# Dow Hits 36,000!  Profits soaring!!



## citygator

Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?


*Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap

Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.

The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.

More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


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## progressive hunter

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,


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## Dogmaphobe

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,


The democrat plan of destroying small business so income is redistributed to the technocrats is working like a charm.


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## blackhawk

Interesting I remember others telling us how the stock market wasn’t a true reflection of how the economy was doing during that same timeframe. Liberals enjoy complaining about this terrible economy.


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## Dekster

....and now comes the big thud.  Record PE's are unsustainable.  How is that margin debt looking?


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## theHawk

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.



Inflation! Ain’t it great?


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## citygator

Wall Street Journal is reluctantly celebrating. 









						Dow Briefly Jumps Above 36000, Finishes at Record
					

The Dow traded above 36000 in the morning, then ended the day at a new high. Investors are awaiting earnings and more clarity on the Fed’s interest-rate plans.




					www.wsj.com
				




The Dow Jones Industrial Average briefly jumped above 36000 Monday morning, hitting 36009.74 in the first 15 minutes of trading. It was up about 0.4% later in the morning, to about 35946.

If the index closes above 36,000, it will be the Dow’s sixth 1,000-point milestone of the year, the most in a single year on record. In January, the Dow closed above 31,000 for the first time.

I don’t see too much concern creeping into the market and that’s because earnings season has been a pretty strong one and most companies are seeing strong demand,” said Seema Shah, chief strategist at Principal Global Investors.


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## citygator

Dekster said:


> ....and now comes the big thud.  Record PE's are unsustainable.  How is that margin debt looking?


So your response is business is too good?  um. Ok.


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## Dekster

citygator said:


> So your response is business is too good?  um. Ok.



If you looked at margin debt you would see something else happening, but whatevers.  Inflation is such a pretty mirage.


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## Synthaholic

*RECORD STOCK MARKET - ANOTHER BIDEN FAILURE!!*


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## Slade3200

blackhawk said:


> Interesting I remember others telling us how the stock market wasn’t a true reflection of how the economy was doing during that same timeframe. Liberals enjoy complaining about this terrible economy.


Could it be true that partisans on both sides are total hypocrites?


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## citygator

Slade3200 said:


> Could it be true that partisans on both sides are total hypocrites?


It’s not a both sides discussion.  You can’t be paying attention to nuance.

For 8 years Republicans claimed the economy sucked under Obama, then it was amazing under Trump and now they claim it sucks again.

For 4 years Democrats recognized the economy was doing well under Trump, they just disputed that it was because of Trumps actions to fix Obama’s terrible economy.

Once the economy plummeted under the shut downs democrats reflected a realistic negative attitude that is rebounding now while republicans felt more positive with a shit economy being shut down but at least their guy was in office. It’s nucking futs.


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## Otis Mayfield

Way to go, Joe!


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## sartre play

Market go's up market go's down. People stuck looking to blame the other party for everything use the market, gas prices, any and all negatives. So much easier than the hard work of looking for solutions.


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## Slade3200

citygator said:


> It’s not a both sides discussion.  You can’t be paying attention to nuance.
> 
> For 8 years Republicans claimed the economy sucked under Obama, then it was amazing under Trump and now they claim it sucks again.
> 
> For 4 years Democrats recognized the economy was doing well under Trump, they just disputed that it was because of Trumps actions to fix Obama’s terrible economy.
> 
> Once the economy plummeted under the shut downs democrats reflected a realistic negative attitude that is rebounding now while republicans felt more positive with a shit economy being shut down but at least their guy was in office. It’s nucking futs.


I think partisans give the president waaaaay too much credit and blame for economic conditions. Economy was good under Obama, not particularly because of Obama… it was good under Trump for the first three years and then crashed, not particularly because of Trump… and now it’s rebounding under Biden but we have a long way to go and to be honest stock market value is low on my priority list which is why Biden is smartly not boasting about it like Trump did on the daily


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## citygator

Slade3200 said:


> I think partisans give the president waaaaay too much credit and blame for economic conditions. Economy was good under Obama, not particularly because of Obama… it was good under Trump for the first three years and then crashed, not particularly because of Trump… and now it’s rebounding under Biden but we have a long way to go and to be honest stock market value is low on my priority list which is why Biden is smartly not boasting about it like Trump did on the daily


I agree with everything you said. However I will again submit that the cognitive dissonance of thinking the economy sucks based on who is in office is a Republican issue. Democrats will point out not everyone wins with a good economy as you can see in wealth consolidation at the top but they won’t say it’s a terrible economy when it’s not.


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## Golfing Gator

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,



then you should pull yourself up by your bootstraps and get off the bottom.  This is America, the land of opportunity.  Just today we were told if you are poor in this country is is 100% by choice.


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## Golfing Gator

blackhawk said:


> Interesting I remember others telling us how the stock market wasn’t a true reflection of how the economy was doing during that same timeframe.



Welcome to partisanship 101.

If your guy is in the White House the stock markets going up is 100% his doing and shows he is amazing.

If your guy is not in the White House the POTUS has nothing to do with the market going up and every single down day is his fault.


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## progressive hunter

Golfing Gator said:


> then you should pull yourself up by your bootstraps and get off the bottom.  This is America, the land of opportunity.  Just today we were told if you are poor in this country is is 100% by choice.


nice dodge there,,


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## citygator

Golfing Gator said:


> Welcome to partisanship 101.
> 
> If your guy is in the White House the stock markets going up is 100% his doing and shows he is amazing.
> 
> If your guy is not in the White House the POTUS has nothing to do with the market going up and every single down day is his fault.


Not true. I stated in this thread why your statement is false.


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## Slade3200

citygator said:


> I agree with everything you said. However I will again submit that the cognitive dissonance of thinking the economy sucks based on who is in office is a Republican issue. Democrats will point out not everyone wins with a good economy as you can see in wealth consolidation at the top but they won’t say it’s a terrible economy when it’s not.


Yeah, those who do that are idiots. I wouldn't pay much attention to them.


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## Golfing Gator

progressive hunter said:


> nice dodge there,,



no dodge at all.  I am raking in the money off the market right now, and I am far from being a rich elite.

If you are a bottom feeder, do something about it besides whining on a forum.


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## progressive hunter

Golfing Gator said:


> no dodge at all.  I am raking in the money off the market right now, and I am far from being a rich elite.
> 
> If you are a bottom feeder, do something about it besides whining on a forum.


so I should be greedy?? sorry not my way,,  but you sure feel free to skim your profits off the top for your benefit,,


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## Golfing Gator

progressive hunter said:


> so I should be greedy?? sorry not my way,,  but you sure feel free to skim your profits off the top for your benefit,,



If you are happy being a bottom feeder, more power to you.  Just do not come on here and whine about it.


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## progressive hunter

Golfing Gator said:


> If you are happy being a bottom feeder, more power to you.  Just do not come on here and whine about it.


I'm not whining about me dumbass,,,


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## Golfing Gator

progressive hunter said:


> I'm not whining about me dumbass,,,



Of course you were, you even included yourself in your statement.


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## progressive hunter

Golfing Gator said:


> Of course you were, you even included yourself in your statement.


youre missing the nuance of my comment,,


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## Golfing Gator

progressive hunter said:


> youre missing the nuance of my comment,,



no, you are just back peddling after getting called out for whining


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## progressive hunter

Golfing Gator said:


> no, you are just back peddling after getting called out for whining


nope,,


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## Claudette

blackhawk 
I have to agree. The stock market isn't the economy. Anyone who plays the market is doing well. Too bad the economy isn't as robust.


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## citygator

Claudette said:


> blackhawk
> I have to agree. The stock market isn't the economy. Anyone who plays the market is doing well. Too bad the economy isn't as robust.


Curious. What does the market reflect?


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## Claudette

citygator 
It means folks that play the market are doing well. The market isn't the economy though.


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## Slade3200

Claudette said:


> citygator
> It means folks that play the market are doing well. The market isn't the economy though.


Gator does make a valid point that the stock market being at a record high was amongst one of Trump and his supporters most regular and repeated talking points. Now it doesn't matter. Those that flopped on their position on this from both sides are just showing their partisan stripes.


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## DrLove

Yep, my IRA is humming - Thanks Uncle Joe!

35,884.37 *+64.81 *(0.18%) today
Nov 1, 2:41 PM EDT


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## XponentialChaos

blackhawk said:


> Interesting I remember others telling us how the stock market wasn’t a true reflection of how the economy was doing during that same timeframe. Liberals enjoy complaining about this terrible economy.


I remember Trumpsters praising Trump for the stock market.


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## citygator

Claudette said:


> citygator
> It means folks that play the market are doing well. The market isn't the economy though.


The market reflects the return on investing in company stock. Companies show record earnings which leads to record stock prices. If companies are making record profits the economy is doing well.

I’m not arguing everyone, particularly the bottom,  is doing well but the economy is doing well for sure. Offer up a data point that it isn’t perhaps?


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## Claudette

Slade3200
Sure it was a great talking point and both sides used it but, as I said, the stock market isn't the economy.









						I Ran the Numbers Again. Stocks Are Not the Economy.
					

Even when using an equal-weight measure for the S&P 500 and not adjusting for inflation, there is no correlation between the market and GDP.




					www.bloomberg.com


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## Claudette

citygator 
No one has to offer anything. Just look around at the hiring signs, and empty shelves and the price of gas. That should tell you how the economy is doing.


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## WEATHER53

It’s just so morally offensive for people to work hard, be disciplined and responsible, save and invest and reap the rewards.
Lib 101 Core  Course


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## Claudette

WEATHER53 
I'm all for those who play the stock market and win. Takes a lot of insight to be good at playing the market. Good for them. They are making loads right now if they invested correctly. 

Next month the market could be in the cellar.


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## citygator

Claudette said:


> citygator
> No one has to offer anything. Just look around at the hiring signs, and empty shelves and the price of gas. That should tell you how the economy is doing.


An economist you are not.


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## Claudette

citygator 
No but Bloomberg is. 








						I Ran the Numbers Again. Stocks Are Not the Economy.
					

Even when using an equal-weight measure for the S&P 500 and not adjusting for inflation, there is no correlation between the market and GDP.




					www.bloomberg.com


----------



## Slade3200

Claudette said:


> Slade3200
> Sure it was a great talking point and both sides used it but, as I said, the stock market isn't the economy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I Ran the Numbers Again. Stocks Are Not the Economy.
> 
> 
> Even when using an equal-weight measure for the S&P 500 and not adjusting for inflation, there is no correlation between the market and GDP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bloomberg.com


I agree, the stock market isn’t the economy which is why I shook my head whenever Trumpsters bragged and took credit for it and why I am now when the occasional Biden bro boasts about it. Who do you think boasted about it more the Trump crew or the Biden crew?


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## blackhawk

XponentialChaos said:


> I remember Trumpsters praising Trump for the stock market.


So do I and I also remember the TDS infected downplaying it.The partisans on both sides have the remarkable ability to change their view when it’s no longer a convenient one for them to have.


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## Natural Citizen

Synthaholic said:


> *RECORD STOCK MARKET - ANOTHER BIDEN FAILURE!!*



Who do you think actually benefits from inflation?


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## hadit

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Is it time yet to declare this Quid Pro Joe's economy or do we still need to wait until his first tax and spend bills hit? The memo wasn't clear.


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## hadit

Natural Citizen said:


> Who do you think actually benefits from inflation?


Anyone who owes money benefits as their debt shrinks in value. IOW all those who borrowed money and can now pay it off with cheaper dollars.


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## Synthaholic

Natural Citizen said:


> Who do you think actually benefits from inflation?


There is no inflation. There is supply and demand. Totally different.


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## Natural Citizen

hadit said:


> Anyone who owes money benefits as their debt shrinks in value. IOW all those who borrowed money and can now pay it off with cheaper dollars.



Yeah. Pretty much. The hedge funds and private equity firms are making a killing.

The political football type direction these thread always take, although chuckle worthy, are a bit disturbing. Really is a reflection of the sad state of the electorate. They're taking a pounding and basically celebrating while the people giving the mthe pounding laugh all the way to the central bank.

People would do well to study economic theory and monetay policy.


Anyway. Good to see you around, Hadit. Hope you're doing well.

We should try to open the old place back up, btw.


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## hadit

Synthaholic said:


> There is no inflation. There is supply and demand. Totally different.


The supply/demand balance drives inflation. When demand goes up but supply does not, prices go up. That's inflation. It can come down again when demand goes down or supply goes up, but it's still inflation.


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## Slade3200

Natural Citizen said:


> Who do you think actually benefits from inflation?


Nobody benefits from inflation… What do you think caused the inflation?


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## Natural Citizen

Slade3200 said:


> What do you think caused the inflation?



The creation of new 'money" out of thin air.

The monetary system itself is the culprit.

Duh.

And there's not a nickel's worth of difference between the parties who rely on it.

Sure, you can pretend there's a difference in the winger world of unicorns and fairies, if that's the kind of conversation you're loking for. But there's not.


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## Slade3200

Natural Citizen said:


> The creation of new 'money" out of thin air.
> 
> The monetary system itself is the culprit.
> 
> Duh.


How much was created and where did it go? Who was responsible?


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## XponentialChaos

blackhawk said:


> So do I and I also remember the TDS infected downplaying it.The partisans on both sides have the remarkable ability to change their view when it’s no longer a convenient one for them to have.


Correct.


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## B. Kidd

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.



The market loves the near term certainty of an obstructed Congress! * (Thanks Joe Manchin!!)*

Meanwhile, other areas still burn under Joe ''Nero" Biden while he fiddles around.
I can live with this, for now.


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## LeftofLeft

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Great! What are the Democrats going to do for Main Street? Wealthy Liberal Elites need a healthy Wall Street. What they don’t need nor care about is a healthy Main Street.


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## whitehall

Lefties used to hate profit earnings As a matter of fact democrats plan to tax corporations to death. What changed?


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## Natural Citizen

Slade3200 said:


> How much was created and where did it go? Who was responsible?



Alright. Let me just cut to the chase with you, so as to avoid meaningless dialogue.

Technically what happens is that the politicians say, hey, vote for me and I'll make sure you get more free stuff than my opponent says he'll get for you.

Then government creates glorified IOUs in the form of Treasury Bonds. Then, in order to provide all of that supposed free stuff that they ran on, the politicians vote for the country to spend more than its income.

This is called deficit spending.

So to pay for that deficit spending the Treasury borrows currency by issuing a bond. Which is just an IOU. These bonds increase our national debt and put the public on the hook to pay it back.

Then those IOUs are swapped to create 'currency.' Through a shell game called 'open market operations' the Treasury sells those bonds to the banks. The banks then turn around and sell our national debt at a profit to the Federal Reserve who buys them by opening its checkbook and writes a hot check which is drawn from an account with nothing  in it.  The Fed is buying those IOUs with their own IOUs.

Technically speaking the Fed is committing fraud here.

So anyway, they give those hot checks to the banks and 'currency' is created out of thin air. AKA "inflation"

Then the whole process repeats over and over and over again. This results in a build-up of bonds at the Federal Reserve and a build-up of currency at the Treasury which is really just a supply of numbers. The Treasury then deposits the numbers into the various branches of the government and then the government spends the numbers on promises, public works, social programs, and undeclared wars.

After everyone deposits their new 'currency' the banks multiply the numbers by creating more IOUs through fractional reserve lending where they steal a portion of everyone's deposit and lend it out. That 'currency' gets redeposited and then a portion is stolen again. And the process repeats over andover and over again, magnifying the currency supply exponentially.

Then the poor saps in the electorate work for some of those numbers and then they get held up at the barrel of a government gun by the Federal Reserve's collection wing, the IRS ,who then turns those numbers over to the Treasury so the Treasury can pay the principal plus the interest on the bonds that were purchased by the Federal Reserve from the banks who themselves previously bid on them with a hot check.

Of course, the increasing levels of debt will eventually collapse under its own weight because politicians and pundits always kick the can down the road so it doesn't happen on their watch.

Which is where we are in all of this. But they're actually running out of road to keep kicking the can. And people really aren't talking much about that at all.  The BIS is aware of this, however, and are starting to come from out of their historically comfortable wood work. Which is what all of this reset spew is about. That's a bit of a deeper discussion, however.

If you have any more questions, I'll be in the neighborhood. Maybe. I dunno. The bad joo joo around here is starting to become a bit much, in my view.


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## Natural Citizen

While I'm thinking of it.

Some relevant reading, for casual passers-by...









						The Cantillon Effect: Why Wall Street Gets a Bailout and You Don't - ProMarket
					

According to the 18th-century French banker and philosopher Richard Cantillon, who benefits when the state prints money is based on its institutional setup. In the 18th century, this meant that the closer you were to the king and the wealthy, the more you benefitted, and the further away you...




					promarket.org


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## Slade3200

Natural Citizen said:


> Alright. Let me just cut to the chase with you, so as to avoid meaningless dialogue.
> 
> Technically what happens is that the politicians say, hey, vote for me and I'll make sure you get more free stuff than my opponent says he'll get for you.
> 
> Then government creates glorified IOUs in the form of Treasury Bonds. Then, in order to provide all of that supposed free stuff that they ran on, the politicians vote for the country to spend more than its income.
> 
> This is called deficit spending.
> 
> So to pay for that deficit spending the Treasury borrows currency by issuing a bond. Which is just an IOU. These bonds increase our national debt and put the public on the hook to pay it back.
> 
> Then those IOUs are swapped to create 'currency.' Through a shell game called 'open market operations' the Treasury sells those bonds to the banks. The banks then turn around and sell our national debt at a profit to the Federal Reserve who buys them by opening its checkbook and writes a hot check which is drawn from an account with nothing  in it.  The Fed is buying those IOUs with their own IOus..
> 
> Technically speaking the Fed is cmmitting fraud here.
> 
> So anyway, they give those hot checks to the banks and 'currency' is created out of thin air. AKA "inflation"
> 
> Then the whole process repeats over and over and over again. This results in a build-up of bonds at the Federal Reserve and a build-up of currency at the Treasury which is really just a supply of numbers. The Treasury then deposits the numbers into the various branches of the government and then the government spends the numbers on promises, public works, social programs, and undeclared wars.
> 
> After everyone deposits their new 'currency' the banks multiply the numbers by creating more IOUs through fractional reserve lending where they steal a portion of everyone's deposit and lend it out. That 'currency' gets redeposited and then a portion is stolen again. And the process repeats over andover and over again, magnifying the currency supply exponentially.
> 
> Then the poor saps in the electorate work for some of those numbers and then they get held up at the barrel of a government gun by the Federal Reserve's collection wing, the IRS ,who then turns those numbers over to the Treasury so the Treasury can pay the principal plus the interest on the bonds that were purchased by the Federal Reserve from the banks who themselves previously bid on them with a hot check.
> 
> Of course, the increasing levels of debt will eventually collapse under its own weight because politicians and pundits always kick the can down the road so it doesn't happen on their watch.
> 
> Which is where we are in all of this.
> 
> If you have any more questions, I'll be in the neighborhood. Maybe. I dunno. The bad joo joo around here is starting to become a bit much, in my view.


Haha, I appreciate the explanation but I still just have the original two questions that I asked. Would you mind just answering those?


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## Lastamender

Synthaholic said:


> *RECORD STOCK MARKET - ANOTHER BIDEN FAILURE!!*


As long as he keeps printing money things will be fine. You dumbass.


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## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> As long as he keeps printing money things will be fine. You dumbass.


How much money has he printed and circulated so far?


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## SassyIrishLass

whitehall said:


> Lefties used to hate profit earnings As a matter of fact democrats plan to tax corporations to death. What changed?



Trying desperately to prop up the stuttering fool


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## Natural Citizen

Slade3200 said:


> Haha, I appreciate the explanation but I still just have the original two questions that I asked. Would you mind just answering those?



I pretty much did. Rather thoroughly, in fact. I can't make you absorb it, too. That's up to you. Respectfully speaking.


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## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> How much money has he printed and circulated so far?











						40% of US dollars in existence were printed in the last 12 months: Is America repeating the same mistake of 1921 Weimar Germany? | Tech News | Startups News
					

On January 1, 2020, bitcoin was trading at $7,160. The Dow Jones was also trading at 28,634 on January 3, 2020, before crashing to 19,173 on March 20, 2020, after the coronavirus pandemic broke out in the United States. States and …




					techstartups.com


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## Slade3200

Natural Citizen said:


> I pretty much did. Rather thoroughly, in fact. I can't make you absorb it, too. That's up to you. Respectfully speaking.


I appreciate that. I just didn’t see in your answer how much has been printed and spent and who exactly is responsible for it. Can you just give me a number and a name. Apologies if I missed that in your last post


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## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> 40% of US dollars in existence were printed in the last 12 months: Is America repeating the same mistake of 1921 Weimar Germany? | Tech News | Startups News
> 
> 
> On January 1, 2020, bitcoin was trading at $7,160. The Dow Jones was also trading at 28,634 on January 3, 2020, before crashing to 19,173 on March 20, 2020, after the coronavirus pandemic broke out in the United States. States and …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> techstartups.com


Ok so how much? Post the number and who you hold responsible please


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> I appreciate that. I just didn’t see in your answer how much has been printed and spent and who exactly is responsible for it. Can you just give me a number and a name. Apologies if I missed that in your last post


Read the link it tells you.


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> Read the link it tells you.


I did. I don’t think that you did which is why I’m reasking the question. Just give me a number and also who you hold responsible. I’m very curious about how you will answer this and if you even have the balls to try


----------



## Natural Citizen

SassyIrishLass said:


> Trying desperately to prop up the stuttering fool



Ironically, five of the six board members of the Federal Reserve were appointed by Mr. negative interest rate promoter himself, Donald Trump.

And that's the thing. It's in the electorates interest to try to understand that keeping them divided and arguing about meaningless things like my democrat is better than your republican or my republican is better than your democrat is what the con artists in the central banking/political system rely on.

This system relies in the public being ignorant to its function.

It's one of the reasons we always see people who work in the industry hanging out on boards like this in the public arena, fronting like they're on your side, but actually working against you by watering down and dissuading fruitful discussion before it can evolve into actual relevancy and into understandable dialogue by those who don't usually think much into how it really works. These are generally the folks who work in open market operations.


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> I did. I don’t think that you did which is why I’m reasking the question. Just give me a number and also who you hold responsible. I’m very curious about how you will answer this and if you even have the balls to try


It looks like 2.7 billion was printed. I blame the Fed and Democrats and RINOs.


----------



## citygator

Claudette said:


> citygator
> No but Bloomberg is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I Ran the Numbers Again. Stocks Are Not the Economy.
> 
> 
> Even when using an equal-weight measure for the S&P 500 and not adjusting for inflation, there is no correlation between the market and GDP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bloomberg.com


Did you read it?  Says market and GDP don’t always move in tandem. Ok. Good example is tech bubbles and real estate bubbles where market grew faster than gdp and stocks eventually crash. GDP is currently growing. So GDP and stock is growing. What now?


----------



## citygator

whitehall said:


> Lefties used to hate profit earnings As a matter of fact democrats plan to tax corporations to death. What changed?


Link?


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> It looks like 2.7 billion was printed. I blame the Fed and Democrats and RINOs.


Only 2.7 billion and you think that caused nation wide inflation?! Ok… who specifically do you blame?  It doesn’t take a genius to predict that last response of yours. Be specific


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> Only 2.7 billion and you think that caused nation wide inflation?! Ok… who specifically do you blame?  It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to predict that last response of yours. Be specific


I just told you. I could add that the prevailing agenda means to destroy this country so they can take part of the blame. They love it.


----------



## citygator

Lastamender said:


> 40% of US dollars in existence were printed in the last 12 months: Is America repeating the same mistake of 1921 Weimar Germany? | Tech News | Startups News
> 
> 
> On January 1, 2020, bitcoin was trading at $7,160. The Dow Jones was also trading at 28,634 on January 3, 2020, before crashing to 19,173 on March 20, 2020, after the coronavirus pandemic broke out in the United States. States and …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> techstartups.com


GDP is $20T. $2T of circulation increase to replace contraction isn’t driving inflation.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> GDP is $20T. $2T of circulation increase to replace contraction isn’t driving inflation.


So 40% of our money is not doing anything to inflation. What percentage do you need?


----------



## Natural Citizen

Slade3200 said:


> I appreciate that. I just didn’t see in your answer how much has been printed and spent and who exactly is responsible for it. Can you just give me a number and a name. Apologies if I missed that in your last post



Our people have been introducing legislation for a true audit of the Fed for years.

Establishment Republicans and Democrats alike have rabidly opposed and blocked any such notion of it. Trying to get someone like Ted Cruz, for instance, to show up at an audit the Fed vote is like pulling teeth. He just ain't showing up for it. and historically speaking, he hasn't. Of course, you can take your pick from any establishment politician from either side and the same thing applies, for the most part. I just happened to pick him because he sems to cherry pick his cso-called 'conservative' values and seems to get quite a bit of media time doing so.

All we ever get is the Fed's own audit of itself. Which is about as deep an audit as a mud puddle, predictably.

It's actually a topic worthy of itself, particularly given the extent of high speed trading these days. How do you really audit that? And there's  lot of shady things that happen there. Start to get into black budget stuff and whatnot, legit and non-legit. A lot of other trickery and passing around of special interest currency out of sight and out of mind of the electorate.


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


/----/ Gee, I remember libtrads said the stock market is not the economy when Trump was president.


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> I just told you. I could add that the prevailing agenda means to destroy this country so they can take part of the blame. They love it.


Sure please add up what ever you think is constitutes the money that has been printed and spent that you think has contributed to the inflations we are seeing and then tell me specifically who you blame. Not some arbitrary group


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> Sure please add up what ever you think is constitutes the money that has been printed and spent that you think has contributed to the inflations we are seeing and then tell me specifically who you blame. Not some arbitrary group


Sorry have not been able to pick one. Deal with it.


----------



## citygator

Cellblock2429 said:


> /----/ Gee, I remember libtrads said the stock market is not the economy when Trump was president.


You convinced me that Trumpers were right. Thanks Biden!


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> Sorry have not been able to pick one. Deal with it.


Nothing for me to deal with. You’re the ignorant one that can’t back up the things you say. Im just here to watch you stumble and to laugh at you.


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> Nothing for me to deal with. You’re the ignorant one that can’t back up the things you say. Im just here to watch you stumble and to laugh at you.


Knock yourself out.  
Now what? Anything else?


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> Knock yourself out.
> Now what? Anything else?


Haha, I’m sure I’ll have something as you as you try and chime in with something else you know nothing about…

Not sure if you caught this but that article you posted was all about data of stuff that happened under the Trump administration


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> Haha, I’m sure I’ll have something as you as you try and chime in with something else you know nothing about…
> 
> Not sure if you caught this but that article you posted was all about data of stuff that happened under the Trump administration


I know the economic policies of this illegitimate administration are meant to fail.


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> I know the economic policies of this illegitimate administration are meant to fail.


Haha, you’ve clearly displayed that you don’t know squat about the things you think you know about. Shown by the fact you posted an article showing 2020 data (Trump years) to try and blame the Dems for inflation. Not too bright there are ya sparky ?


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> Haha, you’ve clearly displayed that you don’t know squat about the things you think you know about. Shown by the fact you posted an article showing 2020 data (Trump years) to try and blame the Dems for inflation. Not too bright there are ya sparky ?


Trump did not have control of that. The Fed handles that crap.


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> Trump did not have control of that. The Fed handles that crap.


Yet you blame the Dems and rhinos and Biden. Wonderful. You’re an idiot


----------



## Lastamender

Slade3200 said:


> Yet you blame the Dems and rhinos and Biden. Wonderful. You’re an idiot


What are they doing to fix the problem?


----------



## Slade3200

Lastamender said:


> What are they doing to fix the problem?


Not much, they are pretty piss poor at budgeting and spending but hopefully they tax the top earners as that’s a good way to help the problem. Trump was responsible for a tremendous amount of debt and spending and didn’t do shit to address the issue except for cut taxes for the top earners. You get that right?!?! Come on hackamender speak truth for once in your life


----------



## frigidweirdo

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.



A good slice of boom and bust for the rich to get richer and the poor to get raped more.


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> Is it time yet to declare this Quid Pro Joe's economy or do we still need to wait until his first tax and spend bills hit? The memo wasn't clear.


No, it isn't.
Congress kicked the can down the road until December.
Republicans, whining about the deficit/debt for the first time in 4 years because a Democrat is president.
Ignoring they massive debt they voted for...............$6,807,290,102,465.77


----------



## Smokin' OP

LeftofLeft said:


> Great! What are the Democrats going to do for Main Street? Wealthy Liberal Elites need a healthy Wall Street. What they don’t need nor care about is a healthy Main Street.


No, shit captain obvious.
Democrats are trying but, as usual, the GQP blocks everything to help main street and the American worker.


----------



## Smokin' OP

Cellblock2429 said:


> /----/ Gee, I remember libtrads said the stock market is not the economy when Trump was president.


It isn't.
That's the point of the thread, sarcasm.


----------



## Turtlesoup

citygator said:


> Wall Street Journal is reluctantly celebrating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dow Briefly Jumps Above 36000, Finishes at Record
> 
> 
> The Dow traded above 36000 in the morning, then ended the day at a new high. Investors are awaiting earnings and more clarity on the Fed’s interest-rate plans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wsj.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average briefly jumped above 36000 Monday morning, hitting 36009.74 in the first 15 minutes of trading. It was up about 0.4% later in the morning, to about 35946.
> 
> If the index closes above 36,000, it will be the Dow’s sixth 1,000-point milestone of the year, the most in a single year on record. In January, the Dow closed above 31,000 for the first time.
> 
> I don’t see too much concern creeping into the market and that’s because earnings season has been a pretty strong one and most companies are seeing strong demand,” said Seema Shah, chief strategist at Principal Global Investors.


INFLATION............


----------



## citygator

frigidweirdo said:


> A good slice of boom and bust for the rich to get richer and the poor to get raped more.


Then you must be for a more equitable tax structure to raise taxes on the wealthy and soften the blow to the bottom of society. Awesome.


----------



## Claudette

Slade3200
I think its about even. You know they all like to take credit when things look good. And boy do they like to take the credit.

If the market crashed they would all be screaming that they had nothing to do with it and would distance themselves from it.


----------



## Claudette

citygator
I hope stocks do continue to grow for those that play the market. However, we both know the market goes up and the market goes down. Always has and always will.


----------



## citygator

Claudette said:


> citygator
> I hope stocks do continue to grow for those that play the market. However, we both know the market goes up and the market goes down. Always has and always will.


Actually it always goes up. About 7% a year for a century.  Yes up and downs along the way but long term it’s always good to invest in the American economy.


