# The M14; To me its the finest battle rifle



## liebuster (Mar 4, 2011)

Just got to give props to the M14 that has served me well for the last few years. Polytech receiver rebuilt with some USGI and commercial parts. Not one malfunction, not one!!! Always goes bang and does it in style and with accuracy. 

Here's some pics of a shooting excursion on a real windy day. It took a lot of brake cleaner to get that crud off. 













Here's what a 600 yard range looks like. Can you see the targets??? My first time shooting that far and I hit the silhouette 6 out of 10 times with iron sights. Can't wait till the snow clears to go back


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## Two Thumbs (Mar 4, 2011)

the M14 was a better weapon than the M16.

It was just so damn heavy and it was llooonnggg.


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## liebuster (Mar 4, 2011)

Two Thumbs said:


> the M14 was a better weapon than the M16.
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> It was just so damn heavy and it was llooonnggg.



You grandpappy wasn't complaining about the heavier M1 garand was he???

I have carried the m14 through the woods on long hunting excursions. It just builds a little stamina.....

The fiberglass stock should reduce the weight and they also are making them with 18" and 16" barrels now that should reduce the weight some. Hell, with all the toilet accessories that guys are putting on their AR15s the m14 probably weighs less on average.


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## Two Thumbs (Mar 4, 2011)

liebuster said:


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My Grandfather was a doctor.  B/c his foot was fused to his leg (no ankle) he was not allowed to serve in WW2.  No matter how hard he tried, they all said no b/c he couldn't march.

My Dad served in Korea.  At the end he got to shoot an M16.  I'll quote him here;

"With the M1 you had to aim and shoot, with that thing, all you did was point and spray."

Nobody wanted to use it b/c it was an auto.  And in Korea carrying an automatic = dead.


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## Ringel05 (Mar 4, 2011)

Everybody has their favorites.  I'll stick with the MG42.........


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## pinqy (Mar 4, 2011)

The M-14 is still in the Army inventory and still used on a small scale.  Small teams where a 7.62mm weapon with full auto is useful, but an M240 would be too heavy and overkill.


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## Two Thumbs (Mar 4, 2011)

Ringel05 said:


> Everybody has their favorites.  I'll stick with the MG42.........



If were gunna go there, lets go there.

The MRK-48 torpedo was a great weapon to go fishing with.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 4, 2011)

Two Thumbs said:


> the M14 was a better weapon than the M16.
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> It was just so damn heavy and it was llooonnggg.



Gaak, cough, cough, yeah the M16's are good. M-14 was a great rifle for its time when you also had to shoot dinosaur's and bad guys .


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## Ringel05 (Mar 4, 2011)

Two Thumbs said:


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Yeah but I have access to 3 working MG42s and 2 working MG34s, one Browning 30 cal amongst a score of others and access to a range to live fire.  
I don't have access to a functioning MRK-48.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 4, 2011)

liebuster said:


> Just got to give props to the M14 that has served me well for the last few years. Polytech receiver rebuilt with some USGI and commercial parts. Not one malfunction, not one!!! Always goes bang and does it in style and with accuracy.
> 
> Here's some pics of a shooting excursion on a real windy day. It took a lot of brake cleaner to get that crud off.
> 
> ...



Very few folks appreciate what 100 yards looks like. you picture of 600 puts it in perspective. 6 out of ten at that range is pretty dang good. We have a range here ware you can shoot them full auto. It is fun, but does not seem to productive. M-16's are better in full auto and with the burst feature you can really tear a target up. Ringel05, are you a class 3 owner ? you dont seem paranoid enough. I have a Bushmaster AR-15 lower that I put together. Do not have an upper for it yet. Might do it up like an M-4 or even go retro Vietnam era AR. I just dont know If I can get a hand guard that will work with a heavy barrel.


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## Ringel05 (Mar 4, 2011)

No I don't own any class III weapons but I have lots of friends who do so I get to play with them on occasion.  I don't know why you say paranoid, none of my friends are, they're just collectors and most are reenactors like me.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 4, 2011)

Ringel05 said:


> No I don't own any class III weapons but I have lots of friends who do so I get to play with them on occasion.  I don't know why you say paranoid, none of my friends are, they're just collectors and most are reenactors like me.



