# California, Arizona, New Mexico Should Belong to Mexico



## longknife

{This is a bit long but will also post it on my blog}

A chant used to justify illegal immigration from south of our borders.

All well and good. But, let's examine the truth of this statement.

When did Spain or later Mexico ever truly control land in these states? From the very beginning, Spain never had complete military control of Texas, Arizona, or New Mexico. For this entire area, there were never more than two or three hundred poorly armed and ill-equipped soldiers in scattered garrisons or _presidios_.  And, those few garrisons relied heavily on support from missions established by Catholic missionaries.

Let's take California as an example. Up to 1769, all Spanish efforts were guided by the Jesuits in Lower California, their widely scattered missions manned by groups or no more than five soldiers at each. There was a _presidio_ - a poorly manned garrison  at San José del Cabo, put there as it was the main shipping point in to and out of Lower California.

When Father Serra and Governor Gaspar Portolá reached the future site of San Diego, it was with a military compliment of less than 100 soldiers fit for duty. Of the 30 Catalonian Volunteers, only six or seven did not suffer from dysentery and diarrhea. Even the hardy Leatherjacket Soldiers faced physical problems. 100 hundred soldiers to cower 60,000 Iron Age savages!

It took Spain from 1769 to 1820 to establish 19 missions from San Diego to San Francisco. Each mission had a minimum of one Franciscan friar, often two when there were enough to do so. And, each mission had an _escolta_ of 5 soldiers, 1 corporal and four privates. That amounted to a total of 95 soldiers to control an estimated 30,000 Mission Indians. In addition, there were four poorly made and maintained _presidios_ at San Diego, Santa Barbara, Monterey, and San Francisco. The total of soldiers at these four forts never exceeded 80, most of those involved in courier or sentry duty. In addition, they went for years without pay or supplies. The military relied heavily on the missions for food.

So, how about Mexican control of the area. When Mexico gained its independence from Spain, one of the first things it did was to secularize the missions  taking them away from church control and turning them over to the Indians under the control of government agents. Disaster. From 1823 to 1840, thriving, industrious missions became ruins and the Indians dependent upon them became slaves to the _Rancheros_, retired soldiers and civilians with political clout. The only army was a understaffed company of ex-convicts brought from Mexico by Governor Echeandía. The _presidio_ at San Diego had been sold for $40 dollars, the one at Monterey in total disrepair, and the one at San Francisco abandoned, the soldiers sent to Sonoma to protect against Russian invasion and Indian incursions.

Mexico owning California? When the various groups fell into internecine fighting, each side formed _companias estranjeros_, made up of English and American settlers who had come to California for the great weather and good prospects  all before the Gold Rush. They were the ones that turned the various _pueblos_ from mere groups of mud huts into substantial towns.

And, the California Indians no longer owned anything as they had been all but wiped out when the missions fell into ruins. Those few surviving _peones_ struggled, poorly clad and barely fed.

So, let me ask this question  if Mexico didn't bother to man its outposts or seriously control the vast territory of California [which included Arizona and New Mexico] knowing it was so sparsely settled that it did not merit the status of being a state, why should the belief continue that those areas still belong to Mexico? And thereby justifying to incursion of Mexican citizens without legal documents?


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## peach174

Mexico lost the war and sold the land to America for 15 million dollars.


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## bianco

peach174 said:


> Mexico lost the war and sold the land to America for 15 million dollars.



Not according to the school kids;


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vT4FHUet988]'Americans Stole Our Land' - AZ Senator Reads Shocking Letter from Teacher - YouTube[/ame]


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## RetiredGySgt

Doesn't change the fact we bought the area. They can tell all the lies they want.


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## bianco

RetiredGySgt said:


> Doesn't change the fact we bought the area. They can tell all the lies they want.



They're taking it back;


HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!

_'We are practicing "La Reconquista" in California.' 

"California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave."

Excelsior- The national newspaper of Mexico "The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot." _


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## Alfalfa

You were doing so good until the last sentence.


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## Alfalfa

bianco said:


> peach174 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Mexico lost the war and sold the land to America for 15 million dollars.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to the school kids;
> 
> 
> [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vT4FHUet988]'Americans Stole Our Land' - AZ Senator Reads Shocking Letter from Teacher - YouTube[/ame]
Click to expand...


Sorry, doesn't pass the smell test.


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## MaryL

Say again? Mexico was created by Europeans to begin with, taken from the native peoples. Spaniards  were first to colonize the hemisphere, Spanish is also a European language,  not native to the continent any more than English is. It cracks me up when Mexicans invade America  NOW and then proclaim they are innocent victims  of AMERICAN colonialismBeing  that  Mexicans   themselves  are tainted with guilt  of the same allegation, to begin with. If it weren't for Europeans "stealing the land," (MEXICO)  wouldn't be a culture to begin with. But I digress...


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## bianco

Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;

List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

_*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_


2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online

_*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*

.  Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043
.  Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _


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## Moonglow

Mexicans can't even run their own nation without our money.


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## bianco

Moonglow said:


> Mexicans can't even run their own nation without our money.



Think what it will be like when they're the majority and running your nation...and the USA is indeed "Mexico"..._'Jose can you see by the dawn's early light' _etc.


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## Moonglow

bianco said:


> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Mexicans can't even run their own nation without our money.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Think what it will be like when they're the majority and running your nation...and the USA is indeed "Mexico"..._'Jose can you see by the dawn's early light' _etc.
Click to expand...


They will still be part of America, but yet again, stop letting the business establishment give them jobs and they will go and stop the welfare.


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## bianco

Moonglow said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Mexicans can't even run their own nation without our money.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Think what it will be like when they're the majority and running your nation...and the USA is indeed "Mexico"..._'Jose can you see by the dawn's early light' _etc.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They will still be part of America, but yet again, stop letting the business establishment give them jobs and they will go and stop the welfare.
Click to expand...


Seems to me that America will become part of them/Mexico...the Mexican flag reigning supreme, as it basically does now in many places.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uhua9tnZNo]Illegals raise Mexican flag over Maywood - YouTube[/ame]

And when all the old White folks have passed away?



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIu6kk4id3o]US Teacher Deems American Flag 'Offensive' - YouTube[/ame]


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## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;
> 
> List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_
> 
> 
> 2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online
> 
> _*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*
> 
> .  Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043
> .  Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _



hey dumbass....you do realize that a hell of a lot of those "Hispanics" are born and raised here right?.....and hey.... if you "white" people are afraid of being a minority.....then start fucking and quit inbreeding with the other races....


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## freedombecki

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;
> 
> List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_
> 
> 
> 2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online
> 
> _*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*_
> 
> _. Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043_
> _. Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey dumbass....you do realize that a hell of a lot of those "Hispanics" are born and raised here right?.....and hey.... if you "white" people are afraid of being a minority.....then start fucking and quit inbreeding with the other races....
Click to expand...

 Kids today in America are taught they have to be multicultural in every way. They're striving to eliminate blonde hair and blue eyes, which they are taught to view as a bad thing, basically and shows how nepotistic and narrow-minded their ancestors were. Also, all white people must be racists!

This message was brought to you by the NEA.


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## theHawk

It will be hilarious if they ever try to secede from the Union and they get their asses kicked.


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## longknife

The pre-Colombian "civilization" of current-day Mexico was not a thriving and growing one. It was filled with internal strife and the constant raids against non-Aztec tribes reduced their supply of slaves and sacrificial lambs.

In fact, Cortez only overcame the stagnant Aztec civilization with overwhelming support from the tribes who had suffered so much from Aztec pillage.

As to the other tribes of North America, all were Stone Age groups with little authority beyond a few days of where they lived - with the exception of the Civliized Nations of the northeast. It was only the arrival of European horses that gave them great mobility.

As for the California Indians, they were even worse, living on insects, moles, gophers, rabbits and other game they could take with their Stone Age tools.

Again, the "truth" about the European incursion in North and Central America is not taught in our schools and not even Hispanics learn the truth about their own countries. [Especially when the vast majority of Mexican "teachers" are not fully qualified to teach most of the subject they are called upon to teach!]


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## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;
> 
> List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_
> 
> 
> 2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online
> 
> _*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*
> 
> .  Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043
> .  Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey dumbass....you do realize that a hell of a lot of those "Hispanics" are born and raised here right?.....and hey.... if you "white" people are afraid of being a minority.....then start fucking and quit inbreeding with the other races....
Click to expand...



Which non-White majority place would you like to live in, as an 'ordinary person'?

Mexico?
etc.


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## Harry Dresden

freedombecki said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;
> 
> List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_
> 
> 
> 2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online
> 
> _*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*_
> 
> _. Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043_
> _. Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey dumbass....you do realize that a hell of a lot of those "Hispanics" are born and raised here right?.....and hey.... if you "white" people are afraid of being a minority.....then start fucking and quit inbreeding with the other races....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Kids today in America are taught they have to be multicultural in every way. They're striving to eliminate blonde hair and blue eyes, which they are taught to view as a bad thing, basically and shows how nepotistic and narrow-minded their ancestors were. Also, all white people must be racists!
> 
> This message was brought to you by the NEA.
Click to expand...


well then i guess as soon as everyone has black hair and black eyes.....they wont have to worry about that anymore......


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## bianco

Juarez looks nice;

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tikIenRQ_K8]Bordertown 2007 -Movie Trailer - YouTube[/ame]


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## antiquity

If the OP is correct than the rest of the US belong to Native Americans, so get out of my country.


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## antiquity

The fact is the ruling class who run Mexico are direct decedents of Spain. The rest are the poor who flood over our boards because the ruling class in Mexico wants it that way to rid themselves of the burden of feeding them.


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## Mushroom

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;
> 
> List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_
> 
> 
> 2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online
> 
> _*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*
> 
> .  Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043
> .  Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey dumbass....you do realize that a hell of a lot of those "Hispanics" are born and raised here right?.....and hey.... if you "white" people are afraid of being a minority.....then start fucking and quit inbreeding with the other races....
Click to expand...


Not only that, but not all "Hispanics" are from Mexico.

My wife was born and raised in South America, and she does not have that great of an opinion of Mexicans.


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## Mushroom

longknife said:


> As to the other tribes of North America, all were Stone Age groups with little authority beyond a few days of where they lived - with the exception of the Civliized Nations of the northeast. It was only the arrival of European horses that gave them great mobility.
> 
> As for the California Indians, they were even worse, living on insects, moles, gophers, rabbits and other game they could take with their Stone Age tools.



To be technical, they were not "Stone Age", but Neolithic.

The various groups in the Americas had some very sophisticated civilizations as well as technologies.  They had domesticated a great many things, including maize and the Chihuahua.

They also had sophisticated pottery and basketry, in addition to metallurgy.  The only major difference is that they were just beginning to use metal tools (evidence exists of bronze being used starting in around 1,000 CE in come areas of Western Mexico).  And they had been smelting gold, silver and copper for over 1,000 years.  The population densities simply never mandated the need for the rapid technological advancements that Europe and Asia had.

But they were not "time locked", and in fact some of their achievements are even more remarkable knowing that they built cities and mounds, canals and pyramids, all with wood and stone and bone tools.  Achievements that other civilizations required metal tools to accomplish.


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## longknife

antiquity said:


> If the OP is correct than the rest of the US belong to Native Americans, so get out of my country.



Well, the OP also understands that American Indians failed to control their territories became there were unable to assimilate with the newcomers who had more advanced technology.

Sadly, there is one truth to history - MIGHT IS RIGHT.

Maybe in the American Indians had wiped out the unprepared European settlers as soon as they arrived, history would be different.


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## longknife

antiquity said:


> The fact is the ruling class who run Mexico are direct decedents of Spain. The rest are the poor who flood over our boards because the ruling class in Mexico wants it that way to rid themselves of the burden of feeding them.



You got it right!

There are 29 Criollo families who run Mexico. They are direct descendants from the Spaniards who managed to stay on top during the wars of independence and the various revolutions. 

Mexico, in spite of its constitution, is a class-conscience society. The more European blood you possess, the better your chances for advancement.


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## longknife

Mushroom, yes they built huge cities and massive structures - on the backs of slaves!

As to their use of metals, they knew how to make bronze but failed to use it properly. And, bronze cannot possibly stand up to iron and tempered steel.

The Conquistadors won, not just due to superior weapons but logistics - they could carry their supplies with them for long distances and had domesticated animals to carry their loads.

As for Chihuahuas - don't you dare say anything negative about them!!!


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## Mushroom

longknife said:


> Mushroom, yes they built huge cities and massive structures - on the backs of slaves!



I was talking of all of the Americas, not just the Aztecs.  And that was the only American culture that made real use of slavery.

The mound builders, the Algonquin Nation, the Toltecs, the Mayans, the Olmecs, none of them used slaves.

And even Aztec slaves were not like slaves in Europe.  They were not even like slaves in the Roman Empire.  The vast majority were essentially "debt slaves", working off money owed (not much different from indentured servitude).  They had the right to marry, and even own slaves themselves.  And were normally freed upon the death of their bond holder, and their children were not slaves.



longknife said:


> As to their use of metals, they knew how to make bronze but failed to use it properly. And, bronze cannot possibly stand up to iron and tempered steel.
> 
> The Conquistadors won, not just due to superior weapons but logistics - they could carry their supplies with them for long distances and had domesticated animals to carry their loads.
> 
> As for Chihuahuas - don't you dare say anything negative about them!!!



A lot of technological advancement is simply due to population density.  When you are a scattered hunter-gatherer culture, what need is there for metallurgy, mathematics or even a written language?  But as the population grows, these things all become more important.

Where as humans had been settled in Europe, Africa and Asia for a hundred thousand years, the Americas had people for less then 20,000 years.  And because of geological boundaries (deserts, mountain ranges, jungles, etc), the incidence of conflict was much lower then say Europe and the Middle East.  So there was simply no need to develop Bronze and Iron and Steel.  

As for the Chihuahua, this is a breed that was specifically bred for it's purpose.  They are small, and it took many generations for the pre-Columbian Mexicans to breed as small as they did.

But these were not pets, Chihuahua was a delicacy that was reserved mostly for the upper reaches of society, although some believe they were also used by traders as a source of food on the trail.


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## longknife

*The mound builders, the Algonquin Nation, the Toltecs, the Mayans, the Olmecs, none of them used slaves*

I think you're mistaken. Almost all American Indian tribes took captives from raids, taking them home and using them as slaves. Those showing merit were allowed to be integrated in the tribal society through adoption or marriage.

It was actually a rather wise method of expanding the gene pool and stpping genetical stagnation.

My studies of Mexican history tell me your comments about the Olmecs and Myans to also be in error. The certainly used slaves to build their temples and other structures.

Check out https://www.google.com/search?q=olm...s=org.mozilla:en-ZA:official&client=firefox-a

and 

https://www.google.com/search?q=olm...+use+of+slaves&rls=org.mozilla:en-ZA:official

As for Chihuahuas, they better NOT try to eat my little Pixie! She'll bit off their fingers!


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## Toro

Washington, Oregon, Idaho and Montana should all be part of Canada. 

True story.  The British granted the Hudson Bay Company all the lands that drained into Hudson Bay, which includes those states.  But they caved when the Americans wanted them.

Oh, and Florida too.  Just because we need something sunny and warm.


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## Mushroom

longknife said:


> *The mound builders, the Algonquin Nation, the Toltecs, the Mayans, the Olmecs, none of them used slaves*
> 
> I think you're mistaken. Almost all American Indian tribes took captives from raids, taking them home and using them as slaves. Those showing merit were allowed to be integrated in the tribal society through adoption or marriage.
> 
> It was actually a rather wise method of expanding the gene pool and stpping genetical stagnation.
> 
> My studies of Mexican history tell me your comments about the Olmecs and Myans to also be in error. The certainly used slaves to build their temples and other structures.
> 
> Check out https://www.google.com/search?q=olm...s=org.mozilla:en-ZA:official&client=firefox-a
> 
> and
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?q=olm...+use+of+slaves&rls=org.mozilla:en-ZA:official
> 
> As for Chihuahuas, they better NOT try to eat my little Pixie! She'll bit off their fingers!



Interesting links, did you even read what came up there in those searches?

