# The Constitution is a Con Game



## Buck111

I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.

The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.


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## Billy_Kinetta

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government.



Only if the citizenry permits.


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## AnCap'n_Murica

Comparing the long train of abuses listed in the Declaration of Independence to the current political conditions, it's easy to recognize that the Constitution has been entirely ineffective at constraining government.


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## JakeStarkey

One of the quickest Ignore I have ever done.

We are dealing with innumerable trolls and buck111 comes out trolling a la prisonmike or grizz.  The difference is that the latter two are fun to mess with.  buck111 would just be a bore.


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## Fenton Lum

Billy_Kinetta said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only if the citizenry permits.
Click to expand...

 
And they always have.  Still do.


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## Billy_Kinetta

Fenton Lum said:


> Billy_Kinetta said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only if the citizenry permits.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And they always have.  Still do.
Click to expand...


That's how the game works.


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## Fenton Lum

Billy_Kinetta said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Billy_Kinetta said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only if the citizenry permits.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And they always have.  Still do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's how the game works.
Click to expand...

 
Hence the op.


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## Spare_change

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



This is popularly known as a WBW thread ((Wasted BandWidth)


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## BULLDOG

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



Forgot to take your meds again today?


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## Buck111

BULLDOG said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot to take your meds again today?
Click to expand...


Apparently you disagree with me. If so, why?


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## saveliberty

I'd ignore you, but you'll eliminate yourself soon enough.

Violate the Constitution, become more intimate with due process.


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## BULLDOG

Buck111 said:


> BULLDOG said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot to take your meds again today?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Apparently you disagree with me. If so, why?
Click to expand...


The ability to use the basic principles of the constitution to address issues that the founding fathers never thought about, and could never foresee is the only reason our constitution is as strong and resilient as it is, and the reason it has lasted as long as it has.  Only an idiot would think our defining document could be just as relevant now as it was a couple hundred years ago without some adaptation to match the times.


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## Yarddog

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.




Which is exactly why the founders also tried to create separation of power within the government. They knew that all governments eventually serve themselves, especially if unchecked.


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## emilynghiem

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



Dear Buck111 yes and no.
If people take away rights of others, they also lose those rights.
There is a natural law in place, of Reciprocity or the Golden Rule.
Since everyone wants their rights, they end up having to respect the same for others.

Look at free speech, the minute one person starts denouncing or censoring the free speech of others,
ten more jump up and denounce that person and cut off their free speech.

If one person goes too far with free will and step on the free will and consent of others,
there is a protest or petition, and either that person gets blocked or people take action to solve the conflict.
But it doesn't go without invoking some due process or grievance process to address the imbalance, 
injustice or disruption of the peace.

The laws check themselves. Why?
Because all people have
* judicial freedom to speak our opinions and interpret laws and right and wrong by freedom of speech
* legislative freedom to write our own contract and policies and establish agreements among ourselves
by freedom of the press and written information and education
* executive freedom to exercise our beliefs and interests equally as long as we don't interfere
or impose unfairly on the same of others

And where we agree to work together we can respect each other's
* right to assemble and petition EACH OTHER (as the people are the Govt) 
for redress of grievances, ie due process of laws.

So we can have equal protections of the laws where people AGREE it is mutual responsibility and contract.

Yes, people abuse the contract, and you can see, other people rise up and police that abuse.
We just have to agree to enforce it consistently, save our resources for good, and quit wasting it policing 
abuses that we can prevent and correct together.

Why? Because we all want our rights, and don't want other people violating them.
We all want the same things, but just don't trust each other's groups.

So why don't we agree to let all groups operate independently,
support each other in managing our own beliefs and programs,
and we can all get what we want without imposing on what others want!

www.ethics-commission.net


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## Buck111

I think some of you are missing my points. 

The CONstitution affords no protections for the rights of the people. Why? Because it can be suspended by government. If a right can be suspended, it is not a "right", it is a privilege. The Bill of Rights, nor any other part of the CONstitution is immune from suspension. 

In 1871, Lincoln suspended habeas corpus. _Eight_ times! This allowed the imprisonment, without charge or due process, to be arrested and jailed. He also approved warrantless searches by his military where they were free to kick in doors. Not only did he do these two things, he also censored the press, effectively closing down several newspapers. Let suspended at least three of the first ten amendments to the CONstituion.

During WWII, habeas corpus was again suspended and Japanese, German and Italian Americans were placed in prison camps. Men, women and children.

During the tragedy of Hurricane Katrina, National Guardsmen went door-to-door confiscating peoples firearms. 

These are not the only times government has suspended parts of the CONstitution, nor will they be the last.

As long as government has the power to take your "rights" for it's reasons, you have no "rights", you have privileges. The big con is you think it doesn't or cant happen.


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## BULLDOG

Buck111 said:


> I think some of you are missing my points.
> 
> The CONstitution affords no protections for the rights of the people. Why? Because it can be suspended by government. If a right can be suspended, it is not a "right", it is a privilege. The Bill of Rights, nor any other part of the CONstitution is immune from suspension.
> 
> In 1871, Lincoln suspended habeas corpus. _Eight_ times! This allowed the imprisonment, without charge or due process, to be arrested and jailed. He also approved warrantless searches by his military where they were free to kick in doors. Not only did he do these two things, he also censored the press, effectively closing down several newspapers. Let suspended at least three of the first ten amendments to the CONstituion.
> 
> During WWII, habeas corpus was again suspended and Japanese, German and Italian Americans were placed in prison camps. Men, women and children.
> 
> During the tragedy of Hurricane Katrina, National Guardsmen went door-to-door confiscating peoples firearms.
> 
> These are not the only times government has suspended parts of the CONstitution, nor will they be the last.
> 
> As long as government has the power to take your "rights" for it's reasons, you have no "rights", you have privileges. The big con is you think it doesn't or cant happen.



Nobody is missing the point you are trying to make. You're just wrong.


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## Buck111

BULLDOG said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think some of you are missing my points.
> 
> The CONstitution affords no protections for the rights of the people. Why? Because it can be suspended by government. If a right can be suspended, it is not a "right", it is a privilege. The Bill of Rights, nor any other part of the CONstitution is immune from suspension.
> 
> In 1871, Lincoln suspended habeas corpus. _Eight_ times! This allowed the imprisonment, without charge or due process, to be arrested and jailed. He also approved warrantless searches by his military where they were free to kick in doors. Not only did he do these two things, he also censored the press, effectively closing down several newspapers. Let suspended at least three of the first ten amendments to the CONstituion.
> 
> During WWII, habeas corpus was again suspended and Japanese, German and Italian Americans were placed in prison camps. Men, women and children.
> 
> During the tragedy of Hurricane Katrina, National Guardsmen went door-to-door confiscating peoples firearms.
> 
> These are not the only times government has suspended parts of the CONstitution, nor will they be the last.
> 
> As long as government has the power to take your "rights" for it's reasons, you have no "rights", you have privileges. The big con is you think it doesn't or cant happen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nobody is missing the point you are trying to make. You're just wrong.
Click to expand...


I am wrong how?


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## Unkotare

The OP is juvenile nonsense.


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## Buck111

Unkotare said:


> The OP is juvenile nonsense.



What evidence do you have to support your accusation?


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## ibc

The Constitution has either authorized such a government as we've had, or has been powerless to prevent it.  -Lysander Spooner.

Conclusively it is the former, i.e. ...it was "Authorized". The Preamble explains it unequivocally. It was not about the "common" man. The Constitution is a contract and your not a party to it.  

This is a document drafted by the PEOPLE"  of the "UNITED STATES" _for,_  the "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"  The "PEOPLE"  guaranteed that the debt payments of the "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"
would be made to the King. -Article 6, clause 1

_"All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation"._

The United States of America founded under the Confederation of states went into debt to fight the war against the King. The king tired of the war and had other issues in Europe agreed to conclude the war with the Treaty of Paris in 1783. This agreement was the repayment of the loans authored by the said countries in that treaty. Article 4 of this treaty puts their (The Kings) claws in our buttocks.

The United States of America, the 13 colonies, became disunited, fought amongst themselves, refused to pay their share of the debts, and was gaining the attention of the king for failure to pay. Because of this disunity, 55 *PEOPLE* gathered together and attended meetings to reorganize and centralize the power of government and to agree to form a new entity called the "UNITED STATES" in 1787. Only 39 of those attendee's signed the constitution forming our present style of government. 

The Preamble  of the Constitution paraphrases to the King what these 39 individuals intend to do with the original agreement and how they are going to run the country. 

We the *P*eople [capitol *"P"* changes legal meaning in contract law, and applies to the signatories only] *(which formed the entity)* of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect *"Union",* establish justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our "*P"*osterity. See Black's 6th ed.  _"All the descendants of a person in a direct line to the remotest generation", _do ordain and establish this Constitution *[for*] the United States of America.

One entity did FOR another entity. See Art.1, sect 2, para. 3; "...the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States". Not the United States of America.

This contract, Constitution is founded, abides and is subservient to  international law, based on a compilation of rules, maxims, and guidelines formed over 4000 years of governance compiled in the form of a book referenced in the US Constitution.  See, Art.1 sect. 8 para. 10; "To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offenses against the *"LAW OF NATIONS".* 

The Law of Nations is a Book!

Most of you went to centralized centers of education... think you were missled?  facts  misrepresented?


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## Onyx

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



Damn right!

We have all these paper worshipers that believe they can control the tyranny of rulers with  magical documents. They are idiots, through and through.


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## Onyx

JakeStarkey said:


> One of the quickest Ignore I have ever done.



The ignorant shall ignore. 

Keep on bowing down to that piece of paper. It will never answer your prayers.


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## Onyx

AnCap'n_Murica said:


> Comparing the long train of abuses listed in the Declaration of Independence to the current political conditions, it's easy to recognize that the Constitution has been entirely ineffective at constraining government.



Not to mention the constitution authorized greater state authority over the prior Articles of Confederation. The moment citizens started refusing to pay taxes and follow the laws of aristocrats, the scared ***** drafted a document giving the government more power to protect their asses.


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## Onyx

Billy_Kinetta said:


> That's how the game works.



Yep, and the game keeps dicking you useful idiots around until time continuum.


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## ibc

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



The Constitution has either authorized such a government as we've had, or has been powerless to prevent it. -Lysander Spooner.

Conclusively it is the former, i.e. ...it was "Authorized". The Preamble explains it unequivocally. It was not about the "common" man. The Constitution is a contract and your not a party to it. 

This is a document drafted by the PEOPLE" of the "UNITED STATES" _for,_ the "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA" The "PEOPLE" guaranteed that the debt payments of the "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"
would be made to the King. -Article 6, clause 1

_"All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation"._

The United States of America founded under the Confederation of states went into debt to fight the war against the King. The king tired of the war and had other issues in Europe agreed to conclude the war with the Treaty of Paris in 1783. This agreement was the repayment of the loans authored by the said countries in that treaty. Article 4 of this treaty puts their (The Kings) claws in our buttocks.

The United States of America, the 13 colonies, became disunited, fought amongst themselves, refused to pay their share of the debts, and was gaining the attention of the king for failure to pay. Because of this disunity, 55 *PEOPLE* gathered together and attended meetings to reorganize and centralize the power of government and to agree to form a new entity called the "UNITED STATES" in 1787. Only 39 of those attendee's signed the constitution forming our present style of government. 

The Preamble of the Constitution paraphrases to the King what these 39 individuals intend to do with the original agreement and how they are going to run the country. 

We the *P*eople [capitol *"P"* changes legal meaning in contract law, and applies to the signatories only] *(which formed the entity)* of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect *"Union",* establish justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our "*P"*osterity. See Black's 6th ed. _"All the descendants of a person in a direct line to the remotest generation", _do ordain and establish this Constitution *[for*] the United States of America.

One entity did FOR another entity. See Art.1, sect 2, para. 3; "...the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States". Not the United States of America.

This contract, Constitution is founded, abides and is subservient to international law, based on a compilation of rules, maxims, and guidelines formed over 4000 years of governance compiled in the form of a book referenced in the US Constitution. See, Art.1 sect. 8 para. 10; "To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offenses against the *"LAW OF NATIONS".* 

The Law of Nations is a Book!

