# Joy of Communistic Health Care!



## HenryBHough (Nov 12, 2015)

State run medicine is the envy of American liberals.  They seem especially enraptured by Britain's National Health Service.

And, of course, those same liberals are big fans of unions and all they do so it's delicious to see this preview of coming attractions:

Junior doctors to have first 'all-out' strike in history if ballot passes

Savor it well, libbies, elect Hillary and we can have our very own "industrial actions" like this one:

* Until now, the BMA has said that it would recommend limiting action in the first instance to an "emergency care" level of service - meaning doctors would provide the sort of skeleton service in operation on Christmas Day. *

* But the union on Thursday released its plans for action if junior doctors vote to strike. The plan would see one day of "emergency care only" action for 24 hours on December 1, followed by a full walk out from 8am to 5pm on December 8 and December 16. *

*There were concerns that an all-out strike in the height of winter would inevitably endanger lives, given that junior doctors make up around half of the medical workforce.*


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## C_Clayton_Jones (Nov 12, 2015)

"Joy of Communistic Health Care!"

Joy of rightwing threads failing as straw man fallacies – this thread being one of many examples.


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## Conservative65 (Nov 15, 2015)

Arianrhod said:


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Still unwilling to admit you lefties orgasm over government run healthcare?


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## Arianrhod (Nov 15, 2015)

Conservative65 said:


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Why do you want me to lie?


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## HenryBHough (Nov 15, 2015)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> "Joy of Communistic Health Care!"
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> Joy of rightwing threads failing as straw man fallacies – this thread being one of many examples.



Please DO try clicking on the link and reading the news report.  I know it's an effort but you can do it though it may require seeking adult assistance.....


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## Arianrhod (Nov 15, 2015)

HenryBHough said:


> Please DO try clicking on the link and reading the news report.



"If" is a wonderful word...so full of potential that may or may not become reality.  Do follow this story and let us know what actually happens in December, mmkay?

How long have you lived in the UK?


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## Sun Devil 92 (Feb 16, 2016)

HenryBHough said:


> C_Clayton_Jones said:
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HenryBHough said:


> State run medicine is the envy of American liberals.  They seem especially enraptured by Britain's National Health Service.
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> And, of course, those same liberals are big fans of unions and all they do so it's delicious to see this preview of coming attractions:
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Great healthcare system.  

Wonder if Harvard's study included any of those people who would croak if this had happened.

Doctors...sworn to save lives....unless......


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## Sun Devil 92 (Feb 16, 2016)

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> "Joy of Communistic Health Care!"
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> Joy of rightwing threads failing as straw man fallacies – this thread being one of many examples.



The joy of seeing you post knowing you don't have any children.


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## Agit8r (Feb 17, 2016)

HenryBHough said:


> State run medicine is the envy of American liberals.  They seem especially enraptured by Britain's National Health Service.
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> And, of course, those same liberals are big fans of unions and all they do so it's delicious to see this preview of coming attractions:
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You _do_ know that Hillary does not favor single payer healthcare, right?


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## Tommy Tainant (Feb 17, 2016)

The strike is overwhelmingly supported by the British public who see their health service under threat by a corrupt tory gang who all have shares in private medicine.

Sky Poll: 74% Of Public Back Doctors' Strike

The public overwhelmingly blame Jeremy Hunt for junior doctors' strike, poll finds

Poll shows growing support for striking junior doctors

It wasnt the Doctors that chose this fight but they will win because they have right, and the public, on their side.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Feb 18, 2016)

Tommy Tainant said:


> The strike is overwhelmingly supported by the British public who see their health service under threat by a corrupt tory gang who all have shares in private medicine.
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> Sky Poll: 74% Of Public Back Doctors' Strike
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Who is going to lose ?


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## Sun Devil 92 (Feb 18, 2016)

Agit8r said:


> HenryBHough said:
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Why would she....?  That would be far left.

Once she is elected, she'll  throw them under the bus as fast as bill did.


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## Tommy Tainant (Feb 18, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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Hopefully it will be the Tories and their vulture mates.Privatisation has, on the whole, not worked in the UK. People have paid into the NHS for years, 34 in my case, and a halt needs to be called on their plans.
The last election was about the economy, the next will be about the NHS.