In the first for Olmecs, they are talking about pok-a-tok, the ball and hoop game common in the region:



> The spectators usually made bets on which team would win; sometimes the stakes were very highpeople offered themselves or their relatives as slaves if they lost.


http://ic.galegroup.com/ic/suic/Ref...ea26856&jsid=e46f8ef1b6d42c0a588f8127cdbc3f85

The next several talk about the Spanish making slaves of them.  Then we have this one:



> Although the Mayas never practiced mass human sacrifices, there was always the odd occasion when they believed the gods required a human victim.  In those cases, they would take prisoners, slaves, and orphaned children, and sacrifice them in one of three ways. In one method, the priests would tie the victim to a wooden pole and throw spears and arrows toward the victim's chest. Another method, likely introduced to the Mayas by the Toltec, would have the victim's heart cut out and presented to the gods. Other rites in the ceremonies would include burning of incense, dancing, and the ousting of evil spirits from the worshipers.


Maya and Olmec religious differences

"Telling History from a Christian perspective".  Sorry if I pass on that one.

And looking down the first page, it is just more and more of the same.

Then your second link, hmmm...



> Slavery in Aztec society was in some ways more humane than in Western cultures. While some slaves were punished criminals or prisoners of war, others sold themselves or their children into slavery due to economic hardship. Slaves could free themselves by repaying their purchase price. They could marry and own property, and their children were born free.


Slavery in Ancient Aztec, Mayan and Inca | Slaveryinjustice

Pretty much exactly what I had said earlier.  And most of the rest go on more about the Spanish enslaving them, not relevant.

The "slave" systems in the Americas prior to the arrival of Europeans was not a "caste" type system where all children were born as slaves and it continued throughout the generations.  An individual was placed in slavery, and only that individual.  And they or others could purchase their freedom, because it was a business transaction, not unlike indenturtude in Europe.


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## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sure looks to me like they're taking it back/over;
> 
> List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _*List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census *_
> 
> 
> 2043 census prediction: US whites will no longer be a majority as Hispanic population surges | Mail Online
> 
> _*Whites will no longer be a majority in U.S. by 2043 as Hispanic population surges, Census data reveals*
> 
> .  Number of white Americans now at 64 per cent, but scales will tip in the favor of Hispanics by 2043
> .  Minority children expected to become the majority by 2019 _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey dumbass....you do realize that a hell of a lot of those "Hispanics" are born and raised here right?.....and hey.... if you "white" people are afraid of being a minority.....then start fucking and quit inbreeding with the other races....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Which non-White majority place would you like to live in, as an 'ordinary person'?
> 
> Mexico?
> etc.
Click to expand...


i have lived in one for the past 40 years.....as an "ordinary person".....maybe if you were not so dam bigoted and got to know Mexicans born and raised here you would find out that many of them aint much different then you "ordinary" people....


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## Luddly Neddite

MaryL said:


> Say again? Mexico was created by Europeans to begin with, taken from the native peoples. Spaniards  were first to colonize the hemisphere, Spanish is also a European language,  not native to the continent any more than English is. It cracks me up when Mexicans invade America  NOW and then proclaim they are innocent victims  of AMERICAN colonialismBeing  that  Mexicans   themselves  are tainted with guilt  of the same allegation, to begin with. If it weren't for Europeans "stealing the land," (MEXICO)  wouldn't be a culture to begin with. But I digress...



This isn't "digression". Its nonsense.

Why do people post stuff like this as though its germane to any possible discussion?


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## Luddly Neddite

Moonglow said:


> Mexicans can't even run their own nation without our money.



They were doing just fine until we ruined their agriculture. 

We turned them into a drug culture and now, that's pretty much all they've got left.


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## Mushroom

Luddly Neddite said:


> Moonglow said:
> 
> 
> 
> Mexicans can't even run their own nation without our money.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They were doing just fine until we ruined their agriculture.
> 
> We turned them into a drug culture and now, that's pretty much all they've got left.
Click to expand...


Yea, that is why they have been pouring across the border for decades now.  It is so absolutely wonderful in Mexico, they come across by the truck load to try and convince others to move down South.


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## Katzndogz

They want to bring mexico here.   When Mexicans become the majority, they vote in Mexicans who are corrupt and cheat them.  This is normal.  It's what they expect.  That's how Bell, California got to be as corrupt as it was.

What's funny about democrats is that they really think that a Hispanic majority will also be a democrat majority.  Of course it won't.  It will be a Hispanic voted into office, whether he's democrat or not it immaterial.   La Familia FIRST and ONLY.


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## bianco

Katzndogz said:


> They want to bring mexico here.   When Mexicans become the majority, they vote in Mexicans who are corrupt and cheat them.  This is normal.  It's what they expect.  That's how Bell, California got to be as corrupt as it was.
> 
> What's funny about democrats is that they really think that a Hispanic majority will also be a democrat majority.  Of course it won't.  It will be a Hispanic voted into office, whether he's democrat or not it immaterial.   La Familia FIRST and ONLY.



Quite.

And no secret is made of their agenda;

HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!

_Mario Obledo, California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under Jerry Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by Bill Clinton *"California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave." *

Art Torres, Chairman of the California Democratic Party "Remember 187 (proposition to deny taxpayer funds for services to non citizens) was *the last gasp of white America in California." *_


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## Mushroom




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## MaryL

Nobody dares  question  popular mentality. E=mc plus tacos equals fairness? 
 I question why illegal aliens are seen as victims  when they know they are breaking  international law. Pretend they aren&#8217;t doing anything wrong...What? They drag their kids into this, and then cynically use them as "Victims"?  I am told  violating immigration law is a civil infraction, All 12 million of these people are here illegally and it&#8217;s minor issue like somebody  like somebody that jaywalks?  Are you kidding me? Something is wrong here  with this concept BIGTIME.


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## bianco

MaryL said:


> Nobody dares  question  popular mentality. E=mc plus tacos equals fairness?
> I question why illegal aliens are seen as victims  when they know they are breaking  international law. Pretend they arent doing anything wrong...What? They drag their kids into this, and then cynically use them as "Victims"?  I am told  violating immigration law is a civil infraction, All 12 million of these people are here illegally and its minor issue like somebody  like somebody that jaywalks?  Are you kidding me? Something is wrong here  with this concept BIGTIME.



Not according to 'every' left/liberal/Democrat I've encountered in the old NYT forums, and many other forums in the US over the last 15 years or so.
Teachers etc.

It's all fine by them...'Whites are racist', 'multiculturalism is wonderful', and 'People of Colour must take over America and the world as payback' [for slavery, colonisation etc of People of Colour].


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Katzndogz said:
> 
> 
> 
> They want to bring mexico here.   When Mexicans become the majority, they vote in Mexicans who are corrupt and cheat them.  This is normal.  It's what they expect.  That's how Bell, California got to be as corrupt as it was.
> 
> What's funny about democrats is that they really think that a Hispanic majority will also be a democrat majority.  Of course it won't.  It will be a Hispanic voted into office, whether he's democrat or not it immaterial.   La Familia FIRST and ONLY.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quite.
> 
> And no secret is made of their agenda;
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
> 
> _Mario Obledo, California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under Jerry Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by Bill Clinton *"California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave." *
> 
> Art Torres, Chairman of the California Democratic Party "Remember 187 (proposition to deny taxpayer funds for services to non citizens) was *the last gasp of white America in California." *_
Click to expand...


Oblado is dead and Torres is no longer in office....two Mexican extremist....quit your worrying.....come up with something this Century....


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nobody dares  question  popular mentality. E=mc plus tacos equals fairness?
> I question why illegal aliens are seen as victims  when they know they are breaking  international law. Pretend they arent doing anything wrong...What? They drag their kids into this, and then cynically use them as "Victims"?  I am told  violating immigration law is a civil infraction, All 12 million of these people are here illegally and its minor issue like somebody  like somebody that jaywalks?  Are you kidding me? Something is wrong here  with this concept BIGTIME.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to 'every' left/liberal/Democrat I've encountered in the old NYT forums, and many other forums in the US over the last 15 years or so.
> Teachers etc.
> 
> It's all fine by them...'Whites are racist', 'multiculturalism is wonderful', and 'People of Colour must take over America and the world as payback' [for slavery, colonisation etc of People of Colour].
Click to expand...


bull fucking shit.....there many "Lefties" out here that are not to fond of Illegals.....many of the harshest critics of these people are American born Mexicans......one of the biggest reasons you dont see them saying anything is because of the racial bullshit they hear coming from people like you and many on the far right.....they could be on your side in this but as usual the people who make it racial will piss them off and lose their support.....


----------



## Mushroom

Harry Dresden said:


> bull fucking shit.....there many "Lefties" out here that are not to fond of Illegals.....many of the harshest critics of these people are American born Mexicans......one of the biggest reasons you dont see them saying anything is because of the racial bullshit they hear coming from people like you and many on the far right.....they could be on your side in this but as usual the people who make it racial will piss them off and lose their support.....



Heck, look at my wife.

She was not even born in this country, identifies as a Democrat, and despises illegal immigrants.  She can't understand why others should not follow the rules and laws.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Mushroom said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> bull fucking shit.....there many "Lefties" out here that are not to fond of Illegals.....many of the harshest critics of these people are American born Mexicans......one of the biggest reasons you dont see them saying anything is because of the racial bullshit they hear coming from people like you and many on the far right.....they could be on your side in this but as usual the people who make it racial will piss them off and lose their support.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heck, look at my wife.
> 
> She was not even born in this country, identifies as a Democrat, and despises illegal immigrants.  She can't understand why others should not follow the rules and laws.
Click to expand...


exactly......and there are plenty of Democrats and American born Mexicans who feel the same way.....


----------



## bianco

Every was qualified 'every'.

Hmmm, I'll change it to most.

_Not according to most liberal/Democrat forumites I've encountered in the old NYT forums, and many other forums in the US over the last 15 years or so.
Teachers etc.

It's all fine by them...'Whites are racist', 'multiculturalism is wonderful', and 'People of Colour must take over America and the world as payback' [for slavery, colonisation etc of People of Colour]. _


That's been my experience.

By what they wrote in favour of "the poor Latinos are only coming here for a better life."
"Without their labor we would have to pay more for lettuce etc".
"They are only doing jobs Americans don't want to do."

Or by their silence showed that they approve of it all...the takeover of towns, cities, and states by Hispanics both legal and illegal.

Surely no one is gonna try and tell me that La Gran Marcha were all illegals.
And that all the people cheering for "immigration reform" [making all the illegals legal etc] are illegals.

LA GRAN MARCHA 2006 - Downtown Los Angeles - March to Defeat HR 4437 - granmarcha.org

_A sea of humanity envelopes downtown Los Angeles during the nation's largest civil and human rights gathering of this millennium. Estimates of the number of people who attended this major mass demonstration ranged between 500 K to 1 million participants. _


LA GRAN MARCHA (THE GREAT MARCH) - Largest March in U.S. History - March 25, 2006


The agenda is perfectly clear to me.
'Hispanic leaders' have stated it very clearly...and the steam train rolls on.


----------



## bianco

LA GRAN MARCHA (THE GREAT MARCH) - Largest March in U.S. History - March 25, 2006

_Many of these type who will readily refer to the undocumented worker as an "illegal alien", an "enemy invader", or often times worse, continue to see this newest influx of immigrants as a threat to their "American way of life", their jobs, and occasionally even their safety. _

#####

And who would blame them for believing that?
...given the 'stealing' of jobs, killing of Americans on the roads, crimes committed, ...given what 'Hispanic Leaders' and supporters have stated very clearly.


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Every was qualified 'every'.
> 
> Hmmm, I'll change it to most.
> 
> _Not according to most liberal/Democrat forumites I've encountered in the old NYT forums, and many other forums in the US over the last 15 years or so.
> Teachers etc.
> 
> It's all fine by them...'Whites are racist', 'multiculturalism is wonderful', and 'People of Colour must take over America and the world as payback' [for slavery, colonisation etc of People of Colour]. _
> 
> 
> That's been my experience.
> 
> By what they wrote in favour of "the poor Latinos are only coming here for a better life."
> "Without their labor we would have to pay more for lettuce etc".
> "They are only doing jobs Americans don't want to do."
> 
> Or by their silence showed that they approve of it all...the takeover of towns, cities, and states by Hispanics both legal and illegal.
> 
> Surely no one is gonna try and tell me that La Gran Marcha were all illegals.
> And that all the people cheering for "immigration reform" [making all the illegals legal etc] are illegals.
> 
> LA GRAN MARCHA 2006 - Downtown Los Angeles - March to Defeat HR 4437 - granmarcha.org
> 
> _A sea of humanity envelopes downtown Los Angeles during the nation's largest civil and human rights gathering of this millennium. Estimates of the number of people who attended this major mass demonstration ranged between 500 K to 1 million participants. _
> 
> 
> LA GRAN MARCHA (THE GREAT MARCH) - Largest March in U.S. History - March 25, 2006
> 
> 
> The agenda is perfectly clear to me.
> 'Hispanic leaders' have stated it very clearly...and the steam train rolls on.



i hope you do realize that all that shit you just posted is not looked at very seriously by American Mexicans and most Illegals dont buy that shit either.....the ones i live around think those people should stay in Mexico.....they are considered "cucaracha"


----------



## MaryL

Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem. I never heard illegal immigrants here in Colorado THEN. Colorado is a Spanish word, and I knew many Hispanics. I remember a Latino kid fighting back tears at being called a "Mexican". He  said: "I am America as any of you, I ain't no mexican". Those days are long gone. Illegals boldly wave Mexican flags, taunt Americans and then cry about racism when they alienate the Americans of all races and backgrounds... in the present tense. They demand sensitivity and are insensitive, they hate and distrust English speakers, but they want "Bilingualism' but won&#8217;t acclimate. Yeah, something isn't adding up here when it comes to Mexican immigrants. Legal or not, we can't ask and they sure as hell won&#8217;t  tell. No wonder these reprobates  side with Gays. I see a definite parallel there.


----------



## Harry Dresden

MaryL said:


> Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem. I never heard illegal immigrants here in Colorado THEN. Colorado is a Spanish word, and I knew many Hispanics. I remember a Latino kid fighting back tears at being called a "Mexican". He  said: "I am America as any of you, I ain't no mexican". Those days are long gone. Illegals boldly wave Mexican flags, taunt Americans and then cry about racism when they alienate the Americans of all races and backgrounds... in the present tense. They demand sensitivity and are insensitive, they hate and distrust English speakers, but they want "Bilingualism' but wont acclimate. Yeah, something isn't adding up here when it comes to Mexican immigrants. Legal or not, we can't ask and they sure as hell wont  tell. No wonder these reprobates  side with Gays. I see a definite parallel there.


*Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem.*

they were not a problem 45 years ago.....


----------



## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> i hope you do realize that all that shit you just posted is not looked at very seriously by American Mexicans and most Illegals dont buy that shit either.....the ones i live around think those people should stay in Mexico.....they are considered "cucaracha"



"Learn Spanish or be sacked" one NYT forum member said her sister was told by her employer.

Another said that her brother caught TB from a Mexican illegal working in agriculture.

When push comes to shove, the legal Hispanic immigrants and Hispanics born in America, will stand with the illegal Mexicans/Hispanics against the rest of America?


----------



## Gracie




----------



## bianco

Latino Gangs Launch Attacks on Black Families in Compton to Drive Them Out of the City | Your Black World

_Latino Gangs Launch Attacks on Black Families in Compton to Drive Them Out of the City


Compton was once a mostly black area in California, but now there are v*****t Latino gangs there who have declared certain areas off limits to blacks. If black families move into what the Latino gangs declare to be their city, then the blacks are driven out by being intimidated or beaten. 

Compton has population of about 97,000, and was predominantly black for many years. It is now 65% Latino and 33% black, according to the 2010 U.S. census, and the Latino gangs intend to keep the city mostly Latino.

Law enforcement officials say the attacks on black families are being ordered by the Mexican Mafia prison gang. _

#####

Sure looks like takeover to me.
Govt man and his cops seem incapable or unwilling to do anything about it.

The 'fun' will start when non-Latinos in America have nowhere left to run to and decide to stand and fight.
Same deal with Whites in England.


----------



## bianco

Gracie said:


>



It is tough.
Tough having immigrants 'stealing' your jobs and thereby having you tossed out of your home onto the streets to live in poverty and despair, and begging for food. 

Also tough having your jobs outsourced to foreign lands, leaving you jobless and homeless.

