# Why the Right HATES Healthcare



## rightwinger (Mar 20, 2010)

Here is what it does for Americans..

1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer

2. If you have the misfortune of becoming seriously ill and run up bills over $100,000, the insurance company can't cap your bill and make you pay anything in excess of $100,000

3. If you just graduated college and have to work for a small company that does not offer health coverage, you can be covered on your parents policy until you are 26.

4. If you own or work for a small company, Insurance pools will be formed to allow you to compete as a large group and get better rates

5. You won't have to defer preventive care which may detect serious problems. It will be free with your insurance coverage

6. Insurance companies will not be able to drop you if you become seriously ill


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## California Girl (Mar 20, 2010)

Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare. 


Will this healthcare improve people's ability to file shit in the right place? 

Damnation, you are an ass.


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## pete (Mar 20, 2010)

Its not "Health care" as much as it is "How" and "What" .... the people spoke including those on the left and all just ignored.


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## rightwinger (Mar 20, 2010)

California Girl said:


> Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
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> Will this healthcare improve people's ability to file shit in the right place?
> ...



There are 12 Healthcare threads on the first page of the Politics Board right now. It is the biggest political  topic of the weekend.This thread describes what is in the bill


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

pete said:


> Its not "Health care" as much as it is "How" and "What" .... the people spoke including those on the left and all just ignored.



They spoke to the fact that "Mr. President, _this bill is not enough_."  Not that it's going too far.


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## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
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> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



7. and if you are a lazy sit on the porch democrat you won't have to pay a dime of it. The 50% of Americans who actually pay federal income taxes will provide you your sugar titty.


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## pete (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> pete said:
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Dream on


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
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> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
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> ...



And all we need to pay for it is to tax the shit out of working folks and kill off granny ......


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## rightwinger (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> rightwinger said:
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This bill helps real Americans and will take very good care of granny. Which of these provisions do you object to and why?


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

pete said:


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40% support the bill, 49% oppose.  Of those who oppose, about half say it doesn't go far enough.

All this Socialism and government takeover and all that noise is just a very small, but noisy minority.

Bill passes in 26.5 hours.  Watch the polls surge once it's passed; Watch.


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## rightwinger (Mar 20, 2010)

I'd ask anyone to explain why they oppose these provisions in the Healthcare bill


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
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> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
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> ...



On what page of the bill is your point #1?


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


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Raising healthcare premiums helps "real" americans ?  Higher taxes helps "real" americans ?

Medicare already denies more services than any insurance company and they're going cut medicare, how does that help granny ?

Why won't the dems just man up and be honest about what this really is, they've told every lie in the book to get the less than concrete support they have. If they really told the truth about it, they'd be lucky to get 25% to support it ........


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## rightwinger (Mar 20, 2010)

Samson said:


> rightwinger said:
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Pre-existing conditions requirements are throughout the bill


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## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



Wingy, what I love about your threads is that you put enough in to antagonize the other side into responding. 
OK, so I love doing that as well.

But here is part of the Samuelson article that destroys your premise(s).

"There's a parallel here: housing. Most Americans favor homeownership, but uncritical pro-homeownership policies (lax lending standards, puny down payments, hefty housing subsidies) helped cause the financial crisis. The same thing is happening with health care. The appeal of universal insurance -- who, by the way, wants to be uninsured? -- justifies half-truths and dubious policies. That the process is repeating itself suggests that our political leaders don't learn even from proximate calamities. 

How often, for example, have you heard the emergency-room argument? The uninsured, it's said, use emergency rooms for primary care. That's expensive and ineffective. Once they're insured, they'll have regular doctors. Care will improve; costs will decline. Everyone wins. Great argument. Unfortunately, it's untrue. 

A study by the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation found that the insured accounted for 83 percent of emergency-room visits, reflecting their share of the population. After Massachusetts adopted universal insurance, emergency-room use remained higher than the national average, an Urban Institute study found. More than two-fifths of visits represented non-emergencies. Of those, a majority of adult respondents to a survey said it was "more convenient" to go to the emergency room or they couldn't "get [a doctor's] appointment as soon as needed." If universal coverage makes appointments harder to get, emergency-room use may increase. 

You probably think that insuring the uninsured will dramatically improve the nation's health. The uninsured don't get care or don't get it soon enough. With insurance, they won't be shortchanged; they'll be healthier. Simple. 

Think again. I've written before that expanding health insurance would result, at best, in modest health gains. Studies of insurance's effects on health are hard to perform. Some find benefits; others don't. Medicare's introduction in 1966 produced no reduction in mortality; some studies of extensions of Medicaid for children didn't find gains. In the Atlantic recently, economics writer Megan McArdle examined the literature and emerged skeptical. Claims that the uninsured suffer tens of thousands of premature deaths are "open to question." Conceivably, the "lack of health insurance has no more impact on your health than lack of flood insurance," she writes."
washingtonpost.com

Keep on keepin' on. This is fun.


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## rightwinger (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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You are not answering...Which of these provisions do you oppose?  Pre-existing conditions, caps on coverage, health insurance pools?

If insurance companies start to jack up their rates, maybe we need to remind them about the public option


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


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I've answered, i oppose all of it, now what's your answer to my questions ?

The objective is for the "public option" to be the only option.


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


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You mean your 29 word summary description repeats itself "throughout the 2000+ page bill,"

But you don't know where it appears like, just once?

You're kidding, right?


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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Yeah?  And if the insurance companies keep gaming the system... Working people over, as they've been doing for years... That's exactly what we'll have.  Quick.


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



Yesterday Boehner looked like a man going to the hangmans noose, The leadership understand that they have screwed the pooch. He knows if this passes the American people will see the benifits nearly immediately and that ALL the THREATS the Rs have made about "what will happen" wont materialize and the republican party will have stood in the way, fought and threatened DOOM and did it by lying their asses off. They will have it thrown in their faces for a generation to come. Boehner knows his carreer is fucked and all Rs who did all the fear mongering will be fucked.


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> rightwinger said:
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From your lips to god's ears.


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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And in comes the gubment to save the day ........

The gubment has been "gaming" people longer and worse than ins. companies have. They're "gaming" and working people over with this current piece of crap legislation that the people don't want.......


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## Claudette (Mar 20, 2010)

I have to laugh at anyone who thinKs the Govt can run anything cheaply or well. What a joke. 

This bill will address a few  problems to start with but the majority won't kick in for 4 or 5 years. Meanwhile premiums will go up and we will all pay up the ass. 

This will turn into a monster full of red tape, mountains of paperwork, waiting lists. You name it. The employers will dump all and pay the fine. I sure would. 

Doctors are already refusing Medicaid patients. 

I have trouble believing that anyone would want the Govt anywhere near their healthcare. Jeeze. The Govt in its entire history fucks up everything it touches. 

Medicare, Medicaid and SS are broke and you folks want another giant Govt run entitlement?? 

This will turn into the public option before long and then you weill really see how "well" Govt runs things.


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



Rw....just saying you are the ONLY fair and balanced poster on the USMB ruins any credibility you may have had.....now you sound like a Sean Hannity wannabe...


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> rightwinger said:
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...once more we see ...The Truth....you still havent answered me Truth....do you know who Shata is?....


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## saveliberty (Mar 20, 2010)

Insurance is simply sharing the risk of loss with others.  Those with more risk, pay higher premiums.  Those who see the cost of premiums as too high will not buy.  In your example, someone who is high risk needs insurance.  Wow, what a mind blowing revelation.

There are high risk pools for insurance.  The premiums are high.  We already have a system in place to help the poor get health care.  It is a poorly run program with a great deal of fraud and mismanagement.  Now you want to expand it.  You also expect me to believe it will be more efficient, better care and  more fair.  Open your eyes.


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## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

Another day, another OP dedicated to proving Rahm "Dems are fucking retards" Emanuel correct.


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> And in comes the gubment to save the day ........
> 
> The gubment has been "gaming" people longer and worse than ins. companies have. They're "gaming" and working people over with this current piece of crap legislation that the people don't want.......



and thats a good point....our Govt is known for fucking people and yet here comes more people saying how.... "they have your best interest at heart".....Cujo....your a fool....as is Truth doesnt matter as long as im the one telling you the Truth....and of course now we have Rw...."The ONLY Fair And Balanced Guy Around".......as Spock would say....FASCINATING...


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## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

Wussammat RW, the 11 year old whose mom died wouldn't come out for your OP?


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> The gubment has been "gaming" people longer and worse than ins. companies have. They're "gaming" and working people over with this current piece of crap legislation that the people don't want.......



YOU ARE THE "GUBMENT."  Why do you insist that government is automatically bad and can't do anything right?  It is not us vs. them.  We are them.  When the government does something for us, it's just us doing something for ourselves.  Often times, especially on projects of a large scale, the power of all of us is better for all of us than a loose-knit collection of profiteers.

Since the GUBMENT is so inefficient, let's privatize the Military, eh?  That's where the real savings are at.  This thing costs less over 20 years than the Pentagon budget over the last 2 years.


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## California Girl (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> California Girl said:
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No shit, Sherlock? 

Still about healthcare, is it not?


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## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

Here's what comes to mind when I read the OP







They hatesssssssssss my precious healthcare, my precious.


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## California Girl (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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No chance God will listen to truthdon'tmatter, He doesn't pay any attention to liars. Just sayin'.


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## boedicca (Mar 20, 2010)

ObamaCare is NOT Health Care.

Just sayin'.


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## California Girl (Mar 20, 2010)

boedicca said:


> ObamaCare is NOT Health Care.
> 
> Just sayin'.



True that. I'm still trying  to work out how a government take over of student loans is going to impact on the nations health?   Except I guess it will get rid of a lot of jobs in the private sector so they'll need a public option to help the unemployed people who used to deal with student loans.


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## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 20, 2010)

First off, the premise of  the thread is idiotic... who the hell "hates healthcare"?  And as for the pointless points, he totally ignores the implications of each.  And, it is also useful to point out that the U.S. Gov't is the largest healthcare provider in the WORLD and they routinely deny more claims than any private insurer.  Go to the V.A. and look what you are in for.
Rightwinger is a fucking imbecile of the highest order.


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## NYcarbineer (Mar 20, 2010)

Claudette said:


> I have to laugh at anyone who thinKs the Govt can run anything cheaply or well. What a joke.



Every industrialized nation that is spending less on healthcare than we are has more government involvement in their healthcare.


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## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 20, 2010)

California Girl said:


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Healthcare has NOTHING to do with healthcare.  This is a massive power/money grab.  that's it.
Unfortunately some seem too blinded by their desparate wanting of more for nothing to see what is really going on.


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## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

NYcarbineer said:


> Claudette said:
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You should move there. Now.


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## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 20, 2010)

NYcarbineer said:


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More leftwing, vapid talking points.  Could you be more vague?  WTF does this even mean?  What is the point?


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

boedicca said:


> ObamaCare is NOT Health Care.
> 
> Just sayin'.



