# Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?



## u2scram (Oct 26, 2010)

*  copywrite violation-you refused to link your source.Meister*


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## Freeman (Oct 26, 2010)

Yep, there is even a connection between the two ideologies.

Ex;
The former zionist PM Isaac Shamir was a known nazi who his terrorist group Lehi get contacts with German Nazis!







This is  letter of lehi to Nazis


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## daveman (Oct 26, 2010)

> Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?



Not to retards.


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## Freeman (Oct 26, 2010)

daveman said:


> > Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> 
> 
> 
> Not to retards.


Today the neonazis retards are pro-israel like you!
not amazing


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## u2scram (Oct 26, 2010)

http://wake-up-america.net/NAZISM AND ZIONISM.htm
In both Nazi Germany and Zionist Israel, the official doctrine is one of
ethnic-supremacy, the Master Race and the Chosen People. 

The Nazis declared the "Germans" a distinct ethnicity and race, superior to others, the Master Race and sought to make "Germans" into an ethnically and religiously homogenized homeland.

The Zionists have declared "Jews" a distinct ethnicity, a distinct race, superior to others, the Chosen People of God and are trying to make the "Jews" and Israel into an ethnically and religiously homogenized homeland by driving the Palestinians, the original inhabitants, out. 

Both Nazis and Jews sought to create a larger socialist state where their are "special ethnic rights" for the favored people.

Both Nazis and Jews seek to purify their race.  In Hitler's Germany there were marriage laws and in Zionist Israel state paid Rabbi's of the fundamentalist Orthodox Judaism don't recognize marriages outside Orthodox Judaism.  In Israel it is against the law to try and convert someone.

The Nazi's sought to create "lebensraum" or living room in Poland and the lands east to the Urals moving German settlers into the lands previously occupied by eastern Europeans. 

The Jews are seeking "lebensraum" in Palestine and claim that all the lands from the Nile in Egypt to the Euphrates in Iraq were promised to the Chosen People by their God.  The Zionists have moved settlers into lands previously occupied by the Palestinians (though now they are moving back out in some areas). 

Both Nazism and Zionism  chose simplistic, ancient religious symbol to rally the race and carry out a policy of ethnic conquest and ethnic cleansing.    

Just as Nazism was German national socialism, Zionism is Jewish national socialism wrapped in a theocratic state.  Both are based on a mythic interpretation of history, the Chosen People, the Master Race.   

In 1940 Germany invaded Poland and created the Warsaw Ghetto.  In 1967 the Jews seized what are now the occupied territories and created ghettos for the Palestinians with their Apartheid Wall and blockades around Palestinian villages.  

Just as the Nazi's built up illegal weapons in their preparations for war Israel today has built up to 400 nuclear weapons and has refused to acknowledge them or sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty. 

Like the Nazis the Jews have had their racial scientists such as Elias Auerbach who wanted Jews to be "politically autonomous, culturally whole, and racially pure.&#8221; and Aron Sandler, Felix Theilhaber, and Ignaz Zollschan.  Though Jewish organization here in the United States have historically supported unrestrained immigration into this country in Israel they practice the racial policies of the Nazis.

Both Nazism and Zionism created conflict with neighboring
countries and sought to dominate them and drive out unwanted ethnicities.   The eastern Europeans who were considered sub-human by the Nazis and the Palestinians?  &#8220;We should get rid of the ones who are not Israeli citizens the same way you get rid of lice. We have to stop this cancer from spreading within us.&#8221; Rehavam Zeevi, member of the powerful Security Cabinet and Israel&#8217;s Minister of Tourism (Assassinated in October, 2001)

Unlike the Nazis the Jews have created a ethnic/nation that lives within other nations and seeks to bend them to their will, giving unwavering support for the racist theocratic state of Israel. "


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## editec (Oct 26, 2010)

You mean aside from the fact that both idologies are based on ethnic identity?

I'd say there's a hell of lot of difference.

The world is filled with nation states that care about ethnic identity issues.

They are hardly all NAZIs.


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

Freeman said:


> Yep, there is even a connection between the two ideologies.
> 
> Ex;
> The former zionist PM Isaac Shamir was a known nazi who his terrorist group Lehi get contacts with German Nazis!



IslamoNazi Grand Mufti was a German Nazi collaborator...
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSUEx1cKUlg[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

u2scram said:


> "Roger Tucker ( A Jew incidentally) argues that Zionism and Nazism are "identical manifestations of the same basic pathology" and that they are "equally dangerous to the well being of humanity". He says that although Zionism ultimately cannot sustain itself, to be complacent would risk inflicting "immense harm" on humanity.



Martin Luther King, Jr...


> I see Israel as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security and that security must be a reality.





> When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-Semitism.


"I have a dream" for peace in the Middle East / King's special bond with Israel


Now, everyone knows YOU are an anti-Semite, too.


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

Freeman said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > > Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> ...



Syrian Socialist Swastika...
http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/2009/02/21/ibn_jqwmc_JQWmC_19672.png

German Nazi Swastika...
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_AcBUSVxs82w/StSABOD3xqI/AAAAAAAAVho/-1O9efVvxlQ/s400/Swastika_Symbol.png


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> If you think about it.
> 
> Adolph Hitler is the person most responsible for the modern state of Israel.



Ignorant Muhammadan, if you think about it, Allah is the person most responsible for the modern state of Israel.

Allah is a Zionist.  No virgin chasing for you!

Quran 5:20-21...


> Remember Moses said to his people: 'O my people! Recall in remembrance the favor of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples. O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin.


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> If you think about it.
> 
> Adolph Hitler is the person most responsible for the modern state of Israel.
> 
> Without him they would still be living in isolated ghettos in various european cities.



Except, ignorant Muhammadan, the League of Nations established Palestine as the Jewish homeland back in 1922, many years before Hitler.

League of Nations...


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country



You're an illustration of why the Muhammadan is so backward.


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> They are a most ungrateful people.



Jews are a most respected people...

Winston Churchill...


> We owe to the Jews a system of ethics which, even if it were entirely separated from the supernatural, would be incomparably the most precious possession of mankind, worth in fact the fruits of all wisdom and learning put together.



The Muhammadan is a most barbaric people.

Winston Churchill...


> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288102959&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


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## daveman (Oct 26, 2010)

Freeman said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > > Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> ...


Thanks for proving my point.


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## u2scram (Oct 26, 2010)

_""Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith.""_

not like xtianity then?

it will be a long time before any 'proselytizing' muslims do as much as harm as xtian missionaries have done in the world.

incidentally, winston churchill was the last racist to hold the office of prime minister in england.


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## Marc39 (Oct 26, 2010)

u2scram said:


> _""Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith.""_
> 
> not like xtianity then?
> 
> it will be a long time before any 'proselytizing' muslims do as much as harm as xtian missionaries have done in the world.



Moron, tens of millions of Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus, Zoroastrians and every other infidel have been slaughtered by the Muhammadan over 1400 years.  

Alexis de Toqueville...


> I studied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Democracy-America-Complete-Alexis-Toqueville/dp/1406822701/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288140475&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: Democracy In America (Complete) (9781406822700): Alexis de Toqueville: Books[/ame]


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## georgephillip (Oct 27, 2010)

"As a 9-year old boy I was an eye-witness to the collapse of German democracy and the ascent of the Nazis to power. 

"The pictures are engraved in my memory  the election campaigns following each other, the uniforms in the street, the debates around the table, the teacher who greeted us for the first time with 'Heil Hitler'. 

"I resurrected these memories in a book I wrote (in Hebrew) during the Eichmann trial, and which ended with a chapter entitled: Can it happen here? I am returning to them these days, as I write my memoirs."

Now, 77 years later Avnery sees Israel at a crossroads similar to that of Weimar Germany:

"The state has arrived at a crossroads: peace or eternal war. Peace means the foundation of the Palestinian state and the evacuation of the settlements. 

"*But the genetic code of the Zionist movement is pushing towards the annexation of the whole of the historical country up to the Jordan River, and  directly or indirectly - the transfer of the Arab population*. 

"The majority of the people is evading a decision by claiming that 'we have no partner for peace' anyhow. We are condemned to eternal war."

Israel on the Verge...


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## editec (Oct 27, 2010)

I wonder how many times in history the land now known as Israel has been drenched in blood?

Few places on earth seem to have such a tragic history.

It seems to be cursed by geography.


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## georgephillip (Oct 27, 2010)

Good question.

I wonder about the religious contribution to Israeli bloodshed and conquest.

Christians, Jews, and Muslims all base their religion on a bronze-age desert psychopath willing to kill his child because "God" commanded it.

Seem like a religion capitalism would invent, to me.


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## Marc39 (Oct 27, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Good question.
> 
> I wonder about the religious contribution to Israeli bloodshed and conquest.



"Oh, Allah, Kill All Jews And Americans"  
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7rls9eRKyo[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Oct 27, 2010)

editec said:


> I wonder how many times in history the land now known as Israel has been drenched in blood?



There is an endless trail of blood left by the Muhammadan who has slaughtered tens of millions of Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Zoroastrians and every other infidel who has gotten in their murderous way.

Islamic scripture boasts about killing Jews...

Sahih Bukhari, 4:52:177...


> The Day of Judgment will not have come until you fight with the Jews, and the stones and the trees behind which a Jew will be hiding will say: 'O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, come and kill him!


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## georgephillip (Oct 27, 2010)

And since 1945 the Christian dominated USA has slaughtered millions of Koreans, Laotians, Cambodians, Vietnamese and Iraqi victims.

Clean your own house first, "Princeton".


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## Marc39 (Oct 27, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> And since 1945 the Christian dominated USA has slaughtered millions of Koreans, Laotians, Cambodians, Vietnamese and Iraqi victims.
> 
> Clean your own house first, "Princeton".



When it comes to mass murder, the Muhammadan is nonpareil.

Alexis de Toqueville...


> I studied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Democracy-America-Complete-Alexis-Toqueville/dp/1406822701/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288189982&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: Democracy In America (Complete) (9781406822700): Alexis de Toqueville: Books[/ame]


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## Freeman (Oct 27, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Freeman said:
> 
> 
> > Yep, there is even a connection between the two ideologies.
> ...


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## Freeman (Oct 27, 2010)

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HepXrt_9kE[/ame]


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## daveman (Oct 27, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> And since 1945 the Christian dominated USA has slaughtered millions of Koreans, Laotians, Cambodians, Vietnamese and Iraqi victims.
> 
> Clean your own house first, "Princeton".


Still haven't worked up the courage to leave yet, I see.


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## Marc39 (Oct 27, 2010)

Freeman said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > Freeman said:
> ...


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## uscitizen (Oct 27, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > And since 1945 the Christian dominated USA has slaughtered millions of Koreans, Laotians, Cambodians, Vietnamese and Iraqi victims.
> ...



so that is why you think Palin is so courageous?


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## u2scram (Nov 1, 2010)

the similarities between the nazis and the zionists are well documented and so obvious that it is pointless trying to pretend that they dont exist.

*but it is important to remember that not all jews are zionists.

and not all zionists are jews.*

many jews, both inside and outside "israel", protest the zionists brutality.

many xtians support it. they  believe that the establishment of "israel" is a requirement before the 2nd coming of their lord.

when he does show up all the 'good' jews will convert to xtianity and the bad ones will join the majority of us in hell.

yes, its childish, its silly, its religion.

the difference between the actions of the zionists in palestine and the actions of the nazis is one of magnitude only.

both share the same bestial nature. they are both ignorant, both racists, both cruel and vicious.


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## georgephillip (Nov 1, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > And since 1945 the Christian dominated USA has slaughtered millions of Koreans, Laotians, Cambodians, Vietnamese and Iraqi victims.
> ...


Still waiting for you to show up and give me a push.

How did someone who didn't care enough about the USA to fight in WW II end up with an aircraft carrier named after him?

GE????


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## georgephillip (Nov 1, 2010)

u2scram said:


> the similarities between the nazis and the zionists are well documented and so obvious that it is pointless trying to pretend that they dont exist.
> 
> *but it is important to remember that not all jews are zionists.
> 
> ...


If there's one point that can't be made often enough it is the level of Zionist opposition that occurs daily in Israel. If the US electorate ever becomes as aware of IDF war crimes in the Occupied Territories as the Jews are, Republicans AND Democrats will all be FLUSHED from power.

For a good analysis of Zionism's relationship with fascist dictators in the early 20th Century, Lenni Brenner's 51 Documents seems like a good place to start.


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## daveman (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Still waiting for you to show up and give me a push.


Typical leftist:  Sits around and bitches until somebody comes along and does his work for him.


georgephillip said:


> How did someone who didn't care enough about the USA to fight in WW II end up with an aircraft carrier named after him?
> 
> GE????


You talking about Reagan?
In 1935, Reagan was commissioned as a reserve officer in the United States Army. Reagan was called up for duty in November 1941 but disqualified for combat due to his astigmatism. After the attack on Pearl Harbor, Lieutenant Reagan was activated and assigned to the First Motion Picture Unit in the United States Army Air Force, to make use of his acting skills for the production of wartime propaganda films.​He served in a capacity that made use of his skills.

If the military needs someone to bitch impotently on the internet, they'll call you.


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## georgephillip (Nov 1, 2010)

"astigmatism (plural astigmatisms)

   1. (optics) A defect of a lens such that light rays coming from a point do not meet at a focal point so that the image is blurred.
   2. (pathology) A disorder of the vision, usually due to a misshapen cornea, such that light does not focus correctly on the retina causing a blurred image."

Wow!

Think the rich bitch was able to read the LA Times on December 8, 1941?

Why are conservatives so good at spotting cowards like Clinton and Obama, yet blurry about Cheney and Reagan?

Pathologies of ideology?


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

u2scram said:


> the similarities between the nazis and the zionists are well documented and so obvious that it is pointless trying to pretend that they dont exist.
> 
> *but it is important to remember that not all jews are zionists.
> 
> ...



I live in Israel:  I know of no protests against Israel defending itself, which it is entitled to do under international law.

You should not post about that which you are ignorant.


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> If there's one point that can't be made often enough it is the level of Zionist opposition that occurs daily in Israel. If the US electorate ever becomes as aware of IDF war crimes in the Occupied Territories as the Jews are, Republicans AND Democrats will all be FLUSHED from power.



You're severely uneducated.  There is no Israeli occupation as international law permits Jews to live throughout sovereign Jewish land.

Now, you know.


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## CMike (Nov 1, 2010)

Zionism is the pursuit of a jewish state and nazism which is aligned with the arabs was the desire to kill jews.

Fortunately, zionism is stronger. Good vs evil.


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

> Quote: Originally Posted by georgephillip
> If there's one point that can't be made often enough it is the level of Zionist opposition that occurs daily in Israel. If the US electorate ever becomes as aware of IDF war crimes in the Occupied Territories as the Jews are, Republicans AND Democrats will all be FLUSHED from power.



There are many war crimes committed by Hamas, none committed by the IDF.

Decorated war hero Coloonel Richard Kemp calls the IDF the most moral army in the world...


> I am the former commander of the British forces in Afghanistan. I served with NATO and the United Nations; commanded troops in Northern Ireland, Bosnia and Macedonia; and participated in the Gulf War. I spent considerable time in Iraq since the 2003 invasion, and worked on international terrorism for the UK Governments Joint Intelligence Committee.
> 
> Mr. President, based on my knowledge and experience, *I can say this: During Operation Cast Lead, the Israeli Defence Forces did more to safeguard the rights of civilians in a combat zone than any other army in the history of warfare. Israel did so while facing an enemy that deliberately positioned its military capability behind the human shield of the civilian population. *
> 
> ...


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX6vyT8RzMo[/ame]


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 1, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> > Quote: Originally Posted by georgephillip
> > If there's one point that can't be made often enough it is the level of Zionist opposition that occurs daily in Israel. If the US electorate ever becomes as aware of IDF war crimes in the Occupied Territories as the Jews are, Republicans AND Democrats will all be FLUSHED from power.
> 
> 
> ...



[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLZgNy46aTQ[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > > Quote: Originally Posted by georgephillip
> ...


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## georgephillip (Nov 1, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > If there's one point that can't be made often enough it is the level of Zionist opposition that occurs daily in Israel. If the US electorate ever becomes as aware of IDF war crimes in the Occupied Territories as the Jews are, Republicans AND Democrats will all be FLUSHED from power.
> ...


Area C and Gaza are not sovereign Jewish land.


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## CMike (Nov 1, 2010)

Yeah...they are.


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



All of Palestine, from the Jordan River to the Med. Sea constitutes sovereign Israeli land, under international law.

Now, you know.


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Area C and Gaza are not sovereign Jewish land.



Gaza is not a sovereign Arab state.

Now, you know.


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## georgephillip (Nov 1, 2010)

CMike said:


> Zionism is the pursuit of a jewish state and nazism which is aligned with the arabs was the desire to kill jews.
> 
> Fortunately, zionism is stronger. Good vs evil.


Are you sure?

"Zionist factions competed for the honor of allying to Hitler. 

"By 1940-41, the 'Stern Gang,' among them *Yitzhak Shamir*, later Prime Minister of Israel, presented the Nazis with the 'Fundamental Features of the Proposal of the *National Military Organization* in Palestine (Irgun Zvai Leumi) Concerning the *Solution of the Jewish Question in Europe and the Participation of the NMO in the War on the Side of Germany.'*"

If Zionists were willing to ally with Hitler against the British (who were occupying Palestine at the time), would that change your mind about good and evil?

51 Docs


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > Zionism is the pursuit of a jewish state and nazism which is aligned with the arabs was the desire to kill jews.
> ...



Comparing Zionism to Nazism constitutes anti-Semitism, based on US and EU guidelines.

Take your mental illness elsewhere.  You have zero reputation here.

US Department of State
Contemporary Global Anti-Semitism:A Report Provided to the United States Congress

Anti-Semitism is one of the oldest forms of malicious intolerance and violates the precepts of human dignity and equality that are fundamental to a free and peaceful society.
History has shown that wherever anti-Semitism has gone unchecked, the persecution of others has been present or not far behind.

Defeating anti-Semitism must be a cause of great importance not only for Jews, but for all people who value humanity and justice and want to live in a more tolerant, peaceful world. Together, we must continue our efforts to monitor and combat anti-Semitism in all of its forms wherever and whenever it occurs.

Forms of Anti-Semitism

Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination. 
Drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis. 
Contemporary Global Anti-Semitism:A Report Provided to the United States Congress

EUMC...
Examples of the ways in which antiSemitism manifests itself with regard to the state of Israel, drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis

Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, eg, by claiming that the existence of a state of Israel is a racist endeavor.

FRA - European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> CMike said:
> 
> 
> > Zionism is the pursuit of a jewish state and nazism which is aligned with the arabs was the desire to kill jews.
> ...



Martin Luther King, Jr was an avowed Zionist...


> When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-Semitism.
> 
> I see Israel as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security and that security must be a reality.
> 
> I solemnly pledge to do my utmost to uphold the fair name of the Jews -- because bigotry in any form is an affront to us all.


"I have a dream" for peace in the Middle East / King's special bond with Israel


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> How many Jews and their families are currently living in Gaza?
> 
> "Princeton"



Gaza is not a sovereign Arab state, high school dropout.  Gaza remains unallocated sovereign Israeli land under the terms of the binding Palestine Mandate.

Your lesson for the day.


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## georgephillip (Nov 1, 2010)

Link?

"Princeton"


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Link?
> 
> "Princeton"



I've instructed you on the matter several times, stoner.

After you sober up, try to use the search engine.


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## u2scram (Nov 1, 2010)

""Moron, tens of millions of Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus, Zoroastrians and every other infidel have been slaughtered by the Muhammadan over 1400 years""

*counted them all did you?*

""there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad.""

*the muslims would have a lot of catching up to do overtake the xtians!*


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

u2scram said:


> ""Moron, tens of millions of Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus, Zoroastrians and every other infidel have been slaughtered by the Muhammadan over 1400 years""
> 
> *counted them all did you?*
> 
> ...



When it comes to mass murder, the Muhammadan is sui generis.

Their pagan moon god allah even ordains genocide...

Quran 17:16... 


> When We decide to destroy a population, We (first) send a definite order to those among them who are given the good things of this life and yet transgress; so that the word is proved true against them: then (it is) We destroy them utterly.


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## u2scram (Nov 1, 2010)

""When it comes to mass murder, the Muhammadan is sui generis.""

reality check. the usa killed about 3,000,000 in the vietnam war alone. more than any other nation since the end of ww2.

add to that iraq, an illegal war, deaths estimated @ 100,000. it will be a long time before any other nation in the modern world reaches those totals.

I hope!!!


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

u2scram said:


> ""When it comes to mass murder, the Muhammadan is sui generis.""
> 
> reality check. the usa killed about 3,000,000 in the vietnam war alone. more than any other nation since the end of ww2.
> 
> ...



Tens of millions of Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Zoroastrians and every other infidel have been massacred by the Muhammadan over the course of 1400 yrs.

4 million Christians and Darfurians have been slaughtered, so far, by Muslims in Sudan.

Islam decrees jihad mass murder. 

Now, you know


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## u2scram (Nov 1, 2010)

http://tinyurl.com/2dft4gm *Edited by Intense-To create Active Link*



u2scram said:


> "Roger Tucker ( A Jew incidentally) argues that Zionism and Nazism are "identical manifestations of the same basic pathology" and that they are "equally dangerous to the well being of humanity". He says that although Zionism ultimately cannot sustain itself, to be complacent would risk inflicting "immense harm" on humanity.
> 
> Zionism and Nazism &#8211; differences and similarities
> 
> ...



there is no copywrite violation. there is no copywrite on this item like 99% of the stuff on the net.  

*Wrong. Link Anything You Copy and Paste from the Web.*


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

u2scram said:


> ]"Roger Tucker ( A Jew incidentally) argues that Zionism and Nazism are "identical manifestations of the same basic pathology" and that they are "equally dangerous to the well being of humanity".



Denigration of Jewishself-determination, which is Zionism, constitutes anti-Semitism under US and EU guidelines.

Take your mental illness elsewhere, psycho  

US Department of State
Contemporary Global Anti-Semitism:A Report Provided to the United States Congress

Anti-Semitism is one of the oldest forms of malicious intolerance and violates the precepts of human dignity and equality that are fundamental to a free and peaceful society.
History has shown that wherever anti-Semitism has gone unchecked, the persecution of others has been present or not far behind.

Defeating anti-Semitism must be a cause of great importance not only for Jews, but for all people who value humanity and justice and want to live in a more tolerant, peaceful world. Together, we must continue our efforts to monitor and combat anti-Semitism in all of its forms wherever and whenever it occurs.

Forms of Anti-Semitism

Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination.&#8230; 
Drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis. 
Contemporary Global Anti-Semitism:A Report Provided to the United States Congress

EUMC...
Examples of the ways in which antiSemitism manifests itself with regard to the state of Israel, drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis

Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, eg, by claiming that the existence of a state of Israel is a racist endeavor.

FRA - European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights


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## u2scram (Nov 1, 2010)

""Denigration of Jewishself-determination, which is Zionism, constitutes anti-Semitism under US and EU guidelines.""

so what? 

*not all jews are zionists and not all zionists are jews.*

there are many orgs within "israel" that are protesting the brutality of the israeli regime, and there are many religious jews who loathe the idea of zionism.

