# The "Virtuous" New Nazis.



## Mindful

Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.

"In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."

"Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."

The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"

The "Virtuous" New Nazis


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## Mindful

:: The European Union signed an agreement with Morocco, which has a territorial dispute with Algeria, but nevertheless enshrined its right to exploit the resources of Western Sahara; no campaign was launched to protest it. And we have not heard any protests against Turkey for its occupation of Northern Cyprus or its wholesale imprisonment of dissidents, journalists or academics. No, the boycott policy is solely against the Jewish State, which boasts one of the highest levels of academic freedom, press freedom and equality under the law on the planet. They do this in the "3-D" ways noted by the true advocate of human rights, the Soviet dissident, Natan Sharansky, in his _The Case For Democracy:_


Double standard: targeting only Israel from among the 200 territorial disputes, from Tibet to Ukraine.
Demonization: comparing Israel's actions to Nazis when it is really the people doing the comparing who should be compared to Nazis.
Delegitimization: denying the right of Israel to exist.
The racist hypocrisy is as transparent as it is perfidious.::


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## Dogmaphobe

Judenrein is once again the fashion.  It is now a product of the left rather than the right for the most part, however.

 Who was it who said "Antisemitism is the socialism of fools"?


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## jillian

Dogmaphobe said:


> Judenrein is once again the fashion.  It is now a product of the left rather than the right for the most part, however.
> 
> Who was it who said "Antisemitism is the socialism of fools"?



It is a product of the far left and the far right. Or did you think white supremacists and neo nazis like Jews?

Jews only thrive in moderate societies


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## Dogmaphobe

jillian said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Judenrein is once again the fashion.  It is now a product of the left rather than the right for the most part, however.
> 
> Who was it who said "Antisemitism is the socialism of fools"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is a product of the far left and the far right. Or did you think white supremacists and neo nazis like Jews?
> 
> Jews only thrive in moderate societies
Click to expand...



 Do you not understand the meaning of the term "for the most part?

 There has to be a hundred left wing politically correct antisemites for every old fashioned right wing variety these days. 

 If you haven't observed that, you haven't been paying attention.


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## Fenton Lum

John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.


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## Dogmaphobe

Fenton Lum said:


> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.




Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.

Should we keep count?


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## TheOldSchool

Mindful said:


> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis


The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.


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## Fenton Lum

Dogmaphobe said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
Click to expand...


Partisanshit is what keeps what you claim to want changed in place my myopic friend.  The system floats on it.


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## Fenton Lum

TheOldSchool said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
Click to expand...


Same old shyte, new boogeyman.


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## Mindful

Not one country, other than Turkey, recognises the Turkish occupation of Northern Cyprus. 

Yet it exists.


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## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
Click to expand...


It'll be the same old....

Yawn.


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## Fenton Lum

Mindful said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
Click to expand...



Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.


----------



## irosie91

TheOldSchool said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
Click to expand...


huh?   can you expand on that delusion?


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## TheOldSchool

irosie91 said:


> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
Click to expand...

Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?


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## Fenton Lum

irosie91 said:


> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
Click to expand...


Get away from your own 6 multinational corporate controlled media and self-absorption with nothing but america.  There’s plenty out there on this phenomenon.  Ours is not the only nation experiencing the resurgence of these types of ideologies.


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## Mindful

Fenton Lum said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
Click to expand...


Enforced by types like you.


----------



## Fenton Lum

Mindful said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Enforced by types like you.
Click to expand...


It's your thread love, you did this.


----------



## jillian

Dogmaphobe said:


> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Judenrein is once again the fashion.  It is now a product of the left rather than the right for the most part, however.
> 
> Who was it who said "Antisemitism is the socialism of fools"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is a product of the far left and the far right. Or did you think white supremacists and neo nazis like Jews?
> 
> Jews only thrive in moderate societies
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Do you not understand the meaning of the term "for the most part?
> 
> There has to be a hundred left wing politically correct antisemites for every old fashioned right wing variety these days.
> 
> If you haven't observed that, you haven't been paying attention.
Click to expand...


I'm pointing out that "for the most part" is nonsense


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## Phoenall

Fenton Lum said:


> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.








 And yet you fail to prove this claim every time you make it, it is the cry of the neo nazi and the neo marxist that is a cover up for their own RACISM, ANTI SEMITISM and APARTHIED. The stooges are too thick to see that they are the ones demanding a Jew free everything, and this is just the same as the German riech in the 1930's


----------



## Coyote

TheOldSchool said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
Click to expand...


I agree.

I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.

How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?

I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.

There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.

Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.


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## Mindful

Fenton Lum said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Enforced by types like you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's your thread love, you did this.
Click to expand...


Did what? Made you come on it?


----------



## Phoenall

Fenton Lum said:


> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Same old shyte, new boogeyman.
Click to expand...







 Nope once a nazi always a nazi and it looks like you were fed your Jew hatred on the tit.   Same old RACISM from the same old NAZI's


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## irosie91

Fenton Lum said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Get away from your own 6 multinational corporate controlled media and self-absorption with nothing but america.  There’s plenty out there on this phenomenon.  Ours is not the only nation experiencing the resurgence of these types of ideologies.
Click to expand...


who the fluck do you think you are?       your comment is just shit


----------



## Fenton Lum

Phoenall said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Same old shyte, new boogeyman.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nope once a nazi always a nazi and it looks like you were fed your Jew hatred on the tit.   Same old RACISM from the same old NAZI's
Click to expand...


Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawn, do you have anything coherent?


----------



## Fenton Lum

irosie91 said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Get away from your own 6 multinational corporate controlled media and self-absorption with nothing but america.  There’s plenty out there on this phenomenon.  Ours is not the only nation experiencing the resurgence of these types of ideologies.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> who the fluck do you think you are?       your comment is just shit
Click to expand...


While this one is so amazing?  Jeez hon.  You really don't handle not being agreed with well.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

jillian said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jillian said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Judenrein is once again the fashion.  It is now a product of the left rather than the right for the most part, however.
> 
> Who was it who said "Antisemitism is the socialism of fools"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is a product of the far left and the far right. Or did you think white supremacists and neo nazis like Jews?
> 
> Jews only thrive in moderate societies
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Do you not understand the meaning of the term "for the most part?
> 
> There has to be a hundred left wing politically correct antisemites for every old fashioned right wing variety these days.
> 
> If you haven't observed that, you haven't been paying attention.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm pointing out that "for the most part" is nonsense
Click to expand...



That is because you are dishonest.

 You are a leftist and so protect your turf because your identity is invested in it.

 I have no identity invested in being either left nor right and so simply call it the way I see it.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Phoenall said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And yet you fail to prove this claim every time you make it, it is the cry of the neo nazi and the neo marxist that is a cover up for their own RACISM, ANTI SEMITISM and APARTHIED. The stooges are too thick to see that they are the ones demanding a Jew free everything, and this is just the same as the German riech in the 1930's
Click to expand...



 These low-functioning leftists repeat the jargon taught to them by Islamist strategists, and do so as mindlessly as parrots.  It's all about buzz phrases, false equivalencies, dishonest framing mechanisms, double standards and group think, and they repeat this crap completely oblivious as to the origin of the various talking points they imitate.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
Click to expand...









 Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?

Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights


----------



## TheOldSchool

Fenton Lum said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Same old shyte, new boogeyman.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nope once a nazi always a nazi and it looks like you were fed your Jew hatred on the tit.   Same old RACISM from the same old NAZI's
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawn, do you have anything coherent?
Click to expand...

No he doesn't.  He thinks Jews are the master race that is secretly in charge of the world.  Ask him about it.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?
> 
> Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights
Click to expand...


The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.

Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?

It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.


----------



## Fenton Lum

TheOldSchool said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Same old shyte, new boogeyman.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nope once a nazi always a nazi and it looks like you were fed your Jew hatred on the tit.   Same old RACISM from the same old NAZI's
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawn, do you have anything coherent?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No he doesn't.  He thinks Jews are the master race that is secretly in charge of the world.  Ask him about it.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I've seen his trail of tripe and drivel on here.


----------



## Fenton Lum

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?
> 
> Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
Click to expand...


Simplistic is all some can manage.


----------



## Fenton Lum

Mindful said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Enforced by types like you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's your thread love, you did this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did what? Made you come on it?
Click to expand...


Trouble following?  You're moaning about enforcing what you enforce, sheesh hon.


----------



## Mindful

Fenton Lum said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Enforced by types like you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's your thread love, you did this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did what? Made you come on it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Trouble following?  You're moaning about enforcing what you enforce, sheesh hon.
Click to expand...


Your type are ten a penny.


----------



## Fenton Lum

Mindful said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enforced by types like you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's your thread love, you did this.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Did what? Made you come on it?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Trouble following?  You're moaning about enforcing what you enforce, sheesh hon.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Your type are ten a penny.
Click to expand...


Great discussion, have a nice day.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Not one country, other than Turkey, recognises the Turkish occupation of Northern Cyprus.
> 
> Yet it exists.








 And the UN is afraid to take any action in case all of islam rises up and starts WW3.


----------



## jillian

Fenton Lum said:


> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.



I'm pretty sure that if Israel were an apartheid state there would be no Arab members of the Knesset. I'm also pretty sure that if you want to talk about apartheid you would talk about the myriad Arab countries that do not allow Jews. 

Let me know when you're not full of it and I'll be happy to discuss this issue further.


----------



## Fenton Lum

jillian said:


> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure that if Israel were an apartheid state there would be no Arab members of the Knesset. I'm also pretty sure that if you want to talk about apartheid you would talk about the myriad Arab countries that do not allow Jews.
> 
> Let me know when you're not full of it and I'll be happy to discuss this issue further.
Click to expand...


And the american involvement in all of it?  Go ...


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?
> 
> Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
Click to expand...








 Here you go again with the islamonazi propaganda lies that arab muslims have historic ties to Israel. They invaded illegally after 1917 and flooded the country with muslims to gain superior numbers. They then had an international law enacted that made it illegal for Jews to live in any arab muslim nation.

What rights do illegal immigrants, terrorists and criminals have ?

Only if you make it so by ignoring historical facts and international law. Why did the UN have to create UNWRA to support the arab muslims who fled the fighting in palestine, after all the law was they became full citizens after living there for just 2 years. Work it out and see why this was so, and when you allow one small piece of truth to seep through the rest follows and you see how you have been made a fool of all these years


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> Your type are ten a penny.




 I disagree.  You haven't taken into account the incredible inflation over the last 30 years.

I think the correct figure is now a thousand a penny.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.




 So THAT'S why you support those who have ACTUALLY indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are against it.

 There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.

 When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.


----------



## Penelope

Fenton Lum said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fenton Lum said:
> 
> 
> 
> John Bolton bullshit, figures.  Israel is an apartheid state, economic sanctions worked on South Africa.  That’s all this is about, american control of the middle east is still the neocon goal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that's one virtuous new leftist Nazi checking in.
> 
> Should we keep count?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It'll be the same old....
> 
> Yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Your OP insured it, it is indeed the same old yawn.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Enforced by types like you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's your thread love, you did this.
Click to expand...


Where are you from?


----------



## Penelope

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
Click to expand...


And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.


----------



## Bleipriester

Mindful said:


> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis


Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Penelope said:


> [
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.




  Arabs have 22 states encompassing 12.9 million square Kilometers including Jordan, the original Palestinian State.  There are only a few thousand Jews left. 

  Israel is a mere 20 thousand square Kilometers and contains approximately 1.7 million Arabs.

 You are very stupid, very dishonest, and very racist and so ignore facts in favor of your relentless persecution.


----------



## Penelope

Dogmaphobe said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arabs have 22 states encompassing 12.9 million square Kilometers including Jordan, the original Palestinian State.  There are only a few thousand Jews left.
> 
> Israel is a mere 20 thousand square Kilometers and contains approximately 1.7 million Arabs.
> 
> You are very stupid, very dishonest, and very racist and so ignore facts in favor of your relentless persecution.
Click to expand...


I am only talking about Israel. The other arab state are not Israel. The jews have no right to Israel. Rome got it from the Greeks and the Greeks captured it from the Persians who captured it from the Babylonians. What right the original Canaanites had on it died out long long ago, besides they were Arab as well.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?
> 
> Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here you go again with the islamonazi propaganda lies that arab muslims have historic ties to Israel. They invaded illegally after 1917 and flooded the country with muslims to gain superior numbers. They then had an international law enacted that made it illegal for Jews to live in any arab muslim nation.
> 
> What rights do illegal immigrants, terrorists and criminals have ?
> 
> Only if you make it so by ignoring historical facts and international law. Why did the UN have to create UNWRA to support the arab muslims who fled the fighting in palestine, after all the law was they became full citizens after living there for just 2 years. Work it out and see why this was so, and when you allow one small piece of truth to seep through the rest follows and you see how you have been made a fool of all these years
Click to expand...


More propaganda.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have ACTUALLY indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are against it.
Click to expand...


Not sure such retarded rhetoric deserves a serious response, but here goes.

I don't support ethnic cleansing - not of Palestinians,  not of Jews.  It's a pretty simple concept.



> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.



And?  That has what to do with the people currently living in Israel and the Occupied Territories?

Has anyone supported the forced explulsion of Jews from Arab countries? 



> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.



I'm curious - are you saying you support forced expulsions then?

I don't.


----------



## Coyote

Penelope said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
Click to expand...


There's no genocide going on.


----------



## Penelope

Coyote said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
Click to expand...


Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.


----------



## Coyote

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
Click to expand...


Something about Europe, glass houses, land grabbing and racism comes to mind here and it's nothing to do with the Nazi's.  In fact, it's Europe's "land grabbing" division of the Ottoman Empire that led to some of the mess we are in now in the ME.


----------



## Coyote

Penelope said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
Click to expand...


Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?


----------



## Mindful

This is the crux of the matter.

What this topic is about.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> This is the crux of the matter.
> 
> What this topic is about.




and it has acted like a roll call for some of the forum's virtuous new Nazis.


----------



## jillian

Penelope said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arabs have 22 states encompassing 12.9 million square Kilometers including Jordan, the original Palestinian State.  There are only a few thousand Jews left.
> 
> Israel is a mere 20 thousand square Kilometers and contains approximately 1.7 million Arabs.
> 
> You are very stupid, very dishonest, and very racist and so ignore facts in favor of your relentless persecution.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am only talking about Israel. The other arab state are not Israel. The jews have no right to Israel. Rome got it from the Greeks and the Greeks captured it from the Persians who captured it from the Babylonians. What right the original Canaanites had on it died out long long ago, besides they were Arab as well.
Click to expand...


the jews have every right to israel.

thanks for spewing the palestinian terrorist line.

the reality is that the mandate was divided by the british. they had that right...same as when the created the UAE. 

the pals started a war... they lost. and they kept waging war and kept losing. that's life.

tell ya what... i want my great grandfather's land in belarus....i have as much right to that as the so-called pals have to israel.


----------



## Tilly

In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.


----------



## irosie91

TheOldSchool said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
Click to expand...


lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot


----------



## irosie91

Penelope said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
Click to expand...


so?    Until recently I lived in a large city---in a part of town that used to be 80% Polish------then it became more like 80% Hispanic------its called demographic shift.    The city of Medina Saudi arabia  was----at one time---MOSLY JEWISH---now jews cannot set foot on that land.    I grew up in a town in an important suburban area of a very large city-----it was 100% white back then because it was run by white trash like you.  
Now it has a significant black population


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> In Europe, *most anti Semites come from the Left*, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.



Or maybe not.  Rightwing parties pretending to be against antisemitism for political expediency even though their members harbor a lot of antisemitic feelings.  As the expession goes - you can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig.

Cleaning Up Real Nice

http://forward.com/opinion/343604/after-brexit-europes-right-wing-will-try-to-woo-jews-resist/


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
Click to expand...



The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.


----------



## Dr Grump

Tilly said:


> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.



Yeah, that is why - to a T - all anti-semite parties in Europe are referred to as right-wing or far right.


----------



## Phoenall

Penelope said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
Click to expand...








 It was never arab in the first place, they are just illegal immigrants sent by the surrounding arab nations after 1917. Under International laws 22% of palestine was granted to the Jews as their national home, the other 78% became arab muslim and was called Jordan. So the arab's have their 80% and that is where they should be living, not on the land they have stolen from Israel. Or dont you understand that palestine was originally much bigger and the arab lived on the 78% granted as trans Jordan


----------



## Phoenall

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
Click to expand...







 So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.


----------



## Phoenall

Penelope said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arabs have 22 states encompassing 12.9 million square Kilometers including Jordan, the original Palestinian State.  There are only a few thousand Jews left.
> 
> Israel is a mere 20 thousand square Kilometers and contains approximately 1.7 million Arabs.
> 
> You are very stupid, very dishonest, and very racist and so ignore facts in favor of your relentless persecution.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am only talking about Israel. The other arab state are not Israel. The jews have no right to Israel. Rome got it from the Greeks and the Greeks captured it from the Persians who captured it from the Babylonians. What right the original Canaanites had on it died out long long ago, besides they were Arab as well.
Click to expand...








 International law says they do. In fact they have more right to all of palestine than you have to even the smallest dust particle of America. The lands Sovereign owners handed them the Keys and title to what is now Israel. The arab muslim illegal immigrants got nothing other than the order to leave.


 YOUR RACISM WILL NEVER HIDE THE TRUTH THAT THE JEWS WERE THE LANDS OWNERS PRIOR TO THE ROMAN CONQUEST


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the crux of the matter.
> 
> What this topic is about.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and it has acted like a roll call for some of the forum's virtuous new Nazis.
Click to expand...


The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.

"Jews, go back to Palestine!"

"Jews, get out of Palestine!"

Is that an oxymoron,or what?


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
Click to expand...



"Set things in motion"---???    what  "THINGS"???   Why not
blame it on NAPOLEON?
the subject is the present situation in Syria-------What does the
invasion into Iraq have to do with THE PRESENT SITUATION 
IN SYRIA???-------the events have no correlation other than TIME.    Why not blame it all on my birthday party in  1995.  
The "carving up of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE"?    why not blame it on my mom's birthday in 1920?


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?
> 
> Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here you go again with the islamonazi propaganda lies that arab muslims have historic ties to Israel. They invaded illegally after 1917 and flooded the country with muslims to gain superior numbers. They then had an international law enacted that made it illegal for Jews to live in any arab muslim nation.
> 
> What rights do illegal immigrants, terrorists and criminals have ?
> 
> Only if you make it so by ignoring historical facts and international law. Why did the UN have to create UNWRA to support the arab muslims who fled the fighting in palestine, after all the law was they became full citizens after living there for just 2 years. Work it out and see why this was so, and when you allow one small piece of truth to seep through the rest follows and you see how you have been made a fool of all these years
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More propaganda.
Click to expand...









 WHERE   you saying it is does not make it so, it just shows that you have lost the argument and have no reply in regards to historically correct data and extant international laws. The facts are there for anyone with an open mind to find, and they are published on unbiased sites that just hold the truth for future generations. All you have is suspect sources that omit much of the data because it would alter the authors POV.

Are you saying that the International law that set up Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria is only illegal when it set up Israel ? Are you saying that the Egyptian, Syrian, Iraqi and Iranian deserters had lived in palestine for the two years prior to their invasion in 1947 ? Are you saying that the Jews have no rights under international law and never did, because that is what it sounds like from here. The same stance taken by the Germans in the 1930's and by the islamonazi's since


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have ACTUALLY indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are against it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sure such retarded rhetoric deserves a serious response, but here goes.
> 
> I don't support ethnic cleansing - not of Palestinians,  not of Jews.  It's a pretty simple concept.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And?  That has what to do with the people currently living in Israel and the Occupied Territories?
> 
> Has anyone supported the forced explulsion of Jews from Arab countries?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm curious - are you saying you support forced expulsions then?
> 
> I don't.
Click to expand...







 Yes the people who you support in their endeavours to take what is now Israel and wipe out the Jews once and for all. And they are very vocal in their aims so you cant say you have not heard them.



 Of illegal immigrants, islamonazi terrorists and criminals YES. You seem to be in support of these same people expelling the rightful owners so that islam can at last own all of the M.E. and shortly the world


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
Click to expand...








 See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have ACTUALLY indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are against it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sure such retarded rhetoric deserves a serious response, but here goes.
> 
> I don't support ethnic cleansing - not of Palestinians,  not of Jews.  It's a pretty simple concept.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And?  That has what to do with the people currently living in Israel and the Occupied Territories?
> 
> Has anyone supported the forced explulsion of Jews from Arab countries?
> 
> Yes----muhummad did.   Any country that uses any aspect of
> shariah law as its legal code supports the forced expulsion
> of jews.       Your question is as silly as claiming that no country ever supported the enslavement of blacks
Click to expand...


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> "Set things in motion"---???    what  "THINGS"???   Why not
> blame it on NAPOLEON?
> the subject is the present situation in Syria-------What does the
> invasion into Iraq have to do with THE PRESENT SITUATION
> IN SYRIA???-------the events have no correlation other than TIME.    Why not blame it all on my birthday party in  1995.
> The "carving up of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE"?    why not blame it on my mom's birthday in 1920?
Click to expand...


lol

And what do these fatuous circular arguments we see dominating most of the Israel threads, done to death and beyond, have to do with the age old scapegoating of Jews, down through the centuries? And still going on today.


----------



## Mindful

I wonder what took them so long.

    In 1965, the Second Vatican Council established that the Jewish people were not to be held responsible for the death of Christ.


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> "Set things in motion"---???    what  "THINGS"???   Why not
> blame it on NAPOLEON?
> the subject is the present situation in Syria-------What does the
> invasion into Iraq have to do with THE PRESENT SITUATION
> IN SYRIA???-------the events have no correlation other than TIME.    Why not blame it all on my birthday party in  1995.
> The "carving up of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE"?    why not blame it on my mom's birthday in 1920?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> And what do these fatuous circular arguments we see dominating most of the Israel threads, done to death and beyond, have to do with the age old scapegoating of Jews, down through the centuries? And still going on today.
Click to expand...


I am trying to find out. -----the fall of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE----did it all------I wonder if anyone who blames the fall of the
Ottoman Empire have any idea just what the Ottoman empire
was.     The Austrian Hapsburg empire also fell.    Anybody want to name the evil agency that   "CARVED IT UP"?-----
The Moghul Empire fell------if you want to know how much evil
the destruction of the NOBLE AND UTOPIAN MOGHUL EMPIRE caused the world------ask a Pakistani or a muslim from India


----------



## Phoenall

Penelope said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
Click to expand...








 There are Jews killed here and there, does that make it a genocide ?

 When did the arab muslims get ownership of this land as I can find no mention of it since 1099

Is that like your home in America then, as that is an illegal settlement just the same


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Something about Europe, glass houses, land grabbing and racism comes to mind here and it's nothing to do with the Nazi's.  In fact, it's Europe's "land grabbing" division of the Ottoman Empire that led to some of the mess we are in now in the ME.
Click to expand...








 And again you repeat the islamonazi/white supremacist mantra only found on their sites. You do know that the US was also involved in the LoN and sat on the many formal meettings


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
Click to expand...









 When they have already ethnically cleansed 90% of the Jews from the M.E. then it most certainly is a genocide


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> "Set things in motion"---???    what  "THINGS"???   Why not
> blame it on NAPOLEON?
> the subject is the present situation in Syria-------What does the
> invasion into Iraq have to do with THE PRESENT SITUATION
> IN SYRIA???-------the events have no correlation other than TIME.    Why not blame it all on my birthday party in  1995.
> The "carving up of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE"?    why not blame it on my mom's birthday in 1920?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> And what do these fatuous circular arguments we see dominating most of the Israel threads, done to death and beyond, have to do with the age old scapegoating of Jews, down through the centuries? And still going on today.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am trying to find out. -----the fall of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE----did it all------I wonder if anyone who blames the fall of the
> Ottoman Empire have any idea just what the Ottoman empire
> was.     The Austrian Hapsburg empire also fell.    Anybody want to name the evil agency that   "CARVED IT UP"?-----
> The Moghul Empire fell------if you want to know how much evil
> the destruction of the NOBLE AND UTOPIAN MOGHUL EMPIRE caused the world------ask a Pakistani or a muslim from India
Click to expand...


Austrian Empire. Good question.

Travelling around Europe, particularly the East, and the Balkans, one sees the fragments of the Imperial past.

I don't think the Ukraine will ever recover.


----------



## irosie91

Phoenall said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are Jews killed here and there, does that make it a genocide ?
> 
> When did the arab muslims get ownership of this land as I can find no mention of it since 1099
> 
> Is that like your home in America then, as that is an illegal settlement just the same
Click to expand...


Pay attention to what people SAY-----Penelope makes it clear that the basis of each of her declarations of  "FACT"  is based
entirely on personal and individual sophistry invented entirely
to fit her personal POV regarding that specific situation. 
   Her statement   "Not all genocides happen at one"   means
that regardless of fact and reality----she has DECIDED that
DA JOOOOS are committing   "genocide"  against the 
"Palestinians" -------truth and reality have nothing to do with the
"DECLARATION OF FACT"


----------



## Phoenall

Tilly said:


> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.










 They always did and it was only the German Nazi party that forced the left to disown them and claim they were right wing extremists.  Look at their history and see that they were originally the National Socialist German Workers party and were allied to the communist party in Russia


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?



The nature of antisemitism has shifted since Israel was established. Virtuous Nazis like Coyote and countless other illiberal leftists here can now focus their hatred on the state that represents the aspirations of the Jewish people instead of Jews individually.  Instead of small groups of Jews acting as a target living within a nation state, the State of Israel now exists as a small nation state living within the greater community of nations.  It's the same old target, but under a different guise.

 Those who refuse to admit that antisemitism is now primarily a leftist illness are either too ignorant, too stupid or too dishonest to  notice what is as plain a day. Arab propaganda has been specially tailored to appeal to leftists, thus all the talk about apartheid and whathaveyou, and the entire creation of a brand new people called "Palestinian" was geared towards that end. It was simply the way to frame the conflict, not between Arabs and Jews, but between Jews and this mythical new subset of Arabs created specifically for the purpose of deceiving low functioning leftists into joining their persecution. By joining the persecution of Jews, all these leftists see themselves as protecting the underdog, even as they add their support to the great majority, instead. That is where the sense of virtue comes in, however, as they have fallen prey to all the propaganda geared towards deceiving them as they carry the Arab torch for the destruction of the tiny Jewish state because of the invention of this new group.


----------



## Bleipriester

Phoenall said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
Click to expand...

I am not a Muslim and I received no land.


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The nature of antisemitism has shifted since Israel was established. Virtuous Nazis like Coyote and countless other illiberal leftists here can now focus their hatred on the state that represents the aspirations of the Jewish people instead of Jews individually.  Instead of small groups of Jews acting as a target living within a nation state, the State of Israel now exists as a small nation state living within the greater community of nations.  It's the same old target, but under a different guise.
> 
> Those who refuse to admit that antisemitism is now primarily a leftist illness are either too ignorant, too stupid or too dishonest to  notice what is as plain a day. Arab propaganda has been specially tailored to appeal to leftists, thus all the talk about apartheid and whathaveyou, and the entire creation of a brand new people called "Palestinian" was geared towards that end. It was simply the way to frame the conflict, not between Arabs and Jews, but between Jews and this mythical new subset of Arabs created specifically for the purpose of deceiving low functioning leftists into joining their persecution. By joining the persecution of Jews, all these leftists see themselves as protecting the underdog, even as they add their support to the great majority, instead. That is where the sense of virtue comes in, however, as they have fallen prey to all the propaganda geared towards deceiving them as they carry the Arab torch for the destruction of the tiny Jewish state because of the invention of this new group.
Click to expand...


Trying to trace back the origins of it.


Bleipriester said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
Click to expand...


This topic is not about Muslims.


----------



## Phoenall

Bleipriester said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
Click to expand...







You are an islamonazi propagandist and dont deserve anything for your RACE HATE


----------



## irosie91

Bleipriester said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
Click to expand...


you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism


----------



## irosie91

For the record----Baathism is entirely CONSISTENT with
Islamism which is entirely consistent with Nazism ----both
ideologically and historically


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> For the record----Baathism is entirely CONSISTENT with
> Islamism which is entirely consistent with Nazism ----both
> ideologically and historically



I think Saddam Hussein was a Ba'athist?


Would go some way to explaining why he paid $30,000 per Palestinian family for one of its members to blow him or herself up in a suicide bombing, within Israel.


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> For the record----Baathism is entirely CONSISTENT with
> Islamism which is entirely consistent with Nazism ----both
> ideologically and historically
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think Saddam Hussein was a Ba'athist?
> 
> 
> Would go some way to explaining why he paid $30,000 per Palestinian family for one of its members to blow him or herself up in a suicide bombing, within Israel.
Click to expand...


Saddam Hussein was an ARDENT BAATHIST------one of the
INNER CIRCLE Baathists------a worshipful follower of Gamal Nasser ---king of the UAR  (united arab republic)     It seems to me that  Saddam was more PERSONALLY ambitious than
was Nasser------Nasser was really into the basic concept of
Baathism which can best be described as   ARAB SUPREMACY     (in the same manner as ARYAN SUPREMACY)   Nasser was only mildly barbaric as
compared to Saddam who was extremely barbaric.


----------



## Jroc

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have ACTUALLY indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are against it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not sure such retarded rhetoric deserves a serious response, but here goes.
> 
> I don't support ethnic cleansing - not of Palestinians,  not of Jews.  It's a pretty simple concept.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And?  That has what to do with the people currently living in Israel and the Occupied Territories?
> 
> Has anyone supported the forced explulsion of Jews from Arab countries?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm curious - are you saying you support forced expulsions then?
> 
> I don't.
Click to expand...



Jews take in their people. The Arabs set up refugee camps, and use those people in their mission to destroy Israel.


----------



## Penelope

Coyote said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The way forward is to recognize that that land belongs to two peoples who have historic ties there and the resolution is NOT ethnically cleansing either one.
> 
> Why do you want to deny anyone's rights?
> 
> It's a complex long standing dispute - not a simplistic one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
Click to expand...


I call it protecting their people and land. 

Do only jews have a right to protect their people and land, sure sounds like it. Not Lebanon, Syria, or Iran.


----------



## irosie91

Penelope said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I call it protecting their people and land.
> 
> Do only jews have a right to protect their people and land, sure sounds like it. Not Lebanon, Syria, or Iran.
Click to expand...


you call public declarations calling for the ANNHILATION of a  neighboring country and its people  ----- "self protection of country and people"??     You call tying bombs to the asses of
young women and nudging them towards babies----"self protection of country and people"?      You call secreting knives
in ones clothing and stabbing vulnerable people to death in
the streets   "self protection of country and people"?.


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I call it protecting their people and land.
> 
> Do only jews have a right to protect their people and land, sure sounds like it. Not Lebanon, Syria, or Iran.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you call public declarations calling for the ANNHILATION of a  neighboring country and its people  ----- "self protection of country and people"??     You call tying bombs to the asses of
> young women and nudging them towards babies----"self protection of country and people"?      You call secreting knives
> in ones clothing and stabbing vulnerable people to death in
> the streets   "self protection of country and people"?.
Click to expand...


You'll be getting the justifications next, like the 1930's Nazis. 

Nothing has changed, and nothing has been solved, with regard to European anti semitism.


----------



## Coyote

Penelope said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I call it protecting their people and land.
> 
> Do only jews have a right to protect their people and land, sure sounds like it. Not Lebanon, Syria, or Iran.
Click to expand...

How do you justify killing children?  Do you realize Jews have also been there from the beginning?


----------



## Eloy

Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi



what is  "this"  in your question?     Programs aimed at destroying Israel?


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The nature of antisemitism has shifted since Israel was established. Virtuous Nazis like Coyote and countless other illiberal leftists here can now focus their hatred on the state that represents the aspirations of the Jewish people instead of Jews individually.  Instead of small groups of Jews acting as a target living within a nation state, the State of Israel now exists as a small nation state living within the greater community of nations.  It's the same old target, but under a different guise.
> 
> Those who refuse to admit that antisemitism is now primarily a leftist illness are either too ignorant, too stupid or too dishonest to  notice what is as plain a day. Arab propaganda has been specially tailored to appeal to leftists, thus all the talk about apartheid and whathaveyou, and the entire creation of a brand new people called "Palestinian" was geared towards that end. It was simply the way to frame the conflict, not between Arabs and Jews, but between Jews and this mythical new subset of Arabs created specifically for the purpose of deceiving low functioning leftists into joining their persecution. By joining the persecution of Jews, all these leftists see themselves as protecting the underdog, even as they add their support to the great majority, instead. That is where the sense of virtue comes in, however, as they have fallen prey to all the propaganda geared towards deceiving them as they carry the Arab torch for the destruction of the tiny Jewish state because of the invention of this new group.
Click to expand...


According to articles I've read antisemitism is inherent in both the far right and far left in European political parties.  I'm not surprised that virtuous rightwinger Nazis like yourself fail to recognize it's existence.  Rightwingers don't like to recognize it amongst their own. They repackage the same hatred in overt nationalism and anti-muslim rhetoric in an attempt to legitimize scapegoating, but underneath the same old antisemitic canard are propagated by its membership.


----------



## koshergrl

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree.
> 
> I think it's fueled by a melting pot of scapegoats.  Boycotting commodities produced in the Occupied Territories seems in my opinion a legitimate action to try to force a resolution of the IP situation much like boycotts did with South Africa.  But there are hidden dangers there that ought to be examined.
> 
> How many of those supporting the movements truly care about the Palestinians?  How many of them are opposing Israel's policies, and how many of them are simply finding a way of legitimizing the scapegoating of Jews - all Jews?
> 
> I'm seeing a lot of things that are very concerning:  the rise, around Europe (and America) of far right nationalistic politics that are based, in part, on the politics of exclusion - anti-immigrant for example.  Those are often the same groups that scapegoat Jews.  They are legitimizing themselves on the issues of immigration and Islam where they have gained widespread support, because it's not "socially acceptable" to outwardly hate Jews the way it is Muslims but I think it's there, and can be seen in the propogation of conspiracy theories.
> 
> There are disturbing "groupings" - anti-semitism with some if the far right, anti-semitism painted as "anti-Israel" from some of the far left, and anti-semitism from some Muslim immigrants.  But it's dishonest to label all opposition to Israel as anti-semitism.
> 
> Instead of the politics of seperation and division, there needs to be a move towards interfaith action in order to overcome this trend.  It's been heading towards a dangerous repetition of history and the politics and rhetoric are the same, even if the targeted scapegoats now include others.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you see the only way forward to be stealing Israeli land and giving it to illegalimmigrants, is this because that is how you ended up owning America ?
> 
> Why should the Jews ALWAYS be the ones to give up what is theirs under international law, and why do those who deny they are anti semitic deny the Jews their rights
Click to expand...

Coyote is pro-muslim, pro-isis, anti-Christian, anti-American, anti-baby. That's why she believes the Jews should always be the ones to die/give up property/etc.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> [
> According to articles I've read antisemitism is inherent in both the far right and far left in European political parties.  I'm not surprised that virtuous rightwinger Nazis like yourself fail to recognize it's existence.  Rightwingers don't like to recognize it amongst their own. They repackage the same hatred in overt nationalism and anti-muslim rhetoric in an attempt to legitimize scapegoating, but underneath the same old antisemitic canard are propagated by its membership.




 I'm sure all those "articles" you read at electronicintafada are very informative. 

 I am not one of these mythical "rightwing" Nazis of which you speak. Unlike you, I support gay rights, women's rights, a clean environment, progressive taxation and a strong separation of religion and politics.  These are hardly right wing positions even if you do happen to possess such a combination of stupidity and utter dishonesty to ever admit it.

 Did one of the Malfoys hit you with a particularly nasty Cranius imperviosis spell by any chance?


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Nazi movement is certainly gaining steam across Europe, though fueled far less by hatred of Jews as you suggest than by hatred of Muslims fleeing wars the West started in their home countries.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
Click to expand...

Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

koshergrl said:


> Coyote is pro-muslim, pro-isis, anti-Christian, anti-American, anti-baby. That's why she believes the Jews should always be the ones to die/give up property/etc.




 People should pay attention to the serious comments that elicit her "funny" response in particular.  Muslims indulging in mass murder is funny to her.  Muslims raping children is funny to her. Muslims killing Jews is funny to her.  If a person opposes ANYTHING a Muslim does, she thinks it is funny.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the crux of the matter.
> 
> What this topic is about.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and it has acted like a roll call for some of the forum's virtuous new Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
Click to expand...


Do you acknowledge any legitimate objection to Israel's policies and if so how do you make the distinction?


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
Click to expand...


coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
work on a messageboard.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the crux of the matter.
> 
> What this topic is about.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and it has acted like a roll call for some of the forum's virtuous new Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you acknowledge any legitimate objection to Israel's policies and if so how do you make the distinction?
Click to expand...


too non-specific,   coyote.


----------



## Mindful

Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> "Set things in motion"---???    what  "THINGS"???   Why not
> blame it on NAPOLEON?
> the subject is the present situation in Syria-------What does the
> invasion into Iraq have to do with THE PRESENT SITUATION
> IN SYRIA???-------the events have no correlation other than TIME.    Why not blame it all on my birthday party in  1995.
> The "carving up of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE"?    why not blame it on my mom's birthday in 1920?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> And what do these fatuous circular arguments we see dominating most of the Israel threads, done to death and beyond, have to do with the age old scapegoating of Jews, down through the centuries? And still going on today.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I am trying to find out. -----the fall of the OTTOMAN EMPIRE----did it all------I wonder if anyone who blames the fall of the
> Ottoman Empire have any idea just what the Ottoman empire
> was.     The Austrian Hapsburg empire also fell.    Anybody want to name the evil agency that   "CARVED IT UP"?-----
> The Moghul Empire fell------if you want to know how much evil
> the destruction of the NOBLE AND UTOPIAN MOGHUL EMPIRE caused the world------ask a Pakistani or a muslim from India
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Austrian Empire. Good question.
> 
> Travelling around Europe, particularly the East, and the Balkans, one sees the fragments of the Imperial past.
> 
> I don't think the Ukraine will ever recover.
Click to expand...


I think that "balkinization" is what is occurring in the ME today.


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.



flexibility in the human mind is that which makes US human


----------



## koshergrl

Dogmaphobe said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote is pro-muslim, pro-isis, anti-Christian, anti-American, anti-baby. That's why she believes the Jews should always be the ones to die/give up property/etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People should pay attention to the serious comments that elicit her "funny" response in particular.  Muslims indulging in mass murder is funny to her.  Muslims raping children is funny to her. Muslims killing Jews is funny to her.  If a person opposes ANYTHING a Muslim does, she thinks it is funny.
Click to expand...

Yup.


----------



## koshergrl

Mindful said:


> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.



And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?

"
Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.

According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”

The Return of Anti-Semitism


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
Click to expand...

That would require starting a new topic.


----------



## koshergrl

In 2011:

"
 It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.

Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "

The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe


----------



## Coyote

I don't think antisemitism ever really left Europe, it just got buried.  People will always need scapegoats to blame for their troubles and to unite them when the future is uncertain and their identity seems threatened.  Those scapegoats are usually minorities.


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
Click to expand...


wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.


----------



## Mindful

koshergrl said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
Click to expand...


It never really went away.

Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.


----------



## koshergrl

Mindful said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
Click to expand...

Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe



Interesting article.  And I agree.

The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.

But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.

In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
Click to expand...


I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
Click to expand...




Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
Click to expand...


coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST


----------



## koshergrl

So Coyote is trying to prevent any discussion of historical events as they pertain to the situation today.

Of course she is.  And we all know why. Nazis and Muslims BOTH deny the holocaust, and ban the teaching of history that doesn't promote their cause.


----------



## Mindful

koshergrl said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
Click to expand...


These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.

Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> 
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
Click to expand...


I DO NOT AGREE-----the OTTOMAN EMPIRE itself created
more than enough strife that would have BY NOW----become
just as virulent as anything now going on in the Middle east


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
Click to expand...


Mind----he knows that Israel would not turn his machines off-----


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
Click to expand...


Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.

Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.


----------



## koshergrl

irosie91 said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mind----he knows that Israel would not turn his machines off-----
Click to expand...

Exactly. And Coyote knows that the hard working, Christian people who pay for her entitlements wouldn't deny her, either.


----------



## Phoenall

Penelope said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> So THAT'S why you support those who have actually indulged in ethnic cleansing -- it's because you are actually against it.
> 
> There were once a million Jews living in Arab lands. Today, there are just a few thousand. Meanwhile, the Arab population in Israel continues to grow faster than that of the Jewish.
> 
> When the original Mandate of Palestine was divided, Arabs were given over 78%.  Not content with that, you antisemites want Arabs to have even more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I call it protecting their people and land.
> 
> Do only jews have a right to protect their people and land, sure sounds like it. Not Lebanon, Syria, or Iran.
Click to expand...






So that is what Israel is doing protecting its people and land, now when will they go all out and evict the terrorist scum from the land granted to them under International law.   It seems that you are another plastic nazi that denies the Jews their legal, human, religious and customary rights while also denying them the right to have international law support them.


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I DO NOT AGREE-----the OTTOMAN EMPIRE itself created
> more than enough strife that would have BY NOW----become
> just as virulent as anything now going on in the Middle east
Click to expand...




koshergrl said:


> So Coyote is trying to prevent any discussion of historical events as they pertain to the situation today.
> 
> Of course she is.  And we all know why. Nazis and Muslims BOTH deny the holocaust, and ban the teaching of history that doesn't promote their cause.



I'm trying to be mindful of Mindful's request to stay on the topic of antisemitism in Europe.  This digression is really more about the conflict in the wider ME then it is about the topic.  Capiche?


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
Click to expand...


It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
Click to expand...


wrong again-------there was NO time in the course of history
when jews and muslims  "got along"  in anything close to a
manner that YOU would consider  GOOD AND JUST----absolutely no time.    The change that  1948 brought was that it created a place TO WHERE jews could more easily than before  ESCAPE.     In the course of history---jews did not need "equality"   in order to FLOURISH------in fact the stress of persecution kinda galvanized  FLOURISH skills


----------



## irosie91

koshergrl said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
Click to expand...


in the world today-------Nazism has been relatively sidelined


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> 
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I DO NOT AGREE-----the OTTOMAN EMPIRE itself created
> more than enough strife that would have BY NOW----become
> just as virulent as anything now going on in the Middle east
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> So Coyote is trying to prevent any discussion of historical events as they pertain to the situation today.
> 
> Of course she is.  And we all know why. Nazis and Muslims BOTH deny the holocaust, and ban the teaching of history that doesn't promote their cause.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm trying to be mindful of Mindful's request to stay on the topic of antisemitism in Europe.  This digression is really more about the conflict in the wider ME then it is about the topic.  Capiche?
Click to expand...


Nonsense. You're trying to prevent a real discussion by limiting the scope. That's what people who know that what they're saying is garbage do. Prevent any evidence from being brought in by claiming it's irrelevant.

It's like saying that talking about WWI is irrelevant to the topic of WWII. Obviously, the Middle East is going to be a part of this conversation because the one thing we know is that immigration from the ME to Europe increased exponentially at the exact same time that anti-Semitism in Europe increased exponentially.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
Click to expand...


How is it different?  Boycotting has often been a legitimate means to attempting to force social change.  Where do you draw lines?


koshergrl said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
Click to expand...


People being scapegoated vary according to where they are.  In many places it is also muslims.  The thing is - it's a dangerous thing to start advocating when most of the members of that group do not engage in those actions and are simply being used as a focus for other societal problems.


