# There is No Home in the Universe but Earth



## Death Angel (Mar 24, 2021)

In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.

There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


----------



## Mac1958 (Mar 24, 2021)

No, we don't have to accept that.

It's okay to admit that we don't know for sure.  It's not sign of weakness, it's a sign of intellectual honesty.


----------



## Mr Natural (Mar 24, 2021)

We’re either alone or we’re not.

Both ideas are equally disturbing.


----------



## San Souci (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


There are indeed planets around other stars. So God has nothing to do with them? Hmmmmm.... Food for thought.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 24, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> We’re either alone or we’re not.
> 
> Both ideas are equally disturbing.


I dont believe we are alone at all, but EVERY planet we encounter seems to be a nightmarish world where no living thing can survive


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 24, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


Again, we seem to live in a video game simulation, with God outside OUR universe


----------



## Mac-7 (Mar 24, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> we don't have to accept that.
> 
> It's okay to admit that we don't know for sure. It's not sign of weakness, it's a sign of intellectual honesty.


What libs cannot accept are Christians who believe that the Bible is God’s word


----------



## San Souci (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > We’re either alone or we’re not.
> ...


Ah ,yes. But there are very likely planets of other stars within the melting and boiling point of H2O. Where life CAN exist.


----------



## Mac1958 (Mar 24, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Mac1958 said:
> 
> 
> > we don't have to accept that.
> ...


Huh?  Isn't that pretty much the definition of the Bible?

You really know nothing about anyone outside your little world.


----------



## fncceo (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe



We respectfully disagree...


----------



## petro (Mar 24, 2021)

There are beacons several light years out warning of the crazy primates on the third world from Sol.
We are the New Jersey of the Milky Way.


----------



## Mr Natural (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > We’re either alone or we’re not.
> ...


Those are only the ones in our solar system. There’s billions of planets out there.


----------



## JLW (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


Lol.. I agree with you. We only inhabit one planet;  however, you would think anti-environmental lunatics like yourself would have second thoughts about trashing this planet, but alas you could care less...so stop ya bitching.


----------



## Moonglow (Mar 24, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Mac1958 said:
> 
> 
> > we don't have to accept that.
> ...


So God has no idea what the future looks like in Revelations?


----------



## Mac1958 (Mar 24, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> Those are only the ones in our solar system. There’s billions of planets out there.


Trillions.  And even more moons!


----------



## ReinyDays (Mar 24, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Ah ,yes. But there are very likely planets of other stars within the melting and boiling point of H2O. Where life CAN exist.



Agreed ... but will the life we find there allow us to join? ... _c.f._ H.G. Wells' _War of the Worlds_ ...


----------



## Moonglow (Mar 24, 2021)




----------



## San Souci (Mar 24, 2021)

ReinyDays said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Ah ,yes. But there are very likely planets of other stars within the melting and boiling point of H2O. Where life CAN exist.
> ...


That depends. Will we get to THEM first? Or will THEY get HERE first?


----------



## ReinyDays (Mar 24, 2021)

San Souci said:


> That depends. Will we get to THEM first? Or will THEY get HERE first?



Depends on who gets hungry first ... but "getting there" has some problems, Einstein could be right after all ...


----------



## San Souci (Mar 24, 2021)

ReinyDays said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > That depends. Will we get to THEM first? Or will THEY get HERE first?
> ...


Only one way to find out. Develop a constant boost Fusion engine. Reach "C". And then double the boost power.


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


I am a numbers man.  I figure out the odds.  Lets say that in this solar system there is one planet that supports life.  Earth.  Now how many solar systems are there in this galaxy called the milky way?  So in the 200 billion stars of the milky way, the odds say there could be other life supporting planets.  Now multiply how many galaxies there are in the universe, there must be another planet similar to ours, why else do we get visitors from other than Earth?   Of course these visitors look at what is going on, shake their heads at how stupid the left is, and figures that we will end up killing ourselves so they stay out of reach.  


Our *solar* *system* is located in the outer reaches of the *Milky* *Way* Galaxy, which is a spiral galaxy. The *Milky* *Way* Galaxy contains roughly 200 billion stars. Most of these stars are not visible from Earth. Almost everything that we can see in the sky belongs to the *Milky* *Way* Galaxy.
*The Milky Way Galaxy - Zoom Astronomy*

www.enchantedlearning.com/subjects/astronomy/solarsystem/where.shtml


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Mar 24, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


Who says there isnt a God?  Who made the universe?


----------



## Concerned American (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


Mars.


----------



## ReinyDays (Mar 24, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Only one way to find out. Develop a constant boost Fusion engine. Reach "C". And then double the boost power.



If fusion could do this, then stars wouldn't be stable ... we'll need at least a pair instability engine ...


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Mar 24, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


It will take Man Made Terraforming to get Mars livable for humans.  But out in our universe there has to be another planet 3rd from the sun, Oxygen/Nitrogen atmosphere, and plenty of water.. The odds say so...


----------



## ReinyDays (Mar 24, 2021)

andaronjim said:


> ... Oxygen/Nitrogen atmosphere ...



Not without life evolving first ...


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 24, 2021)

andaronjim said:


> Concerned American said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


If it existed, you could never get there.
At the speed of light, it would take you 45 minutes to get to Jupiter (from the sun). 5 hours to get to pluto (I think). 4 1/2 years to the nearest star.  You can never get to the speed of light, and if you could, you'd have to accelerate and de-accelerate.  It takes INFINITE energy to get a mass to the speed of light, meaning more energy than is contained in the universe.

All planets, that we know of, are MUCH more dangerous to humans than the vacuum of space.

There is no other home for Man


----------



## Concerned American (Mar 24, 2021)

andaronjim said:


> Concerned American said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


No argument here.  However, with the discovery of water? on Mars, I believe it would be a stop-gap measure as the planet becomes more over-crowded.  I think covid was one of those stop-gap measures.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 24, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


You didn't watch the video.

I know it looks like Arizona, but it is a DEADLY planet to humans.


----------



## Concerned American (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> andaronjim said:
> 
> 
> > Concerned American said:
> ...


Isn't the sun the nearest star?  If so we are only 20 minutes to the nearest star, give or take.


----------



## Unkotare (Mar 24, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> We’re either alone or we’re not.
> 
> Both ideas are equally disturbing.


Why?


----------



## petro (Mar 24, 2021)

We just need the Devil's Anus...




Looking to expand upon the work of Schwarszchild and other scientists seeking solutions to GR, they proposed the *possible* existence of "*bridges*" between two distant points in space time (known as "*Einstein*–*Rosen bridges*" or "wormholes") that could theoretically allow for matter and objects to pass between them.

Simple.
A few solar panels should do it.


----------



## ReinyDays (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> You didn't watch the video.
> I know it looks like Arizona, but it is a DEADLY planet to humans.



Mars has a trivial magnetic field ... her surface is subject to the full fury of solar radiation ... nasty stuff ... any biology there will have to be shielded at all times ...


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 24, 2021)

ReinyDays said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > You didn't watch the video.
> ...


Not to mention the near vacuum and colder than our poles, plus the winds and the poisonous soil where nothing can grow.


----------



## Unkotare (Mar 24, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Concerned American said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


Shouldn't the title of this thread be "Don't Walk Around on Venus"?

It's kinda like the ladies hygiene aisle in the drug store. You know it's there, but you want to avoid it.


----------



## Mac-7 (Mar 24, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Huh? Isn't that pretty much the definition of the Bible?


Its what real Christians believe

Godless libs on the other hand dont believe that


----------



## Mac-7 (Mar 24, 2021)

Moonglow said:


> So God has no idea what the future looks like in Revelations?


What makes you ask a dumb question like that?

God tells us what will happen


----------



## Mac1958 (Mar 25, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Mac1958 said:
> 
> 
> > Huh? Isn't that pretty much the definition of the Bible?
> ...


Well, one of these days I'll have a conversation with a real Christian about that.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 25, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


Do you realize how vast the universe is?


----------



## Quasar44 (Mar 25, 2021)

Wow are you so myopic and provincial 

There are trillions of planets and many many earths


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 25, 2021)

petro said:


> "*Einstein*–*Rosen bridges*" or "wormholes"


This is a viable probability, especially if there are 4th and/or more spatial dimensions.
...
A *wormhole * (or *Einstein–Rosen bridge* or *Einstein–Rosen wormhole*) is a speculative structure linking disparate points in spacetime, and is based on a special solution of the Einstein field equations.

A wormhole can be visualized as a tunnel with two ends at separate points in spacetime (i.e., different locations, or different points in time, or both).

Wormholes are consistent with the general theory of relativity by Einstein, but whether wormholes actually exist remains to be seen. Many scientists postulate that wormholes are merely projections of a fourth spatial dimension, analogous to how a two-dimensional (2D) being could experience only part of a three-dimensional (3D) object.[1]

A wormhole could connect extremely long distances such as a billion light years or more, short distances such as a few meters, different universes, or different points in time.[2]
...








						Wormhole - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
*What Is Wormhole Theory?*








						What is a Wormhole?
					

Maths has predicted wormholes, but for now these bridges through space-time remain hypothetical




					www.space.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
*The Einstein-Rosen Bridge*




__





						The Einstein-Rosen Bridge
					






					i4is.org
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*A new ‘Einstein’ equation suggests wormholes hold key to quantum gravity*
*                    ER=EPR summarizes new clues to understanding entanglement and spacetime                *









						A new ‘Einstein’ equation suggests wormholes hold the key to quantum gravity
					

A new Einsteinian equation, ER=EPR, may be the clue physicists need to merge quantum mechanics with general relativity.




					www.sciencenews.org


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 25, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


There may not be another world in the solar system for humankind, without doing some special habitat constructions and/or eventual terra-forming; but that's quite a leap to say such applies to the rest of the universe.  Though not every star with planets may have an Earth like one orbiting it, there could still be hundreds to thousands or more "Earths" just in our own galaxy(Milky Way). 

As for 'God' and creating; that in another post.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 25, 2021)

petro said:


> We just need the Devil's Anus...
> View attachment 471918
> Looking to expand upon the work of Schwarszchild and other scientists seeking solutions to GR, they proposed the *possible* existence of "*bridges*" between two distant points in space time (known as "*Einstein*–*Rosen bridges*" or "wormholes") that could theoretically allow for matter and objects to pass between them.
> 
> ...


Another concept or similar one is the "warping" of space, or "discontinuity window" approach.




__





						What Is A Space Warp? | Warp Drive Possible
					

In this article we explore what is a space warp and how a warp drive would work. In effect space warp allows you to distort space-time, travel beyond light.




					warpdrivepossible.com
				



Images page;




__





						space warping at DuckDuckGo
					

DuckDuckGo. Privacy, Simplified.




					duckduckgo.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~
*Is NASA Actually Working On a Warp Drive?*

Hyperspace, here we come!








						Is NASA Actually Working On a Warp Drive?
					

Hyperspace, here we come!




					www.popularmechanics.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
*Is Warp Drive Real?*








						Is Warp Drive Real?
					

Ever since the sound barrier was broken, people have turned their attention to how we can break the light speed barrier.




					www.nasa.gov
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


*The Tau Zero Foundation

 Pioneering
 Interstellar Flight*
A coalition of researchers, educators, makers, and visionaries who pioneer bridge-building methods, develop solutions, and inspire us all toward interstellar flight.
...




__





						Pioneering Interstellar Flight - Tau Zero Foundation
					






					tauzero.aero


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 25, 2021)

There's also the decades old concept of building colonies(cities) in space.

Interviews from the Vault  October 12, 2017
*Gerard K. O’Neill on Space Colonies
...*
*Editor’s note: Gerard K. O’Neill pioneered the idea of human colonies in space. He conceived of human civilization throughout the solar system and said that by 2050, 200 million people could be living in habitats beyond the Earth, offering humanity a viable plan B. That date looks pretty unlikely now, but O’Neill’s ideas may still provide the blueprint for the future of humans in space.
by Monte Davis*

Ever since Christopher Columbus made the rounds of potential royal backers, the exploration of new worlds has required as much persuasive salesmanship as it has intrepid navigation. Few men in that tradition have been as articulate as Professor Gerard K. O’Neill, a high-energy physicist who was a prominent advocate of human colonies in space.