Most of you went to centralized centers of education... think you were missled? facts misrepresented?


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## Onyx

ibc said:


> Most of you went to centralized centers of education



IE, Reeducation camps


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## C_Clayton_Jones

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.


You should say that this is as ignorant as it is ridiculous and wrong.


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## Onyx

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> You should say that this is as ignorant as it is ridiculous and wrong.



Here comes C_Clayton_Jones right on que.

It is a hard days work, snobbishly dismissing political nonconformists.


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## Buck111

ibc said:


> The Constitution has either authorized such a government as we've had, or has been powerless to prevent it.  -Lysander Spooner.
> 
> Conclusively it is the former, i.e. ...it was "Authorized". The Preamble explains it unequivocally. It was not about the "common" man. The Constitution is a contract and your not a party to it.
> 
> This is a document drafted by the PEOPLE"  of the "UNITED STATES" _for,_  the "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"  The "PEOPLE"  guaranteed that the debt payments of the "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"
> would be made to the King. -Article 6, clause 1
> 
> _"All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation"._
> 
> The United States of America founded under the Confederation of states went into debt to fight the war against the King. The king tired of the war and had other issues in Europe agreed to conclude the war with the Treaty of Paris in 1783. This agreement was the repayment of the loans authored by the said countries in that treaty. Article 4 of this treaty puts their (The Kings) claws in our buttocks.
> 
> The United States of America, the 13 colonies, became disunited, fought amongst themselves, refused to pay their share of the debts, and was gaining the attention of the king for failure to pay. Because of this disunity, 55 *PEOPLE* gathered together and attended meetings to reorganize and centralize the power of government and to agree to form a new entity called the "UNITED STATES" in 1787. Only 39 of those attendee's signed the constitution forming our present style of government.
> 
> The Preamble  of the Constitution paraphrases to the King what these 39 individuals intend to do with the original agreement and how they are going to run the country.
> 
> We the *P*eople [capitol *"P"* changes legal meaning in contract law, and applies to the signatories only] *(which formed the entity)* of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect *"Union",* establish justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our "*P"*osterity. See Black's 6th ed.  _"All the descendants of a person in a direct line to the remotest generation", _do ordain and establish this Constitution *[for*] the United States of America.
> 
> One entity did FOR another entity. See Art.1, sect 2, para. 3; "...the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States". Not the United States of America.
> 
> This contract, Constitution is founded, abides and is subservient to  international law, based on a compilation of rules, maxims, and guidelines formed over 4000 years of governance compiled in the form of a book referenced in the US Constitution.  See, Art.1 sect. 8 para. 10; "To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offenses against the *"LAW OF NATIONS".*
> 
> The Law of Nations is a Book!
> 
> Most of you went to centralized centers of education... think you were missled?  facts  misrepresented?



Thank you for adding to the conversation. 



> The Constitution has either authorized such a government as we've had, or has been powerless to prevent it.  -Lysander Spooner.
> 
> Conclusively it is the former, i.e. ...it was "Authorized". The Preamble explains it unequivocally. It was not about the "common" man. The Constitution is a contract and your not a party to it.



A contract requires a meeting of the minds and a signature. Only the original signers of the CONstitution ever agreed upon it and to it. Therefore it only applies to them and they are dead. Government knows this and that is one of the reasons the united states became the United States, a corporation (a business).


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## Onyx

Buck111 said:


> A contract requires a meeting of the minds and a signature. Only the original signers of the CONstitution ever agreed upon it and to it. Therefore it only applies to them and they are dead. Government knows this and that is one of the reasons the united states became the United States, a corporation (a business).



The statist argument is that you do not need to sign a social contract to consent to a social contract. 

To justify the tyranny of the state, they argue that if one lives among society, then they are party to the laws that society creates. There are several fallacies with this logic, most prominently being...

1. Nothing legitimizes the state as the voice for society

2. Society refers to the collective population, meaning 100% of all members. In this regard, no majority or minority in a society has the right to speak for everyone.


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## Buck111

> * NT.6.0.1*
> 
> The first and second numbers of this series were published in 1867. For reasons not necessary to be explained, the _sixth_ is now published in advance of the third, fourth, and fifth.
> NO TREASON
> No. VI.
> 
> THE CONSTITUTION OF NO AUTHORITY.
> 
> 
> *I.
> NT.6.1.1* The Constitution has no inherent authority or obligation. It has no authority or obligation at all, unless as a contract between man and man. And it does not so much as even purport to be a contract between persons now existing. It purports, at most, to be only a contract between persons living eighty years ago. And it can be supposed to have been a contract then only between persons who had already come to years of discretion, so as to be competent to make reasonable and obligatory contracts. Furthermore, we know, historically, that only a small portion even of the people then existing were consulted on the subject, or asked, or permitted to express either their consent or dissent in any formal manner. Those persons, if any, who did give their consent formally, are all dead now. Most of them have been dead forty, fifty, sixty, or seventy years. _And the constitution, so far as it was their contract, died with them_. They had no natural power or right to make it obligatory upon their children. It is not only plainly impossible, in the nature of things, that they _could_ bind their posterity, but they did not even attempt to bind them. That is to say, the instrument does not purport to be an agreement between any body but “the people” _then_ existing; nor does it, either expressly or impliedly, assert any right, power, or disposition, on their part, to bind anybody but themselves. Let us see. Its language is:
> 
> “We, the people of the United States (that is, the people _then existing_ in the United States), in order to form a more perfect union, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves _and our posterity_, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”
> *NT.6.1.2* It is plain, in the first place, that this language, _as an agreement_, purports to be only what it at most really was, viz., a contract between the people then existing; and, of necessity, binding, as a contract, only upon those _then existing_. In the second place, the language neither expresses nor implies that they had any right or power, to _bind_ their “posterity” to live under it. It does not say that their “posterity” will, shall, or must live under it. It only says, in effect, that their hopes and motives in adopting it were that it might prove useful to their posterity, as well as to themselves, by promoting their union, safety, tranquility, liberty, etc.



For those who would like to expand their minds and learn the truth, you can continue reading Lysander Spooners 'NO TREASON' at Lysander Spooner – No Treason No. 6: The Constitution of No Authority


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## Onyx

Buck111 said:


> For those who would like to expand their minds and learn the truth, you can continue reading Lysander Spooners 'NO TREASON' at Lysander Spooner – No Treason No. 6: The Constitution of No Authority



I have a whole library of anarchist literature. Are you an anarchist?


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## Buck111

Onyx said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> For those who would like to expand their minds and learn the truth, you can continue reading Lysander Spooners 'NO TREASON' at Lysander Spooner – No Treason No. 6: The Constitution of No Authority
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a whole library of anarchist literature. Are you an anarchist?
Click to expand...


I lean that way, but I don't confine myself to any certain dogma or beliefs. Especially any that are political or even quasi-political. I find it easier living with myself when I am not trying to live by others ideals.

Am sure you are familiar with Larken Rose. I think when Rose speaks in his videos (you can find him on YouTube, ladies and gentlemen) he speaks what people already know but were afraid to realize. He has opened a lot of peoples eyes.


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## Deleted member 61768

Only we the people can keep or give up what the founding fathers set forth. I am willing to die for my freedoms; are you?


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## AnCap'n_Murica

C_Clayton_Jones said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> You should say that this is as ignorant as it is ridiculous and wrong.
Click to expand...


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## ibc

Paparock said:


> Only we the people can keep or give up what the founding fathers set forth. I am willing to die for my freedoms; are you?[
> 
> If you are referring to the type of sacrifice in the war of independence of 1775-1783, the answer is no!
> 
> That war was a mercenary army fighting for the People's cause not yours. -emphasis mine.  _"On June 17, 1783, Congress received a message from soldiers of the _*CONTINENTAL ARMY *_stationed in Philadelphia, which demanded payment for their service during the American Revolutionary war. The soldiers threatened to take action that day if their complaints were not addressed. Congress ignored their message, but the soldiers did not act on their threat. Two days later, however, the Congress received word that a group of about 80 soldiers had left their post at Lancaster, Pennsylvania, approximately 60 miles west of Philadelphia, and had joined with the soldiers stationed at the city barracks. The group of approximately 500 men had effective control over the weapons stores and munition depot. The next morning on June 20, the State House was mobbed by as many as 400 soldiers demanding payment. The soldiers blocked the door and initially refused to allow the delegates to leave."  - Pennsylvania Mutiny of 1783
> 
> " *PEACE AT LAST: *The war for independence was all but won by 1783. Soldiers and civilians alike rejoiced. The army could be disbanded; officers and enlisted men could go home. The bad news was that the eight exhausting years of conflict had left the United States with an empty treasury and a staggering war debt. How would the government PAY the long-overdue money it owed to the soldiers of the Continental Army. let alone the special bounties and other reenlistment incentives so liberally offered during the darkest hours of war?
> 
> *A PRECARIOUS SITUATION: *Entire Continental regiments had mutinied over the lack of pay during the war. Now, some officers wanted to march the whole army to Philadelphia. They argued that only the threat of force would prevent Congress from abandoning its promise to provide Continental officers half pay pensions for life once the war ended. A moving address by Commander-in-Chief George Washington in March, 1783, defused this so-called Newburgh Conspiracy, but the situation remained precarious. The government shifted its attention to dispersing the angry, still unpaid rank and file.
> 
> *EMERGENCY MEASURES:* Congress decided to furlough rather than discharge most of the army in the months leading up to ratification of the peace treaty. Entire regiments marched to their home states under the tight control of their officers. An emergency loan enabled the government to give each soldier on month's pay in cash. Each man received the remainder of his back pay in government certificates redeemable for cash, plus interest at a future date. At General Washington's suggestion, soldiers were permitted to keep their uniforms, muskets and other army-issued equipment. Lacking decent clothing, food and other necessities, many men quickly spent what little cash they received and sold their certificates, muskets and other possessions to support themselves and their families. Only a few regiments remained under arms at West Point, New York, when Congress began formally discharging the entire army in the fall of 1783."  -Wars End: The Promises OF THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION _
> 
> 
> -Good day to all and that all is well.


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## ibc

Paparock said:


> Only we the people can keep or give up what the founding fathers set forth. I am willing to die for my freedoms; are you?


----------



## ibc

Paparock said:


> Only we the people can keep or give up what the founding fathers set forth. I am willing to die for my freedoms; are you?



You are willing to die for your freedoms? what freedoms? You have granted civil rights, are you referring to these? That which is granted can be un-granted. I'm assuming your are framing your question around the alleged sacrifices of the men who fought in the Revolutionary war from 1775-1783?  To answer your question, the answer is no!

Greetings,

That war was fought with a mercenary army for the People's rights and freedoms not yours.

*Pennsylvania Mutiny of 1783*
"On June 17, 1783, Congress received a message from soldiers of the Continental Army stationed in Philadelphia, which demanded payment for their service during the American Revolutionary War. The soldiers threatened to take action that day if their complaints were not addressed. Congress ignored their message, but the soldiers did not act on their threat. Two days later, however, the Congress received word that a group of about 80 soldiers had left their post at Lancaster, Pennsylvania, approximately 60 miles (97 km) west of Philadelphia, and had joined with the soldiers stationed at the city barracks. The group of approximately 500 men had effective control over the weapons stores and munition depot.[2]

*Protests*
The next morning on June 20, the State House was mobbed by as many as 400 soldiers demanding payment. The soldiers blocked the door and initially refused to allow the delegates to leave. Alexander Hamilton, then a delegate from New York, persuaded the soldiers to allow Congress to meet later to address their concerns. The soldiers did allow the members of Congress to peacefully adjourn that afternoon.[3] That evening, a small Congressional committee, headed by Hamilton, met in secret to draft a message to the Pennsylvania Council, asking them to protect Congress from the mutineers. The letter threatened that Congress would be forced to move elsewhere if the Council did not act.[2] -*Wikipedia*

*Peace at Last* 
The war for independence was all but won by 1783. Soldiers and civilians alike rejoiced. The army could be disbanded; officers and enlisted men could go home. The bad news was that eight exhausting years of conflict had left the United States with an empty treasury and a staggering war debt. How would the government pay the long-overdue money it owed to the soldiers of the Continental Army, let alone the special bounties and other reenlistment incentives so liberally offered during the darkest hours of the war?

