# South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts



## Darkman00

*Why isn't this all over MSM news today? When Nelson Mandela was imprisoned there were nightly updates as to his cell conditions, etc.*

*So much for South Africa .... total Zimbabwe/Somalia/Yemen in less than 5 years? *


*---*

*South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts*

*SOUTH AFRICA's government has begun seizing land from white farmers, targeting two game farms in the northern province of Limpopo after talks with the owners to buy the properties collapsed. *

By Paul Withers

PUBLISHED: 04:41, Tue, Aug 21, 2018   | UPDATED: 13:33, Tue, Aug 21, 2018







South Africa farm seizures: The proposal was announced by Cyril Ramaphosa (Image: GETTY)







South Africa farm seizures: Gwede Mantashe sparked panic among the farming community (Image: GETTY)


*Read more*: South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts


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## DigitalDrifter

Well, look at what their leader has been saying:


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## DigitalDrifter

By the way, both Russia and Australia have been offering asylum for white South Africans.

If I were white, the last place on this earth I would want to be is on the African continent. It's a sewer, and not a place for first-worlders.


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## Toro

I think this is a good idea.

Zimbabwe has been a smashing success.


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## 2aguy

Darkman00 said:


> *Why isn't this all over MSM news today? When Nelson Mandela was imprisoned there were nightly updates as to his cell conditions, etc.*
> 
> *So much for South Africa .... total Zimbabwe/Somalia/Yemen in less than 5 years? *
> 
> 
> *---*
> 
> *South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts*
> 
> *SOUTH AFRICA's government has begun seizing land from white farmers, targeting two game farms in the northern province of Limpopo after talks with the owners to buy the properties collapsed. *
> 
> By Paul Withers
> 
> PUBLISHED: 04:41, Tue, Aug 21, 2018   | UPDATED: 13:33, Tue, Aug 21, 2018
> 
> 
> 
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> South Africa farm seizures: The proposal was announced by Cyril Ramaphosa (Image: GETTY)
> 
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> South Africa farm seizures: Gwede Mantashe sparked panic among the farming community (Image: GETTY)
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> *Read more*: South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts




If you are a white South African you need to leave the country immediately...... the mass killing is about to start.


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## TroglocratsRdumb

People need to get out of SA before it's too late.


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## basquebromance




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## there4eyeM

Isn't there a Biblical quotation about sowing the wind?


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## Nia88

It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.

Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.

I say Karma is coming to collect.


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## basquebromance

the government are doing nothing for them. they want them starving or dead.


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## basquebromance

south africa's white population has fallen by 23,000 and that number will continue to skyrocket


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## basquebromance

there will be civil war. there will be genocide.

unfortunately!


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## AvgGuyIA

Darkman00 said:


> *Why isn't this all over MSM news today? When Nelson Mandela was imprisoned there were nightly updates as to his cell conditions, etc.*
> 
> *So much for South Africa .... total Zimbabwe/Somalia/Yemen in less than 5 years? *
> 
> 
> *---*
> 
> *South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts*
> 
> *SOUTH AFRICA's government has begun seizing land from white farmers, targeting two game farms in the northern province of Limpopo after talks with the owners to buy the properties collapsed. *
> 
> By Paul Withers
> 
> PUBLISHED: 04:41, Tue, Aug 21, 2018   | UPDATED: 13:33, Tue, Aug 21, 2018
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> South Africa farm seizures: The proposal was announced by Cyril Ramaphosa (Image: GETTY)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> South Africa farm seizures: Gwede Mantashe sparked panic among the farming community (Image: GETTY)
> 
> 
> *Read more*: South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts


The communist ANC government is seizing the game preserves so they can harvest the wild game for food when the famine hit South Africa in a couple of years.


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## AvgGuyIA

2aguy said:


> Darkman00 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Why isn't this all over MSM news today? When Nelson Mandela was imprisoned there were nightly updates as to his cell conditions, etc.*
> 
> *So much for South Africa .... total Zimbabwe/Somalia/Yemen in less than 5 years? *
> 
> 
> *---*
> 
> *South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts*
> 
> *SOUTH AFRICA's government has begun seizing land from white farmers, targeting two game farms in the northern province of Limpopo after talks with the owners to buy the properties collapsed. *
> 
> By Paul Withers
> 
> PUBLISHED: 04:41, Tue, Aug 21, 2018   | UPDATED: 13:33, Tue, Aug 21, 2018
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> South Africa farm seizures: The proposal was announced by Cyril Ramaphosa (Image: GETTY)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> South Africa farm seizures: Gwede Mantashe sparked panic among the farming community (Image: GETTY)
> 
> 
> *Read more*: South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are a white South African you need to leave the country immediately...... the mass killing is about to start.
Click to expand...

. The US allows 1,000,000 immigrants in every year from shithole countries.  Let's open this to just South African whites.  I'm positive they will assimilate nicely into our American culture.


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## basquebromance

"They are turning South Africa into the next Rwanda"


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## EverCurious

What's really fucked up is that's probably where the US is headed next time we let D's get control.


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## sartre play

Not enough info, use to be that black Africans could not own any land. so far the new rules have taken no land from white people, what may be coming in the future is not yet known. wait & watch for how it effects the country.


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## there4eyeM

South Africa should at least serve as a cautionary tale.


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## basquebromance

Man, reporters get really angry if someone gets in the way of white South Africans being tortured and killed.


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## miketx

Give them 5 years and see all the industry these black leaders will create in S. Africa. Yeah right. In two years they will be eating bugs again.


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## EverCurious

Their leader announced they won't be giving out the legally required payment for the lands they re-appropriate - their stocks have started hard bleeding.


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## frigidweirdo

TroglocratsRdumb said:


> People need to get out of SA before it's too late.



I'm surprised they didn't get out before.

Firstly that they haven't been killed before, due to what happened during the Apartheid era, secondly because South Africa really is a stressful place to be.


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## Issa

DigitalDrifter said:


> By the way, both Russia and Australia have been offering asylum for white South Africans.
> 
> If I were white, the last place on this earth I would want to be is on the African continent. It's a sewer, and not a place for first-worlders.


Bitch it's the mother land , all humanity comes from there.


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## Issa

AvgGuyIA said:


> 2aguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Darkman00 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *Why isn't this all over MSM news today? When Nelson Mandela was imprisoned there were nightly updates as to his cell conditions, etc.*
> 
> *So much for South Africa .... total Zimbabwe/Somalia/Yemen in less than 5 years? *
> 
> 
> *---*
> 
> *South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts*
> 
> *SOUTH AFRICA's government has begun seizing land from white farmers, targeting two game farms in the northern province of Limpopo after talks with the owners to buy the properties collapsed. *
> 
> By Paul Withers
> 
> PUBLISHED: 04:41, Tue, Aug 21, 2018   | UPDATED: 13:33, Tue, Aug 21, 2018
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> South Africa farm seizures: The proposal was announced by Cyril Ramaphosa (Image: GETTY)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> South Africa farm seizures: Gwede Mantashe sparked panic among the farming community (Image: GETTY)
> 
> 
> *Read more*: South Africa farm seizures BEGIN: Chaos as first expropriation of white-owned farms starts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are a white South African you need to leave the country immediately...... the mass killing is about to start.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . The US allows 1,000,000 immigrants in every year from shithole countries.  Let's open this to just South African whites.  I'm positive they will assimilate nicely into our American culture.
Click to expand...