True Torah Jews Against Zionism

B'Tselem - The Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the ... - [ Terjemahkan halaman ini ]
Endeavors to document and educate the Israeli public and policymakers about human rights violations in the Occupied Territories,

Live From Occupied Palestine: Israel moves to ban Israeli human ... - [ Terjemahkan halaman ini ]
3 May 2010 ... Two articles/blogs below on the newly proposed law, as well as a statement issued by Israeli Human Rights organisations in response. ...
livefromoccupiedpalestine.blogspot.com/.../israel-moves-to-ban-israeli-human.html -

WIKI: "Amnesty International says that Israel's settlement policy is illegal, discriminatory and a violation of Palestinian human rights:
'As well as violating international humanitarian law per se, the implementation of Israel's settlement policy in the Occupied Territories violates fundamental human rights provisions, including the prohibition of discrimination. The seizure and appropriations of land for Israeli settlements, bypass roads and related infrastructure and discriminatory allocation of other vital resources, including water, have had a devastating impact on the fundamental rights of the local Palestinian population, including their rights to an adequate standard of living, housing, health, education, and work, and freedom of movement within the Occupied Territories."[1]
The Israeli human rights centre B'Tselem and other sources have indicated that the road blocks scattered inside the West Bank between Palestinian cities and villages which are designed to protect the settlers from Arab snipers firing on Israeli drivers, as well as Arab ambushes of Israelis, have had a significant impact on freedom of movement. While the road blocks are also said to protect Israelis within Israel, according to B'Tselem, the (siege) "imprisons entire populations within their communities or in a small geographic area and limits their access to other parts of the West Bank."[2][3][4]"


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

u2scram said:


> ""Denigration of Jewishself-determination, which is Zionism, constitutes anti-Semitism under US and EU guidelines.""
> 
> so what?
> 
> not all jews are zionists and not all zionists are jews.[/B]



You don't actually know what you're talking about, so why pretend?

Zionism is merely Jewish self-determination.

Anyone opposed to this simple proposition is anti-Semitic.

Case closed.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 1, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > How many Jews and their families are currently living in Gaza?
> ...



There are people living on sovereign Israeli land and they can't vote?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 1, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> u2scram said:
> 
> 
> > ""Denigration of Jewishself-determination, which is Zionism, constitutes anti-Semitism under US and EU guidelines.""
> ...



Determined to steal, kill, and lie.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



People are not necessarily citizens.  Surely, even a gimp like you can understand this.

All Israeli citizens are accorded the right to vote.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 1, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



The vast majority of Gazans were born on sovereign Israeli land but are not citizens.

Interesting concept.

BTW, what is the country of birth on their birth certificates?


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## Marc39 (Nov 1, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> The vast majority of Gazans were born on sovereign Israeli land but are not citizens.



You just make this bullshit up as you go along?  The majority of Gazans were born in Gaza or elsewhere outside of Israel.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 2, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > The vast majority of Gazans were born on sovereign Israeli land but are not citizens.
> ...





> Gaza is not a sovereign Arab state, high school dropout. Gaza remains unallocated sovereign Israeli land under the terms of the binding Palestine Mandate. ~ Marc39



Your words.


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Facts.  Not exactly your strong-suit


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 2, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



Definitely not when I use your quotes.


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



You're definitely brain dead, so, I'm not surprised.


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## u2scram (Nov 2, 2010)

COMMON SENSE & FACTS.

FACT 1 : *It is self evident that no one has the right to take someone else&#8217;s land. *


FACT 2 : That was an accepted practice in the colonial era of the 18th to 19th century. By the mid-20th century, it was not acceptable. 

FACT 3 : *Israel did not exist before 1948. Palestine did. That simple fact alone tells you were justice lies in this matter! *

FACT 4 : &#8220;The population of Palestine, predominantly agricultural, was about 690,000 in 1914, 535,000 Muslims; 70,000 Christians, most of whom were Arabs; and 85,000 Jews." (Encyclopaedia Britannica). 

FACT 5 : There was no substantial Jewish population until after ww2 when Jews were 'imported'. Often wealthy Zionists financed them. Wealthy Zionists who incidentally, decided to remain were they where! 

FACT 6 : The Chinese have used similar tactics, massive immigration, to subjugate Tibet, a similar crime against humanity. 


FACT 7 : *Ancient history is irrelevant. Modern history is not. 

To claim someone else&#8217;s land because your ancestors once lived there is merely unreasonable. However, to claim it because god gave it to you is insane. *

FACT 8 : Modern Zionism is based upon religious fundamentalism and racism. Anyone who supports these policies must exist in a religious fantasy camp, were seizing the lands of others is a god-given right and anyone who attempts to recover their own land is a terrorist. 

Eventually, the Israelis must come to terms with their criminal actions in Palestine. 

If they do this, and establish some kind of 'Truth Commission' to address the injustices that the Palestinians have endured, I believe that they will find a new basis for discussion with the Palestinians, and that a single state solution will be a possibility, with some kind of reconciliation with the Palestinians, who have suffered so much at the hands of the brutal Zionist regime since the occupation began. The brutal nature of the Zionist regime is obvious too all who are not either racists or religious fundamentalists.


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

u2scram said:


> COMMON SENSE & FACTS.
> 
> FACT 1 : t is self evident that no one has the right to take someone else&#8217;s land.



Fact 2: Muslims took Jews' and Christians' land throughout the predominanlty Jewish and Christian Middle East.    The Muhammadan also took Spain, Portugal, Italy and Afghanistan, among others' countries.

Read, learn, dimwit...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_conquests

Fact 2, Palestine is the historic homeland of the Jews.  Arabs are interlopers who originated from Arabia. 

The League of Nations agreed...


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country


 
Allah agrees...
Quran 5:20-21...


> Remember Moses said to his people: 'O my people! Recall in remembrance the favor of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples. O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin.


 
Barack Obama agrees...:


> Israel is a sovereign state, and the historic homeland of the Jewish people.
> 
> It should be clear to all that efforts to chip away at Israel's legitimacy will only be met by the unshakeable opposition of the United States.  The slaughter of innocent Israelis is not resistance -- it's injustice


Remarks by the President to the United Nations General Assembly | The White House


Winston Churchill agreed...: 


> The Jews had Palestine before that indigenous population [the Arabs] came in and inhabited it


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Churchill-Jews-Friendship-Martin-Gilbert/dp/0805078800]Amazon.com: Churchill and the Jews: A Lifelong Friendship (9780805078800): Martin Gilbert: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

The US Congress agrees...

The United States Congressional Record
1922 HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 
NATIONAL HOME FOR THE JEWISH PEOPLE JUNE 30, 1922 
HOUSE RESOLUTION 360 - UNANIMOUSLY ADOPTED


> Palestine of today, the land we now know as Palestine, was peopled by the Jews from the dawn of history until the Roman era. It is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. They were driven from it by force by the relentless Roman military machine and for centuries prevented from returning. At different periods various alien people succeeded them but the Jewish race had left an indelible impress upon the land.
> 
> Today it is a Jewish country. Every name, every landmark, every monument and every trace of whatever civilization remaining there is still Jewish. And it has ever since remained a hope, a longing, as expressed in their prayers for these nearly 2,000 years. No other people has ever claimed Palestine as their national home. No other people has ever shown an aptitude or indicated a genuine desire to make it their homeland. The land has been ruled by foreigners. Only since the beginning of the modern Zionist effort may it be said that a creative, cultural, and economic force has entered Palestine. The Jewish Nation was forced from its natural home. It did not go because it wanted to.
> 
> ...


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0688123635/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0688123627&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0HX00TRZAFXPP1PG6MNR]Amazon.com: Israel: A History (9780688123635): Martin Gilbert: Books[/ame]


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 2, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


If Gaza is sovereign unallocated Israeli land, does that mean her inhabitants remain unallocated citizens of Israel under the binding Palestine Mandate?

How much profit do you personally earn from the misery of Gaza?


----------



## jillian (Nov 2, 2010)

> Anti-Semitism has proven to be an adaptive phenomenon.  New forms of anti-Semitism have
> evolved.  They often incorporate elements of traditional anti-Semitism.  However, the distinguishing
> feature of the new anti-Semitism is criticism of Zionism or Israeli policy that&#8212;whether intentionally
> or unintentionally&#8212;has the effect of promoting prejudice against all Jews by demonizing Israel and
> ...



http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/102301.pdf


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 2, 2010)

What about Israel's "Founding Fathers" communications with Hitler and Mussolini?

"The Nazi era is the most discussed period in history, yet most Jews and others are unaware of the interaction between Zionism, Hitler and Mussolini. 

"This book brings to light, through the use of actual historic documents, the disservice that the Zionists did to Jews before and during the Holocaust. Some of these documents were published in English decades ago, but are only now seeing the light of day."

Is it "anti-Semitic" to question why principal architects of the Jewish State of Israel apparently offered to side with Hitler during WWII in order to facilitate the British withdrawal from Palestine?

The Plot


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 2, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> What about Israel's "Founding Fathers" communications with Hitler and Mussolini?
> 
> "The Nazi era is the most discussed period in history, yet most Jews and others are unaware of the interaction between Zionism, Hitler and Mussolini.
> 
> ...


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 2, 2010)

For a few months in  1953 Noam Chomsky and his wife lived on a kibbutz in Israel where there was little food and much hard work.

"I came close to returning there to live, as my wife very much wanted to do at the time. I had nothing particularly attractive here. 

"I didn't expect to be able to have an academic career, and was not particularly interested in one. There was no major drive to stay. 

"On the other hand, I did have a lot of interest in the kibbutz and I liked it very much when I was there. 

"But there were things I didn't like, too. 

"In particular, the ideological conformity was appalling. 

"I don't know if I could have survived long in that environment because I was very strongly opposed to the Leninist ideology, as well as the general conformism, and *uneasy -- less so than I should have been -- about the the exclusiveness and the racist institutional setting*.

"What I did not then face honestly was the fairly obvious fact that *these are Jewish institutions* and are so because of legal and administrative structures and practice. 

"*So, for example, I doubt if there's an Arab in any kibbutz, and there hardly could be, because of the land laws and the role the institution plays in the Israeli system*. 

"In fact, even the Oriental Jews, some of whom were marginally at the kibbutz or in the immigrant town nearby, were treated rather shabbily, with a good deal of contempt and fear. 

"I also visited some Arab villages, and learned some unpleasant things, which I've never seen in print, about the military administration to which Arab citizens were subjected." 

Personal Influences


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> For a few months in  1953 Noam Chomsky and his wife lived on a kibbutz in Israel where there was little food and much hard work.
> 
> "I came close to returning there to live, as my wife very much wanted to do at the time. I had nothing particularly attractive here.
> 
> ...



Noam Chomsky the language teacher?


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## georgephillip (Nov 2, 2010)

Noam Chomsky the 8th most quoted author of all time.


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Noam Chomsky the 8th most quoted author of all time.



Burger King sells billions of hamburgers.

Both are crap and hard to digest.


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> What about Israel's "Founding Fathers" communications with Hitler and Mussolini?
> 
> counterpunch



Bogus website.  This is why you're severely uneducated and have no reputational points

You...are...a...loser


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



You're not the brightest bulb.  Gazans are squatters on Israeli land.


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## u2scram (Nov 2, 2010)

zionism = nazism

long after ww2 the zionists were allying themselves with nazis. this time it was the apartheid state of s.africa, with which modern 'israel' has much in common.


*Brothers in arms - Israel's secret pact with Pretoria*

Brothers in arms - Israel's secret pact with Pretoria | World news | The Guardian

"During the second world war the future South African prime minister John Vorster was interned as a Nazi sympathiser. Three decades later he was being feted in Jerusalem. In the second part of his remarkable special report, Chris McGreal investigates the clandestine alliance between Israel and the apartheid regime, cemented with the ultimate gift of friendship - A-bomb technology."

South Africa's prime minister John Vorster (second from right) is feted by Israel's prime minister Yitzhak Rabin (right) and Menachem Begin (left) and Moshe Dayan during his 1976 visit to Jerusalem. Photograph: Sa'ar Ya'acov


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

u2scram said:


> zionism = nazism



Equating Zionism and Nazism constitutes anti-Semitism under US and EU guidelines.

Keep your mental illness to yourself.

US Department of State
Contemporary Global Anti-Semitism:A Report Provided to the United States Congress

Anti-Semitism is one of the oldest forms of malicious intolerance and violates the precepts of human dignity and equality that are fundamental to a free and peaceful society.
History has shown that wherever anti-Semitism has gone unchecked, the persecution of others has been present or not far behind.

Defeating anti-Semitism must be a cause of great importance not only for Jews, but for all people who value humanity and justice and want to live in a more tolerant, peaceful world. Together, we must continue our efforts to monitor and combat anti-Semitism in all of its forms wherever and whenever it occurs.

Forms of Anti-Semitism

Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination. 
Drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis. 
Contemporary Global Anti-Semitism:A Report Provided to the United States Congress

EUMC...
Examples of the ways in which antiSemitism manifests itself with regard to the state of Israel, drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis

Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, eg, by claiming that the existence of a state of Israel is a racist endeavor.

FRA - European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

u2scram said:


> long after ww2 the zionists were allying themselves with nazis.



False.

IslamoNazis collaborated with the German Nazis.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSUEx1cKUlg[/ame]


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## u2scram (Nov 2, 2010)

""IslamoNazis collaborated with the German Nazis.""

yes they did. what difference does that make? i consider islam and judaism to be nasty little primitive superstitions.

zionism and nazism have much in common, no matter what muslims did.


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

u2scram said:


> ""IslamoNazis collaborated with the German Nazis.""
> 
> yes they did. what difference does that make? i consider islam and judaism to be nasty little primitive superstitions.
> 
> zionism and nazism have much in common, no matter what muslims did.



IslamoNazis: "We Desire Death Like You Desire Life"
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWIDZ7Jpdqg[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Nov 2, 2010)

*What About The Arab Apartheid?
by Khaled Abu Toameh*



> And is it not ironic that the government of Binyamin Netanyahu is doing more to boost the Palestinian economy in the West Bank than any Arab country?





> How come the Lebanese students who recently talked about Israel's "war crimes" in the Gaza Strip during Israel Apartheid Week on many North American college campuses had nothing to say about the fact that tens of thousands of Palestinians have been massacred in Lebanon over the past four decades?   Dozens of refugees were killed and hundreds wounded in the three-month offensive that also destroyed thousands of houses inside the refugee camp. Reporters said it was the worst internal violence in Lebanon since the civil war that hit the country between 1975-1990. And just three years ago, the Lebanese Army used heavy artillery to bomb the Nahr-al-Bared refugee camp in north Lebanon.
> 
> Yet who has ever heard of a United Nations resolution condemning Syria or Lebanon for committing horrific atrocities or discriminating against the Palestinians?  The Lebanese, Syrian and Jordanian students and professors who took part in the anti-Israel events on campuses have clearly "forgotten" that their regimes probably have more Palestinian blood on their hands than Israel. In the early 1970s, the Jordanians slaughtered thousands of Palestinians in what has become known as Black September. Can somebody point to one United Nations resolution condemning that massacre?
> 
> ...


What about the Arab apartheid? by Khaled Abu Toameh  Israel, belegerd volk, cultuur en natie


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## daveman (Nov 3, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> For a few months in  1953 Noam Chomsky and his wife lived on a kibbutz in Israel where there was little food and much hard work.
> 
> "I came close to returning there to live, as my wife very much wanted to do at the time. I had nothing particularly attractive here.
> 
> ...



I expect what he objected to the most was having to work for a living.


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## georgephillip (Nov 3, 2010)

What would you and "the Gipper" know about working for a living?


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## Marc39 (Nov 3, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> What would you and "the Gipper" know about working for a living?



In 40 years, Chomsky's opinions have never been sought by any US president, the Congress or any US govt institution.

Nor, has Chomsky appeared on the front pages of the NY Times, Washington Post or any other important news outlet.

Because, the consensus is Chomsky is a flake.


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## Bonano (Nov 3, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > What would you and "the Gipper" know about working for a living?
> ...



No, because joos against chomsky have a lot of power in the US.


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## Marc39 (Nov 3, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



8 year old trolling the internet.


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## Bonano (Nov 3, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



joo said that already.


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 3, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> u2scram said:
> 
> 
> > zionism = nazism
> ...



When you are losing, play the anti-Semite card.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 3, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > u2scram said:
> ...



When you are mentally ill, you're not playing with a full deck.


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 3, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



When you are losing, call names.


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## Marc39 (Nov 3, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



A nut by any other name is still a nut.


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 3, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



That's true. When did you change your name?


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## Marc39 (Nov 3, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



You ran out of gas 1000 miles, ago.  Sputter away.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 3, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



Did you ever contemplate having an original thought?


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## u2scram (Nov 4, 2010)

*TERRORISM BY ZIONISTS:  ATTACKS AGAINST PALESTINIANS AND BRITS*

list of irgun terrorist attacks 1937-1948

Date : Casualties : Comments: 

March, 1937 2 Arabs killed on Bat-Yam beach 

November 14, 1937 ("Black Sunday") Irgun units launched attacks around Jerusalem, killing 10 Arabs. 

April 12, 1938 2 Arabs and 2 British policemen were killed by a bomb in a train in Haifa. 

April 17, 1938 An Arab was killed by a bomb detonated in a cafe in Haifa. 

July 6, 1938 Bombing of Arab market in Haifa killed 21 Arabs. 

May 17, 1938 An Arab policeman was killed in an attack on a bus in the Jerusalem-Hebron road. 

May 24, 1938 3 Arabs were shot and killed in Haifa. 

June 23, 1938 2 Arabs were killed near Tel-Aviv. 

June 26, 1938 7 Arabs were killed by a bomb in Jaffa. 

June 27, 1938 An Arab was killed in the yard of a hospital in Haifa. 

Late June, 1938 Unspecified number of Arabs killed by a bomb that was thrown into a crowded Arab market place in Jerusalem. 

July 5, 1938 7 Arabs were killed in several shooting attacks in Tel-Aviv. 

On the same day 3 Arabs were killed by a bomb detonated in a bus in Jerusalem. 

On the same day an Arab was killed in another attack in Jerusalem. 

July 6 1938 18 Arabs and 5 Jews were killed by two simultaneous bombs in the Arab Melon market in Haifa. 

July 8, 1938 4 Arabs were killed by a bomb in Jerusalem. 

July 16, 1938 10 Arabs were killed by a bomb at a marketplace in Jerusalem. 

July 25, 1938 43 Arabs were killed by a bomb at a marketplace in Haifa. 

August 26, 1938 24 Arabs were killed by a bomb at a marketplace in Jaffa. 

February 27, 1939 33 Arabs were killed in multiple attacks, incl. 24 by bomb in Arab market in Suk Quarter of Haifa 

and 4 by bomb in Arab vegetable market in Jerusalem. 

May 29, 1939 5 Arabs were killed by a mine detonated at the Rex cinema in Jerusalem. 

On the same day 5 Arabs were shot and killed during a raid on the village of Biyar 'Adas. 

June 2, 1939 5 Arabs were killed by a bomb at the Jaffa Gate in Jerusalem. 

June 12, 1939 A post office in Jerusalem was bombed, killing a British bomb expert trying to defuse the bombs. 

June 16, 1939 6 Arabs were killed in several attacks in Jerusalem. 

June 19, 1939 20 Arabs were killed by explosives mounted on a donkey at a marketplace in Haifa. 

June 29, 1939 13 Arabs were killed in multiple shootings during one-hour period. 

June 30, 1939 An Arab was killed at a marketplace in Jerusalem. 

On the same day 2 Arabs were shot and killed in Lifta. 

July 3, 1939 An Arab was killed by a bomb at a marketplace in Haifa. 

July 4, 1939 2 Arabs were killed in two attacks in Jerusalem. 

July 20, 1939 An Arab was killed at a train station in Jaffa. 

On the same day 6 Arabs were killed in several attacks in Tel-Aviv. 

On the same day 3 Arabs were killed in Rehovot. 

August 27, 1939 2 British officers were killed by a mine in Jerusalem. 

September 27, 1944: 150 Irgun members attacked four British police stations; unknown number of casualties. 

September 29, 1944 senior British police officer of the Criminal Intelligence Department assassinated in Jerusalem. November 6, 1944 Assassination fo Lord Moyne in Cairo. December 27, 1945 British Intelligence offices in Jerusalem bombed, killing seven British policemen; British army camp in north Tel Aviv attacked, killing one British soldier. 

July 22, 1946 King David Hotel Bombing; 91 fatalities, most civilians -- 41 Arabs, 17 Jews, and 15 British. October 30, 1946 Gunfire and explosion kill two British guards at Jerusalem Railway Station. 

January 12, 1947 Four killed in bombing of British headquarters. 

March 1, 1947 Raid and explosion kills 17 British officers. 

March 12, 1947 Attack on Schneller Camp kills one British soldier. 

July 29, 1947 Two kidnapped British sergeants hanged. 

September 26, 1947 Four British policemen killed in Irgun bank robbery. 

September 29, 1947 13 killed, 53 wounded in attack on British police station. 

December 29, 1947 14 Arabs killed by bomb in Jerusalem. 

April 9-April 11, 1948 107-120 Palestinian unarmed civilian villagers killed in Deir Yassin massacre, the estimate generally accepted by scholars, instead the first announced number of 254 during and possibly after the battle at the village of Deir Yassin (also written as Dayr Yasin or Dir Yassin modern Kefar Sha&#702;ul near Jerusalem in the British Mandate of Palestine by 132 Jewish Zionist guerrilla fighters (72 Irgun and 60 Lehi along with some women for support), while Jewish Yishuv forces fought to break the siege of Jerusalem during the period of civil war that preceded the end of the Mandate. 

Between 1937-1948 During 11 years of attacks, 194-207 + Arabs (1 policeman, rest civilian),


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## docmauser1 (Nov 5, 2010)

u2scram said:


> _March, 1937 2 Arabs killed on Bat-Yam beach_


So, what did they do to deserve such treatment?


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## georgephillip (Nov 5, 2010)

Possibly they objected to the British colonial enterprise known as "The Jewish State of Israel" even then taking shape in a part of the world where Jews were still a minority of voters?

"The persecution of Jews for centuries in Europe was the worst of many stains on the European record, and the Zionists&#8217; desire for a place of sanctuary is certainly understandable. 

"*Like all other colonial enterprises, however, Zionism was based on the total disregard of the rights of the indigenous inhabitants.* 

"As such, it is morally indefensible. And, as previously stated, all subsequent crimes--and there have been many on both sides--inevitably follow from this *original injustice to the Palestinians*.

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/download/origin_booklet.pdf


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Possibly they objected to the British colonial enterprise known as "The Jewish State of Israel" even then taking shape in a part of the world where Jews were still a minority of voters?



Clueless one, Israel existed 3200 years ago.
Not one Arab country, today, existed prior to World War I.

Open a book, you embarrass yourself.


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

* Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
* Yes, nazis spoke german.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> * Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> * Yes, nazis spoke german.



Stupid little boy.

Martin Luther King, Jr...


> When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-Semitism.
> 
> I see Israel as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security and that security must be a reality.


"I have a dream" for peace in the Middle East / King's special bond with Israel


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
> 
> 
> > * Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> ...



