# Biden's Failing Afghanistan Withdrawl



## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.

By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.









						Biden's failing Afghanistan withdrawal
					

By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise, President Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.




					www.washingtonexaminer.com


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## Mac1958 (Aug 12, 2021)

Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

This is a good editorial, but it fails to mention the critical relationship between US military in Afghanistan, and the fragile Pakistani government, constantly under threat of attack from Muslim jihadists, for control of Pakistan's 100+ nuclear warheads.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


As usual, the left has a different perspective than the right.  The only thing that is inevitable, is the threat to US national security by the loony Islamic jihadists, that will never go away.  1400 years of Islamic militarist imperialism has well proven that.

After 20 years in Afghanistan, it should be evident to everyone that the ultimate reality, unfortunate as it may be, is that there can never be a withdrawl of US military power from Afghanistan, or other places that Islamic lunacy chooses to place itself, and that war against the jihad is NEVER-ending.

US military will ALWAYS need to be in the Middle East, as the insanity of the Koran and its lunatics will always continue.


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## gipper (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> As usual, the left has a different perspective than the right.  The only thing that is inevitable, is the threat to US national security by the loony Islamic jihadists, that will never go away.  1400 years of Islamic militarist imperialism has well proven that.
> 
> After 20 years in Afghanistan, it should be evident to everyone that the ultimate reality, unfortunate as it may be, is that there can never be a withdrawl of US military power from Afghanistan, or other places that Islamic lunacy chooses to place itself, and that war against the jihad is NEVER-ending.
> 
> US military will ALWAYS need to be in the Middle East, as the insanity of the Koran and its lunatics will always continue.


Lol. There never was any threat to our national security from Afghanistan.


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## Burgermeister (Aug 12, 2021)

I think Biden is a dangerously stupid and incompetent person but I don't blame him for whatever happens in that shithole when we leave. And I don't care how we leave as long as it is safely. I don't buy the bullshit argument that we have to fight them over there or we'll have to fight them over here. That's just an excuse for a terrible policy.


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## Biff_Poindexter (Aug 12, 2021)

We should have never been there...fuck Afghanistan....I am glad we are leaving


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## initforme (Aug 12, 2021)

We couldn't win there, the Russians couldn't do it.  It was long overdue.


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## DudleySmith (Aug 12, 2021)

Another million or so refugees headed our way, with the usual compliment of terrorists hiding among them.


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## DudleySmith (Aug 12, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> I don't buy the bullshit argument that we have to fight them over there or we'll have to fight them over here. That's just an excuse for a terrible policy.



You will get to find that out the hard way. Of course you won't be around to take responsibility for the outcomes if you prove to be wrong, which is a certainty.

And, we could win there and anywhere else, easily.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...



Washington Examiner is a tabloid.. So that's where you get your news.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> I think Biden is a dangerously stupid and incompetent person but I don't blame him for whatever happens in that shithole when we leave. And I don't care how we leave as long as it is safely. I don't buy the bullshit argument that we have to fight them over there or we'll have to fight them over here. That's just an excuse for a terrible policy.



The Taliban is strictly about internal affairs.


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## DudleySmith (Aug 12, 2021)

initforme said:


> We couldn't win there, the Russians couldn't do it.  It was long overdue.



Which war? The Russians were a failed state in 1978 when they went in to prop up their man in Kabul. We bankrupted them in 1973, and they were just a shell waiting to finally die.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> Which war? The Russians were a failed state in 1978 when they went in to prop up their man in Kabul. We bankrupted them in 1973, and they were just a shell waiting to finally die.



The Soviets came in from 1979 to 1989 to support the Afghan communists who had overthrown the Afghani monarchy in 1974.

They sure made a mess. Afghanistan had high literacy, cinemas, cafes, etc under the monarchy.


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## pknopp (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> As usual, the left has a different perspective than the right.  The only thing that is inevitable, is the threat to US national security by the loony Islamic jihadists, that will never go away.  1400 years of Islamic militarist imperialism has well proven that.
> 
> After 20 years in Afghanistan, it should be evident to everyone that the ultimate reality, unfortunate as it may be, is that there can never be a withdrawl of US military power from Afghanistan, or other places that Islamic lunacy chooses to place itself, and that war against the jihad is NEVER-ending.
> 
> US military will ALWAYS need to be in the Middle East, as the insanity of the Koran and its lunatics will always continue.



 The left? This is the very action Trump called for.


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## jknowgood (Aug 12, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


Clinton brought us 911, and looks like Biden is going to try to out do him.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

pknopp said:


> The left? This is the very action Trump called for.



protectionist 

The Gulf States hate Communism.  That's why they fought the Communists in Afghanistan. The Taliban were war orphans and were not in existence before 1994. They are NOT a threat to the US .. Strictly internal politics.


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## Mac1958 (Aug 12, 2021)

jknowgood said:


> Clinton brought us 911, and looks like Biden is going to try to out do him.


 More deflection from Bush's wars.  You guys are a bit too obvious.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> More deflection from Bush's wars.  You guys are a bit too obvious.



Clinton pulled a couple of quick stunts to deflect from his Monica scandal, but he didn't invade Afghanistan.


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## Lesh (Aug 12, 2021)

So what do we do ?

Make Afghanistan a US territory?

We been there 20 years


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## pknopp (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


> protectionist
> 
> The Gulf States hate Communism.  That's why they fought the Communists in Afghanistan. The Taliban were war orphans and were not in existence before 1994. They are NOT a threat to the US .. Strictly internal politics.



 I've noted for years that the Taliban never did anything to us. That if the people of Afghanistan don't want them running things the only way to accomplish that is from within.


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## kyzr (Aug 12, 2021)

1. I'm glad we are finally pulling out of AFG, 20-years was too long
2. Trump's "enhanced vetting" should have been good enough to protect the US from terrorism, but Xiden's "open borders" fucks that up.
3. We need to pull out of Europe next, let the EU fund their own defense, then Nord Stream 2 might look a bit different to them


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## Burgermeister (Aug 12, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> You will get to find that out the hard way. Of course you won't be around to take responsibility for the outcomes if you prove to be wrong, which is a certainty.
> 
> And, we could win there and anywhere else, easily.


A certainty? LOL.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

pknopp said:


> I've noted for years that the Taliban never did anything to us. That if the people of Afghanistan don't want them running things the only way to accomplish that is from within.



Afghanistan was completely lawless when the US pulled out. Taliban stopped the rapes, truck hijackings ad opium production. They are Deobandi Pashtun and went too far.


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## TheParser (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...



Yes, Mr. Senior Moments has failed his first foreign policy test.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

kyzr said:


> 1. I'm glad we are finally pulling out of AFG, 20-years was too long
> 2. Trump's "enhanced vetting" should have been good enough to protect the US from terrorism, but Xiden's "open borders" fucks that up.
> 3. We need to pull out of Europe next, let the EU fund their own defense, then Nord Stream 2 might look a bit different to them



We don't have open borders. 

Nordstream 2 is smart money for the Europeans.. Russia and the Stans can't eat their natural gas and its much cheaper for the Europeans.


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## 22lcidw (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


> The Soviets came in from 1979 to 1989 to support the Afghan communists who had overthrown the Afghani monarchy in 1974.
> 
> They sure made a mess. Afghanistan had high literacy, cinemas, cafes, etc under the monarchy.


The Soviets were/are looking for a route/routes into the Indian Ocean. With allies and American Bases not so close.


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## surada (Aug 12, 2021)

22lcidw said:


> The Soviets were/are looking for a route/routes into the Indian Ocean. With allies and American Bases not so close.


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## cnm (Aug 12, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> And, we could win there and anywhere else, easily.


Sure. That's what all the recent evidence shows.


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## Dekster (Aug 12, 2021)

Lesh said:


> So what do we do ?
> 
> Make Afghanistan a US territory?
> 
> We been there 20 years



The better tactic would have been to walk away slowly without any big announcements or fanfare we were going.  Wither on the vine so to speak instead of doing the whole "Date Certain" thing.


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## Mac-7 (Aug 12, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> More deflection from Bush's wars. You guys are a bit too obvious.


I think it was time to leave

but it opens the door to chinese expansion

and in  a future war with china bases in afganistan would be very useful

so there are no perfect answers


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## easyt65 (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...



Here's my $.02....

Once you decide to withdraw it means you are DONE, you're leaving, you're washing your hands of the situation...as in NOT your problem anymore. 

When you publicly declare you are withdrawing, and especially when you announce the date by which you will be gone, you are telling the enemy, "It's all yours - after this date you can do whatever you want...hell, you can start re-taking the country as long as you don't attack us as we leave."

There was never going to be a good way to withdraw - the Afghan people were not ready to stand up for themselves ... and possibly never would have been. 

Tribalism, tradition, old vs new, loyalties to the Taliban inside the new govt / military....all things we could / can not control.   

Our job (the military) was to kick their asses - we did that. We drove them into Pakistan - our 'ally', who gave them refuge every winter, and they returned every spring. 

Then we were ordered to engage in 'nation-building'.   The military is not meant for that. 

With the politicians' resolve wavering, why we were there became more and more muddled. 

We could not stay there forever...so be began to pull out. With the Taliban hanging back, licking their chops to fill the void, there was . is no great way to leave.  Te only thing we should have planned for and executed better was getting all the Afghans who helped us, and their families, out when we started leaving.


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## DudleySmith (Aug 12, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> A certainty? LOL.



Yes, a certainty.


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## DudleySmith (Aug 12, 2021)

cnm said:


> Sure. That's what all the recent evidence shows.



Recent evidence shows the Taliban would be toast in about a week of real warfare. So yes, you're right, by accident, not brains.


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## Lesh (Aug 12, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> Recent evidence shows the Taliban would be toast in about a week of real warfare. So yes, you're right, by accident, not brains.


Where do you get that from?

The Russians couldn't do it in 10 years.

We tried it in 2002. That didn't happen.


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## kyzr (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


> We don't have open borders.
> 
> Nordstream 2 is smart money for the Europeans.. Russia and the Stans can't eat their natural gas and its much cheaper for the Europeans.


1. We do have open borders, and the covid infected migrants are pouring into the US











						Nearly a thousand illegal immigrants held under a bridge in Texas, video shows
					

New video shows nearly a thousand illegal immigrants being held by border patrol agents under a bridge near the southern border in Texas, with a top Republican calling it an “absolute catast…




					nypost.com
				




2. Agree NS2 is a good deal for the EU, so why is the US paying $24b a year to keep US troops in the EU to protect them from the Russians?????  WTF?
3. We need to bring US troops home and save that $24b a year.
4. Let Russia and the Stans eat that gas, its better than funding Russia's military.


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## my2¢ (Aug 12, 2021)

Way before Afghanistan and Iraq, I felt our military's forte isn't playing the role of nation builders.  Nor should it be.


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## bendog (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...



Seriously, you shudda volunteered.  But the Army and Marines were pretty much done


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## 22lcidw (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


>


So look at Eastern Iran and Afghanistan at their Indian Ocean borders. Bases to be built with open access to that part of the world.


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## bendog (Aug 12, 2021)

bendog said:


> Seriously, you shudda volunteered.  But the Army and Marines were pretty much done





kyzr said:


> 1. We do have open borders, and the covid infected migrants are pouring into the US
> View attachment 524704
> 
> 
> ...


Do you have any cites for the cost of stationing troops in europe?


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## NoNukes (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


http://


protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


After 20 years, 2,400 personnel dead, and 2 2 trillion spent, Biden was right to get out.


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## kyzr (Aug 12, 2021)

bendog said:


> Do you have any cites for the cost of stationing troops in europe?


Can't find now, its a few years old, its the number Trump used to get NATO deadbeats to pay up.


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## bendog (Aug 12, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Can't find now, its a few years old, its the number Trump used to get NATO deadbeats to pay up.


Two separate things, really.  








						PolitiFact - Do European allies pay U.S. $2.5 billion yearly to keep troops there?
					

President Donald Trump criticized fellow NATO members during a summit on July 11, saying they had spent too little on de




					www.politifact.com
				




Germany is paying less to house US troops because Trump moved them ... to Poland I think I recall.

But I don't really care.  I'm just glad our "leaders" aren't sending young men into vastly outnumbered firefights in a god foresaken place that only illiterate muslim theocrats have a use for.


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## bendog (Aug 12, 2021)

I don't see a lot of media interest in this.





__





						US Veterans & Military Families | Costs of War
					

The Costs of War Project is a team of 35 scholars, legal experts, human rights practitioners, and physicians, which began its work in 2011. We use research and a public website to facilitate debate about the costs of the post-9/11 wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Pakistan.




					watson.brown.edu


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## kyzr (Aug 12, 2021)

bendog said:


> Two separate things, really.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Two separate things, yes, but the two separate things are:
1. Xiden and Germany approved NS2 to buy Russian gas to fund Putin's military.  Why the fuck should US taxpayers pay the cost to keep US troops in the EU? 
Bring them all home and boost the US GDP instead of the EU GDP.  It would save a ton of money annually.

2. The $2.5b is just 1/3 the cost of "incidentals", not the cost of the military equipment, the salaries, the food, housing, utilities, jet fuel, and the actual Budget the DOD has for the EU, which is cl9oser to $24b annually:
"...the $2.5 billion in NATO support came from what are called indirect costs -- things like rent and foreign taxes and customs duties. Such streams of support are important in evening out the books, but they are not reimbursements for outlays that the United States has made."


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

gipper said:


> Lol. There never was any threat to our national security from Afghanistan.


You are massively ignorant.  

1. Al Qaeda
2.  Pakistan's nuclear warheads'
3.  when asked what keeps him awake at night, Obama answered with 1 word > "Pakistan".


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


> Washington Examiner is a tabloid.. So that's where you get your news.


INVALIDATION is hard-wired in liberals.,...and if you had any real complaint with the *CONTENT *of this editorial, you had every opportunity to voice that SPECIFIC disagreement. 

Since you expressed no specific disagreement, I will assume you don't have one.


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## gipper (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> You are massively ignorant.
> 
> 1. Al Qaeda
> 2.  Pakistan's nuclear warheads'
> 3.  when asked what keeps him awake at night, Obama answered with 1 word > "Pakistan".


Our murderous government has killed untold numbers of innocent people, maimed thousands more and dislocated millions these past 20 years, but you’re cool with it. You are an imperialist.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

pknopp said:


> The left? This is the very action Trump called for.


I disagree with Trump.  US military cannot ignore the international jihad.  Nuclear warheads in Pakistan today, can be nuclear bombs in shipping containers in US ports tomorrow.

Incidentally, the majority of US ports are foreign-owned.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


> protectionist
> 
> The Gulf States hate Communism.  That's why they fought the Communists in Afghanistan. The Taliban were war orphans and were not in existence before 1994. They are NOT a threat to the US .. Strictly internal politics.


FALSE!  As the Washington Examiner article correctly noted >> 

"Contrary to the Trump and Biden administrations' assertions, *the Taliban remain an ally of al Qaeda*. It is thus not simply the girls and women of Afghanistan who have much to fear from a Taliban return to power. A new Taliban regime would help revitalize al Qaeda's forever war on the West. It would do so in 2021 for the same reason it did in 2001. Namely, because the Taliban share al Qaeda's theologically vested belief that the United States is intrinsically evil and requiring of forcible submission to political Islam. In turn, it should be clear that a Taliban regime would pose a profound threat to American security."


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

surada said:


> We don't have open borders.
> 
> Nordstream 2 is smart money for the Europeans.. Russia and the Stans can't eat their natural gas and its much cheaper for the Europeans.


If the Mexican border were to currently, not be called "open". it would only be becasue there no longer is a border there at all.  Biden has eliminated it.

Back to* the topic *> Afghanistan.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> Here's my $.02....
> 
> Once you decide to withdraw it means you are DONE, you're leaving, you're washing your hands of the situation...as in NOT your problem anymore.
> 
> ...


This isn't mentioning the 2 main reason for US presence.
1.  Stopping al Qaeda from having bomb-making schools & factories there.
2.  having US troops close to the Pakistan border, and able to rush into Pakistan to seize the 100+ nuclear warheads, if they were threatened to fall into the hands of jihadists.


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## struth (Aug 12, 2021)

Xiden has been on the wrong side of just above every foreign policy decision of the last fifty years


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

NoNukes said:


> http://
> After 20 years, 2,400 personnel dead, and 2 2 trillion spent, Biden was right to get out.


Then what the reasons why we were there - as stated in Post # 52.  OK to endanger US national security, facilitating jihadist aims of nuclear destruction of US cities ?


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## Leo123 (Aug 12, 2021)

Liz Cheney and a Democrat colluded to block Trump's withdrawal plans.  We would have already been out.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

gipper said:


> Our murderous government has killed untold numbers of innocent people, maimed thousands more and dislocated millions these past 20 years, but you’re cool with it. You are an imperialist.


FALSE! Our government has been fighting a defensive effort, against a foe, mightily determined to annihilate us. You are DUPED and lost.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

Leo123 said:


> Liz Cheney and a Democrat colluded to block Trump's withdrawal plans.  We would have already been out.


She finally did something right.