You mean to the racist culture ?


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## Yarddog

Nia88 said:


> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.




yes and look at all the places where your sentiment has made a wreck out of the country in the name of social justice.  What prevails in the world is wisdom.... but go ahead do whatever feels good and you have another, Zimbabwe, Cambodia, Venezuela ,etc. its all social justice under a different name ... without wisdom or restraint taking a thriving place and turning it into a basket case.


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## Tilly

Nia88 said:


> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.


Wow.
More leftard bloodlust.
Since when did two wrongs make a right?
I guess they’ll earn themselves a hefty dose of Karma too.
Really intelligent way to run a country - Karma cycles!


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## Political Junky

Trump Cites False Claims of Widespread Attacks on White Farmers in South Africa

CAPE TOWN, South Africa — President Trump waded into South Africa’s proposal to seize land from white farmers, saying in a post on Twitter late Wednesday that he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to “closely study” the “the large scale killing of farmers” — a claim disputed by official figures and the country’s biggest farmer’s group.


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## NewsVine_Mariyam

Issa said:


> You mean to the racist culture ?


That's what came to my mind as well, let in people who already have a white supremacist mindset.


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## C_Clayton_Jones

As usual, Trump and most on the right are being dishonest about land 'seizure' claims:

‘Brian Klaas, a political scientist at University College London, described Trump's tweet as an alarming example of [Trump] transforming "Fox News commentary into American foreign policy."

Klaas told DW it could also be seen as an attempt "to pander to white nationalists and the segment of his political base that is bigoted, xenophobic or both," in the lead-up to the midterm elections in November.

South African analyst Danny Bradlow said Trump's tweet is in part a diversionary tactic.

"He wants to divert his base of supporters' attention and show them (at least the racist portion) that he understands their concerns," he told DW. "It also is potentially harmful for South Africa — this is particularly unfortunate given that the information on which it is based is inaccurate."
[…]
South African political analyst Ryan Cummings said on Twitter that Trump's tweet appeared aimed at "deflecting attention to a black bogeyman while trying to outrun the long arm of the law."’

https://www.dw.com/en/south-africa-rejects-donald-trumps-farm-seizure-claims/a-45194147


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## Issa

Trump is an idiot.


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## basquebromance

no comment


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## Baron

Where is outcry of western presstitutes? Just imagine what would happen if whities dare to rob blacks.
SA shows the sad future of whites in so called western 'democracies'.


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## Baron

TroglocratsRdumb said:


> People need to get out of SA before it's too late.



Where?

All western countries are run by anti-white liberal traitors


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## Baron

Nia88 said:


> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.



SA was a country of whites always.


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## Nia88

Baron said:


> Nia88 said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SA was a country of whites always.
Click to expand...

 
Next you're going to tell me America was always a white nation.

SA has always been white, just like Norway has always been black.


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## EverCurious

Tim Pool talked about this issue yesterday.  Surprise, surprise, the MSM has TDS - so disgusting.  I can't wish the worst for them hard enough...


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## Death Angel

Nia88 said:


> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.


You're not persecuted. Never were. You've been taken care of as children who can't survive without your white benefactors.


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## Death Angel

Nia88 said:


> Next you're going to tell me America was always a white nation.
> 
> SA has always been white


We STILL are a white nation. Everything about us has origins with white Europe.


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## SavannahMann

The purpose of ending racism is not revenge, nor vengeance, nor getting even, nor any other phrase that means the same thing. It is about changing the way we feel today, and forgiving what happened decades, or even centuries ago. In other words, everyone gets over it. 

I can’t change what happened decades ago. There is no way to “make it right” or “pay them back”. The people who did it are already dead. The first farm seized in South Africa has been in the family for five generations. Five generations. You can’t punish someone who is dead and disintegrated already. You just can’t. But we realize that even as we want to, so we punish the decendants. We punish those who we say have unfairly benefited. Nonsense. Absolute Rubbish. 

Imagine someone said that we were going to seize Manhattan, and return it to the Indians, or Native Americans, or what ever we call them today. No money will be paid to the people who own, or live, in the houses. No money will be paid to the businesses for their losses. Now this is illegal in America. This has been confirmed by the Kelo decision. The Government can seize your property for any reason they want, even if it is to enrich their campaign contributors, but they have to pay you for it. 

Let’s say my Great Great Great Great Grandfather did something terrible. I didn’t do it. It wasn’t my fault. It happened a very long time before I was a twinkle in Daddy’s eye, and a coy smile on Mama’s lips. Punishing me doesn’t do a damn thing to Great Great Great Whatever Grandfather. Worse, it doesn’t end the harm because the person that Great Great you get the point Grandfather harmed is also dead. 

Ending Racism is not about revenge. It shouldn’t be, because we can’t do it. We are prohibited by physics from going back in time and punishing those who have done wrong and are already dead. 

Ending Racism is about changing our attitudes today. It’s about seeing people as people, not colors, and not sub groups. This is a terrible truth about society. We define ourselves by what we are not. Baptists are Christians, but not Catholics. Catholics are not real Christians. Christians are nice, but only Catholics belong to the proper church that can draw it’s roots to the disciples of Christ. 

We should see each other as equal, and we don’t. The answer to that is not vengeance because here’s the thing, that doesn’t end racism, it doesn’t end injustice, it throws fuel on the fire. Because now those families will tell stories for generations about how the family farm was stolen by the South African Government. And generations of children will grow up hating because they believe they have a reason to hate, and here’s the key, they’re just as right to hate as those who approve of the Vengance today. 

We need to learn to live together, not apart. We need to learn to move forward with our eyes on the future, not stagnant with our feet and eyes firmly on the wrongs of the past. We should learn them, and make sure we never repeat those mistakes again. But we can never rectify or correct those mistakes. We can never bring justice. All we can do is exacerbate the situation and make it much, much worse. 

Yes, I am opposed to the taking of anything without compensation. I am and always have been opposed to Civil Asset Forffeiture. I am, and always will be opposed to Eminant Domain seizures for anything but true public work needs. 

I can’t fix the past. No one can. All we can do is poison the future. That is one thing we are absolutely awesome at.


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## basquebromance

Media - there’s no persecution of white farmers happening in SA. 

 South Africa - “We are cutting the throat of Whiteness”


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## Darkman00

Is Barack Hussein Mandela turning in his grave? 

I doubt it ...


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## deanrd

Is the South African government seizing farmers' land?

Most of the country's farms and agricultural holdings are owned by white farmers - 72% according to government statistics. White people make up 9% of the population.
---------------------------

Huh?  Whites are 9% of the population but own 72% of farms and agriculture?

How can that be?


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## Issa

Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.