----------



## LeftofLeft

Smokin' OP said:


> No, shit captain obvious.
> Democrats are trying but, as usual, the GQP blocks everything to help main street and the American worker.


Obviously, you claim the GOP “blocks everything” to help Main Street yet you provide nothing. Name one thing the Democrats are pushing for Main Street and how it would help Main Street?

The reality is that Democrats over the last 40 years don’t give a shit about small business.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Lastamender said:


> 40% of US dollars in existence were printed in the last 12 months: Is America repeating the same mistake of 1921 Weimar Germany? | Tech News | Startups News
> 
> 
> On January 1, 2020, bitcoin was trading at $7,160. The Dow Jones was also trading at 28,634 on January 3, 2020, before crashing to 19,173 on March 20, 2020, after the coronavirus pandemic broke out in the United States. States and …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> techstartups.com



your article is from POSTED ON MAY 22, 2021

Which means 2/3 of that time and money was "created" under your god.


----------



## Smokin' OP

LeftofLeft said:


> Obviously, you claim the GOP “blocks everything” to help Main Street yet you provide nothing. Name one thing the Democrats are pushing for Main Street and how it would help Main Street?
> 
> The reality is that Democrats over the last 40 years don’t give a shit about small business.


Biden's infrastructure plan.
Republicans can't stand helping their country, only the millionaires that reside in it.


----------



## JohnDB

Bitcoin is now an indicating measure...it's going sky high meaning the Dow is going up...but Bitcoin is a lagging indicator when going down.... meaning it tanks after the market tanks...which is not the narrative they wish to promote. 

What is a tried and true indicator is Margin Debt. Anything above 55% and it's time to get out. 
Well it's been over 55% since the market had a temper tantrum with money supply in March. 
Meaning that when the taper begins and margin money is expensive...risk plus costs means one thing....a reversal. 
We also have inflation...
Meaning a rise in every cost...from sugar to sugar beets... everything is going to be more expensive. Especially labor. (I'm personally betting on coffee) 

As Bitcoin is NOT a legal tender and is a boutique currency...it's not going to hold it's value as a currency. Service fees of 20% or more for it's use are nuts. Not going to pay that! 

So I'm ready for the market to tank... it's fun when going up and fun when going down...so long as it's moving I'm having fun.  
Look at Tesla though...$1200 and climbing. $600-700 just last summer...


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> No, it isn't.
> Congress kicked the can down the road until December.
> Republicans, whining about the deficit/debt for the first time in 4 years because a Democrat is president.
> Ignoring they massive debt they voted for...............$6,807,290,102,465.77


Okay, so any bad economic news after December is Quid Pro's fault? I'm looking for a date here. When are you going to hold Quid Pro responsible for what he does to the economy?


----------



## LeftofLeft

Smokin' OP said:


> Biden's infrastructure plan.
> Republicans can't stand helping their country, only the millionaires that reside in it.


Biden’s infrastructure plan is being pitched to help all Americans. Specific to small business….. what are Biden and the Democrats doing for them? Cutting taxes? Tax incentives? Lower regulations?

Coming up on a year, I’d say the Democrats and Biden still have a long way to go with small businesses.  









						Small business confidence drops to all-time low after Biden election
					

Main Street business confidence hits an all-time low in the CNBC|Survey Monkey Small Business Survey for Q4 2020. The reason? Politics.




					www.cnbc.com


----------



## citygator

LeftofLeft said:


> Biden’s infrastructure plan is being pitched to help all Americans. Specific to small business….. what are Biden and the Democrats doing for them? Cutting taxes? Tax incentives? Lower regulations?
> 
> Coming up on a year, I’d say the Democrats and Biden still have a long way to go with small businesses.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Small business confidence drops to all-time low after Biden election
> 
> 
> Main Street business confidence hits an all-time low in the CNBC|Survey Monkey Small Business Survey for Q4 2020. The reason? Politics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnbc.com


Labor market transition and volatile pricing from supply/demand variability is leading to a lack of confidence. No one likes instability but the US market is built to handle it over the long term.


It was hard selecting only 4 paragraphs. Explains that what we are seeing in prices is volatility not inflation. More like a meme stock price due to sudden demand. Notes all the raw material falling prices. Sorry conservatives the Biden election didn’t suddenly turn inflation on its head.


Why We Should All Start Talking About ‘Whackflation’​Whackflation is an oscillation between big booms and busts. It’s big price spikes followed by price falls. It’s the uncomfortable position in which we watch complex systems that have been given a big whack by the global pandemic try to stabilize themselves. It is ‘whack’ in the sense that it’s rather alarming to witness, but also in the sense that it conjures up images of ‘whac-a-mole’ as one supply shortage leads to another.

In many ways, it’s the monetary equivalent of the bullwhip effect that’s been bedeviling consumers who want to buy things and the producers which make them, in which small changes in consumer demand at one end of the supply chain can end up leading to big swings in production at the other end.

The result is the risk of an environment in which violent run-ups in prices can be followed by falls that are just as extreme. Take, for instance, recent price action in iron ore futures — which sank below $100 a ton in Singapore trading on Tuesday as China’s authorities continued their attempts to curb steel production in an effort toconserve energy.





Lumber futures, which presaged many of the recent supply shortages, are also in the process of normalizing, while China’s thermal coal prices have dropped to 878 yuan ($137) per ton from a peak of more than 1,900 yuan per ton. Extreme volatility in prices is a challenge for policymakers trying to smooth business cycles and control — or even forecast — broader inflation.


----------



## JohnDB

citygator said:


> Labor market transition and volatile pricing from supply/demand variability is leading to a lack of confidence. No one likes instability but the US market is built to handle it over the long term.
> 
> 
> It was hard selecting only 4 paragraphs. Explains that what we are seeing in prices is volatility not inflation. More like a meme stock price due to sudden demand. Notes all the raw material falling prices. Sorry conservatives the Biden election didn’t suddenly turn inflation on its head.
> 
> 
> Why We Should All Start Talking About ‘Whackflation’​Whackflation is an oscillation between big booms and busts. It’s big price spikes followed by price falls. It’s the uncomfortable position in which we watch complex systems that have been given a big whack by the global pandemic try to stabilize themselves. It is ‘whack’ in the sense that it’s rather alarming to witness, but also in the sense that it conjures up images of ‘whac-a-mole’ as one supply shortage leads to another.
> 
> In many ways, it’s the monetary equivalent of the bullwhip effect that’s been bedeviling consumers who want to buy things and the producers which make them, in which small changes in consumer demand at one end of the supply chain can end up leading to big swings in production at the other end.
> 
> The result is the risk of an environment in which violent run-ups in prices can be followed by falls that are just as extreme. Take, for instance, recent price action in iron ore futures — which sank below $100 a ton in Singapore trading on Tuesday as China’s authorities continued their attempts to curb steel production in an effort toconserve energy.
> View attachment 559439
> 
> Lumber futures, which presaged many of the recent supply shortages, are also in the process of normalizing, while China’s thermal coal prices have dropped to 878 yuan ($137) per ton from a peak of more than 1,900 yuan per ton. Extreme volatility in prices is a challenge for policymakers trying to smooth business cycles and control — or even forecast — broader inflation.


Lumber surged due to high demand and low supply....but the smaller mills are shutting down while housing demand stays strong. (No Canadian imports) 

When the taper truly starts and Fed stops the market stimulus then let's see what happens. Of course lead balloons will fly higher than the market at that point.


----------



## candycorn

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Another win for the good guys.


----------



## Circe

Maybe the Dow 36,000 will break the ceiling, but remember the Dow has been trading in a range (34,500 to 35,500) for many months. I assume it will slide (or plunge) down to the range it likes to be in.


----------



## JohnDB

Circe said:


> Maybe the Dow 36,000 will break the ceiling, but remember the Dow has been trading in a range (34,500 to 35,500) for many months. I assume it will slide (or plunge) down to the range it likes to be in.


Market stimulus has unreasonably made it rise up due to margin purchases being essentially free. 

When that stops and interest rates begin to double or triple.... possibly quadruple...then we will see what the market does.


----------



## Lastamender

Golfing Gator said:


> your article is from POSTED ON MAY 22, 2021
> 
> Which means 2/3 of that time and money was "created" under your god.


The Fed decides when the money is printed.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Lastamender said:


> The Fed decides when the money is printed.



yet you blamed it in Biden....weird


----------



## Lastamender

Golfing Gator said:


> yet you blamed it in Biden....weird


Well I am sorry you don't like what I said but Biden is to blame for so many things I thought I would throw that in.


----------



## McRib

My 401K is up 41.1% for the year, it has never been up this high.


----------



## JohnDB

Golfing Gator said:


> yet you blamed it in Biden....weird


Fed Chair serves at the pleasure of the President...most presidents don't usually do much with them...but that has changed. It's become a lot more politically agenda driven in the past year. Also the SEC has become a lot more political and corrupt than in times past. 

And if they don't find a way to get the manure back in the horse it's going to destabilize the Dollar.


----------



## frigidweirdo

citygator said:


> Then you must be for a more equitable tax structure to raise taxes on the wealthy and soften the blow to the bottom of society. Awesome.



Er.... what?

I don't see how your vision would stop boom and bust at all. It'd merely make the poor poorer.


----------



## Synthaholic

hadit said:


> The supply/demand balance drives inflation. When demand goes up but supply does not, prices go up. That's inflation. It can come down again when demand goes down or supply goes up, but it's still inflation.


Ok, you're right that this is technically inflation. But I think it's a short-term supply problem. The wage inflation is long overdue.


----------



## citygator

frigidweirdo said:


> Er.... what?
> 
> I don't see how your vision would stop boom and bust at all. It'd merely make the poor poorer.


Just like I thought. You pointed out the stock market makes the rich richer. You are just a complainer. No vision. A more graduated tax structure moved that money out of the top.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Where else can pension funds and 401ks invest when rates remain super low? Definitely not CEO material. Inflation is close to 6%…time to raise interest rates…then let’s see how much shit you talk, leftist zombie.


----------



## frigidweirdo

citygator said:


> Just like I thought. You pointed out the stock market makes the rich richer. You are just a complainer. No vision. A more graduated tax structure moved that money out of the top.



Well, you're wrong. Because you're not thinking outside of your box. 

Why does boom and bust happen? That's what you need to ask yourself.

Why do people need more stuff produced today than they need producing next year? Often they don't. 

What happens is people lose their jobs, can pay for things, so don't buy things and things then don't get produced which reduces jobs, which reduces the need for buying things and on and on.

If we didn't have such high booms, we wouldn't have such low busts. But the government pushes the booms. It makes sense for them. They look good, their political career is improved in the short term.

Boom and bust is short term thinking. The US presidency is a short term thing, you only need to care for four years. Once you're re-elected, does it matter?

So, we're back to how people are elected. Proportional Representation with a parliamentary system would allow the US to be more long term in thought. For example.


----------



## JohnDB

Synthaholic said:


> Ok, you're right that this is technically inflation. But I think it's a short-term supply problem. The wage inflation is long overdue.


Wage inflation?
Wages have been held artificially low for a long time by republican lawmakers...

Where I don't favor minimum wage I also don't favor collusion to keep wages low and workers not paid fair wages.

Especially when Walmart or a university are the largest employers in an area.


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> Okay, so any bad economic news after December is Quid Pro's fault? I'm looking for a date here. When are you going to hold Quid Pro responsible for what he does to the economy?


That's the problem, he hasn't done anything because his entire plan is being blocked by two democrat senators and the entire GQP.
Just like Obama was blocked by republicans.
Biden may as well be a lame duck.


----------



## Smokin' OP

LeftofLeft said:


> Biden’s infrastructure plan is being pitched to help all Americans. Specific to small business….. what are Biden and the Democrats doing for them?
> 
> Coming up on a year, I’d say the Democrats and Biden still have a long way to go with small businesses.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Small business confidence drops to all-time low after Biden election
> 
> 
> Main Street business confidence hits an all-time low in the CNBC|Survey Monkey Small Business Survey for Q4 2020. The reason? Politics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnbc.com


Biden can't do shit, when he is being blocked by the GQP.

'Cutting taxes? Tax incentives? Lower regulations'?
That's the GQP plan for everything, all that does is add to the debt.


----------



## LeftofLeft

Smokin' OP said:


> Biden can't do shit, when he is being blocked by the GQP.
> 
> 'Cutting taxes? Tax incentives? Lower regulations'?
> That's the GQP plan for everything, all that does is add to the debt.


Biden and the Democrats don’t want to do shit for small businesses. It’s reflected in the policies they are pursuing with or without the Republicans and/or with or without a majority. Stop blaming the Republicans. Further, why don’t you show how how higher corporate taxes  and regulations help or have no impact on small business??


----------



## Smokin' OP

LeftofLeft said:


> Biden and the Democrats don’t want to do shit for small businesses. It’s reflected in the policies they are pursuing with or without the Republicans and/or with or without a majority. Stop blaming the Republicans. Further, why don’t you show how how higher corporate taxes  and regulations help or have no impact on small business??


You're FOS.
Biden's infrastructure plan will create millions of contracts and jobs for small businesses and the companies supplying them with goods are services.
The GQP and two wannbe republicans, are blocking everything Biden is trying to do, you moron.
'Stop blaming the Republicans'.
'Sure don't blame us, we're just voting no on everything you do'.

' Further, why don’t you show how how higher corporate taxes  and regulations help or have no impact on small business'??

Higher tax rates will help some and pay for some of the burden of them getting contracts, you idiot.


----------



## LeftofLeft

Smokin' OP said:


> You're FOS.
> Biden's infrastructure plan will create millions of contracts and jobs for small businesses and the companies supplying them with goods are services.
> The GQP and two wannbe republicans, are blocking everything Biden is trying to do, you moron.
> 'Stop blaming the Republicans'.
> 'Sure don't blame us, we're just voting no on everything you do'.
> 
> ' Further, why don’t you show how how higher corporate taxes  and regulations help or have no impact on small business'??
> 
> Higher tax rates will help some and pay for some of the burden of them getting contracts, you idiot.


Biden’s proposed infrastructure plan is not a universal plan or policy aimed at small business. Some small businesses could benefit. Your case for higher taxes makes no sense. You shit the bed with your use of the word Some.

Again, show us a Biden or Democrat plan or policy aimed at small businesses universally that is specifically being blocked by Republicans. You might also want to review what Democrats do when they are not in power…. They block.


----------



## Smokin' OP

LeftofLeft said:


> Biden’s proposed infrastructure plan is not a universal plan or policy aimed at small business. Some small businesses could benefit. Your case for higher taxes makes no sense. You shit the bed with your use of the word Some.
> 
> Again, show us a Biden or Democrat plan or policy aimed at small businesses universally that is specifically being blocked by Republicans. You might also want to review what Democrats do when they are not in power…. They block.


*Some *as opposed to *all, *most should benefit.

'Your case for higher taxes makes no sense'.
Really?
Is Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk or Bill Gates gonna fix the bridges, railroad tracks, highways?

Ensure that small businesses have access to capital and provide entrepreneurs with technical assistance to start and expand their business. Access to capital and technical assistance are essential to small businesses’ success. 
That is why Democrats are committed to ensuring that the Small Business Administration’s (SBA) programs are fully funded. The SBA provides entrepreneurs with the capital needed to launch and expand their businesses, as well as the training and technical assistance that they need to turn their plans into successful ventures.
 By providing both capital and technical assistance, the SBA fills a significant void in the capital markets, reaching entrepreneurs that would otherwise not be reached by the private sector.
Unfortunately, the Trump Administration has proposed reductions in SBA’s budget.
Democrats object to these proposed cuts and want to fully fund these important programs so that the next generation of great American entrepreneurs is created. 
SBA’s programs increase the availability of seed capital for start-ups, loans for maturing companies, and venture capital for fast-growing firms, while also providing training in business practices - including accounting, budgeting, and marketing - to burgeoning entrepreneurs.
 Failing to strengthen these programs serves only to discourage entrepreneurship, which is critical for the U.S. economy to emerge from its current sluggishness.

The GQP won't even approve of Biden's SBA appointee.

Let alone this.
Specifically, the Trump Administration’s FY2020 Budget proposes the following cuts to programs that benefit small businesses:


a 23 percent cut to funding for Small Business Development Centers, which provide targeted counseling to small businesses across the country so that they have the tools they need to improve their capacity and increase their productivity;
increased loan fees on the thousands of businesses participating in the Small Business Administration’s loan programs, leading to increased borrowing costs for small, local businesses seeking to grow; and
a 5 percent cut to the SBA’s Microloan program, and a 19 percent cut to the agency’s Microloan Technical Assistance program, both of which disproportionately serve women, minority and rural small businesses.


----------



## LeftofLeft

Smokin' OP said:


> *Some *as opposed to *all, *most should benefit.
> 
> 'Your case for higher taxes makes no sense'.
> Really?
> Is Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk or Bill Gates gonna fix the bridges, railroad tracks, highways?
> 
> Ensure that small businesses have access to capital and provide entrepreneurs with technical assistance to start and expand their business. Access to capital and technical assistance are essential to small businesses’ success.
> That is why Democrats are committed to ensuring that the Small Business Administration’s (SBA) programs are fully funded. The SBA provides entrepreneurs with the capital needed to launch and expand their businesses, as well as the training and technical assistance that they need to turn their plans into successful ventures.
> By providing both capital and technical assistance, the SBA fills a significant void in the capital markets, reaching entrepreneurs that would otherwise not be reached by the private sector.
> Unfortunately, the Trump Administration has proposed reductions in SBA’s budget.
> Democrats object to these proposed cuts and want to fully fund these important programs so that the next generation of great American entrepreneurs is created.
> SBA’s programs increase the availability of seed capital for start-ups, loans for maturing companies, and venture capital for fast-growing firms, while also providing training in business practices - including accounting, budgeting, and marketing - to burgeoning entrepreneurs.
> Failing to strengthen these programs serves only to discourage entrepreneurship, which is critical for the U.S. economy to emerge from its current sluggishness.
> 
> The GQP won't even approve of Biden's SBA appointee.
> 
> Let alone this.
> Specifically, the Trump Administration’s FY2020 Budget proposes the following cuts to programs that benefit small businesses:
> 
> 
> a 23 percent cut to funding for Small Business Development Centers, which provide targeted counseling to small businesses across the country so that they have the tools they need to improve their capacity and increase their productivity;
> increased loan fees on the thousands of businesses participating in the Small Business Administration’s loan programs, leading to increased borrowing costs for small, local businesses seeking to grow; and
> a 5 percent cut to the SBA’s Microloan program, and a 19 percent cut to the agency’s Microloan Technical Assistance program, both of which disproportionately serve women, minority and rural small businesses.



The majority of small business owners don’t share the assessment of what you just shared. What you shared is all rhetoric from Democrats. Have you ever run a business or had P & L responsibility for a small businesses?? Loans don’t mean shit if you are going to be slapped with taxes and regulations at or near the same level as big corporations. It only means more debt and higher costs.


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> That's the problem, he hasn't done anything because his entire plan is being blocked by two democrat senators and the entire GQP.
> Just like Obama was blocked by republicans.
> Biden may as well be a lame duck.


That's the way Washington is supposed to work, legislators being forced to compromise and make deals. A good president can get involved and sway public opinion. This one is not interested in doing that.


----------



## theHawk

citygator said:


> Wall Street Journal is reluctantly celebrating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dow Briefly Jumps Above 36000, Finishes at Record
> 
> 
> The Dow traded above 36000 in the morning, then ended the day at a new high. Investors are awaiting earnings and more clarity on the Fed’s interest-rate plans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wsj.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average briefly jumped above 36000 Monday morning, hitting 36009.74 in the first 15 minutes of trading. It was up about 0.4% later in the morning, to about 35946.
> 
> If the index closes above 36,000, it will be the Dow’s sixth 1,000-point milestone of the year, the most in a single year on record. In January, the Dow closed above 31,000 for the first time.
> 
> I don’t see too much concern creeping into the market and that’s because earnings season has been a pretty strong one and most companies are seeing strong demand,” said Seema Shah, chief strategist at Principal Global Investors.


Looks like Virginians didn’t get the memo!


----------



## Smokin' OP

LeftofLeft said:


> The majority of small business owners don’t share the assessment of what you just shared. What you shared is all rhetoric from Democrats. Have you ever run a business or had P & L responsibility for a small businesses?? Loans don’t mean shit if you are going to be slapped with taxes and regulations at or near the same level as big corporations. It only means more debt and higher costs.


Yes I have.
P&L responsibility?
Profit and loss.
The number one responsibility of anyone running a business, in my book.
Done weekly.
SBA provides a lot more than loans.
They provide legal, business, employee advice, tax advice, managing advice, growing your business, purchasing advice, compliance advice.

Taxes are just another bill, just like your, payroll, loan payments, vehicle payments, equipment payments, etc.

So, are you going to insist any one of them lower your payment?
If you're going into debt over taxes and regulations, you failed 'P&L' and you should be in business, in the first place.

Regulations are just part of the job, once an inspector or compliance official explains why you must do this or that or why a rule even exist, they aren't a biggie.
It is, if your totally unprepared or it a major one that's new.


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> That's the way Washington is supposed to work, legislators being forced to compromise and make deals. A good president can get involved and sway public opinion. This one is not interested in doing that.


BS. 
Biden's infrastructure bill is popular among citizen's.
It's these two moron democrats and the GQP that are voting for their donors, instead of their constituents.

“Adding trillions of dollars more to nearly $29 trillion of national debt, without any consideration of the negative effects on our children and grandchildren, is one of those decisions that has become far too easy in Washington,” Manchin said. The month prior, he had specified that some of the climate-related provisions were “very, very disturbing.”

BS.
For decades, Manchin has profited from a series of coal companies that he founded during the 1980s. His son, Joe Manchin IV, has since assumed leadership roles in the firms, and the senator says his ownership is held in a blind trust. Yet between the time he joined the Senate and today, Manchin has personally grossed more than $4.5 million from those firms, according to financial disclosures. He also holds stock options in Enersystems Inc., the larger of the two firms, valued between $1 and $5 million.

Those two companies are Enersystems Inc. and Farmington Resources Inc., the latter of which was created by the rapid merging of two other firms, Manchin’s Transcon and Farmington Energy in 2005. Enersystems purchases low-quality waste coal from mines and resells it to power plants as fuel, while Farmington Resources provides “support activities for mining” and holds coal reserves in the Fairmont area. Over the decades, whether feeding tens of thousands of tons of dirty waste coal into the power plants in northern West Virginia or subjecting workers to unsafe conditions, Manchin’s family coal business has almost entirely avoided public scrutiny.


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> That's the way Washington is supposed to work, legislators being forced to compromise and make deals. A good president can get involved and sway public opinion. This one is not interested in doing that.


Yeah, that's the issue it's democrat's doing the compromising, never the republicans, they just say NO.
Been doing that since Clinton was president.

Arizona Democratic Senator Kyrsten Sinema has spent the last six weeks under increasing pressure from progressives to stop obstructing President Joe Biden’s agenda. Along with fellow Democratic moderate Joe Manchin (D-W.V.), Sinema has all but halted the passage of Biden’s budget complaining about the price-tag  for the wide-ranging piece of legislation publicly. And, according to reports, swiping at the prescription drug price provisions behind closed doors. 

Stan Hubbard, a Minnesota billionaire who since at least 2000 has regularly written six-figure checks to the RNC and who supported GOP presidential hopefuls like Scott Walker (before giving to a pro-Trump super-PAC) wrote Sinema a $2,900 check on Sept. 29. 
And both Jimmy Haslam, the owner of the Pilot truck stop chain and the NFL’s Cleveland Brown’s, and his wife Susan gave Sinema’s campaign $2,900 a piece on Septemeber 30. Haslam is a reliable GOP donor who has given at least $425,000 to the Senate Leadership Fund—a super-PAC set up by allies of Senate minority leader Mitch McConnell to help the GOP take control of the Senate—as well as regular maximum donations to the GOP’s House and Senate party committees.

All this seems to be paying off. Sinema received strong support throughout the entire fundraising quarter from executives and lobbyists with close ties to the pharmaceutical and finance industry. On Friday, _Politico_ reported that 90 percent of the money Sinema raised this summer came from donors who are not her constituents.


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> Where else can pension funds and 401ks invest when rates remain super low? Definitely not CEO material. Inflation is close to 6%…time to raise interest rates…then let’s see how much shit you talk, leftist zombie.


Youre a sick AnitAmerican republican rube when you can’t even be pleased the stock market increased  cause it’s under a democrat president. You’re pathetically partisan.  Seek help.


----------



## gipper

citygator said:


> Youre a sick AnitAmerican republican rube when you can’t even be pleased the stock market increased  cause it’s under a democrat president. You’re pathetically partisan.  Seek help.


We all know the stock market is an inflated bubble. It’s going to burst someday. This has nothing to do with politics. However who ever is potus when it blows up, will get the blame. Whether right or wrong.

It’s in a bubble because the Fed is keeping rates at zero, and buying billions in corporate bonds. The federal government is doing all it can to inflate balance sheets with it’s ridiculous tax policies, where hugely profitable corporations pay little to no income tax.  Big government contracts are handed out like candy to big corporations. spending trillions annually has an impact. Laws are written to protect big corporations from competition.

This can’t continue forever. When it stops, we’ll see a big crash.
55 Corporations Paid $0 in Federal Taxes on 2020 Profits


----------



## LeftofLeft

Smokin' OP said:


> Yes I have.
> P&L responsibility?
> Profit and loss.
> The number one responsibility of anyone running a business, in my book.
> Done weekly.
> SBA provides a lot more than loans.
> They provide legal, business, employee advice, tax advice, managing advice, growing your business, purchasing advice, compliance advice.
> 
> Taxes are just another bill, just like your, payroll, loan payments, vehicle payments, equipment payments, etc.
> 
> So, are you going to insist any one of them lower your payment?
> If you're going into debt over taxes and regulations, you failed 'P&L' and you should be in business, in the first place.
> 
> Regulations are just part of the job, once an inspector or compliance official explains why you must do this or that or why a rule even exist, they aren't a biggie.
> It is, if your totally unprepared or it a major one that's new.



Know business owner or P&L role should expect  to be tax-free or regulation-free. At the same time, business owners and P&L roles know egregious taxes and regulations have their limits.

Taxes and regulations are costs. If those costs are so great, it will LIMIT the number of businesses just like any other cost. This is my original premise that you keep fighting.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> Youre a sick AnitAmerican republican rube when you can’t even be pleased the stock market increased  cause it’s under a democrat president. You’re pathetically partisan.  Seek help.


LOL. You didn’t answer my question. Under Trump rates were higher AND the market still did great. Rates are at the very bottom. Of course the market will be high. Why don’t you try honesty for a change. For the 100th time, I am an Independent


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> BS.
> Biden's infrastructure bill is popular among citizen's.
> It's these two moron democrats and the GQP that are voting for their donors, instead of their constituents.
> 
> “Adding trillions of dollars more to nearly $29 trillion of national debt, without any consideration of the negative effects on our children and grandchildren, is one of those decisions that has become far too easy in Washington,” Manchin said. The month prior, he had specified that some of the climate-related provisions were “very, very disturbing.”
> 
> BS.
> For decades, Manchin has profited from a series of coal companies that he founded during the 1980s. His son, Joe Manchin IV, has since assumed leadership roles in the firms, and the senator says his ownership is held in a blind trust. Yet between the time he joined the Senate and today, Manchin has personally grossed more than $4.5 million from those firms, according to financial disclosures. He also holds stock options in Enersystems Inc., the larger of the two firms, valued between $1 and $5 million.
> 
> Those two companies are Enersystems Inc. and Farmington Resources Inc., the latter of which was created by the rapid merging of two other firms, Manchin’s Transcon and Farmington Energy in 2005. Enersystems purchases low-quality waste coal from mines and resells it to power plants as fuel, while Farmington Resources provides “support activities for mining” and holds coal reserves in the Fairmont area. Over the decades, whether feeding tens of thousands of tons of dirty waste coal into the power plants in northern West Virginia or subjecting workers to unsafe conditions, Manchin’s family coal business has almost entirely avoided public scrutiny.


Manchin is correct, throwing trillions of dollars around like they're Monopoly money is a quick way to turn the American dollar into real Monopoly money. Unless you know everything that is in that massive new spending bill, you have no idea if it's a good idea or not. If only a small percentage of it is actually directed to infrastructure, it SHOULD be blocked and stripped down. As for it being popular, the IDEA of spending money on infrastructure is appealing, something that democrats rely on when they want to crank up a lot more new spending. I remember a certain democrat president who demanded and got billions of dollars for "shovel-ready" infrastructure jobs, then laughed about how they weren't "shovel-ready" after all.

This happens repeatedly. Democrats want to spend money but know that if they just crank up a bunch of random spending bills people will not support them, so they find a focus group approved subject people react positively to and put that on the spending bills. That way they can then just lard the things up with massive amounts of unnecessary pork designed solely to get themselves re-elected and maintain their power. Again, Manchin is correct.


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> Yeah, that's the issue it's democrat's doing the compromising, never the republicans, they just say NO.
> Been doing that since Clinton was president.
> 
> Arizona Democratic Senator Kyrsten Sinema has spent the last six weeks under increasing pressure from progressives to stop obstructing President Joe Biden’s agenda. Along with fellow Democratic moderate Joe Manchin (D-W.V.), Sinema has all but halted the passage of Biden’s budget complaining about the price-tag  for the wide-ranging piece of legislation publicly. And, according to reports, swiping at the prescription drug price provisions behind closed doors.
> 
> Stan Hubbard, a Minnesota billionaire who since at least 2000 has regularly written six-figure checks to the RNC and who supported GOP presidential hopefuls like Scott Walker (before giving to a pro-Trump super-PAC) wrote Sinema a $2,900 check on Sept. 29.
> And both Jimmy Haslam, the owner of the Pilot truck stop chain and the NFL’s Cleveland Brown’s, and his wife Susan gave Sinema’s campaign $2,900 a piece on Septemeber 30. Haslam is a reliable GOP donor who has given at least $425,000 to the Senate Leadership Fund—a super-PAC set up by allies of Senate minority leader Mitch McConnell to help the GOP take control of the Senate—as well as regular maximum donations to the GOP’s House and Senate party committees.
> 
> All this seems to be paying off. Sinema received strong support throughout the entire fundraising quarter from executives and lobbyists with close ties to the pharmaceutical and finance industry. On Friday, _Politico_ reported that 90 percent of the money Sinema raised this summer came from donors who are not her constituents.


Democrats don't compromise, I'm surprised you're claiming that they do. Republicans have only in the past few years discovered that when democrats talk about compromise they only mean Republicans are supposed to compromise, not democrats. It's not really surprising to see them flexing their political muscles. It's something the Blue Blood Rockefeller and Bush Republicans always lacked, as they allowed democrats pretty much free reign to do what they wanted. I think it was when Bush, Sr. allowed them to raise taxes then got savaged by them for breaking his pledge that Republicans started to get fed up with it.


