, who IS NOT A CITIZEN OF THIS COUNTRY?

Why do you trust her over all the people interviewed?  The only thing I can figure is that they removed 3/4ths of your brain.

It's been hashed out repeatedly.  Not my fault that you can't think for yourself and have decided to follow conspiracy theories.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 22, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Ok, I can see that you have no respect nor will you ever present an intelligent argument. Enjoy life fool.
> ...



I believe what my eyes see not what some noise tells me. I tell you that Mr Obama is hiding something, You are too stupid to see that and insult me instead. You are dismissed.


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



*The only document the state of Hawaii releases upon request for a birth certificate is the COLB. *


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Wow, are you dumb.  Take a good look at the form Olly posted.  It is from Hawaii.  That is his point.  If Obama was born there, then he has one that looks pretty much like it.



The one posted was issued in '63.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

BikerSailor responds to valid points by being insulting.  He might as well write "you're right, I'm wrong.  I have broccoli in my ears and listen to voices in my head."

I'd love to see a Hawaiin birth certificate where someone there was actually Black.  I'd bet $50 it does not list the person's race as "African."


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Wow, are you dumb.  Take a good look at the form Olly posted.  It is from Hawaii.  That is his point.  If Obama was born there, then he has one that looks pretty much like it.
> ...



And Obama was born in 1961.  So it's pretty close.
FWIW, I was born in 1962 in NY and my birth certificate looks pretty much like the one posted here in this thread.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

Emma said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Obviously that's yet another lie from you since we've seen a Hawaiian birth certificate right here on this thread.


----------



## Emma (Oct 22, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


The ones issued at that time, yeah. 

*The only document the state of Hawaii issues upon request for a birth certificate is the COLB.* And it's been that way since '01.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 22, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Motherfucker, ain't no way in hell some Supply puke is gonna "dismiss" me.

Like I said, not my fault you choose ignorance and stupidity.  The only reason that people brought this up in the first place is because people asked about McCain FIRST.

The GOP just figured that a conspiracy that sounded close to the one that McCain went against would work, as they had already weathered theirs, and thought that it would sink Obama.

What was your ASVAB score, 33?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

BikerSailor gets more and more incoherent and beligerent.  Life is tough.  It's even tougher when you're stupid.
Actually the thread started with a news story that referred to Obama as Kenyan born.  It isn't like newspapers never make mistakes on facts.
So I am back to "why will the Obama campaign not release his birth certificate, or any other records about him"?
I think BikerSailor is dismissed from this discussion for insubordination to the truth and countermanding a direct order of common sense.


----------



## paperview (Oct 22, 2009)

God bless the Birthers, 

for they give us a never ending supply of nutball fruitcakery.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 22, 2009)

paperview said:


> god bless the birthers,
> 
> for they give us a never ending supply of nutball fruitcakery.


----------



## paperview (Oct 22, 2009)




----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

Obamabots:


----------



## paperview (Oct 22, 2009)

You gotta know you're pretty whacked when Ann Coulter, David Horowitz, Sean Hannity and Michelle Malkin thinks you're loopy-headed fringers. 

I mean, how bad is_* that*_?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 22, 2009)

paperview said:


> You gotta know you're pretty whacked when Ann Coulter, David Horowitz, Sean Hannity and Michelle Malkin thinks you're loopy-headed fringers.
> 
> I mean, how bad is_* that*_?



When did you develop respect for them???


----------



## JD_2B (Oct 22, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



His dad was Kenyan.. The people of Kenya believe that the child is of the father, not the mother, regardless of where the child was born. 

Also, because of their absolutely terrible government, they would love to have Obama lead them.. 



> The absolute support that Kenyans offer Obama comes from the fact that his father was Kenyan, which, according to our tradition, makes him our own. In most of our tribal cultures, a child belongs to the father. This overshadows the fact that his mother was a white American. Likewise, the fact that Obama doesn't hold Kenyan citizenship, or speak any Kenyan language, is insignificant. Kenyans, especially those from his father's home province of Nyanza, love him so much that they have already renamed a primary school and a high school in his honor. In Kenyan bars, you can order "Obama beer," a brew that used to be named "Senator" long before he became one.
> 
> In addition to the pride that Obama has bestowed upon our country by having a successful political career in the most powerful nation in the world, many of us see a future President Obama as a godsend who would deliver our country from its miseries -- something our corrupt, tribalist leaders have failed to do.
> 
> ...



FRONTLINE/WORLD . Dispatches . Dispatches . Obama: The Kenya Connection | PBS


----------



## BolshevikHunter (Oct 23, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



Shhhhhhh! You're providing crystal clear facts to brainwashed morons (on both sides) who refuse to see them. You're also pissing off the International Socialist Bankers who own The Madman Obama and The United States of America as well. ~BH


----------



## Care4all (Oct 23, 2009)

BolshevikHunter said:


> Elutherian said:
> 
> 
> > Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate
> ...



But WHAT, for the love of God, is so CHRYSTAL CLEAR?  please tell us clearly how you are not the one that has been blinded by your brainwashing or are in moron status *as you accuse others of being in*??

WHAT is so crystal clear to you?  An article from a kenyan newspaper, that has no Writer/Author/Journalist attributed to it?  when ALL OTHER ARTICLES in this same archive do?  Or because someone in kenya is calling him kenyan born, via this strange, unattributed article, that is FACT to you?

There is nothing that this ''find'' cleared up on the issue imo!



care


----------



## DiveCon (Oct 23, 2009)

Care4all said:


> BolshevikHunter said:
> 
> 
> > Elutherian said:
> ...


Care, it is not unusual for an AP article to not have the writers name attributed to it
just "AP"


----------



## OFACal (Oct 23, 2009)

> I can't help myself, I just gotta do it..............and just how do you know that THEY spelled it wrong. Maybe the current spelling is the one that is wrong. lol Sorry, I couldn't help myself.



Well, if that were the case, than it would prove the birthers wrong, because that's not how it's spelled on the 'Kenyan Birth Certificate' which was made before the place even existed.


----------



## Care4all (Oct 23, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > BolshevikHunter said:
> ...



well, it did have AP after the article at the very bottom after blank space, is that common when you are attributing the article to the AP though?

and i understand that the kenyan newspapers could have been scrubbed but do you think the AP really could have been?

 and ALL mirror sites to the AP... because i have searched their archives high and low, and there is no such article?

and all articles in the archive of this paper was attributed to a writer...ALL OF THEM....from all the different days i went in to their archive on, except this one article....it just stood out as not being consistent with this paper...

care


----------



## DiveCon (Oct 23, 2009)

Care4all said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...


maybe they only archive their own writers and not the AP stories
and, the site it was found on was an independent archive site
i have no doubt the Kenyan paper did print that story and then removed their mistake
its not like that doesnt happen here as well


----------



## Care4all (Oct 23, 2009)

Well, I just figured out I could not find it on the AP archive...because i was searching for it under the title the Sunday Standard News paper gave to it...Kenyan Born, Barak Obama....

But I just found THIS from SNOPES.COM

And once again, another flub up...

The AP NEVER SAID KENYAN BORN...
er
The Kenyan newspaper put that in...and if you read the link that jd gave on how there was obama LOVE in kenya bigtime...  and it also makes sense why the article was scrubbed if it was scrubbed, because the article took the liberty to quote the AP as the source while they modified the article by putting in Kenyan born....  not too kosher or legal...

snopes.com: AP Reports Obama as 'Kenyan-Born'


----------



## Care4all (Oct 23, 2009)

Claim:   A June 2004 Associated Press article identified Barack Obama as "Kenyan-born."

	FALSE

Example:   [Collected via e-mail, October 2009]

What most people know is that the Associated Press (AP) is one of the largest, internationally recognized, syndicated news services. What most people don't know that is in 2004, the AP was a "birther" news organization.

How so? Because in a syndicated report, published Sunday, June 27, 2004, by the Kenyan Standard Times, and which was, as of this report, available here.

The AP reporter stated the following:

Kenyan-born US Senate hopeful, Barrack Obama, appeared set to take over the Illinois Senate seat after his main rival, Jack Ryan, dropped out of the race on Friday night amid a furor over lurid sex club allegations.



Origins:   A popular item of "birther" chatter in October 2009 concerned the discovery of an archived copy of a 27 June 2004 article from the web version of the Kenyan-based Sunday Standard newspaper. The article was a
reproduction of an Associated Press (AP) wire story which dealt with the withdrawal of Republican candidate Jack Ryan from the race for a seat representing Illinois in the U.S. Senate, paving the way for the Democratic contender, Barack Obama, to win the election. Why this article was of particular interest to birthers was its lead-in sentence, which referred to Barack Obama as "Kenyan-born." Surely, claimed birthers, such an august news agency as the Associated Press would not have identified Barack Obama as "Kenyan-born" if they did not have ample evidence to support its use of that term.

However, the Associated Press made no such reference; the identification of Barack Obama as "Kenyan-born" was added to the Sunday Standard's version of the AP story by someone else (who misspelled the politician's given name as "Barrack" in the process) and is apparently unique to that publication. The full text of the "Jack Ryan Abandons Senate Bid" article as originally issued by the Associated Press is retrievable from the LexisNexis archive of global news sources, and it contains no reference (in the lead-in or elsewhere) to Barack Obama's being "Kenyan-born":

Associated Press Online

June 25, 2004 Friday

Illinois' Jack Ryan Abandons Senate Bid

BYLINE: MAURA KELLY LANNAN; Associated Press Writer
SECTION: NATIONAL POLITICAL NEWS
LENGTH: 768 words
DATELINE: CHICAGO


Illinois Senate candidate Jack Ryan dropped out of the race Friday amid a furor over lurid sex club allegations that horrified fellow Republicans and caused his once-promising candidacy to implode in four short days.

"It's clear to me that a vigorous debate on the issues most likely could not take place if I remain in the race," Ryan, 44, said in a statement. "What would take place, rather, is a brutal, scorched-earth campaign - the kind of campaign that has turned off so many voters, the kind of politics I refuse to play."

The campaign began to come apart Monday following the release of embarrassing records from Ryan's divorce. In those records, his ex-wife, "Boston Public" actress Jeri Ryan, said Ryan took her to kinky sex clubs in Paris, New York and New Orleans and tried to get her to perform sex acts with him while others watched.

Ryan disputed the allegations, saying he and his wife went to one "avant-garde" club in Paris and left because they felt uncomfortable.

In quitting the race, Ryan lashed out at the media and said it was "truly outrageous" that the Chicago Tribune got a judge to unseal the records.

"The media has gotten out of control," he said.

Top Illinois Republicans immediately began the work of selecting a new candidate. Their choice will become an instant underdog against Democratic state Sen. Barack Obama in the campaign for the seat of retiring GOP Sen. Peter Fitzgerald. Obama held a wide lead even before the scandal broke.

"I feel for him actually," Obama said on WLS-AM. "What he's gone through over the last three days I think is something you wouldn't wish on anybody. Unfortunately, I think our politics has gotten so personalized and cutthroat that it's very difficult for people to want to get in the business."

Ryan had faced mounting pressure to quit from party leaders, who met several times in Washington this week to discuss whether the campaign could survive.

"He really was a dead man walking," Gary MacDougal, former Illinois Republican Party chairman.

Ryan conducted an overnight poll to gauge his support. After reviewing the results, Ryan's advisers told the candidate that the only way to survive would be wage an extremely negative and expensive response.

"Jack Ryan made the right decision. I know it must have been a difficult one," said House Speaker Dennis Hastert of Illinois, who made his feelings known by canceling a fund-raising event scheduled for Thursday with Ryan.

Ryan was a political neophyte when he got into the race - a millionaire investment banker who had left business four years ago to teach at an all-boys parochial school in Chicago. He spent $3 million of his own fortune to win the primary.

With his good looks and Harvard background, Ryan was seen by many as the party's best hope for revitalizing the Illinois GOP. The party lost control of the governor's office and nearly every statewide office two years ago in the wake of a corruption scandal involving then-Gov. George Ryan, who has since been indicted. He is not related to Jack Ryan.

During the primary, Ryan waved off rumors of damaging sex allegations in his sealed divorce records, assuring state officials there was nothing in the file to worry about.

But the Tribune and Chicago TV station WLS sued for the records' release, and a California judge ordered them unsealed. The couple fought to keep the records sealed, saying the release could harm their 9-year-old son.

"The fact that the Chicago Tribune sues for access to sealed custody documents and then takes unto itself the right to publish details of a custody dispute - over the objections of two parents who agree that the re-airing of their arguments will hurt their ability to co-parent their child and hurt their child - is truly outrageous," he said.

Although most party leaders abandoned Ryan, Fitzgerald said Friday that he had encouraged him to stay in the race. "I think the public stoning of Jack Ryan is one of the most grotesque things I've seen in politics," the senator said.

He said the party's bigwigs pushed Ryan out: "It was like piranhas. They smelled blood in the water and they just devoured him."

Ryan won the GOP primary by more than 10 percentage points over his two closest rivals, dairy owner James Oberweis and state Sen. Steve Rauschenberger.

Both Oberweis and Rauschenberger said this week that they would step in as Ryan's replacement if party leaders asked. Other possible candidates mentioned include U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald, former Gov. Jim Edgar and Sen. Fitzgerald, though all three have said they are not interested.


Likewise, archived versions of U.S. newspapers that published the same AP wire story (such as the San Diego Union-Tribune and the Seattle Times) do not include lead-ins identifying Barack Obama as "Kenyan-born."

Last updated:   19 October 2009

The URL for this page is snopes.com: AP Reports Obama as 'Kenyan-Born'

Urban Legends Reference Pages © 1995-2009 by Barbara and David P. Mikkelson.
This material may not be reproduced without permission.
snopes and the snopes.com logo are registered service marks of snopes.com.


Sources:

    Lannan, Maura Kelly.   "Illinois' Jack Ryan Abandons Senate Bid."
        Associated Press.   25 June 2004.


----------



## paperview (Oct 23, 2009)

Care4all said:


> Well, I just figured out I could not find it on the AP archive...because i was searching for it under the title the Sunday Standard News paper gave to it...Kenyan Born, Barak Obama....
> 
> But I just found THIS from SNOPES.COM
> 
> ...




Well done care4all.


----------



## MaggieMae (Oct 23, 2009)

paperview said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > Well, I just figured out I could not find it on the AP archive...because i was searching for it under the title the Sunday Standard News paper gave to it...Kenyan Born, Barak Obama....
> ...



Ditto that. However, the Birthers don't believe Snopes either because every lie that's gone viral about the Obamas can be found there. Just another evil liberal web page they say.


----------



## Liability (Oct 23, 2009)

rayboyusmc said:


> When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.
> 
> Now we can post whatever we want and it becomes right wing gospel.
> 
> Sad little people who don't like to lose fair and square.



Wrong.  Dan Rather got canned for presenting forged papers -- period.  There is no such fucking thing as a forged letter that is also "true."  If it is "forged," then it is by definition "false."


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 23, 2009)

Liability said:


> rayboyusmc said:
> 
> 
> > When Dan Rather used shit like this, he got fired even though the forged documents were true about Bush' service or lack thereof.
> ...



That actually highlights the whole liberal mindset.  Yeah its true the papers were forged.  But we "know" that Bush was a creepy little weasel so the papers were true even though they were a forgery.

Facts are secondary to these folks.  Their worldview makes facts, not the other way around.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 23, 2009)

Know why people keep coming up with bullshit like this?

Simple actually.................

When printing first was made available, people took it on faith that the things they were reading were true, why else would someone go to the trouble to print it?

Then.........towards the mid 20th century, television news came out, and we believed that as well, because, again, why else would they go to all the trouble to send it out over the airwaves?

Along the 50's and 60's, (after some experimentation in the 30's and 40's), they figured out they could sell just about anything to the public if it was placed on the news and touted as "facts".

One reason that we believed Saddam had anything to do with 9/11.

Only thing that people keep forgetting though..........now, with the internet, it is reasonably easy to investigate things to see if they are factually true or not.

Looks like the AP story has gone down in flames.........finally, at least on this thread.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 23, 2009)

So when things are scanned, like oh I dunno maybe a certificate of birth, then it becomes believable?
Check your irony at the door.

No one has explained yet why the Obama Campaign/White House will not release any records.  Not birth certificates, not medical records, not school records.

It is the one inconvenient truth circulating here.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 23, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> So when things are scanned, like oh I dunno maybe a certificate of birth, then it becomes believable?
> Check your irony at the door.
> 
> No one has explained yet why the Obama Campaign/White House will not release any records.  Not birth certificates, not medical records, not school records.
> ...



The only inconvenient truth here is your abject stupidity.

People have posted several things from several different places that all say the same thing.......Obama was born in Hawaii.

The only thing that I see with no verification?  The AP story the birthers are using.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 23, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > So when things are scanned, like oh I dunno maybe a certificate of birth, then it becomes believable?
> ...



You're the one who can't explain why Obama won't release the long form of his birth certificate or his school records.  That is the only inconvenient truth I see here.
I've already discounted the news story.  Who cares?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 23, 2009)

You mean......you've discounted facts and cogent thought.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 23, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> You mean......you've discounted facts and cogent thought.




I thought you had been dismissed?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 23, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > You mean......you've discounted facts and cogent thought.
> ...



You ain't got the paygrade to dismiss me ground pounder................

How's things in REMF land?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 23, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...



You have dismissed yourself with your closed mind. And what the hell does the Navy know about anything except REMFs


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 23, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



Standard says that the Navy goes and softens up the ground with artillery.  When that is accomplished, we send in the Marines to kill anything not dead yet.

Then the SeeBee's come in and build bases.

Then the Army comes in and takes over the rear guard.

Air Force?  They're back in the States flying Predators.

What was your specialty again?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 24, 2009)

If you really Must know I was in Communications. From Cable to Satellite. With 4 years in COMSEC and the last 10 as Forward Combat Signal Area Support. Which deck did you keep painted?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 24, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> If you really Must know I was in Communications. From Cable to Satellite. With 4 years in COMSEC and the last 10 as Forward Combat Signal Area Support. Which deck did you keep painted?



Like I said, you're a REMF.

I was in Beruit in '83 when the Marines got hit on a combat ship.

Participated in Desert Storm pts 1 and 2 on a carrier.

Spent time in Kosovo.

At least I didn't hide in the rear echelons.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 24, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > If you really Must know I was in Communications. From Cable to Satellite. With 4 years in COMSEC and the last 10 as Forward Combat Signal Area Support. Which deck did you keep painted?
> ...




Like I said, your inability to think and comprehend has dismissed you. It is not difficult to understand forward area support. Unless of course you were busy with a mop or paintbrush. Now go away I truly do hate arguing with veterans.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 24, 2009)

Really?  Wanna explain to me about the heavy artillery fire we took in Beruit?

I was also a member of the PRP team while stationed in an FA-18 squadron (VFA-131), was a security force team member at the War College, as well as a few other special qualifications.

Nope........didn't sit behind a desk a lot of the time.


----------



## sitarro (Oct 24, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Know why people keep coming up with bullshit like this?
> 
> Simple actually.................
> 
> ...