Then what IS Obamacare?

*****My hobby: Setting-up Boedicca's Replys*****


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## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 20, 2010)

Samson said:


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That's the $2,500,000,000,000 question.


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

NYcarbineer said:


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Jesus Christ, do you, Chrissy and oldrockhead share the same brain ? .....


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

Soggy in NOLA said:


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I posted this in another thread a few days ago.  





Nobody spends HALF per capita what we spend; Yet we're lagging behind others life expectancy and overall health.  But we're #1 in medical-related bankruptcy!

This is one of those things "WE" collectively can do cheaper and better than the profiteers.  Same like military, interstate highways, et al.

Correction: A few do spend Half, but barely.


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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It's a fact!  Will you address the post rather than throwing a hissy fit?


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

boedicca said:


> ObamaCare is NOT Health Care.
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> Just sayin'.





Cuyo said:


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Cuba spends almost nothing on Healthcare, and as we all know, it is Utopia.

So, the USA should do everything Cuba does.


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## boedicca (Mar 20, 2010)

Samson said:


> Then what IS Obamacare?
> 
> *****My hobby: Setting-up Boedicca's Replys*****




At least it keeps you away from OctoPr0n, albeit temporarily.

ObamaCare is expanded government - it is designed for the benefit of Big Government.

It "reforms" (regulates and takes over) aspects of the health insurance industry, turning it into a GSE Utility in all but name.   Insurance doesn't provide health care - doctors, nurses, hospitals, clinics, etc. do.   The taxes, mandates, and price controls embedded in the bill will dampen supply creation - thus reducing the availability of actual Health Care (except of course, the the ruling elite who will receive care from special facilities set up just for themselves, their families, and their cronies).


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## Wry Catcher (Mar 20, 2010)

California Girl said:


> Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
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> Will this healthcare improve people's ability to file shit in the right place?
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My my, nasty today I see.  Of course today is much like any other day.  And, btw, it will.  I will be able to file shit in a lab for evaluation, as a preventative method which if a serious desease is detected earlier may save hundreds of thousands of dollars and lots of pain and worry.
Seems a good deal, at least to the non-nasty and sensible ones among us.


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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Facts dont concern them.

They just pull out of their asses things and then call them facts. Thats good enough for them.

Cali just called me a liar in another thread for saying Drs and Nurses go to college to learn how to do their jobs.

They are reaching the point of explosion.

Lies are all they have to defend the bushel of failed ideas. I wish they would just get new ideas and help fix this country but they seem to be incapable of that. Instead they have chosen the insane path of defending what did not work and gave us this huge mess.


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

boedicca said:


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I WAS BAITED!!!!


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

boedicca said:


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No, it is reform to the private market aimed at eliminating abuse, exploitation, and fraud.  Our current system is corrupt beyond belief.  

You can argue that it won't work, but I'm sorry to say claiming it's "For the benefit of big government" is white noise.  "Big government" already has excellent health care.  The bill is aimed at getting some more people great healthcare, or at least some health care.


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

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It's been addressed ad nauseum with the other previously mentioned Rhodes Scholar liberals, rookie ......

So "your party" is going to solve this so called "fact" by INCREASING healthcare spending .....


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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OK, so address it again.  I sound like a broken fuckin' record here, why not you too?  What is your answer to us spending double the other guys, but living shorter lives?


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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check the ninja edit ...


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## boedicca (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> No, it is reform to the private market aimed at eliminating abuse, exploitation, and fraud.  Our current system is corrupt beyond belief.
> 
> You can argue that it won't work, but I'm sorry to say claiming it's "For the benefit of big government" is white noise.  "Big government" already has excellent health care.  The bill is aimed at getting some more people great healthcare, or at least some health care.




You poor widdle brainwashed booby.

Government already funds 50% of health care - it has become more corrupt as Government interference has increased.  It they could get rid of fraud - why haven't they done so already?  Fraud is already against the law.

Government choosing winners and losers, with the former being funneled taxpayer money, always results in a huge moral hazard.  ObamaCare is just more gasoline on a conflagration of Big Government Cronyism.


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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The theory is that costs will go down by ending abusive profiteering, and by getting more people seen by a doctor when they're just a little sick vs. extremely sick.

A $10 Z-Pack for a URI or Bronchitis is a lot cheaper than a week in the hospital for Pneumonia.  But right now, the uninsured "Wait it out" on the URI for fear of getting a bill they can't handle, and show up in the E.R. very, very ill and fearing for their life, 3 weeks later.

It does, however, shift some more of this spending toward Government expenses vs. private expenses.   Some people are against that, regardless of whether or not it's in their best interests.  Are you such a person?

In other words, do you believe it won't work, or do you object even if it does?


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

boedicca said:


> You poor widdle brainwashed booby.
> 
> Government already funds 50% of health care - it has become more corrupt as Government interference has increased.  It they could get rid of fraud - why haven't they done so already?  Fraud is already against the law.
> 
> Government choosing winners and losers, with the former being funneled taxpayer money, always results in a huge moral hazard.  ObamaCare is just more gasoline on a conflagration of Big Government Cronyism.



Condescending to me.  That's original.

Here's the problem with your post: What you call "Fraud;" People unduly enriching themselves at the expense of others; Is done out in the open in the private market.  It's not called "Fraud" there, it's simply called "Profits."


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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It won't work, the dems know this but don't care. It's a tax increase disguised as healthcare. You are naive if you think Obama, Pelosi, Reid etc.... care if people have health insurance or not.


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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You're Cuban, right?


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## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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The US has the greatest longevity in the world.

And the best healthcare.

The efficacy of our healthcare system cannot be equated to homicides and auto accedident deaths, and...

"When you adjust for these fatal injury rates, U.S. life expectancy is actually higher than in nearly every other industrialized nation.
United States Health Care ranking | Independence Institute: Patient Power


"Despite the poor showing on the WHO study, the low longevity ranking of the United States is not likely a result of a poorly functioning health care system, according to researchers with the National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER).  On the contrary, the United States functions well compared to Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) countries in terms of death avoidance."
http://www.nber.org/digest/dec09/w15213.html 

So, like so many easily led lefty's, for you "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing." (Pope.)


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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Profits are evil, the gubment confiscating as much of our hard earned money as possible is righteous ! .........


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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What well you say to us when it does work?


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

PoliticalChic said:


> The US has the greatest longevity in the world.
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> And the best healthcare.
> 
> .)





Bullshit!

Everyone knows that Cuba spends the least/ capita, so Cuba has the best healthcare.

Get with the program, PC, or you might need to be "re-educated."


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

NYcarbineer said:


> Claudette said:
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and they are not having problems keeping them afloat?....NO 1 France is starting to have problems financing theirs.....and they only have 50-60 million to cover in a much smaller area....


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## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


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What a compendium of misinformation you are!  Where is this "abusive profiteering" of which you speak?

Now, once I shoot this misstatement out of the water, will this send you back to the library to actually learn something before you bloviate?

Here come your marching orders:

" Health insurance profits of nearly $13 billion make up 0.6 percent of that. CEO compensation is a mere 0.005 percent of total spending."
FactCheck.org: Pushing for a Public Plan


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


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Profits that depend upon denying care to those who need it on technicalities is evil.  How would you like to privatize the police?  When you need police assistance you get a bill.  Can you imagine?  Police insurance companies would crop up, scare tactics to convince you that you need police insurance, and insurance companies carefully hiding stipulations in the contract so they don't have to pay the claim when your house gets broken into. 

Seems outrageous when I put it like that, eh?


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## Modbert (Mar 20, 2010)

California Girl said:


> Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
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> Will this healthcare improve people's ability to file shit in the right place?
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And I'm sure you're posting this in all the right wing health care threads, right?


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## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

PoliticalChic said:


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PC: Me, your avatar, baby-making.  That's about all I have to say to you.


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## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

Samson said:


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Of course, I meant OUTSIDE of the People's Utopia of Cuba!


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


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> > Cuyo said:
> ...



The problem won't be me having to admit it's working. You and the state controlled media won't admit it's a failure when it falls on its face.  It's a failure right out of the gate having to pay for it four years in advance. The stimulus is a major failure also, but the koolaid drinkers tout it as a success.


----------



## Wry Catcher (Mar 20, 2010)

PoliticalChic said:


> Cuyo said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...



I wonder why anyone might take greater confidence in a business 'think' tank then in one focused solely on the worlds health?


----------



## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

PoliticalChic said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > PoliticalChic said:
> ...





That's better.


----------



## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> The problem won't be me having to admit it's working. You and the state controlled media won't admit it's a failure when it falls on its face.  It's a failure right out of the gate having to pay for it four years in advance. The stimulus is a major failure also, but the koolaid drinkers tout it as a success.



_THIS IS THE $64,000.00 QUESTION_:

In a hypothetical world where we KNOW it will work, 100% certainty.  Do you approve of it then, or do you still not want it based on principles of not wanting the government involved.


----------



## PubliusInfinitum (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer


 
ROFLMNAO... Man ya can't hide idiocy... can ya kids?

I mean it's like she's trying to claim that 'the insurance company is PUNISHING a a caner victim... and not simply maintianing heir fudiciary responsibility to the pool of those presently insured... from having the available financial resources of that pool subjected to higher actuarial risks, than the pool was designed to meet.





> 2. If you have the misfortune of becoming seriously ill and run up bills over $100,000, the insurance company can't cap your bill and make you pay anything in excess of $100,000


 
Only where that is the scope of the policy to which you agreed; when you accepted that insurance. The simple fact is that had you opted to pay for a policy with larger limits of coverage, you'd be entitled to the larger caps.

DUMBASS!



> 3. If you just graduated college and have to work for a small company that does not offer health coverage, you can be covered on your parents policy until you are 26.


 
Where's this rule which says that because ya just graduated college ya have to work for a small company that does not offer health insurance?

And naturally, when you fail to cite this 'rule' you'll concede TO ME... AGAIN: that you're an imbecile.

FTR: My youngest son is on our healthcare policy... right now. 20 years old... 



> 4. If you own or work for a small company, Insurance pools will be formed to allow you to compete as a large group and get better rates


 
There are DOZENS of small business insurance pools available to small businesses all over these united States... RIGHT NOW. And they've ALWAYS been available... the implication that they're not available is a damn lie...



> 5. You won't have to defer preventive care which may detect serious problems. It will be free with your insurance coverage


There is not a single person in these United States who 'has to defer preventive care, which may detect serious problems...' PERIOD. 

This is the EXACT SAME ARGUMENT that has been used at EVERY inch of the Left's drive to take over the US government through Socialized Medicine... HMO's are a Leftist creation... OKA: Health *MAINTENANCE *ORGANIZATIONS... 

The argument for which was "_You won't have to defer preventive care which may detect serious problems. It will be free with your insurance coverage ..._"

 And that was in the 1970s... nearly TWO GENERATIONS back.