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## Leo123 (Aug 12, 2021)

Biden promised to end the "forever war" in Afghanistan but, meanwhile, Biden bombs Syria.
*"the Biden administration has bombed Iran-backed militias in Iraq and Syria more times in the last three months than the Trump administration did in all of 2020."*








						Opinion |  Biden Wants to Leave the Middle East, But He’s in a Vicious Bombing Cycle in Iraq
					

Caught between aggressive Tehran-backed militias and a skeptical Congress, the administration needs a better approach.




					www.politico.com
				



So, looks like we're just exchanging one war for another war....


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## pknopp (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> I disagree with Trump.  US military cannot ignore the international jihad.  Nuclear warheads in Pakistan today, can be nuclear bombs in shipping containers in US ports tomorrow.
> 
> Incidentally, the majority of US ports are foreign-owned.



 Quit screwing with them and they do likewise.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

pknopp said:


> Quit screwing with them and they do likewise.


Maybe you've never read the Koran.  Or the 1400 year history of Muslim imperialism.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

Leo123 said:


> Biden promised to end the "forever war" in Afghanistan but, meanwhile, Biden bombs Syria.
> *"the Biden administration has bombed Iran-backed militias in Iraq and Syria more times in the last three months than the Trump administration did in all of 2020."*
> 
> 
> ...


Biden (or whoever is pulling his strings) doesn't know what the hell he's doing.


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## pknopp (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Maybe you've never read the Koran.  Or the 1400 year history of Muslim imperialism.



 I've read the Bible and there is no justification for what we do in it.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

pknopp said:


> I've read the Bible and there is no justification for what we do in it.


So you don't believe in self-defense ?


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## pknopp (Aug 12, 2021)

protectionist said:


> So you don't believe in self-defense ?



 Yeah, that's why 9-11 happened. We were warned over and over to quit messing with them.


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## Colin norris (Aug 12, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


Absolutely.  Now they idiots blame Biden for bringing them home. 
This nuts have been waiting for 2000 years. Let them annihilate themselves. Who cares.


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## protectionist (Aug 12, 2021)

pknopp said:


> Yeah, that's why 9-11 happened. We were warned over and over to quit messing with them.


Don't you know that they are world supremacist ? They will not accept anything less that 100% world dominaiton of Islam.  Read the Koran.


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## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This isn't mentioning the 2 main reason for US presence.
> 1.  Stopping al Qaeda from having bomb-making schools & factories there.
> 2.  having US troops close to the Pakistan border, and able to rush into Pakistan to seize the 100+ nuclear warheads, if they were threatened to fall into the hands of jihadists.



Most AQ left Afghanistan for south Yemen, Sudan and Somalia before 2011..

Untying the Gordian Knot: Why the Taliban is Unlikely to ...









						Untying the Gordian Knot: Why the Taliban is Unlikely to Break Ties with Al-Qaeda - Modern War Institute
					

When the political officer of the US embassy in Islamabad met with top Taliban official Jalaluddin Haqqani in the Pakistani city of Rawalpindi in May 1999, neither the US government nor Haqqani knew that it would be the last major exchange between the two parties before war between them would...




					mwi.usma.edu
				




But when pressed publicly, the Taliban insists that al-Qaeda is not in Afghanistan and that the last al-Qaeda fighters left the country around the time of the Arab Spring. In off-the-record conversations, however, some Taliban leaders open up and portray foreign jihadist fighters as Muslim dissidents who deserve their support.

Pakistan remains a key US ally for two reasons: First, the army is the only force currently capable of flushing Islamist militant groups out of their sanctuaries in the tribal areas. Second, the US recognizes that they would need Pakistan to lean on the Afghan Taliban to initiate any kind of meaningful peace negotiations.
Why Pakistan will remain a key US ally | Asia | DW.COM ...
www.dw.com/en/why-pakistan-will-remain-a-key-us-ally/a-18190081
www.dw.com/en/why-pakistan-will-remain-a-key-us-ally/a-18190081


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## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Don't you know that they are world supremacist ? They will not accept anything less that 100% world dominaiton of Islam.  Read the Koran.



So far you're batting zero.

Pakistan remains a key US ally for two reasons: First, the army is the only force currently capable of flushing Islamist militant groups out of their sanctuaries in the tribal areas. Second, the US recognizes that they would need Pakistan to lean on the Afghan Taliban to initiate any kind of meaningful peace negotiations.
Why Pakistan will remain a key US ally | Asia | DW.COM ...









						Why Pakistan will remain a key US ally | DW | 14.01.2015
					

Secretary of State John Kerry has said the US will boost its security and defense cooperation with Pakistan in its fight against militants. DW speaks to analyst Omar Hamid on the nature of the US-Pakistani military bond.




					www.dw.com


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## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> INVALIDATION is hard-wired in liberals.,...and if you had any real complaint with the *CONTENT *of this editorial, you had every opportunity to voice that SPECIFIC disagreement.
> 
> Since you expressed no specific disagreement, I will assume you don't have one.



You're dumb as a stump. Most AQ left Afghanistan before 2011 and Pakistan is an important US ally.


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## Fang (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


‘The real war is in Afghanistan” - Barack Obama

If Bush and Obama both agreed troops needed to be in Afghanistan then clearly there was reason to be there. Trump also did what needed to be done for national security. However, looks Biden if going to fck it up. How many lives will be lost now with this weak President?


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## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> FALSE! Our government has been fighting a defensive effort, against a foe, mightily determined to annihilate us. You are DUPED and lost.


Oh man are you delusional.


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## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Fang said:


> ‘The real war is in Afghanistan” - Barack Obama
> 
> If Bush and Obama both agreed troops needed to be in Afghanistan then clearly there was reason to be there. Trump also did what needed to be done for national security. However, looks Biden if going to fck it up. How many lives will be lost now with this weak President?



The Taliban are not now  nor have they ever been a threat to the US. We can gather intelligence on Afghanistan without troops on the ground.


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## DudleySmith (Aug 13, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Where do you get that from?
> 
> The Russians couldn't do it in 10 years.
> 
> We tried it in 2002. That didn't happen.



We weren't trying to win a war; we were merely trying to maintain the status quo and let the locals solve their own political issues. That is the faillure, not our military; the military is constantly being misused in this fashion, as a police force and not a military force.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> We weren't trying to win a war; we were merely trying to maintain the status quo and let the locals solve their own political issues. That is the faillure, not our military; the military is constantly being misused in this fashion, as a police force and not a military force.



The Taliban isn't a threat to the US.

Who Is Responsible for the Taliban? | The Washington Institute









						Who Is Responsible for the Taliban?
					

The roots of the Afghan civil war and the country's subsequent transformation into a safe-haven for the world's most destructive terror network began in the decades prior to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan.




					www.washingtoninstitute.org
				




The fight between the mujahidin forces commanded by Masud and the Taliban became a fight between those who had been beneficiaries of American assistance in the 1980s, and those who had sprung to prominence in the aftermath of American withdrawal from Afghan affairs.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

*The Taliban explained

The armed group has emerged as a strong player as US-led foreign forces pull out of Afghanistan after 20 years.*









						The Taliban explained
					

The armed group is all set to retake power 20 years after it was removed from power in a US-led military invasion.




					www.aljazeera.com


----------



## Mac1958 (Aug 13, 2021)

Fang said:


> ‘The real war is in Afghanistan” - Barack Obama
> 
> If Bush and Obama both agreed troops needed to be in Afghanistan then clearly there was reason to be there. Trump also did what needed to be done for national security. However, looks Biden if going to fck it up. How many lives will be lost now with this weak President?


Bush put us there.  No one else.  No spin matters.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Bush put us there.  No one else.  No spin matters.


Bush went after Bin Ladin after 911.  Tora-Bora is not spin, it was a battle. 
It was the 20-years of "nation-building" that followed that was a foreign policy disaster. 
That disaster is finally playing out with beheadings and burkas, and that is none of our business, we are not the world's cop.








						Battle of Tora Bora - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Bush went after Bin Ladin after 911.  Tora-Bora is not spin, it was a battle.
> It was the 20-years of "nation-building" that followed that was a foreign policy disaster.
> That disaster is finally playing out with beheadings and burkas, and that is none of our business, we are not the world's cop.
> 
> ...



It should have been a limited police action. Taliban offered to hand OBL over if the US could produce proof,


----------



## DudleySmith (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> It should have been a limited police action. Taliban offered to hand OBL over if the US could produce proof,



They should have wiped the vermin out, leveled the places they were hiding out, whether some scumbag Pakis liked it or not. It would have been over in a day or two, like the destruction Iraq's military, with maybe 60 American casualties, most of them non-combat.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> They should have wiped the vermin out, leveled the places they were hiding out, whether some scumbag Pakis liked it or not. It would have been over in a day or two, like the destruction Iraq's military, with maybe 60 American casualties, most of them non-combat.



You do know that Pakistan and Afghanistan are not the same country, don't you? Pakistan is a US ally.


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> You do know that Pakistan and Afghanistan are not the same country, don't you? Pakistan is a US ally.



 You know how that goes.......they are all brown people and should be controlled by us or destroyed.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

pknopp said:


> You know how that goes.......they are all brown people and should be controlled by us or destroyed.



I am very opposed to the US forcing change on people to make them adhere to our cultural, religious or political beliefs.


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> I am very opposed to the US forcing change on people to make them adhere to our cultural, religious or political beliefs.



 As we have seen, we can't anyway.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

pknopp said:


> As we have seen, we can't anyway.



Always remember that the oil business hates a war zone.


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Always remember that the oil business hates a war zone.



 Unless that country won't co-operate.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

pknopp said:


> Unless that country won't co-operate.



Let me know when the US military can run an oil camp.


----------



## Turtlesoup (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Always remember that the oil business hates a war zone.


Why would you say this?


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

Turtlesoup said:


> Why would you say this?



 They would far prefer that we are simply allowed to exploit their resources without a war.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Turtlesoup said:


> Why would you say this?



Because its always been true.


----------



## Lesh (Aug 13, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> We weren't trying to win a war; we were merely trying to maintain the status quo and let the locals solve their own political issues. That is the faillure, not our military; the military is constantly being misused in this fashion, as a police force and not a military force.


Our military was used as a military force in Iraq. That didn't work so well.

Sadly, Afghanistan is not our problem.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Our military was used as a military force in Iraq. That didn't work so well.
> 
> Sadly, Afghanistan is not our problem.


What didn't work so well in Iraq?


----------



## Turtlesoup (Aug 13, 2021)

pknopp said:


> They would far prefer that we are simply allowed to exploit their resources without a war.


That assumption is so fucking wrong though.............wars have historically been very profitable for oil companies


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

Turtlesoup said:


> That assumption is so fucking wrong though.............wars have historically been very profitable for oil companies



 Wars are very profitable for the war industry. Oil companies do very well in the aftermath but they do as well without them.


----------



## DudleySmith (Aug 13, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Our military was used as a military force in Iraq. That didn't work so well.
> 
> Sadly, Afghanistan is not our problem.



Wrong, but I understand commies have to lie and make up fake news, since they have nothing to point to except their own policies of mass murder as a solution to all their own economic and political problems and need the deflections.


----------



## Lesh (Aug 13, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> Wrong, but I understand commies have to lie and make up fake news, since they have nothing to point to except their own policies of mass murder as a solution to all their own economic and political problems and need the deflections.


Nothing you said addresses my post


----------



## Lesh (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> What didn't work so well in Iraq?


We went in "full battle rattle". That was no police action. And failed miserably.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

Lesh said:


> We went in "full battle rattle". That was no police action. And failed miserably.


Failed how?  We got rid of Saddam and his larvae.  That's a big big win.
If you were a Kurd you'd also call it a big big win.  
You do know who helped us beat ISIS in Syria and Iraq?


----------



## skews13 (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...




So let Washington Times editorial board go over there and do it.


----------



## skews13 (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Failed how?  We got rid of Saddam and his larvae.  That's a big big win.
> If you were a Kurd you'd also call it a big big win.
> You do know who helped us beat ISIS in Syria and Iraq?


Saddam Hussein wasn’t in Afghanistan.

That’s why we can’t win wars anymore, rightward are to stupid to read a map.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

skews13 said:


> Saddam Hussein wasn’t in Afghanistan.
> 
> That’s why we can’t win wars anymore, rightward are to stupid to read a map.


Read post #96, we were discussing Iraq.


----------



## CowboyTed (Aug 13, 2021)

For Afganistan...

US should have told the Taliban to give up Osama pronto or they will start airstrikes against the leadership of the Taliban... 
Also send special forces and support to the various tribal leaders who support the US...

Special Forces are there for training and have a relatively low exposure to risk...

Give the Tribal Leaders Air support and hammer any troop movements by the Taliban...

Low Cost solution...

Ditto for Iraq... CIA has been at this stuff for years, don't get your hands dirty... 

Drones are great... Buy a few Drone launching ships as well... Can decommission Cruiser class to pay for them or convert them if you can...
Can run a nice cost effective war with little risk and maximum pain on the enemy...  Boots on the ground is stupid, that's what the locals are for... 
Want to meet a warlord fly in and have a meeting, Marines do that all the time in Iraq...

Simple Shit, Smart Shit...


----------



## Lesh (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Failed how?  We got rid of Saddam and his larvae.  That's a big big win.
> If you were a Kurd you'd also call it a big big win.
> You do know who helped us beat ISIS in Syria and Iraq?


So is Iraq a better place now overall than before we destroyed the country?


----------



## DudleySmith (Aug 13, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Nothing you said addresses my post


Nothing you said was anything but your worthless opinion, which you got from your Cadre bosses.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

Lesh said:


> So is Iraq a better place now overall than before we destroyed the country?


Yes.  Iraq is much better without Saddam and his larvae running it.
Their oil economy is doing well with the high price per bbl.


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.


Background:

After repeatedly calling for withdrawal from Afghanistan over many years...

*ALL THE TIMES DONALD TRUMP SAID THE U.S. SHOULD GET OUT OF AFGHANISTAN*​
... the Former Guy criticized the President's target date of September 11. He insisted that it should be _sooner_, and the President accommodated his wish:





*"I wish Joe Biden wouldn't use September 11 as the **date to withdraw*
*our troops from Afghanistan, for two reasons.*
*First,** we can **and should** get out earlier.*
*Nineteen years is enough, in fact, far too much and way too long!"*

April 19, 2021​


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Yes.  Iraq is much better without Saddam and his larvae running it.
> Their oil economy is doing well with the high price per bbl.



Right. Oil recovered 8 years after Bush won the war in Iraq.


----------



## Jim H - VA USA (Aug 13, 2021)

With Afghanistan falling to the Taliban, Delta surging, and 12-month inflation at 7.8%, it's a great time for Biden to take a two week vacation...



			Biden vacates D.C. as Afghanistan, immigration crises accelerate


----------



## whitehall (Aug 13, 2021)

It looks like it's going to be a freaking mess. Loyal Afghans will be imprisoned and killed and we won't do a thing about it except maybe to apologize for the inconvenience.


----------



## progressive hunter (Aug 13, 2021)




----------



## basquebromance (Aug 13, 2021)




----------



## Fang (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Bush put us there.  No one else.  No spin matters.



There is no spin. You seriously need to educate yourself. It's hard to believe people like yourself vote with such ignorance to what is really going on.

----

At the same time, [Obama ]added, “the counterterrorism challenges are real.” As bleak as Afghanistan’s prospects were, the United States could not afford to walk away and allow the country to become a seedbed for extremists again.

A few weeks later, the president halted the withdrawal and announced that he would leave thousands of American troops in the country indefinitely.

“This is a war that we have to win,” [Obama ]declared. He promised to send at least two more combat brigades, or roughly 10,000 soldiers, to Afghanistan.









						The Afghan War and the Evolution of Obama (Published 2017)
					

A strategy that went from a “good war” to the shorthand “Afghan good enough” reflects the president’s coming to terms with what was possible in Afghanistan.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Fang (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> The Taliban are not now  nor have they ever been a threat to the US. We can gather intelligence on Afghanistan without troops on the ground.



Right. So I should believe an anonymous internet person over two Presidents _from opposite parties_ who received intelligence briefings and both followed the same path. Gotta love the internet! LOL


----------



## Mac1958 (Aug 13, 2021)

Fang said:


> There is no spin. You seriously need to educate yourself. It's hard to believe people like yourself vote with such ignorance to what is really going on.
> 
> ----
> 
> ...


Bush put us there.  Not Obama.

You call others ignorant but don't even know THAT.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Fang said:


> Right. So I should believe an anonymous internet person over two Presidents _from opposite parties_ who received intelligence briefings and both followed the same path. Gotta love the internet! LOL



The Taliban are LOCAL.. not international.


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

CowboyTed said:


> For Afganistan...
> 
> US should have told the Taliban to give up Osama pronto or they will start airstrikes against the leadership of the Taliban...
> Also send special forces and support to the various tribal leaders who support the US...
> ...


ummmmm .... nevermind.  The Taliban weren't giving us OBL.  But that was still no reason to try nation building where nation building has failed for at least 200 years.

Some of James Michener's later work was pretty formulistic but Caravans captured some of the mystery of why a society would just self-isolate.  jmo


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Bush put us there.  Not Obama.
> 
> You call others ignorant but don't even know THAT.