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## JimBowie1958

Nia88 said:


> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.




Karma is not supposed to be an excuse for racism, theft and oppression, troll.


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## JimBowie1958

This is just one more piece of evidence that you cannot trust Marxists.

The time to leave was when Mandela was alive and the farms still had relatively high values.

Sell then migrat to some place where people still ahve strong property rights and a just government.

Obviously this would exclude the USA where the Democrats can do anything they damned well want and get away with it and Republicans act like sheep.


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## SavannahMann

deanrd said:


> Is the South African government seizing farmers' land?
> 
> Most of the country's farms and agricultural holdings are owned by white farmers - 72% according to government statistics. White people make up 9% of the population.
> ---------------------------
> 
> Huh?  Whites are 9% of the population but own 72% of farms and agriculture?
> 
> How can that be?



So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it. 

But is there a limit?


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## Death Angel

Hey Whitey, COME BACK! We now realize we like to eat!


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## AvgGuyIA

Issa said:


> Trump is an idiot.


Michelle Obama is a tranny.


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## Baron

Nia88 said:


> Baron said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nia88 said:
> 
> 
> 
> It's not nice being persecuted for your skin color, is it? It angers you.
> 
> Now imagine your people living under apartheid for  decades from foreigners in your own land.
> 
> I say Karma is coming to collect.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SA was a country of whites always.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Next you're going to tell me America was always a white nation.
> 
> SA has always been white, just like Norway has always been black.
Click to expand...


Yep, America is indeed a country created by whites, for whites, for Christians, for folks of european origin.


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## ThirdTerm

It's been advertised as South Africa's land seizure is being done without compensation but white farmers are offered few million dollars in compensation. For example, Steenkamp and Cloete asked for 200 million rand ($20.8m) for their reserve and they were offered 20m rand ($2.08m) by the South African government. I think they should take the money and start a new life in Australia or New Zealand. The farm received a valuation of 50m rand in 2011 and they got 40% of its market value.



> Johan Steenkamp and Arnold Cloete, co-owners of the Akkerland Boerdery hunting farm in Limpopo province, said they were ordered to hand over their land after talks to buy it at a 10th of the price broke down, the Daily Mail reported.
> 
> Steenkamp and Cloete asked for 200 million rand ($20.8m) for their reserve but were only offered 20m rand ($2.08m).


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## EvilCat Breath

Issa said:


> Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.


Yep.  That's what happened in Zimbabwe.


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## Issa

Tipsycatlover said:


> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.
> 
> 
> 
> Yep.  That's what happened in Zimbabwe.
Click to expand...

I dont agree with the way it was done in Zimbabwe....but the natives should get their land back, most Africa for its land back feom the french, Belgium,  Portugal, Spain etc.....


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## EvilCat Breath

Issa said:


> Tipsycatlover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.
> 
> 
> 
> Yep.  That's what happened in Zimbabwe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I dont agree with the way it was done in Zimbabwe....but the natives should get their land back, most Africa for its land back feom the french, Belgium,  Portugal, Spain etc.....
Click to expand...

The Africans can get their land back, then starve.   When they get tired of starving, they can offer free land to white farmers.


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## Issa

Tipsycatlover said:


> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tipsycatlover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.
> 
> 
> 
> Yep.  That's what happened in Zimbabwe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I dont agree with the way it was done in Zimbabwe....but the natives should get their land back, most Africa for its land back feom the french, Belgium,  Portugal, Spain etc.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Africans can get their land back, then starve.   When they get tired of starving, they can offer free land to white farmers.
Click to expand...

Study history,  Africans they faired better than Europeans for long period of times in history....Europeans came in as invaders, killed millions, enslaved millions and stole trillions. Things are going back to their original form that's all.


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## irosie91

Issa said:


> Tipsycatlover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tipsycatlover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.
> 
> 
> 
> Yep.  That's what happened in Zimbabwe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I dont agree with the way it was done in Zimbabwe....but the natives should get their land back, most Africa for its land back feom the french, Belgium,  Portugal, Spain etc.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Africans can get their land back, then starve.   When they get tired of starving, they can offer free land to white farmers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Study history,  Africans they faired better than Europeans for long period of times in history....Europeans came in as invaders, killed millions, enslaved millions and stole trillions. Things are going back to their original form that's all.
Click to expand...


you've been reading comic books again


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## EvilCat Breath

irosie91 said:


> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tipsycatlover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tipsycatlover said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Issa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dont support the killing of any race or group...but black south Africans have the right to recover the land that was taken under the apartheid or under euro occupation. Same happened in most of Africa before....once the colonizers were kicked out the land went ba k to the original owners.
> 
> 
> 
> Yep.  That's what happened in Zimbabwe.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I dont agree with the way it was done in Zimbabwe....but the natives should get their land back, most Africa for its land back feom the french, Belgium,  Portugal, Spain etc.....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The Africans can get their land back, then starve.   When they get tired of starving, they can offer free land to white farmers.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Study history,  Africans they faired better than Europeans for long period of times in history....Europeans came in as invaders, killed millions, enslaved millions and stole trillions. Things are going back to their original form that's all.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> you've been reading comic books again
Click to expand...

Wakanda forever.


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## IM2

Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa

The president, who gets his intelligence briefings from Fox News, repeats a white nationalist myth about murders of white South African farmers.

By The Editorial Board

Trust President Trump, following his familiar tactic of deflecting attention from yet another scandal by issuing some outrageous tweet, to come down hard on the wrong side of an issue he knows nothing about, based on no more than a slanted Fox News program. In a late-Wednesday tweet, Mr. Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to look into land seizures and the “large-scale killing of farmers” in South Africa. It was the first time he has mentioned Africa by name in a tweet as president.

His source was a grossly one-sided report by the Fox host Tucker Carlson asserting that the South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, was seizing land from his citizens because they are the wrong “skin color.” There have been no large-scale killings of white farmers, and Mr. Ramaphosa’s proposal to change the Constitution to allow expropriation of land without compensation has not yet passed. That said, the issue does deserve a close look.

There can be no question that South Africa’s black people were long denied fair access to land. The Natives Land Act of 1913 essentially reserved most of the land to the white minority, and the restrictions became more onerous in the apartheid era. When that system was finally dismantled almost 25 years ago, a new Constitution did provide for land reform, but the process has moved slowly. Statistics vary, but what is clear is that whites, who are less than 10 percent of the population, continue to own more than two-thirds of the land, while black South Africans, the overwhelming majority, own a much smaller share.