No wonder he was shot.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
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Mentally ill teen


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
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Too funny


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
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Sick boy


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
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Sick boy


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
> 
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What's even funnier is the joo luvers here taking down my thread about Israel being the holy land of inbreeding.

If you guys don't widen the pool soon, you'll all have to trade your coke-bottle glasses in for actual coke bottles!


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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sick, sick boy.

Warren Buffett, Multi-Billion Dollar Purchase of Successful Israeli Company...


> Israel is exceptional.  I can give you an absolute, unequivocal answer.  You can go around the world and it's very impressive to see a country of 7 million create a business like this, I haven't seen anything like this in the US.
> 
> When you think about it, if you compare Israel (now) to 1948, it's very, very impressive.  It's a remarkable place


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV3W_86NTYA[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
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Israel has more technology companies listed on NASDAQ than your inferior country.


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
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don't joo me. Anyways, Canada has its own stock exchange.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
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Canada's stock exchange doesn't mean shit, loser.  You fucking bacon eaters got to get it together.  Israel whips your lame ass.

Go back to masturbating to gay porn.


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
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Canada isn't about to get nuked. 'nuff said. I win.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Marc39 said:
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Your inflatable doll even rejected you, needle dick


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## hipeter924 (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Bonano said:
> 
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He could have gotten a sex doll, if it wasn't for the fact Mohammad forbids it.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

hipeter924 said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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> > Bonano said:
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Muhammad's 6 year old wife qualified as a sex doll.  She had her own dolls, too.


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## Bonano (Nov 5, 2010)

Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference? No


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

Bonano said:


> Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference? No



Good thing there is an internet for ugly ass dead-enders with no friends to vent their rage.

Otherwise, you might put a bullet in your head.


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## georgephillip (Nov 5, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > Possibly they objected to the British colonial enterprise known as "The Jewish State of Israel" even then taking shape in a part of the world where Jews were still a minority of voters?
> ...


Whether Jews cleansed Canaan of its indigenous population 3000 years ago or not, in 1948 CE there were 1.35 million Arabs and 650,000 Jews living in Mandate Palestine. 

Had the UN acted in the best interests of the majority of those living between the Mediterranean Sea and Jordan River at that time, one person one vote would have rendered a Jewish homeland in Palestine DOA.

And the world today would be a far more peaceful place.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 5, 2010)

As long as Israel occupies Palestine, there will be no peace.

The fake peace talks are meaningless. They just dance around the real issues.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> As long as Israel occupies Palestine, there will be no peace.



Palestine doesn't exist, dummy.  Such stupidity is why you have no reputational points.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> The Palestine entity, formally established and defined by Britain, was formally abolished in 1948 with the termination of the Mandate.



Israel occupies...Israel...

The League of Nations agreed...


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country


 
Allah agrees...
Quran 5:20-21...


> Remember Moses said to his people: 'O my people! Recall in remembrance the favor of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples. O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin.


 
Barack Obama agrees...:


> Israel is a sovereign state, and the historic homeland of the Jewish people.
> 
> It should be clear to all that efforts to chip away at Israel's legitimacy will only be met by the unshakeable opposition of the United States.  The slaughter of innocent Israelis is not resistance -- it's injustice


Remarks by the President to the United Nations General Assembly | The White House


Winston Churchill agreed...: 


> The Jews had Palestine before that indigenous population [the Arabs] came in and inhabited it


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Churchill-Jews-Friendship-Martin-Gilbert/dp/0805078800]Amazon.com: Churchill and the Jews: A Lifelong Friendship (9780805078800): Martin Gilbert: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

The US Congress agrees...

The United States Congressional Record
1922 HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 
NATIONAL HOME FOR THE JEWISH PEOPLE JUNE 30, 1922 
HOUSE RESOLUTION 360 - UNANIMOUSLY ADOPTED


> Palestine of today, the land we now know as Palestine, was peopled by the Jews from the dawn of history until the Roman era. It is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. They were driven from it by force by the relentless Roman military machine and for centuries prevented from returning. At different periods various alien people succeeded them but the Jewish race had left an indelible impress upon the land.
> 
> Today it is a Jewish country. Every name, every landmark, every monument and every trace of whatever civilization remaining there is still Jewish. And it has ever since remained a hope, a longing, as expressed in their prayers for these nearly 2,000 years. No other people has ever claimed Palestine as their national home. No other people has ever shown an aptitude or indicated a genuine desire to make it their homeland. The land has been ruled by foreigners. Only since the beginning of the modern Zionist effort may it be said that a creative, cultural, and economic force has entered Palestine. The Jewish Nation was forced from its natural home. It did not go because it wanted to.
> 
> ...


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0688123635/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0688123627&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0HX00TRZAFXPP1PG6MNR]Amazon.com: Israel: A History (9780688123635): Martin Gilbert: Books[/ame]


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 5, 2010)

Yeah well, as long as Israel occupies Palestine there will be no peace.


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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> > georgephillip said:
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Uneducated one, Mandate Palestine was turned into three Arabs states in Jordan, Syria and Lebanon.  Arabs received the rest of the Ottoman Empire, too, comprising 8 million square miles, twice the size of the US.

Your ignorance is your lack of reputational points.


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## daveman (Nov 5, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Yeah well, as long as Israel occupies Palestine there will be no peace.



Good tactic:  Stick your fingers in your ears and screech "LA LA LA LA LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!"


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Yeah well, as long as Israel occupies Palestine there will be no peace.



Where Arab and Muslim savages live, there has never been peace, clueless one.

Alexis de Toqueville...


> I studied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



Winston Churchill...



> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288411221&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


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## georgephillip (Nov 5, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah well, as long as Israel occupies Palestine there will be no peace.
> ...


Assuming freedom depends more on one person one vote than on UN resolution, can you justify the tactic of telling 1.35 million Arabs and 650,000 Jews living in Palestine in 1948 they would not be allowed to freely decide the nature of their new state?


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## Marc39 (Nov 5, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
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Stupid boy, the Arabs received virtually the entire Ottoman Empire, 8 million square miles, twice the size of the US.

Are you really that stupid?  I guess I answered my own question.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> _As long as Israel occupies Palestine, there will be no peace._


Let's dismantle the rogue state of Jordan - it occupies more, than 70% of that "Palestine".


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
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That was settled when Israel's Arab neighbors attacked Israel and were thrashed.  The land is Israel's now.

And if you believe it isn't, you need to give your house to a native American.  Or you can continue being a hypocrite.  Your call.


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## the machine rag (Nov 6, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
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> > daveman said:
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The pro-Zionist proganda version of re-written history.. Time for you to return to Hasbara Central for more of the same.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

the machine rag said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



You can't even spell propaganda, shit-for-brains.   Drugs will do that.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...


daveman:

Between the time the UN appointed committee, UNSCOP, recommended its "two state solution" in late 1947 and the following May when Israel declared its "independence", both Arabs and Jews fought openly for control of strategic positions inside Palestine.

"Several major atrocities were committed by both sides."

"In the months prior to the end of the Mandate the Haganah launched a number of offensives in which *they gained control over all the territory allocated by the UN to the Jewish State*, creating a large number of refugees and capturing the towns of Tiberias, Haifa, Safad, Beisan and, in effect, Jaffa."

"On May 14, 1948, one day before the end of the British Mandate of Palestine, Israel declared its independence and sovereignty on the portion partitioned by UNSCOP for the Jewish state. 

"The next day, the Arab League reiterated officially their opposition to the 'two-state solution' in a letter to the UN.[22] 

"That day, the armies of Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Iraq *invaded the territory partitioned for the Arab state*, thus starting the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. 

"The nascent Israeli Defense Force *repulsed the Arab nations from part of the occupied territories, thus extending its borders beyond the original UNSCOP partition."*

Israel's Arab neighbors "attacked Israel" by assuming defensive positions around territories partitioned for the Arab state as specified in UN resolution 181.

btw, anyone who includes the words "freedom" and "Ronald Reagan" in their signature treads on very thin ice when using the word "hypocrite."

Arab-Israeli conflict - Wiki


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Arabs: 30 countries, 8 million sq. mi, twice the size of the US, 99.9% of the Middle East.
Israelis: 1 country, 8 thousand sq mi, the size of Vermont, 0.1% of the Middle East


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



In 1922, the League of Nations established Palestine as the Jewish homeland, which became international law with unanimous ratification of the Palestine Mandate.


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country


The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate


Your history lesson for the day


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

the machine rag said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


I think it's safe to assume you're another hypocrite who demands Israel give up what she legally took, but refuses to give your own house back to the natives.


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
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In summary:  You refuse to give your house back to its rightful owners -- and it's the Jews' fault.


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
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> > daveman said:
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## Sunni Man (Nov 6, 2010)

I don't care if it's 0.00000001 %

The Zionists stole the land from it's rightful owners and it needs to be given back. Period


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> I don't care if it's 0.00000001 %
> 
> The Zionists stole the land from it's rightful owners and it needs to be given back. Period



Your Allah knows better, slave of Allah.  No virgin chasing for you, sucker.  

Quran 5:20-21...


> Remember Moses said to his people: 'O my people! Recall in remembrance the favor of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples. O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin.




Alla is a Zionist!


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> I don't care if it's 0.00000001 %
> 
> The Zionists stole the land from it's rightful owners and it needs to be given back. Period



The Muhammadan is a thief and a killer.   Islam must be destroyed.

Winston Churchill...


> The coming into being of a Jewish state in Palestine is an event in world history to be viewed in the perspective, not of a generation or a century, but in the perspective of a thousand, two thousand or even three thousand years" "This is an event in world history


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Israel-History-Martin-Gilbert/dp/0688123635/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288397424&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: Israel: A History (9780688123635): Martin Gilbert: Books[/ame]



Alexis de Toqueville...


> Istudied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



Winston Churchill...



> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...



[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288411221&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> Sunni Man said:
> 
> 
> > I don't care if it's 0.00000001 %
> ...


  Now we get to play "Allah Didn't Say What He Said".


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> I don't care if it's 0.00000001 %
> 
> The Zionists stole the land from it's rightful owners and it needs to be given back. Period



You don't own shit outside of the desert of Arabia, where you belong, you raggedy sand rat.

The Muhammadan stole the Middle East from the rightful Jewish and Christian owners, Muslim motherfucker.
Muslim conquests - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> _The Zionists stole the land from it's rightful owners and it needs to be given back. Period_


Those "rightful owners" have never had any land to own, much less to claim it back.


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## MelissaD (Nov 6, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> Sunni Man said:
> 
> 
> > _The Zionists stole the land from it's rightful owners and it needs to be given back. Period_
> ...



So are you saying that the land the zionist took was not populated by anyone? And that no one owned any land there? Ever?


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > Sunni Man said:
> ...


Why do arab cheerleaders always have to deliberately confuse things, like the issue of ownership of some real estate and having a state? Inconvenient?


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > Sunni Man said:
> ...



Didn't Muslims take the Middle East and north Africa, populated by Jews, Christians and, Zoroastrians?

Yah, they did.

Didn't Muslims  take Afghanistan that was populated by the Buddhists?

Yah, they did.

Didn't Muslims take Spain, Portugal, Italy and much of Europe and Asia populated by non-Muslims?

Yah, they did.

Jews have lived in "Palestine" for over 3000 years, 2000 years before Arabs invaded.

In fact, Jews have ruled in "Palestine" for over 400 years.  Arab rule in "Palestine" amounted to less than 100 years under Umayyad rule.

Zionists took no land that was not Jewish land from the very beginning.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > Sunni Man said:
> ...



The land Zionists purchased...from Arabs all too eager to unload their useless land.

Palestine Royal Commission...


> The Arab population shows a remarkable increase since 1920, and it has had some share in the increased prosperity of Palestine.* Many Arab landowners have benefited from the sale of land [to Jews] and the profitable investment of the purchase money*. The fellaheen are better off on the whole than they were in 1920. This Arab progress has been partly due to the import of Jewish capital into Palestine and other factors associated with the growth of the National Home. In particular, the Arabs have benefited from social services which could not have been provided on the existing scale without the revenue obtained from the Jews.
> 
> The shortage of land is due less to purchase by Jews than to the increase in the Arab population. The Arab claims that the Jews have obtained too large a proportion of good land cannot be maintained. Much of the land now carrying orange groves was sand dunes or swamps and uncultivated when it was bought.


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## MelissaD (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
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Yes, zionists took land that they think belonged to them in the first place 3000 years ago (that's comical, but I get it). But what I'm saying is: did the zionists come in and buy up all the land, or take it by force. So at the very very least, Israel would owe money to the people whose land was taken/expropriated/stolen. Some of these refugees want to come back to their lands that they actually lived on, not that their ancestors had 3000 years ago. Doesn't that count for anything? the rights of people 3000 years ago supercede those who are alive today? That concept is a little hard to defend imo.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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Continual historical Jewish ownership of land is comical?  I see.  Let's tell Saudi Arabia that Muslim ownership of Mecca and Medina is irrelevant and let's open it to non-Muslims.

The fact is Jews took nothing by force.  The Ottoman Turks who owned "Palestine," not the Arabs, permitted Jewish immigration and international law created by the world community established "Palestine" as the Jewish homeland.

1.5 million Arabs live in Israel.  If Israel had wanted to force them out, they would have done so.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
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Er, there are no "Palestinian" refugees.  The actual refugees of the '48 war are dead, for the most part.  Their descendants are not refugees.  Refugee status is not inherited.

My grandfather was a refugee from Poland before emigrating to the US.  Can I claim refugee status and request UN payments?  LOL, I don't think so.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Israel's biggest lie.

"Five Arab states attacked Israel, they lost, Israel won the land."

1) None of those Arab states entered Israel.

2) The war was called to an end by UN resolution. No Arab state surrendered, No Arab state lost.

3) After the war the borders for Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and Palestine remained the same as they were in 1922. Israel has no borders around any land.

Where did Israel win any land?


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> _Yes, zionists took land that they think belonged to them in the first place 3000 years ago (that's comical, but I get it)._


Euroimmigrants took land that didn't belong to them and formed the USA, i'm sure, the locals didn't think it comical at all.


MelissaD said:


> _But what I'm saying is: did the zionists come in and buy up all the land, or take it by force._


As luck would have it, the web has the magnificent me to educate the masses.
"It is made quite clear to all, both by the map drawn up by the Simpson Commission and by another compiled by the Peel Commission, that the Arabs are as prodigal in selling their land as they are in useless wailing and weeping.''
King Abdullah of Jordan


MelissaD said:


> _So at the very very least, Israel would owe money to the people whose land was taken/expropriated/stolen._


Dumbass arab propagandists babble about that all the time. Drivel, of course.


MelissaD said:


> _Some of these refugees want to come back to their lands that they actually lived on, not that their ancestors had 3000 years ago. Doesn't that count for anything? the rights of people 3000 years ago supercede those who are alive today? That concept is a little hard to defend imo._


Then I think, Spain should take the lead and show us a good example of dealing with old arguments on the modern basis just like it demands Israel should do and stop fuleing bilateral fundamentalism and return the islands it had stolen. And let the justice® and the international law® triumph. Kosovo has never been albanian, and, yet, albanians lay claim on it. The Kurile islands are japanese, and, yet, there is not a single japanese there. Etc..


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



There is a lot said about the Palestinians selling their land to Jews, but by 1947 the Jews only owned about 7% of Palestine.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



Arabs owned zero land.

Jews lived in "Palestine" first.  Finders, keepers.   Arabs are weepers.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



Arabs began calling themselves Palestinians in 1967, not 1947.  Open a book.  

UN Res. 181 conferring Arab statehood in the Levant, which they rejected, has no references to so-called Palestinians.

Jews are in point of fact the real Palestinians given the Romans renamed Judea, land of the Jewish people and the correct historical geographic name of the land, "Palaestina" 500 years before Arabs even live there.

Arabs agree...

Former PLO Leader Zuheir Mohsen...


> stinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.


Zuheir Mohsen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Arab American Journalist Joe Farah...


> no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc. Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of 1 percent of the landmass.
> 
> Palestine has never existed -- before or since -- as an autonomous entity. It was ruled alternately by Rome, by Islamic and Christian crusaders, by the Ottoman Empire and, briefly, by the British after World War I. The British agreed to restore at least part of the land to the Jewish people as their homeland.


Myths of the Middle East


Arab Commentator Azmi Bishara...


> dont think there is a Palestinian nation at all. I think there is an Arab nation. I always thought so and I did not change my mind. I do not think there is a Palestinian nation, I think its a colonialist invention - Palestinian nation. When were there any Palestinians? Where did it come from? I think there is an Arab nation. I never turned to be a Palestinian nationalist, despite of my decisive struggle against the occupation. I think that until the end of the 19th century, Palestine was the south of Greater Syria.


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3n5-yG-6dU[/ame]


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



The continuity of the Palestinian roots in the land in fact goes back to antiquity. Absorbing or outlasting various conquerors, Palestinians tenaciously tended their ancestral farmlands, whether as freeholders or as tenants and mortgagees, and by the end of World War 11, mostly as unfettered freeholders again. In his study of the history of landholdings in Palestine, Abraham Granott, formerly Managing Director of the Jewish National Fund, admits:

"When the kingdom of Byzantium was subjugated by the Arabs, practically the whole of the land belonged to the big proprietors, the Emperor, the municipal authorities, and religious bodies, as churches and so on, while the soil was cultivated by the former owners who had remained on their plots as tenants after the land had passed into the hands of large owners."(1)

Thus the Palestinian farmers expelled by the Zionists in 1948 were the lineal descendants of the most ancient owners of the land. The Palestinian Arabs are the indigenous population of Palestine, the descendants of the Philistines and of all the Semitic peoples who have lived in Palestine since the time of the Canaanites. Successive waves of newcomers, such as Philistines from Crete, Semites from Iraq, Romans, Greeks and Arabs came and intermarried with the native stock.

Chapter 2: Encyclopedia of the Palestine Problem


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Al Hambra cinima, Jaffa, 1937, flying Palestinian flag.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> The continuity of the Palestinian roots in the land in fact goes back to antiquity.



Well, no.  Open a history book.

Arabs first inhabited "Palestine" in the 7th century AD, long after ancient times.

Jews inhabited "Palestine" in antiquity dating back to 1300 BCE, twice, in fact, as the First and Second Temples.

Now, you know.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Al Hambra cinima, Jaffa, 1937, flying Palestinian flag.



Problem is, Arabs didn't recognize Palestine or Palestinians until 1967.  The land was southern Syria.  Arabs opposed the British calling southern Syria Palestine for fear it was a Western device.

Thus, your flag is bogus

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> *For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable.  For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. *The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. *For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine.* The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria].  For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.





> *The Palestinian Arabs' basic sense of corporate historic identity was, at different levels, Muslim or Arab or -- for some -- Syrian; it is significant that even by the end of the Mandate in 1948, after 30 years of separate Palestinian political existence, there were virtually no books in Arabic on the history of Palestine*.


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Middle-East-Bernard-Lewis/dp/0684832801/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1288529772&sr=8-5]Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > The continuity of the Palestinian roots in the land in fact goes back to antiquity.
> ...



Are Palestinians really all Arabs?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Al Hambra cinima, Jaffa, 1937, flying Palestinian flag.
> ...



So who was flying that flag? The Jews?


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Pallies are all Arabs, though, they generally identify by religion, mostly Muslim.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
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Some Palestinians are blond with blue eyes. Others are black with kinky hair.  There is a wide variety of colors and facial features in between.

One would think that a specific race would be more homogeneous.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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Palestinians consist of Muslims, Christians, and Jews.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



99% of Pallies are Muslim.   Jews stopped calling themselves Palestinians with Israeli statehood back in 1948.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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> > Marc39 said:
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Some did - some didn't.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Er, no.  Palestine ceased to exist with Israeli statehood.  Israelis are Israelis, not Palestinians.   Now, you know.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> The Palestine entity, formally established and defined by Britain, was formally abolished in 1948 with the termination of the Mandate.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...


Your Logic lesson of the day:

If the League of Nations gave the Jews all of Palestine in 1922, why did the Zionists accept only 55% of Palestine from the UN in 1948?


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Because, Jews are reasonable, unlike Arab barbarians.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
> ...


"Each year, the U.S. Army War College in Carlysle Barracks, Pennsylvania, invites foreign military personnel to partake in war games scenarios and seek solutions to problems and potential problems around the globe. 

"Saudi Arabias Lieutenant Colonel Mohammed F. Abo-Sak participated in the USAWC Class of 1997 where he developed a strategy research project he entitled '*US Involvement in the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict: Solution or Complication?'*"

"Palestinians have continuously resided in Palestine since four thousand years before Christ, Abo-Sak pointed out. *Their ancestors built the cities of Jerusalem, Nablus, Jericho, Beisan, Acca and Jaffa. *

"The Hebrews arrived in the land between *1400-1200 B.C*., and only maintained control over it during the lifetimes of* King David and his son King Solomon  a period of about 80 years*. 

"The land then came under Greek and Roman rule, and was then conquered by *Islam in the year 637 A.D*. under the second Caliph, Omar. 

"*By that time, the Jews had already left Jerusalem*, and Christianity was the dominant religion. 

"The Caliph granted full security to all Christians, including personal safety, and protection of property, religion and churches. 

"The Muslims declared Jerusalem the capital of Palestine, and the city remained under Islamic rule until the end of the Ottoman Empire in 1918, except for a brief time of Christian rule under the Crusaders." 

Let's see...Muslim conquest 637 CE.
End of Ottoman Empire 1918 CE.
1281 years of Muslim rule in Palestine?

US Involvement in...


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "Palestinians have continuously resided in Palestine since four thousand years before Christ



Complete fiction.

Jews are the original Palestinians given the Romans renamed Judea, the correct historical geographical name of the land, "Palestine" 500 years before Arabs lived there. 

The common consensus of opinion among historians and archaeologists is Pallies originated from the Arabian Peninsula and most are descended from Arabs who invaded "Palestine" in the 7th century.

There is no reference to Palestine or Palestinians in the Quran, the Hebrew Bible or the Christian Bible.

There is no reference to Palestine or Palestinians in any ancient historical documents.

The Quran references Jews, not Palestinians, as the owners of the Holy Land.

Quran 5:20-21...


> Remember Moses said to his people: 'O my people! Recall in remembrance the favor of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples. O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


*"The fact is Jews took nothing by force."*

"The 1948 Palestinian exodus (Arabic: &#1575;&#1604;&#1607;&#1580;&#1585;&#1577; &#1575;&#1604;&#1601;&#1604;&#1587;&#1591;&#1610;&#1606;&#1610;&#1577;&#8206;, al-Hijra al-Filas&#7789;&#299;n&#299;ya), also known as Nakba (Arabic: &#1575;&#1604;&#1606;&#1603;&#1576;&#1577;&#8206;, an-Nakbah), meaning the 'disaster', 'catastrophe', or 'cataclysm',[1] occurred when approximately 725,000 Palestinian Arabs fled or were expelled from their homes, during the 1948 Arab-Israeli War and the Civil War that preceded it.[2] The term 'Nakba' was first used in this way by Syrian historian Constantine Zureiq in his 1948 book, Ma'na al-Nakba (The Meaning of the Disaster).[3] 

"According to Ilan Pappe, the term Nakba was adopted "as an attempt to counter the moral weight of the Jewish Holocaust (Shoa)".[4]

"Nur-eldeen Masalha writes that over 80 percent of the Arab inhabitants of the area that became Israel left their towns and villages.[5] 

"Jewish advances, such as that on Haifa, fears of a massacre after Deir Yassin,[6] and a collapse in Palestinian leadership caused many to leave out of panic. 