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> Manchin is correct, throwing trillions of dollars around like they're Monopoly money is a quick way to turn the American dollar into real Monopoly money. Unless you know everything that is in that massive new spending bill, you have no idea if it's a good idea or not. If only a small percentage of it is actually directed to infrastructure, it SHOULD be blocked and stripped down. As for it being popular, the IDEA of spending money on infrastructure is appealing, something that democrats rely on when they want to crank up a lot more new spending. I remember a certain democrat president who demanded and got billions of dollars for "shovel-ready" infrastructure jobs, then laughed about how they weren't "shovel-ready" after all.
> 
> This happens repeatedly. Democrats want to spend money but know that if they just crank up a bunch of random spending bills people will not support them, so they find a focus group approved subject people react positively to and put that on the spending bills. That way they can then just lard the things up with massive amounts of unnecessary pork designed solely to get themselves re-elected and maintain their power. Again, Manchin is correct.


No, he isn't.
 Just like Trumptards that voted for a $2.3 trillion tax cut, instead of cutting spending, they went on a shopping spree.
The GQP only cares about the debt/deficit when a democrat is in office or at election time.

'I remember a certain democrat president who demanded and got billions of dollars for "shovel-ready" infrastructure jobs, then laughed about how they weren't "shovel-ready" after all'.

Yes, they were, they weren't as plentiful as Obama claimed when the  American Recovery and Reinvestment Act was proposed.

Republicans insisted to cuts, repeatedly filibustered routine extensions of emergency unemployment benefits, blocked aid to state governments, filibustered infrastructure investment, used extreme legislative vehicles like refusing to follow precedent on the typically _pro forma_ votes to raise the debt ceiling to extract _more _economically damaging government spending cuts, blocked passage of a majority of the American Jobs Act (AJA), demanded counterproductive offsets to fiscal stimulus, and attacked the Federal Reserve’s expansion of the monetary base and other policy responses intended to lower unemployment. What follows is an abbreviated chronology.

Then when it came to a vote, only 3 republicans voted for the bill.
It was too small, just like republicans and two bought and paid for democrats are doing to Biden's bill.

Then the GQP will whine, when it doesn't do much.

But they will brag how much 'pork' *they *brought home, even though they never voted for it, just like they did with Obama's bill.

The GQP are pure slime.


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> Democrats don't compromise, I'm surprised you're claiming that they do. Republicans have only in the past few years discovered that when democrats talk about compromise they only mean Republicans are supposed to compromise, not democrats. It's not really surprising to see them flexing their political muscles. It's something the Blue Blood Rockefeller and Bush Republicans always lacked, as they allowed democrats pretty much free reign to do what they wanted. I think it was when Bush, Sr. allowed them to raise taxes then got savaged by them for breaking his pledge that Republicans started to get fed up with it.


Right.
Like the GQP are compromising now?
Or when Obama was president?
It's the democrats that are cutting their bill down to appease the two wannabe republicans.


----------



## Winco

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,


Yup, I agree.  Not ultra Rich. Just VERY comfortable.


theHawk said:


> Inflation! Ain’t it great?


I'm selfish.
I'm happy to pay 10% more for a PRODUCT, when I'm making 20% on my Investments.
Who has a problem with this????????


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> LOL. You didn’t answer my question. Under Trump rates were higher AND the market still did great. Rates are at the very bottom. Of course the market will be high. Why don’t you try honesty for a change. For the 100th time, I am an Independent


You’re an evil dude. Raising interest rates won’t fix the driver of the problem which is supply chain shortages from the shut down under Trump. Raising interest rates will still result in the same pricing problems and it would tank the economy. You would rather hurt the economy to feel good about the bad press for Democrats than really address the problems. Evil.


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> Right.
> Like the GQP are compromising now?
> Or when Obama was president?
> It's the democrats that are cutting their bill down to appease the two wannabe republicans.


Yup, they figured out that they never got anywhere by compromising with democrats, just like Bush Sr found out when he caved to their demands for higher taxes, then they turned on him and make a campaign issue out of him doing it. Now, Republicans are acting like democrats and democrats are throwing tantrums over it.


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> No, he isn't.
> Just like Trumptards that voted for a $2.3 trillion tax cut, instead of cutting spending, they went on a shopping spree.
> The GQP only cares about the debt/deficit when a democrat is in office or at election time.
> 
> 'I remember a certain democrat president who demanded and got billions of dollars for "shovel-ready" infrastructure jobs, then laughed about how they weren't "shovel-ready" after all'.
> 
> Yes, they were, they weren't as plentiful as Obama claimed when the  American Recovery and Reinvestment Act was proposed.
> 
> Republicans insisted to cuts, repeatedly filibustered routine extensions of emergency unemployment benefits, blocked aid to state governments, filibustered infrastructure investment, used extreme legislative vehicles like refusing to follow precedent on the typically _pro forma_ votes to raise the debt ceiling to extract _more _economically damaging government spending cuts, blocked passage of a majority of the American Jobs Act (AJA), demanded counterproductive offsets to fiscal stimulus, and attacked the Federal Reserve’s expansion of the monetary base and other policy responses intended to lower unemployment. What follows is an abbreviated chronology.
> 
> Then when it came to a vote, only 3 republicans voted for the bill.
> It was too small, just like republicans and two bought and paid for democrats are doing to Biden's bill.
> 
> Then the GQP will whine, when it doesn't do much.
> 
> But they will brag how much 'pork' *they *brought home, even though they never voted for it, just like they did with Obama's bill.
> 
> The GQP are pure slime.


Name 3 government programs that were budgeted less dollars year over year due to Republican "cuts". Then you can talk about "damaging government spending cuts". And here's a clue, increasing spending by 6% on a program instead of the requested 8% is NOT a "cut".


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> You’re an evil dude. Raising interest rates won’t fix the driver of the problem which is supply chain shortages from the shut down under Trump. Raising interest rates will still result in the same pricing problems and it would tank the economy. You would rather hurt the economy to feel good about the bad press for Democrats than really address the problems. Evil.


They weren’t shut down under Trump. They were impacted by the virus and stupid compliance laws in Cali. I am Evil? Ha ha ha ha. Nazis called my people evil too. Nothing new. Democrats call those who disagree with them racist. That’s their calling card. Talk about evil. This is why VA suddenly turned purple after Biden won it by 10pts…actually VA went full RED! All those voters evil too?


----------



## DudleySmith

hadit said:


> Name 3 government programs that were budgeted less dollars year over year due to Republican "cuts". Then you can talk about "damaging government spending cuts". And here's a clue, increasing spending by 6% on a program instead of the requested 8% is NOT a "cut".



Math is racist; quit using racist memes like arithmetic.


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> They weren’t shut down under Trump. They were impacted by the virus and stupid compliance laws in Cali. I am Evil? Ha ha ha ha. Nazis called my people evil too. Nothing new. Democrats call those who disagree with them racist. That’s their calling card. Talk about evil. This is why VA suddenly turned purple after Biden won it by 10pts…actually VA went full RED! All those voters evil too?


I noticed you didn’t deny rooting against the economy and suggesting disastrous actions. Instead you posted about nazis and racists. What the hell?


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> I noticed you didn’t deny rooting against the economy and suggesting disastrous actions. Instead you posted about nazis and racists. What the hell?


I do not root against anything. This isn't an athletic event. I am seeking common sense policies and free markets. I responded to your posts because those are the calling cards of Leftists like you. What the hell? You literally called me evil. If you cannot see the massive bubble in the stock market then you need to go back to college.


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> I do not root against anything. This isn't an athletic event. I am seeking common sense policies and free markets. I responded to your posts because those are the calling cards of Leftists like you. What the hell? You literally called me evil. If you cannot see the massive bubble in the stock market then you need to go back to college.


You are suggesting raising interest rates when that isn’t the pricing problem. It’s supply strained from pent up demand.

What would you call someone who wanted to crash the economy because they wanted to be able to post about it on a message board?  Sick?  Evil could be a stretch I’ll grant you.


----------



## iamwhatiseem

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.



*citygator: *(When a Democrat is President) - Wall Street profits shows how great our economy is thanks to President (D)
*citygator:* (When a Republican is President) - Wall Street profits shows how Republicans only care about the rich


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> You are suggesting raising interest rates when that isn’t the pricing problem. It’s supply strained from pent up demand.
> 
> What would you call someone who wanted to crash the economy because they wanted to be able to post about it on a message board?  Sick?  Evil could be a stretch I’ll grant you.


I am suggesting raising interest rates because then people can invest their monies in savings accounts, CDs and bonds vs. just equities. That will also normalize the overinflated housing market. It is not JUST a supply chain problem, this is what you do not understand. Find the post where I said I wanted to "crash the economy"? You're just making shit up now, leftist.


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> Find the post where I said I wanted to "crash the economy"? You're just making shit up now, leftist.


Ok. Here you go:

“time to raise interest rates…then let’s see how much shit you talk,”

Those statements  are directly connected by you. If raising rates was going to help the economy why wouldn’t I be happy about it and posting the results here? Youre so disingenuous.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> Ok. Here you go:
> 
> “time to raise interest rates…then let’s see how much shit you talk,”
> 
> Those statements  are directly connected by you. If raising rates was going to help the economy why wouldn’t I be happy about it and posting the results here? Youre so disingenuous.


That will impact the stock market but will also give rise to CDs, bonds and savings account. It won't crash the economy LOL. In fact it will allow banks to increase profits and potentially lend more. You're so uninformed. Did you really go to school?


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> That will impact the stock market but will also give rise to CDs, bonds and savings account. It won't crash the economy LOL. In fact it will allow banks to increase profits and potentially lend more. You're so uninformed. Did you really go to school?


Dodged the question and tried to hide it with nonsense and an insult.

Why would raising interest rates stop me from “talking shit”? You’re cornered.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> Dodged the question and tried to hide it with nonsense and an insult.
> 
> Why would raising interest rates stop me from “talking shit”? You’re cornered.


Because all you have is the stock market. Everything else Biden and his party have utterly destroyed. Once rates normalize so will the inflated market. That is actually better for younger persons as they can buy more shares via their retirement accounts. That is why. Do you want me to teach you basic finance and economics? High stock prices only benefit those that are cashing out, lower values help those dollar cost averaging without a current need for liquidity.


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> Because all you have is the stock market. Everything else Biden and his party have utterly destroyed. Once rates normalize so will the inflated market. That is actually better for younger persons as they can buy more shares via their retirement accounts. That is why. Do you want me to teach you basic finance and economics? High stock prices only benefit those that are cashing out, lower values help those dollar cost averaging without a current need for liquidity.


See the employment thread for more good news from the Biden administration. Your lame POV that the market is the only positive and that it is also a fake positive reeks of desperation and the type of gaslighting you guys do. Keep it up comrade. 





__





						Biden’s Economy adds 531,000 jobs in October
					

At this rate right wingers are gonna have a hard time pretending like the economy sucks for the next 3 years. Jobs are everywhere. Hiring is booming.  Stocks are rising. We are obviously entering a golden age of the economy...



					www.usmessageboard.com


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> See the employment thread for more good news from the Biden administration. Your lame POV that the market is the only positive and that it is also a fake positive reeks of desperation and the type of gaslighting you guys do. Keep it up comrade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Biden’s Economy adds 531,000 jobs in October
> 
> 
> At this rate right wingers are gonna have a hard time pretending like the economy sucks for the next 3 years. Jobs are everywhere. Hiring is booming.  Stocks are rising. We are obviously entering a golden age of the economy...
> 
> 
> 
> www.usmessageboard.com


Did they meet expectations? Yes or no? Biden's approval ratings are in the toilet for a reason. Why do you think that is?


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> Did they meet expectations? Yes or no? Biden's approval ratings are in the toilet for a reason. Why do you think that is?


Brandon’s approval is being hurt by the needed, but highly unpopular, vaccination OSHA guidelines. Plus no one likes price increases from supply and demand issues and that is being taken out on Biden. Finally he hasn’t navigated the infrastructure bills yet.

As for expectations:


August job numbers were adjusted upward from 235 to 483 (+248)
September job numbers were adjusted upward from 194 to 312 (+118)
Adjusted total of +366 jobs added to the economy than first reported in Aug & Sep jobs reports, respectively
Total of +1.33m jobs added to the economy from Aug-Oct (w/Oct #s likely to be adjusted upward next month)
Average=+443 per month Aug-Oct
22.36m jobs lost from covid shutdown
18.74m jobs gained since then


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> Brandon’s approval is being hurt by the needed, but highly unpopular, vaccination OSHA guidelines. Plus no one likes price increases from supply and demand issues and that is being taken out on Biden. Finally he hasn’t navigated the infrastructure bills yet.
> 
> As for expectations:
> 
> 
> August job numbers were adjusted upward from 235 to 483 (+248)
> September job numbers were adjusted upward from 194 to 312 (+118)
> Adjusted total of +366 jobs added to the economy than first reported in Aug & Sep jobs reports, respectively
> Total of +1.33m jobs added to the economy from Aug-Oct (w/Oct #s likely to be adjusted upward next month)
> Average=+443 per month Aug-Oct
> 22.36m jobs lost from covid shutdown
> 18.74m jobs gained since then


So still a big negative in jobs and you called him Brandon. Ha ha


----------



## citygator

AzogtheDefiler said:


> So still a big negative in jobs and you called him Brandon. Ha ha


Not on Brandon’s watch. It’s positive. The negative was all that fat guy, whatshisname?


----------



## AquaAthena

November 5, 2021

*Today’s jobs report showed an acceleration in hiring. Businesses added 604,000 jobs while the government shed 73,000, for a nonfarm payroll expansion of 531,000. This is strong evidence that the end of enhanced unemployment benefits in September has incentivized out-of-work Americans to accept jobs. The revisions to September and August, which added a total of 235,000 jobs, suggest that the earlier ends to the benefit bonuses in Republican-led states got this process started this summer.*

It also suggests that this could have been accomplished earlier, which would have eased inflationary pressures and boosted consumer sentiment. The decision by the Biden administration and Capitol Hill Democrats to extend benefits through the summer now looks like a political own-goal. Perhaps Biden's approval rating would not be as deep underwater as it is today if there had been a few good jobs reports and lower inflationary reads over the summer months. The economic damage is continuing, however, with the labor force about two percent smaller than it was prepandemic.

Speaking of which, labor force participation was surprisingly unchanged at 61.6 percent. The quickest explanation for this is that the population expanded by 142,000. So even though 104,000 people were added to the workforce, they didn't move the participation needle down.

For the Federal Reserve, this report pushes both in a dovish and a hawkish direction. The stronger than expected jobs figure indicates less need for accommodative monetary policy. But black unemployment remained unchanged for the month, which means that October employment fell short of Fed Chair Jerome Powell's goal of a "broad and inclusive" expansion.

Next week will bring October reads for the Producer Price Index (PPI) on Tuesday and the Consumer Price Index (CPI) on Wednesday. It's likely that PPI will remain at least as hot as it was last month, when it rose 0.5 percent, due to ongoing supply chain constraints. CPI likely accelerated due to the retreat of the Delta variant and signs that spending on services surged in October. If the Democrats have not managed to pass Biden's big-spending bills by midweek, the resurgence of inflationary pressures would likely create even more doubts in the minds of more centrist lawmakers about the wisdom of ramping up government spending. *That may be why President Biden was demanding lawmakers pass the bills "right now" on Friday.*

– Alex Marlow & John Carney
Breitbart News Network





__





						Gmail
					





					mail.google.com


----------



## Smokin' OP

hadit said:


> Name 3 government programs that were budgeted less dollars year over year due to Republican "cuts". Then you can talk about "damaging government spending cuts". And here's a clue, increasing spending by 6% on a program instead of the requested 8% is NOT a "cut".


Trump cut the HUD department by $6.2 billion. 13%
Trump cut the education department by $9.2 billion. 14%
Trump cut the health and human services department budget by $15.1 billion.18%
Trump cut the department of agriculture $4.7 billion. 21%
Trump cut the state department $10.9 billion. 29%
Trump cut the EPA by $2.5 billion. 31%


----------



## Smokin' OP

AquaAthena said:


> November 5, 2021
> 
> *Today’s jobs report showed an acceleration in hiring. Businesses added 604,000 jobs while the government shed 73,000, for a nonfarm payroll expansion of 531,000. This is strong evidence that the end of enhanced unemployment benefits in September has incentivized out-of-work Americans to accept jobs. The revisions to September and August, which added a total of 235,000 jobs, suggest that the earlier ends to the benefit bonuses in Republican-led states got this process started this summer.*
> 
> It also suggests that this could have been accomplished earlier, which would have eased inflationary pressures and boosted consumer sentiment. The decision by the Biden administration and Capitol Hill Democrats to extend benefits through the summer now looks like a political own-goal. Perhaps Biden's approval rating would not be as deep underwater as it is today if there had been a few good jobs reports and lower inflationary reads over the summer months. The economic damage is continuing, however, with the labor force about two percent smaller than it was prepandemic.
> 
> Speaking of which, labor force participation was surprisingly unchanged at 61.6 percent. The quickest explanation for this is that the population expanded by 142,000. So even though 104,000 people were added to the workforce, they didn't move the participation needle down.
> 
> For the Federal Reserve, this report pushes both in a dovish and a hawkish direction. The stronger than expected jobs figure indicates less need for accommodative monetary policy. But black unemployment remained unchanged for the month, which means that October employment fell short of Fed Chair Jerome Powell's goal of a "broad and inclusive" expansion.
> 
> Next week will bring October reads for the Producer Price Index (PPI) on Tuesday and the Consumer Price Index (CPI) on Wednesday. It's likely that PPI will remain at least as hot as it was last month, when it rose 0.5 percent, due to ongoing supply chain constraints. CPI likely accelerated due to the retreat of the Delta variant and signs that spending on services surged in October. If the Democrats have not managed to pass Biden's big-spending bills by midweek, the resurgence of inflationary pressures would likely create even more doubts in the minds of more centrist lawmakers about the wisdom of ramping up government spending. *That may be why President Biden was demanding lawmakers pass the bills "right now" on Friday.*
> 
> – Alex Marlow & John Carney
> Breitbart News Network
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gmail
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mail.google.com


That didn't take long, I was wondering when the GQP was going to bring out the  labor force participation rate, because of a democrats good job numbers.

Haven't read/heard of that in 6 years.

February 7, 2020
The labor force participation rate reached a Trump-era high of 63.4 percent, up from 63.2 percent in December, because the civilian labor force increased by 574,000 in January, after accounting for annual adjustments to population controls, BLS said.*


----------



## hadit

Smokin' OP said:


> Trump cut the HUD department by $6.2 billion. 13%
> Trump cut the education department by $9.2 billion. 14%
> Trump cut the health and human services department budget by $15.1 billion.18%
> Trump cut the department of agriculture $4.7 billion. 21%
> Trump cut the state department $10.9 billion. 29%
> Trump cut the EPA by $2.5 billion. 31%


First, which year?
Second, what did Congress enact? I'm don't care what the president proposes, that's not what gets passed into law.


----------



## Westender

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,


I'm getting well up in wealth and I'm far from elite. I work hard and invest


----------



## Weatherman2020

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Celebration of the rich getting richer, how Leftist of you.


----------



## Smokin' OP

Weatherman2020 said:


> Celebration of the rich getting richer, how Leftist of you.


So, the left may celebrate, that aspect of the economy getting better.
The right not only celebrates, they reward them.

December 24 2017
President Trump kicked off his holiday weekend at Mar-a-Lago Friday night at a dinner where he told friends, "You all just got a lot richer," referencing the sweeping tax overhaul he signed into law hours earlier. 

The president has spent many weekends of his presidency so far at the "Winter White House," where initiation fees cost $200,000, annual dues cost $14,000, and some of the most affluent members of society have the opportunity to interact with the president in a setting while many Americans cannot.


----------



## Cellblock2429

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,


/——-/ No ones fault but yours. Trump is gone and yet your problems didn’t disappear, they got worse, and you are still an insufferable bore.


----------



## Weatherman2020

Smokin' OP said:


> So, the left may celebrate, that aspect of the economy getting better.
> The right not only celebrates, they reward them.
> 
> December 24 2017
> President Trump kicked off his holiday weekend at Mar-a-Lago Friday night at a dinner where he told friends, "You all just got a lot richer," referencing the sweeping tax overhaul he signed into law hours earlier.
> 
> The president has spent many weekends of his presidency so far at the "Winter White House," where initiation fees cost $200,000, annual dues cost $14,000, and some of the most affluent members of society have the opportunity to interact with the president in a setting while many Americans cannot.


I’m happy he got richer as I did. As are the poor who did better because of President Trump.








						U.S. income inequality narrowed slightly over last three years: Fed
					

Income inequality in the United States narrowed in the first three years of the Trump administration as rising wages and a low unemployment rate fueled gains for lower-income and less educated families, according to U.S. Federal Reserve data released on Monday.




					www.reuters.com


----------



## iamwhatiseem

Weatherman2020 said:


> I’m happy he got richer as I did. As are the poor who did better because of President Trump.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. income inequality narrowed slightly over last three years: Fed
> 
> 
> Income inequality in the United States narrowed in the first three years of the Trump administration as rising wages and a low unemployment rate fueled gains for lower-income and less educated families, according to U.S. Federal Reserve data released on Monday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com


Unlike the wealth gap which grew more under Obama than any other President in U.S. History.
But....but... he is a Democrat...so...shhhh... we must keep blaming TRUMP!!!!!!


----------



## eagle1462010




----------



## Smokin' OP

Weatherman2020 said:


> I’m happy he got richer as I did. As are the poor who did better because of President Trump.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. income inequality narrowed slightly over last three years: Fed
> 
> 
> Income inequality in the United States narrowed in the first three years of the Trump administration as rising wages and a low unemployment rate fueled gains for lower-income and less educated families, according to U.S. Federal Reserve data released on Monday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com





The richest 1 percent of taxpayers will get an average tax cut of $50,000 in 2020. That’s 75 times more than the tax cut for the bottom 80 percent, which will average just $645.  These figures are comparable to estimates from the Tax Policy Center for 2018, which found the average tax cut for the richest 1 percent to be $51,000 and the average tax cut for the bottom 80 percent to be about $800.

A big reason benefits are tilted to the top is the law slashed the U.S. corporate tax rate on domestic profits from 35 percent to 21 percent and on foreign profits to about 10 percent. Wealthy people own most corporate stock.

Wait until Trump's tax cuts for individuals expire in 3 years.
Corporate tax cuts are permanent.


----------



## Smokin' OP

iamwhatiseem said:


> Unlike the wealth gap which grew more under Obama than any other President in U.S. History.
> But....but... he is a Democrat...so...shhhh... we must keep blaming TRUMP!!!!!!


You're FOS, as usual.



hadit said:


> First, which year?
> Second, what did Congress enact? I'm don't care what the president proposes, that's not what gets passed into law.


That was the 2018 budget by congress contained in Trump's tax cut, in passed in March of 2018.


----------



## Smokin' OP

Smokin' OP said:


> You're FOS, as usual.
> 
> 
> That was the 2018 budget by congress contained in Trump's tax cut, in passed in March of 2018.


2019.


----------



## PinktheFloyd88

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,


Yes perhaps soon enough you won't be able to afford Internet and will have to stop posting


----------



## progressive hunter

PinktheFloyd88 said:


> Yes perhaps soon enough you won't be able to afford Internet and will have to stop posting


thats very childish of you to say,,,


----------



## Ivan88

Back in the 60's there was stock market enthusiasm for rising profits protecting stockholders from inflation.
It was a failed strategy for most people.


----------



## airplanemechanic

Liberals under Trump: The strong stock market is no indication of the strength of the economy as a whole
Liberals under Biden: The strong stock market is an indication of a strong economy

You can't make this shit up.


----------



## Colin norris

progressive hunter said:


> glad to hear the rich elites are getting richer while us bottom feeders get poorer,,



All the Republicans have been saying the economy is tanking. Doom and gloom just around the corner.  Inflation out of control and the Chinese communists are about to invade. 
I think they are all lying.


----------



## Nova78

Not now, Shit for brains Biden has destroyed this country, and the sheeples continue to follow this dipshit to their demise.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Nova78 said:


> Not now, Shit for brains Biden has destroyed this country, and the sheeples continue to follow this dipshit to their demise.



simply a buying opportunity.   There are always ups and downs with the market.  But it takes balls to ride them out so you are just shit out of luck


----------



## JLW

This was the worst week for the stock market  since March 2020. I wonder who was president then?

Markets do fluctuate though I admittedly am worried about stock prices as the stimulus effect runs its course.


----------



## Nova78

Shit for brains Biden is your biggest problem


----------



## Turtlesoup

Golfing Gator said:


> simply a buying opportunity.   There are always ups and downs with the market.  But it takes balls to ride them out so you are just shit out of luck


Buying Opportunity?  Bwahahaha


----------



## Golfing Gator

Turtlesoup said:


> Buying Opportunity?  Bwahahaha



Yep, since I posted that the DJI is up almost 5%, and the NASDAQ is up about 5.5%

The market is no place for soyboys like you.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


It's great. Hopefully the trend continues once the rates start going up. Right now inflation is taking money from people while companies stay solvent


----------



## Nova78

Colin norris said:


> All the Republicans have been saying the economy is tanking. Doom and gloom just around the corner.  Inflation out of control and the Chinese communists are about to invade.
> I think they are all lying


hows it going now ,dip


----------



## Nova78

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Soaring ? fucking moron


----------



## Nova78

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Hows is your portfolio doing 4/29/22 ,


----------



## citygator

Nova78 said:


> Hows is your portfolio doing 4/29/22 ,
> View attachment 638703


Why don’t you get out of the market?  Those who do it for a living are investing.


Buffett Is Back With One of His Biggest Buying Sprees in Years


----------



## Golfing Gator

citygator said:


> Why don’t you get out of the market?  Those who do it for a living are investing.
> 
> 
> Buffett Is Back With One of His Biggest Buying Sprees in Years
> 
> View attachment 638713



This is how the rich get richer.   People get spooked, flee the market during a downturn and those with the cash to do so buy up all the down stocks knowing they will be back.


----------



## Weatherman2020

Golfing Gator said:


> This is how the rich get richer.   People get spooked, flee the market during a downturn and those with the cash to do so buy up all the down stocks knowing they will be back.


Yeah, most people were very rich in 1935.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Weatherman2020 said:


> Yeah, most people were very rich in 1935.



Most people are never very rich.

But people like Getty and Kennedy, Boeing and Chrysler got much richer via the depression.


----------



## Weatherman2020

Golfing Gator said:


> Most people are never very rich.
> 
> But people like Getty and Kennedy, Boeing and Chrysler got much richer via the depression.


Not because of the depression. 
You’re an idiot to say this Bidenpression is good for people.


----------



## gipper

Golfing Gator said:


> This is how the rich get richer.   People get spooked, flee the market during a downturn and those with the cash to do so buy up all the down stocks knowing they will be back.


True but Buffet has a much better chance of generating enormous profits than your typical investor. He has insider knowledge few have. His connections up and down Wall Street grant him near foolproof success.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Weatherman2020 said:


> Not because of the depression.
> You’re an idiot to say this Bidenpression is good for people.



Yes, they got rich because of the depression.  

And no, I did not say it was good for people. I said it is how the rich get richer


----------



## Golfing Gator

gipper said:


> True but Buffet has a much better chance of generating enormous profits than your typical investor. He has insider knowledge few have. His connections up and down Wall Street grant him near foolproof success.



plus he has like a billion dollars in cash to buy with when the right time hits.


----------



## Redfish

Golfing Gator said:


> Yes, they got rich because of the depression.
> 
> And no, I did not say it was good for people. I said it is how the rich get richer


so when rich democrat donors get rich at the expense of average americans, you think thats a good thing?   you are demented if you do.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Redfish said:


> so when rich democrat donors get rich at the expense of average americans, you think thats a good thing?   you are demented if you do.



where the fuck did I say it was good?????????

And why the fuck do you think only Dems are rich people?????????


----------



## Redfish

Redfish said:


> so when rich democrat donors get rich at the expense of average americans, you think thats a good thing?   you are demented if you do.


GG thinks this is funny, laughing is always an excuse when you have no logical response, ask Hillary and Cameltoe, they do it constantly.


----------



## Redfish

Golfing Gator said:


> where the fuck did I say it was good?????????
> 
> And why the fuck do you think only Dems are rich people?????????


post 195.   I said rich democrat donors,  most of the people mentioned in this thread are rich democrat donors who profit when the market crashes and destroys average people.   You said you don't think its good, but you praised them for doing it------------hypocrisy?


----------



## Golfing Gator

Redfish said:


> post 195.   I said rich democrat donors,  most of the people mentioned in this thread are rich democrat donors who profit when the market crashes and destroys average people.   You said you don't think its good, but you praised them for doing it------------hypocrisy?



nothing in 195 about anything being good.  I did not praise them, I pointed out the facts


----------



## Golfing Gator

Redfish said:


> GG thinks this is funny, laughing is always an excuse when you have no logical response, ask Hillary and Cameltoe, they do it constantly.



what's funny is you making shit up that I said


----------



## Redfish

Golfing Gator said:


> nothing in 195 about anything being good.  I did not praise them, I pointed out the facts


maybe that was your intent, but your words indicated that you wish you could do as they do and profit off of a falling market that destroys common americans.


----------



## Turtlesoup

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


City, Your posts don't age well do they--------You were warned that the DOW was BS ---inflation, stimulus money being funneled around, fake employment numbers, bidens war on fuel, Biden Chinese communist ass kissing policies, crime, and illegals all around---Dow is going down.    Biden has killed the economy that trump built up.  Don't you worry though, more socialism which means the billionaires get richer, the poor get poorer once adjusted for inflation and the middle class again shrinks.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Redfish said:


> maybe that was your intent, but your words indicated that you wish you could do as they do and profit off of a falling market that destroys common americans.



no, they do not indicate that at all


----------



## Redfish

Golfing Gator said:


> no, they do not indicate that at all


maybe you need to reread them,  it seems that everyone here read them as I did.   no big deal, we all know who and what you are on this board.  your posts surprise no one,  your left leanings are obvious and well documented.   I will say that at least you are true to your misguided ideology.

tell me this,   where and when has liberalism/socialism ever worked for the average citizens?


----------



## Golfing Gator

Redfish said:


> maybe you need to reread them, it seems that everyone here read them as I did.



Yes, the two people with the same ideological bend read them that way.   The person that is not a MAGA head did not read them that way.  Odd. 



Redfish said:


> tell me this, where and when has liberalism/socialism ever worked for the average citizens?