Someone in India, China, Mexico, Philippines etc now sitting at your desk, using your telephone, your computer and your stapler while you are living in your unregistered car, living in the woods, or cowering under a tarp in the back blocks of the city...hoping someone will feed you.


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> i hope you do realize that all that shit you just posted is not looked at very seriously by American Mexicans and most Illegals dont buy that shit either.....the ones i live around think those people should stay in Mexico.....they are considered "cucaracha"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Learn Spanish or be sacked" one NYT forum member said her sister was told by her employer.
> 
> Another said that her brother caught TB from a Mexican illegal working in agriculture.
> 
> When push comes to shove, the legal Hispanic immigrants and Hispanics born in America, will stand with the illegal Mexicans/Hispanics against the rest of America?
Click to expand...


will they?.....the ones i have known and worked with for the last 40 years may surprise you....one of the things that is making them silent on this and is pissing them off is the racial bullshit that is being thrown out there at Hispanics....you see that in these threads.....there are people in this Country who actually think EVERY Mexican in California is ILLEGAL....if you are 5th or 6th generation here would that kinda piss you off?...


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is tough.
> Tough having immigrants 'stealing' your jobs and thereby having you tossed out of your home onto the streets to live in poverty and despair, and begging for food.
> 
> Also tough having your jobs outsourced to foreign lands, leaving you jobless and homeless.
> 
> Someone in India, China, Mexico, Philippines etc now sitting at your desk, using your telephone, your computer and your stapler while you are living in your unregistered car, living in the woods, or cowering under a tarp in the back blocks of the city...hoping someone will feed you.
Click to expand...



Are you talking about immigrants, or ILLEGAL immigrants? If you are just whining about the realities of a global economy, well, have fun pissing into the wind.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> The 'fun' will start when non-Latinos in America have nowhere left to run to and decide to stand and fight.




Does that include YOU, Rambo, John, J.?


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> When push comes to shove, the legal Hispanic immigrants and Hispanics born in America, will stand with the illegal Mexicans/Hispanics against the rest of America?







No, they won't. There are other hobbies available to you than being stupid, you know.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gracie said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is tough.
> Tough having immigrants 'stealing' your jobs and thereby having you tossed out of your home onto the streets to live in poverty and despair, and begging for food.
> 
> Also tough having your jobs outsourced to foreign lands, leaving you jobless and homeless.
> 
> Someone in India, China, Mexico, Philippines etc now sitting at your desk, using your telephone, your computer and your stapler while you are living in your unregistered car, living in the woods, or cowering under a tarp in the back blocks of the city...hoping someone will feed you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Are you talking about immigrants, or ILLEGAL immigrants? If you are just whining about the realities of a global economy, well, have fun pissing into the wind.
Click to expand...


Legal immigrants, immigrants, and the govt allowing jobs to be sent offshore.
All three.

With 20 million Americans unemployed, millions homeless, ...immigrants of any type [unless very specialised and desperately needed] are not required and should not be allowed in.

Not in America, but, the same thing is happening all over the West including in America.
...and govts just allow it all.

Bank staff refuse to train overseas replacements - National - smh.com.au

_Staff at a St George Bank accounts office in Kogarah yesterday voted not to help train a team of IT workers from *the Indian outsourcing company that is taking over their jobs. *

One staff member, Cathy Samartzis, said it was like being asked to dig your own grave.

"Some people have been here a long time," she said. "They have mortgages and families and kids to feed. It makes me feel sick."

The staff, who were warned last month that they would lose their jobs early next year, were told on Tuesday that they would assist with training the new staff through a buddy system.

*Their Indian replacements first appeared in the office on Wednesday. *_


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> The 'fun' will start when non-Latinos in America have nowhere left to run to and decide to stand and fight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does that include YOU, Rambo, John, J.?
Click to expand...


Nah, I don't live there, and will be long gone from this earth before it happens, but happen it surely will.
California has fallen, so too almost Arizona, Texas.
Memphis is fast being taken over. [the ruling Blacks are in a quandry, having once been the minority themselves who then took over].


----------



## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> i hope you do realize that all that shit you just posted is not looked at very seriously by American Mexicans and most Illegals dont buy that shit either.....the ones i live around think those people should stay in Mexico.....they are considered "cucaracha"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Learn Spanish or be sacked" one NYT forum member said her sister was told by her employer.
> 
> Another said that her brother caught TB from a Mexican illegal working in agriculture.
> 
> When push comes to shove, the legal Hispanic immigrants and Hispanics born in America, will stand with the illegal Mexicans/Hispanics against the rest of America?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> will they?.....the ones i have known and worked with for the last 40 years may surprise you....one of the things that is making them silent on this and is pissing them off is the racial bullshit that is being thrown out there at Hispanics....you see that in these threads.....there are people in this Country who actually think EVERY Mexican in California is ILLEGAL....if you are 5th or 6th generation here would that kinda piss you off?...
Click to expand...


Probably.

But the question is...are they like the 'moderates' from the other lot, who let the radicals fight the war of takeover then just go along with the flow and be part of the victory/new system?

In the NYT forums there were some Muslims, more than a few.
Poster 'bambi' asked them a question;

_ "If Muslim armies had invaded Canada and taken it, and were now advancing into America over the Canadian border to take America...and the President were handing out machine guns to all citizens...would you pull the trigger to kill Muslims in the invading Muslim armies to save America from takeover...yes or no?" _

Their silence was deafening, they all ran a mile, ...disappeared, never to be heard from again.
Well one did return, and begrudgingly answered yes, but was not very convincing.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Legal immigrants, immigrants, and the govt allowing jobs to be sent offshore.
> All three.
> 
> With 20 million Americans unemployed, millions homeless, ...immigrants of any type [unless very specialised and desperately needed] are not required and should not be allowed in.




You're an idiot. You don't understand anything about economics, you don't understand America, and you don't deserve to so much as visit this great country. Stay the fuck out.


----------



## longknife

Seems I opened a can of worms - didn't I?


----------



## Mushroom

Harry Dresden said:


> *Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem.*
> 
> they were not a problem 45 years ago.....



Errrr, sorry, they were a problem.



> Todays high level of illegal immigration originated during the war years of the early 1940s. Labor shortages caused the federal government to set up a program to import Mexican laborers to work temporarily in agriculture, primary in the Southwest. This was called the Bracero Program. The goal was to import foreign workers (originally thought to number in the hundreds) during agricultural harvest and then encourage them to go home.
> 
> Over the next two decades about 4.8 million Mexican workers came into the country and provided cheap labor to many U.S. employers. Although braceros were supposed to be hired only if an adequate number of Americans could not be found, employers preferred the foreign workers who were willing to work for lesser wages. The program finally ended in 1964 due to complaints from unions and Mexican-Americans that these foreigners were taking jobs from them. Not surprisingly, many of the former braceros reentered and worked in the U.S. illegally -- many for the same employers. Illegal immigration increased greatly during the years of the supposed temporary work Bracero Program. The Los Angeles Times reported in May 1950 that 21,000 Mexican nationals had flooded across Mexican border into the United States during April and complained about the overworked, understaffed border patrolmen and the the endless wave of line jumpers, unprecedented in the nations history. The argument about jobs Americans wont do was recited by an employer, while the authorities stressed the need to enforce the law.
> 
> During President Dwight D. Eisenhowers first term, it was estimated that illegal Mexican border crossings had grown to about 1 million. Such a massive illegal workforce had a devastating impact on the wages of American workers. Eisenhower, concerned about corruption that resulted from the profits of illegal labor, took decisive action. In 1954 he appointed General Joseph Swing to head the Immigration and Naturalization Service. Shortly thereafter, Operation Wetback was launched. With only 1,075 Border Patrol agents, tens of thousands of illegal aliens were caught and sent back deep into Mexico. Hundreds of thousands more returned to their homeland voluntarily. Illegal immigration had dropped 95% by the end of the 1950s.


History of Illegal Immigration in U.S.

Just because you are not aware of a problem, that does not mean it did not exist.


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Sure looks like takeover to me.
> Govt man and his cops seem incapable or unwilling to do anything about it.



This is nothing new, and if you knew the history of LA and it's gangs you would know this.

In 1930, Compton had exactly 1 black resident.  The region was one of the last agricultural districts in LA, and was predominantly Hispanic.  In fact, during the Zoot Suit Riots there were several instances of Zoot SUiters confronting sailors passing through Compton.

However, after WWII "Suburban Flight" had started, with the younger families moving to places like the San Fernando Valley, and leaving Compton and Inglewood for other areas.  Also the Jim Crowe laws were creating a massive flight from the South, often to Los Angeles.

So within a decade the area went from mostly Hispanic and White, to mostly Black.

And today it is spreading more.  The San Fernando Valley was once a "White Bastion", mostly settled by the WWII generation.  But as they died off the neighborhoods shifted.  Areas like Van Nuys Blvd, which once resembled "Main Street USA" is now little more then a street full of Bodegas and Flea Markets.  And the Whites moved to Simi Valley, then Santa Clarita Valley, and now the Antelope Valley.

And I saw the same gang wars going on 30 years ago, nothing new there either.  And most of them are US citizens, born and raised here (and do not break the law), so what should be done?


----------



## Mushroom

longknife said:


> Seems I opened a can of worms - didn't I?



Yea, always a problem when people open their mouths (or type with their fingers) when they do not know what they are talking about (not you, others).

I am seeing this rapidly become a "Let's bash Hispanics" thread, and am simply trying to keep a little rationality and sanity (not that anybody wants to seem to listen).


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seems I opened a can of worms - didn't I?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea, always a problem when people open their mouths (or type with their fingers) when they do not know what they are talking about (not you, others).
> 
> I am seeing this rapidly become a "Let's bash Hispanics" thread, and am simply trying to keep a little rationality and sanity (not that anybody wants to seem to listen).
Click to expand...


I'm quite happy to listen.
Talk away.

Thing is, I read this some years ago in another US forum [or in the NYT forums], which was opened by a person when the old NYT forums closed down.

HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!

Nothing I have read, seen on tv, seen on YouTube etc since has changed my mind as to what the agenda is by "Hispanics" and all their supporters in America/Mexico etc.

Also what the worlwide mostly-Left PC brigade of multiculturalism, appeasement, and takeover are all about.
Replacing the 'first world' "White-majority 'Christian' West" with the 'third world' 'another system'...basically.

The thread title for example;

_California, Arizona, New Mexico Should Belong to Mexico  _


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Nothing I have read, seen on tv, seen on YouTube etc since has changed my mind as to what the agenda is by "Hispanics" and all their supporters in America/Mexico etc.





Youtube? TV? Have you ever actually sat down and had a conversation with a Latino person? Ever? You know they do exist outside your TV (I hope that thought doesn't frighten you overly much).


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> longknife said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seems I opened a can of worms - didn't I?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea, always a problem when people open their mouths (or type with their fingers) when they do not know what they are talking about (not you, others).
> 
> I am seeing this rapidly become a "Let's bash Hispanics" thread, ...
Click to expand...



I can only go by what I read, see on tv, see on YouTube, and are informed about by real people on forums.

"Hispanics" seem quite happy to 'bash' everyone else.

HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!

_THE U.S. VS MEXICO

On February 15, 1998, the U.S. and Mexican soccer teams met at the Los Angeles Coliseum. The crowd was overwhelmingly pro Mexican even though most lived in this country. 
They booed during the National Anthem and U.S. flags were held upside down. 
As the match progressed, supporters of the U.S. team were insulted, pelted with projectiles, punched and spat upon. 
Beer and trash were thrown at the U.S. players before and after the match. 
The coach of the U.S. team, Steve Sampson said, "This was the most painful experience I have ever had in this profession." _

Maybe it's not true, but it sure seems to be true.
Maybe someone could interview Steve Sampson.

Then there are all the other quotes listed in that link...there are names listed as speakers of the words in the quotes, and in all the years since no one that I can find had ever denied they're true and were indeed said.


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Thing is, I read this some years ago in another US forum [or in the NYT forums], which was opened by a person when the old NYT forums closed down.
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!



What is a "Hispanic Leader"?  This is something I actually find inherently both racist and arrogant.  After all, who appoints these people?

Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton are frequently called "Black Leaders", but were they elected to such an august position?  No, they were shoved into it by their own arrogance and mistaken belief that all should be following them.

In truth, these "leaders" are nothing but fearmongers and agitators who are using their supporters as a way to push an agenda.  And in reality it does not even really apply, because most who come to the US come here to escape something, not to export their beliefs and culture into this country.

As I said, my wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US (other then she often talks about opening a "real Argentinian restaurant").  She and her family left there for very good reasons, and she has worked all of her adult life to learning English (she barely has an accent) and fitting in as best she can in her new home.

And as you get further from the immigrant generation, their children and grandchildren generally feel even more that way (other then a few radicals).  I can't tell you the huge numbers of "Mexican-Americans" I have known over the years that have even less Spanish then I do.  No different from most immigrant communities, they are proud to be Americans, and generally look down on the idiots that want to see this country become a new incarnation of the one their ancestors come from.

Heck, my son does not even think of himself as "Hispanic" at all.  He sees himself as a "white boy from the San Fernando Valley", never mind he was born in North Carolina, did not live in "the Valley" until he was in his teens, and his mother is from South America and named Margarita.

You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nothing I have read, seen on tv, seen on YouTube etc since has changed my mind as to what the agenda is by "Hispanics" and all their supporters in America/Mexico etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Youtube? TV? Have you ever actually sat down and had a conversation with a Latino person? Ever? You know they do exist outside your TV (I hope that thought doesn't frighten you overly much).
Click to expand...


I don't live in America [thought you knew that].


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nothing I have read, seen on tv, seen on YouTube etc since has changed my mind as to what the agenda is by "Hispanics" and all their supporters in America/Mexico etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Youtube? TV? Have you ever actually sat down and had a conversation with a Latino person? Ever? You know they do exist outside your TV (I hope that thought doesn't frighten you overly much).
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I don't live in America [thought you knew that].
Click to expand...



That's a relief. What poor nation has the unfortunate fate of hosting you?


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Youtube? TV? Have you ever actually sat down and had a conversation with a Latino person? Ever? You know they do exist outside your TV (I hope that thought doesn't frighten you overly much).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't live in America [thought you knew that].
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> That's a relief. What poor nation has the unfortunate fate of hosting you?
Click to expand...


One of the others the cultural Marxists, PC brigade of appeasement and all their mostly Left supporters are trying to also takeover, same deal as in America today.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't live in America [thought you knew that].
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's a relief. What poor nation has the unfortunate fate of hosting you?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> One of the others the cultural Marxists, PC brigade of appeasement and all their mostly Left supporters are trying to also takeover, same deal as in America today.
Click to expand...




Which one, specifically?


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Learn Spanish or be sacked" one NYT forum member said her sister was told by her employer.
> 
> Another said that her brother caught TB from a Mexican illegal working in agriculture.
> 
> When push comes to shove, the legal Hispanic immigrants and Hispanics born in America, will stand with the illegal Mexicans/Hispanics against the rest of America?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will they?.....the ones i have known and worked with for the last 40 years may surprise you....one of the things that is making them silent on this and is pissing them off is the racial bullshit that is being thrown out there at Hispanics....you see that in these threads.....there are people in this Country who actually think EVERY Mexican in California is ILLEGAL....if you are 5th or 6th generation here would that kinda piss you off?...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Probably.
> 
> But the question is...are they like the 'moderates' from the other lot, who let the radicals fight the war of takeover then just go along with the flow and be part of the victory/new system?
> 
> In the NYT forums there were some Muslims, more than a few.
> Poster 'bambi' asked them a question;
> 
> _ "If Muslim armies had invaded Canada and taken it, and were now advancing into America over the Canadian border to take America...and the President were handing out machine guns to all citizens...would you pull the trigger to kill Muslims in the invading Muslim armies to save America from takeover...yes or no?" _
> 
> Their silence was deafening, they all ran a mile, ...disappeared, never to be heard from again.
> Well one did return, and begrudgingly answered yes, but was not very convincing.
Click to expand...


you live in Oz and you are going to tell me you know what the Mexicans here in California  are thinking?.....geezus......