*"A series of laws passed by the first Israeli government prevented them from returning to their homes, or claiming their property.* 

"They and many of their descendants remain refugees."

Creating a Jewish Homeland in 1948 Palestine with 1.35 million Arabs and 650,000 Jews would have been impossible without force underwritten by western colonial powers. 

A fact "Princeton" Marc continues to profit from.

1948 Palestinian exodus - wiki


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "The Hebrews arrived in the land between *1400-1200 B.C*., and only maintained control over it during the lifetimes of* King David and his son King Solomon  a period of about 80 yearsB]. *


*

Wrong.

Jews ruled over Judea for over 400 years under the First Temple, established 1000 BCE, until the Babylonian destruction of the Temple in 586 BCE.

Arab rule of Judea lasted less than 100 years under the Umayyads, from 661 AD to 750 AD.

Your history lesson for the day.*


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


*"Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own and return, to his country.*

    -* Universal Declaration on Human Rights, Article 13*

"Israels military occupation of Gaza and the West Bank (including East Jerusalem) is the most persistent military occupation on earth. But this 35-year-old occupation is only the second stage in the colonization of the land of Canaan. 

"*The first stage, between 1947-1949, generated the largest population of refugees still unsettled since World War Two, with the longest displacement in modern history.* 

"Until recently, two competing accounts of this catastrophic event existed. The first version, advocated by Israeli leaders, holds that the native Palestinians left present day Israel of their own free will or through the encouragement of their leaders. This version even indicates that Israeli leaders desired the Palestinian people to stay within Israels borders." 

"The second version, reported by the Palestinian refugees themselves, is that they were ethnically cleansed before, during and after the 1948 war. 

"In their lexicon, the expulsion became known as Al-Naqba (the Catastrophe) and is the most traumatic event in Palestinian recorded history. 

"More recently, Israeli historians, such as Ilan Pappé, Benny Morris, Zeev Sternhall, Avi Shlaim, Simha Flapan, and Tom Segev, have debunked the established Israeli myths of Israels creation. Using Israeli archives and declassified material, they were able to discover much of *the hidden history of Zionism and they reveal a factual account of the establishment of Israel*.

Palestinian Refugees Right...


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Ilan Pappe is not a proper historian.  Pappe admits to being biased and fabricating history.

Thus, your information is BOGUS.  And, you are severely uneducated.

Ilan Pappe...


> I admit that my ideology influences my historical writings





> I am not as interested in what happened as in how people see what's happened





> Indeed the struggle is about ideology, not about facts. Who knows what facts are? We try to convince as many people as we can that our interpretation of the facts is the correct one, and we do it because of ideological reasons, not because we are truthseekers


http://www.ee.bgu.ac.il/~censor/katz-directory/$99-11-29loos-pappe-interview.htm


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> _There is a lot said about the Palestinians selling their land to Jews, but by 1947 the Jews only owned about 7% of Palestine._


Yeah, and arabs "owned the rest". Been there, heard that drivel. British land regulations officially prohibited, or severely limited jovish land purchases. But the real trick is that, all the land, that wasn't purchased and registered in jooze's name in any way, including government lands, had been categorized as non-jovish, like the funniest UN Beersheeba example, where 99% of the land had been government land, but had been classified as non-jovish. Which means 99% non-arab, too. Incredibly funny.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Factually incorrect.  Neither Gaza nor the West Bank are sovereign Arab states and, thus, cannot be occupied.

Gaza and the West Bank are unallocated sovereign Israeli land under the terms of the binding Palestine Mandate establishing Palestine as the Jewish homeland.

League of Nations' Palestine Mandate...


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



BOGUS junk information, above, from Georgie the high school dropout.  

Eminent Middle East hisltorian Bernard Lewis...


> *Between 1947 and 1949 a large part of the Arab inhabitants of the territories included in the new state of Israel left their homes and took refuge on the West Bank, in the Gaza Strip, and in the neighboring countries*.
> 
> The Israelis claim that they left at the instigation of their own leaders, who told them to go so as not to interfere with the movements of troops, and promised them that they would return in the wake of the triumphant Arab armies very shortly. The Arabs maintain that they were driven out by the Israelis. Both arguments are true; both are false. Some were undoubtedly told to go by their own leaders; some, notably in the strategically vital corridor between Jerusalem and the coast, were ordered to leave by the advancing Israeli troops.
> 
> *The great majority [of Arabs], like countless millions of refugees elsewhere, left their homes amid the confusion and panic of invasion and war [initiated by the Arabs]&#8212;one more unhappy part of the vast movement of populations which occurred in the aftermath of World War II. As the Poles fled from the eastern areas seized by the Russians, as the Germans fled from East German territories annexed by the Poles, as millions of Muslims and Hindus fled from India to Pakistan and from Pakistan to India, so too did great numbers of Arabs flee from Palestine to the neighboring Arab states while large numbers of Jews, most of them previously unaffected by Zionist ideology, fled from the tensions which had arisen in the Arab states to the relative safety of Israel. At the time it was hoped that this problem would be resolved, like the refugee problems in Eastern Europe and in the Indian subcontinent, and that the Arab refugees would be partly resettled in the Arab countries, partly returned to their homes. This did not happen, and with the exception of Jordan, the Arab governments made a point of not according citizenship to the refugees and of opposing their resettlement.*


[ame]http://www.amazon.com/Faith-Power-Religion-Politics-Middle/dp/019514421X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1288961763&sr=1-1[/ame]


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


99% of Marc39's posts are "Princeton" bogus.

Stick to getting rich from stealing your neighbor's land and water and killing her children.

It's what you do best.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own and return, to his country. Universal Declaration on Human Rights, Article 13._


I'm most sure, the japanese read that and weep about returning to their portion of the Kurile islands, grabbed by the USSR in violation of the pact. As far as palestinians® are concerned, - they have their palistan to return to. Bon voyage.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Sux having me rip you a new asshole over and over, eh, high school dropout?

Still no reputational points.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Eminent Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> The Palestine entity, formally established and defined by Britain, was formally abolished in 1948 with the termination of the Mandate [and the establishment of the state of Israel].



Uneducated Georgie gets slapped down, once, again


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


You can continue your impotent whining all you like.  The Jews aren't going to walk into the sea for you.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


Or maybe some Jews are just reasonably barbaric...like some Arabs?

"The use of torture in Israeli prisons has been the subject of extensive inquiry. 

"In 1977, the London Sunday Times conducted a five-month investigation. Corroboration was obtained for the evidence adduced. 

"The torture documented occurred 'through the ten years of Israeli occupation since 1967. 

"The Sunday Times study presented the cases of forty-four Palestinians who were tortured. 

"'It documented practices in seven centers: prisons within the four principal cities of Nablus, Ramallah, Hebron and Gaza; the interrogation and detention center in Jerusalem known as the Russian Compound or Moscobiya; and special military centers located in Gaza and Sarafand.'"

Do you find torture reasonable?

Would Israel or any other appendage of the US Empire exist without it?

Have you found any way to profit from torture, yet?

The Prevalence..


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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I notice you did not refute any of my claims. That would be hard to do since they are historic fact.


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## daveman (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
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You must have a lot of people in this thread on Ignore, then, because you seem to be ignoring a lot of history facts.

The Jews will endure.  Grow up and deal with it.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> _I notice you did not refute any of my claims._


Drivel doesn't need that, of course.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > "Palestinians have continuously resided in Palestine since four thousand years before Christ
> ...


Predictable "Princeton" pablum...

Canaanites are the original Palestinians.
Jews and Arabs are interlopers.

"Canaanite culture apparently developed in situ from the Circum-*Arabian Nomadic Pastoral Complex*, which in turn developed from a fusion of Harifian hunter gatherers with Pre-Pottery Neolithic B (PPNB) farming cultures, practicing animal domestication, during the 6,200 BC climatic crisis.

Regardless of who occupied Palestine first, in 1948 CE 1.35 million Arabs would have outvoted 650,000 Jews if Western colonial powers had not imposed the Jewish State of Israel in the heart of Arab oil.

Follow the money.

Canaan - Wiki


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## docmauser1 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _Canaanites ... ._


Had a problem with toothpaste and then they died.


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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Do your heroic Jews require money for trade?

"the *Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunication (SWIFT)*, ...SWIFT links 8,740 financial institutions in 209 countries. 

"Without access to SWIFT and its interbank payment network, countries are unable either to pay for imports or to receive payment for exports. 

"*In short, no payment &#8212; no trade.*"

'Think there might be a few rich Jews who would rather take that walk?


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > _Canaanites ... ._
> ...


With a little help from the Tribe of the Golden Collection Plate.

Ever worry about a religion that sanctifies slavery?


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> [Canaanites are the original Palestinians.



LOL, Canaanites assimmilated into the Jewish population.

Palestine and Palestinians didn't even exist for Arabs until 1967

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> *For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable.  For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant*. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. *For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. *The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria].  For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.





> *The Palestinian Arabs' basic sense of corporate historic identity was, at different levels, Muslim or Arab or -- for some -- Syrian; it is significant that even by the end of the Mandate in 1948, after 30 years of separate Palestinian political existence, there were virtually no books in Arabic on the history of Palestine*.


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Middle-East-Bernard-Lewis/dp/0684832801/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1288529772&sr=8-5]Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]



Palestine was invented by the Romans who renamed Judea, land of the Jews, "Palaestina," 1500 years after Jews had been living in Judea, after the Philistines who were Greek, not Arab, 500 years before Arabs even lived in Judea.

Palestinians aren't referenced in any ancient historical documents.
Palestinians aren't referenced in the Quran.
Palestinians aren't referenced in the Hebrew Bible.
Palestinians aren't referenced in the Christian Bible.

You history lesson for the day, uneducated one.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Israel is the only country in the Arab Muslim Middle East where every citizen has freedom, equal rights and civil liberties.  

Ever worry about a cult that sanctifies genocide?

Quran 17:16... 


> When We decide to destroy a population, We (first) send a definite order to those among them who are given the good things of this life and yet transgress; so that the word is proved true against them: then (it is) We destroy them utterly.



And, which glorifies the murder of its own children and wives?
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWIDZ7Jpdqg[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Do your heroic Jews require money for trade?



Jews make money, loser.

Warren Buffett recently purchased a successful Israeli company for $4 billion.

Warren Buffett, Multi-Billion Dollar Purchase of Successful Israeli Company...


> Israel is exceptional.  I can give you an absolute, unequivocal answer.  You can go around the world and it's very impressive to see a country of 7 million create a business like this, I haven't seen anything like this in the US.
> 
> When you think about it, if you compare Israel (now) to 1948, it's very, very impressive.  It's a remarkable place


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV3W_86NTYA[/ame]


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


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## georgephillip (Nov 6, 2010)

How long have you been a delusional racist worshiping money, slave?


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## blu (Nov 6, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> u2scram said:
> 
> 
> > "Roger Tucker ( A Jew incidentally) argues that Zionism and Nazism are "identical manifestations of the same basic pathology" and that they are "equally dangerous to the well being of humanity". He says that although Zionism ultimately cannot sustain itself, to be complacent would risk inflicting "immense harm" on humanity.
> ...



why do you always paste that mlk quote as if his opinion matters?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 6, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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> > daveman said:
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I have seen a lot of Israeli propaganda, but that does not match actual history.


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

blu said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > u2scram said:
> ...



Why are you so ugly?


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## Marc39 (Nov 6, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> How long have you been a delusional racist worshiping money, slave?



Translation: You're an unsuccessful loser.


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


So, your business plan is:

1.  Bitch impotently in the internet.

2.  ?????

3.  No more Jews!


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
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I've seen your "history".  It's bullshit.  

The Jews will endure.  Grow up and deal with it.  Take responsibility for yourself.  If your life is screwed up, it's YOUR fault -- not "the JOOOOOS!!!"


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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> > daveman said:
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Israel's biggest lie.

"Five Arab states attacked Israel, they lost, Israel won the land."

1) None of those Arab states entered Israel.

2) The war was called to an end by UN resolution. No Arab state surrendered, No Arab state lost.

3) After the war the borders for Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and Palestine remained the same as they were in 1922. Israel has no borders around any land.

Where did Israel win any land?

What is Bullshit here?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
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Incorrect, again.  Multiple Arab countries declared war on Israel and attacked Israel.  The Arab League's declaration of war is on record 

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> On 29 November, 1947, the General Assembly of the United Nations adopted a resolution approving the partition of mandatory Palestine into three components:  a Jewish state, an Arab state, and an international zone.  As the Mandate came to an end, the Jews began to form their state; the Palestinian Arab leaders and the Arab governments rejected the partition resolution and went to war to prevent its implementation.



Your history lesson for the day


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## hipeter924 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
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Sinai Peninsula. Now go back to school.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> 3) After the war the borders for Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and Palestine remained the same as they were in 1922. Israel has no borders around any land.
> 
> Where did Israel win any land?
> 
> What is Bullshit here?



You're the bullshitter.  This is why you have zero reputational points and your own page says you should be ignored at all costs.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Not one of those countries crossed a border into Israel.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Multiple Arab countries invaded the state of Israel in 1948.  It is a matter of historical fact.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> On 29 November, 1947, the General Assembly of the United Nations adopted a resolution approving the partition of mandatory Palestine into three components:  a Jewish state, an Arab state, and an international zone.  As the Mandate came to an end, the Jews began to form their state; the Palestinian Arab leaders and the Arab governments rejected the partition resolution and went to war [with Israel] to prevent its implementation.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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That quote does not address my post.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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That quote demolishes you.


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## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

1948 Mandate Palestine.
1.35 million Arabs.
650,000 Jews.
One person;One Vote?
Israel doesn't exist (outside Manhattan)


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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I got demolished by an irrelevant quote?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> 1948 Mandate Palestine.
> 1.35 million Arabs.
> 650,000 Jews.
> One person;One Vote?
> Israel doesn't exist (outside Manhattan)



Syria, Lebanon, Jordan: 99.9% of Mandate Palestine.  Jews never voted.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Irrelevant only to the tragically clueless, like you.


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
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The Arab world's biggest lie:  "Israel didn't defeat us militarily."


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

hipeter924 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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This discussion was about the 1948 war.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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The Arab world is still humiliated over their military defeat by the infidel Jew.

Moses rules.  Allah sucks


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


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The Parties to the present Agreement, responding to the Security Council resolution of 16 November 1948 calling upon them, as a further provisional measure under Article 40 of the Charter of the United Nations and in order to facilitate the transition from the present truce to permanent peace in Palestine, to negotiate an Armistice; having decided to enter into negotiations under United Nations Chairmanship concerning the implementation of the Security Council resolutions of 4 and 16 November 1948; (2) and having appointed representatives empowered to negotiate and conclude an Armistice Agreement; 

The Avalon Project : Egyptian-Israeli General Armistice Agreement, February 24, 1949

The Security Council,

Having decided on 15 July 1948 that, subject to further decision by the Security Council or the General Assembly, the truce shall remain in force is accordance with resolution 54 (1948) of that date and with resolution 50 (1948) of 29 May 1948 Unto a peaceful adjustment of the future situation of Palestine is reached, 

The Avalon Project : United Nations Security Council Resolution 61; November 4, 1948

There was no surrender. None of those countries lost any land.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
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Complete gibberish.

The only enforceable document is the binding Palestine Mandate that established Palestine in 1922, from Dan to Beersheba and the Jordan River to the Med. Sea as the Jewish homeland.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Yale Law is gibberish?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Yale Law...


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country


The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Following is a list of battles and operations in the 1948 ArabIsraeli war. All of the listed operations were initiated by Israel.

List of battles and operations in the 1948 Arab?Israeli War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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1947 civil war: Initiated by Arabs
1948 War: Initiated by Arabs
1967 War: Initiated by Arabs
1973 War: Initiated by Arabs
2000-2004 Suicide bombings: Initiated by Arabs
Gaza War: Initiated by Arabs

Iran Iraq War, 1 million dead
Lebanese Civil War, 250,000 dead
Algerian Civl War: 300,000 dead
Bangladesh Civil War: 500,000 dead
Yemen Civil Wars
Iraq invades Kuwait
Kuwait expels 400,000 Palestinians
Black Sept., Jordan's King Hussein murders, expells 80,000 Palestinians
Syrian army kills 20,000 Syrians at Hama
Iraq gases Kurds
300 US Marines killed in Beirut
1400 year conflict between Sunnis and Shiites
Fratricide between Hamas and Fatah
Syria/Hizballah assassinate Lebanese PM Rafik Hariri


Alexis de Toqueville...


> Istudied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



Winston Churchill...


> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...



[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288411221&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


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## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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In which of the 28 Articles of the "binding" Palestine Mandate do you find the the Jewish homeland specified as "from Dan to Beersheba and the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

> 1947 civil war: Initiated by Arabs



Who coined the term civil war.

A civil war would have been between two different groups of Palestinians. The 1947 war was between the Palestinians and foreigners.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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Read the entire document and you'll learn.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> > 1947 civil war: Initiated by Arabs
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Jews are the true Palestinians given the Romans renamed Judea, the correct historical geographic name of the land of the Jews, "Palaestina" 1500 years after Jews had lived on the land and 500 years before Arabs arrived.

That would make Jews the indigenous population and Arabs, who originated from Arabia, the foreigners.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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> > > 1947 civil war: Initiated by Arabs
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So Jews were the only people living in Palestine then?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Jews are the only surviving people.

The correct historical geographic name of the land is Canaan and Judea, as in "Jewish," which derives from Judea.

Palestine was invented by the Romans 1500 years after Jews arrived.

Arabs arrived from Arabia 2000 years after Jews. 

Your history lesson for the day


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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So, before the Arabs arrived Jews were the only people living in Palestine?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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There was no "Palestine" then, which was invented by the Romans.  The correct historical name is Canaan and Judea.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Changing a name changes all the people living there?


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Marc aint too bright. And he doesn't like to answer any questions. Mostly because he can't defend his position.
Hey asshole, just because there was no "palestine" country doesn't mean people didn't live there before 1948. I know, you don't care, israel has a GDP of...


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## docmauser1 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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No palestinians® had been living there, of course.


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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So palestine was deserted land before 1948?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
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Jews lived "there" first.  

Now, you know.


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
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Like you even know anything. So prior to 1948, there weren't any arabs in palestine?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
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Palestine was invented by the Romans, who were not Semitic, and does not exist in the Hebrew Bible, Christian Bible, the Quran or in any historical documents of the Biblical era.

The correct historical geographic name of the land is Judea, as in land of the Jews.  Jews lived in Judea for 500 years before Arabs and Muslims.

Your history lesson for the day


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

So when a new flag is raised over city hall everyone leaves and a whole new population moves in?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> So when a new flag is raised over city hall everyone leaves and a whole new population moves it?



Fakestinians never had a flag.  Fakestinians stole it from Jordan, dropped the star and the Fakestinians made it their own.

Everything about the Fakestinians is fake.

Former PLO Leader Zuheir Mohsen...


> The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.


Zuheir Mohsen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Arab American Journalist Joe Farah...


> There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc. Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of 1 percent of the landmass.
> 
> Palestine has never existed -- before or since -- as an autonomous entity. It was ruled alternately by Rome, by Islamic and Christian crusaders, by the Ottoman Empire and, briefly, by the British after World War I. The British agreed to restore at least part of the land to the Jewish people as their homeland.


Myths of the Middle East


Arab Commentator Azmi Bishara...


> Well, I dont think there is a Palestinian nation at all. I think there is an Arab nation. I always thought so and I did not change my mind. I do not think there is a Palestinian nation, I think its a colonialist invention - Palestinian nation. When were there any Palestinians? Where did it come from? I think there is an Arab nation. I never turned to be a Palestinian nationalist, despite of my decisive struggle against the occupation. I think that until the end of the 19th century, Palestine was the south of Greater Syria.


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3n5-yG-6dU[/ame]


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
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I stump you?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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Hun, were you always brain dead or did the doctor just stomp on your head because you are so fugly?


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

*So palestine was deserted land before 1948?
*

Can't answer the question?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> *So palestine was deserted land before 1948?
> *
> 
> Can't answer the question?



You're ill-equipped to form a coherent thought, hun.  Maybe, when you sober up, you'll have better luck.

Palestine was invented by the Romans.  It doesn't actually exist.


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > *So palestine was deserted land before 1948?
> ...



Did I just stump Mr Knowitall? Does that mean I win?

PS The romans can't have invented something that doesn't exist. You can't invent nothing. Although you're trying real hard!


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
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Hun, cite for us where Palestine is referenced in the Hebrew Bible, Christian Bible or the Quran.

I'll make it easy for you, hun, cite any historical document or archaeological artifact from ancient times referencing Palestine.

Take the week if you need the time, hun


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
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So palestine was deserted land before 1948?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
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This Palestine, hun?...
Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable.  For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria].  For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.




You're not the brightest bulb on Broadway, eh, hun?


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
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a jew, figures.

So palestine was deserted land before 1948?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
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You like when I bitch slap you, hun?

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable.  For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria].  For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.


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## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

1948 Palestine.
1.35 million Arabs
650,000 Jews
One person, one vote?
No Jewish State of Israel.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> 1948 Palestine.
> 1.35 million Arabs
> 650,000 Jews
> One person, one vote?
> No Jewish State of Israel.



Syria, Lebanon and Jordan = 99.9% of Mandate Palestine.
Jews could not vote.


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
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So they didn't lose?

I was at Cairo West AB in Egypt in 1995.  I saw buildings that had been destroyed by the IAF in 1967 during the Six-Day War.


> Israel's first, and most important, move was to attack the Egyptian Air Force. It was by far the largest and the most modern of all the Arab air forces, sporting about 385 aircraft, all of them Soviet-built and relatively new.
> 
> Of particular concern were the 45 TU-16 Badger medium bombers, capable of inflicting heavy damage to Israeli military and civilian centers. On June 5 at 7:45 Israeli time, as air alarms sounded all over Israel, the Israeli Air Force left the skies of Israel, sending all but a handful of its jets in a mass attack against Egypt's airfields. Egyptian defensive infrastructure was extremely poor, and no airfields were yet equipped with armored bunkers capable of protecting Egypt's warplanes in the event of an attack. The Israelis employed a mixed attack strategy; bombing and strafing runs against the planes themselves, and tarmac-shredding penetration bombs for the runways that rendered them unusable, leaving any undamaged planes unable to take off, helpless targets for the next wave. The attack was successful beyond the wildest dreams of its planners, destroying virtually all of the Egyptian Air Force on the ground with few Israeli casualties, and guaranteeing Israeli air superiority during the rest of the war.



And what happened on the ground?