In both scientific and popular articles, in lectures and on television, and in his successful books The High Frontier and 2081, O’Neill argued that the unlimited energy and materials of space could make possible a new and attractive life for millions of people. In his view, the established practice of launching costly chemical rockets would be replaced as soon by permanent habitation and large-scale manufacturing in space. What’s more, while his predecessors advocated metal-walled, compartmentalized “space stations,” O’Neill envisioned colonies that resembled the earth, with soil, greenery, even blue sky, sunshine, and clouds.

The concept behind O’Neill’s space colonies — that there’s more potential energy in high orbit than on earth — was elegantly simple. His first contribution to science came in 1956, when, as a 29-year-old physics instructor at Princeton, he worked on a new proton accelerator, a machine that made accelerating protons collide, permitting physicists to study the quirks of subatomic particles. Until that time, it was felt that particles had to accelerate and collide within the same chamber, a prerequisite that resulted in all sorts of design difficulties and expense. O’Neill’s “simple” solution? To have subatomic particles accelerate in one machine and collide in another. Though his skeptical colleagues challenged his ideas, O’Neill went on to design a “storage ring” that could store accelerated particles awaiting collision. Today, most subatomic particle accelerators are based on O’Neill’s storage ring concept.
...








						Gerard K. O’Neill on Space Colonies
					

By 2050, 200 million people could be living in habitats beyond the Earth, offering humanity a viable Plan B.




					omnimagazine.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~
*O’Neill colonies: A decades-long dream for settling space*
_Amazon's Jeff Bezos, like many before him, is enamored with the idea of spinning space cities that might sustain future humans._
           By            Korey Haynes  |              Published: Friday, May 17, 2019
         RELATED TOPICS:          PRIVATE SPACEFLIGHT | CREWED MISSIONS



O’Neill colonies are an idea nearly as old as the space program, but they still hold value for the future.
NASA
Last week, Amazon founder Jeff Bezos revealed his spaceship company’s new lunar lander, dubbed Blue Moon, and he spelled out a bold and broad vision for humanity’s future in space. Faced with the limits of resources here on Earth, most fundamentally energy, he pointed to life in space as a solution.

“If we move out into the solar system, for all practical purposes, we have unlimited resources,” Bezos said. “We could have a trillion people out in the solar system.” And while colonies on other planets would be plagued by low gravity, long distances to Earth (leading to communication delays), and further limits down the road, those weaknesses are avoided if the colonies remain truly in space.

To that end, Bezos instead suggested people consider taking up residence in O’Neill colonies, a futuristic concept for space settlements first dreamed up decades ago. “These are very large structures, miles on end, and they hold a million people or more each.”
...








						O’Neill colonies: A decades-long dream for settling space
					

To fast-track human spaceflight, Amazon founder Jeff Bezos suggests people consider taking up residence in O’Neill colonies, a futuristic concept for space settlements first dreamed up decades ago.



					astronomy.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~

The *O'Neill cylinder* (also called an *O'Neill colony*) is a space settlement concept proposed by American physicist Gerard K. O'Neill in his 1976 book _The High Frontier: Human Colonies in Space_.[1] O'Neill proposed the colonization of space for the 21st century, using materials extracted from the Moon and later from asteroids.[2]

An O'Neill cylinder would consist of two counter-rotating cylinders. The cylinders would rotate in opposite directions in order to cancel out any gyroscopic effects that would otherwise make it difficult to keep them aimed toward the Sun. Each would be 5 miles (8.0 km) in diameter and 20 miles (32 km) long, connected at each end by a rod via a bearing system. Their rotation would provide artificial gravity.[1]
...








						O'Neill cylinder - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Page of images;




__





						O'neill and cities in space at DuckDuckGo
					

DuckDuckGo. Privacy, Simplified.




					duckduckgo.com


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.


This does not belong on the science section.


----------



## The Irish Ram (Mar 26, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...



He created them and can call the stars by name.  All of them.  
He created Earth and seeded it.  He is the not so elusive alien that we keep searching for...


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 26, 2021)

Stryder50 said:


> There's also the decades old concept of building colonies(cities) in space.
> 
> Interviews from the Vault  October 12, 2017
> *Gerard K. O’Neill on Space Colonies
> ...



I USED TO love this stuff, but it can never happen.

Tell me how much fuel it would take to move this much material from the earth, into space. Then tell me how much fuel it would take to move this city and countryside and millions of gallons of water to escape velocity (7 miles per second) to escape earth orbit. And to leave the solar system you have to beat the sun's escape velocity (382 miles per second)

These are DREAMS. They're fun to theorize over, but it ain't possible


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Stryder50 said:
> 
> 
> > There's also the decades old concept of building colonies(cities) in space.
> ...


I doesn't all have to come from Earth.  Much could come from the Moon or asteroids steered to Earth's orbit.  In fact hollowing out interior chambers in a large asteroid to make habitat, and use the asteroid for the raw materials needed, are one of the options that has been kicked around.

For that matter, such has been speculated with regard to Saturn's moon Iapetus.  Hitch is it wasn't likely done by we humans, or the present era anyway;




__





						A Moon with a View - Part One
					





					www.enterprisemissions.com
				



(First of a six part series of long articles)
See also;




__





						Iapetus - Moon with a View: Or, What Did Arthur Know … and When Did He  Know it?
					





					www.bibliotecapleyades.net
				



&




__





						Iapetus
					





					www.bibliotecapleyades.net
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~
Also, the future may hold new solutions to leaving Earth's gravity well, such as effective zero point energy systems.


----------



## there4eyeM (Mar 26, 2021)

It is fascinating to think and talk about, but another place for humans to live other than Earth is at least as fantastic as to discuss life after death, etc. It is as as likely (and perhaps more than) that there is paradise as that there is another planet that we could get to that would be habitable.


----------



## there4eyeM (Mar 26, 2021)

The Irish Ram said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


Many identify the deity you describe as being extraterrestrial.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 26, 2021)

there4eyeM said:


> The Irish Ram said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...


He is, but he exists outside of the universe we live in


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe




The only life  in the universe is on Earth.  End of discussion.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 26, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


Only applies to you and those of similar mindsets. In which case, just pass on by and don't bother to participate.

Others of us are on the other side of this coin, having already 'been there-done that' so to speak.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 26, 2021)

Before signing off for the next couple of days, this thread seems the best current one for this;
*Fossil Discoveries Challenge Ideas About Earth’s Start*
*A series of fossil finds suggests that life on Earth started earlier than anyone thought, calling into question a widely held theory of the solar system’s beginnings.*
...








						Fossil Discoveries Challenge Ideas About Earth’s Start
					

A series of fossil finds suggests that life on Earth started earlier than anyone thought, calling into question a widely held theory of the solar system’s beginnings.




					getpocket.com


----------



## Crepitus (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


How do you know?


----------



## Dogmaphobe (Mar 26, 2021)

God is such a tease.   He says the same thing to ALL the worlds.   

It makes them all feel special.


----------



## james bond (Mar 26, 2021)

I'd pay to watch closed circuit tv of the naysayers go to Mars, for example, to live there.


----------



## james bond (Mar 26, 2021)

ReinyDays said:


> If fusion could do this, then stars wouldn't be stable ... we'll need at least a pair instability engine ...



Yak, yak, yak, yak...



ReinyDays said:


> Not without life evolving first ...


----------



## james bond (Mar 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Do you realize how vast the universe is?



Just to show us how special Earth is (used to be heaven before the sin).


----------



## miketx (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > We’re either alone or we’re not.
> ...


We have only encountered a fraction of a fraction of .0000000000000000001 of the planets out there. There have to be earth like planets just based on odds alone.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 26, 2021)

miketx said:


> There have to be earth like planets just based on odds alone.


Nope.  They are all nightmare worlds where no life can survive.  But IF there were, how are you going to get there? Star Trek, Star Wars and Buck Roger's are FANTASY.   The distances make travel between worlds impossible.  It's  NOTHING like a trip across the Atlantic

God created the universe so that the earth is forever our "prison."  We will never escape UNTIL we are Resurrected to be like He is


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Nope. They are all nightmare worlds where no life can survive.


You don't have a shred of evidence or argument for this lie.


----------



## miketx (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> miketx said:
> 
> 
> > There have to be earth like planets just based on odds alone.
> ...


Don't know how they would get there but there are a lot of planets.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 26, 2021)

Stryder50 said:


> Others of us are on the other side of this coin, having already 'been there-done that' so to speak.


The only life in the universe is on Earth.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 26, 2021)

EXCERPTS:
*The Space Telescope That Could Find a Second Earth*
*What will it take to capture images of a distant world capable of harboring life?*
...
For all the excitement surrounding the search for distant exoplanets in recent years, the 4,000-plus planets confirmed so far have been unseen actors on the cosmic stage. Except for a handful of very large bodies imaged by ground-based telescopes, virtually all exoplanets have been detected only when they briefly dim the light coming from their host stars or when their gravity causes the star to wobble in a distinctive way. Observing these patterns and using a few other methods, scientists can determine an exoplanet’s orbit, radius, mass, and sometimes density—but not much else. The planets remain, in the words of one researcher in the field, “small black shadows.”

Scientists want much more. They’d like to know in detail the chemical makeup of the planets’ atmospheres, whether liquid water might be present on their surfaces, and, ultimately, whether these worlds might be hospitable to life.

Answering those questions will require space telescopes that don’t yet exist. To determine what kinds of telescopes, NASA commissioned two major studies that have taken large teams of (mostly volunteer) scientists and engineers four years to complete. The results are now under review by the National Academy of Sciences, as part of its Decadal Survey for Astronomy and Astrophysics that will recommend government funding priorities for the 2030s. Past and current NASA mega-projects, from the Hubble Space Telescope launched in 1990 to the James Webb Space Telescope, which is scheduled for launch this year, have all gone through this same vetting process. Sometime this spring, the Decadal Survey is expected to wrap up its deliberations and make recommendations.

That puts four proposals in the running to become NASA’s next “Great Observatory” in space: an X-ray telescope called Lynx; the Origins Space Telescope for studying the early universe; and two telescopes devoted mostly, but not exclusively, to exoplanets. One is called HabEx, for Habitable Exoplanet Observatory. The other—the most ambitious, most complex, most expensive, and most revolutionary of all these concepts—is called LUVOIR, for Large UV/Optical/IR Surveyor.

If scientists really want to find out if life exists on distant Earth-like planets, they’ll eventually need LUVOIR—or something very much like it.

The LUVOIR concept study (published in 2019 as an illustrated, 426-page report) calls for a massive telescope mirror as big as 15 meters, almost 50 feet, in diameter. That would be six times larger than the Hubble Space Telescope mirror and more than twice the size of the 6.5-meter Webb telescope. The most ambitious version of LUVOIR would have a mirror as big as a carnival Ferris wheel.
...
Direct imaging of such a faint target also requires certain technical innovations, most critically a powerful coronagraph—a screen to block out the blinding light of the planet’s host star. Inside the coronagraph instrument, an advanced imaging camera is needed to detect small, rocky planets like our own. Then a highly sensitive spectrograph is required to identify elements like oxygen or methane in a planet’s atmosphere that might suggest the presence of life.

The LUVOIR study team concluded in its final report that the deluxe version of the observatory—as opposed to a scaled-down option that reduces the mirror size almost by half—could identify and study 54 potentially Earth-like planets over a five-year observing period, along with hundreds of larger planets.