----------



## Unkotare

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> will they?.....the ones i have known and worked with for the last 40 years may surprise you....one of the things that is making them silent on this and is pissing them off is the racial bullshit that is being thrown out there at Hispanics....you see that in these threads.....there are people in this Country who actually think EVERY Mexican in California is ILLEGAL....if you are 5th or 6th generation here would that kinda piss you off?...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Probably.
> 
> But the question is...are they like the 'moderates' from the other lot, who let the radicals fight the war of takeover then just go along with the flow and be part of the victory/new system?
> 
> In the NYT forums there were some Muslims, more than a few.
> Poster 'bambi' asked them a question;
> 
> _ "If Muslim armies had invaded Canada and taken it, and were now advancing into America over the Canadian border to take America...and the President were handing out machine guns to all citizens...would you pull the trigger to kill Muslims in the invading Muslim armies to save America from takeover...yes or no?" _
> 
> Their silence was deafening, they all ran a mile, ...disappeared, never to be heard from again.
> Well one did return, and begrudgingly answered yes, but was not very convincing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you live in Oz and you are going to tell me you know what the Mexicans here in California  are thinking?.....geezus......
Click to expand...




Oh, he's Australian? That explains it.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thing is, I read this some years ago in another US forum [or in the NYT forums], which was opened by a person when the old NYT forums closed down.
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is a "Hispanic Leader"?  This is something I actually find inherently both racist and arrogant.  After all, who appoints these people?
> 
> Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton are frequently called "Black Leaders", but were they elected to such an august position?  No, they were shoved into it by their own arrogance and mistaken belief that all should be following them.
> 
> In truth, these "leaders" are nothing but fearmongers and agitators who are using their supporters as a way to push an agenda.  And in reality it does not even really apply, because most who come to the US come here to escape something, not to export their beliefs and culture into this country.
> 
> As I said, my wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US (other then she often talks about opening a "real Argentinian restaurant").  She and her family left there for very good reasons, and she has worked all of her adult life to learning English (she barely has an accent) and fitting in as best she can in her new home.
> 
> And as you get further from the immigrant generation, their children and grandchildren generally feel even more that way (other then a few radicals).  I can't tell you the huge numbers of "Mexican-Americans" I have known over the years that have even less Spanish then I do.  No different from most immigrant communities, they are proud to be Americans, and generally look down on the idiots that want to see this country become a new incarnation of the one their ancestors come from.
> 
> Heck, my son does not even think of himself as "Hispanic" at all.  He sees himself as a "white boy from the San Fernando Valley", never mind he was born in North Carolina, did not live in "the Valley" until he was in his teens, and his mother is from South America and named Margarita.
> 
> You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.
Click to expand...


I see Jesse Jackson as "Black leader" [and a good one].
The NAACP is a "Black Leader" [I'm still deciding about them...nothing wrong with trying to advance one's race].
The NBPP is a "Black Leader"... its officials are interviewed on Fox News /US tv.

"Hispanic Leaders";

_ . Jose Pescador Osuna, Mexican Consul General We are practicing "La Reconquista" in California."

. Mario Obledo, California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under Jerry Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by Bill Clinton

. Gloria Molina, Los Angeles County Supervisor 

. Art Torres, Chairman of the California Democratic Party 

. Professor Jose Angel Gutierrez, University of Texas

. Excelsior- The national newspaper of Mexico "The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot."

. Richard Alatorre, Los Angeles City Council "They're afraid we're going to take over the governmental institutions and other institutions. They're right. We will take them over. . We are here to stay."

. Brown Berets _


I'd say they were/are a fair sample of Hispanic Leaders.




> As I said, my wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US (other then she often talks about opening a "real Argentinian restaurant").  She and her family left there for very good reasons, and she has worked all of her adult life to learning English (she barely has an accent) and fitting in as best she can in her new home.



Trouble is...these days most of the immigrants seem to want to change America/the West into the countries they've come from. 
They cheer against their new homes with great gusto, .....in sport, culture [anything and everything], gangs, crime culture, etc.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Mushroom said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem.*
> 
> they were not a problem 45 years ago.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Errrr, sorry, they were a problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Todays high level of illegal immigration originated during the war years of the early 1940s. Labor shortages caused the federal government to set up a program to import Mexican laborers to work temporarily in agriculture, primary in the Southwest. This was called the Bracero Program. The goal was to import foreign workers (originally thought to number in the hundreds) during agricultural harvest and then encourage them to go home.
> 
> Over the next two decades about 4.8 million Mexican workers came into the country and provided cheap labor to many U.S. employers. Although braceros were supposed to be hired only if an adequate number of Americans could not be found, employers preferred the foreign workers who were willing to work for lesser wages. The program finally ended in 1964 due to complaints from unions and Mexican-Americans that these foreigners were taking jobs from them. Not surprisingly, many of the former braceros reentered and worked in the U.S. illegally -- many for the same employers. Illegal immigration increased greatly during the years of the supposed temporary work Bracero Program. The Los Angeles Times reported in May 1950 that 21,000 Mexican nationals had flooded across Mexican border into the United States during April and complained about the overworked, understaffed border patrolmen and the the endless wave of line jumpers, unprecedented in the nations history. The argument about jobs Americans wont do was recited by an employer, while the authorities stressed the need to enforce the law.
> 
> During President Dwight D. Eisenhowers first term, it was estimated that illegal Mexican border crossings had grown to about 1 million. Such a massive illegal workforce had a devastating impact on the wages of American workers. Eisenhower, concerned about corruption that resulted from the profits of illegal labor, took decisive action. In 1954 he appointed General Joseph Swing to head the Immigration and Naturalization Service. Shortly thereafter, Operation Wetback was launched. With only 1,075 Border Patrol agents, tens of thousands of illegal aliens were caught and sent back deep into Mexico. Hundreds of thousands more returned to their homeland voluntarily. Illegal immigration had dropped 95% by the end of the 1950s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> History of Illegal Immigration in U.S.
> 
> Just because you are not aware of a problem, that does not mean it did not exist.
Click to expand...


were you here in California the 60's?....the 70's?.....they were nothing like it is today.....no where near it......


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Trouble is...these days most of the immigrants seem to want to change America/the West into the countries they've come from.
> They cheer against their new homes with great gusto, .....in sport, culture [anything and everything], gangs, crime culture, etc.





Aren't you kind of far from America to be shooting your mouth off about this?


----------



## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> will they?.....the ones i have known and worked with for the last 40 years may surprise you....one of the things that is making them silent on this and is pissing them off is the racial bullshit that is being thrown out there at Hispanics....you see that in these threads.....there are people in this Country who actually think EVERY Mexican in California is ILLEGAL....if you are 5th or 6th generation here would that kinda piss you off?...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Probably.
> 
> But the question is...are they like the 'moderates' from the other lot, who let the radicals fight the war of takeover then just go along with the flow and be part of the victory/new system?
> 
> In the NYT forums there were some Muslims, more than a few.
> Poster 'bambi' asked them a question;
> 
> _ "If Muslim armies had invaded Canada and taken it, and were now advancing into America over the Canadian border to take America...and the President were handing out machine guns to all citizens...would you pull the trigger to kill Muslims in the invading Muslim armies to save America from takeover...yes or no?" _
> 
> Their silence was deafening, they all ran a mile, ...disappeared, never to be heard from again.
> Well one did return, and begrudgingly answered yes, but was not very convincing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you live in Oz and you are going to tell me you know what the Mexicans here in California  are thinking?.....geezus......
Click to expand...


More like inform you of my opinion, in this message board.

I see your "Mexicans here in California" on Fox News, CNN, CNBC, Fox News Latino | Home, US talk shows etc
plus all the newspapers.

The "Mexicans here in California" tell the world what they're thinking, and doing.
La Gran Marcha, immigration reform, and what their other agendas are. 

No Harvard degree needed for this one either.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Probably.
> 
> But the question is...are they like the 'moderates' from the other lot, who let the radicals fight the war of takeover then just go along with the flow and be part of the victory/new system?
> 
> In the NYT forums there were some Muslims, more than a few.
> Poster 'bambi' asked them a question;
> 
> _ "If Muslim armies had invaded Canada and taken it, and were now advancing into America over the Canadian border to take America...and the President were handing out machine guns to all citizens...would you pull the trigger to kill Muslims in the invading Muslim armies to save America from takeover...yes or no?" _
> 
> Their silence was deafening, they all ran a mile, ...disappeared, never to be heard from again.
> Well one did return, and begrudgingly answered yes, but was not very convincing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you live in Oz and you are going to tell me you know what the Mexicans here in California  are thinking?.....geezus......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like inform you of my opinion, in this message board.
> 
> I see your "Mexicans here in California" on Fox News, CNN, CNBC, Fox News Latino | Home, US talk shows etc
> plus all the newspapers.
> 
> The "Mexicans here in California" tell the world what they're thinking, and doing.
> La Gran Marcha, immigration reform, and what their other agendas are.
> 
> No Harvard degree needed for this one either.
Click to expand...



Have you ever even been to California? Even once? Have you ever been anywhere in the US?


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> I don't live in America [thought you knew that].



OK, wait a minute.

You do not even live in, and from how it sounds have never been here.  Yet you are trying to tell those of us that do live here "how things are"?  Wow, a mit bit ignorant and arrogant at the same time.

Well, let me explain this then for you.  I am a native Angelino (that is somebody from Los Angeles), and have lived in California most of my life.  And what you are saying is complete nonsense.

Yes, there are a few arrogant individuals who claim to be "Hispanic Leaders", but most simply ignore them for what they are:  Radical Leftists pushing an agenda.  In fact, back in 2006 we had the "Day Without Immigrants" protest.  And it was not coincidence that this 1 day walkout of mostly Latinos was on May Day.

In fact, a coalition of Latinos was made called "Don't Speak For Us" saying quite publicly that these groups do not even speak for most Hispanics, let alone these members.

Illegal Aliens on the Streets 'Don't Speak for Us,' Says New Hispanic-American Coalition - informationliberation

And most Hispanics in the US believe that those that came across illegally should return home.

You do not live here, you do not know a single thing about these issues, you are just trying to raise some kind of racist nonsense and I don't understand why.


----------



## Mushroom

Unkotare said:


> Have you ever even been to California? Even once? Have you ever been anywhere in the US?



Me thinks Blanco has to much "White Man's Burden".

And not the movie, that was actually pretty good I thought.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trouble is...these days most of the immigrants seem to want to change America/the West into the countries they've come from.
> They cheer against their new homes with great gusto, .....in sport, culture [anything and everything], gangs, crime culture, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Aren't you kind of far from America to be shooting your mouth off about this?
Click to expand...


Nah.
Speaking softy. ['Desiderata']
I'm just saying what I believe to be true.
US tv is in several rooms of my home...and US is mentioned on nearly all of my radio news bulletins.

The US correspondent , Harley Carnes, on my no 1 local radio station tells all every morning.

Harley Carnes - CBS News


US rules the world.
Nearly everything it does/happens there affects me one way or another.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trouble is...these days most of the immigrants seem to want to change America/the West into the countries they've come from.
> They cheer against their new homes with great gusto, .....in sport, culture [anything and everything], gangs, crime culture, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Aren't you kind of far from America to be shooting your mouth off about this?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> US tv is in several rooms of my home...
Click to expand...






Did you type that with a straight face?


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Have you ever even been to California? Even once? Have you ever been anywhere in the US?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Me thinks Blanco has to much "White Man's Burden".
> 
> And not the movie, that was actually pretty good I thought.
Click to expand...


Make that 'bianco' with a "i".

bianco...in honour of a white English Bull Terrier of the same name I used to have and show.

Named from a wine bottle 'Cinzano bianco'.


"White man's burden"?
Not likely.
I didn't do any of it, so I feel no responsibility for it and will never take any blame for it.


----------



## Unkotare

Hey Blanco, doesn't Australia have its own immigration issues you could be spending your time worrying about?


See what I did there, Blanco? I asked a question because I'm not Australian. See how that works, Blanco?


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Aren't you kind of far from America to be shooting your mouth off about this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> US tv is in several rooms of my home...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you type that with a straight face?
Click to expand...


I always type everything with a straight face. 
Fox News is on '24/7' [well when I can afford the electricity that is, Obama's 'climate change' buddies have almost made it unaffordable].


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Mushroom said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thing is, I read this some years ago in another US forum [or in the NYT forums], which was opened by a person when the old NYT forums closed down.
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is a "Hispanic Leader"?  This is something I actually find inherently both racist and arrogant.  After all, who appoints these people?
> 
> Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton are frequently called "Black Leaders", but were they elected to such an august position?  No, they were shoved into it by their own arrogance and mistaken belief that all should be following them.
> 
> In truth, these "leaders" are nothing but fearmongers and agitators who are using their supporters as a way to push an agenda.  And in reality it does not even really apply, because most who come to the US come here to escape something, not to export their beliefs and culture into this country.
> 
> As I said, my wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US (other then she often talks about opening a "real Argentinian restaurant").  She and her family left there for very good reasons, and she has worked all of her adult life to learning English (she barely has an accent) and fitting in as best she can in her new home.
> 
> And as you get further from the immigrant generation, their children and grandchildren generally feel even more that way (other then a few radicals).  I can't tell you the huge numbers of "Mexican-Americans" I have known over the years that have even less Spanish then I do.  No different from most immigrant communities, they are proud to be Americans, and generally look down on the idiots that want to see this country become a new incarnation of the one their ancestors come from.
> 
> Heck, my son does not even think of himself as "Hispanic" at all.  He sees himself as a "white boy from the San Fernando Valley", never mind he was born in North Carolina, did not live in "the Valley" until he was in his teens, and his mother is from South America and named Margarita.
> 
> You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I see Jesse Jackson as "Black leader" [and a good one].
> The NAACP is a "Black Leader" [I'm still deciding about them...nothing wrong with trying to advance one's race].
> The NBPP is a "Black Leader"... its officials are interviewed on Fox News /US tv.
> 
> "Hispanic Leaders";
> 
> _ . Jose Pescador Osuna, Mexican Consul General We are practicing "La Reconquista" in California."
> 
> . Mario Obledo, California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under Jerry Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by Bill Clinton
> 
> . Gloria Molina, Los Angeles County Supervisor
> 
> . Art Torres, Chairman of the California Democratic Party
> 
> . Professor Jose Angel Gutierrez, University of Texas
> 
> . Excelsior- The national newspaper of Mexico "The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot."
> 
> . Richard Alatorre, Los Angeles City Council "They're afraid we're going to take over the governmental institutions and other institutions. They're right. We will take them over. . We are here to stay."
> 
> . Brown Berets _
> 
> 
> I'd say they were/are a fair sample of Hispanic Leaders.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As I said, my wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US (other then she often talks about opening a "real Argentinian restaurant").  She and her family left there for very good reasons, and she has worked all of her adult life to learning English (she barely has an accent) and fitting in as best she can in her new home.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Trouble is...these days most of the immigrants seem to want to change America/the West into the countries they've come from.
> They cheer against their new homes with great gusto, .....in sport, culture [anything and everything], gangs, crime culture, etc.
Click to expand...

Jose Pescador Osuna....not an American.....
Mario Obledo.....dead....not much of a leader....
Gloria Molina...she is the one trying to get rid of the Taco Street Vendors.....no Illegal leader there
Art Torres-not much of a leader here, called US Rep Loretta Sanchez a **** or something and you dont even hear about him anymore....
Jose Angel Gutierrez.....who?....
Excelsior- The national newspaper of Mexico-?....who gives a fuck what they say?...
Richard Alatorre-he has had legal problems....you dont hear about him to often....

lots of great Mexican leaders here......they get laughed at.....or they are not liked by the Illegal Community....


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> US tv is in several rooms of my home...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you type that with a straight face?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I always type everything with a straight face.
> Fox News is on '24/7' [well when I can afford the electricity that is, Obama's 'climate change' buddies have almost made it unaffordable].
Click to expand...



Look Bunco, it's great that you have a TV and all, but that hardly puts you in a position to be making categorical declarations about the mindset of every Latino immigrant and Latino-American and how they will react in some silly speculative scenario you cooked up in a drug-induced haze.


----------



## Unkotare

Harry Dresden said:


> Gloria Molina...she is the one trying to get rid of the Taco Street Vendors.........





Why?


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> Hey Blanco, doesn't Australia have its own immigration issues you could be spending your time worrying about?
> 
> 
> See what I did there, Blanco? I asked a question because I'm not Australian. See how that works, Blanco?