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I DO NOT AGREE-----the OTTOMAN EMPIRE itself created
> more than enough strife that would have BY NOW----become
> just as virulent as anything now going on in the Middle east
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> So Coyote is trying to prevent any discussion of historical events as they pertain to the situation today.
> 
> Of course she is.  And we all know why. Nazis and Muslims BOTH deny the holocaust, and ban the teaching of history that doesn't promote their cause.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm trying to be mindful of Mindful's request to stay on the topic of antisemitism in Europe.  This digression is really more about the conflict in the wider ME then it is about the topic.  Capiche?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Nonsense. You're trying to prevent a real discussion by limiting the scope. That's what people who know that what they're saying is garbage do. Prevent any evidence from being brought in by claiming it's irrelevant.
> 
> It's like saying that talking about WWI is irrelevant to the topic of WWII. Obviously, the Middle East is going to be a part of this conversation because the one thing we know is that immigration from the ME to Europe increased exponentially at the exact same time that anti-Semitism in Europe increased exponentially.
Click to expand...


Take it up with Mindful then - it's her topic.  I don't see how a discussion of the history of the Ottoman Empire, and the dissolution of the Middle East really helps the topic.



Mindful said:


> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.


----------



## Eloy

irosie91 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what is  "this"  in your question?     Programs aimed at destroying Israel?
Click to expand...

The theme of the thread.


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Might I remind you, gentle people, that this OP was not set up to discuss Muslims. But Jew hatred  in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How is it different?  Boycotting has often been a legitimate means to attempting to force social change.  Where do you draw lines?
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People being scapegoated vary according to where they are.  In many places it is also muslims.  The thing is - it's a dangerous thing to start advocating when most of the members of that group do not engage in those actions and are simply being used as a focus for other societal problems.
Click to expand...


Tell me..list those "many places" where muslims are being scapegoated by anybody other than other muslims.

MANY PLACES. I expect ten at least. Current.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
Click to expand...








 So you havent yet read the koran and hadiths that spell it out  "KILL THE JEWS" Why do you think that the Jews were kept in such low numbers in the M.E., it was the muslims following their religion and having periodic murderfests of the Jews. Just look at Hebron that was attacked and the Jewish residents wiped out 3 times.

Your favourite source tells the whole story

Persecution of Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 Traditionally Jews living in Muslim lands, known as dhimmis, were allowed to practice their religion and to administer their internal affairs but were subject to certain conditions.[8] They had to pay the jizya (a per capita tax imposed on free adult non-Muslim males) to Muslims.[9] Dhimmis had an inferior status under Islamic rule. They had several social and legal disabilities such as prohibitions against bearing arms or giving testimony in courts in cases involving Muslims.[10] Contrary to popular belief, the Qur'an did not allow Muslims to force Jews to wear distinctive clothing. Obadiah the Proselyte reported in 1100 AD, that the Caliph had created this rule himself

This was also the chief motivation behind the 1066 Granada massacre, when "[m]ore than 1,500 Jewish families, numbering 4,000 persons, fell in one day",[12] and in Fez in 1033, when 6,000 Jews were killed.[13] There were further massacres in Fez in 1276 and 1465.[14]

The [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damascus_affair']Damascus affair occurred in 1840, when a French monk and his servant disappeared in Damascus. Immediately following, a charge of ritual murder was brought against a large number of Jews in the city including children who were tortured.[/URL]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews#cite_note-14
 Pogroms occurred in: Aleppo (1850, 1875), Damascus (1840, 1848, 1890), Beirut (1862, 1874), Dayr al-Qamar (1847), Jerusalem (1847), Cairo (1844, 1890, 1901–02), Mansura (1877), Alexandria (1870, 1882, 1901–07), Port Said (1903, 1908), Damanhur (1871, 1873, 1877, 1891), Istanbul (1870, 1874), Buyukdere (1864), Kuzguncuk (1866), Eyub (1868), Edirne (1872), Izmir (1872, 1874).[17] There was a massacre of Jews in Baghdad in 1828.[13] There was another massacre in Barfurush in 1867.[13]

In 1839, in the eastern [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persia']Persian city of Meshed, a mob burst into the Jewish Quarter, burned the synagogue, and destroyed the Torah scrolls. This is known as the Allahdad incident. It was only by forcible conversion that a massacre was averted.[/URL]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews#cite_note-Morris10-13


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Penelope said:
> 
> 
> 
> And what do they have now?  Oh and what use to be 80% arabs is now 20% from the slow genocide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's no genocide going on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well I believe there, is slowly and daily, a few killed here and there. Land stole and more illegal settlements.
> Not all genocides happen at one, its the daily killing of several which is a daily occurrence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Genocide is a very specific and powerful term that is overused.  Would you then call the Palestinian attacks on Israeli Jewish civilians "genocide"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I call it protecting their people and land.
> 
> Do only jews have a right to protect their people and land, sure sounds like it. Not Lebanon, Syria, or Iran.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How do you justify killing children?  Do you realize Jews have also been there from the beginning?
Click to expand...







 How do you justify blaming the Jews for the killings when it was hamas that forced the children to be human shields. This is just another example of islamonazi propaganda that is spread like wildfire.

 Jews were there 2,500 years before the muslims were invented, and then where given the land under the same international law as the arab muslims received trans Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria. Are you going to deny this law exists, or just the part that supports the Jews rights ?


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the world today-------Nazism has been relatively sidelined
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It has just changed i
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> And why do you think it's enjoying such popularity these days?
> 
> "
> Some politicians around the world deny that what is happening in Europe is anti-Semitism. It is, they say, merely a reaction to the actions of the state of Israel, to the continuing conflict with the Palestinians. But the policies of the state of Israel are not made in kosher supermarkets in Paris or in Jewish cultural institutions in Brussels and Mumbai. The targets in these cities were not Israeli. They were Jewish.
> 
> According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, an Egyptian cleric, Muhammad Hussein Yaqub, speaking in January 2009 on Al Rahma, a popular religious TV station in Egypt, made the contours of the new hate impeccably clear: “If the Jews left Palestine to us, would we start loving them? Of course not. We will never love them…They are enemies not because they occupied Palestine. They would have been enemies even if they did not occupy a thing…You must believe that we will fight, defeat and annihilate them until not a single Jew remains on the face of the Earth…You will not survive as long as a single one of us remains.”
> 
> The Return of Anti-Semitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How is it different?  Boycotting has often been a legitimate means to attempting to force social change.  Where do you draw lines?
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People being scapegoated vary according to where they are.  In many places it is also muslims.  The thing is - it's a dangerous thing to start advocating when most of the members of that group do not engage in those actions and are simply being used as a focus for other societal problems.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Tell me..list those "many places" where muslims are being scapegoated by anybody other than other muslims.
> 
> MANY PLACES. I expect ten at least. Current.
Click to expand...


Germany, England, Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, France, Belgium, Ukraine, Russia, Spain, Italy....


----------



## Coyote

Not all Europe is experiencing a rise in anti-semitism though...here's a kind of surprising article:

Amid rising European anti-Semitism, Portugal sees Jewish renaissance


----------



## irosie91

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you havent yet read the koran and hadiths that spell it out  "KILL THE JEWS" Why do you think that the Jews were kept in such low numbers in the M.E., it was the muslims following their religion and having periodic murderfests of the Jews. Just look at Hebron that was attacked and the Jewish residents wiped out 3 times.
> 
> Your favourite source tells the whole story
> 
> Persecution of Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Traditionally Jews living in Muslim lands, known as dhimmis, were allowed to practice their religion and to administer their internal affairs but were subject to certain conditions.[8] They had to pay the jizya (a per capita tax imposed on free adult non-Muslim males) to Muslims.[9] Dhimmis had an inferior status under Islamic rule. They had several social and legal disabilities such as prohibitions against bearing arms or giving testimony in courts in cases involving Muslims.[10] Contrary to popular belief, the Qur'an did not allow Muslims to force Jews to wear distinctive clothing. Obadiah the Proselyte reported in 1100 AD, that the Caliph had created this rule himself
> 
> This was also the chief motivation behind the 1066 Granada massacre, when "[m]ore than 1,500 Jewish families, numbering 4,000 persons, fell in one day",[12] and in Fez in 1033, when 6,000 Jews were killed.[13] There were further massacres in Fez in 1276 and 1465.[14]
> 
> The [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damascus_affair']Damascus affair occurred in 1840, when a French monk and his servant disappeared in Damascus. Immediately following, a charge of ritual murder was brought against a large number of Jews in the city including children who were tortured.[/URL]
> Pogroms occurred in: Aleppo (1850, 1875), Damascus (1840, 1848, 1890), Beirut (1862, 1874), Dayr al-Qamar (1847), Jerusalem (1847), Cairo (1844, 1890, 1901–02), Mansura (1877), Alexandria (1870, 1882, 1901–07), Port Said (1903, 1908), Damanhur (1871, 1873, 1877, 1891), Istanbul (1870, 1874), Buyukdere (1864), Kuzguncuk (1866), Eyub (1868), Edirne (1872), Izmir (1872, 1874).[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews#cite_note-17'][17] There was a massacre of Jews in Baghdad in 1828.[13] There was another massacre in Barfurush in 1867.[13]
> 
> In 1839, in the eastern [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persia']Persian city of Meshed, a mob burst into the Jewish Quarter, burned the synagogue, and destroyed the Torah scrolls. This is known as the Allahdad incident. It was only by forcible conversion that a massacre was averted.[/URL]
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews#cite_note-Morris10-13[/URL]
Click to expand...

[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews#cite_note-Morris10-13']

For those who do not know-----something I learned  WAY BACK THEN------from muslims from southeast asia----IN SCHOOL--muslim children are TAUGHT  that muslims ---historically treated jews VERY WELL----SO WELL THAT 
JEWS  "FLOURISHED"  because of their FAVORED 
POSITION in muslim society.    Today muslim children in their
own societies CONTINUE to be so taught
[/URL]


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the world today-------Nazism has been relatively sidelined
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It has just changed i
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How is it different?  Boycotting has often been a legitimate means to attempting to force social change.  Where do you draw lines?
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People being scapegoated vary according to where they are.  In many places it is also muslims.  The thing is - it's a dangerous thing to start advocating when most of the members of that group do not engage in those actions and are simply being used as a focus for other societal problems.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Tell me..list those "many places" where muslims are being scapegoated by anybody other than other muslims.
> 
> MANY PLACES. I expect ten at least. Current.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Germany, England, Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, France, Belgium, Ukraine, Russia, Spain, Italy....
Click to expand...


OH?    mosques are being BOMBED in  England, Sweden, Norway,  Netherlands, France,  Belgium,  Ukraine, Spain and Italy?------I did not know


----------



## koshergrl

The middle east was historically full of Christians and Jews. The musli


Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you havent yet read the koran and hadiths that spell it out  "KILL THE JEWS" Why do you think that the Jews were kept in such low numbers in the M.E., it was the muslims following their religion and having periodic murderfests of the Jews. Just look at Hebron that was attacked and the Jewish residents wiped out 3 times.
> 
> Your favourite source tells the whole story
> 
> Persecution of Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Traditionally Jews living in Muslim lands, known as dhimmis, were allowed to practice their religion and to administer their internal affairs but were subject to certain conditions.[8] They had to pay the jizya (a per capita tax imposed on free adult non-Muslim males) to Muslims.[9] Dhimmis had an inferior status under Islamic rule. They had several social and legal disabilities such as prohibitions against bearing arms or giving testimony in courts in cases involving Muslims.[10] Contrary to popular belief, the Qur'an did not allow Muslims to force Jews to wear distinctive clothing. Obadiah the Proselyte reported in 1100 AD, that the Caliph had created this rule himself
> 
> This was also the chief motivation behind the 1066 Granada massacre, when "[m]ore than 1,500 Jewish families, numbering 4,000 persons, fell in one day",[12] and in Fez in 1033, when 6,000 Jews were killed.[13] There were further massacres in Fez in 1276 and 1465.[14]
> 
> The Damascus affair occurred in 1840, when a French monk and his servant disappeared in Damascus. Immediately following, a charge of ritual murder was brought against a large number of Jews in the city including children who were tortured.
> Pogroms occurred in: Aleppo (1850, 1875), Damascus (1840, 1848, 1890), Beirut (1862, 1874), Dayr al-Qamar (1847), Jerusalem (1847), Cairo (1844, 1890, 1901–02), Mansura (1877), Alexandria (1870, 1882, 1901–07), Port Said (1903, 1908), Damanhur (1871, 1873, 1877, 1891), Istanbul (1870, 1874), Buyukdere (1864), Kuzguncuk (1866), Eyub (1868), Edirne (1872), Izmir (1872, 1874).[17] There was a massacre of Jews in Baghdad in 1828.[13] There was another massacre in Barfurush in 1867.[13]
> 
> In 1839, in the eastern Persian city of Meshed, a mob burst into the Jewish Quarter, burned the synagogue, and destroyed the Torah scrolls. This is known as the Allahdad incident. It was only by forcible conversion that a massacre was averted.
Click to expand...

ms ki


Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the world today-------Nazism has been relatively sidelined
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It has just changed i
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> It never really went away.
> 
> Cloaked in present day idealistic eloquence, and outrageous justifications, one could almost believe it oneself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How is it different?  Boycotting has often been a legitimate means to attempting to force social change.  Where do you draw lines?
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People being scapegoated vary according to where they are.  In many places it is also muslims.  The thing is - it's a dangerous thing to start advocating when most of the members of that group do not engage in those actions and are simply being used as a focus for other societal problems.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Tell me..list those "many places" where muslims are being scapegoated by anybody other than other muslims.
> 
> MANY PLACES. I expect ten at least. Current.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Germany, England, Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, France, Belgium, Ukraine, Russia, Spain, Italy....
Click to expand...


Lololol.. Yeah, right. 
NONE of those countries is scapegoating muslims, you lying hack. 

You're doing just what nazis and muslims do. Taking examples of their atrocities and calling them acts of self defense. You're disgusting.


----------



## koshergrl

The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi








 Correct              It is the same as the nazi's in 1930's Germany using terms for the Jews out of context because they believed they would not be censured for them. We saw how some were executed and the majority faced prison sentences in solitary for their false beliefs


----------



## Coyote

I'm not totally familiar with politics and political parties in Europe, so it's hard to know how they reflect the attitudes of the people there.  But it does appear that there is at least an effort in UK to deal with antisemitism within the ranks of some of it's parties.   Scapegoating holds a people collectively responsible for the actions of some.  I DO think the left needs to hold itself accountable for propogating these attitudes among it's constituency and I'm glad that in Britain they are addressing this.  It's an interesting analysis - and it brings up "multiculturalism" and "identity politics" - food for thought here.

When Left meets Right: Antisemitism in Europe

_Most notoriously, Ken Livingstone, then a member of the Labour Party’s National Executive Committee and a former Labour Mayor of London, claimed in a radio interview in April this year that Hitler had been a supporter of Zionism before he “went mad and ended up killing six million Jews”. Livingstone’s bizarre and mischievous allegations have been refuted by a raft of eminent historians including Rainer Schulze, Professor of Modern European History at Essex University. Schulze unequivocally dismissed Livingstone’s arguments, emphasising that: “[a]ny claim that Nazis and Zionists ever shared a common goal is not only cynical and disingenuous, but a distortion of clearly established historical fact.”


The statements by Shah, Hussain, Lasharie and Livingstone – along with numerous other allegedly racist, anti-Semitic or inflammatory comments by individuals associated with Labour – shave led to fifty suspension from the Party. They also prompted Labour’s Leader, Jeremy Corbyn, to convene an Inquiry into anti-Semitism and other forms of racism within the Party.


*While the Inquiry, headed by human rights lawyer Shami Chakrabarti, found that, “[t]he Labour Party is not overrun by antisemitism, Islamophobia or other forms of racism”, it acknowledged that there was, “too much clear evidence…of minority hateful or ignorant attitudes and behaviours” and of an “occasionally toxic atmosphere”*. Tellingly, Chakrabarti found it necessary to remind Labour Party members *that they should be wary of perpetuating anti-Semitic tropes: “[t]o suggest, for example, that all or most Jewish people are wealthy or interested in wealth or finance or political or media influence…is a classic stereotype”.*

*Care should be taken in distinguishing statements that relate specifically to Jews as a group and which attribute collective attitudes, propensities or physical characteristics to the group in question or which assert – in the complete absence of evidence – that the group is collectively implicated in such acts as the destruction of the Twin Towers in New York, in September 2001, or the formation of terror groups such as ISIS.* The comments by Naz Shah, Khadim Hussain and Beinazir Lasharie, cited above, would appear to fall into this category. On the other hand, even highly critical statements about Israel or Zionism, however provocative or historically ill-informed, are not anti-Semitic per se. Nevertheless, Livingstone’s comments, casually linking Zionism with Nazism, *are all too likely to incite hostility towards Jews*, especially Jews who do not openly and unequivocally condemn Israel. 

As several commentators have pointed out, there is a growing tendency on the Left to disregard basic and important distinctions between such categories as Jews, “Zionists” and citizens of the state of Israel. Instead, *Jews are frequently viewed by those on the Left as collectively responsible for the actions of Israel. *As the Guardian columnist, Jonathan Freedland, has observed, the term “Zionism” has become “a codeword” in the rhetoric of the Left “that bridges from Israel to the wider Jewish world, hinting at the age-old, anti-semitic notion of a shadowy, global power, operating behind the scenes”.


The historian Simon Schama has portrayed the rise of left-wing anti-Semitism, fuelled by militant anti-Zionism, as a reaction, at least in part, to “the collapse of the Soviet Union and the retreat of Marxist socialism around the world”. As Schama puts it, “militant energies have needed somewhere to go”.


Writing in The New York Times, Kenan Malik has *attributed the increase in left-wing anti-Semitism to a fundamental shift in Left thinking. Malik, who has published extensively on subjects including multiculturalism and race, contends that many on the Left now reject universalist human rights ideology in favour of multiculturalism and identity politics, “celebrating a world divided into distinct cultures, each with its own ideas, beliefs and values*”. As Malik points out:_

_Identity politics has made it easier to hold all Jews responsible for the actions of the State of Israel and to go after Jews simply for being Jews. As the distinction between criticizing ideas and fingering a group has eroded, there has been a slippage from anti-Zionist activism into outright anti-Semitism. *Many who support the Palestinians now seem genuinely unable to distinguish between criticizing the policies of the Israeli government and sowing hatred against a people*_.​

The last line is potent: there is a difference between PEOPLE and GOVERNMENTS.


----------



## Bleipriester

Phoenall said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are an islamonazi propagandist and dont deserve anything for your RACE HATE
Click to expand...

No, you are the fucking racist. You want to expel others from their homes to give it your master race, you submissive fucking disgusting slave.


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> The middle east was historically full of Christians and Jews. The musli
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you havent yet read the koran and hadiths that spell it out  "KILL THE JEWS" Why do you think that the Jews were kept in such low numbers in the M.E., it was the muslims following their religion and having periodic murderfests of the Jews. Just look at Hebron that was attacked and the Jewish residents wiped out 3 times.
> 
> Your favourite source tells the whole story
> 
> Persecution of Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Traditionally Jews living in Muslim lands, known as dhimmis, were allowed to practice their religion and to administer their internal affairs but were subject to certain conditions.[8] They had to pay the jizya (a per capita tax imposed on free adult non-Muslim males) to Muslims.[9] Dhimmis had an inferior status under Islamic rule. They had several social and legal disabilities such as prohibitions against bearing arms or giving testimony in courts in cases involving Muslims.[10] Contrary to popular belief, the Qur'an did not allow Muslims to force Jews to wear distinctive clothing. Obadiah the Proselyte reported in 1100 AD, that the Caliph had created this rule himself
> 
> This was also the chief motivation behind the 1066 Granada massacre, when "[m]ore than 1,500 Jewish families, numbering 4,000 persons, fell in one day",[12] and in Fez in 1033, when 6,000 Jews were killed.[13] There were further massacres in Fez in 1276 and 1465.[14]
> 
> The Damascus affair occurred in 1840, when a French monk and his servant disappeared in Damascus. Immediately following, a charge of ritual murder was brought against a large number of Jews in the city including children who were tortured.
> Pogroms occurred in: Aleppo (1850, 1875), Damascus (1840, 1848, 1890), Beirut (1862, 1874), Dayr al-Qamar (1847), Jerusalem (1847), Cairo (1844, 1890, 1901–02), Mansura (1877), Alexandria (1870, 1882, 1901–07), Port Said (1903, 1908), Damanhur (1871, 1873, 1877, 1891), Istanbul (1870, 1874), Buyukdere (1864), Kuzguncuk (1866), Eyub (1868), Edirne (1872), Izmir (1872, 1874).[17] There was a massacre of Jews in Baghdad in 1828.[13] There was another massacre in Barfurush in 1867.[13]
> 
> In 1839, in the eastern Persian city of Meshed, a mob burst into the Jewish Quarter, burned the synagogue, and destroyed the Torah scrolls. This is known as the Allahdad incident. It was only by forcible conversion that a massacre was averted.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> ms ki
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the world today-------Nazism has been relatively sidelined
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It has just changed i
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nobody said it went away. But it is definitely mainstream now. Look to Coyote. She's the biggest sheep you'll find on this site, and look at the garbage she spouts. She wouldn't do it if it wasn't common. She's never had an original thought in her life.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> These calls for boycotting Israeli products. Some fool likened them to successful sanctions on South Africa.
> 
> Steven Hawking adding his voice to the cause. Does he not realise that he is calling for his own death? As Israeli technology is keeping him alive.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How is it different?  Boycotting has often been a legitimate means to attempting to force social change.  Where do you draw lines?
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's Jews and Christians being scapegoated, you moron. Not Nazis and muslims. If Nazis and Muslims were being scapegoated, we'd be hearing of them being hacked up on subways and blown up in cafes. IT ISN'T HAPPENING. Your heroes are the only ones who are doing that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> People being scapegoated vary according to where they are.  In many places it is also muslims.  The thing is - it's a dangerous thing to start advocating when most of the members of that group do not engage in those actions and are simply being used as a focus for other societal problems.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Tell me..list those "many places" where muslims are being scapegoated by anybody other than other muslims.
> 
> MANY PLACES. I expect ten at least. Current.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Germany, England, Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, France, Belgium, Ukraine, Russia, Spain, Italy....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Lololol.. Yeah, right.
> NONE of those countries is scapegoating muslims, you lying hack.
> 
> You're doing just what nazis and muslims do. Taking examples of their atrocities and calling them acts of self defense. You're disgusting.
Click to expand...


Guess all those articles are wrong then....


----------



## Eloy

By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.






Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.


----------



## Bleipriester

irosie91 said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
Click to expand...

Wrong again, sweet irosie.


----------



## irosie91

Bleipriester said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
Click to expand...


OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The nature of antisemitism has shifted since Israel was established. Virtuous Nazis like Coyote and countless other illiberal leftists here can now focus their hatred on the state that represents the aspirations of the Jewish people instead of Jews individually.  Instead of small groups of Jews acting as a target living within a nation state, the State of Israel now exists as a small nation state living within the greater community of nations.  It's the same old target, but under a different guise.
> 
> Those who refuse to admit that antisemitism is now primarily a leftist illness are either too ignorant, too stupid or too dishonest to  notice what is as plain a day. Arab propaganda has been specially tailored to appeal to leftists, thus all the talk about apartheid and whathaveyou, and the entire creation of a brand new people called "Palestinian" was geared towards that end. It was simply the way to frame the conflict, not between Arabs and Jews, but between Jews and this mythical new subset of Arabs created specifically for the purpose of deceiving low functioning leftists into joining their persecution. By joining the persecution of Jews, all these leftists see themselves as protecting the underdog, even as they add their support to the great majority, instead. That is where the sense of virtue comes in, however, as they have fallen prey to all the propaganda geared towards deceiving them as they carry the Arab torch for the destruction of the tiny Jewish state because of the invention of this new group.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to articles I've read antisemitism is inherent in both the far right and far left in European political parties.  I'm not surprised that virtuous rightwinger Nazis like yourself fail to recognize it's existence.  Rightwingers don't like to recognize it amongst their own. They repackage the same hatred in overt nationalism and anti-muslim rhetoric in an attempt to legitimize scapegoating, but underneath the same old antisemitic canard are propagated by its membership.
Click to expand...








 Just look at the UK political spectrum and you see that the left are the ones most anti semitic as they court the muslims to increase their voters. It does not matter if they are ultra extremist wahabi's or deobandi's that think nothing of slitting a persons throat or raping an eleven year old girl in the name of islam, to the left they are a vote. The same is true on the mainland as well which is why Europe is now overrun with extremist muslims and islamonazi terrorists. The right see the problem much more clearly and want an end to islamic migration to Europe, which is why they are on the rise in Europe. Time for the US to learn by our failures and stupidity and kick out all the muslims and neo marxists before your streets run red with blood as they are in Europe.

 Your articles are only partly right because they are written to hide the reality, look at the news from Europe for the true picture and you will see that the UK's labour party is as anti semitic and as racist towards the Jews as the German nazi's ever were. So much so that they have no chance of winning an election any time soon


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Correct              It is the same as the nazi's in 1930's Germany using terms for the Jews out of context because they believed they would not be censured for them. We saw how some were executed and the majority faced prison sentences in solitary for their false beliefs
Click to expand...

I cannot believe there is anything "new" about antisemitism which should not be confused by anti-Zionism which is more modern and pertains to the establishment of a Jewish state and its expansion into neighboring Arab territory.


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The nature of antisemitism has shifted since Israel was established. Virtuous Nazis like Coyote and countless other illiberal leftists here can now focus their hatred on the state that represents the aspirations of the Jewish people instead of Jews individually.  Instead of small groups of Jews acting as a target living within a nation state, the State of Israel now exists as a small nation state living within the greater community of nations.  It's the same old target, but under a different guise.
> 
> Those who refuse to admit that antisemitism is now primarily a leftist illness are either too ignorant, too stupid or too dishonest to  notice what is as plain a day. Arab propaganda has been specially tailored to appeal to leftists, thus all the talk about apartheid and whathaveyou, and the entire creation of a brand new people called "Palestinian" was geared towards that end. It was simply the way to frame the conflict, not between Arabs and Jews, but between Jews and this mythical new subset of Arabs created specifically for the purpose of deceiving low functioning leftists into joining their persecution. By joining the persecution of Jews, all these leftists see themselves as protecting the underdog, even as they add their support to the great majority, instead. That is where the sense of virtue comes in, however, as they have fallen prey to all the propaganda geared towards deceiving them as they carry the Arab torch for the destruction of the tiny Jewish state because of the invention of this new group.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> According to articles I've read antisemitism is inherent in both the far right and far left in European political parties.  I'm not surprised that virtuous rightwinger Nazis like yourself fail to recognize it's existence.  Rightwingers don't like to recognize it amongst their own. They repackage the same hatred in overt nationalism and anti-muslim rhetoric in an attempt to legitimize scapegoating, but underneath the same old antisemitic canard are propagated by its membership.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just look at the UK political spectrum and you see that the left are the ones most anti semitic as they court the muslims to increase their voters. It does not matter if they are ultra extremist wahabi's or deobandi's that think nothing of slitting a persons throat or raping an eleven year old girl in the name of islam, to the left they are a vote. The same is true on the mainland as well which is why Europe is now overrun with extremist muslims and islamonazi terrorists. The right see the problem much more clearly and want an end to islamic migration to Europe, which is why they are on the rise in Europe. Time for the US to learn by our failures and stupidity and kick out all the muslims and neo marxists before your streets run red with blood as they are in Europe.
> 
> Your articles are only partly right because they are written to hide the reality, look at the news from Europe for the true picture and you will see that the UK's labour party is as anti semitic and as racist towards the Jews as the German nazi's ever were. So much so that they have no chance of winning an election any time soon
Click to expand...


Seems to be a Labour thing. Corbyn's lot is riddled with it.


Mayor Kahn, who's in Chicago, drumming up business, was invited to Friday night  services by Mayor Emmanuel. At his synagogue.


----------



## Tilly

koshergrl said:


> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News


I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.


----------



## Bleipriester

irosie91 said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
Click to expand...

As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.


----------



## Eloy

Tilly said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
Click to expand...

I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Correct              It is the same as the nazi's in 1930's Germany using terms for the Jews out of context because they believed they would not be censured for them. We saw how some were executed and the majority faced prison sentences in solitary for their false beliefs
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I cannot believe there is anything "new" about antisemitism which should not be confused by anti-Zionism which is more modern and pertains to the establishment of a Jewish state and its expansion into neighboring Arab territory.
Click to expand...


very incorrect------anti Zionism as a manifestation of anti-Semitism became firm with the advent of Christianity---
(fourth century AD)   and with the "glorious" age of Islamic
conquest  (aka  invasion, murder, pillage and oppression)  ---
mostly firming up in seventh century AD.     Palestine was
DECLARED Christian in 300 AD and jews rendered third class or------expelled-----and Palestine was declared 'muslim land' --
seventh century AD and jews rendered fourth class or
expelled or dead


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
Click to expand...


I have a sense that you might claim that  Islamic ideology does
not include  anti-semitism


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> huh?   can you expand on that delusion?
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
Click to expand...







 Which white supremacist/islamonazi/neo nazi/antisemitic site was it from as the link I gave you shows that the problem is one of a 7C religious cult that has not evolved over 1400 years still demanding they be given the world as promised by their moon god. The origins are simple mo'mad was a mental defective ( he had frontal lobe epilepsy ) that caused him to see and hear things that did not exist. It also twisted his sense of decency to such a degree that he repealed laws to allow him to have many wives of any age, and also to have sex slaves for his pleasure. There are tales in the hadiths of him raping 12 year old girls in the blood of their slaughtered family members as he slit their throats. Mass murdering Jewish tribes so he could steal their lands, property and goods. Telling lies to his own people so they would attack brothers, fathers and uncles.

That is the origins of the problems and the only way to stop them is to eradicate the teachings of islam


----------



## irosie91

Bleipriester said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
Click to expand...


no wonder the refugees are STREAMING BACK TO THEIR 
BELOVED HOMELAND


----------



## Phoenall

Bleipriester said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
Click to expand...







 Dont deny what is obvious to the world at large


----------



## Coyote

Eloy said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
Click to expand...


I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.


----------



## Bleipriester

irosie91 said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> no wonder the refugees are STREAMING BACK TO THEIR
> BELOVED HOMELAND
Click to expand...

There is still war. But honestly, the only refugee I met is from Africa.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is the crux of the matter.
> 
> What this topic is about.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and it has acted like a roll call for some of the forum's virtuous new Nazis.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The topic being: the demonising of the Jews, and the justifications for it, now, and during 1930's Germany. It's also been referred to in literature, time and time again.
> 
> "Jews, go back to Palestine!"
> 
> "Jews, get out of Palestine!"
> 
> Is that an oxymoron,or what?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you acknowledge any legitimate objection to Israel's policies and if so how do you make the distinction?
Click to expand...








 If you need to ask then you are losing your marbles. If it does not resort to lies, fabrications, blood libels or is widespread amongst western nations then it is legitimate. Strange how not once have you or any other anti Jews managed to produce any objection to Israel's policies that encompass these simple facts.


----------



## Mindful

Bleipriester said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
Click to expand...


What are you so uptight about?


----------



## Bleipriester

Phoenall said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> Big nonsense. It is a simple fact that Europe is not as good in kissing Israel´s ass as the US is. The EU is aware of Israel´s wrongdoing. Banning Israel´s goods, labeling settler goods, is the consequence of Israel´s persistent land grabbing and racism - something they have in common with the Nazis.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So who is trying to increase their 78% of palestine to 100% of palestine then. You muslims forget that Jordan was palestine and that you received 99.9% of the former Ottoman empire as muslim lands. The other 1% went to the Christians in Lebanon and the Jews in Israel. All the land stolen has been done by islamonazi terrorists, who also happen to be the racists. Just read the 3 charter in existence that all say a Jew free M.E.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dont deny what is obvious to the world at large
Click to expand...

No all of us consume Nato propaganda 24h.


----------



## Eloy

Coyote said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
Click to expand...

Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.


----------



## irosie91

Bleipriester said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> no wonder the refugees are STREAMING BACK TO THEIR
> BELOVED HOMELAND
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> There is still war. But honestly, the only refugee I met is from Africa.
Click to expand...


really------I have known Christian Syrian refugees since I was
a child------(in the USA---long long ago)   There have been an
increasing number of Christian refugees from Syria-----for a few decades----in Israel


----------



## Bleipriester

Mindful said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not a Muslim and I received no land.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
Click to expand...

The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.


----------



## Tilly

Eloy said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
Click to expand...

Then you are an ostrich.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Eloy said:


> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.



Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TheOldSchool said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting the neo-Nazis in Europe are actually okay with Muslim refugees?  Are you suggesting that the West has nothing to do with the Middle East?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which white supremacist/islamonazi/neo nazi/antisemitic site was it from as the link I gave you shows that the problem is one of a 7C religious cult that has not evolved over 1400 years still demanding they be given the world as promised by their moon god. The origins are simple mo'mad was a mental defective ( he had frontal lobe epilepsy ) that caused him to see and hear things that did not exist. It also twisted his sense of decency to such a degree that he repealed laws to allow him to have many wives of any age, and also to have sex slaves for his pleasure. There are tales in the hadiths of him raping 12 year old girls in the blood of their slaughtered family members as he slit their throats. Mass murdering Jewish tribes so he could steal their lands, property and goods. Telling lies to his own people so they would attack brothers, fathers and uncles.
> 
> That is the origins of the problems and the only way to stop them is to eradicate the teachings of islam
Click to expand...


I wonder if there'll be a boycott of Moroccan products, over the Western Sahara territorial dispute.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
Click to expand...


islamo Nazis can "characterize"  themselves as anything they wish


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this what Jews call "The New Antisemitism"?
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Correct              It is the same as the nazi's in 1930's Germany using terms for the Jews out of context because they believed they would not be censured for them. We saw how some were executed and the majority faced prison sentences in solitary for their false beliefs
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I cannot believe there is anything "new" about antisemitism which should not be confused by anti-Zionism which is more modern and pertains to the establishment of a Jewish state and its expansion into neighboring Arab territory.
Click to expand...



 You are one of the "virtuous" Europeans under discussion. 

 Double talk is your mainstay when it comes to Jews.


----------



## Bleipriester

irosie91 said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> no wonder the refugees are STREAMING BACK TO THEIR
> BELOVED HOMELAND
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> There is still war. But honestly, the only refugee I met is from Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> really------I have known Christian Syrian refugees since I was
> a child------(in the USA---long long ago)   There have been an
> increasing number of Christian refugees from Syria-----for a few decades----in Israel
Click to expand...

"The vast majority of Israeli Christians (86%) believe the United States is too supportive of Israel."
Israeli Christians Think and Do Almost the Opposite of American Evangelicals


----------



## Coyote

Eloy said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
Click to expand...


There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> lots of people have problems with the influx of refugees from the Middle East wherever they are INFLUXING-------NO LARGE AND PROMINENT COUNTRY IN THE WORLD -----has  "nothing to do with the middle east"       As to the present situation in Syria-----the USA did not  MAKE IT HAPPEN----not by a long shot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The US had a lot to do with what happened when it set things in motion by invading Iraq.  But equally to blame was Europe's carving up of the Ottoman Empire creating large artificial states.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which white supremacist/islamonazi/neo nazi/antisemitic site was it from as the link I gave you shows that the problem is one of a 7C religious cult that has not evolved over 1400 years still demanding they be given the world as promised by their moon god. The origins are simple mo'mad was a mental defective ( he had frontal lobe epilepsy ) that caused him to see and hear things that did not exist. It also twisted his sense of decency to such a degree that he repealed laws to allow him to have many wives of any age, and also to have sex slaves for his pleasure. There are tales in the hadiths of him raping 12 year old girls in the blood of their slaughtered family members as he slit their throats. Mass murdering Jewish tribes so he could steal their lands, property and goods. Telling lies to his own people so they would attack brothers, fathers and uncles.
> 
> That is the origins of the problems and the only way to stop them is to eradicate the teachings of islam
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I wonder if there'll be a boycott of Moroccan products, over the Western Sahara territorial dispute.
Click to expand...


I am all for comprehensive boycotts  of products from
islamo nations like   INDONESIA AND PAKISTAN


----------



## Eloy

Tilly said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Then you are an ostrich.
Click to expand...

I have visited Austria but I am not from there, Tilly.


----------



## Mindful

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> you support the stink and filth of BAATHISM----which is Arabism -------including the virulent Imperialism of that vile creed and the totalitarianism of its real founders----muhummad and his barbaric minions.      While purportedly founded by a somewhat innocuous Michel Aflaq----like the innocuous economic theory of  communism of Karl Mark which MORPHED into  the virulent communism of  STALIN----and the theories of survival genetics of Charles Darwin which became perverted into the Nazi ideology of  MASTER RACE, baathism is the monstrous Utopian Totalitarian shit which has so far galvanized the murder of millions in the Middle east.   Baathism and  ISIS is nothing more or less than two sides
> of the same coin.     It is muhummad's caliphism
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
Click to expand...


Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Guess all those articles are wrong then....




 You have quite the history of confirmation bias, choosing only that information that supports your Islamist supremacist viewpoint while being inimical to the Jews they persecute. 

 Jews were only "tolerated" in Arab lands as long as they were willing to live as second-class citizens to their Islamic masters.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?
Click to expand...


when does legitimate criticism of the rapist pig of mecca cross over into   "islamophobia'?


----------



## Mindful

Anti semitism has many faces and masks.


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> when does legitimate criticism of the rapist pig of mecca cross over into   "islamophobia'?
Click to expand...


When it's constructed the way it is in your sentence.


----------



## Bleipriester

Mindful said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong again, sweet irosie.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
Click to expand...

Come on. This was general.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> when does legitimate criticism of the rapist pig of mecca cross over into   "islamophobia'?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When it's constructed the way it is in your sentence.
Click to expand...


why?----he murdered, he raped and he advised the killing of anyone who did not lick his ass.    It is wrong to say so?


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> 
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> when does legitimate criticism of the rapist pig of mecca cross over into   "islamophobia'?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When it's constructed the way it is in your sentence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why?----he murdered, he raped and he advised the killing of anyone who did not lick his ass.    It is wrong to say so?
Click to expand...

 
As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  There are many faces to Islamophobia.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

I see Coyote, the head troll of the forum is once again up to her usual mocking.

 Besides thinking Muslims raping children is funny, if people look at post #178, this Islamist thinks it is funny that Jews had to live as second-class citizens under the yoke of those like her.


----------



## Eloy

Dogmaphobe said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
Click to expand...






King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .




Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.

 At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.


----------



## Mindful

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> OH??   you have abandoned the vile filth of Baathism?
> 
> 
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come on. This was general.
Click to expand...


You expect me to read your mind?


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> when does legitimate criticism of the rapist pig of mecca cross over into   "islamophobia'?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When it's constructed the way it is in your sentence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why?----he murdered, he raped and he advised the killing of anyone who did not lick his ass.    It is wrong to say so?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  There are many faces to Islamophobia.
Click to expand...


ok-----then you advocate the tit for tat response.   Muslim clerics----LONG AGO-----like more than 50 years ago advocated the murder of ANY JEW OF ANY AGE OR GENDER  in the world by muslims------as Islamic edicts. 
The rationale is------any jew CAN become a soldier in the
IDF regardless of gender and any jew can be assumed to
be a financial supporter of Israel----therefore all jews
are considered  ENEMIES OF THE UMMAH AND ISLAAM.
I learned all about it from muslims from south east asia----
of the highly educated variety.     Way back then the edicts
justified the popular airplane hijackings and airport violence
of the time.    So far no Islamic society has executed a person for murdering a jew----of any age or gender


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think the far left has become so, as is the far right though they are trying to whitewash them.
> 
> 
> 
> Rather, socialists with a sense of justice sees the continuing brutal occupation of Palestine as indefensible. This has to do with Israeli conduct in Gaza and the West Bank and can be characterized as anti-Zionist or anti-Israeli without being antisemitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a line, but people don't seem to want to discuss it (much easier I suppose to paint it all as anti-semitism) - that line is when does legitimate criticism of Israeli policies cross over into anti-semitism?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> when does legitimate criticism of the rapist pig of mecca cross over into   "islamophobia'?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When it's constructed the way it is in your sentence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> why?----he murdered, he raped and he advised the killing of anyone who did not lick his ass.    It is wrong to say so?
Click to expand...


You might get a Fatwah slapped on you for that.


----------



## Mindful

Eloy said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews
Click to expand...


Why this intense disproportionate focus on Jews?


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews
Click to expand...


So?     what is your point?     BTW---I have relatives thru marriage who STILL speak Spanish at home----even though
their HOMES have not been in any Spanish speaking country
for the past 500 years.   The current move in Spain giving citizenship to some communities they murdered and pillaged
and expelled 500 years ago actually is based on Spain's fear
of being overrun by MUSLIMS


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> I don't think antisemitism ever really left Europe, it just got buried.  People will always need scapegoats to blame for their troubles and to unite them when the future is uncertain and their identity seems threatened.  Those scapegoats are usually minorities.








With the rise in islamic immigration, muslims fleeing war torn nations and increasing asylum seekers anti semitism has been broughtback to Europe. Just as disease that we eradicated has came back, and is resistant to treatment. The muslims brought their religious hatreds with them when they invaded Europe and instead of clamping down hard the governments turned a blind eye to the problem. Now it is so firmly entrenched into society that left wing politicians are being openly anti semitic and hostile towards the Jews. They will only have themselvews to blame when the Jews retaliate and hit them where it hurts the most


----------



## Eloy

irosie91 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So?     what is your point?     BTW---I have relatives thru marriage who STILL speak Spanish at home----even though
> their HOMES have not been in any Spanish speaking country
> for the past 500 years.   The current move in Spain giving citizenship to some communities they murdered and pillaged
> and expelled 500 years ago actually is based on Spain's fear
> of being overrun by MUSLIMS
Click to expand...

The Spanish fear nothing.


----------



## irosie91

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Guess all those articles are wrong then....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have quite the history of confirmation bias, choosing only that information that supports your Islamist supremacist viewpoint while being inimical to the Jews they persecute.
> 
> Jews were only "tolerated" in Arab lands as long as they were willing to live as second-class citizens to their Islamic masters.
Click to expand...




Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Guess all those articles are wrong then....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have quite the history of confirmation bias, choosing only that information that supports your Islamist supremacist viewpoint while being inimical to the Jews they persecute.
> 
> Jews were only "tolerated" in Arab lands as long as they were willing to live as second-class citizens to their Islamic masters.
Click to expand...


Coyote laughed----not the first time----she laughed when I recounted the history of my mother-in-law trapped in a
shariah shit hole-----and the fact that she had to be RESCUED
from rape by the Local Imam----legal in Islamic law because her father had died when she was eleven years old


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So?     what is your point?     BTW---I have relatives thru marriage who STILL speak Spanish at home----even though
> their HOMES have not been in any Spanish speaking country
> for the past 500 years.   The current move in Spain giving citizenship to some communities they murdered and pillaged
> and expelled 500 years ago actually is based on Spain's fear
> of being overrun by MUSLIMS
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Spanish fear nothing.
Click to expand...


