# Why Are Some of My Fellow Conservatives Being Irrational About COVID-19 Vaccination?



## mikegriffith1 (Nov 26, 2021)

I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people. 

My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.

Here is some sound scientific information on the safety and effectiveness of the COVID-19 vaccines:









						COVID-19 vaccine myths debunked
					

You've likely heard about the new COVID-19 vaccines, but what should you believe? We'll set the record straight on some of the circulating myths.




					www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org
				












						Q&A with BYU professor addresses COVID-19 vaccine misconceptions
					

While myths and half-truths about vaccinations continue to swirl, Dr. Andersen explains how COVID-19 vaccines work and debunks common misconceptions in this interview.




					news.byu.edu
				












						Is the COVID-19 Vaccine Safe?
					

Our experts answer some frequently asked questions about vaccine safety.




					www.hopkinsmedicine.org
				












						COVID-19 Vaccination
					

COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.




					www.cdc.gov


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## candycorn (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Not all conservatives are immune from the truth.  Good to see you've found some independence.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.

I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Not all conservatives are immune from the truth.  Good to see you've found some independence.



I cited statistics after you called me a liar in the other thread and you have yet to respond. You throw insults around with no facts to back them up. I come with facts.


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## sparky (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> Here is some *sound scientific information* on the safety and effectiveness of the COVID-19 vaccines


those are all _'opinions'_ Mike

they've _zero _science to back them up

because they're not *ALLOWED* to access it


>>>>>>>


FDA Asks Federal Judge to Grant it Until the Year 2076 to Fully Release Pfizer’s COVID-19 Vaccine Data





*The FDA has asked a federal judge to make the public wait until the year 2076 to disclose all of the data and information it relied upon to license Pfizer’s COVID-19 vaccine. That is not a typo.  It wants 55 years to produce this information to the public.*

~S~


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## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


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## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.


How many of them would be much more sick, end up in the hospital or dead without vaccinations?

Yes, you can transmit Delta while vaccinated, but if you are less sick, for shorter period, you transmit less.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Here also, from the latest Gov report from Michigan. And this includes data going back to mid-October, BEFORE the big wave. Beaumont hospital guy says 40% of HOSPITALIZED covid cases are now fully vaccinated (see my thread)

_*In the last 30 days (Oct 14- Nov 12), 30,906 (28%) of 109,455 cases, 454 (29%) of 1,540 hospitalizations, and 151 (25%) of 605 deaths were among fully vaccinated individuals*_



			https://www.michigan.gov/documents/coronavirus/20211122_Data_and_modeling_update_vFINAL_742004_7.pdf
		


I will add this. If you really are conservative, you're letting personal fear override what SHOULD be your principles. And that's....well, that's too bad.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.



Oh shut up. I remember you clearly calling the unvaxxed all kinds of names and wishing horrid things on them. Now whining about the "politicization".


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## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Oh shut up. I remember you clearly calling the unvaxxed all kinds of names and wishing horrid things on them. Now whining about the "politicization".



Typhoid Sue, the Queen of Misinformation chimes in


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> How many of them would be much more sick, end up in the hospital or dead without vaccinations?
> 
> Yes, you can transmit Delta while vaccinated, but if you are less sick, for shorter period, you transmit less.



That's not what is happening. People are really, really sick. My coworker has been sick for 10  days, double vaxxed, and even got the monoclonal antibodies. 

I do not lie here. 

So if you are that sick for that long, there's nothing "magic" about the vaccines that prevents you from spreading to others. You're sick. You're very sick. You're infectious.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Typhoid Sue, the Queen of Misinformation chimes in



I'm coming with facts. You have name calling. You're low rent, as bots go


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## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Here also, from the latest Gov report from Michigan. And this includes data going back to mid-October, BEFORE the big wave. Beaumont hospital guy says 40% of HOSPITALIZED covid cases are now fully vaccinated (see my thread)
> 
> _*In the last 30 days (Oct 14- Nov 12), 30,906 (28%) of 109,455 cases, 454 (29%) of 1,540 hospitalizations, and 151 (25%) of 605 deaths were among fully vaccinated individuals*_
> 
> ...



If 100% of people were vaccinated, then 100% of people in the hospital with Covid would be vaccinated. However there would be a lot less hospitalizations overall.

Among the elderly and immuno compromised  that are at highest risk of hospitalization vaccination rates are very high.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Typhoid Sue, the Queen of Misinformation chimes in



Also, I am unvaccinated, I have been incredibly healthy while people all around me are getting covid. Fully vaccinated. Could I get it? Yes, I could get it today. But so far, I'm no more behind tons of friends and coworkers.

I know that hurts your feelings because I didn't comply


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> If 100% of people were vaccinated, then 100% of people in the hospital with Covid would be vaccinated.
> 
> Among the elderly and immuno compromised  that are at highest risk vaccination rates are very high.



Second one first. Busted argument. Those are the people the vaccines were supposed to help most. 

Now the first claim: yes, but you wouldn't expect to see 40% of bursting at the seam hospitals taken over by very sick VACCINATED patients if the vaccines were so great. What's the problem with admitting this? I don't get it. The medicine sucks. Sometimes this happens. So what?


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## Anomalism (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


So is that all the fault of conservatives like everything else, or do both sides contribute to the politicization of things that shouldn't be politicized?


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## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Also, I am unvaccinated, I have been incredibly healthy while people all around me are getting covid. Fully vaccinated. Could I get it? Yes, I could get it today. But so far, I'm no more behind tons of friends and coworkers.
> 
> I know that hurts your feelings because I didn't comply



Typhoid Mary was perfectly healthy too


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



To safety concerns: If the vaccines are so safe, as just one tiny example, why has Moderna been banned for young people overseas?

Why has Pfizer hidden the data for the next FIFTY years?

Mike? Hello?


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Typhoid Mary was perfectly healthy too



I know it bothers you that I am perfectly healthy and have transmitted covid to no one, but there it is. Meanwhile, you have had  your booster shot and still live in fear. That's sad, but nothing can be done it seems


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## gipper (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


You’re dead to me now.


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## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Second one first. Busted argument. Those are the people the vaccines were supposed to help most.
> 
> Now the first claim: yes, but you wouldn't expect to see 40% of bursting at the seam hospitals taken over by very sick VACCINATED patients if the vaccines were so great. What's the problem with admitting this? I don't get it. The medicine sucks. Sometimes this happens. So what?


If your immune system doesn't work well then vaccine can only do so much.

For example Powell died while vaccinated because he had compromised immune system and for people with his specific disease vaccine is only 40% effective.


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> If your immune system doesn't work well then vaccine can only do so much.
> 
> Powell died while vaccinated because he had compromised immune system and for people with his special disease vaccine is only 40% effective.



Then it's not a very good vaccine. 

What's the problem with admitting that? Did you create it? Do you work for Big Pharma? What's your buy in? I don't understand why people feel the need to deny reality and defend this utter bunk


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## sparky (Nov 26, 2021)

medical tyranny is such an _insidious_ malady by far and large  more contagious and detrimental to your general _health_ .....quit making _excuses_ for it.....

~S~


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## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Second one first. Busted argument. Those are the people the vaccines were supposed to help most.
> 
> Now the first claim: yes, but you wouldn't expect to see 40% of bursting at the seam hospitals taken over by very sick VACCINATED patients if the vaccines were so great. What's the problem with admitting this? I don't get it. The medicine sucks. Sometimes this happens. So what?


That is simply false. Increasingly high vaccination rates among high risk groups mean increasing % of hospitalizations due to Covid are expected to be vaccinated.

Again, obviously 100% vaccination rate would mean 100% hospitalizations would be vaccinated. But the important part is that hospitalizations overall would be much lower.

It's simple math.


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## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

Whether or not one was infected, the virus became political even before it left China. The most original virus politics is that certain Chinese had already identified the virus and knew it was circulating in Sep-Oct 2019. These also knew how the virus behaves amongst roosting bats, so were not clueless about vaccines.


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## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> Why Are Some of My Fellow Conservatives Being Irrational About COVID-19 Vaccination?



No real conservative would say something that stupid. Mandates are illegal and a violation of our rights. Forced medical procedures and papers for travel are repugnant. Those are the problem, not the vaccine itself.


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## Votto (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


First of all, it is NOT a vaccine, it is a treatment.  It does not prevent you from getting the virus, it simply tries to minimize the damage once you do get the virus.  The reason they call it a vaccine is because other vaccines that prevent an illness are already mandated, so they muddy the waters to make it appear as if all is status quo with the jab.

Secondly, the mandate is NOT across the board.  You don't see illegals pouring across the border by the millions being made to get the jab, and you don't see those on welfare being made to get the jab, all of which on average are not vaccinated.  This is because they are the base of the democrat party and they are distrustful of the government even though they suck off it's teat to survive.

And lastly, is it Constitutional?  I put this last because the Constitution always gets put last.  Currently the mandates are being slapped down by the courts because they don't seem to be Constitutional, or do you even care?  Does it even matter anymore?


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## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> That is simply false. Increasingly high vaccination rates among high risk groups mean increasing % of hospitalizations due to Covid are expected to be vaccinated.
> 
> Again, obviously 100% vaccination rate would mean 100% hospitalizations would be vaccinated.
> 
> It's simple math.



Okay of course, if you had 100% of the population vaccinated, any Covid cases in the hospital would be vaccinated. _*But you would not expect hospitals to be overrun with Covid patients *_If these were good vaccines. Put another way. Are hospitals overrun with polio patients? Mumps? German measles? No, and not 100% of the population is vaxxed for those. But the vaccines are better. This is also simple to understand.


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## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



  I would have to say that it is those who are not only allowing themselves to be injected with dangerous, experimental drugs, under the fraudulent guise of _“protecting”_ them from a hyperbolized disease that poses less of a threat to their health than these drugs do; but are demanding that others be forced or coerced into taking these drugs as well, who are being way beyond irrational, and into outright evil.

  If you're stupid and brainwashed enough to let them inject this shit into you, then I will not even think of trying to deny you that choice.  But please allow those of us who are smart enough to know better our right not to take this poison.

  And don't call yourself a _“conservative”_.

  This bullshit spits in the face of what conservatism stands for.


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## Esdraelon (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death.


That's nice.  You are aware that while the numbers are relatively low, it IS possible for fully vaccinated people to spread the virus?  Iceland, Portugal, and Israel are three of the most vaccinated countries on the planet and they've all suffered major outbreaks - AMONG THE VACCINATED.  

Until THIS vaccine, the idea that fully vaccinated people would need "protection" from those who aren't vaxxed, would have been patently absurd.  If you want to bend over for DC, go for it.  You have NO RIGHT to make that decision for others and it's a sign of colossal arrogance to think that you do.


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## Esdraelon (Nov 26, 2021)

sparky said:


> those are all _'opinions'_ Mike
> 
> they've _zero _science to back them up
> 
> ...


55 years... full immunity from lawsuits over the vaccines.  Yeah... nothing to see here, move along.


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## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.



  This _“health emergency”_ was crafted out of lies, exaggerations, and fearmongering, exactly for political purposes.


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## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I will add this. If you really are conservative, you're letting personal fear override what SHOULD be your principles. And that's....well, that's too bad.



  Worse than that, mikegriffith1 is demanding that people far more intelligent and aware than he obviously is, sacrifice our health, our safety, and our freedom to pander to his irrational fear and cowardice.

  His fear and cowardice are his own problem.


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## Esdraelon (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


That 4 years of media assault against Trump is having some negative consequences.  The media totally sold its soul to accomplish that mission and now, no one who saw their lies, trusts them any longer.  The same is true of the DC bureaucracy.  The primary reason that millions are balking over these vaccines is a lack of trust in government.  Guess what?  YOU built that.  Enjoy...


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## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> How many of them would be much more sick, end up in the hospital or dead without vaccinations?
> 
> Yes, you can transmit Delta while vaccinated, but if you are less sick, for shorter period, you transmit less.


Last November not vaccinated had Covid 10 days, this year vaccinated got Covid for 10 days, it was worse than last year so, tell me how the vaccine shortens the and makes you less sick?


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## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Red Storm Rising said:


> No real conservative would say something that stupid. Mandates are illegal and a violation of our rights. Forced medical procedures and papers for travel are repugnant. Those are the problem, not the vaccine itself.


Of course they would. This is science and medicine...not politics


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## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Last November not vaccinated had Covid 10 days, this year vaccinated got Covid for 10 days, it was worse than last year so, tell me how the vaccine shortens the and makes you less sick?


So apparently having had Covid does not protect you


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## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Typhoid Sue, the Queen of Misinformation chimes in


Count me in then .  Take this vaccine and shove it.  It don't belong here anymore.  As a matter of fact it don't do jack so take it with you out the door.  Take this vaccine and shove it.  It don't belong here no more

Early treatment.  cheap drugs.  telling big pharma to KISS MY ASS.......is the proper solution.  Our gov't has caused hundreds of thousands to die unnecessarily from them having MODERNA tattooed on their asses.

The STATS DON'T LIE...........Our countries stats are the WORST IN THE WORLD............No reason to LISTEN TO FAILURES.  

I refer to INDIA........and how they did it with cheap drugs.  And a TRADITIONAL VACCINE that is a WHOLE VIRUS VACCINE.

I also refer to the warnings of many doctors and scientist around the globe who say the mRNA vaccine is circulating through the blood stream leaving spike proteins all over the body.  The VAERS DATA is showing a lot of this even as they try to cover it up.  

They can't hide this forever.  The truth will eventually be known to most.  

Complaints about my views based on studies I've read are being accepted in the 2nd port o let to the left basement section.


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## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Red Storm Rising said:


> No real conservative would say something that stupid. Mandates are illegal and a violation of our rights. Forced medical procedures and papers for travel are repugnant. Those are the problem, not the vaccine itself.


I agree, went to a restaurant the other day and wanted to see my vaccine card to be able to dine. I showed them my card, told them I don’t like their discrimination and would no longer frequent their establishment.


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## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

Red Storm Rising said:


> No real conservative would say something that stupid. Mandates are illegal and a violation of our rights. Forced medical procedures and papers for travel are repugnant. Those are the problem, not the vaccine itself.





Lesh said:


> Of course they would. This is science and medicine...not politics



LOL. Your fake science is all bullshit. Democrats have never followed real science since day one. Just like with abortion they ignore reality and facts and stick with slogans.

Its no wonder that you have no concept of constitutional rights. Go move to China if you like forced medical procedures, and take your senile pedophile fake president with you.


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## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Of course they would. This is *science* and medicine...not politics



  Says someone who believes that _“science”_ supports the premise that Bruce Jenner is a woman.

  This was never about science or medicine.  From the very beginning, this hoax was driven by malicious political motives.


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## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> I agree, went to a restaurant the other day and wanted to see my vaccine card to be able to dine. I showed them my card, told them I don’t like their discrimination and would no longer frequent their establishment.


Well, that was certainly very ethical of you. Thanks


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## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Count me in then .  Take this vaccine and shove it.  It don't belong here anymore.  As a matter of fact it don't do jack so take it with you out the door.  Take this vaccine and shove it.  It don't belong here no more
> 
> Early treatment.  cheap drugs.  telling big pharma to KISS MY ASS.......is the proper solution.  Our gov't has caused hundreds of thousands to die unnecessarily from them having MODERNA tattooed on their asses.
> 
> ...



Why COVID is still killing hundreds of thousands of people


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## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Says someone who believes that _“science”_ supports the premise that Bruce Jenner is a woman.
> 
> This was never about science or medicine.  From the very beginning, this hoax was driven by malicious political motives.



Thank you!


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## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> So apparently having had Covid does not protect you


Nope it does not and neither does the vaccine. So much for the science community claiming having Covid and the vaccine will protect you even more.

So far the vaccine has not done a thing for me.


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## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I do not lie here.


You do indeed lie here and most likely everywhere

In fact you had an entire thread where you got HAMMERED for lying


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## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

I know several who have had injuries and three who died from the injection.  No thanks.  It may be something someone over 75 with health conditions may decide to do.  Different story if this had a kill ratio to that of an ebola type virus.


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## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Why COVID is still killing hundreds of thousands of people



I say your numbers are bullshit. You Leftists prove that you don't care about facts.

And: Why is the Flu still killing tens of thousands of people? Huh? Why?


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## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Plenty of articles trying to attack this all over the world.  All of them with tatooes on their asses of Big Pharma.  They will also show the Gov't of India not agreeing as they are in with the WHO.  But India is made up of STATES.  And the central gov't doesn't make the decisions in them.  Kinda what we need again here.









						COVID Live - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...




					www.worldometers.info
				




Look at the deaths per million.


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## ColonelAngus (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Government forced experimental gene therapy is not what the founders had in mind.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> You do indeed lie here and most likely everywhere
> 
> In fact you had an entire thread where you got HAMMERED for lying



No she doesn't.


----------



## sparky (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> It's simple math.


w/out any science.....


Bob Blaylock said:


> This _“health emergency”_ was crafted out of lies, exaggerations, and fearmongering, exactly for political purposes.


which they've sadly done a grand job of......

~S~


----------



## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

Maybe if the Democrats had not cozied up with the Communist Chinese and allowed them to attack us with this virus we would not have this problem


----------



## Votto (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Of course they would. This is science and medicine...not politics


If it were all about science, then those who have already had Covid would be exempt from the jab because they have acquired immunity.

Also, many countries in Europe have barred the use of Moderna in young men because it tends to cause inflammation of the heart.









						Five Scandinavian countries limit or halt Moderna
					

Finland has joined Sweden, Denmark and Norway in either banning or discouraging young adults or teens from getting the Moderna COVID-19 vaccine, because of the increased risk of myocarditis —




					www.thesuburban.com
				




And lastly, some European countries use such treatments as hydroxycholiquine but in the US it is not because Trump mentioned it.









						Spain will not stop use of HCQ to treat COVID-19 patients, unlike other European nations
					

Spain has said it sees no reason to stop the use of hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) to treat COVID-19 patients even as European governments moved on Wednesday to halt the use of the anti-malaria drug.  Several European nations, including France, Italy and Belgium, followed a World Health Organisation...




					www.wionews.com


----------



## DGS49 (Nov 26, 2021)

MOST prominent Republicans are (a) vaccinated, and (b) opposed to a vaccine mandate.

Apparently this juxtaposition is more than Leftists can handle.

The Media play a role in the "confusion" about the current situation.  When vaccinations swept the country, they were constantly printing stories about vaccinated people WHO TESTED POSITIVE!!!, thus giving the false impression that vaccination served no purpose.

But the fact is that those being vaccinated were told very candidly that they could still be infected, but that the vaccine would make it very unlikely that they get seriously sick or die.  That was the value of the jab.

It is now the case that approximately 90% of the people getting seriously sick and those who are dying are UNVACCINATED, but a casual reading of the daily headlines would not reveal that critical fact.  So many people are still convinced that the vaccine (1) is not effective (in preventing infection), and (2) could result in long term problems that are not yet known.

And the fact is that, from a risk standpoint, *the chances that any individual healthy adult will get sick and die from Covid is very small. * It happens, but it's rare.  It is still the case that the vast majority of the serious victims are either quite elderly or medically compromised.  So would I significantly change my lifestyle to accommodate this small risk?

*It is not being "irrational" to assess a small risk and decide to live with it.*  Another example being, I choose to ride a motorcycle, knowing that I am ten times more likely to be seriously injured or killed in the event of a traffic accident than someone riding in a car.  Increased risk?  Absolutely.  And I accept it.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Red Storm Rising said:


> Well, that was certainly very ethical of you. Thanks


I should not have showed my card, that was wrong. My position is our health is private and what you or I do with our bodies is not the restaurants business.


----------



## sparky (Nov 26, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> From the very beginning, this hoax was driven by malicious political motives.


Fear allows the _'powers that be'_ lots of leverage they normally would not have had ...



DGS49 said:


> That was the value of the jab.


not much of a _value ..._..jmho

~S~


----------



## Votto (Nov 26, 2021)

DGS49 said:


> MOST prominent Republicans are (a) vaccinated, and (b) opposed to a vaccine mandate.
> 
> Apparently this juxtaposition is more than Leftists can handle.
> 
> ...



At it's root, Leftism does not allow any type of dissent of any kind.  It is an ideology based on presumed superior morals, intellect, and purpose for the collective good.

In fact, socialism is so good they need to force it on the entire world, or it simply won't work right.

And when it gets forced on the entire world and does not work right, it will be because it was not implemented correctly.


----------



## JoeBlow (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


It simply shows how little faith we have in the government and Big Pharma. And Fauci lied more times than he can count. So now wonder only newbs like you still believe anything they say.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> So apparently having had Covid does not protect you


Protects you by 27 times more than the jab.  It actually trains you T cells and this is shown in the study from Israel who are VERY PRO VAX.  800000 in the study showed this.

By definition ...until they CHANGED THE DEFINITION.......this isn't a VACCINE AT ALL.

By their definition ......ASPIRIN is a dang Vaccine now.

BAAAAA   BAAAAAA


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Nope it does not and neither does the vaccine. So much for the science community claiming having Covid and the vaccine will protect you even more.
> 
> So far the vaccine has not done a thing for me.





Votto said:


> If it were all about science, then those who have already had Covid would be exempt from the jab because they have acquired immunity.


Hmmm


----------



## candycorn (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I do not lie here.


Where do you usually go?

It is true that the overwhelming percentage of covid deaths is among the un-vaxxed.  Either you'll lie and tell us that is wrong or you'll admit you're full of shit.

Or, door #3, bring up some long-debunked website quoting some doctor who you'll claim is the greatest medical expert in the universe but strangely nobody has ever heard of them.  

Your move...go.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> I agree, went to a restaurant the other day and wanted to see my vaccine card to be able to dine. I showed them my card, told them I don’t like their discrimination and would no longer frequent their establishment.


Glad I live in a  red state.  We don't put up with that shit here.


----------



## 22lcidw (Nov 26, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Not all conservatives are immune from the truth.  Good to see you've found some independence.


Anyone living in deep blue cities and not privileged by government and corporate/small business   shake downs and massive donations knows the truth from Progressives.  Progs are the most   sickly and self abusive people on the planet. The truth is never told about that.


----------



## Dogmaphobe (Nov 26, 2021)

I am more of a libertarian if I would call myself anything at all, but when we have a media absolutely devoted to lying to us and the very doctor who was so heavily involved in creating the damn thing is now telling us all what to do, I can certainly understand people's reluctance.

I have had the vaccine, and that was my choice. I believe in personal liberty, though, so I do not support forcing others.


----------



## candycorn (Nov 26, 2021)

ColonelAngus said:


> Government forced experimental gene therapy is not what the founders had in mind.


They also said blacks were 3/5 of a human.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



The only real way out of the pandemic is vaccination.  I think this is the reason why there is so much disinformation being passed around.  The worst one is that it causes infertility in women of child bearing age.  Young women are really frightened of this one.  We've got two young mothers in my own family who are adamantly refusing to be vaxxed because of it.  

There are a lot of people financially and politically benefitting from the USA not getting past this pandemic.  China, Russia and Iran are pushing anti-vax information through Facebook and other social media - there are numerous threads here about the "dangers" of the vaccine.  

And to be honest, the Republican Party of Donald Trump doesn't want it to end either.  If Biden fails to get the country out of the pandemic, it will help the Republicans at midterms.  Both Greg Abbott and Ron DeSantis are riding this "personal freedom" horse for all it's worth.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Why COVID is still killing hundreds of thousands of people


Then scrub that tattoo off your ass then.  And flip off the FDA while you are at it.

They call the shots here.  They did experiments in Wuhan though proxies........ECO.....and get money off the shots with patents and partners with the assholes selling these jabs.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Okay of course, if you had 100% of the population vaccinated, any Covid cases in the hospital would be vaccinated. _*But you would not expect hospitals to be overrun with Covid patients *_If these were good vaccines. Put another way. Are hospitals overrun with polio patients? Mumps? German measles? No, and not 100% of the population is vaxxed for those. But the vaccines are better. This is also simple to understand.


You are talking about different diseases, with different transmissability, immunity fade, and herd immunity requisites to get fully under control.

For example Alpha variant was not transmitted by the vaccinated and we would be pretty much done with Covid if it wasn't for the adaptations it was able to make.

None of that is an argument against vaccination because perfection is not the enemy of the good.


----------



## Otis Mayfield (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...




trump said not to get vaccinated.

And they love trump.


PS: trump got vaccinated.











						Trump reveals for first time he got Pfizer vaccine
					

‘When I was president, everybody wanted to get the vaccine,’ former president claims




					www.independent.co.uk
				





So they're a little retarded.


----------



## 1srelluc (Nov 26, 2021)

It's going to get worse for the vax pushers this coming winter when it's discovered that you can get and die of the covid either way but have around a 25% better chance if you are vaxxed. That's why they are pushing the booster narrative. 

If my suspicions bear out I think a lot of fully vaxxed people will die of complications from bad colds and such in the coming year. I'm already hearing of fully vaxxed people in my age group (65-70) having a awful time with mere colds.

I really believe the vax has compromised our immune systems.


----------



## Care4all (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Thank you for saying!  

I have high risk family members, that I don't want to see suffering and dying, before their time....


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

1srelluc said:


> It's going to get worse for the vax pushers this coming winter when it's discovered that you can get and die of the covid either way but have around a 25% better chance if you are vaxxed. That's why they are pushing the booster narrative.
> 
> If my suspicions bear out I think a lot of fully vaxxed people will die of complications from bad colds and such in the coming year. I'm already hearing of fully vaxxed people in my age group (65-70) having a awful time with mere colds.
> 
> I really believe the vax has compromised our immune systems.


I agree and hope I'm wrong.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.


Testing positive and becoming extremely ill are 2 entirely different things

Vaccines reduce the incidence of hospitalization, reduce incidences of severe illness and death which is exactly what they were designed to do.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Testing positive and becoming extremely ill are 2 entirely different things
> 
> Vaccines reduce the incidence of hospitalization, reduce incidences of severe illness and death which is exactly what they were designed to do.


So do anti biotics and treatments for illness.

But they don't call them vaccines.  The CDC changing the definition of VACCINE is MANIPULATION to the extreme.

Taken early.  There are treatments that will keep you out of the hospital.  They are being used all over the world with results.  

People are dying here OVER MONEY.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> The only real way out of the pandemic is vaccination.  I think this is the reason why there is so much disinformation being passed around.  The worst one is that it causes infertility in women of child bearing age.  Young women are really frightened of this one.  We've got two young mothers in my own family who are adamantly refusing to be vaxxed because of it.
> 
> There are a lot of people financially and politically benefitting from the USA not getting past this pandemic.  China, Russia and Iran are pushing anti-vax information through Facebook and other social media - there are numerous threads here about the "dangers" of the vaccine.
> 
> And to be honest, the Republican Party of Donald Trump doesn't want it to end either.  If Biden fails to get the country out of the pandemic, it will help the Republicans at midterms.  Both Greg Abbott and Ron DeSantis are riding this "personal freedom" horse for all it's worth.



More dangerous misinformation and propaganda.  Sadly, many who are stupid, ignorant, and vulnerable will lap this up like nectarine.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> So do anti biotics and treatments for illness.
> 
> But they don't call them vaccines.  The CDC changing the definition of VACCINE is MANIPULATION to the extreme.
> 
> ...


The definition was made more accurate



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/09/09/vaccine-skeptics-claim-new-cdc-gotcha-moment-they-havent-got-much/
		


*In truth, though, medical experts have long said that no vaccine, including the coronavirus vaccines, is 100 percent effective. If “immunity” connotes complete protection, then no vaccine actually provides it.*


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Here also, from the latest Gov report from Michigan. And this includes data going back to mid-October, BEFORE the big wave. Beaumont hospital guy says 40% of HOSPITALIZED covid cases are now fully vaccinated (see my thread)
> 
> _*In the last 30 days (Oct 14- Nov 12), 30,906 (28%) of 109,455 cases, 454 (29%) of 1,540 hospitalizations, and 151 (25%) of 605 deaths were among fully vaccinated individuals*_
> 
> ...



So, in Michigan 55% of the people are fully vaccinated and yet they only account for 28% of the cases and just 25% of the deaths.    That means that the 45% unvaxxed account for 72% of the cases and 75% of the deaths. 

Seems you just showed by mistake that the vaccines do indeed help.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The definition was made more accurate
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The cdc did change it.  Its simply a deceptive move to cover their nefarious activities.  Nothing else, nothing more.









						The CDC changed its definition of 'vaccine' so the public would take the COVID shot - LifeSite
					

The new vaccine definition, if publicly known, would reduce public confidence in current COVID vaccines. You don’t have to be a medical expert to see how the new definition has been created to accommodate COVID shots.




					www.lifesitenews.com


----------



## iamwhatiseem (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Very simple.
It is called hypocrisy and silly rules.
The sitting President, and his Vice President and the sitting Speaker of the House - ALL - talked about troubles they had with "Trumps vaccine" before the election. ALL OF THEM. With the Vice President going as far as saying she would not get the "Trump vaccine" before "fully proven t be safe".... she said this just 4 months before saying she supports vaccine mandates after she was elected.
Why so many conservatives are against it is also due to Fauci. WHo has been all over the map about every possible discussion about this virus.
Saying "mask are not effective" at the same time saying we need to require them. Literally in the same discussion.

That is why.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> So, in Michigan 55% of the people are fully vaccinated and yet they only account for 28% of the cases and just 25% of the deaths.    That means that the 45% unvaxxed account for 72% of the cases and 75% of the deaths.
> 
> Seems you just showed by mistake that the vaccines do indeed help.



We simply don't know that yet.  We do know that hundreds of thousands have died so far and millions have been injured.  To say that we know of the long term effects is simply not science.  Over 75 with health problems, yeah it may provide a little help.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> The cdc did change it.  Its simply a deceptive move to cover their nefarious activities.  Nothing else, nothing more.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There has never been a single vaccine produced that imparted 100% immunity to any disease so the word change made the definition MORE accurate not less.

Why do you want less accuracy in definitions?


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> There has never been a single vaccine produced that imparted 100% immunity to any disease so the word change made the definition MORE accurate not less.
> 
> Why do you want less accuracy in definitions?



They changed it to accommodate an injection that isn't a conventional vaccine.  Its not a conventional vaccine.  I want more accuracy and this new definition doesn't provide such.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> So, in Michigan 55% of the people are fully vaccinated and yet they only account for 28% of the cases and just 25% of the deaths.    That means that the 45% unvaxxed account for 72% of the cases and 75% of the deaths.
> 
> Seems you just showed by mistake that the vaccines do indeed help.



They help, but realize that data was from mid-Oct to mid-Nov. Our wave didn't take off until very late October, so this will be updated. You can see this in my Beaumont thread, where nearly 40% of hospitalized patients are vaxxed--from just this past week


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

A video before they started changing the definition of vaccine.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> They help, but realize that data was from mid-Oct to mid-Nov. Our wave didn't take off until very late October, so this will be updated. You can see this in my Beaumont thread, where nearly 40% of hospitalized patients are vaxxed--from just this past week



I know several who are reporting about a 60-40 mix.  The media continues to report dangerous misinformation and propaganda.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> There has never been a single vaccine produced that imparted 100% immunity to any disease so the word change made the definition MORE accurate not less.
> 
> Why do you want less accuracy in definitions?



I can't think of another vaccine either where 40% of patients were recently vaccinated and  yet are so sick as to be in the hospital.

Yet here we are.....


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> I know several who are reporting about a 60-40 mix.  The media continues to report dangerous misinformation and propaganda.



You typically get better information locally. Anything that says 90% goes back to JANUARY, before anyone was really vaccinated.


----------



## 1srelluc (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> The cdc did change it.  Its simply a deceptive move to cover their nefarious activities.  Nothing else, nothing more.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yep, my doctor told me about that and he was none too pleased about it. He thought it was a end-around other viable treatments.

I was un-vaxxed at the time and I asked him what he recommended and he flat-out said he his leaving that decision to his patients and was not going to get involved in it.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The definition was made more accurate
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Really.  The Washington Compost.  A mouth piece for politics.  I don't think so.

In order to protect you from dying from this disease.  The spike proteins need to stop regenerating......spreading.......Simple drugs ALREADY DO THAT.  It attaches to the covid spike proteins and keeps them from replicating.  Then the other meds kill it like zinc.  Other meds Doxycycline stop bacterial infections.  Then Vitamin C and D help your body recover.  

Taken EARLY with TREATMENT.  A whole lot less people would die.  But they DON'T ALLOW THESE DRUGS HERE.  Only the HIGH DOLLAR ONES ARE ALLOWED.

The definition is bogus.  And I WILL NOT LISTEN to the ones in charge here who have the WORST STATS ON PLANET EARTH.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Very simple.
> It is called hypocrisy and silly rules.
> The sitting President, and his Vice President and the sitting Speaker of the House - ALL - talked about troubles they had with "Trumps vaccine" before the election. ALL OF THEM. With the Vice President going as far as saying she would not get the "Trump vaccine" before "fully proven t be safe".... she said this just 4 months before saying she supports vaccine mandates after she was elected.
> Why so many conservatives are against it is also due to Fauci. WHo has been all over the map about every possible discussion about this virus.
> ...


No one trusts them.  It's the boy that cried wolf too many times.  The media the same.

I look for sources outside of this country because I have NO TRUST in our gov't and the media ANYMORE.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> There has never been a single vaccine produced that imparted 100% immunity to any disease so the word change made the definition MORE accurate not less.
> 
> Why do you want less accuracy in definitions?


The new definition is a joke.  By that definition the cheap treatments in India are a dang vaccine.


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> . We do know that hundreds of thousands have died so far and millions have been injured.



hundreds of thousands have died from the vaccine?  

and then you have the gall to whine about misinformation?  

Yet one more person born without a sense of irony


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Hmmm


Hmmmm…So science was wrong about the immunity from Covid if you had Covid. Vaccinated or not, you get Covid. What is the point of the vaccine? Seriously, answer the question, is science wrong again?


----------



## Crepitus (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Sadly your title says it all.  Conservatives being irrational is nothing new.


----------



## Turtlesoup (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Safe and Effective my ass.........dangerous, if they work only work temporarily, kill and maime, and they are likely to fuck up one's natural immunity.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...




The vaccines are a brand new technology, they are not the traditional vaccine...they aren't even really vaccines...they simply boost your immunity, but still allow you to get infected.

Because they are new, the actual side effects and long term effects are not well know.....so if you are an individual who is relatively young, healthy.....you don't have much if anything to fear from getting covid...and as the actual science shows, if you get it and get through it, you have actual immunity to it going forward......

So, these people see very little chance of dying from covid, and they don't know if the issues of heart inflammation and strokes are going to increase as we go forward.......

That is why they are waiting and why mandating a new, untested drug should not be allowed...

If you want it, you can get it...but forcing people to get an untested, unknown drug is immoral and should be illegal.......

Especially for children where we are seeing some really bad side effects....considering they are the least likely to die from the Chinese flu.....it is wrong to mandate that children get the vaccine...

Keep in mind, the idiots who are supporting your post are the very same morons who said that if Trump was re-elected and the vaccine came out, they wouldn't take it....biden won, and now they are demanding people lose their jobs if they don't get the shot...

You are not on the side of the angels on this one...


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.




The democrats did this because they wanted to win an election...you doofus.


----------



## Turtlesoup (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> There has never been a single vaccine produced that imparted 100% immunity to any disease so the word change made the definition MORE accurate not less.
> 
> Why do you want less accuracy in definitions?


There also hasn't been a single 'vaccine' that only last months if it works.   Nor has there been a single vaccine released on the public that wasn't fully tested before doing so.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Hmmmm…So science was wrong about the immunity from Covid if you had Covid. Vaccinated or not, you get Covid. What is the point of the vaccine? Seriously, answer the question, is science wrong again?


No vaccine is 100% effective. But thank you for pointing out that previous infection is not the great protection that your idiot buddies claim.

I do however wonder how it is that certain people get Covid again and again when careful people like myself don’t get it even once.

What do you do… tongue kiss everyone you interact with?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> _*But you would not expect hospitals to be overrun with Covid patients *_If these were good vaccines.


Specifically on this point, there are no hospitals overrun with Covid patients in areas of high vaccination.

Places where you see significant % of hospitalized having vaccination are indicative of high vaccination rates and low hospitalization rates.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Turtlesoup said:


> Safe and Effective my ass.........dangerous, if they work only work temporarily, kill and maime, and they are likely to fuck up one's natural immunity.


You been on Facebook again haven’t you…

I thought I told you to knock that shit off


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

Dogmaphobe said:


> I am more of a libertarian if I would call myself anything at all, but when we have a media absolutely devoted to lying to us and the very doctor who was so heavily involved in creating the damn thing is now telling us all what to do, I can certainly understand people's reluctance.
> 
> I have had the vaccine, and that was my choice. I believe in personal liberty, though, so I do not support forcing others.



The virus doesn't give a rat's ass about your "personal liberty".  

The MSM media isn't "absolutely lying to anyone".  FOX News and other right wing media outlets are fear mongering and spreading lies about the vaccine.  Tucker Carlson is cheering people for refusing to get the vaccine, while working for a Rupert Murdoch who was one of the first people to be vaxxed, and who has required that ALL FOX employees be fully vaccinated, including Tucker Carlson.  What a hypocrite!!

So why are FOX commentators telling YOU to stand on your rights and freedoms and refuse the vaccine when NONE of the people telling your to do this have refused to be vaxxed?  What does that tell you about the people you trust at FOX News?


----------



## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Specifically on this point, there are no hospitals overrun with Covid patients in areas of high vaccination.



There never were you retard. When Trump sent the big hospital ship to New York to help out it wasn't even used, and that was at the height of it all.


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

2aguy said:


> The vaccines are a brand new technology,



Not really accurate. mRNA technology has been being studied and worked on for close to 2 decades.


----------



## Red Storm Rising (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> The virus doesn't give a rat's ass about your "personal liberty".



Go move to China if you don't like the Bill of Rights you POS


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> There has never been a single vaccine produced that imparted 100% immunity to any disease so the word change made the definition MORE accurate not less.
> 
> Why do you want less accuracy in definitions?


Some have decided to consider forced production of Chinese virus parts in the cell as not a vaccine, especially for young children whose immune system are not yet mature. In addition, the real violence POSPOTUS JoeXi and his crony Fau Chi, the WHO, FDA, CDC, have done to Americans is that they can’t get the actual vaccine made from the whole Chinese communist virus: Covaxin. SARS-CoV-2 can only intelligently be called a Chinese communist virus.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> Not really accurate. mRNA technology has been being studied and worked on for close to 2 decades.


Please post the citations and links for application in humans.


----------



## 2aguy (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> Not really accurate. mRNA technology has been being studied and worked on for close to 2 decades.




And yet they didn't know that the protein spikes would travel around and accumulate in the body...they believed they would stay at the injection site.........


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

Because for every human application, we will reply with critique.


----------



## Clipper (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.


People like you are the reason that there ARE waves. Prople like you are the reason that we will never be over this due to your anti vaxx insanity.

Maybe your mind should be open to facts such as 90% of people dying from this are unvaccinated. 

800,000 dead people ain't enough for ya, moron?


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

2aguy said:


> And yet they didn't know that the protein spikes would travel around and accumulate in the body...they believed they would stay at the injection site.........


We think this accumulation of Chinese virus parts cause the thrombosis. See the obstruction shown in the micrograph on Wiki’s Cerebral Palsy page.


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

badger2 said:


> Please post the citations and links for application in humans.











						The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
					

A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.




					publichealth.jhu.edu
				












						The tangled history of mRNA vaccines
					

Hundreds of scientists had worked on mRNA vaccines for decades before the coronavirus pandemic brought a breakthrough.




					www.nature.com
				








__





						The long road to mRNA vaccines - CIHR
					






					cihr-irsc.gc.ca
				












						Three decades of messenger RNA vaccine development
					

In the early nineties, pioneering steps were taken in the use of mRNA as a therapeutic tool for vaccination. In the following decades, an improved und…




					www.sciencedirect.com


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> hundreds of thousands have died from the vaccine?
> 
> and then you have the gall to whine about misinformation?
> 
> Yet one more person born without a sense of irony



Yeah, obviously thats somewhat difficult for you to comprehend........that a lot of people have died from the vaccine.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Watch it.  don't watch it.  I don't care.  Enjoy


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Red Storm Rising said:


> There never were you retard. When Trump sent the big hospital ship to New York to help out it wasn't even used, and that was at the height of it all.


Dope. It was never intended nor fitted out as a Covid ward.

It was supposed to handle overflow standard patients… who never materialized because people in NYC were too afraid to go to the hospital.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
> 
> 
> A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.
> ...



This is the first time they have been tested in humans.


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Yeah, obviously thats somewhat difficult for you to comprehend........that a lot of people have died from the vaccine.



Yes, some people have.  But hundreds of thousands have not.  

If you have to lie, it just shows the weakness of your position.


----------



## Clipper (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> If your immune system doesn't work well then vaccine can only do so much.
> 
> For example Powell died while vaccinated because he had compromised immune system and for people with his specific disease vaccine is only 40% effective.


So what? Does that mean that people shouldn't get the vaxx? No, it doesn't.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> Yes, some people have.  But hundreds of thousands have not.
> 
> If you have to lie, it just shows the weakness of your position.



Only about 1-10 percent is reported to vaers.  Yeah, its easily into the hundreds of thousands.  That's truth.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Clipper said:


> So what? Does that mean that people shouldn't get the vaxx? No, it doesn't.



Get it, don't' get it.  Thats fine with me.  I won't be forced to take it though.


----------



## Clipper (Nov 26, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Says someone who believes that _“science”_ supports the premise that Bruce Jenner is a woman.
> 
> This was never about science or medicine.  From the very beginning, this hoax was driven by malicious political motives.


Idioits like you are the reason that we will never be over this. Patients with other conditions are not getting care they need because beds are being used by people who won't get the shot.

Keep listeng to Tucker & that mob who are all fully vaccinated. They're doing a gooid job thinning the herd.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> No vaccine is 100% effective. But thank you for pointing out that previous infection is not the great protection that your idiot buddies claim.
> 
> I do however wonder how it is that certain people get Covid again and again when careful people like myself don’t get it even once.
> 
> What do you do… tongue kiss everyone you interact with?



Wrong.
All real vaccines are 100% effective, meaning they impart T-cell long term memory in the immune system as to how to identify and attack a pathogen.

The problem with these mRNA injections is they contain nothing for the immune system to memorize or later trigger on.
They are not useless because they temporarily stimulate antibody production, but they have no long term component.

As to why some never get and others get it often, is inherent immunity.
Humans have been living with corona viruses for millions of years, so some people have evolved genetic immunity.


----------



## Baron Von Murderpaws (Nov 26, 2021)




----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Red Storm Rising said:


> There never were you retard.



Looks like someone is not residing in reality.









						Many Hospitals With No Beds Left Are Forced To Send COVID Patients To Cities Far Away
					

Many overwhelmed hospitals, with no beds to offer, are putting critically ill COVID-19 patients on planes, helicopters and ambulances and sending them hundreds of miles away for treatment.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> All real vaccines are 100% effective


Nonsense

Our Kremlin "doctor" is trying to kill people


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Only about 1-10 percent is reported to vaers.  Yeah, its easily into the hundreds of thousands.  That's truth.



And nothing reported to VAERS is verified to have been due to the vaccine or even to have really happened.  Anyone and everyone can post things to VAERS.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> All real vaccines are 100% effective








Vaccine effectiveness:
Measles: 93%​Mumps: 78%​Rubella: 97%​




__





						How Effective are the COVID-19 Vaccines?
					

High efficacy rates of vaccines aren’t uncommon, with measles, polio, tetanus, and hepatitis vaccines showing high efficacy rates. So, how do the new COVID-19 vaccines compare?




					hive.rochesterregional.org


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> And nothing reported to VAERS is verified to have been due to the vaccine or even to have really happened.  Anyone and everyone can post things to VAERS.



Of course they're not verifying it.  They dont want to verify it because it runs antithetical to their message and narrative.  Posting a false statement to vaers is punishable by law.  When you have a media that is fully complicit in censoring all data to one outcome, red flags should go up.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> Not really accurate. mRNA technology has been being studied and worked on for close to 2 decades.


Show me the human trials.  Well......we are right now lol

Are you a happy lab rat.  Want some cheese.


----------



## Lovebears65 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


Biden's whole campaign made it political  yet you were quiet about that


----------



## Golfing Gator (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Of course they're not verifying it.  They dont wan't to verify it because it runs antithetical to their message and narrative.  Posting a false statement to vaers is punishable by law.



They never have, it is not new.  It is not some grand COVID conspiracy.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Clipper said:


> Idioits like you are the reason that we will never be over this. Patients with other conditions are not getting care they need because beds are being used by people who won't get the shot.
> 
> Keep listeng to Tucker & that mob who are all fully vaccinated. They're doing a gooid job thinning the herd.



Wrong.
The main reason we are not getting rid of this is the mistaken idea of "flattening the curve".
All that does is prevent herd immunity from ending it, and make it last forever, with ever increasing variants.

Taking an mRNA injection does not mean you are vaccinated at all.
These mRNA injections can't store any immunity info into long term T-cell memory, because the injection has nothing to store that the immune system could later trigger on.  
And just stimulating antibody production, without helping the immune system identify the invading pathogen, means your immune system never completely wipes it out.  It can linger and become endemic then.  Very irresponsible and risky to everyone else.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Show me the human trials.  Well......we are right now lol
> 
> Are you a happy lab rat.  Want some cheese.



Exactly, it hasn't been tested on humans until now.  The ones taking the injections are the experiment.  The ones not taking it are the control.


----------



## Baron Von Murderpaws (Nov 26, 2021)

*Flu vaccine - once a YEAR

Pneumonia vaccine - once every FIVE years

Many of the other vaccines we get when younger, before entering school for the first time, are ONCE IN A LIFETIME!!

All other vaccines and treatments for DEADLIER AND MORE CONTAGIOUS viruses and diseases are NOT even administered until AFTER the patient has become sick from them!!*

And yet, this COVID "vaccine" doesn't seem to work, as they continue to make claims that people NEED to keep getting pumped full of it every few months!!!  In fact, there are now medical reports being published online from non-government sources that state that MORE people that keep getting these COVID "vaccines" are more apt to get sick from COVID and die from it.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Clipper said:


> Idioits like you are the reason that we will never be over this. Patients with other conditions are not getting care they need because beds are being used by people who won't get the shot.
> 
> Keep listeng to Tucker & that mob who are all fully vaccinated. They're doing a gooid job thinning the herd.


BS.

Leaky vaccines cause worse dang viruses.  The mutations are laughing at you.  They go around the vaccines.

The new NU mutatnt  if it goes postal will mean your vaccine doesn't mean jack squat.  The vaccines do nothing against it.  Maybe it will not go postal but it has already spread to different continents.

The science before this.  Was that leaky vaccines are DANGEROUS.  Oh well.  keep being their lab rat.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> They never have, it is not new.  It is not some grand COVID conspiracy.



Conspiracy, of course not.  They simply don't want to acknowledge the deaths and injuries.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> hasn't been tested on humans until now.


What the fuck is wrong with you?

*From 2020*:

The two-dose vaccine was 94.1% effective based on a total of 196 cases of symptomatic Covid-19 occurring in the company’s *30,000-volunteer study*.









						Moderna to submit Covid-19 vaccine to FDA as full results show 94% efficacy
					

Moderna said Monday its Covid-19 vaccine continued to deliver strong efficacy results, showing 94% efficacy in the main analysis of its key study.




					www.statnews.com
				




You really didn't know that all vaccines went through human trials?


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> Not really accurate. mRNA technology has been being studied and worked on for close to 2 decades.



They just only STARTED on mRNA technology in 1995.
And it was NEVER intended for vaccines, nor is there any reason to assume it could EVER be used for vaccines.
It is just a means by which cells can be made to produce certain proteins.
That likely will never be useful for any vaccines, ever.
Vaccines have to show the immune system a pathogen, so that the immune system will remember and trigger on it later.
And the simple proteins mRNA can produce, are not sufficient for that.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> BS.
> 
> Leaky vaccines cause worse dang viruses.  The mutations are laughing at you.  They go around the vaccines.



Horseshit,

Delta mutation was from India, which had huge Covid outbreak amid ~20% vaccination rate.

And the new one is from South Africa was specifcailly found among 18-35 year olds that have very low vaccination rates.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> What the fuck is wrong with you?
> 
> *From 2020*:
> 
> ...



Yes, you are the experiment.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Dozens dropping in just the last month.  Nobody questioning anything.









						Dozens of Vaxxed Athletes Are Suddenly Collapsing and Nobody’s Allowed to Ask Why
					

There's an extremely inconvenient truth for vaxx-nannies that is quietly surfacing across the globe. Professional athletes, who are among the




					noqreport.com


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Toffeenut Baconsmuggler said:


>


Those with tatooes on their asses don't care about that.  That is why they are giving this crap to young kids with almost no chance of dying from covid.  But they could have permanent damage from the jab.

WTF can we say.  It is INSANITY.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Golfing Gator said:


> The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
> 
> 
> A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.
> ...



Except those are just attempts, not successes.
Likely mRNA techniques can not and never will work to produce a successful vaccine.
The attempt is inherently flawed and can never work.
The simple proteins mRNA can get human cells to produce, are not at all useful in programming the immune system for future trigging on a particular pathogen.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> They just only STARTED on mRNA technology in 1995.
> And it was NEVER intended for vaccines, nor is there any reason to assume it could EVER be used for vaccines.
> It is just a means by which cells can be made to produce certain proteins.
> That likely will never be useful for any vaccines


Why do you keep stating blatant bullshit?

As a matter of fact we have 2 highly effective mRNA Covid vaccines.

mRNA tech is currently under development for Influenza, Malaria and some types of Cancer:









						3 mRNA vaccines researchers are working on (that aren't COVID)
					

We have two mRNA COVID-19 vaccines so far. But what else can this technology do?




					theconversation.com


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> What the fuck is wrong with you?
> 
> *From 2020*:
> 
> ...



Wrong.
It has since then been determined that the mRNA injections just temporarily stimulate some antibody production.
It puts nothing into long term T-cell memory, so is 0% effective as a vaccine.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Horseshit,
> 
> Delta mutation was from India, which had huge Covid outbreak amid ~20% vaccination rate.
> 
> And the new one is from South Africa was specifcailly found among 18-35 year olds that have very low vaccination rates.


333 per million deaths.

2300 per million deaths here.  Stats don't lie.  And mutations are happening all over the world.  

The NU variant.  Coming to a hospital near you soon.  The Vaccines have no effect.  India used the HOME HEALTH KITS.  and they worked.  Their vaccine is a whole vaccine not a spike protein.  

The spike protein of COVID is what damages your body.  It causes long term damage to organs.  So lets inject it and allow it to go into our blood stream on purpose.

Okie Dokie.   Go ahead bro  Enjoy it.  I'm NOT TAKING IT.  

We need treatments here not GARBAGE.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Why do you keep stating blatant bullshit?
> 
> As a matter of fact we have 2 highly effective mRNA Covid vaccines.
> 
> ...



They're not highly effective.  Thats just media regurgitating the propaganda and you just happened to lap it up.


----------



## Briss (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> What the fuck is wrong with you?


Let's see if you have any idea who you've been believing.  

Who said this: 

“…_If you get [perform the PCR test at] a cycle threshold of 35 or more…the chances of it being replication-confident [aka accurate] are miniscule…you almost never can culture virus [detect a true positive result] from a 37 threshold cycle…even 36"_


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Why do you keep stating blatant bullshit?
> 
> As a matter of fact we have 2 highly effective mRNA Covid vaccines.
> 
> ...


So effective you are going to need to take them every 6 months for the variants coming.  You call that SUCCESS.......LMAO


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> So effective you are going to need to take them every 6 months for the variants coming.  You call that SUCCESS.......LMAO



They'll bow to as many as govt and media tell them to take.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Why do you keep stating blatant bullshit?
> 
> As a matter of fact we have 2 highly effective mRNA Covid vaccines.
> 
> ...



You are just lying.
The mRNA injections have no vaccine characteristics at all, and never can.
All they do is stimulate some temporary antibody production.

If they were to be true vaccines, they would have to contain actual viruses that the immune system could use as an identifier to memorize for next time.
But since these injections have no viruses, there is nothing the immune system can store.
So then there is nothing that can trigger the immune response in the future.

If you were to claim that these injections product spike proteins and the immune system can store that info, you would be wrong.
First of all, our own exosome use those same spike proteins, so they had better NOT trigger an immune response, and second is that if the spike proteins were the immune system trigger, then variants would not matter, because variants still have to use the same spike proteins also.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> They'll bow to as many as govt and media tell them to take.


They are sheep.  BAAAA


----------



## Osiris-ODS (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Here's a question for you. If the vaccine works, why the FUCK does it matter if someone else takes it? When was the last time you heard anyone say "my Claritin won't help my allergies unless everyone else takes it too." Or "my Tylenol won't help this headache unless everyone else takes Tylenol too." It's fucking STUPID. You are a sheep, and I have zero respect for you for even writing this coersive post.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Specifically on this point, there are no hospitals overrun with Covid patients in areas of high vaccination.
> 
> Places where you see significant % of hospitalized having vaccination are indicative of high vaccination rates and low hospitalization rates.



Vermont. Fully vaxxed rate 73%. Yet here:

_Vermont hospitals say they are already stressed. Administrators say unvaccinated coronavirus patients put an avoidable strain on the system. As of Wednesday, Vermont had just 11 open ICU beds across 14 acute care hospitals. “The challenges are becoming greater as we see unvaccinated COVID patients coming into our ICUs, because instead of staying three or four days, they’re staying 21 days,” said Dr. Gil Allen, chief of critical care at the UVM Medical Center.

But it’s not just COVID putting a strain on hospitals. Health officials say they’re also experiencing a perfect storm of a staffing crisis, deferred patient care, and mental health patients requiring a step-down facility. And should it continue, it could impact elective services









						COVID spike triggers concern over Vermont hospital capacity
					

Because case counts are leading indicators of both hospitalization rates and deaths, state officials say they are closely monitoring the two-day trend.




					www.wcax.com
				



_
Colorado. Fully vaxxed rate 73%









						Colorado hospitals allowed to turn away patients amid Covid-19 surge
					

Gov. Jared Polis signed an executive order Sunday allowing overwhelmed hospitals to prioritize care.




					www.nbcnews.com
				




How many more do you want? There are plenty. I'm telling you, no matter what you post, the vaccines are failing and hospitals are still skewed toward unvaxxed, but that number is evening out more and more.

Those are just the facts.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Of course they're not verifying it.  They dont wan't to verify it because it runs antithetical to their message and narrative.  Posting a false statement to vaers is punishable by law.  When you have a media that is fully complicit in censoring all data to one outcome, red flags should go up.


Yea...it's a giant worldwide CONSPIRACY

Fuckin nutjobs


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Vermont. Fully vaxxed rate 73%. Yet here:
> 
> _Vermont hospitals say they are already stressed. Administrators say unvaccinated coronavirus patients put an avoidable strain on the system. As of Wednesday, Vermont had just 11 open ICU beds across 14 acute care hospitals. “The challenges are becoming greater as we see unvaccinated COVID patients coming into our ICUs, because instead of staying three or four days, they’re staying 21 days,” said Dr. Gil Allen, chief of critical care at the UVM Medical Center.
> 
> ...





SweetSue92 said:


> Administrators say* unvaccinated coronavirus patients* put an avoidable strain on the system.


Do you read your own posts?


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Nonsense
> 
> Our Kremlin "doctor" is trying to kill people



You are lying.
After taking smallpox, polio, measles, mumps, pertussis, etc. vaccines, how many people fail to mount any immune response to smallpox, polio, measles, mumps, pertussis, etc.?
The answer it ZERO.
Real vaccines always work to create an immune response.
If the immune system is weak or compromised, the person might still show some symptoms, but they will still show an immune response.

But not true with mRNA injections.
They produce no longer term immune system reaction at all.
They only temporarily stimulate antibody production, and are useless after 5 months.


----------



## Hellokitty (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Not following your argument since the vaccine doesn't prevent spread.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> 333 per million deaths.
> 
> 2300 per million deaths here.  Stats don't lie.  And mutations are happening all over the world.
> 
> ...



The spike proteins were SUPPOSED to remain in the arm muscle. Oops. No. they are all over in the vaccinated, or at least some of them. They even cross the blood/brain barrier.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

__





						View of Ivermectin as Pre-exposure Prophylaxis for COVID-19 among Healthcare Providers in a Selected Tertiary Hospital in Dhaka – An Observational Study
					






					www.ejmed.org
				




Method:An  observational  study,  with  118  healthcare  providers  who  were enrolled  purposively,  was  conducted  in  a  tertiary  hospital  in  Dhaka  from May 2020 to August 2020. The subjects were divided into experimental and control groups; and the experimental group received an oral monthly dose of Ivermectin 12mg for 4 months. Both groups were exposed to COVID-19 positive  patients  admitted  in  the  hospital  during  the  course  of  study.  The symptomatic  subjects  were  evaluated  by  physical  examination,  COVID-19 RT-PCR  and/or  HRCT  of  chest.  Differences  between  the  variables  were determined using the Chi-square test and the level of statistical significance was reached when p<0.05.

Result: 73.3%  (44  out  of  60)  subjects  in  control  group were  positive  for COVID-19,  whereas  only  6.9%  (4  out  of  58)  of  the  experimental  group were diagnosed with COVID-19 (p-value < 0.05).Conclusion:Ivermectin,   an   FDA-approved,   safe,   cheapand   widely available drug, should be subjected to large-scale trials all over the world to ascertain its effectiveness as pre-exposure prophylaxis for COVID-19.









						Bangladesh COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

Bangladesh Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info
				




128 per million deaths for covid


----------



## colfax_m (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> It puts nothing into long term T-cell memory, so is 0% effective as a vaccine.


If only you knew what you’re talking about.









						T-Cells & COVID-19: Penn Study Shows Robust T-Cell Response to Vaccine
					

Messenger-RNA (mRNA) vaccines against the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 provoke a swift and strong response by the immune system’s T cells—the heavy armor of the immune system—according to a study from researchers in the Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania.



					www.pennmedicine.org


----------



## Briss (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Yea...it's a giant worldwide CONSPIRACY
> 
> Fuckin nutjobs


Well, after tony, the CDC, and the FDA kept their "expert" mouths shut when they knew the PCR-test was a bullshyt choice to determine spread, you were willing to mindlessly assume that everything coming out of their mouths after that initial deception would be the honest to god's truth.  And you have a problem with those of us who don't believe deceivers.  You're a fanatic . . .


----------



## Hellokitty (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Here also, from the latest Gov report from Michigan. And this includes data going back to mid-October, BEFORE the big wave. Beaumont hospital guy says 40% of HOSPITALIZED covid cases are now fully vaccinated (see my thread)
> 
> _*In the last 30 days (Oct 14- Nov 12), 30,906 (28%) of 109,455 cases, 454 (29%) of 1,540 hospitalizations, and 151 (25%) of 605 deaths were among fully vaccinated individuals*_
> 
> ...


And this is where they will change the definition of "fully  vaccinated".  It's truly unbelievable how so many still trust the "science".


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> The only real way out of the pandemic is vaccination.  I think this is the reason why there is so much disinformation being passed around.  The worst one is that it causes infertility in women of child bearing age.  Young women are really frightened of this one.  We've got two young mothers in my own family who are adamantly refusing to be vaxxed because of it.
> 
> There are a lot of people financially and politically benefitting from the USA not getting past this pandemic.  China, Russia and Iran are pushing anti-vax information through Facebook and other social media - there are numerous threads here about the "dangers" of the vaccine.
> 
> And to be honest, the Republican Party of Donald Trump doesn't want it to end either.  If Biden fails to get the country out of the pandemic, it will help the Republicans at midterms.  Both Greg Abbott and Ron DeSantis are riding this "personal freedom" horse for all it's worth.


How do you vax out of this. The vaccine doesn't work on the new variant out of S. Africa, the Delta variant the vaccine struggles. 2 billion does of vaccine and the earth has six or seven billion?

Do you have proof that Russia and China are using Facebook to pass anti-vaccine messages? Facebook has stopped all the anti-vaxxing BS, I think you are being less than honest.

As far as your Republican party statement, could you provide proof? Or is this another unsubstantiated opinion from any extremely unknowledgeable and bigoted person?


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Horseshit,
> 
> Delta mutation was from India, which had huge Covid outbreak amid ~20% vaccination rate.
> 
> And the new one is from South Africa was specifcailly found among 18-35 year olds that have very low vaccination rates.



Wong.
India has a 55% vaccination rate.
And the delta variant is NOT a mutation.
Mutations are random events, almost always inert, and take on the order of tens of thousands of years to be viable.
Variants happen fast and often, because all you need is for 2 different viruses to inject their RNA into the same cell.


----------



## Desperado (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


So you are another one blaming the vaccines failures on the on the unvaccinate.  If you get the vaccine, you can still spread the virus, you can still get the virus and you can still die from the virus even after 3 shots.  Let us not forget you cn still get sick and die from the vaccine.  Thanks but no thanks


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Yea...it's a giant worldwide CONSPIRACY
> 
> Fuckin nutjobs



A giant, worldwide conspiracy by giant, worldwide, big pharma, multi national, corporations, making trillions off fake injections.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Why mRNA Vaccines Need Two Doses to Best Work – and What Delays Might Mean
					






					news.virginia.edu


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Do you read your own posts?



Since the 73% vaccinated should put Vermont over the top of herd immunity, that clearly proves the vaccines are not working at all.
Instead, it is only the recovery rate that is reducing the infection rate, not vaccinations.


----------



## Briss (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> A giant, worldwide conspiracy by giant, worldwide, big pharma, multi national, corporations, making trillions off fake injections.


Bet she's never seen Pfizer's rap sheet . . .

Johnson&Johnson's rap sheet is even longer than Pfizer's!


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Yea...it's a giant worldwide CONSPIRACY
> 
> Fuckin nutjobs



There's no conspiracy to the deaths that are occurring from this injection.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> The virus doesn't give a rat's ass about your "personal liberty".
> 
> The MSM media isn't "absolutely lying to anyone".  FOX News and other right wing media outlets are fear mongering and spreading lies about the vaccine.  Tucker Carlson is cheering people for refusing to get the vaccine, while working for a Rupert Murdoch who was one of the first people to be vaxxed, and who has required that ALL FOX employees be fully vaccinated, including Tucker Carlson.  What a hypocrite!!
> 
> So why are FOX commentators telling YOU to stand on your rights and freedoms and refuse the vaccine when NONE of the people telling your to do this have refused to be vaxxed?  What does that tell you about the people you trust at FOX News?


That you have a choice? You you can decide for yourself? I'm vaxxed and I won't get the booster.


----------



## Briss (Nov 26, 2021)

VAERS is the new human-trials safety data . . .


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Hellokitty said:


> Not following your argument since the vaccine doesn't prevent spread.



Exactly.  Why take it when it doesn't prevent spread, provides no immunity, doesn't prevent hospitalization?


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> That you have a choice? You you can decide for yourself? I'm vaxxed and I won't get the booster.



My mom took it and said the same thing about the booster.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Penn mRNA Scientists Drew Weissman and Katalin Karikó Receive 2021 Lasker Award, America’s Top Biomedical Research Prize - Penn Medicine
					

As mRNA-based SARS-CoV-2 vaccines are deployed to protect hundreds of millions of people across the world and point the way to end the deadly global COVID-19 pandemic, the University of Pennsylvania scientists whose prescient discovery science effort laid the foundation for swift vaccine...



					www.pennmedicine.org
				




This platform set the stage for the rapid development and deployment of mRNA vaccines to combat COVID-19 when the virus exploded across the world in early 2020.* Both Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna have licensed University of Pennsylvania technology that is used in their COVID-19 vaccines, a combined 370 million doses of which have been administered in the U.S. alone*. The Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine is being deployed in 126 countries, and 71 countries are using the Moderna vaccine.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Clipper said:


> Idioits like you are the reason that we will never be over this. Patients with other conditions are not getting care they need because beds are being used by people who won't get the shot.
> 
> Keep listeng to Tucker & that mob who are all fully vaccinated. They're doing a gooid job thinning the herd.


No variants are the reason we will never get this under control. We have for decades used flu shots and yet the flu and it's variants continue. Africa has a low 6% vaccination rate and has tons of variants coming out of there and it will continue. We currently have 2 billion vaccinated while we have 7.7 billion inhabitants. If you really want to see an end to this you need 7.7 billion of the original and 7.7 billion shots for each variant. 

It's called science. Also, if you are calling a person an idiot, you might want to learn how to spell it first, just sayin.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

colfax_m said:


> If only you knew what you’re talking about.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wrong.
You did not actually read the study.
It proved nothing about T-cell memory.
That is because you can not test for or detect T-cell immunity until you infect someone, and monitor the response.
This study was done after a second vaccine injection, which invalidated the study, because the vaccine stimulated a temporary antibody production, so was NOT measuring long term T-cell response.

{...
In the group of participants who did not previously have COVID-19, they found that the first vaccine dose elicited a rapid and strong response from helper T cells called CD4 T cells—some of which help marshal an antibody response, while others stimulate the proliferation of CD8 killer T cells. The strengths of those initial CD4 T cell responses generally predicted the later strengths of antibody and killer T-cell responses. However, the killer T cells tended not to appear in large numbers until after the second vaccine dose—confirming the importance of that second dose for people with no COVID-19 history.

By contrast, in the prior-COVID-19 group, helper and killer T cells specific for the COVID-19 coronavirus were already substantially present before the first dose. After that first dose, T cell numbers rose somewhat, but did not significantly increase after the second dose.

“For people who haven’t had COVID-19, the first dose powerfully primes the pump, and the second dose turns on the whole engine—but having had COVID-19 is like having had that first vaccine dose already,” Wherry said. “It is important to point out, however, that a complete understanding of the relative importance of these T cell responses, compared to antibody, in protection from future infections will require larger clinical studies.”

The results also showed that the T-cell response in the weeks after mRNA vaccination includes T-cell types normally elicited by natural infection—and in general, natural viral infection is known to be capable of inducing T-cell protection that lasts years and even decades.

“We need to do follow-up studies to confirm the longevity of the T-cell response to vaccination, but our results here support the idea that that response can be long-lasting,” Wherry said.
...}

Notice those who recovered from covid did not need any vaccines in order to have an immune response, while the first injection produced no immune response in those who had never been been infected.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> My mom took it and said the same thing about the booster.


If the all the vaccine does is produce the antibodies and it is limited, why not just do the antibody therapies that are out there, they seem to be working well.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)




----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> No variants are the reason we will never get this under control. We have for decades used flu shots and yet the flu and it's variants continue. Africa has a low 6% vaccination rate and has tons of variants coming out of there and it will continue. We currently have 2 billion vaccinated while we have 7.7 billion inhabitants. If you really want to see an end to this you need 7.7 billion of the original and 7.7 billion shots for each variant.
> 
> It's called science. Also, if you are calling a person an idiot, you might want to learn how to spell it first, just sayin.



Variants explain why flu vaccines have to be changed each season, so they contain the right flu variant to trigger the immune system on.
But since these mRNA injections do not have any virus in them, then they should work on all variants as well, as long as they use the same spike protein.
And the spike protein can't change, or else it would not open the ACE2 receptors.
So then the only logical conclusion is that none of the mRNA injections have any effect on immune system memory at all.
They just temporarily stimulate antibody production, without any long term effect.
They are claiming it is the variants causing new surges in infections among the vaccinated, but that can't be the case, because they are not changing the boosters to match the variants, but the boosters then temporarily work on the new variants.
That means all the mRNA shots are just temporary.
They have no longer term memory effect.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> If the all the vaccine does is produce the antibodies and it is limited, why not just do the antibody therapies that are out there, they seem to be working well.



Exactly.
Instead of risking death by producing spike proteins in OUR cells, it would be much safer to product the spike proteins in the lab, or to produce monoclonal antibodies in the lab.


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

2aguy said:


> The democrats did this because they wanted to win an election...you doofus.


Those nasty Democrats set loose a global epidemic that killed millions just to beat Trump


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Lovebears65 said:


> Biden's whole campaign made it political  yet you were quiet about that


Because he advocated vaccines?


----------



## Desperado (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Those nasty Democrats set loose a global epidemic that killed millions just to beat Trump


China with the help of the democrats set the virus in motion.