Why would you have believed that Saddam had anything to do with 9/11? I don't know anyone that believed that.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 24, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Really?  Wanna explain to me about the heavy artillery fire we took in Beruit?
> 
> I was also a member of the PRP team while stationed in an FA-18 squadron (VFA-131), was a security force team member at the War College, as well as a few other special qualifications.
> 
> Nope........didn't sit behind a desk a lot of the time.




Don't understand what you are bragging about. The point here is not to defend your precious honor or to have you attempt to diminish mine. we did our time and performed our missions. 

But you still cannot show me a Birth Certificate that has Obamas Name on it with the name of the hospital and the attending Physicians signature.

And that is all anyone has asked for. Pretty simple request I would think.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 24, 2009)

Thanks.
Have you guys run out of piss for the contest?


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 24, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Thanks.
> Have you guys run out of piss for the contest?




Never wanted any contest.


----------



## Care4all (Oct 24, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Really?  Wanna explain to me about the heavy artillery fire we took in Beruit?
> ...



WHY do you need the name of the doc and hospital?  IS THAT what the constitution says?  you can only be president if you give the world the name of your mother;s personal doctor?

YOU have no constitutional right or power to demand such private information....THIS IS WHY HAWAII changed their laws and regs to issuing ONLY the COLB= a precise certified duplicate of the original birth certificate, but WITHOUT that kind of personal, private, information.

you only have the right to see his Certificate of Live Birth, showing his place of birth as anywhere in the usa to qualify, OR a Certification of Citizenship IF born overseas but still a citizen at birth due to parents as the requirement of natural born citizenship.

What you all seem to ignore is that if obama were born in another country, and not in hawaii...he WOULD NOT have a birth certificate from hawaii as he does....  he would have a Certificate of Citizenship for the USA to go with a Kenyan Birth Certificate....and yes, that was the law back in 1961 as well....  the state of Hawaii did not issue birth certificates to those born overseas.....  citizenship could be applied for by the parent but this was a long legal process that took months and also after specific legal requirements were met, including meeting federal citizenship requirements....

Obama's birth was registered with the Hawaiian Health Department Registrar of Vital Statistics just 3 days after he was born, along with all other children born in HONOLULU on that day.....  there is no dancing around that FACT.

The Hawaii Health Dept of Vital Statistics Ran an ad every Sunday listing the children born in their state as notice in the local news papers....obama was listed along with all other children born the previous week IN HAWAII....  this was not personal birth announcements by a grandma or proud father....THIS WAS A STATE GVT NOTICE OF BIRTHS WITHIN THE STATE localities....there is no dancing around that FACT.

He could not have been born in kenya and have a birth certificate and announcement in the paper within a weeks time....it is impossible...anyone of sound mind would stop this ridiculous quest to continual bash our black president and require from him what you have Never required from your white presidents....simply because you don't like him.


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## The Rabbi (Oct 24, 2009)

You're tap dancing around the issue.  As Americans we have the right to see whatever the hell we want from someone who wants to be president.
Why is the administration blocking release of this information??

And your race card has been declined.


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## dilloduck (Oct 24, 2009)

Care4all said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...



Our president is BLACK ??


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## SFC Ollie (Oct 24, 2009)

Care4all said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...





Why is it that the Obama Supporters and dare i say worshipers always want to bring up race? 

It's quite simple there was one simple question brought up about the mans Birth records. Instead of producing what would have put the question to bed he covered that document up. And then he made sure that his college documents were covered. The man is either playing a stupid game or hiding something. We the people have a right to know what he is hiding. 

Personally I think it is something stupid like maybe his parents weren't married. But I have the right to know what the President is hiding.


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## Care4all (Oct 24, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> You're tap dancing around the issue.  As Americans we have the right to see whatever the hell we want from someone who wants to be president.
> Why is the administration blocking release of this information??
> 
> And your race card has been declined.



Obama is not blocking the release of this information....NO ONE has gone to him to ask for the release.

the State is and the hospital is blocking the requests for this information, because it is illegal for them to release it....

It's none of your business to see his mom's doc's name....and he should block it from you loony tunes....  it is NOT REQUIRED INFORMATION OF YOURS....got THAT YET?

he has shown LEGAL PROOF that he was born in hawaii....HIS COLB, hawaii certificate of live birth IS THE ONLY LEGAL DOCUMENT NEEDED to show proof of citizenship, for anyone needing proof.  The State Dept vetting all candidates accepted this legal proof.

What part of that do you not understand?   YOU guys are harassing him at this point imo...with no sound reason why...  there's so many other things involved with our country and his political stances to differ with or argue over, but this?  enough already!


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## The Rabbi (Oct 24, 2009)

Gee, you think Obama has never heard of this controversy?  Think all anyone has to do is write a polite letter and he'll be glad to oblige?
What planet do you live on again?
The State Dept does not vet candidates.  I don't know where you got that idea.  You mentioned it before and I challenged you for proof.  I do so again.

And, again, as Americans we can demand any damn thing we want from someone who presumes to lead us.  Why won't he release the birth certificate?  Why won't he release his school records?


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## Care4all (Oct 24, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > SFC Ollie said:
> ...



tell me something....did you require this from president bush?  did you harrass him as obama?  did you insist that reagan's or ghw's legal birth certificate wasn't good enough?  how about clinton's?  ONLY OBAMA'S LEGAL COLB IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH....YOU TELL ME WHY...

you are full of crap on the nonsense you spilled on ''he covered it up....'''

HE GAVE HIS *LEGAL* COLB FROM THE STATE OF HAWAII AS HIS *LEGAL* PROOF.

WHY do you want more than that?  what do you imagine as a scenario that you think demands more than this already shown LEGAL PROOF?

WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR ON THE ORIGINAL THAT PROVES SOMETHING DIFFERENT THAN HONOLULU as his birth place?

Have you actually thought this through or are you just following the heard?

please tell me...


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## The Rabbi (Oct 24, 2009)

Well, no actually he didn't "give" anything to anyone.
Some web site reproduced a document they allegedly got from his campaign.  Has anyone actually seen the document in question?  No.  Did Obama himself actually give anything?  Did he actually request anything from Hawaii?  No, I dont think so.

There was never a question with any other president.  That's why it has never been an issue.


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## Emma (Oct 25, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Has anyone actually seen the document in question?


Yes.  





> Did Obama himself actually give anything?  Did he actually request anything from Hawaii?


  Yes, as that is the only way it can be released.



> There was never a question with any other president.


 They were taken at their word that they were born within the US / US territories? Why not with this President?


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## The Rabbi (Oct 25, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Has anyone actually seen the document in question?
> ...



Because significant doubt exists that that is the case.  This doubt has been inflamed by the Obama campaign's refusal to be forthcoming and open in releasing information, including his college records. When information is absent, rumor takes it place.  One would have to assume the rumors are generally worse than the truth.  This usually leads people to reveal the truth.  The only reason someone would not reveal the truth is the rumors are actually true, or better than the truth.
That is the problem.


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## Care4all (Oct 25, 2009)

it is a ridiculous demand....there is no doubt of him being born in honolulu, JUST AS HIS LEGAL certificate of live birth states.

there is nothing, nothing at all other than mere lies made up. one after another....one fake article after another, one fake kenyan birth certificate after another and YOU THINK that the big O owes you liars and forgers something?

GIVE ME A BREAK!  HOW STUPID can you get?


----------



## DiveCon (Oct 25, 2009)

Care4all said:


> it is a ridiculous demand....there is no doubt of him being born in honolulu, JUST AS HIS LEGAL certificate of live birth states.
> 
> there is nothing, nothing at all other than mere lies made up. one after another....one fake article after another, one fake kenyan birth certificate after another and YOU THINK that the big O owes you liars and forgers something?
> 
> GIVE ME A BREAK!  HOW STUPID can you get?


havent had your morning coffee yet?


----------



## Care4all (Oct 25, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > it is a ridiculous demand....there is no doubt of him being born in honolulu, JUST AS HIS LEGAL certificate of live birth states.
> ...



hahahahahahaha!  no, i haven't....i was hoping to fall back asleep....woke up because it was hot in the house...low and behold it is raining like cats and dogs, humid and in the 60's outside???  then my new stray cat wanted out, so i let her out, now i don't want to go to sleep till i can get her back in.... 

oh, and i opened the windows to cool the house down....  is it warm and humid there too?


----------



## Emma (Oct 25, 2009)

Saturday when I left work it was muggy; felt like summer... this morning rather cool and not nearly as humid.


----------



## Emma (Oct 25, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Bullshit.


----------



## DiveCon (Oct 25, 2009)

Care4all said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...


its only about 52° here right now
so enjoy the warmer temps while you can


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 25, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Informed response.

The doubt exists, fostered by the Obama campaign itself.  They could easily have ended such speculation.  The fact that they don't is undeniable and troubling.  Especially from someone who pledged an open honest administration and has delivered anything but.


----------



## Emma (Oct 25, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Let me spell it out for you, if you will. 

Obama provided proof of his birth. The COLB is the _only_ document the State of Hawaii will provide upon a request for a birth certificate. Further, the state's DOH director has twice confirmed that the records show he was born in Hawaii. 

So as far as all the bullshit accusations and lawsuits go? The burden lies with the accusers, i.e. the birfer nutters, to prove otherwise. He doesn't have to do shit. 

So have fun with that.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 25, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Obama has provided nothing.  His campaign allegedly gave a scan to a website.  That itself ought to be cause for suspicion.
Obviously the state of Hawaii does provide other documentation, as we have seen images of it on this very thread.  He is the fucking president of the united states and it is his birth certificate.  Are you telling me the President of the United States cannot get a copy of his own birth certificate??
No, he doesn't have to do shit.  In fact, he hasn't done shit.  That's why all the rumors have arisen.
So it again goes back to: if all these rumors are flying and he could quash it by producing the legal document then why doesn't he?


----------



## Emma (Oct 25, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> So it again goes back to: if all these rumors are flying and he could quash it by producing the legal document then why doesn't he?



The burden of proof lies with the accuser, not the accused. Birfers now need to pony up with proof that trumps the COLB and the official statements from the Hawaiian DOH. 

Have fun with that.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 25, 2009)

We don't need to do anything.
Obama needs to show that he is actually legally qualified to be president.  He has not done so.  He could easily do so.
The question is why he refuses to do so.


----------



## Emma (Oct 25, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> We don't need to do anything.


He provided the COLB and Hawaiian officials have backed it up. 

Burden of proof is now on _your_ side to trump the COLB and official statements by the DOH. 

Get crackin'. Time's a wastin'!


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## The Rabbi (Oct 25, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > We don't need to do anything.
> ...



Merely repeating what you've already said isn't making an argument.  It is demonstrating you have nothing intelligent to say at all.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


It's repeating the facts. Perhaps if it's repeated often enough, it will sink in. 

Now if you want to bitch and moan and stamp your feet and work yourself into a lather over this issue, then of course you don't have to prove anything. However, if you want these accusations to actually accomplish anything, it will have to be in the Courts (which don't have jurisdiction) or the Congress (which does), and in that case the burden of proof is upon the one(s) bringing the charges, not on President Obama.


----------



## Modbert (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> It's repeating the facts. Perhaps if it's repeated often enough, it will sink in.
> 
> Now if you want to bitch and moan and stamp your feet and work yourself into a lather over this issue, then of course you don't have to prove anything. However, if you want these accusations to actually accomplish anything, it will have to be in the Courts (which don't have jurisdiction) or the Congress (which does), and in that case the burden of proof is upon the one(s) bringing the charges, not on President Obama.



Silly Emma, you expect anything that Rabbi reads on here to sink in? And for Rabbi to do anything but stamp his feet and cry? 

Careful though, if you piss him off too badly, he'll put you on ignore. Shogun and I are already on his list supposedly.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



You are simply asserting.
The facts are that he has not supplied anything.  The facts are that significant doubt exists as to whether the COLB provided is a forgery.  The facts are that he has not released his college records either.
I don't know where Obama was born.  I don't know what hospital he was born in.  I don't know who the doctor was.  I don't know how he paid for private college.  I don't know what his grades were.
And neither does anyone else.
These are the facts.


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## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Don't forget to hold your breath 'til you turn blue. Then we'll know you _really_ mean it.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



I could talk til I was blue in the face and you still wouldn't get it.
Some people never will.  Some people believe Elvis is alive and OJ is innocent.  Doesn't make it true.
To that we'll add that Obama is a native born American citizen.


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## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



If you want to believe in kooky conspiracy theories, that's your business.


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## Care4all (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Can you get any more STUPID?  Who Forged the COLB with the raised seal notarized stamp?  Did the governor...? republican governor of hawaii that assured Obama's record of birth was on file as honolulu, and the head of the Health department of vital statistics who also said his record of birth was on file with hawaii, and that his COLB WAS ACCURATE? 

you don't need to know the hospital he was born in, though we do know what hospital he was born in because they STATED he was born there....they won't release his mother's hospital records because it is against the laws of Hawaii....

This is not a thread about his college records....etc....start one on that, if this is what bothers you...but his official State document for his place of Birth has been legally presented and shown for his qualifications of president...


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## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The ONLY thing that is relevant to his eligibility to serve is his place and date of birth, both of which are on the COLB. 

Hospital records, school records, medical records, etc., are irrelevant and none of our damn business, so _why_ are the birthers demanding those?


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## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Actually I am coming to believe that those who think there is no problem are the real conspiracy theorists.  If you can't answer the questions then how is there not a problem?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The ONLY thing that is relevant to his eligibility to serve is his place and date of birth, both of which are on the COLB.
> 
> Hospital records, school records, medical records, etc., are irrelevant and none of our damn business, so _why_ are the birthers demanding those?



And since the COLB raises obvious questions about its provenance and veracity we would need some supporting documentation.  Which isn't there.
And ANYTHING that pertains to someone who wants to be president is our damn business.
I didn't hear you protesting that Bush's drunk driving convictions weren't anyone's business.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The ONLY thing that is relevant to his eligibility to serve is his place and date of birth, both of which are on the COLB.
> ...



I don't recall saying anything about Bush's DUIs. Perhaps you have some links to refresh my memory? 

And for your information, the COLB is the official documentation. No 'supporting' evidence necessary.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


Right, you didnt protest that what he did 20+ years earlier was anyone's business.  If you did, please post links.
No one has seen the COLB.  We have only seen a scan, one that is probably forged.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Right, you didnt protest that what he did 20+ years earlier was anyone's business.  If you did, please post links.


lol

You made the accusation, you provide the proof. 

You seem to have difficulty with that concept. 



The Rabbi said:


> No one has seen the COLB.



Wrong. 



The Rabbi said:


> We have only seen a scan, *one that is probably forged*.



Prove it.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Right, you didnt protest that what he did 20+ years earlier was anyone's business.  If you did, please post links.
> ...



Provide proof that you didnt say anything?  Are you insane?
You again parrot that someone has seen the COLB.  Please list their names and where the COLB was seen and where it is available for examination.
There have been numerous analyses of the COLB, or the computer scan I should say.  They all point to problems and inconsistencies.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Provide proof that you didnt say anything?  Are you insane?


lol

No more insane than you wanting Obama to prove he _wasn't_ born in Kenya, or Canada, or Indonesia or wherever... 

However, you _can_ provide links to where I was involved in a discussion about Bush's DUIs, since that is your accusation. 



The Rabbi said:


> You again parrot that someone has seen the COLB.  Please list their names and where the COLB was seen and where it is available for examination.



FactCheck.org: Born in the U.S.A.




The Rabbi said:


> There have been numerous analyses of the COLB, or the computer scan I should say.  They all point to problems and inconsistencies.


And all were debunked.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma,

     I honestly believe that Mr Obama was born in Hawaii. However there is little doubt that the man is hiding something that could have an adverse reaction against him. And the longer he keeps hiding his records the worse it will become. All anyone is asking for is what he himself promised; TRANSPARENCY. Looks like he was just kidding about that.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma,
> 
> I honestly believe that Mr Obama was born in Hawaii. However there is little doubt that the man is hiding something that could have an adverse reaction against him. And the longer he keeps hiding his records the worse it will become. All anyone is asking for is what he himself promised; TRANSPARENCY. Looks like he was just kidding about that.



I'm not sure I believe he's *hiding* anything, but what is it you want to see? And why? Just curious.


----------



## jvn (Oct 26, 2009)

Sarge -

What you post is a perfectly valid political reason why you or anyone else might not vote for the President when he runs for re-election in 2012.  If you believe that he has not kept his campaign promises sufficiently enough for you, then by all means do not vote for him. (You should note, however, that his posting his COLB on line is more than any other President or candidate in history has ever done with regard to their birth certificate.)

The problem comes in when people mistake the reasons they oppose the President politically with their "right" to attempt to remove him from office and undo the results of the last election.

Every procedure specified by the Constitution and the law to certify that the President was eligible to serve was followed.  He has been certified as eligible in exactly the same manner as every other President.  In fact, with all of the publicity given to this issue, the Electors and members of Congress likely had more information with regard to this topic than for any other President in history.

Idle speculation, rumors and outright lies notwithstanding, the President was properly elected, certified and inaugurated, and now serves.

Your best bet would be to work for his defeat in 2012.  The "birthers" make political opposition to the President look like lunacy.  It actually will help the President get re-elected...


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Provide proof that you didnt say anything?  Are you insane?
> ...



I dont want proof that Obama wasn't born in Kenya.  Just that he was born here.  And no one seems to want to provide that.  The link is hysterical.  The directors attest they have seen Obama's birth certificate.  They do not attest that this is what we've seen.  They do mention the COLB was produced in the last couple of years, maybe the last couple of months.
FactCheck has cute phots of the certificate, but won't make it available to journalists.  Hello??
And since when is a private web site the arbiter of whether someone is constitutionally qualified to be president?
The questions were not debunked.  Do you have a link doing so?
And do you have a link to a post you made where you said that what Bush did 20+ years ago isn't relevant to his being president?


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

Elutherian said:


> Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate



BTW, why is it when you click the links on the left of this page, it returns with pages from a different date than the alleged Obama article?


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


It has been provided. The COLB is the only birth certificate released upon request. The director of the Hawaiian DOH has stated _twice_ that the records show Obama was born in Hawaii. Do you think she is in on this massive fraud too?



> The link is hysterical.  The directors attest they have seen Obama's birth certificate.  They do not attest that this is what we've seen.  They do mention the COLB was produced in the last couple of years, maybe the last couple of months.
> FactCheck has cute phots of the certificate, but won't make it available to journalists.  Hello??
> And since when is a private web site the arbiter of whether someone is constitutionally qualified to be president?


Your blather makes no sense, but regardless... your question was if anyone has seen the actual COLB and the answer is yes. 



> The questions were not debunked.  Do you have a link doing so?
> And do you have a link to a post you made where you said that what Bush did 20+ years ago isn't relevant to his being president?


You made the accusation that I went along with trashing Bush about his DUIs, and never spoke out against it. 

Prove it.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Actually you dont know that.
You dont know any of it.  All you know is what some private web site tells you.  What a great standard of proof.
Hey, I've got a private web site that says send me all your money and I can teach you to make a million dollars.  Bring it on.
You keep repeating the same untruths, half truths and falsehoods in some pathetic attempt to sound like you're debating.
I pity a country that has voters like you.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Actually you dont know that.
> You dont know any of it.  All you know is what some private web site tells you.  What a great standard of proof.
> Hey, I've got a private web site that says send me all your money and I can teach you to make a million dollars.  Bring it on.
> You keep repeating the same untruths, half truths and falsehoods in some pathetic attempt to sound like you're debating.
> I pity a country that has voters like you.