*A Precarious Situation* 
Entire Continental regiments had mutinied over the lack of pay during the war. Now, some officers wanted to march the whole army to Philadelphia. They argued that only the threat of force would prevent Congress from abandoning its promise to provide Continental officers half pay pensions for life once the war ended. A moving address by Commander-in-Chief George Washington in March, 1783, defused this so-called Newburgh Conspiracy, but the situation remained precarious. The government shifted its attention to dispersing the angry, still unpaid rank and file.

*Emergency Measures* 
Congress decided to furlough rather than discharge most of the army in the months leading up to the ratification of the peace treaty. Entire regiments marched to their home states under the tight control of their officers. An emergency loan enabled the government to give each soldier one month's pay in cash. Each man received the remainder of his back pay in government certificates redeemable for cash, plus interest at a future date. At General Washington's suggestion, soldiers were permitted to keep their uniforms, muskets and other army-issued equipment. Lacking decent clothing, food and other necessities, many men quickly spent what little cash they received and sold their certificates, muskets and other possessions to support themselves and their families. Only a few regiments remained under arms at West Point, New York, when Congress began formally discharging the entire army in the fall of 1783.


*A Dangerous Situation* 
The end of the war was in sight by 1783, and not a moment too soon. The United States treasury was empty. Congress needed to shed the costly burden of maintaining the Continental Army as soon as possible. Yet, how could Congress peaceably disband these soldiers when it lacked the means to pay them? Whole regiments had rioted and even mutinied over the lack of pay and other perceived grievances during the war. Discharging officers and enlisted men without giving them their back pay, pensions and bonuses could spark a full scale uprising.

*Promises to Pay* 
Superintendent of Finance Robert Morris managed to negotiate a hasty cash loan that would put one month's pay in the soldiers' pockets. The remainder of their pay would be issued in government scrip that could be redeemed for cash at a later date. The government also generously allowed soldiers to keep their army-issued weapons, uniforms and equipment.

*Crisis Averted* 
Congress decided to furlough most of the men, rather than discharge them. After all, the peace treaty had not yet been finalized. The British army still occupied New York City; the army might be needed again. Regiments marched home under military discipline, thus preventing any disgruntled, ill-disciplined soldiers from looting the countryside or marching on Congress. Once they were safely dispersed, Congress issued official discharges to these men. The few remaining regiments stationed at West Point, New York, were discharged over the summer and fall. By the winter of 1783, the army was safely disbanded, and Congress had averted a serious crisis. - War's End: The Promises of the American Revolution, Shays Rebellion.


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## ibc

My apologies for the double post, I thought I deleted my original.... it ended up here.


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## Deleted member 61768

As an American we have more rights than any other individual on earth. Having been outside the United States and seen how others live I understand that. I also witnessed how ugly Americans can behave in foreign lands in their attitudes toward those they consider beneath them. As an officer I did what I could to at least try to get through to my own men but that was only a drop in the ocean but it has to start somewhere. Despite what politicians say "character does matter" and if you want to reach people you have to treat them the way you would treat your own family members. 

I saw G.I.s hang out car windows to slap local girls on the rear. I asked my men how they would react if they saw Communist Chinese soldiers do that to their sisters on the streets of their home towns and they would have been outraged so I asked why would you do it in a foreign country? I tried to teach these young guys just because you can do something does not mean it is OK because you are an American and you think you are doing it in fun. In a foreign country it can cost you your life.

With rights come obligations as rights are not free. They have been paid for in blood and I have friends that paid that price. You don't have to believe it or accept it but many millions know better. Me, I don't care about politics, oil, economics, but family and freedom. Touch those and your prospects of living to a ripe old age are slime and none. As I have said before, my father was a First Sgt. in WWII and he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk. By the time I entered college I had memorized the kill and wounding radiuses of all the mortar and artillery rounds in current use in the U.S. Army. In 1969 I started studying Gung Fu at Arkansas State Teachers College (under a former black U.S. Army Officer who volunteered his time to train our "Counter Insurgency Unit" run by the Special Forces in hand to hand combat as he was a specialist in open hand combat) to now Arkansas State University before transferring to Eastern New Mexico University where I graduated at the top of my ROTC class in military tactics. If one wants to be free one MUST be prepared to at any moment to defend that freedom be it from and outside force or an internal force seeking to take away our freedoms. The threat from those within our own society who would wish to take away our rights and freedoms is just as real as those from the outside. I laugh at the libtards  with their panties all in a twist over AR15 when any trained soldier knows the most feared many on any battlefield is the one trained with a scoped sighted sniper rifle which is usually bolt action. Be he a trained sniper, a designated marksman, or just a very well trained civilian in long range shooting along with, observation, field craft, escape and evasion, and camouflage he can reap great damage all out of proportion on a much larger force.


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## BULLDOG

Paparock said:


> As an American we have more rights than any other individual on earth. Having been outside the United States and seen how others live I understand that. I also witnessed how ugly Americans can behave in foreign lands in their attitudes toward those they consider beneath them. As an officer I did what I could to at least try to get through to my own men but that was only a drop in the ocean but it has to start somewhere. Despite what politicians say "character does matter" and if you want to reach people you have to treat them the way you would treat your own family members.
> 
> I saw G.I.s hang out car windows to slap local girls on the rear. I asked my men how they would react if they saw Communist Chinese soldiers do that to their sisters on the streets of their home towns and they would have been outraged so I asked why would you do it in a foreign country? I tried to teach these young guys just because you can do something does not mean it is OK because you are an American and you think you are doing it in fun. In a foreign country it can cost you your life.
> 
> With rights come obligations as rights are not free. They have been paid for in blood and I have friends that paid that price. You don't have to believe it or accept it but many millions know better. Me, I don't care about politics, oil, economics, but family and freedom. Touch those and your prospects of living to a ripe old age are slime and none. As I have said before, my father was a First Sgt. in WWII and he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk. By the time I entered college I had memorized the kill and wounding radiuses of all the mortar and artillery rounds in current use in the U.S. Army. In 1969 I started studying Gung Fu at Arkansas State Teachers College (under a former black U.S. Army Officer who volunteered his time to train our "Counter Insurgency Unit" run by the Special Forces in hand to hand combat as he was a specialist in open hand combat) to now Arkansas State University before transferring to Eastern New Mexico University where I graduated at the top of my ROTC class in military tactics. If one wants to be free one MUST be prepared to at any moment to defend that freedom be it from and outside force or an internal force seeking to take away our freedoms. The threat from those within our own society who would wish to take away our rights and freedoms is just as real as those from the outside. I laugh at the libtards  with their panties all in a twist over AR15 when any trained soldier knows the most feared many on any battlefield is the one trained with a scoped sighted sniper rifle which is usually bolt action. Be he a trained sniper, a designated marksman, or just a very well trained civilian in long range shooting along with, observation, field craft, escape and evasion, and camouflage he can reap great damage all out of proportion on a much larger force.



I agree with much of what you say, but most civilian gun crimes are not done by a trained sniper at a distance. They are done at reasonably close rage by someone with little or no training, and who almost indiscriminately puts as much lead in the air as possible.


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## Deleted member 61768

BULLDOG said:


> Paparock said:
> 
> 
> 
> As an American we have more rights than any other individual on earth. Having been outside the United States and seen how others live I understand that. I also witnessed how ugly Americans can behave in foreign lands in their attitudes toward those they consider beneath them. As an officer I did what I could to at least try to get through to my own men but that was only a drop in the ocean but it has to start somewhere. Despite what politicians say "character does matter" and if you want to reach people you have to treat them the way you would treat your own family members.
> 
> I saw G.I.s hang out car windows to slap local girls on the rear. I asked my men how they would react if they saw Communist Chinese soldiers do that to their sisters on the streets of their home towns and they would have been outraged so I asked why would you do it in a foreign country? I tried to teach these young guys just because you can do something does not mean it is OK because you are an American and you think you are doing it in fun. In a foreign country it can cost you your life.
> 
> With rights come obligations as rights are not free. They have been paid for in blood and I have friends that paid that price. You don't have to believe it or accept it but many millions know better. Me, I don't care about politics, oil, economics, but family and freedom. Touch those and your prospects of living to a ripe old age are slime and none. As I have said before, my father was a First Sgt. in WWII and he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk. By the time I entered college I had memorized the kill and wounding radiuses of all the mortar and artillery rounds in current use in the U.S. Army. In 1969 I started studying Gung Fu at Arkansas State Teachers College (under a former black U.S. Army Officer who volunteered his time to train our "Counter Insurgency Unit" run by the Special Forces in hand to hand combat as he was a specialist in open hand combat) to now Arkansas State University before transferring to Eastern New Mexico University where I graduated at the top of my ROTC class in military tactics. If one wants to be free one MUST be prepared to at any moment to defend that freedom be it from and outside force or an internal force seeking to take away our freedoms. The threat from those within our own society who would wish to take away our rights and freedoms is just as real as those from the outside. I laugh at the libtards  with their panties all in a twist over AR15 when any trained soldier knows the most feared many on any battlefield is the one trained with a scoped sighted sniper rifle which is usually bolt action. Be he a trained sniper, a designated marksman, or just a very well trained civilian in long range shooting along with, observation, field craft, escape and evasion, and camouflage he can reap great damage all out of proportion on a much larger force.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with much of what you say, but most civilian gun crimes are not done by a trained sniper at a distance. They are done at reasonably close rage by someone with little or no training, and who almost indiscriminately puts as much lead in the air as possible.
Click to expand...



Then that person should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law for their crime. The problem is in this country like in Chicago due to the liberal courts, judges, and politicians they are NOT. The Gangs are running wild on the streets caring illegal guns but when they commit gun crimes they are back on the street many times faster that the police that arrested them finish the paperwork. Look up on the internet how many times people are arrested for violent drug and gun crimes, released and re-arrested only to be re-released again onto the streets. If you commit a crime with a gun you should not be released but held for trial period! Many gangs are made of illegal aliens so they get automatically released because Chicago is a "sanctuary city" rather than have these gang banging criminals deported they are released back on your American streets. American lives don't matter because if they did why do American politicians keep releasing Criminal Felons back onto American streets time after time? Get It? We are not talking about chamber maids and gardeners we are talking about gang bangers, drug traffickers, rapists,  Child Molesters, Human Traffickers, and Armed Robbers here and they are routinely released back on American streets rather than held and reported to Federal Authorities!!! A people wonder why more people die on the streets of Chicago than in *Baghdad*, Iraq?  It is because the Democratic Machine that has dominated the city of Chicago most of the 20th Century has allowed Corruption to become the byword of Chicago from Al Copone to today GANGS have run wild in Chicago and the Democrats that have run Chicago have allowed it to continue administration after administration. So why is that? Oh, they blame everyone else but themselves yet it has been the Democratic Party that has run Chicago Politics, appointed judges to the courts, the prosecutor's office,  and still children are being shot down in the streets. New York City has gangs but they don't have this problem so why does Chicago? Use your mind and look at the facts.

Chicago is SOFT on crime and criminals and refuses to enforce law and order!!! Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws on the books so why don't they enforce them???