> The northernmost Israeli division, consisting of three brigades and commanded by Israel Tal, one of Israel's most prominent armor commanders, found itself slowly advancing through the Gaza strip and El-Arish, which were not heavily protected. The central division (Avraham Yoffe) and the southern division (Ariel Sharon), however, entered the heavily defended Abu-Ageila-Kusseima region. Egyptian forces there included one infantry division (the 2nd), a battalion of tank destroyers and a tank regiment.
> At that moment, Sharon initiated an attack, precisely planned and carried out. He sent out two of his brigades to the north of Um-Katef, the first one ordered to break through the defenses at Abu-Ageila to the south, and the second to block the road to El-Arish and to encircle Abu-Ageila from the east. At the same time, a paratrooper force was landed that destroyed the artillery, preventing it from engaging Israeli armor. Combined forces of armor, paratroopers, infantry, artillery and engineers attacked the Egyptian disposition from the front flanks and rear, cutting the enemy off. The breakthrough battles which were in sandy areas and minefields, continued for 3 and-a-half days until Abu-Ageila fell.
> Many of the Egyptian units remained intact and could be scrambled to prevent Israeli units from reaching the Suez Canal or engage in heavy combat in the attempt to reach the canal. However, when the Egyptian Minister of Defense, Field Marshal Abdel Hakim Amer heard about the fall of Abu-Ageila, he panicked and ordered all units in the Sinai to retreat. *This order effectively meant the defeat of Egypt.*.


As a result of the war:


> By June 10, Israel had completed its last offensive, the one in the Golan Heights. On the following day, a cease-fire was signed. *Israel had seized the Gaza Strip, the Sinai Peninsula, the West Bank of the Jordan River(including East Jerusalem), and the Golan Heights. Overall, Israel's territory grew by a factor of 4*, including about one million Arabs placed under Israel's direct control in the newly captured territories. Israel's strategic depth grew to at least 300 kilometers in the south, 60 kilometers in the east and 20 kilometers of extremely rugged terrain in the north, a security asset that would prove useful in the 1973 Arab-Israeli War six years later.



History itself proves you wrong.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Ah, the topic was the 1948 war.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
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The '48 war initiated by the Arabs.


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## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

You're confusing two different wars.
One in 1948 and the other in 1967.

I also couldn't help noticing you left out one event of 8 June 1967?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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Those countries went into Palestine to defend them from the foreigners.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Except, Palestine did not exist to Arabs.  D'oh!  

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable.  For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria].  For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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Jews are the original Palestinians.  The Romans renamed Judea, the correct historical name of the land, "Palaestina" 1500 years after Jews lived on the land and 500 years before Arabs lived there.

Ooops.


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
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And now it's the 1967 war, wherein Israel kicked the Arab world's ass and gained territory.  

I know you really don't want to acknowledge this, but too damn bad.


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> You're confusing two different wars.
> One in 1948 and the other in 1967.


You useful idiots never want to discuss the '67 war.  Why is that?


georgephillip said:


> I also couldn't help noticing you left out one event of 8 June 1967?


Your flailing, pathetic attempt at deflection is noted and dismissed.

Besides, you hate America.  Why do you give a shit about the _Liberty_?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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It was still their country no matter what it was called.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Except, Jews lived in "Palestine" 2000 years before Muslims, who originated from Arabia.

Facts for you are inconveneint things, right?


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Are all those blond, blue eyed Palestinians Arabs?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Are all those Arabs with surnames al-Masri (The Egyptian) and Maghrebi (Maghreb, Africa) Palestinians?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Palestinians are Arabs.  They even speak Arabic.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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Are all Americans English? That is the language we speak.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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All Pallies are Arab, though, Arabs didn't call themselves Pallies until 1967.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...


> The Palestinian Arabs' basic sense of corporate historic identity was, at different levels, Muslim or Arab or -- for some -- Syrian; it is significant that even by the end of the Mandate in 1948, after 30 years of separate Palestinian political existence, there were virtually no books in Arabic on the history of Palestine.


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Middle-East-Bernard-Lewis/dp/0684832801/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1288529772&sr=8-5]Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


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So?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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So, you're clueless about the subject matter.  For this reason, you have zero reputational points and described as a troll


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
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You play the name game like it actually means something.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Marc39 said:
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Your own page here says you're a troll.  That makes me guilty of feeding a troll.  Guilty, as charged.


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

So palestine was deserted land before 1948?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> So palestine was deserted land before 1948?



The Palestine that doesn't exist, hun?  You believe in Never Never Land, too, hun?

Former PLO Leader Zuheir Mohsen...


> The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.


Zuheir Mohsen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Arab American Journalist Joe Farah...


> There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc. Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of 1 percent of the landmass.
> 
> Palestine has never existed -- before or since -- as an autonomous entity. It was ruled alternately by Rome, by Islamic and Christian crusaders, by the Ottoman Empire and, briefly, by the British after World War I. The British agreed to restore at least part of the land to the Jewish people as their homeland.


Myths of the Middle East


Arab Commentator Azmi Bishara...


> Well, I dont think there is a Palestinian nation at all. I think there is an Arab nation. I always thought so and I did not change my mind. I do not think there is a Palestinian nation, I think its a colonialist invention - Palestinian nation. When were there any Palestinians? Where did it come from? I think there is an Arab nation. I never turned to be a Palestinian nationalist, despite of my decisive struggle against the occupation. I think that until the end of the 19th century, Palestine was the south of Greater Syria.


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3n5-yG-6dU[/ame]


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

ok troll, then was the land that israel sits on deserted land before 1948?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> ok troll, then was the land that israel sits on deserted land before 1948?



That would be Israel, hun.  Jews own Israel.

Get it, now, hun?


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > ok troll, then was the land that israel sits on deserted land before 1948?
> ...



So you're too embarassed to admit that people lived there before 1948. Check. 

You know, you're not a very positive voice for israel, so you're not helping things. Maybe you should consider shutting the fuck up?


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
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Illegal aliens live on sovereign Israeli land, hun.  Newsflash for you, dimwit.


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## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
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If you're so afraid of disagreement, might I suggest Stormfront?  I understand there are a lot of people there that share your irrational hatred.


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## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
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> > Marc39 said:
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I'm saying the dude's an obnoxious little man, not helping israel, that's for sure.


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## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Hun, your sheer ignorance of the subject matter is nonpareil.  But, it's fun smacking you around like a cheap ho.


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...


Considering you want to see Israel vaporized, your concern is less than compelling.


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



I didn't say i wanted to see it vaporized, just that it's going to be vaporized.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Your brain is vaporinzed, hun.   Those trimester abortions suck, right, hun?


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Can someone please translate this into english?


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...


Uh huh.  Next time say it without salivating.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Hun, you're out of gas.  Sputter away, hun.


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

I'll be thinking of you when israel gets vaporized.


----------



## Urbanguerrilla (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



Thats right, and when arabic culture spread the Palestinian Jews became Palestinian arabs and adopted Islam and now they are being dispossessed by American and Russian Jews.

Ooops.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> I'll be thinking of you when israel gets vaporized.



You forgot to take your antidepressives, hun.   Sux to look at your ugly face in the mirror, right?


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> I'll be thinking of you when israel gets vaporized.


That's nice.  Run along now to Stormfront, scumbag.


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > I'll be thinking of you when israel gets vaporized.
> ...



I'll pray for you when israel gets vaporized.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Missy, it is depressing for you to be so ugly and have no friends, right?


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...


Does Satan answer your prayers?


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Marc, I'll try to make sure that your land goes to a nice arab family.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



You'll still have an ugly face and no friends.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > 1948 Palestine.
> ...


And billions of Chinese couldn't vote either, Edwin.

In the land between the Mediterranean Sea and Jordan River circa 1948 CE 1.35 million Arabs would have outvoted 650,000 Jews, and a Jewish Homeland in the middle of all that Arab oil would have been impossible.

You're swirling the drain, Ed...

Hold your breath.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Syria, Lebanon and Jordan = 99.9% of Mandate Palestine.  Jews could not vote.

It says on your page that you suck off goats.  Do you not like camels, too?


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > You're confusing two different wars.
> ...


I hate rich American hypocrites like Ronald Reagan and Lyndon Johnson not the country they allegedly "represented."

Maybe you're aware of the two rescue attempts of Liberty launched by Rear Admiral Lawrence Geis?

"*U.S. rescue attempts*: At least two rescue attempts were launched from U.S. aircraft carriers nearby but were recalled, according to the Liberty's senior Naval Security Group officer, Lieutenant Commander *David Lewis*. 

"Lewis made an audio recording and later wrote about a meeting 6th Fleet Rear Admiral Lawrence Geis requested in his cabins:

"'He told me that since I was the *senior Liberty survivor on board* he wanted to tell me in confidence what had actually transpired. 

"'He told me that upon receipt of our SOS, aircraft were launched to come to our assistance and then Washington was notified. 

"'He said that the Secretary of Defense (Robert McNamara) had ordered that the aircraft be returned to the carrier, which was done. 

"'RADM Geis then said that he speculated that Washington may have suspected that the aircraft carried nuclear weapons so he put together another flight of conventional aircraft that had no capability of carrying nuclear weapons. 

"'These he launched to assist us and again notified Washington of his actions. 

"'*Again McNamara ordered the aircraft recalled*. 

"'He requested confirmation of the order being unable to believe that Washington would let us sink. 

"'*This time President Johnson ordered the recall with the comment that he did not care if every man drowned and the ship sank, but that he would not embarrass his allies.* 

"'This is, to the best of my ability, what I recall transpiring 30 years ago.'"

You're probably too badly brain-damaged/washed to appreciate how much your service means to hypocrites like LBJ (or the Gipper); however, others may yet see where the loyalty of the rich and their political handmaidens truly lies.

USS Liberty - Wiki


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


Like the fact that two out of three potential voters in 1948 Mandate Palestine were NOT Jews?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Like Jews didn't vote on 99.9% of Mandate Palestine and 99.9% of the Ottoman Empire gong to the sand rats.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


Might I suggest your irrational ignorance of Zionism is something you should fear and correct:

"Zionist factions competed for the honor of allying to Hitler. By 1940-41, the 'Stern Gang,' among them *Yitzhak Shamir*, later Prime Minister of Israel, presented the Nazis with the 'Fundamental Features of the Proposal of the *National Military Organization* in Palestine (Irgun Zvai Leumi) Concerning the Solution of the Jewish Question in Europe and the Participation of the *NMO* in the *War on the Side of Germany*.'"

51 Docs


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


Are you proud of your racism, Edwin.

Are "sand rats" less than kosher?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Who's racist, needle dick?
Quran 5:51...


> O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians as friends.  They are but friends to one another. And if any amongst you takes them as friends, then surely he is one of them.


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> You're probably too badly brain-damaged/washed to appreciate how much your service means to hypocrites like LBJ (or the Gipper); however, others may yet see where the loyalty of the rich and their political handmaidens truly lies.


Yeah, yeah, you're the only intelligent American.  

On what evidence do you base this ridiculous opinion?  You've never presented any.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

"The combined air and sea attack *killed 34 crew members* (naval officers, seamen, two Marines, and one civilian), *wounded 170 crew members,* and severely damaged the ship.[3] At the time, the ship was in international waters north of the Sinai Peninsula.."

"...This time *President Johnson* ordered the recall with the comment that he *did not care if every man drowned and the ship sank,* but that he would not embarrass his allies.

Embarrassing evidence or ridiculous opinion?

USS Liberty - Wiki


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

You're deflecting, George, and quite transparently.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

What do you mean by "evidence?"


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "The combined air and sea attack *killed 34 crew members*


*

No love for the 300 Marines massacred by the Hizballah jihadists in Beirut whose dick you suck?*


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> What do you mean by "evidence?"



Evidence that you're the only intelligent American, dumbass.


----------



## daveman (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > "The combined air and sea attack *killed 34 crew members*
> ...


*
*


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

It doesn't require much intelligence to notice

War is a Racket

"The normal profits of a business concern in the United States are six, eight, ten, and sometimes twelve percent. But war-time profits &#8211; ah! that is another matter &#8211; twenty, sixty, one hundred, three hundred, and even eighteen hundred per cent &#8211; the sky is the limit. All that traffic will bear.

"*Uncle Sam has the money. Let's get it*.

"Of course, it isn't put that crudely in war time. It is dressed into speeches about patriotism, love of country, and "we must all put our shoulders to the wheel," but the profits jump and leap and skyrocket &#8211; and are safely pocketed. Let's just take a few examples:

"Take our friends the du Ponts, the powder people &#8211; didn't one of them testify before a Senate committee recently that their powder won the war? Or saved the world for democracy? Or something? How did they do in the war? They were a patriotic corporation. 

"Well, the average earnings of the du Ponts for the period 1910 to 1914 were $6,000,000 a year. It wasn't much, but the du Ponts managed to get along on it. 

"Now let's look at their average yearly profit during the war years, 1914 to 1918. Fifty-eight million dollars a year profit we find! Nearly ten times that of normal times, and the profits of normal times were pretty good. 

"*An increase in profits of more than 950 per cent.*"

Wouldn't it require exceptional stupidity to avoid the connection between war and private fortunes?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> It doesn't require much intelligence to notice
> 
> War is a Racket
> 
> ...



George hides under his bed if he hears thunder.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

daveman said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


*
Operation Peace for Galilee

"On June 6, 1982, a massive Israeli expeditionary force began the long expected invasion, Operation 'Peace for Galilee,' a phrase 'which sounds as if it comes directly out of the pages of 1984,' as one Israeli commentator wrote:

"Only in the language of 1984 is war-peace and warfare-humane. One may mention, of course, that only in the Orwellian language of 1984 can occupation be liberal, and there is indeed a connection between the 'liberal occupation' [the Labor Party boast] and a war which equals peace." 

I'm sure we all remember who was in the White House when the Marines were in Lebanon?*


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 7, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > It doesn't require much intelligence to notice
> ...


George doesn't pay other people to kill his neighbors' children.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 7, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



George sucks ass of the jihadists who murder thousands of children in Darfur.


> The genocide in Darfur has claimed 400,000 lives and displaced over 2,500,000 people. More than one hundred people continue to die each day; five thousand die every month.
> 
> Since February 2003, the Sudanese government in Khartoum and the government-sponsored Janjaweed militia have used rape, displacement, organized starvation, threats against aid workers and mass murder. Violence, disease, and displacement continue to kill thousands of innocent Darfurians every month.


Genocide in Darfur, Sudan | Darfur Scorecard
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DcFs4NSDT0[/ame]


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



marc is still growing up.


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


You aren't even a terrorist yet, too cowardly to join Hamas to kill the Jews, typical.


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

hipeter924 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...



hipeter can only reply with juvenile insults. He's still growing up as well.


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 8, 2010)

Jews spend the day in Gaza.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2eLFtfeowY[/ame]


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> hipeter924 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...


Still in Hamas terrorist training college?


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

hipeter924 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > hipeter924 said:
> ...



case in point.


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 8, 2010)

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ide9yJXrbk[/ame]


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 8, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ide9yJXrbk


She looks even uglier than Roachel Cockroach, I hope this isn't a continuing trend or I know who is going there next:


----------



## daveman (Nov 8, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> It doesn't require much intelligence to notice
> 
> War is a Racket
> 
> ...





georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > Marc39 said:
> ...


And George continues flinging poo, desperately hoping something will stick.


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 8, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > It doesn't require much intelligence to notice
> ...


He still pees in a bucket, Osama won't give him anything else, the toilet facilities are limited in a cave.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> hipeter924 said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Hun, your own page says you're a worthlesss troll.  You have self esteem issues, hun?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Missy, ready for another bitch slapping, today?


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 8, 2010)

Does the money "Princeton" Marc's donates to Darfur ease his conscience over Zionist mistreatment of Arabs in Area C and Gaza?

How many pieces of silver does Marc earn from the administrative ethnic cleansing of Arabs?


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

*Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*

Nazis had ovens, jews have nukes.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*
> 
> Nazis had ovens, jews have nukes.



Missy is a brainless troll.

Muslim Wars, just a brief sampling...
Ongoing genocide in Darfur and southern Sudan, 4 million killed
Iran Iraq War, 1 million dead
Lebanese Civil War, 250,000 dead
Algerian Civl War: 300,000 dead
Bangladesh Civil War: 500,000 dead
Yemen Civil Wars
Iraq invades Kuwait
Kuwait expels 400,000 Palestinians
Black Sept., Jordan's King Hussein murders, expells 80,000 Palestinians
Syrian army kills 20,000 Syrians at Hama
Iraq gases Kurds
300 US Marines killed in Beirut
1400 year conflict between Sunnis and Shiites
Fratricide between Hamas and Fatah
Syria/Hizballah assassinate Lebanese PM Rafik Hariri

Winston Churchill...


> The coming into being of a Jewish state in Palestine is an event in world history to be viewed in the perspective, not of a generation or a century, but in the perspective of a thousand, two thousand or even three thousand years" "This is an event in world history


 
Alexis de Toqueville...


> Istudied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



Winston Churchill...



> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...



[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288411221&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

Marc, I don't read your posts, just thought you'd like to know.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc, I don't read your posts, just thought you'd like to know.



Hun, you read every word I post.

Hun, another day for you being ugly and having no friends.  Have a nice day.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*
> 
> Nazis had ovens, jews have nukes.


About 240 nukes and a "Samson" complex.

Have you ever wondered what the global impact would be from  Civil War in Israel?


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> Marc, I don't read your posts, just thought you'd like to know.



You're not missing anything.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*
> ...



*Muslim wars and genocides, brief sampling*...
Ongoing genocide in Darfur and southern Sudan, 4 million killed
Iran Iraq War, 1 million dead
Lebanese Civil War, 250,000 dead
Algerian Civl War: 300,000 dead
Bangladesh Civil War: 500,000 dead
Yemen Civil Wars
Iraq invades Kuwait
Kuwait expels 400,000 Palestinians
Black Sept., Jordan's King Hussein murders, expells 80,000 Palestinians
Syrian army kills 20,000 Syrians at Hama
Iraq gases Kurds
300 US Marines killed in Beirut
1400 year conflict between Sunnis and Shiites
Fratricide between Hamas and Fatah
Syria/Hizballah assassinate Lebanese PM Rafik Hariri

Winston Churchill...


> The coming into being of a Jewish state in Palestine is an event in world history to be viewed in the perspective, not of a generation or a century, but in the perspective of a thousand, two thousand or even three thousand years" "This is an event in world history



Alexis de Toqueville...


> I studied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



Winston Churchill...



> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288411221&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*
> ...



Arabs nuke jews, jews retaliate and nuke arabs. Global consequence? World peace.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Missy, you're as dumb as a rock.

Muslim Bloodbath 
Ongoing genocide in Darfur and southern Sudan, 4 million killed
Iran Iraq War, 1 million dead
Lebanese Civil War, 250,000 dead
Algerian Civl War: 300,000 dead
Bangladesh Civil War: 500,000 dead
Yemen Civil Wars
Iraq invades Kuwait
Kuwait expels 400,000 Palestinians
Black Sept., Jordan's King Hussein murders, expells 80,000 Palestinians
Syrian army kills 20,000 Syrians at Hama
Iraq gases Kurds
300 US Marines killed in Beirut
1400 year conflict between Sunnis and Shiites
Fratricide between Hamas and Fatah
Syria/Hizballah assassinate Lebanese PM Rafik Hariri


Alexis de Toqueville...


> I studied the Koran a great deal. I came away from that study with the conviction there have been few religions in the world as deadly to men as that of Muhammad. So far as I can see, it is the principal cause of the decadence so visible today in the Muslim world and, though less absurd than the polytheism of old, its social and political tendencies are in my opinion to be feared, and I therefore regard it as a form of decadence rather than a form of progress in relation to paganism itself.



Winston Churchill...



> How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
> 
> The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
> 
> ...



[ame=http://www.amazon.com/River-War-Sir-Winston-Churchill/dp/1598184253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1288411221&sr=8-1]Amazon.com: The River War (9781598184259): Sir Winston S. Churchill: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 8, 2010)

"*It was anti-Semitism  alone  that generated Zionism.*

"Herzl could not ground his movement in anything positively Jewish. Although he sought the support of the rabbis, he personally was not devout. 

"He had no special concern for Palestine, the ancient homeland; he was quite eager to accept the Kenya Highlands, at least on a temporary basis. 

"He had no interest in Hebrew; he saw his Jewish state as a linguistic Switzerland. 

"*He had to think of race, for it was in the air*;..."

Theodor Hetzl was so unconcerned with religion that he proposed an atheist, Max Nordau, to succeed him.

"Again, the disciple was less liberal than the master. Nordau was married to a Christian, and was afraid that his wife would be resented by the Orthodox among the ranks. [2] 

"He was already married when he converted to Zionism and, despite his own Gentile wife, he soon became a confirmed Jewish racist. 

"On 21 December 1903 he gave an interview to Eduard Drumonts rabid anti-Semitic newspaper, La Libre Parole, in which he said that *Zionism wasnt a question of religion, but exclusively of race,* and 'there is no one with whom I am in greater agreement on this point than M. Drumont'.

Today in the "Holy Land" Arabs serve the Zionist purpose the same way Jews served Hitler's.

Except Hitler never had 240 nuclear weapons.

Zionism in the age...


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "*It was anti-Semitism  alone  that generated Zionism.*
> 
> marxists.



Bogus website.  Marxists are criminals.


----------



## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



I agree.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



I agree you're as dumb as a rock and ugly, too.

Oh, Allah, Kill all Americans And Jews...
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7rls9eRKyo[/ame]


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 8, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > "*It was anti-Semitism  alone  that generated Zionism.*
> ...


Few Israeli Marxists are getting rich from the occupations of Area C and Gaza.

How much of the money you donate to Darfur comes from ethnic cleansing in the "Holy Land?"

Don't you ever feel a little like a hypocrite?

Or worse...


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Marc39 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...



Jews occupy Israel, dummy  

The League of Nations agreed...


> Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country


 
Allah agrees...
Quran 5:20-21...


> Remember Moses said to his people: 'O my people! Recall in remembrance the favor of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples. O my people! Enter the holy land which Allah hath assigned unto you, and turn not back ignominiously, for then will ye be overthrown, to your own ruin.


 
Barack Obama agrees...:


> Israel is a sovereign state, and the historic homeland of the Jewish people.
> 
> It should be clear to all that efforts to chip away at Israel's legitimacy will only be met by the unshakeable opposition of the United States.  The slaughter of innocent Israelis is not resistance -- it's injustice


Remarks by the President to the United Nations General Assembly | The White House


Winston Churchill agreed...: 


> The Jews had Palestine before that indigenous population [the Arabs] came in and inhabited it


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Churchill-Jews-Friendship-Martin-Gilbert/dp/0805078800]Amazon.com: Churchill and the Jews: A Lifelong Friendship (9780805078800): Martin Gilbert: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

The US Congress agrees...

The United States Congressional Record
1922 HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 
NATIONAL HOME FOR THE JEWISH PEOPLE JUNE 30, 1922 
HOUSE RESOLUTION 360 - UNANIMOUSLY ADOPTED


> Palestine of today, the land we now know as Palestine, was peopled by the Jews from the dawn of history until the Roman era. It is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. They were driven from it by force by the relentless Roman military machine and for centuries prevented from returning. At different periods various alien people succeeded them but the Jewish race had left an indelible impress upon the land.
> 
> Today it is a Jewish country. Every name, every landmark, every monument and every trace of whatever civilization remaining there is still Jewish. And it has ever since remained a hope, a longing, as expressed in their prayers for these nearly 2,000 years. No other people has ever claimed Palestine as their national home. No other people has ever shown an aptitude or indicated a genuine desire to make it their homeland. The land has been ruled by foreigners. Only since the beginning of the modern Zionist effort may it be said that a creative, cultural, and economic force has entered Palestine. The Jewish Nation was forced from its natural home. It did not go because it wanted to.
> 
> ...