You mean things like SS and Medicare and unemployment and welfare?


----------



## eagle1462010

All real wealth is being horded on paper with real assets and deeds for a global reset.  Not ti mention gold.

Globalist will screw the world....reset it... And have own everything on paper as the just start over sgain wirh all the wealth.

WEF doesnt hide it anymore


----------



## Indeependent

Weatherman2020 said:


> Not because of the depression.
> You’re an idiot to say this Bidenpression is good for people.


GG didn't say this was good for people.


----------



## eagle1462010

Gator is just another Mac trying to get people to vote 3rd party because he knows we will not vote Dem.

Dblack is another.  Want Dblack to lose it.  Bring up Scotus Trump pics and say you are Welcome.  Lol


----------



## theHawk

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Boy, this thread didn’t age well.  Dow is below 33,000 now.  We’re still plagued with “supply chain issues” which Biden has done nothing to fix, in fact most of it is a direct result of his policies or the policy of Dems in Blue States.


----------



## marvin martian

theHawk said:


> Boy, this thread didn’t age well.  Dow is below 33,000 now.  We’re still plagued with “supply chain issues” which Biden has done nothing to fix, in fact most of it is a direct result of his policies or the policy of Dems in Blue States.



Let's go, Brandon!


----------



## citygator

theHawk said:


> Boy, this thread didn’t age well.  Dow is below 33,000 now.  We’re still plagued with “supply chain issues” which Biden has done nothing to fix, in fact most of it is a direct result of his policies or the policy of Dems in Blue States.


Meh. You getting out of the market?  The professionals are increasing their investment in Biden’s stock market.


----------



## badbob85037

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


How hard is it for you to find anything good about this administration with a loaf of bread costing $6.00? I mean how stupid are you?


----------



## citygator

badbob85037 said:


> How hard is it for you to find anything good about this administration with a loaf of bread costing $6.00? I mean how stupid are you?


If you’re paying $6 for bread you’re stupid. Try Kroger or Publix and stay out of the Trump Towers convenience store.


----------



## Sandisk

Dow tumbles 1,100 points, Nasdaq loses 5% in worst day of the year for stocks​








						Dow tumbles 1,000 points for the worst day since 2020, Nasdaq drops 5%
					

Stocks reversed Wednesday's rally and then fell back toward their lowest levels of the year.




					www.cnbc.com
				




The Nasdaq is lower now than when Biden took office.
The DOW is down over the last 12 months.
The GDP was down for Q1 2022.
Inflation is the highest in 40+ years.
The US national debt has exploded under Biden.
America just posted the largest, trade deficit in history.








						US Trade Deficit Hits Highest On Record As Imports Soar
					

US trade deficit hits highest on record as imports soar




					www.ibtimes.com
				




I despise both parties...so I have no bias.
But anyone who says that Biden has been good for the economy is either ignorant or delusional.


----------



## Cougarbear

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


DOW down to 33,000 as profits are shrinking under Joe Biden... Let's Go Brandon!


----------



## Sandisk

Cougarbear said:


> DOW down to 33,000 as profits are shrinking under Joe Biden... Let's Go Brandon!


It's one thing to point out that things are worse under Biden.
It's another thing entirely to actually take pleasure (which you obviously are - no matter how much you deny it) in the misery that this is causing tens of millions of Americans.
You selfish prick.


----------



## Indeependent

Sandisk said:


> It's one thing to point out that things are worse under Biden.
> It's another thing entirely to actually take pleasure (which you obviously are - no matter how much you deny it) in the misery that this is causing tens of millions of Americans.
> You selfish prick.


You mean like the people who blame WWI on Trump?


----------



## Cougarbear

Sandisk said:


> It's one thing to point out that things are worse under Biden.
> It's another thing entirely to actually take pleasure (which you obviously are - no matter how much you deny it) in the misery that this is causing tens of millions of Americans.
> You selfish prick.


Actually, if you knew anything about the stock market, this is a buying time period in which the patient investor doesn't worry about because they are in it for the long haul. And, nice try to deflect away from the real selfish prick, Biden. He's the one causing all this. But, as the market has always done, will go back up once the Dems are destroyed in November.


----------



## sjay

Cougarbear said:


> DOW down to 33,000 as profits are shrinking under Joe Biden... Let's Go Brandon!


If all you trumpers are so sure the market is going to tank,why don't you short the market?


----------



## Cougarbear

sjay said:


> If all you trumpers are so sure the market is going to tank,why don't you short the market?


Who says we haven't? Makes no difference because most people are in mutual funds or managed accounts and are in it for the long haul. This is a buying time...


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> Who says we haven't? Makes no difference because most people are in mutual funds or managed accounts and are in it for the long haul. This is a buying time...


Today the Dow is down about 10.5%.  If you're sitting on cash and short term bonds, now is a good time to start buying.  I say start buying because there is no way to accurately predict where the market is going over the short term and it is almost impossible to predict the bottom  Just as a ruff rule of thumb, I purchase with each drop of 2% in market after a 10% fall.  The biggest mistake people make in buying into a falling market is waiting for the bottom.  Even if you could predict the bottom actually buying in can be a big problem.  I remember in 2007 when the market collapsed.  The market fell like a rock in one day and within a couple of days the market had recovered most of it's loss.  Today it can move even faster.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> Today the Dow is down about 10.5%.  If you're sitting on cash and short term bonds, now is a good time to start buying.  I say start buying because there is no way to accurately predict where the market is going over the short term and it is almost impossible to predict the bottom  Just as a ruff rule of thumb, I purchase with each drop of 2% in market after a 10% fall.  The biggest mistake people make in buying into a falling market is waiting for the bottom.  Even if you could predict the bottom actually buying in can be a big problem.  I remember in 2007 when the market collapsed.  The market fell like a rock in one day and within a couple of days the market had recovered most of it's loss.  Today it can move even faster.


100% agree! Also, as dividends and capital gains are paid out, those go in at a lower price as well. In it for the long haul, buy and hold.


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> 100% agree! Also, as dividends and capital gains are paid out, those go in at a lower price as well. In it for the long haul, buy and hold.


I find it amazing that so much of the public is still trying to make the quick bucks, trading and speculating when the odds are really stacked against them.  They are competing against professionals with deep pockets and resources that they could never match.  Also goverment stacks the chips against them with high taxes on short term gains and rewards buy and hold investors with low long term capital gains taxes and tax sheltered retirement plans.


----------



## Leo123

Interest rate went up and the stock market has taken advantage.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> I find it amazing that so much of the public is still trying to make the quick bucks, trading and speculating when the odds are really stacked against them.  They are competing against professionals with deep pockets and resources that they could never match.  Also goverment stacks the chips against them with high taxes on short term gains and rewards buy and hold investors with low long term capital gains taxes and tax sheltered retirement plans.


Only 20% of the investors are buying individual stocks. Most are in retirement plans like 401ks and IRAs. There is a bit more individual stock buying because of managed account advisors now as well. But, they are all trying to time the market and it's well known that one cannot time the market. Even with all the new tech abilities as well.


----------



## DBA

Cougarbear said:


> Actually, if you knew anything about the stock market, this is a buying time period in which the patient investor doesn't worry about because they are in it for the long haul. And, nice try to deflect away from the real selfish prick, Biden. He's the one causing all this. But, as the market has always done, will go back up once the Dems are destroyed in November.



 I sure hope you are right, but there is no underestimating how much damage Biden can do in the next 6 months. He is either (A) a very unlucky idiot who just happens to do everything wrong, (B) a genius intent on destroying the US, or (C) a puppet of our enemies. I'll go with option C. I am also not sure the Democrats won't *make sure* they keep just enough seats in Congress in 2022...by any means necessary.


----------



## Cougarbear

DBA said:


> I sure hope you are right, but there is no underestimating how much damage Biden can do in the next 6 months. He is either (A) a very unlucky idiot who just happens to do everything wrong, (B) a genius intent on destroying the US, or (C) a puppet of our enemies. I'll go with option C. I am also not sure the Democrats won't *make sure* they keep just enough seats in Congress in 2022...by any means necessary.


Ya, I'm sure they will try everything to illegally win enough seats at least in the Senate. I'm not sure what the Republicans are doing about it to stop it. Hopefully something.


----------



## Flopper

DBA said:


> I sure hope you are right, but there is no underestimating how much damage Biden can do in the next 6 months. He is either (A) a very unlucky idiot who just happens to do everything wrong, (B) a genius intent on destroying the US, or (C) a puppet of our enemies. I'll go with option C. I am also not sure the Democrats won't *make sure* they keep just enough seats in Congress in 2022...by any means necessary.


We give presidents far too much blame and credit for the economy.  By far the biggest presidential impact is the appointment of the Federal Reserve Chairmen and governors.  Congress has a much bigger impact than the president because congress controls the purse strings.  They approve or disapprove of tax increases, and cuts, as well as major spending programs.   However, the private sector being larger than government has a bigger impact than either the president or congress.


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> Ya, I'm sure they will try everything to illegally win enough seats at least in the Senate. I'm not sure what the Republicans are doing about it to stop it. Hopefully something.


It might seem strange but the overturning of Rowe may be exactly what democrats need to win congress in the Fall. If somehow the court fails to overturn Rowe, democrats will likely lose seats in both houses.  However if Rowe is overturn, the 70% of women voters who support Rowe may well be a big problem for republicans.   In the last election 9 million more women than men voted and 58% voted for Biden


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> It might seem strange but the overturning of Rowe may be exactly what democrats need to win congress in the Fall. If somehow the court fails to overturn Rowe, democrats will likely lose seats in both houses.  However if Rowe is overturn, the 70% of women voters who support Rowe may well be a big problem for republicans.   In the last election 9 million more women than men voted and 58% voted for Biden


That's all true. But, it isn't the thing women are really concerned with right now. Putting food on the table and other issues the Republicans can go at them with like what happened at the schools. I do wish they would have held off until after the election. That wasn't smart.


----------



## Wickerthing

The market numbers as contrasted to the struggles working people are experiencing is a clear indication of corporate greed.  Very few seem to tie those things together and I understand that both parties use market numbers to define the overall economy and try to beat each other up but as many here know, Presidents factor very little in market fluctuations.  But record profits while all but the wealthiest are hurting is a sign that corporations care more about their shareholders than those of us who buy their products and services and without whom there would be no them.  .  At times like this it demonstrates the need for including those folks in what are considered corporate fiduciary responsibilities.  We need legislation to address this sort of thing.  Any ideas?


----------



## Turtlesoup

Cougarbear said:


> Actually, if you knew anything about the stock market, this is a buying time period in which the patient investor doesn't worry about because they are in it for the long haul. And, nice try to deflect away from the real selfish prick, Biden. He's the one causing all this. But, as the market has always done, will go back up once the Dems are destroyed in November.


THIS IS NOT A BUYING TIME----market is sinking further.   Dems are seizing more power for the chinese and billionaire masters---trying to make us all serfs.   World leaders blow up and destroy everyone----especially in their own nations---we are seeing the death throws of the US.


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> That's all true. But, it isn't the thing women are really concerned with right now. Putting food on the table and other issues the Republicans can go at them with like what happened at the schools. I do wish they would have held off until after the election. That wasn't smart.


I think most women are more concerned with lost of the right to control their bodies than the price of a gallon of gas.  Inflation is a temporary economic condition, the lost of the right to chose is not.   Voting for republicans who were instrumental in taking that right away is not going to be an easy sell.

Since the major source of the inflation is an embargo of Russian oil which both parties supported and the break in supply chain mostly outside of the US, it is highly unlikely that republicans will be able to do any better than democrats at solving the problem.  The current rate of inflation is 8.5% and projected by Federal Reserve to be down to 4.3% by end of the year, so it may not even be a major issue by election time.


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> Only 20% of the investors are buying individual stocks. Most are in retirement plans like 401ks and IRAs. There is a bit more individual stock buying because of managed account advisors now as well. But, they are all trying to time the market and it's well known that one cannot time the market. Even with all the new tech abilities as well.


If the feds are successful in reducing the growth of the money supply before consumers stop buying do to increasing prices, then this correction will just be a bump road but if consumers sharply reduce spending in next few months, then the market will fall a lot lower and we will probably go into a recession.


----------



## Sandisk

Flopper said:


> Today the Dow is down about 10.5%.  If you're sitting on cash and short term bonds, now is a good time to start buying.  I say start buying because there is no way to accurately predict where the market is going over the short term and it is almost impossible to predict the bottom  Just as a ruff rule of thumb, I purchase with each drop of 2% in market after a 10% fall.  The biggest mistake people make in buying into a falling market is waiting for the bottom.  Even if you could predict the bottom actually buying in can be a big problem.  I remember in 2007 when the market collapsed.  The market fell like a rock in one day and within a couple of days the market had recovered most of it's loss.  Today it can move even faster.


I have no idea what you are talking about.
The DOW started falling in late 2007 and did not stop until early April, 2009.








						Check out Dow Industrials's stock price (.DJI) in real time
					

Get Dow Jones Industrial Average	 (.DJI:Dow Jones Global Indexes) real-time stock quotes, news, price and financial information from CNBC.



					www.cnbc.com
				




The macroeconomic fundamentals are lousy right now.
High inflation, LOTS of debt, rising interest rates, possibly heading into a recession.

The Fed was the main reason the equity markets have boomed over the last 13 years.
And now they are raising rates AND cutting back on their balance sheet.
None of that is good for the markets.

I say this is a terrible time to buy - unless you are a day trader and looking for a quick fix.


----------



## DBA

Flopper said:


> We give presidents far too much blame and credit for the economy.  By far the biggest presidential impact is the appointment of the Federal Reserve Chairmen and governors.  Congress has a much bigger impact than the president because congress controls the purse strings.  They approve or disapprove of tax increases, and cuts, as well as major spending programs.   However, the private sector being larger than government has a bigger impact than either the president or congress.



This is the same Fed that was under Trump.  The Congress was split under Trump and yet he got plenty done.  Obviously the administration has a rather large impact.  Congress and the President is currently controlled by the left-wing. They are solely responsible and are inept.


----------



## DBA

Flopper said:


> I think most women are more concerned with lost of the right to control their bodies than the price of a gallon of gas.  Inflation is a temporary economic condition, the lost of the right to chose is not.   Voting for republicans who were instrumental in taking that right away is not going to be an easy sell.
> 
> Since the major source of the inflation is an embargo of Russian oil which both parties supported and the break in supply chain mostly outside of the US, it is highly unlikely that republicans will be able to do any better than democrats at solving the problem.  The current rate of inflation is 8.5% and projected by Federal Reserve to be down to 4.3% by end of the year, so it may not even be a major issue by election time.



Overturning Roe v Wade is not making abortion legal or illegal.  It is turning the decision over to the states, where it should have been all along. 

Inflation was caused by too much needless spending of this administration.  They want to buy votes and it works. Everyone economist with their salt knows this.  Inflation was high before any sanctions on Russian oil.  That is just an excuse for this horrible administration.


----------



## Golfing Gator

DBA said:


> This is the same Fed that was under Trump. The Congress was split under Trump and yet he got plenty done.



What did Trump accomplish legislatively after the GOP lost control of the House in 2018?


----------



## DBA

Golfing Gator said:


> What did Trump accomplish legislatively after the GOP lost control of the House in 2018?



Well he was blamed for no infrastruture plan but we all know the Democrats wouldn’t work with him, so maybe you have a point.

Of course the current disaster is with Democrats in full control.  They are incompetent traitors.  They appoint key positions by racial or social groups alone.  They are lost.  Anyone that supports them is more lost.


----------



## Cougarbear

Turtlesoup said:


> THIS IS NOT A BUYING TIME----market is sinking further.   Dems are seizing more power for the chinese and billionaire masters---trying to make us all serfs.   World leaders blow up and destroy everyone----especially in their own nations---we are seeing the death throws of the US.


 Let me put it it to you another way. Say Filet Mignon was down to $2/pound. Would you not buy it? Would you wait until it was $15/pound? Any half intelligent person would buy 1,000 pounds and freeze it until it rose to $15/pound and make $14,000. But, you think you should wait until it's $15/pound and sell it at $2/pound. You are also conflating several issues, some that have nothing to do with when to buy stocks. I would say this, I'd buy only American grown filet mignon. Same with stocks. Only America stocks right now.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> I think most women are more concerned with lost of the right to control their bodies than the price of a gallon of gas.  Inflation is a temporary economic condition, the lost of the right to chose is not.   Voting for republicans who were instrumental in taking that right away is not going to be an easy sell.
> 
> Since the major source of the inflation is an embargo of Russian oil which both parties supported and the break in supply chain mostly outside of the US, it is highly unlikely that republicans will be able to do any better than democrats at solving the problem.  The current rate of inflation is 8.5% and projected by Federal Reserve to be down to 4.3% by end of the year, so it may not even be a major issue by election time.


Disagree totally and the polls back me, not you. Women are also concerned with finding baby formula as well, not abortions. 
Russian oil embargo? What are you talking about? Too much CNN BS. Trump had us completely energy independent. Biden on his first day stopped all that with his executive orders allowing Russia to sell oil to Germany and other NATO countries because he was stopping the oil flow from the U.S. to NATO. Has to save the planet from climate change. Except, Russia oil is flowing the the same amount as we were doing under Trump. You all are hypocrites. Did you know that Biden allowed for drilling on private and Federal ground but the red tape to get approval is a 1,000 times worse than it was under Trump? You didn't know that, did you? 

The Federal Reserve didn't think inflation was going to go to 8.5%. And, you are going to believe them now? The change today from 8.5% to 8.3% is most likely clerical error as it is no statistical difference. Gas prices are going up again as we get into the summer traveling months. This always happens. But, this will also drive everything else up as well since it costs more for truckers, trains and airplanes to move this stuff all over the world and in America. As we move into hurricane season, refineries will be knocked out driving prices up again. No, people have seen enough from Democrat and Let's go Brandon. 

We also see the hypocrisy from the nutty abortion activists Democrats. In the past, they complained when the loony right would bomb abortion clinics. Now, the loony left are bombing pro-life offices and the Democrats say nothing nor condemn the actions. Same with the loony left and breaking federal laws protesting at Justices homes trying to influence the jury, the Justices. In any court in the world, that is a felony. Yet, Garland is doing nothing. But, he will go after parents who are trying to protect their children from indoctrination on sexual matters and call parents terrorists. What is the matter with you people?


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> If the feds are successful in reducing the growth of the money supply before consumers stop buying do to increasing prices, then this correction will just be a bump road but if consumers sharply reduce spending in next few months, then the market will fall a lot lower and we will probably go into a recession.


We've been in a recession since the shutdowns in 2020. The printing of money to give to the people to pay their rents and bills created a false narrative on the actual GDP. Instead, it created inflation that we have now, rising interest housing rates and a fall in housing values and right into a non-pandemic shutdown recession and possibly a depression. Way to go Brandon!


----------



## DBA

Cougarbear said:


> We've been in a recession since the shutdowns in 2020. The printing of money to give to the people to pay their rents and bills created a false narrative on the actual GDP. Instead, it created inflation that we have now, rising interest housing rates and a fall in housing values and right into a non-pandemic shutdown recession and possibly a depression. Way to go Brandon!



You may as well be talking to a brick wall. It would be a better listener than these Biden Democrats.


----------



## Cougarbear

DBA said:


> You may as well be talking to a brick wall. It would be a better listener than these Biden Democrats.


Where do they learn all this nonsense? AO-C is supposed to have a degree in economics and she sounds like a 1st grader on this subject and every other subject.


----------



## Flopper

Sandisk said:


> I have no idea what you are talking about.
> The DOW started falling in late 2007 and did not stop until early April, 2009.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Check out Dow Industrials's stock price (.DJI) in real time
> 
> 
> Get Dow Jones Industrial Average	 (.DJI:Dow Jones Global Indexes) real-time stock quotes, news, price and financial information from CNBC.
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnbc.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The macroeconomic fundamentals are lousy right now.
> High inflation, LOTS of debt, rising interest rates, possibly heading into a recession.
> 
> The Fed was the main reason the equity markets have boomed over the last 13 years.
> And now they are raising rates AND cutting back on their balance sheet.
> None of that is good for the markets.
> 
> I say this is a terrible time to buy - unless you are a day trader and looking for a quick fix.


Sorry I meant 2008.  On Sep 28, 2008 when Congress failed to pass a 700 billion dollar bailout, the Dow fell nearly 1400 points but regained over 600 points to close down 777 points.  Next day the market rose and most the previous days lost was wiped out.  My point was it is almost impossible to spot market bottoms which is why most short term investors don't do well.  This is why I dollar cost average in my investment  portfolio.  I buy it down and buy it up.  Occasionally when I come into unexpected cash as I have the last few years and the market is way overpriced in relation to earning I will hold for a correction but generally I will just  dollar cost average because it has worked very well for me for over 40 years.


----------



## DBA

Cougarbear said:


> Where do they learn all this nonsense? AO-C is supposed to have a degree in economics and she sounds like a 1st grader on this subject and every other subject.



They have been dumbed down for at least a couple of generations now by public schools and Democrats and the MSM. They don't have a clue how to think for themselves and like good, obedient servants, they protect the Party at all costs, no matter how damaging their policies may be.  One read of the resident lefties on these boards and you will come to understand just how lost they really are.


----------



## Cougarbear

DBA said:


> They have been dumbed down for at least a couple of generations now by public schools and Democrats and the MSM. They don't have a clue how to think for themselves and like good, obedient servants, they protect the Party at all costs, no matter how damaging their policies may be.  One read of the resident lefties on these boards and you will come to understand just how lost they really are.


It's pretty clear that the far left and even some in the middle think with their emotions rather than logic and reason. Yet, they say they are for science. Just look at the loony Fauci as a perfect example. And, we know that power and money drive those with illogical emotions.


----------



## Flopper

DBA said:


> Overturning Roe v Wade is not making abortion legal or illegal.  It is turning the decision over to the states, where it should have been all along.
> 
> Inflation was caused by too much needless spending of this administration.  They want to buy votes and it works. Everyone economist with their salt knows this.  Inflation was high before any sanctions on Russian oil.  That is just an excuse for this horrible administration.


Maybe it should be decided in the states or maybe not, legal scholars will arguing that for a hundred years.  However the decision to scuttle Rowe settles nothing in the abortion battle.  Out of state abortions supported by multiple sources have already raised millions, loosening laws in swing states, liberalizing laws more in blue states,  back alley abortion, and use of the abortion pill will keep the number of abortions pretty close to current numbers.  I suspect one of the biggest impacts on abortions will be women paying more attention to contraception.

Inflation is due to two factors, Covid and support for Ukraine.  Regardless of who controls  congress, inflation numbers will be coming down.  I expect they will be in 4% to 5% range by the election. The Fed has projected 4.3% by the end of the year.  We have already seen a drop in April from the March numbers.

However, since every president in the last 30 years has lost seats in congress in the last half of his term, I would think Biden would follow the the trend.


----------



## Jarlaxle

Golfing Gator said:


> This is how the rich get richer.   People get spooked, flee the market during a downturn and those with the cash to do so buy up all the down stocks knowing they will be back.


I'm maxing out my IRA.


----------



## Flopper

Golfing Gator said:


> This is how the rich get richer.   People get spooked, flee the market during a downturn and those with the cash to do so buy up all the down stocks knowing they will be back.


Yep, that pattern is as old as the stock market.  As the market rises to new peaks, the major players begin reducing stock market purchases  selling companies with less long term potential while the soothsayers tout the market and project higher and higher stock prices.  Minor players in the market with less knowledge and experience enter the market.  And as the market continues to rise these investors pour their saving into the market.  Eventually bad economic news hits as it always does and they begin selling fearing losses .  The lower the prices the more they sell.  Once the news is really bad and these investors are mostly out of the market, it  bottoms out and the major players start coming back into the market and a new bull market begins.  The pattern is repeated over and over.

This age old game is being moderated by mutual funds and retirement plans giving small investors an opportunity to reap large long term rewards.   However,  some people still  think  they can beat market by buying low and selling high on swings in the market.  Their tales of a killings on a swing  in the market or a stock abound however there is little said about returns over 10 or 20 years.


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> Disagree totally and the polls back me, not you. Women are also concerned with finding baby formula as well, not abortions.
> Russian oil embargo? What are you talking about? Too much CNN BS. Trump had us completely energy independent. Biden on his first day stopped all that with his executive orders allowing Russia to sell oil to Germany and other NATO countries because he was stopping the oil flow from the U.S. to NATO. Has to save the planet from climate change. Except, Russia oil is flowing the the same amount as we were doing under Trump. You all are hypocrites. Did you know that Biden allowed for drilling on private and Federal ground but the red tape to get approval is a 1,000 times worse than it was under Trump? You didn't know that, did you?
> 
> The Federal Reserve didn't think inflation was going to go to 8.5%. And, you are going to believe them now? The change today from 8.5% to 8.3% is most likely clerical error as it is no statistical difference. Gas prices are going up again as we get into the summer traveling months. This always happens. But, this will also drive everything else up as well since it costs more for truckers, trains and airplanes to move this stuff all over the world and in America. As we move into hurricane season, refineries will be knocked out driving prices up again. No, people have seen enough from Democrat and Let's go Brandon.
> 
> We also see the hypocrisy from the nutty abortion activists Democrats. In the past, they complained when the loony right would bomb abortion clinics. Now, the loony left are bombing pro-life offices and the Democrats say nothing nor condemn the actions. Same with the loony left and breaking federal laws protesting at Justices homes trying to influence the jury, the Justices. In any court in the world, that is a felony. Yet, Garland is doing nothing. But, he will go after parents who are trying to protect their children from indoctrination on sexual matters and call parents terrorists. What is the matter with you people?


If the Russian oil embargo is not responsible for the big increase in gas prices then what is?


----------



## eagle1462010

Flopper said:


> If the Russian oil embargo is not responsible for the big increase in gas prices then what is?











						Executive Order 14008: Federal Oil and Gas Leasing Pause and Review - Environmental & Energy Law Program - Harvard Law School
					

The Biden administration made limiting offshore and onshore drilling an early priority, implementing a pause on all new federal leases. This pause has been challenged and blocked by the courts, and litigation on the matter is ongoing. With the moratorium currently on hold, the Biden...