Not like that, even a two or three gun collection can represent thousands of dollars worth of investment. The class 3 guys that show up at the range will 9 out of 10 times let you peel a burst or two from there M-60, but they are usually very secretive about ware they live and there homes are fort Knox. And rightly so.


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## Ringel05 (Mar 4, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


> Ringel05 said:
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> > No I don't own any class III weapons but I have lots of friends who do so I get to play with them on occasion.  I don't know why you say paranoid, none of my friends are, they're just collectors and most are reenactors like me.
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Nowadays, 10s of thousands of dollars investment so yeah, they'd be a little cautious.  Oh and if you're planning on building a class III I hope you have a class III manufacturing FFL before you do it, BATF heavily frowns on that if you don't.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 4, 2011)

Ringel05 said:


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Oh, No,No,No,No, I dont have that kind of money and it seems like a big hassle. What I am building was going to be a varmint set up, but I have changed my mind about 4 times. AR-15 is fine by me. Oh, And the FN-FAL is a nice battle rifle in .308 to. but the cost is beyond me. I have always been heavy into archery to and that is not cheap either. Especaley in this day and age. If I want to shoot class three I go here- http://www.thearmsroomtx.com/ and shoot theirs.


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## Ringel05 (Mar 5, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


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If you like building them, cool, but if you don't go to JGSales.com and check out their inventory, they're pretty reasonable.


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## Douger (Mar 5, 2011)

No doubt. I had an M1A, NM when I lived in the Empire. Never 1 jam in years of silhouette practice.
All I can find here is shitty M-16's left over from Ronny Raygun and Idiot Lolly's shenanigans.
I did recently find an old Mini in SS.


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


> Oh, No,No,No,No, I dont have that kind of money and it seems like a big hassle. What I am building was going to be a varmint set up, but I have changed my mind about 4 times. AR-15 is fine by me. Oh, And the FN-FAL is a nice battle rifle in .308 to. but the cost is beyond me. I have always been heavy into archery to and that is not cheap either. Especaley in this day and age. If I want to shoot class three I go here- Beaumont, Benchmade, Galco Gunleather, Trijicon, - Deer Park, Baytown, Bellaire, Bunker Hill Village, - The Arms Room in League City, Texas and shoot theirs.



A guy pawned a 700 in 22-250 about 3 weeks ago. He had tricked this gun out wonderfully for varmint hunting, with bull barrel, tripod, trigger job, and countless other tweaks.

He's going to get it back, but I have 4 employees hoping he gets hit by a bus   

Look into the Remington VTR also. When they first came out, I thought they looked weird, wasn't interested. Finally took one home in .308, stock (haven't tweaked it all, other than a slight lightening of the trigger). The triangulated barrel really works, giving all the advantage of a bull barrel at a reduced weight. And I'm sure its only in my head, but I am convinced the shape of the barrel helps me aim more accurately, even though I don't see the barrel when I'm looking through the scope   

Oh.....and anytime you're looking at a bolt action for ANYthing, if you don't look at a Tikka, you're cheating yourself


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

As for favorite rifles, check my username  

Its as accurate as a Red Ryder BB gun, but reliable as a brick.

I've always known that when Red Dawn becomes reality, I will go out with the Ruger in my hands


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## Ringel05 (Mar 5, 2011)

Mini 14 said:


> As for favorite rifles, check my username
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> Its as accurate as a Red Ryder BB gun, but reliable as a brick.
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> I've always known that when Red Dawn becomes reality, I will go out with the Ruger in my hands



Nah!  You're kidding, right?


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## Ringel05 (Mar 5, 2011)

I'm considering a mini 14, mostly tricked out with ATI collapsible stock, quad rail and ghost ring sights for $688 shipped plus the $35 transfer fee.  I'd like to replace the sights with laser dots.


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

Ringel05 said:


> I'm considering a mini 14, mostly tricked out with ATI collapsible stock, quad rail and ghost ring sights for $688 shipped plus the $35 transfer fee.  I'd like to replace the sights with laser dots.