This estimate comes from matching the telescope’s technical specifications against the number of small, rocky exoplanets predicted to exist in our celestial neighborhood based on data from NASA’s Kepler survey mission of the last decade. Key to reaching the 54-planet goal will be LUVOIR’s internal coronagraph and the large size of the telescope itself, which has 40 times the light-gathering power of Hubble and can capture images much more quickly.
...
Had LUVOIR been proposed a decade ago, it would have been something of a fishing expedition. Today scientists are much more confident it will produce solid results. “What’s new and exciting is that, for the first time, we have major proposals to the Decadal [Survey] in the context of knowing for sure that there are Earth-size planets that get Earth-type energy from their suns in our relatively near neighborhood,” says Shawn Domagal-Goldman, a NASA astrobiologist who is the deputy study scientist for LUVOIR. “This is the first generation of concepts to incorporate that understanding and make it a central part of their science case.”
...
“When you compare the planet brightness in two wavelengths, you get a color. That’s basically how your eye works,” says Aki Roberge, LUVOIR study scientist and an astrophysicist at NASA’s Goddard Space Flight Center. “So when we say we’ll measure the colors of planets, we really do mean the reflected blue, green, red that you could see with your eyes. In addition, we’ll measure colors outside of the range of light your eye can see.”

The planets will be “unresolved” in LUVOIR images, Roberge cautions. With only a few pixels total, they’ll still appear as fuzzy dots without surface features. “However,” she says, “there are ways to pull out information on surface features without actually resolving the planet. For most habitable planet candidates, we’ll be able to see their brightness vary as they rotate and find the lengths of the planets’ days. And if you look at the variation in more than one wavelength, you can probably decompose the variation into total fractions of land, oceans, and clouds. Seeing seasonal changes in planet brightness or color is probably possible too.”

Scientists will be able to read the contents of exoplanet atmospheres as never before with the Extreme Coronagraph for Living Planetary Systems (ECLIPS), which will be able to detect compounds such as oxygen, ozone, water vapor, carbon dioxide, and methane that could be biosignatures. Neither Hubble nor JWST can do that for Earth-like planets orbiting sun-like stars, so LUVOIR represents an important new capability for astrobiology.
...
That diversity may be key to understanding planetary habitability, she believes. “Let’s say we look at a bunch of planets we assume to be similar—maybe five rocky planets that are the same Earth size and same temperature—and we see very different atmospheres. This tells us a lot more than by looking at one planet alone.”
...
That difference has major scientific implications. The larger the number of habitable planet candidates studied, the better we’ll determine whether our own planet is common or rare, while increasing the chances of finding extraterrestrial life. This is a major reason why LUVOIR-A’s ability to find so many small, faint exoplanets has such appeal. Still, it would surprise no one if Congress and NASA—should LUVOIR get the nod—were to decide on the economy version.
...





...
For now, LUVOIR-A is about the biggest space telescope we can build. Its 15.1-meter mirror is the maximum size able to fit inside the next generation of heavy-lift rockets, whether it’s NASA’s Space Launch System or the SpaceX Starship. Folded up inside the rocket at launch, the observatory would be sent out into cold, dark space, away from Earth’s warmth and brightness, to a gravitationally stable spot called Lagrange Point 2.

The notion of sending up LUVOIR-A in pieces, to be assembled later in space, has been presented to the Decadal Survey, although the panel traditionally makes recommendations based on science return rather than how a project should be executed. With in-space assembly, NASA could in theory put together a mirror larger—maybe much larger—than 15 meters. Back in the mid-2010s, then-NASA science chief (and three-time Hubble repairman) John Grunsfeld proposed that astronauts working in deep space could reasonably do the job. NASA commissioned a study of in-space assembly of large observatories in 2018, but the conclusion was that Grunsfeld’s astronaut construction crew was not feasible now and that robotic assembly would be better.

Nick Siegler, chief technologist for NASA’s Exoplanet Exploration Program at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory and a leader of the in-space assembly study, said its 2019 report concluded that in-space assembly will be necessary as observatories get ever larger. It would even lower mission risk. Complex, autonomous self-deployments would no longer be necessary, and since the pieces go up on different rockets, the possibility of one failed launch killing the entire project is eliminated. Siegler says in-space assembly by robots could cost about as much as a single launch in a heavy-lift rocket, possibly less if you factor in servicing. The in-space assembly team has sent a white paper to the Decadal Survey panel, in case LUVOIR gets its stamp of approval.
...




...








						The Space Telescope That Could Find a Second Earth
					

What will it take to capture images of a distant world capable of harboring life?




					www.airspacemag.com
				




Red highlighting my doing, for emphasis.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 26, 2021)

*The Case for Past Life on Mars Gets Stronger *
*But how much evidence is needed until we can say there’s proof?*
...
In a new paper published in the _International Journal of Astrobiology_, Vincenzo Rizzo from the National Research Center in Cosenza, Italy, asks a provocative question: Why are many scientists reluctant to accept the use of geological methods to identify biological processes on Mars, when those methods are commonly used on Earth? 

He points to a case in Germany from 1908, when a scientist by the name of Ernst Kalkowsky proposed that layered mounds, columns, and sheet-like sedimentary rocks called stromatolites were of biological nature. His contemporaries did not believe him. But Kalkowsky was later proven correct, when it was recognized that stromatolites formed because biofilms—composed of cyanobacteria and other microorganisms—trapped sediments. Stromatolites are now known to be the oldest evidence for life on Earth, stretching back at least 3.5 billion years, and they still exist in some remote regions, such as Shark Bay, Australia.

In his paper Rizzo follows in Kalkowsky’s footsteps by analyzing images from the _Spirit, Opportunity_, and _Curiosity_ rovers on Mars that indicate the presence of biotic macrostructures such as stromatolites. He suggests that if no non-biological explanation can be found, the images should be considered as possible candidates for Martian stromatolites. Rizzo shows many examples of structures that have an amazing resemblance to stromatolites on Earth.
...








						The Case for Past Life on Mars Gets Stronger
					

But how much evidence is needed until we can say there’s proof?




					www.airspacemag.com


----------



## Hollie (Mar 26, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Stryder50 said:
> 
> 
> > Others of us are on the other side of this coin, having already 'been there-done that' so to speak.
> ...



“... because I say so”.

Yep. The discovery of life elsewhere, off of this planet is a traumatic stress induced for the hyper-religious.


----------



## The Irish Ram (Mar 26, 2021)

there4eyeM said:


> The Irish Ram said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...


He is absolutely extraterrestrial, and extra-dimensional.  He told us about dimensions a long time before Einstein and Hawking started finding them.  He is the Father of Physics, Master Creator and the Grand Master of Science.  And a loving, forgiving Father.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 26, 2021)

Hollie said:


> Yep. The discovery of life elsewhere, off of this planet is a traumatic stress induced for the hyper-religious.


Did I miss it? We discovered life somewhere in the universe?  Can you provide a link?


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 26, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Hollie said:
> 
> 
> > Yep. The discovery of life elsewhere, off of this planet is a traumatic stress induced for the hyper-religious.
> ...


Obviously he is talking about the idea of it. I don't think you belong in this section.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 26, 2021)

Stryder50 said:


> Only applies to you and those of similar mindsets. In which case, just pass on by and don't bother to participate.
> 
> Others of us are on the other side of this coin, having already 'been there-done that' so to speak.



What mindset would that be?


----------



## ReinyDays (Mar 26, 2021)

james bond said:


> ReinyDays said:
> 
> 
> > If fusion could do this, then stars wouldn't be stable ... we'll need at least a pair instability engine ...
> ...



Incoherent baby-talk? ...


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 27, 2021)

james bond said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Do you realize how vast the universe is?
> ...


It's probably not that special.


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Mac1958 said:
> 
> 
> > we don't have to accept that.
> ...


Well, that's bullshit. Many liberals are Christian. Besides, where in the Bible does it say that nowhere else in God's creation is there life or habitable planets? The universe is vast beyond comprehension.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Mac-7 said:
> 
> 
> > Mac1958 said:
> ...


NO liberal is a Christian.
The Bible isnt a science textbook. It is God's instruction manual for Mankind.

Let us know when you actually find life outside the earth.  You wont, but keep looking.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Well, that's bullshit. Many liberals are Christian. Besides, where in the Bible does it say that nowhere else in God's creation is there life or habitable planets? The universe is vast beyond comprehension.



I don't see any theological or scientific reason to believe that extraterrestrial life exists in the universe.


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Mac-7 said:
> ...


Who died and made you the arbiter of who is and isn't a Christian? Over 75% of Democratic politicians identify as Christian including the President. Several are ordained ministers. Whether or not they or the repugs claiming to be Christian actually hold these beliefs is between them and God.

As you say, the Bible isn't a science text. Doesn't stop you from spouting crap that you have no way of knowing is true or not.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Who died and made you the arbiter of who is and isn't a Christian? Over 75% of Democratic politicians identify as Christian including the President. Several are ordained ministers. Whether or not they or the repugs claiming to be Christian actually hold these beliefs is between them and God.
> 
> As you say, the Bible isn't a science text. Doesn't stop you from spouting crap that you have no way of knowing is true or not.



Supporters of infanticide are not Christians.  Yeah.  I said it.


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Who died and made you the arbiter of who is and isn't a Christian? Over 75% of Democratic politicians identify as Christian including the President. Several are ordained ministers. Whether or not they or the repugs claiming to be Christian actually hold these beliefs is between them and God.
> ...


_Blessed_ shall _he_ be who takes your _little ones_ and _dashes_ them against the rock!
‎Psalm 137:9


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 27, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> NO liberal is a Christian.


Freak


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > Borillar said:
> ...




Typical.  You don't grasp the historical, moral or literary context:  What does Psalm 137:9 mean when it says, “Happy is the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks”? | GotQuestions.org


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


There are numerous instances in the Bible where entire cities are laid waste, killing all to the last man, woman, and child. Pretty sure there were a few pregnant women in those cities too. Perhaps you can point to a few verses where fetuses are held as sacred as you pro-birthers think they should be.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > Borillar said:
> ...


The Bible gawd really is a nasty little character. Toddlers have better morals.


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


It's pretty much the same in most primitive cultures. Man creates a "god" or "gods" in his own image - heartless, cruel, demanding, and vengeful.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > Borillar said:
> ...



You're the baby killer, not I.


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


How is that? I've never had an abortion. I've never performed an abortion. I've never counseled anyone into getting an abortion. I am for sex education in schools, programs and charities that help indigent mothers and expectant mothers, children, and orphans. I have adopted, raised, and supported two children along with my own. Can you pro-birthers say the same?


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Who died and made you the arbiter of who is and isn't a Christian? Over 75% of Democratic politicians identify as Christian


"By their fruits you shall know them" -- Jesus

Scripture defines homosexuality as a great EVIL -- an ABOMINATION 

Intentionally murdering your child is another great evil.

No, liberals are of their father the devil


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > Borillar said:
> ...


Another twisting of scripture. Try to read the scriptures around it with an open mind and understand the CONTEXT.


----------



## james bond (Mar 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> james bond said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...



Can we just kick you to the moon or Mars?

The Earth is corrupted now, but still has its beauty and complexity.


----------



## james bond (Mar 27, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > NO liberal is a Christian.
> ...



A liberal Christian is someone who is saved.  Not you tho.  

I don't think she's not necessarily a freak.


----------



## james bond (Mar 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> james bond said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...



This is where we go our separate ways.


----------



## Borillar (Mar 27, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Who died and made you the arbiter of who is and isn't a Christian? Over 75% of Democratic politicians identify as Christian
> ...


Scripture calls eating lobster an abomination. Scripture defines adultery as an abomination - doesn't stop you from supporting serial adulterer Trump.

You're just another buffet Christian, like most repugs.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 27, 2021)

Borillar said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Borillar said:
> ...


I dont eat lobster.

I've noticed that anti-Gods dont understand the concept of redemption.  Trump, unlike Bill Clinton, didnt receive BJs from a young woman in the White House.