Actually, I know it because I've seen the COLB and because Hawaiian state officials have confirmed that they have seen the records, he was indeed born there and the info contained within the COLB is accurate. 

So until you can provide something that trumps a COLB and the word of the Hawaiian state officials, you fail. 

Continue to blather on about how this is massive fraud and conspiracy for all I care. It's not going to change a damned thing


----------



## SFC Ollie (Oct 26, 2009)

jvn said:


> Sarge -
> 
> What you post is a perfectly valid political reason why you or anyone else might not vote for the President when he runs for re-election in 2012.  If you believe that he has not kept his campaign promises sufficiently enough for you, then by all means do not vote for him. (You should note, however, that his posting his COLB on line is more than any other President or candidate in history has ever done with regard to their birth certificate.)
> 
> ...




Obviously I am not a birther, but i do understand when someone is trying to hide something. And this  "Transparent President" is hiding a lot. I might start referring to him as that;  TP;  and we all know what that is.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 26, 2009)

Yeah.......it's a juvenile nickname given by an idiot named Ollie.

"Well, gee Ollie.........."

What the fuck REMF, you're not a birther, but you keep harping on the same shit they do.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> jvn said:
> 
> 
> > Sarge -
> ...



If you've already answered this, I do apologize (I'm half asleep here lol)...

What exactly would you like Obama to provide and why?


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Actually you dont know that.
> ...



You;ve seen it??  Tell us.  I want details.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



What can I say? I'm just good that way


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Let me guess: it appeared to you in a vision, with Obama enthroned on a sapphire throne and angels with faces of Nancy Pelosi were singing "Barack Hussein Obama.  Mmm Mmm Mmm."  Right?  Am I part way there?
You're obviously lying about this like you've lied so often before.


----------



## Emma (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> You're obviously lying about this like you've lied so often before.



Prove it


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## DiveCon (Oct 26, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


C'mon man, she might have been wrong about something, but i highly doubt she lied
I've known her for years, and that's just outside her character


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 27, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



She claims to have seen the COLB but wont provide details.  Since basically no one has seen it and I doubt she is an Obama campaign operative I can only conclude that she lies.  Do you have a better explanation?


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## DiveCon (Oct 27, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


i have seen several scans of the document
i see nothing that would indicate it being forged
several(at least 2 anyway) Hawaiian State officials have confirmed that the scans are accurate
unless you wish to challenge every Hawaiian issued COLB for validity, you have to accept that his is authentic


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 27, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



You have seen scans of the document.  That is not the same thing as seeing the document.  I do not have to accept anything and some people have examined the scan and pronounced it forged.


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## Care4all (Oct 27, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



you are wayyy behind the eightball.....the original copy of his birth certificate first shown in doubt because the seal could not be seen in the scan and because the Obama team blocked out the registrar number given....  

So then the original COLB was made available for hands on examination, which verified the seal and took very close up picutres of the whole document.

I have given you the link SEVERAL TIMES showing this....but heh, stupid is as stupid does.

Can you please show us evidence that Obama was not born in Hawaii.

WHAT HAVE YOU GOT to support your idiotic position?  PLEASE SHOW US SOME PROOF, that he was NOT born in Honolulu.


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 27, 2009)

I dont know where he was born.  Apparantly neither does anyone else.  Scans on the internet are no substitute for full and complete disclosure, something Obama promised in his administration.


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## Care4all (Oct 27, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> I dont know where he was born.  Apparantly neither does anyone else.  Scans on the internet are no substitute for full and complete disclosure, something Obama promised in his administration.



Who do you want to touch it?  YOu?  The State dept that vetted him?  WHO WILL SATISFY YOU?

Where is obama's mother's passport showing the dates of her travel from kenya to the usa?

How about an airline passenger list thaqt shows she flew from kenya to the usaq after her birthing him...?

How about immigration records, showing her returning to the usa after his birthing there...?

How about proof he was born in a hospital in Kenya..?

How about proof that in 1961 your could make it to honolulu hawaii in 2 days from kenya....so she could have his birth registered at the State Dept in less than the 3 days....from his birth.


How about a legitimate legal, kenyan birth certificate?

How about US embassy records in Kenya showing she was there during her pregnancy....or that they tried to get her back home to deliver him.

WHAT DO YOU HAVE that makes you believe he was not born in Honolulu and born in Kenya or overseas...ANY THING AT ALL AS PROOF, or even that gives doubt, would be greatly appreciated....

IF YOU CAN NOT PRODUCE anything of the sort, WHAT in your little head makes you think, you have the higher ground here and are not just being a complete and utter, false witness, liar to harm Obama?

You have NOTHING to even support the accusation of him not being born here....NOTHING AT ALL....

I took this seriously when i first heard it, and I spent days going over the stuff on the birther sites, trying to confirm ANY of their claims....AND NOT ONE HAS BEEN THE TRUTH or been able to be substantiated with ANY KIND OF VALIDITY OR TRUTH....not one of their accusations....

Now you may be some armchair quarterback leading this SHAM and SLANDER, but honestly and truth prevents me from doing such.....where is your ethical stance?  MIA.

Care


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## candycorn (Oct 27, 2009)

Care4all said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > I dont know where he was born.  Apparantly neither does anyone else.  Scans on the internet are no substitute for full and complete disclosure, something Obama promised in his administration.
> ...


----------



## jvn (Oct 27, 2009)

Sarge -

Once again, you have a political reason to vote against the President in 2012.

For the remaining birthers, a quote from _Monty Python and the Holy Grail_:

"What are you going to do, bleed on me?"


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 27, 2009)

Care4all said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > I dont know where he was born.  Apparantly neither does anyone else.  Scans on the internet are no substitute for full and complete disclosure, something Obama promised in his administration.
> ...



How about the long form of the birth certificate?  Pretty simple, eh?
So why is the administration blocking its release?  Why are they going to court to fight it?  Why are they not releasing his school records?
What is the administration hiding?
I keep coming back to this and no one can answer this question.  Pretty basic, really.


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## Emma (Oct 27, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



It's been answered numerous times. 

_The COLB is the only document the state of Hawaii issues upon request for a birth certificate. _


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## paperview (Oct 27, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...


Since July of last year...you & I have said that ...what, like 700 times by now?


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## Emma (Oct 27, 2009)

paperview said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



At least


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## The Rabbi (Oct 27, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



And I am sure the president of the united states is powerless against the awesome might of the Hawaii dept of health.
yeah.


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## Emma (Oct 27, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> And I am sure the president of the united states is powerless against the awesome might of the Hawaii dept of health.
> yeah.



Their system switched back in '00 (maybe '01). He has nothing to do with it. 

But tell ya what. 

Find someone born in Hawaii and have them request a copy of their birth certificate and see what the state provides.


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## paperview (Oct 27, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > And I am sure the president of the united states is powerless against the awesome might of the Hawaii dept of health.
> ...


I know if you land there, first thing they give you is a lei.


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## ABikerSailor (Oct 27, 2009)

Hey...........I got leid in Hawaii!


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## logical4u (Oct 27, 2009)

Sinatra said:


> Elutherian said:
> 
> 
> > Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate
> ...



The courts (and the congress) do not want to do their jobs; neither are willing to demand the evidence that the President is an American citizen, not a foreign one as he could have claimed to go to college on grants or scholarships.  The people responsible for protecting our Constitution are more concerned with eliminating individual rights and subjugating the population, than doing their jobs as written in the Constitution.
Pray for our country, the people that are supposed to be representing us, think they were elected rulers.  Now we cannot even use "legal" means to draw attention to the poor jobs our representatives are doing.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

Plus  since originally posting this item, I received the following statement from Paul Colford, director of media relations for the Associated Press: *The AP has never reported that President Obama was born in Kenya. In fact, AP news stories about the state of Hawaii have confirmed that he was born there. The Kenyan paper that you cite rewrote a 2004 AP story, adding the phrase Kenyan-born. That wording was not in the AP version of the story.*

Obama birthplace lawyer submits suspect document - Total Buzz - OCRegister.com


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## Care4all (Oct 28, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Sinatra said:
> 
> 
> > Elutherian said:
> ...



Thou shall not bear false witness....(the work of the deceiver)

Which YOU are doing....

How come?

In case you are truly doing this by accident or mistake....FYI

Obama DID NOT get any foreign given scholarships to go to college here....that is just ANOTHER LIE of this group, and has been proven to be FALSE already...

What I would like to know is WHY would you, a supposed believing, religious Christian, continue to FOLLOW LIARS....people who have continually presented ONE LIE AFTER ANOTHER regarding Obama's birth...ALL of the proof was FABRICATED of FALSE....OR FRAUDULENT.

So WHY do you continue to follow DECEIVERS and LIARS, as this group has now turned out to be?

What makes you stay by their side?  God?  I don't think so....    But please explain so that I do understand precisely where you are coming from....

Care


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Liars.  Look who's talking.
Which unit of the State Department is responsible for vetting presidential candidates?  I'll just remind you of that absurd claim you made here.

Seems like when I ask the hard questions your response is always to clam up and/or change the subject.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

The Executive of the states are responsible for elections and ensuring those running are eligible to serve. With most, this falls under Secretary of State.


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Executive of the states are responsible for elections and ensuring those running are eligible to serve. With most, this falls under Secretary of State.



Then you've just contradicted Care4all who maintains some obscure unit in the State Dept does it.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Executive of the states are responsible for elections and ensuring those running are eligible to serve. With most, this falls under Secretary of State.
> ...



I don't know what care is referring to, federal or state.


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Since he wrote State Department, that would seem to indicate the US Dept of State.


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## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


States have Secretaries of State & State Departments, dweeb.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

paperview said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Something that the birthers have never been able to answer ... 

In order for Obama to pull off this off, each and every state Executive (even those of the 'red' states) would have had to be complicit in this _massive_ voter fraud, along with the DNC, Congress and the FEC, Hawaiian state officials, etc.  What purpose would it serve these hundreds (thousands?) to lie and assist Obama in defrauding the American people? Why would they do so, and why would they continue to keep it under wraps?


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## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


You're asking Birthers to actually _think through_ something?


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

Silly me


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

paperview said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Dumbshit.  When someone writes "State Department" that means without any other context the US Dept of State. 
Idiot.


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



First you're assuming each Secy of State actually made such a certification following an investigation.  Please post such reports where available.
Second, you are assuming that there was "massive" fraud when in fact simple negligence could explain it easily.  Negligence like "well I saw it on a web site so it must be true."
Sound familiar?
I realize thinking these things through is harder than just jumping to conclusions.  I'll make it easy for you.  Just repeat: The birther movement is all Bush's fault.


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## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


There was context, and YOU assumed.


Don't blame Care4all for an ASS U Made of yourself in the assumption.


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## Care4all (Oct 28, 2009)

as a senator, obama was appointed to the homeland security committee for the senate, along with 2 other committees....ALL OF WHICH required a background check, vetting BEFORE he could be a committee member.....especially homeland security.

you, Rabb, obviously can not think for yourself....  Obama was vetted and also has top secret security clearance as a member of the Homeland Security Committee, as with all members of this committee.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...


I assume nothing except that the Executive of each state is charged with ensuring elections are fair and legal, to include those running for office are eligible to serve. The conspiracy is vast, and must include many people from all levels of government, federal and state, in order for him to pull this off. So tell me. What is their motive for doing so (_and_ keeping it under wraps)?


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Care4all said:


> as a senator, obama was appointed to the homeland security committee for the senate, along with 2 other committees....ALL OF WHICH required a background check, vetting BEFORE he could be a committee member.....especially homeland security.
> 
> you, Rabb, obviously can not think for yourself....  Obama was vetted and also has top secret security clearance as a member of the Homeland Security Committee, as with all members of this committee.



Oh, OK.  So now he was vetted by ???? instead of the State Department.  Did the vetting include verifying his (fake) birth certificate?

Your story keep changing.  It keep changing because you are making it up as you go along, grasping at straws along the way.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

For someone who obviously distrusts government so much, you sure have an enormous faith in their ability to keep the biggest election fraud _ever_  under wraps.


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> For someone who obviously distrusts government so much, you sure have an enormous faith in their ability to keep the biggest election fraud _ever_  under wraps.



You have an amazing capacity to ignore the obvious and obfuscate.  Also to lie.  But we knew this already.


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## DiveCon (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


you have it right
its done on a STATE level
we dont have "national" elections
we have simultaneous state elections


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## DiveCon (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


you also left out the RNC
since they are not challenging his birth


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Please post references to where each secretary of state investigated whether Obama was constitutionally qualified to run.  To whom did they give this report?


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



True. I didn't name all the co-conspirators. The list is HUGE lol.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



 The person is removed from the ballot, then charged with filing a false affidavit and/or perjury, whatever the state deems the charge to be.


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## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


HUGE!  

I was going to post a pic of a cute cartoon a saw a few weeks ago with _HUGE_! scribbled across.  

I went to look for it just now.  Here's some advice you may never use:

*DO NOT* go looking in Google images with the phrase "Huge" & Safe Search turned off. 

Ay yi yi!  

lol.


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

I'll remember that LOL


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## DiveCon (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


seems its bigger than the 9/11 conspiracy list


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



Probably true.
Not what I asked for though.

Come come.  If what you say is true and every secretary of state vetted Obama then there has to be a record of that somewhere.  Where are these investigations?


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## DiveCon (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


why dont you contact the TN state elections board and ask them?


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



Because that would be waste of my time.

Since you're the one who started, why don't you post which unit of the state department conducted the investigation and vetted the candidates? You did post that.  Twice.

Now you're content to say no no it was the secretary of state of each state.  

I can conclude from all this that you don't have a fucking clue as to what you're talking about.

I ask simple questions and get evasive, changing, or abusive answers.  The fact that no one can answer why Obama will not release his birth certificate or school records should be saying volumes here.  Imagine if Dick Cheney didn't release these things.  Who knows what the Left would invent.


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## DiveCon (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


nope, i didnt say that
but it was done on the state level
there is no "federal elections board"


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


Investigations?


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > why dont you contact the TN state elections board and ask them?
> ...


Then I suppose it's not that important to you...


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## Emma (Oct 28, 2009)

http://api.ning.com/files/5UirxQfJf...jsWtSmYUgDB33COOtoocVq-ggv/ObameBirthCert.JPG

Here ya go Rabbi. The latest forgery by the birfers. Can you spot the obvious error? (hint: it's the same error Taitz and her birfers make when they bray about how Obama could still have a Hawaiian BC in spite of being born in Kenya ... or Indonesia, or Canada)


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## logical4u (Oct 28, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Sinatra said:
> ...



I have seen NO proof from either side, hence, my dilemma.  IF Obama is legit, why won't he allow these documents to be viewed, as required (though in THIS case, not enforced), by law as eligible for his job?  If he is not legit, why can't those that "bear false witness" for him by stating he is legit with no proof, provide the evidence?  It seems really simple to me, if he IS legitimately the commander and chief, he would lead by example, he has chosen, not to do that.  Obama has chosen to spend millions of dollars, legally hiding his past.
I believe he is not a US citizen, by his own declaration as well as being a dual citizen (that would make him, ineligible).  I believe that because he will not discuss it, he will not provide evidence (he, being the only one that can, legally), and I can not see one demonstration of his "love" for this country, that raised the standard of rights and the standard of living for BILLIONS of people on this planet (with medical advances, scientific and engineering technologies, and inventions).
The only "vibes" that I get from Obama is smugness, like he is pulling one over on the citizens, and he sits in the white house and laughs about it every night.  In the senate, he did not fix, or even try to fix one thing that he has his fingers into now.  He did not fix or try to fix any of the existing problems before creating a giant government mess (that is making more problems).
Why would anyone think he is genuine or authentic?  What has he done that has displayed his patriotism or his pride in this country?  What makes you stay by his side?   I don't think so....    But please explain so that I do understand precisely where you are coming from....


----------



## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



You didnt say that?  Must have been someone hacking your account here then.  I'd call for an investigation.


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## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


How bout you link to his posts then?


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

paperview said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



Post #321:


> Who do you want to touch it? YOu? The State dept that vetted him? WHO WILL SATISFY YOU?


And there are others.


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## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


You see.  What a liar you just proved yourself to be.

You didn't link it.

Why?

It was Care4all's post!

http://www.usmessageboard.com/1654152-post321.html

Damn.  You suck at this internet thing, eh?


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## The Rabbi (Oct 28, 2009)

There ya go!


----------



## paperview (Oct 28, 2009)




----------



## DiveCon (Oct 28, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


that wasnt my post


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## Care4all (Oct 29, 2009)

paperview said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



Yes, I had read that Obama was vetted, same with mccain....for security clearances with our government....it could have been the Justice dept vs the State Dept, but they both were well vetted due to their positions as senators...mccain and obama both, as committee memberships in various committees involved with our armed forces and national homeland security.....

These background checks on both were thorough, i'm pretty certain.

And yes, i am certain the fbi would have found obama's supposedly FAKED birth in Honolulu at the time he was being vetted for his position on the Senate Homeland Security Committee.

I had also read that it is the responsibility of the Secretary of State to insure legitimate elections in each of their states....Any one of these 50 secretaries in the various State departments could have challenged the eligibility of the presidential candidates.


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## Emma (Oct 29, 2009)

Judge Carter Ruling on MTD

Heh.


----------



## Liability (Oct 29, 2009)

Emma said:


> Judge Carter Ruling on MTD
> 
> Heh.



That was quite a beat-down by the Judge.

One may still harbor some misgivings about the authenticity of the President's alleged "birth certificate" or his  alleged "cerification of birth."  But the basis for the dismissal of the Taitz lawsuit seems pretty well reasoned all the same.

And it looks like attorney Taitz is in for a bad run.


----------



## Emma (Oct 29, 2009)

Liability said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Judge Carter Ruling on MTD
> ...



Orly and her minions were stoked about going before Judge Carter because he's a former Marine and therefore would be 'sympathetic' to their cause. It would appear that backfired on 'em and got his back up: 



> The Complaint also requests that this Court enjoin the Presidents powers to order new deployments or assignments of any armed forces of the United States outside of the territorial limits of the United States without express Congressional approval, and further to limit the execution of certain orders of the President of the United States relating to the conduct of foreign policy by and through the use of currently deployed and assigned military force.  Compl. 3:14-19.  *This cut and run call to lay down arms and leave this country defenseless is an effort by Plaintiffs to emasculate the military.*  Plaintiffs have inappropriately requested that this Court interfere with internal military affairs.  See Orloff v. Willoughby, 345 U.S. 83, 93-94, 73 S. Ct. 534 (1953) ([J]udges are not given the task of running the Army.).  Plaintiffs only seek to enjoin acts that the President takes as Commander-in-Chief internationally, not domestically.  This peculiarity leads the Court to suspect that the constitutional objection is being used as a veil to avoid deployment to countries where the United States military is currently active, such as Iraq or Afghanistan.  *See Rhodes v.Thomas D. MacDonald et al., No. 4:09-CV-106 (CDL), 2007 WL 2997605 (M.D. Ga. Sept. 16,2009) (Plaintiff objecting to President Obamas natural born citizen status had no concerns about fulfilling her military obligation until she received orders notifying her that she would be deployed to Iraq in September 2009)*.  Furthermore, Lieutenant Freeses claims are based upon the notion that his duty to serve is based upon who is in office.  *The duty to defend is not dependent upon a political or personal view regarding the individual who serves as President and Commander-in-Chief.  It is an unequivocal duty to defend our country.*
> 
> This Court will not interfere in internal military affairs nor be used as a tool by military officers to avoid deployment.  *The Court has a word for such a refusal to follow the orders of the President of the United States, but it will leave the issue to the military to resolve.* Plaintiff Freese fails to meet the Article III standing requirements.