Opinion | Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa


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## Tilly

IM2 said:


> Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> The president, who gets his intelligence briefings from Fox News, repeats a white nationalist myth about murders of white South African farmers.
> 
> By The Editorial Board
> 
> Trust President Trump, following his familiar tactic of deflecting attention from yet another scandal by issuing some outrageous tweet, to come down hard on the wrong side of an issue he knows nothing about, based on no more than a slanted Fox News program. In a late-Wednesday tweet, Mr. Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to look into land seizures and the “large-scale killing of farmers” in South Africa. It was the first time he has mentioned Africa by name in a tweet as president.
> 
> His source was a grossly one-sided report by the Fox host Tucker Carlson asserting that the South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, was seizing land from his citizens because they are the wrong “skin color.” There have been no large-scale killings of white farmers, and Mr. Ramaphosa’s proposal to change the Constitution to allow expropriation of land without compensation has not yet passed. That said, the issue does deserve a close look.
> 
> There can be no question that South Africa’s black people were long denied fair access to land. The Natives Land Act of 1913 essentially reserved most of the land to the white minority, and the restrictions became more onerous in the apartheid era. When that system was finally dismantled almost 25 years ago, a new Constitution did provide for land reform, but the process has moved slowly. Statistics vary, but what is clear is that whites, who are less than 10 percent of the population, continue to own more than two-thirds of the land, while black South Africans, the overwhelming majority, own a much smaller share.
> 
> Opinion | Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa


Would’ve been nice had you elucidated the ‘vile ploy’.
Oh well.


----------



## IM2

Tilly said:


> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> The president, who gets his intelligence briefings from Fox News, repeats a white nationalist myth about murders of white South African farmers.
> 
> By The Editorial Board
> 
> Trust President Trump, following his familiar tactic of deflecting attention from yet another scandal by issuing some outrageous tweet, to come down hard on the wrong side of an issue he knows nothing about, based on no more than a slanted Fox News program. In a late-Wednesday tweet, Mr. Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to look into land seizures and the “large-scale killing of farmers” in South Africa. It was the first time he has mentioned Africa by name in a tweet as president.
> 
> His source was a grossly one-sided report by the Fox host Tucker Carlson asserting that the South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, was seizing land from his citizens because they are the wrong “skin color.” There have been no large-scale killings of white farmers, and Mr. Ramaphosa’s proposal to change the Constitution to allow expropriation of land without compensation has not yet passed. That said, the issue does deserve a close look.
> 
> There can be no question that South Africa’s black people were long denied fair access to land. The Natives Land Act of 1913 essentially reserved most of the land to the white minority, and the restrictions became more onerous in the apartheid era. When that system was finally dismantled almost 25 years ago, a new Constitution did provide for land reform, but the process has moved slowly. Statistics vary, but what is clear is that whites, who are less than 10 percent of the population, continue to own more than two-thirds of the land, while black South Africans, the overwhelming majority, own a much smaller share.
> 
> Opinion | Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> 
> 
> Would’ve been nice had you elucidated the ‘vile ploy’.
> Oh well.
Click to expand...


I did.


----------



## MindWars

Danie Barnard on Twitter


----------



## Tilly

IM2 said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> The president, who gets his intelligence briefings from Fox News, repeats a white nationalist myth about murders of white South African farmers.
> 
> By The Editorial Board
> 
> Trust President Trump, following his familiar tactic of deflecting attention from yet another scandal by issuing some outrageous tweet, to come down hard on the wrong side of an issue he knows nothing about, based on no more than a slanted Fox News program. In a late-Wednesday tweet, Mr. Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to look into land seizures and the “large-scale killing of farmers” in South Africa. It was the first time he has mentioned Africa by name in a tweet as president.
> 
> His source was a grossly one-sided report by the Fox host Tucker Carlson asserting that the South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, was seizing land from his citizens because they are the wrong “skin color.” There have been no large-scale killings of white farmers, and Mr. Ramaphosa’s proposal to change the Constitution to allow expropriation of land without compensation has not yet passed. That said, the issue does deserve a close look.
> 
> There can be no question that South Africa’s black people were long denied fair access to land. The Natives Land Act of 1913 essentially reserved most of the land to the white minority, and the restrictions became more onerous in the apartheid era. When that system was finally dismantled almost 25 years ago, a new Constitution did provide for land reform, but the process has moved slowly. Statistics vary, but what is clear is that whites, who are less than 10 percent of the population, continue to own more than two-thirds of the land, while black South Africans, the overwhelming majority, own a much smaller share.
> 
> Opinion | Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> 
> 
> Would’ve been nice had you elucidated the ‘vile ploy’.
> Oh well.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did.
Click to expand...

Nope.


----------



## IM2

MindWars said:


> Danie Barnard on Twitter
> 
> View attachment 213345



Malema is not the president of South Africa. And really whites here and in South Africa need to just stop given what whites have done there.


----------



## IM2

Tilly said:


> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> The president, who gets his intelligence briefings from Fox News, repeats a white nationalist myth about murders of white South African farmers.
> 
> By The Editorial Board
> 
> Trust President Trump, following his familiar tactic of deflecting attention from yet another scandal by issuing some outrageous tweet, to come down hard on the wrong side of an issue he knows nothing about, based on no more than a slanted Fox News program. In a late-Wednesday tweet, Mr. Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to look into land seizures and the “large-scale killing of farmers” in South Africa. It was the first time he has mentioned Africa by name in a tweet as president.
> 
> His source was a grossly one-sided report by the Fox host Tucker Carlson asserting that the South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, was seizing land from his citizens because they are the wrong “skin color.” There have been no large-scale killings of white farmers, and Mr. Ramaphosa’s proposal to change the Constitution to allow expropriation of land without compensation has not yet passed. That said, the issue does deserve a close look.
> 
> There can be no question that South Africa’s black people were long denied fair access to land. The Natives Land Act of 1913 essentially reserved most of the land to the white minority, and the restrictions became more onerous in the apartheid era. When that system was finally dismantled almost 25 years ago, a new Constitution did provide for land reform, but the process has moved slowly. Statistics vary, but what is clear is that whites, who are less than 10 percent of the population, continue to own more than two-thirds of the land, while black South Africans, the overwhelming majority, own a much smaller share.
> 
> Opinion | Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> 
> 
> Would’ve been nice had you elucidated the ‘vile ploy’.
> Oh well.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nope.
Click to expand...


It's your problem if you can't read.


----------



## IM2

According to one of South Africa's largest farmers' organizations, Agri SA, the number of killings per year has declined to less than a third the number recorded two decades ago. And after diving into decades of data, the BBC concluded its extensive fact check last year by warning against drawing conclusions at all.

"In short — we have no clear idea about the murder rate on South African farms," the broadcaster summed up. "And because of that, the claim being made by protesters about farmers being more likely to be murdered is not supported by reliable data."

Nevertheless, Anton Harber, who teaches journalism in Johannesburg, tells NPR's Michele Kelemen that a group named AfriForum has strongly promoted the claim that white farmers are particularly threatened by this violence. They've gained supporters among politicians in places as far-flung as Australia, they've "sent a delegation" to speak with Tucker Carlson, and on Thursday, they "welcomed" Trump's tweet.

"They are quite vocal, and they present themselves as a group that protects minority rights," Harber said, "but they are largely seen as a group that protects white Afrikaans' rights."

The notion of widespread violence against whites in South Africa has gained particular currency among white supremacists around the world, according to the Anti-Defamation League.

*"It is extremely disturbing that the President of the United States echoed a longstanding and false white supremacist claim that South Africa's white farmers are targets of large-scale, racially motivated killings by South Africa's black majority," the anti-hate advocacy organization said, noting that prominent white supremacists such as Richard Spencer have espoused the claim.