Machismo   is passed mother to son-----the subject is treated
in books on Developmental Psychology and Sociology ---as an
aberration


----------



## Bleipriester

Mindful said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> As much as you have abandoned zionist imperialism of the "chosen", respective their bimbos. We can all be lucky Assad is successful in defending Syria against Nato´s Islamist terrorist gangs. Freedom still prevails in Syria.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come on. This was general.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You expect me to read your mind?
Click to expand...

No but as I said before, the list would be long.


----------



## Mindful

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> 
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come on. This was general.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You expect me to read your mind?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No but as I said before, the list would be long.
Click to expand...


How fascinating.


----------



## Eloy

irosie91 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By royal decree, Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492 and Muslims followed them in 1609. This was done to preserve Catholicism in Spain. It worked back then. Such official antisemitism and Islamophobia would not be tolerated in Spain today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Expulsion of the Moriscos at the port of Dénia, by Vincente Mostre.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So?     what is your point?     BTW---I have relatives thru marriage who STILL speak Spanish at home----even though
> their HOMES have not been in any Spanish speaking country
> for the past 500 years.   The current move in Spain giving citizenship to some communities they murdered and pillaged
> and expelled 500 years ago actually is based on Spain's fear
> of being overrun by MUSLIMS
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Spanish fear nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Machismo   is passed mother to son-----the subject is treated
> in books on Developmental Psychology and Sociology ---as an
> aberration
Click to expand...

I read a book once.


----------



## Bleipriester

Mindful said:


> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come on. This was general.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You expect me to read your mind?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No but as I said before, the list would be long.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> How fascinating.
Click to expand...

Not really. Would be better if there was not so much what makes one sick.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Spain is one of the most antisemitic countries in Europe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King Felipe VI of Spain speaks during a ceremony on granting Spanish citizenship to Sephardic Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So?     what is your point?     BTW---I have relatives thru marriage who STILL speak Spanish at home----even though
> their HOMES have not been in any Spanish speaking country
> for the past 500 years.   The current move in Spain giving citizenship to some communities they murdered and pillaged
> and expelled 500 years ago actually is based on Spain's fear
> of being overrun by MUSLIMS
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Spanish fear nothing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Machismo   is passed mother to son-----the subject is treated
> in books on Developmental Psychology and Sociology ---as an
> aberration
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I read a book once.
Click to expand...


good-----you have probably exceeded most of your kith and kin.    There are MANY MANY works in the subject of developemental psychology and sociology.    I have read only a few------neither psychology nor sociology is my major
field of study


----------



## irosie91

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> 
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come on. This was general.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You expect me to read your mind?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No but as I said before, the list would be long.
Click to expand...


so ---cut it down to the ten MOST SIGNIFICANT


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
Click to expand...


Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.

Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?

I think so.  I don't think you do.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
Click to expand...


could you define "scapegoating"  as you use it?     In my lexicon ---ie how I use the word refers to SPECIFIC claims-----like an accusation of rape against a black male in the south
to satisfy some perversions of white southern males----generally LIBELS  related to ONGOING social problems or
issues or tensions.


----------



## Phoenall

Bleipriester said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bleipriester said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> What are you so uptight about?
> 
> 
> 
> The list would require the forum owner to rent a larger server.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Who are you to assume the monopoly on annoyance with others? Given your own provocative material.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Come on. This was general.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You expect me to read your mind?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No but as I said before, the list would be long.
Click to expand...







 In other words caught out again without the evidence to support your claims so you deflect and derail. 

How big do you think the Server is, as my personal one has the capacity to handle the whole of the USMB 10 times over. It is based around a 5th generation intel processor running Linux. It sits under my desk in an old tower case and allows the whole house to be linked by ethernet at 10/100 protocols. It uses two IDE hard drives that are swapped out every week, with a third as backup in case of failure. I am currently working on a raspberry pi server to miniaturise the system even more, I would reccomend you look up the raspberry pi computer that has taken Europe by storm and is being used to teach children programming skills.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
Click to expand...







 So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
Click to expand...



 Damn, you sure don't stray from the electronicintifada agitprop program, do you?

I learned history at a major university, the likes of which you stood absolutely no chance of entering, and I also watched it unfold before me.

 I have scapegoated no innocent people here. You are simply a repulsive lair with a subversive agenda.


----------



## Mindful

* Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism.*


*Book Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism*


----------



## Jroc

Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> See you ignore the truth and go for islamonazi propaganda instead. The LoN ( not Europe) gave the inhabitants of the former Ottoman empire the nations they wanted based on historic borders. They are not "artificial states" other than Jordan and palestine that never existed in antiquity
> 
> 
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
Click to expand...



States don't "naturally exist"


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Phoenall said:


> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after




She is simply indulging in a form of agitprop developed by the Nazis.  Later writers call it "turnspeak", in which those attacking accuse those defending of doing what they are actually doing. Just as Hitler's excursions were always portrayed as defensive measures geared towards liberating the local inhabitants of the Sudetenland, Czechoslovakia, etc, so, too does this repulsive creature try to portray those who AREN'T using the electronicintifada type hate sites she frequents as the the ones who are actually scapegoating. 

 It's as transparent as all get up to anybody with a functioning brain.


----------



## irosie91

Jroc said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Been reading a very interesting article that's almost a short book, on the origins of the conflicts in the modern middle east. Maybe you should read a bit before you spew your crap.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> States don't "naturally exist"
Click to expand...

'
Lots of "states"  in the Mid east -----EXISTED as----PLACES
sorta called  LANDS----long before the Ottoman empire existed and they exist still.    Iraq is the BABYLON of old----
Syria is approximately ASSYRIA.  Lebanon is still Lebanon
after more then 3000 years.    Egypt is still Egypt.   Sudan
was Sudan thousands of Years ago-----well Morocco was
Morocco for at least 1000 years maybe a lot more    I really do not see where  "THE EVIL WEST"  created anything
new from anything other than  JORDAN---from
the area that used to be called  "Transjordan---
Ie the land to the east of the Jordan River.    Europe got
more CHOPPED up in the last 500 years than did the
Middle east.      My ancestors hailed from the AUSTRIAN-
HAPSBURG EMPIRE_----anyone know what happened
to that place?      Its loss has not discombobulated me


----------



## Jroc

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 2011:
> 
> "
> * It is an anti-Semitism that the left does not want to fight, because for it, the Muslims are oppressed, and the left is always on the side of those it defines as oppressed, whether or not the oppression is caused by the terrible governance inside those countries, or scapegoated onto someone else. European anti-racist movements say they are very concerned about "Islamophobic racism," but they are totally reluctant to discuss the anti-Semitism in the Muslim populations.*
> 
> Hatred towards Israel is now the most widely shared sentiment among Europeans.
> The new, current anti-Semitism now adds on to the old kind, the demonization of the State of Israel. The Islamic view of Israel is now the dominant view of Israel in Europe. "
> 
> The Full-Blown Return of Anti-Semitism in Europe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Interesting article.  And I agree.
> 
> The more I've read about anti-semitism, the more I see it in certain Muslim populations as well, as a result of the conflict surrounding Israel.
> 
> But here's what I feel - it's not a zero sum equation.  Scapegoating innocent people is wrong - it's always wrong - whether it's done because some people of that belief or ethnicity or race have done terrible things, or if it's done because people don't really understand their beliefs or culture.  The rhetoric, and the subliminal calls to violence towards those people is the same across the board - even the conspiracy theories.  I think any decent person should notice that, and fight against it.
> 
> In the US, hate crimes against Jews have gone down, but hate crimes against Muslims have gone up.  I don't know what the statistics are in European countries, but I think anti-semitism is more deeply embedded there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> coyote---you are a victim of wishful thinking and gullibility as
> demonstrated by several of your statements.   Your first paragraph made me laugh.    Muslims do not NEED Israel to
> hate jews.     In fact muslims do not even need jews to hate
> jews.    Hatred of jews is more prominent amongst people who
> never saw a jew in their lives than it is in Gaza.   I learned that
> fact when I first encountered muslims from South east Asia---VERY FEW of whom had ever met a jew before getting into
> the USA.    In fact---WAY BACK THEN---when I was young----
> the least of the newly arriving professionals----as to Jew-hatred---were muslims who had known jews------like the Iranians and Egyptians (back then).     -----Later on I came to know lots of jews who were jews in muslim lands long before
> 1948---------they were CLEARLY HATED in their native
> arab/muslim lands-----as were their grandparents and ancestors way back to the time of the GREAT AND GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once you start to JUSTIFY scapegoating you enter very dangerous territory.
> 
> Muslims didn't particularly hate Jews historically prior to Israel (and no, I'm not saying they coexisted in sweetness and  light) - but they often had peaceful coexistence and at times flourished.  Historically - religious minorities have always had troubled times under the majority religion and religion and government were the same.  I think WW2, the rise of Jewish nationalist inspirations and Arab nationalist inspirations created much greater friction that has always grown.
Click to expand...




Tilly said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
Click to expand...



The same thing is happening at the leftist universities in the U.S. as they import muslim students. The left teams up with muslims to demonized Israel and spread Jew hate on campus  




Coyote's favorite..She defend this woman for 2 years until she decided to change tactics


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> * Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism.*
> 
> 
> *Book Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism*




 Since this book brings up the alliance between the European left and Islamists, dare I add to the reading list, one German historian by the Name of Matthias Kuntzel?  He has written extensively about the connections between the Nazis and Islamists, and provides an insight to the origin of many of the themes these leftists parrot like they do


----------



## Jroc

irosie91 said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> coyote---please try to make a point------"i have read"  does not
> work on a messageboard.
> 
> 
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> States don't "naturally exist"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> '
> Lots of "states"  in the Mid east -----EXISTED as----PLACES
> sorta called  LANDS----long before the Ottoman empire existed and they exist still.    Iraq is the BABYLON of old----
> Syria is approximately ASSYRIA.  Lebanon is still Lebanon
> after more then 3000 years.    Egypt is still Egypt.   Sudan
> was Sudan thousands of Years ago-----well Morocco was
> Morocco for at least 1000 years maybe a lot more    I really do not see where  "THE EVIL WEST"  created anything
> new from anything other than  JORDAN---from
> the area that used to be called  "Transjordan---
> Ie the land to the east of the Jordan River.    Europe got
> more CHOPPED up in the last 500 years than did the
> Middle east.      My ancestors hailed from the AUSTRIAN-
> HAPSBURG EMPIRE_----anyone know what happened
> to that place?      Its loss has not discombobulated me
Click to expand...



States come and go, they don't naturally exist. Babylon no longer exists, neither does Assyria, or ancient Egypt. Nor do those people exist.. they are Arabs


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism.*
> 
> 
> *Book Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since this book brings up the alliance between the European left and Islamists, dare I add to the reading list, one German historian by the Name of Matthias Kuntzel?  He has written extensively about the connections between the Nazis and Islamists, and provides an insight to the origin of many of the themes these leftists parrot like they do
Click to expand...


I had a skim through of him, and will look further in depth at a later date.

I'd not heard of him, and I tend to distrust German writers.


----------



## irosie91

Jroc said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> That would require starting a new topic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> States don't "naturally exist"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> '
> Lots of "states"  in the Mid east -----EXISTED as----PLACES
> sorta called  LANDS----long before the Ottoman empire existed and they exist still.    Iraq is the BABYLON of old----
> Syria is approximately ASSYRIA.  Lebanon is still Lebanon
> after more then 3000 years.    Egypt is still Egypt.   Sudan
> was Sudan thousands of Years ago-----well Morocco was
> Morocco for at least 1000 years maybe a lot more    I really do not see where  "THE EVIL WEST"  created anything
> new from anything other than  JORDAN---from
> the area that used to be called  "Transjordan---
> Ie the land to the east of the Jordan River.    Europe got
> more CHOPPED up in the last 500 years than did the
> Middle east.      My ancestors hailed from the AUSTRIAN-
> HAPSBURG EMPIRE_----anyone know what happened
> to that place?      Its loss has not discombobulated me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> States come and go, they don't naturally exist. Babylon no longer exists, neither does Assyria, or ancient Egypt. Nor do those people exist.. they are Arabs
Click to expand...


well---sorta true----I am trying to come to terms with the theory 
"WESTERN COLONIALISM DONE IT"   aks  "THE WEST"-----
lands and people have existed for a long time------of course very much IN FLUX.    Very few of the cultural groups from the distant past have survived.     Egyptians today are not the Egyptians of the time of  RAMSES II      Today---having been
conquered by FOREIGN PEOPLE from arabia-----the people of
Egypt are LARGELY ARABIZED ---gave up their old culture and religion and even language and are NOW ARABS------but "the west" did not do that-------it happened over several thousand years.     Syria----well no more ASSYRIA-----no
more AEGEAN PEOPLE there-----now they too are  ARABS---
having been overrun by foreigners from way long long off----arabia.    Lebanon has been Lebanon so long that it is named
in the bible------as LEBANON------but it has been overrun by  
ARABS and has been Arabized ------over several centuries---but "THE WEST"  did not do that


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jroc said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> wtf? No, you already referenced it. It would require you supporting the hateful crap you spew, and you won't do that. I don't know if you're too stupid, or too evil. Maybe both.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I referenced it in response to another person's quote and don't want to derail this topic further.  If you want to discuss the origins of the conflicts in the ME today - start a topic and I'll join in.  Much of it started with WW1 and the carving up of the Ottoman Empire into states that would  not have naturally existed forcing different people's together who historically did not get along, and creating a situation where only strongman dictators could hold those states together.  Following the European system of "divide and conquor" they invested minorities with power because they knew the minorities would have to remain loyal to them or their existence would be threatened.  Why are the Christians in Syria in so much trouble?  They were closely linked to the ruling Syrian group, also a minority, and now the civil war has given power, and vengeance, to the oppressed majorities.  That's NOT a defense of anything - just a very simplistic explanation of the history behind it.  It's fascinating and dreadful, and similar played out in Africa.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> States don't "naturally exist"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> '
> Lots of "states"  in the Mid east -----EXISTED as----PLACES
> sorta called  LANDS----long before the Ottoman empire existed and they exist still.    Iraq is the BABYLON of old----
> Syria is approximately ASSYRIA.  Lebanon is still Lebanon
> after more then 3000 years.    Egypt is still Egypt.   Sudan
> was Sudan thousands of Years ago-----well Morocco was
> Morocco for at least 1000 years maybe a lot more    I really do not see where  "THE EVIL WEST"  created anything
> new from anything other than  JORDAN---from
> the area that used to be called  "Transjordan---
> Ie the land to the east of the Jordan River.    Europe got
> more CHOPPED up in the last 500 years than did the
> Middle east.      My ancestors hailed from the AUSTRIAN-
> HAPSBURG EMPIRE_----anyone know what happened
> to that place?      Its loss has not discombobulated me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> States come and go, they don't naturally exist. Babylon no longer exists, neither does Assyria, or ancient Egypt. Nor do those people exist.. they are Arabs
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> well---sorta true----I am trying to come to terms with the theory
> "WESTERN COLONIALISM DONE IT"   aks  "THE WEST"-----
> lands and people have existed for a long time------of course very much IN FLUX.    Very few of the cultural groups from the distant past have survived.     Egyptians today are not the Egyptians of the time of  RAMSES II      Today---having been
> conquered by FOREIGN PEOPLE from arabia-----the people of
> Egypt are LARGELY ARABIZED ---gave up their old culture and religion and even language and are NOW ARABS------but "the west" did not do that-------it happened over several thousand years.     Syria----well no more ASSYRIA-----no
> more AEGEAN PEOPLE there-----now they too are  ARABS---
> having been overrun by foreigners from way long long off----arabia.    Lebanon has been Lebanon so long that it is named
> in the bible------as LEBANON------but it has been overrun by
> ARABS and has been Arabized ------over several centuries---but "THE WEST"  did not do that
Click to expand...


The Assyrians live in the Diaspora. Driven out by the Arabs, they are dispersed throughout the world. A huge community of them live in my area.


----------



## Tilly

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> * Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism.*
> 
> 
> *Book Review | The Left’s Jewish Problem: Jeremy Corbyn, Israel and Anti-Semitism*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since this book brings up the alliance between the European left and Islamists, dare I add to the reading list, one German historian by the Name of Matthias Kuntzel?  He has written extensively about the connections between the Nazis and Islamists, and provides an insight to the origin of many of the themes these leftists parrot like they do
Click to expand...

Islamic student groups have successfully managed to get Mr Kuntzel barred from speaking on Antisemitism in the ME on at least one UK campus.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Damn, you sure don't stray from the electronicintifada agitprop program, do you?
> 
> I learned history at a major university, the likes of which you stood absolutely no chance of entering, and I also watched it unfold before me.
> 
> I have scapegoated no innocent people here. You are simply a repulsive lair with a subversive agenda.
Click to expand...



You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns. 

When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.

Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after
Click to expand...


Where have I "scapegoated" Jews or blamed them for everything?  Think carefully before you keep lying Phoenall.  Maybe you could provide a link.


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Damn, you sure don't stray from the electronicintifada agitprop program, do you?
> 
> I learned history at a major university, the likes of which you stood absolutely no chance of entering, and I also watched it unfold before me.
> 
> I have scapegoated no innocent people here. You are simply a repulsive lair with a subversive agenda.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
Click to expand...

You're one to talk.


----------



## Jroc

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Damn, you sure don't stray from the electronicintifada agitprop program, do you?
> 
> I learned history at a major university, the likes of which you stood absolutely no chance of entering, and I also watched it unfold before me.
> 
> I have scapegoated no innocent people here. You are simply a repulsive lair with a subversive agenda.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
Click to expand...




You're the troll sweetie. You're all over the web pushing your muslim discrimination in the west bull, which for the most part does not exist.


----------



## Drummond

Eloy said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
Click to expand...


You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ? 

--- I wonder.

Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.

During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.

How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?

Here ... check this out ... 

*Labour party antisemitism.*



> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.



That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...


----------



## Tilly

Drummond said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> --- I wonder.
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
Click to expand...

Not to mention Corbyn and his 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah.


----------



## Tilly

From Drummonds link:

British Labour may be in the throes of a crisis that could keep the party out of national government for a generation and threatens its claims to be a progressive political party committed to anti-racism and social justice.

The crisis is entirely of the party’s own making. Plastered across the social media pages of its Councillors, activists, members of the House of Commons and even its esteemed party grandees has been unabashed racism directed squarely at the Jews.

Concerns about antisemitism in Britain’s far-left surfaced at the time of the election of Jeremy Corbyn as party leader in September 2015. While Corbyn himself has not been accused of antisemitism, he has maintained a disturbing proximity to a melange of violent Islamists, Holocaust-deniers and terrorist organisations openly orientated towards the annihilation of the Jews.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.




 That wasn't actually a challenge to you to double down on the turnspeak, you know, but as long as you want to reveal what you are all about to an even greater degree, then be my guest


----------



## Eloy

Drummond said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
Click to expand...

I am not English.



Drummond said:


> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.


Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.



Drummond said:


> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?


Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.



Drummond said:


> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
Click to expand...

Many false assertions were made about socialists.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That wasn't actually a challenge to you to double down on the turnspeak, you know, but as long as you want to reveal what you are all about to an even greater degree, then be my guest
Click to expand...


I'm curious.  Do you ever actually discuss the topic or is your sole contribution to this place discussing other posters?

Instead of discussing a topic, you discuss posters, most of whom you've fit into pigeonholes.  You do this in thread after thread as if it has some sort of importance beyond disruption.

You claim to be neither left nor right (I call bullshit on that) - you have a lot to say on leftwing anti-semitism but nothing on rightwing antisemitism.  You're arguments are hardly impartial but entirely one sided.

You have NO problem whatsoever with hatred and rhetoric directed at Muslims who have done nothing to deserve it.  Like the anti-semites, you blame the entire group for the actions of some.  Yet, that same rhetoric applied to the Jewish people has you up in arms.

Wouldn't the world be a better place if we applied to same standards to all?

I don't expect you to see that.  You have no integrity.  Not when you rely on hate sites for sources.


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That wasn't actually a challenge to you to double down on the turnspeak, you know, but as long as you want to reveal what you are all about to an even greater degree, then be my guest
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm curious.  Do you ever actually discuss the topic or is your sole contribution to this place discussing other posters?
> 
> Instead of discussing a topic, you discuss posters, most of whom you've fit into pigeonholes.  You do this in thread after thread as if it has some sort of importance beyond disruption.
> 
> You claim to be neither left nor right (I call bullshit on that) - you have a lot to say on leftwing anti-semitism but nothing on rightwing antisemitism.  You're arguments are hardly impartial but entirely one sided.
> 
> You have NO problem whatsoever with hatred and rhetoric directed at Muslims who have done nothing to deserve it.  Like the anti-semites, you blame the entire group for the actions of some.  Yet, that same rhetoric applied to the Jewish people has you up in arms.
> 
> Wouldn't the world be a better place if we applied to same standards to all?
> 
> I don't expect you to see that.  You have no integrity.  Not when you rely on hate sites for sources.
Click to expand...

you described yourself pretty perfectly.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Damn, you sure don't stray from the electronicintifada agitprop program, do you?
> 
> I learned history at a major university, the likes of which you stood absolutely no chance of entering, and I also watched it unfold before me.
> 
> I have scapegoated no innocent people here. You are simply a repulsive lair with a subversive agenda.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
Click to expand...








Dont you do the same thing when it comes to dishing the dirt on the Jews and Israel. Not once have I seen you use an unbiased source for your evidence, and your Wiki sources happen to be islamonazi propagandist ones


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I "scapegoated" Jews or blamed them for everything?  Think carefully before you keep lying Phoenall.  Maybe you could provide a link.
Click to expand...






Your complete acceptance of what team palestine post shows that you blame them for everything that is happening. Your refusal to accept that the same international laws that created Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria also created the Jewish national home. Your denial of the Jews rights under international laws and claims of war crimes also shows you to scapegoat the Jews and blame them for everything. Your latest trick of STEALING Jewish land to give to illegal immigrants as it will make the area more peaceful is a laugh after being shown the arab muslims many charters that say the exact opposite and that the only way to ensue peace is to wipe out the Jews and give the land to the muslims. 

 Not just me that has seen through your veneer as far too many posters are now calling you out.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
Click to expand...







 But you could be British 

 No the truth was told and the people saw through them and that is why they ended up out of power. They are the pariah's and have fallen from grace after the Rotherham affair


----------



## Mindful

"Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."

How many times have I heard that old chestnut?


----------



## LuckyDuck

Mindful said:


> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis


Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That wasn't actually a challenge to you to double down on the turnspeak, you know, but as long as you want to reveal what you are all about to an even greater degree, then be my guest
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm curious.  Do you ever actually discuss the topic or is your sole contribution to this place discussing other posters?
> 
> Instead of discussing a topic, you discuss posters, most of whom you've fit into pigeonholes.  You do this in thread after thread as if it has some sort of importance beyond disruption.
> 
> You claim to be neither left nor right (I call bullshit on that) - you have a lot to say on leftwing anti-semitism but nothing on rightwing antisemitism.  You're arguments are hardly impartial but entirely one sided.
> 
> You have NO problem whatsoever with hatred and rhetoric directed at Muslims who have done nothing to deserve it.  Like the anti-semites, you blame the entire group for the actions of some.  Yet, that same rhetoric applied to the Jewish people has you up in arms.
> 
> Wouldn't the world be a better place if we applied to same standards to all?
> 
> I don't expect you to see that.  You have no integrity.  Not when you rely on hate sites for sources.
Click to expand...








 So when will you apply your standards to the arab muslims that you reserve for the Jews. Start with the Jews rights under international law to live in Israel as granted under international laws. Something that you have denied exists until it was pointed out the rest of the M.E. was created under the same laws.


----------



## Mindful

In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.


----------



## Mindful

This is what they were promised:


----------



## Mindful

This is what they got:


----------



## Mindful




----------



## Drummond

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
Click to expand...


You're nitpicking somewhat.

I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?

As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?

Explain this one:

The Insider | Mayor of London faces sack for being rude to a Jewish journalist



> A disciplinary panel is expected to decide if London's mayor breached a code of conduct* in comparing a Jewish reporter to a concentration camp guard. *
> 
> If found to have brought his office into disrepute, Ken Livingstone faces censure,* but suspension is unlikely. *
> 
> His lawyer has argued there was no evidence he had damaged his office with his comments made at a party last year.
> 
> *The Adjudication Panel for England hearing followed a complaint from the Jewish Board of Deputies. *
> 
> During the hearing the mayor has defended the altercation with Evening Standard reporter Oliver Finegold.
> 
> He accused the journalist of "doorstepping" him outside a party and asked him if he had ever been a German war criminal.



Even here, it seems, Labour were reported as being likely to pull their punches when it comes to dealing with Livingstone ...


----------



## Mindful

Drummond said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Explain this one:
> 
> The Insider | Mayor of London faces sack for being rude to a Jewish journalist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A disciplinary panel is expected to decide if London's mayor breached a code of conduct* in comparing a Jewish reporter to a concentration camp guard. *
> 
> If found to have brought his office into disrepute, Ken Livingstone faces censure,* but suspension is unlikely. *
> 
> His lawyer has argued there was no evidence he had damaged his office with his comments made at a party last year.
> 
> *The Adjudication Panel for England hearing followed a complaint from the Jewish Board of Deputies. *
> 
> During the hearing the mayor has defended the altercation with Evening Standard reporter Oliver Finegold.
> 
> He accused the journalist of "doorstepping" him outside a party and asked him if he had ever been a German war criminal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Even here, it seems, Labour were reported as being likely to pull their punches when it comes to dealing with Livingstone ...
Click to expand...


I don't see Corbyn's appeal. He has no charisma; whatsoever.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?



By those who do SO much more than merely criticize an Israeli governmental policy here and there.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Explain this one:
> 
> The Insider | Mayor of London faces sack for being rude to a Jewish journalist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A disciplinary panel is expected to decide if London's mayor breached a code of conduct* in comparing a Jewish reporter to a concentration camp guard. *
> 
> If found to have brought his office into disrepute, Ken Livingstone faces censure,* but suspension is unlikely. *
> 
> His lawyer has argued there was no evidence he had damaged his office with his comments made at a party last year.
> 
> *The Adjudication Panel for England hearing followed a complaint from the Jewish Board of Deputies. *
> 
> During the hearing the mayor has defended the altercation with Evening Standard reporter Oliver Finegold.
> 
> He accused the journalist of "doorstepping" him outside a party and asked him if he had ever been a German war criminal.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Even here, it seems, Labour were reported as being likely to pull their punches when it comes to dealing with Livingstone ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't see Corbyn's appeal. He has no charisma; whatsoever.
Click to expand...







He will dance to the union leaders pipes, which puts him in a position where the unions can call the shots. This is why they are prepared to destroy the labour party and ruin the country. The union leaders are hard line neo marxist nazis, no better than the marxist nazi's in 1930's Germany


----------



## Mindful

Imagine, for a moment, that David Cameron had repeated the ancient antisemitic myth known as the “blood libel”, the idea that Jews murder non-Jewish children in order to use their blood for ritual purposes. Or what if he had said that Jews were “the chief financiers of the slave trade”. What would be the reaction?

At a minimum he would be universally shunned, shamed and discredited. If he were still Prime Minister, he’d have been hounded out of office. Certainly the only people who would share platforms with him after that would be people who either agreed with his sentiment or were apologists for it.

So why has Jeremy Corbyn shared platforms with people who have said those exact words? Such as Jackie Walker, who refuses to apologise for her outrageous remarks? Why did Corbyn express a wish to have tea on the parliamentary terrace with the leader of the Islamic Movement in Northern Israel, Raed Salah, who was found by a British court judge to have used the blood libel against Jews?

Yet by contrast, during the EU referendum campaign, Corbyn refused on multiple occasions to share a platform with David Cameron. What does that say about Jeremy Corbyn’s moral outlook?

Corbyn is often defended by well meaning, naive observers as “a nice guy” even if you disagree with him. Yet the record shows that time and again, Corbyn will provide oxygen and cover for bigots, racists, terrorist sympathisers and antisemites.

Read more:

http://hurryupharry.org/2016/09/17/...-guy-hes-an-apologist-for-racists-and-bigots/


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Imagine, for a moment, that David Cameron had repeated the ancient antisemitic myth known as the “blood libel”, the idea that Jews murder non-Jewish children in order to use their blood for ritual purposes. Or what if he had said that Jews were “the chief financiers of the slave trade”. What would be the reaction?
> 
> At a minimum he would be universally shunned, shamed and discredited. If he were still Prime Minister, he’d have been hounded out of office. Certainly the only people who would share platforms with him after that would be people who either agreed with his sentiment or were apologists for it.
> 
> So why has Jeremy Corbyn shared platforms with people who have said those exact words? Such as Jackie Walker, who refuses to apologise for her outrageous remarks? Why did Corbyn express a wish to have tea on the parliamentary terrace with the leader of the Islamic Movement in Northern Israel, Raed Salah, who was found by a British court judge to have used the blood libel against Jews?
> 
> Yet by contrast, during the EU referendum campaign, Corbyn refused on multiple occasions to share a platform with David Cameron. What does that say about Jeremy Corbyn’s moral outlook?
> 
> Corbyn is often defended by well meaning, naive observers as “a nice guy” even if you disagree with him. Yet the record shows that time and again, Corbyn will provide oxygen and cover for bigots, racists, terrorist sympathisers and antisemites.
> 
> Read more:
> 
> http://hurryupharry.org/2016/09/17/...-guy-hes-an-apologist-for-racists-and-bigots/








 He has cost the Labour party much of its donations to help it fight elections, so much so that the labour party will split into two seperate parties this year and the non neo marxist group will get the majority of the donations. This will mean the Unions will either force their members to pay more for less, or fold and leave the workers without any legal cover or representation. The labour party was overrun by islamonazi terrorists in the 1990's and now is a cancer on the workers


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.



What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?




It seems to me that you are setting up a scenario where any criticism of Israel becomes anti-semitism.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
Click to expand...


A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems to me that you are setting up a scenario where any criticism of Israel becomes anti-semitism.
Click to expand...


It doesn't seem that way to me.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems to me that you are setting up a scenario where any criticism of Israel becomes anti-semitism.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It doesn't seem that way to me.
Click to expand...


Where do you draw the line?  Is all criticism of Israel anti-semitism?  Can Israel's policies NOT be criticized?

I see the difference when it becomes a diatribe on Jews vs anger at specific policies of a nation.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
Click to expand...


It's old history.

Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
Click to expand...


So is my country.

Historical perspective.

It took 1,000 years to get where we are today.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
> 
> Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.
Click to expand...


That's very kind of you.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.




Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That wasn't actually a challenge to you to double down on the turnspeak, you know, but as long as you want to reveal what you are all about to an even greater degree, then be my guest
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm curious.  Do you ever actually discuss the topic or is your sole contribution to this place discussing other posters?
> 
> Instead of discussing a topic, you discuss posters, most of whom you've fit into pigeonholes.  You do this in thread after thread as if it has some sort of importance beyond disruption.
> 
> You claim to be neither left nor right (I call bullshit on that) - you have a lot to say on leftwing anti-semitism but nothing on rightwing antisemitism.  You're arguments are hardly impartial but entirely one sided.
> 
> You have NO problem whatsoever with hatred and rhetoric directed at Muslims who have done nothing to deserve it.  Like the anti-semites, you blame the entire group for the actions of some.  Yet, that same rhetoric applied to the Jewish people has you up in arms.
> 
> Wouldn't the world be a better place if we applied to same standards to all?
> 
> I don't expect you to see that.  You have no integrity.  Not when you rely on hate sites for sources.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So when will you apply your standards to the arab muslims that you reserve for the Jews. Start with the Jews rights under international law to live in Israel as granted under international laws. Something that you have denied exists until it was pointed out the rest of the M.E. was created under the same laws.
Click to expand...


They have the same rights to live there as the Palestinians.  Something I've consistently agreed on.


----------



## Coyote

LuckyDuck said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
Click to expand...


Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> As one poster said - there are many faces to antisemitism.  .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I "scapegoated" Jews or blamed them for everything?  Think carefully before you keep lying Phoenall.  Maybe you could provide a link.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your complete acceptance of what team palestine post shows that you blame them for everything that is happening. Your refusal to accept that the same international laws that created Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria also created the Jewish national home. Your denial of the Jews rights under international laws and claims of war crimes also shows you to scapegoat the Jews and blame them for everything. Your latest trick of STEALING Jewish land to give to illegal immigrants as it will make the area more peaceful is a laugh after being shown the arab muslims many charters that say the exact opposite and that the only way to ensue peace is to wipe out the Jews and give the land to the muslims.
> 
> Not just me that has seen through your veneer as far too many posters are now calling you out.
Click to expand...


Where have I blamed Jews for everything? Your inability to provide links (yet again) is duly noted.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
Click to expand...




Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
Click to expand...


Is that so?

I wonder why  Mahmoud Abbas made a call to sue the British government over the Balfour declaration of November 1917.


----------



## Votto

Dogmaphobe said:


> Judenrein is once again the fashion.  It is now a product of the left rather than the right for the most part, however.
> 
> Who was it who said "Antisemitism is the socialism of fools"?



It was always the left.


Hating Jews does not make anyone "right" winged

Hitler hated capitalism as well.


----------



## LuckyDuck

Coyote said:


> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
Click to expand...

Pew polls and research have interviewed Muslims in various Muslim nations and found a common thread.  To the "majority," Sharia Law is preferable to any other law (and as Sharia Law is part of Islams political aims, it is absolutely incompatible with western society), Gays/Lesbians should be imprisoned or killed, stoning of adulterers is acceptable, and on and on it goes.  The reason we don't see most Muslims out there running amok and killing indiscriminately is because many have families to feed and are busy supporting their large families; yet they will still support the overall goal of conquering the non-Islamic world.  Any who say otherwise are using "taqqiya."


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that so?
> 
> I wonder why  Mahmoud Abbas made a call to sue the British government over the Balfour declaration of November 1917.
Click to expand...


You'd have to ask Mr. Abbas.

This is the best explanation of what it mean that I've read: The Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate


----------



## Eloy

Drummond said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
Click to expand...

Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.



Drummond said:


> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?


The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.


----------



## Coyote

LuckyDuck said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Pew polls and research have interviewed Muslims in various Muslim nations and found a common thread.  To the "majority," Sharia Law is preferable to any other law (and as Sharia Law is part of Islams political aims, it is absolutely incompatible with western society), Gays/Lesbians should be imprisoned or killed, stoning of adulterers is acceptable, and on and on it goes.  The reason we don't see most Muslims out there running amok and killing indiscriminately is because many have families to feed and are busy supporting their large families; yet they will still support the overall goal of conquering the non-Islamic world.  Any who say otherwise are using "taqqiya."
Click to expand...


The reason you don't see them running amok as you say is that is not the way most of them are.  As education and income grow, family size goes down.  In fact, among Muslim immigrants to western countries by the second generation, family size is other groups.

Pew polls are an excellent source.  Have you read what they have to say about American Muslims?


----------



## Mindful

LuckyDuck said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Pew polls and research have interviewed Muslims in various Muslim nations and found a common thread.  To the "majority," Sharia Law is preferable to any other law (and as Sharia Law is part of Islams political aims, it is absolutely incompatible with western society), Gays/Lesbians should be imprisoned or killed, stoning of adulterers is acceptable, and on and on it goes.  The reason we don't see most Muslims out there running amok and killing indiscriminately is because many have families to feed and are busy supporting their large families; yet they will still support the overall goal of conquering the non-Islamic world.  Any who say otherwise are using "taqqiya."
Click to expand...


Tel Aviv has been named no. 1 Gay capital of the world.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Is that so?
> 
> I wonder why  Mahmoud Abbas made a call to sue the British government over the Balfour declaration of November 1917.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You'd have to ask Mr. Abbas.
> 
> This is the best explanation of what it mean that I've read: The Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
Click to expand...


I don't think I'm going to be able to ask Mr. Abbas.

He must have taken it seriously.


----------



## Drummond

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
Click to expand...


Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?

And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.

This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??


----------



## Eloy

Drummond said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
Click to expand...

Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.


----------



## Mindful

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
Click to expand...


No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.


----------



## Eloy

Mindful said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
Click to expand...

Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.


----------



## Mindful

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
Click to expand...


So you think Hamas would spare them?


----------



## koshergrl

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
Click to expand...


^^Scapegoating. Everything bad that happens, whether it's by the Israelis, or against them, is the fault of the Israelis.

See how that works, Coyote? Recognize it? You have expended I don't know how many brain cells spinning in that way.


----------



## Eloy

Mindful said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> hanas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
Click to expand...


----------



## Eloy

Mindful said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
Click to expand...

Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.


----------



## koshergrl

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
Click to expand...


That isn't an answer.


----------



## Eloy

koshergrl said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That isn't an answer.
Click to expand...

Since Hamas has no air force to bomb, army to use heavy artillary, nor navy to strafe civilians, nor even white phosphorous to drop on schools or hospitals, the answer is Yes.


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
Click to expand...

Everything. Dumbass Americon.


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
> 
> Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.
Click to expand...

'Ol


Eloy said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Then you are an ostrich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have visited Austria but I am not from there, Tilly.
Click to expand...

i know. You are from Spain. I'm not from Aistria either, so I don't get your point, or even if you are making one.


----------



## koshergrl

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
> 
> Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 'Ol
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Then you are an ostrich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have visited Austria but I am not from there, Tilly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i know. You are from Spain. I'm not from Aistria either, so I don't get your point, or even if you are making one.
Click to expand...


She's not.


----------



## Eloy

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
> 
> Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 'Ol
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Then you are an ostrich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have visited Austria but I am not from there, Tilly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i know. You are from Spain. I'm not from Aistria either, so I don't get your point, or even if you are making one.
Click to expand...

I believe you said I was an Östereich, Tilly.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
Click to expand...







Last I looked Britain was part of Europe, just a small island of its west coast


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems to me that you are setting up a scenario where any criticism of Israel becomes anti-semitism.
Click to expand...






 Strange that the anti semites roll this one out as well when there is no evidence of it taking place. Key words used by the Jew haters trigger the anti semitic undertones of their criticism, little things like claiming Israel is the worst offender or Israel is top of the list.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
Click to expand...






 TRY AGAIN  only this time get it right


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TRY AGAIN  only this time get it right
Click to expand...


It was a pledge. A pledge is a pledge.

Even Abbas saw it that way.


----------



## Mindful

And back to the boycotts and sanctions.

The latest scheduled events being: Capitol Hill and Berkeley.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You trawl hate sites and post garbage from them to support your points.  You choose them over legitimate sites.  That says a lot about your repulsive character as does your selective support of scapegoating and hate campaigns.
> 
> When you choose to use hate sites, it's like walking through dog shit.  It sticks to your sole (or perhaps that should be soul) and no matter how often you wash, the stink still remains.
> 
> Yes, we have heard ad nauseum about your vaunted education.  A pity it doesn't seem very apparent in your posts other than to inform us that you were accepted into Stanford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That wasn't actually a challenge to you to double down on the turnspeak, you know, but as long as you want to reveal what you are all about to an even greater degree, then be my guest
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm curious.  Do you ever actually discuss the topic or is your sole contribution to this place discussing other posters?
> 
> Instead of discussing a topic, you discuss posters, most of whom you've fit into pigeonholes.  You do this in thread after thread as if it has some sort of importance beyond disruption.
> 
> You claim to be neither left nor right (I call bullshit on that) - you have a lot to say on leftwing anti-semitism but nothing on rightwing antisemitism.  You're arguments are hardly impartial but entirely one sided.
> 
> You have NO problem whatsoever with hatred and rhetoric directed at Muslims who have done nothing to deserve it.  Like the anti-semites, you blame the entire group for the actions of some.  Yet, that same rhetoric applied to the Jewish people has you up in arms.
> 
> Wouldn't the world be a better place if we applied to same standards to all?
> 
> I don't expect you to see that.  You have no integrity.  Not when you rely on hate sites for sources.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So when will you apply your standards to the arab muslims that you reserve for the Jews. Start with the Jews rights under international law to live in Israel as granted under international laws. Something that you have denied exists until it was pointed out the rest of the M.E. was created under the same laws.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They have the same rights to live there as the Palestinians.  Something I've consistently agreed on.
Click to expand...






Not all the time, many times you deny them the international laws made in their favour. As in the 1923 international law that granted 78% of palestine to the arab muslims and 22% to the Jews. You only agree with the 78% portion because it supports the arab muslims. Anything that the LoN granted to the Jews you either ignore or you deny exists, and you defend the arab muslims terrorist attacks on unarmed Jews.

 By the way until 1960 the palestinians were the Jews as no other group would allow themselves to called palestinians. The arab muslims were Filastins


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems to me that you are setting up a scenario where any criticism of Israel becomes anti-semitism.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strange that the anti semites roll this one out as well when there is no evidence of it taking place. Key words used by the Jew haters trigger the anti semitic undertones of their criticism, little things like claiming Israel is the worst offender or Israel is top of the list.
Click to expand...


I've not heard any cogent argument as to why the Arabs turned down the partition plan of 1948. And later the 2000 Camp David summit, brokered by Bill Clinton.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
Click to expand...








 Its not the few though is it, it is the majority as shown by the last elections held or the numbers prepared to act as human shields. The innocent muslims have all left the building and went somewhere else


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yours is certainly one of the ugliest.
> 
> At least a couple of the other antisemites are up front about it to some degree. You play the vile game of claiming to support one thing, but ALWAYS taking the side of those who persecute Jews.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I "scapegoated" Jews or blamed them for everything?  Think carefully before you keep lying Phoenall.  Maybe you could provide a link.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your complete acceptance of what team palestine post shows that you blame them for everything that is happening. Your refusal to accept that the same international laws that created Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria also created the Jewish national home. Your denial of the Jews rights under international laws and claims of war crimes also shows you to scapegoat the Jews and blame them for everything. Your latest trick of STEALING Jewish land to give to illegal immigrants as it will make the area more peaceful is a laugh after being shown the arab muslims many charters that say the exact opposite and that the only way to ensue peace is to wipe out the Jews and give the land to the muslims.
> 
> Not just me that has seen through your veneer as far too many posters are now calling you out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I blamed Jews for everything? Your inability to provide links (yet again) is duly noted.
Click to expand...








 Not just me that has seen through your hypocrisy is it, many others are also commenting on your Jew hatred


----------



## Mindful

Clinton's final reflections.

> Right before I left office, Arafat, in one of our last conversations, thanked me for all my efforts and told me what a great man I was. “Mr. Chairman,” I replied, “I am not a great man. I am a failure, and you have made me one.” I warned Arafat that he was single-handedly electing Sharon and that he would reap the whirlwind.<

President Clinton Reflects on 2000 Camp David Summit | Jewish Virtual Library


----------



## Mindful

Worth noting who the WCC does NOT condemn.

Here's one:

The WCC has been a regular antagonist in the propaganda war against the Jewish State. Here are five things you need to know about the WCC to understand its role in promoting anti-Zionism in Christian churches throughout the world.

*1. WCC staffers and peace activists roar like lions at Israel, but behave in a submissive manner when dealing with Muslim leaders and jihadist movements.*
As the articles linked below demonstrate, the World Council of Churches has repeatedly and regularly condemned Israeli actions, while remaining relatively silent about the misdeeds of Arabs and Muslim leaders and political movements in the Middle East.

CAMERA: Five Things You Need to Know About World Council of Churches


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
Click to expand...








If they had not invaded Jewish land and resorted to violence then they would not be occupied and held static. They are now facing what the Jews faced for 1400 years at their hands, without the wanton rapes, killings and beatings.