There is a difference between one currently living in sin and someone who has repented of his sins

But I understand there is no redemption if you dont agree with Democrats


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 28, 2021)

james bond said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > james bond said:
> ...



There are probably billions if not trillions of planets that are similar to earth


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 28, 2021)

james bond said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > james bond said:
> ...


were we ever going the same way?


----------



## james bond (Mar 28, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> There are probably billions if not trillions of planets that are similar to earth



Yours is swag.

It's not valid according to the evidence.



Blues Man said:


> were we ever going the same way?



I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, but what direction you go is your choice.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 28, 2021)

james bond said:


> A liberal Christian is someone who is saved. Not you tho.


Sure I am. I have been saved from a life of believing in utter, magical nonsense by a scientific education and by having faculties of reason. I could save you, too.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 29, 2021)

james bond said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > There are probably billions if not trillions of planets that are similar to earth
> ...


what evidence.

We don't know anything about every solar system in every galaxy.

Hell we don't even know that much about our own solar system


----------



## westwall (Mar 29, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe









Why?  Why could God only choose one group?  400 billion stars in this galaxy alone.  I think that if there is a God, that entity probably has lots of life forms seeded throughout the universe.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 29, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Hell we don't even know that much about our own solar system


We know that the earth is unique among all the planets and moons in the solar system.

Each of them will kill you in an instant.  They are all worse than the cold vacuum of space.

Besides, it is physically IMPOSSIBLE to get to any place outside the solar system. But believe your science fiction theories if it makes you happy.

I'll wait until God makes me like He is as the Scripture promise


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Besides, it is physically IMPOSSIBLE to get to any place outside the solar system.


False. This is the science sectiion. If you feel like making stuff up, head to the religion section.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Besides, it is physically IMPOSSIBLE to get to any place outside the solar system.
> ...


False?  I don't believe it is practicably possible.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


 A nonstop flight from new york to florida was not "practicably possible" in 1850. This is what i mean.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...


Not quite the same scale or difficulty as traveling to another star.  That's pie in the sky thinking.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> Not quite the same scale or difficulty as traveling to another star.



That's not any argument for it being impossible. We already have the knowledge and the resources to send objects to other star systems. The trick would be keeping people alive for the trip. Several objects travelling together might accomplish that.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 29, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> james bond said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...


According to an article in most recent issue of "Air & Space" magazine, about 54 just within a few hundred light years of here.  Give or take.  That's just our little corner of this galaxy.


----------



## Flopper (Mar 29, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> We’re either alone or we’re not.
> 
> Both ideas are equally disturbing.


Due the size of Universe compared to the distance man might travel and the life span of the universe compared to the likely life span of humanity, it seems unlikely man will every meet other intelligent life.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Not quite the same scale or difficulty as traveling to another star.
> ...


And you think I believe in magic.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

Flopper said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > We’re either alone or we’re not.
> ...


Unless we can harness the energy to fold space and bring distant points to us.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> And you think I believe in magic.


Nobody cares.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > And you think I believe in magic.
> ...


Which is the exact same amount of people that will ever leave our solar system.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> Which is the exact same amount of people that will ever leave our solar system.


Shaman ding has spoken!


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Flopper said:
> 
> 
> > Mr Clean said:
> ...


Or we could just teleport ourselves there.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Which is the exact same amount of people that will ever leave our solar system.
> ...


You have been watching too much science fiction.  But you may be right, let me get into my flying car and zip on over to NASA and see what my buddy who works there thinks.


----------



## Deplorable Yankee (Mar 29, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


Non sense 

Can't be just us out here


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> Or we could just teleport ourselves there.


Not much difference. A rose by any other name...


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> You have been watching too much science fiction


Said everyone to the wright brothers.... Of course, they probably said "read", not "watch". Second, i made no claim we would ever harness the energy to fold space. So you are arguing against a person who does not exist.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Beam me up, Scottie.  ~ Fort Fun Indiana


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > You have been watching too much science fiction
> ...


Seriously, this is orders of magnitude beyond flight.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

Deplorable Yankee said:


> Non sense
> 
> Can't be just us out here


It seems all but certain that life has formed elsewhere in our universe, at some point. The odds of it happening exactly once seem prohibitive.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> Seriously, this is orders of magnitude beyond flight.


"This is orders of magnitude beyond riding horseback"


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Seriously, this is orders of magnitude beyond flight.
> ...


The only people who "believe" this is feasible are the people who will get paid money for "believing" it and the dupes they convince to fund it.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

ding said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...


Haha, you always think talking about other people makes a relevant point in science topics. It's so weird. Did you ask those people what their credentials are?


----------



## Flash (Mar 29, 2021)

The universe is a harsh, dangerous and sterile place.

Thank God we have our little jewel.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

Flash said:


> The universe is a harsh, dangerous and sterile place.


So is the vast majority of planet Earth (save for sterile).


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 29, 2021)

Deplorable Yankee said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


Of course it can be. We are living in a video game.

God created the universe for us.  He created US in His image.

Christ became HUMAN and died for OUR sins.

Do you think He is going from planet to planet dying endlessly?

The universe only exists for our sake.  When we become like He is, the universe will be ours, but not now. Not as flesh and blood


----------



## Flopper (Mar 29, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Mr Clean said:
> ...


The problem is both time and distance.  The known universe is about 93 billion light years across.  Man has reached a speed of 24,000 mph in space.  Traveling at that speed it would take man 28,000,000,000 years to cross the universe.  However, what may be even a bigger problem is the life span of humanity vs lifespan of the universe.  Assuming man somehow was able to travel at light speeds, he would likely find at best only evidence of long dead civilizations or microscopic life that someday might develop into intelligent life.





Must go now, it's time for Star Trek.


----------



## ding (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...


No.  I know they are credentialed.  But they are human too.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 29, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> False. This is the science sectiion. If you feel like making stuff up, head to the religion section


Science deals with what we KNOW.

I posted a video about what we KNOW about all other worlds.

Science doesnt KNOW a single habitable world outside our own


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

Flopper said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


Yep. Which is why Fermi's Paradox...isn't.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 29, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Science deals with what we KNOW



No. 
The chief goal of science is to learn things we do not yet know.


----------



## there4eyeM (Mar 30, 2021)

It takes at least as much imagination to believe we would encounter intelligent life in all the expanse of time and space as to believe in divine intervention. Both are far fetched for our little brains and logic. Both could be equally false. 
That doesn't mean that enormous surprises do not await us in regards to discovering what is 'behind the curtain'.


----------



## LuckyDuck (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


It's estimated that there could be as many as 300 million habitable planets in our galaxy alone.  In 2020, astronomers announced that they have identified 24 "super-habitable planets (planets deemed to be better than Earth).  The only thing preventing our going to them is that our technology hasn't reached the level whereby we could travel to them.  Given time, we might.
To just blanketly say that there is no other world in the solar system or universe comes from a complete ignorance of science.  I'm surprised that you aren't also saying that the Earth is flat and that we would fall off of it, if we were to reach the end of it.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > False. This is the science sectiion. If you feel like making stuff up, head to the religion section
> ...




We have been conditioned by 100 years of science fiction to believe that life exist beyond earth.  However, the only fact that science knows is that life exist only on earth.

When we look elsewhere all we see are environments hostile to life as we know it.


----------



## Death Angel (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> We have been conditioned by 100 years of science fiction to believe that life exist beyond earth


And that we can get there in minutes or hours instead of TENS OF THOUSANDS and MILLIONS of years.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> The universe is a harsh, dangerous and sterile place.
> 
> Thank God we have our little jewel.


And just how much of the universe have you explored to make such a statement?


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...


The knowledge we have of the entire universe and the trillions of solar systems that exist is less than infinitesimal.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > The universe is a harsh, dangerous and sterile place.
> ...




Just looking at the scientific facts.  Everything our astronomers shows us is pretty damn hostile.

People can be really confused about this things like this.  For instance, they look in the sky and say things like "look at all those stars, there must be other life".

However, 70% of the stars they see are Red Dwarfs.  Not only significantly cooler than our own sun but very very variable.  The temperature fluctuates significantly.  It is hard to have life when it is 70F one day and 370F the next day, isn't it? 

Radiation is a real killer for life.  Just look at Mars as an example.  Earth is protected from radiation because we have a tremendous molten iron core that generates a really powerful magnetic field.  That large iron core was created by a very happenstance event.  When Theta collided with the primordial earth merging two iron cores. 

Speaking of happenstance events our large moon is just as responsible for life as anything.  It has stabilized the earth to the point that life could evolve. 

May I suggest you read the book "Rare Earth"?  It describes all the happenstance events that led to life on earth.  It postulates that the happenstance events that created life on earth may be so unique that life (especially complex life) may only exist on earth. 










						Rare Earth: Why Complex Life Is Uncommon in the Universe - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				




Ward and Brownlee argue that the universe is fundamentally hostile to complex life and that while microbial life may be common in the universe, complex intelligent life (like the evolution of biological complexity from simple life on Earth) required an exceptionally unlikely set of circumstances, and therefore complex life is likely to be extremely rare. They argue that among the essential criteria for life are a terrestrial planet with plate tectonics and oxygen, a large moon, magnetic field, a gas giant like Jupiter for protection and an orbit in the habitable zone of the right kind of star. Additionally, events during the Earth's geological past such as Snowball Earth, the Cambrian Explosion, and the various mass extinction events that nearly destroyed life on Earth arguably make the existence and survival of complex life rare as well. They also suggest that animal life, having taken hundreds of millions of years to evolve, unlike bacteria, which were the first life to appear on Earth, is extremely fragile to sudden and severe changes in the environment, and therefore are very prone to becoming extinct very easily and quickly within a short period of geological time, while microbial life is much more resilient to such changes.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > We’re either alone or we’re not.
> ...


of course, that isnt true.
Did your god tell you to lie?


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Johnlaw said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


You AGW freaks dont care about trash. You care about power.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Borillar said:
> 
> 
> > Who died and made you the arbiter of who is and isn't a Christian? Over 75% of Democratic politicians identify as Christian including the President. Several are ordained ministers. Whether or not they or the repugs claiming to be Christian actually hold these beliefs is between them and God.
> ...


_Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, *children and infants*, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'"_


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


You do realize that everything astronomers show us is is the barest fraction of the entire universe and that the light that is bringing astronomers that information can be millions or billions of year old right?

There are an estimated 10 to the 24th power stars in the universe so to say that none of them have planets capable of supporting life as we know it or otherwise is a bold claim indeed.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




Just because there are a lot of stars don't mean there is any more life.  Chemistry is common all over the universe but turning chemistry into biology is a whole new ball game.

If the universe is finite there will be unique things in it.  Life on earth may be unique.

The problem we have assessing thing likes this is that we have only data point for life.  Until we get another data point we can't make an intelligent assumption.  Maybe one of these days we will get another data point but we are not there yet.

We can't even create life in the laboratory.   If life was so easy to be created elsewhere you would think that by now our scientists would have been able to create it in a test tube, wouldn't you?

There is a lot more to turning chemistry into biology than a rock planet, a Goldilocks zone and a little water.

I would love to know that the universe is teaming with life.  Hell, I would love to be able to screw a Green Orion Slave Girl like Cpt Kirk did but alas there is no proof they exist.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


And it doesn't mean there isn't.

Saying that you are 100% certain that no other solar system in the entire universe is capable of harboring life is ridiculous.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




I never said I am 100% certain there is no other life in the universe.

I said the only proof we have is that there is life on earth and when we observed the universe everything that we see seems to be hostile and sterile.

It is true that we don't see everything.

The science that we know now says that there has to be some very unique things to have have happen to create life elsewhere.  So unique that we can't even reproduce it in a Lab.

Right now science has said there is only life on earth.  The only thing that says life is elsewhere is 100 years of Science Fiction brainwashing and some mythical faith.

That may change in the future but that is all we have now.