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## Buck111

Paparock said:


> *As an American we have more rights than any other individual on earth*. Having been outside the United States and seen how others live I understand that. I also witnessed how ugly Americans can behave in foreign lands in their attitudes toward those they consider beneath them. As an officer I did what I could to at least try to get through to my own men but that was only a drop in the ocean but it has to start somewhere. Despite what politicians say "character does matter" and if you want to reach people you have to treat them the way you would treat your own family members.
> 
> I saw G.I.s hang out car windows to slap local girls on the rear. I asked my men how they would react if they saw Communist Chinese soldiers do that to their sisters on the streets of their home towns and they would have been outraged so I asked why would you do it in a foreign country? I tried to teach these young guys just because you can do something does not mean it is OK because you are an American and you think you are doing it in fun. In a foreign country it can cost you your life.
> 
> With rights come obligations as rights are not free. They have been paid for in blood and I have friends that paid that price. You don't have to believe it or accept it but many millions know better. Me, I don't care about politics, oil, economics, but family and freedom. Touch those and your prospects of living to a ripe old age are slime and none. As I have said before, my father was a First Sgt. in WWII and he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk. By the time I entered college I had memorized the kill and wounding radiuses of all the mortar and artillery rounds in current use in the U.S. Army. In 1969 I started studying Gung Fu at Arkansas State Teachers College (under a former black U.S. Army Officer who volunteered his time to train our "Counter Insurgency Unit" run by the Special Forces in hand to hand combat as he was a specialist in open hand combat) to now Arkansas State University before transferring to Eastern New Mexico University where I graduated at the top of my ROTC class in military tactics. If one wants to be free one MUST be prepared to at any moment to defend that freedom be it from and outside force or an internal force seeking to take away our freedoms. The threat from those within our own society who would wish to take away our rights and freedoms is just as real as those from the outside. I laugh at the libtards  with their panties all in a twist over AR15 when any trained soldier knows the most feared many on any battlefield is the one trained with a scoped sighted sniper rifle which is usually bolt action. Be he a trained sniper, a designated marksman, or just a very well trained civilian in long range shooting along with, observation, field craft, escape and evasion, and camouflage he can reap great damage all out of proportion on a much larger force.



WRONG! The U.S. is not the freest country in the world (it is ranked at # 23 by the Cato Institute (and much lower by otheres)). Nor do you have "rights" in the U.S.S.A., you have privileges. Rights cannot be taken or amended, privileges can be and are.

Reads like your father had control issues ("...he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk.") and your acceptance of them shows you were well indoctrinated. Being a mercenary for the U.S. government does not/did not make you a hero.


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## esthermoon

Buck111 said:


> Paparock said:
> 
> 
> 
> *As an American we have more rights than any other individual on earth*. Having been outside the United States and seen how others live I understand that. I also witnessed how ugly Americans can behave in foreign lands in their attitudes toward those they consider beneath them. As an officer I did what I could to at least try to get through to my own men but that was only a drop in the ocean but it has to start somewhere. Despite what politicians say "character does matter" and if you want to reach people you have to treat them the way you would treat your own family members.
> 
> I saw G.I.s hang out car windows to slap local girls on the rear. I asked my men how they would react if they saw Communist Chinese soldiers do that to their sisters on the streets of their home towns and they would have been outraged so I asked why would you do it in a foreign country? I tried to teach these young guys just because you can do something does not mean it is OK because you are an American and you think you are doing it in fun. In a foreign country it can cost you your life.
> 
> With rights come obligations as rights are not free. They have been paid for in blood and I have friends that paid that price. You don't have to believe it or accept it but many millions know better. Me, I don't care about politics, oil, economics, but family and freedom. Touch those and your prospects of living to a ripe old age are slime and none. As I have said before, my father was a First Sgt. in WWII and he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk. By the time I entered college I had memorized the kill and wounding radiuses of all the mortar and artillery rounds in current use in the U.S. Army. In 1969 I started studying Gung Fu at Arkansas State Teachers College (under a former black U.S. Army Officer who volunteered his time to train our "Counter Insurgency Unit" run by the Special Forces in hand to hand combat as he was a specialist in open hand combat) to now Arkansas State University before transferring to Eastern New Mexico University where I graduated at the top of my ROTC class in military tactics. If one wants to be free one MUST be prepared to at any moment to defend that freedom be it from and outside force or an internal force seeking to take away our freedoms. The threat from those within our own society who would wish to take away our rights and freedoms is just as real as those from the outside. I laugh at the libtards  with their panties all in a twist over AR15 when any trained soldier knows the most feared many on any battlefield is the one trained with a scoped sighted sniper rifle which is usually bolt action. Be he a trained sniper, a designated marksman, or just a very well trained civilian in long range shooting along with, observation, field craft, escape and evasion, and camouflage he can reap great damage all out of proportion on a much larger force.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG! The U.S. is not the freest country in the world (it is ranked at # 23 by the Cato Institute (and much lower by otheres)). Nor do you have "rights" in the U.S.S.A., you have privileges. Rights cannot be taken or amended, privileges can be and are.
> 
> Reads like your father had control issues ("...he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk.") and your acceptance of them shows you were well indoctrinated. Being a mercenary for the U.S. government does not/did not make you a hero.
Click to expand...

Why did you write U.S.S.A.?


----------



## Buck111

esthermoon said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Paparock said:
> 
> 
> 
> *As an American we have more rights than any other individual on earth*. Having been outside the United States and seen how others live I understand that. I also witnessed how ugly Americans can behave in foreign lands in their attitudes toward those they consider beneath them. As an officer I did what I could to at least try to get through to my own men but that was only a drop in the ocean but it has to start somewhere. Despite what politicians say "character does matter" and if you want to reach people you have to treat them the way you would treat your own family members.
> 
> I saw G.I.s hang out car windows to slap local girls on the rear. I asked my men how they would react if they saw Communist Chinese soldiers do that to their sisters on the streets of their home towns and they would have been outraged so I asked why would you do it in a foreign country? I tried to teach these young guys just because you can do something does not mean it is OK because you are an American and you think you are doing it in fun. In a foreign country it can cost you your life.
> 
> With rights come obligations as rights are not free. They have been paid for in blood and I have friends that paid that price. You don't have to believe it or accept it but many millions know better. Me, I don't care about politics, oil, economics, but family and freedom. Touch those and your prospects of living to a ripe old age are slime and none. As I have said before, my father was a First Sgt. in WWII and he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk. By the time I entered college I had memorized the kill and wounding radiuses of all the mortar and artillery rounds in current use in the U.S. Army. In 1969 I started studying Gung Fu at Arkansas State Teachers College (under a former black U.S. Army Officer who volunteered his time to train our "Counter Insurgency Unit" run by the Special Forces in hand to hand combat as he was a specialist in open hand combat) to now Arkansas State University before transferring to Eastern New Mexico University where I graduated at the top of my ROTC class in military tactics. If one wants to be free one MUST be prepared to at any moment to defend that freedom be it from and outside force or an internal force seeking to take away our freedoms. The threat from those within our own society who would wish to take away our rights and freedoms is just as real as those from the outside. I laugh at the libtards  with their panties all in a twist over AR15 when any trained soldier knows the most feared many on any battlefield is the one trained with a scoped sighted sniper rifle which is usually bolt action. Be he a trained sniper, a designated marksman, or just a very well trained civilian in long range shooting along with, observation, field craft, escape and evasion, and camouflage he can reap great damage all out of proportion on a much larger force.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG! The U.S. is not the freest country in the world (it is ranked at # 23 by the Cato Institute (and much lower by otheres)). Nor do you have "rights" in the U.S.S.A., you have privileges. Rights cannot be taken or amended, privileges can be and are.
> 
> Reads like your father had control issues ("...he raised me to be a soldier from the time I could walk.") and your acceptance of them shows you were well indoctrinated. Being a mercenary for the U.S. government does not/did not make you a hero.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Why did you write U.S.S.A.?
Click to expand...


United Socialist States of America


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## P@triot

BULLDOG said:


> The ability to use the basic principles of the constitution to address issues that the founding fathers never thought about, and could never foresee is the only reason our constitution is as strong and resilient as it is, and the reason it has lasted as long as it has.  Only an idiot would think our defining document could be just as relevant now as it was a couple hundred years ago without some adaptation to match the times.


If needs to be "adapted" BULLDOG, there is a process for that. It's called the amendment process. You do *not* get to arbitrarily adapt it because you think it needs to be.


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## regent

So why don't they amend the Constitution? The Alabama Constitution has been amended over 800 times. Our Constitution In effect has been modified probably a few hundred times. For example, Archibald Cox has written that one of the ways the Court
has interpreted the commerce clause it can be used is to regulate many other things besides interstate commerce.


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## regent

AnCap'n_Murica said:


> Comparing the long train of abuses listed in the Declaration of Independence to the current political conditions, it's easy to recognize that the Constitution has been entirely ineffective at constraining government.


The Declaration was not meant to set forth a government but to gain support for independence, in short it was propaganda. Independence had already been voted on and the Declaration was voted on two days later. The abuses of George III were really abuses of Parliament but it was easier and more effective to blame one individual, the king.


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## emilynghiem

regent said:


> AnCap'n_Murica said:
> 
> 
> 
> Comparing the long train of abuses listed in the Declaration of Independence to the current political conditions, it's easy to recognize that the Constitution has been entirely ineffective at constraining government.
> 
> 
> 
> The Declaration was not meant to set forth a government but to gain support for independence, in short it was propaganda. Independence had already been voted on and the Declaration was voted on two days later. The abuses of George III were really abuses of Parliament but it was easier and more effective to blame one individual, the king.
Click to expand...


Hi regent sorry to jump into this late, but your last post caught my attention.
I have been looking for Constitutional lawyers and advocates to address this WHOLE issue of "political beliefs."

And yes, clearly, people are still using their Constitutional arguments and INTERPRETATIONS to push their BELIEFS.

Before this time period, the people with the power ie land owners were more in unison.  Then with the growing democracy and diversity, more populations "outside the power based on ownership" started INCREASINGLY REPRESENTING THE BELIEF that govt should be for promoting and providing for general welfare.

Before, these voices were outdominated by the people who actually owned property. The OPINION and BELIEF that govt was supposed to SERVE the public and ESTABLISH the will of the people was historically there, but kept in check by the more powerful people who actually owned and conducted business.

But now with democratized media and parties able to communicate collectively, with or without ownership, that OPINION or BELIEF about the role of govt has become equal if not dominant over the prevailing INTERPRETATION of govt as being CHECKED and LIMITED by the Constitution (not using or depending on govt to provide, distribute and manage resources and social programs FOR the people).

These two different beliefs have always been there,
like two different denominations by tradition.

Now that BOTH SIDES are coming out in the media complaining of being oppressed by the other,
is it possible NOW to hold Constitutional Conventions to ADDRESS these two schools of BELIEFS?

the party that focuses on "health care as a right" and wanting GOVT to be the central source of social programs to "guarantee equal access and provisions for the general populations

the party that focuses on LIMITED govt and the rights and responsibilities belonging to people and states first, NOT bogging down federal govt with social programs and decisions best made locally and not globally for the entire nation who don't fit under one policy fits all.

That's what I'd like to see come out of this generation.
To finally address this split instead of dancing around it or worse bullying each other for dominance in media, party politics, and govt.


----------



## esthermoon

regent said:


> So why don't they amend the Constitution? The Alabama Constitution has been amended over 800 times. Our Constitution In effect has been modified probably a few hundred times. For example, Archibald Cox has written that one of the ways the Court
> has interpreted the commerce clause it can be used is to regulate many other things besides interstate commerce.


I think the US Constitution is not easy to amend 

Why is it so difficult to amend the Constitution? | Reference.com


----------



## Buck111

Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.


Suspended by the government? Which amendments have been suspended?


----------



## regent

Can a written Constitution change as the nation changes?


----------



## BULLDOG

regent said:


> Can a written Constitution change as the nation changes?



It already has.


----------



## ScienceRocks

BULLDOG said:


> regent said:
> 
> 
> 
> Can a written Constitution change as the nation changes?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It already has.
Click to expand...


Yep, through Judaical review and case law.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.


And replaced by what?


----------



## esthermoon

Buck111 said:


> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.


Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?


----------



## Unkotare

Buck111 said:


> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.




Is that supposed to be a joke?


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> And replaced by what?
Click to expand...

Freedom.


----------



## Buck111

esthermoon said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?
Click to expand...

No, I don't. As I have said many times, the constitution is nothing but a con game. All constitutions are. Words on paper protect, nor guarantee, anything. Constitutions give validity to invalid governments.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> And replaced by what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Freedom.
Click to expand...

air head hippy wants to replace our Constitution with....... freedom. One needs a middle school education to know that means less than nothing


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I don't. As I have said many times, the constitution is nothing but a con game. All constitutions are. Words on paper protect, nor guarantee, anything. Constitutions give validity to invalid governments.
Click to expand...