> 6. Insurance companies will not be able to drop you if you become seriously ill


 
The Insurance companies only drop you when you stop paying your premium or exceed your policy limits...

DUMBASS!

.
.
.
.

Understand kids, the fallacy here is that with Socialised medicine, you're all going to have Platinum, UNLIMITED COVERAGE...


That's not true, because it's not possible... the issue here is not your healthcare... The issue is LEFTIST POWER.

What you need to understand is that once they HAVE that power; they don't NEED you anymore... and you can rest assured that they don't give a red rat's ass about YOU; your health of the quality of volume of care you receive towards tending the care of such.

The simple fact is that the Resources are finite and the etheral needs of "The People" are INFINITE... you non-idiots will see the problem that represents without need for further comment; and will naturally vote accordingly in November.


----------



## sole survivor (Mar 20, 2010)

OP is anecdotal whining BS. Why does this clown think we want to read the mechinations of his putrid thought process.


----------



## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> PoliticalChic said:
> 
> 
> > Cuyo said:
> ...



Have no fear: Im here to help you fulfill your comic potential

Of course you have no response: you also have no knowledge.

And, when  confronted with facts you rely on the typical lib response: none.

Thanks: I get that warm, fuzzy feeling that only cruelty to the stupid can provide.


----------



## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

PoliticalChic said:


> Cuyo said:
> 
> 
> > PoliticalChic said:
> ...



Babies, por favor.

But if she talked anything like you, I'd probably have to duct tape her mouth.


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 20, 2010)

NYcarbineer said:


> Claudette said:
> 
> 
> > I have to laugh at anyone who thinKs the Govt can run anything cheaply or well. What a joke.
> ...



No shit ass clown...it called government subsidization...how much of my fucking hard earned money do YOU want to steal from me today!!!!????


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > The problem won't be me having to admit it's working. You and the state controlled media won't admit it's a failure when it falls on its face.  It's a failure right out of the gate having to pay for it four years in advance. The stimulus is a major failure also, but the koolaid drinkers tout it as a success.
> ...



Well, theoretical science can prove that an elephant can hang from a cliff with his tail tied to a daisy and global warming. The problem is, leftists live in the theoretical world way too much. I wouldn't mind some marginal gubment involvement if it could really lower costs and not ration care, but that defies all common sense which tells me they are willfully lying to us.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> Nobody spends HALF per capita what we spend; Yet we're lagging behind others life expectancy and overall health.  But we're #1 in medical-related bankruptcy!
> 
> This is one of those things "WE" collectively can do cheaper and better than the profiteers.  Same like military, interstate highways, et al.
> 
> Correction: A few do spend Half, but barely.



and i have posted this every time someone says what your saying....and the only reply i get is just another dance around the question or its ignored....maybe you will be different.....what does a Health Care System have to do with lifespan?.....in our country a HELL of a lot of people dont take care of them selves properly.....some with Ins. dont go for their regular checkups.....ever hear some guys say they will NEVER get a Colonoscopy..."no ones going to shove anything up my ass".....basically im saying you can have the best fucking Health Care on the planet.....if you dont take care of yourself or dont go for your regular checkups.....it is not going to make you live longer....it will if you use it.....im willing to bet it wont change nothing....


----------



## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

Wry Catcher said:


> PoliticalChic said:
> 
> 
> > Cuyo said:
> ...



Enough aspirsions!

Counter evidence?

Put up or...you know the rest.


----------



## Cuyo (Mar 20, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> Cuyo said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody spends HALF per capita what we spend; Yet we're lagging behind others life expectancy and overall health.  But we're #1 in medical-related bankruptcy!
> ...



Perhaps we had this discussion before, or I had a very similar one with someone else.

I agree with you, whole-heartedly.  But access to primary care physicians is a part of the algorithm as well.

We live in a culture of sickness.  No question about it.  Touche', my good man.


----------



## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

PubliusInfinitum said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...




It would probably add to credability if they could let us know which (or any?) page this appears in the bill.


----------



## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Cuyo said:
> 
> 
> > boedicca said:
> ...



True!!  And only rich conservatives can profit while poor liberals must depend on government for sustenance.


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Cuyo said:
> ...



Well...my suggestion to the poor liberals is to *GET UP OFF YOUR FAT 50 TWINKIE EATING ASS AND GET A BETTER FUCKING JOB AFTER YOU GET A DAMN EDUCATION!!!!*


----------



## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

PatekPhilippe said:


> Thinman said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...



"Asses"

You meant to say the plural.


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Cuyo said:
> ...



Sure thing tinman, if you only had a brain you'd earn your own wealth instead of following the yellow brick road to the Wizard of Obama to ask him to confiscate it from people who've earned it.


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 20, 2010)

Samson said:


> PatekPhilippe said:
> 
> 
> > Thinman said:
> ...



I was attempting to address each fat 50 twinkie eating ass individually but thanks...


----------



## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> Cuyo said:
> 
> 
> > Nobody spends HALF per capita what we spend; Yet we're lagging behind others life expectancy and overall health.  But we're #1 in medical-related bankruptcy!
> ...



This is correct.  It is not a matter of health insurance.  It is taking responsibility for your own health and well being.  Government can't do that for you.


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > NYcarbineer said:
> ...



how many industrialized nations with populations of 350 million plus 30-50 million illegal aliens have successfully relied on national healthcare.. show us the countries and the stats. Please!


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 20, 2010)

Sorry, I have yet to read one post that supports the idea that forgiving student loans, giving more water to central CA, mandating insurance, cutting medicare, exempting unions from fines and taxes and imposing more taxes and fines is going to make healthcare less costly.

Unless of course I missed that post.


----------



## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Thinman said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...



I'm with you.  I was being sarcastic as you were in your previous quote.


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Thinman said:
> ...



Oops, sorry it went over my head the lefty tards have dragged my iq down closer to theirs it appears.....

pos rep coming for you .....


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

When this bill passes and all the LIES the right has proffered never materialize your party will be bankrupt.

You see when you crash an economy and mire the country in costly wars that produce nothing but death and bills for the american people and then you try the path of obstruction and lies to win back the trust of the American people you fuck yourself.

You have time and time proven that the republucan leadership has nothing to offer the American people but death, fear and deficits.

Now you will be remembered in the American publics mind as liars.

This bill will not supply the distruction of the US as you had hoped.

What is your next step?

What will you say to the american people when all this doom and gloom doesnt happen?


Have you even thought about that?


----------



## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

truthmatters said:


> this bill will not supply the distruction of the us as you had hoped.
> 
> What is your next step?
> 
> ...



Blame Bush?


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> When this bill passes and all the LIES the right has proffered never materialize your party will be bankrupt.
> 
> You see when you crash an economy and mire the country in costly wars that produce nothing but death and bills for the american people and then you try the path of obstruction and lies to win back the trust of the American people you fuck yourself.
> 
> ...



Yep, as soon as those premiums go down 3000% as Obama said they would, the R party is done. The premium decreases should happen right around 20NEVER......


----------



## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > When this bill passes and all the LIES the right has proffered never materialize your party will be bankrupt.
> ...



Multiply those saving across all 57 states and we're talking real money here!


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.

You do realize that it would be very easy to change the number he said in the clip right?

Remember what Okeefe did to ACORN by doctoring tapes.


----------



## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.
> 
> You do realize that it would be very easy to change the number he said in the clip right?
> 
> Remember what Okeefe did to ACORN by doctoring tapes.



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbpWonUzlrc]YouTube - Obama Gaffe[/ame]


HAS to be doctored because no one can be THAT Stupid in real life and certainly not anyone that you would give your health care proxy to


----------



## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.
> 
> You do realize that it would be very easy to change the number he said in the clip right?
> 
> Remember what Okeefe did to ACORN by doctoring tapes.



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws]YouTube - Obama Claims He's Visited 57 States[/ame]

57 states? 58? 59?


----------



## Misty (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
> ...




This is why I hate it;

1-According to the Congressional Budget Offices report it will cost 940 billion over 10 years.

2 -95% of Americans are required to be insured or else pay a fine (starting in 2014) exempt for low-income

3 - Starting in 2018 individuals making more than $200,000, or married couples above $250,000 will be facing a 3.8 percent tax increase in order to pay for the bill.


 low income people are exempt from being required to get insurance!? Wasn't that the point of reform?


----------



## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

Misty said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



No, it was to give Eugenicists Ezekiel Emanuel a lot of people to play with


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.
> 
> You do realize that it would be very easy to change the number he said in the clip right?
> 
> Remember what Okeefe did to ACORN by doctoring tapes.




Start at the 28 minute mark, he said that people that get their insurance through their employers will see premiums go down as much as 3000%. Are you going to say this clip is doctored too, liar ? 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Oa9fJXJKpU]YouTube - Health Insurance Reform Right Now[/ame]


----------



## CrusaderFrank (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.
> ...



It must be doctored! I think I see O'Keefe in the audience, third row 4th seat in, has to be him!


----------



## Avatar4321 (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Start at the 28 minute mark, he said that people that get their insurance through their employers will see premiums go down as much as 3000%. Are you going to say this clip is doctored too, liar ?



Yes, Yes she will.


----------



## Rinata (Mar 20, 2010)

This thread is 3 pages long!!! All the OP did was list some advantages to the bill. You people went balistic!!! You'd think you were the Republican leaders in Washington. It sure sounds like it. 

But isn't this more about the prez than it is about healthcare?? I think so. That's what it's about for Republican leaders.


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.
> ...




Looks like truthdon'tmatter had doctored a disappearing act .......


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Do you really think tapes on youtube are tested for doctored content?


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Do you really think tapes on youtube are tested for doctored content?



well, all ya gotta do is find the original undoctered one to prove this one is doctored.. twatwhistle!


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Do you really think tapes on youtube are tested for doctored content?




Are you saying that tape was doctored and that Obama didn't actually say what is on that video ?........


----------



## Zander (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Do you really think tapes on youtube are tested for doctored content?
> ...


Useful idiots only repeat helpful propaganda. This was clearly "just an error" on behalf of "The Obama". He "misspoke". He is the greatest orator that world has ever known!!! Of course, the entire video you are about to see is "Doctored" too!!! 
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ap2Cg_FDRy4]YouTube - Barack Obama - Gaffe Mania I - Dumber than Dumb[/ame]


----------



## Dante (Mar 20, 2010)

pete said:


> Its not "Health care" as much as it is "How" and "What" .... the people spoke including those on the left and all just ignored.



ypur signature sucks. it's fucking up the window.


----------



## Dante (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
> ...



Apparently, posting RWL shit at USMB has blinded some people.

good thread.


----------



## Dante (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Do you really think tapes on youtube are tested for doctored content?
> ...



I'm saying I dont know if its doctored.

Give me a source with this exact tape that I can trust.


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



That video clearly isn't doctored and you're clearly a lying kook, thanks for playing ......