[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0688123635/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0688123627&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0HX00TRZAFXPP1PG6MNR]Amazon.com: Israel: A History (9780688123635): Martin Gilbert: Books[/ame]


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## daveman (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


Agreeing with your own posts is a profound way of announcing, "I'm pathetic!"

You tried to give yourself rep, too, didn't you?


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## docmauser1 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > _Have you ever wondered what the global impact would be from  Civil War in Israel?_
> ...


Cool, isn't "world peace" anything my predictably predictable fans and their alter egos are longing for?


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...



Do you agree or disagree? Being juvenile in your response without dealing with the topic does not make you a man.


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## daveman (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
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I disagree, of course, as any normal person would.  It's an astoundingly moronic and simple-minded statement.  There are more causes for conflict in the world than Israel and Arabs.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
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I agree your own page describes you as a worthless troll.  No surprise, there, right?


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



Ok, like what? The conflict in palestine has drawn in a ton of countries, like the US, Canada, France, England, Spain, Netherlands, Poland, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, and was the cause for 9/11, subway bombings in Spain and England. Did I forget some?
What other conflict has drawn anywhere near as many countries?


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
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Hun, do you know more about al Qaeda than bin Laden?  You're as dumb as a rock.

Osama bin Laden...


> Offensive Jihad is an established and basic tenet of this religion. It is a religious duty rejected only by the most deluded. Divine foundations that are built upon hating the infidels, repudiating them with tongue and teeth till they embrace Islam or pay the jizya with willing submission and humility. The Prophet was "sent in the final hours with the sword so that none is worshipped but Allah alone, partnerless.


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

marc, what does al-qaeda and sammy have to do with what I'm talking about. Be a man and join the discussion or I go back to ignoring you.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> marc, what does al-qaeda and sammy have to do with what I'm talking about. Be a man and join the discussion or I go back to ignoring you.



Hun, you're as dumb as you are ugly.

Your own page describes you as a worthless troll.   I concur.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > MelissaD said:
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Hun, bin Laden has stated what drives him.   Your skull is filled with doo doo.

Osama bin Laden...


> Those who want people to worship the lord of the people, without following that doctrine, will be following the doctrine of Muhammad, peace be upon him.
> 
> I was ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah, and his prophet Muhammad.


washingtonpost.com


You like being bitch slapped by me, hun?


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

You like to think you're bitch slapping me go right ahead. 

I bet all israeli men are wife beaters.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> You like to think you're bitch slapping me go right ahead.
> 
> I bet all israeli men are wife beaters.



I bet all Muslims kill their own wives and children.  You suck them off, hun. 
"We Desire Death Like You Desire Life"
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INf4-DRJlUs[/ame]


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

I don't know where you get the idea that I like arabs or muslims, but if that floats your boat, and since all you have are your petty attempted insults, go for it.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> I don't know where you get the idea that I like arabs or muslims, but if that floats your boat, and since all you have are your petty attempted insults, go for it.



Hun, did someone hit you with an ugly stick?


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

*Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
* Not at this board there's not.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> * Not at this board there's not.



Hun, who are the Nazis, you dumb slut?

"Oh, Allah, Kill All Americans And Jews"
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7rls9eRKyo[/ame]


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

*Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*

nazis had WAY better food.


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## georgephillip (Nov 8, 2010)

"Zionism did not spring full blown from a void with the creation of the Zionist movement in 1897. 

"Jews had maintained a connection with Palestine, both actual and spiritual, even after the Bar Kochba revolt in 135, when large numbers of Jews were exiled from  Roman Palestine, the remains of their ancient national home.

"The Jewish community in Palestine revived and, under Muslim rule, is estimated to have numbered as many as 300,000 about 1000 AD, prior to the Crusades. 

"*The Crusaders killed most of the Jewish population of Palestine* or forced them into exile, so that only about *1,000 families* remained after the reconquest of Palestine by Saladin. 

"The Jewish community in Palestine waxed and waned with the vicissitudes of conquest and economic hardship, and invitations by different Turkish rulers to displaced European Jews to settle in Tiberias and Hebron. 

"At different times there were sizeable Jewish communities in Tiberias, Safed, Hebron and Jerusalem, and numbers of Jews living in Nablus and Gaza.  

"A few original Jews remained in the town of Peki'in, families that had lived there continuously since ancient times."

Zionism and...


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?*
> 
> nazis had WAY better food.



Slut, your page says you're a worthless troll.  Ugly, too.  

Warren Buffett, Multi-Billion Dollar Purchase of Successful Israeli Company...


> Israel is exceptional.  I can give you an absolute, unequivocal answer.  You can go around the world and it's very impressive to see a country of 7 million create a business like this, I haven't seen anything like this in the US.
> 
> When you think about it, if you compare Israel (now) to 1948, it's very, very impressive.  It's a remarkable place


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV3W_86NTYA[/ame]


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## MelissaD (Nov 8, 2010)

*Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
* nazis weren't all inbred.


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## Marc39 (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> *Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
> * nazis weren't all inbred.



Missy, you enjoy sucking Arab dick, slut?

Warren Buffett...


> Israel is now a major factor in commerce and in the world, and, is a smaller replica of what has been accomplished in the US and I think Americans admire that.  They feel good about a society that is on the move


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaN_2nFqFtI[/ame]


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## daveman (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > MelissaD said:
> ...


Need some help moving the goalposts, you ignorant troll?


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## daveman (Nov 8, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> I don't know where you get the idea that I like arabs or muslims, but if that floats your boat, and since all you have are your petty attempted insults, go for it.



This from an alleged woman who thinks "Jew!!" is the ultimate insult.  

Off to Stormfront with you, skank.


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## MelissaD (Nov 9, 2010)

daveman said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
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As usual, no intelligent thoughts. man, you guys are boring.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 9, 2010)

zionism and nazism, 

Nazism being Socialism, the National Socialist. Nazism was just ordinary German and European people committing murder.

Zionism, had a partial role in the creation of modern day Israel, Israel being the only country in the Middle East that functioned without the western countries doing all the work. 

It is not possible that Palestine could of been ruled by the Arabs during the early 1900's, as it was, they did not have the education or experience running governments, we had our hands full teaching the Arabs how to run a dozen brand new countries, it was a godsend to have Jews able to rule themselves. 

Even with our help the Arabs have proved they are still not ready for self rule after almost a hundred years of freedom, give or take.


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## georgephillip (Nov 9, 2010)

"With the centuries, self-segregation became the hallmark of the Jews. In time the masses came to see mixed marriages as treason to Orthodoxy...If Western Zionism developed in a more secular atmosphere than that of Eastern Europe, the bulk of its members still saw mixed marriage as leading Jews away from community rather than bringing new additions to it"

By the early 20th century hundreds of years of "self segregation" made it easier for some young German Jews to agree with local anti-Semites on several key points:

"...the Jews were not part of the German Volk and, of course, Jews and Germans should not mix sexually, not for the traditional religious reasons, but for the sake of their own unique Blut.(blood) 

"Not being of Teutonic Blut, they perforce had to have their own Boden (soil): Palestine.

Blood and soil.

The same racist core that exterminated 50,000,000 to 70,000,000 human beings during World War II now threatens the entire specie as the abused child grows into an abuser even Hitler would salute.

Zionism in...


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 9, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> zionism and nazism,
> 
> Nazism being Socialism, the National Socialist. Nazism was just ordinary German and European people committing murder.
> 
> ...



Interesting premise on self rule. My first question is how often has that been tried? It seems that there is always a foreign hand involved to the detriment of the people.

Palestine was classified as a class A mandate by the League of Nations meaning it needed almost no help to become an independent state.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 9, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> mdn2000 said:
> 
> 
> > _It is not possible that Palestine could of been ruled by the Arabs during the early 1900's, as it was, they did not have the education or experience running governments, we had our hands full teaching the Arabs how to run a dozen brand new countries, it was a godsend to have Jews able to rule themselves. Even with our help the Arabs have proved they are still not ready for self rule after almost a hundred years of freedom, give or take._
> ...


Having joos, doing all the work, and arabs, doing all freeloading.


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## georgephillip (Nov 9, 2010)

While docdrivel drools Blut and Boden and bullshit.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 9, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > mdn2000 said:
> ...



Before Israel Palestine was a self sufficient country.

Israel came along now we have two countries on welfare.


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## MelissaD (Nov 9, 2010)

*Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
* german women and men are much better looking.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 9, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



You know nothing about Israel nor Palestine. Before Israel Arabs came to Palestine so the Jews could cure their babies disease. The Arabs who came to Palestine and stayed had higher mortality rates, especially amongst the babies.

The Jews saved the Arab babies.


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## daveman (Nov 9, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


Perhaps if the Palestinians cared more about taking care of themselves than about killing Jews, they could prosper.


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## Sunni Man (Nov 9, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
> ...


They just have different priorities than you.


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## daveman (Nov 9, 2010)

Sunni Man said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


Obviously.


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## georgephillip (Nov 9, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
> ...


Who has prospered more since September 29, 2000?

During that time Palestinians have killed 1,072 Israelis while Israel has killed 6,348 Palestinians.

Now tell me why anyone should profit from the killing?

If Americans Knew


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## docmauser1 (Nov 9, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _While docdrivel drools Blut and Boden and bullshit._


Witness the essense of my faithflul following here - no aguments, personal attacks, drivel. There goes a civilized conversation.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 9, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


Funny, that classification meant Palestine never was a "country". But my followers here like to deliberately confuse things, like country, state, legal entity, geographical entity. They want the unsuspecting to believe that entity had been industrialized, with factories, belching smoke, electricity in every home, intensive agriculture, and the population as dense as it is now. Which is, of course, an arabian nights agitprop drivel, confirmed by the Anglo-American Committee in 1946:
"One witnesses in Palestine not merely the impact of European culture upon the East, but also the impact of Western science and Western technology upon a semi-feudal civilization."
And then arab immigrant hordes started pouring in in obscene quantities, like flies on honey.Typical.


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## georgephillip (Nov 9, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > _While docdrivel drools Blut and Boden and bullshit._
> ...


The essence of civilized conversation:

*To be a good Zionist one must be somewhat of an anti-semite*

"Although Blut (blood) was a recurrent theme in pre-Holocaust Zionist literature, it was not as central to its message as Boden (soil). 

"As long as America&#8217;s shores remained open, Europe&#8217;s Jews asked: if anti-Semitism could not be fought on its home ground, why should they not just follow the crowd to America? 

"The Zionist response was double-barrelled: anti-Semitism would accompany the Jews wherever they went and, what was more, it was *the Jews who had created anti-Semitism by their own characteristics.* (How's that for civilized?) 

"The root cause of anti-Semitism, Zionists insisted, was the Jews&#8217; exile existence. Jews lived parasitically off their 'hosts'. There were virtually no Jewish peasants in the Diaspora. 

"The Jews lived in cities, they were alienated from manual labour or, more bluntly, they shunned it and preoccupied themselves with intellectual or commercial concerns. 

"At best, their claims of patriotism were hollow as they wandered eternally from country to country. 

"And when they fancied themselves as socialists and internationalists, in reality they were still no more than the middlemen of the revolution, fighting 'other people&#8217;s battles'. 

"These tenets combined were known as shelilat ha&#8217;galut (the Negation of the Diaspora), and were held by the *entire spectrum of Zionists* who varied only on matters of detail. 

"They were argued vigorously in the Zionist press, where the distinctive quality of many articles was their hostility to the entire Jewish people. Anyone reading these pieces without knowing their source would have automatically assumed that they came from the anti-Semitic press."

Now, lets CHANT TOGETHER...BOGUS, MARXIST, DRIVEL!

Zionism in...


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## docmauser1 (Nov 9, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


Is not having an occupation of dumpster-diving into marxist garbage sites, of course.


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## georgephillip (Nov 9, 2010)

Have you never been homeless?

Dumpster diving is becoming a survival skill for many formerly middle class Americans, and it's far more civil than getting rich from war and occupation.

Is it Marxist or uncivilized to ask if Zionists once believed that Jews created anti-Semitism by their own characteristics?


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## docmauser1 (Nov 9, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _Have you never been homeless? Dumpster diving is becoming a survival skill for many formerly middle class Americans, and it's far more civil than getting rich from war and occupation. Is it Marxist or uncivilized to ask if Zionists once believed that Jews created anti-Semitism by their own characteristics?_


Jurassic drivel.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 10, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
> ...



What is a state and what is not a state is an interesting question. In the "west" Israel is considered a state and Palestine is not. However, Palestine is recognized as a state by several international organizations and 117 countries. Those who recognize Palestine generally consider Israel to be an occupation of Palestine.

There are three basic requirements to be a state.

1) A permanent population commonly called inhabitants.
2) A government created by the inhabitants.
3) Defined borders.

Palestine has a permanent Population.
Palestine has a government.
Palestine has defined borders.

Israel was created without a permanent population.
Israel's government was created by foreigners.
Israel has no borders.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 10, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
> ...



Israel destroyed over 100 factories in Gaza during Cast Lead alone. Israel has bulldozed 1/3 of Gaze's agricultural land and shoots at farmers working their land. Israel has devastated Gaze's fishing industry. Israel will not let the Palestinians export any of their products.

The primary thing that Palestinians can do to take care of themselves is to get rid of Israel.


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## hipeter924 (Nov 10, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
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> > P F Tinmore said:
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Thanks for advocating ethnic cleansing and genocide of Jews.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 10, 2010)

hipeter924 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



I said nothing about Jews.

Salam Fayyad, and others, have said that the settlers can stay as citizens of Palestine. Hamas has stated that the Jews can stay, it is Israel that must go. Prominent "one staters" like Ghada Karmi and Ali Abunimah state that the Jews have the right to live in the holy land.

Killing or expelling Jews is just Israeli propaganda.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 10, 2010)

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTHBOhV7RgM&feature=related[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEbUaxbCnnE&feature=related[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDdPsYjs3jk&feature=related[/ame]


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 10, 2010)

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AY2RMe_cGjo[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jtz4WgyTVk4&feature=related[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cK6nZ_7VPHY&feature=related[/ame]


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## daveman (Nov 10, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


If Palestinians wouldn't kill Israelis, Israelis wouldn't kill Palestinians.


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## MelissaD (Nov 10, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > daveman said:
> ...



If Israelis wouldn't have taken their land, they'd have no reason top kill israelis.


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## georgephillip (Nov 10, 2010)

daveman: 

What about the Zionists and al Nakba?


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## georgephillip (Nov 10, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


In 1948 there were 1.35 million Arabs and 650,000 Jews living in Mandate Palestine.
Arab and Jew had coexisted for centuries in that area with no where near the level of violence we see today.
It seems to me if all Arabs and Jews in Palestine had voted on the creation of a Jewish state in 1948, we would all likely be blogging about another subject today.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 10, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> _If Israelis wouldn't have taken their land,_


Which those "their" had yet to have in the first place, of course.





MelissaD said:


> _they'd have no reason top kill israelis._


Arabs are irrational, it's old news.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 10, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _In 1948 there were 1.35 million Arabs and 650,000 Jews living in Mandate Palestine. Arab and Jew had coexisted for centuries in that area with no where near the level of violence we see today. It seems to me if all Arabs and Jews in Palestine had voted on the creation of a Jewish state in 1948, we would all likely be blogging about another subject today._


Nah, my fans can't drivel about "other subjects".


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## docmauser1 (Nov 10, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


Well, mother nature has generously provided us with dumbass individuals and organizations thereof for the purpose of having a bad reference.





P F Tinmore said:


> _There are three basic requirements to be a state._


Must be interesting.



P F Tinmore said:


> _1) A permanent population commonly called inhabitants._


No permanent population to talk about.


P F Tinmore said:


> _2) A government created by the inhabitants._


There have been no palestinian® government, no palestinian® zsar, no palestinian® culture, no palestinian® history.


P F Tinmore said:


> _3) Defined borders._


Never existed, of course.


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## MikeK (Nov 10, 2010)

Yes.

The Nazis made no effort to conceal their agenda.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 10, 2010)

MikeK said:


> _The Nazis made no effort to conceal their agenda._


Indeed, islamics openly talk about setting the world on fire, and the west refuses to believe it. True.


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## daveman (Nov 10, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman:
> 
> What about the Zionists and al Nakba?


What about the Arabs who told the locals to leave?


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## georgephillip (Nov 10, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > daveman:
> ...


daveman...It's my understanding events like the one a Deir Yassin had a greater effect on Arab migrations than Arab leaders calling for a wide-open battle space.

Between late 1947 when the UN announced its partition plan for Palestine and May of 1948 when the Jewish state was born, a period of civil war existed with multiple atrocities committed by both sides.

As I understand it, the Arab call for clearing away civilians primarily occurred after May 14, 1948 when Israel declared its independence.

"That day, the armies of Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Iraq *invaded the territory partitioned for the Arab state*, thus starting the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. 

"The nascent Israeli Defense Force repulsed the Arab nations from part of the occupied territories, thus extending its borders beyond the original UNSCOP partition.[23] 

"*By December 1948, Israel controlled most of the portion of Mandate Palestine west of the Jordan River*. 

"The remainder of the Mandate consisted of Jordan, the area that came to be called the West Bank (controlled by Jordan), and the Gaza Strip (controlled by Egypt). 

"Prior to and during this conflict, 711,000[24] Palestinians Arabs fled their original lands to become Palestinian refugees, in part, due to an alleged promise from Arab leaders that they would be able to return when the war is won. 

Arab-Israeli conflict


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Yet you do not know who the population consisted of, who populated Israel in 1917.
Palestine had a Turkish government.
Palestine had defined borders, Turkish borders. 

All the governments of the middle east were created by foreigners.

funny, tent people are permanent. They did not travel throughout Syria to water and feed the Camels.


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## MelissaD (Nov 11, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > docmauser1 said:
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So then why not find a solution where everyone can live in peace in the area formerly known as Palestine, which includes all religions and people, where everyone enjoys Jerusalem and the rest of the "holy" land together. Isn't religion supposed to be about peace? Maybe you should all start acting like it.


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## MelissaD (Nov 11, 2010)

LOL@ jillian just neg reppped me for my last post, I guess peace is bad.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> mdn2000 said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


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## MelissaD (Nov 11, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> We did, it is called Israel, appeasement is the problem.
> 
> Arabs, Jews, Moslems, Christians, Druzes, Kurds, Bedouins, and all those I never remembered lived in Israel, or as it was known, Syria.
> 
> Palestine was the name of an area on a map, not the name of a country. Palestine was never a country, a state, a nation, or a county.



So Israel would welcome all muslims, christians... to come live in peace in israel? Is that why they have check points every 10 feet to control everyone's movements so arabs don't come into israel? Is the wall they put up a sign of peace and acceptance of everyone?
Man, do YOU even believe the crap you write?


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> mdn2000 said:
> 
> 
> > We did, it is called Israel, appeasement is the problem.
> ...



Would they welcome all, no, unfortunately under current circumstances, problem being decedents of dead refugees. 

Check points are to prevent suicide bombers. 

Things got all screwed up while Arafat was alive, the Jews have to appease the USA and we in turn appease Saudi Arabia. Not being at home my library is not behind me so just going by memory I think it was Carter who began appeasement, had to be an earlier administration, maybe Johnson. 

Appeasement for decades has created this problem, nothing more, we should of demanded basic human rights in Saudi Arabia years ago.


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## jillian (Nov 11, 2010)

MelissaD said:


> LOL@ jillian just neg reppped me for my last post, I guess peace is bad.



no...dumb as toast anti-semites are bad.

peace is good. and as soon as hamas wants peace, i'm sure they'll have it. but they don't.

now go learn something about this subject other than terrorist supporting propaganda.

until then you're a slug.

feel free to go post on al jazeera or stormfront. i'm sure they'll love you.


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## jillian (Nov 11, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> MelissaD said:
> 
> 
> > mdn2000 said:
> ...



why bother responding to her? that implies she's to be taken seriously. she hasn't a clue what she's talking about.

they're idiots... they think israel shouldn't be able to protect its borders so israeli children can get blown up. 

as for check points every 10 feet, that's a joke and a lie which anyone who's ever been there knows. 

i gurantee the blithering idiot has never been to gaza or the west bank.

unfortunately for her, i have.

muslim CITIZENS of Israel have more freedom than they do in any muslim country. People who aren't CITIZENS... like "palestinians"... who are really jordanian. but jordan doesn't want them...neither does egypt... hence Egypt building a wall... which no one talks about.

but that's because they're anti-semitic trash.


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## georgephillip (Nov 11, 2010)

When did Israel declare formal borders?

Why do the maps Israeli children view in their classrooms reveal Israel stretching from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan River when the UN partition plan "gave" the Zionists only 55% of that land?

Why does the "democratic" state of Israel have a religious symbol on its flag?

Are individuals in Israel required to carry state-issued ID cards that indicate their religion.


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## daveman (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


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Of course that's your understanding -- because it lets you absolve the Arab world of culpability.


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## MelissaD (Nov 11, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


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So if israel doesn't welcome, then it's not a true democracy (and can't fall back on the "human rights" argument), as they only let certain people vote. Being a democratic country isn't just about having several parties.
Plus, real democratic countries don't need checkpoints every 20 feet to stop outsiders from coming in. And real democratic countries don't have people blowing themselves up as a last resort protest.

jillian, the term Semite means a member of any of various ancient and modern Semitic-speaking peoples originating in southwestern Asia, including Akkadians, Canaanites, Phoenicians, Hebrews, Arabs, and Ethiopian Semites. So anti-Semite means ? Against all these peoples including arabs? Just thought you should know.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _When did Israel declare formal borders?_


If we had the will, we'd find that out pretty quick, hadn't we? Respective treaties with Egypt and Jordan did set the borders, the UN cartographers did set the border with Lebanon, and Syria, well, the latter is free to get lost in the dunes among the camels.


georgephillip said:


> _Why do the maps Israeli children view in their classrooms reveal Israel stretching from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan River when the UN partition plan "gave" the Zionists only 55% of that land?_


Because one country (jewish) came into being, while another one (arab) did not, because the very people, for whom it was meant, rejected the whole idea and have been wasting their time on attempts to destroy the first one ever since. Simple.


georgephillip said:


> _Why does the "democratic" state of Israel have a religious symbol on its flag?_


Why does democratic Switzerland have a religious symbol on its flag?


georgephillip said:


> _Are individuals in Israel required to carry state-issued ID cards that indicate their religion._


Nah. See, folks, research does wonders.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> When did Israel declare formal borders?
> 
> Why do the maps Israeli children view in their classrooms reveal Israel stretching from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan River when the UN partition plan "gave" the Zionists only 55% of that land?
> 
> ...



Because the United Nations does not make nations, people do.

Symbol on a flag, same reason the Arab countries put religous symbols on their flags.

I dont know the answer to your last question. I did answer all your third grade questions  though, that ought to make you happy.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

MelissaD said:


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I never said anything about true democracy, true democracy is not as good as a republic. As far as real democratic countries I will have to take your word, I dont know of any true democratic countries and as everyone knows, a republic is the best way to go, thats what makes us strong. Confusion makes us weak.