----------



## there4eyeM (Mar 30, 2021)

Given the, to be very generous, 'modest' level of consciousness and ability to handle information on the part of the general human population, knowing about other habitable planets, and especially alien life, would undoubtedly be misused, misunderstood and result in even more problem. At best, this would only be another diversion from what should be given attention so that the life we do know can be maximized.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

I hope Mars Perseverance finds that Mars once had life. Im going to bump this thread and laugh.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

TNHarley said:


> I hope Mars Perseverance finds that Mars once had life. Im going to bump this thread and laugh.




...and if it doesn't?  Are you going to cry?


----------



## jbrownson0831 (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


Oh but I don't want to discourage any libbers who want to fly to Mars....in fact I support that wholeheartedly.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > I hope Mars Perseverance finds that Mars once had life. Im going to bump this thread and laugh.
> ...


I might!


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

I was once pretty much convinced that there was life elsewhere in the universe.  After all so many stars there just has to be life elsewhere, right?

However, the more I learn about science the more I am thinking that it is quite possible that the earth is unique.

Here is a great video about the chances of life elsewhere and why we might be alone.  The people at Cool Worlds are not religion nuts.  They are real astrophysicists and are dedicated to  science.  They are the leaders in the world in doing research to discover moons on exoplanets.

The analogy they use about the prisoners picking the locks is very relevant.  It was hard for the ones that didn't figure it out but it was easy for the lone one that did it.  We here on earth are that lone prisoner that picked the lock.  To us it was easy.  Since we have life on earth then we think it must be everywhere. However, the reality is that the lock was picked by sheer happenstance that may or not be repeated elsewhere.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...



Science also allows for what it doesn't know.  

And no serious scientist would ever say that there is no other life but ours in the universe especially since we actually know that the vastness of the universe prevents us from ever knowing the condition of every planet and whether or not those planets are capable of harboring life as we know it or otherwise.  

Like I said there are an estimated 1000000000000000000000000 stars in the universe so we really don't know anything about all those possible solar systems.


----------



## danielpalos (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe


The law of large numbers supports a hypothesis that there is at least one intelligent life form in every galaxy. Some galaxies may have more than one.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...



For all you, I and any scientist knows all 1000000000000000000000000 of the stars in the universe have sterile solar systems.

A scientist that says there is other life is talking out their ass.  They do not know.

You cannot make a valid statistical analysis with only one data point.  It is unscientific to do that.

If a scientist starts talking about the certainty of life out there then they are like the one prisoner in the Cool Worlds analogy that says it is easy because he hit the combination but ignores the fact that none of the other million prisoners hit the right combination.

Statistics will not turn chemistry into biology.  It takes a very precise set of happenstance events that may or may have been repeated elsewhere in the universe.

The only valid thing any scientist or anybody else can say is that we do not know there is life elsewhere.  Anything else is nothing more than speculation, not science.

Maybe one of these days we will get another data point and that will change everything.   Then we can start making valid statistical probabilities.  Until then we have nothing. Nada.  Zilch.

The other thing is that given the laws of physics we will probably never get out of our solar system.   We will probably never know.  We will probably die out as a species before we ever get any real proof.  Star trekking across the universe may be popular in fiction but we have no idea how to do it.

The best we can hope for is for the Mars probe to come back with some definitive proof that microbial life once existed on Mars.

Even if we create life in a test tube then that is no proof that the same conditions existed elsewhere for life to have been started on another planet.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...



exactly my point THEY DON'T KNOW.

So how do you know that our planet is the only one with life ?

The answer is you don't know.  Nobody knows.  So at least be honest enough to say that.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




Did you read what I had written previously?  The only thing I have been saying is that we have no idea if life exist outside our planet because we only have one data point.

However, there are lots of people that are absolutely convinced life exist elsewhere because they speculate on invalid statistical probabilities and that is unscientific.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...



Given the size of the universe it is not only possible but probable that life besides us exists.

I don't think that our little insignificant planet orbiting a run of the mill  yellow star in Milky Way Galaxy is the only place that life as we know it or don't know it exists and it has nothing to do with sci fi books or movies but rather a statistical probability given the astronomical (no pun intended)  numbers.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 30, 2021)

there4eyeM said:


> It takes at least as much imagination to believe we would encounter intelligent life in all the expanse of time and space as to believe in divine intervention.


With an important difference being that one of those ideas is magical hooha, and one isn't.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

Back on post #65 here, presented the case that NASA is trying to get the telescope to find and confirm other Earth like planets;




__





						There is No Home in the Universe but Earth
					

There have to be earth like planets just based on odds alone.  Nope.  They are all nightmare worlds where no life can survive.  But IF there were, how are you going to get there? Star Trek, Star Wars and Buck Roger's are FANTASY.   The distances make travel between worlds impossible.  It's...



					www.usmessageboard.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
*The Space Telescope That Could Find a Second Earth*
*What will it take to capture images of a distant world capable of harboring life?*
...
For all the excitement surrounding the search for distant exoplanets in recent years, the 4,000-plus planets confirmed so far have been unseen actors on the cosmic stage. Except for a handful of very large bodies imaged by ground-based telescopes, virtually all exoplanets have been detected only when they briefly dim the light coming from their host stars or when their gravity causes the star to wobble in a distinctive way. Observing these patterns and using a few other methods, scientists can determine an exoplanet’s orbit, radius, mass, and sometimes density—but not much else. The planets remain, in the words of one researcher in the field, “small black shadows.”

Scientists want much more. They’d like to know in detail the chemical makeup of the planets’ atmospheres, whether liquid water might be present on their surfaces, and, ultimately, whether these worlds might be hospitable to life. 
...
Direct imaging of such a faint target also requires certain technical innovations, most critically a powerful coronagraph—a screen to block out the blinding light of the planet’s host star. Inside the coronagraph instrument, an advanced imaging camera is needed to detect small, rocky planets like our own. Then a highly sensitive spectrograph is required to identify elements like oxygen or methane in a planet’s atmosphere that might suggest the presence of life.

The LUVOIR study team concluded in its final report that the deluxe version of the observatory—as opposed to a scaled-down option that reduces the mirror size almost by half—could identify and study 54 potentially Earth-like planets over a five-year observing period, along with hundreds of larger planets.

This estimate comes from matching the telescope’s technical specifications against the number of small, rocky exoplanets predicted to exist in our celestial neighborhood based on data from NASA’s Kepler survey mission of the last decade. Key to reaching the 54-planet goal will be LUVOIR’s internal coronagraph and the large size of the telescope itself, which has 40 times the light-gathering power of Hubble and can capture images much more quickly. 
...




...








						The Space Telescope That Could Find a Second Earth
					

What will it take to capture images of a distant world capable of harboring life?




					www.airspacemag.com


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




See you are doing it again.

You are making an assumption based upon nothing.

Have you ever taken a college course in Statistics? If you did you would know that you can never base a probability on one data point.

Your assumption is based upon how you feel, not on science.

I would love to believe in galactic empires and alien worlds teaming with life but to do so would go against the science that says as far as we can see and for what we know right now earth is the only place with life and the rest of the universe looks to be pretty damn hostile.

By the way, our sun is not  a "run of the mill" star.  It is a Yellow Dwarf and only about 7% of the stars in our galaxy are like it.  The run of the mill stars would be the Red Dwarfs (about 70%) that are much cooler and are not stable.  Life would have a hellva time getting established on a planet orbiting a Red Dwarf because of the variability in temperature.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Just because there are a lot of stars don't mean there is any more life.


Nobody said or implied that as a standalone argument. Whether intentionally or accidentally, you are missing an equally important part of the argument:

We know life not only can, but HAS formed at least once in the universe. And by the inherent properties of life, it is trying to form in every system where materials for it exist. For life not to form, conditions would have to stop it.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Stryder50 said:


> Back on post #65 here, presented the case that NASA is trying to get the telescope to find and confirm other Earth like planets;
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That would change everything, wouldn't it?

Maybe one of these days we would get another data point but not today.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


I'm not basing it on one data point.

By saying that the rest of the universe is sterile, you are using one data point.

And probability is part of statistics in case you didn't know that.

The probability in a system as vast as the universe is that at least some other planets harbor life either as we know it or as we don't know it.

You'll notice I'm not saying there is but that the probability exists.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> That would change everything, wouldn't it?


Not really, no. It would only be confirmation of strong theories we already have. Just as the observational confirmation of relativity didn't "change everything".


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




Actually I am not.

We have seven other planets that are hostlie to life just in back yard.

All this exoplanet research we have been doing for the last few years have not produce any earth like planets but a whole lot of monstrosities that would kill life pretty damn quick.

Everywhere we look it seems to be hostile to life.

Maybe we will refine our searches one day but right now we have nothing.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Stryder50 said:
> 
> 
> > Back on post #65 here, presented the case that NASA is trying to get the telescope to find and confirm other Earth like planets;
> ...


What do you mean "we" Kimosabe?


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


FWIW, "Orion" is a constellation of stars, many quite distant from each other, and not a single star.
Also, the Green skin of aliens is rather rare, most are Blue actually.


----------



## there4eyeM (Mar 30, 2021)

Life on Earth shows that life exists in the universe. By our perception of things, it is an easy jump to assume that the same thing would occur given similar conditions elsewhere. Yet, a jump it remains just the same. We should not be overly optimistic that we would ever find extraterrestrial life even if some model could demonstrate the certainty of its existence. The vastness of time and space is simply too overwhelming. For all intents and purposes, we would do well to think of this planet as unique and make the best of it.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


That book sounds intriguing and the premise is plausible. 
One of many questions would be just how much all the factors are essential for complex life to develop?  For example, an Earth like planet with a more stable history and one or more of those factors not present could also develop complex life but might do so in shorter time-span and with less fragile prospects.
How much did an impact event, the creation of such a large moon, and resulting plate tectonics really factor in fostering life, especially complex life versus having made what we have here even more rare compared to tamer conditions in other star systems and on other planets. ???

Some speculations are that Mars may have been more habitable and supportive of life in it's past, when it appears to have had liquid oceans and may have still retained a thicker atmosphere and warmer surface temperatures.

I've a couple of interesting and related articles to present, but will do so in another post following this.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

A couple of related articles to this thread and the above post;

*Hidden Near the Earth's Core, Study Proposes*
A new study suggests that an alien world that smashed into infant Earth and created the Moon might have left vast remains inside our planet.
...
Two gigantic chunks of material lurking deep under the surface of Earth might be remnants of an alien world called Theia that violently collided with our infant planet in an ancient impact that created the Moon. 
That sentence may sound like the synopsis for a sci-fi epic, but it’s actually a new hypothesis proposed by scientists in a presentation at the 52nd Lunar and Planetary Science Conference 2021, which was held virtually last week. 
...
This hypothesis proposes that the Moon was formed in the fallout of a catastrophic collision some 4.5 billion years ago. Earth had barely been born before another planet crashed into it, spewing enormous volumes of planetary debris into space that eventually accumulated into the radiant natural satellite that graces our skies today. Scientists have generally estimated that this bygone planet, named Theia after the mother of a Greek lunar goddess, was about the size of Mars, but some models suggest it was both smaller and bigger than that scale. 
...








						The Massive Remnants of an Alien World Are Hidden Near the Earth's Core, Study Proposes
					

A new study suggests that an alien world that smashed into infant Earth and created the Moon might have left vast remains inside our planet.




					www.vice.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*Ancient Rocks Reveal When Earth's Plate Tectonics Began*
New data indicating that the planet's surface broke up about 3.2 billion years ago helps clarify how shifting plates drove the evolution of complex life.
...
Earth’s fractured carapace of rigid, interlocking plates is unique in the solar system. Scientists increasingly connect it to our planet’s other special features, such as its stable atmosphere, protective magnetic field and menagerie of complex life. But geologists have long debated exactly when Earth’s crust broke into plates, with competing hypotheses spanning from the first billion years of the planet’s 4.5-billion-year history to sometime in the last billion. Those estimates have wildly different implications for how plate tectonics affects everything else on Earth. 