W put us there as an army of occupation.  I thought Obama was wrong is even trying to find a way that war was winnable.


----------



## Nostra (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


Veggie Joe fucks up anything he touches.


----------



## easyt65 (Aug 13, 2021)

*AFGHANISTAN ON THE BRINK*
3,000 US Marines, soldiers to land in Kabul, as captures Afghan govt forces outside capital​



*BIDEN GOES AWOL*
President vacations as Afghanistan's fall sparks rising fears of 'Saigon moment'​
Biden can RUN, but he can't get away from the FACT that he has been wrong about EVERY foreign policy decision he has ever made.....He's used to it, so he doesn't need to stick around while this latest one unfolds. 















						12 US service members killed in Kabul airport explosion, officials say: LIVE UPDATES
					

A suicide bombing outside of Kabul, Afghanistan's airport Thursday has killed 12 U.S. service members, officials tell Fox News. A second explosion later took place outside the Baron Hotel, sources say.




					www.foxnews.com
				












						Biden vacates DC as Afghanistan, immigration crises accelerate
					

Biden left for Camp David Friday afternoon as thousands of U.S. troops head to Afghanistan




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## easyt65 (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> W put us there as an army of occupation.  I thought Obama was wrong is even trying to find a way that war was winnable.


W put us there...Barry kept us there.....
W put us in Iraq...Barry kept us there...
Barry put us in Syria...and Barry Kept us there...
Biden put MORE in Syria


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> W put us there...Barry kept us there.....
> W put us in Iraq...Barry kept us there...
> Barry put us in Syria...and Barry Kept us there...
> Biden put MORE in Syria


And Dump didn't get us out of ANYWHERE


----------



## easyt65 (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> And Dump didn't get us out of ANYWHERE


That's ok - NOT creating disasters like Biden in doing in Afghanistan and NOT starting another war, like the 'Nobel Peace prize Winner' did, is better than what Barry did and Biden is doing.


----------



## Dogmaphobe (Aug 13, 2021)

Every time I think of Afghanistan, I think of the scene from The man Who Would Be King where they are playing polo with a human head.  These are drooling inbreds, here, and their culture (if you can call it one) preculdes any possibility of western-style democracy.

As with the Arab world which is also inbred beyond redemption, there are only two possibilities for how the countries can operate. They are either run by a strong man type doctator who can keep a lock on all the sectarian violence caused by their being inbreds, or watch the worst religious zealots take over.

BOTH Bush and Obama have conttibuted to the disintegration of the middle east by not recognizing these people are simply not ready for democracy because they spend way too much time fucking their own family members.


----------



## Nostra (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> Background:
> 
> After repeatedly calling for withdrawal from Afghanistan over many years...
> 
> ...


Trying to blame Trump for Pedo Joe's clusterfuck?  Seriously?


----------



## easyt65 (Aug 13, 2021)

When Afghanistan's capitol does fall, and the US evac looks like Saigon, is Biden going to be AWOL like Barry was when Benghazi fell & Hussein's former soldiers helped Americans escape?


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> So far you're batting zero.
> 
> Pakistan remains a key US ally for two reasons: First, the army is the only force currently capable of flushing Islamist militant groups out of their sanctuaries in the tribal areas. Second, the US recognizes that they would need Pakistan to lean on the Afghan Taliban to initiate any kind of meaningful peace negotiations.
> Why Pakistan will remain a key US ally | Asia | DW.COM ...
> ...


YOU are batting zero by saying that. I've already stated and proven my case, in one post after another >>

Post #s 3, 46, 49, 50, 52, 54.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> You're dumb as a stump. Most AQ left Afghanistan before 2011 and Pakistan is an important US ally.


FOOL!  All it take for AQ to return to Afghanistan is what we're seeing right now. The removal of US and NATO troops.

As for Pakistan being a US ally, I never said they weren't. I said if/whenever that allied Pakistani government were TO FALL to jihadist elements, those jihadists would then have possession of Pakistan's 100+ nuclear warheads.

SO, to prevent that from happening, the plan has been to keep US troops close by in Afghanistan, where they could quickly enter Pakistan and seize the nukes, and secure them away from the jihadists.  Got it now ?

You are DUMBER than a stump.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

Fang said:


> ‘The real war is in Afghanistan” - Barack Obama
> 
> If Bush and Obama both agreed troops needed to be in Afghanistan then clearly there was reason to be there. Trump also did what needed to be done for national security. However, looks Biden if going to fck it up. How many lives will be lost now with this weak President?


Biden has already fcked it up. 
The deal between the Trump administration and the Taliban was made in February 2020, and had arranged for an orderly, non-violent takeover by the Taliban, AS LONG AS US troops were out May 1, 2021.

So who was in charge of fulfilling that promise ? Joe Biden. And who DID NOT fulfill that promise ? Joe Biden.

So Biden upset the whole applecart, by not abiding by the terms of the deal. Well, everybody knows, if you don't keep your end of a deal, the other side is not going to keep their committment either. Now, that is exactly what is happening, with the Taliban marauding one city after another with beheadings and people being shot dead, thanks to screwball Biden. Total Biden blunder.

Even the leftist Washington Post is ragging scathing condemnations at Biden over this utterly stupid pile of incompetence.

Biden faces mounting blame for Afghan debacle (msn.com)


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

gipper said:


> Oh man are you delusional.


You are clueless.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> The Taliban are not now  nor have they ever been a threat to the US. We can gather intelligence on Afghanistan without troops on the ground.


So without the troops there, our intelligence would tell us that Al Qaeda IS THERE, and is conducting bomb-making schools, and making bombs.  Great. we would have our intelligence to tell us of our impending DOOM.  

Always good to know when you are about to be annihilated, right ?  Pheeeew!  (high-pitched whistle)


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> The Taliban isn't a threat to the US.
> 
> Who Is Responsible for the Taliban? | The Washington Institute
> 
> ...


Your first sentence (_"The Taliban isn't a threat to the US._") is contradicted by your link which says >> _"a safe haven for the world's most destructive terror network"_

It is the Taliban that enables that destructive terror network to be there.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Bush put us there.  No one else.  No spin matters.


Good for Bush. Give him a medal.  If he hadn't done that, how many bombs would have exploded in US cities, and how many Americans would have been killed ?


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Your first sentence (_"The Taliban isn't a threat to the US._") is contradicted by your link which says >> _"a safe haven for the world's most destructive terror network"_
> 
> It is the Taliban that enables that destructive terror network to be there.



The author is being dramatic. The Taliban does not export terrorism. They are strictly local.


----------



## Mac1958 (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Good for Bush. Give him a medal.  If he hadn't done that, how many bombs would have exploded in US cities, and how many Americans would have been killed ?


I don't know, how many?

I can tell you for sure that many thousands of American lives, limbs and minds were lost over there, far too many young American families were destroyed, and far too many trillions of dollars were wasted.

Because that actually happened.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> So without the troops there, our intelligence would tell us that Al Qaeda IS THERE, and is conducting bomb-making schools, and making bombs.  Great. we would have our intelligence to tell us of our impending DOOM.
> 
> Always good to know when you are about to be annihilated, right ?  Pheeeew!  (high-pitched whistle)



By 1994 Al Qaeda had moved to Sudan.. after the Saudis revoked OBL's citizenship. The Taliban is NOT al Qaeda.

AQ was making bombs in Yemen.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> You do know that Pakistan and Afghanistan are not the same country, don't you? Pakistan is a US ally.


"Ally" enough to allow Al Qaeda to hide there from US forces.

Anyone who sees Pakistan as an ally of the US, should read this article, and be cured.









						The Ally From Hell
					

Pakistan lies. It hosted Osama bin Laden (knowingly or not). Its government is barely functional. It hates the democracy next door. It is home to both radical jihadists and a large and growing nuclear arsenal (which it fears the U.S. will seize). Its intelligence service sponsors terrorists who...




					www.theatlantic.com


----------



## BluesLegend (Aug 13, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> That's ok - NOT creating disasters like Biden in doing in Afghanistan and NOT starting another war, like the 'Nobel Peace prize Winner' did, is better than what Barry did and Biden is doing.


Many analysts warned that Biden has been wrong on foreign policy for almost his entire career. It's not surprise Afghanistan has quickly turned into a shit show and Biden is begging the Taliban for mercy. Wow, just wow.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> By 1994 Al Qaeda had moved to Sudan.. after the Saudis revoked OBL's citizenship. The Taliban is NOT al Qaeda.
> 
> AQ was making bombs in Yemen.


I already addressed that feeble comment.  Are you reading my posts ?


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Biden has already fcked it up.
> The deal between the Trump administration and the Taliban was made in February 2020, and had arranged for an orderly, non-violent takeover by the Taliban, AS LONG AS US troops were out May 1, 2021.
> 
> So who was in charge of fulfilling that promise ? Joe Biden. And who DID NOT fulfill that promise ? Joe Biden.
> ...












						UK defense secretary says that Trump's deal with the Taliban was 'rotten' and that the international community will likely 'pay the consequences'
					

In the rare criticism of US strategic decision-making, Ben Wallace called the US's deal with the Taliban a "mistake."




					www.businessinsider.com
				




UK defense secretary says that Trump's deal with the Taliban was 'rotten' and that the international community will likely 'pay the consequences'


----------



## BluesLegend (Aug 13, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> When Afghanistan's capitol does fall, and the US evac looks like Saigon, is Biden going to be AWOL like Barry was when Benghazi fell & Hussein's former soldiers helped Americans escape?


Dude Biden just went out on vacation.


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> I don't know, how many?
> 
> I can tell you for sure that many thousands of American lives, limbs and minds were lost over there, far too many young American families were destroyed, and far too many trillions of dollars were wasted.
> 
> Because that actually happened.


Well by toppling Saddam and allowing the Shiaa to genocide the Sunni in Iraq, we were very successful in luring AQ to Iraq.  We couldn't have done much better even it that had been what we set out to do.


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

BluesLegend said:


> Many analysts warned that Biden has been wrong on foreign policy for almost his entire career. It's not surprise Afghanistan has quickly turned into a shit show and Biden is begging the Taliban for mercy. Wow, just wow.


yes, 20 years in Afghan was a stroke of genius.  God damn Biden for figuring that one out.


----------



## BluesLegend (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> yes, 20 years in Afghan was a stroke of genius.  God damn Biden for figuring that one out.


Lib please if Trump were president during this mess you people would be screaming 24/7 calling for his impeachment and you damn well know it.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> I don't know, how many?
> 
> I can tell you for sure that many thousands of American lives, limbs and minds were lost over there, far too many young American families were destroyed, and far too many trillions of dollars were wasted.
> 
> Because that actually happened.


If AQ, or any other jihadist group, were to acquire a nuclear bomb, that could kill 10 MILLION people in and around New York City in one day.  Don't take my word for it, I got this from Obama.






						Yahoo Search - Web Search
					

The search engine that helps you find exactly what you\'re looking for. Find the most relevant information, video, images, and answers from all across the Web.




					in.news.yahoo.com
				












						What keeps Obama awake?
					

THE actor George Clooney was quoted by the January 2012 issue of Esquire magazine as having asked President Obama:...



					www.dawn.com


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

Dogmaphobe said:


> Every time I think of Afghanistan, I think of the scene from The man Who Would Be King where they are playing polo with a human head.  These are drooling inbreds, here, and their culture (if you can call it one) preculdes any possibility of western-style democracy.
> 
> As with the Arab world which is also inbred beyond redemption, there are only two possibilities for how the countries can operate. They are either run by a strong man type doctator who can keep a lock on all the sectarian violence caused by their being inbreds, or watch the worst religious zealots take over.
> 
> BOTH Bush and Obama have conttibuted to the disintegration of the middle east by not recognizing these people are simply not ready for democracy because they spend way too much time fucking their own family members.


Imo that's a bit oversimplistic.  But I'd agree that any reading of Kipling (or even noticing what happened to the Soviets) should have dissuaded an even marginally educated president from stationing an occupying force there.  

But Muslim countries operate with differing models.  Imo some are oddly similar to the division between church and state in Middle Age Europe.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> yes, 20 years in Afghan was a stroke of genius.  God damn Biden for figuring that one out.


Not genius, just doing what has to be done.  Now, because of not having troops there, we enter possibly the most dangerous era in US history, where the anti-US jihad may move from Asia, to our cities. Hopefully, not in nuclear proportions.


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

BluesLegend said:


> Lib please if Trump were president during this mess you people would be screaming 24/7 calling for his impeachment and you damn well know it.


Why.  He failed in his syrian pullout, but no one impeached him for that.

And I was a conservative before Reagan, sonny


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> If AQ, or any other jihadist group, were to acquire a nuclear bomb, that could kill 10 MILLION people in and around New York City in one day.  Don't take my word for it, I got this from Obama.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And invading Iraq stopped that how?


----------



## Mac1958 (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> If AQ, or any other jihadist group, were to acquire a nuclear bomb, that could kill 10 MILLION people in and around New York City in one day.  Don't take my word for it, I got this from Obama.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm just dealing with what actually happened, and it was a waste.  Started by Bush.


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> I'm just dealing with what actually happened, and it was a waste.  Started by Bush.


By Jimminy I guess we're just lucky we didn't invade Pakistan too!


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 13, 2021)

*"We have wasted an enormous amount of blood and treasure in Afghanistan. Their government has zero appreciation. Let's get out! "*— Trump, November 21, 2013

*"We should leave Afghanistan immediately. No more wasted lives!"  *—  Trump,  March 1, 2013

*"We should have a speedy withdrawal. Why should we keep wasting our money -- rebuild the U.S.!" *— Trump, January 14, 2013

*"Get out now and re-build U.S.!"* -Trump, December 6, 2012

*"Afghanistan is a complete waste. Time to come home!" *—Trump, August 21, 2012

*“Afghanistan is a total and complete disaster!”  - *Trump, March 13, 2012

*“Let’s get with it, get out of Afghanistan. We’ve wasted billions and billions of dollars, and more importantly, thousands and thousands of lives — not to mention all of these young men and women that come home and they really have problems.” - *Trump, March 13, 2012

*"It is time to get out of Afghanistan. We are building roads and schools for people that hate us. It is not in our national interests."  *— Trump,  February 27, 2012

_etc., etc., etc._



Nostra said:


> Trying to blame Trump for Pedo Joe's clusterfuck?


Blame? You are confused. After Trump railed for years that the U.S. should withdraw from Afghanistan, the President cannot fault Trump for the advice he is following just because Trump failed to follow it. 

The President even moved up the withdrawal date after Trump said it should be sooner.

*ALL THE TIMES DONALD TRUMP SAID THE U.S. SHOULD GET OUT OF AFGHANISTAN*




_*“I wish Joe Biden wouldn’t use September 11th as the date to withdraw *_
_*our troops from Afghanistan. For two reasons.*_ _*First, *_
_*we can and should *__*get out earlier!*_ 
_*Nineteen years is enough.*_
* in fact, far too much and way too long!”
APR 18, 2021*
[Trump Criticizes Biden's Afghanistan Withdrawal Timeline]

​


----------



## bendog (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> *"We have wasted an enormous amount of blood and treasure in Afghanistan. Their government has zero appreciation. Let's get out! "*— Trump, November 21, 2013
> 
> *"We should leave Afghanistan immediately. No more wasted lives!"  *—  Trump,  March 1, 2013
> 
> ...


He had the Taliban set for a Camp David cookout!


----------



## Missourian (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


Maybe...but it is inexcusable that Biden is on vacation while Afghanistan turns into the next fall off Saigon.

I can't blame the man for the prior mess... But I can and do blame him for a lack of leadership during the current catastrophe.

Joe "Francesco Schettino*" Biden somehow accidentally fell into Marine One and is coordinating the rescue from shore...









						Biden vacates DC as Afghanistan, immigration crises accelerate
					

Biden left for Camp David Friday afternoon as thousands of U.S. troops head to Afghanistan




					www.foxnews.com
				





*In the event you didn't get that reference...










						Francesco Schettino - Wikipedia
					






					en.m.wikipedia.org


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> And Dump didn't get us out of ANYWHERE


Trump got us out of Syria AND defeated ISIS.
Here's the area ISIS controlled when Barry couldn't handle the "JV team":



Maximum extent of ISIL's territorial control in Syria and Iraq, on 21 May 2015.








						Islamic State - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				



Trump unleashed the US military and eliminated ISIS.


----------



## Dogmaphobe (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> By Jimminy I guess we're just lucky we didn't invade Pakistan too!


Bush made a big mistake when he invaded Iraq.

Obama made a BIGGER mistake when he threw Mubarek under the bus. Not only is Egypt more imortant strategically and economically, but was a valuable ally at the time.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


I have long told my history students that as soon as U.S. troops withdraw Afghanistan will fall. We tried Vietnamization in the 1970's in South Vietnam and invaded Cambodia to give South Vietnamese Army time to train and take over bulk of the fighting. Then after U.S. troops pulled out the liberals on Capital Hill betrayed the ARVN and South Vietnam fell. We tried the "surge" in Iraq in 2003 and the Iraqi Army got it's ass kicked by ISIS ad soon as U.S. troops left. Obama sent an extra 19,000 troops to Afghanistan in order to knock down Taliban. Now that U.S. troops are leaving... Taliban winning victory after victory. Where the fuck is an Afghan version of Operation Linebacker I and II? Bring out the B-52's and close air support for Afghan Army. Biden is a pussy.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Trump got us out of Syria AND defeated ISIS.
> Here's the area ISIS controlled when Barry couldn't handle the "JV team":
> View attachment 525250
> Maximum extent of ISIL's territorial control in Syria and Iraq, on 21 May 2015.
> ...