As I said, it is an inherently inaccurate rifle, but extremely reliable.

They are a niche gun, really, but growing up around a lot of livestock, I always had it with me, so my fondness for them probably comes legitimately.


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## Ringel05 (Mar 5, 2011)

How do you feel about the 10/22?
(Too bad they don't make it in a magnum caliber.)


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

Ringel05 said:


> How do you feel about the 10/22?
> (Too bad they don't make it in a magnum caliber.)



I love them. I hate loading them     but they are a LOAD of fun!

There are so many parts made for the 10/22 that you can literally make it into whatever you want. And you can spend (literally) as much as you want.

I've sold them for $100, $1,800, and everywhere in between.

A real staple. Love 'em!


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## Ringel05 (Mar 5, 2011)

Mini 14 said:


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My idea is to find an older used one for around $100 to $150 and buy the Krinker Plinker kit which comes with a match grade barrel for around $350 unless I can find one for a comparable price already configured.  From what I've read the only drawback is it's a pain to take apart and clean.


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## liebuster (Mar 5, 2011)

Ruger 1022 is an awesome rifle. I bought mine used for $150.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

Ringel05 said:


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Checked out JG sales, and they have a retro Upper receiver parts kit .I forgot all about them. I would have to chuck the flash hider and get a three prong to be true retro. I am stuck with the bolt assist, but no big deal. Thanks for the pointer there.

Mini14- I have a CZ 527 bolt gun in 7.62x39 that is my favorite vermin blaster. It has 6 pigs down all one shot kills. I dont do long range but I have kicked the idea around with the AR lower I have. I guess I could have both If I want. I also like the mini-14. They are tough guns with lots of options. The 10/22 is another awesome rifle. A mag loader tool makes loading mags not so bad. I get lots of stuff from gunbroker.com as well.


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## westwall (Mar 5, 2011)

The M-14 is a good servicable rifle, as is the Mini-14.  My love is HK and FAL (though I do own an M1A for nostalgia sake).

Here's a picture of my G-3.


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

westwall said:


> The M-14 is a good servicable rifle, as is the Mini-14.  My love is HK and FAL (though I do own an M1A for nostalgia sake).
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> Here's a picture of my G-3.



Beauty!

HK and FAL?

You have VERY good taste


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

westwall said:


> The M-14 is a good servicable rifle, as is the Mini-14.  My love is HK and FAL (though I do own an M1A for nostalgia sake).
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> Here's a picture of my G-3.



G-3 is a classy rifle.


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## westwall (Mar 5, 2011)

Mini 14 said:


> westwall said:
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Thank you!

Here's one of my FAL's


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

westwall said:


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The FAL is one of the few assault rifles that look nice in wood.


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

westwall said:


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Now THAT is special!!!

Wow....it looks mint!

VERY nice rifle!!!


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## westwall (Mar 5, 2011)

Mini 14 said:


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Yeah, if my life depends on it I will be carrying either a G3 or an AK, but for sheer pleasure of shooting it is impossible to beat the FAL.  This one is a Browning G-Series import from 1959, I bought it new from Pachmayr in Pasadena.


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## Mini 14 (Mar 5, 2011)

westwall said:


> Yeah, if my life depends on it I will be carrying either a G3 or an AK, but for sheer pleasure of shooting it is impossible to beat the FAL.  This one is a Browning G-Series import from 1959, I bought it new from Pachmayr in Pasadena.



Gorgeous rifle westy.....really nice.

I have 1 or 2 customers who have that kind of taste, so I don't get to handle them nearly as often as I'd like.

That one is as nice as any I've seen. Really nice!


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

westwall said:


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 AK is a good one to. It may just be me, but the crime bill compliant ones seem to be more accurate. In a S.H.T.F I would take an AR-15. Semi-Auto only is fine with me and is common enough like the AK.


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## Douger (Mar 5, 2011)

Try out a Galil. I had a couple in the early eighties.


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## Wicked Jester (Mar 5, 2011)

M-14 is a good weapon.