					eelp.law.harvard.edu
				




BIDEN ADMINISTRATION​Read More
*Jan. 20, 2021* DOI issues Secretarial Order No. 3395, announcing that the agency is temporarily  suspending its authority to issue any onshore or offshore fossil fuel authorizations, including new  lease sales, for 60 days.
*Jan. 20, 2021* In Executive Order 13990, President Biden revokes the Trump Executive Order 13783 titled “Promoting Energy Independence and Economic Growth.” EO 13783 directed federal agencies to streamline the oil and gas leasing process and suspend, revise, or rescind regulations that burdened the development of domestic energy resources.
*Jan. 27, 2021 *President Biden signs Executive Order 14008, which pauses all new federal offshore and onshore oil and gas leasing pending a comprehensive review of the leasing and permitting program. The order also revokes Trump’s EO 13795.
*Jan. 27, 2022 *Western Energy Alliance petitions the District of Wyoming to review President Biden’s suspension of the oil and gas leasing program. _Western Energy Alliance v. Biden_, No. 0:21-cv-00013 (D. Wyo.).
*March 15, 2021 *The Biden administration asks the Ninth Circuit to dismiss the case reviewing President Obama’s withdrawing certain Arctic and Atlantic coastal areas from oil and gas leasing in light of President Biden revoking President Trump’s EO 13795 (the EO challenged in this case). The Biden administration asks the court to vacate the lower court ruling and remand with instructions to dismiss the case. _League of Conservation Voters v. Trump_, No. 19-35460 (9th Cir.).
*March 24, 2021* Louisiana and twelve other states file a lawsuit challenging President Biden’s pause on new federal oil and gas lease sales arguing that the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act (OCSLA) and the current 5-year Leasing Program prohibit the moratorium. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
*April 13, 2021* The Ninth Circuit dismisses the appeal of the March 29, 2019 decision by a federal judge to reinstate President Obama’s withdrawals of Arctic and Atlantic areas from oil and gas leasing because President Biden’s Executive Order 13990 revoking Trump’s EO 13795 rendered the appeal moot. _League of Conservation Voters v. Trump_, No. 19-35460 (9th Cir.).
*June 15, 2021 *A federal judge in the Western District of Louisiana issues a preliminary injunction blocking President Biden’s pause on oil and gas lease sales. The court holds that the leasing moratorium violates statutory authority given to DOI, the Bureau of Land Management, and BOEM under the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act and the current 5-year leasing program. The judge further holds that the immediate impact of the pause renders the preliminary injunction an appropriate remedy and that the DOI may not continue to pause upcoming Lease Sales 257 or 258. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
*Aug. 9, 2021 *Plaintiff states file a motion asking the court to order Lease Sale 257 and asking the federal government to show why its failure to make the sale does not put it in contempt of the preliminary injunction. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
*Aug. 16, 2021* The Biden administration appeals the preliminary injunction that blocked the moratorium on new federal oil and gas leasing. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
*Aug. 24, 2021* DOI announces that it will continue to prepare lease sales during the appeal process.
*Aug. 24, 2021 *The Department of Justice (DOJ) files a memorandum in response to the plaintiff states’ August 9 motion. DOJ argues that DOI had restarted the leasing program and was therefore complying with the preliminary injunction. DOJ further argues that the preliminary injunction did not require the Lease Sale to occur on any timeline, and the government was therefore entitled to complete a new environmental review. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
*Aug. 31, 2021 *Environmental groups file a lawsuit challenging DOI’s decision to hold Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico, seeking vacatur and injunction of the sale. The groups argue that the sale of Lease 257 violates the NEPA and the APA and estimate that the sale “will result in the production of up to 1.12 billion barrels and 4.4 trillion cubic feet of fossil fuels over the next 50 years.” _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 1:21-cv-02317 (D.D.C.).
*Sept. 17, 2021 *Plaintiff states withdraw their motion to compel Lease Sale 257. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
*Oct. 4, 2021* BOEM publishes a notice in the federal register that it will open and publicly announce bids received for oil and gas leases in the Gulf of Mexico Outercontinental Gas Lease Sale 257 on Nov. 17, 2021.
*Oct. 29, 2021* BOEM publishes a draft environmental impact statement (DEIS) for Lease Sale 258, which would offer leasing for oil and gas in Cook Inlet in the Gulf of Alaska. BOEM also announces a 45-day public comment period on the DEIS.
*Nov. 17, 2021 *BOEM holds its largest sale ever, the Gulf of Mexico Lease Sale 257 for 308 tracts, covering 1.07 million acres of federal waters in the Gulf. In approving the sale, the DOI claimed it was acting “consistent with a U.S. District Court’s preliminary injunction.” However, environmental groups argue that this sale was not required by the June 15 preliminary injunction. These groups contend that by not conducting a new environmental review like the DOJ memo suggested was allowed, the federal government sped up the lease sale and worked against its decarbonization goals.
*Nov. 26, 2021 *DOI issues a report reviewing the federal oil and gas leasing process and making recommendations for reform. The report finds, among other things, that the current system does not give taxpayers fair returns and does not fully account for environmental harm, and that the current system encourages speculation by and decreases competition among oil companies. The report outlines recommendations to fix these problems and concludes that DOI is deciding how it will act on these recommendations and encourages Congress to pass reforms to the oil and gas leasing process.
*Dec. 3, 2021* Democratic members of the House Committee on Natural Resources file an amicus brief in support of environmental groups challenging the Gulf of Mexico lease sale, arguing that the administration’s environmental review “substantially underestimates” the environmental harms of the lease sale. The brief also argues that the nationwide injunction issued by the District Court for the Western District of Louisiana “in no way excused” DOI’s obligations under NEPA and the APA. _Friends of the Earth, et al., v. Haaland, et al._, No. 21-cv-02317-RC (D.D.C.).
*Jan. 19, 2022* Over 360 environmental groups sent a legal petition to the Biden administration to reduce oil and gas drilling to 98% lower than current levels by 2035. The petition explains that, without action, it will be difficult for the United States to keep its pledge to keep global temperatures from rising beyond 1.5℃. 
*Jan. 20, 2022* Over 80 environmental organizations sign and send a letter to the Biden administration, which urges the Department of the Interior to write a new 5-year Offshore Lease Program that bans lease sales starting in 2022. The letter also calls on Secretary Haaland to repudiate Lease Sale 257. 
*Jan. 27, 2022* The District Court for the District of Columbia blocks Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico because the Department of the Interior failed to take a “hard look” at the environmental impact of the project or to account for the effect of overseas fossil fuel use when calculating climate impacts, which violated the National Environmental Policy Act. _Friends of the Earth, et al., v. Haaland, et al._, No. 21-cv-02317-RC (D.D.C.). For more background on the ruling, see EELP’s overview of the NEPA Review Process or visit our NEPA Tracker Page for the most up to date review requirements. 
*Feb. 1, 2022* The Department of the Interior mistakenly posted language on its oil and gas webpage that indicated royalty fees for leases would increase to 18.75%. The Department later removed the language, and a spokesperson for the Department said the decision to increase royalty rates was not yet final.
*Feb. 8, 2022 *Intervenor defendant, the American Petroleum Institute files a notice of appeal with the D.C. Circuit, challenging the D.C District Court’s decision to block Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 1:21-cv-02317 (D.D.C.).
*Feb. 14, 2022* Louisiana, another intervenor defendant, files a notice of appeal in the D.C. Circuit case that blocked Lease Sale 257. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 22-05037 (D.C. Cir).
*Feb. 14, 2022 *The Biden administration asks the 5th Circuit to reverse the Western District of Louisiana’s decision that blocked the Biden administration’s moratorium on new oil and gas drilling on federal lands and waters. Among other issues, the Biden administration argues that Biden’s Executive Order 14008 is both lawful and unreviewable and that the plaintiffs relied on erroneous interpretations of the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act and the Mineral Leasing Act. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 21-30505 (5th Cir.)
*Feb. 18, 2022* Environmental groups file a motion to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction in the D.C. Circuit case that blocked Lease Sale 257. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 22-05037 (D.C. Cir).
*Feb. 22, 2022* A federal judge in the Western District of Louisiana blocks the Biden administration’s application of an interim social cost of carbon metric., _Louisiana v. Biden_, No. 21-cv-01074 (W.D. La.). For updates on the metric and this litigation, see our Social Cost of Greenhouse Gases tracker page. In light of this decision, the Biden administration announces that it will delay decisions on new oil and gas drilling on federal lands. 
*Feb. 28, 2022 *The Biden administration announces that it will not appeal the District Court’s decision that canceled Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 1:21-cv-02317 (D.D.C.).
*Mar. 8, 2022 *The Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit denies an emergency motion by American Petroleum Institute to expedite the appeal of the District Court decision that canceled Lease Sale 257. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 22-05037 (D.C. Cir).
*Apr. 15, 2022 *To comply with the preliminary injunction issued by the court in _Louisiana v. Biden, _the DOI announces that the BLM will issue notices for lease sales that will increase in royalty rates from 12.5% to 18.75% and limit the acreage available for leasing. Though this round of lease sales will move forward, the Biden administration continues its appeal of that injunction. _Louisiana et al v Biden et al,_ Docket No. 2:21-cv-00778 (W.D. La.).
*April 18, 2022: *The BLM publishes final environmental assessments and sale notices for June 2022 lease sales. The final sale notices reduces the acreage of land available for leasing on public lands by 80% and increased royalty rates. For offshore leases, the current 5-year program is scheduled to end on June 30, 2022.
*Apr. 19, 2022: *The plaintiffs in _Western Energy Alliance v. Biden_ assert that the notice put forward by the Bureau of Land Management still violates the Mineral Leasing Act because BLM did not establish a reliable and predictable leasing system in the future. A hearing in that case is scheduled for May 13. _Western Energy Alliance v. Biden_, No. 0:21-cv-00013 (D. Wyo.).


----------



## Flopper

eagle1462010 said:


> Executive Order 14008: Federal Oil and Gas Leasing Pause and Review - Environmental & Energy Law Program - Harvard Law School
> 
> 
> The Biden administration made limiting offshore and onshore drilling an early priority, implementing a pause on all new federal leases. This pause has been challenged and blocked by the courts, and litigation on the matter is ongoing. With the moratorium currently on hold, the Biden...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> eelp.law.harvard.edu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BIDEN ADMINISTRATION​Read More
> *Jan. 20, 2021* DOI issues Secretarial Order No. 3395, announcing that the agency is temporarily  suspending its authority to issue any onshore or offshore fossil fuel authorizations, including new  lease sales, for 60 days.
> *Jan. 20, 2021* In Executive Order 13990, President Biden revokes the Trump Executive Order 13783 titled “Promoting Energy Independence and Economic Growth.” EO 13783 directed federal agencies to streamline the oil and gas leasing process and suspend, revise, or rescind regulations that burdened the development of domestic energy resources.
> *Jan. 27, 2021 *President Biden signs Executive Order 14008, which pauses all new federal offshore and onshore oil and gas leasing pending a comprehensive review of the leasing and permitting program. The order also revokes Trump’s EO 13795.
> *Jan. 27, 2022 *Western Energy Alliance petitions the District of Wyoming to review President Biden’s suspension of the oil and gas leasing program. _Western Energy Alliance v. Biden_, No. 0:21-cv-00013 (D. Wyo.).
> *March 15, 2021 *The Biden administration asks the Ninth Circuit to dismiss the case reviewing President Obama’s withdrawing certain Arctic and Atlantic coastal areas from oil and gas leasing in light of President Biden revoking President Trump’s EO 13795 (the EO challenged in this case). The Biden administration asks the court to vacate the lower court ruling and remand with instructions to dismiss the case. _League of Conservation Voters v. Trump_, No. 19-35460 (9th Cir.).
> *March 24, 2021* Louisiana and twelve other states file a lawsuit challenging President Biden’s pause on new federal oil and gas lease sales arguing that the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act (OCSLA) and the current 5-year Leasing Program prohibit the moratorium. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *April 13, 2021* The Ninth Circuit dismisses the appeal of the March 29, 2019 decision by a federal judge to reinstate President Obama’s withdrawals of Arctic and Atlantic areas from oil and gas leasing because President Biden’s Executive Order 13990 revoking Trump’s EO 13795 rendered the appeal moot. _League of Conservation Voters v. Trump_, No. 19-35460 (9th Cir.).
> *June 15, 2021 *A federal judge in the Western District of Louisiana issues a preliminary injunction blocking President Biden’s pause on oil and gas lease sales. The court holds that the leasing moratorium violates statutory authority given to DOI, the Bureau of Land Management, and BOEM under the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act and the current 5-year leasing program. The judge further holds that the immediate impact of the pause renders the preliminary injunction an appropriate remedy and that the DOI may not continue to pause upcoming Lease Sales 257 or 258. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *Aug. 9, 2021 *Plaintiff states file a motion asking the court to order Lease Sale 257 and asking the federal government to show why its failure to make the sale does not put it in contempt of the preliminary injunction. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *Aug. 16, 2021* The Biden administration appeals the preliminary injunction that blocked the moratorium on new federal oil and gas leasing. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *Aug. 24, 2021* DOI announces that it will continue to prepare lease sales during the appeal process.
> *Aug. 24, 2021 *The Department of Justice (DOJ) files a memorandum in response to the plaintiff states’ August 9 motion. DOJ argues that DOI had restarted the leasing program and was therefore complying with the preliminary injunction. DOJ further argues that the preliminary injunction did not require the Lease Sale to occur on any timeline, and the government was therefore entitled to complete a new environmental review. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *Aug. 31, 2021 *Environmental groups file a lawsuit challenging DOI’s decision to hold Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico, seeking vacatur and injunction of the sale. The groups argue that the sale of Lease 257 violates the NEPA and the APA and estimate that the sale “will result in the production of up to 1.12 billion barrels and 4.4 trillion cubic feet of fossil fuels over the next 50 years.” _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 1:21-cv-02317 (D.D.C.).
> *Sept. 17, 2021 *Plaintiff states withdraw their motion to compel Lease Sale 257. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 2:21-CV-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *Oct. 4, 2021* BOEM publishes a notice in the federal register that it will open and publicly announce bids received for oil and gas leases in the Gulf of Mexico Outercontinental Gas Lease Sale 257 on Nov. 17, 2021.
> *Oct. 29, 2021* BOEM publishes a draft environmental impact statement (DEIS) for Lease Sale 258, which would offer leasing for oil and gas in Cook Inlet in the Gulf of Alaska. BOEM also announces a 45-day public comment period on the DEIS.
> *Nov. 17, 2021 *BOEM holds its largest sale ever, the Gulf of Mexico Lease Sale 257 for 308 tracts, covering 1.07 million acres of federal waters in the Gulf. In approving the sale, the DOI claimed it was acting “consistent with a U.S. District Court’s preliminary injunction.” However, environmental groups argue that this sale was not required by the June 15 preliminary injunction. These groups contend that by not conducting a new environmental review like the DOJ memo suggested was allowed, the federal government sped up the lease sale and worked against its decarbonization goals.
> *Nov. 26, 2021 *DOI issues a report reviewing the federal oil and gas leasing process and making recommendations for reform. The report finds, among other things, that the current system does not give taxpayers fair returns and does not fully account for environmental harm, and that the current system encourages speculation by and decreases competition among oil companies. The report outlines recommendations to fix these problems and concludes that DOI is deciding how it will act on these recommendations and encourages Congress to pass reforms to the oil and gas leasing process.
> *Dec. 3, 2021* Democratic members of the House Committee on Natural Resources file an amicus brief in support of environmental groups challenging the Gulf of Mexico lease sale, arguing that the administration’s environmental review “substantially underestimates” the environmental harms of the lease sale. The brief also argues that the nationwide injunction issued by the District Court for the Western District of Louisiana “in no way excused” DOI’s obligations under NEPA and the APA. _Friends of the Earth, et al., v. Haaland, et al._, No. 21-cv-02317-RC (D.D.C.).
> *Jan. 19, 2022* Over 360 environmental groups sent a legal petition to the Biden administration to reduce oil and gas drilling to 98% lower than current levels by 2035. The petition explains that, without action, it will be difficult for the United States to keep its pledge to keep global temperatures from rising beyond 1.5℃.
> *Jan. 20, 2022* Over 80 environmental organizations sign and send a letter to the Biden administration, which urges the Department of the Interior to write a new 5-year Offshore Lease Program that bans lease sales starting in 2022. The letter also calls on Secretary Haaland to repudiate Lease Sale 257.
> *Jan. 27, 2022* The District Court for the District of Columbia blocks Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico because the Department of the Interior failed to take a “hard look” at the environmental impact of the project or to account for the effect of overseas fossil fuel use when calculating climate impacts, which violated the National Environmental Policy Act. _Friends of the Earth, et al., v. Haaland, et al._, No. 21-cv-02317-RC (D.D.C.). For more background on the ruling, see EELP’s overview of the NEPA Review Process or visit our NEPA Tracker Page for the most up to date review requirements.
> *Feb. 1, 2022* The Department of the Interior mistakenly posted language on its oil and gas webpage that indicated royalty fees for leases would increase to 18.75%. The Department later removed the language, and a spokesperson for the Department said the decision to increase royalty rates was not yet final.
> *Feb. 8, 2022 *Intervenor defendant, the American Petroleum Institute files a notice of appeal with the D.C. Circuit, challenging the D.C District Court’s decision to block Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 1:21-cv-02317 (D.D.C.).
> *Feb. 14, 2022* Louisiana, another intervenor defendant, files a notice of appeal in the D.C. Circuit case that blocked Lease Sale 257. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 22-05037 (D.C. Cir).
> *Feb. 14, 2022 *The Biden administration asks the 5th Circuit to reverse the Western District of Louisiana’s decision that blocked the Biden administration’s moratorium on new oil and gas drilling on federal lands and waters. Among other issues, the Biden administration argues that Biden’s Executive Order 14008 is both lawful and unreviewable and that the plaintiffs relied on erroneous interpretations of the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act and the Mineral Leasing Act. _Louisiana v. Biden_, Docket No. 21-30505 (5th Cir.)
> *Feb. 18, 2022* Environmental groups file a motion to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction in the D.C. Circuit case that blocked Lease Sale 257. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 22-05037 (D.C. Cir).
> *Feb. 22, 2022* A federal judge in the Western District of Louisiana blocks the Biden administration’s application of an interim social cost of carbon metric., _Louisiana v. Biden_, No. 21-cv-01074 (W.D. La.). For updates on the metric and this litigation, see our Social Cost of Greenhouse Gases tracker page. In light of this decision, the Biden administration announces that it will delay decisions on new oil and gas drilling on federal lands.
> *Feb. 28, 2022 *The Biden administration announces that it will not appeal the District Court’s decision that canceled Lease Sale 257 in the Gulf of Mexico. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 1:21-cv-02317 (D.D.C.).
> *Mar. 8, 2022 *The Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit denies an emergency motion by American Petroleum Institute to expedite the appeal of the District Court decision that canceled Lease Sale 257. _Friends of the Earth, et al. v. Haaland_, _et al._, Docket No. 22-05037 (D.C. Cir).
> *Apr. 15, 2022 *To comply with the preliminary injunction issued by the court in _Louisiana v. Biden, _the DOI announces that the BLM will issue notices for lease sales that will increase in royalty rates from 12.5% to 18.75% and limit the acreage available for leasing. Though this round of lease sales will move forward, the Biden administration continues its appeal of that injunction. _Louisiana et al v Biden et al,_ Docket No. 2:21-cv-00778 (W.D. La.).
> *April 18, 2022: *The BLM publishes final environmental assessments and sale notices for June 2022 lease sales. The final sale notices reduces the acreage of land available for leasing on public lands by 80% and increased royalty rates. For offshore leases, the current 5-year program is scheduled to end on June 30, 2022.
> *Apr. 19, 2022: *The plaintiffs in _Western Energy Alliance v. Biden_ assert that the notice put forward by the Bureau of Land Management still violates the Mineral Leasing Act because BLM did not establish a reliable and predictable leasing system in the future. A hearing in that case is scheduled for May 13. _Western Energy Alliance v. Biden_, No. 0:21-cv-00013 (D. Wyo.).


It would be virtually impossible for the Biden administration's actions in regard to opening up federal land to oil and gas lease auctions to have measured effect on the 2022 oil prices. The process of  auctioning of federal land, financing exploration and drilling, putting down wells, tanks, piping does not happen in months but years.

Increasing the countries oil supply is a long term process.  The priority for oil producers today is to develop existing known reserves as fast as possible to take advantage of the high oil prices.

The high price oil is due to a loss of 4.5 million barrels of oil per day from Russia.  The only way the 1922 oil crisis can be alleviated is by OPEC significantly increasing output. OPEC has said they are not able to do that which translates to they are not willing see the price of oil drop from $107 a barrel to about $60.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> If the Russian oil embargo is not responsible for the big increase in gas prices then what is?


We weren't buying Russian oil. We were self-sufficient with energy. But, Biden shut much of our production capabilities down and started to buy from our enemies like Iran, Venezuela and others. For a while, Biden was allowing for applications for new drilling permits. But, he also made it impossible for oil companies to comply with their increased regulations to get the permits. So, we have less oil being produced. He also shut down Canadian pipelines and stopped the building of other pipelines including in Alaska. What Biden did with Russia is allow Russia to open a pipeline to Germany and sell Putin gas to Germany and other NATO countries instead of the U.S. selling our allies our oil. Less oil and gas for companies to buy, less purchasers to buy, up goes the price of gas to Americans. Way to go Brandon!!!


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> We weren't buying Russian oil. We were self-sufficient with energy. But, Biden shut much of our production capabilities down and started to buy from our enemies like Iran, Venezuela and others. For a while, Biden was allowing for applications for new drilling permits. But, he also made it impossible for oil companies to comply with their increased regulations to get the permits. So, we have less oil being produced. He also shut down Canadian pipelines and stopped the building of other pipelines including in Alaska. What Biden did with Russia is allow Russia to open a pipeline to Germany and sell Putin gas to Germany and other NATO countries instead of the U.S. selling our allies our oil. Less oil and gas for companies to buy, less purchasers to buy, up goes the price of gas to Americans. Way to go Brandon!!!


No, just because a country is self sufficient does not mean it's oil stays in that country. To my knowledge Biden has not shut down any oil and gas production anywhere in the US.  He has stopped the sale of leases on government land.   However,  94% of all oil is produced on private land, not on federal or state land.  Biden has been trying to get OPEC to increase production but he has not been successful. However, he may be able to get oil from Venezuela must to consternation of Republicans who are counting on high gas prices to help in the midterms.   

Worldwide supply and demand sets the price.  American oil is sold on the world market to highest bidder.   It doesn't matter how much oil this country produces it's going to be sold to the highest bidder regardless of where that might be unless there is a government embargo. Transportation costs gives US buyers an advantage when purchasing US produced oil but there are different grades of oil requiring different processing and not all refineries accept all grades plus refining costs vary by grade.  Also production cost vary across the world making oil slightly cheaper in one area vs another.  The bottom line is increased US production or any other country production will bring down world oil prices. which benefits buyers everywhere.

Unlike some countries oil and gas production is owned and operated by private owners, some US based and some foreign.  The US government has the power to shutdown oil shipments from any country.  However, the US does not regulate how much oil goes to or from various countries.

The Biden administration just like all US administrations do not buy or sell oil.  Occasionally, the government will  put an embargo on sales to or from a country such as is being done now with Russia.


----------



## San Souci

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Now it is CRASHING because Bidens Economy was made of Paper,


----------



## citygator

San Souci said:


> Now it is CRASHING because Bidens Economy was made of Paper,


You have no idea what you’re talking about.


----------



## San Souci

citygator said:


> You have no idea what you’re talking about.


Yeah? It has gone down over 5000 points since this thread started. THAT is what happens when the Market is propped up with Fiat Money.


----------



## Batcat

San Souci said:


> Now it is CRASHING because Bidens Economy was made of Paper,


Biden has the reverse Midas effect.


----------



## citygator

San Souci said:


> Yeah? It has gone down over 5000 points since this thread started. THAT is what happens when the Market is propped up with Fiat Money.


5,000 from where? Biden high point?


----------



## Oddball

citygator said:


> You have no idea what you’re talking about.


----------



## San Souci

citygator said:


> 5,000 from where? Biden high point?


Biden? It was inertia from the Great Trump Economy. Investors are now seeing the light. This economy is headed into DEPRESSION.


----------



## Turtlesoup

Flopper said:


> If the feds are successful in reducing the growth of the money supply before consumers stop buying do to increasing prices, then this correction will just be a bump road but if consumers sharply reduce spending in next few months, then the market will fall a lot lower and we will probably go into a recession.


OMG...........

the road has been smashed.  It is not a bump------the inflation will not reverse for quit a while and never return to normal.  Thanks Biden --thanks feds---thanks globalist billionaires.   We are going into a massive recession------uncharted with the all the fucked intervention that Biden has done.   Mess upon mess...


----------



## Turtlesoup

citygator said:


> You have no idea what you’re talking about.


Yes they do...

The economy is crashing the sugar high of the stimulus stealing is ending--and we are going to be forced to pay the piper for Biden/Fed scams.


----------



## Sandisk

Flopper said:


> Sorry I meant 2008.  On Sep 28, 2008 when Congress failed to pass a 700 billion dollar bailout, the Dow fell nearly 1400 points but regained over 600 points to close down 777 points.  Next day the market rose and most the previous days lost was wiped out.  My point was it is almost impossible to spot market bottoms which is why most short term investors don't do well.  This is why I dollar cost average in my investment  portfolio.  I buy it down and buy it up.  Occasionally when I come into unexpected cash as I have the last few years and the market is way overpriced in relation to earning I will hold for a correction but generally I will just  dollar cost average because it has worked very well for me for over 40 years.


Yes, it is difficult to spot the bottom.
But there are certainly things that can point to trends.
And the the trends now are down.

I cannot say this strongly enough - the boom since 2009 is almost entirely due to the Fed being 'all in'. They have propped up the equity markets continually since then...without fail. 
Result?
The markets have boomed.
The Fed is now out...they are raising rates and lowering their balance sheet as they try to fight inflation.
Throw in the fact that the economy looks poised for a recession with the Q1 GDP drop and throw in almost no, positive indicators.
With respect, I think now is an awful time to buy unless you are looking for a day trader 'special'...and are prepared to get out fast.
 Until the Fed are back in - the markets are pointing (overall) downwards, IMO.

And I despise both political parties - so I am not saying this to jump on Biden.
The economy is in bad shape right now.


----------



## eagle1462010

Flopper said:


> It would be virtually impossible for the Biden administration's actions in regard to opening up federal land to oil and gas lease auctions to have measured effect on the 2022 oil prices. The process of  auctioning of federal land, financing exploration and drilling, putting down wells, tanks, piping does not happen in months but years.
> 
> Increasing the countries oil supply is a long term process.  The priority for oil producers today is to develop existing known reserves as fast as possible to take advantage of the high oil prices.
> 
> The high price oil is due to a loss of 4.5 million barrels of oil per day from Russia.  The only way the 1922 oil crisis can be alleviated is by OPEC significantly increasing output. OPEC has said they are not able to do that which translates to they are not willing see the price of oil drop from $107 a barrel to about $60.


He attacked fossil fuels day 1 to appease the green freaks.  Just showed that and you give excuses.  Hes Obama 2.0 where oil companies have to sue to drill.


----------



## DBA

citygator said:


> You have no idea what you’re talking about.



Honestly, this is by far the most inept administration in the history of our country on every level, including fiscal policy.


----------



## DBA

Flopper said:


> Inflation is due to two factors, Covid and support for Ukraine.



The 3 trillion dollar Build Back Better plan had nothing to do with it? Well, Biden didn’t mention it so I guess some people actually believe that nonsense.  The guy is talking about spending even more money. Biden and his administration are well aware that spending/printing more money will only exacerbate inflation, but many of their supporters couldn’t care less and Biden certainly won’t let them know. He just wants their votes an to get them he can promise more “free” money.  Evidently, he can then just blame his bad policy on anything and everything else and many believe it.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Cougarbear said:


> We weren't buying Russian oil.



Who told you that lie?



			U.S. Imports from Russia of Crude Oil and Petroleum Products (Thousand Barrels)


----------



## Flopper

Sandisk said:


> Yes, it is difficult to spot the bottom.
> But there are certainly things that can point to trends.
> And the the trends now are down.
> 
> I cannot say this strongly enough - the boom since 2009 is almost entirely due to the Fed being 'all in'. They have propped up the equity markets continually since then...without fail.
> Result?
> The markets have boomed.
> The Fed is now out...they are raising rates and lowering their balance sheet as they try to fight inflation.
> Throw in the fact that the economy looks poised for a recession with the Q1 GDP drop and throw in almost no, positive indicators.
> With respect, I think now is an awful time to buy unless you are looking for a day trader 'special'...and are prepared to get out fast.
> Until the Fed are back in - the markets are pointing (overall) downwards, IMO.
> 
> And I despise both political parties - so I am not saying this to jump on Biden.
> The economy is in bad shape right now.


I have never had any faith in the fed.  Theoretically manipulating the money supply and adjusting interest rates should allow them to regulation the economy to avoid busts and booms of capitalism.  The problem is knowing when to act and how much.    The fed's crystal ball has not been that good.

Since I'm retired, my main goal is preservation of capital, income, and moderate growth in that order and that is reflected in my portfolio.  Occasionally, I get windfalls of cash and I invest just as I have for over 45 years, dollar cost averaging into domestic and foreign stock and bond index funds which is what I'm doing now.  I rarely sell anything but supplement my retirement with interest from municipal bonds.

If I were younger, I would be 100% dollar cost averaging into index growth funds, both foreign and domestic. 

I believe the overriding goal of each political party is winning the next election which may or may not be a positive influence on the economy.


----------



## Flopper

DBA said:


> The 3 trillion dollar Build Back Better plan had nothing to do with it? Well, Biden didn’t mention it so I guess some people actually believe that nonsense.  The guy is talking about spending even more money. Biden and his administration are well aware that spending/printing more money will only exacerbate inflation, but many of their supporters couldn’t care less and Biden certainly won’t let them know. He just wants their votes an to get them he can promise more “free” money.  Evidently, he can then just blame his bad policy on anything and everything else and many believe it.


I serious doubt the BBB plan had any effect on inflation.   The Build Back Better Plan (BBB) was a $1.7 trillion, not $3 trillion package and did not pass congress nor was it funded.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> No, just because a country is self sufficient does not mean it's oil stays in that country. To my knowledge Biden has not shut down any oil and gas production anywhere in the US.  He has stopped the sale of leases on government land.   However,  94% of all oil is produced on private land, not on federal or state land.  Biden has been trying to get OPEC to increase production but he has not been successful. However, he may be able to get oil from Venezuela must to consternation of Republicans who are counting on high gas prices to help in the midterms.
> 
> Worldwide supply and demand sets the price.  American oil is sold on the world market to highest bidder.   It doesn't matter how much oil this country produces it's going to be sold to the highest bidder regardless of where that might be unless there is a government embargo. Transportation costs gives US buyers an advantage when purchasing US produced oil but there are different grades of oil requiring different processing and not all refineries accept all grades plus refining costs vary by grade.  Also production cost vary across the world making oil slightly cheaper in one area vs another.  The bottom line is increased US production or any other country production will bring down world oil prices. which benefits buyers everywhere.
> 
> Unlike some countries oil and gas production is owned and operated by private owners, some US based and some foreign.  The US government has the power to shutdown oil shipments from any country.  However, the US does not regulate how much oil goes to or from various countries.
> 
> The Biden administration just like all US administrations do not buy or sell oil.  Occasionally, the government will  put an embargo on sales to or from a country such as is being done now with Russia.


re-read carefully. I said that we were selling our oil to our allies before Biden allowed Russia to sell to them. He even made some stupid comment about allowing Russia to do it will help with climate change. How stupid is that. But, it's also the reason he shut down oil coming into the country from Canada and Alaska and other places. Save the planet! Now, it's save the babies because moms can't get the Similac to feed them when they can't breast feed them. The problem with Democrats and liberals is they can't see two moves ahead of their actions and what their stupidity will do to the country and the world. Private lands also are required to get the same permits. Same regulations. Less oil for us and our allies allowing OPEC and Russia to set the oil prices and control the flow of oil. They see how weak Biden is and laugh at him. That's why they refuse to increase production. Weak presidents cause weak outcomes. And, if you think the world sets the price, then you weren't paying attention while Trump was President when the price sank below $0/gal. And, he had already stopped Russia from selling their oil to NATO countries. But Biden in an hour signed away all of Trump's executive orders creating havoc in all areas of our economy and national interests abroad.


----------



## Cougarbear

Golfing Gator said:


> Who told you that lie?
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. Imports from Russia of Crude Oil and Petroleum Products (Thousand Barrels)
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 643935


Why are we buying oil from Russia for Putin to use against Ukraine? All while we send Ukraine billions of dollars to fight Russia? The more we drill ourselves, the less we have to buy from our enemies and the enemies of the world.


----------



## Flopper

eagle1462010 said:


> He attacked fossil fuels day 1 to appease the green freaks.  Just showed that and you give excuses.  Hes Obama 2.0 where oil companies have to sue to drill.


Of the federal land drilling permits issued,  drilling has not started on 9,000 permits.  The mostly like reason is reduction in demand for oil.  In 2020 the average price per barrel of oil was about $38 to $42 and these low prices continued through most of 2021.  Since no one knew that there would be an embargo on Russia oil in 2022, there was no reason to expect and extraordinary amount of  drilling on federal or private land. Regardless of the number of drilling permits issue in 2020 and 2021, there would be little difference in today's production.









						Fact-checking Biden’s claim that there are 9,000 unused oil drilling permits
					

Fact-checking President Joe Biden’s claim that there are 9,000 unused oil drilling permits. That's mostly true.



					www.statesman.com


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> re-read carefully. I said that we were selling our oil to our allies before Biden allowed Russia to sell to them. He even made some stupid comment about allowing Russia to do it will help with climate change. How stupid is that. But, it's also the reason he shut down oil coming into the country from Canada and Alaska and other places. Save the planet! Now, it's save the babies because moms can't get the Similac to feed them when they can't breast feed them. The problem with Democrats and liberals is they can't see two moves ahead of their actions and what their stupidity will do to the country and the world. Private lands also are required to get the same permits. Same regulations. Less oil for us and our allies allowing OPEC and Russia to set the oil prices and control the flow of oil. They see how weak Biden is and laugh at him. That's why they refuse to increase production. Weak presidents cause weak outcomes. And, if you think the world sets the price, then you weren't paying attention while Trump was President when the price sank below $0/gal. And, he had already stopped Russia from selling their oil to NATO countries. But Biden in an hour signed away all of Trump's executive orders creating havoc in all areas of our economy and national interests abroad.


I don't understand what you mean by this statement.
"I said that we were selling our oil to our allies before Biden allowed Russia to sell to them."
Of course we were selling oil to our allies.  And Biden can not allow or disallow sale of Russian oil to our allies.

"But, it's also the reason he shut down oil coming into the country from Canada and Alaska and other places"
No, He did not stop oil coming into the country from Canada or Alaska.   He issued an executive order canceling the construction of Keystone XL.  XL is just and extension of the Keystone pipeline with larger diameter piping allowing rapid transport of the planet's dirtiest fossil fuel and tar sands oil.  These products can and are being shipped into the US.  XL would have just made it cheaper and faster.