Obviously you are BSing since you oddly forgot to tell us whats give validity to valid govt.
Wait let m e guess, is it freedom that gives validity to a valid govt??


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.


obviously, everything imperfect should be thrown out!!!


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> And replaced by what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Freedom.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> air head hippy wants to replace our Constitution with....... freedom. One needs a middle school education to know that means less than nothing
Click to expand...


*While I can appreciate your humorous personal attacks, I have an issue with understanding your objection to being free. *



EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Obviously you are BSing since you oddly forgot to tell us whats give validity to valid govt.
> Wait let m e guess, is it freedom that gives validity to a valid govt??



*There is nothing valid about government such as you have here - It robs the individual of being an individual and makes collectivism the norm. The individual can be free while the follower becomes the slave to group compliance. *



EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> obviously, everything imperfect should be thrown out!!!
Click to expand...


*Would you keep cancer if you could throw it out? The U.S. CONstitution has 27 amendments (changes) to it. If something is so imperfect it needs 27 changes, do you keep it? Amendments are not voted on by the People (nor was the original CONstitution) but are decided by CONgress or legislatures. My bet is you didn't know that. Ratification...fuck it, am not here to type for hours to teach you. 

Betting you think the 13th Amendment abolished slavery, don't you? Well, it didn't. But you don't know that, do you? You don't know jack shit about the CON(game)stitution you want to argue in favor of, do you? You are the typical, brainwashed "'murica first" sheeple who has never bothered reading the CONstitution, let alone studied it, aren't you? You wallow in pride and patriotism, when you know not why you do so, don't you?

One final question: Did you know the original Bill of Rights had 12 (not 10) articles (not amendments)? 

Don't bring bare knuckles to a gunfight, son.
*


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I don't. As I have said many times, the constitution is nothing but a con game. All constitutions are. Words on paper protect, nor guarantee, anything. Constitutions give validity to invalid governments.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Obviously you are BSing since you oddly forgot to tell us whats give validity to valid govt.
> Wait let m e guess, is it freedom that gives validity to a valid govt??
Click to expand...


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> And replaced by what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Freedom.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> air head hippy wants to replace our Constitution with....... freedom. One needs a middle school education to know that means less than nothing
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *While I can appreciate your humorous personal attacks, I have an issue with understanding your objection to being free. *
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> Obviously you are BSing since you oddly forgot to tell us whats give validity to valid govt.
> Wait let m e guess, is it freedom that gives validity to a valid govt??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *There is nothing valid about government such as you have here - It robs the individual of being an individual and makes collectivism the norm. The individual can be free while the follower becomes the slave to group compliance. *
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> obviously, everything imperfect should be thrown out!!!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> *Would you keep cancer if you could throw it out? The U.S. CONstitution has 27 amendments (changes) to it. If something is so imperfect it needs 27 changes, do you keep it? Amendments are not voted on by the People (nor was the original CONstitution) but are decided by CONgress or legislatures. My bet is you didn't know that. Ratification...fuck it, am not here to type for hours to teach you.
> 
> Betting you think the 13th Amendment abolished slavery, don't you? Well, it didn't. But you don't know that, do you? You don't know jack shit about the CON(game)stitution you want to argue in favor of, do you? You are the typical, brainwashed "'murica first" sheeple who has never bothered reading the CONstitution, let alone studied it, aren't you? You wallow in pride and patriotism, when you know not why you do so, don't you?
> 
> One final question: Did you know the original Bill of Rights had 12 (not 10) articles (not amendments)?
> 
> Don't bring bare knuckles to a gunfight, son.
> *
Click to expand...

Obviously you are BSing since you oddly forgot to tell us whats give validity to valid govt.
Wait let m e guess, is it freedom that gives validity to a valid govt??


----------



## esthermoon

Buck111 said:


> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I don't. As I have said many times, the constitution is nothing but a con game. All constitutions are. Words on paper protect, nor guarantee, anything. Constitutions give validity to invalid governments.
Click to expand...

I know all constitutions and laws are imperfect. Perfection does not exist.
Anyways a society can't survive without some kind of legal regulations


----------



## Buck111

esthermoon said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I don't. As I have said many times, the constitution is nothing but a con game. All constitutions are. Words on paper protect, nor guarantee, anything. Constitutions give validity to invalid governments.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know all constitutions and laws are imperfect. Perfection does not exist.
> Anyways a society can't survive without some kind of legal regulations View attachment 123988
Click to expand...

Do you know, in the U.S., there are so many "legal regulations"/laws it is said they cannot be counted in one life time? There are more than 20,000 federal laws just concerning guns. 
The perfect law would be: "Do no harm to others or equal harm will be done to you." 
Everything in the U.S. is regulated. _Everything. _There is no such thing as freedom, only freedumb (the illusion to dummies that they are free)


----------



## esthermoon

Buck111 said:


> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Since the CONstitution needs amending from time to time, it is not a _perfect_ document. Since it is not a perfect document, it needs to be thrown out.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think a new Constitution for your country would be better than the present one Buck111?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I don't. As I have said many times, the constitution is nothing but a con game. All constitutions are. Words on paper protect, nor guarantee, anything. Constitutions give validity to invalid governments.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know all constitutions and laws are imperfect. Perfection does not exist.
> Anyways a society can't survive without some kind of legal regulations View attachment 123988
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Do you know, in the U.S., there are so many "legal regulations"/laws it is said they cannot be counted in one life time? There are more than 20,000 federal laws just concerning guns.
> The perfect law would be: "Do no harm to others or equal harm will be done to you."
> Everything in the U.S. is regulated. _Everything. _There is no such thing as freedom, only freedumb (the illusion to dummies that they are free)
Click to expand...

I think it's the same all over the world. In Modern Era all laws are written, traditions mean nothing nowadays.
In the past things were different: they have only few written laws 
For example here we have too many laws, everything is regulated here (I think that maybe we have more laws than USA)


----------



## Buck111

According to heritage.org, the U.S. is 17th freest country in the world and Vietnam is ranked at 147.
Country Rankings: World & Global Economy Rankings on Economic Freedom

The truth is, human beings were not meant to be ruled and controlled by other human beings. Governments are the very thing that takes freedoms away from people. If every government in the world were to magically disappear, human beings would be able to get along with each other just fine. People are, for the most part, responsible. Good people do not wish to harm their neighbors or to steal from each other. Nor do good people do so.

Constitutions and laws are written to give the people the illusion they have "rights" and are being protected. Both are lies. People do not have government issued or protected "rights"; people have "privileges" under government. Government can, and will, take any so called "right" away from the individual at its whim. Protection? The government offers none to the individual.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> The government offers none to the individual.


really stupid since libertarian govt is better than anarchy! Libertarianism is when the people create a govt to help protect their natural right to freedom. We don't need a left over hippie reinventing the wheel! Sorry


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> The government offers none to the individual.
> 
> 
> 
> really stupid since libertarian govt is better than anarchy! Libertarianism is when the people create a govt to help protect their natural right to freedom. We don't need a left over hippie reinventing the wheel! Sorry
Click to expand...

Libertarian is the third less evil party in U.S. government - the first two being Republican and Democrat. None the less it is evil in that it is supportive of government.

Sorry, son, I am not an anarchist or any other -ist. Nor am I now, nor have I ever been, a hippy. Not that I have anything against anarchists or hippies, just that I am  not a part of any collective. I simply see myself as a man; an individual. Freedom does not come by following, or being a part of a herd; freedom comes from being apart from the herd. When a man thinks he needs leaders to guide him then he is lost. A man who can lead himself is found. 

Jesus was a man who followed nobody. He needed no government because he was fully capable of governing himself. Although I am not a religious man, I do find a path in his examples.


----------



## esthermoon

Buck111 said:


> According to heritage.org, the U.S. is 17th freest country in the world and Vietnam is ranked at 147.
> Country Rankings: World & Global Economy Rankings on Economic Freedom
> 
> The truth is, human beings were not meant to be ruled and controlled by other human beings. Governments are the very thing that takes freedoms away from people. If every government in the world were to magically disappear, human beings would be able to get along with each other just fine. People are, for the most part, responsible. Good people do not wish to harm their neighbors or to steal from each other. Nor do good people do so.
> 
> Constitutions and laws are written to give the people the illusion they have "rights" and are being protected. Both are lies. People do not have government issued or protected "rights"; people have "privileges" under government. Government can, and will, take any so called "right" away from the individual at its whim. Protection? The government offers none to the individual.


I know constitutions and laws just give illusions because almost 90% you can't see in the real world what they promise but I think they're necessary. Where there's no law things don't work and you have many problems


----------



## Buck111

esthermoon said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to heritage.org, the U.S. is 17th freest country in the world and Vietnam is ranked at 147.
> Country Rankings: World & Global Economy Rankings on Economic Freedom
> 
> The truth is, human beings were not meant to be ruled and controlled by other human beings. Governments are the very thing that takes freedoms away from people. If every government in the world were to magically disappear, human beings would be able to get along with each other just fine. People are, for the most part, responsible. Good people do not wish to harm their neighbors or to steal from each other. Nor do good people do so.
> 
> Constitutions and laws are written to give the people the illusion they have "rights" and are being protected. Both are lies. People do not have government issued or protected "rights"; people have "privileges" under government. Government can, and will, take any so called "right" away from the individual at its whim. Protection? The government offers none to the individual.
> 
> 
> 
> I know constitutions and laws just give illusions because almost 90% you can't see in the real world what they promise but I think they're necessary. Where there's no law things don't work and you have many problems View attachment 124140
Click to expand...

Who would make the laws and who would enforce the laws?
There are natural laws that every animal understands. Except humans. Humans don't understand natural laws because humans have been trained to believe they need special laws to protect them.


----------



## esthermoon

Buck111 said:


> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to heritage.org, the U.S. is 17th freest country in the world and Vietnam is ranked at 147.
> Country Rankings: World & Global Economy Rankings on Economic Freedom
> 
> The truth is, human beings were not meant to be ruled and controlled by other human beings. Governments are the very thing that takes freedoms away from people. If every government in the world were to magically disappear, human beings would be able to get along with each other just fine. People are, for the most part, responsible. Good people do not wish to harm their neighbors or to steal from each other. Nor do good people do so.
> 
> Constitutions and laws are written to give the people the illusion they have "rights" and are being protected. Both are lies. People do not have government issued or protected "rights"; people have "privileges" under government. Government can, and will, take any so called "right" away from the individual at its whim. Protection? The government offers none to the individual.
> 
> 
> 
> I know constitutions and laws just give illusions because almost 90% you can't see in the real world what they promise but I think they're necessary. Where there's no law things don't work and you have many problems View attachment 124140
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who would make the laws and who would enforce the laws?
> There are natural laws that every animal understands. Except humans. Humans don't understand natural laws because humans have been trained to believe they need special laws to protect them.
Click to expand...

Natural laws can be cruel. You know in the natural world nobody help you if you need it...
Nature has no pity. I think this is the reason we did create another "world", a human world with artificial laws


----------



## koshergrl

Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.

News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.

Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.


----------



## koshergrl

Buck111 said:


> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to heritage.org, the U.S. is 17th freest country in the world and Vietnam is ranked at 147.
> Country Rankings: World & Global Economy Rankings on Economic Freedom
> 
> The truth is, human beings were not meant to be ruled and controlled by other human beings. Governments are the very thing that takes freedoms away from people. If every government in the world were to magically disappear, human beings would be able to get along with each other just fine. People are, for the most part, responsible. Good people do not wish to harm their neighbors or to steal from each other. Nor do good people do so.
> 
> Constitutions and laws are written to give the people the illusion they have "rights" and are being protected. Both are lies. People do not have government issued or protected "rights"; people have "privileges" under government. Government can, and will, take any so called "right" away from the individual at its whim. Protection? The government offers none to the individual.
> 
> 
> 
> I know constitutions and laws just give illusions because almost 90% you can't see in the real world what they promise but I think they're necessary. Where there's no law things don't work and you have many problems View attachment 124140
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who would make the laws and who would enforce the laws?
> There are natural laws that every animal understands. Except humans. Humans don't understand natural laws because humans have been trained to believe they need special laws to protect them.
Click to expand...