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Dude you also saoid the Okeefe tapes were not Doctored.


----------



## geauxtohell (Mar 20, 2010)

California Girl said:


> Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
> 
> 
> Will this healthcare improve people's ability to file shit in the right place?
> ...



Surely you can do better than criticizing a thread for placement. 

Or are you applying for a Moderator job?


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

You people dont understand varifiable documentation do you?


----------



## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

CrusaderFrank said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Please produce that clip ffrom anyplace that is not a right wing site.
> ...



Can I get in on this, CF?

I've been wondering which letters in SYRACUSE are silent?

Obama Misspells Syracuse on His NCAA Bracket, Get's Edited Out By ESPN **UPDATE** 
This is exactly what Obama wrote...

Sycasuse?
HotAirPundit: Obama Misspells Syracuse on His NCAA Bracket, Get's Edited Out By ESPN **UPDATE**

[youtube]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/xqPf1t156Gc&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/xqPf1t156Gc&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/youtube]


----------



## Dante (Mar 20, 2010)

Rinata said:


> This thread is 3 pages long!!! All the OP did was list some advantages to the bill. You people went balistic!!! You'd think you were the Republican leaders in Washington. It sure sounds like it.
> 
> But isn't this more about the prez than it is about healthcare?? I think so. That's what it's about for Republican leaders.



The Right Wing Lunacy is all about screaming and being outraged.

I heard Sean Hannity is thinking of pulling an O'Reilly and trying to have "Outrage" copyrighted.


----------



## midcan5 (Mar 20, 2010)

Start around minute 12.

Health Care Reform - C-SPAN Video Library


----------



## Dante (Mar 20, 2010)

geauxtohell said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
> ...


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...




Here you lazy, lying, socialist kook.

Health Insurance Reform Right Now | The White House

The whitehouse website trustworthy enough ?

Looks like you're out of excuses, time to play the race card !


----------



## Zona (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



Socialist.


----------



## PoliticalChic (Mar 20, 2010)

midcan5 said:


> Start around minute 12.
> 
> Health Care Reform - C-SPAN Video Library



It takes three weeks longer to see a medical specialist in Boston than in any other metropolitan area in the country, according to a study by Merritt, Hawkins & Associates, a physician recruiting and consulting company based in Texas.
More than 95 percent of the Bay States population is insured, as state law requires residents to get coverage and prove they have it. The Merritt, Hawkins researchers note health insurance doesnt guarantee a quick visit to the doctor.
The average wait time for an appointment with a doctor in many specialty areas is 50 days, according to the study, with the states expansion of subsidized health insurance serving as the main catalyst driving up demand for care.
Wait Times Signal Problem with Massachusetts ?Model? - by Whitney Stewart - Health Care News

1.	People in Massachusetts wait a long time to see a doctor. People in Georgia don't. 
2.	People in Massachusetts also pay a lot for health insurance. People in Georgia don't. 
3.	Massachusetts in 2006 passed reforms giving almost everybody health insurance. Georgia didn't.
4.	Those reforms are the reason people in Massachusetts pay so much for their health insurance and wait so long to see the doctor.
5.	President Obama wants to pass national reforms that resemble the Massachusetts state reforms.
6.	If President Obama gets his way, all Americans will end up like those cursed people in Massachusettspaying more for health insurance, waiting longer for care
Health Care.

Advocates promised that the Massachusetts plan would make health insurance more affordable, but according to a Cato study, insurance premiums have been increasing at nearly double the national average: 7.4 percent in 2007, 8 percent to 12 percent in 2008, and an expected 9 percent increase this year. Health insurance in Massachusetts costs an average of $16,897 for a family of four, compared to a national average of $12,700. 
The Massachusetts plan incorporates a system of middle-class subsidies called Commonwealth Care to help pay for insurance for families with incomes up to 300 percent of poverty level ($66,150 for a family of four) and also expanded eligibility for Medicaid. 
The costs to the taxpayers are rising, too, and one tax increase has not satisfied the appetite of the hungry plan. The prospect of huge deficits has elicited discussion of cuts in reimbursements to providers and the imposition of a "global budget," which is a euphemism for rationing.
Massachusetts Health Care: A Model Not to Copy


----------



## Yurt (Mar 20, 2010)

the OP is nothing but lies

the thread is simply smear...doesn't seek common ground or honest debate, typical of libs, just mow over the gop, insult them....because who cares, we won, get over it


----------



## Chip (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> You people dont understand varifiable documentation do you?



By the way, "you people" smacks of prejudice.

No way to know for sure, but I suspect you were probably OK with "the documents may be forged, but they're still true" rationalization, back when Dan Rather made the blunder which ultimately led to the end of his career at CBS.


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Documentation is important.

Dan rather paid the price of his failure to properly vet his evidence now didnt he.

Now if you can prove that Obama said that by producing a trustable tape then please do it.

Idont remember any guff about him saying 3000. This makes me very suspicious of the tape.

If you PROVE with proper documentation I will believe it.

It means next to nothing like Zander said because it was obviously a gaff.

I just dont like lies to be allowed to lie arround because I know our country can only prosper if we base our decisions on facts and the truth.

The right has been steeped in lies for far to long and I challenge everything they claim unbless I have verifiable proof of its validity.


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> You people dont understand varifiable documentation do you?



Is whitehouse.gov verifiable documentation ? ...... 

See Post 124 and keep spinning .....


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Can you tell me the time slot so I dont have to waste 35 minutes?


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...



Come on if you checked it you must know the time its on?


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

You didnt check it to see if it says the same thing did you driveby?


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...



lefties are lazy fuckwits.. that's for sho


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 20, 2010)

I'll tell you all something...I perfectly understand how the LIBTARD CAP kooks on this site felt whenever they saw Bush on television....for the first time in my life I actually feel a revolting sense of sickness, akin to wanting to vomit when you catch a whiff of dogshit, watching Obama tell outright lies to the American people today on national television.  Pelosi with her botox smile just laughing at the stupidity of American citizens who voted this con man into office...  I'm truly appalled that our government has sunk this LOW...bribes, payoffs to Unions, special deals for pro-Obama lobbyists and drug companies, outright bribes with OUR MONEY to buy votes in the House!!!!!!....it's just unconscientable that America was stupid enough to elect this European George Soros puppet....

I have lost faith in the American people to be competent enough to pick the right candidate for this country.

America....you asked for it...so bend over...here it comes.


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Health Insurance Reform Right Now | The White House


Driveby, I jsut went through this and at the 28 minute point Obama makes the gaff. Its all his and you were right.

This is verifiable truth and I congradulate you in your presentation of verifiable fact.

Now what you need to realise is that is a gaff.

I do not believe you will find that number anywhere else and if you do I will respect the verifiable evidence you give to prove it.

You see truth does matter to me above all else.


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

All i said was that he said it, jesus christ his whole fucking presidency is made up of lies and gaffes..........

How about you find proof of something for once ?  At least 5 board members have been proving you wrong all day long .......


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

only in your mind.

proving requires verifiable proof like you provided here and I respected.

When will you ever do the same as I did here and accept verifiable proof?


----------



## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

As soon as it's given on something i disagree with ......


----------



## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

PatekPhilippe said:


> I'll tell you all something...I perfectly understand how the LIBTARD CAP kooks on this site felt whenever they saw Bush on television....for the first time in my life I actually feel a revolting sense of sickness, akin to wanting to vomit when you catch a whiff of dogshit, watching Obama tell outright lies to the American people today on national television.  Pelosi with her botox smile just laughing at the stupidity of American citizens who voted this con man into office...  I'm truly appalled that our government has sunk this LOW...bribes, payoffs to Unions, special deals for pro-Obama lobbyists and drug companies, outright bribes with OUR MONEY to buy votes in the House!!!!!!....it's just unconscientable that America was stupid enough to elect this European George Soros puppet....
> 
> I have lost faith in the American people to be competent enough to pick the right candidate for this country.
> 
> America....you asked for it...so bend over...here it comes.



I'm with you all the way and know exactly how you feel.

Many Americans eligible to vote do not even register.  Many registered voters don't vote.  Americans have become comfortable and apathetic.  The party, who successfully energizes their base, gets elected.  This base is typically fringe right or left.  The outrage from their policy energizes the opposite party base and, if the policies are extreme, engages the apathetic silent majority. 

Cause and effect.  The American majority is always a year or two behind the curve.  If America had an 80 or 90% turnout of eligible voters, we would have a more representative government while reducing the strength of the squeaky wheel.


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> As soon as it's given on something i disagree with ......



Can you give me an example on this site where you accepted a fact that made you adjust what you believed in?


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> PatekPhilippe said:
> 
> 
> > I'll tell you all something...I perfectly understand how the LIBTARD CAP kooks on this site felt whenever they saw Bush on television....for the first time in my life I actually feel a revolting sense of sickness, akin to wanting to vomit when you catch a whiff of dogshit, watching Obama tell outright lies to the American people today on national television.  Pelosi with her botox smile just laughing at the stupidity of American citizens who voted this con man into office...  I'm truly appalled that our government has sunk this LOW...bribes, payoffs to Unions, special deals for pro-Obama lobbyists and drug companies, outright bribes with OUR MONEY to buy votes in the House!!!!!!....it's just unconscientable that America was stupid enough to elect this European George Soros puppet....
> ...



Historically the more people who vote the more democratic leaning the election become.

I wpould LOVE more people to vote regularly, this is why the right has worked to disenfranchise voters and demonize groups like ACORN.


----------



## Darkwind (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...


It will do none of those things.  That is why the left hates health care.  They provide a laundry list of what they think America needs, sells that bill of goods to gullible and desperate people  and then fuck them over, with a smile on their faces, with bills like the one that is getting voted on tomorrow.

Given what this POS legislation is going to do, how can you say that anyone other then the progressives hate health care?


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Darkwind said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



What will you say when it in fact does all of these things?


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Come on driveby you must have at least one example where you accepted the verifiable fact from someone that held differeing opinions than you?


----------



## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Thinman said:
> 
> 
> > PatekPhilippe said:
> ...



I think ACORN deserved their demonization.

By the way, do you have a link for the history you claim, something other than the last election which was tainted with voter fraud?