*ouch*

And I like the reference to Judge Land's order


----------



## ABikerSailor (Oct 29, 2009)

Care4all said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Yep.  The background checks are pretty thorough, even if you're only going for a Classified clearance.  If you're going for Top Secret or SCI, then they also interview your family and neighbors.

Trust me.........I've had high clearances.

Additionally, speaking as someone who's worked at a MEPS, I can tell you that EVERYONE WHO COMES IN THE MILITARY, gets a National Agency Check at a minimum.

Part of that requires you to show your actual birth certificate.

Rabbi, you lose again.


----------



## Emma (Oct 29, 2009)

Birthers - Salon.com

In a comprehensive, respectful but damning opinion, a federal court puts an end to the Birthers' best hope


The Birthers' last, best hope -- a case brought by Orly Taitz on behalf of Alan Keyes, among many others -- has failed. On Thursday, U.S. District Judge David Carter issued a ruling in which he dismissed the case, which had been ongoing since the day of President Obama's inauguration.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE]YouTube - Queen - 'Another One Bites the Dust'[/ame]


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## logical4u (Nov 1, 2009)

Care4all said:


> paperview said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



Politicians' clearance "checks" are a LOT different than civilian checks.  Pres Clinton would not have been issued a security clearance if he had been working for the ARMY (due to some of his past activities and countries visited).  It is a mistake to assume politicians are held to the same standards civilians are.  The current President's leadership skills are a prime example; if the military had an officer that acted with his indecisiveness and encouraging our enemies the way he does, he would have been de-moted or kicked out of the military.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 2, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



Well, the Security clearances that mccain and obama had to go through for Homeland Security and the Armed Forces committee were not some light kind of vetting, I can assure you....their clearance was of the highest of levels for these committees.


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## The Rabbi (Nov 2, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



And you know this how?


----------



## Emma (Nov 2, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



Elected officials do not have 'security clearance'. 

BUT, as Care says, those who are on committees that deal with sensitive information are cleared and approved by the Senate (or House) to hear and access that information. (this was confirmed to me in a call to Senator Webb's office)

The President (and others in the Executive) are not cleared for security purposes. The only reason Obama and McCain would have been is because of their positions they held in the Senate.


----------



## Emma (Nov 2, 2009)

Also, the Senate (and House) regulate how they secure the information, what's expected of the members regarding secrecy and are the ones who enforce those rules.

ETA: as was explained to me, Congressional leadership has "clearance" (for lack of a better word) to access everything; the individual committee members are able to access information related to their positions on a particular committee (or committees), but on a need-to-know basis. So someone on (for example) the Homeland Security committee wouldn't be privileged to receive sensitive information that was before another committee, *unless* it related to Homeland Security. 

Is that clear as mud now?


----------



## Emma (Nov 2, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> And you know this how?



Well... I don't know about Care, but I went straight to the source and called my Senator


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## The Rabbi (Nov 2, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > And you know this how?
> ...



This from the woman who claims to have seen Obama's birth certificate.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Nov 2, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > paperview said:
> ...



anyone who thinks that politicians are held to the same standards civilians are held is a damn fool and living in denial like the many people here who ignorantly swallow his lies that he is a legit citizen are.Its a known fact that politicians get away with crimes all the time  that citizens never could get away with.everybody in the world knows that.


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



Despite a username that proclaims that you are a moron, you are nevertheless partly correct.

You overstate the case in a huge way, of course.  But still, you are partly correct.

Politicians DO often get the benefit of being treated differently; that is, too favorably.

But, the thing is, you DO massively overstate it.

If you were to be taken literally (which would be foolish for any rational person to do), it would follow that no politicians ever get arrested or indicted or tried or convicted or sent to prison.

And since we know that lots of politicians have been arrested and indicted and tried and convicted and sentenced to prison, we therefore know that YOUR conspiratorial assessement is just you being a loon again.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Nov 2, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



great points,there were multiple threads created sometime back by this poster named Pale Rider who took the Obama apologists here to school that he is not a legit us citizen.of course people around here only see what they want to see so they ignored his facts that proved it.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Nov 2, 2009)

Liability said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



My user name is the truth Liar-ability,change your user name to LIAR-ability,and your user name is extremely accurate.lol.

sorry the truth hurts you disinfo agent.I and others took you to school on that Kennedy thread that the CIA killed Kennedy,but you of course being the disinfo agent you are,you ignored it since you only see what you WANT to see.Also, yeah low level ones such as congressmen, that happens to them occassionally sure,not high up ones.especially presidents MORON.presidents get away, and have got away with several crimes that citizens could never get away with including murder moron.

 I advise  everyone here to  put this jerkoff on your ignore list.I only took him off briefly to see what new lies he is saying.He can never get into a conversation without his childish name calling he displays.He is a disinfo agent  who ignores evidence as well and does not care about the truth about  ANY government  corruption.


----------



## Emma (Nov 2, 2009)

The Rabbi said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...


Then call Webb's office for yourself.


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> Liability said:
> 
> 
> > 9/11 inside job said:
> ...



LOL!

No, it is not.

Your username is a testament to the fact that you are a moron and a totally dishonest shitbag.

Moron.

Beyond that, 

well, beyond that there's no real purpose served in trying to have a conversation with a sack of shit like you.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

Speaking of moronic dishonest douche bags, how's tricks Lying Ability?  I saw in Huggy's thread that ya missed me you little freak.


----------



## DiveCon (Nov 2, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > And you know this how?
> ...


and proved Care WRONG 

btw


----------



## DiveCon (Nov 2, 2009)

Emma said:


> The Rabbi said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


or any senators/representatives office


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Speaking of moronic dishonest douche bags, how's tricks Lying Ability?  I saw in Huggy's thread that ya missed me you little freak.



No no SissyGayBikerBitch.

I didn't miss you at all.

I just find you beneath contempt and beneath notice.

So, feel obligated to go fuck yourself some more, you pussy.

That is all.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

You know, there's nothing wrong with fucking yourself.

It's called masturbation.

Seeing as it's gonna be almost impossible for you to get laid (even in a Russian whorehouse with a barrel full of rubles), you may wish to engage in some of that before the stress of being such a whiny douche gets to your ticker and ya keel over.


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> You know, there's nothing wrong with fucking yourself.
> 
> It's called masturbation.
> 
> Seeing as it's gonna be almost impossible for you to get laid (even in a Russian whorehouse with a barrel full of rubles), you may wish to engage in some of that before the stress of being such a whiny douche gets to your ticker and ya keel over.



Leave it to the stupid assbite motherfucker, GaySissyBikerBitch, to believe that its self-manipulation is the same as fucking itself.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

Well........my cock is long enough, so that if I really wanted to.........

By the way Lying Ability, what's it like to go from a depression to a smooth spot when you're excited?  Does it make you feel like the plastic Ken doll you are?


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Well........my cock is long enough, so that if I really wanted to.........
> 
> By the way Lying Ability, what's it like to go from a depression to a smooth spot when you're excited?  Does it make you feel like the plastic Ken doll you are?



Your "material" was stupid and stale when you stole it in 2nd grade.  It hasn't improved with age, ya hapless fucktard.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

No.......I actually am pretty intelligent about sex.  Nope......no fuck 'tards here.

However, I DO see an extra large asshole with teeth.


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> * * * *
> 
> However, I DO see an extra large asshole with teeth.



Exposing yourself to your mirror reflection again.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

Wrong yet again.......I'm part vampire and therefore do not cast a reflection.

Try again.


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Wrong yet again.......I'm part vampire and therefore do not cast a reflection.
> 
> Try again.



The part that's vampire must be recessive because the asshole with teeth you see in the mirror is you.  Yep.  All you.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

Speaking of third grade insults.........

"I'm rubber, you're glue, what you call me bounces off and sticks to you".

"I know you are, what am I"?

What, been picking up things from the kiddies that you're molesting in the neighborhood?


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Speaking of third grade insults.........
> 
> "I'm rubber, you're glue, what you call me bounces off and sticks to you".
> 
> ...



Silly fucktard.  There's no need to project your sexual fantasies on to others.

Nobody buys any of your shit anyway, SissyBiker.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 2, 2009)

I see that you didn't answer the question........

So, how many kids DO you tie up in your basement weekly?


----------



## Liability (Nov 2, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> I see that you didn't answer the question........
> 
> So, how many kids DO you tie up in your basement weekly?



I see you're still projecting your disturbed sex fantasies on to others, ya shitsucker.


----------



## The Rabbi (Nov 2, 2009)

wow talk about thread drift....


----------



## Care4all (Nov 2, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



  in what????  don't make me go back through the thread....  i said they were both vetted due to their committee duties???  she called her senator, he said yep....so, on that i wasn't wrong....  though no doubt there have been plenty of things i've gotten wrong....not that one!


----------



## Emma (Nov 2, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > The Rabbi said:
> ...



No.


----------



## Emma (Nov 2, 2009)

Care4all said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


Yes, I am confused again LOL

What I posted confirms what you said. Not sure how that proves you were wrong.


----------



## DiveCon (Nov 2, 2009)

Emma said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...


yes it did
she claimed they had to go through extensive security clearance
and they don't


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## DiveCon (Nov 2, 2009)

Emma said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...


no it didnt


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## The Rabbi (Nov 2, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
> ...



No, see the terms "vetted" and "given security clearance" and "had his original birth certificate examined by experts and authenticated" all mean roughly the same thing to Liberals.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Nov 3, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Speaking of moronic dishonest douche bags, how's tricks Lying Ability?  I saw in Huggy's thread that ya missed me you little freak.



I see you know about this Lying ability poster as well.
Im sure you have also noticed how when you bring up facts to him that prove what your saying is true,he evades it by not addressing it as though he never saw what you posted.lol.


----------



## Liability (Nov 3, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Speaking of moronic dishonest douche bags, how's tricks Lying Ability?  I saw in Huggy's thread that ya missed me you little freak.
> ...



A comment like that from an asshole and deranged lying sack of crap "troofer" is gonna spike the irony meter.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Nov 3, 2009)

ah  the disinfo agent LYING ability is back immediately to post.priceless.lol.


----------



## HUGGY (Nov 3, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> ah  the disinfo agent LYING ability is back immediately to post.priceless.lol.



The only truth he has ever admited to is he has bad knees.


----------



## Emma (Nov 4, 2009)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ja5oQC2Do_w]YouTube - Orly and BillO[/ame]


----------



## Modbert (Nov 4, 2009)




----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 4, 2009)

HUGGY said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> > ah  the disinfo agent LYING ability is back immediately to post.priceless.lol.
> ...



It's part of the consequences of his extra job.  I've heard tell that he's out on dark street corners, dressed up like Rue Paul, trying to score some extra meth money........

Yo, Lying Ability, buy knee pads and you wouldn't have as much trouble.


----------



## Liability (Nov 4, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> HUGGY said:
> 
> 
> > 9/11 inside job said:
> ...



Wow.  This is the best you've got.  

You typed it out.  You looked it over.  And yet you decided you wanted to hit the "submit" button anyway.

You remain beyond pathetic.


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## ABikerSailor (Nov 4, 2009)

At least I'm not the one bitching about my fucked up knees, while wiping what appears to be mayonnaise off your chin.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Nov 4, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Speaking of third grade insults.........
> 
> "I'm rubber, you're glue, what you call me bounces off and sticks to you".
> 
> ...



yep thats the ONLY way Lying Ability knows hot to debate is with third grade insults when he cant refute facts and evidence.


----------



## DiveCon (Nov 4, 2009)

Liability said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > HUGGY said:
> ...


careful man, he'll threaten to break your legs


----------



## Emma (Nov 10, 2009)

Barnett v. Obama - Motion for Reconsideration


----------



## paperview (Nov 10, 2009)

Emma said:


> Barnett v. Obama - Motion for Reconsideration


Oh 

My

God.


Orly Orly Orly.


----------



## jvn (Nov 10, 2009)

Emma said:


> Barnett v. Obama - Motion for Reconsideration



My guess is that Orly's fund raising went up significantly after she was sanctioned by Judge Land, so now she is pushing for more sanctions and possibly disbarment in order to make even more from the saps that keep sending her cash.

That, plus she's nuts!!!


----------



## Emma (Nov 10, 2009)

jvn said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Barnett v. Obama - Motion for Reconsideration
> ...



Did you read her motion?


----------



## logical4u (Nov 11, 2009)

9/11 inside job said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



So you, you personally have seen his college financial information that states he was a US citizen?  You know for a fact that: as an adult, enrolled in college that he did not claim he was a foreign citizen to gain grants or scholarships to pay for those high dollar schools he attended?  You know who paid for his college and it was all legit?

If you don't know these things, you cannot prove that this man is a US citizen, you, like the rest of us can only guess 'what' he really is.  The muslims believe that people should be judged on their merits and deeds above their words, so far, it is not looking to good for his integrity.  

If you have some proof of 'his integrity' or his 'honesty', or 'his love for this country', please provide the evidence.  I am desperately 'hoping' this man that won the office of president cares about the citizens and the country.  Not much to go on, so far.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 11, 2009)

logical4u said:


> 9/11 inside job said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



So who do you think perpetrated the crime Logi?  Did his mother get his records falsified or do you think obama did, later in life, had his records changed to state honolulu as his BIRTH PLACE on his BIRTH CERTIFICATE which his Certificate of Live Birth information MUST MIMIC, BY LAW?  

If it was obama later in life, then HOW did obama get registered as a live honolulu birthed child, with the Hawaii Dept of Health and Vital statistics Registrar, just 4 days after his birth?

And how did this Department of Health have his name and parents name to make their government Health Department weekly announcements of babies birthed in Honolulu, the following week after his birth?  This was not grandparents running the ad, this waqs a State of Hawaii Announcement section in the newspaper every week for the bureau of health statistics?

Please tell all of us any logical explanation for the State of Hawaii to have a birth certificate for Obama, and it stating Honolulu, Hawaii as his birth place.  And please provide the hawaiian Law, that permits anyone to list honolulu as their birth place, in the spot on the certificate that is slotted for BIRTH PLACE, IF THEY WERE NOT BORN HERE.

I'll check in later to see if you have found that....

I tried for days, and there IS NO LAW THAT WOULD PERMIT hawaii to list honolulu as their birth place when they were not born there, when Obama was born.

So, please, please please....any birther, give us the scenario, with some proof to support the speculation, of how Obama could have a LEGAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE ON FILE with the state of Hawaii, IF HE WAS NOT BORN THERE, just 4 days after his birth?

care


----------



## jvn (Nov 11, 2009)

Emma said:


> jvn said:
> 
> 
> > Emma said:
> ...



I did.  The only explanation I have is that she wants to be sanctioned...


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## Otter_Creek (Nov 11, 2009)

Well Grandma ain't talkin' now is she.


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## logical4u (Nov 14, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > 9/11 inside job said:
> ...



Good avoid.  His birth certificate is a technicality.  His father and step-father were both foreign citizens (that would make him a dual-citizen, unqualified).
Did he, Obama or Barry sorento or what ever his name was when he attended college, as an adult, claim to be a foreign citizen and sign legal documents as an adult, stating just that?  I don't care if his excuse was a grant or scholarship payment.  Did he, as an adult, claim to be a foreign citizen?  He will not release the documents that prove otherwise.

If you don't know these things, you cannot prove that this man is a US citizen, you, like the rest of us can only guess 'what' he really is.  The muslims believe that people should be judged on their merits and deeds above their words, so far, it is not looking to good for his integrity.  

If you have some proof of 'his integrity' or his 'honesty', or 'his love for this country', please provide the evidence.  I am desperately 'hoping' this man that won the office of president cares about the citizens and the country.  Not much to go on, so far.

As for who is perpetuating the crime, that would be, none other, than the current president.  By his lack of 'transparency', he is weakening the integrity of the office of the president of the USA.  By his lack of 'transparency', he is showing himself to be without honor and integrity as the commander and chief of our military.  He is not a leader, he is a lecturer, that is what he does.  His actions are silent (except for when it comes to hurting the USA or its citizens).  I pray for him and his family and our country that he will grow a set and become the leader we need.  I do have 'hope'.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 14, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



All I can say is that is just a bunch of partisan dribble....and meaninlgess, faux, religious rhetoric about your prayers for him imo, because you did not bother to keep your mouth shut until you researched those lies that you spewed above....just think about it, you chose to harm him, by gossiping and bearing false witness, so to say....so i seriously do have doubt on your prayers for him and his family Logic.....so just more dribble.

I have no reason to support Obama blindly, I did not vote for him.  When I first heard these claims, the dozen or so, from the Birthers, I spent days if not weeks, researching them all and researching our laws regarding it, because I THOUGHT the Birthers had some valid questions....until....through research, I found that ALL that they were claiming was nothing but hot air, and they did not have one legitimate piece of evidence that showed obama couldn't have been born in Hawaii.

NOw, how about answering those questions of mine that you say i put up to avoid your questions?


----------



## Emma (Nov 14, 2009)

One claim that Taitz and the birfers keep blathering on about is that Hawaii allows relatives or others with knowledge of a birth to submit information to the DOH and obtain a Hawaiian birth certificate. The nutters believe that Obama was born in Kenya, and his grandma (or his mother---the story changes with each telling) then rushed down to Vital Statistics and recorded his birthplace as Hawaii (knowing, of course, that 47 years later he would need this to be eligible to serve as President). 

Well, they got one thing right. Hawaii does have this procedure for obtaining Hawaiian birth certificates for children not born in the state. According to Hawaii statute §338-17.8. _That became law in *1982.*_

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM

Birfers = fail. 

Again.


----------



## logical4u (Nov 15, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



You keep calling me a liar when I am asking questions.  You have no proof that Obama did not declare himself as a foreign citizen to attend college (any one of them).  You have a snopes blog that states 'a group' was not 'real' when it claimed that.  It does not show the records and his records are unavailable for public review (by order of the transparent man, himself). 

To answer your questions, my family had announcements put in the local paper for children born out of state.  Some just listed sex and weight, and grandparents, while others listed where the child was born.  Hawaii had a policy where if a child was born out of country, it could get a Hawaiin birth certificate, up to a certain time period (I believe it was under a month).  "Theoretically", his family could have a 'legal' birth certificate for the child even if he was born in another country.  That has never been my focus.

Again, that is not where my UNANSWERED questions are.  You have not answered them and are 'spouting' kool aid answers for which you cannot prove.  That, is my entire point, that the records that could prove, one way or another, have been sealed, to prevent anyone from knowing.  If actions are all we have to go on, his are lacking.