Shut up, you psycho. 

Humans do understand natural laws, and they choose to set their sights at a higher standard of behavior.


----------



## Votto

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



It is interesting to note that early in American History they passed the Alien and Sedition Acts, that essentially made it illegal to speak out against government.  Thomas Jefferson then rose to power and later struck down most of it, luckily. 

However, FDR later came along and used the left over provisions to lock up innocent Japanese  Americans.

It is obvious to all that the acts were not constitutional, nor was FDR's act constitutional.  No one denies this yet the Constitution was violated without so much as a peep.

I don't count Jefferson striking it down as a check or balance, rather, we just got lucky he won the Oval Office when he did.


----------



## Unkotare

Votto said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is interesting to note that early in American History they passed the Alien and Sedition Acts, that essentially made it illegal to speak out against government.  Thomas Jefferson then rose to power and later struck down most of it, luckily.
> 
> However, FDR later came along and used the left over provisions to lock up innocent Japanese  Americans.
> 
> It is obvious to all that the acts were not constitutional, nor was FDR's act constitutional.  No one denies this yet the Constitution was violated without so much as a peep.
> 
> I don't count Jefferson striking it down as a check or balance, rather, we just got lucky he won the Oval Office when he did.
Click to expand...





Wow, you've got your History pretty muddled.


----------



## GHook93

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.



You know very little about the constitution small fry!


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> Libertarian is the third less evil party in U.S. government - the first two being Republican and Democrat. None the less it is evil in that it is supportive of government.
> 
> Sorry, son, I am not an anarchist



if you don't like Republicans Democrats Libertarians or  anarchists doesn't that make you an idiot??


----------



## koshergrl

GHook93 said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know very little about the constitution small fry!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...


He doesn't care, he isn't interested in the constitution. He's interested in the subversion of our republic, and the indoctrination of children, and a global society.


----------



## Votto

Unkotare said:


> Votto said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is interesting to note that early in American History they passed the Alien and Sedition Acts, that essentially made it illegal to speak out against government.  Thomas Jefferson then rose to power and later struck down most of it, luckily.
> 
> However, FDR later came along and used the left over provisions to lock up innocent Japanese  Americans.
> 
> It is obvious to all that the acts were not constitutional, nor was FDR's act constitutional.  No one denies this yet the Constitution was violated without so much as a peep.
> 
> I don't count Jefferson striking it down as a check or balance, rather, we just got lucky he won the Oval Office when he did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, you've got your History pretty muddled.
Click to expand...


It's nice to retort with actual substance.  What was muddled?


----------



## koshergrl

Votto said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Votto said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is interesting to note that early in American History they passed the Alien and Sedition Acts, that essentially made it illegal to speak out against government.  Thomas Jefferson then rose to power and later struck down most of it, luckily.
> 
> However, FDR later came along and used the left over provisions to lock up innocent Japanese  Americans.
> 
> It is obvious to all that the acts were not constitutional, nor was FDR's act constitutional.  No one denies this yet the Constitution was violated without so much as a peep.
> 
> I don't count Jefferson striking it down as a check or balance, rather, we just got lucky he won the Oval Office when he did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, you've got your History pretty muddled.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's nice to retort with actual substance.  What was muddled?
Click to expand...

He doesn't know. He's the one who is muddled, but pursuant to the creed of leftist minions, he is obligated to blame others for his confusion.


----------



## Buck111

koshergrl said:


> Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.
> 
> News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.
> 
> Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.


Angry little feller, aren't you?

Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today. 

The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that. 

Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).  

Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.


----------



## Buck111

GHook93 said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know very little about the constitution small fry!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
Click to expand...

There is a debate section on this board. I would be happy to finish this with you there.


----------



## koshergrl

Buck111 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.
> 
> News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.
> 
> Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.
> 
> 
> 
> Angry little feller, aren't you?
> 
> Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today.
> 
> The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that.
> 
> Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).
> 
> Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.
Click to expand...


Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.

I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution. 

I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.


----------



## koshergrl

Buck111 said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is juvenile nonsense.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What evidence do you have to support your accusation?
Click to expand...


You didn't provide any evidence or source in your op. It's a flame and garbage, and needs to be moved.


----------



## Buck111

esthermoon said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> esthermoon said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to heritage.org, the U.S. is 17th freest country in the world and Vietnam is ranked at 147.
> Country Rankings: World & Global Economy Rankings on Economic Freedom
> 
> The truth is, human beings were not meant to be ruled and controlled by other human beings. Governments are the very thing that takes freedoms away from people. If every government in the world were to magically disappear, human beings would be able to get along with each other just fine. People are, for the most part, responsible. Good people do not wish to harm their neighbors or to steal from each other. Nor do good people do so.
> 
> Constitutions and laws are written to give the people the illusion they have "rights" and are being protected. Both are lies. People do not have government issued or protected "rights"; people have "privileges" under government. Government can, and will, take any so called "right" away from the individual at its whim. Protection? The government offers none to the individual.
> 
> 
> 
> I know constitutions and laws just give illusions because almost 90% you can't see in the real world what they promise but I think they're necessary. Where there's no law things don't work and you have many problems View attachment 124140
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Who would make the laws and who would enforce the laws?
> There are natural laws that every animal understands. Except humans. Humans don't understand natural laws because humans have been trained to believe they need special laws to protect them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Natural laws can be cruel. You know in the natural world nobody help you if you need it...
> Nature has no pity. I think this is the reason we did create another "world", a human world with artificial laws
Click to expand...


This is what I mean about human beings not understanding natural laws. The first law of nature is the most basic of all law - survival. That's all it is. It isn't about happiness or who dies with the most toys - It's all about survival. That's it. Even in the human world, survival is our first objective. People tend to forget that and think there is something more to it all when there isn't. 

Sadly people believe laws of men somehow protect them; keep them safe. They don't. Laws of men create rulers and rulers are not subject to the rules they control the masses with.


----------



## Buck111

koshergrl said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.
> 
> News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.
> 
> Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.
> 
> 
> 
> Angry little feller, aren't you?
> 
> Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today.
> 
> The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that.
> 
> Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).
> 
> Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.
> 
> I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution.
> 
> I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.
Click to expand...


"Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution. 

Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?

Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?


----------



## koshergrl

Buck111 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.
> 
> News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.
> 
> Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.
> 
> 
> 
> Angry little feller, aren't you?
> 
> Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today.
> 
> The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that.
> 
> Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).
> 
> Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.
> 
> I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution.
> 
> I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution.
> 
> Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
Click to expand...

it is the foundation upon which the freest and most successful republic in the history of the world rests. So fuck off, you're a worthless punk.


----------



## Marion Morrison

Buck111 said:


> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.


----------



## Buck111

koshergrl said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.
> 
> News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.
> 
> Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.
> 
> 
> 
> Angry little feller, aren't you?
> 
> Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today.
> 
> The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that.
> 
> Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).
> 
> Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.
> 
> I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution.
> 
> I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution.
> 
> Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> it is the foundation upon which the freest and most successful republic in the history of the world rests. So fuck off, you're a worthless punk.
Click to expand...

Thank you very much for the opportunity to show truth beats anger every time.


----------



## koshergrl

Buck111 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Oh look a bunch of fucking traitors getting together and promoting the lie that our constitution is worthless, and ineffective. Here they are to repeat the lie that it is the adherence to the constitution, rather than the undermining of it, that is destroying our country.
> 
> News flash..the reason our country is in deep shit is because commie pigs have been undermining the constitution and breaking the law, with the express goal of destroying our country and replacing freedom and democracy with communism.
> 
> Fuck off, pigs. You ought to be jailed or executed, and I hope that you are soon.
> 
> 
> 
> Angry little feller, aren't you?
> 
> Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today.
> 
> The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that.
> 
> Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).
> 
> Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.
> 
> I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution.
> 
> I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution.
> 
> Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> it is the foundation upon which the freest and most successful republic in the history of the world rests. So fuck off, you're a worthless punk.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thank you very much for the opportunity to show truth beats anger every time.
Click to expand...

 If you don't think you come across as unhinged in your hatred of liberty and denial of history, you're stupid as you are worthless and angry.


----------



## Buck111

koshergrl said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Angry little feller, aren't you?
> 
> Your CONstitution was written over 200 years ago by a group of rich men who decided non Whites were not human beings, women were of no importance and only land owners could vote. 200 years ago you would be screeching like a little girl in favor of it just as you are screeching like a little girl in favor of it today.
> 
> The Republicon messiah, the Orange Fuhrer, Donald Trump, blasted the CONstitution thusly: *“It’s a very rough system,” he said. “It’s an archaic system … It’s really a bad thing for the country.” *Seems to me you might wanna send ol' Donny an email. But you wont. That might put you on some list with guys like me. And you're to chickenshit to want that.
> 
> Every 4th of July you probably blow up massive fireworks and wave dainty little flags as you brag about your "freedumbs" and guzzle six packs of beer. Of course you curse commies as you once again shoot off another firecracker (made in communist China) and kiss your dainty little flag (also made in communist China). Then you put on your prideful T-shirt that reads, " 'murica! Love it or leave it!" (also made in communist China and sold at Walmart, where you do a lot of your shopping).
> 
> Wave your flags and talk your shit, but remember, you sold out your economy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.
> 
> I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution.
> 
> I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> "Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution.
> 
> Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> it is the foundation upon which the freest and most successful republic in the history of the world rests. So fuck off, you're a worthless punk.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thank you very much for the opportunity to show truth beats anger every time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don't think you come across as unhinged in your hatred of liberty and denial of history, you're stupid as you are worthless and angry.
Click to expand...

So I hate liberty? I did not know that. Thank you very much for enlightening me. Can we be best friends?


----------



## Marion Morrison

Buck111 said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, traitors and punks who tell lies and agitate to destroy our nation piss me off.
> 
> I'm not a feller, though. You pieces of shit sold us out to China, however. By overregulating and shutting down our industry, by restricting access to our own resources, and by inviting foreigners in to the country to capitalize on the economic devastation that is the result of leftist policies and the shredding of the constitution.
> 
> I know all about guys like you. You're worthless and can't die soon enough for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution.
> 
> Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> it is the foundation upon which the freest and most successful republic in the history of the world rests. So fuck off, you're a worthless punk.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thank you very much for the opportunity to show truth beats anger every time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don't think you come across as unhinged in your hatred of liberty and denial of history, you're stupid as you are worthless and angry.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So I hate liberty? I did not know that. Thank you very much for enlightening me. Can we be best friends?
Click to expand...


I'm guessing no.

Here's a song for you.


----------



## Buck111

Marion Morrison said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Feller" or whatever... It doesn't matter. What matters is you are so brainwashed you actually believe *I *had something to do with your country being sold out to China [et al]. No. I had nothing to do with with it. Your CONstitutional Republic did it all. With approval of your CONgress and in full view of your CONstitution.
> 
> Speaking of your CONstitution: If it is such a great and noble document, why hasn't it stopped your government from ass fucking you every chance it gets? Why do you lose your precious freedumbs more and more every day? Does your CONstitution stop wars? Does it feed the hungry or house disabled veterans? Does it give jobs? Does it stop the influx of foreigners you so self-righteously hate? When is the last time your CONstitution saved the life of a baby in an abortion clinic?
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> 
> 
> it is the foundation upon which the freest and most successful republic in the history of the world rests. So fuck off, you're a worthless punk.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thank you very much for the opportunity to show truth beats anger every time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don't think you come across as unhinged in your hatred of liberty and denial of history, you're stupid as you are worthless and angry.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So I hate liberty? I did not know that. Thank you very much for enlightening me. Can we be best friends?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm guessing no.
> 
> Here's a song for you.
Click to expand...

And that has to do with what?