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Caging (voter suppression) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


1980s
In 1981 and 1986 the Republican National Committee (RNC) sent out letters to predominately African-American neighborhoods. When tens of thousands of them were returned undeliverable, the party successfully challenged the voters and had them deleted from voting rolls. Due to the violation of the Voting Rights Act, the RNC was taken to court. Its officials entered a consent decree which prohibited the party from engaging in anti-fraud initiatives that targeted minorities or conducting mail campaigns to "compile voter challenge lists."[5]

[edit] 2004 US Election
BBC journalist Greg Palast obtained an RNC document entitled "State Implementation Template III.doc" that described Republican election operations for caging plans in numerous states. The paragraph in the document pertaining to caging was:

V. Pre Election Day Operations New Registration Mailing
At whatever point registration in the state closes, a first class mailing should be sent to all new registrants as well as purged/inactive voters. This mailing should welcome the recipient to the voter rolls. It is important that a return address is clearly identifiable. Any mail returned as undeliverable for any reason, should be used to generate a list of problematic registrations. Poll watchers should have this list and be prepared to challenge anyone from this list attempting to vote.[6][7]

Shortly before the 2004 election, Palast also obtained a caging list for Jacksonville, Florida, which contained a high number of African Americans and registered Democrats. The caging list was attached to an email which a Florida Republican party official was sending to RNC headquarters official Tim Griffin. [7] [8] [9] 
The Republican National Committee sent letters to predominately urban minority areas in Ohio. When 35,000 letters were returned as undeliverable, the party employed poll watchers to challenge the voters. Voting rights groups challenged the RNC in a case that went to the Supreme Court, but the RNC was not stopped from challenging those voters. Similarly, the RNC sent out 130,000 letters in Philadelphia hoping to cage voters there. Philadelphia is a city with a majority African American population that votes heavily Democratic. The Republicans were attempting to cage votes by people who were likely to vote for the Democratic candidates. [10] 
In the Ohio court challenge, the RNC submitted a caging list that targeted urban and African-American areas in and around Cleveland.[11] 
Journalists found evidence that the Republican National Committee (RNC) attempted to use caging to suppress votes in five states in the 2004 US presidential election. For example, in New Jersey RNC officials used caging lists to challenge absentee ballots and absentee ballot requests.[11] 
[edit] 2008 US Election
As noted earlier, the Republican Secretary of State in Michigan was found purging voters from voting rolls when voter ID cards were returned as undeliverable. In the court challenge, the federal judge ordered the state to reinstate the voters.[12] The judge ruled that the state's actions were in violation of the NVRA. His decision noted that there was no way to prevent qualified voters from being disfranchised as their cards may be returned as undeliverable due to postal error, clerical error, inadvertent routing within a multi-unit dwelling, and even simple misspelling or transposition of numbers in an address. [13] 
In December 2007, Kansas GOP Chair Kris Kobach sent an email boasting, "[T]o date, the Kansas GOP has identified and caged more voters in the last 11 months than the previous two years!"[14] 
Republicans sent out fundraising mailers to voters in five Florida counties: Duval, Hillsborough, Collier, Miami-Dade and Escambia, with 'do not forward' on the letters. The mailers included inaccurate Voter ID numbers and ostensibly confirmed with voters they were registered as Republican. The RNC declined to discuss the mailer with the St. Petersburg Times. A representative denied the mailing had anything to do with caging. "Two top Florida elections officials, both Republicans, faulted the GOP mailing, calling it "confusing" and "unfortunate" because of a potential to undermine voter confidence by making them question the accuracy of their registrations." Some officials expressed concern that the RNC would try to use a caging list derived from the mailers.[15] 
In Northern California reports of voter caging emerged when letters marked 'do not forward' were sent to Democrats with fake voter ID numbers. The description of the letters matches the letters that were sent out in Florida.[16] See the caging letter that was sent out here. Many details on the letters were false; for example, the letters referred to a Voter Identification Division but RNC personnel said they had no such department. The RNC did not return calls from a news organization regarding the letters. 
On October 5, 2008 the Republican Lt. Governor of Montana, John Bohlinger, accused the Montana Republican Party of vote caging to purge 6,000 voters from three counties which trend Democratic. These purges included decorated war veterans and active duty soldiers.[17] 
The New York Times found in its review of state records that unlawful actions in six states led to widespread voter purges, which could have impact on the 2008 elections. Some of the actions were apparently the result of mistakes by the states' handling voter registrations and files as they tried to comply with a 2002 federal law related to running elections. While neither party was singled out, because the Democratic Party registered more new voters this year, Democratic voters were more adversely affected by such actions of state officials


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Come on driveby you must have at least one example where you accepted the verifiable fact from someone that held differeing opinions than you?



http://www.usmessageboard.com/current-events/107022-student-escorted-out-of-class-for-not-saying-the-pledge.html


Ok, i'm done proving you wrong for today .........


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## csbarry (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> California Girl said:
> 
> 
> > Oh, good grief. There is a fucking forum for healthcare.
> ...



Which, in all sincerity, does not address the real problem with the health care system in America. As in the case with this poster, some are willing to settle for far less than an adequate package. Don't be like this poster and settle for less. Let your Senator's know that if they vote for this weak Health Care Reform Package that they need to update their resume before the end of the present term.


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Come on driveby you must have at least one example where you accepted the verifiable fact from someone that held differeing opinions than you?
> ...



I never claimed you could not find one Driveby now did I.

And in the clip thing I never claimed it was not true I merely asked for verifiable proof it was true.

How did you prove me wrong about anything?

This is where many of you people lose site of the truth.

You gave unverifiable evidence and I requested verifiable evidence.

There is nothing wrong with asking for evidence now is there?

No there is not now is there.

Thank you for your evidence of you accepting as fact, it was refreshing and I hope someday you will be able to accept verifiable evidence that I give daily on subjects here.


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## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Willow can you explain to everyone how recieving verifiable evidence upon request makes the person who recieves it  wrong?


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



wow, ummmmm , you're welcome .......


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## driveby (Mar 20, 2010)

WillowTree said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...




i closed the door behind me, i swear ........


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

csbarry said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > California Girl said:
> ...



How is getting nothing for the American people better than getting something?

How does that help the 40,000 people who die because they cant get proper insurance?


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Willow can you explain to everyone how recieving verifiable evidence upon request makes the person who recieves it  wrong?



not until you have answered everysinglequestioneveraskedofyouonthisboard.


----------



## WillowTree (Mar 20, 2010)

driveby said:


> WillowTree said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Caging (voter suppression) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> 1980s
> ...



Do ether of you accept these facts?


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

WillowTree said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Willow can you explain to everyone how recieving verifiable evidence upon request makes the person who recieves it  wrong?
> ...



You cant can you?


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

The funniest part of this is you really think that accepting the other guys verifiable evidence is some how a failure on ones part.

It is why you people are so intractably mired in the lies of the right.


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 20, 2010)

PatekPhilippe said:


> I'll tell you all something...I perfectly understand how the LIBTARD C.A.P. kooks on this site felt whenever they saw Bush on television....for the first time in my life I actually feel a revolting sense of sickness, akin to wanting to vomit when you catch a whiff of dogshit, watching Obama tell outright lies to the American people today on national television.  Pelosi with her botox smile just laughing at the stupidity of American citizens who voted this con man into office...  I'm truly appalled that our government has sunk this LOW...bribes, payoffs to Unions, special deals for pro-Obama lobbyists and drug companies, outright bribes with OUR MONEY to buy votes in the House!!!!!!....it's just unconscientable that America was stupid enough to elect this European George Soros puppet....
> 
> I have lost faith in the American people to be competent enough to pick the right candidate for this country.
> 
> America....you asked for it...so bend over...here it comes.



The whining from Obama on the Hill has been incessant today...now he's saying that his Presidency rests on this Bill being passed or not....

What he fails to realize is that no matter what...he will not be in office on January 21st 2013.


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

how do you know this?


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 20, 2010)

Look at the direction of the country...it's been straight down the road to socialism ever since he took office.  This is a win for Republicans regardless of tomorrows outcome.


----------



## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Do you have any proof of what you claim or is this all just opinion too?


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Can you tell me what percent of the govenment is socialist?


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## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Caging (voter suppression) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> 1980s
> ...



I did not ask for evidence of voter fraud.  I was asking for evidence of elections going more to Democrats when more people, as a percentage, voted.


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## eagleseven (Mar 20, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> I'd ask anyone to explain why they oppose these provisions in the Healthcare bill


You've distilled over 2,000 pages into 7 talking points.

Perhaps if you re-wrote the bill on _one_ page, with only the above points, I'd believe you. Both you and I know that you are bullshitting about a bill of which you know nothing.


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## csbarry (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> csbarry said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



My point is; if you're going to do it, do it right. This HCRP only scratches the surface and doesn't deal with the real issues that need to be addressed. Pass this bill and you will never see the fix we really need; but what you will see is more higher priced executives at the corporate level, as well as wealthier investors, many of whom work in Washington.


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

csbarry said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > csbarry said:
> ...





Scratching the surface is better than doing nothing. You fail to see that changes are easier than the whole enchalda all at once.

Tell us how the all or nothing approach of Clinton got us anything?


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Caging (voter suppression) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> ...



National Voter Turnout in Federal Elections: 1960?2008 &mdash; Infoplease.com

You asked for the history and I gave you some, next tiem specify what you want.

Now look at this chart while I continue to find the info that I read years ago about turnout and democratic wins.


Do you accept the facts given which prove the Rs have a history of attempoting to keep voters off the rolls?


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## csbarry (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> csbarry said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



United we stand; divided we fall. This issue was so important that all we had to do is stick together and tell our respective legislators to do as we ask and we would have received. They played us like a fine tuned fiddle and should they succeed, it will be our fault because we were indifferent and settled for less, much as we have done for the last forty years, and look where we are today. I'm no holy roller but, God help our children, for they are screwed.


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## antagon (Mar 20, 2010)

republicans are hysterical over this


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

Who Votes, and How? | Dollars & Sense

Here you go. This is about a study of the least votimg group. The poor vote at lower rates than most wealthier groups. The more people who vote the more voters of this group who will be the poor. The poor overwhelmingly vote democratic.


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## Truthmatters (Mar 20, 2010)

In 2000, a majority of voters in the lowest four out of five income quintiles reported choosing the Democratic candidate. In 1980, a majority of voters in three out of five income quintiles reported choosing the Democratic candidate, and the fourth quintile was nearly tied. Low- and middle-income people are far less likely to vote, however. As the table shows, the GSS data suggest that there is typically a 25 to 30 percentage-point gap in participation between the lowest and highest income quintiles. The data for every election show a clear pattern: turnout and the portion of the vote going to the Republican candidate both rise as income increases.


This is why ACORN is the bane of republicans. They registar poor people to vote.


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## Samson (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> This is why ACORN is the bane of republicans. They registar poor people to vote.



I thought it was because they offer low interest loans to pimps of underage prostitutes.


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Cuyo said:


> Perhaps we had this discussion before, or I had a very similar one with someone else.
> 
> I agree with you, whole-heartedly.  But access to primary care physicians is a part of the algorithm as well.
> 
> We live in a culture of sickness.  No question about it.  Touche', my good man.



it wasnt me you had the discussion with.....but thank you for answering....something Old Rocks and a few others never did,or lets put it this way....they think they did........thank you Cuyo....


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

PatekPhilippe said:


> Well...my suggestion to the poor liberals is to *GET UP OFF YOUR FAT 50 TWINKIE EATING ASS AND GET A BETTER FUCKING JOB AFTER YOU GET A DAMN EDUCATION!!!!*


can i be the devils advocate here?.....what if jobs are far and few between?....