Was it, then how come it was the Jews that first thought of it 4,500 years ago. The British media are against Zionism and the Jews seeing as it is run by neo marxists


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Pew polls and research have interviewed Muslims in various Muslim nations and found a common thread.  To the "majority," Sharia Law is preferable to any other law (and as Sharia Law is part of Islams political aims, it is absolutely incompatible with western society), Gays/Lesbians should be imprisoned or killed, stoning of adulterers is acceptable, and on and on it goes.  The reason we don't see most Muslims out there running amok and killing indiscriminately is because many have families to feed and are busy supporting their large families; yet they will still support the overall goal of conquering the non-Islamic world.  Any who say otherwise are using "taqqiya."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The reason you don't see them running amok as you say is that is not the way most of them are.  As education and income grow, family size goes down.  In fact, among Muslim immigrants to western countries by the second generation, family size is other groups.
> 
> Pew polls are an excellent source.  Have you read what they have to say about American Muslims?
Click to expand...







 The average muslim family size in Europe is 7, the average European family size is 5. So you really need to change your source


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
Click to expand...






 Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
Click to expand...







 Only because they elected the people they did to rule them. Most of what happens to the arab muslims is of their own making, and more are killed by their leaders than by the IDF outside of military actions


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
Click to expand...








 WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> 
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That isn't an answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Since Hamas has no air force to bomb, army to use heavy artillary, nor navy to strafe civilians, nor even white phosphorous to drop on schools or hospitals, the answer is Yes.
Click to expand...






They do have W.P. and have been told their use of it is a war crime, as is their use of qassams against Israel. The hamas terrorists attack Israel and then complain when Israel retaliates with force, are they too stupid to realise that they could stop the killings by not attacking Israel.


Hamas launches first phosphorus rocket at Negev; no injuries reported

Palestinian militants fired a phosphorus rocket at Israel for the first time yesterday, one of 17 fired into Israel as fighting entered its 19th day. The phosphorus rocket exploded in an open field in the western Negev. No injuries or damage were reported.


This is what you neo nazi's defend


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
Click to expand...


Just happens to be murdering all opponents...real or imagined. Straight out of the "Stalinist" handbook!!!

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic."
> 
> How many times have I heard that old chestnut?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems to me that you are setting up a scenario where any criticism of Israel becomes anti-semitism.
Click to expand...


Not at all. I have criticised Israel often for not ridding the Palestinians of the likes of Arafat and Hamas. They are the only ones with the means of cleaning out the Terrorist scum and placing a real option for a State based on Gaza and the West Bank. I thought Abbas was their last best chance; now I hope for the next generation. I pray that I am not disappointed...again.

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
Click to expand...


Link please!!!

Greg


----------



## Tilly

Eloy said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
> 
> Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 'Ol
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Then you are an ostrich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have visited Austria but I am not from there, Tilly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i know. You are from Spain. I'm not from Aistria either, so I don't get your point, or even if you are making one.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe you said I was an Östereich, Tilly.
Click to expand...

Ostrich, Eloy, ostrich.


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
Click to expand...


Not as of 2014.


You have something more recent??

Greg


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Livingstone’s remarks are a study in the far-left’s singular treatment of antisemitism, compared to every other form of racism and intolerance. This lesson is as applicable to Australia as it is to Britain. Aside from honourable exceptions, when forced to confront an incident of antisemitism, even when irrefutable, the far-left has sought to deny, invert and ultimately shift blame onto the victims themselves, always culminating in a gratuitous and predictable attack on the ‘Jewish lobby’, a form of conspiracy theory to appeal to the weak of mind. Could one imagine the far-left mounting such a response to an allegation of homophobia, sexism or Islamophobia?
> 
> As the experience of British Labour has shown, antisemitism is very real and there remain those who reserve a unique and unwavering hatred for the dominant symbols of Jewish self-identification – the Jewish community, the Jewish faith and the Jewish nation-state.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If they had not invaded Jewish land and resorted to violence then they would not be occupied and held static. They are now facing what the Jews faced for 1400 years at their hands, without the wanton rapes, killings and beatings.
> 
> Was it, then how come it was the Jews that first thought of it 4,500 years ago. The British media are against Zionism and the Jews seeing as it is run by neo marxists
Click to expand...

Thr Israelis kill very many Palestinians, including children, sometimes vast massacres take place in Gaza using weapons supplied and paid for by American taxpayers.


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
Click to expand...

The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only because they elected the people they did to rule them. Most of what happens to the arab muslims is of their own making, and more are killed by their leaders than by the IDF outside of military actions
Click to expand...

Your attempt to blame Arab victims of Israeli persecution fools nobody.


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
Click to expand...

The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis.. 
You are rewriting history.


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That isn't an answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Since Hamas has no air force to bomb, army to use heavy artillary, nor navy to strafe civilians, nor even white phosphorous to drop on schools or hospitals, the answer is Yes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They do have W.P. and have been told their use of it is a war crime, as is their use of qassams against Israel. The hamas terrorists attack Israel and then complain when Israel retaliates with force, are they too stupid to realise that they could stop the killings by not attacking Israel.
> 
> 
> Hamas launches first phosphorus rocket at Negev; no injuries reported
> 
> Palestinian militants fired a phosphorus rocket at Israel for the first time yesterday, one of 17 fired into Israel as fighting entered its 19th day. The phosphorus rocket exploded in an open field in the western Negev. No injuries or damage were reported.
> 
> 
> This is what you neo nazi's defend
Click to expand...

By all means let is debate war crimes. Those perpetrated by the Israelis against the Palestinian people, including thousands of children, would fill a book.


----------



## Mindful

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That isn't an answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Since Hamas has no air force to bomb, army to use heavy artillary, nor navy to strafe civilians, nor even white phosphorous to drop on schools or hospitals, the answer is Yes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They do have W.P. and have been told their use of it is a war crime, as is their use of qassams against Israel. The hamas terrorists attack Israel and then complain when Israel retaliates with force, are they too stupid to realise that they could stop the killings by not attacking Israel.
> 
> 
> Hamas launches first phosphorus rocket at Negev; no injuries reported
> 
> Palestinian militants fired a phosphorus rocket at Israel for the first time yesterday, one of 17 fired into Israel as fighting entered its 19th day. The phosphorus rocket exploded in an open field in the western Negev. No injuries or damage were reported.
> 
> 
> This is what you neo nazi's defend
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By all means let is debate war crimes. Those perpetrated by the Israelis against the Palestinian people, including thousands of children, would fill a book.
Click to expand...



This again. (Groan)


----------



## Eloy

gtopa1 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...




gtopa1 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...

I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?


----------



## Mindful

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
Click to expand...


I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You say you're from the European Union. Are you from that part of it which is destined to invoke Article 50 .. in which case, where will you say you're from, once that happens ? Will you claim to be Stateless ... ?
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, that aside, your apparent belief that the Left isn't antisemitic is, of course, hogwash.
> 
> During the last major conflict between Hamas and the State of Israel -- Ed Miliband, Labour's then-Leader, not only strongly attacked Israel for its actions in defending itself from their terrorism, he even tried to make capital out of the Conservatives' refusal to be as robustly critical of them that he was.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about George Galloway, who's further to the Left than the Labour Party is ? Or Ken Livingstone, and his outrageous (i.e sick) remark about Hitler being 'a supporter of Zionism' .. ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here ... check this out ...
> 
> *Labour party antisemitism.*
> 
> That link has a lot more to say. Check it out ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If they had not invaded Jewish land and resorted to violence then they would not be occupied and held static. They are now facing what the Jews faced for 1400 years at their hands, without the wanton rapes, killings and beatings.
> 
> Was it, then how come it was the Jews that first thought of it 4,500 years ago. The British media are against Zionism and the Jews seeing as it is run by neo marxists
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thr Israelis kill very many Palestinians, including children, sometimes vast massacres take place in Gaza using weapons supplied and paid for by American taxpayers.
Click to expand...







 So why does hamas force the many hundreds of cnildren to act as human shields. Under the criteria in the Geneva conventions it is hamas that is to blame for these deaths as they refuse to move the people out of harms way. 

ONLY JEW HATERS AND ISLAMONAZI STOOGES SEE THE ISRAELI'S AS BEING THE ONES BEHIND THE DEATHS.

 THE WEAPONS ARE MOSTLY ISRAELI MADE, AND IF THE ARAB MUSLIMS WANTED THE KILLINGS TO STOP THEY SHOULD ASK ISRAEL FOR TALKS


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
Click to expand...







You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?

By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
Click to expand...


So you DO understand why Israel is defending itself!! Good job, Eloy!!! 

Greg


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only because they elected the people they did to rule them. Most of what happens to the arab muslims is of their own making, and more are killed by their leaders than by the IDF outside of military actions
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your attempt to blame Arab victims of Israeli persecution fools nobody.
Click to expand...






So you dont agree with the truth and prefer islamonazi propaganda, blood libels and lies. The arab muslims invaded in 1917 and have been trying to wipe out the Jews ever since. The Jews have fought back and the islamonazi's dont like it, so they spread these LIES to mask the reality. When asked for evidence all you have is islamonazi propaganda sites that are easily shown to be LIES


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> No doubt, any boycotts, destructions and so on would affect Israeli Arabs.
> 
> 
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
Click to expand...





 WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That isn't an answer.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Since Hamas has no air force to bomb, army to use heavy artillary, nor navy to strafe civilians, nor even white phosphorous to drop on schools or hospitals, the answer is Yes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They do have W.P. and have been told their use of it is a war crime, as is their use of qassams against Israel. The hamas terrorists attack Israel and then complain when Israel retaliates with force, are they too stupid to realise that they could stop the killings by not attacking Israel.
> 
> 
> Hamas launches first phosphorus rocket at Negev; no injuries reported
> 
> Palestinian militants fired a phosphorus rocket at Israel for the first time yesterday, one of 17 fired into Israel as fighting entered its 19th day. The phosphorus rocket exploded in an open field in the western Negev. No injuries or damage were reported.
> 
> 
> This is what you neo nazi's defend
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By all means let is debate war crimes. Those perpetrated by the Israelis against the Palestinian people, including thousands of children, would fill a book.
Click to expand...


----------



## Phoenall

Then you will be able to produce the evidence of these alleged war crimes that Israel has been accused of. Start with the findings of the ICC/ICJ that stated Israel had no case to answer when Abbas put a case before them. The same court did say they were still looking at palestinian war crimes with a view to arresting and charging the leaders, so Abbas withdrew his complaint and closed the book on the subject.

The UN has stated that every rocket fired from gaza is seen as a war crime, every attack on unarmed Israeli civilians is a war crime and every blood libel propaganda article is a war crime


Guess you lose before you have even started, as the Geneva conventions have already laid the blame for those deaths at the feet of hamas.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
Click to expand...







 Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay. 

By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Then you will be able to produce the evidence of these alleged war crimes that Israel has been accused of. Start with the findings of the ICC/ICJ that stated Israel had no case to answer when Abbas put a case before them. The same court did say they were still looking at palestinian war crimes with a view to arresting and charging the leaders, so Abbas withdrew his complaint and closed the book on the subject.
> 
> The UN has stated that every rocket fired from gaza is seen as a war crime, every attack on unarmed Israeli civilians is a war crime and every blood libel propaganda article is a war crime
> 
> 
> Guess you lose before you have even started, as the Geneva conventions have already laid the blame for those deaths at the feet of hamas.



Have you noticed; it's a script.

They say exactly the same sentences, even word order, as the other liars, revisionists,and propagandists.


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
Click to expand...


After WW1, the Ottomans handed parts of control to the British and the French.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Eloy said:


> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.




In other words -- you support the mass murder of innocent people. 

  Terrorism is not defending anything, even if you do happen to share the same desire for the genocide of Jews as Hamas.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> They say exactly the same sentences, even word order, as the other liars, revisionists,and propagandists.




They say what they have been trained to say by Islamic terrorists. 

100% buzz phrases.  0% knowledge.


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> They say exactly the same sentences, even word order, as the other liars, revisionists,and propagandists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They say what they have been trained to say by Islamic terrorists.
> 
> 100% buzz phrases.  0% knowledge.
Click to expand...


There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.


----------



## Mindful

Even on a Rome/Greek thread, dear old Penelope is banging on about the Jews.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.




.....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.

  The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.

 I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.  

Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> After WW1, the Ottomans handed parts of control to the British and the French.
Click to expand...







 And the Russians, which many people seem to have forgotten about. And the Mandates covered Europe and Africa


----------



## Eloy

Mindful said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
Click to expand...

I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.
Click to expand...


I do------very few Palestinians are killed by Israel and virtually all of them have gotten state of the art medical care in Israel and most of them are born in Israeli hospitals.     From which mosque floor do you lick shit?


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not English.
> 
> Being critical of Israel is not the same as being antisemitic.
> 
> Being critical of Israel, as I say, may be anti-Zionist but it is not antisemitic. Many Jews criticize Israel.
> Ken Livingstone was right when he mentioned Hitler and the Nazis before the war claimed to be Zionists.
> 
> Many false assertions were made about socialists.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If they had not invaded Jewish land and resorted to violence then they would not be occupied and held static. They are now facing what the Jews faced for 1400 years at their hands, without the wanton rapes, killings and beatings.
> 
> Was it, then how come it was the Jews that first thought of it 4,500 years ago. The British media are against Zionism and the Jews seeing as it is run by neo marxists
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thr Israelis kill very many Palestinians, including children, sometimes vast massacres take place in Gaza using weapons supplied and paid for by American taxpayers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why does hamas force the many hundreds of cnildren to act as human shields. Under the criteria in the Geneva conventions it is hamas that is to blame for these deaths as they refuse to move the people out of harms way.
> 
> ONLY JEW HATERS AND ISLAMONAZI STOOGES SEE THE ISRAELI'S AS BEING THE ONES BEHIND THE DEATHS.
> 
> THE WEAPONS ARE MOSTLY ISRAELI MADE, AND IF THE ARAB MUSLIMS WANTED THE KILLINGS TO STOP THEY SHOULD ASK ISRAEL FOR TALKS
Click to expand...

When the Israelis deliberately pulverize schools, hospitals, and neighborhoods, they know they are killing children. To then put out the claim that these children are being used as human shields is cynical propaganda.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If they had not invaded Jewish land and resorted to violence then they would not be occupied and held static. They are now facing what the Jews faced for 1400 years at their hands, without the wanton rapes, killings and beatings.
> 
> Was it, then how come it was the Jews that first thought of it 4,500 years ago. The British media are against Zionism and the Jews seeing as it is run by neo marxists
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thr Israelis kill very many Palestinians, including children, sometimes vast massacres take place in Gaza using weapons supplied and paid for by American taxpayers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why does hamas force the many hundreds of cnildren to act as human shields. Under the criteria in the Geneva conventions it is hamas that is to blame for these deaths as they refuse to move the people out of harms way.
> 
> ONLY JEW HATERS AND ISLAMONAZI STOOGES SEE THE ISRAELI'S AS BEING THE ONES BEHIND THE DEATHS.
> 
> THE WEAPONS ARE MOSTLY ISRAELI MADE, AND IF THE ARAB MUSLIMS WANTED THE KILLINGS TO STOP THEY SHOULD ASK ISRAEL FOR TALKS
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> When the Israelis deliberately pulverize schools, hospitals, and neighborhoods, they know they are killing children. To then put out the claim that these children are being used as human shields is cynical propaganda.
Click to expand...


any PLACE from which missiles are LAUNCHED is a LEGAL AND JUSTIFIED TARGET.     The islamo pimps and sluts know that they put anybody in the vicinity in danger when they launch bombs on Israel------Hamas and Hezbollah LOVES IT
   (seems you love it too)


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
Click to expand...

By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
Click to expand...


by whom?     The blockade of a hostile nation which states as its MANDATE that annihilation of its perceived  "enemy"  is
entirely LEGAL AND JUSTIFIED          who "controls gaza's airspace and territorial waters beyond the JUSTIFIED blockade?.     Who is "massacring"    gazans?


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
Click to expand...

The Israelis have not withdrawn from Gaza. "The Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory (the West Bank including East Jerusalem *and the Gaza Strip*) is in its fifth decade and the undercurrent of violence and inherent abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international law inherent in any long-standing military occupation is presented by both sides." (Amnesty International)
Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis have not withdrawn from Gaza. "The Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory (the West Bank including East Jerusalem *and the Gaza Strip*) is in its fifth decade and the undercurrent of violence and inherent abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international law inherent in any long-standing military occupation is presented by both sides." (Amnesty International)
> Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories
Click to expand...


you quoted idiot propaganda again.    Amnesty International is not a source.    It is an INTEREST GROUP.    Israel is in a state of WAR  with  the people who fraudulently call themselves  "Palestinians"-------by the choice of the fake
"Palestinians"


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
Click to expand...

You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.


----------



## Eloy

Dogmaphobe said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In other words -- you support the mass murder of innocent people.
> 
> Terrorism is not defending anything, even if you do happen to share the same desire for the genocide of Jews as Hamas.
Click to expand...

I do not support the mass murder of innocent Palestinian children and civilians at the hands of Israeli state terrorism. No.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
Click to expand...


Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped 
'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN


----------



## Eloy

irosie91 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do------very few Palestinians are killed by Israel and virtually all of them have gotten state of the art medical care in Israel and most of them are born in Israeli hospitals.     From which mosque floor do you lick shit?
Click to expand...




irosie91 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do------very few Palestinians are killed by Israel and virtually all of them have gotten state of the art medical care in Israel and most of them are born in Israeli hospitals.     From which mosque floor do you lick shit?
Click to expand...

Given your tone and language, do not expect any more replies from me.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In other words -- you support the mass murder of innocent people.
> 
> Terrorism is not defending anything, even if you do happen to share the same desire for the genocide of Jews as Hamas.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not support the mass murder of innocent Palestinian children and civilians at the hands of Israeli state terrorism. No.
Click to expand...


there is no mass murder of innocent Palestinian children and
civilians at the hands of   "Israeli state terrorism"-----your Imam lied.     There have been horrific episodes of mass murder of
innocent ""Palestinian"''  children and civilians by the state
terrorism of------Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria .      Based on what I know about Egyptian muslims and their attitudes towards  BALESTINIANS------chances are things would be a lot worse for them in CAIRO


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do------very few Palestinians are killed by Israel and virtually all of them have gotten state of the art medical care in Israel and most of them are born in Israeli hospitals.     From which mosque floor do you lick shit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do------very few Palestinians are killed by Israel and virtually all of them have gotten state of the art medical care in Israel and most of them are born in Israeli hospitals.     From which mosque floor do you lick shit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Given your tone and language, do not expect any more replies from me.
Click to expand...


ok        are you sensitive to language usage?     What is your mother tongue?      Your posts indicate that your mother tongue is not English.    URDU?  (probably not----Indians and Pakistanis do better than do you in English)


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
Click to expand...


The Palestinian stamp in documents.

Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.


----------



## Moonglow

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
Click to expand...

Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
Click to expand...


I have so stated many times------and never has a single one of the several islamo Nazis here have so much as acknowledged
that fact.    The word   PALESTINIAN has become an icon of
worship for  islamo-nazis.     I was a child before there existed
such a thing as a  "Palestinian"   non-jew.      As a child I thought the word  PALESTINE----was Hebrew.    Now----the historic revisionism is so convoluted that there is even such a
thing as  "PALESTINIAN"  cuisine-------as if the word describes a  "culture"     which has been around for MILLENNIA


----------



## irosie91

Moonglow said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
Click to expand...


the word   CANAANITE-----was never used to describe jews.  
Canaan was never a country.     It was a land mass-----kinda like  Antarctica is a land mass.    In ancient writings it refers to people living in that land mass who are specifically NOT JEWS


----------



## Coyote

Thread's completely off topic....


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Per RoccoR, in another discussion in IP on this - the Balfour Delcaration had no legal authority and made no promises to either Arab entities or Jewish entities.  It was simply an aggreement between the allied powers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TRY AGAIN  only this time get it right
Click to expand...

I got it right the first time.


----------



## Mindful

Moonglow said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
Click to expand...


So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?

As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.


----------



## Moonglow

Mindful said:


> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?
> 
> As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.
Click to expand...

The British were arbitrators by proxy, their terminology was based on their ability to make a quick decision without researching..Since the Canaan's were in the area, along with Abraham, many years before the Palestinians moved to the area...


----------



## Mindful

Back on topic.

The meat of the thread:

An early case of trying to destroy Israel through economic means occurred in 1980, when L'Oreal had bought the Helena Rubinstein cosmetics company. Arab regimes had threatened to truncate the lucrative relationships with the multinational companies if they did not cut ties with Israel. Instead of rejecting the blackmail, L'Oreal bowed to the blackmail. Today, this antisemitism is not led by either Arab states or Western states. France, for example, recently outlawed calls to single out Israel for boycotts. Today's hate campaign and these Nazi policies are now largely led by universities, trade unions, businesses, and hypocritical so-called "human rights" groups, as well as other NGOs.


----------



## irosie91

Moonglow said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
Click to expand...




Moonglow said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?
> 
> As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The British were arbitrators by proxy, their terminology was based on their ability to make a quick decision without researching..Since the Canaan's were in the area, along with Abraham, many years before the Palestinians moved to the area...
Click to expand...


the  "CANAAN's"     ???        I am pretty sure that even the
CANAANITES did not call themselves  "CANAANITES"----
ever.


----------



## Moonglow

Mindful said:


> Back on topic.
> 
> The meat of the thread:
> 
> An early case of trying to destroy Israel through economic means occurred in 1980, when L'Oreal had bought the Helena Rubinstein cosmetics company. Arab regimes had threatened to truncate the lucrative relationships with the multinational companies if they did not cut ties with Israel. Instead of rejecting the blackmail, L'Oreal bowed to the blackmail. Today, this antisemitism is not led by either Arab states or Western states. France, for example, recently outlawed calls to single out Israel for boycotts. Today's hate campaign and these Nazi policies are now largely led by universities, trade unions, businesses, and hypocritical so-called "human rights" groups, as well as other NGOs.


Yet Sephora is by far the better cosmetic company...


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> Back on topic.
> 
> The meat of the thread:
> 
> An early case of trying to destroy Israel through economic means occurred in 1980, when L'Oreal had bought the Helena Rubinstein cosmetics company. Arab regimes had threatened to truncate the lucrative relationships with the multinational companies if they did not cut ties with Israel. Instead of rejecting the blackmail, L'Oreal bowed to the blackmail. Today, this antisemitism is not led by either Arab states or Western states. France, for example, recently outlawed calls to single out Israel for boycotts. Today's hate campaign and these Nazi policies are now largely led by universities, trade unions, businesses, and hypocritical so-called "human rights" groups, as well as other NGOs.



boycott of Israel ---economically by banning products of any company that did business with Israel by arab and muslim countries  is a lot OLDER than 1980----it dates back to 1950


----------



## irosie91

Moonglow said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back on topic.
> 
> The meat of the thread:
> 
> An early case of trying to destroy Israel through economic means occurred in 1980, when L'Oreal had bought the Helena Rubinstein cosmetics company. Arab regimes had threatened to truncate the lucrative relationships with the multinational companies if they did not cut ties with Israel. Instead of rejecting the blackmail, L'Oreal bowed to the blackmail. Today, this antisemitism is not led by either Arab states or Western states. France, for example, recently outlawed calls to single out Israel for boycotts. Today's hate campaign and these Nazi policies are now largely led by universities, trade unions, businesses, and hypocritical so-called "human rights" groups, as well as other NGOs.
> 
> 
> 
> Yet Sephora is by far the better cosmetic company...
Click to expand...


I never tried Sephora -----what do they make?


----------



## Moonglow

irosie91 said:


> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?
> 
> As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The British were arbitrators by proxy, their terminology was based on their ability to make a quick decision without researching..Since the Canaan's were in the area, along with Abraham, many years before the Palestinians moved to the area...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the  "CANAAN's"     ???        I am pretty sure that even the
> CANAANITES did not call themselves  "CANAANITES"----
> ever.
Click to expand...

Yet Moses led his people to the promised land of Canaan...After 40 years of walking in circles for sins...


----------



## Moonglow

irosie91 said:


> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back on topic.
> 
> The meat of the thread:
> 
> An early case of trying to destroy Israel through economic means occurred in 1980, when L'Oreal had bought the Helena Rubinstein cosmetics company. Arab regimes had threatened to truncate the lucrative relationships with the multinational companies if they did not cut ties with Israel. Instead of rejecting the blackmail, L'Oreal bowed to the blackmail. Today, this antisemitism is not led by either Arab states or Western states. France, for example, recently outlawed calls to single out Israel for boycotts. Today's hate campaign and these Nazi policies are now largely led by universities, trade unions, businesses, and hypocritical so-called "human rights" groups, as well as other NGOs.
> 
> 
> 
> Yet Sephora is by far the better cosmetic company...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I never tried Sephora -----what do they make?
Click to expand...

Cosmetics for the clown in you...It's more expensive..I could be a rich man if I had no wives that used cosmetics...


----------



## irosie91

Moonglow said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?
> 
> As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The British were arbitrators by proxy, their terminology was based on their ability to make a quick decision without researching..Since the Canaan's were in the area, along with Abraham, many years before the Palestinians moved to the area...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the  "CANAAN's"     ???        I am pretty sure that even the
> CANAANITES did not call themselves  "CANAANITES"----
> ever.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yet Moses led his people to the promised land of Canaan...After 40 years of walking in circles for sins...
Click to expand...


yes----the promised land was in the giant and vast land known as  CANAAN------a big vast stretch between Egypt of the nile----and Babylon of the two rivers -------with the dinky little river ---
JORDAN


----------



## Moonglow

irosie91 said:


> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most of the jews now living in Israel were born in Israel.----
> My husband was not born in Israel----he was born in a shariah shit hole-------when he was on his way to Palestine as an infant---
> his government papers were STAMPED  "PALESTINIAN"---
> they were stamped in EGYPT!!!      The land of his birth was
> not even mentioned.    If he had been a muslim born in that same land-----his papers would have probably been stamped
> 'SYRIAN" -------or even just "arab".      I am not sure that anyone is, today, called an  "OTTOMAN"   You seem very confused.    Your allusion to RUSSIAN JEWS  ---indicates that you lick the shit of propaganda-----lately the islamo Nazi propaganda claims that Israeli jews are all  RUSSIAN
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?
> 
> As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The British were arbitrators by proxy, their terminology was based on their ability to make a quick decision without researching..Since the Canaan's were in the area, along with Abraham, many years before the Palestinians moved to the area...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the  "CANAAN's"     ???        I am pretty sure that even the
> CANAANITES did not call themselves  "CANAANITES"----
> ever.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yet Moses led his people to the promised land of Canaan...After 40 years of walking in circles for sins...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yes----the promised land was in the giant and vast land known as  CANAAN------a big vast stretch between Egypt of the nile----and Babylon of the two rivers -------with the dinky little river ---
> JORDAN
Click to expand...

But nooo, the Israelite's had to screw that up also, along with Judah....


----------



## irosie91

Moonglow said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Back on topic.
> 
> The meat of the thread:
> 
> An early case of trying to destroy Israel through economic means occurred in 1980, when L'Oreal had bought the Helena Rubinstein cosmetics company. Arab regimes had threatened to truncate the lucrative relationships with the multinational companies if they did not cut ties with Israel. Instead of rejecting the blackmail, L'Oreal bowed to the blackmail. Today, this antisemitism is not led by either Arab states or Western states. France, for example, recently outlawed calls to single out Israel for boycotts. Today's hate campaign and these Nazi policies are now largely led by universities, trade unions, businesses, and hypocritical so-called "human rights" groups, as well as other NGOs.
> 
> 
> 
> Yet Sephora is by far the better cosmetic company...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I never tried Sephora -----what do they make?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cosmetics for the clown in you...It's more expensive..I could be a rich man if I had no wives that used cosmetics...
Click to expand...


what happened to  MAYBELLINE?


----------



## irosie91

Moonglow said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinian stamp in documents.
> 
> Even today, so many so called informed people don't seem to realise that Palestinians used to be Jews. One could go around with a megaphone till blue in the face, they still wouldn't get it.
> 
> 
> 
> Jews would be more closely called Canaanites than Palestinians, in reality...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you eventually made your way here. How many orbits did it take?
> 
> As for your terminology; the British being pragmatic people, and good at administration, Palestinian, and not the whimsical Canaanite was the logical way to go during those times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The British were arbitrators by proxy, their terminology was based on their ability to make a quick decision without researching..Since the Canaan's were in the area, along with Abraham, many years before the Palestinians moved to the area...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> the  "CANAAN's"     ???        I am pretty sure that even the
> CANAANITES did not call themselves  "CANAANITES"----
> ever.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yet Moses led his people to the promised land of Canaan...After 40 years of walking in circles for sins...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yes----the promised land was in the giant and vast land known as  CANAAN------a big vast stretch between Egypt of the nile----and Babylon of the two rivers -------with the dinky little river ---
> JORDAN
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But nooo, the Israelite's had to screw that up also, along with Judah....
Click to expand...


so true


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I can't understand those nasty Israelis treating Palestinian Arabs in their hospitals for all manner of serious ailments; can you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not know the order of magnitude between the number of Palestinians treated in Israeli hospitals as against the number sent to cemeteries by the Israelis. It must be humongous.
Click to expand...







 Yes in favour of the ones treated in Israeli hospitals. Dont forget that under the terms of the Geneva conventions it is hamas to blame for all the arab muslims in the cemeteries of gaza.


----------



## irosie91

the rendering of a civilian area-----an arena of war is a war crime.    The CRIME would be attributable to  the persons who render the
civilian area an arena of war.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If they had not invaded Jewish land and resorted to violence then they would not be occupied and held static. They are now facing what the Jews faced for 1400 years at their hands, without the wanton rapes, killings and beatings.
> 
> Was it, then how come it was the Jews that first thought of it 4,500 years ago. The British media are against Zionism and the Jews seeing as it is run by neo marxists
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thr Israelis kill very many Palestinians, including children, sometimes vast massacres take place in Gaza using weapons supplied and paid for by American taxpayers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why does hamas force the many hundreds of cnildren to act as human shields. Under the criteria in the Geneva conventions it is hamas that is to blame for these deaths as they refuse to move the people out of harms way.
> 
> ONLY JEW HATERS AND ISLAMONAZI STOOGES SEE THE ISRAELI'S AS BEING THE ONES BEHIND THE DEATHS.
> 
> THE WEAPONS ARE MOSTLY ISRAELI MADE, AND IF THE ARAB MUSLIMS WANTED THE KILLINGS TO STOP THEY SHOULD ASK ISRAEL FOR TALKS
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> When the Israelis deliberately pulverize schools, hospitals, and neighborhoods, they know they are killing children. To then put out the claim that these children are being used as human shields is cynical propaganda.
Click to expand...






 And you have evidence to prove your claims, or are you just repeating the islamonazi propaganda you have been drip fed since birth. Do you want to see the pictures of the children forced into being human shields, they shut up the rest of team palestine pretty quickly.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
Click to expand...






 Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.

If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis have not withdrawn from Gaza. "The Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory (the West Bank including East Jerusalem *and the Gaza Strip*) is in its fifth decade and the undercurrent of violence and inherent abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international law inherent in any long-standing military occupation is presented by both sides." (Amnesty International)
> Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories
Click to expand...







So says the anti semitic left wing AI, that has been proven to tell lies about the Jews and Israel.


International law saws that gaza is not occupied as Israel does not have military control over any part of it. Try reading the real links that tell it as it is, and not as you want to see it


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
Click to expand...






 So you admit that 90% of the arab muslims have no claim to the land as they came from the surroundig area between 1917 and the present day. The UN admit this when they created UNWRA as the arab muslims did not reach the criteria for refugee status being in the area for less than two years.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In other words -- you support the mass murder of innocent people.
> 
> Terrorism is not defending anything, even if you do happen to share the same desire for the genocide of Jews as Hamas.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do not support the mass murder of innocent Palestinian children and civilians at the hands of Israeli state terrorism. No.
Click to expand...






 Evidence to support your claim, what authority has branded Israel as a terrorist state other than the neo nazi's and islamonazi's


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Meet the packs of new Nazis, posing as Righteousness and Virtue, pursuing new exterminationist policies against Israel and, right after that, the Jews.
> 
> "In Nazi Germany," noted Brendan O'Neill in the _Wall Street Journal_, "it was all the rage to make one's town _Judenfrei_."
> 
> "Now a new fashion is sweeping Europe: to make one's town or city what we might call 'Zionistfrei' -- free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves 'Israel-free zones,' insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago."
> 
> The Nazis said "_kauft nicht bei Juden_": do not buy from Jews. The slogan of these new racists is "_kauft nicht beim Judenstaat_": do not buy from the Jewish State. The Nazis repeated "_Geh nach Palästina, du Jud_": Go to Palestine, you Jew. Racists in Europe shout "Jews out of Palestine!"
> 
> The "Virtuous" New Nazis
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Pew polls and research have interviewed Muslims in various Muslim nations and found a common thread.  To the "majority," Sharia Law is preferable to any other law (and as Sharia Law is part of Islams political aims, it is absolutely incompatible with western society), Gays/Lesbians should be imprisoned or killed, stoning of adulterers is acceptable, and on and on it goes.  The reason we don't see most Muslims out there running amok and killing indiscriminately is because many have families to feed and are busy supporting their large families; yet they will still support the overall goal of conquering the non-Islamic world.  Any who say otherwise are using "taqqiya."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The reason you don't see them running amok as you say is that is not the way most of them are.  As education and income grow, family size goes down.  In fact, among Muslim immigrants to western countries by the second generation, family size is other groups.
> 
> Pew polls are an excellent source.  Have you read what they have to say about American Muslims?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The average muslim family size in Europe is 7, the average European family size is 5. So you really need to change your source
Click to expand...


10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West

_People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.

_
*In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​





Muslim Demographics


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Coming from someone who habitually trawls hate sites for information your (lack of) any credibility is noted.
> 
> Scapegoating innocent people is evil, yes?
> 
> I think so.  I don't think you do.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I "scapegoated" Jews or blamed them for everything?  Think carefully before you keep lying Phoenall.  Maybe you could provide a link.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your complete acceptance of what team palestine post shows that you blame them for everything that is happening. Your refusal to accept that the same international laws that created Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria also created the Jewish national home. Your denial of the Jews rights under international laws and claims of war crimes also shows you to scapegoat the Jews and blame them for everything. Your latest trick of STEALING Jewish land to give to illegal immigrants as it will make the area more peaceful is a laugh after being shown the arab muslims many charters that say the exact opposite and that the only way to ensue peace is to wipe out the Jews and give the land to the muslims.
> 
> Not just me that has seen through your veneer as far too many posters are now calling you out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I blamed Jews for everything? Your inability to provide links (yet again) is duly noted.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not just me that has seen through your hypocrisy is it, many others are also commenting on your Jew hatred
Click to expand...


So you can't find a single link to support your lies?


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Everything. Dumbass Americon.
Click to expand...



Speaking of dumbass' - it's "American".


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> In 1921, Great Britain reneged on the Balfour Declaration, lopped off 77 percent of the Land promised in the Balfour Declaration to the Jews, and set up the Arab Emirate of Trans Jordan. Which eventually became Jordan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What does this have to do with anti-semitism in Europe?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A profile of the country the anti Semites want to lobby against?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's old history.
> 
> Edited to add:  but if you consider it topical, then I will stop refraining from that part of the discussion.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 'Ol
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Netherlands sees 'worrisome' rise in anti-Semitism in schools
> German Jewish leaders say deteriorating security has led to a 'highly dangerous situation'
> Anti-Semitism threatens France’s Jewish communities
> 'Worrying' rise in anti-Semitic incidents, charity says - BBC News
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I agree. The fact that Antisemitism in Europe has enjoyed a resurgence alongside a huge rise in Muslim immigration is no coincidence. Jews are leaving many European countries because of this, whilst Muslims can't get here quickly enough. Most holocaust deniers in Europe are Muslims, and the left are their allies. The Labour Party is chock full of anti Semites.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I believe your assertion that the "left" is antisemitic is unfounded.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Then you are an ostrich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have visited Austria but I am not from there, Tilly.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i know. You are from Spain. I'm not from Aistria either, so I don't get your point, or even if you are making one.
Click to expand...


Where's Aistria?


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​



I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.

 The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
Click to expand...


You're concern would have some legitimacy if the main participants, including yourself and the OP had any serious desire to be on topic   Otherwise, it's Zone 3, there is flexibility, as long as it doesn't become derailed into an FZ fest.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
Click to expand...



The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.

Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.

There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.


----------



## koshergrl

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
Click to expand...

You toe the line that all anti semites, and other violent and oppressive ideologues, toe....."We're no.worse than anybody else...except we're JUSTIFIED". What garbage. Nobody is as bad as muslims and nazi progressive douchebags. That's why they're reviled.


----------



## Coyote

koshergrl said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You toe the line that all anti semites, and other violent and oppressive ideologues, toe....."We're no.worse than anybody else...except we're JUSTIFIED". What garbage. Nobody is as bad as muslims and nazi progressive douchebags. That's why they're reviled.
Click to expand...


No one is justified when it is directed at innocent people.

You're toeing the antisemite line.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're concern would have some legitimacy if the main participants, including yourself and the OP had any serious desire to be on topic   Otherwise, it's Zone 3, there is flexibility, as long as it doesn't become derailed into an FZ fest.
Click to expand...



 In other words, do as you say and not as you do.

  You fucking hypocrite, you. 

 I might add as well, that offering a piece by a journalist pulling figures out of his ass does not debunk anything. The world factbook disagrees with his made-up figures.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
Click to expand...



 When you signed up with the Muslim Brotherhood to represent them online, did they have you take a class in this sort of turnspeak agitprop or something?


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're concern would have some legitimacy if the main participants, including yourself and the OP had any serious desire to be on topic   Otherwise, it's Zone 3, there is flexibility, as long as it doesn't become derailed into an FZ fest.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> In other words, do as you say and not as you do.
> 
> You fucking hypocrite, you.
> 
> I might add as well, that offering a piece by a journalist pulling figures out of his ass does not debunk anything. The world factbook disagrees with his made-up figures.
Click to expand...



What, you mean like Pew disagreed with the crap you spewed from a hate site about American Muslims?  You're hardly one to be talking about the merits of sources - you're integrity there is zero.

Here's some more if you disagree:

Pew: Fertility Rate for Muslims vs. Non-Muslims in Europe

_*Birth rates levelling off*_

A 2007 study by demographers Charles Westhoff and Tomas Frejka identified the same trend among Muslim immigrant populations in most countries where data was available, including Austria, Slovenia, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland and England and Wales.

The total fertility rate among Muslim women is almost always higher than that of the native population, but “with the passage of time Muslim fertility moves closer to the fertility of the majority of the population in the respective countries”.





In this country, the study tracks changing fertility rates among women from Pakistan and Bangladesh (assumed to be overwhelmingly Muslim).

Women from Pakistan and Bangladesh tend to have more children, but the fertility gap shrinks over the decades.

The US Pew Forum think-tank predicts that this gap will continue to diminish in the coming decades in all European countries.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> When you signed up with the Muslim Brotherhood to represent them online, did they have you take a class in this sort of turnspeak agitprop or something?
Click to expand...


When hatred is directed against innocent people in order to create scapegoats, it's always wrong dude.  No matter how you try to spin it with your obfuscations and distractions.

Any decent person would recognize it for what it is and oppose it, rather than excuse it.

“We will not be silent”: American Jews hit the streets during Hanukkah to fight Islamophobia and racism
Swedish Muslim takes on anti-Semitism


----------



## gtopa1

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israeli Arabs are already second class citizens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
Click to expand...


Point of information there. They would have to be a mid-range imbecile to be able to do that. If they can't then it IS an indication of the developmental level.

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
Click to expand...


The reason for that is quite simple. True; there are historical factors from Europe proper but Israel is a Cold War ally of the West. Lefties will never forgive her for that!!

I call it sorta hate America by proxy. (One factor of many imo)

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So you think Hamas would spare them?
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis have not withdrawn from Gaza. "The Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory (the West Bank including East Jerusalem *and the Gaza Strip*) is in its fifth decade and the undercurrent of violence and inherent abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international law inherent in any long-standing military occupation is presented by both sides." (Amnesty International)
> Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories
Click to expand...


Unprecedented death and destruction?? To the Gaza strip?? Do they forget the attacks on Israel over the decades by the Soviet and Jew hating proxies? Of course it was a tragedy that Hamas embedded itself in the civilian population. Many innocents died because of their battle plan.

Greg


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
Click to expand...

International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas is the democratically elected government of Gaza.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis have not withdrawn from Gaza. "The Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory (the West Bank including East Jerusalem *and the Gaza Strip*) is in its fifth decade and the undercurrent of violence and inherent abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international law inherent in any long-standing military occupation is presented by both sides." (Amnesty International)
> Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So says the anti semitic left wing AI, that has been proven to tell lies about the Jews and Israel.
> 
> 
> International law saws that gaza is not occupied as Israel does not have military control over any part of it. Try reading the real links that tell it as it is, and not as you want to see it
Click to expand...

"Gaza is definitely still occupied, and Israel is still the belligerent occupying force, and they have no right to enforce this illegal, inhuman collective punishment. It is entirely against the Geneva Convention."
Does Israel actually occupy the Gaza Strip?


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
Click to expand...


Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship. 

Greg


----------



## Eloy

gtopa1 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...

The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.


----------



## gtopa1

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> When you signed up with the Muslim Brotherhood to represent them online, did they have you take a class in this sort of turnspeak agitprop or something?
Click to expand...



That's a bit harsh, Mutty. You must recall that Coyote has already said that anti-semitism is hatred. Now recall that MOST of the hatred spent on muslims is by other muslims. ISIS murders more Muslims than westerners or Jews. Now they may ASPIRE to rid the world of every non-muzzy but they're killing mostly what we would call their own. It's a cross between the Shiite/Sunni animosity and Stalinist play book. Seen it all before in SE Asia where the rallying call was "Nationalism"; ie, Communist expansionism and subversion where it was all about eradicating opposition. Worked a treat there. MILLIONS of dead Asians...how quickly we forget. Now let's be fair; HATRED is the killing machine's fuel. Coyote is quite correct on that point. 

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
Click to expand...


Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!

Greg


----------



## Eloy

gtopa1 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...

The Occupied Palestinian Territories are not disputed in international law or by any country in the world except Israel.


----------



## gtopa1

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> How do you explain Lucy and her supporters? They are certainly not from the left. Nor are you.
Click to expand...


No need to. You're lying!!

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Occupied Palestinian Territories are not disputed in international law or by any country in the world except Israel.
Click to expand...


In a sense you are correct. Israel is the ONLY Nation that is in the matter. Palestine is NOT a Country so cannot lay claim to anything. Good get!!

Greg


----------



## Ravi

gtopa1 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> How do you explain Lucy and her supporters? They are certainly not from the left. Nor are you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No need to. You're lying!!
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...

How so?


----------



## gtopa1

Speaking of cosmetics.

Tilley Soaps Australia







I'm sure they're quite good but I use Solvol and Sunlight . (OK: I'm partial to Pierre Cardin and Lagerfeld but only for special occasions like funerals, weddings and Anniversaries. 

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Ravi said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> How do you explain Lucy and her supporters? They are certainly not from the left. Nor are you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No need to. You're lying!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How so?
Click to expand...


You typed!!!