----------



## Unkotare

Votto said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Votto said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I say that the CONstitution is a con game because it neither grants rights nor protects rights. Men interpret the meanings of the CONstitution to benefit their opinions and beliefs. These same men use the CONstitution to control the actions of the masses.
> 
> The 'Bill of Rights' is the most important part of the CONstitution, yet they can be suspended by the government. This means they are privileges and not 'rights'. Rights cannot be manipulated or taken; privileges can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is interesting to note that early in American History they passed the Alien and Sedition Acts, that essentially made it illegal to speak out against government.  Thomas Jefferson then rose to power and later struck down most of it, luckily.
> 
> However, FDR later came along and used the left over provisions to lock up innocent Japanese  Americans.
> 
> It is obvious to all that the acts were not constitutional, nor was FDR's act constitutional.  No one denies this yet the Constitution was violated without so much as a peep.
> 
> I don't count Jefferson striking it down as a check or balance, rather, we just got lucky he won the Oval Office when he did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, you've got your History pretty muddled.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's nice to retort with actual substance.  What was muddled?
Click to expand...








Jefferson didn't "strike down" the acts, nor did he have the power to do so. They were allowed to expire.


----------



## regent

The importance of the Alien and Sedition Acts were the end of the first conservative party in the US.


----------



## Unkotare

regent said:


> The importance of the Alien and Sedition Acts were the end of the first conservative party in the US.




?????


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

regent said:


> The importance of the Alien and Sedition Acts were the end of the first conservative party in the US.


Actually, Jefferson's Republican Party won the next big presidential election.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?



1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
3) 70% of recent medical patents
4) worlds policeman
5)space travel and technology
6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
> 2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
> 3) 70% of recent medical patents
> 4) worlds policeman
> 5)space travel and technology
> 6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history
Click to expand...


1) False. Show otherwise.
2) Constitution fought in no wars.
3) Nothing to do with constitution.
4) See #3 above.
5) See #s 3 and 4 above.
6) See #s 3, 4 and 5 above.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
> 2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
> 3) 70% of recent medical patents
> 4) worlds policeman
> 5)space travel and technology
> 6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 1) False. Show otherwise.
> 2) Constitution fought in no wars.
> 3) Nothing to do with constitution.
> 4) See #3 above.
> 5) See #s 3 and 4 above.
> 6) See #s 3, 4 and 5 above.
Click to expand...


why be stupid?? people escape to America. Americans don't escape to Cuba and Mexico.


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
> 2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
> 3) 70% of recent medical patents
> 4) worlds policeman
> 5)space travel and technology
> 6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 1) False. Show otherwise.
> 2) Constitution fought in no wars.
> 3) Nothing to do with constitution.
> 4) See #3 above.
> 5) See #s 3 and 4 above.
> 6) See #s 3, 4 and 5 above.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why be stupid?? people escape to America. Americans don't escape to Cuba and Mexico.
Click to expand...


Last year alone 5411 people renounced their U.S. citizen/slaveship. Up 26% from the previous year. This does not include those who have fled to other countries who did not renounce. 

Heritage. org rates the U.S. as the 17th freest country in the world. Others rank it lower.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
> 2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
> 3) 70% of recent medical patents
> 4) worlds policeman
> 5)space travel and technology
> 6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 1) False. Show otherwise.
> 2) Constitution fought in no wars.
> 3) Nothing to do with constitution.
> 4) See #3 above.
> 5) See #s 3 and 4 above.
> 6) See #s 3, 4 and 5 above.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why be stupid?? people escape to America. Americans don't escape to Cuba and Mexico.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Last year alone 5411 people renounced their U.S. citizen/slaveship. Up 26% from the previous year. This does not include those who have fled to other countries who did not renounce.
> 
> Heritage. org rates the U.S. as the 17th freest country in the world. Others rank it lower.
Click to expand...


there are 30 million illegals here and would be billions if they could get in and fit in


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tell me, tell us all - WHAT GOOD IS YOUR FUCKING CONSTITUTION?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
> 2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
> 3) 70% of recent medical patents
> 4) worlds policeman
> 5)space travel and technology
> 6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 1) False. Show otherwise.
> 2) Constitution fought in no wars.
> 3) Nothing to do with constitution.
> 4) See #3 above.
> 5) See #s 3 and 4 above.
> 6) See #s 3, 4 and 5 above.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why be stupid?? people escape to America. Americans don't escape to Cuba and Mexico.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Last year alone 5411 people renounced their U.S. citizen/slaveship. Up 26% from the previous year. This does not include those who have fled to other countries who did not renounce.
> 
> Heritage. org rates the U.S. as the 17th freest country in the world. Others rank it lower.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> there are 30 million illegals here and would be billions if they could get in and fit in
Click to expand...

The U.S. is one of the easiest countries to enter. Also, like the socialist country it is, it gives away a lot of free shit. And guess what? Your constitution isn't stopping any of it! While you get punished by paying 50% of your income to taxes (constitution hasn't stopped that either) non workers and "illegals" are living pretty good. Off your tax dime. Sorry, I can't help but laugh at you.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 1)It created greatest country in human history by far:
> 2) saved civilization through two world wars and recreated it in our image
> 3) 70% of recent medical patents
> 4) worlds policeman
> 5)space travel and technology
> 6)established concept that govt was the source of evil in human history
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1) False. Show otherwise.
> 2) Constitution fought in no wars.
> 3) Nothing to do with constitution.
> 4) See #3 above.
> 5) See #s 3 and 4 above.
> 6) See #s 3, 4 and 5 above.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why be stupid?? people escape to America. Americans don't escape to Cuba and Mexico.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Last year alone 5411 people renounced their U.S. citizen/slaveship. Up 26% from the previous year. This does not include those who have fled to other countries who did not renounce.
> 
> Heritage. org rates the U.S. as the 17th freest country in the world. Others rank it lower.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> there are 30 million illegals here and would be billions if they could get in and fit in
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The U.S. is one of the easiest countries to enter. Also, like the socialist country it is, it gives away a lot of free shit. And guess what? Your constitution isn't stopping any of it! While you get punished by paying 50% of your income to taxes (constitution hasn't stopped that either) non workers and "illegals" are living pretty good. Off your tax dime. Sorry, I can't help but laugh at you.
Click to expand...



agree America has gotten too liberal,  and??????????????


----------



## Buck111

...and your CONstitution isn't stopping anything or fixing anything. It's worthless.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> ...and your CONstitution isn't stopping anything or fixing anything. It's worthless.



worthless compared to what?????


----------



## Buck111

Worthless compared to toilet paper.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> Worthless compared to toilet paper.


Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
Click to expand...

And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three. 

Here is an example:
The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.

Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing. 

I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?


----------



## Buck111

Here's a guy who got it.


----------



## westwall

Buck111 said:


> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
Click to expand...







Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.

Your assertions are wrong.


----------



## Votto

westwall said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
Click to expand...



Right.  For example, if the government ever came around and decided to lock you up because you are of a certain race then the fabulous checks and balances would cause someone to stop them.....unless you are Japanese American, but I think that is only common sense.


----------



## Buck111

westwall said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
Click to expand...

Are you familiar with the term "Lip service is no service"? That is the Bill of Rights. That also describes your post. 
The Bill of Rights is a piece of paper (that no living human being ever agreed to, btw) that has no power. It cannot rise up and stop, start or take part in anything. Nothing. The only way it could have any illusion of power would be for the people to rise up and be its power. And people are not going to do that.


----------



## Buck111

Votto said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  For example, if the government ever came around and decided to lock you up because you are of a certain race then the fabulous checks and balances would cause someone to stop them.....unless you are Japanese American, but I think that is only common sense.
Click to expand...

What many don't know is during WWII, along with Japanese-Americans, German-Americans and dissidents (such as I would be considered) were also interned in prison camps.


----------



## Buck111

Off topic, but needs to be said:
A special "Thank you" to the moderators of this forum.


----------



## westwall

Votto said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  For example, if the government ever came around and decided to lock you up because you are of a certain race then the fabulous checks and balances would cause someone to stop them.....unless you are Japanese American, but I think that is only common sense.
Click to expand...







Like I said, the PEOPLE were in a long sleep.  Authoritarians everywhere were gaining power in Europe AND the USA.  FDR was a junior Stalin.  He LOVED Stalin, as did the overwhelming majority of progressives.  What happened to the Japanese Americans was abhorrent to the COTUS.  The Founders were rolling in their graves when that prick sent those people to the camps.  

It took many decades for the people who were so clearly denied their Rights got any sort of compensation, and acknowledgement.  Of that there is no doubt.  You can thank the MSM for creating the atmosphere that allowed that crime to occur.


----------



## westwall

Buck111 said:


> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you familiar with the term "Lip service is no service"? That is the Bill of Rights. That also describes your post.
> The Bill of Rights is a piece of paper (that no living human being ever agreed to, btw) that has no power. It cannot rise up and stop, start or take part in anything. Nothing. The only way it could have any illusion of power would be for the people to rise up and be its power. And people are not going to do that.
Click to expand...








People ARE doing that.  That is the point.  The MSM is at war with the People.  The political class is at war with the PEOPLE.  Were it not for the constraints of that "useless" piece of paper, that war would be long over and we the People would be fully enslaved.  The fact that we're not is a testament to the power of that "worthless" piece of paper.


----------



## westwall

Buck111 said:


> Votto said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  For example, if the government ever came around and decided to lock you up because you are of a certain race then the fabulous checks and balances would cause someone to stop them.....unless you are Japanese American, but I think that is only common sense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What many don't know is during WWII, along with Japanese-Americans, German-Americans and dissidents (such as I would be considered) were also interned in prison camps.
Click to expand...







Likewise not known is the fact that American soldiers kidnapped German nationals working in Central and South America and brought them to the US for the duration of the was to be used as hostages.  Yet another dark moment in US history that no one wants to mention.  That is the true value of the internet is it allows information to get out.  It allows the PEOPLE a voice that can't be controlled by the MSM.  That is why the political class is so desperate to take it away from the People.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing.



where do guns speech and religion come from if not Bill of  Rights????????? You mean all the SCOTUS cases did not really happen? Its like the fake moon landing???


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> Votto said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Worthless compared to toilet paper.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  For example, if the government ever came around and decided to lock you up because you are of a certain race then the fabulous checks and balances would cause someone to stop them.....unless you are Japanese American, but I think that is only common sense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What many don't know is during WWII, along with Japanese-Americans, German-Americans and dissidents (such as I would be considered) were also interned in prison camps.
Click to expand...


so??? as if that negates saving the world through 2 world wars, world's policeman,  and having 70% of all recent medical patents! America is civilization on earth. Without us civilization would disappear and liberalism would rule the world again!!


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where do guns speech and religion come from if not Bill of  Rights????????? You mean all the SCOTUS cases did not really happen? Its like the fake moon landing???
Click to expand...

SCOTUS *opinions* are just opinions. Several cases can go before the supremes with similar merit. Each will be heard individually and SCOTUS will probably rule, to some degree, differently in each. There are nine "justices". As they die off or retire, they are replaced. New opinions are given on old topics. 
Has nothing to do with Bill of Rights.


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## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> [
> SCOTUS *opinions* are just opinions..



actually they are rulings; if you disobey them you can be arrested and go to jail


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

westwall said:


> Yet another dark moment in US history that no one wants to mention.



war is all dark moments and worse like fire bombing Germany and Japan to burn alive  300,000 living human beings.


----------



## Buck111

westwall said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Votto said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> westwall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EdwardBaiamonte said:
> 
> 
> 
> Totally stupid of course, as if toilet paper has a Bill of Rights
> 
> 
> 
> And what does a "Bill of Rights" do? Nothing. The Bill of Rights (first 10 Articles/Amendments of the CONstitution) is all smoke and mirrors. First off, you have no rights, you have privileges. Rights cannot exist when you have governments that can deprive you of them, manipulate their meanings or ignore them. All governments do all three.
> 
> Here is an example:
> The 5th Amendment originally, in part, read, “life, liberty, and property.” It now reads, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
> See the difference? If you own property it is sovereign  land and cannot be taxed or trespassed upon. If you "own" any real estate, look at the deed to it. You are listed as "tenant". A tenant is a renter. Who do you rent this property from? Its real owner, the government via taxes. Doubt that? Don't pay the taxes and see how quickly the real owner evicts you.
> 
> Why "pursuit of happiness"? Because it is so vague it can be interpreted to mean whatever the courts and the rest of government wants it to. Your opinion on what it means means nothing.
> 
> I could go through the entire Bill of Rights and show you how they do not protect you. Your government has had more than 200 years to manipulate your "rights", are you really so naive as to believe they are honest people who would manipulate them in your favor?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong.  The Bill of Rights explicitly controls what the government can do to you, the individual.  It then makes it possible, when the government gets too big for it's britches for people to have the means to rise up and remove that illegitimate government.  It is because of the Bill of Rights that this country is not already a socialist hell hole.  The People have been asleep at the wheel of government for far too long.  And they are now beginning to wake up.
> 
> Your assertions are wrong.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Right.  For example, if the government ever came around and decided to lock you up because you are of a certain race then the fabulous checks and balances would cause someone to stop them.....unless you are Japanese American, but I think that is only common sense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What many don't know is during WWII, along with Japanese-Americans, German-Americans and dissidents (such as I would be considered) were also interned in prison camps.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Likewise not known is the fact that American soldiers kidnapped German nationals working in Central and South America and brought them to the US for the duration of the was to be used as hostages.  Yet another dark moment in US history that no one wants to mention.  That is the true value of the internet is it allows information to get out.  It allows the PEOPLE a voice that can't be controlled by the MSM.  That is why the political class is so desperate to take it away from the People.
Click to expand...