You have a lot to learn, dont worry though, this is easy stuff for me, I have well over a hundred books on Israel, some dating back to the early nineteenth century.


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## MelissaD (Nov 11, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


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As is the people's republic of China?  
That's what israel should be based on? Isn't it already? lol


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## jillian (Nov 11, 2010)

MelissaD said:


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you don't really think you're going to teach anyone anything, do you?

we all know the common use of the word anti-semite. and it has to do with antipathy toward jews. you know, like what you do.

now run along.

thanks.


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## georgephillip (Nov 11, 2010)

daveman said:


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The degree of blame Arabs bear for the creation of a Jewish homeland in the heart of a region overwhelmingly Arab seems minuscule at most.

Like most of the violence for profit in our world today, culpability for the Arab-Israeli conflict lies with Western powers (read US and England) instigating the original violence by attempting to create a Jewish homeland in Mandate Palestine where only about one in three citizens was Jewish.

Western capitalists then made (and continue to make) vast fortunes from nurturing the violence through a steady flow
of arms and ammunition.

Just another example of War is a Racket.


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## georgephillip (Nov 11, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> georgephillip said:
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The United Nations played a prominent role in the creation of Israel.

"In response to Arab pressure,[19] the British Mandate authorities greatly reduced the number of Jewish immigrants to Palestine (see White Paper of 1939 and the Exodus ship). 

"These restrictions remained in place until the end of the mandate, a period which coincided with the Nazi Holocaust and the flight of Jewish refugees from Europe. 

"As a consequence, *most Jewish entrants to Palestine* were *illegal* (see Aliyah Bet), causing *further tensions* in the region.

"Following several failed attempts to solve the problem diplomatically, *the British asked the newly formed United Nations for help.*

It was the UN appointed committee, *UNSCOP*, that was responsible for recommending a partitioned state with separate territories for Arab and Jew in Palestine.

"This 'two state solution' was accepted with resolution 181 by the *UN General Assembly* in November 1947 by 33 votes to 13 with 10 abstentions.

While Islam incorporates religion and politics in ways the west doesn't (yet), can you name an Arab democracy with a religious symbol on its flag?

The question about the ID card revealing the religion of the person carrying it might be the most important of all as it gets to the heart of whether Israeli Arabs are in fact second class citizens in the Jewish state.

Arab-Israeli conflict - Wiki


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## daveman (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


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Yawn.  You seem to think profit is the only motive for war...again, that lets you absolve the Arab world of culpability.


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## georgephillip (Nov 11, 2010)

What culpability does the Arab world bear for the creation of Israel?

Compared to Harry Truman?

"Sometime in the late 1950s, that world-class gossip and occasional historian, John F. Kennedy, told me how, in 1948, Harry S. Truman had been pretty much abandoned by everyone when he came to run for president. 

"Then an American Zionist brought him *two million dollars in cash, in a suitcase*, aboard his whistle-stop campaign train.

'That's why our recognition of Israel was rushed through so fast.' 

"As neither Jack nor I was an anti-Semite (unlike his father and my grandfather) we took this to be just another funny story about Truman and the serene corruption of American politics."

I don't suppose war qualifies as serene, but it has been the bedrock of corruption for thousands of years before this country came into existence.


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## daveman (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> What culpability does the Arab world bear for the creation of Israel?
> 
> Compared to Harry Truman?
> 
> ...


You're quite the useful tool for terrorists.  But you should be aware they would slit your throat without hesitation if you were in the wrong place at the wrong time, even if you told them how much you support their cause.


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## georgephillip (Nov 11, 2010)

You've met how many "terrorists?" (Outside the US military)


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## daveman (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> You've met how many "terrorists?" (Outside the US military)


I haven't met any.  Especially inside the US military.  But I know what they're like.  And I know who supports them. 

If you don't like me pointing it out, don't support terrorists, dumbass.

Today, of all days, you choose to play that particularly loathsome leftist card?

You're a pathetic, cowardly little piece of shit, aren't you?  Oh, right, we established that months ago.  You lack the courage of your convictions.  You refuse to leave a country you hate.  You won't even go to the local VFW and ask how many there are terrorists.  

Why?

Because you're a coward.  

Yet, there you sit, safe and secure, enjoying the freedom bought and paid for with the blood of men and women better than you, and what do you do with that freedom?  

You call them terrorists.

Fuck you, you cowardly little bitch.


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## georgephillip (Nov 11, 2010)

In the immortal words of Pat Tillman Sr...
"Fuck you and yours!"
S-L-A-V-E


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## daveman (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> In the immortal words of Pat Tillman Sr...
> "Fuck you and yours!"
> S-L-A-V-E


Make me, bitch.

Oh, you can't.  That's because you're a coward.  

Run along, boy.  Felch some more terrorists before they cut your head off.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


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One in three were Jewish, maybe less, that does not make two in three Arab, being this simple one in three is a Jew, one in three is an Arab, one in three is Christian. 

Seems by your post Arabs are the minority.

The USA and England you state created Palestine, What policies by which president, you dont need to be specific I just need to know which years roughly you believe this happened.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 11, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> What culpability does the Arab world bear for the creation of Israel?
> 
> Compared to Harry Truman?
> 
> ...



If you think Truman created or had a hand in creating Israel than you have a difficult argument ahead of you.

Truman at best simply recognized Israel in the United Nations. 

Your posts confuse League of Nations history with United Nations history, if you could clarify yourself or be a bit specific your argument will fall apart.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 12, 2010)

daveman said:


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It was Israel that *went to* Palestine to take over their country. Israel sent its soldiers from neighborhood to town to village driving the Palestinians out of their homes and off their land.

If Israel had not done that, the Palestinians would have no quarrel with them.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 12, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


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How come their are still Arabs left in Israel if they were all drove off.


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## hipeter924 (Nov 12, 2010)

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Hush.  He is still pretending that there is such thing as a Palestinian people, rather than an Arab people. His head would explode if he realized that, let alone that Palestinians live happily within Israel without Hamas or Fatah.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 12, 2010)

georgephillip said:


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The United Nations played no role. They recognized Israel after the fact. The mandate period is before the creation of the United Nations.

The United Nations was created in 1945, thats a long time after the white paper, the Balfour declaration, League of Nations mandates. 

You state the mandate's end coincided with the holocaust, it did not, it ended on On May 14, 1948. The British physically prevented Jews from seeking refugee from entering Palestine, ships literally were sent back to Germany sending the Jews to the holocaust. British immigration policy Palestine under governance by the British sent Jews to their death. 

The British had to fight an armed revolt in Israel, the Jews physically fought a war or revolt inside of Palestine with the British, the British lost control and were forced out by armed Jews fighting for their lives. 

If the British followed the mandate, the Balfour declaration, if the British were just and moral to the Jews, thousands would never of died, maybe millions. How do we know. The British were no friend of the Jews, the Jews rose against them. 

Of course the Zionist were on hand to claim victory and be politicians, the revolt was not the Zionist, it was the people of Israel, that is why it was successful. 

Nobody respects people who do not fight for their nation, that is why all the emphasis is on the Zionist political history and the armed revolt against the British is ignored completely. The Jews gave their lives fighting the British, as the revolt escalated, after the holocaust, the British could not fight the Jews in light of the the worlds attention on the horrors in Germany. 

The British retreated, abandoned Palestine, it was the military reality, that British troops would have to fight a war against the Jews to maintain control of Palestine. 

So its stated here that the British and the USA created Israel yet the British were fighting the Jews to give Palestine to the Arabs, with the understanding they would stay to protect the Jews from the Arabs, it did not work out that way for the British. 

England attempted to make another Arab state, after a dozen new Arab states had been created. 

Israel was not created by England or the United Nations, nor the Zionist.

The flag, how about the Saudi flag, Saudi being the family name, the only country in the world named after a family. Its green, traditional color of Islam. The Arabic writing is the Islamic statement of faith, "There is no God but Allah and Muhammad is his Prophet."

So the flag is no different than Israels, not much of an issue all things considered.

The two state solution, I almost forgot, those who opposed were all the Arab states hence the resolution was never implemented.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 12, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


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It is not without trying. The Palestinians who remained in Israel were shuffled off into ghettos and placed under military guard until 1967 where they received nominal citizenship. Israel still bulldozes Palestinian homes in Israel and many Palestinian villages still have no running water or electricity. Israel is still trying to find political correct methods to eliminate its Palestinian citizens.


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## MelissaD (Nov 12, 2010)

hipeter924 said:


> He is still pretending that there is such thing as a Palestinian people, rather than an Arab people.



Before 1948, there was no such thing as an Israeli either. So what's your point?


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## mdn2000 (Nov 12, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


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Nice bullshit, got a name of the ghettos so I have a bit of reference.

Maybe you can fill us in on the war for independence. I will start, Six Arab nations were part of those who opposed the UN resolution and went to war to prevent partition, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Syria, Trans Jordan (now Jordan), Lebanon, and Egypt. Each defeated thus peace negotiated with each. Is that correct.

So the name of the Ghettos so I can address that and if you know tell us who negotiated on behalf of the Arabs in Palestine. Somebody must of protested, who, when, where. 

Thats ahead of what we are discussing, for we need to know historically how the war ended. How it was fought, against who is very important. So we agree the Jews fought six Arab states.

Quick important fact should be discussed, where did the Jews get the weapons.

Do you know, I ask you, where did the Jews get the weapons they used. I want to see if you know. 

Anyhow I am busy reading, I am traveling and not at home so I am at a disadvantage.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 12, 2010)

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Not really. A truce was called by UN resolution. None of those countries surrendered. There were armistice agreements with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, (Iraq was under Jordanian command) and Egypt. The green line, frequently called '67 borders, was drawn on top of Palestine to define areas of occupation. The green line was specifically not a border. Later the US paid Egypt and Jordan to have peace agreements with Israel.



> So the name of the Ghettos so I can address that and if you know tell us who negotiated on behalf of the Arabs in Palestine. Somebody must of protested, who, when, where.



This is about the one in Jaffa.
------------
Zionist forces initiated a cruel siege on the city of Jaffa in March 1948. The youth of the city formed popular resistance committees to confront the assault. On 14 May 1948, the Bride of the Sea fell to the Zionist military forces; that same evening the leaders of the Zionist movement in Palestine declared the establishment of the state of Israel. Approximately 4,000 of the 120,000 Palestinians managed to remain in their city after it was militarily occupied. They were all rounded up and ghettoized in al-Ajami neighborhood which was sealed off from the rest of the city and administered as essentially a military prison for two subsequent years; the military regime under which Israel governed them lasted until 1966. During this period, al-Ajami was completely surrounded by barbed wire fencing that was patrolled by Israeli soldiers and guard dogs. It was not long before the new Jewish residents of Jaffa, and based on their experience under Nazism in Europe, began to refer to the Palestinian neighborhood as the "ghetto."

ei: Jaffa: from eminence to ethnic cleansing 



> Thats ahead of what we are discussing, for we need to know historically how the war ended. How it was fought, against who is very important. So we agree the Jews fought six Arab states.



Yes but none of them attacked Israel. They went into Palestine and set up defensive positions around Palestinian population centers. This prevented Israel from taking over the entire country. The truce was called by the UN ending the fighting. The war has technically never ended except for Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994)



> Quick important fact should be discussed, where did the Jews get the weapons.
> 
> Do you know, I ask you, where did the Jews get the weapons they used. I want to see if you know.



The main supplier was an eastern European country. Offhand I do not recall the name. 



> Anyhow I am busy reading, I am traveling and not at home so I am at a disadvantage.


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## georgephillip (Nov 12, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


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"By 1948, there were approximately *1.35 million Arabs* and *650,000  Jews* living between the Jordan and the Mediterranean, more Arabs than had ever lived in Palestine before, and more Jews than had lived there since Roman times."

MidEast Web

Britain initiated the colonial project in 1917 with the Balfour Declaration:

"In 1917, the British government issued the Balfour Declaration, which stated that the government viewed favourably 'the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people'... 

"The Declaration was issued as a result of the belief of key members of the government, including Prime Minister Lloyd George, *that Jewish support was essential to winning the war;* however, the declaration caused great disquiet in the Arab world."

Arab - Israeli conflict - Wiki

At the end of World War II the US inherited Britain's colonial project in Palestine of creating a Jewish homeland in a region of the world that was overwhelmingly Arab. 

I believe all US administrations since Truman's have pursued a policy of arming Israel (at US taxpayer expense) while providing blanket diplomatic cover for all Israeli aggression.

It seems like a simple case of following the vast amounts of money that come from arms sales and oil sales and how cost is always socialized while profit becomes the property of the fortunate few.


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## docmauser1 (Nov 12, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> _Zionist forces initiated a cruel siege on the city of Jaffa in March 1948. ...ei: Jaffa: from eminence to ethnic cleansing_


Yeah, "electronicintifada", ..., arab schmucks, ..., bomb-belts, ..., virgins, ..., murder ... . As respectable as an outhouse, of course.


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## P F Tinmore (Nov 12, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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> > _Zionist forces initiated a cruel siege on the city of Jaffa in March 1948. ...ei: Jaffa: from eminence to ethnic cleansing_
> ...



Yeah, yeah, typical slime the source crap.

The Picture shows the Al-Ajami Neighborhood in Jaffa in 1963. The Palestinian Arabs were Boxed and Neglected





Jaffa Affairs 1 and Jaffa Orange


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## georgephillip (Nov 12, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> georgephillip said:
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> 
> > What culpability does the Arab world bear for the creation of Israel?
> ...


Do you think Truman's recognition of Israel contributed in any way to the Jewish state's creation? If Harry's endorsement stemmed from receiving $2 million in cash from an American Zionist during his '48 campaign, would you agree corruption and Harry played big roles in Israel's creation?

Harry "simply" recognized Israel against the advice of his Secretary of State and Secretary of War. Possibly they didn't receive their suitcases from Zion? In the ensuing 62 years their concerns over destablization of the Middle East and interruption of oil deliveries have proven accurate.

Which of my posts have confused League of Nations' history with UN history? You might also link to sources you rely on. 

Harry S. Truman - Wiki


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## daveman (Nov 12, 2010)

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Except for the mandates in the Koran to kill Jews.


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## georgephillip (Nov 12, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
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> > _Zionist forces initiated a cruel siege on the city of Jaffa in March 1948. ...ei: Jaffa: from eminence to ethnic cleansing_
> ...


Not unlike your Alma mater?


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## georgephillip (Nov 12, 2010)

daveman said:


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What of the Torah's mandates regularly omitted from English translations?

"Shahak and Mezvinsky provide a number of translations from the Talmud and other writings that they note are omitted from books on Judaism published in English; for example, from a fundamental book of Hassidism: 'All non-Jews are totally satanic creatures in whom there is absolutely nothing good.' 

"'Even a non-Jewish embryo is qualitatively different from a Jewish one.

"'The very existence of a non-Jew is "non-essential", whereas all creation was created solely for the sake of the Jews.' There are many such passages.'

"What makes such texts particularly significant, Shahak explains, is that '_n Israel these ideas are widely disseminated among the public at large, *in the schools and in the army*.'"

What Our Taxes..._


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## daveman (Nov 12, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
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"But...but...but the JOOOOS!!!"

That's all you're capable of, isn't it?  

Run along, coward.


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## georgephillip (Nov 12, 2010)

Are you Jewish?

Or non-essential?

Or too stupid to notice?


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## MelissaD (Nov 12, 2010)

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Dave, if you're a southern baptist like you claim, wft do you care about "joos" anyways? I thought black people didn't particularly like jews.


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## daveman (Nov 12, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Are you Jewish?
> 
> Or non-essential?
> 
> Or too stupid to notice?


I am not Jewish.  As for non-essential, I guess that depends on who you ask (and no, your worthless opinion doesn't matter, coward).  I'm certainly not stupid.  You can tell because I don't agree with you.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 12, 2010)

georgephillip said:


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> "By 1948, there were approximately *1.35 million Arabs* and *650,000  Jews* living between the Jordan and the Mediterranean, more Arabs than had ever lived in Palestine before,



No Christians, no Kurds, no Syrians, no Druze, how is that, its simple, they pump the Arabs numbers up by including the non-jew population into the Arab data. Clever, huh. No matter though, the amount of people of any particular race or group is irrelevant, there is sufficient population on either side of the argument to justify either establishing a nation.

I notice your post states "more Arabs than had ever lived in Palestine before". Where do you suppose they came from, immigration, attracted  to the better life living alongside the Jews and Christians. Anyhow, can you explain how the Jews took the land from the indigenousness people when you just posted that the Arab population is larger than anytime in history.



> At the end of World War II the US inherited Britain's colonial project in Palestine of creating a Jewish homeland in a region of the world that was overwhelmingly Arab.



In no way, shape, or form did this happen. The end of the war was 1945, Britain did not leave england until 1948, three years later. The only action taken by the USA was to vote in the United Nations for partition in November of 1947. 



> I believe all US administrations since Truman's have pursued a policy of arming Israel (at US taxpayer expense) while providing blanket diplomatic cover for all Israeli aggression.



I know they have not.

No arms deal with the Truman administration
No arms deal with the Eisenhower administration.

Kennedy was the first in 1963, that is 18 years after what you believe. The deal was for the Hawk anti-aircraft missile system, a defensive system. One condition though, Kennedy demanded the USA be allowed to inspect Israel's nuclear program. Israel developed nuclear weapons secretly, without the USA. France did it, the French gave Israel nuclear technology. Seems anywhere a problem exists in the world, there was France.

This is where things were at the time of Kennedy's assassination.

It was 1965 during Johnson's administration that the defensive weapon system was delivered. 

A total of twenty years after the year you posted.

How accurate are any of your beliefs or knowledge of Israel.


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## georgephillip (Nov 12, 2010)

Can you *link to proof* there was no US military aid to Israel until 1963?

Start here:

"Started in 1948 and gradually increased over the years

    * Soon after the Truman decision in 1948 to recognize Israel as a Jewish State, the US Congress approved an aid package in the form of a $135 million Export-Import Bank loan in order to take in holocaust survivors and provide them with homes.
    * Until 1973, aid was mainly made up of military, economic and export-import bank loans, although annual economic grants ranging between $0.1 and $74 million were also offered between the years 1951 and 1962. "

At the outset of World War II programs run by the Council on Foreign Relations and the State Department began planning the post war world.

*Q & A with Noam Chomsky*:

"A FEW years before Kennan&#8217;s document, the U.S. developed something called the '*Grand Area Strategy*.' What was that about?

THIS IS quite interesting. There&#8217;s only one good book about this, by Laurence Shoup and William Minter, called Imperial Brain Trust. It&#8217;s not an official government policy. 

"These were programs run by the Council on Foreign Relations with the participation of the State Department, from 1939 to 1945, planning the postwar world. It began when the Second World War began and went on... 

"The Grand Area would include, at a minimum, the entire Western Hemisphere, the Far East and *the former British Empire*. That&#8217;s the early stage of the war. 

"As it became clear by 1943 roughly, that Germany was going to be defeated, mainly by the Russians, they began extending the policies beyond, to try to hold on to as much of Eurasia as possible, assuming there wouldn&#8217;t be a German world. 

"And those policies later extend into the policy planning carried out in the early postwar period, and in many respects right until today. 

"*These are pretty natural and sensible plans of analysts who are thinking in terms of world domination for the interests that they represent. *

"Of course, they will say, and probably believe, that they&#8217;re just laboring for the benefit of the ordinary person, but the Romans that Schumpeter was talking about would have said the same thing and also believed it." 

Telling the Truth...

Palestine was a key part of the British Empire that the US replaced in 1945. Both Britain and the US conceived of Israel as a proxy working to advance the corporate interests of both countries.

Finally, the fact there were only 650,000 Jews in Palestine in 1948 out of a total population of about 2 million makes it impossible for Jewish voters to have won a fair election.

The UN acting on behalf of the US and other Western powers imposed a Jewish state in the middle of a region that was overwhelmingly Arab.

For pretty much the same reason Harry Truman took that suitcase from an American Zionist in 1948.


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## mdn2000 (Nov 13, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


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## mdn2000 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Can you *link to proof* there was no US military aid to Israel until 1963?
> 
> Start here:
> 
> ...



Link to proof, sorry, I was reading research books by professors who chronicled the history of the Presidents administrations. That seems like a much better source than finding a webpage and linking to lets say, wikipedia. 

This is one of my books, I also have Truman's memoirs, Eisenhower's books, Cordell Hull, a few books by and about Stimson, secretary of war under Truman. Books by Ben Gurion, Menachem Begin, Weizman, Moshe Dyan, Abbas, Ebban, not one mentions weapons coming from anywhere but Europe. Much of the Irgun's weapons were taken in daring robberies of British armories. 

Sorry, but I am not putting my posts together entirely from google searches, I hope you can respect and appreciate that, when things get a bit in depth as in questioning what happened in Jaffa it takes much time to find the information but having read the books and knowing the history allows me to find the facts. Not knowing and blindly searching is difficult if not impossible. 

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Other-Arab-Israeli-Conflict-Making-Americas/dp/0226769623]Amazon.com: The Other Arab-Israeli Conflict: Making America&#39;s Middle East Policy, from Truman to Reagan (9780226769622): Steven L. Spiegel: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

The Other Arab-Israeli Conflict: Making America's Middle East Policy, from Truman to Reagan by Steven L. Spiegel 1986


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## mdn2000 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Can you *link to proof* there was no US military aid to Israel until 1963?
> 
> Start here:
> 
> ...



Before I point out a thing or two that may  surprise you I have one question.

Do you know and understand who Noam Chomsky is.


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## georgephillip (Nov 13, 2010)

*Noam Chomsky*:

"Little of novelty or substance can be added to the millions of words that have already been written or spoken about Noam Chomsky. But it&#8217;s worth repeating a couple of them, if only to underscore the sheer, breathtaking scale of his achievements.

"First, he is the eighth most-cited author in the world, ever.

"Sharing the top ten with him are: *Marx, Lenin, Shakespeare, Aristotle, the Bible, Plato, Freud, Hegel and Cicero*. 

"Put simply, to ignore his work is to court ignorance and irrelevance.

"Second, he is, without a doubt, our Bertrand Russell: a man of extraordinary intellectual achievement, the father of modern linguistics, a pioneer of cognitive science, a political thinker of astonishing breadth and erudition, a writer of great moral courage in the face of cruelty and oppression, a tireless campaigner for peace and justice, and a robust voice of reason in the wilderness of despair and cynicism that is our modern world."

ZCommunications


----------



## docmauser1 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _Noam Chomsky_


As promoted by the gang-rape cheerleader:





georgephillip said:


> Or perhaps you were gang raped by Hamas? What's the matter? Don't they call?


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> *Noam Chomsky*:
> 
> "Little of novelty or substance can be added to the millions of words that have already been written or spoken about Noam Chomsky. But it&#8217;s worth repeating a couple of them, if only to underscore the sheer, breathtaking scale of his achievements.
> 
> ...


*snore*

Your fantasy, rather than reality. The sooner that Jew hating sycophant dies the better.


----------



## mdn2000 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> *Noam Chomsky*:
> 
> "Little of novelty or substance can be added to the millions of words that have already been written or spoken about Noam Chomsky. But it&#8217;s worth repeating a couple of them, if only to underscore the sheer, breathtaking scale of his achievements.
> 
> ...