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > and i have posted this every time someone says what your saying....and the only reply i get is just another dance around the question or its ignored....maybe you will be different.....what does a Health Care System have to do with lifespan?.....in our country a HELL of a lot of people dont take care of them selves properly.....some with Ins. dont go for their regular checkups.....ever hear some guys say they will NEVER get a Colonoscopy..."no ones going to shove anything up my ass".....basically im saying you can have the best fucking Health Care on the planet.....if you dont take care of yourself or dont go for your regular checkups.....it is not going to make you live longer....it will if you use it.....im willing to bet it wont change nothing....
> ...



now how come Rocks and Co. cant see this?.....he will still post saying all these other countries citizens live longer because they have a better Health Care System...


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## skookerasbil (Mar 20, 2010)

The whole damn thing is a gigantic fraud.......................plus, once again, you got a bunch of out and out Obama lies..........

Check it out >>>>> Final health bill omits some of Obama's promises


Just 3 weeks ago, he promised to add the Republican idea of investigations into waste and fraud in the system. IN the end...........Obama said, "FCUKK YOU!!!!.

New Rasmussen #'s on Obama this AM..........*43% APPROVE...........56% DISAPPROVE*.

This president is a fake, phoney, fraud......and those who still trust him are the folks who would buy a shoe full of sh!t if it were packaged just right!!!





I'll give him this............the man has balls. He got up in front of the House today and looked right into the camera and just lied right to the American people.........on the deficit thing...........just fcukking lied with a smile on his face!!! The guy has balls...........I'll give him that!!!


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Thinman said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > Thinman said:
> ...



hey the Thin fella is ok....he has already called out Rdean on some of his bullshit.....so this guy cant be that bad.....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> When this bill passes and all the LIES the right has proffered never materialize your party will be bankrupt.
> 
> You see when you crash an economy and mire the country in costly wars that produce nothing but death and bills for the american people and then you try the path of obstruction and lies to win back the trust of the American people you fuck yourself.
> 
> ...


and we have just heard....THE TRUTH.....from one of the most one sided posters around.....you still havent told me if you know who Shata is......


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Dante said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



so your back.....now you are a lefty again....make up your mind ....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> The right has been steeped in lies for far to long and I challenge everything they claim unbless I have verifiable proof of its validity.



if you were a really Truth Matters type of individual...you would not have posted this,because you know the left lies just as much...OR you would have at LEAST acknowledged that....but you never speak out against the left....which tells many here about you.....TRUTH DOES NOT MATTER.....


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## skookerasbil (Mar 20, 2010)

Can somebody explain this to me....................

Where do liberals NOT learn the lesson so many other Amricans learn early in life..........that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. What the fcukk is up with that???????????????

So we have this Healthcare bill that screws over 200 million Americans for the benefit of 20 million. Thats why conservatives say start over.........apply some free market principles and tort reform and re-route some of the stimulus bill funds not yet allocated. Only those with the IQ of a small soap dish cant realize that the quality of health care gets it up the pooper with this bill.

But hey............what the fcukk do liberals care about the few thousand Cattepillar employees who will now be laid off due to the 100 million cost this bill will have to them.


----------



## csbarry (Mar 20, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > The right has been steeped in lies for far to long and I challenge everything they claim unbless I have verifiable proof of its validity.
> ...



Ain't that the truth!


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Darkwind said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



and if it doesnt?.....what are you gonna say?....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Thank you for your evidence of you accepting as fact, it was refreshing and I hope someday you will be able to accept verifiable evidence that I give daily on subjects here.



oh for Christ Sakes..........


----------



## Thinman (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Thinman said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



Thanks for the link.
I didn&#8217;t ask for evidence of voter fraud, but Democrats don&#8217;t have a monopoly on corruption.  I&#8217;m sure Republicans are just as guilty.

Your link shows no conclusive evidence of higher voter turnout when Democrats won as opposed to Republicans.

I copied Presidential elections only.  The table shows a 4 to 3 advantage to Democrats when more than 55% of eligible voters turned out.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Year______Voting-age_______registered voters_________Turnout________(percent)
2008*____231,229,580___________NA______________132,618,580*_______56.8%
2004_____221,256,931________174,800,000_________122,294,978________55.3
2000_____205,815,000________156,421,311_________105,586,274________51.3
1996_____196,511,000________146,211,960__________96,456,345________49.1
1992_____189,529,000________133,821,178_________104,405,155________55.1
1988_____182,778,000________126,379,628__________91,594,693________50.1
1984_____174,466,000________124,150,614__________92,652,680________53.1
1980_____164,597,000________113,043,734__________86,515,221________52.6
1976_____152,309,190________105,037,986__________81,555,789________53.6
1972_____140,776,000_________97,328,541__________77,718,554________55.2
1968_____120,328,186_________81,658,180__________73,211,875________60.8
1964_____114,090,000_________73,715,818__________70,644,592________61.9
1960_____109,159,000_________64,833,096__________68,838,204________63.1


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> csbarry said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



oh shit another one....40 thou a year die because they have no ins.....so if this passes and it takes a few years to go into effect....those 40 thou are dead anyway....right?...so in a few years there will be no un-insured.....hey...money saved right there....maybe the Prez is on to something....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> The funniest part of this is you really think that accepting the other guys verifiable evidence is some how a failure on ones part.
> 
> It is why you people are so intractably mired in the lies of the right.



if you were for the "truth" Truth....you would not say "you people".....thats admitting your a lefty....you would be equally venting against both sides.....because they both say what they need.....to get people to believe them....you only buy one side.....not showing much about Truth is it......why dont you see if Gunny or Crimson will change your name to "OnlyDemocraticTruthMattersEverythingElseIsBullShit".....fits you better....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> Do you accept the facts given which prove the Rs have a history of attempoting to keep voters off the rolls?



thats funny...out here Dems have a history of putting voters on the rolls who should not be there....funny how a "truthful" individual like yourself never mentions Democrat crimes and  mis -adventures....


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

antagon said:


> republicans are hysterical over this



over what?...getting screwed by our politicians....you bet they are....and im surprised the far left isnt....i know many regular Democrats are at least a little worried....if its a big fucking joke to you Antagon.... bend over and spread those cheeks wide.....and i hope it hurts like hell....


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 20, 2010)

csbarry said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



not to "Truth does not matter"....


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...





Harry Dresden said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > Darkwind said:
> ...



I'm afraid the bill does every one of these things. It ends abusive practices from the insurance industry and expands coverage and protections for Americans

How can Republicans vote against it?


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> I'm afraid the bill does every one of these things.



I'm afraid you, nor most of the House and Senate of the USA, has no fucking clue _*WHAT*_ the bill does beyond proving that Democrats can pass a law whilst they have control of the House and Senate and Presidency of the USA.


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## DiamondDave (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> >
> > 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> >
> ...



Because where the fuck are you owed something for your personal care and upkeep at the expense of someone else???

Ends abusive practices??? LMAO?? You are too funny.. And expanding 'coverage' to a non-contributor at the expense of someone else is flat out wrong.... As stated SO many times... you holier than thou libs are real generous with the money of others....


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## boedicca (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > I'm afraid the bill does every one of these things.
> ...




Even Pelosi and Obama can't say what's it it.


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



That about sums it up.


----------



## csbarry (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> >
> > 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> >
> ...



Simple! Despite your claims to the contrary, the bill doesn't do what we need it to do. It is a joke.


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## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

boedicca said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Why should they?

Content is immaterial: The fact that it passes will give them a "Victory" among the scant few boneheads that continue to support them.


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



Yet you cannot tell me where #1 appears in the bill, can you?

Stop pretending you know WTF you're talking about.


----------



## DiamondDave (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



You motherfucking parrot...

It does none of that... not to mention the bullshit wording you have in there... hell, there is no 'free'... there is paid for by a contributor for the personal care of a non-contributor..

Personally... I hope each and every person who votes for this is put  out of office.. and in the next election or 2 there are the necessary people with backbones in there to override and get rid of this... as well as so many other bullshit entitlement programs


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## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...


  Sums up what? the RW hates the private sector? Hates his own liberty to choose as he sees fit without government intrusion? Hates his own liberty and is willing to give up his liberty to the whims of the Government faceless nameless bureaucrats?

No surprise that YOU would agree with tyranny.


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



It's covered under pre existing conditions and one of the provisions that goes into effect immediately.


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 21, 2010)

DiamondDave said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



You old gasbag...


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 21, 2010)

The T said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



So happy you're not surprised, Thomas.


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > Sarah G said:
> ...



On which page?


----------



## DiamondDave (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> DiamondDave said:
> 
> 
> > Sarah G said:
> ...



So you there there is actually 'free' service??
You think it is right to take from a contributor for the use of a non-contributor for personal wants and needs?


You are a complete dumb ass


----------



## LuckyDan (Mar 21, 2010)

On #1 - are you saying a 24 year old who had a case of cancer 10 years previously cannot find an insurer today?


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Never spend your money before you have it. ~_Jefferson_

Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself. ~Jefferson


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 21, 2010)

There will not be entitlements after the revolution.


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

csbarry said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



The Bill broadens protections for Americans, expands coverage and offers protection for 33 million Americans


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

"He that is of the opinion money will do everything may well be suspected of doing everything for money. "~Franklin 

"A Democracy will continue to exist up until the time the voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury" ~_Alexander Tyler_ (From The Fall Of The Athenian Republic)


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## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> csbarry said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



The bill also has a provision for drinking free Bubble-Up and eating subsidized Rainbow Stew.


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > Samson said:
> ...


 
I won't expect an answer from her. Neither should you.


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

The T said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > Sarah G said:
> ...



Why?

You're not suggesting that proponents of the bill really have no idea what is in it, are you?



Look, we have an Educational System whose primary purpose is to create an Informed Public without which a democracy CANNOT FUNCTION!!!

You are suggesting.........


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > Samson said:
> ...


 
You know it. And it's by _design._


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> The T said:
> 
> 
> > Samson said:
> ...



As if education has done a lot for you.  You sit around here discussing your leg humping dates...  

If that bill is passed today it is law, you will see pre existing conditions policy no longer happening.  

Then you can come and apologize.


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 21, 2010)

Coming from those who atre inextricably in love with abortion and euthenasia, this is kinda funny.


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

The T said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > The T said:
> ...





WHAT?

Is there something in the water?


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > The T said:
> ...



The sad truth is, you probably are dumb enough that you actually believe this.  Your beloved U.S. Government denies more healthcare every year than any private insurer.


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Soggy in NOLA said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > Samson said:
> ...


 
That is true. And it will be more of the same on a largr scale. Sarah knows this...she's a denier...and probably a recipient.


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Soggy in NOLA said:


> Coming from those who atre inextricably in love with abortion and euthenasia, this is kinda funny.


 
Fine. Let them wipe their stain off the face of the Earth.