If you don't know these things, you cannot prove that this man is a US citizen, you, like the rest of us can only guess 'what' he really is.  The muslims believe that people should be judged on their merits and deeds above their words, so far, it is not looking to good for his integrity.  

If you have some proof of 'his integrity' or his 'honesty', or 'his love for this country', please provide the evidence.  I am desperately 'hoping' this man that won the office of president cares about the citizens and the country.  Not much to go on, so far.

Again, I am not stating 'facts'.  I am asking questions, and you, like the rest of the people that are blindly protecting him, will not answer the questions and refuse to admit that there are documents that could prove it, either way.  If you do not 'know' that he claimed to be a citizen of a foreign country to attend some fairly expensive colleges (those tuitions were never explained either for a 'middle' class kid), how can you say that he didn't?  He attended more than one college, did he claim foreign citizenship (as an adult and sign the paperwork stating it), to get into those colleges?

Please feel free to call me a liar again, it shows that you, as a person, are unwilling to be reflective about the absence of proof, and instead believe a politician that has proven 'not to let the truth get in the way of a good story' (See his speeches on health care and being transparent).  Do you care to answer my questions, yet?


----------



## Emma (Nov 16, 2009)

Berg's smackdown: 

BERG v OBAMA (Original Case) - PRECEDENTIAL OPINION -Transport Room - Fullscreen


----------



## Care4all (Nov 16, 2009)

Emma said:


> Berg's smackdown:
> 
> BERG v OBAMA (Original Case) - PRECEDENTIAL OPINION -Transport Room - Fullscreen



Why bother?  it won't be read?


----------



## Emma (Nov 16, 2009)

Care4all said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Berg's smackdown:
> ...



Too bad. It's quite entertaining


----------



## Liability (Nov 16, 2009)

Care4all said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Berg's smackdown:
> ...



I read it.

It was very much on the smackdown side, too.

I'm not a "birther," either (although I readily admit I am closer to being a "birther" than many folks who deride that belief with the dismissive term).

But the smackdown was NOT on the merits of whether President Obama WAS definitively born outside of the USA or not.

The smackdown was on the manner in which the legal "case" was "presented."

A true embarrassment.


----------



## Emma (Nov 16, 2009)

Liability said:


> But the smackdown was NOT on the merits of whether President Obama WAS definitively born outside of the USA or not.



Never said it was. 


I suspect the judiciary is getting a bit fed up with these nutcases.

DOC 21 - Rivernider (and Lincoln) v US Bank Natl Assn, ORDER to SHOW CAUSE Re Fraudulent Filing

Poor Orly.


----------



## Liability (Nov 16, 2009)

Emma said:


> Liability said:
> 
> 
> > But the smackdown was NOT on the merits of whether President Obama WAS definitively born outside of the USA or not.
> ...



I don't believe I ever suggested that YOU had said the "smackdown" was on the merits ofthe main issue.  I just wanted to clarify that I was not making that claim.

It WAS a smackdown, imho.  But it was a smackdown premised on the highly questionable professionalism of the legal presentation.

That being said, it is abundantly clear to me that the whole topic is never going to get any actual legal challenge worthy of the name.  It is, effectively, therefore, a dead-letter issue.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 16, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



*I DISAGREE, you are lying, because YOU have no support for your own accusations, either lying or WILLFULLY STAYING IGNORANT, because the PROOF is right before your eyes, if you would only open them to the research and what the facts say.... 

what you say, is merely fabricated stuff and impossible to even occur, BECAUSE OF THE LAWS in Hawaii regarding this...

I don't mean to be so harsh Logical....it is more out of frustration and all the time I have spent researching all of these far fetched accusations myself, only to find it is clear as day once researched, that what is being accused, isn't even in the realm of possibilities....

Care*

Here are the rules:



> Who is Eligible to Apply for an Amended Certificate of Birth?
> 
> As provided by law (HRS §§338-17.7, 338-20.5), the following persons may apply for an amended certificate of birth:
> 
> ...



And here is who can apply for a late registration of birth...which is already not applicable to Obama because his birth WAS REGISTERED ON AUGUST 8, 1961, 4 days after his birth.



> Who is Eligible to Apply for Late Registration?
> 
> As provided by law (HRS §§338-15, 338-29.5), the following persons may apply for late registration:
> 
> ...


----------



## Emma (Nov 16, 2009)

Care4all said:


> And here is who can apply for a late registration of birth...which is already not applicable to Obama because his birth WAS REGISTERED ON AUGUST 8, 1961, 4 days after his birth.



He was born at 7:24 pm on a Friday. Meaning it was registered on the second business day after his birth. 

Also, just a couple of points related to what you posted above, that the birthers seem to ignore:



> Here are the rules:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hawaiian statute §338-20.5  [Adoption; foreign born persons] became law in *1979*. 

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol06_Ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0020_0005.htm

Hawaiian statute §338-17.7 [Establishment of new certificates of birth, when.  (a)  The department of health shall establish, in the following circumstances, a new certificate of birth for a person born in this State who already has a birth certificate filed with the department and who is referred to below as the &#8220;birth registrant&#8221;:] became law in *1973*.

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol06_Ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0007.htm

However, the statute in effect when he was born states: 



> §338-16  Procedure concerning late and altered birth certificates.
> 
> (a)  Birth certificates registered one year or more after the date of birth, and certificates which have been altered after being filed with the department of health, *shall contain the date of the late filing and the date of the alteration and be marked distinctly &#8220;late&#8221; or &#8220;altered&#8221;.*



http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol06_Ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0016.htm

His certificate is NOT marked "late" or "altered", therefore it _wasn't_ amended. The information on the COLB is what was contained on the original birth certificate.


----------



## DiveCon (Nov 16, 2009)

i dont understand WHY you guys are digging up these facts for people that will only reject them


----------



## logical4u (Nov 16, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



For the fourth, maybe fifth time, the birth certificate is not where my primary QUESTIONS (not accusations) are.  My questions are about Obama's early adulthood when he declared himself a citizen (of where, we do not know) to get into college.  Did he declare himself to be a foreign citizen to ease financial costs for some very expensive colleges?  Did he declare himself to be a US citizen at that time?  There is no way to know because 'Mr. Transparency' will not allow those documents to be viewed.  If he, the president declared himself to be a foreign citizen as a young adult, and signed paperwork stating that 'declaration', then he would be ineligible.  I am amazed that the same people that wanted Bush to find all his paperwork concerning his National Guard service are BLINDLY ignoring what could be an unlawful usurping of this nation.  Where are your stones, I mean fortitude?
PS If the 'transparent one' would present the documents that proved him to be eligible, it would be hard to ask any more questions on this subject.  Why do you, 'you' think he will not release documents that have been released by other presidents (not all)?  Doesn't it make you wonder what the 'transparent one' is HIDING?
Your lack of evidence that he IS a US citizen (or claimed to be a US citizen as a young adult), makes you look as if you are protecting a 'liar'.  All you can present are arguements that he is eligible, not any proof.  How do you expect to sway people by saying "I looked it up and I am satisfied, I know I have no evidence, but TRUST ME, I know"?


----------



## jvn (Nov 17, 2009)

Logi -

Your "question" is kind of silly.

Someone, somewhere speculates that the President with the foreign sounding name MUST have lied about his American citizenship in order to get extra financial aid to go to college, and you feel that this is somehow a legitimate issue?

Please.

Tell you what.  Find us a member of the Foreign Student's Association at Occidental when the President was there who will testify (under oath, of course) that "Barry and I talked often about all of the financial aid we were getting because we were foreign students..."  

Then maybe I would agree that Occidental should release the President's records.

Forcing people or institutions into spending time and money to humor the legal fishing expeditions of cranks doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  That's why no judge yet has allowed any of the so called "plaintiffs" in these cases to have discovery.

Others have speculated that Glen Beck raped and killed a girl in 1989.  Why won't Beck produce his proof of where he was that year?  I mean, his employers no doubt hav documents showing that he as at work, right?  If he wasn't a rapist and murderer, why wouldn't he show us that proof?

Get some evidence and get back to us...


----------



## Emma (Nov 17, 2009)

What cracks me up about Orly and the rest in all these ridiculous lawsuits is that they are demanding Obama provide "proof" (of whatever---if anything---would satisfy them). They seem to forget that the burden of proof is on _them_, not Obama.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 17, 2009)

Like I've said many times before..........

McCain was taking heat from the Democrats when he first started running (I think it was Hillary that started it), by talking about him being born in Panama to American parents stationed abroad.

After that was settled?  The Republicans decided to use the same tactics on Obama, which is where the birthers got their start.

I'm also wondering why a Russian Jew (who has NO US CITIZENSHIP) is bitching about this anyway?  Shit......doesn't she have her own country to go hassle and spew crap in?


----------



## DiveCon (Nov 17, 2009)

actually, it was started by the clinton machine
at least thats the rumor


----------



## Emma (Nov 17, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> actually, it was started by the clinton machine
> at least thats the rumor



I wouldn't be so sure


----------



## logical4u (Nov 17, 2009)

jvn said:


> Logi -
> 
> Your "question" is kind of silly.
> 
> ...



Is Beck the 'leader of the free world'?  
Is he the 'commander and chief' that must command the respect of his military command?  
Is Beck going around the world, taking SUBMISSIVE poses in front of other national leaders?  
Is Beck acting like he is ashamed of this country and everything it represents?  
Did Beck go into China and complement 'them' on their civilization, while NEVER praising the 'people' of the USA?  
Is Beck trying to subvert the Bill of Rights by forcing an unconstitutional health care bill on taxpayers (over 50% that do not want it)?
Is Beck trying to 'cap n trade' our energy to a point where people can no longer afford to cool/heat their homes?  
Is Beck pushing for immigration (illegal) reform to be passed next year?
Is Beck supporting 'green' causes over human life (valley in CA where farmers lose, fish win)?
Is Beck bringing terrorists into the US and giving them a trial that "citizens" must pay for, that is not a right for foreign army members?
Is he bringing terrorists into middle America, promising (we have seen how well those promises have worked) citizen safety?

Just a few things that this president is doing that makes me question: EVERY SINGLE THING ABOUT HIM.  I have requested any evidence that would prove that he loves this country, its culture(s) and its people, any sign that he wants this country to remain strong and independent, any evidence that the 'plans' he proposes will not destroy this country ('cause a lot of 'em have been tried elsewhere and failed, see: Venuzuela, Cuba, Zimbawe).  Please, feel free to add you examples to the list of ZERO.

If Glen Beck committed a crime, he will pay, hopefully in this life, if not, he will in the next.  He cannot influence my life, unless, I choose to let him.  That other one, is trying to subjugate me, my family and my country.  Maybe you will walk through fire for the false god, not me.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 18, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



But logi, wanting college information on him is not the same issue as where he was born or birthed, except your part on wanting to see who he got aid from to pay for his college??

If you accept his COLB then why all these questions about whether he received foreign aid or not...

SINCE HE WAS BORN IN HONOLULU, as his COLB STATES, why the pending questions by you on foreign aid?  WHAT even makes you THINK that he received foreign aid for you to be so concerned over it?   This is what i am talking about....WHY even question whether he received foreign aid?????  Is there any proof that he was given foreing aid for you to even question it?  Or is this ANOTHER THING that you all PULLED OUT OF THE AIR, that you expect him to answer...?

so essentially you MAKE UP A LIE that he received foreign aid, and then want him to answer up and prove that he did not receive foreign aid?

just toooooo much scumminess for me...but continue to have at it....


----------



## jvn (Nov 19, 2009)

Logi -

It seems that you have some very heartfelt POLITICAL reasons to not vote for the President when he runs for re-election in 2012.

But I think it is a mistake to turn those policy disagreements into attempts to overturn past elections.

Fringe politics very rarely influence policy.

So work hard to fight on legitimate political ground and may the best ideas win!

Otherwise you doom yourself and what might be your worthy ideas to obscurity.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 19, 2009)

Still, you have to wonder just what Mr Obama is hiding from us. Because there is little doubt he is hiding something.


----------



## logical4u (Nov 19, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > Care4all said:
> ...



For the fifth, maybe sixth time, I feel it is important to know if the president of the USA declared 'himself' to be a foreign citizen to get through college.  If he did, he is not eligible to serve as the POTUS.  I am not making anything up, I am asking questions that should have been answered before he could become a canidate.  If the people that determine this has been derilict in their duties, it is our job as citizens to question why.  The press has all its people trying to find out how much toilet paper Sarah Palin uses and if she double flushes.  They have never done 'serious' investigative reporting on our current president.  This thread wanted to know about the birthers, since, I think they have a legitimate beef, I responded and added some other questions, THAT HAVE NEVER BEEN ANSWERED WITH DOCUMENTS.
You seem to want to ridicule and poke fun at people that would like to know the truth.  Is that because you can't imagine anyone wanting the law applied equally?  Does it bother you to think, that maybe the Obama voters jumped to conclusions (with the help of the press)?  Does it bother you that this president is doing NOTHING to grow this country?  Or is it because you think it is more important to hide the truth?
As I have said in previous posts, the man that could end this with a stroke of a pen, has spent around a million dollars hiding these documents from public view, why?
Are you afraid of the truth?

Now, if patterns repeat themselves, you will call me a liar for ASKING questions, and provide no, that is zero answers (because the documents are not available for you, either).   Ready....set...go...


----------



## Emma (Nov 19, 2009)

logical4u said:


> *For the fourth, maybe fifth time, the birth certificate is not where my primary QUESTIONS (not accusations) are. *
> 
> <snip>
> 
> *For the fifth, maybe sixth time, I feel it is important to know if the president of the USA declared 'himself' to be a foreign citizen to get through college.  If he did, he is not eligible to serve as the POTUS. *



Declaring himself a foreign citizen to get into college wouldn't change the fact that he was born in Hawaii in 1961 and is therefore eligible to serve as POTUS. IF he did such a thing, it would not strip him of his citizenship. That's not how it works. 

 At the most, he'd be guilty of fraud and owe someone some money.


----------



## Emma (Nov 19, 2009)

Here's a freebie for ya. His Selective Service registration. (somehow I missed all the hoopla over this one)

Obamas Forged Selective Service Registration | Obama Conspiracy Theories


Attorney Debbie Schlussel is the main proponent of this conspiracy theory at debbieschlussel.com, and I call it a conspiracy theory because the claim is that a document obtained through the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) from the federal government is faked, and this would require a government cover-up to have taken place.

Robert Stevens asks:

"_From the analysis provided by Debbie Schlussel, there is something very amiss with what purports to be Obamas Selective Service registration. Were the documents the result of a forgery by a helpful clerk? Were they the result of a coordinated effort or a request from the Obama Campaign itself? Would the email correspondence show evidence of this? The telephone records? Was there a reason it took around a year to get ahold of this document? Why does the document appear to be a fake?

I think there is enough evidence here to suggest a crime has taken place_"

This is another one of those Barack Obama cannot become President because stories. Someone claiming to be an expert found various anomalies with the FOIA obtained copy of Barack Obamas selective service registration. US law at various times required Americans to register for the draft. The purported anomalies including a file number that seems to have too many digits and a postal stamp that was obsolete. Update: Since the writing of this story, Internet investigators have come up with many examples of the same postal stamp used on registered mail from the same time period when Obama registered; that is, the postal stamp is just fine.

Part of the claimed evidence is the difference between a 27 year old signature from Obama from the supposed Selective Service registration and his signature today.








As someone who has had occasion to sign his name 100 times in a day, I can fully appreciate how a signature changes dramatically towards something simpler and faster when you do it as much as Barack Obama must.

Any time you have a claim that a government agency, in this case, the Selective Service, is faking documents, some serious evidence is required to back it up. So far the evidence hasnt risen to the level of serious.

------

March 30, 2009 at 3:45 pm   (Quote)
I received this email today from the SSS

FW: SSS Document Locator Numbers

Sent By:
Richard Flahavan On:	Mar 03/30/09 12:09 PM
To:	REDACTED@REDACTED.net

Dear Mr. Arduini:

Facts will never trump speculation by conspiracy theorists. But the reality is the following:

a. The 10-character Document Locator Number (DLN) was placed on Selective Service Registration Forms beginning prior to the establishment of our current Data Management Center on 31 August 1981.

b. Prior to 1981, the DLN configuration was different from what is used today.

c. At that time when Mr. Obama registered, the first three characters (089) indicated that the form was keyed in by one of the contract keying centers  in this case 089 equated to the Internal Revenue Service.

d. Later, an 11th digit was added to the DLN just prior to Y2K to differentiate another decade.

Thus, the first three characters of the DLN do NOT represent the year the form was keyed into the SSS registrant database, despite what some may hold dear.

Richard S. Flahavan
Associate Director, Public and Intergovernmental Affairs
Selective Service System National Headquarters





[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE[/ame]


----------



## Care4all (Nov 20, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...



logi, why do you even speculate or even think obama lied and claimed he was a foreign citizen to get school financial aid?  

what makes you say such? or basically what kind of proof do you have to even MAKE THIS ACCUSATION and then on top of that... expect obama to answer your 'made up' accusation?

for the third or fourth time, DO YOU HAVE ANY PROOF, that obama claimed to be a foreign student... yes or no answer please.


----------



## jvn (Nov 20, 2009)

To follow up Care's question Logi,

Do you question whether or not George Bush claimed some financial aid that he wasn't entitled to?

Bill Clinton?

Ronald Reagan?

Mitt Romney? (His father was born in Mexico, you know, making Romney a potential Mexican citizen...)

For you to be making this claim applying to only President Obama makes it seem like you do so solely because of his "foreign sounding" name and his skin color...


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 20, 2009)

The question of Mr Obama possibly receiving aid as a foreign student arises from the  possibility that when he was Adopted By an Indonesian citizen he may have lost his American Citizenship. Unfortunately the records regarding all this have been hidden or covered up somehow also.

Again there is little doubt that Mr Obama is hiding something. Just no idea what.


----------



## Jay Canuck (Nov 20, 2009)

*[SIZE=+1][/SIZE]* 
*[SIZE=+1]
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




[/SIZE]*
*[SIZE=+1][/SIZE]* 
*[SIZE=+1][/SIZE]* 
*[SIZE=+1]Rage Grows In America[/SIZE]* 
*Racism, Conspiracy Theories Fuel Anti-Government Fervor* 

* Link* * Excerpt:* 
Rumors about gun confiscations.  Angry protests about the government's tax policies, replete with Nazi comparisons. A resurgent militia movement.  Rage at the election of a president deemed to be illegitimate and threatening. Distrust and anger toward the government fueled by paranoia and conspiracy theories. They are among the crosscurrents of anger and hostility that have swept certain sectors of the country since Obama took office nearly a year ago.  And they are contributing to "a toxic atmosphere of rage in America," according to the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), which today issued a report looking at the various sources that have given rise to a climate of anti-government fervor in the United States. Since Obama became president we have seen a tremendous amount of anger and hostility," said Abraham H. Foxman, ADL National Director.  "There is a toxic atmosphere of rage in America being witnessed at many levels, and it raises fundamental questions for our society."


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 20, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> The question of Mr Obama possibly receiving aid as a foreign student arises from the  possibility that when he was Adopted By an Indonesian citizen he may have lost his American Citizenship. Unfortunately the records *requarding* all this have been hidden or covered up somehow also.
> 
> Again there is little doubt that Mr Obama is hiding something. Just no idea what.