Gotta go with the M-4 myself......Lightweight, durable (you can beat the crap out of it), accurate as all get out when properly zeroed. The folding stock and short barrell make it the best battlefield weapon there is. Particularly in close range, urban battle situations......And, on Airborne and Air Assault missions, it's size makes it ideal when you need to drop and fire on a dime.

All in all, A fantastic, deadly weapon.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

Douger said:


> Try out a Galil. I had a couple in the early eighties.



If I had the money and knew some one who would come off one I would. They are nice rifles for sure.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

Wicked Jester said:


> M-14 is a good weapon.
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> Gotta go with the M-4 myself......Lightweight, durable (you can beat the crap out of it), accurate as all get out when properly zeroed. The folding stock and short barrell make it the best battlefield weapon there is. Particularly in close range, urban battle situations......And, on Airborne and Air Assault missions, it's size makes it ideal when you need to drop and fire on a dime.
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> All in all, A fantastic, deadly weapon.



And versatile to.


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## Wicked Jester (Mar 5, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


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Very.....You can do head shots from 300 meters all day long. But it's within the 1-150 meter range where it really shines. Friggin' awesome.

I still have a nostalgic love for the M-16, I carried one for quite awhile in the 80's. But, it could be quite the pain in the ass. The length alone during Airborne and Air Assaults could often make it a pain the ass. Plus, the cooling issues it always seemed to have.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 5, 2011)

Wicked Jester said:


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Those hand guards do get hot during full auto. Thats one of the reasons I would have an AR-15.


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## liebuster (Mar 5, 2011)

Haven't tried my hands with a FAL yet. I have fondled them but they never really felt comfortable to me. I have heard the Argentinian kits from sarco are very nice and very accurate.


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## Wicked Jester (Mar 5, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


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Funny thing is, in Iraq, the Bogy's were putting bounties on M-4's and compatible 5.56, they wanted 'em so bad.........The crap we would seize from them was laughable.


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## westwall (Mar 5, 2011)

liebuster said:


> Haven't tried my hands with a FAL yet. I have fondled them but they never really felt comfortable to me. I have heard the Argentinian kits from sarco are very nice and very accurate.






The FAL I pictured shoots about 2 MOA.  My G3 on the other hand shoots about .5 MOA.  I have hit people sized targets at 1200 meters with the scope and at 800 meters with iron sights.  It's a tack driver.  What most people don't know is the barrel is free floated on the HK series of rifles.  A standard G3 will outshoot a National Match M1A any day of the week, especially if you drop a PSG-1 trigger group into it.

The Argentine kits are fine but it is the person putting it together that matters.

I have a Colt AR that I've tricked out with a Evolution barrel and a Wilson Combat match trigger and it shoots .5 MOA all the way out to 600 meters with a 69 grain VLD projectile.


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## liebuster (Mar 6, 2011)

westwall said:


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Wow a G3 shooting .5moa!!!! I believe thats the one where you can get 50 mags for $125 also. I know people that are building those up on bent flats and maybe would be cool to build some day.


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## westwall (Mar 6, 2011)

liebuster said:


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So long as you are shooting good ammo (like Federal Premium Match) instead of cheap surplus mine will do it quite handily.  Don't forget the Germans built a sniper rifle (G3SG1) and used the basic G3 with a barrel selected for its accuracy.  But the basic system is very good due to the free floated barrel.  The PSG-1 trigger group is a drop in unit that breaks clean at 3.2 pounds and is the trigger group used in the dedicated PSG-1 sniper rifle.

One other thing, there is a huge difference between a factory HK product and a homebuilt rifle.  The best I've ever seen a homebuilt rifle shoot is around 3 MOA, they don't have the reciever rigidity that the original has so there is barrel whip that you don't have in the original.

And please note I'm not trying to insult the M-14, it's a good rifle, but there's also a reason why it was only adopted by 21 countries (most of those we gave to them as part of our military aid) while the G3 was adopted by 66 countries (9 of which used the M-14 before switching to the G3, in fact two of the countries are license building the G3) and that reason is the G3 is a more modern design that is better because it is 20 years newer in design.  The M-14 was a great rifle in its day and is still serviceable today which says a lot about it!