"We would hope that the President would try to understand the facts and realities of the situation in South Africa, rather than repeat disturbing, racially divisive talking points used most frequently by white supremacists."*

The Southern Poverty Law Center, a group that tracks hate crimes, also identified the claim as "a lodestar for white supremacist groups at home and abroad." And the organization named another notable figure to cite the concept of "white genocide": Dylann Roof, the self-avowed white supremacist who murdered nine people in a historically black church in 2015.

"Trump's tweet last night about South African farmers — a complicated situation that racist propagandists reduce to a 'canary in the coal mine' scenario for white people — is one of the most startling examples of this president indulging in racist thinking."

Here's The Story Behind That Trump Tweet On South Africa — And Why It Sparked Outrage


----------



## IM2

ALL RISE! CLASS IS IN SESSION.

*There Is No “White Genocide” in South Africa*

Canadian alt-right political activist, Lauren Southern, has released a documentary called ‘_Farmlands_‘ which promises to be an expose on the cruelty faced by white South Africans. Through video snippets on her twitter account, Lauren attempts to paint a picture in which BEE (Black Economic Empowerment) laws as well as brutal farm murders have left the country’s white minority destitute and fearing for their lives.

More.

However, this documentary has thus far proven to be rife with misinformation. The reality is that the majority of white South Africans do not face this type of poverty. In fact, recent studies from BusinessTech have revealed shocking disparities between the wages of black and white South Africans – with white male professionals earning almost double that of black male professionals. In 2017, Quartz Africa illustrated an employment landscape which starkly contradicts Lauren Southern’s – one in which black unemployment sits at 31.4% as compared to the 6.6% among white people. These statistics are particularly troubling when noting that white people make up a mere 8.9% of the total South African population; using discretion alone, one can easily see that white South Africans hold a disproportionately large amount of wealth.

More.

South Africa’s Wage Disparity Across Racial Lines

This can be traced to various operations which took place under the Apartheid government, such as the Migrant Labour System and Group Areas Act (1950). To simplify, the Apartheid government displaced millions of black South Africans from land which was rightfully theirs and implemented policies to ensure that they would remain destitute. Additionally, the Bantu Education Act (1953) guaranteed that black South Africans would receive inadequate education in order to perpetuate a cycle in which they remained subservient laborers. Despite the end of Apartheid roughly 24 years ago, black South Africans remain burdened by legacies of poor education, racial discrimination and the loss of their land – which was never returned.

More.

This, of course, is why BBBEE (Broad-Based Black Economic Empowerment) was introduced – an attempt to rectify the unemployment inequalities across South Africa. Furthermore, current President Cyril Ramaphosa has announced his support of “expropriation without compensation” – a principle which will see stolen land being responsibly redistributed among black agricultural workers. A new education plan has also been set in motion which will offer financial assistance to students who cannot afford to attend tertiary institutions.

Yet, not everybody seems joyful about the prospect of supporting equality. ‘_Farmlands_‘ strategically exploits the tragic instances of recent farm murders in order to create a “white genocide” agenda in South Africa. It is true that, between 2016 and 2017, 74 farm murders have occurred – with 61% of victims being white. However, the National Operational Coordinating Committee has previously been unable to prove that these crimes are purely racially motivated.

Furthermore, Lauren fails to mention that many of these “whites-only refugee camps” are in fact racist “white-only enclaves”

There Is No "White Genocide" in South Africa

*No, Katie Hopkins, there is no white genocide in South Africa*
Every murder in the country is a tragedy. But most don’t happen on white farms, or even in white areas. 

No, Katie Hopkins, there is no white genocide in South Africa

*There’s no white genocide in South Africa. I should know: I’m a white South African.*

On average, white South Africans earn five times more than black South Africans. We’re less likely to live in poverty or be unemployed. We’re more likely to have access to quality healthcare services. White people hold the majority of shares in stocks. Despite the fact that we make up 9% of South Africa’s population, we own 23.6% of rural land and 11.4% of the urban land, with 67% of the total land being owned by the state, companies, churches, communities and traditional authorities.

That’s not to mention the intangible evidence of white privilege in this country: the microaggressions that suggest white people are superior to black people. I’m not saying that some white South Africans don’t have it hard. Some do – but that’s not because they’re systemically and institutionally oppressed because of their race.

But despite the overwhelming evidence that white South Africans are privileged, many claim that a white genocide is underway in South Africa.

I’m telling you that this is absolutely not true. *There is no white genocide in South Africa.
*
https://thetempest.co/2018/04/29/news/white-genocide-south-africa/

*Claims about ‘white genocide’ in South Africa unsupported*

Claims of a “white genocide” are frequently attributed to Genocide Watch, an organisation created to predict, prevent, stop, and punish genocide and other forms of mass murder. But the organisation has publically stated that “white genocide is not underway in South Africa”.

It has, however, ranked South Africa on stage six – the stage of “polarisation” – on its 10 Stages of Genocide. Yet the organisation was not prepared to provide the sources or methodology it used to determine the country’s ranking. Neither would it pinpoint the events in South Africa that met the detailed description of that stage, which includes “extremist terrorism [targeting] moderates”.

Without this information, it is impossible to interrogate their ranking. Experts have also suggested that the organisation’s genocide framework could do more harm than good in combating violence in the country.

No other organisation has warned of a genocide or impending genocide in South Africa. This includes both the United Nation’s Office on Genocide Prevention and the Responsibility to Protect and the Atrocity Forecasting Project

Claims about ‘white genocide’ in South Africa unsupported | Africa Check


----------



## deanrd

SavannahMann said:


> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is the South African government seizing farmers' land?
> 
> Most of the country's farms and agricultural holdings are owned by white farmers - 72% according to government statistics. White people make up 9% of the population.
> ---------------------------
> 
> Huh?  Whites are 9% of the population but own 72% of farms and agriculture?
> 
> How can that be?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.
> 
> But is there a limit?
Click to expand...

But the children of Africans should suffer?  Really?

Cuz they're black right?  So it's OK?  Right?

Go one, you can tell us.


----------



## IM2

*So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*

*But is there a limit?*

1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.


----------



## Tilly

IM2 said:


> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> The president, who gets his intelligence briefings from Fox News, repeats a white nationalist myth about murders of white South African farmers.
> 
> By The Editorial Board
> 
> Trust President Trump, following his familiar tactic of deflecting attention from yet another scandal by issuing some outrageous tweet, to come down hard on the wrong side of an issue he knows nothing about, based on no more than a slanted Fox News program. In a late-Wednesday tweet, Mr. Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to look into land seizures and the “large-scale killing of farmers” in South Africa. It was the first time he has mentioned Africa by name in a tweet as president.
> 
> His source was a grossly one-sided report by the Fox host Tucker Carlson asserting that the South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, was seizing land from his citizens because they are the wrong “skin color.” There have been no large-scale killings of white farmers, and Mr. Ramaphosa’s proposal to change the Constitution to allow expropriation of land without compensation has not yet passed. That said, the issue does deserve a close look.
> 
> There can be no question that South Africa’s black people were long denied fair access to land. The Natives Land Act of 1913 essentially reserved most of the land to the white minority, and the restrictions became more onerous in the apartheid era. When that system was finally dismantled almost 25 years ago, a new Constitution did provide for land reform, but the process has moved slowly. Statistics vary, but what is clear is that whites, who are less than 10 percent of the population, continue to own more than two-thirds of the land, while black South Africans, the overwhelming majority, own a much smaller share.
> 
> Opinion | Trump’s Vile Ploy on South Africa
> 
> 
> 
> Would’ve been nice had you elucidated the ‘vile ploy’.
> Oh well.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I did.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nope.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> It's your problem if you can't read.
Click to expand...