And from your comment, you don't seem to think government should do anything about the shortage of baby formula.  3 strikes and you're out.  I'm skipping the rest of your post.


----------



## DudleySmith

Sandisk said:


> I cannot say this strongly enough - the boom since 2009 is almost entirely due to the Fed being 'all in'. They have propped up the equity markets continually since then...without fail.
> Result?
> The markets have boomed.
> The Fed is now out...they are raising rates and lowering their balance sheet as they try to fight inflation.



Yep, and the free money from zero interest rates to giant corporations and real estate is going away, finally.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> I don't understand what you mean by this statement.
> "I said that we were selling our oil to our allies before Biden allowed Russia to sell to them."
> Of course we were selling oil to our allies.  And Biden can not allow or disallow sale of Russian oil to our allies.
> 
> "But, it's also the reason he shut down oil coming into the country from Canada and Alaska and other places"
> No, He did not stop oil coming into the country from Canada or Alaska.   He issued an executive order canceling the construction of Keystone XL.  XL is just and extension of the Keystone pipeline with larger diameter piping allowing rapid transport of the planet's dirtiest fossil fuel and tar sands oil.  These products can and are being shipped into the US.  XL would have just made it cheaper and faster.
> 
> And from your comment, you don't seem to think government should do anything about the shortage of baby formula.  3 strikes and you're out.  I'm skipping the rest of your post.


Pretty simple. We were selling to NATO countries oil. Biden came along and let Russia open up their pipelines of oil and gas to NATO, specifically to Germany. They no longer needed to buy from us as they could get it cheaper from Russia. It took weeks after Russia invaded Ukraine to get NATO to stop buying from Russia. And, we continue to buy from Russia, don't we? Yep. So, we are sending billions of dollars and weapons to Ukraine and paying Russia for oil to fund their war against Ukraine. Typical Democrat warfare. Give both sides weapons to shoot at each other. And, you support this? LOL! 
You lied about the baby formula. I am clear that Biden doesn't care about the shortage of baby formula. I care. Typical Democrat liberal. Lie then stop debating. 
Biden sure did stop the Keystone XL pipeline and others as well. He did shut down oil coming from Canada by doing so and has shut down drilling in Alaska, again. The other way he's shutting down more gasoline is by making more restrictions to get the application permits for drilling for more oil. Ya, there are plenty of application permits but the restrictions stop all of it. As far as the cleanliness of the oil, refineries take care of that problem. You do know what a refinery does? No?


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> Pretty simple. We were selling to NATO countries oil. Biden came along and let Russia open up their pipelines of oil and gas to NATO, specifically to Germany. They no longer needed to buy from us as they could get it cheaper from Russia. It took weeks after Russia invaded Ukraine to get NATO to stop buying from Russia. And, we continue to buy from Russia, don't we? Yep. So, we are sending billions of dollars and weapons to Ukraine and paying Russia for oil to fund their war against Ukraine. Typical Democrat warfare. Give both sides weapons to shoot at each other. And, you support this? LOL!
> You lied about the baby formula. I am clear that Biden doesn't care about the shortage of baby formula. I care. Typical Democrat liberal. Lie then stop debating.
> Biden sure did stop the Keystone XL pipeline and others as well. He did shut down oil coming from Canada by doing so and has shut down drilling in Alaska, again. The other way he's shutting down more gasoline is by making more restrictions to get the application permits for drilling for more oil. Ya, there are plenty of application permits but the restrictions stop all of it. As far as the cleanliness of the oil, refineries take care of that problem. You do know what a refinery does? No?


If you are referring to the Nord Stream Pipeline, it was 99% finished in 2021. The idea that anything was going to be said or done that was going to stop it was not possible.  The pipeline was financed by Royal Dutch Shell, several banks in Switzerland, and Russian OIl interest.  Agreements were between Russia, Germany and the EU.   The US simply had no skin in game. 

You claimed that Biden *shutdown* oil from Alaska and Canada.  That simply is not true. Millions of barrels of oil from Canada and Alaska enter the US lower 48 every year.  The XL pipeline extension cancellation did not block oil or gas from entering the US. The tar sand oil and heavy crude which the XL would have carried still enters the US by rail and truck transport.


----------



## sjay

Cougarbear said:


> Who says we haven't? Makes no difference because most people are in mutual funds or managed accounts and are in it for the long haul. This is a buying time...


if you are in it for the long haul then you buy by  dollar cost averaging not  picking or waiting for magical right time (market timers hall of fame is an empty room still don't understand do you)and as far as shorting market you don't have to use individual stocks you can go triple short on sp500 etf's.


----------



## hjmick

Well, this OP/thread hasn't aged well...


----------



## Flopper

sjay said:


> if you are in it for the long haul then you buy by  dollar cost averaging not  picking or waiting for magical right time (market timers hall of fame is an empty room still don't understand do you)and as far as shorting market you don't have to use individual stocks you can go triple short on sp500 etf's.


I have watched people and myself trying to buy the market near the bottom.  Here is a  typically story. Near the bottom the market falls like a rock scaring the shit out of you.  You know it's going to come back but you want a little confirmation before you buy.  Well you get the confirmation but it's not little.  The market goes up 1300 points and so you buy.  The next day it goes up 500 points confirming your belief that a bottom has been reached but the following day the market is down, just consolidating, no problem.  Then it's down 500 more the next week.  The fed says they are not going to lower interest rates and market falls like a rock.  You 're down 25% so you decide to bail out and wait for the true bottom.  Unfortunately, the bottom has come and gone and you watch the market rise day after day planning to get in when it goes down again but it goes up not down.  3 years later the market is up 5000 points and you're no longer interested in the market because you're convinced there is no way to make money in the market.

To enter the stock market without a plan and making decision based on market movies, anticipated moves and news stories is a good way to lose money.  Have a plan such as dollar cost averaging, or some other tested formula or buying and selling based on long term fundamentals and stick to it.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> If you are referring to the Nord Stream Pipeline, it was 99% finished in 2021. The idea that anything was going to be said or done that was going to stop it was not possible.  The pipeline was financed by Royal Dutch Shell, several banks in Switzerland, and Russian OIl interest.  Agreements were between Russia, Germany and the EU.   The US simply had no skin in game.
> 
> You claimed that Biden *shutdown* oil from Alaska and Canada.  That simply is not true. Millions of barrels of oil from Canada and Alaska enter the US lower 48 every year.  The XL pipeline extension cancellation did not block oil or gas from entering the US. The tar sand oil and heavy crude which the XL would have carried still enters the US by rail and truck transport.


Ignorance is bliss: Biden suspends Trump-era oil drilling leases in Alaska’s Arctic refuge


			https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2022/05/11/gulf-of-mexico-leasing-canceled/
		









						Biden administration cancels Alaska oil and gas lease sale
					

The Interior Department's decision to not move forward with the lease sale comes as gas prices soar.




					www.cbsnews.com
				




Lots more if you want. Biden is a trainwreck and now he claims he wants to help with the prices of gasoline going up? No he doesn't. Higher prices force people into buying high priced electric cars. The poor get squeezed because the poor can't afford new cars and the doubling of gas prices. Get back to the Trump doctrine and drive prices lower and inflation lower.


----------



## Cougarbear

Cougarbear said:


> Ignorance is bliss: Biden suspends Trump-era oil drilling leases in Alaska’s Arctic refuge
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2022/05/11/gulf-of-mexico-leasing-canceled/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Biden administration cancels Alaska oil and gas lease sale
> 
> 
> The Interior Department's decision to not move forward with the lease sale comes as gas prices soar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lots more if you want. Biden is a trainwreck and now he claims he wants to help with the prices of gasoline going up? No he doesn't. Higher prices force people into buying high priced electric cars. The poor get squeezed because the poor can't afford new cars and the doubling of gas prices. Get back to the Trump doctrine and drive prices lower and inflation lower.


Democrats claim to be the party for the poor. Now, that's funny! NOT!!!


----------



## Flopper

Cougarbear said:


> Ignorance is bliss: Biden suspends Trump-era oil drilling leases in Alaska’s Arctic refuge
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2022/05/11/gulf-of-mexico-leasing-canceled/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Biden administration cancels Alaska oil and gas lease sale
> 
> 
> The Interior Department's decision to not move forward with the lease sale comes as gas prices soar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lots more if you want. Biden is a trainwreck and now he claims he wants to help with the prices of gasoline going up? No he doesn't. Higher prices force people into buying high priced electric cars. The poor get squeezed because the poor can't afford new cars and the doubling of gas prices. Get back to the Trump doctrine and drive prices lower and inflation lower.


Alaskan oil and gas leases are not going bring prices down this year and probably not next year because exploration, financing, drilling, and building piping, tanks and other infrastructure takes time, particularly in Alaska.   The priority of Oil and gas companies now  are to squeeze every drop of oil out of existing wells and fields to take advantage of $100/barrel oil prices.  This probably accounts for their lack interest in this area.


----------



## DBA

hjmick said:


> Well, this OP/thread hasn't aged well...



Dimocrats are just that...dim. They will never get it.


----------



## Cougarbear

Flopper said:


> Alaskan oil and gas leases are not going bring prices down this year and probably not next year because exploration, financing, drilling, and building piping, tanks and other infrastructure takes time, particularly in Alaska.   The priority of Oil and gas companies now  are to squeeze every drop of oil out of existing wells and fields to take advantage of $100/barrel oil prices.  This probably accounts for their lack interest in this area.


Had Biden left alone all the Trump programs and executive orders, we would not be in this economic position. Now Biden wants to send in troops to Somolia after getting out of Afghanistan. What is the matter with that dunce?


----------



## RoshawnMarkwees

Flopper said:


> Alaskan oil and gas leases are not going bring prices down this year and probably not next year because exploration, financing, drilling, and building piping, tanks and other infrastructure takes time, particularly in Alaska.   The priority of Oil and gas companies now  are to squeeze every drop of oil out of existing wells and fields to take advantage of $100/barrel oil prices.  This probably accounts for their lack interest in this area.


Word and the plans for extraction expansion or stifling impact prices _immediately_.


----------



## Nova78

Synthaholic said:


> *RECORD STOCK MARKET - ANOTHER BIDEN FAILURE!!*


    record stock market?


----------



## Nostra

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


DOW down to where it was when your Vegetable Messiah took office citygator 

31,261

Worst President ever.


----------



## citygator

Nostra said:


> DOW down to where it was when your Vegetable Messiah took office citygator
> 
> 31,261
> 
> Worst President ever.


Was down under 20,000 under Trump.  Market has ups and downs. I will put $150,000 into the market next week from cash. How do you think I’m gonna do? Looking at taking a position in Target since they are sufficiently beat up.


----------



## Nova78

citygator said:


> Was down under 20,000 under Trump.  Market has ups and downs. I will put $150,000 into the market next week from cash. How do you think I’m gonna do? Looking at taking a position in Target since they are sufficiently beat up.


Chump change


----------



## DBA

citygator said:


> Was down under 20,000 under Trump.  Market has ups and downs. I will put $150,000 into the market next week from cash. How do you think I’m gonna do? Looking at taking a position in Target since they are sufficiently beat up.



Boy, that sure was a dumb move.  Let me give you some better advice.  Start shorting. If you aren't capable, invest in a SQQQ or another ETF specializing in shorting the market.  Biden's policies and lack of action will continue to allow the markets to tank.


----------



## citygator

DBA said:


> Boy, that sure was a dumb move.  Let me give you some better advice.  Start shorting. If you aren't capable, invest in a SQQQ or another ETF specializing in shorting the market.  Biden's *policies* and *lack of action* will continue to allow the markets to tank.


What kind of policies and “action” are you looking for?


----------



## SassyIrishLass

This didn't age well


----------



## Likkmee

SassyIrishLass said:


> This didn't age well


I just bought 22 acres for $8/square meter yesterday.
The avocados are ageing well


----------



## Nova78

Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?

*You are one stupid do the world a favor and never breed.*


----------



## Nostra

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


*Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?*

Update?


----------



## Meathead

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


LOL


----------



## Weatherman2020

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


This thread died a horrific death.


----------



## Weatherman2020

Nostra said:


> *Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?*
> 
> Update?


citygator 
Well?


----------



## DBA

citygator said:


> What kind of policies and “action” are you looking for?



Deregulation for starters.  What about removing the ban on drilling in ANWAR?


----------



## Golfing Gator

Likkmee said:


> I just bought 22 acres for $8/square meter yesterday.
> The avocados are ageing well



32 grand an acre...you better be growing more than avocados


----------



## Weatherman2020

citygator said:


> Was down under 20,000 under Trump.  Market has ups and downs. I will put $150,000 into the market next week from cash. How do you think I’m gonna do? Looking at taking a position in Target since they are sufficiently beat up.


Of that $150k you invested a month ago, what do you have left? $120k?


----------



## Weatherman2020

Likkmee said:


> I just bought 22 acres for $8/square meter yesterday.
> The avocados are ageing well


Meter?
Foreigner


----------



## Weatherman2020

Nova78 said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> *You are one stupid do the world a favor and never breed.*


Brandon needs to run on his economy


----------



## Papageorgio

Synthaholic said:


> *RECORD STOCK MARKET - ANOTHER BIDEN FAILURE!!*


True that, you still thanking Joe, no you are blaming others now, aren’t you?


----------



## citygator

Weatherman2020 said:


> Of that $150k you invested a month ago, what do you have left? $120k?


Well.  I remodeled a bathroom with $25k and then put $105k into an index fund. The bathroom is a better return at this point. I’m down 4% on the $100k right now.


----------



## citygator

Weatherman2020 said:


> citygator
> Well?


Trump’s low was lower. If I were you I’d stay out of the market at the low and wait til Biden has it cranking again to buy into it. Only a matter of time.


----------



## Papageorgio

citygator said:


> Trump’s low was lower. If I were you I’d stay out of the market at the low and wait til Biden has it cranking again to buy into it. Only a matter of time.


We are going to be headed down for the next couple years, then it will turn the corner.


----------



## HikerGuy83

citygator said:


> Trump’s low was lower. If I were you I’d stay out of the market at the low and wait til Biden has it cranking again to buy into it. Only a matter of time.



Let us know when it starts.

Cause it's sucking air right now.  

Biden can't crank anything.


----------



## HikerGuy83

citygator said:


> Trump’s low was lower. If I were you I’d stay out of the market at the low and wait til Biden has it cranking again to buy into it. Only a matter of time.



Under Trump, the market recovered quickly from the quick drop due to COVID shutdown.

Biden's market is still in the tank and does not appear headed anywhere good soon.


----------



## Leo123

HikerGuy83 said:


> Let us know when it starts.
> 
> Cause it's sucking air right now.
> 
> Biden can't crank anything.


Biden has managed to single handedly ruin the American economy.   Like Obama said:_ 'Don't underestimate Biden's ability to fuck things up.'_


----------



## Weatherman2020

citygator said:


> Trump’s low was lower. If I were you I’d stay out of the market at the low and wait til Biden has it cranking again to buy into it. Only a matter of time.


Except everyone knows there’s no light at the end of the tunnel until Republicans take back DC.


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> Well.  I remodeled a bathroom with $25k and then put $105k into an index fund. The bathroom is a better return at this point. I’m down 4% on the $100k right now.


/---/ I did the same thing with two bathrooms in my new condo. My index funds are down too, but I write covered calls out of the money and generate weekly income to recoup my losses.


----------



## Roadrunner76

Synthaholic said:


> *RECORD STOCK MARKET - ANOTHER BIDEN FAILURE!!*


Yay im so happy, my rent is up 40%,,,Food up 30%,,,Gas up 100% and its an election year. Wait till after the election for prices to rise more yay.   Fact : We need 10$ gas because every hour a tree is cut down on the Earth somewhere and by creating a GREEN TAX we can make a difference, I know because Im a 16 yr old white girl and activist.


----------



## Synthaholic

Roadrunner76 said:


> Yay im so happy, my rent is up 40%,,,Food up 30%,,,Gas up 100% and its an election year. Wait till after the election for prices to rise more yay.   Fact : We need 10$ gas because every hour a tree is cut down on the Earth somewhere and by creating a GREEN TAX we can make a difference, I know because Im a 16 yr old white girl and activist.


So you hate Capitalism?


----------



## Batcat

I feel Joe Biden is a terrible President and he has a reverse Midas touch so most everything he deals with turns to shit. 

However, I have to admit that at least so far he hasn’t managed to totally destroy the stock market. At my age of 76 with most of my retirement funds invested in the stock market it would be hard to recover from a stock market crash.


----------



## citygator

Walmart sticks with second-half outlook after earnings beat expectations (msn.com)

Home Depot's second-quarter earnings beat expectations, company stands by 2022 guidance (msn.com)


Earlier this month
CVS Health (CVS) Q2 2022 earnings (cnbc.com)


----------



## HikerGuy83

Market set to drop below 30,000.

Not looking so great now.


----------



## Leo123

HikerGuy83 said:


> Market set to drop below 30,000.
> 
> Not looking so great now.


Biden 'Build Back Better'


----------



## LeftofLeft

HikerGuy83 said:


> Market set to drop below 30,000.
> 
> Not looking so great now.


Like gas prices, Democrats take credit when things are good with the stock market yet when things are bad, it’s either Republicans fault or things that are out of their control.


----------



## Redfish

LeftofLeft said:


> Like gas prices, Democrats take credit when things are good with the stock market yet when things are bad, it’s either Republicans fault or things that are out of their control.


said another way, democrats lie, its all they do.


----------



## Blaster

The stock market continues its decline while Joe Biden tries to tell Americans how great our economy is.  Millions of Americans watching their retirement investments evaporating.


----------



## Slade3200

LeftofLeft said:


> Like gas prices, Democrats take credit when things are good with the stock market yet when things are bad, it’s either Republicans fault or things that are out of their control.


You’re totally correct. The Left should take Donny Trumps example and show a little humility. Admit when they make mistakes, own them, apologize and then try to do better, just like Trump would do. Right?!


----------



## hadit

Slade3200 said:


> You’re totally correct. The Left should take Donny Trumps example and show a little humility. Admit when they make mistakes, own them, apologize and then try to do better, just like Trump would do. Right?!


It would be amazing if they did...


----------



## marvin martian

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.



Aged like milk!


----------



## citygator

Still higher than it was under Trump. But the stock market goes up and down. It’s down now. I recommend buying in now before it bounces back. Up to you.


----------



## Cellblock2429

Slade3200 said:


> You’re totally correct. The Left should take Donny Trumps example and show a little humility. Admit when they make mistakes, own them, apologize and then try to do better, just like Trump would do. Right?!


/——-/ It would be a first.


----------



## B. Kidd

citygator said:


> Still higher than it was under Trump. But the stock market goes up and down. It’s down now. I recommend buying in now before it bounces back. Up to you.



You're nuckin' futz! 
Gas prices ticked up yesterday.
Market still has a ways to drop.
High demand and low supply continues for a lengthy period, maybe until 2025!!


----------



## Blaster

Slade3200 said:


> You’re totally correct. The Left should  show a little humility. Admit when they make mistakes, own them, apologize and then try to do better. Right?!


That would be a good starting point.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> Still higher than it was under Trump. But the stock market goes up and down. It’s down now. I recommend buying in now before it bounces back. Up to you.


Biden sucks, Gator!  You could see this crash coming a mile off and you're an idiot if you didn't move off of stocks.  You're also an idiot if you get back into the market now because this is going to get worse before it gets better.


----------



## LeftofLeft

Slade3200 said:


> You’re totally correct. The Left should take Donny Trumps example and show a little humility. Admit when they make mistakes, own them, apologize and then try to do better, just like Trump would do. Right?!


The Left owns the economy now.


----------



## citygator

B. Kidd said:


> You're nuckin' futz!
> Gas prices ticked up yesterday.
> Market still has a ways to drop.
> High demand and low supply continues for a lengthy period, maybe until 2025!!


What would you do?


----------



## citygator

B. Kidd said:


> You're nuckin' futz!
> Gas prices ticked up yesterday.
> Market still has a ways to drop.
> High demand and low supply continues for a lengthy period, maybe until 2025!!


what is the plan you want to see implemented?


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> what is the plan you want to see implemented?


Why is this so complicated to you on the left, Gator?  Inflation is caused by too much money chasing too few goods and services!  The "plan" is to increase production of both goods and services while at the same time stopping the insane spending being done by Government.  We need to stop pretending that we're ready to do away with fossil fuels.  We need to TRANSITION to green energy!  Cheap energy means lower costs to produce goods.  Cheap energy means we're not at a disadvantage with foreign competition to produce goods.  We need to get people off couches and back to work!  We need to rediscover the American work ethic!  Stop this nonsense with giving people money not to work.  That isn't who we ARE!


----------



## Slade3200

LeftofLeft said:


> The Left owns the economy now.


And…


----------



## LeftofLeft

Slade3200 said:


> And…


When they celebrate a drop in costs (eg energy) or increase in stock market, point to the policies they implemented to positively impact those improvements. When gas was at $5 a gallon, the Left was screaming that a President’s polices don’t impact price. Then, when they dropped, they celebrated it as if their policies were a catalyst.


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> Why is this so complicated to you on the left, Gator?  Inflation is caused by too much money chasing too few goods and services!  The "plan" is to increase production of both goods and services while at the same time stopping the insane spending being done by Government.  We need to stop pretending that we're ready to do away with fossil fuels.  We need to TRANSITION to green energy!  Cheap energy means lower costs to produce goods.  Cheap energy means we're not at a disadvantage with foreign competition to produce goods.  We need to get people off couches and back to work!  We need to rediscover the American work ethic!  Stop this nonsense with giving people money not to work.  That isn't who we ARE!


Stimulus was years ago. That’s not driving any demand. There is no buying spree. Look around. Car sales are down house sales are down every industry is selling fewer units. There is just not enough production. It’s starting to catch up. Inventories are building but there isn’t demand for it. Prices will come down. It’s not demand driven. Not at all.


----------



## B. Kidd

citygator said:


> What would you do?



I've already done it and ain't telling you.
I'm good until I die, cooter!!


----------



## B. Kidd

Oldestyle said:


> Why is this so complicated to you on the left, Gator?  Inflation is caused by too much money chasing too few goods and services!  The "plan" is to increase production of both goods and services while at the same time stopping the insane spending being done by Government.  We need to stop pretending that we're ready to do away with fossil fuels.  We need to TRANSITION to green energy!  Cheap energy means lower costs to produce goods.  Cheap energy means we're not at a disadvantage with foreign competition to produce goods.  We need to get people off couches and back to work!  We need to rediscover the American work ethic!  Stop this nonsense with giving people money not to work.  That isn't who we ARE!



This is about right.  .

And pull back on failed foreign policy expenditures and push a fraction of the money that we give to a corrupt Ukraine and re-direct to the native populace opposition we now see occurring in Iran.


----------



## Papageorgio

citygator said:


> Stimulus was years ago. That’s not driving any demand. There is no buying spree. Look around. Car sales are down house sales are down every industry is selling fewer units. There is just not enough production. It’s starting to catch up. Inventories are building but there isn’t demand for it. Prices will come down. It’s not demand driven. Not at all.


The stimulus packages spurred the inflation, the latest spending bill is going to work against us. The fed's only recourse at this time is raising the rates, which will slow demand, slow employment, cause the stock market to dip. We need to move backward to move forward. The tough part is all the gains employees made in wages has been lost due to inflation.


----------



## B. Kidd

Papageorgio said:


> The stimulus packages spurred the inflation, the latest spending bill is going to work against us. The fed's only recourse at this time is raising the rates, which will slow demand, slow employment, cause the stock market to dip. We need to move backward to move forward. The tough part is all the gains employees made in wages has been lost due to inflation.



Good! Work harder, not smarter.
They need to pay for installing Joey!!


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> Stimulus was years ago. That’s not driving any demand. There is no buying spree. Look around. Car sales are down house sales are down every industry is selling fewer units. There is just not enough production. It’s starting to catch up. Inventories are building but there isn’t demand for it. Prices will come down. It’s not demand driven. Not at all.


Years ago?  Are you smoking crack?


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> Stimulus was years ago. That’s not driving any demand. There is no buying spree. Look around. Car sales are down house sales are down every industry is selling fewer units. There is just not enough production. It’s starting to catch up. Inventories are building but there isn’t demand for it. Prices will come down. It’s not demand driven. Not at all.


You really don't grasp simple economic principles...do you, Gator?  Prices are up because there isn't enough supply to satisfy demand.  Pumping trillions in Government spending into an economy that was poised to come roaring back was stupid economic policy.  Even Larry Summers understood that but nobody in the Biden White House seems to have taken Econ 101 let alone majored in the subject!


----------



## Nova78

HikerGuy83 said:


> Market set to drop below 30,000.
> 
> Not looking so great now.


Yea that Biden a steaming pile


----------



## Slade3200

LeftofLeft said:


> When they celebrate a drop in costs (eg energy) or increase in stock market, point to the policies they implemented to positively impact those improvements. When gas was at $5 a gallon, the Left was screaming that a President’s polices don’t impact price. Then, when they dropped, they celebrated it as if their policies were a catalyst.


You’re talking about partisan politics that both parties engage in. Not a new thing. So what’s your point


----------



## citygator

B. Kidd said:


> I've already done it and ain't telling you.
> I'm good until I die, cooter!!


Lame. You’re just another complainer. You’re dismissed.


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> Years ago?  Are you smoking crack?


Yep 2.5 years ago up until 18 mos ago. Years ago.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> Lame. You’re just another complainer. You’re dismissed.


People are supposed to complain when government fails them. WTF is the matter with you? They have beat you into submission. listen to yourself.


----------



## Indeependent

Lastamender said:


> People are supposed to complain when government fails them. WTF is the matter with you? They have beat you into submission. listen to yourself.


CG is a RWer sock twin.


----------



## citygator

Lastamender said:


> People are supposed to complain when government fails them. WTF is the matter with you? They have beat you into submission. listen to yourself.


Failed how? What should be done differently?


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> CG is a RWer sock twin.


You guys scream sock when you can’t debate. You’re one of the weaker debaters so I get it.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> You guys scream sock when you can’t debate. You’re one of the weaker debaters so I get it.


Why is Biden not speaking out against the Lenders handing out money like candy?
He is a GW clone.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> Failed how? What should be done differently?


How? Pick something.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> Failed how? What should be done differently?


Simple answer?  With the economy?  Just do EVERYTHING that Trump did before Covid shut things down!  Joe's always been happy to plagiarize other's work!  Have him do it now with how Trump handled the economy!  Even Slow Joe can't screw that up!


----------



## LeftofLeft

Slade3200 said:


> You’re talking about partisan politics that both parties engage in. Not a new thing. So what’s your point


What policies did the Democrats push that influenced the gas prices to drop?


----------



## Oldestyle

LeftofLeft said:


> What policies did the Democrats push that influenced the gas prices to drop?


Well, they've been siphoning the Strategic Oil Reserves like crazy...it's down 1/3 since Slow Joe took office!  It hasn't been that low since the oil embargo back in the 1980's.  That was something that OPEC did to us...what's happening NOW is something that the Democrats did to us!


----------



## Slade3200

LeftofLeft said:


> What policies did the Democrats push that influenced the gas prices to drop?


Increased supply by releasing more from the reserves


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> Why is Biden not speaking out against the Lenders handing out money like candy?
> He is a GW clone.


Home loans have been rock solid for the last 15 years. Including now. What are you talking about?


----------



## citygator

Lastamender said:


> How? Pick something.


More shouting at the rain. Let me know if that works while I grab an umbrella.


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> Simple answer?  With the economy?  Just do EVERYTHING that Trump did before Covid shut things down!  Joe's always been happy to plagiarize other's work!  Have him do it now with how Trump handled the economy!  Even Slow Joe can't screw that up!


Another no idea guy. No wonder you vote Republican.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> Home loans have been rock solid for the last 15 years. Including now. What are you talking about?


Home loans were solid from 2006-2008.
What are you talking about?


----------



## LeftofLeft

Slade3200 said:


> Increased supply by releasing more from the reserves


Ok. How sustainable is that to maintain? Also, when and how are you going g to replenish the reserves? 

That’s not policy. That’s a reactionary decision for a quick fix.


----------



## DGS49

For the record, I've experienced paper losses of about $400k since Biden was elected.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> Another no idea guy. No wonder you vote Republican.


The template is there, Gator but Joe can't use it because it was Trump's and to do so is to admit that Trump's economic policies were always better!


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> Home loans were solid from 2006-2008.
> What are you talking about?


Post meltdown they’ve been solid. We are nearly in 2023-15 is 2008. Close enough.


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> The template is there, Gator but Joe can't use it because it was Trump's and to do so is to admit that Trump's economic policies were always better!


What policies? The reason you are cheerleading is you can’t play.  No shame. Just realize what you are and what your limitations are as well.


----------



## citygator

DGS49 said:


> For the record, I've experienced paper losses of about $400k since Biden was elected.


You experienced $500k gain and a pull back of $400k…so you are net positive…. or you are a lousy investor.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> Post meltdown they’ve been solid. We are nearly in 2023-15 is 2008. Close enough.


Bank of New York already has a mortgage default percent of 30% of loans given in last 3 years.


----------



## Likkmee

Indeependent said:


> Bank of New York already has a mortgage default percent of 30% of loans given in last 3 years.


MABA !


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> Bank of New York already has a mortgage default percent of 30% of loans given in last 3 years.


No they dont.  I dont even have to look that up.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> What policies? The reason you are cheerleading is you can’t play.  No shame. Just realize what you are and what your limitations are as well.


What policies?  Just for starters, Trump made the US energy independent and that lower cost of oil, gas and natural gas created an economic boom.  Slow Joe's first action as President was to push an anti fossil fuel agenda that drastically raised the cost of energy here in the US.


----------



## LeftofLeft

Oldestyle said:


> What policies?  Just for starters, Trump made the US energy independent and that lower cost of oil, gas and natural gas created an economic boom.  Slow Joe's first action as President was to push an anti fossil fuel agenda that drastically raised the cost of energy here in the US.


Pushing an anti fossil fuel agenda to the level that this administration has done when an alternative is not viable to run the economy is just heartless. For this alone, the high inflation and bludgeoned stock market are owned by the Democrats.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> No they dont.  I dont even have to look that up.


Yes you do.


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> What policies?  Just for starters, Trump made the US energy independent and that lower cost of oil, gas and natural gas created an economic boom.  Slow Joe's first action as President was to push an anti fossil fuel agenda that drastically raised the cost of energy here in the US.


You should have kept your mouth shut. Better to have people think you’re stupid in silence than prove it out loud.