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 21, 2010)

My Father, a veteran of WW II & Korea, was thrown out on the streets from a hospice because Medicare cut him off.  And he said he'd rather die in the street than go to the V.A.

There's your government in action for you.


----------



## boedicca (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> The Bill broadens protections for Americans, expands coverage and offers protection for 33 million Americans




At what cost?

How does it work to take two programs, Medicare and Medicaid, which are $Ts in the red, add another entitlement program - and set up a vast new government bureaucracy?


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

Sarah G said:


> Samson said:
> 
> 
> > The T said:
> ...



You are impressionable, and probably a bit jealous.

Ironically, you are the only one in this thread to mention "leg humping."


----------



## Sarah G (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> Sarah G said:
> 
> 
> > Samson said:
> ...


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

boedicca said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > The Bill broadens protections for Americans, expands coverage and offers protection for 33 million Americans
> ...


 
Not only that...but involuntary _servitude _(slavery), to PAY for it for generations YET to be born.


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 21, 2010)

boedicca said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > The Bill broadens protections for Americans, expands coverage and offers protection for 33 million Americans
> ...



How does 1/2 TRILLION in medicare cuts = expanded coverage?

33 Milion?  first it was 10 million... then I heard the other day it is 46 million... now it is 33 million.  Of these numbers, which are obviously coming from thin air, how much are those who choose to not have health insurance?  Or, those who self insure?  Or those wo are here illegally?  BTW - Illegal aliens are NOT Americans.


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

Soggy in NOLA said:


> My Father, a veteran of WW II & Korea, was thrown out on the streets from a hospice because Medicare cut him off. And he said he'd rather die in the street than go to the V.A.
> 
> There's your government in action for you.


 
And what of other Government programs? hows the Native American Healthcare doing these days?


----------



## Soggy in NOLA (Mar 21, 2010)

Liberalism is slavery... look at what it has done to minorities... look how minorities who don't dance at their table are treated.


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

Soggy in NOLA said:


> Liberalism is slavery... look at what it has done to minorities... look how minorities who don't dance at their table are treated.



What liberalism has done for minorities is pass Civil Rights legislation, end segregation, integrate schools, integrate the military, ban discrimination in the workplace....the list is endless


----------



## driveby (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Soggy in NOLA said:
> 
> 
> > Liberalism is slavery... look at what it has done to minorities... look how minorities who don't dance at their table are treated.
> ...



Right, it was all done by the government, people in general have not changed one bit over the course of history. It was all done by sooper dooper legislation .........


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

The T said:


> Soggy in NOLA said:
> 
> 
> > My Father, a veteran of WW II & Korea, was thrown out on the streets from a hospice because Medicare cut him off. And he said he'd rather die in the street than go to the V.A.
> ...



Souix Reservation outside Billings:

They still receive a dead horse every month.

Two dead horses in December (Christmas)


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

Here is what it does for Americans..

1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer

2. If you have the misfortune of becoming seriously ill and run up bills over $100,000, the insurance company can't cap your bill and make you pay anything in excess of $100,000

3. If you just graduated college and have to work for a small company that does not offer health coverage, you can be covered on your parents policy until you are 26.

4. If you own or work for a small company, Insurance pools will be formed to allow you to compete as a large group and get better rates

5. You won't have to defer preventive care which may detect serious problems. It will be free with your insurance coverage

6. Insurance companies will not be able to drop you if you become seriously ill



Most of these changes take place immediately.

Do you want your insurance company telling you "We have paid enough for your illness....now go ahead and die"

That is what the GOP supports


----------



## driveby (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



Medicare does it much more than any insurance company, but thanks for the repetitive propaganda update ......


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



You still have no idea where "throught the bill" #1 appears, do you?


----------



## driveby (Mar 21, 2010)

Samson said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...




It appears his method of answering simple questions was learned from Obama and Pelosi, keep parroting todays talking points......


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Do you want your insurance company telling you "We have paid enough for your illness....now go ahead and die"
> 
> That is what the GOP supports



so hold on a minute here.....Rw...are you saying that under this plan sponsored by our Govt.,that they will treat you and take care of the major portions of your illness,no matter what you have,they wont ever tell you....sorry we cant cover this or that....it is just to costly....is that what you are saying here?.....


----------



## driveby (Mar 21, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Do you want your insurance company telling you "We have paid enough for your illness....now go ahead and die"
> ...



Yep, only evil insurance companies deny claims, the friendly neighborhood gubment never does that ......


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Soggy in NOLA said:
> 
> 
> > Liberalism is slavery... look at what it has done to minorities... look how minorities who don't dance at their table are treated.
> ...


 
Really? History could be your friend IF you chose to read it rather than make it up...

Historically it was _DEMOCRATS that opposed it._ Johnson didn't have a prayer of passage if it wasn't for Republicans passing it. That is FACT.

We now return you all to the dumbed-down, historically inaccurate _rightwinger_ for a Rebuttal.


----------



## The T (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...


 
So in essence you APPLAUD Government to make something so that the Individual should do for themselves at the point of a GUN? And yes, the IRS will eventaully oversee this kids...make no mistake.


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

The T said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



Yes ...I do Applaud the Government


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

The T said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Soggy in NOLA said:
> ...



You are obviously unable to tell Democrats/Republicans from Liberal/Conservative

Ever hear of a Liberal Republican?   There were plenty in the 50s and 60s


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 21, 2010)

sorry Rw....i notice you went right over post 239....wanna answer it....


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> sorry Rw....i notice you went right over post 239....wanna answer it....






> .....Rw...are you saying that under this plan sponsored by our Govt.,that they will treat you and take care of the major portions of your illness,no matter what you have,they wont ever tell you....sorry we cant cover this or that....it is just to costly....is that what you are saying here?.....



Yes, and there will be generous servings of Rainbow Stew to comfort us all through the process.


----------



## DE3 (Mar 21, 2010)

So basically this thread shows us that Republican's/conservatives have absolutely no idea what is in the bill.  

Whooda thunk???


----------



## Samson (Mar 21, 2010)

DE3 said:


> So basically this thread shows us that Republican's/conservatives have absolutely no idea what is in the bill.
> 
> Whooda thunk???



If you think ANYONE has _Absolutely_ ANY idea what is in the bill, then you're even more naive than you sound.


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Do you want your insurance company telling you "We have paid enough for your illness....now go ahead and die"
> ...



That is not what a cap is

A cap says your policy will cover $100,000 in any one year and $500,000 lifetime. So say you have cancer and need continual treatment to live. Once you hit the cap, they stop paying and you go bankrupt. After bankruptcy....you just die
This plan says that once you are covered, they have to keep treating you

GREAT NEWS FOR AMERICA


----------



## antagon (Mar 21, 2010)

SEC. 111. PROHIBITING PRE-EXISTING CONDITION EXCLUSIONS.

      A qualified health benefits plan may not impose any pre-existing condition exclusion (as defined in section 2701(b)(1)(A) of the Public Health Service Act) or otherwise impose any limit or condition on the coverage under the plan with respect to an individual or dependent based on any health status-related factors (as defined in section 2791(d)(9) of the Public Health Service Act) in relation to the individual or dependent.

the bill


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## rightwinger (Mar 21, 2010)

antagon said:


> SEC. 111. PROHIBITING PRE-EXISTING CONDITION EXCLUSIONS.
> 
> A qualified health benefits plan may not impose any pre-existing condition exclusion (as defined in section 2701(b)(1)(A) of the Public Health Service Act) or otherwise impose any limit or condition on the coverage under the plan with respect to an individual or dependent based on any health status-related factors (as defined in section 2791(d)(9) of the Public Health Service Act) in relation to the individual or dependent.
> 
> the bill



I can't believe any REAL AMERICAN wants to punish someone for the sin of actually being seriously sick. You beat cancer as a child? TOUGH LUCK....No Insurance for you


----------



## bucs90 (Mar 21, 2010)

We don't hate healthcare.

But we do hate driving private insurance companies out of business. Which WILL happen now.


----------



## antagon (Mar 21, 2010)

bucs90 said:


> We don't hate healthcare.
> 
> But we do hate driving private insurance companies out of business. Which WILL happen now.


well, maybe if i type it in all caps it'll manifest itself.

any basis?


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 21, 2010)

Fortunately most of this won't kick in til 2013.  We can undo most of it well before that.


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 21, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



ok i want you to remember that Rw....cause EVERYTIME i have asked this question in the other threads on this....the people for this bill have either danced around the question OR have told me absolutely not....even the govt is only capable of paying to a certain point and then that is it.....i hope you are right....because if your not.....then there is not much of a difference then what is there right now....


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 22, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Harry Dresden said:
> ...



There is still no dumping of endless money for a hopeless cause. Insurance companies and your doctors will still make decisions on how long and how extensive your treatment will be if you are terminal. What it does is stop an arbitrary cut off of your insurance


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 22, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...


so if a person needs homecare....the govt will pay for it?.....but if your mom or dad need to be in the care of professionals in a home ...you are STILL going to have to sign over all their assets to the govt for them to pay for it....right?....


----------



## PatekPhilippe (Mar 22, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Harry Dresden said:
> ...



and here is where Right Winger loses any credibility along with this entire fucked up Bill and fucked up Congress.

What rw says is in fact true.  There are now no caps on insurance....where once, like he said, you purchased a set amount of lifetime coverage for your monthly premium....now there will be no cap.  So here is where his explanantion fails.  Once you reach a certain amount of payouts the insurance company will simply not renew your policy.  Then what happens.  You go to another insurance company that, now, cannot refuse you because of pre-existing conditions.  That insurance company in turn charges you an exorbatant premium which will be subsidized by our tax dollars.  This payout to the insurance company through the taxpayer is the dirty little secret no one on the left is willing to discuss....now...if the real cost of this was figured into the Bill by the CBO it would have never passed....why?  Because the true cost of this bill after 10 years will be somewhere in the neighborhood of 4 trillion dollars....and that's a very conservative estimate.

The simple fact here is the American people have been ignored by the Democrat Party.  They will be on the unemployment roles come January 21st 2011.


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 22, 2010)

PatekPhilippe said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Boy that will suck.  They will probably pass a law soon that says you get fined for not having a job by then.  If you don't pay they will throw you in jail.  That will take you off the unemployed list.  It is just so simple now in Obamaland.


----------



## rightwinger (Mar 22, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Harry Dresden said:
> ...



What makes you think the government is involved? You deal with your insurance company like you always have


----------



## saveliberty (Mar 22, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Wingerboy thinks they are going to stop with this health care reform.  It is all a set up to drive up premiums, so the government can "save" us from the evil insurance companies.


----------



## driveby (Mar 22, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...



Presented by the US Gubment:





Coming Soon to a theatre near you.......











DEATH PANELS !