The spreading, smashing, and plunging of tectonic plates shapes far more than just geography. The recycling of Earth’s surface helps to regulate its climate, while the building of continents and mountains pumps vital nutrients into the ecosystem. Indeed, plate tectonics, if it began early enough, may have been a major driver of the evolution of complex life. And by extension, shifting plates could be a prerequisite for advanced life on distant planets as well.

Now, a study of the rocks from the Australian Outback by Tusch, Münker and their co-authors, published in _Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences_, has captured “a snapshot” of the advent of plate tectonics, said Alan Collins, a geologist at the University of Adelaide in Australia. The team’s analysis of tungsten isotopes in the rocks reveals Earth in the act of transitioning to plate tectonics around 3.2 billion years ago.
...




...








						Ancient Rocks Reveal When Earth's Plate Tectonics Began
					

New data indicating that the planet's surface broke up about 3.2 billion years ago helps clarify how shifting plates drove the evolution of complex life.




					www.wired.com
				



~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Slight bit of timeline conflict here between these two.  

I'm inclined to think that an impact event with a large enough object is going to blast away some of Earth's original crust and mass and that gravity won't take all that long to reform Earth back to a circular mass, which would crack the remaining crust into pieces and start plate tectonics rather soon thereafter.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

TNHarley said:


> _Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, *children and infants*, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'"_



That's  right!  Kill every swingin' dick and jane of them, and all their livestock. 

It would seem TNHarley's gettin' a weepy, snot-stained hanky feelin'.


----------



## Flopper (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > False. This is the science sectiion. If you feel like making stuff up, head to the religion section
> ...


Scientific research is about what we don't know.
An idea becomes a postulate when is it is based on reasoning and serve as a basis for scientific discussion. 
When we add limited evidence that support the postulate, it can be accepted as a hypothesis.  A hypothesis is a proposed explanation for something that can actually be observed or tested. 
If enough evidence accumulates in support of the hypothesis, it can move on to the next step, known as a theory.  In science there is no level of acceptance beyond a theory.  Over time theories may become universally accepted, modified or discarded. 

In a scientific discussion of the universe it is important understand what is being postulated, hypothesized, or statement of accepted theory.  Most of what has been asserted in this thread is somewhere between a SWAG, (Scientific Wild Ass Guess), and a postulate.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > _Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, *children and infants*, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'"_
> ...


I would have ignored my point, too


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Stryder50 said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




Mars may very well have developed the same as earth but without the iron core to produce the magnetic field the solar radiation stripped away everything.

The collision with Theta was a very happenstance event that very well may be the difference between earth being sterile like Mars or harboring life.  How many other earth like planets in the universe are sterile because they never had a happenstance event like that?

Lots of things happen that led to the creation of life on earth.  It is not a common place event like the Trekkers think.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




There's no chance in hell that mere chemistry can form anything remotely akin to a living organism.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

TNHarley said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > TNHarley said:
> ...



Liar.  I applaud God's justice.  You hate justice.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


Nope. Thats what you did. You are lying and your god hates liars.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...



The Hand of God can turn Chemistry into Biology.  We see it here on earth.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...


God's hand did just that on Earth.  I said mere chemistry cannot and does not produce life.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

TNHarley said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > TNHarley said:
> ...



Lying about what, you silly ass?


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


That you ignored my point.
You dont forum very well, do you?
Lets recap what happened :
You said _ Supporters of infanticide are not Christians. Yeah. I said it._
I then posted a biblical verse about god ordering the death of infants. Which, BTW, makes your statement look incredibly foolish.
You then ignore it, and then lie about ignoring it.
Do you understand now?


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Stryder50 said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Mars might have retained hydrosphere long enough for life to have started, rudimentary biosphere before it was stripped away.  We'll learn more as we explore more.

The Theta/Theia impact to Earth wasn't all that happenstance.  There was a lot of impacting on all the planets when the Solar System was forming and evidence suggests a very massive object "intruded" through this system early on.  All the planets have obits that are inclined a bit to the Solar ecliptic (equatorial band or rotational/angular momentum), and all have rotational axial tilts.  In theory all should revolve about the same plane and have perpendicular rotation, unless some force/event altered such.

In the case of Venus, once posited to be a near twin of Earth, while it has the same orbital/revolution path as the other planets; "counter-clockwise" as seen from the North Star; it spins in the opposite; clock-wise direction.  Albeit rather slowly, but the "Occam's Razor" cause would be either a major impact event or a close passage of a very massive other body/planet that caused Venus to flip about 180 degrees on it's rotational axis. The energy involved in such an event might be the major explanation for that thick cloud covering and intense heat.

Uranus points one of it's rotational axis poles towards the Sun (tilt of about 87 degrees) while rolling along on it's equator as it orbits about the Sun.

Yes, lots of things/factors can lead to creation of life, on Earth and elsewhere.  Open question is if all the things/factors that happened to Earth were essential, or were some "extras" that might not have happened to other worlds around other Stars.  

The Moon/Luna is one that might have more to do with some of the diversity of life than being an essential and required component.  The tidal effects on the oceans certainly resulted in some interesting variations of aquatic life, and rumor has it that because of this unique factor, geoduck is a popular export from here to the gourmet tables of the wealthy on Rigel-7 and Sirius-4.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

TNHarley said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > TNHarley said:
> ...



The only folks claiming to have the authority of God to give and take life are YOU and your fellow baby murders.  You're the fools.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


I have never murdered a baby. But your god has.
Your disingenuous outrage is noted.


----------



## Flash (Mar 30, 2021)

Stryder50 said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Stryder50 said:
> ...




The Theta collision was nothing new because like you said things like that was going on a lot. However, the size and the way it hit to create the moon and create plate tectonics and merge the iron cores all contributed to the development of life on earth.

A smaller body may not have done it.  A larger one may have created something different.  The angle of impact kept both bodies from creating a new asteroid belt. 

Lot of good luck there for us in that collision.


----------



## Stryder50 (Mar 30, 2021)

Flash said:


> Stryder50 said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


"Contributed" yes, but were such essential?
This may remain an open item for contention until some future time when we've got data from other worlds around other stars.
Earth may not be the Metric.


----------



## Ringtone (Mar 30, 2021)

TNHarley said:


> Ringtone said:
> 
> 
> > TNHarley said:
> ...



Your support of infanticide is noted as well as your mindless notion that the giver of life can murder.


----------



## TNHarley (Mar 30, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> TNHarley said:
> 
> 
> > Ringtone said:
> ...


He is more like Charles Manson than a murderer. He directs his lemmings to do it for him.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 30, 2021)

there4eyeM said:


> For all intents and purposes, we would do well to think of this planet as unique and make the best of it.


We can still do that and search for life elsewhere.


----------



## Paulie (Mar 30, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> andaronjim said:
> 
> 
> > Concerned American said:
> ...


Have you ever asked yourself how a vacuum (space, supposedly) can exist next to the non-vacuum of earth?  A vacuum needs to be enclosed, otherwise it’s not a vacuum.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 31, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Our solar system is still a single point when once considers there are possible 1000000000000000000000000 solar systems in the universe

And right now we have nothing because the only solar system we have any real knowledge of is ours.

You just don't seem to grasp the size of the universe.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 31, 2021)

Ringtone said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


abiogenesis is just as viable a theory as the god theory


----------



## harmonica (Mar 31, 2021)

..someone said we have to accept that god made Earth,etc blah blah blah  ......well, one problem with that---you can't prove there is a god


----------



## Flash (Mar 31, 2021)

harmonica said:


> ..someone said we have to accept that god made Earth,etc blah blah blah  ......well, one problem with that---you can't prove there is a god



The problem with not believing in Intelligent Design is that the only alternative is believing that the universe created itself out of nothing.  As anyone that understands the Laws of Physics will tell you that dog don't hunt.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 31, 2021)

Flash said:


> harmonica said:
> 
> 
> > ..someone said we have to accept that god made Earth,etc blah blah blah  ......well, one problem with that---you can't prove there is a god
> ...


Inventing a god that created the universe is just as lame a dog.


----------



## Flash (Mar 31, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > harmonica said:
> ...




If you believe that the universe created itself out of nothing then you believe in magic.


----------



## Blues Man (Mar 31, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


The Big Bang is just a theory 
God is just a theory.

We don't really know how the universe came into existence.  I have no problem admitting that.

In fact I'm of the mind that we might be utterly incapable of comprehending how the universe came to be just like my dogs are utterly incapable of comprehending prime numbers


----------



## Flash (Mar 31, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...




I agree with what you said.   

To me believing in God is admitting that you can't comprehend existence and accepting that there must be something much bigger out there.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 31, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> abiogenesis is just as viable a theory as the god theory


Abiogenesis isn't even a theory. It's a fact. The Theory of Abiogensis, which attempts to explain how abiogenesis works, is a theory. Similarly, star formation is a fact, and the Theory of Star Formation attempts to explain how star formation works.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Mar 31, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The Big Bang is just a theory


The Big Bang theory, in its most strict sense, is so well supported that it is safely considered to be true. In its strict sense, it only says that there was a period of rapid expansion in the early universe. We have taken a picture of it. 

Not trying to pester, just adding clarity.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 1, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > abiogenesis is just as viable a theory as the god theory
> ...



Abiogenesis remains scientifically unproven.  That doesn't mean it didn't happen it just means we can't explain it.


----------



## Flash (Apr 1, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Abiogenesis remains scientifically unproven.  That doesn't mean it didn't happen it just means we can't explain it.




This is one thing that is very perplexing.

It is not easy for life to be created.  Our scientists have been doing research on it for many decades and can't turn chemistry into biology.

That means it takes a very complex process to produce life.  Of course we all would surmise that the more complex it is the less likely chance of it happening elsewhere.

It takes a lot more than water, a Golidlocks zone and bolt of lightning to produce life.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 1, 2021)

Flash said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Abiogenesis remains scientifically unproven.  That doesn't mean it didn't happen it just means we can't explain it.
> ...



Exactly my point.  Theory is mostly supposition.


----------



## danielpalos (Apr 1, 2021)

Flash said:


> However, there are lots of people that are absolutely convinced life exist elsewhere because they speculate on invalid statistical probabilities and that is unscientific.


What invalid statistical probabilities?


----------



## Sunsettommy (Apr 1, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Mr Clean said:
> ...



Says who?

Astronomers have found around 2,800 Planets using the Kepler Telescope.

I have seen ALL of the Solar system planets with my Telescopes over the years, but never see anymore than that as my two biggest scopes are the 25" F5 and the Current 18" F 4.5 scope.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 3, 2021)

danielpalos said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > However, there are lots of people that are absolutely convinced life exist elsewhere because they speculate on invalid statistical probabilities and that is unscientific.
> ...



You Christophobes pose questions such as this and then deny, refute and run from the answers, always.  Your unscientific bias is irrational and widespread.

The human body alone has many thousands of proteins, precise combinations of amino acid residues joined by peptide bonds.  Short proteins are hundreds of amino acid residues in length.  Titin is 33,450 in length.  

What is 1/20 to the 33,450th power? 

Let me give you some perspective to exponents. There are ~10 to the 80th fundamental particles in the universe. "Impossible" can be defined as 1 chance in 10 to the 50th power. Ten to the fiftieth power grains of sand would fill several spheres the size of our solar system out to Pluto. Imagine a space explorer diving into one of the five or ten solar system sized spheres to find one single specially marked grain of sand on his first and only try. It's not an infinite number over 10 to the 50. It's 1.
That's it.

That's statistical impossibility by any common sense measure, not that biased people like you would ever admit it.


----------



## Hollie (Apr 3, 2021)

ChemEngineer said:


> danielpalos said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Leave it to the hyper-religious to invent these phony, "the odds are too great, statistical impossibility... because I say so'', claims.