Greg


----------



## Drummond

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> You're nitpicking somewhat.
> 
> I only posted a selection of examples of the Left's antisemitism. I could have posted more. An example of Corbyn and his friendliness with Israel's enemies, for example ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for Livingstone, well, if he was so 'right', how come he was villified for his 'Hitler' view ? How come his employment as an LBC pundit was abruptly terminated after he expressed that comment ? How come EVEN his OWN PARTY dropped him, because he'd become too much of an embarrassment to them ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
Click to expand...


A couple of points. 

One ... Hamas is *a terrorist group*, existing to attack Israel. It regards Israel as its mortal enemy. It commits terrorist attack after terrorist attack against Israeli territory, not caring how many civilians it may kill in making those attacks.

It has, as its foundling Charter states, a commitment to seeing Israel destroyed (.. and I've yet to see evidence that this was ever revoked, because, of course, IT HASN'T BEEN).

The State of Israel is internationally recognised as legitimate,* and as such, it has every imaginable moral and legal right to defend itself from terrorist attacks. This it does.*

Two ... considering the first point ... what's the way of things, when Hamas and Israel clash militarily ? Simple. Hamas attacks first. The extent of reaction varies ... but, it is ALWAYS A REACTION. What Hamas brings upon itself, it earns through its initial and unprompted attacks upon Israel. Hamas attacks, Israel responds. 

Now, you may not like the extent of that response. But, they ARE JUST THAT. 

Were Hamas to renounce violence, were they to give up on all attempts to be killers of Israelis, sending suicide bombers on to the streets of Tel Aviv, or, if they stopped firing hundreds of rockets into Israel as a disgusting provocation .. then, Israel would not respond. There'd be nothing to respond to !

But Hamas will never give up on its terrorism, because terrorists is WHAT THEY ARE. I daresay they could no more give up their bloodlust than they could give up on breathing.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Drummond said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Almost the entire world is critical of Israel. The Israelis see enemies under their beds. The Palestinian people, including children, are called enemies of Israel for good reason, seeing how they have been treated by the brutal Israeli occupation. Indeed, very many sympathize with Israel's enemies.
> 
> The English media are particularly partial to Zionism, after all, putting an homeland for European Jews right in the middle of Palestine was a British idea in the first place.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A couple of points.
> 
> One ... Hamas is *a terrorist group*, existing to attack Israel. It regards Israel as its mortal enemy. It commits terrorist attack after terrorist attack against Israeli territory, not caring how many civilians it may kill in making those attacks.
> 
> It has, as its foundling Charter states, a commitment to seeing Israel destroyed (.. and I've yet to see evidence that this was ever revoked, because, of course, IT HASN'T BEEN).
> 
> The State of Israel is internationally recognised as legitimate,* and as such, it has every imaginable moral and legal right to defend itself from terrorist attacks. This it does.*
> 
> Two ... considering the first point ... what's the way of things, when Hamas and Israel clash militarily ? Simple. Hamas attacks first. The extent of reaction varies ... but, it is ALWAYS A REACTION. What Hamas brings upon itself, it earns through its initial and unprompted attacks upon Israel. Hamas attacks, Israel responds.
> 
> Now, you may not like the extent of that response. But, they ARE JUST THAT.
> 
> Were Hamas to renounce violence, were they to give up on all attempts to be killers of Israelis, sending suicide bombers on to the streets of Tel Aviv, or, if they stopped firing hundreds of rockets into Israel as a disgusting provocation .. then, Israel would not respond. There'd be nothing to respond to !
> 
> But Hamas will never give up on its terrorism, because terrorists is WHAT THEY ARE. I daresay they could no more give up their bloodlust than they could give up on breathing.
Click to expand...



 They promise genocide of Jews in their very charter.



.....which makes them very popular, indeed, among the Eloys of the world.


 Since the terrorism against Jews started nearly 100 years ago, well before there was an Israel, it's awfully stupid to claim that it is a response to Israeli actions. Of course, that does not stop very stupid people from repeating all the jargon they have learned from terrorists.

 Let's face it -- the killing of Jews provides much of the basis for the Palestinian economy.  They kill some Jews, Israel retaliates, the world eats up all the "poor me" type propaganda and rewards them by making them the single largest beneficiary of world aid around. 

It's little wonder there is so much Islamic terrorism in the world today. The world has been rewarding them for it.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

gtopa1 said:


> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg




 I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.


----------



## Coyote

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
Click to expand...


It's not that clear-cut.


----------



## Coyote

gtopa1 said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...


Exactly, though personally, I feel Israel's citizenship laws are unjust in certain ways - it's up to the nation to determine who is and is not a citizen.  Israel was founded on the principle that ALL Jews would find a homeland there.  It's their right as a nation.  And courts are the appropriate avenue along with civil disobedience and other forms of peaceful protest.  Not violence.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
Click to expand...


You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> Israel has no right to exist ... is THIS the message you want people to believe in ?
> 
> And I suggest you take a look at the Hamas Charter (Hamas being the ruling power in Gaza, and an internationally recognised terrorist organisation !!).* Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction*. THIS is the power that, every now and again, fires rockets into Israeli territory, with the hope of killing as many Israeli citizens as they can manage.
> 
> This includes women and children. Or .. must they, too, be at the mercy of terrorist scum ??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A couple of points.
> 
> One ... Hamas is *a terrorist group*, existing to attack Israel. It regards Israel as its mortal enemy. It commits terrorist attack after terrorist attack against Israeli territory, not caring how many civilians it may kill in making those attacks.
> 
> It has, as its foundling Charter states, a commitment to seeing Israel destroyed (.. and I've yet to see evidence that this was ever revoked, because, of course, IT HASN'T BEEN).
> 
> The State of Israel is internationally recognised as legitimate,* and as such, it has every imaginable moral and legal right to defend itself from terrorist attacks. This it does.*
> 
> Two ... considering the first point ... what's the way of things, when Hamas and Israel clash militarily ? Simple. Hamas attacks first. The extent of reaction varies ... but, it is ALWAYS A REACTION. What Hamas brings upon itself, it earns through its initial and unprompted attacks upon Israel. Hamas attacks, Israel responds.
> 
> Now, you may not like the extent of that response. But, they ARE JUST THAT.
> 
> Were Hamas to renounce violence, were they to give up on all attempts to be killers of Israelis, sending suicide bombers on to the streets of Tel Aviv, or, if they stopped firing hundreds of rockets into Israel as a disgusting provocation .. then, Israel would not respond. There'd be nothing to respond to !
> 
> But Hamas will never give up on its terrorism, because terrorists is WHAT THEY ARE. I daresay they could no more give up their bloodlust than they could give up on breathing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> They promise genocide of Jews in their very charter.
> 
> 
> 
> .....which makes them very popular, indeed, among the Eloys of the world.
> 
> 
> Since the terrorism against Jews started nearly 100 years ago, well before there was an Israel, it's awfully stupid to claim that it is a response to Israeli actions. Of course, that does not stop very stupid people from repeating all the jargon they have learned from terrorists.
> 
> Let's face it -- the killing of Jews provides much of the basis for the Palestinian economy.  They kill some Jews, Israel retaliates, the world eats up all the "poor me" type propaganda and rewards them by making them the single largest beneficiary of world aid around.
> 
> It's little wonder there is so much Islamic terrorism in the world today. The world has been rewarding them for it.
Click to expand...


Where has Eloy supported genocide?  Or is this something you're making up as usual?


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
Click to expand...



Feel free to fuck off, you soulless harpie.


----------



## Tilly

gtopa1 said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> How do you explain Lucy and her supporters? They are certainly not from the left. Nor are you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No need to. You're lying!!
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...

What happened to Ravis post?


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
Click to expand...

How very vulgar of you, coyote, and jealousy is also a very ugly trait, so it suits you well.  I think Dogmaphobe is an excellent poster, and he runs rings around you daily, which is always a pleasure to witness  Oh, and he's also rather handsome and distinguished, not to mention being well educated and possessing excellent taste  
No wonder you stalk him all over the board and lie about him incessantly.
Tissue? 
Oh, and left wing anti Zionism is the new Antisemitism


----------



## gtopa1

Tilly said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> In Europe, most anti Semites come from the Left, including all those that pretend they are simply anti zionists.
> 
> 
> 
> How do you explain Lucy and her supporters? They are certainly not from the left. Nor are you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No need to. You're lying!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What happened to Ravis post?
Click to expand...


I don't know. It was there a while ago. 

Greg


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Feel free to fuck off, you soulless harpie.
Click to expand...


If not a room, at least draw the curtains.

Thank you.


----------



## Tilly

From the excellent Jonathan Sacks:
Incidentally, Jews are leaving Europe for Israel in numbers not seen since WW2.

*ANTI-ZIONISM IS THE NEW ANTI-SEMITISM, SAYS BRITAIN'S EX-CHIEF RABBI*
*Anti-Semitism is a virus that survives by mutating; today Jews are hated because of their nation state.*
BY JONATHAN SACKS ON 4/3/16 AT 2:02 PM 




Desecrated tombstones of the Sarre-Union Jewish cemetery in France February 17, 2015. "Across Europe, Jews are leaving."REUTERS/VINCENT KESSLER
On March 27, speaking to the _Sunday Times_, former Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams expressed his concern at rising levels of anti-Semitism on British university campuses. There are, he said, “worrying echoes” of Germany in the 1930s. Two days later, in _The Times_, Chris Bryant, the Shadow Leader of the House of Commons and a senior member of the British Labour party, warned that the political left was increasingly questioning the right of the state of Israel to exist, a view he called a “not too subtle form of anti-Semitism.”

Across Europe, Jews are leaving. A survey in 2013 by the European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights showed that almost a third of Europe’s Jews have considered emigrating because of anti-Semitism, with numbers as high as 46 percent in France and 48 percent in Hungary...

Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi


----------



## Tilly

From the Sacks article above:

...
Nor is this a problem in Europe alone. A 2015 survey of North American Jewish college students by Brandeis University found that *three-quarters of respondents had been exposed to anti-Semitic rhetoric*. One third had reported incidents of harassment because they were Jewish. Much of the intimidation on campus is stirred by “Israel Apartheid” weeks and the BDS (Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions) campaign against Israel. These have become what Easter was in the Middle Ages, a time for attacks against Jews.

Something is clearly happening, but what? Many on the left argue that they are being wrongly accused. They are not against Jews, they say, only opposed to the policies of the state of Israel. Here one must state the obvious. Criticism of the Israeli government is not anti-Semitic. Nor is the BDS movement inherently anti-Semitic. Many of its supporters have a genuine concern for human rights. *It is, though, a front for the new anti-Semitism, an unholy alliance of radical Islamism and the political left....*


----------



## Tilly

...
What then is anti-Semitism? It is not a coherent set of beliefs but a set of contradictions. Before the Holocaust, Jews were hated because they were poor and because they were rich; because they were communists and because they were capitalists; because they kept to themselves and because they infiltrated everywhere; because they clung tenaciously to ancient religious beliefs and because they were rootless cosmopolitans who believed nothing.

*Anti-semitism is a virus that survives by mutating.* In the Middle Ages, Jews were hated because of their religion. In the 19th and 20th centuries they were hated because of their race. *Today they are hated because of their nation state, Israel. Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism....

Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi*


----------



## gtopa1

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Feel free to fuck off, you soulless harpie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If not a room, at least draw the curtains.
> 
> Thank you.
Click to expand...


There's a "Life of Brian" clip there somewhere but it's a bit rude.

Greg


----------



## Tilly

The blood libel is alive and well:

...The legitimization has also changed. Throughout history, when people have sought to justify anti-Semitism, they have done so by recourse to the highest source of authority available within the culture. In the Middle Ages, it was religion. In post-Enlightenment Europe it was science. Today it is human rights. *It is why Israel—the only fully functioning democracy in the Middle East with a free press and independent judiciary—is regularly accused of the five crimes against human rights: racism, apartheid, crimes against humanity, ethnic cleansing and attempted genocide. This is the blood libel of our time. .....

Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi*


----------



## gtopa1

Tilly said:


> From the Sacks article above:
> 
> ...
> Nor is this a problem in Europe alone. A 2015 survey of North American Jewish college students by Brandeis University found that *three-quarters of respondents had been exposed to anti-Semitic rhetoric*. One third had reported incidents of harassment because they were Jewish. Much of the intimidation on campus is stirred by “Israel Apartheid” weeks and the BDS (Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions) campaign against Israel. These have become what Easter was in the Middle Ages, a time for attacks against Jews.
> 
> Something is clearly happening, but what? Many on the left argue that they are being wrongly accused. They are not against Jews, they say, only opposed to the policies of the state of Israel. Here one must state the obvious. Criticism of the Israeli government is not anti-Semitic. Nor is the BDS movement inherently anti-Semitic. Many of its supporters have a genuine concern for human rights. *It is, though, a front for the new anti-Semitism, an unholy alliance of radical Islamism and the political left....*



They're using the same handbook.

The Political Strategy and Tactics of the Russian Communists

Greg


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How very vulgar of you, coyote, and jealousy is also a very ugly trait, so it suits you well.  I think Dogmaphobe is an excellent poster, and he runs rings around you daily, which is always a pleasure to witness  Oh, and he's also rather handsome and distinguished, not to mention being well educated and possessing excellent taste
> No wonder you stalk him all over the board and lie about him incessantly.
> Tissue?
> Oh, and left wing anti Zionism is the new Antisemitism
Click to expand...


Of course you think he's an excellant poster you silly sycophant   You two are constantly thanking and applauding each other.  Please at least be a bit more discrete.

Lying?  You do an admirable job yourself.


----------



## Coyote

gtopa1 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Feel free to fuck off, you soulless harpie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If not a room, at least draw the curtains.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> There's a "Life of Brian" clip there somewhere but it's a bit rude.
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...




Life of Brian rocks....almost as much as the Holy Grail


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How very vulgar of you, coyote, and jealousy is also a very ugly trait, so it suits you well.  I think Dogmaphobe is an excellent poster, and he runs rings around you daily, which is always a pleasure to witness  Oh, and he's also rather handsome and distinguished, not to mention being well educated and possessing excellent taste
> No wonder you stalk him all over the board and lie about him incessantly.
> Tissue?
> Oh, and left wing anti Zionism is the new Antisemitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course you think he's an excellant poster you silly sycophant   You two are constantly thanking and applauding each other.  Please at least be a bit more discrete.
> 
> Lying?  You do an admirable job yourself.
Click to expand...

Ha ha ha. Thank you so much for letting everyone know how much it annoys you to see us agreeing and supporting each other  lol.


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How very vulgar of you, coyote, and jealousy is also a very ugly trait, so it suits you well.  I think Dogmaphobe is an excellent poster, and he runs rings around you daily, which is always a pleasure to witness  Oh, and he's also rather handsome and distinguished, not to mention being well educated and possessing excellent taste
> No wonder you stalk him all over the board and lie about him incessantly.
> Tissue?
> Oh, and left wing anti Zionism is the new Antisemitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course you think he's an excellant poster you silly sycophant   You two are constantly thanking and applauding each other.  Please at least be a bit more discrete.
> 
> Lying?  You do an admirable job yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ha ha ha. Thank you so much for letting everyone know how much it annoys you to see us agreeing and supporting each other  lol.
Click to expand...


----------



## Coyote

gtopa1....beware the rabbit!


----------



## gtopa1

Coyote said:


> gtopa1....beware the rabbit!




Greg


----------



## Mindful

gtopa1 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1....beware the rabbit!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...


I don't think the Americans 'get' Dick Emery.

Show it to the gang. lol


----------



## gtopa1

Mindful said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1....beware the rabbit!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think the Ameicans 'get' Dick Emery.
> 
> Show it to the gang. lol
Click to expand...


OK Chief; I'll get onto it right away!!!!

Greg


----------



## Mindful

I never really went for Monty Python.

Patronising university student humour.

Thank goodness Michael Palin has moved on to worthy travel documentaries.


----------



## Mindful

Anyway......

*London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
*by Raheem Kassam  •  Sep 16, 2016
Cross-posted from Breitbart*

*London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*








*Sadiq Khan narrowly won London's mayoral election in May.*



London's Muslim mayor Sadiq Khan has continued his pro-Hillary Clinton tour of the United States by declaring that immigrants into the West should not be forced to assimilate.

His comments come hot on the heels of the Chicago press exposing his connections to radical Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan.

Mr. Khan, who was elected to be London's mayor in May 2016, has also used his trip to claim that Republican candidate Donald Trump is "playing into the hands" of the Islamic State.

His trip runs contrary to the U.S. visit from former UK Independence Party leader Nigel Farage, who presented an upbeat message of defeating the political establishment on stage with Donald Trump.

Instead, Mr. Khan insisted: "One of the lessons from around the world is that a laissez-faire or hands-off approach to social integration doesn't work. We need rules, institutions, and support to enable people to integrate into cohesive communities and for the avoidance of doubt, I don't mean assimilation, I mean integration, and there's a difference."

He added: "People shouldn't have to drop their cultures and traditions when they arrive in our cities and countries


----------



## Mindful

I never dropped my tradition of scones and cucumber sandwiches.


----------



## irosie91

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
Click to expand...


what are you calling   "Palestine"?


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LuckyDuck said:
> 
> 
> 
> Those idiots don't realize that Jews were never a threat to them and that the one true threat to them, as well as most of the world......is Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right, so it's ok to scapegoat innocent Muslims for the actions of a few.  Never changes.  Just choose new targets.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Pew polls and research have interviewed Muslims in various Muslim nations and found a common thread.  To the "majority," Sharia Law is preferable to any other law (and as Sharia Law is part of Islams political aims, it is absolutely incompatible with western society), Gays/Lesbians should be imprisoned or killed, stoning of adulterers is acceptable, and on and on it goes.  The reason we don't see most Muslims out there running amok and killing indiscriminately is because many have families to feed and are busy supporting their large families; yet they will still support the overall goal of conquering the non-Islamic world.  Any who say otherwise are using "taqqiya."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The reason you don't see them running amok as you say is that is not the way most of them are.  As education and income grow, family size goes down.  In fact, among Muslim immigrants to western countries by the second generation, family size is other groups.
> 
> Pew polls are an excellent source.  Have you read what they have to say about American Muslims?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The average muslim family size in Europe is 7, the average European family size is 5. So you really need to change your source
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Muslim Demographics
Click to expand...







 A little bit old isnt it, the date stamp shows it to be from 2009. The fact is the muslims have on average 5 children per household.

Only an islamonazi propagandist would post such an article to try and hide the truth


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you see no problem in scapegoating the Jews and try to blame them for everything. They did not start the problems in the world, that was down to the religions that came after
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where have I "scapegoated" Jews or blamed them for everything?  Think carefully before you keep lying Phoenall.  Maybe you could provide a link.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your complete acceptance of what team palestine post shows that you blame them for everything that is happening. Your refusal to accept that the same international laws that created Jordan, Iraq, Iran and Syria also created the Jewish national home. Your denial of the Jews rights under international laws and claims of war crimes also shows you to scapegoat the Jews and blame them for everything. Your latest trick of STEALING Jewish land to give to illegal immigrants as it will make the area more peaceful is a laugh after being shown the arab muslims many charters that say the exact opposite and that the only way to ensue peace is to wipe out the Jews and give the land to the muslims.
> 
> Not just me that has seen through your veneer as far too many posters are now calling you out.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where have I blamed Jews for everything? Your inability to provide links (yet again) is duly noted.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not just me that has seen through your hypocrisy is it, many others are also commenting on your Jew hatred
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So you can't find a single link to support your lies?
Click to expand...






 Then try looking again as many people are now calling you out


----------



## Phoenall

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
Click to expand...







 What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> I never dropped my tradition of scones and cucumber sandwiches.







Is that scones with cream and jam, and do you put poached salmon in with the cucumber. I like cucumber sliced and then soaked in vinegar it lifts the flavour


----------



## Tilly

Phoenall said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
Click to expand...

Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> koshergrl said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You toe the line that all anti semites, and other violent and oppressive ideologues, toe....."We're no.worse than anybody else...except we're JUSTIFIED". What garbage. Nobody is as bad as muslims and nazi progressive douchebags. That's why they're reviled.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No one is justified when it is directed at innocent people.
> 
> You're toeing the antisemite line.
Click to expand...







 Just as you are toeing the islamonazi propagandist line


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're concern would have some legitimacy if the main participants, including yourself and the OP had any serious desire to be on topic   Otherwise, it's Zone 3, there is flexibility, as long as it doesn't become derailed into an FZ fest.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> In other words, do as you say and not as you do.
> 
> You fucking hypocrite, you.
> 
> I might add as well, that offering a piece by a journalist pulling figures out of his ass does not debunk anything. The world factbook disagrees with his made-up figures.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> What, you mean like Pew disagreed with the crap you spewed from a hate site about American Muslims?  You're hardly one to be talking about the merits of sources - you're integrity there is zero.
> 
> Here's some more if you disagree:
> 
> Pew: Fertility Rate for Muslims vs. Non-Muslims in Europe
> 
> _*Birth rates levelling off*_
> 
> A 2007 study by demographers Charles Westhoff and Tomas Frejka identified the same trend among Muslim immigrant populations in most countries where data was available, including Austria, Slovenia, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland and England and Wales.
> 
> The total fertility rate among Muslim women is almost always higher than that of the native population, but “with the passage of time Muslim fertility moves closer to the fertility of the majority of the population in the respective countries”.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In this country, the study tracks changing fertility rates among women from Pakistan and Bangladesh (assumed to be overwhelmingly Muslim).
> 
> Women from Pakistan and Bangladesh tend to have more children, but the fertility gap shrinks over the decades.
> 
> The US Pew Forum think-tank predicts that this gap will continue to diminish in the coming decades in all European countries.
Click to expand...







 Even older when neo marxists had almost total power and could get published anything they wanted as true


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> There's a strain of pernicious anti semitism running through European 'intellectual' thought, not particularly influenced by Islam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....and as we can see from Eloy, here, that includes those who are not the least bit intellectual as well.
> 
> The different strains of antisemitism matter less to me than the hatred, though.   The particulars of the various themes utilized to single out Jews may differ between the orthodox Neo Marxists, the Islamists and the soccer hooligan type Nazis, but they all merge together.  They all agree that Jews are a singularly pernicious people, sneaky and conniving in behavior, not to be trusted, unduly influential, manipulative and powerful. That these themes now coalesce around the collective Jew as represented by a tiny nation state doesn't really change the nature of the age-old hatred one bit.
> 
> I do agree about the pernicious nature of European antisemitism, however, and what makes it especially pernicious is that these idiots actually do see their singling out of Jews as a virtue.  Take Coyote, here, who sees herself as a great champion fighting for social justice -- so much so that she has turned it into a full-time preoccupation.  Her entire personality is immersed in this great.......well, I would call it a crusade were it not for the fact it is more of an anti-Crusade,  and hers is a case of the true believer every bit as rigid and absolute as the most ardent bible-thumping fundamentalist.  Multiply one Coyote by tens upon tens of millions, and the true extent of this hatred is revealed.
> 
> Antisemitism has passed like a virus from one leftist to the next over the last 50 years or so, and is now so pervasive that a person is automatically assailed if they AREN'T antisemitic. It has become the badge worn proudly by leftists and is now a litmus test used to determine who gets to be included in the club and who doesn't.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> The thing with antisemitism is that when boiled down, it's nothing more than hate - hate, which when it riles up a people enough, can kill.  It's a hatred perpetrated against a group solely because of *who they are perceived to be - not who they are*.  That hatred is fed by *easily believed canards and conspiracy theories, complexities boiled down into black and white simplicities* and, no matter how often they are debunked they continue to resurface in times of social, political or economic stress.  Right now - in a time when nations are unraveling, national identities are in crisis, and economies are shakey - it's growing: fed and watered by a rhetoric designed to appease the nervous masses and promote a false sense of security.
> 
> Whether that rhetoric is directed at Jews, a minority historically persecuted by the great religious majorities, or at Muslims, collectively blamed for the actions of the religion's extremists - it is the same.  It's designed to promote hatred, fear and intolerance.  To divide a nation along ethnic, racial and religious lines - lines that make it clear one group, no matter what it does, can not belong as long as it shows any visible of it's identity.
> 
> There is no difference between what you spew and what you criticize antisemites for.  It's all hate (albeit wrapped in a patriotic package), directed at people, because of their identity.  That is your proud badge beneath your self-righteous words.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> When you signed up with the Muslim Brotherhood to represent them online, did they have you take a class in this sort of turnspeak agitprop or something?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When hatred is directed against innocent people in order to create scapegoats, it's always wrong dude.  No matter how you try to spin it with your obfuscations and distractions.
> 
> Any decent person would recognize it for what it is and oppose it, rather than excuse it.
> 
> “We will not be silent”: American Jews hit the streets during Hanukkah to fight Islamophobia and racism
> Swedish Muslim takes on anti-Semitism
Click to expand...








 So when will you start opposing the lying POS that posts the worst lies ever on the board, and I am talking about liq who is a revolting nazi


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> I never dropped my tradition of scones and cucumber sandwiches.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that scones with cream and jam, and do you put poached salmon in with the cucumber. I like cucumber sliced and then soaked in vinegar it lifts the flavour
Click to expand...


Can't always be bothered with the cream. 

Cucumber sandwiches pure. There's an art to buttering the bread, and slicing off the crusts.

Salmon sandwiches. Someone showed me a special way to do those too. Involving white pepper.

I love the cucumber soaked in vinegar. With shallots.

And I soak my fish & chips with malt vinegar.


----------



## Mindful

Cue Penelope to ask if my cucumber is Kosher.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why do they trot it out every month or so as a reason/excuse for attacking the Jews. The leaders of hamas call for the destruction of Israel every day, and they even put it in a letter to the UN that the UN should have replied to with threats of multinational violence
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
Click to expand...






 WHICH ONE  LINK TO IT AND SHOW WERE IT SAYS THAT, AND THIS NEGATES UN RESOLUTIONS AS THEY ARE NOT LEGALLY BINDING


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG they were part of the democratically elected governeent until they decided to take over as dictators. They have refused to allow the people the right to vote and try to blame it on the Jews
> 
> 
> 
> The Hamas party won the democratic election ten years ago, since when Gaza has been under siege by the Israelis..
> You are rewriting history.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WRONG in August 2005 Israel withdrew from gaza and have not had any control over it since. The blockade is legal and it is hamas that is putting gaza under siege by closing the border crossing on the gaza side. Any idiot that can use a search engine can find out the truth at any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis have not withdrawn from Gaza. "The Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory (the West Bank including East Jerusalem *and the Gaza Strip*) is in its fifth decade and the undercurrent of violence and inherent abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international law inherent in any long-standing military occupation is presented by both sides." (Amnesty International)
> Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So says the anti semitic left wing AI, that has been proven to tell lies about the Jews and Israel.
> 
> 
> International law saws that gaza is not occupied as Israel does not have military control over any part of it. Try reading the real links that tell it as it is, and not as you want to see it
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> "Gaza is definitely still occupied, and Israel is still the belligerent occupying force, and they have no right to enforce this illegal, inhuman collective punishment. It is entirely against the Geneva Convention."
> Does Israel actually occupy the Gaza Strip?
Click to expand...






 I give you INTERNATIONAL LAW

ICRC service



*1. What is occupation? *
Article 42 of the 1907 Hague Regulations (HR) states that a* " territory is considered occupied when it is actually placed under the authority of the hostile army. The occupation extends only to the territory where such authority has been established and can be exercised. "*

According to their common Article 2, the four Geneva Conventions of 1949 apply to any territory occupied during international hostilities. They also apply in situations where the occupation of state territory meets with no armed resistance.

The legality of any particular occupation is regulated by the UN Charter and the law known as jus ad bellum. Once a situation exists which factually amounts to an occupation the law of occupation applies – whether or not the occupation is considered lawful.

Therefore, for the applicability of the law of occupation, it makes no difference whether an occupation has received Security Council approval, what its aim is, or indeed whether it is called an “invasion”, “liberation”, “administration” or “occupation”. As the law of occupation is primarily motivated by humanitarian considerations, it is solely the facts on the ground that determine its application.




 Therefore gaza is not occupied by Israel


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
Click to expand...







 Another moron that trots out invisible international laws. Does this mean that all the Americans are illegals, as are all Europeans unless they can show their abcestry back before the Roman conquest ?

 Nice of you to admit that the arab muslims are occupying Israeli land, and I would so like to read this International law you are so boldly posting ?


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Occupied Palestinian Territories are not disputed in international law or by any country in the world except Israel.
Click to expand...







 CORRECT as under International law the land was granted to the Jews, the same set of international laws also granted land to create Jordan, Syria, Iraq, Iran Egypt and Saudi


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> I never dropped my tradition of scones and cucumber sandwiches.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that scones with cream and jam, and do you put poached salmon in with the cucumber. I like cucumber sliced and then soaked in vinegar it lifts the flavour
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Can't always be bothered with the cream.
> 
> Cucumber sandwiches pure. There's an art to buttering the bread, and slicing off the crusts.
> 
> Salmon sandwiches. Someone showed me a special way to do those too. Involving white pepper.
> 
> I love the cucumber soaked in vinegar. With shallots.
> 
> And I soak my fish & chips with malt vinegar.
Click to expand...





Flake the Salmon removing the bones and skin, dust with white pepper and a dash of white vinegar. Leave in a fridge to marinate before serving. I prefer a bed of lettuce first, then a thin layer of salmon covered in this slices of cucumber, wholemeal bread of course cut into triangles and no crusts.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Cue Penelope to ask if my cucumber is Kosher.







 Mine is home grown, a variety called marketmore.   Short thick fruits with a tough skin and a taste that has to be experienced


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
Click to expand...







 There is no such international law in existence, and if you were truly unbiased that is what you would have replied.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Only one problem the land was never arab muslims from 1099 when they were evicted. The Ottomans never handed sovereignty to the arab muslims and the LoN gave them 78% of palestine to play with. This left the Jews with the poorest of land and desert to make into their National Home, and because they did in the face of constant attacks from islamonazi's proves they are there to stay.
> 
> By the way if you were to act as the islamonazi scum then you would be wiped out by your own government with the blessings of the world. How do you like them apples ?
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly, though personally, I feel Israel's citizenship laws are unjust in certain ways - it's up to the nation to determine who is and is not a citizen.  Israel was founded on the principle that ALL Jews would find a homeland there.  It's their right as a nation.  And courts are the appropriate avenue along with civil disobedience and other forms of peaceful protest.  Not violence.
Click to expand...








 Are they any more unjust than Americas immigration laws then ?

How about the islamic nations immigration laws that ban everyone but muslims from becoming citizens.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
Click to expand...






 Jealous much, cos you can only attract some 14 year old Oz schoolboy


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drummond said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link please!!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hamas has moved on from its charter and no longer call for the destruction of Israel, I understand.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not as of 2014.
> 
> 
> You have something more recent??
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I do know one thing; were a country's military occupying my land for half a century, massacring thousands in defiance of all international, sniping at children, destroying our infrastructure, hospitals, water treatment plants, schools, factories, bulldozing our homes with JCBs, arresting our children and keeping them for interrogation without legal counsel or family present, preventing pregnant women from attending maternity clinics, humiliating my people at checkpoints in our own homeland, ... well, I would want that enemy destroyed, wouldn't you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A couple of points.
> 
> One ... Hamas is *a terrorist group*, existing to attack Israel. It regards Israel as its mortal enemy. It commits terrorist attack after terrorist attack against Israeli territory, not caring how many civilians it may kill in making those attacks.
> 
> It has, as its foundling Charter states, a commitment to seeing Israel destroyed (.. and I've yet to see evidence that this was ever revoked, because, of course, IT HASN'T BEEN).
> 
> The State of Israel is internationally recognised as legitimate,* and as such, it has every imaginable moral and legal right to defend itself from terrorist attacks. This it does.*
> 
> Two ... considering the first point ... what's the way of things, when Hamas and Israel clash militarily ? Simple. Hamas attacks first. The extent of reaction varies ... but, it is ALWAYS A REACTION. What Hamas brings upon itself, it earns through its initial and unprompted attacks upon Israel. Hamas attacks, Israel responds.
> 
> Now, you may not like the extent of that response. But, they ARE JUST THAT.
> 
> Were Hamas to renounce violence, were they to give up on all attempts to be killers of Israelis, sending suicide bombers on to the streets of Tel Aviv, or, if they stopped firing hundreds of rockets into Israel as a disgusting provocation .. then, Israel would not respond. There'd be nothing to respond to !
> 
> But Hamas will never give up on its terrorism, because terrorists is WHAT THEY ARE. I daresay they could no more give up their bloodlust than they could give up on breathing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> They promise genocide of Jews in their very charter.
> 
> 
> 
> .....which makes them very popular, indeed, among the Eloys of the world.
> 
> 
> Since the terrorism against Jews started nearly 100 years ago, well before there was an Israel, it's awfully stupid to claim that it is a response to Israeli actions. Of course, that does not stop very stupid people from repeating all the jargon they have learned from terrorists.
> 
> Let's face it -- the killing of Jews provides much of the basis for the Palestinian economy.  They kill some Jews, Israel retaliates, the world eats up all the "poor me" type propaganda and rewards them by making them the single largest beneficiary of world aid around.
> 
> It's little wonder there is so much Islamic terrorism in the world today. The world has been rewarding them for it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Where has Eloy supported genocide?  Or is this something you're making up as usual?
Click to expand...





 Read his posts, and not by flicking from this part to another leaving out the parts were he is anti semitic.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Feel free to fuck off, you soulless harpie.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> If not a room, at least draw the curtains.
> 
> Thank you.
Click to expand...







 Stop being a pervert and peeping at them


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cue Penelope to ask if my cucumber is Kosher.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine is home grown, a variety called marketmore.   Short thick fruits with a tough skin and a taste that has to be experienced
Click to expand...


I used to grow my own. Nothing like them.


----------



## Phoenall

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tilley Soaps Australia
> 
> 
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to go on record here by way of saying that Tilly can soap me any time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You and Tilly need a room, you're up each other's butts in public enough as it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How very vulgar of you, coyote, and jealousy is also a very ugly trait, so it suits you well.  I think Dogmaphobe is an excellent poster, and he runs rings around you daily, which is always a pleasure to witness  Oh, and he's also rather handsome and distinguished, not to mention being well educated and possessing excellent taste
> No wonder you stalk him all over the board and lie about him incessantly.
> Tissue?
> Oh, and left wing anti Zionism is the new Antisemitism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Of course you think he's an excellant poster you silly sycophant   You two are constantly thanking and applauding each other.  Please at least be a bit more discrete.
> 
> Lying?  You do an admirable job yourself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ha ha ha. Thank you so much for letting everyone know how much it annoys you to see us agreeing and supporting each other  lol.
Click to expand...








 Maybe we should do it more often and see what happens, see if it results in a biased set of rules being put into play ?


----------



## Mindful

Which reminds me:


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> Anyway......
> 
> *London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
> *by Raheem Kassam  •  Sep 16, 2016
> Cross-posted from Breitbart*
> 
> *London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Sadiq Khan narrowly won London's mayoral election in May.*
> 
> 
> 
> London's Muslim mayor Sadiq Khan has continued his pro-Hillary Clinton tour of the United States by declaring that immigrants into the West should not be forced to assimilate.
> 
> His comments come hot on the heels of the Chicago press exposing his connections to radical Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan.
> 
> Mr. Khan, who was elected to be London's mayor in May 2016, has also used his trip to claim that Republican candidate Donald Trump is "playing into the hands" of the Islamic State.
> 
> His trip runs contrary to the U.S. visit from former UK Independence Party leader Nigel Farage, who presented an upbeat message of defeating the political establishment on stage with Donald Trump.
> 
> Instead, Mr. Khan insisted: "One of the lessons from around the world is that a laissez-faire or hands-off approach to social integration doesn't work. We need rules, institutions, and support to enable people to integrate into cohesive communities and for the avoidance of doubt, I don't mean assimilation, I mean integration, and there's a difference."
> 
> He added: "People shouldn't have to drop their cultures and traditions when they arrive in our cities and countries



I agree with  Mr. Khan----people should not have to drop their own cultures and traditions----wherever they end up living.   He not only delivered that message to his fellow Britishers.  He seems to have found  it appropriate to appoint himself the advisor to me and my  fellow americans.    I support a world-wide tour for Mr. Khan-----he can deliver his good tidings 
thruout the world------especially to those lands that impose the
filth of shariah, including the land of his ancestry----Pakistan


----------



## irosie91

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gtopa1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are mistaken. It is the people who are born in a land who own it as a birthright. Palestinians who were born in Palestine have a more legitimate right to the land than Ottomans or Russian Jews for that matter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Once a person is a CITIZEN of a nation they are 100% legitimate shareholders in that Nation. Doesn't matter if its Jews or East Timorese. They are CITIZENS. It has ZERO to do with blood; everything to do with Citizenship.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Israelis give citizenship to Jews from Queens, New York, and permits them to be settlers on Palestinian occupied land. This is a violation of international law and basic justice.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Rubbish. They are a sovereign nation and can give Citizenship to whoever they like. My father was made a Citizen of THIS country with the appropriate residency etc. The lands on which they settle are indeed disputed but it is LEGAL wrt Israeli Law. If you don't agree then that's what the courts are for; not a suicide vest!!
> 
> Greg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Exactly, though personally, I feel Israel's citizenship laws are unjust in certain ways - it's up to the nation to determine who is and is not a citizen.  Israel was founded on the principle that ALL Jews would find a homeland there.  It's their right as a nation.  And courts are the appropriate avenue along with civil disobedience and other forms of peaceful protest.  Not violence.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are they any more unjust than Americas immigration laws then ?
> 
> How about the islamic nations immigration laws that ban everyone but muslims from becoming citizens.
Click to expand...


your question fascinates me  Phoen.      I wonder if you will
get answers from the usual suspects.    I am delighted that Eloy made an attempt to answer your question----he claims
that people BORN in a land ----own that land.    The shariah shit-hole in which my hubby was born is not only rich in oil----
the SPECIFIC city in which he was born is VERY rich in oil----
I hope he gets to claim his oil well soon.


----------



## Mindful




----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


>



Perhaps he would like to meet  Sadiq Khan to discuss that
issue of NOT ABANDONING ones culture and traditions
on emigration


----------



## Mindful

‘70% of European Jews won’t go to shul on High Holy Days despite heightened security’

Poll by EJA and RCE finds decrease in synagogue attendance and increase in security measures for Jewish communities.





A poll released on Tuesday claiming that 70% of European Jews won’t go to synagogue on Rosh Hashana or Yom Kippur due to security concerns, has been met with skepticism by prominent Jewish leaders.

The online survey, conducted last week by the European Jewish Association and the Rabbinical Center of Europe had 78 respondents, who the EJA says are a representative sample of 700 capital cities and peripheries throughout Europe – spanning from Britain to Ukraine.

The pollsters explained that while the number of respondents is far lower than the number of communities represented, each respondent speaks for multiple communities, as within certain cities and areas, many communities have similar characteristics.

The JPost


----------



## Mindful

Another piece of filth.

Anti-Zionist-Not-Antisemite Of The Day: Kristine L Doyle (Melbourne, Australia)


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Another piece of filth.
> 
> Anti-Zionist-Not-Antisemite Of The Day: Kristine L Doyle (Melbourne, Australia)









 Have you noticed they are all reading from a script and use the same words to describe Israel. Her opening words are "brutal occupation" used on here by the  members of team palestine. Then the old nugget claiming the Jews call themselves "gods chosen" when it is white supremacists and nazi's that make the claim.Even the black real Jews conspiracy theory is used, and shows that the anti semites want islamonazi's to take over.


 Australia should arrest her for inciting violence, terrorism, religious persecution and racism and see how she likes it when she is found guilty.


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway......
> 
> *London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
> *by Raheem Kassam  •  Sep 16, 2016
> Cross-posted from Breitbart*
> 
> *London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Sadiq Khan narrowly won London's mayoral election in May.*
> 
> 
> 
> London's Muslim mayor Sadiq Khan has continued his pro-Hillary Clinton tour of the United States by declaring that immigrants into the West should not be forced to assimilate.
> 
> His comments come hot on the heels of the Chicago press exposing his connections to radical Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan.
> 
> Mr. Khan, who was elected to be London's mayor in May 2016, has also used his trip to claim that Republican candidate Donald Trump is "playing into the hands" of the Islamic State.
> 
> His trip runs contrary to the U.S. visit from former UK Independence Party leader Nigel Farage, who presented an upbeat message of defeating the political establishment on stage with Donald Trump.
> 
> Instead, Mr. Khan insisted: "One of the lessons from around the world is that a laissez-faire or hands-off approach to social integration doesn't work. We need rules, institutions, and support to enable people to integrate into cohesive communities and for the avoidance of doubt, I don't mean assimilation, I mean integration, and there's a difference."
> 
> He added: "People shouldn't have to drop their cultures and traditions when they arrive in our cities and countries
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with  Mr. Khan----people should not have to drop their own cultures and traditions----wherever they end up living.   He not only delivered that message to his fellow Britishers.  He seems to have found  it appropriate to appoint himself the advisor to me and my  fellow americans.    I support a world-wide tour for Mr. Khan-----he can deliver his good tidings
> thruout the world------especially to those lands that impose the
> filth of shariah, including the land of his ancestry----Pakistan
Click to expand...


Do you think Mayor Khan might appear on Jimmy Kimmel?


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway......
> 
> *London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
> *by Raheem Kassam  •  Sep 16, 2016
> Cross-posted from Breitbart*
> 
> *London Mayor Sadiq Khan to U.S. Immigrants: Don't Assimilate*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Sadiq Khan narrowly won London's mayoral election in May.*
> 
> 
> 
> London's Muslim mayor Sadiq Khan has continued his pro-Hillary Clinton tour of the United States by declaring that immigrants into the West should not be forced to assimilate.
> 
> His comments come hot on the heels of the Chicago press exposing his connections to radical Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan.
> 
> Mr. Khan, who was elected to be London's mayor in May 2016, has also used his trip to claim that Republican candidate Donald Trump is "playing into the hands" of the Islamic State.
> 
> His trip runs contrary to the U.S. visit from former UK Independence Party leader Nigel Farage, who presented an upbeat message of defeating the political establishment on stage with Donald Trump.
> 
> Instead, Mr. Khan insisted: "One of the lessons from around the world is that a laissez-faire or hands-off approach to social integration doesn't work. We need rules, institutions, and support to enable people to integrate into cohesive communities and for the avoidance of doubt, I don't mean assimilation, I mean integration, and there's a difference."
> 
> He added: "People shouldn't have to drop their cultures and traditions when they arrive in our cities and countries
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with  Mr. Khan----people should not have to drop their own cultures and traditions----wherever they end up living.   He not only delivered that message to his fellow Britishers.  He seems to have found  it appropriate to appoint himself the advisor to me and my  fellow americans.    I support a world-wide tour for Mr. Khan-----he can deliver his good tidings
> thruout the world------especially to those lands that impose the
> filth of shariah, including the land of his ancestry----Pakistan
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think Mayor Khan might appear on Jimmy Kimmel?
Click to expand...


yeah


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cue Penelope to ask if my cucumber is Kosher.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine is home grown, a variety called marketmore.   Short thick fruits with a tough skin and a taste that has to be experienced
Click to expand...