Just because you're American doesn't stop you from expressing opinions on Australian immigration issues in Australian forums...like everyone else does.

You're quite welcome to inform us if your opinion is that people smuggling is great, some people will likely agree with you, others not. 

We've had US warship officers ringing the no 1 radio station talkback.
We have Americans sometimes phoning from America, mostly they email.
2GB | Sydney's premier news and talk radio station - news, talk, sport, entertainment our Sydney [and on relay around the nation] no 1 radio station, worldwide on the net.


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Probably.
> 
> But the question is...are they like the 'moderates' from the other lot, who let the radicals fight the war of takeover then just go along with the flow and be part of the victory/new system?
> 
> In the NYT forums there were some Muslims, more than a few.
> Poster 'bambi' asked them a question;
> 
> _ "If Muslim armies had invaded Canada and taken it, and were now advancing into America over the Canadian border to take America...and the President were handing out machine guns to all citizens...would you pull the trigger to kill Muslims in the invading Muslim armies to save America from takeover...yes or no?" _
> 
> Their silence was deafening, they all ran a mile, ...disappeared, never to be heard from again.
> Well one did return, and begrudgingly answered yes, but was not very convincing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you live in Oz and you are going to tell me you know what the Mexicans here in California  are thinking?.....geezus......
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> More like inform you of my opinion, in this message board.
> 
> I see your "Mexicans here in California" on Fox News, CNN, CNBC, Fox News Latino | Home, US talk shows etc
> plus all the newspapers.
> 
> The "Mexicans here in California" tell the world what they're thinking, and doing.
> La Gran Marcha, immigration reform, and what their other agendas are.
> 
> No Harvard degree needed for this one either.
Click to expand...

*

The "Mexicans here in California" tell the world what they're thinking, and doing.
La Gran Marcha, immigration reform, and what their other agendas are. 
*

all you are hearing is what the ILLEGALS think.....the people who cant speak English.....there is nothing like actually knowing these people personally....going to school and working with them.....Mexicans who were born here or the ones who were born in Mexico but who have assimilated into this society by and far can care less what the Jerks from "La Raza" think......


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you type that with a straight face?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I always type everything with a straight face.
> Fox News is on '24/7' [well when I can afford the electricity that is, Obama's 'climate change' buddies have almost made it unaffordable].
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Look Bunco, it's great that you have a TV and all, but that hardly puts you in a position to be making categorical declarations about the mindset of every Latino immigrant and Latino-American and how they will react in some silly speculative scenario you cooked up in a drug-induced haze.
Click to expand...


Not the mindset of every Latino immigrant and Latino-American [one day hopefully they'll just be called 'American']...but the scenario is not speculative.

List of U.S. communities with Hispanic majority populations in the 2010 census - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The new normal: Asians, Hispanics will soon outnumber current white majority


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Blanco, doesn't Australia have its own immigration issues you could be spending your time worrying about?
> 
> 
> See what I did there, Blanco? I asked a question because I'm not Australian. See how that works, Blanco?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because you're American doesn't stop you from expressing opinions on Australian immigration issues in Australian forums....
Click to expand...



It stops me from 'informing' Australians about what is happening in your country because that would be stupid. Simple reason stops me from declaring what millions of people I've never met are thinking and how they 'would' respond in some silly speculative scenario of my own imagining.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> [one day hopefully they'll just be called 'American']...






They _are_ just called Americans. You are the one who framed this whole thing according to ethnicity.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thing is, I read this some years ago in another US forum [or in the NYT forums], which was opened by a person when the old NYT forums closed down.
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is a "Hispanic Leader"?  This is something I actually find inherently both racist and arrogant.  After all, who appoints these people?
> 
> Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton are frequently called "Black Leaders", but were they elected to such an august position?  No, they were shoved into it by their own arrogance and mistaken belief that all should be following them.
> 
> In truth, these "leaders" are nothing but fearmongers and agitators who are using their supporters as a way to push an agenda.  And in reality it does not even really apply, because most who come to the US come here to escape something, not to export their beliefs and culture into this country.
> 
> As I said, my wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US (other then she often talks about opening a "real Argentinian restaurant").  She and her family left there for very good reasons, and she has worked all of her adult life to learning English (she barely has an accent) and fitting in as best she can in her new home.
> 
> And as you get further from the immigrant generation, their children and grandchildren generally feel even more that way (other then a few radicals).  I can't tell you the huge numbers of "Mexican-Americans" I have known over the years that have even less Spanish then I do.  No different from most immigrant communities, they are proud to be Americans, and generally look down on the idiots that want to see this country become a new incarnation of the one their ancestors come from.
> 
> Heck, my son does not even think of himself as "Hispanic" at all.  He sees himself as a "white boy from the San Fernando Valley", never mind he was born in North Carolina, did not live in "the Valley" until he was in his teens, and his mother is from South America and named Margarita.
> 
> You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.
Click to expand...

*
wife is an immigrant.  But she has absolutely no interest in bringing Argentina into the US 
*

i worked for a few years with a guy from Argentina......we used to kid him about showing us his green card....to work for the PO you are supposed to be a citizen.....so we used to get on him about not being legal....Jorge had a good sense of humor....

*
You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.*

and that sums it up in a nutshell right there.....


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Blanco, doesn't Australia have its own immigration issues you could be spending your time worrying about?
> 
> 
> See what I did there, Blanco? I asked a question because I'm not Australian. See how that works, Blanco?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because you're American doesn't stop you from expressing opinions on Australian immigration issues in Australian forums....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> It stops me from 'informing' Australians about what is happening in your country because that would be stupid. Simple reason stops me from declaring what millions of people I've never met are thinking and how they 'would' respond in some silly speculative scenario of my own imagining.
Click to expand...


Then what's this?

Latino Organizations Launch A Nationwide Push for Immigration Reform | Fox News Latino

_*Latino Organizations Launch A Nationwide Push for Immigration Reform *


A coalition of Latino organizations from around the country is launching a grassroots push for comprehensive immigration reform.

The National Hispanic Leadership Agenda, or NHLA, announced Wednesday that it was kicking off a campaign to push for a restructuring of the nations system for handling immigrants  both legal and undocumented  and that it would feature 60 town hall discussions. _


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Nah.
> Speaking softy. ['Desiderata']
> I'm just saying what I believe to be true.



Personally, I prefer Deteriorata myself.



> Avoid quiet and passive persons, unless you are in need of sleep.





bianco said:


> Make that 'bianco' with a "i".
> 
> bianco...in honour of a white English Bull Terrier of the same name I used to have and show.
> 
> Named from a wine bottle 'Cinzano bianco'.
> 
> 
> "White man's burden"?
> Not likely.
> I didn't do any of it, so I feel no responsibility for it and will never take any blame for it.



And yea, I saw that, but it seems more like "Blanco" from what you are saying.

And are you even aware of what "White Man's Burden" is?  It is from Kipling, basically saying it is the responsibility of the "White Man" to bring culture and civilization to the wogs of the world (not his exact words, but the implication of them).

Sounds to me like you think those brown skinned fools should get back into their place.

I wonder if you are aware of (or even care) how arrogantly racist your posts come off as.  As for myself, how about asking some of us how things really are, instead of just jumping in and throwing around a bunch of nonsense, eh?

Like your posts earlier about Compton.  You really did stick your face to the dog turd with that one, and I notice you have completely ignored it.  To you Compton is probably just a name you hear in rap songs, where as to me it was home for several years.

As for Australian immigration, I have no opinion because it is not my country.  Therefore I have no right to tell Australia (or any other country) how to handle their own immigration policies.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just because you're American doesn't stop you from expressing opinions on Australian immigration issues in Australian forums....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It stops me from 'informing' Australians about what is happening in your country because that would be stupid. Simple reason stops me from declaring what millions of people I've never met are thinking and how they 'would' respond in some silly speculative scenario of my own imagining.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then what's this?
> 
> Latino Organizations Launch A Nationwide Push for Immigration Reform | Fox News Latino
> 
> _*Latino Organizations Launch A Nationwide Push for Immigration Reform *
> 
> 
> A coalition of Latino organizations from around the country is launching a grassroots push for comprehensive immigration reform.
> 
> The National Hispanic Leadership Agenda, or NHLA, announced Wednesday that it was kicking off a campaign to push for a restructuring of the nations system for handling immigrants  both legal and undocumented  and that it would feature 60 town hall discussions. _
Click to expand...



What about it? Many Americans, of all 'races,'  want to see immigration reform. It has nothing to do with your asinine fantasies. 

Don't you have some Indian tourists to harass or something? Turn off your TV and go have a 'walkabout' or whatever it is you people do there.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nah.
> Speaking softy. ['Desiderata']
> I'm just saying what I believe to be true.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Personally, I prefer Deteriorata myself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Avoid quiet and passive persons, unless you are in need of sleep.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Make that 'bianco' with a "i".
> 
> bianco...in honour of a white English Bull Terrier of the same name I used to have and show.
> 
> Named from a wine bottle 'Cinzano bianco'.
> 
> 
> "White man's burden"?
> Not likely.
> I didn't do any of it, so I feel no responsibility for it and will never take any blame for it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And yea, I saw that, but it seems more like "Blanco" from what you are saying.
> 
> And are you even aware of what "White Man's Burden" is?  It is from Kipling, basically saying it is the responsibility of the "White Man" to bring culture and civilization to the wogs of the world (not his exact words, but the implication of them).
> 
> Sounds to me like you think those brown skinned fools should get back into their place.
> 
> I wonder if you are aware of (or even care) how arrogantly racist your posts come off as.  As for myself, how about asking some of us how things really are, instead of just jumping in and throwing around a bunch of nonsense, eh?
> 
> Like your posts earlier about Compton.  You really did stick your face to the dog turd with that one, and I notice you have completely ignored it.  To you Compton is probably just a name you hear in rap songs, where as to me it was home for several years.
Click to expand...


I'd never heard of Compton until I read about how 'Latinos' [gangs in this case] are establishing no go zones for non-Latinos in Compton and keeping it majority Latino by force/violence against Black families.

It's not up to the "White man" to bring civilisation and culture to anyone.
Some places could do with some 'civilisation' though.

Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into White-majority countries to take them over and turn them into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures.



> Sounds to me like you think those brown skinned fools should get back into their place.



I wrote nothing resembling that.
Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?


----------



## Mushroom

Harry Dresden said:


> i worked for a few years with a guy from Argentina......we used to kid him about showing us his green card....to work for the PO you are supposed to be a citizen.....so we used to get on him about not being legal....Jorge had a good sense of humor....



Way back when my wife got her Permanent Resident Card, she thought it was funny that they are not green at all, but tan.

But I being in the Marines had an ID card that was green, that I jokingly called my "Green Card".



Harry Dresden said:


> *You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.*
> 
> and that sums it up in a nutshell right there.....



And I wonder if Blanco even knows who or what MOVE is.

Foreigners often have little to no comprehension of what living in the US is really like.  We are the most polyglot nation on the planet, where 99% are immigrants or the descendants of immigrants.  And for the most part, we do not care where those ancestors came from.

Most of us are literally a "Heinz 57" of heritages and ancestors.  Indian (teepee type not the dot on the head type) is my strongest, followed by French, German, Norse, English and a few others.  Most of us are such a blending that trying to determine a single ethnicity is almost impossible.  And in the last half century this has accelerated even more as my generation often thinks nothing of marrying "outside of our race".

Other then in a few ghetto areas (in the technical sense not the pejorative one) like "Chinatown" will you find predominantly people in the US who are only of a single ethnicity.

For most of us, "Ethnicity" is mostly something we pull out on days like St. Patrick's Day or Cinco de Mayo.  In other words, an excuse to drink and party.

As for "Mexicans wanting parts of the US to be part of Mexico", that is simple nonsense.  I doubt that Blanco is even aware that the 2 biggest states he is talking about (Texas and California) openly revolted from Mexico and became part of the US by their own free will - *even though their predominant population was Mexican!*


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into White-majority countries to take them over and turn them into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures.





You go try and convince your fellow Australians (almost all of whom are there because of immigration - voluntary or not) of that, and we'll take care of America without your expert advice. How's that? Super.


----------



## Unkotare

Mushroom said:


> Most of us are literally a "Heinz 57" of heritages and ancestors.  Indian (teepee type not the dot on the head type) is my strongest, followed by French, German, Norse, English and a few others.  Most of us are such a blending that trying to determine a single ethnicity is almost impossible.  And in the last half century this has accelerated even more as my generation often thinks nothing of marrying "outside of our race".





The fastest growing demographic in the US is mixed-race people. 


Multiracial people are fastest growing group - US news - Life - Race & ethnicity | NBC News


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into White-majority countries to take them over and turn them into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You go try and convince your fellow Australians (almost all of whom are there because of immigration - voluntary or not) of that, and we'll take care of America without your expert advice. How's that? Super.
Click to expand...


Which you speak from a White-majority-'Christian' nation....with the systems, values, Consitution, culture, and standards that entails.

Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> I'd never heard of Compton until I read about how 'Latinos' [gangs in this case] are establishing no go zones for non-Latinos in Compton and keeping it majority Latino by force/violence against Black families.



And having lived in Compton, I find that hard to believe.  Especially since Compton is still mostly a Black city, not Latino.



bianco said:


> Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into White-majority countries to take them over and turn them into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures.



And with that comment there is now no question that you are a racist and bigot, and to be openly ridiculed and shunned.

Have a nice day.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into White-majority countries to take them over and turn them into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You go try and convince your fellow Australians (almost all of whom are there because of immigration - voluntary or not) of that, and we'll take care of America without your expert advice. How's that? Super.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Which you speak from a White-majority-'Christian' nation....with the systems, values, Consitution, culture, and standards that entails.
> 
> Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?
Click to expand...


Why do you keep using inside quotation marks around "ordinary person"?


----------



## Mushroom

Unkotare said:


> Mushroom said:
> 
> 
> 
> Most of us are literally a "Heinz 57" of heritages and ancestors.  Indian (teepee type not the dot on the head type) is my strongest, followed by French, German, Norse, English and a few others.  Most of us are such a blending that trying to determine a single ethnicity is almost impossible.  And in the last half century this has accelerated even more as my generation often thinks nothing of marrying "outside of our race".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The fastest growing demographic in the US is mixed-race people.
> 
> Multiracial people are fastest growing group - US news - Life - Race & ethnicity | NBC News
Click to expand...


And I am not one bit surprised.

My wife is Hispanic.  And I have dated gals of many ethnicities, from Mexican and Puerto Rican to Black, German, and even one who was Japanese.  "Hispanic" is simply on the rise so fast because it is the 3rd largest ethnicity after White and Black.  And most of them have been in this nation for over 100 years.  Pretty much everything South of Georgia was once Spanish or Mexican territory.  And it is not unusual to see families that have been in the region longer then the United States has been a country.

And I am sure this infuriates a lot of "White Foreigners", as they see in their minds that the US is becoming "Non-White".  Well that is their problem, not mine.

The only race I actually claim is "American", and often refuse to admit to one if asked because I feel it is nobody else's business but my own.

So either Blanco is a racist turd, or is trying to stir the pot by making some kind of obscure race ploy.  Either way it fails, because he has no concept of what it is like to live in the US.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd never heard of Compton until I read about how 'Latinos' [gangs in this case] are establishing no go zones for non-Latinos in Compton and keeping it majority Latino by force/violence against Black families.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And having lived in Compton, I find that hard to believe.  Especially since Compton is still mostly a Black city, not Latino.
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into White-majority countries to take them over and turn them into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And with that comment there is now no question that you are a racist and bigot, and to be openly ridiculed and shunned.
> 
> Have a nice day.
Click to expand...


I won't likely get an answer but I'll ask the question anyway;

So you think immigrants should be allowed into White-majority 'Christian' America to take it over and turn it into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures ?

A la 'Mexico', 'South America', 'Middle East', 'Asia', 'Africa' etc.


My  _Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'? _ was obviously too hard.


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Which you speak from a White-majority-'Christian' nation....with the systems, values, Consitution, culture, and standards that entails.
> 
> Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?



Actually, the US is not a "Christian Nation".  It is however a spiritually Judeo-Christian nation, but not at all religious.

That is why for example in our Declaration of Independence it simply says "The Creator".  Not "God", not "Jehova", not "Jesus", not "Allah", not "Vishnu", and not even "The Great Spaghetti Monster".  "The Creator", generic, implying a higher power but not implying who or any one over another.