First question.........what is "re quard ing"?

Second question.........what the fuck is it about you that made you such a paranoid pussy?

I thought Army guys were supposed to be brave.  But then again.........from your look in your avi, I'm guessing a REMF.

Am I right?  Main reason I ask is because you REMF motherfuckers like to gossip like little old women and bring up conspiracy theories.

Inquiring minds wanna know Ollie.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 20, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > The question of Mr Obama possibly receiving aid as a foreign student arises from the  possibility that when he was Adopted By an Indonesian citizen he may have lost his American Citizenship. Unfortunately the records *requarding* all this have been hidden or covered up somehow also.
> ...



Ah you actually caught me with a mis-spelling. Isn't that precious. And no I was not a REMF. But I am obviously smart enough to know that no one uses lawyers to bury their paperwork unless they have something to hide. I say again, Mr Obama is hiding something, What, I haven't a clue.

Never knew you could tell what a man did by looking at a picture. maybe I should post an updated one someday.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 20, 2009)

Well.......considering that I can read your fitness level from your pic (8 years as a Physical Fitness Counselor), you kinda look a bit soft.

Sort of like the Pillsbury Dough Boy.

And from what I can read of your ribbons, they look like you got 'em because you had a pulse and could fog a mirror.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 20, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> Well.......considering that I can read your fitness level from your pic (8 years as a Physical Fitness Counselor), you kinda look a bit soft.
> 
> Sort of like the Pillsbury Dough Boy.
> 
> And from what I can read of your ribbons, they look like you got 'em because you had a pulse and could fog a mirror.




Well, most people would think that was a respectable display of salad for 1987. The only one I wear today is the National Defense ribbon. It's the only one that truly matters. At any rate, at least I am honest enough to put the picture out there. And not ashamed as you would have me be.  Nice try though. But I'm also not some thin skinned punk kid. 

I do still wonder why you want to try to degrade other veterans and retirees....Is your own self esteem that low?

Oh not that it's any of your business but my PT score was usually around 260 out of a possible 300, Respectable. Never claimed to be super Sergeant. In fact I don't brag about anything I've done. Look in the mirror much?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 20, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Well.......considering that I can read your fitness level from your pic (8 years as a Physical Fitness Counselor), you kinda look a bit soft.
> ...



National Defense?  THAT is the one that matters most to you?  REALLY?  

Well, considering that when you only wear a few ribbons, you generally wear only the top 3 awards.

Me?  3 Navy Achievements, several Expeditionary Medals, as well as some other rather decent PERSONAL, not UNIT awards.

Apparently, unlike you, I actually did something with my career, which is why I don't keep looking for stupid conspiracy theories.

Oh yeah.....260 out of 300?  Well.........during the time I was PRT coordinator at the War College in Newport RI, when it came to PRT, there were 2 top scores in the command each cycle.  Lt Roux's and mine.

It was a toss up each cycle to see who would beat each other.  Scores were ALWAYS 296 to 300.

Try again Dough Boy (which incidentally, is a WWI term for an army dude). 

Oh yeah..........the reason they made me PRT coordinator?  I raced bicycles.  My average mileage PER DAY was 50 - 150 miles.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 20, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > ABikerSailor said:
> ...



Brag much? Some day I might list my awards and decorations, if there is ever a need. Other than that, 2 Awards of the National Defense. Yes I consider those the most important. It means I served during 2 separate times of national conflict. No Brag, just fact.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 20, 2009)

You know..........National Defense Service medals are awarded to ANYONE during a time of war.



> Criteria: a. The National Defense Service Medal was awarded for honorable active service for any period between 27 June 1950 and 27 July 1954; between 1 January 1961 and 14 August 1974; between 2 August 1990 and 30 November 1995 and between 11 September 2001 and a closing date to be determined. For the purpose of the award, the following persons will not be considered as performing active service:
> 
> (1) Guard and Reserve forces personnel on short tours of duty to fulfill training obligations under an inactive duty training program.
> 
> ...



Me?  I place more value on my Expeditionary Medals.  Why?  Simple........you actually have to go to the conflict zone to earn them.

National Defense?  All you need is a pulse and an honorable.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 20, 2009)

Please see previous post.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 21, 2009)

So........in other words......you didn't do anything special.

Okay.  Got it.

You're a class A pud.


----------



## Emma (Nov 21, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> The question of Mr Obama possibly receiving aid as a foreign student arises from the  possibility that when he was Adopted By an Indonesian citizen *he may have lost his American Citizenship*. Unfortunately the records regarding all this have been hidden or covered up somehow also.
> 
> Again there is little doubt that Mr Obama is hiding something. Just no idea what.



One does not "lose" their US citizenship that easily. First of all, you must be of age. Second, I've seen no proof of any 'adoption'. 

POTENTIALLY EXPATRIATING ACTS

Section 349 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1481), as amended, states that U.S. citizens are subject to loss of citizenship if they perform certain *specified* acts *voluntarily and with the intention to relinquish U.S. citizenship*. Briefly stated, these acts include:


obtaining naturalization in a foreign state (Sec. 349 (a) (1) INA);


taking an oath, affirmation or other formal declaration to a foreign state or its political subdivisions (Sec. 349 (a) (2) INA);


entering or serving in the armed forces of a foreign state engaged in hostilities against the U.S. or serving as a commissioned or non-commissioned officer in the armed forces of a foreign state (Sec. 349 (a) (3) INA);


accepting employment with a foreign government if (a) one has the nationality of that foreign state or (b) an oath or declaration of allegiance is required in accepting the position (Sec. 349 (a) (4) INA);


formally renouncing U.S. citizenship before a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer outside the United States (sec. 349 (a) (5) INA);


formally renouncing U.S. citizenship within the U.S. (but only under strict, narrow statutory conditions) (Sec. 349 (a) (6) INA);


conviction for an act of treason (Sec. 349 (a) (7) INA).

(italics in original)

Advice about Possible Loss of U.S. Citizenship and Dual Nationality


BTW, Indonesia does NOT allow dual nationality, and neither does Kenya.


----------



## Emma (Nov 21, 2009)

US CODE: Title 8,1481. Loss of nationality by native-born or naturalized citizen; voluntary action; burden of proof; presumptions

§ 1481. *Loss of nationality by native-born or naturalized citizen; voluntary action; burden of proof; presumptions*


(a) A person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by voluntarily performing any of the following acts with the intention of relinquishing United States nationality

(1) obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application or upon an application filed by a duly authorized agent, *after having attained the age of eighteen years*; or


(2) taking an oath or making an affirmation or other formal declaration of allegiance to a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, *after having attained the age of eighteen years*; or


(3) entering, or serving in, the armed forces of a foreign state if
(A) such armed forces are engaged in hostilities against the United States, or
(B) such persons serve as a commissioned or non-commissioned officer; or


(4)
(A) accepting, serving in, or performing the duties of any office, post, or employment under the government of a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, *after attaining the age of eighteen years* if he has or acquires the nationality of such foreign state; or

(B) accepting, serving in, or performing the duties of any office, post, or employment under the government of a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, *after attaining the age of eighteen years* for which office, post, or employment an oath, affirmation, or declaration of allegiance is required; or


(5) making a formal renunciation of nationality before a diplomatic or consular officer of the United States in a foreign state, in such form as may be prescribed by the Secretary of State; or


(6) making in the United States a formal written renunciation of nationality in such form as may be prescribed by, and before such officer as may be designated by, the Attorney General, whenever the United States shall be in a state of war and the Attorney General shall approve such renunciation as not contrary to the interests of national defense; or


(7) committing any act of treason against, or attempting by force to overthrow, or bearing arms against, the United States, violating or conspiring to violate any of the provisions of section 2383 of title 18, or willfully performing any act in violation of section 2385 of title 18, or violating section 2384 of title 18 by engaging in a conspiracy to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, if and when he is convicted thereof by a court martial or by a court of competent jurisdiction.

(b) Whenever the loss of United States nationality is put in issue in any action or proceeding commenced on or after September 26, 1961 under, or by virtue of, the provisions of this chapter or any other Act, the burden shall be upon the person or party claiming that such loss occurred, to establish such claim by a preponderance of the evidence. Any person who commits or performs, or who has committed or performed, any act of expatriation under the provisions of this chapter or any other Act shall be presumed to have done so voluntarily, but such presumption may be rebutted upon a showing, by a preponderance of the evidence, that the act or acts committed or performed were not done voluntarily.


[note the title of this statute... NATIVE born or naturalized. The only two legally recognized types of US citizenship, for those who claim there's a difference between "native born" and "natural born".]


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## Emma (Nov 21, 2009)

President Obama could not have simply "lost" his US citizenship by living in Indonesia (even if he HAD been adopted), and although the US does allow for dual citizenship, Kenya and Indonesia do NOT; furthermore, he returned to the US long before his 18th birthday, therefore Obama is a US citizen. And since by statute there are only two forms of US citizenship --- native born and naturalized --- he is eligible to serve as POTUS as a native born (i.e. NATURAL born) citizen.


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## Care4all (Nov 21, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> The question of Mr Obama possibly receiving aid as a foreign student arises from the  possibility that when he was Adopted By an Indonesian citizen he may have lost his American Citizenship. Unfortunately the records regarding all this have been hidden or covered up somehow also.
> 
> Again there is little doubt that Mr Obama is hiding something. Just no idea what.



A born American can NOT lose their citizenship as a child....they are not of legal age to swear their allegiance to a new country, or to give up their citizenship....

once i looked up the law it made sense, and it should to you as well....you can't TAKE someones citizenship away easily and one must be of LEGAL AGE to give it up.

obama was nearly 5 years old when he got to indonesia and was there  about 3-4 years before being sent back to his grandmother in hawaii....on the application for the school obama was sent to in indonesia by his step father, it lists HAWAII as his birth place as well.


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## SFC Ollie (Nov 21, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> So........in other words......you didn't do anything special.
> 
> Okay.  Got it.
> 
> You're a class A pud.





Nope nothing special at all. At least nothing that I consider worth bragging about. Unlike other people we have heard from. 

Simply put, you go ahead and Brag all you like, I simply do not choose to do so. And that's Sergeant First Class A pud. to you.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 21, 2009)

No......it's just pud.  You're a civilian now.


----------



## Emma (Nov 22, 2009)

Birther scorecard: 

http://tesibria.typepad.com/whats_your_evidence/BIRTHER CASE LIST.pdf

_Excellent_ summary, sourced well with numerous links to decisions, etc. 

Credit: tes @ politijab


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 22, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> No......it's just pud.  You're a civilian now.




Fact is that it is acceptable to use your retired Rank as a formal form of Address. I choose to do so. We even get mail addressed to us as SFC & Mrs..............

You may be called shithead, But I am addressed as SFC.


----------



## Emma (Nov 23, 2009)

Is the pissing contest over yet ?


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 23, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > No......it's just pud.  You're a civilian now.
> ...



Yeah........Shithead First Class Pud Whacker.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 23, 2009)

Emma said:


> Is the pissing contest over yet ?




I'm not sure if he is done bragging yet or not. I hope so, It really gives a bad name to Military retirees.


----------



## jvn (Nov 25, 2009)

Not for nothing Biker, but just how proud of those "Navy Expeditionary Force" medals should you be?

As far as I know the Navy sits miles away and tosses shells and sends up planes to bomb the other side's ground forces.  Unless you're a pilot, that means you sat miles away from danger, and you got a medal for that?  And you're proud of that?

While I may not agree with Ollie's theories on the President, at least he was on the ground where they were taking incoming fire.

The US Navy hasn't faced real incoming fire from a peer since the middle of 1945.

The row boats of Saddam Hussein don't count, and neither do the catamarans of the Taliban...

While I applaud your service, I obviously don't applaud it as much as you do yourself.


----------



## ABikerSailor (Nov 25, 2009)

jvn said:


> Not for nothing Biker, but just how proud of those "Navy Expeditionary Force" medals should you be?
> 
> As far as I know the Navy sits miles away and tosses shells and sends up planes to bomb the other side's ground forces.  Unless you're a pilot, that means you sat miles away from danger, and you got a medal for that?  And you're proud of that?
> 
> ...



"As far as you know"?  Really, you think that the Navy sits miles away?  Ummm......we were 1 mile off the shore of Beruit when we took fire, and the shell was in the water VERY close to us.

No, just because we haven't had a pitched Naval battle doesn't mean that the Navy hasn't had to deal with stuff.......ever hear of the Cole?  Yeah......that "catamaran" couldn't do much damage either.

Don't tell me.......you're another fucking civvie that's read too many Tom Clancy novels, just like that REMF Ollie.


----------



## SFC Ollie (Nov 25, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> jvn said:
> 
> 
> > Not for nothing Biker, but just how proud of those "Navy Expeditionary Force" medals should you be?
> ...




How can you even stand being you,

 All Brag little fact.

It would be funny if not so tragic.

Serving 20 is enough bragging rights for anyone. Or at least for most. Now shut your swabbie squid ass up already.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 26, 2009)

Emma said:


> Is the pissing contest over yet ?



guess not?


----------



## logical4u (Dec 3, 2009)

Emma said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > *For the fourth, maybe fifth time, the birth certificate is not where my primary QUESTIONS (not accusations) are. *
> ...



So are you saying our commander and chief is a fraud and a crimminal and you would be okay with that?


----------



## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...





Your username is a misnomer, eh?


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## DiveCon (Dec 3, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Emma said:
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> > logical4u said:
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first off, it would be "Commander IN Chief"
and second, that's not what she said at all


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## logical4u (Dec 3, 2009)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
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I have not "accused" him of anything.
Short answer: I have NO PROOF.
The FACT is: I know very little about the man in the white house.  Usually, the press does a bang up job of pointing out all the failings of men BEFORE they are elected.  As I have stated in earlier posts, it makes you wonder....the fact that this particular person, that claims to be transparent spends over a million dollars keeping that information away from the public's eyes, makes me question what he has to hide.  This thread was started asking people why they thought O was not legitimate.  For those of us trying to answer and point out that no one knows (other than Mr. Transparency), it is disappointing to be called: liars, racists, blind, etc.  
Now DO YOU HAVE ANY PROOF, that obama is a legitimate citizen....yes or no answer please.


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
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Yes. 

Now do you have PROOF he isn't?


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## logical4u (Dec 3, 2009)

Emma said:


> logical4u said:
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> > Care4all said:
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Did you read my post?  Your proof is his word?


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## DiveCon (Dec 3, 2009)

logical4u said:


> Emma said:
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> > logical4u said:
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no, the proof is his COLB and the verifications of many Hawaiian state officials


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

What he said


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 3, 2009)

Yet so much about Mr Obama remains unknown and hidden. WHY? It is really a simple question; What is Mr Obama hiding from the world? Don't you think the people have a right to know?


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

Hidden? Like what? 

lol

There's nothing he's "hiding" that I feel I have a right to know.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 3, 2009)

Emma said:


> Hidden? Like what?
> 
> lol
> 
> There's nothing he's "hiding" that I feel I have a right to know.





You are lost. I want to know if he was ever an Indonesian citizen. I want to know what his papers in college were written about. I want to see his college transcripts. I want to know how he traveled to Pakistan while supposedly a poor broke college kid at Harvard. 

And yes we have the right to know these things about our president. At least the left demanded similar things about bush, and got them.

But then I bet you never cared about that did you..............


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Hidden? Like what?
> ...



No, I didn't. It had no bearing on Bush's job as President, and what you list here has no bearing on Obama's.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 3, 2009)

Emma said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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> > Emma said:
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Whatever, I would rather know more about the man with the Nuclear football in his control.


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## DiveCon (Dec 3, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma said:
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and shes telling the truth on that Ollie
she didnt give a rats ass about Bush's guard records or his college stuff
she was one of the few libs(shes really more of a moderate but she claims to be a libs )


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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> > Emma said:
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You take that back!


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## Modbert (Dec 3, 2009)

Who the fuck cares how they did in college? I don't see how judging a man in his 40's or beyond by his records from 20 years prior is even relevant. As long as they got a degree, they had to pass.


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma said:
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I fail to see how what you listed has anything to do with Obama (or any President) having the capability to fire nuclear weapons, or their decision (God forbid) to do so.


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## Modbert (Dec 3, 2009)

Emma said:


> I fail to see how what you listed has anything to do with Obama (or any President) having the capability to fire nuclear weapons, or their decision (God forbid) to do so.



I want his drawings from the first grade. God knows the little Antichrist fucker had pictures of wanting to hang whitie from the time he could draw. 


...


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

BTW: 

I want to know if he was ever an Indonesian citizen.

The answer would be 'no'. Indonesia does not recognize dual citizenship, and it must be applied for as an adult (and giving up US citizenship must be done voluntarily as an adult).


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## DiveCon (Dec 3, 2009)

Dogbert said:


> Who the fuck cares how they did in college? I don't see how judging a man in his 40's or beyond by his records from 20 years prior is even relevant. As long as they got a degree, they had to pass.


it sure mattered to a lot of libs a few years ago


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## Modbert (Dec 3, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> it sure mattered to a lot of libs a few years ago



Don't make wide spreading generalizations about Liberals. Wouldn't want wide spreading generalizations made Conservatives on this subject would you? The people who thought Bush was a Dictator Nazi who was behind 9/11 are not representative of Liberals. Just like the people who think Obama was not born here, is an Atheist Muslim, etc are not representatives of Conservatives.

Though, these numbers should concern you:

Public Policy Polling: ACORN

&#8220;Birthers&#8221; a majority among Republicans « Why Evolution Is True


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## Emma (Dec 3, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> Dogbert said:
> 
> 
> > Who the fuck cares how they did in college? I don't see how judging a man in his 40's or beyond by his records from 20 years prior is even relevant. As long as they got a degree, they had to pass.
> ...



Perhaps to a number of loud-mouths who screeched about it back then, but no one I ever knew gave a damn.


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## ABikerSailor (Dec 4, 2009)

I'd like to know where Bush Jr. was when he was supposed to be serving as a pilot in the military, yet can't provide proof of being there.


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## Emma (Dec 4, 2009)

ABikerSailor said:


> I'd like to know where Bush Jr. was when he was supposed to be serving as a pilot in the military, yet can't provide proof of being there.



Bush Records


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## DiveCon (Dec 4, 2009)

Dogbert said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
> 
> > it sure mattered to a lot of libs a few years ago
> ...


since when is saying "a lot" a broad brush???
learn to read boy
lol


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## DiveCon (Dec 4, 2009)

Emma said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > I'd like to know where Bush Jr. was when he was supposed to be serving as a pilot in the military, yet can't provide proof of being there.
> ...


see, it mattered to a lot of libs and there is an example


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 4, 2009)

Dogbert said:


> Who the fuck cares how they did in college? I don't see how judging a man in his 40's or beyond by his records from 20 years prior is even relevant. As long as they got a degree, they had to pass.





Not so much as how they did, but what they were thinking. You cannot deny that the collage years is what has shaped many of us.


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## rightwinger (Dec 4, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Dogbert said:
> 
> 
> > Who the fuck cares how they did in college? I don't see how judging a man in his 40's or beyond by his records from 20 years prior is even relevant. As long as they got a degree, they had to pass.
> ...