Goddamn right!


----------



## Nostra (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> *"We have wasted an enormous amount of blood and treasure in Afghanistan. Their government has zero appreciation. Let's get out! "*— Trump, November 21, 2013
> 
> *"We should leave Afghanistan immediately. No more wasted lives!"  *—  Trump,  March 1, 2013
> 
> ...


There is a right way and a wrong way to do it.  And Veggie Joe always, ALWAYS, chooses the wrong way.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Clinton pulled a couple of quick stunts to deflect from his Monica scandal, but he didn't invade Afghanistan.


9-11 showed he should have.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> protectionist
> 
> The Gulf States hate Communism.  That's why they fought the Communists in Afghanistan. The Taliban were war orphans and were not in existence before 1994. They are NOT a threat to the US .. Strictly internal politics.


Never heard of 9-11?


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

pknopp said:


> The left? This is the very action Trump called for.


He wasn't going to cut and run like lost child Joe Biden. Trump would have a contingency plan. Biden has none.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Washington Examiner is a tabloid.. So that's where you get your news.


Liberal MSM is a propaganda wing of Democratic Party.


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He wasn't going to cut and run like lost child Joe Biden. Trump would have a contingency plan. Biden has none.



 As we have seen, Trump was all bluster and no action. When do you suppose we will get that new trade deal with China?

 He said over and over he was going to do it. Why didn't he as opposed to leaving it to others to do?


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Never heard of 9-11?



Yes. OBL went to Afghanistan at age 24 to fight communists and build roads. In 1994 Saudi Arabia revoked his Saudi citizenship so he hated the Saudis as much as he hated the US....

The Taliban had nothing to do with Sept 11th.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He wasn't going to cut and run like lost child Joe Biden. Trump would have a contingency plan. Biden has none.


One would think after 20 years and $2 trillion dollars our wonderful military and great political leadership would have Afghanistan ship shape. No?


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> As usual, the left has a different perspective than the right.  The only thing that is inevitable, is the threat to US national security by the loony Islamic jihadists, that will never go away.  1400 years of Islamic militarist imperialism has well proven that.
> 
> After 20 years in Afghanistan, it should be evident to everyone that the ultimate reality, unfortunate as it may be, is that there can never be a withdrawl of US military power from Afghanistan, or other places that Islamic lunacy chooses to place itself, and that war against the jihad is NEVER-ending.
> 
> US military will ALWAYS need to be in the Middle East, as the insanity of the Koran and its lunatics will always continue.


Eunuch's on the left have no idea how to defend s country.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Yes. OBL went to Afghanistan at age 24 to fight communists and build roads. In 1994 Saudi Arabia revoked his Saudi citizenship so he hated the Saudis as much as he hated the US....
> 
> The Taliban had nothing to do with Sept 11th.


He was angry that the U.S. had air bases in Saudi Arabia during Gulf War.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Eunuch's on the left have no idea how to defend s country.


I don’t think you understand what the word defend means.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> yes, 20 years in Afghan was a stroke of genius.  God damn Biden for figuring that one out.


Now that we have cut and run in Vietnam and Afghanistan, what nation will ever trust us again?


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He was angry that the U.S. had air bases in Saudi Arabia during Gulf War.



The Saudis love Americans. 

OBL was a religious fanatic who had been under the influence of Hassan al Banna and Sayiid Qubt.. banned in Saudi Arabia since 1970.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

gipper said:


> I don’t think you understand what the word defend means.


Destroy our enemies and threat's to the American people anywhere in the world. The best defense is a proactive offense.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Now that we have cut and run in Vietnam and Afghanistan, what nation will ever trust us again?


Oh Jesus not that old canard.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Destroy our enemies and threat's to the American people anywhere in the world. The best defense is a proactive offense.



LOLOL.. Maybe we should not stick our noses in other's people's business.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Destroy our enemies and threat's to the American people anywhere in the world. The best defense is a proactive offense.


Our military hasn’t defended us since WWII. It has invaded numerous countries for the oligarchs since then, but you’re blind to this fact.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> The Saudis love Americans.
> 
> OBL was a religious fanatic who had been under the influence of Hassan al Banna and Sayiid Qubt.. banned in Saudi Arabia since 1970.


He used Afghanistan as a base of operations to attack the United States of America. Guests of the Taliban.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He used Afghanistan as a base of operations to attack the United States of America. Guests of the Taliban.



AQ and Taliban are not the same thing. The Taliban were war orphans who didn't exist until 1994 about the time OBL moved to Sudan.


----------



## Eric Arthur Blair (Aug 13, 2021)

initforme said:


> We couldn't win there, the Russians couldn't do it. It was long overdue.


A withdrawal was inevitable, given we could not spend forever in Afghanistan.
Alexander the Great and Genghis Khan could not conquer the nation. Invasions of Afghanistan - Wikipedia
It's been a bone yard for many powerful nations.

The question is did Joe Biden withdraw deliberately and wisely. And given Joe's history of failure
of course he didn't. 








						U.S. Asks Taliban to Spare Its Embassy in Coming Fight for Kabul (Published 2021)
					

The demand seeks to stave off an evacuation of the embassy by dangling aid to future Afghan governments — even one that includes the Taliban.




					www.nytimes.com
				




This just seems pitiful and the sort of  naive weakness a major player should not lower itself to
not that such a request would be respected in any way, in any event. 

My guess is Joe will pump billions into the hands of the Taliban or whoever is running things there
hoping to bribe his way out of a disaster.

Although I thoroughly dislike Barack Obama I respect that he's always been discourteous and
disrespectful towards Joe (his non invitation to his recent birthday party for Joe being
the most recent example).

Obama is right...Biden will fuck up whatever he's given to do.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

gipper said:


> Our military hasn’t defended us since WWII. It has invaded numerous countries for the oligarchs since then, but you’re blind to this fact.


Look Calvin Coolidge, where did isolationism get us? The Pearl Harbor attacks and we had the 18th largest army in the world. Romania and Sweden had larger military force. You do realize that there are groups and nation states around the world that want to kill Americans don't you?


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> AQ and Taliban are not the same thing. The Taliban were war orphans who didn't exist until 1994 about the time OBL moved to Sudan.


Al Qaeda an Bin Laden were "guests" of the Taliban. Do you know Al Qaeda translated means "The Base?"


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Look Calvin Coolidge, where did isolationism get us? The Pearl Harbor attacks and we had the 18th largest army in the world. Romania and Sweden had larger military force. You do realize that there are groups and nation states around the world that want to kill Americans don't you?



That's what happens if you invade another country.. They hate you.


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He used Afghanistan as a base of operations to attack the United States of America. Guests of the Taliban.



 Which never happens if we had minded our own business.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Al Qaeda an Bin Laden were "guests" of the Taliban. Do you know Al Qaeda translated means "The Base?"



Not exactly.. AQ fought the communists .. So did the Mujahideen... The Soviets pulled out. Then the US pulled out and Afghanistan was left broken and lawless. In 1994 the war orphans organized to restore order and just went too far..  But, they stopped the rapes and the carjackings and the Opium production.


----------



## iamwhatiseem (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


READ: The fact that the situation as is will get intolerably worse if we leave doesn't matter to me.

  I wasn't a supporter of this either in the beginning. But the fact remains we are (were) there. And once again, we are abandoning a people we propped up - to be murdered/raped/abused by those we convinced them to fight.
  Right now the Taliban are literally storming into people's houses and kidnapping their daughters to be sex slaves for soldiers. Mass murders are and will happen. Public hangings will return.
   If you think people hated us before in this region, that hatred will boil down to pure fury now.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Not exactly.. AQ fought the communists .. So did the Mujahideen... The Soviets pulled out. Then the US pulled out and Afghanistan was left broken and lawless. In 1994 the war orphans organized to restore order and just went too far..  But, they stopped the rapes and the carjackings and the Opium production.


They make their $$$ off the heroin trade. Taliban is ran by drug smuggling war lord's and rape girls and boys on a regular basis.


----------



## C_Clayton_Jones (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


This will forever be GWB’s failure; he alone is responsible for all that happens.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> They make their $$$ off the heroin trade. Taliban is ran by drug smuggling war lord's and rape girls and boys on a regular basis.



Nope. The Taliban shut down Opium production.. You have your players mixed up.. The Taliban are NOT Mujahideen and now the Taliban are fighting them.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> Background:
> 
> After repeatedly calling for withdrawal from Afghanistan over many years...
> 
> ...


Trump would have a contingency plan to provide close air support. Biden has cut and ran like a coward.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> Nope. The Taliban shut down Opium production.. You have your players mixed up.. The Taliban are NOT Mujahideen and now the Taliban are fighting them.


You are dumb as dog shit.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Look Calvin Coolidge, where did isolationism get us? The Pearl Harbor attacks and we had the 18th largest army in the world. Romania and Sweden had larger military force. You do realize that there are groups and nation states around the world that want to kill Americans don't you?


Isolationism lol. We are so far from that it’s on the other side of the universe. How about we just stop the constant foreign interventions and imperialism?


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

pknopp said:


> You know how that goes.......they are all brown people and should be controlled by us or destroyed.


What a dumb statement.


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> *"We have wasted an enormous amount of blood and treasure in Afghanistan. Their government has zero appreciation. Let's get out! "*— Trump, November 21, 2013
> 
> *"We should leave Afghanistan immediately. No more wasted lives!"  *—  Trump,  March 1, 2013
> 
> ...


Trump was pulling out of afghanistan

but a stolen election prevented him from doing what biden is doing now

and I supported the decision until very recently

but thankfully we dont yet have a CCP style controlled media where liberals on Washington, New York and Silicon Valley determine what we are allowed to think and say

what is truth and what is a lie that gets people banned from Twitter or FaceBook

so reading dissenting opinions I now think we should have remained in afghanistan as long as iran and china are military threats


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

gipper said:


> Isolationism lol. We are so far from that it’s on the other side of the universe. How about we just stop the constant foreign interventions and imperialism?


Um... that would be isolationism Ron Paul.


----------



## Bush92 (Aug 13, 2021)

NoNukes said:


> http://
> After 20 years, 2,400 personnel dead, and 2 2 trillion spent, Biden was right to get out.


He cut and ran without a coherent plan.


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> What a dumb statement.



 And yet you could provide nothing to counter it. Let's imagine for a second that we minded our own business. That would mean we don't interfere in the Afghanistan/Russia mess. Let's say Russia wins. Do you think the Taliban sets up there? Does OBL have any beef with the U.S. if we had completely minded our own business all around?


----------



## pknopp (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He cut and ran without a coherent plan.



 One might have thought there would have been a plan before we invaded.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> Um... that would be isolationism Ron Paul.


No it would not. Look up the term.

Why are you an imperialist?  Have you failed to learn from history?


----------



## bodecea (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


You should go there and help out.


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> I'm just dealing with what actually happened, and it was a waste. Started by Bush.


I remember libs giving him hell about how we supported the resistance fighters when they were fighting the russians when Bush41 was president

but then abandoned the country when we no longer needed them

Bush43 being a bleeding heart “compassionate” conservative decided to stay and nation build when he should gave pulled out after 6 months and let the afghns return to their usual barbarism


----------



## bodecea (Aug 13, 2021)

kyzr said:


> 1. I'm glad we are finally pulling out of AFG, 20-years was too long
> 2. Trump's "enhanced vetting" should have been good enough to protect the US from terrorism, but Xiden's "open borders" fucks that up.
> 3. We need to pull out of Europe next, let the EU fund their own defense, then Nord Stream 2 might look a bit different to them


No such thing as open borders.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 13, 2021)

bodecea said:


> No such thing as open borders.


Even Mayorkas admits the border is open.  Listen to the tape,








						LEAKED AUDIO: Biden’s Radical DHS Chief Mayorkas on Border Crisis: “This is Unsustainable. These Numbers Cannot Continue”
					

Joe Biden’s radical open borders DHS chief Alejandro Mayorkas privately told Border Patrol agents in Texas that the border crisis is “unsustainable.” “A couple of days ago I was down in Mexico, and…



					goodtree.us


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

bodecea said:


> You should go there and help out.



We could bomb the Afghan mountains until  our heads falls off and not do much damage to them.


----------



## surada (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> I remember libs giving him hell about how we supported the resistance fighters when they were fighting the russians when Bush41 was president
> 
> but then abandoned the country when we no longer needed them
> 
> Bush43 being a bleeding heart “compassionate” conservative decided to stay and nation build when he should gave pulled out after 6 months and let the afghns return to their usual barbarism



No he didn't. When his pipeline negotiations with the Taliban failed Dubya raced in to try and save ENRON.


----------



## gipper (Aug 13, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> They make their $$$ off the heroin trade. Taliban is ran by drug smuggling war lord's and rape girls and boys on a regular basis.


You’d think after 20 years of occupation that failed your kind would recognize the futility of a interventionist foreign policy, but no.

You do know what it means to do the same thing over and over expecting a different result?


----------



## Sandy Shanks (Aug 13, 2021)

protectionist said:


> *By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise, Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.*


Afghanistan, "the graveyard of empires."

Of course, Biden failed in Afghanistan. Twenty years, two trillion dollars, tens of thousands of dead and wounded later this should come as no surprise. After all that, not a damn thing was accomplished. Yeah, Biden failed.

As did President Bush, and he started the war by invading Afghanistan. Bush was in office for eight years. The war was in full fury mode when he left office. 

President "The Right War" Obama also failed in Afghanistan. He was in office for eight years and ultimately sent in 85,000 troops to defeat the Taliban. The war was in full fury mode when he left office. 

President Trump also failed in Afghanistan. He was in office for eight years and all he did was order a retreat, trusting the Taliban would hold up their end of the bargain. Instead, the Taliban ignored the gullible American President. The war was in full fury mode when he left office. 

Biden has been in office for seven months and he inherited the failed Afghan war from three previous Presidents. A massive offensive against the Taliban was out of the question. Biden would either be impeached or lynched. He had no choice but to withdraw, retreat, evacuate, surrender, whatever term the reader wishes to use. They all mean the same thing -- something the White House should learn.

But why did all this happened? It happened because American Presidents completely misread the people of Afghanistan. 

The Afghan security forces number over 300,000, and they have an air force. They also have billions of dollars of equipment we gave them. 

They have no desire to fight the Taliban.

The Taliban are Afghans. Moreover, they are the largest ethic group in Afghanistan. 

Why are the Taliban America's enemy? Why did Bush attack the Taliban?

*Because the Taliban gave safe haven to al Qaeda, the terrorist group that attacked us on 9/11.*

Does anyone think the soldiers and officers of the Afghan army give a rat's ass about that twenty years later?

Essentially, we trained and equipped the Afghan army to fight Afghans. Also, members of the Afghan army have more in common with the Taliban than they do with Americans.

That is why America failed in Afghanistan. The twenty-year debacle should be treated as a lesson learned.

Never again.


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Trump was pulling out of afghanistan...


He was pulling out for four years, just as he had been vociferously advocating should be done since 2011 if not before. 

If the American electorate had_ not _fired the Cry Baby Loser at their first opportunity, would he now be repealing 'ObamaCare' and replacing it with _"something terrific!"_ that _"covers everybody!"_? Would he be building a _"big, beautiful wall!"_ that he'd be making Mexico pay for? Would he be eagerly sharing his tax returns with the American public? Would he be reviving coal mining? Resurrecting the steel industry? Rebuilding the nation's infrastructure? etc. etc., etc.

You can fantasize if you need to.

Trump approves sending 4,000 more troops to Afghanistan​[Trump approves sending 4,000 more troops to Afghanistan, senior official says]​One thing I _am _confident of, if he had not been thrown out on his big, flabby candy ass, he would _not_ be inciting his goons to attack Congress to trash the democratic process.




​


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> Background:
> 
> After repeatedly calling for withdrawal from Afghanistan over many years...
> 
> ...


What does this have to do with the topic ?


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

Jim H - VA USA said:


> With Afghanistan falling to the Taliban, Delta surging, and 12-month inflation at 7.8%, it's a great time for Biden to take a two week vacation...
> 
> 
> 
> Biden vacates D.C. as Afghanistan, immigration crises accelerate


Hiden' Biden.  Where else will he hide, after this ?


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

whitehall said:


> It looks like it's going to be a freaking mess. Loyal Afghans will be imprisoned and killed and we won't do a thing about it except maybe to apologize for the inconvenience.


It's already happening. Beheadings and mass shootings, galore.*  Biden's fault.*


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> The Taliban are LOCAL.. not international.


You need to read the OP link article.....thoroughly.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> W put us there as an army of occupation.  I thought Obama was wrong is even trying to find a way that war was winnable.


It isn't a scenario about winning. It is about containing and defending.