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## Tommy Tainant (Feb 20, 2016)

Private Eye
The NHS strike is a massively complicated issue. This article sheds some light on the matter. The author has been a critical voice for many years and is not a fan of any of the political parties.


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## HenryBHough (Feb 20, 2016)

Arianrhod said:


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Is there not some board rule about seeking personal information?


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## MDiver (Feb 20, 2016)

This nation should be number one in everything and sadly, we're not.
We're something like 36th in education in the world and 27th in health care.  For a nation whose right-wing followers like to strut about thumping their chests claiming that the U.S. is number one, being that far down in health care (as well as education) for its people, is absurd. 
Needing transplants or other in-depth treatments shouldn't destroy your bank account or cause you to lose your home to pay for the treatment. 
France is number one in the world for health care, both preventive and actual treatment. 
Simple logic must prevail.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Feb 21, 2016)

MDiver said:


> This nation should be number one in everything and sadly, we're not.
> We're something like 36th in education in the world and 27th in health care.  For a nation whose right-wing followers like to strut about thumping their chests claiming that the U.S. is number one, being that far down in health care (as well as education) for its people, is absurd.
> Needing transplants or other in-depth treatments shouldn't destroy your bank account or cause you to lose your home to pay for the treatment.
> France is number one in the world for health care, both preventive and actual treatment.
> Simple logic must prevail.



Screw the WHO


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## Tommy Tainant (Mar 17, 2016)

Some more on the cuts to NHS funding. This committee is cross party and not partisan.
Spending watchdog accuses NHS leaders over ‘black hole’ - FT.com


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## Sun Devil 92 (Mar 19, 2016)

Tommy Tainant said:


> Some more on the cuts to NHS funding. This committee is cross party and not partisan.
> Spending watchdog accuses NHS leaders over ‘black hole’ - FT.com



Sounds serious !!!


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 12, 2016)

Tommy Tainant said:


> Some more on the cuts to NHS funding. This committee is cross party and not partisan.
> Spending watchdog accuses NHS leaders over ‘black hole’ - FT.com



Sounds like things are still an issue in your home country.


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## Tommy Tainant (Aug 16, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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Very much so. It will probably get worse.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 16, 2016)

What is the average 


Tommy Tainant said:


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What is the average tax rate in the U.K. ?

This thread calls government health care communistic.  

I don't agree.

But I do believe it can become expensive and rather inflexible.


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## Tommy Tainant (Aug 16, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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Starts at 20% and goes up to a top rate of 40%.

The better off can get private insurance,generally through work. I had it for a decade through an employer but never needed it personally.

The NHS is under real threat from a party that represents the better off and doesnt see the need for the NHS. They cant come out and say it because that would be suicide. So they cut funding and wage war on the people who make it work.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 16, 2016)

Tommy Tainant said:


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Do they think they can get away with this.

It would seem that sooner or later a majority of people will vote themselves the benefits they deserve at the expense of the well-off.


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## Tommy Tainant (Aug 16, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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I dont really know. The political opposition to this government is a mess and there is no easy answer. When they start charging people to visit the GP or A and E I would expect the worm to turn.  

But the vast majority of the electorate are as thick as shit and your guess is as good as mine.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 17, 2016)

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You don't seem to have much faith in people.

Of course, John Gruber didn't either.


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## Tommy Tainant (Aug 17, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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People generally get there in the end. Lots of pain to come first.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 20, 2016)

Tommy Tainant said:


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Tommy Tainant said:


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I think there is a lot of misinformation out there and people don't know who to trust or what to believe.

I understand that people want good healthcare.

In this country we spend 8,500 per person per year on health care.  The average person does not pay that much in insurance......

I don't know how we think we can sustain that.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 20, 2016)

Agit8r said:


> HenryBHough said:
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At one time Hillary voted against raising the debt limit when Bush was President (2006) until she said doing so was common sense  when Obama was (2014).

At one time Hillary opposed driver's licenses for illegals (2008) then supported it (2015).

At one time Hillary opposed same sex marriage (2000) until she supported it (2015).

The list is quite extensive of what she didn't/did support then what she later did/didn't support.


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## HenryBHough (Aug 20, 2016)

Conservative65 said:


> At one time Hillary voted against raising the debt limit when Bush was President (2006) until she said doing so was common sense  when Obama was (2014).
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> At one time Hillary opposed driver's licenses for illegals (2008) then supported it (2015).
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Check recent photos of the old bitch.  Her face is lengthening!  She's morphing into John Kerry!