Those cucumbers. They look like the ones I buy at the Turkish supermarket.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Phoenall said:


> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them




Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Tilly said:


> The blood libel is alive and well:
> 
> ...The legitimization has also changed. Throughout history, when people have sought to justify anti-Semitism, they have done so by recourse to the highest source of authority available within the culture. In the Middle Ages, it was religion. In post-Enlightenment Europe it was science. Today it is human rights. *It is why Israel—the only fully functioning democracy in the Middle East with a free press and independent judiciary—is regularly accused of the five crimes against human rights: racism, apartheid, crimes against humanity, ethnic cleansing and attempted genocide. This is the blood libel of our time. .....
> 
> Anti-Zionism is the new anti-Semitism, says Britain's former chief rabbi*




Be careful, there, Tilly.  That's three consecutive posts discussing the actual subject matter instead of promoting Islam.  You don't want Coyote to give you another warning, do you?


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cue Penelope to ask if my cucumber is Kosher.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine is home grown, a variety called marketmore.   Short thick fruits with a tough skin and a taste that has to be experienced
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Those cucumbers. They look like the ones I buy at the Turkish supermarket.
Click to expand...





Could well be they are an F1 hybrid that give an abundance of fruit, and can be grown outside in pots


----------



## Dogmaphobe

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/12/opinion/anti-semitism-and-the-british-left.html?_r=0

" The Muslim Association of Britain has been described by a government minister as the British “representative” of the international Muslim Brotherhood organization. The Palestinian branch of the Brotherhood is Hamas, the radical group that governs Gaza — and which Mr. Corbyn has praised for its commitment to “peace and social justice and political justice.” This is not the only case of Mr. Corbyn’s appearing to align himself with Islamism: From 2009 to 2012, he was a paid host on the Iranian state-owned Press TV."



So, here you have the leader of the British Labor party who praises a genocidal terrorist organization.  Indeed, he has traveled to meet with them on a regular basis to provide support their mission.


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
Click to expand...


And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
Click to expand...


Mooning again were you?


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
Click to expand...



You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.

 You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though. 

 We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids




You are such a desperate and revolting thing.

 You really are quite insane in the Islamomania of yours.


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are such a desperate and revolting thing.
> 
> You really are quite insane in the Islamomania of yours.
Click to expand...


That what she said was a terrible accusation.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
Click to expand...


Dude, I tried several times to get the thread on track with antisemitism in Europe but you'd have none of it, preferring to talk about other posters instead (as per many of your posts here).  You're making choices here and are unwilling to be adult enough to accept the consequences of your own behavior.  If you prefer attacking other members over discussing topics then don't be so thin skinned if you end up mocked in return.

You want to talk about antisemitism?

Your stated hero was a raging antisemite who went around the country electrocuting live animals because of a petty vendetta with Tesla.  How suitable.

If you going to promote and reward hate towards innocent people, you're no different then those you condemn.  You just take your bile on a different class of people - rather than on the actions conducted by some of them.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are such a desperate and revolting thing.
> 
> You really are quite insane in the Islamomania of yours.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That what she said was a terrible accusation.
Click to expand...


A lot of people make terrible accusations here.  Though I doubt you've noticed.  On the other hand, Tilly did hit "agree" with a post that was talking about nuking Muslim kids over the age of 5 because they might be indoctrinated.  Hard to wiggle out of that one.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, I tried several times to get the thread on track with antisemitism in Europe.........
Click to expand...


No. I did.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, I tried several times to get the thread on track with antisemitism in Europe but you'd have none of it, preferring to talk about other posters instead (as per many of your posts here).  You're making choices here and are unwilling to be adult enough to accept the consequences of your own behavior.  If you prefer attacking other members over discussing topics then don't be so thin skinned if you end up mocked in return.
> 
> You want to talk about antisemitism?
> 
> Your stated hero was a raging antisemite who went around the country electrocuting live animals because of a petty vendetta with Tesla.  How suitable.
> 
> If you going to promote and reward hate towards innocent people, you're no different then those you condemn.  You just take your bile on a different class of people - rather than on the actions conducted by some of them.
Click to expand...



 You are nothing but a dishonest piece of excrement with an Islamist agenda.   

This background info is for the humans here, rather than you, but this is what happened:

 When you were in one of your manic stages, you were heaping praise upon Islamist terrorists who you considered heroic.  I casually mentioned that if a person were actually looking for heroes, they needed look no further than various scientists who had actually done something useful for society and with lasting effects, whereupon I rattled off a half dozen of such off the top of my head.   Your insane response was that this meant I supported the electrocution of dogs, and you have been harping on this ever since.  You even accused me of doing so, myself.

  Words can  hardly describe my opinion of you. Seldom in my life have I encountered a creature as purely evil as you, or one driven by such an absolute maniacal zeal to promote a despicable agenda.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, I tried several times to get the thread on track with antisemitism in Europe.........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No. I did.
Click to expand...


You took it off topic multiple times.


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids



I thought you were against attacking the poster, just the post?


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, I tried several times to get the thread on track with antisemitism in Europe but you'd have none of it, preferring to talk about other posters instead (as per many of your posts here).  You're making choices here and are unwilling to be adult enough to accept the consequences of your own behavior.  If you prefer attacking other members over discussing topics then don't be so thin skinned if you end up mocked in return.
> 
> You want to talk about antisemitism?
> 
> Your stated hero was a raging antisemite who went around the country electrocuting live animals because of a petty vendetta with Tesla.  How suitable.
> 
> If you going to promote and reward hate towards innocent people, you're no different then those you condemn.  You just take your bile on a different class of people - rather than on the actions conducted by some of them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are nothing but a dishonest piece of excrement with an Islamist agenda.
> 
> This background info is for the humans here, rather than you, but this is what happened:
> 
> When you were in one of your manic stages, you were heaping praise upon Islamist terrorists who you considered heroic.  I casually mentioned that if a person were actually looking for heroes, they needed look no further than various scientists who had actually done something useful for society and with lasting effects, whereupon I rattled off a half dozen of such off the top of my head.   Your insane response was that this meant I supported the electrocution of dogs, and you have been harping on this ever since.  You even accused me of doing so, myself.
> 
> Words can  hardly describe my opinion of you. Seldom in my life have I encountered a creature as purely evil as you, or one driven by such an absolute maniacal zeal to promote a despicable agenda.
Click to expand...



Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.

Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> You took it off topic multiple times.



There was a lot of that going on, some of it from you.


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.



So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.


----------



## Coyote

.


saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You took it off topic multiple times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There was a lot of that going on, some of it from you.
Click to expand...


I gave up after the OP made it clear she wasn't interested in trying to stay on topic and the posts that were on topic, garnered far fewer responses than the off topic crap.  There's not much point in trying to maintain the topic when the OP doesn't support it.


----------



## saveliberty

Did anyone admit the current campaign against Jews in Germany has strong similarities to the WWII era?


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
Click to expand...



It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> .
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> You took it off topic multiple times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There was a lot of that going on, some of it from you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I gave up after the OP made it clear she wasn't interested in trying to stay on topic and the posts that were on topic, garnered far fewer responses than the off topic crap.  There's not much point in trying to maintain the topic when the OP doesn't support it.
Click to expand...


Oh, I understand I have the same reaction sometimes.  Thank you for the summary.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.




 Example:

A person is on record as supporting the basic dynamics of Palestinian terrorism. I point out that they support Islamic terrorism. You are a lying piece of excrement, so say I have accused a poster of supporting something they don't, when they HAVE.  A poster supports the mission of Hamas. Hamas's mission includes genocide. That poster knows that and supports them, anyway. Such a position DOES support genocide since it supports those who seek it. 

  I have asked before -- did the Muslim Brotherhood train you in these agitprop techniques you use in advancing their agenda? You're entire M.O. involves an inversion of truth utilized to make those rejecting the hatred into the hateful and elevating the hateful to a position above reproach.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
Click to expand...





 Do you have a link to that, or are you exceeding your authority again ?


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Did anyone admit the current campaign against Jews in Germany has strong similarities to the WWII era?



Yes.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
Click to expand...







 I hear the local perverts have painted your black so they cant see anything anymore


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
Click to expand...



 Your history of following me around the forum using the "funny" option in order to troll indicates the reality of the situation.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have a link to that, or are you exceeding your authority again ?
Click to expand...


I'm still waiting on your links Phoenall.

If you have a problem with "authority" - take it up via pm.


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
Click to expand...


I had some interest in the topic.  One thing I was going to mention is Muslims seem to be fairing better than Jews in Germany.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hear the local perverts have painted your black so they cant see anything anymore
Click to expand...


Well that makes no sense.  If you're going to attempt to be clever then you need to try and get the grammar and wording right.


----------



## Phoenall

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are such a desperate and revolting thing.
> 
> You really are quite insane in the Islamomania of yours.
Click to expand...







 I wonder if coyote is going to deny this reflection on her and say it doesnt happen.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought you were against attacking the poster, just the post?
Click to expand...



This creature is the biggest and most hypocritical troll in the forum.


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I had some interest in the topic.  One thing I was going to mention is Muslims seem to be fairing better than Jews in Germany.
Click to expand...


In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.

That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.


----------



## saveliberty

Dogmaphobe said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought you were against attacking the poster, just the post?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> This creature is the biggest and most hypocritical troll in the forum.
Click to expand...


Oh Hell no!  Even I give her a run for the money some days.  

She has some topics that are near and dear. just like everyone else here.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Your history of following me around the forum using the "funny" option in order to troll indicates the reality of the situation.
Click to expand...


Stop attacking me in posts that have nothing to do with me.  Pretty simple.  I would far prefer to be left alone by the likes of you but you don't seem to want to allow that and then you whine when I respond.  Make up your mind.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did anyone admit the current campaign against Jews in Germany has strong similarities to the WWII era?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes.
Click to expand...





 Have your words on here been likened to the word used by nazi's against Jews in the same era ?


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.
> 
> That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.



I think you overlook Germany's religious viewpoint.  Lutheranism began there and is not doing well in its country of origin.  I like the last sentence.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, I tried several times to get the thread on track with antisemitism in Europe.........
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No. I did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You took it off topic multiple times.
Click to expand...


I know. Mea culpa.

And I tried to put it right.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hear the local perverts have painted your black so they cant see anything anymore
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well that makes no sense.  If you're going to attempt to be clever then you need to try and get the grammar and wording right.
Click to expand...





IT IS PERFECT GRAMMAR, UNLESS YOU ARE TRAINED BY ISLAMONAZI'S


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.
> 
> That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you overlook Germany's religious viewpoint.  Lutheranism began there and is not doing well in its country of origin.  I like the last sentence.
Click to expand...


I think that is because Europe is far more secular and values it's secularness.  Unlike ourselves, they've been ravaged by religious wars.


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> I think that is because Europe is far more secular and values it's secularness.  Unlike ourselves, they've been ravaged by religious wars.



I disagree as to cause.  Socialism has created government as God.


----------



## Mindful

saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.
> 
> That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you overlook Germany's religious viewpoint.  Lutheranism began there and is not doing well in its country of origin.  I like the last sentence.
Click to expand...


Roman Catholicism is big in Germany, particularly Bavaria.


----------



## saveliberty

Okay, hopefully back on topic?

Feel free to go to another thread should the urge to be a jackass returns.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have a link to that, or are you exceeding your authority again ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm still waiting on your links Phoenall.
> 
> If you have a problem with "authority" - take it up via pm.
Click to expand...








 In other words you have stepped out of line    AGAIN


----------



## saveliberty

Phoenall said:


> In other words you have stepped out of line    AGAIN



Did you see red?  Because I didn't see red writing. 

Seems like we have an argument over which religion should be bashed, instead of supporting choice.


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think that is because Europe is far more secular and values it's secularness.  Unlike ourselves, they've been ravaged by religious wars.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I disagree as to cause.  Socialism has created government as God.
Click to expand...


I don't think it's that cerebral. 

Look at Europe's history of religious wars and the horrific bloodshed associated with various wars, pogroms, expulsions etc:  
European wars of religion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Still, according to Pew, Europe is still vastly Christian and will continue to be.  Unfortunately it's Jewish population is continuing to decline with Jews moving to Israel and elsewhere.  That could be a reflection of anti-semitism in general and anti-semitism from an increasing Muslim immigrant population putting pressure on them.


----------



## saveliberty

Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources. 

I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I had some interest in the topic.  One thing I was going to mention is Muslims seem to be fairing better than Jews in Germany.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.
> 
> That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.
Click to expand...








 And once again you ignore the truth from people on the ground. We see how anti semitism is growing in left wing groups, who also ally themselves with muslims. We dont see any anti semitism in any right wing groups, in fact we see the opposite. Are you aware that anti semitism has increased in line with the rise of neo marxism and the immigration of muslims, something the left wing parties have tried to hide and cover up. When our last Labour P.M stated that he would alter the laws to enable him to silence the detractors it set the wheels turning for his dismissal and the end of labours rule.You would think they would have learnt from that that the people did not want anti semitism and uncontrolled migration of potential terrorists, guess they are burying their heads in the sand. The labour leaders latest stupid outburst is he would nationalise a T.V programme because the BBC would not all,ow it to be made by certain production companies and so sold the rights.


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.



I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....


----------



## saveliberty

You have to admit, I am a really good bouncer.

Pouncer, I meant pouncer.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Suddenly context matters?  Wow.  It's not as clean as you make it out to be.
> 
> Again: if you can't handle shit, stop throwing it.  Stop accusing people of supporting things they don't.  It you are incapable of that then at least grow a pair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I had some interest in the topic.  One thing I was going to mention is Muslims seem to be fairing better than Jews in Germany.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.
> 
> That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And once again you ignore the truth from people on the ground. We see how anti semitism is growing in left wing groups, who also ally themselves with muslims. We dont see any anti semitism in any right wing groups, in fact we see the opposite. Are you aware that anti semitism has increased in line with the rise of neo marxism and the immigration of muslims, something the left wing parties have tried to hide and cover up. When our last Labour P.M stated that he would alter the laws to enable him to silence the detractors it set the wheels turning for his dismissal and the end of labours rule.You would think they would have learnt from that that the people did not want anti semitism and uncontrolled migration of potential terrorists, guess they are burying their heads in the sand. The labour leaders latest stupid outburst is he would nationalise a T.V programme because the BBC would not all,ow it to be made by certain production companies and so sold the rights.
Click to expand...


One of the articles I posted was about anti-semitism in the rightwing - despite the superficial rhetoric and attempts to change the public face - the inner workings and members still believe in the same old antisemitic dogma.  I think it's just wrapped in a more palatable package now because it can be focused on Muslims.  I agree, it is growing in some of the far left groups and it was disturbing to read about what occurred in Britain's labor party.


----------



## saveliberty

Phoenall said:


> And once again you ignore the truth from people on the ground. We see how anti semitism is growing in left wing groups, who also ally themselves with muslims. We dont see any anti semitism in any right wing groups, in fact we see the opposite. Are you aware that anti semitism has increased in line with the rise of neo marxism and the immigration of muslims, something the left wing parties have tried to hide and cover up. When our last Labour P.M stated that he would alter the laws to enable him to silence the detractors it set the wheels turning for his dismissal and the end of labours rule.You would think they would have learnt from that that the people did not want anti semitism and uncontrolled migration of potential terrorists, guess they are burying their heads in the sand. The labour leaders latest stupid outburst is he would nationalise a T.V programme because the BBC would not all,ow it to be made by certain production companies and so sold the rights.



Hopefully the government responds in equal measure to the problem.


----------



## Phoenall

saveliberty said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> In other words you have stepped out of line    AGAIN
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you see red?  Because I didn't see red writing.
> 
> Seems like we have an argument over which religion should be bashed, instead of supporting choice.
Click to expand...





All religions that promote peace as a fundamental part of their teachings should be supported, any that promote violence, hate, divisiveness and child abuse as basic tenets should be outlawed and eradicated from the west. When they realise they cant gain access to our trapping of modern life they might start making changes for the better.

 I wont hold my breath waiting for the followers of such religions/dogmas to change their ways


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
Click to expand...







 The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"


----------



## saveliberty

I'd be happy if upstairs threads promoted fair and balanced retorts.  My expectations of getting millions to agree are almost nonexistent.


----------



## saveliberty

Phoenall said:


> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"



Thank you.


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> You have to admit, I am a really good bouncer.





saveliberty said:


> You have to admit, I am a really good bouncer.
> 
> Pouncer, I meant pouncer.


----------



## saveliberty

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> You have to admit, I am a really good bouncer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> You have to admit, I am a really good bouncer.
> 
> Pouncer, I meant pouncer.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


That will leave a mark.


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"
Click to expand...


Fascism and socialism are different things.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> So.. all of what you said was meant to show people what they were doing wrong in the thread?  You might want to mention that, because it looks like all of your last three whines you violated too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's between myself and a particular poster who follows me around with his personal attacks.  I have no issue with defending myself.  Why do you suddenly feel the need to jump into a thread that you hadn't participated at all in up until now - in fact, not once did you discuss the topic.  Is it simply to join a dog pile?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I had some interest in the topic.  One thing I was going to mention is Muslims seem to be fairing better than Jews in Germany.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> In post #21, I tried to explain it as I see it.  The rhetoric and the rise of far right nationalism is, in my opinion dangerous because it seeks to scapegoat classes of people.  It did so with the Jews between the world wars and now the same rhetoric is being used to promote hatred against Muslims while they're courting the Jews in an attempt to become politically mainstream.  Underneath, it's the same old anti-semitism and the supporters of those movements spout the same old canards.  I don't think it's a big problem for German Jews.  I think Jews in France have a harder time of it, because they are also faced with antisemitism from Islamic migrants.
> 
> That kind of rhetoric is dangerous and divisive, and it seeks to scapegoat - not bring together.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And once again you ignore the truth from people on the ground. We see how anti semitism is growing in left wing groups, who also ally themselves with muslims. We dont see any anti semitism in any right wing groups, in fact we see the opposite. Are you aware that anti semitism has increased in line with the rise of neo marxism and the immigration of muslims, something the left wing parties have tried to hide and cover up. When our last Labour P.M stated that he would alter the laws to enable him to silence the detractors it set the wheels turning for his dismissal and the end of labours rule.You would think they would have learnt from that that the people did not want anti semitism and uncontrolled migration of potential terrorists, guess they are burying their heads in the sand. The labour leaders latest stupid outburst is he would nationalise a T.V programme because the BBC would not all,ow it to be made by certain production companies and so sold the rights.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> One of the articles I posted was about anti-semitism in the rightwing - despite the superficial rhetoric and attempts to change the public face - the inner workings and members still believe in the same old antisemitic dogma.  I think it's just wrapped in a more palatable package now because it can be focused on Muslims.  I agree, it is growing in some of the far left groups and it was disturbing to read about what occurred in Britain's labor party.
Click to expand...







 And this had been going on for 14 years when they were in power. Even today there are pockets of neo marxist local government heads of department that use the threat of branding the police and other public servants as racist's, islamophobes and nazi's to protect the muslims extremists that are their "friends" This is why the muslims got away with the rape of white children for so long, and were protected from arrest for their crimes. It took the demise of the labour party to allow the police to start taking action and to date over 500 adult male muslims have been charged with sex crimes against children We are waiting for the case involving the murder of a Blackpool 15 year old girl to be re-opened and the named culprits to be found guilty and sentenced to life. The whole case shows just how much the neo marxists were ruling the country from the back rooms of power. Unelected and unwanted by the people and still they had the power of life and death in some cases over ordinary people. The full story will never be told as it involves so many figures in high power and could destroy the nation as a whole


----------



## Phoenall

saveliberty said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> And once again you ignore the truth from people on the ground. We see how anti semitism is growing in left wing groups, who also ally themselves with muslims. We dont see any anti semitism in any right wing groups, in fact we see the opposite. Are you aware that anti semitism has increased in line with the rise of neo marxism and the immigration of muslims, something the left wing parties have tried to hide and cover up. When our last Labour P.M stated that he would alter the laws to enable him to silence the detractors it set the wheels turning for his dismissal and the end of labours rule.You would think they would have learnt from that that the people did not want anti semitism and uncontrolled migration of potential terrorists, guess they are burying their heads in the sand. The labour leaders latest stupid outburst is he would nationalise a T.V programme because the BBC would not all,ow it to be made by certain production companies and so sold the rights.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully the government responds in equal measure to the problem.
Click to expand...







 The government is collecting data to be used against him in the fullness of time, at the moment he is protected by parliamentary privilege


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fascism and socialism are different things.
Click to expand...







 Are they they why did the National Socialist Workers party of Germany practise and epitomise fascism.

 And why is Israel likened to the same fascist party ? and named as fascist if the socialists of Germany werent fascists ?


----------



## Coyote

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fascism and socialism are different things.
Click to expand...




Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fascism and socialism are different things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are they they why did the National Socialist Workers party of Germany practise and epitomise fascism.
Click to expand...


Because they became fascist, not socialist.

Why is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea called "Democratic" when it isn't?



> And why is Israel likened to the same fascist party ? and named as fascist if the socialists of Germany werent fascists ?



You'll have to ask people who call them fascist.


----------



## Eloy

Coyote said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> The Palestinians have a right to defend themselves as best they can from a brutal Israeli occupation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
Click to expand...

"Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
*(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
(ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
(UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)


----------



## Tilly

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> You are incapable of discussing the subject matter.
> 
> You sure do think genocide if funny by the looks of your response to post 461, though.
> 
> We'll just have to add that to the list of things you consider funny like the rape of children, the massacre of gay people and just about anything else your heroes do.
Click to expand...

And Isis dissolving people people in vats of acid, she finds that funny too.


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> _ I_
> 
> 10 Myths About Muslim Immigrants in the West
> 
> _People look at the huge families of many new Muslim immigrants and imagine them multiplying at exponential rates. But this is a bit of an illusion — as are many of the figures suggesting that Muslim immigrants have fertility rates higher than in their homelands. This is because most new immigrants have most of their children in the years immediately after their arrival. The way we calculate Total Fertility Rate — the measure of average family size — is by taking the total number of births a woman has had and extrapolating it across her fertile life. As a result, because immigrants tend to have most of their children soon after arriving, scholarly analyses of their actual family sizes show that they appear to have more children than they really do.
> 
> _
> *In reality, the family sizes of Muslim immigrant groups are converging fast with those of average Westerners — faster, it seems, than either Jewish or Catholic immigrants did in their time. Muslims in France and Germany are now having only 2.2 children per family, barely above the national average. And while Pakistani immigrants in Britain have 3.5 children each, their British-born daughters have only 2.5. Across Europe, the difference between the Muslim and non-Muslim fertility rate has fallen from 0.7 to 0.4, and is headed toward a continent-wide convergence.*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
Click to expand...

You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are such a desperate and revolting thing.
> 
> You really are quite insane in the Islamomania of yours.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That what she said was a terrible accusation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> A lot of people make terrible accusations here.  Though I doubt you've noticed.  On the other hand, Tilly did hit "agree" with a post that was talking about nuking Muslim kids over the age of 5 because they might be indoctrinated.  Hard to wiggle out of that one.
Click to expand...

As has been explained over and over again, I agreed that children are being indoctrinated, and I agreed with the Ayan Hirsi Ali's comments about this abuse, and with her comments about the abuse of female children - FGM in particular. I do not agree with nuking Muslims or their children - anywhere. So, again, why won't you take this up with the person who actually said they think Muslims and their children should be nuked?
Because you are a coward.


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> I sure wish this forum had a moderator of good character who would warn people when they are WAY off topic.
> 
> The topic here isn't American Muslims. It is antisemitism, specifically the politically correct variety sweeping the European left.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you expect when they are islamonazi propagandists who refuse to see the complaints made against them
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
> For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you gone off Lucy finally?
Click to expand...

i have gone off coyote constantly attributing Lucys words to me whilst she is too Craven to actually take to task the person who actually wrote those words. Lucy and I have never agreed on everything, which you might have noticed if you weren't so busy calling me a Nazi.


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Stop being a pervert and peeping at them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank goodness for Cosco, what with all the windex I need to buy for removing all the grimy nose smudges from the outside of my bedroom window.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Mooning again were you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hear the local perverts have painted your black so they cant see anything anymore
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well that makes no sense.  If you're going to attempt to be clever then you need to try and get the grammar and wording right.
Click to expand...

Says the creature who consistently uses 'then' for 'than', and 'tenants' for 'tenets'. Lol. Oh and who supports the terrorists Hamas - who are among the worst antisemites going.


----------



## Tilly

saveliberty said:


> I'd be happy if upstairs threads promoted fair and balanced retorts.  My expectations of getting millions to agree are almost nonexistent.


There is always the CDZ.


----------



## Tilly

The European left are disproportionately energised in their demonisation of Israel because they are Antisemitic.

...The European Left has a disproportionate obsession with Israel: its default position is against Israel; its default sympathy is often with Israel's declared enemies. This unbalanced focus on Israel is itself an example of antisemitism. There are dozens of brutal dictatorships to choose from. Saudi Arabia. Iran. Islamic State. Russia. China. Eritrea. North Korea. Cuba. Yet the Left expends extra time and resources on its critiques of Israel, which is a democracy....

http://uk.businessinsider.com/the-left-doesnt-understand-about-antisemitism-on-the-left-2016-4


----------



## Tilly

From the article above:

...And when you're Jewish, you look at these things and ask, why is the Left failing to criticise "friends" who want to destroy an entire country, but insisting on sanctions against one of the few democracies in the Middle East? 

This cognitive dissonance comes up time and time again:


No doubt Labour MP Naz Shah doesn't literally hate Jewish people, she simply regarded herself as a critic of the Israeli government's sometimes harsh policies in its occupied territories. But then she wrote a Facebook post that suggested Israel should be relocated to the US to end "foreign interference" in the Middle East, “Problem solved.”
No doubt NUS president Malia Bouattia doesn't literally hate the Jews. But somehow she suggested that the Jews control the media. 
No doubt Ken Livingstone doesn't literally hate Jewish people, either. But he somehow managed to equate Hitler with the only country on the planet that Jews call home.
This stuff goes down to the party level. Here is a Labour activist who was suspended from the party because he wrote a Facebook post arguing that the Holocaust was somehow advantageous to the Jews. ("The Holocaust has been the most useful political tool of the Zionist government in Israel to establish a financial racket in the West, whereby Israel receives an unlimited sum for the duration of its existence," he said.)

These incidents add up, and they have one thing in common: An unbalanced, disproportionate level of criticism against one small country, coupled with a complete lack of criticism of the many larger non-Jewish regimes who do far worse things. You don't have to be a huge champion of Israel to realise that this just isn't fair. 

When you treat one group of people, or their country, differently than another, that's discrimination. And that's why the Left's "anti-Zionism" so often functions effectively as the anti-Semitism it claims not to be.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/the-left-doesnt-understand-about-antisemitism-on-the-left-2016-4


----------



## Ravi

If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ironically, if this thread were about Muslims, coyote would be the first to go full Godwin, and would be ranting ad nauseum about Nazis and painting Muslims as the new Jews.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
> For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you gone off Lucy finally?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i have gone off coyote constantly attributing Lucys words to me whilst she is too Craven to actually take to task the person who actually wrote those words. Lucy and I have never agreed on everything, which you might have noticed if you weren't so busy calling me a Nazi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> so you are still down with Lucy's views?
Click to expand...

Despite the fact that coyote keeps bringing up Lucys views, this is not a thread about Lucys views, and she isn't even participating in this thread, so I don't think it's relevant to discuss them. Plus, I've already answered your question, Ravi.


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.


So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?


----------



## Ravi

Tilly said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
> For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you gone off Lucy finally?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i have gone off coyote constantly attributing Lucys words to me whilst she is too Craven to actually take to task the person who actually wrote those words. Lucy and I have never agreed on everything, which you might have noticed if you weren't so busy calling me a Nazi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> so you are still down with Lucy's views?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Despite the fact that coyote keeps bringing up Lucys views, this is not a thread about Lucys views, and she isn't even participating in this thread, so I don't think it's relevant to discuss them. Plus, I've already answered your question, Ravi.
Click to expand...

No, you didn't but I understand both your reluctance to answer and your chastising me for being off topic while being off topic yourself.


----------



## Ravi

Tilly said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.
> 
> 
> 
> So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?
Click to expand...

The gvmnt is not a party. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. The asshole was suspended by his party.


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
> For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.
> 
> 
> 
> Have you gone off Lucy finally?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i have gone off coyote constantly attributing Lucys words to me whilst she is too Craven to actually take to task the person who actually wrote those words. Lucy and I have never agreed on everything, which you might have noticed if you weren't so busy calling me a Nazi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> so you are still down with Lucy's views?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Despite the fact that coyote keeps bringing up Lucys views, this is not a thread about Lucys views, and she isn't even participating in this thread, so I don't think it's relevant to discuss them. Plus, I've already answered your question, Ravi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you didn't but I understand both your reluctance to answer and your chastising me for being off topic while being off topic yourself.
Click to expand...

I am responding to people's off topic comments directly to me. And yes, your question was answered. If you want more details, you'd have to be more specific and this thread is not about a specific posters views, nor my views on those, despite yourself and coyotes attempts to make it so.


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.
> 
> 
> 
> So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The gvmnt is not a party. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. The asshole was suspended by his party.
Click to expand...

The assholes aren't suspended until there is a media furore because they've exposed their Antisemitism very publicly, usually more than once in the case of the former mayor.


----------



## Ravi

Tilly said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.
> 
> 
> 
> So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The gvmnt is not a party. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. The asshole was suspended by his party.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The assholes aren't suspended until there is a media furore because they've exposed their Antisemitism very publicly, usually more than once in the case of the former mayor.
Click to expand...

How else would they know?


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
> For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.
> 
> 
> 
> Have you gone off Lucy finally?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i have gone off coyote constantly attributing Lucys words to me whilst she is too Craven to actually take to task the person who actually wrote those words. Lucy and I have never agreed on everything, which you might have noticed if you weren't so busy calling me a Nazi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> so you are still down with Lucy's views?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Despite the fact that coyote keeps bringing up Lucys views, this is not a thread about Lucys views, and she isn't even participating in this thread, so I don't think it's relevant to discuss them. Plus, I've already answered your question, Ravi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, you didn't but I understand both your reluctance to answer and your chastising me for being off topic while being off topic yourself.
Click to expand...

As usual you understand very little, I guess it's back on ignore for you.


----------



## Tilly

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.
> 
> 
> 
> So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The gvmnt is not a party. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. The asshole was suspended by his party.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The assholes aren't suspended until there is a media furore because they've exposed their Antisemitism very publicly, usually more than once in the case of the former mayor.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How else would they know?
Click to expand...

How else would who know?


----------



## Coyote

*Posts have been shifted to FZ - let's take the off topic fighting over there.*


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> *Posts have been shifted to FZ - let's take the off topic fighting over there.*


I really think you should not copy the title of this thread into the FZ.
posts in that thread do not relate to Mindfuls topic or title. I think you should change the FZ title.
Also, there are people who don't like to post there, who may do so unwittingly, due to the Unecessary confusion caused by duplicated titles.


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Posts have been shifted to FZ - let's take the off topic fighting over there.*
> 
> 
> 
> I really think you should not copy the title of this thread into the FZ.
> posts in that thread do not relate to Mindfuls topic or title. I think you should change the FZ title.
> Also, there are people who don't like to post there, who may do so unwittingly, due to the Unecessary confusion caused by duplicated titles.
Click to expand...


The title copies automatically.  What would you like it changed to?  Post a suggestion in the thread.


----------



## Tilly

Coyote said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Posts have been shifted to FZ - let's take the off topic fighting over there.*
> 
> 
> 
> I really think you should not copy the title of this thread into the FZ.
> posts in that thread do not relate to Mindfuls topic or title. I think you should change the FZ title.
> Also, there are people who don't like to post there, who may do so unwittingly, due to the Unecessary confusion caused by duplicated titles.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The title copies automatically.  What would you like it changed to?  Post a suggestion in the thread.
Click to expand...

Call it what you will, I really don't think this title should be copied to the FZ for the reasons already mentioned.


----------



## Tilly

Also, isn't there a rule against taking peoples posts from the upstairs down into the FZ?


----------



## Coyote

Tilly said:


> Also, isn't there a rule against taking peoples posts from the upstairs down into the FZ?



Not when they are FZ material and derailing threads - we can move them or trash them.  FZ is the place to hash this out - not in threads like this.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fascism and socialism are different things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey look posters!  Civil discussion complete with sources.
> 
> I happen to think they overlook what socialism has contributed, but I am not name calling.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know, increased socialism might have been means to remedy what they saw as societal ills but not sure created a view of the state as god....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The term is FASCISM to describe the socialist ideal of "The state is everything, and everything is the state"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Fascism and socialism are different things.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are they they why did the National Socialist Workers party of Germany practise and epitomise fascism.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Because they became fascist, not socialist.
> 
> Why is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea called "Democratic" when it isn't?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And why is Israel likened to the same fascist party ? and named as fascist if the socialists of Germany werent fascists ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You'll have to ask people who call them fascist.
Click to expand...







 To fool the rest of the communists into seeing them as something they arent. And they started out originally as fascists in the true sense, not the sense team palestine now uses.

 The answer is the same as the last 1,000 times "because we say they are" . Then start the name calling, threats and LIES to silence the voices of truth and reason.


----------



## Mindful

Tilly said:


> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you'd be the first to agree when someone calls for nuking Muslim kids
> 
> 
> 
> You are the one who is pally with the person who wrote that Muslims and their children should be nuked, and you are the one too Craven to take her to task about it. Hypocrite, thy name is lying coyote.
> For the record, please refer to my sig, and note why it's necessary, people.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you gone off Lucy finally?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i have gone off coyote constantly attributing Lucys words to me whilst she is too Craven to actually take to task the person who actually wrote those words. Lucy and I have never agreed on everything, which you might have noticed if you weren't so busy calling me a Nazi.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> so you are still down with Lucy's views?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Despite the fact that coyote keeps bringing up Lucys views, this is not a thread about Lucys views, and she isn't even participating in this thread, so I don't think it's relevant to discuss them. Plus, I've already answered your question, Ravi.
Click to expand...


It's not a thread about Muslims either.

It's about British lefties agitating for  the boycotting of Israeli products.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> You do realise that gaza is not occupied dont you, and that firing illegal rockets into Israel is a war crime and not defence. So want to find where in the Geneva conventions it says targetting children is allowed as a defencive move ?
> 
> By the way under International laws it is the arab muslims that occupy Israel, and it is time the UN forced them to leave
> 
> 
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> "Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
> *(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
> (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> (UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)
Click to expand...







 Which is not legally enforceable as it is just a set of recommendations. You also need to read the authors side notes that clearly state this means in the goodness of time after a peace treaty has been thrashed out. Why do you always gloss over the next part that tells the arab muslims what they must do. In matter of fact 242 dictates to the arab muslims and not the Jews, which is why the arab muslims try to alter its meaning


----------



## Phoenall

Ravi said:


> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.










 Not when it is done to appease the membership who complained about the post


----------



## Mindful

More coming out of London, on the theme of demonising.

"I went to Hinde Street Methodist Church’s exhibition in London about Israel’s security checkpoints today expecting something on the scale of the St James’s Church’s lifesize reproduction of Israel’s security barrier outside their own church in 2013 which cost £30,000 to construct. Hinde Street Church’s reproduction, however, was more of an IKEA job.

First, all of the exhibition was inside the church and second, the checkpoint was made from simple plywood with various negative commentaries about the wall, including quotations from the Bible, attached to it.

There were also real photographs of Israeli checkpoints, some sort of jenga section and three prayer stations for silent contemplation.

Third, the Zionist Federation and the Board of Deputies had spent the weekend persuading the church to accept as part of the exhibition literature (including two big boards) explaining why the security checkpoints are so necessary (see below).

The exhibition didn’t seem to be busy (it runs till friday) but the ZF/BOD literature will be effective in countering those unsuspecting members of the public who wander in. My hunch though is that the exhibition will only attract real Israel haters coming to have their views on the Jewish state confirmed.

David Collier and I sat at a prayer station in discussion with two elderly British women for about 15 minutes. We played dumb about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as one of the women proceeded to tell us, inter alia, that Israel has an “unkind society” and that Israel in the West Bank is akin to Putin conquering the Ukraine and transporting Russians there.

Although the exhibition itself is pretty downboat the fact that the church decided to criticise checkpoints that keep Israelis alive is pretty bewildering. Nowhere in the exhibition does the church condemn the Palestinian terrorism that has killed so many Israelis.

But reading the Church’s Facebook page marketing the exhibition gives you an indication of the mindset of some Methodists, perhaps."

Richard Millett.


----------



## Phoenall

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.
> 
> 
> 
> So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The gvmnt is not a party. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. The asshole was suspended by his party.
Click to expand...








 WRONG the UK government is a political party, and the rules that have been relaxed over the last 200 to 300 years should be re-inroduced. This means representing the people that voted for them and not the party politics in Westminster, give the people back their powers to veto party policies after the ballot box


----------



## Phoenall

Ravi said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ravi said:
> 
> 
> 
> If the Labour Party suspended an asshole for antisemitism then I conclude that the European left is against antisemitism.
> 
> 
> 
> So if the gvmnt suspended an asshole for being racist against blacks you would conclude the same? The European left is against racism against Black people?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The gvmnt is not a party. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. The asshole was suspended by his party.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The assholes aren't suspended until there is a media furore because they've exposed their Antisemitism very publicly, usually more than once in the case of the former mayor.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How else would they know?
Click to expand...







 By listening to what they say, and what they support outside of their political interests. Then make overtures to their local party to complain officially and have the offenders local party suspend them as an M.P.


----------



## gtopa1

Coyote said:


> *Posts have been shifted to FZ - let's take the off topic fighting over there.*



??? Still says "in "Europe" at the top...I will be naughty after I check this out.

Greg


----------



## gtopa1

Still says in "Europe". I have no confidence that I can unleash my disgusting, puerile and debased inner self unless I am in the FZ. I shall have to keep my outer mask of decency until later.

Greg


----------



## Tommy Tainant

The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.

Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.

The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism. 

That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.

It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.


----------



## Mindful

Tommy Tainant said:


> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.



It's not supposed  to. Despite your "righteous" indignation.


----------



## gtopa1

Tommy Tainant said:


> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.



Rinsing Israel Out of Europe: The Zionistfrei Movement

Sounds quite a considered piece quite frankly. Are you trying to make Wrexham Judenfrei??

Greg


----------



## irosie91

Tommy Tainant said:


> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.



WRONG!!!   as usual     Economic boycott of Israel is nothing new----In fact such a boycott has been in force since the
inception of Israel.     Since approximately 1950 ----ALL arab
countries and even most Muslim countries have imposed a 
VERY COMPREHENSIVE boycott on all things Israeli and 
in that program BOYCOTT of any business that also does
business with Israel-----It was designed to be the modern
alternative to STARVATION SIEGE-----the very same technique your kith and kin have used for millennia in
conducting your many genocides and continue to use.   
In memory of living people-----(like me)   the same method
was used to murder the  IBO  people of BIAFRA by your
fellow filth---(1967-70)----STARVATION SIEGE has been
the method of choice by barbaric filth for MILLENNIA    (even
in Europe------whole towns wiped out---by SIEGE OF THE CASTLE---      Learn some history


----------



## Tilly

Boycotts tend to hurt regular people and businesses. That seems like collective punishment to me. I thought all the pally lovers and Antisemites disapprove of collective punishment.


----------



## irosie91

Tilly said:


> Boycotts tend to hurt regular people and businesses. That seems like collective punishment to me. I thought all the pally lovers and Antisemites disapprove of collective punishment.



When I was a kid-----(another boring personal anecdote)----
some geniuses decided to promote Christianity by elaborating
a directory of  approved businesses based on sunday closure
and "church going owners"   and stuff like that----THE DIRECTORY WAS DECLARED ILLEGAL IN MY STATE.  
How is  BDS  different?   There are lots of muslim countries exporting lots of stuff to the USA-------I wonder how a BDS
program sponsored by  THE JDL  would go over in the USA?


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> It's not a thread about Muslims either.
> 
> It's about British lefties agitating for  the boycotting of Israeli products.




The same thing happens whenever the subject actually IS Islam, when the site Islamists seize upon the opportunity to turn the thread into a hate fest against Christianity or Judaism and in similarly Orwellian fashion, demand others "stay on topic" with the new one they have engineered instead of the original.


 I'm rather surprised that anybody would actually thank this behavior.


The British left -- and through extension, the western left in general -- cannot come to terms with what Islam actually IS, and so they utilize all these techniques to distract from the subject matter. This particular ruse is called a Tu Quoque fallacy, and has become part and parcel of western leftist agitprop. 
 .


----------



## irosie91

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's not a thread about Muslims either.
> 
> It's about British lefties agitating for  the boycotting of Israeli products.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The same thing happens whenever the subject actually IS Islam, when the site Islamists seize upon the opportunity to turn the thread into a hate fest against Christianity or Judaism and in similarly Orwellian fashion, demand others "stay on topic" with the new one they have engineered instead of the original.
> 
> 
> I'm rather surprised that anybody would actually thank this behavior.
> 
> 
> The British left -- and through extension, the western left in general -- cannot come to terms with what Islam actually IS, and so they utilize all these techniques to distract from the subject matter. This particular ruse is called a Tu Quoque fallacy, and has become part and parcel of western leftist agitprop.
> .
Click to expand...


thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas


----------



## Dogmaphobe

TheOldSchool said:


> ]The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.




Are there any other trite Uber-leftist platitudes you would like to trot out while you are at it?  You have already parroted the "any criticism of Israel" nugget you have been trained to repeat as well as the "silencing debate" trick.

 The singular fascination with demonizing a tiny nation state that acts to fulfill the aspirations of a besieged minority is not mere criticism.  Naming the nature of the hatred does not silence debate.  If it did, those such as yourself and the countless other members of the antisemitic left would not be so prominent here, or anywhere else.


----------



## Tilly

Israels exports mostly consist of electronics, medical equipment and pharmaceuticals.  I wonder have all the BDS Antisemites given up their mobiles?  Of the food it exports, its biggest buyers are Russia and China, and they aren't boycotting them. I think the efforts of the BDS movement, which has been going for well over a decade, have failed to meet their objective of completely isolating and demonising Israel, and they will continue to do so, yay


----------



## Tilly

Tommy Tainant said:


> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.


What's really insulting to Israelis and Jews is leftards shrieking Nazi at everyone who disagrees with them, and of course labelling the Israelis themselves as Nazis.


----------



## irosie91

Tilly said:


> Israels exports mostly consist of electronics, medical equipment and pharmaceuticals.  I wonder have all the BDS Antisemites given up their mobiles?  Of the food it exports, its biggest buyers are Russia and China, and they aren't boycotting them. I think the efforts of the BDS movement, which has been going for well over a decade, have failed to meet their objective of completely isolating and demonising Israel, and they will continue to do so, yay



the program HAS had an interesting fallout-----I witnessed---in my town---which is replete with every ethnic group on the planet----a  REALLY ANGRY interaction between two  Muzzettes.    One muzzette was happily dumping Israeli made
canned food items into her grocery basket and another muzzette  SCREAMED at her about the people Israel is TORTURING


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.








 Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.

If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews


 WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.


----------



## Phoenall

gtopa1 said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rinsing Israel Out of Europe: The Zionistfrei Movement
> 
> Sounds quite a considered piece quite frankly. Are you trying to make Wrexham Judenfrei??
> 
> Greg
Click to expand...






 He will fail as the decent people will turn against him and his fellow neo marxists again, this time they will evict them from power


----------



## Phoenall

Tilly said:


> Boycotts tend to hurt regular people and businesses. That seems like collective punishment to me. I thought all the pally lovers and Antisemites disapprove of collective punishment.