If we were all held accountable for the stupid things we thought in College, nobody would get elected.

I was a right wing conservative.


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## ABikerSailor (Dec 4, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Dogbert said:
> 
> 
> > Who the fuck cares how they did in college? I don't see how judging a man in his 40's or beyond by his records from 20 years prior is even relevant. As long as they got a degree, they had to pass.
> ...



Actually, everything that you're going to do, as well as how you're going to react, is fully formed inside your psyche by the time you're 10.

The years that shaped me the most?  From 6 until 12.  Why?  Went through more shit in those 6 years than most people do by the time they're 50.

Might explain my "don't fuck with me" attitude.

And.........if what you said is true, then why do we give felons a second chance?  You DO realize that when inmates are placed in positions of trust, around 70 percent of them live up to it?

Nope, I believe everything that shapes you is in place by the time you're 10.


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## Care4all (Dec 5, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > Hidden? Like what?
> ...



read the law....your answer is right before your eyes, yet you refuse to see or read it.

Mr obama COULD NOT BE an indonesian citizen at 6 years old, due to the LAW of both the usa and of indonesia.  This HAS BEEN EXPLAINED many times.....but PLEASE feel free to research it YOURSELF, to get your own questions answered.

What is with this lackadaisical attitude that keeps you from doing such?  Do you need help with this....?  I can teach you how to research the subject and the laws regarding this if you need me to....

This makes you look bad ollie, unknowledegable, uninformed....ignorant...on the topic....  

IS this what you truly want to portray about yourself? 

care


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 5, 2009)

Care4all said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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Yes and Eots and his crowd have explained how the twin towers were destroyed by Bush too. Doesn't make it true. Perhaps I am not so well versed in legaleze. I can read and comprehend but maybe I don't know where to read this law. So I ask. Asking a question does not make one ignorant of anything except the answer. So can you answer all the other questions too? For instance why did he stop going by Barry and start using Barrack after meeting his Pakistani college buddies? I believe he was born in Hawaii, but i also believe he is hiding something, besides being very very bad for the USA.


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## Polk (Dec 5, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


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You're the one in the Eots column, thinking that there has been a massive bipartisan conspiracy to cover for Obama.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 5, 2009)

Polk said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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I have never said there was any conspiracy, Simply asking what the man is hiding. If it is not evident to you that he is hiding something then I'm sorry for you. But I understand how so many believe he can do no wrong and no harm. You'll wake up one day.


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## HUGGY (Dec 5, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


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I agree that he is hiding something.  I believe he was told what the real deal is by some powerful nasty people that can make bad things happen.  I believe if he told the world what he was told he wouldn't live another year.  We all sit around and ramble on to nauseum like we know what is going on.  We just witnessed what the HMO's are willing to do to keep thier strtangle hold on americas health care.  They did this all out in the open...a great big fuck you ...you stupid assholes...we are going to take even more of your money and there isn't a fuckin thing you can do about it.  What do you think the military industrial complex people told BO behind closed doors?  They said.."this is the way it is gonna be punk...Remember Wellstones little accident?"  People that sell bullets and bombs are not squeemish about getting thier way.


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## Care4all (Dec 5, 2009)

SFC Ollie said:


> Polk said:
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> > SFC Ollie said:
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IF he is hiding something of importance from us that will hurt us, I SERIOUSLY DOUBT it was him living in Indonesia when he was 6 years old, and also seriously doubt it is something from college 27 years ago.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 5, 2009)

Care4all said:


> SFC Ollie said:
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I haven't a clue, but he is hiding something, It may be something as stupid as his parents not being married, I don't know. But I want to know. And I want to know why his papers in college have been blocked. Michele's weren't blocked, only Barry's.


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## logical4u (Dec 9, 2009)

DiveCon said:


> logical4u said:
> 
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> > Emma said:
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So you don't know the doctor's name, the hospital where he was born, etc.  You have a certificate (that does not contain that information) that Hawaiins would give to newborns that were born out of country.  Because it is for 'Mr Transparency', you believe?  That is not proof, that is an illusion.


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## SFC Ollie (Dec 9, 2009)

rightwinger said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Dogbert said:
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Sorry to hear about your head injury.


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## Emma (Dec 9, 2009)

logical4u said:


> DiveCon said:
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Wrong.


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## ABikerSailor (Dec 10, 2009)

logical4u said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
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> > logical4u said:
> ...



No, what is an illusion is your belief that Hawaii would issue a birth certificate to someone who wasn't born there.

Matter of fact, I can't think of a single country that would give you a birth certificate if you weren't born there.  

Epic fail.


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## Emma (Dec 17, 2009)

HSB Birth Announcement 081461

Sorry birthers. One of your ilk paid the newspaper for access to their archives, hoping to find the Obama birth announcement a fake. 

Alas. 

It was real.


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## Emma (Jan 9, 2010)

RHODES v MacDONALD - OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT - 9-14-09 Hearing

Holy crap!

After reading this, I think O Rly ought to thank her lucky stars she only got hit with a $20K sanction.


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## paperview (Jan 9, 2010)

Emma said:


> RHODES v MacDONALD - OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT - 9-14-09 Hearing
> 
> Holy crap!
> 
> After reading this, I think O Rly ought to thank her lucky stars she only got hit with a $20K sanction.


Morning Emm!  

I just popped that open, but it's like 60+ pages long.

Any highlights I should look for specifically?


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## Emma (Jan 9, 2010)

paperview said:


> Emma said:
> 
> 
> > RHODES v MacDONALD - OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT - 9-14-09 Hearing
> ...



Really? I honestly didn't notice it was that long lol. Not sure I could pick out any specific highlights---the whole thing is a wealth of Teh Crazy that is our Orly. I especially like the argument that the Geneva Convention wouldn't apply to the good doctor because Obama isn't the legitimate president and therefore if she (Dr. Rhodes) were to be captured by the enemy, they could therefore behead her. Because she wouldn't have protection of the GC... 

Yeah. I'm sure that is utmost in their minds...

_"Dammit! We can't behead this prisoner! Their Commander in Chief is for reals!"_

Trust me... it's worth the read and it goes pretty fast. The only thing that slowed me down was my hysterical laughter at every turn


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## paperview (Jan 9, 2010)

Emma said:


> paperview said:
> 
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Ok.  Thanks Emm.  I'll check it out later.
For some reason the page is a clunky read for me cause of their set up.  It might be my Firefox, No Script add on settings, but I don't like that's it's not an easy HTML page scroll down.

Nonetheless, always fun to read about the batshititdies goofiness.

Have you seen what one of the other Birther Kings, Andy Martin (just saying his name makes me laugh) is up to lately as he actually _tries_ to get elected?


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## Care4all (Jan 9, 2010)

logical4u said:


> DiveCon said:
> 
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l4u
How about a LINK or some PROOF that Hawaii, or any state for that matter, would issue a birth certificate for newborns, born out of the country....and what the procedure for doing such was or is...
good luck!

then look at the official, legal, registration date of Obama's birth with Vital statistics, just a day or two after he was born....

Come on l4u, are you really incapable of doing your own research....?

or is it just too easy to repeat the dishonest statements of some birthers regarding this...?

Care


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## Liability (Jan 9, 2010)

Emma said:


> RHODES v MacDONALD - OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT - 9-14-09 Hearing
> 
> Holy crap!
> 
> After reading this, I think O Rly ought to thank her lucky stars she only got hit with a $20K sanction.



Regardless of the merits of the doubt about the President's actual NBC status, I have to agree with Emma that Ms. Orly Taitz, the lawyer bringing that case, DESERVED to be sanctioned.  There was *nothing* wrong with the judge noting that she represented the party bringing the request for the Temporary Restraining Order (TRO) and that she, therefore, bore the burden of proof.  And when the Judge RIGHTLY asked her whether she had laid a proper foundation for the alleged African Birth Certificate (and let's be clear, the answer was "no"), she snidely argued TO the Judge that the Judge was being biased.  

Yeah.  Imagine the NOIVE of dat guy demanding that a lawyer comply with the rules of procedure and the rules of evidence!

She was in contempt in my view.  And I think *she* also served to undermine whatever appearance of rationality the side doubting President Obama's Natural Born Citizenship status may have had or hoped to get.


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## Emma (Jan 10, 2010)

paperview said:


> Emma said:
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lol yeah

Funny thing... didn't he run for President at some point ? And one of HIS parents was not born in this country?


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## Emma (Jan 10, 2010)

Liability said:


> And I think *she* also served to undermine whatever appearance of rationality the side doubting President Obama's Natural Born Citizenship status may have had or hoped to get.



It's pretty clear now why Rhodes fired her... and then Orly continues to file to the Court on Rhodes behalf (a no-no, I presume). 

Orly has single-handedly made the birthers irrelevant. And she is mental. I'm convinced of that. She's getting crazier and crazier, paranoid as all hell. I don't suggest going to her site to check it out, though. It's swarming with malware and trojans and stuff.


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## Emma (Jan 10, 2010)

paperview said:


> Ok.  Thanks Emm.  I'll check it out later.
> For some reason the page is a clunky read for me cause of their set up.  It might be my Firefox, No Script add on settings, but I don't like that's it's not an easy HTML page scroll down.



BTW, I find it easier to read and scroll on 'fullscreen'.


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## feudal22 (Jan 10, 2010)

Never trust a person who isnt having at least one crisis. -HITLER-


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## logical4u (Jan 10, 2010)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > DiveCon said:
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November 26, 2008 
Why the Barack Obama Birth Certificate Issue Is Legitimate
By Joe the Farmer

"1.  Under Hawaiian law, it is possible (both legally and illegally) for a person to have been born out of state, yet have a birth certificate on file in the Department of Health.


A. From Hawaii's official Department of Health, Vital Records webpage: "Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country" (applies to adopted children).  


B. A parent may register an in-state birth in lieu of certification by a hospital of birth under HRS 338-5.


C. Hawaiian law expressly provides for registration of out-of-state births under HRS 338-17.8.  A foreign birth presumably would have been recorded by the American consular of the country of birth, and presumably that would be reflected on the Hawaiian birth certificate.


D. Hawaiian law, however, expressly acknowledges that its system is subject to error.  See, for example, HRS 338-17.


E. Hawaiian law expressly provides for verification in lieu of certified copy of a birth certificate under HRS 338-14.3.


F. Even the Hawaii Department of Home Lands does not accept a certified copy of a birth certificate as conclusive evidence for its homestead program.  From its web site:  "In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."



2.  Contrary to what you may have read, no document made available to the public, nor any statement by Hawaiian officials, evidences conclusively that Obama was born in Hawaii.


A. Associated Press reported about a statement of Hawaii Health Department Director Dr. Fukino, "State declares Obama birth certificate genuine."


B. That October 31, 2008 statement says that Dr. Fukino "ha personally seen and verified that the Hawai'i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama's original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."  That statement does not, however, verify that Obama was born in Hawaii, and as explained above, under Hawaiian policies and procedures it is quite possible that Hawaii may have a birth record of a person not born in Hawaii.  Unlikely, but possible.


C.  The document that the Obama campaign released to the public is a certified copy of Obama's birth record, which is not the best evidence since, even under Hawaiian law, the original vault copy is the better evidence.  Presumably, the vault record would show whether his birth was registered by a hospital in Hawaii.


D. Without accusing anyone of any wrongdoing, we nevertheless know that some people have gone to great lengths, even in violation of laws, rules and procedures, to confer the many benefits of United States citizenship on themselves and their children.  Given the structure of the Hawaiian law, the fact that a parent may register a birth, and the limited but inherent potential for human error within the system, it is possible that a parent of a child born out-of-state could have registered that birth to confer the benefits of U.S. citizenship, or simply to avoid bureaucratic hassles at that time or later in the child's life.  


1. We don't know whether the standards of registration by the Department of Health were more or less stringent in 1961 (the year of Obama's birth) than they are today.  However, especially with post-9/11 scrutiny, we do know that there have been instances of fraudulent registrations of foreign births as American births.


2. From a 2004 Department of Justice news release about multiple New Jersey vital statistics employees engaged in schemes to issue birth certificates to foreign-born individuals:  "An individual who paid Anderson and her co-conspirators for the service of creating the false birth records could then go to Office of Vital Statistics to receive a birth certificate . . . As part of the investigation, federal agents executed a search warrant of the HCOVS on Feb. 18, 2004, which resulted in the seizure of hundreds of suspect Certificates of Live Birth which falsely indicated that the named individuals were born in Jersey City, when in fact, they were born outside the United States and were in the United States illegally . . . Bhutta purchased from Goswamy false birth certificates for himself and his three foreign-born children." 


3.  Even before 9/11, government officials acknowledged the "ease" of obtaining birth certificates fraudulently.  From 1999 testimony by one Social Security Administration official:  "Furthermore, the identity data contained in Social Security records are only as reliable as the evidence on which the data are based. The documents that a card applicant must present to establish age, identity, and citizenship, usually a birth certificate and immigration documents-are relatively easy to alter, counterfeit, or obtain fraudulently."


3.  It has been reported that the Kenyan government has sealed Obama's records.  If he were born in Kenya, as has been rumored even recently, the Kenyan government would certainly have many incentives to keep that undisclosed.  Objectively, of course, those records may prove nothing.  Obama's refusal to release records at many levels here in the United States, though, merely fuels speculation.


4.  Obama has refused to disclose the vault copy of his Hawaiian birth certificate.  This raises the question whether he himself has established that he is eligible to be President.  To date, no state or federal election official, nor any government authority, has verified that he ever established conclusively that he meets the eligibility standard under the Constitution.  If the burden of proof were on him, perhaps as it should be for the highest office of any individual in America, the more-than-dozen lawsuits challenging his eligibility would be unnecessary.


A. Had he disclosed his vault copy in the Berg v. Obama lawsuit (which was the first lawsuit filed on the question of his eligibility to be President), and it was established he was born in Hawaii, that would have constituted res judicata, and acted to stop other similar lawsuits being filed.  Without res judicata (meaning, the matter is adjudged and settled conclusively) he or government officials will need to defend other lawsuits, and valuable court resources will be expended.  Strategically from a legal standpoint, therefore, his refusal to disclose doesn't make sense.  Weighing factors such as costs, resources and complexity of disclosing versus not disclosing, he must have reason of considerable downside in disclosing, or upside in not disclosing.  There may be other reasons, but one could speculate that he hasn't disclosed because:


1. He was not born in Hawaii, and may not be eligible to be President;


2. He was born in Hawaii, but facts that may be derived from his vault copy birth certificate are inconsistent with the life story he has told (and sold);


3. He was born in Hawaii, and his refusal to provide the best evidence that he is a natural born citizen is a means by which to draw criticism of him in order to make him appear to be a "victim."  This would energize his supporters.  This would also make other charges about him seem suspect, including his concealment about ties to Bill Ayers and others of some infamy.  Such a clever yet distasteful tactic would seem to be a Machiavelli- and Saul-Alinsky-style way to manipulate public opinion.  But while this tactic may energize his supporters, it would convince those who believe him to be a manipulator that he's not only just that, but a real pro at it.  This would indeed be the basest reason of all, and would have repercussions about his trustworthiness (both here and abroad), which Americans know, is a characteristic sorely lacking in its leaders.


B. His motion to dismiss the Berg case for lack of standing could be viewed as contemptuous of the Constitution.  See, "Who Enforces the Constitution's Natural Born Citizen Clause?"  Are we to expect yet another White House that hides behind lawyers, and expects Americans to swallow half-truths on a just-trust-me basis?


C. This issue poses the potential for a constitutional crisis unlike anything this country has seen.  Disclosure at this stage, however, could even result in criminal sanctions.  See, "Obama Must Stand Up Now Or Step Down." Thus, he has motive not to disclose if he were ineligible.


The question not being asked by the holders of power, who dismiss this as a rightwing conspiracy, is what's the downside of disclosing?  This is a legitimate issue of inquiry because Barack Obama has turned it into one.  The growing number of people who demand an answer in conformance with the Constitution are doing their work; the people's watchdogs aren't.


The pen name Joe the Farmer pays tribute to Joe the Plumber, who had the audacity to ask a question."

I think that part of the article justifies questions about President Obama's eligiblity or integrity enough to keep asking.  If you want to take 'him' at his word, there is a short history (of his time in office) where the lies keep piling up (transparency, open gov, no lobbyist, etc).  In my experience, people do not learn to lie like that overnight; it takes decades of practice.


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## Care4all (Jan 11, 2010)

logical4u said:


> Care4all said:
> 
> 
> > logical4u said:
> ...




*LINK please, or it gets removed.

Also, ONCE AGAIN you take the easy way out and do NOT read the law itself and the procedure of the Law and can NOT explain, how obama's birth certificate could be filed with the State of Hawaii within a few days of his birth if it was amended or requested by out of State parents.  

What is your problem?  LOOK UP THE LAW itself, read it, and TRY to comprehend it...INSTEAD of taking this "Joe the Farmer's" take on it.  PLEASE.*


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## ABikerSailor (Jan 11, 2010)

How's about we start calling him "Illogical Joe"?


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## logical4u (Jan 11, 2010)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
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> > Care4all said:
> ...




I thought "Joe the Farmer" had a very logical explanation, and at the time read the links to the Hawaian info.  I admit I am being lazy, but when it has been explained so well, why try to cloud the waters?

I understand you want to trust Obama.  He won the election.  Still, there are too many unanswered (not transparent) questions.  If he acted like he care about the United States or the people that live here (and did not go around the world assuming the position for leaders that would do us harm if given a chance), or if he actually acted like a "leader" instead of an arrogant tenured college professor, shaking his finger at citizens like they were helpless students, dependent on 'him' for a grade, the issue might drop.  But when he intentionally insults Americans (terrorists on trial in NYC, slamming intellegence for being invasive and then for not 'connecting the dots', ruining the economy, ensuring higher unemployment by his lack of vision/clear plan, plans to tax, charge or fee every working person or business into oblivion, encouraging mini-kingdoms with czar blindness, and leaving our energy sources and production evaporate), then some of us are wondering just who is this undocumented worker in the WH.  If you want to kiss his feet, that is okay by me.  I know people like that. 

 I get it, you are hurt when someone can't see things from your perspective, sorry, I am ruined, I have worked and known MEN (not boy suits) that were true leaders with integrity beyond question; they made mistakes and owned them, they didn't blame it on someone else, they didn't cry and whine and carry around pictures of themselves.  They saw what needed to be done and made it happen (they didn't form groups and give out class assignments, so IF someone came up with a good idea, they could claim it as their own).  The only hope for me 'believing' in this president, is to see his documentation, not 'his' word, not Nancy P's 'word', but the proof.  

Until you can provide me with that documentation, you can call me lazy, you can call me a right winger, you can call me a conservative, just don't call me fooled.


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## paperview (Jan 11, 2010)

> Until you can provide me with that documentation, you can call me lazy, you can call me a right winger, you can call me a conservative, just don't call me fooled.



After reading the tripe you post, most people will call you stupid and gullible.


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## Care4all (Jan 11, 2010)

paperview said:


> > Until you can provide me with that documentation, you can call me lazy, you can call me a right winger, you can call me a conservative, just don't call me fooled.
> 
> 
> 
> After reading the tripe you post, most people will call you stupid and gullible.



let me add, ''Intentionally'' before both of those....which makes it worse, imho.