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Desperado said:


> China with the help of the democrats set the virus in motion.



Those sneaky Chinese invented a virus that they set loose on their own people without a cure

They then destroyed the global market for their own goods


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Likely mRNA techniques can not and





Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> It has since then been determined that the mRNA injections just temporarily stimulate some antibody production.
> It puts nothing into long term T-cell memory, so is 0% effective as a vaccine.


Moron, how does 0% effective vaccine show 95% efficacy in double blind medical studies?

Why do you keep saying blatant bullshit?


----------



## Flash (Nov 26, 2021)

My wife and I got the vaccine because it was the right medical decision for us.

It should be up to you if you want to get it or not.  I am sure as hell not going to tell you to get it and we sure as hell don't need the government forcing you to get  it.

I believe in personal responsibility and Liberty, unlike these Karens.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Wong.
> India has a 55% vaccination rate.
> And the delta variant is NOT a mutation.


Moron, at the time Delta showed up in India vaccination rate was about 20%.

Delta is ABSOLUTELY a derivative of prior Covid 19 generations.


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Flash said:


> My wife and I got the vaccine because it was the right medical decision for us.
> 
> It should be up to you if you want to get it or not.  I am sure as hell not going to tell you to get it and we sure as hell don't need the government forcing you to get  it.
> 
> I believe in personal responsibility and Liberty, unlike these Karens.


I agree

It should be up to you if you choose to be a threat to other people

But society should not allow you the same access as regular people


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Because he advocated vaccines?


During his campaign he questioned whether one should take the Trump vaccine. So he was against it before he was for it.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

You are never going to change the mind of someone that hasnt taken the vaccine by this point.


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> During his campaign he questioned whether one should take the Trump vaccine. So he was against it before he was for it.


Actually, both Biden and Harris said they would get vaccinated as soon as Medical Experts said it was safe

But they did say they would not take Trumps word on its safety. 
They also did not rush out to inject disinfectant


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

Flash said:


> My wife and I got the vaccine because it was the right medical decision for us.
> 
> It should be up to you if you want to get it or not.  I am sure as hell not going to tell you to get it and we sure as hell don't need the government forcing you to get  it.
> 
> I believe in personal responsibility and Liberty, unlike these Karens.


Viruses dont care about liberty.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Because he advocated vaccines?


Oh.  Did he decide to call India and get a real vaccine.  When are they giving it out.......hmmm


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Actually, both Biden and Harris said they would get vaccinated as soon as Medical Experts said it was safe
> 
> But they did say they would not take Trumps word on its safety.
> They also did not rush out to inject disinfectant


Who took a disinfectant?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Viruses dont care about liberty.


Can you quote them saying that on youtube please.  I didn't know they could speak.  thanks.


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Who took a disinfectant?



See?

Nobody trusted Trumps recommendations


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Can you quote them saying that on youtube please.  I didn't know they could speak.  thanks.


Exactly.  Thanks for making my point.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Actually, both Biden and Harris said they would get vaccinated as soon as Medical Experts said it was safe
> 
> But they did say they would not take Trumps word on its safety.
> They also did not rush out to inject disinfectant


Right because the FDA would not approve of the vaccine? Oh wait, they did, so Biden was politicizing the virus, something you just claimed he did not do. 

Maybe if he quit politicizing the virus, more would be accomplished however that is not the narrative the want to push, they are happy with politics being injected into the issue until it is no longer an advantage, which seems to be happening.


----------



## colfax_m (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> You did not actually read the study.
> It proved nothing about T-cell memory.
> That is because you can not test for or detect T-cell immunity until you infect someone, and monitor the response.
> This study was done after a second vaccine injection, which invalidated the study, because the vaccine stimulated a temporary antibody production, so was NOT measuring long term T-cell response.


Literally nothing you said here is true.

The presence of T-cells is T-cell memory.

You can test and detect T-cell immunity without infecting someone.

The second dose does not invalidate the study because it has nothing to do with antibody production.

You simply have no idea what you're talking about. Again.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> See?
> 
> Nobody trusted Trumps recommendations


Show us where Trump specifically told us to take a disinfectant.


----------



## colfax_m (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> There's no conspiracy to the deaths that are occurring from this injection.


Don't know what hospital you're in, but we have had a LOT more deaths among the unvaccinated.

Had a lady show up, lots of risk factors, rather poor health overall. Unvaccinated. 

Now on the ventilator, pressors, dialysis, shock liver, ventilator essentially maximized. Family says she'd want everything done. Full code. All of this almost certainly would have been prevented with a simple cheap vaccine.


----------



## colfax_m (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> After taking smallpox, polio, measles, mumps, pertussis, etc. vaccines, how many people fail to mount any immune response to smallpox, polio, measles, mumps, pertussis, etc.?
> The answer it ZERO.


Of course you have proof  of this, no doubt...


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Right because the FDA would not approve of the vaccine? Oh wait, they did, so Biden was politicizing the virus, something you just claimed he did not do.
> 
> Maybe if he quit politicizing the virus, more would be accomplished however that is not the narrative the want to push, they are happy with politics being injected into the issue until it is no longer an advantage, which seems to be happening.


WTF are you babbling about?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Exactly.  Thanks for making my point.


Anytime.  Go get your next jab bro.  It's out of date.  

Fuck Fa Chi.

and 

LETS GO BRANDON.

Glad we could clear that up.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Right because the FDA would not approve of the vaccine? Oh wait, they did, so Biden was politicizing the virus, something you just claimed he did not do.
> 
> Maybe if he quit politicizing the virus, more would be accomplished however that is not the narrative the want to push, they are happy with politics being injected into the issue until it is no longer an advantage, which seems to be happening.



Here is both Biden and Harris getting PUBLICLY vaccinated in Dec 2020, as soon as it was cleared for emergency use by FDA:











Trump? You will not find pictures of him getting vaccinated, he didn't give enough shit.

So wtf are you talking about?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Here is both Biden and Harris getting PUBLICLY vaccinated as soon as it was cleared for emergency use by FDA:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So.  who cares.  Looks like 2 more lab rats to me.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> WTF are you babbling about?


Thank you for just giving up and admitting Biden politicized Covid.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Anytime.  Go get your next jab bro.  It's out of date.
> 
> Fuck Fa Chi.
> 
> ...


Actually I was looking into getting my booster just today.  But thanks for the reminder.  I can tell you're a deep thinking, thoughtful individual.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Actually I was looking into getting my booster just today.  But thanks for the reminder.  I can tell you're a deep thinking, thoughtful individual.


No boosters for me, my choice, I had Covid before the vaccine and after the vaccine, post vaccine the virus was worse. All the vaccine is, is anti-body therapy, you can get that as soon as you test positive of Covid and the results are the same.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Thank you for just giving up and admitting Biden politicized Covid.


Everyone keeps asking you wtf you are talking about and you can't seem to explain.

Covid brain?


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> No boosters for me, my choice, I had Covid before the vaccine and after the vaccine, post vaccine the virus was worse. All the vaccine is, is anti-body therapy, you can get that as soon as you test positive of Covid and the results are the same.


Great.  Don't get it.  You've proven you can get Covid a 2nd time.  One might think you are even more susceptible to it since you've had it twice.  But by all means, dont get a shot.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Actually I was looking into getting my booster just today.  But thanks for the reminder.  I can tell you're a deep thinking, thoughtful individual.


Yes .  I thought you needed the reminder.  Enjoy the Clot shot.  Have fun as it escapes your arm and moves into organs............to be continued......


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> All the vaccine is, is anti-body therapy, you can get that as soon as you test positive of Covid and the results are the same.


You mean aside from America luxuriously spending $2000-3000 a pop on monoclonal antibody infusions?


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Yes .  I thought you needed the reminder.  Enjoy the Clot shot.  Have fun as it escapes your arm and moves into organs............to be continued......


You must have a weird perspective on how the human body functions.  I'd love to hear about it sometime.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

How in hell can this dipshit Chinese communist virus not be politicized? American prisoners have the choice of mRNA, a chimp-based non-coronavirus, and a human-based non-coronavirus vaccine, none of which contains the entire virus, as does Covaxin. Americans are being refused access to vaccines made in the traditional way with the entire virus.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

https://wonder.cdc.gov/controller/datarequest/D8;jsessionid=423A084A83A800AED538C0692BDD
		


6887 deaths so far.  Show me the other vaccines with this many reported deaths....


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> You must have a weird perspective on how the human body functions.  I'd love to hear about it sometime.


How so.  The lady is having a heart attack or an upset stomach from listening to people like you.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

badger2 said:


> How in hell can this dipshit Chinese communist virus not be politicized? American prisoners have the choice of mRNA, a chimp-based non-coronavirus, and a human-based non-coronavirus vaccine, none of which contains the entire virus, as does Covaxin. Americans are being refused access to vaccines made in the traditional way with the entire virus.


Alex, I'll take Johnson & Johnson vaccine for $1000.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

badger2 said:


> How in hell can this dipshit Chinese communist virus not be politicized? American prisoners have the choice of mRNA, a chimp-based non-coronavirus, and a human-based non-coronavirus vaccine, none of which contains the entire virus, as does Covaxin. Americans are being refused access to vaccines made in the traditional way with the entire virus.


They don't care.  Gov't is their GOD.  Just the cheap drugs would save hundreds of thousands of lives.

Western countries are doing the same in many places.  Going full Nazi in many.  Brain Washed idiots.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Alex, I'll take Johnson & Johnson for $1000.


It's a single spike protein IDIOT.  The one he's talking about is the whole virus.  Data from India says you SUCK.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> https://wonder.cdc.gov/controller/datarequest/D8;jsessionid=423A084A83A800AED538C0692BDD
> 
> 
> 
> 6887 deaths so far.  Show me the other vaccines with this many reported deaths....


Your link is about as bust as your understanding of the data.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Your link is about as bust as your understanding of the data.


It doesn't allow it to go to your search.

Go back.  Hit i agree at bottom of page.  Click section 3 Covid 19  Go to the bottom and search.

This is the gov't website for VAERs.  

Enjoy.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> It's a single spike protein IDIOT.  The one he's talking about is the whole virus.  Data from India says you SUCK.


Hey look we have a virologist and immunologist in our midst!


----------



## maybelooking (Nov 26, 2021)

because freedom is soooooo irrational!!!!!


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> It doesn't allow it to go to your search.
> 
> Go back.  Hit i agree at bottom of page.  Click section 3 Covid 19  Go to the bottom and search.
> 
> ...


Yep I was right, you are clueless about what you are reading.

VAERS is a PUBLIC REPORTING TOOL, and does not establish CAUSALITY.

If you give sugar pill to 450 million people, some small number of them will die shortly after. It does not mean that the sugar pill caused the deaths.



CDC's explanation:









						COVID-19 Vaccination
					

COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.




					www.cdc.gov
				




*Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare*. More than 452 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through November 22, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 10,014 reports of death (0022%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine. FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it’s unclear whether the vaccine was the cause. *Reports of adverse events to VAERS following vaccination, including deaths, do not necessarily mean that a vaccine caused a health problem. * CDC clinicians review reports of death to VAERS including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records. A review of reports indicates a causal relationship between the J&J/Janssen COVID-19 Vaccine and TTS, a rare and serious adverse event—that causes blood clots with low platelets—which has caused or directly contributed to six confirmed deathsexternal icon.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Hey look we have a virologist and immunologist in our midst!


Nope its called I can read and have read more than I've ever cared to on this FUCKING BS.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Alex, I'll take Johnson & Johnson vaccine for $1000.


That’s not a coronavirus being used. India’s Covaxin uses the actual entire virus, SARS-CoV-2. Truckers may be compromised by giving their immune systems only Chinese virus parts to confront rather than the entire virus. They already walk a fine line for weight gain and sedentation. Truckers should demand all the choices available to them, not just the one’s JoeXi’s handlers suggest.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Yep I was right, you are clueless about what you are reading.
> 
> VAERS is a PUBLIC REPORTING TOOL, and does not establish CAUSALITY.
> 
> ...


You can explain it till you are blue in the face, these animals wont and/or dont understand it.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> That you have a choice? You you can decide for yourself? I'm vaxxed and I won't get the booster.



Then you're even dumber than I thought you were, which doesn't say much for you.  Vaccines aren't a matter of "freedom" in a pandemic, and they never have been throughout recorded history.  Furthermore, you're not even qualified to decide for yourself unless have a degree in advanced medical research.

That you're gullible enough to believe this is a matter of "personal freedom" shows both a dearth of common sense, and a complete lack of critical thinking skills.  You're being encouraged to do things that are no only against your own best interests, but against those of your community and your nation.  The people promoting your "freedom and independence" are those with a financial interest in keeping the virus going, and that includes FOX News, and its owner.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Nope its called I can read and have read more than I've ever cared to on this FUCKING BS.


You seemingly think you know more about it than virologists and immunologists.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Yep I was right, you are clueless about what you are reading.
> 
> VAERS is a PUBLIC REPORTING TOOL, and does not establish CAUSALITY.
> 
> ...


And the doctors are the ones reporting it.  Most have no clue what the terms in the whole data base are.  And most don't even know this place exists.

But oh well.  Drink the Gov't swill.


----------



## Fueri (Nov 26, 2021)

It would help greatly if:

A.  They began being honest about potential risks.



			https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/circ.144.suppl_1.10712
		


B.  Released the FDA paperwork in a timely fasion









						Wait what? FDA wants 55 years to process FOIA request over vaccine data
					

Freedom of Information Act requests are rarely speedy, but when a group of scientists asked the federal government to share the data it relied upon in licensing Pfizer’s COVID-19 vaccine, the response went beyond typical bureaucratic foot-dragging.




					www.reuters.com
				




C.  The CDC was not so obviously full of shit on multiple things.

All of these, and other factors, have led to a massive loss of trust in public health.  People are not going to line up for something when they have zero trust in those pushing it.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> You can explain it till you are blue in the face, these animals wont and/or dont understand it.


They won't, but someone reading their tripe might.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Then you're even dumber than I thought you were, which doesn't say much for you.  Vaccines aren't a matter of "freedom" in a pandemic, and they never have been throughout recorded history.  Furthermore, you're not even qualified to decide for yourself unless have a degree in advanced medical research.
> 
> That you're gullible enough to believe this is a matter of "personal freedom" shows both a dearth of common sense, and a complete lack of critical thinking skills.  You're being encouraged to do things that are no only against your own best interests, but against those of your community and your nation.  The people promoting your "freedom and independence" are those with a financial interest in keeping the virus going, and that includes FOX News, and its owner.


He's even admitted to supposedly getting Covid twice.  He must REALLY be susceptible to it.  But he isnt getting the booster.  LOL makes sense.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> You seemingly think you know more about it than virologists and immunologists.


That is baloney.  I read from all over the world their opinions on this.  And I post those findings not tied to the ass of the Pharma assholes who are in bed with Govt.

So.  Why does the United States have the worst stats in the world on this virus........well Peru shows higher.  So second highest.

Why the fuck would I listen to a coach who is losing the game?


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> That is baloney.  I read from all over the world their opinions on this.  And I post those findings not tied to the ass of the Pharma assholes who are in bed with Govt.
> 
> So.  Why does the United States have the worst stats in the world on this virus........well Peru shows higher.  So second highest.
> 
> Why the fuck would I listen to a coach who is losing the game?


That's ironic.  You're part of the reason we are losing the game.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> They won't, but someone reading their tripe might.


And here goes the LETS SENSOR THEM .......coming soon to every social media network near you.

Show me why countries with 4 times the population have less than half our deaths.

India.  Go......


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> That's ironic.  You're part of the reason we are losing the game.


And I think you are the reason.  So there we are.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And I think you are the reason.  So there we are.


History is already on my side, not yours.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And the doctors are the ones reporting it.  Most have no clue what the terms in the whole data base are.  And most don't even know this place exists.
> 
> But oh well.  Drink the Gov't swill.


Medical professionals submitting a death report  following vaccination is REQUIRED.

Does not matter if they think the death was caused by vaccine or not.





__





						VAERS - Report an Adverse Event
					






					vaers.hhs.gov


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> History is already on my side, not yours.


Nope.  When we get to jab number 20 get back to me on that.  lol


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Medical professionals submitting a death report  following vaccination is REQUIRED.
> 
> Does not matter if they think the death was caused by vaccine or not.
> 
> ...


And.  They die right after getting the vaccine........Whats the problem.  hmmm

You are giving excuses.  Have thousands died or not.  Oh I know wait for the CDC who is up Phama's ass to tell you what to say.

Got it.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And here goes the LETS SENSOR THEM


Moron, who is sensoring, or attempting to sensor you here?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And.  They die right after getting the vaccine........Whats the problem.  hmmm



Did I not just explain that out of 450 million doses some are EXPECTED to die in the following weeks even if you are distributing a sugar pill?

About 8000 Americans die everyday, someone died as I typed this.

Can you get around to understanding that simple concept?


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And.  They die right after getting the vaccine........Whats the problem.  hmmm
> 
> You are giving excuses.  Have thousands died or not.  Oh I know wait for the CDC who is up Phama's ass to tell you what to say.
> 
> Got it.


I guess you're not done making a fool out of yourself.  You cant even understand the simple concept even after it was explained to you.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Moron, who is sensoring, or attempting to sensor you here?


I was referring to your conversation to the other jack ass.  You know what I meant.

Doesn't matter.  We are AGAINST EACH OTHER HERE.  Oh Well.

My view versus yours.  Except our views don't matter............ONLY GOD FACI AND THE FDA MATTER HERE.

They stop treatments used all around the world that are CHEAP AND EFFECTIVE.  They are responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths because of it.

I don't give a Fuck if you agree or not.  Time will show the real truth.  It always does.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Did I not just explain that out of 450 million some are EXPECTED to die even if you are distributing a sugar pill?
> 
> About 8000 American die everyday, someone died as typed this.


Like I said, you cant reason with these animals.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Did I not just explain that out of 450 million some are EXPECTED to die even if you are distributing a sugar pill?
> 
> About 8000 American die everyday, someone died as I typed this.


LOL  Now you justify their deaths from the jab as SHIT HAPPENS.  LOL

What you are saying is STFU and get the jab.  NO


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Great.  Don't get it.  You've proven you can get Covid a 2nd time.  One might think you are even more susceptible to it since you've had it twice.  But by all means, dont get a shot.


Had the two shots and now I am done, and I don't need your permission to get or not get a booster.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Had the two shots and now I am done, and I don't need your permission to get or not get a booster.


Sleep well!


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> LOL  Now you justify their deaths from the jab as SHIT HAPPENS.  LOL
> 
> What you are saying is STFU and get the jab.  NO


Ok obviously I'm dealing with someone not quite mentally developed for even simple concepts like expected mortality rates.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> LOL  Now you justify their deaths from the jab as SHIT HAPPENS.  LOL
> 
> What you are saying is STFU and get the jab.  NO


Do you understand the term "causation"?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> Had the two shots and now I am done, and I don't need your permission to get or not get a booster.


Do you think it's possible you would have been a lot worse off without them?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Ok obviously you not quite mentally developed for even simple concepts about death statistics.


I posted the death per day not long after this BS started.  It was 7800 a day here then. 

Mental  FUCK YOU .  There is your mental. 

Cheap drugs denied in this country.  And choice of a better vaccine denied in this county

People like you are killing right now.  Not me.


----------



## Turtlesoup (Nov 26, 2021)

Clipper said:


> People like you are the reason that there ARE waves. Prople like you are the reason that we will never be over this due to your anti vaxx insanity.
> 
> Maybe your mind should be open to facts such as 90% of people dying from this are unvaccinated.
> 
> 800,000 dead people ain't enough for ya, moron?


Virus run their course--they hit for about 3 years and fade away---fucking with these fake vaccines is going to drag this out for ever.  Maybe you should worry about your "facts" and watch how vaccinated is being redefined constantly.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Ok enough  of this back and forth.

I say Fuck you and you say the same to me.

That is clear.  Enjoy your jabs.  I'm not getting them.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Ok enough  of this back and forth.
> 
> I say Fuck you and you say the same to me.
> 
> That is clear.  Enjoy your jabs.  I'm not getting them.


I dont want you to get the jab.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> I dont want you to get the jab.


Good.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I posted the death per day not long after this BS started.  It was 7800 a day here then.
> 
> Mental  FUCK YOU .  There is your mental.
> 
> ...


No nutbag, it's people like you who don't know their face from their ass that are irresponsibly spreading half-baked anti-vaxer falsehoods and cause preventable misery and death.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> If the all the vaccine does is produce the antibodies and it is limited, why not just do the antibody therapies that are out there, they seem to be working well.



Because the antibody therapies cost $3,000 per patient, and the vaccine costs $30.  Because the antibodies won't stop you from getting "long haul covid", only reduce its severity.  Because you don't know what kind of covid you'll end up with until you get it.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Because the antibody therapies cost $3,000 per patient, and the vaccine costs $30.  Because the antibodies won't stop you from getting "long haul covid", only reduce its severity.  Because you don't know what kind of covid you'll end up with until you get it.


Speaking of long haul covid, I read an article about a woman that committed suicide because her long haul covid was so bad.  Left a suicide note apologizing to her husband and kid.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Then you're even dumber than I thought you were, which doesn't say much for you.  Vaccines aren't a matter of "freedom" in a pandemic, and they never have been throughout recorded history.  Furthermore, you're not even qualified to decide for yourself unless have a degree in advanced medical research.
> 
> That you're gullible enough to believe this is a matter of "personal freedom" shows both a dearth of common sense, and a complete lack of critical thinking skills.  You're being encouraged to do things that are no only against your own best interests, but against those of your community and your nation.  The people promoting your "freedom and independence" are those with a financial interest in keeping the virus going, and that includes FOX News, and its owner.


You are no dumber than I first thought but I know rocks are smarter than you. I don't listen to a medical recommendation and accept it as the end all to be all. I ask my doctor about treatments and side effects from all drugs. My doctor is fine without me taking a booster, he thinks I'll be fine without the booster, so do I listen to a stupid moronic idiot, like yourself or my doctor? Easy answer, you are a dummy, she has a degree in medicine and reads the latest information. I'll follow her, not you, you idiot!


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Because the antibody therapies cost $3,000 per patient, and the vaccine costs $30.  Because the antibodies won't stop you from getting "long haul covid", only reduce its severity.  Because you don't know what kind of covid you'll end up with until you get it.


I have Covid twice, pre-vaccine and post vaccine, I did better the first go round, with the vaccine it still took 10 days and it was worse than the first run. It is my decision, not yours, I don't care what you decide to do, you and your life are not my business, just as my life is not your business.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Sleep well!


Always do.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

Papageorgio said:


> You are no dumber than I first thought but I know rocks are smarter than you. I don't listen to a medical recommendation and accept it as the end all to be all. I ask my doctor about treatments and side effects from all drugs. My doctor is fine without me taking a booster, he thinks I'll be fine without the booster, so do I listen to a stupid moronic idiot, like yourself or my doctor? Easy answer, you are a dummy, she has a degree in medicine and reads the latest information. I'll follow her, not you, you idiot!


Pretty sure you're lying.  But that's your issue.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> They changed it to accommodate an injection that isn't a conventional vaccine.  Its not a conventional vaccine.  I want more accuracy and this new definition doesn't provide such.


No the change actually made the definition more accurate.

If you know of any vaccine that has ever provided 100% immunity why don't you post the data?


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Do you think it's possible you would have been a lot worse off without them?


I had covid end of November last year and then got a vaccine in September, then got covid in mid October, the November case was milder and this last one was tougher, more fatigue than the first round. Time it took to recover was 10 days on both.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

2aguy said:


> The vaccines are a brand new technology, they are not the traditional vaccine...they aren't even really vaccines...they simply boost your immunity, but still allow you to get infected.
> 
> Because they are new, the actual side effects and long term effects are not well know.....so if you are an individual who is relatively young, healthy.....you don't have much if anything to fear from getting covid...and as the actual science shows, if you get it and get through it, you have actual immunity to it going forward......
> 
> ...


They're not that new









						The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
					

A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.




					publichealth.jhu.edu


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> No nutbag, it's people like you who don't know their face from their ass that are irresponsibly spreading half-baked anti-vaxer falsehoods and cause preventable misery and death.


BS  Cheap drugs are used all over the world and are denied here.  Not half baked.  You are just preaching about your GOD GOV'T.

Stats don't lie.  Our countries stats suck because of sheep like you.


----------



## Desperado (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Those sneaky Chinese invented a virus that they set loose on their own people without a cure
> 
> They then destroyed the global market for their own goods


The Chinese do not have the same respect for life,  The have a bilion chinese so they don't care if they loose a few. plus it give them plausable deniability.  The Chinese destroyed American manufacturing so they were ok with a slowdown in the sale of their goods because they knew it would pic back up


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> The new definition is a joke.  By that definition the cheap treatments in India are a dang vaccine.


No they're not.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

badger2 said:


> Please post the citations and links for application in humans.











						The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
					

A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.




					publichealth.jhu.edu
				




The first mRNA vaccines using these fatty envelopes were developed against the deadly Ebola virus, but since that virus is only found in a limited number of African countries, it had no commercial development in the U.S.


----------



## westwall (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...




Then you ARE NOT a conservative.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> No they're not.


LOL

By the NEW DEFINITION TO SUIT THE NEW VACCINE.

LMAO

Only in America do we need to change long held definitions to suit the narrative.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Our countries stats suck because of sheep like you.


Meh you're pretty wrong on that.  You are the one fighting against having things other 1st world countries have.

Now I will give you that meds are cheaper in other 1st world countries.  But that's because politicians on both sides of the aisle take pharma money.  Which wouldnt be an issue if repubs wouldnt have allowed corps to own politicians.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

westwall said:


> Then you ARE NOT a conservative.


Biden isnt a liberal.  Anyone against universal healthcare is NOT a liberal.


----------



## Papageorgio (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Pretty sure you're lying.  But that's your issue.


I have no issue and I didn't ask you to believe me. My doctor recommends for me not to get a booster, there are signs it could suppress my immune system but she is still looking into it. The vaccine. that hasn't prevent me from getting covid a second time, is good until March supposedly but who knows.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Meh you're pretty wrong on that.  You are the one fighting against having things other 1st world countries have.
> 
> Now I will give you that meds are cheaper in other 1st world countries.  But that's because politicians on both sides of the aisle take pharma money.  Which wouldnt be an issue if repubs wouldnt have allowed corps to own politicians.


They gave out health kits in these countries to be taken EARLY as soon as symptoms appeared.

Night and day difference.  Here.  Go home and quarantine.. Then they don't go to hospital til it's too damned late.

Early treatment is the key or have you missed that too.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> LOL
> 
> By the NEW DEFINITION TO SUIT THE NEW VACCINE.
> 
> ...


Treating symptoms is not the same as preventing infection

And definitions change all the time the language isn't static.

But in this case the definition is actually MORE accurate than the old one Why do you have a problem with a more accurate definition?

Or are you trying to say that there are actually vaccines that provide 100% immunity to a disease?

If so please post the data on those vaccines.


----------



## Desperado (Nov 26, 2021)

colfax_m said:


> Don't know what hospital you're in, but we have had a LOT more deaths among the unvaccinated.
> 
> Had a lady show up, lots of risk factors, rather poor health overall. Unvaccinated.
> 
> Now on the ventilator, pressors, dialysis, shock liver, ventilator essentially maximized. Family says she'd want everything done. Full code. All of this almost certainly would have been prevented with a simple cheap vaccine.


Right the vaccine would have cured all her other health problems


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> They gave out health kits in these countries to be taken EARLY as soon as symptoms appeared.
> 
> Night and day difference.  Here.  Go home and quarantine.. Then they don't go to hospital til it's too damned late.
> 
> Early treatment is the key or have you missed that too.


You mean kits provided by the government?  LOL you know how difficult that would be to get accomplished in this country because it sounds like "communism".  LOL get real.


----------



## BertramN (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Like Governors DeSantis and Abbott, the overwhelming majority of trump Nazis are honoring their cheeto-in-chief's "advice" to avoid wearing masks, disregard social distancing recommendations, and above all, shun all attempts by officials to force vaccinations onto you and your loved ones.

After all, just because the percentage of COVID deaths are the unvaccinated, and mostly in red states, there is no reason the trump Nazis should lose faith in their cheeto-in-chief's medical expertise.



.


----------



## colfax_m (Nov 26, 2021)

Desperado said:


> Right the vaccine would have cured all her other health problems


Nope. But she ain’t dying of her other problems. She’s dying of COVID.


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

Desperado said:


> The Chinese do not have the same respect for life,  The have a bilion chinese so they don't care if they loose a few. plus it give them plausable deniability.  The Chinese destroyed American manufacturing so they were ok with a slowdown in the sale of their goods because they knew it would pic back up


It crippled their economy worse than it did ours and we recovered quicker

But your Kung Flu conspiracy keeps living


----------



## rightwinger (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Biden isnt a liberal.  Anyone against universal healthcare is NOT a liberal.


 Biden has always been a moderate


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Treating symptoms is not the same as preventing infection
> 
> And definitions change all the time the language isn't static.
> 
> ...


More excuses.  The definition was fine til they needed to change it for mRNA. 








						The CDC Suddenly Changes the Definition of ‘Vaccine’ and ‘Vaccination’ - Citizens Journal
					

By Nick Arama, Red State Matt Margolis over at our sister site PJ Media has picked up on a very interesting change on the CDC website when it comes to the definitions for “vaccine” and “vaccination.” The timing of the change is very interesting. He notes that it would appear that the CDC is trying




					www.citizensjournal.us
				




Of course you will post the PRAVDA of the CDC saying opposite.

Protection from the virus.

Well there are drugs you can take that do that now.  So they are now vaccines.

lol


----------



## westwall (Nov 26, 2021)

john doe 101 said:


> Biden isnt a liberal.  Anyone against universal healthcare is NOT a liberal.





No shit, he's a fascist.

Duh.


----------



## john doe 101 (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Biden has always been a moderate


I wouldnt even call him a moderate.  I'd put him firmly right wing.  Hell there are plenty of right wingers in Europe that embrace universal health insurance.


----------



## Desperado (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> It crippled their economy worse than it did ours and we recovered quicker
> 
> But your Kung Flu conspiracy keeps living


As it should, the virus did not come out of a meat market in Wuhan it came out of the bio lab in Wuhan


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I posted the death per day not long after this BS started.  It was 7800 a day here then.
> 
> Mental  FUCK YOU .  There is your mental.
> 
> ...



Your death rate has NEVER been 7800 per day.  Deaths peaked at 4,430 on January 27, 2021 - that.  As for the peak number of deaths in the spring "not long after this BS started" that was 2,731 on April 21st. This is why you're one of the most misinformed posters on this board.  Scroll down to the dail

*








						United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info
				



*
More important than cheap drugs, the decision NOT to use the cheap, effective WHO tests so that Big Pharma could profit off an exclusive rights "Made in America" test, cost the USA more than 3 months time in having a quick efficient test available.  If the USA had tested everyone coming in to the country from Europe and China, you could have cut this virus off before it got into the country.

Instead, calling Americans home from China ACCELERATED the spread of the disease because 40,000 people came into the country with being tested.  Canada tested everyone coming in from China and other hotspots and cut the virus off at the knees.  But within 2 weeks of calling Canadians home from the USA and closing the border, the virus was out of control because there was no testing except at the airports, and people didn't quarantine as requested.

Trump's decision to sell ALL of America's stockpile of PPE to China in January (more profit for Big Pharma), without keeping enough for American hospitals was also a bad mistake.  Trump was more concerned that American corporations profit off the pandemic than he was about keeping Americans from getting sick.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> More excuses.  The definition was fine til they needed to change it for mRNA.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's not a vaccine in the classic sense but it's also not a medicine to treat the disease.  It's a vaccination which introduces parts of the virus into your body so that when you become infected it should - in theory - provide a faster response by your body's autoimmune system than it would have otherwise.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Your death rate has NEVER been 7800 per day.  Deaths peaked at 4,430 on January 27, 2021 - that.  As for the peak number of deaths in the spring "not long after this BS started" that was 2,731 on April 21st. This is why you're one of the most misinformed posters on this board.  Scroll down to the dail
> 
> *
> 
> ...


lol

idiot.  Deaths per day of all causes in the united states.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Biden has always been a moderate



There isn't a "radical liberal" in the entire Democratic Party.  It's fully a centre right party since most Democrats favour gun rights, and few support worker rights to healthcare, vacations or family leave.  The Biden Administration is much further to the left of the Clinton Administration, though.  Bill Clinton embraced Milton Friedman's "capitalism on steroids" concept of cutting social safety nets.  Yes, Clinton promoted healthcare reform, but his welfare reform program was wrong headed and did more harm than good.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> lol
> 
> idiot.  Deaths per day of all causes in the united states.



Ill informed, yet again.  500,000 excess deaths from all sources in the USA between March 2020, and January 2, 2021, corresponding to the 500,000 covid deaths during the same time frame.









						Excess Deaths From COVID-19 and Other Causes in the US, March 2020 to January 2021
					

This study updates an analysis of US mortality in 2020, including deaths due to COVID-19 as well as all other causes.




					jamanetwork.com
				




Those who are consistently proven WRONG on ever post, and who can never back up the statistics you pull out of your ass, should really never, ever call the poster who proves them wrong every single time, an "idiot".  

You lie, you pull misinformation out your ass, and then insult those who prove you're lying.  You're no "eagle", FuckBoi.  You're just a shitbird.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Ill informed, yet again.  500,000 excess deaths from all sources in the USA between March 2020, and January 2, 2021, corresponding to the 500,000 covid deaths during the same time frame.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Shut up.  The argument was any death per day.  NOT COVID


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Shut up.  The argument was any death per day.  NOT COVID



Proven wrong yet again, and you tell me to "shut up".  

I guess you didn't read my link at all, did you Shitbird?  The USA AVERAGED 7,675 deaths per day all year long.  7,800 deaths a death while the hospitals are overflowing and 2000 people a day are dying of the crud is really not that high.  

Care to try again, Seagull, or are you going to continue to humiliate yourself?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Proven wrong yet again, and you tell me to "shut up".
> 
> I guess you didn't read my link at all, did you Shitbird?  The USA AVERAGED 7,675 deaths per day all year long.  7,800 deaths a death while the hospitals are overflowing and 2000 people a day are dying of the crud is really not that high.
> 
> Care to try again, Seagull, or are you going to continue to humiliate yourself?


Go play in traffic idiot.


----------



## g5000 (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


My wife and one of my closest friends both have suppressed immune systems, particularly my friend with MS.

I got the vaccine for them more than for myself.

My brother has COPD and one of his lungs is non-functioning.  He's a die hard Trump lover and refuses to get the vaccine.  I have begged and begged him to get it, but he just says, "I've already come close to dying three times, so God obviously wants me around for some reason." 

Fortunately, he lives in a very isolated location and his wife has been vaccinated because she works at a hospital.  But her daughter won't get vaxxed and she visits them all the time.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Go play in traffic idiot.



Your concession is noted, Shitbird.  Stop spreading bullshit and propaganda and this won't happen to you.

Oh yeah, calling people who are clearly smarter than you'll ever be "idiots", over and over again, really just make you look like a short bus kid.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

g5000 said:


> My wife and one of my closest friends both have suppressed immune systems, particularly my friend with MS.
> 
> I got the vaccine for them more than for myself.
> 
> ...


I'm getting my booster on Monday.  I have a pretty good immune system but my wife does not.  We've both had two shots.  With that said it's better to not get it than to get it.  Just because people are vaccinated does not mean they can't get it and spread it.  It's not a vaccine in the classic sense.  It's a vaccination which introduces parts of the virus into your body so that when you become infected it should - in theory - provide a faster response by your body's autoimmune system than it would have otherwise.  There's no downside to getting vaccinated, but one must still follow protocols and be smart.  It's ridiculous this has been politicized.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

We are suspicious of forced mRNA production of Chinese communist virus parts, especially in children without fully developed immune systems. The other two choices are different viruses, not even coronaviruseS, and one of these is from a chimpanzee. The traditional and real vaccine is India’s Covaxin. Americans have no access to the entire, real virus vaccine.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

So the confounding of different vaccines are not the only political parameters. The reader does not have access to the stats showing the age and gender of each individual who get each of the different vaccines. We would tend to call that politics par excellence. Chinese communists knew as early as Sep-Oct 2019 that it was circulating in the population and had the nasty transmission characteristics forged from evolving in roosting bats and intermediate hosts. There may have been vaccines being produced even before that time.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Treating symptoms is not the same as preventing infection
> 
> And definitions change all the time the language isn't static.
> 
> ...


The new definition is faulty for scientific reasons. The political and psychopathological reasons include the fact that Americans are not entitled to the entire virus in a traditional vaccine form: India’s Covaxin. Another political reason is that CIA-sponsored propaganda is involved in the current fear-mongering (because that’s their puppet in the White House) Dem-Nazi media for the Nu/omicron variant. This variant is being deliberately sensationalized. We see the list of Nu mutations, old and new. So which ones make it so deadly? By now it could just as easily be deliberately seeded into the population from production facilities inside the U.S. The first SARS-CoV-2 could have begun in the same way, though taken from nature.


----------



## toobfreak (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others



Boy Mike, the joke really is on you, isn't it?


----------



## Slade3200 (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.


How sick are your friends who caught it? Hope all are ok


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Because the antibody therapies cost $3,000 per patient, and the vaccine costs $30.  Because the antibodies won't stop you from getting "long haul covid", only reduce its severity.  Because you don't know what kind of covid you'll end up with until you get it.



Coworker of mine, double vaxxed, got Covid AND has to get the antibody therapies. Right. So now what?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

Slade3200 said:


> How sick are your friends who caught it? Hope all are ok



Thank you! All are sick: fevers, etc. I do not count "tested positive" with no symptoms. One close coworker was fully vaxxed and hit hard. She had monoclonal antibodies and still had a hard go.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Your concession is noted, Shitbird.  Stop spreading bullshit and propaganda and this won't happen to you.
> 
> Oh yeah, calling people who are clearly smarter than you'll ever be "idiots", over and over again, really just make you look like a short bus kid.



"Short bus kid"

Behold the compassion and tolerance of the Left, everyone


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

toobfreak said:


> Boy Mike, the joke really is on you, isn't it?


How is the joke on him? Are you looking for a scapegoat, Einstein?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> I'm getting my booster on Monday.  I have a pretty good immune system but my wife does not.  We've both had two shots.  With that said it's better to not get it than to get it.  Just because people are vaccinated does not mean they can't get it and spread it.  It's not a vaccine in the classic sense.  It's a vaccination which introduces parts of the virus into your body so that when you become infected it should - in theory - provide a faster response by your body's autoimmune system than it would have otherwise.  There's no downside to getting vaccinated, but one must still follow protocols and be smart.  It's ridiculous this has been politicized.



There's no downside to getting vaccinated? Are you for real

What about the young people who suffer myocarditis?

What about people who get this, it messes with their immune system, and they end up with shingles and so many other effects?


----------



## toobfreak (Nov 26, 2021)

badger2 said:


> How is the joke on him? Are you looking for a scapegoat, Einstein?


Getting vaccinated does little to affect your inability to carry and transmit Covid to others.


----------



## Dragonlady (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> "Short bus kid"
> 
> Behold the compassion and tolerance of the Left, everyone



I guess you missed the part where he called me an 'idiot" three times in a row when I completely debunked his post - with links.  You said nothing about HIS intolerance, rudeness and generally being an asshole.  No, it's only when I retaliated in the only language that his clown seems to understand that you come after ME as intolerate.

Unless you would like similar treatment, I suggest you apologize for your rudeness and cut it out.  Otherwise you'll learn just how intolerant and lacking in compassion I am for knee jerk responses that ignore context.


----------



## Slade3200 (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Thank you! All are sick: fevers, etc. I do not count "tested positive" with no symptoms. One close coworker was fully vaxxed and hit hard. She had monoclonal antibodies and still had a hard go.


I’m sorry to hear that, I hope she’s back to normal soon. Probably a good thing she got vaxxed huh? Otherwise the virus would have hit her even harder and who knows how bad it could have gotten.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> There's no downside to getting vaccinated? Are you for real
> 
> What about the young people who suffer myocarditis?
> 
> What about people who get this, it messes with their immune system, and they end up with shingles and so many other effects?


Is that your situation?


----------



## Burgermeister (Nov 26, 2021)

Well, pending confirmation from the scientists who have been alerted to it (whoever they are), it seems the current jabs will be even less effective on the new Wachoochoo variant. I would self-quarantine until some pharma company fast tracks another dangerous experimental injection that doesn't stop the infection or spread, but seems to reduce symptoms in many cases and might kill you.


----------



## Burgermeister (Nov 26, 2021)

At least 69 athletes collapse in one month, many dead | Free West Media
					

The reports of athletes who suddenly collapse have been increasing noticeably lately. Heart problems such as heart inflammation are often the cause – one of the known life-threatening side effects of Covid vaccines, which even the manufacturers themselves warn against.




					freewestmedia.com


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> Is that your situation?



What are you saying, it's okay to roll the dice


ding said:


> Is that your situation?



Right so if a friend or acquaintance or multiple people get ill from the shots, don't worry, it's not your situation.

Does this apply to covid panic too? So if you have a very mild case, don't worry, it's not your situation so no one is in harm's way?


----------



## Otis Mayfield (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



They are retarded.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> What are you saying, it's okay to roll the dice
> 
> 
> Right so if a friend or acquaintance or multiple people get ill from the shots, don't worry, it's not your situation.
> ...


No.  I'm saying if you haven't gotten vaccinated and you are using those as your reasons you are an idiot.  This is a simple risk analysis.  Not a political position to take.  It's simple math.  

This is a disease of the endothelium.  It attacks the lining of organs.  It only uses the respiratory system to gain access.  Long term damage to all organs, that may affect ones life span, can occur even if one does not need to go to the hospital.  If this is the first time you are hearing this you have been getting your information from sources that are more worried about political parties than they are about your health.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

colfax_m said:


> Don't know what hospital you're in, but we have had a LOT more deaths among the unvaccinated.
> 
> Had a lady show up, lots of risk factors, rather poor health overall. Unvaccinated.
> 
> Now on the ventilator, pressors, dialysis, shock liver, ventilator essentially maximized. Family says she'd want everything done. Full code. All of this almost certainly would have been prevented with a simple cheap vaccine.



Texas.  I don't know about this new version Nu.


----------



## Oddball (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


If you can be infected and infect others, the "vaccine" is nothing of the sort.....It's a placebo at best, and spurring on endless mutations.....Also, why the hell isn't natural immunity for the roughly 1/4 - 1/3 of the population even in the conversation?

Disappointing that such a freedom lover such as yourself turns to State aggression when it suits you....What happened to your skepticism of the pop culture and State narratives?


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> No the change actually made the definition more accurate.
> 
> If you know of any vaccine that has ever provided 100% immunity why don't you post the data?



All conventional vaccines provide more immunity than mRNA. I've been vaxxed with almost all of them before going in to hot zones.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate.


Tyrants always support tyrants.


mikegriffith1 said:


> The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated.


It's a stretch, since reporting standard has been changing to fit THAT narrative. 


mikegriffith1 said:


> Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated.


Thousands dying from side effects would be alive if they haven't gotten the "vaccine".


mikegriffith1 said:


> We gave them over six months to do the right thing.


"We"? 
What makes you think you have to decide what's the "right thing" for anyone else?


mikegriffith1 said:


> The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard.


They're neither safe, nor effective. Both stooges, Walensky and Fauci admitted that hospitalizations are rising among those who are "vaccinated" and that there is a decline in "vaccine" efficacy. 


mikegriffith1 said:


> When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.


Who told you that? You just said that vaccines are "safe and effective", didn't you?  If I chose not to get "vaccinated" how am I harming you who took the jab? 


mikegriffith1 said:


> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death.


Even "vaccinated" you can transmit the virus, hence you are still risking infecting the others. 


mikegriffith1 said:


> Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.


Are you saying, you as "as vaccinated" cannot infect anyone? What are you smoking, dude?

As you can see, every single sentence you wrote above is a lie repeated from your propaganda box. You made your choices, leave me make mine. They do not effect you, since you're "protected", Well, almost, since government solution for failed "vaccine" is more "vaccine". You're about to get your third dose, once you do, you probably gonna turn against those who are only double jabbed.

So far, all evidence shows that illness and death rises with "vaccination". The same thing will happen with more "vaccination". When the third jab worsens the situation, their solution will be a fourth jab. If you're wondering why am I calling it "vaccine", try researching what the vaccine is. What you got is not.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> If your immune system doesn't work well then vaccine can only do so much.
> 
> For example Powell died while vaccinated because he had compromised immune system and for people with his specific disease vaccine is only 40% effective.


Did it ever occur to you that his immune system became compromised because of the "vaccine"?


----------



## candycorn (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Testing positive and becoming extremely ill are 2 entirely different things
> 
> Vaccines reduce the incidence of hospitalization, reduce incidences of severe illness and death which is exactly what they were designed to do.


Another uncontrollable carom into the truth!


----------



## candycorn (Nov 26, 2021)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Very simple.
> It is called hypocrisy and silly rules.
> The sitting President, and his Vice President and the sitting Speaker of the House - ALL - talked about troubles they had with "Trumps vaccine" before the election. ALL OF THEM. With the Vice President going as far as saying she would not get the "Trump vaccine" before "fully proven t be safe".... she said this just 4 months before saying she supports vaccine mandates after she was elected.
> Why so many conservatives are against it is also due to Fauci. WHo has been all over the map about every possible discussion about this virus.
> ...



So you're stating that right wing nut jobs are refusing the vaccine because of what Pelosi, Biden and Harris allegedly said?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Of course they would. This is science and medicine...not politics


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

candycorn said:


> They also said blacks were 3/5 of a human.



Actually, that not what they said.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> You are lying.
> *After taking smallpox, polio, measles, mumps, pertussis, etc. vaccines, how many people fail to mount any immune response to smallpox, polio, measles, mumps, pertussis, etc.?
> The answer it ZERO.*
> Real vaccines always work to create an immune response.
> ...


Bullshit





__





						About Measles Vaccination | CDC
					

Measles is a very contagious disease that can be prevented with MMR vaccine, which protects against Measles, Mumps and Rubella.




					www.cdc.gov


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> What the fuck is wrong with you?
> 
> *From 2020*:
> 
> ...


Care to explain, if "human trials" were complete, why "vaccines" are still under emergency use authorization?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> 333 per million deaths.
> 
> 2300 per million deaths here.  Stats don't lie.  And mutations are happening all over the world.
> 
> ...



But wait...





I'm missing the part when their first "vaccine" got approved.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Here is both Biden and Harris getting PUBLICLY vaccinated in Dec 2020, as soon as it was cleared for emergency use by FDA:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Pictures?

How about the video?






Your browser is not able to display this video.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

g5000 said:


> My brother has COPD and one of his lungs is non-functioning. He's a die hard Trump lover and refuses to get the vaccine. I have begged and begged him to get it, but he just says, "I've already come close to dying three times, so God obviously wants me around for some reason."



  You think you're criticizing your brother here, but your aren't.  You're only showing us what an arrogant, meddling asshole you are.

  If you're stupid enough to drink the mRNA Kool-Aid, that's your business.  If your brother is smart enough to know better, that's his business.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


My family is vaccinated and we had COVID19 but issue is with Democrats these days when you acquiesce it’s a slippery slope. That is all.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler (Nov 26, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> You think you're criticizing your brother here, but your aren't.  You're only showing us what an arrogant, meddling asshole you are.
> 
> If you're stupid enough to drink the mRNA Kool-Aid, that's your business.  If your brother is smart enough to know better, that's his business.


g5000 is a pussy. Doesn’t know anything about science.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

AzogtheDefiler said:


> Bob Blaylock said:
> 
> 
> > You think you're criticizing your brother here, but your aren't.  You're only showing us what an arrogant, meddling asshole you are.
> ...



  And that's not even what this exchange is about.

  It's about him sticking his filthy nose in someone else's business, where it doesn't belong.


----------



## AzogtheDefiler (Nov 26, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> And that's not even what this exchange is about.
> 
> It's about him sticking his filthy nose in someone else's business, where it doesn't belong.


g5000 is a waste of life. Who cares?


----------



## badger2 (Nov 26, 2021)

toobfreak said:


> Getting vaccinated does little to affect your inability to carry and transmit Covid to others.


So amongst all the information chaos (the source of the virus is still unknown) you blame someone for not keeping up, for not knowing that the viral load in the mouths and throats of both vaxxed and unvaxxed are the same and that the vaccine does nothing to affect those viral loads. While you were learning that, your scapegoat was, like a dummy, getting vaccinated,


----------



## Vel (Nov 26, 2021)

Oddball said:


> If you can be infected and infect others, the "vaccine" is nothing of the sort.....It's a placebo at best, and *spurring on endless mutations..*...Also, why the hell isn't natural immunity for the roughly 1/4 - 1/3 of the population even in the conversation?
> 
> Disappointing that such a freedom lover such as yourself turns to State aggression when it suits you....What happened to your skepticism of the pop culture and State narratives?


Louder so they can hear it in the back.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Treating symptoms is not the same as preventing infection


Are you implying that jabs are preventing infections?


Blues Man said:


> And definitions change all the time the language isn't static.


Of course, especially when it doesn't fit the narrative. 


Blues Man said:


> Or are you trying to say that there are actually vaccines that provide 100% immunity to a disease?


Nothing is 100% efficient. Just tell me how many people are still dying from smallpox or polio?

Beside, not so long ago...






Do you still believe so?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> Biden has always been a moderate


True... Moderate fascist.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 26, 2021)

toobfreak said:


> Getting vaccinated does little to affect your inability to carry and transmit Covid to others.



Wait... let's refresh their memory hole...


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> No.  I'm saying if you haven't gotten vaccinated and you are using those as your reasons you are an idiot.  This is a simple risk analysis.  Not a political position to take.  It's simple math.
> 
> This is a disease of the endothelium.  It attacks the lining of organs.  It only uses the respiratory system to gain access.  Long term damage to all organs, that may affect ones life span, can occur even if one does not need to go to the hospital.  If this is the first time you are hearing this you have been getting your information from sources that are more worried about political parties than they are about your health.



No covid is NOT a disease of the endothelium.
It is confined to only the air passages of the lungs and sinuses.
It can not survive anywhere that the immune system can detect or access.
For example, it cannot survive in the blood.
So far there has not been a single blood transfusion infection, even though infected people have donated blood and organs to other people.

It does not attack organs at all.
What can happen instead is that the immune system can over react with a cytokine storm, which can mascerate the lungs.
If and when that happens, then organs get damaged by all the thousands of tiny blood clots the immune system has created.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So you say "Bullshit" and then quote a link that agrees with me?
That makes no sense.
Are you unaware of the difference between an actual MMR vaccine and a fake mRNA injection?


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> No covid is NOT a disease of the endothelium.
> It is confined to only the air passages of the lungs and sinuses.
> It can not survive anywhere that the immune system can detect or access.
> For example, it cannot survive in the blood.
> ...











						COVID-19 is, in the end, an endothelial disease
					

Abstract. The vascular endothelium provides the crucial interface between the blood compartment and tissues, and displays a series of remarkable properties that




					academic.oup.com
				













						COVID-19 Is an Endothelial Disease: Implications of Nitric Oxide - PubMed
					

Endothelial cells are a clinically important infection site for COVID-19, both as a mechanism for disease pathogenesis and as a therapeutic target. People with dysfunctional endothelium, defined by nitric oxide deficiency, appear to have a more severe disease course. As such, nitric oxide has...




					pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				












						Endothelial activation and dysfunction in COVID-19: from basic mechanisms to potential therapeutic approaches - Signal Transduction and Targeted Therapy
					

On 12 March 2020, the outbreak of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) was declared a pandemic by the World Health Organization. As of 4 August 2020, more than 18 million confirmed infections had been reported globally. Most patients have mild symptoms, but some patients develop respiratory...




					www.nature.com
				












						SARS-CoV-2 Mediated Endothelial Dysfunction: The Potential Role of Chronic Oxidative Stress
					

Endothelial cells have emerged as key players in SARS-CoV-2 infection and COVID-19 inflammatory pathologies. Dysfunctional endothelial cells can promote chronic inflammation and disease processes like thrombosis, atherosclerosis, and lung injury. In endothelial cells, mitochondria regulate these...




					www.frontiersin.org


----------



## toobfreak (Nov 26, 2021)

badger2 said:


> So amongst all the information chaos (the source of the virus is still unknown)


Maybe unknown to you.



badger2 said:


> you blame someone for not keeping up, for not knowing that the viral load in the mouths and throats of both vaxxed and unvaxxed are the same and that the vaccine does nothing to affect those viral loads. While you were learning that, your scapegoat was, like a dummy, getting vaccinated,


Poor baby, you didn't get a second helping of sweet potatoes and stuffing yesterday!


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> I know several who have had injuries and three who died from the injection.  No thanks.  It may be something someone over 75 with health conditions may decide to do.  Different story if this had a kill ratio to that of an ebola type virus.


How did they die from the injection?


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> COVID-19 is, in the end, an endothelial disease
> 
> 
> Abstract. The vascular endothelium provides the crucial interface between the blood compartment and tissues, and displays a series of remarkable properties that
> ...



Sorry, this is totally and completely wrong, and goes against everything any doctor has written about covid.
Covid lives in air passageways like the lungs and sinuses because there is can hide from the immune system.
It can not and never has been able able to survive anywhere the immune system can get at it.
So it can not get to any organs, organ linings, etc.
When organs are damaged, that is ONLY due to tiny blood clots getting to the organs and cutting off their air supply by plugging capillaries.
The ph of the blood alone kills covid on contract.
It has NEVER survived in the blood or traveled anywhere in the body.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> How did they die from the injection?



There are several ways the mRNA injection can be fatal.
The most common is that th mRNA injection material is so small that it does not have to stay in the arm muscle.
It can migrate, and where ever it ends up, is where the immune system causes inflammation as it attacks.
If the mRNA managed to get to the brain or heart, then you die.
If it get to the capillaries in the extremities, then you end up having to amputate the hands or feet.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Sorry, this is totally and completely wrong, and goes against everything any doctor has written about covid.
> Covid lives in air passageways like the lungs and sinuses because there is can hide from the immune system.
> It can not and never has been able able to survive anywhere the immune system can get at it.
> So it can not get to any organs, organ linings, etc.
> ...


Do you have a link that refutes any of the FIVE references I provided?


----------



## Snouter (Nov 26, 2021)

"Conservatives" are supposed to be informed enough to make intelligent decisions.  Get informed.  Even in the 1990's "vaccines" were controversial, the regular type, by introducing small amounts of a toxin to supposedly prepare the immune system when if faces the real toxin, bacteria, virus, etc.  The thing new information suggested that even the older, generally accepted vaccines like DPT, etc. were bogus and that diseases have their own patterns in populations regardless of vaccination.  What definitely happens with vaccines are undesirable side effects and sometime acquiring the disease itself.  Fast forward to the Fauci era medical terrorism.  Fauci is a sociopath who is basically a Big Pharma rep and has been seeking to get the global population on annual vaccines since his failure during the "AIDS" era in the 1980's.  Enter Bill Gates, another sociopath.    





Bottom line is a true conservative values individual liberty, truth, and justice!  So obviously just say no to the Fauci Jabs.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Snouter said:


> "Conservatives" are supposed to be informed enough to make intelligent decisions.  Get informed.  Even in the 1990's "vaccines" were controversial, the regular type, by introducing small amounts of a toxin to supposedly prepare the immune system when if faces the real toxin, bacteria, virus, etc.  The thing new information suggested that even the older, generally accepted vaccines like DPT, etc. were bogus and that diseases have their own patterns in populations regardless of vaccination.  What definitely happens with vaccines are undesirable side effects and sometime acquiring the disease itself.  Fast forward to the Fauci era medical terrorism.  Fauci is a sociopath who is basically a Big Pharma rep and has been seeking to get the global population on annual vaccines since his failure during the "AIDS" era in the 1980's.  Enter Bill Gates, another sociopath.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm about as conservative as they come and this sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. This is a risk assessment not politics.  It's just simple math.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> So you say "Bullshit" and then quote a link that agrees with me?
> That makes no sense.
> Are you unaware of the difference between an actual MMR vaccine and a fake mRNA injection?


Your claim was that various vaccines were 100% effective.

I showed you that was untrue and you ignore that fact


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> Do you have a link that refutes any of the FIVE references I provided?



Sure.
If covid could live inside a human body and not just in external air passages, like the lungs and sinuses, then it would have to survive in the blood.
But it does not.
Human blood kills covid on contact.





__





						Can I get COVID-19 from a blood transfusion?
					

COVID-19 is primarily a respiratory virus, people can get infected when they inhale or ingest the virus, but not via a blood transfusion




					www.blood.ca
				




{...
Why you won’t get COVID-19 from a blood transfusion​Transfusion
Blood
Tuesday, March 10, 2020 Catherine Lewis

COVID-19 is primarily a respiratory virus, with potential to infect the digestive system as well. People can get infected when they inhale or ingest the virus, but not via a blood transfusion.

“There is absolutely no evidence of transfusion transmission for COVID-19, or any other coronavirus,” says Dr. Steven Drews, associate director of microbiology at Canadian Blood Services. “This family of respiratory viruses just doesn’t appear to be transfusion-transmitted.”

This also applies to other coronaviruses such as severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS), Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS), and the unrelated influenza viruses.
...
*Why COVID-19 can’t be transmitted by blood*​Blood cells don’t have the binding sites the COVID-19 virus is looking for. The virus is focused on attacking the respiratory and digestive systems.

Tests for COVID-19 aren’t blood tests, they’re tests for viral genetic material done on respiratory specimens such as a throat swab or sputum sample. These tests may be supported by medical imaging, as well as by looking at symptoms.
...}


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Your claim was that various vaccines were 100% effective.
> 
> I showed you that was untrue and you ignore that fact



WRONG! 
I said that vaccines were 100% effective in creating some sort of measurable immune response.
I never said it prevented infection, as that is impossible.

And the point is these mRNA injections appear to be creating ZERO long term immune response.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

So why are you trying to kill people Rigby?


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> COVID-19 is, in the end, an endothelial disease
> 
> 
> Abstract. The vascular endothelium provides the crucial interface between the blood compartment and tissues, and displays a series of remarkable properties that
> ...


Wait...you mean "Dr. Rigby" is full of shit AGAIN?

I'm shocked...


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> So why are you trying to kill people Rigby?



Do the math.
Assuming we need 70% herd immunity to end the epidemic, that would have required deliberate infection of 230 million people last March, to end it then.
So how many would have died.
Fauci estimated a 2% lethality rate, but he was wrong because he did not realize most people infected would either not even notice, or would be afraid to let anyone know they were infected.  It actually is less than 1% in general.
And by limiting infection volunteers to those under 40, then the death rate is reduced by a factor of 400.
So 1% of 230 million is 2.3 million, and when you divide that by 400, you get only 5,750 deaths.
That means letting the virus have this 1.5 year free reign is what killed over 700,000 people for no reason.
We could have saved over 700,000 lives if we had deliberately infected enough young people to end it last March.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Sure.
> If covid could live inside a human body and not just in external air passages, like the lungs and sinuses, then it would have to survive in the blood.
> But it does not.
> Human blood kills covid on contact.
> ...


This has absolutely nothing to do with what we are talking about.  Covid is a disease of the endothelium.  The risk of exposure is not limited tyo death.  The risk is organ damage and a shorter life span.  And that applies to people who only had mild cases.   Have you been infected yet?


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Wait...you mean "Dr. Rigby" is full of shit AGAIN?
> 
> I'm shocked...



The hypothethis that covid can enter the body and travel to the organs is nonsense.
You will not find anyone supporting anything remotely like that.
And the article proving covid can not be transmitted by blood, proves it, as traveling in the blood is the only way any disease can become endothelial.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Do the math.
> Assuming we need 70% herd immunity to end the epidemic, that would have required deliberate infection of 230 million people last March, to end it then.
> So how many would have died.
> Fauci estimated a 2% lethality rate, but he was wrong because he did not realize most people infected would either not even notice, or would be afraid to let anyone know they were infected.  It actually is less than 1% in general.
> ...


The risk is not limited to death.  A much higher percentage of covid patients are showing signs of organ damage.  Because covid IS a disease of the endothelium.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Wait...you mean "Dr. Rigby" is full of shit AGAIN?
> 
> I'm shocked...


I'll just say he is vastly uninformed about this disease.


----------



## Rigby5 (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> This has absolutely nothing to do with what we are talking about.  Covid is a disease of the endothelium.  The risk of exposure is not limited tyo death.  The risk is organ damage and a shorter life span.  And that applies to people who only had mild cases.   Have you been infected yet?



Wrong.
The ONLY harm to any organs has always and only been due to the tiny blood clots covid introduces into the blood stream through immune system damage to the lungs.
Again, the covid virus itself does essentially nothing.
All the harm is done by the cytokine storm, the over reaction by the immune system.









						Cytokine storm in COVID-19: pathogenesis and overview of anti-inflammatory agents used in treatment - PubMed
					

COVID-19 infection has a heterogenous disease course; it may be asymptomatic or causes only mild symptoms in the majority of the cases, while immunologic complications such as macrophage activation syndrome also known as secondary hemophagocytic lymphohistiocytosis, resulting in cytokine storm...




					pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				



{...
COVID-19 infection has a heterogenous disease course; it may be asymptomatic or causes only mild symptoms in the majority of the cases, while immunologic complications such as macrophage activation syndrome also known as secondary hemophagocytic lymphohistiocytosis, resulting in cytokine storm syndrome and acute respiratory distress syndrome, may also occur in some patients.
...}


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> I'll just say he is vastly uninformed about this disease.


He is more than than. He CLAIMS to know a lot about medicine and clearly knows enough to show that he is continually and loudly lying


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> The ONLY harm to any organs has always and only been due to the tiny blood clots covid introduces into the blood stream through immune system damage to the lungs.
> Again, the covid virus itself does essentially nothing.
> All the harm is done by the cytokine storm, the over reaction by the immune system.
> ...


This says nothing about what the disease does. 

This guy explains in exquisite detail what this disease is and how it does it.


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> He is more than than. He CLAIMS to know a lot about medicine and clearly knows enough to show that he is continually and loudly lying


It's pretty obvious he knows nothing about what he is talking about.  He's probably a troll.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> It's pretty obvious he knows nothing about what he is talking about.  He's probably a troll.


He is that...but he tries to sound knowledgeable and that makes him a dangerous troll

He WANTS people to die


----------



## ding (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> He is that...but he tries to sound knowledgeable and that makes him a dangerous troll
> 
> He WANTS people to die


That would be sad if true.


----------



## BasicHumanUnit (Nov 26, 2021)

antontoo said:


> If 100% of people were vaccinated, then 100% of people in the hospital with Covid would be vaccinated. However there would be a lot less hospitalizations overall.
> 
> Among the elderly and immuno compromised  that are at highest risk of hospitalization vaccination rates are very high.



Just stop it.
I was hospitalized last year for a temporary health emergency for 5 days.  NON Covid related.
2 days in they moved me into the ICU Covid Backup ward (WITH ALL THE SERIOUSLY ILL COVID PATIENTS, all 4 of them)
I left that hospital on the 3rd day and went elsewhere...but never tested positive for covid most likely because I already had natural immunity.
Yes...I left 2 days early.

If you can give me a reasonable explanation for why they would do that then I will reconsider your thoughts.
Otherwise I remain convinced......
Covid is a massive political stunt with the intent to scare people into compliance and make money for the big pharmas and certain medical facilities.
At best your beloved "Covid19" vaccine is nothing more than a regular flu vaccine.


----------



## Orangecat (Nov 26, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death.


Vaccination neither prevents you from getting nor spreading COVID. That's the science.


----------



## frigidweirdo (Nov 26, 2021)

sparky said:


> those are all _'opinions'_ Mike
> 
> they've _zero _science to back them up
> 
> ...



The problem here is that so many people are emotional about their politics. Facts are an inconvenience at best. Something to be ignored or made up at worst. 

Then all of a sudden they decide they need facts, they demand others have facts when they themselves wouldn't have bothered, because people are emotional and they care more about that emotion.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 26, 2021)

Lesh said:


> So why are you trying to kill people Rigby?



Rigby5 is not, as far as I know, encouraging people to take dangerous experimental drugs.  That would be you, and your kind.  The blood is on you hands, and on those of your fellow Mengele-wannabes.


----------



## Lesh (Nov 26, 2021)

ding said:


> That would be sad if true.


It is sad

It is cynical 

It is true


----------



## g5000 (Nov 27, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> You think you're criticizing your brother here, but your aren't.  You're only showing us what an arrogant, meddling asshole you are.
> 
> If you're stupid enough to drink the mRNA Kool-Aid, that's your business.  If your brother is smart enough to know better, that's his business.


BWA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!

It sounds like you are the one drinking the Kool-Aid.


----------



## easyt65 (Nov 27, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



The United States Government


mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



The same United States government that bankrupted over 50% of all minority-owned small businesses with Un-Constitutional quarantine, mask, and vaccine mandates is the same ones putting milkions of Americans out of work to force compliance with the Un-Constitutional vaccine mandates.

The same government doing these things is the same government that medically / scientifically experimented on US military personnel by injecting nuclear material into their bodies, gave them LSD, and other drugs at times and hid it for decades, the sane ones who injected Anthrax into military personnel...into me.

It is the same government that has experimented on US citizens while hiding the truth.

When a government tells you that you no longer have control, decision-making rights over your own body and / or your own health care there is more than enough reason to have concern.

The government has been trying to get Americans to vaccinate teens and now as young as 5yo.  There has been a lot of resistence ... then suddenly, by coincidence, a new mutation of COVID-19 breaks out that targets primarily teens and kids.... what a coincidence, and how 'lucky' for the govt who wants teens & kids as you as 5 to be vaccinated... 

Just sayin'....


----------



## easyt65 (Nov 27, 2021)

Did I mention how many vaccinated people ate getting COVID?

Did I mention how many vaccinated people are dying after getting vaccinated and / or hiw many people are getting heart trouble, ending careers of professional athletes and others?


----------



## Snouter (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> I'm about as conservative as they come and this sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. This is a risk assessment not politics.  It's just simple math.



"Conspiracy theory" implies a lack of facts.  The vids conclusively present facts.  But it is indeed definitely a conspiracy.  Probably the most evil conspiracy in world history.


----------



## meaner gene (Nov 27, 2021)

easyt65 said:


> The United States Government
> 
> 
> The same United States government ... is the same ones putting milkions of Americans out of work to force compliance with the Un-Constitutional vaccine mandates.



*You must have read that last weeks new unemployment claims is at the lowest level in 50 years.*


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> No.  I'm saying if you haven't gotten vaccinated and you are using those as your reasons you are an idiot.  This is a simple risk analysis.  Not a political position to take.  It's simple math.
> 
> This is a disease of the endothelium.  It attacks the lining of organs.  It only uses the respiratory system to gain access.  Long term damage to all organs, that may affect ones life span, can occur even if one does not need to go to the hospital.  If this is the first time you are hearing this you have been getting your information from sources that are more worried about political parties than they are about your health.



You realize the shots do the same thing, I hope. You realize, I hope, that the spike proteins in the shots were supposed to stay confined to the arm muscle and do not. That's why you're seeing heart damage, menstrual changes in women, etc. Those spike proteins in some people go EVERYwhere.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

DGS49 said:


> MOST prominent Republicans are (a) vaccinated, and (b) opposed to a vaccine mandate.
> 
> Apparently this juxtaposition is more than Leftists can handle.
> 
> ...



That 90% number is what you get when you count vaxxed/unvaxxed numbers going back to JANUARY, when almost no one was vaccinated. For recent numbers, look through the thread. In the MI beaumont hospital system it's up to 40% vaccinated. In Minnesota the same.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Where do you usually go?
> 
> It is true that the overwhelming percentage of covid deaths is among the un-vaxxed.  Either you'll lie and tell us that is wrong or you'll admit you're full of shit.
> 
> ...



Yes, if you go back to January, when most people were unvaxxed. As I have put right in this thread, evidence from my own state in the last month is that nearly a THIRD of deaths are among the vaxxed. 