----------



## Turtlesoup (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> He was pulling out for four years, just as he had been vociferously advocating should be done since 2011 if not before.
> 
> If the American electorate had_ not _fired the Cry Baby Loser at their first opportunity, would he now be repealing 'ObamaCare' and replacing it with _"something terrific!"_ that _"covers everybody!"_? Would he be building a _"big, beautiful wall!"_ that he'd be making Mexico pay for? Would he be eagerly sharing his tax returns with the American public? Would he be reviving coal mining? Resurrecting the steel industry? Rebuilding the nation's infrastructure? etc. etc., etc.
> 
> ...


You are a fool.....congress was attacked because it is corrupt and needs to be protested---and really rioted and overthrown at this point.    Most of our congress critters belong in prison.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> And Dump didn't get us out of ANYWHERE


Actually, Trump DID get us out of Afghanistan. It was his agreement with the Taliban in February of 2020, that established the framework for the 2021 withdrawl (even though Biden fcked it up, by not following through on the designated date - May 1, 2021)

A whole lot of blood is on Biden's hands now, because of that huge blunder.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> He was pulling out for four years, just as he had been vociferously advocating should be done since 2011 if not before.
> 
> If the American electorate had_ not _fired the Cry Baby Loser at their first opportunity, would he now be repealing 'ObamaCare' and replacing it with _"something terrific!"_ that _"covers everybody!"_? Would he be building a _"big, beautiful wall!"_ that he'd be making Mexico pay for? Would he be eagerly sharing his tax returns with the American public? Would he be reviving coal mining? Resurrecting the steel industry? Rebuilding the nation's infrastructure? etc. etc., etc.
> 
> ...


Too much idiocy here to spend time responding.  Nah!


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> When Afghanistan's capitol does fall, and the US evac looks like Saigon, is Biden going to be AWOL like Barry was when Benghazi fell & Hussein's former soldiers helped Americans escape?


He already is.









						Joe Biden Heads to Camp David for Extended Five-Day Vacation as Afghanistan Falls Apart - Patriots Freedom
					

President Joe Biden left his home in Delaware for the presidential retreat at Camp David on Friday, even as news spread of Afghanistan rapidly losing territory to the Taliban. The White House announced that there were no public events scheduled while Biden resides at Camp David until Wednesday...




					www.patriotsfreedom.com


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> The author is being dramatic. The Taliban does not export terrorism. They are strictly local.


I have explained it enough times. You are either in Deep Denial, or are brain dead.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

bendog said:


> And invading Iraq stopped that how?


Going into Afghanistan, not Iraq.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> I'm just dealing with what actually happened, and it was a waste.  Started by Bush.


No.  US troops in Afghanistan kept al Qaeda at bay, and away from making bombs and having training camps there.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 13, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> *"We have wasted an enormous amount of blood and treasure in Afghanistan. Their government has zero appreciation. Let's get out! "*— Trump, November 21, 2013
> 
> *"We should leave Afghanistan immediately. No more wasted lives!"  *—  Trump,  March 1, 2013
> 
> ...


Moving the withdrawl date (May 1, 2021) is, and will be forever, one of Biden's biggest blunders as POTUS.  Thousands of good people are being killed right now, because of his stupidity.

Even the leftist Washington Post bitched him out over it.



			Biden faces mounting blame for Afghan debacle


----------



## candycorn (Aug 13, 2021)

surada said:


> It should have been a limited police action. Taliban offered to hand OBL over if the US could produce proof,


Unlikely...link?


----------



## lantern2814 (Aug 13, 2021)

Biden’s Saigon. What did the drooling dementia patient expect when he told the world exactly when we were leaving? Now  running away instead of answering questions he hasn’t been prepared  for.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 13, 2021)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> This will forever be GWB’s failure; he alone is responsible for all that happens.


Nope...failure also belongs at the feet of Obama who didn't get us out of there after he got Bin Laden and Trump.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 13, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> I remember libs giving him hell about how we supported the resistance fighters when they were fighting the russians when Bush41 was president
> 
> but then abandoned the country when we no longer needed them
> 
> Bush43 being a bleeding heart “compassionate” conservative decided to stay and nation build when he should gave pulled out after 6 months and let the afghns return to their usual barbarism


You must have made that comment here at some point right?  I'm guessing not.


----------



## NoNukes (Aug 14, 2021)

Bush92 said:


> He cut and ran without a coherent plan.


They knew the US was leaving and should have been prepared. It was a mistake that lasted 20 years after failures by the Soviets and British.


----------



## DudleySmith (Aug 14, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Yes.  Iraq is much better without Saddam and his larvae running it.
> Their oil economy is doing well with the high price per bbl.



First they run around babbling about 'American imperialism', then they whine when we try and stabilized them while they attempt to determine their own course, and when they fail it's suddenly our fault or something. Forget discussing anything with these morons; all they're here for is to peddle narratives all about how America sucks, yet they can't point to anybody else eve doing any better. That's because they can't find anybody else who ever did better.


----------



## DudleySmith (Aug 14, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> W put us there...Barry kept us there.....
> W put us in Iraq...Barry kept us there...
> Barry put us in Syria...and Barry Kept us there...
> Biden put MORE in Syria



FEinstein and other Democrats needed to make more money first, so Obama waited. Feinstein's hubby became a billionaire off of government contracts, for one.


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Unlikely...link?



CNN.com - U.S., Taliban bargained over bin Laden ...
www.cnn.com/2005/US/08/19/taliban.documents/index.html
Ahmed "said that the U.S., if it chose to do so, could arrange to have bin Laden killed by cruise missiles or other means, and there would be little the Taliban could do to prevent it," according ...

Taliban agreed Bin Laden handover in 1998 | World news ...








						Taliban agreed Bin Laden handover
					

The Taliban leader, Mullah Mohammed Omar agreed three years ago to hand over Osama bin Laden, but changed his mind after US cruise missile attacks, the former head of Saudi Arabian intelligence said yesterday.




					www.theguardian.com
				



The Taliban leader, Mullah Mohammed Omar agreed three years ago to hand over Osama bin Laden, but changed his mind after US cruise missile attacks, the former head of Saudi Arabian intelligence ...


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

And again in 2001.

Bush rejects Taliban offer to hand Bin Laden over ...








						Bush rejects Taliban offer to hand Bin Laden over
					

9.30pm update: * Taliban demand evidence of Bin Laden's guilt * Second week of airstrikes starts * Taliban urges US to halt bombing




					www.theguardian.com
				



In Jalalabad, deputy prime minister Haji Abdul Kabir - the third most powerful figure in the ruling Taliban regime - told reporters that the Taliban would require evidence that Bin Laden was behind...


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

The US-Taliban Agreement signed in Doha on 29 February 2020 between USA and Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan with much fanfare is the root cause of the current problems that besiege Afghanistan. The so called “Peace Agreement” has failed to deliver any semblance of peace in Afghanistan. To the contrary, the agreement emboldened Taliban to intensify violence, fully aware that Afghanistan forces after withdrawal of US support were simply ‘sacrificial lambs’ waiting to be slaughtered devoid of any aerial support. As a result the Afghan National Army troops only thought it prudent to abandon their positions rather than face a certain death at hands of Taliban.

Financial Express - Business News, Stock Market News
Sign in

INVEST IN US MARKET
Contradictions galore in Afghanistan: Defunct militias only hope
Updated: August 13, 2021 3:23 PM
The US-Taliban Agreement signed in Doha on 29 February 2020 between USA and Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan with much fanfare is the root cause of the current problems that besiege Afghanistan. The so called “Peace Agreement” has failed to deliver any semblance of peace in Afghanistan.
afghanistan
The rapid advance of Taliban through North and North West Afghanistan has sent shivers down the spine of Afghan government. (Photo source: Reuters)
By Maj Gen NK Bhatia, 

The current situation in Afghanistan today is anything but a “mess” perpetuated by those who had set about to set things right.

RELATED NEWS
World Punjabi Organisation urges Home Minister to evacuate Hindu, Sikh families from KabulKabul to fall soon? Assault on capital anytime now as Taliban seize more cities across Afghanistan
The US-Taliban Agreement signed in Doha on 29 February 2020 between USA and Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan with much fanfare is the root cause of the current problems that besiege Afghanistan. The so called “Peace Agreement” has failed to deliver any semblance of peace in Afghanistan. To the contrary, the agreement emboldened Taliban to intensify violence, fully aware that Afghanistan forces after withdrawal of US support were simply ‘sacrificial lambs’ waiting to be slaughtered devoid of any aerial support. As a result the Afghan National Army troops only thought it prudent to abandon their positions rather than face a certain death at hands of Taliban.

As a result almost two third of rural Afghanistan and three major cities today are in control of Taliban within less than one month of US and its coalition partners withdrawing their support from Afghan government forces.


Taliban at first escalated attacks in major cities by attacking minorities across Afghanistan. At first the attacks The Taliban started escalating the violence beginning March 2020 after a moral victory, having forced USA to negotiate with them and leave the Afghan government at the side lines, showing irrelevance of President Ashraf Ghani and his entire newly elected government.

Taliban at first escalated attacks in major cities by attacking minorities across Afghanistan. At first the attacks were attributed to Islamic State Khorasan Province (ISKP). It remained silent on its annual Spring Offensive that it has been unleashing every year to show its relevance and challenge the authority of legitimate government. Its attacks on government forces continued with full intensity leaving very little room for any negotiations, except at terms that were acceptable to the Taliban.

The US had been entrapped in an Agreement with an uncompromising Taliban and it neither had any leverage or control left over actions of Taliban. The Taliban on the other hand started regaining its strength. It was courted by all the countries that had been too willing to see back of USA in Afghanistan. Resultantly during the last one year Taliban has gained its legitimacy and has been on the high table of round table conferences hosted by Russia, Iran and Turkey. However most significantly Taliban’s direct negotiations with China have drawn maximum attention, with Taliban showing a readiness to accommodate Chinese concerns of an expanding Uygur uprising.

Pakistan, as usual continues to play its double game of playing smug on any commitment to rein in Taliban or help reach a consensus for peace in Afghanistan. To the contrary, its Prime Minister has openly stated that Taliban would be unwilling to join any peace as long as President Ghani stays in power, reconfirming its continued mentoring of Taliban leadership. Pakistan has never shied away from admitting Taliban as its protégés and claiming that it considers Afghanistan as its backyard. It fails to see that once anointed in power and free of shackles, Taliban would be a difficult ally to please and control.

The rapid advance of Taliban through North and North West Afghanistan has sent shivers down the spine of Afghan government. It was this region that had stood against Taliban during the last time it had gained control over Afghanistan. As is well known, Taliban draws its strength from Pushtun dominated region of South Afghanistan that neighbours Pakistan, from where it draws its cadres, weapons and political guidance.

The fast paced capture of North and North West therefore seems to be a carefully crafted Taliban strategy to dominate and control non Pushtun regions dominated by Afghanistan’s major ethnic minorities, namely Tajiks, Uzbeks and Hazara’s who could possibly pose a threat to Taliban’s takeover of complete country due to their aligning with a number of parallel power centres controlled by war lords that once held complete sway over the region and now stand relatively weak due to their diminished strength over passage of time.

President Ashraf Ghanis who has been vocal to his opposition to the Afghan warlords seems to have suddenly realised the importance of warlords. Struck against the menace of advancing Taliban he opened negotiations with Abdul Rashid Dostum in Kabul, till last year one of his Vice President but currently out of favour, and thereafter rushed to Mazar e Sharief on 11 Aug 2021 to open negotiations with a battery of other warlords and formulate a joint strategy of taking on Taliban in conjunction with Afghan forces and set up a Joint Command Centre at Mazar-e-Sharif after meeting Atta Mohammad Noor and Dostum.

As things stand today Afghan government seems to have very limited options with Afghan National Army troops abandoning their positions in meek surrender to Taliban. The fresh negotiations with warlords and a combined strategy with Afghan government troops would be the only way to put up resistance. However most private militias of late 1990’s having been disarmed and their leadership having merged with Afghan society to take different roles in civil society, their revival is likely to be a challenging task.

A few noteworthy erstwhile regional strongmen who continue to command loyalty and armed backing are Abdul Rashid Dostum, Atta Mohammad Noor, Ismael Khan and Bismillah Khan. Others like Abdullah Abdullah, Ahmed Zia Massoud (brother of Ahmed Shah Massoud) and a few junior commanders have successfully moved to political roles.

Reviving old militias and setting up of joint command that is envisaged is a herculean task with need to find new recruits and equip them. The requirement of money for equipment and manpower is therefore immense. The militias have their loyalty to warlords with inter group rivalry amongst cadres for control of territory and areas of influence. And finally the warlords over a period of time have aged with no young leadership in sight. All these pose a formidable challenge for the current regime.

Afghan government faces challenges to its survival and the only way to take on Taliban appears to be consolidation of forces that have capacity to withstand the onslaught of Taliban. Reequipping and rearming of erstwhile militias and empowering old warlords is a strategy but with immense challenges and huge uncertainties. However the fact that Afghanistan is heading to a civil war is certain.

(The author is Indian Army Veteran. Views expressed are personal and do not reflect the official position or policy of Financial Express Online.)









						Contradictions galore in Afghanistan: Defunct militias only hope
					

The US-Taliban Agreement signed in Doha on 29 February 2020 between USA and Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan with much fanfare is the root cause of the current problems that besiege Afghanistan. The so called “Peace Agreement” has failed to deliver any semblance of peace in Afghanistan.




					www.financialexpress.com


----------



## candycorn (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> CNN.com - U.S., Taliban bargained over bin Laden ...
> www.cnn.com/2005/US/08/19/taliban.documents/index.html
> Ahmed "said that the U.S., if it chose to do so, could arrange to have bin Laden killed by cruise missiles or other means, and there would be little the Taliban could do to prevent it," according ...
> 
> ...



Oh yeah; in 1998; 3 years before 9/11.


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Oh yeah; in 1998; 3 years before 9/11.



And again in 2001.









						Bush rejects Taliban offer to hand Bin Laden over
					

9.30pm update: * Taliban demand evidence of Bin Laden's guilt * Second week of airstrikes starts * Taliban urges US to halt bombing




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

Afghanistan before the communists overthrew the Monarchy.


----------



## EMH (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> CNN.com - U.S., Taliban bargained over bin Laden ...
> www.cnn.com/2005/US/08/19/taliban.documents/index.html
> Ahmed "said that the U.S., if it chose to do so, could arrange to have bin Laden killed by cruise missiles or other means, and there would be little the Taliban could do to prevent it," according ...
> 
> ...




"Head of Saudi Intel" = Zionist Jew liar


----------



## EMH (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> And again in 2001.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Tenet and sandy the burglar had 9 opportunities to off col Tim osman, and failed to strike each time, because col Tim osman was a Zionist Jew CIA/Mossad double agent, and tenet and zionism's #1 hero....

Saudi's were in on 911 too = Putin


----------



## candycorn (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> And again in 2001.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You're under the impression that the Taliban had Bin Laden--who had done 9/11 right before--in pocket?  I doubt it myself.


----------



## EMH (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> You're under the impression that the Taliban had Bin Laden--who had done 9/11 right before--in pocket?  I doubt it myself.





Because you know col tim osman worked for your employer....

The mossad


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

Afghanistan also had very active Girl Scouting.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> Afghanistan also had very active Girl Scouting.


Soon they'll be shot in the head by the Taliban...


----------



## Desperado (Aug 14, 2021)

If you want someone to blame for the fall of Afghanistanm blame the  Afghanistan Army!  Talk about worthless, 20 years of US training and equipment and they drop their weapons and run faster than you thought possible,


----------



## surada (Aug 14, 2021)

EMH said:


> Because you know col tim osman worked for your employer....
> 
> The mossad



Tim Osman was only 5'11". You are completely in the dark and stuck in stupid conspiracy theories.


----------



## EMH (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> Tim Osman was only 5'11". You are completely in the dark and stuck in stupid conspiracy theories.



You have no photos of "Osama" in Saudi, and you have lied about that here a dozen times.

Tell us how you know col Tim osman.  When did you measure his height.  Col Tim osman is clearly 4-5 inches taller than Zbigniew, who was listed as 5-11....

Hint - your side denies col Tim osman exists.....


----------



## Burgermeister (Aug 14, 2021)

We didn't take care of all this shit before we executed the withdrawal? What a bunch of idiots.


----------



## EMH (Aug 14, 2021)

kyzr said:


> Soon they'll be shot in the head by the Taliban...




If you believe anything that lying traitor posts, you have no clue...

He knew col tim osman and "Osama" but he does not have

One single photo of "Osama" in Saudi despite lying and lying and lying about it....


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 14, 2021)

_"We have a proud family  tradition of fighting in Afghanistan
generation after generation through the ages."_​


protectionist said:


> Moving the withdrawl date (May 1, 2021) is, and will be forever, one of Biden's biggest blunders as POTUS.  Thousands of good people are being killed right now, because of his stupidity.


Whether the President should have stuck with his original withdrawal date of 9/11 or followed Trump's insistence that it should be sooner may be of no consequence whatever. 

Extricating the United States from the Bush quagmire - an inevitably gruesome necessity - has been an imperative that has been deferred far too long. Was a collapse of democratic governance inevitable? We can only speculate, but there are ample, historically-validated reasons to believe so. Why postpone the inevitable even further when the unjustifiable cost that has been exacted for two decades is relentless?