Nope. It’s entirely YOUR problem if you promise us a ‘vile policy’ then produce a nonsense preamble and no policy - vile or otherwise.


----------



## SavannahMann

deanrd said:


> SavannahMann said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is the South African government seizing farmers' land?
> 
> Most of the country's farms and agricultural holdings are owned by white farmers - 72% according to government statistics. White people make up 9% of the population.
> ---------------------------
> 
> Huh?  Whites are 9% of the population but own 72% of farms and agriculture?
> 
> How can that be?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.
> 
> But is there a limit?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But the children of Africans should suffer?  Really?
> 
> Cuz they're black right?  So it's OK?  Right?
> 
> Go one, you can tell us.
Click to expand...


Wait, you're going to complain that I must be racist if I do not support this? Pfui. Might makes right is the same excuse that Whites used to take land from the Indians, because the majority needed what the minority had. We had the numbers, and the power, and we were going to do it and nothing you could do would stop us. Taking things without paying for them is called theft. I have railed against that many times on this board. But having zero arguments not based upon race, you attack me. 

If you read more than you ranted, you would have noticed that I object to mistreatment of blacks by police constantly. But of course, who could expect you to notice such things while you are here ranting insanely about how awful anyone who doesn't detest Trump is. 

Might makes right is the worst of all the reasons to do anything. Theft of anything by the Government is always wrong. It's why I have posted and objected to Civil Asset Forfeiture for pretty much all my life. But of course, if I object to the same treatment when Blacks are in power I'm racist. 

I've said it before. You are an ignorant ass. You always have terrible responses when anyone challenges you. You asked what would happen if Trump was indicted, and I said you would probably suffer terminal orgasm, you would literally climax to death. You proved what a mental midget you are by deciding that I wanted you dead. I laughed at you then, and I am still laughing at you now. 

I detest racism, no matter who the racist is. I detest stupidity, not just in you. I eschew injustice, no matter who is the victim. 

So again we see what you are made of. Terrible and weak replies, based in the shallowest of emotions, with nothing moral, ethical, or historical to base it upon except revenge on someone you don't like. I am thankful you are powerless. Because without power of any sort, you are already corrupt, one can only shudder at the thought you might have power over more than a TV remote one day.


----------



## Anathema

I believe the only necesssry words for the white farmers should be:  SCORCHED EARTH.


----------



## Two Thumbs

sell the land then burn everything down, including the crops, then leave and come to America.


----------



## SavannahMann

Anathema said:


> I believe the only necesssry words for the white farmers should be:  SCORCHED EARTH.



I can’t remember ever agreeing with you before. Not one issue, nor one comment. Yet in this case I do. Not just in the case of white farmers in South Africa. But anyone who is going to see their property stolen by the Government, any Government.


----------



## SavannahMann

Two Thumbs said:


> sell the land then burn everything down, including the crops, then leave and come to America.



Salt the earth. Nothing will grow. Toss an animal carcass down the well to taint the water.


----------



## Anathema

SavannahMann said:


> ]I can’t remember ever agreeing with you before. Not one issue, nor one comment. Yet in this case I do. Not just in the case of white farmers in South Africa. But anyone who is going to see their property stolen by the Government, any Government.



You can’t be wrong in everything. ;-)

Burn the fields, salt the ground, and blow up the buildings. Leave them nothing they can use.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

Anathema said:


> I believe the only necesssry words for the white farmers should be:  SCORCHED EARTH.



    Salt the shit out of the fields and poison the wells.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

SavannahMann said:


> Two Thumbs said:
> 
> 
> 
> sell the land then burn everything down, including the crops, then leave and come to America.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Salt the earth. Nothing will grow. Toss an animal carcass down the well to taint the water.
Click to expand...


  Beat me to it.


----------



## deanrd

IM2 said:


> *So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*
> 
> *But is there a limit?*
> 
> 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.


9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.  

So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?

Wow, that makes sense.

Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.

Castro should have been able to keep what he took.

If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

deanrd said:


> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*
> 
> *But is there a limit?*
> 
> 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.
> 
> 
> 
> 9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.
> 
> So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?
> 
> Wow, that makes sense.
> 
> Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> Castro should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.
Click to expand...


   Farmland in the city?


----------



## deanrd

HereWeGoAgain said:


> SavannahMann said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Two Thumbs said:
> 
> 
> 
> sell the land then burn everything down, including the crops, then leave and come to America.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Salt the earth. Nothing will grow. Toss an animal carcass down the well to taint the water.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Beat me to it.
Click to expand...

Wow, sounds so very American Christian.

The Trump's providing food for people in foreign countries.


----------



## deanrd

HereWeGoAgain said:


> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*
> 
> *But is there a limit?*
> 
> 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.
> 
> 
> 
> 9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.
> 
> So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?
> 
> Wow, that makes sense.
> 
> Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> Castro should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Farmland in the city?
Click to expand...

Real estate dum dum.

Did that really need to be said?

Yea, I guess so.


----------



## HereWeGoAgain

deanrd said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SavannahMann said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Two Thumbs said:
> 
> 
> 
> sell the land then burn everything down, including the crops, then leave and come to America.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Salt the earth. Nothing will grow. Toss an animal carcass down the well to taint the water.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Beat me to it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wow, sounds so very American Christian.
> 
> The Trump's providing food for people in foreign countries.
Click to expand...


   You try and kill people they tend to react in kind.


----------



## SavannahMann

deanrd said:


> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*
> 
> *But is there a limit?*
> 
> 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.
> 
> 
> 
> 9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.
> 
> So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?
> 
> Wow, that makes sense.
> 
> Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> Castro should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Farmland in the city?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Real estate dum dum.
> 
> Did that really need to be said?
> 
> Yea, I guess so.
Click to expand...


So all the people in Manhattan need to get out. It was taken by violence from the original occupants. Who in turn took it by violence from others. 

The first farm seized had been in the family for five generations. That is 150 years. Not since 1994. Now. We are going back 150 years to right a wrong. Why not two hundred? Or 300 years? Why stop there? 

Generation - Wikipedia

If we go back far enough we can argue we stole the land from Neanderthal man. That means all land everywhere belongs to you. 

This is why I say it is bullshit. Not because of the color, but because of the time involved. The Status Quo is defined as the mess we are in. We’ve been in this mess for a while and spending all our time arguing about wrongs from a century and a half ago is not fixing the mess we are in, but exacerbates the mess. 