There is some talk about Minnesota as well, but they're being very coy with the numbers. You can only get good information going back to OCTOBER 10th--at least two weeks before the wave hit.  Then you find this:

_The latest breakthrough case data from the Minnesota Department of Health comes from the week of Oct. 10. More vaccinated people died of COVID-19 that week than non-vaccinated people._









						While COVID Breakthrough Deaths Are Increasing, Doctors Still Urge Minnesotans To Get Vaccinated: 'If You're Playing The Odds, Being Vaccinated Is Markedly Better'
					

The latest breakthrough case data from the Minnesota Department of Health comes from the week of Oc. 10. More vaccinated people died of COVID-19 that week than non-vaccinated people. But the numbers also make it clear the risk of hospitalization and death is still much greater for Minnesotans...




					minnesota.cbslocal.com
				




The fact is that if these vaccines were still super protective against hospitalization and death no boosters would be necessary AND the powers that be would not have to go back to JANUARY to fudge the numbers about how great they are. 

It remains a total mystery to my why Leftists have decided to throw in with Big Pharma who is obviously playing roulette with people's BODIES--and with a subpar product (to say the least). But here we are. Go down with the ship, I guess, if you must.


----------



## candycorn (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Yes, if you go back to January, when most people were unvaxxed. As I have put right in this thread, evidence from my own state in the last month is that nearly a THIRD of deaths are among the vaxxed.
> 
> There is some talk about Minnesota as well, but they're being very coy with the numbers. You can only get good information going back to OCTOBER 10th--at least two weeks before the wave hit.  Then you find this:
> 
> ...



From your source:

"But the numbers also make it clear the *risk of hospitalization* and *death *is still much greater for Minnesotans who aren’t fully vaccinated."

Thanks for the link.  I didn't need any extra ammunition to blow your sorry ass out of the water but it is especially wonderful when you hand me the bullets.  As I've always said about you...you're dumber than a box of rocks.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> From your source:
> 
> "But the numbers also make it clear the *risk of hospitalization* and *death *is still much greater for Minnesotans who aren’t fully vaccinated."
> 
> Thanks for the link.  I didn't need any extra ammunition to blow your sorry ass out of the water but it is especially wonderful when you hand me the bullets.  As I've always said about you...you're dumber than a box of rocks.



I will go even further and quote you the rest:

_As of last Tuesday, nearly 300 patients are hospitalized with COVID in the Allina system.

*Three out of four of them are unvaccinated.* The proportion is even higher in ICUs.

“In our ICUs and those that are on ventilators, over 90% are unvaccinated,” Best said. “I’m hopeful that starts to really hit home for people.”_

So here is what we have: two weeks ago in Minnesota, about two weeks into the surge (and hospitalization is a lagging indicator), we had a full QUARTER of hospitalized patients FULLY VACCINATED. That had not bled over to the ICU YET. 

And you're bragging about this--you think these are great vaccines? I guarantee these numbers are closer to Michigan's now, where you have close to a THIRD of hospitalized patients fully vaccinated.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> From your source:
> 
> "But the numbers also make it clear the *risk of hospitalization* and *death *is still much greater for Minnesotans who aren’t fully vaccinated."
> 
> Thanks for the link.  I didn't need any extra ammunition to blow your sorry ass out of the water but it is especially wonderful when you hand me the bullets.  As I've always said about you...you're dumber than a box of rocks.



Here's a more recent article. Notice the LACK of info on vaxxed/unvaxxed....huh. But with nearly 75% of the population vaxxed, why are cases so high and growing? Why are hospitalizations so high? You wouldn't see that if cases weren't EXPLODING among the vaccinated, just like here in MI.









						COVID-19 hospitalizations set 2021 record once again in Minnesota
					

Gov. Tim Walz outlined steps the state is taking to protect hospital capacity amid the latest pandemic surge that has the state facing a critical time.




					www.startribune.com


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> From your source:
> 
> "But the numbers also make it clear the *risk of hospitalization* and *death *is still much greater for Minnesotans who aren’t fully vaccinated."
> 
> Thanks for the link.  I didn't need any extra ammunition to blow your sorry ass out of the water but it is especially wonderful when you hand me the bullets.  As I've always said about you...you're dumber than a box of rocks.



Here's another one on Minnesota, from Nov 24th. Note that ICU unvaxxed is down to 80%. And that's ICU:

_Doctors continue to stress the effectiveness of the COVID-19 vaccines, saying that while immunizations can't stop all infections, they help most patients avoid the worst of the virus. At Minneapolis-based Allina Health System, 56 of the 68 pandemic patients in the intensive care unit Monday were unvaccinated.

*The number of serious illnesses in people who've been vaccinated is beginning to tick up, but that's a function of waning immunity, plus the simple fact that as more people get vaccinated there are more chances for breakthrough infections,* said Dr. Frank Rhame, an infectious disease specialist at Allina._









						Minnesota confronts another Thanksgiving scarred by COVID
					

Thousands are newly infected and more health care workers are tending to the sick as families navigate dicey conversations over whether to get vaccinated.




					www.startribune.com


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> From your source:
> 
> "But the numbers also make it clear the *risk of hospitalization* and *death *is still much greater for Minnesotans who aren’t fully vaccinated."
> 
> Thanks for the link.  I didn't need any extra ammunition to blow your sorry ass out of the water but it is especially wonderful when you hand me the bullets.  As I've always said about you...you're dumber than a box of rocks.



An article on breakthrough infections with an anecdotal report. Right. People can only see this for so long before they start to say "these vaccines are crap". And that's what's starting to happen.

_Meanwhile, another Minneapolis resident Kurt Decker has been battling his own breakthrough illness. He's the general manager of two running gear outfitters in the Twin Cities metro area. Some of his colleagues have breakthrough cases, too, causing staff scheduling headaches.

"So all of a sudden — boom, boom, three people [were sick],” he said. “That was really stressful."

Decker, 50, runs and bikes constantly, so he's in good shape. But he says his breakthrough case has been brutal.

"It got really bad. I was wheezing, having a hard time breathing and my chest was sore," he said.

Rising breakthrough COVID-19 cases cause hassle, worry _


----------



## candycorn (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Here's a more recent article. Notice the LACK of info on vaxxed/unvaxxed....huh. But with nearly 75% of the population vaxxed, why are cases so high and growing? Why are hospitalizations so high? You wouldn't see that if cases weren't EXPLODING among the vaccinated, just like here in MI.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You're pitching Batting Practice...

Again from your source:

"Compared with last year, *Minnesotans can be thankful for many advances in coping with COVID-19, Malcolm said, with vaccines being first and foremost.* Minnesota ranks second among states in adults who have received booster shots, Walz said, and sixth in immunizations among children ages 5-11."


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> Your concession is noted, Shitbird.  Stop spreading bullshit and propaganda and this won't happen to you.
> 
> Oh yeah, calling people who are clearly smarter than you'll ever be "idiots", over and over again, really just make you look like a short bus kid.


Be a good little sheep.  Baaaa.   

We have the worst stats on the earth PERIOD.  And here are a bunch of dumb asses....fitting symbol of the DNC.........worshiping what they say.

At what point do you go .........maybe we should listen to countries who have done night and day better.

Gov't is your God.  Not mine.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> You're pitching Batting Practice...
> 
> Again from your source:
> 
> "Compared with last year, *Minnesotans can be thankful for many advances in coping with COVID-19, Malcolm said, with vaccines being first and foremost.* Minnesota ranks second among states in adults who have received booster shots, Walz said, and sixth in immunizations among children ages 5-11."



Doctors shilling, so what? If people had been told when they got this experimental shot: hey, it won't do a thing to stop transmission or reduce your chances of getting covid, and we have no idea of the long term effects. But it might reduce your odds of severe illness and death for about six months....

How many fewer people would have gotten it?

A LOT


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Dragonlady said:


> I guess you missed the part where he called me an 'idiot" three times in a row when I completely debunked his post - with links.  You said nothing about HIS intolerance, rudeness and generally being an asshole.  No, it's only when I retaliated in the only language that his clown seems to understand that you come after ME as intolerate.
> 
> Unless you would like similar treatment, I suggest you apologize for your rudeness and cut it out.  Otherwise you'll learn just how intolerant and lacking in compassion I am for knee jerk responses that ignore context.


Idiot.  Make it 4 times.


----------



## candycorn (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> But it might reduce your odds of severe illness and death for about six months....



Well, enjoy your 7th month after death.  Dingbat.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Well, enjoy your 7th month after death.  Dingbat.



Have you been boosted? Do you have any idea what THREE mRNA shots with all those spike proteins are doing inside you?

Of course you don't. No one really does. Cancers are way up, though. Weird heart problems and blood clots too. Oh well. You pays your money and you take your chances. Why you choose to shill for an operation as crooked as Big Pharma is anyone's guess. You do you, good little bootlicker


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> But wait...
> 
> View attachment 568807
> 
> I'm missing the part when their first "vaccine" got approved.


India version of it.  Was used there, but primarily they did better from Home Health Kits containing Imervectin doxycycline and zinc.  Told their citizens to take it as soon as they get symptoms of Covid.  

And..........4 times the population and a little over half the deaths here.  But the FDA here only approves their PAY TO PLAY BUDDIES.  Gillead...........etc.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> How did they die from the injection?








						The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) Request
					






					wonder.cdc.gov
				




click agree at bottom.
click vaers data search
Click section 3 covid 19

Then it will show a large list of reported issues reported to date.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Do the math.
> Assuming we need 70% herd immunity to end the epidemic, that would have required deliberate infection of 230 million people last March, to end it then.
> So how many would have died.
> Fauci estimated a 2% lethality rate, but he was wrong because he did not realize most people infected would either not even notice, or would be afraid to let anyone know they were infected.  It actually is less than 1% in general.
> ...


I said the same thing when this started.  Protect the vulnerable and not shut down.  Don't let it hang out too long so it can't have time to mutate .

Now.......with these BS vaccines it is worse.  WE FUCKED UP shutting down.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I said the same thing when this started.  Protect the vulnerable and not shut down.  Don't let it hang out too long so it can't have time to mutate .
> 
> Now.......with these BS vaccines it is worse.  WE FUCKED UP shutting down.



And now add vaccinating all these healthy young non-vulnerable people with these experimental vaccines. People in high places are in pure panic mode.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Have you been boosted? Do you have any idea what THREE mRNA shots with all those spike proteins are doing inside you?
> 
> Of course you don't. No one really does. Cancers are way up, though. Weird heart problems and blood clots too. Oh well. You pays your money and you take your chances. Why you choose to shill for an operation as crooked as Big Pharma is anyone's guess. You do you, good little bootlicker


I'm gonna call that one you are posting to an Idiot too.  lol
Even though she is on ignore.

Some cheap pills that keep covid from replicating as soon as you get symptoms would stop all this shit.  But the talking heads call it HORSE DEWORMER.........even though 4 billion doses have been used on Humans over time.  That with the doxy, zinc, vitamins.  right up front and hospitalization would drop dramatically.

But the talking heads own the FDA and don't approve .........order you to take high dollar drugs.  

The vaccines would have to be changed constantly with the new strains coming out to stop the next wave..............and then the virus will just mutate around that one too.  

We are playing WACK A MOLE and losing.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> And now add vaccinating all these healthy young non-vulnerable people with these experimental vaccines. People in high places are in pure panic mode.


No they are not.  They are being made filthy rich.  

The kit from India used to help costs $2    No money in that.  Gillead products cost a fortune and they own members of the gov't.  The patents for these jabs are owned partially by the NIH.  And Fa Chi gets royalties off of it.

This is already an ENDEMIC situation.  Then they will want shots forever.  Eventually a mutant that is a real killer is gonna emerge and kill the hell out of people.  And they will...........as they do now BLAME US for refusing to obey.

Sheep


----------



## mikegriffith1 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.



Your experience is the exception. Statistically, the percentage of people who have caught the virus after being vaccinated is very small, around 3-5%, which is in line with the clinical trials, which found the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines to be effective in about 95% of the people in the trials. 

People who got the Johnson & Johnson vaccine have a smaller degree of protection, around 68%. J&J has admitted that people who got the J&J shot should probably get a second shot after six months.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> Your experience is the exception. Statistically, the percentage of people who have caught the virus after being vaccinated is very small, around 3-5%, which is in line with the clinical trials, which found the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines to be effective in about 95% of the people in the trials.
> 
> People who got the Johnson & Johnson vaccine have a smaller degree of protection, around 68%. J&J has admitted that people who got the J&J shot should probably get a second shot after six months.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> Your experience is the exception. Statistically, the percentage of people who have caught the virus after being vaccinated is very small, around 3-5%, which is in line with the clinical trials, which found the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines to be effective in about 95% of the people in the trials.
> 
> People who got the Johnson & Johnson vaccine have a smaller degree of protection, around 68%. J&J has admitted that people who got the J&J shot should probably get a second shot after six months.



What is the percentage of people who have caught the virus unvaccinated though?

And of course, that would be since they were fully vaccinated. You have pretty good protection against catching covid for the first 90 days. Is that what you signed up for? A 90 day vaccine?


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> You realize the shots do the same thing, I hope. You realize, I hope, that the spike proteins in the shots were supposed to stay confined to the arm muscle and do not. That's why you're seeing heart damage, menstrual changes in women, etc. Those spike proteins in some people go EVERYwhere.


That's crazy talk.  Stop getting your news from social media.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

Snouter said:


> "Conspiracy theory" implies a lack of facts.  The vids conclusively present facts.  But it is indeed definitely a conspiracy.  Probably the most evil conspiracy in world history.


Have you gotten covid yet?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> That's crazy talk.  Stop getting your news from social media.



Not at all. Japan insisted on the information from Pfizer, and they got it. Here. Specifically pg 16. That crap found everywhere. 



			https://files.catbox.moe/0vwcmj.pdf


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Not at all. Japan insisted on the information from Pfizer, and they got it. Here. Specifically pg 16. That crap found everywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> https://files.catbox.moe/0vwcmj.pdf


Can you save me some time and post the relevant passage and cite the page number?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> Can you save me some time and post the relevant passage and cite the page number?



So you don't want to know, you didn't even look. You couldn't even be bothered to click the link and scroll to page 16, because if you would have you would have seen that the "relevant information" is the entire page.

Okay, you made your choice and now you're a Vaccine Cheerleader. Fine. But don't pretend you're open-minded because you're not.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> So you don't want to know, you didn't even look. You couldn't even be bothered to click the link and scroll to page 16, because if you would have you would have seen that the "relevant information" is the entire page.
> 
> Okay, you made your choice and now you're a Vaccine Cheerleader. Fine. But don't pretend you're open-minded because you're not.


I’m not going to go sifting through 23 pages looking for something that might not be there. But I will look at page 16 and get back to you.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> So you don't want to know, you didn't even look. You couldn't even be bothered to click the link and scroll to page 16, because if you would have you would have seen that the "relevant information" is the entire page.
> 
> Okay, you made your choice and now you're a Vaccine Cheerleader. Fine. But don't pretend you're open-minded because you're not.


I looked at page 16 of the pdf which is numbered page 6 of the document here it is:





Exactly what is it that you think this is saying?


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Okay, you made your choice and now you're a Vaccine Cheerleader. Fine. But don't pretend you're open-minded because you're not.


I am the most open minded person you will ever meet.  

How many times have you gotten covid?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> I am the most open minded person you will ever meet.
> 
> How many times have you gotten covid?



You are most certainly not; you barely opened the document. You wouldn't. The document is telling how much of the vaccine components were in the ORGANS after vaccination. This wasn't supposed to happen. This is what is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women. 

I have not had covid, am unvaccinated, and have been around so many people who have had it I can't even tell you. I lost count beyond 50. Now, most of them are fully vaccinated. I am in an early hotspot, MI, and we are in our fourth wave. I teach 150 children a day.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Don't mention Ivermectin; it'll upset the vaccine rollout - BizNews.com
					

Ivermectin is seen as a repeat of hydroxychloroquine and not to be taken seriously. Belief in it, worthy only of derision.




					www.biznews.com


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> You are most certainly not; you barely opened the document. You wouldn't. The document is telling how much of the vaccine components were in the ORGANS after vaccination. This wasn't supposed to happen. This is what is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women.
> 
> I have not had covid, am unvaccinated, and have been around so many people who have had it I can't even tell you. I lost count beyond 50. Now, most of them are fully vaccinated. I am in an early hotspot, MI, and we are in our fourth wave. I teach 150 children a day.


The liver count got me there on page 16.  Not sure what could happen there.  But it shows the spike protein moving around the body.


----------



## iamwhatiseem (Nov 27, 2021)

candycorn said:


> So you're stating that right wing nut jobs are refusing the vaccine because of what Pelosi, Biden and Harris allegedly said?


Someone with a simple brain incapable of understanding would think that is all I mean yes... or someone who does understand, but just wants to troll. Which are you?


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> More excuses.  The definition was fine til they needed to change it for mRNA.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So tell me how the wording change makes the definition LESS accurate?

And I'm still waiting for you to post the data on all the vaccines that provide 100% immunity


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> So tell me how the wording change makes the definition LESS accurate?
> 
> And I'm still waiting for you to post the data on all the vaccines that provide 100% immunity



If he doesn't it proves nothing. People can see what's going on, and it makes a difference. 

People get their kids vaccinated for measles, mumps, rubella, polio. Generally no one gets these diseases, or if they do, everyone is SHOCKED.

Meanwhile, almost all my coworkers got vaccinated ONLY months ago, and many many many of them are getting sick with Covid. It is not shocking to hear this. It is now expected.

If you think there is no difference between the two, or somehow someone posting information that shows "no vaccine is 100%" makes these failed vaccines somehow better, you're wrong. People can see and know what's going on.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> So tell me how the wording change makes the definition LESS accurate?
> 
> And I'm still waiting for you to post the data on all the vaccines that provide 100% immunity


I never stated that vaccines offer 100% immunity. That was you attacking me twisting words.  So I'm not going to go there .  You will now go.....SEE YOU PROVE MY POINT.  From something I never said.

Oh well Sucks to be you.

Changing the wording is BS.  They did it because it DIDN'T MATCH THEIR NARRATIVE and nothing more.

Protection from ............Well hell the FOOTBALL PLAYER was VACCINATED FROM INJURY by wearing a helmet.  

Same dang thing happened to the defintion of death with the CDC before this started.  You COULD ASSUME they had covid at death.  And then create  a CARE's ACT that hands out $77000 per admitted patient in a hot spot.  Soooo  The hospitals CASHED IN.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

What makes people defend these failing vaccines at any rate?

Haven't we all taken medicine that sucked before? Didn't work, had bad side effects, etc? Go on any drug ratings website and see the people who are thrilled to tell you all about how bad the drugs SUCKED.

Yet here are all these yahoos, watching cases, hospitalizations and deaths explode even in highly vaxxed areas--STILL DEFENDING THEM.

Why? Do they work for Pfizer? It's just stupid


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> If he doesn't it proves nothing. People can see what's going on, and it makes a difference.
> 
> People get their kids vaccinated for measles, mumps, rubella, polio. Generally no one gets these diseases, or if they do, everyone is SHOCKED.
> 
> ...


They don't care.   Our gov't is just cashing in on this plannedemic.  Pharma making BILLIONS off people dying.  Nothing new here.  They have been doing it forever.  

$2 a treatment used in many countries Early on have done very well.  Can't have that.  THERE IS NO PROFIT IN IT.









						Don't mention Ivermectin; it'll upset the vaccine rollout - BizNews.com
					

Ivermectin is seen as a repeat of hydroxychloroquine and not to be taken seriously. Belief in it, worthy only of derision.




					www.biznews.com


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> What makes people defend these failing vaccines at any rate?
> 
> Haven't we all taken medicine that sucked before? Didn't work, had bad side effects, etc? Go on any drug ratings website and see the people who are thrilled to tell you all about how bad the drugs SUCKED.
> 
> ...


Brain washed by the tube.  TV.  Social media.  Gov'ts controlling what you see.  Kill any article that doesn't support the narrative they want. 

Then they use FEAR and say ...........PANDEMIC OF THE UNVACCINATED.  Create a target for all pissed off about this BS.  Point at us.............how dare you NOT OBEY........You are causing this.

The variants are causing this.  The LEAKY EXPERIMENTAL VACCINES are causing this.  EARLY treatment NOT BEING DONE..........is causing this.

They will be trying to put a YELLOW STAR ON US SOON SweetSue.  Same shit that caused WWII.  You see it all over the world.  Everyone going FASCIST over this crap that I am convinced they created in that lab.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Brain washed by the tube.  TV.  Social media.  Gov'ts controlling what you see.  Kill any article that doesn't support the narrative they want.
> 
> Then they use FEAR and say ...........PANDEMIC OF THE UNVACCINATED.  Create a target for all pissed off about this BS.  Point at us.............how dare you NOT OBEY........You are causing this.
> 
> ...



You cannot obtain ivermectin now. And even if you can, many pharmacies will not fill it. 

This is my country. This is America. A TRULY safe, effective medication that won the Nobel Prize. But "they" won't let you have it because it doesn't advance their interests.

Again. This is what has become of the "land of the free and the home of the brave"


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> You cannot obtain ivermectin now. And even if you can, many pharmacies will not fill it.
> 
> This is my country. This is America. A TRULY safe, effective medication that won the Nobel Prize. But "they" won't let you have it because it doesn't advance their interests.
> 
> Again. This is what has become of the "land of the free and the home of the brave"


And people are too stupid to see it.  All the narratives are that it is HORSE DEWORMER.  In fact it attaches to the spike protein and keeps it from replicating.

But...........har har har.........you are taking horse dewormer.....har har har.  From these MOONBATS.  Same thing they did with HCL  

We are a world of MOON BATS NOW.  Oh well FUCK THEM.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> All conventional vaccines provide more immunity than mRNA. I've been vaxxed with almost all of them before going in to hot zones.


Please supply the data that supports your claim.  And FYI your stories aren't data.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Are you implying that jabs are preventing infections?
> 
> Of course, especially when it doesn't fit the narrative.
> 
> ...


I never believed any vaccine was 100% effective because there has never been a vaccine that has been 100% effective.

The word change has made the definition MORE accurate and you are whining about that?


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> If he doesn't it proves nothing. People can see what's going on, and it makes a difference.
> 
> People get their kids vaccinated for measles, mumps, rubella, polio. Generally no one gets these diseases, or if they do, everyone is SHOCKED.
> 
> ...


Yeah people with any intelligence at all realize that the word change is actually an improvement because it makes the definition more accurate.

And you say they failed but still more unvaccinated people are hospitalized, more unvaccinated  are dead.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

Lesh said:


> Bullshit
> 
> 
> 
> ...



He's right.  You're wrong once again.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

badger2 said:


> The new definition is faulty for scientific reasons. The political and psychopathological reasons include the fact that Americans are not entitled to the entire virus in a traditional vaccine form: India’s Covaxin. Another political reason is that CIA-sponsored propaganda is involved in the current fear-mongering (because that’s their puppet in the White House) Dem-Nazi media for the Nu/omicron variant. This variant is being deliberately sensationalized. We see the list of Nu mutations, old and new. So which ones make it so deadly? By now it could just as easily be deliberately seeded into the population from production facilities inside the U.S. The first SARS-CoV-2 could have begun in the same way, though taken from nature.


I disagree.

No vaccine has ever provided 100% immunity 

And mRNA vaccines aren't really as new as people think and the research on then has been active for decades now.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

Despite the fact that tony's "expert" _proactive _prescription for those who contracted a killer disease was to stay home and isolate until it's so bad that you can't breathe, and then get to the hospital.

Is there anyone here who would like to defend tony's "proactive" approach to those who get sick?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Yeah people with any intelligence at all realize that the word change is actually an improvement because it makes the definition more accurate.
> 
> And you say they failed but still more unvaccinated people are hospitalized, more unvaccinated  are dead.



Three shots in about 8 months, with no idea of long term effects.

All I can say is, glad it's you and not me at this point.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> I disagree.
> 
> No vaccine has ever provided 100% immunity
> 
> And mRNA vaccines aren't really as new as people think and the research on then has been active for decades now.


Show me the products of moderna and profits from Moderna.......Gates ....lol........before this plannedemic

Show me the massive HUMAN TRIALS OF IT before this plannedemic.

yawn


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> You are most certainly not; you barely opened the document. You wouldn't. The document is telling how much of the vaccine components were in the ORGANS after vaccination. This wasn't supposed to happen. This is what is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women.
> 
> I have not had covid, am unvaccinated, and have been around so many people who have had it I can't even tell you. I lost count beyond 50. Now, most of them are fully vaccinated. I am in an early hotspot, MI, and we are in our fourth wave. I teach 150 children a day.


I did open the document, dummy.  That's how I knew there were 23 pages.  And like I already explained to you I wasn't going to go searching for something that might not have even been there in the first place.  It was your duty to point me to what you wanted me to see.  It is not my duty to try to guess what it was that you wanted me to see.  Which is why I asked you to cite the page number that referenced what you wanted me to see. I then went to that page and found nothing that resembled your claim, so I showed you the page your referenced and asked you how this was relevant.  I do not get from page 16 that how much of the vaccine components were in the ORGANS after vaccination or that is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women.

Can you explain how you got that from page 16?

You are either very lucky or your predictable surprise is still waiting to happen.  Good luck with that.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

badger2 said:


> We are suspicious of forced mRNA production of Chinese communist virus parts, especially in children without fully developed immune systems. The other two choices are different viruses, not even coronaviruseS, and one of these is from a chimpanzee. The traditional and real vaccine is India’s Covaxin. Americans have no access to the entire, real virus vaccine.


Yea dummy, the mRNA instructions are for spike protein without the rest of the virus.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> There's no downside to getting vaccinated? Are you for real
> 
> What about the young people who suffer myocarditis?
> 
> What about people who get this, it messes with their immune system, and they end up with shingles and so many other effects?


Myocarditis is far more common among...Covid-19 patients.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Three shots in about 8 months, with no idea of long term effects.
> 
> All I can say is, glad it's you and not me at this point.



Yes you can live in fear of science if you want to.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Please supply the data that supports your claim.  And FYI your stories aren't data.





Blues Man said:


> I disagree.
> 
> No vaccine has ever provided 100% immunity
> 
> And mRNA vaccines aren't really as new as people think and the research on then has been active for decades now.



The data shows they are exponentially more dangerous than conventional vaccines.  This is the first time in history that mRNA has been tested on humans.  They never went through the proper clinical trials.  Now, we're seeing the effects of such horrid science.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

Didn't the Saulk Institute produce the first study that showed the spike-protein alone to be the thing that does the damage?  Yes.  

Yes they did!

Sooooo . . .


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Myocarditis is far more common among...Covid-19 patients.



According to your local propaganda pumping media.  They love gullible people.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> The data shows they are exponentially more dangerous than conventional vaccines.  This is the first time in history that mRNA has been tested on humans.  They never went through the proper clinical trials.  Now, we're seeing the effects of such horrid science.


WHat data?  You haven't provided any.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> WHat data?  You haven't provided any.



VAERS, european reporting etc.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

Social media is ruining this country.  It's 1984 all over again.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Myocarditis is far more common among...Covid-19 patients.


No shit sherlock.  That how you water down the vaccine doing it as well.,

lmao


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Yes you can live in fear of science if you want to.



  Yours is the Josef Mengele branch of _“science”_.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> I never believed any vaccine was 100% effective because there has never been a vaccine that has been 100% effective.
> 
> The word change has made the definition MORE accurate and you are whining about that?



More accurate? Or just fitting the narrative. Let's see...


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Did it ever occur to you that his immune system became compromised because of the "vaccine"?


No.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Taiwan Bans 2nd Pfizer Shot For Kids 12-17 Over Myocarditis Concerns
					

Taiwan has joined Iceland, Sweden, Finland and Denmark on halting vaccines for young people due to concerns about…




					thepulse.one


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> More accurate? Or just fitting the narrative. Let's see...
> 
> View attachment 568956



Before everyone stepped into the BS


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Care to explain, if "human trials" were complete, why "vaccines" are still under emergency use authorization?


It's a very easy explanation - you don't know what you are talking about.

Pfizer has full authorization. FDA is working through Moderns full authorization now.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Pictures?
> 
> How about the video?
> 
> ...


What about the video?


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> VAERS, european reporting etc.


LINK


----------



## Canon Shooter (Nov 27, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Your words lost all value when you essentially say that anyone who disagrees with you is irrational. It's ignorant to post that on a forum like this, simply because it doesn't allow for a discussion. 

_That's_ irrational...


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

BasicHumanUnit said:


> Just stop it.
> I was hospitalized last year for a temporary health emergency for 5 days.  NON Covid related.
> 2 days in they moved me into the ICU Covid Backup ward (WITH ALL THE SERIOUSLY ILL COVID PATIENTS, all 4 of them)
> I left that hospital on the 3rd day and went elsewhere...but never tested positive for covid most likely because I already had natural immunity.
> ...


Wtf? You think your hospital CONSPIRED with someone to place you into...

Let me explain something. NOBODY GIVES ENOUGH SHIT ABOUT YOU to run a convoluted conspiracy to do something to you.

You sound out of your fucking mind.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> According to your local propaganda pumping media.  They love gullible people.


No dummy, according to medical professionals.

Myocarditis is a well known Covid complication.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Wtf? You think your hospital CONSPIRED with someone to place you into...
> 
> Let me explain something. NOBODY GIVES ENOUGH SHIT ABOUT YOU to run a convoluted conspiracy to do something to you.
> 
> You sound out of your fucking mind.


When they can make $100,000 per patient, the game changes.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> More accurate? Or just fitting the narrative. Let's see...
> 
> View attachment 568956


Funny how you didn't see this part of the definition

_: a preparation of genetic material (such as a strand of synthesized messenger RNA) that is used by the cells of the body to produce an antigenic substance (such as a fragment of virus spike protein)_


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> No dummy, according to medical professionals.
> 
> Myocarditis is a well known Covid complication.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> It's a very easy explanation - you don't know what you are talking about.
> 
> Pfizer has full authorization. FDA is working through Moderns full authorization now.



Another lie. Well, at least half truth. 

Pfizer/BioNTech is still under emergency use authorization, while Pfizer/Comirnaty has "full approval" (based on what?), and is not available in US. 

From FDA website: "Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine is *authorized for emergency use* and is available under the EUA as a two-dose primary series in individuals 5 years of age and older, as a third primary series dose for individuals 12 years of age and older who have been determined to have certain kinds of immunocompromise, and as a single booster dose in people 18 years of age and older."

Comirnaty and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine​


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

badger2 said:


> When they can make $100,000 per patient, the game changes.


He wasn't treated for Covid and did not have positive PCR test, wtf are you talking about?

He can easily look up if he was billed for Covid treatment and refer to authorities evidence of fraud if he was.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Funny how you didn't see this part of the definition
> 
> _: a preparation of genetic material (such as a strand of synthesized messenger RNA) that is used by the cells of the body to produce an antigenic substance (such as a fragment of virus spike protein)_


This has been an EMERGENCY USE DEFINITION.  Disregard all further alarms.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Funny how you didn't see this part of the definition
> 
> _: a preparation of genetic material (such as a strand of synthesized messenger RNA) that is used by the cells of the body to produce an antigenic substance (such as a fragment of virus spike protein)_



That's exactly what doesn't make it vaccine.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> He wasn't treated for Covid and did not have positive PCR test, wtf are you talking about?
> 
> He can easily look up if he was billed for Covid treatment and refer to authorities evidence of fraud if he was.


Well shit.  Where have we heard this before.  Crank the cycles up to 50 to make real sure he's postive.

Will you understand my sarcasm.?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Another lie. Well, at least half truth.
> 
> Pfizer/BioNTech is still under emergency use authorization, while Pfizer/Comirnaty has "full approval" (based on what?), and is not available in US.
> 
> ...


Idiot, it's fully approved as of August.









						FDA Approves First COVID-19 Vaccine
					

FDA approved the first COVID-19 vaccine, now marketed as Comirnaty, for the prevention of COVID-19 disease in individuals 16 years of age and older.




					www.fda.gov


----------



## candycorn (Nov 27, 2021)

iamwhatiseem said:


> Someone with a simple brain incapable of understanding would think that is all I mean yes... or someone who does understand, but just wants to troll. Which are you?



You seem really confused.  Perhaps some professional counseling could help you make sense of things once more.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Well shit.  Where have we heard this before.  Crank the cycles up to 50 to make real sure he's postive.
> 
> Will you understand my sarcasm.?


You fools live on paranoid conspiracy theories.

I work in IT management for a hospital. It's a bureaucracy where getting people from all levels to quietly participate in a brazen fraud scheme is right near impossible. Nobody on the clinical side wants to go to jail just because someone in finance or administration wants to infect people with Covid.

It's fucking nuts.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> You fools live on paranoid conspiracy theories.
> 
> I work in IT management for a hospital. It's a bureaucracy where getting people from all levels to quietly participate in a brazen fraud scheme is right near impossible. Nobody wants to go to jail just because someone in finance or administration wants to infect people with Covid.
> 
> It's fucking nuts.


Tell me about the Cares Act and $77000 per covid patient money then........hmmmm  

Went right over your head on the pcr cycles.  What was normal before this BS and where did they test at during this BS???

HOW MANY CYCLES ?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Nobody wants to go to jail just because someone in finance or administration wants to infect people with Covid.


LOL

Twisting words that were never said.  The more they say are covid the more $77000 per patient they get.

And you are going to tell me the hospitals didn't feed at that trough......lmao


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> This has been an EMERGENCY USE DEFINITION.  Disregard all further alarms.


No that was part of the definition from the Meriam Webster Dictionary that the Americano linked to 

Maybe you should read it?


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> That's exactly what doesn't make it vaccine.


Not according to the definition you just posted.  Did you even read the definition?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> I did open the document, dummy.  That's how I knew there were 23 pages.  And like I already explained to you I wasn't going to go searching for something that might not have even been there in the first place.  It was your duty to point me to what you wanted me to see.  It is not my duty to try to guess what it was that you wanted me to see.  Which is why I asked you to cite the page number that referenced what you wanted me to see. I then went to that page and found nothing that resembled your claim, so I showed you the page your referenced and asked you how this was relevant.  I do not get from page 16 that how much of the vaccine components were in the ORGANS after vaccination or that is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women.
> 
> Can you explain how you got that from page 16?
> 
> You are either very lucky or your predictable surprise is still waiting to happen.  Good luck with that.



Are you a woman? You must be, because this is a lot of arguing about opening a document.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Idiot, it's fully approved as of August.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I literally gave you a link to FDA document that says it's still under EUA, and you gave me link to "press release" that confirms continuation of EUA and expansion to cover different age groups. 

You can't see forest for the trees, and with that, I'm done arguing with you.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Yes you can live in fear of science if you want to.



If you don't, you're a bigger dunderhead than I thought.

Science destroyed Hiroshima. Science kills an inordinate amount of Americans via "medical mistakes". Proper caution is only RATIONAL


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> No that was part of the definition from the Meriam Webster Dictionary that the Americano linked to
> 
> Maybe you should read it?


Maybe you can figure out I'm making fun of your BS crawfishing here.

Oh well.  WE CHANGED IT FOR EVERYONE'S GOOD.  lmao

Need a backhoe in here to shovel that shit.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Tell me about the Cares Act and $77000 per covid patient money then........hmmmm
> 
> Went right over your head on the pcr cycles.  What was normal before this BS and where did they test at during this BS???
> 
> HOW MANY CYCLES ?


It's hard to follow wtf you are talking about.

Patient comes in presenting Covid symptoms, PCR test is ordered by a PA or Attending, if it's negative and clinical correlation remains consistent with Covid another PCR test is administered because false negatives are possible.

Neither PA, nor Attending get paid more for Covid diagnosis. They have zero incentive to mis-treat the patient.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Not according to the definition you just posted.  Did you even read the definition?


I literally posted the image of the definition of what vaccine was before and after it was changed. 

Definition was changed to fit the narrative of what they was it to mean today. You say to be "more accurate", I say to make you believe that you're getting the vaccine, which mRNA shot isn't.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Myocarditis is far more common among...Covid-19 patients.



So if you DO NOT get vaccinated, you might get covid, and maybe myocarditis from it. But if you get vaccinated, you might get myocarditis from the vaccine, and then you will probably ALSO get covid...and get myocarditis from that.

Gosh. Which one do I choose?

Ever heard "the cure cannot be worse than the disease"?


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Maybe you can figure out I'm making fun of your BS crawfishing here.
> 
> Oh well.  WE CHANGED IT FOR EVERYONE'S GOOD.  lmao
> 
> Need a backhoe in here to shovel that shit.



We change definitions all the time.

It's not some conspiracy.  An mRNA vaccine simply uses a manufactured part of a virus's genetic coding for a protein instead of the the entire  virus and all the proteins it contains.

The result is the same


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> It's hard to follow wtf you are talking about.
> 
> Patient comes in presenting Covid symptoms, PCR test is ordered by a PA or Attending, if it's negative and clinical correlation remains consistent with Covid another PCR test is administered because false negatives are possible.
> 
> Neither PA, nor Attending get paid more for Covid diagnosis. They have zero incentive to mis-treat the patient.


Here, let me help you understand what he's getting at.  Are you familiar with the PCR-test?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> It's hard to follow wtf you are talking about.


Which is the point.  You DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.



antontoo said:


> Patient comes in presenting Covid symptoms, PCR test is ordered by a PA or Attending, if it's negative and clinical correlation remains consistent with Covid another PCR test is administered because false negatives are possible.
> 
> Neither PA, nor Attending get paid more for Covid diagnosis. They have zero incentive to mis-treat the patient.


LOL

Again You don't know what I'm talking about.  lmao  You are lecturing people and don't have a clue.

You also don't know the CARES ACT ether.  $100 billion for what i'm talking about.  That was only the first round.

Study pcr tests and get back to me.

lol


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> I literally posted the image of the definition of what vaccine was before and after it was changed.
> 
> Definition was changed to fit the narrative of what they was it to mean today. You say to be "more accurate", I say to make you believe that you're getting the vaccine, which mRNA shot isn't.


The Meriam Webster definition?

Or the CDC definition?

Or the scientific definition?

And I'll take the opinion of scientists and virologists over yours when it comes to what is and isn't a vaccine.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> So if you DO NOT get vaccinated, you might get covid, and maybe myocarditis from it. But if you get vaccinated, you might get myocarditis from the vaccine, and then you will probably ALSO get covid...and get myocarditis from that.
> 
> Gosh. Which one do I choose?
> 
> Ever heard "the cure cannot be worse than the disease"?


BS. Vaccinated have much less chance of complications from Covid.

Go look at serious clinical data instead of running your mouth.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> We change definitions all the time.
> 
> It's not some conspiracy.  An mRNA vaccine simply uses a manufactured part of a virus's genetic coding for a protein instead of the the entire  virus and all the proteins it contains.
> 
> The result is the same


No it is not.  It is a Flu Shot.  As the virus mutates to new variants around it.  That is why we don't really have Flu Vaccines but shots.  We are on NU variant and they are giving Alpha vaccines.......lol.......now.

WHY?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Which is the point.  You DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.
> 
> 
> LOL
> ...


Ok moron you are not saying anything here. Just  stupid beating around the bush while I explained to you exactly how it works.

If you have any serious evidence of hospital fraud go ahead and coherently present it.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> BS. Vaccinated have much less chance of complications from Covid.
> 
> Go look at serious clinical data instead of running your mouth.



Really? How many people do you know who have had covid and recovered with no complications? 

Because I know a lot.

While we're at it, what is your stake in defending these failing vaccines so vigorously? Just the fact that BOOSTERS are already necessary should tell you something. But no. Geez


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> BS. Vaccinated have much less chance of complications from Covid.
> 
> Go look at serious clinical data instead of running your mouth.


Vaccinated from which variant.  As the variants change so should the JAB.  Which is why they call endemic Flu A SHOT and not a vaccine.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Ok moron you are not saying anything here. Just  stupid beating around the bush while I explained to you exactly how it works.
> 
> If you have any serious evidence of hospital fraud go ahead and coherently present it.


You don't know squat or you would have answered the original question.  YOU DON'T KNOW.

Whatever.  You proved to those who know what I'm talking about.  lol


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Really? How many people do you know who have had covid and recovered with no complications?
> 
> Because I know a lot.
> 
> While we're at it, what is your stake in defending these failing vaccines so vigorously? Just the fact that BOOSTERS are already necessary should tell you something. But no. Geez


Most recover from Covid-19 without complications, BUT SOME DO NOT and the rate of complications from Covid are thousands times more common than vax complications...get it?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Really? How many people do you know who have had covid and recovered with no complications?
> 
> Because I know a lot.
> 
> While we're at it, what is your stake in defending these failing vaccines so vigorously? Just the fact that BOOSTERS are already necessary should tell you something. But no. Geez


Did you notice he doesn't have a clue about cycles and pcr tests.?


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Are you a woman? You must be, because this is a lot of arguing about opening a document.


Nope.  And you still have not explained how what was on page 16 leads you to your conclusion that the vaccine is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Most recover from Covid-19 without complications, BUT SOME DO NOT and the rate of complications from Covid are thousands times more common than vax complications...get it?



If you trust that the reporting is honest and valid coming out of the hospitals on vaccine injuries. I do not. And you shouldn't either


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Did you notice he doesn't have a clue about cycles and pcr tests.?


Yup!  His belief system depends on him not understanding the PCR-test issue.  That's why he's avoiding it.  He knows the next question will be why he continues to put his health in the hands of people who deceived him in the very beginning of this.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> Nope.  And you still have not explained how what was on page 16 leads you to your conclusion that the vaccine is damaging hearts, causing clots, and causing menstrual problems in women.



The spike protein was supposed to stay confined to the large muscle in arm or leg, and produce an antibody response. It was not supposed to break free and travel around to organs. That's why it's causing organ damage and blood clots, heart damage, etc. 

The "fact checkers" say it doesn't happen this way. The "fact checking" thing is right out of 1930s Germany.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The Meriam Webster definition?
> 
> Or the CDC definition?
> 
> ...


Uhmm... what? Science is not about opinions, but about facts. And you chose opinions of the politicians and talking heads... 

Meriam Webster got it from scientists when science meant science, and not politics. You don't like their definition? How about CDC definition, before and after COVID.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Uhmm... what? Science is not about opinions, but about facts. And you chose opinions of the politicians and talking heads...
> 
> Meriam Webster got it from scientists when science meant science, and not politics. You don't like their definition? How about CDC definition, before and after COVID.
> 
> View attachment 568975


Vaccines now don't need to produce immunity.

These people are clowns..........NO SEE IT WAS RIGHT.  OBEY YOUR GOD GOV;T.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Vaccines now don't need to produce immunity.
> 
> These people are clowns..........NO SEE IT WAS RIGHT.  OBEY YOUR GOD GOV;T.



I guess, the vaccine science will be settled, as it is updated.


----------



## Correll (Nov 27, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...




IMO, it is because of the hate and lies spread by the MSM about them, for so long. Any actions on the part of conservatives, to validate them as sources of information, is emotionally repugnant to them.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> The spike protein was supposed to stay confined to the large muscle in arm or leg, and produce an antibody response. It was not supposed to break free and travel around to organs. That's why it's causing organ damage and blood clots, heart damage, etc.
> 
> The "fact checkers" say it doesn't happen this way. The "fact checking" thing is right out of 1930s Germany.


Putting aside the fact that you are wrong because the spike protein by itself is benign, how did you get that from page 16 of the document you posted?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> BS. Vaccinated have much less chance of complications from Covid.
> 
> Go look at serious clinical data instead of running your mouth.



Are you saying that clinical trials were complete?


----------



## Oddball (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Really? How many people do you know who have had covid and recovered with no complications?
> 
> Because I know a lot.
> 
> While we're at it, what is your stake in defending these failing vaccines so vigorously? Just the fact that BOOSTERS are already necessary should tell you something. But no. Geez


All that and not a single peep about the previously infected, who have natural immunity.


----------



## Oddball (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> BS. Vaccinated have much less chance of complications from Covid.
> 
> Go look at serious clinical data instead of running your mouth.


Much of that data is being hidden, jackass.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Ok moron you are not saying anything here. Just  stupid beating around the bush while I explained to you exactly how it works.
> 
> If you have any serious evidence of hospital fraud go ahead and coherently present it.





Correll said:


> IMO, it is because of the hate and lies spread by the MSM about them, for so long. Any actions on the part of conservatives, to validate them as sources of information, is emotionally repugnant to them.


You didn't hear about the study done at the Salk Institute that showed for the first time that the spike-protein causes damage on its own, did you?

Would you care to address that?


----------



## Correll (Nov 27, 2021)

Briss said:


> You didn't hear about the study done at the Salk Institute that showed for the first time that the spike-protein causes damage on its own, did you?
> 
> Would you care to address that?



No.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

Correll said:


> No.


I know . . .

But just for the record, explain why that issue is not open for discussion with you.


----------



## Correll (Nov 27, 2021)

Briss said:


> I know . . .
> 
> But just for the record, explain why that issue is not open for discussion with you.




Not sure. Perhaps faith in Trump? It was  his program after all.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> Putting aside the fact that you are wrong because the spike protein by itself is benign, how did you get that from page 16 of the document you posted?



Are you willing to go back to pg 14 or is that too much to ask, or would you rather argue about it for a while?


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

Correll said:


> Not sure. Perhaps faith in Trump? It was  his program after all.


No, I'm talk about a study done at the Salk Institute that showed for the first time that the spike-protein on it's own causes damage to the body.  So, how does one reconcile that with the fact that the experimental injection is going to deliver spike-proteins into you?


----------



## Correll (Nov 27, 2021)

Briss said:


> No, I'm talk about a study done at the Salk Institute that showed for the first time that the spike-protein on it's own causes damage to the body.  So, how does one reconcile that with the fact that the experimental injection is going to deliver spike-proteins into you?



I rarely read raw studies. This issue seemed clear cut enough not to require that level of investigation. 

I...just am not going to invest teh time to read up on the issue enough to discuss it. Sorry. I know that much be frustrating for you.


----------



## Mac-7 (Nov 27, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Why single out conservatives?

Opposition to the shot exists in all quarters of society for many different reasons


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Are you willing to go back to pg 14 or is that too much to ask, or would you rather argue about it for a while?


Here is page 14 of the pdf which is page 4 of the report.  Lay it on me.


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> LINK







__





						European Vaccination Information Portal / Home page | European Vaccination Information Portal
					






					vaccination-info.eu
				








__





						VAERS - Data
					





					vaers.hhs.gov


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Another lie. Well, at least half truth.
> 
> Pfizer/BioNTech is still under emergency use authorization, while Pfizer/Comirnaty has "full approval" (based on what?), and is not available in US.
> 
> ...



You may as well be talking to a fence post.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Why single out conservatives?
> 
> Opposition to the shot exists in all quarters of society for many different reasons


Because three-to-one it's conservatives that are anti-vaxers, odds even higher on Trumpsters.

It exists PRIMARILY on the right, as vaccination rates, this thread, or any Trump rally shows.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's correlative data, not causation data.


----------



## Mac-7 (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Because three-to-one it's conservatives that are anti-vaxers


Thats only your biased and uninformed guessimate

There is resistance all over the world


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Because three-to-one it's conservatives that are anti-vaxers, odds even higher on Trumpsters.
> 
> It exists PRIMARILY on the right, as vaccination rates, this thread, or any Trump rally shows.


Lets put your statement to a test.

Left claim is that more intelligent people support democrats, including around half of whites, nearly 95% of blacks, and nearly 90% academia.

Can you explain to me, why blacks have lowest vaccination rate of all minority groups? Why scientists are refusing to get vaccinated?

The lie you participate in today becomes the future you live in tomorrow. Enjoy your boosters.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> No it is not.  It is a Flu Shot.  As the virus mutates to new variants around it.  That is why we don't really have Flu Vaccines but shots.  We are on NU variant and they are giving Alpha vaccines.......lol.......now.
> 
> WHY?


The flu shot is a vaccine.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The flu shot is a vaccine.


I'll concede that one point.  It's good for the mutation it targets.  Why you have to get one every year. But it is NOT A mRNA.  And it is a whole virus antigen.  Only one like it for covid is a vector vaccine Covaxin from India.  And it.....like the rest is tailored to the ALPHA variant of covid.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Where are the stats for deaths due to the vaccine?


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The flu shot is a vaccine.



It's a conventional vaccine that contains an attenuated virus.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I'll concede that one point.  It's good for the mutation it targets.  Why you have to get one every year. But it is NOT A mRNA.  And it is a whole virus antigen.  Only one like it for covid is a vector vaccine Covaxin from India.  And it.....like the rest is tailored to the ALPHA variant of covid.











						The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
					

A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.




					publichealth.jhu.edu
				




Tell me what is the difference between injecting a set of proteins isolated from a live virus and the injection of a synthesized piece of the genetic code of those proteins.

That is what an mRNA vaccine is.  It's just a modern version of the old live or denatured virus vaccines.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The flu shot is a vaccine.



Yes, against current strain. When flu mutates, the shot changes too. 

The shot you got few years back still works against that particular strain, but not against new ones. You don't get booster of the same vaccine, you get new shot for new strain.

The current shot for covid may have been effective (despite side effects) against original Wuhan strain, but not against delta strain. 

Just as delta, this new "omicron" variant got mutated spike proteins that mRNA suppose to tech your body to identify and fight against. Thus, the current so called "vaccine" is useless.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> It's a conventional vaccine that contains an attenuated virus.


Tell me what is the difference between injecting a set of proteins isolated from a live virus and the injection of a synthesized piece of the genetic code of those proteins.

That is what an mRNA vaccine is. It's just a modern version of the old live or denatured virus vaccines.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Yes, against current strain. When flu mutates, the shot changes too.
> 
> The shot you got few years back still works against that particular strain, but not against new ones. You don't get booster of the same vaccine, you get new shot for new strain.
> 
> ...



The flu shot is a vaccine
mRNA vaccines are vaccines

There is no conspiracy here


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
> 
> 
> A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.
> ...


One is fake and the other is not.  One gives very limited memory the other gives longer memory.  T Cell memory.  One is TRADITIONAl and one is EXPERIMENTAL.

Covaxin from India is the ONLY TRADITIONAL VACCINE OUT THERE.  It is a vector based vaccine.  

So.  tell me about how the mRNA vaccine is supposed to stay in the injection site.  And is it good if it travels through the body????????????????


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The flu shot is a vaccine
> mRNA vaccines are vaccines
> 
> There is no conspiracy here


One has a long history of tests on humans.  The other has 4 months.  

VAERs.  has reported more Adverse effects than all the other vaccines combined.  Why is that?

VAERs Wonder site.  Then do the search.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Where are the stats for deaths due to the vaccine?








						The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) Request
					






					wonder.cdc.gov
				




Click I agree first.
Click vaers data search
Click covid 19 section 3


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> One is fake and the other is not.  One gives very limited memory the other gives longer memory.  T Cell memory.  One is TRADITIONAl and one is EXPERIMENTAL.
> 
> Covaxin from India is the ONLY TRADITIONAL VACCINE OUT THERE.  It is a vector based vaccine.
> 
> So.  tell me about how the mRNA vaccine is supposed to stay in the injection site.  And is it good if it travels through the body????????????????


Neither is fake.

MRNA vaccine research is decades old.

This article id from 2018









						mRNA vaccines â€” a new era in vaccinology - Nature Reviews Drug Discovery
					

mRNA vaccines represent a promising alternative to conventional vaccine approaches, but their application has been hampered by instability and delivery issues. Here, Pardi and colleagues discuss recent advances in mRNA vaccine technology, assess mRNA vaccines currently in development for cancer...




					www.nature.com


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> One has a long history of tests on humans.  The other has 4 months.
> 
> VAERs.  has reported more Adverse effects than all the other vaccines combined.  Why is that?
> 
> VAERs Wonder site.  Then do the search.


We can extrapolate from other vaccine research and on the data from other mRNA vaccines.  The COVID vaccine isn't the first one you know.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Neither is fake.
> 
> MRNA vaccine research is decades old.
> 
> ...


It has been around before 1989.  It failed many tests over that span.  

Only recently did they find ways to trick the body into accepting it.  aka the body kills the protein during injection.  

It has NEVER HAD MASSIVE HUMAN TRIALS. before this.  YOU ARE THE TRIAL.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> We can extrapolate from other vaccine research and on the data from other mRNA vaccines.  The COVID vaccine isn't the first one you know.


lol

EBOLA.......HIV............lol

That is another story.  Show me the HUMAN TESTS ON HIV OR EBOLA.  LMAO

You go right ahead and be the first lab rat on that.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> It has been around before 1989.  It failed many tests over that span.
> 
> Only recently did they find ways to trick the body into accepting it.  aka the body kills the protein during injection.
> 
> It has NEVER HAD MASSIVE HUMAN TRIALS. before this.  YOU ARE THE TRIAL.


It was the delivery system not the mRNA portion of the vaccine that was the problem.

And I'm fine with the method of the trials.  The FDA is notorious for taking way too long to approve a drug.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The flu shot is a vaccine
> mRNA vaccines are vaccines
> 
> There is no conspiracy here



The only similarity between mRNA shot and a vaccine is the way being injected into a body. 

I would tell you to search for what non American pharma says about it, but you would ignore it, so here is the screenshot.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> lol
> 
> EBOLA.......HIV............lol
> 
> ...


The mRNA Ebola vaccine was given to people but Ebola is extremely rare and there has never been a need for it here.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> The only similarity between mRNA shot and a vaccine is the way being injected into a body.
> 
> I would tell you to search for what non American pharma says about it, but you would ignore it, so here is the screenshot.
> 
> View attachment 569040


It's not gene therapy because there is no change to the human genome.

And Bayer missed the boat on the vaccine so now they are trying to discredit their competitors who beat them in the race for a vaccine.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> It was the delivery system not the mRNA portion of the vaccine that was the problem.
> 
> And I'm fine with the method of the trials.  The FDA is notorious for taking way too long to approve a drug.


I'm not .  They have ties to the dang Pharma and the CDC.  They make money off their decisions for Companies.  4 months IS NOT ENOUGH.

And in the report from Japan it showed that the protein didn't stay in the injection site.  Ended up in other organs.  

That is BS.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I'm not .  They have ties to the dang Pharma and the CDC.  They make money off their decisions for Companies.  4 months IS NOT ENOUGH.
> 
> And in the report from Japan it showed that the protein didn't stay in the injection site.  Ended up in other organs.
> 
> That is BS.







__





						mRNA vaccines — a new era in vaccinology
					





					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				



Over the past decade, major technological innovation and research investment have enabled mRNA to become a promising therapeutic tool in the fields of vaccine development and protein replacement therapy. The use of mRNA has several beneficial features over subunit, killed and live attenuated virus, as well as DNA-based vaccines. First, safety: as mRNA is a non-infectious, non-integrating platform, there is no potential risk of infection or insertional mutagenesis. Additionally, mRNA is degraded by normal cellular processes, and its _in vivo_ half-life can be regulated through the use of various modifications and delivery methods9–12. The inherent immunogenicity of the mRNA can be down-modulated to further increase the safety profile9,12,13. Second, efficacy: various modifications make mRNA more stable and highly translatable9,12,13. Efficient _in vivo_ delivery can be achieved by formulating mRNA into carrier molecules, allowing rapid uptake and expression in the cytoplasm (reviewed in REFS 10,11). mRNA is the minimal genetic vector; therefore, anti-vector immunity is avoided, and mRNA vaccines can be administered repeatedly. Third, production: mRNA vaccines have the potential for rapid, inexpensive and scalable manufacturing, mainly owing to the high yields of _in vitro_ transcription reactions.

The mRNA vaccine field is developing extremely rapidly; a large body of preclinical data has accumulated over the past several years, and multiple human clinical trials have been initiated. In this Review, we discuss current mRNA vaccine approaches, summarize the latest findings, highlight challenges and recent successes, and offer perspectives on the future of mRNA vaccines. The data suggest that mRNA vaccines have the potential to solve many of the challenges in vaccine development for both infectious diseases and cancer.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The mRNA Ebola vaccine was given to people but Ebola is extremely rare and there has never been a need for it here.











						The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
					

A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.




					publichealth.jhu.edu
				




*THERE’S A BIG GAP BETWEEN WHEN THE FIRST MRNA FLU VACCINE WAS TESTED IN MICE IN THE 1990S AND WHEN THE FIRST MRNA VACCINES FOR RABIES WERE TESTED IN HUMANS IN 2013. WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN THE INTERIM?

SO, WHAT HAPPENED ONCE THEY FIGURED OUT THIS TECHNOLOGY?*

The first mRNA vaccines using these fatty envelopes were developed against the deadly *Ebola virus,* but since that virus is only found in a limited number of African countries, it had no commercial development in the U.S.


Again  SHOW ME THE HUMAN TRIALS BEFORE THIS


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Doesn't show the long history of HUMAN TESTING NOW DOES IT?

Show me the VAST HUMAN TRIALS OF mRNA VACCINES


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Doesn't show the long history of HUMAN TESTING NOW DOES IT?
> 
> Show me the VAST HUMAN TRIALS OF mRNA VACCINES


We just had a world wide one.  Now the vaccine is fully approved by the FDA

Just like any other vaccine.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Science marches on without you

*The use of mRNA has several beneficial features over subunit, killed and live attenuated virus, as well as DNA-based vaccines.* First, safety: as mRNA is a non-infectious, non-integrating platform, there is no potential risk of infection or insertional mutagenesis. Additionally, mRNA is degraded by normal cellular processes, and its _in vivo_ half-life can be regulated through the use of various modifications and delivery methods9–12


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> We just had a world wide one.  Now the vaccine is fully approved by the FDA
> 
> Just like any other vaccine.


Thanks for PROVING MY POINT.

I'm surprised you actually admitted it.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Thanks for PROVING MY POINT.
> 
> I'm surprised you actually admitted it.


Every vaccine had a large trial BEFORE it was approved for emergency use.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Science marches on without you
> 
> *The use of mRNA has several beneficial features over subunit, killed and live attenuated virus, as well as DNA-based vaccines.* First, safety: as mRNA is a non-infectious, non-integrating platform, there is no potential risk of infection or insertional mutagenesis. Additionally, mRNA is degraded by normal cellular processes, and its _in vivo_ half-life can be regulated through the use of various modifications and delivery methods9–12


And now you brag on I'm gonna play with your DNA vaccines.  lmao

Yes they are out there.  They got away with this shit why not continue.  lmao


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Every vaccine had a large trial BEFORE it was approved for emergency use.


You ARE THE TRIAL


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And now you brag on I'm gonna play with your DNA vaccines.  lmao
> 
> Yes they are out there.  They got away with this shit why not continue.  lmao


You can be afraid of progress if you want.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> We just had a world wide one.  Now the vaccine is fully approved by the FDA
> 
> Just like any other vaccine.



  Which, of course, is bullshit.

  Under normal procedures, it takes years, for any new drug to gain full FDA approval.

  It's only been about a year, at most, that they've been pushing this mRNA shit.  There's no way that it could have been adequately tested in such a short time, to the degree that is normally required for FDA approval.

  No matter what games the bureaucraps play, these are still very much experimental drugs, and we have no way of knowing what adverse long-term effects they might cause.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> You ARE THE TRIAL


Nope the trial was concluded before I got my shots


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> You can be afraid of progress if you want.



  Josef Mengele probably said something very similar, defending almost exactly the same crimes he was committing, as what you are now defending.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> You can be afraid of progress if you want.


Not afraid.  Just gonna watch your silly ass for a few years to see if it kills ya.

ENJOY.  Largest Human experiment in HISTORY.  Go for it.  Take more jabs.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Which, of course, is bullshit.
> 
> Under normal procedures, it takes years, for any new drug to gain full FDA approval.
> 
> ...











						Trends in FDA drug approvals over last 2 decades: An observational study
					

The discovery of novel drugs is critical for pharmaceutical research and development as well as for patient treatment. Repurposing existing drugs that may have anticipated effects as potential candidate is one way to meet this important goal. Systematic ...




					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




The FDA has been expediting approvals for several drug categories

 Expedited approval of anticancer and biologics is seen as recent trend in drug development. 

Vaccines are biologics.

Seems like the FDA knows something you don't.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 27, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Josef Mengele probably said something very similar, defending almost exactly the same crimes he was committing, as what you are now defending.


Here we go again with the ignorant claims of Nazism.  If you had any real idea of the actual horrors committed by the Nazis you would not be comparing anything they did to the approval of a vaccine.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Lets put your statement to a test.
> 
> Left claim is that more intelligent people support democrats


I stopped reading the sandbox tangent there. 

3 out of 4 unvaccinated are Republicans, thats the statistics.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Every vaccine had a large trial BEFORE it was approved for emergency use.


Trials did not include the immature immune systems of children.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Nope the trial was concluded before I got my shots


How many children were in the trial?  Where is the link showing children included in the trial?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> I stopped reading the sandbox tangent there.
> 
> 3 out of 4 unvaccinated are Republicans, thats the statistics.


Great, isn't it. All you have to do is sit and wait for your Marxist utopia to become reality.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

badger2 said:


> Trials did not include the immature immune systems of children.


Correct.

What we had was beginning of the trials.

Normally, there would be three stages, before anything gets approved.

However, what we get is this...

Nobody dies in first month... those are very promising results.
In the second month, nobody dies... and those with side effects were removed from trials and their data eliminated, while claiming 95-99% efficacy rate....
In third month, the only immunity provided was to pharmaceutical companies from suing them for damages caused by their "vaccines".

Year later, covid "vaccines" are so safe and effective that they still require EUA to protect them from class action lawsuits.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> Here is page 14 of the pdf which is page 4 of the report.  Lay it on me.
> 
> View attachment 568990



Pg 14-16 show the pharmacokinetics of the mRNA shots--all the places it went that you wouldn't want it to go. Brain, eyes, heart, kidney. How long it stays there and in what quantities.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Pg 14-16 show the pharmacokinetics of the mRNA shots--all the places it went that you wouldn't want it to go. Brain, eyes, heart, kidney. How long it stays there and in what quantities.


How can you tell that from the numbers on the pages?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Nope the trial was concluded before I got my shots



They also destroyed the control group. Sound normal to you?


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> How can you tell that from the numbers on the pages?



Can you read what's on the page, or do you just want to play Stupid Internet Games? 

Mr Open Minded?


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Here we go again with the ignorant claims of Nazism.  If you had any real idea of the actual horrors committed by the Nazis you would not be comparing anything they did to the approval of a vaccine.



  One of the crimes for which the Nazis (and also the Japs) were infamous was the use of nonconsenting human subjects for medical experiments.  We put war criminals to death for this crime.

  Those who have any willing part in the use of any force or coercing to compel human test subjects today to take this dangerous experimental mRNA shit are guilty of exactly the same crime, and deserve exactly the same treatment.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Can you read what's on the page, or do you just want to play Stupid Internet Games?
> 
> Mr Open Minded?


I can read what's on the page.  What I don't know is how to make the determination you made.  Can you explain it or not?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Great, isn't it. All you have to do is sit and wait for your Marxist utopia to become reality.


What the f? That's not a sane reply.

Not sure what's wrong with you.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> I can read what's on the page.  What I don't know is how to make the determination you made.  Can you explain it or not?



If you cannot understand "PHARMACOKINETICS AFTER A SINGLE DOSE" printed on page 14 and the charts that follow, especially on pg 16, where it says "Mean total lipid concentration"....that explains a lot, really.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> What the f? That's not a sane reply.
> 
> Not sure what's wrong with you.


Not sane? You mean like statistics you pulled out of your ass?


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> If you cannot understand "PHARMACOKINETICS AFTER A SINGLE DOSE" printed on page 14 and the charts that follow, especially on pg 16, where it says "Mean total lipid concentration"....that explains a lot, really.


What is the normal range for lipid concentration?


----------



## debbiedowner (Nov 27, 2021)

Turtlesoup said:


> There also hasn't been a single 'vaccine' that only last months if it works.   Nor has there been a single vaccine released on the public that wasn't fully tested before doing so.


Guess the flu shot doesn't work then it is only 40-50% effective and lasts 6 months.  How long does the flu shot last? When to get it and more.


Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> All real vaccines are 100% effective, meaning they impart T-cell long term memory in the immune system as to how to identify and attack a pathogen.
> 
> The problem with these mRNA injections is they contain nothing for the immune system to memorize or later trigger on.
> ...


Then I guess we don't have any real vaccines.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Not sane? You mean like statistics you pulled out of your ass?


Pulled out of my ass? How do you know that exactly?

Did you ask me? Did you look them up yourself? Nope.

So are you just lashing out because you don't happen to like them?















						KFF COVID-19 Vaccine Monitor: The Increasing Importance of Partisanship in Predicting COVID-19 Vaccination Status
					

This analysis shows that as COVID-19 vaccination rates have increased over time, Republicans make up an increasingly disproportionate share of those who remain unvaccinated and that political parti…




					www.kff.org


----------



## debbiedowner (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> So effective you are going to need to take them every 6 months for the variants coming.  You call that SUCCESS.......LMAO


Flu shot is only good for 6 months.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> What is the normal range for lipid concentration?



Why would you want ANY amount of an experimental drug in your pancreas, OVARIES, brain (!), spleen, prostate, and etc? This again was supposed to stay confined to the arm muscle and it's everywhere. The newest explanation is "oh hey well, there's MORE of it in the arm muscle."

Your argument seems to be that since I'm not the scientist who carried out the studies or a scientist in a similar field, my points are invalid. This is like saying if you're not a physicist you can't understand why plowing a car into a tree at 60 MPH is a really, really bad idea.

IOW, it's Stupid Internet Arguing.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

debbiedowner said:


> Flu shot is only good for 6 months.



One shot, six months. Not two shots. Or three.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

debbiedowner said:


> Guess the flu shot doesn't work then it is only 40-50% effective and lasts 6 months.  How long does the flu shot last? When to get it and more.
> 
> Then I guess we don't have any real vaccines.



The flu shot, frankly, sucks. I now know TWO families, including my own, who had one member vaccinated who was later the ONLY one who got the flu, according to official dx at the dr. And none of the unvaxxed family members living in the same home did.

The flu vaccine used to be the worst of the vaccines. Well. Not anymore.


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Why would you want ANY amount of an experimental drug in your pancreas, OVARIES, brain (!), spleen, prostate, and etc? This again was supposed to stay confined to the arm muscle and it's everywhere. The newest explanation is "oh hey well, there's MORE of it in the arm muscle."
> 
> Your argument seems to be that since I'm not the scientist who carried out the studies or a scientist in a similar field, my points are invalid. This is like saying if you're not a physicist you can't understand why plowing a car into a tree at 60 MPH is a really, really bad idea.
> 
> IOW, it's Stupid Internet Arguing.


Again... what is the normal range for lipids and how do those readings compare to that?  Because that is the basis of your argument.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 27, 2021)

ding said:


> Again... what is the normal range for lipids and how do those readings compare to that?  Because that is the basis of your argument.



Dude

They are not measuring cholesterol here. WOW


----------



## ding (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Dude
> 
> They are not measuring cholesterol here. WOW


You are the one who used lipids from page 16 in post #564 as your justification to not get vaccinated, dear.  Not me.  Clearly you don't understand anything you are talking about.  You aren't worried about your health.  You are worried about your politics and you are a poor example of a steward.


----------



## krichton (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.



Yes, and guess who they're all getting it from, the unvaccinated.  Two vaccinated individuals are 200x less likely to spread covid between themselves compared to the unvaccinated, according to a new study of NSW.  The numbers don't lie.  Keep drinking that koolaid.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Pulled out of my ass? How do you know that exactly?
> 
> Did you ask me? Did you look them up yourself? Nope.
> 
> ...



OK, lets give you benefit of the doubt. 

Can you just explain the sample they based it on, and also, how more people were unvaccinated in October then in September.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

debbiedowner said:


> Flu shot is only good for 6 months.


So.  Now this goes on forever.  hmmm..

Yippie.  You gonna cheer.  Fucked up the economy.  For WHAT EXACTLY.  NOTHING.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> OK, lets give you benefit of the doubt.
> 
> Can you just explain the sample they based it on, and also, how more people were unvaccinated in October then in September.


Much apreciated, but get the fuck out of here. I'm not your little fetch doggy.

What I've said, I've supported. You support nothing.

Don't like data? Then go ahead and try to refute it. If you can find data ANYWHERE that shows Republicans are not the primary anti-vax contigent you come on right back and show us that evidence.