An interview with Chomsky is your source. That is pretty stupid, not because of who Chomsky is, but because its simply an opinion, in an interview, not even a history scholar.

That is your idea of offering a bit of information to have a discussion about history.

City Journal



> Here&#8217;s a small but representative sample. The goal of America, Chomsky charges, &#8220;is a society in which the basic unit is you and your television set. If the kid next door is hungry, it&#8217;s not your problem. If the retired couple next door invested their assets badly and are now starving, that&#8217;s not your problem either.&#8221; Prisons and inner-city schools, Chomsky maintains, &#8220;target a kind of superfluous population that there&#8217;s no point in educating because there&#8217;s nothing for them to do. Because we&#8217;re a civilized people, we put them in prison, rather than sending death squads out to murder them.&#8221; Another example: &#8220;When you come back from the Third World to the West&#8212;the U.S. in particular&#8212;you are struck by the narrowing of thought and understanding, the limited nature of legitimate discussion, the separation of people from each other.&#8221;





> the U.S. instigated a process that &#8220;annihilated the indigenous [American] population (millions of people), conquered half of Mexico, intervened violently in the surrounding region, conquered Hawaii and the Philippines (killing hundreds of thousands of Filipinos), and in the past half century particularly, extended its resort to force throughout much of the world.&#8221;





> For Chomsky, turn over any monster anywhere and look at the underside. Each is clearly marked: MADE IN AMERICA. The cold war? All America&#8217;s fault: &#8220;The United States was picking up where the Nazis had left off.&#8221; Castro&#8217;s executions and prisons filled with dissenters? Irrelevant, for &#8220;Cuba has probably been the target of more international terrorism [from the U.S., of course] than any other country.&#8221; The Khmer Rouge? Back in 1977, Chomsky dismissed accounts of the Cambodian genocide as &#8220;tales of Communist atrocities&#8221; based on &#8220;unreliable&#8221; accounts. At most, the executions &#8220;numbered in the thousands&#8221; and were &#8220;aggravated by the threat of starvation resulting from American distraction and killing.&#8221; In fact, some 2 million perished on the killing fields of Cambodia because of genocidal war against the urban bourgeoisie and the educated, in which wearing a pair of glasses could mean a death sentence.





> Chomsky concedes that the WTC attack was unfortunate&#8212;not so much because of the deaths of Americans, but because &#8220;the atrocities of September 11 were a devastating blow to the Palestinians, as they instantly recognized.&#8221; (Some other group, disguised as Palestinians, must have been dancing in the streets that day.) Israel, he adds, &#8220;is openly exulting in the &#8216;window of opportunity&#8217; it now has to crush Palestinians with impunity.&#8221;


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 13, 2010)

In addition to Bertrand Russell, Albert Einstein has also been compared to Chomsky. In 1955 Russell and Einstein wrote a letter to the world pointing out a choice that is "stark, dreadful, and inescapable: shall we put an end to the human race; or shall mankind renounce war?"

Noam's position over the last 55 years is that war remains the most immediate threat to the survival of the specie, and the principle reason is the amount of profit war generates for those who cast the shadow called "politics" across American society.

Do you think it's likely a specie that kills its young for money (or glory) is hardwired to self-destruct?

Copyright 2006 _Failed States_ by Noam Chomsky P.3.


----------



## hipeter924 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> In addition to Bertrand Russell, Albert Einstein has also been compared to Chomsky. In 1955 Russell and Einstein wrote a letter to the world pointing out a choice that is "stark, dreadful, and inescapable: shall we put an end to the human race; or shall mankind renounce war?"
> 
> Noam's position over the last 55 years is that war remains the most immediate threat to the survival of the specie, and the principle reason is the amount of profit war generates for those who cast the shadow called "politics" across American society.
> 
> ...


Oh, his ego is even worse than I thought. I prefer Nostradamus, it holds more factual information than Chomsky's anti-semetic, western hating rants.


----------



## docmauser1 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _In addition to Bertrand Russell, Albert Einstein has also been compared to Chomsky._


"Or perhaps they were gang raped by Hamas? What's the matter? Don't they call?" by memorable georgephillip.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 13, 2010)

"Chomsky's anti-Semitic, western hating rants," draw much of their inspiration from an objective reading of Western history:

"The English colonists in North America had no doubts about what they were doing. 

"Revolutionary War hero General Henry Knox, the first Secretary of War in the newly liberated American colonies, described '*the utter extirpation of all the Indians in most populous parts of the Union'* by means 'more destructive to the Indian natives than the conduct of the conquerors of Mexico and Peru,' which would have been no small feat."

In his 2009 Edward Said Memorial Lecture at Columbia University, Chomsky probes Western civilization's emphasis on imperialism, particularly settler colonialism "commonly the most vicious form of imperial conquest..."

Chomsky links our sixth President's policies of genocide against "that hapless race of native Americans" with contemporary commentators linking (John Quincy) Adams with the Bush Doctrine:

"Distinguished contemporary commentators reinterpret the wisdom of Providence in secular terms. 

"The prominent Yale historian John Lewis Gaddis hails Adams as the grand strategist who laid the foundations for the Bush Doctrine: the doctrine that '*expansion is the path to security*' -- a convenient doctrine, for those who can get away with it, or who have powerful patrons. 

"With evident appreciation, Gaddis observes that the doctrine has been routinely applied throughout the history of the 'infant empire,' as George Washington termed the new Republic. 

"He passes in silence over Adams's gory contributions to the 'heinous sins of this nation' as he established the doctrine in a famous State paper justifying the conquest of Florida on utterly fraudulent pretexts of self-defense. 

"The conquest was part of Adams's project of 'removing or eliminating native Americans from the southeast,' in the words of William Earl Weeks, the leading historian of the massacre, who provides a lurid account of this 'exhibition of murder and plunder' targeting 'lawless Indians' and runaway slaves."

All of which proved a little harsh on runaway slaves and lawless Indians and Iraqis, but as long as cost is socialized and profit privatized Western civilization will continue to expand until....?


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 13, 2010)

docmauser1 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > _In addition to Bertrand Russell, Albert Einstein has also been compared to Chomsky._
> ...


docDrama...

Can you DRIVEL with both hands?

Should we ask Hamas?


----------



## docmauser1 (Nov 13, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> docmauser1 said:
> 
> 
> > georgephillip said:
> ...


What would we do without individuals, sharing their experience?


----------



## mdn2000 (Nov 14, 2010)

mdn2000 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > mdn2000 said:
> ...



I see George and Chomsky have ceded, without being able to address my post George cedes there is no basis in fact Chomsky's view.

The USA are the good guys. Chomsky cannot even respond to my simple post, I mean George cannot cut/paste a good Chomsky rebuttal.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 15, 2010)

Are you in favor of a "one state" or "binational" solution to Israel's "Arab problem"?

Chomsky has the following thoughts:

"Among the options under discussion are one-state and binational approaches. 

"These are crucially different. 

"There are many forms of multinationalism in the world: Switzerland, Belgium, Spain, etc. 

"The concept is a cover term for arrangements that allow forms of autonomy for groups within complex societies, not necessarily only those that choose to regard themselves as 'nations.' 

"Quite different are one-state systems, with no form of autonomy for various communities. 

"*In the US, for example, Latinos do not have autonomy or control over language or education in the areas stolen by violence from Mexico (or elsewhere); nothing approaching, say, the partial autonomy in Catalonia, *to mention one of many cases of some form of multinationalism.

"Let&#8217;s turn to some of the relevant background. Pre-1948, binationalism was a minority position within the Zionist movement. 

"From 1967-73 Israel had a real opportunity to institute a binational settlement in cis-Jordan in the context of a full peace treaty with Egypt and Jordan, hence the relevant part of the Arab world. 

"There was no interest. 
"The PLO had no interest. 
"US articulate opinion was bitterly opposed. 
"My own writings on the topic were harshly attacked from all sides."

"After the 1973 war, that option was effectively closed. Palestinian national rights were, for the first time, clearly and forcefully articulated in the international arena. 

"*A two-state settlement was brought to the UN Security Council in January 1976, vetoed by the US, an act condemned by Syria, Jordan, Egypt and the PLO.* 

"Since then there has been a broad international consensus in favor of a two-state settlement, *blocked by the US and Israel alone.* 

"It should be unnecessary to review this history once again."

Or not.

Advocacy and Realism...


----------



## daveman (Nov 15, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Chomsky has the following thoughts:



Who gives a shit what that America-hating hack has to say?


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 15, 2010)

Chomsky must be making his mark or there would not be so much slime against him.


----------



## daveman (Nov 15, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> Chomsky must be making his mark or there would not be so much slime against him.



The only thing remarkable about him is how he's used you morons to make a pile of money speaking about the evils of capitalism.


----------



## P F Tinmore (Nov 15, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Chomsky must be making his mark or there would not be so much slime against him.
> ...



Personally I am not a Chomsky fan but he does have some good points.


----------



## daveman (Nov 15, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...


As a fellow Jew-hater, of course you'd think so.


----------



## FrankZapper (Nov 15, 2010)

*Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?
* Nazism is the father of Zionism. Although strangely, the idea of a master race originated in Judaism who consider Jews above everyone else as God's chosen people.


----------



## mdn2000 (Nov 16, 2010)

P F Tinmore said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Name one good point.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 16, 2010)

daveman said:


> P F Tinmore said:
> 
> 
> > Chomsky must be making his mark or there would not be so much slime against him.
> ...


Do you find it remarkable Chomsky is the 8th most quoted author of all time?

The only living human being on a Top Ten List that starts with the Bible?

How many of Noam's books have you read?

Never mind.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 16, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> daveman said:
> 
> 
> > P F Tinmore said:
> ...



Chomsky has never been quoted on the front pages of the NY Times or Washington Post, nor on Meet The Press nor in Congress nor in the White House

chomsky is a crackpot, just like you


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 16, 2010)

Because the rich have no answers to his questions.

He's also never been banned from USMB.

Unlike you.

Crackpot.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 16, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Because the rich have no answers to his questions.
> 
> He's also never been banned from USMB.
> 
> ...



The rich pay taxes that fund your welfare checks, stoner


----------



## docmauser1 (Nov 18, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> _Do you find it remarkable Chomsky is the 8th most quoted author of all time?_


Of course, not. Chomskin isn't the only one to admire Pol Pot, after all.


----------



## mdn2000 (Nov 18, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Because the rich have no answers to his questions.
> 
> He's also never been banned from USMB.
> 
> ...



Chomsky is the rich, you stated top .02% of wealthiest Americans.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 18, 2010)

You stated that.

Not that you're likely to notice.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 18, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> You stated that.
> 
> Not that you're likely to notice.



Funny how in 40 years, Chomsky has never been consulted by one US president nor one member of Congress nor the US State Dept nor the US Defense Dept nor the NY Times nor the Washington Post nor Time or Newsweek magazines nor Meet The Press.

Chomsky is a legend...in his own mind.


----------



## FrankZapper (Nov 19, 2010)

Marc39 said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > You stated that.
> ...



Funny how in 40 years, you've never been consulted by anyone either.

marc is a legend...in his own mind.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 20, 2010)

"*By 1934 the SS had become the most pro-Zionist element in the Nazi Party*. 

"Other Nazis were even calling them 'soft' on the Jews. Baron von Mildenstein had returned from his six-month visit to Palestine as an ardent Zionist sympathiser. 

"Now as the head of the Jewish Department of the SSs Security Service, he started studying Hebrew and collecting Hebrew records; when his former companion and guide, Kurt Tuchler, visited his office in 1934, he was greeted by the strains of familiar Jewish folk tunes. [16] There were maps on the walls showing the rapidly increasing strength of Zionism inside Germany. [17] 

"Von Mildenstein was as good as his word: he not only wrote favourably about what he saw in the Zionist colonies in Palestine; he also persuaded Goebbels to run the report as a massive twelve-part series in his own Der Angriff (The Assault), the leading Nazi propaganda organ (26 September to 9 October 1934). 

"*His stay among the Zionists had shown the SS man* 'the way to curing a centuries-long wound on the body of the world: the Jewish question'. 

"It was really amazing how some good Jewish boden under his feet could enliven the Jew: 'The soil has reformed him and his kind in a decade. This new Jew will be a new people.' [18] 

"To commemorate the Barons expedition, *Goebbels had a medal struck: on one side the swastika, on the other the Zionist star."* 

Zionism in


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 20, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "B]By 1934 the SS had become the most pro-Zionist element in the Nazi Party[/B].


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 20, 2010)

"Goebbels 
had a medal struck.
On one side
the Swastika
On the other
the Zionist star."

Feeling proud of your roots?

Baby killer.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 20, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "Goebbels
> had a medal struck.
> On one side
> the Swastika
> ...



Equating Israelis with Nazis is antiSemitism, Nazi George, under US and EU guidelines.

Take your genetic white trash mental illness elsewhere.

Martin Luther King, Jr...


> When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-Semitism.
> 
> I see Israel as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security and that security must be a reality.
> 
> I solemnly pledge to do my utmost to uphold the fair name of the Jews -- because bigotry in any form is an affront to us all.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 21, 2010)

Are you refuting Brenner's claim that Goebbels once ordered a medal struck with the Nazi Swastika on one side and the Zionist star on the other?

"Princeton"?

Do you choke on the thought that the Land of Israel depended upon the murderers of six million Jews for its existence?

Or do you just swallow?

Like everything else the rich shove down your throat?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 21, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Are you refuting Brenner's claim that Goebbels once ordered a medal struck with the Nazi Swastika on one side and the Zionist star on the other?
> 
> "Princeton"?
> 
> ...


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 21, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Are you refuting Brenner's claim that Goebbels once ordered a medal struck with the Nazi Swastika on one side and the Zionist star on the other?
> 
> "Princeton"?
> 
> ...



Open a history book, clown.  Israel existed twice in antiquity as a state and at least 3200 years ago, substantiated by the archaeological record.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 21, 2010)

So what?

Do you want a world where everyone has to right to "own" land their ancestors' occupied thousands of years ago?

'Might be hard on Hollywood and Manhattan.


----------



## daveman (Nov 21, 2010)

I called it in post #3, and the usual suspects have been falling all over themselves to prove me right.

Thanks, guys!


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 21, 2010)

Don't you think you're being a little harsh on Marc "the Banned Bitch"39?

If you became convinced Zionists living in Israel during WWII offered to collaborate with Hitler by killing the British in Palestine, would that influence your current support for the Jewish state?

51 Docs


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 21, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> So what?
> 
> Do you want a world where everyone has to right to "own" land their ancestors' occupied thousands of years ago?



Americans live in America 
Egyptians live in Egypt.
Saudis live in Saudi Arabia
Syrians live in Syria
Israelis live in Israel.

Simple enough for you, freak?


----------



## daveman (Nov 21, 2010)

I couldn't have done it without you, George.  Thanks for your support!


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 21, 2010)

"Zionist factions competed for the honor of allying to Hitler. 

"By 1940-41, the 'Stern Gang,' among them *Yitzhak Shamir*, later Prime Minister of Israel, presented the Nazis with the 'Fundamental Features of the Proposal of the National Military Organization in Palestine (Irgun Zvai Leumi) Concerning the Solution of the Jewish Question in Europe and the Participation of the NMO in the *War on the Side of Germany*.'"

How about a little love for Hitler's haver, Yitzhak?

51 Docs


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 21, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "Zionist factions competed for the honor of allying to Hitler.



Bogus.  

Not bogus...

Eminent Middle East historian Bernard Lewis: Nazis Collaborated With Arab Muslims ...


> Then came the Third Reich, connections to the Arab world and, later, to other Muslim countries. Now that the German archives are open, we know that within weeks of Hitler&#8217;s coming to power in 1933, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem got in touch with the German consul general in Jerusalem, Doctor Heinrich Wolff, and offered his services. It is interesting that the common image of the Germans pursuing the Arabs is the reverse of what happened. The Arabs were pursuing the Germans.
> 
> The Germans turned their attention more seriously to the Arabs, responding at last to their approaches, and from then on the relationship developed very swiftly.
> 
> ...


[ame]http://www.amazon.com/Semites-Anti-Semites-Inquiry-Conflict-Prejudice/dp/0393318397/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1290368422&sr=8-1[/ame]


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 21, 2010)

"Zionism convicts itself. On June 21, 1933, the German Zionist Federation sent a secret memorandum to the Nazis:

"Zionism has no illusions about the difficulty of the Jewish condition, which consists above all in an abnormal occupational pattern and in the fault of an intellectual and moral posture not rooted in one's own tradition. 

"*Zionism recognized decades ago that as a result of the assimilationist trend, symptoms of deterioration were bound to appear*, which it seeks to overcome by carrying out its challenge to transform Jewish life completely."

Why would some Zionists equate assimilation with deterioration?

Would you call that racist?

51 Docs


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 21, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "Zionism convicts itself. On June 21, 1933, the German Zionist Federation sent a secret memorandum to the Nazis:



The UN ranks Israel among the 15 best countries to live in  (out of 170 countries) in the world and with the highest qualities of life, emphasizing political and cultural freedom and equality in education, healthcare, life expectancy and income, ahead of England, Spain, Greece, Italy, Finland,  Belgium, Denmark, Luxembourg and Austria 

Statistics | Human Development Reports (HDR) | United Nations Development Programme (UNDP)


> Human Development is a development paradigm that is about much more than the rise or fall of national incomes. It is about creating an environment in which people can develop their full potential and lead productive, creative lives in accord with their needs and interests. People are the real wealth of nations. Development is thus about expanding the choices people have to lead lives that they value. And it is thus about much more than economic growth, which is only a means if a very important one of enlarging peoples choices.
> 
> Fundamental to enlarging these choices is building human capabilities the range of things that people can do or be in life. The most basic capabilities for human development are to lead long and healthy lives, to be knowledgeable, to have access to the resources needed for a decent standard of living and to be able to participate in the life of the community. Without these, many choices are simply not available, and many opportunities in life remain inaccessible.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 21, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Would you call that racist?



Avowed Zionist Martin Luther King, Jr...


> When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking anti-Semitism.
> 
> I see Israel as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security and that security must be a reality.
> 
> I solemnly pledge to do my utmost to uphold the fair name of the Jews -- because bigotry in any form is an affront to us all.


"I have a dream" for peace in the Middle East / King's special bond with Israel


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 22, 2010)

Do you equate assimilation with deterioration?

Are ALL Jews really that special?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 22, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Do you equate assimilation with deterioration?
> 
> Are ALL Jews really that special?



You're severely mentally distubed.  Seek psychiatric help, for your own benefit


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 22, 2010)

Or maybe you've been licking too much newborn foreskin lately?


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 22, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Or maybe you've been licking too much newborn foreskin lately?


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 24, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> "Zionist factions competed for the honor of allying to Hitler.
> 
> "By 1940-41, the 'Stern Gang,' among them *Yitzhak Shamir*, later Prime Minister of Israel, presented the Nazis with the 'Fundamental Features of the Proposal of the National Military Organization in Palestine (Irgun Zvai Leumi) Concerning the Solution of the Jewish Question in Europe and the Participation of the NMO in the *War on the Side of Germany*.'"
> 
> ...


Yitzhak Shamir wasn't Israel's only Founding Father to approach Hitler with offers of collaboration during WWII when the British occupied Palestine.

"Avraham Stern and his followers announced that

    "The NMO,(National Military Organization in Palesine) which is well-acquainted with the *goodwill of the German Reich government* and its authorities towards Zionist activity inside Germany and towards Zionist emigration plans, is of the opinion that:

    "1. Common interests could exist between the establishment of a new order in Europe in conformity with the German concept, and the true national aspirations of the Jewish people as they are embodied by the NMO.

    "2. Cooperation between the new Germany and a renewed folkish-national Hebraium would be possible and,

    "3. The establishment of the *historic Jewish state *on a national and totalitarian basis, bound by a treaty with the German Reich[/B], would be in the interest of a maintained and strengthened *future German position of power in the Near East*."

"Proceeding from these considerations, the NMO in Palestine, under the condition the above-mentioned national aspirations of the Israeli freedom movement are recognized on the side of the German Reich, *offers to actively take part in the war on Germany's side*."

*"They hanged people all over Europe after WW II for notes to the Nazis like these. But these treasons against the Jews were virtually unknown in the run up to the creation of the Zionist state in May 1948*. 

"Ninety percent of America's Jews suddenly became emotional pro-Zionists. With Democrats, Republicans and even the Communist-organized Progressive Party competing for Jewish votes in the November Presidential election, Harry Truman's monetary aid bought arms from pro-Soviet Czechoslovakia, and an Israel was born, run by the *German Zionists' cothinkers in Jerusalem*.

51 Docs


----------



## Godboy (Nov 24, 2010)

^^

Let me just settle this. Israel is a fine and honorable country, while your just a dumb ass bigot that hates jews. Theyve accomplished great things and youve accomplished nothing. Get a clue dip shit.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 24, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > "Zionist factions competed for the honor of allying to Hitler.
> ...


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 24, 2010)

Many Israelis are fine and honorable people; however, that doesn't mean the Jewish State isn't as racist as white South Africa or that some Israelis behave as brutally as Nazis.

"Website Reveals Details of hundreds of IDF 'war criminals.'"

"Those behind it claim, &#8216;People listed here held positions of command therefore not only did they perform on behalf of a *murderous state mechanism* but actively encouraged other people to do the same&#8217;

"A website that went online Tuesday has published a list of 200 IDF soldiers which it classifies as directly involved in operations carried out in Gaza during Operation Cast Lead. 

"Each entry features the soldiers and officers&#8217; pictures and personal details, including identification numbers and addresses."


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 24, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Many Israelis are fine and honorable people; however, that doesn't mean the Jewish State isn't as racist as white South Africa or that some Israelis behave as brutally as Nazis.



You have a fat nose from excessive drinking?


----------



## daveman (Nov 24, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Many Israelis are fine and honorable people; however, that doesn't mean the Jewish State isn't as racist as white South Africa or that some Israelis behave as brutally as Nazis.
> 
> "Website Reveals Details of hundreds of IDF 'war criminals.'"
> 
> ...


"People listed here held positions of command therefore not only did they perform on behalf of a murderous state mechanism but actively encouraged other people to do the same" -- and by publishing the soldiers' addresses, the website is doing the exact same thing.

Way to go, asshat.


----------



## georgephillip (Nov 24, 2010)

Still rooting for the war criminals?

Slave.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 24, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Still rooting for the war criminals?
> 
> Slave.



Do you have Thanksgiving with other indigents at the Salvation Army?


----------



## daveman (Nov 24, 2010)

georgephillip said:


> Still rooting for the war criminals?
> 
> Slave.



Still rooting for the terrorists?

Tool.  

Happy Thanksgiving, George.  You should be thankful there are men and women with the courage to do what you couldn't.


----------



## Marc39 (Nov 24, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > Many Israelis are fine and honorable people; however, that doesn't mean the Jewish State isn't as racist as white South Africa or that some Israelis behave as brutally as Nazis.
> ...



He's a recovering alcoholic.  They never really fully recover.


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## georgephillip (Nov 25, 2010)

daveman said:


> georgephillip said:
> 
> 
> > Still rooting for the war criminals?
> ...


Happy Thanksgiving, daveman.


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