Do we have a horrid history in Africa? Yes. We do. Is it too complicated to fix by seizing a few farms. You bet your ass it is. But as usual you focus on the surface and ignore the truth. In fact your mind is so shallow as to be nothing but surface. 

A lot of people have a horrid history in Africa. Yes. We took slaves. But the dirty truth is that one tribe would capture another and sell them to the white man. The same way that one tribe of Indians would assist the whites in making war against other tribes. 

History is replete with inhumane actions. We can not fix them. We can only learn from them. Or in your case, repeat them.


----------



## Jarlaxle

SavannahMann said:


> Two Thumbs said:
> 
> 
> 
> sell the land then burn everything down, including the crops, then leave and come to America.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Salt the earth. Nothing will grow. Toss an animal carcass down the well to taint the water.
Click to expand...

No...put mercury in the well and contaminate the soil with it.


----------



## IM2

SavannahMann said:


> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*
> 
> *But is there a limit?*
> 
> 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.
> 
> 
> 
> 9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.
> 
> So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?
> 
> Wow, that makes sense.
> 
> Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> Castro should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Farmland in the city?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Real estate dum dum.
> 
> Did that really need to be said?
> 
> Yea, I guess so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all the people in Manhattan need to get out. It was taken by violence from the original occupants. Who in turn took it by violence from others.
> 
> The first farm seized had been in the family for five generations. That is 150 years. Not since 1994. Now. We are going back 150 years to right a wrong. Why not two hundred? Or 300 years? Why stop there?
> 
> Generation - Wikipedia
> 
> If we go back far enough we can argue we stole the land from Neanderthal man. That means all land everywhere belongs to you.
> 
> This is why I say it is bullshit. Not because of the color, but because of the time involved. The Status Quo is defined as the mess we are in. We’ve been in this mess for a while and spending all our time arguing about wrongs from a century and a half ago is not fixing the mess we are in, but exacerbates the mess.
> 
> Do we have a horrid history in Africa? Yes. We do. Is it too complicated to fix by seizing a few farms. You bet your ass it is. But as usual you focus on the surface and ignore the truth. In fact your mind is so shallow as to be nothing but surface.
> 
> A lot of people have a horrid history in Africa. Yes. We took slaves. But the dirty truth is that one tribe would capture another and sell them to the white man. The same way that one tribe of Indians would assist the whites in making war against other tribes.
> 
> History is replete with inhumane actions. We can not fix them. We can only learn from them. Or in your case, repeat them.
Click to expand...


I focus on the truth. You are the one lying. 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today. That's when apartheid ended. Not 150 years ago. We are not talking about the white revisionist history of slavery you repeat. White tribes have been fighting in Europe for centuries but no one did this to them. So STFU with your excuses.


----------



## SavannahMann

IM2 said:


> SavannahMann said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> *So you believe that the people of today should pay for the crimes of our ancestors. Great. So where does this end? Is it limited to five generations or can we, or perhaps I should say must we go further back? Can we judge guilt for crimes committed during the dark ages? The long standing principle that the Children are not responsible for the sins of the father is apparently long gone. Good. Glad to hear it.*
> 
> *But is there a limit?*
> 
> 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today That's when apartheid ended. It gets old reading excuses from whites who want to tell everyone else to take responsibility.
> 
> 
> 
> 9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.
> 
> So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?
> 
> Wow, that makes sense.
> 
> Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> Castro should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Farmland in the city?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Real estate dum dum.
> 
> Did that really need to be said?
> 
> Yea, I guess so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all the people in Manhattan need to get out. It was taken by violence from the original occupants. Who in turn took it by violence from others.
> 
> The first farm seized had been in the family for five generations. That is 150 years. Not since 1994. Now. We are going back 150 years to right a wrong. Why not two hundred? Or 300 years? Why stop there?
> 
> Generation - Wikipedia
> 
> If we go back far enough we can argue we stole the land from Neanderthal man. That means all land everywhere belongs to you.
> 
> This is why I say it is bullshit. Not because of the color, but because of the time involved. The Status Quo is defined as the mess we are in. We’ve been in this mess for a while and spending all our time arguing about wrongs from a century and a half ago is not fixing the mess we are in, but exacerbates the mess.
> 
> Do we have a horrid history in Africa? Yes. We do. Is it too complicated to fix by seizing a few farms. You bet your ass it is. But as usual you focus on the surface and ignore the truth. In fact your mind is so shallow as to be nothing but surface.
> 
> A lot of people have a horrid history in Africa. Yes. We took slaves. But the dirty truth is that one tribe would capture another and sell them to the white man. The same way that one tribe of Indians would assist the whites in making war against other tribes.
> 
> History is replete with inhumane actions. We can not fix them. We can only learn from them. Or in your case, repeat them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I focus on the truth. You are the one lying. 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today. That's when apartheid ended. Not 150 years ago. We are not talking about the white revisionist history of slavery you repeat. White tribes have been fighting in Europe for centuries but no one did this to them. So STFU with your excuses.
Click to expand...


You mean there were no slaves in Europe? Wow, talk about revisionist history. Slavery is in the Old Testiment. Slaves were common in Greece during the era of the City States. It is one of the reasons that Sparta was never able to send its entire army out to fight, most had to be kept back to keep the slaves from revolting. 

Then you have the gall to claim that the Africans were blameless for the slave trade. Pfui again. African chiefs urged to apologise for slave trade

What did you think that Slavery didn’t exist until the White Man found the Black Man? Are you joking? Vikings had slaves in the 11th Century, Spanish Muslims had slaves in the 15th Century, and it continued through to the 20th Century in the Ottoman Empire. Pfui. Stop with the revisionist history. Or perhaps I should suggest you open a history book and learn something. 

The Russians Revolted because they were essentially slaves to the Czars. If Ignorance is bliss, then you are one of the happiest people on earth. Because you are incredibly ignorant. 

Slavery was not just practiced in Africa, it was one of the earliest practices in any written history. From Persia where ever citizen was a slave to the King. 

Many people came to America from Europe as “indentured servants” which by the way, is contracted slavery. 

Slavery is still practiced today. Not in Georgia, or in South Carolina, nor in Alabama. No. It is still practiced today in which Continent? Opinion | It’s the 21st century. Yet slavery is alive and well.

Is it the White Man subjugating people? Is it the White Man who is doing this today? 

Yes, we did some horrible things in the past. But they are in the past. The farm which was seized was in the family for five generations. Five Generations. It was not magically given to the family in 1994. Five generations using the standard formula of thirty years per generation is one hundred and fifty years. Let me use numbers. 150. 

This is the frustrating thing. I never owned a slave. Never. My ancestors did not arrive in the nation until after Slavery was abolished. My Great Great Grandfather was a peasant Reindeer Herder from Norway. Not exactly the weathy men of lore and legend. Peasant by the way, means the guys with the fewest rights. Like. none. 