----------



## Oddball (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Much apreciated, but get the fuck out of here. I'm not your little fetch doggy.
> 
> What I've said, I've supported. You support nothing.
> 
> Don't like data? Then go ahead and try to refute it. If you can find data ANYWHERE that shows Republicans are not the primary anti-vax contigent you come on right back and show us that evidence.


You have no "evidence" that isn't tainted and cooked by technocratic authoritarian political hacks.

You GTFO, hack.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Oddball said:


> You have no "evidence" that isn't tainted and cooked by technocratic authoritarian political hacks.
> 
> You GTFO, hack.


No you go fuck yourself nutbag.

You don't like the data, so you reject the data, even though it is consistanly shown by *ALL *polling.

Republicans are vaccinated at singnificantly lower rates. Thats a fact and it's too bad you can't sanely deal with it.


----------



## Natural Citizen (Nov 27, 2021)

sparky said:


> FDA Asks Federal Judge to Grant it Until the Year 2076 to Fully Release Pfizer’s COVID-19 Vaccine Data
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Heh heh. I was gonna share that, but saw that you already did.

It's almost as humorous as it is disturbing that your post  just got skipped right over like it was irrelevant, isn't it?

Gosh. So much for 'the science' huh?


----------



## ClaireH (Nov 27, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


It would take an alien invasion to unite Earthlings. That old adage that enemies unite when faced with a stronger adversity comes into play frequently, with daily use of divide and conquer tactics. If and when humankind faces a true threat of extinction, it will be too late to unite or basically futile to suddenly try. If there ever is another evolved life form that decides to visit, they will be disappointed with their findings of billions of advanced primates led by other advanced primates who lack ethical decision making skills.


----------



## sparky (Nov 27, 2021)

~S~


----------



## Natural Citizen (Nov 27, 2021)

Anyway. Nobody ever asks if one has immunity. Which is the correct question. That's the actual science based query. But they're not interested in that. That's not what this is about. It never has been.

They always seem to prefer to control the terms of controvertsy by simply asking if one is 'vaccinated.' Which really only equates to asking people if they have consumed the products that the government has provided these special interest companies a captive market for.

But fascists gonna be fascists. So long as the mandates continue to go unchallenged, and so long as governments continue to provide a captive market for them through mandates, the pharmaceutical companies will continue to lobby government for more of them.

Really, what we're experiencing here is a live exercise to acquire the power they never had, power they have always wanted very badly, which is to mandate all of your medical decisions.  They can't do it alone. Government and these special interest industries have to work in synergy. That's what fascism_ is_.

In the past, people incorrectly referenced Obamacare as socialist. This was never the case. It was always fascist.


----------



## sparky (Nov 27, 2021)

Natural Citizen said:


> Gosh. So much for 'the science' huh?


yeah Natural one

seems to be all the anti-vax crowd needs......

~S~


----------



## ClaireH (Nov 27, 2021)

Votto said:


> First of all, it is NOT a vaccine, it is a treatment.  It does not prevent you from getting the virus, it simply tries to minimize the damage once you do get the virus.  The reason they call it a vaccine is because other vaccines that prevent an illness are already mandated, so they muddy the waters to make it appear as if all is status quo with the jab.
> 
> Secondly, the mandate is NOT across the board.  You don't see illegals pouring across the border by the millions being made to get the jab, and you don't see those on welfare being made to get the jab, all of which on average are not vaccinated.  This is because they are the base of the democrat party and they are distrustful of the government even though they suck off it's teat to survive.
> 
> And lastly, is it Constitutional?  I put this last because the Constitution always gets put last.  Currently the mandates are being slapped down by the courts because they don't seem to be Constitutional, or do you even care?  Does it even matter anymore?


These are the precise facts that escape the minds of the pro-fake-vaccine crowd. This pro-fake-vaccine crowd includes unscrupulous investors who went “all in” on one of the 3 amateur vaccine creators. Other deviants in the mix are ego-driven
scientists (excluding all ethical research scientists) who are hanging on to promoting the “need” for more vaccines. Those jabs out in US public circulation are not effective because they only target a section of Spike when they should’ve targeted T cells all along, known as an effective clean up crew for most. They know that now. That’s the reason for the need to repeat and rinse, over and over, at best giving a person a couple of months of increased antibodies, but not always a  given. The risks are not worth it for many. There are only a few specific groups that should even consider these jab risks to hope for at best 4-5 months of antibody activity. No thanks I have a healthy immune system like most people, and not in a high risk group.


----------



## Natural Citizen (Nov 27, 2021)

sparky said:


> yeah Natural one
> 
> seems to be all the anti-vax crowd needs......
> 
> ~S~


The anti freedom of choice / pro-force quislings certainly have it out for the naturally immune pure bloods. At this point I think many of them are just really upset that not everyone is as foolish as they were and that a lot of the vitriol toward natural immunity and those who prefer it comes as a reaction to the realization that they did all of this to themselves.

In other words, some are perfectly content to stand on their hands in three feet of sht, so long as they aren't doing so by themselves. They're not mad because they're standing on their hands in three feet of sht, per se.

I'm really hoping that Baal Gates and company have rigged these potions up in such a way that they can't reproduce.

The fact that these companies who have directly benefitted ( I think it's been calculated to $1,000 per second) as a consequence of governments providing them a captive market through mandates are lobbying federal courts for the actual science to be suppressed until after this current generation is all dead is very revealing.  It should be anyway. To the thinking person.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

Correll said:


> I...just am not going to invest teh time to read up on the issue enough to discuss it. Sorry. I know that much be frustrating for you.


Frustrating? Not at all.  

Whether or not you have time to acknowledge the study that came from the Salk Institute which showed for the first time that the spike-protein on its own causes damage to the body doesn't change the fact that the spike-protein on its own causes damage to the body.  And it doesn't change the fact that the experimental injection contains those spike-proteins.


----------



## Man of Ethics (Nov 27, 2021)

I am vaccinated and pro-vaccine 100%.  Human Life is precious.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> VAERS, european reporting etc.


VAERS is a freaking joke. There is no statistical value in purely anecdotal BS contained on that website.  "I got the vaccine and was in a car crash with a tractor trailer that killed my mother" is an example of some of the BS found there.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

ClaireH said:


> These are the precise facts that escape the minds of the pro-fake-vaccine crowd. This pro-fake-vaccine crowd includes unscrupulous investors who went “all in” on one of the 3 amateur vaccine creators. Other deviants in the mix are ego-driven
> scientists (excluding all ethical research scientists) who are hanging on to promoting the “need” for more vaccines. Those jabs out in US public circulation are not effective because they only target a section of Spike when they should’ve targeted T cells all along, known as an effective clean up crew for most. They know that now. That’s the reason for the need to repeat and rinse, over and over, at best giving a person a couple of months of increased antibodies, but not always a  given. The risks are not worth it for many. There are only a few specific groups that should even consider these jab risks to hope for at best 4-5 months of antibody activity. No thanks I have a healthy immune system like most people, and not in a high risk group.


What did spike do to be targeted?  You post is based on BS, plain and simple.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 27, 2021)

Briss said:


> Frustrating? Not at all.
> 
> Whether or not you have time to acknowledge the study that came from the Salk Institute which showed for the first time that the spike-protein on its own causes damage to the body doesn't change the fact that the spike-protein on its own causes damage to the body.  And it doesn't change the fact that the experimental injection contains those spike-proteins.


But another coronavirus from pigs links influenza and polio. PHEV’s spike protein is identical to yak coronavirus spike protein. Can someone from Salk Institute please explain this for us: why does the pig virus, PHEV cause encephalomyelitis as in polio? Why did these Canadians first think that PHEV was pig polio in 1962?


----------



## badger2 (Nov 27, 2021)

Poliovirus also has a spike. It’s 17 Angstroms in height from the viral surface. The above should read: ‘PHEV’s spike protein is identical to yak coronavirus spike protein in some places.’


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> So if you DO NOT get vaccinated, you might get covid, and maybe myocarditis from it. But if you get vaccinated, you might get myocarditis from the vaccine, and then you will probably ALSO get covid...and get myocarditis from that.
> 
> Gosh. Which one do I choose?
> 
> Ever heard "the cure cannot be worse than the disease"?


Myocarditis is relatively easy to treat.  Also no one has died of myocarditis as a result of the vaccines.  You are reacting to Fear Porn!


----------



## ClaireH (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> What did spike do to be targeted?  You post is based on BS, plain and simple.


It appears you’re behind the curve.









						T Cell Responses to Viral Infections – Opportunities for Peptide Vaccination
					

An effective immune response against viral infections depends on the activation of cytotoxic T cells that can clear infection by killing virus-infected cells. Proper activation of these T cells depends on professional antigen-presenting cells, such as ...




					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				












						T-cell-inducing vaccines – what's the future
					

In the twentieth century vaccine development has moved from the use of attenuated or killed micro-organisms to protein sub-unit vaccines, with vaccine immunogenicity assessed by measuring antibodies induced by vaccination. However, for many infectious ...




					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				












						Viral targets for vaccines against COVID-19 - Nature Reviews Immunology
					

As the world races to develop vaccines against SARS-CoV-2, Dai and Gao highlight which viral targets are best to include in a vaccine and how this impacts the induced immune response and, ultimately, the safety and efficacy of a vaccine.




					www.nature.com


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Did you notice he doesn't have a clue about cycles and pcr tests.?


,,,and you do?  Where did you go to medical school and how long have you specialized in communicable diseases?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

ClaireH said:


> It appears you’re behind the curve.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No offense, but you have no idea what those links tell you.  You see what you want to see.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> ,,,and you do?  Where did you go to medical school and how long have you specialized in communicable diseases?


It's called reading studies.  Talking to people who are in the know.

How many cycles was normal before this BS started?  And then how many were used during it?


----------



## ClaireH (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> No offense, but you have no idea what those links tell you.  You see what you want to see.


You’ve absolutely proven you’re just a blowhard without substance. Just now scrolling this particular thread you attempted to slam other posters but you only succeed in looking a bit desperate. Good military personnel have an honorable way of presenting themselves. You fall short by about 5’.

I gave you three medical journal links supporting my post to recent studies and you did not read one of them. I have no further interest to post to you. I like to choose how my time is spent without wasting it.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Where are the stats for deaths due to the vaccine?


None exist!  The Fear Porn campaign in social media and by the anti-vaxxers on this forum is the only place it exists.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

badger2 said:


> But another coronavirus from pigs links influenza and polio. PHEV’s spike protein is identical to yak coronavirus spike protein. Can someone from Salk Institute please explain this for us: why does the pig virus, PHEV cause encephalomyelitis as in polio? Why did these Canadians first think that PHEV was pig polio in 1962?


The pandemic was predicated on the number of cases; the number of cases was predicated on the results of the PCR-test; the PCR-test did not include clinical observation; the PCR-test does not distinguish between Covid and influenza or other pathogens; the PCR-test does not tell you whether a virus is dead or alive.  Thus, the PCR-test was the worst choice among the available alternatives.

From the CDC:

_“Detection of viral RNA may not indicate the presence of infectious virus or that 2019-nCoV is the causative agent for clinical symptoms. The performance of this test has not been established for monitoring treatment of 2019-nCoV infection. This test cannot rule out diseases caused by other bacterial or viral pathogens.”_ — *The Centers For Disease Control and Prevention.*

_“…you can find almost anything in anybody…it doesn’t tell you that you’re sick and it doesn’t tell you the thing you ended up with really was going to hurt you…_” — *Dr. Kary Mullis, PhD (Nobel Peace Prize Winner inventor of the PCR test)*.

Perhaps that would explain why this test was not approved for the purpose assigned to it (Covid detection),  and had to be given Emergency Use Authorization.  What it does not explain is why the highest medical authorities in the land said nothing when an unapproved test that does not distinquish between Covid and Influenza or other pathogens was used to determine the nature of the spread when there were many approved alternative tests that actually work. 

Also from the CDC: 

Audience: Individuals Performing COVID-19 Testing

Level: Laboratory Alert

_After December 31, 2021, CDC will withdraw the request to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for Emergency Use Authorization (EUA) of the CDC 2019-Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) Real-Time RT-PCR Diagnostic Panel, the assay first introduced in February 2020 for detection of SARS-CoV-2 only. CDC is providing this advance notice for clinical laboratories to have adequate time to select and implement one of the many FDA-authorized alternatives._

So, not only did the CDC allow for the WRONG test to be used, they were also aware of the existence of many APPROVED alternatives.  I am showing you that those in authority watched quietly as labs around the world used the PCR-test despite being fully aware of its misapplication.   To add insult to injury, they also said nothing when labs used a cycle threshold of 40+, despite every medical authority (including the CDC and Mr. Fauci himself) clearly stating that a cycle threshold of anything over 35 will produce meaningless results.

From Fauci:

_“…If you get [perform the PCR test at] a cycle threshold of 35 or more…the chances of it being replication-confident [aka accurate] are miniscule…you almost never can culture virus [detect a true positive result] from a 37 threshold cycle…even 36…_”

Can it be that some people actually believe that that was the last time these organization heads and tony would try to deceive them?  Or is it more a case of not ready to acknowledge that first deception?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> None exist!  The Fear Porn campaign in social media and by the anti-vaxxers on this forum is the only place it exists.


Really.  It's all BS.  Tell that to the guy who knew one that died from it.  An elderly lady.  Got the vaccine and her arm was swollen.  They said she should go to the hospital.  She said if it's still bad that night she'd go to the doctor in the morning.  She died that night.

VAERs is hardly known by the public.  Most of the entries are by DOCTORS.  Most of the information and listings.......you have to google to understand them.  But you disregard it all.........why?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> It's called reading studies.  Talking to people who are in the know.
> 
> How many cycles was normal before this BS started?  And then how many were used during it?


I have about 10 doctors, from cardiologists , endocrinologists, gastroenterologist, hematologists, surgeons and oncologists, that would tell you that you are full of shit!


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Briss said:


> From Fauci:
> 
> _“…If you get [perform the PCR test at] a cycle threshold of 35 or more…the chances of it being replication-confident [aka accurate] are miniscule…you almost never can culture virus [detect a true positive result] from a 37 threshold cycle…even 36…_”
> 
> Can it be that some people actually believe that that was the last time these organization heads and tony would try to deceive us?


It's was 32 cycles before this BS.  That was when Fa Chi said it for 35.  Yet he SAID NOTHING for over a year nor changed CDC policy to stop 40 cycle tests.

And he does this for a living.  pffft.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> I have about 10 doctors, from cardiologists , endocrinologists, gastroenterologist, hematologists, surgeons and oncologists, that would tell you that you are full of shit!


BS.  Ask them.  The last post was Fauci saying anything over 35 cycles is BS.  

Go ASK THEM.  Then tell me why they did the test too damned high for over a year.  The 32 was from a Doctor that testified in Mississippi.

Tell them to tell him he is full of shit.

Your blasting everyone in here.  Go do your dang homework first.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Really.  It's all BS.  Tell that to the guy who knew one that died from it.  An elderly lady.  Got the vaccine and her arm was swollen.  They said she should go to the hospital.  She said if it's still bad that night she'd go to the doctor in the morning.  She died that night.
> 
> VAERs is hardly known by the public.  Most of the entries are by DOCTORS.  Most of the information and listings.......you have to google to understand them.  But you disregard it all.........why?


More BS you got from social media is more likely. I just read a study on myocarditis that said that almost every person who developed the infection was a male in their late teens or early twenties and that none, zero, nada died from it.  Yet, everyone of you anti-vaxxers has digested the Fear Porn that the vaccine will kill you.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> More BS you got from social media is more likely. I just read a study on myocarditis that said that almost every person who developed the infection was a male in their late teens or early twenties and that none, zero, nada died from it.  Yet, everyone of you anti-vaxxers has digested the Fear Porn that the vaccine will kill you.


You acting all big and bad doesn't mean a thing to me.  I've read more on this than I ever cared to read.

I don't give a shit if you agree with me or not.  I'll keep posting my findings.  You don't like it.  I really don't care.

The cycles are BS and they allowed too many cycles for over a year.  Florida called them on it and issued a executive order over it to record at what cycle they found the positive.  Desantis called them out on it and HIS TEAM OF MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS.

It created many false positives in the first year.  These are Facts.  I don't care if you like them.

Guy at work knew the person who died.  So.........let me see........believe you because you have a bitching attitude or him..........YOU LOSE.


----------



## Briss (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> It's was 32 cycles before this BS.  That was when Fa Chi said it for 35.  Yet he SAID NOTHING for over a year nor changed CDC policy to stop 40 cycle tests.
> 
> And he does this for a living.  pffft.





eagle1462010 said:


> It's was 32 cycles before this BS.  That was when Fa Chi said it for 35.  Yet he SAID NOTHING for over a year nor changed CDC policy to stop 40 cycle tests.
> 
> And he does this for a living.  pffft.


It's kind of saddening to find that lots of people here believe that they need a degree in order to understand what "set too high" means.  I guess it was the lifelong, seamless transition from one authority figure to the next that conditioned them to bow down to even insanity IF it comes from the approved mouth.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

__





						You are being redirected...
					





					stateofthenation.co
				




All of which is background for an intriguing decision made by Florida’s Department of Health (and signed off on by Florida’s Republican Governor Ron deSantis).

For the first time in the history of the pandemic, a state will _*require that all labs in the state report the critical “cycle threshold” level of every COVID-19 test they perform*_.



> *All positive, negative and indeterminate COVID-19 laboratory results must be reported to FDOH* via electronic laboratory reporting or by fax immediately. This includes all COVID-19 test types – polymerase chain reaction (PCR), other RNA, antigen and antibody results.
> *Cycle threshold (CT) values and their reference ranges, as applicable, must be reported by laboratories to FDOH via electronic laboratory reporting or by fax immediately.*




Read the articles saying it's BS Admiral.  All of them are BS too.  Whole state and their EXPERT medical personnel need to call you and you tell them how to do their job.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Briss said:


> It's kind of saddening to find that lots of people here believe that they need a degree in order to understand what "set too high" means.  I guess it was the lifelong, seamless transition from one authority figure to the next that conditioned them to bow down to even insanity IF it comes from the approved mouth.


FA Chi allowed this crap to go on for over a year.  He knew what he was doing.  He does this for a living.  They wanted higher case counts.  Spread the fear.  How many people were sent home from work with false positives?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> BS.  Ask them.  The last post was Fauci saying anything over 35 cycles is BS.
> 
> Go ASK THEM.  Then tell me why they did the test too damned high for over a year.  The 32 was from a Doctor that testified in Mississippi.
> 
> ...


You don't even understand the fucking homework, you dumbass.  My doctors told me to get vaccinated as soon as it was available, and I have to get a booster in the next few weeks because they told me to wait three months after I had COVID.  You assholes would argue with a brick wall you are so ignorantly, but apparently your over-inflated ego won't let you.

They were in 100% agreement on my taking the vaccine and they all work at the largest teaching hospital in my state. at the largest university in the state.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



OK. asswipe.  My information comes from real doctors that I sit in the examination room with.  You have reports you do not possibly understand.

What is your education level?  High school dropout, GED holder?  What is it? BA degree in basket weaving?

I have a daughter that has degree that would allow her to decipher those reports for you and I guarantee her assessment would be different that your amateur opinions based on reports you could not  even begin to understand.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> You don't even understand the fucking homework, you dumbass.  My doctors told me to get vaccinated as soon as it was available, and I have to get a booster in the next few weeks because they told me to wait three months after I had COVID.  You assholes would argue with a brick wall you are so ignorantly, but apparently your over-inflated ego won't let you.
> 
> They were in 100% agreement on my taking the vaccine and they all work at the largest teaching hospital in my state. at the largest university in the state.


And where have I told you to do anything.  If that is your choice and their advice then do it.  Our main beef earlier was on pcr tests.  YOU WERE WRONG.

On the vaccine.  That is your choice.  And it is mine as well.  I consider it an experimental vaccine and will not use it.  

Tell me.  Did they offer you a traditional vaccine with a whole virus antigen?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> OK. asswipe.  My information comes from real doctors that I sit in the examination room with.  You have reports you do not possibly understand.


LOL

Florida doesn't have real doctors then on pcr tests.  lmao

Even Fauci admitted it.  Guess that information just goes right by you.  YOU ARE WRONG on PCR tests.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> One is fake and the other is not.  One gives very limited memory the other gives longer memory.  T Cell memory.  One is TRADITIONAl and one is EXPERIMENTAL.
> 
> Covaxin from India is the ONLY TRADITIONAL VACCINE OUT THERE.  It is a vector based vaccine.
> 
> So.  tell me about how the mRNA vaccine is supposed to stay in the injection site.  And is it good if it travels through the body????????????????



Another example of your ignorance?  Vaccines don't work in just your left arm or right arm.  Judging by your level of knowledge, you would prefer the shot between the cheeks of your ass.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Another example of your ignorance?  Vaccines don't work in just your left arm or right arm.  Judging by your level of knowledge, you would prefer the shot between the cheeks of your ass.


Again.  I don't give a shit about your twisted fantasies.

YOU ARE WRONG ON PCR TESTS.  PERIOD.    I've read and looked at EXPERTS SAYING THIS.  Even the freaking asshole Fauci admitted it.  They were too high in cycles for over a year and did NOTHING ABOUT IT.

Who has the vaccine that is a whole virus antigen?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> And where have I told you to do anything.  If that is your choice and their advice then do it.  Our main beef earlier was on pcr tests.  YOU WERE WRONG.
> 
> On the vaccine.  That is your choice.  And it is mine as well.*  I consider it an experimental vaccine* and will not use it.
> 
> Tell me.  Did they offer you a traditional vaccine with a whole virus antigen?


I don't give a shit what you consider it.  All you have displayed is an unbelievable level of ignorance on this topic.

What vaccine is a whole virus antigen?  None, is the correct answer, dumbass!


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I'm not .  They have ties to the dang Pharma and the CDC.  They make money off their decisions for Companies.  4 months IS NOT ENOUGH.
> 
> And in the report from Japan it showed that the protein didn't stay in the injection site.  Ended up in other organs.
> 
> That is BS.


Why would it stay in the injection site?  Are you worried that your arm will develop COVID?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> I don't give a shit what you consider it.  All you have displayed is an unbelievable level of ignorance on this topic.
> 
> What vaccine is a whole virus antigen?  None, is the correct answer, dumbass!











						The Trouble With PCR Tests
					

Already in mid-March, SPR explained that the highly sensitive PCR tests are prone to producing false-positive results and their predictive value may easily drop below 50%.




					swprs.org
				




This means that if a person gets a “positive” PCR test result at a cycle threshold of 35 or higher (as applied in most US labs and many European labs), the chance that the person is infectious is* less than 3%*. The chance that the person received a “false positive” result is 97% or higher.





__





						Covaxin COVID-19 Vaccine
					

Covaxin (BBV152) (iNCOVACC, BBV154) is an inactivated COVID-19 vaccine produced by Bharat Biotech located in Pune, India.




					www.precisionvaccinations.com
				




Covaxin COVID-19 Vaccine (BBV152) Description​Bharat Biotech's Covaxin (BBV152) is an inactivated COVID-19 vaccine that uses adjuvant Alhydroxiquim-II to boost immune response longer-lasting immunity. The Indian Council of Medical Research created the Covaxin (BBV152) vaccine. 

COVAXIN (BBV152) contains six µg of *whole-virion inactivated** SARS-CoV-2 antigen (*Strain: NIV-2020-770), and the other inactive ingredients such as aluminum hydroxide gel (250 µg), TLR 7/8 agonist (imidazoquinolinone) 15 µg, 2-phenoxyethanol 2.5 mg, and phosphate ® buffer saline up to 0.5 ml. The components of the Covaxin vaccine include BBV152A, BBV152B, and BBV152C. The virus strain is soaked in beta-propiolactone, an organic compound that deactivates them by binding to their genes, says the Company. The SARS-CoV-2 betacoronavirus strain was isolated from an asymptomatic COVID-19 patient at India's National Institute of Virology. 


Only one in the world and it is from India.  vector based whole inactivated SARS-Cov-2 antigen

But of course traditional vaccines aren't offered here.  Nor the treatments they use there.

YOU ARE WRONG AGAIN ADMIRAL.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Josef Mengele probably said something very similar, defending almost exactly the same crimes he was committing, as what you are now defending.



Hey Bob, why don't you STFU and stop embarrassing yourself?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Why would it stay in the injection site?  Are you worried that your arm will develop COVID?


Jesus.  Are you an idiot.  Yes.  It's job is to teach the body the spike protein.  Not travel through the blood stream into the body.  That is what causes the adverse effects.  That is a problem and Japan called them on that as well.

It is supposed to stay in the arm.  Train and that's it.  It doesn't matter which arm.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Clinical Considerations: Myocarditis after mRNA COVID-19 Vaccines | CDC
					

Clinical considerations for myocarditis and pericarditis after receipt of mRNA COVID-19 Vaccines among adolescents and young adults.




					www.cdc.gov
				




*Summary*

Since April 2021, increased cases of myocarditis and pericarditis have been reported in the United States after mRNA COVID-19 vaccination (Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna), particularly in adolescents and young adults. There has not been a similar reporting pattern observed after receipt of the Janssen COVID-19 Vaccine (Johnson & Johnson).

In most cases, patients who presented for medical care have responded well to medications and rest and had prompt improvement of symptoms. Reported cases have occurred predominantly in male adolescents and young adults 16 years of age and older. Onset was typically within several days after mRNA COVID-19 vaccination, and cases have occurred more often after the second dose than the first dose. CDC and its partners are investigating these reports of myocarditis and pericarditis following mRNA COVID-19 vaccination.

CDC continues to recommend COVID-19 vaccination for everyone 5 years of age and older given the risk of COVID-19 illness and related, possibly severe complications, such as long-term health problems, hospitalization, and even death.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> The Trouble With PCR Tests
> 
> 
> Already in mid-March, SPR explained that the highly sensitive PCR tests are prone to producing false-positive results and their predictive value may easily drop below 50%.
> ...


How the fuck am I wrong when I stated that the vaccines available were NOT whole virus antigens?

You are turning out to be dumber than a box of fucking hammers.

Like I said before, you do not have the education, much less the intellect to be making the claims you do.

Why don't you just go crawl back under your bed, and let the professionals do the work?  This is really starting to be embarrassing!


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Jesus.  Are you an idiot.  Yes.  It's job is to teach the body the spike protein.  Not travel through the blood stream into the body.  That is what causes the adverse effects.  That is a problem and Japan called them on that as well.
> 
> It is supposed to stay in the arm.  Train and that's it.  It doesn't matter which arm.



That's like the kettle calling the pot black.

Where is your link to that information?  Oh, that's right!  You couldn't fucking understand that it probably said the exact opposite of what you claim.

I have seen many scared shitless pussy-men like you, but I think you are the worst yet.

Why are you scared of the vaccine?  Did Momma refuse to let her boobs be available for you to nurse?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> If you cannot understand "PHARMACOKINETICS AFTER A SINGLE DOSE" printed on page 14 and the charts that follow, especially on pg 16, where it says "Mean total lipid concentration"....that explains a lot, really.


Lipids are fats.  What the heck does that have to do with the vaccines effectiveness?  Want to explain that Dr. Sue(ss)?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> How the fuck am I wrong when I stated that the vaccines available were NOT whole virus antigens?


Not available.  That is correct and that is my problem with it.  Why should we only choose experimental vaccines?  You know why I'd hope.  Take a look at the lawsuit of Moderna and the NIH some time arguing over the patent.  aka money.



Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> You are turning out to be dumber that a box of fucking hammers.


I have backed up everything I stated .  You haven't backed up shit unless you clogged your toilet.  I've shown information.  YOU HAVEN'T SHOWN A DANG THING.



Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Like I said before, you do not have the education, much less the intellect to be making the claims you do.


That is a matter of opinion.  I don't care what you think.  I've been posting and researching since the 90s.  I'M VERY FUCKING GOOD AT IT.

Why is it that your opinion means a damn thing to me.  It doesn't.



Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Why don't you just go crawl back under your bed, and let the professionals do the work? This is really starting to be embarrassing!


I'm not the one hiding under any damn bed.  I was off 5 weeks and worked ever since,.  Got this shit..wasn't jack.....and still work. 

HIDE FROM IT........You are the one who hid from it.  You are just slinging shit at me because I JUST STOMPED YOUR BUTT WITH FACTS.

Guess we are just going to have to ignore each other again.  YOU ARE AN ASSHOLE. I think you know that.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

ClaireH said:


> These are the precise facts that escape the minds of the pro-fake-vaccine crowd. This pro-fake-vaccine crowd includes unscrupulous investors who went “all in” on one of the 3 amateur vaccine creators. Other deviants in the mix are ego-driven
> scientists (excluding all ethical research scientists) who are hanging on to promoting the “need” for more vaccines. Those jabs out in US public circulation are not effective because they only target a section of Spike when they should’ve targeted T cells all along, known as an effective clean up crew for most. They know that now. That’s the reason for the need to repeat and rinse, over and over, at best giving a person a couple of months of increased antibodies, but not always a  given. The risks are not worth it for many. There are only a few specific groups that should even consider these jab risks to hope for at best 4-5 months of antibody activity. No thanks I have a healthy immune system like most people, and not in a high risk group.


Let's see proof of your assertion.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Lipids are fats.  What the heck does that have to do with the vaccines effectiveness?  Want to explain that Dr. Sue(ss)?


God almighty.  That's how they get the spike protein into the body.








						Concerns of Lipid Nanoparticle Carrying mRNA Vaccine into the Brain: What to Make of It?
					

Detailing the arguments for and against this concern with input from experts.




					medium.com


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> OK. asswipe.  My information comes from real doctors that I sit in the examination room with.  You have reports you do not possibly understand.
> 
> What is your education level?  High school dropout, GED holder?  What is it? BA degree in basket weaving?
> 
> I have a daughter that has degree that would allow her to decipher those reports for you and I guarantee her assessment would be different that your amateur opinions based on reports you could not  even begin to understand.


You really need to work on being less of a pretentious douche.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Not available.  That is correct and that is my problem with it.  Why should we only choose experimental vaccines?  You know why I'd hope.  Take a look at the lawsuit of Moderna and the NIH some time arguing over the patent.  aka money.
> 
> 
> I have backed up everything I stated .  You haven't backed up shit unless you clogged your toilet.  I've shown information.  YOU HAVEN'T SHOWN A DANG THING.
> ...


You may as well have posted studies in Chinese or Serbo-Croatian as far as your understanding of the data.  You obviously do not.  You still  claim they are experimental vaccines even after it was posted that the vaccines had ALL been approved.  How's that like stomping your ass with facts, dumbass!


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> God almighty.  That's how they get the spike protein into the body.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wow!  You can sure talk the talk, but you trip over your own fucking feet every time you try to prove a points.



Unkotare said:


> You really need to work on being less of a pretentious douche.


Shut up, Drizzling Shit!  when I want your opinion, I'll tell you what it should be.  By the way, a flaming pervert like you knows much more about douchebags than I care to know.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> You may as well have posted studies in Chinese or Serbo-Croatian as far as your understanding of the data.  You obviously do not.  You still  claim they are experimental vaccines even after it was posted that the vaccines had ALL been approved.  How's that like stomping your ass with facts, dumbass!


Ok.  My last post to you and I'm done with your dumbass remarks with not a single link to refute the facts.  

I DON'T CARE IF THEY ARE APPROVED.  They are in BED with pharma.  I don't trust them and have no reason to trust them.  

Human trials ARE YOU ADMIRAL.  They rushed these trials and shoved them through and this is how IT'S NEVER BEEN DONE.  

So if you want to be a lab rat.  Fine.  BE THE RAT.  

You are an arrogant asshole bro.  You post NO DATA and cuss everyone in the room and ARE FLAT OUT WRONG on this.

bYE.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Really.  It's all BS.  Tell that to the guy who knew one that died from it.  An elderly lady.  Got the vaccine and her arm was swollen.  They said she should go to the hospital.  She said if it's still bad that night she'd go to the doctor in the morning.  She died that night.
> 
> VAERs is hardly known by the public.  Most of the entries are by DOCTORS.  Most of the information and listings.......you have to google to understand them.  But you disregard it all.........why?


What did the autopsy say she died from?  Oh, you forgot the little detain that she died of a heart attack.  


I disregard VAERS because I have read enough bullshit stories on there to make me dismiss the whole damn thing.  "I got the COVID vaccine and fell off the ladder and broke my femur while cleaning my gutters two weeks later" is the kind of bullshit that site is filled with.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Ok.  My last post to you and I'm done with your dumbass remarks with not a single link to refute the facts.
> 
> I DON'T CARE IF THEY ARE APPROVED.  They are in BED with pharma.  I don't trust them and have no reason to trust them.
> 
> ...



They are in bed with pharma.  Where is your link to that?  My God, I have never seen someone so eaten up with irrational hatred of a perfectly safe vaccine for 99% of the people.

Why are you so fucking stupid that you can post all kinds of data, yet cannot answer a simple question with saying "Well, it is right there!" when you could never possible understand what you are citing.  I don't need data to prove you are a mental case that doesn't understand the data, but pretends he does.

You never answered my questions about your education so it is safe to assume by your overwhelming inability to interpret the data stands to reason that you are simply an uneducated buffoon.

If you want to see an arrogant asshole, I suggest going to your restroom at the Greyhound Bus station and looking in the mirror.  That's where you will definitely find one.  I have not tried to prove a point as I have been far too busy disproving your assertions and those of your ilk.

I had a close friend and coworker's wife die for COVID, as well as three family members.  I can almost guarantee that had a vaccine been available at the time, all would have survived.

I had the vaccine as quickly as I was eligible, as did my wife.   Then, a few months later the Delta variant spread across the US.  I contracted COVID, yet none of the five other people who were with me that day did.  Four days after I tested positive, so did my wife.  We were both given monoclonal antibodies to fight the infection.  My wife missed one day of  work and I was given two weeks off by my employer to recover even though I was over it in two days.

Everyone in my family has either had COVID or was vaccinated, with very little impact on their health.  My oldest daughter was recently certified as an EMT and was hired because a bunch of the stupid EMTs were fired because they refused the vaccine.  She had a very early case of COVID in the Spring of 2020 and then proceeded to get vaccinated when it was available.

I have stage 4 liver failure and get COVID tested every time I undergo any medical procedure, despite having the vaccine, having had COVID, and being current on all my vaccines.

I am not arguing from a position of ignorance, but I assert that you are.  I am sorry my cussing about your stupidity offends you.  I didn't realize that you were that big of a pussy!


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 27, 2021)

Natural Citizen said:


> Anyway. Nobody ever asks if one has immunity. Which is the correct question. That's the actual science based query. But they're not interested in that.


Lol - what "science"?

There is no conclusive way to know if you have immunity.









						Antibody Tests Should Not Be Your Go-To For Checking COVID Immunity
					

Worries about waning immunity and talk of COVID booster shots has some Americans checking their antibody levels to see if they're protected. But scientists warn blood tests don't tell the full story.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> ....
> 
> 
> Shut up, .....!  ......


NO, you pretentious douche.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Clinical Considerations: Myocarditis after mRNA COVID-19 Vaccines | CDC
> 
> 
> Clinical considerations for myocarditis and pericarditis after receipt of mRNA COVID-19 Vaccines among adolescents and young adults.
> ...



I referenced a study I just read tonight that showed the instances of myocarditis was approximately 54 cases out of 2,5 million people who had the vaccine, mostly men and boys which means your personal risk is much less.  Are you capable of doing the math on that?  

Oh, BTW, only one of those 54 died, and it wasn't related to the myocarditis.  They were probably hit by a bus on their way to the Greyhound Bus station where you definitely need to visit.  Maybe you can find a drunk there that will confirm your data.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

Unkotare, 

 Watch _unkotare_ japanese scat uncensored on ThisVid, the HD tube site with a largest scat collection.

Why would any rational human being choose that as a user name?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Much apreciated, but get the fuck out of here. I'm not your little fetch doggy.
> 
> What I've said, I've supported. You support nothing.
> 
> Don't like data? Then go ahead and try to refute it. If you can find data ANYWHERE that shows Republicans are not the primary anti-vax contigent you come on right back and show us that evidence.



No, I like the data, really. It shows how many people are sheep, and as expected, by party line. 

You act like being unvaxed is a bad thing, and I see it as promising result of how many people are thinking for themselves and not falling for media, pharma, and government lies. 

Yet, some data is still bullshit, because it's impossible that 2% more people were unvaccinated in October than month earlier. You refused to explain how. 

So, yes, we're both happy with the results. We're both cheering that mostly unvaccinated are Republicans, just for different reasons.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> ......
> 
> Why would any rational human being choose that as a user name?


Your ignorance is your own shortcoming, pretentious douche.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Natural Citizen said:


> Anyway. Nobody ever asks if one has immunity. Which is the correct question. That's the actual science based query. But they're not interested in that. That's not what this is about. It never has been.
> 
> They always seem to prefer to control the terms of controvertsy by simply asking if one is 'vaccinated.' Which really only equates to asking people if they have consumed the products that the government has provided these special interest companies a captive market for.
> 
> ...



This outstanding post has been recognized.

Looking at these government mandates, and how many are not just complying, but willingly supporting these government decisions, I can see the parallel and even understand how majority of Germans agreed with everything Nazis ask them to comply with, putting Jews, Gypsies, and other undesirable in camps, removing their rights, killing them. With little bit of propaganda, and mandates, they fall in line the same way Germans did. 

Today, that type of people would do the same to you. They think the same, they act the same. They are the same, just times are different.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

Unkotare said:


> Your ignorance is your own shortcoming, pretentious douche.


No.  Your username is Japanese scat porn.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> You don't even understand the fucking homework, you dumbass.  My doctors told me to get vaccinated as soon as it was available, and I have to get a booster in the next few weeks because they told me to wait three months after I had COVID.  You assholes would argue with a brick wall you are so ignorantly, but apparently your over-inflated ego won't let you.
> 
> They were in 100% agreement on my taking the vaccine and they all work at the largest teaching hospital in my state. at the largest university in the state.



My doctor told me that data is promising, but not complete, he mentioned benefits and risks, and said to make decision for myself. He also said that my kids are not at risk and he doesn't recommend because it's not needed.

Your doctors are laughing at you while counting kickback they receive from vaccine makers. Are you ready for the second booster?

You got your two shots, waiting for booster, you're still wearing a mask and nothing has changed. How stupid do you feel? Well, you don't feel stupid at all. Why? Because you're stupid. Really efing stupid. Now you're yelling at everyone who is not vaccinated like you're looking for validation that you did the right thing. We get it. You're protected, we're not. Leave it like that.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 27, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> My doctor told me that data is promising, but not complete, he mentioned benefits and risks, and said to make decision for myself. He also said that my kids are not at risk and he doesn't recommend because it's not needed.
> 
> Your doctors are laughing at you while counting kickback they receive from vaccine makers. Are you ready for the second booster?


One doctor.  Let me guess!  Your primary care physician.

What kickbacks?  Got a link to prove they are receiving kickbacks?   Oh, the one you made up in your feeble little conspiracy theory mind?

As I stated I have 10 specialists at a teaching hospital that would not even know that I had the vaccine unless I told them I got mine at Walmart. How would they get kickbacks when they only recommended I take the vaccine.  Forgot that little logical reasoning didn't you?  I haven't even seen some of them since I was vaccinated.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 27, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> One doctor.  Let me guess!  Your primary care physician.
> 
> What kickbacks?  Got a link to prove they are receiving kickbacks?   Oh, the one you made up in your feeble little conspiracy theory mind?
> 
> As I stated I have 10 specialists at a teaching hospital that would not even know that I had the vaccine unless I told them I got mine at Walmart. How would they get kickbacks when they only recommended I take the vaccine.  Forgot that little logical reasoning didn't you?  I haven't even seen some of them since I was vaccinated.



Yes, one doctor I trust, and whom I visit once a year. No need for more, we are thankfully pretty healthy faintly.

If you have 10 specialists watching over you, you are very sick man. I hope one of them can help you with your shizo... scratch that, there is no cure for idiocy.

As of proof... Pfizer got fined in 2009 some $2.3 billion (from which $1.3 billion was criminal fine) for bribing doctors and suppressing adverse trial results. It makes you wonder what Pfizer is up to these days?


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 28, 2021)

Briss said:


> The pandemic was predicated on the number of cases; the number of cases was predicated on the results of the PCR-test; the PCR-test did not include clinical observation; the PCR-test does not distinguish between Covid and influenza or other pathogens; the PCR-test does not tell you whether a virus is dead or alive.  Thus, the PCR-test was the worst choice among the available alternatives.
> 
> From the CDC:
> 
> ...



It's not that bad... it could have been worse. 






*COVID DATA*


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Nov 28, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> None exist!  The Fear Porn campaign in social media and by the anti-vaxxers on this forum is the only place it exists.



  Now that's funny.

  A hardcore useful idiot and/or knowing, willing accomplice to the whole fearmongering-based #CoronaHoax2020 is accusing the opposing side of _“fear porn”_.

  Your hoax is based almost entirely on fear porn—on taking what, in reality, would be nothing more than a routine flu/cold, and exaggerating it into a huge fake crisis.  You cretins have trashed our freedoms and our economy, for the benefit of criminals who infest positions of power, and to the great harm of individuals and society.

  What would the great John Wayne think, if he were alive today, to see his image and the name of one of his characters being used as a symbol of cowardice and lies and fearmongering?

  You are unworthy even to speak his name, much less to appropriate his image and identity for your own use.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Lol - what "science"?
> 
> There is no conclusive way to know if you have immunity.
> 
> ...











						Home - T-Detect
					

T cells are key players in the adaptive immune system. When the body is invaded by a foreign substance like a virus or bacteria, the immune system begins to rally one of its earliest lines of defense, helper T cells, to join the fight.




					www.t-detect.com
				




And again FAIL.  Why yes they can test for it.  T Cell and B Cell are the key to your own body fighting it off and LONG TERM MEMORY OF IT.

But the jab doesn't last very long.  Why they yell at anyone who MENTIONS THE DREADED NATURAL IMMUNITY.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 28, 2021)

ding said:


> You are the one who used lipids from page 16 in post #564 as your justification to not get vaccinated, dear.  Not me.  Clearly you don't understand anything you are talking about.  You aren't worried about your health.  You are worried about your politics and you are a poor example of a steward.



I do, this is a measure of the drugs that go into various organs. Obviously you thought lipids were cholesterol. And I do not care what narcissistic ego driven politician hawked these drugs, Trump, Biden, Obama, Bush, or Reagan--I still don't want it in my body. Ever.

The end.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 28, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Lipids are fats.  What the heck does that have to do with the vaccines effectiveness?  Want to explain that Dr. Sue(ss)?



They are lipid nanoparticles. Not lipids like cholesterol or fat. LNP in the document: Lipid Nanoparticles. Hey, and btw, glad this crap is not in me.

_Lipid nanoparticles (LNPs) are the most clinically advanced non-viral gene delivery system. Lipid nanoparticles safely and effectively deliver nucleic acids, overcoming a major barrier preventing the development and use of genetic medicines. Genetic medicine has many different applications such as gene editing, rapid vaccine development, immuno-oncology and treatment of rare genetic and undruggable diseases; all of which are usually hindered by nucleic acid delivery inefficiency.






						Lipid Nanoparticles
					

The most clinically advanced non-viral gene delivery system; safely and effectively delivering nucleic acids.




					www.precisionnanosystems.com
				



_


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

3 existing drugs fight coronavirus with ‘almost 100%’ success in Jerusalem lab
					

If medicines pass clinical test for COVID, they’re also likely to prove effective for new variants, scientists say, as they target proteins that barely change between mutations




					www.timesofisrael.com
				




When confronting SARS‑CoV‑2, the drugs in question — darapladib, which currently treats atherosclerosis; the cancer drug Flumatinib; and an HIV medicine — don’t target the spike protein. Rather, they target one of two other proteins: the envelope protein and the 3a protein. These proteins — especially the envelope protein — hardly change between variants, and even between diseases from the coronavirus family. As such, drugs that target them are likely to remain effective in spite of mutations, Arkin said.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> They are lipid nanoparticles. Not lipids like cholesterol or fat. LNP in the document: Lipid Nanoparticles. Hey, and btw, glad this crap is not in me.
> 
> _Lipid nanoparticles (LNPs) are the most clinically advanced non-viral gene delivery system. Lipid nanoparticles safely and effectively deliver nucleic acids, overcoming a major barrier preventing the development and use of genetic medicines. Genetic medicine has many different applications such as gene editing, rapid vaccine development, immuno-oncology and treatment of rare genetic and undruggable diseases; all of which are usually hindered by nucleic acid delivery inefficiency.
> 
> ...


He'll just yell and scream at you saying you don't know anyting.  He will post no data and say my 10 specialist doctors trained me to be gods gift to the world on Covid.  He didn't know about the cycles of pcr.  Or most of the info that is common to us.

I put his ass back on iggy again.  Waste of my time.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> He'll just yell and scream at you saying you don't know anyting.  He will post no data and say my 10 specialist doctors trained me to be gods gift to the world on Covid.  He didn't know about the cycles of pcr.  Or most of the info that is common to us.
> 
> I put his ass back on iggy again.  Waste of my time.



The game is disingenuous---Stupid Internet Games. Like saying if you're not an automotive engineer and can't explain exactly how your car works, you can't drive. People resort to these Stupid Internet Games when they have been defeated.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> The game is disingenuous---Stupid Internet Games. Like saying if you're not an automotive engineer and can't explain exactly how your car works, you can't drive. People resort to these Stupid Internet Games when they have been defeated.


I've read massively during this plannedemic.  You know what amazes me.  How people can't look at the numbers of deaths all over the world and not realize we are the ones fucking up.  Why I use India and now Africa.  

All the Fear mongers said they would be massacred by Covid.  As usual they are wrong.  India used Cheap home health kits that had the dreaded Ivermectin in it.  lol..........Most of Africa isn't vaccinated and their deaths are very low.  They use a lot of malaria drugs there.

But they just IGNORE IT.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I've read massively during this plannedemic.  You know what amazes me.  How people can't look at the numbers of deaths all over the world and not realize we are the ones fucking up.  Why I use India and now Africa.
> 
> All the Fear mongers said they would be massacred by Covid.  As usual they are wrong.  India used Cheap home health kits that had the dreaded Ivermectin in it.  lol..........Most of Africa isn't vaccinated and their deaths are very low.  They use a lot of malaria drugs there.
> 
> But they just IGNORE IT.



I guess it's human psychology. Once you "buy in", the product you bought into is automatically wonderful. This is why, even as the vaccines fail terribly, Big Daddy Govco wants everyone to get the shots. The more buy in, the more brainless defenders they have even as the vaccines fail and people get heart problems, blood clots and cancers.


----------



## Unkotare (Nov 28, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> No.  Your username is Japanese scat porn.


That's not what it means you sick, ignorant freak. Keep your deviant interests to yourself.


----------



## CowboyTed (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> That's not what is happening. People are really, really sick. My coworker has been sick for 10  days, double vaxxed, and even got the monoclonal antibodies.
> 
> I do not lie here.
> 
> So if you are that sick for that long, there's nothing "magic" about the vaccines that prevents you from spreading to others. You're sick. You're very sick. You're infectious.


In Ireland who have 93% of the adult pop vaccinated...
96% of the vaccinated in ICU have underlying conditions and  average age of 67...

Vaccines work but are not foolproof... To not be vaccinated is to either be ignorant, selfish or a combination of both...

Without a very high uptake of the vaccine this will never end... Getting this doesn't make you immune for life and we will contiinue to get outbreaks in rolling cycles... Not taking the vaccine and boosters is to keep promoting that and forcing the Government to have to implement more restrictions...


----------



## SweetSue92 (Nov 28, 2021)

CowboyTed said:


> In Ireland who have 93% of the adult pop vaccinated...
> 96% of the vaccinated in ICU have underlying conditions and  average age of 67...
> 
> Vaccines work but are not foolproof... To not be vaccinated is to either be ignorant, selfish or a combination of both...
> ...



The vaccines are keeping the cases exploding. Seen in the UK, as revealed by a woman who used to work for Pfizer. want the links, or do you believe me?

The vaccines have only a very limited use, and in many populations, do more harm than good.


----------



## Blues Man (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> They also destroyed the control group. Sound normal to you?


No they didn't becuase people like you who are afraid of science are plentiful.


----------



## Oddball (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Lol - what "science"?
> 
> There is no conclusive way to know if you have immunity.
> 
> ...


National Panhandler Radio......rofl


----------



## Oddball (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> The vaccines are keeping the cases exploding. Seen in the UK, as revealed by a woman who used to work for Pfizer. want the links, or do you believe me?
> 
> The vaccines have only a very limited use, and in many populations, do more harm than good.


There's mounting evidence to suggest that the vaxes are driving the mutations.

Even money that has been foreseen, in order to keep the hype and panic porn going.


----------



## Briss (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> They also destroyed the control group. Sound normal to you?


This is a good observational study going on here.  It appears that those who learn that the manufacturer opted to not have a control-group in the efficacy study do not know how to overcome their white-coat mania which causes them to think nothing of obvious fraud even when it's directed against them.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

Oddball said:


> National Panhandler Radio......rofl


Ok moron, what science? Maybe you can answer if no one else can.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Home - T-Detect
> 
> 
> T cells are key players in the adaptive immune system. When the body is invaded by a foreign substance like a virus or bacteria, the immune system begins to rally one of its earliest lines of defense, helper T cells, to join the fight.
> ...


Maybe you need to read your own links before posting them so you don't catch eggs with your face so often.


*What does T-Detect COVID mean regarding immunity?*

A T cell response is typically detectable in blood as early as several days after initial infection. *How long this response lasts post-infection and the implications for immunity are not known.1
The relationship between a demonstrable T cell response and the risk of infection is not well understood.*
If you are fully vaccinated, the CDC states that you can participate in many of the activities that you did before the pandemic. To maximize protection from the Delta variant and prevent possibly spreading it to others, wear a mask indoors in public if you are in an area of substantial or high transmission. You should continue to wear a mask where required by laws, rules, regulations, or local guidance.


----------



## ding (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I do, this is a measure of the drugs that go into various organs. Obviously you thought lipids were cholesterol. And I do not care what narcissistic ego driven politician hawked these drugs, Trump, Biden, Obama, Bush, or Reagan--I still don't want it in my body. Ever.
> 
> The end.


I wasn't thinking anything.  I was trying to understand the basis for your beliefs.


----------



## justoffal (Nov 28, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


By taking the vaccine and conditioning your immune system to ignore it's own Immune response you have most likely ensured that the virus will live longer and mutate farther. ( You're heart is definitely in the right place....I know this) subsequently...you will harm more people.

Jo


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

justoffal said:


> By taking the vaccine and conditioning your immune system to ignore it's own Immune response


WTF?

Your body's reaction to vaccine IS it's own immune response. Vaccine simply trains it for the real thing.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Maybe you need to read your own links before posting them so you don't catch eggs with your face so often.
> 
> 
> *What does T-Detect COVID mean regarding immunity?*
> ...


Yawn you said it wasn't out there.  It isn't the only one and plenty of countries out there are doing T Cell tests to determine how many in the country have already had Covid.

IT MATTERS.  Unless you are pushing to make Billions of these BS vaccines.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Yawn you said it wasn't out there.  It isn't the only one and plenty of countries out there are doing T Cell tests to determine how many in the country have already had Covid.
> 
> IT MATTERS.  Unless you are pushing to make Billions of these BS vaccines.


Because it ISN'T.

There is currently no reliable, well understood way to test for Covid-19 immunity.

The only thing all these tests show (somewhat unreliably) is evidence of past infection or vaccination. Which implies some sort of protection from the current Covid-19 variants, but extent is not clear.


----------



## justoffal (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> WTF?
> 
> Your body's reaction to vaccine IS it's own immune response. Vaccine simply trains it for the real thing.


No..it responds only to a partial identity..because it is not actually a vaccine. It hinders more than it helps apparently.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

justoffal said:


> No


No, WHAT?

What are you disagreeing with and why.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

Be aware of SARS-CoV-2 spike protein: There is more than meets the eye - PubMed
					

The COVID-19 pandemic necessitated the rapid production of vaccines aimed at the production of neutralizing antibodies against the COVID-19 spike protein required for the corona virus binding to target cells. The best well-known vaccines have utilized either mRNA or an adenovirus vector to...




					pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




However, recent reports have raised some skepticism as to the biologic actions of the spike protein and the types of antibodies produced. One paper reported that certain antibodies in the blood of infected patients appear to change the shape of the spike protein so as to make it more likely to bind to cells, while other papers showed *that the spike protein by itself (without being part of the corona virus) can damage endothelial cells and disrupt the blood-brain barrier.* These findings may be even more relevant to the pathogenesis of long-COVID syndrome that may affect as many as 50% of those infected with SARS-CoV-2. In COVID-19, a response to oxidative stress is required by increasing anti-oxidant enzymes. In this regard, it is known that polyphenols are natural anti-oxidants with multiple health effects. *Hence, there are even more reasons to intervene with the use of anti-oxidant compounds, such as luteolin, in addition to available vaccines and anti-inflammatory drugs to prevent the harmful actions of the spike protein.*


----------



## justoffal (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Because it ISN'T.
> 
> There is currently no reliable, well understood way to test for Covid-19 immunity.
> 
> The only thing all these tests show (somewhat unreliably) is evidence of past infection or vaccination. Which implies some sort of protection from the current Covid-19 variants, but extent is not clear.


The virus is beating them hands down and they just don't want to admit it.


----------



## justoffal (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Be aware of SARS-CoV-2 spike protein: There is more than meets the eye - PubMed
> 
> 
> The COVID-19 pandemic necessitated the rapid production of vaccines aimed at the production of neutralizing antibodies against the COVID-19 spike protein required for the corona virus binding to target cells. The best well-known vaccines have utilized either mRNA or an adenovirus vector to...
> ...


Exactly.... We have become human guinea pigs. They need to go back to the time test is method of creating an actual vaccine it may take 5 to 10 years of what they're doing now is actually criminal.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

justoffal said:


> No..it responds only to a partial identity..because it is not actually a vaccine. It hinders more than it helps apparently.


It's actually vaccine. It makes your body generate spike protein through mRNA instructions mechanism.

Your own body's immune response then attacks the spike protein, training it to better attack Covid-19 spike protein.

What does that hinder?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

justoffal said:


> The virus is beating them hands down and they just don't want to admit it.


Who is "them"? Humans? Scientists?

Did you admit that Influenza beat them hands down?


----------



## sealybobo (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> That's not what is happening. People are really, really sick. My coworker has been sick for 10  days, double vaxxed, and even got the monoclonal antibodies.
> 
> I do not lie here.
> 
> So if you are that sick for that long, there's nothing "magic" about the vaccines that prevents you from spreading to others. You're sick. You're very sick. You're infectious.


You’re not lying but you’re still spreading misinformation. People need to get vaccinated. Your numbers are true but spun. Fact is the unvacc8nated are dying 3 to every 1 of us.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

justoffal said:


> Exactly.... We have become human guinea pigs. They need to go back to the time test is method of creating an actual vaccine it may take 5 to 10 years of what they're doing now is actually criminal.


Actually Covaxin is a more traditional vaccine.  Even though it's vector based.  And it is the WHOLE COVID 19 antigen.  But it's not offered here  because India made it.  No money in that for Big Pharma that way.

It's take what tell you and STFU.  Same things these assholes are saying to us here.

OR ELSE never sits well with Americans.  Unless their GOD IS GOV'T.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 28, 2021)

Oddball said:


> There's mounting evidence to suggest that the vaxes are driving the mutations.
> 
> Even money that has been foreseen, in order to keep the hype and panic porn going.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

sealybobo said:


> You’re not lying but you’re still spreading misinformation. People need to get vaccinated. Your numbers are true but spun. Fact is the unvacc8nated are dying 3 to every 1 of us.


Then OFFER A FUCKING TRADITIONAL VACCINE.

We aren't going to be the Lab Rat for a dang experimental vaccine.  And I believe this BS vaccine has made the whole dang thing worse.  

Look at the numbers in India and now Africa.  They are kicking our asses........and very few in Africa are vaccinated.  As a matter of fact the most advanced countries there have the worst results with higher vaccine rates.

SPLAIN THAT.


----------



## Oddball (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Ok moron, what science? Maybe you can answer if no one else can.


You wouldn't know science if it kicked you in your shriveled up little beanbag.

All you've psted here as "evidence" is agitprop that oriniates with minions of The State, who need to keep useful idjit rubes like you in a constant state of fear.

I'd be tempted to feel sorry for you, if morally preening asswipes like you weren't so fucking dangerous to those of us who can think rationally and clearly.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

Oddball said:


> You wouldn't know science if it kicked you in your shriveled up little beanbag.
> 
> All you've psted here as "evidence" is agitprop that oriniates with minions of The State, who need to keep useful idjit rubes like you in a constant state of fear.
> 
> I'd be tempted to feel sorry for you, if morally preening asswipes like you weren't so fucking dangerous to those of us who can think rationally and clearly.


Thats a lot of words to say nothing at all. If you have nothing then just run along idiot.

Come back when you can point to science that lets us reliably test for Covid-19 immunity.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Thats a lot of words to say nothing at all. If you have nothing then just run along idiot.
> 
> Come back when you can point to science that lets us reliably test for Covid-19 immunity.











						Metropolis Healthcare launches new test 'CoviRisk TBNK'; Stock gains 1%
					

The test is available in India for Rs4500 and the TAT is within 6 hours of receiving the sample.




					www.indiainfoline.com
				




There are others .  Google it.  Labs can test T Cells from blood.  You are being STUPID.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 28, 2021)

Oddball said:


> You wouldn't know science if it kicked you in your shriveled up little beanbag.
> 
> All you've psted here as "evidence" is agitprop that oriniates with minions of The State, who need to keep useful idjit rubes like you in a constant state of fear.
> 
> I'd be tempted to feel sorry for you, if morally preening asswipes like you weren't so fucking dangerous to those of us who can think rationally and clearly.


It's interesting that least knowledgeable people like antontoo and that Admiral, are loudest about "listening to science" while they're the one who's ignoring it. 

Take for instance this "moronic" (anagram of omicron) variant, that is discovered back in July in South Africa, for which their doctors say causes mild disease. All western media and governments are creating panic and issuing travel bans (are travel ban racist?), just in time to push for another round of booster shots and vaccines for kids. And experts like this antontoo will scream their lungs out and derail every thread or post that says otherwise. 

The same experts that were mandating masks (that doesn't work), and doing lockdowns (that doesn't work), and mandating "vaccines" (that doesn't work), are doing it all over again, proposing boosters, lockdowns, even internment camps... Listen to the experts.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Thats a lot of words to say nothing at all. If you have nothing then just run along idiot.
> 
> Come back when you can point to science that lets us reliably test for Covid-19 immunity.


----------



## Oddball (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Thats a lot of words to say nothing at all. If you have nothing then just run along idiot.
> 
> Come back when you can point to science that lets us reliably test for Covid-19 immunity.


The person saying nothing at all is you, Gomer Pyle.

All you got is "LISTEN TO THE EXPERTS!"..."Experts" who have been wrong, moved the goalposts, and straight-up gaslighted the entire nation for going on two years....And true believer saps like you gobble it all up, like kittens at a saucer of milk.

Hell, even most of the QAnon drips have managed to conclude that they were had, and have subsequently STFU....You're not even that smart.


----------



## sealybobo (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Then OFFER A FUCKING TRADITIONAL VACCINE.
> 
> We aren't going to be the Lab Rat for a dang experimental vaccine.  And I believe this BS vaccine has made the whole dang thing worse.
> 
> ...


Why can’t we solve this? It’s simple. You

So, right from the beginning, most African governments took drastic measures to try and slow the spread of the virus. 
Public health measures - including avoiding handshakes, frequent hand-washing, social distancing and wearing of face masks - were swiftly introduced.
In a survey conducted in 18 countries in August by PERC, public support for safety measures was high - 85% of respondents said they wore masks in the previous week.
"With strict public health and social measures implemented, African Union member states were able to contain the virus between March and May," the report said.
Globally, most of those who have died have been aged over 80, whileAfrica is home to the world's youngest population with a median age of 19 years, according to UN data.
4. Favorable climate.
5: Good community health systems​


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 28, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Yes, one doctor I trust, and whom I visit once a year. No need for more, we are thankfully pretty healthy faintly.
> 
> If you have 10 specialists watching over you, you are very sick man. I hope one of them can help you with your shizo... scratch that, there is no cure for idiocy.
> 
> As of proof... Pfizer got fined in 2009 some $2.3 billion (from which $1.3 billion was criminal fine) for bribing doctors and suppressing adverse trial results. It makes you wonder what Pfizer is up to these days?


I don't have a shizo.  I have a Shih Tzu that my team of veterinarians care for.  He has ever had COVID, nor the shot.

All the more reason Pfizer would NOT be bribing doctor and suppressing adverse trial results.  What happens when you rob a bank, got to jail and when you get out the first thing happens is your local bank gets robbed?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 28, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> It's interesting that least knowledgeable people like antontoo and that Admiral, are loudest about "listening to science" while they're the one who's ignoring it.
> 
> Take for instance this "moronic" (anagram of omicron) variant, that is discovered back in July in South Africa, for which their doctors say causes mild disease. All western media and governments are creating panic and issuing travel bans (are travel ban racist?), just in time to push for another round of booster shots and vaccines for kids. And experts like this antontoo will scream their lungs out and derail every thread or post that says otherwise.
> 
> ...


Stop putting words in my mouth!  My God, you must have a room temperature IQ!  When did I say anything like what you just posted?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Be aware of SARS-CoV-2 spike protein: There is more than meets the eye - PubMed
> 
> 
> The COVID-19 pandemic necessitated the rapid production of vaccines aimed at the production of neutralizing antibodies against the COVID-19 spike protein required for the corona virus binding to target cells. The best well-known vaccines have utilized either mRNA or an adenovirus vector to...
> ...


Now, go back and explain what all of that bullshit means! Oh, never mind.  With that GED educated mind, you wouldn't get past the first sentence.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Nov 28, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> View attachment 569371


Bullshit!  That is what your addled brain is telling you.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 28, 2021)

sealybobo said:


> Why can’t we solve this? It’s simple. You


Typical Fascist statement,  Same damned tone that put yellow stars on the jews.
You are using Cohersion and threats pointing at us which is FASCISM.  That shit just don't set well in America except people like you obsessed with power and control.

The Vaccines are experimental.  I'm not taking them.  I'll consider traditional like India and NOTHING ELSE.  That is my position.



sealybobo said:


> So, right from the beginning, most African governments took drastic measures to try and slow the spread of the virus.
> Public health measures - including avoiding handshakes, frequent hand-washing, social distancing and wearing of face masks - were swiftly introduced.
> In a survey conducted in 18 countries in August by PERC, public support for safety measures was high - 85% of respondents said they wore masks in the previous week.
> "With strict public health and social measures implemented, African Union member states were able to contain the virus between March and May," the report said.
> ...


Baloney.  That didn't make them have those stats.  Most aren't vaccinated and they are doing stellar compared to us.

At some point in time maybe you'll go SHIT.  WHY DO MY STATS SUCK AND THEIR DON'T.  But I guess you are PHARMA'S MOUTHPIECE HERE.


----------



## ClaireH (Nov 28, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I guess it's human psychology. Once you "buy in", the product you bought into is automatically wonderful. This is why, even as the vaccines fail terribly, Big Daddy Govco wants everyone to get the shots. The more buy in, the more brainless defenders they have even as the vaccines fail and people get heart problems, blood clots and cancers.


You know Sue, your post brings about a psychological factor that is definitely weighing in here. A person tries to do their best to make their best health choices and falls for the Fauci/NIH heads, CDC, WHO scam. We were told that every single person needed the vaccine, even children. Total lie. Unfortunately and as you know, many US citizens instantly believed it because after all, it was the government’s recommendation.

What’s been happening now for many of these individuals? Buyer’s remorse. Various emotions come into play with that including self-anger, but lashing out at others who didn’t fall for it must be somehow therapeutic, short term. Long term? They just have to deal with it that they were “had” and stop projecting their anger onto those of us who were not.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

Oddball said:


> The person saying nothing at all is you, Gomer Pyle.
> 
> All you got is "LISTEN TO THE EXPERTS!"..."Experts" who have been wrong, moved the goalposts, and straight-up gaslighted the entire nation for going on two years....And true believer saps like you gobble it all up, like kittens at a saucer of milk.
> 
> Hell, even most of the QAnon drips have managed to conclude that they were had, and have subsequently STFU....You're not even that smart.


What did you say about actual science? NOTHING.

How did you contradict my well supported point that available tests do not show immunity? You didn't.

So if you have nothing to say about science then maybe the thing to do is to take your own advice and just stfu. You are adding exactly nothing to the discussion.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> View attachment 569379


Well as it happens it wasn't me who brought up science here. So why are you not responding to him?


Natural Citizen said:


> Anyway. Nobody ever asks if one has immunity. Which is the correct question. That's the actual science based query. But they're not interested in that. That's not what this is about. It never has been.



So much for the "they are not interested in science" bullshit. It's you ignorant nutters who are not interested.


----------



## badbob85037 (Nov 28, 2021)

Maybe if you personally knew ones killed by this vaccine it would change the way you think. If it is such a wonder drug we are just suppose to over look the deaths associated with this miracle vaccine.  I  haven't shut myself in my house and by everything I have learned in life there is no way a virus can be stopped by a piece of cotton but fear is a great thing and I think some would eat shit if some one were told it would save them. If this virus or poison were as spread as bad as it does I would be dead. I know no one who has died from this virus   including ones over 80 years old. But I do know ones in their 20's dying of the cure. And what the hell is this booster bull shit? The pharmaceutical industry is not your friend. They care as much as Joe if you live or die. Drugs that have thousands of law suits against them are still being passed off as miracle dugs. Take the over 200 drugs to cure a chemical imbalance, you know the ones that have been involved in EVERY school shooting since the 50's. How many elected officials have called out these drugs as nothing but poisons? None they blame a piece of steel. Mercury, is poison and belong to nothing we eat. Prozac was used by NAZIS in WWII to make their victims go mad. But these poisons are used to cure  a  chemical imbalance. No one on Earth even knows what a chemical imbalance is. Ya just might think this would explain  these crazed ass holes that burn down schools or go through a mall hacking anyone in sight in places that don't have a Second Amendment? Just take your poison and shut up and if you die you can count on your media to cover it up. All at the FDA have financial ties to the drug industry. These drugs are approved by the FDA twice as fast and twice as many.The average profit of each poison to cure a  chemical imbalance is $6.5 million a day with over a million people around the earth prescribed these poisons. Remember when we had home remedies that was always at the store and always worked? They all one day vanished because these small manufactures didn't have the funds to spend millions to prove these home remedies worked.  

The  pharmaceutical industry is the number one lobbyist spending 7 times that of number two and with profits of hundreds of billions a year is plenty to butter every palm that comes along. Government is not Godly or a saint. Unless you know anyone in government that hasn't retired without riches beyond anyone's dream including that fuck Joe.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 28, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Then OFFER A FUCKING TRADITIONAL VACCINE.
> 
> We aren't going to be the Lab Rat for a dang experimental vaccine.  And I believe this BS vaccine has made the whole dang thing worse.
> 
> ...


Fau Chi, Daszak, Baric and the Chinese communists knew what they were doing. American prisoners do not have access to real vaccine: Covaxin.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

badbob85037 said:


> Maybe if you personally knew ones killed by this vaccine it would change the way you think. If it is such a wonder drug we are just suppose to over look the deaths associated with this miracle vaccine.  I  haven't shut myself in my house and by everything I have learned in life there is no way a virus can be stopped by a piece of cotton but fear is a great thing and I think some would eat shit if some one were told it would save them. If this virus or poison were as spread as bad as it does I would be dead.


What the fuck? Surgical masks are always used at hospitals, there actually IS a reason for that.

Covid-19 kills somewhere around 0.5-1% of unvaxed people that get it, where did you get the idea that someone is saying that it will kill you specifically?

Adverse outcome from vaccination are hundreds of times more rare than Covid-19 complications. 