What is the probability of ''... because I say so'' 10^50?


----------



## Death Angel (Apr 4, 2021)

Sunsettommy said:


> Says who?
> 
> Astronomers have found around 2,800 Planets using the Kepler Telescope.
> 
> I have seen ALL of the Solar system planets with my Telescopes over the years, but never see anymore than that as my two biggest scopes are the 25" F5 and the Current 18" F 4.5 scope


No planet outside the solar system has ever been SEEN.

I'm not saying they dont exist, but nobody had ever seen one.

But the "fact" they exist is irrelevant to the statement that THERE IS NO HOME IN THE UNIVERSE FOR MAN BUT THE EARTH


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

Hollie said:


> ChemEngineer said:
> 
> 
> > danielpalos said:
> ...




You are falling into the trap that was illustrated by the prisoner analogy in the video I posted earlier.

Just because life exist on earth you think it must be common elsewhere where in fact it is the result of some highly improbable events that may or may be reproduced elsewhere.


----------



## Hollie (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> Hollie said:
> 
> 
> > ChemEngineer said:
> ...


You're not understanding what I wrote. My comments didn't address whether or not life my be common elsewhere in the universe. My comments addressed the nonsensical ''the odds are too great'', comments from the science illiterate religious extremist.


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

Hollie said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Hollie said:
> ...




Sorry if I misunderstood.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 4, 2021)

Hollie said:


> Leave it to the hyper-religious to invent these phony, "the odds are too great, statistical impossibility... because I say so'', claims.
> 
> What is the probability of ''... because I say so'' 10^50?



I put you, Hollie, on Ignore months ago because you blather on and  on without saying anything worth reading.  You simply PRETEND to be sophisticated and intellectual without ever providing anything to substantiate your fatuous claims.

1. I posted science, not religious claims. You obviously don't know the difference between them.
2.  Have you any IDEA of how difficult biochemical synthesis is?  Any CLUE?
If so, tell the audience how you have that IDEA.  I already introduced some solid facts and in response all you did was cry "hyper-religious."  No, it's biochemistry. It's statistics.  Get a clue.
3.  My dear friend is a chemistry professor and he agrees emphatically with my statement of  10^-50 being impossible.
4.  Atheist Richard Dawkins states that 10^-40 is impossible.  He grants ten orders of magnitude to my definition, but you pretend to be smarter than your hero atheist Richard Dawkins.

Now IF you ever have some science to contribute, please do so.  Otherwise spare the world your claims of scientific and statistical sophistication when you show precisely the opposite every time you tap your keys.  

What is chirality and how does it impact the insuperable statistics of protein synthesis?
How does folding impact it?
What do you know about hemoglobin? Anything?  Anything at all?


----------



## Hollie (Apr 4, 2021)

ChemEngineer said:


> Hollie said:
> 
> 
> > Leave it to the hyper-religious to invent these phony, "the odds are too great, statistical impossibility... because I say so'', claims.
> ...


I understand. Your claim to put me on ignore is a fraudulent as your ''the odds are too great", nonsense. The problem shared by the hyper-religious is that their version of ''science'' amounts to cutting and pasting ''quotes'' they ''quote mine'' from ID'iot creationer websites. 

Present the peer reviewed data and papers, works prepared by AIG for their biology research. You can't. We both know the charlatans at your ID'iot creationer ministries do no research and publish in no peer reviewed journals. Your clownish ''the odds are too great'' are just slogans with no support, right out of the Disco'tute. Why don't you tell us about chirality and how does it impact the insuperable statistics of protein synthesis? How does folding impact it? Tell us how any of the above precludes biological evolution. Obviously, you can't. You simply and mindlessly cut and paste ''quotes'' you read on fundie websites.

What you hyper-religious loons fail to realize is that your phony ''odds'' mean nothing because abiogenesis occurred, obviously, life exists and biological life evolves.

So, IF you have any evidence of a 6,000 year old planet, Arks cruising the seas, or anything to support your claims to polytheistic gods, godly miracles or supernatural events, present them. 

Thanks. I'll be waiting to read your reference material and links to objective research on godly miracles and a flat earth.


----------



## danielpalos (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> You are falling into the trap that was illustrated by the prisoner analogy in the video I posted earlier.
> 
> Just because life exist on earth you think it must be common elsewhere where in fact it is the result of some highly improbable events that may or may be reproduced elsewhere.


The law of large numbers could claim that simply because there is (intelligent) life in one galaxy, there could be at least one in every galaxy.


----------



## initforme (Apr 4, 2021)

This gets the award for ultimate troll thread....very well done.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Apr 4, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> No, we don't have to accept that.
> 
> It's okay to admit that we don't know for sure.  It's not sign of weakness, it's a sign of intellectual honesty.


Fir the first time in your miserable existence you did not troll and said something intelligent,


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Apr 4, 2021)

ChemEngineer said:


> Hollie said:
> 
> 
> > Leave it to the hyper-religious to invent these phony, "the odds are too great, statistical impossibility... because I say so'', claims.
> ...


Hollie is a paid shill for Israel I put on ignore years ago.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Apr 4, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Mr Clean said:
> ...


Which is why it is absurd beyond reason to say we are the only planet with life forms.half of mankind is in denial mode like the op that there are alien life forms out there that hover in our sky’s observing us everyday with ships that are a thousand times more advanced than us able to easily leave our planet within a second or two. Man I sure hate being in agreement with two of our resident trolls.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 4, 2021)

initforme said:


> This gets the award for ultimate troll thread....very well done.



*Says the self-appointed Troll Thread Judge.*

(Very well done by whom, _precisely_? You did not say.)


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Apr 4, 2021)

petro said:


> We just need the Devil's Anus...
> View attachment 471918
> Looking to expand upon the work of Schwarszchild and other scientists seeking solutions to GR, they proposed the *possible* existence of "*bridges*" between two distant points in space time (known as "*Einstein*–*Rosen bridges*" or "wormholes") that could theoretically allow for matter and objects to pass between them.
> 
> ...


You nailed it and aliens have mastered it.they are a 100 times more advanced than us,sure wish I could join them the way mankind is destroying this planet and always starting wars with each other,wish it was as easy as it is in the Star Wars universities when Luke was telling kenobi he did not mind selling the land speeder to pay fir the trip in the falcon saying that’s okay,I’m never coming back to this planet again. If ONLY it was that easy in real life to leave a planet for another one.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Apr 4, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...


Obviously not.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Apr 4, 2021)

andaronjim said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Mr Clean said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...




Why is it absurd?

We have absolutely no proof that life exist elsewhere.

Our scientists have not been able to produce life in a laboratory after decades of research, which means it is a very difficult process.  Maybe that process only happened once under a very unique set of circumstances.

How do you know that life on earth is not unique?


----------



## Death Angel (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> LA RAM FAN said:
> 
> 
> > Mr Clean said:
> ...


This is an example of "faith" in the left


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > LA RAM FAN said:
> ...




That is the same as believing in magic if they think the universe magically created itself out of nothing.  Some real serious magic.

This "faith" that there just has to be life elsewhere simply comes from being brainwashed by Science Fiction.

Hell, they see aliens and starships and other worlds every time they turn on the TV or go to the movies.  It just has to be that way, doesn't it?


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> LA RAM FAN said:
> 
> 
> > Mr Clean said:
> ...


Life on Earth is unique, but what is to say that some other life form is on a 3rd planet from its sun, has nitrogen and oxygen, and water?  Billions on billions of stars and planets out there, the odds are that we arent the only ones.


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Okay who created the big bang then?


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

andaronjim said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > LA RAM FAN said:
> ...




It takes more than water, O2 and whatever.  Our scientists have been trying to turn chemistry into biology for decades and they have nothing.

If it is was common for life to be created from simple ingredients then it would be a classroom science experiment in every jr High school science class, wouldn't it?

It is a very complex thing and we have no proof that it has ever happen before.

That may change in the future as we learn more but then again we may never know.


----------



## San Souci (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> andaronjim said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Flying had never happened before. Until Wright did it. The Speed of sound was impossible until it was done. Speed of Light? Impossible. Until someone figures it out.


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

andaronjim said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...




First of all the BB is nothing more than a placeholder to explain the unexplainable.  The actual evidence for it is really pretty flimsy.  Just some cosmic background noise that some scientists say is nothing more than earth background.  Also, the red shift that tends to indicate the universe is expanding.

The thing that is so perplexing about the BB is that the scientists that are absolutely convinced that it happen can't explain:

What was here before the BB?

What initiated the BB?

Where did the energy for the BB come from?

How in the hell can everything in the universe once have been the size significantly smaller than the size of a grain of sand?

How come the BB can't be explained by the Laws of Physics?


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > andaronjim said:
> ...




Just show me the money.  Just show me where there is life elsewhere in the universe.

Until you do you have nothing but your Science Fiction brainwashing.


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> andaronjim said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


I never said that other life would be like us, i said that the odds are in favor that there is some other life out there.  The experts say that it is damn near impossible to be struck by lightning twice...


During his lifetime, a man named *Walter Summerford* was struck by lightning three times. After his death, his gravestone was also struck. It's fairly rare to be hit by lightning at all during one's lifetime, which rolls in at a 1 in 3,000 chance of happening in the United States. However, one man was struck three times whilst he was alive.
*Man Struck by Lightning 3 times, Then His Gravestone Was ...*

funfactz.com/amazing-facts/walter-summerford-lightning/


----------



## San Souci (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Prove there is not. As far as light speed ,it could be done. If we could develope a FUSION reactor. Maybe 100 years away.


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...




The set of things that humans think COULD be done is always larger than the set of things that HAVE been done, isn't it?


----------



## San Souci (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Ever heard of Edison? Bell? Oppenheimer? Goddard? Von Braun?


----------



## Flash (Apr 4, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...




If you want to believe we can go star trekking across the universe screwing pretty green Orion slave girls then go for it Sport.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 4, 2021)

Christians, Jews, and Muslims believe that God made the universe for us humans, and not for anybody else.  No other group is mentioned on any planet.  

EITHER:

A. God made the universe for us, with the insuperable statistics attending thereto, or

B.  Nothing made everything including possibly other  beings on other planets.

The evidence to date all points to A.  SETI has been squandering hundreds of millions of dollars for decades with zero to show for it.  

Knock knock.

(Who's there?)

................No answer.........................


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 4, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Ever heard of Edison? Bell? Oppenheimer? Goddard? Von Braun?



Nobody reading the page has ever heard of these names except you.
How utterly brilliant you are.  NO, really.
Impressive.  Therefore you're always right, about everything.


----------



## San Souci (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


A constant boost Fusion engine could reach light speed in 6 months using a 1 Gee boost.


----------



## San Souci (Apr 4, 2021)

ChemEngineer said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Ever heard of Edison? Bell? Oppenheimer? Goddard? Von Braun?
> ...


Can't help it if ya can't read.


----------



## Death Angel (Apr 4, 2021)

Flash said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


We have an entire generation that now believes aliens are scattered throughout the galaxy, and we can hop into our starship and go visit them in a matter of hours.

The truth is, if Adam got into his spaceship and began 6,000 years ago, he'd still need another 60,000 years to get to 5he nearest star.

But we have faith now in "warp drive" and maybe wormholes to get around those pesky laws of physics


San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...


Nope.  Fusion can get you maybe 1/10 lightspeed



> Depending on the concept, the exhaust velocity of a fusion-propelled rocket would be in the range of 150-350 *kilometres per second*. Planet Mars could be reached in 90 days or even less, as compared to eight months with a conventional propulsion



Fusion Drive will get you from earth to mars in 90 days.

Light can travel from the sun to mars in 12 minutes.

It takes INFINITE ENERGY to get any mass to light speed


----------



## San Souci (Apr 4, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


Theory. Has anyone TESTED it? If you accelerate  20 feet per second every second ,how fast will ya be going after 6 months? That is starting at escape velocity.  PS--That includes DECELERATION time in your Mars trip.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 5, 2021)

Smartass San Souci:   "A constant boost Fusion engine could reach light speed in 6 months using a 1 Gee boost. 