That farm was already owned by that family before anyone alive today was born. Now, you are arguing that they never should have owned it. Again, where is the limit on that? Manhattan was taken from the Indians. Should we give it back for free? Alsace and Lorraine were handed back and forth dozens of times in history, who really owns it? The French today, The Germans of Yesterday? Who owns that land? Belgium was carved out of other nations, so should we go and carve it up again and give it back to who once owned it? 

We end racism by moving forward, not rewriting the history of how we got here. The Massacres of the Indians by the American Calvary would not have been possible if not for the Indian Scouts. United States Army Indian Scouts - Wikipedia

Again, that is not fantasy, it is history. The Indian Scouts warned Custer that he was walking into more Indians than he could imagine. But he went anyway. They didn’t. But the tragedies in the West, the massacres of the Tribes, could never have happened without the Indian Scouts leading the Calvary to the other tribes. Always other tribes. You didn’t use the Sioux Scouts for example, when you were after the Sioux, because they would vanish in the night. They were happy as could be to lead the Whites to other tribes, but not their own. 

Again, all this is history. The White Man has much history to be aware of, perhaps even ashamed of. But to deny that history, all of the history, is the greatest disservice we can do. Because it insures that the mistakes of history will repeat themselves. It means we don’t learn the truth from history, but the fantasy, the fiction. 

Try reading a few books, you might even enjoy learning.


----------



## Tilly

SavannahMann said:


> IM2 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SavannahMann said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HereWeGoAgain said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deanrd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 9% of white people own 72% of the farmland.  I bet it's even more in the cities.
> 
> So because these people went in with guns and stole African people's land because it was their great grandparents and great great grand parents, they should be able to keep it today?
> 
> Wow, that makes sense.
> 
> Saddam should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> Castro should have been able to keep what he took.
> 
> If you can steal it through violence and manage to keep it a couple of generations, it's yours for good.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Farmland in the city?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Real estate dum dum.
> 
> Did that really need to be said?
> 
> Yea, I guess so.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> So all the people in Manhattan need to get out. It was taken by violence from the original occupants. Who in turn took it by violence from others.
> 
> The first farm seized had been in the family for five generations. That is 150 years. Not since 1994. Now. We are going back 150 years to right a wrong. Why not two hundred? Or 300 years? Why stop there?
> 
> Generation - Wikipedia
> 
> If we go back far enough we can argue we stole the land from Neanderthal man. That means all land everywhere belongs to you.
> 
> This is why I say it is bullshit. Not because of the color, but because of the time involved. The Status Quo is defined as the mess we are in. We’ve been in this mess for a while and spending all our time arguing about wrongs from a century and a half ago is not fixing the mess we are in, but exacerbates the mess.
> 
> Do we have a horrid history in Africa? Yes. We do. Is it too complicated to fix by seizing a few farms. You bet your ass it is. But as usual you focus on the surface and ignore the truth. In fact your mind is so shallow as to be nothing but surface.
> 
> A lot of people have a horrid history in Africa. Yes. We took slaves. But the dirty truth is that one tribe would capture another and sell them to the white man. The same way that one tribe of Indians would assist the whites in making war against other tribes.
> 
> History is replete with inhumane actions. We can not fix them. We can only learn from them. Or in your case, repeat them.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I focus on the truth. You are the one lying. 1994 is well within the lifetimes of almost every South African living today. That's when apartheid ended. Not 150 years ago. We are not talking about the white revisionist history of slavery you repeat. White tribes have been fighting in Europe for centuries but no one did this to them. So STFU with your excuses.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You mean there were no slaves in Europe? Wow, talk about revisionist history. Slavery is in the Old Testiment. Slaves were common in Greece during the era of the City States. It is one of the reasons that Sparta was never able to send its entire army out to fight, most had to be kept back to keep the slaves from revolting.
> 
> Then you have the gall to claim that the Africans were blameless for the slave trade. Pfui again. African chiefs urged to apologise for slave trade
> 
> What did you think that Slavery didn’t exist until the White Man found the Black Man? Are you joking? Vikings had slaves in the 11th Century, Spanish Muslims had slaves in the 15th Century, and it continued through to the 20th Century in the Ottoman Empire. Pfui. Stop with the revisionist history. Or perhaps I should suggest you open a history book and learn something.
> 
> The Russians Revolted because they were essentially slaves to the Czars. If Ignorance is bliss, then you are one of the happiest people on earth. Because you are incredibly ignorant.
> 
> Slavery was not just practiced in Africa, it was one of the earliest practices in any written history. From Persia where ever citizen was a slave to the King.
> 
> Many people came to America from Europe as “indentured servants” which by the way, is contracted slavery.
> 
> Slavery is still practiced today. Not in Georgia, or in South Carolina, nor in Alabama. No. It is still practiced today in which Continent? Opinion | It’s the 21st century. Yet slavery is alive and well.
> 
> Is it the White Man subjugating people? Is it the White Man who is doing this today?
> 
> Yes, we did some horrible things in the past. But they are in the past. The farm which was seized was in the family for five generations. Five Generations. It was not magically given to the family in 1994. Five generations using the standard formula of thirty years per generation is one hundred and fifty years. Let me use numbers. 150.
> 
> This is the frustrating thing. I never owned a slave. Never. My ancestors did not arrive in the nation until after Slavery was abolished. My Great Great Grandfather was a peasant Reindeer Herder from Norway. Not exactly the weathy men of lore and legend. Peasant by the way, means the guys with the fewest rights. Like. none.
> 
> That farm was already owned by that family before anyone alive today was born. Now, you are arguing that they never should have owned it. Again, where is the limit on that? Manhattan was taken from the Indians. Should we give it back for free? Alsace and Lorraine were handed back and forth dozens of times in history, who really owns it? The French today, The Germans of Yesterday? Who owns that land? Belgium was carved out of other nations, so should we go and carve it up again and give it back to who once owned it?
> 
> We end racism by moving forward, not rewriting the history of how we got here. The Massacres of the Indians by the American Calvary would not have been possible if not for the Indian Scouts. United States Army Indian Scouts - Wikipedia
> 
> Again, that is not fantasy, it is history. The Indian Scouts warned Custer that he was walking into more Indians than he could imagine. But he went anyway. They didn’t. But the tragedies in the West, the massacres of the Tribes, could never have happened without the Indian Scouts leading the Calvary to the other tribes. Always other tribes. You didn’t use the Sioux Scouts for example, when you were after the Sioux, because they would vanish in the night. They were happy as could be to lead the Whites to other tribes, but not their own.
> 
> Again, all this is history. The White Man has much history to be aware of, perhaps even ashamed of. But to deny that history, all of the history, is the greatest disservice we can do. Because it insures that the mistakes of history will repeat themselves. It means we don’t learn the truth from history, but the fantasy, the fiction.
> 
> Try reading a few books, you might even enjoy learning.
Click to expand...

He’s been presented with these links and this info many times but he remains in denial.
Bravo anyway for an excellent post


----------



## Two Thumbs

this thread just solidifies that leftists have no sense of history or if they do, truly hate American history, as they have no concept of property rights.


----------