And we are not going to be "White majority" for long, which I am sure pisses you off to no end.  Ethnically, my son is as "White" as the President and Tiger Woods are "Black".


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> My  _Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'? _ was obviously too hard.




First explain why you keep putting "ordinary person" in inside quotes.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> You go try and convince your fellow Australians (almost all of whom are there because of immigration - voluntary or not) of that, and we'll take care of America without your expert advice. How's that? Super.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which you speak from a White-majority-'Christian' nation....with the systems, values, Consitution, culture, and standards that entails.
> 
> Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Why do you keep using inside quotation marks around "ordinary person"?
Click to expand...



As a 'qualification', meaning that the person being asked the question is not ordinary/lowly as such, and neither are the people in the non-White-majority-'Christian' nation.
And as a title, like 'working class', as distinct from the ruling elite/rich.


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> I won't likely get an answer but I'll ask the question anyway;
> 
> So you think immigrants should be allowed into White-majority 'Christian' America to take it over and turn it into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures ?
> 
> A la 'Mexico', 'South America', 'Middle East', 'Asia', 'Africa' etc.
> 
> 
> My  _Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'? _ was obviously too hard.



For one, I live in a Representational Republic.  Therefore nothing happens without the consent of the people.

And there are not enough immigrants to make that kind of a change, ever, period.  We may get nutcases and extremists at the local level, but they do not make it at all in National politics.

Look at Jesse Jackson for an example, every time he ran for President it was humiliating for him, because nobody bought his race politics.  There are probably a number who would think that way, but they are a small minority.

And I would rather see that then to see my country become some kind of "White Christian Only Playground" like you seem to wish it was.  I am sure that you would have had no problem telling my Grandmother to go back to the reservation, put feathers in her hair and be a good little Squaw.

And you have no idea how hard it is becoming for me to remain civil at this time.  The more you type the more I feel my self-control slipping and saying something that would probably get me temporarily banned from here.  Everything that I see spew from your sewer of a mind now I find more disgusting then what is probably running in the sewer under the building I am sitting in.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Which you speak from a White-majority-'Christian' nation....with the systems, values, Consitution, culture, and standards that entails.
> 
> Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you keep using inside quotation marks around "ordinary person"?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> As a 'qualification', meaning that the person being asked the question is not ordinary/lowly as such, and neither are the people in the non-White-majority-'Christian' nation.
> And as a title, like 'working class', as distinct from the ruling elite/rich.
Click to expand...



Unnecessary, but OK. I have lived comfortably and well in countries such as the type to which you referred in your question. I reckon I could live about anywhere if circumstances called for it. If not for my deep and abiding love for America (a country you clearly understand nothing about) I could live the rest of my life in Japan quite contentedly.

Does that answer your 'question,' you ignorant, racist turd?


----------



## Unkotare

Mushroom said:


> And you have no idea how hard it is becoming for me to remain civil at this time.  The more you type the more I feel my self-control slipping and saying something that would probably get me temporarily banned from here.  Everything that I see spew from your sewer of a mind now I find more disgusting then what is probably running in the sewer under the building I am sitting in.





Go for it. Tell 'it' what it really is. I can't imagine anyone having any sympathy for it by now.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Which you speak from a White-majority-'Christian' nation....with the systems, values, Consitution, culture, and standards that entails.
> 
> Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, the US is not a "Christian Nation".  It is however a spiritually Judeo-Christian nation, but not at all religious.
> 
> That is why for example in our Declaration of Independence it simply says "The Creator".  Not "God", not "Jehova", not "Jesus", not "Allah", not "Vishnu", and not even "The Great Spaghetti Monster".  "The Creator", generic, implying a higher power but not implying who or any one over another.
> 
> And we are not going to be "White majority" for long, which I am sure pisses you off to no end.  Ethnically, my son is as "White" as the President and Tiger Woods are "Black".
Click to expand...


U.S. is seen from afar as a Christian nation, but is not in effect...hence the qualification 'Christian'. 

The money says, or used to ;  In God We Trust. [It meant Jesus' Father, I believe]
When you are no longer a White Majority nation, what will you be?  and who will you be run by? 
That's the worry.
Not what the colors of the skin of the citizens are.

Mexican-South American-Russian gangsters, in league with Al Qaeda?
Communist China?


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> When you are no longer a White Majority nation, what will you be?




The same nation we are now. You'd know that if you understood the first thing about America, you ignorant little turd.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you keep using inside quotation marks around "ordinary person"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As a 'qualification', meaning that the person being asked the question is not ordinary/lowly as such, and neither are the people in the non-White-majority-'Christian' nation.
> And as a title, like 'working class', as distinct from the ruling elite/rich.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Unnecessary, but OK. I have lived comfortably and well in countries such as the type to which you referred in your question. I reckon I could live about anywhere if circumstances called for it. If not for my deep and abiding love for America (a country you clearly understand nothing about) I could live the rest of my life in Japan quite contentedly.
> 
> Does that answer your 'question,' you ignorant, racist turd?
Click to expand...


Then you must've had plenty of money, or lowered your expectations/standard of living.
I notice you're not living in any of those countries today. 

Japan?
No thank you!

Whites are being genocided in Africa, so no thank you to there also!


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> As a 'qualification', meaning that the person being asked the question is not ordinary/lowly as such, and neither are the people in the non-White-majority-'Christian' nation.
> And as a title, like 'working class', as distinct from the ruling elite/rich.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unnecessary, but OK. I have lived comfortably and well in countries such as the type to which you referred in your question. I reckon I could live about anywhere if circumstances called for it. If not for my deep and abiding love for America (a country you clearly understand nothing about) I could live the rest of my life in Japan quite contentedly.
> 
> Does that answer your 'question,' you ignorant, racist turd?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Then you must've had plenty of money, or lowered your expectations/standard of living.
Click to expand...




Neither. I'm just not a pussy like  you.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Japan?
> No thank you!!





Is this like California all over again? Have you ever been to Japan? Lots of Australians visit.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I won't likely get an answer but I'll ask the question anyway;
> 
> So you think immigrants should be allowed into White-majority 'Christian' America to take it over and turn it into 'the third world'/ some other system-cultures ?
> 
> A la 'Mexico', 'South America', 'Middle East', 'Asia', 'Africa' etc.
> 
> 
> My  _Which non-White-majority-'Christian' nation would you like to live in as an 'ordinary person'? _ was obviously too hard.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For one, I live in a Representational Republic.  Therefore nothing happens without the consent of the people.
> 
> And there are not enough immigrants to make that kind of a change, ever, period.  We may get nutcases and extremists at the local level, but they do not make it at all in National politics.
> 
> Look at Jesse Jackson for an example, every time he ran for President it was humiliating for him, because nobody bought his race politics.  There are probably a number who would think that way, but they are a small minority.
> 
> And I would rather see that then to see my country become some kind of "White Christian Only Playground" like you seem to wish it was.  I am sure that you would have had no problem telling my Grandmother to go back to the reservation, put feathers in her hair and be a good little Squaw.
> 
> And you have no idea how hard it is becoming for me to remain civil at this time.  The more you type the more I feel my self-control slipping and saying something that would probably get me temporarily banned from here.  Everything that I see spew from your sewer of a mind now I find more disgusting then what is probably running in the sewer under the building I am sitting in.
Click to expand...


I didn't write White Christian Only Playground...you made that up.
I wrote White-Majority 'Christian'...'Christian' values.

You're sure of nothing.
I voted in the federal referendum in 1967 for Aborigines [at that time classed by the govt as 'flora and fauna' and treated as such] to be fully equal in every respect...as did 90% of the population, mostly White people.

Do you have Americans living on garbage dumps today?
Born on them, live on them, and die on them.
Non-White-majority Asia does.

I would have your grandmother living in nice public housing if she could not afford a home of her own.
All the comforts and facilites.
Not on any reservation.
If she could afford a home or mansion of her own...then my equality system would see her as anyone else.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Japan?
> No thank you!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is this like California all over again? Have you ever been to Japan? Lots of Australians visit.
Click to expand...


Maybe when they stop treating me with utter contempt, and slaughtering my whales every Christmas.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Japan?
> No thank you!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is this like California all over again? Have you ever been to Japan? Lots of Australians visit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Maybe when they stop treating me with utter contempt, and slaughtering my whales every Christmas.
Click to expand...



So the answer is NO, you've never been there. You are talking out your ass AGAIN.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this like California all over again? Have you ever been to Japan? Lots of Australians visit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe when they stop treating me with utter contempt, and slaughtering my whales every Christmas.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> So the answer is NO, you've never been there. You are talking out your ass AGAIN.
Click to expand...


I thought my answer was quite clear.

I wouldn't set foot in Japan if you or anyone else paid for it all.
WW2, dolphins, whales, don't speak Japanese, object to taking my shoes off...there are many reasons.


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe when they stop treating me with utter contempt, and slaughtering my whales every Christmas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So the answer is NO, you've never been there. You are talking out your ass AGAIN.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I thought my answer was quite clear.
> 
> I wouldn't set foot in Japan if you or anyone else paid for it all.
> WW2, dolphins, whales, don't speak Japanese, object to taking my shoes off...there are many reasons.
Click to expand...





No, there is only one reason. It's the same reason you shoot your mouth off about the US despite the fact that you have no fucking idea what you are talking about. You are a bitter little coward who is only comfortable hiding at home and guessing at other places because reality might not confirm your asinine little imagination. You're fucking pathetic.


----------



## bianco

Unkotare said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> So the answer is NO, you've never been there. You are talking out your ass AGAIN.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought my answer was quite clear.
> 
> I wouldn't set foot in Japan if you or anyone else paid for it all.
> WW2, dolphins, whales, don't speak Japanese, object to taking my shoes off...there are many reasons.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, there is only one reason. *It's the same reason you shoot your mouth off about the US despite the fact that you have no fucking idea what you are talking about. *You are a bitter little coward who is only comfortable hiding at home and guessing at other places because reality might not confirm your asinine little imagination. You're fucking pathetic.
Click to expand...


I do know what I'm talking about...I have plenty of idea.
America is an open book...as are Mexico, Africa, South America, Japan, Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Koreas, Middle East, etc.

What it's like living in America is very clear;

Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino

_*Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas *


Black and White

Charles says those who run organized, largely Hispanic crews almost never hire willing African-American laborers.

"Oh no, blacks they are out of the question. Blacks are out of the question. Nobody wants a black person in there," Charles insisted, a Mexican-American man.

*The practice of rejecting black labor is deeply entrenched discrimination which extends to white workers as well, *Charles says.

These men and women are effectively cut off from decent-paying construction jobs by secretive Mexican labor gangs.

"They are afraid that white people are not going to put up with their unethical acts," Charles explained. _


----------



## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I thought my answer was quite clear.
> 
> I wouldn't set foot in Japan if you or anyone else paid for it all.
> WW2, dolphins, whales, don't speak Japanese, object to taking my shoes off...there are many reasons.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, there is only one reason. *It's the same reason you shoot your mouth off about the US despite the fact that you have no fucking idea what you are talking about. *You are a bitter little coward who is only comfortable hiding at home and guessing at other places because reality might not confirm your asinine little imagination. You're fucking pathetic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do know what I'm talking about...America is an open book...as is Mexico, Africa, South Ameria, Japan, Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Koreas, Middle East, etc.
Click to expand...



Because you can turn on the TV? Because of Youtube? You are so completely full of shit it's embarrassing to watch. You know nothing, you ignorant little shit nugget.


----------



## Againsheila

bianco said:


> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't change the fact we bought the area. They can tell all the lies they want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They're taking it back;
> 
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
> 
> _'We are practicing "La Reconquista" in California.'
> 
> "California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave."
> 
> Excelsior- The national newspaper of Mexico "The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot." _
Click to expand...


Just read my sig line, it says it all.


----------



## bianco

Againsheila said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RetiredGySgt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't change the fact we bought the area. They can tell all the lies they want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They're taking it back;
> 
> 
> HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!
> 
> _'We are practicing "La Reconquista" in California.'
> 
> "California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave."
> 
> Excelsior- The national newspaper of Mexico "The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot." _
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Just read my sig line, it says it all.
Click to expand...



Which will no doubt suit a lot of Americans...but I wonder just how long it will suit them for.


----------



## Harry Dresden

Mushroom said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> i worked for a few years with a guy from Argentina......we used to kid him about showing us his green card....to work for the PO you are supposed to be a citizen.....so we used to get on him about not being legal....Jorge had a good sense of humor....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Way back when my wife got her Permanent Resident Card, she thought it was funny that they are not green at all, but tan.
> 
> But I being in the Marines had an ID card that was green, that I jokingly called my "Green Card".
> 
> 
> 
> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> *You are taking this from a fringe group, that no more speaks for Hispanics then MOVE spoke for Blacks.*
> 
> and that sums it up in a nutshell right there.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And I wonder if Blanco even knows who or what MOVE is.
> 
> Foreigners often have little to no comprehension of what living in the US is really like.  We are the most polyglot nation on the planet, where 99% are immigrants or the descendants of immigrants.  And for the most part, we do not care where those ancestors came from.
> 
> Most of us are literally a "Heinz 57" of heritages and ancestors.  Indian (teepee type not the dot on the head type) is my strongest, followed by French, German, Norse, English and a few others.  Most of us are such a blending that trying to determine a single ethnicity is almost impossible.  And in the last half century this has accelerated even more as my generation often thinks nothing of marrying "outside of our race".
> 
> Other then in a few ghetto areas (in the technical sense not the pejorative one) like "Chinatown" will you find predominantly people in the US who are only of a single ethnicity.
> 
> For most of us, "Ethnicity" is mostly something we pull out on days like St. Patrick's Day or Cinco de Mayo.  In other words, an excuse to drink and party.
> 
> As for "Mexicans wanting parts of the US to be part of Mexico", that is simple nonsense.  I doubt that Blanco is even aware that the 2 biggest states he is talking about (Texas and California) openly revolted from Mexico and became part of the US by their own free will - *even though their predominant population was Mexican!*
Click to expand...


the Illegals i live around and know, dont think too highly of the La Raza type of shit.....when they had their last rally in LA ....Walter the guy who lives behind me was in his Garage and i was on my way out....i yelled over to him ..."hey why aint you in LA with your La Raza buddies.....he said ..."fuck that shit i have to work.....something those assholes dont do".....he is from El Salvador....


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I thought my answer was quite clear.
> 
> I wouldn't set foot in Japan if you or anyone else paid for it all.
> WW2, dolphins, whales, don't speak Japanese, object to taking my shoes off...there are many reasons.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, there is only one reason. *It's the same reason you shoot your mouth off about the US despite the fact that you have no fucking idea what you are talking about. *You are a bitter little coward who is only comfortable hiding at home and guessing at other places because reality might not confirm your asinine little imagination. You're fucking pathetic.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I do know what I'm talking about...I have plenty of idea.
> America is an open book...as are Mexico, Africa, South America, Japan, Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Koreas, Middle East, etc.
> 
> What it's like living in America is very clear;
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _*Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas *
> 
> 
> Black and White
> 
> Charles says those who run organized, largely Hispanic crews almost never hire willing African-American laborers.
> 
> "Oh no, blacks they are out of the question. Blacks are out of the question. Nobody wants a black person in there," Charles insisted, a Mexican-American man.
> 
> *The practice of rejecting black labor is deeply entrenched discrimination which extends to white workers as well, *Charles says.
> 
> These men and women are effectively cut off from decent-paying construction jobs by secretive Mexican labor gangs.
> 
> "They are afraid that white people are not going to put up with their unethical acts," Charles explained. _
Click to expand...


your problem is you listen to way to much Latino News about what goes on here....


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Japan?
> No thank you!



Why not?  Have you ever been to Japan (let alone lived there)?

Well, I have, yes to both.  And I have never found the people to be anything other then polite unless provoked.  Even though I was very obviously a minority there, nobody treated me any differently then I would have expected in the US.

And they are not Christian, but Shinto-Buddhist.


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> I would have your grandmother living in nice public housing if she could not afford a home of her own.
> All the comforts and facilites.



Oh... my... fucking... god.

What do you think a "reservation" is?  Public housing, paid for by the people of the US, where the Indians were shoved to keep them away from the "respectable White people".