G3SG1


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## JWBooth (Mar 6, 2011)

They make a fine deer rifle as well. I shot them from the fantail of a destroyer back in the 70's, I've shot them in other situations, and I've shot the Mattel/Colt 5.56 that replaced them. No comparison, and no question that the M-14 is the superior weapon.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 6, 2011)

JWBooth said:


> They make a fine deer rifle as well. I shot them from the fantail of a destroyer back in the 70's, I've shot them in other situations, and I've shot the Mattel/Colt 5.56 that replaced them. No comparison, and no question that the M-14 is the superior weapon.



Well the M-16 had its issues back in the day, Nothing beats its versatility. I can have a purpose built weapon in any caliber from .22 long rifle to God knows what caliber By swapping the upper receiver and bolt carrier group with no tools. I can also do that for half the cost of a new rifle. They will also shoot as good as or better then any large bore assault rifle out there. On top of that, An AR-15 can be built in a pinch from a parts kit, vise grips and a flat head screw driver. Not even the AK-47 can boast as much. I agree that the M-14 is a great rifle, but it has been eclipsed by the cost, and versatility of the M-16/AR-15 design. The M-16 0f today is not what it was in the 60's.


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## liebuster (Mar 6, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


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> ...



The M-16 still poops where it eats. They need to upgrade it to a piston design. 

I'm not a big fan of a 22 cal. Doesn't have enough know down power. For me a battle rifle has brute strength reliability, ease of maintenance, large powerful caliber, and is capable of accurate fire out to 1000 yards. That doesn't mean I don't have some 22 cal in my safe. Just not a "battle rifle" caliber in my opinion. M16 is a battle carbine in my opinion. 

AR platform is cool but I would probably only buy one for prairie dogs and other varmints.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 7, 2011)

liebuster said:


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my lower is built, I just dont know what it wants to be when it grows up. I will never convince you on .223, but all I can say for it is there are allot of dead bad guys around the world who would say different. I dont think I would want it in a bolt gun for combat, but in an M-16/AR-15 I would feel fine.


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## liebuster (Mar 7, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 7, 2011)

liebuster said:


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## liebuster (Mar 7, 2011)

Aint nuttin wrong with commie rifles. They go bang everytime unlike some ARs


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## BrianH (Mar 7, 2011)

Just a question.  I know you can buy an AR-10 that shoots .308 rounds.  Does our military deploy this weapon?  If not, why don't they?  It seems to me that you've got the same versatilty of the AR-15, but your shooting a bigger round with ALOT of knock down power.  I know weight of the rounds and number of rounds in the magazine plays a role, but the .308 is also one of the most accurate rounds out there.


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## Momanohedhunter (Mar 7, 2011)

BrianH said:


> Just a question.  I know you can buy an AR-10 that shoots .308 rounds.  Does our military deploy this weapon?  If not, why don't they?  It seems to me that you've got the same versatilty of the AR-15, but your shooting a bigger round with ALOT of knock down power.  I know weight of the rounds and number of rounds in the magazine plays a role, but the .308 is also one of the most accurate rounds out there.



True all. The thing is, the .308 can be a bear when shooting full auto from a light rifle. As well as the points you made.

liebuster, Ak is a good rifle. I pointed out before that to me the crime bill compliant guns seem to shoot better for me. I wouldn't feel naked if that's all I had, just not as sexy as I would with an M-16.


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## BrianH (Mar 7, 2011)

Momanohedhunter said:


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I know they deploy the .308 as a sniper round.  But they should deploy the AR-10 as a "precision strike" weapon.  It doesn't have to necessarily be full Auto, but made for accuracy.  You may have 5 guys firing full auto at a target a good ways off, and need a precision shot without having to call in a sniper.  From what I hear the M4 isn't exactly great at long distances compared to the AK.  I saw a report a while back that said the troops were having trouble engaging the enemy who were attacking them from long distances with AK's.


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## westwall (Mar 7, 2011)

BrianH said:


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The Knights Armaments SR-25 is used by both the US Navy (MK11, Mod 0) and the US Army (XM110) as a sniper rifle.


Modern Firearms - Mk.11 mod.0, M110, SR-25


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