_"It has only been twenty years. Let's squander American lives and treasure for just a while longer!" _is not an informed calculus.

*Here are five reasons why that the U.S. is not likely to return to war in Afghanistan.*

1. American Voters are opposed to staying in Afghanistan​​_"We already have service members doing their duty in Afghanistan today whose parents served in the same war,"_ Biden said in April, explaining his plans to leave the country. _"We have service members who were not yet born when our nation was attacked on 9/11."_​​His push has been largely supported by the American public. A July poll  found 70% of Americans support withdrawing U.S. forces from Afghanistan by Sept. 11, the 20th anniversary of the attacks, while 29% oppose doing so.​​2. Returning would risk American casualties​​Yes, combat troops could return. The Taliban military is no match for U.S. forces. But the costs would not be insignificant and likely far more than what the American public is willing to support.​​"It would destroy his presidency, not least because they would have to fight their way back in, and they would clearly take casualties doing it," Crocker said.​​3. Doubts more time would create a different outcome​​The United States spent $2.26 trillion on the war in Afghanistan, trying to rebuild the Afghan government and train its military, according to the Costs of War project.​​... "And for his critics who say, 'Oh, if we had just stayed a little longer we would have avoided the situation.' If you weren't able to do what needed to be done in 20 years, why do you think 21 or 22 years would have done the trick?"​​4. The U.S. mission wouldn't be clear​​_"We went to war with clear goals"_ Biden said. _"We achieved those objectives. [Osama] Bin Laden is dead, and al-Qaida is degraded in Iraq — in Afghanistan. And it's time to end the forever war."_​​The United States would need a new reason to return.​​"So what's the mission?" Crocker said. "To exterminate the Taliban? Bolster the [Afghan President Ashraf] Ghani government? In what ways? And again, to what end? So it's just to me is an utterly imaginary scenario. We will not be going back."​​5. Biden's focus is on domestic challenges — and China​​"We'll be much more formidable to our adversaries and competitors over the long term if we fight the battles for the next 20 years, not the last 20," he said.​​Charles Kupchan, a senior adviser in the Obama White House, said it's a lesson Biden learned after four years of former President Donald Trump.​​"Trump was responding to a sentiment in the American electorate: 'Too much world, not enough America. What about us?'," Kupchan said.​​He said Biden understands this and therefore is focused on repairing problems at home and "rebuilding schools in Kansas, not in Kandahar."​​


_*"If we just wait one more day, peace in*_​*Afghanistan may be achieved tomorrow!"*​​*

*​
*When I'm stuck with a day
That's gray,
And lonely,
I just stick out my chin
And Grin,
And Say,
Oh

Tomorrow!
Tomorrow!
I love ya
Tomorrow!
You're always
A day
A way!*​


----------



## Flash (Aug 14, 2021)

Don't worry.  The 3K troops Jo Dufus sent to evacuate the embassy are queers fresh off their CRT training.  They will be hell for the Taliban.


----------



## basquebromance (Aug 14, 2021)




----------



## basquebromance (Aug 14, 2021)

To our troops who fought in the Afghan War:
You did your job. You did it well. You defeated the enemies of America at every turn.
You gave the Afghans a shot at freedom. Be proud of your service because America is proud of you.

This Afghan debacle is on the suits. Not the boots.


----------



## basquebromance (Aug 14, 2021)

MSNBC finally disagrees with Biden and you'll never guess about what!  

Pulling out of Afghanistan.  Now, there's NOT ONE GOOD THING about liberals.  They're not even anti-war.


----------



## DudleySmith (Aug 14, 2021)

surada said:


> Afghanistan also had very active Girl Scouting.



Well to be fair, commies set such a low bar any insane asylum cou;d produce a better government, so it's not really a great point.


----------



## JLW (Aug 14, 2021)

Biden’s withdrawal of US forces just followed Trump’s deal with the Taliban to withdraw by May.  They both erred by not withdrawing troops in November or December when fighting is at a lull as opposed to the summer months when the fighting is the most intense.


----------



## Remodeling Maidiac (Aug 14, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> I think Biden is a dangerously stupid and incompetent person but I don't blame him for whatever happens in that shithole when we leave. And I don't care how we leave as long as it is safely. I don't buy the bullshit argument that we have to fight them over there or we'll have to fight them over here. That's just an excuse for a terrible policy.


My opinion is that we should have left YEARS ago. We have satellites that can read license plates so If we see something that needs delt with we can send in a few missiles from afar.


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 14, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> was pulling out for four years, just as he had been vociferously advocating should be done since 2011 if not before.


Trump just cant win with you folks

the generals were completely against leaving afghanistan

if trump had ordered it over their objections you would have roasted him for not obeying the experts

but he finally did schedule a pullout

btw, I now think leaving afghanistan was a mistake after all

so go figure


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> You must have made that comment here at some point right? I'm guessing not.


I may have


----------



## Desperado (Aug 14, 2021)

Biden's mistake was not evacuating all Americans before pulling the troops out. Then he should have used a MOAB to bombed the US embassy leaving nothing but ruble


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 14, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Trump just cant win with you folks


I have no idea who your "you folks" are. It makes you sound alienated. Perchance, the majority of the American electorate who voted for the President?

In any event, I give Trump full credit for repeatedly calling for the withdrawal of U.S. troops over the years, as well as for his call for the President to move up the withdrawal date. If he needs to take credit, I'll give him the unstinting approval that he craves.

Was there _ever_ a "good time" to extract the nation from the quagmire Dubya stumbled into, and is a "good time" now a prospect? No.


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 14, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> Was there _ever_ a good time to extract the nation from the quagmire Dubya stumbled into, and was a good time _ever _a prospect? No.


I suppose I will never be in sync with events

because i fully supported in the invasion at first and still do

but in retrospect our mistake was trying to nation build 

the afghans are a crazy people who are never going to be civilized or peaceful

it was folly to ever think they could be changed

so after six months of destruction there we should have left

however, having invested 20 years and much American blood,  the payoff should be a very strategic base for the coming war with china and or iran


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 14, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> I suppose I will never be in sync with events
> 
> because i fully supported in the invasion at first and still do
> 
> ...


The invasion was a horrible mistake (as Trump consistently noted.)

A targeted police action could have expediently fulfilled the mission of exterminating al Qaeda. Taliban never constituted a threat to the U.S.

The best time to extract the United States from the futile fiasco that has cost trillions and squandered American lives has always been and remains _"now."_

Two decades of an horrific lack of progress with none in the offing is quite enough.


----------



## Nostra (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Oh yeah; in 1998; 3 years before 9/11.


Yep.  That puts 9/11 on Clinton.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 14, 2021)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> This will forever be GWB’s failure; he alone is responsible for all that happens.


FALSE!  Biden is responsible for all the killing bloodbath that is going on now, as are all the idiots who voted for him, and who cheated for him.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 14, 2021)

gipper said:


> Isolationism lol. We are so far from that it’s on the other side of the universe. How about we just stop the constant foreign interventions and imperialism?


How about if everybody stick to the TOPIC ? >> Biden, and the current Afghanistan bloodbath.


----------



## gipper (Aug 14, 2021)

protectionist said:


> How about if everybody stick to the TOPIC ? >> Biden, and the current Afghanistan bloodbath.


We tried that but you learned nothing.


----------



## TemplarKormac (Aug 14, 2021)

Pure and simple:  Never fight wars you don't intend to win. Get them out and never go back.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 14, 2021)

Nostra said:


> Yep.  That puts 9/11 on Clinton.



Don't be stupid...for once.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 14, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> I may have


Doubtful.  The one common thread about conservative principles is that they change with the slightest breeze.  Are you guys still for family values given that your cult leader pays porn stars for sex and parties with pedophiles?


----------



## Nostra (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Don't be stupid...for once.


No Bin Laden, no 9/11, Simpleton.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 14, 2021)

Nostra said:


> No Bin Laden, no 9/11, Simpleton.


So we can blame WWII on Hitler's nanny who didn't strangle him in the crib?


----------



## Nostra (Aug 14, 2021)

candycorn said:


> So we can blame WWII on Hitler's nanny who didn't strangle him in the crib?


Was Hitler a well known terrorist when his nanny was watching him?

Any other dumbfuck questions?


----------



## candycorn (Aug 14, 2021)

Nostra said:


> Was Hitler a well known terrorist when his nanny was watching him?
> 
> Any other dumbfuck questions?


Yeah, heres one...

Was Bin Laden a well known terrorists when Reagan was arming him?


----------



## lennypartiv (Aug 14, 2021)

protectionist said:


> As usual, the left has a different perspective than the right.


Dems refuse to admit we need to stay in Afghanistan a lot longer.  Obviously we need a lot more US troops there.


----------



## tyroneweaver (Aug 15, 2021)

defensive forces are running with their tails between their legs.
Taliban is winning thru winning the hearts and minds


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> CNN.com - U.S., Taliban bargained over bin Laden ...
> www.cnn.com/2005/US/08/19/taliban.documents/index.html
> Ahmed "said that the U.S., if it chose to do so, could arrange to have bin Laden killed by cruise missiles or other means, and there would be little the Taliban could do to prevent it," according ...
> 
> ...


This is not a HISTORY thread. Please address the topic>> Biden, and the *current *Taliban takeover,


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> The US-Taliban Agreement signed in Doha on 29 February 2020 between USA and Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan with much fanfare is the root cause of the current problems that besiege Afghanistan. The so called “Peace Agreement” has failed to deliver any semblance of peace in Afghanistan. To the contrary, the agreement emboldened Taliban to intensify violence, fully aware that Afghanistan forces after withdrawal of US support were simply ‘sacrificial lambs’ waiting to be slaughtered devoid of any aerial support. As a result the Afghan National Army troops only thought it prudent to abandon their positions rather than face a certain death at hands of Taliban.
> 
> Financial Express - Business News, Stock Market News
> Sign in
> ...


Lots of words here. None about Bidens's role in the current bloodbath. (the TOPIC)


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

EMH said:


> Tenet and sandy the burglar had 9 opportunities to off col Tim osman, and failed to strike each time, because col Tim osman was a Zionist Jew CIA/Mossad double agent, and tenet and zionism's #1 hero....
> 
> Saudi's were in on 911 too = Putin


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> You're under the impression that the Taliban had Bin Laden--who had done 9/11 right before--in pocket?  I doubt it myself.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

EMH said:


> Because you know col tim osman worked for your employer....
> 
> The mossad


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Yeah, heres one...
> 
> Was Bin Laden a well known terrorists when Reagan was arming him?


----------



## toobfreak (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Biden's Failing Afghanistan Withdrawl​



Kind of redundant, isn't it?  I mean, what HASN'T Joe failed at so far?

The guy can't even board his own jet right.


----------



## MarathonMike (Aug 15, 2021)

It sucks that our 20 year investment in lives and money will be for naught,  but I'm more concerned about the offensive Biden is launching against the US through the Southern Border.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> Whether the President should have stuck with his original withdrawal date of 9/11 or followed Trump's insistence that it should be sooner may be of no consequence whatever.
> 
> Extricating the United States from the Bush quagmire - an inevitably gruesome necessity - has been an imperative that has been deferred far too long. Was a collapse of democratic governance inevitable? We can only speculate, but there are ample, historically-validated reasons to believe so. Why postpone the inevitable even further when the unjustifiable cost that has been exacted for two decades is relentless?
> 
> ...


*FALSE! * If Biden would have followed through with the Doha Agreement, and got the troops out by May 1, 2021, it is most likely that the current killings we see going on now would not have happened.

Biden knew the Taliban was honoring that agreement, no matter who was POTUS in April/May, and yet he chose to DIShonor the agreement, thereby relieving the Taliban of any obligation to adhere to it on their side (and refrain from violence in the ensuing takeover).

Maybe Biden's failure to honor the Doha Agreemnt is _"of no consequence"_ to YOU, but it is of major consequence to hundreds (if not thousands) of Afghans now being slaughtered, and children being orphaned, and abducted into sex slavery.

Defending Biden in all of this is idiocy.  Even such Biden apologists as the New York Times and Washington Post have raked Biden over the coals on this.  Get a brain.


----------



## Asclepias (Aug 15, 2021)

MarathonMike said:


> It sucks that our 20 year investment in lives and money will be for naught,


It wasn't for naught. People made millions probably billions, which is why it went on so long.  There was no way the US was going to actually win anyway.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

basquebromance said:


> MSNBC finally disagrees with Biden and you'll never guess about what!
> 
> Pulling out of Afghanistan.  Now, there's NOT ONE GOOD THING about liberals.  They're not even anti-war.


The leftist media is strongly in OPPOSITION to Biden on the Afghanistan debacle, as are Democrats in Congress. About the only ones defending him are a few scatterbrained Democrats in this forum, and the other forum I post in.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

Johnlaw said:


> Biden’s withdrawal of US forces just followed Trump’s deal with the Taliban to withdraw by May.  They both erred by not withdrawing troops in November or December when fighting is at a lull as opposed to the summer months when the fighting is the most intense.


It did NOT follow "Trump’s deal with the Taliban to withdraw by May." FIRST.  Look at the calender. It is August.


----------



## EvilCat Breath (Aug 15, 2021)

tyroneweaver said:


> defensive forces are running with their tails between their legs.
> Taliban is winning thru winning the hearts and minds


The taliban isn't winning through winning hearts and minds.  They simply kill anyone suspected of being in opposition.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> The invasion was a horrible mistake (as Trump consistently noted.)
> 
> A targeted police action could have expediently fulfilled the mission of exterminating al Qaeda. Taliban never constituted a threat to the U.S.
> 
> ...


FALSE! No, "now" is absolutely NOT the time for troop withdrawl. Not that any time is correct for withdrawl, but if there was to be one, the time for it was 3 months ago.  Many* lives are now being lost because of that.*

It is also FALSE to say the invasion was a mistake.  Had the invasion not taken place, numerous American cities might have become rubble from Al Qaeda bombs (possibly nuclear), and with the occupation now ending, that may now become the consequence for us in the near future,


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

gipper said:


> We tried that but you learned nothing.


Try it again (and I'm not interested in "learn"ing your ignorance).


----------



## EvilCat Breath (Aug 15, 2021)

NoNukes said:


> http://
> After 20 years, 2,400 personnel dead, and 2 2 trillion spent, Biden was right to get out.


To hell with a responsible way to leave. Go for giving the Taliban the highest body count and the most fireworks.  Top it off with groveling to these goat fuckers to let us go without a helicopter on the embassy roof moment.  It is NOT anything other than a disgusting picture.  On a brighter note.  The Taliban has beheaded so many women, there is a distinct lack of brides.  We have plenty slithering across the border.  We could send 10,000 women, no problem.


----------



## EvilCat Breath (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> FALSE! No, "now" is absolutely NOT the time for troop withdrawl. Not that any time is correct for withdrawl, but if there was to be one, the time for it was 3 months ago.  Many lives are now being lost because of that.
> 
> It is also FALSE to say the invasion was a mistake.  Had the invasion not taken place, numerous American cities might have become rubble from Al Qaeda bombs (possibly nuclear), and with the occupation now ending, that may now become the consequence for us in the near future,


With our open borders!   They are here applying for welfare right now.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Doubtful.  The one common thread about conservative principles is that they change with the slightest breeze.  Are you guys still for family values given that your cult leader pays porn stars for sex and parties with pedophiles?


You support Biden, and you wanna talk about "pedophiles" ?  Pheeeew!

And paying porn stars for sex, is nowhere near as bad as letting tran men lunatics destroy womens' sports, or supporting tran lunatics at all, or nutjob men engaging in SSM.

Frankly, I don't think paying porn stars (or whomever) for sex is so bad at all.  I'm for legalization of prostitution, and it could even help to save some failing marriages.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

Asclepias said:


> It wasn't for naught. People made millions probably billions, which is why it went on so long.  There was no way the US was going to actually win anyway.


NONSENSE!  The US WON by first routing the Taliban in 2001, and then by keeping them down and out, and keeping Al Qaeda out as well.  In this regard, the US had 20 years of WINNING.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

Tipsycatlover said:


> The taliban isn't winning through winning hearts and minds.  They simply kill anyone suspected of being in opposition.


Which is exactly what they are now doing, which is why the title if this OP is entirely wrong.


----------



## zaangalewa (Aug 15, 2021)

tyroneweaver said:


> defensive forces are running with their tails between their legs.
> Taliban is winning thru winning the hearts and minds



What a nonsense. The Taliban are a Clan-structure comparable to the Mafia. No one likes to fight against them as long as he sees not any chance to win, because they fear the revenge laws of this Mafia. Without head it's difficult to live.


----------



## protectionist (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Maybe Biden's failure to honor the Doha Agreement is _"of no consequence"_ to YOU, but it is of major consequence to hundreds (if not thousands) of Afghans now being slaughtered, and children being orphaned, and abducted into sex slavery.


----------



## zaangalewa (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> NONSENSE!  The US WON by first routing the Taliban in 2001, and then by keeping them down and out, and keeping Al Qaeda out as well.  In this regard, the US had 20 years of WINNING.