Full of people who became alcoholics and largely did nothing with their lives, because there was nothing to do with them.  An entire way of life destroyed, and replaced with a totally different culture that it took them decades to adapt to.

All you are preaching here is another form of slavery, but one to the state.

My grandmother actually did very well for herself, without that "government housing", thank you very much.  Until a few months before she died (at the age of 96), she was still speed walking 3-5 miles a day, and only stopped skiing when she was 93 because her osteoporosis got to bad to continue.

Why is it that just about everything you say is offensive?  Are you really this ignorant, or enjoy pissing people off?



bianco said:


> If she could afford a home or mansion of her own...then my equality system would see her as anyone else.



Ahhh, so I see, you are a Socialist, that explains a lot.

Actually, she and my grandfather retired pretty nicely.  They owned one of the nicest houses in town, and spent their summers after retirement on a sailboat near Seattle in the Summer, and at a condo in Idaho skiing in the winters.

So under your "equality system", she would have still ended up in "public housing", how nice.



bianco said:


> Maybe when they stop treating me with utter contempt, and slaughtering my whales every Christmas.



And what is the problem with that?  They are not hunting whales that are endangered (nor dolphins), so what is the big deal?

As I said, I have lived in Japan.  And yes, I have eaten whale and dolphin.  So what?  I did not care much for the whale (to much fat), but that is their business.

And while I did agree when they forced most nations to use "dolphin safe nets", I actually agreed with the request from Japan to be exempt.  For most nations dolphins were an accidental catch, to be thrown overboard as waste.

When Japanese fishers caught dolphins, it was just another source of food.  It was never the killing of dolphins that bothered me at all, but the waste of most of those that were caught.

I no more put dolphins and whales on a sacred pedestal then I would a cow or a pig.

And maybe they treat *you* with utter contempt because you are a contemptible racist individual.


----------



## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, there is only one reason. *It's the same reason you shoot your mouth off about the US despite the fact that you have no fucking idea what you are talking about. *You are a bitter little coward who is only comfortable hiding at home and guessing at other places because reality might not confirm your asinine little imagination. You're fucking pathetic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do know what I'm talking about...I have plenty of idea.
> America is an open book...as are Mexico, Africa, South America, Japan, Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Koreas, Middle East, etc.
> 
> What it's like living in America is very clear;
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _*Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas *
> 
> 
> Black and White
> 
> Charles says those who run organized, largely Hispanic crews almost never hire willing African-American laborers.
> 
> "Oh no, blacks they are out of the question. Blacks are out of the question. Nobody wants a black person in there," Charles insisted, a Mexican-American man.
> 
> *The practice of rejecting black labor is deeply entrenched discrimination which extends to white workers as well, *Charles says.
> 
> These men and women are effectively cut off from decent-paying construction jobs by secretive Mexican labor gangs.
> 
> "They are afraid that white people are not going to put up with their unethical acts," Charles explained. _
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> your problem is you listen to way to much Latino News about what goes on here....
Click to expand...


Nah, the problem is the corrupt and racist, secretive Mexican labor gangs that you seem to approve of.


----------



## Mr. H.

There was a really good documentary about Sam Houston on the TV this evening. More episodes to come.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I would have your grandmother living in nice public housing if she could not afford a home of her own.
> All the comforts and facilites.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh... my... fucking... god.
> 
> What do you think a "reservation" is?  Public housing, paid for by the people of the US, where the Indians were shoved to keep them away from the "respectable White people".
> 
> Full of people who became alcoholics and largely did nothing with their lives, because there was nothing to do with them.  An entire way of life destroyed, and replaced with a totally different culture that it took them decades to adapt to.
> 
> All you are preaching here is another form of slavery, but one to the state.
> 
> My grandmother actually did very well for herself, without that "government housing", thank you very much.  Until a few months before she died (at the age of 96), she was still speed walking 3-5 miles a day, and only stopped skiing when she was 93 because her osteoporosis got to bad to continue.
> 
> Why is it that just about everything you say is offensive?  Are you really this ignorant, or enjoy pissing people off?
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> If she could afford a home or mansion of her own...then my equality system would see her as anyone else.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ahhh, so I see, you are a Socialist, that explains a lot.
> 
> Actually, she and my grandfather retired pretty nicely.  They owned one of the nicest houses in town, and spent their summers after retirement on a sailboat near Seattle in the Summer, and at a condo in Idaho skiing in the winters.
> 
> So under your "equality system", she would have still ended up in "public housing", how nice.
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe when they stop treating me with utter contempt, and slaughtering my whales every Christmas.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> And what is the problem with that?  They are not hunting whales that are endangered (nor dolphins), so what is the big deal?
> 
> As I said, I have lived in Japan.  And yes, I have eaten whale and dolphin.  So what?  I did not care much for the whale (to much fat), but that is their business.
> 
> And while I did agree when they forced most nations to use "dolphin safe nets", I actually agreed with the request from Japan to be exempt.  For most nations dolphins were an accidental catch, to be thrown overboard as waste.
> 
> When Japanese fishers caught dolphins, it was just another source of food.  It was never the killing of dolphins that bothered me at all, but the waste of most of those that were caught.
> 
> I no more put dolphins and whales on a sacred pedestal then I would a cow or a pig.
> 
> And maybe they treat *you* with utter contempt because you are a contemptible racist individual.
Click to expand...


Gee it's tough.

Slavery?
If your grandmother couldn't provide housing etc for herself, what you have happen to her?
Wander the streets homeless, starving, in rags?
...or live in one of my nice comfortable public housing condos?

I'm talking about how it would be if I were 'king' of America, not how it was or is now.

Equality!...Social-capitalism!...not everyone walking around in green tunics.
Equality!...your grandmother entitled to anything and everything all other people in the nation would be.
Now if she, or anyone else, could not provide for themselves they would be entitled to public housing...condos etc, not tents on a reservation.
That's why massive immigration just for the sake of it would be stopped, and only very selective immigration allowed [of people desperately needed, people who could support themselves forever].

Japan, dolphins, whales etc, I'll start a special thread in the global section-Australia...entitled "Whale Wars" and start it with this post of yours on the subject.


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do know what I'm talking about...I have plenty of idea.
> America is an open book...as are Mexico, Africa, South America, Japan, Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Koreas, Middle East, etc.
> 
> What it's like living in America is very clear;
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _*Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas *
> 
> 
> Black and White
> 
> Charles says those who run organized, largely Hispanic crews almost never hire willing African-American laborers.
> 
> "Oh no, blacks they are out of the question. Blacks are out of the question. Nobody wants a black person in there," Charles insisted, a Mexican-American man.
> 
> *The practice of rejecting black labor is deeply entrenched discrimination which extends to white workers as well, *Charles says.
> 
> These men and women are effectively cut off from decent-paying construction jobs by secretive Mexican labor gangs.
> 
> "They are afraid that white people are not going to put up with their unethical acts," Charles explained. _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> your problem is you listen to way to much Latino News about what goes on here....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Nah, the problem is the corrupt and racist, secretive Mexican labor gangs that you seem to approve of.
Click to expand...


"Secretive" Mexican Labor gangs?.....ok if you say so....if they are "secret" how come they are known?........and its funny how those "secret" gangs dont exist in California.....or maybe TeleMundo says they do....but we just havent heard about them....like i said Bianco.....get your news from someplace else......


----------



## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Japan, dolphins, whales etc, I'll start a special thread in the global section-Australia...entitled "Whale Wars" and start it with this post of yours on the subject.



And you wanna know something?  I could not care less, and will not be there.

Why?  Well, I almost never go down to these "political threads"  All to often I find them filled with braindead morons (both Right and Left) who if you took 10 of them together and combined their brain power it would not be enough to blow out a candle.

I only came down this time because somebody sent me a message saying that they wanted me to see what some moron was saying.  

And sorry, from all I have seen your beliefs are simply insane.  "Socio-Capitalism"?  WTF?

Because if that were true, and you would believe in parts of both Socialism and Capitolism, *then you would have absolutely no problem with people capturing and eating non-endangered animals*!

So just pull that "Capitalism" out, you are nothing but a Socialist idiot, who wants to mandate how everybody will live, breathe, eat, sleep, and probably reproduce if people would just let you do what is so obviously right.


----------



## Mushroom

Harry Dresden said:


> "Secretive" Mexican Labor gangs?.....ok if you say so....if they are "secret" how come they are known?........and its funny how those "secret" gangs dont exist in California.....or maybe TeleMundo says they do....but we just havent heard about them....like i said Bianco.....get your news from someplace else......



Shhhh, they are operating in concert with the Secret Chinese Invasion Force that has been massing in parts of Mexico.

Activist Post: Chinese Troops Reportedly Amassing Near US-Mexico Border


----------



## Harry Dresden

Mushroom said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> "Secretive" Mexican Labor gangs?.....ok if you say so....if they are "secret" how come they are known?........and its funny how those "secret" gangs dont exist in California.....or maybe TeleMundo says they do....but we just havent heard about them....like i said Bianco.....get your news from someplace else......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Shhhh, they are operating in concert with the Secret Chinese Invasion Force that has been massing in parts of Mexico.
> 
> Activist Post: Chinese Troops Reportedly Amassing Near US-Mexico Border
Click to expand...


the guy counted 10,000 military vehicles while his truck was being unloaded..........how did Telemundo miss this?.....


----------



## Mushroom

Harry Dresden said:


> the guy counted 10,000 military vehicles while his truck was being unloaded..........how did Telemundo miss this?.....



Actually, I commented extensively on this a few years ago when the stories first started to appear.  Myself, I think it is a case of "Guerrilla/Viral Marketing" gone astray.

If you look back at the first reports, they were in early 2010.  And at that time the expected release date of the remake "Red Dawn" was expected to be in September 2012, with China as the enemy.

At this time several movies had been marketed with false web sites building hype not about the movie itself, but the premise.  _Swordfish_ is a perfect example of this, as was The Matrix, A.I., I Robot, and a slew of others (even HALO used this technique).

I think in this case the fake releases were picked up by the lunatic fringe, and they have been running with it ever since.  This story has been appearing and reappearing for over 3 years now, normally with the same vague reporting, no names, no real information or details.

But the paranoid crazies actually believe it, and this tells me who has reasonable cognitive skills and knows how to vette sources, and who is a crazy nutcase that will latch onto any fear and paranoia that strikes them.


----------



## bianco

Mushroom said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Japan, dolphins, whales etc, I'll start a special thread in the global section-Australia...entitled "Whale Wars" and start it with this post of yours on the subject.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And you wanna know something?  I could not care less, and will not be there.
> 
> Why?  Well, I almost never go down to these "political threads"  All to often I find them filled with braindead morons (both Right and Left) who if you took 10 of them together and combined their brain power it would not be enough to blow out a candle.
> 
> I only came down this time because somebody sent me a message saying that they wanted me to see what some moron was saying.
> 
> And sorry, from all I have seen your beliefs are simply insane.  "Socio-Capitalism"?  WTF?
> 
> Because if that were true, and you would believe in parts of both Socialism and Capitolism, *then you would have absolutely no problem with people capturing and eating non-endangered animals*!
> 
> So just pull that "Capitalism" out, you are nothing but a Socialist idiot, who wants to mandate how everybody will live, breathe, eat, sleep, and probably reproduce if people would just let you do what is so obviously right.
Click to expand...


Japan and whaling are not really what this thread is about, so I started a new one.
Do what you like, visit or not, free country still.

Yes, Social-capitalism;

Social capitalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

_The essence of social capitalism is that private markets are the most effective allocation mechanism, and output is maximized through sound state macroeconomic management of the economy.
 Social capitalism posits that a strong social support network for the poor enhances capital output. By decreasing poverty, capital market participation is enlarged. Social capitalism also posits that government regulation, and even sponsorship of markets, can lead to superior economic outcomes, as evidenced in government sponsorship of the internet or basic securities regulation.[2]

In early 2009, Australian Prime Minister Kevin Rudd called for a new economic approach that he termed "social capitalism" which includes "a system of open markets, unambiguously regulated by an activist state, and one in which the state intervenes to reduce the greater inequalities that competitive markets will inevitably generate." _


'Social-capitalism'...in short, capitalism with a social flavour.

. Public Housing/rental assistance for the poor
. Shelter and food for the homeless
. Healthcare system where everyone is entitled to proper healthcare in public hospitals...even a homeless person in rags.
. Money to live on for the unemployed ['food stamps and cash' if you like]
. Govt regulation.
etc



> Why? Well, I almost never go down to these "political threads"  All to often I find them filled with braindead morons (both Right and Left) who if you took 10 of them together and combined their brain power it would not be enough to blow out a candle.



#####

LOL

What, don't they agree your ideas of how things are and should be?
Could be that you're just a scaredy cat unwilling to discover what the truth actually is.


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## bianco

The usual suspects are in denial...those who seem to be cheering for the takeover;

My money is on Ricardo.

Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino

_ It's all recorded in "Mexican Cliques in Construction", the book he paid thousands of his own hard-earned dollars to publish.

He has also brought his allegations and evidence to the FBI.

"Many people are victims. Many of my friends who are honest are victims," he insisted. "We are applying a system that didn't work in Mexico for hundreds years and actually it's working here in Houston, Texas."

Copies of "Mexican Cliques in Construction" can be obtained by contacting Ricardo Charles through his email address: ricardocharles46@hotmail.com. _


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## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> The usual suspects are in denial...those who seem to be cheering for the takeover;
> 
> My money is on Ricardo.
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _ It's all recorded in "Mexican Cliques in Construction", the book he paid thousands of his own hard-earned dollars to publish.
> 
> He has also brought his allegations and evidence to the FBI.
> 
> "Many people are victims. Many of my friends who are honest are victims," he insisted. "We are applying a system that didn't work in Mexico for hundreds years and actually it's working here in Houston, Texas."
> 
> Copies of "Mexican Cliques in Construction" can be obtained by contacting Ricardo Charles through his email address: ricardocharles46@hotmail.com. _



yea the usual suspects who live here....meanwhile someone half a world away watching fucking Latino News has it all figured out....


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## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> The usual suspects are in denial...those who seem to be cheering for the takeover;
> 
> My money is on Ricardo.
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _ It's all recorded in "Mexican Cliques in Construction", the book he paid thousands of his own hard-earned dollars to publish.
> 
> He has also brought his allegations and evidence to the FBI.
> 
> "Many people are victims. Many of my friends who are honest are victims," he insisted. "We are applying a system that didn't work in Mexico for hundreds years and actually it's working here in Houston, Texas."
> 
> Copies of "Mexican Cliques in Construction" can be obtained by contacting Ricardo Charles through his email address: ricardocharles46@hotmail.com. _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea the usual suspects who live here....meanwhile someone half a world away watching fucking Latino News has it all figured out....
Click to expand...


Yep.

btw, in the global village of today I just live down the street.


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## Unkotare

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> The usual suspects are in denial...those who seem to be cheering for the takeover;
> 
> My money is on Ricardo.
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _ It's all recorded in "Mexican Cliques in Construction", the book he paid thousands of his own hard-earned dollars to publish.
> 
> He has also brought his allegations and evidence to the FBI.
> 
> "Many people are victims. Many of my friends who are honest are victims," he insisted. "We are applying a system that didn't work in Mexico for hundreds years and actually it's working here in Houston, Texas."
> 
> Copies of "Mexican Cliques in Construction" can be obtained by contacting Ricardo Charles through his email address: ricardocharles46@hotmail.com. _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea the usual suspects who live here....meanwhile someone half a world away watching fucking Latino News has it all figured out....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep.
> 
> btw, in the global village of today I just live down the street.
Click to expand...



No, you don't. You live half a world away (thank goodness) and happen to have a TV. You're an ignorant moron.


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## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bianco said:
> 
> 
> 
> The usual suspects are in denial...those who seem to be cheering for the takeover;
> 
> My money is on Ricardo.
> 
> Corruption, Racial Discrimination as Construction Gangs Steal Millions in Texas | Fox News Latino
> 
> _ It's all recorded in "Mexican Cliques in Construction", the book he paid thousands of his own hard-earned dollars to publish.
> 
> He has also brought his allegations and evidence to the FBI.
> 
> "Many people are victims. Many of my friends who are honest are victims," he insisted. "We are applying a system that didn't work in Mexico for hundreds years and actually it's working here in Houston, Texas."
> 
> Copies of "Mexican Cliques in Construction" can be obtained by contacting Ricardo Charles through his email address: ricardocharles46@hotmail.com. _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea the usual suspects who live here....meanwhile someone half a world away watching fucking Latino News has it all figured out....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yep.
> 
> btw, in the global village of today I just live down the street.
Click to expand...


you still dont know shit about the Latino mindset in the US......all you are showing us is what a small percentage of Illegals in the US think and the people who live in Mexico who actually believe the shit being fed to them by these "Latino" news sources saying that the South West US is still a part of Mexico..... the great majority of Latinos HERE in the Country dont buy it and if you actually knew one....they would tell you that.....