 They do when they perceive it as being aimed at their hero's. But when they put it in place it is validated because of the blood libels and propaganda lies spewed as the fore runner of the collective punishment. They always have double standards and hypocrisy and claim that they are justified by Israel's treatment of the arabs


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> By blockading Gaza, controlling its air space and territorial waters, and periodically massacring its citizens, Gaza is effectively occupied territory.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> "Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
> *(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
> (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> (UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which is not legally enforceable as it is just a set of recommendations. You also need to read the authors side notes that clearly state this means in the goodness of time after a peace treaty has been thrashed out. Why do you always gloss over the next part that tells the arab muslims what they must do. In matter of fact 242 dictates to the arab muslims and not the Jews, which is why the arab muslims try to alter its meaning
Click to expand...

Anyone who can read English has no difficulty with the diplomatic meaning of "*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*". Putting it in one word: ¡Fuera!


----------



## Coyote

gtopa1 said:


> Still says in "Europe". I have no confidence that I can unleash my disgusting, puerile and debased inner self unless I am in the FZ. I shall have to keep my outer mask of decency until later.
> 
> Greg



It's in another thread of the same title in the FZ if you wish to wander over there.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

irosie91 said:


> thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas




I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again. 

 This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again.
> 
> This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.
Click to expand...



Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Tilly said:


> Israels exports mostly consist of electronics, medical equipment and pharmaceuticals.



....and green technology. 

 of course, these posturing idiots who CLAIM to be environmentalists would rather support primitives who intentionally destroy such technology, instead. 

 The world is maddeningly Orwellian these days when it comes to this new authoritarian left. Whether it is women's rights, gay rights, the environment or most anything else, what they ACTUALLY support is the very antithesis of what they claim to support.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again.
> 
> This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'
Click to expand...



 I have been watching it from afar, but I have been on discussion groups like this since the nineties, and my experience is that if a person defines themselves as British and left of center, pretty much all I have encountered were actively hostile to Jews.


----------



## Mindful

Dogmaphobe said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again.
> 
> This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I have been watching it from afar, but I have been on discussion groups like this since the nineties, and my experience is that if a person defines themselves as British and left of center, pretty much all I have encountered were actively hostile to Jews.
Click to expand...



I hope Phoenell reads that link.

I wanted to ask him what he thinks of Dianne Abbott.


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to international law, and that is what counts. Not your JEW HATRED and NAZISM.
> 
> If hamas stopped firing illegal weapons into Israel from civilian areas then its civilians would not be killed
> 
> 
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> "Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
> *(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
> (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> (UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which is not legally enforceable as it is just a set of recommendations. You also need to read the authors side notes that clearly state this means in the goodness of time after a peace treaty has been thrashed out. Why do you always gloss over the next part that tells the arab muslims what they must do. In matter of fact 242 dictates to the arab muslims and not the Jews, which is why the arab muslims try to alter its meaning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Anyone who can read English has no difficulty with the diplomatic meaning of "*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*". Putting it in one word: ¡Fuera!
Click to expand...






It seems that you do as it does not say when or which territories it means, that is in the description of the meaning as provided by the authors.

 The most controversial clause in Resolution 242 is the call for the "Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict." This is linked to the second unambiguous clause calling for "termination of all claims or states of belligerency" and the recognition that "every State in the area" has the "right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."

The British Ambassador who drafted the approved resolution, Lord Caradon, declared after the vote: "It is only the resolution that will bind us, and we regard its wording as clear."

This literal interpretation was repeatedly declared to be the correct one by those involved in drafting the resolution. On October 29, 1969, for example, the British Foreign Secretary told the House of Commons the withdrawal envisaged by the resolution would not be from "all the territories." When asked to explain the British position later, Lord Caradon said: "It would have been wrong to demand that Israel return to its positions of June 4, 1967, because those positions
were undesirable and artificial."

Similarly, Amb. Goldberg explained: "The notable omissions-which were not accidental-in regard to withdrawal are the words 'the' or 'all' and 'the June 5, 1967 lines'....the resolution speaks of withdrawal from occupied territories without defining the extent of withdrawal."

The resolutions clearly call on the Arab states to make peace with Israel. The principal condition is that Israel withdraw from "territories occupied" in 1967, which means that Israel must withdraw from some, all, or none of the territories still occupied. Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.


So what conclusion do you draw from the true meaning of 242, as opposed to the islamonazi one you seem to think is the real one ?


The Meaning of UN Security Council Resolution 242 | Jewish Virtual Library


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again.
> 
> This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I have been watching it from afar, but I have been on discussion groups like this since the nineties, and my experience is that if a person defines themselves as British and left of center, pretty much all I have encountered were actively hostile to Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I hope Phoenell reads that link.
> 
> I wanted to ask him what he thinks of Dianne Abbott.
Click to expand...







 She is the worst racist scum and most hated two faced person I have ever come across. She says she is a true socialist and then sends her child to public school because he would mix with white trash in the local secondary modern ones. This video shows her to be the real racist and she has never lived it down


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Phoenall said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
Click to expand...


Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.

I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.

To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.

I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?


----------



## saveliberty

Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?


----------



## Coyote

saveliberty said:


> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?



Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
Click to expand...



There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.


----------



## saveliberty

Boycotts are funny things.  I mean I could boycott broccoli for almost no reason, but gasoline is a toughie.


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
Click to expand...


I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
Click to expand...


You're advocating boycotting the Palestinians?


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're advocating boycotting the Palestinians?
Click to expand...


Why not?  If that is a means to try to create meaningful change - again, it's better than violence.


----------



## Coyote

I'm not sure a boycott against the Palestinians would accomplish much, they simply don't have enough of an economy.  More likely strings attached to aid.


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
Click to expand...

I think you are showing remarkable patience.
Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.

Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.

Its a nonsense.


----------



## Coyote

Tommy Tainant said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> *Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.*
> 
> Its a nonsense.
Click to expand...


That's what makes discussion of anything related to IP extremely difficult - it's like walking through a minefield full of anti-semitic canards from one side and accusations of anti-semitism from the other.


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Coyote said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> *Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.*
> 
> Its a nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what makes discussion of anything related to IP extremely difficult - it's like walking through a minefield full of anti-semitic canards from one side and accusations of anti-semitism from the other.
Click to expand...

It would be imbecilic to claim that it didnt exist and has existed throughout history. But it doesnt put Israel beyond reasonable criticism.


----------



## irosie91

Tommy Tainant said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
Click to expand...


in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.   
Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)


----------



## flacaltenn

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're advocating boycotting the Palestinians?
Click to expand...


Actually IS a boycott of Palestinians.  Has been for almost 10 years..  Called the Gaza Embargo..  Of course they still have a govt of sorts. Mostly murderous sorts..


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> *Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.*
> 
> Its a nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what makes discussion of anything related to IP extremely difficult - it's like walking through a minefield full of anti-semitic canards from one side and accusations of anti-semitism from the other.
Click to expand...


think hard------what sort of persons are likely to endlessly repeat anti-Semitic canards?      I will freely admit that I make
the DIAGNOSIS of  "ANTI SEMITE SYNDROME"  on the basis
of lingo


----------



## Coyote

flacaltenn said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're advocating boycotting the Palestinians?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Actually IS a boycott of Palestinians.  Has been for almost 10 years..  *Called the Gaza Embargo.*.  Of course they still have a govt of sorts. Mostly murderous sorts..
Click to expand...


Forgot about that one.


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> *Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.*
> 
> Its a nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what makes discussion of anything related to IP extremely difficult - it's like walking through a minefield full of anti-semitic canards from one side and accusations of anti-semitism from the other.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> think hard------what sort of persons are likely to endlessly repeat anti-Semitic canards?      I will freely admit that I make
> the DIAGNOSIS of  "ANTI SEMITE SYNDROME"  on the basis
> of lingo
Click to expand...



I think a belief in and deliberate propagation of those canards are a pretty defining symptom of it.


----------



## Tommy Tainant

irosie91 said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
Click to expand...

Um, ok.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> *Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.*
> 
> Its a nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what makes discussion of anything related to IP extremely difficult - it's like walking through a minefield full of anti-semitic canards from one side and accusations of anti-semitism from the other.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> think hard------what sort of persons are likely to endlessly repeat anti-Semitic canards?      I will freely admit that I make
> the DIAGNOSIS of  "ANTI SEMITE SYNDROME"  on the basis
> of lingo
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I think a belief in and deliberate propagation of those canards are a pretty defining symptom of it.
Click to expand...


In correct parlance-----lingo and the expression of canards
is not a  "symptom"     A symptom is a phenomenon reported by the "patient"  and is subjective-----PAIN is a symptom.  
A "sign" is that which is observed by the diagnostician---eg.
a  'rash" -----the use of lingo and canards is constitutes
"signs"   (sorry---but that is how it is).    Of course one could
say that the belief in and propagation of canards constitute
the SIGNS AND SYMPTOMS of the syndrome


----------



## irosie91

Tommy Tainant said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Um, ok.
Click to expand...


good answer.        Kinda like Hillary's    
"I CAN TAKE IT"    ------(from the deplorables)


----------



## Tommy Tainant

irosie91 said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Um, ok.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> good answer.        Kinda like Hillary's
> "I CAN TAKE IT"    ------(from the deplorables)
Click to expand...

Well you sorta stumped me. You accused me of something pretty horrible and then backed it up with some stories from your childhood. Not sure what the correct response is to that.


----------



## irosie91

Tommy Tainant said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Um, ok.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> good answer.        Kinda like Hillary's
> "I CAN TAKE IT"    ------(from the deplorables)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well you sorta stumped me. You accused me of something pretty horrible and then backed it up with some stories from your childhood. Not sure what the correct response is to that.
Click to expand...


oh----"horrible"-----lots of people take that which you are
calling  "horrible"   as simple fact.    It was WRITTEN for
centuries and it is taught to more than a billion people
from early childhood------whether in school  or from "grandma"  
If the best you can do by way of response is   "uh huh"-----
it might be wise to refrain from responding.     I anticipate the
debates with bated breath----I wonder who will say 
"uh huh"    first


----------



## Tommy Tainant

irosie91 said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Um, ok.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> good answer.        Kinda like Hillary's
> "I CAN TAKE IT"    ------(from the deplorables)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well you sorta stumped me. You accused me of something pretty horrible and then backed it up with some stories from your childhood. Not sure what the correct response is to that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> oh----"horrible"-----lots of people take that which you are
> calling  "horrible"   as simple fact.    It was WRITTEN for
> centuries and it is taught to more than a billion people
> from early childhood------whether in school  or from "grandma"
> If the best you can do by way of response is   "uh huh"-----
> it might be wise to refrain from responding.     I anticipate the
> debates with bated breath----I wonder who will say
> "uh huh"    first
Click to expand...

I havent got a clue what you are talking about.


----------



## irosie91

Tommy Tainant said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
> 
> 
> 
> Um, ok.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> good answer.        Kinda like Hillary's
> "I CAN TAKE IT"    ------(from the deplorables)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well you sorta stumped me. You accused me of something pretty horrible and then backed it up with some stories from your childhood. Not sure what the correct response is to that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> oh----"horrible"-----lots of people take that which you are
> calling  "horrible"   as simple fact.    It was WRITTEN for
> centuries and it is taught to more than a billion people
> from early childhood------whether in school  or from "grandma"
> If the best you can do by way of response is   "uh huh"-----
> it might be wise to refrain from responding.     I anticipate the
> debates with bated breath----I wonder who will say
> "uh huh"    first
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I havent got a clue what you are talking about.
Click to expand...


I am not surprised


----------



## saveliberty

I guess that is the problem with discussing Nazis.  You eventually are going to have it tied to Jews.  It derails speaking about the current immigration problem with Muslims.


----------



## Eloy

Phoenall said:


> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> International law requires Israel to get out of Palestine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> "Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
> *(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
> (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> (UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which is not legally enforceable as it is just a set of recommendations. You also need to read the authors side notes that clearly state this means in the goodness of time after a peace treaty has been thrashed out. Why do you always gloss over the next part that tells the arab muslims what they must do. In matter of fact 242 dictates to the arab muslims and not the Jews, which is why the arab muslims try to alter its meaning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Anyone who can read English has no difficulty with the diplomatic meaning of "*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*". Putting it in one word: ¡Fuera!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems that you do as it does not say when or which territories it means, that is in the description of the meaning as provided by the authors.
> 
> The most controversial clause in Resolution 242 is the call for the "Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict." This is linked to the second unambiguous clause calling for "termination of all claims or states of belligerency" and the recognition that "every State in the area" has the "right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> 
> The British Ambassador who drafted the approved resolution, Lord Caradon, declared after the vote: "It is only the resolution that will bind us, and we regard its wording as clear."
> 
> This literal interpretation was repeatedly declared to be the correct one by those involved in drafting the resolution. On October 29, 1969, for example, the British Foreign Secretary told the House of Commons the withdrawal envisaged by the resolution would not be from "all the territories." When asked to explain the British position later, Lord Caradon said: "It would have been wrong to demand that Israel return to its positions of June 4, 1967, because those positions
> were undesirable and artificial."
> 
> Similarly, Amb. Goldberg explained: "The notable omissions-which were not accidental-in regard to withdrawal are the words 'the' or 'all' and 'the June 5, 1967 lines'....the resolution speaks of withdrawal from occupied territories without defining the extent of withdrawal."
> 
> The resolutions clearly call on the Arab states to make peace with Israel. The principal condition is that Israel withdraw from "territories occupied" in 1967, which means that Israel must withdraw from some, all, or none of the territories still occupied. Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.
> 
> 
> So what conclusion do you draw from the true meaning of 242, as opposed to the islamonazi one you seem to think is the real one ?
> 
> 
> The Meaning of UN Security Council Resolution 242 | Jewish Virtual Library
Click to expand...

Forgive me but no amount of verbiage can make the words ""*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*".mean that the Israelis should stay in the occupied territories.


----------



## Tilly

Does anyone have any evidence of BDS success? Israel doesn't seem to be any more demonised or isolated than it was before BDS started. Pals still do their thing, the wall and the Iron Dome are keeping Israelis safer than they used to be, and they are doing fine economically etc. 

I'm with Dershowitz. I think the 'achievements' of the BDS are in fact negatives.


..."Adopting a strong line against the movement’s leadership, Dershowitz argued that “BDS will absolutely not bring peace._ If the BDS movement is desirous of peace, then why will its leaders not debate me_?” Asked about the lack of official representative from the BDS National Committee, Oxford University responded that “it is the Union’s policy never to comment on our invitation process.” The BDS National Committee were unavailable for comment....

In his view, “BDS is not an alternative to war as Tatchell said, but rather *an alternative to negotiations for the Palestinians. The message to the Palestinian cause is clear, you don’t have to negotiate with Israel, you’ll get a state through external intervention.”...*

The JPost


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
Click to expand...







 LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested. 

How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
> 
> 
> 
> "Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
> *(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
> (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> (UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which is not legally enforceable as it is just a set of recommendations. You also need to read the authors side notes that clearly state this means in the goodness of time after a peace treaty has been thrashed out. Why do you always gloss over the next part that tells the arab muslims what they must do. In matter of fact 242 dictates to the arab muslims and not the Jews, which is why the arab muslims try to alter its meaning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Anyone who can read English has no difficulty with the diplomatic meaning of "*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*". Putting it in one word: ¡Fuera!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems that you do as it does not say when or which territories it means, that is in the description of the meaning as provided by the authors.
> 
> The most controversial clause in Resolution 242 is the call for the "Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict." This is linked to the second unambiguous clause calling for "termination of all claims or states of belligerency" and the recognition that "every State in the area" has the "right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> 
> The British Ambassador who drafted the approved resolution, Lord Caradon, declared after the vote: "It is only the resolution that will bind us, and we regard its wording as clear."
> 
> This literal interpretation was repeatedly declared to be the correct one by those involved in drafting the resolution. On October 29, 1969, for example, the British Foreign Secretary told the House of Commons the withdrawal envisaged by the resolution would not be from "all the territories." When asked to explain the British position later, Lord Caradon said: "It would have been wrong to demand that Israel return to its positions of June 4, 1967, because those positions
> were undesirable and artificial."
> 
> Similarly, Amb. Goldberg explained: "The notable omissions-which were not accidental-in regard to withdrawal are the words 'the' or 'all' and 'the June 5, 1967 lines'....the resolution speaks of withdrawal from occupied territories without defining the extent of withdrawal."
> 
> The resolutions clearly call on the Arab states to make peace with Israel. The principal condition is that Israel withdraw from "territories occupied" in 1967, which means that Israel must withdraw from some, all, or none of the territories still occupied. Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.
> 
> 
> So what conclusion do you draw from the true meaning of 242, as opposed to the islamonazi one you seem to think is the real one ?
> 
> 
> The Meaning of UN Security Council Resolution 242 | Jewish Virtual Library
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Forgive me but no amount of verbiage can make the words ""*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*".mean that the Israelis should stay in the occupied territories.
Click to expand...







And no amount of leftist double speak will alter the intended meaning as detailed by the authors of UN res 242. A resolution written before there were any arab muslims calling themselves palestinians so it does not apply to them does it.

 Israel has already done its part under 242 by withdrawing from territories occupied, when are the arab muslims going to do their's by stopping the attacks on Israel with illegal weapons ?


----------



## Phoenall

Tilly said:


> Does anyone have any evidence of BDS success? Israel doesn't seem to be any more demonised or isolated than it was before BDS started. Pals still do their thing, the wall and the Iron Dome are keeping Israelis safer than they used to be, and they are doing fine economically etc.
> 
> I'm with Dershowitz. I think the 'achievements' of the BDS are in fact negatives.
> 
> 
> ..."Adopting a strong line against the movement’s leadership, Dershowitz argued that “BDS will absolutely not bring peace._ If the BDS movement is desirous of peace, then why will its leaders not debate me_?” Asked about the lack of official representative from the BDS National Committee, Oxford University responded that “it is the Union’s policy never to comment on our invitation process.” The BDS National Committee were unavailable for comment....
> 
> In his view, “BDS is not an alternative to war as Tatchell said, but rather *an alternative to negotiations for the Palestinians. The message to the Palestinian cause is clear, you don’t have to negotiate with Israel, you’ll get a state through external intervention.”...*
> 
> The JPost








 They have a state already, it is called Jordan and it is about time the UN told them to give up their pipe dreams and move back home.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
Click to expand...







 And the only change it has brought for the arab muslims is unemployment, poverty, homelessness and deprivation. And not any part of this can be laid at Israel's door as they have done exactly what BDS has demanded and stopped producy=tion in the occupied territory. Even the P.A. has made BDS illegal and punishable by arrest and the usual treatment afterwards


----------



## Phoenall

saveliberty said:


> Boycotts are funny things.  I mean I could boycott broccoli for almost no reason, but gasoline is a toughie.








 Not when Israel invents a new source of fuel that is cheaper based around alcohol. Will this mean the muslims will have to stop everything as the world runs on fuel.


----------



## Mindful

However, former Chief Rabbi Lord Jonathan Sacks added his voice to the complaint that Mr Corbyn appeared to compare the state of Israel to so-called Islamic State (IS), calling it "demonisation of the highest order, an outrage and unacceptable". 

The comments showed "how deep the sickness is in parts of the left of British politics today", he said in a statement.

He said IS was "a terrorist entity whose barbarities have been condemned by all those who value our common humanity. In the current political climate, when hate crimes are rising and political rhetoric is increasingly divisive, this is all the more shocking."



Chief Rabbi condemns 'offensive' Corbyn anti-Semitism comments - BBC News


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
Click to expand...






 Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> I'm not sure a boycott against the Palestinians would accomplish much, they simply don't have enough of an economy.  More likely strings attached to aid.









 And that is why it would hit them harder, what to the U.S. would be less than 1% of its economy would be 100% of the arab muslims economy and could destroy what little nation they have. Stop the aid and the arab countries would just allow them free passage to the west to start terrorist attacks forcing a lifting of the aid embargo. So even more violence will ensue not less, and youi will face what the Jews are facing daily.


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.
> 
> Its a nonsense.
Click to expand...







 Like you ?    who resorts to silly childish name calling when your arguments are shown to be just LIES


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think you are showing remarkable patience.
> Dogmaphobe frames his argument in dishonest terms that seeks to stifle debate.
> 
> *Israel, in his eyes, can do no wrong and to suggest so is to mark you as an anti Semite.*
> 
> Its a nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what makes discussion of anything related to IP extremely difficult - it's like walking through a minefield full of anti-semitic canards from one side and accusations of anti-semitism from the other.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It would be imbecilic to claim that it didnt exist and has existed throughout history. But it doesnt put Israel beyond reasonable criticism.
Click to expand...







 And you have never shown one instance of reasonable critisim of Israel that has not had racism and Jew hatred as its main reason.

 Want to try doing so now ?


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism
Click to expand...


Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.

Some interesting history here.

The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine

PS. Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Phoenall said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
Click to expand...

And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> However, former Chief Rabbi Lord Jonathan Sacks added his voice to the complaint that Mr Corbyn appeared to compare the state of Israel to so-called Islamic State (IS), calling it "demonisation of the highest order, an outrage and unacceptable".
> 
> The comments showed "how deep the sickness is in parts of the left of British politics today", he said in a statement.
> 
> He said IS was "a terrorist entity whose barbarities have been condemned by all those who value our common humanity. In the current political climate, when hate crimes are rising and political rhetoric is increasingly divisive, this is all the more shocking."
> 
> 
> 
> Chief Rabbi condemns 'offensive' Corbyn anti-Semitism comments - BBC News







 Corbyn is a hateful person that will LIE to gain a point over his opponents. His latest stunt to sit on the floor of a half empty train trying to claim the rail networks were letting down passengers was a typical example. He has pledged to plunge the UK into massive debt to pay for his nationalisation and cronieism. In the process he will engineer attacks on the Jews and their supporters using rent a mob and the great unwashed uni lefties. We see it now in Labour heartlands where Jewish homes are now derelict muslim squats. Vibrant integrated Jewish areas and now segregated no go muslim enclaves. All down to the left's rampant anti semitism and Jew hatreds that has risen to the top at the same rate as the neo marxists have taken over. This has led to the nazi's being more openly racist and anti semitic. Maybe the police should arrest Corbyn for his offensive anti semitism and see what the party Grandees do then ?


----------



## Mindful

Tommy Tainant said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
Click to expand...


That's what they all say.


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Mindful said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
Click to expand...

Perhaps because there is no basis to the accusation. 

I know that there is anti Semitism out there. I have seen it, albeit in a mild form. But when I get accused of it for no reason it does make me wonder if it is being exaggerated out of context.
You do more harm than good when you make wild allegations.


----------



## Mindful

Tommy Tainant said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Perhaps because there is no basis to the accusation.
> 
> I know that there is anti Semitism out there. I have seen it, albeit in a mild form. But when I get accused of it for no reason it does make me wonder if it is being exaggerated out of context.
> You do more harm than good when you make wild allegations.
Click to expand...



For no good reason. lmao.

What does your last sentence mean? Some kind of moral judgement?


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Mindful said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Perhaps because there is no basis to the accusation.
> 
> I know that there is anti Semitism out there. I have seen it, albeit in a mild form. But when I get accused of it for no reason it does make me wonder if it is being exaggerated out of context.
> You do more harm than good when you make wild allegations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> For no good reason. lmao.
> 
> What does your last sentence mean? Some kind of moral judgement?
Click to expand...

Its an observation. If I can be accused of anti semitism then it naturally makes you wonder when others are accused of the same.
Its a variant of crying wolf. It gets in the way of real issues.


----------



## Mindful

Tommy Tainant said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> 
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Perhaps because there is no basis to the accusation.
> 
> I know that there is anti Semitism out there. I have seen it, albeit in a mild form. But when I get accused of it for no reason it does make me wonder if it is being exaggerated out of context.
> You do more harm than good when you make wild allegations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> For no good reason. lmao.
> 
> What does your last sentence mean? Some kind of moral judgement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its an observation. If I can be accused of anti semitism then it naturally makes you wonder when others are accused of the same.
> Its a variant of crying wolf. It gets in the way of real issues.
Click to expand...


I don't wonder. I don't need to.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> However, former Chief Rabbi Lord Jonathan Sacks added his voice to the complaint that Mr Corbyn appeared to compare the state of Israel to so-called Islamic State (IS), calling it "demonisation of the highest order, an outrage and unacceptable".
> 
> The comments showed "how deep the sickness is in parts of the left of British politics today", he said in a statement.
> 
> He said IS was "a terrorist entity whose barbarities have been condemned by all those who value our common humanity. In the current political climate, when hate crimes are rising and political rhetoric is increasingly divisive, this is all the more shocking."
> 
> 
> 
> Chief Rabbi condemns 'offensive' Corbyn anti-Semitism comments - BBC News







 Corbyn is a hateful person that will LIE to gain a point over his opponents. His latest stunt to sit on the floor of a half empty train trying to claim the rail networks were letting down passengers was a typical example. He has pledged to plunge the UK into massive debt to pay for his nationalisation and cronieism. In the process he will engineer attacks on the Jews and their supporters using rent a mob and the great unwashed uni lefties. We see it now in Labour heartlands where Jewish homes are now derelict muslim squats. Vibrant integrated Jewish areas and now segregated no go muslim enclaves. All down to the left's rampant anti semitism and Jew hatreds that has risen to the top at the same rate as the neo marxists have taken over. This has led to the nazi's being more openly racist and anti semitic. Maybe the police should arrest Corbyn for his offensive anti semitism and see what the party Grandees do then ?


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> 
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Perhaps because there is no basis to the accusation.
> 
> I know that there is anti Semitism out there. I have seen it, albeit in a mild form. But when I get accused of it for no reason it does make me wonder if it is being exaggerated out of context.
> You do more harm than good when you make wild allegations.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> For no good reason. lmao.
> 
> What does your last sentence mean? Some kind of moral judgement?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Its an observation. If I can be accused of anti semitism then it naturally makes you wonder when others are accused of the same.
> Its a variant of crying wolf. It gets in the way of real issues.
Click to expand...








 So when you lefties were doing it to anyone that opposed the Labour party and its policies of protectionism of child abusers . When you were told to brand anyone that spoke out against islam and the muslims as racists and nazi's it was O.K. But now it is being used against you when you attack the Jews simply because they are Jews and no other reason it is crying wolf. Even in the bad days of Labours rule we told you and your fellow leftists that you were the real fascists, racists and nazi's and pointed to your treatment of hard working Ballerina's as an example. How do you go about justifying the hounding, threats and abuse because she held a different political view to yours.


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> in the future I will point out for you how the nature of your
> posts reveal the fact that you are anti-Semitic.     I am a minor expert-----I grew up in a town that was heavily   WASP----in the true sense of WASP----anglo saxon protestant having been
> of that unfortunate nature since the time that the "united 'states"   was   -----THE COLONIES.     My paternal "ancestors"    resided in London----east end, of course.  If
> you lived in the USA, you would be a typical  anti-Semitic
> WASP.   Even way back when I was a kid ---the PLETHORA of  anti-jewish propaganda that floated around was   "pro-arab" ------long before I knew what an "arab"  is-----or where Syria happens to be-------I understood that the seedy little
> propaganda pamphlets that floated around my town had something to do with Syria and "arabs"     I thought that Syria had lots of Nazis-----but later found out that what Syria had was  escaped Nazi war criminals who were prolific writers.
> Of course I also thought that  Syria was a CHRISTIAN country
> since all the Syrians I knew were Christians with extra lines
> in their crosses    (keep in mind---your literature fell into my hands by the time I was eight years old)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Um, ok.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> good answer.        Kinda like Hillary's
> "I CAN TAKE IT"    ------(from the deplorables)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well you sorta stumped me. You accused me of something pretty horrible and then backed it up with some stories from your childhood. Not sure what the correct response is to that.
Click to expand...







 Accept that you are acting exactly the same way as those people, and that they were openly anti semitic and racist. You are trying to hide behind symantics and failing because the people are better educated than they were in the 1930's


----------



## Phoenall

Eloy said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eloy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's not that clear-cut.
> 
> 
> 
> "Operative Paragraph One "Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
> *(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict; *
> (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgment of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> (UN Security Council Resolution 242 Adopted unanimously half a century ago)
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which is not legally enforceable as it is just a set of recommendations. You also need to read the authors side notes that clearly state this means in the goodness of time after a peace treaty has been thrashed out. Why do you always gloss over the next part that tells the arab muslims what they must do. In matter of fact 242 dictates to the arab muslims and not the Jews, which is why the arab muslims try to alter its meaning
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Anyone who can read English has no difficulty with the diplomatic meaning of "*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*". Putting it in one word: ¡Fuera!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems that you do as it does not say when or which territories it means, that is in the description of the meaning as provided by the authors.
> 
> The most controversial clause in Resolution 242 is the call for the "Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict." This is linked to the second unambiguous clause calling for "termination of all claims or states of belligerency" and the recognition that "every State in the area" has the "right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force."
> 
> The British Ambassador who drafted the approved resolution, Lord Caradon, declared after the vote: "It is only the resolution that will bind us, and we regard its wording as clear."
> 
> This literal interpretation was repeatedly declared to be the correct one by those involved in drafting the resolution. On October 29, 1969, for example, the British Foreign Secretary told the House of Commons the withdrawal envisaged by the resolution would not be from "all the territories." When asked to explain the British position later, Lord Caradon said: "It would have been wrong to demand that Israel return to its positions of June 4, 1967, because those positions
> were undesirable and artificial."
> 
> Similarly, Amb. Goldberg explained: "The notable omissions-which were not accidental-in regard to withdrawal are the words 'the' or 'all' and 'the June 5, 1967 lines'....the resolution speaks of withdrawal from occupied territories without defining the extent of withdrawal."
> 
> The resolutions clearly call on the Arab states to make peace with Israel. The principal condition is that Israel withdraw from "territories occupied" in 1967, which means that Israel must withdraw from some, all, or none of the territories still occupied. Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.
> 
> 
> So what conclusion do you draw from the true meaning of 242, as opposed to the islamonazi one you seem to think is the real one ?
> 
> 
> The Meaning of UN Security Council Resolution 242 | Jewish Virtual Library
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Forgive me but no amount of verbiage can make the words ""*Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied*".mean that the Israelis should stay in the occupied territories.
Click to expand...







The have left under the terms of UN res 242, as it does not stipulate when and which does it. Fully explained by the authors, and still islamonazi's get it wrong.


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
Click to expand...







No it is an example of just what you are a racist moron. All your attacks on the Jews are anti semitism because you have no foundation for them other than what you get from neo marxist, neo nazi or islamic sources.


----------



## Phoenall

Mindful said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is a bit hysterical in comparing events in nazi Germany to an economic boycott of Israeli goods.
> 
> Its very insulting to those who died under the Nazis.
> 
> The thrust seems to be that Israel has done no wrong and that any criticism of Israel is akin to anti semitism.
> 
> That is an outrageous suggestion and one designed to silence all debate.
> 
> It does the Israeli people no service whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
Click to expand...






 Exactly and why he is proving himself to be an anti semite. Just as the racist will say they cant be racist because they have coloured friends...................


----------



## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because the boycott is only on Israeli outlets and not on muslim outlets selling the same goods. This makes it a RACIST ATTACK and hence ANTI SEMITISM.
> 
> If it was truly a boycott of Israeli goods then the muslim shops should be targeted as well. Only a neo marxist neo nazi would not see that as true and welcome the next line of attack on the Jews, just as we saw in 1930's Germany. We have had little " krystalnachts" already along with burning of Torah scrolls and defacing Jewish homes, shops and Synagogues. Dont forget tainted that it was you neo marxists that tried to silence all debate when your political party was in power, and invited extremist muslims to come here and attack British Jews
> 
> 
> WE WILL NEVER FORGET THE LABOUR PARTY THROWING OVER 1 MILLION UNDERAGE SCHOOLGIRLS TO THE MUSLIMS AS SEX SLAVES IN RETURN FOR 500 VOTES.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a nonsense and you know it. In my life time I have boycotted South African and Chilean goods.
> I have also boycotted businesses like Starbucks,Vodafone, Amazon and Sports Direct because of their dubious business model. I used to get my specs from Specsavers until I read about their tax avoidance and I have never bought the Sun or other Murdoch rags.
> 
> I know some on here have claimed to be boycotting Target in the US.
> 
> To me boycotting is a low key and non violent protest.
> 
> I disagree with the way that Israel treats the Palestinians but that does not make me anti-Semitic. How should I express this to meet your satisfaction ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LIAR as you have shown yourself to be a racist nazi and anti semitic. We have all seen the video's of the same people attacking elderly people that then protest about animal cruelty by attacking other elderly people. The video of the man plainly being racist who was asked why he was targeting a Jewish shop when the muslim shop over the road sold the same goods and replied because he was boycotting Jewish goods. It is the same old lefty rent a mob that rely on daddies money to bail them out when they are arrested.
> 
> How do the Israeli's treat the arab muslims then, any differently to how the Welsh treat the English ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And this is a good example of an incoherent and crazed loon. Please show me where I have been anti Semitic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's what they all say.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Perhaps because there is no basis to the accusation.
> 
> I know that there is anti Semitism out there. I have seen it, albeit in a mild form. But when I get accused of it for no reason it does make me wonder if it is being exaggerated out of context.
> You do more harm than good when you make wild allegations.
Click to expand...







 Ever thought that you have been educated to ignore it when you do it, so cant see it and go all librarian when it is pointed out. The usual response of the anti semite


----------



## Mindful

Next......


Who said what.....


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saveliberty said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts are a good approach.  How you doing on fuel oil and gasoline?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
Click to expand...


No, sadly.

Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.

Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.

Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.

Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?

I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Boycotts and peaceful protests are civilized means of creating change.  Beats the hell out of IED's and suicide vests.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
Click to expand...


Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?


----------



## Coyote

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2015/05/campus-politics

*Are calls to boycott Israel anti-Semitic? *

_And student-government councils are increasingly embracing BDS resolutions at “dozens of college campuses across the country,” according to the New York Times. These students join peers on campuses in Canada and Europe, such as Britain, France. This has not resulted in any official changes in college policy, but the debates on campuses rage on, and they rage in circles. Critics of Israeli policy argue that the country denies basic human rights to millions of Palestinians on the West Bank and in Gaza, and sustains its occupation of Arab land with indiscriminate force. Israel’s defenders say that the Palestinians are at least partially to blame for the impasse in the peace process, and they add that the BDS campaign singles out the world’s lone Jewish state for criticism when plenty of other countries, including many of Israel’s Arab neighbours, mete out more flagrant injustices. This selectivity, say BDS critics, smacks of anti-Semitism.

*Both sides are clinging to specious arguments.* Claims that the BDS campaign is somehow misguided because its proponents are not troubled enough over the denial of the vote to 1.3 billion Chinese people or the sad state of women’s rights in Saudi Arabia are doubtful. *There is no duty to fight all injustice in order to fight some. *And it’s no defence of Israel to say that policies are just as bad or worse elsewhere. *BDS supporters are right when they say that criticism of Israel can be delivered without anti-Semitic intent.* If the two are really of a piece, then Ha’aretz, the Israeli daily preferred by Israel's leftist intelligentsia, is a hotbed of Jew hatred.

*That said, calls for boycotts on some campuses have been tainted by clear expressions of anti-Jewish sentiment. *At the University of California, Davis earlier this year, a successful boycott vote was followed by Muslims taunting Jewish students with chants of "allahu-akbar" and painting swastikas on a Jewish fraternity. At UCLA a Jewish student almost lost a seat on the student judicial board over concerns among fellow students that she was perhaps too "active in the Jewish community" to "maintain an unbiased view." 

*The BDS campaign also seems to prefer straw men to realistic positions. Take the demand that Israel retreat to its 1967 borders, before it seized the Sinai, the West Bank and the Golan Heights in a defensive six-day war. BDS fails to address the complexities of such a move.* Hundreds of thousands of Israelis now live beyond this border. Some of these settlers will have to go, but it would be unreasonable to shove everyone out of homes they have lived in for decades. *Advocates of a two-state solution have taken account of this complication with proposals to swap out some land in pre-1967 Israel for equal portions of land on the West Bank. But reasoned compromise is not part of the BDS discourse.*

*The same goes for the campaign’s demand that Israel submit to an unconditional right of return* for descendants of Palestinians who fled or were expelled from their homes in the wake of the war of independence in 1948. Supporters must know that an influx of 5m Palestinians into pre-1967 Israel would put an end to any possibility of Israel continuing to be a Jewish and democratic state. This is the so-called one-state solution, a resolution to the Israeli-Palestinian impasse that is born of fantasy, not of pragmatism.

*This is not to say that the BDS campaign is necessarily anti-Semitic. Opponents of the boycott need to make a better case than that. *But to sanction Israeli companies and universities until Israel agrees to implode is not quite kosher, either. *The boycott movement springs from a noble motive of advocating for a long-suffering underdog*. But the positions BDS pushes are non-starters for Middle East peace negotiations. *They can only inspire resentment and retrenchment, not constructive dialogue, among students on college campuses.*_​


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is nothing either peaceful nor civilized about trying to destroy a tiny country because you hate their ethnicity and because you have joined the campaign of the savages whose only wish in life is to kill them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
Click to expand...


I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think that is why they are engaging in boycotts - it's a means to try and achieve a change in policy - whether right or wrong.  It's certainly far more preferable than violence.  Regardless of what you think about Israel - it isn't exactly black and white.  There are wrongs and injustices on both sides, that need to be resolved.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
Click to expand...


The OP is about what is happening in England.


----------



## Coyote

,,,,


Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism is a means to try and achieve a change in policy, and that has been proven not to work. To the lefties it is a means to engage in their nazism and racism legally until people start invoking laws and using the terminology in their favour. If we find BDS offensive then report the rallies as such to the police, if we see them as racially offensive tell the people taking part that we are reporting them as such. The message will go out very quickly and the racist followers of BDS will start wearing mask's to hide their identities, proving that they are just nazi racists out to attack the Jews. Every one arrested shown to be a political activist for the labour party would be a nail in Labours coffin and eventually an end to neo marxism
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
Click to expand...


The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.


----------



## Mindful

From The Independent. 

More maybe: later.

How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt. Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> ,,,,
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.
Click to expand...


I didn't mean to bring them in, I was dragged into it. So it's not my fault.

You're not entirely blameless.


----------



## Mindful

As I recall: 

There's a new fashion sweeping Europe: to make one’s town or city what we might call ‘Zionistfrei’ — free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves ‘Israel-freezones,’ insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago.”


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> ,,,,
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I didn't mean to bring them in, I was dragged into it. So it's not my fault.
> 
> You're not entirely blameless.
Click to expand...


I'm not saying I 'm not, but you are being somewhat selective in trying to keep this thread on an extremely narrow focus - allowing yourself to respond, but not allowing others.  If the thread begins to get derailed that would be a point of stepping in and redirecting it, but your thread title invites a wider discussion then the Labor Party and anti-semitism in England.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> ,,,,
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I didn't mean to bring them in, I was dragged into it. So it's not my fault.
> 
> You're not entirely blameless.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not saying I 'm not, but you are being somewhat selective in trying to keep this thread on an extremely narrow focus - allowing yourself to respond, but not allowing others.  If the thread begins to get derailed that would be a point of stepping in and redirecting it, but your thread title invites a wider discussion then the Labor Party and anti-semitism in England.
Click to expand...


Whatever you say. You're the boss.

I'm not up to a tutorial in life improvement skills today.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.



I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.

I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> ,,,,
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I didn't mean to bring them in, I was dragged into it. So it's not my fault.
> 
> You're not entirely blameless.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not saying I 'm not, but you are being somewhat selective in trying to keep this thread on an extremely narrow focus - allowing yourself to respond, but not allowing others.  If the thread begins to get derailed that would be a point of stepping in and redirecting it, but your thread title invites a wider discussion then the Labor Party and anti-semitism in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whatever you say. You're the boss.
> 
> I'm not up to a tutorial in life improvement skills today.
Click to expand...

 
I give up with you.  I frankly can't figure out if you are a troll or genuinely interested in discussion 

Have fun with your thread


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Mindful said:


> As I recall:
> 
> There's a new fashion sweeping Europe: to make one’s town or city what we might call ‘Zionistfrei’ — free of the products and culture of the Jewish state. Across the Continent, cities and towns are declaring themselves ‘Israel-freezones,’ insulating their citizens from Israeli produce and culture. It has ugly echoes of what happened 70 years ago.”




 Yep.  Leftist antisemitism is all ABOUT fashion.  It is really little more than a conditioned response where people receive props from their fashionable little peeps if they hate Jews and condemnation if they don't. Of course, as odious creatures like Coyote and Tommy Taint have shown, in order to prop up their self-reinforcing sense of virtuousness, these sniveling things deny their antisemitism just as fiercely as they attack anything related to Jews. At least the right wing Nazis are fairly straight forward about it. The left wing variety that outnumbers them by a hundred to one plays this double-talking game where they justify all manner of atrocities against Jews up to and including their intentional murder, and immediately deny they are antisemitic.


----------



## Mindful

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> ,,,,
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I didn't mean to bring them in, I was dragged into it. So it's not my fault.
> 
> You're not entirely blameless.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm not saying I 'm not, but you are being somewhat selective in trying to keep this thread on an extremely narrow focus - allowing yourself to respond, but not allowing others.  If the thread begins to get derailed that would be a point of stepping in and redirecting it, but your thread title invites a wider discussion then the Labor Party and anti-semitism in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Whatever you say. You're the boss.
> 
> I'm not up to a tutorial in life improvement skills today.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I give up with you.  I frankly can't figure out if you are a troll or genuinely interested in discussion
> 
> Have fun with your thread
Click to expand...


I was wondering the same about you. You seem ....too....fixated.

And I can't get my head round your convoluted arguments. They don't make sense to me.