We don't have hospitals full of people suffering from vaccine, we have Covid-19 patients.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 28, 2021)

badbob85037 said:


> Maybe if you personally knew ones killed by this vaccine it would change the way you think. If it is such a wonder drug we are just suppose to over look the deaths associated with this miracle vaccine.  I  haven't shut myself in my house and by everything I have learned in life there is no way a virus can be stopped by a piece of cotton but fear is a great thing and I think some would eat shit if some one were told it would save them. If this virus or poison were as spread as bad as it does I would be dead. I know no one who has died from this virus   including ones over 80 years old. But I do know ones in their 20's dying of the cure. And what the hell is this booster bull shit? The pharmaceutical industry is not your friend. They care as much as Joe if you live or die. Drugs that have thousands of law suits against them are still being passed off as miracle dugs. Take the over 200 drugs to cure a chemical imbalance, you know the ones that have been involved in EVERY school shooting since the 50's. How many elected officials have called out these drugs as nothing but poisons? None they blame a piece of steel. Mercury, is poison and belong to nothing we eat. Prozac was used by NAZIS in WWII to make their victims go mad. But these poisons are used to cure  a  chemical imbalance. No one on Earth even knows what a chemical imbalance is. Ya just might think this would explain  these crazed ass holes that burn down schools or go through a mall hacking anyone in sight in places that don't have a Second Amendment? Just take your poison and shut up and if you die you can count on your media to cover it up. All at the FDA have financial ties to the drug industry. These drugs are approved by the FDA twice as fast and twice as many.The average profit of each poison to cure a  chemical imbalance is $6.5 million a day with over a million people around the earth prescribed these poisons. Remember when we had home remedies that was always at the store and always worked? They all one day vanished because these small manufactures didn't have the funds to spend millions to prove these home remedies worked.
> 
> The  pharmaceutical industry is the number one lobbyist spending 7 times that of number two and with profits of hundreds of billions a year is plenty to butter every palm that comes along. Government is not Godly or a saint. Unless you know anyone in government that hasn't retired without riches beyond anyone's dream including that fuck Joe.


Americans were given these choices to deal with the Chinese communist virus: mRNA, a human-based non-coronavirus, and a chimp-based non-coronavirus.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> It's actually vaccine. It makes your body generate spike protein through mRNA instructions mechanism.
> 
> Your own body's immune response then attacks the spike protein, training it to better attack Covid-19 spike protein.
> 
> What does that hinder?


It’s a fragment of the Chinese communist virus. Forced manufacture of Chinese communist virus parts in the cell is extremely problematic. Wait until the Pedophile gets to the children’s immature immune systems.


----------



## Flopper (Nov 28, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


IHMO, conservatives are irrational about vaccine mandates for several reasons.  First, conservatives are very reluctant to support any presidential mandate and doubly so if comes from a democrat president.  Also, if the mandate was very successful and the number of cases dropped significantly this could easily turnaround Biden's unfavorable approval rating because ending the epidemic in the US would mean dropping covid restrictions and a stronger economy.  The last thing Republicans would want to see would be the democrats going into the next presidential elections with an end of Covid, the worst epidemic in US history, an end to the Afgan war, the longest war in American history, plus an improving economy.

This would be particular bad for Trump.  He couldn't stop the epidemic.  He couldn't end the Afgan war.  He couldn't prevent the the near economic collapse. In essence, where Trump failed, Biden would have succeed.  Republicans just can't let this happen.  If it means opposing efforts to end Covid, so be it.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 28, 2021)

Flopper said:


> IHMO, conservatives are irrational about vaccine mandates for several reasons.  First, conservatives are very reluctant to support any presidential mandate and doubly so if comes from a democrat president.  Also, if the mandate was very successful and the number of cases dropped significantly this could easily turnaround Biden's unfavorable approval rating because ending the epidemic in the US would mean dropping covid restrictions and a stronger economy.  The last thing Republicans would want to see would be the democrats going into the next presidential elections with an end of Covid, the worst epidemic in US history, an end to the Afgan war, the longest war in American history, plus an improving economy.
> 
> This would be particular bad for Trump.  He couldn't stop the epidemic.  He couldn't end the Afgan war.  He couldn't prevent the the near economic collapse. In essence, where Trump failed, Biden would have succeed.  Republicans just can't let this happen.  If it means opposing efforts to end Covid, so be it.



Oh come on flip-flopper. First, there were no mandates during Trump. He left states to decide their own policies, which was constitutional thing to do.
You lefties were against vaccine when Trump was president, while you're trying to mandate the very same vaccine manufactured during Trump.

Where you're wrong is this, you're equating refusal of mandate with refusal of vaccine. Those are very different things.


----------



## Flopper (Nov 28, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Oh come on flip-flopper. First, there were no mandates during Trump. He left states to decide their own policies, which was constitutional thing to do.
> You lefties were against vaccine when Trump was president, while you're trying to mandate the very same vaccine manufactured during Trump.
> 
> Where you're wrong is this, you're equating refusal of mandate with refusal of vaccine. Those are very different things.


Of course there were no Covid mandates from Trump because Covid was just a bad case of the flu or China Flu, or Kung Fu virus.  As a result we had no test kits in most of states, no policy, and a shortage of hospital supplies when they were most needed, at initial stages of the epidemic.  Finally he decided to dump it all on the states and concentrate on the election pausing occasionally to criticize and make fun of the only preventive measures we had, masks and social distancing.  By the end of his term in office, it became quite clear to his supporters, fighting Covid was anti-Trump.  So when Biden took over and started his vaccination campaign, Trumpeters became the major opposition.  

Today, most republicans states are opposing Biden vaccination mandates and in the Florida any employer requiring his employees get vaccinated can be arrested.  Schools can not require vaccinations or require masks.   Clearly republicans have decided that more covid deaths and cases are to their benefit and they will do whatever it takes to make that happen.

Here is part of the Florida Governor's letter to state and local offices regarding Covid requirement.

✓* Private Employer COVID-19 vaccine mandates are prohibited.
‣ Employees can choose from numerous exemptions, including but not limited to,
health or religious concerns; pregnancy or anticipated future pregnancy; and past
recovery from COVID-19.
‣ Employees can choose to opt for periodic testing or PPE as an exemption.
‣ Employers must cover the costs of testing and PPE exemptions for employees.

✓ Employers who violate these employee health protections will be fined.
‣ Small businesses (99 employees or less) will face $10,000 per employee
violation.
‣ Medium and big businesses will face $50,000 per employee violation.

✓ Government entities may not require COVID-19 vaccinations of anyone,
including employees.

✓ Educational institutions may not require students to be COVID-19
vaccinated.

✓ School districts may not have school face mask policies.

✓ School districts may not quarantine healthy students.

✓ Students and parents may sue violating school districts and recover costs
and attorney’s fees.*


----------



## Briss (Nov 28, 2021)

antontoo said:


> What the fuck? Surgical masks are always used at hospitals, there actually IS a reason for that.


Well, maybe not.



			https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2493952/pdf/annrcse01509-0009.pdf


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 28, 2021)

Flopper said:


> Of course there were no Covid mandates from Trump because Covid was just a bad case of the flu or China Flu, or Kung Fu virus.  As a result we had no test kits in most of states, no policy, and a shortage of hospital supplies when they were most needed, at initial stages of the epidemic.  Finally he decided to dump it all on the states and concentrate on the election pausing occasionally to criticize and make fun of the only preventive measures we had, masks and social distancing.  By the end of his term in office, it became quite clear to his supporters, fighting Covid was anti-Trump.  So when Biden took over and started his vaccination campaign, Trumpeters became the major opposition.
> 
> Today, most republicans states are opposing Biden vaccination mandates and in the Florida any employer requiring his employees get vaccinated can be arrested.  Schools can not require vaccinations or require masks.   Clearly republicans have decided that more covid deaths and cases are to their benefit and they will do whatever it takes to make that happen.
> 
> ...



Data doesn't back your claim... "Clearly republicans have decided that more covid deaths..." Florida covid rates are among lowest in a nation.

When are you going to question Democrat governors decisions to put covid patients in nursing homes?

By the way, why do you think that what DeSantis is doing is a bad thing for Florida?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Data doesn't back your claim... "Clearly republicans have decided that more covid deaths..." Florida covid rates are among lowest in a nation.
> 
> When are you going to question Democrat governors decisions to put covid patients in nursing homes?
> 
> By the way, why do you think that what DeSantis is doing is a bad thing for Florida?


What data...??? Florida has just had a huge Covid-19 spike and for a month accounted for a third of all Covid deaths in United States.





__





						A tale of two governors: COVID outcomes in Florida and Connecticut show that leadership matters | Fortune
					

Florida's spiking hospitalization and COVID death rates show what happens when ideology trumps science on mask mandates and vaccinations.



					fortune.com


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 28, 2021)

badger2 said:


> It’s a fragment of the Chinese communist virus. Forced manufacture of Chinese communist virus parts in the cell is extremely problematic. Wait until the Pedophile gets to the children’s immature immune systems.


No moron, it is a vaccine spike protein designed and developed right here in the US of A.

No go be a patriot and get your ass vaccinated with some of that red, white and blue Trump vax.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> No moron, it is a vaccine spike protein designed and developed right here in the US of A.
> 
> No go be a patriot and get your ass vaccinated with some of that red, white and blue Trump vax.


It’s based on a Chinbese communist virus, Dipshit. It can only intelligently be called a Chinese communist virus. America mimicked a China-evolved virus, Dumbass.


----------



## Confederate Soldier (Nov 29, 2021)

For the record, I don't care if you get vaccinated or not. It don't bother me. However, a mandate is just a slippery slope that won't lead anywhere good.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

badger2 said:


> It’s based on a Chinbese communist virus, Dipshit. It can only intelligently be called a Chinese communist virus. America mimicked a China-evolved virus, Dumbass.


Vaccine here is not the virus dummy. It just matches the protein spike markers your immune system needs to be trained on.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> For the record, I don't care if you get vaccinated or not. It don't bother me. However, a mandate is just a slippery slope that won't lead anywhere good.


Where did all the prior vaccination mandates lead?

Kids have a bunch of vaccines they are required to have to attend daycare and schools.


----------



## Confederate Soldier (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Where did all the prior vaccination mandates lead?
> 
> Kids have a bunch of vaccines they are required to have to attend daycare and schools.




There are two problems with this logic.

#1 is that these vaccines were tested rigorously for years to make sure they were safe. These covid vaccines were tested only in months. I am,and I'm sure others are, are just not comfortable with that.



And another problem with that logic, is that the school vaccinations are law, not mandates. They went through the correct legal procedures to make it a law, not a mandate.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Vaccine here is not the virus dummy. It just matches the protein spike markers your immune system needs to be trained on.


Your punk-ass arrogance will not suffice for an education you little c.u.n.t. Above, the forced manufacture of the communist spike has already been pointed out. There is no difference between an American pharm worker matching it and the confiscated cell of the injectee matching it. mRNA training is failing and ephemeral. It should, like you, be boycotted.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 29, 2021)

The irrational part of thias is that Americans have been denied access to the real, entire SARS-CoV-2 in a vaccine even though it does exist. This POS commie virus gets to travel all over the world and the real, entire vaccine, Covaxin, does not.


----------



## jbrownson0831 (Nov 29, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Here also, from the latest Gov report from Michigan. And this includes data going back to mid-October, BEFORE the big wave. Beaumont hospital guy says 40% of HOSPITALIZED covid cases are now fully vaccinated (see my thread)
> 
> _*In the last 30 days (Oct 14- Nov 12), 30,906 (28%) of 109,455 cases, 454 (29%) of 1,540 hospitalizations, and 151 (25%) of 605 deaths were among fully vaccinated individuals*_
> 
> ...


Dimmers hate statistics...


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

badger2 said:


> Your punk-ass arrogance will not suffice for an education you little c.u.n.t. Above, the forced manufacture of the communist spike has already been pointed out. There is no difference between an American pharm worker matching it and the confiscated cell of the injectee matching it. mRNA training is failing and ephemeral. It should, like you, be boycotted.


There is a huge difference.

It's a capitalist vaccine, as American as apple pie and a credit to this country.

So go fuck yourself and half baked anti-vax conspiracy horseshit.


----------



## krichton (Nov 29, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Then it's not a very good vaccine.
> 
> What's the problem with admitting that? Did you create it? Do you work for Big Pharma? What's your buy in? I don't understand why people feel the need to deny reality and defend this utter bunk



Actually the vaccines, especially the mrna ones and moderna in particular are some of the best in modern history.   The speed in which they were created and their 95% efficacy against the original strain and some of the variants, outside of Delta was amazing.  Unfortunately, we are dealing with an ever evolving upper respiratory virus.  There hasn't been a vaccine made in history that has been able to deal with a virus that A) attacks us through our upper respiratory system and B) consistently mutates into variants that can potentially bypass any previous antibodies developed by vaccine or infection.  If at least 95% of everyone took them and followed up with updated boosters for the next year or so then it's conceivable covid could potentially be eliminated, but this is not realistic.  There are way too many ppl in this country and around the world who would sooner see it burn down than get a shot in the arm because they're afraid of needles.  We can only hope science overcomes covid and the cult.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> There are two problems with this logic.
> 
> #1 is that these vaccines were tested rigorously for years to make sure they were safe. These covid vaccines were tested only in months. I am,and I'm sure others are, are just not comfortable with that.
> 
> And another problem with that logic, is that the school vaccinations are law, not mandates. They went through the correct legal procedures to make it a law, not a mandate.


Covid vaccines have been tested for well over a year before any mandate (with 500+ million doses already administered). Which btw followed full FDA clearance.

The courts ensure legalities, not layman opinion. But it seems moot for you to even go into legalities when your complaint is about the principle idea of mandating vaccines. If it's done by some other authority then it's all good? Come-on, you are just parsing distinctions without a difference.

I just don't buy your argument that this is a slippery slope. It just hasn't been, the courts have done well in ensuring proper jurisdiction and keeping personal rights on balance with public healthcare needs.


----------



## Briss (Nov 29, 2021)

krichton said:


> Actually the vaccines, especially the mrna ones and moderna in particular are some of the best in modern history.


What do you believe the repeated experimental injection does for you?  And where did you learned that from?


----------



## Confederate Soldier (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Covid vaccines have been tested for well over a year before any mandate (with 500+ million doses already administered). Which btw followed full FDA clearance.
> 
> The courts ensure legalities, not layman opinion. But it seems moot for you to even go into legalities when your complaint is about the principle idea of mandating vaccines. If it's done by some other authority then it's all good? Come-on, you are just parsing distinctions without a difference.
> 
> I just don't buy your argument that this is a slippery slope. It just hasn't been, the courts have done well in ensuring proper jurisdiction and keeping personal rights on balance with public healthcare needs.


I firmly believe it's a slippery slope argument, especially when we are talking about democrats here. This is a new age, a different time. We don't act like we did even in the '80s. I 100% believe that if the Biden admin gets away with this, they are going to see what else they can get away with.


And rigorously tested for a year? Gimme a break. It took half a year alone to formulate and develop, they haven't tested it anywhere near as rigorously as vaccines in the past.

Besides, the damn things don't even seem to work.


----------



## badger2 (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> I firmly believe it's a slippery slope argument, especially when we are talking about democrats here. This is a new age, a different time. We don't act like we did even in the '80s. I 100% believe that if the Biden admin gets away with this, they are going to see what else they can get away with.
> 
> 
> And rigorously tested for a year? Gimme a break. It took half a year alone to formulate and develop, they haven't tested it anywhere near as rigorously as vaccines in the past.
> ...


The work that mRNA does is ephemeral. Note that the drugs JoeXi’s son eats are also ephemeral.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> I firmly believe it's a slippery slope argument, especially when we are talking about democrats here. This is a new age, a different time. We don't act like we did even in the '80s. I 100% believe that if the Biden admin gets away with this, they are going to see what else they can get away with.
> 
> 
> And rigorously tested for a year? Gimme a break. It took half a year alone to formulate and develop, they haven't tested it anywhere near as rigorously as vaccines in the past.
> ...



Sure seems like a lot of very special politico pleading.

Vaccine taking half a year to develop does not contradict what I've said, because pandemic started in early 2020, which is over a year and half ago and Mandates go in effect in 2022.

You saying vaccines don't work is simply false, as established by gold-standard medical studies. It's kinda ironic that you argue that vaccine wasn't tested enough, yet reject out of hand results that all the rigorous testing showed.


----------



## Confederate Soldier (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Sure seems like a lot of very special politico pleading.
> 
> Vaccine taking half a year to develop does not contradict what I've said, because pandemic started in early 2020, which is over a year and half ago and Mandates go in effect in 2022.
> 
> You saying vaccines don't work is simply false, as established by gold-standard medical studies. It's kinda ironic that you argue that vaccine wasn't tested enough, yet reject out of hand results that all the rigorous testing showed.




If it was so rigorously tested, than why are all these breakthrough cases happening? Why is effectiveness going down to 30%? A year, half a year, whatever, is just simply not enough time to test things out.


----------



## gipper (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> If it was so rigorously tested, than why are all these breakthrough cases happening? Why is effectiveness going down to 30%? A year, half a year, whatever, is just simply not enough time to test things out.


It’s the forever pandemic courtesy of Bill Gates and Tony Fauci.  Boosters for life. Yippee!


----------



## theHawk (Nov 29, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Because the mRNA and viral vector (DNA) vaccines are purely experimental.

In October 2019 Dr. Fauci himself said that mRNA vaccines would take a decade to approve even if *perfect*, since that is how long is needed to study long term effects in humans.

Short term adverse effects have been documented, and it doesn’t look good.  They have much worse adverse reactions than any other vaccine on record.  Plus they don’t even work, vaccinated can carry the WuFlu virus and get sick, and get hospitalized, and die from it.  

So if you want to be a guinea pig for Big Pharma then go right ahead, don’t expect us all to follow you off that cliff.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> If it was so rigorously tested, than why are all these breakthrough cases happening? Why is effectiveness going down to 30%? A year, half a year, whatever, is just simply not enough time to test things out.



Don't know where you got 30% from, but mRNA vaccines were 95% effective against Covid-19 A variant, and pretty much stopped transmission. 98% of hospitalized Covid-19 patients were unvaccinated, clearly showing real world results.

With Delta variant vaccination was only a few % less effective at keeping people out of the hospital. It is however more transmissible due to being more contagious.

With time some immunity wane was shown, which lead to booster shot recommendation for higher risk groups, though nowhere near 30% you are talking about.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> There is a huge difference.
> 
> It's a capitalist vaccine, as American as apple pie and a credit to this country.
> 
> So go fuck yourself and half baked anti-vax conspiracy horseshit.


Hes forgotten more than you know.  You prove you are clueless more everyday


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Hes forgotten more than you know.


That's true, Dementia with a paranoid bend is hell of a disease, even for a famous molecular biologist like badger2


----------



## theHawk (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Don't know where you got 30% from, but mRNA vaccines were 95% effective against Covid-19 A variant, and pretty much stopped transmission


LOL that’s what they claimed.  Now we know the vaccines wear off over time and are useless, and they never stopped transmission.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

theHawk said:


> LOL that’s what they claimed.  Now we know the vaccines wear off over time and are useless, and they never stopped transmission.



That's a bunch of made up BS. 

Studies showed alpha transmission halted by vaccination, Delta spread reduced by vaccination and not a single study showed vaccines to be "useless" overtime. It's not all-or-nothing proposition you and other anti-vaxers like to push.


----------



## Confederate Soldier (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Don't know where you got 30% from, but mRNA vaccines were 95% effective against Covid-19 A variant, and pretty much stopped transmission. 98% of hospitalized Covid-19 patients were unvaccinated, clearly showing real world results.
> 
> With Delta variant vaccination was only a few % less effective at keeping people out of the hospital. It is however more transmissible due to being more contagious.
> 
> With time some immunity wane was shown, which lead to booster shot recommendation for higher risk groups, though nowhere near 30% you are talking about.




When they first rolled out, yes, 98% stopping power was the norm. But those shots first administered earlier in the year are now only 30% effective, they aren't working right now. I believe with another year or two of research, a 100% effective vaccine can be rolled out, but by then we may be done with this. Enough people will get sick with it anyway that we won't need it.


----------



## Wild Bill Kelsoe (Nov 29, 2021)

rightwinger said:


> What is most disheartening is that a health emergency that should have drawn us together became a political issue.


You can thank the Libtards for that.


----------



## Wild Bill Kelsoe (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> That's a bunch of made up BS.
> 
> Studies showed alpha transmission halted by vaccination, Delta spread reduced by vaccination and not a single study showed vaccines to be "useless" overtime. It's not all-or-nothing proposition you and other anti-vaxers like to push.


If the vaccines didn't wear off, we wouldn't need a booster...lol


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> That's true, Dementia with a paranoid bend is hell of a disease, even for a famous molecular biologist like badger2


That True..........you were doing good til that.  Have yo figured out cycles and PCR tests yet?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> That's a bunch of made up BS.
> 
> Studies showed alpha transmission halted by vaccination, Delta spread reduced by vaccination and not a single study showed vaccines to be "useless" overtime. It's not all-or-nothing proposition you and other anti-vaxers like to push.


Worked so good that they had to change the definition of vaccine.


----------



## theHawk (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> That's a bunch of made up BS.
> 
> Studies showed alpha transmission halted by vaccination, Delta spread reduced by vaccination and not a single study showed vaccines to be "useless" overtime. It's not all-or-nothing proposition you and other anti-vaxers like to push.


Yea sure.  Once it’s pointed out they don’t prevent one from getting and transmitting WuFlu, you all suddenly change your tune and say “we never said it would prevent infection” (when they did say this), and that the vaccines are more for “lessening the symptoms”.  Oh, so it’s no different than just using Ivermectin then if it’s just therapeutic, except you don’t get all the nasty side effects of an experimental vaccine type.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Confederate Soldier said:


> shots first administered earlier in the year are now only 30% effective


Source??


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Wild Bill Kelsoe said:


> If the vaccines didn't wear off, we wouldn't need a booster...lol


That's just bad logic. If vaccine becomes 75% effective over time it's well worth it for higher risk groups to get it back into 90's with a booster.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

theHawk said:


> Yea sure.  Once it’s pointed out they don’t prevent one from getting and transmitting WuFlu, you all suddenly change your tune and say “we never said it would prevent infection”


You have trouble understanding what you read.

Vaccine reduces Delta transmission, and highly reduces odds of death and hospitalization.

Just because it is not perfect does not mean it's not well worth getting vaccinated.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> You have trouble understanding what you read.
> 
> Vaccine reduces Delta transmission, and highly reduces odds of death and hospitalization.
> 
> Just because it is not perfect does not mean it's not well worth getting vaccinated.


I will wait til I see what happens to the lab rats like you for a few years first.  Just to be safe about it.






ENJOY THE JABS


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Worked so good that they had to change the definition of vaccine.


There was no change to definition, you just don't know what the hell you are talking about as usual.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> There was no change to definition, you just don't know what the hell you are talking about as usual.


I haven't seen you prove anything.  You don't even know the basics when questioned.  All you do is go ballistic and show nothing.  

You are mostly worthless on information.  Now for being a drama queen.....you can go to Burger King and accept your crown.


----------



## Wild Bill Kelsoe (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> That's just bad logic. If vaccine becomes 75% effective over time it's well worth it for higher risk groups to get it back into 90's with a booster.


Its not logic, it's reality.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I will wait til I see what happens to the lab rats like you for a few years first.  Just to be safe about it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If you could do basic math you'd know that these % numbers translate into millions of Americans dead.

Maybe you think vaccination and other mitigation efforts were not worth doing to save millions, but I don't.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Wild Bill Kelsoe said:


> Its not logic, it's reality.


I've just explained why it's bad logic.

You now doubling down on stupid and re-asserting the same thing is not advancing your argument.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I haven't seen you prove anything.  You don't even know the basics when questioned.  All you do is go ballistic and show nothing.
> 
> You are mostly worthless on information.  Now for being a drama queen.....you can go to Burger King and accept your crown.


Many words, zero substance.

What definition change numbnuts? Can you support _anything_ you say?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Dummy, these % numbers translate into millions of Americans dead.
> 
> Maybe you think vaccination and other mitigation efforts were not worth doing to save millions, but I don't.


1.  Millions haven't died.  Early on they called everything a covid death.  I know people who had people die NOT FROM COVID and it was called covid.  

2.  Early treatment with cheap drugs, like being done in other countries, would have saved hundreds of thousands of lives.  I've shown the data from places like India.  Cheap Health kits to be taken Early and the results were amazing.  

Denying these prescriptions and sending people home and saying call me if it gets worse is BS.  Simple cheap effective Health kits should have been done.

3.  Shutting down helped NOTHING.  They only caused more misery and economic destruction.  Flattening the curve was the dumbest decision in mankinds recent history.


----------



## Wild Bill Kelsoe (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> I've just explained why it's bad logic.
> 
> You now doubling down on stupid is not advancing your argument.


And I explained that it's not logic, it's reality.  Its a simple fact that if the vaccines didn't wear off, there would be no need for a booster.  That's common sense.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Many words, zero substance.
> 
> What definition change numbnuts? Can you support _anything_ you say?


It's been shown over and over again.  You've seen it.  From immunity to PROTECTION.

Now the next time your gal just say baby I'm gonna wear this vaccine on my tallywacker baby.........

You are nothing but a troll these days.  Nothing more just slinging shit at the wall to see if it sticks.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> 1.  Millions haven't died.


The Covid-19 survival expectancy numbers you yourself presented translate into millions of Americans not surviving, because sooner or later everyone would 100% catch it.

Do the math dummy.

This is not a question of what happened, because what happened was masking, shutdowns, social distancing, remote work, vaccinations etc. all of which reduced deaths. All the stuff fools like you fight tooth and nail.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Wild Bill Kelsoe said:


> And I explained that it's not logic, it's reality.  Its a simple fact that if the vaccines didn't wear off, there would be no need for a booster.  That's common sense.


Cut the shit, are you or are you not saying that vaccine that wears off from 95% to 70% efficacy over time not worth getting?

Because 70% is a whole lot better than nothing.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> The survival numbers you yourself presented translate into millions of Americans not surviving
> 
> True or false? Do the math dummy.


Fear mongering and nothing more.  The survival rates are very high most of this country.  VERY HIGH.  And had we just let's protect the vulnerable and moved on.  Then most would have gotten it and hardly known they had it.  For most of America the virus didn't even amount to a bad flu for them.  Shutting down was STUPID.



antontoo said:


> This is not a question of what happened, because what happened was masking, shutdowns, social distancing, remote work, vaccinations etc. all of which reduced deaths. All the stuff fools like you fight tooth and nail.


Just spouting the Gov't BS and fear mongering.  Didn't change a damn thing.  It spreads like the Flu now and peeps like you think you can contain it.  You can't.

It's not a matter of IF YOU CATCH THE VIRUS.......IT'S A MATTER OF WHEN .....It's always been that way whether you like it or not

2 years you fuckers have been whining like bitches.  America is getting tired of your BS.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> It's been shown over and over again.  You've seen it.  From immunity to PROTECTION.


Dumbass thats not definition, thats an EXPLANATION to laymen what to expect from Covid-19 vaccinations. And yes, with new variants and info this has changed. None of that means vaccination is not well worth it, none of it means it is not saving many lives.


Definition of the word has not.









						Definition of VACCINE
					

a preparation that is administered (as by injection) to stimulate the body's immune response against a specific infectious agent or disease: such as… See the full definition




					www.merriam-webster.com


----------



## Flopper (Nov 29, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Data doesn't back your claim... "Clearly republicans have decided that more covid deaths..." Florida covid rates are among lowest in a nation.
> 
> When are you going to question Democrat governors decisions to put covid patients in nursing homes?
> 
> By the way, why do you think that what DeSantis is doing is a bad thing for Florida?


Florida death rate per hundred thousand from Covid as of Nov. 26th is certainly not one of the lowest in the country.  In fact, they are the 10th highest in deaths per hundred thousand in the country.
Florida case rate per hundred thousand from Covid as of Nov. 26th are certainly not one of the lowest in the country.  In fact, they are the 12 highest in the country.

*If we look at blue state vs red states...
Of the 10 states with the least covid deaths per hundred thousand, 8 out the 10 are blue state.
Of the 10 states with the least number of covid cases per hundred thousand, 10 out of 10 were blue states.*

The fact is republicans are most interested in relaxing restriction and stimulating the economy in their state because that is where the votes are.  The public is sick and tired wearing masks, social distancing, vaccinations, and other restrictions.  They are working to end the epidemic but are unpopular with voters. Although democrats have made the hard choices that are paying off in reducing covid and saving lives, I suspect that they will pay the price in upcoming elections.









						U.S. COVID death rate by state 2022 | Statista
					

As of August 2022, Mississippi had the highest COVID death rate in the U.S., with over 425 deaths per 100,000 population. Vermont had the lowest death rate.




					www.statista.com
				











						U.S. states with the highest COVID rates 2022 | Statista
					

As of Dec. 2022, two U.S. states had COVID rates higher than 41 cases per 100 population. Maryland had the lowest rate of cases.




					www.statista.com


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Cut the shit, are you or are you not saying that vaccine that wears off from 95% to 70% efficacy over time not worth getting?
> 
> Because 70% is a whole lot better than nothing.


As you ignore the natural immunity factor and studies that make your standard BS suck.

Time for people to tell you to fuck off......And all the other FAUCITES.........Yall have done enough damage already.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Dumbass thats not definition, thats an EXPLANATION to laymen what to expect from Covid-19 vaccinations.
> 
> Definition of the word is the same.
> 
> ...


It's been shown over and over.  But I'm sure daddy gov't is proud of you defending them so.  Maybe you bought stock in Gillead............and their Gov't chosen drug over cheap drugs that could have saved hundreds of thousands of lives.

But I guess you don't care about that.  They told you to attack those who don't agree so they can keep making billions off of those dying from their policies.


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Fear mongering and nothing more.


These are *YOUR NUMBERS* dummy.

How am I "fear mongering" by simply explaining to you what your very own numbers mean in terms of Covid-19 death expectancy?

I'm sorry doing basic math scared you so much.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 29, 2021)

Flopper said:


> Florida death rate per hundred thousand from Covid as of Nov. 26th is certainly not one of the lowest in the country.  In fact, they are the 10th highest in deaths per hundred thousand the country.
> Florida case rate per hundred thousand from Covid as of Nov. 26th are certainly not one of the lowest in the country.  In fact, they are the 12 highest in the country.
> 
> *If we look at blue state vs red states...
> ...



Interesting that you're not using CDC data. Why?

*CDC*

*



Wanna take guess where are the lowest rates?*


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Interesting that you're not using CDC data. Why?
> 
> *CDC*
> 
> ...


Death rate....death rate....concentrate now...he is talking about DEATH RATE.

Florida has accounted for 1/3 of all deaths in America last month, biggest Covid spike they've had since the start of the pandemic and you think thats a success story?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> These are *YOUR NUMBERS* dummy.
> 
> How am I "fear mongering" by simply explaining to you what your very own numbers mean in terms of Covid-19 death expectancy?
> 
> I'm sorry doing basic math scared you so much.


Yawn.  Your FEAR INCORPORATED doesn't work here.  2 years and you are still whining like a little bitch.


----------



## Ame®icano (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Death rate....death rate....concentrate now...he is talking about DEATH RATE.
> 
> Florida has accounted for 1/3 of all deaths in America last month, biggest Covid spike they've had since the start of the pandemic and you think thats a success story?



Is it that hard to select the "death" from pulldown menu?


----------



## AntonToo (Nov 29, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Yawn.  Your FEAR INCORPORATED doesn't work here.  2 years and you are still whining like a little bitch.


Yep, basic math = fear mongering. 

You've heard it here first ladies and gentlemen from our very own village idiot.


----------



## Wild Bill Kelsoe (Nov 29, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Cut the shit, are you or are you not saying that vaccine that wears off from 95% to 70% efficacy over time not worth getting?
> 
> Because 70% is a whole lot better than nothing.


No, I'm not saying that...lol.


----------



## Flopper (Nov 29, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Interesting that you're not using CDC data. Why?
> 
> *CDC*
> 
> ...


I have not found CDC data that has deaths and cases  per hundred thousand.  They show totals and those are misleading.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 8, 2021)

mikegriffith1 better question is WHY are you a dumbass who believes what the corporate controlled media tell you over the best doctors in the world.


----------



## Calypso Jones (Dec 11, 2021)

The Benefits of the vaxxine FAR outweigh the drawbacks..especially if you are in the politically elite class getting the B12 and/or Saline solution fake covid shots.   









						Baby of 'fully vaccinated' mom dies after born bleeding from mouth, nose: VAERS report - LifeSite
					

A two-year-old’s death which was then scrubbed from the website, a neonate’s hemorrhaging death, and an eight-year-old’s heart attack were among recent VAERS reports




					www.lifesitenews.com
				




The drawbacks are only important if it is YOUR CHILD.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 11, 2021)

Calypso Jones said:


> The Benefits of the vaxxine FAR outweigh the drawbacks..especially if you are in the politically elite class getting the B12 and/or Saline solution fake covid shots.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Slovenia COVID Scandal: Whistleblower Nurse Says Politicians Receive Saline Instead Of mRNA Vaccine​Thousands In Germany Thought They Had Their Vaccine. It May Have Been Saline Instead​


----------



## Flopper (Dec 11, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Slovenia COVID Scandal: Whistleblower Nurse Says Politicians Receive Saline Instead Of mRNA Vaccine​Thousands In Germany Thought They Had Their Vaccine. It May Have Been Saline Instead​


_LifeSiteNews_ (or simply LifeSite) is a Canadian Catholic far-right anti-abortion advocacy website and news publication. It has recently become anti-vax site.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 11, 2021)

Flopper said:


> _LifeSiteNews_ (or simply LifeSite) is a Canadian Catholic far-right anti-abortion advocacy website and news publication. It has recently become anti-vax site.


What that has to do with my post? 

By the way, is there any comment on NPR?


----------



## Flopper (Dec 11, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> What that has to do with my post?
> 
> By the way, is there any comment on NPR?


Sorry that was meant for someone else.  Saline in vaccines, fake cancer drugs, and doctored drugs are as old as medicine itself.  Sometimes it's intentional and sometimes it's a mistake.


----------



## Death Angel (Dec 11, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I am in Michigan. We are in a bad wave. Almost EVERYONE I know who has covid--and that is a lot of people--are fully vaccinated. My count is at least 10. *And yes, those who are fully vaccinated are obviously getting it AND transmitting it freely.*
> 
> I just posted a thread on this, but let's see if your mind is actually open to any information, or if you're just a Vaccine Cultist here to preach.


The bolded part is being denied by the pro-vaccine nazis. Getting this vaccine doesn't mean you won't get it or spread it.

But if you're looking at the actual evidence, if you've been vaccinated, and you do get the virus, you have a much better chance of having serious complications from the virus.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 11, 2021)

ding said:


> This says nothing about what the disease does.
> 
> This guy explains in exquisite detail what this disease is and how it does it.



They guy in your video is totally and completely wrong.
I have read hundreds of papers on covid-19, and not a one said it really does any harm at all, and all have said it is only the "cytokine storm", the over reaction by the immune system, by which all the damage is done and all the deaths caused.

If you want to learn how this  happens, then just seach on "covid, cytokine storm".
But here is the first one I ran into early on.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 11, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> The bolded part is being denied by the pro-vaccine nazis. Getting this vaccine doesn't mean you won't get it or spread it.
> 
> But if you're looking at the actual evidence, if you've been vaccinated, and you do get the virus, you have a much better chance of having serious complications from the virus.



Apparently only for about the first 4 months or so.
Then the vaccine no longer seems to have any effect.
And that is what we actually should expect, since the vaccines only promote spike protein production, which can't be remembered by the immune system T-cells or trigger on them later.


----------



## krichton (Dec 12, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> The bolded part is being denied by the pro-vaccine nazis. Getting this vaccine doesn't mean you won't get it or spread it.
> 
> But if you're looking at the actual evidence, if you've been vaccinated, and you do get the virus, you have a much better chance of having serious complications from the virus.



No one is denying it.  As long as you have 100 million unvaccinated ppl walking around infecting themselves and spreading it to everyone including the vaccinated you're going to have breakthroughs.  This is just basic common sense.   Although even those numbers are relatively low.  The only ppl having serious complications are the unvaccinated.   The vast majority of vaccinated individuals are healthy, even the ones who have breakthroughs.  

A new study out of NSW shows that two vaccinated individuals are up to 200x less likely to get covid from one another than two unvaccinated individuals.  So while it's true, that the vaccinated can potentially spread the virus, they are not what is driving the current pandemic.  Even with delta, a much more infectious virus, actual infections, hospitalizations and deaths are way down compared to this exact same time last year.  That's due to the vaccine, even in the face of a much more infectious virus.  Again, science wins out over facebook conspiracy theories.  









						Your unvaccinated friend is roughly 20 times more likely to give you COVID
					

Unvaccinated people are ten times more likely to contract COVID, and more likely to pass it on than vaccinated people.




					theconversation.com


----------



## DudleySmith (Dec 12, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Most right wing fads are like this level of mentality:






After all, they went to the same schools as  left wing deviants did.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 12, 2021)

krichton said:


> No one is denying it.  As long as you have 100 million unvaccinated ppl walking around infecting themselves and spreading it to everyone including the vaccinated you're going to have breakthroughs.  This is just basic common sense.   Although even those numbers are relatively low.  The only ppl having serious complications are the unvaccinated.   The vast majority of vaccinated individuals are healthy, even the ones who have breakthroughs.
> 
> A new study out of NSW shows that two vaccinated individuals are up to 200x less likely to get covid from one another than two unvaccinated individuals.  So while it's true, that the vaccinated can potentially spread the virus, they are not what is driving the current pandemic.  Even with delta, a much more infectious virus, actual infections, hospitalizations and deaths are way down compared to this exact same time last year.  That's due to the vaccine, even in the face of a much more infectious virus.  Again, science wins out over facebook conspiracy theories.
> 
> ...











						Fully Vaccinated Are COVID ‘Super-Spreaders,’ Says Inventor of mRNA Technology
					

By Jeremy Loffredo On the latest episode of “The Hidden Gateway” podcast, Dr. Robert Malone, recognized for his role in inventing mRNA vaccine technology, said, “The idea that if you have a workpla…




					stuartbramhall.wordpress.com
				




The vaccinated are actually the “super-spreaders” that everyone was told about in the beginning of the pandemic, Malone argued.

He said:

“If you consider the scientific fact that vaccinated people have less symptoms than the unvaccinated, but can still easily spread disease, consider your fellow vaccinated worker, whose unvaccinated son brought the disease home and gave it to him … He might not have any symptoms … but he’ll definitely be producing the virus. And he’s going to say, hey, I can go to work today. But he’s going to be spreading the virus like crazy.”

Malone also touched on the idea of “the noble lie:”

“If the government isn’t going to disclose to you what the [vaccine] risks are, and they’re not going to disclose to you what’s really going on because they think that you can’t handle the news … this is called the noble lie.”


Of course your side hates this guy.  He only was instrumental on the tech used for your precious vaccines.  He warned of their use because they have serious problems.  These vaccines fit the definition of Leaky Vaccines.  It has already been proven that vaccinated can spread the disease and have the same or greater viral loads.

You LAB RATS ARE THE SUPER SPREADERS.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 12, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> They guy in your video is totally and completely wrong.
> I have read hundreds of papers on covid-19, and not a one said it really does any harm at all, and all have said it is only the "cytokine storm", the over reaction by the immune system, by which all the damage is done and all the deaths caused.
> 
> If you want to learn how this  happens, then just seach on "covid, cytokine storm".
> But here is the first one I ran into early on.


And we have shown cheap drugs that can stop that storm if taken early.  Sending people home who are positive with nothing, and being told to wait til the oxygen level drops is AN INSANE STRATEGY.  Once they have trouble breathing the Storm is already there.  And the damage is already done.









						Early COVID-19 Therapy with Azithromycin Plus Nitazoxanide, Ivermectin or Hydroxychloroquine in Outpatient Settings Significantly Reduced Symptoms Compared to Known Outcomes in Untreated Patients
					

Background While there was a lack of pharmacological interventions proven to be effective in early, outpatient settings for COVID-19, in a prospective, open-label observational study (pre-AndroCoV Trial) the use of nitazoxanide, ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine demonstrated similar effects, and...




					www.medrxiv.org
				




*Conclusion* Apparent benefits of the combination between early detection and early pharmacological approaches for COVID-19 demonstrated to be consistent when when compared to different control groups of untreated patients. *The potential benefits could allow a large number of patients prevented from hospitalizations, deaths and persistent symptoms after COVID-19 remission.* The potential impact on COVID-19 disease course and numbers of negative outcomes and the well-established safety profile of the drugs proposed by the Pre-AndroCoV Trial led to ethical questions regarding the conduction of further placebo control randomized clinical trials (RCTs) for early COVID-19. *Early pharmacological approaches including azithromycin in combination with any of the options between nitazoxanide, ivermectin or optionally hydroxychloroquine should be considered for those diagnosed with COVID-19 presenting less than seven days of symptoms*. Of the three drugs, we opted for nitazoxanide, due to more extensive demonstration of _in vitro_ and _in vivo_ antiviral activity, proven efficacy against other viruses in humans, and steadier safety profile.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 12, 2021)

Nitazoxanide against COVID-19 in three explorative scenarios - PubMed
					

Nitazoxanide could be useful against COVID-19 as a safe and available regimen to be tested in a massive way immediately.




					pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




*Results: *The experience with a first group of 20 women, pregnant (17) or in immediate puerperium (3) was successful in 18 cases with two unfortunate deaths. The five cases treated in an Internal Medicine service showed a positive outcome with two patients weaned from mechanical ventilation. Of the remaining 16 patients treated in an ambulatory setting, all got cured. Nitazoxanide seems to be useful against SARS-CoV-2, not only in an early intervention but also in critical condition as well as in pregnancy without undesired effects for the babies. As an adjunctive therapy budesonide was used that seems to contribute to the clinical improvement.

*Conclusions: *Nitazoxanide could be useful against COVID-19 as a safe and available regimen to be tested in a massive way immediately.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 12, 2021)

A review on possible mechanistic insights of Nitazoxanide for repurposing in COVID-19
					

The global pandemic of Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) has brought the world to a grinding halt. A major cause of concern is the respiratory distress associated mortality attributed to the cytokine storm. Despite myriad rapidly approved clinical trials ...




					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




It has demonstrated broad spectrum antiviral efficacy _in vitro_, against a range of viruses including the respiratory syncytial virus, parainfluenza virus, coronavirus (CoV), rotavirus, norovirus, hepatitis B virus (HBV), hepatitis C virus (HCV), dengue virus, yellow fever virus, Japanese encephalitis virus, and human immunodeficiency virus (HIV). Furthermore, clinical trials suggested the potential role of nitazoxanide in gastroenteritis, hepatitis and influenza (Rossignol, 2014).* A significant finding *is the ability of nitazoxanide to promote balance between pro-inflammatory and anti-inflammatory responses in humans, which could play a crucial role in *COVID-19 by curbing the hyperinflammatory cytokine storm*

It was used for MERs.  And it kills the storm which kills you.  Early in this study it EXPLAINS THAT.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 12, 2021)

Nitazox - 500mg Tablet
					

Save up to 85% on your purchase. Save and buy straight from the source.



					bacinmotion.com
				




Here is that product for 79 cents.  Imagine that.  No money in it is there for PHARMA


----------



## ding (Dec 12, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> They guy in your video is totally and completely wrong.
> I have read hundreds of papers on covid-19, and not a one said it really does any harm at all, and all have said it is only the "cytokine storm", the over reaction by the immune system, by which all the damage is done and all the deaths caused.
> 
> If you want to learn how this  happens, then just seach on "covid, cytokine storm".
> But here is the first one I ran into early on.


You should contact Professor Roger Seheult, MD.


----------



## Death Angel (Dec 12, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> Most right wing fads are like this level of mentality:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You MANDATE clowns just don't get CHOICE. Just admit you want a STALINIST, ANTI-FREEDOM State

You want to be BULLIED by your own damn government UNTIL a RIGHT OF CENTER president is elected, then we can expect RIOTS masquerading as "protests" and burning our cities and murdering our citizens.


----------



## miketx (Dec 12, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


So you bought into the media bullshit. How nice.


----------



## DudleySmith (Dec 12, 2021)

Death Angel said:


> You MANDATE clowns just don't get CHOICE. Just admit you want a STALINIST, ANTI-FREEDOM State
> 
> You want to be BULLIED by your own damn government UNTIL a RIGHT OF CENTER president is elected, then we can expect RIOTS masquerading as "protests" and burning our cities and murdering our citizens.



Fuck you, I've never said anything in support of mandates. Strawmen are  another feature of right wing idiocy. There really is no difference in the results of right or left wing nutjobbery.


----------



## Calypso Jones (Dec 12, 2021)

Govern me HARDER, Daddy.

Enough is ENOUGH


----------



## boedicca (Dec 12, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Lets put your statement to a test.
> 
> Left claim is that more intelligent people support democrats, including around half of whites, nearly 95% of blacks, and nearly 90% academia.
> 
> ...




Correction:  he is going to enjoy a lifetime of Immunity as a Service shots due the Vaxx ruining his immune system.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 12, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The flu shot is a vaccine.


 
Yes it is.  But the Pfizer and Moderna Vaxxes are not vaccines. They are mRNA based medical treatments that damage one's immune system.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 12, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Neither is fake.
> 
> MRNA vaccine research is decades old.
> 
> ...



Yes, it is.  And mRNA research to produce vaccines for animals has been a disaster.  The animal subjects die at very high rates.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 12, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Correction:  he is going to enjoy a lifetime of Immunity as a Service shots due the Vaxx ruining his immune system.



Sounds like a paid subscription.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 13, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Yes it is.  But the Pfizer and Moderna Vaxxes are not vaccines. They are mRNA based medical treatments that damage one's immune system.


They are vaccines and they do no such thing


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 13, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Yes, it is.  And mRNA research to produce vaccines for animals has been a disaster.  The animal subjects die at very high rates.


Care to prove that?


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 13, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> They are vaccines and they do no such thing


FDA had to change the definition of what vaccine is to be able to fit mRNA chemicals into it.

Even J&J shot is not a vaccine, since it doesn't deliver what vaccine suppose to deliver, dead or depleted virus, but it's vector tech that delivers only the spike to your cells and it still fuses to your cell walls, which eventually will cause blood clots and reward you with a heart attack in few years.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 13, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> FDA had to change the definition of what vaccine is to be able to fit mRNA chemicals into it.
> 
> Even J&J shot is not a vaccine, since it doesn't deliver what vaccine suppose to deliver, dead or depleted virus, but it's vector tech that delivers only the spike to your cells and it still fuses to your cell walls, which eventually will cause blood clots and reward you with a heart attack in few years.


The change actually made the definition more accurate since there has never been a vaccine in existence that ever provided 100% immunity


----------



## Delldude (Dec 13, 2021)

DudleySmith said:


> Fuck you, I've never said anything in support of mandates. Strawmen are  another feature of right wing idiocy. There really is no difference in the results of right or left wing nutjobbery.


Should be 'fuck you, sir'.


----------



## Delldude (Dec 13, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> FDA had to change the definition of what vaccine is to be able to fit mRNA chemicals into it.
> 
> Even J&J shot is not a vaccine, since it doesn't deliver what vaccine suppose to deliver, dead or depleted virus, but it's vector tech that delivers only the spike to your cells and it still fuses to your cell walls, which eventually will cause blood clots and reward you with a heart attack in few years.


Better to put your faith in science, er, I mean windmill profits and get all three jabs and catch the 'Rona.

Ever stop and think Big Pharma puts out a jab, knowing quite well what the true infection and contagion rate is 

and it ends up you were no better off in the first place with or without a jab?

Wouldn't surprise me in the least.


----------



## DGS49 (Dec 13, 2021)

Leftists cannot understand the concept of "*assumption of risk*."

If I am a healthy adult, and know that my chances of getting sick enough to DIE from Covid (regardless of the strain or "variant") are, say, one in a hundred thousand, I might very well decide that I would rather not be bothered with vaccines or masks or social distancing; I WILL ASSUME THE RISK.

But Leftists wail, "WHAT ABOUT THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU?"  Well, they can decide for themselves whether to take precautions and what precautions to take.  If THEY are vulnerable due to age or medical condition, then THEY need to take whatever precautions THEY deem necessary. I will tell them that I (speaking hypothetically here - I am vaccinated to hell and gone) am not vaccinated, and I promiscuously gather, unprotected, with other unvaccinated people, so they might want to take extra precautions around me.

Assuming this risk is an entirely rational choice, like choosing to ride a motorcycle, or skydiving, or driving too fast on the road.  If you don't like it, then take precautions to protect yourself.  What could be simpler than that?


----------



## OhPleaseJustQuit (Dec 13, 2021)

DGS49 said:


> Leftists cannot understand the concept of "*assumption of risk*."
> 
> If I am a healthy adult, and know that my chances of getting sick enough to DIE from Covid (regardless of the strain or "variant") are, say, one in a hundred thousand, I might very well decide that I would rather not be bothered with vaccines or masks or social distancing; I WILL ASSUME THE RISK.
> 
> ...


Spoiled children who have never been taught that they must accept personal responsibility for anything.

I want them out of my country.  When's the divorce final?


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 13, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> The change actually made the definition more accurate since there has never been a vaccine in existence that ever provided 100% immunity


"actually" 

When leftist zombie uses "actually" to "explain" something, you know it's gonna be either a lie, or a talking point (which is also a lie).

Nope, the change made it fit the narrative. The old description is the only one that explain what vaccine is, since mRNA shot is not the vaccine.

Mental midget such as yourself can't process that.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 13, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> They are vaccines and they do no such thing




No, they are not vaccines.  The CDC changed the definition of vaccines so that these mRNA treatments could be considered "vaccines".   They are an experiment, and they are failing.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 13, 2021)

krichton said:


> No one is denying it.  As long as you have 100 million unvaccinated ppl walking around infecting themselves and spreading it to everyone including the vaccinated you're going to have breakthroughs.  This is just basic common sense.   Although even those numbers are relatively low.  The only ppl having serious complications are the unvaccinated.   The vast majority of vaccinated individuals are healthy, even the ones who have breakthroughs.
> 
> A new study out of NSW shows that two vaccinated individuals are up to 200x less likely to get covid from one another than two unvaccinated individuals.  So while it's true, that the vaccinated can potentially spread the virus, they are not what is driving the current pandemic.  Even with delta, a much more infectious virus, actual infections, hospitalizations and deaths are way down compared to this exact same time last year.  That's due to the vaccine, even in the face of a much more infectious virus.  Again, science wins out over facebook conspiracy theories.
> 
> ...



Wrong on all counts.

First of all, the evidence shows the vaccines have no useful effect after about 5 months.
All they do is temporarily stimulate antibody production, and do not at all enter T-cell memory.

Second is that the unvaccinated are developing immunity that the vaccinated are not getting, because recovery immunity does get into T-cell memory and is permanent.
It is the 100 million unvaccinated are who will achieve herd immunity and end this epidemic, through recovery immunity.
Those getting vaccinated are accomplishing nothing except hiding out from it.
They are not getting immunity from their mRNA injections.


----------



## Flopper (Dec 13, 2021)

krichton said:


> No one is denying it.  As long as you have 100 million unvaccinated ppl walking around infecting themselves and spreading it to everyone including the vaccinated you're going to have breakthroughs.  This is just basic common sense.   Although even those numbers are relatively low.  The only ppl having serious complications are the unvaccinated.   The vast majority of vaccinated individuals are healthy, even the ones who have breakthroughs.
> 
> A new study out of NSW shows that two vaccinated individuals are up to 200x less likely to get covid from one another than two unvaccinated individuals.  So while it's true, that the vaccinated can potentially spread the virus, they are not what is driving the current pandemic.  Even with delta, a much more infectious virus, actual infections, hospitalizations and deaths are way down compared to this exact same time last year.  That's due to the vaccine, even in the face of a much more infectious virus.  Again, science wins out over facebook conspiracy theories.
> 
> ...


Although breakthrough cases can spread the virus, the viral load that is transmitted is likely to be very small compared to unvaccinated who become ill with the virus.   The viral load you receive is a very important factor in determining how your body respond to it.


----------



## Flopper (Dec 13, 2021)

ding said:


> You should contact Professor Roger Seheult, MD.


My understanding that in serious cases where lung size expands and O2 levels in blood are well below normal, the immune system is overreacts and often leads to death.

The immune system storm (cytokine) is a very serious problem but it typically comes not in the earliest stages but in the latter stages of the disease.  If someone is peddling a cure, then they are surely charlatans


----------



## Flopper (Dec 13, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> FDA had to change the definition of what vaccine is to be able to fit mRNA chemicals into it.
> 
> Even J&J shot is not a vaccine, since it doesn't deliver what vaccine suppose to deliver, dead or depleted virus, but it's vector tech that delivers only the spike to your cells and it still fuses to your cell walls, which eventually will cause blood clots and reward you with a heart attack in few years.


It Was the CDC not the FDA.
After covid-19 vaccines were introduced, and it was discovered that they do not necessarily "prevent disease" or "provide immunity", the CDC altered the definition of vaccines again to say that they simply "produce protection"." The Covid vaccines, flu vaccines, Tetanus and in fact most vaccine do not make you immune to the disease at some point you need another vaccination.  The immune system memory in the B and T cells does not last a lifetime for all diseases.  Covid-19 and Flu shots will provide protection falling to about 40% to 50% after 6 months.  The MMR vaccine is very effective at protecting people against measles, mumps, and rubella and it lasts a lifetime.

Scientist don't know why our immune system memory dulls after 6 months for the flu or Covid and last a life time for other pathogen.


----------



## krichton (Dec 14, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Apparently only for about the first 4 months or so.
> Then the vaccine no longer seems to have any effect.
> And that is what we actually should expect, since the vaccines only promote spike protein production, which can't be remembered by the immune system T-cells or trigger on them later.



Study after study has shown that tcell immunity is both present in naturally infected and vaccinated individuals equally.   There is no difference between the amount or the antibodies themselves, according to the evidence.  This is a another silly junk science lie debunked by real science, and facts.  Furthermore, tcell immunity against a coronavirus is next to useless for protection against infection anyway, especially when coronaviruses attack humans in our upper respiratory tracts.  You will get infected, you just won't get seriously ill and die because your tcell antibodies will come to the rescue eventually.   



Rigby5 said:


> They guy in your video is totally and completely wrong.
> I have read hundreds of papers on covid-19, and not a one said it really does any harm at all, and all have said it is only the "cytokine storm", the over reaction by the immune system, by which all the damage is done and all the deaths caused.
> 
> If you want to learn how this  happens, then just seach on "covid, cytokine storm".
> But here is the first one I ran into early on.



It's as if everyone, including the world's leading scientists, virologists, vaccinologists are ALL WRONG, except you!  You should be leading the fight against covid19!  Please head straight to the cdc now and make them see reason!!!     




eagle1462010 said:


> Fully Vaccinated Are COVID ‘Super-Spreaders,’ Says Inventor of mRNA Technology
> 
> 
> By Jeremy Loffredo On the latest episode of “The Hidden Gateway” podcast, Dr. Robert Malone, recognized for his role in inventing mRNA vaccine technology, said, “The idea that if you have a workpla…
> ...



Malone is a ivermectin pushing crack whore, who's now a regular on every wacked out anti vax podcast you can find.  I wouldnt be surprised to see him on Alex Jones, so it's no wonder the woefully ignorant would continue to champion him as their leading "expert" on all things covid.  How much do you want to bet he's gotten one of the mrna vaccines. Yet no one who follows him religiously would give a shit.   This pandemic has given him the notoriety he's always wanted, but in a different way, but hey, fame is fame amirite? However, what you quoted from Malone is correct, vaccinated individuals do have less symptoms.  That's because by day 3, the virus is already being slaughtered and viral load is dropping preciptuosly during the course of the next few days.  Meanwhile in unvaxxed individuals covid is replicating exponentially, in the absense of a single antibody.   Gee, i wonder who's a lot more likely to spread the virus.


----------



## krichton (Dec 14, 2021)

Flopper said:


> It Was the CDC not the FDA.
> After covid-19 vaccines were introduced, and it was discovered that they do not necessarily "prevent disease" or "provide immunity", the CDC altered the definition of vaccines again to say that they simply "produce protection"." The Covid vaccines, flu vaccines, Tetanus and in fact most vaccine do not make you immune to the disease at some point you need another vaccination.  The immune system memory in the B and T cells does not last a lifetime for all diseases.  Covid-19 and Flu shots will provide protection falling to about 40% to 50% after 6 months.  The MMR vaccine is very effective at protecting people against measles, mumps, and rubella and it lasts a lifetime.
> 
> Scientist don't know why our immune system memory dulls after 6 months for the flu or Covid and last a life time for other pathogen.



I don't think that's whats happening.  Early evidence is showing very strong tcell memory.  I think the first problem we're dealing with is that the vaccine was made specifically against the alpha strain.  It's not unusual to see more infections and breakthroughs as a result of this, although i would say it's still incredibly effective.  The second problem is, we have 100 million ppl walking around refusing to be vaccinated.   If we were experiencing a smallpox outbreak on the same scale as covid, we would be seeing tons of ppl getting smallpox even in vaccinated populations, they simply wouldn't get severe forms of the disease or die from it, much like what is happening now with those who are vaccinated but had breakthroughs.   The last and most important problem is, this is a coronavirus, this is a disease that attacks us through our lungs and science has never discovered a means to provide a vaccine that protects us in the same way it does with other viruses.  I think the recent drive to develop nasal spray vaccines and nasal spray treatments as a means of prevention may be the key as that actually keeps the virus out of our lungs.  Putin has already got himself one.


----------



## Mac-7 (Dec 14, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Pulled out of my ass? How do you know that exactly?
> 
> Did you ask me? Did you look them up yourself? Nope.
> 
> ...


Your “proof” is a poll?

Thats not proof because polls are often inaccurate or biased


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> "actually"
> 
> When leftist zombie uses "actually" to "explain" something, you know it's gonna be either a lie, or a talking point (which is also a lie).
> 
> ...


So now I'm a leftist?

The other day one of you idiots was calling me a Trumper.

And yes the new shots are vaccines and every scientist, virologist and doctor will tell you the same thing


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> No, they are not vaccines.  The CDC changed the definition of vaccines so that these mRNA treatments could be considered "vaccines".   They are an experiment, and they are failing.


You're still wrong.

And I'm still waiting for your proof that lab animals die at far greater rates from mRNA vaccines


----------



## SweetSue92 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> They are vaccines and they do no such thing



Cardiovascular diseases, autoimmune disease, and soft tissue cancers. Yep


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Cardiovascular diseases, autoimmune disease, and soft tissue cancers. Yep


OK where is your scientific proof that an mRNA vaccine causes cancer or autoimmune diseases?

And the RARE cases of Myocarditis and Pericarditis are acute cases and will heal themselves.  And a COVID infection carries a far greater risk of myocarditis than does the vaccine.

And fyi the risk of heart inflammation is about .017%


----------



## SweetSue92 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> OK where is your scientific proof that an mRNA vaccine causes cancer or autoimmune diseases?
> 
> And the RARE cases of Myocarditis and Pericarditis are acute cases and will heal themselves.  And a COVID infection carries a far greater risk of myocarditis than does the vaccine.
> 
> And fyi the risk of heart inflammation is about .017%



Don't have time to hunt it all down here. Follow molecular biologist Gabor Erdosi on Twitter. More and more scientists are seeing the warning signs now.


----------



## AntonToo (Dec 14, 2021)

Mac-7 said:


> Your “proof” is a poll?
> 
> Thats not proof because polls are often inaccurate or biased


Yes dummy, serious polling is how we know things like party identification.

That is the best information and that is what I believe. You believe whatever the fuck your little heart desires.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Dec 14, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Yes dummy, serious polling is how we know things like party identification.
> 
> That is the best information and that is what I believe. You believe whatever the fuck your little heart desires.





antontoo said:


> Yes dummy, serious polling is how we know things like party identification.
> 
> That is the best information and that is what I believe. You believe whatever the fuck your little heart desires.



You can also see how much people REALLY trust these vaccines by what they're willing to do to their kids. In my state, a month after they have been available everywhere, only 1 in 5 children age 5 to 11 has had their first shot.

Confidence level: not that great, I would say. Also reflective of how ineffective the "Covid is killing kids" campaign has been--not very.


----------



## krichton (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> OK where is your scientific proof that an mRNA vaccine causes cancer or autoimmune diseases?
> 
> And the RARE cases of Myocarditis and Pericarditis are acute cases and will heal themselves.  And a COVID infection carries a far greater risk of myocarditis than does the vaccine.
> 
> And fyi the risk of heart inflammation is about .017%



It says it in all the memes posted on facebook.  What more proof would you need, amirite?

yes, we're talking several hundred cases, which is insanely small, but I would recommend children and younger adults take either astrazeneca or J&J if they want to lower those odds even further.


----------



## krichton (Dec 14, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Wrong on all counts.
> 
> First of all, the evidence shows the vaccines have no useful effect after about 5 months.
> All they do is temporarily stimulate antibody production, and do not at all enter T-cell memory.
> ...



This is what you call passing along misinformation.  Where are the studies that show this.  Post your evidence that the mrna vaccines don't produce any tcell antibodies.  I'll wait.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> So now I'm a leftist?
> 
> The other day one of you idiots was calling me a Trumper.
> 
> And yes the new shots are vaccines and every scientist, virologist and doctor will tell you the same thing



Let me fix that for you: "every scientist, virologist and doctor *on Pfizer payroll* will tell you the same thing"


----------



## OhPleaseJustQuit (Dec 14, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Let me fix that for you: "every scientist, virologist and doctor *on Pfizer payroll* will tell you the same thing"


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> OK where is your scientific proof that an mRNA vaccine causes cancer or autoimmune diseases?
> 
> And the RARE cases of Myocarditis and Pericarditis are acute cases and will heal themselves.  And a COVID infection carries a far greater risk of myocarditis than does the vaccine.
> 
> And fyi the risk of heart inflammation is about .017%


​Teens recover quickly from rare post-vaccine heart inflammation, study says​Rare blood clots more likely after COVID-19 infection than from vaccine, report finds​Nevada teen suffers seizures, extremely rare brain clots after Johnson & Johnson vaccine​DoD Confirms: Rare Heart Inflammation Cases Linked to COVID-19 Vaccines​*Comirnaty and Spikevax: possible link to very rare cases of myocarditis and pericarditis*.





You're trying to sound like you know what you're talking about, but in reality you're just parroting media lies. 

So many articles about something that suppose to be so rare, that normally you wouldn't even care about. Media and government are downplaying it to something that you shouldn't worry about, that if happens you can fully recover, again depending what they mean by that. I believe the full recovery is considered if the patient has no further advancement of the illness and can get off the prescription. Of course, they don't mean that.

Myocarditis and myopericarditis are a serious problems and will ruin your heart in under a decade. Your heart doesn't just "recover", it scars. When caught early, the inflammation will not cause big damage when treated, you could be as good as new. If you have some damage to the heart, you will have to live on prescription made by the same vaccine makers, possible for the rest of your life, and not just that... You have to alter every aspect of your life. Physical exertion is gone when troponin levels are high. A heart attack becomes a real threat and heart failure almost inevitable. How long you can live like that... 5, 10, 20 years. Tell that to teenager, and ask the same teenager, or anyone who took the shot, is that what you signed for when you agreed to take it?

The heart is like a well balanced machine, the left and right side operate in harmony. When one side is damaged, the other side must work harder to pick up the slack which will result in early failure. Now imagine a helicopter, it runs perfectly well and the propellers are functioning as intended. But if you remove the dynamic balancing mechanisms that keep vibrations from growing strong enough to make the blades flail widely, if you get it out of balance, you can expect a failure in seconds. Myocarditis in kids was something almost unheard of, and now is common due to the mRNA "vaccines".

For anyone interested in more, read it *here*.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> You're still wrong.
> 
> And I'm still waiting for your proof that lab animals die at far greater rates from mRNA vaccines



Marek's disease mRNA vaccine is leaky, just like the Covid one, and 

"Over the past fifty years, Marek’s disease—an illness of fowl—has become fouler. Marek’s is caused by a highly contagious virus, related to those that cause herpes in humans. It spreads through the dust of contaminated chicken coops, and caused both paralysis and cancer. In the 1970s, new vaccines brought the disease the under control. But Marek’s didn’t go gently into that good night. Within ten years, it started evolving into more virulent strains, which now trigger more severe cancers and afflict chickens at earlier ages.

Andrew Read from Pennsylvania State University thinks that the vaccines were responsible. The Marek’s vaccine is “imperfect” or “leaky.” That is, it protects chickens from developing disease, but doesn’t stop them from becoming infected or from spreading the virus. Inadvertently, this made it easier for the most virulent strains to survive. Such strains would normally kill their hosts so quickly that they’d die out. But in an immunised flock, they can persist because their lethal nature has been neutered. That’s not a problem for vaccinated individuals. But unvaccinated birds are now in serious trouble."









						Leaky Vaccines Enhance Spread of Deadlier Chicken Viruses
					

Over the past fifty years, Marek’s disease—an illness of fowl—has become fouler. Marek’s is caused by a highly contagious virus, related to those that cause herpes in humans. It spreads through the dust of contaminated chicken coops, and caused both paralysis and cancer. In the 1970s, new...




					www.nationalgeographic.com
				












						Integrated analysis of lncRNA and mRNA repertoires in Marek's disease infected spleens identifies genes relevant to resistance - PubMed
					

Our results provide both transcriptomic and epigenetic insights on MD resistance and its pathological mechanism. The comprehensive lncRNA and mRNA transcriptomes in MDV-infected chicken spleens were profiled. Co-expression analysis identified integrated lncRNA-mRNA and gene-gene interaction...




					pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Don't have time to hunt it all down here. Follow molecular biologist Gabor Erdosi on Twitter. More and more scientists are seeing the warning signs now.


Nope I don't do Twitter Facebook or any other  of that shit.

If you can't support your claims then don;t make them


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Marek's disease mRNA vaccine is leaky, just like the Covid one, and
> 
> "Over the past fifty years, Marek’s disease—an illness of fowl—has become fouler. Marek’s is caused by a highly contagious virus, related to those that cause herpes in humans. It spreads through the dust of contaminated chicken coops, and caused both paralysis and cancer. In the 1970s, new vaccines brought the disease the under control. But Marek’s didn’t go gently into that good night. Within ten years, it started evolving into more virulent strains, which now trigger more severe cancers and afflict chickens at earlier ages.
> 
> ...


So an illness that only affects birds.

IOW completely irrelevant to humans.

How about a documentation of all those HUMAN deaths directly attributed to the vaccine?


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> ​Teens recover quickly from rare post-vaccine heart inflammation, study says​Rare blood clots more likely after COVID-19 infection than from vaccine, report finds​Nevada teen suffers seizures, extremely rare brain clots after Johnson & Johnson vaccine​DoD Confirms: Rare Heart Inflammation Cases Linked to COVID-19 Vaccines​*Comirnaty and Spikevax: possible link to very rare cases of myocarditis and pericarditis*.
> 
> View attachment 575620
> 
> ...


Since when does the number of articles have anything to do with the ACTUAL PERENTAGE of occurrences?

There is a .017% chance of any endocarditis from a Covid vaccine.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

COVID-19 Vaccines: Myth Versus Fact
					

Two of our experts review some common myths circulating about the vaccine and clear up confusion with reliable facts.




					www.hopkinsmedicine.org


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Dec 14, 2021)

krichton said:


> This is what you call passing along misinformation.  Where are the studies that show this.  Post your evidence that the mrna vaccines don't produce any tcell antibodies.  I'll wait.



Killer T cells are created in the bone marrow and clear infections after they have started. Helper Ts stimulate production of antibodies and fighter Ts.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> So an illness that only affects birds.
> 
> IOW completely irrelevant to humans.
> 
> How about a documentation of all those HUMAN deaths directly attributed to the vaccine?



Grasping at straws bub?  The problems with mRNA vaccines have been recognized for years.

"From the start, Moderna’s scientists knew that using mRNA to spur protein production would be a tough task, so they scoured the medical literature for diseases that might be treated with just small amounts of additional protein.

“And that list of diseases is very, very short,” said the former employee who described Bancel as needing a Hail Mary.

Crigler-Najjar was the lowest-hanging fruit.