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## logical4u (Feb 12, 2010)

It goes on: It could all end with documents produced, until them.....theories continue:

February 07, 2010 
Another Look at Obama's Origins
By Jack Cashill
The murky circumstances of Obama's birth invite attempts to make the known facts fit together. This article was prompted by two e-mails. The first asked me why I had never weighed in on the birth certificate controversy surrounding President Barack Obama.  


I responded that although I was troubled by the lack of documentation regarding all phases of Obama's history -- I'd be content with his SAT scores -- I could not understand why any pregnant American woman would go anywhere near Kenya.


The second e-mail was more interesting. It came from a Michigan entrepreneur named Don Wilkie, with whom I had not previously communicated. Knowing my interest in the authorship questions surrounding Obama's writing, he presumed that I was intrigued as he was by a cryptic poem the nineteen-year old Obama wrote called "Pop," the best thing that Obama himself has actually written.  He was right.


"Pop" relates an encounter between Obama and a man most reviewers presume to be Obama's maternal grandfather, Stanley Dunham. Dunham would have been in his early sixties at the time. In the poem, Obama has "Pop" wondering drunkenly about the boy, "What to do with me, a green young man."  


The Obama of the poem is cynical, even a little bitter. He makes several allusions to the fact that he and the old man look and even smell alike, a fact that strikes Obama as more ironic than reassuring. The poem ends, however, with reconciliation when Pop stands and asks for a hug. Writes Obama:


I see my face, framed within&#8232;
Pop's black-framed glasses&#8232; 
And know he's laughing too.


Wilkie offers a novel interpretation of "Pop." Says Wilkie, "I think the poem zeros in on that poignant moment when Obama was told that his grandfather was in reality his father." 


Wilkie concedes his theory is "off-the-wall," but he also offers photographic evidence to show that Obama much more closely resembles Dunham -- especially by the telltale ears -- than he does Barack Obama, Sr.  


Intriguing as the theory is, I thought it would be easy to disprove. I was wrong. For starters, in his 1995 memoir Dreams From My Father, Obama refers to his grandfather not as "Pop," but as "Gramps." If he were writing about his grandfather in this poem, the title "Pop" may very well be suggestive of a more direct kinship.


For another, there is little known about the marriage between Stanley Ann Dunham, Obama's presumed mother, and Barack Obama, Sr. According to most accounts, Dunham and Barack Sr. were married on the Hawaiian island of Maui -- in some reports on February 2, 1961, and in others, on February 21.


Obama knows little about the wedding.  He writes in Dreams, "In fact, how and when the marriage occurred remains a bit murky, a bill of particulars that I've never quite had the courage to explore. There's no record of a real wedding, a cake, a ring, a giving away of the bride." 


In his fair-minded biography, Barack and Michelle: Portrait of an American Marriage, Christopher Andersen concedes, "There were certainly no witnesses -- no family members were present; and none of their friends at the university had the slightest inkling they were even engaged." 


Another conflicting bit of evidence is that at the time of his alleged marriage to Ann Dunham, Barack Sr. had a pregnant wife and a son back in Kenya. There is more. In July 2008, speaking at a university roundtable, Michelle Obama said of Barack's mother that she was "very young and very single when she had him." This could well have been a slip of the tongue, but it may not have been. 


Obama was reportedly born roughly six months after the February wedding date on August 4, 1961. Andersen reports that Barack Sr. drove Ann to Honolulu's Kapiloani Hospital for Women and Children to have the baby.


Andersen's account, however, suffers from chronology problems. He relates that Ann told the Dunhams of her pregnancy in "late October." Even if she had she been impregnated in early October -- it probably would have been earlier -- Obama's official birth date came ten months later. 


In any scenario, Obama had at least one black parent, and if it is not Obama Sr., who then is it? Obama offers a possible clue in Dreams:  


I was intrigued by old Frank, with his books and whiskey breath and the hint of hard-earned knowledge behind the hooded eyes. The visits to his house always left me feeling vaguely uncomfortable, though, as if I were witnessing some complicated, unspoken transaction between the two men, a transaction I couldn't fully understand. The same thing I felt whenever Gramps took me downtown to one of his favorite bars, in Honolulu's red-light district. 


The "Frank" in question is Frank Marshall Davis, a black communist, pornographer, and poet who had abandoned Chicago for Hawaii. In "Pop," it should be noted, the Pop character "recites an old poem" just before the reconciliation and reeks of whiskey. Davis would have been in his mid-seventies at the time. Some have theorized that Davis, in fact, is Obama's father and the "Pop" of the poem. This theory, though tenuous, cannot be ruled out. A grandson can look more like his maternal grandfather than his father. That happens. And then, too, there is Davis's Chicago connection.


The "Frank" passage and the ones that follow, however, tell us something suggestive about Stanley Dunham, namely that he frequented otherwise all-black bars in an area rife with prostitution. That a black woman -- perhaps a friend of Davis's -- gave birth to a child of Dunham's may explain "the complicated, unspoken transaction between the two men." If this were the case, it would have caused far less societal stress for Ann Dunham to assume maternity of her little brother than for Stanley Dunham to assume paternity of his son.  


We also know that Stanley Dunham so desperately wanted a boy that he named his only child "Stanley Ann." That he chose to raise the young Barack would not have been out of character. 


Is it possible that Barack Sr. obliged the Dunhams and went along with the charade? If so, as Andrew Young attests in The Politician, he would not have been the last good friend to claim false paternity for a larger cause.


As a Kenyan, Barack Sr. would have given the boy more than a name. He would give him a distinctive identity as an "African," a more respected ethnicity in the America of the 1960s than "Negro." Indeed, Obama has built his career around his exotic identity. Were he named after an American father -- say "Darnell Johnson" -- he may never have been elected president.


This hypothetical extended charade would help explain why Barack Sr. blithely blew off his new family when he headed for Harvard a year later, rejecting a reported opportunity to take both wife and child to New York, and began dating as soon as he arrived at Harvard. It would explain too why Ann Dunham felt free to leave young Barack with her parents for years at a time when her career beckoned.


Barack Sr.'s cooperation would also put Stanley Dunham's fondness for him in perspective.  In Dreams, Gramps speaks so respectfully of his prodigal son-in-law that the whole opening sequence rings false to anyone who knows the larger story. A man, and a black man at that, has knocked up Dunham's daughter. Ann and Barack Sr. marry despite reported opposition from both families. The man then abandons wife and child, and the grandfather can only sing his praises to the man's son. This makes no sense at all and would have made even less sense in the racially charged 1960s.


Jerome Corsi of WorldNetDaily has found additional evidence that argues against Obama's birth to Ann Dunham in August 1961. As the records clearly show, "Stanley Ann Dunham" enrolled for classes at the University of Washington at Seattle on August 19, 1961, fifteen days after Obama's presumed birth. It defies all logic -- and logistics as well -- that Dunham would have flown her newborn across the Pacific, found an apartment and a job, and enrolled at school all within two weeks of the birth.


Most accounts put young Barack with Dunham in Seattle when she was attending college, but the sourcing on these accounts is suspect. One person cited often is Dunham's good childhood friend, Maxine Box. In February 2008, Box told the Seattle Times that the last time she saw Dunham was "in 1961," when, says Times reporter Nicole Brodeur, "[Dunham] visited Seattle on her way from Honolulu to Massachusetts, where her then-husband was attending Harvard."  


"She seemed very happy and very proud," Box tells the Times of Dunham. "She had this beautiful, healthy baby. I can see them right now."


There are any number of problems with this account, beginning with the fact that Barack Sr. did not attend Harvard until the fall of 1962. Box also gives no sense that Dunham lived in Seattle or attended classes there through the winter and spring sessions of 1962, as records show she did. Whether Dunham was actually heading for Harvard, we have no real way of knowing.  


A seeming hole in Andersen's account is that he missed the Washington adventure and has Ann remaining in Hawaii through Obama's first few years. He makes no mention of any trip to Harvard by Ann.


One other scenario makes sense out of a falsely assumed paternity by Barack Sr. This begins with the abrupt departure of the Dunham family from the Seattle area in the late summer of 1960. In Dreams, Obama tells how pleased the senior Dunhams were with the success of Ann in high school, but Stanley forbade her to go to the University of Chicago, "deciding that she was still too young to be living on her own."





Soon thereafter, however, the family decamped for Hawaii.  


"Something must have still been gnawing at my grandfather's heart," writes Obama. He attributes the move to his wanderlust and the "limitless" prospects offered by a new furniture store in Honolulu. Adds Obama, "He would rush home that same day and talk my grandmother into selling their house and packing up yet again."


What Obama does not mention is that even at this time, his grandmother, Madelyn Dunham, likely earned more than her furniture salesman husband. To move, she had to give up her job as a bank officer in Seattle. Arriving in Honolulu, she worked as a by-the-hour bank teller. This job would, however, have given her the opportunity to tend to the young Barack.  


It seems altogether possible that the progressive and adventurous seventeen-year-old Dunham was impregnated by a black man while the family was still living in the Seattle area. If so, this pregnancy could have prompted the family to uproot to Hawaii, where no one knew them and where mixed-race babies were more accepted. According to the Andersen account, whose source was Maxine Box, "There were loud arguments between father and daughter -- fights that sometimes turned violent." Ann did not want to go.


Both the "Dunham as father" and the "anonymous black father" scenarios would make the Obama camp wary of sharing Obama's actual birth certificate, either because Dunham was not Obama's mother, or, if she were, because Obama was born much earlier than August 4, 1961.  


If Obama were born, say, in February or March 1961, it would clarify why, as documented, Dunham attended the University of Hawaii at Manoa in the fall semester of 1960, but not in the spring semester of 1961. This timetable would have also allowed Dunham enough time to recover and prepare for a return to college in Seattle in August with or without the baby. Dunham would not return to the University of Hawaii until 1963. She filed for divorce in 1964, and little was heard from Barack Sr. ever again.


Scientists use the phrase "inference to the best explanation" to illuminate an unproven phenomenon. Given the available evidence, including the fact that some evidence has been strategically withheld, one can infer that Obama likely was born in Hawaii but that Ann Dunham did not give birth to Barack Obama, Sr.'s child on August 4, 1961.


So much depends on Obama's fabled "story," however, that the mainstream media have chosen not to investigate. When Christopher Andersen tried, he found himself immersed in a swamp of conflicting and concocted stories that tested the savvy of even a veteran biographer.  


And so Obama's birth remains a mystery a year after his inauguration. The mainstream media, meanwhile, have paid more attention to the origins of Trig Palin than to those of the president, and they have spent their excess energy mocking those who do the reporting they once did.  


If my humble efforts to clarify matters make me a "birther," then so be it.


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## Emma (Feb 12, 2010)

logical4u said:


> Jerome Corsi of WorldNetDaily has found additional evidence that argues against Obama's birth to Ann Dunham in August 1961. As the records clearly show, "Stanley Ann Dunham" enrolled for classes at the University of Washington at Seattle on August 19, 1961, fifteen days after Obama's presumed birth. It defies all logic -- and logistics as well -- that Dunham would have flown her newborn across the Pacific, found an apartment and a job, and enrolled at school all within two weeks of the birth.



Jerome Corsi needs to learn to read. 

Look at upper left. Date entered: 3/26/1962

Now look at lower right. The classes she enrolled in August of '61 were *extension and correspondence courses. *


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## Care4all (Feb 12, 2010)

logical4u said:


> It goes on: It could all end with documents produced, until them.....theories continue:
> 
> February 07, 2010
> Another Look at Obama's Origins
> ...



jimminee cricket logical....have you even read what is written and how SKEWED AND BIASED AND RACIST AND BIGOTED  it is?

*also

please GIVE THE LINK AND SHORTEN THIS COPY YOU PASTED, ACCORDING TO BOARD RULES...

*


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## logical4u (Feb 13, 2010)

Care4all said:


> logical4u said:
> 
> 
> > It goes on: It could all end with documents produced, until them.....theories continue:
> ...



February 07, 2010

American Thinker: February 2010 Archives

Another Look at Obama's Origins
Jack Cashill
The murky circumstances of Obama's birth invite attempts to make the known facts fit together. More 

just pointing out that until the documents are presented, the theories will get wilder and wilder.  The person who could end a lot of crap floating around out there, like....health care control, energy expense tax, oil hoarding, muslim extremists emboldenment...will not say where he stands or show the documents that could prove otherwise.

IF (that is a mighty big IF, but of course, no documents will come forward to prove otherwise) his "grandfather" was really his father and Obama was told the truth when he was older; it would explain his comment about his grandmother being "a typical white woman".  That statement never made sense....

Love the intrigue, if he keeps it up, people will be accusing him of stealing Barry Sorento's identity from when the "real" Barry went to Pakistan.  The tales keep growing, here and abroad.

When will the real "Barack Obama" stand?


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## ABikerSailor (Feb 13, 2010)

Shit........Obama could place his official birth certificate in a glass case right next to the Constitution, with full color pictures of him coming outta his mother, under a sign that says Hawaii, and you fuckers would still think he was Kenyan.

Fuck y'all..........quit listening to Limp Idiot and the Wasilla Chihuahua.  They're not doing it for telling the truth, they're doing it for PUBLICITY TO MAKE MONEY!!!!!

Conflict and strife sells.  Ever heard the saying in the news industry?

If it bleeds, it leads.


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## Cal (Feb 13, 2010)

ABikerSailor said:


> Shit........Obama could place his official birth certificate in a glass case right next to the Constitution, with full color pictures of him coming outta his mother, under a sign that says Hawaii, and you fuckers would still think he was Kenyan.
> 
> Fuck y'all..........quit listening to Limp Idiot and the Wasilla Chihuahua.  They're not doing it for telling the truth, they're doing it for PUBLICITY TO MAKE MONEY!!!!!
> 
> ...



Exactly.

Also, Why was there a birth announcement for a Barack H. Obama Jr. in Hawaii's newspaper right around the time BHO was born? Let me guess, Obama's mom KNEW he was gonna run for President?


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## Emma (Feb 14, 2010)

YoungLefty said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Shit........Obama could place his official birth certificate in a glass case right next to the Constitution, with full color pictures of him coming outta his mother, under a sign that says Hawaii, and you fuckers would still think he was Kenyan.
> ...



But of course


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## Care4all (Feb 14, 2010)

YoungLefty said:


> ABikerSailor said:
> 
> 
> > Shit........Obama could place his official birth certificate in a glass case right next to the Constitution, with full color pictures of him coming outta his mother, under a sign that says Hawaii, and you fuckers would still think he was Kenyan.
> ...



OHHHHHH, it is EVEN BETTER than THAT!!!!

Obama's parents or grand parents did not run the Birth anouncement in the 2 Honolulu, Hawaii newspapers at the time....NOPE, they did not run these Birth Announcement Ads back in August of 1961....  The State of Hawaii Health Bureau ran a Government Announcement section in these Newspapers every week to announce the birth of new Hawaiian born babies, such as Barak Obama and marriages that took place the previous week.....

These Birthers are suggesting that the State of Hawaii Health Bureau was in cahoots with the Obama, unknown obama family to hide the fact that he was not born there and to falsify certified records of the state for his Honolulu birth...BACK IN 1961!  

These people supporting the birthers are certifiable, at this point....they do not use their own God given ability to reason and are only being partisan hacks, I'm afraid to say.

And in the beginning of this movement, I can understand the support...at least to a degree...but after all the facts are out and things like what I mentioned above are taken in to consideration and reasoned with, they should have dropped their initial support for this lunacy....!  Again, in my humble opinion.


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## SFC Ollie (Feb 14, 2010)

Obama could still end the questioning by releasing the long form of his Birth Certificate. The only reason he will not do this is because it will show that his parents were not legally married. And who really gives a shit about that today?


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## ABikerSailor (Feb 14, 2010)

Obama could, just like I said, yet all you Orly Taint motherfuckers are gonna keep saying he's a Kenyan Muslim who is hell bent on bringing socialism to this country in the form of health care.

You dipshits also state that he's making this country less safe.

But question............how much safer were we under Bush Jr. and his little house of horrors?


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## Emma (Feb 15, 2010)

SFC Ollie said:


> Obama could still end the questioning by releasing the long form of his Birth Certificate.



The State of Hawaii does not release "long form" birth certificates.


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## Care4all (Feb 15, 2010)

the Supreme court, over a hundred years ago, ruled that the constitution supports EACH STATE to determine qualifications for their own citizens of their state....once a person is a citizen of any state, they are a citizen of the United States.


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## SFC Ollie (Feb 15, 2010)

Emma said:


> SFC Ollie said:
> 
> 
> > Obama could still end the questioning by releasing the long form of his Birth Certificate.
> ...



My guess is that if the President of the United States asked for it, that the State of Hawaii would find a way to release it......


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## ABikerSailor (Feb 15, 2010)

Really?  Did they exist back then, or do you have a time travel device Ollie?


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## SFC Ollie (Feb 15, 2010)

Did someone fart in here?


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## logical4u (Feb 17, 2010)

ABikerSailor said:


> Obama could, just like I said, yet all you Orly Taint motherfuckers are gonna keep saying he's a Kenyan Muslim who is hell bent on bringing socialism to this country in the form of health care.
> 
> You dipshits also state that he's making this country less safe.
> 
> But question............how much safer were we under Bush Jr. and his little house of horrors?



That remains to be seen: 
one man killing people on a military base, yelling about allah
one man trying to blow up a plane over the Detroit area
Iran threatening anyone that isn't willing to bow down (not a problem for our Prez) to them
Sudan prirates taking ships and hostages whenever the mood takes them
Chavez climbing into the nuclear bed with Iran
Putin humiliating our Prez on the international stage
Our allies are now openly critical of THIS administration
The people that hold our securities (loans) are dumping them, because they no longer trust the USA to do the right thing
Our congress wants to defend our country on a budget so they can re-distribute the wealth thru handouts
Our gov wants to take over health care (if you deny health care to social security recipients, social security is no longer BROKE)
Our gov is limiting the amounts of energy or the fuel that provides energy, and trying to raise taxes on the energy we use to "function".
Our gov will have to raise taxes on every single person to pay off the debt it owes
Our gov will not spending and digging us deeper into debt
Our gov does not want to do the jobs spelled out in the Constitution: keeping the borders safe, and protecting the citizens
Homeland Security is a lot more concerned with tracking down citizens that vocalize a different OPINION than the administration
Homeland Security (and the administration) thinks the war is with obesity, and not extremists that spend millions of dollars every year, just to get the opportunity to KILL Americans.

Does any of that make you "feel" safe?


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## ABikerSailor (Feb 18, 2010)

I actually feel safer under Obama than I did under Bush Jr.

Why?  No torture, or wiretapping of me or mine.  Remember Homeland Security?  It has a strangely Nazi like structure.


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## logical4u (Feb 18, 2010)

ABikerSailor said:


> I actually feel safer under Obama than I did under Bush Jr.
> 
> Why?  No torture, or wiretapping of me or mine.  Remember Homeland Security?  It has a strangely Nazi like structure.



Do you mean the "Homeland Security" run by Jannet N.?  Are you talking about the one that believes its own citizens are a bigger threat to national security than muslim extremists?  I think you are right, it does have a "strangely Nazi like structure".


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