----------



## Coyote

*Some posts have been moved to the Flame Zone - take the fight there.  Enough disrupting threads upstairs.*


----------



## Dogmaphobe

The True Believer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 This should be required reading for those who wish to understand some of the underpinnings to the phenomenon of leftist antisemitism brought forth in the opening thread.  Without understanding this in terms of social psychology, people will never grasp why people see their hatred as a virtue and why they go to such extreme lengths towards trying to invert the dynamic between those who persecute and those resisting the persecution. Those who RESIST the hatred are the true haters in their Orwellian little world.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2015/05/campus-politics
> 
> *Are calls to boycott Israel anti-Semitic? *
> 
> _And student-government councils are increasingly embracing BDS resolutions at “dozens of college campuses across the country,” according to the New York Times. These students join peers on campuses in Canada and Europe, such as Britain, France. This has not resulted in any official changes in college policy, but the debates on campuses rage on, and they rage in circles. Critics of Israeli policy argue that the country denies basic human rights to millions of Palestinians on the West Bank and in Gaza, and sustains its occupation of Arab land with indiscriminate force. Israel’s defenders say that the Palestinians are at least partially to blame for the impasse in the peace process, and they add that the BDS campaign singles out the world’s lone Jewish state for criticism when plenty of other countries, including many of Israel’s Arab neighbours, mete out more flagrant injustices. This selectivity, say BDS critics, smacks of anti-Semitism.
> 
> *Both sides are clinging to specious arguments.* Claims that the BDS campaign is somehow misguided because its proponents are not troubled enough over the denial of the vote to 1.3 billion Chinese people or the sad state of women’s rights in Saudi Arabia are doubtful. *There is no duty to fight all injustice in order to fight some. *And it’s no defence of Israel to say that policies are just as bad or worse elsewhere. *BDS supporters are right when they say that criticism of Israel can be delivered without anti-Semitic intent.* If the two are really of a piece, then Ha’aretz, the Israeli daily preferred by Israel's leftist intelligentsia, is a hotbed of Jew hatred.
> 
> *That said, calls for boycotts on some campuses have been tainted by clear expressions of anti-Jewish sentiment. *At the University of California, Davis earlier this year, a successful boycott vote was followed by Muslims taunting Jewish students with chants of "allahu-akbar" and painting swastikas on a Jewish fraternity. At UCLA a Jewish student almost lost a seat on the student judicial board over concerns among fellow students that she was perhaps too "active in the Jewish community" to "maintain an unbiased view."
> 
> *The BDS campaign also seems to prefer straw men to realistic positions. Take the demand that Israel retreat to its 1967 borders, before it seized the Sinai, the West Bank and the Golan Heights in a defensive six-day war. BDS fails to address the complexities of such a move.* Hundreds of thousands of Israelis now live beyond this border. Some of these settlers will have to go, but it would be unreasonable to shove everyone out of homes they have lived in for decades. *Advocates of a two-state solution have taken account of this complication with proposals to swap out some land in pre-1967 Israel for equal portions of land on the West Bank. But reasoned compromise is not part of the BDS discourse.*
> 
> *The same goes for the campaign’s demand that Israel submit to an unconditional right of return* for descendants of Palestinians who fled or were expelled from their homes in the wake of the war of independence in 1948. Supporters must know that an influx of 5m Palestinians into pre-1967 Israel would put an end to any possibility of Israel continuing to be a Jewish and democratic state. This is the so-called one-state solution, a resolution to the Israeli-Palestinian impasse that is born of fantasy, not of pragmatism.
> 
> *This is not to say that the BDS campaign is necessarily anti-Semitic. Opponents of the boycott need to make a better case than that. *But to sanction Israeli companies and universities until Israel agrees to implode is not quite kosher, either. *The boycott movement springs from a noble motive of advocating for a long-suffering underdog*. But the positions BDS pushes are non-starters for Middle East peace negotiations. *They can only inspire resentment and retrenchment, not constructive dialogue, among students on college campuses.*_​









Not if they are justified by truth and reality, but while the Israeli's are under attack for just protecting themselves from arab muslim violence the Boycott is another form of that terrorism. Are the arab muslims justified in targeting children with illegal weapons branded war crimes, or are they guilty of what the Jew haters claim the Israeli's are. Lets say the Jew haters win and Israel collapses where will the Jews go that is safe for them in the future, because the Jew haters will take strength from that victory and hound them to extinction. Then what will the world rally round the Jews and see too late that the blame lay with the arab muslims all along and start a boycott of arab muslims goods that would amount to nothing. The heavily armed islamic nations would attack the west and hope that the west is too weak to fight to win. Not just to fight until they have had enough but to fight to utterly destroy their opponents.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> ,,,,
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Terrorism against Jews was going on long before the State of Israel.
> 
> Some interesting history here.
> 
> The Myth of Moslem-Jewish coexistence in Palestine
> 
> PS. *Do you see any similar outrage directed to the latest onslaught on Aleppo?*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, sadly.
> 
> Nor at the violence in the Ukraine.
> 
> Nor the upsurge in violence in the Congo.
> 
> Nor the human rights violations against the Rohinga.
> 
> Seems there are those who's only interest is in the IP conflict.  And that includes opponents and proponents.  Outrage against Israel's actions, outrage against Palestinian actions and a complete ignoring when the same thing happens elsewhere.  Is that anti-semitism?  Then what it is it when Team Israel criticizes the Palestinians and ignores the same things happening elsewhere?
> 
> I think the anti-semitism label can become a tactic to avoid difficult conversations - like the racist label.  It absolutely exists, but it gets overused.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do you think Jeremy Corbyn is an anti Semite?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't know - I need to read more about him, I'm not that familiar with British politicians and I've not paid attention to the postings about him.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The OP is about what is happening in England.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The title states anti-semitism in rising in Europe.  You've also brought in Middle East elements.  Talking about antisemitism in Europe doesn't require close knowledge of specific politicians.  Antisemitism is cultural.
Click to expand...







 As well as being political, nationalistic and collective punishment of minorities. All things you decry when allegedly done by Jews to muslims.


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
Click to expand...







 And in every instance of these areas free of Israel you find left wing governments rallying the neo marxists to band together and force the Jews out. As I asked where will the Jews go if the neo marxists/islamonazi's win. Where will they be safe from harm, violence, ethnic cleansing and genocide. Who will have the gonads to welcome them in and then face the hatred of the rest of the world. Are you willing to stand by and watch 12 million Jews be mass murdered because you supported one aspect of Jew hatred that appealed to your sensibilities. No doubt you would cry out that you did not mean for this to happen and that you wish you could turn the clock back. Then you would see that the blame lies with the arab muslims and their religion telling them they own the world.


----------



## Tilly

Phoenall said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for the new word---I had guessed that a  TU QUO QUO--is a little fluffy dress worn by ballerinas
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again.
> 
> This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I have been watching it from afar, but I have been on discussion groups like this since the nineties, and my experience is that if a person defines themselves as British and left of center, pretty much all I have encountered were actively hostile to Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I hope Phoenell reads that link.
> 
> I wanted to ask him what he thinks of Dianne Abbott.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She is the worst racist scum and most hated two faced person I have ever come across. She says she is a true socialist and then sends her child to public school because he would mix with white trash in the local secondary modern ones. This video shows her to be the real racist and she has never lived it down
Click to expand...

She is such a freaking patronising, racist weirdo.


----------



## Mindful

Tilly said:


> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> I would wear a little fluffy dress every single day if that was what it took to make the left liberal again.
> 
> This new Nazi left disturbs me to no end.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I have been watching it from afar, but I have been on discussion groups like this since the nineties, and my experience is that if a person defines themselves as British and left of center, pretty much all I have encountered were actively hostile to Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I hope Phoenell reads that link.
> 
> I wanted to ask him what he thinks of Dianne Abbott.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She is the worst racist scum and most hated two faced person I have ever come across. She says she is a true socialist and then sends her child to public school because he would mix with white trash in the local secondary modern ones. This video shows her to be the real racist and she has never lived it down
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> She is such freaking patronising, racist weirdo.
Click to expand...


I haven't seen much of her lately.

Jeremy's always surrounded by flower power people.


----------



## Tilly

Mindful said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Phoenall said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ruth Smeeth: 'I've never seen anti-Semitism in Labour like this'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have been watching it from afar, but I have been on discussion groups like this since the nineties, and my experience is that if a person defines themselves as British and left of center, pretty much all I have encountered were actively hostile to Jews.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> I hope Phoenell reads that link.
> 
> I wanted to ask him what he thinks of Dianne Abbott.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She is the worst racist scum and most hated two faced person I have ever come across. She says she is a true socialist and then sends her child to public school because he would mix with white trash in the local secondary modern ones. This video shows her to be the real racist and she has never lived it down
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> She is such freaking patronising, racist weirdo.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I haven't seen much of her lately.
> 
> Jeremy's always surrounded by flower power people.
Click to expand...

She has several jobs in what barely passes for a shadow cabinet, but haven't seen much of her lately.  I wonder if Jeremy and Diane have rekindled their romance?


----------



## Tilly

Dogmaphobe said:


> The True Believer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> This should be required reading for those who wish to understand some of the underpinnings to the phenomenon of leftist antisemitism brought forth in the opening thread.  Without understanding this in terms of social psychology, people will never grasp why people see their hatred as a virtue and why they go to such extreme lengths towards trying to invert the dynamic between those who persecute and those resisting the persecution. Those who RESIST the hatred are the true haters in their Orwellian little world.



"...A variety of what Hoffer terms "misfits" are also found in mass movements. Examples include "chronically bored," the physically disabled or perpetually ill, the talentless, and criminals or "sinners." In all cases, Hoffer argues, these people feel as if their individual lives are meaningless and worthless.[7]..."

Hmmm. Interesting


----------



## Tilly

It's not going away:

*Jeremy Corbyn hit with formal anti-Semitism complaint ahead of Labour leadership election result*
"...
The CAA has written to deputy leader Tom Watson urging him to raise the issue with Labour’s ruling national executive committee.

The letter accuses Mr Corbyn of “committing acts that are grossly detrimental to the party, namely characterising Jewish people as dissembling and dishonest in their reporting of anti-Semitism, and by using the influence and prestige of his office to disseminate and normalise that lie”.

It goes on to list a series of incidents where it says Mr Corbyn and his supporters dismissed allegations of anti-Semitism..."

Jeremy Corbyn hit with formal anti-Semitism complaint ahead of Labour conference


----------



## Tilly

Seriously? Lol

*Labour MP Naz Shah says did not recognise 'anti-Semitism as racism' in Facebook outburst*
*Bradford West MP was suspended after she said Jews should be removed from Israel and moved to the US.*






By Lewis DeanJuly 18, 2016 14:43 BST
 



Embed Feed
In a related video: John McDonnell says he wants to restore the reputation of the Labour Party amid an anti-Semitism rowIBTimes UK
Recently reinstated Labour MP Naz Shah has said that she didn't understand anti-Semitism was a form of racism when she compared Israel with Nazi Germany, and said that Jews there should be removed and sent to the US.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/labour-mp-...nti-semitism-racism-facebook-outburst-1571212


----------



## Dogmaphobe

Coyote said:


> Antisemitism is cultural.




Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.

 As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.


----------



## Ravi

Arc.


----------



## irosie91

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
Click to expand...


SO TRUE----FASHION-----when I was a kid-----the FASHION was--------"""western colonialism as the root of ALL EVIL----from acne to hemorrhoids........"


----------



## Coyote

Dogmaphobe said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
Click to expand...


I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.

I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.

I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.

I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.

But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.

Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.


----------



## irosie91

anti-Semitism is a necessary and invariable element of two specific religions----Christianity and Islam.   The scriptural writings of both------endorse it


----------



## Coyote

irosie91 said:


> anti-Semitism is a necessary and invariable element of two specific religions----Christianity and Islam.   The scriptural writings of both------endorse it



But they also repudiate it.

Ah it's full of contradictions.


----------



## irosie91

Coyote said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> anti-Semitism is a necessary and invariable element of two specific religions----Christianity and Islam.   The scriptural writings of both------endorse it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But they also repudiate it.
> 
> Ah it's full of contradictions.
Click to expand...


you are very confused.    Nowhere does either the  "new testament"  or the "koran"   repudiate anti-Semitism.    Both
are dull books-----but it is a good idea to try to plough thru


----------



## Tilly

Interesting article that goes some way to explain how disparate social justice groups manage to ignore reality and facts in order to unite in their support of wildly antithetical causes so they can all hate on Israel - the collective Jew.

*Intersectionality’ and the Bizarre World of Hating Israel*
*Bogus new linkages blame Jewish state for basically everything*
By Ziva Dahl • 03/15/16 12:15pm







A demonstrator holds a Palestinian flag. (Photo: Filippo Monteforte/AFP/Getty Images)

Have you heard of “intersectionality,” the latest strategy of Israel-haters who, like Alice in Lewis Carroll’s classic, reside in a “looking-glass world,” where clocks run backwards, language is nonsensical and everything is topsy-turvy?

Have you wondered why Black Lives Matter activists carry signs “Justice From Ferguson to Palestine,” seeking to link claims of American racism and police violence with claims of Israeli brutality against Palestinians?


*How about the National Women’s Studies Association endorsing a boycott of Israel to condemn the “sexual and gender-based violence perpetrated [by Israel] against Palestinians,” making a fictitious claim about the only Middle Eastern country with full gender equality and ignoring repression of women’s rights in Palestinian society?*

Jewish Voice for Peace, a rabidly anti-Israel organization, links the Palestinian issue to “the struggles of students of color, student survivors of sexual assault, and all others who on campus fight against oppression, whether imperialism, racism, patriarchy, police violence, or other systemic inequities.”

_At Columbia University, Students for Justice in Palestine and No Red Tape, a student group fighting sexual violence, join forces. What does opposing sexual violence have to do with Israel and the Palestinians?_

At Vassar, Africana Studies offers course AFRS 383, “Transnational Solidarities: Palestinian Struggle for Self-Determination/Black Struggle for Liberation” and Jasbir Puar, a Rutgers Gender/Queer Studies professor, delivers a diatribe accusing Israel of harvesting Palestinian organs for research, experimenting on Palestinian children and targeting Palestinians for “stunting” and “maiming.”

*Welcome to the world of “intersectionality,” inhabited by Israel-haters on college campuses and elsewhere. ...*

‘Intersectionality’ and the Bizarre World of Hating Israel


----------



## Tilly

More from:

*Intersectionality’ and the Bizarre World of Hating Israel*
*Bogus new linkages blame Jewish state for basically everything*
By Ziva Dahl • 03/15/16 12:15pm


....The anti-Israel BDS campaigns have successfully injected the Palestinians into this intersectional mix as victims of colonialist oppression by pro-Western Israel. The marriage of intersectionality with the Arab-Israeli conflict allows any victim group to make common cause with the Palestinians. The Palestinian struggle is linked to other “social justice” causes, no matter how disparate, in an aggressive strategy to attract supporters and speak with one unified voice....


*....Solidarity with other supposedly “oppressed” groups compels the intersectionalist to adopt positions unrelated or even diametrically opposed to one’s cause, leading to coalitions, in this upside-down “looking-glass world,” with those actively hostile to one’s agenda.*

This explains why, in January, the National LGBTQ Task Force initially chose to ally itself with Palestinians who execute gays, rather than with Israel, the sole Middle Eastern country that protects the rights of the LGBTQ community. And why women’s rights groups champion Palestinian society, where honor killings and violence against women are commonplace. To such “identity” groups, Palestinians are noble people of color struggling against “Western imperialistic injustices.” Treating women as chattel, beating or killing gays or discriminating against blacks are merely inconvenient facts that emanate from Western colonialism. A passion for the “virtuous” Palestinians reigns supreme and all manner of Palestinian behavior is morally justified in the Israel-hater “looking-glass world.”

In the “jabberwocky” of multicultural victimhood, Western, white, wealthy, cis-male and Israel (the collective Jew) are inherently evil, while third-world people of color, women, LGBTQ and Palestinians are automatically good. Alice would be right at home here. Today, to the sanctimonious social justice warrior, Jews are part of the oppressor class. On college campuses, Jewish students are stereotyped “white privileged,” while Palestinians are glorified as innocent “non-white” victims.  And genuine historical Jewish support for the rights of minorities is now being questioned....

‘Intersectionality’ and the Bizarre World of Hating Israel


----------



## Tilly

And blatant anti semitism on campuses:

*Intersectionality’ and the Bizarre World of Hating Israel*
*Bogus new linkages blame Jewish state for basically everything*
By Ziva Dahl • 03/15/16 12:15pm
.....
Jewish students involved in campus leadership are accused of “dual loyalty.” In *2015, Stanford University’s Students of Color Coalition refused to endorse senate candidate Molly Horwitz because they felt that her Judaism would impact her vote on divestment issues. The UCLA student Judicial Board asked Rachel Beyda, “Given that you are a Jewish student… how do you see yourself being able to maintain an unbiased view?”  Ms. Beyda was initially denied a position due to her Jewish faith.*

With the advent of “intersectionality,” Jewish students must pass an Israel litmus test to prove their commitment to social justice. Jewish students are being marginalized on campuses, many feeling the need to hide their pro-Israel and Jewish identities to “get along” in this hostile environment. University of Missouri sophomore Michael Stephenson, a social justice advocate, commented, “I don’t know where I belong…. It’s hard to be a Jewish student and support these [anti-racism] groups when harsh criticism of Israel sometimes turns into criticism of the Jews.”

In _Through the Looking-Glass, _Alice climbs through a mirror into a world of contradictions and illogical word play, where normal rules don’t prevail, where everything is backward, where animals and flowers talk, chess pieces come to life, a world not quite right. Alice finally wakes up and the reader ponders the blurring of boundaries between reality and fantasy. I wonder, will the Israel-haters eventually wake up from the fantasy of intersectionality, their obsession with victimization, the idolization of Palestinians and the demonization of Israelis?

_Ziva Dahl is a fellow with the Haym Salomon Center. She has a Master of Arts degree in public law and government from Columbia University and an A.B. in political science from Vassar College

‘Intersectionality’ and the Bizarre World of Hating Israel
_


----------



## Phoenall

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.
> 
> I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.
> 
> But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.
> 
> Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.
Click to expand...








 The US was just as anti semitic as Europe was if you look at the facts. The US government knew all about the treatment of the Jews as far back as the mid 1930's and refused all but the rich the right to migrate. So much so the canard was send us your unwanted as long as they are not Jews. This is why so many ended up mass murdered in the camps of Eastern Europe because they had nowhere to go. The US decided that granting them a small plot of land in the M.E. was enough, and saw that it was just like the deal done with the first nations. The right see the muslims the same way the US saw the Japanese during WW2, and cant understand their cultural differences when it comes to war and violence. Could you see yourself teaching your child to slit the throat of a man by having them slit the throats of goats and sheep under the pretext of it being a religious obligation


----------



## Mindful

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.
> 
> I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.
> 
> But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.
> 
> Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The US was just as anti semitic as Europe was if you look at the facts. The US government knew all about the treatment of the Jews as far back as the mid 1930's and refused all but the rich the right to migrate. So much so the canard was send us your unwanted as long as they are not Jews. This is why so many ended up mass murdered in the camps of Eastern Europe because they had nowhere to go. The US decided that granting them a small plot of land in the M.E. was enough, and saw that it was just like the deal done with the first nations. The right see the muslims the same way the US saw the Japanese during WW2, and cant understand their cultural differences when it comes to war and violence. Could you see yourself teaching your child to slit the throat of a man by having them slit the throats of goats and sheep under the pretext of it being a religious obligation
Click to expand...


Watch the video, lower down on the page. 

Corbyn campaign video dismissing antisemitism accusations is withdrawn | The Jewish Chronicle


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Coyote said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
Click to expand...

The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.


----------



## Mindful

Tommy Tainant said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
Click to expand...


More flamboyant nonsense.


----------



## Tommy Tainant

Mindful said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More flamboyant nonsense.
Click to expand...

Which part ?


----------



## Mindful

Tommy Tainant said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More flamboyant nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Which part ?
Click to expand...


Are you prevaricating again?


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More flamboyant nonsense.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Which part ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Are you prevaricating again?
Click to expand...


Mr Tain..   Is doing his best----he is parroting islamo-nazi propaganda.     His premise is that opposition to islamo
Nazi  terrorism is----ITSELF   a Nazi cause.     The jailing of
persons involved is exactly the same as internment of populations of the meek and mild in Auschwitz


----------



## Mindful

So Jeremy won.


----------



## Mindful

Dianne; spouting off.


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> Dianne; spouting off.



I would appreciate surnames.   ----------uhm-----are you in London?


----------



## Mindful

irosie91 said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dianne; spouting off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would appreciate surnames.   ----------uhm-----are you in London?
Click to expand...


Sorry. Dianne Abbott, Corbyn's muse.

No, I'm not in London right now.


----------



## irosie91

Mindful said:


> irosie91 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dianne; spouting off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would appreciate surnames.   ----------uhm-----are you in London?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry. Dianne Abbott, Corbyn's muse.
> 
> No, I'm not in London right now.
Click to expand...


thanks


----------



## Drummond

Mindful said:


> So Jeremy won.



... yep. Jeremy won ... convincingly so, too.

I hope he enjoys the victory, and savours it. He should. He'll be earning a famine of them, as of now. 

You really have to 'admire' the Labour Party's utter determination to keep itself in the political wilderness. A Corbyn win is a gift to the Conservatives. We will most definitely see an equivalent of the Michael Foot days, back in the Eighties, where infighting made Labour unelectable back then.

As for Corbyn .. he's a con artist. He's happy to have it perceived by those not old enough to know differently, that his approach is a 'new' or 'fresh' one. In fact, it's anything BUT ... all he offers are the bad old days before Labour moderated itself and became electable, post-Foot. Essentially the same older policies. Undoubtedly a display of an old-style Leftie who wants Labour to forget all the lessons it SHOULD have learned, and force Labour to become its older and useless self. 

Well .. I'm no Leftie, and I for one am delighted that Labour is so firmly set upon its destructive path. Let them remain unelectable for a generation ... or more.* In fact, let's see Labour fracture and disintegrate, once and for all !!*


----------



## Maggdy

Coyote said:


> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.
> 
> I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.
> 
> But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.
> 
> Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.
Click to expand...


BUT this the idealism is not profitable. This is still causing property damage.
An example: 
"A house which looks like Adolf Hitler has been put up to let – and you can move into the Fuhrer for rent flat for just £85 a week.
The notorious ‘Hitler House’ is a tourist attraction because its sloping roof looks like the Nazi leader’s side-parting hair and front door lintel like his toothbrush moustache.
Retired university worker Clive Davies, 70, reckons it is a snip at £85 a week – even with the Hitler lookalike reputation."
Source: House that looks like Hitler is up for rent


----------



## Mindful

Drummond said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> So Jeremy won.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... yep. Jeremy won ... convincingly so, too.
> 
> I hope he enjoys the victory, and savours it. He should. He'll be earning a famine of them, as of now.
> 
> You really have to 'admire' the Labour Party's utter determination to keep itself in the political wilderness. A Corbyn win is a gift to the Conservatives. We will most definitely see an equivalent of the Michael Foot days, back in the Eighties, where infighting made Labour unelectable back then.
> 
> As for Corbyn .. he's a con artist. He's happy to have it perceived by those not old enough to know differently, that his approach is a 'new' or 'fresh' one. In fact, it's anything BUT ... all he offers are the bad old days before Labour moderated itself and became electable, post-Foot. Essentially the same older policies. Undoubtedly a display of an old-style Leftie who wants Labour to forget all the lessons it SHOULD have learned, and force Labour to become its older and useless self.
> 
> Well .. I'm no Leftie, and I for one am delighted that Labour is so firmly set upon its destructive path. Let them remain unelectable for a generation ... or more.* In fact, let's see Labour fracture and disintegrate, once and for all !!*
Click to expand...


I'd like to see a decent and robust opposition party.


----------



## Mindful

I think McDonnel is the evil guy.

Kudos to Alastair Campbell for taking him on.


----------



## Mindful

Maggdy said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.
> 
> I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.
> 
> But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.
> 
> Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> BUT this the idealism is not profitable. This is still causing property damage.
> An example:
> "A house which looks like Adolf Hitler has been put up to let – and you can move into the Fuhrer for rent flat for just £85 a week.
> The notorious ‘Hitler House’ is a tourist attraction because its sloping roof looks like the Nazi leader’s side-parting hair and front door lintel like his toothbrush moustache.
> Retired university worker Clive Davies, 70, reckons it is a snip at £85 a week – even with the Hitler lookalike reputation."
> Source: House that looks like Hitler is up for rent
> View attachment 90884
Click to expand...


That's ages old news.


----------



## Maggdy

Mindful said:


> Maggdy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.
> 
> I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.
> 
> But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.
> 
> Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> BUT this the idealism is not profitable. This is still causing property damage.
> An example:
> "A house which looks like Adolf Hitler has been put up to let – and you can move into the Fuhrer for rent flat for just £85 a week.
> The notorious ‘Hitler House’ is a tourist attraction because its sloping roof looks like the Nazi leader’s side-parting hair and front door lintel like his toothbrush moustache.
> Retired university worker Clive Davies, 70, reckons it is a snip at £85 a week – even with the Hitler lookalike reputation."
> Source: House that looks like Hitler is up for rent
> View attachment 90884
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> That's ages old news.
Click to expand...


There is a young rumor that refutes this?


----------



## Coyote

Phoenall said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dogmaphobe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> Antisemitism is cultural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not necessarily.  Since the traditional antisemitic canards rely on spinning Jews as rich and powerful, manipulative and sneaky, and with undue power over others, it appeals to worthless individuals of all stripes looking for a convenient scapegoat for all their own shortcomings.  The disgruntled, the paranoid schizophrenics, those suffering from a Joan of Ark complex -- all concentrate their attention on Jews as there is already such a ready-made wealth of material out there for them to utilize.
> 
> As far as culture is concerned, it is often less a matter of culture than a mere PART of the culture. Leftists are increasingly hostile to Jews because it is fashionable and they are seeking approval from other leftists. The United states, as a whole, is not antisemitic, but levels of antisemitism run very high in the black community, fast increasing portions of the left, and a small vestige of the paleocon and white supremacist portion of the right.  Since Europe is dominated by leftist politics, the levels of antisemitism run much higher.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't think it's as simple as "fashionable" but I actually agree with parts of what you say.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is cultural in large part.  It's taught and passed on in a culture.  That's why it has never completely disappeared.
> 
> I think anti-semitism is one component of a broader need to scapegoat and scapegoats will always be whatever relatively powerless minority exists.  In addition, a minority that is seen to be insular, and outside of the mainstream culture, will be even more likely to be scapegoated.  I don't see it as a left vs right situation.  What I see as different is that it has always been the provenance of the right before, and now we are seeing it also in the left.  The right is cloaking it in anti-Muslim rhetoric but the followers still spout the same old canards.
> 
> I think the fact that levels of anti-semitism are much higher in Europe is not because of leftist politics but because of history.  Europe has had a strongly entrenched history of antisemitism - that resulted in expulsions, pogroms, lack of rights and forced conversions of non-Christians, in particular Jews.  The US, Canada, Australia - while it's had anti-senmitism, never had that history.  WW2 after all, was European.
> 
> But I agree it is a part of the culture - an ugly part, that is kept largely out of sight until stresses give it strength and voice.
> 
> Scapegoating a religious, ethnic or racial group is unfortunately very human.  They are viewed as "outside" and when nationaism rises - outsiders suffer.  It doesn't matter what group it is...it's wrong, dangerous and tragic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * The US was just as anti semitic as Europe was if you look at the facts. The US government knew all about the treatment of the Jews as far back as the mid 1930's and refused all but the rich the right to migrate. So much so the canard was send us your unwanted as long as they are not Jews. *This is why so many ended up mass murdered in the camps of Eastern Europe because they had nowhere to go. The US decided that granting them a small plot of land in the M.E. was enough, and saw that it was just like the deal done with the first nations. The right see the muslims the same way the US saw the Japanese during WW2, and cant understand their cultural differences when it comes to war and violence. Could you see yourself teaching your child to slit the throat of a man by having them slit the throats of goats and sheep under the pretext of it being a religious obligation
Click to expand...


I agree, the US was very antisemitic and it is a huge huge shame on our nation that we turned away Jewish refugees. But we didn't set up concentration camps, and we didn't kill them in gas chambers.  We were "isolationist", didn't want to get involved, and they were "Jews", with all that implied in the antisemitic rhetoric of the time.  Opponents (on both the right and left) claimed Nazi and Commie infiltrators would sneak in with them and we couldn't afford the risk.  And anyway they were "Jews".   How many might not have died if we had taken in more refugees?  That, and the internment of innocent American citizens will be an everlasting badge of shame for that era in our history.  Even the US Jewish community turned away from them at first.  For one, because American Jews kept their heads down, did not want to cause trouble or do anything to attract attention on themselves, and secondly - many of the refugees were East European - people considered backwards, dirty, uneducated, superstitous and impoverished.  Very different culturally from American Jews.  It wasn't until after we turned away the St. Louis, and sent people back to a certain death that the American Jewish community began to speak out in force to influence politicians.  

This is something we should always remember doing, and never do it again.  But I doubt that will happen.


----------



## Coyote

Tommy Tainant said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
Click to expand...


Of course they will - going after Muslims simply gives them political legitimacy.  It hasn't changed any of their underlying anti-semitism.

I also am not sure that many Jews are really falling for it.  But in some countries, like France, where Jews have been targeted by Muslim antisemitism in attacks, there is probably a lot of fear and uncertainty and any party that can promise and promote security is going to be considered carefully.  Of course, it's easy to forget that when Muslim extremists targeted Jews in a grocery store, it was a Muslim worker there that hid them.  Rhetoric makes non distinctions.


----------



## Coyote

Mindful said:


> Tommy Tainant said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More flamboyant nonsense.
Click to expand...


I don't think so.  

This is a long article, but it is very enlightening - taking a hard look at the interaction of rightwing antisemitism, Islamic antisemitism, and leftwing antisemitism.  It makes some really good points particularly for those who thinks it's only the left or the right or the Muslims.

Is It Time for the Jews to Leave Europe?


----------



## Mindful

*Israel  fumes over Norwegian theater boycott video*

*Artists release clip falsely claiming to be by Norway’s National Theater, in which it says it’s terminating cooperation with its Israeli counterpart over ‘apartheid’.*

Israel fumes over Norwegian theater boycott video


----------



## Maggdy

Mindful said:


> *Israel  fumes over Norwegian theater boycott video*
> 
> *Artists release clip falsely claiming to be by Norway’s National Theater, in which it says it’s terminating cooperation with its Israeli counterpart over ‘apartheid’.*
> 
> Israel fumes over Norwegian theater boycott video



They want to go per falsehood way is to the finish?  For who this is good? Who loves that, when are cheated? Pitiable team.
"Norwegian news site Vartoland said Roll and fellow actor Marius von der Fehr were behind the film, which expressed their opinion. Roll said their intention was to trick people into thinking the statement was made by the theater."


----------



## Tilly

Mindful said:


> I think McDonnel is the evil guy.
> 
> Kudos to Alastair Campbell for taking him on.


Yes. Did you watch that? Apparently they almost came to blows afterwards. Lol.


----------



## Mindful

Tilly said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think McDonnel is the evil guy.
> 
> Kudos to Alastair Campbell for taking him on.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes. Did you watch that? Apparently they almost came to blows afterwards. Lol.
Click to expand...


Yes I did.


----------



## Tilly

*Lord Mitchell quits Labour over Jeremy Corbyn’s ‘lukewarm approach to anti-semitism*
*JEREMY Corbyn today faced fresh accusations of tolerating anti-semitism after he rejected criticism from a senior Jewish peer who quit the party.*
By ALISON LITTLE
PUBLISHED: 14:36, Sun, Sep 25, 2016 | UPDATED: 15:04, Sun, Sep 25, 2016







GETTY

Lord Mitchell quits Labour party over Jeremy Corbyn's 'lukewarm' approach to anti-semitism
Lord Mitchell said he was leaving largely because of anti-semitism in Labour which Mr Corbyn was "lukewarm" about tackling....

....Karen Pollock, chief executive of the Holocaust Educational Trust, commented furiously on her personal Twitter account: "I just find astonishing. A Jew says it's hard being a Jew & supporter of Israel in the party. He's told 'he' needs to reflect..."

...
He [Lord Mitchel] added: "I'm Jewish and I'm very strongly Jewish and I make no bones about it, and there's no doubt in my mind that Jeremy himself is very lukewarm on this subject.

"He's never been as vociferous in condemning anti-Semitism as he should be, and when he does make a mention of it he combines it with other forms of racism, so he will never say specifically as far as anti-Semitism is concerned.

"But even more than that, he surrounds himself with a coterie of people who hold violent, violent anti-Israel views and allied with it they are very hostile to Jews so, in my view, they're pretty bad guys."

"I think it's very difficult if you are Jewish and you support Israel to be a member of the Labour Party."

Lord Mitchell quits Labour over Jeremy Corbyn’s ‘lukewarm approach to anti-semitism


----------



## Mindful

Tilly said:


> *Lord Mitchell quits Labour over Jeremy Corbyn’s ‘lukewarm approach to anti-semitism*
> *JEREMY Corbyn today faced fresh accusations of tolerating anti-semitism after he rejected criticism from a senior Jewish peer who quit the party.*
> By ALISON LITTLE
> PUBLISHED: 14:36, Sun, Sep 25, 2016 | UPDATED: 15:04, Sun, Sep 25, 2016
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GETTY
> 
> Lord Mitchell quits Labour party over Jeremy Corbyn's 'lukewarm' approach to anti-semitism
> Lord Mitchell said he was leaving largely because of anti-semitism in Labour which Mr Corbyn was "lukewarm" about tackling....
> 
> ....Karen Pollock, chief executive of the Holocaust Educational Trust, commented furiously on her personal Twitter account: "I just find astonishing. A Jew says it's hard being a Jew & supporter of Israel in the party. He's told 'he' needs to reflect..."
> 
> ...
> He [Lord Mitchel] added: "I'm Jewish and I'm very strongly Jewish and I make no bones about it, and there's no doubt in my mind that Jeremy himself is very lukewarm on this subject.
> 
> "He's never been as vociferous in condemning anti-Semitism as he should be, and when he does make a mention of it he combines it with other forms of racism, so he will never say specifically as far as anti-Semitism is concerned.
> 
> "But even more than that, he surrounds himself with a coterie of people who hold violent, violent anti-Israel views and allied with it they are very hostile to Jews so, in my view, they're pretty bad guys."
> 
> "I think it's very difficult if you are Jewish and you support Israel to be a member of the Labour Party."
> 
> Lord Mitchell quits Labour over Jeremy Corbyn’s ‘lukewarm approach to anti-semitism



I watched him today. I didn't realise he was Jewish.


----------



## Mindful

Anyone wanting to boycott Israeli products should:  First, remove all Intel Pentium and Celeron computer processor chips from personal computers (desktops, laptops and notebooks) as these were either developed or manufactured in Israel. Note that the revolutionary new Ivy Bridge processor will be manufactured in Israel. Any computers running the Windows XT operating system must be turned off immediately as this was developed in Israel. 

All current Microsoft operating systems are not to be used as Microsoft is heavily reliant on its Israel R&D centre. Step 2. Any computers that still work need to have their anti-virus software and personal firewalls removed as this technology originated in Israel. The organisation’s firewall will also need to be switched off. 

And that's just scratching the surface.


----------



## Tilly

Mindful said:


> Anyone wanting to boycott Israeli products should:  First, remove all Intel Pentium and Celeron computer processor chips from personal computers (desktops, laptops and notebooks) as these were either developed or manufactured in Israel. Note that the revolutionary new Ivy Bridge processor will be manufactured in Israel. Any computers running the Windows XT operating system must be turned off immediately as this was developed in Israel.
> 
> All current Microsoft operating systems are not to be used as Microsoft is heavily reliant on its Israel R&D centre. Step 2. Any computers that still work need to have their anti-virus software and personal firewalls removed as this technology originated in Israel. The organisation’s firewall will also need to be switched off.
> 
> And that's just scratching the surface.


And give up their mobiles.

No one is actually boycotting Israel. Not the Europeans. Not the American Studies Professors. Not Saudi Arabia. Not even Roger Waters. There is not a single human being on this planet that has access to electricity and the internet that actually boycotts all Israeli products. How do I know this? The same way you all know it: they all have cell phones, and there isn't a cell phone manufactured today that does not contain Israeli hardware or software or both. ...

The JPost


----------



## Mindful

Tilly said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone wanting to boycott Israeli products should:  First, remove all Intel Pentium and Celeron computer processor chips from personal computers (desktops, laptops and notebooks) as these were either developed or manufactured in Israel. Note that the revolutionary new Ivy Bridge processor will be manufactured in Israel. Any computers running the Windows XT operating system must be turned off immediately as this was developed in Israel.
> 
> All current Microsoft operating systems are not to be used as Microsoft is heavily reliant on its Israel R&D centre. Step 2. Any computers that still work need to have their anti-virus software and personal firewalls removed as this technology originated in Israel. The organisation’s firewall will also need to be switched off.
> 
> And that's just scratching the surface.
> 
> 
> 
> And give up their mobiles.
> 
> No one is actually boycotting Israel. Not the Europeans. Not the American Studies Professors. Not Saudi Arabia. Not even Roger Waters. There is not a single human being on this planet that has access to electricity and the internet that actually boycotts all Israeli products. How do I know this? The same way you all know it: they all have cell phones, and there isn't a cell phone manufactured today that does not contain Israeli hardware or software or both. ...
> 
> The JPost
Click to expand...


Then there's the health.

Health. Destroy all personal medication. Israel’s Teva Pharmaceuticals, the largest generic drugs company in the world, will have manufactured many of your medicines.


----------



## Dreamer

What do all Zionist world think about this. Are not Zionist Patriotic in Israel.


----------



## Mindful

Dreamer said:


> What do all Zionist world think about this. Are not Zionist Patriotic in Israel.



This isn't about that topic.


----------



## Tilly

Dreamer said:


> What do all Zionist world think about this. Are not Zionist Patriotic in Israel.


Dreamer, what is it you find funny about my post on Lord Mitchell leaving the Labour Party over anti semitism?


----------



## Dreamer

What is that headlines about my posts. I can't remember Israeli threat however is worse threat in here is well good with Zionist in Israeli. Very Army figures the Zionist in middle east.


----------



## Dreamer

Well. Anti semitism are better than whole Israeli for 71 back wood.


----------



## Mindful

Tilly said:


> Dreamer said:
> 
> 
> 
> What do all Zionist world think about this. Are not Zionist Patriotic in Israel.
> 
> 
> 
> Dreamer, what is it you find funny about my post on Lord Mitchell leaving the Labour Party over anti semitism?
Click to expand...



THE late Denis Healey, a big beast of British politics for half a century, once noted, ‘The First Law of Holes is: if you’re in one, stop digging.’As holder of many high offices of state in various Labor governments, Healey – who died last year, aged 98 – had ample experience of being stuck in political pits, especially when his party lurched far Left in the 1980s and condemned itself to 13 years in the graveyard of opposition.

There’s nothing on record to suggest Healey had any views about a gobby, back-bench rabble-rouser called Jeremy Corbyn, but the veteran grandee certainly thought serial rebels behaved treacherously.[For the record, long-time maverick Corbyn – ‘friend’ of Hamas, Hezbollah and the IRA – voted against Labor more than 500 times]Though a close buddy of Shimon Peres, Healey was no great fan of Israel, especially when he headed the pro-Arab Foreign Office (a.k.a. ‘The Camel Corps’). But his disfavor nowhere neared the obsessive hostility towards the Jewish state held by today’s Labor leader.What Healey would have found profoundly repugnant, however, is how the current regime has practically sanitized anti-Semitism and left Labor reeking of racism.I’d bet, too, Big Denis – his bushy eyebrows bristling with righteous indignation – would have demanded gaff-prone Corbyn stop digging himself deeper into the excrement of the People’s Party’s ‘Jewish problem’, showed some guts and booted out the bigots for all time.That’s essentially the message of Owen Smith, who is mounting a challenge for Labor’s leadership and who pointedly referenced how the rising tide of Jew hatred within the ranks coincided with Corbyn’s shock elevation to power last October.

The JPost


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## Tilly

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/04/opinion/the-british-lefts-jewish-problem.html

...In recent days, the Labour Party has been embroiled in a furious dispute over the attitudes of some members toward Jews. Two leading figures, Naseem Shah, a member of Parliament for a Bradford constituency, and Ken Livingstone, a former London mayor and a member of Labour’s National Executive Committee, were suspended from the party for what were condemned as anti-Semitic remarks. Ms. Shah had suggested in a social media post that Israel be “relocated” to the United States, while Mr. Livingstone had tried to defend her by claiming that Adolf Hitler had been a Zionist.

It is not the first such uproar: In February, the party was forced to open an investigation into the Oxford University Labour Club, and in March to suspend some councilors and activists accused of anti-Semitism. All this has led a number of prominent Jews — including the novelist Howard Jacobson, the former senior BBC executive Danny Cohenand The Financial Times’s managing editor, Robert Shrimsley — to withdraw support from Labour...


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## Tilly

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/04/opinion/the-british-lefts-jewish-problem.html


...
The final issue, and perhaps the one most difficult to broach for many on the left, is the growth of Muslim communities in the West. “It pains me to have to admit this,” wrote Mehdi Hasan, one of Britain’s leading left-wing Muslim voices, in 2013, “but *anti-Semitism isn’t just tolerated in some sections of the British Muslim community, it’s routine and commonplace.”*

Last month, an opinion poll of British Muslims bore out Mr. Hasan’s contention.* It showed a significant proportion of British Muslims — 30 percent to 40 percent — clinging to virtually every conspiracy theory about Jews: that they held too much power over government, the media, business and world affairs....*


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## Mindful

Tilly said:


> http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/04/opinion/the-british-lefts-jewish-problem.html
> 
> 
> ...
> The final issue, and perhaps the one most difficult to broach for many on the left, is the growth of Muslim communities in the West. “It pains me to have to admit this,” wrote Mehdi Hasan, one of Britain’s leading left-wing Muslim voices, in 2013, “but *anti-Semitism isn’t just tolerated in some sections of the British Muslim community, it’s routine and commonplace.”*
> 
> Last month, an opinion poll of British Muslims bore out Mr. Hasan’s contention.* It showed a significant proportion of British Muslims — 30 percent to 40 percent — clinging to virtually every conspiracy theory about Jews: that they held too much power over government, the media, business and world affairs....*



But even the Muslim Mayor Khan (recently on a visit to the US) was not kindly disposed towards Corbyn, regarding the anti-Semite thing infecting the Labour Party.


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## Mindful

Meanwhile, over at the Labour Friends of Israel stand:

Labour Delegate Rants Against Jews - Guido Fawkes


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## WheelieAddict

They are all over this forum.


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## Tommy Tainant

Maggdy said:


> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Israel  fumes over Norwegian theater boycott video*
> 
> *Artists release clip falsely claiming to be by Norway’s National Theater, in which it says it’s terminating cooperation with its Israeli counterpart over ‘apartheid’.*
> 
> Israel fumes over Norwegian theater boycott video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They want to go per falsehood way is to the finish?  For who this is good? Who loves that, when are cheated? Pitiable team.
> "Norwegian news site Vartoland said Roll and fellow actor Marius von der Fehr were behind the film, which expressed their opinion. Roll said their intention was to trick people into thinking the statement was made by the theater."
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I think the point is that they have a view and managed to get it across. After all it is being discussed on here.


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## Phoenall

Tommy Tainant said:


> Coyote said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mindful said:
> 
> 
> 
> From The Independent.
> 
> More maybe: later.
> 
> How it is possible to guarantee the complexion of another’s soul when our own are such mysteries to us, I don't know. Speaking generally, it is easier these days, anyway, *to hate Israel rather than Jews, since you get the same frisson with none of the guilt.* Besides, anti-Semitism need not be the worst of crimes. Depends on the variety you espouse. Not every anti-Semite is Joseph Goebbels. You can not like Jews much and be no great harm to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think that it is likely that some people feel that way, hating Israel provides them a way of "legitimizing" their anti-semitism.  However, it's also all too easy for that label to spill over and silence legitimate criticism of Israel's policies.  For example - labeling the BDS movement as across the board anti-semitism.
> 
> I DO find it unsettling to see areas declaring themselves "free" of Israeli products...that speaks to a larger undercurrent that demonizes rather than seeks actual resolution.  I also find that, as in the article I posted, that the BDS campaign ignores the complexities of the situation and ignores the Palestinians own role in the conflict.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The crazy thing is that Jewish people make common cause with these people against Muslims. When the hard right has disposed of the Muslims they will go for the Jews next.
Click to expand...







 WRONG we will go for the two faced neo marxist hypocrites that have no place in our society, after getting rid of the "hard right " of course. Or are those the same people flying two flags


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## Mindful

Jackie Walker  dismissed antisemitism charges as bids to undermine Jeremy Corbyn and his supporters.


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