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 20, 2016)

Agit8r said:


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I thought I asked for a link to this.

But I didn't see one.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 21, 2016)

HenryBHough said:


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I saw one just a few days where I would have guessed it was Halloween and she was going as a ghost.


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## frigidweirdo (Aug 21, 2016)

HenryBHough said:


> State run medicine is the envy of American liberals.  They seem especially enraptured by Britain's National Health Service.
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> And, of course, those same liberals are big fans of unions and all they do so it's delicious to see this preview of coming attractions:
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Here's the deal. The NHS was working fine. Then the right wing got in, and they're attempting to destroy the health care system in order to implement a US style system, which involves double the cost, loads of corruption, profits for their friends, their friends giving them nice backhanders and "campaign financing" and all that stuff.

This isn't "communistic health care", this is social health care being DESTROYED BY THE RIGHT>


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 22, 2016)

frigidweirdo said:


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It's the Britians who are destroying it.  

Now, why would they do that ?


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## Arianrhod (Aug 22, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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It's been explained to you numerous times that it's the ruling British party that's making these changes.  Sort of like the Republicans in Congress stalling everything Because Obama.

Do you think asking the question again and again makes you look smart?  (Who are "the Britains," anyway?  Spellcheck fail?)


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 22, 2016)

frigidweirdo said:


> Here's the deal. The NHS was working fine.



Can you supply the definition of "fine" ?

Seems that the British elected the people who are killing the system.

Why would they do that ?


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## frigidweirdo (Aug 22, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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The "Britians"? Now who the fuck would they be?

The people destroying it are British, well the reality is they're Normans, the posh upper class are destroying it because they're selfish bastards, that's why.


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## frigidweirdo (Aug 22, 2016)

Sun Devil 92 said:


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Why would they elect the Tory Party? Well they have a few choices.

They had Labour, but then the economy hit hard and almost every country (except Germany who do things the other way around) changed their government from left to right or right to left. Then Labour decided to put a muppet as leader who didn't stand much chance of winning.

Also, while Labour are good on Education and Health, they're bad on immigration and a few other things.

Also "fine" means that it worked. The problem with the NHS was that the Tories tried to destroy it up until 1997, so Labour spend from 1997 to 2010 trying to fix it. They reached a point. However the NHS was working on a budget half of that of the US healthcare system. Not only that the Tories were saying it cost too much (yet wanted to double the spending, and have actually implemented private healthcare within the system that costs 15% more for doing exactly the same thing as was done under the NHS). 

So, had the NHS been given the same budget as the US healthcare service, it would be a lot better than the US healthcare service. As it is, with half the budget, it's FINE.


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## HenryBHough (Aug 23, 2016)

And today the hero of the left got busted for faking a video.  National Health is already Communist-Care in Britain and now he wants to seize the railways:

Virgin challenges Jeremy Corbyn train footage - BBC News

Alas, Britain has its own Hillary........


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## dblack (Aug 23, 2016)

Arianrhod said:


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Government run healthcare is just the foreplay.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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Is there some country whose way of doing things fits your sense of "justice," or do you need to invent your own?  Please share with us your idea of a nation that functions without requiring its citizens to involve themselves in any way.


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## dblack (Aug 23, 2016)

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As usual, I don't know what you're rambling about.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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The problem is what you lefties want only involves some citizens being involved and the others sitting back doing nothing while reaping the benefits.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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I'm sure you have many more lies, but I'm not interested in them.  Some hard facts proving that everyone below 400% of the federal poverty line is a slacker would be helpful.

But you haven't got 'em, so you'll just keep repeating your pet lies.

Do it again.


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## westwall (Aug 23, 2016)

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Your sense of justice seems to be "rip off the middle class and give them a more expensive, inferior,  product so that they will embrace a single payer system, while at the same time ignoring the fact that people are going to needlessly die because of our lying".  Does that cover it?


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Anyone that relies on the government to do for them what they should be doing for themselves is a slacker.  If you have to have someone else fund you're food, you're a slacker.  If you have to have someone else subsidize where you live, you're a slacker.  If you have to have taxpayers subsidize your healthcare, you're a slacker.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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Nope, nothing to see here, folks.  Move along...