Who wins not peace wins nothing.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> Lots of words here. None about Bidens's role in the current bloodbath. (the TOPIC)



Are you having difficulty reading?


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Yeah, heres one...
> 
> Was Bin Laden a well known terrorists when Reagan was arming him?



Nope. He was fighting the Communists. He wasn't a terrorist in 1979 when he went to Afghanistan.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> Nope. He was fighting the Communists. He wasn't a terrorist in 1979 when he went to Afghanistan.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

tyroneweaver said:


> defensive forces are running with their tails between their legs.
> Taliban is winning thru winning the hearts and minds


so?

Feel free to deploy yourself over there and stop them.


----------



## my2¢ (Aug 15, 2021)

Perhaps there needs to be a time limit of no more than 2 years on the War Powers Act?


----------



## Colin norris (Aug 15, 2021)

MarathonMike said:


> It sucks that our 20 year investment in lives and money will be for naught,  but I'm more concerned about the offensive Biden is launching against the US through the Southern Border.


And what do you think he is planning. An invasion if communists? 
It wouldn't matter what he did you goons wouldn't agree with it.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


>



OBL was 24 when he went to Afghanistan to build roads. He brought his own equipment.. and was lauded by the US as the face of the Arabs who were fighting the Soviets. He wasn't a terrorist.


----------



## Burgermeister (Aug 15, 2021)

Of course the CIA trained and funded the mujahideen to fight the Soviets and they probably knew OBL at that time.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> Of course the CIA trained and funded the mujahideen to fight the Soviets and they probably knew OBL at that time.



The CIA recruited heavily in Yemen for fighters to go to Afghanistan. They funded the fight thru the Saudis for the most part. I don't remember them having any training camps.


----------



## Burgermeister (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> The CIA recruited heavily in Yemen for fighters to go to Afghanistan. They funded the fight thru the Saudis for the most part. I don't remember them having any training camps.


You probably weren't in on the briefings. Not heavily publicized.

This will help. Google Operation Cyclone.


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Are you guys still for family values given that your cult leader pays porn stars for sex and parties with pedophiles?


Sure

its the lesser of two evils

both dems and repubs in congress cheat on their wives

but the dem is 90-100% on the wrong side of the issues and the repub isnt

so its an easy choice


----------



## pknopp (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> The CIA recruited heavily in Yemen for fighters to go to Afghanistan. They funded the fight thru the Saudis for the most part. I don't remember them having any training camps.



 It wasn't our fight.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> You probably weren't in on the briefings. Not heavily publicized.
> 
> This will help. Google Operation Cyclone.



One of my classmates was at the French Embassy in Yemen for 20 years.. She talked about the CIA recruiting jihadis for Afghanistan.


----------



## Burgermeister (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> One of my classmates was at the French Embassy in Yemen for 20 years.. She talked about the CIA recruiting jihadis for Afghanistan.


I believe it.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> You probably weren't in on the briefings. Not heavily publicized.
> 
> This will help. Google Operation Cyclone.



Operation Cyclone - Wikipedia








						Operation Cyclone - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				



Operation Cyclone was the code name for the United States Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) program to arm and finance the Afghan mujahideen in Afghanistan from 1979 to 1989, prior to and during the military intervention by the USSR in support of its client, the Democratic Republic of Afghanistan. The mujahideen were also supported by Britain's MI6, who conducted separate covert actions. The …
BackgroundProgramAftermathCriticismAllegations of CIA assistance to bin Laden

See also
Communists under the leadership of Nur Muhammad Taraki seized power in Afghanistan on 27 April 1978. The new regime—which was divided between Taraki's extremist Khalq faction and the more moderate Parcham—signed a treaty of friendship with the Soviet Union in December of that year. Taraki's efforts to improve secular education and redistribute land were accompanied by mass executions.


----------



## Burgermeister (Aug 15, 2021)

Some additional context regarding training - The United States and the Mujahideen | History of Western Civilization II

Operation Cyclone was one of the longest and most expensive covert CIA operations ever undertaken. More than $20 billion in U.S. funds was funneled into the country to train and arm Afghan resistance groups.

President Reagan greatly expanded the program as part of the Reagan Doctrine of aiding anti-Soviet resistance movements abroad. To execute this policy, Reagan deployed CIA Special Activities Division paramilitary officers to equip the mujihadeen forces against the Soviet Army. Although the CIA and Texas Congressman Charlie Wilson received the most attention for their roles, the key architect of the strategy was Michael G. Vickers, a young CIA paramilitary officer working for Gust Avrakotos, the CIA’s regional head who had a close relationship with Wilson. Vicker’s strategy was to use a broad mix of weapons, tactics, logistics, and training programs to enhance the rebels’ ability to fight a guerrilla war against the Soviets. Reagan’s program assisted in ending the Soviet’s occupation in Afghanistan.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> Some additional context regarding training - The United States and the Mujahideen | History of Western Civilization II
> 
> Operation Cyclone was one of the longest and most expensive covert CIA operations ever undertaken. More than $20 billion in U.S. funds was funneled into the country to train and arm Afghan resistance groups.
> 
> President Reagan greatly expanded the program as part of the Reagan Doctrine of aiding anti-Soviet resistance movements abroad. To execute this policy, Reagan deployed CIA Special Activities Division paramilitary officers to equip the mujihadeen forces against the Soviet Army. Although the CIA and Texas Congressman Charlie Wilson received the most attention for their roles, the key architect of the strategy was Michael G. Vickers, a young CIA paramilitary officer working for Gust Avrakotos, the CIA’s regional head who had a close relationship with Wilson. Vicker’s strategy was to use a broad mix of weapons, tactics, logistics, and training programs to enhance the rebels’ ability to fight a guerrilla war against the Soviets. Reagan’s program assisted in ending the Soviet’s occupation in Afghanistan.



Poor Afghanistan. They have been thru the wringer for decades.

This guy was a real piece of work.









						Nur Muhammad Taraki - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Burgermeister (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> Poor Afghanistan. They have been thru the wringer for decades.
> 
> This guy was a real piece of work.
> 
> ...


I was thinking the same thing. Kicked around like a soccer ball. This was taken at Kabul University some time before the Soviet invasion.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Burgermeister said:


> I was thinking the same thing. Kicked around like a soccer ball. This was taken at Kabul University some time before the Soviet invasion.
> View attachment 525930



Probably around 1970-1973.. before the Afghani communists overthrew the Monarchy.

What utter hell they have been thru.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Sure
> 
> its the lesser of two evils
> 
> ...



And your blob paying a porn star for sex is exempt?  Really?

Again; you're as delusional as you are dishonest.


----------



## Desperado (Aug 15, 2021)

Bottom line is this is all Charlie Wilson's fault! He was no hero


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> And your blob paying a porn star for sex is exempt? Really?


No one said he was exempt

Trump has experienced much criticism over that

and it has been embarrassing to his family


----------



## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> No one said he was exempt
> 
> Trump has experienced much criticism over that
> 
> and it has been embarrassing to his family


And you worship him....as do most republicans.

So again...how can you honestly (giggle) say that the GOP is for family values?


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> And you worship him....as do most republicans.


I support trump

But I dont worship him


----------



## tyroneweaver (Aug 15, 2021)

Tipsycatlover said:


> The taliban isn't winning through winning hearts and minds.  They simply kill anyone suspected of being in opposition.


you're thinking of Isis and boko harem.
the taliban hasnt' resorted tho this yet.


----------



## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> I support trump
> 
> But I dont worship him


----------



## Mac-7 (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


>


Libs cant make arguments

all they can do is post funny faces


----------



## lennypartiv (Aug 15, 2021)

Who in the Biden administration came up with this stupid idea to leave Afghanistan?


----------



## 22lcidw (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> And you worship him....as do most republicans.
> 
> So again...how can you honestly (giggle) say that the GOP is for family values?


There are people that are trying to quell a revolution taking us into Communism. Sometimes the ones you do not expect show up to try to thwart it. If Trump is true to what he spouts, he is one of them. But the Progs know as they have taken control of a good amount of our nation's direction by propaganda must always force the "Democracy" agenda.  Always "Democracy"! And that gives them the green light to do what they want. The agenda then goes to the other side being fascists as "Democracy" may be infringed. That is why the voting issue is a big one. You have been stealing elections for years and decades. We are now no better then the fascism/communism tactics that other nations have faced around the world.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

22lcidw said:


> There are people that are trying to quell a revolution taking us into Communism. Sometimes the ones you do not expect show up to try to thwart it. If Trump is true to what he spouts, he is one of them. But the Progs know as they have taken control of a good amount of our nation's direction by propaganda must always force the "Democracy" agenda.  Always "Democracy"! And that gives them the green light to do what they want. The agenda then goes to the other side being fascists as "Democracy" may be infringed. That is why the voting issue is a big one. You have been stealing elections for years and decades. We are now no better then the fascism/communism tactics that other nations have faced around the world.



Nobody is trying to take us into Communism. How could you be so gullible? Trump will promote any outrageous lie to retain power. Its idiotic.


----------



## tyroneweaver (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> so?
> 
> Feel free to deploy yourself over there and stop them.







__





						Contractor on the ground at Kabul. AMA. UPDATE/AAR ON PAGE 26 - AR15.COM
					

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.




					www.ar15.com


----------



## JWBooth (Aug 15, 2021)




----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> NONSENSE!  The US WON by first routing the Taliban in 2001, and then by keeping them down and out, and keeping Al Qaeda out as well.  In this regard, the US had 20 years of WINNING.



We didn't win anything in Afghanistan.


----------



## lennypartiv (Aug 15, 2021)

MarathonMike said:


> It sucks that our 20 year investment in lives and money will be for naught,


Exactly.  Who in the Biden administration came up with this stupid idea to leave Afghanistan?


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

lennypartiv said:


> Exactly.  Who in the Biden administration came up with this stupid idea to leave Afghanistan?



Why do you want to stay? What do you expect to win? Afghanistan has been at war since 1974 when the Afghan communists overthrew the Monarchy.


----------



## WinterBorn (Aug 15, 2021)

If I am not mistaken, the US went into Afghanistan to get bin Laden and those who assisted in the 9/11 attacks.    We did that.

We are not in the nation building business and shouldn't be.


----------



## Mac1958 (Aug 15, 2021)

WinterBorn said:


> If I am not mistaken, the US went into Afghanistan to get bin Laden and those who assisted in the 9/11 attacks.    We did that.
> We are not in the nation building business and shouldn't be.


Yep.  Many of us knew this was inevitable, whether we were there for 20 years or 50.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

WinterBorn said:


> If I am not mistaken, the US went into Afghanistan to get bin Laden and those who assisted in the 9/11 attacks.    We did that.
> 
> We are not in the nation building business and shouldn't be.



We went into Afghanistan because Bush had failed in negotiations with the Taliban over a gas pipeline from the Stans to India. He was trying to save ENRON.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 15, 2021)

lennypartiv said:


> Exactly.  Who in the Biden administration came up with this stupid idea to leave Afghanistan?


Tell me you want to waste more money and lives on that shithole country?
We should have left during the non-fighting season.


----------



## kyzr (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> We went into Afghanistan because Bush had failed in negotiations with the Taliban over a gas pipeline from the Stans to India. He was trying to save ENRON.


Got a link for that?


----------



## Flash (Aug 15, 2021)

Is Biden still on vacation?


----------



## Flash (Aug 15, 2021)




----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> We went into Afghanistan because Bush had failed in negotiations with the Taliban over a gas pipeline from the Stans to India. He was trying to save ENRON.


Idiot.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Idiot.



Don't be ignorant.


----------



## Flash (Aug 15, 2021)

Joe Dufus continues his record of fucking up everything he touches.  Meanwhile the dipshit is on vacation.


*
Street fighting has begun in Kabul as the helicopters are trying to evacuate the US embassy...

CIA grossly miscalculated the rate of taleban advance and now a complete SNAFU is at the embassy.....\uD83D\uDE01

It seems August 15th, India's independence Day, is cursed for US too....\uD83D\uDE01 pic.twitter.com/0bXKIsPcoX

Zaid Hamid  (@ZaidZamanHamid) August 14, 2021*


----------



## Flash (Aug 15, 2021)

It really paid off for China to put it's man in the White House, didn't it?


*Taliban spokesman Suhail Shaheen said in an interview that “China is a friendly country and we welcome it for reconstruction and developing Afghanistan … if [the Chinese] have investments, of course we will ensure their safety.” **https://t.co/CLTa0HopGr*


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

Flash said:


> It really paid off for China to put it's man in the White House, didn't it?
> 
> 
> *Taliban spokesman Suhail Shaheen said in an interview that “China is a friendly country and we welcome it for reconstruction and developing Afghanistan … if [the Chinese] have investments, of course we will ensure their safety.” **https://t.co/CLTa0HopGr*



You are an idiot. China built a railroad in Afghanistan 10 years ago. They have also built power plants and mining operations. They share a border with Afghanistan and have a shared heritage in the Hazara people.


----------



## JWBooth (Aug 15, 2021)

Flash said:


> It really paid off for China to put it's man in the White House, didn't it?
> 
> 
> *Taliban spokesman Suhail Shaheen said in an interview that “China is a friendly country and we welcome it for reconstruction and developing Afghanistan … if [the Chinese] have investments, of course we will ensure their safety.” **https://t.co/CLTa0HopGr*


The real lesson here is that China does business, US does military domination.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

JWBooth said:


> The real lesson here is that China does business, US does military domination.



Soft power works.


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> FALSE! No, "now" is absolutely NOT the time for troop withdrawl. Not that any time is correct for withdrawl, but if there was to be one, the time for it was 3 months ago.  Many* lives are now being lost because of that.*
> 
> It is also FALSE to say the invasion was a mistake.  Had the invasion not taken place, numerous American cities might have become rubble from Al Qaeda bombs (possibly nuclear), and with the occupation now ending, that may now become the consequence for us in the near future,


After having insisted that the U.S. immediately withdraw from Afghanistan for years, 
On February 29, 2020, Trump and the Taliban signed a conditional peace deal which required that U.S. troops withdraw  from Afghanistan within 14 months.​[https://www.state.gov/wp-content/up...or-Bringing-Peace-to-Afghanistan-02.29.20.pdf'​​Trump says Biden should pull U.S. troops from Afghanistan ​months sooner than September 11​APRIL 19, 2021​
If you are of the opinion that the President should have deferred withdrawal until September 11 rather than following Trump's recommendation that it be sooner, I doubt that would have made any difference, not even if we deferred it for another 20 years and another $2.2 trillion sunk into the fiasco.

The invasion was doomed from the start. Obviously, a targeted police action to destroy al-Qaeda rather than a 2 decade deployment fighting the Taliban that had never threatened the U.S. would have been far preferable.

Such imperialistic caprices and meddling in the internal affairs of sovereign nations don't go well.





*"My dear boy, as long as you do not invade Afghanistan 
you will be absolutely fine."
PRIME MINISTER HAROLD MacMILLAN *




Bush initiated the war against Afghanistan in 2001 as part of his so-called _“war on terror,” _
claiming that U.S, military occupation  would destroy Al-Qaeda bases and remove the threat of terrorism.​
*Prescient voices from Afghanistan:*

*"Our people have been caught in the claws of the monster of a vast war and destruction. ... The continuation of US attacks and the increase in the number of innocent civilian victims not only gives an excuse to the Taliban, but also will cause the empowering of the fundamentalist forces in the region and even in the world."*
*— RAWA, Afghan women fighting for human rights and for social justice in Afghanistan, October 11, 2001*
[RAWA statement on the US strikes on Afghanistan]​


----------



## lennypartiv (Aug 15, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> On February 29, 2020, Trump and the Taliban signed a conditional peace deal which required that U.S. troops withdraw  from Afghanistan within 14 months.​


I knew liberals would try to blame this on Trump.


----------



## AntonToo (Aug 15, 2021)

Flash said:


> View attachment 525950



Anyone actually buys this horseshit?

Trump was 100% for withdrawal and his plan was simply continued by Biden. 

What an ass.


----------



## Flash (Aug 15, 2021)

JWBooth said:


> The real lesson here is that China does business, US does military domination.




The real lesson is that Democrat leadership always fucks up everything they touches.


----------



## Turtlesoup (Aug 15, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Anyone actually buys this horseshit?
> 
> Trump was 100% for withdrawal and his plan was simply continued by Biden.
> 
> What an ass.


What a load of shit-------------Trump would not have done and did not do  this crap that Biden is doing...........fleeing, not warning anyone that we are leaving, leaving brand new weapons for the Taliban who are using them to kill.  Trump hated that Bush/Biden got us into the war------------despised the war but realize you just couldn't turn tail and run much leaving terrorists weapons.


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 15, 2021)

lennypartiv said:


> I knew liberals would try to blame this on Trump.


I don't know about those "liberals" that fester in your noggin, but I don't blame Trump. He was correct to insist upon immediate withdrawal for years and years, and If the President had not followed his advice to withdraw sooner than September 11, it would not have made any difference.


----------



## Flash (Aug 15, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Anyone actually buys this horseshit?
> 
> Trump was 100% for withdrawal and his plan was simply continued by Biden.
> 
> What an ass.




You are confused Moon Bat.