The US was never energy independent because we don’t produce crude that our refineries can use. Therefore *we imported more oil under Trump than we are under Biden*. In fact only the covid depressed months of the last 6 months of Trump are lower than Biden's crude oil imports 









__





						U.S. Imports of Crude Oil (Thousand Barrels per Day)
					





					www.eia.gov


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> No they dont.  I dont even have to look that up.


You are correct…
AP News deleted last week’s article.
We don’t want a panic.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> You should have kept your mouth shut. Better to have people think you’re stupid in silence than prove it out loud.
> 
> 
> The US was never energy independent because we don’t produce crude that our refineries can use. Therefore *we imported more oil under Trump than we are under Biden*. In fact only the covid depressed months of the last 6 months of Trump are lower than Biden's crude oil imports
> View attachment 700374
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. Imports of Crude Oil (Thousand Barrels per Day)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.eia.gov


You can TRY to use statistics to spin what Trump and Biden have done with energy policy, Gator but people aren't stupid!  They know what the cost of gasoline was under Trump.  They know what it's been under Biden.  They know what they paid for heating oil under Trump.  They're now getting astronomical bills for their heating oil under Biden.  The Democrats OWN those price increases because they pushed an anti fossil fuel agenda to make fossil fuels more expensive.  They know when they're being told not to charge their electric vehicles because there is a danger of brown outs that something isn't right!


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> You can TRY to use statistics to spin what Trump and Biden have done with energy policy, Gator but people aren't stupid!  They know what the cost of gasoline was under Trump.  They know what it's been under Biden.  They know what they paid for heating oil under Trump.  They're now getting astronomical bills for their heating oil under Biden.  The Democrats OWN those price increases because they pushed an anti fossil fuel agenda to make fossil fuels more expensive.  They know when they're being told not to charge their electric vehicles because there is a danger of brown outs that something isn't right!


I can try to use facts to confuse you?  uh. ok.  Your emotional tie to how Trump speaks doesnt change the reality of what is going on. He never impacted oil production one way or another until he pushed OPEC to cut back production which we are still struggling with. I get why he did it but it is hurting us now. 









						Trump helped broker a large oil production cut with OPEC, Russia, Mexico
					

The 13 nations in the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) reached agreement with Russia, Mexico, the United States and seven other major oil producers Sunday to cut production by a combined 9.7 million barrels a day in May and June. President Trump resolved an impasse between...




					news.yahoo.com
				











						Oil prices SOAR as OPEC+ agrees historic deal to cut production
					

OIL PRICES rose today by almost five percent after oil producing nations agreed a historic deal that will see output reduced by nearly 10 million barrels a day.




					www.express.co.uk


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> I can try to use facts to confuse you?  uh. ok.  Your emotional tie to how Trump speaks doesnt change the reality of what is going on. He never impacted oil production one way or another until he pushed OPEC to cut back production which we are still struggling with. I get why he did it but it is hurting us now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump helped broker a large oil production cut with OPEC, Russia, Mexico
> 
> 
> The 13 nations in the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) reached agreement with Russia, Mexico, the United States and seven other major oil producers Sunday to cut production by a combined 9.7 million barrels a day in May and June. President Trump resolved an impasse between...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oil prices SOAR as OPEC+ agrees historic deal to cut production
> 
> 
> OIL PRICES rose today by almost five percent after oil producing nations agreed a historic deal that will see output reduced by nearly 10 million barrels a day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.express.co.uk


Statistics are not facts.
If statistics were facts, we wouldn’t need statisticians to lie about everything.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> I can try to use facts to confuse you?  uh. ok.  Your emotional tie to how Trump speaks doesnt change the reality of what is going on. He never impacted oil production one way or another until he pushed OPEC to cut back production which we are still struggling with. I get why he did it but it is hurting us now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump helped broker a large oil production cut with OPEC, Russia, Mexico
> 
> 
> The 13 nations in the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) reached agreement with Russia, Mexico, the United States and seven other major oil producers Sunday to cut production by a combined 9.7 million barrels a day in May and June. President Trump resolved an impasse between...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oil prices SOAR as OPEC+ agrees historic deal to cut production
> 
> 
> OIL PRICES rose today by almost five percent after oil producing nations agreed a historic deal that will see output reduced by nearly 10 million barrels a day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.express.co.uk


Trump needed to broker that deal because the cost of oil had dropped TOO low, Gator!  Unlike you...or Slow Joe...Trump grasps that too much production can lead to problems as well.  That's called competence!  It's what we're lacking in this administration!


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> Statistics are not facts.
> If statistics were facts, we wouldn’t need statisticians to lie about everything.


A fact is a fact. A statistic involves probability. A poll is a statistic. The amount of imported oil is a fact - no probability. I’ll grant you polls can be wrong. A fact can’t be wrong. We imported more oil under Trump.  Sorry it burns your narrative.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> A fact is a fact. A statistic involves probability. A poll is a statistic. The amount of imported oil is a fact - no probability. I’ll grant you polls can be wrong. A fact can’t be wrong. We imported more oil under Trump.  Sorry it burns your narrative.


You use statistics to hide facts, Gator.  You know as well as I do that it's been Biden's policies that have increased the price of fossil fuels here in the US and that he did that intentionally.


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> Trump needed to broker that deal because the cost of oil had dropped TOO low, Gator!  Unlike you...or Slow Joe...Trump grasps that too much production can lead to problems as well.  That's called competence!  It's what we're lacking in this administration!


We’re still under depressed output from OPEC. Every entity in the world is price gouging. Them too. None of it has to do with the president. You my friend are a cheerleader. You just cheer oil production up or down as long as there was Trump in the office. You see that don’t you?


----------



## B. Kidd

citygator said:


> Lame. You’re just another complainer. You’re dismissed.



Here's a "knock-knock" joke for you cooter:

Knock-Knock

Cooter: "Who's there?".

STAGFLATION!!


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> You use statistics to hide facts, Gator.  You know as well as I do that it's been Biden's policies that have increased the price of fossil fuels here in the US and that he did that intentionally.


Again. I used no statistics. Just oil import facts.  Biden’s policies have nothing to do with free market oil prices. We are producing more than when Trump handed over the economy.  We’re using less than 2019. We are importing less than precovid. Even his release of the strategic oil made only a small dent in prices. OPEC needs to produce more or the prices will stay high.


----------



## citygator

B. Kidd said:


> Here's a "knock-knock" joke for you cooter:
> 
> Knock-Knock
> 
> Cooter: "Who's there?".
> 
> STAGFLATION!!


We have low unemployment. There is no stagflation. I am not a fan of raising interest rates. We have a supply problem in the world not a demand problem. Raising interest rates and driving up unemployment won’t fix inflation caused by supply.  That could cause a period of stagflation. Lesson being don’t raise interest rates.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> More shouting at the rain. Let me know if that works while I grab an umbrella.


Open borders, a ruined economy, political persecution and rampant crime, you bag of shit. That is not rain, it is treason.


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> We’re still under depressed output from OPEC. Every entity in the world is price gouging. Them too. None of it has to do with the president. You my friend are a cheerleader. You just cheer oil production up or down as long as there was Trump in the office. You see that don’t you?


Did I cheer the fact that Trump pushed energy independence for the US?  Guilty as charged!
Am I disgusted that Biden had to go hat in hand begging Iran, Saudi Arabia and Venezuela to increase oil production?  Again...guilty as charged!


----------



## Oldestyle

citygator said:


> We have low unemployment. There is no stagflation. I am not a fan of raising interest rates. We have a supply problem in the world not a demand problem. Raising interest rates and driving up unemployment won’t fix inflation caused by supply.  That could cause a period of stagflation. Lesson being don’t raise interest rates.


The Fed has no choice but to raise interest rates because Joe Biden's policies have given us inflation so bad it's crippling the country.  Lesson being...take Economics in college so you don't have economic policies that make no sense!


----------



## Oldestyle

Oldestyle said:


> The Fed has no choice but to raise interest rates because Joe Biden's policies have given us inflation so bad it's crippling the country.  Lesson being...take Economics in college so you don't have economic policies that make no sense!


The other lesson being...if it ain't broke...don't fix it!  If Biden had left Trump's policies alone?  We wouldn't have a border crisis.  We wouldn't have an energy crisis.  We wouldn't have a crime crisis.


----------



## B. Kidd

Oldestyle said:


> The other lesson being...if it ain't broke...don't fix it!  If Biden had left Trump's policies alone?  We wouldn't have a border crisis.  We wouldn't have an energy crisis.  We wouldn't have a crime crisis.



Yupp!
We could've been a contender instead of being a hollow shell of our former Country. Sad.


----------



## citygator

Lastamender said:


> Open borders, a ruined economy, political persecution and rampant crime, you bag of shit. That is not rain, it is treason.


This is a thread on the economy. You provided nothing other than more shouting.  Every country has inflation. It's not US centric.  It's supply.  What do the republicans have to fix that jackass?  Nothing. The borders arent open. 48 of the 50 people Desantis flew to Mass were legal immigrants with asylum applications.  Youre just dumb enough to repeat stuff that makes you feel like you are on some team.  You're not.  The republican leaders laugh at people like you who vote against their own interests.  Grow up.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> This is a thread on the economy. You provided nothing other than more shouting.  Every country has inflation. It's not US centric.  It's supply.  What do the republicans have to fix that jackass?  Nothing. The borders arent open. 48 of the 50 people Desantis flew to Mass were legal immigrants with asylum applications.  Youre just dumb enough to repeat stuff that makes you feel like you are on some team.  You're not.  The republican leaders laugh at people like you who vote against their own interests.  Grow up.


The economy is terrible. You are laughable trying to act like Biden has done good. He is a fucking disaster and is destroying this country and you are helping him. Why?


----------



## citygator

Oldestyle said:


> The Fed has no choice but to raise interest rates because Joe Biden's policies have given us inflation so bad it's crippling the country.  Lesson being...take Economics in college so you don't have economic policies that make no sense!


How is Biden crippling the world?











						Inflation Rate - Countries - List
					

This page displays a table with actual values, consensus figures, forecasts, statistics and historical data charts for - Inflation Rate. This page provides values for Inflation Rate reported in several countries. The table has current values for Inflation Rate, previous releases, historical...




					tradingeconomics.com


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> How is Biden crippling the world?
> 
> View attachment 700404
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Inflation Rate - Countries - List
> 
> 
> This page displays a table with actual values, consensus figures, forecasts, statistics and historical data charts for - Inflation Rate. This page provides values for Inflation Rate reported in several countries. The table has current values for Inflation Rate, previous releases, historical...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tradingeconomics.com


He should have told Zelensky to go to hell.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> How is Biden crippling the world?
> 
> View attachment 700404
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Inflation Rate - Countries - List
> 
> 
> This page displays a table with actual values, consensus figures, forecasts, statistics and historical data charts for - Inflation Rate. This page provides values for Inflation Rate reported in several countries. The table has current values for Inflation Rate, previous releases, historical...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tradingeconomics.com


How is he doing it? *He is doing it by design.* Biden puppet masters want this country to fail and are doing everything possible to bring that failure to fruition.


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> He should have told Zelensky to go to hell.


I'll take that as a "I see what you mean".


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> I'll take that as a "I see what you mean".


If we both agree that Zelensky knew he would be able to pilfer US dollars for mentioning NATO.


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> If we both agree that Zelensky knew he would be able to pilfer US dollars for mentioning NATO.


We agree that Inflation isnt driven by Biden economic policy.  If you want to saddle the Russian war on Ukraine to your fantasy that its about bilking Nato for money... have at it.


----------



## citygator

Lastamender said:


> How is he doing it? *He is doing it by design.* Biden puppet masters want this country to fail and are doing everything possible to bring that failure to fruition.


Exactly how is Biden driving up inflation in Germany, Netherlands, South Africa, France, South Korea, Italy, Mexico, India...etc...??? 

You guys really have no ability to intellectually tackle a problem. You simply run to remedial conspiracy stuff.


----------



## Lastamender

citygator said:


> Exactly how is Biden driving up inflation in Germany, Netherlands, South Africa, France, South Korea, Italy, Mexico, India...etc...???
> 
> You guys really have no ability to intellectually tackle a problem. You simply run to remedial conspiracy stuff.


Your go to is "conspiracy" because you know we are right. You could not make it any plainer or obvious.


----------



## Winco

Lastamender said:


> Biden puppet masters want this country to fail


the KKKult continues to con you.  team trump, hooray.

Yes, my portfolio is down 120K, but I still have plenty, and in fact, I hope to never use that money, up or down, because I will leave that money to FAMILY, and my pension provides the money I need.
Life is good.  Market sucks right now, but it really only has an emotional affect.


----------



## Lastamender

Winco said:


> the KKKult continues to con you.  team trump, hooray.
> 
> Yes, my portfolio is down 120K, but I still have plenty, and in fact, I hope to never use that money, up or down, because I will leave that money to FAMILY, and my pension provides the money I need.
> Life is good.  Market sucks right now, but it really only has an emotional affect.


What does your finances have to do with the obvious destructive policies in place? This is about the country not you.


----------



## Winco

Lastamender said:


> the obvious destructive policies in place?


What are those?

Be specific.


----------



## Lastamender

Winco said:


> What are those?
> 
> Be specific.


Open borders. Political persecution. Forgiving student loans. Shutting down oil production and killing the Keystone pipeline. Sending billions to prop up a fascist government in Ukraine. Bailing out Blue states under the guise of infrastructure.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> We agree that Inflation isnt driven by Biden economic policy.  If you want to saddle the Russian war on Ukraine to your fantasy that its about bilking Nato for money... have at it.


Putin, Biden and Zelensky are pilfering whatever NATO doesn’t get.


----------



## Lastamender

Indeependent said:


> Putin, Biden and Zelensky are pilfering whatever NATO doesn’t get.


There is laundry. Big loads of money to wash. Rinse and repeat and we finance them.


----------



## HikerGuy83

Slade3200 said:


> You’re totally correct. The Left should take Donny Trumps example and show a little humility. Admit when they make mistakes, own them, apologize and then try to do better, just like Trump would do. Right?!



While I appreciate your comment's validity with respect to Trump.

It is still a whataboutism.


----------



## HikerGuy83

citygator said:


> Exactly how is Biden driving up inflation in Germany, Netherlands, South Africa, France, South Korea, Italy, Mexico, India...etc...???
> 
> You guys really have no ability to intellectually tackle a problem. You simply run to remedial conspiracy stuff.



The baldfaced truth is that no president is responsible for the economy.

But since both sides do it to each other....Biden gets to own this one.


----------



## Slade3200

HikerGuy83 said:


> While I appreciate your comment's validity with respect to Trump.
> 
> It is still a whataboutism.


If you’re looking for a straight forward acknowledgement that partisans from the left play the same hypocritical games as partisans from the right then I can absolutely acknowledge that. No whataboutism necessary


----------



## B. Kidd

Lastamender said:


> Open borders. Political persecution. Forgiving student loans. Shutting down oil production and killing the Keystone pipeline. Sending billions to prop up a fascist government in Ukraine. Bailing out Blue states under the guise of infrastructure.



And the purpose of the Green New Deal seals our fate towards China becoming our master's without firing a shot!!
El Presidente is essential (along w/ Newsome) pulling off this design.

I'll explain when I'm ready to.


----------



## Nova78

McRib said:


> My 401K is up 41.1% for the year, it has never been up this high.


That's great, now it's 82 % down


----------



## Nova78

You will notice rightwinger deleted his post on how great his stocks are
doing under Biden.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Nova78 said:


> You will notice rightwinger deleted his post on how great his stocks are
> doing under Biden.



Great time to buy shares at a reduced cost, thus when the market comes back you are better off than before.


----------



## the other mike

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Democrats magically turn into Republicans right before election time.


----------



## Nova78

Golfing Gator said:


> Great time to buy shares at a reduced cost, thus when the market comes back you are better off than before.


It will be a long time before he even hits bottom.
The stock market has become a pump and dump.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Nova78 said:


> It will be a long time before he even hits bottom.
> The stock market has become a pump and dump.



Nope, we are pretty close now.  

I do not need any money that is in the market for at least 10 years.  

Even after the 08 crash it was back in just a tad over 2 years. 

So, I will enjoy gaining extra shares for the same money and looking for those diamond in the rough bargains.  

You though should keep all your money in your mattress.


----------



## Seymour Flops

Golfing Gator said:


> Nope, we are pretty close now.
> 
> I do not need any money that is in the market for at least 10 years.
> 
> Even after the 08 crash it was back in just a tad over 2 years.
> 
> So, I will enjoy gaining extra shares for the same money and looking for those diamond in the rough bargains.
> 
> You though should keep all your money in your mattress.


You said this before.  I'm more or less in the same boat.  I have eight years to retirement as a teacher, and even then I'll likely be able to let my 403b keep growing and live off TRS, social security which I paid into long enough to "double dip," and a little side hustle playing poker.  I'm happy that I'm buying cheaper stocks and I am confident that they will grow again and I may personally be in better shape than even if Trump had stayed in office this whole time.

But there are plenty of people who are retired right now and count on their 401k, etc, to live above the poverty line.  Seeing such a large percent of their scrimped for savings sacrificed to whatever the goals are of the Democratic Party is disheartening and frightening.  Biden has more than two more years to continue with that process, and he shows no sign of stopping.

It will drive them to the polls in a couple of months, and again in 2024.  I hope that by then, you will see the need to stop the destruction of the economy by putting either Trump or DeSantis in the White House.  Trump's advocacy of de-regulation allowed the economy to grow, since companies no longer needed to fear being suddenly put out of business by fiat.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Seymour Flops said:


> You said this before.  I'm more or less in the same boat.  I have eight years to retirement as a teacher, and even then I'll likely be able to let my 403b keep growing and live off TRS, social security which I paid into long enough to "double dip," and a little side hustle playing poker.  I'm happy that I'm buying cheaper stocks and I am confident that they will grow again and I may personally be in better shape than even if Trump had stayed in office this whole time.
> 
> But there are plenty of people who are retired right now and count on their 401k, etc, to live above the poverty line.  Seeing such a large percent of their scrimped for savings sacrificed to whatever the goals are of the Democratic Party is disheartening and frightening.  Biden has more than two more years to continue with that process, and he shows no sign of stopping.
> 
> It will drive them to the polls in a couple of months, and again in 2024.  I hope that by then, you will see the need to stop the destruction of the economy by putting either Trump or DeSantis in the White House.  Trump's advocacy of de-regulation allowed the economy to grow, since companies no longer needed to fear being suddenly put out of business by fiat.



Recession happen, in this country they are built in to the system.   Not counting the mini-COVID recession we were way past due for one.   This would have happened no matter who won in Nov, it was they say "inevitable".

In 2024 I will vote for the nominee from the Libertarian Party like I have done for since 2000.  

Removing the duopoly is the only hope the country has, but you and those like you will never not vote for your beloved party, so we each just have to make the best for ourselves as we can.


----------



## B. Kidd

Golfing Gator said:


> Great time to buy shares at a reduced cost, thus when the market comes back you are better off than before.



Not at my age.
I'd have to live forever!!


----------



## Seymour Flops

Golfing Gator said:


> Recession happen, in this country they are built in to the system.   Not counting the mini-COVID recession we were way past due for one.   This would have happened no matter who won in Nov, it was they say "inevitable".


LoL!  Yeah, they say that as soon as a Democrat crashes the economy.


Golfing Gator said:


> In 2024 I will vote for the nominee from the Libertarian Party like I have done for since 2000.


Yet, on here, you do little but defend Democratic politicians and Democratic policies.


Golfing Gator said:


> Removing the duopoly is the only hope the country has, but you and those like you will never not vote for your beloved party, so we each just have to make the best for ourselves as we can.


Which party is my beloved party that I will never not vote for?  I voted for that tax-and-spend "Libertarian" fool Gary Johnson in 2016.  I had no confidence that Trump would do anything except be a thorn in the side of the GOP.  Much as I enjoyed that show, I doubted that he would be elected and doubted more that he would do anything other than roll over for Democrats the way Republicans do.

By 2020, it was clear that Trump was a lot of talk, but not all talk, which put him leaps and bounds ahead of other Republicans.  

I pray someday that the U.S. will be a libertarian democratic republic.  But given the Democrats and non-Trump Republicans we have in charge, I fear that it will soon be neither democratic, nor a republic (assuming you know the difference between a democratic republic and the Democrats and Republicans).


----------



## Golfing Gator

Seymour Flops said:


> LoL! Yeah, they say that as soon as a Democrat crashes the economy.



I have been saying that as long as I have been on this forum and well beyond that.  Unlike you all, I do not change my views based upon who is sitting in the White House.   



Seymour Flops said:


> Yet, on here, you do little but defend Democratic politicians and Democratic policies.



Nope.  You think not agreeing with Trump equals defending Democratic politicians and Democratic policies...but that is just not the case.



Seymour Flops said:


> I pray someday that the U.S. will be a libertarian democratic republic.



Trump is no closer to being a libertarian than Biden.


----------



## Seymour Flops

Golfing Gator said:


> I have been saying that as long as I have been on this forum and well beyond that.  Unlike you all, I do not change my views based upon who is sitting in the White House.
> 
> Nope.  You think not agreeing with Trump equals defending Democratic politicians and Democratic policies...but that is just not the case.


Defending the DNC/DOJ/FBI in their actions at Mar-a-Lago, and their open border policies is extremely pro-Democratic Party.  Pro-their most extreme policies, in fact.


Golfing Gator said:


> Trump is no closer to being a libertarian than Biden.


No, he is not.  But at least we had a strong economy and a border moving toward being secure under Trump, statist bastard that he is.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Seymour Flops said:


> Defending the DNC/DOJ/FBI in their actions at Mar-a-Lago,



I have not done that, I have said we do not know yet if the search was valid or not.  We have not been given enough information to make that determination.  



Seymour Flops said:


> and their open border policies is extremely pro-Democratic Party.



link?



Seymour Flops said:


> No, he is not. But at least we had a strong economy and a border moving toward being secure under Trump, statist bastard that he is.



We had a economy being kept up longer than it should have been with tax cuts and increased government spending. 

Was the border really moving towards secure?  Trump ignored his first two years when his party controlled all of Congress....why is that?


----------



## Seymour Flops

Golfing Gator said:


> I have not done that, I have said we do not know yet if the search was valid or not.  We have not been given enough information to make that determination.


A reasonable and non-partisan person can compare the DOJ's treatment of Hillary's bathroom server and Trump's de-classified documents and see the difference.  The DOJ negotiated with Hillary and allowed her to tell them what they would get and what not.  She was essentially her own special master.  No raid either.  Do you know what happened to the server on which she stored tens of thousands of classified documents?  We sure know what happened to the hundred or so documents marked classied that Trump had.

Do you criticise the disparate treatment?  If not, you are pro-Democrat Party.

State your position, I'm not playing the guessing game.  If you don't state your position, I will assume the worst.









Golfing Gator said:


> link?


Maybe I'm wrong.  State your position on the border, and if I was wrong in assuming you support the current open border, I'll acknowlege it.  Don't state your position and I'll assume the worst.


Golfing Gator said:


> We had a economy being kept up longer than it should have been with tax cuts and increased government spending.


I said he is a statist bastard.  


Golfing Gator said:


> Was the border really moving towards secure?


It was moving in that direction, much more so than under Biden.  

Negotiating the stay-in-Mexico policy to the benefit of both the U.S. and Mexico was an incredible achievment that Biden flushed down the proverbial toilet.  Also great was requiring criminal aliens to be incarcerated and not giving them a pass because of them also smuggling children - known by The Party as "the family separation policy." It was a deterrent to the most expensive to provide services for and least valuable to the economy illegal - families with several children

Biden welcomes all kinds of illegals, welfare seekers, drug smugglers, gangs, human traffickers and those who seek to compete with Americans for unskilled jobs.  How do you feel about that?


Golfing Gator said:


> Trump ignored his first two years when his party controlled all of Congress....why is that?


He did not construct his wall as he should have, but I disagree that he ignored immigration.

Still, he did not do nearly enough.  For once he allowed the wailing and gnashing of teeth of the Democratic Party and their cheerleaders in the media to sway him.  His biggest mistake.  It might have cost him the election even without the cheating.

Oh . . . please state your position on ballot harvesting. If not, etc . . .


----------



## Golfing Gator

Seymour Flops said:


> A reasonable and non-partisan person can compare the DOJ's treatment of Hillary's bathroom server and Trump's de-classified documents and see the difference. The DOJ negotiated with Hillary and allowed her to tell them what they would get and what not. She was essentially her own special master. No raid either. Do you know what happened to the server on which she stored tens of thousands of classified documents? We sure know what happened to the hundred or so documents marked classied that Trump had.
> 
> Do you criticise the disparate treatment? If not, you are pro-Democrat Party.
> 
> State your position, I'm not playing the guessing game. If you don't state your position, I will assume the worst.



I have stated my position on Hillary 1000 times on here, probably 20 times to you alone.  Hillary should be in jail, they were wrong to not go after her.

But that has ZERO impact on the Trump case.  If a cop lets someone going 100 MPH go by and stops you for going 75, guess what, pointing out the guy going faster does not change your guilt.


----------



## Seymour Flops

Golfing Gator said:


> I have stated my position on Hillary 1000 times on here, probably 20 times to you alone.  Hillary should be in jail, they were wrong to not go after her.
> 
> But that has ZERO impact on the Trump case.  If a cop lets someone going 100 MPH go by and stops you for going 75, guess what, pointing out the guy going faster does not change your guilt.


It sure does.  Never hear of precedent? 

Going 100 miles per hour amounts to reckless driving, while going 75 is just five miles over the speed limit and most likely keeping up with the flow of traffic for safety. 

To get away from that poor analogy, Clinton had tens of thousands of actually classified documents and Trump had - at most - 100.  If they turn out to be the Crossfire Hurricane documents that he declassified in writing, then he had zero even arguably classified documents.  He had declassified documents that documented the DNC/DOJ/FBI scheme to sway the presidentia election in 2016. 

No mystery whe the raid took place if that was the case.

Back to your analogy, If the police let the first driver go and gleefully stop, ticket, and impound the car of the second, while prosecutors try for seven years to find something to put the 75 MPG guy in prison, it doesn't take a genius to see something is wrong with that picture.  Doesn't even take a cheeseburger.  A dry bologna sandwich could see the problem.

How the DOJ/FBI treats one political figure differently than another is absolutely relevant to discussign the Mar-a-Lago raid and the DOJ/FBI in general.

I'm glad that you belatedly recognize that Hillary was wrong, but I disagree with your statement that she should be in jail.  She worked closely under Barack Obama and there is no way he did not know about her classified information server.  He was the president and if he was cool with it, no crime.

The answer is for us not to elect such corrupt individuals.  There should be no reason that we cannot elect a reasonable person who openly works to make America great.  Unfortunately reasonable people who want to make America great are attacked without mercy by the DNC/MSM and nearly always frightened off.  So we are left with Republicans whose only goal is to comprimise with Democrats at every turn. 

It was only Trump's willingness to laugh off their attacks that allowed him to be nominated over the large field of DIABL* candidates.  No typical person could withstand that kind of abuse.

*Democrat in All But Label


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.



Ouch!

That didn't age well.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Seymour Flops said:


> It sure does. Never hear of precedent?



One incident does not set precedent.



Seymour Flops said:


> To get away from that poor analogy, Clinton had tens of thousands of actually classified documents and Trump had - at most - 100. If they turn out to be the Crossfire Hurricane documents that he declassified in writing, then he had zero even arguably classified documents. He had declassified documents that documented the DNC/DOJ/FBI scheme to sway the presidentia election in 2016.



What those documents were matters more than how many.  1000 Confidential documents could do far less harm than one TSI. 



Seymour Flops said:


> No mystery whe the raid took place if that was the case.



If that was the case then Trump was again his own worst enemy as he had 560 plus days to release those document to We The People and choose not to. 



Seymour Flops said:


> I'm glad that you belatedly recognize that Hillary was wrong, but I disagree with your statement that she should be in jail.



There is nothing belated about it, I have said it since then and about 1000 times on this forum.  Your ignorance of my post is not my problem. 



Seymour Flops said:


> She worked closely under Barack Obama and there is no way he did not know about her classified information server. He was the president and if he was cool with it, no crime.



Nope, if I had done what she did I would be in jail, so she should as well.



Seymour Flops said:


> The answer is for us not to elect such corrupt individuals.



That is a great answer.  When will you stop voting for such corrupt individuals?



Seymour Flops said:


> There should be no reason that we cannot elect a reasonable person who openly works to make America great.



Because we have not had one of those people as the nominee for a major party in more than 100 years.


----------



## Baron Von Murderpaws

I hope the Red Wave DOES hit in November.  That means my gold and silver will go back up in value.
As of last week, they are worth $10 less for each piece than when I bought them in 2021.  

If the Dow jumps again and the market stablizes for a while next year, then they will go back to normal.......hopefully more.


----------



## Blisterfinger

Thud


----------



## DudleySmith

Blue Line Jumps 11 Percent
					

NEW YORK–Excitement swept the financial world Monday, when a blue line jumped more than 11 percent, passing four black horizontal lines as it rose from 367.22 to 408.85.




					www.theonion.com
				




This article is more factual than the 'market' discussions here.


----------



## Canon Shooter

citygator said:


> When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?



Where the stock market closes is of little concern to someone who's paying $6.49 a gallon for gasoline...


----------



## citygator

Stock market up over Trump and +35% to 5 years you greedy bastards.  Only going up from here.  No way I’m wrong.


----------



## theHawk

Golfing Gator said:


> Removing the duopoly is the only hope the country has, but you and those like you will never not vote for your beloved party


Then vote MAGA.  It is the third party.


----------



## Manonthestreet

Inflation is going to fall just as fast as it rose, and that’s investors’ cue to enter the stock market
		

Your buy buy buy moment has arrived. Be Bold be brave......I suspect ya might be good thru the election and shortly after


----------



## Jarlaxle

Indeependent said:


> Bank of New York already has a mortgage default percent of 30% of loans given in last 3 years.



What. The. Fuck. Have a link to that?!



Oldestyle said:


> You use statistics to hide facts, Gator.  You know as well as I do that it's been Biden's policies that have increased the price of fossil fuels here in the US and that he did that intentionally.



I don't think so. I do not think Slow Joe has the mental faculties to do much "intentionally" now.



citygator said:


> How is Biden crippling the world?
> 
> View attachment 700404
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Inflation Rate - Countries - List
> 
> 
> This page displays a table with actual values, consensus figures, forecasts, statistics and historical data charts for - Inflation Rate. This page provides values for Inflation Rate reported in several countries. The table has current values for Inflation Rate, previous releases, historical...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tradingeconomics.com



You realize the "8%" inflation number is as real as a three-dollar bill...right?


----------



## Jarlaxle

Golfing Gator said:


> Great time to buy shares at a reduced cost, thus when the market comes back you are better off than before.