Rated (D)


----------



## oreo (Mar 22, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...




*The right doesn't hate health care--what we hate is a government take-over of health care--which they just did.*

*15,000 new IRS agents & 157 new government agencies will be in charge of collecting money from Americans for this new approved health care bill.* Everyone will have to pay for their health care insurance. We will have these agents looking at us monthly to insure that we are paying for our own healthcare. If not--& with all the powers of the IRS--they can & will seize money in personal checking & savings accounts, withold federal income tax returns,--lien properties & even foreclose on assets--to obtain the money. Add to this--penalties & interest--& health care in this country has just turned into another tax bill.

Not only that--but if the federal government decides that your current health care insurance is not up to par with their health care bar--you will be forced to obtain another--which most certainly you will have to pay more for.

Not only that--but since it is the Federal Government--& like we have seen with Social Security--the Federal Government will get into Health Care funds that Americans have been forced to contribute too--to fight wars, give foreign aid, earmarks & political favors & spend our money on anything & everything other than the health care of Americans.

Taxes will start to go up immediately in 2011-for this massive bill--but Americans will not realise any benefits for another 4 years. 

Employers who are just trying to survive this recession will start to pay an additional 8% payroll tax next year--forcing them to lay-off temporary & part time workers. To add--those Americans who currently have their health insurance paid for by their employers--will be paying taxes on those benefits starting in 2013.

*ABORTION COVERAGE*-To add to this BART STUPACK Yes vote on this bill. Stupack & his group of democrats wanted nothing to do with federal tax dollars going for abortion. A deal was struck with Obama agreeing to sign an executive order stating that no federal tax dollars would go for abortions. THE PROBLEM: Since the bill does include coverage for abortions & it is written law--any woman in this country seeking an abortion could go before any judge in this country--who would kick Barack Obama's executive order to the curb--to follow legislative law. So we will see this in court & probably be paying for abortions in this bill. (This does not sit right with the democrats claim of the pursuit of Life-Liberty & the Pursuit of Happiness-LOL) Or don't babies have rights to life too?

Now Bart Stupack & his democrat followers certainly knew this before they agreed at the last minute to vote for this bill. Stupack's district also received $700,000.00 dollars on Friday before the vote.

*You voted for it, YOU got it! *---

*did you plagiarize this oreo?  link up dear...it is posted elsewhere on the net. PM me, IF you are the original author.

care4all*


----------



## MajikMyst (Mar 23, 2010)

No no no.. You all got it all wrong.. 

They hate healthcare because they aren't the ones doing it.. They were to busy starting wars, torturing innocent people, passing bills with absolutely now way of paying for them.. Like the Bush drug plan.. It had no funding what so ever.. Not to mention, failing to include wars in the nations budget.. Oh?? So we didn't pay for the Iraq war for how many years?? 

Well... I guess they were to busy not paying for anything that they couldn't do healthcare reforn.. Even though that if done correctly would pay for itself..


----------



## MajikMyst (Mar 23, 2010)

oreo said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



Ruh oh!! 

Haven't read the bill in the Senate now have you??


----------



## MajikMyst (Mar 23, 2010)

driveby said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Harry Dresden said:
> ...



Would you believe Obama is actually Jesus reincarnated it??? Wait no no no.. He is black.. Can't be him.. How bout George W. Bush?? Wait no no no... Jesus is all for helping the poor and the sick.. Can't be him.. 

Well.. Would you believe there is no such thing as death panels?? 

DING DING DING!!! 

Wait.. Nope.. Your tinfoil hat says otherwise don't it?? 

Sorry.. I can't argue with a tinfoil hat..


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 23, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > so if a person needs homecare....the govt will pay for it?.....but if your mom or dad need to be in the care of professionals in a home ...you are STILL going to have to sign over all their assets to the govt for them to pay for it....right?....
> ...



then nothing has actually changed....for those with nice "expensive diseases" or those who need some kind of specialist care...has it?....those people are still up shit creek.....i was under the impression that those issues were to be dealt with....


----------



## Harry Dresden (Mar 23, 2010)

MajikMyst said:


> No no no.. You all got it all wrong..
> 
> They hate healthcare because they aren't the ones doing it.. They were to busy starting wars, torturing innocent people, passing bills with absolutely now way of paying for them.. Like the Bush drug plan.. It had no funding what so ever.. Not to mention, failing to include wars in the nations budget.. Oh?? So we didn't pay for the Iraq war for how many years??
> 
> Well... I guess they were to busy not paying for anything that they couldn't do healthcare reforn.. Even though that if done correctly would pay for itself..



why dont you address the points these people are making instead of being a typical asshole?.....if someone has a disease that is considered "expensive"....will they be paying exorbant premiums if they want to be covered?.....if someone needs home care...is this covered or not?....or do they have to sign over their fucking house....and how does this pay for itself?......


----------



## Gunny (Mar 23, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



Are you trying to see if you can create the most threads on healthcare on the board, or what?

You really DON'T have anything worthwhile to say.  

The right doesn't hate healthcare.  The right hates having to pay for YOUR healthcare, dimbulb. Get a clue, huh?


----------



## antagon (Mar 23, 2010)

Gunny said:


> rightwinger said:
> 
> 
> > Here is what it does for Americans..
> ...



indications are the right hates having to appreciate any merits of anything that requires more than recycling names like nazi, marxist.... and dimbulb.  i could understand why republican legislators would do so; it's their job in the shadow of a heavy-handed majority government. other than loyal pawnship, what motivates their fan club? 

ok, other than ignorance and pawnship?


----------



## GHook93 (Mar 23, 2010)

I know why I hate Obamacare! ==> Its a ginormous tax burden (noncontributing COST) on American business, which will lead to:
(1) More heads rolling
(2) More strain on Corporations and corporate spending
(3) More corps going under
(4) More corps going overseas
(5) More pain and suffering to the American Economy


----------



## Some Guy (Mar 23, 2010)

GHook93 said:


> I know why I hate Obamacare! ==> Its a ginormous tax burden (noncontributing COST) on American business, which will lead to:
> (1) More heads rolling
> (2) More strain on Corporations and corporate spending
> (3) More corps going under
> ...


That's basically what it boils down to.  This bill basically does nothing to change the way actual health care if provided, so nothing will be done to the costs of that.  Doctors aren't operating more efficiently with this, they're not competing anymore.  As a result of this bill, you won't see surgical procedures and physical examinations suddenly cost 30% less across the board, thus you won't see the health insurance companies lowering their premiums in order to cover those health care costs that remain the same.

All this bill does is put everyone who doesn't currently have health insurance into the health insurance pool.  The problem with that is that the majority people who don't have health insurance don't because they can't afford it.  How are they suddenly going to afford it when they can't now and nothing has been done to address what's actually making health care expensive?  Government subsidies of course, which is just money taken from those who earn it and given to those who don't.

So, you've basically just got another big tax burden for the struggling private sector to support.  In a time of high unemployment and recession, this isn't a smart economical move whatsoever. Hey, but at least we have a bill we can feel really good about.  No one is going to die anymore and everyone is going to get top notch care whenever they want, all for free!! How awesome is that?


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## Truthmatters (Mar 23, 2010)

What we now have is a bill that will save lives this year.

Now when the stories come tumbling down on the rights heads of people whos baby is still ALIVE because of this bill you wont have a fucking chance in hell to win in the midterm elections.


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## Samson (Mar 23, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> What we now have is a bill that will save lives this year.
> 
> Now when the stories come tumbling down on the rights heads of people whos baby is still ALIVE because of this bill you wont have a fucking chance in hell to win in the midterm elections.



Yeah.

Where were we hiding a PILE OF DEAD BABIES _BEFORE_ OBAMACARE???


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## manu1959 (Mar 23, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...



all great things......

why do i have to pay for yours if you can't afford it or simply don't want to pay for it......


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## Harry Dresden (Mar 23, 2010)

Truthmatters said:


> What we now have is a bill that will save lives this year.
> 
> Now when the stories come tumbling down on the rights heads of people whos baby is still ALIVE because of this bill you wont have a fucking chance in hell to win in the midterm elections.



more so-called truth....what a joke....


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## saveliberty (Mar 23, 2010)

Harry Dresden said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > What we now have is a bill that will save lives this year.
> ...



I had to laugh the other night when NBC News was interviewing Obama's female cancer patient poster girl.  We here how this bill will help her and she is so grateful.  The interview was conducted IN THE HOSPITAL WHERE SHE WAS GETTING TREATMENT.  Ah, before the bill passed.


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## rightwinger (Mar 23, 2010)

saveliberty said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> > Truthmatters said:
> ...



Yes...Sick people are such liars


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## PatekPhilippe (Mar 23, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> > Harry Dresden said:
> ...



Do you have health insurance?


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## Political Junky (Mar 23, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> I'd ask anyone to explain why they oppose these provisions in the Healthcare bill


Cons can't give you a reason. They only have their talking points.


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## Charles Stucker (Mar 24, 2010)

rightwinger said:


> This bill helps real Americans and will take very good care of granny. Which of these provisions do you object to and why?


The history of Government "help" is what causes me grave reservations with this bill. Every single instance of government "help" did not help the supposed recipients and cost too damn much for the taxpayers. 

I predict this bill will do one of two things
1) be the same as all other government help
or 
2) be revoked before it goes into effect.


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## frustratoman201 (Mar 25, 2010)

I am not opposed to True Healthcare reform, but I am opposed to the idea or purposely misleading idea of universal healthcare thrust upon us by these thugs in Washington.


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## DriftingSand (Mar 14, 2014)

driveby said:


> Truthmatters said:
> 
> 
> > driveby said:
> ...



LOL


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## Antares (Mar 14, 2014)

Cuyo said:


> pete said:
> 
> 
> > Cuyo said:
> ...



Sorry no.

The premiums are too high, the sign up process is labrynthian and the coverage is NOT better.

You go ahead and rely on the poll, NOvember is going to be a blood bath.


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## Rozman (Mar 14, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> driveby said:
> 
> 
> > rightwinger said:
> ...





If ObamaCare is so great why were 5 million at least driopped from plans they liked.
If ObamaCare is so great why haven't the 48 million that Obama said needed it not signing up.
If ObamaCare is so great why is Obama pushing back the individual mandate.
*Oh yeah...to give the Democrats cover with an election coming up.
*
If ObamaCare is so great why aren't the young people signing up?


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## Politico (Mar 14, 2014)

Truthmatters said:


> What we now have is a bill that will save lives this year.
> 
> Now when the stories come tumbling down on the rights heads of people whos baby is still ALIVE because of this bill you wont have a fucking chance in hell to win in the midterm elections.



And it will not help a lot of others. So....


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## Howey (Mar 14, 2014)

rightwinger said:


> Here is what it does for Americans..
> 
> 1. If you had cancer as a 14 year old and now are 24 and need to get insurance. Insurance companies can't punish you for daring to have cancer
> 
> ...




The right doesn't necessarily hate the ACA. After all, they came up with the concept.

What they hate is that Obama managed to get it passed through Congress to become law.


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