Can't help it if ya can't read."

----------------------------

1.  Nobody has come close to your wishful thinking.   Cross your anti-scientific fingers and click your red heels together. It'll come true!

2.  Your unmitigated gall of fatuous arrogance is typical of the godless, insufferable, destructive Left.
My Ignore List just increased by you, smartass.

*"How is (SETI, the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence) different from fantasy and pseudoscience?"- Demon Haunted World, by Carl Sagan, page 178

(A good question, never answered.  But partaking in fantasy and pseudoscience for seven or eight figures was just fine with wealthy Carl, who asked me to buy his latest book when I sent critiques of several of his books to his publisher.  I sold his letter on eBay for $125.)*


----------



## Flash (Apr 5, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...




It would take all the energy that is produced on earth for three years to get a Shuttle size craft to 60% of the speed of light.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 5, 2021)

Flash said:


> It would take all the energy that is produced on earth for three years to get a Shuttle size craft to 60% of the speed of light.



Do not bother the smartass San Souci with science.


----------



## Flash (Apr 5, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...




You may not know how enormous space is.  In Science Fiction that distance is covered lickety split but reality is different.

If the sun was the size of a golf ball the earth would be about the size of a pea.  The nearest star would be over 700 miles away.


----------



## frigidweirdo (Apr 5, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> 
> There is no other world in the solar system or the universe



God was created as a patch for all things we don't know. 

And you seem to be using this for its intended purpose. Well done.


----------



## Flash (Apr 5, 2021)

frigidweirdo said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.
> ...




There are a lot of things in Astro Science that was invented as a patch for the unexplainable. 

For instance: "The Laws of Physics did not exist until after the Big Bang".


----------



## Flash (Apr 5, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Fusion Drive will get you from earth to mars in 90 days.



The Moon Bat Environmental Wackos (with the help of the stupid Democrats) were able to get the best test bed for fusion in the world (FFTF at Hanford) mostly shut down so good luck with that idea.


----------



## Mikeoxenormous (Apr 5, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > Death Angel said:
> ...


Got to start somewhere....


All *plasma* *rockets* operate on the same type of principle: Electric fields and magnetic fields work side by side to first transform a gas – typically xenon or krypton – into *plasma* and then accelerate the ions in the *plasma* out of the engine at over 45,000 mph (72,400 kph), creating a thrust in the direction of desired travel [source: Science Alert ].
*How Plasma Rockets Work | HowStuffWorks*

science.howstuffworks.com/plasma-rockets.htm


----------



## San Souci (Apr 5, 2021)

Flash said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Flash said:
> ...


Is there any FRICTION in space? Any Gravity? Do you know anything about continuous acceleration? Yes. Space is enormous. But the nearest Star is 4 years away a 99% of Light speed. Of course we can't do it today. Maybe not for 100 years. But how about this? What would an 1850 man say about the possibility of "The Internet" ? Well ,Einstein? Ever heard of PROGRESS? (It is the opposite of Progressivism)


----------



## San Souci (Apr 5, 2021)

Flash said:


> Death Angel said:
> 
> 
> > Fusion Drive will get you from earth to mars in 90 days.
> ...


Like I said. --Progress is the opposite of Progressive.


----------



## San Souci (Apr 5, 2021)

ChemEngineer said:


> Smartass San Souci:   "A constant boost Fusion engine could reach light speed in 6 months using a 1 Gee boost.
> 
> Can't help it if ya can't read."
> 
> ...


 My grandpappy cain't do it ,so it cain't be did. "Christopher ,you will fall off the edge of the world".   "Orville ,that thing hain't never gonna fly". It is ignorant Nay-Sayers like this piece of shit that has stopped all human progress for centuries.  Nobody has TRIED yet. So how the FUCK do you know?


----------



## Flash (Apr 5, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Flash said:
> 
> 
> > San Souci said:
> ...




Keep on believing in your Science Fiction religion.  Maybe you will get to screw one of those green Orion Slave girls one of these days.


----------



## Death Angel (Apr 5, 2021)

San Souci said:


> Nobody has TRIED yet. So how the FUCK do you know?


Science


----------



## San Souci (Apr 5, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> San Souci said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody has TRIED yet. So how the FUCK do you know?
> ...


Typical Lib answer. So ya think there will be no progress in the next 100 Years? In 1850 there were no cars ,phones , light bulbs. Very little plumbing. No real medical science. So all progress stops NOW? ---Well ,ya might be right. If Progressives take over ,it will be Orwellian.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 6, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Abiogenesis remains scientifically unproven.


Abiogenesis is a fact and a foregone conclusion. Once there was no life. Then, there was life. Abiogenesis connects these two states, just as star formation connects the states of "no star" and "star". What is not "proven" is how it happened, i.e., the Theory of Abiogenesis.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 6, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Abiogenesis remains scientifically unproven.
> ...


It remains scientifically unproven just like the existence of a god. We can give it a name but that in no way means we understand how it happened if we don't know how it happened then we cannot repeat the process therefore it isn't scientifically proven.

So we have the religious people theorizing that a god created life and we have others saying abiogenesis created life.

Either theory can be considered valid until we can scientifically prove the existence of a god or recreate abiogenesis.

So until we figure it out and open the box we can say that both theories are true and false at the same time.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 6, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> It remains scientifically unproven just like the existence of a god.


It is a foregone conclusion. It is a fact. I don't think you are following. We have never "proven" star formation as fact, nor have we observed the entire process. But it is a foregone conclusion that star formation is a fact. Similarly, abiogenesis is a fact. 

Abiogensis did create life. Just as star formation created stars. Abiogenesis is just a term for the formation of life.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 6, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > It remains scientifically unproven just like the existence of a god.
> ...



We can also describe the star formation process in detail.

Abiogenesis is still a black box and thus the process is not understood.  And creation is also a term for the formation of life.  Right now for all we know either one could be true.

As I said we have to either prove that a god exists or crack the code of abiogenesis.  Until we do either of those neither theory is better than the other.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 6, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...





Blues Man said:


> We can also describe the star formation process in detail.


No. Star formation is an "effective theory". We , in fact, do not know exactly when and how many of the processes occur within the star and its progenitor. And whether we could describe the actions exactly or knew nothing about it at all, we would still know star formation is a fact. So this is point is kind of irrelevant. Once there was no star, then there was a star. That is enough to know star formation is a fact. 




Blues Man said:


> Abiogenesis is still a black box and thus the process is not understood


But it is still a fact that the process occured. Abiogenesis is a fact.


----------



## danielpalos (Apr 6, 2021)

The Miller-Urey experiment proved the possibility of abiogenesis.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 6, 2021)

danielpalos said:


> The Miller-Urey experiment proved the possibility of abiogenesis.


Okay, but the possibility doesn't have to be proven. Once there was no life, then there was. Abiogenesis, else magic. And magic is not considered.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 7, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...


It's one of any number of possibilities.

Until we crack the code of the process we don't know which of those possibilities actually happened.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 7, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> It's one of any number of possibilities.


Name one. Abiogenesis is simply a term for the formation of life. So i am curious as to how you think life formed without forming. This should be interesting.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 7, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > It's one of any number of possibilities.
> ...


I'm not postulating anything I am merely pointing out that without more information that the god theory is just as viable as the abiogenesis theory.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 7, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...


That is false, for the reasons i mentioned. Magic is not as valid as a fact. Abiogenesis is a fact. At no point is it ever correct to say "god did some magic" is as valid as saying something happened via a deterministic physical process. How bizarre to say.


----------



## westwall (Apr 7, 2021)

ding said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > ding said:
> ...







No, it isn't.   FTL travel is possible, and it will happen.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 7, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...




Like I said we really don't know if there ever was a supreme being as his existence hasn't been proven or disproven.  And when you think about it what the god theorists say the creator did was basically abiogenesis, turning the inanimate  animate.

Like I said we need to actually crack the code and recreate spontaneous abiogenesis to be able to shut the door on the god theory.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 7, 2021)

westwall said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...



Einstein would disagree with you.


----------



## toobfreak (Apr 7, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> In the end we have to accept that God created ONLY the earth for Mankind.





God may have created Earth as mankind's natural intended ideal home, but there are no doubt other worlds, other habitable worlds, and eventually I think, other ideal worlds out there, and we will either move out and find them, or eventually perish here on Earth from the next major impactor.


----------



## ChemEngineer (Apr 7, 2021)

The godless know-it-alls are supremely confident that "there is no god" and "you can't prove it" but when they are asked to provide proof of no God, they stutter and stammer and offer nothing, just the same as when asked to provide proof of alien life.  "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" they claim of aliens, but absence of evidence of God is indeed their claim of evidence of absence.
They talk out of three or four sides of their mouths.

As to how fast humans can power a space ship, increasing the speed tenfold from today's velocities requires one hundred times as much energy, and so on as one squares the velocity.   We're not going anywhere. Nobody is going to give us magic solutions to humanity's insane problems, such as men becoming women, women becoming men, and the divisive race warfare now being waged by the evil Democrat Party.






						Democrat Insanity - Trump Derangement Syndrome
					






					DemocratInsanity.blogspot.com
				












						White Lives Don't Matter
					






					WhiteLivesDontMatter.blogspot.com


----------



## ding (Apr 7, 2021)

westwall said:


> ding said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...


My understanding is that as the speed of an object approaches the speed of light the mass of the object approaches infinity therefore the energy required to accelerate the object approaches infinity.

What did I get wrong?


----------



## toobfreak (Apr 7, 2021)

ChemEngineer said:


> just the same as when asked to provide proof of alien life.


Hey Fake Chem Engineer, The search for ET life has just begun.  So far, we have examined 1% of 1% of 1% of the Moon and Mars.  Only the other 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of the universe to go.



> We're not going anywhere.


Certainly not you.









						Exoplanet Catalog | Discovery – Exoplanet Exploration: Planets Beyond our Solar System
					

NASA’s Exoplanet Exploration Program, the search for planets and life beyond our solar system.




					exoplanets.nasa.gov
				









						List of potentially habitable exoplanets - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 7, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Fort Fun Indiana said:
> 
> 
> > Blues Man said:
> ...


This is absurd commentary, and here is why:

Given that logic, you would have to fully and equally doubt any scientific theory ever, no matter how well evidenced. Because if there is a god who did everything by miracles, then the scientific evidence is all deceiving and is worthless garbage. 

And even then, you STILL haven't touched the facts of abiogenesis or star formation. You are simply saying they happened via miracles, if there was a god. You will have upended the scientific theories explaining how they happened, but the FACT that they happened still remains.


----------



## Blues Man (Apr 8, 2021)

Fort Fun Indiana said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > Fort Fun Indiana said:
> ...



Shouldn't every theory be subject to doubt and additional testing?

That is what the scientific method is all about isn't it?

And we don't know HOW abiogenesis happened because we do not know the process by which it did. 

And I never used the word miracles.  You seem to think I am saying that some god created the universe and I have never once said that.  I am talking about theories and whether or not more than one theory for a phenomenon can be considered valid because we have no real understanding of the phenomenon.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 8, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Shouldn't every theory be subject to doubt and additional testing?


Red herring. What you are describing is fully doubting every theory, because we cannot prove god didn't do it another way. And STILL you haven't touched the idea that abiogenesis is a fact. You can doubt star formation theory as much as you like, but you will not have argued against the fact that stars form.


Blues Man said:


> And we don't know HOW abiogenesis happened because we do not know the process by which it did.


Again... We do not have to know HOW stars form to know that it is a fact that stars form. Same goes for life. Abiogenesis is a fact.


----------



## Fort Fun Indiana (Apr 9, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Einstein would disagree with you.


Not if we showed him we could do it using his physics!


----------