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Typical  Liberal if you don't acknowledge the truth it doesn't exist excuse.  

I'll move along when you can move me, son.  Until then, no.  Can you?  Do you have the guts to try?


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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You've presented no truth, only your unsupported opinion.  Do it again.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Are you saying people that won't do the most simple things when it comes to supporting themselves are honorable in doing so?  

The truth is if you won't do for yourself, you're a piece of shit that deserves to go without.  The only way you can say otherwise is to claim the piece of shit freeloader deserves something he/she didn't earn.  Go ahead, I know you want to say it.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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I'm saying you post the same opinion (yours) in the absence of facts (you know what facts are, don't you?) over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, regardless of the topic or even the country in question.

Tell us about your vast experience of the UK's NHS which, BTW, is the topic of this thread, in case you've forgotten.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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You're saying blah, blah, blah, big government is good, blah, blah, blah, socialism is good, blah, blah, blah.  Same shit over and over and over.  

If you can't provide for yourself, do without and that goes for the UK, US, or any fucking other country in the world.  NO ONE owes another person a damn thing that person is unwilling to provide to themselves.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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I'm not saying any such thing.  I'm saying "You, Conservative65, show proof of your assertions or be mocked."

I can understand why that would upset you.

Do it again.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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You're too stupid to mock yourself much less someone far superior to you.  

I know it bothers you that you're so inferior to someone like me you consider a fool but life goes on.   You'll have to accept you're just a worthless motherfucker.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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So tell us what you know about the NHS, which is the topic of this thread, in case you've forgotten.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Just as I stated, you're inferior and can't stand being a worthless motherfucker.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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Still posting contentless ad hominems which westwall will ignore, but proving incontrovertibly that you know nothing about the NHS.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Posting facts about you, puss.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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I am not the topic of this thread.  But please keep posting contentless ad hominems which westwall will ignore, proving incontrovertibly that you know nothing about the NHS.  I want to see how many you can get away with before you either run away again or the hammer drops.

And, go...


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Where are you saying I'm running?  Can you run me off?  Didn't think so.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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You called me names and ran off in our last contretemps.  Now, tell us again what you know about the NHS.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 23, 2016)

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I call you what you are.  Calling you names implies it's not true.  

Now, tell me again where I'm going.


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## Arianrhod (Aug 23, 2016)

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I'd like to think you're going back to the topic, which is your extensive knowledge of the UK's NHS (which is why you chose to participate in this thread), but I'm overly optimistic.  Surprise me.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 23, 2016)

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HenryBHough said:


> State run medicine is the envy of American liberals.  They seem especially enraptured by Britain's National Health Service.
> 
> And, of course, those same liberals are big fans of unions and all they do so it's delicious to see this preview of coming attractions:
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Doctors on strike.

Just what this country needs.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 23, 2016)

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Save yourself the trouble of damaged brain cells.


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## Conservative65 (Aug 24, 2016)

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Tell me again where I'm going.  Surprise me and start being a worthwhile member of society.  I know you won't because some people simply aren't worth the air they breathe.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 24, 2016)

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I can only guess.


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## Tommy Tainant (Aug 25, 2016)

The NHS is not free. We pay for it through our taxation.

If you are out of work or sick you cant pay but as a society we have chosen to have a system where everybody is covered.

There is a story doing the rounds this week about the victims of the Pulse shootings getting free treatment. Something like that would not even be worth a comment in the UK.

The Conservative guy on here doesnt have much knowledge of anything and his attitude towards community or society is simplistic at best.

Society is not a jungle. We all live and work in the same space and rely on each other to make our lives work. ME,ME,ME could only be appropriate if you lived on a desert island.

Under the current government everything is up for sale. But the nurses still wear the same uniforms and the ambulances are painted the same. People dont realise what is going on.

If the Labour party could stop fighting each other and start on the tories then there might be a hope.

None of this would have happened under thatcher because she would have had her bony arse kicked down the road. The last generation who lived in pre NHS Britain has virtually all gone. The rest of us dont appreciate what we have.


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## Sun Devil 92 (Aug 25, 2016)

Tommy Tainant said:


> The NHS is not free. We pay for it through our taxation.



Thank you.


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