Trump had a good plan.  This clown Joe Dufus fucked everything up just like the Worthless Negro fucked up withdrawing from Iraq.

Typical incompetent Democrat leadership.

We Americans warned the stupid uneducated Moon Bats that Joe Dufus was going to be a disaster but like all idiots they didn't listen.


----------



## surada (Aug 15, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> ​After having insisted that the U.S. immediately withdraw from Afghanistan for years,
> On February 29, 2020, Trump and the Taliban signed a conditional peace deal which required that U.S. troops withdraw  from Afghanistan within 14 months.​[https://www.state.gov/wp-content/up...or-Bringing-Peace-to-Afghanistan-02.29.20.pdf'​​Trump says Biden should pull U.S. troops from Afghanistan months sooner than September 11​APRIL 19, 2021​
> If you are of the opinion that the President should have deferred withdrawal until September 11 rather than following Trump's recommendation that it be sooner, I doubt that would have made any difference, not even if we deferred it for another 20 years and another $2.2 trillion sunk into the fiasco.
> 
> ...



Great post.. You know the truth.


----------



## JWBooth (Aug 15, 2021)




----------



## JWBooth (Aug 15, 2021)

It is done. Ghani has resigned, the embassy evacuation is running.








						President Ashraf Ghani leaves Afghanistan as Taliban take over Kabul
					

Afghanistan Ashraf Ghani has reportedly left Kabul after resigning, TOLO News reported on Sunday as Taliban terrorists entered capital Kabul.




					www.oneindia.com


----------



## schmidlap (Aug 15, 2021)

surada said:


> Great post.. You know the truth.


History is rewritten and selectively edited to fit current agendas.

Women's human rights organizations in Afghanistan vehemently expressing opposition to the Bush invasion doesn't comport with some folks' agenda.

It bears repeating, especially because women's rights has been contrived as a pretext:

*"Our people have been caught in the claws of the monster of a vast war and destruction. ... The continuation of US attacks and the increase in the number of innocent civilian victims not only gives an excuse to the Taliban, but also will cause the empowering of the fundamentalist forces in the region and even in the world."

— RAWA, Afghan women fighting for human rights and for social justice in Afghanistan, October 11, 2001*

[RAWA statement on the US strikes on Afghanistan]​


----------



## Lesh (Aug 15, 2021)

How many Afghanistan threads do we need?


----------



## EMH (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> View attachment 525885





Explaining to the USMB the whole truth that was the 100% pure Zionist false flag treason, murder, looting, and bullshit that was 911 and the "war on exclusively anti Israel terror" is necessary  for people to understand your motives, your lies, your slant, and the truth that 

You cheered when your fellow Zionist traitors deliberately murdered pat Tillman and then lied and claimed AQ did it....


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## Nostra (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Yeah, heres one...
> 
> Was Bin Laden a well known terrorists when Reagan was arming him?


Nope.  He was fighting your heroes the communist Russians.

Next Dumbass question?


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## 22lcidw (Aug 15, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> After having insisted that the U.S. immediately withdraw from Afghanistan for years,
> On February 29, 2020, Trump and the Taliban signed a conditional peace deal which required that U.S. troops withdraw  from Afghanistan within 14 months.​[https://www.state.gov/wp-content/up...or-Bringing-Peace-to-Afghanistan-02.29.20.pdf'​​Trump says Biden should pull U.S. troops from Afghanistan ​months sooner than September 11​APRIL 19, 2021​
> If you are of the opinion that the President should have deferred withdrawal until September 11 rather than following Trump's recommendation that it be sooner, I doubt that would have made any difference, not even if we deferred it for another 20 years and another $2.2 trillion sunk into the fiasco.
> 
> ...


We have learned about Pseudo Repubs. You have not about Progressive Socialist Communists.


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## Nostra (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> And you worship him....as do most republicans.
> 
> So again...how can you honestly (giggle) say that the GOP is for family values?





candycorn said:


> And your blob paying a porn star for sex is exempt?  Really?
> 
> Again; you're as delusional as you are dishonest.


You and your brainless Dimtards are the only ones bringing up Trump in this thread.  You are the one who worships him..............without him you would have zero to post about.


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## Nostra (Aug 15, 2021)

Flash said:


> View attachment 525950


Nailed it.


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## AntonToo (Aug 15, 2021)

Flash said:


> You are confused Moon Bat.
> 
> Trump had a good plan.  This clown Joe Dufus fucked everything up just like the Worthless Negro fucked up withdrawing from Iraq.
> 
> ...


In which way did Trump plan differ???

He was constantly bragging how he got us out of Afghanistan and now that Biden has ACTUALLY DONE IT, this ass is complaining that it was done.


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## d0gbreath (Aug 15, 2021)

A failing exit from a failed war somehow seems appropriate.


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## tyroneweaver (Aug 15, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Anyone actually buys this horseshit?
> 
> Trump was 100% for withdrawal and his plan was simply continued by Biden.
> 
> What an ass.


Doesn't concern me.
I don't care about Afghanistan
What's hilarious  is watching biden lye so much about it


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## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Libs cant make arguments
> 
> all they can do is post funny faces


Con's can't produce any time they ever disagreed with their lord and master.


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## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

Nostra said:


> Nope.  He was fighting your heroes the communist Russians.
> 
> Next Dumbass question?



Yet somehow conservatives are the only ones who praise Putin.


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## candycorn (Aug 15, 2021)

tyroneweaver said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not sure what an ad for a gun is supposed to say.  I'm pretty sure you have no come back....  cool.


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## AntonToo (Aug 15, 2021)

Turtlesoup said:


> What a load of shit-------------Trump would not have done and did not do  this crap that Biden is doing...........fleeing, not warning anyone that we are leaving, leaving brand new weapons for the Taliban who are using them to kill.  Trump hated that Bush/Biden got us into the war------------despised the war but realize you just couldn't turn tail and run much leaving terrorists weapons.



Fleeing? We withdrew exactly as Biden AND TRUMP promissed we will.

Are you saying Trump would not withdraw from Afganistan? thats what you belive?

Because it's been made clear at this point - after 20 years, this is exactly what happens as soon as we leave, today or tommrow or next year.


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## tahuyaman (Aug 15, 2021)

The Biden administration is screwing this up just because they need to do the opposite as the Trump administration.


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## tahuyaman (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Yet somehow conservatives are the only ones who praise Putin.


Conservatives don’t praise Putin. They recognize that he can bully a weak liberal US president.


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## tyroneweaver (Aug 15, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Not sure what an ad for a gun is supposed to say.  I'm pretty sure you have no come back....  cool.


Liar


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## danielpalos (Aug 15, 2021)

protectionist said:


> This is an editorial from the Washington Examiner, August 12, 2021.
> 
> By refusing to use overwhelming air power to blunt the Taliban's rise,  Joe Biden is failing to protect American interests in Afghanistan and ultimately undermining national security.
> 
> ...


I agree that we should be providing air cover for Government forces.  In the long run, we should create first world infrastructure for that nation-State. What economy would be worse off with another trading partner in our global economy?


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## tahuyaman (Aug 16, 2021)

danielpalos said:


> I agree that we should be providing air cover for Government forces.  In the long run, we should create first world infrastructure for that nation-State. What economy would be worse off with another trading partner in our global economy?


Afghanistan is an un-governable country. There’s never going to be a functional nation state there.   Nation building doesn’t work there.


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## Mac-7 (Aug 16, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Con's can't produce any time they ever disagreed with their lord and master.


My comment still stands

With libs its either a funny face or in this case a ripoff of my comment


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## bigrebnc1775 (Aug 16, 2021)

pknopp said:


> The left? This is the very action Trump called for.


that's funny why did biden destroy everything the Trump administration did but yet keep this one thing in place?
You are seeing in 7 months the total destructive effect of leftism policies.


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## pknopp (Aug 16, 2021)

bigrebnc1775 said:


> that's funny why did biden destroy everything the Trump administration did but yet keep this one thing in place?
> You are seeing in 7 months the total destructive effect of leftism policies.



 Sorry, was this supposedly a denial that this is exactly what Trump called for?


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 22, 2021)




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## Calypso Jones (Aug 22, 2021)

Any president with Balls and we've only had one of those in the past 20 years would bomb the hell out of these terrorist scum.


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## themirrorthief (Aug 22, 2021)

Mac1958 said:


> Yeah, the thousands of lives, limbs and minds, the trillions of dollars, all wasted on Bush's wars should be ignored so we can focus on what was inevitable from the very beginning.


biden is a wonderful gift to GOP  thanks democrats


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 22, 2021)

MSM will never show you this Israeli study…
					

A new study by Israeli researchers and published in Nature has revealed an increase of over 25 percent in cardiovascular-related emergency calls in the young-adult population, following the …




					citizenfreepress.com
				



\
Media doesn't want you seeing this...as biden lies about the condition in Kabul.   Makes me sick.    THIS Is America under democrat rule.  OWN IT.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 23, 2021)

Biden has left these people at the mercy of the terrorists and they will be searched out and killed.   WHat a mess.    President Trump would not have allowed this to happen.    BIden is a moron, incompetent, clueless.   Elections have consequences.    Bad Idea Democrats elected Nutball

Only thing we can hope for now is for someone to step up and do the job this resident is incapable or unwilling to do.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 24, 2021)

THANK GOD for Americans  and some other nations who are doing the job that the cowardly, incompetent boobs in the  Biden Regime Cannot/willnot do AND THAT IS to rescue the RIGHT people out of this developing HellHole.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

President A. H.  is on tv now...bringing up Beau...trolling for that sympathy.   Talking about we will hunt you down.>    words are cheap dick.   ANd that's all you got. Words.    You ain't gonna do NOTHING.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

He will get his afghan allies!!!   He has screwed THAT UP!!

BALD FACED LIES outta this moron.    OH..blaming the commanders...none of joe's doins.....insinuating it is them.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

OMG QUOTING FROM THE BIBLE>   ...  BLASPHEMY>

OH>...now for the moment of SILENCE.    Cause he DARES NOT PRAY to the God of HEAVEN's ARMIES.  and not even a whole minute.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

World..US ALLIES...this is what you wanted.  This is what you helped to accomplish.   Now you can watch the middle east burn and then it comes for you.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

Words out of this ass.  JUST. WORDS.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

LIAR>   YOU DID NOT INHERIT A BAD SITUATION.    pass the buck, Schmuck.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

Jennifer Griffin DESTROYS Biden’s claim that he’s going to hunt down the ISIS terrorists who killed American Marines
					

Jennifer Griffin was on Special Report tonight and absolutely destroyed Biden’s claim that he’s going to hunt down the ISIS terrorists who killed 11 US Marines and one Navy medic. Watch…




					therightscoop.com
				




stupid old fool.   Who believes you.  No one except the ones that made the mistake of voting for your dumbass and they've got to double down now.   US allies are done with you.   Afghanis are done with you.      The only people you'll continue to hunt down are trump supporters and people who don't want the damn vaxxine.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

bunch of freakin' woke retards.









						Commander Says U.S. Military Is Relying On Taliban Protection In Kabul
					

General Kenneth McKenzie Jr. told reporters Thursday military evacuation efforts in Kabul depended on Taliban protection.




					thefederalist.com
				




LOLOL   fools.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

Lightning strikes the white house.  This posted about 439 pm about an hour before Biden's little 'not my fault' talk.









						Lightning strikes the White House…
					

Presented without comment




					citizenfreepress.com
				




think it might be an omen?  a message?


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## Toro (Aug 26, 2021)




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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

um.  no.  it was NOT at the request of President Trump.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

Biden gives Taliban a ‘complete list’ of all trapped Americans and Afghans…
					

“Basically, they just put all those Afghans on a kill list,” said one defense official.   U.S. officials in Kabul gave the Taliban a list of names of American citizens, green card holde…




					citizenfreepress.com
				




And i'm sure Joe asked them very nicely pretty please with a cherry on top to protect the people on the list and get them home safe.  These fool generals and this Out to Lunch president think they'll do it too.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 26, 2021)

This Out To Lunch president has hurt us irreparably and he is not facing impeachment or preferably court marshall and imprisonment and President Trump was impeached for a freakin' phone call that was part of his responsibility??

Jill...you are no foreign affairs expert...stick to your affairs here in the US.  That's where yer expertise lies.  You and your husband's VP have a lot in common...thats probably why you two can't stand each other.


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## JohnReese (Aug 27, 2021)

Calypso Jones said:


> This Out To Lunch president has hurt us irreparably and he is not facing impeachment or preferably court marshall and imprisonment and President Trump was impeached for a freakin' phone call that was part of his responsibility??
> 
> Jill...you are no foreign affairs expert...stick to your affairs here in the US.  That's where yer expertise lies.  You and your husband's VP have a lot in common...thats probably why you two can't stand each other.


Impeach 46!


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 27, 2021)

Follow maxine's chant.   'Peach fohtee six'.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 27, 2021)

Glen Beck is in the middle east with Nazarene fund rescuing the people that SHOULD HAVE BEEN RESCUED by this Biden Regime but they weren't.  They've been intentionally turned away.

If Joe lives long enough he will tell the story of his personally rescuing afghani citizens.   Him and his new General Cornpop but mostly Joe.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 27, 2021)

You know what it seems like.....where's obama?  Susan Rice? Hilliary?  Jimmy Carter?   Where are they backing up Joe's stupid decisions?  Where's Joe saying he calls Barry every morning?    LOLOL     THey all got their heads down.  They DARE NOT open their big mouths at this point.  LOLOL   Joe's gonna go down on this all by hisself.


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## Calypso Jones (Aug 27, 2021)




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## Calypso Jones (Aug 27, 2021)




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## woodwork201 (Aug 31, 2021)

Joe Biden now joins the list, at the #2 position, of the most prolific murdering terrorists in the history  of the US.  He may move up to #1.


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## woodwork201 (Aug 31, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Yet somehow conservatives are the only ones who praise Putin.


Yet Hillary gave him the Easy Button.  Obama and Hillary, together, gave him control of the US uranium industry.  Hunter Biden got 3.7 million dollars from the wife of the mayor of Moscow - apparently he's got one heck of a magical tongue.  And then, Daddy Biden, gave Putin a pipeline and control of all of Europe  through the threat of turning off the Russian petroleum spigot.

No; it's not Trump or conservatives who love Putin.


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## candycorn (Sep 1, 2021)

woodwork201 said:


> Yet Hillary gave him the Easy Button.  Obama and Hillary, together, gave him control of the US uranium industry.  Hunter Biden got 3.7 million dollars from the wife of the mayor of Moscow - apparently he's got one heck of a magical tongue.  And then, Daddy Biden, gave Putin a pipeline and control of all of Europe  through the threat of turning off the Russian petroleum spigot.
> 
> No; it's not Trump or conservatives who love Putin.


Wow, could you imagine if any of that were true?


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## danielpalos (Sep 1, 2021)

woodwork201 said:


> Yet Hillary gave him the Easy Button.  Obama and Hillary, together, gave him control of the US uranium industry.  Hunter Biden got 3.7 million dollars from the wife of the mayor of Moscow - apparently he's got one heck of a magical tongue.  And then, Daddy Biden, gave Putin a pipeline and control of all of Europe  through the threat of turning off the Russian petroleum spigot.
> 
> No; it's not Trump or conservatives who love Putin.


Yet, right-wingers seem to make the Best Russian tools.


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## woodwork201 (Sep 2, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Wow, could you imagine if any of that were true?


Which part isn't true?  Well, maybe the part about Hunter's tongue; in reality it wasn't out of love or sex that she gave him the money, it was about Hunter's Daddy and having the power to blackmail into things like approving pipelines, abandoning Americans in Afghanistan, and anything else Putin wants his puppet Joe Biden to do.


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## candycorn (Sep 2, 2021)

woodwork201 said:


> Which part isn't true?  Well, maybe the part about Hunter's tongue; in reality it wasn't out of love or sex that she gave him the money, it was about Hunter's Daddy and having the power to blackmail into things like approving pipelines, abandoning Americans in Afghanistan, and anything else Putin wants his puppet Joe Biden to do.


Wow, could you imagine if what you dreamt about was true?


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## basquebromance (Sep 2, 2021)

victory isn't a birthright. you need to outwork, outhustle, and outpunk the Taliban, and that did not happen

to those Afghans who love America, we need to offer them American citizenship. to the Taliban, we need offer them a grave, and kill every last son of a bitch of them!


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## Calypso Jones (Sep 3, 2021)

"Please Mr. Taliban, Let our people go. "  

idiots.


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## Calypso Jones (Sep 3, 2021)

President Biden has his first successful Rally.


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## easyt65 (Sep 3, 2021)

'Failing?

FAILED!

'nuff said.


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## Calypso Jones (Sep 7, 2021)




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## Rambunctious (Sep 7, 2021)

4 prisoners Obama exchanged for Bowe Berghdahl now in senior Taliban posts​








						4 prisoners Obama exchanged for Bowe Bergdahl now in senior Taliban posts
					

Four of five former Guantanamo detainees whom former President Barack Obama released in exchange for Bowe Bergdahl in 2014 now hold senior roles in the Taliban's interim government.




					www.foxnews.com


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## Calypso Jones (Sep 28, 2021)




----------