Manonthestreet said:


> Inflation is going to fall just as fast as it rose, and that’s investors’ cue to enter the stock market
> 
> 
> Your buy buy buy moment has arrived. Be Bold be brave......I suspect ya might be good thru the election and shortly after



I recently doubled contributions to my retirement-yes, thank you, I WILL buy stocks on sale!


----------



## Indeependent

Jarlaxle said:


> What. The. Fuck. Have a link to that?!
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think so. I do not think Slow Joe has the mental faculties to do much "intentionally" now.
> 
> 
> 
> You realize the "8%" inflation number is as real as a three-dollar bill...right?


AP News several weeks ago.
Google "2022 Mortgage Defaults" and view the results...not promising.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Indeependent said:


> AP News several weeks ago.
> Google "2022 Mortgage Defaults" and view the results...not promising.











						Loan Performance Insights - September 2022
					

In June 2022, 2.9% of mortgages were delinquent by at least 30 days or more including those in foreclosure. This represents a 1.5 percentage point decrease in the overall delinquency rate compared with June 2021.




					www.corelogic.com


----------



## Golfing Gator

Jarlaxle said:


> What. The. Fuck. Have a link to that?!



He never has a link for anything, he just makes shit up with his every post

Doing a google search of BNY and mortgage defaults does not provide the lies that he told.

Also, this story cannot be found on the AP News website.


----------



## citygator

Jarlaxle said:


> What. The. Fuck. Have a link to that?!
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think so. I do not think Slow Joe has the mental faculties to do much "intentionally" now.
> 
> 
> 
> You realize the "8%" inflation number is as real as a three-dollar bill...right?


Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.


----------



## CrusaderFrank

Two thoughts: Berkshire Hathaway is trading near book value and the market is nowhere near a bottom


----------



## citygator

CrusaderFrank said:


> Two thoughts: Berkshire Hathaway is trading near book value and the market is nowhere near a bottom


Short it then. Let us know how that goes.


----------



## CrusaderFrank

citygator said:


> Short it then. Let us know how that goes.


Been going fine, I’m even this year


----------



## citygator

CrusaderFrank said:


> Been going fine, I’m even this year


Investing in what?


----------



## Oldestyle

Jarlaxle said:


> What. The. Fuck. Have a link to that?!
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think so. I do not think Slow Joe has the mental faculties to do much "intentionally" now.
> 
> 
> 
> You realize the "8%" inflation number is as real as a three-dollar bill...right?


Joe does what his "handlers" tell him to!  He's surrounded by ideologues that don't have a clue about economics...and couldn't care less if their policies hurt everyday Americans!  Joe just eats ice cream and wanders around stages after butchering another teleprompter speech!


----------



## Indeependent

Golfing Gator said:


> Loan Performance Insights - September 2022
> 
> 
> In June 2022, 2.9% of mortgages were delinquent by at least 30 days or more including those in foreclosure. This represents a 1.5 percentage point decrease in the overall delinquency rate compared with June 2021.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.corelogic.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 714359


You only read the first lying Link.
Read the others,..not very promising.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.


I wonder if that has to do with the fact that the rest of the world lives off American gifts.


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.


/-----/ I'll thank biden if he stops destroying the economy.
Òscar Jordà, Celeste Liu, Fernanda Nechio, and Fabián Rivera-Reyes
Inflation rates in the United States and other developed economies have closely tracked each other historically. Problems with global supply chains and changes in spending patterns due to the COVID-19 pandemic have pushed up inflation worldwide. *However, since the first half of 2021, U.S. inflation has increasingly outpaced inflation in other developed countries.* Estimates suggest that fiscal support measures designed to counteract the severity of the pandemic’s economic effect may have contributed to this divergence by raising inflation about 3 percentage points by the end of 2021.








						San Francisco Fed
					

Inflation rates in the United States and other developed economies have closely tracked each other historically. Problems with global supply chains and changes in spending patterns due to the COVID-19 pandemic have pushed up inflation worldwide. However, since the first half of 2021, U.S...




					www.frbsf.org


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.


/-----/
Countries with the Lowest Inflation​South Sudan (not to be confused with Sudan) had massive deflation with prices actually falling by -8.52% over the year. Bolivia had less than 1% annual inflation and the Maldives and Macau had just over 1% inflation. But beware, many of the low inflation countries on this list haven’t reported since last December (or earlier) so their actual inflation rate could be much higher by now.


COUNTRYLASTREFERENCESouth Sudan-8.52December 2021Bolivia0.87April 2022Vanuatu0.9September 2021Maldives1.05March 2022Macau1.07March 2022New Caledonia1.2December 2021Liechtenstein1.5December 2021Afghanistan1.56June 2021Hong Kong1.7March 2022Benin2April 2022China2.1April 2022Brunei2.2December 2021Malaysia2.2March 2022Seychelles2.2April 2022Saudi Arabia2.3April 2022Cameroon2.37September 2021Bermuda2.5February 2022Japan2.5April 2022Switzerland2.5April 2022United Arab Emirates2.5December 2021Eritrea2.6December 2021Vietnam2.64April 2022Oman2.67April 2022Central African Republic2.7December 2021Ecuador2.89April 2022Equatorial Guinea2.9December 2021Gabon2.9March 2022Swaziland3.3February 2022Taiwan3.38April 2022Indonesia3.47April 2022


----------



## Manonthestreet

Jarlaxle said:


> I recently doubled contributions to my retirement-yes, thank you, I WILL buy stocks on sale!


You ain't seen on sale yet......


----------



## Jarlaxle

citygator said:


> Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.


You believe the official inflation numbers? *BLESS YOUR HEART!*


----------



## Cellblock2429

Jarlaxle said:


> I recently doubled contributions to my retirement-yes, thank you, I WILL buy stocks on sale!


/——/ Don’t try to catch a falling knife.


----------



## Jarlaxle

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——/ Don’t try to catch a falling knife.


I'm far enough from retirement that my risk is minimal.


----------



## citygator

Cellblock2429 said:


> /-----/
> Countries with the Lowest Inflation​South Sudan (not to be confused with Sudan) had massive deflation with prices actually falling by -8.52% over the year. Bolivia had less than 1% annual inflation and the Maldives and Macau had just over 1% inflation. But beware, many of the low inflation countries on this list haven’t reported since last December (or earlier) so their actual inflation rate could be much higher by now.
> 
> 
> COUNTRYLASTREFERENCESouth Sudan-8.52December 2021Bolivia0.87April 2022Vanuatu0.9September 2021Maldives1.05March 2022Macau1.07March 2022New Caledonia1.2December 2021Liechtenstein1.5December 2021Afghanistan1.56June 2021Hong Kong1.7March 2022Benin2April 2022China2.1April 2022Brunei2.2December 2021Malaysia2.2March 2022Seychelles2.2April 2022Saudi Arabia2.3April 2022Cameroon2.37September 2021Bermuda2.5February 2022Japan2.5April 2022Switzerland2.5April 2022United Arab Emirates2.5December 2021Eritrea2.6December 2021Vietnam2.64April 2022Oman2.67April 2022Central African Republic2.7December 2021Ecuador2.89April 2022Equatorial Guinea2.9December 2021Gabon2.9March 2022Swaziland3.3February 2022Taiwan3.38April 2022Indonesia3.47April 2022


What’s your point?


----------



## citygator

Indeependent said:


> I wonder if that has to do with the fact that the rest of the world lives off American gifts.


Nope.


----------



## citygator

Jarlaxle said:


> You believe the official inflation numbers? *BLESS YOUR HEART!*


Let’s just all make up our own narrative then.


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> Nope.


Yep!


----------



## citygator

Cellblock2429 said:


> /-----/
> Countries with the Lowest Inflation​South Sudan (not to be confused with Sudan) had massive deflation with prices actually falling by -8.52% over the year. Bolivia had less than 1% annual inflation and the Maldives and Macau had just over 1% inflation. But beware, many of the low inflation countries on this list haven’t reported since last December (or earlier) so their actual inflation rate could be much higher by now.
> 
> 
> COUNTRYLASTREFERENCESouth Sudan-8.52December 2021Bolivia0.87April 2022Vanuatu0.9September 2021Maldives1.05March 2022Macau1.07March 2022New Caledonia1.2December 2021Liechtenstein1.5December 2021Afghanistan1.56June 2021Hong Kong1.7March 2022Benin2April 2022China2.1April 2022Brunei2.2December 2021Malaysia2.2March 2022Seychelles2.2April 2022Saudi Arabia2.3April 2022Cameroon2.37September 2021Bermuda2.5February 2022Japan2.5April 2022Switzerland2.5April 2022United Arab Emirates2.5December 2021Eritrea2.6December 2021Vietnam2.64April 2022Oman2.67April 2022Central African Republic2.7December 2021Ecuador2.89April 2022Equatorial Guinea2.9December 2021Gabon2.9March 2022Swaziland3.3February 2022Taiwan3.38April 2022Indonesia3.47April 2022











						Countries With The Highest Inflation: How U.S. Prices Compare Globally
					

Though the latest U.S. inflation report didn’t break records like the month prior, it’s clear that high prices are sticking around for a while. The Consumer Price Index (CPI), which measures price changes and is a key indicator of inflation, showed that in July, prices were 8.5% higher than they wer




					www.forbes.com


----------



## Meathead

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Another thread that's aged as well as a crack whore.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

citygator said:


> Countries With The Highest Inflation: How U.S. Prices Compare Globally
> 
> 
> Though the latest U.S. inflation report didn’t break records like the month prior, it’s clear that high prices are sticking around for a while. The Consumer Price Index (CPI), which measures price changes and is a key indicator of inflation, showed that in July, prices were 8.5% higher than they wer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.forbes.com



Sounds like we're not the only country that has to vote out some morons.

So how many House seats are the Dems gonna lose?

You think they'll lose 3 seats in the Senate? More?


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> What’s your point?


/——-/ I’m replying to your post. DUHHHH  “Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.”


----------



## citygator

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——-/ I’m replying to your post. DUHHHH  “Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.”


All you did is show a few countries with lower inflation in subsaharan desert Africa. Awesome work.


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> All you did is show a few countries with lower inflation in subsaharan desert Africa. Awesome work.


/——-/ which is all I need to prove your statement to be false.


----------



## Jarlaxle

citygator said:


> Let’s just all make up our own narrative then.


Yes, that's essentially what happened: the method of calculating "core" inflation was rigged, so it doesn't include little things like fuel and food. By the old (realistic) standard, it's closer to 16%.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Jarlaxle said:


> Yes, that's essentially what happened: the method of calculating "core" inflation was rigged, so it doesn't include little things like fuel and food. By the old (realistic) standard, it's closer to 16%.



Core never included food and fuel.


----------



## citygator

Cellblock2429 said:


> /——-/ which is all I need to prove your statement to be false.


Nope. You need to see where the US is among all developed nations. Pretty much in the middle genius. Can I ask why you didn’t stay in school?


----------



## Indeependent

citygator said:


> Nope. You need to see where the US is among all developed nations. Pretty much in the middle genius. Can I ask why you didn’t stay in school?


What developed nations?
They all ask the US for help for money and our military.


----------



## Cellblock2429

citygator said:


> Nope. You need to see where the US is among all developed nations. Pretty much in the middle genius. Can I ask why you didn’t stay in school?


/——-/ I proved you wrong so naturally you move the goal posts. Typical liberal debate tactic.

ONCE AGAIN YOU POSTED: “Worldwide inflation is higher than the US. Thank Biden.”
I PROVED YOU WRONG AND THEN YOU SAID WE WERE IN THE MIDDLE.  Give up- you lost.


----------



## Jarlaxle

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Core never included food and fuel.


Then it's meaningless.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Jarlaxle said:


> Then it's meaningless.



Why?

They publish the rate that includes food and fuel too.

It's not a secret.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Sounds like we're not the only country that has to vote out some morons.
> 
> So how many House seats are the Dems gonna lose?
> 
> You think they'll lose 3 seats in the Senate? More?



They will lose about 30 house seats and and pick up 1 maybe 2 Senate seats


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Golfing Gator said:


> They will lose about 30 house seats and and pick up 1 maybe 2 Senate seats



Only 30? Have you seen the right track/ wrong track numbers?
The +8% inflation rate?

Which seats are they gonna pick up in the Senate?


----------



## Indeependent

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Only 30? Have you seen the right track/ wrong track numbers?
> The +8% inflation rate?
> 
> Which seats are they gonna pick up in the Senate?


Relax...GG is a Leftist who *Identifies *as a Libertarian.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Only 30? Have you seen the right track/ wrong track numbers?
> The +8% inflation rate?
> 
> Which seats are they gonna pick up in the Senate?



Yes, I have seen them.  That is my prediction, sorry it triggers you so, but it is what it is.

The two seats in the Senate are PA and WI


----------



## sparky

~S~


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Golfing Gator said:


> Yes, I have seen them.  That is my prediction, sorry it triggers you so, but it is what it is.
> 
> The two seats in the Senate are PA and WI



Doesn't trigger me at all. Thanks.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Doesn't trigger me at all. Thanks.



If you say so...


----------



## DOTR

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


Boy this aged like milk.


----------



## Mac-7

Golfing Gator said:


> then you should pull yourself up by your bootstraps and get off the bottom.  This is America, the land of opportunity.  Just today we were told if you are poor in this country is is 100% by choice.


I think that was a reference to welfare bums standing in line for their handouts

Most of them could do better of they tried


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> Boy this aged like milk.



Tis the problem with the internet, it is forever and your words often comeback to bite you on the butt


----------



## citygator

DOTR said:


> Boy this aged like milk.


Profits still soaring. Media induced angst on recession is actually causing a cutback and ultimate maybe a recession. Stock market reflects that. Most economists expect inflation to drop dramatically over the next 6 months. We will see.

Regardless the OP was a post that mirrored the blustering of Trump threads that also dried up with the economy implosion.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

citygator said:


> Most economists expect inflation to drop dramatically over the next 6 months.



Recessions tend to do that.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Recessions tend to do that.



Which is why the Fed is pushing us in to one.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

Golfing Gator said:


> Which is why the Fed is pushing us in to one.



They gotta fight Bidenflation somehow.

The other way would be to free up supply....but that would involve reducing taxes
and regulations......like garlic to a vampire.


----------



## DOTR

citygator said:


> Regardless the OP was a post that mirrored the blustering of Trump threads that also dried up with the economy implosion.



   I understand of course. You are only interested in how you can spin any given item to the advantage of your masters without regard for any truth because you felt painfully exposed on the issue in the past.

  Makes perfect sense if you are a communist I suppose.


----------



## Blaster

Adidas Stands To Lose $650 Million After Dropping Kanye’s Yeezy Line—‘Right Decision,’ Analyst Says
					

Adidas shares are down 15% since Thursday as the company deals with stagnating sales and a rash of anti-Semitic comments from its highest-paid employee.




					www.forbes.com


----------



## Golfing Gator

Blaster said:


> Adidas Stands To Lose $650 Million After Dropping Kanye’s Yeezy Line—‘Right Decision,’ Analyst Says
> 
> 
> Adidas shares are down 15% since Thursday as the company deals with stagnating sales and a rash of anti-Semitic comments from its highest-paid employee.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.forbes.com



Good to see a company do the right thing even if it cost them.  One cannot have a piece of shit anti-semitic asshole as their spokesperson.


----------



## Blaster

Golfing Gator said:


> Good to see a company do the right thing even if it cost them.  One cannot have a piece of shit anti-semitic asshole as their spokesperson.


I feel sorry for anyone with stock in that company.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Blaster said:


> I feel sorry for anyone with stock in that company.



I know right, how dare a company do the right thing....just terrible.  

I am sure you can find yourself a company that still embraces anti-Semites to invest in


----------



## Blaster

Golfing Gator said:


> I know right, how dare a company do the right thing....just terrible.
> 
> I am sure you can find yourself a company that still embraces anti-Semites to invest in


I don't have any stock in that company and I wasn't making a moral judgement either.  I look at it strictly from a financial perspective.


----------



## Golfing Gator

Blaster said:


> I don't have any stock in that company and I wasn't making a moral judgement either.  I look at it strictly from a financial perspective.



Not everyone is devoid of morals.


----------



## Blaster

Golfing Gator said:


> Not everyone is devoid of morals.


Why is investing in the stock market related to moral values?


----------



## Golfing Gator

Blaster said:


> Why is investing in the stock market related to moral values?



It is not for everyone.  Some people do pay attention to the companies they invest in. 

Adidas did the correct thing, especially after Kanye said they would never do it no matter what he said. 

Their stock will be back for those in it for the long run.


----------



## McRib

I'm only down 0.9% for the year today, the first time this low all year. (The highest has been about 10%)

All told, I'm fine with this, as there has never been a bear market that has lasted 4 years, and this one is about a year old. Year and a half, maybe less, and we'll be back to a bull market.


----------



## citygator

I’m about to put a significant cash outlay into the S&P. We’ll be over 36k again by March. GDP was strong on latest report.


----------



## Oddball




----------



## DOTR

citygator said:


> I’m about to put a significant cash outlay into the S&P. We’ll be over 36k again by March. GDP was strong on latest report.



  Havent learned your lesson yet? Or is this another "I said it because Trump"?


----------



## citygator

DOTR said:


> Havent learned your lesson yet? Or is this another "I said it because Trump"?


What lesson should I learn?


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> Havent learned your lesson yet? Or is this another "I said it because Trump"?



Are you one of those people that think the market will never come back?


----------



## DOTR

citygator said:


> What lesson should I learn?



  That these things are humiliating for you in a few months. Then you have to say "well I only said that because trump supporters opposed it"


----------



## citygator

DOTR said:


> That these things are humiliating for you in a few months. Then you have to say "well I only said that because trump supporters opposed it"


Are you in Biden’s stock market or not right now?


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> Are you one of those people that think the market will never come back?



  I dont know what it will do. Its been damaged on a structural level now.


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> I dont know what it will do. Its been damaged on a structural level now.



No more so than it was in 2008 or in 2001or 1990 or....

But hey, keep your money under your mattress, that is sure to be winner


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> No more so than it was in 2008 or in 2001or 1990 or....
> 
> But hey, keep your money under your mattress, that is sure to be winner


  It may be the best choice but for the inflation you people unleashed on the world. Bonds and savings accounts dont work for the Financial Repression you people unleashed. And your president acted very quickly to undo the Trump ban on ESG so theres that.

  The only hope for stocks is that the fed hands out free money again.


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> It may be the best choice but for the inflation you people unleashed on the world. Bonds and savings accounts dont work for the Financial Repression you people unleashed. And your president acted very quickly to undo the Trump ban on ESG so theres that.
> 
> The only hope for stocks is that the fed hands out free money again.



Damn, I had not idea the Libertarian party had such power. 

Learn something new every day on this forum!


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> Damn, I had not idea the Libertarian party had such power.
> 
> Learn something new every day on this forum!



  Its been quite a while since ive been here. I forgot you pretended to be a libertarian. But even after all this time I find you still loudly protesting the obvious. I wonder why?


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> Its been quite a while since ive been here. I forgot you pretended to be a libertarian. But even after all this time I find you still loudly protesting the obvious. I wonder why?



Which obvious is that?


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> I forgot you pretended to be a libertarian.



My 2020 ballot...I support my claims...


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> Which obvious is that?


what are we talking about?


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> what are we talking about?



The stock market that you think will never come back.

Not sure what that has to do with my voting habits, but I am sure it makes perfect sense to you.

You keep your money under your matters and I will keep mine in the market and we will see who is happier in 5 years.


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> Damn, I had not idea the Libertarian party had such power.
> 
> Learn something new every day on this forum!


  The Libertarian party only has what power the Democrats give them to carry out their role.


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> The stock market that you think will never come back.
> 
> Not sure what that has to do with my voting habits, but I am sure it makes perfect sense to you.
> 
> You keep your money under your matters and I will keep mine in the market and we will see who is happier in 5 years.



 try to get outside your partisanship. Read my post again.


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> The Libertarian party only has what power the Democrats give them to carry out their role.



Funny, the Dems say it only has what power the Repubs give them to carry out their role.


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> Funny, the Dems say it only has what power the Repubs give them to carry out their role.


  They would wouldnt they?


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> They would wouldnt they?



Of course they would as there is little to no difference between the two parties


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> Of course they would as there is little to no difference between the two parties


  I dont doubt it. They both probably offshore their dirty work to libertarians who arent the brightest or least gullible.


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> I dont doubt it. They both probably offshore their dirty work to libertarians who arent the brightest or least gullible.



I often forget how much you big government loving folks hate the libertarians


----------



## DOTR

Golfing Gator said:


> I often forget how much you big government loving folks hate the libertarians



  Its kind of hard to hate people you only ever see in internet chat rooms


----------



## Golfing Gator

DOTR said:


> Its kind of hard to hate people you only ever see in internet chat rooms



And yet you still manage....well done!


----------



## themirrorthief

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


the mega rich sure love those democrat tools of theirs


----------



## themirrorthief

Otis Mayfield said:


> Way to go, Joe!


now go take another long nap JOe and get somebody to change that depends for crying out loud


----------



## CrusaderFrank

Golfing Gator said:


> Which obvious is that?



Wait, you're a "Libertarian"? LOL!  Seriously?  What else are you, a hobbit?


----------



## gtopa1

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


This thread hasn't aged well.

Greg


----------



## Golfing Gator

gtopa1 said:


> This thread hasn't aged well.
> 
> Greg



That is has not


----------



## DOTR

CrusaderFrank said:


> Wait, you're a "Libertarian"? LOL!  Seriously?  What else are you, a hobbit?


    The difference between a libertarian and a hobbit is I havent given up on one day meeting a hobbit.


----------



## Flopper

citygator said:


> Companies are making profits right now and Wall Street sure likes that. I remember how much of a barometer the stock market was to measure a President’s success over the last several years. When will you conservatives start enjoying a growing economy?
> 
> 
> *Dow Average Touches 36,000 Buoyed by Earnings: Markets Wrap*
> Stocks Pare Gains Amid Earnings, Fed Taper Outlook: Markets Wrap
> 
> Stocks rose toward another record amid earnings surprises and optimism the recovery in the world’s largest economy is on track.
> 
> The Dow Jones Industrial Average touched the 36,000 level. The S&P 500 climbed for a third day, led by commodity, retail and financial companies. The tech-heavy Nasdaq 100 underperformed. Treasuries fell.
> 
> More than 80% of S&P 500 companies reporting third-quarter results have beaten Wall Street estimates, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That has laid the groundwork for a nearly 6% gain in the equity benchmark since the season began on Oct. 13 -- the best performance over a comparable period since 2014.


The fact that corporate profits are rising is a good indication that we have a ways to go before we break the back of inflation. If the Fed continues to raise interest rates which they are certainly going to do, at some point when interest rates are high enough both corporate and personal spending will shrink and we will see falling inflation and then the beginning of a real recovery.  I think that will happen in next 6 to 12 months.

Although business is generally good, there are signs that point to a real slow down, home sales are down and new construction is down.  Wage increases are falling well behind inflation.  I've noticed that rising prices in some retail stores are slowing as customers say no to higher prices.  A restaurant I go to for breakfast occasionally is seeing the effect of higher prices. An $8.95 breakfast is up to $13 in the last 18 months and you can really see the decrease in volume of business.


----------



## DOTR

gtopa1 said:


> This thread hasn't aged well.
> 
> Greg


I mentioned that. His explanation was that he only said it to score points because of Trump? Now you know what you are dealing with.


----------



## gtopa1

Looking at the GDP numbers; Imports down due to large inventories; exports up (good) and consumer spending DOWN...................................uh oh!!!

"
The rise in third-quarter growth reflected net increases in exports, matching expectations that the trade deficit had narrowed as a result of a steep drop in imports, in part due to bloated inventories at some retailers. It was much fewer imports of consumer goods that led to the overall decline.

International trade dynamics may have been what ultimately delivered such strong growth in GDP, but investors would do well to examine some of the more telling components in the data.

Consumer spending increased overall, reflecting money flowing to healthcare and other services. But shoppers stopped digging as deep in their pockets to purchase goods, with data showing a deceleration of spending on cars, parts, and food and beverages. This was the third straight quarter in which goods spending fell, indicating a squeeze on consumers.

Amid signs that inflation remains persistently high—with two more interest-rate decisions due from the Federal Reserve this year—these trends are important.


As are indications that the U.S. is facing a slowdown in the housing market. GDP growth was primarily weighed down by a decrease in residential housing investment, and especially single-family home construction. The Fed’s hawkish shift on interest rates has had a knock-on effect on the mortgage market and created what some economists have called a housing recession.

The data out Thursday may be as good as it gets for a while.

“We expect 3Q22 to mark the peak in quarterly growth, as the cumulative effect of tighter monetary policy begins to push growth below potential,” said Ellen Zentner, the chief U.S. economist at Morgan Stanley. The bank expects to see GDP growth in the fourth quarter of just 0.8%.

“There’s a distinct possibility that Q3 could be the last hurrah for this post-pandemic economic expansion, as the U.S. faces material economic headwinds as a result of the Fed’s aggressive tightening cycle,” said Michael Reynolds, vice president of investment strategy at Glenmede.

The growth picture is likely to get gloomier as the full impact of the Fed’s monetary policy ripples across the economy—a process that can take many months or a year. The central bank is expected to hike rates by 75 basis points, or three quarters of a percentage point, for the fourth time since June next week. That, and another rate decision in December, will only show up in the data deep in 2023.

By that point, this year’s third quarter likely will look even better.






The U.S. Economy Grew, but It’s Not as Good as It Looks​The surprisingly strong increase in GDP should reassure investors that the economy has yet to enter a recession, but risks of a slowdown remain.



www.marketwatch.com
It's only been a TECHNICAL recession, folks. Nothing to see here!!!! 

The real one is yet to come unless the settings change BIG TIME!!!!

btw: selling from the Strategic Reserve assisted the Exports number. Go figure!!!!


Greg


----------



## citygator

The corporate overlords want a recession. They want to do mass layoffs and force people back into offices to save commercial real estate. Too many well paid happy employees makes that harder.

The only reason to keep raising rates is to blow up the labor market (the thing keeping the economy afloat). Capital wants its cheap labor back and a soft landing doesn't accomplish that. 

Look out below!


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

citygator said:


> The corporate overlords want a recession. They want to do mass layoffs and force people back into offices to save commercial real estate. Too many well paid happy employees makes that harder.
> 
> The only reason to keep raising rates is to blow up the labor market (the thing keeping the economy afloat). Capital wants its cheap labor back and a soft landing doesn't accomplish that.
> 
> Look out below!



What are they supposed to do to fight Bidenflation?


----------



## citygator

Toddsterpatriot said:


> What are they supposed to do to fight Bidenflation?


Lower prices due to producer competition.  This is a result of industry consolidation.


----------



## McRib

Today, for the first time in months, my 401K is *UP* 0.56%! 



Yes, based on strong 3rd Qtr. earnings of my various holdings, I am back in the *GREEN*.

Keep up the GREAT work President Biden!


----------



## Golfing Gator

citygator said:


> The corporate overlords want a recession. They want to do mass layoffs and force people back into offices to save commercial real estate. Too many well paid happy employees makes that harder.
> 
> The only reason to keep raising rates is to blow up the labor market (the thing keeping the economy afloat). Capital wants its cheap labor back and a soft landing doesn't accomplish that.
> 
> Look out below!



There will be no mass layoffs.  Most companies are short people as it is.


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

citygator said:


> Lower prices due to producer competition.  This is a result of industry consolidation.



Biden is so incompetent, he destroyed competition?


----------



## citygator

Golfing Gator said:


> There will be no mass layoffs.  Most companies are short people as it is.


Hopefully.


----------



## citygator

Toddsterpatriot said:


> Biden is so incompetent, he destroyed competition?


Pandemic accelerated an already consolidating economy. Or would you disagree?


----------



## Toddsterpatriot

citygator said:


> Pandemic accelerated an already consolidating economy. Or would you disagree?



Any stats you can post?


----------



## Flopper

gtopa1 said:


> Looking at the GDP numbers; Imports down due to large inventories; exports up (good) and consumer spending DOWN...................................uh oh!!!
> 
> "
> The rise in third-quarter growth reflected net increases in exports, matching expectations that the trade deficit had narrowed as a result of a steep drop in imports, in part due to bloated inventories at some retailers. It was much fewer imports of consumer goods that led to the overall decline.
> 
> International trade dynamics may have been what ultimately delivered such strong growth in GDP, but investors would do well to examine some of the more telling components in the data.
> 
> Consumer spending increased overall, reflecting money flowing to healthcare and other services. But shoppers stopped digging as deep in their pockets to purchase goods, with data showing a deceleration of spending on cars, parts, and food and beverages. This was the third straight quarter in which goods spending fell, indicating a squeeze on consumers.
> 
> Amid signs that inflation remains persistently high—with two more interest-rate decisions due from the Federal Reserve this year—these trends are important.
> 
> 
> As are indications that the U.S. is facing a slowdown in the housing market. GDP growth was primarily weighed down by a decrease in residential housing investment, and especially single-family home construction. The Fed’s hawkish shift on interest rates has had a knock-on effect on the mortgage market and created what some economists have called a housing recession.
> 
> The data out Thursday may be as good as it gets for a while.
> 
> “We expect 3Q22 to mark the peak in quarterly growth, as the cumulative effect of tighter monetary policy begins to push growth below potential,” said Ellen Zentner, the chief U.S. economist at Morgan Stanley. The bank expects to see GDP growth in the fourth quarter of just 0.8%.
> 
> “There’s a distinct possibility that Q3 could be the last hurrah for this post-pandemic economic expansion, as the U.S. faces material economic headwinds as a result of the Fed’s aggressive tightening cycle,” said Michael Reynolds, vice president of investment strategy at Glenmede.
> 
> The growth picture is likely to get gloomier as the full impact of the Fed’s monetary policy ripples across the economy—a process that can take many months or a year. The central bank is expected to hike rates by 75 basis points, or three quarters of a percentage point, for the fourth time since June next week. That, and another rate decision in December, will only show up in the data deep in 2023.
> 
> By that point, this year’s third quarter likely will look even better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The U.S. Economy Grew, but It’s Not as Good as It Looks​The surprisingly strong increase in GDP should reassure investors that the economy has yet to enter a recession, but risks of a slowdown remain.
> 
> 
> 
> www.marketwatch.com
> It's only been a TECHNICAL recession, folks. Nothing to see here!!!!
> 
> The real one is yet to come unless the settings change BIG TIME!!!!
> 
> btw: selling from the Strategic Reserve assisted the Exports number. Go figure!!!!
> 
> 
> Greg


Decreased growth and consumer spending has to occur in order to drive down inflation.


----------