*Yet Moderna could not make its therapy work, former employees and collaborators said. The safe dose was too weak, and repeat injections of a dose strong enough to be effective had troubling effects on the liver in animal studies.*"









						Lavishly funded Moderna hits safety problems in bold bid to revolutionize medicine
					

Moderna Therapeutics, the most highly valued private company in biotech, has run into troubling safety problems with its most ambitious therapy, STAT found.




					www.statnews.com


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Grasping at straws bub?  The problems with mRNA vaccines have been recognized for years.
> 
> "From the start, Moderna’s scientists knew that using mRNA to spur protein production would be a tough task, so they scoured the medical literature for diseases that might be treated with just small amounts of additional protein.
> 
> ...


mRNA research is decades old.









						The Long History of mRNA Vaccines | Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health
					

A look at how this vaccine technology has been in the works for decades.




					publichealth.jhu.edu


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> mRNA research is decades old.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Research is not the same as safe and effective vaccines.

Companies such as Moderna have been trying to find a way to profit from mRNA. This is all about money and power, not public health.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Research is not the same as safe and effective vaccines.
> 
> Companies such as Moderna have been trying to find a way to profit from mRNA. This is all about money and power, not public health.


Yeah OK  I suppose you want the government to do all medical research then.


----------



## Briss (Dec 14, 2021)

Flopper said:


> If someone is peddling a cure, then they are surely charlatans


You mean like Pfizer?  They're peddling an experimental injection that doesn't confer immunity and wanes in short order, but calling it a vaccine anyway.  And they want everyone to keep taking it indefinitely.

What with Pfizer's criminal rap sheet, one has to wonder what's wrong with people who look to them for answers to their health problems.


----------



## Briss (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> mRNA research is decades old.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And yet they couldn't get it approved . . .


----------



## Oldestyle (Dec 14, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Why should I be forced to get an untested vaccine when I've already HAD Covid and have natural immunity, Mike?  In what way does that make any sense at all?


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Briss said:


> And yet they couldn't get it approved . . .


But they did.  There were no shortcuts in the FDA approval process only some overlapping of the trial phases so as to speed up the whole process

 And in fact there was an Ebola mRNA vaccine produced and used in Africa before the Covid vaccine  if you read the article you would have know that


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Yeah OK  I suppose you want the government to do all medical research then.



Omigoodness!  What do you think is happening right now?   The Vaxx is a giant clinical trial sponsored by the government.  The Pharmas have been given complete immunity for any damage the vaxxes cause.  And note, the NIH is part owner of the Moderna Vaxx.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> But they did.
> 
> in fact there was an Ebola mRNA vaccine produced and used in Africa before the Covid vaccine  if you read the article you would have know that



This is America and Covid is not Ebola.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Omigoodness!  What do you think is happening right now?   The Vaxx is a giant clinical trial sponsored by the government.  The Pharmas have been given complete immunity for any damage the vaxxes cause.  And note, the NIH is part owner of the Moderna Vaxx.



So then there should be no medical research because no one can make a profit on it and the government can't do it.

You better stop using all drugs and refuse any prescriptions your Dr might give you.

Oh but wait your Dr is making money off your health care so you better not use his or her services either.

And I'll trust Johns Hopkins medical school over an anonymous internet poster any day of the week


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

badbob85037 said:


> Maybe if you personally knew ones killed by this vaccine it would change the way you think. If it is such a wonder drug we are just suppose to over look the deaths associated with this miracle vaccine.  I  haven't shut myself in my house and by everything I have learned in life there is no way a virus can be stopped by a piece of cotton but fear is a great thing and I think some would eat shit if some one were told it would save them. If this virus or poison were as spread as bad as it does I would be dead. I know no one who has died from this virus   including ones over 80 years old. But I do know ones in their 20's dying of the cure. And what the hell is this booster bull shit? The pharmaceutical industry is not your friend. They care as much as Joe if you live or die. Drugs that have thousands of law suits against them are still being passed off as miracle dugs. Take the over 200 drugs to cure a chemical imbalance, you know the ones that have been involved in EVERY school shooting since the 50's. How many elected officials have called out these drugs as nothing but poisons? None they blame a piece of steel. Mercury, is poison and belong to nothing we eat. Prozac was used by NAZIS in WWII to make their victims go mad. But these poisons are used to cure  a  chemical imbalance. No one on Earth even knows what a chemical imbalance is. Ya just might think this would explain  these crazed ass holes that burn down schools or go through a mall hacking anyone in sight in places that don't have a Second Amendment? Just take your poison and shut up and if you die you can count on your media to cover it up. All at the FDA have financial ties to the drug industry. These drugs are approved by the FDA twice as fast and twice as many.The average profit of each poison to cure a  chemical imbalance is $6.5 million a day with over a million people around the earth prescribed these poisons. Remember when we had home remedies that was always at the store and always worked? They all one day vanished because these small manufactures didn't have the funds to spend millions to prove these home remedies worked.
> 
> The  pharmaceutical industry is the number one lobbyist spending 7 times that of number two and with profits of hundreds of billions a year is plenty to butter every palm that comes along. Government is not Godly or a saint. Unless you know anyone in government that hasn't retired without riches beyond anyone's dream including that fuck Joe.


Millions of people dying from the vaccine is the biggest hoax of the 21st century.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> This is America and Covid is not Ebola.


Still a virus and it was still a vaccine.


----------



## Oldestyle (Dec 14, 2021)

The only thing you have to know about the "vaccines", to understand that they do pose risks for those who take them, is that the companies who made them asked for complete immunity from litigation from those who take the shot.


----------



## Briss (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> But they did.  There were no shortcuts in the FDA approval process only some overlapping of the trial phases so as to speed up the whole process
> 
> And in fact there was an Ebola mRNA vaccine produced and used in Africa before the Covid vaccine  if you read the article you would have know that


You're making excuses for the fact that it required emergency-authorization because it was not authorized.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> So then there should be no medical research because no one can make a profit on it and the government can't do it.
> 
> You better stop using all drugs and refuse any prescriptions your Dr might give you.
> 
> ...




That is a total strawman.   

The issues with the Vaxx are twofold:  Lack of Informed Consent and Government Mandates.   The entire Vaxx situation violates the first and is an abuse of power for the second.   Nor are either necessary in order for proper medical research to be undertaken.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Briss said:


> You're making excuses for the fact that it required emergency-authorization because it was not authorized.


And then shortly after that it got full authorization, no excuses needed.


----------



## Briss (Dec 14, 2021)

Oldestyle said:


> The only thing you have to know about the "vaccines", to understand that they do pose risks for those who take them, is that the companies who made them asked for complete immunity from litigation from those who take the shot.


Plus, the companies making the experimental injection are proven liars and cheats.  They're crooks . . .


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> That is a total strawman.
> 
> The issues with the Vaxx are twofold:  Lack of Informed Consent and Government Mandates.   The entire Vaxx situation violates the first and is an abuse of power for the second.   Nor are either necessary in order for proper medical research to be undertaken.


No one is being forced to get a vaccine

Stop making shit up


----------



## Mac-7 (Dec 14, 2021)

antontoo said:


> Yes dummy,


Fuck off asshole


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Millions of people dying from the vaccine is the biggest hoax of the 21st century.



Pfizer has reported over 1,200 vaxx deaths to FDA for the first 90 days of use.

Up until now, vaccines with 50 deaths have been pulled from the market.

This is the biggest Human Rights Abuse in history.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Pfizer has reported over 1,200 vaxx deaths to FDA for the first 90 days of use.
> 
> Up until now, vaccines with 50 deaths have been pulled from the market.
> 
> This is the biggest Human Rights Abuse in history.


LINK


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> LINK



Easy Peasy Lemon Squeezy:  note FATAL







			https://phmpt.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/5.3.6-postmarketing-experience.pdf


----------



## Briss (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> And then shortly after that it got full authorization, no excuses needed.


Did you know that your trusted FDA was unaware of the fact that the PCR-test was a stupid choice to determine spread?  Actually, they were aware, but they're hoping that that doesn't diminish their reputation in your eyes.

I don't think they have anything to worry about.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> So an illness that only affects birds.
> 
> IOW completely irrelevant to humans.
> 
> How about a documentation of all those HUMAN deaths directly attributed to the vaccine?


Damn, the worst part is not that you're stupid, but that you don't know that you're stupid.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Since when does the number of articles have anything to do with the ACTUAL PERENTAGE of occurrences?
> 
> There is a .017% chance of any endocarditis from a Covid vaccine.


Let me guess, Pfizer say so?


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Easy Peasy Lemon Squeezy:  note FATAL
> 
> View attachment 575651
> 
> ...


Within 90 days of getting the shot.

There is no direct evidence that the vaccine was the sole cause of deaths

7500 people die every day in the US so in 90 days 675000 people die.

Now for your claims to be true that it was the vaccine that killed them you have to prove those people would not have died anyway


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Let me guess, Pfizer say so?


No that was


Ame®icano said:


> Let me guess, Pfizer say so?


nope

The NIH









						Myocarditis, Pericarditis and Cardiomyopathy After COVID-19 Vaccination
					






					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




*These reported cases of temporally associated possible myocarditis/pericarditis and their clinical course are being evaluated and may be an overestimate of the incidence; however, if all these events are confirmed as likely vaccination complications, this represents an incidence of 13.5 per million doses administered*

So I was wrong the incidence of myocarditis is actually .00135%


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Within 90 days of getting the shot.
> 
> There is no direct evidence that the vaccine was the sole cause of deaths
> 
> ...




Oh puhleeze.  This is Pfizer reporting results to the FDA from the use of the vaccine.  The FATALS are deaths caused by the vaccine.

Haven't you wondered why they want to hide the records for 75 years?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> That True..........you were doing good til that.  Have yo figured out cycles and PCR tests yet?


Why should he?  You have no clue as to what you are talking about either!


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> Let me guess, Pfizer say so?


How about the New England Journal of medicine?


----------



## Briss (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Now for your claims to be true that it was the vaccine that killed them you have to prove those people would not have died anyway


Thanks for bringing that up.  You have to prove that people who've received the experimental injection would have been much sicker without it.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Oh puhleeze.  This is Pfizer reporting results to the FDA from the use of the vaccine.  The FATALS are deaths caused by the vaccine.
> 
> Haven't you wondered why they want to hide the records for 75 years?


Have you noticed there are no documented cases of any fatalities cause by the vaccine?  I have yet to see a case where the person who died did not die of absolutely naturally occurring causes.  I have read all the stories of the so-called deaths from the vaccine, but they always stop short of providing any proof that the vaccine actually caused the death.

In fact, I cannot think of a single person that I know that has not had the vaccine.  Because I work for a government contractor, that would make 104 vaccinations with no deaths just where I work.  Add in the hundred of other people in my family and church, you would still get 0 deaths.  In that same grouping, at least 5 died of COVID before the vaccine was available and none since.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I haven't seen you prove anything.  You don't even know the basics when questioned.  All you do is go ballistic and show nothing.
> 
> You are mostly worthless on information.  Now for being a drama queen.....you can go to Burger King and accept your crown.


I love your hypocrisy!  You say he doesn't know the basics, while all you do is repeat your Google-found articles filled with technical terms you think support your beliefs.  You are probably wrong in most cases because you do not have the education to understand them.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Have you noticed there are no documented cases of any fatalities cause by the vaccine?  I have yet to see a case where the person who died did not die of absolutely naturally occurring causes.  I have read all the stories of the so-called deaths from the vaccine, but they always stop short of providing any proof that the vaccine actually caused the death.
> 
> In fact, I cannot think of a single person that I know that has not had the vaccine.  Because I work for a government contractor, that would make 104 vaccinations with no deaths just where I work.  Add in the hundred of other people in my family and church, you would still get 0 deaths.  In that same grouping, at least 5 died of COVID before the vaccine was available and none since.



Yes.  I'll also note the hyper focus on fake PCR "cases" instead of deaths.


----------



## ding (Dec 14, 2021)

Flopper said:


> My understanding that in serious cases where lung size expands and O2 levels in blood are well below normal, the immune system is overreacts and often leads to death.
> 
> The immune system storm (cytokine) is a very serious problem but it typically comes not in the earliest stages but in the latter stages of the disease.  If someone is peddling a cure, then they are surely charlatans


My understanding is that it is a disease of the endothelium - lining of organs - and can cause damage to the lining of organs even if hospitalization isn't required.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> No, they are not vaccines.  The CDC changed the definition of vaccines so that these mRNA treatments could be considered "vaccines".   They are an experiment, and they are failing.


No, they are NOT failing and you have zero evidence they are.  I had the vaccine and then caught the Delta variant of COVID months later.  Before the vaccine many of my friends and families died. My case of COVID was a non-event.  I had a head cold last weekend that was at least 10 times worse than my COVID experience. My wife caught the Delta variant from me and missed one day of work to get her monoclonal antibodies.

My doctors all told me to get the vaccine as quickly as possible because of my health problems, COVID would easily kill me.  I was left wondering what the big deal was when it turned out to be so minor because I had the "jab" as morons call it!


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Yes.  I'll also note the hyper focus on fake PCR "cases" instead of deaths.


You have no idea what that means, so why post it?


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> ​Teens recover quickly from rare post-vaccine heart inflammation, study says​Rare blood clots more likely after COVID-19 infection than from vaccine, report finds​Nevada teen suffers seizures, extremely rare brain clots after Johnson & Johnson vaccine​DoD Confirms: Rare Heart Inflammation Cases Linked to COVID-19 Vaccines​*Comirnaty and Spikevax: possible link to very rare cases of myocarditis and pericarditis*.
> 
> View attachment 575620
> 
> ...


Remind me again, where did you go to medical school?


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> No, they are NOT failing and you have zero evidence they are.  I had the vaccine and then caught the Delta variant of COVID months later.  Before the vaccine many of my friends and families died. My case of COVID was a non-event.  I had a head cold last weekend that was at least 10 times worse than my COVID experience. My wife caught the Delta variant from me and missed one day of work to get her monoclonal antibodies.
> 
> My doctors all told me to get the vaccine as quickly as possible because of my health problems, COVID would easily kill me.  I was left wondering what the big deal was when it turned out to be so minor because I had the "jab" as morons call it!



Bully for you.  If you want the Vaxx you can get Vaxxed for life.  Do you get a prize for your 100th booster?

Those of us who do not wish to be Lab Rats for Big Pharma should not be forced to get the Vaxx.   The effects of the leaky vaccine are appearing in deaths of young athletes, resurgence of cancer in victims who were in remission and so on.

I just found out that my next door neighbor "unexpectedly" has stage 4 Prostate Cancer.  He's Vaxxed and now dying.   

The evidence of the dangers of the Vaxxes is growing and the Government-Big Pharma-Media partnership is doing everything it can to spread the propaganda that the Vaxxes are safe.  It's a lie.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Omigoodness!  What do you think is happening right now?   The Vaxx is a giant clinical trial sponsored by the government.  The Pharmas have been given complete immunity for any damage the vaxxes cause.  *And note, the NIH is part owner of the Moderna Vaxx.*


What government agency owns stock in a company?  You are full of shit!


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> What government agency owns stock in a company?  You are full of shit!



NIH owns part of Moderna Vaxx patent:









						Moderna offers NIH co-ownership of COVID vaccine patent amid dispute with government
					

Activists have been pushing the Biden administration to "reclaim" ownership over the vaccine, in hopes of increasing global access.




					www.cbsnews.com


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Bully for you.  If you want the Vaxx you can get Vaxxed for life.  Do you get a prize for your 100th booster?
> 
> Those of us who do not wish to be Lab Rats for Big Pharma should not be forced to get the Vaxx.   The effects of the leaky vaccine are appearing in deaths of young athletes, resurgence of cancer in victims who were in remission and so on.
> 
> ...


Are you so stupid to realize that this "unexpected" stage 4 prostate cancer is not unexpected?

The vaccines are safe  because you can't document any proof his prostate cancer was caused by the vaccine and never will.  Correlation is NOT causation.

BTW, vaxx and vaxxes are not words, you lazy dumbass!


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Are you so stupid to realize that this "unexpected" stage 4 prostate cancer is not unexpected?
> 
> The vaccines are safe  because you can't document any proof his prostate cancer was caused by the vaccine and never will.  Correlation is NOT causation.
> 
> BTW, vaxx and vaxxes are not words, you lazy dumbass!



It was for my neighbor.   He went from being healthy to stage 4 in a very short period of time - with proper annual check-ups etc.

VAXX is a word in the common venacular.   You know exactly what I mean.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> NIH owns part of Moderna Vaxx patent:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hey shit for brains, you said the NIH owned Moderna.  Your article is talking about a patent. Catch a fucking clue!  The issue hasn't even been resolved.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> It was for my neighbor.   He went from being healthy to stage 4 in a very short period of time - with proper annual check-ups etc.
> 
> VAXX is a word in the common venacular.   You know exactly what I mean.


I had a close friend from church who had the same annual checkups and was healthy as a horse.  On his last checkup, they found an enlarged prostate and discovered cancer.  He began treatment immediately and died within months as the cancer spread to his other organs.  You are simply talking out of your ass!

Vaxx is not a word in the common vernacular as you are the only one who seems to use it.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Hey shit for brains, you said the NIH owned Moderna.  Your article is talking about a patent. Catch a fucking clue!  The issue hasn't even been resolved.



You sad little man.  I said that the NIH owned part of the Moderna Vaxx/Patent.  They are going to get royalties.  Which means that the government is profiting from the Vaxx they are mandating.

Your vulgarity is an admission that you have lost the debate. Thank you for the concession and enjoy your lifelong Immunity-As-A-Service Boosters for Life lifestyle.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Pfizer has reported over 1,200 vaxx deaths to FDA for the first 90 days of use.
> 
> Up until now, vaccines with 50 deaths have been pulled from the market.
> 
> This is the biggest Human Rights Abuse in history.


I am sure you have a link for that ridiculous claim that you can provide..  

Please spell out "vaccine" as it only gives away the fact that you are a moron and conspiracy theory nut job.  It's only three letters.  Surely you are not that incompetent or lazy.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> I had a close friend from church who had the same annual checkups and was healthy as a horse.  On his last checkup, they found an enlarged prostate and discovered cancer.  He began treatment immediately and died within months as the cancer spread to his other organs.  You are simply talking out of your ass!
> 
> Vaxx is not a word in the common vernacular as you are the only one who seems to use it.



It's a word, bub:









						NY Holiday Vaxx-or-Mask Mandate: 4 HV County Execs Won't Enforce
					

One of them did ask residents to be respectful of those who are masked or social distancing.




					news.yahoo.com
				












						COVID Booster Jab Comes With Free Rockettes Tickets At Vaxx Event
					

A coronavirus booster shot clinic in Mount Vernon will give participants a chance to attend the Radio City Music Hall tradition for free.




					news.yahoo.com
				












						GO-VAXX bus to stop in Listowel
					

Huron Perth Public Health announced that the Ontario GO-VAXX mobile clinic bus will be heading to Listowel.




					blackburnnews.com
				












						UK think tank: Consumer spending helps boost PH economic recovery, but vaxx rate still slow
					

MANILA, Philippines—Strong consumer spending, which accounted for about a fourth of economic growth pre-pandemic, is back and driving the Philippines' recovery, but a relatively lower




					business.inquirer.net
				












						Silver Lake School Committee members ask about alternatives to 80 percent vaxx threshold
					

School counsel recommends the direct approach to mandate questions.



					www.wickedlocal.com


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> I am sure you have a link for that ridiculous claim that you can provide..
> 
> Please spell out "vaccine" as it only gives away the fact that you are a moron and conspiracy theory nut job.  It's only three letters.  Surely you are not that incompetent or lazy.



Here's a little story about that:  No.

Vaxx is a perfectly appropriate word for a fake vaccine that is an experimental mRNA treatment that is quickly losing its effectiveness

Here's what you are going to find out:  the VAXX causes your body to produce spike proteins for 15 months, but loses its protective properties within 6 months.  Your stacking over boosters will damage your immune system to the point where you are much more at risk for cancers and heart disease.   There is no cure for the Vaxx at this point, so good luck - you're going to need it.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> You sad little man.  I said that the NIH owned part of the Moderna Vaxx/Patent.  They are going to get royalties.  Which means that the government is profiting from the Vaxx they are mandating.
> 
> Your vulgarity is an admission that you have lost the debate. Thank you for the concession and enjoy your lifelong Immunity-As-A-Service Boosters for Life lifestyle.


I don't speak vulgarities unless they are richly deserved.  So you are now a patent judge too?  You know they will be getting royalties?  From your link, it was self-evident that you tried to pass off a bullshit claim that NIH owned Moderna's vaccine patent.  They don't yet, as the issue is still up in the air.  Details you neglected to mention or lie about.

Since when are you REQUIRED to get the Moderna vaccine?  You aren't!

This is typical dumbass behavior by a know it all, with at best a high school diploma from a shitty school.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> It's a word, bub:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It is slang, which is used by uneducated morons like journalists and you.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> *Here's a little story about that:  No.*
> 
> Vaxx is a perfectly appropriate word for a fake vaccine that is an experimental mRNA treatment that is quickly losing its effectiveness
> 
> Here's what you are going to find out:  the VAXX causes your body to produce spike proteins for 15 months, but loses its protective properties within 6 months.  Your stacking over boosters will damage your immune system to the point where you are much more at risk for cancers and heart disease.   There is no cure for the Vaxx at this point, so good luck - you're going to need it.


So you admit your claims are total bullshit?  Thank you!


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Flopper said:


> Although breakthrough cases can spread the virus, the viral load that is transmitted is likely to be very small compared to unvaccinated who become ill with the virus.   The viral load you receive is a very important factor in determining how your body respond to it.



That is not what I read.
I read that most transmissions happen early on, before there are significant symptoms or much of a total viral load in your body.
The vaccinated feel better, so go out more, and therefore spread the virus more than the unvaccinated.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Flopper said:


> My understanding that in serious cases where lung size expands and O2 levels in blood are well below normal, the immune system is overreacts and often leads to death.
> 
> The immune system storm (cytokine) is a very serious problem but it typically comes not in the earliest stages but in the latter stages of the disease.  If someone is peddling a cure, then they are surely charlatans



Except that the damage done by the immune system over reaction, the cytokine storm, is easily stopped with "cures".
Fighting a virus is hard, but controlling the immune system over reaction is very easy.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Flopper said:


> It Was the CDC not the FDA.
> After covid-19 vaccines were introduced, and it was discovered that they do not necessarily "prevent disease" or "provide immunity", the CDC altered the definition of vaccines again to say that they simply "produce protection"." The Covid vaccines, flu vaccines, Tetanus and in fact most vaccine do not make you immune to the disease at some point you need another vaccination.  The immune system memory in the B and T cells does not last a lifetime for all diseases.  Covid-19 and Flu shots will provide protection falling to about 40% to 50% after 6 months.  The MMR vaccine is very effective at protecting people against measles, mumps, and rubella and it lasts a lifetime.
> 
> Scientist don't know why our immune system memory dulls after 6 months for the flu or Covid and last a life time for other pathogen.



Immune system memory can NOT "dull after 6 months".
That is not possible.
My understanding is that T-cells actually add the immunity information to their own DNA, so that it is passed on when they reproduce.

When immunity does quickly dull, that means it never got put into T-cell memory.
That means the mRNA injections are just temporarily stimulating antibody production, and NOT adding to T-cell memory.

And by the way, flu vaccine immunity does NOT dull either.
The lack of last year's flu vaccine is due to this year there being a completely different species we collectively call flu.
It is not due to any change in immunity to the old flu the vaccine was made for.

Tetanus does wain, but only after a decade or so.
Pertussis is the shortest immunity, but that is still good for about 5 years.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

krichton said:


> Study after study has shown that tcell immunity is both present in naturally infected and vaccinated individuals equally.   There is no difference between the amount or the antibodies themselves, according to the evidence.  This is a another silly junk science lie debunked by real science, and facts.  Furthermore, tcell immunity against a coronavirus is next to useless for protection against infection anyway, especially when coronaviruses attack humans in our upper respiratory tracts.  You will get infected, you just won't get seriously ill and die because your tcell antibodies will come to the rescue eventually.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wrong.
The amount of antibodies does NOT at all indicate whether they are directly stimulated or from T-cell memory.
And we currently have absolutely NO WAY to tell anything about T-cell memory except that is the production of antibody response wains, then likely there was no immunity info put into T-cell memory.

Dr. Malone is the one considered the inventor of all mRNA techniques.
So your slurs only demean you, not anyone else.

Any doctor will tell you that recovery immunity is always stronger than vaccine immunity, and I have never read about a single doctor who thinks these mRNA injections are proven or even a good idea.
All doctors are very skeptical of these mRNA injections, because our own exosomes have to use the exact same spike proteins we are trying to get our immune system to attack.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 14, 2021)

krichton said:


> Study after study has shown that tcell immunity is both present in naturally infected and vaccinated individuals equally.   There is no difference between the amount or the antibodies themselves, according to the evidence.  This is a another silly junk science lie debunked by real science, and facts.  Furthermore, tcell immunity against a coronavirus is next to useless for protection against infection anyway, especially when coronaviruses attack humans in our upper respiratory tracts.  You will get infected, you just won't get seriously ill and die because your tcell antibodies will come to the rescue eventually.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Baloney.  I shown tons of data and yall can kiss my ass.  It has worked all over the world.  There is no money in it here, which is why it isnt used here


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Research is not the same as safe and effective vaccines.
> 
> Companies such as Moderna have been trying to find a way to profit from mRNA. This is all about money and power, not public health.


Moderna made no profit til this.  No drugs to show.  Bill Gates was waitinf around for this.  Only real human trials before this was Ebola.  Very limited.  So there had never been sufficient trials in mRNA


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

krichton said:


> I don't think that's whats happening.  Early evidence is showing very strong tcell memory.  I think the first problem we're dealing with is that the vaccine was made specifically against the alpha strain.  It's not unusual to see more infections and breakthroughs as a result of this, although i would say it's still incredibly effective.  The second problem is, we have 100 million ppl walking around refusing to be vaccinated.   If we were experiencing a smallpox outbreak on the same scale as covid, we would be seeing tons of ppl getting smallpox even in vaccinated populations, they simply wouldn't get severe forms of the disease or die from it, much like what is happening now with those who are vaccinated but had breakthroughs.   The last and most important problem is, this is a coronavirus, this is a disease that attacks us through our lungs and science has never discovered a means to provide a vaccine that protects us in the same way it does with other viruses.  I think the recent drive to develop nasal spray vaccines and nasal spray treatments as a means of prevention may be the key as that actually keeps the virus out of our lungs.  Putin has already got himself one.



Wrong.
Obviously all the mRNA injections are made ONLY for the spike protein that opens the ACE2 receptors.
So they can NOT be variant specific.
So anyone claiming the mRNA injection efficacy drop is due to variants, has to be deliberately LYING!
The ACE2 receptors have not changes, so for any variant of covid to succeed in entering ACE2 receptors, they have to have and use the same spike protein.

And no, with all other REAL vaccines, you do NOT see breakthrough cases like with these mRNA injections.

And by the way, the common cold is also a corona virus.
{...
Although the common cold is usually caused by rhinoviruses,[93] in about 15% of cases the cause is a coronavirus.[94] The human coronaviruses HCoV-OC43, HCoV-HKU1, HCoV-229E, and HCoV-NL63 continually circulate in the human population in adults and children worldwide and produce the generally mild symptoms of the common cold.[87] The four mild coronaviruses have a seasonal incidence occurring in the winter months in temperate climates.[95][96] There is no preponderance in any season in tropical climates.[97]
...}


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Remind me again, where did you go to medical school?


If you read the whole thread I posted, you would know. Unlike me, all your postings here are based on parroting the MSM.


----------



## Gracie (Dec 14, 2021)

Might wanna listen to this lady.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 14, 2021)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://directorsblog.nih.gov/2020/07/28/immune-t-cells-may-offer-lasting-protection-against-covid-19/amp/&ved=2ahUKEwj-o5aC6-P0AhVGl2oFHZWfB5YQFnoECAUQAQ&usg=AOvVaw12Mqi4alxdzmIPxHajSPZa
		


17 year memory of SARs from 2003


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> And yes the new shots are vaccines and every scientist, virologist and doctor will tell you the same thing



No, I have never found a single doctor who believes these mRNA injections are real vaccines.
The reason being that all they do is stimulate our own body to produce a specific spike protein.
But since our own exosomes use and have to use this same spike protein for the same purpose, ACE2 receptor access, then long term immune system T-cell memory can not possibly use that spike protein as future trigger.
It can not be emphasized enough, that a spike protein used to trigger ACE2 receptors, can NOT possibly be used to trigger the immune system response.

So that means all these mRNA injections are doing is temporarily stimulating antibody production.
They are not a vaccine, in any way.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> OK where is your scientific proof that an mRNA vaccine causes cancer or autoimmune diseases?
> 
> And the RARE cases of Myocarditis and Pericarditis are acute cases and will heal themselves.  And a COVID infection carries a far greater risk of myocarditis than does the vaccine.
> 
> And fyi the risk of heart inflammation is about .017%



Sure the risk of heart inflammation from the mRNA injection is low, but so is any covid complication.

But it is obvious why these mRNA injections are far more dangerous than any previous vaccine.
Look at what they do and how they operate.
They do not contain a harmless or dead virus.
Instead, what they do is invade and attack your own cells, converting them into spike protein producers.
Since all the covid deaths are essentially coming from an allergic reaction to spike proteins, the fact the risk then is huge, is obvious.

From these mRNA injections, there have not only been the usual anaphylactic shock, Guillain-Barré Syndrome, and other common vaccine causes of death, but the fact these injections are so small that they can and do migrate to the heart, brain, or other fatal areas.  They also lead to amputations when they migrate to the capillaries in the extremities.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

krichton said:


> This is what you call passing along misinformation.  Where are the studies that show this.  Post your evidence that the mrna vaccines don't produce any tcell antibodies.  I'll wait.



You clearly do not understand how the immune system works.
T-cells are NOT antibodies.
T-cells are the immune system host cells in the bone marrow, that produce antibodies.
Antibodies are not really living cells, but just limited function, organic compounds.

And anyone who does not know mRNA injections quickly loose efficacy over time, is not keeping up with anything.














						What We Know So Far About Waning Vaccine Effectiveness (Published 2021)
					

Vaccines still offer strong protection against severe Covid-19, but many studies show their protection against infection decreases over time. How much that decline matters is up for debate.



					www.nytimes.com
				




Real vaccines lose efficacy over decades, not months.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

krichton said:


> This is what you call passing along misinformation.  Where are the studies that show this.  Post your evidence that the mrna vaccines don't produce any tcell antibodies.  I'll wait.



The fact the mRNA injection wain in efficacy is well known, documented, and a fact.
The fact immune system T-cell memory does not normally wain in less than decades, is also well known.

The only way to prove if a vaccine is producing T-cell memory or not is to wait.
We do not have time for that, and the 6 months that have passed have already shown the mRNA injections are not lasting.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> So you admit your claims are total bullshit?  Thank you!



Clearly, you are sorely lacking in reading comprehension and retention abilities.


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Moderna made no profit til this.  No drugs to show.  Bill Gates was waitinf around for this.  Only real human trials before this was Ebola.  Very limited.  So there had never been sufficient trials in mRNA



Moderna's stock price has gone through the roof, so insiders have made bank. That's really the point and the NIH folks want their cut.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> So you admit your claims are total bullshit?  Thank you!



No, Boediccia is correct,
No real vaccine loses efficacy in less than years or decades.
So these mRNA injections can not be real vaccines.

And your own intuitive suspicions should tell you that, since these injections do not contain an actual dead virus like historic vaccines do.
All they do is force your own cells to start making spike proteins, which not only is incredibly dangerous in itself, but can not be used by T-cell memory, since our own exosomes have to also use these same spike proteins.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Oh puhleeze.  This is Pfizer reporting results to the FDA from the use of the vaccine.  The FATALS are deaths caused by the vaccine.
> 
> Haven't you wondered why they want to hide the records for 75 years?


They are not caused by the vaccine unless you can prove they are.

675000 people in the US alone would have died in that same 90 days you have no clue as to whether or not those 1200 which were probably from more than one country weren't going to die anyway.

So once again if you can't back up your statements with actual facts and not your own biased suppositions then they are meaningless.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> No, I have never found a single doctor who believes these mRNA injections are real vaccines.
> The reason being that all they do is stimulate our own body to produce a specific spike protein.
> But since our own exosomes use and have to use this same spike protein for the same purpose, ACE2 receptor access, then long term immune system T-cell memory can not possibly use that spike protein as future trigger.
> It can not be emphasized enough, that a spike protein used to trigger ACE2 receptors, can NOT possibly be used to trigger the immune system response.
> ...


Really?

All the people at Johns Hopkins would disagree with you.  And all vaccines only temporarily  increase immune response.

Animals need rabies vaccine boosters
People need MMR and tetanus boosters









						Are Booster Shots Common for Vaccines?
					

According to experts, booster shots are common. An additional dose can help bolster immunity against COVID-19.




					www.verywellhealth.com
				




According to Jason C. Gallagher, PharmD, FCCP, FIDP, FIDSA, BCPS, clinical professor at Temple University’s School of Pharmacy and clinical specialist in infectious diseases, boosters are common.


“Most vaccines that are given in the U.S. require several doses to render immunity,” Gallagher tells Verywell. “I like to think of [a COVID-19 vaccine booster] as the third dose of a multi-dose series.”


While boosters are common, whether they’re necessary largely depends on the type of vaccine, Jeffrey Langland, PhD, virologist and professor at Southwest College of Naturopathic Medicine, tells Verywell.


“Most vaccines that do not contain a live, attenuated (weakened) virus, typically require multiple doses or boosters,” Langland says.


One dose of some live vaccines can offer you a lifetime of protection against disease.3 Other live vaccines may require two doses, like the measles, mumps, and rubella (MMR) and chickenpox vaccines. Children typically get their first dose at 12–15 months old and their second (and final) dose between age 4–6.4


But other types, like inactivated vaccines, will need several doses over time to remain effective. Boosters are currently recommended for several vaccines—chances are you’ve likely received one in your lifetime.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Sure the risk of heart inflammation from the mRNA injection is low, but so is any covid complication.
> 
> But it is obvious why these mRNA injections are far more dangerous than any previous vaccine.
> Look at what they do and how they operate.
> ...


Endocarditis risk is higher with a Covid infection than it is with the vaccine.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Clearly, you are sorely lacking in reading comprehension and retention abilities.


Why did you quote me when you are obviously talking to yourself?  You have shown absolutely zero evidence that you understand the first word of the articles you link.  You just think they agree with your conspiracy theory, but you really don't understand what they are saying.  You are merely a Google parrot!


----------



## boedicca (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> They are not caused by the vaccine unless you can prove they are.
> 
> 675000 people in the US alone would have died in that same 90 days you have no clue as to whether or not those 1200 which were probably from more than one country weren't going to die anyway.
> 
> So once again if you can't back up your statements with actual facts and not your own biased suppositions then they are meaningless.



Are you a Pot now?

I think you should read the report yourself, friendo.

I can turn right around and say that you can't prove that all of the people who died "with" Covid died because of it.  If any death statistic has been manipulated, that is the top candidate.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Are you a Pot now?
> 
> I think you should read the report yourself, friendo.
> 
> I can turn right around and say that you can't prove that all of the people who died "with" Covid died because of it.  If any death statistic has been manipulated, that is the top candidate.


I did read it and all it said was the list of adverse reactions happened within 90 days of a vaccine.

That's all it said.

There were no coroner findings that stated unequivocally that the vaccine was the immediate cause of death.

This is what you are claiming and you still haven't provided any evidence for your assertions.


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Are you a Pot now?
> 
> I think you should read the report yourself, friendo.
> 
> I can turn right around and say that you can't prove that all of the people who died "with" Covid died because of it.  If any death statistic has been manipulated, that is the top candidate.


Unlike you I like actual facts









						Has Anyone Died After Receiving The COVID-19 Vaccine?
					

A listener asks about deaths on the VAERS website, which is used to report adverse events after vaccines.




					www.ideastream.org
				




As of August 30, 2021, there have been more than 369 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines administered in the U.S. During this time, VAERS received 7,218 reports of death (0.0020%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine but* a causal link to the vaccine has not been established*, according to the CDC. "However, recent reports indicate a plausible causal relationship between the J&J/Janssen COVID-19 Vaccine and TTS, a rare and serious adverse event—blood clots with low platelets- which has caused death," according to the CDC website.










						COVID-19 Vaccine Related Fatalities Updated
					

VAERS confirmed over 6000 additional COVID-19 vaccine death reports




					www.precisionvaccinations.com
				




The CDC’s website says, ‘Reports of adverse events to VAERS following vaccination, including deaths, do not necessarily mean that a vaccine caused a health problem. This is because the U.S. FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after a COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it’s unclear whether the vaccine was the cause.

*Furthermore, a review of available clinical information, including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records, has not established a causal link to COVID-19 vaccines, says the CDC.









						Fact Check-Reports of 9,318 VAERS COVID-19 vaccine deaths do not prove causality
					

Posts are sharing numbers reported to the U.S. Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) as deaths following COVID-19 vaccinations and claiming that it proves the vaccines have killed people. This is false. Anyone can submit a report into the system and the reports...




					www.reuters.com
				




Posts are sharing numbers reported to the U.S. Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) as deaths following COVID-19 vaccinations and claiming that it proves the vaccines have killed people. This is false. Anyone can submit a report into the system and the reports do not imply causality.*


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 14, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Blues Man said:
> 
> 
> > They are not caused by the vaccine unless you can prove they are.
> ...



  My guess would be that he's just someone who has smoked too much of it.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 14, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death.


News Flash Mike, according to the CDC, WHO and Fauci, the fully jabbed contract and spread the virus in like numbers to the unjabbed.  The mrna inoculations are experimental, not safe and by all indications ineffective at preventing infection or spread.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> They are not caused by the vaccine unless you can prove they are.
> 
> 675000 people in the US alone would have died in that same 90 days you have no clue as to whether or not those 1200 which were probably from more than one country weren't going to die anyway.
> 
> So once again if you can't back up your statements with actual facts and not your own biased suppositions then they are meaningless.





Blues Man said:


> They are not caused by the vaccine unless you can prove they are.
> 
> 675000 people in the US alone would have died in that same 90 days you have no clue as to whether or not those 1200 which were probably from more than one country weren't going to die anyway.
> 
> So once again if you can't back up your statements with actual facts and not your own biased suppositions then they are meaningless.



From the 20,000 who died after covid vaccination, the official verdict is about 10,000 were from the vaccines.

No one should be dying from covid.
Covid can't kill anyone, and is easily wiped out by the immune system of anyone.
They deaths are not caused by covid, but by an immune system over reaction, which is easily treatable with a large number of immuno suppressants.

And it is obvious why the vaccines are killing.
They can easily migrate because they are much smaller than a virus, where ever they end up will get attacked by the immune system, and if that is someplace important like the heart or brain, you die.  If it is something like the capillaries in the extremities, then amputations become necessary.

These are not good vaccines, do not add permanent immunity, and have not been sufficiently test.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Really?
> 
> All the people at Johns Hopkins would disagree with you.  And all vaccines only temporarily  increase immune response.
> 
> ...



No, I know some people at John Hopkins, and no one agrees with the administrative position on these vaccines.
Everyone who actually works with patients dislikes them.

Tetanus, and pertussis are the only vaccines that need boosters, but that is still only after many years for pertussis, and a decade for tetanus.
With rabies, you are wrong and does not need boosters.
{... A long-lasting immunity to the virus develops after a full course of treatment.[6] ...}








						Rabies vaccine - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				




A muti dose regimen is NOT boosters.
Boosters are for when efficacy has declined.
Multi dose is just to reduce side effects right after being applied.

No other vaccine has ever rapidly declined in efficacy like the mRNA injections.
The only possible explanation is that these mRNA injections are ONLY stimulating antibody production, and are NOT being stored in long term T-cell memory.

All real vaccines do have a real dead virus, and anything that does not, likely is not really a vaccine.

The MMR vaccine is only given in 2 doses to the very young.
With those over 3 years of age, a single dose is used.
And after the first dose, these is no attenuation of immunity.
Any time you have rapid attenuation of efficacy, like in less than 6 months, it is not a vaccine.
It is not in T-cell immune system memory.
Then it is just a temporary stimulation of antibodies.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Blues Man said:


> Endocarditis risk is higher with a Covid infection than it is with the vaccine.



Wrong.

Endocarditis only happens if the immune system over reacts, macerates lung tissue, sending millions of little blood clots into the vascular system.
That is easily prevented in people who have a covid infection.
It is not covid that causes endocarditis, and these mRNA injections stimulate an immune system over reaction by causing your own cells to start producing spike proteins.


----------



## Rigby5 (Dec 14, 2021)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> No, they are NOT failing and you have zero evidence they are.  I had the vaccine and then caught the Delta variant of COVID months later.  Before the vaccine many of my friends and families died. My case of COVID was a non-event.  I had a head cold last weekend that was at least 10 times worse than my COVID experience. My wife caught the Delta variant from me and missed one day of work to get her monoclonal antibodies.
> 
> My doctors all told me to get the vaccine as quickly as possible because of my health problems, COVID would easily kill me.  I was left wondering what the big deal was when it turned out to be so minor because I had the "jab" as morons call it!



Over 99.5% of those who get covid have no problem.
If you had friends and family die from covid, that is extremely unusual.
Of the thousands of people I know, through work, relatives, etc., I only know 1 single person who ever got covid, and it was nothing.

In contrast, I took 2 Moderna shots, and thought the second one was going to kill me.
I was sick for over 3 weeks, and had the worst symptoms of my life.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 14, 2021)




----------



## Blues Man (Dec 15, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> From the 20,000 who died after covid vaccination, the official verdict is about 10,000 were from the vaccines.
> 
> No one should be dying from covid.
> Covid can't kill anyone, and is easily wiped out by the immune system of anyone.
> ...


LINK


----------



## Blues Man (Dec 15, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> 
> Endocarditis only happens if the immune system over reacts, macerates lung tissue, sending millions of little blood clots into the vascular system.
> That is easily prevented in people who have a covid infection.
> It is not covid that causes endocarditis, and these mRNA injections stimulate an immune system over reaction by causing your own cells to start producing spike proteins.


Yes you are wrong









						What COVID-19 is doing to the heart, even after recovery
					

Emerging research finds evidence of heart damage in many COVID-19 survivors, whether they were seriously ill or not.




					www.heart.org
				




But two recent studies suggest heart damage among those infected may be more widespread. In JAMA Cardiology, an analysis of autopsies done on 39 COVID-19 patients identified infections in the hearts of patients who had not been diagnosed with cardiovascular issues while they were ill.


Another JAMA Cardiology study used cardiac MRIs on 100 people who had recovered from COVID-19 within the past two to three months. Researchers found abnormalities in the hearts of 78% recovered patients and "ongoing myocardial inflammation" in 60%. The same study found high levels of the blood enzyme troponin, an indicator of heart damage, in 76% of patients tested, although heart function appeared to be generally preserved. Most patients in the study had not required hospitalization.









						Heart inflammation, COVID-19 and the rare side effects of the vaccine
					

<p>UC Davis Health Cardiologist Nayereh Pezeshkian discusses COVID-19, its impact on the heart, and the rare risk of developing heart complications after a COVID-19 vaccine.</p>




					health.ucdavis.edu
				




About 20-30% of patients hospitalized with COVID-19 show heart problems. These patients tend to have more severe symptoms and worse health outcomes. Their heart issues can be due to direct damage from the virus, resulting in heart inflammation, or the indirect effect of inflammatory proteins (known as cytokines) released in the bloodstream. Heart muscle inflammation (myocarditis) commonly manifests as heart failure or through uneven heartbeat (arrhythmia). Sudden death in COVID-19 patients caused by arrhythmia can be a consequence of these heart problems.


COVID-19 is also associated with the inflammation of the vascular lining and an increased risk for blood clots forming in large blood vessels and small vessels, particularly in the heart and lungs. The inflammation and the blood clots can lead to poor oxygen levels in these critical organs.

Rare heart inflammation cases (around one in 6000) were reported in teenagers after their COVID-19 vaccination. These cases have been mild and self-resolving. However, the _chance of developing severe illness and death after a COVID-19 infection is much higher_ (2-10%). *There is a higher risk of myocarditis from COVID itself than there is from the vaccine.*


----------



## krichton (Dec 15, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> You clearly do not understand how the immune system works.
> T-cells are NOT antibodies.
> T-cells are the immune system host cells in the bone marrow, that produce antibodies.
> Antibodies are not really living cells, but just limited function, organic compounds.
> ...



Somewhere along the way I picked up calling them that, so that was my mistake, what isn't a mistake is that MRNA vaccines indeed generate ample tcell memory in anyone vaccinated with them.  If you don't believe so, then show the evidence to prove your claim.



Rigby5 said:


> The fact the mRNA injection wain in efficacy is well known, documented, and a fact.
> The fact immune system T-cell memory does not normally wain in less than decades, is also well known.
> 
> The only way to prove if a vaccine is producing T-cell memory or not is to wait.
> We do not have time for that, and the 6 months that have passed have already shown the mRNA injections are not lasting.



You're singling out vaccines, but the same efficacy also goes down in people who were naturally infected.  Also a well documented fact.  Antibodies do not last in the body.  There hasn't been a vaccine made that can prevent infection from a coronvirus because it's an upper respiratory virus that goes straight to our lungs first.  Any future vaccine will have the same issue, unless it's one in our noses and even those will likely need to be renewed annually, if not bi annually, or sooner.  However, what a vaccine will do is keep your out of the hospital and from dying, in the vast majority of the case, and that is precisely what these vaccines are doing.


----------



## gipper (Dec 15, 2021)

Rigby5 said:


> Over 99.5% of those who get covid have no problem.
> If you had friends and family die from covid, that is extremely unusual.
> Of the thousands of people I know, through work, relatives, etc., I only know 1 single person who ever got covid, and it was nothing.
> 
> ...


You’ve posted many posts outlining the facts about the phony vaccines. I’ve read much the same information as have a few others on this forum. And yet the establishment continues to push the phony vaccines completely ignoring the facts.  The corporate media promotes the vaccines every day without the slightest criticism. 

They’re giving the jabs to children now, ignoring the fact that children have zero risk of hospitalization or death. 

Many nations are imposing Draconian laws limiting the rights of the unvaxxed. Corporations are doing the same. Kroger being the most recent.

It’s as if we’re living in the Twilight Zone. 

Kroger to take away paid Covid benefits, add insurance surcharges for unvaccinated employees


----------



## Delldude (Dec 15, 2021)

Anybody see this:



> mRNA vaccine protection from Covid is far weaker than natural immunity and declines very fast, according to a new study of almost 6 million people in Israel.
> 
> During the summer Covid wave, more than 140,000 Israelis who had been vaccinated but not received a booster shot became infected with Covid. Put another way, in just two months, about 1 out of every 20 vaccinated Israelis became infected with Sars-Cov-2.
> 
> ...



URGENT: A huge Israeli study shows natural Covid immunity is far superior to the vaccine-generated kind


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Dec 15, 2021)

krichton said:


> Somewhere along the way I picked up calling them that, so that was my mistake, what isn't a mistake is that MRNA vaccines indeed generate ample tcell memory in anyone vaccinated with them.  If you don't believe so, then show the evidence to prove your claim.
> 
> 
> 
> You're singling out vaccines, but the same efficacy also goes down in people who were naturally infected.  Also a well documented fact.  Antibodies do not last in the body.  There hasn't been a vaccine made that can prevent infection from a coronvirus because it's an upper respiratory virus that goes straight to our lungs first.  Any future vaccine will have the same issue, unless it's one in our noses and even those will likely need to be renewed annually, if not bi annually, or sooner.  However, what a vaccine will do is keep your out of the hospital and from dying, in the vast majority of the case, and that is precisely what these vaccines are doing.



Your parroting the cdc when you say "keep you out of the hospital".  There is no empirical evidence for that.  The CDC has repeatedly moved the goal posts around.  Also, it was known before these mRNA injections were ever created that stopping a coronavirus was impossible.  All test subjects, ferrets, rabbits died when introduced with an attenuated virus after being injected with the mRNA shot.


----------



## krichton (Dec 16, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Your parroting the cdc when you say "keep you out of the hospital".  There is no empirical evidence for that.  The CDC has repeatedly moved the goal posts around.  Also, it was known before these mRNA injections were ever created that stopping a coronavirus was impossible.  All test subjects, ferrets, rabbits died when introduced with an attenuated virus after being injected with the mRNA shot.



I'd rather parrot scientific data than conspiracy theories.   The evidence is all there, you just choose to ignore it because you can't abandon your extremist politics.    As for the CDC, they just report what state health departments across the country sends into them, although they conduct their own studies and tests as well, and all the data points to the same exact thing, and that is the unvaccinated make up an enormous portion of all cases, hospitalizations and deaths over the vaccinated.  If 100 million ppl got vaccinated, we wouldn't even be having the low amount of breakthroughs we're having because we wouldn't have unvaccinated walking around spreading it to everyone.  The same data here mirrors what's going on the UK and other countries.  No evidence you say?  Maybe if you live in an alternate reality.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 16, 2021)

krichton said:


> I'd rather parrot scientific data than conspiracy theories.



  Is Bruce Jenner a man or is he a woman?


----------



## krichton (Dec 16, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Is Bruce Jenner a man or is he a woman?



Why would i care?  Are you interested?


----------



## Briss (Dec 16, 2021)

krichton said:


> As for the CDC . . .


. . . they're being sued by some scientists and their colleagues at seven universities for fraud because not one of the 1500 samples of people who've tested positive for covid had covid.  They were all found to have Influenza A and B.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 16, 2021)

krichton said:


> Bob Blaylock said:
> 
> 
> > krichton said:
> ...



  It goes directly to your credibility on any matters relating to science.

  Is Bruce Jenner a man, or is he a woman?

  Anyone who has any grasp of science, any credibility with anything to do with science, would have no difficulty at all, and no hesitancy, in answering the question and getting it right,


----------



## krichton (Dec 17, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> It goes directly to your credibility on any matters relating to science.
> 
> Is Bruce Jenner a man, or is he a woman?
> 
> Anyone who has any grasp of science, any credibility with anything to do with science, would have no difficulty at all, and no hesitancy, in answering the question and getting it right,



Whether Jenner or anyone else considers himself a woman has zero to do with science.  Now i have a question for you, how often do you wonder what Bruce Jenner looks like naked and does this give you a tingly feeling every time? lol


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 17, 2021)

krichton said:


> Whether Jenner or anyone else considers himself a woman has zero to do with science.  Now i have a question for you, how often do you wonder what Bruce Jenner looks like naked and does this give you a tingly feeling every time? lol



  I guess we know, then, how much credibility to assign to you regarding anything to do with genuine science:  None at all.

  And based on the sort of bizarre shit you're trying to project on me, it seems we have good reason to have serious doubts about your mental health and moral character.

  I have no other questions for you.  I think you've repealed enough about yourself for us to know how to look at anything you may have to say on any subject.


----------



## Stann (Dec 17, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


I'm beginning to notice on my local news the doctors and nurses are so sick and tired of taking cares of people that are I'll and dying from Covid. As the hospitals here in Nebraska keep filling up with these unvaccinated people. The hospitals are close to capacity I think when they finally reach that point. They're just going to say they're not going to treat Covid cases anymore you're on your own you had your chance to get back to me you made your bed now lie in it. The cancelling needed transplant surgeries. I think this anger towards the unvaccinated is going to increase and eventually drastic action will have to be taken. It is a pandemic and it's not getting better because of the  unvaccinated. Something's going to give sooner or later.


----------



## Stann (Dec 17, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> I guess we know, then, how much credibility to assign to you regarding anything to do with genuine science:  None at all.
> 
> And based on the sort of bizarre shit you're trying to project on me, it seems we have good reason to have serious doubts about your mental health and moral character.
> 
> I have no other questions for you.  I think you've repealed enough about yourself for us to know how to look at anything you may have to say on any subject.


You brought it up you idiot ! A crazy comparison, and a questionable one at that !


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 17, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Marek's disease mRNA vaccine is leaky, just like the Covid one, and
> 
> "Over the past fifty years, Marek’s disease—an illness of fowl—has become fouler. Marek’s is caused by a highly contagious virus, related to those that cause herpes in humans. It spreads through the dust of contaminated chicken coops, and caused both paralysis and cancer. In the 1970s, new vaccines brought the disease the under control. But Marek’s didn’t go gently into that good night. Within ten years, it started evolving into more virulent strains, which now trigger more severe cancers and afflict chickens at earlier ages.
> 
> Andrew Read from Pennsylvania State University thinks that the vaccines were responsible. The Marek’s vaccine is “imperfect” or “leaky.” That is, it protects chickens from developing disease, but doesn’t stop them from becoming infected or from spreading the virus. Inadvertently, this made it easier for the most virulent strains to survive. Such strains would normally kill their hosts so quickly that they’d die out. But in an immunised flock, they can persist because their lethal nature has been neutered. That’s not a problem for vaccinated individuals. But unvaccinated birds are now in serious trouble."





Blues Man said:


> So an illness that only affects birds.
> 
> IOW completely irrelevant to humans.
> 
> How about a documentation of all those HUMAN deaths directly attributed to the vaccine?



You're so shallow. Why do you think he's talking about Marek's? If you didn't made that connection from his post, you're also a retard.

Immune responses to pathogens involve many cells and proteins of the immune system. Early during an infection, these responses are non-specific, meaning that although they are directed at the pathogen, they are not specific to it. This is called innate immunity, and this is the response you get to the mRNA stimulated spike proteins.

Within a few days, adaptive immunity takes over; this immunity is specific to the invading pathogen. mRNA shots do not provide or create adaptive immunity, because it is not the whole virus, just the spike protein of the virus.

Adaptive immune responses include antibodies. A major goal of antibodies is to bind to the pathogen and prevent it from infecting, or entering, a cell. Antibodies that prevent entry into cells are called neutralizing antibodies. Many vaccines work by inducing neutralizing antibodies. However, not all antibody responses are created equal. Sometimes antibodies do not prevent cell entry (like the mRNA doesn't) and, on rare occasions, they may actually increase the ability of a virus to enter cells and cause a worsening of disease through a mechanism called antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE).

ADE occurs when the antibodies generated during an immune response recognize and bind to a pathogen, but they are unable to prevent infection. Instead, these antibodies act as a “Trojan horse,” allowing the pathogen to get into cells and exacerbate the immune response.

If you still don't see the connection between Marek's and COVID, there is something really wrong with you and you should be sterilized.


----------



## Stann (Dec 17, 2021)

Ame®icano said:


> You're so shallow. Why do you think he's talking about Marek's? If you didn't made that connection from his post, you're also a retard.
> 
> Immune responses to pathogens involve many cells and proteins of the immune system. Early during an infection, these responses are non-specific, meaning that although they are directed at the pathogen, they are not specific to it. This is called innate immunity, and this is the response you get to the mRNA stimulated spike proteins.
> 
> ...


How ironic you should mention this. It's already been dismissed. In fact if you don't get the Covid vaccination and you get Covid there is a chance you could become sterile. Infertility is one of the rare side effects of Covid.


----------



## Mr Natural (Dec 17, 2021)

Stann said:


> How ironic you should mention this. It's already been dismissed. In fact if you don't get the Covid vaccination and you get Covid there is a chance you could become sterile. Infertility is one of the rare side effects of Covid.


Ain’t nothing wrong with sterile conservatives.


----------



## Ame®icano (Dec 17, 2021)

Stann said:


> How ironic you should mention this. It's already been dismissed. In fact if you don't get the Covid vaccination and you get Covid there is a chance you could become sterile. Infertility is one of the rare side effects of Covid.



And where did you get that from?

I better run to get my clot shot, and boosters too. So, please explain, what part of my post was incorrect or wrong? Be precise.


----------



## Stann (Dec 17, 2021)

Mr Clean said:


> Ain’t nothing wrong with sterile conservatives.


If you're talking about these new " fake conservatives ", you'll get no argument from me. They should reap what they sow, nothing.


----------



## Delldude (Dec 18, 2021)

krichton said:


> I'd rather parrot scientific data than conspiracy theories.   The evidence is all there, you just choose to ignore it because you can't abandon your extremist politics.    As for the CDC, they just report what state health departments across the country sends into them, although they conduct their own studies and tests as well, and all the data points to the same exact thing, and that is the unvaccinated make up an enormous portion of all cases, hospitalizations and deaths over the vaccinated.  If 100 million ppl got vaccinated, we wouldn't even be having the low amount of breakthroughs we're having because we wouldn't have unvaccinated walking around spreading it to everyone.  The same data here mirrors what's going on the UK and other countries.  No evidence you say?  Maybe if you live in an alternate reality.


Since when do the unvaccinated become covid typhoid Mary's? 

One can not spread covid if they haven't been exposed to the virus........whether or not one is vaxed or unvaxed.

What a crock of shit.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Delldude said:


> Since when do the unvaccinated become covid typhoid Mary's?
> 
> One can not spread covid if they haven't been exposed to the virus........whether or not one is vaxed or unvaxed.
> 
> What a crock of shit.


Yes a lot of s*** with the unvaccinated. Resentment may turn into anger soon and action. Doctors and nurses are so tired of all this. I honestly believe very soon this they say if you're on vaccinated you did this to yourself and they're not going to treat you they're going to let you f****** die. Hospitals are at capacity and turning away people that need transplants to laying other things that are caused problems for people in the future all because of the on vaccinated of course there's going to be resentment I just hope it doesn't go any further than that but I'm afraid it will it's at the breaking point.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Yes a lot of s*** with the unvaccinated. Resentment may turn into anger soon and action. Doctors and nurses are so tired of all this. I honestly believe very soon this they say if you're on vaccinated you did this to yourself and they're not going to treat you they're going to let you f****** die. Hospitals are at capacity and turning away people that need transplants to laying other things that are caused problems for people in the future all because of the on vaccinated of course there's going to be resentment I just hope it doesn't go any further than that but I'm afraid it will it's at the breaking point.


More Fear Porn


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> More Fear Porn


I watch TV I have a friend who watches TV with me on occasion especially the news she knows body language. For right now the doctors and nurses and specialists are all disgruntled that's a good word for it at this time but I think it's going to get worse. If the numbers keep growing there will be a reaction to the on vaccinated that's unheard of in America.


----------



## Delldude (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Yes a lot of s*** with the unvaccinated. Resentment may turn into anger soon and action. Doctors and nurses are so tired of all this. I honestly believe very soon this they say if you're on vaccinated you did this to yourself and they're not going to treat you they're going to let you f****** die. Hospitals are at capacity and turning away people that need transplants to laying other things that are caused problems for people in the future all because of the on vaccinated of course there's going to be resentment I just hope it doesn't go any further than that but I'm afraid it will it's at the breaking point.


Hospitals run close to capacity all the time. Don't let MSM feed your head. Ever seen one with a vacancy sign?

You aware, it's being reported, that these 'life saving vaccines', from Pfizer have a 75 year liability exclusion?

An unvaxed person is no more or less a risk of exposure than a vaxed person.


----------



## AMart (Dec 18, 2021)

The vaxx Nazis are actually the most anti vaxx people. They actually admit that vaxxs suck lol.
True North
@TrueNorthCentre
 · 18h
Ontario's top doctor advises against seeing your triple vaccinated grandparent if you're double vaccinated.


----------



## Delldude (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Yes a lot of s*** with the unvaccinated. Resentment may turn into anger soon and action. Doctors and nurses are so tired of all this. I honestly believe very soon this they say if you're on vaccinated you did this to yourself and they're not going to treat you they're going to let you f****** die. Hospitals are at capacity and turning away people that need transplants to laying other things that are caused problems for people in the future all because of the on vaccinated of course there's going to be resentment I just hope it doesn't go any further than that but I'm afraid it will it's at the breaking point.





> Rapidly waning vaccine efficacy and COVID-19 surges in countries and regions with high vaccination rates – including Israel, the United Kingdom, Singapore, and now Europe, as well as high-vaccination U.S. states like Vermont – are evidence that vaccinated individuals can spread COVID-19 at rates comparable to the unvaccinated. Multiple studies have shown that viral load in vaccinated individuals with COVID-19 is the same as in the unvaccinated.


Forcing People Into COVID Vaccines Ignores Important Scientific Data


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Delldude said:


> Hospitals run close to capacity all the time. Don't let MSM feed your head. Ever seen one with a vacancy sign?
> 
> You aware, it's being reported, that these 'life saving vaccines', from Pfizer have a 75 year liability exclusion?
> 
> An unvaxed person is no more or less a risk of exposure than a vaxed person.


We were watching the local news on television we could see the frustration in the peoples faces. This carnage is totally unnecessary.


----------



## badger2 (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> I'm beginning to notice on my local news the doctors and nurses are so sick and tired of taking cares of people that are I'll and dying from Covid. As the hospitals here in Nebraska keep filling up with these unvaccinated people. The hospitals are close to capacity I think when they finally reach that point. They're just going to say they're not going to treat Covid cases anymore you're on your own you had your chance to get back to me you made your bed now lie in it. The cancelling needed transplant surgeries. I think this anger towards the unvaccinated is going to increase and eventually drastic action will have to be taken. It is a pandemic and it's not getting better because of the  unvaccinated. Something's going to give sooner or later.


Supposedly high IQ, why don't Medical professionals publically protest  communist Chinese lack of transparency regarding their invading virus? Has Fau Chi's vaccine cartel told them that that's dangerous to do, not worthwhile to do? It would be interesting to videotape any medical psychopath trying to explain away the theolgical-style esoterica, now that American prisoners have been forced to deal with (two [italics]) protection-racket psychopaths of the Catholic mafia, one of them installed and controlled by the CIA.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

badger2 said:


> Supposedly high IQ, why don't Medical professionals publically protest  communist Chinese lack of transparency regarding their invading virus? Has Fau Chi's vaccine cartel told them that that's dangerous to do, not worthwhile to do? It would be interesting to videotape any medical psychopath trying to explain away the theolgical-style esoterica, now that American prisoners have been forced to deal with (two [italics]) protection-racket psychopaths of the Catholic mafia, one of them installed and controlled by the CIA.


I don't think they have time to waste on conspiracy theories.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Delldude said:


> Since when do the unvaccinated become covid typhoid Mary's?
> 
> One can not spread covid if they haven't been exposed to the virus........whether or not one is vaxed or unvaxed.
> 
> What a crock of shit.



  And on top of that, the evidence is becoming increasingly clear and indisputable that none of these new dangerous experimental drugs do anything at all to reduce anyone's chances of being infected with this virus or of spreading it to others.  At most, they may reduce the severity of the symptoms in one who is infected with earlier variants on this virus.  If anything, this would result in an increased risk of spreading the disease, as those who have reduced or absent symptoms are less likely to be aware that they might be contagious, and to take appropriate efforts to reduce infecting others.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> And on top of that, the evidence is becoming increasingly clear and indisputable that none of these new dangerous experimental drugs do anything at all to reduce anyone's chances of being infected with this virus or of spreading it to others.  At most, they may reduce the severity of the symptoms in one who is infected with earlier variants on this virus.  If anything, this would result in an increased risk of spreading the disease, as those who have reduced or absent symptoms are less likely to be aware that they might be contagious, and to take appropriate efforts to reduce infecting others.


yup   They are the super spreaders as the variants dance around their BS vaccine.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Yes a lot of s*** with the unvaccinated. Resentment may turn into anger soon and action.



  You should worry about that happening in the other direction.

  Many of us have very legitimate concerns about being injected with dangerous experimental drugs.  How long do you think we are going to put up with modern-day Josef Mengele wannabes such as yourself who demand that we submit to this risky shit?  How long do you think we are going to be put up with being harassed, marginalized, discriminated against, and generally treated as second-class citizens for refusing to participate in your dangerous medical experiments?

  Those of you who are at risk of being perceived as being complicit in this bullshit, you have very good reason to be worried about your safety.  Keep pushing us this way, and there *will* be some very serious pushback.


----------



## skye (Dec 18, 2021)

I am repelled by the vaxx nazis....they make me nauseous!


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## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> And on top of that, the evidence is becoming increasingly clear and indisputable that none of these new dangerous experimental drugs do anything at all to reduce anyone's chances of being infected with this virus or of spreading it to others.  At most, they may reduce the severity of the symptoms in one who is infected with earlier variants on this virus.  If anything, this would result in an increased risk of spreading the disease, as those who have reduced or absent symptoms are less likely to be aware that they might be contagious, and to take appropriate efforts to reduce infecting others.


Keep kidding yourself, keep the delusion going no matter what; until you end up in the hospital really sick and or dying on your deathbed and you say, " I wish I got the darn shot. " It's too late goodbye ! We've seen this fool's act over and over since the pandemic began. 800,000 of them and counting. There's no hurry to get that shot, there's still plenty of room in the cemeteries.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> You should worry about that happening in the other direction.
> 
> Many of us have very legitimate concerns about being injected with dangerous experimental drugs.  How long do you think we are going to put up with modern-day Josef Mengele wannabes such as yourself who demand that we submit to this risky shit?  How long do you think we are going to be put up with being harassed, marginalized, discriminated against, and generally treated as second-class citizens for refusing to participate in your dangerous medical experiments?
> 
> Those of you who are at risk of being perceived as being complicit in this bullshit, you have very good reason to be worried about your safety.  Keep pushing us this way, and there *will* be some very serious pushback.


I'm not pushing anything I'm just sick of seeing all this crap on TV caused by the unvaccinated. Enough is enough already.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Keep kidding yourself, keep the delusion going no matter what; until you end up in the hospital really sick and or dying on your deathbed and you say, " I wish I got the darn shot. " It's too late goodbye ! We've seen this fool's act over and over since the pandemic began. 800,000 of them and counting. There's no hurry to get that shot, there's still plenty of room in the cemeteries.



  Keep pushing this bullshit at your own peril.  People are waking up.  When enough of us are awake, and aware of what filth such as you have been trying to do to us, there will be serious repercussions.

  Mengele spent the rest of his life, after WWII, as a fugitive, in hiding.  Many of his colleagues who were caught, tried, and sentenced, served their sentences at the end of ropes.  May the same fate await you and your kind.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> I'm not pushing anything I'm just sick of seeing all this crap on TV caused by the unvaccinated. Enough is enough already.



  It is not _“the unvaccinated”_ who are causing any of this.  It is you and your kind, and you will be held to account for it one day.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> I watch TV I have a friend who watches TV with me on occasion especially the news she knows body language. For right now the doctors and nurses and specialists are all disgruntled that's a good word for it at this time but I think it's going to get worse. If the numbers keep growing there will be a reaction to the on vaccinated that's unheard of in America.





Stann said:


> We were watching the local news on television we could see the frustration in the peoples faces. This carnage is totally unnecessary.



  Do you imagine that when you are finally held to account for what you have been doing, that you will be allowed to get away with it by pleading that you were ignorant, because you stupidly trusted your TV tell tell you what was what?

  That's not going to fly.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Keep pushing this bullshit at your own peril.  People are waking up.  When enough of us are awake, and aware of what filth such as you have been trying to do to us, there will be serious repercussions.
> 
> Mengele spent the rest of his life, after WWII, as a fugitive, in hiding.  Many of his colleagues who were caught, tried, and sentenced, served their sentences at the end of ropes.  May the same fate await you and your kind.


You're threatening me you're a very sick man.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Do you imagine that when you are finally held to account for what you have been doing, that you will be allowed to get away with it by pleading that you were ignorant, because you stupidly trusted your TV tell tell you what was what?
> 
> That's not going to fly.


A threatening moron that's unbelievable. What a sick combination you are.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> It is not _“the unvaccinated”_ who are causing any of this.  It is you and your kind, and you will be held to account for it one day.


You're an idiot and it's useless talking to you. The vast majority of covid patients in the hospital are 80 / 90% unvaccinated people. You really want to argue with facts. That's all the proof of sensible person would need. The 10% or so of vaccinated people who are in the hospital are very old and close to death anyway. They give reports here in Nebraska every day on the news, for example saying eight people died in Omaha one was vaccinated and she was in her 80s,  the other seven were all unvaccinated, 3 we're in their 60's, 2 we're in their 50's, 1 was in his 40's and 1 was in his 30's. They do get the vaccinated but it's the elderly and frail. The unvaccinated that are dying are much younger and in much greater numbers.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> You're threatening me you're a very sick man.



  I'm quite healthy, actually, and I prefer to remain this way.  A major reason why I do not want to take these dangerous experimental drugs that you want to force on me.