I agree with much of what you posted. However, I do not agree that the CONstitution or the Bill of Rights prevented or protected anything. 

The U.S. is already one giant slave ship. When a government taxes you into poverty, uses the money they take from you for things you do not approve of, (abortions, endless wars, banker bailouts, land grab through imminent domain, borrowing fiat money from the FRB (that you are expected to pay back) donating billions of dollars to other countries, etcetera) there is no way you can say pieces of paper with pretty words written on them can save you from the doom and gloom that is fastly coming down on you and your country. 

The whip hasn't cracked yet, but it is only inches from our collective backs. When the time comes for total domination of the people of this country by those in command, your constitutions, your laws and your bills will be able to do nothing to save you. Remember my name so you can say "Buck told us so" as jack boots kick in your doors in the middle of the night and take your guns and what's left of your precious freedoms.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> I do not agree that the CONstitution or the Bill of Rights prevented or protected anything.



beyond absurd. Without Constitution America would not exist and Hitler or worse would rule the world!!


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> The whip hasn't cracked yet, but it is only inches from our collective backs.



so then you should we working hard to elect the most conservative candidates who can win and drop the anarchy BS.


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> [
> SCOTUS *opinions* are just opinions..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> actually they are rulings; if you disobey them you can be arrested and go to jail
Click to expand...

Wrong on both counts. 
The Supremes do not render rulings; rulings are regulations. The Supremes do not regulate anything. They opine on laws/rules that already exist.


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> The whip hasn't cracked yet, but it is only inches from our collective backs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so then you should we working hard to elect the most conservative candidates who can win and drop the anarchy BS.
Click to expand...

There is nothing more absurd than voting. 45 presidents and not a one of them has done anything but rape and rob the people; each new president as bad as the previous.


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> The Supremes do not render rulings.



"Each will be heard individually and SCOTUS will probably rule",

does the genius know who I"m quoting above??? 


*Supreme Court ruling in 2015 may lead to 7 executions in 11 days*
https://www.usatoday.com/.../*supreme*-*court*...*executions*.../100426446/
‎
Apr 14, 2017 *...* WASHINGTON -- The *Supreme Court's* narrow decision in 2015 allowingOklahoma to use a controversial sedative in lethal injections has led ...


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> There is nothing more absurd than voting. 45 presidents and not a one of them has done anything but rape and rob the people; each new president as bad as the previous.



so why not persuade more people to vote more conservative/libertarian??


----------



## Buck111

EdwardBaiamonte said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Supremes do not render rulings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Each will be heard individually and SCOTUS will probably rule",
> 
> does the genius know who I"m quoting above???
> 
> 
> *Supreme Court ruling in 2015 may lead to 7 executions in 11 days*
> https://www.usatoday.com/.../*supreme*-*court*...*executions*.../100426446/
> ‎
> Apr 14, 2017 *...* WASHINGTON -- The *Supreme Court's* narrow decision in 2015 allowingOklahoma to use a controversial sedative in lethal injections has led ...
Click to expand...

The "genius" stands corrected.


----------



## Buck111

"The twisted mind of Adolf Hitler, by itself, posed little or no threat to humanity. It was the millions of people who viewed Hitler as “authority,” and thus felt obligated to obey his commands and carry out his orders, who actually caused the damage done by the Third Reich. In other words, the problem is not that evil people believe in “authority”; the
problem is that basically good people believe in “authority,” and as a result, end up advocating and even committing acts of aggression, injustice and oppression, even murder." Larken Rose, "The Most Dangerous Superstition."


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> The "genius" stands corrected.



wow that shows lots of character. No liberal would ever do that!! Congratulations!!!


----------



## EdwardBaiamonte

Buck111 said:


> "The twisted mind of Adolf Hitler, by itself, posed little or no threat to humanity. It was the millions of people who viewed Hitler as “authority,” and thus felt obligated to obey his commands and carry out his orders, who actually caused the damage done by the Third Reich. In other words, the problem is not that evil people believe in “authority”; the
> problem is that basically good people believe in “authority,” and as a result, end up advocating and even committing acts of aggression, injustice and oppression, even murder." Larken Rose, "The Most Dangerous Superstition."



and thus the Constitution is the greatest document ever written since its purpose is to limit authority [ something new under the sun as Jefferson called it] while liberals are the greatest enemy of mankind since their purpose is to undermine the Constitution.

Thus, we want to kill liberals like Hitler and kill the thinking in others that leads them to follow liberals like Hitler.


----------



## Buck111

Conservatism or Liberalism = Collectivism.
Collectivism = Followers and obeyers.
When people fail to think for themselves they allow others to think for them. When people allow others to think for them, they become slaves to the thinkers.

Does your constitution approve of you killing liberals? It has no room in it for live and let live?


----------



## anotherlife

Buck111 said:


> Conservatism or Liberalism = Collectivism.
> Collectivism = Followers and obeyers.
> When people fail to think for themselves they allow others to think for them. When people allow others to think for them, they become slaves to the thinkers.
> 
> Does your constitution approve of you killing liberals? It has no room in it for live and let live?



The first rule of human species is that humans crave to be the slaves of the one who kills/murders the most.


----------



## Buck111

47 years ago today the constitution did not protect these childrens Bill of Rights. It did not restrain government and nobody was held to account for it. The constitution is a con game. The sooner people wake up to that fact, the sooner we can move ahead as a free people.


*It’s the Anniversary of the One School Shooting the Govt Won’t be Ramming Down Your Throat*


On May 4, 1970, a disorganized and nonviolent antiwar protest turned violent and deadly when the Ohio National Guard inexplicably opened fire on students at Kent State University — indelibly polarizing the United States populace to an extreme arguably unabated since.

Guardsmen opened fire on the assembled crowd, unleashing between 61 and 67 bullets in 13 seconds — which left four people dead and nine wounded. Now, 46 years after the unjustified bloodbath, critical questions remain unanswered about both details of the incident, as well as circumstances that culminated in the shooting of unarmed protesters.


Read more at It's the Anniversary of the One School Shooting the Govt Won't be Ramming Down Your Throat


----------



## Buck111




----------



## regent

Buck111 said:


> 47 years ago today the constitution did not protect these childrens Bill of Rights. It did not restrain government and nobody was held to account for it. The constitution is a con game. The sooner people wake up to that fact, the sooner we can move ahead as a free people.
> 
> 
> *It’s the Anniversary of the One School Shooting the Govt Won’t be Ramming Down Your Throat*
> 
> 
> On May 4, 1970, a disorganized and nonviolent antiwar protest turned violent and deadly when the Ohio National Guard inexplicably opened fire on students at Kent State University — indelibly polarizing the United States populace to an extreme arguably unabated since.
> 
> Guardsmen opened fire on the assembled crowd, unleashing between 61 and 67 bullets in 13 seconds — which left four people dead and nine wounded. Now, 46 years after the unjustified bloodbath, critical questions remain unanswered about both details of the incident, as well as circumstances that culminated in the shooting of unarmed protesters.
> 
> 
> Read more at It's the Anniversary of the One School Shooting the Govt Won't be Ramming Down Your Throat


Sort of reminds one of George Washington and the whiskey rebellion.


----------



## Buck111

regent said:


> Buck111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 47 years ago today the constitution did not protect these childrens Bill of Rights. It did not restrain government and nobody was held to account for it. The constitution is a con game. The sooner people wake up to that fact, the sooner we can move ahead as a free people.
> 
> 
> *It’s the Anniversary of the One School Shooting the Govt Won’t be Ramming Down Your Throat*
> 
> 
> On May 4, 1970, a disorganized and nonviolent antiwar protest turned violent and deadly when the Ohio National Guard inexplicably opened fire on students at Kent State University — indelibly polarizing the United States populace to an extreme arguably unabated since.
> 
> Guardsmen opened fire on the assembled crowd, unleashing between 61 and 67 bullets in 13 seconds — which left four people dead and nine wounded. Now, 46 years after the unjustified bloodbath, critical questions remain unanswered about both details of the incident, as well as circumstances that culminated in the shooting of unarmed protesters.
> 
> 
> Read more at It's the Anniversary of the One School Shooting the Govt Won't be Ramming Down Your Throat
> 
> 
> 
> Sort of reminds one of George Washington and the whiskey rebellion.
Click to expand...

Yes, indeed. The Whiskey Rebellion was one of the first times the constitution was "interpreted" differently from how it was written (in favor of government and disfavor of the people)

"Article III, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution defines treason as "levying War" against the United States. During the trials of the two men convicted of treason, Circuit Court Judge william paterson instructed the jury that "levying war" includes armed opposition to the enforcement of a federal law."


----------



## Buck111

Nobody defines the constitution better than Lysander Spooner.


* NO TREASON
No. VI.

THE CONSTITUTION OF NO AUTHORITY.*


*I.*

*NT.6.1.1* The Constitution has no inherent authority or obligation. It has no authority or obligation at all, unless as a contract between man and man. And it does not so much as even purport to be a contract between persons now existing. It purports, at most, to be only a contract between persons living eighty years ago. And it can be supposed to have been a contract then only between persons who had already come to years of discretion, so as to be competent to make reasonable and obligatory contracts. Furthermore, we know, historically, that only a small portion even of the people then existing were consulted on the subject, or asked, or permitted to express either their consent or dissent in any formal manner. Those persons, if any, who did give their consent formally, are all dead now. Most of them have been dead forty, fifty, sixty, or seventy years. _And the constitution, so far as it was their contract, died with them_. They had no natural power or right to make it obligatory upon their children. It is not only plainly impossible, in the nature of things, that they _could_ bind their posterity, but they did not even attempt to bind them. That is to say, the instrument does not purport to be an agreement between any body but “the people” _then_ existing; nor does it, either expressly or impliedly, assert any right, power, or disposition, on their part, to bind anybody but themselves. Let us see. Its language is:

“We, the people of the United States (that is, the people _then existing_ in the United States), in order to form a more perfect union, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves _and our posterity_, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”
*NT.6.1.2* It is plain, in the first place, that this language, _as an agreement_, purports to be only what it at most really was, viz., a contract between the people then existing; and, of necessity, binding, as a contract, only upon those _then existing_. In the second place, the language neither expresses nor implies that they had any right or power, to _bind_ their “posterity” to live under it. It does not say that their “posterity” will, shall, or must live under it. It only says, in effect, that their hopes and motives in adopting it were that it might prove useful to their posterity, as well as to themselves, by promoting their union, safety, tranquility, liberty, etc.
*NT.6.1.3* Suppose an agreement were entered into, in this form:
*NT.6.1.4* We, the people of Boston, agree to maintain a fort on Governor’s Island, to protect ourselves _and our posterity_ against invasion.
*NT.6.1.5* This agreement, _as an agreement_, would clearly bind nobody but the people then existing. Secondly, it would assert no right, power, or disposition, on their part, to _compel_ their “posterity” to maintain such a fort. It would only indicate that the supposed welfare of their posterity was one of the motives that induced the original parties to enter into the agreement. 

Lysander Spooner – No Treason No. 6: The Constitution of No Authority


----------