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## Harry Dresden

not to veer off the subject to much Bianco.....but since you live there....is it true gun crimes have increased in Oz since the gun ban in the 90's?......just thought i would ask...


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## bianco

Harry Dresden said:


> not to veer off the subject to much Bianco.....but since you live there....is it true gun crimes have increased in Oz since the gun ban in the 90's?......just thought i would ask...



Yes, 'Middle Eastern appearance' thugs mostly, with handguns and the occasional machine gun shooting each other and rivals.
"Machine guns at 50 paces" Sunday mornings at 1am [well one Sunday morning anyway].
Bikie gangs wars also...of which 'Middle Eastern appearance' gun toting thugs seem to form a large part these days.
Glock handguns their weapon of choice.

Sydney's S and SW suburbs basically being "Middle East central"...cops have a special "Middle Eastern Organised Crime Squad"...and "Asian Crime Sqaud".

Massive immigration...don't ya just love it.

They were simply ordering in Glock pistols by mail from Austria...corruption at one Post Office branch franchise.

The takeover and intimidation started in earnest in abot the year 2000, with the 'Sydney gang rapes', with guns present.

Sydney gang rapes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

_The Sydney gang rapes were a series of gang rape attacks committed by a group of up to fourteen Lebanese Australian youths led by Bilal Skaf against Australian women and teenage girls, as young as 14, in Sydney Australia in 2000. The crimes&#8212; described as ethnically motivated hate crimes by officials and commentators[1][2][3]&#8212; were covered extensively by the news media, and prompted the passing of new laws. 
The nine men convicted of the gang rapes were sentenced to a total of more than 240 years in jail. According to court transcripts Judge Michael Finnane described the rapes as events "you hear about or read about only in the context of wartime atrocities".[4]_


Then the takeover by the merchants of intimidation and 'under new management' got into full swing...resulting in 2005 with 'The Cronulla Riots';

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYiAAxZWyys]Nine Sunday Cover story 2006 cronulla riot - YouTube[/ame]

No guns, luckily.


In 2013, there was a shooting, people gunned down in the suburban streets of SW Sydney nearly every day.
...until Nick the cop and his merry band of 'girls and boys' were appointed to get out and get into the gun toting thugs.
Hasn't been a shooting in weeks.

Australia was a much better place in 1958;

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXWFcNLSZiQ]Christmas In Australia - YouTube[/ame]


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## Mushroom

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> not to veer off the subject to much Bianco.....but since you live there....is it true gun crimes have increased in Oz since the gun ban in the 90's?......just thought i would ask...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 'Middle Eastern appearance' thugs mostly, with handguns and the occasional machine gun shooting each other and rivals.
Click to expand...


Why am I not surprised?


----------



## Harry Dresden

bianco said:


> Harry Dresden said:
> 
> 
> 
> not to veer off the subject to much Bianco.....but since you live there....is it true gun crimes have increased in Oz since the gun ban in the 90's?......just thought i would ask...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 'Middle Eastern appearance' thugs mostly, with handguns and the occasional machine gun shooting each other and rivals.
> "Machine guns at 50 paces" Sunday mornings at 1am [well one Sunday morning anyway].
> Bikie gangs wars also...of which 'Middle Eastern appearance' gun toting thugs seem to form a large part these days.
> Glock handguns their weapon of choice.
> 
> Sydney's S and SW suburbs basically being "Middle East central"...cops have a special "Middle Eastern Organised Crime Squad"...and "Asian Crime Sqaud".
> 
> Massive immigration...don't ya just love it.
> 
> They were simply ordering in Glock pistols by mail from Austria...corruption at one Post Office branch franchise.
> 
> The takeover and intimidation started in earnest in abot the year 2000, with the 'Sydney gang rapes', with guns present.
> 
> Sydney gang rapes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> _The Sydney gang rapes were a series of gang rape attacks committed by a group of up to fourteen Lebanese Australian youths led by Bilal Skaf against Australian women and teenage girls, as young as 14, in Sydney Australia in 2000. The crimes described as ethnically motivated hate crimes by officials and commentators[1][2][3] were covered extensively by the news media, and prompted the passing of new laws.
> The nine men convicted of the gang rapes were sentenced to a total of more than 240 years in jail. According to court transcripts Judge Michael Finnane described the rapes as events "you hear about or read about only in the context of wartime atrocities".[4]_
> 
> 
> Then the takeover by the merchants of intimidation and 'under new management' got into full swing...resulting in 2005 with 'The Cronulla Riots';
> 
> [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYiAAxZWyys]Nine Sunday Cover story 2006 cronulla riot - YouTube[/ame]
> 
> No guns, luckily.
> 
> 
> In 2013, there was a shooting, people gunned down in the suburban streets of SW Sydney nearly every day.
> ...until Nick the cop and his merry band of 'girls and boys' were appointed to get out and get into the gun toting thugs.
> Hasn't been a shooting in weeks.
> 
> Australia was a much better place in 1958;
> 
> [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXWFcNLSZiQ]Christmas In Australia - YouTube[/ame]
Click to expand...

maybe you should go over to one of the gun threads and tell all those people who are saying that Oz is a nice peaceful Country since the gun ban down there....see these people are just reading things about Oz.....things that you are saying it aint so....


----------



## bianco

Most of the rest of the nation is not like SW Sydney...and is a nice peaceful low/non-gun crime country.
They just use axes, knives, hammers, machetes etc. 

Since the banning of auto, semi-auto rifles and pump-action shotguns in 1996 there have been no more massacres like 'The Port Arthur masscre', 'The Hoddle St massacre', 'The Strathfield massacre'.

Port Arthur massacre (Australia) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

_The Port Arthur massacre of 28-29 April 1996, was a killing spree in which 35 people were killed and 23 wounded, mainly at the historic[1] Port Arthur prison colony, a popular tourist site in south-eastern Tasmania, Australia.[2] 
Martin Bryant, a 28-year-old from New Town, a suburb of Hobart, eventually pleaded guilty to the crimes and was given 35 life sentences without possibility of parole.[3] He is now imprisoned in the Wilfred Lopes Centre near Risdon Prison Complex.[4]

The Port Arthur massacre remains one of the deadliest shootings worldwide committed by a single person[5][6] and remains the deadliest in the English-speaking region. After the shootings, *it emerged that Bryant had significant intellectual disabilities. * _


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## Unkotare

MaryL said:


> Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem. I never heard illegal immigrants here in Colorado THEN. Colorado is a Spanish word, and I knew many Hispanics. I remember a Latino kid fighting back tears at being called a "Mexican". He  said: "I am America as any of you, I ain't no mexican". Those days are long gone. Illegals boldly wave Mexican flags, taunt Americans and then cry about racism when they alienate the Americans of all races and backgrounds... in the present tense. They demand sensitivity and are insensitive, they hate and distrust English speakers, but they want "Bilingualism' but wont acclimate. Yeah, something isn't adding up here when it comes to Mexican immigrants. Legal or not, we can't ask and they sure as hell wont  tell. No wonder these reprobates  side with Gays. I see a definite parallel there.




You seem to have some very specific and personal issues.


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## Politico

We can finally get rid of Kalifornia? Cool sounds like a plan!


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## longknife

Back on topic:

*Cailfornia May Allow Noncitizens to Sit on Juries*

[Gee! Newser doesn't have editors for headline?]



> California has recently passed a number of new bills that would expand the rights of permanent noncitizens: allowing them to monitor polls during elections; making drivers licenses available to unauthorized immigrants; and allowing those who were brought illegally to the US to practice law.



Read more @ Cailfornia May Allow Noncitizens to Sit on Juries - Supporters of law say it's about 'discrimination'

This goes quite well with the thread, doesn't it? 

In a way, I'm torn. If a jury is to be make up of one's &#8220;peers&#8221; doesn't that mean illegals standing trial have a right to be judged by other illegals?


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## longknife

And then comes this:

*For Migrants, New Land of Opportunity Is Mexico*

Andrea Bruce for The New York Times



> MEXICO CITY &#8212; Mexico, whose economic woes have pushed millions of people north, is increasingly becoming an immigrant destination. The country&#8217;s documented foreign-born population nearly doubled between 2000 and 2010, and officials now say the pace is accelerating as broad changes in the global economy create new dynamics of migration.



Hmmmm. Read story @ http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/22/w...pportunity-is-mexico.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

It'll be interesting to see how and if the Mexican president's efforts to reform things in that country and mean providing more of these jobs to his own people.


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## Harry Dresden

Politico said:


> We can finally get rid of Kalifornia? Cool sounds like a plan!



hey dildoitico?....what State do you live in?....


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## Mushroom

Politico said:


> We can finally get rid of Kalifornia? Cool sounds like a plan!



Sounds like a plan to me, just give me some warning first.


----------



## MaryL

Unkotare said:


> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem. I never heard illegal immigrants here in Colorado THEN. Colorado is a Spanish word, and I knew many Hispanics. I remember a Latino kid fighting back tears at being called a "Mexican". He  said: "I am America as any of you, I ain't no mexican". Those days are long gone. Illegals boldly wave Mexican flags, taunt Americans and then cry about racism when they alienate the Americans of all races and backgrounds... in the present tense. They demand sensitivity and are insensitive, they hate and distrust English speakers, but they want "Bilingualism' but won&#8217;t acclimate. Yeah, something isn't adding up here when it comes to Mexican immigrants. Legal or not, we can't ask and they sure as hell won&#8217;t  tell. No wonder these reprobates  side with Gays. I see a definite parallel there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You seem to have some very specific and personal issues.
Click to expand...


Do tell? You hate white people and you are mining for reasons to justify your racism, we both know it. If you represent Latinos, god help them, because that attitude of yours  is exactly why  non Hispanics don't wan't anything to do with with Mexicans/Latinos/whatever ya&#8217;l want to call yourselves.  They  are selfish, ignorant  arrogant (enough adjectives for you?) JERKS. Those attributes, my friend, aren&#8217;t something most human beings  find positive. Somebody has "issues" alright.


----------



## Unkotare

MaryL said:


> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> Forty  five years ago, illegal immigrants were a Californian problem. I never heard illegal immigrants here in Colorado THEN. Colorado is a Spanish word, and I knew many Hispanics. I remember a Latino kid fighting back tears at being called a "Mexican". He  said: "I am America as any of you, I ain't no mexican". Those days are long gone. Illegals boldly wave Mexican flags, taunt Americans and then cry about racism when they alienate the Americans of all races and backgrounds... in the present tense. They demand sensitivity and are insensitive, they hate and distrust English speakers, but they want "Bilingualism' but wont acclimate. Yeah, something isn't adding up here when it comes to Mexican immigrants. Legal or not, we can't ask and they sure as hell wont  tell. No wonder these reprobates  side with Gays. I see a definite parallel there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You seem to have some very specific and personal issues.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Do tell? You hate white people ...
Click to expand...




When have you ever seen me post anything even remotely suggesting such a ridiculous thing? You're out of your little mind.


----------



## Unkotare

MaryL said:


> If you represent Latinos, god help them, because that attitude of yours  is exactly why  non Hispanics don't wan't anything to do with with Mexicans/Latinos/whatever yal want to call yourselves.





"Yourselves"? Are you laboring under the impression that I am Latino? Whatever drugs you are on have blurred the line between your imagination and reality.


----------



## Unkotare

MaryL said:


> non Hispanics don't wan't anything to do with with Mexicans/Latinos/whatever yal want to call yourselves.  They  are selfish, ignorant  arrogant (enough adjectives for you?) JERKS.





You, for some utterly absurd reason, accuse ME of being racist and then post THAT blatantly racist tirade? You are mentally and morally defective.


----------



## longknife

I think something that would help EVERYBODY in this discussion is watching this series on PBS - Latino Americans. See Home | Latino Americans | PBS

Now, I for one, have already seen one "error" or overstatement in the series but will watch it again to see if there are more.

But, from what little I saw, it appeared to be a decent look at the subject.


----------



## Mushroom

Unkotare said:


> MaryL said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unkotare said:
> 
> 
> 
> You seem to have some very specific and personal issues.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do tell? You hate white people ...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> When have you ever seen me post anything even remotely suggesting such a ridiculous thing? You're out of your little mind.
Click to expand...


This is always the danger in these threads.  Either you got one group jumping out and shouting "racist", or the real racists jumping out and shouting "racist".  Either way any debate and discussion disappears and it become a lunatic factory.

I also notice they avoid facts whenever possible, a sure sign that the lunatics are running loose in the thread.

Notice when I corrected Mary on the fact that illegal immigration was a problem over 60 years ago, and even provided verifiable references, but from Mary we hear nothing.  This is the classic "ignore it until it goes away" tactic I love so much in these forums.  Say something stupid and somebody proves you wrong, just start to throw out racism charges until it is all forgotten.

This however also reminds me of why I rarely venture down into the more "political" discussions, and prefer to stick to history and military topics.  Although such nonsense does appear in there from time to time as well.

You don't think the new Type 052C Destroyer is the best destroyer ever?  That is because you are a racist and hate the Chinese!

The Type 052C is the best Destroyer ever, because it was built by the Chinese!

Whenever I see a posting where that is the level of logic involved, I make a note that I am dealing with somebody that is seriously dain bramaged and generally humor them when I can.


----------



## longknife

Mushroom - here's a bit of historical irony for you -

illegal immigration was a problem in both Spanish AND Mexican California!

Outsiders jumped ship and fled into the hills, often marrying local girls to make their presence legal. And, more than a few trappers came over the mountains into the Central Valley seeking beaver and other furs, even sneaking to the coast to trap sea otters - the creature that caused concerns over the Russians in the first place!

As long as they convinced the _padres_ to baptize them into the Catholic church, they were instantly considered legal.

However, when Mexico took control, foreigners paid for "passports" allowing them to say for 1 year at a time. They could then marry a local girl of good standing and apply for naturalization.


----------



## Mushroom

longknife said:


> Mushroom - here's a bit of historical irony for you -
> 
> illegal immigration was a problem in both Spanish AND Mexican California!
> 
> Outsiders jumped ship and fled into the hills, often marrying local girls to make their presence legal. And, more than a few trappers came over the mountains into the Central Valley seeking beaver and other furs, even sneaking to the coast to trap sea otters - the creature that caused concerns over the Russians in the first place!
> 
> As long as they convinced the _padres_ to baptize them into the Catholic church, they were instantly considered legal.
> 
> However, when Mexico took control, foreigners paid for "passports" allowing them to say for 1 year at a time. They could then marry a local girl of good standing and apply for naturalization.



Tell me about it!

And in the Territory and State of California during the Gold Rush it was even worse.

Huge parts of the city of San Francisco are built on top of the old waterfront.  Once gold was discovered often entire crews would jump ship and head to the hills to make their fortune.  And because more land was needed the abandoned ships were just filled with rocks and dirt and trash and sunk to the bottom, expanding the city.  The outer mile or more of the East side of the city is all built upon the hulls of abandoned ships from all over the world.

San Francisco got huge "immigrant districts" within less then 10 years.  German, Italian, Chinese, each settled their own little areas which remain to this day.

And how much area was filled in with all these abandoned ships full of illegal immigrants?







One of my favorite old maps, from 1852.  If you are familiar with the city, the map is turned 90 degrees to the right, turn left and you will recognize it.

Notice the darker areas of the street grid, that is all fill, new land made within the previous 3 years.  I actually work at the corner of Washington and Montgomery, the top of that little bay in the bottom center.  They kept going out for quite a while even after this map was made, you can't even see Embarcadero yet, it was still underwater.

This should give you an idea how many ships were abandoned in this city in the late 1840's and early 1850's.






Most of the crews were "illegal aliens".


----------



## rightwinger

* California, Arizona, New Mexico Should Belong to Mexico 
*

You forgot Texas


----------