  In any event, I stand by my words.  Continue to push this bullshit at your own peril.  At some point, there will be severe pushback against you and your fellow Mengele-wannabes.  If you are fortunate, perhaps you'll be able to follow your idol's footsteps, and escape to some obscure place in South America where you can live out the rest of your life in hiding, and never be brought to justice.  But I wouldn't count on it.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Keep kidding yourself, keep the delusion going no matter what; until you end up in the hospital really sick and or dying on your deathbed and you say, " I wish I got the darn shot. " It's too late goodbye ! We've seen this fool's act over and over since the pandemic began. 800,000 of them and counting. There's no hurry to get that shot, there's still plenty of room in the cemeteries.


More Fear Porn.  Enjoy being the lab rat.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Do you imagine that when you are finally held to account for what you have been doing, that you will be allowed to get away with it by pleading that you were ignorant, because you stupidly trusted your TV tell tell you what was what?
> 
> That's not going to fly.


Held to account for what, exactly?  You’ve already lost credibility trying to make a comparison to Mengele.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Held to account for what, exactly?  You’ve already lost credibility trying to make a comparison to Mengele.



  Mengele was most notorious for the crime of performing risky medical experiments on non consenting human subjects—exactly the same crime which I am taking Stann to task for advocating and defending and even demanding.  Had Mengele been caught, he would have been put to death for these crimes, a many of his colleagues were, and as his modern-day counterparts fully deserve.

  I wouldn't expect you to understand, but that is not my problem.  Your superhuman stupidity is your own issue, not mine.

  In any event, you are not anyone in a position to ever speak of _“credibility”_.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Mengele was most notorious for the crime of performing risky medical experiments on non consenting human subjects—exactly the same crime which I am taking Stann to task for advocating and defending and even demanding.  Had Mengele been caught, he would have been put to death for these crimes, a many of his colleagues were, and as his modern-day counterparts fully deserve.
> 
> I wouldn't expect you to understand, but that is not my problem.  Your superhuman stupidity is your own issue, not mine.


Wrong.  Mengele was NOT known for performing “risky experiments”.   He was known for experimenting on human beings who’s lives were less than a rats.  Some of the experiments were completely frivolous, and incredibly cruel.  Most of the children died.

I wouldn’t expect you to understand.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Wrong. Mengele was NOT known for performing “risky experiments”. He was known for experimenting on human beings who’s lives were less than a rats. Some of the experiments were completely frivolous, and incredibly cruel.



  The same is exactly true of the use of these dangerous experimental drugs that efforts are now being made to coerce or even outright force people to take today.

  It is exactly the same crime, and deserves exactly the same consequences.

  By denying this obvious fact, you only show everyone what a lying piece of shit you truly are.  Not that everyone doesn't already know this who has ever paid any attention to you.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> I'm quite healthy, actually, and I prefer to remain this way.  A major reason why I do not want to take these dangerous experimental drugs that you want to force on me.
> 
> In any event, I stand by my words.  Continue to push this bullshit at your own peril.  At some point, there will be severe pushback against you and your fellow Mengele-wannabes.  If you are fortunate, perhaps you'll be able to follow your idol's footsteps, and escape to some obscure place in South America where you can live out the rest of your life in hiding, and never be brought to justice.  But I wouldn't count on it.


This time you just called me some kind of f****** criminal you are insane.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> This time you just called me some kind of f****** criminal you are insane.



  If you're going to openly advocate severe human rights abuses, then you really have no cause to get upset when people call you out for what you openly are.

  You openly advocate the forced use of nonconsenting human subjects for dangerous medical experiments.  This makes you undeniably the moral and ethical equivalent of Josef Mengele.

  None of your bullshit excuses change anything at all about what this says about you.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> If you're going to openly advocate severe human rights abuses, then you really have no cause to get upset when people call you out for what you openly are.
> 
> You openly advocate the forced use of nonconsenting human subjects for dangerous medical experiments.  This makes you undeniably the moral and ethical equivalent of Josef Mengele.
> 
> None of your bullshit excuses change anything at all about what this says about you.


I am not advocating anything you a******it I guess you can't comprehend what I said. I just stated the facts what's going on. Everyone has a right not to get vaccinated, but if you're not vaccinated you are more like the to get sick and die it's that simple not a threat a fact.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> The same is exactly true of the use of these dangerous experimental drugs that efforts are now being made to coerce or even outright force people to take today.
> 
> It is exactly the same crime, and deserves exactly the same consequences.
> 
> By denying this obvious fact, you only show everyone what a lying piece of shit you truly are.  Not that everyone doesn't already know this who has ever paid any attention to you.


Ya, you just keep believing it is comparable.  Your ignorance borders on arrogance.









						The Terrible Nazi Medical Experiments
					

Human torture at unimaginable levels




					historyofyesterday.com


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> I'm quite healthy, actually, and I prefer to remain this way.  A major reason why I do not want to take these dangerous experimental drugs that you want to force on me.
> 
> In any event, I stand by my words.  Continue to push this bullshit at your own peril.  At some point, there will be severe pushback against you and your fellow Mengele-wannabes.  If you are fortunate, perhaps you'll be able to follow your idol's footsteps, and escape to some obscure place in South America where you can live out the rest of your life in hiding, and never be brought to justice.  But I wouldn't count on it.


I hope you have good health insurance and a lot of money in savings. Covid stays in the hospital are long and expensive. Running on average $22, 000 to $320,000
Real long stays involving ICU care and respirators can be in the millions.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> I hope you have good health insurance and a lot of money in savings. Covid stays in the hospital are long and expensive. Running on average $22, 000 to $320,000
> Real long stays involving ICU care and respirators can be in the millions.


More Fear Porn.  More nonsense from the lab Rats.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> I hope you have good health insurance and a lot of money in savings. Covid stays in the hospital are long and expensive. Running on average $22, 000 to $320,000
> Real long stays involving ICU care and respirators can be in the millions.



  I am much more likely to be killed or seriously harmed in an automobile accident or a work-related mishap than I am to suffer serious effects from the COVID-1984 virus.

  On the scale of things that may adversely impact my health or safety, this stupid virus doesn't belong on the radar at all.

  But nobody is trying to frighten me into submitting to serious losses of my freedom and prosperity, or into participating in dangerous medical experiments, over dangers of automobile or work-related accidents.  And if anyone did try that shit on me, I'd respond not much more favorably than to the idiots such as yourself who are using hyped-up fear of an exaggerated cold/flu bug to try to pull this shit on me.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> More Fear Porn.  More nonsense from the lab Rats.



  Most of them are probably sincerely brainwashed and deceived, but you have to wonder how many of them know that they've been had, and think that they can make themselves feel better of they help to deceive and brainwash others the way that they've come to realize has been done to them—that perhaps they won't have to feel so stupid for being had, the more that they can help cause others smarter than them to fall for the same bullshit that they have fallen for.


----------



## Stann (Dec 18, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> More Fear Porn.  More nonsense from the lab Rats.


Fear is a poor reaction to commonly available information. Maybe you have money to burn, I don't. Just thought you'd want to start making a list of pros and cons or you can keep playing Russian roulette. Hope it's at least exciting for you. Good night.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 18, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> Okay of course, if you had 100% of the population vaccinated, any Covid cases in the hospital would be vaccinated. _*But you would not expect hospitals to be overrun with Covid patients *_If these were good vaccines. Put another way. Are hospitals overrun with polio patients? Mumps? German measles? No, and not 100% of the population is vaxxed for those. But the vaccines are better. This is also simple to understand.


The hospitals are NOT overwhelmed.  There are plenty of beds--the problem is self-inflicted by the medical industry as they sent staff home because they would not vax.  This dempanic is a scamdemic.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Fear is a poor reaction to commonly available information.



  Fear is all that your side has to offer.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 18, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Ya, you just keep believing it is comparable.  Your ignorance borders on arrogance.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So you are willing to wait for walking skeletons before you oppose government overreach?  Is that it?  A bit of a naive outlook I'd say.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 18, 2021)

Stann said:


> Fear is a poor reaction to commonly available information. Maybe you have money to burn, I don't. Just thought you'd want to start making a list of pros and cons or you can keep playing Russian roulette. Hope it's at least exciting for you. Good night.


You shovel shit for 'Fear.  Nothing more.  You are their Lab Rat for an experimental vaccine that is in bed with the NIH and Fauchi's big gov't.    

Enjoy being the rat.  don't worry .....Might take a while for the clots waiting in your blood stream to get you.  I suggest taking daily aspirin.  lol


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 18, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> So you are willing to wait for walking skeletons before you oppose government overreach?  Is that it?  A bit of a naive outlook I'd say.



  It should be kept in mind that even the grand Nazi Holocaust started on a modest scale.  They didn't start building huge concentration/extermination camps such as Auschwitz from the beginning.  The started much smaller, separating and distinguishing groups to be designated as _untermenschen_ to be selectively mistreated and denied basic rights that were afforded other Germans.  Much of what was happening then, we can clearly see happening now.  Not very far past the point that we are seeing today, they developed the _Sonderwagen_, basically a bus with the passenger compartment isolated from the driver's position, and with valves set up so that exhaust from the engine could be routed into the passenger compartment.  It was a very convenient way to transport inmates from one facility to another, and be spared the burden of having to care for them at the destination facility.  The mass extermination camps came much later.


----------



## krichton (Dec 19, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> And on top of that, the evidence is becoming increasingly clear and indisputable that none of these new dangerous experimental drugs do anything at all to reduce anyone's chances of being infected with this virus or of spreading it to others.  At most, they may reduce the severity of the symptoms in one who is infected with earlier variants on this virus.  If anything, this would result in an increased risk of spreading the disease, as those who have reduced or absent symptoms are less likely to be aware that they might be contagious, and to take appropriate efforts to reduce infecting others.



They reduce the severity of symptoms because your body is actively destroying the virus from the antibodies and t and b cells created when you got the vaccine.  This defense doesn't exist in a person who hasn't been vaccinated.  If the vaccine creates an increased risk of spreading the virus, why are cases way down this year compared to this exact same time last year?  Currently the dominant strain is delta, which is way more infectious than alpha every was.  Nothing of what you say has come to pass.  The vast majority of cases by a wide margin are unvaccinated, many of which are also asymptomatic carriers except they have no defense against the virus, their viral loads on average are higher, they carry the virus for much longer than a vaccinated person, and therefore spread it, for longer periods.   What we are currently seeing is that the unvaccinated spread it amongs themselves and then spread it into the vaccinated communities, which is why we have breakthrough infections.  If everyone got the vaccine the amount of cases, hospitalizations and deaths would drop dramatically.  Instead the unvaccinated whine and cry all day and post memes.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 19, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> So you are willing to wait for walking skeletons before you oppose government overreach?  Is that it?  A bit of a naive outlook I'd say.


Another person with absolutely no historical knowledge.  If you are really that concerned about overreach, keep the government out of the uterus.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 19, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> It should be kept in mind that even the grand Nazi Holocaust started on a modest scale.  They didn't start building huge concentration/extermination camps such as Auschwitz from the beginning.  The started much smaller, separating and distinguishing groups to be designated as _untermenschen_ to be selectively mistreated and denied basic rights that were afforded other Germans.  Much of what was happening then, we can clearly see happening now.  Not very far past the point that we are seeing today, they developed the _Sonderwagen_, basically a bus with the passenger compartment isolated from the driver's position, and with valves set up so that exhaust from the engine could be routed into the passenger compartment.  It was a very convenient way to transport inmates from one facility to another, and be spared the burden of having to care for them at the destination facility.  The mass extermination camps came much later.


Again, there is absolutely no historical comparison to be made between that era and this,  It is a slap in the face to those who survived when you pretend you are comparable.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 19, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> You shovel shit for 'Fear.  Nothing more.  You are their Lab Rat for an experimental vaccine that is in bed with the NIH and Fauchi's big gov't.
> 
> Enjoy being the rat.  don't worry .....Might take a while for the clots waiting in your blood stream to get you.  I suggest taking daily aspirin.  lol


I’ve been vaccinated for almost a year now.  No clots.  No effects.  I don’t even glow in the dark.  I feel cheated


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 19, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Again, there is absolutely no historical comparison to be made between that era and this,  It is a slap in the face to those who survived when you pretend you are comparable.



  You make me think of the cliché about those who refuse to study history being doomed to repeat it.  Surely you represent a more extreme version of that, not merely refusing to study history, but actively denying history; and denying the obvious similarity to things that are clearly happening now, and what we know to have happened in the past.  From there, there also seems to be a connection to another cliché that defines insanity as doing what has been done before and expecting a different result.

  It cannot be honest or rationally denied that much of what you defend and support being done now, in our time, is the same as what we saw being done in the past and we saw that it led to some very bad results.


----------



## Coyote (Dec 19, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> You make me think of the cliché about those who refuse to study history being doomed to repeat it.  Surely you represent a more extreme version of that, not merely refusing to study history, but actively denying history; and denying the obvious similarity to things that are clearly happening now, and what we know to have happened in the past.  From there, there also seems to be a connection to another cliché that defines insanity as doing what has been done before and expecting a different result.
> 
> It cannot be honest or rationally denied that much of what you defend and support being done now, in our time, is the same as what we saw being done in the past and we saw that it led to some very bad results.


If you had studied history, you wouldn’t be stuck on false moral equivalencies.


----------



## krichton (Dec 19, 2021)

Coyote said:


> If you had studied history, you wouldn’t be stuck on false moral equivalencies.



Don't mind Bob, he studied history out of a far right wing coloring book so that's why his comparisons are on a kindergarten level.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 19, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Another person with absolutely no historical knowledge.  If you are really that concerned about overreach, keep the government out of the uterus.


Madison and Jefferson are laughing in their graves over your comments.  As they were for preventing the gov't from getting too big.  And ALLOWING STATES TO RULE THEMSELVES.

Of course HAMILTON who hated them wanted more FED.  But hell he'd be laughing at you too now.  

Hamilton was so hated he died in a duel over that with Burr.  A little history of Federalist versus Anti Federalist which in essence created a 2 party system.


----------



## mamooth (Dec 19, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> I am much more likely to be killed or seriously harmed in an automobile accident or a work-related mishap than I am to suffer serious effects from the COVID-1984 virus.


Both car crashes and COVID often have severe long-term effects, so we'll call that a wash and just concentrate on deaths.

Car crash deaths in the USA are about 38,000/year.

COVID deaths in 2021 will be around 450,000.

You probably don't drive drunk or impaired, making your odds of being in a car crash much lower.

And COVID deaths are concentrated among the unvaccinated minority, making the odds of death for that group much higher.

So, an unvaccinated person is far more likely to die of COVID than a car crash.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 19, 2021)

krichton said:


> t and b cells created when you got the vaccine


Those with natural or acquired immunity have t cells which actually last longer than the jab provides.


krichton said:


> If the vaccine creates an increased risk of spreading the virus, why are cases way down this year compared to this exact same time last year?


Infections are higher this year than last.


krichton said:


> Currently the dominant strain is delta,


Nope, Omicron, please keep up


krichton said:


> they carry the virus for much longer than a vaccinated person,


Link?


krichton said:


> then spread it into the vaccinated communities,


HaHaHa, according to the CDC, vaxxed contract and spread it as well.  BTW, why do you have the vax if you can contract it or spread it?  Also, how do you know you are not getting it from a vaxxed person?  You are grasping at straws.


krichton said:


> Instead the unvaccinated whine and cry all day


I believe I just responded to a vaxxed whiner--this thread seems to be full of them.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 19, 2021)

Coyote said:


> I’ve been vaccinated for almost a year now.  No clots.  No effects.  I don’t even glow in the dark.  I feel cheated


I was infected almost a year ago and I also have no clots, no effects and I don't glow in the dark.  I also don't have an experimental substance in my body.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 19, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Another person with absolutely no historical knowledge.  If you are really that concerned about overreach, keep the government out of the uterus.


How is my questioning of when you feel it is appropriate to oppose government overreach "no knowledge of history?"  Secondly, I believe that what I am advocating is exactly "keeping the government out of the uterus."  I believe that the government ensuring that what happens in the uterus naturally actually happens and keeps murderers out of the uterus.  Which is irrelevant to this thread anyhow, ms. moderator.  Please stay on topic.


----------



## ClaireH (Dec 19, 2021)

Delldude said:


> Better to put your faith in science, er, I mean windmill profits and get all three jabs and catch the 'Rona.
> 
> Ever stop and think Big Pharma puts out a jab, knowing quite well what the true infection and contagion rate is
> 
> ...


Yep, they are fully aware now, most likely  many already were a year back, while filling their corruptive pockets and counting on future profits.

“THE REPRESENTATIVES OF the biopharmaceutical companies behind the Covid-19 vaccines made undisclosed donations to Democratic and Republican campaign organizations last year.”









						Vaccine Makers Funneled Undisclosed Campaign Cash to Democrats and Republicans in 2020
					

Biotechnology Innovation Organization, the trade group for Pfizer and Moderna, made large dark-money donations during the 2020 election, a new filing reveals.




					theintercept.com


----------



## Coyote (Dec 19, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> I was infected almost a year ago and I also have no clots, no effects and I don't glow in the dark.  I also don't have an experimental substance in my body.


Neither do I, so all is good


----------



## ClaireH (Dec 19, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> I was infected almost a year ago and I also have no clots, no effects and I don't glow in the dark.  I also don't have an experimental substance in my body.


I would add to that list “I sleep soundly at night”. My husband got the jab 9 months ago and has recently woke up during the night (more than once) with his heart racing. No previous health problems known. Hard to know but it seems likely to me what’s causing it. I’m worried about related heart event beyond temporarily racing.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 19, 2021)

Coyote said:


> Neither do I, so all is good


I believe you are being disingenuous.  You said in your previous post--*I’ve been vaccinated for almost a year now.  *Since you admit to being injected with a mrna vaccine, you have, indeed, allowed an experimental substance in your body. I guess credibility isn't a requirement for mods.


----------



## ClaireH (Dec 19, 2021)

boedicca said:


> Omigoodness!  What do you think is happening right now?   The Vaxx is a giant clinical trial sponsored by the government.  The Pharmas have been given complete immunity for any damage the vaxxes cause.  And note, the NIH is part owner of the Moderna Vaxx.


NIH is really up in arms about not being listed on Moderna’s patent. They left off the 3 research scientists who were affiliated with NIH. It should be an interesting court case ALL in the name of money of course and nothing about public health! It’s actually funny because NIH funded Moderna’s product- what a slap in the face!

“*The stakes are high. Moderna, which is based in Cambridge, Massachusetts, has projected that it will make up to US$18 billion on its COVID-19 vaccine this year.* Inventor status could enable the NIH to collect royalties — potentially recouping some of its investment of taxpayer money — and to license the patent as it sees fit, including to competing vaccine makers in low- and middle-income countries, where vaccines are still painfully scarce.” Let’s recap: 18 billion in one year, so each additional year…. Unacceptable motive!








						What the Moderna–NIH COVID vaccine patent fight means for research
					

Collaborators are locked in a high-stakes dispute over which researchers should be named as inventors on a key vaccine patent application.




					www.nature.com


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 19, 2021)

ClaireH said:


> NIH is really up in arms about not being listed on Moderna’s patent. They left off the 3 research scientists who were affiliated with NIH. It should be an interesting court case ALL in the name of money of course and nothing about public health! It’s actually funny because NIH funded Moderna’s product- what a slap in the face!
> 
> “*The stakes are high. Moderna, which is based in Cambridge, Massachusetts, has projected that it will make up to US$18 billion on its COVID-19 vaccine this year.* Inventor status could enable the NIH to collect royalties — potentially recouping some of its investment of taxpayer money — and to license the patent as it sees fit, including to competing vaccine makers in low- and middle-income countries, where vaccines are still painfully scarce.” Let’s recap: 18 billion in one year, so each additional year…. Unacceptable motive!
> 
> ...











						Moderna pulls out of its vaccine patent battle with the NIH - WHATNEW2DAY
					

Moderna has pulled out of a bitter dispute with the government over who deserves credit for a crucial part of its coronavirus injection, in a case that will have major implications for the future distribution of the vaccine and Moderna’s future profits. Moderna has decided not to take the final...



					whatnew2day.com


----------



## ClaireH (Dec 19, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Moderna pulls out of its vaccine patent battle with the NIH - WHATNEW2DAY
> 
> 
> Moderna has pulled out of a bitter dispute with the government over who deserves credit for a crucial part of its coronavirus injection, in a case that will have major implications for the future distribution of the vaccine and Moderna’s future profits. Moderna has decided not to take the final...
> ...


Thanks for the update Eagle-I’d missed it. Wow, interesting that Moderna has now decided to delay the patent at the moment. The stakes are indeed at play. The article mentioned that their concoction should be referred to as NIH/Moderna and I guess that wasn’t exactly Moderna’s s plan lol

It is interesting to consider whether or not it’s a good thing that the US government have increased say so to determine which drug companies can do what. No thanks to that! I don’t like any type of government control that tells people what to do, including companies. In that respect I am glad they left off NIH. I hope it stands for precedent alone as I certainly have no trust in Moderna. Consumers have the power to manipulate pharmaceuticals, we just all need to act in unison if and when it comes to that. I’m ready here in the midwest!


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 19, 2021)

ClaireH said:


> Thanks for the update Eagle-I’d missed it. Wow, interesting that Moderna has now decided to delay the patent at the moment. The stakes are indeed at play. The article mentioned that their concoction should be referred to as NIH/Moderna and I guess that wasn’t exactly Moderna’s s plan lol
> 
> It is interesting to consider whether or not it’s a good thing that the US government have increases power to determine which companies can do what. No thanks to that! I don’t like any type of government control that tells people what to do, including companies. In that respect I am glad they left off NIH. I hope it stands for precedent alone as I certainly have no trust in Moderna.


I have no trust in either of them.  Cheap drugs would have ended this in the 1st 6 months of the plannedemic.


----------



## krichton (Dec 20, 2021)

Stann said:


> I hope you have good health insurance and a lot of money in savings. Covid stays in the hospital are long and expensive. Running on average $22, 000 to $320,000
> Real long stays involving ICU care and respirators can be in the millions.



They don't run into the millions, not even for 2 month stays on a ventilator, but it's expensive.  Although I doubt you'd live long enough to worry about the bill even if you recover. Covid damages lungs permanently.  If you have to be on a ventilator for an extended period of time you are likely to develop severe lung fibrosis, which for many ppl is a death sentence either way.  All this just to own the libs.  



Concerned American said:


> Those with natural or acquired immunity have t cells which actually last longer than the jab provides.
> 
> Infections are higher this year than last.
> 
> ...



Nope.  Many ppl who acquire natural immunity don't even have any antibodies based on the severity of their infection and for those that do, the amount of antibodies varies from the low hundreds into the hundreds of thousands.  People who are vaccinated have a 100% immune response.  This was measured by the CDC in their studies.

Nope.   This time last year we were 2-3x the number of cases we are at now.  We reached 300,000 cases at one point in Nov or Dec. of 2020.  In contrast, yesterday we had 72k new cases.  Last year, it was 193k new cases on the same exact day.  Considering the delta variant is the dominant strain,  which is so much more infectious than alpha, that's an accomplishment in of itself.  You can thank the vaccine for the lower cases.

Nope.  Omicron makes up 3% of US cases as of a few days ago.  How can it be the dominant strain?  Please keep up. Seriously.  Maybe read something that's not a meme.

Viral activity will always last longer on average in the unvaccinated because they have no prior antibodies to immediately fight the virus off.  This is just basic common sense.

A study out of NSW found that two vaccinated ppl are 200x less likely to infect each other over two unvaccinated individuals.   An unvaccinated person was 10x less likely to be infected by a vaccinated person.  An oxford study found that a vaccinated person infected with delta was 65% less likely to pass the virus onto another person if they got the pfizer vaccine.

I don't whine about wearing masks, I don't whine about mandates, I don't whine about indoor restrictions, I don't whine about getting vaccinated.  It is you and your crowd that does this all day every day.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 20, 2021)

krichton said:


> They don't run into the millions, not even for 2 month stays on a ventilator, but it's expensive.  Although I doubt you'd live long enough to worry about the bill even if you recover. Covid damages lungs permanently.  If you have to be on a ventilator for an extended period of time you are likely to develop severe lung fibrosis, which for many ppl is a death sentence either way.  All this just to own the libs.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Natural immunity teaches the T cells B cells to produce antibodies when it sees Covid.  It teaches the whole virus and not just the spike protein.  It is Far better than the experimental mRNA jab.  Studies have shown that SARS 1 eurvivors had t cell memory 17 years later.

Natural us far better than mRNA vaccines.  Lasts Much longer.  Had the vaccine comoanies made trafitiinal whole antigen vaccines then they would have lasted much longer.

Not to mentiin cheap drugs that WORK if taken early.  This has been a Clusterfuck of epic proportions.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 20, 2021)

krichton said:


> I don't whine about wearing masks, I don't whine about mandates, I don't whine about indoor restrictions, I don't whine about getting vaccinated. It is you and your crowd that does this all day every day.


Whining is exactly what you are doing.   The title of the OP makes that abundantly clear.  I don't whine about anything you've listed because I disregard every bit of it.  I dismiss it as completely out of hand.  I have a singular request.  Please stay out of my life with all of this hype.  You do you and leave me alone.


----------



## ILOVEISRAEL (Dec 20, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


There are those who had the Virus already and resent he is not even addressing National Immunity. There are SOME Medical Conditions that defy Vaccine Mandate. One is Myasthenia Gravis . There are others 
  It’s my understanding the Vaccine was developed through Fetal tissue.  Don’t know if that’s true but if it is there are those who object for Religious Reasons
   You can still spread the Virus if you get it and you are Vaccinated
   Don’t mean to sound cold but if some choose to “ take a chance” it should be their decision


----------



## krichton (Dec 21, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> Natural immunity teaches the T cells B cells to produce antibodies when it sees Covid.  It teaches the whole virus and not just the spike protein.  It is Far better than the experimental mRNA jab.  Studies have shown that SARS 1 eurvivors had t cell memory 17 years later.
> 
> Natural us far better than mRNA vaccines.  Lasts Much longer.  Had the vaccine comoanies made trafitiinal whole antigen vaccines then they would have lasted much longer.
> 
> Not to mentiin cheap drugs that WORK if taken early.  This has been a Clusterfuck of epic proportions.



Where are the studies showing that natural infection produces longer last immunity?  Show them to me.



ILOVEISRAEL said:


> There are those who had the Virus already and resent he is not even addressing National Immunity. There are SOME Medical Conditions that defy Vaccine Mandate. One is Myasthenia Gravis . There are others
> It’s my understanding the Vaccine was developed through Fetal tissue.  Don’t know if that’s true but if it is there are those who object for Religious Reasons
> You can still spread the Virus if you get it and you are Vaccinated
> Don’t mean to sound cold but if some choose to “ take a chance” it should be their decision



The vaccines were not developed using fetal tissue, lol.  This is dumb antivax propaganda.  You can spread the virus even if vaccinated but it is 200x less likely between vaxxed individuals and 10x less likely from vaxxed to unvaxxed.


----------



## krichton (Dec 21, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> Whining is exactly what you are doing.   The title of the OP makes that abundantly clear.  I don't whine about anything you've listed because I disregard every bit of it.  I dismiss it as completely out of hand.  I have a singular request.  Please stay out of my life with all of this hype.  You do you and leave me alone.



Nope, you are a definite whiner.


----------



## ILOVEISRAEL (Dec 21, 2021)

krichton said:


> Where are the studies showing that natural infection produces longer last immunity?  Show them to me.
> 
> 
> 
> The vaccines were not developed using fetal tissue, lol.  This is dumb antivax propaganda.  You can spread the virus even if vaccinated but it is 200x less likely between vaxxed individuals and 10x less likely from vaxxed to unvaxxed.


Wrong, they were used for the Johnson and Johnson Vaccine


----------



## badger2 (Dec 21, 2021)

ClaireH said:


> Yep, they are fully aware now, most likely  many already were a year back, while filling their corruptive pockets and counting on future profits.
> 
> “THE REPRESENTATIVES OF the biopharmaceutical companies behind the Covid-19 vaccines made undisclosed donations to Democratic and Republican campaign organizations last year.”
> 
> ...


But the "windfall" occurred after the deliberate killing of the cheaper alternatives that work: hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin. This fact should prompt lasting boycott akin to lasting boycott of marxist blm.


----------



## badger2 (Dec 21, 2021)

ILOVEISRAEL said:


> Wrong, they were used for the Johnson and Johnson Vaccine


Intelligent people should not be prompted to take the bait and call Johnson and Johnson's a "vaccine," because it begins its arrogance by using a different virus than SARS-CoV-2.


----------



## Colin norris (Dec 21, 2021)

badger2 said:


> Intelligent people should not be prompted to take the bait and call Johnson and Johnson's a "vaccine," because it begins its arrogance by using a different virus than SARS-CoV-2.


You cannot you use anti vaxxers and intelligent people in the same sentence. Its an oxymoron.


----------



## M14 Shooter (Dec 21, 2021)

Colin norris said:


> You cannot you use anti vaxxers and intelligent people in the same sentence. Its an oxymoron.


You don't do much thinking, boy.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 21, 2021)

krichton said:


> Where are the studies showing that natural infection produces longer last immunity?  Show them to me.
> 
> 
> 
> The vaccines were not developed using fetal tissue, lol.  This is dumb antivax propaganda.  You can spread the virus even if vaccinated but it is 200x less likely between vaxxed individuals and 10x less likely from vaxxed to unvaxxed.


I have shown them over and over again on many threads.  Geesh


----------



## eagle1462010 (Dec 21, 2021)

NIH Director's Blog › immu...
Immune T Cells May Offer Lasting Protection Against COVID-19


----------



## ClaireH (Dec 21, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> I have shown them over and over again on many threads.  Geesh


Sometimes a blind person prefers to remain blind if given a choice to see clearly; it’s rare and sad but it happens.


----------



## Concerned American (Dec 21, 2021)

krichton said:


> The vaccines were not developed using fetal tissue, lol. This is dumb antivax propaganda. You can spread the virus even if vaccinated but it is 200x less likely between vaxxed individuals and 10x less likely from vaxxed to unvaxxed.


Linkie, you shrill, whining moron?


----------



## ClaireH (Dec 21, 2021)

Thanks for the info and a relevant resource added below.


eagle1462010 said:


> NIH Director's Blog › immu...
> Immune T Cells May Offer Lasting Protection Against COVID-19


Infant T cells are developmentally adapted for robust lung immune responses through enhanced T cell receptor signaling​





						AAAS
					






					www.science.org


----------



## krichton (Dec 22, 2021)

ILOVEISRAEL said:


> Wrong, they were used for the Johnson and Johnson Vaccine



Fetal tissue cells from decades ago were used in research we benefit from today.   No vaccine, J&J or otherwise used actual fetal tissues in their vaccine.   You are intentionally or unintentionally conflating those meanings.  Here's the lowdown, medical research has been researching fetal cell tissue for nearly one hundred years.  The polio vaccine was the result of said research.  Human fetal cells obtained from two abortions in the early 1960s are still growing in labs and used as incubators to replicate viruses for the production of vaccines against chickenpox, rubella, shingles, rabies and hepatitis A.  Other medical advancements have been furthered by this research.  I know many on the right wish we still lived in the dark ages, but that's never going to happen.  We don't want your vision of this alternate reality.


----------



## krichton (Dec 22, 2021)

Concerned American said:


> Linkie, you shrill, whining moron?



Sorry, I don't have any memes for you to read.  I know this is where you get all your info.  I just have the facts, because i live in reality. 









						Fact Check-Johnson & Johnson’s COVID-19 vaccine does not contain aborted fetal cells
					

Social media users have been sharing posts online that claim the COVID-19 vaccine produced by Johnson & Johnson contains aborted fetal DNA as an ingredient. This claim is false. While the vaccine used lab-replicated fetal cells (known as fetal cell lines) during its production...




					www.reuters.com


----------



## schmidlap (Dec 22, 2021)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


As I have maintained, the pandemic never should have been contrived into a partisan, political issue. Respect public health officials whose expertise is based upon the latest empirical data in matters of public health, not ideological media entertainers and pandering pols.

Ignorance comes at a high price that is being inflicted upon those whose knowledge and dedication we rely:

Most of the patients infected with COVID at UW Health are unvaccinated, leaving Sue Wolfe [a nurse at UW Health in Madison, Wisconsin] frustrated and exhausted.​
_"We are burnt out, we are tired and we are disheartened. So much of what we see on a daily basis is preventable,"_​​_"I find it frustrating. I get angry,"_ Wolfe said. _"I wonder why they did this, why they're doing this to me. Why are they doing this to all the people that need to be away from sick people in the waiting room? I'm frustrated because I can't get them out of the frickin' waiting room."_​​


			'I get angry': Hospital workers left frustrated by unvaccinated amid surge
		

​


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 22, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> As I have maintained, the pandemic never should have been contrived into a partisan, political issue.



  It was CREATED to be a partisan, political issue, a vehicle for corrupt politicians to exploit in order to seize and abuse powers over us far beyond any to which they had any legitimate claim.


----------



## schmidlap (Dec 22, 2021)

Bob Blaylock said:


> It was CREATED to be a partisan, political issue, a vehicle for corrupt politicians to exploit in order to seize and abuse powers over us far beyond any to which they had any legitimate claim.


Crackpot paranoid stuff is not helpful. 

Evil masterminds are nor required to contrive the thousand natural shocks that flesh is heir to.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 22, 2021)

schmidlap said:


> Crackpot paranoid stuff is not helpful.



  And yet you cannot seem to refrain from spewing it all over the place.

  The idea that people might wish to be allowed to make important choices for themselves, based on what is in their interests, rather than having choices forced on them by corrupt politicians who are only acting in their own interests and very much against the interests of those on whom they are forcing these choices, terrifies ignorant sheep such as yourself.

  And in your ignorant and cowardly compliance, you are complicit with these corrupt politicians, and an enemy of the people.


----------



## mamooth (Dec 23, 2021)

In antivaxx land, refusing to leave a propaganda echo chamber and parroting facebook memes is what they classify as "doing your own research".

So sad. So many antivaxxers have died and will die. They don't deserve it. They may be weak-minded and hysterical, but they don't deserve death for that.

I will say that it's hard to feel sympathy for them, given how so many of them have spent the past five years giggling about how they want to execute anyone like me.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Dec 23, 2021)

mamooth said:


> In antivaxx land, refusing to leave a propaganda echo chamber and parroting facebook memes is what they classify as "doing your own research".
> 
> So sad. So many antivaxxers have died and will die. They don't deserve it. They may be weak-minded and hysterical, but they don't deserve death for that.
> 
> I will say that it's hard to feel sympathy for them, given how so many of them have spent the past five years giggling about how they want to execute anyone like me.


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 26, 2021)

candycorn said:


> Not all conservatives are immune from the truth.  Good to see you've found some independence.


Well, not all of the truth. Trump is pushing vaccines but he’s hardly a supporter of medical science in general. He’s just tired of seeing his base dying Off.


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 26, 2021)

mamooth said:


> So sad. So many antivaxxers have died and will die. They don't deserve it. They may be weak-minded and hysterical, but they don't deserve death for that.


You’re right, no one deserves to die early of a horrible death that could have been prevented…..but it’s not unusual. We still have plenty of cigarette smokers left too.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

Without tooting my own horn,the only post that matters on this thread is this post of mine,everything thst has been posted on this thread is irrelevent,mikegriffith1 is a fucking dumbass,thst cannot be debated,the best doctors in the world have talked about and proven that the vaccine is dangerous and it’s well known thousands of people around the world,probably millions even,have died from the vaccines.many who were in perfect health.

what’s also well,known is the majority in hospitals that have covid took the vaccine and any doctor that speaks out on the dangers of vaccines gets fired,not only thst if they don’t follow hospital protocols and try to treat them with hydroxchroquine and Ivermectim,they are dismissed as well.many doctors have come forward and said so.America’s front line doctors have said they have treated thousands of their patients across the country and have cured them all therefore Mike is a fucking liar and full of shit we need vaccines.

here is another fact that destroys his op,there is a coroner Englishman who has come out and said the year the virus came out,there was no more deaths that year than any other past year,the virus is no more dangerous than the common flu with the elderly being the exception,this past year though when they rolled out the vaccine,he has had 10 times more deaths from people that took the vaccine than any other time in his life as a coroner.

So again without tooting my horn,every other post on this thread is all irrelevent,without sounding arrogant,this is the only post that matters,I apologize to anybody here if i come across as arrogant and tooting my own horn but these are facts that cannot be refuted,they are  NOT my facts.facts from the best doctors in the country and actual moments that have transpired from people taking the vaccine,not one of you can come up with a reason to take the vaccine over Ivermectim and hydroxychroline,you vaccine pushers  are all going to hell if you ignore this post or post a laughing smiley and try to laugh off these facts.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

Dagosa said:


> Well, not all of the truth. Trump is pushing vaccines but he’s hardly a supporter of medical science in general. He’s just tired of seeing his base dying Off.


Let me guess,your going to try and tell us biden is a supporter of medical science.lol,if so,you are as much a trollboy as him.lol


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 said:


> I'm coming with facts. You have name calling. You're low rent, as bots go


That’s all this resident troll can do when he can’t address or counter facts,biggest trollboy at the site sling with candyass.paid shills.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

ESDRAELON said:


> 55 years... full immunity from lawsuits over the vaccines.  Yeah... nothing to see here, move along.


Mike gets his ass owned.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

Dragonlady I just proved in my post 1,018 on page 51 that same as every other topic you always discuss,you are a fucking liar as always.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

Care4all I just proved in post number 1,018  on page 51 you are as much a fucking  dumbass lying  troll as he is.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

Care4all better have them not be a dumbass as you were in have them take the vaccine like the brainwashed sheep you are then and get them on Ivermectim and hydroxychrioline then,I seriously hope that your loved oneshave not also taken the vaccine,if they have,I feel bad for them unlike I do with you.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> More dangerous misinformation and propaganda.  Sadly, many who are stupid, ignorant, and vulnerable will lap this up like nectarine.


LordBrownTrout   Well done.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 26, 2021)

SweetSue92 there has a case in the seventys when they had an experimental vaccine that killed far less people than this vaccine is doing and the government stopped the dustribution of it yet their vaccine has killed 20 to,es more people than that one did yet they have not halted it how much more proof do these morons need the elite are trying to kill us all off through vaccines


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Let me guess,your going to try and tell us biden is a supporter of medical science.lol,if so,you are as much a trollboy as him.lol


What I’ve said is absolutely true. Don’t change the subject. Trump verbally bashed science his entire presidency and he now supports vaccines. Only an idiot would deny that. Secondly, Biden literally  makes every decision with science involved. That’s totally opposite to what the GOP does. Catering to the  far right religious fanatics, the white supremest and the tax cuts for the rich, pretty much guarantees science is a bad word to conservatives. Except to Catholics, s in e is a bad word to right wing Christians.   .


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Without tooting my own horn,the only post that matters on this thread is this post of mine,everything thst has been posted on this thread is irrelevent,mikegriffith1 is a fucking dumbass,thst cannot be debated,the best doctors in the world have talked about and proven that the vaccine is dangerous and it’s well known thousands of people around the world,probably millions even,have died from the vaccines.many who were in perfect health.
> 
> what’s also well,known is the majority in hospitals that have covid took the vaccine and any doctor that speaks out on the dangers of vaccines gets fired,not only thst if they don’t follow hospital protocols and try to treat them with hydroxchroquine and Ivermectim,they are dismissed as well.many doctors have come forward and said so.America’s front line doctors have said they have treated thousands of their patients across the country and have cured them all therefore Mike is a fucking liar and full of shit we need vaccines.
> 
> ...


What a stupid anti science rant. At least produce some evidence without rambling. Going on line and producing a few sickos that agree with you is not evidence. It’s evidence if Yale and other med research agree with you. They are backed by years of research and hundreds of studies.

Now, get off you bogus ass and just start asking why Yale and the 3400 other research facilities don’t recommend  your bogus treatments OVER vaccines. Afraid ? Of course you are.


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Care4all I just proved in post number 1,018  on page 51 you are as much a fucking  dumbass lying  troll as he is.


Rambling bullshit isn’t proof. It’s rambling bullshit.


----------



## mamooth (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Without tooting my own horn,the only post that matters on this thread is this post of mine,everything thst has been posted on this thread is irrelevent,


Basically everything you said in that rant was the opposite of reality. Non-cultists know that, so you can't gaslight us. Your BS only works on your fellow brainwashed cult pals.

Sadly, that means you have a good chance of dying from COVID. If you sport a beer-belly, goatee and knock-off Oakleys, your chance of death is crazy high. Such people may as well climb into the coffin now, to save everyone the trouble of moving them.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

Dagosa said:


> What a stupid anti science rant. At least produce some evidence without rambling. Going on line and producing a few sickos that agree with you is not evidence. It’s evidence if Yale and other med research agree with you. They are backed by years of research and hundreds of studies.
> 
> Now, get off you bogus ass and just start asking why Yale and the 3400 other research facilities don’t recommend  your bogus treatments OVER vaccines. Afraid ? Of course you are.


What I’ve said is absolutely true. Don’t change the subject. Trump verbally bashed science his entire presidency and he now supports vaccines. Only an idiot would deny that. Secondly, Biden literally  makes every decision with science involved. That’s totally opposite to what the GOP does. Catering to the  far right religious fanatics, the white supremest and the tax cuts for the rich, pretty much guarantees science is a bad word to conservatives. Except to Catholics, s in e is a bad word to right wing Christians.   .
I’m not changing the subject,trump only trashed  the science of thst mass murderer fuckie,you same as candyass are lying shills that hate America,and don’t know the meaning of the word truth, I


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

Dagosa said:


> Rambling bullshit isn’t proof. It’s rambling bullshit.


So because you are backed up against the wall with nowhere to run unable to refute any of the evidence I gave,you dismiss it as bullshit,what a fucking coward troll,your buddies at Langley pay you well fir your ass beatings,same as idiot 4 all and Mike,neither of you will attempt to address and try and debunk it so you can only grasp at straws and say it’s bullshit like the cowards you are.  You dismiss hard facts that disprove your bullshit as rambling,what a dumbfuck.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

Dagosa said:


> What a stupid anti science rant. At least produce some evidence without rambling. Going on line and producing a few sickos that agree with you is not evidence. It’s evidence if Yale and other med research agree with you. They are backed by years of research and hundreds of studies.
> 
> Now, get off you bogus ass and just start asking why Yale and the 3400 other research facilities don’t recommend  your bogus treatments OVER vaccines. Afraid ? Of course you are.


You just proved to the entire world what a lying paid shill from Langley you are,there have been many doctors around the country  that have come forward and spoken out how the hospitals are receiving massive payoffs to call every death from a gunshot to the head ,a fatal car accident,a fall from the roof as being a covid death to inflate the numbers to scare them to take the vaccine and many have quit their jobs because of that not willing to go along with the coverupyou stupid fuck lying paid shill.I made a thread on this months ago where they are on video saying that and how the vaccines are dangerous and they have cured thousands withIvermectim and hydroxychroline so stop lying I have not given evidence asshole.just because you were too much a coward to come on there On that thread does not mean I did not give evidence, a thread thst I welcome anybody to come on and disprove the evidence,not one person has fuckface.


Many America’s front line doctors have said that,those are not my words you stupid fuck,those are the best doctors in the world,.oh if you were actually capable of admitting you were proven wrong I would post the evidence fir you but you just ignore it sense it destroys your lies. For the people that have come on here and attacked Mike pointing out what an idiot and liar he is,I would post it fir THEM on all those doctors saying that but they already know and have done their research so no need to post it fir open minded people like them that want to know the truth.  also you stupid fuck I HAVE posted a thread on this that has doctors speaking out documenting all this,

You really advertise what a stupid fuck you are,Yale has a long history with other major ivy league university’s of corrupt university teachers.you are playing dodgeball changing the subject evading the evidence thst Several dozens of doctors from America’s front line doctors have treated and cured their patients with those two medicines I mentioned,ignoring it has a 100 % cure rate. Which proves you are a fucking paid shill ignoring the evidence thst many healthy people around the country with no previous health problems are dying from the vaccines.

YOU are the one that’s afraid,you are afraid to try and address and refute the facts I have given that Several of the doctors from America’s front line doctors have said they have successfully treated their patients with Ivermectim and hydroxquire and are afraid to try and tell them to thier faces they are liars thst the vaccines are dangerous and afraid to try and disprove me thst thousands of people worldwide including many of the best athletes the most healthy people in the world,have died weeks and even days later after taking the vaccines you stupid fuck coward.

YOU are the only one afraid to get into a debate and try to refute facts,you proved to the entire board you have to LIE when you can’t refute facts and thst you evade the facts as well.  
You are the one that’s afraid,I made a thread on this in the global events section months ago and posted TONS of evidence,you never even attempted to come on that thread and try and refute my evidence you fucking coward,not one single person that came on could refute any of it. You won’t come on that thread same as you won’t address that evidence I gave just like Mike and idiot4all won’t.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

Trollboy paid shill from Langley Dagosa has proven on this thread he cannot stand toe to toe in a debate so he is the latest sockpuppet shill from Langley fir me to add to my ignore list,he is another shill that has penetrated this site everyone should add to ignore.

In my last post to you before I put you on ignore trollboy,thst last post no doubt  was too complicated for your brain to  comprehend  same as thst other long post was that you dismissed as rambling sense you could not refute the facts in it.

so here is the short version of what I just said,you just proved you cannot stand toe to toe in a debate,that you evade facts and change the subject dismissing the best doctors in the world what they have said then lie and claim I don’t have evidence of that when everybody that knows me,knows that I made a thread on this MONTHS ago with links and videos in it that documents all this of doctors saying they have treated thousands of patients with Ivermectim and hydroxychroline with a 100 % cure rate and have said vaccines are dangerous and ignore  that thousands around the country and the world  have died after taking the vaccines proving you are a paid shill from langley that has penetrated this site.

you ignore all of this and dismiss all the best doctors in the world thst have said all this thst I have posted on my thread and you failed to disprove my facts from post # 1,018 from page 51 evading them like the coward you are dismissing it as rambling so YOU are the One thst is afraid  of a debate NOT me,again not one person has ever come on that thread of mine and been able to refute the evidence I gave so enough of your lies I don’t give evidence,YOU are the one that does not give evidence as demonstrated on this thread.

have fun talking to yourself trollboy.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout these vaccine lovers like trollboy Dagosa  I just got done taking to school,Dragonidiot,idiot4all Mike Griffith golfing gator clipper and the other dumbass vaccine lovers are indeed stupid fucks who deny reality that it’s the vaccines killing people around the world and the virus is no more dangerous than the yearly flu virus except fir the elderly,them being the exception.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Dozens dropping in just the last month.  Nobody questioning anything.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Pesky facts lie that are something the trolls here have no interests in that these are althetes with the best health in the world dropping like flies having to stop games to take them to hospitals cause of collapsing on the field after taking vaccines,trollboys like Dagosa will say you gave no evidence of thst as well.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

Hellokitty mike is a trollboy on crack,not worth following.lol


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> You just proved to the entire world what a lying paid shill from Langley you are,there have been many doctors around the country  that have come forward and spoken out how the hospitals are receiving massive payoffs to call every death from a gunshot to the head ,a fatal car accident,a fall from the roof as being a covid death to inflate the numbers to scare them to take the vaccine and many have quit their jobs because of that not willing to go along with the coverupyou stupid fuck lying paid shill.I made a thread on this months ago where they are on video saying that and how the vaccines are dangerous and they have cured thousands withIvermectim and hydroxychroline so stop lying I have not given evidence asshole.just because you were too much a coward to come on there On that thread does not mean I did not give evidence, a thread thst I welcome anybody to come on and disprove the evidence,not one person has fuckface.
> 
> 
> Many America’s front line doctors have said that,those are not my words you stupid fuck,those are the best doctors in the world,.oh if you were actually capable of admitting you were proven wrong I would post the evidence fir you but you just ignore it sense it destroys your lies. For the people that have come on here and attacked Mike pointing out what an idiot and liar he is,I would post it fir THEM on all those doctors saying that but they already know and have done their research so no need to post it fir open minded people like them that want to know the truth.  also you stupid fuck I HAVE posted a thread on this that has doctors speaking out documenting all this,
> ...


I didn’t read your stupid post. You had no references, just Fix News Tripe. If  you’re going to lie and ramble, don’t bother. No one reads this shit.


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Trollboy paid shill from Langley Dagosa has proven on this thread he cannot stand toe to toe in a debate so he is the latest sockpuppet shill from Langley fir me to add to my ignore list,he is another shill that has penetrated this site everyone should add to ignore.
> 
> In my last post to you before I put you on ignore trollboy,thst last post no doubt  was too complicated for your brain to  comprehend  same as thst other long post was that you dismissed as rambling sense you could not refute the facts in it.
> 
> ...


Geesus, you have no life do you ?


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> So because you are backed up against the wall with nowhere to run unable to refute any of the evidence I gave,you dismiss it as bullshit,what a fucking coward troll,your buddies at Langley pay you well fir your ass beatings,same as idiot 4 all and Mike,neither of you will attempt to address and try and debunk it so you can only grasp at straws and say it’s bullshit like the cowards you are.  You dismiss hard facts that disprove your bullshit as rambling,what a dumbfuck.


The worlds longest unreadable sentence. Not only are you science  illiterate, you’re illiterate. You’re in all an internet tough guy who‘s afraid of his own shadow, like Tucker.


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> So because you are backed up against the wall with nowhere to run unable to refute any of the evidence I gave,you dismiss it as bullshit,what a fucking coward troll,your buddies at Langley pay you well fir your ass beatings,same as idiot 4 all and Mike,neither of you will attempt to address and try and debunk it so you can only grasp at straws and say it’s bullshit like the cowards you are.  You dismiss hard facts that disprove your bullshit as rambling,what a dumbfuck.


I bet I make your day just responding. I bet no one   listens to you in real life. This is the internet where even low life’s who just make up shit are allowed to post.


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

Someone farted in here.

did I call it or did I call it folks thst trollboy whom I just schooled,would come back and talk to himself again?


----------



## LA RAM FAN (Dec 27, 2021)

eagle1462010 said:


> They don't care.  Gov't is their GOD.  Just the cheap drugs would save hundreds of thousands of lives.
> 
> Western countries are doing the same in many places.  Going full Nazi in many.  Brain Washed idiots.


Trollboys like him and dacosa Mike and others have no interest in hearing those facts of course because as you just said so well eagle1462010 the government is THEIR god,anything that does not conform to the government they worship,they dismiss.


----------



## Dagosa (Dec 27, 2021)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Trollboys like him and dacosa Mike and others have no interest in hearing those facts of course because as you just said so well eagle1462010 the government is THEIR god,anything that does not conform to the government they worship,they dismiss.


You wouldn’t recognize  a fact if you had to read it.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 22, 2022)

candycorn said:


> Not all conservatives are immune from the truth.  Good to see you've found some independence.


They call themselves "conservatives" but they are just tump supporters. They eat whatever tump says, for lunch. Let's not forget that tump has been a liberal Democrat all his sorry life, until he had to change his stripes to run as a Republican.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 22, 2022)

LA RAM FAN said:


> Trollboys like him and dacosa Mike and others have no interest in hearing those facts of course because as you just said so well eagle1462010 the government is THEIR god,anything that does not conform to the government they worship,they dismiss.


tump is your ilks' god, and anything that does not conform to the god they worship, they dismiss as "fake", "lies", "stolen", etc.


----------



## candycorn (Jan 22, 2022)

Bobob said:


> They call themselves "conservatives" but they are just tump supporters. They eat whatever tump says, for lunch. Let's not forget that tump has been a liberal Democrat all his sorry life, until he had to change his stripes to run as a Republican.


You're 100% correct.

Trump was about one thing, sticking it to someone.  Didn't matter who they were.  Its the same thing you see on reality TV.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 22, 2022)

Bobob said:


> They call themselves "conservatives" but they are just tump supporters. They eat whatever tump says, for lunch. Let's not forget that tump has been a liberal Democrat all his sorry life, until he had to change his stripes to run as a Republican.


Yup….
As a fraud and a grifter he couldn’t  get enough support from Democrats. They weren’t gullible enough. But conservatives  bought all this shit. Heck, they’ll believe in the tooth fairy.  After all, he’s captivated the white  supremacists of the country.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 22, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Yup….
> As a fraud and a grifter he couldn’t  get enough support from Democrats. They weren’t gullible enough. But conservatives  bought all this shit. Heck, they’ll believe in the tooth fairy.  After all, he’s captivated the white  supremacists of the country.


Most of these people are not conservatives, because they don't have conservative values. They, for some reason, have adopted tump's values and enjoy him expressing them--like mocking a handicapped person, threatening other countries with his "locked and loaded" attitude, dissing a gold star family because of their color, virtually challenging our way of life with his attack on our election, etc.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 22, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Most of these people are not conservatives, because they don't have conservative values. They, for some reason, have adopted tump's values and enjoy him expressing them--like mocking a handicapped person, threatening other countries with his "locked and loaded" attitude, dissing a gold star family because of their color, virtually challenging our way of life with his attack on our election, etc.


I don’t know what conservatives values are ? It hasn’t been demonstrated by the gop for decades. There is one party that has had 11 of the last 12 recessions, didn’t pay their bills, has had the most criminal indictments, leads in the greatest deficit and  has been stomping on voting rights for 20 years. This didn't start with Trump.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 23, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> I don’t know what conservatives values are ? It hasn’t been demonstrated by the gop for decades. There is one party that has had 11 of the last 12 recessions, didn’t pay their bills, has had the most criminal indictments, leads in the greatest deficit and  has been stomping on voting rights for 20 years. This didn't start with Trump.


Maybe True, but I am referring to family values, moral compass, taking responsibility. Trump did none of the above. Recessions don't necessarily originate during Republican times, because the seeds are planted long before. About Trump--he is challenging our democracy with his nefarious antics.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 23, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Maybe True, but I am referring to family values, moral compass, taking responsibility. Trump did none of the above. Recessions don't necessarily originate during Republican times, because the seeds are planted long before. About Trump--he is challenging our democracy with his nefarious antics.


Moral compass ? Really ? All the recessions originated during the Republican administration.
Its the administration responsibility to “pay the bills” and keep money flowing from the worlds biggest emplyee, enforce regulations passed by Congress and support the full function of the regulatory commissions. The gop does none of that. It’s not rocket in how to avoid recessions.  The gop traditionally fails.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 23, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Moral compass ? Really ? All the recessions originated during the Republican administration.
> Its the administration responsibility to “pay the bills” and keep money flowing from the worlds biggest emplyee, enforce regulations passed by Congress and support the full function of the regulatory commissions. The gop does none of that. It’s not rocket in how to avoid recessions.  The gop traditionally fails.


I know that you are anti-Republican. I try to support the person and not the party. Hence, Tump is
out of the question. Liz Cheney, Chris Christie, Mitt Romney are good people who I could support.
Hubert Humphrey, Reagan, George H W Bush, Jeb Bush were others that I supported. Obama and Kerry-yes.
So yes, moral compass.
Carter, Clinton were responsible for recessions that were their doing for the most part, even though Republicans inherited their mess.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 23, 2022)

Bobob


Bobob said:


> I know that you are anti-Republican. I try to support the person and not the party. Hence, Tump is
> out of the question. Liz Cheney, Chris Christie, Mitt Romney are good people who I could support.
> Hubert Humphrey, Reagan, George H W Bush, Jeb Bush were others that I supported. Obama and Kerry-yes.
> So yes, moral compass.
> Carter, Clinton were responsible for recessions that were their doing for the most part, even though Republicans inherited their mess.


Wow,  Bush did a wonderful job turning a booming economy with years of balanced budgets into the biggest recession since 1929. You’re going to blame a recession that started seven years after Bush entered office on the previous President Clinton. Someone is really stupid. Wonder if those huge tax cuts and letting banks and corporations run amuck had anything to do with it. Bush was a stupid nimrod whose saving grace was the bigger idiot Trump……”covid will be gone this spring” and  “let’s look into injecting people with industrial cleaner” works for you. The gop is filled with crooks from every admin but Bush one. 11 of the last 12 recessions were under GOP admins. Over 200 indicted under the gop to 2 under Dems. Nice job trying  to throw shit.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 23, 2022)

Bobob said:


> I know that you are anti-Republican.


I’m anti any party that’s anti science, anti voter rights and backs Trump. The GOP is now discussing not engaging in any debate for national offices because of Trumps influence . This is what dictatorships do. The gop has become an apartheid party of minority rule in control of the highest bidder. I used to vote for repo candidates as an independent till they ALL started taking the crazy pills.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 23, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> I’m anti any party that’s anti science…



  Is Bruce Jenner a man or is he a woman?

  Which party is it that has, as an explicit plank of its platform, a denial and repudiation of the hard science that pertains to the biological distinction between men and women?


----------



## Bobob (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Bobob
> 
> Wow,  Bush did a wonderful job turning a booming economy with years of balanced budgets into the biggest recession since 1929. You’re going to blame a recession that started seven years after Bush entered office on the previous President Clinton. Someone is really stupid. Wonder if those huge tax cuts and letting banks and corporations run amuck had anything to do with it. Bush was a stupid nimrod whose saving grace was the bigger idiot Trump……”covid will be gone this spring” and  “let’s look into injecting people with industrial cleaner” works for you. The gop is filled with crooks from every admin but Bush one. 11 of the last 12 recessions were under GOP admins. Over 200 indicted under the gop to 2 under Dems. Nice job trying  to throw shit.


Clinton admitted that he was responsible for the  recession at the end of his presidency. I speak of Bush senior, not Bush junior. I never insinuated that industrial cleaner should be used. I agree with you totally about Bush Jr. and tump, and did not support either of them.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Is Bruce Jenner a man or is he a woman?
> 
> Which party is it that has, as an explicit plank of its platform, a denial and repudiation of the hard science that pertains to the biological distinction between men and women?


Tell us, why is that a problem for you ? There is no science involved in that question. They have addressed everything about sex differences. It’s just you changing the conversation to something  you have a problem with.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Jan 24, 2022)

Only thing missing herenfrom leftists here are pom poms


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

eagle1462010 said:


> Only thing missing herenfrom leftists here are pom poms


The only stupid democrats are the ones who want to negotiate with Republicans. They keep forgetting that Republicans have no platform, agenda or policies. They are waiting to hear from their rich donors before they vote on anything.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Clinton admitted that he was responsible for the  recession at the end of his presidency. I speak of Bush senior, not Bush junior. I never insinuated that industrial cleaner should be used. I agree with you totally about Bush Jr. and tump, and did not support either of them.


Since when did this happen ? The Bush recessions like all recessions happen for a variety  of reasons, all of which have to be dealt with collectively. Republicans have trouble walking and chewing gum, let alone managing the atmosphere of a diverse economy.,


----------



## eagle1462010 (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> The only stupid democrats are the ones who want to negotiate with Republicans. They keep forgetting that Republicans have no platform, agenda or policies. They are waiting to hear from their rich donors before they vote on anything.


You work in a pixie dust factory don't ya?  Powered by Unicorns.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Since when did this happen ? The Bush recessions like all recessions happen for a variety  of reasons, all of which have to be dealt with collectively. Republicans have trouble walking and chewing gum, let alone managing the atmosphere of a diverse economy.,


Carter is happy to transfer the title Mr. Stagflation to Biden.  Good job Brandon.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

eagle1462010 said:


> You work in a pixie dust factory don't ya?  Powered by Unicorns.


The gop is driven by donors who call the shots. You can’t tell us the platform of the last presidential election from the right can you. It’s because they had none…..unless you call birtherism, jail Hillary and excuse the assassination of school kids to appease the nra , a party platform. 
,


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

eagle1462010 said:


> Carter is happy to transfer the title Mr. Stagflation to Biden.  Good job Brandon.


Gee, Biden created more jobs and saved more lives of those who believe in science then Trump ever did. Oh, did we mention he had the usual gop recession ?


eagle1462010 said:


> Carter is happy to transfer the title Mr. Stagflation to Biden.  Good job Brandon.


You are forgetting the Donny Lardo recession and fiasco handling COVID.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> The gop is driven by donors who call the shots. You can’t tell us the platform of the last presidential election from the right can you. It’s because they had none…..unless you call birtherism, jail Hillary and excuse the assassination of school kids to appease the nra , a party platform.
> ,


Trump platform of less regulations and not allowing the communists to take SCOTUS.  As far as the career politicians both sides need to be fired.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Gee, Biden created more jobs and saved more lives of those who believe in science then Trump ever did. Oh, did we mention he had the usual gop recession ?
> 
> You are forgetting the Donny Lardo recession and fiasco handling COVID.


Fake ass counting.  Leftist help destroy jobs and small businesses with covid regulations then try to doubletap the numbers that return.  Typical cooking the books like housing before the 2008 crash.


----------



## Captain Caveman (Jan 24, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


No, many view politics as a single axis, Left or Right. There's several axes, hence why someone who pigeons hole someone as a Right Wing Conservative, expects them to be X, y, and z. Doesn't work like that.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> I’m anti any party that’s anti science…





Bob Blaylock said:


> Is Bruce Jenner a man or is he a woman?
> 
> Which party is it that has, as an explicit plank of its platform, a denial and repudiation of the hard science that pertains to the biological distinction between men and women?





Dagosa said:


> Tell us, why is that a problem for you ? There is no science involved in that question. They have addressed everything about sex differences. It’s just you changing the conversation to something  you have a problem with.



  Science has everything to do with it; and your denial and repudiation of science, in this instance, puts the lie to your earlier statement that you are _“anti any party that’s anti science”_.

  The hard, underminable fact remains that the Democrapic party has explicit planks in its platform that deny the hard science pertaining to the distinction between men and women, and denying the significance of this distinction and the relative roles thereof to the purpose of perpetuating the human race.

  That is only one of several ways in which the Democraps are explicitly the anti-science party.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> The hard, underminable fact remains that the Democrapic party has explicit planks in its platform that deny the hard science pertaining to the distinction between men and women, and denying the significance of this distinction and the relative roles thereof to the purpose of perpetuating the human race.


Woo woo. Lots of babble from an science illiterate.  .You really have a problem.   Maybe  it’s you who should come out of the closet.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Woo woo. Lots of babble from an science illiterate.  .You really have a problem.   Maybe  it’s you who should come out of the closet.



  Is Bruce Jenner a man or a woman?

  What does the science say?


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Is Bruce Jenner a man or a woman?
> 
> What does the science say?


I guess you don’t  have access science or you don’t have much of a life if all you care about is how Bruce Jenner lives. Really, is that all you can think about.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> Is Bruce Jenner a man or a woman?
> 
> What does the science say?


Really ? You think there’s a science textbook book out there that  discusses  Bruce Jenner ? That’s hilarious.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> I guess you don’t  have access science or you don’t have much of a life if all you care about is how Bruce Jenner lives. Really, is that all you can think about.





Dagosa said:


> Really ? You think there’s a science textbook book out there that  discusses  Bruce Jenner ? That’s hilarious.



  I think my point has been made well enough.

  Anyone who has any grasp on science, who has any credibility with regard to anything to do with science, would have no difficulty at all stating the obvious scientific fact, that his insane delusions, and the quasi-medical mutilations he has had done to himself notwithstanding, Bruce Jenner is a man, and not, in any meaningful sense, a woman.

  You cannot bring yourself to say it.  And you can't stop from hiding behind all sorts of absurd semantic games, because unlike many on the left *wrong*, you still have barely enough of a grasp on reality to know that if you came out and said that you think Bruce Jenner is a woman, then you'd be branding yourself as batshit crazy.

  It's an easy enough question for anyone who is sane and honest to answer:  Is Bruce Jenner a man or is he a woman?  You cannot and will not answer, because you are neither sane nor honest.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 24, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> I think my point has been made well enough.
> 
> Anyone who has any grasp on science, who has any credibility with regard to anything to do with science, would have no difficulty at all stating the obvious scientific fact, that his insane delusions, and the quasi-medical mutilations he has had done to himself notwithstanding, Bruce Jenner is a man, and not, in any meaningful sense, a woman.
> 
> ...


No one  except the weird has any idea what your point is. Why do you even care ? Sane people don’t. You spent three paragraphs worrying about Bruce Jenner. You got a secret you’re hiding ? I have a sane and honest answer. I don’t care. And no. There is no science  book out there that addresses Bruce Jenner..


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 24, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> No one  except the weird has any idea what your point is. Why do you even care ? Sane people don’t. You spent three paragraphs worrying about Bruce Jenner. You got a secret you’re hiding ? I have a sane and honest answer. I don’t care. And no. There is no science  book out there that addresses Bruce Jenner..



  It goes directly to your credibility [or lack thereof] with regard to anything to do with science.

  We have now established, beyond any question, that you have no credibility whatsoever in any such fields.

  And the silly semantic games that you are playing to avoid answering a simple and obvious question demonstrate your lack of honesty or integrity, which reflect on your credibility [or, again, lack thereof] on any subject at all.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 25, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Since when did this happen ? The Bush recessions like all recessions happen for a variety  of reasons, all of which have to be dealt with collectively. Republicans have trouble walking and chewing gum, let alone managing the atmosphere of a diverse economy.,


Bush inherited a major recession when he took office. People committed suicide due to the stock market collapse. Clinton admitted that he had loosened banking regulations as a cause. Yes it went full bore under Bush and was brought under control, until he fostered his own recession and left it to Obama to resolve. 

Bill Clinton accepts responsibility for the recession. - Slate ...​https://slate.com › news-and-politics › 2009/05 › bill-cli...


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Seriously


Bobob said:


> Bush inherited a major recession when he took office. People committed suicide due to the stock market collapse. Clinton admitted that he had loosened banking regulations as a cause. Yes it went full bore under Bush and was brought under control, until he fostered his own recession and left it to Obama to resolve.
> Bill Clinton accepts responsibility for the recession. - Slate ...​https://slate.com › news-and-politics › 2009/05 › bill-cli...


Huh ? You’re rewriting history. The recession that literally stopped the world was seven years into Bush 2 where the economy was collapsing.. Bush 2 was too incompetent to fix anything. Where is the quote by Clinton ? And then there was 911 Bush did nothing to prevent when warned about it then with no just cause, invading a nation with NO WMD.  Clinton had nothing to do with it. Clinton tried to fight  terrorism, Bush did nothing….we were attacked and had a huge recession under Bush seven years into his presidency. What did Bush do ? Deregulated Banks even more…..


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Seriously
> 
> Huh ? You’re rewriting history. The recession that literally stopped the world was seven years into Bush 2 where the economy was collapsing.. Bush 2 was too incompetent to fix anything. Where is the quote by Clinton ? And then there was 911 Bush did nothing to prevent when warned about it then with no just cause, invading a nation with NO WMD.  Clinton had nothing to do with it. Clinton tried to fight  terrorism, Bush did nothing….we were attacked and had a huge recession under Bush seven years into his presidency. What did Bush do ? Deregulated Banks even more…..


Just the opposite is true from your own article.
*Clinton rightly rejects as “just a totally off-the-wall crazy argument” that the Community Reinvestment Act, to which significant legislative and regulatory changes were made on his watch, is responsible for creating abuses in the subprime lending market. (*


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> It goes directly to your credibility [or lack thereof] with regard to anything to do with science.
> 
> We have now established, beyond any question, that you have no credibility whatsoever in any such fields.
> 
> And the silly semantic games that you are playing to avoid answering a simple and obvious question demonstrate your lack of honesty or integrity, which reflect on your credibility [or, again, lack thereof] on any subject at all.


That’s funny. You think I care about your evaluation on a forum filled with Trump Humpers and science deniers ?
You‘re the science illiterate. I was quite clear. There is no mention of Bruce Jenner in  ANY SCIENCE text used to teach science. The natural Science of biology had better things to do then appease your silly fears. Geesus, just Google anyone of the hundreds of accredited university science college institutes in the world and make your silly requests about Bruce Jenner. Maybe you’ll get lucky.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 25, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> Seriously
> 
> Huh ? You’re rewriting history. The recession that literally stopped the world was seven years into Bush 2 where the economy was collapsing.. Bush 2 was too incompetent to fix anything. Where is the quote by Clinton ? And then there was 911 Bush did nothing to prevent when warned about it then with no just cause, invading a nation with NO WMD.  Clinton had nothing to do with it. Clinton tried to fight  terrorism, Bush did nothing….we were attacked and had a huge recession under Bush seven years into his presidency. What did Bush do ? Deregulated Banks even more…..


