# Alternate History novel idea



## Delta4Embassy (Jul 1, 2015)

Love to read a well-done alternate history where Native Americans repelled early settlers and kept control of North America.


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## DGS49 (Jul 1, 2015)

Current history and fictional accounts gloss over the tremendous disparity between the resources and "technology" of the natives versus that of the oncoming Europeans.

The North American locals were basically stone-age "hunter/gatherers" with no resources other than their own hands, crude stone or bone tools, and what they could kill or pick up.  Farming, where it did exist was rudimentary and unreliable.  They had no metallurgy, did not have the wheel, no weapons that could kill at greater than 25 meters or so, no written language, and only a primitive understanding of architecture. They had no domesticated animals that could be used for work or bred for food.  The average lifespan was less than 40 years.  Their lives were nothing more than striving day after day to eke out a meager existence from what nature provided.

Making a dugout canoe was done with fire and seashells.  Even the tree they  used  had to be either fallen through natural causes or felled using fire and ashes - a process that sometimes took weeks.  Rivers were huge obstacles and could only  be crossed if you walked to a spot where fording was possible, and even that was a dangerous prospect as they would not know the depth of the water until possibly too late.

Clearly, there were many things that the Europeans had difficulty dealing with, and many lessons were learned from the natives, but the idea that the natives could permanently repel Europeans whose resources were orders of magnitude greater, is simply not believable.

Maybe in Central America, where the Aztecs lived...


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## Porker (Jul 1, 2015)

Informative
But only for people such as Delta4Embassy.


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## longknife (Jul 2, 2015)

DGS49 said:


> Current history and fictional accounts gloss over the tremendous disparity between the resources and "technology" of the natives versus that of the oncoming Europeans.
> 
> The North American locals were basically stone-age "hunter/gatherers" with no resources other than their own hands, crude stone or bone tools, and what they could kill or pick up.  Farming, where it did exist was rudimentary and unreliable.  They had no metallurgy, did not have the wheel, no weapons that could kill at greater than 25 meters or so, no written language, and only a primitive understanding of architecture. They had no domesticated animals that could be used for work or bred for food.  The average lifespan was less than 40 years.  Their lives were nothing more than striving day after day to eke out a meager existence from what nature provided.
> 
> ...



I think you've hit the nail on the head.


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## longknife (Jul 2, 2015)

Stop to think of the success of Cortez. A hand full of men far from home with little knowledge of the land or the people. Against an empire that built a massive city out of marshlands, along with towering structures. A civilization with written records, some advanced surgical techniques, and a large group of warriors that had dominated the land for untold decades.

Yet these few overcame all of those obstacles, wiping out that mighty civilization against overwhelming odds.

Because, for all intents and purposes, the small group was self-sufficient and had weapons far advanced of those held by their opponents. Steel against wooden clubs and stone-edged weapons. Sharp blades and gunpowder hurling metal projectiles against bows, arrows, and hide shields and leather armor.

Their horses, mules, and donkeys alone gave them a huge, insurmountable, advantage.


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## Roadrunner (Jul 2, 2015)

longknife said:


> DGS49 said:
> 
> 
> > Current history and fictional accounts gloss over the tremendous disparity between the resources and "technology" of the natives versus that of the oncoming Europeans.
> ...


No matter where they met the white man, Meso-America or the fuckin' Arctic, the first thing they did was form alliances against other "Indians".

Their own hatred of each other, their tribalism, prevented any resistance.


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## prison/con.net (Jul 4, 2015)

the Indians refused to use the wheel, for 300+ years after they became aware of it. Very few ever learned to write their native tongue. They refused to see the advantages of holding the bow STRING (ie, can draw a much longer range capable bow0. they refused to see the advantages (for them) of the crossbow over the trade musket. DUMB, man. They should have attacked the invading white man every chance that they got, poisoned them, etc.


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## boedicca (Jul 4, 2015)

Delta4Embassy said:


> Love to read a well-done alternate history where Native Americans repelled early settlers and kept control of North America.




It would be an under developed country.   If Western Civ retreated to Europe, then the modern inventions we all enjoy now would have been developed there.


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## prison/con.net (Jul 4, 2015)

Once read a book wherein Nazis went back in time and saved the Civil war for the Confederacy, with a few AK's and grenade launchers. Actually, it could have been done with a few silenced .22 pistols and the right info about who would be where, at what time.


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## Moonglow (Jul 4, 2015)

DGS49 said:


> Current history and fictional accounts gloss over the tremendous disparity between the resources and "technology" of the natives versus that of the oncoming Europeans.
> 
> The North American locals were basically stone-age "hunter/gatherers" with no resources other than their own hands, crude stone or bone tools, and what they could kill or pick up.  Farming, where it did exist was rudimentary and unreliable.  They had no metallurgy, did not have the wheel, no weapons that could kill at greater than 25 meters or so, no written language, and only a primitive understanding of architecture. They had no domesticated animals that could be used for work or bred for food.  The average lifespan was less than 40 years.  Their lives were nothing more than striving day after day to eke out a meager existence from what nature provided.
> 
> ...


You evidently have never heard of the 5 civilized tribes..The Cherokees being one of them..The Cherokees had their own farming communities that had metal, wheels and yes an alphabet...Yet the whites wanted their land and they ripped these peaceful tribes from their land and sent them on a death march a 1000 miles away..Destroying the tribes and making them rebuild their communities...


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## sealybobo (Jul 4, 2015)

Delta4Embassy said:


> Love to read a well-done alternate history where Native Americans repelled early settlers and kept control of North America.


Or if gore won 2000. Or if we never ended slavery.


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## The Sage of Main Street (Jan 21, 2022)

Delta4Embassy said:


> Love to read a well-done alternate history where Native Americans repelled early settlers and kept control of North America.


*How Do You Change a Somali Into a Tamale?
Give His Brother a Fork.*

That would be the same as the history of Somalia.


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