I am aware, and there was a major recession at the end of the Clinton years.  I don't care about Bush jr.
Clinton slashed military spending and many FBI and CIA agents retired because they feared that they were vulnerable while in the field. If you watched TV, many of them were telling their story.
Clinton balanced the budget at the expense of the military.


Dagosa said:


> Seriously
> 
> Huh ? You’re rewriting history. The recession that literally stopped the world was seven years into Bush 2 where the economy was collapsing.. Bush 2 was too incompetent to fix anything. Where is the quote by Clinton ? And then there was 911 Bush did nothing to prevent when warned about it then with no just cause, invading a nation with NO WMD.  Clinton had nothing to do with it. Clinton tried to fight  terrorism, Bush did nothing….we were attacked and had a huge recession under Bush seven years into his presidency. What did Bush do ? Deregulated Banks even more…..


----------



## Bobob (Jan 25, 2022)

Bobob said:


> I am aware, and there was a major recession at the end of the Clinton years.  I don't care about Bush jr.
> Clinton slashed military spending and many FBI and CIA agents retired because they feared that they were vulnerable while in the field. If you watched TV, many of them were telling their story.
> Clinton balanced the budget at the expense of the military.


I know all about Bush 2. There was a recession at the end of the Clinton years, and it was not the Great Recession.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Bobob said:


> am aware, and there was a major recession at the end of the Clinton years.


You just started a paragraph with a lie. You have no reference and obviously, you don’t know what constitutes a recession. The recession began months after Bush took office. There was plenty he could do like every dem admin  before him, to forestall a recession. He did nothing. At least stop lying about a recession or admit you don’t even know what a recession is. Bush was like a deer in the headlights of a car. He did nothing with economic slow down to prevent a recession, nothing to prevent 911 when warned about it, and nothing about Bin Ladin in Bora BOra. He did nothing to insure there were wmd before invading Iraq by making massive tax cuts then going to a war he could not fund. It’s typical. Repugs are incompetent.


“*period of temporary economic decline during which trade and industrial activity are reduced, generally identified by a fall in GDP in two successive quarters.”*


----------



## Bobob (Jan 25, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> You just started a paragraph with a lie. You have no reference and obviously, you don’t know what constitutes a recession. The recession began months after Bush took office. There was plenty he could do like every dem admin  before him, to forestall a recession. He did nothing. At least stop lying about a recession or admit you don’t even know what a recession is. Bush was like a deer in the headlights of a car. He did nothing with economic slow down to prevent a recession, nothing to prevent 911 when warned about it, and nothing about Bin Ladin in Bora BOra. He did nothing to insure there were wmd before invading Iraq by making massive tax cuts then going to a war he could not fund. It’s typical. Repugs are incompetent.
> 
> 
> “*period of temporary economic decline during which trade and industrial activity are reduced, generally identified by a fall in GDP in two successive quarters.”*


Not the Great recession, but the Clinton recession.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Not the Great recession, but the Clinton recession.


Of course, you really don’t know what a recession is do you ? Clinton had no recession. It’s a GOP myth made up….like Hillary is going to jail. All bull shit. Never seen as big a bunch of bag lappers as republucans and Fix News idiots. You guys buy the tripe they pedal. Of course, you have no reference.


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Not the Great recession, but the Clinton recession.


Only Dem President Carter had a recession. Everyother gop had one to two recessions in modern times.  Click  your heals together three times Dorothy, maybe someone will buy this tripe. Not anyone with the mentality greater then a mature cucumber though. .


----------



## Dagosa (Jan 25, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Not the Great recession, but the Clinton recession.


There was no Clinton recession. You need to look up what constitutes a recession, then look at the economic indicators during the Clinton  admin. Otherwise, you’re just making up shit.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 26, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> There was no Clinton recession. You need to look up what constitutes a recession, then look at the economic indicators during the Clinton  admin. Otherwise, you’re just making up shit.


You are joking, right? Every home had a boat and RV in the driveway, and the stock market was humming. People with no stock purchasing experience bought stocks and made much moolah, until it collapsed.

Clinton and Economic Growth in the '90s - FactCheck.org​https://www.factcheck.org › 2007/12 › clinton-and-eco...
Dec 7, 2007 — By the time he left office, the _economy_ was slowing rapidly, and it slipped into _recession_ in March 2001, just weeks after George W. Bush was ...


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 26, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



  The lies and fearmongering on which the entire #CoronaHoax2020 is based; the tyranny and abuse that have been perpetrated in its name, are not conservative values.

  If you support any of this bullshit, then you are no more a conservative than Bruce Jenner is a woman.


----------



## Bobob (Jan 26, 2022)

Bob Blaylock said:


> The lies and fearmongering on which the entire #CoronaHoax2020 is based; the tyranny and abuse that have been perpetrated in its name, are not conservative values.
> 
> If you support any of this bullshit, then you are no more a conservative than Bruce Jenner is a woman.


Tump supporters are not conservatives. Who knows what they are?


----------



## eagle1462010 (Jan 26, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Tump supporters are not conservatives. Who knows what they are?


We are against you.  Nuff said.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Jan 26, 2022)

Bobob said:


> Tump [sic] supporters are not conservatives. Who knows what they are?



  Nobody is looking to a left *wrong*-wing piece of filth to define for us who is or is not a conservative.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Wrong.
When almost no one was vaccinated, then almost all those dying were unvaccinated.
But now that the majority are vaccinated, then the majority of those dying are vaccinated.

The mRNA vaccines are not at all safe or effective.
The 2nd Modena shot nearly killed me, I was sicker than I had ever been in my whole life, it lasted for months, and my toes are still numb.
The efficacy only STARTS high, but drops to ZERO by 6 months, so is useless as a vaccine.

The main means by which all epidemics normally end is herd immunity.
Which means the faster you spread an infection among those least likely to die, the sooner it is over and it stops killing.
By instead "flattening the curve" with masks and social distancing, we are essentially conserving easy hosts, so preventing covid from ever ending.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Dagosa said:


> You just started a paragraph with a lie. You have no reference and obviously, you don’t know what constitutes a recession. The recession began months after Bush took office. There was plenty he could do like every dem admin  before him, to forestall a recession. He did nothing. At least stop lying about a recession or admit you don’t even know what a recession is. Bush was like a deer in the headlights of a car. He did nothing with economic slow down to prevent a recession, nothing to prevent 911 when warned about it, and nothing about Bin Ladin in Bora BOra. He did nothing to insure there were wmd before invading Iraq by making massive tax cuts then going to a war he could not fund. It’s typical. Repugs are incompetent.
> 
> 
> “*period of temporary economic decline during which trade and industrial activity are reduced, generally identified by a fall in GDP in two successive quarters.”*



Good points.
If anything, I would say Clinton was guilty of inflating the bubble and the recession happened much later as the real estate market dropped due to the inability of people to refinance ARM balloon payments based on the British LIBOR.
And yes, Bush was warned about 9/11 ahead of time, knew about Bora Bora but attacked Saddam instead, etc.
My impression of you went up a few notches.


----------



## Stann (Apr 19, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> Wrong.
> When almost no one was vaccinated, then almost all those dying were unvaccinated.
> But now that the majority are vaccinated, then the majority of those dying are vaccinated.
> 
> ...


As far as public health goes I believe only medical experts should be calling the shots. The pandemic response in the United States was pitiful,  it got off to a very bad start. We are 1/20th of the world population but we ended up with 1/6 of the world's deaths from Covid-19.  That is absolutely ridiculous for an advanced nation.


----------



## Concerned American (Apr 19, 2022)

Stann said:


> As far as public health goes I believe only medical experts should be calling the shots. The pandemic response in the United States was pitiful,  it got off to a very bad start. We are 1/20th of the world population but we ended up with 1/6 of the world's deaths from Covid-19.  That is absolutely ridiculous for an advanced nation.


Due to democrat governors in NY, CA and WA putting infected people into nursing homes with the most vulnerable populations.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 19, 2022)

Concerned American said:


> Due to democrat governors in NY, CA and WA putting infected people into nursing homes with the most vulnerable populations.


Not even close.

That “may” have accounted for several thousand deaths… maybe 

But nothing approaching the hundreds of thousands we ended up with.

It was Trump


----------



## Stann (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Not even close.
> 
> That “may” have accounted for several thousand deaths… maybe
> 
> ...


He downplayed the epidemic, he all but ignored prevention measures, any search for a cure. There is no cure for viruses, there are just protective measures.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Stann said:


> As far as public health goes I believe only medical experts should be calling the shots. The pandemic response in the United States was pitiful,  it got off to a very bad start. We are 1/20th of the world population but we ended up with 1/6 of the world's deaths from Covid-19.  That is absolutely ridiculous for an advanced nation.



Except we do NOT have public health care in the US, and the private health care is so corrupt, they control the CDC.
That is why the US got mRNA fakes while the ENTIRE REST of the WORLD, went with real vaccines, containing dead viruses instead.

There is a valid strategy with masks and social distancing, but that ONLY works if you are doing full quarantine, lock down, and contact tracing, like we did for Ebola.
That can end any epidemic ins less than 2 weeks, but is expensive and unnecessary for something like covid.
The lethality for covid is so tiny if you are under 40, that we should have encouraged herd immunity by accelerating the initial spike.


----------



## Manonthestreet (Apr 19, 2022)

are those the cooked numbers or revised


----------



## PoliticalChic (Apr 19, 2022)




----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Stann said:


> He downplayed the epidemic, he all but ignored prevention measures, any search for a cure. There is no cure for viruses, there are just protective measures.



The epidemic SHOULD have been "downplayed" by everyone.
It was not of significant lethality.
It is no more lethal than flu, ON A MONTHLY BASIS.
So why was covid a greater total?
Because when you deliberately "flatten the curve" you prevent the normal ending from herd immunity, and it will go on then FOREVER!


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Not even close.
> 
> That “may” have accounted for several thousand deaths… maybe
> 
> ...



Trump may be greedy or an idiot, but he had absolutely nothing to do with covid.
He funded vaccines and did everything the CDC recommended.
The fault was with the CDC, not Trump.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Not even close.
> 
> That “may” have accounted for several thousand deaths… maybe
> 
> ...


Once again you parade that ignorance.  Tell us, Dr. Fauci wanna-be, what should have been done different?


----------



## Lesh (Apr 19, 2022)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Once again you parade that ignorance.  Tell us, Dr. Fauci wanna-be, what should have been done different?


Taken the virus seriously.

Told people the truth

NOT push to open too soon...

NOT fought mask mandates

NOT promoted heard immunity

NOT politicize the doctors and the CDC

NOT told people to shine lights up their asses and take horse dewormer and fishtank cleaner

For starters


----------



## PoliticalChic (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Taken the virus seriously.
> 
> Told people the truth
> 
> ...



*“Biden Adviser Gives Trump Credit for ‘Great Thing’ He Did for the American People*…Biden’s COVID adviser Andy Slavitt gave credit to work done under the Trump administration to get vaccines rolled out.
“So you are grateful for the work that came prior to it?” Bill Hemmer asked.
“No question,” Slavitt responded.
“So you would tip your hat to Operation Warp Speed?” Hemmer continued.
“I would absolutely tip my hat,” the Biden adviser replied. “This is a scientific process that actually began more than a decade ago with scientists inside the NIH and inside BARDA creating this mRNA vaccine. I think the Trump Administration made sure that we got, in record time, vaccine up and out. That’s a great thing and it’s something that we should all be excited about.” WATCH: Biden Adviser Gives Trump Credit for 'Great Thing' He Did for the American People

* 


“Gov. Cuomo Heaps Praise on Trump for Responsiveness and Decisiveness Amid Coronavirus Outbreak”* Gov. Cuomo Heaps Praise on Trump for Responsiveness and Decisiveness Amid Coronavirus Outbreak



“California Gov. praises Trump's help on coronavirus crisis” California Gov. praises Trump's help on coronavirus crisis



*“Some Democrats Praise Trump’s Leadership Amid Coronavirus*

President Trump’s recent actions to stop the spread of coronavirus have won him praise from an unlikely source: Representative Ilhan Omar….Omar quoted fellow Squad member Representative Ayanna Pressley (D-Mass.) as saying “unprecedented times require unprecedented leadership,” and then added that “we are seeing that in our country right now.”

And Dana Bash of CNN asserted the president’s new aggressive approach to the virus makes him the “kind of leader that people need.” Some Democrats Praise Trump’s Leadership Amid Coronavirus - The New American



* 

*


----------



## Stann (Apr 19, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> Except we do NOT have public health care in the US, and the private health care is so corrupt, they control the CDC.
> That is why the US got mRNA fakes while the ENTIRE REST of the WORLD, went with real vaccines, containing dead viruses instead.
> 
> There is a valid strategy with masks and social distancing, but that ONLY works if you are doing full quarantine, lock down, and contact tracing, like we did for Ebola.
> ...


Public health is in the Constitution, otherwise we would not have a US department of health and safety. You are talking out of your ass.


----------



## Admiral Rockwell Tory (Apr 19, 2022)

Stann said:


> Public health is in the Constitution, otherwise we would not have a US department of health and safety. You are talking out of your ass.


Please cite the text in the Constitution mentioning public health.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Taken the virus seriously.
> 
> Told people the truth
> 
> ...



That is stupid because Trump took the virus not only seriously but accurately.  
He did exactly what the CDC said.
And the truth is that over reacting with masks and social distancing killed the maximum number of people, by preventing herd immunity.
Trump never "pushed to open too soon" and said NOTHING about that.
Trump never "fought mask mandates".
Trump never "promoted herd immunity", although he should have, since that is the only reality.
Trump never "politicized the CDC" or else he would have fired Fauci for being incompetent, as he should have.
Trump never "told people to" do any of the stupid things you said. 
He suggested that maybe the researchers would come up with something?
I dislike Trump, but that post is the biggest collection of lies I have ever heard.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Stann said:


> Public health is in the Constitution, otherwise we would not have a US department of health and safety. You are talking out of your ass.



Wrong.
Public health is NOT on the constitution at all, anywhere.
The closest is in the preamble, and only refers to "the general welfare".
We should NOT have a US department of health and safety, without an amendment.
And then we should have government labs working on things like covid, instead of for profit crooks like Pfizer and Moderna, selling us placebos.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 19, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> That is stupid because Trump took the virus not only seriously but accurately.


He's on tape (ya stupid sck puppet) saying exactly the opposite of what he said in public


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> He's on tape (ya stupid sck puppet) saying exactly the opposite of what he said in public



According to you, but you don't happen to have that tape, do you?
From what I remember, Trump did all sorts of actions such as blocking travelers from Europe, that showed extreme reaction to covid.
The fact the courts reversed his travel bans, it not his fault.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 19, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> According to you, but you don't happen to have that tape, do you?
> From what I remember, Trump did all sorts of actions such as blocking travelers from Europe, that showed extreme reaction to covid.
> The fact the courts reversed his travel bans, it not his fault.


Ya know what he didn't do sock puppet?

Stop travel from Europe. Ya know what he didn't do?

Quarentine ANYONE coming back.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 19, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Ya know what he didn't do sock puppet?
> 
> Stop travel from Europe. Ya know what he didn't do?
> 
> Quarentine ANYONE coming back.



Wrong.
This is an article very unfriendly to Trump, but it still does admit Trump did to the travel restriction recommended by the CDC.









						The Facts on Trump's Travel Restrictions - FactCheck.org
					

President Donald Trump has made a number of misleading statements about his decision on Jan. 31 to impose travel restrictions related to the novel coronavirus epidemic.




					www.factcheck.org


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Not even close.
> 
> That “may” have accounted for several thousand deaths… maybe
> 
> ...


Then why have more people died under Joe Biden than died under Donald Trump?  Your talking point doesn't stand up to even a cursory examination, Lesh!  Trump gave us the vaccines in record time.  Trump gave us so many ventilators we were giving them away to other nations.  What has Biden done?  Besides promise things he didn't deliver on?


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Stann said:


> He downplayed the epidemic, he all but ignored prevention measures, any search for a cure. There is no cure for viruses, there are just protective measures.


So did Nancy Pelosi, Bill De Blasio and even Anthony Fauci early on, Stann!  Show me someone that had it right about Covid from the start!  The fact of the matter is that Trump did his job as President during the epidemic.  He fast tracked vaccine research and development.  He used the power of the Federal Government to get ventilators built and field hospitals delivered to cities like New York that said they needed them!
Joe Biden STARTED with vaccines...ventilators...mask mandates in place and he STILL lost more people than Trump did!  I'm sorry but how do you manage to do THAT?


----------



## PoliticalChic (Apr 20, 2022)

Admiral Rockwell Tory said:


> Please cite the text in the Constitution mentioning public health.




Please direct him to the *eighteen* enumerated powers are explicitly stated in Article I, Section 8.


----------



## Dogmaphobe (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Ya know what he didn't do sock puppet?
> 
> Stop travel from Europe. Ya know what he didn't do?
> 
> Quarentine ANYONE coming back.


The actual truth of the matter is that when Trump talked about limiting travel from the originating point of the virus early on, you mindless Stalinist sheeple were calling him a racist for it. 

 You stupid sociopathic fucks support oppressive shutdowns because your own lives are not ruined by them. Who cares about other people's lives, eh?


----------



## Lesh (Apr 20, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Then why have more people died under Joe Biden than died under Donald Trump?  Your talking point doesn't stand up to even a cursory examination, Lesh!  Trump gave us the vaccines in record time.  Trump gave us so many ventilators we were giving them away to other nations.  What has Biden done?  Besides promise things he didn't deliver on?


Why have more people died? 
A. A longer time period

B. Refusal of people like you to vaccinate

C. Delta

D. Omicron


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Why have more people died?
> A. A longer time period
> 
> B. Refusal of people like you to vaccinate
> ...


Funny.   Refusal to vax.   There was NO Vax for a long period of Trump.  Lmao


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Why have more people died?
> A. A longer time period
> 
> B. Refusal of people like you to vaccinate
> ...


A longer time period?  Did you seriously just claim that?  Explain your rationale, Lesh!  How is that fewer people died under Trump when for the early part of the pandemic we didn't HAVE vaccines...we didn't HAVE enough ventilators...and we had a more virulent strain of Covid!  We also had idiots like Andrew Cuomo putting Covid infected patients back into nursing homes!  Donald Trump had to deal with ALL of that plus a Main Stream Media who did everything they could to paint HIM as the bad guy...and yet he managed to get those vaccines made...those ventilators built and those field hospitals erected!  What the hell has Joe Biden done?  He can't fix the supply chain problem.  He couldn't provide enough testing materials.  He totally dropped the ball on both the Delta and the Omicron variants...seeming not to know they'd be coming.

Joe Biden better at Covid than Donald Trump?  That's a joke...


----------



## Lesh (Apr 20, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> A longer time period? Did you seriously just claim that? Explain your rationale, Lesh!


Trump was Prez for only the first 10 months of the pandemic. Biden has been Prez for 15. Do the math retard


Oldestyle said:


> How is that fewer people died under Trump when for the early part of the pandemic *we didn't HAVE vaccines*


Most of the people who have died during the Biden Admin REFUSED to vaccinate.

There was also the more contagious Delta and Omicron


----------



## Lesh (Apr 20, 2022)

As far as blaming all the deaths on Cuomo

More people have died in Florida than NY


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> As far as blaming all the deaths on Cuomo
> 
> More people have died in Florida than NY


No shit, Sherlock!  Old people move to Florida and then they die.  Duh?  You really aren't the sharpest tool in the shed...are you?


----------



## Lesh (Apr 20, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> No shit, Sherlock!  Old people move to Florida and then they die.  Duh?  You really aren't the sharpest tool in the shed...are you?


You think it was 20 yr olds dying in NY?

DiSantis was a Deathsaster


----------



## Lesh (Apr 20, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Old people move to Florida and then they die.


Do they move to Texas?

20,000 more died in Texas than NY


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Trump was Prez for only the first 10 months of the pandemic. Biden has been Prez for 15. Do the math retard
> 
> Most of the people who have died during the Biden Admin REFUSED to vaccinate.
> 
> There was also the more contagious Delta and Omicron











						COVID-19 deaths in 2021 have surpassed last year's count, CDC data shows: Live updates
					

COVID-19 has killed more people in 2021 than 2020, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data shows. Latest updates.




					news.yahoo.com
				




I'll let someone do it for me, Lesh!  Omicron was more contagious...it wasn't even CLOSE to being as deadly!  You're clueless...it's becoming a habit with you.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> You think it was 20 yr olds dying in NY?
> 
> DiSantis was a Deathsaster


You on the left TRIED to paint DeSantis as DeathSantis and Cuomo as Saint Andrew, Lesh!  Then it came out that Cuomo was killing helpless seniors and hiding it so he could sell books.  More egg on your face.  But what else is new?


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 20, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Do they move to Texas?
> 
> 20,000 more died in Texas than NY


Haven't you been paying attention, Lesh?  EVERYONE is leaving New York and most of them are moving to...drum roll please...Florida and Texas!  You keep getting dumber with each subsequent post!


----------



## Dagosa (Apr 21, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> Good points.
> If anything, I would say Clinton was guilty of inflating the bubble and the recession happened much later as the real estate market dropped due to the inability of people to refinance ARM balloon payments based on the British LIBOR.
> And yes, Bush was warned about 9/11 ahead of time, knew about Bora Bora but attacked Saddam instead, etc.
> My impression of you went up a few notches.


If that’s true, for 8  years after the Clinton admin, Bush was too incompetent to correct his mistakes, even in the years he had full control of congress. Bush and his cronies are 100% responsible for 911, his recession and the huge debt incurred from his unfounded war in Iraq and the resulting years of dealing with the additional terrorism that evolve from his incompetent administration. Trump has sought and succeeded in increasing the level of incompetence. He makes Bush look like Abraham Lincoln 
.


----------



## Dagosa (Apr 21, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> There is a valid strategy with masks and social distancing, but that ONLY works if you are doing full quarantine, lock down, and contact tracing, like we did for Ebola.


No logic. The diseases are totally different.


----------



## Dagosa (Apr 21, 2022)

Bobob said:


> I am aware, and there was a major recession at the end of the Clinton years.  I don't care about Bush jr.
> Clinton slashed military spending and many FBI and CIA agents retired because they feared that they were vulnerable while in the field. If you watched TV, many of them were telling their story.
> Clinton balanced the budget at the expense of the military.


Hilarious……”many” say this ? Like whom ? Sounds  like a Trumpism….” People are saying”…..BS with no evidence is just BS.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 21, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Haven't you been paying attention, Lesh?  EVERYONE is leaving New York and most of them are moving to...drum roll please...Florida and Texas!  You keep getting dumber with each subsequent post!


I LIVE in NY.

Haven't seen anyone moving out.

Clearly "everyone" is bullshit


----------



## OhPleaseJustQuit (Apr 21, 2022)

Lesh said:


> I LIVE in NY.
> 
> Haven't seen anyone moving out.
> 
> Clearly "everyone" is bullshit


Explains a lot.


----------



## Stann (Apr 21, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> The epidemic SHOULD have been "downplayed" by everyone.
> It was not of significant lethality.
> It is no more lethal than flu, ON A MONTHLY BASIS.
> So why was covid a greater total?
> Because when you deliberately "flatten the curve" you prevent the normal ending from herd immunity, and it will go on then FOREVER!


I think a million dead in the United States alone is significant. Maybe you didn't lose anyone,maybe you were one of the few lucky ones who didn't lose someone to the pandemic or maybe you just want to ignore the facts. I don't know and I don't care. The government has the authority to issue mandates to protect the public safety. That is one of the duties of our government.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 21, 2022)

Stann said:


> I think a million dead in the United States alone is significant. Maybe you didn't lose anyone,maybe you were one of the few lucky ones who didn't lose someone to the pandemic or maybe you just want to ignore the facts. I don't know and I don't care. The government has the authority to issue mandates to protect the public safety. That is one of the duties of our government.


Freedom days NO.  Anyone who says different can kiss my ass,.....fitting symbol of the DNC


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 21, 2022)

OhPleaseJustQuit said:


> Explains a lot.


Guaranteed Moonbat


----------



## Concerned American (Apr 21, 2022)

Stann said:


> I think a million dead in the United States alone is significant. Maybe you didn't lose anyone,maybe you were one of the few lucky ones who didn't lose someone to the pandemic or maybe you just want to ignore the facts. I don't know and I don't care. The government has the authority to issue mandates to protect the public safety. That is one of the duties of our government.


Maybe they should ban abortion then, eh?  Sixty million murdered souls in fifty years is quite the record, don't you agree?


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 21, 2022)

Lesh said:


> I LIVE in NY.
> 
> Haven't seen anyone moving out.
> 
> Clearly "everyone" is bullshit


Everyone with the means to move out are going.  The only people that are going to be left in the cesspool by the time this is done will be the poor and homeless.  The quality of life in New York City sucks!  You're taking your life in your hands riding the subway.  You keep right on deluding yourself, Lesh!


----------



## Lesh (Apr 21, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Everyone with the means to move out are going.


hardly. Maybe you can provide a lnk to this huge disapora?


Oldestyle said:


> The quality of life in New York City sucks!


You don't have a clue what life in NY OR NYC is like.

In fact my son is renting a house from a couple who moved TO NYC recently


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 21, 2022)

Lesh said:


> hardly. Maybe you can provide a lnk to this huge disapora?
> 
> You don't have a clue what life in NY OR NYC is like.
> 
> In fact my son is renting a house from a couple who moved TO NYC recently


How did you fair on Congress   Lose Reps lmao


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 21, 2022)

Lesh said:


> hardly. Maybe you can provide a lnk to this huge disapora?
> 
> You don't have a clue what life in NY OR NYC is like.
> 
> In fact my son is renting a house from a couple who moved TO NYC recently


I used to date someone from New Rochelle.  That was in the pre Rudy days.  It was very similar then...to the way things are now.  New York City used to be a place where if you had enough money you could insulate yourself from crime.  That's no longer the case.  It's now dangerous to everyone.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 21, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> *I used to date someone from New Rochelle.*  That was in the pre Rudy days.  It was very similar then...to the way things are now.  New York City used to be a place where if you had enough money you could insulate yourself from crime.  That's no longer the case.  It's now dangerous to everyone.


Oh yea...that makes you an expert on demographics and NYC...dope


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 21, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Oh yea...that makes you an expert on demographics and NYC...dope


My point...oh Clueless One...is that I know a great deal about New York City since I've been visiting the city since the mid 70's.  I saw what it was like before Rudy G.  I saw how much better it was after he cracked down on crime.  I saw the decades of low crime before De Blasio's policies recreated conditions from way back then.  I've seen how bad it's gotten since.

My question for you is a simple one.  If you pretend to know about NYC...then how is it that you don't see how dangerous the city is right now?


----------



## Lesh (Apr 21, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> My point...oh Clueless One...is that I know a great deal about New York City since I've been visiting the city since the mid 70's.  I saw what it was like before Rudy G.  I saw how much better it was after he cracked down on crime.  I saw the decades of low crime before De Blasio's policies recreated conditions from way back then.  I've seen how bad it's gotten since.
> 
> My question for you is a simple one.  If you pretend to know about NYC...then how is it that you don't see how dangerous the city is right now?


So an occasional visitor is an expert on the city and the demographics of population shifts

Right. Fuck off or post links


And I have lived just outside the city my entire life and have worked IN the city off and on for most of my life

So yea...you don't know shit


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> A longer time period?  Did you seriously just claim that?  Explain your rationale, Lesh!  How is that fewer people died under Trump when for the early part of the pandemic we didn't HAVE vaccines...we didn't HAVE enough ventilators...and we had a more virulent strain of Covid!  We also had idiots like Andrew Cuomo putting Covid infected patients back into nursing homes!  Donald Trump had to deal with ALL of that plus a Main Stream Media who did everything they could to paint HIM as the bad guy...and yet he managed to get those vaccines made...those ventilators built and those field hospitals erected!  What the hell has Joe Biden done?  He can't fix the supply chain problem.  He couldn't provide enough testing materials.  He totally dropped the ball on both the Delta and the Omicron variants...seeming not to know they'd be coming.
> 
> Joe Biden better at Covid than Donald Trump?  That's a joke...


Joe Biden let the experts decide what to do about the pandemic from the very beginning, he didn't doubt them like trump did, or say that he knew better than they did. trump was a total buffoon when it came to the pandemic and that is why the United States leads the world in pandemic deaths.


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

eagle1462010 said:


> Freedom days NO.  Anyone who says different can kiss my ass,.....fitting symbol of the DNC


Freedom from a virus ? You got to be insane.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Lesh said:


> So an occasional visitor is an expert on the city and the demographics of population shifts
> 
> Right. Fuck off or post links
> 
> ...


You want me to post links on how often I've visited New York City?  Amusing.

If you DO live in New York...then you DO know that it's broken.  If you DO live in New York then you DO know that it's losing it's population and that demographic "shift" is real!  I'm not quite sure why you'd want to deny that's happening but that's on you.  You can't fix something until you admit that it's broken.  Denying it's happened just makes you look foolish.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> Joe Biden let the experts decide what to do about the pandemic from the very beginning, he didn't doubt them like trump did, or say that he knew better than they did. trump was a total buffoon when it came to the pandemic and that is why the United States leads the world in pandemic deaths.


Experts, Stann?  Who?  Anthony Fauci?  That little publicity hound is the biggest idiot on the planet and Joe put him in charge of Covid because he opposed Trump.  The United States leads the world in pandemic deaths BECAUSE of your so called experts!  Total buffoon?  That pretty much sums up two people...Joe Biden and Anthony Fauci!


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> You want me to post links on how often I've visited New York City?  Amusing.
> 
> If you DO live in New York...then you DO know that it's broken.  If you DO live in New York then you DO know that it's losing it's population and that demographic "shift" is real!  I'm not quite sure why you'd want to deny that's happening but that's on you.  You can't fix something until you admit that it's broken.  Denying it's happened just makes you look foolish.


You're both idiots. Crime is getting worse everywhere. In Omaha Nebraska, which definitely has traditional hardline policing. Crimes, especially murders are up. I think people are just going crazy, and I'm hoping all the crazies kill each other off without too much collateral damage. I think drugs are driving it all. I just thought I live in a small town outside of Omaha. I used to visit the city all the time, now I'm lucky if I get there once a month. Some things are just for the better.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> You're both idiots. Crime is getting worse everywhere. In Omaha Nebraska, which definitely has traditional hardline policing. Crimes, especially murders are up. I think people are just going crazy, and I'm hoping all the crazies kill each other off without too much collateral damage. I think drugs are driving it all. I just thought I live in a small town outside of Omaha. I used to visit the city all the time, now I'm lucky if I get there once a month. Some things are just for the better.


Not like New York, Stann.  Omaha is NOTHING like New York at the moment.  You're trying to rationalize the results of progressive policies on urban cities by saying it's happening everywhere and that's not reality and you know it.


----------



## evenifigoalone (Apr 22, 2022)

Nothing like logging onto the hellsite for reminding me why I listen to Last Resort by Papa Roach


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> You're both idiots. Crime is getting worse everywhere. In Omaha Nebraska, which definitely has traditional hardline policing. Crimes, especially murders are up. I think people are just going crazy, and I'm hoping all the crazies kill each other off without too much collateral damage. I think drugs are driving it all. I just thought I live in a small town outside of Omaha. I used to visit the city all the time, now I'm lucky if I get there once a month. Some things are just for the better.


And here's the thing.  Respect for the order of law is something that can be squandered and once that happens it spreads like a virus.  You think crime in Omaha is because of drugs?  Think about it, Stann.  It's because people in charge of things decided to do stupid things like open up the border and defund the Police.  Actions like that have consequences and what you're seeing now in Omaha has leached there from Chicago...from New York City...from Los Angelos.


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Not like New York, Stann.  Omaha is NOTHING like New York at the moment.  You're trying to rationalize the results of progressive policies on urban cities by saying it's happening everywhere and that's not reality and you know it.


I looked at the national statistics, from 1991 until 2015 violent crimes are going down it's reversed in 2018 and 2019 and by 2020 it was significantly increased. I don't care who's in charge of the police whether they're liberal or downright right wing hardcore. That doesn't seem to matter that every every place is getting worse. Something changed in society, respect and courtesy went out the window, insults and spontaneous violence took its place.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> I looked at the national statistics, from 1991 until 2015 violent crimes are going down it's reversed in 2018 and 2019 and by 2020 it was significantly increased. I don't care who's in charge of the police whether they're liberal or downright right wing hardcore. That doesn't seem to matter that every every place is getting worse. Something changed in society, respect and courtesy went out the window, insults and spontaneous violence took its place.


It isn't spontaneous violence, Stann.  It's happening because naive people have been making policy.
People that don't understand human nature.  People that are clueless about what happens when you don't enforce the law because of "wokeness"...because of false narratives about "systemic racism"!


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> It isn't spontaneous violence, Stann.  It's happening because naive people have been making policy.
> People that don't understand human nature.  People that are clueless about what happens when you don't enforce the law because of "wokeness"...because of false narratives about "systemic racism"!


All I know is all these bad changes started happening when trump started spouting his nonsense. I think he more than anyone else brought all the crazies out.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> All I know is all these bad changes started happening when trump started spouting his nonsense. I think he more than anyone else brought all the crazies out.


Come on, Stann!  This has nothing to do with Trump and you know it.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

This is the whole "broken window" theory played out on a bigger stage and Donald Trump has zero to do with that!


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> Freedom from a virus ? You got to be insane.


Freedom to make your own choices you Moonbat


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> All I know is all these bad changes started happening when trump started spouting his nonsense. I think he more than anyone else brought all the crazies out.


Crazies.  Uou get the jab and still piss yourself if a dreaded unvaxxed is near??  You are Loco


----------



## Batcat (Apr 22, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


Technically we have no idea what the long term side effects of the vaccines are. I doubt if any truly serious side effects will emerge over the next 20 years but who really knows. 

In a free nation I personally feel a citizen should have the right to determine if he wants to risk taking a brand new vaccine with a short track record. 

I made my decision based on my own risk analysis. I am 75 years old and overweight with a number of medical issues that make me a prime target for the COVID viruses. Therefore I am fully vaccinated with a booster shot.


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Come on, Stann!  This has nothing to do with Trump and you know it.


He galvanized and emboldened the far right wing nuts. Maybe there's a connection with all the gun nuts and other criminals.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> I think a million dead in the United States alone is significant. Maybe you didn't lose anyone,maybe you were one of the few lucky ones who didn't lose someone to the pandemic or maybe you just want to ignore the facts. I don't know and I don't care. The government has the authority to issue mandates to protect the public safety. That is one of the duties of our government.



Philly just canceled their mask mandate after four days.

That's how much people love the mandates.

Welcome to the backlash.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> He galvanized and emboldened the far right wing nuts. Maybe there's a connection with all the gun nuts and other criminals.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Stann said:


> He galvanized and emboldened the far right wing nuts. Maybe there's a connection with all the gun nuts and other criminals.


With all due respect, Stann...violent crime in our cities is not being caused by "gun nuts" or the "far right"!  Claiming it is...is ducking the real causation.  Nor does it have anything to do with Donald Trump.  New York has a gun problem but it's guns in the hands of gang bangers that is the problem and that's taken place because "stop and frisk" policies that had taken guns off the streets were determined by the far left to be "systemically racist" and were eliminated!  That's something that could be fixed.  We know what works.  But we won't do that until people like you stop pretending that it's "far right wing nuts" that are the problem!


----------



## Lesh (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> You want me to post links on how often I've visited New York City?


No stupid...I want you to post links to this huge demographic shift of New Yorkers to Texas and Florida


Oldestyle said:


> If you DO live in New York then you DO know that it's losing it's population and that demographic "shift" is real!


I Do and I'm not seeing anything more than the normal amount of retirees leaving


Oldestyle said:


> I'm not quite sure why you'd want to deny that's happening but that's on you.


Because it isn't. Because you're a liar


Oldestyle said:


> Not like New York, Stann. Omaha is NOTHING like New York at the moment.


And you know this beause you once visitited Westchester..I see.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 22, 2022)

looking for a graph


----------



## Stann (Apr 22, 2022)

SweetSue92 said:


> Philly just canceled their mask mandate after four days.
> 
> That's how much people love the mandates.
> 
> Welcome to the backlash.


Giving in to popular wins is very foolish; it is much better to follow the science. As I said, the  number of cases, hospitalizations and death toll tells the story. Our ignorance in dealing with this health crisis is very apparent.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 22, 2022)

Lesh said:


> No stupid...I want you to post links to this huge demographic shift of New Yorkers to Texas and Florida
> 
> I Do and I'm not seeing anything more than the normal amount of retirees leaving
> 
> ...











						New York To Lose Congressional Seat Following Census Results
					

New York could have kept its seat in Congress if 89 more people filled out the census form.




					www.cbsnews.com


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Lesh said:


> No stupid...I want you to post links to this huge demographic shift of New Yorkers to Texas and Florida
> 
> I Do and I'm not seeing anything more than the normal amount of retirees leaving
> 
> ...


Once visited it?  I visited it practically every weekend for the better part of two years!  After I dated that girl I dated another who lived right around the corner from the Dakota in Manhattan.  I've seen first hand the ebbs and flows of crime in New York City over fifty YEARS!  I've seen what works.  I've seen what's been an abject failure!  If you really DO live in New York City then you know that liberal policies have NOT worked!  People are afraid.  That's not a right wing talking point as you seem to believe...that's reality!  Homeless people with mental issues and gang bangers with guns have made the streets of New York City a war zone.  People are tired of it.  They're tired of the shut downs.  They're tired of the taxes.  They're voting with their feet and leaving.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Lesh said:


> looking for a graph


I know you too well, Lesh.  Showing you a graph won't change your mind.  You refuse to hear it.  You refuse to see it.  You have your "narrative" and you'll stick to that narrative come hell or high water!


----------



## playtime (Apr 22, 2022)

dear OP,






^^^ _*that's why. *^^^_

sincerly, 

playtime.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Once visited it?  I visited it practically every weekend for the better part of two years!  After I dated that girl I dated another who lived right around the corner from the Dakota in Manhattan.  I've seen first hand the ebbs and flows of crime in New York City over fifty YEARS!  I've seen what works.  I've seen what's been an abject failure!  If you really DO live in New York City then you know that liberal policies have NOT worked!  People are afraid.  That's not a right wing talking point as you seem to believe...that's reality!  Homeless people with mental issues and gang bangers with guns have made the streets of New York City a war zone.  People are tired of it.  They're tired of the shut downs.  They're tired of the taxes.  They're voting with their feet and leaving.


Right so visiting and dating makes you an expert. No facts actually needed


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Right so visiting and dating makes you an expert. No facts actually needed


So first you accuse me of not knowing anything about NYC.  Then when I point out that I actually know quite a bit about the city and have for the better part of 50 years...you accuse me of not knowing the "facts"?  What facts are those, Lesh?  That the city saw a nasty spike in gun violence that went away when Rudy G implemented "Stop and frisk"?  That for several decades after that NYC was one of the safest big cities in the world?  That when liberal Mayors like Bill De Blasio got rid of "Stop & Frisk" because they claimed it was "systemically racist" that NYC once again saw a spike in gun violence?  That when liberal DA's started putting criminals back on the streets without bail that those very same criminals once again broke the law?

What "facts" am I missing?  (eye roll)


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

playtime said:


> dear OP,
> 
> 
> View attachment 634559
> ...


Is this the part where you on the left claim how much more "intelligent" you are than conservatives, Playtime?
Funny how your liberal agenda has turned into a raging dumpster fire in all of the cities that you control...but YOU'RE the smart ones!


----------



## Lesh (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Then when I point out that I actually know quite a bit about the city and have for the better part of 50 years...you accuse me of not knowing the "facts"?


Pointing out that you once dated someone from NY is pointing out NOTHING

Show us FACTS. Show us that crime is substantially higher thsn 2019. That people have moved out of NY in greater numbers than normal


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 22, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Pointing out that you once dated someone from NY is pointing out NOTHING
> 
> Show us FACTS. Show us that crime is substantially higher thsn 2019. That people have moved out of NY in greater numbers than normal


Word comprehension isn't your strong suit...is it, Lesh?  I pointed out that I dated TWO different people who lived and worked in the NYC area!   I've been a regular visitor to the city for 50 years.  I'll never attempt to tell you that I know about LA or San Fran or Chicago.  I've never spent much time in any of those places.  New York City on the other hand is a city that I'm very familiar with.  I remember how bad it was before Rudy G. instituted Stop & Frisk.  I remember how much better it became after that was instituted.

The FACT is that Bill De Blasio managed to turn the saftest big city in the world into one where it's citizens are afraid to take the subway!








						Leftists’ anti-police policies have led to a startling number of black, Latino crime victims
					

New York became a microcosm of the national police stats. Murder rose here in 2020 and 2021, as did crimes in all seven major categories, creating more nonwhite victims.




					nypost.com


----------



## Lesh (Apr 22, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Word comprehension isn't your strong suit...is it, Lesh?  I pointed out that I dated TWO different people who lived and worked in the NYC area!   I've been a regular visitor to the city for 50 years.  I'll never attempt to tell you that I know about LA or San Fran or Chicago.  I've never spent much time in any of those places.  New York City on the other hand is a city that I'm very familiar with.  I remember how bad it was before Rudy G. instituted Stop & Frisk.  I remember how much better it became after that was instituted.
> 
> The FACT is that Bill De Blasio managed to turn the saftest big city in the world into one where it's citizens are afraid to take the subway!
> 
> ...


FACTS moron. Statistics.

Not "Well I dated some..."


----------



## iceberg (Apr 22, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


if the risk is very low, don't give me experimental vaccines. 

don't make masks mandatory

don't fire people for not coming sling on the panic fest. 

maybe if it was treated seriously and not weapinized, people would take it seriously too


----------



## Lesh (Apr 22, 2022)

iceberg said:


> if the risk is very low,


A million people dead is not "low risk"


----------



## Cecilie1200 (Apr 22, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Why do so many people think they can claim "irrational" is defined as "doing anything that isn't what I want" and still call themselves conservative?

Or advocate for government forcing medical decisions on people and still call themselves conservative?


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> Why do so many people think they can claim "irrational" is defined as "doing anything that isn't what I want" and still call themselves conservative?
> 
> Or advocate for government forcing medical decisions on people and still call themselves conservative?


One of my friends here is in the hospital at the moment.  He just had open heart surgery to repair a valve that was damaged during a "stress related heart attack" the day after he got his second Covid shot.  I have no idea if the "vaccine" he got caused that heart attack but in my opinion, anyone taking a vaccine that was rushed into production without any long term testing is playing Russian Roulette with their health.  Now if that's something that someone else chooses to do...then I respect that decision.  If someone else "mandates" that I or anyone else has to get a shot to keep a job or travel then they're WAY overstepping their authority!  It's amazing how the same liberals that are adamant about a woman's right to make decisions about her body...for some reason don't feel that I or you should have that same right!  Just saying...


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> Why do so many people think they can claim "irrational" is defined as "doing anything that isn't what I want" and still call themselves conservative?
> 
> Or advocate for government forcing medical decisions on people and still call themselves conservative?



 I guess if Bruce Jenner can call himself a _“woman”_, then mikegriffith1 can call himself a _“conservative”_.


----------



## SweetSue92 (Apr 23, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> One of my friends here is in the hospital at the moment.  He just had open heart surgery to repair a valve that was damaged during a "stress related heart attack" the day after he got his second Covid shot.  I have no idea if the "vaccine" he got caused that heart attack but in my opinion, anyone taking a vaccine that was rushed into production without any long term testing is playing Russian Roulette with their health.  Now if that's something that someone else chooses to do...then I respect that decision.  If someone else "mandates" that I or anyone else has to get a shot to keep a job or travel then they're WAY overstepping their authority!  It's amazing how the same liberals that are adamant about a woman's right to make decisions about her body...for some reason don't feel that I or you should have that same right!  Just saying...



There are entirely too many of these stories now for them all to be coincidence. Or to be "stress related".

At some point the dam is going to break and nurses and drs will start talking.


----------



## iceberg (Apr 23, 2022)

Lesh said:


> A million people dead is not "low risk"


Maybe if that number didn't keep getting "adjusted"


----------



## iceberg (Apr 23, 2022)

SweetSue92 said:


> There are entirely too many of these stories now for them all to be coincidence. Or to be "stress related".
> 
> At some point the dam is going to break and nurses and drs will start talking.


after I got my 2nd shot, I had 2 incidents where my heart sped up to dangerous levels for a few days then came back down. 

I asked my cardiologist if the vaccine could do it. 

"who knows" was his answer. 

if you don't know, don't demand people take it.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 23, 2022)

iceberg said:


> Maybe if that number didn't keep getting "adjusted"


It gets "adjusted" when more people fucking DIE nitwit


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 23, 2022)

Lesh said:


> It gets "adjusted" when more people fucking DIE nitwit


Well stop shooting up Moonbat...............


----------



## Cecilie1200 (Apr 23, 2022)

SweetSue92 said:


> There are entirely too many of these stories now for them all to be coincidence. Or to be "stress related".
> 
> At some point the dam is going to break and nurses and drs will start talking.



Doctors already are.  NOW we're seeing studies - carefully ignored by the major media - showing that the Covid vaccines increase the risk of heart inflammation.  For most people, it's not a big concern, because it's not a big risk overall.  However, the more compromised your heart already is, the higher the risk.


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> *Doctors already are.  NOW we're seeing studies - carefully ignored by the major media -* showing that the Covid vaccines increase the risk of heart inflammation.  For most people, it's not a big concern, because it's not a big risk overall.  However, the more compromised your heart already is, the higher the risk.





SweetSue92 said:


> There are entirely too many of these stories now for them all to be coincidence. Or to be "stress related".
> 
> At some point the dam is going to break and nurses and drs will start talking.


Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination​Health Updated on Jan 21, 2022  — Published on Jan 18, 2022
PBS.org

""The heart has played a central role in COVID-19 since the beginning. Cardiovascular conditions are among the highest risk factors for hospitalization. A significant number of patients hospitalized with SARS-CoV-2 infections have signs of heart damage, and many recover from infection with lasting cardiovascular injury./....









						Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination
					

Myocarditis — an inflammation of the heart muscle — following COVID-19 vaccination is rare, and the risk is much smaller than the risks of cardiac injury linked to COVID-19 itself.




					www.pbs.org
				




`


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> ​Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination​Health Updated on Jan 21, 2022 5:00 PM EDT — Published on Jan 18, 2022 2:30 PM EDT
> PBS.org
> 
> ""The heart has played a central role in COVID-19 since the beginning. Cardiovascular conditions are among the highest risk factors for hospitalization. A significant number of patients hospitalized with SARS-CoV-2 infections have signs of heart damage, and many recover from infection with lasting cardiovascular injury./....
> ...


So those with 4 jabs and got covid twice are how much more at risk..........lmao


Go hide in the closet again.


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination​Health Updated on Jan 21, 2022  — Published on Jan 18, 2022
> PBS.org
> 
> ""The heart has played a central role in COVID-19 since the beginning. Cardiovascular conditions are among the highest risk factors for hospitalization. A significant number of patients hospitalized with SARS-CoV-2 infections have signs of heart damage, and many recover from infection with lasting cardiovascular injury./....
> ...


Just ask yourself one question, Abu!  Why did the drug companies that fast tracked the "vaccines" demand that they be given protection from lawsuits from any complications arising from taking a vaccine?  I don't think most Americans are aware of PREP and what it means.


----------



## Cecilie1200 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination​Health Updated on Jan 21, 2022  — Published on Jan 18, 2022
> PBS.org
> 
> ""The heart has played a central role in COVID-19 since the beginning. Cardiovascular conditions are among the highest risk factors for hospitalization. A significant number of patients hospitalized with SARS-CoV-2 infections have signs of heart damage, and many recover from infection with lasting cardiovascular injury./....
> ...



"Look, I found someone on the Internet who says I'm right!  That's all I need, now do as I say!"

Please fuck off and go yap around someone else's ankles for attention, stalker.


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> *"Look, I found someone on the Internet who says I'm right!  That's all I need, now do as I say!"
> 
> Please fuck off and go yap around someone else's ankles for attention, stalker.*


PBS is not just "some website," not just some unknown fringe from scraping google, it's a highly credible source.
And it is the SAME opinion you would get from any Legitimate source. (scores more available)
Only YOUR ilk is in the anti-vaxxer Conspiracy realm.

You want to play science with me, come after me you voodoo Twot?
Think again.
`


----------



## playtime (Apr 23, 2022)

Oldestyle said:


> Is this the part where you on the left claim how much more "intelligent" you are than conservatives, Playtime?


----------



## Cecilie1200 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> PBS is not just "some website," not just some unknown fringe from scraping google, it's a highly credible source.
> And it is the SAME opinion you would get from any Legitimate source. (scores more available)
> Only YOUR ilk is in the anti-vaxxer Conspiracy realm.
> 
> ...



No, PBS is a website funded by the government.  You might as well just quote me Jen Psaki's press releases and triumphantly proclaim, "So that PROVES it!"

For me to "play science" with you, you would have to first 1) have some science to offer beyond "I found something to cut and paste from the Internet", and 2) have the balls to stand firm and debate, instead of running and hiding to offer useless "You're just so stoopid because you don't agree with me" insults from the shadows.

I'm right here, Sparkles.  Come dazzle me with your "science".


----------



## BackAgain (Apr 23, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...


It is not “irrational” to oppose a mandate. So your question is premised on an error in your thinking.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 23, 2022)

Lesh said:


> Why have more people died?
> A. A longer time period
> 
> B. Refusal of people like you to vaccinate
> ...



A.  A "longer period of time" is the fault of the people in charge of health care, because "flattening the curve" prevents herd immunity from ending any epidemic and makes it last longer.

B. Refusal of some people to vaccinate does nothing because less than 1% of the population has been infected, and once infected, are more immune than if they had vaccinated.

C. D. Mutations can not happen that quickly, so these variants likely always existed and just become more common based on what works the best.  Its just natural selection, and nothing at all to do with immunity.  If immunity varied along with variants, then so would vaccines have to vary.  But vaccines have NOT varied.  We are still using the exact same vaccine as we did at first.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 23, 2022)

mikegriffith1 said:


> I did not vote for Joe Biden, but I agree with Biden's vaccine mandate. The vast majority of the new COVID-19 cases and deaths in the last four months have been among the unvaccinated. Thousands of those people would be alive today if they had gotten vaccinated. We gave them over six months to do the right thing. The vaccines are safe and effective, by any reasonable standard. When it comes to a virus, no one is an island; it's not just "my body, my choice" because your choice can harm other people.
> 
> My risk of dying from COVID-19 is very low, but I got vaccinated because I don't want to risk infecting others and possibly causing their death. Those who say, "Well, I don't hang around anyone in the high-risk groups." Great, but you might infect other people who do hang around high-risk persons (i.e., the elderly people and the medically ill), and some of those people might die as a result.
> 
> ...



Totally wrong.
The evidence shows that being vaccinated does not alter your chances of getting infected or passing the infection to others.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 23, 2022)

Lesh said:


> A million people dead is not "low risk"



A million people dead over 2.5 years of deliberately "flattening the curve" is a very low risk indeed.
Remember the population is over 330 million.
So that less than 0.3%.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination​Health Updated on Jan 21, 2022  — Published on Jan 18, 2022
> PBS.org
> 
> ""The heart has played a central role in COVID-19 since the beginning. Cardiovascular conditions are among the highest risk factors for hospitalization. A significant number of patients hospitalized with SARS-CoV-2 infections have signs of heart damage, and many recover from infection with lasting cardiovascular injury./....
> ...



That article is totally and entirely wrong.
Covid has NEVER posed any risk to the heart at all, in any way.
The virus can not survive in the blood has absolutely no way to ever travel to any organ except through airways in the lungs and sinuses.

Anyone claiming any heart damage from covid is just lying.

But the mRNA of the vaccines can and does get into the blood stream, travel to the heart, and cause swelling from the immune system attacking the spike proteins the mRNA forces heart cells to grow.


----------



## Rigby5 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> PBS is not just "some website," not just some unknown fringe from scraping google, it's a highly credible source.
> And it is the SAME opinion you would get from any Legitimate source. (scores more available)
> Only YOUR ilk is in the anti-vaxxer Conspiracy realm.
> 
> ...



I am far left and like PBS, it should be obvious that anyone claiming covid causes heart damage, is just lying.

Lots of covid infected are not aware, being asymptomatic, so are contaminating the blood banks.
Does anyone care?
The answer is no, because any nurse can easily tell you covid can NOT at all survive in blood.
Blood ph instantly kills covid.
Never has anyone gotten covid from tainted blood.
It can't happen.
So then the claim the blood supply within an individual was covid contaminated, has to be a lie.
It is absolutely impossible.


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> No, PBS is a website funded by the government.  You might as well just quote me Jen Psaki's press releases and triumphantly proclaim, "So that PROVES it!"
> 
> For me to "play science" with you, you would have to first 1) have some science to offer beyond "I found something to cut and paste from the Internet", and 2) have the balls to stand firm and debate, instead of running and hiding to offer useless "You're just so stoopid because you don't agree with me" insults from the shadows.
> 
> I'm right here, Sparkles.  Come dazzle me with your "science".


So you DISHONESTLY had to ignore my offer of numerous websites.
*(there are NONE who would advise you Not to get the vaccine except extreme RW Conspiracy websites OR if you had some rare condition/ which precluded it.)*
You FRAUD.
PBS is Individually and Corporately Funded as well, Including it's main Science program, Nova, by RW David Koch. 

I would be glad to debate sciences.
In fact, when you finally made Two posts in the Sci section (after 54,000 posts/14 years) NEITHER of them was about science, only the Idiocy that "no one invited me."

If you want to be dazzled (or least should be) go look at My thread starts IN the Sci section you have (rightly) avoided for 14 Years and 54,000+ posts. You can't debate any of them.
Your last post I will destroy there later, was answered 1000 times by me in many threads.
I have tackled all the/your common Fallacies.
You might be interest in that you posted the most common of BS logic ones:::





						God of the Gaps (well then, how did...")
					

This is probably THEE #1 rationale for those arguing for a god on msg boards. "Well then, did all this stuff just appear?".. "how did ___ if not god?" And we can see several Fallacious OPs currently employing this boner.  If we can't explain it/explain it Yet, it must be 'god.' The same...



					www.usmessageboard.com
				




You're a complete FRAUD, a KonspiracYst and Kweationist.
Science is not your thing.
Stick to Recipes and RW chirps.
`


----------



## Oldestyle (Apr 23, 2022)

playtime said:


> View attachment 635046


I make up my own mind on issues, Playtime.  I don't need a politician to do so for me.  Trump's view of the vaccines doesn't match my own by the way which makes your post even more idiotic.

I'm simply pointing out that despite you on the left declaring how much more "intelligent" you are than the unwashed masses...whenever you run things...they turn to shit and need to be fixed.  Growing up in Massachusetts I saw that same thing over and over.  The voters elect a Democratic Governor.  The State subsequently has fiscal issues and the voters elect a Republican to fix things.  Rinse and repeat.  Would you like to take a crack at explaining why that happens if you on the left are so dog gone intelligent?  Hmmm?


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> I am far left and like PBS, it should be obvious that anyone claiming covid causes heart damage, is just lying.
> 
> Lots of covid infected are not aware, being asymptomatic, so are contaminating the blood banks.
> Does anyone care?
> ...


Cecilie1200 as well.
American Heart Association
Heart.org

"...As of late November 2021, officials had confirmed 1,071 reports nationwide of myocarditis or pericarditis following vaccination. Cases were more common in adolescent males and young adults. A recent study shows that most people under age 21 who developed myocarditis thought to be linked to COVID-19 vaccination had mild symptoms that improved quickly.
*The American Heart Association/American Stroke Association urges all U.S. adults and children 5 and older to receive COVID-19 vaccination as soon as possible to protect against severe illness from the coronavirus.* Learn more here.
[.............]

Should I get the vaccine if I have a history of heart disease or stroke?​*Yes. People with cardiovascular risk factors, heart disease, and heart attack and stroke survivors should get vaccinated(link opens in new window) as soon as possible because they are at Much Greater Risk from the Virus Than they are from the Vaccine,* according to leaders of the American Heart Association. The AHA urges people with medical conditions to discuss vaccination with their health care team.".."










						Questions about COVID-19 vaccination
					

Wondering which COVID-19 vaccination to get, when, and why? Find answers to those questions and more.




					www.heart.org
				




Anyone else?
What a Freak show this board is.

`


----------



## Cecilie1200 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> So you DISHONESTLY had to ignore my offer of numerous websites.
> *(there are NONE who would advise you Not to get the vaccine except extreme RW Conspiracy websites OR if you had some rare condition/ which precluded it.)*
> You FRAUD.
> PBS is Individually and Corporately Funded as well, Including it's main Science program, Nova, by RW David Koch.
> ...



This seems to be a theme with you.  "I HAVE WEBSITES.  GO PROVE ME RIGHT FOR ME!"  Do you ever have an actual thought of your own?  Or do you just fill your head with nothing but, "Admiring this person will make me smart like he is!"?

There is nothing "dishonest" about saying, "Quoting a government-funded organization about how wonderful the government is does not constitute science."  Contrary to your obvious belief, "dishonest" does not mean "a bad person who says things I don't like".  If you want to disagree with me, you're going to have to do better than randomly throwing out words with no reference to their meaning in the hope that I'll be overwhelmed by your generic disapproval.

By the way, PBS receives 15% of its annual funding from the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, which in turn gets the money it gives to PBS from the federal government.  It also receives government grants such as the Ready to Learn grant from the Department of Education.  This makes the federal government the single largest contributor to PBS.

Oh, just a tip:  "Fraud" is also not defined as "a bad person who says things I don't like."  I have presented myself as nothing more or less than someone who views you with complete contempt for your intellectual capacity.  Since I actually AM a person who views you with contempt for your intellectual capacity, there is no fraud involved.  I've been completely accurate.

"Go read my post in this other thread and see how wonderful I am, because I say that's what happened!" is right up there with, "I have a link to do all my talking for me."

Also, I post where I choose to post.  I am not obligated to post in any particular forum in order to "earn" the right to post there when I do choose to, and I CERTAINLY am not obligated to do any fucking thing because YOU demand it.  Where I do and don't normally post has no bearing whatsoever on the accuracy of those things I do choose to post, and you can go fuck yourself with this strawman of "You've NEVER posted here, so that makes your posts invalid".

It will be fascinating to see you try to "destroy" anything, since your idea of debate is, "Go read these links."  Sounds to me like you expect other people to "destroy" me on your behalf, so that you can pretend you did something.


----------



## Bob Blaylock (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> PBS is not just "some website," not just some unknown fringe from scraping google, it's a highly credible source.



  It's a branch of the same corrupt government that is pushing this dangerous mRNA shit.


----------



## Lesh (Apr 23, 2022)

Rigby5 said:


> A million people dead over 2.5 years of deliberately "flattening the curve" is a very low risk indeed.
> Remember the population is over 330 million.
> So that less than 0.3%.


The fuck you say.

That’s like saying the six million who died in the holocaust wasn’t so bad because it happened over the course of a number of years

Idiot sock puppet


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Apr 23, 2022)

Lesh said:


> The fuck you say.
> 
> That’s like saying the six million who died in the holocaust wasn’t so bad because it happened over the course of a number of years
> 
> Idiot sock puppet



50 million died from spanish flu in 1918-1920, population earth----1.7 billion
6 million people died from covid in 2020-2022, population earth-----8 billion.

Covid is nowhere near the lethality of spanish flu.  Survivable rate at 99.7 for covid.  Those are facts.


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> This seems to be a theme with you.  "I HAVE WEBSITES.  GO PROVE ME RIGHT FOR ME!"  Do you ever have an actual thought of your own?  Or do you just fill your head with nothing but, "Admiring this person will make me smart like he is!"?
> 
> There is nothing "dishonest" about saying, "Quoting a government-funded organization about how wonderful the government is does not constitute science."  Contrary to your obvious belief, "dishonest" does not mean "a bad person who says things I don't like".  If you want to disagree with me, you're going to have to do better than randomly throwing out words with no reference to their meaning in the hope that I'll be overwhelmed by your generic disapproval.
> 
> ...


You're welcome to make Baseless claims.
and so you do.. on everything you crazy Ale Wench.

However, when debate reaches impasse on mere opinion (Yes/No/Yes/No), real DEBATES as well as online ones go the links/expert sources.
I have posted Smithsonian Mag, PBS, and the American Heart Association.
You have posted YOU, you empty ConpiracYst clown... as you can't cite anything credible for your quackery.
In fact, you skipped over the *American Heart Association* completely. (A second source after you dissed PBS)

And yes I did introduce you to your fallacy in another section "God of the Gaps," as that's just an answer to another of the Nothing-but-fallacies you post.

*You're a lunatic with no content just long posts resenting facts and those who present them. ie the twice ldiotic "Who invited you," as if someone had to invite me to post my positions on a Open Public message board!
You Nasty rag.*
Yes you have a right to be a Kwazy Baseless Ranting psychotic, and I have the right to show why you are with excellent backing for my positions.

And of course No content above. No Contrary position backed or unbacked.. just the usual Resentment.
Now go check the propane tank before it blows up your trailer.
`


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

LordBrownTrout said:


> 50 million died from spanish flu in 1918-1920, population earth----1.7 billion
> 6 million people died from covid in 2020-2022, population earth-----8 billion.
> 
> Covid is nowhere near the lethality of spanish flu.  Survivable rate at 99.7 for covid.  Those are facts.


In good part the toll is so 'low' because the technology and medical knowledge is much better now.
Masks, Vaccines, distancing, drugs, breathing apparatus, and many other Hospitalization techniques/treatments
We know what to do.

Also 'survival rate' is calculated how many survived our of how many got sick.
And that would be 500 Million got sick, 6 million/1.2% died.... a 98.8% survival rate
(and undercounted many places like China, Russia, India, Africa, etc)
`


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> In good part the toll is so 'low' because the technology and medical knowledge is much better now.
> Masks, Vaccines, distancing, drugs, breathing apparatus, and many other Hospitalization techniques/treatments
> We know what to do.
> 
> ...



Of course technology, antibiotics, sterile technique are better now but this covid virus is still nothing compared to the spanish flu.  Whats most amazing is watching the masses just scared out of their minds over a virus with a survival rate at 99.7.  Think what these people will do when a really lethal one comes along at a 30-70 percent kill ratio.


----------



## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

LordBrownTrout said:


> Of course technology, antibiotics, sterile technique are better now but this covid virus is still nothing compared to the spanish flu.  Whats most amazing is watching the masses just scared out of their minds over a virus with a survival rate at 99.7.  Think what these people will do when a really lethal one comes along at a 30-70 percent kill ratio.


82 Million Americans have gotten sick: 1 in 4.
10% or more get 'long COVID'.
I have a doctor friend whose never been the same since. Arrhythmia.
A worker from my building turned gray after a brutal 5 weeks of it. Another survived but he can't work any more.
For many Millions it was the worst sick they EVER got. Not the flu. Much Worse.
And you can hear that daily.
You do not want to get C19.
`


----------



## LordBrownTrout (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> 82 Million Americans have gotten sick: 1 in 4.
> 10% or more get 'long COVID'.
> I have a doctor friend whose never been the same since. Arrhythmia.
> A worker from my building turned gray after a brutal 5 weeks of it. Another survived but he can't work any more.
> ...



I've had family, friends, coworkers who were sick.  My uncle died from it.  I also know four people who died from taking the injection.  I was around family who were sick and helped them.  Its way more than 82 million that were sick.  Those were just accountable numbers.  Tens of millions didn't even report being sick nor did they take tests.


----------



## eagle1462010 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> 82 Million Americans have gotten sick: 1 in 4.
> 10% or more get 'long COVID'.
> I have a doctor friend whose never been the same since. Arrhythmia.
> A worker from my building turned gray after a brutal 5 weeks of it. Another survived but he can't work any more.
> ...


Most not so much.   And early treatment protocols would have stopped 90%

Long Covid.  Will that be the new excuse for vaccines?

No early treatments,  lungs turned tonhamburger meat from your own immune system,  and scar tissue that will maybe kill you in a few years??  Is that your Long Covid??  For the cost of a Big Mac that could have been stopped.


----------



## Cecilie1200 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> Cecilie1200 as well.
> American Heart Association
> Heart.org
> 
> ...



As usual, you are "proving" points to the voices in your head, and deluding yourself that I'm somehow responsible for whatever it was they said.  

No wonder this board is a freak show, when freaks like you keep showing up.


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## Cecilie1200 (Apr 23, 2022)

abu afak said:


> You're welcome to make Baseless claims.
> and so you do.. on everything you crazy Ale Wench.
> 
> However, when debate reaches impasse on mere opinion (Yes/No/Yes/No), real DEBATES as well as online ones go the links/expert sources.
> ...



Which "baseless claims" did I make?  That PBS's single largest contributor is the federal government?  Or the fact that you're a mindless, drooling fanboy who thinks adoring people with PhDs is equivalent to actually knowing something?

"Your posts have no content" is just another way for cowards like you to say, "I didn't read it, because I'm illiterate and afraid I might hear something that makes me realize how ashamed to be myself I should be."


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## abu afak (Apr 23, 2022)

Cecilie1200 said:


> Which "baseless claims" did I make?  That PBS's single largest contributor is the federal government?  Or the fact that you're a mindless, drooling fanboy who thinks adoring people with PhDs is equivalent to actually knowing something?
> 
> "Your posts have no content" is just another way for cowards like you to say, "I didn't read it, because I'm illiterate and afraid I might hear something that makes me realize how ashamed to be myself I should be."


You make plenty of baseless claims about the topic, my sources, and that you don't make claims.
ie, Suggesting we can't trust PBS because they are part Govt funded IS a claim and you can't show is in any way true.
Your a conspiracYst Twot for one thing.
I backed the PBS link with the American Heart Assn Link you can't mention, and you got Porked again. (and didn't even get your usual $4).

And it's that was every few sentences you lying POS.
Everything you say is a lie, some about your last lie/post.
`
`


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## SweetSue92 (Apr 24, 2022)

abu afak said:


> Getting COVID-19 is much riskier for your heart than vaccination​Health Updated on Jan 21, 2022  — Published on Jan 18, 2022
> PBS.org
> 
> ""The heart has played a central role in COVID-19 since the beginning. Cardiovascular conditions are among the highest risk factors for hospitalization. A significant number of patients hospitalized with SARS-CoV-2 infections have signs of heart damage, and many recover from infection with lasting cardiovascular injury./....
> ...



Even if we grant this is true, this is not the metric used for "safe and effective" treatments. The cure cannot be worse than the disease. In this case, since the cure does not even PREVENT the disease and does cause heart problems, notably in young people at little risk from Covid, the vaccines should not have been recommended for at least young people.

More and more people are coming around to this mindset. Another 6 months and it will be the new "common knowledge". Like lockdowns.


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## eagle1462010 (Apr 24, 2022)

abu afak said:


> You make plenty of baseless claims about the topic, my sources, and that you don't make claims.
> ie, Suggesting we can't trust PBS because they are part Govt funded IS a claim and you can't show is in any way true.
> Your a conspiracYst Twot for one thing.
> I backed the PBS link with the American Heart Assn Link you can't mention, and you got Porked again. (and didn't even get your usual $4).
> ...


Up yours









						COVID-19 early treatment: real-time analysis of 1,778 studies
					

COVID-19 early treatment: real-time analysis of 1,778 studies




					c19early.com
				




Do a gain of function on your brain..............


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## abu afak (Apr 24, 2022)

eagle1462010 said:


> Up yours
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And same to you.. with a broomstick... BOY.
*We're talking about getting Vaccinated, not after the fact treatment efficacy of different agents.*
ldiots galore here on USMB/Fox News Jr High.

and BTW MAGAt your website is completely anonymous and it's info is... dubious.
`


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## eagle1462010 (Apr 24, 2022)

abu afak said:


> And same to you.. with a broomstick... BOY.
> We're talking about getting Vaccinated, not after the fact treatment efficacy of different agents.
> ldiots galore here on USMB/Fox News Jr High.
> `


mRNA is not a vaccine boy...........

Covaxin is.............Biden needs his diapers changed again BOY.


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